# Who Was Jesus? What Did He Teach? Letting His Words Do The Talking!



## crackerboy (Dec 12, 2010)

[video=youtube;fLKIRwkCusc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLKIRwkCusc[/video]


This thread is not about debate. This thread is to simply let the words of Jesus speak for them selves. There is no evil in Jesus. Let his words guide your actions.


----------



## Japanfreak (Dec 12, 2010)

Jesus has a youtube account?


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 13, 2010)

Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God. Mathew 5:9


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 13, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> Jesus has a youtube account?


 its called an intro


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 13, 2010)

Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Mathew 5:10


----------



## Japanfreak (Dec 13, 2010)

I know but what I'm suggesting is that we don't have any clue to what Jesus actually wrote because he didn't put it down to paper. Not saying that what is written is bad, just that I don't accept it as from the horses mouth so to speak.


----------



## baaamalaaam (Dec 13, 2010)

These threads are really irritating. 
READ: Food of the Gods by Terence McKenna.
PLEASE!


----------



## Crimble (Dec 13, 2010)

The story of "Jesus", is the story of our Earth's Sun progressing through the Zodiac, just like the story of Orion the Hunter is not about a man who hunted, the story of Jesus was a way for people to track the times for growing and harvesting throughout the year.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 13, 2010)

You are those who justify yourselves before men, but God knows your hearts. For what is highly esteemed among men is an abomination in the sight of God. Luke 16:15


----------



## baaamalaaam (Dec 13, 2010)

It bothers me when christians spout bible verses and expect that alone to hold water as an "argument." 
Can't you think for yourself? 
The bible can be equated to software. Cultural data packs and ideologies and doctrines that--somewhere along the line of history--benefitted their creators.
Religion is used to control and suppress masses. Is it any surprise that there is a direct correlation between increased instances of low-IQ in societies with greater prevalence of religion?
Use your HARDWARE for once. Use what you already have in your skull--what you were born with--instead of relying on ancient, convoluted texts. Your religion exists OUTSIDE your mind, in the form of text written and translated by imperfect Man. Be self-informed and listen to your intuition and senses. Concern yourself with being a human.


----------



## Grumpy Old Dreamer (Dec 13, 2010)

Wasn't jesus an overtly gay homosexual with a foot fetish?


----------



## Tym (Dec 13, 2010)

[video=youtube;LACyLTsH4ac]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LACyLTsH4ac[/video]


----------



## Saerimmner (Dec 13, 2010)

very simply jesus was a terrorist, (crucifixion was reserved solely for the enemies of the state) he cut off a roman legionnaires arm in the garden of gethsemine (so much for meek n mild eh?) and was sentenced to die by crucifixion for that very offence which was well witnessed and documented in many towns/cities public records( roman records are commonly acknowledged as some of the most complete of any past civilisation to date) so there we go, this is in no way my opinion just a matter of fact that is well documented in public records


----------



## Japanfreak (Dec 13, 2010)

baaamalaaam said:


> Religion is used to control and suppress masses. Is it any surprise that there is a direct correlation between increased instances of low-IQ in societies with greater prevalence of religion?


That's a conclusion that the studies didn't make, that's all yours there. Kind of a huge jump in logic as well.


----------



## upthearsenal (Dec 13, 2010)

Tym said:


> [video=youtube;LACyLTsH4ac]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LACyLTsH4ac[/video]


This documentary is frightening...

Edit: from the clip "Harry Potter would have been put to death!"

"Amen"

"Amen!"

::applause::


----------



## baaamalaaam (Dec 13, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> That's a conclusion that the studies didn't make, that's all yours there. Kind of a huge jump in logic as well.


To which studies do you refer, lol?
Explain to me your logic.


----------



## Japanfreak (Dec 13, 2010)

The studies that you were referring to I presume. Prove of burden is on the side of the person making the argument. The studies did find that the average IQ was lower among the religious but that says nothing about the validity of religion.


----------



## Tym (Dec 13, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> The studies that you were referring to I presume. Prove of burden is on the side of the person making the argument. The studies did find that the average IQ was lower among the religious but that says nothing about the validity of religion.


Uh.. He never made the claim that it has anything to do with the validity..


----------



## Japanfreak (Dec 13, 2010)

Excuse me, I'm used to looking past words and to the message.


----------



## Tym (Dec 13, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> Excuse me, I'm used to looking past words and to the message.


Very well then. Please explain how you came to that conclusion. Simply implying that is what he was saying isn't enough. I read the same text and didn't get that message from it. Please tell me where he posited that claim.


----------



## Japanfreak (Dec 13, 2010)

I'm not here to educate you, if you don't get it you don't get it.


----------



## Basshead (Dec 13, 2010)

I believe Jesus is the Creative Force in the Universe in the Christian Definition. And Creativity Rules.


----------



## Japanfreak (Dec 13, 2010)

Even though I'm an atheist I always find it odd when I see people arguing about religion being about controlling people. Still killing and raping going on, they just must be really really bad at it.


----------



## mindphuk (Dec 13, 2010)

baaamalaaam said:


> These threads are really irritating.
> READ: Food of the Gods by Terence McKenna.
> PLEASE!


 Looks interesting.


----------



## Padawanbater2 (Dec 13, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> Even though I'm an atheist I always find it odd when I see people arguing about religion being about controlling people. Still killing and raping going on, they just must be really really bad at it.


I think organized religion is about controlling people.


----------



## Japanfreak (Dec 14, 2010)

Control to what end? You may as well say that Children's story books are about controlling people, like oh wow!


----------



## Tym (Dec 14, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> I'm not here to educate you, if you don't get it you don't get it.


No no. I get what your saying. But he never said that. You said he did. You made the claim, back it up.

I can read in between the lines too. You just said "I cannot possibly defend my statement so I will just pretend you are the one who made the error". Oh what you didn't say that? See how easy it is to put words in peoples mouths? Defend you statement or admit you're wrong. Trying to dismiss a valid argument on the grounds of a privileged understanding is useless unless you can explain how it is you came to that understanding. You might as well say "Cause I said so".


----------



## Japanfreak (Dec 14, 2010)

You missed the bigger meaning of his words, try again.


----------



## mindphuk (Dec 14, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> You missed the bigger meaning of his words, try again.


 Dude, you're reading things into a post that were never said. Tym pointed that out and now you are arguing for argument's sake. 
A poster made a comment about religion being used for control and pointed to the correlation between lower intelligence and religion. You came in and said that the studies didn't make that conclusion. When asked what conclusion that would be, you responded about the validity of religion. Well, no one claimed that was the conclusion of the study. I believe the rhetorical question had more to do with the idea that keeping people ignorant is one way to control them. Possibly he meant that people with lower intelligence are more credulous. I don't know but Tym pointed out that no one claimed anything pointed to whether to not religious belief is valid. He called you out on it, asked you to explain your logic, and now just being a dick by refusing to accommodate the request.


----------



## Tym (Dec 14, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> You missed the bigger meaning of his words, try again.


No, you projected meaning into something that wasn't there. Make all the claims you want, until you actually point out what the hell it is you are talking about, and how that necessarily means what you think it means, you have nothing. The "Bigger meaning" is non existent. You've spent more time telling me I missed something that isn't there than it would have taken you to prove your claim..

It's ok to be an ignorant fool. Just don't expect anyone to take you seriously.


----------



## Japanfreak (Dec 14, 2010)

All that to say nothing eh? Big thinkers in here. Like I said, don't get pissed if you can't see the logical end to the bullshit the guy posted. Maybe you should stick to linking other people's ideas.


----------



## mindphuk (Dec 14, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> All that to say nothing eh? Big thinkers in here. Like I said, don't get pissed if you can't see the logical end to the bullshit the guy posted. Maybe you should stick to linking other people's ideas.


 If you can't see that in order to be logical, you should be able to defend your position by detailing the steps you used to reach the conclusion. So far all you have done is make assertions and an ad hominem saying that if anyone else doesn't understand how you reached the conclusion, it must be our fault. 

Sorry, but your logic-fu is weak.


----------



## Tym (Dec 14, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> All that to say nothing eh? Big thinkers in here. Like I said, don't get pissed if you can't see the logical end to the bullshit the guy posted. Maybe you should stick to linking other people's ideas.


Hey Japanfreak, I have an idea.. How about you address the valid criticisms we brought up in a logical and civil manner? Surely such an intelligent man as yourself is capable of having a reasonable conversation?
Surely you're not going to hide your massive intellect behind name calling and ignorance?

I'm just wondering, how does it feel to walk into a thread full of logical, free thinking, intelligent people and have nothing to say buy ad hominem attacks? How does it feel to be unable to defend yourself against people obviously way beyond your level of intelligence? How does it feel to just ignore valid points and strive to tighten your vale of ignorance to the point where you can't make one, single, valid argument?


----------



## Japanfreak (Dec 14, 2010)

mindphuk said:


> If you can't see that in order to be logical, you should be able to defend your position by detailing the steps you used to reach the conclusion. So far all you have done is make assertions and an ad hominem saying that if anyone else doesn't understand how you reached the conclusion, it must be our fault.
> 
> Sorry, but your logic-fu is weak.


Of course, I'm just not interested in helping some kid see the bigger picture. You guys can go back to your circle jerk now.


----------



## Japanfreak (Dec 14, 2010)

Tym said:


> Hey Japanfreak, I have an idea.. How about you address the valid criticisms we brought up in a logical and civil manner? Surely such an intelligent man as yourself is capable of having a reasonable conversation?
> Surely you're not going to hide your massive intellect behind name calling and ignorance?
> 
> I'm just wondering, how does it feel to walk into a thread full of logical, free thinking, intelligent people and have nothing to say buy ad hominem attacks? How does it feel to be unable to defend yourself against people obviously way beyond your level of intelligence? How does it feel to just ignore valid points and strive to tighten your vale of ignorance to the point where you can't make one, single, valid argument?


Grow up for christs sake


----------



## Tym (Dec 14, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> Grow up for christs sake


I rest my case.


----------



## Japanfreak (Dec 14, 2010)

baaamalaaam said:


> Can't you think for yourself?





baaamalaaam said:


> READ: Food of the Gods by Terence McKenna.
> PLEASE!



Once again, you guys don't think for yourselves as far as I can see, just argue over something missing the bigger picture but I realize that in this day and age if you can link a google video it makes you hot shit


----------



## Tym (Dec 14, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> Once again, you guys don't think for yourselves as far as I can see, just argue over something missing the bigger picture but I realize that in this day and age if you can link a google video it makes you hot shit


Lol this thread is 4 pages long dude, it's not all about you.

Once again, you prove your ignorance and your inability to defend you claims. Something I found, you are quite good at.


----------



## mrdrywall (Dec 14, 2010)

Grumpy Old Dreamer said:


> Wasn't jesus an overtly gay homosexual with a foot fetish?


 ha too funny i think your right


----------



## Japanfreak (Dec 14, 2010)

Tym said:


> Lol this thread is 4 pages long dude, it's not all about you.
> 
> Once again, you prove your ignorance and your inability to defend you claims. Something I found, you are quite good at.



You don't exactly impress me there sparky.


----------



## Tym (Dec 14, 2010)

[video=youtube;d0A4_bwCaX0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0A4_bwCaX0[/video]


----------



## Padawanbater2 (Dec 14, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> Control to what end? You may as well say that Children's story books are about controlling people, like oh wow!


It keeps people ignorant, ignorant people are easier to control.

How many atheists do you see in the military? Why is that?...


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

WTF..... So much ignorance and intolerance. Once again you all have clearly shown that it's the atheist
That are the oppressor. I specifically asked that this not turn into a hate fest. What is really sad is that most of you are Americans.
Its a shame that this what America has become.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

Pad the reason atheist don't join the military is Most likely because they are selfish cowards. The only reason your allowed to spew such bullshit is because people fight and die for your rights.


----------



## guy incognito (Dec 14, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> Control to what end? You may as well say that Children's story books are about controlling people, like oh wow!


Controlling by telling them what they can think and do. You cannot have impure thoughts, you must worship god on sunday, etc. More than controlling your life it's controlling your inner most thoughts.

I think Jesus was an all around good guy though. If you have read any of my posts in this sub-forum you know i'm atheist. I still consider "what would jesus do?" a good question to ask yourself. I don't think he was a god, but in general I think "jesus" would do the right and honorable thing in most situations. Sometimes when friends come up with shitty things they want to do (in my opinion) I just ask them what jesus would do in their situation.


----------



## Wordz (Dec 14, 2010)

I think all atheists should have there heads chopped off for the blasphemy they spew from there mouths on a daily basis. God is punishing our country right now for electing a muslim into the presidency. For the sake of everyone's soul on the planet we need to elect palin next time.


----------



## guy incognito (Dec 14, 2010)

Don't blame me, I did a write in for Jesus.


----------



## Padawanbater2 (Dec 14, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> WTF..... So much ignorance and intolerance. Once again you all have clearly shown that it's the atheist That are the oppressor. I specifically asked that this not turn into a hate fest. What is really sad is that most of you are Americans.
> Its a shame that this what America has become.


Denial isn't just a river in Egypt bro.

Organized religion keeps people ignorant to real world facts. You, for instance, don't accept evolution even though a few of us _evil _atheists have attempted to explain it to you. It's real, it happens, yet you refuse to acknowledge it. Same thing most likely goes for the big bang and any other scientific theory that conflicts with the beliefs organized religion has instilled into you. And there are millions of others just like you. I come into contact with some of them on a daily basis and it blows my mind how absolutely stupid some people can be and still be able to function as a part of society. 

America has become what it is today *because* of organized religion and the unintended, yes, but that doesn't make it any less damaging, consequences people like you refuse to accept. Our population is retarded because parents pull their kids out of science class when evolution gets brought up, they don't want them to hear the facts because their authority could come into question. Because kids spend 5 hours a day in front of a tv instead of actually being raised by their parents because parents in our society don't have the time to spend teaching and raising their kids and also making a living to support them and put food on the table all at the same time.

How you don't see that Christianity specifically has stifled progress in our country since it's creation is beyond me. You're fuckin' blind crackerboy. 
 


crackerboy said:


> Pad the reason atheist don't join the military is Most likely because they are selfish cowards. The only reason your allowed to spew such bullshit is because people fight and die for your rights.


Well, interesting conclusion, but again, obviously wrong. 

Anyone who goes off to fight and die for a country who lies to them is a mindless drone who deserves everything they get on the battlefield. 

The reason atheists don't join the military in the numbers believers do is because we only have ONE life and it would be a waste to die for something or someone you can't even see and have never even met because society says it's the ''honorable'' thing to do. Fuck society. Fuck anyone right in their arrogant self righteous mouth who thinks that way. Go ahead and believe it, it doesn't make you any less dead in the end.

Edit: Also got a kick out of the irony of you believing it to be selfish to _NOT_ go off into foreign lands and murder other people... so selfish indeed! (idiot!)


----------



## trishmybiscuits (Dec 14, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> [video=youtube;fLKIRwkCusc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLKIRwkCusc[/video]
> 
> 
> This thread is not about debate. This thread is to simply let the words of Jesus speak for them selves. There is no evil in Jesus. Let his words guide your actions.


I've got news for you. Christianlty was debinked once and for all back in 2008:

http://www.unintimidatedpress.com/christianity.htm


----------



## upthearsenal (Dec 14, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> WTF..... So much ignorance and intolerance. Once again you all have clearly shown that it's the atheist
> That are the oppressor. I specifically asked that this not turn into a hate fest. What is really sad is that most of you are Americans.
> Its a shame that this what America has become.





crackerboy said:


> Pad the reason atheist don't join the military is Most likely because they are selfish cowards. The only reason your allowed to spew such bullshit is because people fight and die for your rights.



Why do you make yourself out to be some polite little shit who is anything but ignorant in one post... "oh look at what america has become" and then moments later you insult atheists as a whole, you sir, are a fucking bigot.


----------



## bunnyface (Dec 14, 2010)

hey,,yeah there was a man called jesus, but he wasnt a christian or jew, he was a buddist.
let me explain, in a lot of ancient text, such as the bible and koran to name two have references to this man. 
In the buddist religon when a new dila-lama is needed 3 elders are sent to follow a star to guide them to a baby to be selected and taken at the age of seven to be taught the ways of the budda. hence the wise men, hence why there are no account of jesus as a teen in the bible,,he is just an adult when he re appears.
also alot of his teachings or preachs are stolen from buddist pro verbs and just re- worded. 
also jesus never died on the cross, he was simply close to death and when they took thing to 'bamb that body in the cave it was more like actual meds and revival herbs to make him better. so he didnt rise again just recovered. crusification as we know it from the romans take a long time to fully kill someone. jesus wasnt on there long enough. 
anway as he disappeared there is evidence of a tomb. some where in nepal or tibet around there, are to graves of anicent dila-lama's. 
one grave is facing south north,,one east west, which is unusal, anyway these graves have foot imprints cast in bronze of the feet of the dila-lamas. One of these has stange scars on the foot sole which are slighty indented and slight off set. if the feet where crossed they would match to lap over each other if the feet where place as such,,like on the cross. 
These are all facts about jesus,, the man who did preach good and helped peolpe. the buddist had a different name for him, but the koran, bible, have him as a saint or 'son of god' when infact he was a buddist preist. buddism being atleast 2,000years older than hinduism,let alone christianity.


----------



## IAm5toned (Dec 14, 2010)

bunnyface said:


> hey,,yeah there was a man called jesus, but he wasnt a christian or jew, he was a buddist.
> let me explain, in a lot of ancient text, such as the bible and koran to name two have references to this man.
> In the buddist religon when a new dila-lama is needed 3 elders are sent to follow a star to guide them to a baby to be selected and taken at the age of seven to be taught the ways of the budda. hence the wise men, hence why there are no account of jesus as a teen in the bible,,he is just an adult when he re appears.
> also alot of his teachings or preachs are stolen from buddist pro verbs and just re- worded.
> ...



you better hush or you will be called a liar, a heretic, etc etc etc.

people dont like the truth, its never as interesting as a good story


----------



## Wordz (Dec 14, 2010)

bunnyface said:


> hey,,yeah there was a man called jesus, but he wasnt a christian or jew, he was a buddist.
> let me explain, in a lot of ancient text, such as the bible and koran to name two have references to this man.
> In the buddist religon when a new dila-lama is needed 3 elders are sent to follow a star to guide them to a baby to be selected and taken at the age of seven to be taught the ways of the budda. hence the wise men, hence why there are no account of jesus as a teen in the bible,,he is just an adult when he re appears.
> also alot of his teachings or preachs are stolen from buddist pro verbs and just re- worded.
> ...


umm... buddhism isn't older than hinduism fact.


----------



## bunnyface (Dec 14, 2010)

Padawanbater2 said:


> Denial isn't just a river in Egypt bro.
> 
> Organized religion keeps people ignorant to real world facts. You, for instance, don't accept evolution even though a few of us _evil _atheists have attempted to explain it to you. It's real, it happens, yet you refuse to acknowledge it. Same thing most likely goes for the big bang and any other scientific theory that conflicts with the beliefs organized religion has instilled into you. And there are millions of others just like you. I come into contact with some of them on a daily basis and it blows my mind how absolutely stupid some people can be and still be able to function as a part of society.
> 
> ...



urr not all religons require ignorance. faith is not ignorance, and did a great man not once say, Ignorance is Bliss.?
I am an athesit, beliver in science . I also served In the UK Royal Marines for 4 and a half years,(42 Com) not out of duty, nor some blind faith., I really object over that comment about anyone who dies for a country that lies to them,, that is utter BS, you really dont know what those men and women have scarificed for. Right now the quailty of life in afghan are on the up. 
the US wanted the UK to help because we have expierance in occupying terrortiy. N. Ireland as an example, even though your goverment supplied the IRA with money to make bombs to blow up here in the UK,,but that aside,,,,,,,
and Iraq was a time bomb with Saddam.
Is it wrong to remove a man who commits genocide? the UN batts an eye, The US was the only one who wanted to take action the first time(George Sen.) and yes there may not have been WMDs, but that region all wanted them, hence why Iran has started to inrich used power sorces... but on the saddam front do you think they would of hang him otherwise??
and i dont see how your country is really lying to you. In relation to afghan that is,.....the tailban werent what we went to war for. It was al-quieada(excuse my spelling, im quite high), so we just ended up fighting them cause they were harbouring many of these terrist camps. these camps where established along time ago, back when we were all fighting saddam that first time. 
anyway we could agrue about if its just, or right etc, but I think you have been sniffing captain hindsights bum abit. 
This 'war' isnt a religous war, peolpe find relgion alot more appling if your going to be shot at everyday!!!!!!!
thats why religon was big in the 'olden days' to use that fraise. when life was short, or likly hood of dieing was more and more each day,, 
sorry for the ramble but those, 'idots' who die,,, for you,,,deserve respect,cause they are making the world a better place, GOD or NOT,......... .!!!!!


----------



## bunnyface (Dec 14, 2010)

Wordz said:


> umm... buddhism isn't older than hinduism fact.


yeah sorry,, just reading my book on anicent reilgons,,,,your right sorry bout that im quite high,, no excuse though. 
but this thing says judism,,is 1400 bc, hindism 2000bc, budism 500bc,zoratism 600bc and janism 700-526bc,,(this is abit like budism not with 3 god, to use that term losely, but the looking for souls to be clear of impurities,,has alot of stuff about two cycles, with 24 pure jains being born, they where the propounders of Jainism, where it also clams to be alot older than the 700bc.)
sorry bout that, got these dates from my book,which is publish 2001.


----------



## guy incognito (Dec 14, 2010)

bunnyface said:


> urr not all religons require ignorance. faith is not ignorance, and did a great man not once say, Ignorance is Bliss.?


Faith: 1. strong or unshakeable belief in something, esp without proof or evidence

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/faith?&qsrc=

Ignorant: 1. lacking in knowledge or training; unlearned: an ignorant man. 2. lacking knowledge or information as to a particular subject or fact: ignorant of quantum physics.
3. uninformed; unaware.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/ignorant


----------



## bunnyface (Dec 14, 2010)

IAm5toned said:


> you better hush or you will be called a liar, a heretic, etc etc etc.
> 
> people dont like the truth, its never as interesting as a good story


there is a mob with flaming sticks and pitch forks, there also what looks like a burning effagy??????


----------



## Padawanbater2 (Dec 14, 2010)

bunnyface said:


> urr not all religons require ignorance. faith is not ignorance, and did a great man not once say, Ignorance is Bliss.?


Faith is belief without the evidence to justify it. 

If you believe *anything* without the evidence to justify that belief, you are ignorant. 

Ignorance is *not* bliss. Ignorance is slavery. Stupid people feel comfortable with a lie. I'm here to tell those people the truth is always more comforting, no matter how scary it may seem because it is what's real. 



bunnyface said:


> I really object over that comment about anyone who dies for a country that lies to them,, that is utter BS, you really dont know what those men and women have scarificed for.


You object to my comment about anyone who dies for a country that lies to them is an idiot? I'd love to hear any objections you have.

Those men and women have sacrificed their mobility, future and, in a lot of instances, their lives... but it wasn't for me or for my freedoms. That is a line of propaganda they feed you to make you feel all patriotic. They get paid, just like any other job, people in the military wouldn't do it for free, and the recruitment rates wouldn't be nearly as high as they are without all the government incentives. 



bunnyface said:


> Is it wrong to remove a man who commits genocide?


ROFL! Sudan? Rwanda? Bosnia? Somalia?...

Since when is it our responsibility to police the world?




bunnyface said:


> and i dont see how your country is really lying to you.


Check out the Wikileaks documents



bunnyface said:


> sorry for the ramble but those, 'idots' who die,,, for you,,,deserve respect,cause they are making the world a better place, GOD or NOT,......... .!!!!!


There is a distinction between a soldier and the kind of idiot I'm referring to.


----------



## bunnyface (Dec 14, 2010)

guy incognito said:


> Faith: 1. strong or unshakeable belief in something, esp without proof or evidence
> 
> http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/faith?&qsrc=
> 
> ...


so your saying im ignorant ?? 
hell im not religous in the slightest but,,,,,,you have faith in sicence and are 'ignorant' of reilgon.yes, but so ignorant that its become intorlance. 
I said im not here to agrue,but faith is still different ,in genral ignaorant people have faith in religion, and ignorant people have faith in science, but BOTH are ignorant of the other feelings,,


----------



## bunnyface (Dec 14, 2010)

Padawanbater2 said:


> Faith is belief without the evidence to justify it.
> 
> If you believe *anything* without the evidence to justify that belief, you are ignorant.
> 
> ...


hell this this giong on abit,,, I really cant be asssed arguing anymore ,, WE ALL HAVE BETTER THINGS TO DO.
but to say bout that stuff,,so we agree about the soilders, thats the point I was making
and you say why is it your job? its kinda what you like to do america? haha, I dont mean that, I mean surely as free people we have an obligation to try to make this world better? Im not saying opress fredoms,,just everyone do alittle. seem governments try to do alot.
hell thats why I joined to get paided...loved it too.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

Padawanbater2 said:


> Denial isn't just a river in Egypt bro.
> 
> Organized religion keeps people ignorant to real world facts. You, for instance, don't accept evolution even though a few of us _evil _atheists have attempted to explain it to you. It's real, it happens, yet you refuse to acknowledge it. Same thing most likely goes for the big bang and any other scientific theory that conflicts with the beliefs organized religion has instilled into you. And there are millions of others just like you. I come into contact with some of them on a daily basis and it blows my mind how absolutely stupid some people can be and still be able to function as a part of society.
> 
> ...


 You have no idea what your talking about. let me guess your one of those people that think the CIA crashed those planes into the world trade center. And what else, oh maybe we also bombed pearl harbor ourselves just so we could test a bomb on Japan. Or wait we secretly controlled the Nazi's and made them invade Europe. Your right those are all pointless wars that we sent soldiers to die for no reason. Get a clue. Read a history book instead of some atheist propaganda site.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

trishmybiscuits said:


> I've got news for you. Christianlty was debinked once and for all back in 2008:
> 
> http://www.unintimidatedpress.com/christianity.htm



I won't even waist by breath ripping that thing apart.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

upthearsenal said:


> Why do you make yourself out to be some polite little shit who is anything but ignorant in one post... "oh look at what america has become" and then moments later you insult atheists as a whole, you sir, are a fucking bigot.


I was not the one who came onto a thread and started taking shit. I know that im no saint. But I at least try to be tolerant of everyone. I am usually civil with everyone. But such ignorance deserves a harsh response.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

bunnyface said:


> hey,,yeah there was a man called jesus, but he wasnt a christian or jew, he was a buddist.
> let me explain, in a lot of ancient text, such as the bible and koran to name two have references to this man.
> In the buddist religon when a new dila-lama is needed 3 elders are sent to follow a star to guide them to a baby to be selected and taken at the age of seven to be taught the ways of the budda. hence the wise men, hence why there are no account of jesus as a teen in the bible,,he is just an adult when he re appears.
> also alot of his teachings or preachs are stolen from buddist pro verbs and just re- worded.
> ...



There is so much wrong with this statement I don't even know where to begin. Even if the Buddhist thing is true so what. He was well educated and wise. Just the simple fact that God led the wise men with a star to find Jesus is a miracle in its self. But I don't really buy this story of the Buddhist. First of all the three wise men came from Persia. As for Jesus not being dead on the cross, the soldiers pierced him with a spear just to make sure he was dead. This is all just another bs story used to confuse the masses.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

Saerimmner said:


> very simply jesus was a terrorist, (crucifixion was reserved solely for the enemies of the state) he cut off a roman legionnaires arm in the garden of gethsemine (so much for meek n mild eh?) and was sentenced to die by crucifixion for that very offence which was well witnessed and documented in many towns/cities public records( roman records are commonly acknowledged as some of the most complete of any past civilisation to date) so there we go, this is in no way my opinion just a matter of fact that is well documented in public records



If it is public record, then can you post a link or something cause I'm calling bullshit on this one. I have read extensively on this subject and have never come across this. State your source.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

baaamalaaam said:


> Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaannnnnnnnd
> this.
> This is why I hate these pointless threads.
> Live and let live.



Like I said in the original post. I did not want this to be a debate thread. I just wanted to educate people on what Jesus actually taught. But the intolerant masses on this site just could not allow that.


----------



## Tym (Dec 14, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> If it is public record, then can you post a link or something cause I'm calling bullshit on this one. I have read extensively on this subject and have never come across this. State your source.


Funny how you require and ask for evidence when someone else makes a claim you don't agree with, but you can't provide any of your own when you make a claim.. You sir, are a hypocrite.

If you applied that same standard of evidence in every aspect of your life, this thread wouldn't exist.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

Tym said:


> Funny how you require and ask for evidence when someone else makes a claim you don't agree with, but you can't provide any of your own when you make a claim.. You sir, are a hypocrite.
> 
> If you applied that same standard of evidence in every aspect of your life, this thread wouldn't exist.



I have provided plenty of evidence for what I believe. As a matter of fact I have already posted the answers to everything you have asked. I just did it before you ever posted the questions. I even pointed you to the specific threads that you could find those answers. So while we are both on at the same time. Ask whatever questions you want and I will re answer to shut you up.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

Tym said:


> Funny how you require and ask for evidence when someone else makes a claim you don't agree with, but you can't provide any of your own when you make a claim.. You sir, are a hypocrite.
> 
> If you applied that same standard of evidence in every aspect of your life, this thread wouldn't exist.



You can start here ==> https://www.rollitup.org/spirituality-sexuality-philosophy/383062-share-your-testimony-revelations-god.html


----------



## Tym (Dec 14, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> I have provided plenty of evidence for what I believe. As a matter of fact I have already posted the answers to everything you have asked. I just did it before you ever posted the questions. I even pointed you to the specific threads that you could find those answers. So while we are both on at the same time. Ask whatever questions you want and I will re answer to shut you up.


Yes, you posted invalid answers that have been refuted.. They cannot be accepted as evidence for anything other than your ignorance..


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

Tym said:


> Yes, you posted invalid answers that have been refuted.. They cannot be accepted as evidence for anything other than your ignorance..



oh no, your not getting off that easily. What have you refuted. I have seen no posts from you that directly address any of the issues that I have mentioned. You posted some definitions from wiki thats it. Now you keep hammering away at me about not responding. I am here now so come on what have you got to say other than insults? Les hear it. Which subject would you like to discuss?


----------



## 66FreeSpirit (Dec 14, 2010)

Couldn't have said it any better baaamalaaam! As for cracker boy I think you have some critical thinking to do about your "holy doctrine" and current mythological beliefs. I find it insulting that for what ever reason you took it upon yourself to post about this. If I wanted to be "saved" from damnation and learn about jesus I wouldn't be looking on a marijuana forum. Please refrain from bringing your ideological views into these kinds of situations. With that being said I can appreciate your interest in growing and wish you best the best of luck.


----------



## 66FreeSpirit (Dec 14, 2010)

How about the fact that missionaries are going to third would countries in Africa telling them that they are going to go to hell for using condoms even though 1 out of every 3 persons in some of the countries have AIDS/HIV?


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

66FreeSpirit said:


> How about the fact that missionaries are going to third would countries in Africa telling them that they are going to go to hell for using condoms even though 1 out of every 3 persons in some of the countries have AIDS/HIV?



Do you actually know any missionaries? I do and I promise you that not one of them would do so. I think that your misconceptions and generalizations blind you to the truth. I post this kind of stuff because I continually see people misrepresenting what the Bible actually says. Believe it or not but I get a lot of positive P.M.'s from people all the time on this site. I think that this site needs to see the other point view. People have a very skewed idea of what Christianity really is. I have noticed over and over again that people make claims about the Bible and Jesus that are completely and historically incorrect. Also its the subjects that I enjoy discussing. Why does everyone feel so compelled to silence my freedom of speech?


----------



## mindphuk (Dec 14, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> Do you actually know any missionaries? I do and I promise you that not one of them would do so. I think that your misconceptions and generalizations blind you to the truth. I post this kind of stuff because I continually see people misrepresenting what the Bible actually says. Believe it or not but I get a lot of positive P.M.'s from people all the time on this site. I think that this site needs to see the other point view. People have a very skewed idea of what Christianity really is. I have noticed over and over again that people make claims about the Bible and Jesus that are completely and historically incorrect. Also its the subjects that I enjoy discussing. Why does everyone feel so compelled to silence my freedom of speech?


 Dude, it's the Catholics, the largest denomination of Xtians worldwide. The last pope went on record advising the people of Africa that condoms actually spread AIDS and not to bother with them. In the same speech he also said not to worry about kids "because God will provide for all he creates." http://www.condoms4life.org/facts/lesserEvil.htm


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

mindphuk said:


> Dude, it's the Catholics, the largest denomination of Xtians worldwide. The last pope went on record advising the people of Africa that condoms actually spread AIDS and not to bother with them. In the same speech he also said not to worry about kids "because God will provide for all he creates." http://www.condoms4life.org/facts/lesserEvil.htm



Now I think you may be purposely trying to mislead people. I am not Catholic myself and disagree with a lot of the stances they have been taking. But that article is trying to connect the churches position on abstinence with the HIV crisis unfairly. All the Catholics are saying is that it is better to not have sex out side of marriage. To try and stretch that into something else is just untruthful. The article on several occasions quotes several bishops such as " Bishop Kevin Dowling of Rustenberg, South Africa, raised expectations even higher when he formally announced that the bishops would consider a change in condom policy, noting that people with AIDS had a responsibility not to transmit death. He said, &#8220;When people for whatever reason choose not to follow the values we promote as church&#8212;within and outside of our community&#8212;then the bottom line is the real possibility that a person could transmit a death-dealing virus to another through a sexual encounter. Such people, who are living with the virus, must be invited and challenged to take responsibility for their actions and their effect on others. They should use a condom in order to prevent the transmission of potential death to another.&#8221; Even though this quote is from someone that opposes the Vatican's view it still demonstrates that most Christians are not against using condoms. The Vatican is just trying to promote abstinence since it is the only sure way to prevent the spread of HIV. How ever misguided they might be it is not done for evil. They have good intentions behind the stance they have taken. You can't deny that abstinence is safer than using condoms.


----------



## mindphuk (Dec 14, 2010)

I don't understand how you think I'm misleading people. The pope declared that Catholics shouldn't use condoms. I never said there are people in the church that disagree with the pope. This was about missionaries. The pope teaches that contraception is immoral. Catholic missionaries will follow the pope's decrees. How have I misrepresented anything?


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

mindphuk said:


> I don't understand how you think I'm misleading people. The pope declared that Catholics shouldn't use condoms. I never said there are people in the church that disagree with the pope. This was about missionaries. The pope teaches that contraception is immoral. Catholic missionaries will follow the pope's decrees. How have I misrepresented anything?



You are trying to promote the idea that the Catholics don't want to prevent HIV. Thats what 66freespirit was trying to imply and you where attempting to back up his claim by posting that article. You know what you where doing. Don't play coy.


----------



## Tym (Dec 14, 2010)

mindphuk said:


> I don't understand how you think I'm misleading people. The pope declared that Catholics shouldn't use condoms. I never said there are people in the church that disagree with the pope. This was about missionaries. The pope teaches that contraception is immoral. Catholic missionaries will follow the pope's decrees. How have I misrepresented anything?


You haven't.. He's just unable to defend himself logically, so he's trying to keep you on the defensive..


----------



## Tyrannabudz (Dec 14, 2010)

So glad to see you have overcome them, completely silent. 
Now with heavens help, you cast your demons out.
And not to pull your halo down 
around your neck and tug you off your cloud.
But I'm more than just a little bit curious how your planning
to go about making your amends, to the dead.

Recall the deeds as of thier own 
someone elses atrocious stories.
Now you stand reborn before us all.
So glad to see you well.

And not to pull your halo down 
around your neck and tug you to the ground.
But I'm more than just a little bit curious 
how your planning to go about making your amends.

With your halo slippin down,
your halo slippin.
Your halo slippin down
To choke you now.

A song for your "Jesus" from A Perfect Circle called "The Noose"

It means how will Jesus explain to humanity what has been done in his name. For all the lies that were spread after his death about his intentions when he was alive, claiming he was the Messiah. Jesus was a high priest, a master in the Mystery Schools of Isis and Osiris. His high priestess and initiatrix was none other than Mary Magdelene. As well she was his consort.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 14, 2010)

Tym said:


> You haven't.. He's just unable to defend himself logically, so he's trying to keep you on the defensive..


Really?? I think I addressed that subject with great clarity. What was wrong with my logic? Or are you just making pointless claim again.


----------



## 66FreeSpirit (Dec 14, 2010)

This will be my last post on this topic.

I said earlier I'm glad that we can at least agree on marijuana, how growing it can be fun to grow, and that still holds true. 

But before I go just let me leave saying that I am not trying to silence you or take away any freedom of speech. I just believe that this is not the appropriate place to be having this conversation. Just like it would be in appropriate to for me to talk about my sex life or financial status. All I ask is that in the future you keep your religious opinions to yourself while posting on a pot site. If you feel the need to talk about it get in touch with a group, website, chat room or church that would be more suitable for the topic.

Look forward to seeing how your plants do and best of luck


----------



## Tym (Dec 14, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> Really?? I think I addressed that subject with great clarity. What was wrong with my logic? Or are you just making pointless claim again.


Did you even read what he said?

He said, and I quote "Dude, it's the Catholics, the largest denomination of Xtians worldwide. The last pope went on record advising the people of Africa that condoms actually spread AIDS and not to bother with them. In the same speech he also said not to worry about kids "because God will provide for all he creates." http://www.condoms4life.org/facts/lesserEvil.htm"

All he did was repeat what the pope said. Where did refute what the pope said?

Oh and abstinence is better than condoms? So is castration.. The only problem is, castration is more effective. According to the official doctrine, it's possible to get inseminated and have a child without ever having sex.. That's not %100 effective, Castration is..
But all that is besides the fact, abstinence only education doesn't work. Studies and statistics show that the rate of sexual transmitted infections and pregnancy are unaffected by abstinence only education.
Here is a link to a meta study that has been published in a peer reviewed journal.

http://www.siecus.org/_data/global/images/research_says.pdf

This study was conducted by Mathematica Policy Research Inc. on behalf of the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.


----------



## Tym (Dec 15, 2010)

66FreeSpirit said:


> This will be my last post on this topic.
> 
> I said earlier I'm glad that we can at least agree on marijuana, how growing it can be fun to grow, and that still holds true.
> 
> ...


Not to take away your right to your opinion, but you're in a forum section called.


Spirituality & Sexuality & Philosophy
This is the place to be talking about it. If you don't like it, don't read it.
I know it looks like a heated argument, but this is how rational people debate. None of us hate anyone here, we just passionately express our opinions and lay out the facts as they stand.
We can all agree on a lot of things.. More than just the love of pot.
We can all agree that we have the right to say and think whatever we want.

So thanks for adding to the conversation, but don't think it's going to stop. This is what we love to do 
You may come to understand if you ever take a stance on an issue you think is worth debating.
Best of luck to you too man!


----------



## mindphuk (Dec 15, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> You are trying to promote the idea that the Catholics don't want to prevent HIV. Thats what 66freespirit was trying to imply and you where attempting to back up his claim by posting that article. You know what you where doing. Don't play coy.


 Absolutely not! Stop putting words into my mouth. It is so annoying when you people cannot take what is said at face value. Maybe it says something about you. Do you purposely try to be vague, to imply something or do you come out and try to say it? I have been nothing but straightforward with you through all of this. This isn't about intentions, this is about ignoring science because the bible is the authority on this issue. I think EVERYONE wants to prevent HIV spread. I think the Pope is pulling another Galileo and ignoring the fact that condoms can prevent HIV but feeling too strongly about his interpretation of scripture and has a conflict. It is immoral to teach condoms are bad to a population that is dying in large numbers. You can teach abstinence too, teach it as the primary, but don't withhold something that could save a life. The thing is, you appear to agree with me on this, but not everyone does. Some people are blindly following the Pope, and you know that's true. I would say that if you are a Catholic missionary, the probability is even higher that you will obey the Vatican because to the Catholics, they are the authority on this. I never once said or implied that anyone wants to prevent the spread of HIV.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 15, 2010)

mindphuk said:


> Absolutely not! Stop putting words into my mouth. It is so annoying when you people cannot take what is said at face value. Maybe it says something about you. Do you purposely try to be vague, to imply something or do you come out and try to say it? I have been nothing but straightforward with you through all of this. This isn't about intentions, this is about ignoring science because the bible is the authority on this issue. I think EVERYONE wants to prevent HIV spread. I think the Pope is pulling another Galileo and ignoring the fact that condoms can prevent HIV but feeling too strongly about his interpretation of scripture and has a conflict. It is immoral to teach condoms are bad to a population that is dying in large numbers. You can teach abstinence too, teach it as the primary, but don't withhold something that could save a life. The thing is, you appear to agree with me on this, but not everyone does. Some people are blindly following the Pope, and you know that's true. I would say that if you are a Catholic missionary, the probability is even higher that you will obey the Vatican because to the Catholics, they are the authority on this. I never once said or implied that anyone wants to prevent the spread of HIV.



Ok then I apologize. But I think trying to down play what these missionaries are doing over there is dangerous. These people have given up their lives to help them. They are doing great things for the people of Africa. They are actively building infrastructure and providing medicine and education to the people. For any one to try and attack them and what they are doing over there is despicable. Not saying that is what you are doing, but you seemed to support the argument that he was trying to make. There is no doubt that the support the Catholic church provides greatly out ways this one stance.


----------



## Tym (Dec 15, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> Ok then I apologize. But I think trying to down play what these missionaries are doing over there is dangerous. These people have given up their lives to help them. They are doing great things for the people of Africa. They are actively building infrastructure and providing medicine and education to the people. For any one to try and attack them and what they are doing over there is despicable. Not saying that is what you are doing, but you seemed to support the argument that he was trying to make. There is no doubt that the support the Catholic church provides greatly out ways this one stance.


Nobody doubts that some good is being done by these missionaries. But any good they do can be done without them and to a greater extent if the pope just sent money, food, and medicine.. 
Let us not forget that the main reason they are there to begin with is to spread the word of god. Helping people is secondary. Tremendous money and provisions are wasted by sending people there to preach the word of a fiction novel.. Far more good could be done without missionaries.. Africa has enough people, they need money, supplies and medicine. But what good they do, is greatly appreciated no matter how inefficient the use of resources are..


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 15, 2010)

Tym said:


> Nobody doubts that some good is being done by these missionaries. But any good they do can be done without them and to a greater extent if the pope just sent money, food, and medicine..
> Let us not forget that the main reason they are there to begin with is to spread the word of god. Helping people is secondary. Tremendous money and provisions are wasted by sending people there to preach the word of a fiction novel.. Far more good could be done without missionaries.. Africa has enough people, they need money, supplies and medicine. But what good they do, is greatly appreciated no matter how inefficient the use of resources are..



I think that maybe you should try and meet some of these people. I think that you will see where their hearts truly are. Sending money and medicine is pointless if they don't ever get it. All the money in the world does not beat having people on the ground to properly distribute it. Its not all about converting people. It's about loving your neighbor. Most of these people have dedicated their lives to helping others. They expect no compensation and hardly ever receive any credit for anything they do. There is no better way to spend the money in my opinion. Whether you want to believe it or not, Jesus changes peoples lives for the better. I have seen it first hand over and over again.


----------



## Tym (Dec 15, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> I think that maybe you should try and meet some of these people. I think that you will see where their hearts truly are. Sending money and medicine is pointless if they don't ever get it. All the money in the world does not beat having people on the ground to properly distribute it. Its not all about converting people. It's about loving your neighbor. Most of these people have dedicated their lives to helping others. They expect no compensation and hardly ever receive any credit for anything they do. There is no better way to spend the money in my opinion. Whether you want to believe it or not, Jesus changes peoples lives for the better. I have seen it first hand over and over again.


I'm sure the people's intentions are pure. Sending money, supplies and medicine is never pointless. Of course you would need people to distribute it. But it could be done internally. You don't need to send thousands of people to simply distribute supplies. I know these people have the greatest of intentions, and I commend them for it. But it can be done more efficiently, with less overhead and more end products to the people who need it most. And above all, it can all be done without spamming your god.. There are better ways to spend money, like doctors without borders, and other secular charities that don't try to jam a holy book in your face and tell you a story about how you deserve to die, how you were born flawed some how and that if you don't believe what I'm telling you, there is a fate worse than death waiting for you.

Jesus doesn't change anything, people who tell the story change things. These are people, interacting with people. If Jesus existed, he wouldn't need people to do it for him. If Jesus existed, he would have a physical effect that could be confirmed, measured and reproduced. The fact that Jesus can't be shown to exist, shows us rational people that there is no valid reason to believe he exists.

I would love to be proven wrong.


----------



## mindphuk (Dec 15, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> I think that maybe you should try and meet some of these people. I think that you will see where their hearts truly are. Sending money and medicine is pointless if they don't ever get it. All the money in the world does not beat having people on the ground to properly distribute it. Its not all about converting people. It's about loving your neighbor. Most of these people have dedicated their lives to helping others. They expect no compensation and hardly ever receive any credit for anything they do. There is no better way to spend the money in my opinion. Whether you want to believe it or not, Jesus changes peoples lives for the better. I have seen it first hand over and over again.


 You can be helpful to people without making it contingent on them learning the Gospel. 

I found a missionary story inspiring. Here it is -- http://freethinker.co.uk/2008/11/08/how-an-amazonian-tribe-turned-a-missionary-into-an-atheist/


----------



## Saerimmner (Dec 15, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> If it is public record, then can you post a link or something cause I'm calling bullshit on this one. I have read extensively on this subject and have never come across this. State your source.


 
as far as im aware all roman records are kept under lock and key at vatican city and if you wish to view them you must apply to your local catholic archbishop so he can contact the vatican and arrange viewing of records, they may also be online as well somewhere but unfortunately not speaking italian trawling thru websites to find it would be a tad difficult


----------



## Tyrannabudz (Dec 15, 2010)

Truth cannot be found through the investigation of lies.


----------



## guy incognito (Dec 15, 2010)

bunnyface said:


> so your saying im ignorant ??
> hell im not religous in the slightest but,,,,,,you have faith in sicence and are 'ignorant' of reilgon.yes, but so ignorant that its become intorlance.
> I said im not here to agrue,but faith is still different ,in genral ignaorant people have faith in religion, and ignorant people have faith in science, but BOTH are ignorant of the other feelings,,


You are a bonafide retard. Seriously fucking retarded man. I already posted definition directly from the dictionary. I will once again since you are either illiterate or too stupid to comprehend on the first time around.

Faith: 1. strong or unshakeable belief in something, esp without proof or evidence

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/faith?&qsrc=

That being said my "faith" in science is strong (because of so much evidence) but is not unshakable. I will gladly revise my view of the world ANYTIME evidence presents itself.


----------



## bunnyface (Dec 15, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> There is so much wrong with this statement I don't even know where to begin. Even if the Buddhist thing is true so what. He was well educated and wise. Just the simple fact that God led the wise men with a star to find Jesus is a miracle in its self. But I don't really buy this story of the Buddhist. First of all the three wise men came from Persia. As for Jesus not being dead on the cross, the soldiers pierced him with a spear just to make sure he was dead. This is all just another bs story used to confuse the masses.


well thats how the buddist used to choose a figure head,,so thats a fact. There is no evidence to suggest they came from persia,, whats on the otherside of persia??back then as it where,,so they came accross persia. and yeah they stabbed him but he didnt die, look at how the romans used to crusify loads of people,, it would take days to die up there, and when your stabbed(in genral) you pass out from blood lose, then die. well what did they take into the tomb? those herbs are for healing.....
and to be honest explain the tombs in nepal, Hey he may not of been a buddist , or jew or christian, just some one trying to do some good,,


----------



## bunnyface (Dec 15, 2010)

u clearly have small cock synidrome cognito, why do you have to be so rude???

well thats proof right there that you are just as ignorant as the f'in bible bashers.
die in pain.


----------



## guy incognito (Dec 15, 2010)

bunnyface said:


> u clearly have small cock synidrome cognito, why do you have to be so rude???
> 
> well thats proof right there that you are just as ignorant as the f'in bible bashers.
> die in pain.



I have an average sized cock thank you. I am "so rude" because you called me ignorant and intolerant. I'm not really that offended given the fact that you clearly don't even understand the definition of MOST of the words you are throwing around. Either that or you are purposely being disingenuous.


----------



## Basshead (Dec 15, 2010)

Its funny when people say that religion is about controlling you.

YES! its called discipline, foo.
For instance. I am a Christian. I want you to be nice. If I see you lacking niceness I may attempt to control you, depending on the degree of your wrongdoing.
I will try to control you by saying : HEY! STOP FUCKING UP! Directly to you.
Another part of the religion is shame at the natural human condition because its not easy to maintain balance. Only Jesus was any good.
So even though I encourage you to stop fucking up, I am also very forgiving. because i'm probably worse than you if i'm older than you.

So yes. its all about control. Religion, Values, Discipline.

It is also true that there have been evil organizations of people in the past within the Christian Religion. And yes, they contaminated the original scriptures. To anyone concerned the information is available. Everyone else either disregards, or protests. If I recall correctly 95% of all organizations composed of humans do something really horrible eventually. especially if the group spans a century or two across a thousand or million or so people. Not only is it just like a random act either. its a carefully organized effort because the religion itself is organized with the wiseguys at the top. same as it ever was.

Those people should have nothing to do with an individual's decisions. Sometimes people are born into bad environments.


----------



## Tym (Dec 15, 2010)

Basshead said:


> Its funny when people say that religion is about controlling you.
> 
> YES! its called discipline, foo.
> For instance. I am a Christian. I want you to be nice. If I see you lacking niceness I may attempt to control you, depending on the degree of your wrongdoing.
> ...


I think the control aspects of religion are obvious, I don't think most rational people will contest it.
It's the things religion trys to make you do that I have a problem with. And the things it does to other people.


----------



## upthearsenal (Dec 16, 2010)

Basshead said:


> Its funny when people say that religion is about controlling you.
> 
> YES! its called discipline, foo.
> For instance. I am a Christian. I want you to be nice. If I see you lacking niceness I may attempt to control you, depending on the degree of your wrongdoing.
> ...


You realize that people choose to "stop fucking up" if you ask them to, you did nothing other than give them the option, you didn't control them. 

"Religion teaches people to be satisfied with trivial supernatural non-explanations, and blinds them to the wonderful real explanations that we have in our grasp, *it teaches them to rely on authority, revelation, and faith instead of always insisting on evidence*."

it's as simple as that... the quote is from Richard Dawkins' TED talk


----------



## Tym (Dec 16, 2010)

upthearsenal said:


> You realize that people choose to "stop fucking up" if you ask them to, you did nothing other than give them the option, you didn't control them.
> 
> "Religion teaches people to be satisfied with trivial supernatural non-explanations, and blinds them to the wonder real explanations that we have in our grasp, *it teaches them to rely on authority, revelation, and faith instead of always insisting on evidence*."
> 
> it's as simple as that... the quote is from Richard Dawkins' TED talk


Yes, then it teaches them to infect everyone they know including children with the same virus..


----------



## Sure Shot (Dec 16, 2010)

"Jesus has a very special love for you. As for me, the silence and the emptiness is so great that I look and do not see, listen and do not hear,"

Mother Teresa


----------



## kush groove (Dec 16, 2010)

What color was the skin of the man who bared the cross......
No matter how many lashes they couldn't beat if off......

Kanye West

Your bible says jesus had skin like burned bronze and hair like wool....hmmmmmmm interesting......but for some reason that doesn't mactch the picture in my living room

But anyway jesus is the son and its an old story out of egypt to teach children science...................adults believing in jesus is equivalent to an adult believing in the easter bunny


----------



## Tym (Dec 16, 2010)

What kind of science?


----------



## domp1234 (Dec 16, 2010)

https://www.rollitup.org/indoor-growing/393282-4-weeks-flower.html


----------



## Tym (Dec 16, 2010)

domp1234 said:


> https://www.rollitup.org/indoor-growing/393282-4-weeks-flower.html


Sweet, lets see!


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 21, 2010)

[video]http://www.youtube.com/user/ppsimmons#p/c/BD482D8B99BA28DA/7/1wiBtYITrxM[/video]


----------



## Tym (Dec 21, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> [video]http://www.youtube.com/user/ppsimmons#p/c/BD482D8B99BA28DA/7/1wiBtYITrxM[/video]


And this proves? Oh yeah, that's right. Nothing


----------



## Tym (Dec 21, 2010)

http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2010/12/who_is_to_blame_for_all_those.php


----------



## MrDank007 (Dec 21, 2010)

domp1234 said:


> https://www.rollitup.org/indoor-growing/393282-4-weeks-flower.html


Nice.......


----------



## mindphuk (Dec 22, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> [video]http://www.youtube.com/user/ppsimmons#p/c/BD482D8B99BA28DA/7/1wiBtYITrxM[/video]


 I guess that youtuber isn't concerned about blasphemy.


----------



## Tym (Dec 22, 2010)

We Love 1 said:


> Click on the link below to get RAPTURED!
> 
> https://www.rollitup.org/politics/387666-i-am-god-almighty-i.html
> 
> ...


You need help.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 23, 2010)

mindphuk said:


> I guess that youtuber isn't concerned about blasphemy.



What part was blasphemy?


----------



## mindphuk (Dec 24, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> What part was blasphemy?


 The original crime of blasphemy was saying the holy, secret name of God, YHWH. One of the reasons the pronunciation is lost to history is because saying his holy name was reserved for special occasions and only by a high priest. Since the destruction of the Temple, there is no more legitimate reason for a priest to pronounce His name and hence the correct pronunciation is no longer known. This is why Jews will use euphemisms such as HaShem (the Name) and Adonai (Lord) when they refer to the one God. 
This is also the reason the Pharisees accused Jesus of blasphemy. It was NOT as most Xtians think, because he claimed to be God but because he spoke this forbidden name when he said, "before Abraham was born, I AM." 
Since this is a translation to Greek, the point gets lost. Most bibles also translate God's name when he speaks it to Moses in the form of the burning bush. In Hebrew, you can see that God clearly tells Moses his true name, YHWH, but your English translation probably says, "I AM that I AM." 
So really, the only thing Jesus really said is that YHWH is eternal, he did not say he is YHWH but it was against the law of blasphemy nonetheless.


----------



## Tym (Dec 24, 2010)

Mindphuk, you don't actually think he questions the things said in the videos do you? Lol..

I know you don't, it's a rhetorical question.

If only he used his rational thought processes when it comes to religion. It's the same old compartmentalization that we see all to often in the religious..
Flying spaghetti monster? That's just stupid! An invisible man who created everything that can't be tested and there is no actual way to prove his existence? Yeah, I'll buy that..


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 24, 2010)

mindphuk said:


> The original crime of blasphemy was saying the holy, secret name of God, YHWH. One of the reasons the pronunciation is lost to history is because saying his holy name was reserved for special occasions and only by a high priest. Since the destruction of the Temple, there is no more legitimate reason for a priest to pronounce His name and hence the correct pronunciation is no longer known. This is why Jews will use euphemisms such as HaShem (the Name) and Adonai (Lord) when they refer to the one God.
> This is also the reason the Pharisees accused Jesus of blasphemy. It was NOT as most Xtians think, because he claimed to be God but because he spoke this forbidden name when he said, "before Abraham was born, I AM."
> Since this is a translation to Greek, the point gets lost. Most bibles also translate God's name when he speaks it to Moses in the form of the burning bush. In Hebrew, you can see that God clearly tells Moses his true name, YHWH, but your English translation probably says, "I AM that I AM."
> So really, the only thing Jesus really said is that YHWH is eternal, he did not say he is YHWH but it was against the law of blasphemy nonetheless.



These legalistic tendencies that they used to persecute Jesus are exactly why Jesus was the harshest with them.


----------



## sk'mo (Dec 24, 2010)

Japanfreak said:


> I know but what I'm suggesting is that we don't have any clue to what Jesus actually wrote because he didn't put it down to paper. Not saying that what is written is bad, just that I don't accept it as from the horses mouth so to speak.


The same is true of Socrates. Guy never wrote a damn thing!


----------



## Tym (Dec 24, 2010)

sk'mo said:


> The same is true of Socrates. Guy never wrote a damn thing!


Yes, but extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. If people claimed Socrates was the son of god and performed miracles, we would require extraordinary evidence.
Whether Socrates wrote philosophical texts or not is not extraordinary, for it wouldn't matter if he wrote them or someone else wrote them. There are no extraordinary claims. People write things every day.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 24, 2010)

Tym said:


> Mindphuk, you don't actually think he questions the things said in the videos do you? Lol..
> 
> I know you don't, it's a rhetorical question.
> 
> ...



80% of the worlds population says they have experienced God in some way or another. So that is all the testing I need. I also experience the presence of God on a regular basis. You are the 20% minority that refuses to accept it. Maybe your the one that is blinded to the facts.


----------



## Tym (Dec 24, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> 80% of the worlds population says they have experienced God in some way or another. So that is all the testing I need. I also experience the presence of God on a regular basis. You are the 20% minority that refuses to accept it. Maybe your the one that is blinded to the facts.


Another Logical Fallacy.
*Argumentum ad populum*

*From Iron Chariots Wiki*

(Redirected from Ad populum)
Jump to: navigation, search
*Argumentum ad populum* ("argument from popular appeal", "appeal to the majority") is a logical fallacy whereby a proposition is claimed to be true because it is believed by large numbers of people. 
*Contents*

[hide]


1 Examples
2 Discussion
3 Counter-apologetics
4 See also
 [edit]
*Examples*



 "Fifty million Elvis fans can't be wrong." (See also Wikipedia:50,000,000 Elvis Fans Can't Be Wrong.)
 "All US presidents have been Christians. Maybe such a prestigious group of people is onto something."
 "90% of the people in the world believe in God. Are you saying that all of them are wrong?"
 [edit]
*Discussion*

_Argumentum ad populum_ comes in two varieties: 


 The first is to argue from sheer numbers: "Everyone knows X, so X must be true". This argument is appealing because in many cases, what "everyone knows" _is_ true: the Sun rises in the east, not the south; grass is green; and George Washington was the first President of the United States. This is effective because it pressures people to be "normal". People have a desire to be like their peers. Thus tactics involving alienation are often used to bully people into submission, this is often a sign of a bad argument.
 The second variety is "snob appeal": A proposition is claimed to be true because it is believed by an elite or distinguished group of people. This argument often appears in advertising, (e.g., "Z Cola: The official soft drink of the Big-Time Sports Event").
 [edit]
*Counter-apologetics*

_Argumentum ad populum_ is a fallacy because the fact that many people believe something does not make it true. For many years, most people believed that the Earth was the center and most important feature of the universe. Millions of people believe that astrology works. Neither is true. 
One special case is that in which a statement is said to be true because it is believed by most of the experts in the field (_9 out of 10 dentists recommend Brand X toothpaste!_). For example, if most astronomers say that the Earth revolves around the Sun instead of the other way around, then that is very likely to be true. In this case, however, we are trusting the judgment of people who have carefully studied the matter. In effect, we are trusting that the experts have reached their conclusions through valid arguments based on careful observation, so there is no need for us to research the matter ourselves. This type of argument is often reliable, but not always. After all, scientific knowledge is never perfect and complete. However, for most "mature" scientific fields, the likelihood of a complete reversal of views &#8212; such as moving the Earth from the center of the universe to the outskirts of one unremarkable galaxy among millions &#8212; is incredibly, and ever increasingly, small. 
[edit]
*See also*



 Argumentum ad verecundiam (argument from authority)
 Appeal to emotion


----------



## Tym (Dec 24, 2010)

Also how do you experience god? I'm curious.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 24, 2010)

Tym said:


> Another Logical Fallacy.
> *Argumentum ad populum*
> 
> *From Iron Chariots Wiki*
> ...



I can do that too. 

*Denial*

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search 
For the politics of science/history and public policy, see Denialism. For other uses, see Denial (disambiguation).


*Denial* is a defense mechanism postulated by Sigmund Freud, in which a person is faced with a fact that is too uncomfortable to accept and rejects it instead, insisting that it is not true


----------



## upthearsenal (Dec 24, 2010)

Denial? Denial is NOT rejecting another's faith in god, denial is rejecting facts like the definition says... religion is based on FAITH not facts, we all know that.

I think he missed your point tym


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 24, 2010)

upthearsenal said:


> Denial? Denial is NOT rejecting another's faith in god, denial is rejecting facts like the definition says... religion is based on FAITH not facts, we all know that.
> 
> I think he missed your point tym



The fact part was that more than 80% of the world population says they have experienced God in some way or another. That my friend is a FACT!!!


----------



## upthearsenal (Dec 24, 2010)

Like I said I think you missed tym's point.. a fact isn't a fact because the majority believe it... So then what, when people thought the world was flat, it was, but the when they realized it wasn't... it wasn't? It makes not sense man.. facts are based on viable evidence and are indisputable, simply put.


----------



## Tym (Dec 24, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> The fact part was that more than 80% of the world population says they have experienced God in some way or another. That my friend is a FACT!!!


Lol, wow dude.. Did you even read my post? Obviously not.. I never denied the fact that over %80 of the population of the world believes in some sort of god..
Read the post man, you committed a logical fallacy. It makes no difference if it was %99.9 of the population.

Try again, I know you can do better..


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 24, 2010)

Do I need to re-post the definition of denial again?


----------



## upthearsenal (Dec 24, 2010)

If you didn't understand it, sure, but it's a pretty simple concept for the rest of us...


----------



## Tym (Dec 24, 2010)

upthearsenal said:


> Denial? Denial is NOT rejecting another's faith in god, denial is rejecting facts like the definition says... religion is based on FAITH not facts, we all know that.
> 
> I think he missed your point tym


Yup. As per usual 

I refuse to accept that he's just not intelligent enough to get it. He's compartmentalizing his rational thought from his religion.. It's fairly obvious. He's just got to break out of his box..

It's ok to question your beliefs dude. If it's true, surely it could withstand some honest criticism.. If it can't, it's obviously false.. We do this every day in other circumstances. Someone wants to sell you a bridge, you think about it critically and come to the conclusion that he most likely doesn't have a bridge and is just trying to scam you. Religion is no different, you just have to get past the mental block..


----------



## Tym (Dec 24, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> Do I need to re-post the definition of denial again?


Please tell me what I am denying?


----------



## Padawanbater2 (Dec 24, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> Do I need to re-post the definition of denial again?


Say you have a group of 20 people. Everyone is shown a red card, then asked what color card they believe they were shown was. 15 people answer "blue". Does that make the card blue and the remaining 5 people wrong?

This is why your example of "well most people believe it, so that makes it true" is a logical fallacy. It wasn't pointed out by Tym because he felt like being an asshole. You need to understand, in the realm of logic, there are rules that need to be followed, otherwise the train stops dead in it's tracks. 

Thinking is easy. Thinking _logically_ is what's hard.


----------



## Tym (Dec 24, 2010)

Padawanbater2 said:


> Say you have a group of 20 people. Everyone is shown a red card, then asked what color card they believe they were shown was. 15 people answer "blue". Does that make the card blue and the remaining 5 people wrong?
> 
> This is why your example of "well most people believe it, so that makes it true" is a logical fallacy. It wasn't pointed out by Tym because he felt like being an asshole. You need to understand, in the realm of logic, there are rules that need to be followed, otherwise the train stops dead in it's tracks.
> 
> Thinking is easy. Thinking _logically_ is what's hard.


I'll admit I can be an asshole, but I did more than point out why it was wrong. Here's an exact copy of my reply.
He commits so many logical fallacies I just cut and paste from iron chariots wiki..





Originally Posted by *crackerboy*  
80% of the worlds population says they have experienced God in some way or another. So that is all the testing I need. I also experience the presence of God on a regular basis. You are the 20% minority that refuses to accept it. Maybe your the one that is blinded to the facts.
Another Logical Fallacy.
*Argumentum ad populum*

*From Iron Chariots Wiki*

(Redirected from Ad populum)
Jump to: navigation, search
*Argumentum ad populum* ("argument from popular appeal", "appeal to the majority") is a logical fallacy whereby a proposition is claimed to be true because it is believed by large numbers of people. 
*Contents*

[hide]


1 Examples
2 Discussion
3 Counter-apologetics
4 See also
 [edit]
*Examples*



 "Fifty million Elvis fans can't be wrong." (See also Wikipedia:50,000,000 Elvis Fans Can't Be Wrong.)
 "All US presidents have been Christians. Maybe such a prestigious group of people is onto something."
 "90% of the people in the world believe in God. Are you saying that all of them are wrong?"
 [edit]
*Discussion*

_Argumentum ad populum_ comes in two varieties: 


 The first is to argue from sheer numbers: "Everyone knows X, so X must be true". This argument is appealing because in many cases, what "everyone knows" _is_ true: the Sun rises in the east, not the south; grass is green; and George Washington was the first President of the United States. This is effective because it pressures people to be "normal". People have a desire to be like their peers. Thus tactics involving alienation are often used to bully people into submission, this is often a sign of a bad argument.
 The second variety is "snob appeal": A proposition is claimed to be true because it is believed by an elite or distinguished group of people. This argument often appears in advertising, (e.g., "Z Cola: The official soft drink of the Big-Time Sports Event").
 [edit]
*Counter-apologetics*

_Argumentum ad populum_ is a fallacy because the fact that many people believe something does not make it true. For many years, most people believed that the Earth was the center and most important feature of the universe. Millions of people believe that astrology works. Neither is true. 
One special case is that in which a statement is said to be true because it is believed by most of the experts in the field (_9 out of 10 dentists recommend Brand X toothpaste!_). For example, if most astronomers say that the Earth revolves around the Sun instead of the other way around, then that is very likely to be true. In this case, however, we are trusting the judgment of people who have carefully studied the matter. In effect, we are trusting that the experts have reached their conclusions through valid arguments based on careful observation, so there is no need for us to research the matter ourselves. This type of argument is often reliable, but not always. After all, scientific knowledge is never perfect and complete. However, for most "mature" scientific fields, the likelihood of a complete reversal of views &#8212; such as moving the Earth from the center of the universe to the outskirts of one unremarkable galaxy among millions &#8212; is incredibly, and ever increasingly, small. 
[edit]
*See also*



 Argumentum ad verecundiam (argument from authority)
 Appeal to emotion


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 24, 2010)

Padawanbater2 said:


> Say you have a group of 20 people. Everyone is shown a red card, then asked what color card they believe they were shown was. 15 people answer "blue". Does that make the card blue and the remaining 5 people wrong?
> 
> This is why your example of "well most people believe it, so that makes it true" is a logical fallacy. It wasn't pointed out by Tym because he felt like being an asshole. You need to understand, in the realm of logic, there are rules that need to be followed, otherwise the train stops dead in it's tracks.
> 
> Thinking is easy. Thinking _logically_ is what's hard.



Look I totally get what a fallacy is. You are still ignoring the fact that is an enormous amount of people to be just a coincidence. All these people are not delusional. He is real.


----------



## Tym (Dec 24, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> Look I totally get what a fallacy is. You are still ignoring the fact that is an enormous amount of people to be just a coincidence. All these people are not delusional. He is real.


Lol see what I mean?
To him, the card is blue.
The earth was flat, now it's round.
The sun used to go around the earth, now the earth goes around the sun.
It is hopeless to try and reason with him, I'll just stick to proving him wrong over and over again so other people can learn from his mistakes.


----------



## upthearsenal (Dec 24, 2010)

Your "He" is not supported by that 80%, but maybe there is a type of god, we don't know. Look, it's not like there are facts that anyone and everyone can look at and agree. With that in mind, there has to be other reasons why people feel there is a god, but there are no real facts that prove a god exists.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 24, 2010)

Tym said:


> Lol see what I mean?
> To him, the card is blue.
> The earth was flat, now it's round.
> The sun used to go around the earth, now the earth goes around the sun.
> It is hopeless to try and reason with him, I'll just stick to proving him wrong over and over again so other people can learn from his mistakes.



No really just address that one issue. Why is it that the majority of the people on earth believe in a God? You won't address it because you can't come up with a logical reason. Just because you don't understand it does not make it wrong.


----------



## upthearsenal (Dec 24, 2010)

Just because one can't answer the question of why so many people believe is irrelevant and does nothing for your argument... Why do they believe? Because they have faith, and that's it... 

Faith: strong belief in God or in the doctrines of a religion, based on spiritual apprehension *rather than proof*. 

If you want your question to mean anything, first prove god and his existence to an indisputable measure, to make that fact/percentage significant.


----------



## Tym (Dec 24, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> No really just address that one issue. Why is it that the majority of the people on earth believe in a God? You won't address it because you can't come up with a logical reason. Just because you don't understand it does not make it wrong.


Cause you never asked me to address it, you asserted it. You made a statement, then never asked me a question.. Now that you have, I will answer.

First of all, even if I can't come up with a logical reason, doesn't mean you can. Also it doesn't mean your answer is right. It's called a false dichotomy, another logical fallacy.
But it just turns out I do have a logical reason.

%80 of people believe in a god, because they want it to be true.

But even if I said "I don't know" it does not make you right, or your answer any more valid..


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 24, 2010)

Look I don't really care about making arguments on this point. As you said i made a statement. I just want all of you to ask yourselves the question of why is it that you are one of the few in this world that don't have that connection. Are you the elite or the deprived?


----------



## Tym (Dec 24, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> Look I don't really care about making arguments on this point. As you said i made a statement. I just want all of you to ask yourselves the question of why is it that you are one of the few in this world that don't have that connection. Are you the elite or the deprived?


Then why ask? Anyways.. Do you honestly think people like me have come to this conclusion without asking questions like that? The reason is, someone makes a claim. There is no evidence for the claim. Do you believe it?
I'm not talking about religion, I'm not talking about god, I'm not talking about anything specific.

There is a claim, no evidence exists for this claim, do you believe it?


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 24, 2010)

Ok well if the person that made that claim also gave me a book. And when I read that book strange and miraculous things began to happen to me, then yes I would begin to believe. But wait, the more I believed in what is said the more began to work within me. So yes if all these things where actually happening to me than I would believe. Oh wait, that is what has happened to me.


----------



## canuckgrow (Dec 24, 2010)

Well I'll chime in here. If there is a god or Jesus that is all seeing and all loving why are there so many people suffering and dieing needlessly in this world? I mean really if god existed I think a good time to show up would have been say around the holocaust. Or take your pick of events that could have turned out so much better with just a little help from a god or a jesus. The bible is a collection of stories written over hundreds and some would say thousands of years if you include all the revisions you see today.

If anyone says that "god works in strange ways" I'm gonna hurl chunks soaked in bong water at 'em...No he doesn't work in strange ways...He just doesn't work.
I asked Jesus or god to show me one thing....just one little thing to let me know that they exist.....That was 30 years ago and I have yet to get an answer. Not even a "hang on we are working on it" no "Your call is in priority sequence and will be answered by the next available Jesus"nothing, Nada, Zip, zilch. Meanwhile on the other side of it a man blindlessy follows his faith in Jesus for 60 years living as the bible wanted him too. Same man lost all 3 of his kids at a young age to different events, Wife she is dead too, Poor chap starved to death in his old broken down house waiting for Jesus to bring him some groceries. He must have been too busy that day or maybe this guy just wasn't religious enough to warrant being saved LOL....What a crappapalooza. But hey whatever floats your boat or trips your trigger(Appropriate)
This is close to home but may shed some light on the subject. My 17 year old daughter is dieing of cancer. Her Mother and her mothers religous friends have been having a hay day prayer fest asking god or jesus to"help" my daughter. Trouble is she is getting sicker and sicker each passing week so it appears that the prayers are actually having a negative effect at this point. So go ahead all you "faithful" and put some "real thought" on that. i'll shoot you a PM when she does pass and we can discuss how your god failed yet again.


----------



## Tym (Dec 24, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> Ok well if the person that made that claim also gave me a book. And when I read that book strange and miraculous things began to happen to me, then yes I would begin to believe. But wait, the more I believed in what is said the more began to work within me. So yes if all these things where actually happening to me than I would believe. Oh wait, that is what has happened to me.


Just yes or no man.


----------



## mindphuk (Dec 24, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> No really just address that one issue. Why is it that the majority of the people on earth believe in a God? You won't address it because you can't come up with a logical reason. Just because you don't understand it does not make it wrong.


 The majority of the people in this world might actually believe in a god but you made a claim that a majority actually "experienced" god. Would you care to support that claim with actual evidence?


----------



## Tyrannabudz (Dec 24, 2010)

We Love 1 said:


> Click on the link below to get RAPTURED!
> 
> https://www.rollitup.org/politics/387666-i-am-god-almighty-i.html
> 
> ...


Click on the link below to get RAPED!? You need to understand where the words that have been chosen for you originate from, and what they really mean.


----------



## Tyrannabudz (Dec 24, 2010)

Everyone laughed at a joke, as if they never even heard it before.
And maybe they were truly amused, but every word that she spoke was a bore.
And maybe it's because they had seen, the previews on the TV screen.
Well this part is good and that's well understood, 
so you should laugh if you know what I mean.

But it's all relative. 
Even if you don't understand,
well it's all understood.
Especially when you don't understand.
And it's all just because.
Even if we don't understand,
and it's all just believe.

Everyone knows what went down.
Because the news was spread all over town.
Fact is only what you believe. 
Fact & fiction work as a team.
It's almost always fiction,
in the end the content begins to bend
when context is never the same. 

But it's all relative.
Even if we don't understand,
and it's all understood.
Especially when you don't understand.
And it's all just because.
Even if we don't understand.
And it's all just believe.

I believe I was reading a book, 
or maybe it was a magazine.
Suggestions on where to place faith.
Suggestions on what to believe.
But I read somewhere that you've got to beware
you can't believe anything you read.
But the GOOD BOOK is good and thats well understood
so don't even question it if you know what I mean.

But it's all relative.
Even if you don't understand.
And it's all understood.
Especially when we don't understand.
And it's all just because.
Even if we you don't understand.
And it's all just believe.

There you go once again,
you missed the point,
and then you point your fingrers at me.
And say that I said not to believe.
But I believe.

It's all relative, I guess.

-Jack Johnson "It's All Understood"


----------



## guy incognito (Dec 24, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> Ok well if the person that made that claim also gave me a book. And when I read that book strange and miraculous things began to happen to me, then yes I would begin to believe. But wait, the more I believed in what is said the more began to work within me. So yes if all these things where actually happening to me than I would believe. Oh wait, that is what has happened to me.


LOL. I'm becoming more and more convinced that crackerboy is a troll. I mean he SEEMS fairly intelligent, until he starts talking about religion. Once the topic of religion or god enters his brain all logic goes right out the window and he becomes retarded. Or he is a troll. Not sure which is the most likely. If he is being serious then he is pretty gullible. I was going to follow suit and post a definition, but gullible isn't even in the dictionary.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 24, 2010)

canuckgrow said:


> Well I'll chime in here. If there is a god or Jesus that is all seeing and all loving why are there so many people suffering and dieing needlessly in this world? I mean really if god existed I think a good time to show up would have been say around the holocaust. Or take your pick of events that could have turned out so much better with just a little help from a god or a jesus. The bible is a collection of stories written over hundreds and some would say thousands of years if you include all the revisions you see today.
> 
> If anyone says that "god works in strange ways" I'm gonna hurl chunks soaked in bong water at 'em...No he doesn't work in strange ways...He just doesn't work.
> I asked Jesus or god to show me one thing....just one little thing to let me know that they exist.....That was 30 years ago and I have yet to get an answer. Not even a "hang on we are working on it" no "Your call is in priority sequence and will be answered by the next available Jesus"nothing, Nada, Zip, zilch. Meanwhile on the other side of it a man blindlessy follows his faith in Jesus for 60 years living as the bible wanted him too. Same man lost all 3 of his kids at a young age to different events, Wife she is dead too, Poor chap starved to death in his old broken down house waiting for Jesus to bring him some groceries. He must have been too busy that day or maybe this guy just wasn't religious enough to warrant being saved LOL....What a crappapalooza. But hey whatever floats your boat or trips your trigger(Appropriate)
> This is close to home but may shed some light on the subject. My 17 year old daughter is dieing of cancer. Her Mother and her mothers religous friends have been having a hay day prayer fest asking god or jesus to"help" my daughter. Trouble is she is getting sicker and sicker each passing week so it appears that the prayers are actually having a negative effect at this point. So go ahead all you "faithful" and put some "real thought" on that. i'll shoot you a PM when she does pass and we can discuss how your god failed yet again.



Im sorry about your daughter. But if it is her time than it is her time. It is common for people to blame God when tragedy strikes. But all life ends. It can be difficult to let go. If your wife is a Christian than she should take comfort in the fact that she will be with Jesus. As hard as this may all seem to you, this is the natural process of life. If Jesus stepped in and saved everyone that prayed to him and asked for his help, no one would ever die. Again I am deeply sorry for your family and will pray that God brings you all some comfort.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 24, 2010)

guy incognito said:


> LOL. I'm becoming more and more convinced that crackerboy is a troll. I mean he SEEMS fairly intelligent, until he starts talking about religion. Once the topic of religion or god enters his brain all logic goes right out the window and he becomes retarded. Or he is a troll. Not sure which is the most likely. If he is being serious then he is pretty gullible. I was going to follow suit and post a definition, but gullible isn't even in the dictionary.





ARRRG boogidy blah blah blah


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 24, 2010)

Tym said:


> Just yes or no man.



You don't want my answer you just want to hear what you want to hear.


----------



## Padawanbater2 (Dec 24, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> Look I totally get what a fallacy is. You are still ignoring the fact that is an enormous amount of people to be just a coincidence. All these people are not delusional. He is real.
> 
> Look I don't really care about making arguments on this point. As you said i made a statement. I just want all of you to ask yourselves the question of why is it that you are one of the few in this world that don't have that connection. Are you the elite or the deprived?


Just about all of humanity from the dawn of civilization has believed in God. Before the enlightenment and scientific revolution it was *mandatory* or risk death. This is what has led to the majority of people, today, still believing in a god. Their parents did, and their parents before them did. We've all been over all the different aspects of indoctrination organized religion provides. That's another part of it, the *irrational fear* of hell. 

The 14% nonreligious number is growing by the year. Will this argument remain valid (to you) once the majority is atheist? 
 


canuckgrow said:


> This is close to home but may shed some light on the subject. My 17 year old daughter is dieing of cancer. Her Mother and her mothers religous friends have been having a hay day prayer fest asking god or jesus to"help" my daughter. Trouble is she is getting sicker and sicker each passing week so it appears that the prayers are actually having a negative effect at this point. So go ahead all you "faithful" and put some "real thought" on that. i'll shoot you a PM when she does pass and we can discuss how your god failed yet again.


I'm sorry for your circumstances.


----------



## Tym (Dec 24, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> You don't want my answer you just want to hear what you want to hear.


It's a yes or no question.


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 24, 2010)

Tym said:


> It's a yes or no question.



No its not.


----------



## canuckgrow (Dec 25, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> Im sorry about your daughter. But if it is her time than it is her time. It is common for people to blame God when tragedy strikes. But all life ends. It can be difficult to let go. If your wife is a Christian than she should take comfort in the fact that she will be with Jesus. As hard as this may all seem to you, this is the natural process of life. If Jesus stepped in and saved everyone that prayed to him and asked for his help, no one would ever die. Again I am deeply sorry for your family and will pray that God brings you all some comfort.


 I have no doubt that you truly feel for those who suffer needlessly and I agree that when it is your time it is your time. However your view on the natural order of things is somewhat unbalanced. Its totally natural to think that a supernatural being will take care of us when we die....That has no logic or rationale to it......Funny I knew almost verbatim what you would type before you actually posted it. Why? Because christians always say the same things when they are confronted with people that do not believe what they do. Well at least you didn't say that god has a plan....That is the most common response for christians.


----------



## tip top toker (Dec 25, 2010)

I love it. A thread about jesus and you state it's not about debate  All i know is that all i ever hear from christians from my various camping experiences etc, is that all they say is how good life is going about their life knowing that there's some figment looking over their shoulder, how everything is managable because of this knowledge that they're being watched. Damn, i feel exactly the same wihtout the need for someone else to dump my shit on. I must just be a stronger minded human being than a lot i guess


----------



## Papa Raazi (Dec 25, 2010)

tip top toker said:


> I love it. A thread about jesus and you state it's not about debate  All i know is that all i ever hear from christians from my various camping experiences etc, is that all they say is how good life is going about their life knowing that there's some figment looking over their shoulder, how everything is managable because of this knowledge that they're being watched. Damn, i feel exactly the same wihtout the need for someone else to dump my shit on. I must just be a stronger minded human being than a lot i guess


Alot stronger minded, keep being dope


----------



## Papa Raazi (Dec 25, 2010)

Anyway if you look at the first quote on my sig you will know how i feel about this. Fuck anything that divides people up, we are 1 race...the human race.


----------



## weed4cash (Dec 25, 2010)

Actually the real Jesus would relate more to ATHIEST then to modern day Christians.

Jesus told Peter that he was satan because he wanted the world when Peter told Jesus he should not die on a cross. Jesus was trying to tell Peter that the Kindom of God was GODS WILL and not MANS.

Most of todays Christians worship Jesus in thought and by their lips but they don't really give a shit about one another. 

Jesus said that it's better to care about your brother then to care about me. Jesus taught to love one another and in doing so you love Jesus.

Most Christians today think that to love Jesus you have to praise and sing about him and act like some holy light is piercing your soul every time you hear music.

It's all bull shit. Jesus will tell these people he never knew them. The real people who will be saved are those who help one another and the poor. If a Christian is not trying to help his fellow brother every chance he gets he is waisting his talents and will be cast out by God.

That's it in a nut shell.

Here are my scriptures to back up EVERY thing I say:

Jesus wants men to love each other and not him only:

If any man will give a child a cup of water in my name he will in no wise loose his reward.
I will have mercy not sacrafice
Pray for your enemie
Pray for those who dispitfully use you and mistreat you
If any man have aught against his brother, let him leave his gift at the alter and first go make amends with his brother.
Make amends with thy enemie will he is in thy path.


----------



## Tym (Dec 25, 2010)

weed4cash said:


> Actually the real Jesus would relate more to ATHIEST then to modern day Christians.
> 
> Jesus told Peter that he was satan because he wanted the world when Peter told Jesus he should not die on a cross. Jesus was trying to tell Peter that the Kindom of God was GODS WILL and not MANS.
> 
> ...



Actually no. The only thing that makes an atheist an atheist. Is the lack of belief in a god..
That is it. There is nothing else to atheism, don't believe in a god? You're an atheist. Nothing else is required..
Jesus (if he existed) believed in a god.


----------



## guy incognito (Dec 26, 2010)

I'm all for intelligent discussion and debate. Everyone needs to stop responding to weed4cash and crackerboy though. They are either trolls or too stupid to warrant a response. Maybe if we stop feeding them they will go away.


----------



## Papa Raazi (Dec 26, 2010)

Jesus is the biggest troll ever


----------



## guy incognito (Dec 26, 2010)

LOL. I just smoked some home grown. Now instead of shaking my head in digust i'm laughing hysterically at these posts!


----------



## Hayduke (Dec 26, 2010)

Jesus supposedly said, "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: _I came not to send peace, but a sword_."...sounds like love to me!!!


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 26, 2010)

guy incognito said:


> I'm all for intelligent discussion and debate. Everyone needs to stop responding to weed4cash and crackerboy though. They are either trolls or too stupid to warrant a response. Maybe if we stop feeding them they will go away.



Dude i started the thread. If me and weed4cash quit posting, this thread would be a giant circle jerk of atheists just slamming Christianity. I have yet to actually see anything of substance anyway come form you though. Why am I responding to you again? oh its because Homer is awesome especially with that mustache. Jesus Rules.


----------



## Tym (Dec 26, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> Dude i started the thread. If me and weed4cash quit posting, this thread would be a giant circle jerk of atheists just slamming Christianity. I have yet to actually see anything of substance anyway come form you though. Why am I responding to you again? oh its because Homer is awesome especially with that mustache. Jesus Rules.


But you also think that nothing of substance has come from mindphuck and I ether. So that doesn't mean much coming from you


----------



## tip top toker (Dec 26, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> Dude i started the thread. If me and weed4cash quit posting, this thread would be a giant circle jerk of atheists just slamming Christianity. I have yet to actually see anything of substance anyway come form you though. Why am I responding to you again? oh its because Homer is awesome especially with that mustache. Jesus Rules.


A guy preaching jesus and god demanding for something of substance


----------



## Papa Raazi (Dec 26, 2010)

tip top toker said:


> A guy preaching jesus and god demanding for something of substance


damnit you beat me to it XD


----------



## guy incognito (Dec 26, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> Dude i started the thread. If me and weed4cash quit posting, this thread would be a giant circle jerk of atheists just slamming Christianity. I have yet to actually see anything of substance anyway come form you though. Why am I responding to you again? oh its because Homer is awesome especially with that mustache. Jesus Rules.


My point was this forum would be a better place without this thread and your nonsensical posts. You lack the intellectual horsepower to determine when an argument holds any substance or not. You and weed4cash deserve every remark hurled your way in this thread.

Also, homer? Who is this homer? My name is Guy Incognito.


----------



## TrippyReefer (Dec 26, 2010)

There can be no valid points because there is no concrete evidence supporting one view or another. There is just our limited knowledge on which our biases will make a decision to believe or not to believe. Whether or not Jesus was the son of God or just a man, can we agree his preaching was legit? if not, then you are a fool, that you can believe.
Flame on


----------



## tomatogrowop (Dec 26, 2010)

What's with the cult propaganda on a gardening site? WOW I for one find this video Offensive and this post should be deleted.


----------



## Hayduke (Dec 26, 2010)

TrippyReefer said:


> Whether or not Jesus was the son of God or just a man, can we agree his preaching was legit? if not, then you are a fool, that you can believe.
> Flame on


This fool cannot agree with you...I suppose the BS that was given the pen name Jesus was for the most part nice...but we cannot agree because I do not believe he even existed...it's a big hoax! The Romans kept better records than the Mormons...If some rabble-rouser who people were calling the messiah was starting shit in Palestine and got nailed to a tree...they would have written it down!...Dude died and came back to life in front of others...and nothing written for near 60 years about him... It's like Elvis is on the Ed Sullivan Show, New Years Eve 2010...for the first time ever...


----------



## guy incognito (Dec 27, 2010)

TrippyReefer said:


> There can be no valid points because there is no concrete evidence supporting one view or another. There is just our limited knowledge on which our biases will make a decision to believe or not to believe. Whether or not Jesus was the son of God or just a man, can we agree his preaching was legit? if not, then you are a fool, that you can believe.
> Flame on


What are you talking about? I suppose both sides must be equally as valid?


----------



## Tym (Dec 27, 2010)

TrippyReefer said:


> There can be no valid points because there is no concrete evidence supporting one view or another. There is just our limited knowledge on which our biases will make a decision to believe or not to believe. Whether or not Jesus was the son of God or just a man, can we agree his preaching was legit? if not, then you are a fool, that you can believe.
> Flame on


No we cannot agree, we don't even have evidence for Jesus even existing, let alone preaching anything. But, simply just a man existing named Jesus that preached is not an extraordinary claim. Specially in those times, there were hundreds of people preaching. So I will grant that around that time, some guy named Jesus preached to some people is quite possible. But I can't agree his preaching was "legit", as we don't even know if he existed, and it wouldn't matter if this turned out to be true.

But we can have valid points one way or the other. There is no evidence for the existence of bigfoot, Just because we can't prove bigfoot doesn't exist does not mean we can't logically say "I don't believe you" when someone claims bigfoot does exist. That's all we are doing with god, we are not disproving god, we are not claiming that a god doesn't exist. I am simply saying "I don't believe you" when someone says a god does exist.
They try to offer what they think is evidence, and we logically and refute it and show why what they perceive as evidence is in fact, not evidence at all. 
The null hypothesis for claims is, it's not true till proven otherwise.


----------



## TrippyReefer (Dec 27, 2010)

Hayduke said:


> I suppose the BS that was given the pen name Jesus was for the most part nice...


Well, at least you can agree with that. Im not trying to validate his existence, but it was written that Pointus Pilot washed his hands of Jesus' execution and wanted nothing to do with it, hence the lack of roman record. You guys sure are quick to display your skepticism...


----------



## Hum215 (Dec 27, 2010)

Jesus is a great guy, he used to work for me. I love the mexican people! 

You can't be serious with this post? The Jesus from biblical days was just a parrot for John, if Jesus actually even existed. Books that are written decades or centuries after an event cannot be accurate, that is dictated by human nature. I do not believe in invisible men or invisible deities.


----------



## mexiblunt (Dec 27, 2010)

Tym said:


> No we cannot agree, we don't even have evidence for Jesus even existing, let alone preaching anything. But, simply just a man existing named Jesus that preached is not an extraordinary claim. Specially in those times, there were hundreds of people preaching. So I will grant that around that time, some guy named Jesus preached to some people is quite possible. But I can't agree his preaching was "legit", as we don't even know if he existed, and it wouldn't matter if this turned out to be true.
> 
> But we can have valid points one way or the other. There is no evidence for the existence of bigfoot, Just because we can't prove bigfoot doesn't exist does not mean we can't logically say "I don't believe you" when someone claims bigfoot does exist. That's all we are doing with god, we are not disproving god, we are not claiming that a god doesn't exist. I am simply saying "I don't believe you" when someone says a god does exist.
> They try to offer what they think is evidence, and we logically and refute it and show why what they perceive as evidence is in fact, not evidence at all.
> The null hypothesis for claims is, it's not true till proven otherwise.


Not only was there many men named jesus, many men named jesus preaching, there were many men also performing miracles.


----------



## Hayduke (Dec 27, 2010)

Ever notice that the Mormons story of the messiah in North America...if I remember right...had a name that sounded a bit middle eastern...and the middle eastern messiah was clearly from Michoacan...I think somebody got their chocolate in my peanut butter!


----------



## crackerboy (Dec 30, 2010)

Hayduke said:


> This fool cannot agree with you...I suppose the BS that was given the pen name Jesus was for the most part nice...but we cannot agree because I do not believe he even existed...it's a big hoax! The Romans kept better records than the Mormons...If some rabble-rouser who people were calling the messiah was starting shit in Palestine and got nailed to a tree...they would have written it down!...Dude died and came back to life in front of others...and nothing written for near 60 years about him... It's like Elvis is on the Ed Sullivan Show, New Years Eve 2010...for the first time ever...



No other man on earth has had as large of an affect on society as Jesus Christ did. Your hoax has had a greater affect on the world than any other event in history. Why do you insist on lying to yourself. Do you really believe that it is possible for a myth to have had such a profound affect on this world.


----------



## mindphuk (Dec 30, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> No other man on earth has had as large of an affect on society as Jesus Christ did. Your hoax has had a greater affect on the world than any other event in history. Why do you insist on lying to yourself. Do you really believe that it is possible for a myth to have had such a profound affect on this world.


 Yes. 

Myths and superstitions have always had profound effects on people and society. It still doesn't make the stories true. Do you think that Mohammad's effect on a large percentage of people and society make his claims true? You're POV is very western-centric as well. Most of the eastern beliefs and cultures have no ties to Jesus whatsoever.


----------



## Hayduke (Dec 31, 2010)

crackerboy said:


> No other man on earth has had as large of an affect on society as Jesus Christ did. Your hoax has had a greater affect on the world than any other event in history. Why do you insist on lying to yourself. Do you really believe that it is possible for a myth to have had such a profound affect on this world.





mindphuk said:


> Yes.
> 
> Myths and superstitions have always had profound effects on people and society. It still doesn't make the stories true. Do you think that Mohammad's effect on a large percentage of people and society make his claims true? You're POV is very western-centric as well. Most of the eastern beliefs and cultures have no ties to Jesus whatsoever.


Thanks for saving my breath!

The myth of a fat burglar with flying ungulates seems to be overshadowing the Zombie gardener...


----------



## Tyrannabudz (Jan 11, 2011)

crackerboy said:


> No other man on earth has had as large of an affect on society as Jesus Christ did. Your hoax has had a greater affect on the world than any other event in history. Why do you insist on lying to yourself. Do you really believe that it is possible for a myth to have had such a profound affect on this world.


http://www.jesusneverexisted.com 

Knock yourself out. Just keep some tissue handy.


----------



## Sure Shot (Jan 11, 2011)

[youtube]jwp72LesRLU[/youtube]


----------



## shishkaboy (Jan 14, 2011)

i would like for any of the creationists to refute the claim that the worship of jesus is actually the worship of the sun itself. Or the fact that there have been many others with the same story just a dif name. i mean how many people can be born of a virgin, killed and resurrected 3 days later.


----------



## upthearsenal (Jan 16, 2011)

*"I, Jesus Christ, was in prison and I found a picture of Jesus Christ and in the picture He was pointing up to the sky with one arm and the other arm was horizontal and in the backround there was a strip of clouds."

schizophrenia?

I mean seriously, even the bible thumpers must think Welove1 is crazy...
*


----------



## Hayduke (Jan 16, 2011)

No! I am Brian!

GMO...that does mean something to the rest of us...it means MONSANTO...as close to pure evil in the quasi private sector as you can get...GMO Genetically Modified Organism...

And how many mothers named Mary would give their little bundle of joy a segundo premier of "Manuel" with the apellido of Oliveira but spell the premier..."George"...not "Jorge"!!!!

You are a full of yourself as you are full of shit. Jesus exists now...there are at least 20 of them that are enrolled at the local high school. But the ancient mythical hayseus and you Jorge are nothing more than tools for control. 

Shalom...but first...watch this to be raptured!

[youtube]lp1CmV2m4MQ[/youtube]


----------



## Hayduke (Jan 16, 2011)

If you did not get raptured...maybe you need a bit more religion...here is a sermon for this fine sunday morning...

Blessed are the Cheese makers!

[youtube]slbMe-aTY1A[/youtube]


----------



## upthearsenal (Jan 16, 2011)

Yeah, I know Jesús, he plays on my soccer team, but we just call him Chuy.


----------



## trishmybiscuits (Jan 18, 2011)

I've got news for you. Christianity was debunked once and for all 3 years ago:

http://www.unintimidatedpress.com/christianity.htm


----------



## guy incognito (Jan 18, 2011)

I know i've stated this before, but that link doesn't debunk shit. It has some decent points about christianity not making sense, but sometimes things don't make sense. It doesn't quite debunk it. For example:

"In fact, if the biblical account of creation was true then dinosaurs might still be walking the Earth today because Noah would've tossed them on the Ark with him, right? And one could even argue that, if the biblical account was true, humans never could've existed beyond Adam and Eve and their immediate offspring because they almost certainly would've been eaten by dinosaurs. I can see T-Rex foaming at the mouth now!"

This passage completely ignores the possibility of a species going extinct. I mean how are we guaranteed that the dinos would have existed from noahs ark until now?

Don't get me wrong, I agree with the conclusions, but I think this article does a poor job.


----------

