# 1600Kw vertical grow tent. Hybrid Aero/RDWC build.



## drekoushranada (Jun 8, 2011)

I finally have the things I need to get this thing off to the races. I will post pics as I go along. I figure it will take me about 4-8 hours to build. So have a bit of patience with me. By the way my Critical +, Blue Widow, Northern Lights x Big Bud, AK-48, and some random bag seed all popped. I soaked them in some water in a cup for a few hours and then used the paper towel method. So im super stoked! Not bad for a first timer This site has helped a ton!!


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## Monkeyfloss (Jun 8, 2011)

Love the ambition .... you dont mess about.
Goodluck


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## drekoushranada (Jun 8, 2011)

Thanks for the good thoughts. These damn Uniseals are HELL m8... That 4-8 hour time frame has just been increased. LOL


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## Sillybee (Jun 8, 2011)

Pics pics pics ! :d


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## Monkeyfloss (Jun 8, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> Thanks for the good thoughts. These damn Uniseals are HELL m8... That 4-8 hour time frame has just been increased. LOL


take your time and do it right, i think.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 8, 2011)

The pics is the dry set up of the tent and the Uniseals. More pics shall come. BTW everything will be white. Well the totes at least.


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## lotsOweed (Jun 9, 2011)

Very nice looking setup. Clean and organized. Your running a 1k and 600w light?


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## drekoushranada (Jun 9, 2011)

lotsOweed said:


> Very nice looking setup. Clean and organized. Your running a 1k and 600w light?


Correct I am running a 600kw MH for veg but a 1000kw hps and the 600kw MH will be used for Flower. The 1000Kw is a dimmable digital ballast and the 600kw is a galaxy regular digital ballast. BTW ppl to make your life a boat load easier when using uniseal. GRAB SOME 2" COUPLERS!!!! That way u can force one side in at a time and wont have to fight the damn thing. It hit me late. So off to the hardware store I go.


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## BendBrewer (Jun 9, 2011)

Since you are using what I use as a res. for pots, I have to ask what you are using as a res. Looks sweet!


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## drekoushranada (Jun 9, 2011)

BendBrewer said:


> Since you are using what I use as a res. for pots, I have to ask what you are using as a res. Looks sweet!


 I am using the samething for a res. The res is on the outside of the tent. I will post a pick up of it when I get home.


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## BendBrewer (Jun 9, 2011)

Going to be interesting to see what you can grow in 27 gallon pots! I saw 1 guy that used 50 gallon pots for his containers. Claimed to get 10 pounds per.

Cheers to you!


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## drekoushranada (Jun 10, 2011)

Here are a few more pics. The items have been dry fitted. I am trying to figure out if I want to use pvc cement on the 2" pipe...??? I think I may go with silicone if I have to take it apart at some time or point I can. What do you guys and girls think about it so far?


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## BendBrewer (Jun 10, 2011)

So your pump is external and draws from the plant tubs back to the res?


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## drekoushranada (Jun 10, 2011)

BendBrewer said:


> So your pump is external and draws from the plant tubs back to the res?


Its a 550 gph that with be inside of the res. It with power the misters and at the same time draw the water back. I will post a few more pics up in a hour so you will better understand it. Im sure im not giving a good explanation of the system.


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## BendBrewer (Jun 10, 2011)

It's almost an Undercurrent system. I really like it and you should be able to grow trees!


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## drekoushranada (Jun 10, 2011)

BendBrewer said:


> It's almost an Undercurrent system. I really like it and you should be able to grow trees!


Thats what I hope to do!


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## drekoushranada (Jun 10, 2011)

This is how the misters will be set up.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 11, 2011)

Please feel free to ask questions and give some advice!


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## drekoushranada (Jun 13, 2011)

Well I did a test run and im happy to report that there is no leaks!


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## mr.bond (Jun 14, 2011)

How are you keeping the misters from spraying liquid out from under the lid? My buddy used the same tubs in a similar setup but had to abandon it after massive leakage... even though the lid sits flush it doesn't seal.

Also I noticed you painted the lids. How is the light penetration after doing that? 

Looking good so far! Cheers!

Mr. Bond


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## drekoushranada (Jun 14, 2011)

mr.bond said:


> How are you keeping the misters from spraying liquid out from under the lid? My buddy used the same tubs in a similar setup but had to abandon it after massive leakage... even though the lid sits flush it doesn't seal.
> 
> Also I noticed you painted the lids. How is the light penetration after doing that?
> 
> ...


I used some weather stripping on the totes. That solved the problem. You can buy it from Home de pot for $3 and it comes with a sticky side. I painted the lids black and then I went over them with some white. So no light should be getting in the system. I also have some foil duct tape for the pipes as well to shield them from the light. Thanks for stopping by. I will have the plants in the system tomorrow. I modified the lids and added 2 3" net pots to each lid. I figured I will try the bagseed out that happened to live through my germination practices.


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## ChronicObsession (Jun 14, 2011)

Hey buddy I like the sound of your setup but I'm confused about your power specs. I'm not trying to be an engineering nazi, but 1600kw grow is like... 1,600,000 watts or am I retarded? I was really hoping to see an underground bunker of 10,000 square feet, jam packed with lights and lights and lights and fans and lights.. Plus you would have had to have a military issue tent on a massive scale. Oh well


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## drekoushranada (Jun 15, 2011)

ChronicObsession said:


> Hey buddy I like the sound of your setup but I'm confused about your power specs. I'm not trying to be an engineering nazi, but 1600kw grow is like... 1,600,000 watts or am I retarded? I was really hoping to see an underground bunker of 10,000 square feet, jam packed with lights and lights and lights and fans and lights.. Plus you would have had to have a military issue tent on a massive scale. Oh well


 LOL. I was hoping nobody was going to catch that TYPO I made in the title.  Im not sure if I can edit it of not. It is just 1600w. + REP to you on that sir.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 15, 2011)

Temps: Rez= 73 Tent= 79 
Humidity= 46 
ppm= 500


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## BendBrewer (Jun 15, 2011)

The baby is growing. Careful with those nutes. I wouldn't go over 500 ppm until they are well established and then 700-800 tops through veg. Those clones that I LST'd ran at 450 ppm for 10 days before I bumped it to 700.


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## ajorden88 (Jun 16, 2011)

Lookin good! I can't wait to see those huge trees in there!


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## kr320 (Jun 16, 2011)

The sprayers appear like they might be too high. From what I remember, those red sprayers shoot pretty much in an upwards direction and seem to be positioned very close to the net pot. I'm sure you'll accomplish the task of getting the nutes to the roots(rhyme unintended) while the root system is still smaller, however once they emerge they may just be getting dripped on from the lid. Not exactly a bad thing, I suppose just not ideal for "aero".
Let us know how this is actually working in practice and good luck with the grow!


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## LBH (Jun 16, 2011)

You're going to LOVE growing in this system dude,....hold on tight, it's about to get interesting


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## Rcb (Jun 16, 2011)

great looking set up i hope everything works out.


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## Jozikins (Jun 16, 2011)

Dude, way to wrap your brain around some grow methods! You are going to rock this! 500ppm is some strong sauce though, bump it down to 250-450 for the first 2 weeks. In hydro you can get away with the minimalist's effort, so you can go as low on your PPM's as you can.

Man, I see all the effort and research you put into your first grow, I remember when I did my first one I thought I knew everything... and holy shit it turned out so bad it made my balls hurt. I grow like a pro now, but the first round was such money wasted, 3 years later and it still makes me sad.

You are going to be one hell of a producer though, I can't wait until you get the itch for more plants!

sub'd


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## LBH (Jun 16, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> You are going to rock this! 500ppm is some strong sauce though, bump it down to 250-450 for the first 2 weeks. In hydro you can get away with the minimalist's effort, so you can go as low on your PPM's as you can.


+ rep THAT! My motto,...."Less is more" ....ESPECIALLY in hydro. I use 1/3 the nutes I did in soil. I rarely break 800ppm in flower, avg 500-600 This is awesome advice that we rarely see. Many like to push ppm to the limit thinking the more food, the better. I'm not a believer. In time you will learn to listen to what the plants are saying and address what they need as they tell you.


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## Jozikins (Jun 16, 2011)

LBH said:


> + rep THAT! My motto,...."Less is more" ....ESPECIALLY in hydro. I use 1/3 the nutes I did in soil. I rarely break 800ppm in flower, avg 500-600 This is awesome advice that we rarely see. Many like to push ppm to the limit thinking the more food, the better. I'm not a believer. In time you will learn to listen to what the plants are saying and address what they need as they tell you.


 Good to see another genius here on RIU 
Thank you for the rep and the kind words. When I was exclusively DWC my PPM's topped 950, I actually had a hard time trying to figure out how to get them lower, because I had a few additives I couldn't part with that weren't part of my main line up. I always load up on humic acid, fulvic acid, amino acids, B vitamins, and silica. All these additives are loaded with caron (silica aside) and raise the PPM's a little bit. H&G doesnt have an official carb either, so I use a few a carb additive during the final few weeks of feed and flush. But otherwise I would probably max out at 800. Less food, more yield, more money in your pocket.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 17, 2011)

BendBrewer said:


> The baby is growing. Careful with those nutes. I wouldn't go over 500 ppm until they are well established and then 700-800 tops through veg. Those clones that I LST'd ran at 450 ppm for 10 days before I bumped it to 700.


Thanks for the kind words. Im going to drop the ppm.



ajorden88 said:


> Lookin good! I can't wait to see those huge trees in there!


Thats what im hoping for. I thing im going to go buy another 600 watter to veg with.



kr320 said:


> The sprayers appear like they might be too high. From what I remember, those red sprayers shoot pretty much in an upwards direction and seem to be positioned very close to the net pot. I'm sure you'll accomplish the task of getting the nutes to the roots(rhyme unintended) while the root system is still smaller, however once they emerge they may just be getting dripped on from the lid. Not exactly a bad thing, I suppose just not ideal for "aero".
> Let us know how this is actually working in practice and good luck with the grow!


I would have to agree with you on that. When I had to mod the tent I had to make the water level higher for the remote rez. But out of 12 misters I say 2 of them are hitting the tops of the totes.


LBH said:


> You're going to LOVE growing in this system dude,....hold on tight, it's about to get interesting


This is a lot of fun. Its cool to go in the tent and check on them. Great relaxation.


Rcb said:


> great looking set up i hope everything works out.


I hope so too. But if not im sure the great minds on this site will help me solve the problem.



Jozikins said:


> Dude, way to wrap your brain around some grow methods! You are going to rock this! 500ppm is some strong sauce though, bump it down to 250-450 for the first 2 weeks. In hydro you can get away with the minimalist's effort, so you can go as low on your PPM's as you can.
> 
> Man, I see all the effort and research you put into your first grow, I remember when I did my first one I thought I knew everything... and holy shit it turned out so bad it made my balls hurt. I grow like a pro now, but the first round was such money wasted, 3 years later and it still makes me sad.
> 
> ...


I cant wait to get that itch as well. This Diy set up is pretty cool I think. As a noob grower I did not want to burn through a bunch of money. This grow was most certainly in my limit. Just took a boat load of time.



LBH said:


> + rep THAT! My motto,...."Less is more" ....ESPECIALLY in hydro. I use 1/3 the nutes I did in soil. I rarely break 800ppm in flower, avg 500-600 This is awesome advice that we rarely see. Many like to push ppm to the limit thinking the more food, the better. I'm not a believer. In time you will learn to listen to what the plants are saying and address what they need as they tell you.


I am trying to read them as well. I find it so strange that the "bagseed" are out growing the designer strains I have. I know they are a week or so older but they are some freaking champs!!



Jozikins said:


> Good to see another genius here on RIU
> Thank you for the rep and the kind words. When I was exclusively DWC my PPM's topped 950, I actually had a hard time trying to figure out how to get them lower, because I had a few additives I couldn't part with that weren't part of my main line up. I always load up on humic acid, fulvic acid, amino acids, B vitamins, and silica. All these additives are loaded with caron (silica aside) and raise the PPM's a little bit. H&G doesnt have an official carb either, so I use a few a carb additive during the final few weeks of feed and flush. But otherwise I would probably max out at 800. Less food, more yield, more money in your pocket.


What will be the best way to drop the ppm?? +REP to you all for the great knowledge.


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## LBH (Jun 17, 2011)

Best way to drop ppm is to do a water change and only bring it up as far as you want it


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## drekoushranada (Jun 17, 2011)

LBH said:


> Best way to drop ppm is to do a water change and only bring it up as far as you want it


I will be doing that right now.


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## Jozikins (Jun 17, 2011)

LBH said:


> Best way to drop ppm is to do a water change and only bring it up as far as you want it


He's got it right. 

And your bag seed is taking off because it was an unintentional cross, so it has hybrid vigor. It isn't super common to find a bag seed that is a genetic duplicate of the mother, most gardeners have a few different plants in their garden so it is often a cross. So that would be the source of the hybrid vigor. That is usually how I know if bag seed is pure or not. I don't normally fucking with bag seed unless it is a strain I have long since lusted after.

I just came up on some iron lotus, i think it's pure


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## drekoushranada (Jun 17, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> He's got it right.
> 
> And your bag seed is taking off because it was an unintentional cross, so it has hybrid vigor. It isn't super common to find a bag seed that is a genetic duplicate of the mother, most gardeners have a few different plants in their garden so it is often a cross. So that would be the source of the hybrid vigor. That is usually how I know if bag seed is pure or not. I don't normally fucking with bag seed unless it is a strain I have long since lusted after.
> 
> I just came up on some iron lotus, i think it's pure


Thats what I was thinking. I hope I get majority females out of the Bagseed. The World of Seeds WWxBB is a good strain I must say. You think I will have problems once the roots hit the water with my rez temps? I hope not. I do have a lot of movement going on and when I add the air stones its going to be bonkers. I just leave the misters on bc the pump is not on a timer.


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## Jozikins (Jun 18, 2011)

What is your res temp? 

I have a similar strain, I have Whiteberry by Paradise Seeds. It is a great all day smoker, sure to please but not to put you out. I've gotten some amazing frost on this plant, people always flip when they see it. It actually isn't my dankest strain, but definitely one of my frostiest. I haven't tried it from The World of Seeds.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 18, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> What is your res temp?
> 
> I have a similar strain, I have Whiteberry by Paradise Seeds. It is a great all day smoker, sure to please but not to put you out. I've gotten some amazing frost on this plant, people always flip when they see it. It actually isn't my dankest strain, but definitely one of my frostiest. I haven't tried it from The World of Seeds.


My res temps are 73f. Yeah I hope these girls turn out like that. I did a water 65-75% water change. I am letting the system circulate and I will post pics and measurements in a hour or so.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 18, 2011)

The temps in my tent dont seem as hot as my thermometer reads (it is close to the light). It actually feels good in it. Granted it is alot of air movement going on in that thing. I just ordered me a Milwaukee digital ph pen because that colored water crap is not for me at all!! I did a water change as instructed today. I let it circulate before I took a measurement unlike the other days. So the readings should be good. 
rez tent humidity ppm
6/16 74 81 46 530 
6/17 74 81 48 541 
6/18 75 82 46 270 

The first pick is one of the 6 "bagseed" plants. Pic 2 Blue Widow. Pic 3 Critical Plus. Pic 4 AK-48. Pic 5 WWxBB. The yellow is from when they grew right into the CFL last week. How are they looking to you all? I will be getting another 600w MH this week to knock them into overdrive BTW.


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## Jozikins (Jun 18, 2011)

GOD FUCKING DAMMIT! GOD FUCKING DAMMIT! GOD FUCKING DAMMIT GOD FUCKING DAMMIT GOD FUCKING DAMMIT GOD FUCKING DAMMIT!!!!!

Why the fuck does backspace take me back a page? How do I disable this shit? Fucking Google Chrome always waits until I have typed out 8 or 10 paragraphs and then deletes it all by doing that shit!!!!!!!!!!!

God dammit! I wish I had the patience to retype all that information to help you out but I do not.

A Summary of what I typed:

If you care about your garden and it's success at all, as well ass your own mental health, return that Milwaukee meter ASAP! Before it is too late! I have Milwaukee and it is the worst addition there ever was to my garden. Returned it almost immediately it was such garbage! It is very cheaply assembled, and closely resembles that of a Happy Meal toy. Hanna is also terrible, and extremely inaccurate.

RETURN THE MILWAUKEE METER! Learn from my mistakes.

HM Digital, Oakton, and Bluelab are what you want, don't look anywhere else. I've bought and used ALL OF THEM, and I know what is best. The Truncheon from Bluelab is AWESOME!! My boss uses it. Fucking amazing. I own a Hanna trimeter I don't even use anymore, I use my Oakton pH pen and my HM digital TDS pen. The only thing I use the Hanna for is to measure the temps, but I think that is even inaccurate now. Piece of shit. The Milwaukee I returned so fast! Soooo fast! What a piece of shit! Always off by .2, even if we JUST calibrated it. Piece of shit meter! I can't stress it enough!

Your temps are okay, but can and probably will eventually cause problems. Right away buy some 1 gal jugs of water, freeze them, and place in your reservoir, or use h2o2. h2o2 limits what beneficial organisms you can feed your plants. I'm not sure if the frozen water bottle could kill bacteria it comes in contact with, I only did it once or twice, but my temps were so high it didn't matter, the ice just melted and my water stayed at 82... man am I glad I don't live in the awful desert anymore! You will eventually have to purchase a chiller if you cannot figure out how to cool your reservoir. You can drape some thick plastic over it to help insulate it, that is about all the advise I could give you besides bury it, which you can't. 

I have a friend who is exclusively on DWC, his res temps were 74 almost the entire grow, he has 2 grow chambers, grow chamber #1 got struck by root rot, which let in bud rot and powdery mildew. He lost half of all his nugs the week of harvest. Some of it he lost a few days before harvest, some a few days after. He is harvesting room #2 today and there doesn't seem to be any problems. His yield is not what it should be, I don't know if it is to be blamed on weak stem growth or water temps. I know the last time I did DWC with the same strain (SFV OG Kush) I had high water temps, but still got a fantastic yield off the plant. But my roots were brown and unhappy by the end. The other plant right next to my SFV was a White Berry, and she got root rot and started to die on week 6.5, but I was able to keep her alive long enough with out mold to give her a clearex flush and chop her on week 7, maybe a few days before. The buds still turned out great, and the harvest was good too, but that was mainly do to the excellent job I did of FIM'ing it when it was very young, and the pruning I did on it before it flowered. I know for a fact I could have pulled an extra 1/2 oz or more off of it if it didn't get the root disease and could have gone on one more week or so.

And all your seedlings look great. When you start to flower you may want to do 100% res changes, not 65%-75% it could cause problems during the worst possible time.


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## Robert Paulson (Jun 18, 2011)

no sense in doing a 75 % rez change as most of the sediments and salt are in the last bit you flush out.

Jozikins....dman that sucks about your buddies garden PM is a bitch i had a beutiful strain get that and i had to trash it, once they have it they have it forever. was your friends grow are cooler with high humidity? is most have been or else his pm came from the mother.


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## Jozikins (Jun 18, 2011)

He didn't get it from the mother, me and him trade clones all the time, and I haven't had any issues with it. I don't think his humidity was high, but his plants were all packed in too close, he uses a screen with 1" squares so I don't think there was enough air flow between his nugs. It was also in a filing cabinet, which doesn't have any passive air flow.

But yeah, all the salts do usually sit at the bottom, but I guess all he really needed to do is dilute it at the moment, because his PPM's were too high, the sauce was still fresh. But normally, later on in life, that can cause lock-up and produce a poor quality flavor in your nugs.


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## Robert Paulson (Jun 18, 2011)

what's too high? the plants will tell you if the ppm's are too high.


oh and on the meter note... i have two nutra dip tri-meters, they rock. whenever i calibrate them they are always right on or barely off. moving them or bumping them is what throws the calibration off.


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## Jozikins (Jun 18, 2011)

Nutradip huh? Never heard of them, I'll look them up. Normally bumping, dropping, or removing the power source from a meter can throw it off, but in the case of the Milwaukee it was just garbage. My Hanna is descent enough at keeping calibration, but it's PPM meter is sooooooo inaccurate, it will rapidly adjust between 100-50 PPM above the correct PPM, and 100-50 below the correct PPM. So I have to kind of guess where it is in the middle, and I call that the PPM in my log. my HM Digital PPM meter can give me accurate reading usually with 10 PPM, and it costs me less than 40 bucks. It isn't waterproof, but it is accurate. I like the pens more than anything because I can carry them from grow room to grow room and usually they are very reliable!

I would like a trimeter to call my own that I love though...


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## Robert Paulson (Jun 18, 2011)

I don't even worry about a fluctuation of 100 ppms, that is such a minute amount it really makes no difference.


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## Jozikins (Jun 19, 2011)

I'm a real minimalist and I usually bump my reservoir up by only 50ppm a week. I actually do get a significant difference from just 100ppm's, I've actually burned a few plants by jumping up like that before. Not just young plant's, when they are more sensitive, but this has happened to mature flowering plants as well. It's partially because my plants do not have a tolerance built up for excessive mineral salts, some of my strains are also super sensitive to fertilizers, even if I bring them up as seedlings and try and get them to take in higher PPM's, they just don't do well. I'm okay with this though, sometimes it saves me money, sometimes my fertilizer bottles start to lose their jazz after a while and I have to throw them out. 

On another note I have some other plants that are totally fine with me bumping PPM's up by 250 at a time, sometimes more (usually by accident, sometimes because I just don't give a fuck and I'm tired.) Part of it is strain specific, part of it is how you feed them. Usually it's my OG's from LA that don't care about PPM's as long as I don't go over 1300, but my fancy Dutch strains don't like the hot sauce at all, they peak at 900-1150PPM.


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## Robert Paulson (Jun 19, 2011)

White Widow liked about 900 ppm's when i grew it (i don't know what seed bank it was from though, definately the most touchy strain i have grown) purp kush was taking ppms as high as 2200, u dubb and super silver haze seem to like to stay about 1200-1300. those are the only strains i have done since i've had my meters. i've seen posts on here where people say to never go over 1000 ppm's, i think those people are full of shit, if the plant can take it -they can take it, so why not give it to them? oh and my water is about 180 or so off of a tall boy sediment/carbon filter, we have damn good water here.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 19, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> GOD FUCKING DAMMIT! GOD FUCKING DAMMIT! GOD FUCKING DAMMIT GOD FUCKING DAMMIT GOD FUCKING DAMMIT GOD FUCKING DAMMIT!!!!!
> 
> Why the fuck does backspace take me back a page? How do I disable this shit? Fucking Google Chrome always waits until I have typed out 8 or 10 paragraphs and then deletes it all by doing that shit!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> ...





Robert Paulson said:


> no sense in doing a 75 % rez change as most of the sediments and salt are in the last bit you flush out.
> 
> Jozikins....dman that sucks about your buddies garden PM is a bitch i had a beutiful strain get that and i had to trash it, once they have it they have it forever. was your friends grow are cooler with high humidity? is most have been or else his pm came from the mother.


Yeah I ordered that dang thing of flea bay already. I will see if I could put a stop on it so I can purchase a different one.The only reason why I did only 75% when I did do the water change was because the sauce was only a 2-3 days old. I have around 80-90 gallons running through the system for 10 plants. I was trying to save a bit of coin on the Grow nutes. I know im a noob but this Dyna Gro stuff does not seem bad at all. Still not sure which ones will be female from some of them. I think I may ScRog one and top another one for 4 main colas just to see what happens. The others will grow at their own will.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 19, 2011)

One weird thing I noticed on pretty much all of my plants since I germed them is the stems are a purple color. What is the reason for this?


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## Robert Paulson (Jun 19, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> One weird thing I noticed on pretty much all of my plants since I germed them is the stems are a purple color. What is the reason for this?


 just the strain. some are redish some are bright bright green some get purple. its totally normal, those purpla lines are nute super highways.


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## Robert Paulson (Jun 19, 2011)

Is this your first grow in this set-up?


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## Jozikins (Jun 19, 2011)

Robert Paulson said:


> White Widow liked about 900 ppm's when i grew it (i don't know what seed bank it was from though, definately the most touchy strain i have grown) purp kush was taking ppms as high as 2200, u dubb and super silver haze seem to like to stay about 1200-1300. those are the only strains i have done since i've had my meters. i've seen posts on here where people say to never go over 1000 ppm's, i think those people are full of shit, if the plant can take it -they can take it, so why not give it to them? oh and my water is about 180 or so off of a tall boy sediment/carbon filter, we have damn good water here.


Well I wouldn't say they are full of shit. I'll post an article about this as soon as I can find it, but over feeding your plants can have traumatic results on your yields and flavor! Mineral salts are bounded, and let's say your plants are in desperate need of Phosphorus, but are over loaded with Sodium, well your source of P happens to be TSP (old school I know, it was the first example that came to mind) so your plants cannot take up any more Phosphorus without taking up more Sodium. Well because we bumped up the PPM's so high we now not only have plenty of Sodium, but a Sodium toxicity. This means the plant will have a hard time getting rid of this build up, so if it is close to crop we will have crackling and harsh buds. Not only this, but plants with a nutrient toxicity lose their resistance to disease like root rot, bud rot, and powdery mildew. Like I said, 100ppm's has been the difference between a crop of 6 week plants finishing up, or a crop of plants infested with root rot. 

There was more than just res temps that screwed my friend over with mold, he also ran his PPM's well into the 2000's, and because of this he could not control is pH. When you cannot control your pH certain nutrients separate from their original chemical forms and turn into a cloudy solution your plants cannot take up, this begins different toxicities which start deficiencies else where, in the end your plants get disease and bug attacks.

I strongly believe a consistent and low PPM to pull the largest harvest possible. I share clones a lot, and people that run high PPM's never pull the same yields I do with the same strains, not ever. Not only that, but you are saving money! Of course, the best way to grow is to read your plants, but "more is better" does not apply as far as I'm concerned in the world of cannabis cultivation. 

I'll post the article soon, it was a recent one from Maximum Yield. Knowledge is so powa!



drekoushranada said:


> Yeah I ordered that dang thing of flea bay already. I will see if I could put a stop on it so I can purchase a different one.The only reason why I did only 75% when I did do the water change was because the sauce was only a 2-3 days old. I have around 80-90 gallons running through the system for 10 plants. I was trying to save a bit of coin on the Grow nutes. I know im a noob but this Dyna Gro stuff does not seem bad at all. Still not sure which ones will be female from some of them. I think I may ScRog one and top another one for 4 main colas just to see what happens. The others will grow at their own will.


 Sad, I hope you can stop the order. Hopefully you don't share my experience with Milwaukee. But I would definitely cross reference it with someone else' meter. I don't trust it! I understand that you changed your res the way you did because the nutes were still fresh. I would have done the same thing. But when we are trying to swap from one fertilizer to the other (one bloom booster to another, for example, or veg to bloom) we need to do full res changes.



drekoushranada said:


> One weird thing I noticed on pretty much all of my plants since I germed them is the stems are a purple color. What is the reason for this?


 How young is it. It is either genetics, temperature, or food. 

What's the strain? How old is it? What temperature is it? I already know what it is eating.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 19, 2011)

Robert Paulson said:


> Is this your first grow in this set-up?


Yes this is my 1st grow in this set-up.



Jozikins said:


> Well I wouldn't say they are full of shit. I'll post an article about this as soon as I can find it, but over feeding your plants can have traumatic results on your yields and flavor! Mineral salts are bounded, and let's say your plants are in desperate need of Phosphorus, but are over loaded with Sodium, well your source of P happens to be TSP (old school I know, it was the first example that came to mind) so your plants cannot take up any more Phosphorus without taking up more Sodium. Well because we bumped up the PPM's so high we now not only have plenty of Sodium, but a Sodium toxicity. This means the plant will have a hard time getting rid of this build up, so if it is close to crop we will have crackling and harsh buds. Not only this, but plants with a nutrient toxicity lose their resistance to disease like root rot, bud rot, and powdery mildew. Like I said, 100ppm's has been the difference between a crop of 6 week plants finishing up, or a crop of plants infested with root rot.
> 
> There was more than just res temps that screwed my friend over with mold, he also ran his PPM's well into the 2000's, and because of this he could not control is pH. When you cannot control your pH certain nutrients separate from their original chemical forms and turn into a cloudy solution your plants cannot take up, this begins different toxicities which start deficiencies else where, in the end your plants get disease and bug attacks.
> 
> ...


Bagseed, Blue widow, AK48, WWxBB, Critical +. The temps are 81 with lights on and 72-74 with lights out. The food is Dyna Gro grow and ProTek. The bagseed are about two weeks old and the designer strains are about a week old.


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## Jozikins (Jun 20, 2011)

Widow strains have purple tendencies and red stems sometimes, I've grown one particular blueberry strain before that always had red stems, AK 48 I haven't grown, although I never saw red stems on my AK 47. And Critical + I am clueless about. Your temps shouldn't give your red stems, and Dyna Gro should be well balanced enough to provide them everything..

You should be fine, but watch for signs of any deficiencies, just in case.


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## medicine21 (Jun 20, 2011)

I think you will be fine with 73* water temps. Just add some Aquashield or heisenberg tea for protection against rot.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 20, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Widow strains have purple tendencies and red stems sometimes, I've grown one particular blueberry strain before that always had red stems, AK 48 I haven't grown, although I never saw red stems on my AK 47. And Critical + I am clueless about. Your temps shouldn't give your red stems, and Dyna Gro should be well balanced enough to provide them everything..
> 
> You should be fine, but watch for signs of any deficiencies, just in case.


Yes the Dyna Gro is on the money. I bet when I add the other 600w MH they are going to rocket off. People claims are on the money about when the plants roots hit the sauce they take off. 1 bag seed is a wilty joker but that thing grows like a monster. Not perky at all. I thought it was heat stress but all the other plants are doing great.



medicine21 said:


> I think you will be fine with 73* water temps. Just add some Aquashield or heisenberg tea for protection against rot.


Great news. Which one of those products are for a sterile res? Have you ever used food grade H2O2?


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## BendBrewer (Jun 20, 2011)

I use Heisenberg's tea and I don't see anyone talking me out of using it anytime soon. It's magic. Tired H202 once and the slime loved it. Won't do that again.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 20, 2011)

BendBrewer said:


> I use Heisenberg's tea and I don't see anyone talking me out of using it anytime soon. It's magic. Tired H202 once and the slime loved it. Won't do that again.


Im going to look into this tea. I take it that your using benificial microbes?


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## BendBrewer (Jun 20, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> Im going to look into this tea. I take it that your using benificial microbes?


Yeah, that is what you are brewing up. Microbes and fungi that you feed outside your res. They multiply into the billions. Really makes those products last a long long time and work much more efficiently.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 20, 2011)

BendBrewer said:


> Yeah, that is what you are brewing up. Microbes and fungi that you feed outside your res. They multiply into the billions. Really makes those products last a long long time and work much more efficiently.


So what product would you suggest if I wanted to keep my res sterile?


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## BendBrewer (Jun 20, 2011)

Heisenberg uses ZHO powder for the fungi *Aquashield for the bacteria and EWC for **a diversity of microorganisms.

I used General Hydroponics' Subculture in place of the ZHO powder as I couldn't find ZHO.

When making 3 gallons of tea, I use 1 scoop of the powder a shot of Aquashield and 2 handfuls of EWC and 3 TBS of Molasses. That'll give me 2 weeks of tea at a fraction of the cost of adding those products to the res. 
*


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## medicine21 (Jun 20, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> So what product would you suggest if I wanted to keep my res sterile?


If you want to go sterile, go with H2o2 or Zone.


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## Jozikins (Jun 20, 2011)

Heisenberg makes a great Tea. I sort of just ran with his ideas, and borrowed some from VermiT as well (the co-owner always comes into our dispensary) and my plants fucking LOVE it. 

I use Tea because my res is always between 65-72, so I'm really safe using it, but I don't know at higher temps. The friend I am constantly referencing just chopped down 6 SFV OG's out of a recirculating DWC system in a 4x4 tent. a few weeks ago, if even that, he had his Blue Dream disaster in the filing cabinet with all the mold, bud rot, and root rot. 
Anyways, his reservoir temps seem to be about the same in both the cab and the tent, but these SFV's were all champs, with NO ROOT DISEASE and they were in the same hot water as the Blue Dream, the difference was that it was a recirculating system, constantly churning in new oxygen, just like your system does. He also had 45-55 gallons of water in the system, so that helped a lot too. But he was using the Heisenberg Tea, and not only did his plants love it, but they had VERY healthy white roots, with no mold or disease the entire grow, even with a cab sharing ventilation with his tent, that was loaded with mold spores!!

I know that information was kind of confusing with me saying "No tea, yes tea" but it is only because I'm still figuring it out myself. I just started reading this months issue of Urban Garden, it is all about organic gardening and brewing teas. So I'm still learning. But so far it seems like an excellent idea to keep your reservoir fresh, but at the same time it has the ability to go completely south. It all seems easy enough to understand, just read up on it. Search for "Heisenberg Tea" here on RIU, that is a great source! I also am talking to the VermiT guys, as well as referencing my Urban Garden magazine. I'm about to actually borrow my friend's Organic Chemistry book, so I can get a better science-based understanding of all this.

H2O2 will keep things sterile, some people swear by it.... But I'm having a lot of fun brewing my own tea, and I'm saving money. I have so much tea after a brew my outdoor plants look amazing as well. Now my neighbors don't wonder why some of the plants in my yard look like crap while I'm always unloading soil and fertilizer out of my truck.
Right now they just think I'm farming annual's to sell the local nursery, and I do a good job of having Morning Glories always growing in pots around the house. No I don't get high off of them... I know a chemist for that reason.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 21, 2011)

Some pics of the ladies. The strains in the 10" net pots arenot taking off like the ones in the 3" net pots. I think the reason is because it is taking them a longer time for there roots to hit the water. Once that happens im sure they will rocket off. They just need to hurry up and do it.


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## Jozikins (Jun 21, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> Some pics of the ladies. The strains in the 10" net pots arenot taking off like the ones in the 3" net pots. I think the reason is because it is taking them a longer time for there roots to hit the water. Once that happens im sure they will rocket off. They just need to hurry up and do it.


That is exactly why it's taking them longer. Go ahead and start top feeding them every now and then.

Some of them look sad. Maybe they do need more food. What do you think? Do they look better or worse since the res change? I hate giving advice on seedlings! It's hard to tell what's going on until you have them in your hands.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 21, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> That is exactly why it's taking them longer. Go ahead and start top feeding them every now and then.
> 
> Some of them look sad. Maybe they do need more food. What do you think? Do they look better or worse since the res change? I hate giving advice on seedlings! It's hard to tell what's going on until you have them in your hands.


Well they are looking better since the res change. I did top feed them this morning and they seem to have loved it. They have only been in this system for about a week. I just need them to hurry up and pop their roots through the net pots. Anyway to speed up that root growth?


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## Robert Paulson (Jun 22, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Well I wouldn't say they are full of shit. I'll post an article about this as soon as I can find it, but over feeding your plants can have traumatic results on your yields and flavor! Mineral salts are bounded, and let's say your plants are in desperate need of Phosphorus, but are over loaded with Sodium, well your source of P happens to be TSP (old school I know, it was the first example that came to mind) so your plants cannot take up any more Phosphorus without taking up more Sodium. Well because we bumped up the PPM's so high we now not only have plenty of Sodium, but a Sodium toxicity. This means the plant will have a hard time getting rid of this build up, so if it is close to crop we will have crackling and harsh buds. Not only this, but plants with a nutrient toxicity lose their resistance to disease like root rot, bud rot, and powdery mildew. Like I said, 100ppm's has been the difference between a crop of 6 week plants finishing up, or a crop of plants infested with root rot.
> 
> There was more than just res temps that screwed my friend over with mold, he also ran his PPM's well into the 2000's, and because of this he could not control is pH. When you cannot control your pH certain nutrients separate from their original chemical forms and turn into a cloudy solution your plants cannot take up, this begins different toxicities which start deficiencies else where, in the end your plants get disease and bug attacks.


 Who's full of shit? I've never had a problem, but I am also E&B not DWC.


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## Jozikins (Jun 22, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> Well they are looking better since the res change. I did top feed them this morning and they seem to have loved it. They have only been in this system for about a week. I just need them to hurry up and pop their roots through the net pots. Anyway to speed up that root growth?


Love is about all you can give them, or you can buy a root enhancing product. "Roots Excelurator" (that's how they spell it, not me,) and "Clonex" are too good products. If you buy Clonex (or Olivia's) make sure you get the solution, not the gel.



Robert Paulson said:


> Who's full of shit? I've never had a problem, but I am also E&B not DWC.


People that don't go over 1000ppm's. I've seen some dynamite harvests that never went over 1000ppms. I just have too many additives to pull that off. I never normally go over 850ppm on my base A&B, but I have so much good shit I always end up between 900-1300 during flower.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 22, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Love is about all you can give them, or you can buy a root enhancing product. "Roots Excelurator" (that's how they spell it, not me,) and "Clonex" are too good products. If you buy Clonex (or Olivia's) make sure you get the solution, not the gel.
> 
> 
> 
> People that don't go over 1000ppm's. I've seen some dynamite harvests that never went over 1000ppms. I just have too many additives to pull that off. I never normally go over 850ppm on my base A&B, but I have so much good shit I always end up between 900-1300 during flower.


I willlet them grow as they please. I just think they are using so much energy trying to get the roots to the sauce that it is slowing their upward growth. I think I may start using a drip system on them to blast their upward growth off. What do you all think about this? I must say that this system is some fun running.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 22, 2011)

I made some modifications to the system. 
1. I added a 12" airstone to each rez. 
2. I put in a drip irrigation set up to help with the root line of the plants in the 10" net pots. I hope the plants love what I did for them. They were looking pretty hungry. The 2nd 600 watt mh will be added next week. I want to vegg them until they get 20-30" Not sure how long that will take. The node growth on the plants has been super tight. To the point that I wont be mad if they stretched just a little bit.


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## Jozikins (Jun 22, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> I made some modifications to the system.
> 1. I added a 12" airstone to each rez.
> 2. I put in a drip irrigation set up to help with the root line of the plants in the 10" net pots. I hope the plants love what I did for them. They were looking pretty hungry. The 2nd 600 watt mh will be added next week. I want to vegg them until they get 20-30" Not sure how long that will take. The node growth on the plants has been super tight. To the point that I wont be mad if they stretched just a little bit.


 If I was a seedling, I know I would love that. 20-30" might be a little tall considering your roof is only 84" You have to consider the size of your planter and the fact that your plants can stretch anywhere between 1/3 their size to 3x their size.
Then again, with your choice in seedlings (minus the bag seed) I bet they won't stretch more than 1/3 for most of them.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 23, 2011)

The wwxbb in the pic has some dry leaves on it. Im not sure what the problem is though. Any ideas? The sprout leaves (the ones that start eith a "C") are turning yellow. What can this be?


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## Jozikins (Jun 23, 2011)

Totally natural. Plants shed those first sprout leaves as soon as they can. If you pull one off you'll notice it pull off a protective casing from the stem, all this shit is going to fall of eventually, don't sweat it. Just don't pull it off! Let it do it naturally so you don't damage the tender your seedling. At any other stage in a plants life we manually remove dying portions of the plant, but right now we let it roll. If you a have a few that insist on staying long after the rest have fallen, then you can go ahead and make a manual attempt at removing them.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 24, 2011)

Well I got my PH pen today and calibrated it. Right after that I tested my water. It was 6.5.. Ouch!!


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## Jozikins (Jun 24, 2011)

Don't worry too much. 6.5 is the highest you can go, but you can still grow in it. Bump it on down to 5.8- 5.9, if you can't check it every day bump it down to 5.6-5.7, and hopefully it'll sit at 5.8 for longer.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 24, 2011)

Cool. It looks like I wont be able to get a chiller so I think I will be brewing up some bennies. Will these do great with temps in the 70's?? I would hate to get root rot and slime!!


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## Jozikins (Jun 24, 2011)

I've seen it do well in temps as high as 74, I've never seen it in anything warmer than that.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 24, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> I've seen it do well in temps as high as 74, I've never seen it in anything warmer than that.


Cool. I will start some up soon! What ingredients will I need for the tea and where do I get them from?? Thanks for all your help with this grow.


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## Jozikins (Jun 24, 2011)

All you need to start is earthworm castings, molasses and mycorrhizae. Molasses you can get from any grocery store. They sell horticulture grade molasses, I have some but that is because it was gifted, but I used to use normal unsulfured molasses. Sulfur is a benefit though, it is not common to get a Sulfur deficiency, but i have experienced it in the past, with 2 strains in particular.

You can get worm castings from any good nursery, molasses you can get at the grocery store or hydro store, I know the Hi-Brix by Earth Juice is thinner and easier to pour, it is also a very reasonable 18 bucks for 1 gallon. But if you get the grocery store stuff just pop a pre measured amount into the microwave and heat it for a few seconds to soften it up. I like to use a ceramic espresso shot glass for that. Mycorrhizae you can get from a variety of hydroponic outlets and from high end nurserys. You can find it in a liquid or powdered form, but powder goes a lot further. The best part about teas is that you only need a little bit, the idea is that it breeds and multiplies in the bucket so you can make a product that is only good for 50 servings, and make 150 servings out of it.

Optional and recommended additives:
Sea Kelp extract (powdered is preferred for this application)
Guano; bat or seabird; I prefer Jamaican Bat Guano for it's high PK ratio
Fish Emulsion
Nematodes, they defend your plant from fungus gnats and root aphids!
Any product for plants that says "microbe," "bacteria," "fungi," and of course, trichoderma.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 25, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> All you need to start is earthworm castings, molasses and mycorrhizae. Molasses you can get from any grocery store. They sell horticulture grade molasses, I have some but that is because it was gifted, but I used to use normal unsulfured molasses. Sulfur is a benefit though, it is not common to get a Sulfur deficiency, but i have experienced it in the past, with 2 strains in particular.
> 
> You can get worm castings from any good nursery, molasses you can get at the grocery store or hydro store, I know the Hi-Brix by Earth Juice is thinner and easier to pour, it is also a very reasonable 18 bucks for 1 gallon. But if you get the grocery store stuff just pop a pre measured amount into the microwave and heat it for a few seconds to soften it up. I like to use a ceramic espresso shot glass for that. Mycorrhizae you can get from a variety of hydroponic outlets and from high end nurserys. You can find it in a liquid or powdered form, but powder goes a lot further. The best part about teas is that you only need a little bit, the idea is that it breeds and multiplies in the bucket so you can make a product that is only good for 50 servings, and make 150 servings out of it.
> 
> ...


Great I ordered some mycorrhizae from fungi.com. cant wait to brew it up!


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## Jozikins (Jun 25, 2011)

Hell yeah dude I am stoked for you! Make sure you read up real good on using this in DWC/recirculating/undercurrent systems to avoid any complications down the line. Did I ever link you that Heisenberg Tea thread?


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## drekoushranada (Jun 25, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Hell yeah dude I am stoked for you! Make sure you read up real good on using this in DWC/recirculating/undercurrent systems to avoid any complications down the line. Did I ever link you that Heisenberg Tea thread?


Im already sub"d to the tea thread bro. Where can I go to read about these problems and what are some of the things to look out for that you know off the top of your head?


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## Jozikins (Jun 26, 2011)

Smell and film are the two biggest problems. Look out for a film forming on your water surface, look out for root slime, and be extra sensitive to foul odor. The slightest foul odor can spell big trouble in the future, but if you get a faint waft of it, change reservoir immediately, if you catch it early enough, nothing will happen. Keep air circulation and water circulation to a max, anywhere the water isn't churning means that the water is going stagnant, and that needs to be avoided. Anytime crud appears, investigate it to see if it's food forming or a problem. There are a few issues that were addressed in that thread actually. Keep reading through the thread, even the stupid questions.


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## drekoushranada (Jun 26, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Smell and film are the two biggest problems. Look out for a film forming on your water surface, look out for root slime, and be extra sensitive to foul odor. The slightest foul odor can spell big trouble in the future, but if you get a faint waft of it, change reservoir immediately, if you catch it early enough, nothing will happen. Keep air circulation and water circulation to a max, anywhere the water isn't churning means that the water is going stagnant, and that needs to be avoided. Anytime crud appears, investigate it to see if it's food forming or a problem. There are a few issues that were addressed in that thread actually. Keep reading through the thread, even the stupid questions.


I will be sure to do that.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 4, 2011)

BendBrewer said:


> I use Heisenberg's tea and I don't see anyone talking me out of using it anytime soon. It's magic. Tired H202 once and the slime loved it. Won't do that again.


I finished brewing some "Heisenberg tea" and added it last night. I went this morning and checked on the plants and they were Super perky. More than they usually are. Im not sure if it is the tea but it has to be. The roots are seem to grab the particles of the tea. I freaked out at first but I took a close look and smelled them then calmed down and smiled. The plants are stinking even in vegg. I will take a few picks in a minute and post them. The have been in the system for 18 days now


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## drekoushranada (Jul 4, 2011)

Here you go people. 18 days in the system. The root porn is before the tea was added. The have some tea particles on them now. But if they like it I love it!


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## Jozikins (Jul 4, 2011)

Alright looking good! Those are some happy roots right there. That little bag seed you put off to the side really took of to be the star of the show, didn't it? That thing is a monster, has some fatty kush leaves on it. 

But yeah, the roots don't mind the brown dots at all, and they will all rinse off for the most part when you give them their first fresh water flush. I was so jealous of all the threads I am in now because everyone had beautiful seedlings but me, so I went ahead and germinated 12 of my finer seeds for a whole new generation of seedlings!! With all these fresh mom's, I've almost locked myself into selling clones for the next few months so I don't go way over my limit. But I plan on cloning and testing them all!

Those are some really really happy young vegging plants though, you are doing a great job. Blowing most 1st timers out of the water and you haven't even hit flower yet. It is waaaayyyyy to early to say this, especially with all the new challenges brought on by your first flowers, but I think you might have a knack for this whole "Growing Ganja" thing.


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## LBH (Jul 4, 2011)

I think you mean 1600w, not Kw 

Good luck!


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## drekoushranada (Jul 4, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Alright looking good! Those are some happy roots right there. That little bag seed you put off to the side really took of to be the star of the show, didn't it? That thing is a monster, has some fatty kush leaves on it.
> 
> But yeah, the roots don't mind the brown dots at all, and they will all rinse off for the most part when you give them their first fresh water flush. I was so jealous of all the threads I am in now because everyone had beautiful seedlings but me, so I went ahead and germinated 12 of my finer seeds for a whole new generation of seedlings!! With all these fresh mom's, I've almost locked myself into selling clones for the next few months so I don't go way over my limit. But I plan on cloning and testing them all!
> 
> Those are some really really happy young vegging plants though, you are doing a great job. Blowing most 1st timers out of the water and you haven't even hit flower yet. It is waaaayyyyy to early to say this, especially with all the new challenges brought on by your first flowers, but I think you might have a knack for this whole "Growing Ganja" thing.


Yeah those roots are loving the tea. The bagseeds are some monsters. I cant wait to get them into flowering. Im going to vegg them for ten days or more with the other 600 mh then I will put them into flower 7/17/11. I hope those bagseeds are mostly female. The tent is smelling already. I want to wait until the bagseed start showing me pre-flowers before I flip them to flower. They are around 5 weeks olds or so from seed.



LBH said:


> I think you mean 1600w, not Kw
> 
> Good luck!


Yeah I know. I corrected it a few pages back. I dont think I can edit the title. Can I?


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## Jozikins (Jul 4, 2011)

Fracking sweet. I'm just glad to see that your still around.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 8, 2011)

Just a few updates. Tell me what you think. They seem to not be eating as much as I thought they would. The ph pretty much stays constant or within hydro range and the ppm barely moves. But all and all I feel the plants look good.


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## medicine21 (Jul 8, 2011)

Looks good, man! Will you flower in the same setup or going to move them around?


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## drekoushranada (Jul 8, 2011)

medicine21 said:


> Looks good, man! Will you flower in the same setup or going to move them around?


It will be the same set up. Some of the plants Idont know the sex of because they were bagseed. Im trying to scope some pre-flowers so I will know. So out of the plants in the 3" net pots I figure half will be males. Are you any good at the "guess the sex" game? haha


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## Jozikins (Jul 8, 2011)

Clone for sex under CFL, just pop them in a cube with rooting gel under 12/12 and they should show signs of sex as they root under 12/12 within 2 weeks, make sure you properly label both the mother/father and the corresponding clone. Once you find out, throw the clones away, clone only your female plants, label them, and then throw out your males. 

But believe me, when you see bananas, you know they are bananas.

Your plants look good and healthy, one is a little droopy, and the rest seem to be over transpiring. What is your RH and your PPM? But it is good that your PPM and pH are rock solid, they should be with that much water in the system.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 8, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Clone for sex under CFL, just pop them in a cube with rooting gel under 12/12 and they should show signs of sex as they root under 12/12 within 2 weeks, make sure you properly label both the mother/father and the corresponding clone. Once you find out, throw the clones away, clone only your female plants, label them, and then throw out your males.
> 
> But believe me, when you see bananas, you know they are bananas.
> 
> Your plants look good and healthy, one is a little droopy, and the rest seem to be over transpiring. What is your RH and your PPM? But it is good that your PPM and pH are rock solid, they should be with that much water in the system.


The RH range is 45-48% and the PPM is at 323 when I checked it this morning. Yeah one plant is a bit droopy while anther plant is cupping upward a little like a canoe. By 2 weeks time they would be growing like giants. haha. I dont really have another area I can do 12/12 at that will be 100% light controlled. So will I cut a branch or just a leaf to clone? I never done it but watched it a few times.


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## Jozikins (Jul 8, 2011)

look it up on your tube on how to properly clone but you use a good branch that is well developed. RH is around where it should be, 50-60% is best for veg, but 48% should be fine. The PPM's could be higher, bump them up by 100ppm and see how your plants respond. I could explain cloning, but a video makes it a lot easier.

Light control the area the best you can, it doesn't have to be perfect, but make sure it is at least dark. Outside plants get moon light, so as long as a light leak doesn't illuminate the plants you should be fine.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 8, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> look it up on your tube on how to properly clone but you use a good branch that is well developed. RH is around where it should be, 50-60% is best for veg, but 48% should be fine. The PPM's could be higher, bump them up by 100ppm and see how your plants respond. I could explain cloning, but a video makes it a lot easier.
> 
> Light control the area the best you can, it doesn't have to be perfect, but make sure it is at least dark. Outside plants get moon light, so as long as a light leak doesn't illuminate the plants you should be fine.


Great. I will get started on that soon!


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## drekoushranada (Jul 11, 2011)

The ganja is doing great. The are starting to eat and drink like crazy now. I had to top the rez off with 5 gallons of water today. 2 days ago the ppm was at 320 and today is down to 280. I have to start a new tea brewing and do a water change. Im going to up the PPM to 500-600. I think im going to flip to flower soon though.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 12, 2011)

The plants are in a growth spurt or something! They are growing inches a day!


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## Jozikins (Jul 12, 2011)

I bet the bag seed is the craziest, it has it's hybrid vigor. Keep an eye out for signs of sexing. It may be a good idea to start cloning the larger plants for sex if possible. They make good clones in general when you are in a growth spurt like this. Obviously your store-bought genetics are more stable and are going a little more slow, and are not ready for cloning. I think with net pots that big you might even want a drip ring, I'm starting to think, so your elite genetics can keep up. 

Anyways, I'm probably going to set up my own vertical veg room today. Probably not going to use any hydroponics in it. I'm already in soiless, but I have really been wanting to get back to hydroponics. I hated the upkeep, but I love the lack of mess, not to mention, the physical labor with hydro is just less physical.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 12, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> I bet the bag seed is the craziest, it has it's hybrid vigor. Keep an eye out for signs of sexing. It may be a good idea to start cloning the larger plants for sex if possible. They make good clones in general when you are in a growth spurt like this. Obviously your store-bought genetics are more stable and are going a little more slow, and are not ready for cloning. I think with net pots that big you might even want a drip ring, I'm starting to think, so your elite genetics can keep up.
> 
> Anyways, I'm probably going to set up my own vertical veg room today. Probably not going to use any hydroponics in it. I'm already in soiless, but I have really been wanting to get back to hydroponics. I hated the upkeep, but I love the lack of mess, not to mention, the physical labor with hydro is just less physical.


I agree its less physical. You can do a set it and forget it...Well kind of. I have some drip for the plants in the big net pots and they really love it. They responded very well to them actually. Im going to do a rez change early in the morning also. I need to up the PPM's. I will just wait until I flip to flower and add the other 600w light.


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## Jozikins (Jul 12, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> I agree its less physical. You can do a set it and forget it...Well kind of. I have some drip for the plants in the big net pots and they really love it. They responded very well to them actually. Im going to do a rez change early in the morning also. I need to up the PPM's. I will just wait until I flip to flower and add the other 600w light.


 Friggin' sweet. I think holding off on the other 600w until flower is a good idea.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 13, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Friggin' sweet. I think holding off on the other 600w until flower is a good idea.


Great thats what I was thinking! Come Monday I will switch to flower.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 15, 2011)

Day 31


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## Jozikins (Jul 16, 2011)

Those roots are a little too brown compared to what you had, what are your rest temps? And how often are you changing res? It should be at least once every two weeks.

Still pretty healthy though, do you have any enzyme products?


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## drekoushranada (Jul 16, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Those roots are a little too brown compared to what you had, what are your rest temps? And how often are you changing res? It should be at least once every two weeks.
> 
> Still pretty healthy though, do you have any enzyme products?


I just did a rez change 3 days ago. I have been doing a change every 10 days as instructed. The reason the roots are that color is because I just put in 3 gallons of Heisenberg Tea in the system. I was a little heavy on the Ancient Forest on this batch by mistake. It fouled a few of my sprayers but all is well now. I strained it using a fish tank net also. That stuff came out super dark but smelled so great. These plants are about 6 week old now from seed and I want to see some preflowers. Because it is pretty full in the tent. Can I still give them Grow nutes for 1 week into flower? Plus how do you feel about the 36 hour dark period before flowering stage? Your help has been so useful with this grow. A million thanks to you.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 16, 2011)

I know the roots in my pics are a bit concerning so here are some pics of the same roots that were rinsed with a bit of fresh water.  Please note that I didnt rinse the top near the net pots. I did not want to stress the plants nor the bennies in that area. Not sure if it would have or not though.


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## Jozikins (Jul 17, 2011)

Alright, this is my 666th post! Hail Satan.

You sir are correct. Your roots look great. The humic acid stains thew me off. You can give veg nutes during the first week of flower, some people advise it, I do not. I advise a really low strength flower formula with plenty of enzymes and beneficial organisms to suck up everything left from veg. After that I suggest continuing on with your plans in flower. I also think the 36 hour darkness period is a lot of bs. You will see faster results into flowering, I have seen it personally because I did this, but not by my own will, my power went out for 2 days... Fucking weak.... But I noticed my plants were stressed and stretched out more than anything, and I think just recovering from that stress added another week onto my flowering period. 

You can always clone for sex, you could have your answer in as little as a week. Do you know how to clone for sex? It's just like normal cloning but you root them under 12/12 instead of the normal 18/6 or 24/0 cycle.

Dude I am more than happy to help you. You put some money and thought into your grow and you deserve good advise for being a good student and researching like you should have in the first place. I hope you do really well. You've already done a pretty good job of running with concepts I have trouble wrapping my head around.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 17, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Alright, this is my 666th post! Hail Satan.
> 
> You sir are correct. Your roots look great. The humic acid stains thew me off. You can give veg nutes during the first week of flower, some people advise it, I do not. I advise a really low strength flower formula with plenty of enzymes and beneficial organisms to suck up everything left from veg. After that I suggest continuing on with your plans in flower. I also think the 36 hour darkness period is a lot of bs. You will see faster results into flowering, I have seen it personally because I did this, but not by my own will, my power went out for 2 days... Fucking weak.... But I noticed my plants were stressed and stretched out more than anything, and I think just recovering from that stress added another week onto my flowering period.
> 
> ...


666 post! haha. Thanks for the comps. Well I just added another 600w in the tent. So that is a total of 1200 watts in the 5x5. I have one mh and one hps. I ran out of money and could not grab another hps bulb. Will that be a problem running different bulbs? I dont know how to clone at all. Can I just stick them in a glass of water? i am seeing some growth at the stipules where the pre-flowers form at but I dont know if the are developed enough to tell. I can post pics tomorrow if you want me to. Wont they show the sex in a week in the tent under flower? The flower period starts tomorrow.


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## Jozikins (Jul 17, 2011)

Cloning is easy, remove a lower branch with a sharp razor and cut it at a 45 degree angle. Remove all but 3-4 nodes and stick it in cloning gel and into a rockwool cube. If you don't have cloning gel it is alright, they will root without it, but much slower. Normally we take a branch from the middle of the plant, our best and healthiest, but that is for producing our next generation, you are just going to put these under 12/12 until they start to flower and then throw them away, so a low cut is fine. Sounds like you won't have time to wait for them to root, however. Just keep a very close eye on them if you flower them all together. The males can develop their flowers much faster than the females can. I've seen pollen sacks form and open in only a few days time, sometimes they develop on different parts of the plants than you normally check and they can get you that way. 
Just be careful, and all should be fine.

A MH/HPS combo is great. Some people actually purchase a MH set up just to balance the spectrum of their HPS. You should get great results with it, but remember that MH gives off less lumens than HPS, but with the same amount of electricity.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 18, 2011)

1st day of flower starts today. Wish me luck. haha. Im sure I will need it. The plants are all over a foot tall with the tallest ones being 22" or so. Well it is 2 seedling in the room but there are lost in the jungle somewhere. Oh yeah I took a stab at LST!


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## drekoushranada (Jul 19, 2011)

Flowering tips?...


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## drekoushranada (Jul 19, 2011)

Dang I made a mistake and burnt two leaves with a light when I was not paying attenting. Can I just trim that part off the leaf?


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## Jozikins (Jul 20, 2011)

Yeah just cut that part off, it'll be fine. I like how the plants are enclosing that space so well, they should take up the whole room while flowering even if you half to cull out half of them after sexing. 

I can't tell if they are male or female yet. You need to get a really good clear close up of the nodes near the middle of the plant. that whole region is usually where I see my first preflowers.

There seems to be a lot of 5x5 tents in my area for sail on craigslist, for cheap, I never payed any attention because I run horizontal 600w, but it seems perfect for 600w vertical. I think I might give it a try. I already bought a 4x4 tent to try scroging, and I am about to buy a 3x3 tent for moms and larger vegging plants... but I think I will put the scrog in the 3x3, because I only use 600w for flower, and I will veg and put moms and T5 in 4x4, and then vertical in the 5x5. Basically see if I can make more yield in the 3x3 with a compact "stealth" style like SCROG or a 5x5 ballsy vertical grow, which isn't so compact on this scale.

LST looks good though, if you keep the plants nice and healthy you are guaranteed a dank as fuck harvest.

You have maybe a day or two at the most to clone those things without the clones revegging on you. You are probably going to end up with some buds that you are going to fall in love with, but never be able to smoke again unless you take a clone. Or it could just be an amazingly easy plant to deal with and high yielding. Either way, you better do it before it's too late. In my opinion, revegged clones are garbage.

My best tip for flowering is keep your RH around 40-45% and you probably shouldn't do anymore LST now that they have started to flower, at least not after the first week or two. Flowering is all about timing, you need to know what to add and when, and how much. For most 8-9 week flowering strains they eat the most between weeks 3-5, so at the start of week 6 we should start decreasing nutrients, if you aren't already flushing. I really don't feel a 2 week flush is necessary in DWC. 9 days is the longest I have ever gone in hydroponics, and that is pretty long. Some people do two weeks, but I don't know, it depends on you plant mostly, I suppose.

Also, now that they are in 12/12, all the shoots and stalks will stiffen up pretty quick, so don't fuck around with them too much, or you could snap a plant, I did that once to a SFV that was 2 or 3 weeks deep.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 20, 2011)

I will love to try my hand at cloning but I have to leave the state soon for a few months. So sadly I wont be able to start grow number 2 for a good while.They are starting to eat like crazy though. On friday I will start adding bloom nutes and get a microbe brew going. These things are loving the system. My ppm are at 624 now. They are drinking like crazy. Way over 5 gallons a day.


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## Jozikins (Jul 21, 2011)

Lame. Blow off your responsibilities and keep growing pot! haha.

5 gallons a day is insane though. You got a green thumb, buddy.


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## Luger187 (Jul 21, 2011)

just read through the thread. your shit looks nice man! very good for a first time.

where is the MH going to go? r u leaving the HPS vertical, or is that going horizontal? thatd be cool to have both bulbs vertical and next to eachother. theyd have to be on some sort of frame though so the wind doesnt smash the bulbs together haha. also if the frame spun back and forth, everyone would get blue and red spectrum


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## drekoushranada (Jul 21, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Lame. Blow off your responsibilities and keep growing pot! haha.
> 
> 5 gallons a day is insane though. You got a green thumb, buddy.


I wish it was that easy. LOl. I was hoping I did.



Luger187 said:


> just read through the thread. your shit looks nice man! very good for a first time.
> 
> where is the MH going to go? r u leaving the HPS vertical, or is that going horizontal? thatd be cool to have both bulbs vertical and next to eachother. theyd have to be on some sort of frame though so the wind doesnt smash the bulbs together haha. also if the frame spun back and forth, everyone would get blue and red spectrum


Everything will stay vertical in the tent. Right now the plants get both blue and red. I will keep both bulbs in the tent for the whole grow.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 22, 2011)

I did a few up grades on the system to protect the plants from growing into the lights and burning their leaves. I will post pics later.


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## Luger187 (Jul 22, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> I wish it was that easy. LOl. I was hoping I did.
> 
> 
> Everything will stay vertical in the tent. Right now the plants get both blue and red. I will keep both bulbs in the tent for the whole grow.


so the bulbs r right next to eachother, just hanging? wont they blow around in the wind and possibly hit eachother? if they r just hanging like that, maybe get some kind of stick or rod, and attach one of these metal cable ties to each end 





then tie the ties around the light bulbs base. now the bulbs will always be seperated by whatever the length of the rod is


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## drekoushranada (Jul 22, 2011)

Luger187 said:


> so the bulbs r right next to eachother, just hanging? wont they blow around in the wind and possibly hit eachother? if they r just hanging like that, maybe get some kind of stick or rod, and attach one of these metal cable ties to each end
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I installed cages around the lights to protect them from hitting each other and burning the plants.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 22, 2011)

I think we have a boy!! What you all think? Sorry for the blurry second pic.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 22, 2011)

I think we have our first boy!! What do you all think? I apologize for the blurry second pic.


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## Luger187 (Jul 22, 2011)

looks like it. wait for more confirmation before killing it


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## Jozikins (Jul 22, 2011)

Those are _without a doubt_, balls. 

I just cancelled a breeding project, so I'm very familiar with naners on a plant, I was actually looking for plants with them for a while. Chop him down, send him to hell for making you spend all this money for nothing.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 23, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Those are _without a doubt_, balls.
> 
> I just cancelled a breeding project, so I'm very familiar with naners on a plant, I was actually looking for plants with them for a while. Chop him down, send him to hell for making you spend all this money for nothing.


Thats what I am going to do! These damn things are showing up all over the plant within just one day of me seeing them. Well the good thing is more space for the plant that I know for sure is a female right next to it. To HELL he shall go!!


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## drekoushranada (Jul 23, 2011)

Luger187 said:


> looks like it. wait for more confirmation before killing it


I went into the grow room today and looked at the plant and its alot more of those freaking balls on the plant. Not one freaking hair!! the thing now that is giving them away is that they are growing in bunches.


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## Luger187 (Jul 23, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> I went into the grow room today and looked at the plant and its alot more of those freaking balls on the plant. Not one freaking hair!! the thing now that is giving them away is that they are growing in bunches.


remove it asap. he is going to pollinate the girls soon. if he does, your weed will be full of seeds


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## drekoushranada (Jul 23, 2011)

Luger187 said:


> remove it asap. he is going to pollinate the girls soon. if he does, your weed will be full of seeds


He is now gone. I am just waiting for the others to come out and show their colors!


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## Luger187 (Jul 23, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> He is now gone. I am just waiting for the others to come out and show their colors!


hopefully thats the only male u got. did u already switch to 12/12? thatd be nice if u could get a clone to replace that male. u would need to veg it for a bit though to get a nice root system


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## Jozikins (Jul 24, 2011)

Luger187 said:


> hopefully thats the only male u got. did u already switch to 12/12? thatd be nice if u could get a clone to replace that male. u would need to veg it for a bit though to get a nice root system


 For reals. I don't think he has anything else to fall back on unless he has a local dispensary that does DWC. I've never seen a DWC nursery before, would be pretty neat though. 

Can you safely rearrange them Dre? Or LST?


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## drekoushranada (Jul 24, 2011)

Luger187 said:


> hopefully thats the only male u got. did u already switch to 12/12? thatd be nice if u could get a clone to replace that male. u would need to veg it for a bit though to get a nice root system


Yeah I dont have any clones at all. Today will be day 7 of 12/12. I need to start another microbe tea and do a water change.



Jozikins said:


> For reals. I don't think he has anything else to fall back on unless he has a local dispensary that does DWC. I've never seen a DWC nursery before, would be pretty neat though.
> 
> Can you safely rearrange them Dre? Or LST?


 Yes they actually rearrange with no problem at all. The other plants have pretty much taken up that new territory already. They grow so freaking fast. I think I may have 2-3 males left but I will make sure they are. The females are starting to spit a few hairs which is pretty darn cool. I need to keep the nice and healthy for 7-10 more weeks. They are loving the lights in that place. They took off even more when they were added. The tent stays at 86f and sometimes may reach 88f. But its plenty of air moving in that thing plus the plants dont seem to mind at all. I had to grab some yo yo's because some of them are getting too heavy for the 3" net pots. Next time I will do all 6" net pots.


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## Luger187 (Jul 24, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> Yeah I dont have any clones at all. Today will be day 7 of 12/12. I need to start another microbe tea and do a water change.
> 
> Yes they actually rearrange with no problem at all. The other plants have pretty much taken up that new territory already. They grow so freaking fast. I think I may have 2-3 males left but I will make sure they are. The females are starting to spit a few hairs which is pretty darn cool. I need to keep the nice and healthy for 7-10 more weeks. They are loving the lights in that place. They took off even more when they were added. The tent stays at 86f and sometimes may reach 88f. But its plenty of air moving in that thing plus the plants dont seem to mind at all. I had to grab some yo yo's because some of them are getting too heavy for the 3" net pots. Next time I will do all 6" net pots.


nice, sounds good. temps r a little high, but if they dont seem to be bothered by it, it shouldnt be too big of a deal. you will probably need to change to bloom nutes soon. what r those yo yo's for again? i thought they were for hanging lights


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## drekoushranada (Jul 24, 2011)

Luger187 said:


> nice, sounds good. temps r a little high, but if they dont seem to be bothered by it, it shouldnt be too big of a deal. you will probably need to change to bloom nutes soon. what r those yo yo's for again? i thought they were for hanging lights


I actually use them for the plants and the lights. They are made out of some stuff that looks like fishing line.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 24, 2011)

Well out of the plants I had 3 males total. So that was 3 males and 3 females out of the bagseeds. Now I do have 2 sprouts that I dont know the sex off yet. But they may end up getting bullied by the bigger plants. So I may have to take them out of the system anyway.


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## Luger187 (Jul 25, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> I actually use them for the plants and the lights. They are made out of some stuff that looks like fishing line.


just use string and zip ties for the plants. i found yo yos to be a pain in the ass to hang light with. i used 12 gauge insulated wire. it bends easily into whatever shape, but is strong enough to hold a lot of weight. ive got like 100ft roll in my garage haha



drekoushranada said:


> Well out of the plants I had 3 males total. So that was 3 males and 3 females out of the bagseeds. Now I do have 2 sprouts that I dont know the sex off yet. But they may end up getting bullied by the bigger plants. So I may have to take them out of the system anyway.


aww that sucks. id try to keep those 2. u cant put the big ones towards one side, and the small ones towards the other?


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## drekoushranada (Jul 25, 2011)

Luger187 said:


> just use string and zip ties for the plants. i found yo yos to be a pain in the ass to hang light with. i used 12 gauge insulated wire. it bends easily into whatever shape, but is strong enough to hold a lot of weight. ive got like 100ft roll in my garage haha
> 
> 
> 
> aww that sucks. id try to keep those 2. u cant put the big ones towards one side, and the small ones towards the other?


I will most certainly try that. Those two girls have taken up the back walls of the tent very nice way. So I think I shall let them stay there so the breeder strains can catch up. Im hoping the bagseeds are some indica dominant stuff because the sativa takes too long to finish.


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## Jozikins (Jul 25, 2011)

You can stick those little seedlings in your flood table, and let them grow with everything else. Help take up some of that wasted light in the middle. I'm such a fucking light nazi.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 25, 2011)

I will be sure to do that!


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## Jozikins (Jul 25, 2011)

Cool dude. If you want an easy way to get the roots in the cubes, I used to just split the soaked cube open like a hot dog bun and stuck the roots in the middle, folded it back up, and put it back in it's plastic or into another cube. Roots usually show within 5 days. This is how me and a old room mate did it with an aerocloner when we were just clone farmers.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 27, 2011)

I made a few mods in the tent. All of the males are out. The temps stay around 81-82f. The RH has been 46-55. The PPM's are at 600. Are there are things you I think I need to improve on?


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## medicine21 (Jul 27, 2011)

Looking good, man! How are the water temps?

Your setup is cool, the only thing I don't like about it is that the plants all surround the light, thus only receiving light from one side. Unless, you are constantly rotating them, but that would be a pain... 

The ideal vert setup is like this: (X=plant, O=light)

5 plants / 4 lights.
X O X
O X O
X O X

And even better is this 4 plant / 5 light configuration. All plants here get light from 3 sides.

O X O
X O X
O X O

Usually vert and setups I gave above are for growing trees, which does not seem to be the case for you? I could be wrong, but I think you would've been better off with a horizontal setup unless you got no headroom at all? How come you went vert?


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## drekoushranada (Jul 27, 2011)

medicine21 said:


> Looking good, man! How are the water temps?
> 
> Your setup is cool, the only thing I don't like about it is that the plants all surround the light, thus only receiving light from one side. Unless, you are constantly rotating them, but that would be a pain...
> 
> ...


I went vert because it was cheaper and a lot simpler to design for me and im running multiple strains so the canopy height is of no concern with me with the vert set up. This is my first grow so I will most certainly learn from this grow. Trying to gain some experience. Yeah im not really growing trees yet. But I did want the plants to surround the lights. The tent is 6'6". But with the pots I would have to take off another 2 feet from that. The water temps are 75-77f. I keep a Heisenberg Microbe Tea going in the system at all times and I must say the plants love it. I check the root zone 2-4 times a week maybe more and it has not been any signs of slime. The pics may make it seem like the plants are not getting any light on the other side but my camera makes it dark like that. Trust me when I say its no shaded part in the tent. I turned the plants once the males were taken out which was a few days ago and they have already taken over that area. I did a little LST which the plants loved. +rep for stopping by. So any other advice will be very welcomed. Im new to this so im trying to grab as much knowledge as I can.


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## medicine21 (Jul 27, 2011)

Cool, man. I hope it works out for you. You definitely will learn a lot! I would however, still suggest you go horizontal next time. Nevertheless, your plants look great and you are doing well!


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## drekoushranada (Jul 27, 2011)

medicine21 said:


> Cool, man. I hope it works out for you. You definitely will learn a lot! I would however, still suggest you go horizontal next time. Nevertheless, your plants look great and you are doing well!


I will give horizontal a try for my next run to see how it goes.


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## Ponicengineer (Jul 27, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> All you need to start is earthworm castings, molasses and mycorrhizae. Molasses you can get from any grocery store. They sell horticulture grade molasses, I have some but that is because it was gifted, but I used to use normal unsulfured molasses. Sulfur is a benefit though, it is not common to get a Sulfur deficiency, but i have experienced it in the past, with 2 strains in particular.
> 
> You can get worm castings from any good nursery, molasses you can get at the grocery store or hydro store, I know the Hi-Brix by Earth Juice is thinner and easier to pour, it is also a very reasonable 18 bucks for 1 gallon. But if you get the grocery store stuff just pop a pre measured amount into the microwave and heat it for a few seconds to soften it up. I like to use a ceramic espresso shot glass for that. Mycorrhizae you can get from a variety of hydroponic outlets and from high end nurserys. You can find it in a liquid or powdered form, but powder goes a lot further. The best part about teas is that you only need a little bit, the idea is that it breeds and multiplies in the bucket so you can make a product that is only good for 50 servings, and make 150 servings out of it.
> 
> ...


I put sulfur in my peppers when I grow them as good peppers need sulfur. Take a book of matches and cut the heads off with scissors. Position them depending on what type of system you run so the water takes the sulfur heads and dissolves them. It has worked great for me in the past.


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## Jozikins (Jul 28, 2011)

Ponicengineer said:


> I put sulfur in my peppers when I grow them as good peppers need sulfur. Take a book of matches and cut the heads off with scissors. Position them depending on what type of system you run so the water takes the sulfur heads and dissolves them. It has worked great for me in the past.


For reals? That is fucking ingenuity! But you can also buy pure elemental sulfer from any excellent nursery (I put stress on excellent) or any high end hydroponics shop. They sell it for both sulfur burners for rot/mildew, or as a pH amendment. It works fantastic to amend soil pH, my azalea's and camellia's will vouch for me... now I just need to get them out of the sunlight! I trimmed up the trees on my property to get more light to my cannabis, but I accidentally exposed all my shade loving parts of my garden to partial or even full sunlight now. Dammit. But I prefer the ganja to the camellias, although they both have pretty flowers 

I also highly recommend a dry humic acid in your teas! 

I bet if someone's tea was a little to alkaline they could brew it up with sulfur to fix the pH.... actually, that sounds stupid, that sounds like a recipe for fucking disaster. I would try it myself, but my tea always comes out very acidic at about 5.0, and I usually just add a little potassium silicate to my reservoir and then mix in the tea, and it all comes out to about 5.7-5.9 in the end. Love it!


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## drekoushranada (Jul 28, 2011)

That sounds like one awesome garden you got going on there Jozikins.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 28, 2011)

The plants in the 10" net pots dont have massive root balls like the ones in the 3" pots. It may also be because I have drip stakes feeding water from the top also. Do you think this could be a reason? It is day 12 of flower. Other than that the plants look awesome!


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## Jozikins (Jul 29, 2011)

Drippers are why, yeah. Usually people turn them off as soon as the roots hit the drink. You can use smaller net pots next time as well. 10" pots are pretty big.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 29, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Drippers are why, yeah. Usually people turn them off as soon as the roots hit the drink. You can use smaller net pots next time as well. 10" pots are pretty big.


So just turn off the off the other pump? Will it make a real difference if I didnt? Just trying to see if it will be best to keep the water circulation up.


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## ironheadxl (Jul 29, 2011)

LBH said:


> + rep THAT! My motto,...."Less is more" ....ESPECIALLY in hydro. I use 1/3 the nutes I did in soil. I rarely break 800ppm in flower, avg 500-600 This is awesome advice that we rarely see. Many like to push ppm to the limit thinking the more food, the better. I'm not a believer. In time you will learn to listen to what the plants are saying and address what they need as they tell you.


 spot fuckin' on too.


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## ironheadxl (Jul 29, 2011)

the stout indica like leaves sure look like they want to be cloned and scrogged. Awesome first grow, bang right out of the chute.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 29, 2011)

ironheadxl said:


> the stout indica like leaves sure look like they want to be cloned and scrogged. Awesome first grow, bang right out of the chute.


Thanks a lot. Once I get settled I shall get into the cloning game. In still trying to figure out what plants are Sativa or Indica. Most of them look like freaking hybrids even the bagseed.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 30, 2011)

Day 13 of 12/12


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## Jozikins (Jul 31, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> So just turn off the off the other pump? Will it make a real difference if I didnt? Just trying to see if it will be best to keep the water circulation up.


Once roots hit the drink real good, turn off the water pump.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 31, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Once roots hit the drink real good, turn off the water pump.


Ok cool. I want to make the diameter of the cage smaller but I dont think that will be a good idea. The plants are growing into it with their big fan leaves. Do the bud sites need direct light or are the size of the buds based off the amount of light the plant gets in general?


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## Jozikins (Jul 31, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> Ok cool. I want to make the diameter of the cage smaller but I dont think that will be a good idea. The plants are growing into it with their big fan leaves. Do the bud sites need direct light or are the size of the buds based off the amount of light the plant gets in general?


 That question is HIGHLY debatable. But for the most part, you do need more light coming to the bud sites, though I and others argue that as long as the leaves attached the nugs are being well lit, there shouldn't be much of a difference. Only in the final week or two when the fan leaves really aren't doing anything do you want to remove some that could be blocking nugs. I would not ever recommend removing leaves before that point unless they are causing a circulation issue.

I don't see an issue caused by shrinking the screen, besides the shadows will thicken up from the chicken wire obstructing the light.


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## drekoushranada (Jul 31, 2011)

I just dont want the plants to keep burning their leaves if I do shrink the cage. It may be best to wait until the stretch period is done huh? I will let the fan leaves be. Im about to put the other hps in the tent. I can tell that the side that gets the mh light grows alot different than the hps side. i like the hps side better. I will add the mh bach during the final weeks of flower. I may just add my cfl that I have from a reef tank for some overhead lighting. Its 48" long and about 300 true watts. Its more of a blue spectrum. Im sure the plants can figure out a way to use that extra light. I will cut the other water pump tomorrow.


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## Jozikins (Aug 1, 2011)

I'll be watching.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 1, 2011)

So my sprayers are pretty much clogged up! Im tired of this going on so im going to cut the pipe in the 2 back totes and pretty nuch make it a Under Current with a top feed. It will make much more circulation. Anybody see a problem with doing this?


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## Jozikins (Aug 2, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> So my sprayers are pretty much clogged up! Im tired of this going on so im going to cut the pipe in the 2 back totes and pretty nuch make it a Under Current with a top feed. It will make much more circulation. Anybody see a problem with doing this?


 Not personally, but I wouldn't be the authority on this one.


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## reaver1912 (Aug 2, 2011)

Nice thread mate, I was just wandering how big is your tent? as I can see you are accommodating a good number of plants. I'll keep an eye on this, really curios about the results


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## drekoushranada (Aug 2, 2011)

reaver1912 said:


> Nice thread mate, I was just wandering how big is your tent? as I can see you are accommodating a good number of plants. I'll keep an eye on this, really curios about the results


My tent measures 5x5x6.6". I actually only have 8 plants in the tent. Those 8 plants just happened to be bloody monsters.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 2, 2011)

Lol. Well I almost flooded my tent today after cutting the sprayer fittings. The pump flowing more than it drained. But That problem is fixed now I hope. I added the two cages and did a bit of training on the plants to get them out of the light bulbs. I also added another HPS bulb. That tent is bright. Here is a baby bud shot!


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## SWUSAZ (Aug 3, 2011)

Sub-d. Cool looking setup I wish I had the totes to rig a RDWC but I will make do with what I have and not what I want for now. Tea worked for me on my last LED only in a confined space and I averaged 81* reservoir temps (attic grow). Tea saved mine and I am using it again good luck.


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## MEGAyielder420 (Aug 3, 2011)

Dre I love what your doing here buddy. I gotta say Im proud of you. If your gonna do something do it right. I love the fact you converted to vertical. Keep up the good work.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 3, 2011)

SWUSAZ said:


> Sub-d. Cool looking setup I wish I had the totes to rig a RDWC but I will make do with what I have and not what I want for now. Tea worked for me on my last LED only in a confined space and I averaged 81* reservoir temps (attic grow). Tea saved mine and I am using it again good luck.


The tea is a life saver! What do you use to make yours?


MEGAyielder420 said:


> Dre I love what your doing here buddy. I gotta say Im proud of you. If your gonna do something do it right. I love the fact you converted to vertical. Keep up the good work.


Thanks for the props. This is my first grow ever and I just want to get it to harvest. I feel the vert set up is much easier to set up. I think im going to try 10 gallon air pots and coco for my next run but that wont be for a while. Have to get this first one under my belt. Im trying to get on your level and grow a few trees!
.


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## SWUSAZ (Aug 4, 2011)

I only have Zho powder, and Aqua Shield. I have the darnedest time trying to find the Ancient Forest EW. I am just trying to make do with those and they work. Like I said enjoy and use what I have not what I want. I use it mainly for soil grows but when I add a cup to my new rinsed seedlings in their little 2.5 gallon DWC's they go crazy within two days. I was getting a clear slime after the transplants, looked like frog eggs. LOL I think it was the small dirt particles attached to the roots that just would not rinse off.
A sweet grow you have in the mix, very impressed. Rep


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## drekoushranada (Aug 4, 2011)

SWUSAZ said:


> I only have Zho powder, and Aqua Shield. I have the darnedest time trying to find the Ancient Forest EW. I am just trying to make do with those and they work. Like I said enjoy and use what I have not what I want. I use it mainly for soil grows but when I add a cup to my new rinsed seedlings in their little 2.5 gallon DWC's they go crazy within two days. I was getting a clear slime after the transplants, looked like frog eggs. LOL I think it was the small dirt particles attached to the roots that just would not rinse off.
> A sweet grow you have in the mix, very impressed. Rep


Thanks a lot! I'm trying to get my feet wet with growing. The weirdest part about starting to grow is having to leave the plants alone. I have to keep in mind what the other great people that posted on my thread said. "less is more"!


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## drekoushranada (Aug 4, 2011)

I have noticed with using the MH is that the plants on that side are flowering at a slower rate than the plants that were on the HPS side. So thats why I changed both lights to HPS.


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## SWUSAZ (Aug 4, 2011)

Good move swapping out to HPS even though I have never used one. Trying to dial temps even in the house in a tent sucks. Ran the CMH last night (of course I left the Black Star panel on) temps made it to 84 so I guess I can leave them alone, that sucks. LOL
It would be killer to have a vertical bulb in each corner in cool tubes and two verticals. I would pay rent to watch that. LOL


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## Jozikins (Aug 4, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> Thanks for the props. This is my first grow ever and I just want to get it to harvest. I feel the vert set up is much easier to set up. I think im going to try 10 gallon air pots and coco for my next run but that wont be for a while. Have to get this first one under my belt. Im trying to get on your level and grow a few trees!
> .


 Lol, aren't we all trying to get to MEGA's level? That crazy bastard!



SWUSAZ said:


> I only have Zho powder, and Aqua Shield. I have the darnedest time trying to find the Ancient Forest EW. I am just trying to make do with those and they work. Like I said enjoy and use what I have not what I want. I use it mainly for soil grows but when I add a cup to my new rinsed seedlings in their little 2.5 gallon DWC's they go crazy within two days. I was getting a clear slime after the transplants, looked like frog eggs. LOL I think it was the small dirt particles attached to the roots that just would not rinse off.
> A sweet grow you have in the mix, very impressed. Rep


 You don't need the Ancient Forest , people just like it because it has some extra magic in it, but I do not believe it has any earthworm castings added to it. You can pick up a bag of earth worm castings and humus from any nursery (not the garden section of Home Depot) but you can find it in an Ace's Nursery, Ace's Hardware has separate nurseries and they are actually pretty good. They carry all the basics for hydroponics, not to mention bricks of coco coir that expand to 2 cubic feet for only 8 bucks. Ace's Nursery also has Grower's Gold, which is an amazing new product from Sunshine Mix, just in case anyone in here uses or like Sunshine Mix. You can also buy dry humus at any reputable nursery and or hydroponics store, in the most extremely rare occasions, you can find it dirt cheap at a hardware store, usually online is your best bet. You should also consider adding molasses to your tea, if you don't already.

http://www.ronshomeandhardware.com/33442-RDC04-40LB-Humus-p/368662.htm?utm_source=googleproducts&utm_medium=free_feed&utm_campaign=comparison_shopping_feeds&Click=1014 But I bet shipping is murder on a 40lb bag of anything.


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## SWUSAZ (Aug 4, 2011)

Great info and thanks on the Ace but unfortunately I have not seen a nursery ACE. Trees and more trees. Good catch about the tea and the sugar for the bugs, hell why earthworm castings why not just buy a container of wigglers at Wally World throw the worms into an outdoors flowerbed and put the containers old soil into the mix would that not be a Bennie?


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## drekoushranada (Aug 4, 2011)

I dont think the AF has any EWC in it as well. But it seems to work and I have a lot of it. Its 2 sprouts on the ends of my system that I just leave in the tent. I use those two plants to check the root health. Another thing I noticed is genetics is the name of the game with growing. I have plants that are budding like crazy but when I look at the root system on the 2 plants one has crazy roots and the other one don't have as much. I will post some updated pics this weekend of the ladies. I have some sativa's that are some slow starters in the back. I think they are just starting to bud because of the MH used. The reason I say that is because a few branches by the HPS are budding really well. I know I talked about this earlier but I feel I needed to add more detail. Hell I will love to grow one of those damn crazy trees Mega is growing. When I get to that point I think I will use 10 gallon Air Pots and Coco with a drip. I been liking the stuff I been seeing from Coco. Don't like the story of bugs though.


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## Jozikins (Aug 5, 2011)

SWUSAZ said:


> Great info and thanks on the Ace but unfortunately I have not seen a nursery ACE. Trees and more trees. Good catch about the tea and the sugar for the bugs, hell why earthworm castings why not just buy a container of wigglers at Wally World throw the worms into an outdoors flowerbed and put the containers old soil into the mix would that not be a Bennie?


Have an Armstrong near by? Any good nursery or nursery supply store will have them. Same with a hydroponics store. If you are the down to earth DIY grower than a worm farm is right up your alley! It's my next step in organics, Earthworm Compost is where it's at! Walmart is evil, remember that when you give them the cutesy names... I however, am your friend 



drekoushranada said:


> I dont think the AF has any EWC in it as well. But it seems to work and I have a lot of it. Its 2 sprouts on the ends of my system that I just leave in the tent. I use those two plants to check the root health. Another thing I noticed is genetics is the name of the game with growing. I have plants that are budding like crazy but when I look at the root system on the 2 plants one has crazy roots and the other one don't have as much. I will post some updated pics this weekend of the ladies. I have some sativa's that are some slow starters in the back. I think they are just starting to bud because of the MH used. The reason I say that is because a few branches by the HPS are budding really well. I know I talked about this earlier but I feel I needed to add more detail. Hell I will love to grow one of those damn crazy trees Mega is growing. When I get to that point I think I will use 10 gallon Air Pots and Coco with a drip. I been liking the stuff I been seeing from Coco. Don't like the story of bugs though.


Almost positive AF doesn't have any EWC. I am super interested in your experiments man, all of it is valuable information. Sativas can be very slow starters, with this blue dream it is hard to determine when it begins and when it ends. But HPS definitely gives you bigger fatter buds, no doubts about it! I have run the tests myself. and the answer is definitive. I want a drip system real bad, but I like the elbow grease I put into hand watering, it really allows me to tend to each individual plant's needs. But it is by no means an advanced technique! Lol!


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## drekoushranada (Aug 5, 2011)

Lol. Yeah a bit of elbow grease is healthy for us all. I think i may remove one ove those crazy branchy sativas in the back from the grow. To make more room and light for the critical plus or NLxBB. Not to sure what I want to do yet. I will post some pics tonight and get you guys inputs. I dont have the time to flower a pure sativa.


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## Jman305 (Aug 5, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


>


If you were still trying to figure out the indica/sativa side of things those leaves most def are indica. long and skinny is almost always indica, even if its only the phenotype. BTW, most brilliant setup and results for a first timer! This is better than a lot of peoples 2nd and 3rd time go arounds. mad props buddy!  Can't wait to see them at full flower.


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## Jozikins (Aug 5, 2011)

Jman305 said:


> If you were still trying to figure out the indica/sativa side of things those leaves most def are indica. long and skinny is almost always indica, even if its only the phenotype. BTW, most brilliant setup and results for a first timer! This is better than a lot of peoples 2nd and 3rd time go arounds. mad props buddy!  Can't wait to see them at full flower.



You got it backwards Jman, long and skinny is Sativa, just like my beautiful Blue Dream. But I'll cut you a break since I go by "Jman" when vending or volunteering at dispensaries. But you are most certainly correct that Dre is light years ahead most people on their first grow. I think he might have a little bit of genius in him. 

When are you going to get your feet wet, friend?


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## drekoushranada (Aug 6, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> You got it backwards Jman, long and skinny is Sativa, just like my beautiful Blue Dream. But I'll cut you a break since I go by "Jman" when vending or volunteering at dispensaries. But you are most certainly correct that Dre is light years ahead most people on their first grow. I think he might have a little bit of genius in him.
> 
> When are you going to get your feet wet, friend?


Yeah you informed him before I did. Its not really genius I was just lucky to find friends like you and others on this site that actually gave me the correct information. I just happen to be a good thinker. Haha. Well its about time for me to start up a microbe tea and get ready for a water change. Im coming up on day 20 something of flower. Should I up the ppm? They are at 950 ATM. I didnt think this Blue Widow would grow so well. It super surprised me. If I could have taken a clone to keep I would have. Once I get settled I will get into cloning. Because this sexing plants and trying to calculate the growth vigor is not fun trust me. I under calculated on all of that stuff.  Jozikins It seems like you have a busy schedule dude. But keep spreading that love bro. Im sure you are and will be getting it back 10 fold!


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## Jman305 (Aug 6, 2011)

lol I was going to edit my post before anyone noticed but you got me. I just had some amazing hydro last night and I must say I was thinking circles. Glad to know someone else has the nickname as well


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## Jman305 (Aug 6, 2011)

Upon further thought I saw a bubblegum grow awhile back that had similar leaf structure to the above photograph. I was under the impression that bubblegum was indica dominant. Does leaf structure vary by phenotype?



Jozikins said:


> You got it backwards Jman, long and skinny is Sativa, just like my beautiful Blue Dream. But I'll cut you a break since I go by "Jman" when vending or volunteering at dispensaries. But you are most certainly correct that Dre is light years ahead most people on their first grow. I think he might have a little bit of genius in him.
> 
> When are you going to get your feet wet, friend?


I've tried a couple of times through helping other people grow and tried an outdoor once but it got dug up and it was too late in the season to start over. I'm looking to save back and possibly start an indoor LED and CFL grow. I've seen more than promising results from Irishboy here on this site and I believe that a DWC setup with a little LST and ScROG would be the direction I'm looking to go. I've done a LOT of research on trimming and training techniques and how light effects our plants. There's a load of information out there. Just gotta get to savin that money back, those LED's are expensive.


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## Arabic (Aug 6, 2011)

since those in this thread are very knowledgeable, share some light on my situation please:

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-room-design-setup/453045-first-grow-1000w-flowering-room-2.html vid and pics in there. I'm a first time grower and your ambition resembles mine op


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## drekoushranada (Aug 6, 2011)

Well_ went in the tent and tried _to take some pics but its too darn bright for my cam. Well this is the best I could do friends.


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## SWUSAZ (Aug 6, 2011)

Sweet stuff starting to happen now and soon the fun really begins. Great work and so happy for you. Not sure if you are interested but you may want to check this out if you want to drop some temps for a possible better output spectrum. CMH cooler more stuff to play with. http://advancedtechlighting.com/cmhfact3.htm


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## Jozikins (Aug 7, 2011)

Jman305 said:


> Upon further thought I saw a bubblegum grow awhile back that had similar leaf structure to the above photograph. I was under the impression that bubblegum was indica dominant. Does leaf structure vary by phenotype?
> 
> 
> 
> I've tried a couple of times through helping other people grow and tried an outdoor once but it got dug up and it was too late in the season to start over. I'm looking to save back and possibly start an indoor LED and CFL grow. I've seen more than promising results from Irishboy here on this site and I believe that a DWC setup with a little LST and ScROG would be the direction I'm looking to go. I've done a LOT of research on trimming and training techniques and how light effects our plants. There's a load of information out there. Just gotta get to savin that money back, those LED's are expensive.


Usually that depends on which variety is dominant, indica or sativa, but, in rare instances, yes it can be based purely on phenotype. I have 2 sativa dominant plants that have GIGANTIC but very fat leaves, the very fat stature of the leaves makes it look like indica, but it's the giant size that is the sativa clue, you just wouldn't think about it. On the same note, I have a indica that has these little tiny skinny leaves, and it looks like it's sativa from just the leaves, but it's the smaller leaves that give away it's indica heritage. I happen to have an eye for the rare and bizarre though, so you wont see this commonly. I don't remember if Bubblegum is indica or sativa, but a quick google search could deal with that, but it's 4:20 am (smoke a bowl!) and I'm too tired for google. lol. 

LED and CFL are both great for veg, I've seen good results from LED in flower too, but HPS still trumps them all. LED is great if you have heat issues though, I am going to stick a 240w Blackstar panel between my two 600w HPS. The nice thing about LED growers is that they are usually new to the scene and give up easily, so I can trade them a oz or so for just about anything. After you sink all that money into making bud and you fail, you really just want some good bud out of it. Hopefully you do better than they do! I use CFL in veg right now, love it. Right in between MH and t5 quality wise and growth wise, better than t5 by a long shot. I am talking about 125w-250w horticulture grade CFL btw.

I have a few beasts going on outside right now actually, first time growing more than 3 or 4 plants outside. I suggest putting them in containers unless you have a safe back yard, containers are so nice and easy to move around or hide a plant on a rainy day. You should also consider ruderalis for your next out door, since you haven't completed a harvest yet. SCROG and LST are both the shit btw.



drekoushranada said:


> Yeah you informed him before I did. Its not really genius I was just lucky to find friends like you and others on this site that actually gave me the correct information. I just happen to be a good thinker. Haha. Well its about time for me to start up a microbe tea and get ready for a water change. Im coming up on day 20 something of flower. Should I up the ppm? They are at 950 ATM. I didnt think this Blue Widow would grow so well. It super surprised me. If I could have taken a clone to keep I would have. Once I get settled I will get into cloning. Because this sexing plants and trying to calculate the growth vigor is not fun trust me. I under calculated on all of that stuff.  Jozikins It seems like you have a busy schedule dude. But keep spreading that love bro. Im sure you are and will be getting it back 10 fold!


 It's people like you that keep me striving to do better. You do so well on your first attempt I need to make every attempt here-after a balls-to-the-wall attempt or I'm not going to stack up! I know it's hard to get everything down and adjusted in the beginning, but you are going to learn so much more from this multi strain grow. And I could have told you that the Blue Widow is a total beast, and champion grower! In speaking of which, my White Berry (reversed Blue Widow) is fucking totally systemic!! Every seedling so far has mold all over the stem about a month into veg. Pisses me off! This is what I get from buying seeds from someone who just breed out there own White Berry stock, instead of Paradise Seeds. Luckily I have 3 non moldy fem Grape Krush to replace them with, but still, I really wanted some White Berry again this harvest. Stupid bastard can't keep mold off his breeding pairs, wtf?? Don't sell that shit to me!

But seriously bro, I'm glad I can help you in any way. I know it will come back to me 10fold when you teach me something that is going to totally blow my mind. I mean, you've been borderline doing that this entire time. haha.
I am a busy mother fucker, no doubt about it. My schedule is grow, grow, grow, eat, shit, grow. I try and have as much fun with the cannabis scene here in CA as possible without breaking the law. The fact that the law out here has such a big fat gray line makes it quite the adventure.

Your plants look amazing btw, pretty fucking good for 20 days. I actually just finished brewing up some tea. I normally discard the stocking full of ewc and guano, but I decided to give it a second 36 hour round with fresh water after the initial 48 hour brew. If it doesn't go rancid it will be free food for all my outdoor plants. I'm trying not to spend too much money on outdoor, there is no point in doing it if you are dumping a bunch of money into it.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 9, 2011)

Okay Im starting to notice what people ment by the smell certain strains have. I touched one plant and it smelled like some of the best perfume ever. The Mrs. went crazy when she smelled it. The smell was a mixture of mint and fruit. Now its a few skunky ones in the mix I love. i am really thinking of getting rid of that pure sativa plant in the rear left hand side of my pics. Its a huge space bully and does not have bud sites like the other plants. Plus I dont have the time to flower this pure sativa. Do you all think I should get rid of it or give it some time? I think the Critical + can use the light more than that darn Sativa. I would love that brachy sucker if I was doing a Scrog.


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## Jozikins (Aug 10, 2011)

Yeah strong sativas should be outside or in a dedicated grow space, unless you have a small screen you can scrog with in the grow room. It is up to you if you want to throw her away, but the thing is, do you think the weight you gain from the new light will justify the weight lost by throwing out a plant. 

If she is causing a real problem for you or your other plants, you can't have a single plant jeopardize your entire grow. So if it must be done it must be done, with a cold heart. 

I love plants with unique smells, it's so hard to describe the sweet perfume my BD makes too, but it is a little skunky sometimes. I have had a few stains that have a wonderful perfume, and I've had some that were peppery or hashy, or even smell like mulling spices. I've had strains smell like straight skunk or straight earth. But BD is really fruity, that is for sure!

Oh, and my tea didn't go rank, it and actually got more than 48 hours brewing for the second batch. All the plants outside loved the second batch. It was low in PPM's but was super inoculated with all the amazing microbes I put into it. There is such thing as good sludge and bad sludge, my plants will tell you! Found a fucking caterpillar munching away though, squished him to hell! Spraying them down tomorrow.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 10, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Yeah strong sativas should be outside or in a dedicated grow space, unless you have a small screen you can scrog with in the grow room. It is up to you if you want to throw her away, but the thing is, do you think the weight you gain from the new light will justify the weight lost by throwing out a plant.
> 
> If she is causing a real problem for you or your other plants, you can't have a single plant jeopardize your entire grow. So if it must be done it must be done, with a cold heart.
> 
> ...


Damn those bugs. Im sure the outdoors plants have a super sweet smell. Im going to grab some of that extra caging I have and train it today. I love bennies. I think plants gain more from using them. How big do your outdoor plants get? The weight gain vs throwing it out is a great question. Im not sure really. So since im not sure I will just make a screen!


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## drekoushranada (Aug 10, 2011)

These are some bloody great ladies. I did a ton of training and cleaning up today that took me almost 2 hours. Had to turn the HIDs of and put in some cfls so I could work and take some pics. Im not sure why I didnt take no pics after the clean up and training but I forgot. Im still learning and keeping it balls to the walls. I decided to keep the Sativa lady. This vert grow is making some soon to be huge colas out of branches that you would not of imagined would ever make any. Got a pick of the stem of that sativa I was going to get rid of. I know it look crowded. Haha. Im going to do a water change tomorrow and up the ppms to 1100-1200. They are really hungry and im sure they will take well to the increase from what I have been seeing. I got the tent dialed in and my temps are between 77-81 with lights on. Any advice or questions?


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## SWUSAZ (Aug 10, 2011)

Sweet Jesus you are going to have your hands full throw up some picks after the colossal garden has been tended, this I have to see. I am thinking of individual SCROG screens for each type of container whether hydro sort or a soil too pre-empt any cutting problems. But I only have the 400 CMH and the LED. I pity you if these beasts all finish close to the same time. Of course you will be feeling fine and the finger / hand pain will be all that much more enjoyable.


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## SWUSAZ (Aug 10, 2011)

Also noted during your initial assembly, I see you were taking into account the flow patterns, is that why you beveled intakes and outputs to not flow straight thru I believe that was your intent correct? And if you were going to build the containers again would you have moved the intakes on outputs to opposite ends? Reason I am asking as this is my first real grow and I am leaning towards these Igloo 5 day coolers that are approx 18 X 24 footprint which in the 4 X 4 tent will leave me with some maneuvering room. Have you seen them they are on wheels with a extendable handles integrated in Wally World? I think with my extreme heat in the valley of the sun that would assist in the res temps staying manageable. Maybe temps can even be maintained at the magical 70 degree mark inside an AC room not sure. Just throwing thing out there trying to learn from those that are a step ahead.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 10, 2011)

SWUSAZ said:


> Sweet Jesus you are going to have your hands full throw up some picks after the colossal garden has been tended, this I have to see. I am thinking of individual SCROG screens for each type of container whether hydro sort or a soil too pre-empt any cutting problems. But I only have the 400 CMH and the LED. I pity you if these beasts all finish close to the same time. Of course you will be feeling fine and the finger / hand pain will be all that much more enjoyable.


Lol. My hands were super sticky after I finished with them. I will try to grab some pics tomorrow. I would do it now but they are sleeping. Im sure you can set up a mean Scrog with the combo of the 400 CMH and LED. I hope I will have some help trimming them up for sure! I noticed with a vert grow you can run pretty much any strain as long as the ladies feed the same. But even if they dont im sure they will find plenty of food in the over 75 gallons of sauce running in the system. Im actually very aprehensive of taking on a soil grow. I know it may seem crazy but I am. But im going to get an outdoor organic one in sometime.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 10, 2011)

SWUSAZ said:


> Also noted during your initial assembly, I see you were taking into account the flow patterns, is that why you beveled intakes and outputs to not flow straight thru I believe that was your intent correct? And if you were going to build the containers again would you have moved the intakes on outputs to opposite ends? Reason I am asking as this is my first real grow and I am leaning towards these Igloo 5 day coolers that are approx 18 X 24 footprint which in the 4 X 4 tent will leave me with some maneuvering room. Have you seen them they are on wheels with a extendable handles integrated in Wally World? I think with my extreme heat in the valley of the sun that would assist in the res temps staying manageable. Maybe temps can even be maintained at the magical 70 degree mark inside an AC room not sure. Just throwing thing out there trying to learn from those that are a step ahead.


Yes I have seen those coolers and I think they are great. I heard they are some awesome insulators. Well if I had to do it all over again I would use 6" pots and have the water floweing from the top. I think I have another much simpler design that will give even better results. I had to change so many things after the misters got clogged. Now the water flows free through the 3/4" pvc. Make sure you use ball valves so you can control the flow. Well you actually only need one on your pump. As far as the inlets and outlets go I had to adjust them to my tent. I originaly wanted them on the outside.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 11, 2011)

ROOT PORN!! I got a few request to see the root zone. So I figured I will take some during the water change. This is the roots of the Dinafem Blue Widow. The tent after I did the training yesterday.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 12, 2011)

I may be getting rid of the grow you all. The ex girlfriend that stays with me made a comment I didn't like in the form of a threat. I think im going to deep 6 the operation tomorrow! This really sucks because I put a lot in it!


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## ironheadxl (Aug 12, 2011)

that is ugly. am so sorry to hear - no one deserves that.


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## SWUSAZ (Aug 12, 2011)

Dam ouch maybe on a smaller scale she will understand. We hope all the best for you.


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## Jman305 (Aug 12, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> I may be getting rid of the grow you all. The ex girlfriend that stays with me made a comment I didn't like in the form of a threat. I think im going to deep 6 the operation tomorrow! This really sucks because I put a lot in it!


 Tell her to gtfo lol. No man I'm just kidding, that really sucks. You put a lot of time and effort into this grow and you've been having amazing results. Sorry to hear about that.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 12, 2011)

Well have realized how retarded some people can act some times under anger. But im happy to report the show is still going on folks! She knows how much I been loving this new hobby of mine and plus she will have some top notch meds. So it all good!  it would of sucked to have to get rid of them. I am going to add my microbe brew to the system soon. I will also up the ppms. Im interested in knowing if the amount of gallons in the system have any affect on the ppms you need to give your plants? Say I have 1 plant in a 5 gallon bucket with the ppm at 850 in one system and in another system like mine I have 7 plants in 85 gallons of sauce at the same ppm. I think that the circulating system can eat longer that the 5 gallon one without having to use so much fertilizer. Am I getting somewhere here? Im just not sure.


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## SWUSAZ (Aug 13, 2011)

I would be careful with the nutes as we all know different strains like different amounts. I personally would stay low on the PPM's if they are healthy maybe bump 200 and leave them be for a week and watch and learn what they want. I tried a run with a single res at a friends and we burnt some while the others loved it. Stay with the tea and medium nute strength and they should be fine. Your assumptions are dead on the small res should flux a hell of a lot more than the big buffer of all that H2O. Just remember controlling the res PPM is your ticket to happiness.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 13, 2011)

SWUSAZ said:


> I would be careful with the nutes as we all know different strains like different amounts. I personally would stay low on the PPM's if they are healthy maybe bump 200 and leave them be for a week and watch and learn what they want. I tried a run with a single res at a friends and we burnt some while the others loved it. Stay with the tea and medium nute strength and they should be fine. Your assumptions are dead on the small res should flux a hell of a lot more than the big buffer of all that H2O. Just remember controlling the res PPM is your ticket to happiness.


 I will keep the ppm in the medium range then.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 17, 2011)

These are a few pics of the ladies. Some of them have yellow tips but the PPms are at 750 after the water change. I should of got rid of that pure sativa like I was going to do. But oh well.


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## hydroleaf (Aug 17, 2011)

wow beautiful setup


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## ironheadxl (Aug 17, 2011)

as much as Sativia is a PIA! to grow it is such a fine ass smoke. Your in the home stretch Homie ! I've got 2 week seedlings and pocketful of hope lol.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 17, 2011)

Lol. I know they are a good smoke but they had to go. I may start some outside one day. Here are the plants after I got rid of the space bullies. They may take a few days to recover from the adjustments but im sure they are loving all of the light they are getting. I hope I did not affect my yield too much by waiting until day 30 to remove the 2 plants. I just wanted to see what they would do. I guess its part of the learning curve of being a new grower.I still hope to grow at least a pound out of my first grow. Its just a goal. I am know down to 5 plants.


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## Jozikins (Aug 18, 2011)

It is part of the learning curve. But it's your responsible approach that is going to ensure you a great harvest. A good grower would have known to throw those out. I didn't see that lighter colored undergrowth before, I didn't know they were that shaded. I think you helped yourself a bit, even in day 30. A pound off 5 trees isn't so unreasonable, I think 3oz a plant would be pretty accurate, I think you might get a 4oz plant or 2. If you get .5g per watts on your first run you are already rocking and rolling just like some of the big boys. Some people pull 1 gram per watt, but that is tough as fuck, .78 grams per watt is my record, I hope to break that in the next grow or 2.


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## MEGAyielder420 (Aug 18, 2011)

Dre the plants are coming along great buddy especially for your first grow. Keep up the good work! +REP


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## drekoushranada (Aug 18, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> It is part of the learning curve. But it's your responsible approach that is going to ensure you a great harvest. A good grower would have known to throw those out. I didn't see that lighter colored undergrowth before, I didn't know they were that shaded. I think you helped yourself a bit, even in day 30. A pound off 5 trees isn't so unreasonable, I think 3oz a plant would be pretty accurate, I think you might get a 4oz plant or 2. If you get .5g per watts on your first run you are already rocking and rolling just like some of the big boys. Some people pull 1 gram per watt, but that is tough as fuck, .78 grams per watt is my record, I hope to break that in the next grow or 2.


Yeah I should of went with my first instinct and got rid of them. But I was not sure it it was due to the different spectrum of light they were getting that had some thing to do with it. So I let them go a little bit longer with the HPS. When I seen no difference I chopped them. Im sure the plants would love this new light they are getting. But its one of those learning curves. Its one plant that has multiple huge colas. If I only knew 100% what strain it is. I think I mixed them up when I germed them but oh well. I had to tie the colas up because they are falling everywhere. Its time I go buy a few more yoyo's for sure.



MEGAyielder420 said:


> Dre the plants are coming along great buddy especially for your first grow. Keep up the good work! +REP


Thanks a lot for the kind words. Im sure they are going to benefit a ton from the change. I will have some updates next week. The tent is smelling pretty great BTW!


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## Jozikins (Aug 18, 2011)

So what are you going to do with those chopped plants? Hash or edibles? Have you checked out dry ice hash? Nothing gives me a boner like the simplicity of dry ice hash.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 18, 2011)

Im going to have to check out a video. You think its a how to on dry ice hash on Youtube?


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## Jozikins (Aug 18, 2011)

That is where I learned about it. You are going to flip. You don't know the pains of making normal bubble hash yet, but it's a long and shitty process. I will take pressed kief over bubble hash if it saves me 1-2 days of time. 10 minute hash is a beautiful thing.


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## MEGAyielder420 (Aug 19, 2011)

Bubble hash is a pain in the ass. For this simple fact I choose to make iso or pressed kief over bubble hash. Dry Ice hash sounds interesting and any hash you can make in 10 mins and is fire sounds great to me. Im gonna look into this myself. Let me know if you try it dre and how it comes out for.


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## MEGAyielder420 (Aug 21, 2011)

Dre I hope you dont mind bro. I know we were talking about the Dry Ice Hash a couple days ago. Im not sure if you gave it a try but I did. I got some pics for you. I thought you'd be interested.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 21, 2011)

MEGAyielder420 said:


> Dre I hope you dont mind bro. I know we were talking about the Dry Ice Hash a couple days ago. Im not sure if you gave it a try but I did. I got some pics for you. I thought you'd be interested.
> 
> View attachment 1746131View attachment 1746133View attachment 1746135


 I don't mind at all bro. I love it. How does it smoke?


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## MEGAyielder420 (Aug 21, 2011)

It smokes really well. The lighter more blonde looking one is more potent but they are both fire. This was the first experiment. I wanna prepare another batch soon. This one is going to be massive. I may even document it maybe I'll throw a vid on here for you guys. When I first smoked it earlier today I underestimated it. I smoked like two grams with my girl and then it hit us. We were both blasted bro we just looked at each other and started laughing. LOL!!!


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## drekoushranada (Aug 21, 2011)

Haha. Now that sounds like a fun time! What size micron/bag did you use?


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## MEGAyielder420 (Aug 22, 2011)

220 micron. I have seen people make it with both the 160 and the 220. I have yet to try it. Lots of fun Dre you will see what I mean when it just starts snowing hash when you flip the bucket its amazing how much Kief you see on the table.


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## Jozikins (Aug 22, 2011)

Going to go get dry Ice right now. hopefully dropping off a qp at the local dispensary. Fucking love California.


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## MEGAyielder420 (Aug 23, 2011)

Gotta love that! California Love!


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## drekoushranada (Aug 24, 2011)

So its day 38 of flower and I have yet to see a major or minimal increase in bud size. Any suggestions or just wait for it? The ppm are at 800 or so BTW.


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## SWUSAZ (Aug 24, 2011)

Drekoushranda have you been using tea by chance? Are you below 12hrs on the light on schedule maybe go down and hr that may help them to trigger them to bulk a tad faster but at only 40 days I think all is well. When it gets to 50 I decrease the time an hour and see what the effects are, not sure but it worked for me using LED.


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## Jozikins (Aug 24, 2011)

800 ppm is pretty low for week 5, week 5 is the heaviest feeding period, so go ahead and bump it up to 950 or 1000ppm. Week 6 bump it to 1000ppm - 1100ppm, and from there on out you can start flushing or bump it back down to 600 for the last week before flush. Depends on if you are flushing for 1 or 2 weeks. That should help fatten them up.

You are doing good with the minimalist theory here, more is less. But during week 4-6 is the plant's heaviest feeding schedule. Week 5 is usually when it starts, unless you have a 6 or 7 week bloomer.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 24, 2011)

SWUSAZ said:


> Drekoushranda have you been using tea by chance? Are you below 12hrs on the light on schedule maybe go down and hr that may help them to trigger them to bulk a tad faster but at only 40 days I think all is well. When it gets to 50 I decrease the time an hour and see what the effects are, not sure but it worked for me using LED.


Yes I am using Tea. I am right at 12hrs of light.



Jozikins said:


> 800 ppm is pretty low for week 5, week 5 is the heaviest feeding period, so go ahead and bump it up to 950 or 1000ppm. Week 6 bump it to 1000ppm - 1100ppm, and from there on out you can start flushing or bump it back down to 600 for the last week before flush. Depends on if you are flushing for 1 or 2 weeks. That should help fatten them up.
> 
> You are doing good with the minimalist theory here, more is less. But during week 4-6 is the plant's heaviest feeding schedule. Week 5 is usually when it starts, unless you have a 6 or 7 week bloomer.


 Ok the reason I kept it at 800 is because the tips were yellow. But I just was not sure if it was nute burn or not. I will get some more Bloom nutes on friday and up the feeding to 1000ppm. Any additives you all suggest during this time?


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## Jozikins (Aug 24, 2011)

I can think of a million different additives. I believe you are about ready for the kool bloom dry formula, if not the liquid is still always great. Floralicious and floralicious plus. MOAB is very effective for the first two and final two weeks, but that shit is dangerous so be careful! The fox farm trio pack of finishers is actually excellent. I do not like Fox Farm that much, but the ripeners are fucking amazing, just synthetic as it gets. So is MOAB though. Bud XL, Top Booster, and Shooting Powder from H&G are some of the most effective flower boosters I have ever used, but they are expensive components.

Usually your best bet is using boosters from your current manufacturer.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 24, 2011)

Right now im using Dyna Grow nutes and I dont think they make any. I think I will give the Kool Bloom powder a run to see how it works. I need to order my microscope as well.


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## wiimb (Aug 24, 2011)

Dre lovely looking set up and plants, sorry to hack ya thread, but could you or jozinkins look at this for me and tell me what ya's think?
They are 1 week 5 days into flowering and this is what i do daily before and after i add water readings and i think i could do with some more tips and i seen you's two mentioned are pretty clueded up lol
E and M means Edwina and Montana.


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## Jozikins (Aug 24, 2011)

All looks well, after adding water, ph buffers, or fertilizers, always remember to give your reservoir 20 minutes to fully incorporate the new additives before recording information, you will have more accurate data. The more you can tell me the more I can tell you.


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## wiimb (Aug 24, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> All looks well, after adding water, ph buffers, or fertilizers, always remember to give your reservoir 20 minutes to fully incorporate the new additives before recording information, you will have more accurate data. The more you can tell me the more I can tell you.


 Thats everything bascailly, im using advance nutes sensi grow/bloom


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## drekoushranada (Aug 24, 2011)

wiimb said:


> Thats everything bascailly, im using advance nutes sensi grow/bloom


No problem bro. Ask your questions. Its nothing but love and knowledge in this thread.


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## Jozikins (Aug 24, 2011)

Just made a bunch of dry ice hash, so fuuucking stooooonnnnned!!!


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## MEGAyielder420 (Aug 25, 2011)

Dre I have to agree with Jo on this one. I think 800ppm is too low at this stage of flowering. My girls are about as far along as yours and Im hitting them with 1150 right now plus my cal mag and my additives. Im like at 1400 out the door. You will know when its too high for them. I have a plant that no matter what you give her low ppms or high she will always burn up very lightly on the tips Ive come to a conclusion that this is normal with her. 

I give my girls both the Liquid and powdered koolbloom. I start the liquid KB as soon as the first week of flowering I introduce the powder kb pretty much after week 5. I like to bring my nutes down to about 700 the last week of feeding during week 6 or 7, then begin flushing. Look into the MOAB I heard this shit kicks ass!! If the MOAB is not available to you go look into the HC Gravity this stuff works its just very strong take it light or it can and will burn up your girls badly. Ive seen whole crops get ruined by the gravity. Not trying to scare you this shit is good! I just though I'd let you know.

Other than this your girls look good you can expect for them to slow down a little around this time, with my formula Ive noticed they really blow up the last couple weeks.


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## MEGAyielder420 (Aug 25, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Just made a bunch of dry ice hash, so fuuucking stooooonnnnned!!!


KICK ASS!!!! Im doing the same. This shit has saved my life while I wait for my girls to finish. Good thing the sour is coming around the corner. I got about a good 7 to 10 days left for those girls.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 25, 2011)

Cool thats good news. Well I just checked my ppm and its down by 100 ppm. I will be getting that stuff first thing tomorrow. I cant wait to do a Coco grow. Your ladies are looking great BTW. Im going to have to give that strain of yours a try.


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## vapedup (Aug 25, 2011)

GREAT first grow. Dre! Love the set up homie, just spent the better part of the morning reading all 24 pages, looking nice! I've learned a lot also, big ups to Joz and Mega for great info, can't wait to c some. Harvest pics! Some. Advice, u might want to start tying up some branches, cause when they swell, they SWELL, I learned the hard way!  check out my grow in my link, my first offical grow, cutting down Wednesday! +rep for Dre


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## Jozikins (Aug 25, 2011)

MEGAyielder420 said:


> KICK ASS!!!! Im doing the same. This shit has saved my life while I wait for my girls to finish. Good thing the sour is coming around the corner. I got about a good 7 to 10 days left for those girls.


Dude, I am so happy I found this technique out. My first shake made beautiful hash, and I kept her blond by scooping her up before I gave another shake. Fucking devastating hash man, I'm in the same predicament, my Blue Dream isn't chopped down for another 3 days, and I'm out of everything but this hash now. I can definitely "get by" with nothing but hash, ahahahaha  Anyways, I'll post some pics of this blonde beauty later on your thread.



drekoushranada said:


> Cool thats good news. Well I just checked my ppm and its down by 100 ppm. I will be getting that stuff first thing tomorrow. I cant wait to do a Coco grow. Your ladies are looking great BTW. Im going to have to give that strain of yours a try.


Yeah dude, time to add something cool to the res. But just like MEGA said, Gravity can burn up a crop, but I've had success with that stuff, just use it EXACTLY as they say, do not ever try and go over the recommended dose. MOAB is crazy good too, but it is dangerous fire! I burned up my entire first crop with it. Dre, if you choose the MOAB product, which is an amazing incredible product, seek council on it first from experienced users. I know a guy up here on the mountain that owns the hydro shop, his entire leg piece is devoted to MOAB. That is one hell of an endorsement.



vapedup said:


> GREAT first grow. Dre! Love the set up homie, just spent the better part of the morning reading all 24 pages, looking nice! I've learned a lot also, big ups to Joz and Mega for great info, can't wait to c some. Harvest pics! Some. Advice, u might want to start tying up some branches, cause when they swell, they SWELL, I learned the hard way!  check out my grow in my link, my first offical grow, cutting down Wednesday! +rep for Dre


Thanks for the shout out bro, appreciate it. When you are growing trees sometimes the lower branches get a little to fat, I remember my first crop. If you don't have the stem growth to support it (aint easy when they swell up like that) stringing them up is in your near future. I like Soft Tie, you can get it from the hydro shop, and it is strong, it stays wherever you bend it, and it doesn't cut into stems.


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## jigfresh (Aug 26, 2011)

Damn Dre... it's a good thing Jozikins got your back. Good dude isn't he. I thought I'd chime in on a couple things. Like Joz said, 0.5 g/w is a good ratio for a first grow (or any grow for that matter). I've never broken 0.55, and I think I'm doing pretty good.

For the trim, I would go for Butane Honey Oil. Definitely not the simplest of methods, but damn BHO is some good shit. My second choice would be dry ice hash. Bubble hash sucks to make (like everyone said).

MH definitely doesn't pack on the weight like HPS, but in my experience it does give a better taste, smell, and seems to produce more resin than the HPS buds. I think the best ratio for HPS/ MH is 3/2. A 600w hps and a 400w mh would be my dream setup for my closet.

I have the opposite opinion on the ppms than mega and joz. I think keeping the ppms as low as possible while still having happy plants is the way to go. HOWEVER.... that being said, you shared a bit of info that changes my opinion. You said the ppms dropped. That's what's so great about running DWC (or variations) is that the ppm meter will tell you how hungry the plants are. If the ppms are dropping, the plants are 'eating' more nutes than they are drinking water... so they want more nutes. If the ppms are rising, they are drinking more water than eating the nutes, so they want more water (less nutes). If the ppms are stable... then you are golden.

Additives. Something that boosts Potasium during flower is good. I use Potash+ from Dutch Masters, pretty sure most companies make some potash booster I just like DM stuff myself. Also I love me some Gravity. Just love it. If you want to know how I use it i'll tell you, but I'll spare myself the typing right now. I've read how people have lost their whole crop from using Humboldt country's own stuff, but I've always done well with Gravity and Bushmaster. Never burnt a plant yet (fingers crossed). Lastly about additives, I use DM Zone which is to keep the tank clean and the roots happy. I didn't read everything closely enough to know what you are using to keep the tank clean, but you should be using something. Happy roots = Big fruits.

In one picture you showed the stem and how fat it was, and there were some dry/ dead leaves around the bottom of the plant... you should clean that stuff up. They could potentially invite stuff you don't want in the grow space. Cleanliness is next to jorge cervantes, or something, lol.

So yeah man, could you tell I felt like talking, haha. You have done/ are doing a great job on your first grow. You are doing a great job period. Keep it up, keep us posted, and no more girl drama. At least until harvest. Glad you dodged that bullet.

peace


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## vapedup (Aug 26, 2011)

I know! When I read that part about the lady making threats, I was like DAMN, all that going away?? Tragic! But. The Mari God ( Shiva) shined on u!  so how many weeks on the strains? The flowering time?


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## drekoushranada (Aug 26, 2011)

jigfresh said:


> Damn Dre... it's a good thing Jozikins got your back. Good dude isn't he. I thought I'd chime in on a couple things. Like Joz said, 0.5 g/w is a good ratio for a first grow (or any grow for that matter). I've never broken 0.55, and I think I'm doing pretty good.
> 
> For the trim, I would go for Butane Honey Oil. Definitely not the simplest of methods, but damn BHO is some good shit. My second choice would be dry ice hash. Bubble hash sucks to make (like everyone said).
> 
> ...


 Yeah the pics were before the clean up. The dead leaves are long gone. I am going to try one of those great additives today. I have been Heisenberg tea for my root zone which has been working very well. Right now I am using the 2 hps lights and I will add the MH bulb back to the mix in a week or so. Im sure the plants would love


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## jigfresh (Aug 26, 2011)

Yeah, about the mh hps thing. If you are going to be switching stuff around, I think the first 4 weeks of flower are a good time for the mh, but the last 3 or 4 weeks when the buds really pack on their weight, that is when HPS is best. So you might just want to leave it orange. Either way dude... you're going to have a phat harvest.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 26, 2011)

Ok. I would leave it orange. I figured the extra UV from the MH will help get them frosty but I will let the lights be.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 26, 2011)

I got some powdered Kool Bloom. I'm about to add it to the system.


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## Jozikins (Aug 26, 2011)

Quality advise from our friend Jigfresh. Those opinions are just as valuable as mine or mega's, and he is absolutely right with all his DWC info. His objections to mine and Mega's advice isn't just valid, he is right. Me and Mega have a larger grow space to deal with, so we go for a slightly more commercial approach, while still giving the TLC of a micro grow, since we are so fucking anal about this shit.... no pun intended.

Good luck with that Kool Bloom dre, remember to ease into it, it'd be terrible to burn your plants up this late into flower. But don't be afraid to use it, I just suggest caution.


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## jigfresh (Aug 26, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> remember to ease into it, it'd be terrible to burn your plants up this late into flower. But don't be afraid to use it, I just suggest caution.


I second that. Additives are great, just don't over do them. Much easier to add a little in a couple hours.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 26, 2011)

Yeah and that what I did. I used a little less than 1 tsp per 5 gallons of liquid.


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## Student Teacher (Aug 27, 2011)

dre.. I have been following this thread for a while and I was wondering a few questions..
how do you control the level the water is at in the totes in respect with the rez? the level of the pvc pipes naturally keeps the level the same???
also why do you have two shutoff knobs in your res.. one before the pump and one after... what is the point of these?
final question.. for now.. lol .. is how is the water recirculating through the totes and back to the rez if the pump is pumping water out of the rez into the mister pvc pipes??

I currently have coco and a rainforest growing and want to expand to a system like this...

Thanks man!


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## drekoushranada (Aug 28, 2011)

Student Teacher said:


> dre.. I have been following this thread for a while and I was wondering a few questions..
> how do you control the level the water is at in the totes in respect with the rez? the level of the pvc pipes naturally keeps the level the same???
> also why do you have two shutoff knobs in your res.. one before the pump and one after... what is the point of these?
> final question.. for now.. lol .. is how is the water recirculating through the totes and back to the rez if the pump is pumping water out of the rez into the mister pvc pipes??
> ...


You are correct. The PVC pipes naturally keep the water level correct. Well I have 2 shut off valves in the rez because I used it to drain the system. I have a garden hose connection on the end of the valve. The pipe you see in the remote rez is the return pipe. Did I explain everything to you?


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## Student Teacher (Aug 29, 2011)

yes it did. Thank you. This setup looks like it worked out well throughout the whole grow. Very nice man.

Also a couple other things I was thinking about.. 

What is pumping the water to the PVC pipes with the misters in them?

Did you put the PVC pipes connecting the totes and Rez below or above the desired level?

And as far as the pump goes I am thinking it pulls the water back into the Rez And then pushes it back out through the misters PVC pipes??

And last one.. For now lol... The PVC pipes connecting the totes and the Rez are placed through a grommet that is sealed in the tote with silicone/acrylic???

I would like to be sure I am setting it up right on the first run.. Don't want any leaks!! Lol


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## Jozikins (Aug 29, 2011)

Dre is def the guy to ask for advise on this stuff. Anyone who gets it locked down like he can on the first grow is already a hydro-building pro. Did I mention that I have been continuously impressed since this thread started Dre?


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## drekoushranada (Aug 29, 2011)

Student Teacher said:


> yes it did. Thank you. This setup looks like it worked out well throughout the whole grow. Very nice man.
> 
> Also a couple other things I was thinking about..
> 
> ...


1. The pump is pumping water from the rez to the misters. 
2. The pump push instead of pull but on my next build im going to try pulling the water. 
3. The totes are all on the same level. The return pipe is much higher than the other pipes in the system. 
4. I am still trying to figure out how I got this freaking weird system to work. I happen to like a multitude of hydro systems so I just went and combined them all in one. LOL


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## drekoushranada (Aug 29, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Dre is def the guy to ask for advise on this stuff. Anyone who gets it locked down like he can on the first grow is already a hydro-building pro. Did I mention that I have been continuously impressed since this thread started Dre?


J-Man that really means a lot to me coming from a Vet such as yourself. BTW the Kool Bloom powder is freaking beast. My ph is right at 5.8 and I cant keep the ppm up. Its at about 900 now but it was up to 1000 when I boosted it up. I may have to up the ante but im out of freaking Dyna Grow Bloom. That is one thing that sucks about having a high gallon hydro system. You will run out of nutes before you know it. The buds are starting to swell finally on some branches. Its a branch that is pretty think but fell over from the weight of the buds. This is going to be a nice one.


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## SWUSAZ (Aug 29, 2011)

Dre still trucking along and they have swelled like crazy you have as stated nailed this setup on the head. Please try to not out do your self on your next grow we may not be able to take it. LOL


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## drekoushranada (Aug 29, 2011)

SWUSAZ said:


> Dre still trucking along and they have swelled like crazy you have as stated nailed this setup on the head. Please try to not out do your self on your next grow we may not be able to take it. LOL


 Lol.. I know right!


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## Jozikins (Aug 29, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> J-Man that really means a lot to me coming from a Vet such as yourself. BTW the Kool Bloom powder is freaking beast. My ph is right at 5.8 and I cant keep the ppm up. Its at about 900 now but it was up to 1000 when I boosted it up. I may have to up the ante but im out of freaking Dyna Grow Bloom. That is one thing that sucks about having a high gallon hydro system. You will run out of nutes before you know it. The buds are starting to swell finally on some branches. Its a branch that is pretty think but fell over from the weight of the buds. This is going to be a nice one.


Awwweeee yeeee-yeeahhh son! Thanks for the compliment bro, but I haven't been growing for that long, just had a lot of exp in a short amount of time. I guess I'm just fortunate. Keep them happy with that Kool Bloom, I'm glad to hear it has explosive results with the DynaGro.

I have so much extra ferts laying around, I wish I could just send some out whenever someone is out.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 30, 2011)

Day 44 of Flower. I had to get in the tent and tie some of the sites up. Its one plant in there that has one of the best fruity smells I ever experienced. I do now think I mixed the strains up when I was sprouting them. So I am not really sure which plants are what but I do have an idea! LOL, Oh well im sure all of them will smoke great. I took a sample of the bag seed plant to dry. My tester wants to give it a try.


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## Jozikins (Aug 30, 2011)

Massive yields ahead! Set sail!


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## drekoushranada (Aug 30, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Massive yields ahead! Set sail!


 I hope so. Since this is my first grow I really cant tell a crappy harvest from a good one! Haha


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## Jozikins (Aug 31, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> I hope so. Since this is my first grow I really cant tell a crappy harvest from a good one! Haha


 It's going to be a good one if they are as dense as they look. What are your PPMs at? They do look a little hungry.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 31, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> It's going to be a good one if they are as dense as they look. What are your PPMs at? They do look a little hungry.


The ppm are at 1103. Should I up the ante to 1300 or so?


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## Jozikins (Aug 31, 2011)

No, 1103 should be fine. It's hard to tell if they are over feed in the picture, do you think they are? If so then maybe 1300 is fine, but if we are entering week 6 of 7 than 1300 is probably too hot.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 31, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> No, 1103 should be fine. It's hard to tell if they are over feed in the picture, do you think they are? If so then maybe 1300 is fine, but if we are entering week 6 of 7 than 1300 is probably too hot.


Well they don't look hungry to me personally. It has been at 1103 for only a day or so. I am about to go check on them and see if anything changed. I ordered a 60-100x microscope to check the trics. Cant wait until it freaking gets here. How do you dry and cure your product? I been reading the Ganjaluvurs thread for curing on the site.


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## Jozikins (Aug 31, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> Well they don't look hungry to me personally. It has been at 1103 for only a day or so. I am about to go check on them and see if anything changed. I ordered a 60-100x microscope to check the trics. Cant wait until it freaking gets here. How do you dry and cure your product? I been reading the Ganjaluvurs thread for curing on the site.


 Oh, well if it's only been a day or two it is too soon to know. It takes 4-5 days to see the results usually. 

I have sooooo many ways of drying and curing, they all work fine, I have tried them all! But if you don't have a pm problem and your temps/rh is just right, as slow as possible is always best. But leaving all the leaves on makes the trim job horribly difficult. My favorite method so far is trimming them into 10" spears with most the leaves still on, but all the big ones off, both frosty and fan leaves are removed that are large. Then I hang them all up upside down (because it's easiest, not because it does anything) and keep them in a room with moving air but no direct breeze, at around 72 degrees at 48-52% humidity in total darkness if possible. They take about a week to dry like this, if you leave all the big leaves on there, it'll take 2 weeks and trimming will take a solid week and will be horrible and unpleasant. 

Around here with all the PM I have to break all my plants down to nugs immediately during the harvest, and then I put it on a drying rack that is wrapped in plastic like a grow tent would be, it is just a storage shelf unit from Lowes, and we put window screen on the shelves to support the nugs and let them breath. The nugs dry out rapidly like this and can be very harsh, so I put a humidifier right next to the tent and keep the rh around 60% to slow down the drying process, this gives me dried product in 4-5 days, less if I screw up. I also use paper bags as a inbetween step from curing and drying.


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## drekoushranada (Aug 31, 2011)

That sounds like a plan to me. I have a tester piece hanging in a shoe box to dry. Its now one stinky shoe box!! Lol.. Oh yeah I did my math wrong the ppm are at 1003 not 1103. I gave them a bit more food though. im sure they will enjoy it.


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## Jozikins (Aug 31, 2011)

I'm sure they will. Let me know how that tester is. I rolled a bunch of my dried bd popcorn in kief and smoked it, I'm on the fucking moon.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 3, 2011)

Well something strange is going on but good. I raised the food up to 1250 ppm, the ph is between 5.6 and 5.7 I usually kept it at 5.8. Now I changed my light schedule to 11 on 13 off. After this change in lighting the plants are eating and drinking like crazy. I have a feeling that the extra hour of darkness is throwing them in overdrive but I really cant prove what is going on. It is day 48 of flower. I am going to HAVE to chop them on day 60 no matter what.


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## Jozikins (Sep 3, 2011)

Hell yeah. probably increasing that end-of-life signal. 60 days to chop sounds ideal for most plants. When does the flush begin?


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## captainbud (Sep 3, 2011)

I just read this entire thread from the beginning. Wow! Great job. My wife is pissed, I have to go to bed now. Rep.


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## Jozikins (Sep 3, 2011)

captainbud said:


> I just read this entire thread from the beginning. Wow! Great job. My wife is pissed, I have to go to bed now. Rep.


 Haha, thanks for the rep bro. Go to bed, you don't want your wife thinking this is all you do with your spare time, lol. My girlfriend thinks it's cute that I am learning about growing all day, I'm sure if we marry it'll be a different story. haha.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 4, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Haha, thanks for the rep bro. Go to bed, you don't want your wife thinking this is all you do with your spare time, lol. My girlfriend thinks it's cute that I am learning about growing all day, I'm sure if we marry it'll be a different story. haha.


 Heck all I get most of the time is." When is it going to be done??!!"


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## drekoushranada (Sep 4, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Hell yeah. probably increasing that end-of-life signal. 60 days to chop sounds ideal for most plants. When does the flush begin?


Oh crap! Well it looks like I need to start that today huh? Lol


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## drekoushranada (Sep 4, 2011)

Well I started my flush. I will do it again in 3 days to remove any residue in the totes.


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## Jozikins (Sep 5, 2011)

Sweet. You using any flushing agents at all? Or just water and sugar?


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## drekoushranada (Sep 5, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Sweet. You using any flushing agents at all? Or just water and sugar?


 I am just using water. I do have some Earth Juice Hi-Brix Grow part A. Its from when I used it to make my Heisenberg Tea. Would that make slime pop up? Also I would I spot hermied plants im not sure what to look for but balls. Also during these last days can I cut my lighting down to only 600w? That way I can keep the heat way down during these final days before chop? I know its a burst of questions but im stoked about being on my way to finally getting my first harvest under my belt.


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## SWUSAZ (Sep 5, 2011)

Sweet stuff happy Joy Joy. Are you planning on harvest in about 4 or 5 weeks with those?


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## Jozikins (Sep 5, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> I am just using water. I do have some Earth Juice Hi-Brix Grow part A. Its from when I used it to make my Heisenberg Tea. Would that make slime pop up? Also I would I spot hermied plants im not sure what to look for but balls. Also during these last days can I cut my lighting down to only 600w? That way I can keep the heat way down during these final days before chop? I know its a burst of questions but im stoked about being on my way to finally getting my first harvest under my belt.


HiBrix part A? I just know of the HiBrix molasses, the grow/bloom nutrients i have never used. Don't put that in your res to flush with. You can't use molasses in hydro... well you can... very diluted, but it's still risky without mixing it into tea. I would use something like Liquid Carboload by AN, the only thing I will ever recommend from AN. You could also use Sugar Daddy or Sweet Raw, same thing as each other. Carboload is really the only carb out there for plants that has something "Special" to it.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 5, 2011)

SWUSAZ said:


> Sweet stuff happy Joy Joy. Are you planning on harvest in about 4 or 5 weeks with those?


 Im cutting on 09/15/11.. I would let some of them go longer but I have to get ready to move..


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## drekoushranada (Sep 5, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> HiBrix part A? I just know of the HiBrix molasses, the grow/bloom nutrients i have never used. Don't put that in your res to flush with. You can't use molasses in hydro... well you can... very diluted, but it's still risky without mixing it into tea. I would use something like Liquid Carboload by AN, the only thing I will ever recommend from AN. You could also use Sugar Daddy or Sweet Raw, same thing as each other. Carboload is really the only carb out there for plants that has something "Special" to it.


As always thanks a million J-Man. So what about the lighting part? Cutting it down to only 600w and for the final days should I put a mh back in the mix?


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## Jozikins (Sep 5, 2011)

I don't know about cutting back, I did and cut back to a 400w MH with no lens from a 600w HPS with a lens in my last grow. The MH was to see if i could get more resin, and i've never had stickier plants because of it, but it could also be the strain, I've never grown Blue Dream before this. The 600w was burning out much faster than it should have, so I placed the 400w MH in there and it was much brighter, which means I've been throwing 200w+ out the door every week for 3.5 weeks. Laziness got me again. But I still got fat dense buds and they are all amazing.

You can downgrade, and I don't think you'll see too much loss in weight, I would def use MH to finish up, it's worth the effort, even if there is a slight chance it really works. But if you don't know about downgrading just stick with what you are using, unless the power bill is killing you. As long as you can get the light penetration with 600w, you should be fine, they are still very powerful bulbs.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 5, 2011)

Thanks J-Man. I will get the 600w MH up there tomorrow. Im sure they would love it. Plus im sure the temp drop would play a role in the making more resin with using one light. We shall see though.


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## Jozikins (Sep 5, 2011)

Well I can guarantee you it wont hurt.... bleh, I don't want to clean my tent man! I really want to get my MH running over vegging plants again but I hate preping a room. Need more buds though! I only pulled 9oz off my two blue dreams, that is a pathetic gram per watt ratio for a 600w lamp, I need to do better! I need better vegged plants for better flowers! And I need some new god damn trays! 2x3 grow trays are fucking retarded, I can't believe my partners bought these things.


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## stelthy (Sep 6, 2011)

Nice grow dude, you've had a few hiccups here n there but have gotten through it just fine  Growing and Hydroponics is a learning curve to say the least. I gotta say the ladies are looking nice! How many watts are you running in Flower (total) ??

I also wondered why you used 10" net pots.. Personally I use the smallest ones I can find.. They take up less room in the Res container, so thats more room for roots and nuits etc 

What temps are you Res. ??

Have you considered using a Dual Cool-tube and running a Vertical SCROG, its a great space saver and also an easy/ier way to control temps...

Either way, I am glad you have resolved your differences with your partner and look forward to seeing your next post/s - STELTHY


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## drekoushranada (Sep 6, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Well I can guarantee you it wont hurt.... bleh, I don't want to clean my tent man! I really want to get my MH running over vegging plants again but I hate preping a room. Need more buds though! I only pulled 9oz off my two blue dreams, that is a pathetic gram per watt ratio for a 600w lamp, I need to do better! I need better vegged plants for better flowers! And I need some new god damn trays! 2x3 grow trays are fucking retarded, I can't believe my partners bought these things.


 I can see how that would suck. How long did you vegg the blue dreams for? Im sure you will get your mark soon. I do find 2x3 grow trays weird myself! haha


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## drekoushranada (Sep 6, 2011)

stelthy said:


> Nice grow dude, you've had a few hiccups here n there but have gotten through it just fine  Growing and Hydroponics is a learning curve to say the least. I gotta say the ladies are looking nice! How many watts are you running in Flower (total) ??
> 
> I also wondered why you used 10" net pots.. Personally I use the smallest ones I can find.. They take up less room in the Res container, so thats more room for roots and nuits etc
> 
> ...


Yeah I realized after the learning curve hit me that 10" net pots were a waste of space. I am going to run 6" net pots next time. I am using a 3" for the bag seed plant but it is freaking heavy and fell over. I had to tie her up. I am running 1200w total in the 5x5 tent. My res temps are 75-78f. I use the Heisenberg microbe tea and its been a life saver I guess. Because from what I read a lot of times is hydro without a chiller is a suicide mission. I dont even bother to check my res temps anymore. I have been really thinking about doing a big wall of bud for my next grow in Coco. I want to get a bigger tent also. Thanks for stopping by also.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 6, 2011)

Well my scope came in and the trichomes on the ladies are looking really good. On 3 of the girls I see a good number of amber depending on the plant. Ranging from 20-40%. 2 other plants are a mix of clear and cloudy. Like 20% clear and 80% cloudy. How many days should I give all the plants in general? They all will have to come down at the same time because the flower room is the drying room as well. On my next set up I will have 2 tents so I can operate a bit better. How much do the trichomes mature once the plant is drying and curing? Because if I chop before 09/15/2011 I will have more time to cure. The 11th or 12th would be better for me or maybe before.


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## SWUSAZ (Sep 6, 2011)

High amber count plant should be close to chop and if you must be finished by the 15th you had better take her like in two days as you will need at least a week with all that bud drying if you take them all at once I would think. The first ime I harvested at 40% amber when it was cured it was quite couchlock with 70% being amber after the cure. Get the sissors ready and enjoy as there will be many future grows and you can always play later. IMHO


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## Jozikins (Sep 7, 2011)

As long as all your plants are mostly opaque you are good to go, but I always recommend flushing them out as long as possible, how deep are you into flush?


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## drekoushranada (Sep 7, 2011)

Well I looked at some different part on the plants and its like 10-30% amber on some. But even though I see amber I do still see some clear. Sunday or Monday will be Chop Chop time for me. Has any of you guys done the 72 hours of darkness before harvest thing? What does it really do? I say nothing but I have not tried it so I cant really speak on it. I am 4 days into the flush J-Man.


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## jigfresh (Sep 7, 2011)

With those amber counts, I personally would chop now. My first couple grows I was trying for mostly amber trichs, but I've found that having maybe 10-20% amber is the max that I will go to. To me the high is just better with more cloudy's in there. I don't know the chemicals and shit... something like ccb's or some shit, lol. Now I sound stupid. But whatever the chemicals are before they start to break down (turn amber)... I like those chemicals more than the degraded ones. But don't get me wrong, it's not like degrading from quality... maybe that was the wrong word, but they break down to another chemical that gives you that couch lock. My herb can give you couch lock no matter what the trichs look like if you smoke a couple bowls. So there's my take. I'd do it asap... no rush, just sooner than later. I don't think you can go wrong with your plan though... twill be all good no matter.

Oh, I've done 24 hours of darkness. Don't know if there is anything to it, but apparently the plants produce the most resin around midnight, so peeps figure if you give them a really long night they will produce resin even more. In my head, it don't hurt to turn the lights off, so why waste electricity. However... my room get's a little humid during lights off... and 72 hours of lights off would be a long time in a semi humid environment. You wouldn't want to go and get mold in the buds the last day before harvest, just to get a tiny tiny bit more resin. That would be a fucking disaster. If you have it dry enough at night, and the air is moving around enough... then turn them off. Save a couple buck on the elec. bill.

looking forward to seeing the finished product.

peace


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## drekoushranada (Sep 7, 2011)

Heck I stay in the freaking south so the lights will not be going off now that I think about it. We have been getting a ton of rain also. The AK-48 is the one with the most amber. Its a straight indica pheno that smells of a awesome fruit. I am going to dry in my tent so I want to chop them all at once. Some may not be as good as other but this is my first grow and next time it will be ten times better for sure. Im going to go take some pics so you all can see them. I will post them in a few. Thanks for a the help RIU.


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## jigfresh (Sep 7, 2011)

Can't wait to see. Man I'm stoked for you. It's so fucking awesome having a shit load of herb... it's like finally making it. Mom and dad would be so proud, lol.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 7, 2011)

Well as promised here are the ladies. They will come to there final days between Friday and Sunday. Chop Chop!! Some still have a good deal of white pistils but oh well. I harvest on swell and trichomes. I am seeing on one plant that the trichomes are amber but a good bit of them are still clear. I mixed them up during seedling stage but upon research I pretty much identified which plants are which. 
This is the Blue Widow. This is the plants with the best fruity smell. Its so hard to describe it. The trics on this plant is around 25% amber and The rest are Cloudy/clear. 









This is the Bagseed. The plant has a bunch of pistils which gives it a fuzzy look. Much more than the breeder strains. The trichomes on this lady are 5% amber and pretty much all cloudy. 









This is the Critical +. It seems like it was always on the droopy side. It may have needed more Cal Mag. Did not swell how I wanted to. Must of been a more sativa pheno. The trichomes on this one are all Cloudy for the most part. 









This is the AK-48. This plant is living up to the hype so far and much more. Its a must for a new grower I feel. The trichomes are 30-40% amber and the rest are cloudy and clear. 













The last plant is the Northern Lights x Big Bud. These buds are freaking huge. The trichomes on this plan are about 20-30% amber and the rest are cloudy.









Random pic of the whole tent.


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## SWUSAZ (Sep 7, 2011)

Stuff dreams are made of. My Blue Widow seems to be more on the Indica side that yours maybe because yours is in flower. Congratulations on the first run and may I say quite an excellent show. I thank you


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## jigfresh (Sep 7, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> Well as promised here are the ladies.


Real nice looking. You did a hell of a job. Now get ready for the 'fun' part. Trimming, lol. I hate trimming.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 8, 2011)

SWUSAZ said:


> Stuff dreams are made of. My Blue Widow seems to be more on the Indica side that yours maybe because yours is in flower. Congratulations on the first run and may I say quite an excellent show. I thank you


The Blue widow is the smallest plant in the tent. But its the best smelling one for sure. It must be that Blueberry pheno that is giving out the smell. 



jigfresh said:


> Real nice looking. You did a hell of a job. Now get ready for the 'fun' part. Trimming, lol. I hate trimming.


Yeah thats the same thing I was thinking. But I will have me some dry ice hash for the friends to try until this stuff dry and cure. Hash is not popular at all around these parts of the South. For some reason they think its a different drug! Smh.....


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## UnderCurrentDWC (Sep 9, 2011)

Man!.. that was a long read but well worth it!
I'm using those totes as well so I had to see what your experience has been with them so far, I also had to add weather stripping to keep it from leaking.
Looks like you've had great results with your UC system, I think I made the right choice switching over from soil..... we'll see.

Thanks for sharing drekoushranda & Thanks Jozikins for all the wonderful tips in this thread.

UCDWC~


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## Jozikins (Sep 9, 2011)

Dude that is a sweet fucking system. Hope you don't mind me using your design and Dre's tubs, lol. Can you explain to us more about it? Anything out of the ordinary of UC?

Dude Dre, your buds look so dank and totally ready. That bag seed seems to actually be a real champion. And that AK48 looks so bomb, I want me some of that now. Blue Widow is also very impressive. It's going to be awesome having all that variety, I am doing more variety myself now for this reason. I wish it was as easy for me to find variety that works together like you did! Woot woot dry ice hash!!


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## drekoushranada (Sep 9, 2011)

UnderCurrentDWC said:


> Man!.. that was a long read but well worth it!
> I'm using those totes as well so I had to see what your experience has been with them so far, I also had to add weather stripping to keep it from leaking.
> Looks like you've had great results with your UC system, I think I made the right choice switching over from soil..... we'll see.
> 
> ...


Thank! I was lucky enough to get help from some great people on my thread. Yeah the UC kicks but like its nothing else but this is the only thing I have tried. I will do some Coco next run. What strains are you running?


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## drekoushranada (Sep 9, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Dude that is a sweet fucking system. Hope you don't mind me using your design and Dre's tubs, lol. Can you explain to us more about it? Anything out of the ordinary of UC?
> 
> Dude Dre, your buds look so dank and totally ready. That bag seed seems to actually be a real champion. And that AK48 looks so bomb, I want me some of that now. Blue Widow is also very impressive. It's going to be awesome having all that variety, I am doing more variety myself now for this reason. I wish it was as easy for me to find variety that works together like you did! Woot woot dry ice hash!!


His system is pretty cool. Im so ready for everybody to try the dry ice once its done. Is there a DIY for the bag when it come to dry ice or do I have to actually buy the bubble bags? Everybody that seen the bagseed always say "what the hell is that/".. Haha. Its looks so great. What strains are you going to run J-Man? You will love the AK-48 and Blue widow. Now the Blue Widow is not a big producer to me but it makes up in smell and im sure it will in taste.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 9, 2011)

Im about to harvest these ladies today! Im sure my first run at trimming should be a hoot......


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## jigfresh (Sep 9, 2011)

You're in good company my friend. I'm harvesting my girls today as well. Right about now I'm wishing I had some friends to help. I will probably be able to talk the wife into helping tonight. Damn sticky fingers got everything on earth sticking to me, lol. This is a time when having a bunch of cats isn't ideal. If I get one cat hair on my finger it is quite a chore to get it off. My first instinct is to rub it on my shirt or pants... then I have 100 hairs on my finger.

I hope you have some spring loaded scissors. If not they are definitely worth the time and money to get them. Throw up some pics when you get a chance. You can check my journal for my harvest pics... I don't want to intrude reposting here.

Congrats on getting to harvest!!! That's really awesome.


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## Jozikins (Sep 9, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> His system is pretty cool. Im so ready for everybody to try the dry ice once its done. Is there a DIY for the bag when it come to dry ice or do I have to actually buy the bubble bags? Everybody that seen the bagseed always say "what the hell is that/".. Haha. Its looks so great. What strains are you going to run J-Man? You will love the AK-48 and Blue widow. Now the Blue Widow is not a big producer to me but it makes up in smell and im sure it will in taste.


 I love how beginners are getting straight into super "advanced" hydroponic systems that were being sold for 3k for just 6 or 8 site system. Everyone at Home Depot must be wondering why kids have such an interest in plumbing and irrigation now a days, LOL! Oh man, I would like to try that dry ice hash, I guess I'll just have to stare at the pics and wank it though, bahaha. You don't need to buy a complete bubble bag kit, each manufacturer sells a replacement bag in case one tears, just pick up the 120 or the 73, 120 gives you great smoking and cooking grade, depending on how much you shake, 73 gives you only smoking grade for the most part, so I've heard. I've been using 120, everyone I got into it around here is using 120, and so far great results. You get a lot more cooking grade with 180 or 190, but screw it, who wants to smoke workbag hash? I suggest the 120 personally, haven't even tried the 73 yet. I've grown AK 47 and White Berry, which are both extremely similar, but the WhiteBerry smoke is just okay, and the AK47 is amazing but it isn't in the area currently, so I might just pick up both. I have so many I want to try though, Youngdog and shwagbag always have so many nice strains going, I want to try them all! Especially that bastard Shwagbag, he has a spending problem for sure! haha.



jigfresh said:


> You're in good company my friend. I'm harvesting my girls today as well. Right about now I'm wishing I had some friends to help. I will probably be able to talk the wife into helping tonight. Damn sticky fingers got everything on earth sticking to me, lol. This is a time when having a bunch of cats isn't ideal. If I get one cat hair on my finger it is quite a chore to get it off. My first instinct is to rub it on my shirt or pants... then I have 100 hairs on my finger.
> 
> I hope you have some spring loaded scissors. If not they are definitely worth the time and money to get them. Throw up some pics when you get a chance. You can check my journal for my harvest pics... I don't want to intrude reposting here.
> 
> Congrats on getting to harvest!!! That's really awesome.


You know who to call bro, I'm right around the corner  I have cats to, little fuckers, make it impossible to trim and when they only demand attention when you can't give it to them. Having a pile of disposable gloves helps a lot.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 9, 2011)

jigfresh said:


> You're in good company my friend. I'm harvesting my girls today as well. Right about now I'm wishing I had some friends to help. I will probably be able to talk the wife into helping tonight. Damn sticky fingers got everything on earth sticking to me, lol. This is a time when having a bunch of cats isn't ideal. If I get one cat hair on my finger it is quite a chore to get it off. My first instinct is to rub it on my shirt or pants... then I have 100 hairs on my finger.
> 
> I hope you have some spring loaded scissors. If not they are definitely worth the time and money to get them. Throw up some pics when you get a chance. You can check my journal for my harvest pics... I don't want to intrude reposting here.
> 
> Congrats on getting to harvest!!! That's really awesome.


Jig its no such thing as intruding around these parts bro. I am going to check out those great pics and will post some. I just woke up from a nap because I needed the rest..


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## UnderCurrentDWC (Sep 9, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Dude that is a sweet fucking system. Hope you don't mind me using your design and Dre's tubs, lol. Can you explain to us more about it? Anything out of the ordinary of UC?


It's basically the Current Culture design with different buckets I think they want $1200 for an 8 site system I was able to build mine for half that. I set it up to be on 28" centers the buckets are 10 gallons I figure with the water 1-2" below the net pot there will be around 6-7 gallons per bucket x 9 buckets the whole system should hold around 60-70 gallons. I used uniseals for the 2" PVC, for bubbles I bought 8 Ecoplus 48" flexible airstones and a 180Lpm airpump, to pull the water back to the epicenter I bought a 500gph danner magdrive water pump. I still need to buy a water chiller but I should have everything ready in the flower room in a few weeks. 

Research of different hydro systems led me down the UC path for flowering but for veg I found this cool DIY system Built be Mike the gardner from Suretogrow, It top drips, areo sprays and DWC's all in one. I figured this would be a great way to take a plant from clone to deep veg, I also figured I could build it with 6" net pots so I will never have to transplant between net pots, the pot could go directly into the UC system. 

When building the veg tote I was very conscious about having the smallest reservoir possible for the 12 plants to save on nut costs. I connected the two veg totes with 2" PVC under current style and built a manifold that runs both totes off of one pump. From cutting to when I take out the aero manifold and go dwc the system only runs on 15 gallons of sauce at a time and I'm pretty happy with that.

I'm also keeping my epicenter and Rez in the veg room so I can maximize the sq/ft in the flower room


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## drekoushranada (Sep 10, 2011)

Well it took me 8 freaking hours of trimming but its finally done. They are hanging in the tent in the dark. I have a small fan blowing against the wall along with the exhaust fan set on l0w or medium. I feel its good air flow in the room. The bud sites on some of the plants are VERY dense. I don't want them to mold at all! The room climate is 77f and 54rh +/- 3%. Not really sure how accurate the Hygrometer is. Well on to the PORN! 
Blue Widow 





The Bag Seed 





AK-48 





Northern Lights x Big Bud 





Critical + 





My nice bag of sugar trim and popcorn for Hash! 





The buds hanging!


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## jigfresh (Sep 10, 2011)

Nice bro. Way to go! Nice job trimming. I'm still at it. I really need to loosen up on what I trim. I just keep going and going and going. I just LOVE the selection you got. What a great batch of smoke. Enjoy all the different smokes. I know you will.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 10, 2011)

jigfresh said:


> Nice bro. Way to go! Nice job trimming. I'm still at it. I really need to loosen up on what I trim. I just keep going and going and going. I just LOVE the selection you got. What a great batch of smoke. Enjoy all the different smokes. I know you will.


 That is true. Im sure you will have the trimming knocked out soon. The buds are so dense. I cant wait until the test session! Im trying to figure out when to jar them. I guess in 3-4 days should do.


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## jigfresh (Sep 10, 2011)

The rule that I follow is when smaller stems 'snap' when you bend them. If they just bend like a noodle you need more time. I have always been scared of jarring my buds too early and having them mold in the jar. I've read that too many time. Talk about heartbreak getting all the way... well almost all the way, then to lose a crop after harvest and drying (or drying half way). 3-4 days sounds about right, but might be 5. We are drying out buds in about the same exact conditions. I got 67 deg and 51% humidity in my closet... I have my big fan extracting air, the small fan is off and of course they are in dark. My first plant has 2 days drying so far and it's still nice and wet. About jarring... to me too dry is way safer than too wet. And I would say I've done pretty well with timing and such. I have herb that was jarred in May 2009 that is still rockin. Smells great and still has almost all the effect it did when it was fresh.

Any idea what you'll do with the trim? So many options I know.


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## Jozikins (Sep 10, 2011)

Hell yeah dude, that is a fat fucking harvest. That Blue Widow and Critical + look extremely dank. I already know the 48 is dank!
I hate trimming, hate hate hate it. Usually I pay someone to do it for me. lol.

Oh, and I like to see that you are brushing your teeth on the regular, that's good hygiene! Lol


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## drekoushranada (Sep 11, 2011)

Well my plants are drying too fast. I went and checked on them and the outside of the plants are crispy. They have to get jarred today so I dont miss the cure window! This sucks big time!


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## jigfresh (Sep 11, 2011)

That's weird. It should all work out in the jar though. The moisture from inside should even out the dryness of the outside. Maybe it was the fan in there? The plant I cut on Thursday still isn't dry, and I'm in cali. Don't worry though. My guess it it'll be just fine. Check them a few times a day for the first couple days. Make sure there's not too much moisture in there.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 11, 2011)

jigfresh said:


> That's weird. It should all work out in the jar though. The moisture from inside should even out the dryness of the outside. Maybe it was the fan in there? The plant I cut on Thursday still isn't dry, and I'm in cali. Don't worry though. My guess it it'll be just fine. Check them a few times a day for the first couple days. Make sure there's not too much moisture in there.


 I will be sure to do that. I guess its these crazy southern temps that throws stuff off. Its a little fan set on low. But who knows!


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## Jozikins (Sep 11, 2011)

I bet it needs more time but check your jars on the frequent the first few days to see if they get all soft and wet again. Don't want mold! Use a indirect fan, have the fan blowing in the other direction and drawing air across the nugs. Make sure you keep the humidity in check, especially with a lot of air flowing.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 11, 2011)

Yeah I went and checked the bigger buds and they are still moist. So it was the smaller sites that dried like that. They are now in jars though. So I guess things are on pace. I left them hanging.


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## Jozikins (Sep 11, 2011)

Cool. Smaller nugs dry up quick, and usually end up harsh if you don't do it that way, it's a pain in the ass though. My shit flips so fast in the dispensaries I just do everything at once to keep up. I vended 8oz of Blue Dream to the dispensary Friday and they called me Saturday afternoon saying they were out and wanted 8 more oz. I need some Blue Dream to rain from the sky to keep up.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 11, 2011)

I know your happy to be getting yours of so fast though.


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## lostNug (Sep 11, 2011)

very nice harvest. hands down


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## drekoushranada (Sep 11, 2011)

lostNug said:


> very nice harvest. hands down


 Thanks. I'm just trying to get the cure and drying part down now. Have a Western Caliber III hygrometer on its way.


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## Jozikins (Sep 12, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> I know your happy to be getting yours of so fast though.


 sure do. It's fucking super tough to keep up, I need a new 6x6 tent or larger to fulfill a new client I just got.

I know you're super happy your first harvest is dank as fuck.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 12, 2011)

Lol. I am. My girl tested a piece of popcorn bud. She didn't care for it. Then I looked at her and said.. " you know THC dont go psychoactive until it dries right" but she said that she threw it in the microwave! Then I walked away laughing. I have a piece out in the light to look at and it is frosty as crap. I realized that when I given the test pieces that were dried for 4 days and not much they were much more potent! It has an awesome fruity smell. Cant wait until my hygrometer comes in. I turned my exhaust fan on low BTW. Im sure it will slow everything down. The true smell of the buds are starting to break through. Im going to check on the real dense colas. Does mold for overnight or is it a gradual process?


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## Jozikins (Sep 12, 2011)

Yeah, my buds are only a fraction as potent on day 4 as they are on week 3. And when it dries up it converts THCA into it's psychoactive form, THC. So when you see read outs of 25% THCA in a sales pitch for seeds, I would ignore it.

Hygrometers are important, mold can happen over night. It really just depends on how good the conditions are for mold to survive. It can appear over a week, or it can appear overnight. A few nights back I had mold all over a SFV because I left the ventilation fan off because I was doing some adjustments in the room. It's no big deal though, this particular SFV is big and strong, but came from a weak clone and her stems snap over any little bit of pressure, pisses me off. 

Lol... microwave.


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## jigfresh (Sep 12, 2011)

Back in the day before I knew anything about pot except I liked smoking it... a friend of mine got some chopped down male plants from a friend of his. He gave them to me, and I thought I'd be smart and pull all the leaves off it, and dry them... then we could all smoke for free, hahaha. Had a bowl of it (bowl as in big ass salad bowl) in my room. 9th grade I think. Anyways, no one could wait for it to dry, so we brought it to a friends house who had their own place, apartment actually. We put some of the leaves in the oven, and some in the microwave. Shit was too funny. Somehow (i don't know how) the paper towel they were on in the microwave started smoking, like it was burning, but not on fire. The whole place smelled like weird pot being burned or something. I remember sticking my head in the microwave to try and get some fumes, lol. I'm embarrassed now even thinking about it. I don't even know if we tried smoking them. Just remember that stupid shit. I think we ended up dropping acid. Good times. 

Yeah, about drying and curing, you won't beleive what a difference a good cure will have on effect. Testers aren't the best way to judge stuff. Like Jozi said the thc get's activated after drying and somehow gets better with curing.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 12, 2011)

HAHA. Things we do when we are young... Smh. The plants are so freaking frosty. Jig you were right the plants are drying well.I think I panicked the other day. I think it was the dried up pistils giving them the feeling. The stems have a good amount of moisture in them. I will jar them in a day or 2. I think I need a bigger scale. Its going to take all day getting the weight but thats a good thing in my book!


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## jigfresh (Sep 12, 2011)

drekoushranada said:


> HAHA. Things we do when we are young... Smh. The plants are so freaking frosty. Jig you were right the plants are drying well.I think I panicked the other day. I think it was the dried up pistils giving them the feeling. The stems have a good amount of moisture in them. I will jar them in a day or 2. I think I need a bigger scale. Its going to take all day getting the weight but thats a good thing in my book!


I know the feeling about the scale. I have to do a quarter at a time. Kinda takes a while when you have around a pound. (i think i only got a half lb this round... but other times) Glad it's all turning out. I jarred my first plant today. 32g's... it's gonna be some good smoke. I can't wait to hear how your stuff gets it's stink going in the jars.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 13, 2011)

I know. This is the start of day 4 of drying. I may jar them up and start curing them in a few hours. I will go check on them first though.


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## Jozikins (Sep 13, 2011)

I usually start my cure a little wetter than most people. Because I know I'm going to get high and walk away for twice as long as I planned on when I checked on them... at least a few times.

Heads up, things dry out at a much faster rate after being pulled out of the jars than they do than before they were jarred. They feel wet like they were originally, so we walk away like it will take days, but it isn't even a fractionally as wet as it was, just feels like it, so it dries up to jar in 30min-1hr, usually, in my experiences.

Probably not with your product since it was only a few days dry when you jarred it at first. But this is just one of those things you eye ball. Was it this thread someone posted the correct humidity for storage and how to gauge that? Because that was great info! I need to get me some of those little hygrometers for my jars!


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## LVTDY (Sep 13, 2011)

What are your thoughts on the Critical+? I've had a freebie seed kickin' around for a while, but my carbon scrubber is on its final months and I'm hesitant to grow it out and stink up the joint. Is it as smelly/pungent as the description online?


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## drekoushranada (Sep 13, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> I usually start my cure a little wetter than most people. Because I know I'm going to get high and walk away for twice as long as I planned on when I checked on them... at least a few times.
> 
> Heads up, things dry out at a much faster rate after being pulled out of the jars than they do than before they were jarred. They feel wet like they were originally, so we walk away like it will take days, but it isn't even a fractionally as wet as it was, just feels like it, so it dries up to jar in 30min-1hr, usually, in my experiences.
> 
> Probably not with your product since it was only a few days dry when you jarred it at first. But this is just one of those things you eye ball. Was it this thread someone posted the correct humidity for storage and how to gauge that? Because that was great info! I need to get me some of those little hygrometers for my jars!


 The plants are still hanging. The stems are still bendy. A few of the smaller ones will snap but its not enough small ones drying to pay much attention to. I think I will let it go another full day or so. A few plants have a grassy smell but its getting better with drying. I have been jarring some plant samples at different times though. I notice when I touch a bud site it will freaking reek. I tray not to touch them at all though. I just dont want them to smell like that without touching them. This curing part of growing is most certainly an art that Im trying to master. Yeah I hope my hygrometer will come in the mail by tomorrow. The samples I put into jars were wet the next day so thats the main reason for me letting them hang a bit longer.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 13, 2011)

LVTDY said:


> What are your thoughts on the Critical+? I've had a freebie seed kickin' around for a while, but my carbon scrubber is on its final months and I'm hesitant to grow it out and stink up the joint. Is it as smelly/pungent as the description online?


 Well I hope you have a big space as well. Its a really pungent smell I must say. I was getting hit with loads of it during the trim. I thought I was going to get a headache. the plant also give off a minty smell as well. You will love it though.


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## LVTDY (Sep 13, 2011)

Good to read. I'll upgrade the carbon scrubber and if I have the presence of mind, I'll let you know how it goes in a few month's time.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 13, 2011)

Awesome!! Be sure to post some cool pics.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 15, 2011)

Well I ended up jarring the bud in 5 days after being left to hang and dry. Boy did that make a difference when it comes to the smell. They have the "dank" smell that they had when they were growing. I think a lot of people may be getting that hay smell from jarring to early because they are afraid they will be too dry to cure. I jarred some plants earlier and it did have a different smell from the plants I let hang longer. Took a bit longer drying in paper bags for the smell to come around. I willpost some pics and weights up soon.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 15, 2011)

AK-48= 181.5g
Blue Widow= 53.1g 
Bag Seed= 37.47g 
Critical += 181.1g 
Northern Lights x Big Bud= 167.2g 
Testers= around 20g or so. 
Total= 620.3g 1.37lbs


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## jigfresh (Sep 15, 2011)

WOOOO HOOOO! Someone's gonna be smokin!!!! That's the shit bro. Bigger harvest than I've ever had. Love the selection. Job well done, especially for the first one. Mad props to Drekoushranada. ... so, when you coming over to smoke me out? lol.


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## Jozikins (Sep 15, 2011)

Good job dude. Must feel good man. That's a really good yield for the space you are in. Oh man, nothing feels quite like your first _dank_ harvest, I almost wish I could jar up that feeling and reserve a bit for every crop. Haha. I have one coming down later today, hopefully. 

I'm excited for the next round bro, I know you have so many killer ideas to apply.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 15, 2011)

jigfresh said:


> WOOOO HOOOO! Someone's gonna be smokin!!!! That's the shit bro. Bigger harvest than I've ever had. Love the selection. Job well done, especially for the first one. Mad props to Drekoushranada. ... so, when you coming over to smoke me out? lol.


Lol. Soon bro!!



Jozikins said:


> Good job dude. Must feel good man. That's a really good yield for the space you are in. Oh man, nothing feels quite like your first _dank_ harvest, I almost wish I could jar up that feeling and reserve a bit for every crop. Haha. I have one coming down later today, hopefully.
> 
> I'm excited for the next round bro, I know you have so many killer ideas to apply.


 Yeah I have a sweet idea I would like to do with Coco. recirculating drip, and 10 or 5 gallon Air Pots. I am so stoked to be able to get through my first harvest. You all have been a ton of help! The C+ and AK-48 has been hard hitters so far.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 15, 2011)

Here are some pics of some random bud porn. A pic with and without the flash! 

AK-48 










Norther Lights x Big Bud 










Critical + 










Bag Seed 










Blue Widow


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## jigfresh (Sep 15, 2011)

Dude. the bagseed is just Insane with the pistols. It's like all red hairs. All the rest are lovely as well. I like the second pics of each, not sure if that's the flash ones or not, but yeah. Great spread. Great photos. Your gonna have people doubting this is your first grow. But that's a good thing.


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## Jozikins (Sep 15, 2011)

Yeah dude, that bag_seed_ has bag _appeal!_ The critical + looks ultra dank in the pictures. My only advice is to tighten up your trim job.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 15, 2011)

Yeah my trimming skills happen to suck big time!! The bag seed is super crazy. A lot of ppl get spaced out by the way it looks. It actually hermed on me and made a few seeds. Im not too sure if I want to sprout them for the next grow. I think I may grow them in there own independent area for the sake of it not sexing my ladies!


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## mastiffkush (Sep 15, 2011)

BendBrewer said:


> Since you are using what I use as a res. for pots, I have to ask what you are using as a res. Looks sweet!


I liked those to, i wasnt sure about the light seal though....how does that work out?


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## SWUSAZ (Sep 16, 2011)

May your scissors never work again.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 16, 2011)

SWUSAZ said:


> May your scissors never work again.


 Lol... Tell me about it! But I may need to find a "trimming 101" class.


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## SWUSAZ (Sep 17, 2011)

Hell a 1" cube cutter would make waves. Don't patent that.


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## Cap'n Calyx (Sep 18, 2011)

Congrats Dre. That's a nice setup and an awesome haul. I started my humble tent grow at the begining of the month. I've got some bagseed in there too. 

It's great to see other people enjoying success in their tents and I hope to keep my ladies as healthy throughout as yours obviously were. Lots of good info all around in this thread. I've gotta try my hand at making some dry ice hash. Enjoy your smoke, you've earned it. Trimming's brutal!


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## oceangreen (Sep 19, 2011)

how tall were your plants from the top of you pot before you switched to flowering?


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## drekoushranada (Sep 20, 2011)

They ranged from 2ft-5ft. The Blue Widow was the shortest.


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## SWUSAZ (Sep 22, 2011)

Was the Blue nute shy? What was her stretch X 2 or more? I have one on wk 2.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 23, 2011)

Well I kept the Nutes on the low side for the most part. The Blue Widow actually did well. It didnt seem nute shy to me.


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## SWUSAZ (Sep 23, 2011)

Cool thank you for the heads up. My BW seems a tad bit slower but in soil. "I thought I had mold yesterday on my Cheese". Sorry really though I did see the pudie cat. Turned out to be flowers have a different look like velvet close up.


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## drekoushranada (Sep 23, 2011)

Im glad its not mold. It would suck to get some. You will love the Blue Widow smell. Its very sweet smelling!


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## SWUSAZ (Sep 23, 2011)

Yes I am guilty I was just fondling her and wow she must have sprayed me blue.
She sucked up almost a half gallon today rather slow drinker compared to my guzzle gut Mazar girl. She will finish off a gallon then ask for more every day.


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## Jman305 (Feb 15, 2012)

drekoushranada said:


> The Blue widow is the smallest plant in the tent. But its the best smelling one for sure. It must be that Blueberry pheno that is giving out the smell.
> 
> 
> Yeah thats the same thing I was thinking. But I will have me some dry ice hash for the friends to try until this stuff dry and cure. Hash is not popular at all around these parts of the South. For some reason they think its a different drug! Smh.....


 Yeah dude, you almost never hear of anyone havin that hash. Only run across it a couple of times.


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## DOMSWOOZ (Feb 13, 2013)

LBH said:


> + rep THAT! My motto,...."Less is more" ....ESPECIALLY in hydro. I use 1/3 the nutes I did in soil. I rarely break 800ppm in flower, avg 500-600 This is awesome advice that we rarely see. Many like to push ppm to the limit thinking the more food, the better. I'm not a believer. In time you will learn to listen to what the plants are saying and address what they need as they tell you.


Best thing said on here since they announced slice bread. "LESS IS MORE"


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