# Mammoth p microbes



## TreeFiddy350 (Feb 9, 2019)

Has anybody used this compared to other products? It seems a little pricey. For the people who have used it and others, what did you think about it? Worth the money? If so, why?


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## NoWaistedSpace (Feb 9, 2019)

Yes, it's worth the $. Been using it for about 3 years along with Recharge.
It goes a long way. You only use like .5 ml/ gal, I think.


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## Renfro (Feb 9, 2019)

I like Tribus better.


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## TreeFiddy350 (Feb 9, 2019)

Renfro said:


> I like Tribus better.


Why do you like it better?


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## Renfro (Feb 9, 2019)

TreeFiddy350 said:


> Why do you like it better?


I have used many different products and nothing made for better looking and abundant roots in DWC. A friend turned me on to the stuff and I was blown away. No other microbial product I have tried (including mammoth P) has ever impressed me this much. Lots of beautiful white roots.


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## TreeFiddy350 (Feb 10, 2019)

Renfro said:


> I have used many different products and nothing made for better looking and abundant roots in DWC. A friend turned me on to the stuff and I was blown away. No other microbial product I have tried (including mammoth P) has ever impressed me this much. Lots of beautiful white roots.


What type of medium do you grow in?


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## 5BY5LEC (Feb 10, 2019)

I think it is made here in CO. I about choked up my food when I saw the prices. 
For what it costs, it better keep my water clean, feed my plants and change my res when it needs it lol.
Tribus?
-_Bacillus subtilis_

-_Bacillus amyloliquefaciens_

-_Bacillus pumilus_
That looks great. I use Orca with Hydroguard to get me those extra microbes. I might try it.


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## NoWaistedSpace (Feb 10, 2019)

250ml bottle of Mammoth P lasts me a year.
Spend 25 bucks for a 60ml sample and give it a try.
Will make 100 gallons. (.6ml/gal)
I can only speak for organic "living soil" grows.


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## Renfro (Feb 10, 2019)

TreeFiddy350 said:


> What type of medium do you grow in?


Currently Berger BM6 HP. Have done DWC before for several years. I have grown so many ways it's funny. Every once in a while I just change things up. I'm silly like that lol

Thing about Tribus, the guy studied shit and came to the conclusion that too many microbe species is actually counterproductive. Thats why tribus works so well,


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## NoWaistedSpace (Feb 10, 2019)

Renfro said:


> Currently Berger BM6 HP. Have done DWC before for several years. I have grown so many ways it's funny. Every once in a while I just change things up. I'm silly like that lol
> 
> Thing about Tribus, the guy studied shit and came to the conclusion that too many microbe species is actually counterproductive. Thats why tribus works so well,


Have you read "Teaming With Microbes"?


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## Renfro (Feb 10, 2019)

NoWaistedSpace said:


> Have you read "Teaming With Microbes"?


No.


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## Renfro (Feb 10, 2019)

I have used Orca in the past, Age old mycorrhizae, Mammoth P... But Tribus original outperformed them in my personal grows. I don't have the logic behind it but it works. The guy at Impello could probably explain it for us however for me it's a winner. This run I am using up my leftover supply of Age Old. After that I will be Tribus all the way.


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## 5BY5LEC (Feb 10, 2019)

It makes sense. A lot of the microbes in Orca are just hype in my opinion, because a lot of them do not do any good in pure water hydro. Or so I read.
I have to say though, the stuff did me right. I just want to simplify down the microbes in it that actually did the work.


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## Coloradoclear (Feb 10, 2019)

NoWaistedSpace said:


> 250ml bottle of Mammoth P lasts me a year.
> Spend 25 bucks for a 60ml sample and give it a try.
> Will make 100 gallons. (.6ml/gal)
> I can only speak for organic "living soil" grows.


Where did you find the 60ml samples?


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## NoWaistedSpace (Feb 10, 2019)

Coloradoclear said:


> Where did you find the 60ml samples?


Ebay


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## Renfro (Feb 11, 2019)

I got an explanation from the makers of Tribus.

_"The bacteria in Tribus are the most dominant bacterial species in the cannabis rhizosphere (because the plant selects for them) and provide a number of advantages in practical application: their spore-forming ability helps them persist in unfavorable environments and means they can be tank-mixed with incredibly concentrated fertilizers and/or pesticides, they produce an incredible diversity of enzymes, antibiotic compounds, and even some phytohormones, and they are ultimately capable of promoting plant growth through every known microbial growth-promoting mechanism (i.e., nutrient cycling, pathogen resistance, improved water uptake, etc).

Tribus is composed of a limited consortia of microbes (3-7 species) at extremely high concentrations (10 billion CFUs/ML). Older gen. inoculants (like Great White by Plant Success) have 20+ microbes at lower concentrations. You will hear these companies pitch the benefits of microbial diversity in their product. The problem with that is that is two-fold: 1) the plant is highly selective in its rhizosphere microbiome and rarely supports more than a few dominant bacterial species and 2) no one in the world has the ability to quantify the interactions between dozens of microorganisms. There was a paper published recently by a biophysicist that looks at the maximum number of microbe-microbe interactions that we can quantify in an ecosystem (soil, petri dish, or otherwise); he concluded that when there are more than ~17 microbes interacting with each other, there are more possible microbe-microbe interactions than their are atoms in the visible universe. In turn, products with that many microbes cannot be quantifiably analyzed for efficacy. What we can do today, however, is pick the 3, 4 or 5 most productive species that the plant selects for in its root zone and actually quantify what's going on.

We are trying to keep things simple- by focusing on the most productive species at high concentrations we can better quantify and attribute growth to microbe interactions. Our inoculants are purely bacteria and water, and nothing else. We know they aren't competing with each other in the rhizosphere which we can't confidently say for older-gen inoculants with 10+ species. Also, the high concentration ensures there is also a consistently high population of our good bacteria in the rhizosphere! At 10 billion CFUs/mL we are over 50x more concentrated per mL than most other inoculants."_


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## Zephyrs (Feb 14, 2019)

TreeFiddy350 said:


> Has anybody used this compared to other products? It seems a little pricey. For the people who have used it and others, what did you think about it? Worth the money? If so, why?


I have used mammoth P and then bushdoctor microbe brew and without a doubt mam P out performed the bushdoct. By far. In my opinion, the mammoth P is a lil pricey but highly effective for a big full beautiful root mass. BD not so much. Bottom line here is ya get what ya pay for in that dept. JM2C.


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## CikaBika (Feb 14, 2019)

Renfro said:


> I like Tribus better.


Do you have a link?


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## smokebros (Feb 14, 2019)

@Renfro Thanks for the knowledge drop. Do you use just the grow microbes, bloom, or both? I've had really good results using Orca in conjunction with Mammoth P, but I'm always open to trying new things. I've heard lots of great things about Tribus.


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## Renfro (Feb 14, 2019)

CikaBika said:


> Do you have a link?


https://www.impellobio.com/tribus-original/



smokebros said:


> @Renfro Thanks for the knowledge drop. Do you use just the grow microbes, bloom, or both? I've had really good results using Orca in conjunction with Mammoth P, but I'm always open to trying new things. I've heard lots of great things about Tribus.


I just use the original currently, haven't tried their grow or bloom formulas.


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## 5BY5LEC (Feb 15, 2019)

I like the sound of the Tribus. I have 5 gallons of Hydroguard I bought for next to nothing and need to use up first though ugh.


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## CikaBika (Feb 15, 2019)

Renfro said:


> https://www.impellobio.com/tribus-original/
> 
> 
> I just use the original currently, haven't tried their grow or bloom formulas.


Thank you a lot!!


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## CikaBika (Feb 15, 2019)

Renfro said:


> https://www.impellobio.com/tribus-original/
> 
> 
> I just use the original currently, haven't tried their grow or bloom formulas.



I recived this today.. It was ordered waay before I saw your post.. I'm free to hear any advice how to use it?? Im watering my soil every 4 days..


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## Renfro (Feb 15, 2019)

CikaBika said:


> I recived this today.. It was ordered waay before I saw your post.. I'm free to hear any advice how to use it?? Im watering my soil every 4 days..
> View attachment 4283085


I have no experience with those exact products, however I normally inoculate for the first few weeks, and use some form of simple sugar as well (to feed them). After a few weeks there should be a good population existing in your medium so you can stop using it and just feed them with the simple sugars, maybe hit with a booster every few weeks. (unless in hydro then use it all the time).


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## waxman420 (Feb 15, 2019)

Any one have any idea why these products aren't available in canada


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## CikaBika (Feb 16, 2019)

Renfro said:


> I have no experience with those exact products, however I normally inoculate for the first few weeks, and use some form of simple sugar as well (to feed them). After a few weeks there should be a good population existing in your medium so you can stop using it and just feed them with the simple sugars, maybe hit with a booster every few weeks. (unless in hydro then use it all the time).


Hm I read that mycro should be used more than once? Like it can cause more harm than good?
But I dl. AN chart and they say that you add piranha and nirvana (their version of mycro and bacteria) with every feeding
I'm confused now..


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## Renfro (Feb 16, 2019)

CikaBika said:


> Hm I read that mycro should be used more than once? Like it can cause more harm than good?
> But I dl. AN chart and they say that you add piranha and nirvana (their version of mycro and bacteria) with every feeding
> I'm confused now..


Perhaps that chart was for hydro? The guy at AN told me on the phone that I should use bennies + carboload for like the first two weeks of veg and first two weeks of flower and then just keep feeding them with a simple sugar (they have carboload for that). He said that in a soiless mix or coco there would be an established colony. I just added the booster idea, figured it cant hurt. You can't overdo the bennies really. The idea is the more the better. In hydro they cant establish as much of a colony as they get dumped with the nutes so adding them the whole time is the way to go.


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## CikaBika (Feb 17, 2019)

I really dont know,and only text I found on web is what beenies do,nothing much of how often Should I appy them..


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## Greenthumbs256 (Feb 17, 2019)

I think mammoth p is very good, there is no denying that, but for the cost, I can't justify it! mainly bc of the simple fact if you already create the perfect environment for microbial life, then it's not really needed! those same microbes will already be there! granted they do supposedly make those certian microbes, that are specifically designed to handle p, which isn't bad, but if your supporting life in your soil, in order for it to work the way mother nature intended, you need more than just those microbes! it's a soil food web, not a a dollar menu! lol, you don't get to pick and choose, that's for hydro!

basically what I'm trying to say is it takes more then just those specific microbes to make all the magic happen! if your NOT running true living organics, then yea sure it's great, but if you are and doing it right, and supporting the entire food web, I can't see much of a difference happening at all! sure it will help a tad, but nothing compared to what it cost to buy a small bottle of it! 

you can do the same thing, but much better and way cheaper to buy everything, then one bottle of that stuff cost!

just my 2 cents!


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## Greenthumbs256 (Feb 17, 2019)

now with all that said, if your running bottles and stuff like that, and not really living organics, then sure it can help out alot, but still that dam price tag!


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## Joint Monster (Feb 17, 2019)

Anyone try Humbolt Nutrients Myco Madness? I really liked it!
Works in soil or hydro.
Price is reasonable compared to stuff like great white imo. (Although I've not tried G.W.)



> http://www.humboldtnutrients.com/blog/myco-madness/
> *Guaranteed Analysis*
> *CONTAINS NON PLANT FOOD INGREDIENTS:*
> 
> ...


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## Renfro (Feb 17, 2019)

Joint Monster said:


> Anyone try Humbolt Nutrients Myco Madness? I really liked it!
> Works in soil or hydro.


I have not tried that, seems a little diluted to me though.


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## Joint Monster (Feb 17, 2019)

Renfro said:


> I have not tried that, seems a little diluted to me though.


Interesting! Yeah the CFU's are a lot lower of the Humbolt.

Have you heard of this one? (I saw a fairly reputable breeder vouche for them. But they don't say much specifically about what is in there.)
https://www.ecothrive.co.uk/catalogue/biosys_4/


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## Renfro (Feb 17, 2019)

Joint Monster said:


> Interesting!
> 
> Have you heard of this one? (I saw a fairly reputable breeder vouche for them. But they don't say much specifically about what is in there.)
> https://www.ecothrive.co.uk/catalogue/biosys_4/


I have not heard of that one, and I am by no means an expert on the subject. I wonder what the concentrations are in that one.

I just haven't seen any results like the tribus original. I think their idea of fewer species in much higher concentrations has merit. Their rep explained it really well, way better than I could have. That said any product is probably better than none as I don't see how they can cause any harm only good.


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## Greenthumbs256 (Feb 17, 2019)

Joint Monster said:


> Interesting! Yeah the CFU's are a lot lower of the Humbolt.
> 
> Have you heard of this one? (I saw a fairly reputable breeder vouche for them. But they don't say much specifically about what is in there.)
> https://www.ecothrive.co.uk/catalogue/biosys_4/


man u can get that same stuff, by brewing up a nice compost tea! and a hell of a lot cheaper!


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## dstroy (Feb 20, 2019)

Greenthumbs256 said:


> man u can get that same stuff, by brewing up a nice compost tea! and a hell of a lot cheaper!


Prove it.

The reality is, that you have no idea, because you don’t know what bacteria will be present in your “compost tea”, you just know that it works. That’s fine, good for you. Compost tea is great.

Glad you found something that works for you.


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## Greenthumbs256 (Feb 20, 2019)

dstroy said:


> Prove it.
> 
> The reality is, that you have no idea, because you don’t know what bacteria will be present in your “compost tea”, you just know that it works. That’s fine, good for you. Compost tea is great.
> 
> Glad you found something that works for you.


your right I've been learning and they are not the same microbes! I actually emailed the company, trying to get some more info! waiting to hear back from them still! I'll share what learn here!

but your 100% right, those microbes are not in teas! or in living soil for that matter!


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## Greenthumbs256 (Feb 20, 2019)

also I don't really use teas anymore, I've moved on to probiotics! and I've never grown this well!


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## Joint Monster (Feb 20, 2019)

I'm wondering if anyone can chime in here... I'm in hydro running bennies as a pythium preventative. I ran the Myco Madness mostly for the Mycorrhizae and Trichoderma.

I tried just using Extreme Gardenings Myco and it seemed to do the trick.

Would Mammoth P do the same job? (seeing it does not contain Trichoderma or Mycorrhizae)


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## Renfro (Feb 20, 2019)

Joint Monster said:


> I'm wondering if anyone can chime in here... I'm in hydro running bennies as a pythium preventative. I ran the Myco Madness mostly for the Mycorrhizae and Trichoderma.
> 
> I tried just using Extreme Gardenings Myco and it seemed to do the trick.
> 
> Would Mammoth P do the same job? (seeing it does not contain Trichoderma or Mycorrhizae)


I don't think so, to the best of my knoweledge Mammoth P is designed to aid in nutrient uptake. Thats what mycorrhizae do as well. The Trichoderma is the one that fights off the pythium.


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## smokebros (Feb 20, 2019)

Joint Monster said:


> I'm wondering if anyone can chime in here... I'm in hydro running bennies as a pythium preventative. I ran the Myco Madness mostly for the Mycorrhizae and Trichoderma.
> 
> I tried just using Extreme Gardenings Myco and it seemed to do the trick.
> 
> Would Mammoth P do the same job? (seeing it does not contain Trichoderma or Mycorrhizae)


I use Orca in my hydro setup. It contains bacillus amyloliquefaciens which is the active ingredient in hydroguard. This is a species of bacteria that fights off pithium, fusarium, and other commonly unwanted aerobic bad guys. 

If you're trying to prevent pithium, you want bacillus amyloliquefaciens.


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## growin-Jables (Jan 18, 2020)

NoWaistedSpace said:


> Yes, it's worth the $. Been using it for about 3 years along with Recharge.
> It goes a long way. You only use like .5 ml/ gal, I think.


Same here. Ive been using mammoth P at .6 ml per gal when i feed. Than alternate to using recharge inbetween feedings. People say mamm p doesent make a difference. I beg the differ. I stopped using for two runs to see if i saw anything dofferent. And plants did fine but didnt thrive like they did when using mamm p. Heres my current run in a 5x5


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## Greenthumbs256 (Jan 18, 2020)

Mammoth p is not a bad product at all, but it's not some super secret that will make someone an expert grower. You can achieve the exact same results or even better just by having a living soil teaming with life, and keeping it alive. Mother nature is a better farmer than any of us can ever even dream of becoming. Stop trying to beat her and work against her, when you can just help her get rolling get out the way, and she will grow better than you could ever dream of!

I dont use any nutrients or anything out of a bottle. I dont ever feed, and I top dress with some compost and guano twice per cycle once in veg and once before flower.


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## Coloradoclear (Jan 18, 2020)

And thread is back from the dead!


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## growin-Jables (Jan 18, 2020)

Its really not the expensive when using at the rate of .5ml per gal every other watering. Its convient and easy to use. I just get the medium size bottle so the shelf life stays within range. This was result i got from the first and second time trialing the mammoth P. Both single plant grows. Biggest difference i saw was the overall health, thriving performance, thickness of stalks and branches and i can say in my opinion, im able to feed a bit more PK booster without burning and it seems to help in yield but im not going to say for sure since ive never done true side by side comparison. I also see a more even canopy with tigher nodes. The second run i did was by far the best trained plant ive yet to accomplish. And i struggled to see the same performance when dropping the mammoth p and just sticking to recharge. Thats just my person opinion and i have yet to trial any other replacement supplements


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## growin-Jables (Jan 19, 2020)

Greenthumbs256 said:


> Mammoth p is not a bad product at all, but it's not some super secret that will make someone an expert grower. You can achieve the exact same results or even better just by having a living soil teaming with life, and keeping it alive. Mother nature is a better farmer than any of us can ever even dream of becoming. Stop trying to beat her and work against her, when you can just help her get rolling get out the way, and she will grow better than you could ever dream of!
> 
> I dont use any nutrients or anything out of a bottle. I dont ever feed, and I top dress with some compost and guano twice per cycle once in veg and once before flower.View attachment 4459454View attachment 4459455View attachment 4459456


How are you liking the Rspec boards? Im trialing them for the first time right now


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## Greenthumbs256 (Jan 19, 2020)

growin-Jables said:


> How are you liking the Rspec boards? Im trialing them for the first time right now


Love them, faster flowering, better and denser nugs, I couldnt be happier. In the works of getting 6 more 240w boards to start with mixed spectrums


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## growin-Jables (Jan 20, 2020)

Greenthumbs256 said:


> Love them, faster flowering, better and denser nugs, I couldnt be happier. In the works of getting 6 more 240w boards to start with mixed spectrums


 Are you comparing them to the V2 288 boards? Its odd. The 3k boards put off more orangrish redish light than the r spec. R spec is more white light with dark red led diodes mixed in. Still puts off what looks like a more even balanced spectrum than the 3k. But being the r spec if enhanced flowering and supposedly more red spectrum than 3k caught me off guard.
In what way did you mean by your plants flower faster? Meaning getting into flower sooner or finishing sooner


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## Greenthumbs256 (Jan 20, 2020)

growin-Jables said:


> Are you comparing them to the V2 288 boards? Its odd. The 3k boards put off more orangrish redish light than the r spec. R spec is more white light with dark red led diodes mixed in. Still puts off what looks like a more even balanced spectrum than the 3k. But being the r spec if enhanced flowering and supposedly more red spectrum than 3k caught me off guard.
> In what way did you mean by your plants flower faster? Meaning getting into flower sooner or finishing sooner


I was comparing to 1k hps


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## Concentratedcam (Mar 19, 2020)

I have used MP for the past year and I have liked it for the most part. I have used it during the whole plants life cycle. The only substitute that i could recommend besides having a good soil is FishSh!t. It has been killer as well. Less pricey than MP with the same results.


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## Justin_C (Mar 22, 2020)

I personally have never used MP but I have used the fish shit and it has made all of the difference in my root development it is a excellent additive to whatever nutrient regimen you are using


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## Justin_C (Mar 22, 2020)

I really like the Fish Shit it is OMRI listed as an organic product,have had excellent results using this stuff. I personally think it is better than the MP but that is just my opinion


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## kingzt (Mar 23, 2020)

It’s sounds like more people are on the side of using mammoth p. I’ve heard good and bad things about the product. Yield goes up but quality doesn’t. I was told by someone using it that it made their buds foxtail when he never experienced that. Has anyone had this experience. Also I use a product called max microbe that may rival mp.


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## OGEvilgenius (Mar 26, 2020)

I ain't doubting mother nature at all. In fact I dream of a beautiful aquaponic setup one day. But you cannot grow in living soil and get the bud size and density you can growing hydroponically by the simple virtue of root oxygenation. I've done both well. It is what it is. Also you can't really tell the difference smoke wise if you do both properly. So, just my humble opinion. Not to say you can't do huge dense nuggets with RLOS. They just get a little bigger when you can keep the root zone well oxygenated with fresh water which you cannot growing in soil. And when I say well I mean using brix meters and shit to dial stuff in properly with the chemical grows and proper mixes with the soil (and brix testing too).


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## Southside112 (Apr 5, 2020)

Sothern ag garden friendly fungicide is a single bacteria formula as well. Has the same bacteria as hydroguard but like 100 times more concentrated. I use this with good results and a great price.


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## ChrispyCritter (Apr 5, 2020)

I use Mammoth P . I do have some foxtailing but primarily top buds and not all strains. Might be heat or light related too. I like it but I've read Tribus is similar. Also Photosynthesis Plus. Definitely not the same products but same goal of bigger buds through microbes.


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## ChrispyCritter (Apr 19, 2020)

So I went ahead and got a 250 ml bottle of Tribus original based on some things I've read. As it turns out most of those posts are from The same person but I'm still excited. USDA approved, etc. Lots of good info too. I started it on some plants that are about 3 weeks old. I've been using Recharge and im really happy with that but this is a full cycle innoculant so I'm trying it. I bought it to replace my MP which I also like but thought something new might be ok. Since then I decided what I really wanted was the bloom version since that's what I used MP for, so I picked up a 100 ML bottle of Tribus Bloom, which is geared toward P and K uptake similar to Mammoth. I grow in soil and I don't use any bottles or boosters but I'm very into beneficial bacteria since way way back when it cleared up my slimy dwc res. I see all they can do and th e products are far better today through real science. I hope there is less foxtailing with Tribus but t that may be my environment too. I'm working on that too.


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## Moabfighter (Apr 24, 2020)

5BY5LEC said:


> I think it is made here in CO. I about choked up my food when I saw the prices.
> For what it costs, it better keep my water clean, feed my plants and change my res when it needs it lol.
> Tribus?
> -_Bacillus subtilis_
> ...


Well. I just found two different sample bottles of microbes that contain the first two but not the last one. So this stuff I found I can use as hydro guard (which I’m running low on) for nice white roots?


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## ChrispyCritter (Apr 25, 2020)

One week in on the original Tribus and the plants have really responded. They are growing fast right now anyway so I haven't lost my mind in love with it or anything but the stalks do seem extra thick and stout. It is fine to use with Recharge, well it has been so far for me....One week like I said. I have been only because I had the Recharge, I like it, and it's different than the Tribus. One week and the plants have almost outgrown my starter fluorescent but I'm not ready for them to move. The others won t finis h. I guess there's worse situations.


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## 5BY5LEC (Apr 26, 2020)

Moabfighter said:


> Well. I just found two different sample bottles of microbes that contain the first two but not the last one. So this stuff I found I can use as hydro guard (which I’m running low on) for nice white roots?


_Bacillus amyloliquefaciens_ is Hydroguard so yes. I think it used to have those same three but the newer formula is just B.A.


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## xtsho (Apr 27, 2020)

Justin_C said:


> I personally have never used MP but I have used the fish shit and it has made all of the difference in my root development it is a excellent additive to whatever nutrient regimen you are usingView attachment 4511079


My roots grow fine as well without the need for any added products. Just a mix of FFOF, Happy Frog, and a couple doses of basic dry nutrients in flower.


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