# Grow tent 600w hps hydro under construction



## anon1122 (Sep 22, 2009)

Okay, here we grow!

I've been a lurker for quite some time and have been doing a bit of research and am now implementing my research into my first solo grow. Let's start with the equipment lists...


Here's what I have:

1 4'x4'x6.5' grow tent
1 Hydrofarm Radiant 8 hood
1 600w hps
1 600w Lumatek digital ballast
1 2x2 ebb and flow Hydrofarm Megagarden
1 air pump and air stone
2 sets of t8 lights that have 2 bulbs each
Misc. Timers and power strips

I just ordered:

1 6" value line fan 435cfm
1 6" carbonaire carbon filter

I need:

Fox farm hydroponic nutrient trio
Ph/PPM meter
Rock wool
Hydroton
PH up+down
small circulation fans
SEEDS!!!! 


And that ladies and gents barring any oversight on my part, is going to be my setup. Let me figure out exactly how to post pictures on here and I will.

I plan on implementing a SCROG technique. Anyone have any suggestions for strains that would do well in this environment with that technique? I am going for a high yielding, indica dominant strain. Also, if you have any suggestions on a fairly inexpensive ph/tds meter, please send a link.

Like I said, I've been reading on here for a long time and really believe this is the best online growing site and I can't wait to become a member of this community and wealth of knowledge. Any suggestions and comments are appreciated, let me know what you think!


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## phabphour20 (Sep 22, 2009)

Looking like a great set up.Would like to see some pics once you get it up.


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## anon1122 (Sep 22, 2009)

Here goes my feeble attempt at posting some pictures for you guys. Any suggestions and comments are welcome!








View with light off







Lamp off







Radiant 8 Hood







Lumatek Ballast







Megagarden with Air pump. Airstone will go in reservoir of course.







Light on







Bulb burning







Tent closed with light on


The only problem/concern I'm really having right now is that the light takes 10+ minutes to fire/start up. I have read about some bulbs misfiring with the lumatek ballasts. Any suggestions on what bulbs work 100% of the time the first time and don't take forever to fire up?


Also, I assume since the cubic feet of the tent is roughly 104 cf. that the 435 cfm exhaust fan will dissipate most of the heat given off by the lamp. If the air in the room is being exhausted at 4x per minute It should create a negative pressure area within the tent drawing fresh air in from the flaps on the bottom/side and not letting any smell escape as well.

Let me know if I am correct in my assumptions.


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## anon1122 (Sep 22, 2009)

Great thing is, a lot of the equipment was obtained off craigslist for super cheap too.


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## anon1122 (Sep 22, 2009)

Can someone explain how to post pics? I will as soon as I can figure it out...


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## anon1122 (Sep 22, 2009)

Lights out







Ballast







Megagarden







Lights on







Closed up with the light on


The only concern I am having right now is that when I plug the ballast in, it takes 10-20 minutes for the light to fire up. I have read about bulb compatability issues regarding lumatek ballasts. Does anyone know what bulbs are the best to use that light up immediately?

Also, do you guys think heat build up will be an issue? I think with the 430+ cfm exhaust fan running it will take out the heat and smell very well. And since it will be creating a negative pressure area, it should draw air in through the bottom vents right?

Please let me know what you think!


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## anon1122 (Sep 23, 2009)

91 views and one response? Maybe I should just go over to grasscity.


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## phabphour20 (Sep 23, 2009)

Very nice Setup bro!Who makes that tent if you dont mind me asking?Does that light setup you have put out alot of heat?i want to put togehter exactley what you have there minus the hydro table.


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## anon1122 (Sep 23, 2009)

phabphour20 said:


> Very nice Setup bro!Who makes that tent if you dont mind me asking?Does that light setup you have put out alot of heat?i want to put togehter exactley what you have there minus the hydro table.


Thanks! I'm not sure exactly on the brand, I posted the link to where I bought it on amazon. If I were you, I would go with a brand name one though. This one isn't quite sturdy enough and I had to add boards to the top to support the light hangers. As for the carbon filter and fan, it's going to have to be creatively mounted somewhere other than from the ceiling. Hydro hut or growlabs would be a better option in my opinion. But I have it now, so it will have to do. I can make it work, I'm flexible and creative. I'm hoping that with proper care and attention, I can achieve at least 3/4 gpw which would put me at my target of roughly 1lb. Now I just have to find a good strain to use or someone to get some clones from. Too bad I don't know any growers in my area.

As for heat, I know this bad boy will throw some off, if it didn't it wouldn't be air cooled. I think with the 430 cfm exhaust fan in the room sucking through the carbon filter I can kill the heat and the smell and get two birds stoned at once. Anyone else, feel free to chime in and let me know if that sounds about right.


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## phabphour20 (Sep 23, 2009)

Ive ordered beans from attitude 3 times.Il ive in the northeast usa and havnt had a problem.Just pay the extra for the guaranteed shipping.So your tent dosnt have straps to hang your filter from on the inside?


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## anon1122 (Sep 23, 2009)

phabphour20 said:


> Ive ordered beans from attitude 3 times.Il ive in the northeast usa and havnt had a problem.Just pay the extra for the guaranteed shipping.So your tent dosnt have straps to hang your filter from on the inside?



nope, no straps. this thing is bare bones to the max. But, like I said, I think it will serve it's purpose for now.


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## anon1122 (Sep 24, 2009)

Just ordered the fox farm hydroponic nutrient trio, advanced nutrients ph control kit, and a sheet of 50 2"x2"x1.5" rockwool cubes. Getting closer...


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## phabphour20 (Sep 25, 2009)

Great im subscribed so keep us posted!

ulls up chairops popcornacks a phat bowl


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## anon1122 (Sep 29, 2009)

Just received nutes, ph up+down, rockwool, and carbon filter. Carbon filter is fucking HUGE. It may be overkill for my application, I'll post pics asap so some of you can help me brainstorm about how to set this monster up. It's approx 2 ft tall and 15" in diameter and weighs 55 lbs. Definitely too heavy for this tent. Pics to come asap.


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## phabphour20 (Sep 29, 2009)

wow that thing sounds big!


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## Bob Smith (Sep 29, 2009)

Hey Anon, that tent you have looks like one of the plant killers from a year or two ago - the ones with the white insides (like yours) kill plants eventually.

You need to get one with the new silver lining - I'm not a paid endorser for anyone, but I have a couple of Sun Huts that work great.

An additional benefit is that the roof is plenty strong and comes with straps for hanging your inline fan(s) and filters.


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## anon1122 (Sep 29, 2009)

I've read about those problems, and I checked with the vendor before ordering my tent and I was assured that this one is non-toxic. So, Im gonna roll with it for the first grow and upgrade on the 2nd grow and just use this one for a veg tent. Anyway, I hope to have pictures of this monster filter tomorrow. I'm telling you, HUGE!!!


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## denny beezwax (Sep 29, 2009)

Very good -- hoping to learn more about venting and heat here too. Keep it up!


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## tea tree (Sep 29, 2009)

lol, I have a 600 lumatel in the same size tent too. I love lumatek, they work as good as they say and have that 30 percent advantage over magnetics. I also hve a lumatek 400. Anyway I was just switching those yo yos withc are awesome and it just snapped back, lol, and smacked my eye with a triangle! Ow that shit hurts, i just want to say, riu, be careful. You will shoot your eye out.


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## anon1122 (Sep 29, 2009)

Right on, thanks guys. I hope the one 6" fan sucking through the filter will be enough to control heat and odor. What type of bulb are you using tea tree? Mine likes to take at least 10 minutes to turn on. Is that normal?


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## expatriot823 (Sep 29, 2009)

Looks good man, keep up the good work!


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## anon1122 (Sep 30, 2009)

Thanks man, I plan on it!


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## Potner (Sep 30, 2009)

When heat became to much for me here in the summer I creatively added a window unit. No co2 exchange. Are You adding co2 to your tent?

(unfolding my chair, watching like an ole GA. Farmer)


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## anon1122 (Sep 30, 2009)

Potner said:


> When heat became to much for me here in the summer I creatively added a window unit. No co2 exchange. Are You adding co2 to your tent?
> 
> (unfolding my chair, watching like an ole GA. Farmer)




I plan on introducing co2 once everything is dialed in nicely. I have some co2 tanks ready to go. I purchased one, and found two outside the business I work at. I think some bum was trying to take the for scrap metal and sat them down, and I found 'em. One of the ones I found was still full, the other empty, but still, free co2 tanks 20lb ones too.

I have some odds and ends to get still before things are up and running. I need a fan speed controller, ph/ec/tds meter, hydroton, and seeds.

I need some strain suggestions guys and gals, something that does well with limited vertical space in a scrog. Im thinking about doing a bowl shaped scrog. I believe the journal I read referred to it as a parabolic scrog. Just an idea though.

So yeah, strain suggestions and also let me know if the fox farm micro line is worth the extra money (beastie bloomz, cha ching, open sesame.) I already have the 3 part liquid trio. I just want to do all this shit right the first time. I should probably buy some neem oil and other things for pest control because you never know. The one thing you don't try to anticipate is the one thing that will fuck you over for sure.

Sorry about the rambling, I'm just ready and excited to get this shit up and growing...


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## anon1122 (Oct 2, 2009)

Getting paid today, gonna order the fox farm micros and Im gonna try to order that ph meter. A friend gave me a seed that is supposedly blue cheese (or at least whats being passed around as blue cheese.) When I get the fan, I may crack it and throw it in some soil. Fan finally shipped, it was on back order. It should be here monday. No input from anyone on the lumatek issue or what strain I should go with for big yeid, good potency and good in small areas? It's funny but out of 550 views, only a couple people say anything.


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## Bob Smith (Oct 2, 2009)

"I should probably buy some neem oil and other things for pest control because you never know. The one thing you don't try to anticipate is the one thing that will fuck you over for sure."

Without a doubt - pests are something that the first-timer never realizes can be such a fugging pain in the ass.

Keep your grow area clean and do some preventive spraying/dipping - I've had spider mites and aphids, and lemme tell you that they fugging suck.

As far as the FF nutes, never used them so I can't comment.

Good luck to you, though.


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## laserbrn (Oct 2, 2009)

This is a very good setup. I have exactly the same setup except I'm running a 365cfm fan. I run a 600w in my 4x4x7.5 tent and haven't had ANY problems with heat.

I just finished my first grow in it....just over 13 oz's.

It was Ebb & Flow

White Widow

I think you'll have lots of fun with this setup...


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## grasscity46 (Oct 2, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> The only problem/concern I'm really having right now is that the light takes 10+ minutes to fire/start up. I have read about some bulbs misfiring with the lumatek ballasts. Any suggestions on what bulbs work 100% of the time the first time and don't take forever to fire up?


From what I've read in the 2nd latest hightimes and on the companies website, these are the lights to use: http://www.sunpulselamps.com/ . They are digital lamps designed to work properly with a digital ballast. They claim that certain premature lamp failures lately have been caused by digital ballasts destroying magnetic lamps. Cost is similiar to an Eye Hortilux


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## anon1122 (Oct 2, 2009)

Thanks for the input everyone! I ordered my ph meter this evening. What do you guys think about this one?

Laser, that is extremely encouraging. What nutes were you using? FF?

I appreciate the info on the bulbs as well.

Pics to come hopefully soon!

I'll keep you guys posted as I make more progress.
http://www.amazon.com/Hanna-Instruments-Digital-Temperature-Testing/dp/B0002IXKFC/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&s=sporting-goods&qid=1254545987&sr=8-4


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## cyborg (Oct 3, 2009)

Wow, I'm doing a setup like this too 600 hps in a 4x4 tent. Im gonna do aero with 4 inch pvc SOG. I hope I get a P to choke on for a few months. All I need is a fan and a tds meter and i am set. good luck dude


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## neiltoosweet (Oct 3, 2009)

Hi I like the look of the sun huts, but cant fing them here in UK, anyone know where to find them? ta, peace all


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## anon1122 (Oct 4, 2009)

neiltoosweet said:


> Hi I like the look of the sun huts, but cant fing them here in UK, anyone know where to find them? ta, peace all


It's called google. Use it. ta.


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## anon1122 (Oct 4, 2009)

6" valueline fan was recieved yesterday. PH/ppm/ec meter was ordered friday. And now I think I just need seeds, fan speed controller, hydroton and some stuff for pest control, and Ill be ready to rock and roll. I know I've been promising pics and I assure you, once I've made considerable progress, Ill put some up.


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## evets (Oct 4, 2009)

I have a 600 lumatek in a 4' x 3.5' x 7.5' corner of a room tented off. 

I am using a Ushio Hi-Lux Grow Red right now and the bulb reaches full brightness in about 2 minutes. 

As for heat, the 600 is hot, but that air cooled hood will take care of it. I have a 4" vortex fan @ 177cfm venting my tent. I also have a Can33 air filter hooked up which is huge too (bigger than a 5gal pail). This fan keeps the tent at 75f. So your 6" should have no problem, infact, you may need a speed controller ( I suggest speedster).

A couple pics. I found the best venting/odor control with the filter hanging from the ceiling.

Nice Equipment! Good Luck, I am not disappointed with my lumatek 600.


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## anon1122 (Oct 4, 2009)

I don't really have any way to attach the mega filter to the ceiling, so right now it's on a makeshift table with the fan sucking through on top of it. Do you guys think this would word for heat dissipation and scent if I rigged it up like this...? Blue is the carbon filter, black is the fan, red is ducting. Sorry about the shitty paint skillz.


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## evets (Oct 4, 2009)

my setup is similar although, I have the fan at the end of the line - after the hood - so that it is sucking everything and exhausting directly out. This worked best for me, but I dont know if it is the proper way, I'm pretty new at this.

I've heard that there is less wind noise in the flexible ducting while pulling air rather than pushing air....again no science to back this up, but since it is basically the same velocity I'm not sure if there would be a difference

I really only needed the filter once flowering started, right now she's almost done, and the smell is very pronounced - Glad to have the filter!


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## tea tree (Oct 4, 2009)

If I were you I would save money and not get the speed controller. I have the same setup as you. I use two valuline fans. I also have tow Lumateks. I use an eight inch on my 600. I used a six inch valueline on my 600 but it was not enough for my climate. I use the air but it is hot here in summer. I tried to attach a speed controller to my eight in fan. It is smart when the light is off but pointless when it is on. A better investment is sound proofing. I wrap my fan in blackout noise proofing curtains. That helps a lot. Also my lumateks start up in no time flat.


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## EdIsOnnOsIdE (Oct 4, 2009)

I think you need the scrubber at the top. Your current drawing looks as if your pulling clean air right through the vents into scrubber/fan then pushing light/out... What about the spent air and all the heat that is building up above the light?....it will lurch up there.... I have 600 watt/lumatek/4x4x7 tent aswell. Dont know about your budget...but...Im looking at 2 vent holes on either side of your tent. Run ducting from one side of tent to your light then to other side of tent. Directly venting the heat out. Time it with the lights. Now, as far as venting the room, put another fan on your scrubber and vent going out the top on the ceiling. 

"My setup is similar although, I have the fan at the end of the line - after the hood - so that it is sucking everything and exhausting directly out. This worked best for me, but I dont know if it is the proper way, I'm pretty new at this." Evets 
All information i have gathered points to this method. I have heat issues at times so i decided to vent the light seperately


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## laserbrn (Oct 4, 2009)

I have a Can 66 filter so there's no way in hell I can mount it up on the top of my tent. I have it sitting outside the tent on the ground. Fan just sits on top of it, it connects to the light and other end of the light is open to get the air from the room.

I just added a SCROG screen too. There's a lot you can do with these 4x4 tents!


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## anon1122 (Oct 4, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> I have a Can 66 filter so there's no way in hell I can mount it up on the top of my tent. I have it sitting outside the tent on the ground. Fan just sits on top of it, it connects to the light and other end of the light is open to get the air from the room.
> 
> I just added a SCROG screen too. There's a lot you can do with these 4x4 tents!


I think I'll give that setup a go. I'm thinking about big buddha's blue cheese. What company is your widow from laserbrn?

I sincerely appreciate you guys taking time to give me input. Hopefully with the knowledge I have and what you guys can supply as well this will go smoothly.

Is it safe to assume I should run the ff nutes at 1/2 strength when I get started?


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## phabphour20 (Oct 5, 2009)

Looking good brother!


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## laserbrn (Oct 5, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> I think I'll give that setup a go. I'm thinking about big buddha's blue cheese. What company is your widow from laserbrn?
> 
> I sincerely appreciate you guys taking time to give me input. Hopefully with the knowledge I have and what you guys can supply as well this will go smoothly.
> 
> Is it safe to assume I should run the ff nutes at 1/2 strength when I get started?


The Blue Cheese is definitely a good smoke, but I didn't like growing it with White Widow. It didn't have nearly the same nutrient needs. I grew Dutch Passions White Widow and I just loaded it up with the same again.
kiss-ass


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## anon1122 (Oct 5, 2009)

just set up my filter and fan. I have the fan and filter on the outside. the fan is blowing into the filter, and sucking through duct work that attaches to one end of the air cooled hood. It seems like it isn't drawing enough air though. I am worried it won't be enough for smell. Any input?


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## anon1122 (Oct 5, 2009)

scratch that. put the fan/filter back on inside. creates a negative pressure zone and I think it will be more efficient. wayyy more air being moved. I am going to do a dry run for a couple days to work out any heat issues or anything else that may arise. I'll keep everyone updated.


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## laserbrn (Oct 6, 2009)

I haven't seen your exact setup, but it moves WAY more air with the filter inside and the fan blowing out? How did you determine that it's moving WAY more air?

I've run mine both ways and never had a noticeable difference in temperature. Mine does sit RIGHT outside and in the configuration you stated and it keeps the inside of my tent about 4-5 degrees warmer than the outside of the tent with a 600w. So it stays about 78-80 degrees (directly under center of the lamp @ canopy height) without any problems.

I'm just suprised you see THAT much of a difference, but I don't know how you are gauging it either.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 6, 2009)

I'm about to start the EXACT same setup. I think you're right on track so far, because it's exactly how I would have done it. Now I'm thinking ahead a bit and trying to figure out an ebb & flow setup that easy to clean and maintain. I'll keep in touch


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## anon1122 (Oct 6, 2009)

Trying to get a screen built, but working with limited space. A screen might not be in the cards because I will have to lift the tray the plants will be sitting in to refill the res. It may just complicate things more than help. What do you guys think?


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## anon1122 (Oct 6, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> I haven't seen your exact setup, but it moves WAY more air with the filter inside and the fan blowing out? How did you determine that it's moving WAY more air?
> 
> I've run mine both ways and never had a noticeable difference in temperature. Mine does sit RIGHT outside and in the configuration you stated and it keeps the inside of my tent about 4-5 degrees warmer than the outside of the tent with a 600w. So it stays about 78-80 degrees (directly under center of the lamp @ canopy height) without any problems.
> 
> I'm just suprised you see THAT much of a difference, but I don't know how you are gauging it either.



When I had the filter and fan on the outside and it was running, it felt like very little air was being drawn through the ducting. I held my hand to the other end of the hood and it felt like nothing. So it made me worry about smell.

Then I put the filter and fan inside the tent, the fan sucks air through the filter and exhausts directly out of the tent. With this set up, it creates a negative pressure area in the tent and it looks like it's being sucked in, which I feel will work not only for smell, but heat as well.

The tent is 104 cubic feet and the fan moves 435 cubic feet per minute. So if the fan is exchanging the air at over 4x per minute heat shouldn't stand a chance.

I think this will be the best way to run it in my set up. As soon as I can get a working camera around here I'll take more pics.

As for a strain, here is what I am leaning towards...

Barney's Farm Crimea Blue


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## ads420 (Oct 6, 2009)

i recommend, if possible, having the air pulled through the filter. then your air cooled hood. then fan. then out the exhaust. in that order. if possible. does your hood have a lens over the light or is it completely open?

heat rises, remember that. so having the air sucked through the highest possible point is best. also you can get away with not using that carbon scrubber until you start flowering. it shouldnt smell until past the 2nd week of flowering.


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## laserbrn (Oct 7, 2009)

It certainly works best to have the filter inside the tent if possible, I just found it very difficult to do in a 4x4 tent. I also wanted to make sure that I was pulling air through the light and not pushing it. I've tested it both ways and the temp difference was about 2 degrees by pulling instead of pushing. Consistently.


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## Bob Smith (Oct 7, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> It certainly works best to have the filter inside the tent if possible, I just found it very difficult to do in a 4x4 tent. I also wanted to make sure that I was pulling air through the light and not pushing it. I've tested it both ways and the temp difference was about 2 degrees by pulling instead of pushing. Consistently.


Lol, you ain't lying, brother........pics are in my grow journal, but it's a real bitch fitting three inlines, a filter, and a reflector in a 4x4 tent.

Not fun at all, lemme tell you.

BTW Anon, we're both learning as we go with setting these things up, but take a look at my setup (like I've been doing with yours) for some ideas if you get stuck.

Good luck, bro.


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## laserbrn (Oct 7, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> Lol, you ain't lying, brother........pics are in my grow journal, but it's a real bitch fitting three inlines, a filter, and a reflector in a 4x4 tent.
> 
> Not fun at all, lemme tell you.
> 
> ...


That's why my fan and filter are outide. I have a SCROG screen in there too, so it would only stand to make matters worse. And with a 3x3 tray inside my 4x4 tent, there wasn't any room to prop it up from ground, had to suspend it from the ceiling and Can-66 Filters are NOT light. It would hinger my lights, it's just never going to work. It needed to be outside.

I can't believe that with a 400+CFM fan you had temp problems running it this way anon....seems nuts.

I'm using a 365cfm fan and I'm strongly considering picking up a 1000w ballast and lamp to run in it. Granted I run my dark periods overnight and during the winter night time temps drop so low that I certainly won't need A/C to keep it cool. Right now the night time temps are in the 40's and that's plenty cool to keep things runnin' smoothly.


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## Bob Smith (Oct 7, 2009)

I haven't gotten it up and running yet, but I'm going to be running a 1000HPS with a 6" inline (435CFM) cooling that, then a 6" inline hooked up to a filter for exhaust, and a 4" inline for intake.

Similar setup in my 2x4 veg tent except that the 6" inline is responsible for cooling the reflector and for exhaust (no filter), and those temps stay about 1 to 1.5 degrees warmer than outside of the tent.

Hoping to have the same success, although I can live with 3 or 4 degrees higher than room temp in my flowering tent.


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## Bob Smith (Oct 7, 2009)

Just for reference, here's what the setup looks like as of yesterday (obviously not done, but that's the way I'm thinking the main parts are going to be setup):



Here's the light being cooled by its 6" with the filter being run by its 6" behind it.



Close up of the filter.

Maybe these pics will give you some ideas, maybe they won't, but either way, good luck to you.

Now I've gotta go find some space for a 4" inline somewhere in that damn tent.


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## laserbrn (Oct 7, 2009)

I just got a +rep from someone asking if my PC was fucked now. What happened? My PC is fine.

Why would a thread on a forum fuck up a PC?


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## anon1122 (Oct 7, 2009)

laserbrn, Im sure it would work on the outside, but it just seemed like smell would be an issue. I'm going to work on it today and see what I can come up with. Thank you everyone for helping me. It makes this worlds easier.


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## laserbrn (Oct 7, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> laserbrn, Im sure it would work on the outside, but it just seemed like smell would be an issue. I'm going to work on it today and see what I can come up with. Thank you everyone for helping me. It makes this worlds easier.


The same amount of air still passes through the carbon filter. Why would smell suddenly become an issue? I'm not understanding. 

I have the best filtration I have every come across and it starts with my Can 66 filter outside my tent. The tent sits in a seperate bedroom and there is an Ozone Generator in the room. It's on a timer so that it comes on for 15 minutes every hour and a half. 9 weeks into flowering my last batch I couldn't smell it until I opened the tent and my face was literally IN the tent. I have family, friends, friends of family and all kinds of people in my place and nobody ever suspects a thing. Hardly anyone knows I even SMOKE pot in the place, all day long.


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## Bob Smith (Oct 7, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> I just got a +rep from someone asking if my PC was fucked now. What happened? My PC is fine.
> 
> Why would a thread on a forum fuck up a PC?


It's from that troll who tried to post 900 threads that he's infecting the whole site with viruses.

Just ignore it, should be neutral rep (blue), no?


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## laserbrn (Oct 7, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> It's from that troll who tried to post 900 threads that he's infecting the whole site with viruses.
> 
> Just ignore it, should be neutral rep (blue), no?


You're right, it is. What a doorknob.


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## anon1122 (Oct 7, 2009)

Well, my reasoning was that if the fan is sitting on top of the filter on the outside of the tent, and the ducting goes up and onto the top of the tent and then down into the duct hole and then attaches to the hood, i put my hand on the other side of the hood that was open and you could feel it pulling some air, but it did not make the tent concave.

When the filter and fan is inside the tent, all sides of the tent are sucked in and there is forceful air coming out of the exhaust ducting. So it would seem to be more efficient this way, but I am a newbie so I could very well be wrong.

I read somewhere that every bend in the ducting makes you lose air pressure. I think that because the fan is trying to suck with pressure through bends and at least 10 feet of ducting that it is losing significant pressure. Therefore not moving as much air out of my tent.

Im thinking now about keeping the fan and filter in the tent and just running it through the hood on the way out. seal up the flanges of the light where the glass is with duct tape and vent it that way. I know that you said it is a 2 degree difference whether pull or push but at least I'd be doing something about cooling the hood.

Thanks for taking time out to help.


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## laserbrn (Oct 7, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Well, my reasoning was that if the fan is sitting on top of the filter on the outside of the tent, and the ducting goes up and onto the top of the tent and then down into the duct hole and then attaches to the hood, i put my hand on the other side of the hood that was open and you could feel it pulling some air, but it did not make the tent concave.
> 
> When the filter and fan is inside the tent, all sides of the tent are sucked in and there is forceful air coming out of the exhaust ducting. So it would seem to be more efficient this way, but I am a newbie so I could very well be wrong.
> 
> ...


That's interesting. You definitely need to have as few bends and as short a run as possible for the fan to run efficiently. I don't have 10 ft of ducting as my Can 66 Filter is pretty tall. The hole for my tent is also not on the VERY top, it's on the upper portion almost parallel with my light so I don't have a "U" shaped bend on mine. I'll bet that would kill my idea. A combination of a shorter filter (further distance) and much more drastic angles and bends in the ducting.

The only thing that I can think with the pushing vs pulling is that when you pull air through the lamp it sucks away the hot air before it has a chance to hit the glass. Very little pressure from hot air on the glass lens. When you push it you are creating MORE pressure on the glass from hot air causing the glass to heat up.

Could be way off base. I'm only basing my assertion on trying it both ways and testing the temps.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 7, 2009)

Anon,

Can you confirm the size of duct holes in your tent? I want to use my 8" fan, so I will buy a hood with a 8" hole and the same size filter. I just want to make sure everything is going to fit.


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## Bob Smith (Oct 7, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> Anon,
> 
> Can you confirm the size of duct holes in your tent? I want to use my 8" fan, so I will buy a hood with a 8" hole and the same size filter. I just want to make sure everything is going to fit.


Most tens only have 6" flanges, but that's easily fixable with a $2, 8" to 6" reducer at Home Depot.


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## laserbrn (Oct 7, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> Most tens only have 6" flanges, but that's easily fixable with a $2, 8" to 6" reducer at Home Depot.


I think most of the 4x4 tents I have seen have had either 4" or 6" holes, but yeah a reducer does the trick.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 7, 2009)

I tried reducing the 8" fan down to a 4" dryer vent and that totally did NOT work. Well, it worked in principle but it certainly didn't move enough air. If the holes are 6" then I should buy 6" stuff and save or sell the 8" fan.


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## laserbrn (Oct 7, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> I tried reducing the 8" fan down to a 4" dryer vent and that totally did NOT work. Well, it worked in principle but it certainly didn't move enough air. If the holes are 6" then I should buy 6" stuff and save or sell the 8" fan.


I definitely wouldn't hook up an 8" fan to a 6" duct. You need to run some temp tests because I don't think you have as many problems as you think. An 8" fan is GNARLY for a 4x4 space. I would get a 6" reducer and just run it like that if the tents holes are applicable. Don't you already have an 8" flange on your filter, an 8" air hood and an 8" fan?


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## anon1122 (Oct 7, 2009)

The holes on the upper sides are 4" the ones on top are 6". I have a 6" valueline fan and a carbonaire 6" filter. the filter is 22"tall 15" in diameter and weighs 55 lbs. she's a big bitch.


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## tea tree (Oct 7, 2009)

I have an eight in valueline fan on a six inch duct for my 8 in cool tube that a 600 watt lumatek powers. It works great. All this in a 4x4x6 tent. I tried it with a six in valueline first that I use to cool my 400 in a 4x4x6 tent and it was not powerful enough for me. I exhaust all this straight over an ozone generator then out the house into the desert air. Lol, it gets a little mixing first then out. I tried a htg speed contriller on my eight in and it works when the light is off but pointless when on and the fan makes a funny hum when I reduce the power. SO IDK save your money and dont get one. Keep the eight inch. It is a goog investment on a light for sure. I have always beleved in the biggest fan I can allow soundwise. Lightbleeching becomes my concern.


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## anon1122 (Oct 7, 2009)

Ok, temps hold at the low to mid 70's all zipped up with the ventilation the way it is. I think it will be ok. as for a screen, Im having a bit of trouble but I think I have found a design solution. The only thing I worry about is when I have to change the reservoir and I have to lift the tray up to refill it. So I am almost leaning towards not having one. I am sure I can pull a respectable harvest of at least 10-13 oz's when all is said and done. Anyone read or have any experience with bc bud depot's 
"The black"? So many choices but I have to pick one by next friday, that's for sure. Any input?


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## laserbrn (Oct 8, 2009)

I say go without the screen the first time. I'm experimenting with the screen. My last grow I ran without it and I got 13 zips of White Widow. I just felt I could've gotten more if I had a bit more efficiency so I'm going to try it. I might get less, it might become a huge problem later, I have no idea at this point. First go around, keep it simple.


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## Bob Smith (Oct 8, 2009)

tea tree said:


> I have an eight in valueline fan on a six inch duct for my 8 in cool tube that a 600 watt lumatek powers. It works great. All this in a 4x4x6 tent. I tried it with a six in valueline first that I use to cool my 400 in a 4x4x6 tent and it was not powerful enough for me. I exhaust all this straight over an ozone generator then out the house into the desert air. Lol, it gets a little mixing first then out. I tried a htg speed contriller on my eight in and it works when the light is off but pointless when on and the fan makes a funny hum when I reduce the power. SO IDK save your money and dont get one. Keep the eight inch. It is a goog investment on a light for sure. I have always beleved in the biggest fan I can allow soundwise. Lightbleeching becomes my concern.


I currently have two 6" in my 4x4, one strictly for light cooling and one strictly for exhaust pulling through a filter, and then a 4" inline for intake, but if I could do it all over again, I'd probably just go with one 8" for both light cooling and for room exhaust and then stay with the one 4" for intake.

Less shit to hang, mainly.


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## laserbrn (Oct 8, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> I currently have two 6" in my 4x4, one strictly for light cooling and one strictly for exhaust pulling through a filter, and then a 4" inline for intake, but if I could do it all over again, I'd probably just go with one 8" for both light cooling and for room exhaust and then stay with the one 4" for intake.
> 
> Less shit to hang, mainly.


I can't belive you need that much ventilation for a 4x4. Assuming it's 8 ft tall it's only 128 Cubic Feet.

If both of your exhaust fans are 340CFM+ you're wayyyyyyy overdoing it.

128 Cubic Feet and you've got ~600-700CFM exhausting it (you lose some on the carbon filter for those paying attention to numbers). 

Overkill city. 1 6" exhaust and no intake. 360CFM on a 128 Cubic Foot space is going to be plenty.

More isn't always better. It'll keep it cooler, but the law of diminishing returns will kill you. Your now using a lot of extra wattage for no reason.

6" HO fans run ~ 140w
4" HO fans run ~ 70w

so you're running in the neighborhood of 350w for ventilation. That's killing efficiency.


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## Squarebagel (Oct 8, 2009)

lookin good bro~ i just set up something very similar to you... i`ll be following this thread for sure


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## smokingrubber (Oct 8, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> I definitely wouldn't hook up an 8" fan to a 6" duct. You need to run some temp tests because I don't think you have as many problems as you think. An 8" fan is GNARLY for a 4x4 space. I would get a 6" reducer and just run it like that if the tents holes are applicable. Don't you already have an 8" flange on your filter, an 8" air hood and an 8" fan?


The 8" hood & filter are installed on the other grow. I have one 8" fan left over that I want to use on a new tent. I will have to get a new hood, flange and filter for the new setup.

I think I'll buy everything 6" inside the tent, then run it out to the 8" fan with an adapter. I can just put it on a speed controller. If it doesn't work, I can buy a 6" fan later.

It can't smell though. I'm in a condo and everyone's mailbox is right outside my garage door.


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## laserbrn (Oct 8, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> The 8" hood & filter are installed on the other grow. I have one 8" fan left over that I want to use on a new tent. I will have to get a new hood, flange and filter for the new setup.
> 
> I think I'll buy everything 6" inside the tent, then run it out to the 8" fan with an adapter. I can just put it on a speed controller. If it doesn't work, I can buy a 6" fan later.
> 
> It can't smell though. I'm in a condo and everyone's mailbox is right outside my garage door.


Sounds like a good plan. It's not going to smell. I live in an apartment and I can't smell a thing anywhere. It's the carbon filter that's going to dictate that, not the size of the fans.

It's a matter of not having any leaks and maintaining negative pressure. You are going to be FINE. I have the stinkiest buds around and the 2 people I actually showed it to couldn't believe it had been there the whole time. They had no idea, no odors, no problems. 

I did have a little left over smell when I had my veg room up and running because the plants were stinking in there, but like I said, Ozone Generator stopped all secondary smells. Killed'em dead. Smells like a clean rainforest.


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## anon1122 (Oct 8, 2009)

Can't ozone generators be detrimental to human's health though? I would like a back up, but everything is in my bedroom.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 8, 2009)

First, I was just checking the stats on the GL145 tent (the one Im getting) and it says it has 5 - 8" ports. That's perfect. I can go with 8" front to back. I'll still get the tent set up and measure everything first before I whip out the visa.

Second, talk to me about this ozone generator. I've got one (it came with the going-out-of-biz packagel that I got on craigslist). I've heard that you have to set up a seperate room to vent through or something like that. Probably wouldn't work in my garage, but my friend vents to his crawl space. Could we just plug it in down there and let it do it's thing? He has the filter going, so it doesn't smell now, but the ozone would be good backup.


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## Bob Smith (Oct 8, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> I can't belive you need that much ventilation for a 4x4. Assuming it's 8 ft tall it's only 128 Cubic Feet.
> 
> If both of your exhaust fans are 340CFM+ you're wayyyyyyy overdoing it.
> 
> ...


Yeah, I know I probably overdo it when it comes to ventilation, but to me that's one of if not the most important factor in a grow, so I don't mind - as far as the extra wattage goes, once this electrician wires me up for 60 amps, I really couldn't care less about $10 or $15 more a month.

Also, I'm running CO2 with a 1000 watt in there, so I need to cool the light to keep temps in check while also having no exhaust going out to waste the CO2, therefore the two 6" fans are somewhat necessary for me.

I appreciate your input and agree with you, but like most things in my grow, I like to get something that can easily handle what I need it to handle - once temps get up to high and my atmosphere controller turns on my exhaust fans, it's only gonna take a hot minute for the temps to get back down and CO2 enrichment to resume.

Again, I agree that what I have is overkill, but I'm gonna go with it and see how it does.


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## anon1122 (Oct 8, 2009)

Hanna combo meter just arrived. now for the hydroton, seeds, some pest control shit and away we grow! Am I supposed to be keeping the tip of this meter wet or something? There was some stuff crusted on the inside of the cap and I was just wondering if that was normal or important...?


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## smokingrubber (Oct 8, 2009)

You should have gotten the seeds FIRST. You have a few days of germ time and then some florescent time before they get anywhere near your 1000 watt grow room. You can start the seeds on the side 3 or 4 weeks before the room is completely set up.

If you haven't bought seeds yet, try these. http://www.cannabis-seeds-bank.co.uk/a-train/prod_1297.html


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## anon1122 (Oct 11, 2009)

Ok guys, I am soaking the blue cheese bag seed in 5.7-6.0ph distilled water, and rockwool in a bowl of distilled water 5.8-6.0

Now, when the seed sprouts, I plant it taproot down and put it in the ebb and flow unit. Im going to start with 1/4 strength nutes and work my way up. 

Do I start nutes the day I put it in the megagarden? Also, will 2 floods a day be enough for it?

Thanks!


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## smokingrubber (Oct 12, 2009)

I wouldn't presoak the rockwool for more than a couple minutes. It breaks down the fibers and expells too much air (or something like that). Some instructions say that you should let sit for 24 hrs in "tap" water. That's because it takes that long for the clorine in tap water to disapate. If you're using ph balanced RO or distilled water, then you shoukldn't soak.

I've tried both ways and I had much better success when I did not soak.

Before it gets about 4" tall, I would go with only one soak a day. Make damn sure the rockwool gets wet, but not drowned out. When they are that young you can easily over water them. Later, when they're bumpin and grinding with roots everywhere, you can hit then 5-6 times a day.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 12, 2009)

... bag seed? <clears throat> I'm not looking down my nose here, I just wouldn't even waste my time with it if I were you. First, it will NEVER EVER EVER be anywhere near the kind of bud and high that you will get from some real seeds. Even if it came off some of the dankest, stickiest, banana-bomb EVER. Why? Because it wasn't pollinated by Daddy Dank. It picked up some dandy-lion pollen or something from your yard and popped out a bastard seed. 

Besides, you've sunk about 2k into your project so far, spend 200 more on some real marijuana plants. You won't be sorry. 

Start that bag-seed and order some real seeds today. Starts extra real seeds and let them all get to about a foot tall. Bagseed, if it grows at all, will probably grow much faster. After 2 weeks in the flower stage, I guarentee that no matter what size the bagseed is, you'll jerk it out in favor of the beautiful pearls that start developing on the real plants.


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## anon1122 (Oct 12, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> ... bag seed? <clears throat> I'm not looking down my nose here, I just wouldn't even waste my time with it if I were you. First, it will NEVER EVER EVER be anywhere near the kind of bud and high that you will get from some real seeds. Even if it came off some of the dankest, stickiest, banana-bomb EVER. Why? Because it wasn't pollinated by Daddy Dank. It picked up some dandy-lion pollen or something from your yard and popped out a bastard seed.
> 
> Besides, you've sunk about 2k into your project so far, spend 200 more on some real marijuana plants. You won't be sorry.
> 
> Start that bag-seed and order some real seeds today. Starts extra real seeds and let them all get to about a foot tall. Bagseed, if it grows at all, will probably grow much faster. After 2 weeks in the flower stage, I guarentee that no matter what size the bagseed is, you'll jerk it out in favor of the beautiful pearls that start developing on the real plants.



It's cool, im going to be ordering from attitude very very soon, I just wanted a little pet project to kill some time and see what happened. Just to work out any kinks you know?


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## wexpac (Oct 12, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> It's cool, im going to be ordering from attitude very very soon, I just wanted a little pet project to kill some time and see what happened. Just to work out any kinks you know?



so you went with blue cheese? Man do I hate that strain... you should of went with Querkle or something that had a better taste


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## Bob Smith (Oct 12, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> It's cool, im going to be ordering from attitude very very soon, I just wanted a little pet project to kill some time and see what happened. Just to work out any kinks you know?


I'm doing the exact same, dude - running some bagseed through my setup first before the "real" genetics get flowered.

I must say, however, I vehemently disagree with the above poster regarding bag seeds from outstanding weed - I wouldn't be surprised if the bag seeds ended up every bit as good as the seeds I've bought.


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## anon1122 (Oct 12, 2009)

I haven't chosen a strain yet, who breeds querkel? I want something with outstanding yield and high as well. Preferably indica. Something attitude carries...?


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## smokingrubber (Oct 12, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> I'm doing the exact same, dude - running some bagseed through my setup first before the "real" genetics get flowered.
> 
> I must say, however, I vehemently disagree with the above poster regarding bag seeds from outstanding weed - I wouldn't be surprised if the bag seeds ended up every bit as good as the seeds I've bought.


You're certainly allowed to have your opinion. In my experience, it doesn't work out that way. Definately, it's a crap shoot. A couple seeds MAY turn out okay, but it all depends on what you're expecting. One of my first plants was a 5ft seaweed bush, and I was convinced it was going to sell. I've still got a 1 gallon jar of it. 

Bagseed is not a bad place to learn. For sure, try it out. Just don't jump to any conclusions like "this system sucks" or "I don't know what I'm doing" if you don't have any success. The skills learned germing and vegging bagseed will help later. At least you won't be too pissed if they all croak.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 12, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> I haven't chosen a strain yet, who breeds querkel? I want something with outstanding yield and high as well. Preferably indica. Something attitude carries...?


Don't worry about yield yet. Get something that's easy to grow. Those yield numbers only apply under optimum conditions and time schedules. If you want more yield, just let it veg a little longer. Unfortunately, unless you know what you're growing, you don't know how tall it will get. Some plants shoot another 2ft high as soon as you put them in the flower room. Some grow fatter than others. You won't know until you do it.


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## anon1122 (Oct 12, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> Don't worry about yield yet. Get something that's easy to grow. Those yield numbers only apply under optimum conditions and time schedules. If you want more yield, just let it veg a little longer. Unfortunately, unless you know what you're growing, you don't know how tall it will get. Some plants shoot another 2ft high as soon as you put them in the flower room. Some grow fatter than others. You won't know until you do it.



Yeah, Im looking for something easy to grow, stout, and great potency. Im a heavy smoker so yield is a bit of a concern, no veg room, just one tent so everything will be from seed for right now and then once I have something good to clone from, then go from there. But im not expecting anything spectacular from this bagseed. Just a buffer so I know what will work with the real things. 

What strain do you suggest smokingrubber?


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## laserbrn (Oct 12, 2009)

Start with bag seeds. They will be just fine. You'll know immediatly if it's not an MJ seed for crying out loud. I've never gotten a seed that I beileved was crossed with dandelion. I know that cross-polination is possible, but more than likely you've just got an MJ seed.

I've seen many a good grow here completed on bagseeds. There's a good chance you'll end up killing them or somewhat destroying them in the first 30 days so it's definitely an okay practice to grow out some bagseed first.


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## digitalliquid (Oct 12, 2009)

i got some bubblegum seeds , but before i started those i started 2 bag seeds and im totaly happy i did because it helped me catch alot of problems before i just started those bubblegum. also i have seen some good lookin bag seeds on this site.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 13, 2009)

Okay, okay. Bagseed on your first run is okay. NONE of you (that has had more than 6 harvests) can say that you've had better results with bagseed than real seeds. Sure there are exceptions to both kinds.

In my opinion. (1-10 rating)
Bagseed: Average seed = 4 Best you'll find = 6
Attitude Seed: Average seed = 7 Best you'll find = 9

I say the best is only a 9 because getting to a 10 requires a lot more than just having a good seed.

Practice with the bagseed, just don't count your pounds before the harvest. If you go into it expecting some 3 or 4 smoke, you won't be disappointed. If you thought you were growing next months rent, you may need a plan B.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 13, 2009)

And they don't look anything like a dandi-lion. You will NOT know right away. They're still mostly MJ because they came from MJ mama. They just won't be looking like the High Times cronic either.


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## laserbrn (Oct 13, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> And they don't look anything like a dandi-lion. You will NOT know right away. They're still mostly MJ because they came from MJ mama. They just won't be looking like the High Times cronic either.


I have never experienced that, but I live in So Cal. It has seeds in it and it comes from some good bud, it's generally a good seed. I've had WAYYY more than 6 harvests and granted I don't use bagseeds (I don't like the high likelyhood of hermies). It's not because it was crossed with a dandelion, it's just because it's a weak ass seed from some weak ass bud if you're having that problem.

I know there are plenty of people on this site that have grown some dank buds from bagseed. And there are people who have had decent yeilds as well. The reason you probably see so many poor bagseed grows is that it's generally a first grow.


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## laserbrn (Oct 13, 2009)

There's that and the fact that you can't pollinate MJ with anything other than MJ. At least not accidentally and it doesn't just happen. Otherwise no one could grow bud outside. This has to be up there with the stupidest things I've heard. Dandelion crossed with MJ? You're so far off base here it's ridiculous.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 13, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> There's that and the fact that you can't pollinate MJ with anything other than MJ. At least not accidentally and it doesn't just happen. Otherwise no one could grow bud outside. This has to be up there with the stupidest things I've heard. Dandelion crossed with MJ? You're so far off base here it's ridiculous.


 
LOL

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pollination

"fertilization is said to be due to self-pollination (autogamy); or, the sperm may be derived from pollen originating on a different plant individual, in which case the process is called cross-pollination (heterogamy). Both processes are common, but cross-pollination clearly has certain evolutionary advantages for the species: the seeds formed may combine the *hereditary* traits of both parents"


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## laserbrn (Oct 13, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> LOL
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pollination


Thanks guy. You're still WAAAAAAAAAAY off base. Otherwise no one could ever grow bud outside without it being seeded. Get a clue guy.

MJ plans can't be cross polinated with freakin' dandelions or anything else for that matter. Try googling "Cross Polinating marijuana".

I can't figure out if you're delusional or just grossly misinformed. Lots of people grow bagseed and I've never seen a strange looking plant come from it that would lead me to believe it was 'cross polinated' by some other wild flower. 

C'mon....Don't continue spreadin misinformation, especially stuff that's just so ridiculous.

"Don't grow bagseed because it's likely MJ crossed with some other wild plant?". That's something you spread alot? It's horseshit.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 13, 2009)

I guess you've never had outdoor with a bunch of seeds in it? I have and there were no male MJ nearby. I've also had some with very few seeds, but they were still there. Not ALL pollen will work. Dandi-lions probably won't, but MANY types of "wind pollenated" grasses will. 

Whatever.... Keep growin bagseed Pimp!!!!! More power to ya.


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## laserbrn (Oct 13, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> I guess you've never had outdoor with a bunch of seeds in it? I have and there were no male MJ nearby. I've also had some with very few seeds, but they were still there. Not ALL pollen will work. Dandi-lions probably won't, but MANY types of "wind pollenated" grasses will.
> 
> Whatever.... Keep growin bagseed Pimp!!!!! More power to ya.


 
Some people just can't admit when they are wrong...

You can't even cross polinate marijuana with hops and they are both in the cannabis family. You're so wrong on this it's disgusting. You really should just stop as you look like a doorknob to anyone who's been around and knows anything about this plant.

It's been tried to cross-polinate this plant for CENTURIES and it doesn't happen. It's been tried in labs over and over and you're claiming it just "happens" for you? Bullshit, you got male parts on some of your outdoor plants and instead of doing any research you jumped to your own conclusion. 

Like I said, I don't grow bagseed. I like knowing what the genetics I am working with are. I have used bagseed in the past when testing new growing methods. I started out on clones from dispensaries so I never went the bagseed route from the start, but it's a good practice and I can guarantee 100% you don't have a cross polinated seed.

Start a new thread about this topic, you'll feel pretty retarded.


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## laserbrn (Oct 13, 2009)

I have actually changed my signature so that I don't forget this asinine assertion. LOL


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## smokingrubber (Oct 13, 2009)

Sweet, Immortality  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immortality


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## smokingrubber (Oct 13, 2009)

Learn something new every day I guess.

http://books.google.com/books?id=fERzFsZhdxYC&pg=PA428&lpg=PA428&dq=marijuana+wind+pollination&source=bl&ots=t0SwbsMFPo&sig=4phqb9JR1k5d0XIq0HeSMhhX2D0&hl=en&ei=yLrUSuLqLoH8sQO5m63PCg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=8&ved=0CCMQ6AEwBw#v=onepage&q=&f=false

It says that MJ can only be pollinated by MJ. My bad.


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## hayzeheven (Oct 13, 2009)

I just have to say lmfao at smokingrubber, this mofo must actually smoke rubber. Cuz his brain is on cancer mode. I've been reading this whole thread and it's hilarious. Dandilion bud. Lmfao hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

seriously it IS that funny... Like The kid I was talking to who thought his plant was mj and it was a weed. HAHAHAHAHA

look below for signature, lollooks like somethin this dude smokingrubber would say


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## laserbrn (Oct 13, 2009)

hayzeheven said:


> I just have to say lmfao at smokingrubber, this mofo must actually smoke rubber. Cuz his brain is on cancer mode. I've been reading this whole thread and it's hilarious. Dandilion bud. Lmfao hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
> 
> seriously it IS that funny... Like The kid I was talking to who thought his plant was mj and it was a weed. HAHAHAHAHA
> 
> look below for signature, lollooks like somethin this dude smokingrubber would say


 
Well, in his defense he finally admitted it. I thought for sure no matter how much research he did and how much information he found he was going to claim it's happened to him AND that it's commonplace. I'm glad he did look it up and learned something new today.

What did he learn? The definition of a species. Nice.

Still really funny shit though, I'm glad it happened today, otherwise today has been shit.


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## Bob Smith (Oct 13, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> Well, in his defense he finally admitted it. I thought for sure no matter how much research he did and how much information he found he was going to claim it's happened to him AND that it's commonplace. I'm glad he did look it up and learned something new today.
> 
> What did he learn? The definition of a species. Nice.
> 
> Still really funny shit though, I'm glad it happened today, otherwise today has been shit.


Just checking in on this thread and catching up and this shit is ludicrous.

He admitted his mistake so I'm not gonna harp on it, but it just shows you that you need to research where you're getting your information from before you just accept it at face value.

Wowsers.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 13, 2009)

I originally heard it from someone here. And after seeing some of the bullshit grown from bagseed, it didn't seem too far-fetched. Glad you all had a good laugh, but insults are unnessesary. I'm here seeking knowledge, and I found some today. 

It still doesn't mean I'm going to start some bagseed.


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## anon1122 (Oct 13, 2009)

Just catching up on what I missed. Anyway, just got back from HTG and got some hydroton and some fox farm "dont bug me" organic pesticide. They have a really freakin nice retail store!

Im not going to be growing bag seed, just something insignificant to test the setup with. Still waiting for seed to crack, hopefully soon.

Now, can I get some serious seed suggestions so I know what to order friday?

Nothing x'ed with dandelion though.

Sorry rubber, had to. Now let's let that shit die. lol.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 13, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Now, can I get some serious seed suggestions so I know what to order friday?
> 
> Nothing x'ed with dandelion though.
> 
> Sorry rubber, had to. Now let's let that shit die. lol.


 
You too? 

No love! LOL. I understand.

I've had good luck with almost everything I've gotten from World of Seeds (attitude). Prices are very good compared to a lot of other outlets. I can vouch for Strawberry-Blue or Yumbolt. That link I suggested the other day looks VERY good, but I've not actually grown it.


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## anon1122 (Oct 13, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> You too?
> 
> No love! LOL. I understand.
> 
> I've had good luck with almost everything I've gotten from World of Seeds (attitude). Prices are very good compared to a lot of other outlets. I can vouch for Strawberry-Blue or Yumbolt. That link I suggested the other day looks VERY good, but I've not actually grown it.


Thanks man, I'll give those a look. I appreciate all the help everyone is giving.


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## laserbrn (Oct 13, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Thanks man, I'll give those a look. I appreciate all the help everyone is giving.


I orderered Dutch Passions White Widow from them and me and my friends are NOT unhappy. We live in socal and this weed is a BLAST and can hang with the best of 'em. Definitely fun to grow and great to smoke.


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## anon1122 (Oct 13, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> I orderered Dutch Passions White Widow from them and me and my friends are NOT unhappy. We live in socal and this weed is a BLAST and can hang with the best of 'em. Definitely fun to grow and great to smoke.



I think im going to go with that. Plus, you get two freebies!


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## anon1122 (Oct 13, 2009)

are able to get to the mid 80's. that's ok right? 90 and above is cause for concern right?


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## laserbrn (Oct 14, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> are able to get to the mid 80's. that's ok right? 90 and above is cause for concern right?


You should work to get them down lower than that, but they should survive in that temp.


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## steven22 (Oct 14, 2009)

how is that tent?... im thinking of getting one cause its really cheap compared to the sunhuts or homebox ones....any pros n cons?


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## anon1122 (Oct 14, 2009)

steven22 said:


> how is that tent?... im thinking of getting one cause its really cheap compared to the sunhuts or homebox ones....any pros n cons?


Dude, buy the homebox or sun hut. seriously, I wish I would have. It's a bitch to try to hang any kind of weight from the "supports" Spend the extra $ and do it right. I cut one corner and have kicked my ass for it ever since. Im sure it will be good for a veg tent once I expand but for right now, I am going to forge ahead and do what I can.


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## anon1122 (Oct 14, 2009)

Ok, I pulled the trigger and ordered.

5 Dutch Passion white widow feminized

1 Barney's Farm Blue Cheese Feminized

1 Free DNA Genetics LA Woman

1 Free DNA Genetics LA Confidential

1 Free DNA Genetics Lemon Skunk

White widow is up to bat for the first round. The rest will be stored for future mothers post expansion. 

The game plan is as follows:

Grow 2-3 white widow seeds, take 15 clones. Keep the best 12, veg for 2-3 weeks in which time I will top for 2-4 main colas and eliminate under growth. Then throw them into flower.

So if all goes well and according to plan I am hoping for a harvest in feb-march. I am going to build an aero cloner by following the blueprints laid out by stinkbud.

Sound like a solid plan?


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## laserbrn (Oct 15, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Ok, I pulled the trigger and ordered.
> 
> 5 Dutch Passion white widow feminized
> 
> ...


Sounds like A plan, but not the best plan. The way I did it (by the way, that's what's in my avatar right there) was to plant ALL of the seeds. Veg them for about month (I had 10 seeds) you may need longer as you have fewer beans. 

Take clones from all of them and label them carefully. Flower you original beans and keep a watchful eye for hermies. Any of them that pop male parts make sure to kill any clones that came from that one. Don't need hermie traits in your garden for the future.

Note which plant performed the absolute best. Didn't have any troubles with nutrients, didn't act weak, produced the most buds, etc. I would maybe take the top 2 or 3 so that you can put together another batch really quickly, but ultimately you want it down to a flowering room full of the best cuttings you could get from those 5 beans.

Not all seeds are equal. And just because they are the same strain doesn't mean they perform the same. They actually just don't. Each plant will have it's own unique genetic mixture and you only want the best of the best. That's how you get a grow room full of donkey dick buds.

In my first go around I had one plant that was about 2 1/2 oz's while I had another one that only gave me maybe 1 1/2 oz's. I had some that developed "The Claw" from over ferting, and some that looked hungry and starving from underferting. It's definitely best to get clones of the ones you think will produce best for the future.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 15, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> Sounds like A plan, but not the best plan. The way I did it (by the way, that's what's in my avatar right there) was to plant ALL of the seeds. Veg them for about month (I had 10 seeds) you may need longer as you have fewer beans.
> 
> Take clones from all of them and label them carefully. Flower you original beans and keep a watchful eye for hermies. Any of them that pop male parts make sure to kill any clones that came from that one. Don't need hermie traits in your garden for the future.
> 
> ...


Yeah labeling is important. One of my earlier rounds, I had 10 White Widows so I labeled everything WW. That was fine until I took cuttings and labeled all that WW too! When the 1st gen went to flower and a couple didn't perform up to par. I was stuck trying to guess liniage. Not good. That was the end of the WWs.

Like he said, not all beans are created equal even from the same bag.

Most of the free seeds I've grown were not very impressive. Those were from G13 labs though and I know they're not sending those now. Last time, they sent me a Blue Hash, that's going right now, that I'm definately going to order more of.

If I were you, I would germ them all.


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## anon1122 (Oct 17, 2009)

went to htg again yesterday and bought the fox farm solubles, seedling heating mat, and new containers. Also determined the problem about the light taking forever to start up is because of the bulb, not ballast. yay! Can someone explain what a mh conversion bulb is? Anyway, we should be seeing some action this week so stick with me guys, I know it's taken a while, but it will be worth it to see how things turn out.


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## anon1122 (Oct 18, 2009)

Built a couple small bubble cloners and bought two small 75w t8 lights. Rigged it up inside a dresser so it's all stealth-like. We'll see how that goes. Waiting on my seeds from attitude. hopefully tomorrow. fingers crossed...

Going back to HTG this week to get a 600 sunmaster conversion mh, and a 600 watt sunmaster hps. And maybe some light hangers that work better than these pieces of shit I have.

So yeah, this week is go time! I'm gonna need you guys, you with me?


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## smokingrubber (Oct 19, 2009)

Take it one step at a time bro. Get the seeds . . . germ the seeds . . . talk to the sprouts . . . not too much water . . . not too much light . . . love the ladies  You're 4 or more weeks from needing the MH setup. Let them make Happy under the floro's til they're about a foot tall. Then, let there be LIGHT.

Did you germ the bagseed already or are you going to start everything at the same time? How many seeds are you going to do? Do you have access to clones in your area?


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## anon1122 (Oct 19, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> Take it one step at a time bro. Get the seeds . . . germ the seeds . . . talk to the sprouts . . . not too much water . . . not too much light . . . love the ladies  You're 4 or more weeks from needing the MH setup. Let them make Happy under the floro's til they're about a foot tall. Then, let there be LIGHT.
> 
> Did you germ the bagseed already or are you going to start everything at the same time? How many seeds are you going to do? Do you have access to clones in your area?


Got the seeds today. Going to start germing them in a while. Will the two 75 watt t8's be enough? Im thinking about putting them into the hydrofarm running one flood a day and keeping the hps up high. then switch to mh as soon as I get the conversion bulb.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 19, 2009)

I haven't flooded them that early, so I don't know what will happen. I've killed my fair share by over-watering though. That may be too much for the young sprouts to handle. IMO you should stick them in there and just spray by hand for a few weeks. 

T8's should be fine if they're at least a foot away.

Write down your process and keep a log so that you can repeat or adjust your process effectively. You think you'd remember that stuff, but after a few months have gone by and you've had several harvests, it's easy to forget small details. If you have problems, you can easily relate your steps to (forum) experts and get solid advise. And you'll be able to see what you've done differently from one grow to the next and see their results.


----------



## laserbrn (Oct 19, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> I haven't flooded them that early, so I don't know what will happen. I've killed my fair share by over-watering though. That may be too much for the young sprouts to handle. IMO you should stick them in there and just spray by hand for a few weeks.
> 
> T8's should be fine if they're at least a foot away.
> 
> Write down your process and keep a log so that you can repeat or adjust your process effectively. You think you'd remember that stuff, but after a few months have gone by and you've had several harvests, it's easy to forget small details. If you have problems, you can easily relate your steps to (forum) experts and get solid advise. And you'll be able to see what you've done differently from one grow to the next and see their results.


 
I'm not an expert on T8's, but my T5 HO's need to be about 24" in from seedlings. I also don't flood that early at all. Hand water for a while. Only water when they are dry, but don't go too long. In small rockwool cubes I have to water about once a day and just enough to keep the rockwool moist. I'd say after a week or two (about 3 real sets of leaves) put them on the flood.


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## anon1122 (Oct 19, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> I'm not an expert on T8's, but my T5 HO's need to be about 24" in from seedlings. I also don't flood that early at all. Hand water for a while. Only water when they are dry, but don't go too long. In small rockwool cubes I have to water about once a day and just enough to keep the rockwool moist. I'd say after a week or two (about 3 real sets of leaves) put them on the flood.


How long before I start mild nutes? What ppm should I start them out at and at what point in time? I used to grow clones in WA, but now with things how they are in my current locale, that is not an option, so I am new at growing from seed. Thanks!


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## anon1122 (Oct 19, 2009)

3 white widows are germinating now. I kept 2 to fall back on if needed.


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## laserbrn (Oct 20, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> 3 white widows are germinating now. I kept 2 to fall back on if needed.


You don't need nutes for awhile. I start them at 50ppm and work them over 4 days to 200ppm. I don't start until I actually either A) see the first signs of hungry plants or B) the plant has 3 or 4 nodes. I leave them at 200-300ppm for a week or two. They are really quite happy generally on minimal nutes. Then I start bumping them up by 50ppm per day until I reach 600ppm and I leave them there until flower.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 20, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> You don't need nutes for awhile. I start them at 50ppm and work them over 4 days to 200ppm. I don't start until I actually either A) see the first signs of hungry plants or B) the plant has 3 or 4 nodes. I leave them at 200-300ppm for a week or two. They are really quite happy generally on minimal nutes. Then I start bumping them up by 50ppm per day until I reach 600ppm and I leave them there until flower.


 
That sounds about right to me. I go with no nutes for about a week (the clone juice and spray has root hormone in it). The next week they get 50% nutes, then they go on the drip feeder at 75% grow nute. One week at 75% then they get 100% till flower (900-1100ppm). When they go to flower, the ppm is 1500. 

My only problem has been finding a nute recipe that works for everyone. When you've got 4 different strains, someone isn't happy. I'm trying to weed out the strains that don't do well in my garden, but you can't tell till you do it.


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## laserbrn (Oct 20, 2009)

yeah, I tried growing WW and Blue Cheese at the same time and it was a disaster. The White Widow was starving and the Blue Cheese was choking from over feeding. This go around I'm just doing the white widow by itself. No room for those that can't keep up. Oh, and this DP White Widow is the shit, so it was an easy choice.


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## anon1122 (Oct 20, 2009)

Yeah, the 3 widows are germing now since last night, I wanna go check on them all the time. The paper towel dried out a little bit today, but I moistened it again. Im just hoping they pop soon. I have the other seeds stored away for later on. how long for germination 24-48?


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## laserbrn (Oct 20, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Yeah, the 3 widows are germing now since last night, I wanna go check on them all the time. The paper towel dried out a little bit today, but I moistened it again. Im just hoping they pop soon. I have the other seeds stored away for later on. how long for germination 24-48?


Just put the seeds directly in your medium, wet it and forget it man! Don't mess with this paper towel business.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 20, 2009)

I just drop them in a cup of distilled water (about an inch of water in a dixie). Place them in the dark and they pop in about 36-48 hours. Mr. Green's method. Works every time.


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## anon1122 (Oct 20, 2009)

One popped open but I put all 3 into rockwool and gently covered the opening. I turned on the t8's and put them roughly 4 inches above the rockwool. Sound good?


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## steven22 (Oct 21, 2009)

How is that fan and filter?

I just bought a homebox XL 4x4x6? and Im on a budget... that fan looks to be a sweet price with the right specs.... how does it function though?... you said you regret getting the tent because you skimped on it.


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## anon1122 (Oct 21, 2009)

steven22 said:


> How is that fan and filter?
> 
> I just bought a homebox XL 4x4x6? and Im on a budget... that fan looks to be a sweet price with the right specs.... how does it function though?... you said you regret getting the tent because you skimped on it.



Fan is great, but the filter is fucking HUGE. Yes for the fan, look for a different filter.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 21, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> One popped open but I put all 3 into rockwool and gently covered the opening. I turned on the t8's and put them roughly 4 inches above the rockwool. Sound good?


 
4 inches? NO. Try 18-24 inches away for the first week. Make sure you have a fan on low (not high enough to dry out the rockwool in 10 minutes). After the first week, you can start to feed them some nutes and lower the light.


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## laserbrn (Oct 21, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> 4 inches? NO. Try 18-24 inches away for the first week. Make sure you have a fan on low (not high enough to dry out the rockwool in 10 minutes). After the first week, you can start to feed them some nutes and lower the light.


 
Agreed....24" my man. Don't put that light right down on them yet. It'll just slow them down.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 21, 2009)

Anon, you regret getting the tent? Why? 

I just bought this tent: http://www.hydroponicsoutlet.com/GrowLab-145-p/syseigl145.htm

And this hydro system: http://www.horticulturesource.com/product_info.php?products_id=4490

I'll be setting it all up in about 2 weeks. I was excited, but why do you regret getting it?


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## anon1122 (Oct 21, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> Anon, you regret getting the tent? Why?
> 
> I just bought this tent: http://www.hydroponicsoutlet.com/GrowLab-145-p/syseigl145.htm
> 
> ...



That is the tent I wish I would have gotten. The one I got is cheap and has almost NO support for any kind of weight.

That hydro system looks solid though. Should be able to grow some TREES with that. Im going small for my first one though using the hydrofarm.

I raised the lights up. All 3 have cracked, 2 have their seed casings poking out, so anytime now...


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## smokingrubber (Oct 21, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> That is the tent I wish I would have gotten. The one I got is cheap and has almost NO support for any kind of weight.
> 
> That hydro system looks solid though. Should be able to grow some TREES with that. Im going small for my first one though using the hydrofarm.
> 
> I raised the lights up. All 3 have cracked, 2 have their seed casings poking out, so anytime now...


This is me going "small" too  If I start it with clones in a couple weeks, we'll probably harvest at the same time. I've still got a bunch of stuff to buy though. I desperately need a RO system before I start, because buying 55 gallons of distilled from Safeway would really suck.


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## anon1122 (Oct 21, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> This is me going "small" too  If I start it with clones in a couple weeks, we'll probably harvest at the same time. I've still got a bunch of stuff to buy though. I desperately need a RO system before I start, because buying 55 gallons of distilled from Safeway would really suck.


Yeah, the people at the store look at me a little funny with 10 gallons at a time, I cant imagine 55. lol.

I am going to grow these out and take clones from the best one and then I will put them all into flower, so hopefully I'll harvest around feb-march, sound right?


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## smokingrubber (Oct 21, 2009)

Yeah, that sounds pretty close. Depends on how long you intend to grow them out, and how long you intend to veg the clones. 

Figure you can take clones in about 4-6 weeks. Of course, you'll probably only get 3 or 4 clones off each when they're that small. Then you should veg the clones for about 6 weeks, and it'll take 8-10 weeks to flower. If you add in 2 weeks to cure . . . you're smoking 20-24 weeks from now. That's mid March to mid April.

You shouldn't be too impatient with the Veg stage. The bigger it is, the more bud you'll have. Of course, a lot depends on the size of your room, the amount of Co2 it's getting and the amount of light. But basically, if the clones are only big enough to hold an eighth . . . that's about what you'll get out of it. Plus, the clones have to have a root system that's established enough to suck up water when you flood.


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## anon1122 (Oct 21, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> Yeah, that sounds pretty close. Depends on how long you intend to grow them out, and how long you intend to veg the clones.
> 
> Figure you can take clones in about 4-6 weeks. Of course, you'll probably only get 3 or 4 clones off each when they're that small. Then you should veg the clones for about 6 weeks, and it'll take 8-10 weeks to flower. If you add in 2 weeks to cure . . . you're smoking 20-24 weeks from now. That's mid March to mid April.
> 
> You shouldn't be too impatient with the Veg stage. The bigger it is, the more bud you'll have. Of course, a lot depends on the size of your room, the amount of Co2 it's getting and the amount of light. But basically, if the clones are only big enough to hold an eighth . . . that's about what you'll get out of it. Plus, the clones have to have a root system that's established enough to suck up water when you flood.


I want to veg long enough where I can top it to get two tops and hopefully a oz to an oz and a half each. just lollipopping them.


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## l333t (Oct 21, 2009)

nice grow, don't veg to big, when flowing they can grow


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## smokingrubber (Oct 22, 2009)

I don't think lolipopping will result in 1½ oz on each plant. They'll be a LOT closer to ½ oz. Of course, that all depends on your definition of a lolipop.


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## anon1122 (Oct 22, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> I don't think lolipopping will result in 1½ oz on each plant. They'll be a LOT closer to ½ oz. Of course, that all depends on your definition of a lolipop.



well, top it into 2 or 4 tops and then trim the undergrowth.


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## anon1122 (Oct 22, 2009)

The seed casings have dropped but the cotyledons have not opened yet. Maybe soon...


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## smokingrubber (Oct 22, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> well, top it into 2 or 4 tops and then trim the undergrowth.


 
What does trimming the undergrowth do? There is a lot of quality bud down there. That's the bud I (er. my friend) sell and I smoke the colas.


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## anon1122 (Oct 22, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> What does trimming the undergrowth do? There is a lot of quality bud down there. That's the bud I (er. my friend) sell and I smoke the colas.



I've been reading on here that trimming the undergrowth will make the plant focus on making bigger and heavier colas. I think that with a dozen clones vegged for a month that have been topped and the undergrowth removed, an oz+ per plant is not an unrealistic goal. I'm not counting my chickens or anything, just hopeful thinking.


Anyone know which pheno I should be looking for with DP White Widow, heaviest and stoniest?

PS. Cotyledons are opening.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 22, 2009)

I'm sure it WILL make the top cola bigger, but I doubt the top will grow faster than the stuff you're trimming off the bottom. Seriously, there is a lot of bud down there by the time it's ready for harvest.

One oz per plant is not unrealistic. It just depends on a LOT of other variables. 

Also, large colas can develop mold a little easier. Now if you focus on creating one big bud and that bud goes moldy . . . you've lost most of your crop. Mold sucks! How are you planning on handling your humidity levels?


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## anon1122 (Oct 22, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> I'm sure it WILL make the top cola bigger, but I doubt the top will grow faster than the stuff you're trimming off the bottom. Seriously, there is a lot of bud down there by the time it's ready for harvest.
> 
> One oz per plant is not unrealistic. It just depends on a LOT of other variables.
> 
> Also, large colas can develop mold a little easier. Now if you focus on creating one big bud and that bud goes moldy . . . you've lost most of your crop. Mold sucks! How are you planning on handling your humidity levels?


I have ran my system without plants in it and the RH stays at 40% Im sure this will jump by 10-15% with plants in there and the hydro system running. But I do have a small de-humidifier on hand in case things go awry. Maybe I will trim the undergrowth on half, and let the other half do its thing and Ill compare results. Im all about trying and learning new things and finding the best and most efficient way of doing things.

I have the full fox farm line of nutes, the liquids and the solubles. and I am going to get some stuff called "gravity" It's made by humboldt nutrients and it supposedly makes your flowers super dense.

This is a cash crop for me, but i'm also a stickler for quality. I'm trying to have the best of both worlds. I've grown before when I lived in Washington state, but it was always from clones, and now that I'm back east in a non med-friendly state, seed is my only option because I don't know anyone here that grows. And it kills me because I know I am probably less than 2 or 3 degrees of separation from someone who does.

I don't really feel comfortable disclosing my state or exact location, so it's sketchy trying to make friends on here to co-op with. I am hoping from a dozen clones that I can yield anywhere from 16-18 oz keeping back 4-6 for myself.


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## anon1122 (Oct 24, 2009)

The little ones seemed to be stretching a lot, so Im trying to introduce them to HID lighting for a few hours today and see how they do. The cotyldeons are out and tiny jagged leaves are starting to come out, but the plant is like almost 4" tall including the rockwool. So I dont think those floros were enough. How much longer till I fill the res and give some light nutes?


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## smokingrubber (Oct 24, 2009)

You can move the light to about 4 in away. Depending on the heat of the floro tube. In a couple days, you can put the small rockwool into a 3" rockwool. Don't flood yet. When you see roots coming out the bottom, you can go to the next stage.

You're at 50% nutes once a day right? Patience. It doesn't happen overnight.


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## anon1122 (Oct 24, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> You can move the light to about 4 in away. Depending on the heat of the floro tube. In a couple days, you can put the small rockwool into a 3" rockwool. Don't flood yet. When you see roots coming out the bottom, you can go to the next stage.
> 
> You're at 50% nutes once a day right? Patience. It doesn't happen overnight.


I haven't been giving them nutes at all the past couple days. Im going to mix 1/4 strength nutes and flood it manually once a day. I have them under the hps but its a couple feet above them. So it's not too intense.


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## jmanno1 (Oct 24, 2009)

people if you wanna no the best brand of grow tent is grow lush tried them all now l use the best


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## anon1122 (Oct 25, 2009)

jmanno1 said:


> people if you wanna no the best brand of grow tent is grow lush tried them all now l use the best



Keep your advertising off this thread please.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 26, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> I haven't been giving them nutes at all the past couple days. Im going to mix 1/4 strength nutes and flood it manually once a day. I have them under the hps but its a couple feet above them. So it's not too intense.


Sounds good  Got a fan in there too right.

I'm working on my stuff slowly but surely. Im still in "buying shit" mode, but a lot of the major pieces are here. I opened the grolab box last night and spread it out in my living room. Good times. You might save some money, but some of this crap online takes forever to arrive.


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## stonedgrappler (Oct 26, 2009)

So what is the verdict on the filter being outside/inside? I am new to a tent and looking at getting one and I have some questions. If anyone would take the time to answer any of them I would be greatful. 

1. Is a 1000W sodium too much for a 4x4 tent?

2. should I hook the exhaust fan right to the filter and keep the fan outside thus forcing the air from inside the tent to be pushed out of the tent and through the filter(which is outside the tent)? 

3. I am confused as to why you would leave the filter inside the tent? How does this eliminate odor? Help me out here. I don't think heat will be in issue as I will be setting this up in my garage, which will be cold in the witer. 

Thanks in advance for any tips. Also, if anyone can provide a link with a growtent set up guide i would much appreciate it.


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## anon1122 (Oct 26, 2009)

stonedgrappler said:


> So what is the verdict on the filter being outside/inside? I am new to a tent and looking at getting one and I have some questions. If anyone would take the time to answer any of them I would be greatful.
> 
> 1. Is a 1000W sodium too much for a 4x4 tent?
> 
> ...


I've only got a couple minutes right now, but I'll do my best to go through and answer your questions tonight.


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## SmokeyMcChokey (Oct 26, 2009)

phabphour20 said:


> Very nice Setup bro!Who makes that tent if you dont mind me asking?Does that light setup you have put out alot of heat?i want to put togehter exactley what you have there minus the hydro table.


 i bought an the exact same tent from a site called LA somethin or other the box came marked darkroom. but the instructions said LA hydro or whatever the site was. i love it. i works well and i have almost the same setup as he does. only a 400 watter with a digigreenhouse ballast tho.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 26, 2009)

stonedgrappler said:


> So what is the verdict on the filter being outside/inside? I am new to a tent and looking at getting one and I have some questions. If anyone would take the time to answer any of them I would be greatful.
> 
> 1. Is a 1000W sodium too much for a 4x4 tent?
> 
> ...


I'm about to start a 4x4 grow, but here's what I know.

1. 1000 watts a LOT of light, but not too much. 

2 & 3. The filter goes inside the tent. Then run the duct from the filter to the air-cooled light hood. Then run the duct from the light to the fan outside the tent. This sucks the dirty air through the filter (cleaning it) and past the light (cooling it). Make sure you have a source of fresh air for a direct intake.

1000 watts is not too much light, but it's way too much heat. You will need to use an air-cooled hood (cool sun XL). The intense amount of light also creates humidity problems in some instances. Make sure you're keeping an eye on it.


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## stonedgrappler (Oct 26, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> I'm about to start a 4x4 grow, but here's what I know.
> 
> 1. 1000 watts a LOT of light, but not too much.
> 
> ...


 
I am not too worried about heat because it will be in the garage and temps there outside the box will probably be between around 55-65F and I will have a small fan bringing air in the tent. 

My next question is should I have the exhaust fan on the one side of the tent and the intake on the other? Won't this mess with air circulation? If I do this I assume the air will just go in and get sucked right out causing only the top half of my tent to get fresh air. Would it be a better idea to put the intake fans near the bottom of the tent and the exhaust on the top of the tent on the opposite side?


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## stonedgrappler (Oct 26, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> I'm about to start a 4x4 grow, but here's what I know.
> 
> 
> 2 & 3. The filter goes inside the tent. Then run the duct from the filter to the air-cooled light hood. Then run the duct from the light to the fan outside the tent. This sucks the dirty air through the filter (cleaning it) and past the light (cooling it). Make sure you have a source of fresh air for a direct intake.


 
How does this eliminate odor? Am I to assume that odor won't get out because it is airtight? I was under the impression that the filter should be attached to an exhaust fan outside the tent so the hot, smelly air would pass through the filter and leave the tent(and into my garage) without smell. I am confused about this one step. I understand running the intake fans to the light and exhausting it on the other side of the light to cool the bulb but I'm still a little confused about the filter.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 26, 2009)

stonedgrappler said:


> My next question is should I have the exhaust fan on the one side of the tent and the intake on the other? Won't this mess with air circulation? If I do this I assume the air will just go in and get sucked right out causing only the top half of my tent to get fresh air. Would it be a better idea to put the intake fans near the bottom of the tent and the exhaust on the top of the tent on the opposite side?


Intake and exhaust holes should be pre-installed in most tents. Intakes are located at the bottom. Run a FRESH air line from the outside world to your intakes. Don't use the recycled air from inside the garage, you need fresh co2.


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## smokingrubber (Oct 26, 2009)

stonedgrappler said:


> How does this eliminate odor? Am I to assume that odor won't get out because it is airtight? I was under the impression that the filter should be attached to an exhaust fan outside the tent so the hot, smelly air would pass through the filter and leave the tent(and into my garage) without smell. I am confused about this one step. I understand running the intake fans to the light and exhausting it on the other side of the light to cool the bulb but I'm still a little confused about the filter.


Note: the filter comes with a pre-filter. This is just a scrub pad wrapped around the outside of the filter. They call it a "pre" filter because it's the first filter the air gets passed through when it gets SUCKED through. 

Air goes INTO the filter and it gets cleaned. It passes by the light and takes the hot, clean air out into your garage. Since the filter is SUCKING air in, the tent doesn't need to be air-tight as it's creating negative pressure inside the tent (smells can't get out). Therefore, all air leaving the tent gets passed through the filter.


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## stonedgrappler (Oct 26, 2009)

Still a bit confused. I guess I'll have to wait and experiment.


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## laserbrn (Oct 26, 2009)

stonedgrappler said:


> How does this eliminate odor? Am I to assume that odor won't get out because it is airtight? I was under the impression that the filter should be attached to an exhaust fan outside the tent so the hot, smelly air would pass through the filter and leave the tent(and into my garage) without smell. I am confused about this one step. I understand running the intake fans to the light and exhausting it on the other side of the light to cool the bulb but I'm still a little confused about the filter.


I run mine the way you describe here and it works brilliantly. You can put the filter right outside the tent in the garage. Set the fan on top of the filter and run a duct into the tent and into your light. This will draw the warm air from the light out as well as the stanky air from the tent. It will pass through the filter and out into the garage.

Now this way works....but it is not the most efficient setup...

The most efficient way is to actually put the filter IN the tent up at the top and connect the fan to it. I don't run it this way because it's more of a PITA and I run a much bigger filter than most people (I used to have a bigger grow space). 

Honestly with my 365cfm fan it's about a 2 degree difference if I put the filter in the tent versus outside the tent. Doesn't have much effect.


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## CasteR (Oct 26, 2009)

Hey man i've been reading your entire setuip it looks nice. 

I was bummed because as i was reading through i noticed early on you asked for suggestions for attitude strains to buy and nobody seemed to answer you right away, i was hoping to catch you before you ordered to request aurora indica. I'm on my 2nd aurora indica grow now and its a great strain. very hearty strain grows short, is primarily indica and very potent. also flowering times are pretty low too. but since you've already ordered write it down for next time or something i guess haha.

anyways, sick lookin setup, can't wait to see some plants in there


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## stiffla (Oct 27, 2009)

anon1122

hi there ive just read all the tread and its sounds like your having plenty of fun and been given alot of very good advice, the thing is im setting up my very first budbox's and need to know how to start a thread so people can help me and give me advice cheers mate and keep up the good work with them babies


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## anon1122 (Nov 1, 2009)

Hi everyone! I've been very busy with work and working in the tent. Things are going fairly well at the moment. All 3 plants are growing at a healthy rate.


Plant A is tall, long 1st set of jagged leaves and the second set of leaves are coming in nicely, leaves look to be thinnish. Tallest one of all 3.

Plant B is also tall, not much shorter than A. It's first set of jagged leaves are long, not as long as A, and more wide. First set of jaggeds are pointing down slightly. 

Plant C is kinda a runt, short, first set of jagged leaves are droopy but second set are fine. Not yellowing or anything, just droopy.

All plants are already growing a 3rd set of leaves.

I have nutes set to 1/4 strength at roughly 140 ppm, and I keep ph between 5.8 and 6.1 Lights come on at 7 am and off at 1 am. fits into my work schedule, I work odd hours. 

I flood manually once or twice a day. what times would be optimal to flood given the hours the light is on? Does it matter if it only takes 5 minutes to flood but my timer only goes in 15 minute intervals, would the extra 10 minutes of soaking be detrimental?

I will have pictures up in the next couple days, I promise!


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## smokingrubber (Nov 2, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> I have nutes set to 1/4 strength at roughly 140 ppm, and I keep ph between 5.8 and 6.1 Lights come on at 7 am and off at 1 am. fits into my work schedule, I work odd hours.


Get the ppm up to 400-500.

Flood when the lights come on and again 9 hours later. Do that for the entire veg period. Flooding for 20 minutes is not a problem. If things look a little yellow, water only once a day.


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## laserbrn (Nov 2, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> Get the ppm up to 400-500.
> 
> Flood when the lights come on and again 9 hours later. Do that for the entire veg period. Flooding for 20 minutes is not a problem. If things look a little yellow, water only once a day.


You are smoking rocks. Didn't even need nutes yet. Don't raise your nutrient levels! Seedlings are fine in hydro until the 3rd set of leaves show. Then it's time to get started on nutrients. Don't get your nutes up to 400ppm or you'll burn them for sure and they will grow slower. Leave them at 140ppm if they are doing okay with it for a couple of weeks. They won't grow faster because you added more nutrients. You want them to grow faster, use more lights. Play it safe with the nutes and restrain yourself.


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## anon1122 (Nov 2, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> You are smoking rocks. Didn't even need nutes yet. Don't raise your nutrient levels! Seedlings are fine in hydro until the 3rd set of leaves show. Then it's time to get started on nutrients. Don't get your nutes up to 400ppm or you'll burn them for sure and they will grow slower. Leave them at 140ppm if they are doing okay with it for a couple of weeks. They won't grow faster because you added more nutrients. You want them to grow faster, use more lights. Play it safe with the nutes and restrain yourself.



They were showing a tinge of yellowing the past couple days so I flushed them really well and will give them some plain water for a couple days. What will they look like when they WANT nutes?

I checked the roots on plant c today and they are abundant and healthy. So I can only imagine what A and B look like, but I dont want to cause damage so I am leaving them alone. 

So yeah pictures. Maybe tonight if I can acquire a digital camera.


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## smokingrubber (Nov 3, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> You are smoking rocks. Didn't even need nutes yet. Don't raise your nutrient levels! Seedlings are fine in hydro until the 3rd set of leaves show. Then it's time to get started on nutrients.


I've smoked a few nugg's today, but no rocks. I don't f with that shit.  What does that mean: "seedlings are fine in hydro"? What exactly are you refering to as hydro? 

And, he said the third set was already coming in! Are you reading the conversation or just trying to attack me?


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## smokingrubber (Nov 3, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> They were showing a tinge of yellowing the past couple days so I flushed them really well and will give them some plain water for a couple days.


A tinge of yellow means too much water. Flushing them is not really nessessary unless you've given them a bunch of nutes you're trying to get rid of.

There are books that describe all of the sypmtoms of over/under nutes. I'm no botanist and it's difficult to know what advise to take around here. Invest in a books or two. A little education is never a bad thing.


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## laserbrn (Nov 3, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> I've smoked a few nugg's today, but no rocks. I don't f with that shit.  What does that mean: "seedlings are fine in hydro"? What exactly are you refering to as hydro?
> 
> And, he said the third set was already coming in! Are you reading the conversation or just trying to attack me?


Are these not being grown in hydro? I read through and follow a lot of threads and it's possible I have this one mixed up. I thought this was growin' in Rockwool w/ Hydroton using Ebb & Flow?

I could reread it, but that's just crazy, it's huge. 

When I start from seeds I feed them PLAIN water for ~ 2 weeks. By then they are on about their 3rd or 4th set of leaves. 

Veg feeding Schedule looks like this....

Week 1: 0 ppm
Week 2: 0 ppm
Week 3: 200ppm - Start the 3rd week with 50ppm. Increase by 50ppm each day until 200ppm is reached.
Week 4: 200ppm
Week 5: 300ppm
Week 6: Increase by 100ppm each day until you reach ~600ppm.

Week 7: Flowerin' time. Whole different schedule.

Some people like to pump the nutrients faster, but if you look through all of my past grow journals you will see WHY I do it this way.

Now, this is a basic guideline for what I would call "safe growing" and a good start for a first timer. This is a minimal feeding schedule and will should give you healthy plants, but not all strains are created equal. And that's where things get interesting.

Using this basic guideline I can work on determining my plants needs without risking burning them and slowing my progress. 

I am looking for these indicators in veg:

1) PPM is rising as the water level drops - Too strong. Need to add water and lower the PPM. The plants are taking up more water than nutrients.

2) PPM is falling as the water level drops - Too Weak. Plants are taking up more nutrients than water. Need to add more nutrients to keep the plants happy.

3) PPM stays steady as the water level drops - We are in the right zone.

That again is another basic guideline, I then have to look at the plants....

1) Lower leaves are starting to yellow and overall the plant looks a bit "pale"
-Pleant is underfed and she would really like some more nutrients. Don't need to be drastic, she's just a hungrier breed.

2) Plant is REALLY dark green and starting to get "The Claw". The leaf tips are beginning to curl under. - She's overfed and has too much Nitrogen. Back off the nutes for a little bit. Overfed plants aren't happy.

You'll get the hang of it over time, but it's best to start out with less.


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## anon1122 (Nov 5, 2009)

Well, I had accidentally followed smoking rubber's advice about bumping them up. it was only for one feeding but boy did it burn them good. The first set of jaggeds are almost gone, the second set have brown spots and slightly necrotic tips. I really think he is smoking rubber. I flushed thoroughly and fed with ph adjusted distilled water. Now I added nutes to 50 ppm. PH stays in the neighborhood of 5.75-6.0. Hopefully it didn't stunt them too terribly. I'm sad I listened to his advice.  But, it's a weed and it wants to grow, so i am sure they will bounce back. 


Right now lights come on at 7, watered at 8 am and 4 p.m. lights out at 1 am. How dry should rockwool be before watering again? It's still moist when it gets watered, it never dries out though. Temps hover in the mid to upper 70's. RH is around 45-50% I am discouraged seeing how my plants look compared to some people's grows on here. But I am trying to follow everything to the letter. My only real mistake so far was the one feeding of high nutes and I really hope I didn't just fuck myself.


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## laserbrn (Nov 5, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Well, I had accidentally followed smoking rubber's advice about bumping them up. it was only for one feeding but boy did it burn them good. The first set of jaggeds are almost gone, the second set have brown spots and slightly necrotic tips. I really think he is smoking rubber. I flushed thoroughly and fed with ph adjusted distilled water. Now I added nutes to 50 ppm. PH stays in the neighborhood of 5.75-6.0. Hopefully it didn't stunt them too terribly. I'm sad I listened to his advice.  But, it's a weed and it wants to grow, so i am sure they will bounce back.
> 
> 
> Right now lights come on at 7, watered at 8 am and 4 p.m. lights out at 1 am. How dry should rockwool be before watering again? It's still moist when it gets watered, it never dries out though. Temps hover in the mid to upper 70's. RH is around 45-50% I am discouraged seeing how my plants look compared to some people's grows on here. But I am trying to follow everything to the letter. My only real mistake so far was the one feeding of high nutes and I really hope I didn't just fuck myself.


He thought you bagseed could be pollenated by dandelions! He doesn't have pictures of his many grows. Watch out the advice you listen to and where it comes from. This forum is full of those that love to talk based upon what they've read, not from their growing experience.

Lesson learned, always consider the source.

Post up some pictures so we can see what's going on now. I would think that watering once a day at this stage should be fine and twice might be too much.


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## laserbrn (Nov 5, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> He thought you bagseed could be pollenated by dandelions! He doesn't have pictures of his many grows. Watch out the advice you listen to and where it comes from. This forum is full of those that love to talk based upon what they've read, not from their growing experience.
> 
> Lesson learned, always consider the source.
> 
> Post up some pictures so we can see what's going on now. I would think that watering once a day at this stage should be fine and twice might be too much.


Oh and the reason I said that if you look through my old journals you'd see why I don't feed early and don't feed strong in veg......I've burned many, many plants. Especially using AN nutes, they are strong and less is way more. Check out my current grow log, my previous grow log, I don't fuck around anymore and I've figured out how to do this without burning the plants and slowing yourself way down. And this smokingrubber guy has tried to contradict me on a few threads now and it's pissing me off that he's offering up poor advice based on shit he's just simply read somewhere. 3rd set of leaves 400ppm, told ya. That's 100% guaranteed to burn the shit out of them and it's TERRIBLE advice.

Put them back on plain water until you see new growth that is nice and green again up on top. Then move to 50ppm and leave it there for a couple of days. You need to be gentle too them. Seedlings are sensitive.

Oh yeah...and as reminder, pics please.


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## denny beezwax (Nov 6, 2009)

Man, Smoking Rubber is all over the place with some very strange and questionable advice. I saw one thread where he got in a huge "screaming" match with somebody and temporally banned. Whoa.



laserbrn said:


> Oh and the reason I said that if you look through my old journals you'd see why I don't feed early and don't feed strong in veg......I've burned many, many plants. Especially using AN nutes, they are strong and less is way more. Check out my current grow log, my previous grow log, I don't fuck around anymore and I've figured out how to do this without burning the plants and slowing yourself way down. And this smokingrubber guy has tried to contradict me on a few threads now and it's pissing me off that he's offering up poor advice based on shit he's just simply read somewhere. 3rd set of leaves 400ppm, told ya. That's 100% guaranteed to burn the shit out of them and it's TERRIBLE advice.
> 
> Put them back on plain water until you see new growth that is nice and green again up on top. Then move to 50ppm and leave it there for a couple of days. You need to be gentle too them. Seedlings are sensitive.
> 
> Oh yeah...and as reminder, pics please.


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## laserbrn (Nov 6, 2009)

denny beezwax said:


> Man, Smoking Rubber is all over the place with some very strange and questionable advice. I saw one thread where he got in a huge "screaming" match with somebody and temporally banned. Whoa.


 
Yeah after the Dandelion disagreement he should've figured out that I know what the fuck I'm talking about. I don't come on this forum often for advice anymore. I come by to help growers to figure this out with maximum chance at success. I like to share my experience with others. Not google shit, regurgitate nonsense and keep the misinformation alive. 

When I joined this forum a few years back it was RIDDLED with misinformation. What was considered to be true, simply wasn't and I destroyed my plants trying some of the shit people said. I have watched countless others, and it typically stems from the users that don't have grows under their own belt that are trying to help out other new growers.

I understand that they are trying to help. That they are trying to share the information that they know with someone seeking information. The problem is that the information that they "know" isn't always correct. The simple fact is that the information was obtained from the forum and regurgitated. Where it originated is a complete mystery and it's like playing the game "operator" as a kid.

When you are seeking advice look for people with higher reputation points (not that this a very good indicator, but it's a start), pictures of their grows, links to their journals, and look for people that you respect. 

You are often better off searching for the information that you seek. It gives you the opportunity to ascertain a lot of opinions quickly, identify the sources of the arguments, and to make a reasonable decision based upon your own judgement. If 10 people give one answer and 10 people give another or even a completely polar opposite (which is often the case) you are only left to consider the source. You can't simply guess at it. The rollitup search sucks. Always has. Use Google. Their search engine searches RIU better than RIU's does...fuckin' sad MODS and Administrators! Just google for example "Seedling PPM rollitup". I haven't done it, but I'd bet you yeild quicker results and the ability to consider many sources in a shorter period of time.

I've also decided that I'm going to go ahead and put the "credit" on the quote that is now my signature. Disagreeing with me again and gettin' this guys plants burned after the dandelion shit isn't cool. I know you're trying to help, but we all dropped it and let you slide on the first one. It was a clear sign you don't know what the fuck you're talking about, but we let it go. Repeating the same mistake is absolutely asinine.


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## Bob Smith (Nov 6, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> Yeah after the Dandelion disagreement he should've figured out that I know what the fuck I'm talking about. I don't come on this forum often for advice anymore. I come by to help growers to figure this out with maximum chance at success. I like to share my experience with others. Not google shit, regurgitate nonsense and kepp the misinformation alive.
> 
> When I joined this forum a few years back it was RIDDLED with misinformation. What was considered to be true, simply wasn't and I destroyed my plants trying some of the people shit said. I have watched countless others, and it typically stems from the users that don't have grows under their own belt that are trying to help out other new growers.
> 
> ...


Priceless 

Anon, looking good so far - keep up the good work.

Feel free to check out my journal for setup ideas if you'd like (same as you but with a 1000 in my tent).


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## anon1122 (Nov 12, 2009)

I had flushed, brought the nutes up to 50ppm and have slowly increased it to 170ppm. Brown spots keep appearing and it took out the first set of jagged leaves then they are over taking the first set of jagged leaves of 3. and now its moving up to the first set of 5. As always the new growth is coming in green, but im sure will get spotty. Here are some pictures, i apologize about the low resolution.


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## laserbrn (Nov 12, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> I had flushed, brought the nutes up to 50ppm and have slowly increased it to 170ppm. Brown spots keep appearing and it took out the first set of jagged leaves then they are over taking the first set of jagged leaves of 3. and now its moving up to the first set of 5. As always the new growth is coming in green, but im sure will get spotty. Here are some pictures, i apologize about the low resolution.


The leaves that were originally damaged by the nutes will slowly die off. They are damaged now and the plant will eat them up as necessary. There's nothing you can do about them now, the fact that your new growth is coming in green is very good.

It's been awhile since you updated (and I was going to ask today for an update), but things don't look too bad. The bottom leaves will yellow off and die. Let them. I would get them up to about 200-250ppm by raising slowly like you have been. Then leave them there for about another week. They should then take off and be ready to go. How high are your lights now?


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## anon1122 (Nov 12, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> The leaves that were originally damaged by the nutes will slowly die off. They are damaged now and the plant will eat them up as necessary. There's nothing you can do about them now, the fact that your new growth is coming in green is very good.
> 
> It's been awhile since you updated (and I was going to ask today for an update), but things don't look too bad. The bottom leaves will yellow off and die. Let them. I would get them up to about 200-250ppm by raising slowly like you have been. Then leave them there for about another week. They should then take off and be ready to go. How high are your lights now?


Light is at about a foot or so. The only thing that is troubling me is that the first set of 5 pointed leaves came in green, but yesterday started developing spots. If it happens with this next set coming in I will really worry because that first set of 5 points was coming in during the fluctuation and turmoil. so this next set will tell.


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## anon1122 (Nov 12, 2009)

ps, told you the carbon filter was effing HUGE.


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## Bob Smith (Nov 12, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Light is at about a foot or so. The only thing that is troubling me is that the first set of 5 pointed leaves came in green, but yesterday started developing spots. If it happens with this next set coming in I will really worry because that first set of 5 points was coming in during the fluctuation and turmoil. so this next set will tell.


Hey anon, I had/am battling what seems to be the same problem as you - saw the yellowing on the leaves of my freshly rooted clones, thought it might be nute burn (it wasn't), thought it might be an N deficiency (it wasn't), and then came to the realization of what it is.

In my attempts to get my clones to catch up to some other plants, I put them directly under my 400 (and moved the older, stronger plants to the perimeter), about a foot away (my light runs 24/7) - I only figured out what the issue was when I realized that the clones that were slightly shaded by the larger plants had no yellow - evidently I had the clones so close to the light that they were getting "bleached" and losing their ability to photosynthesize.

Long story short, moved the light up about a foot, and all's better now - for how large those seedlings are, a 600 at a foot away is kinda strong, IMHO.

Trust me, I was always under the impression that as close as you can get the light to the plants is the best, but for young seedlings and clones, that seems to not always be the case.

Anyhow, good luck to you in whatever you decide to do.


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## anon1122 (Nov 12, 2009)

some people on here have said it could be a magnesium deficiency. any thoughts on how to rectify this? or any tell tale signs?


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## Bob Smith (Nov 12, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> some people on here have said it could be a magnesium deficiency. any thoughts on how to rectify this? or any tell tale signs?


Well if it's an mg deficiency, you need to get some Cal-Mag, or switch to some nutes that have a reasonable amount of mg in them (I just started using GH, and no problems since I switched).

As far as telltale signs, the link below is okay, and there's tons of these on the Net, most with pics as well:

http://www.weedfarmer.com/cannabis/tables_guide.php

As a caution, I've found that most symptoms that growers (like me) instantly attribute to nutes are actually caused by something else - we've been programmed to assume that any problem is related to nutes, but I'd do a double-check of your other factors first, and leave nutes until the very end.

Is your pH okay? Temp okay? Enough ventilation, enough water (but not too much), etc., etc...............make sure all of these are okay, and then when you've eliminated all else, you can conclude that it's a nute problem.

Just my MO, some may agree and some may disagree - do what you think is appropriate.

Just seems to me that nutes are a "scapegoat" more often then not when the problem lies elsewhere.

Good luck.


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## Bob Smith (Nov 12, 2009)

Lol, just looked at your picks again - have a hard time believing a two or three inch tall plant is suffering from an mg deficiency already.

That'd have to be a record, no?

If you're taking a poll, my vote is "no" on the mg deficiency.


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## laserbrn (Nov 12, 2009)

That 600w light is a foot away? Please tell me I'm mistaken? How did that not come up all this time? I must be missing something! Get that light up another foot, 2 would be better. I would raise that light to about 30" and give those plants a chance. If they start to stretch, lower the light, but I'll bet they don't stretch.

You don't have an MG Deficiency, don't start in on all of that. These plants are small and have just been through a lot. They don't have a lot to work with as far as leaves so you need to be gentle on them. Treat them very gently, easy nutes, easy light on seedlings. Otherwise it just goes really, really, really slowly.


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## denny beezwax (Nov 12, 2009)

Yeah, I wonder about the heat too. How long can you hold your hand directly over the tops of the plants before feeling heat?


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## Bob Smith (Nov 12, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> That 600w light is a foot away? Please tell me I'm mistaken? How did that not come up all this time? I must be missing something! Get that light up another foot, 2 would be better. I would raise that light to about 30" and give those plants a chance. If they start to stretch, lower the light, but I'll bet they don't stretch.
> 
> You don't have an MG Deficiency, don't start in on all of that. These plants are small and have just been through a lot. They don't have a lot to work with as far as leaves so you need to be gentle on them. Treat them very gently, easy nutes, easy light on seedlings. Otherwise it just goes really, really, really slowly.


Cosign on all of that - you need to take into account the source of the info before having strangers on the Internet diagnose problems for you.

To further LB's point, the pic below is the clones after they were moved into my flowering tent a couple of days ago (to veg, not flowering them yet) - that light (1000HPS) is a solid three feet above my clones, and they're all covered in light.

Trust me (us), start off slow under an HID light - start high, and work your way down, not the other way around.


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## laserbrn (Nov 12, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> Cosign on all of that - you need to take into account the source of the info before having strangers on the Internet diagnose problems for you.
> 
> To further LB's point, the pic below is the clones after they were moved into my flowering tent a couple of days ago (to veg, not flowering them yet) - that light (1000HPS) is a solid three feet above my clones, and they're all covered in light.
> 
> Trust me (us), start off slow under an HID light - start high, and work your way down, not the other way around.


Agreed, and seedlings are even more sensitive than clones! I have my T5HO's about 24" above my seedlings when they are the size you have there. That's a floro for crying out loud. You definitely need to get that 600 up to at least 30", even 3 feet would probably be better.


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## anon1122 (Nov 12, 2009)

Here's better resolution...


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## anon1122 (Nov 12, 2009)

I raised the light to about 30 inches +/-. I hope its just a light issue like you said. You guys know what you're talking about. I'll let you be my Sherpas. lol.

I took some extra pictures other than just the plants so you can see my ventilation and scale of stuff. 175 ppm and roughly 6.08 ph. Heat isn't an issue, you can hold your hand right to the glass and it isn't hot. It's warm, but no more than 80 if you're touching it. Will they bounce back from light damage or will those leaves just be a loss?

Hopefully they'll take off soon, I see other people at 3 weeks and they have mini bushes, but I'm sure they haven't been raping their plants with light either.

Thank you all for your help and insight. I'll rep you as much as I can.


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## laserbrn (Nov 12, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> I raised the light to about 30 inches +/-. I hope its just a light issue like you said. You guys know what you're talking about. I'll let you be my Sherpas. lol.
> 
> I took some extra pictures other than just the plants so you can see my ventilation and scale of stuff. 175 ppm and roughly 6.08 ph. Heat isn't an issue, you can hold your hand right to the glass and it isn't hot. It's warm, but no more than 80 if you're touching it. Will they bounce back from light damage or will those leaves just be a loss?
> 
> ...


Check out my WW grow log in my signature. Go to the beginning and read the first few pages. I bought a T5HO and treated it like a regular floro and had the same problem you do. Just look at the pics and you'll know you're doing the right thing. Those same pics from the beginning of that journal are featured in my avatar. You'll be just fine as soon as they get going again.


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## anon1122 (Nov 12, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> Check out my WW grow log in my signature. Go to the beginning and read the first few pages. I bought a T5HO and treated it like a regular floro and had the same problem you do. Just look at the pics and you'll know you're doing the right thing. Those same pics from the beginning of that journal are featured in my avatar. You'll be just fine as soon as they get going again.


Thanks so much man, I appreciate it!


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## Bob Smith (Nov 13, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> I raised the light to about 30 inches +/-. I hope its just a light issue like you said. You guys know what you're talking about. I'll let you be my Sherpas. lol.
> 
> I took some extra pictures other than just the plants so you can see my ventilation and scale of stuff. 175 ppm and roughly 6.08 ph. Heat isn't an issue, you can hold your hand right to the glass and it isn't hot. It's warm, but no more than 80 if you're touching it. Will they bounce back from light damage or will those leaves just be a loss?
> 
> ...


I think I can speak on LB's behalf when I say it's our pleasure.

BTW to both of you - put together some short Youtube videos of my two tent setups, if either of you are interested.

Just do a search for "SOGBobSmith" and there's seven ~1 minute videos - would love any input and/or feedback from either of you.


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## smokingrubber (Nov 13, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> I think I can speak on LB's behalf when I say it's our pleasure.
> 
> BTW to both of you - put together some short Youtube videos of my two tent setups, if either of you are interested.
> 
> Just do a search for "SOGBobSmith" and there's seven ~1 minute videos - would love any input and/or feedback from either of you.


 
Bob, love the videos. It's a little difficult to watch them in order.

I see you have a Sentinal controller. I'm going to get one too. Do you recommend getting the expensive one that controls everything or should I get the one that just does Co2. I really like the way it scrolls all the digital info. That looks very professional! How long does your Co2 tank last and how big is it?


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## Bob Smith (Nov 13, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> Bob, love the videos. It's a little difficult to watch them in order.
> 
> I see you have a Sentinal controller. I'm going to get one too. Do you recommend getting the expensive one that controls everything or should I get the one that just does Co2. I really like the way it scrolls all the digital info. That looks very professional! How long does your Co2 tank last and how big is it?


I have (3) 20lb. CO2 tanks, and I'd definitely spend the extra money and get the upgraded version - it's $500.

CO2 tanks last about a month and a half each running 12/12 @ 1500PPM.

If you don't mind, PM me or go to my journal to ask me anymore questions - I wanna keep this thread focused on anon's tent (I know I opened the Pandora's box anon, and I apologize for that).

Many thanks for your compliments, though


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## smokingrubber (Nov 13, 2009)

Bob, I think I'm doing your set-up almost exactly. I've got the same RO system, same tent, same pots . . . and I'm gonna get the same sentinal system and Co2. You've got 17 pots going. How many of those would you flower in a 4'9 x 4'9?


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## Bob Smith (Nov 13, 2009)

Gonna post a pic update in my journal within the hour, check it out - my tent's the same size, so you'll see what I'm doing with it.


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## anon1122 (Nov 14, 2009)

K guys, sorry to delete pictures but after reading https://www.rollitup.org/general-marijuana-growing/271343-rollitup-member-gets-busted-arrested.html#post3393061


I am too paranoid as it is. I will post pictures for a limited time and then delete them soon after. Laserbrn and bobsmith, you guys seem to give me the best advice and respond quickly so after you've seen it, I'll trash it. I just don't know how safe this site is now, I mean jacksonville is nowhere near me but still.https://www.rollitup.org/general-marijuana-growing/271343-rollitup-member-gets-busted-arrested.html#post3393061


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## laserbrn (Nov 14, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> K guys, sorry to delete pictures but after reading https://www.rollitup.org/general-marijuana-growing/271343-rollitup-member-gets-busted-arrested.html#post3393061
> 
> 
> I am too paranoid as it is. I will post pictures for a limited time and then delete them soon after. Laserbrn and bobsmith, you guys seem to give me the best advice and respond quickly so after you've seen it, I'll trash it. I just don't know how safe this site is now, I mean jacksonville is nowhere near me but still.


If you aren't in Florida and you aren't telling your friends about your online posting you'll be just fine. This has happened in the past and yes they can use the information against you in court and to obtain warrants. They need someone to link your name to the postings in the first place to secure a subpoena if they feel it necessary for the ISP. 

If you're nervous, it's understandable. I'm a California Prop 215 patient and I keep to my legal limits so I don't worry much about local PD. DEA's not going to come bustin' in my door for my 6 plant operation. The press would be terrible as well as I have a LEGITIMATE medical case with all of the records for years to back it up. I didn't just pay some sham doctors to hook me up with a rec. I would go down a martyr for the cause as MMJ is the only thing that has helped me and I didn't touch the stuff before my doctor recommended it.


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## Bob Smith (Nov 14, 2009)

I was somewhat tweaking when I first saw that post, but as I only ever run my mouth on RIU (and never give away location), I feel reasonably secure.

There's not a soul in the world besides me who can link my RIU screen name to my real name (it ain't "Bob Smith", in case anyone was wondering).

I feel better now, but I'm still a little leery.


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## laserbrn (Nov 14, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> I was somewhat tweaking when I first saw that post, but as I only ever run my mouth on RIU (and never give away location), I feel reasonably secure.
> 
> There's not a soul in the world besides me who can link my RIU screen name to my real name (it ain't "Bob Smith", in case anyone was wondering).
> 
> I feel better now, but I'm still a little leery.


If you are really in Cali you don't have much to worry about. If you go posting pictures of your 6000w setup w/ your 75 plants you might have some trouble someday. But as long as you are sticking to your plant counts and operating with the limits of the local law you will be fine. DEA isn't looking for you, doesn't care about you and doesn't know you exist. 

I actually would LOVE for the local sherriff to investigate me and to simply look at my posts on the forum. They can see that I'm within my limits and not even bother knocking at my door.


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## Bob Smith (Nov 14, 2009)

Well, if it says I'm in Cali in my profile, that must be where I am 

Just a precautionary measure.........


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## anon1122 (Nov 18, 2009)

eh, paranoia getting the best of me I guess. They have REALLY bounced back and have started to take off. Everything is coming in nice and green and beautiful. A couple/few more weeks in veg and we'll see if they're ready to flower. They smell really nice. Especially before the light, filter and exhaust fan come on. Thanks for helping my ladies in their time of need guys.


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## laserbrn (Nov 18, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> eh, paranoia getting the best of me I guess. They have REALLY bounced back and have started to take off. Everything is coming in nice and green and beautiful. A couple/few more weeks in veg and we'll see if they're ready to flower. They smell really nice. Especially before the light, filter and exhaust fan come on. Thanks for helping my ladies in their time of need guys.


Glad that they've turned a corner now and are underway. As they get stronger and stronger and more established go ahead and lower the light a little at a time.

I know you won't post pics anymore, but I hope they do well!


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## Bob Smith (Nov 18, 2009)

That goes for me as well; I know I shouldn't be posting pics, but I can't tell anyone in "real life", so this site is the only place I get to show them off.

Plus, using that guy who got busted as a reference point is kinda silly to me - from everything I've read, he was almost on a mission to get busted.

Glad to hear that the plants are doing well, though.


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## anon1122 (Nov 20, 2009)

They are doing well, they have been sitting at 300ppm for a week now, tomorrow is res change day. Gonna bump the nutes up a bit. The only thing is that towards the end of the day they start to droop a bit, is that normal? In the morning, they're right back and perky.


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## laserbrn (Nov 20, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> They are doing well, they have been sitting at 300ppm for a week now, tomorrow is res change day. Gonna bump the nutes up a bit. The only thing is that towards the end of the day they start to droop a bit, is that normal? In the morning, they're right back and perky.


 
Yep, it's just fine. Drooping and perking up are just part of what plants do. Don't worry about it too much. Check to see if it seems related to your watering though...if it droops right after watering, or if it droops right BEFORE watering. Might mean it's time to add another watering cycle.


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## Bob Smith (Nov 20, 2009)

Solid advice - drooping is either over or under watering, shouldn't be very difficult to figure out which one it is.


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## anon1122 (Nov 21, 2009)

Res change today. following week 3 of veg at 1/2 strength on fox farm feeding chart. ppm at right about 525-550. they seem to be digging it. When should I start thinking about topping them? Soon right?


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## jakethetank (Nov 21, 2009)

subscribed


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## anon1122 (Nov 22, 2009)

Yeah, they don't sag until the end of the night maybe a couple hours before bed time. I think they're just tired after a hard day of growing. Nutes are at 550 and ph is chilling between 5.8 and 6. Res temps are 76-78. Lots of little leaves growing at the crux of the established leaves.

I'm going to do 2 week 3's if they do well like this and then move to week 4. The second week 3, I will increase dosage, week 4 will be at 1/2 recommended strength and the second week 4 will be increased accordingly.

Then I will switch to flower. I want some good sized plants for 2 reasons.

1. I want to be able to take plenty of clones

2. This first 3 plants I am growing will be my personal smoke until the clones are established, grown and finished.

I am going to be building and aero cloner according to stinkbud's tutorial. So I have to buy neoprene collars and clonex next time I take a trip to the shop. With any luck it will be this week/weekend.

Any advice on topping laserbrn or bobsmith?


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## anon1122 (Nov 26, 2009)

No opinion on topping anyone???


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## anon1122 (Nov 27, 2009)

Gonna hit up HTG in the morning and get neoprene collars, cloning gel, submersible pump and a couple other things. Im going to start putting together an aero cloner soon. I'll be needing it very soon if they keep up the path they are on...


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## Bob Smith (Nov 28, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> No opinion on topping anyone???


Just check out Uncle Ben's thread for two or four main colas; I just topped my entire tent a few days ago to keep the height down for flowering - you could look at those pics if you'd like.


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## laserbrn (Nov 28, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> Just check out Uncle Ben's thread for two or four main colas; I just topped my entire tent a few days ago to keep the height down for flowering - you could look at those pics if you'd like.


And topping isn't something that I've tried. Correction, I've done it , but I have no idea if it helped or not. I guess I got more "main cola's", but nothing that I really noticed or paid enough attention to. One of these days I'll take a real run at topping, but for my FI grow I've just started I'll grow them Au' Naturale and try to get some big ol' pretty buds. I just like'em that way.


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## anon1122 (Nov 29, 2009)

Ok, just a quick update...

I have confirmed all 3 are in fact ladies. They are approximately 10-12 inches tall. I changed their nutes yesterday and bumped them up to 600-650 and they seem to be liking it.

Here's how I've been doing the feedings:

If you look at the feeding schedule they recommend, I went week 1, 2, then 2 a 2nd time because of the light burning issue, then week 3, now I am doing week 2 again for extra veg time then I am going to do week 4 next week, and the following week will be flower time.

Do you guys think it's a good idea reverting to week 2 for extra veg or should I just change the water today again and go for week for week four? I want extra veg time to get more clones before flowering and for a larger yield.

Whaddya think?


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## smokingrubber (Nov 29, 2009)

I think you should not go back to week 2. A 3 year old kid can't wear and eat what a 2 year old wears and eats. He can, but that won't slow his growth (mentally maybe). He'll be an underfed 3 year old. If a plant is of a certain age and size, it needs the fuel to continue growing.

Let the size of the plant determine the flowering date, not the feeding schedule. Just my opinion.


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## Bob Smith (Dec 2, 2009)

Agreed, at 12" tall and under a reasonable HID, 600 sounds like an appetizer to me (and that's assuming you're on a .5 conversion, at .7 it's a joke).

Understood that you don't wanna burn your plants, but you need to bump that up, kid.

I'd bump it up ~100PPM every three days until I noticed the first tinges of yellow on the tips or I got to 1000PPM, whichever comes first (again, assuming .5 conversion, if .7, 1300).

Just my $.02, but if you wanna stay uber-safe, don't go higher then 800 for now.

Good luck.


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## anon1122 (Dec 2, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> Agreed, at 12" tall and under a reasonable HID, 600 sounds like an appetizer to me (and that's assuming you're on a .5 conversion, at .7 it's a joke).
> 
> Understood that you don't wanna burn your plants, but you need to bump that up, kid.
> 
> ...



It was 600ppm not an ec reading. Right now they are at 675ppm and are doing really well. I got the nutes to the point where it was ever so slightly turning the tips. As soon as the open sesame was added, the lower and side growth EXPLODED. I won't have a shortage of clones to choose from this weekend. The nutes will be the first week of flower nutes and the bulb will be switched from a MH conversion to HPS. Ill update more later.


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## anon1122 (Dec 2, 2009)

*µs reading is 1367. They are getting bushier every time I look at them!
*


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## smokingrubber (Dec 3, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> *µs reading is 1367. They are getting bushier every time I look at them!*


What kind of reading is that? Pics please?


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## Bob Smith (Dec 3, 2009)

That's a measure of the electrical conductivity (EC), and s/he doesn't post pics.

Also obviously is on a .5 conversion, not .7.


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## anon1122 (Dec 5, 2009)

Ok, 

took a couple clones today, trimmed the lower 1/3 just like laserbrn. switched the bulb to the 600w sunmaster hps. switched the nutes to week 1 of flowering nutes. After the light goes off at 1 am I will adjust the timer to come on at 8 am and off at 8 pm. Ph is 6.0 and the nutes are at 835-850ppm. Hopefully that isn't too high, if it seems to be I can always back off. I have all day off tomorrow to monitor them like a hawk.

I'll keep you posted.

laserbrn, what time did you do your floods throughout the day during flowering with the widow?


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## laserbrn (Dec 6, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Ok,
> 
> took a couple clones today, trimmed the lower 1/3 just like laserbrn. switched the bulb to the 600w sunmaster hps. switched the nutes to week 1 of flowering nutes. After the light goes off at 1 am I will adjust the timer to come on at 8 am and off at 8 pm. Ph is 6.0 and the nutes are at 835-850ppm. Hopefully that isn't too high, if it seems to be I can always back off. I have all day off tomorrow to monitor them like a hawk.
> 
> ...


That ppm will really depend on the strain and it's needs. I think that 800-900 is a good start for flowering. It's on the safe side which is what you want the first time around. You are doing the right thing not trying to force feed. The plants will tell you if they are starving and more nutes don't make buds bigger and don't make plants grow faster. 

I did my floods about 30 minutes before lights on, and again mid-day (their day).


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## anon1122 (Dec 6, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> That ppm will really depend on the strain and it's needs. I think that 800-900 is a good start for flowering. It's on the safe side which is what you want the first time around. You are doing the right thing not trying to force feed. The plants will tell you if they are starving and more nutes don't make buds bigger and don't make plants grow faster.
> 
> I did my floods about 30 minutes before lights on, and again mid-day (their day).


Thanks for the reply! ppm is at 835-850 still. Ph is hanging out in the neighborhood of 6. Lights on at 8 am and off at 8pm. Flood times are at 8:15am noon, 4pm, and 7:30. Do you think that is too much? I planted the seeds into 1" rockwool, then they went into the square pots with hydroton, so I dont know if we have the same water retention properties since you used larger cubes and used a bed of hydroton. Everything looks good with them, just some of the newer leaves have a V shape to them. Eventually they pretty much flatten out. But they seem to be happy and I have a large healthy root system judging by the bottom of the pots.

How long before I start seeing flowers form?


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## laserbrn (Dec 6, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Thanks for the reply! ppm is at 835-850 still. Ph is hanging out in the neighborhood of 6. Lights on at 8 am and off at 8pm. Flood times are at 8:15am noon, 4pm, and 7:30. Do you think that is too much? I planted the seeds into 1" rockwool, then they went into the square pots with hydroton, so I dont know if we have the same water retention properties since you used larger cubes and used a bed of hydroton. Everything looks good with them, just some of the newer leaves have a V shape to them. Eventually they pretty much flatten out. But they seem to be happy and I have a large healthy root system judging by the bottom of the pots.
> 
> How long before I start seeing flowers form?


You should definitely be watering at least 3 times x day if you are only using 1" rockwool cubes. You are going to get a lot less moisture retention than I do. I would even consider 4x/day for 15 min. each when they are taking up more water during flowering. After about the third week I'd say.

You should start seeing female pistils in just a few days, the small flowers don't really start to show up until about the third week. Some take longer some a little shorter. Once you can see the "bud sites" and the flowers it just takes off from there. I wish I could see how big they've become, but you've done a good thing to limit your risks.


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## anon1122 (Dec 6, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> You should definitely be watering at least 3 times x day if you are only using 1" rockwool cubes. You are going to get a lot less moisture retention than I do. I would even consider 4x/day for 15 min. each when they are taking up more water during flowering. After about the third week I'd say.
> 
> You should start seeing female pistils in just a few days, the small flowers don't really start to show up until about the third week. Some take longer some a little shorter. Once you can see the "bud sites" and the flowers it just takes off from there. I wish I could see how big they've become, but you've done a good thing to limit your risks.



They have a ton of white pistils, 3-4 at each node. I might be able to take some pics and send them to you in a PM so it isnt all public. You're the one providing the most support. I think I'll stick with the 4x a day right now and see how they keep up with it. I was worried about bumping them up so much on nutes, but they seem to be fine and loving it. Time will tell eh?


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## laserbrn (Dec 6, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> They have a ton of white pistils, 3-4 at each node. I might be able to take some pics and send them to you in a PM so it isnt all public. You're the one providing the most support. I think I'll stick with the 4x a day right now and see how they keep up with it. I was worried about bumping them up so much on nutes, but they seem to be fine and loving it. Time will tell eh?


Definitely. If you have any problems we can take care of them that way, as long as all is well go ahead and keep it as secure as possible. Sounds like it was more than ready to be flowered so the onset shouldn't take too long at all.


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## Bob Smith (Dec 7, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Thanks for the reply! ppm is at 835-850 still. Ph is hanging out in the neighborhood of 6. Lights on at 8 am and off at 8pm. Flood times are at 8:15am noon, 4pm, and 7:30. Do you think that is too much? I planted the seeds into 1" rockwool, then they went into the square pots with hydroton, so I dont know if we have the same water retention properties since you used larger cubes and used a bed of hydroton. Everything looks good with them, just some of the newer leaves have a V shape to them. Eventually they pretty much flatten out. But they seem to be happy and I have a large healthy root system judging by the bottom of the pots.
> 
> How long before I start seeing flowers form?


Anon, is the flood level reaching the 1" rockwool cubes or staying strictly in the hydroton area?

I use only hydroton (root in a bubbler), and I flood for ten minutes every two hours that the light is on, and then once at "night".

My light cycle is on at 9:00pm and off at 9:00am.

Flood times are 9:00pm, 11:00pm, 1:00am, 3:00am, 5:00am, 7:00am, 9:00am, and then once at 3:00pm to make sure they don't dry out during the dark cycle.

I've actually contemplated going to floods once an hour, but will stay at every other hour - long story short, it's virtually impossible to overwater hydroton, as long as your pump floods your tray in a reasonably short period of time.


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## laserbrn (Dec 7, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> Anon, is the flood level reaching the 1" rockwool cubes or staying strictly in the hydroton area?
> 
> I use only hydroton (root in a bubbler), and I flood for ten minutes every two hours that the light is on, and then once at "night".
> 
> ...


I actually agree. I would think without the rockwool cubes your not going to retain enough moisture. You'll certainly get enough oxygen to the roots, I would think you can water as often as you want as long as it drains at some point. If I were usually 1x1 rockwool cubes I'd be flooding at least every 3 hours, every other hour if possible. If I could get away with more often than that I would do it too. If I could get it to flood and drain quickly I'd do like 10-15 minutes per hour.


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## Bob Smith (Dec 7, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> I actually agree. I would think without the rockwool cubes your not going to retain enough moisture. You'll certainly get enough oxygen to the roots, I would think you can water as often as you want as long as it drains at some point. If I were usually 1x1 rockwool cubes I'd be flooding at least every 3 hours, every other hour if possible. If I could get away with more often than that I would do it too.  If I could get it to flood and drain quickly I'd do like 10-15 minutes per hour.


100% agreed - you CAN'T overwater hydroton, as long as the floods are quick.

I'd go to once an hour, but the plants are doing great at every other hour - and as far as flooding at night goes, not sure if it's necessary or not, but I'm now able to keep my humidity pretty much in check, so I'm not too worried about mold or anything like that (as of yet, might change).


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## laserbrn (Dec 7, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> 100% agreed - you CAN'T overwater hydroton, as long as the floods are quick.
> 
> I'd go to once an hour, but the plants are doing great at every other hour - and as far as flooding at night goes, not sure if it's necessary or not, but I'm now able to keep my humidity pretty much in check, so I'm not too worried about mold or anything like that (as of yet, might change).


I don't think your humidity would even make that much difference. It needs to be controlled really due to the moisture in the buds during flower. 

I'd flood through the night. I might actually switch to doing it this way in the future, it's just that rockwool keeps my plants alive a lot longer if a pump fails (seems to happen a lot) or I lose power or anything else that can be a fairly quick killer. Sometimes I end up away for days at a time due to time spent under medical care. I like to have it as forgiving as possible.


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## Bob Smith (Dec 7, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> I don't think your humidity would even make that much difference. It needs to be controlled really due to the moisture in the buds during flower.
> 
> I'd flood through the night. I might actually switch to doing it this way in the future, it's just that rockwool keeps my plants alive a lot longer if a pump fails (seems to happen a lot) or I lose power or anything else that can be a fairly quick killer. Sometimes I end up away for days at a time due to time spent under medical care. I like to have it as forgiving as possible.


I'm actually contemplating putting in two different pumps and running each one every 1.5 hours, so that there's a failsafe in case one of them goes out (would have them on different circuits, obviously).

Something I've been meaning to do, but it's not at the top of my list, currently.


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## ddot773 (Dec 7, 2009)

i have that same exact tent, i got it off of ebay for $120. i can say its cheap after about a month i had to lean a chair up against it to support it. but it did its job, i got 12 ounces off 6 plants under a 600 watter grown in soil too intimidated to go hydro.


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## anon1122 (Dec 7, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> Anon, is the flood level reaching the 1" rockwool cubes or staying strictly in the hydroton area?
> 
> I use only hydroton (root in a bubbler), and I flood for ten minutes every two hours that the light is on, and then once at "night".
> 
> ...



When it floods, it's maximum level gets the bottom of the cubes, and soaks them. Im going to increase the flood cycles today and see how they hold up.


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## anon1122 (Dec 7, 2009)

ddot773 said:


> i have that same exact tent, i got it off of ebay for $120. i can say its cheap after about a month i had to lean a chair up against it to support it. but it did its job, i got 12 ounces off 6 plants under a 600 watter grown in soil too intimidated to go hydro.



Yeah, the tent is a motherfucker. I can't wait to get a quality tent for flowering and convert this one into a veg tent with a lightweight hood and fan/carbon filter.

So far I think I am doing quite well. I wish I could share more with you, but as it is, no go.


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## anon1122 (Dec 7, 2009)

Just got the power bill. Last year this time I was using 473 kwh, this month I used 1,063. Am I fucked?


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## smokingrubber (Dec 7, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Just got the power bill. Last year this time I was using 473 kwh, this month I used 1,063. Am I fucked?


Not at all. Pay the bill, smoke a bowl, you're fine. If you had 6,000 watts and ful ac going I would be concerned, but you're well within the range of someone who bought a new appliance or two. Nothing to worry about at all.


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## laserbrn (Dec 7, 2009)

Other than the increased cost what's the problem? They don't care how much power you use or if it increased. Nothing to be concerned about their brotha. I know it sounds like a large increase, but it's really just the difference between using very little power and just little power. It's not abnormal at all.


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## anon1122 (Dec 9, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> Other than the increased cost what's the problem? They don't care how much power you use or if it increased. Nothing to be concerned about their brotha. I know it sounds like a large increase, but it's really just the difference between using very little power and just little power. It's not abnormal at all.


Right on. I'm just paranoid.

Plants are bushing out nicely. How tall did your dp white widows get by the time it was all over? I started flowering at 10-12 inches and they're easily 14-16 now.

The edges are slightly pointed up and jagged looking. Temps aren't getting too high. Could it be that the temps are too low?


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## laserbrn (Dec 9, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Right on. I'm just paranoid.
> 
> Plants are bushing out nicely. How tall did your dp white widows get by the time it was all over? I started flowering at 10-12 inches and they're easily 14-16 now.
> 
> The edges are slightly pointed up and jagged looking. Temps aren't getting too high. Could it be that the temps are too low?


They weren't huge stretchers. They did alot of growing though the first time around. I mean look at this....Pics of them on day 1 of flower, 4 weeks, and 6 weeks.

I tried to post pics that would show the height difference. They definitely at least doubled in size, quite possibly 2.5x, I didn't measure them or anything. But, they will be growing on ya.


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## anon1122 (Dec 10, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> They weren't huge stretchers. They did alot of growing though the first time around. I mean look at this....Pics of them on day 1 of flower, 4 weeks, and 6 weeks.
> 
> I tried to post pics that would show the height difference. They definitely at least doubled in size, quite possibly 2.5x, I didn't measure them or anything. But, they will be growing on ya.



Yeah, mine were definitely bigger on day one of flower I think, so this is going to get interesting, and STINKY. You guys have no idea how hard it is not to post pics or anything.


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## laserbrn (Dec 10, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Yeah, mine were definitely bigger on day one of flower I think, so this is going to get interesting, and STINKY. You guys have no idea how hard it is not to post pics or anything.


You're right...I think you're a bit nutso not posting pics, but I understand it. I live in So Cal and have all my ducks in a row so I don't worry about it. If I didn't it would probably be a different story. It could be the bullet in the brain sorta speak if someone ratted you out. If they tipped off the cops and they knew your username on this public forum it would be all over.

So stay strong and if you feel the need use PM's to share with us. That way it isn't openly available public information for anyone to find (including LEO's).

I'm actually running my setup now the way you are with the hydroton inside of pots. I think this way is going to work out nicely brotha. Now I know for certain that we are using a good size pot for the rootmass. The first time I used hydroton I decided on the full tray of it so I can see how big the roots would grow. They grew enormous given the opportunity to grow as large as they really wanted to. But this size pot is about perfect for rootmass that was attached to those WW donkey dick buds so I'm confident this will just work out better and easier.

The flood on mine comes just to the bottom of the cubes too so I'm going to be increasing my watering cycles to every other hour. So now we are officially running the same shit.


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## anon1122 (Dec 10, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> You're right...I think you're a bit nutso not posting pics, but I understand it. I live in So Cal and have all my ducks in a row so I don't worry about it. If I didn't it would probably be a different story. It could be the bullet in the brain sorta speak if someone ratted you out. If they tipped off the cops and they knew your username on this public forum it would be all over.
> 
> So stay strong and if you feel the need use PM's to share with us. That way it isn't openly available public information for anyone to find (including LEO's).
> 
> ...


Right on. My floods are as follows...

8am w/ lights on
10a
12p
2p
4p
6p
7:30p before lights off at 8
12a
4a
then starts all over.

They are eating that schedule up. Roots are poking out the bottom... They are about 16-18 inches tall and about 18-24 inches in diameter. The stalks are a bit thicker than a AA battery.


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## laserbrn (Dec 10, 2009)

Sounds good. I'm actually just going to hook up the timer I already had setup for my Ozone Generator. It's setup to be on for 15 minutes every hour and half I believe then it's less during lights out.


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## anon1122 (Dec 10, 2009)

The ladies are drinking almost a half gallon of water a day. Every other day I have to add almost a gallon to the res and add nutes. They are in the 880ppm range right now. The megagarden is good, but it's a little small. I bet I could pack MAYBE 6 of these white widows on this thing and that just isn't quite enough. I'm going to have to do some adjusting and upgrading once these are done. I bet I could fit two of them in here somehow so I could have some running a month behind and have separate reservoirs. I dont know. I'll figure something out soon.


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## anon1122 (Dec 12, 2009)

Just changed the res again. Took out the small table in the room, put megagarden on the ground. That solved my vertical space issues. I have to get a small piece of hose so I can attach it to the pump in the megagarden so I can drain it easily. PPM is running at a bit over 1000. How much should I be bumping them up and how often? Right now I am using full strength nutes and they seem to be okay with that. I just follow the chart and adjust as needed. I might take a hand full of pictures just so you can see how phenomenal the growth has been.


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## laserbrn (Dec 12, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Just changed the res again. Took out the small table in the room, put megagarden on the ground. That solved my vertical space issues. I have to get a small piece of hose so I can attach it to the pump in the megagarden so I can drain it easily. PPM is running at a bit over 1000. How much should I be bumping them up and how often? Right now I am using full strength nutes and they seem to be okay with that. I just follow the chart and adjust as needed. I might take a hand full of pictures just so you can see how phenomenal the growth has been.


I knew you'd finally show us! At this point the plants will tell you what to do with the reservoir. If the ppm is climbing with each flood and drain it's too strong and you should lower it, if it's falling with each flood and drain you are too weak on the nutes. If the nutrients are staying really stable you are in the sweet spot. Remember if your plant doesn't have a defeciency and looks healthy giving it more nutes isn't going to make it grow faster. It could stress the plant and work against you! If the plant looks healthy and the ppm is stable, you've got it right on the money.


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## anon1122 (Dec 12, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> I knew you'd finally show us! At this point the plants will tell you what to do with the reservoir. If the ppm is climbing with each flood and drain it's too strong and you should lower it, if it's falling with each flood and drain you are too weak on the nutes. If the nutrients are staying really stable you are in the sweet spot. Remember if your plant doesn't have a defeciency and looks healthy giving it more nutes isn't going to make it grow faster. It could stress the plant and work against you! If the plant looks healthy and the ppm is stable, you've got it right on the money.


It was falling a bit faster than the water level so that's why I upped it. I always remember you saying in an earlier post nutes wont make them grow faster, more light will. So I never up the nutes just to speed them up, I try to feed as needed.


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## laserbrn (Dec 12, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> It was falling a bit faster than the water level so that's why I upped it. I always remember you saying in an earlier post nutes wont make them grow faster, more light will. So I never up the nutes just to speed them up, I try to feed as needed.


Good shit. I can't remember who I've told what anymore, just wanted to make sure you're keeping to the plan. Right around 1000ppm sounds about right as I go into flower. I want to see dangit!

All I've got goin' right now is little babies.


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## anon1122 (Dec 12, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> Good shit. I can't remember who I've told what anymore, just wanted to make sure you're keeping to the plan. Right around 1000ppm sounds about right as I go into flower. I want to see dangit!
> 
> All I've got goin' right now is little babies.



No buds yet, but they are some large bitches. I'm approx 6'1" and with the mega garden and container, they are almost mid thigh. Ill do my best to track down a digital camera today or soon and upload some.


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## laserbrn (Dec 14, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Here they are for a limited time only...


Oh man, they look really good! That carbon filter is taking up ALL of your space brotha! You couldn't keep the temps down and keep that thing outside the tent huh?

Those plants are going to turn into ridiculous monsters after the flip to 12/12. Lookin' real good bro.


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## smokingrubber (Dec 14, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Here they are for a limited time only...


Looking very happy. That filter is eating all your space! Can't you reinforce the roof supports (make better ones) to get that beast in the air? Heat rises so getting that thing off the ground would really help control your temps. 

I like the little ebb tray, what is involved in the cleaning-refilling process?


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## anon1122 (Dec 14, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> Oh man, they look really good! That carbon filter is taking up ALL of your space brotha! You couldn't keep the temps down and keep that thing outside the tent huh?
> 
> Those plants are going to turn into ridiculous monsters after the flip to 12/12. Lookin' real good bro.


Saturday started week 2 of 12/12. That picture was taken friday, and they are a good 4" taller today.

The temp got a bit too high, plus there is no more room where I'm at. So the filter has to stay in. The temps are not an issue right now with how I have it set up. It's a space issue. 

Thanks for the compliment though.


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## anon1122 (Dec 14, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> Looking very happy. That filter is eating all your space! Can't you reinforce the roof supports (make better ones) to get that beast in the air? Heat rises so getting that thing off the ground would really help control your temps.
> 
> I like the little ebb tray, what is involved in the cleaning-refilling process?


It can't happen man. That bitch is 56 lbs and this thing is rickety as fuck. 

The ebb tray is a hydrofarm megagarden. The tray comes out, you hook up a longer piece of hose to the submersible pump, and drain it into the bucket, hose it out really well to clean it, refill and adjust. I added a 2 outlet airpump and 2 airstones to the reservoir for aeration. It's a nice little ebb and flow, but I want an actual setup like laserbrns soon, but I have some upgrading to do. I basically have this thing filled up with only 3 plants. I am glad I didn't plant all 5.

Thanks everyone for your support, but now the pics are getting removed.


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## Bob Smith (Dec 14, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> It can't happen man. That bitch is 56 lbs and this thing is rickety as fuck.
> 
> The ebb tray is a hydrofarm megagarden. The tray comes out, you hook up a longer piece of hose to the submersible pump, and drain it into the bucket, hose it out really well to clean it, refill and adjust. I added a 2 outlet airpump and 2 airstones to the reservoir for aeration. It's a nice little ebb and flow, but I want an actual setup like laserbrns soon, but I have some upgrading to do. I basically have this thing filled up with only 3 plants. I am glad I didn't plant all 5.
> 
> Thanks everyone for your support, but now the pics are getting removed.


Damn, missed 'em.

Sounds like they're doing well though, so nice work.


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## Bob Smith (Dec 14, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Since bob was late to the party, here's two more from this morning... ​


Looking great, man 

One question - why in the hell did you get a filter designed for a commerical warehouse operation??

Holy fuck is that thing massive............what's the diameter on that, like 12"?

Mine's 6" and is plenty large enough for my tent............yowsers..........


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## smokingrubber (Dec 14, 2009)

But I bet it doesn't stink


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## Bob Smith (Dec 14, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> But I bet it doesn't stink


Lol.....neither does mine and it weighs about 12 pounds.

6" by 24" Phresh filter, super light-weight and can't smell a thing.

Honestly, I'd put that filter up on Ebay or Craigslist and get a more reasonable-sized one - the amount of space that takes up is very wasteful (if you're trying to be efficient in there).

Just my $.02.


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## anon1122 (Dec 14, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> Looking great, man
> 
> One question - why in the hell did you get a filter designed for a commerical warehouse operation??
> 
> ...



I bought it here:

http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/carbonaire-inch-carbon-filter-p-1379.html

It didn't say anything about it being 56 lbs until it got here. I know I need another one, got a link to yours?

The ladies are doing well though.


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## Bob Smith (Dec 14, 2009)

This is the one I've got............light as a feather, in comparison:

http://www.growlightexpress.com/air-purification-50/phresh-filter-6-x-513.html


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## smokingrubber (Dec 14, 2009)

Is that 56lbs with the fan? You could move the fan outside the tent after the hood. Get a steel rod, put a couple holes on the end and zip-tie it to the roof frame. Then you could strap the filter to the rod and viola.

But a 56lb filter IS a bit too big for 3 plants and a 4x4 tent imo. 12lbs sounds too small, but I'm sure you can find a happy medium.


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## Bob Smith (Dec 14, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> Is that 56lbs with the fan? You could move the fan outside the tent after the hood. Get a steel rod, put a couple holes on the end and zip-tie it to the roof frame. Then you could strap the filter to the rod and viola.
> 
> But a 56lb filter IS a bit too big for 3 plants and a 4x4 tent imo. 12lbs sounds too small, but I'm sure you can find a happy medium.


Just took another look, mine's 20 pounds, but the way they design them is to be super-lightweight.

Take my word for it, when it's running you can't smell a fugging thing.

EDIT: Here's some pics.........


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## anon1122 (Dec 14, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> Just took another look, mine's 20 pounds, but the way they design them is to be super-lightweight.
> 
> Take my word for it, when it's running you can't smell a fugging thing.
> 
> ...


I took my filter and fan out and I am running it laserbrn style. I still need something for an intake. I'll hopefully be dealing with this issue wednesday. I'll keep you posted. Temps seemed to be ok with it running like that.


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## laserbrn (Dec 14, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> I took my filter and fan out and I am running it laserbrn style. I still need something for an intake. I'll hopefully be dealing with this issue wednesday. I'll keep you posted. Temps seemed to be ok with it running like that.


And your space about doubled didn't it? You think you need an intake? I ran an intake once and it made things really inefficient and I though I remember you having a 400+cfm fan. Is your tent suckin' in like crazy? I taped off my flap vents and ran a duct outside a lower intake vent in my tent (mostly just for the light seal).


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## anon1122 (Dec 15, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> And your space about doubled didn't it? You think you need an intake? I ran an intake once and it made things really inefficient and I though I remember you having a 400+cfm fan. Is your tent suckin' in like crazy? I taped off my flap vents and ran a duct outside a lower intake vent in my tent (mostly just for the light seal).


Oh, it's extracting like crazy, but the problem is, the carbon filter and fan are right outside the tent, it would just recycle hot, used up air back into the tent. I need fresh air coming in from somewhere.


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## Bob Smith (Dec 15, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> And your space about doubled didn't it? You think you need an intake? I ran an intake once and it made things really inefficient and I though I remember you having a 400+cfm fan. Is your tent suckin' in like crazy? I taped off my flap vents and ran a duct outside a lower intake vent in my tent (mostly just for the light seal).


That's the only reason I'm thinking of putting an intake fan in my veg tent - light seal.

Other then that, don't need it.


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## The Potologist (Dec 15, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> They weren't huge stretchers. They did alot of growing though the first time around. I mean look at this....Pics of them on day 1 of flower, 4 weeks, and 6 weeks.
> 
> I tried to post pics that would show the height difference. They definitely at least doubled in size, quite possibly 2.5x, I didn't measure them or anything. But, they will be growing on ya.


WOW A++ Very nice gurls. Looks like the green crack I grew bubbleponics. Enjoy brotha, those are sure some tastey budz.


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## anon1122 (Dec 15, 2009)

The Potologist said:


> WOW A++ Very nice gurls. Looks like the green crack I grew bubbleponics. Enjoy brotha, those are sure some tastey budz.


<dick>

Yeah, Im sure laserbrn is enjoying them, you should congratulate him on HIS thread...

</dick>


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## anon1122 (Dec 15, 2009)

Saturday began week 2 of flowering, the branches that I am imagining are going to become budsites are starting to look different, but no discernible buds yet though... is that normal?


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## laserbrn (Dec 15, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> <dick>
> 
> Yeah, Im sure laserbrn is enjoying them, you should congratulate him on HIS thread...
> 
> </dick>


Woah there tiger. I've given you a lot of help in this thread and YOU don't have pictures anymore for him to give you props here. You should've actually taken it as a compliment as he was obviously reading through the entire thread to see your progress to have SEEN those pictures. Granted your right, he could've clicked on my thread and shown some love, but I don't think his comment was outta line. 

Anyway, I digress, to solve the light seal problem you don't need to hook up a fan, you can just hook up the duct. I ran a 4" duct through my "intake port" and it it goes about 2' I'd say at a slight bend up to a window next to my tent. I'll try to take a pic for you to see tonight. That way I'm pulling fresh air in through the window and exhausting warm air into the room itself. It's actually working quite nicely here during the winter, still not quite good enough to keep my place warm, but it helps a bit. I use the extra warmth for my own comfort.


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## anon1122 (Dec 15, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> Woah there tiger. I've given you a lot of help in this thread and YOU don't have pictures anymore for him to give you props here. You should've actually taken it as a compliment as he was obviously reading through the entire thread to see your progress to have SEEN those pictures. Granted your right, he could've clicked on my thread and shown some love, but I don't think his comment was outta line.
> 
> Anyway, I digress, to solve the light seal problem you don't need to hook up a fan, you can just hook up the duct. I ran a 4" duct through my "intake port" and it it goes about 2' I'd say at a slight bend up to a window next to my tent. I'll try to take a pic for you to see tonight. That way I'm pulling fresh air in through the window and exhausting warm air into the room itself. It's actually working quite nicely here during the winter, still not quite good enough to keep my place warm, but it helps a bit. I use the extra warmth for my own comfort.


I was joking, humor doesn't translate well into text. I apologize to the poster, and I didn't mean to offend...

Thank you for reading though, I do appreciate it.

Back to the matter at hand. I can't be opening a window where I'm at, but I can just run a duct to the laundry room, it isn't heated so it would be cool air... Maybe one of those cheap can looking inlines would help push some air, eh? Something like this... http://htgsupply.com/viewproduct.asp?productID=46434

Anyway, sorry again to the poster who it seemed like I bit their head off.


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## anon1122 (Dec 15, 2009)

See what I mean about the sites?


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## DubsFan (Dec 15, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> Are these not being grown in hydro? I read through and follow a lot of threads and it's possible I have this one mixed up. I thought this was growin' in Rockwool w/ Hydroton using Ebb & Flow?
> 
> I could reread it, but that's just crazy, it's huge.
> 
> ...


 
I'm on my first hydro grow and I would agree with all of this. I'm 40 days into my 4x8 tray Rockwool grow. I finally have the money zone. PPM is about the same as water level goes down. 1100 seems to be the number.

My buddy has an identical set up but has a different strain. He starts them off at 1200ppm. I have no clue how he gets away with it. It has to be the strain.


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## laserbrn (Dec 15, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> See what I mean about the sites?


 
Ahhh....yes, and so it begins! They just start out looking like tiny little bright flowers at the start at the ends of the growing tips. Can you take a couple with no lights? They look healthy, but the color is hard to tell with those and everything is a little washed out. If that's all we've got to work with I'd say your plants look good. Usually it's about 3 weeks into flower that they flowers really start showing up. By the mid way through week 4 - 5 is when they become "colas" sorta speak and you start to see the spiraled flowers starting to connect.

Right now your plants are just going to stretch out a bit and make some room for buds to get light.


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## smokingrubber (Dec 15, 2009)

It's hard to see in the pics. Unless you see ballz I wouldn't sweat it much. She'll drop her panties and show you her flower pretty soon. I would send you some patience if I had ANY to spare.


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## anon1122 (Dec 16, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> It's hard to see in the pics. Unless you see ballz I wouldn't sweat it much. She'll drop her panties and show you her flower pretty soon. I would send you some patience if I had ANY to spare.


Nevermind, they are definetly turning into buds now. And boy do they stink...


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## anon1122 (Dec 18, 2009)

Ppm is at like 1200, the buds are starting to develop. Tomorrow is res change and I start week 3 of the flowering schedule. It uses Grow big, big bloom, and beastie bloomz. Maybe I'll work in some pics at some point soon. Hope everyone is doing well.


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## anon1122 (Dec 19, 2009)

Changed the res. I have now started week 3 of the FF feeding schedule. 2tsp per gallon growbig, 1tbsp per gallon big bloom, 1/4tsp per gallon beastie bloomz. I had to add extra nutes to get the ppm right, about 2 gallons worth. Hopefully my new qt of big bloom will be here by monday, im running LOW. I have enough to take care of roughly 2 top offs before its gone.

If anyone reading this is going to be using the complete fox farm line like I am, make sure you get extra big bloom. I have a 7.5 gallon res and the quarts just aren't enough. When I crop out its time to get the gallon sizes... lol.

We'll see how they develop the next couple of days. ph 5.8-6.0 and ppm is in the 1200 range.


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## Bob Smith (Dec 19, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Changed the res. I have now started week 3 of the FF feeding schedule. 2tsp per gallon growbig, 1tbsp per gallon big bloom, 1/4tsp per gallon beastie bloomz. I had to add extra nutes to get the ppm right, about 2 gallons worth. Hopefully my new qt of big bloom will be here by monday, im running LOW. I have enough to take care of roughly 2 top offs before its gone.
> 
> If anyone reading this is going to be using the complete fox farm line like I am, make sure you get extra big bloom. I have a 7.5 gallon res and the quarts just aren't enough. When I crop out its time to get the gallon sizes... lol.
> 
> We'll see how they develop the next couple of days. ph 5.8-6.0 and ppm is in the 1200 range.


Please tell me I'm reading that incorrectly and you didn't put 2 gallons of nutes into your reservoir (unless you have a 300 gallon reservoir, in which case that'd be okay).


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## laserbrn (Dec 19, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> Please tell me I'm reading that incorrectly and you didn't put 2 gallons of nutes into your reservoir (unless you have a 300 gallon reservoir, in which case that'd be okay).


I think he means for example he has a 15 gallon reservoir, he had to add nutes based on a 17 gallon reservoir to get the PPM where he felt it was appropriate.


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## Bob Smith (Dec 19, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> I think he means for example he has a 15 gallon reservoir, he had to add nutes based on a 17 gallon reservoir to get the PPM where he felt it was appropriate.


Lol, I believe you are correct - my bads.


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## onefortheroad (Dec 19, 2009)

hello can you check my threads and give me a hand?? feed schedule?? and other q and a's ive posted. thanks


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## anon1122 (Dec 19, 2009)

That's exactly what I meant, thanks laserbrn! Yeah, the ladies are doing great. I got a green colored cfl so if I need to open the tent at night, I can just use that. Works really well too, got it at lowes for ~5


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## laserbrn (Dec 19, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> That's exactly what I meant, thanks laserbrn! Yeah, the ladies are doing great. I got a green colored cfl so if I need to open the tent at night, I can just use that. Works really well too, got it at lowes for ~5


 
Best not to open the tent, but if you MUST (c'mon when do you really HAVE to?) the green bulbs are better.


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## anon1122 (Dec 19, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> Best not to open the tent, but if you MUST (c'mon when do you really HAVE to?) the green bulbs are better.


I haven't used it or anything, I just have it in case I have to go in during dark hours and I use it in the room in general at night just in case of light leaks I may have missed.


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## anon1122 (Dec 20, 2009)

Not much new today. Pics will be up for a short time later. Look for them around 8-9pm est. They'll be down by midnight. How is everyone's sunday going? Im chilling with a bowl of ak watching some Trailer Park Boys. Hope you're all chillin too.


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## anon1122 (Dec 20, 2009)

I think they're gonna start getting fed every hour. the root tips that are hanging out the bottom are starting to get dry between the 2 hr waterings. 15 min on 45 off.


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## laserbrn (Dec 20, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> I think they're gonna start getting fed every hour. the root tips that are hanging out the bottom are starting to get dry between the 2 hr waterings. 15 min on 45 off.


That's odd, my plants went to looking overwatered and I cut my watering back to 4x /day for 15 minutes each. 

I think the 4x4 rockwool cubes are just sucking up a bit more moisture.


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## anon1122 (Dec 20, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> That's odd, my plants went to looking overwatered and I cut my watering back to 4x /day for 15 minutes each.
> 
> I think the 4x4 rockwool cubes are just sucking up a bit more moisture.



I think they dont like the every hour, so I changed it every 1.5 hrs. Anyway, here's some pics. they tend to get droopy towards the end of their day and it's 30 min. till lights out.


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## anon1122 (Dec 20, 2009)

Here's pics from tonight.


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## smokingrubber (Dec 20, 2009)

Whats that ac on the wall? Can I get a close up of it and a model no?


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## Bob Smith (Dec 20, 2009)

Looking good Anon - what day did you flip to 12/12?


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## anon1122 (Dec 20, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> Looking good Anon - what day did you flip to 12/12?



12/5/09 is when I switched to flower.


It's not AC on the wall rubber, it's a fan that is suspended by a pulley I rigged up. Each fan can be set to a different speed. pretty handy.


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## MEANGREEN69 (Dec 20, 2009)

good looking girls, your going to need cal/mag soon if you dont already have? judt seems to be used faster in hydro.


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## anon1122 (Dec 20, 2009)

MEANGREEN69 said:


> good looking girls, your going to need cal/mag soon if you dont already have? judt seems to be used faster in hydro.



I dont have calmag. I thought ff nutes would have all that in it. I'll look at the calcium and magnesium ratings on it. They seem to be going along flawlessly right now though. *knocks on wood*


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## anon1122 (Dec 21, 2009)

From this morning. Are they looking ok to you laserbrn?


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## laserbrn (Dec 21, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> From this morning. Are they looking ok to you laserbrn?


They look pretty good for about 3 weeks into flower from what I can tell. If you could take a picture with the lights off it would go a long ways. Can't really tell the condition of the leaves or the coloration with the HPS photos.

Maturity and growth look on pace, but I certainly can't see any "early signs" with an HPS photo. They generally have to be pretty tore up to tell with photos with lights on.


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## anon1122 (Dec 21, 2009)

Here they are with the HPS off.


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## laserbrn (Dec 21, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Here they are with the HPS off.


They look good to me. Just fine in my book. Mighty fine as a matter of fact.


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## anon1122 (Dec 21, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> They look good to me. Just fine in my book. Mighty fine as a matter of fact.



Well thank you very much! I'm mighty proud of em. I'm not doing too bad for my first time going solo and coming off a 6 or 7 year break.


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## MEANGREEN69 (Dec 22, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> I dont have calmag. I thought ff nutes would have all that in it. I'll look at the calcium and magnesium ratings on it. They seem to be going along flawlessly right now though. *knocks on wood*


most nutes do have cal/mag but in hydro thats one of the fist things to

go...your plant look great by the way..didnt mean they looked bad..was

just giveing you a heads up cause you dont want anything going south

at this point....


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## anon1122 (Dec 22, 2009)

Im probably freaking out over nothing. It looks like light bleaching. what do you think? It was only on 2 leaves near the top on one plant. Let me know!!!


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## smokingrubber (Dec 22, 2009)

So you ripped them off? That was mean. I dont know whats wrong with them, but it looks like you won't have to worry about them any longer.


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## anon1122 (Dec 22, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> So you ripped them off? That was mean. I dont know whats wrong with them, but it looks like you won't have to worry about them any longer.


I just cut the one off, the other is still attached.


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## Bob Smith (Dec 22, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Im probably freaking out over nothing. It looks like light bleaching. what do you think? It was only on 2 leaves near the top on one plant. Let me know!!!


How far is (was) the light away from the leaf in question?

And what do the two infected leaves have in common? Both high on the plant, low on the plant, next to a fan, etc............


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## anon1122 (Dec 22, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> How far is (was) the light away from the leaf in question?
> 
> And what do the two infected leaves have in common? Both high on the plant, low on the plant, next to a fan, etc............



High up towards the top. they were next to a fan, and symmetrical. Temps are not high, and humidity is in check.


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## Bob Smith (Dec 22, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> High up towards the top. they were next to a fan, and symmetrical. Temps are not high, and humidity is in check.


So the leaves were high on the plant, but not the highest (or closest to the light)?

Well that would seem to rule out light bleaching............

And they were the two leaves closest to a fan, huh?

Even though that's interesting and could be a clue, it still looks more like a nute/pH issue to me................what's the current TDS and pH?


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## anon1122 (Dec 22, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> So the leaves were high on the plant, but not the highest (or closest to the light)?
> 
> Well that would seem to rule out light bleaching............
> 
> ...


Come to think of it, I did have a bit of a ph fluctuation the last day or so, but it's been stable and ok for the last 24 hrs. Maybe it was just working out the stress of that from the other day.

They are 5.8-6.0 right now. At one point a couple days ago, saturday or sunday, they hit 6.4, overnight and I didn't catch it till morning. The other 2 are ok though, so maybe that one is just more susceptable to ph fluctuations. Ill keep a close eye on them and let you guys know.


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## Bob Smith (Dec 22, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Come to think of it, I did have a bit of a ph fluctuation the last day or so, but it's been stable and ok for the last 24 hrs. Maybe it was just working out the stress of that from the other day.
> 
> They are 5.8-6.0 right now. At one point a couple days ago, saturday or sunday, they hit 6.4, overnight and I didn't catch it till morning. The other 2 are ok though, so maybe that one is just more susceptable to ph fluctuations. Ill keep a close eye on them and let you guys know.


Anytime I let my pH go over 6.0 I run into problems, so I think you're onto something.


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## smokingrubber (Dec 22, 2009)

My ph slowly rises over the course of the week. It's stabalized quite well now that I've switched to GH nutes, but it still went from 5.8 to 6.0 in 4 days. Anyway, I've let it go as high as 6.4 without seeing any effect on the plants. Again that was a gradual float, not a spike like you described.

Can you train those branches to avoid the direct fan? It's obviously causing some kind respiration issues with those leaves. Is your fan oscilating?


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## anon1122 (Dec 22, 2009)

no oscillation, just blowing. the airflow hasn't affected it though really. I think it was the ph spike.


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## Dubble (Dec 22, 2009)

Great Thread... I just picked up a Grow Lab GL 120 and already have a 400w digital ballast. I still need to pick up a couple of inline fans, and some bulbs. I have a noobish question I was hoping you could answer for me. I bought a lumatek digi ballast and I'm a little confused. It says it can run both mh and hps bulbs. Is the bulb fitting different with each type of bulb? Can i screw in both hps and mh bulbs without modding anything? Just plug n' play? I also was wondering if you had any suggestions for fans. I'm planning on picking up a *Cool Sun Reflector - 6*". 

Given these parameters what would you choose? I realize I bought a rather large tent and have rather low light, but I think I can pull it off with a 3x3 tray. I plan to have 2 400w lights some time in the future. 

I have learnt a lot following this thread from start to finish and the nutes chart was great. Any advise is much appreciated.


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## smokingrubber (Dec 22, 2009)

*Electronic Ballast vs. E-Ballast

*_The Lumatek ballast is an E-ballast unlike brand other electronic ballasts. What is the difference? E-ballasts use a micro processor similar to a personal computer which runs a software program. This microprocessor allows the E-ballast to run both halide or sodium lamps, switch between 50 and 60 hertz, make adjustments for the type of bulb it is running and, will even compensate for degrading lamps by increasing output. The other Electronic ballasts on the market have a constant output and cannot make adjustments or changes. They will light a MH lamp but quickly degrade it._

http://www.ecogrow.com/index.cfm?product=1496&special=monthly

Nice hood choice  Let me know how it works, I'm in the market for a new ballast soon.


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## anon1122 (Dec 22, 2009)

Dubble said:


> Great Thread... I just picked up a Grow Lab GL 120 and already have a 400w digital ballast. I still need to pick up a couple of inline fans, and some bulbs. I have a noobish question I was hoping you could answer for me. I bought a lumatek digi ballast and I'm a little confused. It says it can run both mh and hps bulbs. Is the bulb fitting different with each type of bulb? Can i screw in both hps and mh bulbs without modding anything? Just plug n' play? I also was wondering if you had any suggestions for fans. I'm planning on picking up a *Cool Sun Reflector - 6*".
> 
> Given these parameters what would you choose? I realize I bought a rather large tent and have rather low light, but I think I can pull it off with a 3x3 tray. I plan to have 2 400w lights some time in the future.
> 
> I have learnt a lot following this thread from start to finish and the nutes chart was great. Any advise is much appreciated.


I'm running a lumatek digital 600w. but the 600's only run hps, so I had to get a MH conversion bulb. I would think a 400w would work for that area. The bulb fitting on them is the same size and everything. I love my setup, I just wish I bought a better tent. Oh well, live and learn.


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## Dubble (Dec 22, 2009)

Thanks for the quick response, much appreciated.


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## anon1122 (Dec 22, 2009)

Dubble said:


> Thanks for the quick response, much appreciated.



No problem. I've gotten a ton of help on here, the least I can do is help someone else.


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## anon1122 (Dec 23, 2009)

Here they are in all their glory. I think they are doing well. What do you think?


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## Bob Smith (Dec 23, 2009)

Looking very nice.


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## anon1122 (Dec 23, 2009)

Bob Smith said:


> Looking very nice.


Thanks Bob!


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## laserbrn (Dec 23, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Thanks Bob!


 
How far in are they now? They look about 3 weeks?


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## anon1122 (Dec 23, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> How far in are they now? They look about 3 weeks?



yeah, they are in week 3. week 4 starts saturday. Looking ok?


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## laserbrn (Dec 23, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> yeah, they are in week 3. week 4 starts saturday. Looking ok?


They look good...Those main cola's are going to get fat. It's hard to see the spacing real well, but are you starting to see the "spiral effect" from the flowers yet? It's fun to watch them all connect up. I think you're going to have yourself some beasties there.


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## anon1122 (Dec 24, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> They look good...Those main cola's are going to get fat. It's hard to see the spacing real well, but are you starting to see the "spiral effect" from the flowers yet? It's fun to watch them all connect up. I think you're going to have yourself some beasties there.


I dont know about spiraling, but they seem to have a touch of nute burn. i lowered the ppm a bit and we'll see. Can't wait to see how they develop with the cha ching.


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## anon1122 (Dec 25, 2009)

I got bored this evening, so here's an update...

On some latter pics you can see some of the damage to the leaves. Do you think it's just slight nute burn or just recovering from my ph fuck up this past week?


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## laserbrn (Dec 25, 2009)

Could be either one, keep your nutrient levels in check and your ph at the right level from here out and it won't matter which one it was .


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## anon1122 (Dec 26, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> Could be either one, keep your nutrient levels in check and your ph at the right level from here out and it won't matter which one it was .


im just keeping them at the recommended levels, and keeping the ph at 5.75-6.0

I was going above what the feeding schedule called for, so im just gonna go by it and see how things go.


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## DubsFan (Dec 26, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> im just keeping them at the recommended levels, and keeping the ph at 5.75-6.0
> 
> I was going above what the feeding schedule called for, so im just gonna go by it and see how things go.


My WW like nothing over 950/1000ppm.

My previous batch from the same mom loved the nutes much higher.


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## don2009 (Dec 27, 2009)

Looks great just read most of the thread good job keep up the good work +rep


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## anon1122 (Dec 27, 2009)

Ok,

I did my res change yesterday during my break from work. Started week 4 of flowering nutrients. 2 tsp grow big per gallon, 1 tbsp big bloom per gallon, 1/4 tsp cha-ching per gallon. Gives me a ppm of 1050-1100. I got the ph to 5.8, went back to work, checked them this morning, ph was 6.4 so yeah, I am anticipating more fucked up leaves. PH is back down to 5.8 I just don't know why it climbed so high. Anyway, we'll see what happens.


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## laserbrn (Dec 27, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> Ok,
> 
> I did my res change yesterday during my break from work. Started week 4 of flowering nutrients. 2 tsp grow big per gallon, 1 tbsp big bloom per gallon, 1/4 tsp cha-ching per gallon. Gives me a ppm of 1050-1100. I got the ph to 5.8, went back to work, checked them this morning, ph was 6.4 so yeah, I am anticipating more fucked up leaves. PH is back down to 5.8 I just don't know why it climbed so high. Anyway, we'll see what happens.


 
6.4 isn't a high enough to fuck up your leaves. What feeding schedule are you using? I'm just curious why you passed on Tiger Bloom and went with Grow Big and Big Bloom. Are you trying to keep it organic?


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## anon1122 (Dec 27, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> 6.4 isn't a high enough to fuck up your leaves. What feeding schedule are you using? I'm just curious why you passed on Tiger Bloom and went with Grow Big and Big Bloom. Are you trying to keep it organic?


I am using this feeding chart. I have all the products except bush doctor. Which I believe is discontinued. I am on week 8. (the 4th week of 12/12.) Some of the leaves are still having issues, they are yellowing, a bit burnt at the tips, and spots on the leaves. But it's only a few per plant. I am just wondering if it is a deficiency or just some burn. If it's just some burn, then no big deal, just lower the ppm, but if it is a deficiency I need to pin point what it is so I can go about correcting it. I am changing my solution every week. With fresh water and nutes. Do you think that may be a problem?


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## smokingrubber (Dec 27, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> I am using this feeding chart. I have all the products except bush doctor. Which I believe is discontinued. I am on week 8. (the 4th week of 12/12.) *Some of the leaves are still having issues, they are yellowing, a bit burnt at the tips, and spots on the leaves. But it's only a few per plant. I am just wondering if it is a deficiency or just some burn.* If it's just some burn, then no big deal, just lower the ppm, but if it is a deficiency I need to pin point what it is so I can go about correcting it. I am changing my solution every week. With fresh water and nutes. Do you think that may be a problem?


 
Let me offer an opinion based mostly from common sense, not years and years of actual experience. 

If it were a nutrient or ph issue, it would be a plant-wide problem mostly. If it's only on a few leaves (like 3) then I would look for an isolated problem with the environment. Did you spray something or drip something? Near the fan that would have splattered something toward that leaf? Have you cleaned the fan lately? Can you turn the plant to see if it's just an air flow issue?

Just thoughts. If its really more than a couple and you're seeing traces of the problem everywhere, I would look at the nutrients. When was the last time you disinfected the root system?


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## anon1122 (Dec 27, 2009)

smokingrubber said:


> Let me offer an opinion based mostly from common sense, not years and years of actual experience.
> 
> If it were a nutrient or ph issue, it would be a plant-wide problem mostly. If it's only on a few leaves (like 3) then I would look for an isolated problem with the environment. Did you spray something or drip something? Near the fan that would have splattered something toward that leaf? Have you cleaned the fan lately? Can you turn the plant to see if it's just an air flow issue?
> 
> Just thoughts. If its really more than a couple and you're seeing traces of the problem everywhere, I would look at the nutrients. When was the last time you disinfected the root system?


It could be air flow. But I think I have really good airflow throughout the room. I mean on 1 side I have a fan blowing at them, they dance all day, and directly on the other side, the carbon filter is sucking air. Though, they are roughly at the same place on the plants. I have not splattered or dripped anything on them. What is the best way to disinfect the root system?


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## smokingrubber (Dec 27, 2009)

This is the guide I will be using when my H2o2 arrives.
https://www.rollitup.org/hydroponics-aeroponics/8620-how-sterilize-disinfect-your-system.html


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## laserbrn (Dec 27, 2009)

Can you get a good pictuer of one of the plants with the HPS off? I can spot nute burn pretty quick and easy.

That feeding schedule is interesting, I've never used their hydro nutrients...I might have to try them soon. Does Tiger Bloom claim to be organic for the hydro stuff too? 

You could be seeing the classic Cal/Mag problems that hydro LOOOOOOVES to bring (sounds like it to me), some good pics should solve the problem.


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## anon1122 (Dec 27, 2009)

I took them out of the tent and took some pics so you can see them better.


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## anon1122 (Dec 27, 2009)

oh yeah, tiger bloom doesn't specifically say its organic. i think it is though, but im not sure.


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## anon1122 (Dec 28, 2009)

Any ideas laser?


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## milehigh970 (Dec 28, 2009)

Man 35 pages!! I think I am all caught up! Lol I am putting together a similar setup... gl145 with a lumatek 1000, co2 and 12 site ebb and grow. Ill start a thread so you can check it out..


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## laserbrn (Dec 28, 2009)

You need to do something to correct this issue quickly.

I don't grow using organics in hydro and I think this is where your problems lie.

If I had to guess I'd say you've got something a brewin' in your reservoir. I'm not famililar with Fox Farms for hydro either so it's a difficult call for me. If it were me and I was bound to using that particular line of nutrients I would at this point look out for the health of my roots as I know this will be a problem using organics.

I would flush out the reservoir and fill with plain phed water and and hygrozyme or AN's Tarantula. Hydgrogen Peroxide would probably work just fine if you have it available anything to kill everything alive in your reservoir and to promote the health of your roots. After a few days of that I would go to 1/2 strength nutrients and get them back up to full strength after that. Should take about a week total and the roots should much healthier.

It could be a micro-nutrient deficiency, but generally there is a CAUSE for the problem and directly trying to resolve the problem just leads to more problems. Your nutrients should be balanced and have the micro nutrients that you need. Growing with organics you're going to have this come up.

What is your reservoir temp?


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## anon1122 (Dec 28, 2009)

milehigh970 said:


> Man 35 pages!! I think I am all caught up! Lol I am putting together a similar setup... gl145 with a lumatek 1000, co2 and 12 site ebb and grow. Ill start a thread so you can check it out..


Yeah man, it's been a journey, I realized yesterday it was 35 pages and almost 13,000 views. Make sure you get a quality tent man, it will save you a lot of headache later on. Start a thread and post some pics of the equipment, I'd love to see your ebb and grow setup, I am looking to expand post-harvest.


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## anon1122 (Dec 28, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> You need to do something to correct this issue quickly.
> 
> I don't grow using organics in hydro and I think this is where your problems lie.
> 
> ...


I read up on the nutes, and they are not completely organic. The roots that are poking from the bottom look abundantly healthy. I wash out the reservoir every week. I am thinking they just need to be flushed really well. I'll do that today. Res temps stay in the 68-72 range. 

I hope I can get this figured out soon, im getting nervous.


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## laserbrn (Dec 28, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> I read up on the nutes, and they are not completely organic. The roots that are poking from the bottom look abundantly healthy. I wash out the reservoir every week. I am thinking they just need to be flushed really well. I'll do that today. Res temps stay in the 68-72 range.
> 
> I hope I can get this figured out soon, im getting nervous.


It's not a matter of "completely organic" or not. If they have organic material in them you're going to have a high likelyhood of getting some bacteria in there. They may not be slimy or brown, but I'd bet everything they are infected. You can't see the bacteria but it will cause while swings in PH and problems just like you are having with the leaves.


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## anon1122 (Dec 28, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> It's not a matter of "completely organic" or not. If they have organic material in them you're going to have a high likelyhood of getting some bacteria in there. They may not be slimy or brown, but I'd bet everything they are infected. You can't see the bacteria but it will cause while swings in PH and problems just like you are having with the leaves.



I'll try to go get some flora kleen and some cal mag and see if we can get this straightened out.


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## laserbrn (Dec 28, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> I'll try to go get some flora kleen and some cal mag and see if we can get this straightened out.


You are on the right path...


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## anon1122 (Dec 28, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> You are on the right path...


I flushed each plant today with a gallon of water and 2 tbsp of peroxide. That will have to do until I can get some more money up to buy these things. Money is getting tight. Anyway, Ill keep you guys updated.


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## laserbrn (Dec 28, 2009)

anon1122 said:


> I flushed each plant today with a gallon of water and 2 tbsp of peroxide. That will have to do until I can get some more money up to buy these things. Money is getting tight. Anyway, Ill keep you guys updated.


Are you able to get at that reservoir to clean it out fully? I've never used one of these type of systems, is it sort of DWCish or is it fully ebb & flow? If it's E & F and you can clean out the reservoir I would just clean it and fill it with water and H2o2 and run it for a day or possibly two. Then clean it out and go back to your feeding schedule. That's the po' man's solution sorta speak. It works perfectly well and shouldn't be discarded...go for it and it won't cost you shit and you can go forward.


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## anon1122 (Dec 28, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> Are you able to get at that reservoir to clean it out fully? I've never used one of these type of systems, is it sort of DWCish or is it fully ebb & flow? If it's E & F and you can clean out the reservoir I would just clean it and fill it with water and H2o2 and run it for a day or possibly two. Then clean it out and go back to your feeding schedule. That's the po' man's solution sorta speak. It works perfectly well and shouldn't be discarded...go for it and it won't cost you shit and you can go forward.



It's full on e&f. I clean the resevery week with a dilluted peroxide solution during res change. i'll do a flush like you described on saturday, providing things don't look worse. Today they looked a bit better today though. I'll let you know.


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## Joker209 (Dec 29, 2009)

If it is an E & F system I would try cleaning the res with a touch of bleach then rinse very thoroughly. It has worked for me in the past. After cleaning it thoroughly with the bleach water, I would suggest going with laserbrn's idea with the H2O2 and water. No nutes for a couple days as you want to get rid of the infection asap or it will kill your plants.. I think you will be fine if you do both of these things and then return to regular feeding. Good luck


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## smokingrubber (Dec 29, 2009)

I just bought some Oxegen Bloom (50% H2o2) from these guys http://www.agriculturalorganics.com/aspx/home.aspx

You only need 2ml for every 10 Liters of res. I found it in a store in Santa Barbera for about $32. Those guys are the shit.


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## anon1122 (Dec 30, 2009)

ok,

made the trip to htg today and picked up florakleen, cal mag plus, and some calibration solution for my meter. The ph was apparently way off, so I flushed everything with florakleen very well, sanitized everything, took apart the pump and sanatized it. Then refilled it with nutrient solution including calmag. now we'll see them bounce back hopefully. Plus I re-arranged the room and now they all have LOTS more room. Ill post pics in a bit. be kind though, some leaves took a beating in the time it took me to go to htg and get this stuff. Pics. Soon.


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## anon1122 (Dec 30, 2009)

Here they are.


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## c5rftw (Dec 30, 2009)

lookin good anon.


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## cappeeler09 (Dec 30, 2009)

lookin good bro ive got a grow tent with a 600w 

check out my grow journal m8 tell me wot u think

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/277194-cheese-journal-2nd-grow.html


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## don2009 (Dec 30, 2009)

Anon your the MAN! keep it up


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## anon1122 (Jan 3, 2010)

I think the yellowing and spots are starting to ease up. hard to tell though. bud development seems to be picking up again. ill post pics as soon as I find some batteries that work in the camera.


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## anon1122 (Jan 3, 2010)

the buds still look like a lot of white hairs, there doesnt seem to be much actual green bud forming. strange. This is the beginning of week 5.


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## andya12420 (Jan 3, 2010)

Good work, looks nice!


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## anon1122 (Jan 4, 2010)

I just started flushing them again this evening. Im trying to get this spotting and yellowing under control.


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## anon1122 (Jan 4, 2010)

These are with the hps off.


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## Joker209 (Jan 4, 2010)

Looking very nice there Anon. I am having troubles with spotting and yellowing too... Starting to wonder if it's my nutes. Looks great man keep it up


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## MEANGREEN69 (Jan 4, 2010)

looking good....look at the cola on the one on the left, fucken nice...whats the strain? im sorry if you already said...


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## anon1122 (Jan 4, 2010)

MEANGREEN69 said:


> looking good....look at the cola on the one on the left, fucken nice...whats the strain? im sorry if you already said...



they are all dutch passions white widow. ordered from attitude.


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## anon1122 (Jan 4, 2010)

Thanks for all the great comments guys!


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## MEANGREEN69 (Jan 4, 2010)

anon1122 said:


> they are all dutch passions white widow. ordered from attitude.


 
nice..did you clone them for mums??


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## anon1122 (Jan 4, 2010)

MEANGREEN69 said:


> nice..did you clone them for mums??


nope, they are all 3 from seed. I have 2 more feminized widow seeds to grow out and clone from next time. This run is just to get my feet wet again and make sure the system is up to par.


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## MEANGREEN69 (Jan 4, 2010)

anon1122 said:


> nope, they are all 3 from seed. I have 2 more feminized widow seeds to grow out and clone from next time. This run is just to get my feet wet again and make sure the system is up to par.


 
oh so they were fem seeds??...they look nice and happy, no probs with the fox farms huh?.....i always have to have cal/mag on hand in my E&F....


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## anon1122 (Jan 4, 2010)

MEANGREEN69 said:


> oh so they were fem seeds??...they look nice and happy, no probs with the fox farms huh?.....i always have to have cal/mag on hand in my E&F....


I have some yellowing and spotting, but working on curing these problems. ff nutes are a bit strong, but we'll see the end results...


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## don2009 (Jan 4, 2010)

Dameeeeeee that shit looks like a fuckin xmas tree good job anon your doing your mofo thing you lucky sob


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## anon1122 (Jan 6, 2010)

don2009 said:


> Dameeeeeee that shit looks like a fuckin xmas tree good job anon your doing your mofo thing you lucky sob


Thanks man, I appreciate it.

What can be causing this spotting and curling of the leaves? I have flushed, and refilled with a weaker solution that also includes calmag. But it doesn't seem to be helping. You still around laser?


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## laserbrn (Jan 6, 2010)

anon1122 said:


> Thanks man, I appreciate it.
> 
> What can be causing this spotting and curling of the leaves? I have flushed, and refilled with a weaker solution that also includes calmag. But it doesn't seem to be helping. You still around laser?


I'm just popping in, I would SWEAR that's an MG deficiency all day long. Cheetah spots like that are definitely a sign of MG deficiency and Cal-Mag should clear that right up. They won't turn back to green, but they should stop spreading the cheetah prints over the plant. Are you seeing new leaves with the problem? It could be that you have too much Cal. and it's causing an MG lockout. I don't remember what we've already been through, but is your tap water really hard?


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## anon1122 (Jan 6, 2010)

laserbrn said:


> I'm just popping in, I would SWEAR that's an MG deficiency all day long. Cheetah spots like that are definitely a sign of MG deficiency and Cal-Mag should clear that right up. They won't turn back to green, but they should stop spreading the cheetah prints over the plant. Are you seeing new leaves with the problem? It could be that you have too much Cal. and it's causing an MG lockout. I don't remember what we've already been through, but is your tap water really hard?



I've been using RO water the whole time. The new growth doesn't look bad. I'll have to double check when lights come on again tomorrow. I think it may have stopped spreading, I was expecting it to clear up. Ill keep a watchful eye and see. Other than that, what do you guys think? I have some close ups Ill add in a few. The leaves are curling upward at the tips too.


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## laserbrn (Jan 6, 2010)

anon1122 said:


> I've been using RO water the whole time. The new growth doesn't look bad. I'll have to double check when lights come on again tomorrow. I think it may have stopped spreading, I was expecting it to clear up. Ill keep a watchful eye and see. Other than that, what do you guys think? I have some close ups Ill add in a few. The leaves are curling upward at the tips too.


Yeah, it won't "clear up" once those spots appear on those leaves they don't go away. Sometimes an N defeciency can be "cleared up", but most other leaf damage sticks with you until the end. If those leaves developed it early on and haven't completed died off and rotted away you've solved the problem.

They look great, those "hairs" will all fill in with great buds, especially THAT strain. It start off hairy, but around week 6 things start just getting crazy.


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## anon1122 (Jan 6, 2010)

laserbrn said:


> Yeah, it won't "clear up" once those spots appear on those leaves they don't go away. Sometimes an N defeciency can be "cleared up", but most other leaf damage sticks with you until the end. If those leaves developed it early on and haven't completed died off and rotted away you've solved the problem.
> 
> They look great, those "hairs" will all fill in with great buds, especially THAT strain. It start off hairy, but around week 6 things start just getting crazy.



I'll keep a close eye on it. Here's the closer shots I promised...


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## anon1122 (Jan 12, 2010)

The yellowing is continuing and worsening. the leaves are curling up and crisping. I have added cal mag and everything and this is still happening. The buds are still growing and the new growth underneath is green, but most of the leaves that had the spotting are just all dying. Here are some pics from today.


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## DRIPS420 (Jan 12, 2010)

look Im no expert...but it looks like your brown spots are nutrient burn.....the tips of your leaves....burnt by heat....too close to light...or not enough vent.... other thing is you need to cover that water in your res....thats probably too hot......do a nute change ease back vent more and cover that tray......just my 2 cents......


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## Joker209 (Jan 13, 2010)

DRIPS420 said:


> look Im no expert...but it looks like your brown spots are nutrient burn.....the tips of your leaves....burnt by heat....too close to light...or not enough vent.... other thing is you need to cover that water in your res....thats probably too hot......do a nute change ease back vent more and cover that tray......just my 2 cents......


I say some of this and also heat stress judging by the upward curl. Aside from all that those buds are beautiful man. Happy harvest


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## anon1122 (Jan 14, 2010)

Today is day 41 of 12/12. Lots of the hairs are turning orange, but plenty are still white. When should I begin flushing? The attitude site says that I should keep them in the dark for the last 2 weeks while flushing if possible. What do you guys think? I am thinking one more week of nutes and then flush the shit out of them for 2 weeks. The first week with lights on 12/12 and the second week of flush with lights off. What do u think? How many days did you flower before flushing laser?


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## thewinghunter (Jan 14, 2010)

very nice. i was mislead, u didnt construict it, u bought it. i made mine for a few $, 100s cheaper than store bought and mines bigger. panda film is cheap. and so is wood. but very cool


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## supertiger (Jan 14, 2010)

looking nice


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## smokingrubber (Jan 14, 2010)

anon1122 said:


> Today is day 41 of 12/12. Lots of the hairs are turning orange, but plenty are still white. When should I begin flushing? The attitude site says that I should keep them in the dark for the last 2 weeks while flushing if possible. What do you guys think? I am thinking one more week of nutes and then flush the shit out of them for 2 weeks. The first week with lights on 12/12 and the second week of flush with lights off. What do u think? How many days did you flower before flushing laser?


Two weeks with no nutes and 1 week with no light? NO!

4 days flush is all you need and there is no need to turn the lights off. I've heard some people turn it off for the last 2 days, but definately NOT 7. I believe both of those topics are covered by a "myths" post I read by Al B Fuct.

Typically, most plants finish in 56-70 days. Buy a small hand-held microscope and check them ($25). When the little tricomes turn cloudy, then light-amber she's ripe.


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## anon1122 (Jan 14, 2010)

smokingrubber said:


> Two weeks with no nutes and 1 week with no light? NO!
> 
> 4 days flush is all you need and there is no need to turn the lights off. I've heard some people turn it off for the last 2 days, but definately NOT 7. I believe both of those topics are covered by a "myths" post I read by Al B Fuct.
> 
> Typically, most plants finish in 56-70 days. Buy a small hand-held microscope and check them ($25). When the little tricomes turn cloudy, then light-amber she's ripe.



So, when the trichs are cloudy/amber I should start flushing then? And only a 4-7 day flush and maybe lights off for a day or two.


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## smokingrubber (Jan 14, 2010)

I wouldn't do light's out at all, but a day or 2 would probably stress it just enough to do something. Again, not recommended.

Yeah, watch the trichs over the next 2 weeks and you should see the change happen right before your eyes. Different levels of amber have a different high. From a couple feet away, the buds will darken and get that ripe look. Unless you have some data from the breeder on the exact havest date, you'll just have to watch and wait. Then flush and pluck.  My guess would be 60-63 days. (just a guess).


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## laserbrn (Jan 14, 2010)

smokingrubber said:


> I wouldn't do light's out at all, but a day or 2 would probably stress it just enough to do something. Again, not recommended.
> 
> Yeah, watch the trichs over the next 2 weeks and you should see the change happen right before your eyes. Different levels of amber have a different high. From a couple feet away, the buds will darken and get that ripe look. Unless you have some data from the breeder on the exact havest date, you'll just have to watch and wait. Then flush and pluck.  My guess would be 60-63 days. (just a guess).


I just finished that strain....don't go early. I grew it twice so I know the difference, it's a SOLID 9 - 10 week flowering strain. I went 8 weeks the first time (way too early) and 9 weeks the second time (still too early) and I would go 10 weeks if I were doing it again. I wouldn't bother flushing until about the end of the 8th week, they DEFINITELY won't be ready by then and if you start earlier than that you are ripping yourself off. Day 64ish start flushing and pull them at about 60 and you'll be a REAL happy summama bitch. Great strain...still smokin' it. Smoked it an hour ago.


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## patlpp (Jan 14, 2010)

I have read ur journal and can't get how your vent system finally ended up. Your piks don't show the whole thing. Could u explain your system? I hate to open old wounds. I plan on: 4" filter to 6" 600 watt light, to 430 cfm speed-adjustable can-fan out. (suckie out method) I have a 4x8x7 tent. Did you experiment with a simular design and it didn't work? Ru running 2 separate vent systems? 
Thanks


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## anon1122 (Jan 14, 2010)

patlpp said:


> I have read ur journal and can't get how your vent system finally ended up. Your piks don't show the whole thing. Could u explain your system? I hate to open old wounds. I plan on: 4" filter to 6" 600 watt light, to 430 cfm speed-adjustable can-fan out. (suckie out method) I have a 4x8x7 tent. Did you experiment with a simular design and it didn't work? Ru running 2 separate vent systems?
> Thanks


The fan sucks through the carbon filter, pushed air through the air cooled hood, then out the tent, through the wall and into the laundry room where it connects to a Y adapter with the dryer vent.

Let me know if u have anymore questions.


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## anon1122 (Jan 16, 2010)

Well, the ladies are doing pretty well. filling out nicely. I started 3 new seeds the other day.

1 barneys farm blue cheese
1 dna lemon skunk
1 dna la confidential

The blue cheese and la confidential have sprouted and lemon skunk will be up by morning. It will be perfect timing with the harvest and everything. These will provide clones and when I have a nice 4x4 tray I can fill it up laserbrn style. lol. Ill definetly have to start a new journal when the time comes for the new seeds. But for now they will overlap until harvest and dried weight is posted for the widows.


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## laserbrn (Jan 17, 2010)

anon1122 said:


> Well, the ladies are doing pretty well. filling out nicely. I started 3 new seeds the other day.
> 
> 1 barneys farm blue cheese
> 1 dna lemon skunk
> ...


Sounds like a good plan and some good genetics you've chosen. The only recommendation I have is a 3x3 tray instead of a 4x4 tray inside the 4x4 tent. There's no need to have the tray all the way to the edges and a 4x4 will just mean more water in a larger reservoir and more of a pain in the ass when trying to get the tray in/out of the tent.

Here's my 3x3 tray inside my 4x4 tent with my 8 plants sitting in it and they are about 6 days into flower. You can see that they will easily fill the 4x4 space while only need the 3x3 tray to hold the pots.

Things look like they are working out pretty well for you first grow eh? Most people end up with a lot more troubles than you've had!


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## anon1122 (Jan 19, 2010)

I know the leaves aren't the prettiest from where the problems affected them before, but they are doing really well, continuing to swell and grow. I can't wait until harvest. Any estimates on weight? Sorry I had to delete the previous post, I put the wrong pics on.


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## smokingrubber (Jan 19, 2010)

I would guess: 9 oz dried


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## laserbrn (Jan 19, 2010)

anon1122 said:


> I know the leaves aren't the prettiest from where the problems affected them before, but they are doing really well, continuing to swell and grow. I can't wait until harvest. Any estimates on weight? Sorry I had to delete the previous post, I put the wrong pics on.


I'm gonna go with 8-10 zips. I know those buds might be huge in real life. Hard to make any guesses from here, but those look amazing man, what a great first grow....I'll definitely +rep you if I can.

If your plants were still suffering from the problems earlier on they wouldn't look like that at all.

I should note...they don't even look close to done. Do what you can to preserve those leaves......keep them alive, don't pick them off, etc. They have a lot more work to do for you.


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## anon1122 (Jan 19, 2010)

laserbrn said:


> I'm gonna go with 8-10 zips. I know those buds might be huge in real life. Hard to make any guesses from here, but those look amazing man, what a great first grow....I'll definitely +rep you if I can.
> 
> If your plants were still suffering from the problems earlier on they wouldn't look like that at all.



Thanks for all the great compliments guys. I'd be stoked with 8-10 and that puts me in the neighborhood of my goal. They have this lemony/citrus smell, so beautiful. I've been really lucky to have some great mentors like you guys to help me achieve such great results.


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## don2009 (Jan 21, 2010)

ABSOLUTLY Anon Thanks for your journal I feel you come along way i hope the best yield for you. Do you use any advance nutes? check out this guy journal https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/144247-600hps-hydro-grow-14-plants.html 
he seems like he doing it big with the advance nutes good luck bro and keep it goin im goin to try and follow his nutes style I think thats what got his thing going what you think?


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## anon1122 (Jan 21, 2010)

don2009 said:


> ABSOLUTLY Anon Thanks for your journal I feel you come along way i hope the best yield for you. Do you use any advance nutes? check out this guy journal https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/144247-600hps-hydro-grow-14-plants.html
> he seems like he doing it big with the advance nutes good luck bro and keep it goin im goin to try and follow his nutes style I think thats what got his thing going what you think?



Yeah, he did a hell of a job. I like the fox farm nutes and im sure next time since I now know about needing calmag, the next grow will be spectacular.


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## laserbrn (Jan 22, 2010)

anon1122 said:


> Yeah, he did a hell of a job. I like the fox farm nutes and im sure next time since I now know about needing calmag, the next grow will be spectacular.


You've got the idea. YOu know what you need next time for your setup and you are good to go. I have add Cal Mag to mine or I get the same problem, as a matter of fact if you followed my FI thread you'll see that I ran into the same problem. Now all is well and I have a bottle fo Cal-Mag Plus chillin' on my shelf.


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## anon1122 (Jan 22, 2010)

laserbrn said:


> You've got the idea. YOu know what you need next time for your setup and you are good to go. I have add Cal Mag to mine or I get the same problem, as a matter of fact if you followed my FI thread you'll see that I ran into the same problem. Now all is well and I have a bottle fo Cal-Mag Plus chillin' on my shelf.




If I can do this well this time, just imagine what I can do next time! I am so psyched.


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## laserbrn (Jan 22, 2010)

Wow, I wrote that previous post before I smoked and right after I woke up. It's barely coherent! I'm glad I smoke a little bowl before heading to work. 

Your crops will definitely get better over time and as you run into problems and solve them your repetoir only gets larger and you learn to identify problems really early and keep them from manifesting into something very serious. You can minimize the effects that small problems have on your overall yield and quality.


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## anon1122 (Jan 22, 2010)

Ok guys,

great news.

I took a trim sample of each plant and here are the results.

Plant A has 50% amber trichs under the microscope.

Plant B has 40% amber and 60% cloudy

Plant C has 25-30% amber and the rest are a mix of cloudy and clear.

With that in mind I am going to begin flushing.

I figure within the next week or so of plain water the trichs will turn a good bit. Giving me some energetic buds and some couch lock buds.

Tonight I am going to clean the res and fill with RO water and some flora kleen. Then tomorrow between work shifts I am going to empty the res and replace with just plain RO water. And just use that until they are done. If the ppm of the water keeps going up, Ill replace the water again.

Here we go guys, the home stretch.


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## laserbrn (Jan 22, 2010)

anon1122 said:


> Ok guys,
> 
> great news.
> 
> ...


You got it brotha, home stretch it is. It's been a good ride.


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## bigneil422 (Jan 22, 2010)

Just read through and I wanted to give you some congrats. Also thanks to laser for some good help along the way eh?


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## spmoney82 (Jan 22, 2010)

glad i stumbled upon this hope you harvest well great job


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## anon1122 (Jan 22, 2010)

bigneil422 said:


> Just read through and I wanted to give you some congrats. Also thanks to laser for some good help along the way eh?



Thanks for the congrats! I've said it before, and I'll say it again. I couldn't have pulled off this caliber of grow my first time without some intense mentoring from laserbrn. He really made this a lot easier for me, and not to forget BobSmith, and smokingrubber too (dandelion pollen argument not withstanding.)

It's been a great ride and It's about to get a hell of a lot better. Next up is Blue Cheese and LA confidential.

Stay tuned for flush, harvest, dry, cure and smoke report, and final weight.


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## smokingrubber (Jan 23, 2010)

The dandelion thing was an honest mistake LOL. I don't know about you, but I've learned A LOT since then.

What's up with your next grow? Are you starting from seed? Do you have them inhand yet? When will you germ them? Any changes to the room in-between grows?


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## anon1122 (Jan 23, 2010)

smokingrubber said:


> The dandelion thing was an honest mistake LOL. I don't know about you, but I've learned A LOT since then.
> 
> What's up with your next grow? Are you starting from seed? Do you have them inhand yet? When will you germ them? Any changes to the room in-between grows?



Yeah, we've both learned a lot. I was just kidding anyway. The seeds are in hand and have popped out of the cubes. I will be getting a cool tube reflector, a 3x3 ebb and flow table, a light weight carbon filter, and a couple more upgrades. Ill post more later.


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## laserbrn (Jan 23, 2010)

anon1122 said:


> Yeah, we've both learned a lot. I was just kidding anyway. The seeds are in hand and have popped out of the cubes. I will be getting a cool tube reflector, a 3x3 ebb and flow table, a light weight carbon filter, and a couple more upgrades. Ill post more later.


Very nice. I don't know why the cool tube reflector though. Do you mean an air cooled hood or an acutal cool tube? The efficiency on those cooltubes is aweful. And in this size tent my only regret right now is that I didn't get a larger reflector for my 600w. 

I'm glad the dandelion thing came up again, but in all honesty I followed his thread and I think he's learned a lot and done a lot of reading in the past 3 months while this has been going on. I on the other hand apparently haven't been doing enough "helping the new guys" in the newbie section and help sections because I haven't come across a differnet quote to replace yours with and 3 months has to be damn near a record. People say stupid shit on here all day long.


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## Walk (Jan 23, 2010)

42 pages of reading, but helpful reading nonetheless, I'm about 10 days into my first grow and hope to get as much help, and have as much success as you have anon!!

Going to sub for the final weight and smoke tests 

Way to be lazer, bob, and smoking! You guys keep the community alive!

-Walk


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## anon1122 (Jan 23, 2010)

laserbrn said:


> Very nice. I don't know why the cool tube reflector though. Do you mean an air cooled hood or an acutal cool tube? The efficiency on those cooltubes is aweful. And in this size tent my only regret right now is that I didn't get a larger reflector for my 600w.
> 
> I'm glad the dandelion thing came up again, but in all honesty I followed his thread and I think he's learned a lot and done a lot of reading in the past 3 months while this has been going on. I on the other hand apparently haven't been doing enough "helping the new guys" in the newbie section and help sections because I haven't come across a differnet quote to replace yours with and 3 months has to be damn near a record. People say stupid shit on here all day long.


Well, I have the hydrofarm radiant 8 hood. That thing is effing heavy. I at least need to get a daystar instead. I need something that spreads the light instead of making in a footprint. Because next time the tent will be FULL. But yea, I was thinking a cool tube is light weight and would spread the light. Anyway, We'll see what happens.


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## smokingrubber (Jan 24, 2010)

I like the Sun System Hoods because of the hinged glass. Very handy imo. I had a couple spreckles of insulation that got sucked through the ducting during the last remodel. Today, it was nothing to unscrew the frame and drop the glass real quick. I cleaned both hoods in less than a minute.

Considering I'm going to be swapping the MH and the HPS bulbs every couple months, it'll get some use.


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## anon1122 (Jan 26, 2010)

K guys,

Had to chop a bit early, but the great thing is, i did the taste test on the leaves, and tasted like clean water.

My grandmother is in desperate need of medicine because she gets sick on her pain killers. She has agreed to try cannabis, so to speed up the process, the plants had to go today. But they look wonderful and will be some amazing smoke. Will post pics shortly.


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## laserbrn (Jan 26, 2010)

anon1122 said:


> K guys,
> 
> Had to chop a bit early, but the great thing is, i did the taste test on the leaves, and tasted like clean water.
> 
> My grandmother is in desperate need of medicine because she gets sick on her pain killers. She has agreed to try cannabis, so to speed up the process, the plants had to go today. But they look wonderful and will be some amazing smoke. Will post pics shortly.


I understand the need for meds, but that was a huge mistake. Aren't you at like 7.5 weeks? Oh man...you gave up MAJOR weight by cutting early and this bud is so freakin' "racey" already I don't even want to imagine how bad someone who doesn't smoke is going to freak out if they smoke some that was chopped early. You definitely wanted a more narcotic effect and a less of head rush, but to each their own. Glad your crop came out good and the plants made it to the end. Now you have room for the next one. Get it started quick, it's going to take longer than you want it to. And try not to somke up all of your shit before it's dried and cured properly. It gets better and better with time.


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## smokingrubber (Jan 26, 2010)

Yeah u shoulda waited. Hope you're happy with it though, time to fire up the next one! Patience is a virtue when it comes to curing too. It really does get MUCH better and lasts much longer if you properly cure it. Dry it, trim it up and take some photos.


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## anon1122 (Jan 27, 2010)

turns out I had major root rot going on. So in a way Im kinda glad they came down before something like that brought them down. Im checking the trichs, and there is a lot of amber action going on, so I am thinking it may be pretty stony. I am proud anyway for this being my first time out in a long time. Ill keep you posted and ill post pics tonight.


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## BCBuddy420 (Jan 28, 2010)

Hey there  I think your setup is tight. In my opinion you drawing air in through the flaps at the bottom via negative pressure for your fan will only work if you have alot of fresh, cool air in that room perhaps from a window. Otherwise just bringing in that house-warm slightly stale air won't quite cut it for proper ventilation. You may need to draw fresh air directly into your room from an outside source, whatever that may take. Try your plan and if it works and the plants are healthy and thriving...stick to it my friend, no need for further measures. I also think that you should sell your hydro system , buy some 3 gallon pots, fillem' with wicked soil medium and grow some nice 5 footers  I just like soil growing better


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## anon1122 (Jan 31, 2010)

10 oz 22 gr dried. now for curing.


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## DRIPS420 (Jan 31, 2010)

Hey good job on the grow. Hope I make it ....Im 2 weeks in to 12/12

I got pretty much the same setup as you....Growing some gods gift. 4x4 tent 600w with carbon filter. DWC 5 gal x2 I have the hortilux eye and am going with botanicare nutes. With Kool Bloom. 

My foliar canopy is 3x4.....lighter size pistol balls on em. 

Funny thing is I am using DWC in 5 gal buckets with central res......and I had some similar problems to you. I think I got some root rot starting. THe leaves are turning yellow and the ppm in one bucket keeps going up. EC x500. 1100 base going up to about 1300 within 3-4 days. 
Any advice you could give?

Im going with the tray next grow and "hope" its a good one. 

I was thinking i might get like 6 oz off these two.....


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## newbiebob (Jan 31, 2010)

great post. I am building a similar set up.
I see a lot of people have said that they are building simial set ups too.
i got a next gen 400w/600w mh /hps ballist.
i got a xtrasun 6 air cooled reflector.
I built a bubble ponics system. 
I am worried about the smell. i live in a 1 bedroom apt. 
let me know how the filter is working. I was going to build one but i might buy the same one you got if you give it a good review.
I am trying to decide on seeds now.
where to get them and wht type. I hear that the auto flowering plants do well for indoor grows where odor is an issue. However, i wanted to grow some jack the ripper 
letme know what you decide.
also what are you doing for humidity? have you had to make any adjustments etc.


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## anon1122 (Feb 1, 2010)

newbiebob said:


> great post. I am building a similar set up.
> I see a lot of people have said that they are building simial set ups too.
> i got a next gen 400w/600w mh /hps ballist.
> i got a xtrasun 6 air cooled reflector.
> ...



Humidity was ok, the only problem was the carbon filter was too heavy for my tent, so go with a lighter filter, or an ozone generator.


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## don2009 (Feb 1, 2010)

Hey how you looking on those pics???


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## KNS420 (Feb 1, 2010)

incase you havent figured it out or someone hasnt said it yet you should make sure that your tent is completely light proof.. like no light shining thru the zippers!


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## anon1122 (Feb 1, 2010)

KNS420 said:


> incase you havent figured it out or someone hasnt said it yet you should make sure that your tent is completely light proof.. like no light shining thru the zippers!



Mine had several light leaks, and no hermies or anything. *shrugs*


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## laserbrn (Feb 2, 2010)

anon1122 said:


> Mine had several light leaks, and no hermies or anything. *shrugs*


Yeah, light shines through my zippers too, and at first I guess I was a little concerned, but I hopped in the tent and turned the lights on outside and it was still dark as shit in there.

Light doesn't really SHINE through the zippers it just kind of illuminates the zipper cloth and the ambient light in my space doesn't penetrate it nearly as well as the HPS penetrates it coming out.


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## newbiebob (Feb 3, 2010)

anon1122 said:


> Humidity was ok, the only problem was the carbon filter was too heavy for my tent, so go with a lighter filter, or an ozone generator.


i heard the same thing from several people so i got the sunhut silver it has a metal frame im hopeing that it will hold up here is the specs:


*SUN HUT SILVER XL 4X4*

NEW Sun Hut Silver! 30% more reflective than white plastic interior. 

Larger than competitive huts to accommodate Botanicare 4' x 4' & 4' x 8'
Thick black canvas exterior with while plastic interior
Heavy duty zippers
Metal framing is made of heavy-duty steel tubing
2 - 6" duct flanges (LG) included 2 - 6" duct flanges (XXL) included
Bracket to support exhaust fan & filter
got it from plantlighting hydroponics.com for 
$189.90
that seemes like a great deal to me. however, as the name implies 
i dont know my di*k from a hole in the ground

what do you think?


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## anon1122 (Feb 4, 2010)

newbiebob said:


> i heard the same thing from several people so i got the sunhut silver it has a metal frame im hopeing that it will hold up here is the specs:
> 
> 
> *SUN HUT SILVER XL 4X4*
> ...



The sun huts are pretty tight, but I am still partial to grolabs if u have the $.


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## smokingrubber (Feb 4, 2010)

My only complaint about the GrowLAB is height. The Sun Hut (I think) is 6" taller. That 6" could be a big difference right now in my garden.


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