# SOG vs. long veg times



## papapayne (Apr 13, 2012)

So have had my first harvest dried and cured up, and am working on my 2nd harvest which is in 1 month into flower now and a 3rd harvest which is 10 days into flower. What I am wondering is what you guys think is better for quality and quanity. Is it better to run a SOG method and put rooted clones straight into flower or if its better to have a long veg time to get them big. What I have been doing is vegging till they are approx 13-18 inches tall. So approx a month of veg time. I have 15 strains to work with as well. I have for flower a 600 and a 430 but am going to be using some money to get a few more HPS for flower, prob 2 more 600s


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## polyarcturus (Apr 13, 2012)

if i had the time i would veg longer under 1/3 the wattage of my flowering lights. because first 2 weeks of flower they fill up thier space anyways. you have to look at it like this a in the first 2 weeks of flower a plant will double or triple it size. so say you want a six foot plant you would only have to veg to 3ft-4ft. so when i veh my plant for my i think hey my lights are 3ft from the floor and i have a 4 foot ceiling so ican only veg my plant to like 6in-1ft height so i optimize my my space.


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## FrostyTheBudMan (Apr 13, 2012)

papapayne said:


> What I am wondering is what you guys think is better for quality and quanity. Is it better to run a SOG method and put rooted clones straight into flower or if its better to have a long veg time to get them big. What I have been doing is vegging till they are approx 13-18 inches tall. So approx a month of veg time. I have 15 strains to work with as well. I have for flower a 600 and a 430 but am going to be using some money to get a few more HPS for flower, prob 2 more 600s


Personally, the more veg time you can get the better in terms of root development, which is the key in my mind. Healthy roots, happy plant. I am scrogging, but if I was doing SOG I would still vote for more veg time, more veg+more budsites=more FUN!


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## Saldaw (Apr 13, 2012)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Sa1IIgmtqY&feature=my_liked_videos&list=LL_MZr_PuDVQ51KZ0ZPDvXKA

SOG, all that needs to be said.


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## rumors1011 (Apr 13, 2012)

Saldaw said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Sa1IIgmtqY&feature=my_liked_videos&list=LL_MZr_PuDVQ51KZ0ZPDvXKA
> 
> SOG, all that needs to be said.


wow, thats all that needs to be said.


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## FranJan (Apr 13, 2012)

To me it's strain dependent. I've got a Magic Bud plant that will go all bonsai on me if I try to flower it straight from clone. On the other hand I've got a Tangerine Dream pheno that will grow a very impressive kola straight from clone.


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## throwdo (Apr 13, 2012)

i think it depends on the grower , some people can kill in a waterfarm ,SCOTTY BALLS , some people wreck in vert HEATH ROBBISON , you have to find what works for you


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## OGEvilgenius (Apr 13, 2012)

Vertical, SOG, small plants, proper genetics. Just check out some of Heath Robinsons grows. You can do well growing a number of ways, but I think in terms of turnaround and overall production it's hard to beat a SOG.


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## polyarcturus (Apr 13, 2012)

SOG USERS UNITED! fast turnarounds and big yields WEEKLY


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## iamAK47 (Apr 15, 2012)

S.O.G a.k.a Life without parole growing techniqe

be smart n veg them bitches


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## lighting (Apr 15, 2012)

polyarcturus said:


> SOG USERS UNITED! fast turnarounds and big yields WEEKLY


 i have done stupid big sogs and take it as you like its not worth doing i have vegged 5 weeks 6000 watts per room finished height was 6 feet tall only to achieve 6 pounds per 80 plants 
the problem is lots of lower buds become under developed and turn into shake or what ever sog your really only achieving 1/4 of the plant thats top half under parts turn into hash or what ever some people got to realize more plants dont mean more yields 
Why do i say this cause i took same strain did 4 plant scrog vegged 6 weeks under 2000 watts and got me 4 pounds anyonwe can clearly see less is better least in my books my next grow will be 16 plant 16 pound harvest 8 x 20 scrog 6000 watts c02


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## mufastaa (Apr 15, 2012)

iamAK47 said:


> S.O.G a.k.a Life without parole growing techniqe
> 
> be smart n veg them bitches


haha i like this one.
ideally you should go for a PERPETUAL grow WITH 2 WK VEG. just make a veg room, which you probly have for the mother anyway. you dont need a sog to harvest every 2 wks.


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## axionjaxson (Apr 15, 2012)

FranJan said:


> To me it's strain dependent. I've got a Magic Bud plant that will go all bonsai on me if I try to flower it straight from clone. On the other hand I've got a Tangerine Dream pheno that will grow a very impressive kola straight from clone.


thats what i was thinking , i had to veg my la cons to 3 feet before switching to 12\12 to get 4 foot plants .


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## axionjaxson (Apr 15, 2012)

lighting said:


> i have done stupid big sogs and take it as you like its not worth doing i have vegged 5 weeks 6000 watts per room finished height was 6 feet tall only to achieve 6 pounds per 80 plants
> the problem is lots of lower buds become under developed and turn into shake or what ever sog your really only achieving 1/4 of the plant thats top half under parts turn into hash or what ever some people got to realize more plants dont mean more yields
> Why do i say this cause i took same strain did 4 plant scrog vegged 6 weeks under 2000 watts and got me 4 pounds anyonwe can clearly see less is better least in my books my next grow will be 16 plant 16 pound harvest 8 x 20 scrog 6000 watts c02


sweet dude dude sweet


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## zo0t (Apr 16, 2012)

SOG ftw but then when u flower your 5month old mother plant cuz iz too big in da veg room it turns into a monster SOG = flower when 14 inchs tall ,
5month veg scary monster really its too big.


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## + WitchDoctor + (Apr 16, 2012)

I veg for about 5 weeks or so usually. I FIM at 12" and lollypop right before flipping. I use 18" tomato cages instead of ScrOG or SOG because I like to have the ability to move the plants if I need too. This works well for me.


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## Ilovebush (Apr 16, 2012)

Hey, eventhough I like SOG very much and it is strain dependent as mentioned...it's a guaranteed way to be Bubba's new bitch. Unless ur willing to do the time don't risk the numbers associated with the SOG method. Yeah the turnaround is quick and it's great for small spaces but some strains are not suited to the donkey dick method. Just ma 2 cents...I'm with iamAK47...peace!


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## iamAK47 (Apr 17, 2012)

Ilovebush said:


> it's a guaranteed way to be Bubba's new bitch.


 S.O.G a.k.a Bubbaponics


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## FranJan (Apr 17, 2012)

iamAK47 said:


> S.O.G a.k.a Bubbaponics


 LOL. That's so perfect. It should be called that! All I know is I had to have some work done to a leaking radiator valve in my grow room this winter and that it's nice when your grow fits into a few 55 gallon containers. The guys from my building's maintenance crew were in that room working for 45 minutes or so with those plants, (80 + Moms I think), and gear all packed up to look like it was just camping equipment. They didn't see/smell a thing. Now do that with a 3+ foot tree.


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## polyarcturus (Apr 17, 2012)

FranJan said:


> LOL. That's so perfect. It should be called that! All I know is I had to have some work done to a leaking radiator valve in my grow room this winter and that it's nice when your grow fits into a few 55 gallon containers. The guys from my building's maintenance crew were in that room working for 45 minutes or so with those plants, (80 + Moms I think), and gear all packed up to look like it was just camping equipment. They didn't see/smell a thing. Now do that with a 3+ foot tree.


happened to me on friday the 13, GAS MAN, my area is so small but productive you would never know it was there he sure didnt


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## theexpress (Apr 17, 2012)

dont veg longer then 3 weeks for s.o.g. 3 weeks is to long for some stretchy sativas even..... high number of plants... short veg time {2-3weeks} and smaller pots 1-2 gallon.... i would get the square pots and put them super close togather to make best use of space/light... dont top!!!! you want single cola stlye here and honly verticle growth {no bushing!} veg till like 6-8 inches... dont let them get too big... never over 12 inches unless your growing a super short growing indica with zero stretch that takes forever to veg {examples... bubba kush, l.a. con., afghanies}


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## EROsain (Apr 17, 2012)

all about your growing situation, if you got SOG or SCROG yo prolly want the benefits from the height . so its good for people with horizontal space not vertical , but if you have vertical space and no horizontal ScroG would be a bad i dea, with fewer taller plants you gould get the same yeild with out having to water and feed over 10 containers . another really good reason for SCROG or SOG is hydro . but a long veg time will always get you a much stronger plant which i think gets you more dense budz


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## Bob Smith (Apr 17, 2012)

I don't make any money vegging.

VSOGs all day, every day.


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## RawBudzski (Apr 17, 2012)

Usually those who are trying to stay as Legal as can be avoid the SOG.


I would rather have LEO check up on my garden of 5 monsters than a garden of 50 mini-me plants.. They only see #


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## EROsain (Apr 17, 2012)

yer SOG get your plant count high as fuck .


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## polyarcturus (Apr 17, 2012)

EROsain said:


> yer SOG get your plant count high as fuck .


depends on how you design it but 99 plants is a lot of plants still (if your scared) me ill do whatever when the feds come its not gonna matter what a statey says plus i dont think the feds really care about #s if you could grow 10lbs off one efficiently and you had 30 of them bitchs i think they would hit you just as hard as if you had 400 smalls clones producing an 1-2oz ea. maths probably off but you get the idea


hell yeah express absolutely right 4x4 pots into 1 gal pots under 3 weeks veg, bluecheese, a purp strain and a stretchy ass widow(as for sativa dom vegged too long that stretch and fuck shit up) i just had to expand my grow area for.


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## EROsain (Apr 17, 2012)

true . but you can screw up with the plant count cuz of clones and seedlings if your perpetual . but the feds wouldn't prolly care


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## + WitchDoctor + (Apr 17, 2012)

The feds might only care about numbers when it's over 99, but they make it look bad on the news either way, that's what sucks. Most Americans that don't know much about the plant think it's a problem every time they here 80 plants...or 800 plants in a collective. Sometimes they'll even show the bigger plants in the media coverage just so that it seems like every plant looked like that. Not to say we shouldn't grow how we want to or however works best for us though. I tried SOG and it was just too much work for me, but I can see why other people like it better too.


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## Bob Smith (Apr 19, 2012)

I flower out 90 plants in my structure and keep 8 moms............save for the last two weeks of every cycle (when I've taken clones for the next cycle), I leave myself one plant of federal wiggle room


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## lighting (Apr 19, 2012)

rooted clones , vegging plants , and plants in flower are all considered plants and are counted as a plant when your raided it comes down to how much balls you got but remember bottom line its illegal and plant count dictates jail time cause if you think you get charged only for growing think again theres conspiracy also i used to be one of them that grew crazy amount of plants and i mean crazy over 700 clones , 700 plants in veg and 700 in flower and i tell yea its fckin scary fun to do may be once or 2 times but no matter what consider your self lucky if you don't get caught cause you read about it all the time grows going down and its just a matter of time as well with smart meters etc hell when you get 1800.00 dollar power bills every 2 months and power company calls wondering whats going on ?? cause previous 5 years there was nowhere as much power consumption 
so now its about growing only a few vegging longer and staying under the radar yes longer veg = better yields 
as well SOG really isnt efficient cause your lucky to get half of a plant when harvesting other half is popcorn and under developed bud theres a lot of better techniques out there to produce yields


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## lighting (Apr 19, 2012)

Bob Smith said:


> I flower out 90 plants in my structure and keep 8 moms............save for the last two weeks of every cycle (when I've taken clones for the next cycle), I leave myself one plant of federal wiggle room


and what do you get for yield from 90 plants if i may ask ??


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## Bob Smith (Apr 19, 2012)

4-5 pounds usually, shooting for 5.5 this round.

1800 watts of lighting (4 600s, only 3 on at any one time).


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## lighting (Apr 19, 2012)

see i just completed 4 plant 4 pound harvest 2000 watts no need to grow so many bro just veg longer and use bigger totes


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## Bob Smith (Apr 19, 2012)

If you're happy doing what you're doing, then we're all happy - don't see the point in giving advice to someone pulling anywhere from 15-25% more weight than you with 10% less wattage and a sliver of the veg time that you use, but I do appreciate the thought.

I'm gonna keep doing what I do best, and you do the same - BTW, not all of us grow in "totes'


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## polyarcturus (Apr 19, 2012)

all can say wow.

but on another not theirs room for improvement, and really only one thing i coould see, if you wanted to fit more units in there (if) you need to organize the space around the grow where you work to also be space efficient, really i would try and use pannel board in a removeable fasion orund that system to make it more like a sealed chamber too. but just some food for though otherwise im drooling.


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## polyarcturus (Apr 19, 2012)

oh i see the plastic that probably works better now i understand the first pic. lol i was wtf a trash bag?


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## lighting (Apr 19, 2012)

40 days veg isnt that bad yea think


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## Bob Smith (Apr 19, 2012)

Assuming a 60 day flowering and your forty days of veg (total cycle of 100 days), you're turning over (365/100) = 3.65 crops a year @ 4 lbs per crop = 14.6lbs. per year.

Assuming a 60 day flowering and my ten days of veg (total cycle of 70 days), I'm turning over (365/70) = 5.21 crops per year @ 4.5lbs. per crop = 23.4 lbs. per year.


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## zo0t (Apr 20, 2012)

Bob Smith said:


> If you're happy doing what you're doing, then we're all happy - don't see the point in giving advice to someone pulling anywhere from 15-25% more weight than you with 10% less wattage and a sliver of the veg time that you use, but I do appreciate the thought.
> 
> I'm gonna keep doing what I do best, and you do the same - BTW, not all of us grow in "totes'
> 
> View attachment 2129660View attachment 2129662View attachment 2129659View attachment 2129661


what a lovely nft colosseum br0 would liek to see moar pix0rz


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## iamAK47 (Apr 20, 2012)

Bob Smith said:


> If you're happy doing what you're doing, then we're all happy - don't see the point in giving advice to someone pulling anywhere from 15-25% more weight than you with 10% less wattage and a sliver of the veg time that you use, but I do appreciate the thought.
> 
> I'm gonna keep doing what I do best, and you do the same - BTW, not all of us grow in "totes'
> 
> View attachment 2129660View attachment 2129662View attachment 2129659View attachment 2129661


Mmmmmmm, Bubba likes


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## del66666 (Apr 20, 2012)

no veg.......just 12-12 from the start.....but i use seeds.....


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## lighting (Apr 20, 2012)

Bob Smith said:


> Assuming a 60 day flowering and your forty days of veg (total cycle of 100 days), you're turning over (365/100) = 3.65 crops a year @ 4 lbs per crop = 14.6lbs. per year.
> 
> Assuming a 60 day flowering and my ten days of veg (total cycle of 70 days), I'm turning over (365/70) = 5.21 crops per year @ 4.5lbs. per crop = 23.4 lbs. per year.


actually if you want to get technical lol 50 pounds out door 150 plants 4 shots of 16 plant indoor total 84 day from start to finish = 64 pounds plus out door = 114 pounds per year


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## beenthere (Apr 20, 2012)

lighting said:


> actually if you want to get technical lol 50 pounds out door 150 plants 4 shots of 16 plant indoor total 84 day from start to finish = 64 pounds plus out door = 114 pounds per year



Hey bro, you can't even keep up with your own stories, you came in the vert section talking shit and basically calling guys liars for posting their yields.
Now you're in here singing the same song.

First you claim to grow a 4 plant scrog because you're afraid of johnny law, but now your getting 114 lbs out of a total of 214 plants!
Sorry but I'm calling BS.


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## Gone Green (Apr 20, 2012)

my first grow was with a 150w hps and I yielded 110ish grams off two plants in a 2ft x 1.5ft x 3.5ft tall grow DRESSER with some cha ching by ff. Plants went through hell and back, but I fed my tops through chicken wire and trimmed everything below the wire. worked really well. I'm doing a chemdawg grow right now, and I cut as little as possible, no more screens or chicken wire. I bend tops, lightly tie back plants and manipulate them for an even canopy. Ballers just tell their plants where and how to grow.


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## beenthere (Apr 20, 2012)

Gone Green said:


> my first grow was with a 150w hps and I yielded 110ish grams off two plants in a 2ft x 1.5ft x 3.5ft tall grow DRESSER with some cha ching by ff. Plants went through hell and back, but I fed my tops through chicken wire and trimmed everything below the wire. worked really well. I'm doing a chemdawg grow right now, and I cut as little as possible, no more screens or chicken wire. I bend tops, lightly tie back plants and manipulate them for an even canopy. Ballers just tell their plants where and how to grow.


Dude, a quarter pound from that small space and light is impressive, good luck with the dog!


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## papapayne (May 3, 2012)

man, didnt pay attention and this took off! Guess I should have expected it. Guess its kinda like arguing republic vs democrat. I am gonna try both ways lol. I have a mini sog under my 600 watter and I have some 4 foot trees under my 1000 gonna see how it goes down.


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## dukethompson (May 5, 2012)

I recently just finished this experiment in my grow room and found that the amount of time it takes to grow the plant for a larger yield is not worth the time it takes to simply cycle plants through. I fit 12- 1/2 gallon pots in the same space as one 5 gallon pot. What I mean by that is the space the plant will consume. It takes 40-60 days of training and grooming to get the larger yielding plant ready to flower. I already flowered 12 plants that always yield at least an ounce, and I get to do it twice before I get one plant harvested. Also the variety. Instead of waiting on Blue Dream for 1/3rd of a year, you get to grow Blackberry Kush, Jack Herer, AK-47, Hogs Breath, etc. etc, and not have to wear yourself out of a high you put so much time into getting. You also aren't stuck when you smoked too much and are still 3 weeks away from harvest and dry time because since you can easily just throw more plants into flower, your grow cycle has fresh bud ready for you to smoke weekly, not every 2-3 months.


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## PJ Diaz (May 6, 2012)

Bob Smith said:


> Assuming a 60 day flowering and your forty days of veg (total cycle of 100 days), you're turning over (365/100) = 3.65 crops a year @ 4 lbs per crop = 14.6lbs. per year.
> 
> Assuming a 60 day flowering and my ten days of veg (total cycle of 70 days), I'm turning over (365/70) = 5.21 crops per year @ 4.5lbs. per crop = 23.4 lbs. per year.





dukethompson said:


> I recently just finished this experiment in my grow room and found that the amount of time it takes to grow the plant for a larger yield is not worth the time it takes to simply cycle plants through. I fit 12- 1/2 gallon pots in the same space as one 5 gallon pot. What I mean by that is the space the plant will consume. It takes 40-60 days of training and grooming to get the larger yielding plant ready to flower. I already flowered 12 plants that always yield at least an ounce, and I get to do it twice before I get one plant harvested. Also the variety. Instead of waiting on Blue Dream for 1/3rd of a year, you get to grow Blackberry Kush, Jack Herer, AK-47, Hogs Breath, etc. etc, and not have to wear yourself out of a high you put so much time into getting. You also aren't stuck when you smoked too much and are still 3 weeks away from harvest and dry time because since you can easily just throw more plants into flower, your grow cycle has fresh bud ready for you to smoke weekly, not every 2-3 months.



Many growers have separate veg and flower rooms, which makes this a non-issue.


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## Bob Smith (May 8, 2012)

PJ Diaz said:


> Many growers have separate veg and flower rooms, which makes this a non-issue.


Correct.

Assuming their time (caring for those vegging plants), space (they have a veg room whereas I would have another flower room - you don't make any money vegging), and electricity (for vegging) are free, then it's a non-issue.

Otherwise it's kind of an issue.

It's really simple - both methods can produce abundant amounts of great weed. SOG can produce more weed, more quickly. It can also get you more years in jail. Then again, I can also finish trimming much more quickly because there's no popcorn.

Life's full of calculated risks............we all need to decide what method is best for us.

Happy (and safe) growing, everybody.


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## Clown Baby (May 8, 2012)

SOG will give you higher yield, and nothing but Colas. No popcorn. Takes a lot less time.

The tradeoff is a higher plant count. you dont want to wind up in federal "pound me in the ass" prison


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## polyarcturus (May 8, 2012)

Clown Baby said:


> SOG will give you higher yield, and nothing but Colas. No popcorn. Takes a lot less time.
> 
> The tradeoff is a higher plant count. you dont want to wind up in federal "pound me in the ass" prison


federal prison is more like a minimum security resort.... state prison well thats another story....


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## REALSTYLES (May 11, 2012)

I don't know why you guys are worried about plant count if you have a doctor's recommendation for 99 plants and 6 pounds of dried herb why not sog. I'm gonna try it as soon as my blueberry x skywalker clones are ready within a few days but I'm only doing 30 plants total in a 4 x 4 tent with a 600 hps to see what happens. I've grown big plants and vegged for 4-5 weeks with 1000 watt but the electric bill is kicking my ass by the time of harvest and yes you do get weight off less plants.


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## PJ Diaz (May 24, 2012)

REALSTYLES said:


> I don't know why you guys are worried about plant count if you have a doctor's recommendation for 99 plants and 6 pounds of dried herb why not sog. I'm gonna try it as soon as my blueberry x skywalker clones are ready within a few days but I'm only doing 30 plants total in a 4 x 4 tent with a 600 hps to see what happens. I've grown big plants and vegged for 4-5 weeks with 1000 watt but the electric bill is kicking my ass by the time of harvest and yes you do get weight off less plants.


I dunno what county you live in to allow 6 lbs dried. The state law allows only 6 mature plants and 6 immature plants. I'm in one of the few counties that will allow up to 99 plants, but only up to 3 lbs.


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## REALSTYLES (May 25, 2012)

PJ Diaz said:


> I dunno what county you live in to allow 6 lbs dried. The state law allows only 6 mature plants and 6 immature plants. I'm in one of the few counties that will allow up to 99 plants, but only up to 3 lbs.


I make edibles so the doctor gave me the maximum dried weight allowed. I'm in socal plus I gotta renew my recommendation in July.


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