# Barney's Farm Tangerine Dream Ebb & Flow MicroGarden Grow T5 New Wave Lights



## Serapis (Feb 11, 2011)

​
Thanks for stopping in. This thread is dedicated to the Barney's Farm (BF) Tangerine Dream (TD) strain. Please do not use this grow journal as a place to vent about BF or TD. Everyone has heard or read the stories that are going around about this strain; let's not rehash them here. If you do not know what I'm referring to, good, that means that you can view this grow without any pre-conceived conclusions, as will I. 

Everyone is invited to share their own personal experience with TD if they are currently growing it or have in the recent past. Please feel free to ask questions, make suggestions, jokes, observations, whatever. Just please keep it civil and pull up a seat, because it is going to be a long grow.

​ 
DAY 1


The seeds were previously acquired from Attitude Seeds. The cost for the seeds was in the neighborhood of $60 and one of the freebies was a G13 Pineapple Express; the 10% off 420 coupon code helped as well. I was really excited at the time I bought the seeds, as I love citrus fruits. I love tropical flavors as well. The description was so mouth watering for these seeds, that I could literally smell the oils from the tangerine, as they sprayed from its tearing skin.

I decided to go with Rockwool this time, as peat pellets have been giving me issues lately, and, these will be growing in hydroton, in an ebb and flow MicroGarden. I pre-soaked the cubes in distilled water, PH'ed to 4.0. This is to counter the extremely high PH that new Rockwool has. I used about a quart of water and poured it into my handy-dandy propagation tray. The tray is on a towel, which is resting on a germination heating pad.

View attachment 1436176
​ I poured a jigger of distilled water into a shot glass and then deposited the seeds. Only one seed took to the bottom like a true champion diver, the remaining four seeds clung to the side, floating , as if they couldn't swim and were holding on to the edge of the pool. I playfully pushed them into the center, using my 5ml plastic pipette, coaxing them to let out their breath and sink like a stone. Eventually, one of them gained enough weight to sink.

I placed the Jigger on the warm towel in my nursery and covered it with 4 stacked solo cups, to keep the light out. My nursery is strictly CFL and T8, and T5s that stay on 24 hours a day, seven days a week. I'm waiting for the Microgarden to show up, so I can get it ready for some TD ladies. I also have an RO unit ordered so I can quit lugging 15 gallons of distilled water home every week from the grocery stores. I currently have two monster Bubblelicious plants scrogging in my flowering tent that drink almost 3 gallons a day between them. The link to that grow is in my sig if anyone is interested.

View attachment 1436177
​ Until next update....


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## bestbuds09 (Feb 11, 2011)

sounds fucking good bro...... im in for the ride. and i have no idea what you are talking about BF or TD and i could care less if its negative since ive grown barneys seeds plenty of times without any problems whatsoever. so far this sounds like an interesting project you will be having.... good luck bro with everything and i hope your grow goes smooth and easy....


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## Grow'N'Smoke (Feb 11, 2011)

Pulling up my chair.



-GNS


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## Serapis (Feb 11, 2011)

I now have 4 seeds on the bottom of the pool... Hi GrowNSmoke and Bestbuds09... I'm honored to have both of you here.

Weirdest thing happened a few moments ago. I lifted the cups to peek and I saw 2 of the seeds falling as I did.... Did the light do it? Did they both happen to take a dive together? It was a weird moment... I had to actually think, 'Did I just see that!?"


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## Grumpy Old Dreamer (Feb 11, 2011)

Hi Serapis - I've just started a couple of BF TD seeds - not germinated yet, it will be good to follow your thread while growing plants that are the same age ... although mine won't be flowering for a long time yet.


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## Serapis (Feb 11, 2011)

Grumpy Old Dreamer said:


> Hi Serapis - I've just started a couple of BF TD seeds - not germinated yet, it will be good to follow your thread while growing plants that are the same age ... although mine won't be flowering for a long time yet.


Hi-ya buddy!! It is going to be awesome following two BF TD grows together. Please feel free to share some pics with us if you don't intend to journal the grow. I have heard sooo many things about this strain, both good and bad and decided to find out for myself. I love oranges!!


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## Serapis (Feb 12, 2011)

​

All 5 seeds were floating this morning. I thought I saw a root tail coming out, but upon a closer view, it was just a tiny air bubble on that end of the seed. I have NEVER germinated this way before. Soaking seeds is alien to me. I do have the jigger on a towel over a seedling heat map, so the water is tepid, not hot, not cold. It's going on 20 hours now, I hope to see some action here soon. I know I shouldn't leave the seeds in the water much longer than 24 hours. I have tepid grodan cubes in PH 4.0 water ready to go the minute the ER is called into action for transplants.  

View attachment 1437459 View attachment 1437460​
I'm happy to see all 5 sink. That indicates that all 5 are indeed viable seeds. If a floater refuses to sink, chances are the seed is old and needs to soak for a few days, OR, it has air in it and the embryo was dried out, killing it and causing the floater to never sink. If you paid a good deal for the seed, by all means, stil attempt to germ it, but your chances are probably 9:1 against you, maybe even higher. Any statisticians reading along? LOL... 

View attachment 1437461​
As soon I can, I'll do a transplant and photograph the steps and share with you guys and gals. this is after all a non-gender hobby that has seen a great influx of female growers in the past 10 years. I'm glad to have them with us. Having our wives, partners, loved ones, etc share our grows and spend time in the garden with us... WTF!? NOT MY GARDEN... LOL... I prefer to garden alone. 

OK everyone, remember, this thread is all about good karma and fun times. I have no expectations of this grow. Whatever the outcome, it is what it is. Let's have fun. Let's try some different shit. Hell, one or two of these may become outside plants. I live in a tropical locale. Here it is not even Valentines Day yet and we are in the 60's today. I wonder how big one of these can get? Wouldn't it be neat to grow one like a tree?

We'll see. For the first 6 weeks at least, these babies will be living in the nursery, under a new. New Wave T5 4 bulb unit. I have never thought I would be a FL user or rely on them much, but my nursery has had great results raising seedlings with them. Last grow, I had to veg under T8's for 3 weeks while waiting space in my flowering tent. The growth rate was not bad. The T5 unit will hang from a 2' ventilated shelf that I use for my nutrients, additives, testers, etc. I'll hang the light, and then line shelf with panda poly to prevent anything from dripping on my unit. The New Wave units allow you to mix bulb spectrums, 6500k working side by side with 3000k. The 6 and 8 bulb units have dual on off controls to allow you to run just the 3000k or the 6500k, or just to reduce ovrall lumen, as if for rootings or seedlings.

​
OK, back to the seeds.... I'm taking bets, winner gets +REP.... How many of these seeds will germinate? One guess per reader....   

MORE to come.....

STAy tUNED


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## JimBro (Feb 12, 2011)

I'm going to say 6 out of those 5 will germ. Wait, what? 
Pullin' up a chair cuz I got a few of them TDs myself. Tried to germ 2, 1 made it but is not looking too good.


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## Serapis (Feb 12, 2011)

JimBro said:


> I'm going to say 6 out of those 5 will germ. Wait, what?
> Pullin' up a chair cuz I got a few of them TDs myself. Tried to germ 2, 1 made it but is not looking too good.


I'm putting you down for 5 Jimbro... I hope you are correct sir.... Maybe we need a tie breaker..... Nah, everyone that is right will get rep..


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## Grumpy Old Dreamer (Feb 12, 2011)

I'll go for 4 out of the 5 - one failure is permissable.

I'm using the paper towel method for once (usually just plant direct in jiffy pellet).
Yesterday morning my single TD seed hadn't germinated so I added a second seed, by the evening the first seed had a small root showing and now it is about a quarter of an inch long, so I hopefully will soon have a plant to play with. 
If the second seed pops, it will be vegged then put outside and be ready to smoke sooner than my ScrOG.
I won't be in a position to flower the ScrOG for about 12 weeks so I have plenty of time to take clones, use for grafting etc and get my ScrOG set up for flowering.
I've got a mother with Red Dragon and L.S.D. growing on it and will add a graft of Tangerine Dream asap.


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## WakethBaketh (Feb 13, 2011)

Subscribed. I'm in the for the ride and excited to see how it goes! Quick question sorry if it's already been answered or you already mentioned it, but you'll be using the waterfarm like your last grow yeah?


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## Serapis (Feb 13, 2011)

OK GOD, I have you down for four. As of right now, all 5 seeds are heavy. I changed out the water with clean tepid distilled, as I don't like cloudy water. We have 0 germination as of right this minute. The seeds have been soaking now for going on 40 hours. They look bigger than they were when I first put tehm in, as if they have swollen, just waiting for them to crack. I could have waited to two days before soaking the Grodan cubes... Nothing to update at this time.. 



Grumpy Old Dreamer said:


> I'll go for 4 out of the 5 - one failure is permissable.
> 
> I'm using the paper towel method for once (usually just plant direct in jiffy pellet).
> Yesterday morning my single TD seed hadn't germinated so I added a second seed, by the evening the first seed had a small root showing and now it is about a quarter of an inch long, so I hopefully will soon have a plant to play with.
> ...


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## Serapis (Feb 13, 2011)

WakethBaketh said:


> Subscribed. I'm in the for the ride and excited to see how it goes! Quick question sorry if it's already been answered or you already mentioned it, but you'll be using the waterfarm like your last grow yeah?


No, this will be an ebb and Flow grow, in a Bontanicare MicroGarden, that will be here next week. Depending on the grow, one might end up in a waterfarm, as my clones are struggling. They either weren't getting nutrients in the aero set up, or you really have to crank the nute rates up in aero, cause they weren't getting food yet had some good roots. The plants continued to eat off of their own leaves, turning them all yellow. I have 3 left, in a jiffy seedling mix, in solo cups that are reverse watering/feeding. Two of them seem to be recovering already, the other is critical, prognosis not good.

My intention is to grow all 5 in a MicroGarden until flowering. At that point, I haven't decided whether to finish them off outside or in. We'll see. One may very well graduate to the farm.


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## WakethBaketh (Feb 13, 2011)

Serapis said:


> No, this will be an ebb and Flow grow, in a Bontanicare MicroGarden, that will be here next week. Depending on the grow, one might end up in a waterfarm, as my clones are struggling. They either weren't getting nutrients in the aero set up, or you really have to crank the nute rates up in aero, cause they weren't getting food yet had some good roots. The plants continued to eat off of their own leaves, turning them all yellow. I have 3 left, in a jiffy seedling mix, in solo cups that are reverse watering/feeding. Two of them seem to be recovering already, the other is critical, prognosis not good.
> 
> My intention is to grow all 5 in a MicroGarden until flowering. At that point, I haven't decided whether to finish them off outside or in. We'll see. One may very well graduate to the farm.


Thanks for the speedy reply. Interested how the ebb and flow works out for you and sorry to hear about your clones and I've heard good things about tangerine dream but haven't read enough to know what all the complaints are. Good luck man and I know with your knowledge you'll have a kick ass harvest!


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## Serapis (Feb 13, 2011)

I wish knowledge was the only contributing factor.... but thanks for the wishes!!... 3 out of 5 clones ain't bad, considering I took them in flower AND the two that didn't root had stems that were kinda woody, from near the top. It was just a test of if a fogger could cause cuttings to root by itself and it indeed can. 3 of them may still come through...



WakethBaketh said:


> Thanks for the speedy reply. Interested how the ebb and flow works out for you and sorry to hear about your clones and I've heard good things about tangerine dream but haven't read enough to know what all the complaints are. Good luck man and I know with your knowledge you'll have a kick ass harvest!


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## Serapis (Feb 13, 2011)

*UPDATE*::

I'm keeping a close eye on the seeds today. It appears as if one has cracked but I do not see the tap root yet. I'm thinking soon....


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## CombatVeterans 4 Cannabis (Feb 13, 2011)

i just ordered 5 tangerine dreams from barny's farm and 5 ak47 x jack herer from sensi seeds...i wont be starting them for about 2 months but i will for sure be keeping everyone updated when i do...im going with a DWC as my method... cant wait till then....now im working on my very 1st grow...i was in amsterdam this summer and went to green house seed co and picked up some himalayan gold and arjan's strawberry haze seeds. i got 2 himalaya golds going now and they are doing really well for my 1st grow with a few hiccups. here are a few pics of my 3x3x8.5 closet grow...im using AN Connoisseur, AN Big Bud, AN Bud Candy, Botanicare Sweet Berry Carbo, & Emerald Triangle Snow Storm Ultra... in the 4 gal res for each plant im Running 10ml of each A&B of the Connoisseur, 6ML of each B.B., B.C., & Sweet Berry, & 2.5ML of Snow Storm in 1qrt spray bottle...these plants can suck up the nutes let me tell ya....
 Combat Veterans for Cannabis - Recon!!!


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## Serapis (Feb 13, 2011)

Hi C4C! 

Please do me a favor buddy, and keep any pictures you'd like to share with us in this thread related to BF TD please. I certainly appreciate your enthusiasm in wanting to share your grow, but that would be best done in your own thread, then you could receive feedback and stuff. Some people consider what you have done in your post as 'hijacking' a thread. If you see this and don't mind, please edit the post to remove the 13 or so photos.

I appreciate your understanding and hope you'll stay with us as we grow TD.


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## CombatVeterans 4 Cannabis (Feb 13, 2011)

sorry guy, yeah i am a lil excited. i fixed the post and i see what your saying. ive been smoking for 18 yrs and im 32. besides 6yrs in the army. and this is my 1st grow so yeah i feel free for once and excited... so i apologize for "hijacking your thread" not my intention...good luck with your grow and +rep!!!
Combat Veterans for Cannabis


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## Serapis (Feb 13, 2011)

You are awesome! Thanks for serving and welcome back to civy life. Glad to have you here on RIU!!


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## tendran (Feb 13, 2011)

Can't wait to see this grow take off. I'm assembling a diy ebb and flow right now. Are you using that bucket cloner again for rooting? I asked in your other post (though maybe it go overlooked as it was the last post on a page), but is it doing the job rooting? Is that the system you just mentioned that isn't feeding the plants properly?

I was about to recreate that sprinkler head concept in a coleman cooler to put 2 mother plants into, but if it has problems feeding than I'm not sure that'd be ideal! Hopefully the drip stakes I got as a backup plan will work better.


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## Serapis (Feb 13, 2011)

Sorry, I thought I answered it. The fogger created roots, but I think the pump got here too late to start aero feeding, so they suffered some deficiency. I haven't said anything in this thread to reference the other because I don't want to have cross chat like this, because it will only confuse a reader who has never seen my other journal. If you could ask your question again in the other thread I'd love to answer it in a lot more detail there.


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## Serapis (Feb 13, 2011)

*UPDATE:

*53 hours:

No activity since the last report. Feelings range from slight frustration to amusement....


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## JimBro (Feb 13, 2011)

Yeah, I'd like to change my guess from 5 to 0. Can I do that? Just kidding. My TD that did pop is growing, but doing so verrryyy slowly. I just popped her to try and grow a mom under flouros so I'm not concerned with growth rate. Anyway, moral of the story is...well, there ain't no moral, but don't count out the TDs yet.

Do I understand you correctly: do you keep your seeds in water until they crack open? No paper towel? I've only soaked mine a max 24hrs. Maybe that's why some didn't crack. Didn't soak long enough.


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## Serapis (Feb 13, 2011)

I've read the 24 hour rule, but to be honest, I've done some research outside of RIU forums and have determined that people soak all kind of seeds for however long it takes. After 72 hours though, I just may have to do something else. This is one of the things about this batch of seeds.... Those of us that rushed to buy the cup winner are all having some issues with the seeds. I know they eventually do open up, but wow, this wait is something else...



JimBro said:


> Yeah, I'd like to change my guess from 5 to 0. Can I do that? Just kidding. My TD that did pop is growing, but doing so verrryyy slowly. I just popped her to try and grow a mom under flouros so I'm not concerned with growth rate. Anyway, moral of the story is...well, there ain't no moral, but don't count out the TDs yet.
> 
> Do I understand you correctly: do you keep your seeds in water until they crack open? No paper towel? I've only soaked mine a max 24hrs. Maybe that's why some didn't crack. Didn't soak long enough.


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## tricka (Feb 13, 2011)

Hey there Serapis im Sub'd and along for the journey as well, i really enjoy the way you write!! i love to learn and help and follow others, after years of outdoor and soil im doing my first indoor ebb+flow and im interested as hell

im from australia by the way


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## JimBro (Feb 13, 2011)

Makes sense. I wish I had left past seeds that didn't crack for me soaking longer. 

The cup winner and a strain Barney's claims a minimum 25% THC. Guess no one can prove that claim wrong if we can't get their damn seeds to crack!



tricka said:


> im from australia by the way


Really? I would have never guessed...what, with the bongaroo and all. Sorry about Steve Irwin. That dude was the shit.


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## tricka (Feb 13, 2011)

JimBro said:


> Makes sense. I wish I had left past seeds that didn't crack for me soaking longer.
> 
> The cup winner and a strain Barney's claims a minimum 25% THC. Guess no one can prove that claim wrong if we can't get their damn seeds to crack!
> 
> ...


Oh yeah i only changed that a couple of days ago.....so it works 
im still laughing!


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## Hob10 (Feb 14, 2011)

Hi all

just my 2 cents I soak my seeds distilled water ph 6.3 for 24 hours, if the seeds sink to the bottom they are ready, however some time all of them don't sink due to the shell is to hard form to much heat and or are old, all so one of the hings i have seen is the shape of the seeds, it all so appears if the hole on the seed dose not set in the water it is harder for the seed to soak up the water, one of the thing's i have tryed is i made a small bag screen cloth put my seeds and a small stone so they sink to the bottom then the hole seed is submersed in the water for 24 hours then on to the paper towels, all so temp is real important i personally use 80 degrees it seems hot, but seed bust a nut out of the shell just my two cents.


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## Serapis (Feb 14, 2011)

When a seed sinks, it means the seed is viable, however, most people that use the soak method let the bean soak until it has a 1/4 inch tap root showing. I have read about people switching from a soak to paper towels after 24 hours, but I only see that on MJ forums. If you scout about other grow sites that do veggies and stuff, they do the soak method just to skim the bad seeds from the top of the water.

As for temp, the jigger has been sitting on top of my seedling mat. It's not hot, it's just a bit warmer than the air that's 74. I just took them off the mat, in case the strain likes a cooler germination. I may have to take a closer look at the genetics in the morning.


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## Serapis (Feb 14, 2011)

Hi, glad to have ya here Bongaroo!!  I had several friends from Aussieland when I played Eve Online and joined a corporation. You mates are cool with me!.



tricka said:


> Hey there Serapis im Sub'd and along for the journey as well, i really enjoy the way you write!! i love to learn and help and follow others, after years of outdoor and soil im doing my first indoor ebb+flow and im interested as hell
> 
> im from australia by the way


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## tricka (Feb 14, 2011)

my pleasure, btw i grow for taste and for my connisuer traits.....how do you find your bubbleicious, im more of an indica man but i love to have my sativa highs as well


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## Serapis (Feb 14, 2011)

I love Bubblelicious from Nirvana. It's easy to grow and it is LOADED with THC. The buzz is very lethargic. It is couch lock dumb. If you med then go shopping in a Lowes without a list, your going to have a lot of brain dull moments on it. That is why I'm switching over to something like BFTD. I like sativa like buzzes too. I find them to help my creativity when writing and they just perk me up. I have an anxiety disorder, so I have to be wary of which strains I administer.  



tricka said:


> my pleasure, btw i grow for taste and for my connisuer traits.....how do you find your bubbleicious, im more of an indica man but i love to have my sativa highs as well


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## tricka (Feb 14, 2011)

Serapis said:


> I love Bubblelicious from Nirvana. It's easy to grow and it is LOADED with THC. The buzz is very lethargic. It is couch lock dumb. If you med then go shopping in a Lowes without a list, your going to have a lot of brain dull moments on it. That is why I'm switching over to something like BFTD. I like sativa like buzzes too. I find them to help my creativity when writing and they just perk me up. I have an anxiety disorder, so I have to be wary of which strains I administer.


ahh yes the BFTG im sub'd on that grow too  
i get excited about strain reviews so rep to you! i love to cough lock till my eyes water, sometimes i just wake up, toke, wake up, toke cough drink sleep some more and toke again, ahahaha
sometimes i am a dull moment  
we have bunnings here in Oz for those times!


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## Serapis (Feb 15, 2011)

It has just officially passed 3.5 days of soak time. Something is happening, it appears that two of the seeds have cracked, but no tap root is visible as of yet. I'll start watching every other hour or two. I certainly hope to be able to get some of these in their cubes today. While the wait seems extreme, we all share in this hobby together and realize that patience is key. Without it, one will never achieve happiness in a marijuana garden.


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## tricka (Feb 15, 2011)

Great out look on the patience game Serapis! great things come to those who can patiently wait


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## Serapis (Feb 15, 2011)

*UPDATE:*

We have the first seed to give me root. I was so excited, I had it in a Grodan cube an in the damn propagator before I thought to take the first picture. At 3 days and 21 hours, we have our first TD seed with a tap root. It was more like 1/16th an inch sticking out, but that was enough for me. After 3 days of soaking, I'm not trying to drown the guys.

I'm keeping extra viligence on these remaining 4 seeds. I'm also crossing my fingers for the first one. I'll be naming them in hurricane season fashion, in alphabetical order. I'd like for everyone to please welcome Abbey into our midst. Please keep her in your thoughts and DREAMS.

OK, now we await the next tail....

til then....


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## zedragon (Feb 15, 2011)

Something tells me you won`t be waiting long for the rest, next few hours i bet....


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## mcgyversmoke (Feb 15, 2011)

took my TD 5 days to crack in a wet paper towel but 4 of 4 cracked, 1 never broke the soil and 1 is retarded lol. im entering the retard in the party cup grow contest lol.
and out of the 2 healthy ones i got a sativa dom and indica dom pheno's, one very spread skinny leaves the other they are fat and overlap. 
good luck man!!!


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## Serapis (Feb 15, 2011)

Thanks!! It appears as though I'll be planting a couple more seeds shortly... two more seem cracked and I see something emerging, but it is still inside the seed.



mcgyversmoke said:


> took my TD 5 days to crack in a wet paper towel but 4 of 4 cracked, 1 never broke the soil and 1 is retarded lol. im entering the retard in the party cup grow contest lol.
> and out of the 2 healthy ones i got a sativa dom and indica dom pheno's, one very spread skinny leaves the other they are fat and overlap.
> good luck man!!!


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## tricka (Feb 15, 2011)

Serapis said:


> Thanks!! It appears as though I'll be planting a couple more seeds shortly... two more seem cracked and I see something emerging, but it is still inside the seed.


Congrats.....now go bust out that camera


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## Serapis (Feb 15, 2011)

*Number 2 appears:

*We have another TD seed ready for a Grodan Rockwool cube. Since I only have one seed that's cracked enough to remove, I've cut off the tip of a pipette dropper and I use that to suck up the lucky seed.

View attachment 1443773

After picking up the seed, I gently place it in a Rockwool cube, right in the pre-drilled hole. If the seed doesn't come out with the water, just gently thump on the end of the pipette or use more water. It takes a few tries before you get over the nervousness and inject the seed and water simultaneously.

View attachment 1443781

View attachment 1443791 View attachment 1443787


I'd like to introduce everyone to Bonnie.​


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## tricka (Feb 15, 2011)

ahhhh Good'o......how's the hands, still shakey?? 
we all got our fingers crossed for ya


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## ldachosenonel (Feb 15, 2011)

What made you go from a waterfarm to an ebb and flow?


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## Serapis (Feb 15, 2011)

I still have water farms. I needed something to transition several plants from cutting stage to vegetation stage and the MicroGarden seems like the perfect answer. With 10 gallon res and a pump on a timer, I don't have to worry much about it. It can pretty much take care of itself, except for top offs. That was a big plus to me. 



ldachosenonel said:


> What made you go from a waterfarm to an ebb and flow?


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## ldachosenonel (Feb 15, 2011)

What would you recommend for a first time grower. I want to do a two tent set up for a perpetual harvest but im not sure if I want to go with stink buds aero system or al's 4 table ebb and flow. Both seem to have great success. Which ever one I choose will be after I grow one plant in a waterfarm first just to get the hang of things. The one thing I like with stinkbuds system over al's is that I wouldnt have to really trim plants what do you think serapis?


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## Serapis (Feb 15, 2011)

Everybody's grows are different. We all have different goals, requirements, environments, etc. While copying another method that has been successful usually assures us of success, that is not always the case. We have to evaluate variables and see if they fit our own circumstances, if not, adjustments need to be made. I can't tell you what method to pick; but i can suggest based on what I've tried, and I love the Waterfarm. It will remain my main indoor producer. Everything else I do is geared towards them, or growing outside.

Put together a list of pros and cons. Then go with your gut feeling.


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## ldachosenonel (Feb 15, 2011)

I love the waterfarm idea also it seems almost fail proof and it seems to have great success but I dont know how I could incorporate it into a two tent perpetual harvest Im trying to get a harvest every 2 or 3 weeks any ideas?


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## Serapis (Feb 15, 2011)

You would need at least 4 waterfarms to do that, and a way to raise clones. Every three weeks you move a new waterfarm into the flowering tent.


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## Serapis (Feb 16, 2011)

All 5 seeds are now in cubes. The seeds were soft and swollen after soaking nearly 4 days, so the remaining three are in cubes and in the nice tropical propagator which is on my seedling mat. I have each cube in a 2" net pot to keep it out of the PH'ed water, just enough so that only the bottoms are wicking up moisture as the cube needs it. This will also encourage the roots to follow the water, along with gravity of course. 

Once the seeds germinate, I'll remove the standing water and the dome and transition the seedlings to prepare them for the MicroGarden pots, which are 5.5" square. 

Please keep the plants in good thoughts and may good karma follow you around and touch those you care for.  I guess now we can chit chat about growing and BF and TD until we have germination. then we can do pics and start updates again.


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## tendran (Feb 16, 2011)

Maybe I will write a song that we can sing to our seedlings.. my jock horror is bent limp after I transplanted it to the new hydroponic getup and I think the power of song may be necessary to revive her. I'll also be starting another seed just in case she doesn't make it.. though it'll upset me to have it behind the skunks progress (since I want to keep them both on the same feeding schedule - unless I encounter resistance). I didn't bother placing my bet cause you already had a 5/5, but I have great faith in your technique by now. Haha


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## Serapis (Feb 16, 2011)

I got my fingers crossed for your lil girl!...

I put you down for 5... 



tendran said:


> Maybe I will write a song that we can sing to our seedlings.. my jock horror is bent limp after I transplanted it to the new hydroponic getup and I think the power of song may be necessary to revive her. I'll also be starting another seed just in case she doesn't make it.. though it'll upset me to have it behind the skunks progress (since I want to keep them both on the same feeding schedule - unless I encounter resistance). I didn't bother placing my bet cause you already had a 5/5, but I have great faith in your technique by now. Haha


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## NorthernLights#5 (Feb 16, 2011)

scribed for sure really wanna see how the dream turns out.. my prayers are with them


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## Serapis (Feb 17, 2011)

*Toys:*

Nothing new to report to you today regarding plants. I'm still awaiting a leaf. The new Microgarden and New Wave lights arrived, I thought I'd share some pics of those while we await plants.


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## tricka (Feb 17, 2011)

that waterfarm is crazy Serapis, i wish we had E+F tubs set up like that in Australia, i love the pre-cast channels and sunken fill and drain area's. not to mention the side cavity on the actuall res....very smart set up!! 
how heavy will it be with it filled with hydraton? mine is just comfortable on my back when i lift it but then again i gotta line up my drain and fill holes, i want to do a set up change so its more to the side like the waterfarm you have.
and does the bottom res have a seperate 'quick' drain valve somewhere? (like the one i made on mine)

i love the RO set up, that is very nice, i have a spare bathroom in the house but its the guest bathroom/shower and the misses wont allow me to deck it out 
...Do you /have you had any leaks with the water plumbing as yet?


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## Serapis (Feb 17, 2011)

The res on the micro garden is dry. No plants to put in it yet. It does have a quick drain. I need to buy two milk crates, get it lifted off of floor and affix some flex pipe to it. I won't need to lift it once I have it set up the way I want. The top tray will stay in place. I'll use plumbing and or the pump to drain the reservoir.

I made 25 gallons of RO water today. I'm happy to report it was 387 ppm going in, and 000 ppm coming out.


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## Raylan (Feb 17, 2011)

He already took my answer, but 5 out of 5 for sure.


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## Serapis (Feb 18, 2011)

It's been 7 days with these seeds so far, and I've yet to see anything, other than two seeds that cracked and started to send out a tap. This is a rather stubborn strain to germinate.


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## Grumpy Old Dreamer (Feb 18, 2011)

That's gotta be frustrating the shit out of you Serapis.
My two TDs are doing ok, one is near perfect and the other has a couple of blemishes on the first leaves but may sort itself out as it grows.


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## Serapis (Feb 18, 2011)

It certainly can be a frustrating experience, but I have no expectations. I wrote these seeds off when I started reading of all the problems people were having with this strain/batch.



Grumpy Old Dreamer said:


> That's gotta be frustrating the shit out of you Serapis.
> My two TDs are doing ok, one is near perfect and the other has a couple of blemishes on the first leaves but may sort itself out as it grows.


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## Beansly (Feb 19, 2011)

I cant beleive your only slightly frustrated to amused. You have the patience of a saint. You must be doing pretty good in the cash department as well considering all those cool hydroponic setup you got. I have to make all of mine... 
very nice setups. Best of luck on your grow.


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## Serapis (Feb 19, 2011)

Let's just say it isn't worth losing sleep and faith in God over. I knew from other stories around the net that it was likely these seeds were worthless. It was my intention to highlight the Attitude pledge with this thread.... Those bastards don't care if the 'souvenirs' germinate or not. On the other hand, Nirvana guarantees them. Contact Nirvana and tell them you had a 0% germ rate and they'll resend your beans...

We'll see with these, but I have my doubts...



Beansly said:


> I cant beleive your only slightly frustrated to amused. You have the patience of a saint. You must be doing pretty good in the cash department as well considering all those cool hydroponic setup you got. I have to make all of mine...
> very nice setups. Best of luck on your grow.


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## Beansly (Feb 19, 2011)

Serapis said:


> Let's just say it isn't worth losing sleep and faith in God over. I knew from other stories around the net that it was likely these seeds were worthless. It was my intention to highlight the Attitude pledge with this thread.... Those bastards don't care if the 'souvenirs' germinate or not. On the other hand, Nirvana guarantees them. Contact Nirvana and tell them you had a 0% germ rate and they'll resend your beans...
> 
> We'll see with these, but I have my doubts...


I thought that attitude would resend your beans if the didnt germ?


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## Alice42069 (Feb 19, 2011)

This is sweet guys. I just opened my package from attitude with 5 fem bf td and it came with 5 freebees. 3 from sweet seeds and 2 from female seeds. They are II diavolo fem autoflower, Northern light blue fem, and sugar black rose fem from sweet and the other 2 are xline fast nevilles(supposedly a 8 week flower neville haze) and a cross of white widow and big bud??? Also used the 420 10% code and opted for the coffee mug shipping. Go here in lest than 2 weeks and the mug was cool with a big cali connection picture on it. So the other seeds are a great bonus ,the autoflower for sure, i am so stoked to get the barney farms td!!!!! Like you said man the write up makes you drool and the thc said to be at a minimum 25% and the cbd at 1.8 this shit should blow our minds! Will try to keep up and post with ya'll but i make no promises lmfao i am kind of flighty. . .


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## Alice42069 (Feb 19, 2011)

so i dont grow from seed very much. Have been growing the same 2 strains i started with. Nirvana Bubblelicious and Aurora Indica and have been cloning them for a long time now. So if i soak tonight how long do ya'll suppose it will take for these bf td to get flowerable?? I seed under 6500k t5s, veg with 600w true mh from digitek, and flower with dual 600w hortilux super hps's. Everything is pretty well climate controlled with all air vented 6in blockbuster hoods. Medium is sunshine mix #4 in 3 gallon pots and we the full line of advanced nutrients nutes from start to finish. I hope like hell these guys flower in the 70 days advertised.


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## Serapis (Feb 19, 2011)

Start soaking tonight and you'll be ready by Spring.... ;p

I really don't know with this strain... I just don't know...

I also grow Bubblelicious and it rocks. I never had a problem out of several seeds now. I have a Bubble mother going and I should probably just go back to doing that. I also have a 5 pack of BF Van Kush that I'm wondering if it is any good. It came from the Tude, so like their UFO's, it's probably DOA... I have had one freebie germinate, the G13 PE. thats it. The Reserva Privada, junk... Dina Fem, junk..... They pick their freebies based on what shit they have lying around.


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## Alice42069 (Feb 19, 2011)

so i said those free seeds where sweet seeds but i am a stoner so there you go. They are actually from Delicious seeds. Hhahahaha


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## Serapis (Feb 19, 2011)

LOL, nope. You say the G word and they refuse to talk to you or respond to your email. Nirvana on the other hand will dispatch out replacements, pronto. Come to think of it, I'll never order the 'tude again. This was $60 blown.... not to mention the Tee- shirt I did not get... TWICE.... poor, shitty service... bad beans...



Beansly said:


> I thought that attitude would resend your beans if the didnt germ?


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## Alice42069 (Feb 19, 2011)

You know i bet thats true but i did get a church from greenhouse and that is no junk seed there but my cfl dropped and burnt it up. had a dina fem grapefruit and it was crushed when i got it looked like it was packed that way too but whatever i love the "tude"(lol) Yep the bubble is the shit i got two different phenos growing of the bubble one is light green tall with long skinny blades and the other is short and bushy with dark green short fat blades. The buds are more compact and finishing faster on the dark shorter plants so i think i will lose the other one next round and keep just the short guys. The Aurora is the best shit i have ever smoked. Everyone i let try it swears it must be mixed with hash or something. Also have Jorges diamonds starting will put one in flower next wed should be great smoke. But still cant wait for the td


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 19, 2011)

Hey Serapis! No way your growing TD too 


I got my seeds a few weeks ago.... I had odd germinations too... I did the paper towel in a plastic baggie method, on something warm...


Within 20 hours my first seed cracked, and by 48 hours I had 3 of 4 that had sprouted a tap root... The 4th, had cracked yet showed NO tap root.

I germinated the 5th, just to make sure I had enough plants. The 5th seed by 48 hours didn't crack, so I tossed it, by this time I had planted all 4 seeds. Including the one that had simply cracked but not shown tap root.


About 3.5 days later, they were through the soil and I hit them with the light of a 250w MH.

Now I just started Day 8 this morning, and they are looking pretty good.


I'm going to grow them out a bit more til they get properly rooted, then I'm transplanting straight to 3.5gal pots in FFOF. Then for flower I have a 250w hortilux super HPS 


I'm going to go snap a few pictures for you now... this strain smells AMAZING! I can rub my leaves, and for a minute smell the most amazing, TROPICAL, tangerine with fresh citrus undertones and god I can't even describe it 

The tangerine dreams seem to be some slightly unstable genetics... But it is still early! They are shaky to get on their feet, but I'm guessing once they are on their feet they will take off...


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 19, 2011)

Day 8 Barneys Farm Tangerine Dream

My prime plant.. It smells like a tangerine lollipop seriously! Sooo glad I got this strain now 






Interesting Indica Pheno?






Group shot







Just so you can see them in action


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## Serapis (Feb 19, 2011)

I hate you Verde...... 

Most people woulda tossed these seeds by now, I'm going to give them another chance. Monday, if the three that sank but never cracked open aren't showing, I'm going to split the cube in two and have a look see. Any still intact will get the dreaded, hated, stupid, paper towel method. (Sorry, I hate it. it is un-natural) If we don't have something happening by next Friday, this thread is dead..... and so is my Tangerine Dreams... As much as I love oranges and tangerines, I'll NEVER, EVER, NEVER order this strain again. It is far from stable and BF should be ashamed....


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## mane2008 (Feb 19, 2011)

Serapis said:


> I hate you Verde......
> 
> Most people woulda tossed these seeds by now, I'm going to give them another chance. Monday, if the three that sank but never cracked open aren't showing, I'm going to split the cube in two and have a look see. Any still intact will get the dreaded, hated, stupid, paper towel method. (Sorry, I hate it. it is un-natural) If we don't have something happening by next Friday, this thread is dead..... and so is my Tangerine Dreams... As much as I love oranges and tangerines, I'll NEVER, EVER, NEVER order this strain again. It is far from stable and BF should be ashamed....


I think we just got bad batches man... The sprouts I did get are doing great but 2/5 sprouts is still fuking bad. And you have none. I'm trying some TD beans again I hope you do some day too. Maybe they have it down pack now.


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## NorthernLights#5 (Feb 19, 2011)

damn man that sucks... but ive been haveing tons of issues with tude's seed hope you see something soon


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## Alice42069 (Feb 19, 2011)

hey guys dont give up yet. i dont know whats up but i have only had one seed ever not germ. lucky i guess. i have 5 weeks and 3 days til i need to move plants into flower again and am not sure if i should germ these now or wait til the next round and use some clones for the next round. Checked the calander and i will need something to flower on march 30th what do you guys think try and germ or wait one more round? And as far as bad genetics go i read that there are a few different phenotypes for this strain so they will act differently.


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## Alice42069 (Feb 19, 2011)

need to move into flower room on march 30th. Think i can germ these and make it to flower by then or should i just use some clones for then and wait til the next month for the td? we run a monthly harvest 6 plants a month. 6 in clone/seedling under t5. 6 in veg under digilux 600w mh air cooled. and 12 four weeks apart under 2 600w hortilux super hps. so if they wont make the 30th of march will have to wiat four more weeks but gotta do it right if thats what i need to do.


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## kidgraphix (Feb 19, 2011)

Sorry to hear you had some bad luck Serapis hope you get at least one sprout i see couple of my bros have stopped by (Mane and Verde ) i germed 2 of my five and got one sprout it is now on day 8 of flower. just took 2 cuttings for clones today an put them in the clone machine so i can at least have a couple more as Verde said the smell from the leaves is awesome especially now that she is flowering, the anticipation is brutal cant wait to see her get frosty
 these were taken yesterday morning as you can see she is very sativa dom and tropical looking


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## Serapis (Feb 20, 2011)

The pics you guys have posted look awesome. I do want to try the strain again someday, but I'm about done with BF for now. One more attempt for BF redemption... I just opened a five pack of fem Vanilla Kush. They are soaking now....we'll see.....

The TD are still in cubes.... double checked PH, it's fine, propagator temp is about 77. I'm thinking about putting these in a dome under the sun and get the heat up in there.... maybe thats what these seeds need, tropical heat to germinate... That would make since if the genetics pointed to the equator....


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 20, 2011)

Serapis said:


> I hate you Verde......
> 
> Most people woulda tossed these seeds by now, I'm going to give them another chance. Monday, if the three that sank but never cracked open aren't showing, I'm going to split the cube in two and have a look see. Any still intact will get the dreaded, hated, stupid, paper towel method. (Sorry, I hate it. it is un-natural) If we don't have something happening by next Friday, this thread is dead..... and so is my Tangerine Dreams... As much as I love oranges and tangerines, I'll NEVER, EVER, NEVER order this strain again. It is far from stable and BF should be ashamed....


Yeah man I'd definitely keep going!


I had a bean that had NO taproot by the time everyone elses taproot was an INCH...

Now the bean that I planted with no tap root is AHEAD of the ones that had taproots! You never know!


It's an amazing smelling strain from what I can tell. I smelled it and thought, THIS is why it won cannabis cup no doubt.

I agree they are very unstable though! I think they are just seriously picky.


I feel like your one of those people who doesn't fuck around with things, so I feel you on hating the genetics! but it really is a wonderful smell 

Perhaps if these don't work out, look for clones in the future? 

Just don't give up hope dude! There are people out there getting good results, and there are people getting bad results.. Think positive, these seeds took everyone a while to get going, don't give up so early


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## Serapis (Feb 20, 2011)

I haven't tossed the cubes yet. It's been 9 days though and things aren't looking good for them... Two were already cracked and the taps were coming out when I put them in cubes and those two at least should be showing now.... I have nothing from 5 seeds costing $60. Thanks Barney!! You tarnished your rep with these seeds....


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 20, 2011)

Hmmm I had my seeds on a warm surface the whole time germing

Temps were in the high 70's waiting for them to come through the soil.


Good luck on the VK, was interested in that strain but I'm probably staying away from barneys with all I'm hearing about them



Do you have any grow pics of other strains Serapis? I'd be interested to see what you can do 

For my next grow, I'm thinking GreenHouse: Super Lemon Haze... and Blueberry

Not sure what company to get the Blueberry from though, Dutch Passion? Any reccomendations serapis, as we wait for some seedling action?


My tangerine dreams are starting to perk up, they are back onto leaf production... the second set is really looking nice.

My first plant is REALLY starting to pull away from the pack. This leads me to believe there is really only like 1 _good_ phenotype but we will see....


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## Serapis (Feb 20, 2011)

Check out my Bubblelicous grow... link in sig. I love that strain!!

I have heard wonderful thingsd about the SLH, not sure about Blueberry, but I would prefer Nirvana if it were me. They have an excellent blackberry and blueberry strains.

I'll try Tangerine dream again, as I'm a sucker for oranges, but it will be awhile... I want to make sure I'm getting new shit... I just sent BF a long email regarding my disappointment in a strain that obviously wasn't ready for mass consumption. I'm hearing on average 1-2 seeds per five having life...


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 20, 2011)

Serapis said:


> Check out my Bubblelicous grow... link in sig. I love that strain!!
> 
> I have heard wonderful thingsd about the SLH, not sure about Blueberry, but I would prefer Nirvana if it were me. They have an excellent blackberry and blueberry strains.
> 
> I'll try Tangerine dream again, as I'm a sucker for oranges, but it will be awhile... I want to make sure I'm getting new shit... I just sent BF a long email regarding my disappointment in a strain that obviously wasn't ready for mass consumption. I'm hearing on average 1-2 seeds per five having life...


Yeah I'm hearing the same thing, or _none_ in your case which is bullshit! At 1/5 it becomes a $60 seed/plant. At 0/5 it's like stealing your money.

I guess I'm lucky to have 4/5 :\ However, I ordered those rather recently. Jan. 28th I placed my order..

You should do the paper towel method next to try though... I know it's un-natural... but it's just moist fiber. I have also heard of people using wash clothes/hankies in jars.... that would be a more 'natural' way to germ your seeds, with the same _idea_ as the paper towel method.

I've never tried the sitting in water method though... I like the paper towel because they don't rot, or actually sit in water... but they are completely surrounded by moisture, and they are absorbing it as fast as they can



Tangerine Dream Day 9:


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## eyecandi (Feb 20, 2011)

cracked mine overnite (with some lemon skunk, PExp. and Corleone Kush) with pre-soak, placed em in cubes today and into the humidome @ 79deg with heat mat. I really hope they do something. BFs Red Diesel was some of the stinkiest weed I've worked with .... so pungent I had a hard time working around them in the garden (most girls are pleasant to be around, I really did not like working around Red D because of the smell, but it produces a kick ass product. hoping for a little of the same since my RD mom decided to die 2 weeks ago. 

I feel for you Serapis, the cost of seeds ... anticipation of arrival .... anticipation of the grow .... then failure and dissapointment. time lost. wasted emotions. sucks


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## Serapis (Feb 20, 2011)

Thanks for the words, I appreciate the thoughts behind them.


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## kidgraphix (Feb 20, 2011)

Keep the faith Serapis give them at least 14 days.I would strongly recommend finding a different germination medium I hate rockwool because of the fine structure which can kill the taproot which are sensitive to any kind of trauma i had to learn this the hard way doing outdoor grows the best way is to just find a soft organic media you can incorporate into your grow. I wrote BF also expressing my disappointment in results and all the neg reviews lets hope they actually respond and make an effort to make it right !! we all know the Tude aint goin to do crap unless you bullshit them and say they were crushed in shipping.


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## Alice42069 (Feb 20, 2011)

Hey guys i am going to have to wait on my td seeds til next month. I have read alot about blueberry and would recommend dutch passion hands down. I hope my luck is better with my 5 seeds. i did soak and papertowel the diavolo ll fem autoflower freebee i got with the bf from the tude. says it will harvest in 7 weeks from sprouting under 24 hours of light!!! Veg room bonus buds muuuuuhahahhahaha


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## Serapis (Feb 21, 2011)

Even if you lie and say the dead seeds were crushed, their new tactic is to require you to_ mail them back_. I don't know about you, but I for one, am not going to put my name and address in or on a package with a controlled substance and mail it to a foreign country. Are they fucking nuts? No, they are fucking smart, because they KNOW that few if any people are crazy enough to risk a *felony *over some bad seeds. That, along with the fucked up shipping charges and jacked _stealth _charges, have convinced me to never order from Attitude again. They still owe me a tee-shirt and now they owe me $60 for dead seeds that they should easily be able to charge back to Barney's...

I also wrote Barney's a long letter, letting them know of my disappointment. I also suggested that they either get a quality control person or fire the one they have now. It doesn't take a genius to realize a batch of seed has issues.... Now it's all over the internet and some people like myself are over it. I'm not angry or upset, I'm just done. Since I have the room in the propagator, the cubes remain until the end of the week. Come Saturday, no life, no space....



kidgraphix said:


> Keep the faith Serapis give them at least 14 days.I would strongly recommend finding a different germination medium I hate rockwool because of the fine structure which can kill the taproot which are sensitive to any kind of trauma i had to learn this the hard way doing outdoor grows the best way is to just find a soft organic media you can incorporate into your grow. I wrote BF also expressing my disappointment in results and all the neg reviews lets hope they actually respond and make an effort to make it right !! we all know the Tude aint goin to do crap unless you bullshit them and say they were crushed in shipping.


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## OldGrowth420 (Feb 21, 2011)

You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes.... You get what you need.


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## Serapis (Feb 21, 2011)

Wow that was inspiring. Did you come up with it on your lonesome? 



OldGrowth420 said:


> You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes.... You get what you need.


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## Serapis (Feb 21, 2011)

About 12 hours into my Vanilla Kush soak and 4 of the beans have popped and are in Rockwool now. I'm a bit relieved after waiting ten days for some signs of life from the TD seeds.... ;p


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## Justin00 (Feb 21, 2011)

i have 5 BF TD seeds in my drawer i got a few days ago i haven't tried germing yet and frankly im scared =(. im super excited about the strain but it seems like almost no one is having any luck with it.


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## Serapis (Feb 21, 2011)

I had purchased mine to use down the road as well, but after hearing so many bad things, I decided to try germing them now... sure enough, I got duds as well.... thanks BF and tude...



Justin00 said:


> i have 5 BF TD seeds in my drawer i got a few days ago i haven't tried germing yet and frankly im scared =(. im super excited about the strain but it seems like almost no one is having any luck with it.


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## cannabisguru (Feb 21, 2011)

I don't know whats up.. but if I were you bro I would try talking with Attitude. Just MO.

and good luck with it.. maybe dude over there will give you a break and resend a new batch.

peace.


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## OldGrowth420 (Feb 21, 2011)

Serapis said:


> Wow that was inspiring. Did you come up with it on your lonesome?


LOL credit goes to the stones.. didn't think that one needed a quote 

Namaste


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## Serapis (Feb 21, 2011)

cannabisguru said:


> I don't know whats up.. but if I were you bro I would try talking with Attitude. Just MO.
> 
> and good luck with it.. maybe dude over there will give you a break and resend a new batch.
> 
> peace.


You've never dealt with Attitude or read their terms of service....



OldGrowth420 said:


> LOL credit goes to the stones.. didn't think that one needed a quote
> 
> Namaste


I know who sang the song, lol, I was wondering what it was doing in the thread. As a closing statement, it woulda been fine, but to just drop in and say something like "too bad, so sad" and leave seemed kinda rude. I was just wondering what, if anything, you were contributing to the discussion at hand....


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## OldGrowth420 (Feb 21, 2011)

I'm trying to say, it's just how it is. Go with the flow. Today is a new day life is short put a smile on yo face! At tis time i think thats the best thing to contribute


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## Serapis (Feb 21, 2011)

Thanks, but that was my attitude going into this grow. I didn't care one way or the other. I stated that at the beginning of the thread. I knew the seeds were crap just from other reports. But I appreciate your attempt to blow sunshine up my ass. 



OldGrowth420 said:


> I'm trying to say, it's just how it is. Go with the flow. Today is a new day life is short put a smile on yo face! At tis time i think thats the best thing to contribute


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 21, 2011)

Serapis said:


> About 12 hours into my Vanilla Kush soak and 4 of the beans have popped and are in Rockwool now. I'm a bit relieved after waiting ten days for some signs of life from the TD seeds.... ;p


Great news!

I'm sort of interested in the Vanilla Kush. But, barneys farm you know  

I'm honestly interested: What was your reasoning for the vanilla kush, what did you hear about it?


Serapis, too bad you don't use PM's I've been keeping a few people updated like every week-2 with the messages


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## mane2008 (Feb 21, 2011)

Glad to hear about the Vanilla Kush. I think you'll like it, I have some jarred up. I have this one pheno thats nice and low odor, and a fairly easy grow, nice pistil to leaf ratio. With some fine tuning def. can be a reg thing for me. I hope for. you too

It does look like a 70day strain though and not the recc. 60-65


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## Serapis (Feb 21, 2011)

mane2008 said:


> Glad to hear about the Vanilla Kush. I think you'll like it, I have some jarred up. I have this one pheno thats nice and low odor, and a fairly easy grow, nice pistil to leaf ratio. With some fine tuning def. can be a reg thing for me. I hope for. you too
> 
> It does look like a 70day strain though and not the recc. 60-65


Thanks for the heads up on that longer photo period!  I heard good things about this kush.



Sr. Verde said:


> Great news!
> 
> I'm sort of interested in the Vanilla Kush. But, barneys farm you know
> 
> ...


I had to turn PMs off because I was getting overwhelmed with requests for help. I don't mind browsing around and helping with what i know, but I can't diagnose every problem with insects, nutes, environment, etc that some people think I can. I know my basics, a little advanced stuff, and that's it. I'm here to learn too and the PMs were just taking up too much of my fun time on RIU.

The Vanilla Kush came in 2nd in the 2009 Cannabis Cup. It is highly prized for it's hints of lavender and vanilla. It is a beautiful indica dominant species that packs a punch. This strain is good for pain relief and relief from anxiety and stress. It is a favorite Kush of many. That is what i heard. I actually bought the seeds before I learned of the problems with TD. I'm glad I did, or otherwise, I might have never tried these seeds.

If i could change the title of the thread, I would, lol.... but who knows, maybe these seeds are just waiting on a new union contract.... I'm giving em 4 more days to show me something.


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 21, 2011)

Serapis said:


> Thanks for the heads up on that longer photo period!  I heard good things about this kush.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 yeah i feel you

You project that image of all knowing which is why I'm sure the newbies flock to you


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## kidgraphix (Feb 21, 2011)

Well Serapis hate hear about the TD but you arent alone there plenty of growers got ripped by the tude we should actually unite and start a boycott against them get the message across that they still need to be reputable and just because we are inconvenienced by ignorant laws doesnt mean they can rip people off. Time for them to rememer that without us they have no business or future classic case of getting to big and full of themselves. On another note i am glad i decided to take some cuttings and cloned the TD hope i get them to take so i can keep one going as a mother plant.If it were possible i would offer you a couple clones just a kind gesture I know but the thought counts if i ever invest in a tissue culture kit who knows.I sincerely want to stick it to the tude though give them a taste of real "attitude"


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## Serapis (Feb 21, 2011)

Thanks for the responses.... It's all good.... it's karma, it will bite them.


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## Alice42069 (Feb 21, 2011)

Hey just ondering. I watched for the TD to finally go on sale and when they did i was broke and by the time i was ready to order seeds they were sold out. So i got some jorges diamonds #1 dutch passion. Anyways just a couple weeks ago i saw that they were back at the tude. So my question is did maybe the first batch have problems and get pulled and later replaced. I really really really hope so am so pissed to see all the bad reviews after being so stoked to get these seeds. Will germ one and see if it goes.


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 21, 2011)

alice like I said i ordered jan 28th and had 4/5 germ rate doing good so far


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## Alice42069 (Feb 21, 2011)

yep saw that verde but do you think there might be a new batch and an old shitty one


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## Grumpy Old Dreamer (Feb 21, 2011)

I only buy from Seedsman.com and they missed out on the first batch of seeds.
When they finally got some they only had packs of 10 so I waited until they got some 5 packs, so I definitely didn't get the first batch to hit the market.
I've got 2 seedlings out of 2 so far, one took 3 days to crack, the other under 2.
I think that the first batch may have been dodgy - and someone probably got an ass-kicking as it has seriously impacted on the demand for the seeds for the "cup winning" strain.
A lot of money was wasted in winning the cup only to send out dodgy seeds.


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## Alice42069 (Feb 22, 2011)

thats what i am counting on. I have had a very high germ rate so far on everything ive tried. I dont want to pat my own back but if i cant get these to grow i wont ever buy another bf product. There are far to many great breeders with awesome genetics to waste time and money on garbage. I love nirvana and dutch passion myself.


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## faithfulmastiff (Feb 22, 2011)

Hi guys n gals, newbie on here, you have me kinda paniking now, i ordered 5 fem TD from BF, i'm wondering if i made the right choice, fingers crossed, & after reading all the coments on whether to soak in towels or water, now i'm all confused what method to try ..lol

keep up the the good work & keep sending the love.

Peace.


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## Serapis (Feb 22, 2011)

Good luck with those seeds..... After my spanking, I'll probably never buy Barney's Farm again, unless Nirvana carries them. At least they guarantee germination, unlike the 'Tude that acts like 'germinate' is a four letter word... Regardless of what their disclaimer says, they know, DAMN well, that the majority of their seeds are being germinated, not stored away for years while we wait for changes in the law. That legal disclaimer is pathetic, it shields them from responsibility of the product the peddle.


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## Serapis (Feb 22, 2011)

LOL, all 5 of my vanilla Kush seeds cracked.... Just waiting to see some leaves now.


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## cannabisguru (Feb 22, 2011)

Serapis said:


> You've never dealt with Attitude or read their terms of service....
> 
> 
> 
> I know who sang the song, lol, I was wondering what it was doing in the thread. As a closing statement, it woulda been fine, but to just drop in and say something like "too bad, so sad" and leave seemed kinda rude. I was just wondering what, if anything, you were contributing to the discussion at hand....



The hell? Don't even know me.. sir.  Secondly.. yes, I have indeed 'dealt' with Attitude. 

good luck though..


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## Serapis (Feb 22, 2011)

If you have dealt with Attitude in the past (I believe you have), then you know that their policy is that they only sell the seeds as souvenirs and do not guarantee their germination rate either. Anyone that contacts Attitude with a germination rate issue is shunned. You know that. They are also now requiring 'crushed' seeds to be returned. So your suggestion that I try to talk to Attitude was not very helpful.

As to the second part of the quote, you lifted that from a response that was, I thought, clearly directed at the dude quoting the Rolling Stones tune, not you. 



cannabisguru said:


> The hell? Don't even know me.. sir. Secondly.. yes, I have indeed 'dealt' with Attitude.
> 
> good luck though..


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## Alice42069 (Feb 22, 2011)

well there is a big difference between the tude and nirvana. Nirvana is a breeder they dont sell other peoples seeds they make their own strains. The tude is just a dealer not a breeder they sell whatever they can make a buck on. just sayin


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## Serapis (Feb 23, 2011)

Wal*mart doesn't manufacture video games, but if one is bought and doesn't work, they'll replace it and charge back the vendor or supplier. Attitude could just as easily replace bad beans, especially when there are threads all over the internet about the quality issues of these seeds. Just as you have the right to defend Attitude's practices, I have a right to not shop there. I also have the right to be able to post about my bad experience and being ripped off for $60.

I know that the Tude is only a reseller.... Thanks for the education. They should still be concerned with the quality of what they are selling and be willing to right a bad deal to prevent the loss of customers. I'm no big time seed buyer, but I have spent hundreds of dollars with them on several orders. I don't blame them for Barney's issues with quality, I blame the Tude for not standing behind what they sell.



Alice42069 said:


> well there is a big difference between the tude and nirvana. Nirvana is a breeder they dont sell other peoples seeds they make their own strains. The tude is just a dealer not a breeder they sell whatever they can make a buck on. just sayin


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## JimBro (Feb 23, 2011)

Serapis said:


> Wal*mart doesn't manufacture video games, but if one is bought and doesn't work, they'll replace it and charge back the vendor or supplier. Attitude could just as easily replace bad beans, especially when there are threads all over the internet about the quality issues of these seeds. Just as you have the right to defend Attitude's practices, I have a right to not shop there. I also have the right to be able to post about my bad experience and being ripped off for $60.
> 
> I know that the Tude is only a reseller.... Thanks for the education. They should still be concerned with the quality of what they are selling and be willing to right a bad deal to prevent the loss of customers. I'm no big time seed buyer, but I have spent hundreds of dollars with them on several orders. I don't blame them for Barney's issues with quality, I blame the Tude for not standing behind what they sell.


I admit the system is flawed, and I'm not trying to defend the Attitude by any stretch, but seeds are a bit different than a production item like video games. Obviously, you know what you're doing, but some jack leg that buys seeds and tries to germ them in rubbing alcohol or something stupid might claim they got bad seeds. How can it be proven that the seeds are bad and not the grower? People are stupid. I read a review on a pH kit where the guy gave them one star because he said putting the tiniest of drops of UP in the test bottle would raise the pH significantly. The jackass was trying to adjust the pH in the test bottle, not the source. I do think they could at least do you like before with the shirt and say 'on your next order we'll give you a discount' kind of deal. Something. In the end, they know we have no recourse. I saw on Cops once where a girl called the police because she got scammed trying to buy crack. It did not end well for her.


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## Grumpy Old Dreamer (Feb 23, 2011)

What Attitude does regarding their sales of dodgy seeds reflects their "attitude" towards their customers. 
Presumably they do monitor the number of complaints that they get and, presumably they know which seeds are attracting more than the "normal" number of complaints.
They choose to respond exactly how they respond, and customers will also choose how to respond to the lack of support.

Luckily we have open forums where our experiences with seed vendors can be shared. I haven't bought from Attitude and I am very unlikely to change from my supplier.

Attitude don't offer anything special, except a wide choice of genetics ... and none of the genetics are theirs. Each and every strain that Attitude sells can be found elsewhere, often from vendors that care about building and maintaining a loyal customer base.
I would rather pay a dollar or two extra and deal with a vendor that will listen to (and act on) complaints from multiple growers.

It doesn't take much for a good reputation to be ruined, and Attitudes reputation is definitely looking dodgy.


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## bestbuds09 (Feb 24, 2011)

sorry to hear about the td from barneys serapis. I guess I'm going to stay away from that one. And as far as the tude sending bad seeds, imo I guess it happens to all of us that have ordered before sooner or later. So far I from all the orders/seeds I've bought from tude I have only had one that did not sprout. Same thing with barneys seeds, I'm a fan of their seeds, and my last batch I had twoo bluecheese with excellent result and before that I had one lsd and 6 red dragons with excellent results as well. I guess shit happens bro. And stay away from barneys td for sure. And good luck with the ne girls bro. Be positve......


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## Alice42069 (Feb 24, 2011)

very well said. i wasnt triing to defend the tude just sayin. As far as them not backing what they sell that sucks. They sell sooooo many breeders it has to be a nightmare over there. Good luck. As far as my seeds go i started to panic over all the bad talk so i started one seed. Soaked it for over 24 hours and its been in papertowels for just over another 24 and no sign of life. . .Shit


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## weedlingsprout (Feb 24, 2011)

I just want to add a note in Attitudes favour. 
Ive never had a problem with any of their seeds germinating.
The only problems I encountered was down to me due to my lack of knowledge and impatience being a novice grower.
In my opinion their customer service has been exceptional. I had a delivery that went astray and as soon as they had confirmation to clarify this they sent out a duplicate order with complimentary seeds.
The attacted photos are all seeds bought from Attitude, 10 x's Barneys farm Vanilla kush and tangerine dream, and white widow big buds 
I put them on a paper towel on Saturday the 5th Feb in the airing cuboard, and they all poped and sprouted a tap root over 1cm by the Monday.
Here they are 2 weeks on.







Out of the 10 Tangerine Dreams that have germinated, I have only one that is showing a strange formation of leaf as shown in the next pic. I will persevere and veg her to see what she brings.







The last pic is from my grow in week 6 of flower, hopefully be cutting down in 2 weeks time. Again all seeds bought from the good old Attitude.


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## Serapis (Feb 24, 2011)

I've gotten good seeds from Attitude as well. I never stated their seeds were crap. There is obviously a problem when so many growers are reporting non-germination, or bad ratios altogether. I'm glad your seeds sprouted. In the picture, they look sickly and pale compared to the ones behind them. I wish you luck. All of the rest of us noobs that can't germinate BF TD seeds from the first batch sold to public, bow down to you.  Surely it is all of us and not bad seeds....


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## Serapis (Feb 25, 2011)

Removed seeds from Rockwool today.... in two weeks, seeds hadn't done a thing..... they are dead....


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## tricka (Feb 25, 2011)

I'm packing a 1/4 G bowl for you, out of compassion for the roller coaster of emotions you rode for those 14 days....




yeah in fact that is most fustrating, great breeder and red tape involving legalities....here I'll smoke it for you


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## Serapis (Feb 25, 2011)

One seed had a brown tap, the others hadn't opened at all and they are now in peat pellets. Why? I dunno, they are whole and they sink, one more try...


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## OldGrowth420 (Feb 25, 2011)

Glad you at least got some beauties growinnn, let us know when they pop up.. great thread for no action.

Weedling sprout, your obviously an attitude spokesperson or something. glad to see you made an account (1post so far) just to rep attitude.

Now off with you! We know the truth! Plus we support small biz anyway.. Let the poor entrepreneur get a piece too!


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## tricka (Feb 25, 2011)

what exact climate have have you prepared for them?

temps day/night:
humidity d/n:
lights on y/n:
moisture content of rockwool/pellets (ie: 1/4, double they're weight):
ph/ec of water used/using:


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## JimBro (Feb 25, 2011)

Serapis said:


> Removed seeds from Rockwool today.... in two weeks, seeds hadn't done a thing..... they are dead....


 This fucking blows. I was looking forward to this grow. What strain are you looking at to replace?


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## sumlykos (Feb 25, 2011)

hey guys just a litte tip here. Only 3 out of 5 TD seeds germed. Was told by a pro to run a lite grit sandpaper across them. worked like a charm the other 2 opened 24 hr later


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## tricka (Feb 25, 2011)

sumlykos said:


> hey guys just a litte tip here. Only 3 out of 5 TD seeds germed. Was told by a pro to run a lite grit sandpaper across them. worked like a charm the other 2
> opened 24 hr later


Sumlykos I guess you mean the leading edge of the two halves where the tip of the tap will break through, surely rubbing the side has no effect? i am just wondering as to a genetic fail in where the first lots of BF's seed were likely to be slightly fused' together, then yes this 'pro tip' would make sence


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## Serapis (Feb 25, 2011)

After reading Jorge Cervantes Grow guide again on the seed section, I'm giving these guys a second chance. Apparently, some difficult strains can take a month or more to germinate. I've never experienced that til now.... 

Tricka, Some of the environmental elements are non starters for germination, such as humidity day/night. The humidity remains high in a propagation tray/dome setup. I've tried t answer your questions. I know you mean well, but it's not anything I'm doing. The seeds are a bitch to work with and there are plenty of threads and internet posts to show so.


*temps day/night: 78 (Heat mat)
humidity d/n: 60-90%, depending on if cover on or off
lights on y/n: yes (I've tried covering individual cubes with solo cups, no avail)
moisture content of rockwool/pellets (ie: 1/4, double they're weight): Soaked until they can hold no more, than gently squeezed to remove about half or more of water. They are not sopping wet, they are not dry.
ph/ec of water used/using: *7.0


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## sumlykos (Feb 25, 2011)

Yes sorry the tip not just anywhere on the seed. Thats exactly what she said because they are sometimes slightly fused together. Not sure about other seeds but definitly TD.


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## Alice42069 (Feb 25, 2011)

i have read all the grow books and do recall a part where the grower put a piece of sandpaper in a matchbox then put the seeds in and shook the crap out of it. that way it is easier for them to uptake water. duh i am going to have to do that to my dud. good call sumlykos


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## tricka (Feb 25, 2011)

Serapis said:


> After reading Jorge Cervantes Grow guide again on the seed section, I'm giving these guys a second chance. Apparently, some difficult strains can take a month or more to germinate. I've never experienced that til now....
> 
> Tricka, Some of the environmental elements are non starters for germination, such as humidity day/night. The humidity remains high in a propagation tray/dome setup. I've tried t answer your questions. I know you mean well, but it's not anything I'm doing. The seeds are a bitch to work with and there are plenty of threads and internet posts to show so.
> 
> ...


Thanks Sep, i know i couldnt have helped you, but i was just trying to get a grasp on your climate for them, some people use heat mats (radiant heat) some use Climate control (convection) i also hear lights off is better?


sumlykos said:


> Yes sorry the tip not just anywhere on the seed. Thats exactly what she said because they are sometimes slightly fused together. Not sure about other seeds but definitly TD.


Thort so Cheers


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## Serapis (Feb 25, 2011)

Because my nursery also houses my Bubblelicious mom plant and some clones, I don't turn the lights off. I do cover the trays with Glad Ovenware casserole trays which are black. I'm not sure how the plant below in a cube is supposed to know if it is light out or not before it sprouts, but i have read in the Nirvana guide to keep them in the dark until they sprout.



tricka said:


> Thanks Sep, i know i couldnt have helped you, but i was just trying to get a grasp on your climate for them, some people use heat mats (radiant heat) some use Climate control (convection) i also hear lights off is better?
> 
> Thort so Cheers


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## eyecandi (Feb 25, 2011)

sumlykos said:


> hey guys just a litte tip here. Only 3 out of 5 TD seeds germed. Was told by a pro to run a lite grit sandpaper across them. worked like a charm the other 2 opened 24 hr later


 
the sandpaper is to scarify the seed. some seeds have a tougher exterior waxy coating, this is to protect the seed in the wild, but it also takes longer for water to penetrate the shell to begin germination. there are 2 thoughts/methods I'm aware of to scarify, both use 300+grit - (1) just lightly rubbing the shell anywhere, this gets germination going within 24hrs for most varieties. (2) a light rub along the seam if the shell casings 'welded', are needed for some (I've only had to do this for one variety years ago)

either way, I scarify 100% of my seeds and seem to get pretty good ratios. still waiting to see if my TD pop though - scarified/pre-soaked last weekend .... dropped em into cubes and still nada. 3 other strains from the same order started popping. =\ I'll keep em going too until they do something or I get pissed and chuck em


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## Serapis (Feb 25, 2011)

Sorry to hear that you too may have gotten bad seeds. A piece of emery board stuck into a matchbox is sufficient to scarify seeds. Shake for approximately 30 seconds.


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## weedlingsprout (Feb 25, 2011)

OldGrowth420 said:


> Weedling sprout, your obviously an attitude spokesperson or something. glad to see you made an account (1post so far) just to rep attitude.
> 
> Now off with you! We know the truth! Plus we support small biz anyway.. Let the poor entrepreneur get a piece too!


Im no rep for Attitude, im just giving credit where credit is due. I didnt realise that this thread was only aloud to contain negative feedback. 
As for my first post, I was browsing through various threads and saw this as this is the breed that i've just started to grow, and thought i would leave my opinion.


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## ninjagaiden (Feb 25, 2011)

Hey There.

I was one of the first i the US to get TD seeds, and to say they shipped them out TOO quick is an understatment.

My seeds were tiny, almost all white,and took forever to germ and grow.

They popped dec31 or jan1, the first 2-3 weeks after that were absolutely PAINFUL. Very slow growth. After that they exploded. I have 2 stretchy phenos at about 2ft and 2 bushy phenos at about 1.5ft.

So far the plants look great but had a really shitty start


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## Serapis (Feb 25, 2011)

Glad to hear you are having some success. I've decided to give the seeds another go. one had a exposed tap that was turning brown, so it got trashed. I can't really call the others DOA yet, because apparantly it can take some time for troubled seeds to germinate.

Weedlingsprout, you are more than welcome to rep attitude here or in any other thread if that is how you feel. I felt that way once about Attitude myself, until I found other vendors that will replace a lost shipment without some crazy "guarantee" fee. My last purchase was 20 seeds, regs, free shipping. AND they came shipped VERY stealthy at no extra cost. All of the seeds were big and mature with spots, no pales or small BF TD shit. My TD seeds were tiny. They came spilling out of the BF pack quite easily. they were pale in color and I was suspicious of them from the get go. I hope you never have a reason to change your opinion of the Tude.



ninjagaiden said:


> Hey There.
> 
> I was one of the first i the US to get TD seeds, and to say they shipped them out TOO quick is an understatment.
> 
> ...


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## weedlingsprout (Feb 25, 2011)

Serapis said:


> Glad to hear you are having some success. I've decided to give the seeds another go. one had a exposed tap that was turning brown, so it got trashed. I can't really call the others DOA yet, because apparantly it can take some time for troubled seeds to germinate.
> 
> Weedlingsprout, you are more than welcome to rep attitude here or in any other thread if that is how you feel. I felt that way once about Attitude myself, until I found other vendors that will replace a lost shipment without some crazy "guarantee" fee. My last purchase was 20 seeds, regs, free shipping. AND they came shipped VERY stealthy at no extra cost. All of the seeds were big and mature with spots, no pales or small BF TD shit. My TD seeds were tiny. They came spilling out of the BF pack quite easily. they were pale in color and I was suspicious of them from the get go. I hope you never have a reason to change your opinion of the Tude.


My BF TD's were also small and pale, i just thought that was norm from this breeder of seeds as the Vanilla Kush was also small and pale. The White Widow Big Bud was smaill but nice and brown but they popped the day after the BF seeds.


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## faithfulmastiff (Feb 25, 2011)

Hiya Serapis, sorry to hear of ya pain with the germinating, i been keeping up with post, cos i was awaiting my TD babies, got a buddy of mine in the netherlands to mail them to me, got the TD & Utopia Haze, was gonna grow them 2 of each side by side, my babies arived today, fukkin yayyyyyyyy, so exited, pray for me dude, i been prayin for yours to crack, oh i been told to soak my rockwool cubes in a 5.3 PH solution, you had mentioned you used a 7 PH, the 3.3 is needed to disolve the reidue lime from production, thats fron grodans website, hope it helps, off i go to soak my babbies... fingers crossed 

Peace


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## hellraizer30 (Feb 25, 2011)

guess im not buying those, well I noticed bc GOD BUD is back in stock woot!!


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## Serapis (Feb 25, 2011)

weedlingsprout said:


> My BF TD's were also small and pale, i just thought that was norm from this breeder of seeds as the Vanilla Kush was also small and pale. The White Widow Big Bud was smaill but nice and brown but they popped the day after the BF seeds.


I just popped open a pack of Vanilla Kush from BF this last Monday and they were anything but small and pale. They were big and had the proper looking spotting. I had seeds cracking open in just a few hours in water so I know those seeds are viable. I'd be wary of any small BF VK seeds....



faithfulmastiff said:


> Hiya Serapis, sorry to hear of ya pain with the germinating, i been keeping up with post, cos i was awaiting my TD babies, got a buddy of mine in the netherlands to mail them to me, got the TD & Utopia Haze, was gonna grow them 2 of each side by side, my babies arived today, fukkin yayyyyyyyy, so exited, pray for me dude, i been prayin for yours to crack, oh i been told to soak my rockwool cubes in a 5.3 PH solution, you had mentioned you used a 7 PH, the 3.3 is needed to disolve the reidue lime from production, thats fron grodans website, hope it helps, off i go to soak my babbies... fingers crossed
> 
> Peace


I'll keep my fingers crossed for ya!! Good job! 

As for the PH, 7.0 is my goal for seeds in an inert medium. I draw water up from the rockwool using a pipette and I read the PH that way. My actual PH'ing to obtain 7.0 drawn through the cube might be 4.5 or 5.0. I didn't want to state earlier that I use PH of 4.5 water, because then someone else would have questioned that and I would have to explain myself then, like I'm doing now.... Since an obvious explanation is in order, let me give you a quick run down of how I PH water for Rockwool cubes. I start with water at a PH of 5.5 and soak the cubes. I draw water from a cube using a pipette or syringe, depending on whats clean and right in front of me. I then eject that water into a jigger and take a PH reading. Usually it will be too high and I'll drop the solution a bit again, and squeeze all of the wet cubes so the water will mix and they can soak up the lower PH.

When I stated I used PH of 7.0, I was referring to soaking seeds in an attempt to germinate.



hellraizer30 said:


> guess im not buying those, well I noticed bc GOD BUD is back in stock woot!!


I've actually heard that the second/third batch of seeds released are fresher and more viable. However, I'm still seeing some weird looking plants. This strain is far from refined and I see why they won't sell regular seeds of it yet. Some of the plants I've seen look mutant, including the one that was posted up here yesterday by another reader. I love oranges and was excited to read the description on this strain. It's more hype than fact so far.


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## faithfulmastiff (Feb 25, 2011)

Oh btw, how many do you guys (and gals of corse) think will be right for a 2' x 3' x 6' , will post some pics later of my set-up.

Peace


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 25, 2011)

My tangerine dreams are going sloooow in their party cups.

They seem to be over the stress of topping now, and working on 2 tops each .

Putting them in 3.5 gals with FFOF today


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## Serapis (Feb 25, 2011)

Hold off on transplanting those man, they look to be in awful stress...  You have any superThrive there?



Sr. Verde said:


> My tangerine dreams are going sloooow in their party cups.
> 
> They seem to be over the stress of topping now, and working on 2 tops each .
> 
> Putting them in 3.5 gals with FFOF today


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 25, 2011)

Serapis said:


> Hold off on transplanting those man, they look to be in awful stress...  You have any superThrive there?


The pics were from yesterday, less than 24 hours after the topping 

I HAVE superthrive, but I'm not using it... I've never used it, so don't know how to use properly (at what times, how much, issues with too much etc.) So I figured i'd do fine without it this grow.. figure it's _more_ for hydroponics


I'll go check on them now... I know it seems early to transplant.. but they aren't going to do much else in that 20oz...


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## Serapis (Feb 25, 2011)

I was more concerned about the plant undergoing more stress so soon. If it were me, I'd add 2-3 drops of superthrive to about a qt of water along with a few drops of Shultz PLant food and lightly water. ST has B1 and hormones. It is Excellent for relieving plants of stress. I use it every time I transplant. I also use it when the plants look rough. You'll be amazed....


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 25, 2011)

Serapis said:


> I was more concerned about the plant undergoing more stress so soon. If it were me, I'd add 2-3 drops of superthrive to about a qt of water along with a few drops of Shultz PLant food and lightly water. ST has B1 and hormones. It is Excellent for relieving plants of stress. I use it every time I transplant. I also use it when the plants look rough. You'll be amazed....


Hmm. Ok, I think I will try it..

Only problem is they are all good and watered now, most of them take 2-3 days to drink all their water.. where the good one takes about a day and a half..

Would it be a good idea to water with superthrive RIGHT before I transfer them? I like to water my plants soil before transplant, so everything holds together, and pops out easy.


Also I can transplant in about 4-5 hours.. HALF way into their light schedule... or I can transplant tomorrow, closer to when the lights turn on.. what do you think serapis? Any other suggestions also taken 

I know they look sort of like shit, but notice the new tops coming in, look at those. I think that's just the first set of leaves coming this long & looking so shitty... also thinking they are beginning to curl downwards from the small pot.

The fan leaves and second set of leaves looked VERY normal on all of them but - I was topping for two tops so had to remove that growth






LOL @ the one in the back, the first set had 3 leaves


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## Serapis (Feb 25, 2011)

They'll live, but hold off on transplant, please trust me on that. The roots have plenty of room to grow atm. There are drain holes on bottom of those containers? You say they take 2-3 days to drink their water? they aren't sagging from container size, I can promise that. It looks to be more a drainage or too much water issue. I'd make sure bottoms are draining well, then water again with ST and let them drain out a bit and then make sure they are not in standing water, but a dry tray, and don't water for 4-5 days.

I promise they'll look a lot better


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 25, 2011)

Serapis said:


> They'll live, but hold off on transplant, please trust me on that. The roots have plenty of room to grow atm. There are drain holes on bottom of those containers? You say they take 2-3 days to drink their water? they aren't sagging from container size, I can promise that. It looks to be more a drainage or too much water issue. I'd make sure bottoms are draining well, then water again with ST and let them drain out a bit and then make sure they are not in standing water, but a dry tray, and don't water for 4-5 days.
> 
> I promise they'll look a lot better


Oh yeah no doubt... They were a little to wet at the start, which is why they were dropping. They were all growing at different rates, and my primary plant drinks twice as fast, so that kind of messed the watering up a bit.

They chill in that dry trey, there are drain holes, quite a few... the mix is 20% perlite, 80% ffof.

I know they are sagging a bit, but I'm not too worried about that. Notice the one in the back with the weird pheno? That one is starting to sit back up as they should all be doing. I haven't watered in 3 days on the little guys, I just watered the prime one the other day... The soil was dried out..


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 25, 2011)

This is more of what I consider them running out of space.. if you notice the soil is just _beginning_ to dry out... So this guy hasn't been completely saturated or anything... Just curling like that, and the others are beginning to curl at the tips downwards









It's this Barneys Farms  weird ass genetics, smells fantastic though so I got no problem fiddling a bit more 




edit: I've blazed and since relaxed


I'll meet you half way serapis... I'll give them another day for recovery and then transplant to 3.5 gals tomorrow afternoon. Sound good? 

They should be fine, personally I think they'd be cool if I did them today.. But I feel where your coming from, and will go with you a little on this one.. I think they should have zero issues tomorrow

I think I am just going to water with Root 66 (kelp additive) and a couple drops of SuperThrive /L of h2o before/after transplant (to saturate new soil)


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## kidgraphix (Feb 25, 2011)

I think Serapis is right on this one Verde TechnaFlora recommends a 24 hr presoak with B1 green ThriveAlive prior to transplanting If it were me i would go with either formula but also add a night in a humidity dome that will relieve stress of the roots and leaves and they will firm up nice the root66 after transplant is also a good move maybe add humic acid or bonemeal Jobe's jump start is great and like 5 bucks for 4lb bag also has Hychs and biozome formula forr root structure it only takes like 1/2 tsp for 3gal pot bag has mixing directions


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 25, 2011)

kidgraphix said:


> I think Serapis is right on this one Verde TechnaFlora recommends a 24 hr presoak with B1 green ThriveAlive prior to transplanting If it were me i would go with either formula but also add a night in a humidity dome that will relieve stress of the roots and leaves and they will firm up nice the root66 after transplant is also a good move maybe add humic acid or bonemeal Jobe's jump start is great and like 5 bucks for 4lb bag also has Hychs and biozome formula forr root structure it only takes like 1/2 tsp for 3gal pot bag has mixing directions



That's some good info.. However I've never had issues with transplanting... mind you in soil..

They just droop for a half day/day and come back up strong as ever.

Adding the Root66 alone is a step towards something new for ME... But the root 66 makes sense because of all those good kelp hormones to promote cell division and _plain old_ root growth when watered right into the soil.. Or so I have been reading in some old RIU kelp threads  Will find out myself


Good info on the pre-soak though.


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## faithfulmastiff (Feb 25, 2011)

TD babies still floating in my shot glass, 3 hours & it's like they sitting on the surface of the water, the Utopia Haze sank like a brick, distilled water with few drops of B1 green, ebb n flo patiently waiting ....lol


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## eyecandi (Feb 25, 2011)

I'm with Serapis, wait. those cups can hold plants up to @ 8-12" tall before really needing a transplant. wait until the rootball is a little more established, it will ease any shock and allow the plant to explode in growth once transplanted. transplanting at this stage will slow down growth a bit (roots are still delicate and small, transplanting disturbs and breaks them) and may cause additional issues. 

my .24


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## RawBudzski (Feb 25, 2011)

aww why did you top the girls so young..


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 25, 2011)

RawBudzski said:


> aww why did you top the girls so young..


Cause fuck it I'm inpatient lol everything will come in fine... I just didn't feel like cutting off a bunch of worthless growth... get those two ACTUAL tops going as quick as I can


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## faithfulmastiff (Feb 26, 2011)

16 hours later & they still floating


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## Serapis (Feb 26, 2011)

Try tapping them with a pencil eraser or something. Mine floated a long time too  That is not a good sign if air has entered the seed. The embryo is more than likely already dried up and dead. Keep hoping....


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## faithfulmastiff (Feb 26, 2011)

sure did, few taps later & they sank like bricks, now its a waiting game, cmon girls its time to crack, the cubes are waiting.

Peace


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## faithfulmastiff (Feb 26, 2011)

TD babies future home, i know i know looks lil rough, this was just to get few readings of temps & such, wiring etc will be tidyied up later


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## Serapis (Feb 26, 2011)

Nice.... you'll want to raise that tote up closer to those CFLS or drop that light down some if ya can...



faithfulmastiff said:


> TD babies future home, i know i know looks lil rough, this was just to get few readings of temps & such, wiring etc will be tidyied up later
> 
> 
> View attachment 1463496View attachment 1463495


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## faithfulmastiff (Feb 26, 2011)

ok brief decription of setup.... oh btw light was raised just for picture purposes, anyway...

got a light fitting which holds 5 bulbs, right now theres 5 x 26 watt 6500k cfl's, & 4 x 225 bulb led's, mixed red & blue, (2700k bulbs ready for flower), ebb & flow tray for flower, but still using same tray have another line run from res & setup for drip system for veg, theres 10 gal res under shelf with airstones & pump, at top there a 135 cfm inline canfan with carbon scrubber venting through floor & intake low level, i made a monster light which was constructed from 4" solid duct, 3 pieces riveted together & it held 12 x cfl's, unfortunately this raised my temps to 105 so that light came out for now, post better pics soon.

Peace


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## faithfulmastiff (Feb 26, 2011)

couple more pics, criticise away if need be, constructive preferably & not a bashing please....lol, theres a basic pic of my super cfl light fitting, works a charm, but its supprising how much heat 12 cfl's produce.

Peace


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## JimBro (Feb 26, 2011)

@faithful, might want to start your own thread on your grow. Probably a better place to post your pics and whatnot. Interesting setup, would like to see what happens.

So, back on floating seeds. Should they eventually sink to the bottom on their own? I've always been too impatient and will shake the glass after a while until they break the surface.


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## faithfulmastiff (Feb 26, 2011)

oops, would help if i attached the pictures,


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## faithfulmastiff (Feb 26, 2011)

jimbro, i tapped the seeds a few times as serapis suggested & they sank, only reason i put few pics on here was only because i was growing the TD too & i thought we were sharing


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## JimBro (Feb 26, 2011)

yeah, I have no problem at all. I'm just saying if someone wants to follow your stuff, it's a lot easier to do so from your own thread.

Serapis, did you scarify the seeds like was talked about before, or are you just letting them soak longer?


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## Serapis (Feb 26, 2011)

I let them soak 24 more hours and this time placed them in peat pellets in a tray, under a black cover, on a heating pad....



JimBro said:


> yeah, I have no problem at all. I'm just saying if someone wants to follow your stuff, it's a lot easier to do so from your own thread.
> 
> Serapis, did you scarify the seeds like was talked about before, or are you just letting them soak longer?


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## eyecandi (Feb 26, 2011)

*chuckle*

did you remember to use the Holy Water and Rosary Beads?



Serapis said:


> I let them soak 24 more hours and this time placed them in peat pellets in a tray, under a black cover, on a heating pad....


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## kidgraphix (Feb 26, 2011)

Tangerine Dream received and germed on 1/22/2011 I only germed 2 because of all the neg feedback, out of the 2 one was viable and produced a seedling sprout on the 26th of Jan. which I transplanted to the hydro system on day 1 and started the vegatative phase on 1/26/2011

these are pics from today at day 30 from germination and day 15 from switch to 12/12 they were just short of 2 weeks in veg but had to switch for the other 2 Blueberry Gum which were ready for switch to 12/12 would have vegged her longer but space is limited and dont have room for separate veg and flower.Anyway her actual height is roughly 11"s undergoing LST to bring her into more direct light even at this stage underdeveloped the smell is unbelievable and the sativa phenotype is very distinct.Best of luck to any who try this strain not recommended for first timers LOL very precise and specific and my opinion still a bit unstable genetics(one thing not perfect no results) so if you give this strain a shot be prepared for disappointment and on your A game lots of luck
View attachment 1464342View attachment 1464340


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## kidgraphix (Feb 26, 2011)

Its only one TD feel free to check out the grow journal for more specifics


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## eyecandi (Feb 28, 2011)

of my 2 TD seeds - 1 was small with hardly any spotting/striping at all. the other was 2x bigger but had a small deformity on the seed (otherwise normal looking). 24hr pre-soak and 6 days in soil one finally popped (the bigger one) - the shell casing on these are hard/tough ... I had to help pry the casing in half so the petioles could spread out, otherwise I doubt she could have done it on her own. 

so-so luck on the other beans as well. both corleone kush popped ok, but nothing else so far (4 others). but I have a lot more on the way from smaller known breeders directly. i think I'll avoid the big stores for the most part now.

Serapis - I assume no positive news yet? How are the Vanilla's looking?


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## Sr. Verde (Feb 28, 2011)

Hey serapis! Hope you don't mind me dropping by a short update...

Anyway, transplanted a few days ago... Everything went fine... they slid into their pre-packed holes in the soil, and were covered fine... they took to their new homes within the day and are now starting to get some reallly nice growth

I ended up watering with 3.5mL root 66, 1mL MagiCal, & 1mL ThriveAlive [organic] (as per your suggestion)... They bounced back really well, actually seemed to grow a bit the day of the transplant

My GE MH bulb just didn't start up one day, so I was forced to return it & buy a hortilux blue MH.. I'm really satisfied with the Hortilux though! I have a Super HPS for flower too..

Here's a pic







edit: day 19







 @ the retard on the bottom left, should be interesting


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## faithfulmastiff (Mar 2, 2011)

Yayyy 6 days & the TD's finaly cracked, about bloody time too


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## Serapis (Mar 2, 2011)

Sigh, I'm still waiting, one is dead for sure, 4 left....


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## faithfulmastiff (Mar 2, 2011)

Serapis said:


> Sigh, I'm still waiting, one is dead for sure, 4 left....


that sucks man, i ordered pk of 5 fems, well after 2 was soaking for days with no result, i thought what the hell i'll try another 2, well i did the in paper towel method, i kinda soaked the towels then put in smal ziplock & folded bag in half without zipping shut & set on plate on top of my cable box, way too hot i know, but by now was gettin pissed & impatient, well less than 24 hrs & all 4 cracked, was 92 in there too, don't know if a fluke or not, all i know is they popped real quick when i did this, fingers crossed on yours dude.

Peace


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## faithfulmastiff (Mar 2, 2011)

sorry i meant to add.... i made a ph balanced solution with some Thrive Alive B1 red, & thats what i soaked the towels in.

Peace


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## Serapis (Mar 2, 2011)

You are the 3rd person that has mentioned high temperatures to get to germ.... I wish I had a second seed mat.... I have too many outdoor varieties germing right now to crank the heat up. Well hell. it's been 3 weeks, what is another one?



faithfulmastiff said:


> that sucks man, i ordered pk of 5 fems, well after 2 was soaking for days with no result, i thought what the hell i'll try another 2, well i did the in paper towel method, i kinda soaked the towels then put in smal ziplock & folded bag in half without zipping shut & set on plate on top of my cable box, way too hot i know, but by now was gettin pissed & impatient, well less than 24 hrs & all 4 cracked, was 92 in there too, don't know if a fluke or not, all i know is they popped real quick when i did this, fingers crossed on yours dude.
> 
> Peace


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## faithfulmastiff (Mar 2, 2011)

Serapis said:


> You are the 3rd person that has mentioned high temperatures to get to germ.... I wish I had a second seed mat.... I have too many outdoor varieties germing right now to crank the heat up. Well hell. it's been 3 weeks, what is another one?


have you tried the ziplock method, i found that when i soaked the towels n folded that ziplock they seemed to sweat in there, i'm sure thats what did it,


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## legallyflying (Mar 3, 2011)

Super thrive is the money shit for sure. So what is the final story on TD? I am thinking about buying some seeds but I have heard from others that they are pretty unstable at this point with several different phenos. 

Man. Sr. verde, you topped those things EARLY. I guess if it works it works but I usually wait till at least 5 nodes. I totally agree with serapis though on transplanting. They should root out for at least two weeks in those cups. Your stressing a stressed plant and there really isn't any need.


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## Serapis (Mar 3, 2011)

They are still in the pellets.... I'll take them out this weekend and if they look viable, I'll stick the damn things in a ziploc, just like mother nature intended... ;p


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## hellraizer30 (Mar 3, 2011)

anybody having any luck with this strain yet?


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 3, 2011)

I am, look for my post above


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## hellraizer30 (Mar 3, 2011)

just read alot about seeds not poping and such and was planning on ordering it, any positive is good


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## kidgraphix (Mar 3, 2011)

I have one goin with couple Blueberry seems to be lookin mighty fine still waiting for flowers though journal link in signature


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## legallyflying (Mar 3, 2011)

hellraizer30 said:


> just read alot about seeds not poping and such and was planning on ordering it, any positive is good


Did an extensive google search and concluded "fuck it". I am going to order some of barney's vanilla kush though when attitude starts their 25 anniversary sale tonight. 12 free seeds with $50 order.


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## eyecandi (Mar 3, 2011)

1 out of 2 popped for me. same vigor as the 2 corleone kush growing next to it. of course, only 3" tall right now ......


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## tendran (Mar 4, 2011)

Just made an Attitude purchase and went with the Fem Tangerine Dream and Reg Jilly Bean (just to hit the next freebie cap) I really wanted that Plush Berry strain too, but it sold out between last night and this morning. It looked so tasty! Good luck, I'll let you know if I have the same issue or not.


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 4, 2011)

legallyflying said:


> Man. Sr. verde, you topped those things EARLY. I guess if it works it works but I usually wait till at least 5 nodes. I totally agree with serapis though on transplanting. They should root out for at least two weeks in those cups. Your stressing a stressed plant and there really isn't any need.









Day 21.... 6 days after transplant

They were in their party cups for two weeks, when I transplanted there were roots wrapped all around the bottom

Doing fine now, this one will be a fine plant.

& again honestly I thought some of those first sets of leaves were going to die.... and if the first set died, and I removed all the other sets for topping, I didn't think they would survive, especially the retard of the bunch, and I wanted an even canopy, not topping at different times.....








serapis, how are those Vanilla Kush's doing?


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## Serapis (Mar 4, 2011)

I've got one germinated..... and if anyone questions my methods or ability, I'm 10/10 on my regular mango seeds and 9/10 on my Dankee Doodle seeds. I'll NEVER buy from BF again.


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## NorthernLights#5 (Mar 4, 2011)

thats sad to hear i just ordered 5 BF LSD and 5 BF Acapulco Gold


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## Serapis (Mar 4, 2011)

I'm sure you'll be fine....


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 4, 2011)

NorthernLights#5 said:


> thats sad to hear i just ordered 5 BF LSD and 5 BF Acapulco Gold





Serapis said:


> I'm sure you'll be fine....



exactly  don't mess with that good juju, tell yourself everything will be great, and it will be 

good to hear on those germ rates serapis


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## gumball (Mar 4, 2011)

I understand your decision serapis after all this. But I bet you won't turn it down if a fellow grower offered you a stable cross of some sort or clone  

One hell of a ride though!


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## kidgraphix (Mar 4, 2011)

Hey Serapis,just a quick pic update on the TD for ya these first 3 are after the mid morning foliar feeding.
View attachment 1475205View attachment 1475204View attachment 1475203
and these are from later in the day after she has absorbed the morning dew feeding. Day 21 of 12/12 light
View attachment 1475217View attachment 1475216View attachment 1475215View attachment 1475214


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## Serapis (Mar 4, 2011)

Nice pics.... I would pay $30 a pop for TD clones, but I ain't buying anymore seeds with BF on them. It sucks too, cause I really wanted to check it out and the Vanilla Kush


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 4, 2011)

Yeah clones would be great of this strain, no doubt a clone of one of the GOOD, strong growing phenos


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## kidgraphix (Mar 4, 2011)

I would be more than willing to help you out I definitely have a nice sample and have taken a couple cuttings from her for the clone machine I might even try to regenerate her after harvest just to have her as a mother plant. I dont have high hopes for the other three seeds I have left.


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## Serapis (Mar 7, 2011)

Pulled the 4 peat pellets apart today and I have 4 intact seeds.... I have now placed them in wet paper towels and a ziploc......


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 7, 2011)

Serapis said:


> Pulled the 4 peat pellets apart today and I have 4 intact seeds.... I have now placed them in wet paper towels and a ziploc......


LOL you should totally 'scarify' them too. just for shits


I would laugh hard if they popped open man 

then i'd pat you on the back and smoke you out


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## hellraizer30 (Mar 7, 2011)

man from the sounds of it this TD strain is imposable. serapis I ordered violator kush from BF, you tryed to germ that strain? guess im hopeing 
for a good response


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## gumball (Mar 7, 2011)

hellraizer30 said:


> man from the sounds of it this TD strain is imposable. serapis I ordered violator kush from BF, you tryed to germ that strain? guess im hopeing
> for a good response


I think it was certain shipments/stock, or something. I follow some folks on a different forum, and they got a batch of TD and I think several folks are growing some out with no problem. I still understand your feelings toward BF, I wouldnt do business with 'em after blowing that much on some seeds. Did you ever get a response back from BF? I think I remember you said you wrote them.


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## growmomma (Mar 8, 2011)

*Hey guys, Newbie here and I must say I have enjoyed reading this thread. But at the same time am now terrified!!! Lol This will be me and my husbands first DWC indoor grow. We just ordered seeds from attitude, 5 White Label WW, 5 sweet seeds sweet cheese, and 5 BF Tangerine Dream. I think its safe to say the TD will be stored until we have a couple grows under our belts. Would the WW be the easiest to try first? Serapis I hate the TD is giving you such trouble and hope things turn around for you. That being said thanks for the thread and all the good info!!!*


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 8, 2011)

Barneys Farm: Tangerine Dream

Day 25 from seed under 250w
Note: Photo taken after watering/training..





Not impossible folks


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## Novakid (Mar 11, 2011)

I have a TD thats 20 days into flowering, and it is the best plant of my bunch. It is in FFOF soil with FF nutes. 4 weeks veg but as far as germination goes I must have gotten lucky because I only ordered one and it popped.


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 11, 2011)

She looks great! That's pretty much exactly what I'm going to do with my 3 novakid 

Thanks for the photos


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## kidgraphix (Mar 15, 2011)

TD 32 days into flowering Only vegged for like 2 wks she was the runt of my three I also have 2 G13/Blueberry Gum
View attachment 1496550View attachment 1496542


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## mane2008 (Mar 15, 2011)

yep not impossible just that it was rushed imo and they sent out batches they knew weren't ready. this is day 3
View attachment 1496553View attachment 1496554View attachment 1496555


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## faithfulmastiff (Mar 15, 2011)

hey kid, half way there with the flower, looking good so far, be interesting to see how much it plumps up, i got 3 TD's going, mine are still only 11 days old...lol, i'm considering doing 2 diff topping techniques & 1 au naturel just to see the differences in yield, seeing you guys already in flower i'm in the closet with the lil girls encouraging them to grow, usualy chillin with some floyd, you can all laugh all you like but i sit n smoke n talk to my plants every day, i swear it makes a difference, call me crazy...haha


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## faithfulmastiff (Mar 15, 2011)

mane2008 said:


> yep not impossible just that it was rushed imo and they sent out batches they knew weren't ready. this is day 3
> View attachment 1496553View attachment 1496554View attachment 1496555


hi mane, just curious, you say that is day 3 of flower, how long did you veg for.

Peace


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## faithfulmastiff (Mar 15, 2011)

hellraizer30 said:


> man from the sounds of it this TD strain is imposable. serapis I ordered violator kush from BF, you tryed to germ that strain? guess im hopeing
> for a good response



hi hellraizer, iv'e got a violator kush too, just the 1 fem, haven't started that 1 yet i was kinda waiting to do just that 1 & clone her & then grow 5 at once, seeing as iv'e only got the 1 seed, from the feedback ive gotten its some realy fuked up dank smoke, so iv'e heard...lol, be interested to see pics if you are growing yours


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## Serapis (Mar 15, 2011)

hellraizer30 said:


> man from the sounds of it this TD strain is imposable. serapis I ordered violator kush from BF, you tryed to germ that strain? guess im hopeing
> for a good response


I have been hearing good things about the TD seeds out there now, but no smoke reports yet... Many are several weeks into flowering. Everyone is encouraged to post success stories in this thread, regarding your TD grows. As I stated very early on, I love oranges. I almost ordered two single seeds from the SSC's website today. I got in the checkout, and noticed I was just a few pounds shy of qualifying for the two free fem seeds, so I added another TD to the basket and I just froze like a deer in headlights, unable to pull out my Paypal card. 

Herein lies the problem with free seeds.... I'm a sucker for them. I know that technically they are not free, but I always end up reasoning with myself that I'd be foolish to pass up a bargain. One might think that with my luck with seed banks lately, I'd know better.... well, technically, I do! But when you start talkin UFO#1, UFO#2, #3, #4 and then some Birthday freebies on top of that!? I'm there.... And wait, what about an additional 6 free feminized Confidential Cheese because I bought 6 Cataract Kush...

I'm a sucker for freebies....

If you'll excuse me, I'm going to be busy winning in my garden. 



gumball said:


> I think it was certain shipments/stock, or something. I follow some folks on a different forum, and they got a batch of TD and I think several folks are growing some out with no problem. I still understand your feelings toward BF, I wouldnt do business with 'em after blowing that much on some seeds. Did you ever get a response back from BF? I think I remember you said you wrote them.


I've heard the same thing now. I think they have worked out their quality issues, to put it politely. 



growmomma said:


> *Hey guys, Newbie here and I must say I have enjoyed reading this thread. But at the same time am now terrified!!! Lol This will be me and my husbands first DWC indoor grow. We just ordered seeds from attitude, 5 White Label WW, 5 sweet seeds sweet cheese, and 5 BF Tangerine Dream. I think its safe to say the TD will be stored until we have a couple grows under our belts. Would the WW be the easiest to try first? Serapis I hate the TD is giving you such trouble and hope things turn around for you. That being said thanks for the thread and all the good info!!!*


You'll be fine! AND welcome to RIU!!

View attachment 1496595


mane2008 said:


> yep not impossible just that it was rushed imo and they sent out batches they knew weren't ready. this is day 3


Nice pics!! Thanks for sharing!


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## mkey1185 (Mar 15, 2011)

I too spent much more than intended during Attitudes Birthday Promo ordered some TDs and about 10 other strains LMAO. Thanks for the info will post pics of sussesful grows lol. knock on wood.


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 15, 2011)

bout to put my tangerine dreams into flower *rubs hands together* muahahaha


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## mane2008 (Mar 16, 2011)

faithfulmastiff said:


> hi mane, just curious, you say that is day 3 of flower, how long did you veg for.
> 
> Peace


49days. i wanted to do 42 but couldnt...


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## eyecandi (Mar 16, 2011)

my one popper is @ 4" tall and weird leaf structure so far, especially when compared to the 2 Corleone Kush that popped with her - those 2 are little growth monsters with a 3rd set starting already (only 2nd set starting to show on the TD). hope she comes out of whatever weirdness


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## hellraizer30 (Mar 16, 2011)

faithfulmastiff said:


> hi hellraizer, iv'e got a violator kush too, just the 1 fem, haven't started that 1 yet i was kinda waiting to do just that 1 & clone her & then grow 5 at once, seeing as iv'e only got the 1 seed, from the feedback ive gotten its some realy fuked up dank smoke, so iv'e heard...lol, be interested to see pics if you are growing yours


ive grown the VK before in the past and love the shit out of it but due to a melt down in the grow room it was distroyed, so having it back is awsome.
going to be doing the ultimate first. but I can say the VK top notch shit


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## Sr. Verde (Mar 16, 2011)

mane2008 said:


> 49days. i wanted to do 42 but couldnt...


Yeah I'll probably end up around 40 days veg myself from seed. I almost want to put them in flower now around day 34-35 but I just tied them down to let them bush out a bit more I figure it will be worth it... I just hope they don't go too stretch crazy! I hear the tangerines stretch like balls.


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## Serapis (Mar 16, 2011)

I won't have time for TD now... I've got 12 plants in my cloner, 4 in my Ebb, 2 in water farms vegging in my tent, and 6 in the germ station.... Just now realized I got a lot going on... Once propogation is all done, I'll start 10 papaya for outdoors.


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## Novakid (Mar 17, 2011)

View attachment 1498782View attachment 1498781

Day 25 since showing signs of flowering.


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## faithfulmastiff (Mar 17, 2011)

aaahhhh look at them nuggs ....... drools on keyboard


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## faithfulmastiff (Mar 17, 2011)

thought i'd share few pics with yall, the 3 smallest are TD, bottom right utopia haze & middle 1 bag seed i wanted to experiment a topping method with, yep got lil nute burn last week but seem to be bouncing back nicely


       

16 days since cracking, middle one 27 days (i think..lol)


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## tendran (Mar 22, 2011)

Germed one in a paper towel buddy, and at 48 hours later it looked swelled but hadn't popped. By 80 hours the taproot was almost 2 inches long. Had to put poke a hole through one starter pellet and stack them to accommodate it and it broke ground last night around 9-10pm pst. May be worth giving another try.. Though it does suck that they didn't take care of the customers with issues resulting from that batch..


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## fredt (Apr 21, 2011)

WTF! What happened to this thread? I read 24 bloody pages and it stopped a month ago. Did anyone harvest? Are TD germination rates improving? I'm really concerned because I have Barneys TD and LSD in the mail from Attitude. If I'd read this thread earlier I would have bought something else from a different vendor.


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## growmomma (Apr 21, 2011)

Go to the TD fan club that's in faithfulmastifs sig^^^


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## faithfulmastiff (Apr 21, 2011)

growmomma said:


> Go to the TD fan club that's in faithfulmastifs sig^^^


just for you momma....


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## growmomma (Apr 23, 2011)

faithfulmastiff said:


> just for you momma....
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 1561926 View attachment 1561929 View attachment 1561927 View attachment 1561930


They are looking great!!! I can't wait to see these TD nugs, I'm living vicariously through you until I can pop mine lol


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## Sr. Verde (Apr 23, 2011)

some Tangerine Dream nug here

I remember 2 months ago I could NOT find any pics like this, so  your welcome guys


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## fredt (May 1, 2011)

Great news! My TD and LSD ordered from Attitude arrived Friday. The delivery time, to So Cal was 9 days. Friday evening I put 3 TDs in a moist paper towel, in a ziplock, on top of my tv. I checked them today, after less than 48 hrs and all 3 had quarter inch tap roots. I put 1 in soil and the other 2 in 2inch RW cubes. All 3 are in my spare room closet inside a covered container to keep fungus gnats at bay_something I've had a bit of a problem with in the past. I still have 2 seeds for back-up.


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## adamhew77 (May 3, 2011)

Serapis said:


> LOL, nope. You say the G word and they refuse to talk to you or respond to your email. Nirvana on the other hand will dispatch out replacements, pronto. Come to think of it, I'll never order the 'tude again. This was $60 blown.... not to mention the Tee- shirt I did not get... TWICE.... poor, shitty service... bad beans...


I am having the same trouble. I wrote attitude and it was just a run around about souvenirs and blah blah. I had 1 of 3 germ of br TD and 2 of 3 pineapple chunk. I received sage and Burmese kush as freebies. Both popped and the sage is fine but the bu. Ku. Seems to have broke.the surface and just died. Not .sure but.... I have just started these last week but none of the remaining 3 of 8 are likely to do.any more. I am not impressed l, I.have had hat seed do.better. cool.thread this is one I will be.subscribing.to. I.am still catching up.


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## patmyballzz (May 3, 2011)

Sr thank u for those pix brother


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## patmyballzz (May 3, 2011)

sr verde ,What day are u at?40s?


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## maxsnchz (May 5, 2011)

I have 5 Tangerine Dream plants 6 weeks into flower and they don't have shit for trichome development. Is this really the Cannabis Cup winner? I bought 5 feminized seeds from Barney's by way of Attitude and watch them grow up into beautiful young lady-plants. Then, I put them into flower. The only thing: they look crappy. I'm growing in 5-gal pots with CO2 and yet the buds are small. Come on. And I am not seeing the trichome development I've seen on other BF seeds I've sprouted. Anyone else have similar issues?

Is it just too early? Is it the curse of the feminized seeds?


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## Sr. Verde (May 6, 2011)

maxsnchz said:


> I have 5 Tangerine Dream plants 6 weeks into flower and they don't have shit for trichome development. Is this really the Cannabis Cup winner? I bought 5 feminized seeds from Barney's by way of Attitude and watch them grow up into beautiful young lady-plants. Then, I put them into flower. The only thing: they look crappy. I'm growing in 5-gal pots with CO2 and yet the buds are small. Come on. And I am not seeing the trichome development I've seen on other BF seeds I've sprouted. Anyone else have similar issues?
> 
> Is it just too early? Is it the curse of the feminized seeds?


Hey pal 

You hit the nail on the head I think!

The Tangerine Dream begins each stage like SHIT, then ends up OK.

Slow to pop through the soil, took 2 weeks for a fan leaf then BOOM! Exploded into growth!

Then looked GREAT by flower... but 25 days into flower still like NO development of pistils! Which you were expecting by day 15!


I'm glad to say that my TD is chunking out now around day 50... it's on day 51 today and getting more massive every day. (patmyballz that answers your question)

Heres some new pics... and here is my journal >> https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/417817-2x2x5-gl60-tent-250w-hortilux-6.html




Day 50:






Day 47:


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## hellraizer30 (May 6, 2011)

Looks good sucks its slow to the races


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## Sr. Verde (May 7, 2011)

hellraizer30 said:


> Looks good sucks its slow to the races


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## patmyballzz (May 7, 2011)

Damn sr verde lookn sticky


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## patmyballzz (May 7, 2011)

You blaze any yet


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## Sr. Verde (May 9, 2011)

Day 54 tangerine dream


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## reddiesel69 (May 12, 2011)

nice! i just ordered 5 td's from attitude kinda wish i woulda read this thread before i did that! i hope i dont have any issues with the germmin thanngg! i have 5 vanilla kush going right now day 1 of flower and it is a great strain compared to the violator which i just grew. any techniques you reccomend for the tangerine?


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## Sr. Verde (May 12, 2011)

reddiesel69 said:


> nice! i just ordered 5 td's from attitude kinda wish i woulda read this thread before i did that! i hope i dont have any issues with the germmin thanngg! i have 5 vanilla kush going right now day 1 of flower and it is a great strain compared to the violator which i just grew. any techniques you reccomend for the tangerine?



Flower way way wayyy early, expect 4-5x stretch. SERIOUSLY. I trained mine too. Watch out for the retard pheno


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## faithfulmastiff (May 12, 2011)

reddiesel69 said:


> nice! i just ordered 5 td's from attitude kinda wish i woulda read this thread before i did that! i hope i dont have any issues with the germmin thanngg! i have 5 vanilla kush going right now day 1 of flower and it is a great strain compared to the violator which i just grew. any techniques you reccomend for the tangerine?


 
the TD favours the moist paper towel in ziplock for germing, majority had huge success with this method.
whats the violator kush like, i got 1 just in bloom


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## Dayzt (May 12, 2011)

Sr. Verde said:


> Flower way way wayyy early, expect 4-5x stretch. SERIOUSLY. I trained mine too. Watch out for the retard pheno


Wow, i hope my pheno isn't like that - by the look of it, mine is still showing pretty strong indica traits so I don't think I'll more than 2x in stretch.... she's still in veg for about a week more yet.


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## Sr. Verde (May 12, 2011)

Dayzt said:


> Wow, i hope my pheno isn't like that - by the look of it, mine is still showing pretty strong indica traits so I don't think I'll more than 2x in stretch.... she's still in veg for about a week more yet.


Thats what I thought... And I topped and trained too... but look at this !

The more indica, hybrid pheno is looking like it will take 70 days. The MORE sativa hybrid looks like it will be 80-85 days. The really really sativa pheno, I chopped down because it wasn't stopping the stretch.

this is mcgyvers grow, TD's in the back







https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/400784-2nd-grow-1000w-tangerine-dream-13.html





Mine...

Day 1 flower (MH for the first 2 days):







Day 15 (sideways sorry)






Day 17 after chop







Day 54


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## Bill Wilson (May 30, 2011)

Did any of those latest pics have the rosy stems. I have two tang rosy phenos bushed out something big, but I grow vertical so it stretces outward. Is the Rosy stemed pheno good? Please tell me about it if you have it.


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## Sr. Verde (May 31, 2011)

You mean red?


My one has quite a few colas with some red stems.... it's the sativa pheno


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## mrstoney420 (Jun 1, 2011)

hey this is a great journal. had i noticed it a few months ago i would have been right here with u all. i got a 5 pack and got 3 out of 5 to grow. 2 of them r in the flowering room. 1 is at week6 and stand around 6 ft! and over takes my garden. i have to tie the branchs up inorder to make it not conflict with my other gals as it bushed out about 5 feet across. she dosnt handle any nutes i feed here mild strenght nutes the amount that i would use to flush a plant. and she also was split down the middle were she was toped during week 4-5. oh and she was either stunted from over fertilization or shes just really slow and gunna be a long grower. maybe even both r playing a big factor, just have to wait and see. ohh yeah and i put her in flower at day 45 of veg i believe. and she was 3 ft tall maybe a bit under not really sure it was a wileback. ill get some pics up later. any of ya heard of count Ossie & the Mystic revelation of Rastafari by any chance off topic but wats weed without good music?!


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## breaktimer2000 (Jun 2, 2011)

any technique to get it that bushy? Girl looks great!


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## patmyballzz (Jun 4, 2011)

Verde how did they finish did they bulk up?they look a lil heat streached


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## Sr. Verde (Jun 4, 2011)

this is day 78 & 76... were at day 80 and they still got a while to go... the sativa pheno in the back of the tent still has weeks.................... 


yes... were on week 11 and still going. 


they are heat stressed because they are sativa as FUCK stretched 4x... outgrew my setup big, i even chopped them in half... the light is as high as it goes i keep the canopy around 78F

Next grow will be better genetics and earlier flowering.


78












76






trichs on calyxes remain cloudy as fuck.. waiting for some of it to amber before i chop..


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## eyecandi (Jun 6, 2011)

hmmmm ... better be some kick ass weight or smoke to be an 11wk +. I just put mine into flowering 2 weeks ago, has about 2.5x stretch right now (compared to my corleone kush test at same age, put on 3.5-4x stretch so far and main stem WAY outgrew the smaller side branches in growth - untopped).


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## CTtokin (Jul 11, 2011)

Hey man your TD is looking sexy . I'm not sure whats going on with mine, I have a tek4 t5 and i think it had some issues with heat stress. It is a scrog grow and i think what happened was the tops stretched too fast for the buds to keep up with growth. hopefully she fills out. otherwise looking beautiful and smelling like a damn orange. 

i believe i am on week 8 with her right now. slow to start flowering though.


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## Sr. Verde (Jul 11, 2011)

This journal seems dead.

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/417817-2x2x5-gl60-tent-250w-hortilux-11.html

Here is my journal... I'm cutting down my sativa pheno today. I've been reallly lazy, I also have pics of the harvest of the first plant... and oil made with trim...


its REALLLLY really really strong weed. Like all in the head, hits you immediately. like completely opposite of 'creeper' effect.

The oil I made from it is like 2x as strong by weight as any other oil i've made...


I vape nuggets out of the volcano and i'm baked for like 3 hours off 2 bags. That's impressive as nothing else lasts nearly as long.


The bag appeal on my buds were kind of low, but I don't care I'm not selling them.... The high is definitely the best part... very dreamy with a sweet tangerine flavor on the exhale.


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## Alice42069 (Dec 30, 2011)

Hey been awhile but here to tell you all how it turned out for me. TD BLOWS flowered one plant and tossed the clones i had going. It was supposed to be an indica growers sativa. Yeah right the one seed out 5 that did ever grow was tall lanky,slow and fluffy. The smoke was nothing at all like the advertisement said. I flowered it for 10 weeks and said hell with it. Trikes were turning milky so i was done with that bitch. So keep triin bf but i wont keep buyin.


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## Impman (Aug 16, 2012)

Alice42069 said:


> Hey been awhile but here to tell you all how it turned out for me. TD BLOWS flowered one plant and tossed the clones i had going. It was supposed to be an indica growers sativa. Yeah right the one seed out 5 that did ever grow was tall lanky,slow and fluffy. The smoke was nothing at all like the advertisement said. I flowered it for 10 weeks and said hell with it. Trikes were turning milky so i was done with that bitch. So keep triin bf but i wont keep buyin.


Did your package of seeds come from Barnys Farm? I am going to start a grow journal soon. I have 10 TD seeds from Barnys farm that all germinated. I vegged them for 4 weeks and they all look amazing. None of them will be tall, lanky plants. Follow my journal , I will begin tomorrow. The first week of veg my temps were a touch too high and they really hated it. I have been keeping the temp perfect since then. Maybe you had it a little hot


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