# 2x2x5 Grow Lab - Reserva Privada Headband ... [ 100w T5 veg / 250w HPS flower ]



## Sr. Verde (Nov 11, 2011)

Welcome 

For the next few months, we are going to be growing two headbands by Reserva Privada... We will start them in Fox Farms Light Warrior as seeds, veg under 100w of 6500k florescent bulbs until they are 6 inches.. Then they're going in 11 liter pots with Fox Farms Ocean Forest... then flowering under a 250w Hortilux HPS...


I plan on using a screen for SCROG, we will see how it all goes.


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 11, 2011)

Day 1 Headband


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## blimey (Nov 11, 2011)

Looks legit. I really wanna try some head band. Sour diesel x OG Kush sounds better than sex!!!


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## theexpress (Nov 11, 2011)

subbed..................


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## dankshizzle (Nov 11, 2011)

Im subbed to all ur threads... Im a stalker verde


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 11, 2011)

theexpress said:


> subbed..................





dankshizzle said:


> Im subbed to all ur threads... Im a stalker verde



Thanks for joining the party folks 

Hopefully you guys can follow along and maybe point out some errors, or some things I could do better .

Thanks!


fyi: 
I will be keeping this journal to keep track of various information I have (dates/feedings/photoperiods/etc.).. So don't mind my little "personal notes" .


[Personal note: Veg day 1 started Nov 10 2011]


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## BongRipper559 (Nov 11, 2011)

OOOOO subbed


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## kmksrh21 (Nov 13, 2011)

Subbn' up Sr....


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## past times (Nov 13, 2011)

hey dude. I like what your doing. I grew with a 250watter for years. that is a perfect space for it. I got my best yield/watt with it actually. I'll be watching. 

Are those seeds feminized?


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 13, 2011)

Day 4......






Days confuse me but I think I'm correct, ill keep going with this count  

Second set of leaves will probably come through tomorrow... guessing fan leaves by 7 days .... hopefully ready to flower by 2-2.5 weeks.


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## dankshizzle (Nov 14, 2011)

Two legit......


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## mugan (Nov 14, 2011)

am subbed.. mostly cuz i wanna see the plants but also cuz your avy is so hypnotizing


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 15, 2011)

Day 5... Just rubbed a leaf and got a fatt whiff of fresh diesel with these almost fruity over tones... very complex smell... 

[I watered this morning heavy..hence the saggy leaves. The soil dries quick..]












So far, this strain seems promising. The last strain I ran was Tangerine Dream by Barneys Farm and they suckkkkked. Germ rate was terrible, and I had to kill half the plants because the phenos were just so terrible.. Even the good plants didn't have any kind of decent structure.

Theese seedlings have nice rigid leaves, and good vibes about them. I can't wait to see what they do . 78 day flower I hear from most people.


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## CEEJR (Nov 15, 2011)

Looking good. I'm running a GL60 with a 250 watter also but with a waterfarm.


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 15, 2011)

CEEJR said:


> Looking good. I'm running a GL60 with a 250 watter also but with a waterfarm.


Awesome .

At first I regretted not going bigger but I'm super happy now.. It's not big but you still get your medication . It takes a bit of refinement, and it's actually fun to really push such a small space. Leave for days, and not have to touch it!


Do you have a link to your journal?


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 18, 2011)

Headband day 9







I woke up this morning, soil was dry, temp was 78F and they were like this.... (leaves curling slightly downward)

I'm not worried, *still green - but any ideas on the leaves?*

.....I gave it water, and took the photo about 5 hours after.. I also just lowered the light a little.... figured it could use more intense light from the 100w CFL.. IDK first time running seedlings with a T5..I will have to compare my day 9 photos of my MH seedlings from my last grow VS day 9 of these Floro seedlings..


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## TheGrotesque (Nov 18, 2011)

Sr. Verde said:


> Welcome
> 
> For the next few months, we are going to be growing two headbands by Reserva Privada... We will start them in Fox Farms Light Warrior as seeds, veg under 100w of 6500k florescent bulbs until they are 6 inches.. Then they're going in 11 liter pots with Fox Farms Ocean Forest... then flowering under a 250w Hortilux HPS...
> 
> ...


Dude, when you say "We" do you mean the viewers of your journal or do you mean we as my friend or something?

Because dude, if you mean WE as in the viewer I was gonna totally feel like I played a role in your grow.


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 18, 2011)

I don't share my growing with anyone but RIU 


WE is _us_


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## TheGrotesque (Nov 19, 2011)

Looking forward to seeing your RP headband take off. I took a small sample bud of mine for testing and it's awesome already. If you wanna see some RP headband in the 7 week of flowering check out my journal.


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## mugan (Nov 19, 2011)

i feel a cumbia song coming


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## PanterasSon (Nov 19, 2011)

sub'd up, best of luck to ya


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 19, 2011)

Day 10





They are doing better today... Is it possible they were curling because I was hitting them with too much fan?  That or it was an overwatering issue that took 3 days to correct itself 

Either way they are perked back up again... I hope they take off soon, but I know they are growing valuable roots right now when I don't see any new leaves.


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## HIGHdef420 (Nov 19, 2011)

Definitly gonna sub this one. I just started my first medical grow and doing it in a box similar to size maybe a half foot difference in both L x W. Mine are a lil older sprouted the day before halloween. My wintergreen OG is doing spectacular and leaving the other 2 behind lol. 1 of the others looks great just a lil slow i think do to the cheap soil I used for that one and the other one idk what happened it is way behind. One day i noticed it only had 1 leaf coming out the middle and was worried, checked for bugs that could of eaten it or anything but couldnt find any sign of what happened. so i left it and it would just refuse to grow so as a last ditch effort i threw just a lil nutes and sparked the lil bugger back to life, leafs doubled in size in less the 48 hours. Well cant wait to watch your grow as were only like a week difference or so...


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## kmksrh21 (Nov 20, 2011)

Nice my man... Keep em' perky...

Here's a pic I snapped yesterday morning'...

I think it's awesome...

 

About to snap some more...


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 22, 2011)

We are rockin' now .


Day 13 Veg

Snapped a pic after misting the top soil...






So far this reserva privada headband looks good... Leaves are rugged, short so far.. and it smells awesome .

I cant wait until the roots get more established so I can plant it in its final pot of ocean forest..... I'm going to have to get some nutes soon. Superthrive and root 66 is on my list, as well as fox farms line and a new carbon pre filter ...


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## mugan (Nov 23, 2011)

they look nice nice


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 23, 2011)

Thanks 

Yeah they are starting to kick ass... Must have got a good root structure going by now


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 25, 2011)

Day 16 









interesting phenotypes

roots now coming through the bottom.... thinking of transplanting in 4ish days


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## Michael Phelps (Nov 25, 2011)

Thanks for the link buddy..

Hell yeah looking good Verde... Cant wait to watch these babies... Very interested in possibly growing the RP Headband in the future if it pans out to be anything like the 707 Headband.. 


So your really going to start flowering them at 6 inches tall? Id think you would have time to wait a little longer then that, your cab isnt that small.. 



I recommend a Scrog, very nice and easy, really helps to have an even canopy when height could potentially be a problem..


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 25, 2011)

Michael Phelps said:


> Thanks for the link buddy..
> 
> Hell yeah looking good Verde... Cant wait to watch these babies... Very interested in possibly growing the RP Headband in the future if it pans out to be anything like the 707 Headband..
> 
> ...


thanks for joining 

I've heard this strain will do 3.5x stretch for the first 20-30 days of flower.. I'm keeping these on the small side though definitly.. for fun .... this isn't my first run i'm just playing with what i can do right now


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## C.Indica (Nov 26, 2011)

That damned gyrating otter..

I'm stoked that I found this,
I was literally searching for something like this a few days before you started this thread.


I've got a couple unmarked containers, I'm 99% sure they're Headband/Trainwreck.
I've already got a Sativa, so I'm on the quest for some Headband.

Gonna use this as a comparison, and I expect nothing but clean gardening


Holy shit, +250% Stretch? 78 day Flowering time?
I take back what I said, this sounds even more Sativa than what I've got.

78 days.. I hope to god mine doesn't take that long, or I'll probably trash it unless it's golden.


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 26, 2011)

Thanks for joining 

Yeah I hear they fill out what stretches though

Good luck with your stuff... 

My plants don't seem too happy..... I don't know if it's the soil (FF light warrior)... the light or the strain.... it's all new to me... but they are curling somewhat....

It looks almost like they are root bound, but they just came through the bottom yesterday? Oh well, they are growing slow but it will be sorted once they are transplanted into their final pots with Fox Farms Ocean Forest .

edit : Perhaps they are simply not getting enough oxygen with this clay pot with a single hole on the bottom?


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## C.Indica (Nov 26, 2011)

I've had nothing but good results from terracotta pots (My favorite)
They all have good drainage, but the lower levels of your medium should also consist of well draining materials.

I'm assuming overwatering is your problem, good luck.
Dude fuck your otter, it slows my computer down when I try to type.


By the way, during week 3-4 of veg, (I'm assuming that would be ABOUT day 35-42 from seed)
For more females;
&#8226;~70% Humidity
&#8226;65*F-75*F (70*F optimal)
&#8226;More blue light (MH, or 5000k+)
&#8226;Shorter veg days, 15-18 hours of light per day.
&#8226;N>P>K as far as ratios go. (like 3-2-1 for example)
&#8226;No stress in the last week or two. (Topping, pruning, overwatering, underwatering, too much light, heat, repotting, etc)

Don't know if you knew this, but it encourages more Females from seed.


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 26, 2011)

For sure... These are femmed seeds so I'm not worried... I tend to go the *safe* route with my little two plant setup 

If only I had a mom  and some space for that fat lady 

I'm pretty much running 55% humidity, 78F at canopy level.. 100w 6500K floro... 20 hours on / 4 off.... no nutes... no training


Going to bring down a 250w 32,000 lumen air cooled HPS to flower them.... of course


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## C.Indica (Nov 26, 2011)

Ahh missed the bit about Feminised seeds haha.

Do a Bonsai Mum. If that's what you were talking about. I love mine.


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 26, 2011)

C.Indica said:


> Ahh missed the bit about Feminised seeds haha.
> 
> Do a Bonsai Mum. If that's what you were talking about. I love mine.


I'd need another small tent which I don't have  And I don't keep strains running all year... It gets too hot..... thats my problem ..... though its winter now so lights on baby !


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## C.Indica (Nov 27, 2011)

Small tent for Bonsai Moms?

As lame as it sounds, just do a PC stealth case with some CFL's in it, and keep a couple mothers.
I know you can keep that cold enough in the summer.


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## past times (Nov 28, 2011)

Hey Verde. Just cought up in the thread. looking good. For the mom you could keep them in a small little like 1x1x3 with a bunch of cfl's up top. If you bonsai you could have a few if you wanted. those you could control the temps better and even give them low lightduring the summer...but you could keep them year around. give yourself a little project during the summer too


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 28, 2011)

past times said:


> Hey Verde. Just cought up in the thread. looking good. For the mom you could keep them in a small little like 1x1x3 with a bunch of cfl's up top. If you bonsai you could have a few if you wanted. those you could control the temps better and even give them low lightduring the summer...but you could keep them year around. give yourself a little project during the summer too



But then I would need additional room to run more plants to find a good mom . If your going to have a mom you should insure it is a good pheno...


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 28, 2011)

Day 19

Plants have been looking like shit the last 2-3 days... I doubt it's overwatering, as I watered on the 16th day and watched the leaves curl worse as the soil dried.... I think they were suffering from a lack of nutrients or something... I was using FF light warrior the first time and I definitely like a 30% perlite 70% FFOF mix for seedlings instead. Today on the 19th day the lower leaves began to yellow - a sign of a lack of nitrogen....

I had intended to pop them in their final pot a little before the 3rd week, so today I did. I found the roots curling around the bottom and a few finding their way out the drain hole..


I put them in what I have been told is like a 10-11 liter square bucket... Filled with Fox Farms Ocean Forest...my shit... the stuff I'm used to...... I also added a few handfuls of some perlite to the bottom of the pots... for the first 5 inches and mixed it up, to let the roots breathe towards the bottom a little.




___

before the transplant..looks like shit I know . Tell me about it  Also seriously small for 19 days. Perhaps I should have not been lazy and picked up nutes before today .





























after the transplant.... not going to look like shit for long  Now I'm wondering why I didn't do half ffof half fflw for the first pots...  That would have been enough nutes but still airy .... I'm a stoner.. what can I say..



You guys ready to see some plants take off? Should be awesome for the next week. I hit them with some thrive alive in the water today... I let them soak before I transplanted and soaked the soil a little after the transplant. So they should bounce back rather quickly they love that stuff.


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## blimey (Nov 28, 2011)

Yea I think it is from lack of nutes. My plants had some yellowing of the leaves from lack of nutes around 2 weeks.


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 28, 2011)

blimey said:


> Yea I think it is from lack of nutes. My plants had some yellowing of the leaves from lack of nutes around 2 weeks.


Yeah good call. ... they are tiny, but still growing tiny leaves... and yellowing from a recessive deficiency.. 

Yeah I just didn't think about it.... I'm so used to my ocean forest being fine for a month... the light warrior threw me off because I kind of forgot I had used it in the little pots.. 



They are sitting on a goldmine of nutes now... So lets see how this goes...

side note:
Today I also picked up Fox Farms nutrient line : Grow Big, Big Bloom & Tiger Bloom....... also picked up a small bottle of thrive alive


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## mugan (Nov 29, 2011)

i have also had that happen as my root structure is growing then after a few weeks goes back to normal ,


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## mugan (Nov 29, 2011)

with that curling tho you might wanna check how damp your keeping your soil, just something that happened to me


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## Sr. Verde (Nov 29, 2011)

mugan said:


> with that curling tho you might wanna check how damp your keeping your soil, just something that happened to me


The soil was 95% bone dry when I took the photos of them looking like shit in their pots..

The roots were definitely getting oxygen.. Overwatering was my first guess until they started to wilt on top of the curling 

Now for the first few weeks I'll only have to water this lot once a week or so.. Sweet.


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## titycaca (Nov 29, 2011)

Seriously Subbed. You were my inspiration to start growing. I watched one of your DR60 grows with 4 plants and you took up every possible inch it was impressive. 

Now I join the journey of growing, all thanks to you, a little motivation and a little bit of cash  

Excited for the SCROG!


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## JamesQuall (Nov 29, 2011)

I'm looking into a very similar set up with a 250, looking good and def subbed.


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## past times (Nov 29, 2011)

Hey verde. You could probably do 2 harvest over the winter. that would be at least 4 plants to pick a mother from. You check pH issues also with that curling? Did you add lime to the soil?


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 1, 2011)

Day 22 Veg...

[Probably the best update so far]

I'm so happy to bring you folks happy plants. For once. Just in the last few days alone the difference between mediums is night and day... I no longer think that Light Warrior is ment to be used by itself.... I now feel its more like perlite, you just mix that in with regular soil to air it out and bring the heat from the nutes down...

Ocean Forest Magic:
pheno #1[looking indica thus far.. compact and bushy structure..]





pheno #2[looking sativa so far..... long node spaces, thick structure.. but no stretching..

from the side... reaching for the light like they should be doing







Seriously liking my floros so far.. I can bring them DOWNNN... temps are at 73F...45% humidity... Perfect 






I feel like if I had been feeding my plants in some way in the last 15 days that they would be twice as big by now....... Oh well, they should catch up soon.



Pheno #1/#2 look pretty close so far.... I mean one looks more sativa but the height difference and node development is within a day or two of eachother...  looking pretty decent for SCROG..




grow note: I'm spotting some minor, inital signs of cal/mag deficiency on the older leaves... Means that the plant isn't getting enough additional calcium or magnesium...... This is a typical problem with my plants - indoor and out... I will be picking up some Cal/Mag at the store tomorrow.


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## kmksrh21 (Dec 2, 2011)

Lookin' perfect...


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## dankshizzle (Dec 2, 2011)

looking good. is this your normal grow size or an experiment?


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 2, 2011)

kmksrh21 said:


> Lookin' perfect...


Thanks dude!  Keep watching! Should start looking awesome in a week



dankshizzle said:


> looking good. is this your normal grow size or an experiment?



This is the second time i've done a run with this tent in particular... I don't have a normal size... I mean I could fit 3 medium plants... 2 large plants or 4 small plants most likely.... I'll continue to play around with all the *settings* and see what else can come from this...


I really wanted to give these headbands some space.... We will see how they do... they definitely will not be cramped though.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 2, 2011)

past times said:


> Hey verde. You could probably do 2 harvest over the winter. that would be at least 4 plants to pick a mother from. You check pH issues also with that curling? Did you add lime to the soil?


Yeah.... I could.... but it would be a guessing game.... If I were to ever truly clone... I would clone out maybe 3-4 promising plants from 15-20... then I would plant a few mothers, and flower out the ones I picked..... Which ever ended up with the best structure and flowers - I would pick as a mother...

If I was going to make moms in this tent..... i'd have to blindly clone from 2-3 plants... and then id have 2 mothers that I've never seen past veg ... thats not very helpful! I'd rather see all the phenos in the seeds and take a cutting from a friends plant I know is awesome to grow...



JamesQuall said:


> I'm looking into a very similar set up with a 250, looking good and def subbed.


Nice I'm glad... i don't see too many 250s around here but they are really nice.... I almost regretted not getting a 400w but I'm happy now --- I'm spending less on my electric bill, worrying less about temperatures (250w can't even get that hot) and just growing some fire in a small tent 



titycaca said:


> Seriously Subbed. You were my inspiration to start growing. I watched one of your DR60 grows with 4 plants and you took up every possible inch it was impressive.
> 
> Now I join the journey of growing, all thanks to you, a little motivation and a little bit of cash
> 
> Excited for the SCROG!


 Thanks man! Makes me happy this journal is helping people out! I wish I saw a 250w grow like this before I purchased, I would have learned things faster.... I kind of just went for a small tent that was still awesome 

Lets see your tent


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## dankshizzle (Dec 2, 2011)

i have a 4x4 tent and a 2x4 tent that i use. i also have a 15x15 flowering room. i like the tents. craigslist is a great place to pick them up. i got both mine for 100$ and they were only used for 2 months. said they died in that 2 months and gave up. also got the fans and t5s with it. he showed me the pic of what he was doing. he had a 4 foot 4 bulb all the way on the ceiling with the plants on the floor. about 4-5 foot gap between the light.... it was funny. they got tall n skinny in no time...


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 2, 2011)

I would bang a really ugly chick for a room with a 10x10 tent inside it.......they are beautiful....


if I had to pick between that and a really nice 100k sports car i couldn't sell... i would take the tent in a room in a heart beat..


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 2, 2011)

I picked up some botanical cal/mag..... like $7 a bottle I was pleasantly surprised 

Also picked up a new pre filter for my carbon filter.... the old one is like 160 days of use on it... could use a new clean cover... the old cover is super dusty and grimy 


gave the two people working at the hydro shop a few cannabis infused lollipops  they were pleasantly surprised by the freebies


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## mugan (Dec 3, 2011)

that kind of kind of kindness deserves a medal :LOLZ


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 3, 2011)

I give away more than I can keep track of.. What goes around comes around.. And I have too much for myself anyway..


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## mugan (Dec 3, 2011)

word......


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 6, 2011)

The ladies are doing nicely.... They are vegging pretty hard (somewhat presumably, haven't looked at them in 2 days honestly, but bitches love that  )... 
Also...... DAMN temps have dropped recently, and rather drastically with the weather... I have no heater in the room with the tent, I kind of rely on the lights .... I hope my little ladies will take to the chills ok!





I feel like a heater will just laugh at my electricity bill, so I'll just keep it how it's going... HPS will warm the tent perfectly if these temps persist....
As it is now day 72F/night 58-62F... I hear cannabis enjoys like 8-12F temp changes, and starts to get different coloring with lower temps locking out phosphorous... Though i have never witnessed it grow like that myself.

I'm probably going to water them today/tomorrow with nutes.. 1/4 strength to start, they will be fine on food for 2 weeks + probably but i personally find they respond better to a slow weaning than an immediate half or even full dose... Perhaps this 'organic' Fox Farms line will be easier on the plants though....


I've decided to cut back on supplements as much as I can for this grow... Keep it natural, keep it cannabis.... Ill use 'non-organic' cal/mag by botanicare..... with the occasional Thrive Alive [red]... the shop only had huge bottles of the organic so i figured fuck it and opted with the regular red stuff.... I use thrive alive when they need it and I actually find it's awesome for transplant stress if you soak the roots like a half hour before transplanting..



Now that I'm uploading this thermostat picture I'm realizing I took plant photos for you guys then must have gotten stoned and forgot to post them  ... sorry


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## Weedo Bandito (Dec 6, 2011)

Subbed. I just picked up a GL60 a few days ago. I look forward to seeing your progress. I plan on using my tent to flower my current Northern Lights grow. I have 6 plants that are 3 weeks into veg in a HydroFarm DWC set up.


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## witelightnin (Dec 6, 2011)

Sr. Verde said:


> The ladies are doing nicely.... They are vegging pretty hard (somewhat presumably, haven't looked at them in 2 days honestly, but bitches love that  )...
> Also...... DAMN temps have dropped recently, and rather drastically with the weather... I have no heater in the room with the tent, I kind of rely on the lights .... I hope my little ladies will take to the chills ok!
> 
> I feel like a heater will just laugh at my electricity bill, so I'll just keep it how it's going... HPS will warm the tent perfectly if these temps persist....
> As it is now day 72F/night 58-62F... I hear cannabis enjoys like 8-12F temp changes, and starts to get different coloring with lower temps locking out phosphorous... Though i have never witnessed it grow like that myself.


Temps below 60 seem a bit extreme. The lowest my room gets is about 61-2 and I STILL get reddish purple stems. A heater might not be a bad idea. If you're worried about heat bill, you could always look into different types of heaters than just electric. Some of them can actually be VERY cost effective, especially if you are only running them when your lights are off. One other note, if you do decide to get a heater, keep a close eye on your humidity level. Heaters tend to really dry out the air, so you might need to counter with a humidifier or something.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 6, 2011)

Weedo Bandito said:


> Subbed. I just picked up a GL60 a few days ago. I look forward to seeing your progress. I plan on using my tent to flower my current Northern Lights grow. I have 6 plants that are 3 weeks into veg in a HydroFarm DWC set up.
> 
> View attachment 1922314


Awesome.. Just plan for the flower stretch and growth. I was pushing the gl60 capacity with 4 plants my last grow.



witelightnin said:


> Temps below 60 seem a bit extreme. The lowest my room gets is about 61-2 and I STILL get reddish purple stems. A heater might not be a bad idea. If you're worried about heat bill, you could always look into different types of heaters than just electric. Some of them can actually be VERY cost effective, especially if you are only running them when your lights are off. One other note, if you do decide to get a heater, keep a close eye on your humidity level. Heaters tend to really dry out the air, so you might need to counter with a humidifier or something.


Yeah I know I know lol..

It's because these damn floros are so cool... With the lights on the plants are sitting in like 68f.. I have the t5 nearly touching.

These temperatures are really strange for my area though. Kind of a fluke this week. In 5 days the weather comes up like 15F.

I have a heater, I was just hoping to not have to bust it out. Maybe though.


Grow update:

First day of feeding.. Im following a feeding schedule from fox farms and they're telling me to combine grow big and bloom.. Did about 1/3 strength with full strength cal mag.. Next feeding will be like 3/4 strength then full power I guess.

They did blow up too, though the one plant seems to be growing bigger and faster than the other. I hope the little girl can catch up to the bigger one. Pics later.


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## Michael Phelps (Dec 6, 2011)

Sr. Verde said:


> I give away more than I can keep track of.. What goes around comes around.. And I have too much for myself anyway..


Isnt it awesome bro???



I feel like im on the same plane with you on this one, i give so much free shit out, in return it seems soooo much more ends up coming back around...





Btw Verde, glad to know your grow is going so well! I was going to suggest PHing the run off water cause ive had similar problem like that where PH coming out of the pot was way more acidic then when it was going in.. But it seems like transplanting to the O.F. got those babies up and going!


Btw, should be getting a new rig pretty soon! Hella stoked!


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## jaycuffee21 (Dec 6, 2011)

plant looks a little stunted for 22 days in the last pic, she should be at least 6 inches by now headband is a pretty vigorous strain in the veg state.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 6, 2011)

jaycuffee21 said:


> plant looks a little stunted for 22 days in the last pic, she should be at least 6 inches by now headband is a pretty vigorous strain in the veg state.


 trust me, I know. They are super small for the amount of time they have been alive.. 

However, shes not stunted...at least not anymore. Just super duper slow growing.... Thanks to using Light Warrior for like the first 2.5 weeks... No nutrients, I should have mixed it 50% light warrior 50% ocean forest... If I did I guarentee they would be bigger.

Don't worry though, they are in nutrient rich soil, in their final pots... They are established and thriving now - no worries.  Just gave them a light feeding today, they are like twice the size of the last pics.

Were not on a time limit.... So I took it sloooooowwww and lazy for the first few weeks (oops.)

.... wait for this update coming up 



Michael Phelps said:


> Isnt it awesome bro???
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah like I said the problem was definitely me incorrectly using a medium. I should have been feeding, but didn't because I forgot I planted it in light warrior.

The ocean forest is good stuff - I don't have pH problems as long as I adjust my water before I water them.... The soil holds a stable pH..


Your getting a rig.... and I'm getting a rig  nice.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 7, 2011)

What the fuck happened to the forum? I tried over like 3 hours last night to get on, and it kept loosing connection.... fuck man.. now it's all retarded


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 7, 2011)

Day 27 (photos are from yesterday, today is day 28 )



Very pretty...





Not struggling, but not growing as big as the other one... Nodes are compact and smell is more sweet than the other plant





Nice green foliage now.... Starting to pack the leaves with N.





Area where we were seeing cal/mag deficiencies form... Interestingly enough, the copper spots have gone away from the mag deficiency.. Looking good in that respect, not very deficient in anything - we will push the nutes later on..





added 52w of CFL... brought the temp up to 70F in the tent.. Won't hurt, but keeps daytime temps proper. Night time temps are still worrysome but eh fuck it? Experiment time?





Plant level.. bending a few leaves to expose newly forming branches a bit better.. don't mind the sag.





Looks like a circus in there... 







It's safe to say were back on track, where we should have been a week and a half ago .


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## upthearsenal (Dec 7, 2011)

What up Verde! You know I'm in for this one, had to find it the hard way! 

I think you and I have similar t5s, how many bulbs is yours?


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 7, 2011)

I think I have 4 bulbs.... each bulb 24w ?

Works out pretty well... But I'm going to try to veg them short and bushy so lets hope the floros do work...!


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## upthearsenal (Dec 7, 2011)

True, I have the six bulb, and love it for veg. I also have another four bulb that I've used for two years and it still does me well.

Happy growing!


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 7, 2011)

upthearsenal said:


> True, I have the six bulb, and love it for veg. I also have another four bulb that I've used for two years and it still does me well.
> 
> Happy growing!


Four does seem a little small...  I don't think the store I went to had any 6 bulbs though...


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## C.Indica (Dec 7, 2011)

Yo I started up a T5 Club since it doesn't exist yet.
https://www.rollitup.org/cfl-fluorescent-lighting/493026-club-t5.html


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## upthearsenal (Dec 8, 2011)

For sure, I wanted the 8 bulb but they didn't have it where I shop. I like the one I have though because unlike the older t5 I own, the 6 bulb has on/off switches for both 2 and 4 bulbs, which is nice if I don't want all six on.

I actually think a 4 bulb model goes perfect with a 250, considering the plant count you can keep under each. I guess that's why I had to move up to a 6 when I got a 400w hps, haha... either way, t5's are the shit, and I enjoy using 'em.


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## titycaca (Dec 9, 2011)

I'm rocking 2' 8 BULB T5 in my dr60 and it's actually creates mad heat issues, but other than that my bubba kush is so stout and bushy... seriously wasn't expecting it at all. Can't wait to see your ladies flourish.


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## C.Indica (Dec 9, 2011)

titycaca said:


> I'm rocking 2' 8 BULB T5 in my dr60 and it's actually creates mad heat issues, but other than that my bubba kush is so stout and bushy... seriously wasn't expecting it at all. Can't wait to see your ladies flourish.


Been brainstorming in the back of my head for a while,
can you rotate the light like 10*-30*?


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## kmksrh21 (Dec 9, 2011)

Start to finish...

Glad I could encourage your t5 purchase, even though I'm rockin' 8's and 12's.

View attachment 1927319View attachment 1927321


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## Someguy15 (Dec 10, 2011)

Hey Verde nice grow. Veggies are looking great. I have 2 diff phenos of the RP headband myself and both are pretty stretchy. I flowered at about 15" and ended up with plants about 42" lol just beware, a bit of sativa in her! Subscribed.


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## C.Indica (Dec 10, 2011)

I have two seeds that just germinated,
50/50 chance of Trainwreck or Headband,
but whichever they are they're both the same.


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## dankshizzle (Dec 10, 2011)

I love my quantum bad boy 8 bulb 4 foot t5. It's a live saver. And bad as looking..

But Verde- u didn't join my club yet... What gives. It's been up for 42 hours!


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 10, 2011)

Someguy15 said:


> Hey Verde nice grow. Veggies are looking great. I have 2 diff phenos of the RP headband myself and both are pretty stretchy. I flowered at about 15" and ended up with plants about 42" lol just beware, a bit of sativa in her! Subscribed.


Yessir!

I spoke to upthearsenal about this before I even planted my seeds. He warned me about a 3-3.5x flower stretch.. So I'm *anticipating* 4x stretch to be safe.. I have a little over 2 feet to work with from soil level to flower tops in the end, so I am flowering at around 6 inches.



Grow update: I just watered my plants with about 3L balanced plain water.. I won't see them for 3 days, and they were already about 30-45% larger than they were on day 27..

I will probably start 12/12 in a week or two.. It depends.

I guess I will set up my screen, try to let them veg into the screen and start flowering? I've never used a screen, so I'm not sure how/when to begin approaching it. Any tips? I know I want to let the tops grow up into the screen, and tuck it under and away from the center to utilize my space. But I don't know if most people do that before or after the flower stretch? Both? After 2-3 weeks flower just let them grow out of the screen?

This should be fun! The ladies are smelling pretty diesel. Like a jungle plant, musky dankness.


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## Someguy15 (Dec 10, 2011)

Sr. Verde said:


> Yessir!
> 
> I spoke to hotheaded snap about this whefore I even planted my seeds. He warned me about a 3-3.5x flower stretch.. So I'm *anticipating* 4x stretch to be safe.. I have a little over 2 feet to work with from soil level to flower tops in the end, so I am flowering at around 6 inches.
> 
> ...


 Start with topping and and LST. You want a bunch of branching before you put the screen on. Check out my pic album for a screen example... https://picasaweb.google.com/110253852692039295916/BlueMisticWaterfarmSideProject?authkey=Gv1sRgCLTa4pOEqfbHxwE


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## upthearsenal (Dec 10, 2011)

Yeah, LST is important. I start training before it goes under the screen (probably now for you) in veg, and I would place the screen over just before flowering... 

You'll see which are most dominant and such, tie those down so that the auxins travel to the smaller/lower shoots. I'd say once you have an even canopy, maybe just under the screen, (considering the stretch) you should flip... when they start stretching just tie them down so that the big ones stay at the height you want, and the others should should catch up.... 

One thing I did with my HB when it was under the scrog was when a lot of the branches got to a point where I wanted them, and there a few that were straggling behind, I just tied down EVERY single cola that I didn't want to grow any more and the other few (maybe like 3-4) shot up like crazy and when the stretch was over they were all around the same height... hope that made sense, haha...

I revived my old journal so that I could keep track of what I'm doing, I need to build another screen cause the plant I have now was a huge bush before I flowered her and now it's all disorganized, colas everywhere toppled over and shit... hah.. Screens really do help a lot...


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## thegersman (Dec 10, 2011)

Sr. Verde said:


> Welcome
> 
> For the next few months, we are going to be growing two headbands by Reserva Privada... We will start them in Fox Farms Light Warrior as seeds, veg under 100w of 6500k florescent bulbs until they are 6 inches.. Then they're going in 11 liter pots with Fox Farms Ocean Forest... then flowering under a 250w Hortilux HPS...
> 
> ...


Hey old friend !!!! Logging on and entire site been keeping me off,

I am subbed!!!!!! My new grow is about 6-8 weeks ahead of yours. 

gers


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 10, 2011)

Someguy15 said:


> Start with topping and and LST. You want a bunch of branching before you put the screen on. Check out my pic album for a screen example... https://picasaweb.google.com/110253852692039295916/BlueMisticWaterfarmSideProject?authkey=Gv1sRgCLTa4pOEqfbHxwE


Yeah I will be slowly training them.... I'm not topping as per recommendation.. I hear the RP headband produces a lot of tops as it is.... and that topping pretty much detriments the growth (for this strain, usually I'm a fan of topping)



upthearsenal said:


> Yeah, LST is important. I start training before it goes under the screen (probably now for you) in veg, and I would place the screen over just before flowering...
> 
> You'll see which are most dominant and such, tie those down so that the auxins travel to the smaller/lower shoots. I'd say once you have an even canopy, maybe just under the screen, (considering the stretch) you should flip... when they start stretching just tie them down so that the big ones stay at the height you want, and the others should should catch up....
> 
> ...


 Thanks for the tips! I am familiar with the growth auxins and hormones..and their relation to where and how a plant grows...... just wasn't 100% clear on utilizing the screen! Ill take your tips.... Start weaving it in the screen ASAP in veg... and will flower when the screen is somewhat full.... then will keep weaving tops for the first 2 weeks....



thegersman said:


> Hey old friend !!!! Logging on and entire site been keeping me off,
> 
> I am subbed!!!!!! My new grow is about 6-8 weeks ahead of yours.
> 
> gers





Good luck on yours gersman! Last run looked really nice!


It's nice coming back here with a journal, and reuniting with all you folks... It's cool that we are always running different setups, strains, and comparing notes on everything! Good keeping in touch 




 I should be keeping track of my vegging plants more honestly.... I just haven't had the time! They will be HUGE by the time I see them again I'm sure.


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## upthearsenal (Dec 10, 2011)

I wouldn't weave per-say, once a branch gets long, I'd pull it out from underneath and move it to another spot farther down, so that it's now shorter, and more of the branch and it's nodes are underneath the screen, horizontally. Again, hopefully that made sense 

You'll figure it out though once you get the screen going it's much easier once you're in the actual process...


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 10, 2011)

upthearsenal said:


> I wouldn't weave per-say, once a branch gets long, I'd pull it out from underneath and move it to another spot farther down, so that it's now shorter, and more of the branch and it's nodes are underneath the screen, horizontally. Again, hopefully that made sense
> 
> You'll figure it out though once you get the screen going it's much easier once you're in the actual process...


For sure.... I didn't mean I'd be knitting or anything, obviously branches wouldn't like that ... just forcing a branch to be smaller without effecting the flower sites! . i wouldn't be weaving it in and out, just tucking it down once or twice onto a different part of the screen.

SCROG is an art though... that is learned from experience. ... this I understand! Should be fun!


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## upthearsenal (Dec 10, 2011)

LOL yeah, I've seen people try and weave and they end up with problems hah... Scroging is fun though, you'll love they way your ladies look when there's a nice even canopy of colas


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 10, 2011)

upthearsenal said:


> LOL yeah, I've seen people try and weave and they end up with problems hah... Scroging is fun though, you'll love they way your ladies look when there's a nice even canopy of colas




You saw my last tent .... donky dicks falling out the front of the tent when you opened it.... I want that screen to keep them in place 

I'm very ready :loL:


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## mugan (Dec 10, 2011)

we all waiting


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 10, 2011)

Me too! I'm waiting til monday... You guys will have pics tuesday


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 11, 2011)

Reading over this tent got my heart racing... Im about to buy a GL60 also. I have one question not mean to jack your thread but i have a 400W HPS do you think I could cool it in there? PS SUBBEDDD!!!


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 11, 2011)

Ge7Som3 said:


> Reading over this tent got my heart racing... Im about to buy a GL60 also. I have one question not mean to jack your thread but i have a 400W HPS do you think I could cool it in there?




No worries man! I'm all about spreading information. Just so others know, *the below is not grow notes*... just notes on grow tents, and my experiences in general....



but.....HMMMM..... it really depends... With my environment I don't think I could fit a 400w in my tent while keeping it cool. The only way I could possibly do that is with a 6 inch inline fan, hooked up to a cool tube with the 400w inside it.... and the smallest cool tube I could find was like 26 inches without any ducting attached... which very much exceeds the space in a gl60...

I think a 2.5ftx2.5ft tent would be the minimal for an 400w efficient grow... if you wanted to go 600w you could probably do 3x3ft with a high CFM 6 inch fan...



My advice... Is start with ventilation, and inline fans - then move on from there to figure out how much light you can have....

I started my tent journey wondering how big of a hood I could fit in a GL60.... I should have thought about how much I could cool it... Then I should have thought about what light would run the coolest/brightest under that ventilation...

250w is perfect for the gl60 with some supplemental lighting, you can keep the light somewhat low, intense, and cool... I can add about 50w-100w of floroescent light in addition to a 250wHPS and keep things cool.... but again 400w you would be battling temperatures, and keeping that light super high so your flowers dont get cooked... 

I would honestly get the next size up for 400w..... if you can afford the space, it is worth it totally.


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## Someguy15 (Dec 11, 2011)

Sr. Verde said:


> No worries man! I'm all about spreading information. Just so others know, *the below is not grow notes*... just notes on grow tents, and my experiences in general....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I concur the 250 is as big as you want to go in the GL60.


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 11, 2011)

Sr. Verde said:


> No worries man! I'm all about spreading information. Just so others know, *the below is not grow notes*... just notes on grow tents, and my experiences in general....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 size is a big problem for me.. I already have the 400w..
And yeah I was looking at cool tubes there all just too big... I really hope I can find a solution to this without haveling to sell my lightthanks for your input it really helps I'm subbed love to see how this goes. If you think of anything let me know lol I have a ac I could hook a duct to? And I am thing about making co2

Edit: so kind of a noob question im pretty sure i can but would like some experienced opinions anyywayss i can just buy a 250W Bulb right?
.


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## upthearsenal (Dec 11, 2011)

Ge7Som3 said:


> size is a big problem for me.. I already have the 400w..
> And yeah I was looking at cool tubes there all just too big... I really hope I can find a solution to this without haveling to sell my lightthanks for your input it really helps I'm subbed love to see how this goes. If you think of anything let me know lol I have a ac I could hook a duct to? And I am thing about making co2
> 
> Edit: so kind of a noob question im pretty sure i can but would like some experienced opinions anyywayss i can just buy a 250W Bulb right?
> .



If you have a digital ballast, then it's likely you can dim it from 400w to 250... I did this in the summer for heat reasons; I have a lumatek 400w.


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 11, 2011)

Its not dimable. just a digital ballast its a off brand im sure.. got it off amazon


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 11, 2011)

But thanks for the help i dont wanna jack your Beautiful Thread u got going here so if u care to help out come stop by (https://www.rollitup.org/stealth-micro-cab-growing/494002-growlab-60-a.html) Thanks again Verde!


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 11, 2011)

You need the proper ballast.... then the hood doesn't matter... like upthearsenal said...



Just trust me lol it gets really warm with just a 250w in the gl60... i dont think it would be worth the money to run AC or Co2 to battle temps off a 400w in a gl60...

like i said updates tuesday


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## mugan (Dec 11, 2011)

but i thought , other than raising the temp threshold of the plants Co2 helps with other stuff too. well when flowering


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## Someguy15 (Dec 11, 2011)

mugan said:


> but i thought , other than raising the temp threshold of the plants Co2 helps with other stuff too. well when flowering


It does but a tank and regulator is 300. Pretty big investment. And with the air movement you need to cool the light, you might have heat issues while injecting (exhaust fan off).


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 11, 2011)

Well carbon dioxide does help plants.... But I hardly see the need to take a whole room and maintain a c02 PPM if your only using a 2x2x5 tent...

They have little crappy bags that emmit Co2.... idk if they work, i doubt if they do..


IMO the only time people should use CO2 is when they can maintain precise PPM for the entirety of the grow.... and the grow should be bigger than a tent - it should be a room.... Then you can use co2 tanks with the correct equipment to maintain those levels...


Co2 is tricky... It's an all or nothing thing, and can effect plants as such.


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## mugan (Dec 11, 2011)

lolz, what about alternatives, like fermenting sugar or baking powder/vinigar or what ever, when i did my first grow i tried it in the veg box. no significant diff but am also growing sats that take 4-6 months so...


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## Someguy15 (Dec 11, 2011)

mugan said:


> lolz, what about alternatives, like fermenting sugar or baking powder/vinigar or what ever, when i did my first grow i tried it in the veg box. no significant diff but am also growing sats that take 4-6 months so...


that stuff is a waste of time with any real circulation. Maybe if your growing in a Uhaul box with computer fans...other than that it be like trying to piss and create a river lol


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## mugan (Dec 11, 2011)

hmm .. well eventually i just moved out side, besides growing sats with CFLs is more like trying to make a river with pis than the Co2 thing


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 11, 2011)

Someguy15 said:


> that stuff is a waste of time with any real circulation. Maybe if your growing in a Uhaul box with computer fans...other than that it be like trying to piss and create a river lol





Exactly. Rooms with increased co2 work because they are sealed, and the co2 never escapes the room.... The air is cooled and recycled inside the room....


If your letting a little bag produce/emit co2 in a room that isn't totally sealed, the co2 will most likely never go over any substantial concentrations... It's a good comparison with "pissing in the river... "


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## upthearsenal (Dec 11, 2011)

I've read that buildings have a high ppm of co2 than most places outdoors. So with that in mind, I guess in theory if you have a few plants inside the co2 is of a good ppm, but if you have let's say dozens of plants, that's when you're probably going to add more.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 11, 2011)

upthearsenal said:


> I've read that buildings have a high ppm of co2 than most places outdoors. So with that in mind, I guess in theory if you have a few plants inside the co2 is of a good ppm, but if you have let's say dozens of plants, that's when you're probably going to add more.



But say you introduce plants to (hypothetically) 1000ppm of Co2...... then 5 weeks later drop it to 200ppm....the plants will seriously suffer far more than they benefit.... While - the plants that had _no_ additional co2 at all will end up a stronger, larger plants by the end of the cycle...

if they EXPECT a level of co2..... they need to have it. They require it throughout... Otherwise growth will be seriously detrimented (i hear).... this is why the 'office building' theory makes sense when thinking co2=food, but when you put the science behind horticulture ....your better off keeping gas ratios in the air constant throughout your grow... unless you know what your doing, in a sealed room, with reliable co2 regulators and monitors...


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 11, 2011)

how about the Tonic water method?


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 11, 2011)

Dare I ask what the "tonic water" method is?  lets not get tooooo off topic though,, pm me?


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 11, 2011)

sent the pm


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## mugan (Dec 11, 2011)

Sr. Verde said:


> But say you introduce plants to (hypothetically) 1000ppm of Co2...... then 5 weeks later drop it to 200ppm....the plants will seriously suffer far more than they benefit.... While - the plants that had _no_ additional co2 at all will end up a stronger, larger plants by the end of the cycle...
> 
> if they EXPECT a level of co2..... they need to have it. They require it throughout... Otherwise growth will be seriously detrimented (i hear).... this is why the 'office building' theory makes sense when thinking co2=food, but when you put the science behind horticulture ....your better off keeping gas ratios in the air constant throughout your grow... unless you know what your doing, in a sealed room, with reliable co2 regulators and monitors...


can you apply that to , light intensity / spectrum


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## upthearsenal (Dec 11, 2011)

For sure, agreed. I was just saying that if you have a few plants the level of co2 will be quite high (considering they won't use it ALL up, and will get what they want/need) but when you get into the tens of plants that's when supplementation would help, i.e. tank, controller, sealed room, the whole shebang. So yeah, I'm sure a shit ton of plants would use up the average amount (already indoors) of co2, and thus hampering photosynthesis and glucose production.

But yeah, let's not stray too far away from the topic, looking forward to your next update mang!


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## mugan (Dec 11, 2011)

Co2/h20 are not food they make Atp which is kinda like energy , its used to power mitosis and the citric acid cycle and all those things, so you need ATP and carbs/sugars to get vegetation or flowers , well and the nutes . so it might not be food but its needed to metabolize it


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 11, 2011)

mugan said:


> Co2/h20 are not food they make Atp which is kinda like energy , its used to power mitosis and the citric acid cycle and all those things, so you need ATP and carbs/sugars to get vegetation or flowers , well and the nutes . so it might not be food but its needed to metabolize it


See thats another explanation entirely....  which is why i left it at co2=food.... as it helps plants *eat* ... or produce energy at least... I couldn't be more specific in such narrow explanations, while still explaining the idea behind co2


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 13, 2011)

Day 33 veg... Reserva Privada : Headband.... update


It's been a slow veg but whatever  Nice tight nodes, good branching forming. Two very healthy plants, ready to get a full feeding of organic nutes once their soil dries out a bit. I mean I can't complain. I just need to get this SCROG set up.

PS: The scrog isn't final yet.. So yes it looks a little shitty. My trey to collect drain water has cracked, so I have a temporary fix in place... I'm picking up some treys and I will take more time to get the screen right....... What level do you guys reccomend I keep the screen? My nodes are tight, and I'm flowering at 6-7 inches, I plan for a 3.5x stretch and a total height of about 2.2 feet from the dirt (once they stop growing vertically in flower).

*click play*
[youtube]mUT3KoxVzQg[/youtube]

Came back after 3 days to this, had to keep the light marginally higher for safety concerns..






This is definitely vegging more like an indica pheno type... Very compact nodes, and very large, round and even fan leaves.







This one is a little stretchier, and more vigorous with the foliage, but still doesn't seem super sativa or anything. Which will be nice.







Nodes before training











Brought the light up, & tossed in a 12 inch ruler for a photo... How high should the screen be? (flipping to 12/12 @ 6-7inches from dirt).







Exposing the nodes with some very gentle bending.... The light exposure past the fan leaves should make them come out from the bottom really strong and make a really even canopy.. Also the main stalk is looking very thick for a plant as short as it is, with the 6500k floros. 













Dropped the lights, this is how they chill out all day.






Lifted dangling CFLs for better photo







The air cooled 250w hps, chilling, getting pissed my plants aren't ready to flower yet  (sorry mr. high pressure sodium!  )











I'm finding this floro is cool... Makes really tight nodes... but things are slow, I understand why people have separate perpetual vegging/flower setups... So they can have the patience to do work with the floros during the veg stage.. The MH I have made my plants grow faster for sure, but the nodes weren't nearly as tight. These plants seem like they are better off, and ready to flower after a good long session in the floro light!



MMMMMMMmmmm. Can't wait to flip the switch on these bitches .


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 13, 2011)

Hhahahaha "MR. High Pressure Sodium"  Looks Great! Seems like where going to be doing close to the same thing, Good Luck man Keep the pics comin. Cant wait to see how this SCROG works. lol


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## mugan (Dec 13, 2011)

nice , greenery


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## kmksrh21 (Dec 13, 2011)

View attachment 1933937View attachment 1933938

lookin' good sr. verde.

I'm tokin' on this bubba kush^^. I love it. I don't know if you're a kush fan, but it's killer. I got one ak47 in flower <below>. I'm gonna flower 10 more ak's in the next 4-8 weeks. If you're still interested.

View attachment 1933936


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## C.Indica (Dec 13, 2011)

Wow, I'mnot sure if it's right,but I keepmy T5's much closer. Within an inch or two.
I've been raising them the last couple nights though to see if my seedlings will respond with vigor.

I hope the two unmarked seeds I planted are Headband.


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## mugan (Dec 13, 2011)

i think the space for florescent is 5 inch prolly a lil more for T5s tho


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 13, 2011)

C.Indica said:


> Wow, I'mnot sure if it's right,but I keepmy T5's much closer. Within an inch or two.
> I've been raising them the last couple nights though to see if my seedlings will respond with vigor.
> 
> I hope the two unmarked seeds I planted are Headband.


Closer than this?







I have them about an inch lower than that now that I adjusted the screen and made it tight....


They are like an inch from the tops of the big plant....



The tops are coming through really nice ill have more photos up tonight..





grow update: i picked up some general organics "bio weed" ? it's basically kelp... straight up... I just did a 1/3 tsp foliar feed i hear this stuff kicks ASS.


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 13, 2011)

Cant wait for the update and hear how the kelp worked out!!


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## mugan (Dec 13, 2011)

ya the kelp is supposed to have some killer enzymes to so you should drop some in tha soil


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## upthearsenal (Dec 14, 2011)

I keep my t5s as close as possible without the plants getting burnt (which only really happens when they touch the bulb), so about an inch away from the canopy.

And yeah man kelp is great, I run soil-less and I feed with kelp every watering. It keeps my plants constantly vigorous... good stuff indeed.


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## 287872542 (Dec 14, 2011)

Subbed and +Rep.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 14, 2011)

this is from yesterday... day 34


Gave them a foliar kelp feed, and poured the rest of the bottle in the soil.... Trying to squeeze the last bit of veg out that I can...

Going to let the soil dry real nice then feed fox farms grow big, cal mag, and bio weed (kelp)... Then we will probably be onto flower.

I wanted to see the effects of this kelp on a heavy foliar spray..

Before






After






Now we wait







They are tucked away, pretty good now.

Notice how my screen is nice?



How far from the soil should I set the screen once I flip to 12/12?


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 14, 2011)

Nice! lookin good


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## upthearsenal (Dec 14, 2011)

Are you going to top/train them?

Edit: before flipping that is


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 14, 2011)

You sent me this PM in june 



> Dude, verde, I'm gonna be pissed if you don't scrog these things. If you want the most out of this, you gotta scrog it. Don''t top because the apical meristem will be effing huge. I grew one without training it was okay, nothing like the the others I trained.



You didn't realize I'm going by 100% the numbers you provided?  3.5-3.7x stretch, no topping ... and SCROG.....

You said, "ill be pissed if you don't"


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## upthearsenal (Dec 14, 2011)

Lmao... I still stand by the no top, but I'd LST her without a doubt, look at mine in my journal. I show exactly when I train 'er


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 14, 2011)

upthearsenal said:


> Lmao... I still stand by the no top, but I'd LST her without a doubt, look at mine in my journal. I show exactly when I train 'er




I've already been training dude 


I started with bending and now I have ties going..


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## upthearsenal (Dec 14, 2011)

Haha, I guess I'm partially blind then, I can't tell if they're bent. They look like they're itching to get bushy already though which is awesome.

This is how mine looked, I guess I was just predisposed to this:

https://www.rollitup.org/attachments/grow-journals/1343740d1293248666-utas-indoor-organics-waterfarmin-closet-dsc02850.jpg

My bad! 

Looking back on mine, yours definitely look a lot more indica than mine did...


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 14, 2011)

Day 35...... Obviously I raise the light to take some photos.. fyi 


The training was poor before... I figured out a way to use an "anchor" on each node, and connect each anchor with a twist tie and tie them into each other... Basically it brings the main stem down to dirt level, to let the lower branching grow up... Looks a lot cleaner...


I'm kind of getting used to this screen... still don't know where it will be when I flower... but i'm liking how much I can spread the tops out...


I will be filling this screen out it looks like as much as I can before 12/12

Before training






after... jeeezeee this is gonna be fun  












chillin..... veggin....








Cant wait to give them a full strength feeding, still waiting for them to dry up their soil a bit though. Need that o2. The new growth/branches seem lime green like they could use some more N, and they are getting hungry for more cal/mg.


Mad branches coming through!


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 14, 2011)

I see Im loving the Before/After pics (as i am a novice) they help alot!! Looks Great nice and stocky. i had a question i think it involves SCROG but the term is "lollypopping"?

Edit: and what are you Anchoring them with


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## upthearsenal (Dec 14, 2011)

Awesome man. That last shot looks great.

As far as the height of the screen... I liked it about a foot above the soil, so I could water/feed with my jugs, and work well underneath. That was with a wire screen and wooden frame so there was no flexibility, I also had around 10 plants... As long as you can water and work with the plants it's totally up to you, especially since the squares are pretty big and the rope is flexible watering should be easier.

What nutrients are you using btw?


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## Someguy15 (Dec 14, 2011)

Ge7Som3 said:


> I see Im loving the Before/After pics (as i am a novice) they help alot!! Looks Great nice and stocky. i had a question i think it involves SCROG but the term is "lollypopping"?
> 
> Edit: and what are you Anchoring them with


Lollipoping is just removing the lower branches and bud sites that aren't getting good light. They produce popcorn buds that are usually made into hash, so by cutting them you can push a little bit more energy into the top colas. Most scrogers lolli once at week 1 and again at week 3.


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 14, 2011)

Someguy15 said:


> Lollipoping is just removing the lower branches and bud sites that aren't getting good light. They produce popcorn buds that are usually made into hash, so by cutting them you can push a little bit more energy into the top colas. Most scrogers lolli once at week 1 and again at week 3.


Week 1 and 3 of Flowering Correct?


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## Someguy15 (Dec 14, 2011)

Ge7Som3 said:


> Week 1 and 3 of Flowering Correct?


Yes. I do a bit of lolli at the end of veg too right before they go in. You get a feel for what's not going to make it to the top of the canopy.


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 14, 2011)

Someguy15 said:


> Yes. I do a bit of lolli at the end of veg too right before they go in. You get a feel for what's not going to make it to the top of the canopy.


Thanks.!!.


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 14, 2011)

How badly does it stress the plants?


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## mugan (Dec 15, 2011)

i think monster cropping is better than topping your plant. and less stress


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 15, 2011)

upthearsenal said:


> Awesome man. That last shot looks great.
> 
> As far as the height of the screen... I liked it about a foot above the soil, so I could water/feed with my jugs, and work well underneath. That was with a wire screen and wooden frame so there was no flexibility, I also had around 10 plants... As long as you can water and work with the plants it's totally up to you, especially since the squares are pretty big and the rope is flexible watering should be easier.
> 
> What nutrients are you using btw?



I'm using the full fox farms soil line... grow bloom, and tiger bloom...

additionally I have cal/mag by botanicare... bio-weed (kelp) by general organics.... and some thrive alive from technaflora...

So far it's working out nice.... But i'm dealing with a bunch of shit  literally..


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 18, 2011)

Day 38 veg... 
Going to flower soon. Should I start reducing the light cycle by one hour at a time, or just flip it? Do you guys think it's better to just flip from 20/4... to 12/12? I was told an hour a day but I feel like thats pretty long. like from 20/4 to 19/5 to 18/6 etc....

I was considering maybe from day by day go 20/4...18/6.... 14/8.... 12/12 ? Then turn on the HPS for the second or third day of 12/12? I've been hearing it's better to slowly reduce it, to minimize flower stretch... But HOW slowly? What do you guys think, what do you practice? They are at about 4-5 inches and they will be going til 6 inches before 12/12.. I can squeeze out another 3 maybe 4 days with training.. But any longer than that and they will probably be huge in flower. 



photos:

When I opened the tent.. They had a full strength feeding the day before, and it really shows.






Both plants after training






Left side plant (looks more like an indica phenotype)






The right side plant.. looks more hybrid, but is branching like crazy.







*I could really use the subscriber help on this one .* I would like to perfect this flower flip technique 

(grow note: photos from yesterday, day 39 today*)


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## upthearsenal (Dec 18, 2011)

Fuck yeah man, they look so good! I'd just flip, I really don't know about reducing the cycle by one hour... seems tedious. You could add the HPS a few days later, if you want to see the response, personally I've never done that but I know of a few respectful growers that keep the MH for the first week, so in principle it's basically the same idea.


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## wyteberrywidow (Dec 18, 2011)

Those plants are looking goodi woud flower them.. I don't really use no schedule like that I just switch to 12/12.


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## C.Indica (Dec 18, 2011)

I usually veg on either 20/4 or 21/3,
flip it to like18/6 for a few days, andthen either 15/9 or straight 12/12.

They dig the slow flip.

My "hopefully" headbandseeds are really taking off, can't wait until I can start to identify them.



Don't Sativas usually have havybranching traits anyways?


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 18, 2011)

upthearsenal said:


> Fuck yeah man, they look so good! I'd just flip, I really don't know about reducing the cycle by one hour... seems tedious. You could add the HPS a few days later, if you want to see the response, personally I've never done that but I know of a few respectful growers that keep the MH for the first week, so in principle it's basically the same idea.


Thanks dude! Yes I agree it does seem tedious, I've never done it - though I also experience some serious flower stretching so I'm interested somewhat.

The MH for the first week is the same idea with the floro.... Instead of completely changing their light let them get used to the 12/12 on the normal light, then switch the light... HPS makes big stems and big nugs and isn't really* needed in the first week.



wyteberrywidow said:


> Those plants are looking goodi woud flower them.. I don't really use no schedule like that I just switch to 12/12.


For sure man. I usually do the 12/12 flip normally too. Thanks.



C.Indica said:


> I usually veg on either 20/4 or 21/3,
> flip it to like18/6 for a few days, andthen either 15/9 or straight 12/12.
> 
> They dig the slow flip.
> ...


Very cool man. Sounds good .

**edited out**


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## C.Indica (Dec 18, 2011)

Aren'tthese T5's kickass?
I get themso close to my seedlings, although I've noticed faster growth with the light raised at least a couple inches.


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 18, 2011)

What are you tieing them down with? LOOKS GRREAT BTW!


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## scroglodyte (Dec 18, 2011)

* "What level do you guys reccomend I keep the screen?"
8-12 inches. little hands......8", big hands......12". you want to have room to get under your screen for maintenance. it looks like your screen needs a little slack taken out of it, also. your plants will lift your screen, and you won't get an even canopy. happy scrogging. 
*


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 19, 2011)

OK. Sorry to totally change plans on you guys..... But I changed the method in which I was tying my plants down, and got them even lower to the ground. So it wouldn't be smart to veg them this week, I can get them much bigger. Going to keep it 20/4 for another few days until the tops start developing more.


Here are some photos for you folks.

Day 39 veg (end of the day... starting day 40 veg in a few hours)

Opened up the tent, and really inspected the girls






Removed the crappy ties I decided to try to LST with (they were too small for my favorite zip tie method)..
I found some really nasty cuts on my girls, and we cant have that! I taped it up really good with masking tape after this.. Going to replace the tape tomorrow.







I finally employed my favorite method of using zip ties anchored to the pots, and pulling the main stem down to the soil level.










Marked the side of the tent at 7 inches from soil level... Once we are at 7 inches we will flip to 12/12.  ... Now do you guys see why I'm going to hold off on flowering? We can grow some trees!






Top down, light raised.






#1






#2






Tent in grow mode.. (vs. maintenance mode :lol).. cfl turned off for photo









So yeah. I want to push this, that 250w is pretty bright. The screen still has a lot to fill. The plants are happy, and seem to be even more hungry for food. I'm going to feed them again, see how they like it.. and let the new branches get thick.

Stay tuned, this should be fun. Probably some huge colas.. I've never seen this strain grow personally but it seems like a good candidate for some large and strong plants so far.


Oh also, both girls are sexually mature (alternating nodes)... So... nice...


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## mugan (Dec 19, 2011)

they are growing wild there .. very nice . extreme green  u still feeding for vegging?


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## iamaaror (Dec 19, 2011)

Growing real nice now, can't wait to see the end result!


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 19, 2011)

mugan said:


> they are growing wild there .. very nice . extreme green  u still feeding for vegging?


Yeah I am. Im waiting til the soil dries and i will feed them again. I jus did a full feeding last watering but i think i am just going to feed back to back because they are still looking lime green at the tops. Today I'm about to go foliar feed with thrive alive and kelp.. Should be like liquid plant health lol. I feel bad about the cuts on the meristem so I'll definitely be taking care of that before 12/12 also.


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## upthearsenal (Dec 19, 2011)

Gotta love when they're sexually mature 

:inserts humpy emoticon:


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 19, 2011)

How are you tiring them down sir Verde


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 19, 2011)

upthearsenal said:


> Gotta love when they're sexually mature
> 
> :inserts humpy emoticon:


Definitely!  

Not to mention plants flowered when mature yield better and grow better  vs. those flowered immature.  



Ge7Som3 said:


> How are you tiring them down sir Verde



Hey bro! Sorry if I've been missing questions I'm not avoiding them, I just forget to answer.


I DID have these green ties similar to those you get in the produce section at the grocery store... I picked up 200ft for like $3... Well now I realize those ties are shitty, they will cut and chafe into your plants.

NOW I'm using Zip Ties... my _favorite_ method for plants.... Seriously there are 30 things to use zip ties on in a garden.. I use like $10-$15 worth of zip ties in a grow. I put some photos up above..




My method is this:
I will get four 11 inch long zip ties... and hook all 4 into eachother... Then I put them around my plants and connect them. So now *we* have a zip tie band, tied around the bottom of the pot.... Then I take another zip tie, and hook/connect it to that band (so a ring, connected to that band), on the side I am going to train on... THEN I use two zip ties, hook them together, wrap it around the plant, and CONNECT them to the HOOK tied to the BAND around the pots....... If that doesn't make sense I'll take some specific photos for you.

It works out really well. A zip tie will never loosen itself, and if you need a plant just a LITTLE bit more tied down then you just pull the zip ties a few extra clicks. The only problem is you can't undo clicks, so you will be straight up cutting down the zip ties you mess up... It's an art  that requires you to go through a lot of zip ties before you perfect it 


I recommend buying an assorted tube at home depot for like $11.. You get like 500 zip ties of different sizes which is very handy. Also I'd pick up a wire cutter if you don't have one, to cut the zip ties... They are quite thick.


I have found zip ties are not sharp enough to cut into your plants when training. They are really gentle.


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## Bud Farmer (Dec 19, 2011)

Those babies are really taking off now! I just read through your whole journal and it's been a good read. Can't wasit to see the Headband filled out. Subbed.


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 19, 2011)

That's very helpful thank you!


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## thegersman (Dec 19, 2011)

Nice Sr !!!!!!!!!!!!
I agree with you on maturing girls.

I am giving massive flowering nutes at this time, and most of the girls are wanting more more more.

Later Bro !


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## Ge7Som3 (Dec 19, 2011)

Sr. Verde said:


> Definitely!
> 
> Not to mention plants flowered when mature yield better and grow better  vs. those flowered immature.
> 
> ...


Yes I am pretty familiar with zip ties, as I do many Car Audio Installs, this sounds like a great method and its so simple. I think I get what your saying but pics would be nice as I am pretty medicated and might have a completely different picture in my head.


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## mrmaddu (Dec 20, 2011)

Man i feel like i am late for the movie this sucks but nice to see ya going again sr. i have a project going myself right now also and i pick up these beans with my last order as well looking forward to seeing your grow as well as mine in the coming months i plan on germing those.......right now i have barneys farm blue cheese and g13 sour kandy flowering. 

keep em green


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## tightpockt (Dec 20, 2011)

I think if you vegged with that 250 your plants would grow a lot faster. If you can keep your temps under control I'd chose a 250w hps 2700k over cfl's every day of the week. They don't really stretch if you keep the light close.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 21, 2011)

tightpockt said:


> I think if you vegged with that 250 your plants would grow a lot faster. If you can keep your temps under control I'd chose a 250w hps 2700k over cfl's every day of the week. They don't really stretch if you keep the light close.



Thanks for the tip . I'm trying something new with the floros.... I have a 250w MH bulb, but my hood sucks - it isn't air tight. So in order to install the MH, I have to remove all the tape I put on the hood, and replace it.... then do it over again when switching to HPS...... Seems like a lot of work to me so I picked up that t5, to see how well it would do.

I'm finding the t5 is producing tighter nodes, and over all a better structure... But you are right the HID does grow them faster... But I feel like the plants aren't 100% what they could be in the end, as far as node spacing and branching...... Like for as big as these plants are, they are impressively low to the soil....

All in all, your right - this is taking longer than it could..... but at the same time it's a fun experiment ... I want to veg out some little monsters, then just throw that 250w HPS on them and let the puppies do work.

The plants wont suffer in the end, with mh vs. floro..... It will just take longer.

Next veg I do plan on figuring out how to get some more lumens in there to stimulate growth... I'm looking into some LEDs....... only for veg though, I think I love HPS too much for flower to change it. 



mrmaddu said:


> Man i feel like i am late for the movie this sucks but nice to see ya going again sr. i have a project going myself right now also and i pick up these beans with my last order as well looking forward to seeing your grow as well as mine in the coming months i plan on germing those.......right now i have barneys farm blue cheese and g13 sour kandy flowering.
> 
> keep em green


Not too late at all! It's been far too slow up to this point. Pull up a chair, we are still vegging and training. I'm going to work these sour kush females..... Fill this screen out, and let the branching branch ... 

I'm finding the Sour Kush by RP to be really vigourous in growth, very strong, THICK meristem (and branches it seems now).... the smell is very diesel.... with this slightly sweet stinky skunky overtone... It smells like jungle ganja or something. It seems like it will be some POWERFUL, full bodied medicine for SURE tough! I can't wait to smell a bag of 4 week cured RP headband! Something to be excited for.



Ge7Som3 said:


> Yes I am pretty familiar with zip ties, as I do many Car Audio Installs, this sounds like a great method and its so simple. I think I get what your saying but pics would be nice as I am pretty medicated and might have a completely different picture in my head.


There ya go  You know how the zip tie thing goes... Once you make the connection between horticulture and zip ties you like, "damn why haven't I been doing this from the start??"..... I used to use string. That sucked - it stretched, came untied, or just deteriorated with all the sun and moisture.


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## C.Indica (Dec 21, 2011)

Don't mess w/ith leds..

Right now your T5 system consists entirely of either 5400k or 6500k bulbs.

Lot'sof blue light, cool.

Look up UVB.
And the "LED without LEDS" thread.

~$20 abulb,but so worth it.


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## supchaka (Dec 21, 2011)

I'm sure it's already been mentioned but I'd get a screen with tighter spacing. Good luck on the grow!


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 21, 2011)

C.Indica said:


> Don't mess w/ith leds..
> 
> Right now your T5 system consists entirely of either 5400k or 6500k bulbs.
> 
> ...


I know a guy who is doing a start up LED company.. With some new LED tech.... I'd be getting a prototype from him, rather than going to a store... IF I did pick up an LED 

These LEDs are supposed to be like 4-5w each... most on the market today are 3-4w.

If only I could stuff in more floros! 



supchaka said:


> I'm sure it's already been mentioned but I'd get a screen with tighter spacing. Good luck on the grow!


Yessir it has... I picked this screen up at the hydro store.. It works better than no screen, but a home made screen with like PVC and fishing line would be best I think... My screen is decent enough I think! It will keep the tops from falling into eachother..

But yes we will upgrade that eventually.


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## Joos Springsteen (Dec 21, 2011)

Lookin' nice! We've got similar dimensions and I'm rocking a 250 hps as well. 

I wonder if your 250 watt HPS wouldn't do better for veg than a 100 watt T5. With my 250, I couldn't have had tighter nodes throughout the veg of my current grow. It would really surprise me to see 100 watts of fluorescent bulbs out perform a 250 watt HPS, even in veg. I could be wrong, but I'd be surprised.

I dig that you're trying it out, but it seems to me that we don't need to reinvent the car every time we build one.

Check out the 250 watt club and help guide, lots of stuff going on over there!

Pics of the node spacing:


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 21, 2011)

It seems in that photo the foliage is lacking.... and foliage is usually grown really well under the blue spectrum... is that why the tops have the most green of the whole plant?


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## Joos Springsteen (Dec 21, 2011)

Dig my 250 grow journal when you get a chance. You'll see that the foliage is not lacking on account of my choice of light.


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## upthearsenal (Dec 21, 2011)

I've gone from 250w hps for veg to t5s for many reasons. Heat, distance I can keep the lamp over the canopy, spectrum, and plus, why do I want to use my hps bulb that I'm going to flower with, I'd be using it for like four months straight, with only half that for bud production. I can get t5 bulbs for $11 each, and the hps bulb, well that about $100 and replaced every six months...


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## supchaka (Dec 21, 2011)

Joos Springsteen said:


> Lookin' nice! We've got similar dimensions and I'm rocking a 250 hps as well.
> 
> I wonder if your 250 watt HPS wouldn't do better for veg than a 100 watt T5. With my 250, I couldn't have had tighter nodes throughout the veg of my current grow. It would really surprise me to see 100 watts of fluorescent bulbs out perform a 250 watt HPS, even in veg. I could be wrong, but I'd be surprised.
> 
> ...


Those are some mutant plants lol


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 23, 2011)

Today is the first day of 18/6..lights shut off early tonight to start 18/6. coming from 20/4.... They are at about 5 inches (after training) now... once they reach like 6.5inches trained. I will drop the daylight hours to 15/9 for a day then start 12/12..... I will probably do 3-4 days with the floros and drop the HPS in for the rest of the grow 


Hopefully I can fit that 100W t5 on the side, and give some side lighting - but we will see.




grow note: tops are doing great, have multiple nodes - very healthy branching.. Were going to have quite a few colas.


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## kmksrh21 (Dec 23, 2011)

Sweet! Sounds like it's comin' along beautifully!


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 23, 2011)

They are... These plants are sending me for a loop though... I fed with fox farms grow big.. the full strength 20mL/gal mixture... twice in a row (no plain water between) and the new tops are still lime green...  no burn or anything...

Guess I will start pumping the nutes up a bit, these plants seem to handle it.

Thanks


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## kmksrh21 (Dec 23, 2011)

Sr. Verde said:


> They are... These plants are sending me for a loop though... I fed with fox farms grow big.. the full strength 20mL/gal mixture... twice in a row (no plain water between) and the new tops are still lime green...  no burn or anything...
> 
> Guess I will start pumping the nutes up a bit, these plants seem to handle it.
> 
> Thanks



Nice dude! That's exactly how my bubba kush is.

I feed it full strength through out it's whole life (grow big, big bloom, tiger bloom) and it stays green til harvest.

It's a super hardy strain (at least the pheno I have is...)

That's awesome thought definately a good sign you got something worth while...


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 26, 2011)

Finishing up Day 47 veg.. It's been a long veg, more lumens next time for sure. 


Anyway.... doing one more day of 18/6 later on today (monday).... then 15/9 on Tuesday, 12/12 on Wednesday.... HPS dropping in Friday/saturday.. I've been running 18/6 for 2-3 days. Plants haven't stretched much, tops still around 6 inches, which is nice I guess.

Just want these girls a litttttle bigger. I think they can do it.


























This is the longest by far I've vegged.. But it's been fun... I can't complain - the plants are really healthy and have a nice structure.. The soil is still healthy, and they have a great root system.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 26, 2011)

More from day 47 after some training...

Notice the label to the right indicating the 7inch mark






Screen view











#1






#2






Put in 2 42w 2700k CFLs in there... Now that's 84w 2700k + 100w 6500k... bringing the total to 184w for the last 3 days of veg.. decent..


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## Gastanker (Dec 26, 2011)

Damn, a bit late jumping into this journal. Great looking plants! Love headband and love DNA/RP so this has got to be great. Subbed for sure.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 26, 2011)

Gastanker said:


> Damn, a bit late jumping into this journal. Great looking plants! Love headband and love DNA/RP so this has got to be great. Subbed for sure.



Not late at all... Just in time for flower, and the HID being dropped in ...


I'm so tired of the floro now! I know those girls are craving the canopy-penetrating power of the HPS.

Least I could add about 40w with the hanging CFLs.. I'm hoping that gives them some extra energy and keeps them perky.


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## jdro (Dec 26, 2011)

Pulling up a chair


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## thegersman (Dec 27, 2011)

keepin' updated


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 28, 2011)

first day of 12/12 starting today ( december 28 )


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## C.Indica (Dec 28, 2011)

HID is up?


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## Joos Springsteen (Dec 28, 2011)

Finally pulled out the real light! Nice!


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 28, 2011)

Probably going to drop in the HID on friday.. give it 2 days of 12/12 with the 100w 6500k floro and the 84w 2700k

Then watch it go boom


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 28, 2011)

Flower day 1...

Changed my mind - going to drop in the HPS first.


Early morning photos...


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 30, 2011)

Hey all...

Technically the 30th right now... so the girls will start day 3 shortly...

Here are some photos *from day 1 flower, after I dropped the HPS in* at night.. I haven't gotten a chance to post these until now... 

photos were taken after a good watering and a nice training session 







down... girls .. (i hope they will grow out enough in flower.. i'm kind of sure they will though  )






plant view












#1 - if you didn't notice, I turned it around, so both plants are growing meristems in different directions, hoping to utilize space and colas towards the end)






#2 - this is a noticeable larger plant.. I wonder how the quality of medication will differ plant to plant... considering the size difference... I wouldn't be surprised if the small one was the strongest though.. 







They are realllllly enjoying the extra lumens!! moving from something like 10,000 lumens - to 32,000... they are noticeably perky.... I think I will pick up an additional t5 and squeeze 8 bulbs in there to make for a faster veg next time .


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## C.Indica (Dec 30, 2011)

I've noticed that when the T5's are superclose, you getSlow, Dense,Deformed growth, sort of like ytour curly LST pictures.
And when it's further away, you get more symmetrical, evenly spaced, beautiful (near perfect) growth, as well as faster.

Still workingon specifics.. IT's different for every situation andevery strain.

My seedlings remind me of your two phenos already, I hope I have headband.
If not, then they're trainwreck.
But theyliterally remind me of your twoplants. it'spretty funny.


Mine had the same curly stress issue atday 18/19 ish.
I thinkit was too close to the lights.

Also check this out;
Soil seedling is faster, moredeficient
Peat/Cocoseedling is slower, prettier.
I blamethe air in soil.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 30, 2011)

C.Indica said:


> I've noticed that when the T5's are superclose, you getSlow, Dense,Deformed growth, sort of like ytour curly LST pictures.
> And when it's further away, you get more symmetrical, evenly spaced, beautiful (near perfect) growth, as well as faster.
> 
> Still workingon specifics.. IT's different for every situation andevery strain.
> ...



They are pretty close in hybrid ratios i think.. so it would make sense that the structure and leaves would be the same


mine smell more like disel than any kush..... the smaller, more compact plant (#1) smells like diesel with sweet, somewhat sugary overtones..

They just smell like jungle weed pretty much 



and the floro is doing great with the growth... it's just slow because i don't think I have enough lumens for as big as I was taking those plants.. and I was too lazy to go out and get more lights rather than wait an extra few weeks.. next time I will have more light in there for veg, last time I used a 250w MH this is the least amount of light I've vegged with so far. Even with my first CFL grow I vegged with 150-200w. I thought I could get away with it but I couldn't ..


any tears you see in the plants are from me accidentally ripping the leaves.. any bends are from my fingers . these are flawless plants... really great genetics so far.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 30, 2011)

I have to PUMP up the nutes! Thoughts? These things are still lime green at the tops.. Not dark green at all..





(photo from day 1)
I feel like the leaves could be far darker, I could feed them a lot more... but how much? First time using (mostly) organic nutrients..

Anyone have experience with FOX FARMS nutrients? I have Grow Big, Tiger Bloom, and Big Bloom.

I was using like 20mL grow big / gal... that wasn't enough, still not darkening them but they responded great... I'm tempted to go 25mL or 30mL.. I'm going to start out with both the Big Bloom and the Grow Big.... Feeding the Grow Big 30mL while feeding the Big Bloom in regular, full strength... Then I will most likely begin to wean off the Grow Big and replace it with Tiger Bloom as the stretch slows down and as bloom sets in... Until then though I really think they need N.


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## C.Indica (Dec 30, 2011)

Bro chill out and look at abush.
New growth is lime, oldgrowth is dark green.
It's not like thgwe lime leaves are developing into lime large leaves.
They fill in yes?

If you're really worried, look up micronute deficiencies and check.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 30, 2011)

They fill in greener when I feed  otherwise no the leaves stay yellowish

But never totally turn dark green... I'm wondering how high I can run these FF nutes without burning... it seems like 25mL/gal adds a light green but it seems like these girls need more.

only the very lowest leaves are dark green


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## upthearsenal (Dec 30, 2011)

N def starts from the bottom/with the older leafs first.

Your plants look great bro, no need to feed heavy again, you'd be on your way to a toxicity.

Although, I would hit them with some N during/after the stretch....

And yeah, I have experience with FF nutes, I started with them way back when. I'd replace that Tiger Bloom for something organic (that is if you want to be straight organic).

Either way, they look really nice man!


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## C.Indica (Dec 30, 2011)

What would be a good Biology-Friendly Veg fert to usewith FFBBloom?


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## upthearsenal (Dec 30, 2011)

A biofriendly veg fert? There's quite a few, you could go with straight fish emulsion, or go with something more brand name like Earthjuice, Biocanna (what I use), General Organics, etc...


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## C.Indica (Dec 30, 2011)

I think I'm gonna roll with GH's "BioThrive Grow" for veg.

I have Subcuture-M to get the dirt life started,
but should I get that Kangaroots Drench crap to feed it more? or just let it roll with the FFBBloom ? 

Also Im thinking \about a Biologyfriendly Cal/Mg just to besafe.
Is the General Organics CaMg+ suitible for beneficials and mycos?


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 30, 2011)

upthearsenal said:


> N def starts from the bottom/with the older leafs first.
> 
> Your plants look great bro, no need to feed heavy again, you'd be on your way to a toxicity.
> 
> ...


Thanks for bringing me back 

Your right a serious N deficiency does start with the lower older leaves yellowing first. *So I don't think it's a deficiency, but more of a, 'could-use-more' situation...
*
Though these plants haven't ever shown any signs of nute burn, even at the tips... and even with back to back feedings.... Which just makes me think I'm in the safe zone, but I could pump it up a little more. I don't intend to burn, I just intend to find out what these plants can take... Without seriously over feeding of course.

*I'm now wondering if the yellowed tops are from the cold/warm change... it can get nippy at night... In the 60's.. and it can get up to 80F during the day (but that's it).*

Either way, the foliage color could still be a little darker in my books... I know what sickly green plants that got too much N look like, and I'm not going for that... just DARK green instead of LIGHT green.

Guess I'm going for 30mL / Gal Grow Big next feed and we will see how that works. I just watered plain water + Cal Mag 3 days ago so the soil will be dry in a day or two.




& I was under the impression that FF was somewhat organic? is Tiger bloom a main offender? ..... learning branding and ingredients is a process in itself 


I'd like to migrate to fully organic eventually, but I'm taking it one step at a time. I already paid for the FF line so Ill just keep running that for now I think  Start using tiger bloom when needed and all that.. Thanks for the advice and the tips man I appreciate it! 


[youtube]WoAXW30mMAg[/youtube]


----------



## Ge7Som3 (Dec 30, 2011)

Looks great!!


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## C.Indica (Dec 30, 2011)

Hey sorry about derailing this thread,
whichbegs thequestion;

How are your plants shapedup for 2012!?

Let's get some phenotype profiles eh?


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 30, 2011)

C.Indica said:


> Hey sorry about derailing this thread,
> whichbegs thequestion;
> 
> How are your plants shapedup for 2012!?
> ...


No your fine. You asked the question I was going to ask   .

My plants? You mean the Headband in this thread or plants in general?


I'm looking into dropping 2000w in a mmj grow. I have the means, and the general knowledge to start and not totally fuck it up. So it's all on other people and seeing if they can come through so I can come through .

Why buy gold when you can buy some 1000w hortiluxes and 8 inch air cooled hoods?


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## C.Indica (Dec 30, 2011)

Why? I thought you were a personal co nsumption guy?


So I've been looking into thisliving soil setup..

-Roots Organic (soil)
(Subculture M, or Subculture B,or both)
General Hydroponics (Organics) BioThrive Grow,

OR I've been thinking about their Bio-Marine.
Idon't know if it will substitute for Fish Emulsion though..

And then I'm using FoxFarm Big Bloom for flower, since it has bveneficials in (or so they say)


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## Highlanders cave (Dec 30, 2011)

Hey there C. Indica what's going on bro!

Stumbled upon your post here and thought I would through out my 2 cents on your thoughts to using Big Bloom as a flowering enhancer. If I remember correctly with FFs stuff... Big Bloom is mainly a soil additive with little or no flowering nutes in it so I don't think that I would rely on that alone. GL


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## C.Indica (Dec 30, 2011)

I was mostly stoked that it's a package of beneficials.
Good stuff on the advice though!
I don't want to, but I might haveto break down and get theBio-Bud to makeup for this.
But we'll play it out yk'know.


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## upthearsenal (Dec 30, 2011)

Yeah Verde, the Tiger Bloom isn't organic. I can't remember about the others, but in the ingredients if it has anything like urea, ammonium nitrate/phosphate, and/or anything EDTA (which is a synthetic chelating agent) will harm the bennies in the soil.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 31, 2011)

Day 3 flower update

Beginning day 4 today in a few hours

grow mode






canopy






#1






#2






grow note: keeping the humidity at 40% for the first week or so.. then 35% for a bit then dropping to 20%-25% by the time pistils start coming in well.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 31, 2011)

upthearsenal said:


> Yeah Verde, the Tiger Bloom isn't organic. I can't remember about the others, but in the ingredients if it has anything like urea, ammonium nitrate/phosphate, and/or anything EDTA (which is a synthetic chelating agent) will harm the bennies in the soil.


Hmm that sucks.... It has urea as in urine? from what? :O... seems un necessary... with so many different organic types of sources for N..

and by bennies you mean beneficial micro organisms? I used TechnaFlora and Advanced Nutrients before but I didn't like them...

@ upthearesenal: So far I dig the Grow Big but do you think the Tiger Bloom and Big Bloom is good for flower nutes? Or is it worth it to just use on my chili peppers in the summer and go buy something different?


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 31, 2011)

I just found this photo from my last grow.... I didn't even use a screen for that one. The genetics sucked too (foxtails/massive stretch).. I'm expecting tight nuggets for this RP headband now


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## upthearsenal (Dec 31, 2011)

Yup, urea as in urine. And yes bennies are beneficial microbes. It's up to you to use the tiger bloom and such, I'm sure they would be good, as in they would work. But if you want to grow some dank organic buds, I'd say get something else. I'm super poor so I hate to buy things to replace something I just purchased, but if you can exchange them or something then go for it. I use biocanna which is certified organic, and I also use Humboldt's Natual Bloom as an additional P source. 

But I don't want to be totally biased, if you use the mineral based Tiger Bloom, you could end up with bigger bugs. Chem ferts are designed to give everything to the plant quickly, if you go organic there's a bit more effort that has to be put into really achieving higher yields (teas, improving/increasing the bioactivity in the rhizosphere so that there is better nutrient uptake).


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 31, 2011)

Gotta love them organics 


This would be so much easier if it were taught first hand ! 


I guess I will try the Tiger Bloom... It can't be the WORST thing right?  as long as it doesn't smell like piss.


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## Gastanker (Dec 31, 2011)

Gotta jump in real fast. Urea is all natural and there is nothing wrong with it - it's a great organic source of nitrogen and although there is urea in your urine this does not mean your bottle has any pee in it (although there could be... mwah haha! - gotta love organics). Chelation agents will not harm your benefitials - chelated chemical nutes are much better for your benefitials than non chelated chemical nutes. Chelation is simply the process of adding an additional bond between the salt (nutrient) and a variety of organic compounds - this extra bond helps negates the hydrogen bonding when the nutrient comes in contact with the soil solution which helps maintain a more steady soil pH. 

And don't be afraid of scarey chemical names like ammonium nitrate. Aside from anhydrous ammonia and pure ammonium, ammonium nitrate is one of the easiest and cleanest forms of nitrogen a plant can uptake. Personally I say go organic all the way but some tiger bloom definitely shouldn't negate the good the organic amendments are doing. 

Eh, look at guano (one of my personal favorites) - Ammonium oxelate and urea. Ammonium oxelate is C[SUB]2[/SUB]H[SUB]8[/SUB]N[SUB]2[/SUB]O[SUB]4[/SUB] , technically a much dirtier form of nitrogen; it's ammonium (nute) + an oxelate salt that it pretty useless.

Plants are looking amazing by the way. Congrats on thinking about stepping up the wattage.


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 31, 2011)

Thanks for the info gastanker +rep! 

Yes I'm not crazy against urea just that it is what makes urine smell, no? Either way I took a look at the ingredients and didn't see it listed as a main ingredient so even if it is in the nutes it's probably so trace you couldn't smell it over the other stuff.

I'm not against the chemicals - I was just shooting for as much organic for piece of mind... I'm finding it's also very beneficial to my knowledge of plants and nutrients by deciding to work the organic route.... By looking at so many products and ingredients and compounds I'm really learning a lot about whats going on under the soil and that's very interesting to me .

That being said it's good to have what you said in mind.. It puts me at ease understanding what chelation is/does... As well as everything else 




SO many different routes to get the *best* buds... It's intriguing


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 31, 2011)

Day 4.. 

HPS 8 inches from canopy






overhead..looks like its spreading out well





Look how #1 took over #2... Interesting...!



calyxes






Showing multiple pistils all over 

That was fast.

Still waiting for a serious stretch.. hasn't happened yet ... looking good though so far... Think ill feed tomorrow


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## Sr. Verde (Dec 31, 2011)

So this is going to finish mid march... Cured mid april.... Ready to go by 4/20/12 in the best outcome ... I hear 78 days to finish! Should be plenty of time 


I'm excited for 4/20 this year!


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## kmksrh21 (Dec 31, 2011)

Lookin' superb Sr...


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 1, 2012)

off to feed the girls... I know these numbers are high but I want to see what happens. It's marginally higher than what I've been feeding them with.


25mL Grow Big
15mL Tiger Bloom
20mL Big Bloom
10mL Botanicare Cal/Mag
6mL General Organics - BioWeed (cold-processed kelp)


We will see if we get any _slight_ burning... I need to know what these girls can take.. Though I doubt it will be too much for them, they are seriously hungry plants.


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## upthearsenal (Jan 1, 2012)

Not trying to jack the Senior's thread but Gastanker is right about the additional bond chelates create, but because of that bond you don't need microbes to get food to the plant. There are many different chelating agents and they are not all created equal. Some are fucking great for microbes, others aren't so much. While you can use EDTA, Iron EDTA for example, and it won't necessarily decimate your microbes, the plant will only take up the Iron, but leave the EDTA behind... EDTA is considered a pollutant for that very reason, so while this may not pretain specifically to a potting mix that will get used for a very short amount of time, saying "chelates are good for microbes" is an oversimplification.

Let's say you add a carbon source to your soil, molasses in this case(which is also considered a chelating agent), microbes will take up the carbon (while releasing O) but need a source of N, this can be considered a carbon-nitrogen fixation. If there is no N for the microbes, then they will take it from your plant. Thus, after using molasses, you can actually use a mineral based fertilizer containing N to feed the microbes. I'd say using chelates with bio-active soil is totally possible (even using microbes in straight hydro can be possible), but it's very tricky business and for you to REALLY know what's going on in there you'd need a nice microscope, that's one reason I say just keep it simple, and just build a rhizosphere you know (w/o the need for the microscope) is going to be a great place for your beneficials.


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## upthearsenal (Jan 1, 2012)

Quick note: I decide to google EDTA really quick, and found that "it degrades to ethylenediaminetriacetic acid, which then cyclizes to the diketopiperizide, a cumulative, persistent, organic environmental pollutant." And diketopiperizides "have a wide variety of biological activities including antitumor,[SUP][3][/SUP] antiviral,[SUP][4][/SUP] *antifungal*[SUP][5][/SUP] and *antibacterial*[SUP][6][/SUP] activities."

...more food for thought I suppose, I'm done now, sorry for the tangent SV!


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 1, 2012)

I enjoy the discussion! I can only post so many pictures . 

That quick google on EDTAs sounds good to me..However I have a few questions........

Even if the biological activities include antifungal and antibacterial... wouldn't this be good to keep the soil healthy & pest/virus/fungus free? I know SOME bacteria is good, but on the upside would we be worried less about the nasty funguses, mildews or rots that can harm a crop?

I'm not well educated in this area of the soil, as a *disclaimer to anyone reading*... I'm just hypothesizing about the potential upsides of those properties?



What does the definition of, "*organic environmental pollutant." *mean anyway? What environment? Can't term pollutant could be misconstrued depending on the environment the 'pollutant' is applied to?


You could take a bunch of good, beneficial plant nutrients, and dump them over a coral reef... and the good nutrients would be considered a pollutant as it introduces algae into the water that starves the coral for o2 and sunlight.



I will have to read more after dinner... Just took a few oil dabs, so excuse me if I'm talking non-sense  .


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## upthearsenal (Jan 1, 2012)

You don't really want a sterile evrinment in soil, if that's what you want then a sterile hydro res is best for you. There a symbiotic relationship between fungus and plant roots, it's really quite crazy.... You could look up mycorrhizal fungi to read more..........

The environment that it would be polluting is the soil. It converts into somethng that has anti-fungal, and antibacterial properties, which will destroy soil. Sorry if I worded that previous post poorly, I thought it made sense.

In fact, in my system I brew teas for my organics with specific endo-fungal strains, anything with antifungal properties would defeat the purpose.

Lol I don't know how anything EDTA would sound good....


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## bleedintears (Jan 1, 2012)

Looking forward to seeing this one finish up.


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## CannabisChef (Jan 1, 2012)

Just smoked some Headband and searched the site for it and found this grow. Awesome strain.
I'm gonna watch this one. Good luck sir.


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## Gastanker (Jan 1, 2012)

Environmental pollutant is anything not normally found in nature (generally ground water) in large amounts that can be monitored - nitrogen is an environmental pollutant. Doesn't necessary mean it has a negative effect, just that it wasn't there prior or in nearly as large amounts. 

upthearsenal provided some great info. My claim of chelated nutes being easier on bennies was more correlated to reactivity and pH fluctuation. Chemical salt based nutes have a fairly strong charge which can drastically influence pH which can kill benefitials but also the salts can directly harm benefitials as well. These same salts once chelated are much less reactive and thus direct contact to beneficials is less detrimental and the chances of quick changes in soil solution pH are drastically minimized.


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 1, 2012)

Here's day 5..

Actually fed with

*25mL Grow Big
15mL Tiger Bloom
20mL Big Bloom
10mL Botanicare Cal/Mag
6mL General Organics - BioWeed (cold-processed kelp)*


The previous watering was just h20 and calmag..

I will feed with water and CalMag again in another 5 days... I bet they will love this feeding though.. You guys can see a little discoloration going on.. I'm hoping the extra food serves them well.. Makes them blow up 







[lights off] Pushed the tops down a bit to even things out and expose new growth.. will be interesting to see how the colas form


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 2, 2012)

upthearsenal said:


> You don't really want a sterile evrinment in soil, if that's what you want then a sterile hydro res is best for you. There a symbiotic relationship between fungus and plant roots, it's really quite crazy.... You could look up mycorrhizal fungi to read more..........
> The environment that it would be polluting is the soil. It converts into somethng that has anti-fungal, and antibacterial properties, which will destroy soil. Sorry if I worded that previous post poorly, I thought it made sense.
> In fact, in my system I brew teas for my organics with specific endo-fungal strains, anything with antifungal properties would defeat the purpose.
> Lol I don't know how anything EDTA would sound good....


I understand what your saying, but I don't aim for a totally sterile soil... If we were to say 'sterile' that would mean that the EDTAs kill *ALL* the bacterial/fungal organisms in the soil.. I don't think that would happen though.. 


bleedintears said:


> Looking forward to seeing this one finish up.


Thanks! Me too 



CannabisChef said:


> Just smoked some Headband and searched the site for it and found this grow. Awesome strain.
> I'm gonna watch this one. Good luck sir.


Thanks !  I appreciate it.

Was it the 707 headband (clone only), or was it the Reserva Privada version?



Gastanker said:


> Environmental pollutant is anything not normally found in nature (generally ground water) in large amounts that can be monitored - nitrogen is an environmental pollutant. Doesn't necessary mean it has a negative effect, just that it wasn't there prior or in nearly as large amounts.
> 
> upthearsenal provided some great info. My claim of chelated nutes being easier on bennies was more correlated to reactivity and pH fluctuation. Chemical salt based nutes have a fairly strong charge which can drastically influence pH which can kill benefitials but also the salts can directly harm benefitials as well. These same salts once chelated are much less reactive and thus direct contact to beneficials is less detrimental and the chances of quick changes in soil solution pH are drastically minimized.


Good to know!


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 2, 2012)

Day 6

 worked on evening out the canopy today... tying some branches up that finally got long enough... also have been trimming underneath the canopy, getting all the little branches that aren't going anywhere.. should be somewhat easy from here on out..

I'm curious to see how much bigger they will get. They seem to have really taken off in the last 3 days.

























Hood @ 8.5inches from canopy.. Canopy: 78.1F 36% humidity 












Zip tie training .. I have no idea how I originally came up with this.. Being medicated in the garden produces some good ideas I guess.










When I'm standing above the plants, and pushing the canopy aside to see down through into the main stem.. I find it difficult if not impossible! I could do it last week, but not today . It's really dense, as you can see by the length of some of the branches.. Excited to see it stretch out more and have the flowers fill the branches in. 



Who's ready for these things to chunk out? I'm ready. .


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## C.Indica (Jan 2, 2012)

Loving the documentation.
I'm using this to guage my seedlings,
although Istill don't know if they're trainwreck or headband.

I noticed at athebeginning of the 4th week, your plants started pushing out "adult" leaves., I cant wait for these.


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 2, 2012)

Adult leaves? By what do you mean? BTW...As long as you feed, your plants should veg 2x as fast. I fucked up and was lazy!

Lets see some photos of your plants! And a link? 

[youtube]YUCNsZXCd58[/youtube]


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## C.Indica (Jan 2, 2012)

Take a look for yourself.
Look at your seedlings between days 25-35.

That's what I mean.
If you still don't see it, take a look at young philodendrons.


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## Gastanker (Jan 2, 2012)

Looking great verde. They are really loving the light.


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 3, 2012)

C.Indica said:


> Take a look for yourself.
> Look at your seedlings between days 25-35.
> 
> That's what I mean.
> If you still don't see it, take a look at young philodendrons.


There are many things on my plants between those days!

I'm just curious if you mean branching from nodes, or fan leaves or what?

I call my plants "adult" which is technically the term I believe when they show pre-flowers and alternating node growth. That is sexual maturity.. which happened after day 35 I'm pretty sure..


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 3, 2012)

Gastanker said:


> Looking great verde. They are really loving the light.



Thank you! I think your right! They love stretching up and being happy in that Super HPS . Far more than the 100w t5


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## 400aZip (Jan 3, 2012)

hey man , love to setup. Im scrogging some headband under 250w as well. 3 weeks into flowering. looking forward to seeing your harvest


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## C.Indica (Jan 3, 2012)

Nah watch thes hape of leaves.
Between days 28-35 your plant pushed it's leafspan from tiny leaves a couple inches wide,

to monsters the size of the plant itseltf


See?


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 3, 2012)

from

day 22 veg






Day 33 veg






The only difference between both that I see is one has branching and one doesn't yet 

The sudden difference is because they were transplanted to larger pots with nutrient rich soil..


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## C.Indica (Jan 3, 2012)

Baby leaves - Adult leaves.
Not the same subject., totally different specie between philodendron and cannabis..
Just anidea though..
Nevermind, I giveup,..All I was trying yto pointout as thelarger leaf switch.


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## Gastanker (Jan 4, 2012)

Only difference is the side branching? Hehe, I agree that they look similar scale wise but the later mass wise is like 20x the prior  That's a big difference in my mind  

My goodness how plants like additional room and nutrient rich soil.


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 4, 2012)

Gastanker said:


> Only difference is the side branching? Hehe, I agree that they look similar scale wise but the later mass wise is like 20x the prior  That's a big difference in my mind
> 
> My goodness how plants like additional room and nutrient rich soil.


Well yeah of course it's going to get larger over the period of 10 days .


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 4, 2012)

Day 8 today.. 70 more to go.

Plants are really filling out that screen.. I have been tightening zip ties as they stretch out to keep an even canopy

Light raised.. To get into the back



















Looking very pretty


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## upthearsenal (Jan 4, 2012)

They look good, did you sort out the little deficiency? Looks like, just kinda hard to tell under the hps.

Man, I need to get some of those rope ratchet things, they seem so versatile.


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## Someguy15 (Jan 4, 2012)

upthearsenal said:


> They look good, did you sort out the little deficiency? Looks like, just kinda hard to tell under the hps.
> 
> Man, I need to get some of those rope ratchet things, they seem so versatile.


yeah they're awesome I have like 8 pairs. Every light for sure. sometimes they are nice for a carbon filter, duct silencer, dry rack hanging ect... and not a single one has ever given out on me. Little pricey but they are quality!


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 5, 2012)

upthearsenal said:


> They look good, did you sort out the little deficiency? Looks like, just kinda hard to tell under the hps.
> 
> Man, I need to get some of those rope ratchet things, they seem so versatile.



Yeah they really liked the last feeding for sure.. They got some slight N claw but no burning... They lost the claw after like 3 days and the lighter top leaves started to green up and now they're looking nice... 

Tomorrow I'm feeding 6.6pH water + cal/mag on (day 10)... 1 gal h2o each we will see how much they drink..

Then later @ day 15.. I will feed again about the same grow big, bloom, tiger bloom as last then slowly back off the N after the flowering stretch...

*Do you remember when did the RP headbands stop stretching ?*


&
As far as the hangars:

I have these pretty much..

http://www.growwurks.com/progrip-light-fixture-hanger-150-lbs-1-pair.aspx

The local store carries them.. Make sure you get those kind not the ball-shaped ones. 

They work awesome for everything I now have 4 pairs.. I hang fans and CFLs and reflectors and florescents with them and adjust really easy.

Like someguy said they are expensive but worth it and are quality.. will last a long time.


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## upthearsenal (Jan 5, 2012)

well, it was always the last one in my flowering room stop stretching. i think I remember around 21 days.. I don't think yours look at sativa as mine, but we'll see. 

I also found of the rope ratchets for $12 on ebay, so I'll probably get a couple at least but yeah they seem great.


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 5, 2012)

Sounds good to me! I want them bigger anyway 

Nice find


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 6, 2012)

Day 10 today






Can't wait for day 25! Going to be some sweet little budsites by then!


#2 is flowering faster than #1.... Which is strange because #1 was smaller, with tighter nodes and slower growth in veg...!

Excellent genetics thus far! I'm can't wait to see how they turn out. By the way - the smell is just fantastic.


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## Gastanker (Jan 6, 2012)

Wow, crazy how little stretch so far. They are looking great man. Bravo.


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## jammin screw (Jan 6, 2012)

senor verde............. muy bueno homie...... nice greenssssss....... .....


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 7, 2012)

Gastanker said:


> Wow, crazy how little stretch so far. They are looking great man. Bravo.


There's actually quite a bit of stretch... though nothing to complain about.. You just can't tell because those girls are growing sideways  Theres like a foot and a half of meristem..

Once it all gets chopped down you'll be able to see it all..


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## upthearsenal (Jan 7, 2012)

The canopy is looking pretty awesome, I want them to stretch up bit more myself, lol... nice colas in the making.

I'm excited to see what the next few weeks bring


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 7, 2012)

Thanks and yeah I'm welcoming stretch at this point! Either way though they should be some pretty plants... It gives me a good idea of what to take it to next time, you know? 

I am sooo ready for some colas I feel like I have been waiting forever already. I just want a little stink factory going on to sit in front of .

Not to mention the oil I'll be making!


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## upthearsenal (Jan 7, 2012)

Shit, the oil will be amazing. It was my favorite from all the ones I've made. It tasted super sour and funky, good stuff.

Are you planning on running this again?


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 7, 2012)

I've got 4 more beans so yeah  I'm pretty impressed with the genetics so far

sour oil is what I'm shooting for 

yessir


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## Boyz N Da Hood (Jan 7, 2012)

Looking good man! Can't wait to see some buds! I'm running their sour d and really liking it so far.


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## 400aZip (Jan 7, 2012)

Oilllll, deliciious. thats a little moster bush you got there! Im sure you already know the smell quite well but 24 days into flower and the headband smell is taking over my room


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 7, 2012)

400aZip said:


> Oilllll, deliciious. thats a little moster bush you got there! Im sure you already know the smell quite well but 24 days into flower and the headband smell is taking over my room



Nice .... Thanks!

I'm excited! Any pics of day 24 blossoms?


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## 400aZip (Jan 7, 2012)

If you dont mind... its a single headband next to a Jekyll Passion which is in between a Yumbolt 47 and the headband. its my first scrog and 250hps grow but headband is one of my favorite strains so I had to give it a go. with the way its going thus far I think I'll grow it a few more times after this round as well. It likes whatever I do to it lol


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 7, 2012)

Oooh those look pretty!

I removed a bit of the lower foliage today going to let them go soon .

Nice healthy plants man..!


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 9, 2012)

Hey subscribers.. I have some questions I wanted to ask... I'm looking for strain suggestions!


A medical grow is going to get up and running sometime soon.. But I can't decide what strain to grow! I need to pick something to order relatively soon. 


I was looking for something with decent yields that doesn't take 70+ days to finish for the first grow.... I need to get some patients medicated asap to cover light/vent costs, so I'm not looking for a lanky sativa that takes a long time to flower.




So far I'm considering:

TGA Subcool: Querkle
Reserva Privada: Headband (so far it's looking like a safe, vigorous strain.. IDK about quality yet, & it does take nearly 80 days to flower though!)
Reserva Privada: Kosher Kush

I'm looking at other TGA strains too... Though I have nearly zero experience with them.

I don't have any locals running any strains to check out. Otherwise I would check them out. So I come to you folks for honest opinions! 

I've been reading a lot about querkle.. it finishes fast looks heady still... but then I read a few bad opinions about the yield and it kind of soured my assurances! I know TGA is a standup guy but would Querkle be the right strain?

I could clone out some moms too...

Thanks  

[mmj compliant]


----------



## C.Indica (Jan 9, 2012)

Afgooey?
I don't know muchaboutfloweringtime, but I'd assume short being Afg/Ind.

One of myfavorite smokes, because ofthe body high/med feeling.


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 9, 2012)

back to the journal real fast

day 13







from the side






look at those tops  lots of potential!






one of the tops






lights off.. more leaves tucked and a few branches tied down a bit.. (as compared to the first pic)






#1 and #2 ..structure (from the left, to right)






meristem... ..


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## C.Indica (Jan 10, 2012)

I'm LOVING those subcanopy leaves!
So FAT!

Honestly my favorite time to look at cannabis is usually in Deep veg.


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 10, 2012)

C.Indica said:


> I'm LOVING those subcanopy leaves!
> So FAT!
> 
> Honestly my favorite time to look at cannabis is usually in Deep veg.



Thanks  trying to keep as much green on the plant as possible... It sure makes for a nice lower canopy


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## C.Indica (Jan 10, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> Thanks  trying to keep as much green on the plant as possible... It sure makes for a nice lower canopy


Yea I decided I'm gonna let a couple plants go their whole liveswith an allrounder diet, try to keep those leaves as healthy green as possible until chop.
Especially since I'm avoiding the chem nutes as much as possible.


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 10, 2012)

I've done a lot of reading from uncle bens posts.. i think hes banned now maybe though..


Anyway he has a super straight forward no bs approach to everything.. dont quote me but things like if leaves are yellow in flower, give them the veg nutes... because fuck many veg nutes is are high in some nutes that bloom nutes are deficient in..

So i don't remove foliage unless it's not going to grow.. and I give them what food they need and try to ignore all the stupid myths and cannabis-specfic nutrients, and look at what the advanced home gardeners are doing..

Seems to be really working for this little headband run!


----------



## mugan (Jan 10, 2012)

well since your sog, does not removing leaves effect your circulation ?


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 10, 2012)

mugan said:


> well since your sog, does not removing leaves effect your circulation ?


I have the two fans pretty much blasting the canopy with air ... one runs 12/12.. the other runs 24/0... to keep air moving always... Then the humidity stays between 30-35% 24/7.

So I keep the lower canopy trimmed but theres a mighty bush in the middle for sure... It never seems damp or weird or anything I inspect it pretty often now with all the tie downs I'm doing..

If there was another plant I might have issues but the two do fairly well in that space even with a screen up ..


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 10, 2012)

wrapping up day 14

right after lights on - fed with .. /gal

35mL Big Bloom
25mL Tiger Bloom
8mL Bio-Weed (Kelp)
12mL Cal Mag


I had to use like 10mL of pH up it was crazy  After mixing that into the water my pH was at 5.4....

Sounds good for chiles, but not this medication  I'm going to have to pick up more pH Up.. I'm still using one of my first bottles of pH UP.


----------



## C.Indica (Jan 11, 2012)

Wouldn't call a two plant personal grow aSOG, but to each their own.

Man, I thought CFL's were weakuntil my veg cab stared showing leaf stress..
Now theperfect place for my little seedlings is to have the CFL like 8" off of them.
Rediculous right? But no stretching, just perfect perky leaves stretched out flat.

I picked up Big Bloom the other day, I love it. It seems to "soothe" my plants when Ifeed them.


----------



## mugan (Jan 11, 2012)

well sub sog


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 11, 2012)

C.Indica said:


> Wouldn't call a two plant personal grow aSOG, but to each their own.
> 
> Man, I thought CFL's were weakuntil my veg cab stared showing leaf stress..
> Now theperfect place for my little seedlings is to have the CFL like 8" off of them.
> ...



I think he meant SCROG... at least thats how I read it 

Lets see some pics..!

And yeah big bloom seems like it has a bunch of good stuff in it.. I'm excited to see how fox farm nutrients form these plants.. I wonder what the nuggets will be like!


----------



## mugan (Jan 11, 2012)

wow triple fail ..  SCROG


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## C.Indica (Jan 11, 2012)

Well..
I shouldn't overexaggerate..

ONE of my "Headband"s is perfect.
The other "headband" is recovering from deficiency, and slightly droopy.
And my Lemon Skunk is healthy as hell, but also recovering from deficiency.

But I'm stillrediculously confused as to how I've had a 40w CFL within 3" of myplants in the past,
and now after a years worth of burning, I can't have it less than 8"?


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 12, 2012)

Some shots from day 15

..16 today


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## iamaaror (Jan 12, 2012)

Looking forward to seeing what you can pull from this one, I am starting a 2X2 tent grow with a 400w hps and some critical jack, it's gonna be a tight squeeze!


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 12, 2012)

link me to that if you can 

what hood are you using for the 400w?


----------



## titycaca (Jan 12, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> link me to that if you can
> 
> what hood are you using for the 400w?


I second that question.


----------



## C.Indica (Jan 12, 2012)

Today is day 1 Flowering of my T5 cabinet.


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 13, 2012)

Just picked up some nice seeds on attitude... missed that last deal because I didn't know what I wanted at the time... so I did some research .. first it was a 60british pnd order.. then i found their pick and mix section, and picked up some jilly bean, super lemon haze, and blueberry..then it got a little pricey. oh well....I got some strains I've always wanted to run..








I decided to run G13 lab's Pineapple Express for my upcoming medical garden .. I hear they do well with yield.. Read through a couple grow journals and seems like a solid 60 day flowering plant. After I run all those I might have to run those jilly beans and super lemon hazes... with some white widows and or headbands


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## Michael Phelps (Jan 13, 2012)

Looking fan fucking tastic bro! 


Thought i had this thread subb'd but i guess i didnt... 


Sub'd now!


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 13, 2012)

Michael Phelps said:


> Looking fan fucking tastic bro!
> 
> 
> Thought i had this thread subb'd but i guess i didnt...
> ...


 you subbing at the perfect time


I was just looking at pictures from some guys lanky under fed headband and the colas were huge.... I'm really excited now.. check this out

& I have like 20 main tops on each plant  

(NOT MY PICS)





(NOT MY PICS)





(NOT MY PICS)





(NOT MY PICS)


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## 400aZip (Jan 13, 2012)

a guy I know grew some dank as fuck headband last year but I think it was a 400. I loveddd that shit and thats why im growing it now lol but yeah man get excited!!


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 13, 2012)

so is this shit pretty strong or what? 

headstash?


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## genuity (Jan 13, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> so is this shit pretty strong or what?
> 
> headstash?


very strong,headstash for real.


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## 400aZip (Jan 13, 2012)

oh yeah. he had a couple rounds of it. both were some of the best tasting and smelling bud I have ever seen. I hope I can make a fraction of something that dank with my 250


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## Someguy15 (Jan 14, 2012)

It's really good in my experience. Found two different phenos, one more sativa with more lemon scent with a slight diesel, little more airy. It has weak branches and doesn't support itself very well. The Indica pheno has sturdy branches, less fruit smell, more indica buzz but stinks like strait sour diesel. Both phenos are nice in their own way but I decided #2 was my keeper. Are yours clones or from seed sorry I don't remember...


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 14, 2012)

Mine are from seed... It sounds like I have one of the indica phenos and something that resembles the sativa pheno... It started out looking sativa but it still seems like a lot of the Kush traits/smells are coming through it.. It's quite interesting... the smell is very jungle weedy 




Anyway... 

Day 18 just starting up this morning

Just fed/watered with.... /gal of h2o.

16mL Grow Big
12mL Cal/Mag
2mL Bio-Weed (kelp)

Today was scheduled to be water.. But they needed a little N I think that was lacking in last feeding.. I think they will like it at this time..


----------



## 400aZip (Jan 14, 2012)

I wonder if I have the first phenotype. I was training my main stalk (before i knew to top when scrogging) and it snapped...basically topping the plant. i never really showed stress but I think the yields definitely affected. but it smells like straight diesel. the nugs you just posted, Verde, look like that bud has a high calyx to leaf ratio and my strain doesnt look like it will be like that. but time will tell. its gonna be a good spring for us!


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## upthearsenal (Jan 14, 2012)

Someguy15 said:


> It's really good in my experience. Found two different phenos, one more sativa with more lemon scent with a slight diesel, little more airy. It has weak branches and doesn't support itself very well. The Indica pheno has sturdy branches, less fruit smell, more indica buzz but stinks like strait sour diesel. Both phenos are nice in their own way but I decided #2 was my keeper. Are yours clones or from seed sorry I don't remember...


Mine was sativa and extremely sour diesel-ish, and on a whole was pretty thick, even though it stretched like crazy I wouldn't call it lanky per se. I wonder just how many phenos I'd find in my pack... I had some pretty colors on mine as well. 

It seems like verde has more indica ones, I honestly expected a bigger stretch on his...


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 14, 2012)

Mine keep on growing.. They were late stretchers! They are like a foot 4 inches at the highest point now from soil... I'm keeping them spread out.


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 16, 2012)

Day 20 flower...

Flowers are starting to form.. Very small but still those calyxes are packing on.. The smell is quite heavenly, and has gone from lasting a few minutes on your hands.. To stinking up your whole arm when you work on them *sniff sniff*..

Resin glands are starting to form on the leaves on the flower sites... I haven't seen that happen this early yet, ever. Honestly this is probably one of the best genetics I've ran so far. Bad genetics and bagseeds before this. Glad I found the attitude!

I can't wait until they start chunking out. They are actually stretching into VERY lanky plants... I've been fighting the canopy to keep it even.. There are a few colas that just want to grow way faster than the others..

The screen is at about 1ft above the soil and it's quite filled out. The plants are where I want them, I think it's time to *leave them alone and let them do their thing .*


I gave them a little N claw with the last N bump 2 days ago, no burn but some claw.. I will take a note and let them use up whats in the leaves before I start adding too much more to their diet.


----------



## Someguy15 (Jan 17, 2012)

Lookin good. I think most of your stretch should be over, maybe a few more inches is all as the buds develop. Got a pheno that smells like strait diesel in there?


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 17, 2012)

They both smell like really really diesely.. But the overtones are somewhat sweet or hashy, like kush.

Overall they just smell like something different all together, pretty awesome though.

The smell has gotten a little more complex every few weeks. 

As for structure: #1 was more compact, and branchy with a little thicker meristem. #2 started a little stronger with more vigorous growth and sweeter smells, as compared to #1. Both of them seem somewhat close in genetics, besides the subtle differences.


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## C.Indica (Jan 17, 2012)

Depends on end product, but that #2 sounds like my typeof lady


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 17, 2012)

Yeah mine too!

It will be interesting to see how they turn out... So far the forecast is looking frosty .


----------



## Someguy15 (Jan 17, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> Yeah mine too!
> 
> It will be interesting to see how they turn out... So far the forecast is looking frosty .


your 1 sounds a lot like mine as does your 2. The 2 yields better and has better taste and bag appeal, did you take any clones b4 flower or any plans to keep the genetics around?


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 17, 2012)

I've got 4 more beans so I'm going to run this strain again sometime but no I didn't take any clones..

So far it's looking like 1 may yield more than 2, but 2 will be close and more frosty/sweet smelling.

So I agree with you.


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 17, 2012)

Here is a shot from today, day 21 flower... Finally a photo in the middle of their light cycle..

--grow notes--
The tops are slowly morphing into small colas now ... These Headbands were fast to show pistils, yet very slow to pack them on so far... I'm hoping the flower production kicks up a few notches in the coming weeks. I heard from someone here that the RP headband really starts chunking out after week six, which is very understandable so far.

A few leaves are clawing pretty bad, but show no signs of burn or damage, so I will just let the plant use whats there and not worry about it.. I will have to feed tomorrow & be careful about the additional N that I add. Interestingly enough, only plant #1 is showing signs of serious N claw, though they are both being fed the same thing... Again, no burn. This leads me to believe that either the #2 is using more nutrients, or it has a higher tolerance to N.

They're still stretching about a half inch to an inch a day.. I woke up and they were an inch taller than yesterday.. So we will see how they come in. I am glad that I flowered at the height I did (6.5inches), these things stretched just like upthearesenal told me they would in flower.
--end notes--


----------



## upthearsenal (Jan 17, 2012)

Damn I can tell they've stretched a lot, I almost thought they weren't going to as much. Its nice though it looks like you got the timing spot on, that's a beautiful scrog. 

How far is the light from the canopy?


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 17, 2012)

Thanks! You should see underneath! 

Ive been pulling the branches down every once in a while to even things out.. That just ended up making the canopy shorter and wider at the same time.. The meristem is like 2-2.5ft long at least on each. though they are about 1ft 4 inches from the dirt. I will definitly be clipping flowers and keeping the skeleton for some photos..

The 250w Super HPS is 7-9 inches from the canopy... You might see it pretty high in some photos but it's because I raise it to get in for maintenance on the plants. I can't even work on the branches at the back or the sides anymore... i have to reach under and around the plant to get to the back .


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 18, 2012)

Day 22 Flower today..

Fed with: /gal

35mL Big Bloom
25mL Tiger Bloom
12mL Cal/Mag
4mL Thrive Alive
5mL Bio-Weed (kelp)


They are seriously loaded on N, I don't think that blend is _super_ rich in N so I think we should be good... I will wait 5 days and water them with plain h2o sometime sunday.. To let them dry out real nice. I feel like every 4 days is ever so slightly too much, and I want to be careful with that.


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 18, 2012)

Day 22 flower







branch on #2






flower on #2 ..look at how far the resin is going on those leaves... and @ day 22!


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 19, 2012)

After Day 23 flower.. lights off

Green  I think we can tone that down a little 

Bud sites and resin is coming along just lovely.. I'm not using any 'resin' boosters this go, just letting it do it's natural cannabis thing with as much organic food as possible. Let it produce as much resin as it feels comfortable. 


Do you guys notice how #2 is flowering shorter than #1? *Do you folks have any suggestions for risers under the pots? I need to put something underneath that wont get nasty with the water and nutes running onto it. If I could move the plant on the right up 2 inches the whole canopy would be perfect.*


----------



## Someguy15 (Jan 19, 2012)

Yeah I have that same prob with the SK. It will not stop eating N...meanwhile a couple of my other strains won't eat N to save their lives lol

Patio bricks would work. old box of tile maybe. flat stone, idk be creative lol


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## titycaca (Jan 20, 2012)

put it on harry potter books just like me lol


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 20, 2012)

Someguy15 said:


> Yeah I have that same prob with the SK. It will not stop eating N...meanwhile a couple of my other strains won't eat N to save their lives lol
> 
> Patio bricks would work. old box of tile maybe. flat stone, idk be creative lol


Yeah I've been keeping the N really high, and they've been loving it so far... but I pushed it just a little too much an got some N claw on a lot of leaves on #1... #2 is fine though .. So I figured I didn't over-do it too seriously..

Just going to feed tiger bloom, and big bloom with algae and calmag until that dark sickly green tones down a bit.. They will have some straight water this week too, so hopefully it can use more nutes in the soil then.

Patio bricks sounds nice... Maybe I will go pick up a few really flat ones to stack at home depot ... thanks


----------



## StuFish (Jan 20, 2012)

Sr. Verde, During your grow back in spring of 2011, you were trying to boost your N during flower. What did you end up using to get your plants greener, and how did the grow turn out? Thanks in advance, -Stufish-


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 20, 2012)

just the 'grow' solution that usually had a higher N value

Just read the N-P-K on the front of the bottle


----------



## Someguy15 (Jan 20, 2012)

StuFish said:


> Sr. Verde, During your grow back in spring of 2011, you were trying to boost your N during flower. What did you end up using to get your plants greener, and how did the grow turn out? Thanks in advance, -Stufish-


Also understand that every strain is different. SK has very dark leaves, most of the sour diesels do. They just love to pull the N up. Some of my other strains like PPP or my Blackwater refuse to eat very much N almost to the point of deficiency on the same exact feed. This is why running multiple strains can be more challenging, each is unique.


----------



## C.Indica (Jan 20, 2012)

I prefer your Pheno#2.
Presuming my two seedlings are in fact headband, my first seedling reminds me of your #2.
Maybe I'll rename them for confusions sake.

I would use Terracotta, but that's justme.


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 22, 2012)

Here we are @ day 26...

5 days since last watering,, I usually water every 4 but haven't gotten to it... They'll get watered tomorrow.. They look pretty fine to me .

Honestly the ladies haven't looked too keen in the last 2 weeks... Slightly clawed, and barely showing signs of being over fertilized (I personally think that's healthy though, only way to find the limits of the strain & then back off accordingly ).. I'm watering with plain water tomorrow anyway, and feeding very lightly the next round of fertilizer.. So I believe they should be back to their perky happy selves before day 30 .







the colas aren't very large yet, but wow at the resin production so far..


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 23, 2012)

27..

Fed with /gal h2o

10mL CalMag


[youtube]YdPml5QhMIA[/youtube]

Photos taken about 3 hours after watering... Surprisingly enough a lot of the N claw on #1 is flattening out within a few hours of the watering.. Hopefully #1 will be relieved of the N claw completely in a day or two . Yay. #2 has been looking great throughout this all, except she was a little wilted yesterday. Shes back stretching into the light. I also raised #2 onto bricks.. Found some at the store .. The canopy is reasonably even now..






/\ cute little cola off #2..... fun fact: yesterday i learned that cola is spanish for tail... and sin semilia is spanish for without seeds.. commonly compounded together into sinsemillia.. neat! makes sense.


----------



## johnyutah (Jan 24, 2012)

Untz untz untz... Great song to wake up too. I think I'll smoke some h3ttis now... Thanks br3h


----------



## upthearsenal (Jan 25, 2012)

Looking awesome V!


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 26, 2012)

Day 30 today

My buds are starting to chunk out... Calyx on top of calyx style... @ upthearsenal When am I supposed to see some serious growth in flower weight? Day 45?


Also, my girls are still full of N.. I don't want to add TOO much more N... Tiger Bloom is 2-8-4... You guys think I could get away with a full feeding on that with some slight N claw... Or should I bump the tiger bloom down to half for now? I'm not trying to burn my ladies..


----------



## Someguy15 (Jan 26, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> Day 30 today
> 
> My buds are starting to chunk out... Calyx on top of calyx style... @ upthearsenal When am I supposed to see some serious growth in flower weight? Day 45?
> 
> ...


Maybe do every other feeding with the tiger bloom and then use a 'bloom boost' product the other feeding. Something like 0-13-14 would be good. I can just tell you from experience you will need to really cut the N out, they are N whores lol As for fat budding, I run hydro & co2 so it maybe a bit quicker, but I had decent bud masses bulking around day 35-40 of flower.


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## C.Indica (Jan 26, 2012)

Rememberthe claw can also be overwatering.


----------



## Michael Phelps (Jan 26, 2012)

Looking good buddy!


Hella envious! Headband really is a top 3 strain for me, cant wait to see the finished product..


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 26, 2012)

C.Indica said:


> Rememberthe claw can also be overwatering.


for sure... but i'm watering once every 5 days minimum..only one plant is showing a good n claw



Michael Phelps said:


> Looking good buddy!
> 
> 
> Hella envious! Headband really is a top 3 strain for me, cant wait to see the finished product..


thanks!! sounds good!


----------



## C.Indica (Jan 26, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> for sure... but i'm watering once every 5 days minimum..only one plant is showing a good n claw
> 
> 
> 
> thanks!! sounds good!



I can only hope you take this the right way;
Humans like to use days and years and weeks and count in fives and tens,
but nature just doesn't work so black and white.
It's not necessarily about how much time in between waterings,
but how much moisture is in the medium, and how much oxygen/drainage available.
But it could be Nitrogen, totally correct,
and we can tell your plants are NOT lacking Nitrogen.


----------



## upthearsenal (Jan 27, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> Day 30 today
> 
> My buds are starting to chunk out... Calyx on top of calyx style... @ upthearsenal When am I supposed to see some serious growth in flower weight? Day 45?
> 
> ...


yeah at around 6wks.


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 27, 2012)

Very close then! I'm excited... These things are getting really frosty..

Day 31 today... fed with /gal

10mL Cal Mag
12mL Tiger Bloom
20mL Big Bloom
3mL Bio Weed

pH'd @ 6.6

They look like the N claw is still uncurling even after the feeding.... Smooth sailing from here? Wanted to keep the food up for the flowering boom.. Went with the notion they could handle a moderate feeding..

I'll put up some lights off photos tonight.. Going snowboarding tomorrow.. Got 19g of ground bud sitting in a crock pot with a stick of butter right now  2+g per brownie..


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 27, 2012)

31 lights off







main cola on #2.. wowzers












shiny things


----------



## jdro (Jan 28, 2012)

Looking so magically delicious. Safe to say you are much happier with reserva privada so far over barneys?


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 28, 2012)

yeah my experience with barneys farm is just really poor genetics


the reserva privada is really nice so far...


----------



## Ge7Som3 (Jan 28, 2012)

Looks increadable! I just got my tent today! cant wait! =)


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## Ge7Som3 (Jan 29, 2012)

SO Sir gowing thru this grow do you think you coulda squeesed a 400W in there?


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## C.Indica (Jan 29, 2012)

Jeez I get more and more jealous as I watch this grow.
My headband girls are still in veg, starting to pre-flower.
I don't get to flower any until at LEAST mid march.


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 31, 2012)

Yesterday... Day 34

Plant #1






Plant #2






Canopy







Watering with plain water next... Going to let them munch on whatevers in the soil for a week and see if the excess nutrients gets sorted out then.. Seeing some slight burning on the tips of the very lower fan leaves. No big deal really.


----------



## titycaca (Jan 31, 2012)

Ah man I'm loving your ladies! that canopy..... So clean and so even. I'm a bit jealous as my canopy is far from even. Do you know the flowering time for this strain?

Good work, can't wait for harvest


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 31, 2012)

Thanks! I've put hours into that canopy

I hear the rp sour kush takes 70-78 days..

So we're about half way through..


----------



## titycaca (Jan 31, 2012)

I can tell you put a lot of time into that canopy! Dang that must be a little tough waiting that long, but I saw your concentrate thread earlier and doesn't look like you will be dry any time soon 

I'm about 3 weeks into my first grow and I just can't WAIT for it to finish..


----------



## Sr. Verde (Jan 31, 2012)

titycaca said:


> I can tell you put a lot of time into that canopy! Dang that must be a little tough waiting that long, but I saw your concentrate thread earlier and doesn't look like you will be dry any time soon  I'm about 3 weeks into my first grow and I just can't WAIT for it to finish..


 It's always worth the wait though! I really don't mind 10-11 weeks.. It could be longer, I just figure I'll have some stronger more plentiful medication.. That's why I chose the headband.. I hear it delivers. Good luck!


edit: 

+ tomorrow the girls will be watered through with plain water 4mL calMag per gal .. we will see how much of a gal they drink after 5 days of no water.. 

grow note: February 1st with plain water... on day 36


----------



## Someguy15 (Feb 1, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> It's always worth the wait though! I really don't mind 10-11 weeks.. It could be longer, I just figure I'll have some stronger more plentiful medication.. That's why I chose the headband.. I hear it delivers. Good luck!
> 
> 
> edit:
> ...


I'd be cautious taking them that far. My indica dom pheno was done at 8 week, at 9 she was startin to make those tiny ass seeds, like a spec of salt sized, but still annoying to have in the bud. Sativa phenos can go an extra week or so. I also use CO2 so that speeds them up a bit.


----------



## Sr. Verde (Feb 1, 2012)

Day 36 today..

Watered with / h2o

5mL CalMag




Someguy15 said:


> I'd be cautious taking them that far. My indica dom pheno was done at 8 week, at 9 she was startin to make those tiny ass seeds, like a spec of salt sized, but still annoying to have in the bud. Sativa phenos can go an extra week or so. I also use CO2 so that speeds them up a bit.


We will have to see then! I was told 10-11 weeks.. I will take them as long as they need to go ... Til the pistils turn, and all the clear trichs go cloudy, then a few of them turn amber... chop chop chop.. 

Thanks for the advice!


----------



## Sr. Verde (Feb 1, 2012)

Day 36 after lights off







#1 main cola






#2


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## 400aZip (Feb 1, 2012)

I wish my light was as concentrated on my headband as it is on yours. I think I'll have really good smoke but yours is a bit frostier and chunkier than mine were at your age. outstanding job, keep up the good work. just curious, what are you feeding it/them? ppms?


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 1, 2012)

Thanks.... I think I have the light like 6-10 inches from any main cola.. most are about 9 inches from the light..

ive been feeding them fox farms and kelp.. you can read back to see how much i think i take lots of notes on that..

I could honestly clip a sample and smoke it right now.. It's crazy, so much frost so far.. I'm really excited for day 40-50.. I'm happy if the calyxes keep packing on... as soon as they start inflating it will be real fun to watch


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## 400aZip (Feb 1, 2012)

yeah man, you are going to have a really nice yield. I know you're smelling them now. by day 50, i think they have a similar smell but on a whole other level...so intense! I love the smell and the sample cola I cut yesterday still smells like the cured headband, unlike the other sample strains i cut that smell like plant. I cant wait to smoke it. definitely a killer strain.

i forgot I accidentally 'topped' my headband while training it one night lol. I think that probably negatively effected my yield. must get more beans.


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 2, 2012)

[FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]


400aZip said:


> yeah man, you are going to have a really nice yield. I know you're smelling them now. by day 50, i think they have a similar smell but on a whole other level...so intense! I love the smell and the sample cola I cut yesterday still smells like the cured headband, unlike the other sample strains i cut that smell like plant. I cant wait to smoke it. definitely a killer strain.
> 
> i forgot I accidentally 'topped' my headband while training it one night lol. I think that probably negatively effected my yield. must get more beans.


Yeah man! Im interested to see the yield too.. But i have to give creit as they wouldn't look anything like they look now if it wasn't for the advice of multiple others.. They really let me avoid some mistakes! Thanks![/FONT][FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]
Great to hear the smell keeps going. I happened to be by the tent around 3 am and couldn't put my finger on the vanilla/sour weed smell and I realized it was my plants stinking up the room heavily and heavenly. The carbon filter is really doing its job.

As far as topping, that was my initial plan until upthearesenal reccomended keeping it untopped and to train the meristem down and use SCRoG for maximum vigor... Glad I took that advice! It worked great.


I will probably pick up more headband beans too, keep some in the back pocket for good genetics... I'm going to wait til the end to taste it and I really think the headband will deliver![/FONT]


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## 400aZip (Feb 2, 2012)

haha thats exactly what I TRIED to do with my headband but I put a little too much stress on the stalk one night and it snapped so I had to deal with what I had. mine are really starting to swell. you will have a massive yield.


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## Ge7Som3 (Feb 2, 2012)

Jeers looks great I hope I get as much help as you did when I start lol hopefully this weekend!!


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 2, 2012)

400aZip said:


> haha thats exactly what I TRIED to do with my headband but I put a little too much stress on the stalk one night and it snapped so I had to deal with what I had. mine are really starting to swell. you will have a massive yield.



Can't say I haven't done that before!

I give my self rules...Like: No serious training / bending until 3+ hours after watering... And ALWAYS keep masking tape within arms reach from your garden.... I can't tell you how many branches I've had to tape up when they tore or got cut up..

Can I see some pics of your ladies?




Ge7Som3 said:


> Jeers looks great I hope I get as much help as you did when I start lol hopefully this weekend!!



You've got a long road ahead but a rewarding one.. Zip ties are your friends! I hold pretty much everything up with them.. That and some wirecutters might save you some time..


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## 400aZip (Feb 2, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> Can't say I haven't done that before!
> 
> I give my self rules...Like: No serious training / bending until 3+ hours after watering... And ALWAYS keep masking tape within arms reach from your garden.... I can't tell you how many branches I've had to tape up when they tore or got cut up..
> 
> Can I see some pics of your ladies?


of course. i have 3 strains. the headband, jekyll passion(black domina and Flo) and yumbolt (freebie, using it for hash). ill show you 2 of jekyll and 2 of my headband. the trichomes arent so much getting out onto the bigger leaves like yours but I think the actual buds are covered. again, I wish my light was more concentrated on the headband, but oh well. 

pics in order - Jekyll group shot, headband group shot, jekyll close up, headband close up


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 2, 2012)

Hmm yeah I see what you mean... The jekyII looks more like my #2 headband in regards to resin... but your headband looks like my #1 headband.. 

the #2 is much much frostier than #1 and I actually use that plant for a lot of close up frost covered pictures.. like this 

#2 from day 31


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## 400aZip (Feb 2, 2012)

right.. i like your 'grow lab' better too. i think it matches the footprint of my hood better. I learned a lot in the past few months... 

but excellent job thus far. this will be a fun finish to keep an eye on


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 2, 2012)

I'm definitely a grow lab whore now... they sold me 

thanks..!


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## Ge7Som3 (Feb 2, 2012)

Hey verde after doing this grow do you think you could have squeesed in a 400W?


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## 400aZip (Feb 2, 2012)

I wanted to ask the same but I thought you also did work with the 250.. I just feel like 250 didnt cut it for me, not in the 2x4 at least.


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 2, 2012)

i answered the question a few times before.... a long while back though

i dont think 400w would work... youd need to have the same size hood.. and i already do 82F on the warmer days with my suppliment CFL.. I have to drop the AC down to like 69-70 on the really warm days just to keep the temps down.. Other than that on a regular day I keep up normal AC and the tent stays at a comfy 77-78F..

i find environment to be more important than the extra intensity... if you can keep the temps down lower with good ventilation youll have happy plants... if you really need a 400w then get a 2.5x2.5x6 tent.. .. or just get a 3x3x Y with a 600w hood.. 

250w works perfect in 2x2x5 with a few extra light bulbs..


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## Ge7Som3 (Feb 2, 2012)

Good info. so if i get a lumatec dimable ballast can I dim it to like 300W? lol


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 2, 2012)

I wouldn't be one to give advice on dimmable lights..

If it were me I'd just get a 250w light up above and position extra lights around where they're needed..

Or again just get a slightly larger tent with a slightly larger fan to pull air out and it's gravy .


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## Ge7Som3 (Feb 2, 2012)

Thing is i dont have the room for a bigger tent and im planning on getting a dimmable digital ballast system for a steal at my local Hydro store thats a 400W dimmable . ill try stuff out lol im basing it all on this grow tho lol. once again GREAT WORK!


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 2, 2012)

If you had an extra half foot on each side you could do a 400w no problem is all im saying..


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## Myroaches (Feb 2, 2012)

Cant wait to see the finished budz....I was gifted some headband from a friend and we decided try her outdoors this year


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## titycaca (Feb 2, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> If you had an extra half foot on each side you could do a 400w no problem is all im saying..


I put a 400w in my dr60. The ducting is a little tight of a fit and pushes out the ends of the tent, but it works! my lady is lovin it.


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## Ge7Som3 (Feb 2, 2012)

titycaca said:


> I put a 400w in my dr60. The ducting is a little tight of a fit and pushes out the ends of the tent, but it works! my lady is lovin it.


any pics???


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## titycaca (Feb 2, 2012)

for you sir. if you want a differn't angle or something let me know. Or i can just try and describe it for you.


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## Michael Phelps (Feb 4, 2012)

Verde those are smoking!! Good job bro!



Finally got a TI Nail, v3.. I have to admit it is pretty legit... But honestly i dont think it's all that much better then a well seasoned quarts nail... 


Just nice to know it's never going to break.


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## 400aZip (Feb 4, 2012)

Michael Phelps said:


> Verde those are smoking!! Good job bro!
> 
> 
> 
> ...



oil is where its at. my friend (because I dont have a dome lol) just got a new Ti nail and its the shit. i wouldnt say it gets hotter faster or anything but it definitely STAYS hot for a good amount of time letting you hit the whole dab. thats basically the only difference I see in em.


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## 400aZip (Feb 4, 2012)

and while I love hitting oil, i just caught on to dry ice hash. it looks so easy and effortless. I might just make a lot of that stuff. concentrates for the win!


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## titycaca (Feb 4, 2012)

400aZip said:


> and while I love hitting oil, i just caught on to dry ice hash. it looks so easy and effortless. I might just make a lot of that stuff. concentrates for the win!


Agreed. Whole new levels with that stuff.


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## Frawsti (Feb 4, 2012)

How much of a yeild do you think you'll get out of that?


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## wakkawa (Feb 7, 2012)

Frawsti said:


> How much of a yeild do you think you'll get out of that?


Wondering the complete same thing, as I have my gl60 just waiting to be outfitted, but i'm following verde and seeing it i can replicate his grow... wondering how much fruit he getting out of this all.


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 7, 2012)

*Calling on subscribers! Need some advice..*

Pretty much the entire foliage of the top canopy is at risk... I'm *not sure if it's serious nutrient burn, or heat damage from the HPS.* From what I'm seeing *I'm thinking heat damage? But IDK  I seek advice..*



Some background:

I haven't checked on them in a while, and realized that it had been 6 days since I watered them.. I usually do 4 or 5.. When I checked I noticed the whole top foliage was burned to hell... And the dehumidifier was off. 

The previous two waterings were fresh water.. clean with only 5mL of CalMag added... I made sure to water them through really nice to wash out some of the nutes in the soil... Or so I thought?  *They weren't burned like this two weeks ago*, and I've *been watering with plain water ever since*. Now I'm noticing that the lower leaves look completely fine, and the upper leaves look really bad... The flowers are OK but the burn is spreading to the little leaves on the flowers.... 















messed up leaves
















I've since backed the light off like 2 inches, and I shut down the CFLs on the side. The temps used to be 78-80F on the canopy with the HPS @ 9inches, now they are like 76F with the HPS @ 11inches.

Here is the lower foliage.. All looks healthy??










I'm not worried about the foliage affected so far, I just want the issue solved so the flowers dont get affected... I expected the big foliage to yellow out and die anyway within the next month, but I dont want the flowers all burned up 
This is my first time using these FF nutes, and a new strain so there are too many variables for me to nail this down without help..

Thanks folks! I appreciate you taking the time to save these meds..

PS: I have a good thing to report.... The smell has totally changed into some crazy complex, lemony-kushy smell, instead of the very diesel smell... Very headstash.


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## 400aZip (Feb 7, 2012)

is it hot in there? perhaps its a deficiency + heat and dryness, not a burn


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 7, 2012)

400aZip said:


> is it hot in there? perhaps its a deficiency + heat and dryness, not a burn



I didn't think it was particularly hot... 78-80... But that was just the canopy, and I'm not sure about radiant heat from the bulb.. Plus I had the 65w underneath the canopy.. It's 74.5F now at night though with the CFL off and the light raised a bit..


Do you think the dryness could attribute to the leaves burning up? Combined with the heat?

I kind of always thought that the leaves would withstand the dry periods for more than a week but maybe not in those conditions?


Leaf damage is always tough because it's difficult to tell if its getting worse or balancing out...


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## Ge7Som3 (Feb 7, 2012)

Hey verde do you know if the Botanicare Liquid Karma is like your Kelp Fert ?


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## 1234five (Feb 8, 2012)

Wow great grow, this is so useful for me! I am just starting a 2 plant headband scrog in a grow lab, so your grow is the perfect guide! The only difference is that i am using a GL80 (2.5 by 2.5) with a 400 watt MH/HPS. Anyways, I had to dig up my ROI account just so i could comment, havnt been on here in a while! Is it allowed to post links to other forums? im keeping my grow journal on GC and if you have a account on there id love if you could jump in! Heres the link: http://forum.grasscity.com/indoor-grow-journals/991650-first-grow-707-headband-clones-400-watt-mh-hps-scrog.html

And some pics I took today:


I have a few questions in particular:

Looking back, how long would you veg and flower? How about if you had been using 400 watts in a GL80? Is there anything else you would do differently knowing what you know now?

Sorry for bombarding you with questions, Im just so stoked to have found this thread and got so excited while reading through it and seeing it go so well for you. Id really appreciate some input on my grow as it is my first one and you seem to really know your shit! 

Peace ​


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## CEEJR (Feb 8, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> I didn't think it was particularly hot... 78-80... But that was just the canopy, and I'm not sure about radiant heat from the bulb.. Plus I had the 65w underneath the canopy.. It's 74.5F now at night though with the CFL off and the light raised a bit..
> 
> 
> Do you think the dryness could attribute to the leaves burning up? Combined with the heat?
> ...


Hey Verde my Ladyburn had a leaf issue similar to yours. I'm also running a gl60 but with twin 250's I never figured out the cause but still pulled 8 zips off the plant. Link in sig has pics.


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## mugan (Feb 8, 2012)

if its continueous like that maybe its a long out. ... maybe flush . ? but i forgot your medium tho so am prolly wrong


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## mugan (Feb 8, 2012)

sorry i corrected wrong . ment lock out . ... and continuous


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## 400aZip (Feb 8, 2012)

mugan said:


> sorry i corrected wrong . ment lock out . ... and continuous



thats what I was going to say but he's been flushing for some time now. thats why I suggested a deficiency. 


maybe they're just getting *there*, you know? like when the leaves die off and the trichs ripen up. its a good thing. maybe its happening

not necessarily a 'good' thing in the sense of the plant loves it, but you know what I mean?


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 8, 2012)

Ge7Som3 said:


> Hey verde do you know if the Botanicare Liquid Karma is like your Kelp Fert ?


All mine is, is Cold Processed Norwegian Kelp.. Pure...



1234five said:


> Wow great grow, this is so useful for me! I am just starting a 2 plant headband scrog in a grow lab, so your grow is the perfect guide! The only difference is that i am using a GL80 (2.5 by 2.5) with a 400 watt MH/HPS. Anyways, I had to dig up my ROI account just so i could comment, havnt been on here in a while! Is it allowed to post links to other forums? im keeping my grow journal on GC and if you have a account on there id love if you could jump in! Heres the link: http://forum.grasscity.com/indoor-grow-journals/991650-first-grow-707-headband-clones-400-watt-mh-hps-scrog.html
> 
> And some pics I took today:
> View attachment 2045786View attachment 2045787
> ...


Feel free to PM me if you want.. I'd probably veg until they start filling up some of the screen then switch... I think mine only stretched 2.5x-3x if that helps.. I wouldn't do much different besides feed less .



CEEJR said:


> Hey Verde my Ladyburn had a leaf issue similar to yours. I'm also running a gl60 but with twin 250's I never figured out the cause but still pulled 8 zips off the plant. Link in sig has pics.


Thats strange... Maybe it is radiant heat if your in the same tent as me with more heat.



mugan said:


> if its continueous like that maybe its a long out. ... maybe flush . ? but i forgot your medium tho so am prolly wrong


Does nute lock out deficiency start showing from the top down?  I don't remember

My medium is Fox Farms Ocean Forest with Perlite mixed in.. I'm using fox farms nutes..



400aZip said:


> thats what I was going to say but he's been flushing for some time now. thats why I suggested a deficiency.
> 
> 
> maybe they're just getting *there*, you know? like when the leaves die off and the trichs ripen up. its a good thing. maybe its happening
> ...


Yeah I thought about that for a second too but the little leaves on the flowers are starting to get burned too... Usually only the nutes get sucked out of the fan leaves and the fan leaves die off... This is pretty much all foliage on the top...




Ive had the CFL off and the temp is at 74F at the canopy... 5F lower than it was before.... lets hope these girls brush off this burn and start growing green again.. Lets hope it was the heat in the last week just building up.




Well, we are on day 43 flower now...

I watered them on day 42 with some food.. I was leaning towards deficiency, + heat.. So i gave them a moderate bloom feed with low Cal Mag..

Fed on day 42 with /gal

20mL big bloom
15mL Tiger Bloom
2mL Cal Mag

pH balanced to 6.6


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## ProAce (Feb 8, 2012)

Nice grow sr. Verde, how much are you expecting to yield out of your tent? I plan to get a 600 watt light and a 4x4 tent, if I grow in a party cup sog how much do you think I could yield I was thinking that if people can get an o a plant I can be safe to say I will have maybe 7 grams a cup and I can fit 144 in a 4x4 space, idk do you think that it is possible?


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 8, 2012)

id just do 4 big plants scrog

idk about my yield


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## ProAce (Feb 8, 2012)

Do you think that would yield more then a whole bunch of party cups?


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 9, 2012)

can't say ive never done it


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## Devils love (Feb 9, 2012)

umm not really sure just looking at the leaves..uhh.. make sure you water bit prior to turning out light or with lights off and then of course bit before..not really good to water plants in light and leave the water on them because the water droplets that are formed on the surface of the leaves and the petals act as miniature lenses and focus the sun rays on the tissue ; thus scorching them, and disfiguring them .looks like those are bad burns and not just yellowing that would form..


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## upthearsenal (Feb 9, 2012)

Lol, don't listen to that^ 

If that were true, consider what would happen in nature if there was rain and the sun were out............


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 10, 2012)

It's somewhat true.. Spray the foliage under direct HPS and let it sit and you can get some burns..


Though I don't spray my foliage whatsoever in flower... UTA any ideas on the burn? I'm flushing this morning anyway.. Looks like backing off the heat helped a bit though


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## C.Indica (Feb 10, 2012)

upthearsenal said:


> Lol, don't listen to that^
> 
> If that were true, consider what would happen in nature if there was rain and the sun were out............


Be a little more relaxed, it can happen if the rays focused on a stomata.


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## upthearsenal (Feb 10, 2012)

Did most of the burning start at the tips? To me it looks like overfeeding. I guess flushing is your best bet. 

Has the problem stopped, or is it getting worse?


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 10, 2012)

upthearsenal said:


> Did most of the burning start at the tips? To me it looks like overfeeding. I guess flushing is your best bet.
> 
> Has the problem stopped, or is it getting worse?


Nah it started everywhere, really fast... Began with copper specks towards the ends of the leaves, then moved back to the stem of the leaf.. on the bad leaves the leaves burned up completely and curled up towards the HPS..

When I was pushing the nute levels 25mL Tiger Bloom 30mL big bloom I noticed that the tips started to burn (nute burn) so I backed right off the nutes... started doing feedings like 10-15mL tiger bloom 10-15mL big bloom every other watering as a response..... everything was good, then 1.5 weeks of plain water, I left for 5 days, and came back to this..




extra notes:
I am also starting to yellow naturally, I'm used to this... i'm noticing a few leaves here and there with them getting a very slight hint of yellow.. Just as a grow note.. This is separate from the burning though. A natural response to being late in bloom...

If this is a 70-78 day strain I'm looking to chop in a month. Or less than a month.. Very exciting. A few pistils are turning brown. The frost is really nice.


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## upthearsenal (Feb 10, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> Nah it started everywhere, really fast... Began with copper specks towards the ends of the leaves, then moved back to the stem of the leaf.. on the bad leaves the leaves burned up completely and curled up towards the HPS..
> 
> When I was pushing the nute levels 25mL Tiger Bloom 30mL big bloom I noticed that the tips started to burn (nute burn) so I backed right off the nutes... started doing feedings like 10-15mL tiger bloom 10-15mL big bloom every other watering as a response..... everything was good, then 1.5 weeks of plain water, I left for 5 days, and came back to this..
> 
> ...


Yeah, the TB can burn for sure. I haven't used it in a while but 30ml seems crazy, maybe not though. I would have just kept the solutions at around 15ml if it were me, but again I haven't used the TB in ages. I also subscribe to notion that less is best.


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## upthearsenal (Feb 10, 2012)

C.Indica said:


> Be a little more relaxed, it can happen if the rays focused on a stomata.


Be a little more relaxed?  It's hard to be more relaxed when one is already totally dabbed out.

I've actually talked about this with scientists and grad students from a&m. There is actually a lot of debate about this, but it is still considered a myth. There was some Hungarian scientist who tested it out, and we all know that droplets are in fact mini magnifying lenses, but what people forget is that water evaporates pretty quickly under intense sun. Anyways, in the Hungarian's test he showed that smooth leafs won't burn, but leafs that have little hairs on them (like cannabis) can hold a droplet up above the leaf surface and magnify it. Although he never got one to burn, this was just a theory (that a droplet, suspended would potentially magnify) based from an observation, and I think his main conclusion (it's been months since I read this) was that leafs wouldn't burn under intense sunlight was because the droplets would evaporate, simply put. One concept that you always arrive at when discussing this is, "if that were true what would happen to plants in nature, or humans for that matter", which is why I tossed out that thought experiment, although it seems like it was in vain.

Didn't want to jack the thread, I just felt compelled to throw that out there. I try not to say something unless I have some substance to back it up, I don't always post everything on my mind, so sometimes it can come out patronizing, although I'm usually just high and laughing my arse off.


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## Devils love (Feb 10, 2012)

you do know though that there has to be clouds in the sky for it to rain? so the sun might be out a bit?.....


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## upthearsenal (Feb 10, 2012)

I'm not entirely sure what you mean Devils love, but yes I do know that there has to be clouds in the sky for it to rain. By the "sun might be out", do you mean out and about, or out of view? 

The conclusion to the only scientific study done on this was basically, the sun will evaporate the droplets before anything could potentially happen.

This isn't what caused Sr.'s problem, so hopefully we can just get back on focus... and speaking of which, it would be cool to get a shot of the plant(s) affected without HPS, if possible.


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 10, 2012)

Day 45 flower

Flushed with 3 gal plain h2o... balanced to 6.6&7.0&7.3


The runoff started at 5.8.. then by the time the third gallon was done it was at 6.03...

The plants look pretty much the same, they might have some nutrient shit going on but I think it was mostly burn from the lamp.. Looking at the damage, it seems _only _the exposed parts of leaves were severely burned.. the parts covered by extra leaves were fine.. and the damage was only the worst directly below the bulb.. Though I think the flush will do the roots some nice... When I started the run off was brown, when I was done it was mostly clear with a tint of brown. I'm thinking I flushed out a lot of excess bat guano and worm castings? That shit was really acidic to my solutions maybe it was doing a little the same to my soil?


Oh well I only think these headbands will do well from now... The flowers look 100% healthy and vigorous.. Now with about a month left. Some trim leaves will be damaged but its still useable for hash oil .


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 10, 2012)

upthearsenal said:


> I'm not entirely sure what you mean Devils love, but yes I do know that there has to be clouds in the sky for it to rain. By the "sun might be out", do you mean out and about, or out of view?
> 
> The conclusion to the only scientific study done on this was basically, the sun will evaporate the droplets before anything could potentially happen.
> 
> This isn't what caused Sr.'s problem, so hopefully we can just get back on focus... and speaking of which, it would be cool to get a shot of the plant(s) affected without HPS, if possible.


I'll touch on the water spray thing  just to add a little input: 
idk about where you guys live but out here water in the sun is a big problem for little plants like tomatos and peppers, strawberrys etc.... you have to water at night or at the break of dawn.. To give the water time to evaporate, otherwise the sun is intense enough to cause burns on the leaves. They don't do a whole lot of harm besides make the plants look like shit and maybe cause a little stress.. It wont destroy leaves but it will make little burn marks..

Granted this is in 110F weather, no clouds in the sky.


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## Michael Phelps (Feb 10, 2012)

Verde looking good buddy!


Overall i just think it was a mixture of not watering and potentially higher temps... maybe one of those days the temp sky rocketed for one reason or another, who knows, shit happens. 


Cant wait to get a solid report on it buddy!




BTW, now my Ti and Quartz nail are both well seasoned i can honestly say that the Ti nail def wins on all levels... 


1. It it will fit in any piece. 
2. Heats up just as fast if not faster(considering how thick it is).
3. It stays hotter longer(Am able to get 2 dabs off in one heating).
4. Will last forever(maybe not forever, but for a long time no doubt).
5. Taste increases by 1.5x in my opinion.


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 10, 2012)

Yeah I love Ti too.. i have an 18mm and a 14mm...

You guys should see these plants.. ill take some lights off shots tonight... the next month will be fun they are yellowing out..

phelps you got any plants?


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## Michael Phelps (Feb 11, 2012)

Word that's legit, i just have the 18mm V3 at the moment... Im lucky, due to the fact that taskrok is local and a friend of many friends i was able to get my nail for $75 vs. 95$ that they normally go for. 



No i fucking wish bro, i feel like im living vicariously through you on this one! I have 650watts of hps/mh lighting, a 470cfm inline fan(with sound box built around it), soil, pumps, reservoirs, nutrients, seeds, etc. 

I could grow, im just scared to be honest. When im sober, the idea sounds GREAT! When im stoned i cant stop being super paranoid about it and thinking about how id never last a day in jail. 

Essentially i know id be fine, the paranoia just get's so bad that i cant even enjoy the high not really making it worth it at the moment.



Did you by chance ever get to see any of my grows? I cant remember... 




I got some hella dank seeds to! Og ghost train haze, essentially it's a cross between Ghost OG(thought to be the original OG kush cut), Arcata trainwreck, and Neville's Haze 





I got a 6 pack of regular seeds, im going to breed the best male and female once all is said and done, ill be sure to send you some seeds if you'd like. Probably wont be for a min, but i dont expect you or myself to be going anywhere..


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 11, 2012)

Nice! You should grow some normal plants under those lights then.. Like peppers or tomatoes..


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## Ge7Som3 (Feb 11, 2012)

Cant wait for the pics!!


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## upthearsenal (Feb 11, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> I'll touch on the water spray thing  just to add a little input:
> idk about where you guys live but out here water in the sun is a big problem for little plants like tomatos and peppers, strawberrys etc.... you have to water at night or at the break of dawn.. To give the water time to evaporate, otherwise the sun is intense enough to cause burns on the leaves. They don't do a whole lot of harm besides make the plants look like shit and maybe cause a little stress.. It wont destroy leaves but it will make little burn marks..
> 
> Granted this is in 110F weather, no clouds in the sky.


Actually we don't grow pepper, tomatoes, or anything like that here in the summer as it's waaaay too hot. The tomatoes won't blossom and the pepper pollen becomes sterile because it's too hot. We usually wait till October or so to start the seeds, so they can be placed out in September. But yeah some plants don't like water directly on them, but that's why we water at the base  

In my experience the best reason to water outside during cool hours is best because of evaporation, my area has been in a drought for a long time so water conservation is important. In my veggie garden I have a drip system so I don't waste a drop, so to speak.


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## Michael Phelps (Feb 12, 2012)

Ive thought about it actually! Try my hand at some hydroponic strawberrys... Mmm Bet those would be good


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## greenlikemoney (Feb 12, 2012)

Glad I found this thread, starting up a GL 60 in 3 days.....old phototron user here.....This thread WILL be my BIBLE, great advice from upthearsenal, love the zip tie/screen setup and like your nutes notes.....awesome stuff......BRILLIANT !!!!!!!


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## titycaca (Feb 12, 2012)

Hey Verde. I was looking around and I know everybody says this, but Are you feeding any Mag or Calcium? It seems to be a common problem in soil grow. As well It isn't absorbed under 6.5 PH and with this lockout usually comes with copper spotting. As well when Mag is cut out other nutrients can't be absorbed. Or if your ph is good, lack of Calcium can cause Mag lockout. Viscous cycle if you ask me  

You obviously aren't a noob grower, just make sure you can get that PH where it needs to be. Dolomite lime as a top dressing could help bring your PH back up if it is too Acidic.


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 13, 2012)

titycaca said:


> Hey Verde. I was looking around and I know everybody says this, but Are you feeding any Mag or Calcium? It seems to be a common problem in soil grow. As well It isn't absorbed under 6.5 PH and with this lockout usually comes with copper spotting. As well when Mag is cut out other nutrients can't be absorbed. Or if your ph is good, lack of Calcium can cause Mag lockout. Viscous cycle if you ask me
> 
> You obviously aren't a noob grower, just make sure you can get that PH where it needs to be. Dolomite lime as a top dressing could help bring your PH back up if it is too Acidic.



yep i add cal mag... keep ph at around 6.6 for solutions... calibrate my meter weekly.. and my nutes have ca / mg in small amounts too 

thanks though it sure did look like a mg deficiency though im pretty certain it was the lights as is was mainly directly in the bulbs hot spot and not in the cooler spots in the canopy... the canopy is at 74F during the day now


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## C.Indica (Feb 13, 2012)

I topped my two headbands, and stuck them in Root Riots.
My next harvest should be early to mid march,
then I can flower these headbands out and see if they'll be keepers.


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 13, 2012)

photos from day 47 after lights off... day 48 today


yeah now you guys can really see how bad those leaves got...













thankfully the flowers themselves look GREAT 






































I dont think i've really seen any flowers with this level of resin production before.. they smell great too..


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## Ge7Som3 (Feb 13, 2012)

That looks AMAZING!!!!


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 13, 2012)

Ge7Som3 said:


> That looks AMAZING!!!!



thanks!

yeah i think the leaves are actually kind of cool looking .. next grow ill try to keep it more stable with temps food and soil PH so hopefully my trim next run can be green


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## greenlikemoney (Feb 13, 2012)

Ain't nobody caring 'bout them leaves, ain't nobody even noticed.....transfixed on the buds.....


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 14, 2012)

greenlikemoney said:


> Glad I found this thread, starting up a GL 60 in 3 days.....old phototron user here.....This thread WILL be my BIBLE, great advice from upthearsenal, love the zip tie/screen setup and like your nutes notes.....awesome stuff......BRILLIANT !!!!!!!


I just saw this.. Thanks so much! I really journal this 10% to track info 30% to learn new things and 60% to help folks doing the same thing. When I started every journal was difficult to read and I had to source information for my first grow from dozens of threads.. Very time consuming to say the least.

Im glad you could find this thread and take some information from it!

You guys are welcome to share photos or ask any questions you'd like.. If I can't answer a subscriber to this thread is more than likely to


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 14, 2012)

Day 49 today

Fed with /gal

15ml tiger bloom
15ml big bloom
4 ml cal mag
5 ml bio weed
@6.7pH
I literally ran out of cal mag and ph up with that feeding  oops gotta get more

[youtube]Xn_9rBl620U[/youtube]


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## Highlanders cave (Feb 15, 2012)

ProAce said:


> Nice grow sr. Verde, how much are you expecting to yield out of your tent? I plan to get a 600 watt light and a 4x4 tent, if I grow in a party cup sog how much do you think I could yield I was thinking that if people can get an o a plant I can be safe to say I will have maybe 7 grams a cup and I can fit 144 in a 4x4 space, idk do you think that it is possible?


I like your enthusiasm but 144 party cups is not realistic and you would be a slave to your plants. You could use something like half gal milk cartons and do 50 or so and prolly end up with the same yield with half the work.

Hey I got your pm bro, no problemo I would be happy to set you up : !) Talk to ya


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 15, 2012)

Highlanders cave said:


> I like your enthusiasm but 144 party cups is not realistic and you would be a slave to your plants. You could use something like half gal milk cartons and do 50 or so and prolly end up with the same yield with half the work.
> 
> Hey I got your pm bro, no problemo I would be happy to set you up : !) Talk to ya


I agree. Less is more! Especially with cannabis plants..

I believe i touched on mature plants going into flower vs immature plants going into flower... The mature will do better and yield better...


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## ProAce (Feb 15, 2012)

Highlanders cave said:


> I like your enthusiasm but 144 party cups is not realistic and you would be a slave to your plants. You could use something like half gal milk cartons and do 50 or so and prolly end up with the same yield with half the work.
> 
> Hey I got your pm bro, no problemo I would be happy to set you up : !) Talk to ya


Thanks so much bro! Great info, I'm kinda a heavy smoker so being able to produce a good amount of high quality cannabis is my goal here and I think with help from this forums members I can do it. Talk to you soon bro thanks,


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 17, 2012)

Starting day 52 later on today.. 26 days left... I think it's safe to say the plant will just be chilling for the rest of the grow with no additional leaf damage.. Flowers look fine, trim should be good enough for some oil.  I just fed a little, 10-15mL tiger bloom..big bloom.. ill keep bringing the food down and just not feed the last 10 or so days.. with a few flushes between those days..

I'm watching the foliage yellow out very naturally. Love it, it reminds me of fall. 

[youtube]OCcUXEC5_eU[/youtube]

On another note, for our next adventure..

I've decided I'm going to start some *pineapple express *on march 2nd... Germ em, plant em, get them started on a few true sets of leaves under 100w t5... then 14 days later chop down the RP headband (assuming 78 day flower) and then put the pineapple express in the tent under TWO 100w t5s for veg. Hopefully that will make them veg a bit faster.. (I only used one for two plants last time! Dumb! Took too long.)

Pineapple Express is supposedly 50-60 day flowering plants.. So I'm hoping to have meds from that by june for the summer... I'm hoping to avoid running lights in the heat of summer.


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## Someguy15 (Feb 17, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> Starting day 52 later on today.. 26 days left... I think it's safe to say the plant will just be chilling for the rest of the grow with no additional leaf damage.. Flowers look fine, trim should be good enough for some oil.  I just fed a little, 10-15mL tiger bloom..big bloom.. ill keep bringing the food down and just not feed the last 10 or so days.. with a few flushes between those days..
> 
> I'm watching the foliage yellow out very naturally. Love it, it reminds me of fall.
> 
> ...


Nice choice my friend. I have been growing the PE for 12 rounds, she is my flagship strain. Very stable line from what I have seen too. My pheno is 56 days on the spot pretty much every time. She will need support in flower if your growing heavy colas tho, so stick with scrog or have somethin planned. O and she bushes really nice naturally. Top her once at about 3 weeks veg and then let em ride. How many you planning to do in the GL60? 4 again?


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 17, 2012)

Two sizeable plants is my plan, like this run...

SCROG. I want to make a better screen for the next run... Though the one I'm using now is quite nice..

12 rounds is a lot! Any harvest pics?


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## Someguy15 (Feb 18, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> Two sizeable plants is my plan, like this run...
> 
> SCROG. I want to make a better screen for the next run... Though the one I'm using now is quite nice..
> 
> 12 rounds is a lot! Any harvest pics?


Some, check out my pic album in the sig. tons of eye candy over the past year or two.

As for the screen, make a PVC one and get the clamps like I do. Then you can drill your own holes, and string it yourself at whatever size you want. I like 2" squares for the GL60. I used Mason string over in the masonry section at lowes/depo, like 500ft is $5 I think. Just make sure you melt the ends with a lighter. It will frey apart if you don't.


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 18, 2012)

credits to someguy15






Thats hella dope... thats what i was going to set up a 2kw flower garden for.. the space fell through for now im still looking though got the capital for the equip .

I'll have to comb through your thread to see if you posted any instructions for that.. I'd love to replicate it with the clamps down to a smaller scale


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## Ge7Som3 (Feb 18, 2012)

Cant Wait to see the finished product and the Pineapple!!


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## Someguy15 (Feb 18, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> credits to someguy15
> 
> Thats hella dope... thats what i was going to set up a 2kw flower garden for.. the space fell through for now im still looking though got the capital for the equip .
> 
> I'll have to comb through your thread to see if you posted any instructions for that.. I'd love to replicate it with the clamps down to a smaller scale


Here's my GL60 tent and the screen, you should be able to see the little clamps. They are near the wood working/tool section at the depo. Kinda pricey, but fuck what else u gonna do right lol I think $2eax8 so $16. Other than that you need 1x10ft 3/4" pvc, 4x 3/4" elbows and the 500ft of mason thread.



more @ https://picasaweb.google.com/110253852692039295916/BlueMisticWaterfarmSideProject250wCMH?authkey=Gv1sRgCO-SzYbXpb3OxQE


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 18, 2012)

Day 53 flower

Fed with /gal h2o

Cal Mag 7mL

solution pH @ 6.8

These girls are really taking off now  Late bloomers for sure.

















underneath






Some popcorn, still looking real nice.






#2 cola under HPS






They are on schedule for sure though, #2 will get chopped before #1 most likely.. #1 looks to be about a week behind #2 in swelling. Pistils are turning really nice Id say its 25% turned pistils on #2 10% on #1.


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 18, 2012)

Someguy15 said:


> Here's my GL60 tent and the screen, you should be able to see the little clamps. They are near the wood working/tool section at the depo. Kinda pricey, but fuck what else u gonna do right lol I think $2eax8 so $16. Other than that you need 1x10ft 3/4" pvc, 4x 3/4" elbows and the 500ft of mason thread.
> 
> View attachment 2067085
> 
> more @ https://picasaweb.google.com/110253852692039295916/BlueMisticWaterfarmSideProject250wCMH?authkey=Gv1sRgCO-SzYbXpb3OxQE


Awesome  Yeah i've been through your thread already I think... when I was eyeing the different 2k journals on RIU & making an equipment list... I was thinking, "man i'm totally going to replicate this guys screen" So it's awesome that it's actually you helping me with this . 


Those materials aren't bad! So you cut the PVC into measured sections.. Drill holes 2 inches apart and run the screen like a tennis racket?


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## Someguy15 (Feb 18, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> Awesome  Yeah i've been through your thread already I think... when I was eyeing the different 2k journals on RIU & making an equipment list... I was thinking, "man i'm totally going to replicate this guys screen" So it's awesome that it's actually you helping me with this .
> 
> 
> Those materials aren't bad! So you cut the PVC into measured sections.. Drill holes 2 inches apart and run the screen like a tennis racket?


Exactly my man. And that's what these forums are all about, helping people learn, sharing ideas, debating ect. Anytime I can help someone out it's a great sense of accomplishment. I'd say for the whole screen your only looking at about 30-35 dollars worth of materials. It will reward you with a even canopy; I'm sure will you yield that much back haha.

edit: Just saw the pics damn they are looking awesome, its like the bud is freaking packed in there lol...you worried about the bottoms not getting enough light? going to do the partial harvest maybe? Just seein what the final plan is here. I'm tellin ya the #2 is where it's at, but let me know your opinion when it's done. Does the #1 or the #2 have more of a fuely smell when u rub the trim leaves?


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 18, 2012)

day 53 lights off


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## Michael Phelps (Feb 19, 2012)

Looking good man! You can really tell those calyxes are starting to swell.. 



What are the trichomes looking like?


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 19, 2012)

Michael Phelps said:


> Looking good man! You can really tell those calyxes are starting to swell..
> 
> 
> 
> What are the trichomes looking like?


Super trippy.. So coated its hard to describe.

I'll have to show better pics of the trichs at harvest!


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## TheTruSmokr (Feb 19, 2012)

Nice thread man...Subbed up for this one


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 19, 2012)

Hmmmmm.... Yeah RIU server must be messed... I chopped 12 days ago.. that stinks. all those pics are gone I don't really feel like putting them back up

Anyway had to take them outta the jars today so I weighed it at 220g... after dipping into it pretty heavy this week.. so it might have been like 230 if i didn't touch it?  That's all flower.. no trim in that math..

250w doing work! I'm set on meds for a bit now! Stuff is great, definitely headstash.


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## C.Indica (Mar 21, 2012)

Picked up my 250w system the other day.

Not setting it up quite yet, but I'm gonna pick up a 250w CMH.
Building a box 2'x2'x5'.



At least repost one juice harvest shot!


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## imagreenwitya (Mar 22, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> Hmmmmm.... Yeah RIU server must be messed... I chopped 12 days ago.. that stinks. all those pics are gone I don't really feel like putting them back up
> 
> Anyway had to take them outta the jars today so I weighed it at 220g... after dipping into it pretty heavy this week.. so it might have been like 230 if i didn't touch it?  That's all flower.. no trim in that math..
> 
> 250w doing work! I'm set on meds for a bit now! Stuff is great, definitely headstash.


Wow, great yield. Bummer about the data loss


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## jonnynobody (Mar 22, 2012)

Love the grow and the fact that you did this all under a 250w makes it even more badass. I'm sorry if I missed it through the pages but what kind / size of grow tent do you have there? Lookin forward to a stealth tent grow myself down the road....I just hope I can get my girls looking as good as yours.


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## Someguy15 (Mar 22, 2012)

jonnynobody said:


> Love the grow and the fact that you did this all under a 250w makes it even more badass. I'm sorry if I missed it through the pages but what kind / size of grow tent do you have there? Lookin forward to a stealth tent grow myself down the road....I just hope I can get my girls looking as good as yours.


I'm pretty sure it's a Growlab GL60. 2x2 footprint, 5'3" tall. Best lights for it I've found are a 2ft 8 tube T5 or 250w HPS/CMH. I'm sure there are leds that would work too, but I'm not too familiar with those.


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## jonnynobody (Mar 22, 2012)

That's friggin sweet b/c I found 'em for sale @ less than $100 online which is well within my budget. I was looking at some of those secret jardins and they're just too damned expensive. Nice to see a fat yield out of a relatively modest size tent.


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 23, 2012)

Yep 2x2x5 (5.3ft) as described in the title 




Just planted some Pineapple Express seeds in a clean tent.. Dusted the shit out of my tent, pulled it out, remounted electronics etc... I'm going to the hydro store to look at new reflectors, going to upgrade my inline fan hopefully to a can fan or vortex 6 inch.... then also swap out the carbon filter with a 6 incher.

One of the pineapple express seeds had an inch long taproot, the other looked cracked right down the middle... Either its a dead seed or it JUST cracked 2 days into germination... Either way, I planted them both and germed ANOTHER seed just in case #2 doesn't come through the soil.. I will have a backup seed


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## jonnynobody (Mar 23, 2012)

Good action there Verde, pineapple express is a fine strain...picked up a bit from a local dispensary last october and it did not disappoint. Can't wait to get my own tent up and running so I can contribute a journal of my own. All I know is I couldn't possibly do any worse than I did on my last grow a ways back =]

Did that 4" filter & fan combo not workout well? I hear the 6" vortex fans can be quite effective but very noisy...not so sure about the noise level on the can fans tho. I would think for a 250w that a 4" high quality fan / filter combo would do the trick but I've never grown in an enclosed environment so I couldn't say for sure.


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 24, 2012)

Well it happened - I upgraded...

Sorry guys, moving on up to a 400w.... I kind of figured out I can do it, just required some extra room.

I was super tired of my crappy 250w hood, so I went to the store to look for new hoods only to find the 6 inch reflectors were about 23 inches across with the flanges...

SO I bought a GL80, it's 2'7x2'7x5'11... It's a serious tent! Has windows on the front of it and all.

I'm hooking up a 400w Hortilux with a Super Sun II reflector, galaxy 400w ballast, 6 inch 370cfm inline fan, 400cfm Phresh Filter, and a fan controller... 370cfm will probably be too much for a 400w but I figured the CF is rated for 400, and I'll just put a fan controller on it 

The first pineapple express came through the soil today.. I'll call it day 1 when they're both through the soil... I had to plant a newly germenated seed last night as the other one never produced a tap root. The new seed germinated in 20 hours with an inch long tap root , so it should be coming through next!

Wish me luck folks! I had to push some furniture around for the extra 7inches, but I think it will be worth it...

Thoughts?


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## tehgenoc1de (Mar 24, 2012)

Looking snazzy, dude. I like the GrowLab tents, great quality. 

Good luck. Should be in for a treat.


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 24, 2012)

this is two under scrog under 250w... 2x2x5'3






what will happen with 400w...2'7x2'7x5.3? :O


(250w) 30500 lumens vs (400w)55000 lumens


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## johnyutah (Mar 24, 2012)

DO you only do 2 plants because 4 is a pain in the ass to water? how do you water? did u really almost go 1GPW with a 250? How many days total did the grow pictured about take??????

oh ya... epic move up to 400! I would get a small intake fan. pull some fresh air under the canopy. 

are u gonna do CO2 this run? if so i would not get a small intake fan to pull some fresh air under the canopy.


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 24, 2012)

Nope no co2... not a sealed enviornment..

I do two plants because its easy, and what fit best under the 250w... I might move up to three after this Pineapple express run but we will see.. I plan to just veg big..

i chopped around 72 days? strain is reserva privada headband..

& i water with 1gal water jugs


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## Gastanker (Mar 24, 2012)

Woot woot! Upgrading is always a good thing. Considering the weight you pull with a 250 I can't wait to see what you do with a 400. So how long till a 600 or 1kW?


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## johnyutah (Mar 25, 2012)

Questions about last grow: What size pots were used? How much water per pot? How Often did you Water? How many days did you vegetate your plants, and how many days did u flower your plants?


I have been accustomed to 3 gal pots, in particular black Maxipots. I use a round-up 1 gallon chemical sprayer to water my plants. The sprayer has a long wand with an adjustable brass tip that exerts a fine mist. I water my plants every 2-4 days with about 1/2 gallon per 3 gallon pot.


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 25, 2012)

Gastanker said:


> Woot woot! Upgrading is always a good thing. Considering the weight you pull with a 250 I can't wait to see what you do with a 400. So how long till a 600 or 1kW?



Right 


But hey, so this GL80's vent holes seem to be about 5 inches.... I cant stuff the 6 inch ducting in there, for the outtake... I'm hanging my fan inside the tent, and blowing air through the hood and out the tent.

I guess I have to get a 6 inch to 4 inch steel fitting, and I have to stick it up into that vent hole to downconvert to 4 inch, and then buy some 4 inch ducting to route the air out of the tent?

Am I looking at problems going from 6 inch to 4 right at the exhaust, or should I try to figure out some other way?

Using a 6 inch max fan 330CFM


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## Gastanker (Mar 25, 2012)

You'll lose quite a bit of airflow with the 6" to 4" but you'll still have plenty for a 400w light. My tent only has 4" sleeves so I always have a 4" bottleneck and it's never stopped me from cooling my 600 or 1kW.


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 25, 2012)

Yeah that's what I figured...

Turns out the exhaust sleeves are 5 inches... so I should get a 6 inch to 5 inch? Then vent out with the 5 inch?

It's disappointing that they make these so small, even though there is so many types of venting.


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## tehgenoc1de (Mar 25, 2012)

Yeah go 6 to 5 with 5 inch ducting. Should be just fine with that fan.


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 25, 2012)

Awesome.. Hope they carry the 6 to 5 at the hydro store!

Then should I foil tape the ducting to the adapter, or clamp it?

PS: pineapple express is through the soil... both seedlings have begun photosynthesis! new thread coming up tonight! will be as detailed as this one


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 25, 2012)

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/515810-growlab-80-g13-pineapple-express.html

New journal! Click the link and +sub 


I've got 200w of fluorescent bulbs for veg, and pots about 4x bigger to start... Should be a better, faster, more enjoyable veg . Flower should be great too! Pineapple express!


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## Sr. Verde (Apr 2, 2012)

Reserva Privada headband... 72 day flower.... photo of 3.5 gram nugget *after 4 weeks of curing...* Will go another 2 weeks before I write a smoke report.. I believe 6 weeks is optimal, 8 weeks is great . 








Will be blasting trim to BHO in 2 weeks also.


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## Ge7Som3 (Apr 2, 2012)

Looks So Yummy!!


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## Sr. Verde (Apr 2, 2012)

Thanks 

It's so yummy.. like sour candy.... Smell is no longer cut grass... Building up stronger and stronger each day.


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## Ge7Som3 (Apr 3, 2012)

Awesome! Hopefully mine turns out as bomb! GL on the Pineapple also ill be locked in.


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## Sr. Verde (Apr 3, 2012)

Dammit i wish i could like.....

"Sr. Verde likes this."


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## Sr. Verde (Jun 5, 2012)

Half of this thread got deleted, I posted lots of pictures after day 50 but they were lost..

Anyway, for anyone finding this later, this is how they ended up at day 72. Photo _right_ before chop.


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## jonnynobody (Jun 9, 2012)

Sr. Verde said:


> Well it happened - I upgraded...
> 
> Sorry guys, moving on up to a 400w.... I kind of figured out I can do it, just required some extra room.
> 
> ...


That there is one sweet setup guy! I can see you spared no expense going with all quality gear. I hope to have something similar in the next couple of months...your thread is a damn fine inspiration.


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## Hettyman (Jun 18, 2012)

Nice grow, and a good read.

Especially liked the cradle you made for CFL Y-splitter using cable ties/zip ties.... i'm stealing that idea


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## Sr. Verde (Jun 18, 2012)

Hettyman said:


> Nice grow, and a good read.
> 
> Especially liked the cradle you made for CFL Y-splitter using cable ties/zip ties.... i'm stealing that idea


Awesome! Yeah I forgot about that. I just get medicated and play with zip ties in the tent . You can use them everywhere I'd advise you to pick up a tube of the different sizes for like $10 at Home Depot you get like 500-800 zip ties.


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## Hettyman (Jun 18, 2012)

Its cool, I always have a good stock of them cos they're so usefull for everything. Also the survivalist (paranoid) in me forced my to learn how to escape if they've been used as hand cuffs... cos, well you never know  hahaha 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZvEXcRE4BU


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## PaulN'Chuck (Sep 2, 2012)

What was the final weight?


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## doubletake (Jan 30, 2013)

I'm gamma have to call b.s on 220 grams dry people have trouble doing that in 5 gallon dwc buckets (a qp per plant) no way could he do that with a 250 watt in that small of a space.


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## Sr. Verde (Jan 30, 2013)

whatever ya wanna think man  this is an old thread and I didn't win anything . just reporting my numbers... by the way 250w + 82w cfl.

.658 g / w


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## doubletake (Jan 31, 2013)

Shit man if ya did it that's crazy you think scrog beats sog any day, I like the no veg time, but your yields are killing it compared to my sog


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 1, 2013)

Yeah I did veg for a long time. 40-60 days? Low intensity light though..


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