# Root Clone Test - pictures



## Hobbes (Jan 23, 2010)

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Root cloning is simply taking a few handfuls of roots from the side or bottom of the root ball (adventitious roots), leaving them in their growing medium (Pro Mix) with moisture, warmth and darkness. Within a few weeks to months the adventitious root pieces will develop calydons and there will be hundreds of shoots ready to plant.

I did this successfully when I first started growing, around the same time that I learned marijuana needs 12/12 to develop buds and the buds grow where the leaves are. The learning curve is not steep. I read about cloning on Overgrow and was trying root cloning, a bubbler and rockwool. The rockwool cuttings died; I had roots in a week with the bubbler; and a bucket of pro mix and dead roots. I jumped on the bubbler because of the early success and forgot about the root cloning. 

Weeks to months later I was looking for a bucket and found hundreds of shoots in my root clone bucket. I planted two and threw the rest out. The plants grew fine and I forgot about them, just a couple more clones.

Looking at that bucket full of clone shoots I paused and thought: "Who the fuck would want hundreds of clones? And it takes forever, back to the bubbler." I assumed, and did until recently, that root cloning was a common method that commercial growers used. I was shocked at how little there is on the net about it, including horticultural and science sites.

Since I brought up root cloning and made the claim that it works I see it as my responsibility to prove the claim. In this thread I'll track, with pictures, root cloning trials until we have a technique developed for regular success. I'm hoping the first trial so I can be done with this.  

This test is going to be like watching sod grow, perhaps not as interesting. I'll check the roots every week or so and post some pics if there's anything to see.

*"... In particular, the natural ability of roots of many species to form buds that develop into new shoots has been long recognized, and lists of species capable of forming root buds are extensive. In some species, shoot buds occur sporadically on roots only after the root has been excised, whereas in other species one of the main functions of the root system appears to be the production of root buds. The formation of buds on roots enables the propagation of plants by root cuttings and is an important means of spreading noxious weeds. A variety of root tissue may be involved in bud differentiation, and the development pattern therefore varies considerably depending on the region of the root in which bud initiation occurs. Root buds of herbaceous species frequently arise endogenously, in a manner similar to initiation of lateral or adventitious roots. Therefore, descriptions of buds arising from both the pericycle and the phellogen or related tissues are frequently reported"*

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"In propagation by cuttage or layerage it is only necessary for a new root system to form, since the meristematic shoot apex comes directly from the parental plant. Many stem cells, even in mature plants, have the capability of producing adventitious roots. In fact, every vegetative cell in the plant contains the genetic information needed for an entire plant. Adventitious roots appear spontaneously from stems and old roots as opposed to systemic roots which appear along the developing root system originating in the embryo. In humid conditions (as in the tropics or a green house) adventitious roots occur naturally along the main stalk near the ground and along limbs where they droop and touch the ground."*

http://aob.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/full/92/1/145

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## Hobbes (Jan 23, 2010)

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My first and hopefully final trial will use roots from 4 plants: 3 plants with 2-3 weeks of flower left and 1 plant that was harvested 3 weeks ago and the root ball has been sitting in a garbage bag in my grow room. I have a Jillybean and Pandora's Box from Subcool and a Killer Chem Dog by Rez. The 3 week old root ball is from a Jillybean, bud was great, much more potent than I thought it would be.

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Step 1: Dig a hole

Dig down the side, putting the pro mix aside until you hit roots, then start pulling out handfulls and put them in a bucket. Use the Kajozgi-Jones method when possible.







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Step 2: Put the roots in a bucket

Make sure the pro mix and roots are about the same moisture content as when you'd plant - will hold together when you squeeze it in your hand but not drip water. Don't squeeze the roots. I gently separate root clumps and shake the bucket around to fluff up the mix.







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The 3 week chopped root ball. I really want to see if we can get a clone after we've cured and vaped the bud.







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Step 3: Put some plastic on the dirt

I'm following my last method as close as I can remember. Keep the moisture in.







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Step 4: Label it







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Step 5: Put the buckets somewhere warm.







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I'm going to post any info I find on root cloning in this thread and I'll post a weekly update. I'm off to mind the sod. 

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## jnuggs (Jan 23, 2010)

Right on. Thank you for trying this method out. I was looking at giving it a go..except using roots from my hydro plants. I have no less than 8 or 9 gallons volume of roots between 2 plants!


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## hotsxyman911 (Jan 23, 2010)

im also giving this a try just to see if i can make this happen so hopefully ill get success along with you but your a much more exp grower than i am =]


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## That 5hit (Jan 24, 2010)

now this being true (not douting you)
with all this said then if you could get a leaf to root then said leaf could then sprout a cotyldones from root zone
because everyone , self included, douts leaf cloning but i and others have had leafs sprout roots 
maybe we gave up to soon


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## MuntantLizzard (Jan 24, 2010)

That 5hit said:


> now this being true (not douting you)
> with all this said then if you could get a leaf to root then said leaf could then sprout a cotyldones from root zone
> because everyone , self included, douts leaf cloning but i and others have had leafs sprout roots
> maybe we gave up to soon


Deep tissue culture clones any plant tissue.


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## That 5hit (Jan 24, 2010)

MuntantLizzard said:


> Deep tissue culture clones any plant tissue.


 thanks for the lessen 
but this is root cloning 
taking roots planting them a letting them sprout whole plants 
everyone douts leaf cloning but if this works (the first im hereing of it ) then it would be thinckable to leaf clone (after the leaf dies the root that is submerged would then sprout a plant given enuff time - with all this said it would still be ezer to just branch clone in a bubbler with hormones- but this shit is still cool to know and do


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## Hobbes (Jan 24, 2010)

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Thanks MutantLizzard, now I know what it's called. 

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*Plant tissue culture* is a practice used to propagate plants under sterile conditions, often to produce clones of a plant. Different techniques in plant tissue culture may offer certain advantages over traditional methods of propagation, including:



The production of exact copies of plants that produce particularly good flowers, fruits, or have other desirable traits.
To quickly produce mature plants.
The production of multiples of plants in the absence of seeds or necessary pollinators to produce seeds.
The regeneration of whole plants from plant cells that have been genetically modified.
The production of plants in sterile containers that allows them to be moved with greatly reduced chances of transmitting diseases, pests, and pathogens.
The production of plants from seeds that otherwise have very low chances of germinating and growing, i.e.: orchids and nepenthes.
To clean particular plant of viral and other infections and to quickly multiply these plants as 'cleaned stock' for horticulture and agriculture.

Plant tissue culture relies on the fact that many plant cells have the ability to regenerate a whole plant (totipotency). Single cells, plant cells without cell walls (protoplasts), pieces of leaves, or (less commonly) roots can often be used to generate a new plant on culture media given the required nutrients and plant hormones.

Modern plant tissue culture is performed under aseptic conditions under filtered air. Living plant materials from the environment are naturally contaminated on their surfaces (and sometimes interiors) with microorganisms, so surface sterilization of starting materials (explants) in chemical solutions (usually alcohol or bleach) is required. Mercuric chloride is seldom used as a plant sterilant today, as it is dangerous to use, and is difficult to dispose of. Explants are then usually placed on the surface of a solid culture medium, but are sometimes placed directly into a liquid medium, particularly when cell suspension cultures are desired. Solid and liquid media are generally composed of inorganic salts plus a few organic nutrients, vitamins and plant hormones. Solid media are prepared from liquid media with the addition of a gelling agent, usually purified agar.

 

In-vitro tissue culture potato explants

The composition of the medium, particularly the plant hormones and the nitrogen source (nitrate versus ammonium salts or amino acids) have profound effects on the morphology of the tissues that grow from the initial explant. For example, an excess of auxin will often result in a proliferation of roots, while an excess of cytokinin may yield shoots. A balance of both auxin and cytokinin will often produce an unorganised growth of cells, or callus, but the morphology of the outgrowth will depend on the plant species as well as the medium composition. As cultures grow, pieces are typically sliced off and transferred to new media (subcultured) to allow for growth or to alter the morphology of the culture. The skill and experience of the tissue culturist are important in judging which pieces to culture and which to discard.

As shoots emerge from a culture, they may be sliced off and rooted with auxin to produce plantlets which, when mature, can be transferred to potting soil for further growth in the greenhouse as normal plants. reference: Plant tissue culture: theory and practice By Sant Saran Bhojwani, M. K. Razdan

The tissue obtained from the plant to culture is called an explant. Based on work with certain model systems, particularly tobacco, it has often been claimed that a totipotent explant can be grown from any part of the plant. However, this concept has been vitiated in practice. In many species explants of various organs vary in their rates of growth and regeneration, while some do not grow at all. The choice of explant material also determines if the plantlets developed via tissue culture are haploid or diploid. 

Also the risk of microbial contamination is increased with inappropriate explants. Thus it is very important that an appropriate choice of explant be made prior to tissue culture. The specific differences in the regeneration potential of different organs and explants have various explanations. The significant factors include differences in the stage of the cells in the cell cycle, the availability of or ability to transport endogenous growth regulators, and the metabolic capabilities of the cells. The most commonly used tissue explants are the meristematic ends of the plants like the stem tip, auxiliary bud tip and root tip. These tissues have high rates of cell division and either concentrate or produce required growth regulating substances including auxins and cytokinins.

Some explants, like the root tip, are hard to isolate and are contaminated with soil microflora that become problematic during the tissue culture process. Certain soil microflora can form tight associations with the root systems, or even grow within the root. Soil particles bound to roots are difficult to remove without injury to the roots that then allows microbial attack. These associated microflora will generally overgrow the tissue culture medium before there is significant growth of plant tissue.

Aerial (above soil) explants are also rich in undesirable microflora. However, they are more easily removed from the explant by gentle rinsing, and the remainder usually can be killed by surface sterilization. Most of the surface microflora do not form tight associations with the plant tissue. Such associations can usually be found by visual inspection as a mosaic, de-colorization or localized necrosis on the surface of the explant.

An alternative for obtaining uncontaminated explants is to take explants from seedlings which are aseptically grown from surface-sterilized seeds. The hard surface of the seed is less permeable to penetration of harsh surface sterilizing agents, such as hypochlorite, so the acceptable conditions of sterilization used for seeds can be much more stringent than for vegetative tissues.

Tissue cultured plants are clones, if the original mother plant used to produce the first explants is susceptible to a pathogen or environmental condition, the entire crop would be susceptible to the same problem, conversely any positive traits would remain within the line also.

Plant tissue culture is used widely in plant science; it also has a number of commercial applications. Applications include:



Micropropagation is widely used in forestry and in floriculture. Micropropagation can also be used to conserve rare or endangered plant species.
A plant breeder may use tissue culture to screen cells rather than plants for advantageous characters, e.g. herbicide resistance/tolerance.
Large-scale growth of plant cells in liquid culture inside bioreactors as a source of secondary products, like recombinant proteins used as biopharmaceuticals.
To cross distantly related species by protoplast fusion and regeneration of the novel hybrid.
To cross-pollinate distantly related species and then tissue culture the resulting embryo which would otherwise normally die (Embryo Rescue).
For production of doubled monoploid (dihaploid) plants from haploid cultures to achieve homozygous lines more rapidly in breeding programmes, usually by treatment with colchicine which causes doubling of the chromosome number.
As a tissue for transformation, followed by either short-term testing of genetic constructs or regeneration of transgenic plants.
Certain techniques such as meristem tip culture can be used to produce clean plant material from virused stock, such as potatoes and many species of soft fruit.
micropropagation using meristem and shoot culture to produce large numbers of identical individuals.

Although some growers and nurseries have their own labs for propagating plants by the technique of tissue culture, a number of independent laboratories provide custom propagation services. The Plant Tissue Culture Information Exchange lists many commercial tissue culture labs. Since plant tissue culture is a very labour intensive process, this would be an important factor in determining which plants would be commercially viable to propagate in a laboratory.

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## NewGrowth (Jan 24, 2010)

will this really work? I'm super interested


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## That 5hit (Jan 24, 2010)

did not know that what it was called


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## Lo'pan (Jan 24, 2010)

I cant wait to see if you pull anything out of that rootball! Sub'd and in for the long haul!


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## Drr (Jan 24, 2010)

http://www.scribd.com/doc/14571756/The-Biotechnology-of-Cannabis-Sativa

Here is a good read about the biotechnology of cannabis.. 

download it


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## That 5hit (Jan 24, 2010)

Hobbes said:


> *Weeks to months later* I was looking for a bucket and found hundreds of shoots in my root clone bucket. I planted two and threw the rest out. The plants grew fine and I forgot about them, just a couple more clones.
> 
> Looking at that bucket full of clone shoots I paused and thought: "Who the fuck would want hundreds of clones? And *it takes forever*, back to the bubbler." I assumed, and did until recently,
> 
> ...


i trust that this works - it will be cool to watch it - 
and thanks for being the type of person that walks and talks it - thats shit is important - so many make claims and never back them up what you are doing is cool shit dude regardless on how long it take - this is just cool shit to be apart of


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## bleedintears (Jan 24, 2010)

sick.
I think i might try this.

Just harvested some killer bud.
But it was a bagseed.
so genetics are unknown


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## Hobbes (Jan 24, 2010)

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Anyone who wants to run parallel trials please post pics and keep a journal in this thread, the more people trying the more chance of proving the method. This thread is open to all.

After reading the Plant Tissue Culture write up several times Root Cloning seems to work on the same principles but uses a much rougher technique - the garden not the lab.

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## AquafinaOrbit (Jan 25, 2010)

Very interested in if this actually works. Pretty crazy a root can get enough energy in complete darkness to grow a plant but I figure at worse I waist 1sq/f of my house and a couple gallons of soil so I'll be doing this for sure once my current grow finishes.


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## NewGrowth (Jan 25, 2010)

Ok I'm going to try this with the super skunk I harvested today, I just keep it moist covered, warm and dark? Seems like it would just compost . . .


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## That 5hit (Jan 25, 2010)

NewGrowth said:


> Ok I'm going to try this with the super skunk I harvested today, I just keep it moist covered, warm and dark? Seems like it would just compost . . .


this is what i was thinking


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## MuntantLizzard (Jan 25, 2010)

I would like to try this with White rhino, im in reveg now(DWC), which takes weeks and months anyway. Speed isnt everything. So Hobbes, Do you thing this could work for a set of thick DWC roots? I know what i would do with a 100 clones, Spread the good stuff around. imagine a 20 dollar 1/4 of rhino.


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## Hobbes (Jan 25, 2010)

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*" Do you thing this could work for a set of thick DWC roots?"*

Yes, so long as they are adventitious roots.

*"Adventitious roots arise out-of-sequence from the more usual root formation of branches of a primary root, and instead originate from the stem, branches, leaves, or old woody roots."
*
So we're looking for newer pulpier roots growing out of woody roots - most likely 2nd and 3rd order lateral roots but I'd keep the 1st order lateral as well. Definitely not the tap root. Remember to separate the roots - I just ripped them apart but with a bunch of hydro roots you could use scissors.

This is going to be a great experiment for learning about the much ignored root system.

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## hotsxyman911 (Jan 25, 2010)

im in this with you Hobbes, i too made a journal the same DAY you started this one, and mine as well has pics. I didn't try to thread jack or anything but when i read the thing about root cloning i went strait for it because i want alot of little clones to work with and especially if it works for me ill have alot of little clones of OG Kush haha so im stoked about that. but with you im following you and we started this on the same day so im excited to see who gets them going hopefully both of us =]


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## Hobbes (Jan 25, 2010)

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Good stuff Hotsxyman! Could you post a link to your thread and/or some pics please?

Let's consider ourselves all working to achieve the goal or proving Root Cloning, the more people the better chance we have.

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## Bob Smith (Jan 25, 2010)

Subbed; not something I'd most likely ever use, but very curious.

Kudos to you for trying this, Hobbes.


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## capnnemo (Jan 25, 2010)

Thanks for your efforts to document this alternative approach to regenerating harvested plants. Often it is not until we've harvested a plant that we know that it's a keeper. This would give us one more opportunity to keep a line alive.
Off topic, but since you mentioned the Jillybean and Pandora's Box here, does this mean we can expect a full smoke report (with your usual rigor) on those units some time soon? Been wondering how they stack up to two of your benchmarks, Bubblegum and Kali Mist. 

Thanks for all of your great posts.


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## NewGrowth (Jan 25, 2010)

Hobbes can I mail you weed to test? you always give the best smoke reports . . .


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## Sexxxy Beast (Jan 25, 2010)

Im in...

Plastic Jar
Fox Farm Ocean Forest soil
a couple fingers scoops of roots from a vegging headband clone
placed an inch of soil
roots
an inch of soil above
wet the soil a little
mist the top 
place lid
throw into closet

Lets see what happens!


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## hotsxyman911 (Jan 25, 2010)

here is my link to my testing 

https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/295732-vh-root-budding.html

good luck all on this experiment =]


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## BehindYou (Jan 25, 2010)

I uprooted a plant 3 days ago ran across this so I tossed a hand full of roots in a bowl watered and covered.


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## MuntantLizzard (Jan 25, 2010)

Thinking....


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## NickNasty (Jan 25, 2010)

I wonder if this could be a way to clone auto's...


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## Hobbes (Jan 25, 2010)

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Make sure the roots are in complete dark - if your container is translucent put it in a second container or closet like Sexxxy Beast.

Make a moisture/air seal right on top of the mix, keep all the moisture in. Put Saran wrap or a plastic bag - gently - touching the top of the mix, in addition to the cover.

Think of the roots you that will form calydons like the cuttings you'd pick to sprout roots - pulpy and not woody. Separate the roots but put them all in the mix - each piece of root is like a cutting.

Good stuff guys!

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## SotaFats (Jan 25, 2010)

NickNasty said:


> I wonder if this could be a way to clone auto's...


Subscribed


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## Hobbes (Jan 25, 2010)

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*"I wonder if this could be a way to clone auto's..."*

That is a good question. On one hand any clone coming from any part of the mother should be as old as the mother, on the other hand we're basically cloning a plant into a sprout.

Anyone with an auto flower going, we'd love to have you join the test.

Another great angle to the experiment! Kudos Nick!

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## Drr (Jan 26, 2010)

I will be trying this once I harvest.. couple more weeks..

I'll keep you posted on when I start


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## hotsxyman911 (Jan 26, 2010)

that is a really good idea though. and you can really clone the plant this way at any stage of the plants life if you really think about it.


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## That 5hit (Jan 26, 2010)

hotsxyman911 said:


> that is a really good idea though. and you can really clone the plant this way at any stage of the plants life if you really think about it.


 yeah i was thinking this also, its looks like everyone wants to wait 'till the end of there harvest- this tecnik will be gr8 for seed growers , even good genitics produce differant results- this way if a plant produces amazing results you can still clone it (i wish i knew about this awhile ago
i swear i grow a bagseed kush one time but had no way of knowing untell it was all choped up , but i now know what i'll do next time i get a bagseed fire ball- root clone it!


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## beeker (Jan 26, 2010)

Im along for the ride, learning some really good stuff here. Kudos, Hobbes


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## Hobbes (Jan 27, 2010)

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I harvested a Jillybean tonight and collected some roots, sifted out the old pro mix.







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I took half of them and set up a bubbler. It should work and be quicker than pro mix, as with cloning. I'm concerned about too much bubbling damaging developing calydons. Maybe a hanging basket with the bubbles off to the side so the water is oxygenated and the roots don't get disturbed. As is I think the roots will collect along the side of the bucket, they won't move around but it might not be good to have the roots touching the bucket.







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I put the other half of the roots in fresh Pro Mix with ph 6.8 water, black bucket, plastic bag, lid, under grow table. I've got 3 buckets of roots from plants that were in flower, 1 bucket from a plant harvested 3 weeks prior, 1 bucket of roots from a freshly harvested plant in a bubbler and 1 bucket from the same plant in fresh Pro Mix.

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## statik (Jan 27, 2010)

I have to sub to this one for sure. Interesting concept indeed.


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## tom__420 (Jan 27, 2010)

So this is just a way to save genetics pretty much?
Once you get too far into flowering and want to save the strain you can do this?
This will take much longer than regular cloning so that is why I figured that was the case


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## hotsxyman911 (Jan 27, 2010)

cant you put like chicken wire or some kind of wire to hand the roots over while the bubbler is going and just put a lid on it, and the humidity and wetness will have moisture in the air to give to the roots, idk if this made sense because im really baked


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## Hobbes (Jan 27, 2010)

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That's an excellent idea HSM. I'll figure something out, I'm thinking a 4 or 5 inch hanging basket somehow. I'm going to get backed. Baked. Then I can think about this properly. Damn good idea, maybe some roots in the water and some hanging to see which work, or work quickest.

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## sagensour (Jan 27, 2010)

Benefits?????


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## NickNasty (Jan 28, 2010)

Well I guess the # 1 benefit is that you could take clones off an already harvested plant. You could also get a ton of clones with very little effort. And for those of us who dont live in medical states where clone only strains are abundant it would be very easy to transport/ship these without the worry of getting caught.


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## reeferMaster (Jan 28, 2010)

NickNasty said:


> Well I guess the # 1 benefit is that you could take clones off an already harvested plant. You could also get a ton of clones with very little effort. And for those of us who dont live in medical states where clone only strains are abundant it would be very easy to transport/ship these without the worry of getting caught.


 this is certainly a good thing but i dont understand how this actually works and how long would it take 2 have a actual clone, i dont c how just using some roots a clone will grow out, ive heard of haveing a dormant stalk and root ball that can reveg but this seems 2 make no sense at al and i havent seen any pickture proving this works and is effective i would like some proof of this and then i will belive, sorry for my inconvience keep up the good work


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## Corp (Jan 28, 2010)

As they say it is a experimental try , if this works Hobbes and Sexy,it will be a revolution in technical use of plants

BIG kudos from me at last, thinking new ways are progress. 
How can i give you credits for this guys









reeferMaster said:


> this is certainly a good thing but i dont understand how this actually works and how long would it take 2 have a actual clone, i dont c how just using some roots a clone will grow out, ive heard of haveing a dormant stalk and root ball that can reveg but this seems 2 make no sense at al and i havent seen any pickture proving this works and is effective i would like some proof of this and then i will belive, sorry for my inconvience keep up the good work


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## nitetrain (Jan 28, 2010)

transporting clones for outdoor use would become a handful of roots...and I can see proof that the theory works in nature right outside my window. The trees and bushes in my yard have "suckers" growing into their own trees and bushes from exposed roots. Looking at that makes me think the root my have to become woody and be exposed to the environment for period of time.


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## grow plenty (Jan 28, 2010)

not being a nay sayer, but...why not just reveg after harvest? i reveged my bella-donna. in 8 days i seen new growth, 5 weeks later i cut 10 clones, stuck it back in flower closet and will harvest a second time in 4 weeks. i know all strains wont reveg in a week, but still it only takes a fraction of the time and you still keep your good strain....peace


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## tom__420 (Jan 28, 2010)

I just don't see the point of this, why not just cut clones off the plant?


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## reeferMaster (Jan 28, 2010)

reveg is great but consit of one plant and most likely transplanting, so why not use the old roots from when u reveg the plant, win win situation, better yet just use ur extra clones and grow out some mother plants, with this techniquie there would be no need for a mother room u would want a reveg room, i was also thinking about, using reveg for a grow op 2 see if it would produce , i wana try 24 in one gallon pots bud them and take the best 12, and reveg them in 3 gallon pots, and bud them, then possibly reveg in 5 gallon for out door use, one advantage i see 2 root cloning is that it will be nice 2 make clones from simple roots , but as far as i can tell wouldnt clones be better? they root in a week u can have a small tray of 50 clones in a small area, that will grow quickly, root cloning seems like it would take forever and produce small clones, does anyone have actually proof that this works and is a realiable resorce 2 growing?


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## Hobbes (Jan 28, 2010)

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To reitterate and summarize my position on root cloning and the purpose of this thread, as stated on page 1 (lots of reading, don't blame anyone if they skipped it):

*I have no use for hundreds of clones or waiting a month to get one clone -* but I have made the technique work and have made the claim on the forum that it works so it's my responsibility to prove my claim. With the help of other forum members we are going to prove that root cloning works and if someone wants several hundred, or several tens of thousands, of genetically identical sprouts then we will have a simple cost and space effective technique for them.

I don't know if planting cloned sprouts will be advantageous for commercial growers: RC may be too slow; cuttings cloned in rockwool might be simple, cheap and fast enough that nothing else is needed. Home growers might rather fill a bubbler with cuttings. But the technique will be there if they do need it or want to try it, I'll leave the usability up to the individual grower.

And that's all I've got to say about that.

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## mrduke (Jan 28, 2010)

i'm in the process of giveing this a try also. I put a small handful of roots from a veging bubba kush that was on a flood table, the roots were sticking 6-8"out of the bottom of the 6" pot. So when i transplanted them i took some of the roots that i couldnt get threw the pot holes. Placed them in a 4x4 pot filled with happy frog soil that was damp and coverd with saran wrap and foil to block light. This was done on jan 18,nothing doing so far. I check it out once a week so we'll see what happens would be cool if it worked


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## mrduke (Jan 28, 2010)

Hobbes--- how do you think you would transplant these clones? arnt all the roots tangled together in one root ball? would you just cut the sprout w/ some roots and hope for the best or what?


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## Hobbes (Jan 28, 2010)

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Hey Mrduke, kudos on running a test!

I separate the roots gently before putting them in pro mix/bubbler but they get tangled again from fluffing the mix or the bubbles. 

After my first run I picked a couple of root clones up individually, there were dozens just laying there by themselves. The ones that had clumped I sorted a few out before throwing the bunch in the garbage. The clump was like a handful of earth worms, easy to separate.

*"would you just cut the sprout w/ some roots and hope for the best or what?"*

Most of them should separate after wards, but it's good to separate the roots before cloning.. I don't know if breaking them will kill them like a sprout or not matter like a root - we will find out.

To plant them it's just like a normal sprout except you might get some root clones 12" long - whatever the length of the roots we use.

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## That 5hit (Jan 28, 2010)

tom__420 said:


> I just don't see the point of this, why not just cut clones off the plant?


who knows, you maybe stranded in a forest some where with some seeds and noway to clone , you may have no root hormes or bubbler on hand

IDK - but this shit sounds cool and any and all information is allways somehow usefull -
if anything it could be a last ditch effort at cloning something that failed to reveg or a plant that you forgat to clone off of 

also i think i read somewhere that cloning this way gives the plant a stronger stable genes. whereas branch clones are the same age as the mother plants makeing a plant that you have been cloneing year after year old as hell. whereas a root clone would be equal to growing from seed each time


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## That 5hit (Jan 28, 2010)

mrduke said:


> i'm in the process of giveing this a try also. I put a small handful of roots from a veging bubba kush that was on a flood table, the roots were sticking 6-8"out of the bottom of the 6" pot. So when i transplanted them i took some of the roots that i couldnt get threw the pot holes. Placed them in a 4x4 pot filled with happy frog soil that was damp and coverd with saran wrap and foil to block light. This was done on jan 18,nothing doing so far. I check it out once a week so we'll see what happens would be cool if it worked





Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> Hey Mrduke, kudos on running a test!
> 
> ...


im still not understanding the process
what are the steps
this is what i am thinking please correct
1. take roots from root ball of vegging, flowering, or harvested plant 
2. place roots in a dark clean container
3. add water and soil in with roots/or add water and roots in with bubbler 
4. cover so it is dark inside 
5. place in a warm place
6. check once every 1-2 weeks for sprouts


for step 3 could i add a root stimulater or cloning gel or powder


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## greensister (Jan 28, 2010)

This is fantastic. If this works out, this could be as great as FIM of LST. Image the SOG you could do with this technique...it also makes me re think outdoor growing. I love the idea of throwing a handful of sprouting roots on the side of a highway and watching it grow as i travel back and forth to/from work.


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## Hobbes (Jan 28, 2010)

That 5hit said:


> im still not understanding the process
> what are the steps
> this is what i am thinking please correct
> 
> ...


That's it T5. That's the beauty of this method, it's so simple. Toss some dirt in a bucket. I've read of people cloning cuttings in pro mix, no rockwool. The roots will get the same conditions as the cuttings except fluffing the Pro Mix allows for more air.

There are a few things I did first time around that I'm duplicating - separating roots before root cloning; picking the outer roots - like picking a pulpy cutting for a clone. Actually I used all kinds of root except the tap just to see what will form calydons. Use the Soilless the roots were growing in or mix new soilless and water before putting the roots in.

I've never used cloning gel, always a bubbler with cuttings. Definitely give it a try.

.


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## ONEeyedWILLY444 (Jan 28, 2010)

amazing...subbed


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## AquafinaOrbit (Jan 28, 2010)

That 5hit said:


> who knows, you maybe stranded in a forest some where with some seeds and noway to clone , you may have no root hormes or bubbler on hand
> 
> IDK - but this shit sounds cool and any and all information is allways somehow usefull -
> if anything it could be a last ditch effort at cloning something that failed to reveg or a plant that you forgat to clone off of
> ...



Think on a business level selling clones. This method would completely change the industry if it worked.


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## hotsxyman911 (Jan 28, 2010)

this is just another method that big time growers would use and it was told on this site to hobbes and people were douting him so he just wants to prove that it works. if you have negative comments just dont look at the thread. we are all working to share knowledge with everyone for different techniques so stop the hating please its just immature.


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## AquafinaOrbit (Jan 29, 2010)

hotsxyman911 said:


> this is just another method that big time growers would use and it was told on this site to hobbes and people were douting him so he just wants to prove that it works. if you have negative comments just dont look at the thread. we are all working to share knowledge with everyone for different techniques so stop the hating please its just immature.



Though I'm on your side as I really hope with works. (Could be ridiculous making clones to sell, but at same time may hurt market.) there is no reason to call someone immature when we are still yet to prove this method.


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## reeferMaster (Jan 29, 2010)

olny douting him becuase the thread says pictures and i have yet 2 see any picture of a root clone , im am just curious like every one be cuse this method is not popular but very interesting,


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## hotsxyman911 (Jan 29, 2010)

ok so its been 5 days and my update is not much progress looking but re sprayed the soil to moisten it a little and thats about it for me.


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## That 5hit (Jan 29, 2010)

so... if you can get a leaf to root then sooner or later it will grow into a sprout,,,right?


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## Hobbes (Jan 29, 2010)

.

The root will not grow more roots until it develops calydons (tiny first leaves) - then we have a sprout.

The people calling for proof before believing are correct - Root Cloning doesn't work until someone posts pics of roots with calydons.

.... like watching sod grow .... think weeks or months .... maybe the bubbler will be quicker ....

.


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## greensister (Jan 29, 2010)

It will take time if it will happen. I am skeptical, but that doenst mean im biased. From what i know about plants, its possible, but such whispy roots are fragile and the probability is low-based on what i know. Im sure there are 1000s of factors im not aware of that contribute the the success or failure of this experiment.

I would like for it to work. Believe me. ScrOG would be changed forever. Hell, you could do some massive overgrow the government campaigns in parks and along highways.

And yes, there were pics. Pics of how he prepared. Its not like TV cooking where a 4 hour roast is done in 1/2 hour. 

And HOBBS....if it doesnt work this time for you, after my next harvest in 4+ months, ill be trying this too.


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## Don Gin and Ton (Jan 29, 2010)

very interesting idea hobbes, subbed to see!


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## ONEeyedWILLY444 (Jan 29, 2010)

see you made it don should be very interesting


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## Afka (Jan 29, 2010)

ONEeyedWILLY444 said:


> see you made it don should be very interesting


Wouldn't this need to happen in an laboratory environment?


Pathogens, fungi and bacteria, will probably decompose the roots before this process will happen.

There's a reason there aren't 10000 cannabis sprouts under a chopped canna-tree outdoors.


After reading this, I figured I'd throw a handful of roots in a worm compost, it's the perfect warm moist environment, but I figured, DUH, they're gonna eat that shit in no time.


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## greensister (Jan 29, 2010)

That is true, to a point. Roots take extra care to compost as they have a protective mechanism because they are meant to be underground. If you were to take worm castings, which will have live beneficial bacteria and few pathogens, and put the roots in there, if the worms are not in the container, and/or there is a better choice of food for the critters such as partially decomposed organic material, the roots will be one of the later choices for the composting agents to consume. They would go after the easy stuff first, which could provide enough time for the roots to regenerate and start up its immune system, staving off the composting agents that would eat them eventually.

If you used something sterile like perlite and warmed distilled water, then it would take even longer to compost.

The entire world is a lab. You dont need, white walls, and bright overhead lights, and glass cabinets to call something a lab. You just need a question, an idea, and the will to execute a plan to find out the answer.

Almost everyone here should consider themselves an amatuer scientist because scientists observe, research, predict, and test.


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## Hobbes (Jan 29, 2010)

.

*What are the methods of vegetative propagation?*

Stems, *roots*, leaves, and even single cells are used for cloning plants. Plants can be cloned by cuttings. For cuttings, a portion of a stem with leaves is cut from the parent and placed in a suitable rooting medium for that particular species of plant. Some suitable media include moist sand, a mixture of peat moss and soil, or water. After roots have developed from the cut end of the stem, the cutting is transplanted into soil. House plants such as coleus, philodendron, ivy, and geraniums propagate by cuttings.

Grafting is similar to cuttings in that a part of a stem (or a bud) is removed from the parent. The part removed from the parent is called a scion. In making a graft, it is important to match the vascular cambium of the scion to that of the stock. A graft will fail if the cambia are not in contact. Grafting is used when it is difficult to root cuttings of the plant being propagated, or if the stock has desirable traits not found in the plant that is the source of the scion. For example, frail ornametal roses are usually grafted onto the root stock of more hardy and disease-resistant wild roses. This way, the aboveground part of the rose has the qualities we like in a rose (pretty flowers and pleasing aroma), and the roots resist soil-borne pathogens, which the original parent of the scion could not do. Grafting is also an important means for reproducing plants that do not produce seeds. The best examples here are seedless citrus fruits and certain ornamental plants. 

 Modified stems, like stolons of strawberry (left), rhizomes of bermuda grass and irises, tubers of potatoes, are all commonly used to propagate these crops. Crops propagated asexually are uniform genetically.

There are now new ways to clone plants. In the past few decades, scientists have begun to use methods of biotechnology to produce cloned plants commercially. Basic studies of plant development have shown that one plant cell can give rise to an entire new plant if the cell is first grown into a mass of cells (callus) under controlled environmental conditions and the callus is then treated with special chemicals (plant hormones) that induce development of shoots and roots. Using these tissue culture methods, one plant could be divided into myriads of cells, each of which could potentially develop into a new plant. 
.

*What are the are rooting powders?*
 
Rooting powders are widely used in vegetative propagation to enhance rooting of stem cuttings. Rooting powders usually contain a plant hormone, auxin, which strongly influences root initiation. Propagation from cut leaves can also be promoted by auxins. Auxins have another function inside plants. Auxins are involved in apical dominance, a phenomenon in which the uppermost bud exerts an inhibitory influence upon the lateral buds, preventing their development.

.

*Rhizomes* are horizontal underground stems that can produce new stems from their nodes. Examples of plant species that store food and propagate with rhizomes are smooth bromegrass, Kentucky bluegrass and johnsongrass. Stolons are horizontal aboveground stems that can produce new plants from their nodes. White clover, strawberries and bermudagrass propagate themselves with stolons.

.


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## Hobbes (Jan 29, 2010)

*[SIZE=+1].

** Click the pictures for a larger view **

.

What are root's functions?[/SIZE]* 

The three universal functions of all roots are anchorage, absorption and translocation of water with dissolved mineral nutrients. In many perennial and biennial species, roots are also sites for food storage. These food reserves keep the plant alive through the non-growing season, and are used to resume growth in spring or after cutting or grazing. Some species that store food in their roots are yams, alfalfa and red clover. Food storage organs of some vegetables (carrots, beets, and radishes) are actually a combination of root and stem tissues. 

.

*[SIZE=+1]Types of root systems

[/SIZE]*  

There are two major types of root systems: fibrous and taproot (left). Grasses have fibrous root system. Their roots are adventitious, arising from the lowest nodes of the stems. Species with a fibrous system are more shallowly rooted than plants with a persistent taproot. Most dicots have a taproot system. The taproot originates from the primary root (radicle) of the seed. The taproot may have many branches originating from it. Roots of legumes may also have root nodules, which are sites for nitrogen fixation . 

.

*Zones of the root* 

A root can be divided into the mature zone, zone of maturation, zone of cell elongation, and the zone of cell division (the apical meristem) protected by the root cap (right). All of the root cells originate from the divisions of the cells of the *apical meristem*. These cells are small, thin-walled, and contain large nuclei. Root meristem is protected by a *root cap*. The root cap is a dynamic, multifunctioning organ. For many years it was believed that the root cap functioned solely to protect the apical meristem of the root. Recently, it was shown that the cells of root cap percieve both light and gravity. Root caps of both dicots and monocots produce large numbers of metabolically active root "border" cells, which are programmed to separate from the root into the surrounding soil. In soil, border cells play important roles in protecting the roots from the soil-borne diseases (Hawes et al, 199. 

 
*[SIZE=+1]
.

What are the root tissues?[/SIZE]* 

The primary root tissues are the *epidermis*, the outermost layer of cells covering the root surface, the *cortex* that surrounds the stele, and the *vascular tissue* or *stele*, which occupies a central position.
The root *epidermis* (*1* on the cross-sections below) is usually a single cell layer that protects the root. The cells of epidermis can elongate to produce *root hairs*. These root hairs have larger surface area and are more efficient in absorbing water. Root hairs are also the sites of Rhizobium invasion of the legumes.

*Right: scanning electron micrograph of soybean root hairs.* 

 

*

above: crossection of a dicot root* 

*below: crossection of a grass root

* 

Let's focus on the micrographs of root crossections (left). The *cortex (2)* is composed of thin-walled parenchyma cells, which are frequently arranged in radial rows or concentric circles. The root cortex region frequently functions as a major storage region, its parenchyma cells are packed with starch grains or other compounds. The innermost layer of the cortex is *endodermis (3)*. The endodermis is a single cellular layer enclosing the vascular cylinder. 

The central region of the root (*stele*) consists of *xylem (xy)*, *phloem (ph)* and associated parenchyma cells. When xylem occupies the center of the root, it has variable number of extensions projecting outward toward the endodermis. The phloem tissue lies between these radiating arcs of xylem. Such anatomy is typical to the roots of dicots (carrots, beans, etc).

Where a pith is present, the vascular tissue takes the form of discrete strands of *xylem (xy)* with alternating strands of *phloem (ph)*, like in the roots of corn, grains, turf and other grasses.

The main *function* of *xylem* is the upward transport of water and dissolved nutrients. The *phloem* is the tissue through which photosynthate, manufactured by the leaves and other green parts of the plant is translocated to other regions of the plant. At times of reserve mobilization, the phloem is also the tissue through which organic materials are transported from storage regions (roots and tubers) to support new growth.

.


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## IAm5toned (Jan 29, 2010)

that is a good post.


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## golddog (Jan 29, 2010)

Very interesting, heard about this before.

I'm subscribed, I will start a test as soon as I harvest or transplant.

Great Post !

Peace -


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## That 5hit (Jan 29, 2010)

That 5hit said:


> so... based on this if you can get a leaf to root then sooner or later it will develops calydons then grow into a sprout,,,right?


still no response......


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## IAm5toned (Jan 29, 2010)

That 5hit said:


> still no response......


i dont think so.
you have to have a node for a vegatative clone.
on paper, it appears that you could take a clone from a leave, then root it, then use the ensuing root system to make clones. but then your not really cloning a leaf then are you 
you could also use deep culture methods to clone from a leaf, as all it requires is a single cell to develop into a callus, then you could introduce hormones to make shoots.... but im no biologist and couldnt begin to tell you how to do his. i know you would need a lab to pull it off however.


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## Hobbes (Jan 29, 2010)

.

*" based on this if you can get a leaf to root then sooner or later it will develops calydons then grow into a sprout"*

Sorry T5, I replied to what I thought you were asking, in the post directly below yours on the previous page. I assumed that you typed in leaf instead of root. I'm not familiar with leaf cloning.

If I have it wrong please restate in one syllable words, book words confuses me.:

"
*"The root will not grow more roots until it develops calydons (tiny first leaves) - then we have a sprout." *- The sprout grows like any normal sprout, we believe that this may be a way to clone auto flower strains.

With root cloning the root itself will develop "buds" - calydons - which is why some people refer to it as Root Budding. That does give a clearer picture of what we want - calydons to bud on one end of a root. Sprout.

.


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## That 5hit (Jan 29, 2010)

IAm5toned said:


> i dont think so.
> you have to have a node for a vegatative clone.
> on paper, it appears that you could take a clone from a leave, then root it, then use the ensuing root system to make clones. but then your not really cloning a leaf then are you
> you could also use deep culture methods to clone from a leaf, as all it requires is a single cell to develop into a callus, then you could introduce hormones to make shoots.... but im no biologist and couldnt begin to tell you how to do his. i know you would need a lab to pull it off however.


 


Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> *" based on this if you can get a leaf to root then sooner or later it will develops calydons then grow into a sprout"*
> 
> ...


leaf cloning has never been proven, with weed - but i have tried it and at best made the leaf develop roots after a while the fans of the leaf die then i just give up - but next time i will keep the leaf there longer to see if the roots make calydons -- this could be a way of root cloning with out disturbing the roots of a growing plant or waiting 'till harvest to get roots, furthermore this could be done and finshed by harvest,, if it work


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## IAm5toned (Jan 29, 2010)

or you could just LST the mom to get adventious roots, and then take the branch that the roots are protruding from.
you can also do this by wrapping the base of branch with cloth/plastic to make a lightproof barrier. roots will form. i forget what the proper term for this is called, it just takes a little longer than traditional cloning with cuttings for the roots to develop


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## That 5hit (Jan 29, 2010)

IAm5toned said:


> or you could just LST the mom to get adventious roots, and then take the branch that the roots are protruding from.
> you can also do this by wrapping the base of branch with cloth/plastic to make a lightproof barrier. roots will form. i forget what the proper term for this is called, it just takes a little longer than traditional cloning with cuttings for the roots to develop


air layering


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## northeastern lights (Jan 29, 2010)

subscribed.


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## DaveCoulier (Jan 29, 2010)

Im sorry but I can't take it anymore. Its cotyledons.

Anyways, I hope this works. Interesting stuff.


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## Hobbes (Jan 29, 2010)

.

*"Im sorry but I can't take it anymore. Its cotyledons."*

Thanks Dave. I use too look it up evary time I needed to speel it, witch was more oftan then one wold think, and after a wile I jest said "fuck it, I'll spell it any way, the computer puts a red line under it anyways." Just one of those words I can't get to stick in my mind.

Cotyledons. No red line.



.


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## IAm5toned (Jan 29, 2010)

lol 
there was once a point when i cared about my spelling and punctuation...
it has long past.
so yeah, cotyledons... ill make an effort to remember but ill prolly forget it 5 mins from now


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## DaveCoulier (Jan 29, 2010)

IAm5toned said:


> lol
> there was once a point when i cared about my spelling and punctuation...
> it has long past.
> so yeah, cotyledons... ill make an effort to remember but ill prolly forget it 5 mins from now


I still forget it half the time too and need to double check it when posting sometimes. One of the most frustrating words ever, imo.


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## Hobbes (Jan 31, 2010)

.

Day 8

.

Sod's looking good. 

Nothing happening with the pro mix roots yet, looking alive still. The bubbler roots that were harvested 3 weeks prior to cloning are looking better, swelled with water and crisp.

Today







7 days ago







.

I added a hanging 3" basket in the bubble bucket, and an aquarium heater and thermometer. I always root cuttings quickest with water around 80F, I figure the roots should bud best around the same temperature.



















.

Roots and bubbles through the center basket hole.







.


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## statik (Jan 31, 2010)

Good stuff Hobbes. Be a trip to see about 100 little heads popping out of that hole. Can indeed tell those roots (in the basket) are very healthy. How long have they been in there now? 3 weeks, did I catch that right?


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## Hobbes (Jan 31, 2010)

.

statik I harvested the plant that these roots are from 3 weeks before I thought to do a root clone test - the 5 gallon root ball was sitting in a garbage bag in my grow room through that time. I sifted some roots from the pro mix and used those for the bubbler and one of the 4 pro mix tests. I want to see if, when we get fantastic bud cured for a plant that we haven't cloned - can we get a clone from the root ball. The roots look good so far.







.


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## YungMoolaBaby (Jan 31, 2010)

Isn't this just another way of tissue culture? Taking parts of the plant and growing them in hormone to produce new growth? I saw an article in High Times about Tissue Culture and it just seems it's the same concept as this root thing here. Interesting to say the least.


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## MuntantLizzard (Jan 31, 2010)

*Plant Tissue Culture*

*Presenter:  Lydiane (Ann) Kyte
Host: Kathy Liu 
Discussion*

Did you ever have a plant that was so unique or so beautiful that you wished you had hundreds or thousands of them to enjoy or to sell? Plant tissue culture (micropropagation) is a technique which will do just that for us. We are going to discuss this tool which is used so extensively in the nursery business and in plant biotechnology. It is a fascinating and useful tool which allows the rapid production of many genetically identical plants using relatively small amounts of space, supplies and time. 

Basically the technique consists of taking a piece of a plant (such as a stem tip, node, meristem, embryo, or even a seed) and placing it in a sterile, (usually gel-based) nutrient medium where it multiplies. The formulation of the growth medium is changed depending upon whether you are trying to get the plant to produce undifferentiated callus tissue, multiply the number of plantlets, grow roots, or multiply embryos for "artificial seed".

For many who become superficially aware of the technique it seems shrouded in mystery and is shrugged off as too technical to be of concern. Actually, it is no more of a mystery than taking a cutting of your favorite house plant and growing it to share with a friend. As for being technical, you can begin plant tissue culture with as little as a cookbook approach and a feeling for sterile technique.

Some people have visions of scientists doing plant tissue cultures in white gowns and masks in hospital-clean environments. Such conditions are excessive. While it is true that mold spores, bacteria, and other contaminants will grow and overrun a culture, air that is not moving has a minimum of contaminants. In addition, disinfection of implements, work surface and nearby areas helps eliminate contaminants.

The guidelines for preparation and the laboratory protocol provided here are given as a place to begin. Included with is a limited discussion of some of the many options you have as you explore micropropagation. We can discuss these in more depth if you have questions, concerns or related experiences to share. I would be particularly interested in success and challenges you may have had or are currently having in your classroom.

Some suggestions are given for the following
(a) Selecting plant sources. Some species, or even clones are easier to grow in culture than others. Some respond reluctantly to culture, some do not respond at all, and many plants have never been tried.

(b) Choosing a growth medium (price, convenience, type of plant and purpose of the micropropagation all enter into this decision.) How important are the kinds of hormones used? On limited scale, media ingredients are available at the grocery and health food stores. 

(c) Suggestions for media preparation and sterilization. There are alternatives to sterilization in a pressure cooker or an autoclave.

(d) Methods for cleaning, storing and manipulating explants (plant pieces to be cultured).

Given certain basics there are many options for procedure, equipment and supplies for plant tissue culture. Some of your decisions will be based upon the amount of time, money and space you have. Other decisions will be based upon why you are doing plant tissue culture and what you expect as a result (more plants?) . Catalogs, such as Sigma, Carolina Biological, or Edmund Scientific are good reference and they are for purchasing needed materials..

I look forward to sharing tissue culture experiences with you.


*References: * 
Debergh, P.C. and R.H. Zimmerman, eds. 1991. Micropropagation, Technology and Application. Kluwer Academic Publishers. $61.50. Lab design, info on labs worldwide, in depth discussions of problems. Not for the beginner. 

Donnelly, D.J., and W.E.Vidaver, 1988. Glossary of Plant Tissue Culture, Portland, OR. Timber Press, $22.95. Good definitions of tissue culture terms. 

Kyte, Lydiane and J. Kleyn, 1996. Plants from Test Tubes: An Introduction to Micropropagation, 3rd ed., Timber Press, 1996 $29.95. Good basics for the beginning amateur or grower. 

Smith, Roberta H., 1992. Plant Tissue Culture-Techniques and Experiments. Academic Press. $35.00. Good introduction and broad base for college course. 

Trigiano, Robert N, and Dennis J. Gray, eds.1996,Plant Tissue Culture Concepts and Laboratory Exercises. CRC Press. $65.00. For the advanced student.


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## MuntantLizzard (Jan 31, 2010)

*Sample Protocol*

*Preparing Media *

When ordering media we find a baffling number of options in the catalogs. One of the most complete media is in the Sigma catalog: Murashige and Skoog shoot multiplication medium B (MSMB) (Sigma Catalog No. M7149). At the appropriate time, order a pretransplant medium (Murashige syngonium stage III Pretransplant Medium with sucrose: Sigma M 8650) You will also need a gelling agent, preferably a blend of agar and agar substitute, such as Agargel. 
Purchase sterile distilled water from a local grocery store. For 1 liter of medium use a 2 liter container (because the medium boils up). Add the powdered medium to the water and stir. (Don't add the agar (gelling agent) at this stage because it gums things up when adjusting the pH).

Adjust the pH to pH 5.7 using 1N NaOH or 1N HCl (carefully, by the drop) and pH indicator paper (3.5 - 6., or a pH meter. (If you don't have a pH meter, the chemistry teacher might.) Now add the agar. Use about 5 grams per liter of medium . Heat and stir until the the medium is clear. (The clarity tells you that the agar has melted.) Dispense into test tubes.


*Sterilizing the Medium
*
Pour about one and a half inches of water into the pressure cooker. Place the tubes upright in the cooker. To hold them upright place them in a wide mouth jar, make a wire or wooden rack, or tie them with string in bundles of ten. They must not fall over. Process at 15 pounds for 15 minutes according to the instructions which come with your cooker.


*Preparing Explants *

An explant is the part of a plant that you put in culture. The example used here is a strawberry runner tip. Select a young runner where the bud on the end has not yet opened. Cut it off the plant one inch or so from the end. Transport the tips to your classroom in a plastic bag in which you have placed a wet, but not dripping wet, paper towel. If the runner tips are not going to be processed immediately, they can be held in a refrigerator for a day or two.

Fill a pint jar half full of sterile water (boiled, pressure cooked tap water or the store-bought bottled distilled water. Add 2 or 3 drops of liquid dish washing detergent (or Tween 20, a wetting agent). Place the runner tips in the jar and replace the screw-on lid. Vigorously shake the jar by hand for one minute. Pour off the water, rinse two or three times with fresh sterile water. Repeat this operation (or dip in 70% alcohol for a few seconds and rinse. In another container add 30 ml of household bleach to 270 ml of sterile water(10% bleach). To this add 2 drops of detergent. Add the explants and shake intermittently for 10 minutes. Quickly drain and add sterile water, cover and shake. The explants are now ready to take to the transfer chamber.


* Starting the Explants *

The transfer chamber should be ready with the walls and workspace wiped or sprayed with 10% bleach/sterile water solution or 70% isopropyl alcohol (not if using a Bunsen burner). There should be a container of 10% bleach/sterile water and a container of 1% bleach/sterile water to sterilize and rinse the instruments and gloved hands of the operator.

Immerse the forceps and knife for 30 seconds or more in the 10% bleach then rinse in the 1% bleach and rest them on a sterile holder or paper towel to dry for a few seconds. With the forceps place a sterile paper towel on the workspace. With the forceps place a runner tip on the towel. Place the forceps in the other hand to hold the tip while the first hand uses the knife or scalpel to cut off 1 cm of the stem. Place the knife in the 1/10 bleach, move the forceps to that hand. Grab a sterile test tube of medium with the other hand, hold it by the base. With the little finger of the hand holding the forceps, remove the cap and cradle it there while you use the forceps to firmly lay the bud on the medium. Recap the test tube and seal with a piece of Scotch tape (or Parafilm).


*Growing* 

Place the test tubes in the planter tray (or other appropriate holder ) and place the tray on a shelf under fluorescent light which is 8-10 inches above the top of the tubes. Room temperature is o.k. Continuous light is acceptable, but 16 hours light/ 8 hours darkness is standard.

Check daily for contaminants. If any are found, sterilize tube and contents before discarding the contents.

Transfer the explant every two weeks or so until it is actively growing. In one to two months you should be able to divide the culture into two pieces, each of which is about 0.5 cm in diameter. Continue to divide and transfer until you have enough plantlets. The plantlets should be singulated as you transfer to prerooting medium which has no hormones (or only IAA).


*Transplanting *

When the plantlets begin to root, perhaps two to four weeks, transplant them to a light artificial soil mix, such as peat/pearlite, in a seedling tray. Cover with clear plastic and place on a lighted shelf or in a shaded greenhouse. After two or three weeks begin leaving the plastic off for a period of time each day. The time the plantlets are left uncovered should get longer each day, until after about a week, the cover can be left off completely. (Tissue cultured plantlets are more delicate than seedlings as the stomates remain open until they slowly adjust to normal humidity and light.


*Conclusion *

After having successfully tried plant tissue culture, you will wonder about nearly every plant you see, asking yourself, "I wonder how that plant will respond in tissue culture?"


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## MuntantLizzard (Jan 31, 2010)

I haven't yet started because well i dont think my roots(DWC) are going to work. the bubbler doesnt seem compleat., were missing something.


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## MuntantLizzard (Jan 31, 2010)

*Preparation*

Given certain basics there are many options for procedure, equipment and supplies for plant tissue culture. Some decisions will be based upon the amount of time and money available, others are merely a matter of personal preference. Catalogs, such as Sigma, Carolina Biological, or Edmund Scientific for are essential for reference or purchasing are very important resources.

*OPTIONS *

The following discussion lists some of the various options you have as you begin the tissue culture of plants. Options used in in the sample protocol are identified with an asterisk (*).


*Which plant? *

Perhaps the easiest decision you need to make is which plant you would like to place in culture. To begin with I would suggest one of the following: 

Boston fern (runner tip)
Rex Begonia {petiole segment}
Kalenchoe (stem tip)
*Strawberry (runner tip)
African violet , leaf part
Arrowhead plant , stem tip
 *Work Space *

If your school already has, or can afford to buy, a transfer chamber with a HEPA (high efficiency particulate air) filter then there is no decision, you will use the transfer chamber. For now we shall rule out this unlikely option. An open bench or desk-top in the school room will work but you may have as much as 95% contamination which would be very discouraging. Other options include the following: 

Find a small room with still air
 Build a still air box of wood; with a slanted front of glass (or Plexiglass)
*Use a large cardboard carton; tape clear plastic over the top and front (cut holes in the sides or front for access by hands and forearms)
Use a large, clear plastic bag
Purchase a small HEPA filter and blower and build a little hood.

*Medium (plural media) *

Next you will need to decide on the nutrient medium. The options are limited:

*Buy premixed medium in powder form ready to mix with water, heat, dispense and sterilize.
Buy media already in test tubes ready to use (expensive).
Buy the individual chemicals (expensive for limited use and requires a balance which can weigh milligram quantities).
 Buy "off the shelf" ingredients from local stores.
 
*Equipment for Media Preparation* 

You will need a vessel in which to mix and heat the medium: 

A 2 or 4 liter Erlenmeyer flask (if using a hot plate or hot plate/magnetic stirrer}
*A stainless steel pan (if using a stove or burner)
 You will need a means of stirring while heating :

*A long handled spoon
A hand mixer
A hot plate/magnetic stirrer
 You should have one to ten test tubes per student. 

 If you are really desperate use baby food jars.
*Test tubes, "disposable" glass 25 X 100 mm is standard (80 for $54.60 1995 Sigma Plant Culture Catalog)
*Test tube caps
 You will need racks to hold the test tubes vertical vertically? (see the catalogs)

Buy one or more racks
*Build one or more from wood or wire
 You will need a means of dispensing the medium into test tubes:

Buy an automatic dispenser (expensive and fragile)
*Use a glass (Pyrex) quart pitcher
 The test tubes containing the medium should be sterilized in:

*A household pressure cooker
An autoclave (very expensive)
 You will also need a clean cupboard in which you can store the sterilized tubes of media.


*Equipment and Materials for Use in the Transfer Chamber *

 *Forceps (2 or more) 8 inch
Tweezers (large, o.k. for baby food jars)
*Kitchen paring knife
Scalpel
*Rubber gloves
Spray bottle with 70% isopropyl alcohol (flammable)
*Household bleach
*Plastic dish to hold 10% bleach solution (1 part bleach and 9 parts sterile water) for sterilizing instruments and gloved hands.
*Plastic dish to hold 1% rinse solution (1 part bleach and 99 parts sterile water) for rinsing instruments and gloved hands.
 Other options for sterilizing instruments but too dangerous in a cardboard transfer chamber:

Bunsen burner
Bacti-Cinerator
Glass bead sterilizer
Lead melting pot containing sand
 
*Device to hold sterilized instruments as they cool or dry:* 


*Test tube laid horizontally to rest instruments on
Build a rack of hardware cloth (wire)
Up-end a metal test tube rack
 
*Sterile surface on which to cut cultures:*


A 12 inch square of plate glass (spray with alcohol)
*Single sheet paper towels (which have been wrapped in foil and sterilized in pressure cooker for one hour at 15 lbs pressure. Don't forget to have sufficient water in the base of the cooker and place pack of towels on rack or other holder to keep them out of the water.)
 
*Growing Space*

*Shelves lighted with fluorescent lights (cool white or equivalent)
Test tube racks
*A seedling tray 11 X 22, 78 holes, to hold test tubes on lighted shelves


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## MuntantLizzard (Feb 1, 2010)

Sorry for the Hijack, But Thats strait for the national museum of health. Its a really good read, I like other plants not just weed. So lets learn some shit


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## Hobbes (Feb 1, 2010)

.

No hijack Mutant Lizard, this thread is open to all posts concerning root cloning, thank you very much for all the info. I'm going to read through it 3 or 4 times to look for improvements to my set up.



.


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## AquafinaOrbit (Feb 1, 2010)

Plant Tissue Culture sound perfect for mushroom growers as thats much a process we already use. Both Teks seem very interesting so far.


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## That 5hit (Feb 2, 2010)

this is very well possiable for all plant 
weeds and other plant do this naturally in nature
when you cut your grass or after a long winter, grass, weeds .and all type of plants regen from there roots all the time


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## statik (Feb 3, 2010)

As an ex-landscaper, I agree with That 5hit. I cant tell you how many times I have yanked up a plant (actual garden weeds), the roots stayed in the ground...and had the little bastard come back in a little over a week.

I know it not the same species of plant, but if most common weeds can do this...I am pretty damn sure Cannabis can do it to then.


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## That 5hit (Feb 3, 2010)

statik said:


> As an ex-landscaper, I agree with That 5hit. I cant tell you how many times I have yanked up a plant (actual garden weeds), the roots stayed in the ground...and had the little bastard come back in a little over a week.
> 
> I know it not the same species of plant, but if most common weeds can do this...I am pretty damn sure Cannabis can do it to then.


lets not forget grass
i ve seen grass come back from nothing


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## statik (Feb 3, 2010)

This is true, grass re-sprouts from nothing but roots as well. I hope we can find a way to speed up the process of this whole thing. Instead of root accelerating products, people will be developing cotyledon accelerators. LMAO. 

Get on it now guys, you'd have the market cornered.


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## That 5hit (Feb 3, 2010)

statik said:


> This is true, grass re-sprouts from nothing but roots as well. I hope we can find a way to speed up the process of this whole thing. Instead of root accelerating products, people will be developing cotyledon accelerators. LMAO.
> 
> Get on it now guys, you'd have the market cornered.


already on that - these guys should have put this with the roots

*Gibberellic acid* (also called *Gibberellin A3*, *GA*, and (*GA3*) 

Gibberellic acid is a simple gibberellin, promoting growth and elongation of cells. It affects decomposition of plants and helps plants grow if used in small amounts, but eventually plants develop tolerance for it. Gibberellic acid stimulates the cells of germinating seeds to produce mRNA molecules that code for hydrolytic enzymes. Gibberellic acid is a very potent hormone whose natural occurrence in plants controls their development. Since GA regulates growth, applications of very low concentrations can have a profound effect while too much will have the opposite effect.


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## statik (Feb 3, 2010)

Isn't G.A. what people spray on plants to influence their sex?


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## That 5hit (Feb 3, 2010)

statik said:


> Isn't G.A. what people spray on plants to influence their sex?


 it has many uses at differant ppm levels


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## That 5hit (Feb 3, 2010)

*gat this from some web site*

*Using our own Premium grade water soluble gibberellic acid I ran some germination tests with 1659 corn seeds to find an optimal PPM dose and procedure. The test was putting corn seeds in distilled water with our premium gibberellic acid for 1 hour at around 20 celcius (68 ºF). The seeds where then rinsed in regular tap water and the excess water was drained off and the seeds placed in paper towels and kept moist for seven days. After seven days the growing stems where cut off and weighted.​<LI style="TEXT-ALIGN: left" class=Paragraph>the seeds soaked for 1 hour at 225 PPM had 15% more growth than untreated seeds; <LI style="TEXT-ALIGN: left" class=Paragraph>the seeds soaked for 1 hour at 300 PPM had 30% more growth than untreated seeds; <LI style="TEXT-ALIGN: left" class=Paragraph>the seeds soaked for 1 hour at 400 PPM had 23% more growth than untreated seeds; <LI style="TEXT-ALIGN: left" class=Paragraph>the seeds soaked for 1 hour at 500 PPM had 15% more growth than untreated seeds; <LI style="TEXT-ALIGN: left" class=Paragraph>the seeds soaked for 1 hour at 600 PPM had 6% more growth than untreated seeds. 
* 

*Cotton Germination*

A research project tested the germination of cotton seeds with simple water and 1, 5, 10, 15, 20, 25 parts per million concentrations of Gibberellic Acid with a ten minute soak. The research concluded that the 5 PPM soak gave the fastest germination.

[http://www.usc.edu/CSSF/History/2004/Projects/S1618.pdf] 
*Cotton Growth*

An experiment tested the foliar application of gibberellic acid on cotton plants at 25, 50 and 100 PPM. The cotton plants at 50 and 100 ppm had greater shoot and root length, had more nodes, more leaves leaves and total leaf area. 

http://www.cababstractsplus.org/Abstracts/Abstract.aspx?AcNo=20043143944 
*Lawn - GA3*

1. I used a soil mix of 8 parts top soil, 2 cow manure, .5 peat, and .25 Perlite(Krum) @ 2-4 inches deep.
2. Sprayed lightly with a hose before covering the sewn grass seed.
3. I used stems from last years flowers that were like strong hay, criss-crossed them over the seeded moist soil mix, and then piled oak leaves 1-2 inches deep over that to create heat for the grass.
4. On late March early April near Chicago the 6th day of growth, I pulled off the cover and sprayed the grass in 3 diff locations full sun, part sun, and shady. I put the cover back on after spraying and 1-2 days later gave it a spritz of water. I sprayed GA3 3 days after that and then 2 days after that.
5. There was no presoak.
6. The temperature was approx. 50-70 F during the day and no lower than 45 F at night. 2 of the days it was 78-82 F.
So, from the 6th day of growing to 1.5 weeks of spraying 3 times later I have some good grass. The shady grass seemed to grow the quickest. It might have been because of a less variant temp. I tried the same areas last year without covering the seed, without special potting soil, and without spray GA3. - JT, User Group

Super-Grow note: the gibberellic acid concentration was 35 PPM for each of the three sprayings.

*Lilac - French hybrid*

My new very small hybrid French lilacs are doing well as a result of regular spraying with 50 PPM Gibberellic Acid [John M., User Group - June 2, 2005] 
*Peppers*

I tried a 70ppm solution of GA3 on 5 of my habanero pepper plants and on 5 each of my big boy and cherry tomato plants. After 3 weeks I couldn't see any difference between them and the other plants of the same type. I then used a 140ppm solution of GA3 on the same plants and now, 1 week later I can tell a major difference in the height of the treated plants as compared to the untreated ones and also the treated plants are beginning to bloom. [A.L., User Group - May 28, 2005] 
*Roses*

I sprayed a rose plant that was dormant and had only about 4 sets of leaves with Gibberellic Acid (GA3) 650 PPM and it grew about 10 inches of new winter growth!! Amazing! [Kevin, April 2006]
*Rasberries*

I have a rasberry patch here in RI. If you are trying for a sudden boost use over 500ppm of Gibberellic Acid. If you want sustained growth improvement 50ppm is good. [W.W., User Group - May 5, 2005] 
I had some great results by spraying Raspberries also this year. We have 42 new shoots about 3-4 feet high after spraying 85 PPM Fulvic Acid 2 times and Gibberellic Acid 35-70 PPM 5 times. We should have berries soon! We had enough berries last year to make 2 huge pies. I suspect we with get 5-6 pies this year. [J.T., User Group - June 6, 2005] 
*Squash*

My "Early White Bush Scallop" squash plants are massive! They were given GA3 at 300ppm 22 days after emerging and GrowTonic at 36 days. [User Group, July 17, 2005 7:50 PM] 
*Tomatoes*

I used GA3 at 150 PPM on my tomato plants 36 days after transplanting. That was June 28th. When I applied it I had only 2 "Early Girl" tomatoes the size of a pea showing. Quite a few flowers were about to open on both "Early Girls" and "German Johnsons" when I applied it. Here we are at 13 days after spraying and I have 75 tomatoes growing now!!!
Every plant that I've used GA3 on has responded very well. I've seen many gardens around here and no ones plants are bigger or stronger looking. [D.Z. West Virginia - July 11, 2005 - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gibberellic_acid/message/1351] 

I noticed a big difference in my tomato plants after spraying them with a 200ppm of Gibberellic Acid. [D.S. - User Group January 8, 2005]

I tried a 70ppm solution of GA3 on 5 of my habanero pepper plants and on 5 each of my big boy and cherry tomato plants. After 3 weeks I couldn't see any difference between them and the other plants of the same type. I then used a 140ppm solution of GA3 on the same plants and now, 1 week later I can tell a major difference in the height of the treated plants as compared to the untreated ones and also the treated plants are beginning to bloom. [A.L., User Group - May 28, 2005]


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## jcdws602 (Feb 3, 2010)

statik said:


> As an ex-landscaper, I agree with That 5hit. I cant tell you how many times I have yanked up a plant (actual garden weeds), the roots stayed in the ground...and had the little bastard come back in a little over a week.
> 
> I know it not the same species of plant, but if most common weeds can do this...I am pretty damn sure Cannabis can do it to then.


If this were true for cannabis I would have a whole bunch pop back up from the ground a long time ago...I have thrown plenty of seeds in the ground and later rip out the plant without pulling the roots and I still have yet to see one regenerate itself and continue growing.............


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## FuZZyBUDz (Feb 3, 2010)

can i use my dual T-12 4' tubes (day light) fer the clippings i clone?? i would think so, but i just want to double check if im right or wrong.


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## statik (Feb 3, 2010)

jcdws602 said:


> If this were true for cannabis I would have a whole bunch pop back up from the ground a long time ago...I have thrown plenty of seeds in the ground and later rip out the plant without pulling the roots and I still have yet to see one regenerate itself and continue growing.............


Believe me I have thought of that. I am trying to figure out why that happens. 

Maybe conditions in the soil are not right (too cold/too hot, too much water/not enough water) for too long outdoors.

Will be interesting to see what the end results of this test are either way.


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## statik (Feb 3, 2010)

FuZZyBUDz said:


> can i use my dual T-12 4' tubes (day light) fer the clippings i clone?? i would think so, but i just want to double check if im right or wrong.


I don't see why not man, I'd just make sure the cuttings are not getting too much light.

If you have a light meter you can know how far to place them. Give them about 70 lumens per square foot (pretty sure thats about right for rooting clones) and they should be just fine.


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## jcdws602 (Feb 3, 2010)

FuZZyBUDz said:


> can i use my dual T-12 4' tubes (day light) fer the clippings i clone?? i would think so, but i just want to double check if im right or wrong.


Sure can......Thats what I use..........


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## jcdws602 (Feb 3, 2010)

statik said:


> Believe me I have thought of that. I am trying to figure out why that happens.
> 
> Maybe conditions in the soil are not right (too cold/too hot, too much water/not enough water) for too long outdoors.
> 
> Will be interesting to see what the end results of this test are either way.



Maybe........I know weeds and other species grow back from roots all the time but I just never see it happen with cannabis......I will stay subscribed to see results as well


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## greensister (Feb 5, 2010)

Well i have joined in. I transplanted some clones that i had in my cloning chamber for about a week too long. The roots were massive and subsequently some of the finer ones broke. I noticed that there was a piece of cardboard at the bottom of one of the pots and there were some serious tap roots inside it with other little adventurous roots inside the corigation.

I put this in some wet soil and sealed it in a dark place. Well see what happens in a couple of weeks.


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## Jester88 (Feb 6, 2010)

subscribed ..

i too would like to see more pics and what not.... intriguing


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## beeker (Feb 6, 2010)

had some roots in a plastic garabge can, I recycle used soil into my yard, so figured I give it a try too. WTH. been a week today, going to chek later and see if anything showin.


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## hotsxyman911 (Feb 6, 2010)

so it has been 2 weeks for me and my roots and there is no sign as of yet of anything showing. how about you hobbes?


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## slk (Feb 6, 2010)

This is a good thread I will have to stay tuned


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## That 5hit (Feb 6, 2010)

hotsxyman911 said:


> so it has been 2 weeks for me and my roots and there is no sign as of yet of anything showing. how about you hobbes?


 how are the roots
do they look healthy
are they still alive


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## mrduke (Feb 7, 2010)

2 1/2 for me no signs of life. hard to tell how the root look there an inch under the soil?


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## IAm5toned (Feb 7, 2010)

i was wondering if it would help if the root mass was upside down in the soil.


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## hotsxyman911 (Feb 7, 2010)

the roots are under the soil so can't really see them.


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## beeker (Feb 8, 2010)

Nothing showin mine either, but could take amonth, still good experiment.


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## Sexxxy Beast (Feb 10, 2010)

i got jack shit, i had 2 testing and decided to look at the roots of them, they were dead.


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## can.i.buz (Feb 12, 2010)

I've been doing this for years with onions, green, red, yellow, etc. When you cut off the end with the roots, you just break it up into as many pieces as you want onions and stick them in the ground. In a few weeks, you have more onions. After reading this thread, I broke one up into each single root to see what that would do. I'll let you know in a few weeks. I may try this but with cloning, I always have more than I need.


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## Hobbes (Feb 17, 2010)

.

Nothing to report yet, as I said in my first post it takes forever and is worse than watching sod grow. All of the roots look healthy, the bubbler roots are crisp.

.

I'm running another root experiment and although it has nothing to do with cloning, I though some of your might find it interesting. I'm converting my 5 gallon buckets into air pruning pots, my first design is below and I'm building the 2.0 version tonight - using a jig saw to cut out most of the middle of the bucket (leaving 3 or 4 vertical strips of bucket sides) and fitting in a rigid metal screen (1"x1" holes) like is used in scrog. I'll line the metal screen with the fiberglass screen from above to keep the mix in, probably double wrap the screen. I'll post some pics in the Air Pruning Pot thread later, I'll keep this thread for root cloning as much as possible.

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-room-design-setup/303229-diy-air-pruning-pot-experiment.html

.

.

I've been thinking a lot about developing a better root system, looking for bigger yields and perhaps better potency and quicker harvests. There are several commercial choices from porcipine like hard plastic wraps







to soft bags







or a chemical paint, like Spin-Out, for the inside of the pots.







.

I need a rigid bucket for low stress training, and I have a couple dozen 5 gallon buckets that I'd like to convert. 

.

1. Drill a 1/2" hole every 1" center. Drill a 1/4" hole between the 1/2" holes. I put pro mix in the bucket to make it more rigid and the drilling was much easier.

























.

2. I lined the bucket with fiberglass screen to keep the Pro Mix from falling out of the holes.







.
































The plant goes into veg for 2 weeks under a 150W HPS, I'll train the plant a bit each day and in two or three days the two stems will be bent in semi circles. Then I'll train the branches to grow up and it's a nice scrog style grow.

.

I'll follow this plant through flower to see if it performs better than usual, after I harvest I'll check the root system. And post pictures of both.

.







.


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## Don Gin and Ton (Feb 17, 2010)

hey hobbes man im one step ahead of ya! but im not making my own pots 







the airpot is hands down better than a normal pot


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## Hobbes (Feb 17, 2010)

.

Those look great Don! What are their dimensions? Have you harvested a plant from one and checked out the root ball yet? Do you find that they dry much quicker from evaporation?

I've been wracking my brain about making one of those (I'm going to buy some as well) and was going to heat up a metal cone and push it into plastic buckets. The plastic smell would have been awful. I've been looking around Home Depot and other hardware stores for a plastic matt that I could convert to an Air Pot. I like that the pot directs the roots to the air hole and has less area open for evaporation than my pots.

Please post some pics of the roots and a review when you're ready. Thanks.

.


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## Don Gin and Ton (Feb 17, 2010)

cheers hobbes man! no this is my first run through with the airpots. sadly due to late herms ill be chopping them a touch earlier than id like but ill be posting rootball pics over the weekend. 

as for drying quicker id say a little but not that much, thay are a bitch to water tho i was considering putting a piece of plastic tubing in when i run through next like you see in plants in offices etc. 

top watering is a slow messy process... i found making a bowl shaped well in the top easiest. 

the pots i got are:


Litres &#8211; 5
Diameter (mm) &#8211; 190
Wall Length (mm) &#8211; 660
Wall Height (mm) &#8211; 235


good luck with the experiment man!


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## diet103 (Feb 17, 2010)

I love what you guys are doing! Testing out new methods and sh??owing us what works best! WHat exactly does the air pots do? keep the plant from becoming root bound or what?

And really sorry to hear about the herms Don!! I really feel for you, had 2 different awesome strains herm out and screw over my harvest about 2 weeks ago, it was a sad day! Just had to say that cuz I know what you're going through!!! Never gonna buy fem seeds again, that's for sure. I'd much rather pull out full blown males early than beautiful buds with ugly dicks sticking out of them.


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## Don Gin and Ton (Feb 17, 2010)

exactly man i rarely buy fems if i can get a reg of the same. shitter bout your crop man, its always the supposed bitching strains that grow balls 

airpots basically airprune the plant so the roots grow out rather than round in the pot

check this vid explains it better

http://www.airpotgarden.com/store/index.php?app=gbu0&ns=display&ref=airpotworks


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## NickNasty (Feb 17, 2010)

Hey hobbes I had a few ideas for some DIY Air Pots 2. I will post them in the new thread.


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## diet103 (Feb 17, 2010)

Don Gin and Ton said:


> exactly man i rarely buy fems if i can get a reg of the same. shitter bout your crop man, its always the supposed bitching strains that grow balls
> 
> airpots basically airprune the plant so the roots grow out rather than round in the pot
> 
> ...


Oh I see! So instead of filling th pot with circling roots, the main root keeps growing outward bound roots, this makes sense. I may have to look into these. Is there a noticeable difference?

Ya it sucks I have quite a few fem seeds in my garden at the moment, so it's kind of like watching a bomb ticking that may or may have not been deactivated. We'll see when the time's up!


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## ONEeyedWILLY444 (Feb 17, 2010)

Don Gin and Ton said:


> cheers hobbes man! no this is my first run through with the airpots. sadly due to late herms ill be chopping them a touch earlier than id like but ill be posting rootball pics over the weekend.
> 
> as for drying quicker id say a little but not that much, thay are a bitch to water tho i was considering putting a piece of plastic tubing in when i run through next like you see in plants in offices etc.
> 
> ...


don they should sell a rubber mold that gos around the pots and fills in all the holes so you can just cover, water and let it drain for say 30 secs then peel off and repeat ....if that makes sense...it did to me


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## Hobbes (Feb 17, 2010)

.

OneEyed Willy you just solved my problem, you're a genius!

Come watering time I'm going to put my Air Pruning buckets inside a bucket with no holes on the sides, water as usual, sit for a bit, remove the outer bucket.

.


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## dirrtyd (Feb 17, 2010)

Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> OneEyed Willy you just solved my problem, you're a genius!
> 
> ...


Hobbes #5 and a #7 pot? I would like to try with one plant. Thanks for your response.


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## ONEeyedWILLY444 (Feb 17, 2010)

Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> OneEyed Willy you just solved my problem, you're a genius!
> 
> ...


nothing says thankyou like a nice rep lol
its kind of obvious once you know the idea


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## Hobbes (Feb 17, 2010)

.

*"nothing says thankyou like a nice rep lol"*

You are correct, thank you. 

.


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## Jester88 (Feb 17, 2010)

om of the oppinion that its the thought that counts lol. 

hey hobbes umm ive noticed everyones buried there roots if there in the dark why not let some be exposed to the outer air and just buried.. 

could this help them want to make a new shoot?? 

im just thinking if the roots are to far underground they will see no real need to strive to make a new nodal shoot. let alone see the need to start producing the necisary chemicals to do it. in my experience this has to be helped along or enduced shal we say. 

take grapevines for example although not working with root you can make new nodal sites by cuttig into the vine on an angle, and peeling a nit of bark... this has low succes in my experiences but every now and then when a calys is formed sometimes a neww nodal point and branch will eventually be produced. again very low sucess. 

now as for these airpots
don
the tube idea was good though why not just set up a little drip system to the plants if you find keeping them damp hard.

and heres a question with the edges actually having hioles and places for air to enter i believe that it must be easier to take care of them that is you should be able to saturate the soil a bit more wouldnt you say as theres more places for air to enter. but like you said before the other is applicable to ie the water evaporates faster. 

basically would you say saturation causes less problems in the airpots and possibly a revenue worth taking later in the plants life as theres always ar easily accessible??

if so this would be a very good idea for most noobs out there as overwatering to the point that the soil is completely void of air generally fucks with the plants and there growth.. and this may just well be the answer to al there worries as complete prolonged saturation of the soil would be harder to achieve. 

hehe make them like the bubblebags cept in scales so you can controll evaporation rates and make complete saturation possible.


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## That 5hit (Feb 17, 2010)

offical air pruning - diy air pot thread
click on this link for all air pot info
https://www.rollitup.org/grow-room-design-setup/303229-diy-air-pruning-pot-experiment.html
https://www.rollitup.org/grow-room-design-setup/303229-diy-air-pruning-pot-experiment.html
https://www.rollitup.org/grow-room-design-setup/303229-diy-air-pruning-pot-experiment.html
https://www.rollitup.org/grow-room-design-setup/303229-diy-air-pruning-pot-experiment.html


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## wonderinaliceland (Feb 17, 2010)

Lookin good diet.... Benn checking into the air-pots myself..... Do they have any retailers in the states that carry them???


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## Don Gin and Ton (Feb 18, 2010)

diet103 said:


> Oh I see! So instead of filling th pot with circling roots, the main root keeps growing outward bound roots, this makes sense. I may have to look into these. Is there a noticeable difference?
> hell yeah there's a difference, full pic report i'll post in a separate thread or hobbes diy one later this weekend
> Ya it sucks I have quite a few fem seeds in my garden at the moment, so it's kind of like watching a bomb ticking that may or may have not been deactivated. We'll see when the time's up!


i feel for ya man, im the same tho im only a few days from 9 weeks anyway just sucks the big one when the smell n taste of the dope is so good. i might write subcool n tell him he needs to do some more back crossing hahaha me telling subcool he needs to up his game haahahahaha what a laugh.


ONEeyedWILLY444 said:


> don they should sell a rubber mold that gos around the pots and fills in all the holes so you can just cover, water and let it drain for say 30 secs then peel off and repeat ....if that makes sense...it did to me



good idea if youve got plent room to work with i work in a tent and even reaching the back plants when their 6 ft is near impossible lifting it up to put a bucket under aint happening lol



Jester88 said:


> now as for these airpots
> don
> the tube idea was good though why not just set up a little drip system to the plants if you find keeping them damp hard.
> I have been thinking of this route a dripper would be a great system but its just a complication, if i was going to do it i might as well go hydro.
> ...


not quite sure what you mean here jester!?


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## Jester88 (Feb 18, 2010)

lmfao 

damn your replies are hard to read at times bro lol. 

1st purple writing: yeah i thought that to. i was just thinking that if you wanted to go do something that would leave your plants wanting water a simple drip setup thats gravity fed may be your answer... for short periods that is

2nd purple writing: sorry i thought you said you had trouble keeping the coco moist at times is all. 

3rd purple writing: i didnt mean water through them i just meant that even if you saturate the soil air should be easily available for the roots and what not. meanin saturation will be less of a problem for noobs. 

what i meant on the last one was once the plant has a decent root system you could possibly just saturate the soil and let it dry with relatively no problems as air is always easily accessing the soil. AKA you shouldnt be able to overwater older plants .

sorry this isnt that great of an explanation i had a mate rock up.. hope it clarifies a bit though


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## Don Gin and Ton (Feb 18, 2010)

rockin up sheesh i thought youd left that all behind  jks jks sorry couldnt resist

thats kool man i just didnt quite get what ya meant! thats rpetty much how the airpot works


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## Jester88 (Feb 18, 2010)

left what all behind??


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## pterzw (Feb 18, 2010)

Why keep it in the dark. Wouldn't roots be more likely to produce sprouts if they can sense light and possibility for photosynthesis?


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## Don Gin and Ton (Feb 18, 2010)

rocking up


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## Hobbes (Feb 18, 2010)

.

*"**Why keep it in the dark. Wouldn't roots be more likely to produce sprouts if they can sense light and possibility for photosynthesis?"*



petrzw light and low humidity will kill any part of the root in that area. Roots grow in the dark - also means that they grow mostly when the plant isn't focusing on photosynthesis.

Opening the sides of a pot or bucket to the light and air (low humidity) is a way to air prune the roots to stop circling, produce thicker roots and branching.

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-room-design-setup/303229-diy-air-pruning-pot-experiment.html

.


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## pterzw (Feb 18, 2010)

Hi Hobbes

low humidity will of course kill roots , but light itself is harmless. My mother plants grow in white,transparent cups...some roots are green ,but my mothers are doing just fine.
Is it essential to grow roots for clones in darkness? Why do you think so? Did you compare "light and darkness" roots?
I will try your method in 2 months. Sounds interesting. 


Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> *"**Why keep it in the dark. Wouldn't roots be more likely to produce sprouts if they can sense light and possibility for photosynthesis?"*
> 
> ...


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## Hobbes (Feb 18, 2010)

.

You are correct and I am wrong pterzw, but it still seems that light will cause algae growth in a high humidity environment like inside a sealed clear container or zip lock bag (great way to contain roots while budding, we could throw a dozen large ziplock bags in a bucket and clone a dozen strains in a small place. I hadn't thought of this before, something good can come from being wrong.

Thanks for the education pterzw, I appreciate the knowledge.

*"A plant can function quite well with its roots exposed to light as long as they do not dry out. However, the light encourages alga growth, which causes odors, and the alga competes with the plant for nutrients in the light period and oxygen in the dark period."*

http://www.hydroempire.com/store/hydroponic-plant-parts.php

.


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## macdadyabc (Feb 18, 2010)

i cant wait to see the results. subscribed


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## Hobbes (Feb 18, 2010)

*.

**The Roots*

*The magic chemistry of plant growth starts at the roots. Roots send nutrients (in exchange for sugar) up through leaf stems to the leaves for final processing. They are also large storage sites for excess energy from the leaves, which is stored as starch. The roots and their capacity to store starch will decide how well a plant will grow and how much the plant will yield.

*​ *Root size: A research Rye plant in a 12-inch pot had 14 billion root hairs that, if placed end to end, would have stretched 6,200 miles (almost 10,000 kilometres). The root hairs alone would have covered a square area of 180 ft by 180 ft (about 55 m by 55 m)! The more extensive the root system, the better the plant will grow. This is because roots storing much energy are able to exchange lots of nutrients up to the leaves, and so the leaves can send down more sugar, etc. Thus, root growth is directly affected by moisture, oxygen, temperature, and sugars sent down from the leaves.

*​ *Root medium is important for plant growth. The less energy the roots use to absorb water and nutrients from their surrounding medium, the more they can use that energy to grow and to help send nutrients up to the plant. Most of a plant's water is taken in by the root hairs. 99% of the water taken in by a plant is transpired out through the leaves. A plant will fall over and wilt as a result of its roots not being able to extract any more water from the surroundings. (See Mediums for Growing)

*​ *Air roots: in a plant's natural life in the earth, its roots get moisture from rainfall. After rain, the soil water soon sinks down and the topsoil dries quickly. For this reason, the top 1/3 of plant roots are air specialized and the bottom 1/3 are water roots. One must be careful not to keep the air specialized roots constantly wet or the plant will drown. The bottom section of roots can be constantly wet provided that the water has oxygen in it. Stagnant water will soon kill the plant. The roots should always look crisp and white. If the roots develop brown tips or general browning, the problem is usually lack of oxygen, and infection will soon follow.*​ *
A plant can function quite well with its roots exposed to light as long as they do not dry out. However, the light encourages alga growth, which causes odors, and the alga competes with the plant for nutrients in the light period and oxygen in the dark period.

*​ *Oxygen is the most important root requirement because the roots need oxygen to convert sugar to energy. The more oxygen available to the roots, the more energy they can transfer to the plant.

*​ *Temperature also affects root growth and function. The roots do a great deal of their storage developing at night when the green sections of the plant are not being pressured by the light to produce and distribute the day's excess sugar to the roots. Roots function more efficiently when they are warm, so roots in warm dark period develop better structures than those grown in cool dark period. As an illustration, a cycle of warm dark 77°F (25°C) and day 59°F (15°C) would develop better roots than a cycle of cool dark 59°F (15°C) and day 77°F (25°C). In essence, plants will grow better with a high average 24-hour root temperature that is constant rather than fluctuating.*​ *
Roots: the root hair zone is relatively small and starts just behind the growing root cap. This zone advances with the growing roots and as the new hairs near the tip emerge, the older hairs die I off. Here is where most water and nutrients are absorbed. So for fast growth, plant roots must not be allowed to become rootbound but be kept healthy and advancing at maximum throughout the entire life of the plant. When growing in pots that are too small, it is better to have the roots trim themselves by coating the inside of pots with a special copper paint rather than letting the roots circle and girdle themselves. In general, pots are not oxygen efficient for super plant growth. Remember that plant yield is proportional to root size.
*​ *
.

The Stems*

The stems serve as supply pipes between the roots and the leaves. 

* Shorter stems are better because the nutrients have less distance to travel between the roots and the leaves. This affects the whole plant since it does not have to lift the water too high, the plant conserves energy - that energy can then be used for extra yield.*

http://www.hydroempire.com/store/hyd...lant-parts.php

.


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## pterzw (Feb 18, 2010)

Hobbes

I wish you all the best, 

You have no idea how many perfectly healthy root balls have I thrown away because I had no idea of "cloning from root".
Lets perfect this method. Thanks for inspiration.


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## ONEeyedWILLY444 (Feb 18, 2010)

Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> *"nothing says thankyou like a nice rep lol"*
> 
> ...


 thank you 2.


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## Hobbes (Feb 18, 2010)

.

Maybe the root tips are want we want, might act like stem cells. There's so little on the net about root budding we'll have to experiment to know.

.

*1. Root Tips*





The growing tip of roots is protected by a root cap consisting of concentric layers of cells surrounding the apical meristem where new root cells are produced. The surface of the root cap of growing roots is often covered by a thick layer of mucilage (Rougier & Chaboud 1985).

When roots stop growing the root cap may be protected by suberisation of its outermost cells, as is shown below. These metacutinised root tips would generally not be produced by annual species such as crop plants, but are commonly produced by perennial plants such as trees (Romberger 1963, Brundrett & Kendrick 1988.

.


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## Hobbes (Feb 19, 2010)

.

OneEyedWilly these are the fruits of your intellectual labor:

An air pruning bucket with 1 1/2" and 1/4" holes, lined with 5 layers of fiberglass screen - for air pruning as well as possible constriction or trapping.







.

And the air pruning bucket in it's OneEyedWilly jacket bucket:







.


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## Sexxxy Beast (Feb 21, 2010)

Has anyone had a root sprout yet?


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## dtp5150 (Feb 21, 2010)

yeah so ....not much good news about this technique with cannabis since the first posting

if by now, over a month later, there are still no growths, this technique may be worthless

as a side note I cloned a fan leaf and it grew roots, i transplanted into soil and its now grown a tap root. I have no worries that this will grow into a normal weed plant. its a very slow method and should be for emergencies only. just make sure its a big leaf and has plenty of stem


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## That 5hit (Feb 21, 2010)

dtp5150 said:


> yeah so ....not much good news about this technique with cannabis since the first posting
> 
> if by now, over a month later, there are still no growths, this technique may be worthless
> 
> as a side note I cloned a fan leaf and it grew roots, i transplanted into soil and its now grown a tap root. I have no worries that this will grow into a normal weed plant. its a very slow method and should be for emergencies only. just make sure its a big leaf and has plenty of stem


 the old leaf clone
this has never been proven with pot 
can we see pics

i do think it possible if you can root clone you can leaf clone
prolly way faster then a root clone


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## ONEeyedWILLY444 (Feb 22, 2010)

Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> OneEyedWilly these are the fruits of your intellectual labor:
> 
> ...


 
good stuff hobbes..hope it works well for you


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## canadianidiot (Feb 22, 2010)

I live in canada, and we have choppped plants at the stalk about 6 inches up usually and thrown them in our compost piles then buring them into the pile and let set over the winter. In the spring them we have found that there is one plant in each of these compost piles! I am not sure if you would consider this as root clonings? But they definetly grow new plants when you leave just a small portion of your main stem and break the root ball up and then bury it for the winter.
These plants then grow with so much viagor and turn into huge plants with tons of bud sites!
I forgot to mention these were hemp plants but a freind of mine practices our same techniques with his mj plants!

Any feedback on what we are doing??
ALso where can you get PROMIX? I heard they went out of buisness as the home depot does not sell it anymore, unless they are not a vendor anymore?


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## IAm5toned (Feb 22, 2010)

yeah im having a hard time finding it to.


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## canadianidiot (Feb 22, 2010)

IAm5toned said:


> yeah im having a hard time finding it to.


Have you found anyone with it anymore? Im pretty sure Home Depot quit setlling it!


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## IAm5toned (Feb 22, 2010)

the only place I have seen it recently is ace hardware.... for like 45$ a bag. havent been there in a while tho.
i know you can order the shit online, but i imagine the shipping would be ridiculous... i just cant find it locally atm.
maybe when they start stocking there spring stuff

wait.. edit/ps

look at what i found:
http://www.premierhort.com/eProMix/

just click the distributor locator....


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## XxNinjaxX (Feb 23, 2010)

This is a wicked Idea, but wouldn't the roots just more likely rot or die without the plant? Also where is the light coming from for energy?


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## Hobbes (Feb 23, 2010)

.

*"wouldn't the roots just more likely rot or die without the plant?"*

Yes. As they would also die if the plant were dug up with the roots and both put in a dark warm bucket. 

We're experimenting to create an environment for the roots to bud (clone) as a branch cutting needs the proper moist and dark environment to root (not for the leaves, the stem). As well, we separate each piece of root from the root ball as though it were an individual cutting that we're putting in a bubbler or rockwool - we wouldn't stick a whole plant in a piece of rockwool and expect it to root grow roots at a branch; we wouldn't pick woody cuttings and expect them to root. 

There are certain types of roots (_adventitious_) that have evolved to grow buds and propagate the plant under certain conditions - as roots are still much of a mystery to most of us we have to learn which roots are which and which of the adventitious roots will make good "cuttings" for clones. 

Hopefully I've explained it well throughout the thread that each piece of root "cutting" has to be separated from the rest of the root ball. All of the root cutting can be mixed together to bud but they first must be torn apart so they are each individual pieces.

That being said, the only time I cloned with this method I had just a couple months growing experience and grabbed a bunch of roots from the bottom side of a bucket, thew it in an empty bucket, mixed in some distilled water, covered with plastic and a lid, in a couple of months had hundreds of sprouts. The learning curve is not high but we need adventitious roots (separated), not the seminal root; and we need the proper temperature and humidity, plus some other environmental factors we'll figure out over time.

.

*"Also where is the light coming from for energy?"*

Ninjax it's amazing how little information there is on the web about root cloning, so some of my answers come from speculation and the small bit of experience I have with this method rather than accredited sources. This is one of those speculation and experience explanations.

I suspect it's stored energy as in a seed, from when the root was attached to and feed by the plant. Roots are full of sugar that they receive from the upper plant in exchange for raw materials. One of the methods of root branching, constriction, causes a build up of sugars in the root on the plant side of the constriction; this is one of the factors that contribute to root branching on that side of the constriction.

.

*How the Superoots Fielder works*

Root tips penetrate the geotextile wall and base, unimpeded, and grow out into the surrounding soil. The fabric allows the root to expand until it reaches a diameter of 3mm, when the fabric stops giving and the root is successfully restricted. 







Perfect restriction of a Fraxinus root - showing the large nodule, secondary branching behind the restriction, the point of restriction and the smaller external root.

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-room-design-setup/303229-diy-air-pruning-pot-experiment-5.html

.


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## Hobbes (Feb 23, 2010)

.

*Pro Mix*: Check your yellow pages for a nursery (plants not babies) and one should carry it. Rona carries it for $29 a bag in my area at the moment.








http://www.rona.ca/shop/~bxmycorise-pro-pro-mix-187876_!pro-mix_shop

.


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## That 5hit (Feb 23, 2010)

http://www.finegardening.com/how-to/articles/grow-more-plants-with-root-cuttings.aspx

*Grow more plants with root cuttings*

*Use this simple technique at the right time to multiply some of your favorites*

by Hunter Stubbs 
The major benefit of root cuttings is the simplicity of the process. Four easy steps can produce a large number of plants without requiring fancy equipment. This method of propagation requires that most of our efforts take place in very late autumn or very early spring, two times when we have a short list of gardening chores. The ensuing growing season will find your new plants filling out, and by the fall, they should be ready for a permanent place in your garden design.
 

*Uncover the roots when the plant is dormant*

Root cuttings are most effective if taken when plants are dormant, usually between November and February. This timing maximizes the stored energy in the roots and minimizes the stress on the parent plant. Once a plant breaks bud in the spring, energy begins to move out of the roots and into the plant, reducing the effectiveness of root cuttings. I also make sure the parent plant is well hydrated and was not under drought stress when it went dormant before I take any cuttings.
When collecting roots on smaller plants, such as perennials, I find it easier to simply lift them in their entirety. For shrubs, I unearth some of the roots on one side of the plant, digging in close proximity to the base to ensure I find roots belonging to the right plant. I then trace them out from the plant until I have a suffi&shy;cient length to take several cuttings.


Make sure you find the right root. 
Digging close to the base of your 
shrub ensures that you get roots from 
the right plant. 
 
Then make sure you choose a living 
root, not a dead, black one. 

*Choose roots that are pencil thick *

 
Shrub roots can get quite large and 
woody, but the best ones for cuttings
are those approximately as thick as a 
pencil. 

These are young, vigorous roots that are more likely to send up new shoots. With perennial roots, thicker is better. I use a sharp pair of pruners to make a straight cut at the end of the root closest to the parent plant. At the far end, I make a diagonal cut. This helps me maintain the root&#8217;s original orientation, critical to the production of new roots and shoots. I always avoid cutting off more than one-third of the roots because this may eliminate too much of the plant&#8217;s stored energy.
I then take the long pieces of root I removed and cut them into sections 3 to 6 inches long, making sure to cut the ends closest to the plant straight and the ends farthest from the plant at an angle. The optimal length is 3 to 6 inches because it ensures that there is enough energy in the cutting and, in some cases, enough dormant buds to produce roots and shoots.
After taking the cuttings, I replant the mother plant or cover the exposed roots. Then I water the area thoroughly to remove large air pockets in the soil and settle the roots back into their home.

*Place the cuttings in soil, and wait*

To get the most out of my cuttings, I treat perennials and woody plants differently at this stage.


 
Place perennial roots horizontally 
because they can send up shoots 
from several places along a cutting. 


*Perennials*
I like to propagate perennial root cuttings in flats because they produce shoots quickly and have the ability to break bud in several places along the root. I place the cuttings horizontally, ½ inch deep, in a flat of moist potting soil (photo, above). To maintain high humidity, I cover the flat with a plastic bag or a pane of glass and place it under lights.

*Woody Plants*
If I&#8217;m working with cuttings from a woody plant (photos, below), I tie them in a loose bundle with like ends together. To locate the cuttings after storage, I wrap them with bright marking tape, allowing a few extra feet to hang from the bundle. I dig a hole below the frost level and place a few inches of sand in the bottom to ensure that the cuttings don&#8217;t rot from poor drainage. I then place the bundles with the slanted ends facing down in the bottom of the hole and refill it.


Tying the cuttings in a
bundle makes them easier 
to find when it is time to 
dig them up. 


The entire hole doesn&#8217;t 
need to be filled with 
sand. But it is essential 
in the bottom to reduce 
the potential for rot. 


Colored tape or some 
other type of marker 
wrapped around the 
cuttings and sticking 
aboveground will keep 
you from planting on top
of the bundle. 



*Plant new shoots outside, and keep them moist*

Cuttings stored in the ground should be ready to lift within three to four weeks but can stay buried for much longer if the weather remains too cold for them to be planted outside. When they are unearthed, the cuttings will likely have roots and, occasionally, some small shoots forming on the cuttings. Even if I see neither sign of growth, I still move forward, unwrapping the bundle and separating the cuttings. I plant the cuttings in freshly prepared, loose garden soil, setting them vertically, 12 to 18 inches apart, with the tops of the cuttings (the straight ends) approximately 2 inches below the soil surface. I mark the area well to prevent planting something else in the same place. As the temperatures rise, I make sure the cuttings stay moist. In a few months, new shoots should be apparent, and they will welcome a light solution of water-soluble fertilizer.
Perennial cuttings grown inside can sprout quicker than their outdoor counterparts. After several shoots emerge, I remove the protective covers, feed them with a half-strength solution of liquid fertilizer, and, if the plants are sun lovers, supply ample light. Just like seedlings, these new shoots will need to be gradually introduced to the rigors of outdoor life before they can be planted in a permanent home.

 
A new shoot 

 
Time for shoots to become plants. To 
help the transition, provide some TLC 
in the form of moist, fertile, loose soil.


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## FileError404 (Feb 23, 2010)

Hoping for results soon... subbed.


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## That 5hit (Feb 23, 2010)




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## That 5hit (Feb 23, 2010)

[youtube]k9Zu6eo3ctg[/youtube]


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## beeker (Feb 23, 2010)

Nothing showin on mine yet, keep on truckin


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## alexonfire (Feb 23, 2010)

wow all this stuff is so new to me. Really interesting info


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## Don Gin and Ton (Feb 26, 2010)

sorry i was a bit late with the pics but heres the first plants root ball from the airpot









inside was just solid dense root 










pics of the airpot vs normal will be up on sun/mon


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## DST (Feb 26, 2010)

Nice corrugated root structure Don.


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## uncledav (Feb 26, 2010)

I have been following this Thread and I also tried sprouting some roots 4 weeks ago. No Luck yet. But + reps to every one who is trying. Has Anyone got a root to sprout ???


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## tom__420 (Feb 26, 2010)

Has anyone had any sprouts from their root ball yet?
I have rooted almost two dozen clones since this thread started....


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## mcpurple (Feb 26, 2010)

i am treyin this but i just tossed the roots out side under the earth and when spring comes they mite pop up. im lettin nature do it for me


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## uncledav (Feb 26, 2010)

mcpurple said:


> i am treyin this but i just tossed the roots out side under the earth and when spring comes they mite pop up. im lettin nature do it for me


You really trying or did you just throw the root ball out back?


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## uncledav (Feb 26, 2010)

tom__420 said:


> Has anyone had any sprouts from their root ball yet?
> I have rooted almost two dozen clones since this thread started....


No sprouts from roots yet. But I started 72 seeds at the same time I did the root cuttings . My seedlings are 12 to 14 inches tall and kicking Early Girl x Hindu Kush  It would be nice if this did work. Good way to make lots of Clones of a proven Plant


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## dtp5150 (Feb 26, 2010)

it seems to take even longer than revegging the harvested plant....


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## tom__420 (Feb 26, 2010)

dtp5150 said:


> it seems to take even longer than revegging the harvested plant....


Which makes me wonder why people are wasting their time....
Even when you get sprouts it will only be a small sprout
With a clone or revegged plant it is a full blown plant, not a small seedling

I guess maybe people want to say that they did it but from the looks of it this is not a practical way of reproducing


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## jcdws602 (Feb 26, 2010)

tom__420 said:


> Which makes me wonder why people are wasting their time....
> Even when you get sprouts it will only be a small sprout
> With a clone or revegged plant it is a full blown plant, not a small seedling
> 
> I guess maybe people want to say that they did it but from the looks of it this is not a practical way of reproducing



Exactly............even if this works.....it takes way too long to use for any practical means....it was just a cool experiment if anybody would have reported success....but it has been long enough and we can pretty much say it's a no go.....anybody get anything????????????????????????


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## hotsxyman911 (Feb 26, 2010)

dude just think about this if you take the roots off of the plant during veg when you repot your plant if you do, than you will have a ton of sprouts by the time the plant goes into flowering. so why not have a ton of new plants instead of taking clones, i mean not everyone is pro at taking clones even though it seems so easy some still die and this all you have to do is pull some roots put it into something like a ziplock and than all you have to do is wait. now if your impatient (which im sure you are) than this is not a method for you. but dont hate on it and say this is a stupid method. its just another method.


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## hotsxyman911 (Feb 26, 2010)

and this is like a last resort just in case you didn't take clones from your plant.


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## tom__420 (Feb 26, 2010)

Why would you do this when revegging the plant would be quicker?
I may be impatient if that means I won't sit around for months waiting for sprouts when I could just as easily clip a clone and have a new plant in a week or two


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## jcdws602 (Feb 26, 2010)

hotsxyman911 said:


> dude just think about this if you take the roots off of the plant during veg when you repot your plant if you do, than you will have a ton of sprouts by the time the plant goes into flowering. so why not have a ton of new plants instead of taking clones, i mean not everyone is pro at taking clones even though it seems so easy some still die and this all you have to do is pull some roots put it into something like a ziplock and than all you have to do is wait. now if your impatient (which im sure you are) than this is not a method for you. but dont hate on it and say this is a stupid method. its just another method.


First off I never said this was stupid.....second, not one of you guys has had any type of sprouts....so how could you try to persuade anybody this is a way to reproduce more plants.........I was hoping someone would get some sprouts that is why I subscribed to this and your thread but not one person has reported any success...hmmmm I wonder why?????It's not a waste of time if you learn something...but it is safe to say unless someone has any sprouts yet that this hasn't worked and probably won't work.....I have been growing for a little over 10 years......I am into efficiency,and maximizing yields.....I have tried almost everything......cloning is the most efficient way of reproducing more plants plain and simple....I understand if you didn't take any clones and you want to keep the strain this would be ideal if it worked but it hasn't,a prepared grower takes clones in the event the strain would show favorable traits and if it don't you simply discard the clones...that is a simple as it gets,if you don't like what I'm saying then that's on you....I'll keep doing what has brought me success and you do what pleases you......I hope you get sprouts......really.........


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## That 5hit (Feb 26, 2010)

i think you guys are doing it wrong 
that's why i put up all that research
you cant just throught the roots in a sealed wet bucket
you have to cut them up into small parts 
close to the rootball and place them in the same way the naturally grow down


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## IAm5toned (Feb 26, 2010)

even if it takes longer than revegging, if you did it on a larger scale, over time, if you cut up enough rootballs, say 10 of em, you would have a perpetual propagation system thats almost effortless when compared to cloning from cuttings. if one rootball produced 10 sprouts of fem plants, and it takes say 80 days for sprouts to appear with leaves; (and the way i see it is that 10 would be a conservative number if the method can be refined and perfected) then if you cut up 10 rootballs, from plants that were cloned from a female, by the time your current harvest is done, you would have an estimated 100 cloned feminized plants rerady for vegging... without taking a single cutting or using a milligram of rootone or a drop of clonex. if you cant see the benefits to that,_ especially _for SOG's then i just dont know what to say. 

i have never seen, personally, a cannabis plant that was cloned using this method. im very curious what the 'shoots' would look like as they emerge from the ground, as seedlings have cotyledons


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## That 5hit (Feb 26, 2010)

IAm5toned said:


> even if it takes longer than revegging, if you did it on a larger scale, over time, if you cut up enough rootballs, say 10 of em, you would have a perpetual propagation system thats almost effortless when compared to cloning from cuttings. if one rootball produced 10 sprouts of fem plants, and it takes say 80 days for sprouts to appear with leaves; (and the way i see it is that 10 would be a conservative number if the method can be refined and perfected) then if you cut up 10 rootballs, from plants that were cloned from a female, by the time your current harvest is done, you would have an estimated 100 cloned feminized plants rerady for vegging... without taking a single cutting or using a milligram of rootone or a drop of clonex. if you cant see the benefits to that,_ especially _for SOG's then i just dont know what to say.
> 
> i have never seen, personally, a cannabis plant that was cloned using this method. im very curious what the 'shoots' would look like as they emerge from the ground, as seedlings have cotyledons


it would take clone only strains to a new level - think of how much space you would be saving by only having sprouts 
but i read that this takes anywhere form 6 months to a full year to sprout for other types of plants 
for me learning this would mean the ablity to save a strain that is form unknown orgin,- i grow bagseed and every now and then that fire as seed that i grew was over the top fire, but this i didnt no untill harvest so at that point it would be to late to clone 
but not if this worked


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## IAm5toned (Feb 26, 2010)

even if it took as long as 6-12 months,. if the timing could be dialed in, then its simply a matter of staggering the timing of the root clones so that they coincide with your harvest times.
im all about this. if it wasnt so fuckin cold where im at, i would be doing it myself, but im out of space in the 'lab', so i can just see it now, me carrying in a bucket of dirt and roots into the house, and the old lady just standing there with 'the look' we all know, and me saying 'what?'


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## JohneyGreenApple (Feb 26, 2010)

It is perfect if you live in a place with a harsh winter such as canada, See heres where it all starts: 
You have harvested your plants in the fall time and a month has gone by, your buds are all dried and cured now and you have your smoke in hand. You light up that spliff when you find that that bagseed you planted is some super killer ass bud and you decide you want to grow it again. But wait you forgot you have used all of those seeds up and now smoked the final product.... Oops you didnt take any clones either.... Idiot what were you thinking! Well there stands your rootball from that plant that your smoking.
So now the snow is starting to fall and you decide before things freeze up too much more you bury your rootball and the remaining couple inches of that stalk that have dried up. So you dig a hole into your compost pile and for best results try to get it into the middle area where it will be least exposed (Even though it may not help or it may makea wold of difference) then you pile the compost back on to it and pour the soil from those dreaded buckets ontop of the pile!
4months later you are digging around in your pile for dirt for your garden when you notice a small weed plant sprouting out of your pile, start digging until you have successfully extracted yout tiny girl out of the soil and throw her and some soil n a bucket and let her grow out another year.
Viola! It has been done before and it will be done again, Just be sure to make some clones this go around because she will loose her potency over the next couple years of repeating this due to the harsh conditions and many other factors.
This is not a experiment it is a fact.
Thank You, Come again!


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## jcdws602 (Feb 27, 2010)

IAm5toned said:


> even if it takes longer than revegging, if you did it on a larger scale, over time, if you cut up enough rootballs, say 10 of em, you would have a perpetual propagation system thats almost effortless when compared to cloning from cuttings. if one rootball produced 10 sprouts of fem plants, and it takes say 80 days for sprouts to appear with leaves; (and the way i see it is that 10 would be a conservative number if the method can be refined and perfected) then if you cut up 10 rootballs, from plants that were cloned from a female, by the time your current harvest is done, you would have an estimated 100 cloned feminized plants rerady for vegging... without taking a single cutting or using a milligram of rootone or a drop of clonex. if you cant see the benefits to that,_ especially _for SOG's then i just dont know what to say.
> 
> i have never seen, personally, a cannabis plant that was cloned using this method. im very curious what the 'shoots' would look like as they emerge from the ground, as seedlings have cotyledons






IAm5toned said:


> even if it took as long as 6-12 months,. if the timing could be dialed in, then its simply a matter of staggering the timing of the root clones so that they coincide with your harvest times.
> im all about this. if it wasnt so fuckin cold where im at, i would be doing it myself, but im out of space in the 'lab', so i can just see it now, me carrying in a bucket of dirt and roots into the house, and the old lady just standing there with 'the look' we all know, and me saying 'what?'


Cloning is still more efficient........if you could even get anything to sprout it would take so long compared to cloning....by the time you have your first sprout (if possible) you could have had a whole bunch of clones rooting and vegging.....and by the time your sprouts would be vegging the clones would already be flowering if not done because it has been a month and nobody has had any results....and other clones would already have been taken right before the switch.....so how could this be more efficient????To get clones you need to veg for a certain amount of time...ok....to get a nice root ball you have to grow your plant until there is a nice size root ball.....ok....the difference is at that time the plants have a big enough root ball and are ready to be cloned the clones will be ready in 7-14 days and the the roots will take much longer......so why wait so much longer when the end result is gonna be the same???I'm sure clones and plants produced from roots will produce the same or did I miss something????


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## pterzw (Feb 27, 2010)

jcdws602 said:


> Cloning is still more efficient........if you could even get anything to sprout it would take so long compared to cloning....by the time you have your first sprout (if possible) you could have had a whole bunch of clones rooting and vegging.....and by the time your sprouts would be vegging the clones would already be flowering if not done because it has been a month and nobody has had any results....and other clones would already have been taken right before the switch.....so how could this be more efficient????To get clones you need to veg for a certain amount of time...ok....to get a nice root ball you have to grow your plant until there is a nice size root ball.....ok....the difference is at that time the plants have a big enough root ball and are ready to be cloned the clones will be ready in 7-14 days and the the roots will take much longer......so why wait so much longer when the end result is gonna be the same???I'm sure clones and plants produced from roots will produce the same or did I miss something????


For example....
Where I live getting caugth transporting 1-5 clones eqals BIG fine. Getting caught with 6 and more means I go to jail. 
Being stopped by LEA with bucket of dirt in my car...I go home and laugh about it.


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## JohneyGreenApple (Feb 27, 2010)

I agree with pterzw but I dont think anyone listened to my input on this.... Go back a page and read up. Its a sure way to keep genetics and especially if you dont have room in the grow room for that clone plant or in the winter if you dont have a grow room..... well there you go! Think outside the box dude!

IMO= I dont know anyone who keeps ther bucket with a plant that has been chopped off at the stalk in their grow room while they are using the space to grow! Doesnt make much sense.... Once again thats where my theory of the compost pile comes into play! I have alot of ideas to share if anyone wants to hear them or maybe agrees to what im saying, it works and always will work.... Just do it if you want to save your genetics, its simple and effective!


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## IAm5toned (Feb 27, 2010)

jcdws602 said:


> Cloning is still more efficient........if you could even get anything to sprout it would take so long compared to cloning....by the time you have your first sprout (if possible) you could have had a whole bunch of clones rooting and vegging.....and by the time your sprouts would be vegging the clones would already be flowering if not done because it has been a month and nobody has had any results....and other clones would already have been taken right before the switch.....so how could this be more efficient????To get clones you need to veg for a certain amount of time...ok....to get a nice root ball you have to grow your plant until there is a nice size root ball.....ok....the difference is at that time the plants have a big enough root ball and are ready to be cloned the clones will be ready in 7-14 days and the the roots will take much longer......so why wait so much longer when the end result is gonna be the same???I'm sure clones and plants produced from roots will produce the same or did I miss something????





> *Yoda*: "_I cannot teach him. The boy has no patience._" *
> Obi-Wan*: "_He will learn patience._"


its all about patience man....
im fully aware you could clone 5 dozen batches in the time it takes to to rootclone, as im sure everyone on this thread is as well.
frankly, i would love a way to have hundreds of clone without using a cloner, and if it takes a few months or even a year to develope this technique, i am fully prepared to wait it out.


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## Hobbes (Feb 27, 2010)

.

Don't forget getting sprouts for your most amazing feminized autoflower pheno. A cloned cutting from an autoflower plant is the same age as the mother so normal cloning will not continue the genetics. But we're hoping that a budded root sprout with calydons ages as a new plant and not a continuation of the mother. A possible method of retaining and passing on genetics for autoflowers that are worthy of being a clone-only plant.

(Nick's idea from page 3)

.

Things are still looking good though I'm concerned that my temperature is dropping too much at night - last time I did this was in spring/summer and the warmer temps might have contributed. I have an aquarium heater in my bubbler and I'll figure something better out for my dirt buckets. I've read that constant temperature is important, not warm and cool.

Some of the roots have that "something is happening" look that cuttings get when they swell just before rooting. I do feel that I have to fix warmer constant temperatures for this to work, missing ingredient right now.

Settle in, it gonna be a while.

.


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## Hobbes (Feb 27, 2010)

.

*Grow more plants with root cuttings*

*Use this simple technique at the right time to multiply some of your favorites*

by Hunter Stubbs 

The major benefit of root cuttings is the simplicity of the process. Four easy steps can produce a large number of plants without requiring fancy equipment. This method of propagation requires that most of our efforts take place in very late autumn or very early spring, two times when we have a short list of gardening chores. The ensuing growing season will find your new plants filling out, and by the fall, they should be ready for a permanent place in your garden design.







*Uncover the roots when the plant is dormant*

Root cuttings are most effective if taken when plants are dormant, usually between November and February. This timing maximizes the stored energy in the roots and minimizes the stress on the parent plant. Once a plant breaks bud in the spring, energy begins to move out of the roots and into the plant, reducing the effectiveness of root cuttings. I also make sure the parent plant is well hydrated and was not under drought stress when it went dormant before I take any cuttings.

When collecting roots on smaller plants, such as perennials, I find it easier to simply lift them in their entirety. For shrubs, I unearth some of the roots on one side of the plant, digging in close proximity to the base to ensure I find roots belonging to the right plant. I then trace them out from the plant until I have a suffi*cient length to take several cuttings.


Make sure you find the right root. Digging close to the base of your shrub ensures that you get roots from the right plant. 






Then make sure you choose a living root, not a dead, black one. 








*Choose roots that are pencil thick *







Shrub roots can get quite large and woody, but the best ones for cuttings are those approximately as thick as a pencil. These are young, vigorous roots that are more likely to send up new shoots. With perennial roots, thicker is better. I use a sharp pair of pruners to make a straight cut at the end of the root closest to the parent plant. At the far end, I make a diagonal cut. This helps me maintain the root&#8217;s original orientation, critical to the production of new roots and shoots. I always avoid cutting off more than one-third of the roots because this may eliminate too much of the plant&#8217;s stored energy.

I then take the long pieces of root I removed and cut them into sections 3 to 6 inches long, making sure to cut the ends closest to the plant straight and the ends farthest from the plant at an angle. The optimal length is 3 to 6 inches because it ensures that there is enough energy in the cutting and, in some cases, enough dormant buds to produce roots and shoots.

After taking the cuttings, I replant the mother plant or cover the exposed roots. Then I water the area thoroughly to remove large air pockets in the soil and settle the roots back into their home.

.

*Place the cuttings in soil, and wait*

To get the most out of my cuttings, I treat perennials and woody plants differently at this stage.







Place perennial roots horizontally because they can send up shoots from several places along a cutting. 
*
Perennials

*I like to propagate perennial root cuttings in flats because they produce shoots quickly and have the ability to break bud in several places along the root. I place the cuttings horizontally, ½ inch deep, in a flat of moist potting soil (photo, above). To maintain high humidity, I cover the flat with a plastic bag or a pane of glass and place it under lights.

*Woody Plants

*If I&#8217;m working with cuttings from a woody plant (photos, below), I tie them in a loose bundle with like ends together. To locate the cuttings after storage, I wrap them with bright marking tape, allowing a few extra feet to hang from the bundle. I dig a hole below the frost level and place a few inches of sand in the bottom to ensure that the cuttings don&#8217;t rot from poor drainage. I then place the bundles with the slanted ends facing down in the bottom of the hole and refill it.

 Tying the cuttings in a bundle makes them easier to find when it is time to dig them up
  http://www.finegardening.com/CMS/uploadedimages/Images/Gardening/Issues_111-120/041111045-02_xlg.jpg

The entire hole doesn&#8217;t need to be filled with sand. But it is essential in the bottom to reduce the potential for rot. 
  http://www.finegardening.com/CMS/uploadedimages/Images/Gardening/Issues_111-120/041111045-03_xlg.jpg

Colored tape or some other type of marker wrapped around the cuttings and sticking aboveground will keep you from planting on top of the bundle.
 http://www.finegardening.com/CMS/uploadedimages/Images/Gardening/Issues_111-120/041111045-04_xlg.jpg



*Plant new shoots outside, and keep them moist*

Cuttings stored in the ground should be ready to lift within three to four weeks but can stay buried for much longer if the weather remains too cold for them to be planted outside. When they are unearthed, the cuttings will likely have roots and, occasionally, some small shoots forming on the cuttings. Even if I see neither sign of growth, I still move forward, unwrapping the bundle and separating the cuttings. I plant the cuttings in freshly prepared, loose garden soil, setting them vertically, 12 to 18 inches apart, with the tops of the cuttings (the straight ends) approximately 2 inches below the soil surface. I mark the area well to prevent planting something else in the same place. As the temperatures rise, I make sure the cuttings stay moist. In a few months, new shoots should be apparent, and they will welcome a light solution of water-soluble fertilizer.

Perennial cuttings grown inside can sprout quicker than their outdoor counterparts. After several shoots emerge, I remove the protective covers, feed them with a half-strength solution of liquid fertilizer, and, if the plants are sun lovers, supply ample light. Just like seedlings, these new shoots will need to be gradually introduced to the rigors of outdoor life before they can be planted in a permanent home.


A new shoot 











Time for shoots to become plants. To help the transition, provide some TLC in the form of moist, fertile, loose soil. 



*The best plants to start from root cuttings*

*Woody Plants

Figs* (_Ficus carica_) zones 6&#8211;9
*Glory bowers* (_Clerodendrum_ spp. and cvs.) zones 7&#8211;11
*Hydrangeas* (_Hydrangea paniculata_ and cvs.) zones 4&#8211;8
*Lilacs* (_Syringa vulgaris_ cvs.) zones 4&#8211;8
*Mock oranges* (_Philadelphus coronarius_ and cvs.) zones 4&#8211;9
*Oregon grapehollies* (_Mahonia aquifolium_ and cvs.) zones 6&#8211;9
*Pussy willow* (_Salix discolor_) zones 4&#8211;8
*Raspberry* (_Rubus biflorus_) zones 6&#8211;9
*Red- and yellow-twig dogwoods* (_Cornus stolonifera_ and cvs.) zones 3&#8211;8
*Rose of Sharons* (_Hibiscus syriacus_ cvs.) zones 5&#8211;9
*Roses, nongrafted types* (_Rosa_ spp. and cvs.) zones 2&#8211;11
*Sumac* (_Rhus typhina_) zones 3&#8211;8
*Trumpet vine* (_Campsis radicans_) zones 5&#8211;9
*Weeping willow* (_Salix babylonica_) zones 6&#8211;9 * Perennials * 
*Barrenworts* (_Epimedium_ spp. and cvs.) zones 4&#8211;9
*Bear&#8217;s breeches* (_Acanthus mollis_) zones 7&#8211;11
*Blue stars* (_Amsonia_ spp. and cvs.) zones 3&#8211;10
*Cardoon* (_Cynara cardunculus_) zones 7&#8211;10
*Colewort* (_Crambe cordifolia_) zones 6&#8211;9
*Comfreys* (_Symphytum_ spp. and cvs.) zones 3&#8211;9
*Garden phloxes* (_Phlox paniculata_ cvs.) zones 4&#8211;8
*Hollyhocks* (_Alcea rosea_ cvs.) zones 3&#8211;9
*Japanese anemones* (_Anemone_ X _hybrida_ cvs.) zones 4&#8211;8
*Japanese aster* (_Kalimeris pinnatifida_) zones 5&#8211;9
*Joe Pye weed* (_Eupatorium fistulosum_) zones 3&#8211;8
*Oriental poppies* (_Papaver orientale_ and cvs.) zones 3&#8211;9
*Pasque flowers* (_Pulsatilla_ spp. and cvs.) zones 4&#8211;9
*Sea hollies* (_Eryngium planum_ and cvs.) zones 5&#8211;9
.

http://www.finegardening.com/how-to/articles/grow-more-plants-with-root-cuttings.aspx


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## NickNasty (Feb 27, 2010)

LOL Hobbes you must be stoned That 5hit posted the exact same thing 30 posts ago on post #166


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## Hobbes (Feb 27, 2010)

.

Dude!







It's a good artcile though, and I spaced it better this time. I'm hoping we get root budding before I find it and post it again.

.


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## statik (Feb 27, 2010)

Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> Dude!
> 
> ...


LMAO..me too Hobbes..me too. 

Can you take any pics of the "looks like something's happening" roots you got?

Even if time wise this make no sense (to most) I think it would be damn awesome just to prove it can be done.

Like a few others have said, I can see a few applications for root cloning...mainly as a last ditch for saving genetics..but still.


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## beeker (Feb 27, 2010)

going to 3rd week now, nothing showin, still optimistic.


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## jcdws602 (Feb 27, 2010)

pterzw said:


> For example....
> Where I live getting caugth transporting 1-5 clones eqals BIG fine. Getting caught with 6 and more means I go to jail.
> Being stopped by LEA with bucket of dirt in my car...I go home and laugh about it.



Good point....I see how a rootball would be a bad ass way of transporting good genes with pretty much no risk of getting caught....and another application with this method I see that is favorable is keeping those good auto flower genes like hobbes said but other than that.......??????.............Well hopefully someone get some sprouts to pop up from them roots...............HopeFullY


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## Hobbes (Feb 27, 2010)

beeker said:


> going to 3rd week now, nothing showin, still optimistic.


Beeker think months not weeks. Hopefully cloning in a bubbler and getting the correct temperature and humidity will speed things up in time. Patience and good technique and we will all get budding. 

.


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## Hobbes (Feb 27, 2010)

jcdws602 said:


> Good point....I see how a rootball would be a bad ass way of transporting good genes with pretty much no risk of getting caught....and another application with this method I see that is favorable is keeping those good auto flower genes like hobbes said but other than that.......??????.............Well hopefully someone get some sprouts to pop up from them roots...............HopeFullY


It does have limited use because of the legnth of time to bud, but it it cool and fun.

*Unique benefits to Root Cloning* (unique more or less)

1. Save genetics when a clone wasn't kept.  (without reveging)
2. Hundreds/thousands of sprouts for a commercial grower timed for spring with little equipment or tending.
3. Auto flower cloning (in theory)
4. Transporting clones risk free - that's ingenious, I hadn't thought of that.
5. One small pack of roots per harvested plant may be of use to a home grower - a series of zip locks of roots timed to bud as new plants are needed.

Can anyone think of other benefits unique to root cloning?

.


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## stupidclown (Feb 27, 2010)

I'm just starting a run of auto flowering diesel ryders, I'll try this and let you know how it works for autos


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## That 5hit (Feb 27, 2010)

you guys have to cut up the roots close to the root ball
place them horizontal or vertical with the tips above to soil


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## Hobbes (Feb 28, 2010)

.

T5 Nick made horrid sport of my marijuana addled memory yesterday for posting that entire technique for the second time (posts 166 and 196). I cried. So I'm not going to tease you, just ask that you post it again in three days when I'll have completely forgotten about it again. Great method, lots of colorful pictures. I'm stoked every time I find it! 

They're using thicker woodier roots that we are - a different technique - it would be like cloning with woody cuttings. I'm harvesting a Pandora's Box in a few days, I'll harvest the adventitious roots for "normal" root cloning and give this method a go with the seminal root. With pics posted.

The author makes a note of using a medium that will not rot the roots - no soil - mulch etc. I'm also impressed with the system he has for producing evaporation and condensation and drawing moisture up through the medium and root pieces. A bag and a stick. Will the advancements of technology never slow.

.


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## Hobbes (Feb 28, 2010)

stupidclown said:


> I'm just starting a run of auto flowering diesel ryders, I'll try this and let you know how it works for autos


Good stuff StupidClown!

It would be amazing if the sprouts had the genetic age of new plants, amazing breakthrough.

And you will be the person to make the breakthrough!

.


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## That 5hit (Feb 28, 2010)

Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> T5 Nick made horrid sport of my marijuana addled memory yesterday for posting that entire technique for the second time (posts 166 and 196). I cried. So I'm not going to tease you, just ask that you post it again in three days when I'll have completely forgotten about it again. Great method, lots of colorful pictures. I'm stoked every time I find it!
> 
> ...


no, no, no, its cool hobbs post it 100 times if you like 
i love this method and others i will also try to find more info on how this is done in differant way 
a lot of info that i have found on this did not have pictures so i did not post any of this info (i have to read with pics/ LOL)

anyways, this only proves that this does work 
but i did notice that there way of doing it is a lot differant then the way discribed in the first few posts of this thread


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## MrBaker (Feb 28, 2010)

Cool thread. Reminds me of how banana trees usually propagate, by clones derived from roots. Only different is that b-trees just sorta send up new shoots on their own. 

Messing with apical meristems is fun, especially in conjunction with the application of the right hormones, imo.


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## sixstring2112 (Mar 4, 2010)

I'm going to try a new way. got some hydro roots i will cut up and put in some soil. just like cloning i will mix up some dip n grow as if i were taking cuttings, but i will pour this in the pot. then water, and i will NOT cover it. i think they need light so i will treat it as if i planted seeds. just keep it moist and in some 27 k light but not right under the lights. wonder if it works and i use a female if all the sprouts would be female also.


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## That 5hit (Mar 4, 2010)

sixstring2112 said:


> I'm going to try a new way. got some hydro roots i will cut up and put in some soil. just like cloning i will mix up some dip n grow as if i were taking cuttings, but i will pour this in the pot. then water, and i will NOT cover it. i think they need light so i will treat it as if i planted seeds. just keep it moist and in some 27 k light but not right under the lights. wonder if it works and i use a female if all the sprouts would be female also.


try this but use clear plastic wrap


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## frostbeard (Mar 22, 2010)

So...Anything happened yet??


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## tom__420 (Mar 22, 2010)

frostbeard said:


> So...Anything happened yet??


Lol judging by the lack of posts by the OP I would guess not

I guess whoever said that cloning is a much better option was right


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## northeastern lights (Mar 22, 2010)

compost, lol


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## Hobbes (Mar 22, 2010)

.

Nothing yet. Like I said in the first post of the thread - like watching sod grow.

I'm adding roots in different types of containers as I harvest plants - zip lock bags, sealed plastic cups, suspended above a bubbler, in the bubbler water. Lots of fun and no work. It could take until the summer when the temperatures are warmer and more consistent - that was when the last batch budded a decade ago.

.


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## That 5hit (Mar 22, 2010)

the info i found said this could take a year everyone sit back and chill

hey hodds did you do one like the setup i found above


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## headstrng117 (Mar 22, 2010)

Saw your original post about this a long time ago Hobbes, and have thought about it off and on since then. Awesome you're doing so much to explore this, very very interesting. Props man.


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## J.cun.Shallow (Apr 8, 2010)

hold on this could take a year? I was thinking of trying this in a autopot so if anyone could advise me on PH for doing this in coco . plus coco has no EC so should I add any nutes? what about microbes etc..... the help would be appreciated


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## grassified (Apr 9, 2010)

Perhaps regulating temps i the secret in getting them to sprout? Maybe the roots need a cold period for a month or so, then a warm consistent temp?

I have a feelin if we could get this all figured out root cloning wouldn't be so bad of a choice.


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## northeastern lights (Apr 9, 2010)

I hate to be negative but I can't see it ever working with mj.


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## tom__420 (Apr 9, 2010)

It may work but it is in absolutely no way practical, by the time you guys get some little sprouts I will have completed at least three grows all the way to harvest...


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## That 5hit (Apr 9, 2010)

tom__420 said:


> It may work but it is in absolutely no way practical, by the time you guys get some little sprouts I will have completed at least three grows all the way to harvest...


i think the praticality come to play in reviving an unknown powerful strain.., or even a known stran. a lot of bagseed grower like myself dont clone past harvest , meaning if i cone its only for that grow, so once i havest that strain is dead for me, and if i smoke it and find out that that strain was killer theres no way i can bring it back untill now
and the same for namebrand strains, i here all the time about strains dieing out, or how its hard to find a true "XXX XXX" trains, if this could work, if your growing a strain that is close to extention then there is a last ditch effort to save that blood line 

but dont get me wrong out side of a last min. save there is no reason for it


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## IAm5toned (Apr 9, 2010)

it does work.... thats already understood. what we are trying to see is, _what makes it work_... so the technique can be refined into something more usable.


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## jcdws602 (Apr 9, 2010)

tom__420 said:


> It may work but it is in absolutely no way practical, by the time you guys get some little sprouts I will have completed at least three grows all the way to harvest...


I've already completed 2 grows since i subscribed  hehehehe............


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## AquafinaOrbit (Apr 10, 2010)

jcdws602 said:


> I've already completed 2 grows since i subscribed  hehehehe............



Could you of gotten hundreds of clones from one pot in this time though?(Not to mention using hardly any light) Because that's what were looking at


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## That 5hit (Apr 10, 2010)

AquafinaOrbit said:


> Could you of gotten hundreds of clones from one pot in this time though?(Not to mention using hardly any light) Because that's what were looking at


 great point 
if you needed like a few thousands by next year this method would be usefull and a space saver
plus if i was doing this method i too would be growing a cloneing the regular way but at the end of the year i would also have like a few thousand sprouts


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## jcdws602 (Apr 10, 2010)

That 5hit said:


> great point
> if you needed like a few thousands by next year this method would be usefull and a space saver
> plus if i was doing this method i too would be growing a cloneing the regular way but at the end of the year i would also have like a few thousand sprouts


............


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## jcdws602 (Apr 10, 2010)

AquafinaOrbit said:


> Could you of gotten hundreds of clones from one pot in this time though?(Not to mention using hardly any light) Because that's what were looking at



Uh.... yeah........mother plant...take many cuttings at once i got a few that are pretty big.........so hundreds is no prob if I had too but no need for that many at least not for me  ....and once your roots become plants your gonna need light.......right


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## IAm5toned (Apr 10, 2010)

the idea here (and someone correct me if im wrong) is to use the time in between seasons to get as many shoots as possible.
yeah, sure i could grow some trees in the barn and keep 4-6 8 foot monsters in constant veg, with all ther soil/hydro requirements, lighting, nutes, rootone. rockwool, the floorspace, and get 100's of cuttings.
but wouldnt it be nice if you got the same amount of cuttings/shoots without having to deal with any of that?
throw some roots in a bucket @ the end of season, come back in spring, and presto!

if you cant see the advantage to that..... your a lost cause.


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## tom__420 (Apr 10, 2010)

apparently it would take longer than that, more like put roots in the bucket at the beginning of spring and come back at the beginning of next spring and you will have roots if your lucky
A clone is also much bigger than a little sprout and will grow much faster....
This sounds like a good idea for cheap people trying to have an expensive hobby....


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## ledgrowing (Apr 10, 2010)

were are the shoots from these root balls this thread is old


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## tom__420 (Apr 10, 2010)

Check back in 8 months lol


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## IAm5toned (Apr 10, 2010)

some of these comments remind me of the ones i used to hear about how you couldnt grow under hid lamps, then hydroponics, then led's...

keep up the closemindedness


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## jcdws602 (Apr 10, 2010)

IAm5toned said:


> the idea here (and someone correct me if im wrong) is to use the time in between seasons to get as many shoots as possible.
> yeah, sure i could grow some trees in the barn and keep 4-6 8 foot monsters in constant veg, with all ther soil/hydro requirements, lighting, nutes, rootone. rockwool, the floorspace, and get 100's of cuttings.
> but wouldnt it be nice if you got the same amount of cuttings/shoots without having to deal with any of that?
> throw some roots in a bucket @ the end of season, come back in spring, and presto!
> ...


\

It's funny because I see it the other way around .................................................... like I said before I am into efficiency like most serious growers,root cloning is a very unpractical approach to propagation,it's more for last minute efforts to conserve a strain and maybe outdoor growers can benefit from this if they only grow outdoors,so _they_ _can_ wait 'till next season,keeping mother plants and cloning off them just makes more sense in my situation and most others.......


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## Hobbes (Apr 10, 2010)

.

I'll chip in quick - I don't care what it's good for I just want to show that it works 

The impracticalities everyone has mentioned are why I didn't use root cloning after having it work the first time.

One very promising area is auto flower cloning - we're hoping that the budded roots will have the same age as a sprout and not the age of the dead parent plant. A possible application with definite benefits. 

But really all I want is to show a pic of budded roots. 

.


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## resinraider (Apr 10, 2010)

So does this shit work or what?


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## IAm5toned (Apr 10, 2010)

it works, but no one can seem to find the enviromental trigger that causes it too happen.
figure that one out and ill mail you an oz....


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## Saerimmner (Apr 12, 2010)

ery interesting, will keep an eye on this thread


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## Hobbes (Apr 12, 2010)

IAm5toned said:


> it works, but no one can seem to find the enviromental trigger that causes it too happen.
> figure that one out and ill mail you an oz....


The trigger may be more heat than I'm using - the budding happened before in the summer in an attic room.

I've moved most of the buckets into my flower cage to increase the heat through the day, I'm using the 3 gallon buckets as risers for the plants in 5 gallon buckets.

.

As well, I've been using Hygrozyme which is suppose to speed the degradation of dead roots. I'm going to wash all of my roots well in distilled water and re-mix with fresh Pro Mix (no Hygrozyme)

.


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## IAm5toned (Apr 12, 2010)

ive got 2 pots with roots in them in my flower cab... the roots are pretty new though, they were males i culled 2 weeks ago. its pretty warm, and they never got a dose of hygro.
im debating tearing up the root ball on one, and keeping it intact on the other, just for control's sake.
you have a major head start on me tho


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## That 5hit (Apr 12, 2010)

yeah i think you should 
keep each peice 2in long 
and keep the root end down in the direction it was grown
and dont bury the whole thing keep a part of it above the soil


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## That 5hit (Apr 12, 2010)

..............................


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## dtp5150 (Apr 14, 2010)

how many fuckin times is that picture going to get reposted


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## dtp5150 (Apr 14, 2010)

maybe the autoflower roots are dead, thats why its not working


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## That 5hit (Apr 14, 2010)

LOL you new it was coming - yuck fou


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## Jester88 (Apr 15, 2010)

huh....

yuck fou... hmm peoples be tripping... my oppinion so far is maybe its possible as there are a many plant that can do this but for savoury sake aka usefulness ( i see no shipping advantages and a lot of time wasted) 

sorry to say im leaning towards failure.. though i think at times and in the right conditions *it may be a possibility *but for a general and overaall practicallity it seems to be a failure...

good test though... i still hope it works because then it will definately gain a use (if a sacred mother is ever lost and theres no new mothers you may be able to save your ass).

come on hobbes get a few going and the technique down... then you could name it after yourself and call it hobbelling or sumething hehe.


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## IAm5toned (Apr 15, 2010)

alot of people told edison the same thing about the light bulb....

lol TS- im going to build one of those things this weekend just to make you happy bro


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## jcdws602 (Apr 15, 2010)

IAm5toned said:


> alot of people told edison the same thing about the light bulb....
> 
> lol TS- im going to build one of those things this weekend just to make you happy bro



Yeah but then there were only candles which was not a very practical way of having light.....but in this case there are already practical and successful forms of propagation so not to be compared to edison.......we need to move forward not backwards...


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## That 5hit (Apr 15, 2010)

i dont think anyone is trying to reinvent the wheel
just do some cool shit


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## cmt1984 (Apr 15, 2010)

its been said a few times in this thread already, this is mainly for a last resort save attempt...or just for fun. nothing wrong with seeing what plants can do...

im gona do a root clone test, like the one 5hit keeps posting, after my next harvest (2-3 more weeks) 

right now i have some roots in a bucket of dirt, just like the OG poster had when he said he found shoots growin from some roots he threw in the garbage. i read this thread awhile ago and had some roots in the trash so i figured why not try it. they've been in the bucket since March 6, nothing happened yet, im sure nothing will ever happen but its not hurting anything just sitting there so ill let them go for a looooooong time.


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## IAm5toned (Apr 15, 2010)

well look at it from a different point of view.
if a person was wise, they could run 4-5 buckets of clones, started at different times, creating a perpetual cloning system that produces hundreds if not thousands of clones.
this method would not require any horticulture lighting, rooting hormones, bubblers, peat pucks, and any of the other crap that is used for cloning; but most importantly... it wont take up _valuable_ _floorspace in my growroom_, I have acres of property, multiple buildings on it, all with a minimum 200 amp service. there are growers out there that would drool in envy if they knew the space i had to work with, but space _under my lights_ is very fucking limited. i like flowering plants in my room, not mothers, or running perpetual sog's which require some type of cloner to pull off. cloning from cuttings also requires that you run 2 different setups for veg and flower, unless your running a large sog, perpetual 12/12 al b fuct style. 
growing is a numbers game... the less i have to spend to get my final product, the better it is for all involved. having an aero cloner, or a dwc bubbler, or ebb and flow rockwool setups or trays of peat/coco pucks is nice, it works, but the end result is that they all take up very valuable time and space, and have parts that need to be replaced periodically... the idea of having hundreds of cuttings sprout from a bucket of dirt with little/no effort as compared to traditional methods, greatly intrigues me.


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## Jester88 (Apr 15, 2010)

but it seems not every bucket will grow a heap of shoots, let alone on a smooth, constant enough scale to continue going on perpetually.

BTW 
i have already said i think it possible and am hoping thats the case didnt i... im just putting a realistic not


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## StonerPuppy69 (Apr 17, 2010)

I just want to start by saying that the closed mind people are haters! Whats so wrong with JUST TRYING a new way of cloning? Just to see if it works! This hobby is all about trial and error. Im sure that not everything the haters have ever done has worked. I think root cloning would work best for people that want a big outdoor grow. I have a perpetual indoor grow cause you can only grow outside 4 months out of the year. So this method would be good (even if it takes time) for someone like myself. Start a bucket of roots in September, have shoots by Mayish and put them outside in the beginning of June. Then I could have hundreds of outdoor plants and have the space for them. And then chaaachiinngg! By September I'll have some serious poundage =) Right now I clone by taking cuttings and I have very healthy mothers with lots and lots of clones but it's also time and space consuming (and more expensive) to take as many cuttings and you'll get shoots. I don't think it's that bad of an idea! My flowering plants are near their end (within a few days) and I will DEF be trying this. I don't care how long it takes, I just wanna see if it works! It's pretty fuckin cool sounding!

_"i dont think anyone is trying to reinvent the wheel
just do some cool shit"_
Nicely put that 5hit!

All anyone is trying to do is try something new! *Stop hating!!*

Have a nicee day everyone..and GOOD LUCK TO ROOT CLONERS!


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## Jester88 (Apr 17, 2010)

oi fuck face i wasnt hating i was making an assumption....

how bout reading all my previous posts... and even that aside i think hobbes is a siic cunt ( aka hes an awsome bloke) so i wouldnt hate on him even if he was asking for it lol. 

so fuck you and go back home and suck on your mummies tittie. if your delicate eyes cant handle reading an all round report or something you just plain out dont want to hear then ill say it again...... go back and suck on your mummies tittie... youve at least gotta be on the bottle before ya can be a real contributing member asshole... 

hobbes knows my views on this are pro and im hoping and waiting for it to work.. ive pointed out reasons it should to haters and reasons it may not. there are many plants that do this (ie , grape vines) and cannabis may well be another. 

again hobbes your an awsome bloke and i love the experiment. i cant wait untill someone gets results and starts working on a system to perfect it.. hell i have some ideas i wish i could try but circumstances keep me from contributing and experimenting.

i too love experimenting with plants hell i am always trying new shit lol. i also howver keep things realistical and say shit as i see it... 

i was also away from riu for a while and was more asking for an update on things and if what ive sumed up was acurate so far... there are a lot of other aspects this can be helpful with even if it is a tedious proceedure but i was mainly pointing out the flaws that jumped out to me to begin with.

again if ya done wanna hear what i have to say dont read it. but jesters here to stay bitches, hehe fuck i love being a smartass at times... 

(sorry if i went to far but i was happily medicated until i seen another fucking douch bag bitching)... i mean damn i said it a page or so ago and like i said it was a quick question/review so i could catch back up on where we are so far... just because a few things are ruled out doesnt mean all are and on the flipped side i actually still see the other doors tha this is opening if it works.

and yes as that 5hit said i agree. but to get somewhere ya have to take everything into account. i was more just pointing out some observations.. isnt that what this is supposed to be?? a compendium of thoughts and knowledge. this is just one other aspect that has to be viewed in my books. 

peace out
j88


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## cmt1984 (Apr 18, 2010)

Jester88 said:


> oi fuck face i wasnt hating i was making an assumption....


you know what happens when you assume, right? 



StonerPuppy69 said:


> I just want to start by saying that the closed mind people are haters!


we definitely have some haters in this thread..


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## Jester88 (Apr 18, 2010)

hopefully some fucker jumps up and proves me wrong lol. 

but yeah i know what happens when you assume... same as when you make plans lol.


_just wanna say that this is fucking awsome ive stared at it a few times now lol. lmfao especially when he bends the stick and propels it at one lmfao.
_


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## IAm5toned (Apr 18, 2010)

i like how the camera angle changes... hard to find that in an avatar


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## Jester88 (Apr 18, 2010)

yeah its clever.... its white and looks like a camera moving... somewhat matrix like .

i just got stuck looking at it again lol .


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## cmt1984 (Apr 18, 2010)

Jester88 said:


> hopefully some fucker jumps up and proves me wrong lol.


lol yeah im waiting for that fucker too...and i hope that fucker is me 

and ive been lost in IAm5toned's avatar many times


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## StonerPuppy69 (Apr 19, 2010)

Wow jester you took that way too personally..that wasnt even directed to you cunt nugget. Obviously there's pros and cons to it (if it works) and I too made that point. RIU *is* for growers to talk to each other and help everyone out but there is def some haters in this 26 page thread. The point I was making was to stay open minded about it.


And just a little note for anyone haha...I get to harvest my girls tomorrow! Pretty excited! Ive got northern lights, ak 47, strawberry cough, and skunk! Should be quite the bountiful harvest!


Happy 420 smoking folkss!


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## MuntantLizzard (Apr 20, 2010)

Hi, Have any of you ran across the CNN Article about A Mexican strain breed to Regenerate from the roots?


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## MuntantLizzard (Apr 20, 2010)

LAZARO CARDENAS, Mexico - Soldiers trying to seize control of one Mexico's top drug-producing regions found the countryside teeming with a new hybrid marijuana plant that can be cultivated year-round and cannot be killed with herbicides.Soldiers fanned out across some of the new fields Tuesday, pulling up plants by the root and burning them, as helicopter gunships clattered overhead to give them cover from a raging drug war in the western state of Michoacan. The plants' roots survive if they are doused with herbicide, said army Gen. Manuel Garcia.
"These plants have been genetically improved," he told a handful of journalists allowed to accompany soldiers on a daylong raid of some 70 marijuana fields. "Before we could cut the plant and destroy it, but this plant will come back to life unless it's taken out by the roots."


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16311450


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## jcdws602 (Apr 21, 2010)

MuntantLizzard said:


> LAZARO CARDENAS, Mexico - Soldiers trying to seize control of one Mexico's top drug-producing regions found the countryside teeming with a new hybrid marijuana plant that can be cultivated year-round and cannot be killed with herbicides.Soldiers fanned out across some of the new fields Tuesday, pulling up plants by the root and burning them, as helicopter gunships clattered overhead to give them cover from a raging drug war in the western state of Michoacan. The plants' roots survive if they are doused with herbicide, said army Gen. Manuel Garcia.
> "These plants have been genetically improved," he told a handful of journalists allowed to accompany soldiers on a daylong raid of some 70 marijuana fields. "Before we could cut the plant and destroy it, but this plant will come back to life unless it's taken out by the roots."
> 
> 
> ...


Ha they got tired of popping beans....pretty smart move....>>>>>>>....wonder what strains they used???


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## That 5hit (Apr 21, 2010)

> The new plants, known as "*Colombians*," mature in about two months and can be planted at any time of year, meaning authorities will no longer be able to time raids to coincide with twice-yearly harvests. These plants have been genetically improved
> The hybrid first appeared in Mexico two years ago but has become the plant of choice for drug traffickers Michoacan, a remote mountainous region that lends to itself to drug production.
> Yields are so high that traffickers can now produce as much marijuana on a plot the size of a football field as they used to harvest in 10 to 12 acres. That makes for smaller, harder-to-detect fields, though some discovered Tuesday had sophisticated irrigation systems with sprinklers, pumps and thousands of yards of tubing.
> "For each 100 (marijuana plots) that you spot from the air, there are 300 to 500 more that you discover once you get on the ground," Garcia said.


holy bagseed batman
i'm only growing bag seed for now on
i knew these mexican had good gennetics
and they soound lije they are heavy indica
they'l prolly being sold as mids


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## NLNo5 (Apr 21, 2010)

Root propagating works. I've been doing it for years at my horticulture operation. Not every type of plant will propagate from roots. But MJ does fine. I can also tell you that the indicas pop better from roots than the sativas. I just plop my roots down in a bucket, stirr it up a little bit, and spray it with water until its damp, then I put a piece of black poly sheeting cut in a nice circle down on the soil, with about .5 inches around the edge of the plastic to ensure air flow. Yes, make the bucket warm, about 78 degrees is perfect. If you use a little superthrive in your spray bottle you can get roots to sprout in about 3-4 weeks. You can use a clean scissors to chop the edge of the mother's root ball right into the buckets. One mother can make many buckets worth of clones. I cut the roots in about 1 inch pieces as I'm chopping. I can sell a 4-incher grown from this method for about 10 bucks a piece. Makes for a pretty good side show.


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## That 5hit (Apr 21, 2010)

NLNo5 said:


> Root propagating works. I've been doing it for years at my horticulture operation. Not every type of plant will propagate from roots. But MJ does fine. I can also tell you that the indicas pop better from roots than the sativas. I just plop my roots down in a bucket, stirr it up a little bit, and spray it with water until its damp, then I put a piece of black poly sheeting cut in a nice circle down on the soil, with about .5 inches around the edge of the plastic to ensure air flow. Yes, make the bucket warm, about 78 degrees is perfect. If you use a little superthrive in your spray bottle you can get roots to sprout in about 3-4 weeks. You can use a clean scissors to chop the edge of the mother's root ball right into the buckets. One mother can make many buckets worth of clones. I cut the roots in about 1 inch pieces as I'm chopping. I can sell a 4-incher grown from this method for about 10 bucks a piece. Makes for a pretty good side show.


with all do respect
show and prove 
we are way past talking about it on this thread 
you dig 
either post some pics of the step by step tranformation 
or stfu


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## AudiA6Driver (Apr 21, 2010)

That 5hit said:


> with all do respect
> show and prove
> we are way past talking about it on this thread
> you dig
> ...


A little on the rude side lol but i do agree, WERE'S THE PICS? i have a couple plants right now but this summer i will be moving into a house and not an apt so i want to go full scale and help some people out with clones while im at it. so this root propagation sounds interesting. We had this happen in one of my friends rental houses, we cleaned it all up and in the basement were some pots with just dirt in them ( Like the plant was just ripped out) Anyway the garden in the back yard yard needs some dirt so i just dumped it out there and my friend told me he had to go out there couple months later and rip out a bunch of little plants! i thought it was hilarious and kept it in the back of my head for a way to get ALOT of clones


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## That 5hit (Apr 21, 2010)

i would think that auto flowering plants would be prone to doing this ezer


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## northeastern lights (Apr 21, 2010)

I'm with 5 on the pics. Kinda reminds me of that monkey ass person claiming to be able to clone from a leaf then grow a plant out of it.


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## statik (Apr 21, 2010)

Yep.. as the saying goes:

Pics or it didn't happen.

BTW... I am pretty sure that "new strain" is just propaganda. Seriously, yeah..Mexico came up with the resources to genetically alter a plant in this fashion before Europe, Canada, or the US? Uhm....K.


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## That 5hit (Apr 21, 2010)

man dont hate 
its possible 
i think they could and did 
i also think that they released this info to stir up interest for this strain
its just advertizement 

but i do think this about every "new" drug or weapon the news reports on


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## IAm5toned (Apr 21, 2010)

its not as hard as you would think... mexico has a huge agriculture sector, and geneticaly altered crops are all the rage down there.
you buy them in the grocery store


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## AquafinaOrbit (Apr 22, 2010)

So basically they literally turned marijuana into a grass?(In terms of how it can survive) Really though that seems dangerous to environment, imagine with how many seeds a plant can produce how fast a strain like that would take over.


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## statik (Apr 22, 2010)

That 5hit said:


> man dont hate
> its possible
> i think they could and did
> i also think that they released this info to stir up interest for this strain
> ...


Wasn't trying to hate on Mexico! I live just a hop skip and jump from T.J.! What I was saying, how many breeders are in the regions I mentioned? I would have surely thought that in some places that where it was/is legal to grow (be it for medical or not) it would be nice to have a strain that actually did this (especially for outdoors). If Mexico did accomplish this then kudos for sure. Then again, yeah I wonder what kind of impact that could have on an ecosystem. Always something to consider.


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## That 5hit (Apr 22, 2010)

statik said:


> Wasn't trying to hate on Mexico! I live just a hop skip and jump from T.J.! What I was saying, how many breeders are in the regions I mentioned? I would have surely thought that in some places that where it was/is legal to grow (be it for medical or not) it would be nice to have a strain that actually did this (especially for outdoors). If Mexico did accomplish this then kudos for sure. Then again, yeah I wonder what kind of impact that could have on an ecosystem. Always something to consider.


yeah but what i was trying to get you to understand 
is never underestmate anyone based on race, culture, religion, or what you where lead to believe on how they live 
do you realize if you where to make a salad 
90% of th veggies you would put in it come from mexico farm
and you really think they cant master a simple urb (fyi. most of our urbs come from there also)
or do you think we or someone else (other then mexico farms) stablize and master genes of fruit and veggies then we are kind enuff to send them the strains we would like for them to grow for us 
because they are not smart enuff or advanced enuff to figure out how to isolate strains to grow for uniformity


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## That 5hit (Apr 22, 2010)

AquafinaOrbit said:


> So basically they literally turned marijuana into a grass?(In terms of how it can survive) Really though that seems dangerous to environment, imagine with how many seeds a plant can produce how fast a strain like that would take over.


who really cares this is what we want 
to over grow the government 
here these guys have made a strain that root system is resistant to "weed killer"
who care 
with all the 1,000 uses for weed 
it will never grow out of control (if this was what you were thinking)
get to makeing hemp product
if they cant kill it they would have to acknowledg it


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## That 5hit (Apr 22, 2010)

https://www.rollitup.org/blogs/blog15-mexicos-new-bagseed-strain.html
hay lets nolonger hijack this thread on this topic i have started a blog on this that is taking off join me there
here the link..............-> https://www.rollitup.org/blogs/blog15-mexicos-new-bagseed-strain.html


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## v12xjs (Apr 23, 2010)

Hey guys
This root cloning idea recently occurred to me after seeing how well it works for the weeds in my garden. I was pointed to this thread after mentioning it in my grow journal and I've just finished reading through.
Great thread Hobbes.
I'm really surprised nobody has managed to crack it yet, and I'm still sure it can be done, we just need to find the key. I'm loving the fact that so many have had the curiosity and patience to try it out even though there's no real reason to do so.
I'm interested because I don't have room for a clone op and I run my lights on permanent 12/12, so I'm looking for a way to clone without the need for 18/24 hour lights if such a thing exists.
I guess from what's been posted the usual methods don't work in the same way they do for other plants so I'll try a few different things and see if any work. My growspace is only a square foot so I'm not sure where I'll put them 
My first thoughts are to maybe put some roots in the fridge for a couple of days to simulate that dormant period & then into the growroom.
Now and again I get roots forming forming on the stem and growing down into the soil. I call them anchor roots and it makes sense these would also be good candidates to try.
Got a few other thoughts but I think I may need to get some pure landrace genetics to test them properly, because all the seeds I buy have prolly been bred in hydro for decades and don't really represent wild weed anymore.
I'll post any findings. Good luck everyone.


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## IAm5toned (Apr 23, 2010)

> I'm interested because I don't have room for a clone op and I run my lights on permanent 12/12, so I'm looking for a way to clone without the need for 18/24 hour lights if such a thing exists.


thats my deal as well 


> I call them anchor roots


advantageous roots is the proper name


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## v12xjs (Apr 24, 2010)

IAm5toned said:


> advantageous roots is the proper name


Thanks IAm5toned.

I have a girl due for chopping & some repotting to do this evening so I'll get the ball rolling.


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## IAm5toned (Apr 24, 2010)

i harvested a lady a few days ago, but after looking at the cut stalk i noticed theres some new growth coming from it, so i decided to reveg it instead. i have another lady that will be rdy any day now, so im going to try it with her roots


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## Jester88 (May 3, 2010)

bump ___^_- diddy bump bump ---^--^--


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## IAm5toned (May 3, 2010)

rofl the second lady is being revegged as well... i just didnt want to lose the genetics if there was a chance to reveg....

now i have 2 males that the roots have been cut up and tossed in a bucket in a warm dark dry place. not shoots yet. im patient tho


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## Jester88 (May 4, 2010)

id think the main mass would have to stay as one big living structure. I don't think that the roots with survive in segments. Though there is a good chance that I could be wrong, coz it's plenty for other plants

My views are that the roots need to be left as a living structure so the re-vegging thing might work.

From what I gather, what we want to achieve here is for a plant to grow foliage from the root system kapeesh. again like grape vines and roses but in a controllrd environment to do this the best results would be achieved with hormones or as a living deep tissue culture as such but yeah i just rote a big thing only to lose half of it, in short 

i think the roots have to be expoed to the right environment as i said earlier in the thread and the growth is more likely to come from the laateral or or fiborous and advantitious roots at the surface is my oppinion possible even on the ends kinda like grape vines, if you leave some growth perhaps forced growth is possible like when roses shoot out from the bottom of the plant. they build up the chemicals they need and then make a place to force shoot from more or less. so yeah by leaving some you may get more growth or at least more clones if it does reveg.... then you get lots again though they may lose some potency and vigour the genetics are the same and can still be bred with.. i just wouldnt if i could avoid it, though sometimes its gotta be done. the less stress the better imho. 

anyhoo ill try again btw this is a rough example and first pics i found (for the second time lol) anyhoo





example of roots






now my idea is leave them close to the surface ofthe ground hell let some see the surface. see if they start producing the auxins and chemicals to make a calys and shoot from it. perhaps this is the way people need to go.

again im sorry this is nothing com[pared to ma first post that ws ruined but i re writ the bulk of it anyhoo lol. 

peace out
jester


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## J.cun.Shallow (May 23, 2010)

without bein a dick about it, when can we say that it dont work.


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## Hobbes (May 23, 2010)

.



J.cun.Shallow said:


> without bein a dick about it, when can we say that it dont work.


LOL! A fair question.

We cannot say that root cloning does not work, only that we haven't been able to make it work so far. Takes time. I'm still harvesting roots from most plants, using zip lock bags so I can keep a stack of root bags in one bucket. 

Break out the rocking chair, fire up your vaporizer. 

.


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## mcpurple (May 23, 2010)

root cloning does work i had a bunch of roots fro some strawberries and put them in dirt and bam new roots and a new plant just look it up its been doen has been done for years its just marijauna is a harder plant to do it to. strawberries almost do it naturally all by them selfs along with alot of other plants


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## That 5hit (May 23, 2010)

j.cun.shallow said:


> without bein a dick about it, when can we say that it dont work.


lol .


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## v12xjs (May 24, 2010)

I never got the time to do anything with my last plant but it occurred to me that even people who clone use a chemical stimulant to induce rooting, so rather than mess around with unknown methods I looked into that. It seems that the vegetative equivalent of rooting hormone is called cytokinins. I haven't had any time to find out how easily available they are but the discovery came about as a result of a guy in a lab in the 1940's who spotted that his plants grew bigger flowers when he added raw coconut water to them. It turns out coconut water is full of cytokinins which seem to encourage cell division.
I'm studying for exams right now so I can't really do much with it but I'd love someone to follow this up and see how easy it is to get the pure cytokinins.


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## That 5hit (May 24, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> I never got the time to do anything with my last plant but it occurred to me that even people who clone use a chemical stimulant to induce rooting, so rather than mess around with unknown methods I looked into that. It seems that the vegetative equivalent of rooting hormone is called cytokinins. I haven't had any time to find out how easily available they are but the discovery came about as a result of a guy in a lab in the 1940's who spotted that his plants grew bigger flowers when he added raw coconut water to them. It turns out coconut water is full of cytokinins which seem to encourage cell division.
> I'm studying for exams right now so I can't really do much with it but I'd love someone to follow this up and see how easy it is to get the pure cytokinins.









*Nature of Cytokinins*
Cytokinins are compounds with a structure resembling adenine which promote cell division and have other similar functions to kinetin. Kinetin was the first cytokinin discovered and so named because of the compounds ability to promote cytokinesis (cell division). Though it is a natural compound, It is not made in plants, and is therefore usually considered a "synthetic" cytokinin (meaning that the hormone is synthesized somewhere other than in a plant). The most common form of naturally occurring cytokinin in plants today is called zeatin which was isolated from corn (Zea mays).​ 
Cytokinins have been found in almost all higher plants as well as mosses, fungi, bacteria, and also in tRNA of many prokaryotes and eukaryotes. Today there are more than 200 natural and synthetic cytokinins combined. Cytokinin concentrations are highest in meristematic regions and areas of continuous growth potential such as roots, young leaves, developing fruits, and seeds (Arteca, 1996; Mauseth, 1991; Raven, 1992; Salisbury and Ross, 1992). 

*History of Cytokinins*
In 1913, Gottlieb Haberlandt discovered that a compound found in phloem had the ability to stimulate cell division (Haberlandt, 1913). In 1941, Johannes van Overbeek discovered that the milky endosperm from coconut also had this ability. He also showed that various other plant species had compounds which stimulated cell division (van Overbeek, 1941). In 1954, Jablonski and Skoog extended the work of Haberlandt showing that vascular tissues contained compounds which promote cell division (Jablonski and Skoog, 1954). The first cytokinin was isolated from herring sperm in 1955 by Miller and his associates (Miller et al., 1955). This compound was named kinetin because of its ability to promote cytokinesis. Hall and deRopp reported that kinetin could be formed from DNA degradation products in 1955 (Hall and deRopp, 1955). The first naturally occurring cytokinin was isolated from corn in 1961 by Miller (Miller, 1961). It was later called zeatin. Almost simultaneous with Miller Letham published a report on zeatin as a factor inducing cell division and later described its chemical properties (Letham, 1963). It is Miller and Letham that are credited with the simultaneous discovery of zeatin. Since that time, many more naturally occurring cytokinins have been isolated and the compound is ubiquitous to all plant species in one form or another (Arteca, 1996; Salisbury and Ross, 1992). 

*Biosynthesis and Metabolism of Cytokinins*
Cytokinin is generally found in higher concentrations in meristematic regions and growing tissues. They are believed to be synthesized in the roots and translocated via the xylem to shoots. Cytokinin biosynthesis happens through the biochemical modification of adenine. The process by which they are synthesized is as follows (McGaw, 1995; Salisbury and Ross, 1992): 
A product of the mevalonate pathway called isopentyl pyrophosphate is isomerized. 
This isomer can then react with adenosine monophosphate with the aid of an enzyme called isopentenyl AMP synthase. 
The result is isopentenyl adenosine-5'-phosphate (isopentenyl AMP). 
This product can then be converted to isopentenyl adenosine by removal of the phosphate by a phosphatase and further converted to isopentenyl adenine by removal of the ribose group. 
Isopentenyl adenine can be converted to the three major forms of naturally occurring cytokinins. 
Other pathways or slight alterations of this one probably lead to the other forms. 
Degradation of cytokinins occurs largely due to the enzyme cytokinin oxidase. This enzyme removes the side chain and releases adenine. Derivitives can also be made but the pathways are more complex and poorly understood. 

*Cytokinin Functions*

A list of some of the known physiological effects caused by cytokinins are listed below. The response will vary depending on the type of cytokinin and plant species (Davies, 1995; Mauseth, 1991; Raven, 1992; Salisbury and Ross, 1992). 

Stimulates cell division. 

Stimulates morphogenesis (shoot initiation/bud formation) in tissue culture. 

Stimulates the growth of lateral buds-release of apical dominance. 

Stimulates leaf expansion resulting from cell enlargement. 

May enhance stomatal opening in some species. 

Promotes the conversion of etioplasts into chloroplasts via stimulation of chlorophyll synthesis


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## IAm5toned (May 25, 2010)

so if i drink some.... will i divide and conquer?

lol j/k. my shoots havent done shit. tho i got to say i havent exactly been keeping a close eye on them


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## Total Head (Sep 17, 2010)

so i dug up this thread after reading another thread about what sounded like accidental root cloning and would like to bump it up. as someone else mentioned, there is probably just something everyone is missing when doing these experiments. however in the thread i read (https://www.rollitup.org/general-marijuana-growing/189531-multiple-root-systems-one-seed.html, no pics) the poster claimed to have leaves in a few days, however this was done from a root from a pre-seedling. could it be possible that the fact that everyone is waiting till the end of harvest to take roots is what is slowing the process? if the account in that thread is correct and these roots can be cut from the single taproot that emerges from the seed, then we are right back in the realm of practicality because you could potentially take these clones before you plant the seed...i have read too much to down this idea. i am very much excited about it. i'm looking for a little bag of bagseeds i have somewhere so i can try this out myself.


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## Hobbes (Sep 17, 2010)

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*"could it be possible that the fact that everyone is waiting till the end of harvest to take roots is what is slowing the process?"*

Total Head you are absolutely brilliant!! That is exactly what I did the first time around, I remember digging down and pulling out the roots and filling the hole back up with fresh Pro Mix.

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*"i'm looking for a little bag of bagseeds i have somewhere so i can try this out myself."*

I wish I could give you a couple of plants to run to get this going right away. If there's anything that I can do to help please let me know. I'm going to run some roots from plants 2, 4, 6, etc weeks of flower to see if a particular week works best, like green pulpy stems for cloning.

*ITS ON AGAIN BABY!*

,


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## Total Head (Sep 17, 2010)

i found the bagseeds. i have a bunch of breeder seeds but i'd rather use "disposable" seeds for this. i have them germing on my cable box right now. after they are planted i will put some under the lamp and some i will put where the light meter barely registers, probably under my plant shelf. i see no reason why the idea of root cloning shouldn't be explored, and seed roots should have different levels of hormones than matured roots. i am certain that if my experiment fails it is my own fault. like anything, it probably takes some dialing in.


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## OZUT (Sep 18, 2010)

Scribed to read later


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## v12xjs (Sep 18, 2010)

Plants just need a chemical stumulant to promote growth from roots.
This site used to sell the chemical product required to stimulate growth from roots. I can't remember what it was called but their supplier stopped production recently.
http://www.super-grow.biz/IAA.jsp
keep an eye on them because I'd bet they find another supplier soon.


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## mcpurple (Sep 18, 2010)

my buddy said he had some plants in rockwool cubes and the roots grew out of them and into the water trey he said they turned green and after awhile started making new plants off the roots while the other plant was still growing. the roots were in water almost all the time. i really dont see why this is a big topic root cloning is done all the time


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## Total Head (Sep 21, 2010)

this will be a kind of radical experiment (at least i think so). i have germed some nice bagseeds that i've been saving for god knows what  and today they all had decent tails that were starting to get that "fur" where the rest of the roots will form. so i took my surgical scissors and sterilized them. i then selected the 3 seeds that appeared to have the most aggressive rooting (these seeds took 3 whole days to get tails this long, so this was as long as i was going to wait). on one of them i cut the furry tip completely off. on another i cut the tip off about halfway down the furry part. i did this on the third seed as well. i planted the tips as far apart from each other as i could in a red 4 inch container, and i planted their other halves in a green 4 inch container. i had origionally planned on individual containers for all but alas i am just about out of soil. the containers are way underfilled but this is just an experiment. i have at least 20 more of these seeds so i'm not sweating it. i altered a peice of clip art to show what i did in case i wasn't clear enough. it doesn't show the fur but you get the idea. i also included a pic of what the seeds looked like germed in the paper towel after 3 days. some of the slowest i have seen but the seeds are over a year old and the smoke was killer. no pics of after i cut them but i didn't want them exposed for long. they are currently in the plant room on veg cycle under hps. i've never had a problem getting seeds to pop under intense light before. let's do this.


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## anomolies (Sep 21, 2010)

didn't have a chance to read all of this yet but do you have to pull off the roots or can you just plant the entire rootball intact after harvesting, why or why not?


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## Total Head (Sep 23, 2010)

all right so 2 days ago i planted the different halves in separate pots, and so far the "seed end" of my seedlings are poking up through the soil. the pic below was actually taken yesterday and since then the other 2 sprouts have come up. the root tip pot has shown nothing, but i assume building a set of primaries takes a bit longer than simply lenthening the root, so i'm still hopeful this will work. if anything i've proven that the idea of treating freshly germed seeds with kid gloves is a lot of hooey. i manhandled these things and chopped off their tips and they grow anyway, seemingly at the same rate as any other seed i've planted. my theory is that the part i chopped off will in fact sprout 2 root tips and perhaps grow faster than it would have otherwise. to clarify the seedling in the pic is to the right and a little below center. it's small but it's there. i will put up a pic tomorrow of the other 2 that came up. could take a bit for the tips to come up though.


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## carl.burnette (Sep 23, 2010)

subscribed


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## YungMoolaBaby (Sep 23, 2010)

Total Head said:


> all right so 2 days ago i planted the different halves in separate pots, and so far the "seed end" of my seedlings are poking up through the soil. the pic below was actually taken yesterday and since then the other 2 sprouts have come up. the root tip pot has shown nothing, but i assume building a set of primaries takes a bit longer than simply lenthening the root, so i'm still hopeful this will work. if anything i've proven that the idea of treating freshly germed seeds with kid gloves is a lot of hooey. i manhandled these things and chopped off their tips and they grow anyway, seemingly at the same rate as any other seed i've planted. my theory is that the part i chopped off will in fact sprout 2 root tips and perhaps grow faster than it would have otherwise. to clarify the seedling in the pic is to the right and a little below center. it's small but it's there. i will put up a pic tomorrow of the other 2 that came up. could take a bit for the tips to come up though.


I'm sorry but the only thing (in my opinion) you're doing is damaging the taproot of the seed, making it more prone to becoming a male/hermie. That's why most expert growers say don't touch the taproot at all and just plant it in, because you fucking with it can alter the hormonal reactions and essentially alter the genetics.


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## Total Head (Sep 23, 2010)

YungMoolaBaby said:


> I'm sorry but the only thing (in my opinion) you're doing is damaging the taproot of the seed, making it more prone to becoming a male/hermie. That's why most expert growers say don't touch the taproot at all and just plant it in, because you fucking with it can alter the hormonal reactions and essentially alter the genetics.


i respect your opinion but i think that's an old wives tale. there is no evidence that i have seen that supports the idea of "stess induced hermies" being caused from anything done in the seedling stage. or in veg for that matter. only circumstance that should do that is if you're talking severe ph/heat/light/moisture etc. type stress and even then i doubt it. even in that case an argument could be made that the abuse likely continues through flower and that may in fact be the cause of any hermies. i just don't buy it.


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## Total Head (Sep 25, 2010)

still nothing from the root tips but all 3 seed ends have come up. i will admit they are probably the slowest growing seeds i've ever seen, but they were also the slowest germing, and i did cut their tips off for hell's sake. they did poke right up through soil the day after they were planted though. they could still take off but they are going to be cramped since there are 3 in a 4 inch pot. if i find this experiment worthy of repeating i will make sure they get idividual pots and i will probably use seeds that are a bit more aggressive in the paper towel. year old bagseeds were probably not the best choice for this but you can't beat free. i'm certainly not going to chop up expensive seeds unless i truly believe there is a benefit. i have some blurry pics of the seedlings that are coming up. you can only see 2 because the 3rd is barely above soil and the seed shell camos it. please don't lecture me on the half full container. i ran out of dirt and have no desire to drop 8 more bucks on a bag of happy frog that will only sit around and dry out. one of them has its first real leaf poking out. the shells haven't fallen off any of them yet.


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## anomolies (Sep 26, 2010)

so... did this experiment ever show results? were the results of the first succesfully reproduced?


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## Hobbes (Sep 27, 2010)

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Not yet anomolies, I've been working on another project and have let this one slide. (The Acedemy linked at the bottom of this post.)

I'm going to take roots from a plant just going into flower, to see if the roots age like the plants. I may be taking the roots too late, like taking a cutting after it turns woody. *(Total Head's idea, post #292, page 30)*

.

I'm also going to use Root Stim. *(V12 & That 5hit)*.

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## wilsoncr17 (Sep 27, 2010)

I think the overwhelming problem with this experiment is that they expected results by putting buckets in the dark. Plants will not grow without light. Right? So after an initial setup in creating proper humidity and sprouting conditions you would have to rotate the soil and give it light. The same thing occurs when you plant outdoors. You have ground free of weeds but when you rotate the soil and plant you end up with a garden in need of weeding. Just a thought.


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## Hobbes (Sep 27, 2010)

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That is a thought wilsoncr, that root near the top of the soil get a little bit of PUR penetration through the soil. The first batch I had were in black buckets but I'll try some roots in a ziploc bag in my nursery. 

Thanks!

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## jmjblaze (Nov 10, 2010)

any luck yet?


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## Hobbes (Nov 10, 2010)

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JM I've slacked off on this experiment but I'm going to try it again with three differences:

- I'll tear out the roots during the first two weeks of flower. This is when the plant produces branch tissue that roots the quickest, it's possible that the roots will produce the same type of cells during stretch.

- I'm going to let the root tips grow out of the root pruning pots for several weeks, being careful not to let the pots dry too light between waterings. I'll pour water around the outer rim of the buckets to keep the roots alive. This last round of attempts used roots harvested from landscaping fabric lined root pruning buckets, the root tips would have been trapped in the fabric and I would have none in the roots I harvested. I'm no longer using landscaping fabric on my plants coming into flower. The root tips are no doubt the key to root cloning, I'll put up the farm on that one.

- I'm going to use rooting powder.

I'll post some pics when I start.

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## Hobbes (Nov 20, 2010)

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I have an embarressing confession as to why I've taken up so much of your time with this root cloning test. I've embedded it in this post from my Grow Lab thread. I apologize for taking so long, I promise to have budded roots within weeks to months or I will refund everyones admittance to the thread and invoke the Hobbes Unconditional Guarantee: *I will do what I say I will do, or I will do it again until I achieve the results that we want.*

Please make a link to the Weed Science download page, if this thread disapears the root cloning pictorial with pictures of successful results will be in Weed Science and there will be a link to my new home forum in the download page of The Academy.

This is so embarressing, I feel like an idiot. I've known why I messed up the root clone experiment for weeks or months, I just ... you're going to laugh. 

If there's anyone who would like to manufacture and sell root pruning buckets with a root tip harvester for cloning I'll help you design a manufacturing process and marketing plan for an incredibly small per sale royalty, only after you're making a profit. I'm using some of my Gizmos to fund The Academy, at the Weed Science download link.

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*Grow Lab*

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My site is The Academy, it's the Weed Science download site in my signature at the bottom of each of my posts. I have to page 44 of this thread uploaded into the ebook, the thread will always be there for everyone whenever they want it. This is one of the simple things that I've made dozens of emails and posts about - insert a first post in this thread that directs people to the ebook so they don't have to wade through this labyrinth to find the simple information that they need to do a project. An Index for Weed Science in my first post, download the ebook chapters from there as needed. I'm not asking to run nude through the forum with a Stephen ColberT mask on, just little stuff.

For anyone who doesn't know, there is an index at the *Weed Science* link that organizes this thread into categories, chapters. Each chapter is downloadable with a linkable index organized by tags. I am adding a timeline index and chapter as Saladman suggested several pages ago, I just need more time. The ebook is free to anyone who might find it useful, I would be honoured if you downloaded it and used some of the equipment or techniques in your garden. This must be a little like what a singer feels like, I'd literally come to your house and help you to build equipment just to know that you are using something that I carried the baton for a length of it's development.

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I'm uploading a video slideshow now - just a rough "it's easier than uploading to tinypic" slideshow. I wanted to bring you folks up to date on a few of things that I'm working on before I take off, I've got some picture series in the video:

*Root Cloning:* I've solved the riddle.

*Elliptical Trough Reflector:* I'm building the base LED.

*The Dope: * I harvested the top third


Picture series of:

- cannibalizing some useless LED UFOs
- one of my beach walks at night
- my Trailer Park Boys CO2 Subcritical fluid extractor
- synching Bubba Kush's stems down for a lower CCOB profile
- root cloning Bubba Kush
- the ventilation redirection bucket and ducting system
- The Dope from harvest through to vaporizing
- The Dope running two good Volcano bags off one bowl
- Trailer Park Boys CO2 Subcritical Paintball Gun Extractor

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[video=vimeo;17040493]http://vimeo.com/17040493[/video]​
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I find that I work best from a forum, its both a journal and my only human contact - I make a game out of seeing if I can go through the day without talking to another person while going about my normal routine. I started making my own coffee to avoid both inconsistent Tim Horton's coffee and repeating my order twice and getting the wrong coffee anyway. It saves me about $20 a day including muffins and a Turkey Bacon sandwich.

As well I'm giving up my interest in my business to develop The Academy full time, my philosophy is that this project must eventually fund itself so I'm going to approach businesses within the marijuana community concerning their affiliate referral programs - if someone is buying a pack of Kali Mist because of the 7000+ views of my Spectrum Of Effects Report, or a pack of Jack The Ripper from the +2500 views, a seed bank could benefit from a link button in my thread. The reader could use my name as a discount code and perhaps get a free seed, the seed bank would know that the referral is from me because of the code.

I'm developing the root pruning pots to include a root tip harvester for root cloning. I believe that I mentioned above my embarressing realization that the roots that I was trying to clone were sans tips because of our root pruning buckets. When I made the root pruning cups and 6" pots without the fabric, and saw the tips growing out, eventually my mind kicked in - when you kill the tip the root stops growing. The root tip is like a stem cell, the top node of a clone cutting. The roots that I was trying to clone, woody stems. 

I was too embaressed to tell anyone here ... its one of those things that make me want to palm face into a tree instead of a palm. I'm thinking either Air Pots or Root Stim as a partner for root cloning pots, unless someone here wants to make them then I'll help you design and build a gang drill for the holes and a bucket indenter for the root tip harvester. We'll make two models, one as we use now and a second with a clam shell cover bucket for people unable to lift the Hole Bucket from the cover. Simple. I want a penny a bucket sold, I won't budge on that. Maybe two cents for three buckets, I hate for anyone to think that I don't have two sense to rub together.

The ETL, I've got 3 good vaporizer designs in Weed Science - The Piker gives better hits than any direct draw on the market. Idiot proof it and it'll be the best vaporizer in the world. Half the power usage, half the time to heat up - magnetic induction is the perfect technology for portable and dock vaporizers. A subcritical water extractor where your expresso machine makes the solvent to replace butane - it makes the $10k I spent this summer developing my CO2 subcritical extractor almost useless except that I can use it for oil sands. Some other stuff, just looking for a very small per sale royalty - and for that I need to be working out of a large forum. This is the best forum for me, the people are great, I love it here - but I can't get a single administrator to even acknowledge that I exist to tell me to go fuck myself. 

I really don't want anything from them ... and if they even get a hundredth of a cent per view for my threads they're at least paying for coffee. I think its a fair trade, if someone bought me coffee and asked nothing in return I'd ... why I'd wonder what they were up to. What their game was.

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## Don Gin and Ton (Nov 21, 2010)

christ hobbes wtff dude hahahahaha we waited so friggin long for that hahah 

good luck in your academy endeavour man.


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## Hobbes (Nov 21, 2010)

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I know, it was a ridiculously idiotic oversight. I feel like such a hippie.

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## Don Gin and Ton (Nov 21, 2010)




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## Hobbes (Nov 22, 2010)

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*Root Clone Test*

*Alcohol Tincture*

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":c lap:"

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Thank you Don and NL3004! I put this together for you folks tonight, it chronicals my etrernal struggle against the hippie menace. I couldn't get very many posters in even with a 10 minute song. NL the posters are in my Grow Lab thread if there are any that you want to download, they start on page 

I've got 50 pages of Holy Carvings (picture hieroglyphs) hidden away at Jon Stewarts forum, I'm going to make those into posters some day. In the spring I became obsessed with non verbal communication and spent 6 weeks in seclusion on Jon's Funny Stuff forum because I figured that no one but no one would go there looking for something funny except by accident.

Baaa zing! Don't forget to tip your waitresses folks, I'll be here until I get my threads deleted. Now for my stinging mamba song.

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[video=vimeo;17076516]http://vimeo.com/17076516[/video]​
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This is a beautiful song, to listen to it uninterupted click on the Only In Dreams video link at the bottom of this post and my Vimeo page will come up. Start the video then pause it and surf the web for 5 minutes while the video loads. I believe that the video can be downloaded from Vimeo as well if you'd like the *Adajio For Strings* on your computer or want a full page video to read the posters. One of the most beautiful songs ever written, this version is from Gershwin's album so it's sans that god awful helicopter chopping and Charlie Sheen's monologue. Just peace.

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## Hobbes (Nov 23, 2010)

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*Weed Science*

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*Much in life doesn't make sense to me*, like a dance who's steps I can memorize but the purpose seems to be to dance as fast as one can. My mind freezes on the WHY people work the way they do and I don't achieve the results that I intend. Marijuana gardening has been the first thing in my life that has been entirely under my control, including my mind. The simple logic of physics and biology are sometimes head bangingly frustrating, but they are always simple and logical, and once deciphered pedestrian. 

Not only the produce, but the procedure of my garden has given me control of my mind and a slowly increasing influence of the world around me - yet I'm completely bewildered at the simplest motivation of another human being. The moderators on RUI have never been anything but the most kind to me, civil and helpful in every way - denying no reasonable request while asking nothing in return. If there is a hippie on RUI it is me - I want something from you, not the moderators, and I have not been able to find out how to provide you with fair trade without asking directly.

For those who've been following the thread for sometime, (Saladman, Shortbus, J.Cun, Mae, and too many others to mention) you may have noticed that I don't ask for help easily, I'm asking now. Everything in this thread has been given freely with no obligation of remuneration, I am humbly asking for your help:

*1. Watch Hobbes 11:9 (Adajio For Strings)*. If the video evokes an emotional response please post and tell me about it - good or bad. If you're offended by some parts that is important for me to know as well - the video is a work in progress, intended first for you and later for the larger community. I need feedback about what the video says to you. If someone posts a negative comment - PLEASE - do not respond. I am asking for the negative comments. As well, its time for us to fight the good fight - to save every resource for the important battles, not the ones that go away when our monitor is turned off.

*2. Tell your friends about the video*, email them my video page URL (*Only In Dreams* - signature section of post) and ask them to drop into the thread. Marijuana grower or tea toddler, we need everyone but the hippie. 

*3. Copy and paste the message at the bottom of this post to the RIU* contact address at the bottom of this post, add a few words of your own if you like. Ask your friends to do the same. We need a forum to expand *Crop Circle Of Bud*, I'm at the point in technology and technique that I'm comfortable brining in people from outside of our thread - people who haven't had the time to absorb what we are doing and why simple simple changes in environmental variables can make such huge changes in results. 

I need to be able to license *CCOB* technology so The Academy can benefit from the sale of products and marijuana seeds that the tens of thousands of views of our thread can provide. The Academy must at sometime support itself, this is central to the CCOB philosophy. At this point in time my only resource to finance The Academy is you, not from your money (I wouldn't / can't take a dime) but from the sale of seeds and technology that the success of your grows will bring.

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[video=vimeo;17106083]http://vimeo.com/17106083[/video]

A full page video can be seen at my Vimeo page, follow the *Only In Dreams* link at the bottom of this post.​
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Please copy and paste this message to the RUI contact email below.

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I support the formation of a Crop Circle Of Bud sub forum for the purpose of developing techniques and alternative technology for refugees and developing countries. Please contact Hobbes in the Grow Lab thread in the Newbie forum.

Thank you

.

*RUI Email Contact*

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## budlover13 (Nov 23, 2010)

I'm new to growing, flowering my second run, vegging my third, and (hopefully) cloning my fourth. Since I'm new to cloning, I have done alot of reading and decided to get rooting hormone for my cuttings. To address this thread with a question(I didn't read all 11 pagea), would dipping your roots in rooting hormone speed up this process?

The reason I would like to do this is so I can have(possibly) hundreds of cuttings for clone and that would allow me to give them to a HUGE number of fellow MMJ patients such as myself that are trying to grow and become self-sufficient with their medicine. I can only IMAGINE the good a process like this would allow. Ad in local paper: "Attn. MMJ card-holders! Free clones available! (XXXX) strains available!"


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## Hobbes (Nov 23, 2010)

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Budlover your post is going in *Weed Science*, an ebook linked in the signature section at the bottom of this post. There will eventually be an index searchable by *RIU* member names, you'll be able to find your contributions quickly.

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Index: *Root Cloning*

Tags: *cloning, roots, free*

RIU: *Budlover*

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*Grow Lab*

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*"would dipping your roots in rooting hormone speed up this process?"*

I believe that it would, I'm testing now with an equal amount of root tips - I'll post pictures when I see cotyledon. I'm doing side by side runs with all of my strains and I'll record and post results.

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*"The reason I would like to do this is so I can have(possibly) hundreds of cuttings for clone and that would allow me to give them to a HUGE number of fellow MMJ patients such as myself that are trying to grow and become self-sufficient with their medicine. I can only IMAGINE the good a process like this would allow. Ad in local paper: "Attn. MMJ card-holders! Free clones available! (XXXX) strains available!"*

Excellent thinking Budlover!!! Beware of the hippies, by helping others for free you have made it on their hit list. You may collapse the overpriced clone industry .... make a bullet proof vest out of duct tape right quick!

.

{DIY Duct Tape Bullet Proof Vest poster coming soon - please check back in, everyone in the thread should have one to protect themselves and their loved ones from *The Hippie Menace*. 

Remember: The only time a hippie is competent is when they're hurting other people. In the arena of misery the hippie is the consolidated heavy weight champion of the world.}

.

I have the same concept of buckets of free and easy clones for our* Crop Circle Of Bud* project, a portable but high yield vegetable growing system being developed for refugees who may have to move their gardens if they have to pick up camp. A community bucket of cheap and easy sprout clones takes the fear from learning gardening - with a supply of unlimited clones a dead plant is just a dead plant, not a starving child.

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Another possible use for root clones could be to create a genetic chain for auto flowering plants. We still have to see the genetic age of root sprouts, the only batch of root clones that I did were from late flowering sativas. But .... time is on my side

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[video=vimeo;17183070]http://vimeo.com/17183070[/video]​
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*A full page video can be seen at ... the site that you'll go to if you click this link.*​
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Please copy and paste this message to the RUI contact email below.

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I support the formation of a Crop Circle Of Bud sub forum for the purpose of developing techniques and alternative technology for refugees and developing countries. Please contact Hobbes in the Grow Lab thread in the Newbie forum.

Thank you

.

*RUI Email Contact*

.


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## IAm5toned (Nov 25, 2010)

lol hobbes has gone off the reservation....


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## Hobbes (Nov 26, 2010)

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Was never on reservation. Free range Hobbes. 

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## MuntantLizzard (Nov 30, 2010)

Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> Not yet anomolies, I've been working on another project and have let this one slide. (The Acedemy linked at the bottom of this post.)
> 
> ...



Come to mexico with me, We could photo document this in the wild.
I may be a Trait. Mexican breeders breed those plants for that reason.

- "Exact Science is not an exact science." - Walter from Fringe(FOX)


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## Theowl (Feb 15, 2011)

So after reading 33 pages I flip to this? It's over and everyone just quit? Hmm, being the experimentalist that i am, I wanna try this
With a few more variables. Being familiar with a wide variety of plants, and the way that each has it's own specific needs&tendacies, I believe that this can be made to work with mj in a controllable, repeatable fashion. 

I'd sure like to speak
With a few of the believers and confer.. 

This was a great thread/ certainly piqued Interest in a lot of folks. 
Even if some of the interest was aimed at nay saying. It takes all kinds folks. Indeed it
Does.


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## DaddyGr33nJeans (Aug 2, 2011)

You know autoflowers are a cross of the ruderalis plant (hemp without thc that flowers upon age not photo period) and a good strain. I see why auto flowers are so popular because the word auto flower is just attractive lol... But in reality auto flowers compromise potency and render the grower without control of his/her yield... Although from a botanists stand point it's very interesting just not practical for what the average grower wants to achieve (a potent strain with control over your harvest). There are many different cloning methods we should start a new thread on that as I would be interested. Remember experiments are the reason we can even communicate right now.


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## Voltrom (Jul 8, 2013)

Was really interested to see if the roots would take hold in the dwc experiment. What a waste of time.


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## ArCaned (Jul 10, 2013)

sad panda read the whole thread and everyone quit. This was abloody good experiment, gogo again!


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## Saldaw (Jul 13, 2013)

did it work out for anyone?


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## HackA (Nov 22, 2013)

Imma try this some time...


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## GutsNReefer (May 3, 2015)

Sorry for bumping an old thread, but I'm amazed at the potential for this type of cloning technique.

This actually looks very possible. I've done some research on hops (ie Humulus lupulus) which is in the Cannabaceae family, and root cloning is the most popular way to propagate them. Though hops have a much stronger root than cannabis (hop plants will regrow from their roots from the previous year) I believe that cannabis would be able to do the same thing. Hops contain a rhizome which is an underground stem.






I'm a new grower but I believe using a root from the 3rd order lateral part of the root system of cannabis would be about the same as a rhizome. 

link: Hop Rhizomes: What, how, and when







Perhaps a stem could even be turned into a kind of rhizome by planting it with rooting gel or putting it in a bubbler. This would be ideal for shipping clones over long distances or storing genetics for long periods of time. I will soon be harvesting my own crop and will try saving some 3rd order roots and also creating a rhizome-like stem. I'm planning on moving soon so this will get a real test.

I'll make a post with links to any useful research I find on this, what methods I used to prepare my roots, and hopefully good results. I didn't have a lot of time for this post but I wanted to get my thoughts out there to see what the community thinks of this.


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## bazoomer (Nov 27, 2021)

mmmmmm


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## GoatSoup (Nov 30, 2021)

I skimmed through this thread looking for the Eureka moment but didn't find one.

I'm interested because I have two White Widow autos with wildly different phenotypes, one is tall (30-32") and the othr (17-19") both are very bushy but the short one is ideal for my "Bath tub" growing, with light leaks. I need short plants in SCROG to fit in my ~50" max height and 2'x3' Scrog net. I grow in a modified Stinkbug NFT system that is easy and efficient. If I could root clone from it it would be brilliant.

If I could root clone these autos, or a Cinderella Jack auto I could save on seed costs and keep an auto perpetual grow going.


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