Why is defoliation so controversial?

You wouldn’t cut a branch off an apple tree because a couple apples were not in direct sunlight! So why do it to your ladies?

Humboldtcalikidd said:

You wouldn’t cut a branch off an apple tree because a couple apples were not in direct sunlight! So why do it to your ladies?

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Not talking apples. And yes. I would take any branches of apples denying the better quality growth of fruit. Cali telling MI about apples? I'm confused.

Peace.

A good rule of thumb, is to not worry about what others think of your horticultural style.

If plants absorbed light energy and dispersed it evenly throughout the plant I dont think you would get popcorn on the bottom of your plant?

Cabrone said:

If plants absorbed light energy and dispersed it evenly throughout the plant I dont think you would get popcorn on the bottom of your plant?

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Nodes are fed most efficiently by the leaves directly attached to the node. If those leaves and nodes are shaded, you get larf, if you remove the leaves but leave the bud sites you get larf. Therefore, logic says remove the shaded bud sites and leaves to avoid larf. The upside is, all plant root energy is directed towards the bud sites with remaining leaves. I would cite my source, but I can't remember where I got it. It was an instructional video on mainlining I believe.

It's all about photosynthesis. The more "solar collecting panels" (AKA leaves) you have, the more photosynthesis. It's not about redirecting root energy to the bud sites. It's just that, IF you remove the leaves, then the only material left to collect light are the rather small sugar leaves. Extreme defoliation lessens the plants ability to photosynthesize and slows all plant processes. The roots don't have any bonus material that will go directly to the buds if the leaves are removed. It's like removing the large gears in a watch to try and get time to speed up. It just doesn't work that way.

The better thing to do, is to spread open the plant's branches (via scrog net or mainlining or super cropping or something like that) where the plant can get as much exposure to the light as possible without needing to remove any otherwise-healthy leaves.

tstick said:

The more "solar collecting panels" (AKA leaves) you have, the more photosynthesis.

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That is the route i have followed. Lowers get trimmed, some fans if things get to thick for airflow. Good results for me...
Dont grow enough plants to say whether trimming more is beneficial. Perfectly happy with over a gpw without stressing too much over things

Just take the pale ones off, looking at two rooms at the mo. One raped them, the other didn't bother , the last bastards winning bye far.

Just to stir the pot, but fan leaves also take energy to maintain...

Humboldtcalikidd said:

You wouldn’t cut a branch off an apple tree because a couple apples were not in direct sunlight! So why do it to your ladies?

Click to expand...

I wonder why defoliation is a standard practice in the cotton industry (hint, it creates higher quality cotton flowers; fact).

Humboldtcalikidd said:

You wouldn’t cut a branch off an apple tree because a couple apples were not in direct sunlight! So why do it to your ladies?

Click to expand...

But you would cut branches and blooms and leaves from rose bushes. It makes for better roses.

Like most things in life, proper defoliation takes wisdom and balance ;P haha

DONT
Strip all your leaves from your plant the day you flip and again 14-21 days after

DO
remove excessive fan leaves, open up the air flow and light penetration within and under the canopy, and help direct the plants energy resources to the maximum benefit growth phase depending

The problem is that people have tried to change the definition over the years.

10 years ago when people talked about defoliation it referred to removing all or most of the fan leaves.

In order to justify the practice it seems like people have tried to be more broad with the definition and less intense with the practices to make them more main stream.

Yet there is already a term for removing sucker branches and selective growth from a plant. That term is “PRUNING”!!

Pruning gets used on roses, and tomatoes, and fruit trees and many other plants to alter and control growth.

Pruning lower bud sites and damaged leaves or large leaves to encourage air flow and focused growth at the remaining growth tips is a common horticultural practice.

These threads are funny.
why is defoliation so controversial?
Because opinions are like assholes ..................

my take on it is indoor it has its place. But trying to explain that to someone that takes off about solar panels is impossible.

also trying to explain that 50 panels in different sun are more efficient then 100 panels in blocked sun. Another bang your head moment.

then taking the defensive route of “it’s not natural” is fucking horse shit. I am inside playing god and Mother Nature. Manipulating plants to get all horned up to reproduce seeds. Then deprive them of that, then roll and smoke that unfertilized Child.

Not to mention the horrors of clones

Outdoor plants also benefit form strategic defoliation. As these plants are being grown in different outdoor climates then where found naturally.

Next. Why do Sativa plants have less fan leaves then indica plant. Sativas tend to come from sunnier climates right. Maybe they dont need all those extra leaves?

well theirs my asshole. Now you know.

Lol defoliation
You guys will lose your minds seeing "shwazzing" haha
I gave it a shot this grow on my plants, so far so good.
I plan to take clones and do 2 plants swazzed, and two with typical thinning and lollipop my next RDWC run. I want to see results for myself
Especially because for some reason, I cannot find any solid side by side tests.
here are my girls the day I flipped to 1212 after I de-leafed

Here is exactly 60 hours later

I've been removing leaves for a decade, works well in my tiny ass setups. I had a fuck up recently where some untested plants stretched into my LEDs, I had to cut off the tops because there was no room for scropping. I decided against removing the buds from the bottom of the plants that would normally stay as larf/popcorn and added more light under the plants, well those bottom buds turned out pretty good. If I have to choose between illuminating leaves or budsites, I'll take the budsites every time.

Like others have said, theres more than 1 way to grow cannabis, and tons of different techniques to increase branches, budsites, yields etc. All the hippy science about solar panels and satellites are pure nonsense. You are supplying everything the plant needs. All the stuff about hurting your plants and stunting them again pure nonsense. If you are on a solid feed program and plants are thriving they will bounce back in 24hrs from a full leaf strip if done at the right time. Remember, we are growing BUDS, not leaves here. The more you open up your plant to allow more direct light to budsites the more higher quality bud you will get. Try covering up a top or bud site but have the fans in direct light. What happens? The bud is dwarfed by other branches and will be less quality, mature later and grow less. Now remove the fans and expose the top or budsite to direct light. What happens? The plant regrows those leaves all while you have added more direct light to more budsites and that top still thrives. There is a reason most top commercial cannabis growers that do scrog style do multiple leaf strips and lollypoping. Ive never seen a decent sized operation doing scrog and not done multiple leaf strips. You want as many budsites to get direct light as possible in your top 1.5-2 feet of canopy.

In retrospect, I can see that some plants/grows might benefit from removing leaves to expose bud site -like if it's a really leafy strain or when the lighting isn't sufficient. But in my small grows, it's never been necessary because I don't have a crowd of plants and I can provide all the light necessary without ever having to remove the leaves. I just grow for myself and not trying to flex my muscles against any big time commercial ops or use their growing techniques. I don't think my goals in growing marijuana are the same as theirs, tbh. I'm never on a time constraint and I don't need to meet any deadlines or fill any quotas, so if it takes longer for me to get my flowers ripe, then it's just fine. In my experience the leaves will remove themselves when they stop making food and they will just fall off all on their own. That's when the buds will get more exposure to the light at that time, anyway. But, I normally just adjust the exposure to the bud sights via LST or HST. I've never done it, but side-lighting or vertical growing achieves the same thing. Put the light where the leaves can't shade the buds seems to make more sense than removing the leaves. But to each his own. *shrugs*

Defoliation is one method of inducing systemic resistance. Ever notice that after defoliation, your plant bounces back and is healthier and faster growing than ever? Defoliation not only opens up bud sites to more light, it makes the plants stronger and healthier and might even increase quality of the final product. There are hundreds of studies dating back over 40 years on the effects of insect damage and other means of defoliation on plant health, this isn't some brand new controversial topic. The question is how much and how often for best results....no one can answer that, so I would just look at the grow journals of trusted top growers who defoliate and see what they do and what they end up with.

I've got a Gorilla Glue #4 plant (from a bag seed) that is in week 7 of flower and it's pretty much all bud and hardly any leaves. It just grew that way. It would be silly to defoliate it. The other plant I'm growing is a Sativa-heavy hybrid and so the leaves are thinner and the colas are longer -less chunky plant. In either case, defoliation would be unwarranted. I guess when the day comes that I end up with a super leafy strain, I'll try to remember what was said in this thread! Until then....