# ISLAM - just clearing a few things up for ya'll



## euthanatos93420 (Apr 13, 2007)

OKAY!!! I just read the racism thread and resisted the urge to reply (although I voted) because 90% of the thread belongs here.

Islam itself has nothing to do with "terrorists." Religion has and always will be an excuse for violence, war, hate, and persecution. Those of you who associate "islam" with "terrorist" are ignorant as shit to begin with. I'm not going to explain why you are ignorant as shit because ignorant people CHOOSE to be that way and nothing I say will dissuade you.

Actually I'm here to put you in the shoes of the ACTUAL terrorist. Then you might have a lot more respect for the muslims that choose NOT to get involved with the violence. In fact...you might wonder why they haven't...shit if I grew up in palastine I don't doubt I'd have volunteered to fly that fucking 747.

And I'm a White, long-haired, peace loving, pot smoking, HIPPIE!

CALM DOWN READ EVERYTHING BEFORE YOU REPLY!

WE started this shit. Back in '68 (may have began prior to this, however this is when israel officially "occupied" palastine. We started giving Israel $2BIL/yr for the EXPLICIT purpose of invading, occupying, and "reclaiming" "their" "holy land". Which by the way for you ignorant shits is MUSLIM holy grounds. Have you ever heard of Islamic violence & extremism before this? Fuck no. Americans didn't even know about Islam and palastine didn't give two shits about America. Right up until Israel invaded and dominated Palastine and america footed the fucking bill.

If you were born and raised in palastine you life might look something like this:

@ 13 my dad was given a piece of paper that said he had to register his property and his home with israeli authorities.

@15 We've been to the israeli's about two dozen times (mind you its a days trip to make this application for our own fucking land). They just bulldozed my best friends house and now he and some of his family live with us. I'm afraid they're going to tear down our house too. Where will my family go? Where will my friend and his family go? My family has owned this house for SEVENTEEN DOCUMENTED GENERATIONS!! We have all the paperwork..why won't the israeli's let us have our own fucking house? they patrol the streets daily. ANyone who argues with the soldiers our is out past curfew is shot on site no questions asked. We buried my uncle last week because a soldier stole his food and he argued with the Israeli who ended up shooting him.

@16 They bulldozed our house today. It's my fucking birthday! These Israeli's are fucking evil! Why do they do this to us? From what I gather they say this used to be there land because thousands of years ago their god promised it to them. FUck that bullshit they're just fucking evil. 

Our family has been taken in by one of my dads friends. He shows us these movies about how the Israeli's are supported by Americans. WHy would America do this to us? We live in poverty. From what they tell me america is full of luxeries and opulence. Being FAT is major problem. They grow SO MUCH FOOD their government BUY TWO BILLION DOLLAR OF CORN EVERY YEAR AND THROWS IT AWAY. On top of that they pay farmers even more money TO NOT GROW FOOD. I"M FUCKING HUNGRY!

--------

Tell me if this was your life story...you wouldn't be a little pissed at americans...ALL RELIGION ASIDE.

Throw a little mind programming propaganda in the mix and BOOM...I almost don't blame them...

Remember the 72 virgins that suicide bombers were supposed to get? if not there was a big media hype about this so-called-fact. Guess who started that and a hundred other anti-muslim propaganda.

Guess who's MAKING MONEY off this whole situation? 

Remember those are YOUR TAX DOLLAR AT WORK OPPRESSING THOSE PEOPLE. I'd be a little PISSED at me too.


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## euthanatos93420 (Apr 13, 2007)

Don't forget that these people are surrounded by gunfire and violence every day. 

Yet our Government will accuse me of being racist. They'll call me anti-semetic.

What pisses ME off is that so many americans are SO fucking clueless. The most they know about the war is "support the troops" We don't want what happened back after 'nam to happen to our boys today. Even if we'd like them home.

You've been told Saddam Hussein is the Evil Violent Oppressor. Guess who is really the evil violent oppressor.

ANYONE REMEMBER WACO??????

Gov't: THEY HAD WEAPONS!!!! So we torched them. 

I.E. Blew a hole on both sides of the compound and fans lit napalm through the place. It didnt BURN the people inside alive because they we're in another room. Women, Children and all were instead baked alive.

Press: Show us the weapons.

Gov't: WE ah...didn't find..err...ah...No...We're not authorized to release that information yet..er....ever I mean...go away. 

Sound's like Jr. just wasn't creative enough and thought the american public was stupid enough to buy the same bullshit twice....apparently he's fucking right about something.


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## euthanatos93420 (Apr 13, 2007)

As for my sources. I've BEEN to waco. My ex (2yr relationship) was from WACO and her father had one of his property siezed AFTER the incident because he turned down the gov'ts cash offer for the place. He never got it or any kind of compensation back. I've driven by the place. But to this day it's illegal to go on the property or anywhere near the "compound" and they DO watch that shit...

I've spoken to AMERICANS (white born n raised americans for those of you to whom that shit makes a diff) who have been to palastine and back and told me of these tradgedies I am relaying to you in the form of a hypothetical/fiction story that is a very similar to many ACTUAL people's stories. Don't believe me? Do your own research. The information is out there and your obviously intelligent enought to use the web to learn how to better grow and smoke fucking weed. So this shouldnt be difficult for you.


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## 7xstall (Apr 13, 2007)

very nice post.




(FYI - .223 bullets (used in M-16) are extremely cheap - about $0.05 each.)



.


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## kenneth_342 (Apr 13, 2007)

OK so what im getting from this is that th US is to blame for this whole mess. Am i right about that?


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## euthanatos93420 (Apr 13, 2007)

OK..I think your right about the bullets..I was pricing them just couple days ago and was coming up with what I thought read $1-2/bullet. But I just googled the remmington .223's again and your right on the dot with about 5 cents ea. Dunno what the fuck was up with that shit. But I've been out of weed and sporadically sleeping the last few days so IDK where the fuck that shit came from. I'll edit the post to remove that incrorect info....wierd thing is my friend was sitting right here and I swear to God he read the same shit I did...but I don't remember what website we were looking at...and I have to erase history and delete cookies everytime I use this fucking computer. Anyway...thanks for the tip.


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## euthanatos93420 (Apr 13, 2007)

You know after reading over my post...

...and invariably I will go back and fix every freaking typo sometime today or tommorow (I don't care if you see them but they will bug the fuck out of me as long as I know they're there with my fucking name on em)...

...I think that maybe I should've posted in polotics. Initially I thought that dude's post belonged in religion but the more I read my OWN diatribe seems it may belong in religion. I suppose if consensus of posters indicate such it'll get moved.


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 13, 2007)

Actually, I enjoyed reading your post. I have said exactly the same things before on this site. ViRedd, I'm sure could vouch for that.

I have never said that I don't sympathise with the muslim cause, and I have gone out of my way to learn about their plight. I have envisioned myself in a muslim's shoes when bombs are landing all around me, I have envisioned my family being blown to bits in front of my eyes. I have envisioned the hatred I would feel towards the West.

There are 2 sides. If you HAD to fight, if the war came to YOU. Which side would you be on? Know thine enemy.


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## Garden Knowm (Apr 13, 2007)

Euthan.. great fooking post mate.. great perspective... 
I feel for the peeps...

DO you think there is a idfference between having your entire village over run by..

1. Ants/termites - very common in africa..
2. Hurricane/ Tornado
3. Human armies

I ask... because, I often see this as the same thing... 

UNTIL I REMEMBER the worst part about being over run by humans is not having THE "HOLY LAND TAKEN AWAY" who gives a fook about LAND when the real dieses is, 

*it fooks up your brain*.. *it spreads the mental dieses of hate AND IGNORANCE....
*


Humans killing humans spreads soooooo much sadness and anger... it seems to take many many generations to heal and to forget....IT IS WORSE THAN NUCLEAR FALL OUT!

The truth is, the real problem the world has is not loosing land or property.. but trying to excercise the hate within themselves that has been ignited within them.... WE WILL ALL GET THAT LESSON

love


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## TheConstantGardner (Apr 13, 2007)

Forgive me if I offend, but I don't condone justifiable homicide and especially not hate driven revenge terrorist attacks that end in thousands of civilian deaths. If we were to be so lenient, every murderer from this day forward would be telling heart wrenching sob stories to justify gunning down an office full of accountants. That's just the way I feel. I'm not flying a jet into some sheiks palace just because I had to grow up with such high oil prices


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## qwerty (Apr 13, 2007)

fuck islam


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## mogie (Apr 13, 2007)

nicely put


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## silk (Apr 13, 2007)

euthanatos93420, thanks for the story. I think some of your points are great, such as: Islam itself has nothing to do with "terrorists."

And other points are horribly ignorant much like the ones you are responding to.
Here is an example: "Have you ever heard of Islamic violence & extremism before this? Fuck no. "

There were Islamic crusades just like the Christian ones. I would call that violence and extremism- or at the very least violence.

You make it sound like the backing of Israel has the world of Islam against Americans and all terrorist acts by Muslims are againts Americans for somewhat understandable reasons.

The truth is closer to that the world of Islam is it's own enemy. If Americans left Iraq, Muslims would still be killing Muslims.

Do you know where Mecca and medina are? That country which those cities lie are the US's greatest allie in the Middle east - and the ruling family is very tight with our dear monkey president and his family.
https://www.rollitup.org/../members/euthanatos93420.html


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## Garden Knowm (Apr 13, 2007)

TheConstantGardner said:


> Forgive me if I offend, but I don't condone justifiable homicide and especially not hate driven revenge terrorist attacks that end in thousands of civilian deaths. If we were to be so lenient, every murderer from this day forward would be telling heart wrenching sob stories to justify gunning down an office full of accountants. That's just the way I feel. I'm not flying a jet into some sheiks palace just because I had to grow up with such high oil prices


I don't understand...

are you saying that you don't condone carpet bombing desserts full of malnurished children.. 

or are you saying that it is cool.. to bomb the fuck out of innocent children

as long as THE intentions are 

1. to preserve the right to have drive through starbucks for people who accidenatlly got to FAT and now cant get out of their Escalade..
2. we use smart bombs aand the kids only get killed by accident
3. we don't send any of our own kids to do the fighting..

iloveyou


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## Garden Knowm (Apr 13, 2007)

silk said:


> euthanatos93420, our dear monkey president and his family.
> https://www.rollitup.org/../members/euthanatos93420.html


there is actually NO proof that he is a monkey...

just for the record... he's one of us.. yikes... 

iloveyou


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## Garden Knowm (Apr 13, 2007)

qwerty said:


> fuck islam


i bet 100 bucks you marry an islamic woman.. and if you don't your daughter will marry an islamic man.. karma... you have lessons to learn

iloveyou


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## silk (Apr 13, 2007)

Garden Knowm said:


> there is actually NO proof that he is a monkey...
> 
> just for the record... he's one of us.. yikes...
> 
> iloveyou


Nobody has offered him a banana in public! You know what I am talking about!


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## FilthyFletch (Apr 13, 2007)

The worlds probablem could easily be solved but people are to needed for a life reason and wont give up all religion. All religion is the rules to all the worlds problems. over who was given what by the bible or islam or the koran.All the differences in whose god is right or the true god.The human factor of weakness to not be able to except a day for what it is and the need for a higher reason why.Stop all that crap if we all had the simple easy to except midnset of we are humanes and we live to day then the next no one is the righteous no one is wrong for a religious beliefs.Think of the wars that would never have been, think of the terrorists acts done in alahs name that wouldnt happen, Think about palestine and isreal not so caught up on who owns gods land.Religion is the end of the world that has just not come to full fruition but will as weak minded people struggle to prove thier righteouness to thier imaginary god figure.STop being so needy and live life and live it good for the worlds sake not yur gods luv..


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## FilthyFletch (Apr 14, 2007)

And thank god Bush was here and nopt that basterd clinton. its like people only kinda paid attention when Bush stated the reason we were going into Iraq. All the dummies walking around" Oh WMDs where are the WMDs? They lied about them for oil" thos fuck heads are so retarded and should be made sterile as they paid no attention. You do remember all 3 reason stated for going in right? And if you paid attention 2 of the 3 were found to be true and the other was most likey true but sold off to iran at the last possible moment. What you think Irans brazen new attitude is becasue they woke up and got balls??Hey remember when the world was so mad the US waited so long to stop Hitler and his jewish genocide? Ever here of Saddam and the Kurd cleansing?I guess those quarter million people he killed with expiremental gas tests(which the bodies have been found and it did happen) dont count and we should have waited til he moved from his borders into Saudi Arabia again and perfected genocide. Then people like the French would be "Why doesnt america do something where are the Americans?'Thats what pissees me off pay attention watch history and learn from it to stop the same tradgedies from happening over and over.Bush stepped up when the world was scared and stopped WW 2 from happening again.I thank our President for his strong stand knowing it would not be a parade with metals and ice cream. You think he sits thinking how popular this made him? He knows but took a stand and promised our help and is standing keeping americas word Unlike most countries .We promised and we stood by our word as hard as it is.What about the rest of the world? where are they now?England and Blair stood by as he promised and stated.I have utmost respect for Blair and his word from his country even though they have the dummies we have whinning and crying"Its for the oil" yeah if it was didnt help much did it as prices are higher then ever.


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 14, 2007)

1000 years ago it was us cutting off the muslim heads (they got it from us, much like the scalping of the American Indians... I've read Geronimo's (auto?)biography), raping their women and robbing their riches.

Since Saladin defeated us at Constantinople we have never again had such a foothold. While we were there it was easier to transport riches back to England. We kept trying to take back a foothold but we were beaten back every time. Now we need to make up excuses to go over there and take what we NEED.

I have thought about this subject at length, and despite you thinking me ignorant I have analysed both sides of the tape. My mind is constantly changing and I may not hold this view forever but this is where it stands now:

If we had have sat on our arses when boats big enough to cross oceans were invented then we wouldn't be where we are today. We wouldn't have this great civilisation which eutha, you are a part of. It is great Eutha, it has given you the mind you have. In fact, we would most likely all be muslim. You likened me to the Nazi's, you are blind my friend. Pakistan... Pakistan is at the moment in the grip of civil war. The taliban in their black garb (very similar to an ss uniform in my mind) are taking over parts of Pakistan. This movement is very similar to the Nazi one, although to my mind it is much worse. Women are executed for the slightest transgressions. I've watched live footage of women being shot in the back of the head, one after the other in a football stadium. For reasons like a woman looking at another man. Know thine enemy. 

We're not picking on them just because we don't like them, the main reason is so that our great society can get even fatter. Now, we just need to finish the fucking job.


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## Jordy Villain (Apr 14, 2007)

nice post, man. By Israel being supported, armed, and funded by our government we made ourselves definite targets.
Just a note that the fundamentalist Islamic Jihad on the U.S. only started when we stationed troops in Saudi Arabia. That was our official 'desecration' of the Holy Land. A bunch of bs really..


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## Garden Knowm (Apr 14, 2007)

silk said:


> Nobody has offered him a banana in public!


 
LOL
ashahahahahahah


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 14, 2007)

Jordy Villain said:


> nice post, man. By Israel being supported, armed, and funded by our government we made ourselves definite targets.
> Just a note that the fundamentalist Islamic Jihad on the U.S. only started when we stationed troops in Saudi Arabia. That was our official 'desecration' of the Holy Land. A bunch of bs really..


Since when have we been targets of the palestinians? All they really want is their land back, we haven't taken any.

Actually you've made a good point. When I said that we no longer have a stronghold in the muslim world, I was wrong. Israel is that stronghold, our Constantinople. The Israeli's have gotten away with far worse atrocities than Saddam Hussein, which shows our true motives in the East. the Israeli secret service is probably the best in the world. Nobody understands a terrorist better than these guys.

There are two sides in this war. Crying and whinging about innocents is not going to stop the fact that we are in the midst of war. It is the muslims that first claimed this to be a holy war, calling ALL muslims to arms. They've had enough of our robbery, and we haven't had enough to stop doing it. We are at an impasse, either one side backs down or one has to be destroyed. The future is clear, for us to prosper we need to think with one mind, have one clear goal. There are going to be more casualties as we achieve this, and achieve it we will. religion is dead, we need to replace it with an ideal.


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 14, 2007)

It seems that I am wrong. My opinion that there is really no such thing as a moderate muslim have evaporated.

It seems that in my country the moderate muslims are rising up, in Bradford. Rival factions of muslims are fighting in the city.

Is this the sign we have been waiting for? The moderate muslims to finally decide which side they are on... Maybe it is the fighting in Pakistan that is finally forcing the muslim world to make a decision.

Now, it is just the Taliban that stand in the way...

Forgive my ignorance...


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## Jordy Villain (Apr 14, 2007)

skunkushybrid said:


> It seems that I am wrong. My opinion that there is really no such thing as a moderate muslim have evaporated.
> 
> It seems that in my country the moderate muslims are rising up, in Bradford. Rival factions of muslims are fighting in the city.
> 
> ...


what you're missing is that those crazy fuckers don't represent all of islam. its just like there being some soccer fights in the U.S. and then I say oh there's nothing such as a peaceful football match worldwide because we have crazy hooligans here. atleast 80% of the world's muslims are ACTUALLY following islam, which is a religion of peace.


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 14, 2007)

Jordy Villain said:


> what you're missing is that those crazy fuckers don't represent all of islam. its just like there being some soccer fights in the U.S. and then I say oh there's nothing such as a peaceful football match worldwide because we have crazy hooligans here. atleast 80% of the world's muslims are ACTUALLY following islam, which is a religion of peace.


I see that more now. I did before, but the moderate muslims seemed to be doing little about the extremists. Allowing hate to be preached in their mosques, and there was no REAL evidence that there was such a thing as a moderate muslim (at least not to someone like myself). I think that the 80% you speak of have finally taken note of the way people like myself were/are feeling and realise that they need to do something about it. In my country we have very large muslim communities. Black, white and muslim youths have all been fighting in my country, it's largely kept out of the media, and I think the moderate muslims have finally had enough of being labled.

The Taliban are spreading very quickly, and if they take Pakistan... they will hold a massive position of power.


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## preoQpydDlusion (Apr 14, 2007)

aggression towards the ignorant is just as bad as racism. most ppl are prejudiced against muslims because they dont know any better, not because they stubbornly ignore their better judgment.

i think its funny that middle-easterners have caught so much bullshit over the past few years. supposedly, folks assume that because they come from an arab nation that they are muslim (all my chaldean(sp?) friends are christian), and on top of that, their assumed to be sympathetic towards terrorists. does anybody remember when Islam was connected to blacks? when malcom x was raising hell the word 'muslim' was accompanied by a thought of black suits and the Nation of Islam.


making a big deal about prejudice bs isnt going to solve the problem. by ranting, u continue to spread a message of hate that continues to infect the population, even if u mean well. if u want to live in a world without hatred, do it. ignore all the bullshit. all these bigots are going to end up killing each other one day, and even if they dont, we're all going to have to join together if we dont want to be annihilated when the aliens come


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## mogie (Apr 14, 2007)

I still say the best answer to 911 would have been a big ass bomb in the sand.


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 14, 2007)

preoQpydDlusion said:


> aggression towards the ignorant is just as bad as racism. most ppl are prejudiced against muslims because they dont know any better, not because they stubbornly ignore their better judgment.
> 
> i think its funny that middle-easterners have caught so much bullshit over the past few years. supposedly, folks assume that because they come from an arab nation that they are muslim (all my chaldean(sp?) friends are christian), and on top of that, their assumed to be sympathetic towards terrorists. does anybody remember when Islam was connected to blacks? when malcom x was raising hell the word 'muslim' was accompanied by a thought of black suits and the Nation of Islam.
> 
> ...


I think it'll be us that comes to the Aliens.


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## j_g (Apr 15, 2007)

mogie said:


> I still say the best answer to 911 would have been a big ass bomb in the sand.


Ahh, the ever popular glass factory approach






It appears, OP, that you have gotten a few facts mixed up. 

First and foremost "we Americans" did not start this "shit." Britain, in the Sanremo Conference of 1920, was given control of the former Ottoman Empire's land in the region we now know as Israel, Palestine, Jordan, and Iraq. During WWI, the British promised the local Arabs of the region an independent Arab state in return for their support, and the Britain had promised to create and foster a Jewish national home as laid out in the Balfour Declaration of 1917.

The Palestinians didn't like the deal that they had made, and by June 15, 1920, attacks on the Jews had become such a threat, that the Jews established the Haganah (a paramilitary group). Between 1936 and 1939, the "Great Uprising" took place. In this time period, the Palestinians attacked the Jews (and yes, they used terrorist tactics), and the Jews attacked the Palestinians (and yes, the Jews were just as bad as the Arabs).

And then WWII started... Some Palestinians enlisted in the British Army, but others, such as Haj Amin Al-Husseini, declared jihad on the allied powers. War is hell blah blah blah... and the War ends. We now have a very chaotic Palestine/Israel. The UN steps in, and following the recommendations of the UNSCOP (United Nations Special Committee on Palestine; a group of member states, not including the "Great Power", who's job was to come up with a plan for Palestine) officially, taking affect after the British pullout, created two independent counties.

Little stuff takes place, and on June 5, 1967, the Six Day War commenced. It was not Israel who started the conflict, but the "peaceful Muslims." 




> Which by the way for you ignorant shits is MUSLIM holy grounds. Have you ever heard of Islamic violence & extremism before this? Fuck no


If you say "holy lands" everybody knows what you are talking about. This is because the "holy lands" are not just considered the closest location to heaven by Mohammedans, but considered holy by Jews and Christians alike.

And if we truly weren't "ignorant shits", we would have heard about "Islamic violence & extremism." 
So who's the ignorant shit now? "Just clearing a few things up for ya'll"


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 15, 2007)

The Palestinians had obviously been tricked in some way... there is no way a muslim would live next door to a jew willingly. No way.

Why do Muslims HATE jews? I know the christians hate them because of their betrayal of JC, but why do all muslims hate the jews?

I'd say that it was Israel that started the conflict, whether intentionally or not. Why would a jew even think they could live peacefully next door to a muslim? Why would the jews believe they would be welcome?

It doesn't make any sense.


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 15, 2007)

I'm also a little confused with your dates.

Wasn't Israel formed in palestine after world war 2? Britain was under pressure to find a home for all the survivors of the holocaust as not a single country wanted them. At this period of time everybody had a bad taste in their mouth at the sight of a jew... not just the germans, the british, americans, fucking everybody hated or disliked the jews.

So, nobody else wants them... and we are expected to believe that the muslims did?

Fuck off.


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## Smirgen (Apr 15, 2007)

The Palestinians were originally Syrians.


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 15, 2007)

I've done some checking, and here is what I found:


*The Birth of Isreal*​[FONT=Verdana, Arial][SIZE=-1]The state of Israel was proclaimed by the Jewish leader, David Ben Gurion, on May 14, 1948, and officially came into being on the 15th, after British Mandatory rule ended at midnight. In many minds, the birth of Israel is closely identified with the Nazi terror in Europe and the Holocaust, but in fact the conception of and planning for a Jewish state had begun some 60 years earlier. [/SIZE][/FONT]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]The Messianic idea of returning the Jews to their "promised land" had been a Puritan religious belief since the 16th Century. In the mid-19th Century, British politicians saw another value: that of having in place in the Middle East a Jewish entity sympathetic to the British Empire. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]Two phenomena made real these and the Jews' own previously vague aspirations of "return": the burgeoning European nationalism of the time, from which the Jews felt excluded; and the massacres, or pogroms, carried out by Tsarist Russia against its six million Jews, the largest single Jewish population in Europe, which spread into the Ukraine and Poland. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]By the 1880s, groups of desperate Russian and other Eastern European Jews were settling in Palestine, which was under the somewhat tenuous authority of the Turkish Ottoman Empire.[/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]The visionary Austrian-Jewish journalist, Theodore Herzl, clarified and gave political weight to the concept of Jewish nationalism - or Zionism - and a national home for the Jews in Palestine at the first Zionist Congress at Basle, in Switzerland, in 1897. He won wide Jewish backing for it, and tried, at first unsuccessfully, to encourage the British Government to support it. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]It was not until World War I, when British forces were at the gates of Jerusalem, in November, 1917, that the British Foreign Secretary, Arthur Balfour, anxious for Jewish support in the war, issued his epic yet ambiguous Declaration. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]This said the Government viewed "with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine..." [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]The Turks defeated, the British ruled Palestine as a military authority from 1917 until 1922. Then the League of Nations awarded Britain the Mandate to govern Palestine and prepare its citizens for self-government. From that moment, Jewish immigration from Europe increased phenomenally, with the British Cabinet pledged rigorously to honour Balfour's promise of a Jewish homeland, as it was interpreted by the Zionists. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]Already during the 1930s, the displacement of the Arab population began The Arabs of Palestine, not even referred to by name in Balfour's document, were increasingly angry at what they feared would be their eventual replacement and domination by an alien, inspired and technologically superior people of different religion. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]Bloody inter-communal rioting broke out during the 1920s, the most notorious example perhaps being the massacres of some 60 religious Jews in the town of Hebron, about 20 miles south west of Jerusalem. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]The situation intensified in the 1930s as Nazism spread across Europe, bringing more persecution and more and even more sophisticated and determined Jews to Palestine. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]The Arabs were incensed. In 1936, they rose in armed revolt, mainly against the British rulers they saw as authors of their plight. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]But they were disorganised, factional and poorly equipped. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]British soldiers searching Arabs during the revolt in the late 1930s By 1939, the British had crushed the uprising, ending for good effective Arab resistance to the Mandatory Power and the Zionist planners, and leaving behind a fractured Palestinian-Arab society. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]The Arab resentment, however, did force the British, first, to abandon a plan to partition Palestine into Arab and Jewish sectors; and seriously to restrict Jewish immigration at that very crucial moment, in 1939-40, when Hitler was at his most dangerous, conquering Europe and launching his mission to exterminate the Jewish people. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]The British idea was that the Arabs would rule Palestine, inside which would be established a finite Jewish entity. It was the Zionists' turn to be outraged and to work, successfully, to explode this stratagem.[/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]In 1948, the Jews in Palestine managed to establish their own state, Israel. The price to pay were decades of war and violence. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]The contrast between the growing Jewish society in Palestine - the Yishuv - and the indigenous, mainly Muslim Arab population could not have been greater.[/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]In 1917, two-thirds of the roughly 600,000 Arab population, were rural and village-based, with local, clannish loyalties and little connection with the towns. What passed for "national" Arab leadership was based in the towns, though there was little national identity. Two or three established, rival families dominated Palestinian politics. [/FONT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]The majority of the Jews arriving in Palestine were well organised, motivated and skilled. In the early 1920s, they set up an underground army, the Haganah, or Defence. A Jewish shadow government was set up, with departments which looked after every aspect of society: education, trades unions, farmers, the "kibbutzim" settlements that spread across Palestine, the law, and political parties. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]During World War II, Haganah fighters joined the British Army, acquiring military skills and experience. Not so the Arabs. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]At the same time, extremist groups such as the Irgun Zwei Leumi and the Lehi, or Stern Group, began a brutal campaign of assassinations, bombings, kidnappings, intimidations, disruptions and sabotage. Their actions were directed against Briton, Arab and even Jews. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]During the World War, the Zionist movement clearly defined its objective as a dominant Jewish state in Palestine. Deep plans were laid.[/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]After 1945, as the facts and consequences of Hitler's death camps became evident, the Jewish underground intensified the terror campaign to oust the British, whom they accused of Arab sympathies. Jewish organisations tried to restart unlimited immigration. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Verdana, Arial]Enormous emotional and political support for the Zionists came from the United States. The enfeebled postwar British Government no longer had the strength or the stomach to control Palestine or try to find a middle way that would suit both Jews and Arabs. [/FONT][/SIZE]


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 15, 2007)

[FONT=Verdana, Arial][SIZE=-1]
*Arabs rioted followed the UN vote* 

Britain handed the problem to the United Nations. On November 29, 1947, the UN General Assembly voted to partition Palestine into Jewish and Arab sectors. 

There was violent and total Arab opposition, but wild Jewish acclaim. Fighting started almost immediately. 

Even before the mandate ended, in April and May, Jewish fighters moved to protect, consolidate and widen the territory for the new Jewish state. Often they attacked areas designated for Arabs, and tried to depopulate Arab areas in the planned Jewish sector. 

On April 9, Jewish fighters massacred more than 200 Palestinian villagers, including old people, women and children, in the West Jerusalem village of Deir Yassin, causing widespread panic and greatly augmenting the flight of Palestinians from their homes across the country. 

As the Jewish authorities had predicted, Arab armies from Egypt, Jordan, Syria, Iraq and Lebanon tried to invade Palestine as soon as the British forces actually left. But the Arab campaign was a generally badly organised, uncoordinated affair with untrained units who were no match for the Haganah and, later, the Israeli Defence Force. 

The Palestinian militias and other Arab irregulars were also easily crushed. 

There was one exception: the British-trained and British-officered Arab Legion, under the command of King Abdullah of Jordan. But it was constrained financially and politically by the British-dominated King, who had already colluded with the Jewish leaders on territorial matters and who had ambitions in Palestine. 

The Arab Legion, therefore, was restricted to defending territory in and around East Jerusalem and the Old City and on the West Bank of the Jordan, which it did successfully. 

By the middle of 1949 up to 700,000 of about 900,000 Palestinian Arabs had left the affected region, forced out by a combination of Jewish/Israeli terror tactics, the frightening thrust of war, the contagious panic of local residents, fractious and incompetent Arab leadership, the flight of some richer and therefore influential families and the actual sale of Arab land to the Jews without coercion, often by absentee Arab landlords. 

These Palestinians had fled from their homes for ever, though they did not know it at the time. They ended up in the refugee camps of Lebanon, Syria, Jordan and Egyptian-run Gaza and in the Palestinian territory of the West Bank, which was ruled by the Jordanian King Abdullah, as was Arab East Jerusalem. 

Those Palestinian refugees and their descendants in the region now number more than three million. Israel has since refused to allow the refugees to return as long as Arab states remain pledged to its destruction, often claiming that there was no room for them anyway. 

Peace treaties and agreements with Egypt, Jordan and the Palestinian movement have not altered this.

In 1917, there had been 50,000 or so Jews in Palestine. By 1948, they had become 650,000 Israelis. At the same time, the majority of Palestinian Arabs had left Israel; only 200,000 or so withstood the war and other depradations and remained in Israel. 

Israel became a state on May 15, 1948, and was recognised by the United States and the Soviet Union that same day. 

Israel's Arab neighbours , however, united their forces to drive the Jews out of Palestine. 

BY:_ Tim Llewellyn._ 

*Israel - Land of Apartheid* By Professor Tanya Reinhart, September 2000

[/SIZE][/FONT]​


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## TheConstantGardner (Apr 15, 2007)

Garden Knowm said:


> I don't understand...
> 
> are you saying that you don't condone carpet bombing desserts full of malnurished children..
> 
> ...


I never said I agreed to carpet bombing children, nor do I agree with flying stolen jets into occupied buildings full of civilians. At least we aim for military and terrorist forces, not intentionally kill innocents.


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## Garden Knowm (Apr 15, 2007)

TheConstantGardner said:


> I never said I agreed to carpet bombing children, nor do I agree with flying stolen jets into occupied buildings full of civilians. At least we aim for military and terrorist forces, not intentionally kill innocents.


I see... I hope I did not come across rude... that was not my intention..

i am trying to figure out f you think it is ok to KILL under certain circumstances.. and if your answer is yes.. then my comment back is..

when ever somebody attacks.... regardless if it is military or not...

peoples moms, sisters, dads, brothers, wifes, etc get killed.. and that ripple of pain and negativity is not something that heals quickly... killing people, because they kill your family... may seem normal to an emotionl immature being... BUT the truth is ALL LIFE as equal... and once someonebecomes aware that we are all brothers and sisters (which takes very little awareness) one realizes it is doing nothing GOOD for the world as a WHOLE to kill another human.. under ANY circumstance..

iloveyou


KILLING is killing... it does matter weather you kill Hitler or the Dali Lama... the reprucussions are the same... we are all the same.... we can only see what we are... all the hatred that people see in others.... IT is really themselves they are seeing..


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 15, 2007)

Garden Knowm said:


> I see... I hope I did not come across rude... that was not my intention..
> 
> i am trying to figure out f you think it is ok to KILL under certain circumstances.. and if your answer is yes.. then my comment back is..
> 
> ...


Excellent post gk. Gave me a lot of food for thought. I have felt this way myself before then dismissed them once emotions set in again. We all realise exactly what you've said gk, the trouble is just trying to remember it.


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## TheConstantGardner (Apr 15, 2007)

I agree with you GK, killing is wrong but little can stop it. People have been warring with each other since we came down out of the trees (going to spark an evolution debate here). Each new technology we create allows us to wage war with greater efficiency. We used to battle for territory, now we battle for control of resources and because of religious differences. That will never change. People speak of world peace, but that dream is ultimately unobtainable as long as there are governments in existence. Our fear of each other leads us to building bigger and better weapons to destroy each other with. Maybe we should have more women as leaders. There would be no wars, only serious negotiations every 28 days


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## j_g (Apr 15, 2007)

Garden Knowm said:


> KILLING is killing... it does matter weather you kill Hitler or the Dali Lama... the reprucussions are the same... we are all the same.... we can only see what we are... all the hatred that people see in others.... IT is really themselves they are seeing..


As the Jews and Christians believe (although they definitely don't always show it), it is a sin against God to kill anyone; For God values everyone regardless of race or religion.


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## Garden Knowm (Apr 15, 2007)

skunkushybrid said:


> Excellent post gk. Gave me a lot of food for thought. I have felt this way myself before then dismissed them once emotions set in again. We all realise exactly what you've said gk, the trouble is just trying to remember it.


you my friend are LOVE


this is a constant struggle... when the war broke out in IRAQ.. the USA was swept with UNCONCIOUSNESS.... it was devastating to the collective thought.. 911 was a challenge that the AMERICAN people did not PASS.. not yet a tleast....so many people forgot the truth and were consumed by EMOTIONS... 

TRUTH is not an emotion..

Thank you for putting the icing on the cake!!!!


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## Garden Knowm (Apr 15, 2007)

The worst barbarity of war is that it forces men collectively to commit acts against which individually they would revolt with their whole being.
~Ellen Key

FEAR is - 

some men...in order to prevent the supposed intentions of their adversaries, have committed the most enormous cruelties...
~Clearchus, in Xenophon


Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent.
~Issac Asimov



A state of war only serves as an excuse for domestic tyranny.
~Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn


It is always easier to fight for ones principles than to live up to them.
~Alfred Adler


We will not learn how to live together in peace by killing each other's children.
~Jimmy Carter



I hope our wisdom will grow with our power, and teach us, that the less we use our power the greater it will be.
~Thomas Jefferson

That we are to stand by the president, right or wrong is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.
~Theodore Roosevelt


What is more immoral than war?
~Marquis de Sade


Every war when it comes, or before it comes, is represented not as a war but as an act of self-defense against a homicidal maniac.
~George Orwell


There is no way to peace. Peace is the way. 
~Mahatma Gandhi

...the role of the military is to fight and win war and, therefore, prevent war from happening in the first place.
~George W. Bush 


I object to violence because when it appears to do good, the good is only temporary; the evil it does is permanent.
~Mahatma Gandhi


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 16, 2007)

Although all excellent quotes and I enjoyed savouring them all, the last one seems sweetest.


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## FilthyFletch (Apr 17, 2007)

I liked mogies bomb the sand thereory.


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## preoQpydDlusion (Apr 17, 2007)

it doesnt matter if the "bad guys" live in the desert, atomic/nuclear weapons mess up the environment. every time a nuclear weapon is set off, the climate is effected all over the world. its said that even the americas have been contaminated with radioactive particles from hiroshima.

the US needs to chill the fuck out, and blood-thristy assholes need a new image. traditionally, anti-war protesters have either been tree-hugging hippies or fanatic picketers. both group accuse warmongers as being evil and power-hungry, giving the idea of war a macho image. but honestly, its just as easy to see that war is silly. soldiers are just confused and mislead individuals that figure killing people would be an easy way to get money and training to start off their careers.

kids watching sunday morning cartoons are growing up thinking that theres always a "bad guy" trying to cause havoc. after looking long enough, they find their scapegoats in the shape of funny-looking, weird-smelling foreigners. the people that u want to bomb arent evil, theyre just us on the other side of the planet. and if u havent figured it out by now, the "bad guy" is you. we all have a bad guy inside us, many of us dont let him come out instead of setting him free in the name of "liberty".

everybody who has been born is exactly the same. we were all nothing before, and we were dropped into this world that we didnt create. people cant be evil, we are all neutral, its what we make. the cultures we live in are living, changing beings that we have almost no control over. physical force should not be a natural way to change thses cultures. u cant shoot a culture, but u can shoot everybody in that society, right? stupid. and all u STUPID FUCKS that support this mindset are pulling the rest of us in with u. i dont want to be sucked dry from taxes for the rest of my life so little timmy can have a fire fight in the desert, but im gonna because too many in this country dont care.

the muslim extremists are decent guys. the reasons they hate us are the same reasons we hate ourselves, the just have the balls to do something about it.


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 17, 2007)

The extremists that fight military targets are decent people. Anyone that condones the murder of innocents, especially children, to my mind are evil.

If the Taliban takes Pakistan this has heavy implications for India, and the rest of the world. Pakistan is a divided country, yet a powerful one. We are not ready to share one mindset while there are two minds. the Taliban must not be allowed to grow. It is a fascist following of the like Hitler could only dream of. dedicated followers to whom their own lives mean nothing.


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## preoQpydDlusion (Apr 17, 2007)

im sure they value their lives as much as the rest of us, they just value their cause more. ill agree that killing innocents is evil, no two ways about it, but its bs to think we're any better. specially the US, if u go by numbers we're the most evil country in human history.

if the taliban gains significant military power, a war might make more sense. the guys are practically using the same caliber bombs as kentucky highschoolers. the 911 attacks took out 3,000 international citizens and that was a bit of a hail-mary, and in this day n age of over-population its not gonna hurt to thin the herd a bit.

our tax money should be spent on more productive projects


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 18, 2007)

preoQpydDlusion said:


> im sure they value their lives as much as the rest of us, they just value their cause more. ill agree that killing innocents is evil, no two ways about it, but its bs to think we're any better. specially the US, if u go by numbers we're the most evil country in human history.
> 
> if the taliban gains significant military power, a war might make more sense. the guys are practically using the same caliber bombs as kentucky highschoolers. the 911 attacks took out 3,000 international citizens and that was a bit of a hail-mary, and in this day n age of over-population its not gonna hurt to thin the herd a bit.
> 
> our tax money should be spent on more productive projects


Sorry to be a pedantic mofo preo, but you can't say they value their lives as much as we do and then contradict yourself straight away by saying, they just value their cause more. How many of us would blow ourselves up to take out 10 of their men? We can't even fight them fairly, we come across a concentration of enemy trooops (say 20 taliban fighters) and we send in air strikes, even if we outnumber them. The difference with us is that we want to be better. The Taliban are evil, women tortured and executed in a football stadium (I've seen the undercover footage taken by a female reporter, very brave woman) for things like looking at another man, or maybe it just looked that way. The women were lined up, about 20 then shot in the back of the head in front of a packed stadium. This footage was taken well before 9/11.

We are not evil, we are fighting to make the world how WE want it. The rest of the world is doing the same. It's not just the US, there is Europe too, even Japan and China are not concerned with war, at least not with us. Even the rest of the muslim world are fighting against the taliban. Yet in Pakistan, a country with, I believe, 5 nuclear weapons... it is heavily divided. If the Taliban get control of Pakistan the world is for a wake-up call.

This fight is not for nothing, we need to move more troops into Pakistan to help defend it.


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## euthanatos93420 (Apr 18, 2007)

Yeah..it would just suck if muslims were given pakistan back...I mean its not like the israelites could be allowed to live any fucking where else on this world & take their nukes with em. No they gotta be right fucking there (so the temple can be rebuilt & hence armageddon).


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 18, 2007)

euthanatos93420 said:


> Yeah..it would just suck if muslims were given pakistan back...I mean its not like the israelites could be allowed to live any fucking where else on this world & take their nukes with em. No they gotta be right fucking there (so the temple can be rebuilt & hence armageddon).


What are you talking about? It is the muslims in pakistan that are fighting the taliban. Or are you saying there is only one kind of muslim?


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## kenneth_342 (Apr 18, 2007)

The problem with fighting the taliban or any extremist group is the fact that WE DONT KNOW WHO WE ARE FIGHTING. Its not like in ww2 where there were frontlines with men lining up and fighting. The way all these wars are going right now We have no idea who the hell we are fighting. Could be the shop owner on the side of the street or the 12 year old kid on the next block. That is the biggest problem right now. If they were wearing uniforms it would make life alot easier wouldnt it. The wqay it is right now though its either time to get the fuck out and let them sort it out or just go and start shooting. I know either way isnt the best answer. But what can ya do?


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## preoQpydDlusion (Apr 18, 2007)

skunkushybrid said:


> but you can't say they value their lives as much as we do and then contradict yourself straight away by saying, they just value their cause more.


i dont see the contradiction, most ppl i know will refuse to say that their own life is their greatest concern. whether theyre lying or not can go up for speculation, but saying that the muslim bombers dont value their lives takes away from their beliefs. thats just how bad they want their cause to succeed, and theyd rather die than live in a corrupt world.


i think we should get the hell out. say sorry, thro some money around and get america out of this situation, and if i fry in a few years i hope i get the big blast instead of the fallout.


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 18, 2007)

What greater concern can there be, than ones own life?

Even if you value a loved ones life more than your own this still concerns your own life, and your own internal happiness. To actually die for them is something else entirely.

I do see your point.

Yet, are we to allow this fascist regime to thrive? It will gain strength, and in 20 years when ww3 is upon us we will say that we should have finished the job here. 

Hitler was allowed to grow and gain support from across the globe, it would be a folly to allow the Taliban to do the same.


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## kenneth_342 (Apr 18, 2007)

skunkushybrid said:


> Yet, are we to allow this fascist regime to thrive? It will gain strength, and in 20 years when ww3 is upon us we will say that we should have finished the job here.
> 
> Hitler was allowed to grow and gain support from across the globe, it would be a folly to allow the Taliban to do the same.


\

K But the real question is what to do about it?


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## preoQpydDlusion (Apr 18, 2007)

the talilban wont be taken out thru military force. these guys are intelligent gorilla fighters and theyre not going to sign a treaty, we're never going to _finish the job_. theyre alwase going to be a threat as long as we continue to live the way we do.

i do think we should do something to keep ww3 from happening, but this is a great time to let go of our pride and change ourselves. america doesnt have culture, our culture is based on gluttony and excess. we are the devil, thru and thru. i agree with u that ones own life is probly everybodies greatest concern, whether they accept it or not, and this is another point that shows how satanic our culture really is. so if we change our culture, or lack of, we wont be losing anything but pride. stupid, ridiculous pride that only we value. this pride is what has dragged this country (and any other european-minded country) thru so much shit.

so i say, all of the folks out there that say they want to be "good people" should do it instead of living guilt-ridden, watered-down satanic lifestyles. if everybody does that then the taliban wont be such meanies. and if everybody accepts their tru nature and find that they really do want to kill these guys, we should wait for a more productive attack plan instead of playing hide-n-seek in the desert.


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 19, 2007)

I can't agree with that preo'. We live life, it is not a watered down satanic life. I live with morals, these morals might seem slightly satanic to one person yet hardly satanic at all to another.

So, you're suggesting we should live more like the taliban do just to get them to leave us alone? I hope you were stoned when you wrote this. You can't be serious?


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## preoQpydDlusion (Apr 19, 2007)

sorry for being unclear, im referring to laveyan satanism. if ur unfamiliar, self responsibility and hedonism is the name of the game in satanism. its not a matter of opinion, its a fact that western civilization is full of people living flaccidly satanic lives. or in the eyes of a muslim, sinful.

the extremist muslims dont like this type of thing. muslim women dont necessarily cover their faces because their men force them to out of dominance, their faces are covered because the female form arouses carnal desire. in islam sexuality is reserved for intimate relationships, its not exploited to manipulate strangers.



skunkushybrid said:


> So, you're suggesting we should live more like the taliban do just to get them to leave us alone? I hope you were stoned when you wrote this. You can't be serious?


_just_ to get them to leave us alone? from what u make it seem like, they might have nuclear weapons in a few years and they dont like us being alive, so there seems to be alot to be lost. let go of the pride for a second and consider the facts

-we're never going to defeat these guys, the best thats gonna be done is scare the last hundreds/thousands of them into hiding. theyll pretend to be cool, but while they live amongst the nice muslims theyll still grow in strength.

-people are alwase whining about how shitty our cultures are. "oh my gosh, u see these girls nowadays with their thongs and hot pants?" "look at all these fat, stupid children playing their video games." "america is the most wastefull country on the planet with _blank_ tons of trash thrown out every day..."

we need to make our countries more socially conscious. we need to do this for our own sake and if we keep some crazy fucks from blowing us up in the process, even better. obviously, the extremists have rather extreme views of what is respectable or not, so we probly wont all live up to their standards. 

maybe theyll always be a thorn in our side, maybe theyre gonna be content with living like this for ever, but i cant see a society based on strict self-denial lasting very long.

now im not advocating that every country's military should run away, im saying that america's should. we have too much shit going on here to _try_ to play superman once again. in my neighborhood 40 yr old women are pulling double shifts at mcdonalds, doing paper routes because they cant afford their lower-middle class lifestyle. every day more and more americans are truly suffering trying to get by day by day, and our government continues to spend money on war.

today, right now, i dont give a FUCK whats going on in sand-monkey land. they could all die as i speak and it wouldnt effect my daily life in the least. what does effect my life is that im seemingly doomed to live a shitty life because the economy that supports this country has dealt me a bad hand. even worse, i know for a fact that im not alone, millions of people in this country live in similar or worse communities and the government says "tough luck! it wouldnt be _fair_ to help u out, u didnt earn it!" while 5 yr old kids have imported japanese cell phones made of pure platinum, not more than 15 miles away from my house.


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 19, 2007)

My country is prospering. I am too. I am neither fat and I don't mind women walking around in thongs. Arouses carnal desire? So what?

You don't even understand (it seems) what even moderate muslims do to their women. In Pakistan honour killings are frequent. If the man has the suspiscion that his wife is looking at other men in a lustful way he can beat, and in extreme cases kill the woman. The man, after claiming it as an honour killing, will most likely pay a fine. Women are fighting for their lives within this religion, most too afraid to speak out.

One case is of a woman suspected of looking lustfully at another man. Her husband hung her upside down by her feet and beat her with a stick. Then he gouged out both her eyes before pouring petrol on her and setting her on fire. The woman survived and it took her 10 years and the attention of the world to get some justice. Her husband was sentenced to a term in prison. She is now a leading figurehead of the womens movement in Pakistan. How much harder will it be for these women if the Taliban take control?

I can't sympathise with the state of your economy, or the fact that you don't have a platinum mobile (I haven't got one either btw). I can sympathise with a guy that's got no money, but you can't blame your government for this. there are ways to make money preo'. There's no excuse to start living like muslims.

WTF are you talking about preo', seemingly doomed to live a shitty life? What sort of an outlook is that?


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## kenneth_342 (Apr 19, 2007)

Ok skunky so how do we get rid of the problem?


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 19, 2007)

We have to keep fighting. Move more troops into pakistan to stop the taliban from gaining ground.


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## kenneth_342 (Apr 19, 2007)

Right on i agree with that 110 percent.


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## preoQpydDlusion (Apr 20, 2007)

skunkushybrid said:


> My country is prospering. I am too. I am neither fat and I don't mind women walking around in thongs. Arouses carnal desire? So what?


cool to hear about ur prosperity and health, guess my comments dont describe u, but they pretty big problems in the US. i enjoy random eye candy too, but daily exposure to sexual images (be it real-life or thru the media) desensitizes you, thats the obvious bad side. marriages fail more often than succeed in this country, families are broken, and children grow up in unstable environments.



skunkushybrid said:


> You don't even understand (it seems) what even moderate muslims do to their women. In Pakistan honour killings are frequent. If the man has the suspiscion that his wife is looking at other men in a lustful way he can beat, and in extreme cases kill the woman. The man, after claiming it as an honour killing, will most likely pay a fine. Women are fighting for their lives within this religion, most too afraid to speak out.
> 
> One case is of a woman suspected of looking lustfully at another man. Her husband hung her upside down by her feet and beat her with a stick. Then he gouged out both her eyes before pouring petrol on her and setting her on fire. The woman survived and it took her 10 years and the attention of the world to get some justice. Her husband was sentenced to a term in prison. She is now a leading figurehead of the womens movement in Pakistan. How much harder will it be for these women if the Taliban take control?


guess im rather naive in how brutal muslim society can be. i still dont think its the US's responsibility to try to police the situation. maybe if we had our shit together (like your lovely country) itd make more sense to lend a helping hand. besides, and help from the US should be looked as a double-edged sword anyway. any society that we "help", we end up keeping our hand in the pot well after the fact, spreading our power all over the globe.



skunkushybrid said:


> I can't sympathise with the state of your economy, or the fact that you don't have a platinum mobile (I haven't got one either btw). I can sympathise with a guy that's got no money, but you can't blame your government for this. there are ways to make money preo'. There's no excuse to start living like muslims.
> 
> WTF are you talking about preo', seemingly doomed to live a shitty life? What sort of an outlook is that?


im not looking for sympathy, im just letting u kno how it is. (and for the record, i doubt they make cell phones out of platinum. i was just saying that to point out the contradictory logic of our government) i can and will put blame on my government for the way our country is. its their job to look after us and theyre doing a shitty job. theres ways to make money? i think u missed my point. _theyre aint_. im sure its hard to believe if u buy into all the hype coming from this countries entertainment media, but we really aint doin all that hot. there are no jobs available around here. none. i aint bullshittin. i would have to leave my family behind (theyre all in debt, forced to stay where they are till they die).......

fuck. i give up. like u said, this aint a good outlook on life. im not usually this pissed off about stuff, i usually dont involve myself with political issues. frankly, i think its lame that the taxes in this country (i understand that we pay less of a percent in taxes than most european countries) are bleeding the poor dry and we arent getting much back in return. and if ur questioning my definition of poor its anybody who can barely afford the necessities of life. and that describes me and just about everybody i know. i dont live in a ghetto, i live a standard american lifestyle. and even if only 25&#37; of the country is like me or worse, i think the government should spend more time helping its own instead of waging war.

i said whats on my mind, i guess i kno now to stay away from political discussions. i barely have my own shit together half the time, its silly to think i can even fathom what would be best for others.


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 20, 2007)

Preo', you and I are very similar in regards to what we can afford.

Yet, truly it is all about perspective, it is a fact of life that when you have more money your cost of living goes up to match it. Suicides amongst the rich are just as frequent as they are with the poor. Problems are the same. Having more money is only good when you get it as a bonus. If it becomes regular income your needs will start to go up.

When I said I was prospering, I suppose I meant (more than anything else) mentally. I am a writer that hasn't written a word in over 3 years, although with this skill of mine time can only improve it. 
I make my money illegally, I've never even had a bank account in my name. I'm hardly prospering in a material sense either I suppose, but one day preo'... one day I will.

You have to believe that everything is going to turn out alright in the end. If you have faith in this fact something WILL come along. Positive attitudes are welcomed in society, others will feed from it. 

Do you cultivate preo?


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## preoQpydDlusion (Apr 20, 2007)

no, it wouldnt work well with my living arrangements. some day tho. but i do have a pretty positive mindset. shit just gets tiring after a while, sometimes i fall back into how i used to look at things, u kno?


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## skunkushybrid (Apr 20, 2007)

Yeah, I have days like that. rare, but I have them.


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## closet.cult (May 4, 2007)

ethanatos: i appreciate your knowlege of the events. relating the 'big picture' is essential to making informed decisions, and avoiding prejudice.

but i disagree with your tone. being ignorant of something is just uninformed. berating others for NOT knowing what you know may have your message lost. no offence...

good comments everyone. i've learned some things i didn't know. but, imagine the behind the scenes, classified info we'll never know, which really drives the war machine decisions.


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## mjetta (May 31, 2008)

"a wise man knows an ignorant man because he was once ignorant, but an ignorant man does not know a wise man because he was never wise"


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## Garden Knowm (Jun 8, 2008)

mjetta said:


> "a wise man knows an ignorant man because he was once ignorant, but an ignorant man does not know a wise man because he was never wise"







and a wise man that judges an ignorant man.... slips back into ignorance...

iloveyou


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## cr4zy1w4n (Jun 8, 2008)

u all know how it is... its loads of bollocks....and why we white are allways raicist?? that crap always works in one way... save my opinion 4 me...


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## mjetta (Jun 9, 2008)

Garden Knowm said:


> and a wise man that judges an ignorant man.... slips back into ignorance...


im confused, were you agreeing or disagreeing? either way, true


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## surfnsk8er (Jun 9, 2008)

lol i feel like saying something but i will refrain, it starts with nuke, and ends with country


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## ToastedFox (Jun 9, 2008)

Every religion has it's crazies, a good 75% of any religion is one too!


I just don't get why its so hard for people to believe this kinda ordeal caused 9/11.


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## mjetta (Jun 9, 2008)

soo many killings happen in the name of other religions its crazy, its just not in the news because its not as interesting. I.E, shortly before 9/11, two rabbis were arrested for planning to bomb a large mosque in florida. Im sure no one has heard this, of course not, cnn, fox etc.. dont think that qualifies as news


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## euthanatos93420 (Jun 10, 2008)

mjetta said:


> soo many killings happen in the name of other religions its crazy, its just not in the news because its not as interesting. I.E, shortly before 9/11, two rabbis were arrested for planning to bomb a large mosque in florida. Im sure no one has heard this, of course not, cnn, fox etc.. dont think that qualifies as news


You only hear what they want you to hear. Mainstream media holds %87 of popular opinion. They can literally tell you who to vote for now with mainstream media.


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## mjetta (Jun 12, 2008)

Garden Knowm you seem like an intelligent person to me. let us meet, smoke some ganga, and discuss the world in depth


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## Dfunk (Jun 13, 2008)

WOW...I just got done reading all the posts on this thread...and I'm at a loss for words. Communication like this is great.


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## PoseidonsNet (Jun 17, 2008)

great thread
hear ! hear !
bomb the infidels !


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## mrmeangreens (Jun 17, 2008)

euthanatos93420 said:


> You only hear what they want you to hear. Mainstream media holds %87 of popular opinion. They can literally tell you who to vote for now with mainstream media.


Well...let's see. If they're telling me to vote fucking green party, then why aint my fucking candidate winning every election. Huh? There's your first hole I've discovered...It's sad to see this. On every side...White-black...Thesist-Atheist...Fanatic-Moderate. I'm sorry to say Euthanatos, that with a moniker like yours (the Euthanatos being a cult based around the wheel of life and death) you would have no problem seeing loved ones die, that's how the great Circle Spins. Birth-Death-Rebirth. Apparently you didn't buy that Mage Supplement?Long Live the Christian Reich! Death to the Unbelievers! Death to the people that believe the same way we do but call God a different name! Death to Nonconformity(lalalalalalalalalalalalala!) {boom} Death to Death...?!?Fuuuuck...why is this even a fuckin forum? Politics be like religion be like sex preference be like soda preference be like what you call Santa be like whatever...Everyone has an asshole and opinon and you definately ain't gonna change mine, so what is the fucking point of this forum except to breed contempt amongst growers instead of breeding righteous delta-9 strains?Anyone?p.s. I lived every Saturday night (when I was alot more young then I am now) as a Mage, guy, so don't even turn this one around...you opened the worms...you fish with'em. I can White Wolf outgeek any'em.Ask me anything I can answer...


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## Babs34 (Apr 9, 2009)

euthanatos93420 said:


> OKAY!!! I just read the racism thread and resisted the urge to reply (although I voted) because 90% of the thread belongs here.
> 
> Islam itself has nothing to do with "terrorists." Religion has and always will be an excuse for violence, war, hate, and persecution. Those of you who associate "islam" with "terrorist" are ignorant as shit to begin with. I'm not going to explain why you are ignorant as shit because ignorant people CHOOSE to be that way and nothing I say will dissuade you.
> 
> ...


 *Dude, I'm way way WAY too tired to even address this post. Just the first few sentences show me that you, like so many NUMEROUS American's are oblivious to what Islam truly represents. Try intensely studying the "religion"...for that matter, attempt a short course.*
*I'm so tired, I will only address the first lie..........*
*"We"....."America" did not help any single country "occupy" Palestine. Israel just always was. Whether you believe in any religion, any "book".............Bible came first.....grasp onto the rest.*


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## Babs34 (Apr 9, 2009)

*Oops, I skimmed over to the end.*
*Nope, suicide bombers alone were not alloted those 72 virgins. Mohammad promised those virgins. "For what deed" you ask? Go study...*


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## Babs34 (Apr 9, 2009)

TheConstantGardner said:


> Forgive me if I offend, but I don't condone justifiable homicide and especially not hate driven revenge terrorist attacks that end in thousands of civilian deaths. If we were to be so lenient, every murderer from this day forward would be telling heart wrenching sob stories to justify gunning down an office full of accountants. That's just the way I feel. I'm not flying a jet into some sheiks palace just because I had to grow up with such high oil prices


 Amen.........Amen.
I'm done.


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## DaveTheNewbie (Apr 12, 2009)

racism is a crime, and white people dont commit crimes.

just joking


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