# PC Case grow - Stealth + Perpetual + LST



## v12xjs (Feb 15, 2009)

There seems to be a few PC case grows now so I figured maybe I should put mine up on here in the hope it may help out some of the newbies to get started.
It's a perpetual system so there will always be other stuff in the case, but I have a plant about 4 weeks into flowering and I've had her posing for the cam most days since she sprouted, so I'm going to use her as the star of this show.
I'll start uploading from the beginning, but just to tease you guys into checking out this journal, here's a pic of the outside of my case and a shot of my leading lady at 27 days into flower.
So let's get started.


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## v12xjs (Feb 15, 2009)

Forgot to mention this is a 12/12 from seed system.
The strain is Ice Cream, so I called her Granita  She's about 80% Indica and has a flowering time of 8 weeks.
Here's Granita at day 11 and day 14 from sprouting.


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## v12xjs (Feb 15, 2009)

Day16 then. A pic of the grow with Granita in the middle and one of the lady herself.


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## v12xjs (Feb 15, 2009)

Days 19 and 25. Now I have some sidebranches I can start the LST.
Also a pic of the control panel. The bottom 2 numbers are temperature and humidity inside the case.


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## v12xjs (Feb 15, 2009)

Day 27. You may be able to see 2 rubber bands. The front one is to tie it down low, the other one is to start training her around the top of the pot.
The pot turned out to be a bit too thin for my usual hooks and so here the rubber bands are just taped to the sides of the pot. This isn't good enough, so there's a repot coming soon.


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## v12xjs (Feb 15, 2009)

Days 30 and 32. Check right in the centre of the 2nd pic to see Granita's very first flower.
Altogether now...Awwwww


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## floridasucks (Feb 15, 2009)

awsome..... by far the best pc grow ive seen.


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## v12xjs (Feb 15, 2009)

Wow. Thanks for the kind comment Floridasucks. 

Here's a couple from day 38. Clearly a bad hair day for Granita 

She's in her new pot now. It's only 1 litre but it should be ok. If I get trouble with the roots in soil then I can get one of my Hydor pumps in it and convert to a shallow hydro setup.


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## v12xjs (Feb 15, 2009)

Day 40 and 42. 
Don't get too attached to the little one next to Granita. It's another goddam boy! That's the 2nd one in a row out of a pack of feminised seeds. Grrr.


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## v12xjs (Feb 15, 2009)

Day 43 and 44.
There's 7 or 8 nice colas developing now. The 2nd pic is just a close up of one of them.


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## v12xjs (Feb 15, 2009)

Day 46. She's starting to put a bit of weight on now. Here's a full frontal and another of those bud sites.
It's starting to look promising


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## v12xjs (Feb 15, 2009)

Day 49.

I'm back to having an all girl lineup 
There's Granita of course, plus an Amstel Gold and the baby is a CH9 Jack.

I'm looking forward to trying out the Jack. Based on Jack Herer genetics she flowers in 7 weeks, so I may be able to get a full grow done with her inside 11 weeks.
Happy days


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## gronoob (Feb 15, 2009)

lookin good bro!! im gonna post som pix here inna minit of my purple kush gro......


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## v12xjs (Feb 15, 2009)

You are most welcome


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## v12xjs (Feb 15, 2009)

Day 51. How time flies


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## floridasucks (Feb 15, 2009)

nice work they are lookin good. what lights are u using?


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## v12xjs (Feb 16, 2009)

Thanks FS. I have a 125w 2700K envirolite and I recently added a little 12w 6500K cfl to give 10% blue light. I did this because my grows seem to me to start giving yellow leaves a bit early in the flower stage. I know the buds take nitrogen from them so I wanted to be sure the buds have all the nitrogen they need.
I'm not sure if 10% is just right, but you can see the first yellowing leaves in the first pic below and that's about 3 weeks later than in previous attemps, so I'll stick with it for now.

Here's some more pics then. An individual shot from day 52 and a family pic from day 53.


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## v12xjs (Feb 16, 2009)

Day 55 and things are starting to get smelly in there


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## SketzoH (Feb 16, 2009)

hey man just popped over to check it out, i think your right about it being a similar strain they look very alike young..

anyways looking real good bro keep it up


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## v12xjs (Feb 16, 2009)

Hey thanks SketzoH. Good luck with your grow too m8. 

Got a few more snaps for everyone. Days 56 and 57. I put the last one in to give a sense of scale. Who needs auto strains to keep things small enough for a PC grow?
Not me


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## v12xjs (Feb 16, 2009)

OK. Just these and this journal will be real time. Here's day 58 and 59.
The lights have just come on so I'll take some pics later which will be exactly 4 weeks into flowering, which means she has only 4 weeks left.

I just checked and another of those Jack seeds has germinated so it's going to get crowded in there next week. All the better for my empty stash tin


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## v12xjs (Feb 16, 2009)

If anyone has any questions or wants pics of anything specific just yell out.


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## watdaheo808 (Feb 16, 2009)

what do you think is the best soil to use for pc stealth grow? and what nutes should i use?


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## v12xjs (Feb 17, 2009)

Hey Watdaheo808. Thanks for stopping by.

I use Canna pro soil mix with around 35% vermiculite and 10% fine sand. I had problems with cheapo soils but this seems fine. I'm also on the Canna nutes at the moment, Terra Flores is the flowering one I use. I've also had good results with General Hydroponics soil nutes in the past. I also use Canna Boost a couple of times during flowering for a bit of bulk.
With a 12/12 setup like mine the soil tends to get the plants through to early flowering without needing a veg nute, especially with auto flowering strains. If they still haven't shown sex after say 3 weeks I'll give them a bit of a veg feed until I see flowers and then I switch to the bloom nutes.
I've learned never to feed them until the 2 round leaves have wilted as they always get nute burn if fed before this.

Good luck with your grow.


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## v12xjs (Feb 17, 2009)

Got a couple of pics from last night. A family shot and one of the canopy.

The temps are creeping up a little now it's getting warmer outside and I have the odour control back on. I've been running the fans on 6 volts for the last couple of months but I needed 7.5 volts last night to keep it under 80F. I may need to review my airflow soon as the noise draws attention if I run it at 12v. If anyone has any suggestions for extra cooling feel free to chime in.

Anyway, here's the pics. More in a couple of days.


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## LOLsauce (Feb 17, 2009)

bunch of beautiful busty women you got there! if your fans need to be silent, try larger ones(most likely not possible) or quieter ones to begin with, otherwise try remodeling your odor control for better airflow, idk just throwin some stuff out there maybe it'll spark an idea. on a lighter note, hows the smoke with 12/12 from seed?


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## v12xjs (Feb 18, 2009)

Hey LOLsauce. Thanks for stopping by.

Busty girls 
Nearly pissed myself 

Glad to hear you got your stuff. So quit reading. Start growing!

Thanks for the suggestions about cooling. The case can only take 80mm fans so upgrades aren't an option. Look at any of my pics tho, they're all different. Wires hanging here and there; bits of carboard with no mylar on. I'm never happy even though it's always worked ok. I have some ideas though and I still have a couple of volts in hand 
Don't listen to peeps saying your cooltube was a bad investment. Temps are all fine just now but summer is coming and temps will go up for everybody. I already have a pseudo cooltube and ultimately I will separate the bulb from the grow.

Let me know when you get your pics up m8.


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## v12xjs (Feb 18, 2009)

Well now I'm here, got some news for you all. Last night I became a Dad again. Has it really been 3 weeks since last time? 

Got some naughty porn too. A pic of Granita from her good side.
Also one for you LOLsauce. It's just Granita but this would fit perfectly under your 70 watt lamp and leave half of your case unused. You then have 3 weeks to fit some additional lighting and you can get another one growing!

Enjoy.
I will in a few weeks


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## v12xjs (Feb 18, 2009)

If you liked the porn pic just remember there's another 6 of them and 2 just a a touch smaller 

And there's 4 weeks to go


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## SketzoH (Feb 18, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Well now I'm here, got some news for you all. Last night I became a Dad again. Has it really been 3 weeks since last time?
> 
> Got some naughty porn too. A pic of Granita from her good side.
> Also one for you LOLsauce. It's just Granita but this would fit perfectly under your 70 watt lamp and leave half of your case unused. You then have 3 weeks to fit some additional lighting and you can get another one growing!
> ...


 congrats man! im real happy for ya


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## v12xjs (Feb 18, 2009)

Just for that I'm calling her SketzoH 
I've just looked at her and sh's real happy


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## SketzoH (Feb 18, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Just for that I'm calling her SketzoH
> I've just looked at her and sh's real happy


ahh thanks dude im honoured! 

granitas looking pretty frosty is that 8 bud sites i could see in that pic?


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## v12xjs (Feb 18, 2009)

There's 9 in total. 7 fat bitches and a couple just under the canopy.
You should have gone to specsavers 

All 7 of the big ones look like that


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## SketzoH (Feb 18, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> There's 9 in total. 7 fat bitches and a couple just under the canopy.
> You should have gone to specsavers
> 
> All 7 of the big ones look like that



its 1.50am and im super high is that good enuff excuse? lol

thats good to hear though mate


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## v12xjs (Feb 18, 2009)

Your a Daddy 

I'll look after her and send you regular updates on her progress


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## rlax106 (Feb 18, 2009)

How do you grow it so short and get it to flower?


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## v12xjs (Feb 19, 2009)

Hey there rlax106. Thanks for looking in.

I treat the girls like real women. Keep em in the dark and bend them over a lot 

As they are grown in 12/12 they never actually get a veg stage, so this restricts the height a lot. If I grew them like that they would get between 18 - 30 inches tall. This is still too tall for my case, so I also bend them over to encourage the sidebranches to grow like the main top. I aim for 8 - 10 tops which means the plant can only give 10% of that upward growth to each top and the result is very short plants like Granita.
I also use very little soil which probably helps too.


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## LOLsauce (Feb 19, 2009)

Bud porn makes me drool, no lie. Getting 8-10 (3g each?) colas is no lie as well, ima try and finish building the box today and if i cant scrounge up a digital camera i guess i'll have to use my phone : / but if this thing turns out nice id like to at least be able to show off the work, also i'm still waiting on the seeds, BTK3ill just ordered his today T_T so we both wont be started b4 next week i assume but hell keep on goin on seein those frosty buds only makes me work faster


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## v12xjs (Feb 19, 2009)

Good guess mate. 2 - 3g each top is the norm. Forgot to answer your other question about quality too. 12/12 produces indentical quality to vegged plants, just less of it.
Try to hold on a bit after harvest and do a good cure though or quality is compromised.


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## v12xjs (Feb 19, 2009)

Couple of shots from 20 minutes ago. 
Enjoy.


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## v12xjs (Feb 21, 2009)

Well I've spent the afternoon trying to cool down the growbox.

I've not had much success despite my best efforts but I'm thinking now that it isn't a problem with the basic design, which has been running without temp problems for around 3 years in it's present form.

The shared accomodation I'm in just now is inhabited by people who like to live in a sauna. The heating is off in my room but it still never falls below 65F, and it often rises above 72F so I expected to need a bit more fan power, but not like this.
I usually run around 8 - 12F above ambient room temps.
What I have found is that the source of the heat is the glass bulb in the envirolite itself. I can't touch it once it's been on for 5 minutes and I'm sure it never used to be like that. Anybody else had similar issues?

I don't know how hot it will get exactly but during testing I measured a 93.2 and it was still rising. I'm going to mail the manufacturer to see if they know anything, but it's looking like a new lamp is in order.
That may take a couple of weeks to sort out.

I run thelights from 10pm to 10am so I should be able to vent the case without giving the game away to the rest of the house, but in cooling the case I'll be bypassing my odour control.

I have a plan though


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## v12xjs (Feb 21, 2009)

Got a couple of pics from last night for you guys.
These temps gave SketzoH Junior a rough first day and she needed to go to intensive care but the prognosis is good and here's the first pic of the new baby.
There's also 2 side views just to dispel any notions of popcorn buds. With over 3 weeks left it's safe to say those are gonna be some nice little nugs  

Enjoy the show


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## SketzoH (Feb 21, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Got a couple of pics from last night for you guys.
> These temps gave SketzoH Junior a rough first day and she needed to go to intensive care but the prognosis is good and here's the first pic of the new baby.
> There's also 2 side views just to dispel any notions of popcorn buds. With over 3 weeks left it's safe to say those are gonna be some nice little nugs
> 
> Enjoy the show


:O looking real nice dude!!

sorry to hear about the heat issues have you got them sorted now and how u going about it?

Im filing for parental custody  haha


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## v12xjs (Feb 21, 2009)

Hey m8. Junior is looking tubby huh?

No. The heat is still a prob. I'll need to open up the case a bit for now and get a bulb asap.
Removing the carbon filter would do the trick but Granita wears a strong perfume.


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## kinghash (Feb 21, 2009)

very nice buds, bud


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## v12xjs (Feb 21, 2009)

SketzoH Junior is from a large family. She's the 2nd oldest. Luckily they will all be girls 

I was just showing off Granita in this journal but like I said at the off, it's a perpetual system so there's always something going on and here's a pic of SketzoH's eldest sister from last night. She's around 3 weeks and hasn't shown sex yet but she's looking good.


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## v12xjs (Feb 21, 2009)

Thanks Kinghash. Glad you like 'em.


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## v12xjs (Feb 22, 2009)

Been at the case again for a while. 
I let it run for a while before the changes and it hit 97F before I turned it off. I've fitted a little fan in the front blowing over the canopy and it's been stable at 86.3F since the girls went back in an hour ago. Still not great but better.
I'm still on 7.5v for the fans though so I can cool it down some more at the expense of a little noise, but I'm gonna try a plastic shield between the light and the canopy.
I have one ready that I'll try to fit in a little while. I'll get a couple of pics & report back.

I've been thinking about changing the light setup for a little while now anyway and I'd rather save up for that than get another envirolite.
Granita was the first plant I've used 6500K light with in 12/12 and it's worked really well, so I want a more permanent fixture than a dangling bulb. Also the envirolite is a single point of failure. If the lamp goes and I'm not around for a bit or I'm broke then things will go downhill fast, so I think I'd like to fit a couple of banks of smaller cfl's. I can perfect a nice blend of blue orange light and get some insurance that it will be ok if 1 or even 2 bulbs go.
Anyone else using 6500K in a 12/12?


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## v12xjs (Feb 22, 2009)

Got a pic when I put them back in earlier. It's a bit shabby so sorry for that.

It looks like the main cola and you can see it's just solid bud. Flowers are sprouting heavily still too, so that's gonna be a bigger than average bud


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## SeANi0 (Feb 22, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Got a pic when I put them back in earlier. It's a bit shabby so sorry for that.
> 
> It looks like the main cola and you can see it's just solid bud. Flowers are sprouting heavily still too, so that's gonna be a bigger than average bud


 
Granita is looking suberb, and more so seens as she is growing in a pc case. Had some ice cream at christmas and it lovely.

I was looking to start off some autoflowering strains (fem low ryder2, lowlife-whitemoscow) in a similar setup to yours in the next couple of months. I wanted to start this earlier (as you mentioned , summer is coming!) but I am going on holiday so wouldnt have been able to attend to the plants.

I have never grown before so this journal has been great for me.

Have a look at the list of my setup (to be), let me know what you think?:-

pc growcase dimensions: 24" H x 8" W x 17" L
Lighting - 4 27w CFL bulbs (7000lumens) Thanks, SeANi0.


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## faceplate27 (Feb 22, 2009)

Hey, man.. I love your grow. It's truly inspiring. I've had my boxes built for a while - server tower for flower and tall workstation for bonsai mommies is the plan - and ALMOST ready to go, but I have a holdup.. fans. Maybe this is more of an electronics question than a grow question, but.. can I wire up 3 ac fans to one ac extension cor or do I need 3 extension cords? The server case has 1 big intake fan and 2 big exhaust fans, but it would make life much easier if i could wire all 3 to one extension cord.

Also, you doing full nutes? I've read that, if you use a decent organic soil, you can go with simple clean water and molasses in a CC grow and was considering it.

I ordered my seeds tonight to give myself some impetus to get this thing finished - Citraal and Top 44.

Thanks again and great work!!


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## budbuster3000 (Feb 22, 2009)

im trying the samee thing in 18 inch pc case and using well placed lights (45watt cfl and a 29 watt cfl) and 3 lowryder 1's should produce about a ounce and a half just a little project tho


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## floridasucks (Feb 22, 2009)

yooo v12xjs ive been out for a while. the girls are lookin amazing!! sorry to hear u got light and heat issues. the only thing i can think of is cutting a hole in the side of the case and putting a 120mm fan in there. bikeskill has a fan setup like that on his pcgrow and it works good, but you need a dremel tool or somethin like it to cut a hole in the case. hope you get the issues worked out, lookin forward to see the finished product. one other thing ive had 2 120mm fans running on 12v and they were silent, maybe you just have some crappy fans?


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## Dr.Blunt (Feb 23, 2009)

great gro ur the pc grow king i never thought u could grow such nice plants in such a small area. i had a pc box myself but sold it thinking it would produce little. What kind of odor contol do you use im very interested in what would fit in there and still kill the smell.


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## v12xjs (Feb 23, 2009)

Wow. Didn't realise there was quite so much interest in this thing.

Hey SeANi0
Thanks for the comments. I've not tried any Ice Cream yet so I appreciate the smoke report too.
There's a thread by BTK3ill in the cfl forum and he has a similar setup to yours by the sounds of things. Your case is a bit taller than mine so you can be a bit less savage than I am with your girls. I reckon 100w plus is what you need even in such a small space so you tick that box too.
I'm convinced now that flowering is improved by a bit of 6500K light so my tip for you is to use one along with 3 2700K bulbs during flowering. Good luck with the grow and feel free to ask me anything if you think I can help.

Greets Faceplate
Glad you found some help and inspiration here. Your setup sounds awesome. What's with almost? Get growing!
I use 1 adjustable power supply into the case and onto a pc fan splitter I got from Maplins in the UK. You need to match the output of the psu to the total draw of your fans. My psu can cope with 5 amps at 12 volts which means I can run up to 60w (12v x 5amp) of fan power at 12v. You'll get some trailing wires but if you buy enough fan extension cords you will be able to run them so they are out of the way.
I use full nutes but I can't be bothered mixing so many different strengths each time I mix up, so I use 150ppm veg on the babies, and 250, 500 and 750ppm bloom for the different stages of flowring.
Good luck with it and get some pics up as I'd love to see a mom / clone rig in a pc case.

Thanks for stopping by budbuster3000
Those original LR are amazing plants. 8 weeks from seed to flower has to be seen to be believed. Good luck with them and let the world see what you do. There's obviously plenty of interest in pc grows now. Quite right too!

Good to see you again floridasucks
Appreciate the advice. My case only has venting for 80mm fans and there's not many silent fans at this size. I have some 120mm Noctua fans that are extremely silent but I can't fit the buggers in there!

Thanks for stopping by Dr.Blunt
I don't know about pc grow king but you've made my day for sure by saying it 
I'll take a pic of the exhaust tonight for you. Basically I use a strip of active carbon designed for use in cooker extractor hoods. I got a 1 metre sheet for about £10 and I only need 80mm a month so it will last me years.
You've seen how it's done so go buy that case back! And post pics of your porn!

And to any other pc growers lurking out there, I'm always interested in trying out new ideas so let me know what works for you.

But wait. I have some wicked news......


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## v12xjs (Feb 23, 2009)

Finally got it all sorted and temps are back within 10F of ambient even at 6volts. Here's some snaps of the new fan and heatshield setup.


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## v12xjs (Feb 23, 2009)

So here's a gorgeous snap of Granita and one to show SketzoH that I am a fit and proper parent.
You will lose the custody battle Sketzoh!


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## SketzoH (Feb 23, 2009)

granitas looking fantastic fella! bet shes gonna be one hell of a smoke.. any idea on yield?
haha i think ill drop the custody seems like u are a great daddy! plus my familys big enuff as it is 

Im interested in how your using a psu with the fans, dont suppose you have a link to a guide or something..i got loads of psu's and fans sitting around would be very helpful as i dont have any 12v adaptors!


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## v12xjs (Feb 23, 2009)

Hey there SketzoH

Thanks m8. It's always hard to tell what the yield will be but I think this Granita could be a personal best for me. I got 27g from a lowryder 2 a while back but it's possible I'll hit the magic 28 this time out.
I know it doesn't sound like much in comparison to a scrog but the perpetual nature of this system actually yields more in the long run with less effort.
Granita has 21 days left, the Amstel Gold will be ready 14 days later and Pandora will be ready 3 weeks after that, so over a gram a day without any problem.

Here's a link for a psu conversion:
http://www.wikihow.com/Convert-a-Computer-ATX-Power-Supply-to-a-Lab-Power-Supply



Just tumbled that I misread your post faceplate27. I'm a bit scared to advise on mains connectivity. If I tell you something wrong you could get hurt, so better to speak to an electrician if you can.
For what it's worth I have used 240v ac fans but took them out for a couple of reasons. They are much more noisy than 12v pc fans (even mine) and they are just too powerful for my growspace.
They worked fine on the timer but I tried to use a dimmer switch to tone down the noise and the hurricane Katrina effect, but they went pop as soon as the voltage dropped.


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## v12xjs (Feb 23, 2009)

Here's those pics Dr.Blunt

There's a 92mm fan shoehorned into the inside of the case pushing air out. The blue thing is a plastic food container. The blue keeps the light out (or in) and the outer fan is sucking air through as well. Inside the blue container is a folded strip of cooker extractor hood filter.
I used to have the top of the container bonded to the case so I could just snap it off to replace the filter, but the top was clear and let light in so the blutack acts as a temporary fixitive and light seal until I can work out a better system.
That outer fan is the noisy one in my system. With that unplugged there is no noise at 6v, but it helps keep the exhaust efficient so it stays.

Here's the pics:


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## Dr.Blunt (Feb 23, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Here's those pics Dr.Blunt
> 
> There's a 92mm fan shoehorned into the inside of the case pushing air out. The blue thing is a plastic food container. The blue keeps the light out (or in) and the outer fan is sucking air through as well. Inside the blue container is a folded strip of cooker extractor hood filter.
> I used to have the top of the container bonded to the case so I could just snap it off to replace the filter, but the top was clear and let light in so the blutack acts as a temporary fixitive and light seal until I can work out a better system.
> ...


Thanks alot im gonna use somthing like yours for my grow box i just havent figured it out yet.


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## floridasucks (Feb 23, 2009)

why dont you put the 120mm fans on the outside of the case?


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## v12xjs (Feb 23, 2009)

Hope it helps Dr.Blunt. Keep us posted on what you do.

Cheers again floridasucks. At present I can't work out how to do it so it improves on what I have. The bottom of the container is perfect for that 80mm fan. There is an adapter available to convert a 120m fan to an 80m hole so I'll pick one up next time I see one. I'll let you know how it goes.

Got some pics while I served the ladies breakfast just now. Here you go:


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## faceplate27 (Feb 23, 2009)

Heh. I'm at 'almost' because I've been trying to germ bagseed for f'ing ever. All my seeds are some 10 years old. As crazy as this sounds, I'm in a locale where we got nothing but sensi. I have heard of only one dude with seeded stuff in the past 5 years and that was accidental. The fuzz really put the smackdown on the schwagg rings and even the midgrade stuff.in the area. If people here want to smoke, they gotta pay $360 min. every time. I've been coping with that forever, but just got tired of 10 years of $360 per and felt like it was time to finally do it. Well.. as I said, the seeds are bought and on the way, so I should be posting some cool shit up here soon.

As far as the power thing goes, I ditched the psu's from the cases for space and went with a semi-ghetto setup with very decent surge protectors and light plugin converters, so my fans are all ac in one of the cases and the other 2 5 volt dc's are wired up via a modified cell charger. I'll be starting my journal soon to discuss the mechanics of it all more indepth prior to my seeds arriving, so.. pics soon. 

Keep up the great work. Also.. a couple questions..

1. What is your per-plant yield?

2. What's the structure of your perpetual? You start from seed or do you clone somewhere in there? I'm planning on vegging a couple weeks, nabbing a clone from the mommy and flowering the mommy as soon as the clone roots. The clone, then becomes the new mommy until it's veg'd enough to take a clone from her and repeat the cycle. Lucky for me, I have room for several cases and it's really not out of the ordinary for me to have a lot of computer cases in my house.


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## v12xjs (Feb 23, 2009)

I feel for you on those prices faceplate 

Looking forward to debating some tech stuff on that journal of yours too. My perfect goal is to have a motherboard in there too so it IS a pc. Stealth squared 
Send me a link when you get it going.

All plants are a bit different and we all make mistakes so crops vary. That's why I do my system. If this was a higher yielding scrog and I eff up all is lost. This way I'm only ever 3 weeks away from a full recovery.
I just use the wet loo roll in a tupperware container trick to germ. I germ 1 every 3 weeks or so. Never anything more than an 8 week strain. I've had longer ones in and tried running 5 plants but this is more manageable. I'll germ the next one 24 hours before Granita finds out the axe-wielding truth about me 

I got about 14g out of a badly nuteburned LR#2 and that's about the worst I've had. 20g+ is what I expect but I just use safe nute levels and miniscule pots. I prefer an easy life to max yields and a gram a day is plenty for my needs.


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## faceplate27 (Feb 23, 2009)

put linux on that motherboard and you'll be my hero. So.. here's my thought on that.. load linux onto a usb stick and do a motherboard that can boot usb and you are GOLD. You don't need a cdrom drive or anything. Driveless computers are easy as pie these days, but watch your humidity levels.


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## floridasucks (Feb 23, 2009)

shes lookin nice and crystally. what does it smell like? i dont know if you can do this with your setup but like i said before cut a hole the size of a 120mm in the side of the case. you do have a flat peice of metal that opens on the side, like most cases right? and could you put up a pic of the actual pc case closed up?


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## v12xjs (Feb 24, 2009)

Hey faceplate27. My thinking is to put a microATX mobo under the case where the feet screw in. I'm weak on linux skills but I do think it's the right OS for the job. If I can fit it under there then humidity should be contained as there would be 2 seperate chambers.
I'm slowly building up the goodies to make a 2nd case with all the tricks I've learned. The Antec kit looks perfect but they are very expensive cases. I will definitely be fitting a mobo in there but there's no rush just yet.

Greets floridasucks. Checked out your cardboard grow and was very impressed. You should do one of those tv gardening shows  Bet your viewing figures would be huge 
Thanks again for the suggestions.
Not all improvements turn out to be positive which is why my case is always a bit scruffy and looks like a work in progress. It is. But without knowing exactly what the effects will be I wouldn't want to start cutting up the case.
If you look at the inside pics of the light and heatshield you can just see a fan above the little one I fitted. It blows right into the centre of the bulb, so the airflow coming in starts at the front top and goes to the back top where it is forced down and into the exhaust fan. If I put a side mount fan in there it could interfere with that airflow and cause more heat issues than it solves, so I need to think about it.
Oddly enough I already go against the generally accepted view of cold air in at the bottom front and warm air out at the top rear. I actually found that putting the cold air in at a high level cools down the system faster and better than introducing it low down. It also doubles as a fan over the plants so it's a win, win.
Do you want to see the case in daylight or are you looking for light leaks. Just asking so I can get the pics you want.


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## LOLsauce (Feb 24, 2009)

gettin quite frosty, good to see you were able to get the temps under control dude, and consider yourself lucky its warm, im running the shower right now cuse this basement has no heat T_T


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## v12xjs (Feb 24, 2009)

Thanks LOLsauce.

So are you up and running then?
If it only gets cold in the dark period, try throwing a blanket over the rig 20 minutes before lights out to retain some heat.
Another possible solution if it's available where you are is a heating mat. They are used in home brew wine setups to assist fermentation and they only provide a gentle warmth, but that may be enough for you. You could maybe fit one under the case and have it on a timer that runs opposite to your light timer.
Got any pics up yet?


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## floridasucks (Feb 24, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> You should do one of those tv gardening shows  Bet your viewing figures would be huge


haha thanx man.. yea your fan setup sounds good, they look real happy anyway. just a pic in the daylight, one with it closed up and one open.


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## dsn (Feb 24, 2009)

Looks very good for a PC case grow. You gave me an idea. I`m currently growing with CFL`s. Next grow I`m gonna use HPS, so I could make another small cab with CFL`s and put some clones there. Extra bud always is good! 

What strain You have there?


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## v12xjs (Feb 24, 2009)

Will do FS.

I'll post them tomorrow as the lights are on 10pm to 10am.
Forgot to describe the smell for you. Granita has a very strong deep smell. My clothes are still smelling of it from the 2 nights with the door open while I had the heatwave. It's mad when I open the door though as the next in line to the chopping block is a pure indica and she has that fresh light skunky smell.

Hey dsn. Thanks for stopping by.
You are spot on with your plan. You can never have too much bud 

The main plant is Ice Cream and I would strongly rate it so far. An easy grow and very profuse budding. I only got 1 seed which is a shame. There's an Amstel Gold next. Again it came from a seed swap and there's only 1. I didn't have much hope for her as she's pure indica and they don't do well in my system. The 2 youngest are both CH9 Jack and I have another 7 of those so I should be able to learn how to max them after a couple of practice runs.
The CH9 seeds fit my profile of genetics well and are a good price but even better is the fact that those guys welcome questions on any of their range.


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## floridasucks (Feb 24, 2009)

ahh thanx for the smell report. why would a pure indica not be good for you system? i would think thats what you want cause it stays short.


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## v12xjs (Feb 24, 2009)

I used them a lot to start with for the short stature, but they don't really put out roots and this affects yields a lot. I think they need a veg period to build up a rootball but that's just in my experience and not something I've read.
In contrast the sativas I grew carried on growing roots for the whole grow, sometimes I've had to repot within 2 or 3 weeks of harvest due to this growth.
I now select genetics that are around 80% indica and 20% sativa and they grow into those 1 litre pots perfectly.


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## floridasucks (Feb 24, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> I used them a lot to start with for the short stature, but they don't really put out roots and this affects yields a lot. I think they need a veg period to build up a rootball but that's just in my experience and not something I've read.
> In contrast the sativas I grew carried on growing roots for the whole grow, sometimes I've had to repot within 2 or 3 weeks of harvest due to this growth.
> I now select genetics that are around 80% indica and 20% sativa and they grow into those 1 litre pots perfectly.


wow i never would have thought that. very intresting.


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## v12xjs (Feb 24, 2009)

It didn't make sense to me but it's a repeatable experiment so I've had to learn from that.
Much the same with venting cold air in from the bottom. In there it just gave me 2 temp zones. A cool one at the bottom and grill at the top.

The latest big find is in using 6500K light in a 12/12. Granita is the first to benefit from it. All previous grows lost the shade leaves very early in the flowering stage. So much so that I needed to do very little manicuring, but those leaves are bud food so I wanted them to stay on!
10% 6500K and I have lost virtually no leaves.
I would guess that this also works the other way and that a 2700K in veg will help plants to switch to flowering faster, but it isn't an experiment I'll be trying soon as I don't do veg.

Here's a pic from during the heatwave that shows the inside of the case. With the new pots I actually have a bit of free space on the left now and I can't help thinking I can use this for a bonsai mom. I wish I could leave well alone 

Here's your pic:


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## SketzoH (Feb 24, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> It didn't make sense to me but it's a repeatable experiment so I've had to learn from that.
> Much the same with venting cold air in from the bottom. In there it just gave me 2 temp zones. A cool one at the bottom and grill at the top.
> 
> The latest big find is in using 6500K light in a 12/12. Granita is the first to benefit from it. All previous grows lost the shade leaves very early in the flowering stage. So much so that I needed to do very little manicuring, but those leaves are bud food so I wanted them to stay on!
> ...


 I went 12/12 from seeds with just 2700k's and having exact same problem glad i found an answer so quickly lol the bottom three sets of leaves are curling and dying off :\ 
where do u get your 6500ks from? i tryed b&q and wilkinsons and no luck wen i looked before.


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## KaliKitsune (Feb 24, 2009)

This is actually an impressive PC grow. Which case are you using?


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## needhelp (Feb 24, 2009)

nice, inspirational grow you got going..


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## Dr.Blunt (Feb 24, 2009)

do you use clear pots so the roots get a lil light and dnt grow as much resulting in smaller growth?


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## needhelp (Feb 24, 2009)

Dr.Blunt said:


> do you use clear pots so the roots get a lil light and dnt grow as much resulting in smaller growth?


that sounds odd...

you can get smaller growth by placement of lights


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## v12xjs (Feb 24, 2009)

Hey SketzoH
Nearly all the bulbs around are 2700K. Try Focus. Think they are the ones with the deep blue stripe across the pack at the top right of their bulb display. Glad you got that nugget in time 

Thanks needhelp. Always appreciate kind words. Hope there's something of value in here for you too.

Greets again Dr.Blunt
The clear pots are more about seeing what the roots are doing. Fitting all the soil, plants, lights, fans and temp monitor takes it's toll in such a teeny space.They don't affect anything in my experience, just let me see if I need to give the girls bigger shoes. You know what girls are like with shoes 

Thanks KaliKitsune. I got the case maybe 4 years ago and there's nothing written on it. It was just a cheapo Chinese box available at the time.
One thing it does have that I found to be very helpful in trapping light but letting air in is a hinged door at the front.


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## v12xjs (Feb 24, 2009)

needhelp said:


> you can get smaller growth by placement of lights


That's a new one on me. Do you know how it's done needhelp?


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## needhelp (Feb 24, 2009)

i meant the closer the lights were, the smaller it grew... and the further you kept them away, the taller the plant grows to reach for the light...


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## Dr.Blunt (Feb 24, 2009)

i was saying roots dnt like light and it makes them smaller. smaller roots equal smaller plants, but im jus going off of what iv read thru my many travels thru bud mountain, and i was high the whole time.


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## rlax106 (Feb 24, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey there rlax106. Thanks for looking in.
> 
> I treat the girls like real women. Keep em in the dark and bend them over a lot
> 
> ...


Thanks for the response lol treat em like women... Ok so when you say bend you mean use twisties to bend the top down by the side of the pot. Also if my plants been sprouted for two weeks and its been on a 18/6 cycle could I still switch to a 12/12 with out any problems?


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## KaliKitsune (Feb 24, 2009)

Next chance you get I would recommend getting a taller PC case, like one of those old 90MHz Pentium Pro servers that were like three feet tall almost and loud as all hell. Perfect cover for high fan noise, and they were damn-near lightproof.

You could prolly find one for like 2 bucks somewhere.


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## LOLsauce (Feb 25, 2009)

man despite havin such a small space you have some beautiful girls, I cant wait to see granita when shes fully grown


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## v12xjs (Feb 25, 2009)

Thanks for the reply needhelp.
What you say is spot on but sometimes the plants don't want to be short and they will happily grow onto the light 

I've heard the same thing many times Dr.Blunt but I needed to see what was going on so I tried it and it doesn't seem to affect anything.
If the roots in light died off but hidden roots continued to grow I would expect trailing roots at the bottom of my pots but this doesn't happen with the genetics I use.
I may cover up the CH9 plants once I'm used to the strain and am happy they have enough room, simply to replicate nature a bit more.

Hi again rlax106
Yes I just bend the tops down and fix them to the sides of the pot.The pots I use now have lids which are great for use with those screw-in hooks. I either bend the plant under a large hook or tie it down with a smaller one. Got some pics of Pandora that may illustrate better than my words 
I think that plant will show it's first flower tomorrow night as you can see a tiny pistil in the centre of one of those pics.

Think you are showing your age there KaliKitsune 
Bet you still remember DOS 6.2 
An old server case would be perfect for my project to fit a working motherboard in but I really like the hinged front I have on this box and I don't remember ever seeing them on the old kit I worked with.
Also the 12/12 means that plants stay small even if left to grow with a single cola so unless I change my style there's probably no need to go for max headroom.

Thanks LOLsauce. The system is pretty simple and very repeatable as you can see. The hard bit is getting the odour under control and keeping temps in the right kind of range. You'll have similar pics up here in a few weeks and a great big smile on your face


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## v12xjs (Feb 25, 2009)

And a couple of other pics of Granita from last night plus the case again:


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## floridasucks (Feb 25, 2009)

great pix...... in the one where the case is closed are the lights on?


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## v12xjs (Feb 25, 2009)

Thanks FS.

Yup, the case is in full flight 
Got a little peep show for you that illustrates things even better.
1st pic there's just a small white spot which is usually covered with a small flap of tape or a blob of blutack but I removed it just to show how good the light proofing is. The other 2 are self explanatory.


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## floridasucks (Feb 25, 2009)

thats great man, awsome job on the light proofing. you are the master of the pcgrow.


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## v12xjs (Feb 25, 2009)

Appreciate the sentiment FS but I think anyone doing it over a long period like I have would have a good reliable system.
We're starting to see some really nice cases cropping up and with the inventive nature of the folk on here I reckon Granita & co will be eclipsed soon enough.
I thought the grow in your sig was outstanding and just goes to show what can be done after mulling things over with a fat blunt 

How's that arachnid of yours? I always loved the look of the red kneed tarantula. They look like some mad sketboard dude 
Do you ever let it roam in your grow?


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## KaliKitsune (Feb 25, 2009)

"Think you are showing your age there KaliKitsune 
Bet you still remember DOS 6.2 "

I remember DOS 3.


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## v12xjs (Feb 25, 2009)

KaliKitsune said:


> "Think you are showing your age there KaliKitsune
> Bet you still remember DOS 6.2 "
> 
> I remember DOS 3.


 
Me too. Just didn't want to make you sound like an old codger


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## KaliKitsune (Feb 25, 2009)

I'm only 26.

I feel like I'm about 46.


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## v12xjs (Feb 25, 2009)

Wow 26? 
Are you sure you remember it? DOS 4 was release when you were 6!


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## needhelp (Feb 25, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Thanks for the reply needhelp.
> What you say is spot on but sometimes the plants don't want to be short and they will happily grow onto the light


thats true...but thats why you LST... i haven't tried LST yet, just bending and FIM so far... but i like how you have your plants looking, so i will definately have to steal some ideas from you, ha...


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## floridasucks (Feb 25, 2009)

hopefully we will see more like this, but as of now you have the best pcgrow ive seen. yea great ideas can come from a good smoke session. Querkle is doing good, i have not handled her yet still scared of getting bit haha. but i have some seeds growing in there from a real lemony smelling clone i got. its ok for a small grow cause the spider needs 12/12 lighting.


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## KaliKitsune (Feb 25, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Wow 26?
> Are you sure you remember it? DOS 4 was release when you were 6!


I learned how to get DOS working at an early age. I was slamming on keyboards at 2 and typing at 4 to get Ultima to play. 5 years old I played Mobius and got a TI-994A and learned TI-Basic by halfway through 6 years old.


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## Neph (Feb 26, 2009)

Wow. This is so inspirational. You're set up looks so nice and clean and your ladies look so healthy. This makes me want to put a lot more work into my pc grow.


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## romero (Feb 27, 2009)

wow this shit is fucking sick as fuck dawg
amazing
nice shit


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## v12xjs (Feb 27, 2009)

Sorry there were no updates yesterday. Busy day. Here's a few shots of Granita from last night.
Flushing starts on Monday but last night she drank almost half a litre of 750ppm without spilling a drop! That's in a 1 litre pot FFS!
She's just starting to get some yellowing on the lower branches so the 10% blue light is a roaring success in my view. I was considering increasing the percentage of blue but there's just no point based on these results.
Enjoy the pics.


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## v12xjs (Feb 27, 2009)

A couple more pics to show how repeatable this is with the correct genetics. Here's Pandora and the pure indica. The indica is just 2 weeks behind Granita and is nowhere near her in growth. I'll be lucky to scrape 14g from that. In contrast, Pandora is almost the same size already at somewhere around 4 weeks from seed. Her first flower showed last night and she's set fair to put out 11 colas in just 7 more weeks.


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## v12xjs (Feb 27, 2009)

Thanks for all your positive comments guys. Really glad it's inspired and helped some of you. That was always the point of the journal.


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## v12xjs (Feb 27, 2009)

KaliKitsune said:


> I learned how to get DOS working at an early age. I was slamming on keyboards at 2 and typing at 4 to get Ultima to play. 5 years old I played Mobius and got a TI-994A and learned TI-Basic by halfway through 6 years old.


So you had reading, writing and elementary logic sorted out by the time you were 3?
Yeah right.
I won't ruin BTK3ill's thread by taking your post there apart word by word. Suffice to say that what you said in there would be 100% nonsense but for the fact that it contains a contradiction as well.

Please stay out of this journal. Your posts have no value here.


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## floridasucks (Feb 27, 2009)

granita looks great and looks like the other 2 are on the way to being the same. so is the smallest one a girl too?


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## v12xjs (Feb 27, 2009)

Hey FS. Baby SketzoH is a girl too 
I don't bother with mixed gender seeds anymore. I have no interest in seed runs and males don't serve any other useful purpose. To be honest, the rig yields somewhere between 3 - 400g annually and this would be cut in half by using mixed seeds. Fem seeds are also very affordable. Granita was £8 which equates to around £12/oz. You can't go wrong at that really 

You've given me a huge dilemma you know. The new pots have given me a bit of extra room in the case and I'm now torn between squeezing a basic motherboard in there or shopping for a red kneed tarantula. I'm veering towards the spider 
If I had known they needed 12/12 when I had the funds last year I would already be a proud owner!
I'm sooo jealous of you and Querkle


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## floridasucks (Feb 27, 2009)

just to let you know be careful when buying fem seeds from paradise seed co i have ak47 fem seeds from them and got one male. yea man go for the spider those red knees look awsome. i would like to see someone else on here who owns one... wouldent a motherboard cause heat issues with the grow?


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## v12xjs (Feb 27, 2009)

Thanks for the tip. I got some boys in a fem pack from lowlife.

I'm not going to show my hand just yet but I have tons of workable ideas for the mobo. Money is the restricting factor just now. I love animals though and always had a soft spot for the big spiders.
What kind of temps does Querkle like?


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## floridasucks (Feb 27, 2009)

temps stay around 75-85F. T's are pretty easy, dont really need much maintenance. and they eat a few crickets a week at most.


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## v12xjs (Feb 27, 2009)

Think that's my decision made then 
Who needs 2 pc's anyway?


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## floridasucks (Feb 27, 2009)

awsome ill be watchin...


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## v12xjs (Feb 27, 2009)

What do you mean watching?
You will be my guru!


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## mendocino (Feb 27, 2009)

Hey V12xjs,
thanks ,this is areal nice grow...
pete


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## floridasucks (Feb 27, 2009)

haha... another thing they say humidity needs to be at 75-80% but mine goes from 60-99% and Querkle seems to be doing fine. i think my hygrometer is lying tough. and try to get a female they live longer.


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## v12xjs (Feb 27, 2009)

Great to see you Pete.
I'll keep you up to speed on Pandora as she's your baby.


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## v12xjs (Feb 27, 2009)

Forgot to ask about humidity.
I'll have to have a think about how to achieve that. What tricks do you use to keep it so high?


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## floridasucks (Feb 27, 2009)

i have about 2 inches of peatmoss/topsoil (chemical/nutrient free) on the bottom of the tank. under the tank there is a heat pad stuck to the glass. i spray around the tank real good twice a day and overfill the water dish about every 3 days so that it soaks the peatmoss/soil. here is a pic of a heat pad on the side of the tank the one under the tank is bigger. i only use the one on the side if it gets really cold.


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## v12xjs (Feb 27, 2009)

Nice kit.
One of those for the dark period and I think we have lift off 
Watch this space.


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## SeANi0 (Feb 27, 2009)

HEY HEY,

Lookin gud mate... glad too hear you have another girl aswell.

Im soo jealous of this grow at the moment... cant wait to get bk from holiday and start mine up.

When I first saw this post I had it in my head that I would only be able to use autoflowering in my pcgrow. Now ou have showed me that this is rubbish I have been n had another look around the seedbanks. After a long read thru, I have finaly decided on mazar and maple leaf indica. Both are mostly indica and are said to be quite controllable when it comes to height so fingers crossed I will get some lovely big girls from them.

Oh and just a quick one... (may already have been answered... what soil mix do you use for your grow???

Keep the pics comin bud,...

Best Wishes,


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## SeANi0 (Feb 27, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Wow. Didn't realise there was quite so much interest in this thing.
> 
> Hey SeANi0
> Thanks for the comments. I've not tried any Ice Cream yet so I appreciate the smoke report too.
> ...


Thanks so much for the reply bout my grow ... just read it. 

I will hve to look into the 6500k light, prices and if I can install into the case... but looking at urs.. this surely seems to be helping the colou of those leaves.. well something your doin is anyway. 

Im off to find that thread in the CFL FORUM that you mentioned... Tahnks again

SeANi0


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## floridasucks (Feb 27, 2009)

SeANi0 said:


> HEY HEY,
> 
> Lookin gud mate... glad too hear you have another girl aswell.
> 
> ...


mazar and maple leaf indica are both really good strains...


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## ElephantRider (Feb 27, 2009)

Hey.. totally inspirational! I just finished my pc case and waiting on first seeds. I nabbed 2 primarily indica seed packs and goin' mom / clones in it and I have to finish my old server tower for flowering. I'm wondering what you've got going for temps and humidity, generally. With no plants / misting and a few lightholes yet to cover, I've got 80 degrees and 20%. I had 4 27's @ 5500K designated for the 24/7 case, but lost one 27 .. temps came down from 85 to 80. Not sure whether or not to replace it yet.

Also, google single board linux. They have full arm-based linux motherboards the size of a stick of gum, even, available for cheap. Some even w/ linux pre-installed. You could fit it on the bottom of your case by the feet and wire up the monitor / usb ports where they'd normally go!

Cheers!


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## v12xjs (Feb 28, 2009)

Hey again SeANi0
I looked at your choice of seeds and they both look superb. I have grown many auto's thinking that was my only choice whilst drooling over some of the other strains available. That was what got me started on this path in the first place. Mazar-i-Sharif was one of the obvious choices for my first experiments but for some reason I never got round to trying it. The Mazar sounds equally well suited. I never heard of Maple Leaf before but it looks ideal for the case and the description makes my mouth water 
The 6500K light is the only change from previous grows so that's responsible for keeping the shaders green. It's earned it's place in my grow for sure now.
Think I've posted my soil mix already but it's canna pro soil mix with about a third vermiculite and about 10% horticultural sand. I don't measure things exactly though. Perlite isn't available locally which is the only reason I don't have any in there.

I'm probably going to have to cut down on the pics a bit or the mods on here are gonna ban me for sure 
I don't know what the allowance is but I'd like to make sure I get the full grow and chop up to serve as a reference for those just starting out in a pc, so I'll cut back on the daily updates now. Probably 1 every couple of days. Same as before though, if anyone wants to see something specific then just ask and that will be the next pic.
Can't wait to see your Maple Leaf. No chance you can cancel the holiday and get started today?


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## v12xjs (Feb 28, 2009)

Greets ElephantRider

Good to hear you found some inspiration. Sorry there's nothing on clones here but those CH9 seeds I've started up are only £3 each for Jack Herrer genes, so it seems cheaper to start a new seed than to run a whole box for a mom & babies. I start a seed every 3 weeks so a 2nd case with a mom would need to be under £1 a week to run in order to compete. I'm having a hell of a time trying to get a job at the moment so these things need to be considered. This was what lead me to try auto's under 12/12 and that got me into trying non auto strains, so I guess unemployment is good for the creative thinking it brought about. Can't think of any other advantages though 
I think a good sog setup in a 2nd box would reap big rewards however so I'm keen to see what you do.

My environment has just changed with the new fan and humidity has gone up from high 30's to around 45% with the lights on, and 72% during the dark period. Temps are high 70's and low 80's. I never mist in there due to the electrics. Sometimes I take all the girls for a shower with me but privacy is not good where I am so this isn't often.

Your temps are ok just now, but I think you're right to hang fire on replacing the bulb. The summer is coming and temps will rise considerably for everyone, so you should try to address any heat issues now while it's cool enough to make mistakes without losing crops. My view is a lack of light will reduce harvests but too much heat will destroy the whole crop so it's a lesser of 2 evils.
Taking temps of the environment inside and outside is important. My rig runs about 10F above ambient when ambient is 70F, but a 2F rise in ambient means a 5F rise inside. Try to plot this change and consider changing the environment your case is in as well as what is going on inside. Having lots of free space around the exhaust helps a lot in this regard.

Really appreciate the tip on the hardware and OS. I love the whole community thing going on with Linux but there's another contender I'd love to have a crack with, have you come across ReactOS? It still isn't quite ready but the concept is amazing and it's an open source project too. The windows interface would allow the use of stuff like a webcam, usb microscope for trichome observations and fan / temp control without having to develop drivers and software, so it may be an easier option for me at least.

Good luck with everything and link me when you start posting your results.


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## phoenix58 (Mar 1, 2009)

"Intel Inside"  (LOve that Avatar) 

Truly great thread rep+.... and I thought I was tight on space! But seriously you have my respect for that, it really just goes to show what can be achieved in a very small space with skill and care + genetics. I'm a CFL grower myself so I always enjoy a good CFL thread.


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## v12xjs (Mar 1, 2009)

Hi Pheonix58. Really appreciate the kind comments and the rep.
I'm always looking to learn from others so I'll be checking out your grow in a bit.


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## v12xjs (Mar 1, 2009)

Got some pics from last night for you guys. Granita is now looking good from every angle so it's hard to pick out which shots to show. She's still pumping out white flowers like mad at the top of each cola so there's still more to come 
Also got a shot of Pandora's first flower. For those less skilled in spotting the telltale signs, there's a single white hair just below the centre of the gold ring on the left side. There should be 2 hairs but I am a bit rough with my girls in the early weeks so that will be why one seems to be missing.


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## TwistedBladez (Mar 1, 2009)

Very nice looking girl , I might try a PC grow once I get some experince under my belt I'll deff keep watching


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## budbuster3000 (Mar 1, 2009)

hey man, looking amazing its been a while since i checked in but the babys doing really good keep up the good work mn, im still waiting on my seeds  how tall is your pc case?


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## v12xjs (Mar 1, 2009)

Hi TwistedBladez & thanks for the rep. Hopefully this journal will give you most of the info you need if you fancy a crack at a pc grow. Good luck if you do.

Hey there BudBuster3000. Good to see you again and sorry to hear you still have no beans. Get on the blower and give them some stick!
Dimensions of the case are 20(H)x18(L)x8(W).


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## SketzoH (Mar 1, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hi TwistedBladez & thanks for the rep. Hopefully this journal will give you most of the info you need if you fancy a crack at a pc grow. Good luck if you do.
> 
> Hey there BudBuster3000. Good to see you again and sorry to hear you still have no beans. Get on the blower and give them some stick!
> Dimensions of the case are 20(H)x18(L)x8(W).


Looking good buddy got 'high' hopes for the smoke report


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## v12xjs (Mar 1, 2009)

Hey SketzoH
Wondered where you were. Update your page!

Turned out you were right all along with the 8 colas on Granita. There is a 9th but it's a bit drowned out by the tops around it. I hoped it would make make it but maybe it was wishful thinking


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## SketzoH (Mar 1, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey SketzoH
> Wondered where you were. Update your page!
> 
> Turned out you were right all along with the 8 colas on Granita. There is a 9th but it's a bit drowned out by the tops around it. I hoped it would make make it but maybe it was wishful thinking


ahh dude  sorry if i jinxed ya! anyways looks like you got a nice bit of decent smoke coming from her! id be a very proud daddy


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## LOLsauce (Mar 1, 2009)

those colas are getting FAT v12xjs


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## TwistedBladez (Mar 1, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hi TwistedBladez & thanks for the rep. Hopefully this journal will give you most of the info you need if you fancy a crack at a pc grow. Good luck if you do.


Your welcome for the rep , this is good info thanks


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## v12xjs (Mar 2, 2009)

Thanks for all the positve comments you guys.

Granita will be on plain water from now on, but I still expect a little more fattening in the next 2 weeks. The scope shows a few amber trichs already but there's still plenty of clear ones so it still isn't worth cutting down the smaller 9th cola. Not just yet anyway.
I'm still amazed at how little yellowing there is at such an advanced stage. I wish I could have also tried this strain without the additional light to give me a comparison. I will be looking in on the place I got the seed from later today and that grow has only 2700K so it should give me some idea of the difference the blue light makes. I'll post up on that later.
I usually go straight from grow to harvest and cure but this time I'm going to give Granita 48 hours darkness before chopping. I've read that this ensures all the goodies are in the buds and not the stalks. Anyone got any input on doing this?


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## TwistedBladez (Mar 2, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Thanks for all the positve comments you guys.
> 
> Granita will be on plain water from now on, but I still expect a little more fattening in the next 2 weeks. The scope shows a few amber trichs already but there's still plenty of clear ones so it still isn't worth cutting down the smaller 9th cola. Not just yet anyway.
> I'm still amazed at how little yellowing there is at such an advanced stage. I wish I could have also tried this strain without the additional light to give me a comparison. I will be looking in on the place I got the seed from later today and that grow has only 2700K so it should give me some idea of the difference the blue light makes. I'll post up on that later.
> I usually go straight from grow to harvest and cure but this time I'm going to give Granita 48 hours darkness before chopping. I've read that this ensures all the goodies are in the buds and not the stalks. Anyone got any input on doing this?


I've heard that it makes the plant think that its dieing and makes it produce more resin , when you chop make sure its dark so that it doesn't start taking up any thing that it has stored in the roots

When I get my grow going I might take a clone and find a computer case and stick a clone in there , veg it then flower it and try diffrent things out to see what will give the best result


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## LOLsauce (Mar 2, 2009)

giving 48hrs light before the chop seems reasonable, light does degrade THC. Let her muster up all she can before you decide to harvest.


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## v12xjs (Mar 2, 2009)

Thanks for the input guys. Most appreciated.

I spoke to a seed breeder today who has tried the darkness thing and he said it didn't improve potency at all and just made the plants stretch and look bad. I respect his opinion and have decided against trying it now.
The good news is that I'll be smoking Granita 3 days earlier than I thought 

Also looked in on a nice scrog setup with a couple of Ice Cream plants in there and they are also retaining plenty of green leaves. There were lots of dead leaves around the place though and those plants are maybe 2 weeks behind Granita, so I think even the weedy 12 watts of 6500k are having a positive effect.

I'm just off to do some gardening so I'll post up a pic tomorrow.


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## floridasucks (Mar 2, 2009)

i try to harvest right after the lights come on. ive read that during light hours some of the thc is used up to protect the plant from UV light. at night the plant builds that thc back up for use during the day. so supposedly the plant has max amount of thc in the morning when the lights come on. this seems like it would apply to outdoor plants more than indoors, cause there is more UV light outside. regardless of indoor or out i always harvest at dawn or when the lights come on and ive always had good results.


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## phoenix58 (Mar 3, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Thanks for the input guys. Most appreciated.
> 
> I spoke to a seed breeder today who has tried the darkness thing and he said it didn't improve potency at all and just made the plants stretch and look bad. I respect his opinion and have decided against trying it now.
> The good news is that I'll be smoking Granita 3 days earlier than I thought
> ...


Looking great  I have never gone much on the 24hr darkness theory either, and I dont think that light degrades THC at all! I know plenty of experienced growers who dry the colas on racks with the HPS lamps runing and fans running etc.

Are you finding that some 6500k is helping keep the colour in your leaves? I also like to mix the spectrum slightly, I have 320 watts of 2700k plus 30 watts of 6500k, would you suggest increasing that ratio of 6500?

Anyway, like I said earlier, great grow and much respect


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## v12xjs (Mar 3, 2009)

Hi FS. That sounds like solid advice and is pretty much the new plan.
No news on the spider setup yet but there's been a few steps forward. More on that soon.

Good to see you again phoenix58
Thanks for that. Our % of blue light is almost identical...Great minds think alike 
It's early days for me but if I'm honest I wouldn't up it just yet. It's good to know the leaves contain all the food the plant will want, but any more than that is probably blocking light to lower parts and will also need more work in the manicuring stage. I'll stick with 10% for now and see what I can find out from other people's experiences.
Let me know if you come across any other info on the subject.


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## v12xjs (Mar 3, 2009)

Got a couple of pics from last night for you all. Wish I could post up the smell too 
Got a macro and a side on. The macro is a bit down from the top and you can still see fresh new buds popping out near the top there. She's making my mouth water now


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## floridasucks (Mar 3, 2009)

dam those colas look sticky! its topping off real nice, how much longer u think? yea we need smellovision. hey check out the new pics of Querkle.


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## v12xjs (Mar 3, 2009)

Cheers m8
They are REALLY sticky. I'm trying not to touch them now though. I got a new scope recently and I looked at some trichs after giving Granita a couple of friendly squeezes. There were loads of trichs with no heads!
I just talk to her now 
I'll pop over and check out the pics right now.


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## v12xjs (Mar 3, 2009)

Sorry, forgot to answer the q.
The breeder info on the seeds says it's an 8 week strain, so that's what I'm working to and Granita will be meeting my axe a week on Sunday. I love a proper smoke however, squidgy black, sputnik and zero zero are my idea of stoned so I won't be killing anyone until I'm on 40 - 50% amber.


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## SeANi0 (Mar 3, 2009)

Oh my god, she's lookin fit... not long now mate!!!

I read your post about you saying you were going to give her 48hr darkness,.. I have heard this before also,.. and I thought it would be a good idea.

Ive heard (as others have in this thread) that it can frost up the buds, and can help to tell the plant she's going to be harvested.

However, this may only be on certain strains, so I would definetly look up more growers of ur strain to see if they have done the same

Best Wishes, cant wait to see what the dry weight of this grow is... my next post will be from sunny spain

SeANi0


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## ElephantRider (Mar 3, 2009)

I'm very interested in the dry weight, too, considering I finally got my seeds in. I'm just waiting for them to pop their little heads out, now. Since you're mainly from seed, maybe you can give me some advice here. 

I posted in the newb forum, but my question got lost in minutes there. I'm curious about your experience with humidity and germination. My case is about 20%, unfortunately, but I've got 3 27W cfl's @ 5500, so It's super-bright and 3 powerful AC fans to keep air fresh and cool. I just haven't seen peep out of my seeds yet, is all. Wondering if it's tougher in low humidity. I read in a new (to me) book that a decent method was to soak the seeds until taproot showed. I did that, but 36 hours later, no taproot. I decided that, since my water was cool, I'd try to just plant them about 1/2" down in my moist organic soil, cover with press-n-seal and cross my fingers. Should I just chill and wait it out? What's the longest I should wait? And.. will the lack of humidity hurt my seedlings?

Sorry if there's mild hijack here. Just looking for your advice since you've got a similar setup to mine here. Thanks, in advance..

-ER


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## v12xjs (Mar 3, 2009)

Hi SeANi0
I'm with you mate. She's a stunner! I'd have no doubts about recommending the strain, especially for this kind of setup.
The guy that gave me the advice is the breeder for CH9 seeds so unless I find otherwise I'll take what he says as solid advice, and as soon as he said that the plants get leggy it sounded right to me anyway.
He gave me a couple of pointers, one he had tried and another that he felt could be worth trying: he said that just feeding P in the latter stages made the plants very strong, so no N and no K. Never heard that before and it is something I can do with my rig. The other thing he thought may be worth trying was switching to 14/10 in later flowering but he hasn't tried it and I can't do it anyway as my system revolves around 12/12 for the whole family.
Interesting stuff for sure.

I love Spain. Last time I was in Barcelona there was a festival to mark the death of Antoni Gaudi and almost all his buildings were open to the public. Have you seen La Sagrada Familia? Even better looking than Granita 
Have fun buddy.


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## v12xjs (Mar 3, 2009)

Greets ER

I don't germinate in the case. I use a wet tissue in a sealed plastic container and put it in a drawer where it's dark and reasonably warm. I check once every 24 hours and they have usually got a nice white tail by the 2nd checkup.
From there they go into a cut up pill container with a sealy bag over the top and about 1.5 inches of soil. I then put them in the case but keep them in the bottom corner away from most of the light and heat.
There should be a pic in here somewhere but if you can't find one then let me know and I'll post one up for you in about a week when the next girl is due in there.
For info, the pill jar is a 30 capsule glucosamine plastic thing. I cut off the bottom and use the top with lid. Once the seeling gets the cotelydons and is putting out it's first true leaves I remove the sealy bag. It gets very moist in there so humidity is probably quite important.
The reason I use the lid end of the container is that I can let the plant get rootbound and then just take off the lid and push the plant / soil down into the final container. When I do this I fluff out the roots and lay the plant along the top of my container. I only do this because I use rectangular containers and it ensures the plant uses it all.

Try the sealy bag trick. Water before you put it on if the soil isn't already quite moist. Don't go digging in there for an update! You could cause some damage. They will show up


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## phoenix58 (Mar 4, 2009)

Looking ahead mate, have you thought about revegging Granita for a second flowering run plus cuts? Shes a fine specimen and I'm sure you wouldnt be dissapointed on a second flowering run, plus you eliminate all that uncertainty around seeds? I find second run is better on yield and no drop in quality whatsoever. It wont need to interfere with your 12/12 cycle, just leave her under a single 10watt 6500 in a corner of a room somewhere on a 20/4 timer, let her have daylight when its light and she will come back in 2 weeks..... honeslty its well worth it, I do it all the time. These plants WANT to live and can go on producing for you and gifting you cuts. After about 4 weeks you can stick her back under 12/12 and watch her go again!

Just a suggestion, I know you are going to find it hard to kill her, you seem as attached as I get! I have an AK47/LR now end of week 2 of reveg and looking great, bursting out with fresh green leaf all over, I'd be happy to start a thread if you want anymore info.

Can;t wait to see the harvest pics


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## v12xjs (Mar 4, 2009)

phoenix58 said:


> Looking ahead mate, have you thought about revegging Granita for a second flowering run plus cuts? Shes a fine specimen and I'm sure you wouldnt be dissapointed on a second flowering run, plus you eliminate all that uncertainty around seeds? I find second run is better on yield and no drop in quality whatsoever. It wont need to interfere with your 12/12 cycle, just leave her under a single 10watt 6500 in a corner of a room somewhere on a 20/4 timer, let her have daylight when its light and she will come back in 2 weeks..... honeslty its well worth it, I do it all the time. These plants WANT to live and can go on producing for you and gifting you cuts. After about 4 weeks you can stick her back under 12/12 and watch her go again!
> 
> Just a suggestion, I know you are going to find it hard to kill her, you seem as attached as I get! I have an AK47/LR now end of week 2 of reveg and looking great, bursting out with fresh green leaf all over, I'd be happy to start a thread if you want anymore info.
> 
> Can;t wait to see the harvest pics


I really think you should start that thread. I'd love to learn how to do that.


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## SeANi0 (Mar 5, 2009)

phoenix58 said:


> I have an AK47/LR now end of week 2 of reveg and looking great, bursting out with fresh green leaf all over, I'd be happy to start a thread if you want anymore info.
> 
> Can;t wait to see the harvest pics


AWWWW!!!! Granita Junior... Great advice.

However (I might have the wrong strain here), isnt AK47/LR an autoflowering plant? I was under the impression (from a good source) that you couldnt take cutting off autoflowering strains, one of the reaons being the short veg time.

Im not doubting that you have done it mate.... something I would like to try meself if its possible

Please get in touch,

SeANi0


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## SeANi0 (Mar 5, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> I love Spain. Last time I was in Barcelona there was a festival to mark the death of Antoni Gaudi and almost all his buildings were open to the public. Have you seen La Sagrada Familia? Even better looking than Granita
> Have fun buddy.


((ok, maybe a couple more posts before I go))

YES, GORGEOUS BY NIGHT.

Unfortunately, I wont get to see it this time as I am goin to the bottom of Spain (C. Del Sol).

Glad you like Spain, its one of favourite destinations,... that and Amsterdam!!


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## SketzoH (Mar 5, 2009)

SeANi0 said:


> ((ok, maybe a couple more posts before I go))
> 
> YES, GORGEOUS BY NIGHT.
> 
> ...


Im heading off to barcelona in june with my girlfriend cant wait!!
Dont plan on smoking out there but is it readily available for tourists? i havent been spain since i was kid so pretty excited!

v12
Granita is looking juicy! Those macro shots are beautiful and you should be proud i know i would ..are you going to keep this thread going as its a perpetual grow?


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## v12xjs (Mar 5, 2009)

SketzoH said:


> Im heading off to barcelona in june with my girlfriend cant wait!!
> Dont plan on smoking out there but is it readily available for tourists? i havent been spain since i was kid so pretty excited!
> 
> v12
> Granita is looking juicy! Those macro shots are beautiful and you should be proud i know i would ..are you going to keep this thread going as its a perpetual grow?


Hey Matey

I never had any trouble getting supplies in Spain but I do tend to pack my own these days as you never know who you are dealing with.

Interesting thought about keeping the thread going. The indica without a name was a stop gap due to the males I got out of a feminised seed pack but Pandora is 1 of 10 and I do plan to experiment with those. Stuff like feeding it just P in flowering, covering up the roots and anything else that will provide good info. I'm still unsure what the upload limit is for pics and I can't find anything in the site faq. Can anyone clarify what the limits are?
For sure if anyone wants to see what comes next I'd be happy to keep it going.


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## MediMaryUser (Mar 5, 2009)

fucking great lil mini grow. the best ive seen on here +rep +rep +rep

thats like all bud and no leaves good job


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## v12xjs (Mar 5, 2009)

Got a pictorial update too.

The yellowing leaves have finally turned up, so here's a pic to show where they are up to. I'm glad to see them really as I didn't want the plant to have too much greenery on it. I just hate manicuring. There's one of the main cola as well. LST produces numerous colas but the real top of the plant always seems to be the best. To give you an idea of scale, the plant is around 6 inches tall now and that cola is probably just short of 5 inches of pretty well packed bud. Just to show that the other colas are well worth having too, there's a pic of some of those.
Here you go:


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## MediMaryUser (Mar 5, 2009)

how much dry bud do you expect off that one lil fat 1?


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## v12xjs (Mar 5, 2009)

Hey nice to see you MMU. Hope you like the new pics and I really appreciate the positive comments.
I


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## v12xjs (Mar 5, 2009)

You gotta remember it is only a biddy little thing. From experience there will be a minimum of 3/4 oz when she's all dried and manicured. That top may reach 6g or more which would be a personal best for me.


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## MediMaryUser (Mar 5, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> You gotta remember it is only a biddy little thing. From experience there will be a minimum of 3/4 oz when she's all dried and manicured. That top may reach 6g or more which would be a personal best for me.



ive had bigger plants yeild less with a hps lol .

my personal best is about 2 ounces from a pot of gold mother vegged for 2 months and flowered for like 66 days.


i love seeing little plants full of bud,does anyone besides me get mad when someones like check out my plant and its like some big ass monster with grape sized nugs half way flowered ?


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## v12xjs (Mar 5, 2009)

I know exactly what you mean. Kind of seems like a huge waste of time and space.
I do think, at least in small cabs, the 100% PAR lights of a cfl can really help to produce nice nugs. Works for me anyway


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## v12xjs (Mar 5, 2009)

Just had a quick flick at your sig there MMU. Not a UK thing but still interesting. We used to have something called the Smoky Bears Picnic over here. Hundreds of people would have a little march and then all have a spliff in Hyde Park or wherever. As long as we outnumberd the narcs nobody ever got a ticket.
Good days.


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## Counterstriker (Mar 5, 2009)

What's your powersupply? and where can I get it lawlz.


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## floridasucks (Mar 5, 2009)

lookin good v12, lots of white hairs still. how do the trics look?


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## v12xjs (Mar 5, 2009)

Hi Counterstriker
I just checked the website for the place I got the psu and fan splitter. Things have changed a bit since I got mine but here's some links for the current versions at Maplins in the UK. I think if you are resident in the US then the same things would be available at Radio Shack.

http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=35927&&source=14&doy=5m3

http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=34544


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## v12xjs (Mar 5, 2009)

Greets floridasucks.

Gonna bump your Querkle thread in a bit.
I'm with you buddy, there's still plenty of new stuff popping out and I'm starting to doubt the 8 week claims of the breeder for this strain. There's still maybe 75% clear trichs and only 2 or maybe 3% amber. I almost gave her some nutes last night as I think she may need 9 weeks before she's the way I like em, but I decided against it and just gave her water.
The Jack Herer strain is growing really fast and I haven't got that one fully under control just yet, so I may run out of room for Granita and have to pull her a bit early. She will get all the 8 weeks but maybe not the full 9 I think she may actually need for best couchlock effect.


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## floridasucks (Mar 5, 2009)

thanx for the bump.. yea thats alot of clear trics. hope all goes well.


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## v12xjs (Mar 5, 2009)

I realised a problem with this journal too the other day 
As everyone wants to know the final weight I can't cut a sneeky branch and my stash tin has been empty for 2 days now 
Maybe it's for the best with all those clear trichs but I'm chomping at the bit for quick toot!


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## SketzoH (Mar 5, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> I realised a problem with this journal too the other day
> As everyone wants to know the final weight I can't cut a sneeky branch and my stash tin has been empty for 2 days now
> Maybe it's for the best with all those clear trichs but I'm chomping at the bit for quick toot!


Dude if you rele need a bud just weigh the bud you take off then take 75% of that off so it equals dry weight roughly then add that to the total on the final harvest 

just an idea! 
+ I for one would like you to keep this thread going after granita, I think you have alot of knowledge that can still be shared and also things we can share with you on your grows


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## v12xjs (Mar 6, 2009)

Cheers SketzoH
I should be able to keep my hands off the buds now weekend is here. It's just that each time I log onto the site I'm greeted by those random pics along the top of the page and it really makes me itch for smoke!
Luckily it's gentlemans cards night tonight and there are 1 or 2 vendors who attend also, so I can either bum a free ride for the evening or make a small purchase that will see me through.

I'm still undecided about keeping the log going if only because the next one in the spotlight is the indica which was never going to impress anyone and could even discourage folk from trying the pc case thing. 
I kind of thought there was enough info and pics in here up to now for others to replicate the system or adapt it to their needs, so maybe I would just be showing off which isn't really my style and definitely doesn't fit in with the stealth idea.
With that said, I've been blown away by the comments some of you guys have made both here in the thread and especially when giving me rep points. You also make a good point about exchanging ideas and knowledge. I'm always changing things and love to learn ways of improving what I have.

Maybe it's best to leave it to democracy to decide, so if anyone else wants me to keep it going just post here to let me know. I'll base my decision on that.


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## v12xjs (Mar 6, 2009)

Got A bit of a surprising update on junior for you too SketzoH. The baby is still plodding along as with all the seeds I start, but I took a snap of her last night and when I looked at it on the pc today I couldn't believe my eyes.
As with Pandora, it's a CH9 Jack and is based around Jack Herer genetics. I guess now I can see why it's such a legendary strain. 2nd pic is just a blown up section of the 1st one. 
I've also chucked in a pic of the garden from last night and all is back to normal at last. Those damn males really set me back.


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## floridasucks (Mar 6, 2009)

it almost looks like trics on the leaves. wow man that one plant is almost bigger than granita already. btw i want to see this grow continue.


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## ElephantRider (Mar 6, 2009)

I gotta ask.. you say you've done this method for some 2 years. Is Granita above average? She seems mammoth for the size..


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## Counterstriker (Mar 6, 2009)

Hey man, you think you can get me a picture of your Grow box, like the PC itself and the power, thanks man!


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## Counterstriker (Mar 6, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hi Counterstriker
> I just checked the website for the place I got the psu and fan splitter. Things have changed a bit since I got mine but here's some links for the current versions at Maplins in the UK. I think if you are resident in the US then the same things would be available at Radio Shack.
> 
> http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=35927&&source=14&doy=5m3
> ...


Wait, how would that work? The fan splitter is a 4 prong whereas the AC/AC multi-voltage thing is only 2.


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## DukeOfBellSt (Mar 6, 2009)

nice grow bro, i'm really impressed with the buds, looking tasty


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## v12xjs (Mar 7, 2009)

Hey floridasucks
Pandora is almost the size of granita but won't get much bigger as she's already in flower. The Jack strain is more vigorous but still easily controlled. I'd be very surprised if it gets above 8 inches as there's about 11 colas on it, which means it will only grow at 1/11th of it's normal rate. I may need to trim a couple but I think I'll let them grow out as there's still plenty of light getting through to the lower parts of the plant.

Hello again ElephantRider
LOL. A 6 inch plant being considered massive 
There's been a hiccup with a couple of male plants so last harvest was Jan 7th. Look at the early pics of Granita before this date and you should see a white russian that was similar in size.The main cola on that one was very nice but the others were only about 2g each. Granita looks like she will top that as she's filled out the lower parts of the plant much better.
I used to use auto's and had a few indica's which were all small enough for me to have 6 plants in the cycle but there was a bit too much work involved. Yields were still around a gram a day but I was germinating every other week and mixing nutes for 6 plants was a nightmare!
I did try to post up that system on a vauxhall forum early last year in answer to a guy who was grumbling about the price of weed in uk but I was shot down in flames so I never gave much detail.

Greets again counterstiker
If you read through this whole thread I've taken pics of every angle both inside and outside the case.I'm sure you'll find what you need somewhere within.
I think in my last reply to you I mentioned that i cut the end off the psu cable and wired a molex connector to it. This is neat because you only need to feed a very thin cable into the case so not much difficulty in lightproofing it. Obviously I keep the psu itself outside the case to minimise heat.
The wiring on the 4 pin is 2 x black, 1 x yellow and 1 x red. You can use either of the blacks for the neutral and either yellow or red for the live. Usually the yellow carries 12v and the red carries 5v, so I wire up one black and the yellow and adjust the psu so the fans provide enough cooling without spinning at a full 12v. This keeps them reasonably quiet and gives me leeway to turn them up when things get warmer in the summer.

Thanks DukeOfBellSt. There's still a week or more to go and she hasn't slowed up with the new white flowers yet so there's still a little to come


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## v12xjs (Mar 7, 2009)

Sounds like there isn't much call for this thread to keep going so I'll just finish it off with the harvest and cure and post the odd update on any mods I make that improve things in some way.
One I can put in already is that the lids on those containers seem to keep the plants happy for a week between feeds and this means I can go away for 7 days without any worries or having to appoint a deputy gardener. This definitely helps to maintain the stealth element.

Couple of pics for you guys too. Pandora has been stretched to her final flowering position. I was a bit sloppy in pulling the stem back to the rear edge of the container, so she hangs over the front a bit. If I can't sort it out I'll consider topping her but as she's already in flower I'll persevere with pulling it back from the other end.
Other 2 pics are the top and bottom of that main cola just to show why this one could be a bit of a record breaker.
Enjoy.


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## floridasucks (Mar 7, 2009)

nice................. thats gonna be some sticky shit!


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## DukeOfBellSt (Mar 7, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Sounds like there isn't much call for this thread to keep going so I'll just finish it off with the harvest and cure and post the odd update on any mods I make that improve things in some way.
> One I can put in already is that the lids on those containers seem to keep the plants happy for a week between feeds and this means I can go away for 7 days without any worries or having to appoint a deputy gardener. This definitely helps to maintain the stealth element.
> 
> Couple of pics for you guys too. Pandora has been stretched to her final flowering position. I was a bit sloppy in pulling the stem back to the rear edge of the container, so she hangs over the front a bit. If I can't sort it out I'll consider topping her but as she's already in flower I'll persevere with pulling it back from the other end.
> ...


i can't belive the size of the bud for a plant so small, look so tasty 

yo dude i'm thinking of doing something similar it looks like a really nice way to get a filler harvest. 

Is their certain strain you grow?


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## v12xjs (Mar 7, 2009)

Hey fs, I reckon I could use it to hang wallpaper with! Getting more cloudy trichs now but still those amber ones are shy. She's due for the chop a week tomorrow but it's looking like maybe the middle of next week will be better if I can keep my hands off 

Greets again Duke. I think you should have a go if you have the kit to set up something similar. The best results seem to come from 80% indica and 20% sativa crosses. Other than that, anything goes.


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## Counterstriker (Mar 7, 2009)

Awsome! I am getting ready to germinate my seeds! I'll make a video later in the week if it goes well!


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## Counterstriker (Mar 7, 2009)

Hey v12 I was wondering does it smell really noticeable?


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## ElephantRider (Mar 7, 2009)

Awesome work, man. I'm STILL inspired by this grow.  My babies are chugging along. Still hoping to get pictures up. I was hoping last night, but maybe tonight, more realistically. At this point, my Citral is maybe triple the size of the Top44, but they both have just 2 mini fan leaves a piece. The second Citral seed has not yet broken the soil, but I'm at least 100% positive, thanks to the paper towel method, that it's viable. Both seedlings are out of their plastics and about 2 inches from the lights. That sound about right to you? Also, am I OK to add dirt? Now that the dirt in the citral pot is a bit compacted, it seems to be too far away from the lip.

Getting antsy!

~ER~


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## v12xjs (Mar 7, 2009)

Hell yes counterstiker!
Somewhere in this thread is a few pics of my simple odour control. Without it the whole house stinks like fcuk. With it the room the case sits in has a smell that makes you think someone just had a quick toot in there, but that goes away when the lights are off.
I've grown some lemon and orange strains that were less noticeable. I put some rind in a pot pourri too which helped even more.


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## v12xjs (Mar 7, 2009)

Hey ER

Plants sound good. If the citral is going too fast then try to move it up half an inch closer than the 44. This should slow it down a bit. They can both go a little closer soon but just while they are that young I don't keep them within the inch that is usually suggested.
Watering compacts the soil a bit and you will be fine to top up the level. All the area below the 2 round leaves is capable of growing roots so it's fine to cover any of that part of the plant with soil.
I'll check out your link.


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## Counterstriker (Mar 7, 2009)

Hey v12 I just read through the forum and could not find anything on odor in the topic. : P


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## v12xjs (Mar 8, 2009)

Counterstriker said:


> Hey v12 I just read through the forum and could not find anything on odor in the topic. : P


Have a look at post number 60 at the bottom of page 6 in this thread.
If you need anything else just shout out.


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## Counterstriker (Mar 8, 2009)

Thanks dude I got it


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## LOLsauce (Mar 8, 2009)

drool drool droool, still here and can't wait to see those buds post trimming


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## v12xjs (Mar 9, 2009)

Hey there LOLsauce

Forgot to compliment you on your case. A really nice job, can't wait to see it knocking out the goods for you.
Granita is doing great but I'm starting to get impatient with her now. She's going to have been in the case for near to 90 days by harvest and that's not a trait I look for 
The blurb on Pandora looks like better reading. A little over 4 weeks to show flowers. A true 49 day flowering time and 5 - 7 days for curing. That's 84 days from seed to lungs!

Here's a quick snap of the queue in the ladies room


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## floridasucks (Mar 9, 2009)

lookin good not much longer....


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## v12xjs (Mar 9, 2009)

Hey fs. Like the new avatar.

Not long as you say, but there's still 3 blondes in there and I want a redhead now!


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## LOLsauce (Mar 9, 2009)

beautius, idk im havin trouble getting my seedlings to root down into my res, ive got the water level up so the peat pellets stay moist and hopefully ill see some roots soon cuse right now they dry out and look sad and havent been growing much :*(


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## UberSmoker (Mar 9, 2009)

Hey man,

All I can say is wow, just read your great journal from start to finish; a truly awesome looking grow. I have also been considering a functional motherboard in my case to aid with stealth and have been interested in miniature PC's for a while. If you still plan on doing this I recommend a Mini-ITX mobo as they run very cool, are very small and require minimal power.

Keep up the good work dude.

P.S. If you do end this thread you should start another for the PC grow massive, one where we can come together to aid newbies and vets alike.


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## v12xjs (Mar 9, 2009)

LOLsauce said:


> beautius, idk im havin trouble getting my seedlings to root down into my res, ive got the water level up so the peat pellets stay moist and hopefully ill see some roots soon cuse right now they dry out and look sad and havent been growing much :*(


Hey LOLsauce.
Sorry things aren't going so great. If you can get some pics up I'll see if I can advise. Take pics of everything & let me know when they are up.
A few q's though. Can you measure your humidity and temps? What are they reading? You mention peat pellets, do you mean clay? Are you using nutes at all? Does your airstone go directly under the netpots?
I always used root riot and not rockwool which I think you are using but I guess drying out will have the same effect in both cases. As an emergency measure try taking out 1 layer of pellets. Too wet isn't ideal but it's better than being dry at this stage of growth.


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## v12xjs (Mar 9, 2009)

UberSmoker said:


> Hey man,
> 
> All I can say is wow, just read your great journal from start to finish; a truly awesome looking grow. I have also been considering a functional motherboard in my case to aid with stealth and have been interested in miniature PC's for a while. If you still plan on doing this I recommend a Mini-ITX mobo as they run very cool, are very small and require minimal power.
> 
> ...


Hi Uber. Really appreciate the positive feedback. Surprised you didn't fall asleep yet tho 
There's a few pc grows popping up but not much in the way of help & advice yet so I'd be glad to help out and would welcome the chance to learn new tricks myself. I think it needs a new thread though as this one is pretty specific to my system and there's loads of other options like clones, hydro, auto's, scrog and such. Let me finish this one off and if nobody else has started something I'll give it a go.
Cash is the limiting factor in fitting a board just now. I have been considering getting one of those free netbooks you can get for a new phone contract. Just tape it to the bottom of the case and bob's your uncle  I'm gonna start a little home business in the next day or 2 and if that goes ok then I'll give it some serious thought. I'll be sounding you out for some input.


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## UberSmoker (Mar 9, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hi Uber. Really appreciate the positive feedback. Surprised you didn't fall asleep yet tho
> There's a few pc grows popping up but not much in the way of help & advice yet so I'd be glad to help out and would welcome the chance to learn new tricks myself. I think it needs a new thread though as this one is pretty specific to my system and there's loads of other options like clones, hydro, auto's, scrog and such. Let me finish this one off and if nobody else has started something I'll give it a go.
> Cash is the limiting factor in fitting a board just now. I have been considering getting one of those free netbooks you can get for a new phone contract. Just tape it to the bottom of the case and bob's your uncle  I'm gonna start a little home business in the next day or 2 and if that goes ok then I'll give it some serious thought. I'll be sounding you out for some input.


Hey again,

Yeah I really should be asleep lol but I am a nocturnal person so what the hell. 

Yeah cash is a restricting factor for me as well, be careful with phone contracts man, always read the small print first as sometimes it works out to be less expensive to buy a Pay & Go phone and a laptop separately in the long run. 

GL with the home business, gonna do that myself at some point. 

As for the input; I will be around...When not fighting crime of course...in my RIU PC Growing Massive t-shirt...think maybe I should get some sleep actually  

Take it easy


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## v12xjs (Mar 9, 2009)

I know what you mean about contracts.
I'll need a medium t-shirt when you get some more.


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## UberSmoker (Mar 9, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> I know what you mean about contracts.
> I'll need a medium t-shirt when you get some more.


Hahahaha it'll be in the post when I do mate.


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## Young Macdonald (Mar 9, 2009)

Alrighty my pc box finally came in the mail from dell! i bought a brand new one cus the ladies deserve the best. time to start gutting it out!


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## v12xjs (Mar 10, 2009)

Welcome aboard McD!
Not sure if there's any t-shirts left 
My first tip for you is to wear some gloves while you gut that thing. I lost about 2 pints of blood when I did mine!


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## cutman (Mar 10, 2009)

hey im a newbe and was woundering do you trim the first few big leaves off after branches have come out and leaves are on them a coulpe of sets?.im 1 mounth in to my first indoor grow.useing organic soil and nut.just got my seeds in today germ... 3 blue berry 2 white snow and 1 crystal for starters.the other growiing now is just bs stuff.a learning proses.so if i mess up its ok just dont want to mess up with the good stuff.my grow room has a veg area grow area and a flower area.cant wait to start cloneing and get it set up on a cycle.my bottom branches are about 4.5 to 5 in long .how long do they need to be for cloneing? cant wait for some sweet stuff.


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## needhelp (Mar 10, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Welcome aboard McD!
> Not sure if there's any t-shirts left
> My first tip for you is to wear some gloves while you gut that thing. I lost about 2 pints of blood when I did mine!


haha....i thought i was the only one that had problems gutting a case... ha...


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## v12xjs (Mar 10, 2009)

Welcome cutman.
Sounds like you have a very nice grow area there.
I don't cut anything off. I figure if it's green then the plant is using it. I just bend or tie them out of the way. When the plant is done with the leaf it will turn yellow and drop off on it's own.
I think cloning is an art form and it isn't something I mastered. It sounds like the sidebranches are about the right size but if you followed my guidance from here you'd end up with some dead sidebranches 
Post a question in the general growing forum and you'll get the answers you need.
Good luck with it.


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## v12xjs (Mar 10, 2009)

needhelp said:


> haha....i thought i was the only one that had problems gutting a case... ha...


I reckon gutting a pc case is one of the top 10 most dangerous sports!
Hope those wounds have healed up needhelp


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## floridasucks (Mar 10, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> I reckon gutting a pc case is one of the top 10 most dangerous sports!
> Hope those wounds have healed up needhelp


 
haha ive almost taken a finger off just trying to remove the front cover from my case...


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## v12xjs (Mar 10, 2009)

I know they say cannabis never killed anybody, but it's come pretty close to a few of by the sounds of it


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## needhelp (Mar 10, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> I reckon gutting a pc case is one of the top 10 most dangerous sports!
> Hope those wounds have healed up needhelp


ha... yeah... i'm ok now... thanx for asking... how about you...

they definately made them in a way that the average joe isn't suppose to be taking it apart in the first place... first time i looked at it, i was like "this is going to be sooo easy".. then i saw the bolts or whatever they are, holding it together.. i was like "oh sh--", ha... almost killed myself trying to take that thing apart..ha... once i realized what was a faster way.. i felt dumb.. but thats how you learn


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## v12xjs (Mar 10, 2009)

The doctor says I'll walk again someday but the fingers are gone for good 

You raise a great point there you know. If we are ever to put pc cases on the growers map then a good guide on gutting cases would be the very first thing to cover off.
I was bleeding too heavily to take pics


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## ElephantRider (Mar 10, 2009)

Making and gutting machines is my livelihood, so I have some decent ideas. I got out of building my cases with only a nick or two.

1. Phillip's Head Screwdriver - take it all apart that you can. Personally, I liked the motherboard sheet to remain so I can use it, if needed, to attach SCROG stuff or for LST help. It also helps the case to not be flimsy, although, you do lose about a half inch for depth if you keep it.

2. DECENT Drill w/ Metal Bit - Drill the rivets you know you don't need out slowly, but firmly, with a metal-ready bit. I found that I was able to cleanly remove all kinds of awful parts without cutting in minutes. Do not rush this, though, or you can snap bits / stab your hand.

3. NICE tin snips / thin aluminum sheet - This is the part that is sharp as hell. Use gloves, if needed, or sub the aluminum w/ cardboard. This is what I used for covering my holes, since I had used cases.

4. My KEY ingredient for the case: Aluminum Duct Tape. This stuff is strong, stiff and reflective (potential hot spots, though, if not CFL) and can hold all of your covering materials / wires. I painted right over this stuff, too, which is why my cases have a uniform appearance.

Check my grow if you want to see the cases I put together. They are very functional, manage heat nicely and look very clean. I had the cases and spent maybe $80 to build both in materials.


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## v12xjs (Mar 10, 2009)

Great stuff ER.
I think that will be copied and pasted in due course.
Don't suppose you know someone who designs crime fighting t-shirts do you?


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## ElephantRider (Mar 10, 2009)

http://www.cafepress.com 

You and Uber are pretty serious about this crime fighting thing, eh? hehe


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## v12xjs (Mar 10, 2009)

Doubt there's many serious crime fighters on this forum 

It's been a couple of days so just to keep you guys in the loop here's a couple of pics. First one is just to show that Pandora finally toed the line and looks nice and snug around the pot. Not sure if you can see but there's plenty of flower growth since that first bud 10 days ago. She will be ready for harvest in 39 days if I can ever move that fat bitch Granita out of there!
Speaking of Granita there's another of that chubby little main cola. Sorry I keep showing that one but it is a bit fruity. There's still plenty of white pistils popping up so I think she knows I'm a mad axeman now and she's just playing for time 
Had a chance to take them in the shower at lights on tonight. I've been spraying the place with all sorts to shift the smell since then. They all loved it. Before anyone asks by the way, I've no idea if it's beneficial or not but it gives me a chance to flush them all in case of any salt or nute build up and they don't seem to complain.
Enough rambling. Here's the pics.


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## rlax106 (Mar 10, 2009)

Damnnnn those look ridiculous... nice going v12xjs


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## v12xjs (Mar 10, 2009)

Cheers mate.
I chuckle every time I open the door on the case. It's friggin mental in there


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## needhelp (Mar 11, 2009)

damn... this is getting me kind of excited to finish my case... just need a few more things and i'll be done... any time i need that motivation.. i jump on here real quick... and a video for gutting cases or illustrations would definately be a good idea... you seem to be the leader so far


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## standardlad (Mar 11, 2009)

thats a mad pc grow. im a noob and never tried indoors. how do you stop the plants from getting to big for the box or burning themselves on light?


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## SketzoH (Mar 11, 2009)

standardlad said:


> thats a mad pc grow. im a noob and never tried indoors. how do you stop the plants from getting to big for the box or burning themselves on light?


Theres a few different methods to keeping your plant small,

*LST* - Basically you bend and tye the plant around the pot its a good choice for pc grows i think personally 
*More info here* -
https://www.rollitup.org/view.php?pg=faq&cmd=article&id=685

*12/12 From Seed* - Giving your plant 12 hours of light from seed will also help keep your plant shorter than normal but it does decrease the yield.

*Indica/Dwarf/Auto's* - Choosing a strain that is indica dominant will stay short and bushy, Dwarves and Auto Flowering Strains generally stay short (around 10-14inches) 
But from what i have seen I recommend an Indica Dominant as they seem to flourish in a pc case.

*SCROG* - Placing a screen (Chicken wire is good for this) just below some CFL's you can train your plant to the screen to maximise the spread of the canopy creating a larger yield
Some info on the SCROG Method-
https://www.rollitup.org/view.php?pg=faq&cmd=article&id=397
past times scrog pc grow-
https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/164898-pc-scrog-6-week-flower.html

Cant think of any more of the top of my head (wake & bake ftw) but i hope this can help


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## v12xjs (Mar 11, 2009)

needhelp said:


> damn... this is getting me kind of excited to finish my case... just need a few more things and i'll be done... any time i need that motivation.. i jump on here real quick... and a video for gutting cases or illustrations would definately be a good idea... you seem to be the leader so far


I'm no leader.
Having worked for most of the big pc manufacturers and support companies I've yet to see 2 cases that looked the same so a video guide would be a bit too specific to help a lot of people.
That's why I'm so impressed with ER's guide. He's covered what you are likely to come across in any case without being too specific. This also stops people from thinking that maybethey made a bad or wrong choice.
That said, it sounds like you are in a handy position to take pics or a vid. Fancy it?


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## v12xjs (Mar 11, 2009)

standardlad said:


> thats a mad pc grow. im a noob and never tried indoors. how do you stop the plants from getting to big for the box or burning themselves on light?


Hey fella
Read SketzoH's answer to your q. He's saved you about 3 years of research and whittled away all the crap.
Perfect response there SketzoH. Thanks.


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## SketzoH (Mar 11, 2009)

btw i forgot to say v12 everytime you post pics you amaze me just that little bit more.. great grow my man


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## v12xjs (Mar 11, 2009)

Thanks SketzoH. Just wish it was in my stash tin and not my pc case 
Some knockout work on the group by the way. I'll tag it to my sig in a mo.


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## SketzoH (Mar 11, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Thanks SketzoH. Just wish it was in my stash tin and not my pc case
> Some knockout work on the group by the way. I'll tag it to my sig in a mo.


Wont be long thou ay!

haha i thought it had to be done that way we can keep most of the info in one place then


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## ElephantRider (Mar 11, 2009)

I tell ya.. your grow jazzes me up more than just about anything else these days. Sex is like a close second!


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## DrGreen007 (Mar 11, 2009)

Yeah Man Looking Mad For A Pc Grow


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## v12xjs (Mar 11, 2009)

Hey ER. I was with you right up to the sex thing  Perhaps you need to part ex the lady 

Thanks DrGreen. Interesting sig by the way.

Turns out Granita is an 8 - 9 week strain, not 8 week. The notes indicate that it's the Ferrari of plants. On looks I would have to agree, but that 0 - 60% amber time is more Land Rover than Ferrari


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## thc42O (Mar 11, 2009)

i know u arent supposed to post in grow diaries however this advice is useful to u judging by ur pics

wrap black garbage bags around the pots so that light does not get into the root chamber


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## SketzoH (Mar 11, 2009)

thc42O said:


> i know u arent supposed to post in grow diaries however this advice is useful to u judging by ur pics
> 
> wrap black garbage bags around the pots so that light does not get into the root chamber


He doesnt do that as then he can see the root growth and also the light hitting the roots stunts the plant which is whats needed in a pc grow


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## v12xjs (Mar 11, 2009)

Hi thc420. Appreciate the concern and the advice.

As SketzoH points out, I use very small pots so having a handle on what the roots are doing is most beneficial.
I do think the whole thing about keeping roots in the dark is an old wives tale though which is why I wouldn't bother covering them up.
Hopefully the plants speak for themselves in terms of general health, but if you think about it, roots are destined to live in blackness so it's highly unlikely that they have any means of even detecting light.
The only problem that is likely to arise would be from algae forming as happens when you leave a cup of water on a windowsill for a long time. As I let the plant dry out, and I can see for sure that it has dried out, this can't really happen. As an insurance measure I do boil and then filter my water after leaving it to stand though.


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## v12xjs (Mar 11, 2009)

Just before I'm picked up on it, there is a caveat to what I said.
It's possible that roots can detect uv-b light but cfl's don't emit uv-b.


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## floridasucks (Mar 11, 2009)

ive had no problems with exposed roots...


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## v12xjs (Mar 11, 2009)

Glad I'm not the only one fs 

I noticed last night I've posted up 100 images so I'm gonna try & post an update to see if I've reached my limit. Same kind of pics as yesterday, but on Pandora you can see how much the main flowering head has grown overnight. There's 10 viable tops on her now so she should turn out to be a good producer. This is the Granita show though, so I'd best put one of the fat lazy sod up as well I suppose.
Got some stunning trich shots too. If it goes ok with these I'll try and put one of those up.


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## v12xjs (Mar 11, 2009)

So far so good.

OK. Here's a clip of a closeup on one of the lesser tops. They're all similar. You can see a few amber trichs on the small leaf to the left. I love the the little flower hair covered in trichs in the bottom centre.


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## ElephantRider (Mar 11, 2009)

If you love the couchlock, let her go a bit more.  Me.. I'd yank cuz I'm more of an active high type. Although.. looking at this 6" Sour Diesel spliff in front of me is making me think couchlock would be juuuust fine tonight. 

Another question.. which is bigger? Granita's top cola or your junk? ROFL j/k, mate! That is one fat ass cola, though!

Also of note.. since the sour diesel was grown local and is VERY fresh (I think I got her day 1 on the market here), I decided to test a legend I'd heard tale of on another forum site a while back. I'm trying to clone from nug.  I heard an old off the grid hippie talking about having done it a few times, so I figured I'd give it a shot. I used to have great success cloning Ficus trees and I know we're not talking the same thing here, but since I got a bit, I cut the tip real sharp, scarified the other side (insides were still a lil' moist!) and took off all but the VERY top-most piece of 6" bud. Yes, I'll post a pic in my forum. Just givin' you the heads up first. 

ttyl.


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## floridasucks (Mar 11, 2009)

hey i didnt know there was a limit on posting images. where did you read that? anyway the girls look beautiful.. especially granita she looks like she really got fat. thats gonna be some goood smoke.


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## worm5376 (Mar 11, 2009)

good shit.


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## UberSmoker (Mar 11, 2009)

Looking tasty man, you could harvest half earlier than the rest so you have both couch lock and cerebral high.


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## v12xjs (Mar 12, 2009)

Hey ER
I've done the dishes now 
That experiment with the bud sounds really interesting. Got my fingers crossed for you. Closest I ever came to that was germing a nut from a chocolate & nut snack bar. It worked fine but hazelnuts don't do well in this climate so I wish I'd just eaten it now 

Thanks fs
Sure I read someone bitching about a 100 pic limit while rooting around on here but it seems fine. There's usually some kind of restriction, I'll let you know when I find it.

Hi worm5376. Thanks for the positive comment.

Greets again Uber
She does look sweet and maybe she has had long enough on the sunbed. I managed to get a preview smoke of the strain last night and it's very nice despite a lower amber count and a 3 day cure.
The little plant in the corner is only around 10 days from flower now and I needed to repot it into a bigger pill jar last night so it looks like Sunday is the day for Granita after all.


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## needhelp (Mar 12, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey ER
> Closest I ever came to that was germing a nut from a chocolate & nut snack bar. It worked fine but hazelnuts don't do well in this climate so I wish I'd just eaten it now
> .



 me too (wiping tears from eyes with shirt sleeve)

stupid hazlenuts...


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## worm5376 (Mar 12, 2009)

needhelp said:


> me too (wiping tears from eyes with shirt sleeve)
> 
> stupid hazlenuts...


 
LMFAO!! I can see this playing out to be Serious. aha!


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## needhelp (Mar 12, 2009)

worm5376 said:


> LMFAO!! I can see this playing out to be Serious. aha!


you damn right... we're gonna rip hazel nuts off...

and when we get that bastard.. its all over...... ha


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## worm5376 (Mar 12, 2009)

v12 man thats a nice setup. it's so compact and well put together. even the genetic seem called for in this case. you even lst'd it perfect. fucking amzing man

NEEDHELP>> If you Neen Help let me know .. hahaha!


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## v12xjs (Mar 12, 2009)

So so funny 
Hey needhelp. You just made me snot all down my shirt  Maybe they should put a warning on those bars..'DO NOT TRY TO GROW THIS CHOCOLATE BAR. JUST F***ING EAT IT'
LOL
I saw some hemp snack bars at the market recently. Are you thinking what I'm thinking?

Hi again worm5376. Very kind words. Thank you.
I kind of wish I had some pics of gutting the case too, just to complete the picture. Sadly I lost so much blood that they would have been rated 18+ and would never have seen light of day anyway.


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## UberSmoker (Mar 12, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Greets again Uber
> She does look sweet and maybe she has had long enough on the sunbed. I managed to get a preview smoke of the strain last night and it's very nice despite a lower amber count and a 3 day cure.
> The little plant in the corner is only around 10 days from flower now and I needed to repot it into a bigger pill jar last night so it looks like Sunday is the day for Granita after all.


Cool man, i love that home growing means you can grow and cure to personal preference. What curing method did you use? 

I really like the pill jar method, I might try that myself next time around.

I'll be stopping by on Sunday to see Granita in all her harvested glory. Take it easy dude.


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## needhelp (Mar 12, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> So so funny
> Hey needhelp. You just made me snot all down my shirt  Maybe they should put a warning on those bars..'DO NOT TRY TO GROW THIS CHOCOLATE BAR. JUST F***ING EAT IT'
> LOL
> I saw some hemp snack bars at the market recently. Are you thinking what I'm thinking?



ewww... as long as you don't touch me.. its ok..ha

haha.. yeah, i'm thinking what you're thinking......why is Jay Leno chin so big


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## UberSmoker (Mar 12, 2009)

You can buy hemp seed as a health food snack and its legal if you can find it. I think that they sterilise the seeds, or at least are supposed to, but i'm sure a few would germ. Could hybridise them.


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## v12xjs (Mar 12, 2009)

UberSmoker said:


> Cool man, i love that home growing means you can grow and cure to personal preference. What curing method did you use?
> 
> I really like the pill jar method, I might try that myself next time around.
> 
> I'll be stopping by on Sunday to see Granita in all her harvested glory. Take it easy dude.


The tester was from another grow. It was left in the dark for 1 day and put in a glass jar for another 2. Even so it was very smooth and knocked my socks off!

I have a shoe box with a fan at the top and some holes in the other end. I don't need anything bigger. Buds sit on a toaster rack in there for 2 days then go into a glass jar. I like to leave it there for 2 weeks minimum but both my jars are empty so maybe just a couple of days this time round.

The pill jar works well for me and it's easy to cover it with a sealy bag for the first couple of days. It's worth a try for sure.


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## v12xjs (Mar 12, 2009)

needhelp said:


> ewww... as long as you don't touch me.. its ok..ha
> 
> haha.. yeah, i'm thinking what you're thinking......why is Jay Leno chin so big


Totally on the same wavelength 

I changed my shirt now.


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## UberSmoker (Mar 12, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> The tester was from another grow. It was left in the dark for 1 day and put in a glass jar for another 2. Even so it was very smooth and knocked my socks off!
> 
> I have a shoe box with a fan at the top and some holes in the other end. I don't need anything bigger. Buds sit on a toaster rack in there for 2 days then go into a glass jar. I like to leave it there for 2 weeks minimum but both my jars are empty so maybe just a couple of days this time round.
> 
> The pill jar works well for me and it's easy to cover it with a sealy bag for the first couple of days. It's worth a try for sure.


Is the dark period important? Also can you cure for too long or is it like wine?

I did use cling film to begin with but the jar and baggy seems to work great in your setup so i'll defo try it out.


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## v12xjs (Mar 12, 2009)

UberSmoker said:


> You can buy hemp seed as a health food snack and its legal if you can find it. I think that they sterilise the seeds, or at least are supposed to, but i'm sure a few would germ. Could hybridise them.


The one's I saw were called 9 bars. In UK a 9 bar is a 9oz bar of hash! I nearly fell over when I saw it!

I think they use ruderalis and sterilise them as you say. Shame, they could have been auto's!


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## UberSmoker (Mar 12, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> The one's I saw were called 9 bars. In UK a 9 bar is a 9oz bar of hash! I nearly fell over when I saw it!
> 
> I think they use ruderalis and sterilise them as you say. Shame, they could have been auto's!


9 bars lol Yeah i'm a UK resident also man that's hilarious. I'm sure a few would sprout, especially as I heard you can eat hemp sprouts in a similar way to bean sprouts.


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## v12xjs (Mar 12, 2009)

UberSmoker said:


> Is the dark period important? Also can you cure for too long or is it like wine?
> 
> I never really looked into it too much but the thc does degrade in light so I just went with the dark thing.
> My little plants don't last too long but they taste better and seem to get stronger if I leave them for a month in the jar. Just got to be careful about mold.
> If I was keeping anything longer than a few months I would probably consider freezing it.


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## SketzoH (Mar 12, 2009)

lol 9 bars! 
Dont get me started on the state of hash and weed in this country.. 

v12 nice to see you got a sample smoke how was it nice high? good taste?


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## v12xjs (Mar 12, 2009)

Here's the link Uber

http://www.9-bar.co.uk/products/product_details.asp?ProductID=29

Can you believe it?


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## UberSmoker (Mar 12, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Here's the link Uber
> 
> http://www.9-bar.co.uk/products/product_details.asp?ProductID=29
> 
> Can you believe it?


Hhahahaha that's awesome man, perfect for munchies lol


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## v12xjs (Mar 12, 2009)

Hey SketzoH

The smoke was really smooth all the way to the roach. It did have a vanilla flavour that would be even more noticeable with a proper cure I reckon.
Gave me a fair couchlock considering it was maybe 5% amber. Plenty of giggles in there too. Lasted 2 hours before the effects started diminishing, so I won't be worried I'm cutting Granita down too soon.


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## SketzoH (Mar 12, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey SketzoH
> 
> The smoke was really smooth all the way to the roach. It did have a vanilla flavour that would be even more noticeable with a proper cure I reckon.
> Gave me a fair couchlock considering it was maybe 5% amber. Plenty of giggles in there too. Lasted 2 hours before the effects started diminishing, so I won't be worried I'm cutting Granita down too soon.


Thats great news dude 

Your a legend for finding them 9 Bars! lool definate +rep for that!!

EDIT* Wouldnt let me rep you


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## v12xjs (Mar 12, 2009)

UberSmoker said:


> Hhahahaha that's awesome man, perfect for munchies lol


The company name says it all too. Wholebake.
I'd love to meet the guy who set that up.


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## v12xjs (Mar 12, 2009)

No prob SketzoH. May even be full. Folk have been very positive in there about the thread.


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## UberSmoker (Mar 12, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> The company name says it all too. Wholebake.
> I'd love to meet the guy who set that up.


HAHAHAHAHA blatantly a stoner


----------



## floridasucks (Mar 12, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey SketzoH
> 
> The smoke was really smooth all the way to the roach. It did have a vanilla flavour that would be even more noticeable with a proper cure I reckon.
> Gave me a fair couchlock considering it was maybe 5% amber. Plenty of giggles in there too. Lasted 2 hours before the effects started diminishing, so I won't be worried I'm cutting Granita down too soon.


i guess this is the smoke report for Granita? that sounds really good.


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## worm5376 (Mar 12, 2009)

That sounds delicious man. make sure we get some cure pics.


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## needhelp (Mar 12, 2009)

are you gonna try the thing with the snack bar....
i hope you do... i know you can make it into a great grow journal...


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## v12xjs (Mar 12, 2009)

Don't worry worm. Everyone's invited.
I live in shared accomodation though, so prolly Monday before I get some pics up. I can only start manicuring after everyone's asleep. I'll need to blag some scales too but that shouldn't be a problem.

Sounds good doesn't it fs? That was one of Granita's older sisters. My girl is just a couple of days behind them and they have had some serious problems during the grow so Granita should at least be on a par.

Hey Uber
If I'll have a crack at a freaking chocolate bar you know I'm daft enough to try, but I have a waiting list of stuff I want to try first. Euphoria sounds interesting as does Wembley but I saw a journal I'll be checking out real soon that mentioned Lamb's Bread. I had some once courtesy of a Jamaican friend who sadly died just 2 weeks ago (RIP M) and there is no finer weed. End of chat. So if the genetics for that is available I'll be selling a kidney in the next few days.
Got a pic for you though. I snapped the little one last night while I checked the roots and that was what made me do the repot. You can see how easy it is to inspect the goods and to just push it through into another pot without any drama.
And if you want one more laugh, I always use glucosamine pill jars. I assume you know that glucosamine is good for joints 
Here you go:


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## floridasucks (Mar 12, 2009)

hahaha... glucosamine... good for joints...


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## UberSmoker (Mar 12, 2009)

Hey man,

I look forward to seeing your various 'daft' exploits on RIU 

Sorry to hear about your Jamaican friend.
That weed sounds very nice though, I may have to look into getting some.

Thanks for the pic dude, that is definitely a useful way to get her started.

I haven't heard of glucosamine before and just googled it thinking it was some kind of doob additive lol that cracked me up.


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## CodyCasualtiesEngland (Mar 13, 2009)

hey man i have a problem you might be able to help with. I went to check on my plant and it was all droopy. It got cold that night so i got a little heater and put on it. When i checked today it was worse!!! I re potted it and when i took it out of the pot the roots were all bound up an dry. I shook some of it out and replanted and added a little water. I have photos on my thread if you want to see what it looks like. Any advise would help man thanks!!!


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## floridasucks (Mar 13, 2009)

CodyCasualtiesEngland said:


> hey man i have a problem you might be able to help with. I went to check on my plant and it was all droopy. It got cold that night so i got a little heater and put on it. When i checked today it was worse!!! I re potted it and when i took it out of the pot the roots were all bound up an dry. I shook some of it out and replanted and added a little water. I have photos on my thread if you want to see what it looks like. Any advise would help man thanks!!!


sounds like you let it dry out. cant forget to water. did it recover after you watered?


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## v12xjs (Mar 14, 2009)

Hey CCE
Sorry I wasn't around last night, it's poker night on Fridays for me. I'll look in on you in a moment. Think fs has called it though.

Appreciate you jumping in there fs. I was busy losing at the weekly poker night


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## v12xjs (Mar 14, 2009)

Just a quick update on Granita. I'm going to leave you guys in suspense now until after the chop. There's not been any real changes, just a tiny bit more fattening and the white growth has slowed down markedly so I'm happy she's ready. Another 36 hours or so Should have her done to perfection.
I'll go get those scales.


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## SketzoH (Mar 14, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Just a quick update on Granita. I'm going to leave you guys in suspense now until after the chop. There's not been any real changes, just a tiny bit more fattening and the white growth has slowed down markedly so I'm happy she's ready. Another 36 hours or so Should have her done to perfection.
> I'll go get those scales.


Im waiting for monday cant wait to see pics


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## v12xjs (Mar 14, 2009)

Me too. I really need some weed! Those trimmings don't stand a chance!


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## SketzoH (Mar 14, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Me too. I really need some weed! Those trimmings don't stand a chance!


lol same im all out till payday!


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## v12xjs (Mar 14, 2009)

Bummer huh? My solution is to call in on friends. Hell, they do it to me in between paychecks!


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## SketzoH (Mar 14, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Bummer huh? My solution is to call in on friends. Hell, they do it to me in between paychecks!


haha! good call mite give it a go if i feel the need for a doob


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## v12xjs (Mar 14, 2009)

I love to flick through my old Furry Freak Brothers and Fat Freddies Cat comics when I have no herb but I loaned them out to my daughter and her bf before they split so I think they are gone for good


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## worm5376 (Mar 14, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> I love to flick through my old Furry Freak Brothers and Fat Freddies Cat comics when I have no herb but I loaned them out to my daughter and her bf before they split so I think they are gone for good


Call that mother fucker up and get them back lol


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## v12xjs (Mar 14, 2009)

Good point well argued worm 
I'll be on the phone in a minute.


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## worm5376 (Mar 14, 2009)

I just hate to see some dick have your beloeved comics bra. you could be reading some good stuff now but NoOo , some guys prolly got them sitting in the damn closet. That freakin sucks


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## v12xjs (Mar 14, 2009)

Sorry. I was on the phone there 
He's dragging his sorry ass over here on Tuesday. I should have some trimmings ready by then, so it's all good.
Thanks for the kick up the ass. I would have waved goodbye to them otherwise.


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## SketzoH (Mar 14, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Sorry. I was on the phone there
> He's dragging his sorry ass over here on Tuesday. I should have some trimmings ready by then, so it's all good.
> Thanks for the kick up the ass. I would have waved goodbye to them otherwise.


Thats good news dude


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## worm5376 (Mar 14, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Sorry. I was on the phone there
> He's dragging his sorry ass over here on Tuesday. I should have some trimmings ready by then, so it's all good.
> Thanks for the kick up the ass. I would have waved goodbye to them otherwise.


 
Good shit man. see man. You almost let them go. Now when you reunite with them , it'll be like the good ole days


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## phoenix58 (Mar 14, 2009)

Jesus, this threads steaming along so fast I lost hold of it!  Good laugh reading through it too!

Looking good there, this thread should be a sticky for those thinking of trying a PC case grow.


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## floridasucks (Mar 14, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Bummer huh? My solution is to call in on friends. Hell, they do it to me in between paychecks!


thats exactly what i do when i run out.


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## v12xjs (Mar 14, 2009)

floridasucks said:


> thats exactly what i do when i run out.


Great minds think alike


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## v12xjs (Mar 14, 2009)

phoenix58 said:


> Jesus, this threads steaming along so fast I lost hold of it!  Good laugh reading through it too!
> 
> Looking good there, this thread should be a sticky for those thinking of trying a PC case grow.


 
For sure it's been a good laugh. There's some pretty cool and funny people here on RIU.
Don't know about a sticky though. I'd have no objection, I give all this info freely but I think it's a bit of a blinkered approach. There's nothing for cloners, hps users, hydro or whatever and I suspect most pc grows are started because of what people have lying around. Not many can afford to spec out their case just like mine.
The sticky should be saved for the ones that come after this one. The ones that take the best of what I do and combine it with the best of the others.
I do very much appreciate the compliment though.


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## SketzoH (Mar 14, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> For sure it's been a good laugh. There's some pretty cool and funny people here on RIU.
> Don't know about a sticky though. I'd have no objection, I give all this info freely but I think it's a bit of a blinkered approach. There's nothing for cloners, hps users, hydro or whatever and I suspect most pc grows are started because of what people have lying around. Not many can afford to spec out their case just like mine.
> The sticky should be saved for the ones that come after this one. The ones that take the best of what I do and combine it with the best of the others.
> I do very much appreciate the compliment though.


I agree and disagree with stickying this, I think its great inspiration for anyone starting a pc grow whether its a budget grow to someone buying a premade veg or flower tower.Theres also an abundance of info in here and also shows what yield can be produced in one.
Yet i think it would be a better idea to have a permanent link in the CFL section to the pc grow group as i think theyll be alot more straight forward info there and also links to all pc grows (including this one)
Just an Idea


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## ElephantRider (Mar 14, 2009)

You guys are gonna hate me here, but I haven't run out in about 8-9 years. Haven't seen a bag w/ a seed in maybe 10 years, either.


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## v12xjs (Mar 14, 2009)

Perhaps you should have kept that quiet ER. I can go off people you know 

In fairness my problem is financial rather than lack of supply. Reminds me of something on the back page of one of those Furry Freak mags. Dope will get you through times of no money better than money will get you through times of no dope.


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## v12xjs (Mar 14, 2009)

Well the end is nigh. Granita has been found guilty of posession of amber trichs and has been sentenced to death by beheading.
I got a picture of her leaving court after the judgement. She looked sad but resigned to her fate. Sentence will be carried out at sun up tomorrow which will be around 10pm GMT.
Her friend Pandora was also in court but refused to comment on the verdict. Pandora is also believed to be carrying trichs but a search revealed nothing. She remains under surveillance


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## floridasucks (Mar 14, 2009)

sticky buds and more on the way..... good job man they are both beautiful.


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## UberSmoker (Mar 15, 2009)

I'm salivating man, can't wait to see the chop


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## v12xjs (Mar 15, 2009)

Hey SketzoH

Sorry I missed your post. I think you're right in what you say about a centralised source of info as opposed to just stickying this journal. Without a pc case section it's difficult to know how to ensure newbies will be able to locate the info but a permanent link to the group somewhere definitely sounds like the way to go.
Good call fella.


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## needhelp (Mar 15, 2009)

there should be a pc section just like theres a cfl section... more people seem to be doing these lately


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## floridasucks (Mar 15, 2009)

needhelp said:


> there should be a pc section just like theres a cfl section... more people seem to be doing these lately


ill second that....


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## ElephantRider (Mar 15, 2009)

I just asked the site for a PC section under indoor growing just like cfl. Thought you guys might like to hear that.

I'm drooling, v12. That bitch (wait.. bird, right?  ) is humungous!


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## SketzoH (Mar 15, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Well the end is nigh. Granita has been found guilty of posession of amber trichs and has been sentenced to death by beheading.
> I got a picture of her leaving court after the judgement. She looked sad but resigned to her fate. Sentence will be carried out at sun up tomorrow which will be around 10pm GMT.
> Her friend Pandora was also in court but refused to comment on the verdict. Pandora is also believed to be carrying trichs but a search revealed nothing. She remains under surveillance


LMFAO... Looking tasty! cant wait to see the pics tonite/tomorrow 


Well done Elephant Rider a pc section would be excellent


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## v12xjs (Mar 15, 2009)

Some of you guys really have your shit together for stoners!
Nice work ER. I know it will be a busy section if it happens. Let's hope it does.

I'm a bit worried about the anticipation now. Remember I'm only looking for maybe 2g per cola plus an extra little toot from the mama bud. Think I'll have to take the pics from real close range so I don't dissappoint 

I'm getting all trigger happy myself now. Dusted off the drying box and my little toast rack has gone AWOL. I've put something together to keep the buds off the bottom but I need my toast rack for the odd camping hols & summer festivals as well as the bud drier. Wish I could remember what I did with it


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## ElephantRider (Mar 15, 2009)

LOL. I was born in the 70's and have other humans that depend on me. NEED to have it together.  Hopefully, RIU gets back to me on it.


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## kinghash (Mar 15, 2009)

so you must be chopping about now?


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## v12xjs (Mar 15, 2009)

Here you go then.
Pics were all a bit shaky, guess I was a bit hyped, not sure why but I couldn't use half of them. Couldn't get a loan of any scales either but I'll go to the storage place and get mine tomorrow so dry weight should be Tues / Wed.
A quick message to any big HPS users looking in. I'll say to you what I say to most of my gf's when they see my manhood: it may not be much to you but it's all the world to me


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## v12xjs (Mar 15, 2009)

Oops. Clicked submit instead of preview.


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## SketzoH (Mar 15, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Here you go then.
> Pics were all a bit shaky, guess I was a bit hyped, not sure why but I couldn't use half of them. Couldn't get a loan of any scales either but I'll go to the storage place and get mine tomorrow so dry weight should be Tues / Wed.
> A quick message to any big HPS users looking in. I'll say to you what I say to most of my gf's when they see my manhood: it may not be much to you but it's all the world to me


LMFAO ..you are a legend 

As for granita she looks fantastic real crystally! its been great inspiration watching her grow so thankyou for sharing v12 

RIP GRANITA


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## v12xjs (Mar 15, 2009)

Well, shows pretty well over for you guys, but to show you what I've got in store, first pic is of the Indica which starts flushing tomorrow and will be ready in 2 weeks. 2nd is Pandora who will be ready in 5 weeks.
So I guess you could say Granita met a sticky end and I've finished on a high 

I know, I know. I'm going


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## ElephantRider (Mar 15, 2009)

ohhhhhhhman, brother, am I happy for you! That's gorgeous! Can you show some snaps of that dryer box? I've wondered about my needs for that pice. I've seen big 3-day dryer plans, but nothing for that small.


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## v12xjs (Mar 16, 2009)

Thanks ER.
First sample should be tomorrow night if all goes well. I'll get the weight first as they should be pretty dry by then.

The drier is really simple. Just a shoe box with a load of small holes low down at one end. Trace the inside of a 120mm fan into the top and cut out the shape. Fit the fan with a square of the cooker hood carbon filter over it and voila!
The shelf is usually a toast rack from a camping shop that opens up to fit perfectly, but I had to improvise yesterday so what you see is a draining mat I nicked from the kitchen sink! I just used some 25mm pc fan screws with washers to fabricate some legs. Not a long term thing but it works ok. If I had the time I would have gone to the car spares place. In the panel repair section they sell a mesh for use with body filler or fibre glass that is really easy to just bend into shape and would have done the job a treat but they were closed by the time I realised I'd lost the toast rack. Doh!
Let me know if you still needs some pics.

By the way, how about copying your pc gutting instructions into the pc gang section?


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## needhelp (Mar 16, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> . I'll say to you what I say to most of my gf's when they see my manhood: it may not be much to you but it's all the world to me


 you damn right


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## needhelp (Mar 16, 2009)

cool as idea with the shoebox...i'm borrowing it


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## v12xjs (Mar 17, 2009)

needhelp said:


> cool as idea with the shoebox...i'm borrowing it


Be my guest 

Re the manhood thing:
I saw some guys the other day and one kept calling the other one donkey. I saw the guy later and wondered if it was something to do with his manhood, so I asked him why his friend called him donkey. He said 'I don't know. eeaw eeaw he always calls me that'


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## v12xjs (Mar 17, 2009)

Couple more updates on the crop.
It's all dry enough for the jars now. I got a g or 2 of decent skuff that was dry Monday morning and has been keeping me going quite nicely 
6 of the colas and all the popcorn stuff from underneath, including another 2 cute colas that never made the canopy, were all dry enough this morning (Tuesday). They are in the jar.
The North and South wings of Granita were only finished when I checked up a couple of hours ago, so 48 hours in the dryer give or take.
Here's a couple of pics of the last 2.
They shrank more than I thought they would and I'm a bit disappointed in terms of weight. I checked the genetics though and they are 40% sativa so I think they just needed a bit more soil. If that's the case then it was a bad move dropping down to the new 1 litre pots! I even took her out of a 1.8 litre becaause I couldn't get a good base for the LST 
I couldn't get to my scales but I have some lined up for tomorrow, so I'll know the full story then, but even if I didn't break my pb I still have a nice little crop of very nice bud. And the factory is still on full output 
Here's the pics:


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## MediMaryUser (Mar 17, 2009)

impressive + rep


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## v12xjs (Mar 17, 2009)

Thank you. That's made me feel a bit better


----------



## UberSmoker (Mar 18, 2009)

Looking great dude + rep


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## v12xjs (Mar 18, 2009)

Cheers Uber. Appreciate that.
I'm feeling a better now. Got the scales so I know what I got for sure and it was close enough to the 21g target weight. 

Granita just seemed to promise a bit more.

5.6g for the main top is not my pb but very respectable. The others ranged between 1.3g and 2.7g with a final overall 20.9g.
There are a couple of popcorn buds missing in action, but I left a few stalks on to act as handles so the final weight is probably about 20g for the full harvest.

Here's some pics of the big fight weigh in:


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## anonymous.toker (Mar 18, 2009)

Just read through the whole journal. Great info v12, thanks for putting so much into the journal. You've got me eyeing some of the cases I have sitting around here but I think I'm going to try and score an old server case from work and start putting a rig together.


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## UberSmoker (Mar 18, 2009)

Awesome. I doubt I will harvest anywhere near as much for my current grow, but this gives me hope for the next one. Great job man.


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## v12xjs (Mar 18, 2009)

Thanks annonymous.toker
It's a long read huh? Use a case with a front door if you can find one. 

Cheers Uber
You'll do fine. Get the first grow done and you'll see how easy it is.


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## jpipe (Mar 18, 2009)

Wow is all I can say, that was amazing. Just read from start to finish. + rep, and you are the fucking man!


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## needhelp (Mar 18, 2009)

did you FIM and LST...and if you did, by what node did you start


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## v12xjs (Mar 19, 2009)

Wow. Thanks jpipe. 

Hey needhelp
No FIM, just LST.


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## needhelp (Mar 19, 2009)

i FIM before for the multiple tops but i didn't know LST would have such an effect on it.... what is your take on LST vs. FIM.... do you see FIM as less of a quality method then LST... do you think it puts too much stress on the plant and wastes time in waiting for recovery... am i answering my own questions while i'm asking them.... ha


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## floridasucks (Mar 19, 2009)

sweet harvest v12.. i bet it feels real good to finally have that stash tin full.

btw.. i got 2 more flowering plants from my friends pc in Querkle's tank. ima put up some pics now


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## ElephantRider (Mar 19, 2009)

I can't rep you, but I would if I could! That rules, bro. 20g with another 20 a few weeks away? Is that about right?

Any possible way anyone could convince you to go one more plant on this post so you really get to see the 'perpetual' aspect?


----------



## floridasucks (Mar 19, 2009)

ElephantRider said:


> I can't rep you, but I would if I could! That rules, bro. 20g with another 20 a few weeks away? Is that about right?
> 
> Any possible way anyone could convince you to go one more plant on this post so you really get to see the 'perpetual' aspect?


i agree with ER i think you should document one more grow, plus well get to see a diff strain right? or is pandora the same strain as granita?


----------



## v12xjs (Mar 19, 2009)

needhelp said:


> i FIM before for the multiple tops but i didn't know LST would have such an effect on it.... what is your take on LST vs. FIM.... do you see FIM as less of a quality method then LST... do you think it puts too much stress on the plant and wastes time in waiting for recovery... am i answering my own questions while i'm asking them.... ha


I love both methods but just for my system FIM is less well suited than LST. For me FIM comes into it's own for taller plants where 4 - 6 large colas are needed or for scrog setups. FIM also does best with a veg stage. In my system time is of the essence so stressing a plant and knocking it back a week is not helpful.
Just my 2 cents though.


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## v12xjs (Mar 19, 2009)

Hey ER & fs
I think you guys just want some bud porn until yours is ready 

Pandora is different genetics to Granita. Would you believe she is a cross between Jack Herer, Ed Rosenthal SuperBud and hashplant. 
Like I could turn that shit down 

Pandora is much more stretchy than Granita was so maybe there is some value in showing you guys the grow. It's a new strain to me too so I guess we could learn together.
Remember though that I now have a stash tin full of bud. I'll update when I can be bothered 

I'll root through the pics I have up to now and see if I can do a little background on where I'm up to.

But no more bedtime stories after this one!


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## SketzoH (Mar 19, 2009)

WOOOOOHOOOOO!!!

Go v12 your the man glad youve decided to carry on with pandora 

I personally would like updates of sketzoh junior aswell  haha


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## ElephantRider (Mar 19, 2009)

Sweeeet! I've never had the superbud, and a buddy of mine said Jack was better than anything he'd ever had. I have been smoking a NL x Hashplant in this area for some 5-6 years, now, as a regular smoke. It's been fabulous and, having had plenty of NL in my days, the difference is really nice. It's a much milder, more euphoric high, for me. I love what the Hashplant brings to the table.


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## v12xjs (Mar 20, 2009)

ElephantRider said:


> Sweeeet! I've never had the superbud, and a buddy of mine said Jack was better than anything he'd ever had. I have been smoking a NL x Hashplant in this area for some 5-6 years, now, as a regular smoke. It's been fabulous and, having had plenty of NL in my days, the difference is really nice. It's a much milder, more euphoric high, for me. I love what the Hashplant brings to the table.


I guess I know what seeds you are going to grow next


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## v12xjs (Mar 20, 2009)

A thought occurred to me with regard to needhelp's question on my choice of methods and the reasons behind those choices. Maybe it will help you guys to understand my system a little better and assist in forming your own setups.

The biggest breakthrough I ever made in terms of pc case growing was nothing to do with cultivation techniques. I realised that I could get by with modest amounts of weed. In fact when I thought about it, a gram a day was actually more than enough. Once I knew I only needed 350g/year, growing in a pc case was actually a viable option.
Once you understand this principle, maximising yield becomes a secondary consideration. My job is to churn out average yields day in and day out.
The reality of this can be seen in the difference between a hobby gardener and a commercial market garden. Where the hobbyist grows the largest pumpkin or cabbage, the market gardener is concerned with getting lots of high quality smaller fruits for the least amount of effort.
I can pump nutes into a plant to get an extra gram or 2 but I risk nuteburn and losing half the crop or more in order to gain a minimal amount and this risk is too great. The same goes for topping or FIMming. If the timing is right then I can gain a small amount but if it's wrong then none of the tops will develop fully and I lose more than I ever stood to gain.
If you need more than a PC can give then you need to look elsewhere for a grow cab. Most of the problems I see on here are from people who use too much light or too many nutes. Just put more plants in a bigger cab! Everyone seems to want to better the 1g/watt thing but I only aim for a quarter of that which is far more achievable and much less risky.
As a result, I'm much more concerned with correct temps, getting the ph right and ensuring that the plant has an environment where it can thrive on it's own. 
Any form of stress is counterproductive to that aim.


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## worm5376 (Mar 20, 2009)

Yoe V12. Congrats on the harvest and let us know granita taste like. MmMm...+Rep


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## needhelp (Mar 21, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> A thought occurred to me with regard to needhelp's question on my choice of methods and the reasons behind those choices. Maybe it will help you guys to understand my system a little better and assist in forming your own setups.
> 
> The biggest breakthrough I ever made in terms of pc case growing was nothing to do with cultivation techniques. I realised that I could get by with modest amounts of weed. In fact when I thought about it, a gram a day was actually more than enough. Once I knew I only needed 350g/year, growing in a pc case was actually a viable option.
> Once you understand this principle, maximising yield becomes a secondary consideration. My job is to churn out average yields day in and day out.
> ...


well put... puts a lot into perspective


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## green thumb matt (Mar 21, 2009)

sweet job man. I have an almost exact grow going on. Looks like u had a hybrid little more on the indica side. How much more did height increase in flowering?


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## floridasucks (Mar 21, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey ER & fs
> I think you guys just want some bud porn until yours is ready
> 
> Pandora is different genetics to Granita. Would you believe she is a cross between Jack Herer, Ed Rosenthal SuperBud and hashplant.
> ...


yea man we have to see pandora grown out. those are some gooood genetics. 

If anyone has not seen the ER superbud strain it is one insane looking plant... huge buds...


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## v12xjs (Mar 21, 2009)

Hey worm. Thanks for the rep.
I've cracked open one of the jars tonight but it's still only a week since harvest so I'm going easy with it. I feel that 21 days in cure is the minimum needed to get the full hit of flavour and potency. It's looking very good up to now though 

Hi matt
get some pics up of your grow. I'd love to see what you are doing. Granita was only around 7 inches at the chop so she put on maybe 1.5 inches in flower. 

Greets fs
I've never seen or smoked superbud but I did check out some of the pics. I'm really looking forward to seeing Pandora grow out and those genetics are a dead cert for a great smoke 
I'm just rooting through a couple of pics to get you guys up to speed but Pandora looks great so far.


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## v12xjs (Mar 21, 2009)

Hey SketzoH
Here's the update on junior. 
Pics from 20th Feb and 16th March, and yes, she feckin flowered on me while she was still in the kindergarden. I knew I was cutting things fine for the LST stage but I wanted Granita to finish properly so I needed to keep her back. I was expecting 32 days to flower and I don't count the first day as she still hadn't broke out of the seed, so she flowered in 23 days! I thought I still had the best part of 2 weeks to go!
I've put her in a flowering pot now and I'll just grow her out as a single cola I think. No idea what to expect but I'll be a bit more vigilant with this strain in future. The good news is that she will finish in 72 days from seed which rivals auto strains!


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## SketzoH (Mar 21, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey SketzoH
> Here's the update on junior.
> Pics from 20th Feb and 16th March, and yes, she feckin flowered on me while she was still in the kindergarden. I knew I was cutting things fine for the LST stage but I wanted Granita to finish properly so I needed to keep her back. I was expecting 32 days to flower and I don't count the first day as she still hadn't broke out of the seed, so she flowered in 23 days! I thought I still had the best part of 2 weeks to go!
> I've put her in a flowering pot now and I'll just grow her out as a single cola I think. No idea what to expect but I'll be a bit more vigilant with this strain in future. The good news is that she will finish in 72 days from seed which rivals auto strains!


23 Days! oh my that is good 
Shes looking real healthy too what strain is she?


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## v12xjs (Mar 21, 2009)

She's the same as Pandora 
Another one sprouted too. She's called Amber Micheals


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## v12xjs (Mar 21, 2009)

OK. Here's a few shots of Pandora so you can see how she got started.
I laid her roots down along the top of the pot and covered them over with soil. In the 2nd pic you can see the long gaps between nodes compared to Granita.


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## v12xjs (Mar 21, 2009)

Here's the latest ones. The top is still a bit stretchy so the last pic shows her tied down level with the rest of the canopy. It may need a tweek here or there but that should be how she will look when she finishes.


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## floridasucks (Mar 22, 2009)

damm v12 you are the pc master. keep the updates coming, its looking insane in there. jungle status...


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## Cheeese (Mar 22, 2009)

best pc grow ive seen by far. keep us updated.


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## ElephantRider (Mar 22, 2009)

Bravo! That's a crazy strain! What strain is Jr. again?


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## needhelp (Mar 22, 2009)

what side of the aluminum foil are you using


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## v12xjs (Mar 23, 2009)

Thanks for the all the positive comments guys.
Hey ER. Pandora, Junior and Amber are all CH9 Jack. I think Junior would look like Pandora if I had got her into a decent pot before she began flowering, but she matured far faster than I expected. My mistake 
Greets needhelp
I use mylar but don't buy it in sheets. In UK most crisps/potato chips come in mylar bags and the multipack outers are also mylar. These are a great size for doing a pc case door and I get the contents for my munchies 

Here's a couple of pics from last night. Pandora was still stretching but I pulled the top down again and I think she's got the message. The leaves are much tighter packed at the tops now and with 14 tops or more, any growth will be very minimal.
I made Junior do the splits too. I was going to let her grow a single cola which would have looked very cute but if she's taking up a full sized pot them she can at least try to fill it. Got a first shot of Amber too.


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## SketzoH (Mar 23, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Thanks for the all the positive comments guys.
> Hey ER. Pandora, Junior and Amber are all CH9 Jack. I think Junior would look like Pandora if I had got her into a decent pot before she began flowering, but she matured far faster than I expected. My mistake
> Greets needhelp
> I use mylar but don't buy it in sheets. In UK most crisps/potato chips come in mylar bags and the multipack outers are also mylar. These are a great size for doing a pc case door and I get the contents for my munchies
> ...


 lol i used crisp packets too for my pc! 
there looking fantastic as always dude


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## needhelp (Mar 23, 2009)

ha....genius...

potato chip bags..haha....damn, i guess i have to figure out another way....


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## UberSmoker (Mar 23, 2009)

Dude I wish I knew the crisp thing before, that is really handy.


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## v12xjs (Mar 23, 2009)

Just try not to use Walkers bags. You don't want Gary Lineker showing up in your grow!


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## UberSmoker (Mar 23, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Just try not to use Walkers bags. You don't want Gary Lineker showing up in your grow!


Hahahaha yeah right, that cracked me up.

P.S Why are they called Lays everywhere else?


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## v12xjs (Mar 24, 2009)

Lay's is probably far too smutty for the English censors to approve of. We're just lucky they don't know what a 9 bar is yet 

Couple of pics from last night to keep you guys up to speed. An aeriel shot to show all those tops and a group shot taken just after they had dinner. Anyone else notice that plants really smell just after they have been watered?


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## needhelp (Mar 24, 2009)

that bag idea is great.... just looked inside a big bag of Cheeto's...i think its what i need...thanx man


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## ElephantRider (Mar 24, 2009)

Dude.. your pictures make me soo happy.


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## v12xjs (Mar 25, 2009)

ElephantRider said:


> Dude.. your pictures make me soo happy.


LOL 

More pics then?
Got another family shot and also the first bud porn


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## v12xjs (Mar 27, 2009)

A few more pics. Pandora is starting to put out now. Due to the number of tops, I only want about 1g per cola to make up the 21g I'm after and with just under a month to go I'm confident she'll get there.
It's cards night tonight, so to bring me luck there's a picture of 3 Jacks 
I spotted the first bit of ice on the leaves too last night, so there's one of that leaf, plus a profile and some mandatory bud porn.
Enjoy.


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## ElephantRider (Mar 27, 2009)

beautiful, m8!


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## worm5376 (Mar 27, 2009)

Look at the canopy on that naughty girl Very well done.


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## ElephantRider (Mar 27, 2009)

so, hey, man.. how often do you generally harvest? Every few weeks?


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## v12xjs (Mar 28, 2009)

Cheers Guys 
The idea is to harvest 21g every 3 weeks. Mother Nature isn't quite that punctual or productive sometimes though


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## worm5376 (Mar 28, 2009)

do you think you could get a 70 watt hps in there? You could probablt make a tiny cooltube for it. that would be bad ass for a pc grow.


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## floridasucks (Mar 29, 2009)

lookin great as always v12... ive been out for a while cause ive been really fuked up for a while.. dam drug rampages!!


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## v12xjs (Mar 29, 2009)

Hey worm
I used to have a 70w hps in there before the envirolite. I could never really make it pay though. They are like the cfl's as you need to be within a few inches of the bulb, but the bulb is a small round thing and I could never get enough plant in the zone to make it worthwhile. A couple of 70's would be killer in a pc case but I don't think I could keep it cool enough.

Greets fs
Wondered where you got to. Hope you got things under control. PM me if you ever need a kind word or a rant.


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## v12xjs (Mar 29, 2009)

Got this week's episode of Pandora's Box 

The canopy has been getting a bit wonky and some stuff is getting pushed under, but I hate clipping leaves off so I decided to replace the 2 ties with some new ones, just to get a few more colas into the canopy. It turns out Pandora is one fat moma! Just check out some pics of the middle aged spread she's got going on 
I'm harvesting the Indica tonight and with SketzoH jnr being so tiny, there's probably room to leave Pandora like she is now right through to harvest. She has only 3 weeks left so it shouldn't be a problem. I'll have to see what space there is when Amber moves up to a big pot.
That reminds me, I forgot to put one in for germination. Gotta go 
Here's the pics..


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## worm5376 (Mar 29, 2009)

floridasucks said:


> lookin great as always v12... ive been out for a while cause ive been really fuked up for a while.. dam drug rampages!!


 
loL Welcome back did you vissit snow white? lol


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## ElephantRider (Mar 29, 2009)

Lookin' badass as always! What's that massive bud in pic3? To the right of Pandora? And.. there's a porn star named pandora?


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## dopewear (Mar 29, 2009)

oh v12 all mighty pc grower, i seek your knowledge. when you you start to counting flowering time? when you turn your light schedule over or when you see your first flower? like what tells you its in true flowering stage and can start counting down your 8 weeks? thanks


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## v12xjs (Mar 30, 2009)

Hey worm. PMSL 

Did you forget about that indica ER?
It was another seedswap I planted 2 weeks after Granita while I was still saving cash for some feminised seeds. It was the only feminised seed I could blag at the time so I grew it out even though I was told it's a pure indica strain.
I meant to pull it down last night and transfer Amber into the vacated pot but I didn't have enough privacy to do the deed.
For info, the seed is a few years old and is called Amstel Gold. I can't find anyone selling it anymore so there's not much info on it but it has a powerful lemon/citrus aroma. It's looking like I'll get one nice cola a bit bigger than Granita's big top.


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## v12xjs (Mar 30, 2009)

dopewear said:


> oh v12 all mighty pc grower, i seek your knowledge. when you you start to counting flowering time? when you turn your light schedule over or when you see your first flower? like what tells you its in true flowering stage and can start counting down your 8 weeks? thanks


Dunno about mighty. Any time I get high I pmsl at the whole idea of pc grows. I think I must be crazy 

I never really got a good answer about preflowers from anyone I asked. Everyone says something different. Personally I consider the first single flower I see on the main stem to be a preflower and from then I look for hairs in the main top. Once the main top contains hairs I consider the plant to be in flower and start my countdown.


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## v12xjs (Mar 30, 2009)

Quick pictorial update too. I still need a day or 2 to level out the canopy before I tie Pandora (that's Pandora Peaks ER) back up, but I took a snap of her sreading her wings last night and the plant just looks really nice and healthy so I thought you may want to see.
For scale, she's almost touching mylar at each end and she is touching both sides so that's around 18 inches wide and 9 inches deep.
It snowed again last night too


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## ElephantRider (Mar 30, 2009)

That indica looks ridiculous!  It's like someone just tossed a massive nug in dirt! 
So.. how many budsites you got there? Looks like a shit-ton!


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## worm5376 (Mar 30, 2009)

Whatsup v12? I'm sure you've answered this but how big is your PC case?


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## HeC (Mar 30, 2009)

awesome thread, im hoping to start my PC build soon

worm his case size was mentioned, i just read the entire thread in hte last 2 days and off teh top of my head i believe it was 20x18x8

*subscribed!*


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## Neph (Mar 31, 2009)

Seeing Pandora looking all pretty in flowering makes me anxious too see my baby get there. V12 you are like the P.C. Grow Guru. Keep up the good work.


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## floridasucks (Mar 31, 2009)

worm5376 said:


> loL Welcome back did you vissit snow white? lol


hahah oh yea man.. and the seven dwarfs. 

im chillen on that stuff now though, it gets way out of control fast. especially in miami- the cocaine capital!!


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## floridasucks (Mar 31, 2009)

hey v12 the plants are out of control.. beautiful stuff man. keep it up!


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## v12xjs (Mar 31, 2009)

Hey ER
The indica does look a bit funny 
Roots are really small on her. I think she's only had about 7 drinks of water in her whole life. She has a fine smell, kind of like fresh lemons with lots of vodka 
She's above 30% amber now and ready to chop but I've not had the privacy to do it. Maybe tonight.
I whipped pandora back into shape last night so she's got around 12 good good little colas. It's time I stopped messing and let them just grow.

Welcome HeC
Thanks for the props & helping out worm. I hope reading this stuff has helped you. Good luck with your grow.

Cheers Neph and Greets fs. Got your camera charged yet?


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## floridasucks (Mar 31, 2009)

dam things happen fast, your almost ready to chop another one.. awsome.

ya man i got new pics in querkle thread.


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## dopewear (Mar 31, 2009)

ever time i look at this thread i get excited! keep it up dude


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## worm5376 (Mar 31, 2009)

this PC CASE is producing big time..


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## floridasucks (Mar 31, 2009)

worm5376 said:


> this PC CASE is producing big time..


hell yea.... v12 is the PCgrow master.


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## v12xjs (Apr 1, 2009)

Hey Thanks you guys, but you are all easily pleased. I'm totally embarassed with that indica. It's such a wuss!
I knew it would be teeny from day 1 but it still doesn't make me proud 
As long as it smokes I guess it will do, but Pandora is the girl for me.

Got 2 updates for you guys today. A smoke report on Granita and a couple of pics of Pandora all trussed up again.

Smoke report is all good. I like something that knocks me down and gets me thinking creatively but Granita was pulled a bit too early for that. Instead I have been very active but totally stoned at the same time. The taste is creamy and very smooth. There's a nice vanilla flavour on the roof of my mouth too.
The hit kicked in after around 10 minutes and just got stronger and stronger for about 2 hours with a nice comedown that takes another 30 minutes or so and no fatigue or tiredness at the end.
Topping up just made the hit stronger so by bedtime last night I was totally mashed 
All in all a good result 

Here's the pics of Pandora. Got her back in the chains and she fits in the case as she should once more. The tops are starting to ice up a bit and she's putting out a nice perfume now too.
You may also notice the new fan I fitted. I was running ok last summer but as I've added the little blue cfl lamp now, I think the temps will get too hot soon so I've taken action before it affects the crop. I only had the zalman fan that would fit but temps have dropped to 77.7 within a few mm of the bulb and with the outside temp at 72.5, it's looking good for the summer.
Enough babbling, here's the pics:


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## dsn (Apr 1, 2009)

What are Your plans on futue? Will You stay with pc case or try in larger cab?


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## ElephantRider (Apr 1, 2009)

Hate to ask, bro.. can we get a quick snap of the indica?


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## v12xjs (Apr 1, 2009)

I knew you'd want a pic ER 
Here's a couple:


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## v12xjs (Apr 1, 2009)

dsn said:


> What are Your plans on futue? Will You stay with pc case or try in larger cab?


Hey dsn

I've done some really big grows in the past but I hate dealing and don't need much for myself these days so I'm happy sticking with the pc case.
I love a challenge though, so there's a few ideas buzzing round my head just now. I really wanted to get a spider in there like floridasucks cos that's just sooo cool, but I need it to produce weed all day every day and I couldn't balance the needs of my plants with the needs of a spider in the same case, so I've put that on the backburner.
I have a nice P4 core2 duo laptop with some burn damage that made it real cheap now, so hooking that up inside the case is on the agenda.
I also thought about those 12v wind up torches the other day too. It seems that if I took one apart then I would get a charging system and compatible battery plus some pre connected LEDS that could be changed for more suitable growing LEDS. Add a bigger battery and maybe a 12v solar panel and I could grow for free. I'm sure I'll have a torch in bits on the table in the next few days


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## ElephantRider (Apr 1, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> I knew you'd want a pic ER
> Here's a couple:


Thank you SOOOOOO much, man. I know it's ugly, (WHERE THE HELL ARE THE LEAVES!?) but it gives me some hope for my grow. My plants are tiny and slow as balls. I was reading a bit more about Citral last night.. not uncommon for it to be fully done @ 18" even outside! So.. this thing is a serious dwarf! And also known to grow slow. Odd. I'm imagining that's what mine will end up looking like, since they seem to not be growing vertically at all.


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## v12xjs (Apr 1, 2009)

Funny thing is that I toasted the leaves trying to find out how long I could leave it without watering. The answer was a day less than I thought so all the leaves took one for the team


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## ElephantRider (Apr 1, 2009)

That cola's big as balls, though. Wonder what the yield on that guy will be.  10g total out of that guy, maybe?


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## floridasucks (Apr 1, 2009)

hey good idea with a solar panel v12.


i missed out on what happend to that indica, want to fill me in? it still looks somewhat smokeable or you could hash it.


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## arcticvapors (Apr 1, 2009)

hey v12...i dont see apic of your lighting setup (well, except for that 16watter you got hanging by the fans)...i'd like to see the lighting area. I still cant get over how low your temps stay in the pc when I cant get my temps that low (although as you saw in my thread, I do have carbon filter son my exhaust fans which is prolly killing their CFM bvalues and as they are low to begin with...) anyways, would love a pic o fthe light arrangement...and great grow!! 

My girl is doing great, LST'ed and quite a few bud sites...my temps hover around mid 80s since I re-sorted my pc case. i've got another bag seed plant at 23 days of 12/12 and waiting to show sex...fingers are crossed...which makes it real hard to type!

peace


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## v12xjs (Apr 1, 2009)

9 - 10g is my guess too ER. That's a good eye you have there 

Hey fs
The solar panel has to be investigated. I think you can get a ballast and HID on 12v too that would kick ass. They are the HID upgrades you see on pimped out cars. They do 6500k for sure and I think they do 3000k.

Not much of a story to the indica. I always use feminised seeds but got a duff batch before Christmas. I only found out when I got balls in the case. Twice!
I only had 1 dodgy seed left and no money so I traded the seed for the seed that produced Granita and did another deal to get the indica seed. Both were feminised so I planted them until I could get some money together and get myself back on track. From experience I knew the indica wouldn't do well for me but a bit is better than nothing and it gave me time to save for my Jack seeds. I think I mentioned it at the time I planted it and called it at 10g max even then. I'm like ER in that respect


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## v12xjs (Apr 1, 2009)

Hey arcticvapors
There's a pic in the journal that might help:
https://www.rollitup.org/attachments/grow-journals/334528d1235389229-pc-case-grow-stealth-perpetual-day67-23febtwinturbo.jpg

You can see half of the 125w envirolite and the 80mm fan that pushes air out through the middle of the tube. The fan below it is the 60mm I replaced yesterday. It's a 92mm unit now.
Don't forget that I also use a fan on either side of the carbon filter which increases flow a bit.


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## arcticvapors (Apr 1, 2009)

thats right...you use the envirolight...forgot about that. and no cooltube, just the fan blowing inline with the bulb...cool (no pun intended). i didn't think that the double fan arrangement around the carbon filter would work...i may try that in my pc case...although temps are good right now so i may not need too. my other case, a server tower that I bought off ebay, has tremendous heat issues...but that's a whole 'nother story i dont want to hijack your thread...thanks for the info and peace!


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## v12xjs (Apr 1, 2009)

No sweat fella.
I'll keep an eye on your thread. Just post up any q's there and I'll pick them up.


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## worm5376 (Apr 1, 2009)

Looking good. I have 2 8k HID's that would be the wrong spectrum for veg as they normaly like 6500 for veg. correct?. also vapo.. who did you buy your pc from on ebay? i bought one from there and it has heat issues left and right would it be a company named softbytes out of hollywood?


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## arcticvapors (Apr 1, 2009)

no, sorry, perhaps i wasn;t clear. i bought just a plain old server tower...not a customised pc grow box...i do the work myself. i'm still working on this particular box, so I'll solve the heat prob eventually...


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## v12xjs (Apr 2, 2009)

Hey worm
I think you may need to change to 6500k bulbs but they should work with the rest of the kit. I've not looked at the car kits in detail but I like the idea of a 12v system so i'll try and pick one up from a breakers yard soon.


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## worm5376 (Apr 2, 2009)

yeah i bought the bulbs & ballast a few years back for a car i had but i nevver installed them. just hoping i can put them to use.


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## Carpe Diam (Apr 3, 2009)

This is the first time I have seen such witchcraft.... Nice job... could you discribe your system...


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## Neph (Apr 3, 2009)

V12 I would be happy to get a letting nug plant like your inda, but then again I'm happy just keeping mine alive. Pandora is looking nice. Like I said you are the P.C. Guru.


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## v12xjs (Apr 3, 2009)

worm5376 said:


> yeah i bought the bulbs & ballast a few years back for a car i had but i nevver installed them. just hoping i can put them to use.


Pimp!

A bit of looking around and they don't seem to go down to 2700k. 3000k seems about the lowest but that's halogen and I've used it before. It runs very hot even if the ballast is separate. I'll do a bit more research and let you know the score, but the 6500k units should still be fine.


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## v12xjs (Apr 3, 2009)

Carpe Diam said:


> This is the first time I have seen such witchcraft.... Nice job... could you discribe your system...


Thanks Carpe Diam

I suppose I'd describe it as a 12/12 from seed cfl perpetual pc case grow.
I guess that's not really what you want though. Best bet is to read the thread. There's a couple of hundred pics with full explanations that document 2 different grows from seedling to harvest including lighting, odour control, light proofing and training. All questions that have arisen have been fully answered. You should find what you want if you look.


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## v12xjs (Apr 3, 2009)

Neph said:


> V12 I would be happy to get a letting nug plant like your inda, but then again I'm happy just keeping mine alive. Pandora is looking nice. Like I said you are the P.C. Guru.


Thanks mate.
Sounds like I'm a bit of a snob really doesn't it?
I'll quit whining and be thankful for what I've got


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## Neph (Apr 3, 2009)

Hey you called it at ten grams when your started the inda, and you've ended with about ten grams you say. So you grew it good. Genetics play a role, you can't do anything about that.


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## worm5376 (Apr 3, 2009)

[email protected] PIMP! lol

I


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## worm5376 (Apr 3, 2009)

dont know how i sent that message above. anywayslol

I just spliced the ballast to a 14 volt dc trans and it flickers but doesn't stay on. wonder what it could be?


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## v12xjs (Apr 3, 2009)

Love the R & D worm 

Maybe the lamps are drawing too much current from the power source. At 35watts they will need 3 amps each. I guess you tried just using 1 bulb so it sounds like more juice is needed. A charged battery should get you a couple of hours.

I bet some of the old lights at the breakers could be used for decent reflectors too.


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## worm5376 (Apr 3, 2009)

what does R & D mean? I know thats prolly a dumb question. 

you think thats what the problem could be? actualy sounds right. gotta look for another adapter to cut =x One with more juice. Destruction is the path to happy plants =]


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## ElephantRider (Apr 3, 2009)

R & D == Research & Development.


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## floridasucks (Apr 3, 2009)

ElephantRider said:


> R & D == Research & Development.


hah.. yesss sirrrrr.


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## worm5376 (Apr 3, 2009)

sometimes i wonder about my poor wittle brain... but then again it's too small to wonder =/


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## Carpe Diam (Apr 4, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Thanks Carpe Diam
> 
> I suppose I'd describe it as a 12/12 from seed cfl perpetual pc case grow.
> I guess that's not really what you want though. Best bet is to read the thread. There's a couple of hundred pics with full explanations that document 2 different grows from seedling to harvest including lighting, odour control, light proofing and training. All questions that have arisen have been fully answered. You should find what you want if you look.


I have just finished reading your entire thread, and infact, you did answer my question, thank you very much. 
I am new to the using a forum. Any forum. I read the first page and did not realize there were more to the thread. I know, where have I been! Point being, my question showed up 45 pages past the point I was asking about. (Just wanted to explain) I also would like to say thank you for the inspiration..... You have done an excellent job with what you have to work with... Since I began reading your story my mind has been racing... Just trying to think of some household item that I could use as a limmiting factor. One in which I could begin a romance such as the one I was reading about....
That little box will teach you a lot about life... Thanks for taking the time to share, there is nothing more expensive than ignorance.... and you have saved me a fortune....


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## floridasucks (Apr 4, 2009)

welcome to RIU Carpe Diam.


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## dopewear (Apr 4, 2009)

Welcome to RIU Carpe Diam


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## v12xjs (Apr 4, 2009)

worm5376 said:


> what does R & D mean? I know thats prolly a dumb question.
> 
> you think thats what the problem could be? actualy sounds right. gotta look for another adapter to cut =x One with more juice. Destruction is the path to happy plants =]


Amps are important. If you use 1 x 35w bulb in a 12v setup then you need 3 amps. With both bulbs in it's 6 amp.
If you have a car battery charger then that might do it. They output to 12v and have crocodile clips to make connections easy. It should also say on it how many amps it can put out.


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## v12xjs (Apr 4, 2009)

Carpe Diam said:


> I have just finished reading your entire thread, and infact, you did answer my question, thank you very much.
> I am new to the using a forum. Any forum. I read the first page and did not realize there were more to the thread. I know, where have I been! Point being, my question showed up 45 pages past the point I was asking about. (Just wanted to explain) I also would like to say thank you for the inspiration..... You have done an excellent job with what you have to work with... Since I began reading your story my mind has been racing... Just trying to think of some household item that I could use as a limmiting factor. One in which I could begin a romance such as the one I was reading about....
> That little box will teach you a lot about life... Thanks for taking the time to share, there is nothing more expensive than ignorance.... and you have saved me a fortune....


 
Glad you got the answer and thank you for the lovely sentiment. I also offer my apologies for the mild attack of sarcasm. I have grown a little tired of all the mails asking me how I do it when all the info is right here.

I'm loving your use of the term romance too  Never thought of it like that.

Sieze the moment indeed. And the kitchen utensils!
Good luck.


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## v12xjs (Apr 4, 2009)

Sorry I've been quiet on updates. Had another late night again last night but I stuck my head in to check on the girls and got a few pics. 2 of Pandora and 1 of Amber in the training harness.


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## floridasucks (Apr 4, 2009)

how many days flowering is pandora at? they both look great.

i know you already said this but im to lazy to look for it. what are those containers from? where did u get them?


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## dopewear (Apr 4, 2009)

hey florida those containers you can get from walmart people use them for putting try pasts in and cereal all sorts of shit. some even grow dope in it...


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## floridasucks (Apr 4, 2009)

dopewear said:


> hey florida those containers you can get from walmart people use them for putting try pasts in and cereal all sorts of shit. some even grow dope in it...


hey dope thanx for the info...


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## v12xjs (Apr 6, 2009)

Cheers DW. If Walmart say it has many uses then I'm the kind of guy that will test the claim to the limit 

Hey fs. Pandora has just gone to sleep on day 29 of flowering, so 3 weeks left. Sunday 26th April is the planned date for her chop.
Here's a couple of pictures from earlier:


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## v12xjs (Apr 6, 2009)

Just a quick off topic shout to UK smokers with a soft spot for nice black. 3 different people have told me they would have some Afghani black for sale soon. It sounds like there will be plenty around and I'm told it's a very nice smoke. Hope you all get some. Happy toking


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## UberSmoker (Apr 6, 2009)

Haven't had black for years, hope I get mine.


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## v12xjs (Apr 6, 2009)

Hey Uber
Think there will be plenty for everyone. Just hope it's really what it says on the tin!

Just looked in on the girls and Pandora seemed to like yesterday's waterboard torture! Here's a couple of pics that show how much she's grown overnight. Oh baby 
The 2nd pic is the main cola and it doesn't show just how big it is because it's bent right down. It's probably 5 inches and it's getting fatter all the time!
There's a new kid on the block too, so a family pic is included. Four of a kind, all the Jacks. I win


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## worm5376 (Apr 6, 2009)

sweet looking buds forming there man. they're getting so big. It's kinda like watching your kid grow up sept you gonna smoke it loL



quote=v12xjs;2337632]Hey Uber
Think there will be plenty for everyone. Just hope it's really what it says on the tin!

Just looked in on the girls and Pandora seemed to like yesterday's waterboard torture! Here's a couple of pics that show how much she's grown overnight. Oh baby 
The 2nd pic is the main cola and it doesn't show just how big it is because it's bent right down. It's probably 5 inches and it's getting fatter all the time!
There's a new kid on the block too, so a family pic is included. Four of a kind, all the Jacks. I win [/quote]


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## dopewear (Apr 6, 2009)

v12 those buds look amazing man mine are on the slow and steady pace of getting there. cheers


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## ElephantRider (Apr 7, 2009)

Your plants rock, man. Holy hell, you're good at this!


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## dopewear (Apr 7, 2009)

ElephantRider said:


> Your plants rock, man. Holy hell, you're good at this!


ill have to agree with ele you are the pc grow god.


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## floridasucks (Apr 7, 2009)

hey v12 did you ever put up a pic of granita dried?


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## v12xjs (Apr 7, 2009)

Hey ER & DW. Pack it in!
I've nicked everything from proper clever people. LST, Mr Micro's Nanomachine, Hal's 12/12 from seed and loads of other stuff. They are the guru's.

Greets fs
I never really took any snaps of the final crop other than what I posted. Most of them were less than 2g. I was a bit embarassed TBH.

Been really giddy with Granita and a bit of that lemon indica tonight 
Looked in the cab and Pandora looks mighty fine. She's very hairy for a girl Also got my comics back today 
See:


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## dopewear (Apr 8, 2009)

hey v12 those buds look amazing and those comics look funny to read!


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## ElephantRider (Apr 8, 2009)

Nothing to be embarassed about, if you ask me. What did your final granita yield end up? More importantly, how was the smoke? And the smoke on that crazy ass indica?? By the way, that indica looks a lot like the citral grow pics I've seen.. not leafy.. all bud.. and lemony. That about it? I looked at your last update a second time yesterday showing a couple buddies and noticed it was gone. When did that happen? And.. 10g?? 

Sorry, mon frer.. I loved that indica.


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## v12xjs (Apr 8, 2009)

The final tally on Granita was 20g of fully manicured dry bud. Very sticky and a really nice smooth smoke. A bit energetic for my taste but still potent. I never weighed the indica but it was bigger than a 7g bag. It looks and tastes as you say, very lemon with hardly any foliage. All my mates went mad for it so there's not much left. I think I took it down about 10 days ago but it's sooo nice I can't keep my hands off it 
Here's what they both look like right now:


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## ElephantRider (Apr 8, 2009)

Holy hell, man.. I'd bet it's Citral. Do you know what strain or pure mystery? If you're bored, do a google images search on Citral. It looks like a massive lowryder when grown outside, even. One donkey-dick bud and a couple sattellites. That'd be funny as hell if we were growin' the same bud.


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## v12xjs (Apr 8, 2009)

It does look and sound pretty similar doesn't it?
I was told it was Amstel Gold but the leaves didn't look especially like a pure indica so I really don't know for sure.
It kicks ass though 
Hope the citral does the same.


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## ElephantRider (Apr 8, 2009)

Ahhh.. Passion #1 is its other name. I had looked into that as a possibility for my initial grow. They are very similar, it seems..


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## worm5376 (Apr 8, 2009)

that plant looks so nice Lots of buds forming. 

It's about time you got those comics back!




v12xjs said:


> Hey ER & DW. Pack it in!
> I've nicked everything from proper clever people. LST, Mr Micro's Nanomachine, Hal's 12/12 from seed and loads of other stuff. They are the guru's.
> 
> Greets fs
> ...


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## v12xjs (Apr 8, 2009)

Thanks worm. I couldn't have got them back without your helpful kick up my ass.
Some rep coming your way for that


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## stickyfingerz (Apr 8, 2009)

nice grow man


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## v12xjs (Apr 9, 2009)

Hi & thanks stickyfingerz. Glad you like it.

Here's another update from last night. Got a pic of all the girls. The newbie is called Veronica in honour of Veronica Zemanova.
Enjoy:


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## ElephantRider (Apr 9, 2009)

Pandora rocks!

Hey.. when you harvest, what do your roots look like? Are they taking up the whole container pretty well or are they a bit smaller?

Also.. what wattage are you at total? I'm trying to gauge my own potential based on your specs.


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## v12xjs (Apr 9, 2009)

Hey ER
The roots are hardcore after a grow. No soil drops until I shake the mass vigorously. There's no big coiled root around the bottom though and to me that's the surefire sign of being rootbound, so I think you can just do it in 1 litre.

With the blue light I'm running 125w @ 2700K, 12w @ 6500K and about 15 w of fans, so 137w of light and around 150w all in.


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## ElephantRider (Apr 10, 2009)

So I should be lighter than you. I need more watts.


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## v12xjs (Apr 11, 2009)

It's a fine balance between heat and light. I ordered a plexiglass sheet yesterday as I don't know what effect the extra 12w blue light will have on temps and I want to keep everything going through the summer again.

Got a few pics last night too.
Quick update on Pandora. I've had some problems with privacy again and it was easier to just add some bud bulk (coolbloom) to water in my room. I don't think Pandora liked it much and some of her leaves turned a bit yellow. I managed to mix up the right recipe yesterday so she's had a good feed now but I'm just a little concerned that she starts her flush on Monday. Hopefully she'll be fine.
There's a couple of shots of SketzoH junior. 2nd pic is just a crop of the 1st. She's only little but she's coming along nicely and she stinks the place out as much as Pandora


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## dopewear (Apr 11, 2009)

hey v12 she truely is thing of beauty! where did you get your plexiglass from?


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## v12xjs (Apr 11, 2009)

Cheers DW. 

I got the plexi from fleabay. Here's the link i used:
http://stores.shop.ebay.co.uk/The-Wholesale-POS-Co-2009__W0QQ_armrsZ1QQ_fsubZ650724011

I just mailed and asked for my specific size. It was around £3.50 including delivery. Should be something similar on the US site.


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## Teddstah (Apr 11, 2009)

Wow man. Insane grow. So envious. 

I'll work hard on mine to get into a great position like you are now.


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## v12xjs (Apr 11, 2009)

Thanks Teddstah.
You'll get there. If I can do it anyone can.


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## floridasucks (Apr 11, 2009)

awsome pics v12 she looks great! ...what does she smell like?


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## worm5376 (Apr 12, 2009)

So what , now your gonna fit the top with plexiglass to lower temps or keep them in range? Nice to know you can order from ebay. I wouldn't have thought of that. You the man V!!!


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## v12xjs (Apr 12, 2009)

Hey Florida. The case smells wonderful at the mo. Not strong enough to leak through the filter yet so maybe not quite as pungent as Granita. I'd describe it as deep and heavy with a faint smell of fuel.

Yo worm. You're too lazy man 
I'm aiming to split the case in 2 parts. I have a fan at the front of the light and I've opened up where the psu used to go and fitted a fan there too. I was going to get some of the rubber seal from a car window at the breakers yard to surround the acrylic and if it's sealed correctly then I won't need any odour control in that area, so the fans will be more effective and should keep the light much cooler than it is at present.
If the plans works out then I will only need minimal intake / exhaust in the lower area.
I should have the sheet by next weekend. I'll take some pics so you guys can see how it looks.


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## worm5376 (Apr 12, 2009)

I am a bit lazy , part due to the  loL but yeah man , I'm gutting out a small PC case 2morrow and start fitting it. I still haven't another dc adapter i could splice to those hid bulbs but i'm working on it. we'll see how it goes. 

PS
Happy Easter !!


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## v12xjs (Apr 12, 2009)

Hey worm
You know I was kidding. Great to hear you're gutting your case. Follow ElephantRider's guidance if you can find it in here. It's sterling advice. If you think I can help with anything just ask.
I'm working on the 12v hid's too but they need a lot of current so I'm also stuck on a psu. It's prolly easiest to go with cfl's to start. I'll let you know if I make a breakthrough with them.
And thanks. I wish you and yours a happy Easter also (belatedly).
Want to know something really crazy? I rang my brother today to wish him a happy Easter. He's in Bulgaria and it isn't Easter until next Sunday! WTF?
I thought there was only a 2 hour difference


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## v12xjs (Apr 12, 2009)

Just had a peek in there as I'm still a bit worried about Pandora. I'm happy to say that she's all perky and she looks really well now but I'm pretty sure I've set her back a bit. Got some pics and you can see odd problems here and there that don't look right. Lesson learned. Don't feed them pure bud builder.
Got 4 pics and you can see some of the damage: 1st pic you can clearly see a brown spot at the bud end of the leaf pointing to 9pm. The leaves that did that were all a bit pale too but luckily they've all got their colour back now. You can see it on the tallest bud in the 2nd pic too but again it seems to have recovered and they've grown a bit too. A couple of the shaders went a bit rusty too. You can see one of them at the bottom right of this pic.3rd pic is just a parody of the movie Day of the Triffids  
Those front buds are bald because they are against the side of the case so they don't get any light. If I turn the pot around they are up against the other side so they still get none. I can switch the 2 flanks so they get light alternate days and fatten up ok but not the ends. maybe you guys can improve on this in your systems.
Last pic is Amber at 27 days. Just to show once again how I start these things off. She should be showing me a female flower in the next day or 2. Hell, there may be one there now! I'll have a closer look later.


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## floridasucks (Apr 12, 2009)

she still looks good... how much longer you think?


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## dopewear (Apr 12, 2009)

v they look great! i dont no how mine is going to look remotely close to amber 7 days from now, i guess your just the pc case god.


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## v12xjs (Apr 13, 2009)

Hey florida. She's should be on her flush from today, finishing in 14 days but I may give her one more feed tomorrow. I'll use the trichs to give me the exact day but I've only seen one amber trich so far.

Yo DW. I'll post up in your journal in a mo. You can't have Amber but I reckon we can get your girls looking just the same


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## Neph (Apr 13, 2009)

Man Pandora is coming around nicely. Amber is only at 27 days? Esme is at 36 and doesn't look like that. Now I'm worried my plants are stunted.


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## v12xjs (Apr 13, 2009)

Hey Neph
Amber is 4 weeks today. Like Esme there's still no sign of preflowers yet but I think we should both expect good news in the next few days.
I keep getting mixed up with the other pc grow journals but I'll read your whole journal again later and see if there's any pointers I can give you if that's ok.


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## Neph (Apr 13, 2009)

That's refreshing to hear, about the pre-flowers, and any pointers on my grow would be appreciated.


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## v12xjs (Apr 13, 2009)

Watered the girls this morning and there's a faint whiff of bud in my room now getting through the filter which I think will get stronger as Pandora fattens up, so I'm going to brew some hooch in there to cover it up.
Don't know if any of you guys like cider or scrumpy but an old timer gave me his recipe once and it's really easy to do.
It's just apples, raisins and water so it's dirt cheap too. Looks like homegrown plus homebrew for me this summer 
Let me know if any of you fancy a crack at it and I'll do some simple instructions.


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## ElephantRider (Apr 13, 2009)

LOL. I brew my own beer, too. No cider just yet. Just beer and mead, to date. Brewing an IPA will cover your smell right quick, man. Hop smell blows pot away.


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## v12xjs (Apr 13, 2009)

You do mead? Wow.
I love a nice homebrewed IPA. Sometimes when they are in season I swap the apples in my cider recipe for pears and make a Perry. You ever tried that? It's wonderful stuff. Kind of like alcopop for grown ups


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## ElephantRider (Apr 13, 2009)

Hah! A buddy of mine made perry recently, but I didn't try it. I hear its wonderful stuff..


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## v12xjs (Apr 13, 2009)

You gotta try some next time. After Becks it's my favourite tipple.


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## ElephantRider (Apr 14, 2009)

Shit.. if I can find some pear juice, I'm in!


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## v12xjs (Apr 14, 2009)

You won't be disappointed mate 

Good news from Last night. Amber turned out her first flower 
Pandora is looking all rosy again thank goodness. She's still a bit lean but I'm sure she'll put a bit of weight on soon. Here's some pics:


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## Neph (Apr 14, 2009)

Congrats on Amber and her first flower. Pandora is looking good. I can't wait to see all those buds fatten up.


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## v12xjs (Apr 14, 2009)

Thanks Neph. It's looking promising for sure.


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## ElephantRider (Apr 14, 2009)

Oy! How soon 'till Pandora gets the axe?


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## v12xjs (Apr 14, 2009)

A week on Sunday is the date I have penciled in the diary for Pandora. A couple of days either way is ok, so I'll be guided by the trichoscope 
The seed info says it's cool to smoke after 7 days drying, so I'm going to hang it instead of using the dryer and jar method this time.


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## dopewear (Apr 15, 2009)

pandora looks amazing V. Amber shall be another beauty!


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## v12xjs (Apr 15, 2009)

Cheers DW.
Pandora's just started putting on the weight. At lights out this morning I could see the difference just overnight 
Amber is going the right way but I think she will be a little different to Pandora. The leaves are definitely more rounded and shorter. Bud is bud though and as long as she shows me the money I'll be happy.

Every time I see your sig I pmsl at the quote from yoyogrow  Truly funny.


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## dopewear (Apr 15, 2009)

yah i think i laughed endlessly when he said that in his video grow journal. thanks for the humidity idea work great. already put an update up.


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## v12xjs (Apr 15, 2009)

dopewear said:


> yah i think i laughed endlessly when he said that in his video grow journal. thanks for the humidity idea work great. already put an update up.


I might have to stop giving you guys all my tips or I think you're all going to outshine me!


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## ElephantRider (Apr 15, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> I might have to stop giving you guys all my tips or I think you're all going to outshine me!


Please, no?


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## dopewear (Apr 15, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> I might have to stop giving you guys all my tips or I think you're all going to outshine me!


if thats the case should i get rid of my case now or later? please never stop giving advice


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## v12xjs (Apr 15, 2009)

I didn't intend to be around here this long to be truthful. 
Don't fret though. I kind of like it here. There's some very good company and the site seems to support genuine freedom of speech which is incredibly rare and something in which I strongly believe.
And until I get another job I have naff all else to do.


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## ElephantRider (Apr 15, 2009)

I'm thinking I'm out when Beatrice gets razed, to be honest. I'm sure I'll pop back in for advice and questions if I have any, but I feel like I've gotten past the "dumbass" stage and can figure stuff out a bit by trying things or searching the FAQs / Forums. Also, since this server is physically in the US (figured out by career skills), I am not willing to post yields and things like that, as the US government could easily confiscate the server from the owners of the rollitup.org domain with a simple warrant. That's not an issue for you UK blokes, etc., but for me, it is. I'll be forced to do the whole, "Yeah.. all my plants died from fungal infection the day before I harvested, but if I'd harvested, it'd look like this!" That kinda blows.

I, for one, appreciate your willingness to stick out Pandora, since it really helped me figure out how I want to run my own perpetual or what I can move to if my concept fails. I tend to agree with you that the 6 cup thing could get hairy.. especially if this growth rate keeps up! Moreso when I've had my clones vegging for 2+ months while their parents bloom! The 3 tall planters seems to really work if you yank the shit outta your limbs, though.


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## v12xjs (Apr 15, 2009)

Who knows what tomorrow brings.

Just had a look in on the girls. Amber's getting big quickly. She's more or less covering the pot already and I think things will be getting crowded in there by the time Pandora takes the long walk.
In a way it's lucky SketzoH junior triggered early or I'd have another beastie in there to contend with!
Here's a a family snap to show how Amber is growing and some pics of Pandora's colas. Very nice


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## floridasucks (Apr 15, 2009)

yo... lookin good, amber has some fat indica leaves.


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## worm5376 (Apr 15, 2009)

okay so here is my plan. I need a bigger tower then the one i have now. Tore it apart yesterday, and it just looks suh smuhll =/ one of those cheap HP's. I can still use it for veg chamber with 3 23 watter , but im gonna look on craigslist for a taller tower or maybe a flea market? I always see them at markets.


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## v12xjs (Apr 16, 2009)

Hey fs. Amber is going to be a handful I think  I'm already using ties on one of the sidebranches. She starts on nutes next feed so I'm expecting great things.

Yo worm. If money is tight have a go in the HP. I think you could use most of the techniques I use but let it fill the case sideways so it looks like a scrog. There's tricks to create an extra inch or 2 as well. If I were to put one of my pots on its side the plant would have the same volume of soil but it would lower the soil level by 2 or 3 inches.
If you used a 3 litre lemonade bottle on its side you could get a similar effect but with much more soil than I'm using and that will translate directly into better yields so it may prove to be a good option.
I'd give it a try before I scrapped it, but then I'm just a tightwad


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## v12xjs (Apr 17, 2009)

Hey DW. This one's for you fella.
1st pic is Amber from a week ago.
2nd pic is from last night to show the difference.
pics 3 & 4 show how I tuck the big top leaf under the lower ones to expose lower growth.
Last pic shows just how hard I pull on those ties!


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## v12xjs (Apr 17, 2009)

Couple more pics from last night.
First 2 are the same pic of SketzoH junior. She may be dainty but my word does she smell good 
The other 3 are Pandora. A pic of the main cola and a side cola and also a crop of the side cola. Still not much in the way of amber trichs but they will be along soon I'm sure 
I've checked the long range weather forecast for the pc case and the great weather is set to continue


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## ElephantRider (Apr 17, 2009)

Bravo! Excellent stuff, as always, my friend.  So.. how do you keep that leaf down? Just by tucking it? I have one fan leaf that's sorta wedged in between the side of the cup and the stem, which seems to be working well, but I have to keep tucking it. For me, my plant is so damned dwarfed from my n00b mistakes that my internode spacing is ridiculous. There's no way I can tuck all those leaves, thus my snip. Have you ever snipped? I'd be curious to see how it turns out for you.


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## dopewear (Apr 17, 2009)

Pandora Looks great v! and thank you for those pics i will try tie it down hard tonight, both of them hopefully i wont bend the stem. and ill pic up some FF nutes this weekend if my local hydro store carries them.


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## v12xjs (Apr 17, 2009)

Hey ER. 
I do have to keep pushing the shaders down for a couple of days but the plant gets the picture soon enough 
I've snipped and pruned before and would do it again if circumstances called for it, but it's a bit of a false economy in my experience. It's like that scene in Disney's Fantasia, every time you cut one down another 2 smaller ones cause even more trouble!
I do think there's merit in using pruning in a pc case though. If you look at some of the bonsai moms, it can be very effective in restricting growth.

Cheers DW.
I'll pass on your compliments to Pandora 
The trick with bending harder parts of the plant is to do a little each day until she goes where you want. You'll tumble it.


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## floridasucks (Apr 17, 2009)

hey looks like your gonna have a good 420...

talking about bonsai moms check this out.... http://www.cannabase.com/cl/pages/mums/mums.html


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## v12xjs (Apr 17, 2009)

Cheers fs. Nice link too.


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## v12xjs (Apr 20, 2009)

Hey peeps. Sorry for the late update. My daughter is getting married in a couple of weeks and has been a bit upset with it all so she stayed with me for the weekend. It looks like everything is sorted now and she's back on top thank goodness.

Got a few pics to show where Pandora is up to. First is from 2 days ago and it's the top of the main cola. The other 2 are a side view and one of the middle of the canopy.
It's all looking good but I'd prefer a few more amber trichs by now. She's getting a bit tubby though so I musn't grumble 

No sign of any plexiglass yet


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## floridasucks (Apr 20, 2009)

wow shes turining into a bush...

happy 420.


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## dopewear (Apr 20, 2009)

as always v. looking amazing


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## v12xjs (Apr 21, 2009)

Cheers guys and belated 420 wishes for everyone.

Got some pics again last night and just wanted to show why I think roots don't really give a hoot about light. Here's 2 shots of Amber, first shows just how healthy and vigorous she is and the 2nd shows some of the root system.
I may be miles off here, but it strikes me that if the long root with all the little side shoots had any problem with light exposure it would either have shrivelled up or it would have got itself out of the light. It's the same story all around the pot.
I'm not trying to suggest they do better with light exposure but the pics strongly suggest to me that they don't do any worse either.


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## Neph (Apr 21, 2009)

Thanks for showing this. Everyone kept telling me to cover my pots. I didn't think it would be a problem cause you have clear pots too. I have the sides covered with duct tape now though. I did it mostly cause I was tired of so many telling me to cover the roots up.


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## fuckat7t (Apr 22, 2009)

Hey V12,

I read through your thread and I like it so far!
I am starting my 3rd grow and I am getting things set up right now (grow journal coming soon)
Its a small scale, not a PC, but def not a closet either.
Anyway, I just started a thread in the CFL forum about PC fans, and I would appreciate your input as well as the other people in the "PC gang" let me know if its a good idea.

Cheers. 

https://www.rollitup.org/cfl-growing/186450-comparing-pc-fans-exhaust.html


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## v12xjs (Apr 22, 2009)

Hey Neph
I'm with you buddy. Everyone on here is very helpful but sometimes I wish they would check their facts first.

Hey Fuckat7t
Thanks for visiting and for the invite to chime in on your thread. I noticed it earlier and think it's a valuable discussion so I'll post up there in a bit.


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## climax (Apr 22, 2009)

Do you have any good guides on how to build these boxes? Also any information on where i can get some seeds like th at :] Thanx and nice grow!


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## v12xjs (Apr 23, 2009)

Hey climax. Thanks for dropping by and for the props.
I never did a build guide but check out ElephantRider's journal. He dealt with it in plenty of detail and he did do a set of general notes to help, although thinking about it he may have posted that in this journal somewhere.
I'll post a link if I see it. Just get a dremmel and 2 pints of your bloodtype and you will be fine 
As for seeds. Any of the 7 - 8 week flowering strains should be ok and any of the auto flowering plants will be easy to grow, although taste and potency may not be quite up there with the best. Just have a flick through the choices at a decent seedbank and something will catch your eye.
Good luck with it.


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## v12xjs (Apr 23, 2009)

Got a couple of quick updates today. First up is the plexiglass. It's actually polycarbonate and I went with 3mm thickness just to make sure it didn't bend in the middle due to heat. I already had a fan blowing up the centre of the bulb and while I was investigating putting a spider in there I opened up the rear too, so the idea was to have a straight through flow of air to act as a cool tube.
I'm only on the prototype so it's only sealed on one side but initial impressions are above expectation. I ran it last night with a room temp of 75F and the fans on 6v and it never climbed above 79F right under the glass!
Here's a couple of snaps just to show what I'm on about:


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## v12xjs (Apr 23, 2009)

Figured it was time for another update on Pandora too. Don't know about anybody else but I'm rapidly concluding that she's not a 7 week strain. I have her down to vacate the building on Sunday but you can see there's tons of new white growth and she's just starting to put on the pounds.... Well grammes anyway 
Looks like I'll need another pot in there as Veronica is in need of a new home this weekend and I may even need to give Pandora a mild dose of nutes with her next watering. She will have long since exhausted any goodies from the soil after 2 weeks of flushing and I'm pretty sure there's another week or more to go.
Look for yourself:


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## dopewear (Apr 23, 2009)

v. like always they look great! i strive for such great plants like yours! 
did you happen to get that plexi glass?
keep it up! DW


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## v12xjs (Apr 23, 2009)

Hey DW
There's an update on it just above the last pics of Pandora. It looks like a winner so far


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## dopewear (Apr 23, 2009)

wow shows how close i look... it looks great! makes a big diffrence?


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## v12xjs (Apr 23, 2009)

There's lots more sealing to do around the edges but it's knocked about 8F off the temps and I had to turn down the fans from 9v to 6v. If I ran it at 9v I reckon it would maintain the same temps as the outside air.
Bring on the summer


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## dopewear (Apr 23, 2009)

summer is a beautiful thing... so is outdoor season!


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## v12xjs (Apr 23, 2009)

My thinking exactly


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## v12xjs (Apr 26, 2009)

OK. Just made some small adjustments to the box and took a few snaps but this will be my final update for this journal. Pandora will be coming down in the next day or 2 and I've already covered a harvest, so that's all folks.
I've put a pic of the new cooltube in and one of each of the flowering girls, plus a profile of Pandora and family shot with them all waving goodbye.

Current plans for the future are to reveg my harvested girls and pop them outdoors for some extra blooms at the end of the summer.
I'm also thinking about removing the fans from the plant area in the case and just fitting a blower in there to provide some air circulation. The benefit of that would be that no smell could escape so I could dump the carbon filters and still be stink free 
A water cure is on the cards at some point, and I also now have an A4 laptop that will fit neatly behind the baby light. Once that's fitted I should have a light-proof, smell-proof and fully functioning PC that just churns out weed for fun 

Many thanks to everyone who has posted here, sent me rep or pm's. Amazingly, every single one has been positive and I appreciate them all very much.
Good luck to everyone in your grows. I'll be watching.


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## dopewear (Apr 26, 2009)

looks great v. your journal keeping will be missed and i will dedicate my next grow to you! take care man. DW


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## ElephantRider (Apr 27, 2009)

Awesome! Any possible way I could get a view of how you mounted the light up there? I've been thinking of upgrading the flower tower to a 200W CFL, but the logistics of that hook-up are escaping me. I'd thought about possibly getting a single-wing and cutting it or something like that. PM me, if you like.. or pop it on my grow, if you have time.

Thanks for the knowledge, man. You're the fuckin' master, no question about it. I've researched a million micro-grows over the past year to figure out how to run my own and yours has been, by far, the best I've seen documented. I know you were itching to get this grow over after just the one harvest, but I'm so happy you did 2, as it gave me a realistic view of how a perpetual works out. Generally, if you look at a single grow, it's a grow. It doesn't help you feel the process at all.. how often you get to fill your tin, etc. This shows me how this process is completely liveable and easily sustainable. Also, thanks for staying tuned in on my grow. You seem to be the only person that can cut through my mindless banter and other ramblings. I'll definitely ping you if I'm headed to the Kring, by the way. Possibly next year.

ALL HAIL THE MASTER V12XJS!!!


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## v12xjs (Apr 27, 2009)

Hey ER. You do seem to know how to embarass me. A simple 'thanks' would have been fine 
A couple of fair points there though fella. 
I wanted to get a working rig out there but without seeing how often I top up my tin and how the little ones come through it could easily have been a one hit wonder full of bs. I think the 2nd grow showed this is for real and anyone can do it, which was the whole point for me.
Thanks to you and DW for talking me round.

To make it complete though I should cover how I fitted that light huh?
Nothing scientific to that. Just a cheapo reflector with e40 bulb holder. The reflector is a metal 'L' shape with the electrics and the bulb holder on the foot and a reflective metal sheet stapled to the main length.
Here's a pic of a very similar example. Please note I have no affiliation with the vendor, it's just the best pic I can find:
http://www.1-hydroponics.co.uk/grow-lights/envirolite-cfl-reflector.htm
It just fitted in my case, but I could have hung the power box outside through the psu hole if needed. Those reflective wings are pretty easy to bend to the correct width. To fit it I sanded the roof of the case and the metal bar the reflector is screwed to, then I tipped the case upside down and put epoxy resin (araldite) on both the sanded areas and stuck them together. I put some ballast on top to hold it firm and left it for 24 hours. Easy peasy really. A couple of hours with the fans on moved any residual odours.


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## Neph (Apr 27, 2009)

V12 thanks for all the info. I am glad you decided to keep the journal after Granita. It helped me understand more of the whole process of getting a nice perpetual pc grow. I'm going to change almost my whole set up next time around. It's been nice having this journal around, I know it's helped a lot of people. Like how I LST Esme around the rim and it isn't quite working out to well. So I planted Daphnie near the edge and just pulled her straight back acrost the pot. I got that from your journal. You also popped in many of the pc journals around here giving sound advice when ever any of us messed up. So once again thanks V12, the PC Grow Guru.


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## whulkamania (Apr 27, 2009)

Subscribed! I love Micro grows.


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## Neph (Apr 28, 2009)

Whulk, you're a little late. This journal is pretty much coming to a close.


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## whulkamania (Apr 28, 2009)

I'm waiting for harvest time!


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## dopewear (Apr 28, 2009)

again wulk your alittle late hes already covered a harvest so hes done posting.


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## whulkamania (Apr 28, 2009)

Where is the pictures for the harvest?


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## Neph (Apr 28, 2009)

It was a plant before this one. He kept the journal going to show the process a little better. I think he's actually harvested 2 plants since this journal has been going. Granita, an icecream, and a little indica plant that didn't get very big due to it's genetics.


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## LimitedTimer (May 25, 2009)

I've been looking into your grow and i keep seeing this White Air freshener ? pluged in 

is that what that is? i've read through a lot of ur pages and didnt see a comment on it or is it to add humid?

great journal , i'm starting my own pc grow b/c ur looked so good


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## v12xjs (May 25, 2009)

Thanks LimitedTimer.
The thing you spotted is just the remote probe for my temp/humidity gauge.
Please send me a link to your journal when it's up.
Good luck.


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## cerebralvibrator (May 26, 2009)

Such a shame you are closing this thread. I have been following quietly for ages (was a member under a different username until recently) and have pointed others in your direction when they ask about limited space grows! Been an enjoyable ride anyway so thanks for taking the time to do it.

Always made me smile that avatar too 

Keep it up mate.

CV.


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## v12xjs (May 26, 2009)

Hey thanks for props CV.
I enjoyed doing it too. Lots of other good shows going on though. Are you getting one started?

Your usernname reminds me of a fave Hawkwind track. You know them?


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## cerebralvibrator (May 27, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey thanks for props CV.
> I enjoyed doing it too. Lots of other good shows going on though. Are you getting one started?
> 
> Your usernname reminds me of a fave Hawkwind track. You know them?


Ahah .... another *Hawkwind* fan comes out of the closet  Yep, the username comes from 'Orgone Accumulator' of course! I honestly didn't expect anybody to pick up on that one  I'm just into my fifties and have been a fan for more years than I care to admit to. 

I have a thread running currently, small space grow, 2/3 pots max on the go, link below if you would care to take a look in?

Thanks again for a great thread,

CV.


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## floridasucks (May 27, 2009)

cerebralvibrator... one of the best names ive seen.


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## v12xjs (May 27, 2009)

Hey CV
I'll be there in a moment. Be rude not to 
And thanks. I've been humming Space Ritual stuff all day 

Greets fs.
If you like the name you would have loved to see the band that wrote the song.
I have an enduring memory of them playing all through the night at Stonehenge while I watched the sun come up from within the stone circle, tripping my bollox off along with about 300 other wasted acid casualties 
What a gig. What a trip!


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## ElephantRider (May 27, 2009)

Damn, you UK chaps know how to party! Sounds like my cup 'o tea.. about 10 years ago.


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## cerebralvibrator (May 27, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey CV
> I'll be there in a moment. Be rude not to
> And thanks. I've been humming Space Ritual stuff all day
> 
> ...


What year was that mate? That must have been an unforgettable experience.

Hawkwind were *the* band for the big free outdoor festivals. I played 'Space Bandits' the other day to my teenage daughters and you should have seen thier faces .

Anyway, may I add this iconic image of Hawkwind way back in the Seventies !!!!! Stacia with her 6 ' tall frame and huge round breasts had a profound effect upon me as a teenager, 






Thanks again for an inspiring thread.


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## ElephantRider (May 27, 2009)

They're having a profound effect on me right now!


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## v12xjs (May 27, 2009)

Oh mate. What a pic! They were the days 
That Stonehenge memory was from 1983 I think. I can't be sure though, it was the first time I'd ever seen Afghani Black, brickweed, MDMA and bathtubs full of warm saki. It was fooking tough week


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## ElephantRider (May 27, 2009)

YAH! Sounds REEEEEAL tough, there! You guys and your MDMA back in the early 80's! WTF. I lived on acid and shrooms until '98 before I got my first taste of MDMA.. Of course, up where I am near Canada, lots of great LSD rolled through here.. no need for MDMA, that we could see. Boy, were we wrong!


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## v12xjs (May 27, 2009)

I only said it was a tough weekend. Never said I asked for my money back


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## floridasucks (May 28, 2009)

ya im young still got alot to learn..


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## ElephantRider (May 28, 2009)

FS.. when I was a youth of 22 or so, I learned the most about what's good in psychedelics / nuggs from hangin' out with a few older biker hippies that toured with the dead for years and years. I painted with one of them. He introduced me to a buddy of his that had 100 sheets of North Cali Acid from Leary's personal lab that was hidden in the freezer since the early 80's. I rode that train hard, my friend!  This acid was so clean, you could take a nap on it!


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## floridasucks (May 28, 2009)

ElephantRider said:


> FS.. when I was a youth of 22 or so, I learned the most about what's good in psychedelics / nuggs from hangin' out with a few older biker hippies that toured with the dead for years and years. I painted with one of them. He introduced me to a buddy of his that had 100 sheets of North Cali Acid from Leary's personal lab that was hidden in the freezer since the early 80's. I rode that train hard, my friend!  This acid was so clean, you could take a nap on it!



damm u are one lucky man to have gotten that. older people always have the best shit.


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## ElephantRider (May 28, 2009)

HAH! My friends who are scrounging to find pot here would not say the same.  We had a MAJOR Cannugget bust here a year and a half ago, or so. The DEA and FBI came in and took 45 people to jail for hauling literal tons of BC Bud BigBud across the border over a span of several years. They had a ton or so in posession (several houses), too. They had been supplying the entire NE US - Maine to Ohio to DC - with BigBud. After that, everyone in the area took cover and the rastas in the ghetto started having a field day selling their formaldehyde-sprayed, schwag brickweed from Mexico again. Lucky me, I have a small-time guy that didn't need to hide with an awesome NL x Hashplant. Unfortunately, he killed that in favor of the strain I have a clone of in my grow.  Bagseed, but supposedly killer shit and a NICE looking Indica-dominant.


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## v12xjs (May 29, 2009)

Wow ER. That acid stash sounds like all your birthdays came at once! If I'm not mistaken, Leary's personal stash was the legendary Owsley acid. I am sooo jealous


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## ElephantRider (May 29, 2009)

It was amazing, my friend. I've got some 300+ tabs in this old body and about 200 of them were that stuff. White blotter paper.. very inconspicuous.. not even really that crusty. But really.. no back pain, no muscle ache, no jaw, no terrible shits. When we ate that, one tab was enough for some 16 hours going STRONG and a nice peaceful sleep near the end. No acid hangover. I truly feel blessed to have met that guy. He was quirky and 12-14 years older, but he had old school class and smarts on it, too. he outright refused to sell to me the first time. I got my first 2 free, but the catch was I had to do them right then. I was with my g/f, at the time, and we were about to go see Nutty Professor in the theaters. Wow. That was one interesting movie!


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## v12xjs (May 30, 2009)

We had a factory serving all the UK in the 70's but it was busted not long after I started dropping tabs in a huge bust that netted over 6 million tabs. They were also very fresh and clean.
Funny tale about that bust though. It was called operation Julie and took over 4 years to complete, but it should have been done in less than 2 years.
When the drug squad hooked up with local village police to carry out the initial raid, they set off to a remote farm. At the same time, the wife of one of the local cops rang ahead to the farm. She told them her husband was the village cop and he had mentioned he was going to call on them for some reason or other. She asked if they would let him know upon his arrival that he'd left his packed lunch at home 
Unsurprisingly, the raid found nothing


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## v12xjs (May 30, 2009)

While I'm here I've got a quick update that may be of interest to you guys.
Around my garden there is lots of sphagnum moss growing wild so I've been doing some reading and it's most interesting stuff. Kind of like perlite mostly but with a ph 6.5 and built in cal/mag.
So I decided I had to try it and I'm a bit staggered by the results so far. Hence this update.
Got some pics, but the spec is that the plant is now 21 days old and is sitting in my normal soil mix + 20% sphag moss and it's going fookin mental! This is a known strain and it's never done this before.
At the 3rd node I take 5 fingered leaves to be a sign of max health and 7's at the next node means all is rosy in the garden for me. This thing had a 7 on the 3rd node and is now spouting 9 fingered leaves at 20 fooking days under 12/12!!!
I named her Terra after Terra Patrick, but terror now seems more appropriate 
Have a look and see what you think.


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## cerebralvibrator (May 31, 2009)

Thanks for posting that info  Sounds good, theres certainly some vigorous growth happening there! You can get it from garden centres too, its used to line hanging baskets. Can you let us know how she develops? Might be worth a try to see what happens.


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## floridasucks (May 31, 2009)

dam great stories guys.. im drooling over the though of that acid.

wow.. v12 i should have told you before. but ive been using peat moss mixed in my soil for a while now and it works awsome.. the sphagnum is a type of peat moss but i dont think it really matters which type u get. i use this organic kind called better-gro orchid moss. i dont know how u do it but i grind it up with my hands till its kind of powdery, then mix it in.. hope that helps.


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## v12xjs (May 31, 2009)

Hey fs. Always wondered what your trick was 

Cheers CV. It's still going mad. I've got a real fight on to contain it in my little tub


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## RedEyeJedi UK (Jun 1, 2009)

V12 - u are the PC growing God my friend !

I'v just invested in one of these PC growers from Ebay - With the DWC - Hydro system - Which I though would be great for yeild ?
After reading through this whole journal, Im now in 2 minds!

You've inspired me on several of your methods - I know alot of theory but am now about to test this - I'm pretty confident after seeing your results!

However, advice please V12 - Would u say Soil would be a better option or should I see how this DWC system works first? DWC is proven to improve yeild 
(Which isn't a major issue as Im only doin this to save money)
What do ya think buddy ?

RedEyeJedi


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## v12xjs (Jun 1, 2009)

Hey RedEye
Good to see another UK grower around. Glad the journal helped.
Both mediums have pros and cons. Hydro is out on a few counts for me. It takes me a long time to get the ph and ppm of my nutes correct for hydro and also I'm concerned about the implications of so much water near so much electric! Besides, the way I split my case would require 4 separate containers. The vigorous growth can be a downright menace in such a tight space too.
On the plus side, that growth can be your friend if you know your lst and the nutes only need attention once a week.
If you intend to go for a single harvest like a scrog then it's probably ideal, but for multiple plants at different sizes you should stick to soil.
I'm playing about with a middle solution at the moment. It's called a Hempy Bucket and it may offer all the advantages of both systems. I'll let you know how I get on.


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## RedEyeJedi UK (Jun 1, 2009)

Thanks V12,

I think I will test out the hydro for my 1st time and if I succeed with it I may continue - sounds like I may have an easier time with soil though?!
I'll be following your threads fom now on buddy - like I said in my previous post - u are a PC growing god and proved many of my friends wrong in all 
your methods - 1st being the PC grow start to finish - a friend said "no chance" Thanks for proving him wrong on that 1 - the next thing is 12/12 from get go - the same friend said "No chance, they would die due to no veg period". Again - u proved him wrong! and lastly the perpetual side of it - he said u cant grow plants of different stages in the same room! And AGAIN - u proved him wrong! Very impressive! lol =)

I will be keepin a grow journal and let u know how I get on with mine aswell - I'v joined ur forum too (I hope u don't mind?)
I'm just pleased to have found someone who is producing good results with PC growing!

RedEyeJedi


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## v12xjs (Jun 2, 2009)

Hey RedEye.
LOL. Glad I helped shoot your buddies down. Hope you had some money on the bet 
Look forward to seeing your rig.
Thanks for joining up to the forum too. I haven't worked out how to send you an activation email just yet but your account is live.


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## cerebralvibrator (Jun 2, 2009)

*v12XJS,* if you don't mind I'll also sign up to your forum when I get a new 'Hush' account set up. I see you have *Elephant Rider* there already , btw *RedEye*, ER's another good PC case grower and his 'client/server model' thread is well worth reading through.

If I can chip in here, I was wondering how practical DWC would be in a PC case!...... BUT I reckon it could just be done, I have seen it done in a tiny bedside cabinet in the past so its JUST possible maybe. You certainly get far more vigorous growth with DWC and all you are really talking about is a pump and airstone, those roots LOVE being in water  One day I have promised myself I'm going to do true *aquaponics*, we keep fish anyway and to be able to see them nibbling away at roots and feeding them with thier waste is incredible, I have seen amazing results with the plants suspended above the tank and the roots gently swaying about as the fish swim around them  .... sorry wandered off topic there! So many different ways of growing the herb.

Anyway, good luck whatever you do.


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## v12xjs (Jun 2, 2009)

Hey CV. I'd love to see you over on the micro forum. Anybody with an interest in micro is most welcome. Hopefully it's only an interim measure until RIU give us our own section, but it's nice to have a place we can call our own.

I have some Hydor Ario immersible pumps that fit perfectly into my 1 litre pots and they are utterly silent in comparison to normal fish tank pumps. In use they sound like you are sitting next to a glass of lemonade as the only noise you hear is the fizz of the bubbles 
Previous experiments with 2 plant scrogs in a single tank were most promising but changing out the res was a nightmare once they got established. Now I have a mother plant outside and can take cuttings I may stick one in behind my hempy experiment. I think it would be easier to control a clone as it will switch to flowering faster than a seedling would.

You sound like floridasucks trying to combine a pet with a grow 
It sounds amazing though. 
Check out his Querkle thread in the Toke n Talk section. Absolutely wonderful stuff!


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## ElephantRider (Jun 2, 2009)

DWC sounds like fun, but my issue with it is that, if you have 3 plants in there.. 3 strains, say.. and they all have different nute requirements, you're shot because they share a res. Like v12, here, I'm going to experiment with hemptiness. It's the perfect hybrid of soil and hydro, really. Also, if I'm not mistaken, you can use moss in perlite.

V.. sorry I haven't been active on the other board yet.. I'm quite swamped at work.


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## RedEyeJedi UK (Jun 2, 2009)

I'm only doing 1 strain at the moment, "Ice Cream" - My friend is doin my cuttings - they should be ready for the DWC in about a week - Although I do have fish aswell - 
That method sounds cool CV, not experienced enough as yet though - I'm hoping DWC will teach me basic hydro growing (This is my first attempt indoors)
I grew a lovely plant in my Mrs's Parents garden last year - Her dad has MS so it was a perfect opportunity to put my little bit of knowledge to the test.....

She gave us a healthy 9 ounces and a Q - She stunk too!  
I stressed her badly at the beginning! fed her far too much! But the rain we had helped me flush her (luckily) 

She had red stems right till the end though - (She was very stressed, I bet she hated me for ages - but didnt half taste lovely) lol

Now, its got to a point where people round my way a charging £10 per gram for damp, under-cooked and nowhere near nice to smoke -

The sad thing is - it works! So, had they had left it for few more weeks it would probably be spanking smoke! 

Greedy [email protected]$74RD$!

Thats why I'm now here! 

Thanks for makin me feel welcome though guys!
I'm sure I'll be needin some advice soon ! lol


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## v12xjs (Jun 2, 2009)

I know those prices and despair at how good it could have been too 
You will love your ice cream. It is naturally red stemmed so no change there. And they love lst 

np ER. I'm just gonna try getting my head around phpmail.


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## RedEyeJedi UK (Jun 3, 2009)

I got hold of some Ice cream not so long ago off the same friend who's giving me the cutting! (Gorgeous bud, lovely taste!)

Yeh, I loved it!  lol

Quick question V12 - do u think I could manage to get 2 plants flowering at the same time with dimensions like this, L503mm x W243mm x H555mm ?

The DWC system can grow 3 but I'm not silly, I know these babies don't stay small with hydro (Even with LST)
I would love to do the perpetual thing like u, but am not clued up enough yet! Im gona go with what I know so far - so 18/6 with the lights for 3 weeks (start LST after 2 weeks, if possible) then 12/12..

My greenthumb is itching now, can't wait to get started!


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## v12xjs (Jun 3, 2009)

Sounds like a nice big case you got RedEye. 2 Plants should do fine in there, but I agree with you that 3 would prolly be a waste of a cutting/seed.
Your veg/flower plan sounds like a winner too.


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## yzracer (Jun 3, 2009)

I feel the same way, Jedi. V, your setup is badass I must say. I just made one myself but planned on going hydro. I was thinking if I could have 2 seperate DWC pots with one veg and one flower going at the same time with some LST or topping that would be awesome to harvest say every 3 or 4 weeks. I think it would be a little bit more work with two different containers with diff ppms and such but I think the speediness of hydro is awesome. Any thoughts or seen anything like this? 
Preciate it.
Chas

+rep


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## v12xjs (Jun 3, 2009)

Cheers yz
I just posted up an album for Xander that would prolly fit the bill for you. Have a peek. It came out backwards doh! so start at the end and you'll suss it.
https://www.rollitup.org/members/v12xjs-albums-xander.html

Love bike racing. Do you follow British Superbikes?


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## yzracer (Jun 3, 2009)

Hey man thanks for the link. Im about to check it out. Unfortunately not up to date on the british superbikes though. I was just a bored teenager growing up in cough *bullshit* cough America so I killed some time with some dirtbikes and kept the name ever since. 
I just put together a pc setup with a fatass 250w cfl 6500K and another 2700K to switch to for flower (but now im not so sure if Im gonna try to set up a perpetual system) both of which i found on ebay. At least i might be able to use a light that big in another bigger setup later on. But I have skeptical friends who think that might be "too much light". I thought it was the heat that would kill a plant instead of an excessive amount of light, Any thoughts on that one? Im hoping as long as I keep the temp at good levels i might get some decent smoke so ive got 3 case fans in their to keep it as cool as possible.
And actually I just slaughtered 6 seeds trying to germ in a paper towel and then transfer into rockwool but I think that overwatering or a lack of heat was to blame. I just don't know when to take my sproutlings out of my makeshift humidity dome and put them under light. My sprouts just usually looked burned and my two leaflets would never open up. Sometimes i even got purple stems on them.
Any hydro help or maybe even rep points you could give would be much appreciated


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## v12xjs (Jun 4, 2009)

Hey yz
My bad. I should have remembered racing round dirt tracks on an old Suzuki RM chasing those Yamy YZ's.
250watts in a case is a lot of light and You can have too much. It results in white leaves and very sick looking plants. Not sure what level is too much in a case though. 
Heat will be a big issue for sure and I doubt 3 fans would keep it cool through summer. 
If the seedlings are burning up then heat could well be the issue. I think in most pc cases 150w would be the max in terms of temps and that should still give well over 10,000 lumens which is plenty of light for a good harvest.
If you can tame that light then your buds will be fearsome. Google Mr Micro's nanomachine and have a look at the fake wall he fitted at the back of his case. If you could do something like that and have the ballast and the bulbholder outside of the growspace then you have a fighting chance of using the bulbs you have.
If you aren't familiar with rockwool then check out the instructions for that too as it's very acidic when it's new and needs treating before use. I tended to use the rootriot cubes for that reason and I left the dome on them for about a week to let them get established. With your current setup, humidity will be very low, so try putting a cup of water in the case when the seedling go in just to raise it up some. The young plants like high humidity which is why they do ok in the domes.

Just a thought on strains for you. Most of the available seeds are bred to do well at around 75-80F but you can still buy seeds called Landrace strains which should cope with hotter temps. Some of the African/Nigerian strains might do well in your environment.
Good luck with it.


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## cerebralvibrator (Jun 4, 2009)

Hope you dont mind me chipping in again  Airflow is very important in enclosed micro grows YZ, a good 100mm ruck type fan will pull all that hot air straight out for you while pulling in fresh room temp air on a constant flow through the plants. Its possible to maintain a temp of just a few degrees above room temps this way. It may even be slightly too powerful for a pC case grow, anyone use one this way? Of course the size of them makes stealth more difficult in a PC case but a small bedside cabinet type grow can accomodate the fan, ballast, sockets etc by sectioning off a part of the top and hiding everything in that, it can also be sound proofed with insulation. I have seen a brilliant example of this, a small lockable wooden bedside cabinet with a 250 HPS and 4 plant DWC that produces an average of 3.5 dry OZ each run in a very small space! ..... I wish it was mine!! From outside theres not a clue of whats going on inside. I think if you are looking at 250 watts of lighting then maybe you should conside something slightly bigger than a PC case maybe? 

So many brilliant ideas about nowdays, I recall a guy who grew in a lockable metal gun cabinet under his bed, honestly! Light one end, pot the other and the plant was simply trained along the lenght of the cabinet towards the light and held down by weights horizontal grow style. He did well with it too. Clever stuff.


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## RedEyeJedi UK (Jun 4, 2009)

I think Im gonna be ok with my light - 125 watt dual spectrum cfl - 3 built in fans - and thanks V12 - I'm gonna do 2 for sure now... 

I thought I'd be pushing it abit with 3! Good luck with Xander - are they cereal containers ur using? you have made them look as if they were made for growing in?! LOL

CV, is this a friend of yours that grew horizontal style ? Sounds awsome! complicated - but awsome!


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## helpmegrow (Jun 4, 2009)

Dude by far best pc grow ever!! i would like a few pointers please add me and message me because i could use your help on making mine


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## cerebralvibrator (Jun 4, 2009)

RedEyeJedi UK said:


> CV, is this a friend of yours that grew horizontal style ? Sounds awsome! complicated - but awsome!


Hi RedEye, it was a guy I used to know well on a small forum, he posted pics as it progressed. basically if you think about it it was just a standard grow! Pot was upright of course at one end and as they grew he just LST'd them using fishing weights until the stem was bent horizontally then just continued to train them along the lenght of the gun cabinet. The tips would all naturally turn upwards even though the light was at the other end so he kept on weighting them down as they grew  He got a solid dry OZ+ from 2 small plants in that box which I thought was good going. Wish I still had the pics but hopefully you can sort of see how it worked from my dodgy description! He had an inline fan at the light end and passive intake holes at the other so the air flowed straight through the plants. The cabinet was laid on its side under a double bed so he could open the door for access. Gun cabinets are made of steel and obviously have very secure locks on them  They come in different sizes and designed to be secured to solid walls in cupboards etc


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## RedEyeJedi UK (Jun 4, 2009)

Yeh, I agree CV - that really is clever thinking! Where do people learn to do this stuff?

LST is another thing I wonder about aswell - (it must of been a man that invented this!) refereing back to a comment made by the PC growing god himself V12  "Keep her in the dark and bend her over a lot" LOL


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 4, 2009)

u should try paperclips and clothspins, they are ez to shape and clip to just about any pot or jar side.


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 4, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Thanks FS. I have a 125w 2700K envirolite and I recently added a little 12w 6500K cfl to give 10% blue light. I did this because my grows seem to me to start giving yellow leaves a bit early in the flower stage. I know the buds take nitrogen from them so I wanted to be sure the buds have all the nitrogen they need.
> I'm not sure if 10% is just right, but you can see the first yellowing leaves in the first pic below and that's about 3 weeks later than in previous attemps, so I'll stick with it for now.
> 
> Here's some more pics then. An individual shot from day 52 and a family pic from day 53.


You know, i have had no problems with cutting those lower leaves off when they brown or yellow. it allows the plant to re-allocate nutrients to healthier leaves and the buds!


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## v12xjs (Jun 4, 2009)

It's been busy in here today 

Greets CV.
Thanks for the input. I couldn't agree more about fresh air. The inline fan would keep the heat at bay for sure and that would be a killer system, but those fans make a right racket so all thoughts of stealth would be out the window. The pc cases have no sound deadening capabilities where maybe a wooden cab would be good. Agree that a bigger growspace may be the way forward for the 250 watters.
A gun cabinet eh? What did he do with the gun? You have to marvel at some of the ingenuity involved in growing weed 

Hey RedEye. Glad to help. I haven't tried one of the dual spectrums, but I do think there's some merit in having both even for a 12/12, so make sure and post up some pics.
Yup. Cereal containers from the pound shop and to hell with the expense 
I think you will need a bit of lst in due course. Nothing hard about it though and you'll be a dab hand in no time.

Welcome helpmegrow and cheers for the props. My mailbox is a bit full just now but I'll tidy it up and drop you a line later.

Hi there outdoindo. Thanks for stopping by. Really appreciate the tips. Got any pics of your setup?


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## cerebralvibrator (Jun 4, 2009)

OutdoIndo said:


> You know, i have had no problems with cutting those lower leaves off when they brown or yellow. it allows the plant to re-allocate nutrients to healthier leaves and the buds!


I have to say I agree with you OutdoIndo, like so many things about this hobby some people will tell you not to do one thing while others do it as a matter of course  I'm one of those who also removes yellowing fans and never found it a problem. 

v12XJS..... would you say in conclusion that a skilled PC case grow like yours could sustain a moderate user? In my cabinet I reckon I get just enough to cover my 1/2 to 3/4 OZ per month requirement, since I 'lost' my larger scale grow I have cut down quite a bit but I want to try and push that up to a steady 1oz per month. I guess this should be one of the first questions we should ask ourselves when setting up a grow and work from there?


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## v12xjs (Jun 4, 2009)

Fan leaf heathen!

Yes CV, the pc just about covers my needs but no spare change and any problems sees me rushing back on the streets for a top up 
Have to say that I thought your rig was screaming out for a scrog but it seemed churlish to criticise such a nice setup 

It's because I would like a little extra that I'm playing with sphagnum moss and the hempy experiment. I'll keep you posted on both.


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 4, 2009)

Hell yeah, this site is so cool. No web warriors! Finally mature peeps to share with. My grow room (closet corner) is very simple and to me innovative. Mind you, I am only using 6 CFL's, a cheap blue & red LED panel (which turned out great for me) and the backside of some mylar-like christmas wrap, along with an Ionic Breeze. Also keep in mind that these plants are all just 35 days old, and each was treated very differently! 2 were topped (the bushiest one was topped very early), all were bound and trained with paperclips and clothspins to keep them lowriders  Here are a few pix, sorry about the quality, my real camera was stolen. Any comments are welcome. Today I trapped a small wolf spider and dropped her into the biggest pot, hoping she will make herself at home somewhere in the vicenity. 

If you look closely at pic 35-4, you can see the blue and red striped light provided by the LED panel.

Thanks for taking the time to post your journal, and for showing interest in mine!


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 4, 2009)

Also, in reference to pruning and grooming, this baby is a beast, and it seems the more I groom her, the more she blooms!
I think she may be ready within the month, that's only 2 months total, from a seed! Makes me giddy. sorry if i already posted the pic, just wanted to emphasize the one that I have been trimming and pruning, and obviously she was not topped.


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## v12xjs (Jun 4, 2009)

Hey Outdo
Little wolf spider on guard. Meh 
What with floridasucks and his pink-toed tarantula, and CerebralVibrators description of a fish tank being used as a nute reservoir you'd need to drop a herd of rhino in there to impress me these days. 
A tiger at the very least 
Really interested in LED's myself. Once they are fully exploited they will be perfect for a microgrow.

No need to repeat yourself you know 
Nice plant though. Is that the only auto or are the others just a bit behind in development?
Gotta say I think you would do so much better with a reflector above those lights.
You got lots of interesting ideas there, you should put up a journal of your own.


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## RedEyeJedi UK (Jun 4, 2009)

thanks for the advice V12 - I'll be buy another 2 lights in the near future, 1 blue 1 red (Should I go for 100w? or lower do ya think?)

Outdoindo, that is some serious LST work dude! starting them so young! I like it! LOL , The others look nice too! (Paper clips, now thats an idea - must get some tomorrow) 

My babies are only just in there first rockwool cube, gonna get them in a second cube then start LST in the DWC - Will be posting pics as soon as I get it started with it!


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## v12xjs (Jun 4, 2009)

Het RedEye
Bit wasted and I have a few grows I'm looking in on so I mix things up now and again. Didn't you say you had a 125 dual spec bilb? Much more than that in a pc case and you will get heat issues, but if I had a dual spec I would be looking to add flowering light. 
DId you sya your bulb had 3 fans too? Tell me more...


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 4, 2009)

yeah the only single cola, and i can't cover it without the heat and f'ing humidity shooting through the roof. right now it stays right between 75 and 87 degrees and between 30-40 percent humidity. with the covers or a top, they both shoot up 10 percent  I know ur gonna say to ventilate better, but it's ok. but thanks for the pointer, any help is always welcome here. i plan on going closed box next-go-round


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 4, 2009)

thanks redeye, i was really just fucking around trying to find out which top would work the best and fastest and easiest. really bending them isn't hard at all. especially whe you start so young. the most important thing i have learned is to be able to move the light around the plant so that the branches and buds that end up on the bottom side get some light too. it really keeps things compact but seems spacious at the same time.


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## ElephantRider (Jun 4, 2009)

Heh.. I slice off the crispy part of yellowed leaves with a razor blade. Just thought I'd share, too.


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## cerebralvibrator (Jun 5, 2009)

Just a thought here, as we seem to have a nice little bunch of 'mature' growers together here with similar interests why don't we move this over to vx's private small forum? That way we can run our threads here and also keep these ideas and suggestions flowing together elsewhere as I think this thteads going to be ending soon?

I'll get myself signed up today 

Outdoindo, nice grow, be good to watch it develop.


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## v12xjs (Jun 5, 2009)

Hey Outdo
I won't shout about the temp/humidity. Sounds about right to me. I'm running around 40% and low 80's just now and the girls are most happy 

Look forward to seeing a few of you on the private forum. I think it would be good to have all our knowledge and ideas in a single forum.


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 5, 2009)

dudes, i am loving the love!!! thanks y'all for not being jerks. it seems that whenever i explain that i'm trying to do things easy and cheap, some a-holes get mad for some reason and start talking shit? i am just trying to work with what i have, and that ain't a lot of $$$, time, or space right now. also i (we) only share these things to help others realize that you don't have to kill yourself doing this... it's really just a hobby for me. i'm not making a business out of it, nor am i trying for any particular quantity... i just like messing around, and these plants have special meaning to some of us. they are like part of the family. i have a regular vegetable and flower garden in my yard too. And guess what? i hardly waste any time out there either and my carrots are almost ready, it's been just two months! that's pretty fast for an outdoor garden in this heat. my outdoor temps have been crazy here, from 60 at 4am all the way to 100 by 4pm. Plus i get about 13.5-14 hours of sunlight in june-july. that makes for really slow flowering . so indoors is a lot faster.

Wow- i went off on a tangent, sorry to vent here VX: i really am totally impressed with the general intelligence/respect of this group! you've renwewed my faith in strangers!

BTW: what's the private link? 
edit: got it sry...


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## cerebralvibrator (Jun 5, 2009)

OutdoIndo said:


> dudes, i am loving the love!!! thanks y'all for not being jerks. it seems that whenever i explain that i'm trying to do things easy and cheap, some a-holes get mad for some reason and start talking shit? i am just trying to work with what i have, and that ain't a lot of $$$, time, or space right now. also i (we) only share these things to help others realize that you don't have to kill yourself doing this... it's really just a hobby for me. i'm not making a business out of it, nor am i trying for any particular quantity... i just like messing around, and these plants have special meaning to some of us. they are like part of the family. i have a regular vegetable and flower garden in my yard too. And guess what? i hardly waste any time out there either and my carrots are almost ready, it's been just two months! that's pretty fast for an outdoor garden in this heat. my outdoor temps have been crazy here, from 60 at 4am all the way to 100 by 4pm. Plus i get about 13.5-14 hours of sunlight in june-july. that makes for really slow flowering . so indoors is a lot faster.


I know just what you mean Outdo..... we dont all want massive grows and pounds of weed! Like you I enjoy growing not just weed but all kinds of veg too  I get tired of being told by kids with a couple of grows under thier belts that my CFL's wont produce the goods etc when I know from long experience that they clearly can and do!

CV.


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 5, 2009)

my sentiments exactly


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 10, 2009)

Check it out:
Just 5 weeks total, from a seed, and presto! i only harvested the top cola, but still got a dry 1/8th. No nutes, no time, no anything!

Time to start my closed system now.


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## v12xjs (Jun 10, 2009)

Wow. 5 weeks from seed?
What kind of seed can do that?


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 10, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Wow. 5 weeks from seed?
> What kind of seed can do that?



Bagweed, lol. just one of my random hundreds of seeds mixed together over the years.


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 10, 2009)

i started it may 1st, finished _*smoking*_ it yesterday  the 9th of june! and it was a very nice, heavy head, high. i split 1/2 with my friend. Share and share alike, and we both got baked for 2 days off it. IMO, well worth the 35 days and little hassle.


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## v12xjs (Jun 10, 2009)

So basically you have harvested a 35 day old plant and rapid dried it. Surely that's the most basic noob error there is.
Hopefully nobody believes either that you got a dry 1/8th or that you got high off it.
Either way I'm mighty pissed that such a pathetic notion has been aired as a successful growing technique in my journal. 
Please don't post in here again OutdoIndo.


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## ElephantRider (Jun 10, 2009)

I agree.. that's too bad. Had you spent another month on grow and dry, then cured for another month, it probably would have been the best smoke you ever had. I've had TINY tastes of every plant early, but you just don't yield it that soon. In fact, I had a nip of my citral and a bagseed yesterday - 34 and 39 days, respectively. Each did the trick a little, but in twice that time, plus dry, plus month cure, it'll be same kinda quality you'd get in the 'Dam. I'm sure of this because I'm slowly watching my Top44 cure and smell better every day. There's actually a taste to it, now, too. Earthy, but a little spicy to it.

THIS is the part you miss out on when you rush. Do you get 'high'? A little. Wait the time.. excercise some patience, do it the right way and you'd be a shitload higher. PLUS great smell and taste.


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## v12xjs (Jun 11, 2009)

Cheers ER.
I think there's a world of difference between what you have done and Outdo's method. IIRC you vegged for 30 days before flowering and for the Top44 at least, 35 days is pretty close to finished anyway.
Root through pics of plants at 35 days, even LR#1 or 12/12 from seed grows and you will see just how pointless chopping would be.


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 11, 2009)

sorry vx, 

certainly no harm meant.


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## v12xjs (Jun 14, 2009)

OutdoIndo said:


> sorry vx
> 
> 
> Me too Outdo. I was harsh and it wasn't called for. If the edit button shows up again I'll delete what I wrote.


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## crimsol (Jun 15, 2009)

Hello all,

v12xjs, I've been reading this thread with great interest of the last few days.

You've done a brilliant job mate! 

Where did you get the plastic containers that you use? They are well handy. Would definitely go well in my pc g'room...they are perfect, as you have demonstrated, for lst.

Thanks mate and keep up the excellent work!!


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## v12xjs (Jun 15, 2009)

Greets crimsol

Appreciate the nice feedback. The containers came from my local pound shop. The way you said 'well handy' makes me think there will be one near you 
You are spot on. They make perfect pots for a pc grow and those lids are brilliant. As well as holding the hooks they really help with water retention. I haven't seen my plants for a week and they are in rude good health 
The case is like taking candy from a baby so it's still doing the biz 
If you want to read my latest ramblings check out the last link in my sig.

Just took a pic of Amber for posterity. She's geting harvested tomorrow but will be revegged, so instead of the usual execution she will be getting a new life in the country 
There's only 2 plants in the pic but there are a couple of youngsters just out of shot.


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 16, 2009)

Hey, like i said at first, that grow was just a practice run. And you don't need to dry/cure an eighth of bud for more than a few days, I dried it over the a/c vent and ind an open paper bag. All flowers were trimmed from the main stem, so they got really crispy fast, no chlorophyll taste at all. Plus I did not want to w8, that was my point. I'm not drying pounds or ounces. The less weed, the less time it takes to dry out. 

Anyway, I was just hurrying so I could set up the my new system. Check it out if u want: https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/202324-cheap-growers-indoor-setup-outdoindo.html


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## crimsol (Jun 17, 2009)

Had a look in my local 99p shop. No joy. Thankfully, I managed to find the identical containers to yours in one of those shops that sell pretty much everything. Yours are the 1 litre ones aren't they? Did you bother drilling holes in the bottom of them?


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## v12xjs (Jun 17, 2009)

I should have said try Nick's.
Yes that's them. I think they are 1 or 1.1 litre and I put loads of holes in the bottom. No point using perlite for drainage and not letting it drain. I use a hot poker to make the holes but a drill would do it.


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## saphyros (Jun 19, 2009)

dude i have 1 15W light and 2 25W light but only using 1 light ATM of 25W but can replace both bulbs for 40W to come out to 95W with a fan 1 comp fan and a humidifer with humdity around 25-35 and thermometry at 30-40 pleas help what else do i need for my marijuana growing???????????


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## v12xjs (Jun 20, 2009)

Hey saphyros

I'm a bit confused by your post. Sounds like you have an intake and a circulation fan but no exhaust?
The humidity is a little low, is that only with a single bulb and a humidifier running?
Sounds like you have most of what you need. Can you post a pic of the cab and the dimensions?


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 20, 2009)

saphyros said:


> dude i have 1 15W light and 2 25W light but only using 1 light ATM of 25W but can replace both bulbs for 40W to come out to 95W with a fan 1 comp fan and a humidifer with humdity around 25-35 and thermometry at 30-40 pleas help what else do i need for my marijuana growing???????????



Don't feel bad vx, I don't understand either?


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## dopewear (Jun 21, 2009)

hey v. i got an update up check it please miss you bro


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## v12xjs (Jun 21, 2009)

Great to see you DW. Missed your updates.
Those pics are wicked 
That's gonna be a nice smoke fella. All credit to you.


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## v12xjs (Jun 21, 2009)

I only took a few tops from Pandora last week and left the rest for a bit of extra time on the sunbed.
I figured the solstice would be a good day to start her new life in the country so I harvested the rest when the lights came on a couple of hours ago and then fed her a nitrogen cocktail.

Here's a couple of shots of the chop. Also a pic of Tera. She's a proper handful and seems to indicate that sphagnum moss is a boon to your soil mix.


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## cerebralvibrator (Jun 22, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> I only took a few tops from Pandora last week and left the rest for a bit of extra time on the sunbed.
> I figured the solstice would be a good day to start her new life in the country so I harvested the rest when the lights came on a couple of hours ago and then fed her a nitrogen cocktail.
> 
> Here's a couple of shots of the chop. Also a pic of Tera. She's a proper handful and seems to indicate that sphagnum moss is a boon to your soil mix.


Lovely pics there mate  I still cant believe what you grow inside a damn PC case!!! Those buds look tasty.

Looks like the sphag moss is working well  As you know I'm also trialing it thanks to your tip, and I'm convinced it REALLY is making a major difference to my little clone. Maybe you should start a sphag moss thread here? Would be good to run a few trials and see results?

I'm liking this stealth box concept a lot, I keep looking around for a potential little box to grow my cuttings in 

Was watching an interview on Tv on Solstice, they were interviewing a Druid guy with a big knobbly stick and I thought about your Hawkwind experience.


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## floridasucks (Jun 22, 2009)

..........nice buds v12!!


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## v12xjs (Jun 22, 2009)

Hey CV
The case is crackers for sure. Makes me chuckle every time I open it 
Really appreciated that pic. 
I can't run side by side moss comparisons in my case as things are all at different stages, so I won't start a thread but I'm most impressed with the stuff. I'll post some pics up.

Greets fs. Long time m8. Thanks for the props. I'll pop by & bump Querkle in a mo.


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## floridasucks (Jun 23, 2009)

yea man ive been on vacation for 2 weeks. it was nice to get out of miami for a while but i realized i missed it here real quick.


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## tom__420 (Jun 23, 2009)

floridasucks said:


> yea man ive been on vacation for 2 weeks. it was nice to get out of miami for a while but i realized i missed it here real quick.


Lol too bad you can't change your username....

Just messin with you bro


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## v12xjs (Jun 23, 2009)

OK Here's an update on my trials of sphagnum moss so far.
I've got 3 plants in various blends of soil/moss. First was Tera who was planted in it from birth and has shown much accelerated growth over all the other seeds from the same pack. She's healthy as can be and has grown 1/2 inch overnight on a couple of occassions.
2nd plant was a hempy experiment that didn't work out. Not sure why as it's hard to muck up a 100% perlite mix and I could see the roots at the bottom of the pot so it was feeding fine but just didn't like it. She got repotted a week ago into a 40/30/30 soil/perlite/moss mix and has just started recovering from the operation with some serious growth.
Last one was a cockup of mine. I took a cutting from the reveg plant but couldn't find my rooting hormone and the local DIY store had none either, so I ended up just putting it into a 100% moss pot with some plain water and covered it with a poly bag. Obviously I crossed my fingers too  Yesterday it got a 200ppm veg feed and it has rooted!
I took the bag off last night and put it under the lights but it had wilted within an hour and I feared the worst, but I replaced the bag and this morning the little soldier is back in a proud upright position and looking hot to trot 
All in all I'm sold on the use of sphagnum moss and it's just a matter of playing around until I work out the best way to utilise it. Cerebralvibrator is also playing with it and is getting equally amazing results, so it isn't just my imagination.
Here's some pics. Tera went in on May 9 so she's around 6 weeks old. The hempy-gone-wrong went in on 21 May but she didn't like the hempy and had a week of shock after the transplant, so she's 4 weeks old and the cutting is 8 days Today.


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## cerebralvibrator (Jun 23, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> OK Here's an update on my trials of sphagnum moss so far.
> I've got 3 plants in various blends of soil/moss. First was Tera who was planted in it from birth and has shown much accelerated growth over all the other seeds from the same pack. She's healthy as can be and has grown 1/2 inch overnight on a couple of occassions.
> 2nd plant was a hempy experiment that didn't work out. Not sure why as it's hard to muck up a 100% perlite mix and I could see the roots at the bottom of the pot so it was feeding fine but just didn't like it. She got repotted a week ago into a 40/30/30 soil/perlite/moss mix and has just started recovering from the operation with some serious growth.
> Last one was a cockup of mine. I took a cutting from the reveg plant but couldn't find my rooting hormone and the local DIY store had none either, so I ended up just putting it into a 100% moss pot with some plain water and covered it with a poly bag. Obviously I crossed my fingers too  Yesterday it got a 200ppm veg feed and it has rooted!
> ...


V12,

Its defo not your imagination! I dont think I've been growing herb for as long as you have BUt I have been growing for 13 years and pretty much by the same methods/soil mix etc for at least the last 8 of those years. I've tried drainage layers of pebbles/ perlite etc but this is the first time with a 1" bottom layer of the moss and I'm seeing something special happening here. I know the bubba O Kush strain very well and this is the first time I've seen one at 8 weeks 12/12 still pumping out flowers all over (kind of like the 'foxtails' are foxtailing out the sides too !!!). Shes doubled in size in the last 7-10 days and thats no exageration. Theres barely a brown hair on her!

I was in the garden centre today again and picked up another bag of it! When you pick it up its like picking up a natural sponge, bag says it holds up to 20 times its own weight in water and I would not dispute that  

A few more grows will tell but I currently have 4 x Northern Lights fems in usual soil mix but WITH the *moss* bottom layer.

Your plants look beautiful V12  A veritable miniature forest in a pC case mate. 

Anyone else wants to try it you can get bags of it from good garden centres for lining hanging baskets etc. Cost is a bout £7.00 for a big bag enough to line a lot of pots. Pic below.

Take it easy there V12, suns shining today and everythings good in the garden


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## floridasucks (Jun 23, 2009)

yep its no joke, i use shpagnum/ peat moss too with good results.


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## v12xjs (Jun 23, 2009)

Well there you have it. Proof positive that great minds think alike 

I'll post another update in a week. I think there will be a marked difference.


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## dopewear (Jun 24, 2009)

as always v. your progress makes my jaw drop and i bow down before the... those plants look amazing my friend keep up the awesome work! im gonna drop you an email tonight with some qestions... cheers DW


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## v12xjs (Jun 24, 2009)

Cheers DW. Look forward to it.
Hope you've got new pics up 

Greets medimaryuser too


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## Mentalchild (Jun 24, 2009)

Man whats with that one plant with the ends of the leaves cut off lol it looks like my dog got to it lol (My dog bit the end off one of my leaves.
Also subscribed lol finally.


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## floridasucks (Jun 24, 2009)

Mentalchild said:


> Man whats with that one plant with the ends of the leaves cut off lol it looks like my dog got to it lol (My dog bit the end off one of my leaves.
> Also subscribed lol finally.


...........clone?


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## v12xjs (Jun 24, 2009)

Hey MC.
It's a cutting. Doing that helps them to keep moist.
I thought I was quite artistic. Better than a dog 
Only jk


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## Mentalchild (Jun 24, 2009)

lol ^^. I wish my plants looked like yours mine don'y even want to tell me sex and its been so long >.<. Man how many grows have you done?


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## cerebralvibrator (Jun 25, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey MC.
> It's a cutting. Doing that helps them to keep moist.
> I thought I was quite artistic. Better than a dog
> Only jk


I always trim the leaf ends like that when I take cuttings too, most growers do it. 

Shes a healthy little specimen V12, like all your plants


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## johnno (Jun 25, 2009)

thats real nice good work man


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## v12xjs (Jun 25, 2009)

Hey MC. Never really counted my grows.
Been growing under lights since I got my first apartment in 1981 although things were a bit different back then. Nutes came from the rear end of horses and things like hydroponics and pc's were yet to be invented!
Most of my grows have been in restricted spaces so I guess I have plenty of experience, but I've still learned plenty of new tricks from the helpful people here at RIU in the last few months so I wouldn't consider myself an expert by any means.
Speaking of new tricks, I especially love myth busters and big props go out to cerebralvibrator for smashing the 1 plant per pot myth and also floridasucks for proving that 80% humidity is no barrier to growing. Those guys are genuine pioneers and I have a lot of respect for them 

Hey CV. I noticed you trim the leaves too. Just hope that little soldier does as well as your ladies. She still needs the humidity dome but I checked underneath last night and she has a tiny little tap root now, so I can uncross my fingers at least 

Welcome johnno and thanks for the kind words.


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## Mentalchild (Jun 25, 2009)

Nice man so basically you were kinda doing stealth grow before pc growing came out lol. Man dude i think i got bad news i looked in on my grow this morning and the 2 ones in a trash bin looks like they are telling me sex but still to small to tell but one of them im for sure is probably a male because it looks like there is 3 little round things they look like they are stuck together but aren't 1 thing and there is another set of these on the other side of the node and on the node above that node. I would take a picture but it will be way to blurry and i have nothing to look up close to tell what it is. The other one in the trash bin looks like it is also telling sex but there one has like 1 little thing on both sides of the nodes i think this one might be female. i wish i could post a picture where you all can tell what it is so i can get it the hell out my grow now.


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## v12xjs (Jun 25, 2009)

You have a little while before the males will cause a problem MC. Long enough to tell what sex they are at least. Sounds like 1 will be a girl though, so a harvest is coming your way


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## Mentalchild (Jun 25, 2009)

woot ^^. Lol to bad i still don't know the sex of the 55 day old plant <.<. So what your girls up to today


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## v12xjs (Jun 25, 2009)

They've been resting. Luckily they don't snore as bad as some ladies I've known 
It's 9:50pm here and today starts for them in about 10 minutes.
It's most hypnotic when I look in on them. The smell is amazing and it's just a wall of healthy green. I've been a bit lazy recently and let them just grow cos they look so nice


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## Mentalchild (Jun 25, 2009)

Which mine was like that  im all confused. My oldest one's new branches not the big fan leaves but the new ones shooting off the main stem arent all growing at the same height well only 2 seem to be shooint off the main stem the others are staying all close to it and i moved the fan leaves so they can get light but idk. How many clones can you get off your plants?


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## v12xjs (Jun 26, 2009)

Just get the very top ball of growth and gently hook it down just below the sidebranches you want to stimulate. That should kickstart it. You will need to train some of the sidebranches too.

I don't take cuts from my plants. The 12/12 means that they are flowering by the time they have enough growth. That cutting came from an old harvested plant that went outside for revegging. I'm hoping it will keep me in cuttings for the next 3 months and then supply a bumper crop for the winter months 

If you look carfully you can see her in her new home here:


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## Mentalchild (Jun 26, 2009)

Ok man will try that and i already got all the side branches trained down so they can get light in there. Yup yup i see it i see it!! lol.


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## OutdoIndo (Jun 26, 2009)

Looks nice vx, check my new babies now, they are on their 2nd day of flowering.


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## Mentalchild (Jun 26, 2009)

Those seedlings or clones? Nice babies you got there.


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## tom__420 (Jun 26, 2009)

They are seedlings, clones do not have cotyledons


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## Mentalchild (Jun 27, 2009)

Oh sorry about that lol wasn't paying attention fully i think. And you can flower them when they are that big? Sorry not trying to jack thread you know me v12 im just a curious person.


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## tom__420 (Jun 27, 2009)

You can flower the plants directly from sprouting if you want. Check out the growFAQ, it will answer all of your questions


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## Mentalchild (Jun 28, 2009)

Ok lol that sounds interesting ok i will.


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## v12xjs (Jun 28, 2009)

Plants look great Outdo.
Put a link to your grow in your sig so MC can check it out.


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## MediMaryUser (Jun 29, 2009)

nice little outdoor plant v12xjs


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## v12xjs (Jun 29, 2009)

Thanks MediMaryUser. Nice to see you back here.

Loving that avatar too. Fast motorbikes and good bud are 2 of my favourite things, although not usually at the same time 

The little outside plant is doing well. I'll post an update tomorrow.


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## dopewear (Jun 29, 2009)

nice little outdoor plant you got there sir


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## Mentalchild (Jun 30, 2009)

Its tomorrow now where you at


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## v12xjs (Jun 30, 2009)

You've got me bang to rights there MC 
As promised here's some updates to show development over the last week.
First up is the cutting. Remember she has had no rooting hormones, so she can be forgiven for being a slow starter. She'll pick up.
Next is the failed Hempy experiment. She's come on plenty over the last week. She would look more photogenic but I've tied down the whole of the top cola. You can see it under the red band in the middle.
Next 3 shots are of Tera. I've started to rein her in a bit now as I need to reclaim a bit of room for the cutting. If you remember that 9 fingered leaf, it's right at the bottom and shows just how much growing she's done since that leaf came out exactly 28 days ago. There's a picture of the top canopy and one of the side colas too. She's around 2 weeks into flowering so those colas have some filling out to do but I'm pleased with her so far.
Last 2 are of Veronica, the next girl to be harvested and finally a shot of Pandora doing very nicely outside.


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## floridasucks (Jun 30, 2009)

beautiful plants v, as always.


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## v12xjs (Jun 30, 2009)

Thanks fs. Just wish I was as handy with a camera as you are


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## cerebralvibrator (Jun 30, 2009)

Good to see Pandora coming back strong  Veronica looks a beauty, everything looks so healthy V12. Tera looks vigorous still. Thanks for keeping this going, I get a real kick out of seeing what you do inside that case.

V12, I harvested that little Kush today so I'm going to take a look and see how the roots look in that Sphag moss (I'll learn to spell it correctly one day


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## v12xjs (Jun 30, 2009)

Hey thanks CV.
The thread doesn't seem to want to be closed so I figure why not pop the odd update in. Glad you like them.

Tera is pretty good overall but with her height she has been messing with my airflow and consequently she has a bit of heat stress on both the edges from being so close to the ballast of the light. It's nothing major but I think I may have just bought the ideal solution.
It turns out that you can buy external ballasts for cfl's and also the accompanying ballast-free bulbs. They do 150/200/300w bulbs so I've gone for a 150. That's still a 25% increase in my available light but with a fraction of the heat. I think it was my lucky day spotting that kit.
Have a look under cfl's at nlight dot co dot uk if you are interested.

EDIT: Forgot to say I would be most interested in seeing the rootstock for that monster, and especially any extra growth from using the moss. Please post a shot if you can.


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## Mentalchild (Jun 30, 2009)

Nice v12 looking good. Your cutting looks just like mine that i did today i got 2 clones going on now ^^. The first one is of the plant i think is female and the one i did today is from the plant that im sure is a male i did it just to see if i could and who knows i might put him outside somewhere and keep him there and collect pollen from him ^^.


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## tom__420 (Jun 30, 2009)

Mentalchild said:


> Nice v12 looking good. Your cutting looks just like mine that i did today i got 2 clones going on now ^^. The first one is of the plant i think is female and the one i did today is from the plant that im sure is a male i did it just to see if i could and who knows i might put him outside somewhere and keep him there and collect pollen from him ^^.


That would be a dick move honestly to put the male outside. I would be pissed as hell if my outdoor female got pollinated by someone elses male


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## Mentalchild (Jun 30, 2009)

Lol well you don't got to worry about that i don't live near anyone and well if someone has their female plants on my property they deserved it then lol they just better not let me find the plants.


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## floridasucks (Jul 1, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Thanks fs. Just wish I was as handy with a camera as you are




im not the photographer, thats my girl. i take some good pix but most of the credit has to go to her.


randomness.. check out my grow!!! https://www.rollitup.org/outdoor-growing/195991-florida-outdoor-2009-a.html


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## Mentalchild (Jul 1, 2009)

Yo v12 i got a update on my grow check it out ^^.


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## v12xjs (Jul 1, 2009)

Will do guys.


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## Mentalchild (Jul 1, 2009)

Yo you should put my grow journal in the grow journal post on the pc grow forum.


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## v12xjs (Jul 2, 2009)

Do it yourself MC. Add any other grows you've come across too.


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## Mentalchild (Jul 2, 2009)

ok will do lol i just like being lazy <.< lol.


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## Mentalchild (Jul 25, 2009)

Yo what's up with the girls?


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## v12xjs (Jul 27, 2009)

Hey MC
Just got back from the MotoGP so I haven't seen them for a couple of days. I'll snap some pics when the lights go on in a couple of hours.
Chopped this baby last week though. Biggest cola I've had from the case I think


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## Mentalchild (Jul 27, 2009)

Damn lol i want a cola i don't care if it is small lol i want one >.< . I got a question someone asked me today. Around harvest season is there a way for cops to get in helicopters and use something to see if there is weed being grown in the house? Like thermo vision or some shit?


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## cerebralvibrator (Jul 28, 2009)

That PC case must be like a bloody tardis inside V12  It never fails to amaze me! Look forward to the latest pics.

MC .... Unless you are growing huge crops under huge lamps you have nothing to worry about  Your TV probably gives off more heat!


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## Mentalchild (Jul 28, 2009)

ok lol because i wondered and i wasn't going to ask but then my friend asked me the same thing so i just thought id ask.


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## v12xjs (Jul 28, 2009)

Hey MC
You'll get a harvest soon m8 
Like CV says, nothing to worry about with a cfl micro grow.
If you want something to worry about go to your google page and click on where it says privacy to see what kind of shit they are recording about you!
I'm posting a pic of my stem to show you how they look.

Greets CV
Tardis indeed 
There's 6 in there just now and number 7 is growing roots on a windowsill. 

Terra has been looking a bit poorly after she outgrew her pot. I misdiagnosed it too as she wilted a bit while the temps were high so I thought it was heat stress at first. It's made her look a bit sorry for herself and knocked her back 10 days but she's started growing again now. Got an odd trait in my oldest cutting too. It seems too uniform for a deficiency, but it's from a mum that never did that so I don't know what to think.
Here's some pics:


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## Mentalchild (Jul 28, 2009)

Damn thats a thick stem.


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## cerebralvibrator (Jul 28, 2009)

Lovely pics mate  That one inside the case made me smile, I looked at them all standing out of the case and thought, how do they all fit in there! ..... but they do  its brilliant.

I'm looking round for an old case for my veg box now V12. All I want to keep in there will be 2 small mother plants plus any cuttings I take from them, normally just a couple at a time so should be perfect, but to be honest its just the sheer ingenuity and the challenge of growing in a PC case that I like.

Keep the pics coming V12, this thread refuses to die!


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## Mentalchild (Jul 28, 2009)

Lol refuses to die .


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## v12xjs (Jul 28, 2009)

It is a bit of a squeeze in there 
Should be ideal for some mums & a creche though CV. Visit a computer fair if you are looking for a cheapo old used case.

I think maybe you guys are right about the thread refusing to die. Did we try a silver bullet through the heart yet? 
I was thinking of starting a new journal when I get the old seeded plants out and I'm running just clones. I'll be needing some help and advice as there's a few new tricks I need to master to get it as I would like, but I guess I can post up progress in here until I'm ready.
I'll charge up the camera battery


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## ElephantRider (Jul 28, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey MC
> Just got back from the MotoGP so I haven't seen them for a couple of days. I'll snap some pics when the lights go on in a couple of hours.
> Chopped this baby last week though. Biggest cola I've had from the case I think


Jesus jones, man! And I thought my diesel colas were massive! If you don't mind the asking, what was the weight on that whole plant, wet?


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## ElephantRider (Jul 28, 2009)

Alright, so it appears you have now gotten something cloned? Can you help me out on that? Just clipping, dip in rooting hormone, pop in dirt, make soil extra wet and cover with a baggie?


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## grow space (Jul 28, 2009)

looking great man.
if i would get my hand one of those pc case-then hardcore lst stealth grow will be on.




keep up the good work....


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## arcticvapors (Jul 28, 2009)

looking great v12...love the micro grows...starting my pc grow back up when i get my cheese beans...peace


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## v12xjs (Jul 28, 2009)

Hey ER. Good to see you m8.
That is one fat cola eh 
I never weighed her so I don't know what wet weight was. She has another week in the jar but I'll check out the final weight for you when I get a chance.
Your cloning routine is exactly what I do but after clipping, I cut the stalk to 45 degrees and replace the soil with 100% sphagnum moss. It works absolute miracles. 

Thanks for the comment grow space. Case grows are fun.

Hey arctic. Cheers m8. Look forward to seeing you back up and running, I'll keep an eye out for that journal.


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## arcticvapors (Jul 28, 2009)

i started a bagseed thread...its in my sig...i had the worst time with my last two attempts...four out of four were males in the 2nd grow (found that out on day 27)...3rd grow wasn't really a grow as my seedlings never grew...even after 25-30 days they only had one set of leaves, i think i had bad soil asd fungus gnats. i found a grow shop within 1.5 miles from my house that i didn't even know was there and they have FF and all kinds of nutes...psyched about that. will keep the new bagseed thread updated. peace


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## Mentalchild (Jul 28, 2009)

Ouch man i no how bad that is having all males out of a grow lol.


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## ElephantRider (Jul 28, 2009)

OK.. So.. exactly as I described, but 100% sphagnum moss, eh? I have a whole bag of that stuff, after seeing your 7 leaf post. I've been mostly just reading the past month or 2, as life's been moving unreal fast. Things should settle in a month or 2. You gotta see the latest bonsai. My Citral that I planted on day 1 with my Top44.. well.. it's a she and she's laid out real cool. I may be able to get a snap in the next few days.. we'll see. I am betting on 1.5 oz. out of it, alone.  

Also.. harvested about 100 Auto White Russian seeds. It's so many that it's not even worth counting.


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## cerebralvibrator (Jul 29, 2009)

ER, can I just add here ....that Sphagnum moss is amazing from what I am seeing here so far  Its somehow like everything has speeded up quite noticably, almost like hydro growth rates!! I really think V12 has found what could be a key to improved growth in soil. Time will tell. I'm using it now to line the bottom of every pot, it seems to act like a sort of res with stable PH, the roots have a constant source of moisture but with excellent aeration. Give it a try.)

Have you found your camera yet?


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## v12xjs (Jul 29, 2009)

That's tough luck on those males arctic. Odds should be stacked in your favour this time around. Fingers crossed m8 

Hey ER. That 7 fingered plant put out 9's at the 4th node. Something I've never seen in a case before. My first attempt at cloning in moss was done without any hormone cos I lost mine. It worked perfectly and I'd never managed to get a cutting that lived before that.
Like CV says, moss brings something to the party that these plants just love. Give it a try for sure.
Sounds like you've been working wonders in the background. The Citral sounds awesome. Pics would be good 

I'll take some quick pics and show you guys the new plan.


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## v12xjs (Jul 29, 2009)

So here's the new plan.
I have 4 healthy cuttings all about a week apart. The idea is to top the oldest and use the clipped top as my next cutting. They take about 2 weeks to establish themselves so with 3 plants I should be able to produce a cutting every 7 days.
With that working I can keep the case in bloom without ever buying another seed unless I fancy a change of strain. I got my first successful cutting from a cutting yesterday, so that's stage 1 complete 

Next up is how to grow so many plants in the tardis 
I'm thinking that I want either 2 or 4 growing tops on the plants and my first cut-from-a-cut left 4 growing tops on the original plant. This is where I'm struggling ATM as those 4 tops have grown a couple of inches each day since I gave the 1st feeding. I wasn't planning on using LST so I need to tame that growth and I think if I reduce it to 2 tops the problem will be even worse.
The preflowers look most promising though 

I will also need new pots if I want so many plants in there, so I guess it's time to do some reading and some shopping. Any suggestions would be most welcome.

Here's a pic of all 4 cuttings and 1 of the eldest with the new baby I took from her. There's a pic of the early preflowers on the biggest as well.


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## Mentalchild (Jul 29, 2009)

Plants are coming alone just nice and that sounds like a plan i might (if mine ever make it that far and be female) do what your doing ^^.


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## v12xjs (Aug 2, 2009)

Quick update on the state of play.
Still got the old guard in the case. Terra is pretty close to harvest, she's been flushing for a week so prolly getting the chop next Thursday or Sunday. HempyGoneWrong is starting to come into her own, she looks great and is packing on the buds now too 
The clone army is coming along nicely. Still only 4 plants but another will be ready to go in by Tuesday. The next phase of the experiment is to see if I can top a clone that is under 12/12 and root the cutting under 12/12 too. Not sure this is actually viable but there's only 1 way to find out. Wish me luck.
Here's a couple of pics from this morning:


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## Mentalchild (Aug 2, 2009)

Luck wished ^^. tell me how that topping turns out.


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## cerebralvibrator (Aug 2, 2009)

Looking good in there V12  tight as the nuns proverbial whatsit  Those cuts look real healthy too, I dont see any reason why you should not root a clone cut from an early clone either, fingers crossed anyway.

*Hempygonewrong* seems determined to show what she can do... does she have a bit of moss in the soil mix V12?

Liking your style as usual mate 

CV.


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## v12xjs (Aug 3, 2009)

Thanks MC.

Cheers CV. Yes there's 30% moss and 30% perlite in HempyGoneWrong's pot, so it's almost a hydro grow!
Still not sure how best to utilise moss but I think maybe you have the right idea by just lining the pots. Root space is at such a premium for me that just mixing it in seemed the easiest option but it stimulates the root a bit too much TBH.
I'm wondering now if I can combine the hempy bucket with the moss to get my desired effect. I think the 12/12 sysem was the reason my hempy trial failed as the plants don't put out much root growth compared to a plant in veg. Maybe the moss instead of perlite in a hempy would give the plants the start they need.
I guess I know what to try next


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## MediMaryUser (Aug 6, 2009)

Here's a couple of pics from this morning:

Everything looks great v12


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## floridasucks (Aug 6, 2009)

dam v you have so many plants squeezed in there. lookin good, as always.


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## Iwuzbornhigh (Aug 6, 2009)

Wow man thats what im trying to do I have to check you out! good job


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## v12xjs (Aug 6, 2009)

Thanks MediMaryUser. Good to see you again, hope things are good with you. Some top advice you gave earlier in the Outdoor forum. I'm sure it was appreciated.

Greets fs. I'd put in some pics of my manicured toenails but there just isn't any room 
Could always find a spot for one of those new breeds of yours though.

Hey bornhigh
Thanks for stopping by. Got your message and I'll pop over soon.
Check out Sketzoh's PC Growers Gang for some great background research. There's a post full of links to pc grows. Add yours. 
There's a link in my sig.

Got an update from lights on last night. There's allsorts going on in there just now 
In the group pic you can see HempyGoneWrong at the back left. If you look closely you can see some bleaching on her from the new light. Think I may have found a solution though, I fitted a diffused plastic strap under the 2 lowest filaments of the bulb. There's no bleaching on the cuttings so I think it's just a temporary glitch.
In front of Hempy is a new hempy bucket experiment with moss instead of perlite. She went straight into 12/12 after her repot.
The other pics are just budshots, including the one I plan to use for testing after I cut Terra on Saturday night.
Here's the pics:


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## arcticvapors (Aug 6, 2009)

looking great V12...


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## v12xjs (Aug 6, 2009)

Cheers m8.
Realy appreciate the props. Means a lot form someone who knows the deal.
Good luck with your latest grow. I'll check it out in a mo.


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## ElephantRider (Aug 6, 2009)

you're really packing it in there these days, man. I really gotta get you a pic of the insanity in my flower case..


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## cerebralvibrator (Aug 7, 2009)

ElephantRider said:


> you're really packing it in there these days, man. I really gotta get you a pic of the insanity in my flower case..


I have a theory that V12 has actually constructed a PC case 4x normal size for this thread  

V12, lovely as ever mate. They really look healthy. Can I ask again what soil you use and your watering /feeding regime because I'm re thinking this for my future plants. 

Buds look tasty, plenty of sparkle in there.

CV.


ER, I can't wait to see what you're up to atm.


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## v12xjs (Aug 7, 2009)

Hey ER. Good to see you m8. If you still have no cam then do a painting for us 
I think we're all gagging to see what you've been up to!
The plan for me was to move to more plants of smaller stature but I think the genetics I currently have are just a bit to big and bold so I may have to drop back to the original plan and sort out a more suitable strain.
I always fancied Nefertiti for it's single cola growth pattern so maybe I'll get some of those for my next experiment.
Did you ever try the moss cloning trick?

Hey CV. Wish I had the space to fool all you guys with a 4x case 
As soon as I get Terra out of there the place will have a mountain of room! I nicknamed her Bigfoot after the repot 

The best mix I've had so far is the mix Hempy went into after I renamed her to HempyGoneWrong. She looks like she will be ok in the 1.1 litre container and the blue light seems to be keeping her from yellowing off. She has 3 or 4 weeks to go but all is looking well so far.
The mix is 40% soil, 30% perlite and 30% moss. Half of the moss is cut into small bits and the rest left as long strands.
With hardly any nutes in the mix she went onto 100ppm veg pretty soon and that was upped to 250 when the first yellowing appeared at the bottom. I alternated veg and bloom nutes while she was preflowering and I've worked up to 500ppm of bloom now but every 3rd watering is a 100ppm veg feed as a kind of tonic. She will get 750ppm bloom nutes for the last week before her flush and I ph everything to 6.4.
Even with all the soil/perlite/moss/roots, she takes 400ml of food every time. Usually she needs a top up every 3 days but while she was in the growth spurt it was every 2nd day. The soil always feels moist even right on the top layer, but after 3 days the pot feels light as a feather so I know it's time to top up.

Just a tip for when you have multiple plants at different stages. I mix my food up at 2 or 3 times max strength and water it down in a measuring jug. 4 water to 1 food = 500 ppm so I can use that for the big girls. Water what's left down 50/50 gives me 250ppm for the smaller girls and dilute what's left 50/50 again for the toddlers. Makes things sooo much easier than individual bottles for each plant.


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## cerebralvibrator (Aug 7, 2009)

V12, thanks for that detailed reply, its really useful. Do you PH the water ? I have to be honest, I grew for years without ever bothering to adjust or even check PH and rarely had problems, my plants remained green and healthy right till the end aside of course from natural late yellowing. Since I've been using the PH down I've had more probs with burning etc on those fans.

So next run I'll try your % mix and cut the moss up a little, it makes sense to me. I may also revert to my old watering regime too, just to see 

Anyway, thanks again, I'm just off to update my thread and reply to your post.

*edit* sorry I just re read and see that you PH at 6.4 It may well be that I'm feeding too aggessively!

Cheers

CV.


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## v12xjs (Aug 7, 2009)

That's a very interesting point about lack of ph measurement. I never had problems when I was growing bagseed in the 80's and early 90's yet I never even considered ph values.
I wonder if it's because we have moved away from landrace strains in favour of genetics that have been bred for indoor and hydro growing traits. It seems certain to me that this is the reason we have to keep temps so low when indiginous plants thrive in much higher temps.

I've been looking in on Ston3rs grow and he was getting burning on leaf edges even before he started feeding. We think now it's because of a slight drooping caused by high humidity.
When the leaves transpire they put out moisture that needs to evaporate slowly but the drooping was causing leaves higher up to cover or rest on lower leaves so the ones underneath were getting soaking wet. Obviously when those leaves got some light or heat it caused them to dry up too quickly.
I wonder if that's what you are seeing rather than nuteburn?


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## Carolina Green Bud (Aug 11, 2009)

V12,
Read the first 25 plus pages of your thread until you harvested (Granita I think her name was). Great information, I think this could work for me. I'm gonna ask some questions, and I apoligize if they were asked before.

1. You said you bought your PC case on Ebay. I checked ebay and googled PC grow case and came across several "ready made" set ups, as well as instructions to build your own. Your's is ready made? Do you have any comments on what's on the market?

2. You start seeds every 3 weeks for a perpetual grow? How long from seed to harvest?

3. What is your light set up again?

4. You get feminized seeds of regular (not auto flowering strains) on a 12/12 light cycle What is the best? Wasn't it mostly sativa strains?

5. Why not not auto flowering except for lack of variety?


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## Carolina Green Bud (Aug 11, 2009)

One more.

6. How stealth can the PC case be. My wife is not cool at all. But, I am going to have to set up a home office with my job soon, so I'll be getting a new desk, etc. PC case under the desk would not attract much attention. I saw that there is no light leaking out, but what about odor, and how much noise from the fans?


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## v12xjs (Aug 13, 2009)

Hey CGB
Thanks for looking in. Here's some answers to your q's:
1. The case was just a cheapo case without a psu. The same case is still available. I saw 1 at scan.co.uk under the brand name xclio. Can't remember the model but it's the cheapest 1 they do. It wasn't prebuilt but the initial design was based on 1 of the available prebuilt solutions.
That design didn't really work as it used lack of light to control temps. I've not been impressed with any of the ready made solutions I've seen and would suggest building your own. If you want to link me to what you are looking at I'll let you know what i think about specific units.
2. The plants are usually in and out in 12 weeks
3. I have just changed my bulb but all the results in this journal were achieved under a 125w envirolite 2700k and a 13w 6500k cfl.
4. Indica dominant strains are best suited to the job. I've yet to grow anything that bettered Ice Cream for ease of growing or potency.
5. Auto's a very suitable for the task but taste & potency are not up with the best strains yet IMHO. The 2 week veg period also makes them tricky to train into decent canopies.
6. The cooker hood filter removes much of the smell and running the lights through the night means that any odours are emitted while everyone is asleep. The filter also helps trap light pretty well. Hard to describe noise and smell levels, but my rig has been running in a shared house for 12 months without detection and some housemates actually use the internet connection in my room. 
Low odour strains are available as are lemon & fruit smelling strains which also help.


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## Carolina Green Bud (Aug 13, 2009)

V12,
How soon do the plants show sex under 12/12.?I've got some free seeds that aren't feminized, that I may try to set somethin up like this, if not a PC case.
I figure if I'm experimenting, might as well be with free seeds. They are called "cheese wrecks" cross between Big Budda Cheese and Trainwreck.

Oh, and here is a link to one of the ready to go PC grow cases.

http://www.pcgrowcase.com/


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## floridasucks (Aug 13, 2009)

hmmm cheese wreck sounds good. check out purplewreck.


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## v12xjs (Aug 14, 2009)

Hey Green Bud
The plants usually take 3 - 5 weeks to show sex. A dry run with free seeds is a good idea but if you decide to go for it I'd definitely suggest feminised seeds. With mixed seeds you will half your yields at a stroke.

I've have seen the case in your link a couple of times & I wouldn't buy it personally. The 2 grows I've seen it used with have had such bad heat issues that 1 doesn't seem to use it any more and the other has to remove the door every time the lights come on.
I was also asked to look at a grow journal on youtube featuring the same case, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7jxGlGka9Q
The plant in the vid seems to have grown sideways and away from the light which no plant will do. The buds that are touching the side of the case and are getting no light are also as well developed as the rest of the plant. That never happens either. Finally if you compare those buds to cfl and hps buds you can tell pretty easy that the plant was grown under a hps.
If the guy who markets them doesn't even use it to make his own sales material, then perhaps it's best to follow his lead and use something else yourself.
Please don't expect anything even close to 2 -3lb a year out of a case either.


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## v12xjs (Aug 14, 2009)

Just a quick update on where I'm up to ATM.
I've harvested Terra and I've also given a couple of girls away, so things are decidedly quiet for me right now. Here's a pic of the 3 girls that are left and also the latest recruit. HempyGoneWrong is looking really promising with another 2 or 3 weeks to bulk up


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## UberSmoker (Aug 14, 2009)

Looking awesome V12, great job!


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## v12xjs (Aug 14, 2009)

Thanks Uber. 
Good to see you m8. Hope you get your rig back up & running soon.


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## Carolina Green Bud (Aug 14, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey Green Bud
> The plants usually take 3 - 5 weeks to show sex. A dry run with free seeds is a good idea but if you decide to go for it I'd definitely suggest feminised seeds. With mixed seeds you will half your yields at a stroke.
> 
> I've have seen the case in your link a couple of times & I wouldn't buy it personally. The 2 grows I've seen it used with have had such bad heat issues that 1 doesn't seem to use it any more and the other has to remove the door every time the lights come on.
> ...


V12,
I just want to say, that you are great about answering questions. Your thread, and willingness to help are awesome.

No question the youtube video was staged, but you know that's marketing. And yes, 3-4 pounds a year is crap..

But, I wonder why the person you knew had a heating problem with the unit? What is different about the circulation and lighting than the unit you are using?

I mean, if you are inside your house, and you are running an air conditioner, and you have a fan circulating air in and out of the unit, why would overheating be a problem. Maybe it's just an issue at your location. (You from down under?)

I'm in the SE US, and we run our air conditioning full blast. I promise you it hasn't been over 75 F degrees in my house all summer. Outside we hit 100 F last week.

Do you mind taking your plants out of the case and getting some shots of the inside, fan lights, etc.

Thanks again M8


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## v12xjs (Aug 15, 2009)

Hey Green Bud
Thanks for the kind words.

There's an album in my profile called case. Have a look through there, you should find what you need.

The thing with temps is that the room temp is going to be the lowest the case will be, so for you that means it will not get below 75F even when the lights are off, which is already higher than the plants want. Unless you have perfect ventilation and remove all heat as it gets generated, the temps will rise considerably from there when the lights go on.

I'm not going to do a full breakdown of problems & possible solutions for that unit as I have an issue with vendors who blatantly misrepresent their products. Personally I would rather have 3rd degree burns than publish anything that may assist them to fleece good people out of hard earned cash.
If you are still considering buying it you should really be putting your questions directly to them.
Sorry if that sounds a bit shitty. It's not meant as a dig at you.


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## UberSmoker (Aug 15, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Thanks Uber.
> Good to see you m8. Hope you get your rig back up & running soon.


No problem  it's good to be back mate. Just replaced the mylar in the rig as it got damaged in transport.

I also have to add an intake fan soon, as the new place is a lot warmer than where I was living before, and temps are frequently around 85F at the moment when the CFL is on. 

I'm gonna make a smaller internal carbon filter this time and add some dummy ports to the back of the case so it is fully stealth instead of looking half finished. 

I will definitely be posting a new journal to the PC Growers Gang and PC and Micro Growers Forum once the upgrades are done so keep an eye out for it.


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## cerebralvibrator (Aug 16, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey Green Bud
> Thanks for the kind words.
> 
> 
> ...


v12, Looking good mate  HempyGoneWrong is coming on a treat.

Just a thought on temps in a PC case, would it be possible to fit a glass heat shield right below the bulbs? I mean it could be bought cut to size to fit, but I guess it depends where the fans are pulling from? I'm considering of doing this in my small cabinet as I'm also struggling with temps atm!

CV.


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## v12xjs (Aug 16, 2009)

Thanks again Uber. I'll be watching out for the new journal.

Hey CV
Just for info, glass doesn't have any insulation properties, so it will transmit any heat from the bulbs straight through to the plants. I assume it's use in cooltubes is due mostly to the fact that it will not melt if the fans give up the ghost.
For best heat shielding properties, polycarbonate is the obvious choice as it is a much better insulator and will therefore contain more heat. At 2mm thickness it will not block any of the 2700k or 6500k light and will also allow a little of the UVB to get through to the other side, which I'm pretty sure is a good thing.
There's a guy on fleabay UK who cuts it to size. Mine was about £3 delivered. Just search on polycarbonate sheet.


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## Carolina Green Bud (Aug 18, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey Green Bud
> Thanks for the kind words.
> 
> There's an album in my profile called case. Have a look through there, you should find what you need.
> ...


Didn't take it as a dig. You don't like the product, and I appreciate the advice. I did check out the album on your case.


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## RedEyeJedi UK (Aug 21, 2009)

Still looking good V12 - I love the way all your buds look - so fruity looking!! 
I'm glad for my extra space now - I could never have kept it under control like you do in a PC case! 
"Short Rider" far from ressembles its name! LOL


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## dopewear (Aug 22, 2009)

hey v. long time no see, sounds like everything is going great. good to hear


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## v12xjs (Aug 22, 2009)

Greets DW. Hope the weather perked up for your outside girls. Bet they are looking sweet bby now 

Cheers redEye
Glad you picked the tent. Specially lucky given the problems with the strain you chose.
Landed on your feet though. I might start calling you GoldenBalls after this 
You jammy bastard 

Stuff is still rolling along as usual in the case. Had some teething troubles with the new bulb but they seem to be in hand. Gave a few plants up too but the 2 revegging plants have come up trumps and things are looking as they should.
Got some pics by way of update. Figured I'd post up some shots of how they all fit in there so here's a snapshot of how they go in there with the temp/humidity gauge.
There's a couple of canopy shots too. In one you can see the bud behind the fan. It's a 92mm fan so the bud is around 4 inches. If you look hard you can see the one next to it is even bigger!


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## dopewear (Aug 22, 2009)

those are some great pics v. you got another beauty on your hands! i just post new pics today of mine if you care to take a look


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## floridasucks (Aug 22, 2009)

u always got somethin nice goin v.


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## v12xjs (Aug 23, 2009)

Cheers fs.
Looking at that monster you have in your sig I'm thinking you could claim some International Carbon Credits for it soon 
DW isn't far behind you either


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## floridasucks (Aug 23, 2009)

haha.. thanx v. yea i saw DW's stuff, not bad at all. he will deff get some nice smoke off those.


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## v12xjs (Aug 27, 2009)

Just checkud up on the girls and the case looked really awesome tonight.
I'll let the pics do the talking:













Pc case grows with cfl's FTW!!!


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## OutdoIndo (Aug 27, 2009)

holy schkomoly! that is the most beautiful computer i've ever seen. how much longer 1-2 weeks?


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## tom__420 (Aug 27, 2009)

Filling in nicely there v12, keep up the nice stealth growing


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## v12xjs (Aug 28, 2009)

Thanks guys.
I gave away a couple of good looking girls to good causes recently or there would be even more going on 
The girl in the middle is half way through her flush and will be cut in the next week, the others are planted to finish every 2 weeks after that, so there's 14 weeks supply tucked away in there


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## floridasucks (Aug 28, 2009)

thats awsome.. really packin on the buds.


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## normancay (Sep 5, 2009)

looking great dude, check out mine if you get a chance..I am amazed at how you have maximized all your potential "floor" space inside the case...that is one of the things I failed to do...


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## v12xjs (Sep 6, 2009)

Cheers guys. I'll check out both your grows.

Got a swift update on the case and HempyGoneWrong. She got a bit big and with the new bulb she ended up with about 5 colas that were bleached at the top 1/4 inch, so I chopped them down but left the lower buds and the shorter colas to fatten up a bit. Here's a pic of the case before and after the trim plus a couple of shots of some of the dried buds:


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## RedEyeJedi UK (Sep 6, 2009)

It always amazes me how you manage to fit all them buds in a pc case...... 

Looks awsome dude, I'm quite jelous of the dried bud you've got - I can still only get hold of the nepal squidge... loads of it down here, never had it for this long before, I'm not gonna complain about it as it is better than most of the green goin around atm (Its all sprayed shite)... I keep on telling myself that its only a few weeks away - but it really can't come quick enough! lol


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## v12xjs (Sep 6, 2009)

Cheers RedEye.
I miss my black although I have had a bit this year. Harvest will come soon enough for you as long as you have that to keep you going 
You get a little home made black off the scissors every time you manicure buds. I must take a pic next time I collect a decent lump.


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## floridasucks (Sep 7, 2009)

beautiful budshots v!


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## dopewear (Sep 7, 2009)

v like usual those are some epic photos. I dont think I could ever come close to what you've got going on there! Anyways your grows never stop amazing me keep up! Cheers DW


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## BlazedMonkey (Sep 8, 2009)

Nice pics those buds are looking nice! Crossing my fingers i can replicate some of that success


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## v12xjs (Sep 8, 2009)

Greets DW & thanks m8. And to you too BM.
I'm only showing you guys what you can do. Can't wait to see all your pics. Charge up those cameras guys


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## MasterShake1 (Oct 3, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Hey there SketzoH
> 
> Thanks m8. It's always hard to tell what the yield will be but I think this Granita could be a personal best for me. I got 27g from a lowryder 2 a while back but it's possible I'll hit the magic 28 this time out.
> I know it doesn't sound like much in comparison to a scrog but the perpetual nature of this system actually yields more in the long run with less effort.
> ...





Man what an awesome link dude I love it. You just saved me a ton of money to. Thank you very much. Plus I Subscribed. What if you don't have one of those big pc like you have. Can you do it in a regular pc case and if so Does anybody body know of a thread with the build and possibly pics as well. I have 2 old cases and I can get more But I want to make sure you can do it before I go get more cases. Any help would be great guys Thanks


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## v12xjs (Oct 3, 2009)

Hey Mastershake.
Thanks for posting. It's really good to know this thread is still helping people.
If smaller cases is all you got then that's what you should grow in. I was inspired by Mr Micro's Nanomachine and it was way smaller than my rig.
If you still fancy a perpetual system then just get shorter flowering strains or leave a bit more time between plants. A single plant in plenty of soil grown as a scrog can be really productive too. You just got to dive in there and work out what's the best technique for what you have available.
I don't tend to update this page much anymore because RIU don't seem to respect microgrows and won't provide a dedicated forum for us despite the fact that this thread gets 1000 hits a week and Sketzoho's PC grow club is the best and fastest growing club here. Click the private microgrow forum link in my sig if you want to keep up with what I'm up to these days.
Let me know what you are working with and I'll give you a few suggestions to get you
started. 

I'm just off to tend to the garden now. If I've got any charge in the cam I'll take some pics and do an update. 
Oh and some +rep coming your way for doing the groundwork.


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## MasterShake1 (Oct 3, 2009)

Hey man I just registered on your page I will look it over with a fine tooth comb. Thank you very much for being so polite and helpful thank you.


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## MasterShake1 (Oct 3, 2009)

Oh by the way +1 rep for you Mr.


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## v12xjs (Oct 4, 2009)

Cheers 
Got some pics, so here's a quick update.
The cuttings don't fill the case in the same way seedlings do, so it looks a bit empty in there just now. I think with a bit of veg time they would do really well but I don't have the room, so it's back to the 12/12 from seed setup for me.
I've still not found the ideal solution to the bleaching caused by the new light but I'm managing ok and still have a few tricks to try to eliminate it completely. I don't want to change back to the 125w as the buds I'm getting now are sticky beyond belief, but you can see what's happening to the shade leaves so the plants are stressing a little and I do need to address it.
Here's the pics:


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## dopewear (Oct 5, 2009)

like always v. looking totaly beautiful!


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## arcticvapors (Oct 6, 2009)

nice job v12...they do look good.


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## Fditty00 (Oct 6, 2009)

Looks fucn great so far!


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## v12xjs (Oct 6, 2009)

Thanks guys. Very much appreciated.
I was all down on the grow but you guys are right, that case is full of promise. It just feels weird I'm the only guy here banging my head cos I have too much light!
To be fair there's only extra space in there because I gave a couple of plants away to worthy causes and at least I have a grow.
Thanks for putting me straight 

Hey DW. You gotta plant today for a xmas crop. Get growing m8!

Think I might have sorted the bleaching out also. I had a brainwave and went mad with some sandpaper on the plexiglass. I've made it so you can't see through it and I think it will resolve the problem of too many lumens.
I tried it out last night and they do seem to have improved a little. Still got all the bleach damage and some burnt tips but this is restricted to lower growth now.
Here's a family shot taken about 20 minutes ago and a couple of pics of the oldest girl. She showed her 1st flower on september 6 and has been in full flower for about 14 days. I told you they were sticky


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## floridasucks (Oct 6, 2009)

hey v12, lookin sticky. what strains are you running now?


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## v12xjs (Oct 6, 2009)

Just finishing off those jack seeds. Picked up some white label NL fems to get me over the holidays and give me time to pick a new strain. Lovin your offspring mate


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## dopewear (Oct 6, 2009)

V. they are looking great and yes i will get my x-max grow going this week ive been super busy but its time to crack down and get it going.


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## v12xjs (Oct 6, 2009)

That's what I like to hear. Can't wait to see what you got planned.


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## dopewear (Oct 6, 2009)

im aiming to impress you v. so i hope your happy when i show you the new set up


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## floridasucks (Oct 6, 2009)

v12xjs said:


> Just finishing off those jack seeds. Picked up some white label NL fems to get me over the holidays and give me time to pick a new strain. Lovin your offspring mate


thanx alot v, loving yours too.


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## robby963 (Dec 1, 2009)

how does the plant flower when its so small ?

how do you keep it small ?

what lights did you use ?


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## v12xjs (Dec 1, 2009)

Hey 963

Plants will flower small no probs. A combination of a few well known growing techniques can keep things under tight control, and as long as they produce some cloudy trichs then they did their job. With a bit of experience the only difference between small plants and large ones is measured in weight.
Any questions you have will have been answered somewhere in this journal. Have a read and let me know if anything isn't clear.

Might pay to edit your location details. I revere your town for reasons to do with the oval ball, but sadly it isn't just potheads that come to RIU to learn.


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## robby963 (Dec 1, 2009)

what do you mean edit my location details ?


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## v12xjs (Dec 1, 2009)

Well if I was looking for you I think I could narrow it down to a town and a first name already, and that's off 1 post. Nuff said?


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## robby963 (Dec 1, 2009)

im confused but never mind......


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## v12xjs (Dec 1, 2009)

I was trying to tell you that police monitor places like this and maybe you just told them your name and where you live, but I guess I'm not so good at being subtle.


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## hawaiianDirtBag (Dec 1, 2009)

awesome work man im try'n the same kinda thing but only in a rubbermaid tub you said you had lights 12/12 from seedlings and many plants in different stages of growth thanks in advance


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## robby963 (Dec 1, 2009)

i dont grow anyway, i used to but my parents found it :/ gd job it was harvest time


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## worm5376 (Dec 3, 2009)

Hey v, lend me some of your comic books !! lol


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## v12xjs (Dec 7, 2009)

Hey thanks hawaiian.
I like having plants at different sizes because I can give 50% of all the light to the biggest plant and keep another 3 ticking over nicely with the leftovers. I could only get 2 full sized plants in there at a time and that would halve my output.

Hey robby
Just trying to help.

Greets worm. Been a while m8.
I'll dust off my old scanner & see if I can't immortalize some of those cartoons for you.


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## maturesmoker (Dec 8, 2009)

V12, I am so glad to see you keeping this thread going/growing  

I had to take a step back a few months back and now have a new username but you knew me as 'cerebralvibrator'...............both HAWKWIND fans, remember? Apologies for seeming to suddenly vanish but I'm afraid anxiety got the better of me. I hope you are keeping well, I'd like to PM you if you don't mind to explain what happened?

Anyway, just referred a new PC case grower over here for some info as I'm sure you're the man to help him!

ms.


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## v12xjs (Dec 8, 2009)

Hey ms
Kind of figured who you were. 336 watts of cfl and a helpful attitude south of Watford was a bit of a giveaway 
Didn't want to pipe up and blow your new ID though. 
You're always welcome to pm me but there's no need to explain anything. Glad we're good TBH as I really wanted to know what you thought about those biobizz nutes?


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## v12xjs (Dec 8, 2009)

Just an update on the current state of play aound here; The growcase is still churning out little wonders of nature every time my stash gets low but after many months of constant use it's beginning to get a bit the worse for wear and needs a full overhaul. I could prolly do it in a day or 2 but I've decided to build a new unit and start over, so I'm down to a couple of NL's and some cuttings. Nothing especially photogenic after the standards I've already set 
I figure the pc case thing has proved it's value to me many times over, so the construction will take the shape of a tower case once again, but I've got some killer plans for it. 
New for the 2010 model is a 100w HPS/MH/CMH ballast and matching CMH bulb. I'm also going to fit underfloor heating! It's very likely it will be a pentium4 as well 
None of your pikey amd shit for my girls 
All the parts will be arriving over the next couple of weeks so I'll take some snaps and prolly start a new thread in the new year.
Not sure it will be on here though.


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## maturesmoker (Dec 10, 2009)

Cheers V12 

Can you let me know where/when you start the new thread please? I'd like to follow it. 

Your* heat shield* idea made me decide to do the same in my cab and its brilliant. Thin glass cut to size and bang!... temps drop right down. Defo the way to go in a small case/cabinet grow.

All the best mate.


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## v12xjs (Dec 24, 2009)

Ooops.
Sorry guys. 
I moved some pics around on photobucket so I could start an album for the new CMH bulb I'm using and forgot that they were linked here. I've restored what I can but I've forgotten which pics go where so there's some gaps I'm having trouble filling in.
By way of apology Here's a couple of the last shots I took before I switched the bulbs last Sunday.
First is a cured nug ready for me to smoke, next up is a pic of the new NL genetics. This is the main cola after 1 week of flowering. Last is a macro shot of some Jack moments before she was cut down.
Sadly the bulb has now been removed and replaced with an Osram Powerball HCI-T 100w, so the case as featured here is no more 
Wish me luck with the new kit. 
Best wishes from me for xmas & the new year.


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## v12xjs (Jan 28, 2010)

Just a quick update. I've been working out the kinks since I took out the cfl's and fitted a cmh in the case. I got a new acrylic sheet today to replace the old one and when I fit that later everything should be done and dusted.
There's a small batch of NL's in residence just now. They've been a bit problematic but again I think I've sorted out enough of the issues to get something worthwhile out of the grow. The signs for the future are very promising judging by what I've seen so far.
Here's a couple of recent pics, the main plant is about 6 weeks into flowering:


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## tom__420 (Jan 28, 2010)

Looking nice man, they are looking hungry for magnesium though


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## v12xjs (Jan 28, 2010)

Cheers Tom. Good call.
I think I've sorted it now but these plants hate sitting in damp soil so I've had a nightmare trying to feed them while they are young. They just show heavy overwatering symptoms the moment I feed them!
I think they would be better suited to a flood and drain system but they won't find one in my case.


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## ElephantRider (Feb 1, 2010)

Great to see you're still at it, brother! Rep for the CMH, too!! I have been auto white Russian on t5ho recently. Wow!! Actually, the awr is just great overall, except that you need to breed it to keep going.


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## v12xjs (Feb 2, 2010)

Hey ER. Good to see you still at it, sounds like you've been busy too. Love to see some pics of the ruskies if you get a chance.


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## maturesmoker (Feb 2, 2010)

Some great buds in those last pics V12  Impressive as ever.


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## v12xjs (Feb 2, 2010)

Thanks ms. 
The biggest girl has an appointment with the axeman tonight. Can't wait to try her out


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## ElephantRider (Feb 2, 2010)

I will grab a pic tomorrow night. Axe time for me, too!


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## Enjoy! (Feb 2, 2010)

looking good man, to me though it doesnt look like mag def is looks like nitrogen def which happens at the end of flowering but not this much it needs to get a nice amount of nitrogen i belive but it could be mag but from what i know mag def has browning outer leaves and nitrogen is the entire leaf turning a yellow intill it dieing but not browning side. your seem like the nitrogen def. 
Check my journal out i just started 1. 
https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/299010-enjoys-grow-journal-1-a.html


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## ElephantRider (Feb 2, 2010)

It's mg/ca. Looked identical to what I had on my most recent.. ahem.. larger.. ahem.. girls and the sensical mg mix straightened them out immediately. All that crispy brown turned purple. So neat! Also.. N def. tends to look "wetter" to me, versus crispy. And real rare to have N deficiency in flower. The plant usually has enough N.

All that said, I bet V knew just fine and didn't mind much. cheeky fucker!


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## Enjoy! (Feb 2, 2010)

lol. sorry real rare? umm not really alot of growers who have defs get a n def at the end becuase thats a hugee factor in it and alot have a lack of it usually not enough to get full blown nitrogen def so i semi agree but when people dont catch it soon it turns from 1 or two turning yellow to the entire plant starting the yellowing process its happen to me before.


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## v12xjs (Feb 3, 2010)

Welcome Enjoy! and thanks for the comments.
There's a few issues I didn't anticipate when I changed to coco for this grow but I think the redness is from some pretty cold weather recently and the yellowing is mostly from cal/mag def. I only ended up cutting the main cola last night and the plant is a very lush green with it out of the way. I'll try and get a pic tonight to illustrate.
TBH a little deficiency is to be expected with a case grow. These plants want to be 1 - 1.5m and the case is 54cm with a grow area only half that so ideal health is secondary to keeping the buggers contained.
Thanks for the link, I'll check out your grow.

Hey ER. Can't wait to see what you are up to. Bet I'm not the only one either.
You still running multiple cases?


Well I took the axe to the top part of the main cola last night and decided to let the rest of the plant go an extra week. As I've said before I'm not greedy and the top I took looks like it will last me 5 days while the rest of the plant does the full 55 day stint. Here's a look at the top half way through the manicure to give an idea of size. CMH FTW!:


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## tom__420 (Feb 3, 2010)

Nice bud man but I would have let it go longer, I see white hairs all over it
Def let the rest of the plant finish and take a look at this thread, really changed my views on harvesting times: https://www.rollitup.org/harvesting-curing/210501-zeuss-take-harvesting.html


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## floridasucks (Feb 3, 2010)

haha nice bud v... enjoy.


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## v12xjs (Feb 3, 2010)

Count on it fs.
Good to knock heads m8.


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## autoflowa (Feb 3, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Hey Tom.
> Do me a favour and either shout out what you know about pc grows or just stay up your own ass.
> You just saw me pull a bud the size of a can of red bull by clipping less than 1/3 of a plant that took up 1/4 of a fucking pc case and you think there's something wrong
> Like you could do better


wassup v12, not sure why u flipped like that, im pretty sure Tom420 is just trying to give advice, he said it was a nice bud lol.. shit i grow outta pc cases too so i kno where your coming from.. to be honest i havent even been following this journal at all, but looking at that bud i agree with him too.. i harvested my first plant way to early cus i was just so dam anxious to chop it but whatever, you might of had a reason to chop it early. peace man


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## maturesmoker (Feb 4, 2010)

Hiya V12,

Thats a very nice sized bud there. Looks good and chunky. Didnt realize you had switched to coco?

I CAN see the point Tom was making V12, but I also tend to harvest my own buds like yours, its how I like them! Couple of days drying and the pistils have shrivelled anyway and you still have a solid bud. But I agree that if you leave them they will FULLY ripen off as described, its just that most like it cut a little earlier, personal preference.

Anyway, how you finding the coco? Been thinking about trying it myself, judging from that example there mate its obviously good stuff? I like the idea of being able to drench the roots but have them dried out same day! 

Enjoythat bud, it looks tasty


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## v12xjs (Feb 4, 2010)

Hey ms. Thanks.

The coco is a bit of a mixed blessing for me. I was expecting it to dry out rapidly but it doesn't work quite like that. I guess it encourages root growth and when the roots are suitably big they suck it dry quickly, but for little seedlings with no rootmass it just stays damp for days, even in perfect temps. Your use of cuttings may suit it better as they will already have a decent rootstock.
I'm sure it helped yield but there were a few other factors so I couldn't say to what extent. The light is HID now obviously and I used a 2 litre pot instead of the old 1.1's for the final stint.
I fully agree about different tastes with regards clear/amber, we are all different, but personally I just don't think it's too clever to aim for max amber and max couchlock on possibly the most infamous couchlock plant in the world.


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## v12xjs (Feb 4, 2010)

Hey Autoflowa

Tom got a flea in his ear partly because he doesn't grow in a pc case, he doesn't use cmh and it's very unlikely that he does a 12/12 from seed in coco with NL. Would you go trolling NFT grows under HPS & sticking your oar in?
Amongst other things, when you try to fit a 1.5 metre plant into a 30cm growcase, pristine health of shade leaves that will never be smoked isn't a primary concern, but being ignorant of the nuances of a pc grow Tom doesn't understand that. He should stick to what he knows.
I thought he was pretty ignorant too.
when he suggested I let the rest of the plant go longer it was in reply to my post stating I'd just chopped the cola and was letting the rest of the plant go longer. WTF? He didn't even read the post he was replying to.
Sounds like maybe you didn't either.


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## tom__420 (Feb 4, 2010)

I don't know why you got pissed man, you harvested that bud early it doesn't matter where it was grown
I know when to harvest a plant and a bud with white hairs is not ready for harvest plain and simple
I grow aeroponics under HPS in a real cab, you keep on thinking you are hot shit growing in a cpu case
When you can step up and grow some real plants let me know, it is easier to grow dinky plants in a pc case than growing large plants in a real setup
Learn how to take advice better because the shit that I am seeing is not good enough for you to call me out on my skills and what I know







Oh yeah and by the way you harvested that bud early


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## v12xjs (Feb 6, 2010)

Hey Tom
Thought I showed you the door.
I believe the post above has been edited, wish I knew what it said.

I decided to read about magnesium and figured cannabis legend tom_420 would be the person to give me the lowdown so I typed the 2 terms into my search engine.
Never expected it to yield such goldust 

You used to eat it?
I'm surprised such a knowledgeable guy didn't realise it would give permanent shits. Bet that made you popular 
Still, there's plenty of fish out there isn't there Tom. Especially if your not fussy about gender. Your pics look exactly as I expected.
I've got a few more of those links to follow and it's all priceless stuff, but you should expect someone to send one of those 2 roses fairly soon 
Let's see how you like being trolled. You'll know why I got so pissed soon enough boy.

Oh the irony of telling me about magnesium. Bet you never do that again eh?


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## worm5376 (Feb 6, 2010)

Everybody just pipe down a little. Whoa whoa whoa v12 stop swinging the bat bro toms a good dude. I think the both of you just butted heads a little. That's all. Let's not get bigger then our egos. 
You guys are silly , nice bud you got there, and you still haven't immortalized those comics for me buddy


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## maturesmoker (Feb 7, 2010)

worm5376 said:


> Everybody just pipe down a little. Whoa whoa whoa v12 stop swinging the bat bro toms a good dude. I think the both of you just butted heads a little. That's all. Let's not get bigger then our egos.
> You guys are silly , nice bud you got there, and you still haven't immortalized those comics for me buddy


*This threads far too useful to allow it to be drawn into arguments*  But I understand where V12 is coming from, I think maybe 'tom' is a touch pushy in his use of language and in giving his opinions? I followed the link to the 'Zeus' thread he posted and noticed he got into an argument on that one too for the same reason! I for one did not appreciate the comments about PC grows, no call for that in my opinion.

OK, back to business, so V12 I want to ask a question mate ..... I've stripped out my case for the veg box I'm making, went well but........

How do you attach the fittings etc to the top of the case? I cant see how to fix my lights in there! Do you solder or superglue brackets maybe?

Where's a good place UK to get a new PC fan? This is a budget job but I want to make it as good as I can. 

I have made a heat screen as per your idea, of perspex and it fits well  Great idea.

Cheers in advance for any help.


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## v12xjs (Feb 7, 2010)

Hey Guys
Just a spot of territorial pissing. Hopefully behind us now.

Sorry worm, I did make a start over the holidays but it was a much bigger task than I thought. Got a little bit done though, I'll upload and link you up.

Greets ms & thanks.
I used a cheap hps euro reflector because the 125w cfl's are the cheapest way to get 6500k bulbs and they have the same e40 base as hps bulbs. If you go that way then check your measurements as not all cases can accomodate them without adjustments. 
Araldite or Araldite Rapid is what I used to fix the reflector to the roof of the case. Halfords sell it. It takes 24 hours to set though. 
I just tipped the case upside down, applied the resin, dropped the reflector in with some books on top to weigh it down and left it. There's no way it will ever come back off.
If you are using smaller bulbs with individual moguls then you could prolly screw them onto a wooden base and use the same trick.

You'll need to check what size fans fit the case before you go shopping, just measure between 2 of the screw holes, they will be 80mm, 92mm or maybe 120mm on newer stuff.
I'd have a look for Thermaltake or Zalman fans, both makes offer a good balance between cost, power and noise levels and have never let me down. Best sites are fleabay, scan dot co uk or cconline dot co uk. 
If it would help I can prolly do you a shopping list and some simple instructions.


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## ElephantRider (Feb 8, 2010)

Yikes! Sorry, but I agree w/ v12. When you start getting older and have kids to worry about and such, extreme couchlock just does not cut it anymore. You need to be functional. Having smoked NL MANY times, letting it go early might make it smoke more comfortably. I just harvested my Widow early for the same reason.

And Tom, having grown both ways, PC case is WAAAY harder to do right. With soil under 600 hps, i made shit tons of mistakes and the plants still came out kicking ass.. ca/mg burned and all. Stoned out of my mind. With PC case, you make just a hint too much of any nutes, your plant can die in a day. I have had it happen. Or.. stress from all that rootbinding, lst, etc... that is a lot of stress. hermie is a MAJOR concern at any stage of the game. With bonsai, you have to be close to perfect to make something nice. Oh yeah.. and if you're too careful, you only see 3.5 g. Sorry, man.. LOT harder in a PC.


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## v12xjs (Feb 14, 2010)

Hey ER. I reckon even Mother Nature herself would have a job growing in a pc case 
You have learned a lot on the subject and I wish you could post more.

Got to smoke that bud after all and it is absolute dynamite. Easily the strongest weed I've grown in my case, and far more palatable than NL of old. A very big v12 thumbs up for White Lable NL. 
I'll certainly buy some more and try harder to dial it in as it is almost odour free while growing, a major bonus for me. There's no hiding the smell once you harvest it though...My stash tin can stink a house out in 10 minutes without even opening the lid!


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## worm5376 (Feb 14, 2010)

I wonder how big of a Pc case I can by I'm sure there are some big ones but for a decent price? Hmmm,,,


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## maturesmoker (Feb 14, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Hey ER. I reckon even Mother Nature herself would have a job growing in a pc case
> You have learned a lot on the subject and I wish you could post more.
> 
> Got to smoke that bud after all and it is absolute dynamite. Easily the strongest weed I've grown in my case, and far more palatable than NL of old. A very big v12 thumbs up for White Lable NL.
> I'll certainly buy some more and try harder to dial it in as it is almost odour free while growing, a major bonus for me. There's no hiding the smell once you harvest it though...My stash tin can stink a house out in 10 minutes without even opening the lid!


V12/ER, having spent the last week tinkering around with a PC case myself, I have even more respect for what you guys do!! 

V12, so glad you found a good tasting NL, its one thing I have struggled with the strain, lack of taste. But I DO recall good tasting NL from the past, but its just not there in the Nirvana NL, in my opinion. Shame, as I love the strain  I also agree about low odour in flowering. Best I had was a NL I got sent over from a grower in Amsterdam (cost me £75 for the *Q* inc transfer etc about 10 years ago! seems incredible now, I cant afford that these days), and it was just lovely in terms of taste and the best NL I ever had. I'll have to look up the White Label NL.

Anyway, sorry to ramble on, (wasn't that a Led Zep song?) what you up to next?


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## ElephantRider (Feb 14, 2010)

Worm.. If you can find the case for a SunFire v880, it is gigantic! V.. Wish I could post more, too, but busy changing tiny diapers, eh?


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## v12xjs (Feb 15, 2010)

Hey worm
I like your thinking mate. The Broadway r-900 on newegg dot com looks promising, wish we could get them here. 
I came across a page yesterday that looks interesting although I haven't read the deatail yet. Check out barrelofgreen dot net.
I'll send you a pm later.

Greets ms.
You'll get the knack of the pc pretty quick.
The blurb on the NL says it was back crossed to give some juniper & lemon, it really makes a difference.
Just potted up a 2nd Violator Kush this morning, so I have 2 NL's and 2 VK's on the go. Here's a snap of them. 1 & 3 are the NL's, 2 & 4 are the Kush. The oldest NL is another duffer but the younger 1 is looking healthy so far.







I finally agreed to build a case for someone and I'll be getting the kit together next weekend. Let me know if you want any pics of anything.

Grats on the new arrival ER. Good luck with the late nights and smelly nappies, guess you can run without odour control for now


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## dopewear (Feb 15, 2010)

v. your case never stops amazing me! glad to see everthings doing well! sorry i have been around much lifes gotten busy and growing has been put on hold


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## v12xjs (Feb 18, 2010)

Hey DW. Really glad to see your sig. Hope its all good things keeping you busy.
Did you get to smoke your wonderwoman?


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## worm5376 (Feb 18, 2010)

Fyi, Mr. Worm was at Home Depot and decided to purchase 2 100 watt Cfl's.
I know its not much but what I was attempting to do was buy some supplies, that way I pish mself to feel obligated to get the ball on a roll.
It sounds funny but now I feel like I have no choice but to follow thru with the plan. Next on the list is to fined me a big'ole tower to work with. I'll keep you updated V.


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## ElephantRider (Feb 18, 2010)

Worm.. SERVER TOWER. It offers a lot more space. I run a server tower and 2 desktops, fwiw. Can clone in one veg. in one and flower in one if I like. In a server tower, you can top 2-3 times and let it grow straight up (Indica dominant) and it will fit without LST. That's a major plus, in my book.

~ER~


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## worm5376 (Feb 19, 2010)

ElephantRider said:


> Worm.. SERVER TOWER. It offers a lot more space. I run a server tower and 2 desktops, fwiw. Can clone in one veg. in one and flower in one if I like. In a server tower, you can top 2-3 times and let it grow straight up (Indica dominant) and it will fit without LST. That's a major plus, in my book.
> 
> ~ER~


That's an excellent idea, loving the R&D ER. +Rep to you sir


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## v12xjs (Feb 19, 2010)

That's some great news worm. Welcome to the ranks mate.
I use the same trick to motivate myself sometimes, but I laughed anyway 
Let me know if I can help out.

It will be worth it. That last NL put out 21g in all and I get a complimentary refill every 3 weeks. 
I love my case


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## Cheese101 (Feb 19, 2010)

Excellent Grow Mate I Like What Yu Done With Little Space


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## floridasucks (Feb 19, 2010)

complementary refills are the best.


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## crazytrain14 (Feb 19, 2010)

what up V

just found your journal. i'll be watching since i can't grow til i move out again.

peace dude


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## worm5376 (Feb 19, 2010)

Guess what I just realized, the Cfl's don't have a ballast built into them so I'm going to return them 

I won't let it get me down, I'm just a little dissapointed that I didn't notice it the first time around


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## ElephantRider (Feb 20, 2010)

wtf? No ballast in them? Grab 2 42W 3000K cfl's at "home de pot" and toss that shit in a computer case. Wire it, tape it, paint it white. voila.


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## maturesmoker (Feb 21, 2010)

Hi V12,

21g is damn good from a PC case, I mean given the space its amazing, and like you say, you're on a rolling harvest system


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## v12xjs (Feb 22, 2010)

Hey thanks Cheese101 and welcome.

Greets CrazyTrain. Sad to see you without a grow, can't wait to see you up and running again.

Thanks to everyone else too. 21g will do nicely till the next harvest 

Hey worm, ER knows his stuff but if you still have those bulbs then take a closer look as they may be worth it after all. When I changed from a 125w self ballasted to a 150w external ballast cfl I expected a 20% increase in light, but I got way more than that. That was why the plants were getting bleached.
When I looked a bit deeper it seems self ballasted bulbs aren't quite as good as they claim. I think it's to do with the efficiency of the ballasts and external ballasts are more efficient so they produce more light from the same wattage, and also run cooler due to the external ballast. I reckon a 100w PL-L bulb would kick ass in a case and the ballasts are pretty cheap. 
Just a thought.

Got a few pics of the girls last night. Things are ticking along nicely but the new kush is a damn mutant. I'm not sure wether to kill her or let her go. I have grown such a plant once before but it wasn't up to much.


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## crazytrain14 (Feb 22, 2010)

hey v 

could you hit us up with a link to one of those external ballast cfl's? never seen one. 

peace


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## worm5376 (Feb 22, 2010)

Interesting that you say that, and yes I still do have those bulbs. I've been neglecting home depot since.
I guess I have to look into those diy ballast then. 
Mutant kush aye? Let her go for a bit and see what she does, if she doesn't meet your standards OFF with her head


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## floridasucks (Feb 22, 2010)

wow that some sticky shittt v12. yummm

i have to add ive also never seen a CFL without a ballast, i thought they all came with one. i have 3, 150w that came with the ballast attached.


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## worm5376 (Feb 22, 2010)

The funny thing is home depot doesn't even carry the ballast but they have the bulb  
I'll figure it out.


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## v12xjs (Feb 22, 2010)

Nlites were the non ballasted lamps aimed at indoor growing but I'm not sure if they are still around. Here's their cfl page:
http://www.nlites.eu/cfl.htm

This is the kit I used. It's likely these boys manufactured for nlites anyway. Sadly the 150w needs a diffuser or a bigger case than mine:
http://mps.manufacturer.globalsources.com/si/6008825415808/pdtl/Compact-fluorescent/1002444758/Energy-saving-Bulb-Complementary.htm

In Europe you'd need to look on fleabay for the kind of ballast you need as anything over 60w is now prohibited for domestic use. You should be able to get a 2x50w or 2x55w no trouble.

I can't find the stuff I read about the differences between ballasted and non-ballasted, but the general vibe was that self ballasted units generally put out 50-70% of the light an external ballasted bulb does. That does seem to be in line with what I saw.

Hey fs, are you still growing in the tank with Querkle?


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## ElephantRider (Feb 22, 2010)

Agreed on the bulbs. I was only suggesting that if he was going to return them due to the ballast thing (I've run into the depot snafu, too, man.. they sell cfl's like that, as well as MH and HPS! Idiots!) and cost associated, to keep on the path.. even if the cheap route.  And dude.. CMH.. I was reading on that stuff and it sounds FRESH! That's what you roll with now, yes? You could easily rock 2 400's in a tent or small cabinet with minimal venting! The master, hard at work, you are!

Also, I got a 125 CFL now w/ mogul socket. AWESOME power, combined with my 2 68 W 'normal' cfl's and 2 24W T5HO bulbs. 

~ER~


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## v12xjs (Feb 23, 2010)

Wow that's some serious firwpower ER!
I know the quality of cfl's. I've only ever seen a handful of plants bleaching through too much light and my 150w cfl is easily capable of doing just that in my restricted space. You're absolutely right though. A couple of 42's will be just enough to grow some stinky bud and wouldn't be too difficult to cool, and you have to cut your teeth somewhere.

I found that plants stayed healthier in flowering with a mix of red and blue in my op and I just figured that CMH can do that in a single bulb. It isn't a cheap option so I'm really hoping it pays off, but the signs are good 

Have yo started harvesting the fruits of your own breeding program yet?


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## dopewear (Feb 23, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Hey DW. Really glad to see your sig. Hope its all good things keeping you busy.
> Did you get to smoke your wonderwoman?


 
yes sir i did, i was very impressed!


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## maturesmoker (Feb 24, 2010)

Thats a tasty bud shot there V12  real solid looking. Everythings still looking rosy in the garden mate, great colour to them all. 

I would leave the mutant Kush, let her go on. I have had only a couple of mutants from growing my (bubba o) Kush over the years but I recall them being very good on yield. I think its just the way they develop with more tops as well as that characteristic leaf growth. Just my opinion V12 

That case looks an incredibly bright space now!


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## floridasucks (Feb 24, 2010)

no grows in querkle's tank, ive moved to a bit bigger space between 2 rubbermaid tubs.


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## v12xjs (Feb 24, 2010)

Result DW! Made up for you mate. Hope you fire that cab up again soon.

Hey ms. The mutant's got a name now so I can't really hack her. It's Trinity. Obviously 
The one I grew out was in the 80's from some African bush. I thought she'd be a producer compared to the others but when the uneven internode spacing began she kind of grew like a Thai stick instead of budding up. I'm hoping Trinity's refined breeding will give me a better result this time 

You should be banned from having spiders fs! Throw a nug in there for the poor girl, it was you that gave her a taste for it 
Some of that monster sativa tree should do the trick!
jk. 
Tell her I said hello. 
Do you have a rubbermaid thread?


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## floridasucks (Feb 25, 2010)

haha yea i should put a small one in there just for some decoration. i dont have a thread on the rubbermaid but theres some pics in the grow in my sig.


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## v12xjs (Mar 6, 2010)

Just a quick update. The girls are all ok, although Trinity seems determined to stay small. Here's a pic of the case from this morning and you can't even see her in her pot on the right 







The 1st of the violator kush plants is looking lush so far and she has a divine aroma. She's about 10 days into flowering now, here's one of the tops:







And here's a peek at the new case build. It's going slowly as I'm studying these days, but I'll get there eventually. 
The false wall at the front is a For Sale sign and I'll fit another at the back. I'll be fitting the fans to the fake walls so the outside of the case looks totally original, unlike my present unit. I'll post up some more as it progresses.


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## maturesmoker (Mar 7, 2010)

V12, looking healthy in there as usual mate. 

Case is looking good, I like the idea of that 'For Sale' board, is the plastic with a layer of sort of foam in between? Never though of that but it pefect for this. Whats the dimensions of that case ? I know they vary in size. Can I ask where you get the fan controllers ? Lots of questions!


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## floridasucks (Mar 7, 2010)

lookin reeal nice there v, especially that Vkush. i wish i could smell that.


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## v12xjs (Mar 8, 2010)

Hey Florida. Thanks mate.
I wish I could bottle that kush smell.

Cheers ms.
I can understand now why you persevere with BOK and the Mazari. Yummy 

The case I'm using is just a cheapo job but it's 570(d) x 205(w) x 520(h), so it has plenty of room (if you don't need much!). The extra depth over my case means I can fit the 2 for sale signs and still have the same grow area I have now. 
Just a shame I won't be growing in it 

You can get the kit online from scan dot co uk, here's their part numbers:

LN11680 36.74 inc
Xclio SuperTower Black Hi-Performance Gaming (w/o PSU) see details - Hi-End 
LN21012 1.47 inc
4044951001286 - Sharkoon 3-pin Y-Cable (Install x2 fans To One Connector)
LN21011 x2 @ 1.37 2.74 inc
4044951001279 - Sharkoon 3-pin fan extension cable
LN22032 x2 @ 2.86 5.72 inc
AK-FC-08-AT - Asetek PCI FAN Speed Adjuster Kit 3pin Fan/Fan Controller/ Motherboard Kit

Got another link for you Mr Worm. This one is my all time favourite so I'll give everyone else a crack at these:

http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/uu351/v12xjs/General/Furry Freaks and Fat Freddies Cat/06_01.jpg

When you've read it, change the 01.jpg at the end of the link to 02.jpg for the next page etc.. The last page is 52.jpg
Enjoy them. They won't be there for long.


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## tags (Mar 10, 2010)

hey, good work, very jealous ha. could you post pics of the cab from outside with the door closed and open just to see how its all put together? thanks if you can


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## v12xjs (Mar 11, 2010)

Hey tags, thanks.

The case is a work in progress and I'm afraid there has been no progress since that pic was taken. The design is based around my present build and theres some pics of that in one of the albums in my profile. Here's a link for you:
https://www.rollitup.org/members/a-103349/albums/case-5326/


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## maturesmoker (Mar 11, 2010)

Thanks for posting that info V12, I've saved it for reference  I think you clearly have more electrical skill than I do! Mines pretty basic although I take great care in it. I dont think I'd know how to wire one of those fan speed controllers for example 

That box is bigger than the one I have been playing a round with, plus I dont know how to get all of the wiring on the inside as you do, it would look right with just a single power lead coming out the back, I need to do more reading. I was thinking along the lines of an extension socket on the inside but its tight. Anyway, its something I still plan to do because I fancy the challenge of being able to achieve it. 

I've lost my Kush now but know exactly what you mean about the smell of the stuff, its sublime.

Keep em coming mate, I enjoy every post on this thread


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## v12xjs (Mar 11, 2010)

Morning ms.
I'll be doing a bit more on the case asap. I'll make sure I cover the fan controllers in a bit of depth as it seems the fan wiring is a sticking point for lots of peeps.

After you cheering me up with your horny pics of Delia and Super T, allow me to return the compliment 
For info, the decorators have been in so I have some new 'for sale sign' walls and a new plexiglass. The fan filters have been removed in these pics but they just needed a clean and they are back in place now.


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## tags (Mar 11, 2010)

thanks for the link to the pics, top notch. what light you usin in there?


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## tags (Mar 11, 2010)

hey i was on the website scan dot co dot uk looking at the pc case, just from looking at the inside on your pictures, was wondering where do all the fans you have come from?


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## alexonfire (Mar 11, 2010)

I like the idea of the heat shield but Adding another layer of glass between the CFL and plants steals at least 15% of the light, and with CFLs every photon counts.


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## v12xjs (Mar 11, 2010)

Cheers tags.
The light is a 100w CMH bulb. I'm putting one in the new build as well, but it's an expensive option. CMH is very new tec mixing MH with HPS in the same bulb and it seems to work really well. The pics I linked used a 125w red enviro with a 12w 6500k and that was a sweet combo too. 
I got some fans at the same time I got the case. If you look at the tec specs tab for the case it says it can accomodate 2x120mm and 1x80mm fan, so I got those to keep things original looking and then some extra fans for the fake walls. The 80mm fan is for the side door and I will be blocking that hole up, but it can be used elsewhere.
Those splitters and cables are just snap-on links to hook everything together. They are nowhere near long enough but you can extend them with the wiring harness that comes with the case.

Hey alex
As above, it's a HID in there these days.
The shield was a total lifesaver last summer with my cfl's and this bulb is even hotter so it has to stay. It's 2mm polycarbonate though and from what I've read it's a good option. 2mm polycarb transmits 94-96% light and 3mm glass transmits 97-98% which isn't such a bad trade off. Those figures do drop quickly if you use a thicker sheet though.


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## v12xjs (Mar 15, 2010)

I've been a bit busy so there's no update on the case build but I should be able to do a bit either today or Wednesday.

Got some gratuitous plant pics though. The NL on the left is at 71 days from seed and has about 2 more weeks to go. The oldest Violator Kush is in the centre and she's looking very healthy, she's about 18 days into flower. Sitting on her lap is a 5 day old VK seedling and Trinity the mutant is sitting on the left. She put out her first flower yesterday so she'll be ready in around 10 weeks.


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## maturesmoker (Mar 15, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> I've been a bit busy so there's no update on the case build but I should be able to do a bit either today or Wednesday.
> 
> Got some gratuitous plant pics though. The NL on the left is at 71 days from seed and has about 2 more weeks to go. The oldest Violator Kush is in the centre and she's looking very healthy, she's about 18 days into flower. Sitting on her lap is a 5 day old VK seedling and Trinity the mutant is sitting on the left. She put out her first flower yesterday so she'll be ready in around 10 weeks.


Just amazing V12  .... and glad Trinity is going well. 

Quick Q ..... how often do you have to clean that glass? Mine just seems to pick up so much crap so fast but its hard to get back after a clean! is yours just a slide in job?

Anyway, all looking very tasty in the case as usual.


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## dopewear (Mar 15, 2010)

v. im absolutely in love with that case and those ladies keep up the awesome work!


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## v12xjs (Mar 16, 2010)

Hey ms
I'm in the same boat as you, the heatshield gets pretty grubby after a week or so. To be fair those pc fans are notorious for blowing twice as much dust as they do air.
Removal is a PITA, so I just give it a good wipe with a little vinegar in warm water. 
I wipe down the whole case with Milton fluid about once a month so I've been taking it out and washing it down properly when I do that.
Your local pc shop should sell a dust filter that will just clip over your intake if it really bothers you. Good hifi shops sell antistatic guns for vinyl that may help too. If I find mine I'll try it out and let you know how it works.

A pleasure to see you in here again DW. Hope that famous BC Bud is keeping you ticking over until your next grow. 
I guess you will be gearing up for the outdoor season soon. Keep us posted on progress.

I meant to post up a few more pics yesterday, so here they are today instead. All are of The oldest VK. She's called Dusty and I'm in love


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## maturesmoker (Mar 16, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Hey ms
> I'm in the same boat as you, the heatshield gets pretty grubby after a week or so. To be fair those pc fans are notorious for blowing twice as much dust as they do air.
> Removal is a PITA, so I just give it a good wipe with a little vinegar in warm water.
> I wipe down the whole case with Milton fluid about once a month so I've been taking it out and washing it down properly when I do that.
> ...


Hi V12,

Great name 'Dusty'  Great plant. 

V12, you know, this thread is seriously inspiring, can i just recap on a couple of things and ask a couple more questions? Why?.... well my old box is maybe not delivering peak efficiency atm and i am fighting a losing battle against spider mites in there now, i think it might be time for an upgrade and a strip down. I have another small wooden cab that I want to convert to a perpetual grow based upon yours.This is still a 12/12 from seed grow yes? thats what I plan to do. I need improved filtering on the intake (what do you use?), make it simpler to clean down periodically, and increase the number of small plants I can grow for a rolling harvest, as you do. I plan to retire the 'ganja box',and replace it with the new smaller but more solid box for the future.

Meantime I'll read back through your thread again  I'm having to rest as I've done my leg in so I'll put the time to good use.

cheers mate.


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## Phase420 (Mar 16, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Morning ms.
> I'll be doing a bit more on the case asap. I'll make sure I cover the fan controllers in a bit of depth as it seems the fan wiring is a sticking point for lots of peeps.
> 
> After you cheering me up with your horny pics of Delia and Super T, allow me to return the compliment
> For info, the decorators have been in so I have some new 'for sale sign' walls and a new plexiglass. The fan filters have been removed in these pics but they just needed a clean and they are back in place now.


This shit is awesome looking! its so crazy how many plant are in there!


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## v12xjs (Mar 17, 2010)

Hey ms. Really sorry to hear about the leg, hope it's on the mend now. Bad news about those mites too. Maybe a new growbox is the best solution.
I'm just off to a couple of lectures but I'll answer your q's tonight if that's ok.

Welcome Phase.
Glad you like it mate. There's only 4 plants, 2 of them are in bloom and have been LST'd a little to max them, the other 2 are just getting ready to replace the big girls when they get chopped. It's pretty simple really, pop a seed in every 3 or 4 weeks and take a harvest at the same time.
If you think it's mad in there now, you should have seen it at the end of last summer!


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## maturesmoker (Mar 17, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Hey ms. Really sorry to hear about the leg, hope it's on the mend now. Bad news about those mites too. Maybe a new growbox is the best solution.
> I'm just off to a couple of lectures but I'll answer your q's tonight if that's ok.


Thanks mate, I'll check back tonight. I'm in bed typing this as i cant bend or weight bear on the leg atm!.....  On the plus side I'm doing loads of MJ related reading  I'm taking notes from your thread too. one or two more Q's for you......

Are those plants staying so compact due to training, root restriction or genetics would you say?

Whats you current soil mix in those containers?

Is there a significant increase in yield with the new lamp fitted? 

No rush mate, just when you can, meantime I'll keep digging back through the thread 

cheers

ms.


btw, you had already answered my question about fan filters, sorry. I just have a pair of tights stretched over my intake!......need to improve that obviously.


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## Phase420 (Mar 17, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Hey ms. Really sorry to hear about the leg, hope it's on the mend now. Bad news about those mites too. Maybe a new growbox is the best solution.
> I'm just off to a couple of lectures but I'll answer your q's tonight if that's ok.
> 
> Welcome Phase.
> ...


 Im in my first PCgrow right now... with BLUE MYSTIC from nirvana. Im just going to use the LST rack or SOG method in my pc. im only going with one right now. Wasnt sure How much it would fit inside of. Are you in any veg cycle during this or just flowering? thanks


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## v12xjs (Mar 17, 2010)

Ouch! Sounds like you did a proper job there ms.
Here's a recap of what's happened since the new year:

It's still a permanent 12/12 operation providing perpetual harvests every 3 weeks or so, with a new seedling replacing every plant I chop.
The medium is pure canna coco. The seedlings start in a root riot cube with some coco around it and they get repotted into 1 litre containers then 2 litre containers as they get bigger.
I use LST to max the crop but the new bulb definitely increases the size of the colas so I only aim for 4 tops now rather than the 8 or more I got under cfl's.
The old cfl setup used pretty tall strains and they were also pretty new crosses. New strains invariably grow more vigourously than established strains because of a trait called hybrid vigour. I found I needed to restrict growth with every trick I could find when dealing with such plants. I'm now using more established strains with a naturally short stature (under a metre) and they seem to be ideal candidates for the case.
I don't currently use filters on my intake or on the exhaust for the cooltube. The front fans are behind the door of the case and draw air from side vents which makes them pretty lightproof. I use a periscope arrangement on the exhaust for the light to provide lightproofing without restricting airflow much.
The 2 exhausts of the grow chamber are my most powerful fans and they have odour control fitted which makes them 85% lightproof, but that has a big impact on airflow. I have a black plastic thing over them that blocks the rest of the light.
I've also started blacking out the pots finally. As soon as I made the switch to coco I saw green algae forming in the clear pots.

Just a thought ms, but you may be able to use pollen filters out of a car for your intake. That bathroom fan should still be able to pull enough air through.
I'll check out your grow Phase. 

Wow. I think I need some bud porn after all that 
Happy St Patricks Day.


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## Phase420 (Mar 17, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Ouch! Sounds like you did a proper job there ms.
> Here's a recap of what's happened since the new year:
> 
> It's still a permanent 12/12 operation providing perpetual harvests every 3 weeks or so, with a new seedling replacing every plant I chop.
> ...


 Yo thanks for doing the run down for me!! That helped alot.Sounds like you've got this stuff figured out.lol.yeah come check me out. any help is cool with me! keep it up!


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## maturesmoker (Mar 18, 2010)

V12,

BIG thank you mate for taking time to put that together for 'us'  Lots of useful info and I see how far things have progressed, I forgot you were in coco for example. I've noted down most of the info for reference. Coco is obviously going good for you? I think I remember you saying that for small plants (seedlings) there were some issues with it drying out? Certainly the results cant be argued with and the health and condition of your plants remains excellent. So are you using canna coco nutes too now? 

I'm going to use some of your methods as I said and I'm considering that change over to coco myself now. I managed a one legged strip down and clean yesterday!  you can see the results in my update, had to chop a lot of lower leaf away. You obviously remain pest free in that case and I reckon its down to more efficient filtering and I also believe that coco grown plants do not suffer mite infestation as much as soil? This thread has also made me aware that I went ott on the 12litre pot!!I used to grow 12/12 from seed in 2 litres of soil mix, sort of flood watering them every other day, and yields were not that much lower than this huge bas***d will be  I need to take a step back I think.

So thanks again, and keep the updates coming PLEASE 

Btw, have you seen Space Ritual recently? I still enjoy them, there's some crazy vids on YouTube and MsAngel certainly knows how to move that body :-0 .....


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## v12xjs (Mar 18, 2010)

Glad to help mate.
Good to know coco may reduce bug problems. I was getting some issues with it holding too much water for the seedlings but I've got a handle on it now. Besides, I've got a bloody big bag of the stuff so I'm kind of obligated to persevere with it 
I'm still on hydro nutes ATM, they seem ok so I'll stick with them.
I'd have thought the nylon filter would have protected against mites. I'd consider taking them out in the sun a bigger risk for infection. I'll check it out now. Good luck.


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## v12xjs (Mar 20, 2010)

Thanks for the tip about the Nik Turner vids on utube ms. I got to another gig at the end of last year and Ms Angel is even hotter in the flesh. I'm loving your new Mondays avatar too 

I've managed to do a bit on the new case but haven't had the chance to take any pics so I'll update later with a progress report.
I checked up on the girls when I got home last night though, and got a buzz just looking in the case. Dusty has really developed nicely over the last couple of days, it's hard to believe she was a seed less than 9 weeks ago. Here's some pics:


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## Phase420 (Mar 20, 2010)

How many kelvins/lumens are you push with you lighting right now???


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## maturesmoker (Mar 21, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Thanks for the tip about the Nik Turner vids on utube ms. I got to another gig at the end of last year and Ms Angel is even hotter in the flesh. I'm loving your new Mondays avatar too


'Dusty' is pumping them out V12, real chunky buds 

Re the 'Mondays'..... I still love em  Great times.


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## v12xjs (Mar 21, 2010)

Greets Phase
The bulb is rated at 9,500 lumens and my case is 0.99sq ft, so I get about 9,600 lumens per sq ft. The sun maxes out at 10,000 lumens per sq ft, putting me right in the zone.

A quick update on the new case.
I've painted the sides and the fake walls white, with a band of black at each end to help with lightproofing. 
The bulb and reflectors are now fixed in place, as are all the outer fans.
I just need to cut holes and mount the internal fans onto the fake walls and wire everything up.
Here's a pic. 
The light came on in my case as I took it so there's one of the grow as well


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## Phase420 (Mar 21, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Greets Phase
> The bulb is rated at 9,500 lumens and my case is 0.99sq ft, so I get about 9,600 lumens per sq ft. The sun maxes out at 10,000 lumens per sq ft, putting me right in the zone.
> 
> A quick update on the new case.
> ...


*OMG *!!! can i get the name of the light your useing then??where did you get that bad boy at? and is it a floresents?


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## v12xjs (Mar 22, 2010)

Hey Phase
The bulb is an Osram Powerball HCI-T 100w. I don't know anywhere that has them in stock but I just asked my local lighting supplier to order 1 and it took about 3 days to arrive.
They need either an older type magnetic HPS ballast or one of the new electronic ballasts. They are fookin hot bulbs though. I was running 160+ watts of cfl previously and this bulb is prolly even warmer than they were. I'd say that a cooltube or heatshield would be essential in a pc case.
On the plus side, they are full spectrum with a spike at 3000k and blue light is known to contain much more energy than red light, so in theory they will produce more growth than an equivalent HPS bulb. The balance of spectrums is also closer to natural sunlight than any HPS bulb, which seems to help keep the plants lush and green throughout the grow.


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## maturesmoker (Mar 22, 2010)

Wow, that's a tiny bulb V12, perfect for the job in that case. Roughly how much UK? Lets say I wanted to install a couple of those in a small cabinet (you know roughly the size I use), what would I need to get? Re the ballast, I wouldnt know what to ask for!!!! Does the ballast come pre wired? They just look perfect for us stealth growers with a heat screen and good airflow properties.

Dusty gets fatter every time I see her


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## SimplyBaked (Mar 22, 2010)

SUBD! love the pc grows


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## v12xjs (Mar 22, 2010)

SimplyBaked said:


> SUBD! love the pc grows


Welcome aboard SB. Me to 

You'd better sit down ms. Maybe with a stiff drink.
My kit was £100. That covers the bulb, the ballast and a prewired bulb holder. It's a very simple wire job. 
The ballast stays cold to the touch so it doesn't need to be kept outside the grow, it's also totally silent.
The only other bits I used were 2 reflectors from [email protected], 2 90degree brackets and some Araldite from Focus. About £8 all in. You might need some new Raybans though!
It's a lot of money but I strongly doubt you'd look back. I reckon you'll get at least the same lumens as 336w of cfl from 2 of these. And some mighty buds of course


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## tags (Mar 23, 2010)

Hey v12, recently subscribed to your thread. Your lights sounds tasty. What kinda shop would i be looking for if i was lookin to get a kit like yours?

plants look dynamite!


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## v12xjs (Mar 23, 2010)

Welcome back tags.
The kit was a special order item so I dare not link the supplier. If plod asked them for a list of people who had ordered it recently they would get all my personal info. I'm sure you understand.
Shopfitters seem to be the only trade that has embraced this technology but their prices are astronomical. I'll do a search with the numbers printed on the ballast and see if anything turns up. I'll let you know m8.
Thanks for the word on the plants.


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## v12xjs (Mar 23, 2010)

Hey tags. I've had a good look but there's nobody advertising the kit I have anywhere on the internet. Just try to find a decent light shop and ask them to get you a ceramic metal halide bulb and suitable ballast.

Just by way of helpful guidance, I've been at this lark for a while now and I will struggle to cool this baby down in the summer months. Maybe learn to tame an envirolite or 125w cfl before trying 1 of these in such a small space. It could be an expensive mistake otherwise.
Loving the avatar.


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## tags (Mar 24, 2010)

Thanks for the info v12. I'll defo take your advice, would hate to piss that kind of money up against a wall. Would the envirolight or 125w cfl be available in lighting shops also?

Aw, you've got to love the roses.... Been to the Complete Stone Roses the past 3 years... most excellent.


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## tags (Mar 24, 2010)

Meant to add this erlier. With regard to your speed adjustable fans, unless its cheaper to just buy all the kit from the website you mentioned, i found an old speed adjuster for a trainset. Just as a foreword, my electrical skills are basic if anythin haha but i plugged it into the mains then used a couple of bits of spare wire and hooked it upto a small remote control car motor.... it worked well. however i think it was a litte too much power for the small motor but coud be useful for fans for a grow cab  Anyone with a little more skill than me could maybe give this idea a try.. see how practcal it is


Tags


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## HippySmoke (Mar 24, 2010)

New to the forums came across this grow and wanted to give you a little thumbs up  nice ghetto riggage of a "cool plate" for lack of better word... glass partition for easier movement of air around the light keeping the total area cooler... well done nice looking grow and such cute little girls!


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## v12xjs (Mar 24, 2010)

You should have no trouble picking one up tags. They aren't generally stocked on the high street but any hydro store will have them and there's loads on fleabay. I had some great results with mine.
That's a top tip about the train set adapter.

Welcome to RIU HippySmoke.
Appreciate the props. 

Just fed the girls. Dusty still has 3 or 4 weeks to go so hopefully she'll fatten up a bit. Here's one of her buds from the side with a similar shot of the NL and a nice group pic.


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## v12xjs (Mar 25, 2010)

So I've wired up the fans and mounted them now. I took some pics so here's one way of hooking up a few fans. Sorry for the shit blue tinge. I had the camera white balance set for my growbox and not broad daylight.
Pic1
the fan controllers are supplied with 2 sets of cable and the controller itself. There's 2 fitted into the pc slots below the fan on the left. Plugged into the top 1 is the power in cable and it's terminated with a twin molex plug. I can do without the molex plugs so I'll snip the cable just above them. There's another complete controller at the top and you can see the 2 bare wires on that.
The next cable has 3 connectors; 1 for the controller, 1 for the fan and one for a pc motherboard connector which I will also snip. Again it's already been done on the controller at the top.



Pic2
1st cable before and after cutting.



Pic3
2nd cable before and after.



Pic4
shows the connections for a single fan



Pic5
I've inserted a fan splitter between the fan and the controller so I can now run 2 fans off that controller.



Pic6
This is the naughty end of a 12v power supply. It's a specialist thing so it tells you where pos and neg are. If you aren't so flush and you have a phone charger or something then just bare the 2 wires and mark one with tippex or some tape. It doesn't matter which 1 you mark.



Pic7
connect the power supply wires to the fan controller power in wires. The black of the controller or fan is the neg line.
If you don't know which is which the just take a guess and plug it in. You will either be right or wrong and if you are wrong there will be no drama. The fan won't work is all. Swap the cables around and now you should know if you marked up the pos cable or the neg.



Pic8
So here's the 2 fans running and the controller is working well. FWIW the Sunon on the left cost about £4 and almost knocked me over. The Akasa Apache on the right costs 5x more and won't extinguish a lit match placed right in front of it. Sadly, the Apache is the most powerful silent fan on the market, so don't waste your money on any of them.
A quick word on working out how many fans can run off a single 12v power supply.



The 12v power supply will have 2 ratings on it, 1 is the voltage which should be 12v and the other is the Amps and mine is 2A. 
On a 12v system, 1 amp is the same as 12 watts, so my 2Amp supply can output a max of 24 watts. Just add up the watts written on your fans and make sure it's less than the output of your power supply. Too many fans will make it go pop.
Some fans have Amps written on them instead of watts. My sunons are 0.33 Amps. Well if 1Amp is 12watts then 0.33Amps is 4 watts, so the sunons are 4 watts each.
If you only have a 9volt power supply then 1Amp for you equals 9watts.

I've mounted the fans now as well. I'll put those pics up next


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## v12xjs (Mar 25, 2010)

Mounting the fans is straightforward once the wiring is in place.
pic1
Place the fans where you want them and trace the inside with a pencil. This will be the cut line. While you hold it down, pop a hole for each of the corners to make it easier to fit the bolts.



pic2
It will look like this.



pic3
Cut out the vents.



pic4
I'm mounting these on the inside of the grow chamber so they will need a cable guide. They would give more growing area on the other side but I want it to be easy to replace the odour control.



pic5
Fit them.



pic6
Et voila - Ignore the shonky heatshield, a new 1 will be going in before the big switch on.



All the exhaust fans will go on the top controller and all the intakes will go on the other 1. Wiring for the front will be the same but I'll put an extension on so it will reach the front of the case ok.


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## crazytrain14 (Mar 26, 2010)

sweet deal man ive gota buddy starting a pc case and will show him this.

peace


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## Phase420 (Mar 26, 2010)

crazytrain14 said:


> sweet deal man ive gota buddy starting a pc case and will show him this.
> 
> peace


 This guy is definitely one to watch for great ideas on how to build a nice system! +rep


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## maturesmoker (Mar 27, 2010)

Great step by step guide V12  There's a lot of skill and know how going into that build, thats for sure.

The 12v trainset controller idea was interesting tags (great avatar  ) as you can pick them up cheap and they are ready cased/wired etc, you just need to attach the wires to the terminals presumably? V12 ? Could that be a simpler way to control fan speeds for non-techos like me? 

Clever stuff mate.


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## c4shin (Mar 27, 2010)

hi im new to all this. stuck on 1 thing i have a pc grow box what i have made. i have 125w blue cfl in it and 200w red cfl with 2 intake fans 12mm and a 80mm and 1 120 outtake fan my temperature in the case is 85 f and i cant seem to get my humidaty past 30% any tips or is this ok i have my seeds growing white dwarf ty 
*
*


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## v12xjs (Mar 27, 2010)

Greets crazytrain. With a dab hand like you around I think your mate will do very nicely.

Much appreciated Phase. Saw some skillful fimming in your thread too mate. Nice work.

Hey ms. The train adapter is a very cool idea. Very easy to wire with total control over the power delivery. They will handle all the fans you can throw at them as well I would think.

Hey c4shin
Welcome to RIU. Hope you come from the red side of town.
I'm guessing those are equivalent wattages for your lamps as a 125w bulb fills my case on its own.
Your humidity is a little low at 30%. It's prolly because the air is staying in the case a bit too long and drying out. Try using the 80mm fan as an additional exhaust to get the hot air out faster, that should raise the humidity and lower the temp at the same time.


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## maturesmoker (Mar 28, 2010)

V12, 

The* Violator Kush*, whos seeds are they? I'm looking to add a new Kush, whats your opinion of it?

Cheers,

ms.


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## tags (Mar 28, 2010)

Hey V12. Any chance you could upload some pics of your reflectors from pets @ home?

Cheers 
Tags


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## v12xjs (Mar 28, 2010)

Hi ms.
The VK is from Barneys Farm. I've not smoked any yet but all the signs so far are good. It has an enchanting smell close up, but once the case is closed it is a very low odour strain. The 3 I've popped have all been very easy to grow and seem fine on both low and high doses of nutes with no signs of deficiency or overfeeding. Germ rates are currently at 100% so I have no complaints. My only concern would be with the mutant I got, but other than that I'm a happy camper and I can't wait to try it. The trichs have been cloudy since day 1 

Hey tags.
I can't get a pic just now but I'll post a couple tomorrow.


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## c4shin (Mar 28, 2010)

yer im a red  and ill give it a shot with the 80mm fan. o and 1 more thing lol how long should i veg for in a pc case seen sum 1 say till its 6 inch but that seems abit small to me would u say 4 weeks veg then 8 week flowering ty


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## tags (Mar 29, 2010)

Hey V12, another quick Q, how do u rate the canna coco? And what did you pay for a 50L bag?

Cheers
Tags


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## maturesmoker (Mar 29, 2010)

Cheers for the info on the VK, I'll go take a look see if picknmix have them


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## "SICC" (Mar 29, 2010)

Subscribed


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## v12xjs (Mar 29, 2010)

My pleasure ms. I should have mentioned I got mine from picknmix.

Welcome aboard SICC. 

Hey tags.
If you veg for 4 weeks and switch the lights, it will take a further week or 2 for the plant to show it's first flower, which would mean 6 weeks of veg really. Personally I only consider the plant to be showing sex at that point and I wait a further 10 - 14 days until it is putting out pistils instead of leaves before I commence counting down the flowering time. That could mean up to 8 weeks of vegging for you.
There's also an issue where the plant freaks out after going to 12/12 overnight that's called the stretch. They will at least double in size within a couple of weeks of switching, even more if there's some sativa in the genetics.
To save aggro I start them off under 12/12 and give them plenty of LST. The stretch gets them where they need to be and ensures they can finish in the case.
There's pro's & cons to coco. I'm doing ok in it but I suspect I'd be getting similar results with soil and perlite. I like the fact that I can just fill a pot with it and stick a plant in, rather than rinsing perlite and having to blend it with soil every time I repot something. On the other hand, once the plants get into their stride they need watering every day and I can't always look in on them that often. 
I think if you choose coco you should get the coco specific nutes as well as there seems to be an abundance of potassium in there that could cause problems with soil or hydro nutes. I paid £12 for 50L of canna coco.
Wasn't sure exactly what you were looking for with the pics of the reflector, but here's a couple I took:







EDIT: Just in case you wondered about the gap between the 2 reflectors, I did it because a single reflector above seems to focus the light directly below the bulb and it singed a couple of buds. The gap just stops that from happening and shouldn't really be needed for cfl's.


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## shibby2009 (Mar 29, 2010)

i gotta ask are you growing inside a pc case i mean the tower where the motherboards supposed to be inside? i could do that too but i dont know if its a good idea? is it working great and what kind of lights are you using mate cheers


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## v12xjs (Mar 29, 2010)

Greets shibby
It's just a plain old tower case with all the gubbins removed. Works great for me. I've just changed to a CMH bulb but used cfl's to great effect for a long time before that.


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## jjmd (Mar 29, 2010)

V12,
I am going to ask the questions no one else is willing to ask. How much to just build the dam box and ship it to me? If you haven't thought about it then maybe a new bussines venture just openned up for you. LOL

I can see what MS has been talkin about with your grow. *Really nice!!!!*
I am just joking about buying a box from you, but if you do start the biz, just remember where the idea came from. LMAO


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## Phase420 (Mar 29, 2010)

Im starting my first day of flowering tonight!!!


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## c4shin (Mar 29, 2010)

gl with the flowering m8  its my 1st grow in a pc case its good for me coz i have ppl in and out my house all the time. going to get a grow tent after i get the hang of it. but i wish u all the gl with your grows


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## tags (Mar 29, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> My pleasure ms. I should have mentioned I got mine from picknmix.
> 
> Welcome aboard SICC.
> 
> ...


 
Thanks again for the info. I was asking about the reflectors cos i went on the pets @ home site and found ones that didnt really look up to the job. Yours, however, look very different to the ones on the website. This pick n mix you and ms have mentioned. Is it secure/reliable/good value?

Cheers
Tags


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## v12xjs (Mar 29, 2010)

Thanks jjmd.
Times are tough all over so maybe you are onto something there. Just quote the discount code jjmdriu at the checkout 

That's great news Phase, hope you have some pics up. I'll check out your update. Props for growing through the night, it's a shrewd move.

picknmix are discreet and reliable, suitable for pikeys like me too as they sell single seeds 

Just used the last of the camera battery to get a couple of pics. Just plants this time 
The NL is hanging to dry so it's all Kush now. There's a little one just out of sight behind Trinity and another in a wet towel so it's all pretty quiet again for a week or 2.







Oh and a hilarious story from Canada reported on the BBC news today:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8528672.stm


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## tags (Mar 30, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Thanks jjmd.
> Times are tough all over so maybe you are onto something there. Just quote the discount code jjmdriu at the checkout
> 
> That's great news Phase, hope you have some pics up. I'll check out your update. Props for growing through the night, it's a shrewd move.
> ...


Glad to hear picknmix is rated by an experienced grower like yourself, do you pay by card? Any strain in particular you would recommend for a first time cabinet/pc grow? Had a read at that article in uni today, nice find V12 haha
Cheers
Tags


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## jjmd (Mar 30, 2010)

I went out today and purchased one of the type of lights that you are using. I now see why you need to have so many fans. I placed in my clone box and wow temps over 95 easy. I may need to try that light out in a diffrent way.


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## v12xjs (Mar 30, 2010)

Greets tags
Easiest to grow have been this Violator Kush and Ice Cream. Blueberry would also be well suited, but pending a smoke test I'd plump for the kush out of the 3 as it doesn't really smell while growing.
I use a prepay card with no ID check. o2 do a good deal or search on prepay gift cards.
FWIW about 10 miles out of Manchester on the East Lancs road there's a town called Leigh with a head shop that sells seeds over the counter, it's on Bradshawgate. I don't know what seedbanks are represented but cash sales leave no trails.

Grats on the new light jjmd.
I did say it was hot. The info with mine says it's fine in an enclosed fitting if that helps. The polycarb sheet I use keeps most of it at bay TBH. 
I sure hope you can find a use for it.


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## jjmd (Mar 30, 2010)

I use a poly sheet/ glass when I am starting a new grow and the lights are down close to the plants. I want to use the light in a more open area, I just feel like a small wooden box and that much heat could be an issue. I am going to go and trash pick a PC box sometime soon and try it in there.


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## v12xjs (Mar 31, 2010)

Good point. Not something that had ever really occurred to me before. 
I just searched on ignition temperature of wood and this was the first hit on altavista:
http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/fplr/fplr1464.pdf
It doesn't look like too much of a risk after reading that, but I assume you are using are reflector or something that would provide a barrier anyway. If it's just paint then maybe use the stuff for radiators or engine/brake calipers. I've used hammerite radiator paint for the inside of the new case, but that was mostly because I didn't want it to go yellow over time due to heat.


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## jjmd (Mar 31, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Good point. Not something that had ever really occurred to me before.
> I just searched on ignition temperature of wood and this was the first hit on altavista:
> http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/fplr/fplr1464.pdf


That was some interesting reading in that report. makes you think just how fast some things can go wrong. What I was thinking about was a can of some sort. Just not sure which way would be best to cut it to fit.


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## v12xjs (Mar 31, 2010)

A can sounds like a good idea. I'd prolly just chop 1 in half from the top down.
Road signs here have a tube that shines light onto the sign, it's called trough lighting. You might get some better ideas by scanning the online suppliers.


Just checked on the girls and popped a germed seed in there so I'm back to 4 plants. Dusty has started with the amber trichs so not long for her now. I've upped her food slowly but it's at pretty high levels now, around 1000ppm without any deficiencies or stress, so it looks like I can push the rest of them a bit harder early on. Hopefully Trinity will outdo her sister


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## Phase420 (Apr 1, 2010)

always looking good!


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## tags (Apr 3, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Greets tags
> Easiest to grow have been this Violator Kush and Ice Cream. Blueberry would also be well suited, but pending a smoke test I'd plump for the kush out of the 3 as it doesn't really smell while growing.
> I use a prepay card with no ID check. o2 do a good deal or search on prepay gift cards.
> FWIW about 10 miles out of Manchester on the East Lancs road there's a town called Leigh with a head shop that sells seeds over the counter, it's on Bradshawgate. I don't know what seedbanks are represented but cash sales leave no trails.
> ...


Hey v12, not been on in a fewdays. Cheers for the mention of the shop, i'm north of the border so its a bit far for me i'd say. I'll look into the prepay cards from O2.

Cheers
Tags


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## v12xjs (Apr 3, 2010)

Thanks Phase. Your case will look like that soon.

Sorry tags, my bad.

Greets & thanks skunkybud.

I'm a bit drunk but I haven't seen the girls for 3 days so I had to look in on them when the light went on just now. Think I killed the new seedling, those humidity domes need lifting & cleaning each day but I thought she'd be ok. Maybe not. 
Trinity is showing some slight nute burn on the main cola. I'm trying out new nutes and don't have them down yet 
Forgot to switch the white balance back on the cam again but here's some pics of where I'm at. I wish you could see the the full pic of that cola, never mind smelling it 
I clicked a button by accident and Photobucket says those last pics were downoaded 614 times on Mar 29th alone and 3,600 times overall in March. Yowser!
Please just remember they are my images.
Hope you like the last pic, it made me snot on my shirt. It's Homer Simpson


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## crazytrain14 (Apr 7, 2010)

lookin good v. and for the homer pic.... sick lol but very funny

peace


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## gumball (Apr 7, 2010)

hey v12 and everyone else. I really like your grow, 2 thumbs up!I have been reading through here about your cmh, and started looking into them myself. I wanted to pass along the info I found in case it helps you or someone else that follows your thread. www.lighting.philips.com/us_en/browseliterature/download/p-5432.pdf check out that link. the ED-17P have a FadeBlock tech which filters UV light. The regular ED-17 bulbs do not filter UV. they range from 50-150 watt. i priced them at $75 USD from various sites online. hope this helps everyone, keep that PC humming!!

forgot to add that they are about $75 for bulb and ballast together, but the ballast has to be put together and put in a case. that is doable for me, for others maybe not.


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## v12xjs (Apr 8, 2010)

Thanks crazytrain. Hope you're getting closer to putting another grow on. I'm getting withdrawl symptoms.

Hey Gumball, appreciate the double thumbs. That's a great link, hope you get the +rep you deserve for finding and posting it.

Got another eyeful of green last night and some good news on the little plant I thought I'd killed. The seedling has responded to some TLC and is pointing upwards once again, she's a few days behind where she should be but I can live with that.
Dusty has stopped growing upwards and is starting to get fatter now. I just did the math and she's got about 13 days left. She sprouted on Jan 17, showed her first flower on Feb 11 and I always add 14 days on for them to go from showing sex to actually flowering. Another 55 days for the flowering period takes me to April 23 for the chop, so a little over 90 days total.
Here's some pics:


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## gumball (Apr 8, 2010)

looks good v12, damn good


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## jjmd (Apr 8, 2010)

gumball said:


> looks good v12, damn good


I agree that does look good.


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## "SICC" (Apr 8, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Thanks crazytrain. Hope you're getting closer to putting another grow on. I'm getting withdrawl symptoms.
> 
> Hey Gumball, appreciate the double thumbs. That's a great link, hope you get the +rep you deserve for finding and posting it.
> 
> ...



Buds look great


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## maturesmoker (Apr 9, 2010)

And again V12  ..... they look great, I love that solid foxtailing all round the tops! 

Glad you managed to resurrect the little one too.


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## v12xjs (Apr 10, 2010)

Wow thanks you guys. I wish I could take the credit but these plants grow themselves and that little bulb should have MOFO stamped all over it in huge letters!
I really like that group pic. It shows the logic of why I do a perpetual instead of a scrog.
Dusty is taking up around half of the light and space in there but none of the other plants are missing out, so I can harvest 50% of the case every 24 days with this strain. A scrog would give me 100% of the case every 95 days with the same genetics.

Got a pic this morning of the group and Christy is there on the left:


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## floridasucks (Apr 10, 2010)

beautiful.. what strain is Christy?


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## gumball (Apr 10, 2010)

i tried to read your whole thread, but it took over a year for it to get here, so I know it would take a long time to read the WHOLE THING!!

so let me get this right. you plant a seed every 2-3 weeks. your case runs at 12/12 constantly, and all your seeds start with 12/12 light. This lets you harvest every 24 days? 

WOW. if that is correct, you have figured out a system that is pretty close to perfect. i may even think about doing this myself for my cabinet grow. mines in a garage so outside temps have an effect, and I have to run lights on at night time, and lights off when the sun is up to control temps. so 12/12 all the time would work better for me. 

i have about 4 sq ft, or 8 cubic feet, so I have alot of veg space, compared to your pc that is. but I would like to harvest more frequently myself. so yeah, i can grow 'em bigger, but you'll be smok'en on yours well before mine even comes out of the jars!! 

Again v12, there is the rule, and then the exception to the rule. you have showed us how to be the exception.


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## maturesmoker (Apr 11, 2010)

If she gets much fatter V12 shes going to be bursting out of that case!  Brilliant.


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## v12xjs (Apr 12, 2010)

Hey fs. All the plants in there just now are Barneys Violator Kush. Not tried them yet but they are really easy to grow and don't stink the place up, so if they tick the potency box as well then I'll be getting a few more in.
Loved the pics of your last harvest, wish I was so good with a cam.

Sorry about the size of the journal gumball, I talk a lot when I'm stoned 
You've got the specifics spot on. I'd just add that I use feminised seeds so I get a prize every time. Like you I also run the lights through the night to take advantage of reduced ambients.
Loving the sentiment about exceptions, not sure it's deserved though. Remember that you just ran through the whole setup in 1 sentence without even resorting to big words 
I think you should hook up with maturesmoker. His new setup takes some of the ideas I use but he's upscaling it for a cab the same size as yours, here's his perpetual thread:
https://www.rollitup.org/cfl-growing/316278-mature-goes-perpetual.html

Thanks ms. She's a proper little fatty that's for sure 

No pic updates today as I've been a bit busy. Managed to burn Trinity with some nutes. I didn't have any mixed up and she was bone dry so I did a quick midnight feast for her without checking ppm or ph and it didn't go well. Looks like she'll recover though. My bad.


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## gumball (Apr 12, 2010)

Thanks v12. I am already subbed to ms's thread, he has had good success in his grows. I am thinking now how to do perpetual with my setup. I don't think I can do 2 boxes though. I will think of something. I want to reveg my current grow though cause she's a good producer and the other is a good smoke, so I have time to work something out.


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## gumball (Apr 12, 2010)

Oh, I have gotten about 15 pages into the thread, right past your first spell of heat issues. I had an idea for you if you have more heat issues, double stack ur fans together. It only uses a littl more space, only requires extra length screws, and as long as the individual fans are somewhat silent it should be pretty quite. Your plexi-shield looks to have cleared up your temps though. 

I plan to build a 7" square cool tube (for the square pc fans) out of plexi-glass from the ideas that your plexi heat shield gave me. It will have a 120mm fan supported by bungees blowing into, and another 120mm encased with thick foam on the other end to suck the air out of the box. I will post a pick of it when I am done if you don't mind. 

Again, thanks for the idea's, your like a plethora of them!


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## floridasucks (Apr 12, 2010)

i heard that Barneys kush is a real good smoke, hope you enjoy. 

i dont i posted my last harvest after the ak. i did some amazing blueberry that i have revegging now. 

check out these blueberry nugs, hope u dont mind v12.


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## v12xjs (Apr 12, 2010)

Wow fs, they are beautiful pics. Your buds just cry out to be smoked. I trust I can leave that job in your capable hands 

Hey gumball, I'd love to see the cooltube.
As we both turn on the lights at night I have one more thought that may be of use to you. 
I found a cute trick last year that allowed me to use cuttings without changing my lights. Once plants go out to reveg I can take a cutting, put it in a dome and pop it in the case. In the morning before lights out I can then take it out and stick it on the windowsill for some all day sun. The dome prevents people working out what it is. Once the lights go back on it goes back in the case. That way it gets 20+ hours of light to sort out a root system but doesn't require a separate cutting chamber or any changes to my little 12/12 oasis. It's a bit of faffing about but saves a lot of money on seeds.


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## gumball (Apr 12, 2010)

Did u try that cloning technique yet? Sounds interesting enough. Maybe I could mix the clone in with some of my wifes plants, u kno incognito as a plant! Thanks!


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## v12xjs (Apr 12, 2010)

I used it last year and it worked perfectly. Clones were rooted in around 10 days and I was able to let them do another week of vegging before locking them in on 12/12. They don't bush as much as seeded plants so I had to adjust a bit, but I ended up with a clone going in every 2 weeks and it all worked out fine. It did get a bit manic though:


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## v12xjs (Apr 13, 2010)

Well Dusty showed a bit of amber overnight. She's starting to look a bit beat up but she's on a diet just now ready for me to take a sample in about a week. Those buds are plumping up nicely though and there's still more coming.
Where I am it's still too early to put this girl outside when she's done, so it looks like I'll have to wait for Trinity to start revegging and cuttings. That means I'll be growing her mutant offspring all summer! 
Got some pics so here's Dusty on a bad hair day:


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## "SICC" (Apr 13, 2010)

damn she looks great


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## floridasucks (Apr 13, 2010)

very nice!


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## maturesmoker (Apr 14, 2010)

Great big balls of bud


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## gumball (Apr 14, 2010)

hey v12, have you ever had to bond yoru polycarbonate to anything? I am trying to bond mine together and was curious if you had to deal with this. I have acrylic though, not sure if there is a difference.


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## v12xjs (Apr 15, 2010)

Hey thanks guys.
She's just 6 days away now and those amber trichs are spreading from the leaves onto the calyxes. I still have some naughty NL in my jar so I'd love to let 1 cola go another week but there just isn't enough room for that 2 litre pot, so she'll come down all in 1 go.

Greets gum. I've used fish tank glue in the past to bond acrylic and it works really well. Any fish tank you see is glued with this stuff so it's clear, waterproof and can deal with high pressures, but I'm not sure about the temps it can cope with. It should be available at decent pet shops or aquariums but just check it's ok for the kind of temps you are running. If it's rated to 40-50C you should be fine.


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## gumball (Apr 18, 2010)

hey v12-did you get the 3000k or 4200k cmh bulb?


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## v12xjs (Apr 19, 2010)

Greets gum.
I'm using the 3000k bulb. There's plenty of blue spectrum light in it to keep the plants green until the end. I think the 4200k bulbs are tuned more for human vision.

Got a new idea for an experiment yesterday.
I'm currently reclaiming some scrub land and trying to grow some veggies, but it's a major battle against the weeds which are starting to surface now. While I'm clearing the land I have to remove every bit of root I find in the soil or it will just grow a shoot and come back to haunt me in a couple of weeks. This is what gave me the idea.
I'm going to try to take ROOT cuttings from Dusty when she expires. In theory she is a weed just the same as the damned bindweed I'm fighting so I can't see why it wouldn't work and if successful it might be a little faster and more reliable than stem cuttings as there will already be a root system. It should eliminate any possibility of bringing bugs into the grow and I'm also thinking I might be able to do this under my 12/12 light regime. As cuttings usually need 18+ hours of light they aren't really suitable for my single room setup otherwise.
If anyone else is interested, here's 2 links I found last night that give me (a faint) hope I'm neither barking mad nor wasting my time:
http://www.herbs2000.com/herbs/herbs_hops.htm
This is somewhat long-winded but shows that hops is part of the Cannabis family and that commercial cuttings are taken from the root rather than the stem.
http://www.gardenersworld.com/how-to/projects/root-cuttings/
A basic guide to root cuttings.

Wish me luck.

Quick update on the garden. Dusty is still there but she's due for the chop on Wednesday night. Trinity is developing some serious frost and Monica has formed a nice baby bud now, although it looks like I was a bit late with the lst so she's growing with a single cola. Should be a hell of a cola though!
Here's some pics from last night:


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## maturesmoker (Apr 19, 2010)

Hi mate 

I'm staggered by those pictures! Those buds are literally ballshaped 

I'll have a read of the rootcuttings link later when I have more time but I know what you mean. Btw, I also grow all our veggies in summer  nothing like it.

Slightly off topic V12, I;ve just been doing a bit of housework while listening to/watching some Space Ritual vids on YouTube I came across this one by *Inner City Unit* with Rob Calvert, a great version of *Orgone Accumulator* you will love it mate! There's a shot at the end of Nik etc standing by Calverts headstone, really moved me, you know? For those of us old Hawkwind fans its like a piece of history  Heres the link: 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdW8nqI_MVk


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## v12xjs (Apr 19, 2010)

Hey ms. Thanks so much for the link. I love that track. I never thought about scouring utube for Inner City Unit.

The pic of the tombstone is very moving. The guy in the middle is Nik's roadie and a true gentleman. He also set up the stage at Stonehenge all those years ago. I got chatting to him recently and bought him a beer by way of thanks for the pleasure he and the guys had brought me over the years. In return he gave me a copy of The Undisclosed Files for free and had it signed by the band!

I thought of you after I dreamt up the latest cuttings idea. Many years ago I remember being told that Hops was a relative of cannabis and that cuttings could be grafted to roots of cannabis plants. If my geography serves, you are in a part of the country with all the hops farms. Just read through that 1st link to see how much weed and hops have in common.

I'm like you with those pics. It's crazy what goes on in that little box. Just glad it's mine


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## gumball (Apr 19, 2010)

Them girls are lookn good. I have read quite a bit on root cloning, seems like a good option. 

I am tore between the 3000k and 4000k. I am thinking of running a 100watt cmh, a 2700k 42watt, and a 6500k 40 watt(the 40 is 3000 lumens!). I want the 4k because of the uv spectrum, but I don't know. 

Keep them girls bloomn v12, and enjoy your new garden


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## v12xjs (Apr 19, 2010)

Thanks gum.
I don't think UV would be a problem for you. I would expect both the CMH bulbs to output the same amount and all CFL's emit measurable levels of UV, even the 2700k bulbs. My understanding is that HPS is the only lamp that doesn't emit UV. I'll try and post up a few links later that may help.


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## NLNo5 (Apr 19, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> A thought occurred to me with regard to needhelp's question on my choice of methods and the reasons behind those choices. Maybe it will help you guys to understand my system a little better and assist in forming your own setups.
> 
> The biggest breakthrough I ever made in terms of pc case growing was nothing to do with cultivation techniques. I realised that I could get by with modest amounts of weed. In fact when I thought about it, a gram a day was actually more than enough. Once I knew I only needed 350g/year, growing in a pc case was actually a viable option.
> Once you understand this principle, maximising yield becomes a secondary consideration. My job is to churn out average yields day in and day out.
> ...


I'm on the tail end of a NL high, this entry was refreshing to read, spoken like a true PC Stealth Perpetual guru.


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## gumball (Apr 19, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Greets gum.
> I'm using the 3000k bulb. There's plenty of blue spectrum light in it to keep the plants green until the end. I think the 4200k bulbs are tuned more for human vision.
> 
> Got a new idea for an experiment yesterday.
> ...


 
hey v12, here is a link to a thread on RIU with some suggestions to try. not sure if you found it yet or not. hope this helps you out.

https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/295710-root-clone-test-pictures.html


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## v12xjs (Apr 21, 2010)

Brilliant link gumball. Thank you.
I must have deleted all my old cfl links but I'm pretty sure there's plenty coming from your cfl's and some from the CMH. Don't forget how strong HPS grown weed can be without any UV exposure. I wouldn't get too hung up about it.
I notice you have a lot of blue light in that bulb selection, any particular reason?

Really glad you appreciated that NLNo5, that must have taken some finding.
I suppose it is a bit Zen. More by accident than design 
I'm just floating on a cloud of NL myself, been looking forward to it all day.
Thanks for checking in.

Just chopped Dusty. Well a bit of her anyway. The case looked all empty and her replacement bean hasn't even hit the paper towel yet, so I just took the smaller of the twin colas and the popcorn. I'll get the rest in a day or 2.
She's very easy to trim, I've only taken the fan leaves as everything else is dripping with trichs. Here's the state of play:


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## AudiA6Driver (Apr 21, 2010)

NICE!! i think im going to start a little micro grow to, i have many shitty comps laying aound, and i think i have a server that would work perfect, I just like the look of the little plant with hugs ass buds on it. Your grow is an inspiration! lol Enjoy the rewards man!


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## Phase420 (Apr 21, 2010)

LOOOOOOOKING GOOD!!! Dusty looks amazing... wish i could come have a session with that!! Thinking about try to put another one of my blue mystics in and just starting it at 12/12! happy harvesting v12!


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## v12xjs (Apr 21, 2010)

Cheers guys.
I don't know what you're waiting for. Gut that server and pop that seed!


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## maturesmoker (Apr 22, 2010)

Well, that's without doubt the biggest individual bud that I have seen pulled from a PC case grow and that's only a part of her!!!!!! Nice one V12 

I'm with you on not trimming my buds down too tight too, I smoke every bit of it save the bigger leafs. 

'Brilliant' is the only adjective I can find to describe this grow mate.


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## gumball (Apr 22, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Brilliant link gumball. Thank you.
> I must have deleted all my old cfl links but I'm pretty sure there's plenty coming from your cfl's and some from the CMH. Don't forget how strong HPS grown weed can be without any UV exposure. I wouldn't get too hung up about it.
> I notice you have a lot of blue light in that bulb selection, any particular reason?
> 
> ...


very nice looking pre-harvest harvest!! a red bull size bud in a case that size is awesome. no reason on all the blue light, just want fewer bulbs, but still need a little blue. i really want to try this particular light too. so just me wanting to experiment!! keep that thing chugging 'em out and i will keep following!!


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## v12xjs (Apr 23, 2010)

Hey ms. Bonkers innit? 
I should prolly have used a clipper for scale like everyone else. My bad 
I dread to think what you have in store with your new setup. I'll bet you'll need to use the clothes line for a bud dryer come July/August!

Cheers gum.
I don't think you can go wrong with a CMH/CFL mix. I'd be tempted to aim for 10-20% blue light from the cfl's with the rest being red. I found all red caused the leaves to yellow very early into flowering and adding 10% blue kept them green till the end. I didn't really push it any further as that was all I wanted. 
There's plenty of blue even in the 3000k CMH so if you're looking at a 12/12 setup that may be a better choice than the 4200k IMHO.


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## Bagz (Apr 23, 2010)

Hey man, have you seen or heard of a similar clear perspex cool tube setup like this used with HPS Bulbs? I have a 150W Hps in a small stealth shelf that I want to try it with?
If you have time check out my grow journal and see if you think a similar set up would work.
I think an Hps may be too hot for it but am keen to try.


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## gumball (Apr 23, 2010)

Bagz said:


> Hey man, have you seen or heard of a similar clear perspex cool tube setup like this used with HPS Bulbs? I have a 150W Hps in a small stealth shelf that I want to try it with?
> If you have time check out my grow journal and see if you think a similar set up would work.
> I think an Hps may be too hot for it but am keen to try.


I don't know if this helps, but I am building a square cooltube out of plexiglass, 7" square by 19" long. I am going to put a 120mm pc fan at each end, and then exhaust out. I wish I had it built I would post a pic. But the plexiglass I am lookin at can withstand temps to 200 degrees f. If u are capable of custom building something like this it may work better for you.


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## v12xjs (Apr 24, 2010)

Hey Bagz
My light is a HID so it prolly puts out similar heat to yours. A heatshield or cooltube like gumball is making should help your temps a lot. I notice you have more air going in to your cab than you are extracting though and I'm not sure that's the best way to cool things down. Maybe try turning those fans around so the big 1 is the exhaust and the smaller 1 is the intake. I think that might shave a few degrees off for you.
Good luck.


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## maturesmoker (Apr 24, 2010)

Morning V12  I'm going to have a read through those links you posted today, got some time on my hands. I'll let you know what I think. You're right about the hop fields but so many have been lost over the past 50 years. My Nan used to take the whole family 'hopping' (7 children!!) it was the annual holiday for thousands of Londoners, 2 weeks spent in a tin hut in August picking hops and being paid by weight. Most was spent on food and drink though, the local pubs hiking up the prices to exploit the 'outsiders'!!!! But yes, I knew that the hop was a relative of cannabis, should be an interesting read, cheers.

Back on subject, I accept that my yields are low due to using CFL's, I just might look at this alternative having seen your results!

have a good day.


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## v12xjs (Apr 24, 2010)

Greets ms. Hope you are surrounded by your lovely girls on this sunny day 

Not too sure about a lack of yields between this bulb and the cfl's TBH. 
If you remember, I was pulling 8 - 10 colas per plant with the cfl's and I can't really get more than 4 with this bulb. They are bigger buds for sure but the curing jars tell the tale and they are no more full now than they were last year.
I'm still happy with the change to CMH but I prolly would have saved my money and stuck with the cfl's if I knew then what I know know.


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## maturesmoker (Apr 24, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Greets ms. Hope you are surrounded by your lovely girls on this sunny day
> 
> Not too sure about a lack of yields between this bulb and the cfl's TBH.
> If you remember, I was pulling 8 - 10 colas per plant with the cfl's and I can't really get more than 4 with this bulb. They are bigger buds for sure but the curing jars tell the tale and they are no more full now than they were last year.
> I'm still happy with the change to CMH but I prolly would have saved my money and stuck with the cfl's if I knew then what I know know.


INteresting! Like you I'm not looking for huge yields and atm I'm using the SUN wherever I can and they love it. Still behind glass but they still respond well to it I'm certain of that. I'll see how Trinny does. From about 11am the suns full on the back of the house all day so they will soon be out of the cab 

Have you tasted the Kush at all yet? I could almost eat that stuff green I swear!! I'm still planning to try the VK once I thin out these SW's a little.


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## v12xjs (Apr 27, 2010)

Sorry guys, I breached my fair use policy so my internet is being throttled. No more pics for a while I'm afraid.

Hey ms, Dusty was a bit average at 55 days, so I've had to leave her another week. She will prolly come down tonight as I need the space for the replacement seedling. Flavour was ok and should be better with a couple of weeks curing but the hit is unimpressive and I would only class it as a daytime smoke. Hopefully the extra week will help.


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## tom__420 (Apr 27, 2010)

You harvested her at 7 weeks... you were expecting it to be impressive? Not many plants finish in 7 weeks
Now don't freak out just offering kind advice bro you got a nice harvest
Here's a quote about Violator Kush(I believe this is what dusty was:
"*Flowering period of this cannabis variety is 8-9 weeks which is typical for any indica dominated strains.* Already at the beginning of flowering, *Violator Kush* develops an earthy, musty smell and flavour which becomes more intense during maturing. This strain is suitable for indoor and outdoor cultivation."
http://www.cannabis-seeds-bank.co.uk/barneys-farm-violator-kush-feminized/prod_1538.html
Next time you run if you let it go a full 8 or 9 weeks it should give you an impressive result, I have heard good things in the past of this strain

What strain are you growing next?


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## maturesmoker (Apr 27, 2010)

tom-420, if you read the thread you will see that V12 counts day one of flowering from *first pistils*, not day 1 of 12/12 so you need to add another 12/14 days! That makes her closer to 70 days I believe which is pretty much good for any Kush strain I have grown?

V12, let us know how she is when you try the later cut? I have found with my Kush it takes a while to develop that sweetness in the taste but it will come through I'm sure.


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## Phase420 (Apr 27, 2010)

awwww sorry to hear we wont beseeing anymore awsome buds! That sucks! Hope all going well other wise...


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## kilpox (Apr 27, 2010)

Wassup v12.
I interesting about 12/12 from seed. And im read about that if i grow 12/12 from seed i get lower THC. Do that is true or false? You grow 12/12 and smoke a lot of strains. So tell me,do you feel lower thc in your buds when u smoke it?


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## monsoon (Apr 27, 2010)

I've been following this thread on and off since I first started visiting rollitup and it always impresses me.
I recently started a small trial grow just to see what could be accomplished in a pc. Although, my nugs are like midgets compared to yours haha

I've definitely learned a lot from my first attempt and now that I know what I can improve, I'll be able to get more out of my second harvest. (I just started a new plant) =D

Just out of curiosity, how much do you think the main bud in my photo would turn out to weigh?
This grow wasn't about yield, as I'm only expecting a single digit harvest, but since I've never grown, it's tough to tell.
The plant is at about Day 60 in the pic (taken about 10 days ago).


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## v12xjs (Apr 28, 2010)

Thanks for your interest tom
Please don't post in this journal again.

Cheers ms. 
Glad to see you got the 3 r's down np.

Hey & thanks Phase. The medicine cabinet is looking really sweet, just wish I could post an update on Monica, she's a real looker. All is not lost though, MacD's provide free access so I'll pop in for a coffee when I can 
I'll catch up with your grow now.

Greets kilpox
Sorry you had a problem yesterday, my mailbox was full. I'll empty it now if you want to try again.
I can't measure thc except the good old fashioned way but I don't think there's any problem with what I grow. I never saw any links to height or age and thc production, and some of the newer auto strains are showing very high thc content. That would seem to show that early flowering and short stature prolly don't affect thc levels.

Hey monsoon
Nice looking plant. I'm guessing that's 60 days from seed so there's a way to go yet, maybe a month or so. Hard to give a guess on weight but it looks like there's plenty of indica in it so it won't grow up much more but it will grow out. The plant looks very similar to a plant Dopewear grew in his 1st journal, check it out if you want to see the kind of things you might expect.

Greets & good vibes DW.


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## v12xjs (May 1, 2010)

Still got no pics to post but I came across something of interest I thought I'd share.
I visited that shop I mentioned that does over the counter seeds. Not a big place but very helpful. They stock Paradise and Greenhouse seeds and will get Serious stock in to order. They gave me some handouts and the Paradise brochure gave some tips on growing which suggest 80% humidity for veg! I checked the website to see if it was a printing error but it's the same there. 68 - 77F, 80% RH in veg and under 60% for flower. Here's the page, scroll down to the paragraph on indoor growing:
http://www.paradise-seeds.com/index.php?language=en&pageid=growtips

I was always told 40 - 60% RH although I do use humidity domes for small plants and it does keep them sweet. Anybody here using such high moisture levels during their grow?


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## Phase420 (May 1, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Still got no pics to post but I came across something of interest I thought I'd share.
> I visited that shop I mentioned that does over the counter seeds. Not a big place but very helpful. They stock Paradise and Greenhouse seeds and will get Serious stock in to order. They gave me some handouts and the Paradise brochure gave some tips on growing which suggest 80% humidity for veg! I checked the website to see if it was a printing error but it's the same there. 68 - 77F, 80% RH in veg and under 60% for flower. Here's the page, scroll down to the paragraph on indoor growing:
> http://www.paradise-seeds.com/index.php?language=en&pageid=growtips
> 
> I was always told 40 - 60% RH although I do use humidity domes for small plants and it does keep them sweet. Anybody here using such high moisture levels during their grow?


IMO.... I think high humidity while vegging is fine, because the light is on so much longer, that your plant has more water/humidity to substane itself better then in a aired place. For flowering I believe, you can have a little bit high humidity in your box, if that air is super dry coming in threw your intake the dryer air should kill some of the humidity in your box. That just what seem to make sence to me.


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## v12xjs (May 3, 2010)

Hey Phase, I guess you're right. I just assumed they naturally needed drier conditions. Oddly enough I noticed that if I turn off the fans at night the humidity rises to around 78% and then doesn't get any higher. I always wondered if there was any significance to that and I guess now it's prolly the point where the leaves and the surrounding atmosphere are in equilibrium.
It's still no use to me though. I have buds in there that don't like damp!

I still have a poxy connection for now but here's a pic from yesterday. Dusty is gone so that's Trinity on the right and Monica centre. Monica is the single cola plant and she's looking very sweet. That bud looks amazing and it still has 6 weeks to go!


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## gumball (May 3, 2010)

looking good as always v12. monica is going to be a MONSTER in 6 weeks!! i like trinity with the trio'o cola!!


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## "SICC" (May 3, 2010)

looks tasty


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## v12xjs (May 4, 2010)

Thanks guys.
I'm with you gumball, that Monica is 1 hot sexy mama 
I think she's a shoe in for the hall of pc growing fame.

The last 2 colas of Dusty look to be dry enough for a sample tonight. They came down last Wednesday at 63 days flowering and 100 days total from seed, which is as long as I can give a plant really. Hopefully she's got a bit of a kick now or I may have to change things a little to give the rest some extra time in there.
I never weighed the 1st 2 buds but the last 2 came in at 7.8g and 4.1g dry, so prolly 22g total from the plant. I'll report back with the tester results.


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## maturesmoker (May 4, 2010)

All looking great in the box as usual. That's a healthy enough harvest v12  infact for its size that's very good. I'd be happy with that anyday.

Just sent you a long reply to your PM mate, so long I had to split it in 2 PM's! be interested to hear your thoughts.

Let us know how Dusty does when you try it again?


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## floridasucks (May 4, 2010)

sexy girls v...


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## Chebus (May 4, 2010)

im new to this site and thinking of doing a PC grow, cant wait to see the turnout it


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## Phase420 (May 4, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Hey Phase, I guess you're right. I just assumed they naturally needed drier conditions. Oddly enough I noticed that if I turn off the fans at night the humidity rises to around 78% and then doesn't get any higher. I always wondered if there was any significance to that and I guess now it's prolly the point where the leaves and the surrounding atmosphere are in equilibrium.
> It's still no use to me though. I have buds in there that don't like damp!
> 
> I still have a poxy connection for now but here's a pic from yesterday. Dusty is gone so that's Trinity on the right and Monica centre. Monica is the single cola plant and she's looking very sweet. That bud looks amazing and it still has 6 weeks to go!


I bet it also depend on the strain and the area it originated from on what it like. But who knows... i like your idea of stopping the fans, but i wouldnt beable to do so, because i would forget these days with all the stuff i have going. Your girls are looking great and swollen! Cant wait for my girl to get like this... just starting to get plump!


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## tamjam69 (May 4, 2010)

im with every one else too!! them plants and that bud next to the can are very impressive.

im hoping my micro grow turns out half as good as yours

did i read at the start of the thread that you yield around an ounce a month?

keep up the top notch work


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## v12xjs (May 4, 2010)

Thanks ms. Wicked pm, your honour 
I read your thread update & if you got one sorted out then that's the one ms. She'll be happy on Evergreen terrace 

Hey and welcome Chebus. There's some great pc grows on here and there's lots of helpful peeps that will point you in the right direction. PC grows are a challenge but just check back here if you ever want reminding that they can pay off.
Good luck.

Hey Phase. I have a memory like a sieve as well as you. I even forgot you run with a blue bulb in flower. Shame on me 
I have a melted heatshield and a faint smell of burning plastic in my room to remind me of my obligations these days 

Greets & thanks fs. 
Talking about high humidity, you are the man. Fuck me fella, when I think about it I should really hate you! You take awesome pics, grow mean ass weed in everything from a cardboard box to a FLorida sunset and you were growing in 80% humidity a year before I even heard about it! 
That's enough! it's offical, I hate you 
And you have a tarantula!
I'd love an up to date pic of Querkle if your cam is charged up. I really love the blues...

Hey tamjam. Thanks mate.
I love those can & bud shots too. If you got it, flaunt it 
The oz/month thing is about right. It's easier to see it now I'm using the cmh and getting more than 3 cans worth per plant, but the old cfl setup was just as good, both production and sheer stickiness. The buds were more spear-like but I was getting 7 - 10 at around 2g apiece.
If you can't get 14g a month out of that small semi detached stately home you call a growbox I'll eat my car!


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## P4CM4N (May 4, 2010)

I've been following your journal for a little while now and I must say, you've got an exemplary stealth set-up here. Quite ingenious. I really like how little you keep the plants while still maximizing with LST, which I am a big fan of thus far, except it seems like it'd be a lot more manageable with your little ladies than the monster bushes mine seem to be trying to turn into lol. In fact, this makes me want to start my own, just so I can grow in different parts of the house and have a perpetual personal stash, tucked away. +rep and subbed.


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## v12xjs (May 4, 2010)

Thanks P4CN4N
There's no magic here as you can see, just bend 'em over and they seem to do the rest. Gotta be a bit savage with that bend though, let them know who's boss, you know? Pin down any little dissenters as well.
If a plant grows a main cola 1 inch per day then it can only grow an even canopy of 10 colas 1 tenth of an inch every day yes? It's a very effective height control.


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## floridasucks (May 4, 2010)

dam v, thanx for the compliments hahaha...

i actually donated querkle to a new home. my friend is building a system of reptile tanks and i gave him querkle to add to it. i will be able to still get pics tho. ill get some for u soon bro.


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## v12xjs (May 5, 2010)

I'd love to see her fs. Bet you miss her.

Forgot to give out the early tester on the 2nd batch of VK too.
This batch got 14 days preflower, 63 days flower and had been hanging for 7 days.
Smoke is harsh as I'd expect and about the same as the 55 day cut in terms of potency. Nothing special as indicas go and no noticeable sativa effects. I'll try and leave Trinity a bit longer, but Dusty already took 100 days from seed so they don't look like good candidates for my system.


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## maturesmoker (May 6, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> I read your thread update & if you got one sorted out then that's the one ms. She'll be happy on Evergreen terrace


She's just getting herself together ready to travel  she's rooted now but a few more days will make her stronger, I'm sure she will be fine. I took one from each of the 2 mutant clones and forgot to label them so its pot luck  which one we get! Judging from 'tamjams' results both should be well worth working with.

I'm sorry to read that you're still a bit disappointed with the Kush though. Usually a 'fresh' strain will have max impact but it dont seem to be happening for you?


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## tamjam69 (May 6, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> If you can't get 14g a month out of that small semi detached stately home you call a growbox I'll eat my car!


lol that just had me in bits mate  any way the micro grow has been ditched aswell!!! i would have missed going up in the loft with my hps to much

looking forward to see what you do with the new lodger


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## v12xjs (May 7, 2010)

Hey ms. It could be worse, There's 2 grades of smoke below daytime 
I'll have to shuffle things around a bit to give them 65-70 days and that will mean that the baby won't have enough space in the case to be repotted. I'll prolly have to put her outside .

Greets tamjam. Glad you got a chuckle out of that 
You set the bar pretty high for the snow whites, but with any luck I'll need another can of red bull for the pics.

Just done the monthly clean and got a pic of the 2 big girls. Trinity looks healthy on the left although she's at about 53 days now and looks miles from being ready. Monica is at about 25 days and is developing a lovely single cola:


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## DryIsADirtyWord (May 7, 2010)

While I've nowhere near finished reading this entire thread, I've read enough to know it's time for me to stop putting this off... Time to learn to grow. Thank you so much v12.

I started out looking at aero systems, and while I'm sure with the right assistance I could get that to work - but that's not my style. I like to learn things from the ground up (no-pun intended), so starting with soil is what I'd like to do... learn it from square one, then advance. My current situation (many visitors, including my near 17 y/o stoner daughter) - so I wanted to start with a stealthy idea like this. After reading many pages of people saying this can't be done - seeing your grow made me close my browser and get started. Granted, I'm only germing right now - but I've got the materials together and am going to start getting to work this evening. 

Thanks again v12 - given that I work in IT, and have a buttload of PCs/Cases around all the time anyway, this will be perfect for me.. if I can pull it off!

Edit:

BTW - seriously glad this thread kept going. Thanks again!!


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## v12xjs (May 9, 2010)

Hey DryIs. Heartfelt thanks for stopping by and posting such a positive comment. You've really brightened my day.
Welcome to Rollitup and good luck with your grows.


I've been doing a it of the legwork I should have done before buying these VK seeds and it doesn't look promising. The genetics are malana x hindu kush and I should have looked into the malana aspect a bit more. The fact that I've smoked plenty of malana black possibly blinded me a bit, but now I look, I can't find any definitive info on flowering period because it takes so bloody long! Prolly 4 months or more!!!
Dusty had a light green colour to her leaves which would seem to be from the malana parentage but the 2 I have in flo ATM are much deeper green so maybe they will be closer to the kush genetically. That said, Trinity is at day 55 today and there's only the merest hint of flowers turning red. I can't see any chance of her being ready in 10 days and the more I think about it the less inclined I am to continue growing this strain, even the plants I already have.


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## Phase420 (May 9, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Hey DryIs. Heartfelt thanks for stopping by and posting such a positive comment. You've really brightened my day.
> Welcome to Rollitup and good luck with your grows.
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks V, You've opened my eye to not forgetting to be smart and do your research on all the genetics going in to the plant you would like to grow! Sometime good info like this slips by, glad i caught this... used to be smart about that stuff, but the name games has taken over me!!! LOL hope your leg doesnt hurt from all that searching around! haha


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## v12xjs (May 9, 2010)

Cheers Phase, glad it helps. I'm still kicking myself.


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## maturesmoker (May 10, 2010)

Hi V12,

trinity and Monica look fantastic  great shots. You better stock up on the Red Bull cans soon!

Re the Kush well I only ever grew Bubba O Kush and OG Kush and both finished nicely at 9 weeks-ish (12/12) so I can see what you are saying re malana. I grew both strains on and off for about 5 years and was never disappointed. Hopefully those 2 ladies will have more of the Kush genetics as you say.


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## v12xjs (May 10, 2010)

That's useful info ms, thanks. I'll take a bud from Trinity at 65 days and chop the rest at 70. If that doesn't do it I suspect I'll just BHO what I have left and start again from scratch.

FWIW here's a couple of pics. A group shot and a shot of one of Trinity's main colas at day 55. There's no way that cola is in the harvest window despite what Barneys Farm say about the strain.


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## gumball (May 10, 2010)

So, the great v12 knows the art of BHO?!?! Would you share with us your technique as I would like to make that or hash from my trimmings, but I am unsure which is better. 

I think the guys at barneys were sampling a little muCh when they were spec'ing that strain out, no where near ready!


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## v12xjs (May 10, 2010)

I'm with you there gumball, they must have been off their faces!

Floridasucks is the man to speak to for processing bud, He's posted some stunning pics in his outdoor thread.

At times I've needed to make bad shit better and ingesting decarboxylated dope is about 8x stronger than smoking it. I also hate wasting stuff and don't want to throw out incriminating evidence either, so I keep all my trim & shade leaves and I have a little kit I use:

  

The funnel came with a hip flask I have. The end is slightly thinner than the plastic nozzle of a butane canister.

I powder up the trim as best I can by hand, a mortar and pestle makes it too fine. Once the trim is ready I fix 2 coffee filters over 1 end of the pipe using elastic bands and fill the other end with the trim, tapping it now and again to make sure it's settled but not compressed. I leave 1 inch of space at the end and insert the funnel.

The pipe gets way cold when the gas is released so I wear 2 gloves on the hand I use to hold the pipe. I point the end inside an upturned jar with a flexible pastic top like the 1 my trim is in, you can see the cap next to it. I use a full can of gas and after a minute it starts spitting out the end into the collection jar. When it's done I blow down the pipe for a bit to get the last dregs through and I'm done. This has to be done outside obviously.

Leave the jar to evaporate in the shed for a day and then put the plastic cap in the freezer for a couple of hours. I just bend the plastic and the hard oil lifts up and peels away.

I suppose ultimately there would be no differecne in potency between hash and oil from the same trim but hash is a bit more user friendly.
Can't beat a BHO blueberry muffin though. Yummy


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## gumball (May 10, 2010)

and the pc gods rain down honey oil upon us!!  thanks v12, very straight forward. i like the freezing part, makes it seem easier to deal with when done.


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## [seriousdesert] (May 12, 2010)

v12, i'm currently in the process of making a pc grow box, probably never gonna be as good as yours but when i'm done i'll post some pics up or something.

My question is, what strains do you grow in there? i'm not sure what i'd be able to fit in for the entire cycle, as i have no where else to grow it. 

Thanks dude


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## v12xjs (May 13, 2010)

Thanks serious. 
I guess the short answer is that Ice Cream and Northern Lights both do really well in a case , they stay short, flower quickly and are both potent strains.
If you aren't running a perpetual then 12/12 from seed combined with LST should tame just about anything, but for my little perpetual I need stuff that finishes in 60 days or less.
Just remember that some breeders might not be totally honest with their descriptions and flower times


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## [seriousdesert] (May 13, 2010)

Awesome, thanks man 

how do you mean perpetual? 

What do you think of my attempt at a pc grow case? I'm gonna be installing another reflector on the left when i get more bulbs and general materials so i'll straighten the current one up when the new one's in. The reflectors can be raised and lowered when needs be


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## [seriousdesert] (May 13, 2010)

either it's me or the image didn't link properly...

here's another attempt


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## v12xjs (May 15, 2010)

Hey serious.
Nice case. I'm not sure there's enough light in there though, it doesn't look like it's fully covering all 5 of those seedlings and bigger plants will need a lot more. Once you up the lighting you might want to open up that front air intake again to help cool things down.


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## [seriousdesert] (May 16, 2010)

yeah man, i've got another 5 lamps, i just have no means of connecting them at the moment, can't find any lamp fittings which sucks. i'm working on it though


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## v12xjs (May 16, 2010)

Maybe it's worth looking at bigger bulbs. Here's a link with some decent sized cfl's:
http://www.bltdirect.com/products.php?cat=48&nm=Energy+Saving+Spiral+lamp


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## [seriousdesert] (May 16, 2010)

yeah i'm aiming to get bigger and better, it's just i have literally no money at the moment :/ broke my leg and missed out on two months of work so far.

At the moment i have 4 18 watt ( 100 watt eqv.) and two 11 watt (60 watt eqv.) but as i say, i need some roses to actually power them.

Do you have a CO2 generator in your build/are they worth it?


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## v12xjs (May 16, 2010)

Hope you get things sorted out soon serious.
There's no point using CO2 in my grow. I need the fans on constantly when the lights go on so it would just get blown straight out. CO2 really needs the exhaust to be turned off to get the levels up.

Just looked in on the girls so I got a couple of pics. Trinity is finally showing some red pistils but the trichs are still a way off yet, she's at day 63 today. That main cola on Monica is showing real promise though and she's already starting to change colour. 
I need to make a decision on the smaller 2 though, the baby needs repotting urgently and there just isn't any room because Dusty and Trinity have taken so long. Not sure if I should pull the baby and put a NL in her place to keep my momentum going, or sling the other plant outside to reveg. I should be ok to plant outdoors from Tuesday but I'm not sure I want to keep this line going. I guess I'll work it out on Tuesday.


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## GFOYLE (May 17, 2010)

your progress is inspiring, and your input is very helpful. 
Thank you


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## v12xjs (May 17, 2010)

You are most kind GF.


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## floridasucks (May 17, 2010)

those girls are lookin juicy.


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## v12xjs (May 18, 2010)

Thanks fs. Link me to those Qwerkle pics when you get them.
All is not rosy in the garden today though. Check this:

It looks like I've got some new residents in my grow. I watered last night and as usual I collected the runoff for disposal but I noticed something on the top of the water that I wanted to check out properly this morning. Now I've had a good look it seems I'm just about to be overrun by the dreaded thrips 
Here's a pic of what I saw on the surface of the water and a closeup of the little bastards enjoying a swim:

  

I'm very careful when it comes to the grow environment. I don't even wear any clothes when I check on my girls, so the only outside element that could have brought them in is the coco or the root riot and I've already ruled out the root riot. There's a possibility that they were already in the coco when I bought it and they have been dormant over the winter, or maybe they jumped aboard the big bag while I had it open to take some out while I repotted 1 of the plants. Either way I'm convinced that's where they came from.
I just put the jug in the microwave for a minute and that's killed these little buggers off but I've got at least 1 pot in the grow that must be full of them.
Plan of attack then is to decant 2 litres of coco from the big bag each time I need it and to pop that in the micro for 5 minutes before use. I will also get hold of some Genius neem oil tonight or tomorrow and water with that until I'm clear. Fingers crossed I can sort this shit out before it takes a real toll.
Wish me luck.


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## gumball (May 18, 2010)

That sucks v12. I hope you get it worked out, it would definitely put a wrench in the mix


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## maturesmoker (May 18, 2010)

Sorry to read of those pests V12, but only consolation is they are easier to rid yourself of than mites! Must have been in the coco? ..... thats hard to take when you are so careful. I wonder if an organic spray like SMC could work on them, or neem?

Plants look great though  

I owe you a PM, I'll get back to you later tonight.


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## v12xjs (May 18, 2010)

Cheers guys. I'm feeling a bit more philosophical now than I was this morning. I'm off out for some neem oil in a few minutes so hopefully I can keep things under control.
TBH I should consider myself very lucky. I saw 2 thrips infestations last year and I couldn't actually see them because my eyesight isn't what it once was, all I could see was the carnage they were causing to the plants. If I hadn't have spotted these in the runoff I'd never have noticed them until it was too late.

Just a funny tale about killing stuff. I'm 1 of those 'spiritual but not religious' types and I have a Buddhist friend who lives in a place where bloodsucking midges are a plague. I asked him how a Buddhist dealt with them. His reply was that he always wished them a happy rebirth and then he splattered them just like everybody else 

Enough with the light hearted banter. I'm off to slaughter something!


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## [seriousdesert] (May 18, 2010)

good luck dude, keep us posted


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## gumball (May 18, 2010)

The buddhist friends comments was hysterical! Best of luck, but I'm sure your experience will cover up for any luck you lack!


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## Phase420 (May 18, 2010)

No Bueno there V12 sorry to see and hear!


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## floridasucks (May 18, 2010)

dam bro those bugs look nasty. hope u get that fixed soon. 

querkle pics as soon as my boy gets me some. did i tell u i donated her to my friend to put in his "multi animal grow op".


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## v12xjs (May 19, 2010)

Cheers for all the positive comments guys, they really helped lift my spirits.

Holy Moly fs, I NEED to see pics of that grow. It sounds beautiful and so frightening at the same time 

I'll see how the plants are doing in an hour or so, but the thrips got a mild ass kicking last night. I drowned the plants in neem and checked the runoff again. There were only a few this time and they were all dead.
I'm still gonna have to deal with eggs though and anything that was in the foliage. The neem is organic and it's supposed to be cool to use but I'm not spraying with 3 plants in flower, Trinity is at day 65 today FFS! 
Been mulling my options all day but I think I have a plan. I'm gonna get an air duster / compressed air can from Maplins. I figure if I coat the bottom half of the case with neem and keep the coco wet with it then I can blast the compressed air and blow the little sods to their doom.....Wishing them a happy rebirth 1st obviously 

Speaking of Trinity, I'm gonna nip a bud off her tonight but she's still not ready so I'll leave the 2 bigger colas as long as I dare. No more than 70 days though or I'll lose the baby plant, she's pretty stunted as it is.


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## [seriousdesert] (May 20, 2010)

v12, there's some green kinda mould stuff growing on the surface of my soil, looks kind of mossy... any ideas? only noticed it today, figured you'd have a good idea. Cheers dude


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## v12xjs (May 20, 2010)

hey serious, good to hear you started your grow. 
I think you've called it right with moss although it may be a bit of algae, nothing to worry about though. The warm shade under the leaves combined with the damp soil is a perfect environment for mosses to grow. Personally I'd just gently scrape it away and water a little less so the top layer isn't always moist.
Good luck with the grow.


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## [seriousdesert] (May 20, 2010)

yeah, i scraped it off, replaced it with some new soil and am now gonna raise the pots up on some advice from another thread. 

thanks


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## floridasucks (May 21, 2010)

well as of now its not the kind of grow ur thinking of. i meant a multi animal environment. like frog, lizards, turtles, snakes, spiders, ect.. just regular plants in there now but he was thinking of maybe doing some MJ in there as well.

he had a bunch of pics but this is the only one he could find right now...


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## [seriousdesert] (May 21, 2010)

usually i don't mind spiders...but fuck me.


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## floridasucks (May 21, 2010)

hehehe shes quite nice actually.


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## Copycat (May 21, 2010)

Nice plants. PC looks cool


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## [seriousdesert] (May 22, 2010)

is she one of the non-venomous/de-venomised ones you can like pick up and hold?


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## v12xjs (May 22, 2010)

Wicked fs, thanks. She looks gorgeous. I guess it's good all those killer animals aren't in a MJ grow, you'd be too scared to harvest!

Greets copycat and thanks for the nice comment.

Got no update pics today but there's no telltale white spots on the leaves so far, so the bugs seem to be in check. Still no real sign of amber on Trinity though and she's at day 68 now. She's not looking great either as she's had no food for more than 21 days. I'll try and post some pics tonight after the lights come on.


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## gumball (May 22, 2010)

you still harvesting on day 70 irregardless of amber? how was your sample bud, did you get to try it yet?


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## v12xjs (May 24, 2010)

Hey gumball. Sorry to take so long replying mate.
I tried the 65 day cola from Trinity and it's still another daytime thing, it's also a totally different pheno to Dusty as there is no hint of kush flavour, just tastes like fresh charas.
I haven't had any time to chop so I've revised my plan a little. I've killed off the baby and left the 2 big girls along with the next oldest. It looks like the 2 big plants are at the same stage and they'll prolly come down together in a couple of weeks which will give me some space so hopefully I can get something worthwhile from the other plant. I've ordered some new seeds so I'm kind of relying on these plants to get me through 11 or 12 weeks until the new seeds pay out. I'm not hopefull 

Here's the latest family pic. Trinity hasn't been fed for a month so forgive her tawdry appearance but check out that main cola front right of the pic. It's gonna put my red bull can to shame


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## [seriousdesert] (May 24, 2010)

they look pretty tasty man, i envy you. how do you keep them so short?


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## gumball (May 24, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Hey gumball. Sorry to take so long replying mate.
> I tried the 65 day cola from Trinity and it's still another daytime thing, it's also a totally different pheno to Dusty as there is no hint of kush flavour, just tastes like fresh charas.
> I haven't had any time to chop so I've revised my plan a little. I've killed off the baby and left the 2 big girls along with the next oldest. It looks like the 2 big plants are at the same stage and they'll prolly come down together in a couple of weeks which will give me some space so hopefully I can get something worthwhile from the other plant. I've ordered some new seeds so I'm kind of relying on these plants to get me through 11 or 12 weeks until the new seeds pay out. I'm not hopefull
> 
> Here's the latest family pic. Trinity hasn't been fed for a month so forgive her tawdry appearance but check out that main cola front right of the pic. It's gonna put my red bull can to shame


no problem on the wait. sorry to hear your hitting so many bumps in the road with your bug issues, and strains not giving you a good high or finishing on time, then you having to kill one for the better of the group, sounded like a hard decision to make.

they are looking real good, nice family pic! what next on your list of strains? you gonna try any more kush seeds right away, or try and wait to recover your grow cycle a little?


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## v12xjs (May 25, 2010)

Hey serious, the combination of small pots, LST and 12/12 seems to keep them compact.

Greets gumball.
I'm a bit of a drama queen I suppose. Things are not to my satisfaction right now but when I look at the plants I shouldn't really complain. The bud is ok after a bottle of red 
I really need to drop back into a simple effective routine like you say, so the postman brought me 2xNL and 1xPurple Haze this morning. I'll put a NL outside straight away for some summer cuttings and the other 2 will go into the case as soon as there's room. Hopefully the haze will be a keeper and I can put her out for reveg and a few cuttings when she's done.


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## floridasucks (May 25, 2010)

wow doing haze in a pc. u dont think it will strech out and go crazy?


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## v12xjs (May 25, 2010)

It's nearly all indica fs. They just added a bit of the haze genetics into the NL I also bought to give some sativa buzz and the classic taste.
I'm stupid but I'm not crazy


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## floridasucks (May 25, 2010)

true, ill be watchin the progress.


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## v12xjs (May 25, 2010)

Good to hear that m8.


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## Phase420 (May 25, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Thanks fs. Link me to those Qwerkle pics when you get them.
> All is not rosy in the garden today though. Check this:
> 
> It looks like I've got some new residents in my grow. I watered last night and as usual I collected the runoff for disposal but I noticed something on the top of the water that I wanted to check out properly this morning. Now I've had a good look it seems I'm just about to be overrun by the dreaded thrips
> ...


So i just found out, I have the same problem that you have with these little maggot looking things!!! i dont know what they are but im worried now. I want to take her another week or so longer... you think that i would be cool? did you chop?


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## v12xjs (May 26, 2010)

Hey Phase, sorry to hear your news.
Not sure what stage they are at in your grow but these bugs can devastate small plants in just a few weeks so be very careful. Neem oil kills them on contact, is available from hydro stores or online and should only be $20 or so. I highly recommend it.
Best advice I could give you is to look at all the leaves. You are looking for white dots where all the chlorophyll has been sucked out as they feed. If there's plenty of spots then you have a lot of bugs and you'll need to take action. If not then maybe you have a week. From memory these things lay eggs every 14 days so they multiply like wildfire.
Good luck.


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## maturesmoker (May 27, 2010)

Wow, those buds are looking really good V12. Sorry to read you had to make a sacrifice to the Ganja Gods but hopefully they will reward you with a heavy harvest  its certainly looking that way.

New strains sound good too, who are they by? I'm also looking for something new to add in.


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## [seriousdesert] (May 27, 2010)

guys, anyone with case grows, i get like water drops on my leaves sometimes. is that just condensation from the leaves? or is it a bad thing?


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## v12xjs (May 27, 2010)

These are white label seeds ms. The NL is a known quantity but I'm taking a flyer on the haze and just hoping it does what it says.
That single cola plant is looking very promising. The main bud is already bigger than my red bull can and she looks as if she's going to be ready on time in 55-60 days. There's still 2 weeks growing to come so she might be a keeper pheno after all.

Hey serious, they do tend to do that where leaves are packed in tight and touching each other. It seems the leaves give out moisture when the air around them is a bit too dry. It's nothing to worry about and the leaves should naturally find their own space as the plant grows. Might be worth putting a cup of water in there though just to raise the humidity a bit.


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## [seriousdesert] (May 27, 2010)

sounds like good news dude 

ahhh i see. ok man, thanks


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## jakkaru (May 29, 2010)

[seriousdesert]
I get the exact same thing in my pc grow.
i was wondering what it was too, but kept forgetting to ask.
so thanks for asking.


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## [seriousdesert] (May 30, 2010)

no worries jak. 

v12, how's it all going? all straightened out yet?


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## v12xjs (May 30, 2010)

Hey serious.
A new NL has just gone in and I cut down the last cola of Trinity tonight so things are starting to get back on track.
Those bugs are beating a retreat as well. I have them pinned down in Monica's pot. It isn't good news for Monica but I should have them eradicated in a few days and I can give her a decent feed.
I'll be repotting the unamed VK into a full sized pot in the morning so I'll grab some pics.


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## [seriousdesert] (May 31, 2010)

sounds good dude


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## CHIEF PUFF PUFF (May 31, 2010)

*Hey what's up V12xjs? I had to call on the Growing in a PC King. My Baby (sex is undetermined) is 26 days into vegging and the lights (3-6500k & 1-2700k)in the pc case fell on her. Here's some pics of Baby:

* View attachment 968321View attachment 968322View attachment 968324View attachment 968327View attachment 968328View attachment 968329

*pic 1--Baby before the burn
pic 2--Front of Baby was damaged
pic 3--top of Baby has a little burn
pic 4 & 5--Closer looks at the damage area
pic 6--Back of Baby looks good 

Will I be able to keep growing Baby? After Baby recovers from the shock, would you top her? I know you are into lst, is it too late to start that with Baby? Here is a pic of the pc case it's 26.5'h x 18.6D x 8.1w. Baby is 6.5' tall.

*


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## v12xjs (Jun 1, 2010)

Thanks CHIEF.
The damage to Baby doesn't look too bad, I've burned my plants much worse in the past. If I was going to top her I'd be tempted to do it now. She looks like she'll be fine either way though.
The reason I prefer LST to topping is simply that topping will stop growth for up to a week each time you do it, but the plants continue to grow normally with LST. Generally that means my plants finish a week or 2 faster than topped plants would.
That's a sweet looking case you have there. Might be worth putting something reflective above the lights though as up to half the light is going upwards and away from the plants.
Got my fingers crossed for her.


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## crazytrain14 (Jun 1, 2010)

looks dude good. sorry V don't mean to jack your thread here, but i had to ask what the air pump was for in your case chief? i like the case, very tall. good luck man.


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## CHIEF PUFF PUFF (Jun 1, 2010)

Hey CT, I can grow using soil or hydroponics? I've tried growing using DWC and f***ed it up every time.

*Thanks V12jxs for the words of encouragement. I will try topping her soon. I wanted to try LST but I'm nervous I will mess Baby up.


*


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## v12xjs (Jun 4, 2010)

Good spot ct, I missed the pump. 
Your experience and observations are always welcome here.

NP CHIEF. Don't forget you can kill them with tlc. Sometimes the ladies like a little aggression you know 

I've got to say WOW. There's been Over 50,000 views of this thread!
I do hope that's not mostly police activity  

Sorry for the lack of updates.
Case is looking a bit sorry for itself atm. Plants are undernourished and over neem'd, I've even been foliar spraying to keep the bugs in check so there's some leaf burning going on as well. Bugs look like they are in decline though so I'm feeling a bit happier.

I mailed Barney's Farm a few days ago to express my disappointment with their product, nothing rude or offensive, it wouldn't get through otherwise. I just pointed out that they are easy to grow but take much longer to flower than indicated and produce pretty low potency bud. 
I've not had any response so I assume I was pointing out something they already knew and not contradicting other customer feedback. I think their lack of acknowledgement speaks volumes. I wouldn't presume to tell anybody else what they should and shouldn't buy, but unless I specifically want zero customer service combined with wildly inaccurate strain info and sub standard bud it's fair to say I won't be going back for more.
Here's a couple of pics from this morning:


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## crazytrain14 (Jun 4, 2010)

lookin good man. whats your largest yield on a single plant in the case? 

peace


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## v12xjs (Jun 4, 2010)

I've never had more than an oz in a single crop, but I use frequency of harvest to max things so I only harvest 1/3 of 1sq ft at a time.

With this light I can get 7g buds np but they are the size of those red bull cans. I reckon somewhere around 9 or 10 of those buds is the max I could do using the whole case so 2.5 oz as a total harvest, maybe 3 with careful pruning to max out the popcorn.


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## gumball (Jun 4, 2010)

still looking good all in all v12. i am sure you may feel a little tighter in your tin, but at least you will pull some through, and still not miss a beat, or much of one at least!!


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## v12xjs (Jun 4, 2010)

Mustn't grumble really eh gum?
I have some charas on order as backup though, squidgy black to UK tokers. It's better safe than sorry


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## ghettofabulous (Jun 5, 2010)

Wow, I really just read this entire thread from beginning to end in 2 sittings. I laughed, I cried, I cheered, I sat in suspense, I cursed the villains, and I cheered again. I feel like I watched your cases grow up into sophisticated adults, through thick and thin.

Thanks so much to v12 and everyone who contributed (except tom, he is kind of a twat), I would have needed 5 builds to sort through all of the possible combinations and lord knows what the end result would have been. Not to mention the education on light types and practical usage.

I have my case gutted and will rely on my Wordpad file of about 80 copy/pastes from my read through here. One thing I can say for sure, Firefox will lock up a Dell Inspiron 4150 after you have 74 tabs open in one window (Thanks to v12's porn).

I do have two questions, is your recycled mylar the inside of actual potato chip bags? As in a grocery store purchased bag? I was thinking you meant the little bags you get from those shady carts with the lady with teeth broken off at the gum line. I am not sure if you ever clarified within the thead. The other question is for anyone in the US, as this group seems the most helpful in all of the threads I've perused. Is ordering seeds a really shady venture? I'm a bit hesitant to search any out locally, as I'd rather keep my projects to myself. So I am limited to a few seeds I've collected over time, but would much rather maximize my efforts. Any info and advice would be appreciated. Feel free to PM me if that suits you, as well.

Thanks to all.

Since that is my only question after 1025 posts, I'd say you're all pretty fine teachers.


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## gumball (Jun 5, 2010)

ghettofabulous said:


> Wow, I really just read this entire thread from beginning to end in 2 sittings. I laughed, I cried, I cheered, I sat in suspense, I cursed the villains, and I cheered again. I feel like I watched your cases grow up into sophisticated adults, through thick and thin.
> 
> Thanks so much to v12 and everyone who contributed (except tom, he is kind of a twat), I would have needed 5 builds to sort through all of the possible combinations and lord knows what the end result would have been. Not to mention the education on light types and practical usage.
> 
> ...


i have heard not. just pick up a pre-paid visa gift card that can be used internationaly, and order what you want. most threads i have read concerning customs stated that a letter was mailed to the recipient telling them that the package was confiscated for contriband. something like that. i know the paranoia, thats partly why i havent done it.


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## [seriousdesert] (Jun 6, 2010)

ghetto, i'm from the UK so it might be different but when i ordered a couple of seeds the company http://www.everyonedoesit.com they went as far as concealing the seed container behind a label. so unless customs are specifically looking for the seeds it should be fine. Plus, i'm sure possession of seeds is legal, just the growing that isn't right?


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## maturesmoker (Jun 6, 2010)

Mighty fine looking buds there V12, the Flora tub in there gives a good idea of the size of those things! Any reply yet from Barneys Farm? Sad after all that dedication and skill to be disappointed with the result. Liking the sound of a bit of charas though  I love the earthiness of that stuff, its funny as I read that I could almost smell it again and its been a few years now! Enjoy mate.

*Edit* seeds are legal to sell/purchase in the Uk but not in the US. But read around here and you will find plenty of experienced US growers ordering seeds safely and reliably. Most UK seed sellers will not post to US for obvious reasons but some do.


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## [seriousdesert] (Jun 6, 2010)

oh right, fair enough, cheers maturesmoker


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## leorfts (Jun 6, 2010)

So, are you planting clones now? 12/12?


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## ghettofabulous (Jun 6, 2010)

My fledgling attempt, much of which is v12xjs's methods in the first case.

All are welcome as I stammer along 

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/337469-pc-case-grow-stealth-perpetual.html


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## [seriousdesert] (Jun 6, 2010)

v12 man, approximately how long does it take for a plant to be harvested if you 12/12 it from seed?


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## CHIEF PUFF PUFF (Jun 6, 2010)

*What's up V12xjs? I just topped Sassy and Baby, what do you think? Also I put some sun visor reflector at the top of my pc case.
*View attachment 978881View attachment 978882* 
pic 1: Baby
pic 2: Sassy

*


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## v12xjs (Jun 6, 2010)

Welcome ghetto and thank you.
I really appreciate you taking the time to post. You must be an avid reader to finish off such an epic in 2 days! 
It's hard to believe a pissant pc grow journal can crash the mighty Firefox. Makes me truly proud 
They really are just potato chip packets on the walls. The outer sleeve on the multipacks are also mylar and they are the perfect size for a case. Dare I say they are as cheap as chips too 
Love your avatar btw.

Greets ms. 
The black is gold seal and everything you remember. Wish I could have afforded a couple of o's. 
That's why we smoke different spliffs to our American friends. Hash and charas were my only choices for decades, apart from the odd batch of weed or oil. Same for you I'm sure. Hot knives were the only way to avoid tobacco really, remember them?
Got nothing back from Barneys and I don't expect anything tbh. 
We live and learn. 

Hey there leorfts. I'm not there just yet, but the 1st mother has been planted. I should be seeing the 1st cutting in about 5 weeks. I learned a lot with last year's trial so I should do ok this time round.


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## v12xjs (Jun 6, 2010)

Hey serious.
Timetable for a seed under 12/12 goes like this:
23-26 days to show sex or thereabouts.
14 days to preflower, maybe a little less.
45 days+ Flowering, but that's a really big +! 
20+ weeks for malani apparently 

Hey CHIEF.
Pic 2 is the best use of topping and LST I've seen. Looks perfect to me. Can't wait to see how that plant grows.


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## CHIEF PUFF PUFF (Jun 12, 2010)

*What's up V12xjs? It's been awhile and I have an update of Baby and Sassy since the topping and lst. 

Here's Baby as of today (day 38 vegging)

*


*Now here is Sassy as of June 10th(day 15 vegging)!

*

*When would you start flowering considering I'm going in a pc 18.6" D and 8.1"W*?
*
*


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## v12xjs (Jun 13, 2010)

Hey CHIEF.
Girls are looking hot. TBH I don't see you being able to finish Sassy off in the case, I think she is gonna get very big. Once you switch to 12/12 the plants will grow much faster than they are doing now for at least a couple of weeks, and she is already at the size you want her to be after most of the stretching is over. Maybe consider a different future for her.
Baby looks great and I'd be switching her now as she will also do the stretch thing, but your sterling efforts early on should mean she will fill out beautifully. In the 1st pic it looked like maybe a little nute burn starting in the leftmost bud. Just keep an eye on it and consider flushing and lowering the nute levels a bit if it seems to get any worse.
Very impressive grow overall though CHIEF, just keep doing what you're doing.


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## floridasucks (Jun 13, 2010)

hey v how the girls lookin? got any pics?


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## v12xjs (Jun 13, 2010)

Hey fs. Been busy catching up on here so I didn't check the cam for recent pics.
I'm just sharpening the scissors for a harvest tonight though, and I took a pic of the charas, so just to tease you US guys:

Charas is gathered by rubbing the trichs from the leaves and then rubbing the hands together to produce small balls of black that easily join together to make proper naughty smoke. The great Books of Hashish by Lawrence Cherniak show pics of the whole process. Get your mits on that book if you can, you will cream your pants every time you turn a page 

When I was about 13 my gf got me some indian charas with white streaks in it that were the flowers of Datura Stramonium. It was fearsome, easily more hallicinogenic than a 300microgram trip. It hit UK streets a few years later, maybe 1980 or 81 and it was sold as opiated Nepalese. A legend and one of my top 10 smokes ever.
This gold seal is nice but sadly not in the same league.

I'll go harvest this plant and post a few pics.

I never asked why you gave Qwerkle away. Hope things are good with you fs.


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## CHIEF PUFF PUFF (Jun 13, 2010)

What's up V12xjs, *Thanks for the words of encouragement and the help*. I plan to flower Baby starting today June 13, she will be given 26hrs of NO LIGHTS from 5:00pm today to 7:00pm Monday, then 12/12(she will sleep during the day and flower @ night). I plan to veg Sassy for a month more which will be a month of flowering for Baby, then I will start Sassy to flowering (here where the LST and Topping training comes into play . Hopefully(fingers cross) when Sassy outgrows her pc box, Baby will be done (8-9 weeks) of flowering! I plan for the clones (I topped Baby and Sassy a week ago) to be growing roots for a month (this might be my problem)

I forgot that with ocean forest soil, your plants don't need nutes for a month. I gave them both nutes which would account for the yellowing of the leaves.. I will flush them both and just give them plain pH water for the next week or two. *Thanks *for the help I really appreciate it because I know you are busy with your own grow and several threads you keep up. I will post an update a week from today.


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## v12xjs (Jun 14, 2010)

Here's the pics I promised.
Monica looked pretty well ready when she was cut at 60 odd days so I've left all the bottom popcorn and popped her outside for a reveg, you never know. Here's the old red bull comparison chart of what was chopped. It needs a 2nd trim but I'll do that when I have a bit more time.
2nd pick is a bit of that gold seal black. Yummy 
Last pic is purple haze outdoors in anticipation of a summer of cuttings.


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## maturesmoker (Jun 15, 2010)

Another whopper of a bud from that case of yours V12! Looks great. The Gold Seal looks just as I remember it. Yumm, I can almost smell it from here 

Will you let the Haze flower outdoors or just take cuttings from her? No reason why Monica wont reveg, its the perfect time of year for an outdoor reveg here.


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## floridasucks (Jun 15, 2010)

very nice v!


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## gumball (Jun 15, 2010)

Once again another successful harvest, great work!! I see you got the better of them bugs after all!


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## tamjam69 (Jun 15, 2010)

well done v12 lovely looking buds there  i can just picture a snowwhite in that case


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## [seriousdesert] (Jun 15, 2010)

v12, any good ideas as to how i can stop light from entering or escaping through my fans whilst maintaining a good airflow? bearing in mind i have very limited space


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## gumball (Jun 15, 2010)

[seriousdesert];4286518 said:


> v12, any good ideas as to how i can stop light from entering or escaping through my fans whilst maintaining a good airflow? bearing in mind i have very limited space


U can get some of the carbon filter pads and cover your fans. They are sold as big pieces you cut to fit as replacment filters for air filters.


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## [seriousdesert] (Jun 15, 2010)

mmmm, didn't know you could get those  any idea how long they last? seems like a much better idea than a fat home made carbon filter


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## gumball (Jun 15, 2010)

[seriousdesert];4286985 said:


> mmmm, didn't know you could get those  any idea how long they last? seems like a much better idea than a fat home made carbon filter


check out this http://www.lowes.com/pl_Heating+&+Cooling_4294934542__s?Ntt=carbon&Ntk=i_products and this http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xnu/R-202182987/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053 and this http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xnu/R-100674272/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053 and this http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xnu/R-100063845/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053 and I am sure there are more elsewhere. If you are in UK or elsewhere without lowes and homedepot, just look for replacement filters for air purifiers or composters, even sometimes microwave filters for the ones with fans. just look for carbon. they work pretty well. 

Sorry for posting up your thread v12, figured i would help one of your visitors while you were tending the garden. 

i have been meaning to ask you, do you have one? a v12 xjs? took me forever for it to dawn on me, if I am even right. i think of myself as absentminded, guess this may prove me right.


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## crazytrain14 (Jul 1, 2010)

yo v

whats happened dude

just thought i'd show ya how the new box set up is workin. day52 of life and day 35 of flower. had to use bushmaster and some lst. she snuck up on me. just a reggs bagseed. hows your case going? havent seen a post on this thread in a few days.

peace,
ct


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## ThatPotHead (Jul 6, 2010)

haha i got a baby red kneeView attachment 1030423


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## gumball (Jul 6, 2010)

your picture dont work!

hey v12, how you been? hope everything is going well for you on your side of the pond, its blazing HOT here!! had to move into a PC to keep going, but i am ok with it. hope to see ya soon!


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## tamjam69 (Jul 9, 2010)

where you to v12? hope everything's ok.

I think he may be moving house people, im sure he cant stay away from RIU for much longer


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## gumball (Jul 9, 2010)

tamjam69 said:


> where you to v12? hope everything's ok.
> 
> I think he may be moving house people, im sure he cant stay away from RIU for much longer


I hope that's what it is. Kinda worried a little as he normally checks in a little more often.


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## v12xjs (Jul 10, 2010)

Greets guys. Sorry for the enforced absence, I've been bashing the books and sitting exams. I figured I needed to steer clear of this place while I did it because it's too easy to get engrossed in threads and conversations here that would have sapped all my time.
Humble apologies to anybody who was expecting a reply to a post or pm, I meant no disrespect. I'll catch up in the next day or 2.
Afraid the wheels fell off the grow while I was away too. The fem seeds turned out to be boys so there's nothing in the case at all just now 
I doubt that will last for long though


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## gumball (Jul 10, 2010)

Just glad to see your doing alright!


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## v12xjs (Jul 12, 2010)

Cheers gum. 
Was greeted with a couple of little sprouts this morning so I'm back in the game


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## maturesmoker (Jul 12, 2010)

Good to see you back v12


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## gumball (Jul 12, 2010)

never counted u out! Did u do well on your exams?


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## v12xjs (Jul 12, 2010)

Cheers guys.
I did my best in the exams but going back to school after a 30 year break is a bit of a challenge!
Results are in August and retests are in December if necessary


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## tamjam69 (Jul 12, 2010)

Welcome back v12 Nice to see you again, time to get your hands dirty mate.
I don't think I could ever stay away from RIU for a month lol 1 day is long enough for me


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## v12xjs (Jul 13, 2010)

Hey & thanks tamjam.
It wasn't easy mate, it's such a pleasure to read grow journals. 
The stuff I was reading made me crosseyed and bored me half to death!
Great to see you are still around tbh. Having had yet another batch of males bagged up and priced as fems I'm getting seriously ticked off with breeders & seedbanks and their total lack of interest when things go wrong. I think your little postal trick has taught us all the way forward and I'm frantically working on a way to run a clone op alongside my little grow, so big time props for that.

Just a general note on this thread, I'm thinking it's time I stopped updating in here and began a new journal. It seems hypocritical to continue a perpetual thread when the perpetual grow has ended 
I'll still be hanging around though and I've got some funky ideas for a new journal. I fancy getting a clone room going, possibly using a beer can with LED's and I also want to try out a recipe for hooch that costs peanuts and is ready to drink in a week! I figure I'm not the only person interested in trying that out. It generates lots of free CO2 as well so it may be a treat for both me and the plants 
The little seedling is coming along nicely so I'll post up a link to the new thread when I've got the bits I need to get started.


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## gumball (Jul 13, 2010)

Sounds cool


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## v12xjs (Jul 13, 2010)

I figure most of us like a drink so what the hell.


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## tamjam69 (Jul 13, 2010)

micro flowering box, micro cloning chamber micro all the way!!! you'll master that as well and probably manage rooting 10 clones in there lol sounds very intresting and cant wait to see it

And i want recipes kiss-ass


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## tamjam69 (Jul 13, 2010)

I just googled hooch recipes and that sounds very simple gonna go get the ingredients on Thursday!! Does it get stronger if left more than a week?


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## tamjam69 (Jul 13, 2010)

lmfao!! check this stuff out, its called pruno 

http://www.blacktable.com/gillin030901.htm


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## v12xjs (Jul 14, 2010)

You've been busy there tamjam 
That Pruno sounds dreadful!

You'll have to wait till I start up for the specifics but there's be plenty of crazy projects in the pipeline. Most are just random ideas and inspirations that will need refining for my preferences as I go, but hopefully they will all taste better than that tomato sauce gunk! Yuck!
The quickbrew recipe you came across will get stronger with time but only up to a point. Yeast eats sugar, burps CO2 and craps alcohol, but once the alcohol level reaches a certain point it becomes toxic to the yeast. As long as there is still a release of CO2 from the process it will continue to get stronger. 

Some forms of yeast have a higher tolerance to it than others and some are unaffected by alcohol produced from different yeast types, so they can be doubled up. My scrumpy recipe uses raisins and apples for 1 sugar/yeast reaction and brewers yeast/white sugar for another at the same time. It makes for a very potent drink 
I prolly need to look into it a bit more but I think the max is around 20% alcohol from fermentation. Some members of my family brew poteen which they distill from a 20% mash, I'll try to find out what combinations of yeasts and sugars they use for the mash to get such high alcohol concentrations.


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## maturesmoker (Jul 15, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> ...... Having had yet another batch of males bagged up and priced as fems I'm getting seriously ticked off with breeders & seedbanks and their total lack of interest when things go wrong. I think your little postal trick has taught us all the way forward and I'm frantically working on a way to run a clone op alongside my little grow, so big time props for that.


Hi V12,

I'd say that clones are defo the way to go so long as a little time can be given to allow them to establish. Its pointless flowering a week rooted cone for example, compared to a week vegged seedplant which will still produce a reasonable yield. I find clones *once rooted* (10 to 14days average) still require about 2 weeks longer before being ready to flower. My small clone box has just 50watts of mixed CFL's but its enough to grow them on a bit to get them ready, that is all thats needed in my experience. I started my clone box in a drawer, pull it out and hey presto! 

I currently have 2 seedplants and 2 clones side by side in my little veg box, the clones rooted at the same time as the seeds germinated and I'm waiting to see which I can flower first, my guess is that the seedplants will be more ready than the clones despite the fact at the moment the clones are bigger. But of course like you say with seeds you never quite know what you are going to get, and unlike feminised seeds I have never known a clone to hermie and of course you know exactly the quality of the plant you will get from the mother. Downside with clones is that you have to have patience in waiting for them to root in the first place  I have learned to put them in the back of the box and just forget about them for the first week!

Anyway, I'm interested to see what you do, and I just know that whatever it is its going to be inventive and challenging


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## v12xjs (Jul 15, 2010)

Hey ms.

That's a perfect summary of the pro's & cons of seeds v cuttings. Sounds like you have it all dialled in now. 

My thoughts after the batch of males was to move towards a cloning op but obviously I need a separate environment as the case is permanent 12/12 and as you say, I will also need to somehow improve cutting growth rates so I've been considering some kind of CO2 enrichment.
Once I started looking at CO2 I had to laugh because in every case people are producing it with yeast and sugar but they are throwing away the mucky residue after the reaction slows down. It struck me that what they are throwing away is neat alcohol!
OMG what a waste 

The start point for my CO2 production then is to turn it on its head, so I'll be making booze and then harvesting the gas produced by fermentation. Sneaky eh?
I don't know if it will work out, but the plan is to put a LED downlight into a beer can and fill it each morning with harvested CO2. With any luck it will promote much faster growth rates in the clones.

If it doesn't work out on the CO2 then as long as I can keep a clone inside the can under LED for 4 weeks, they should be ready to go into the case anyway. That would only require a 4 pack of empty beer cans to run a full clone op.


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## gumball (Jul 15, 2010)

Hey v12! 
i was on and seen something you had to see, a DWC cola can!!! i thought this may give you some inspiration on your next move. i can pm you a link where all the pics are at if you want to see more. hope its of use to you.


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## maturesmoker (Jul 16, 2010)

V12, were those 'fem' seeds that turned out to be males from P&M? if so did they offer to replace them or give any explanation? That's bad because by the time you find out all grow schedules go out the window. I'd be justifiably very angry about that.

Looking forward, I am visualising already the *4 pack veg box*  I'm trying to get my head round HOW but I know you will work it out! I guess there are so many ways to disguise a small grow op if you really let the imagination run wild, kitchen cupboards, drawer units, desks etc. Going through the garage the other day I found one of those little 'mini fridge' things you know? I thought, "that would make a good little clone box!"

I'm also interested in home made booze  my father in law made beer for more years than I can remember, not from the kits but hops and barley etc, used to stink out the whole house for hours when he used to boil them all up but I loved it! I love that deep 'hoppy' taste in real ale. His stuff always tasted very slightly 'yeasty' to me but man was it powerful stuff, deep colouring and a taste that was close to some of those fine Belgian Trapist 'double' and 'triple' ales. I wish he was still here to produce more of that stuff  You will have to post a few recipes etc when the time comes V12.


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## v12xjs (Jul 17, 2010)

Wow that DWC can is amazing gum. Hydro is awesome for growth but I find it a little counter productive as the plants just get too big for my little rig. I'm determined to try the hempy style some time soon but I will wait until I have a bit more room before I put the res & pumps back into service.

Hey ms. The seeds were indeed from p&m. I still await a response. Sensi Seeds replied but just told me to speak to p&m so I'll take my business elsewhere. I'm back to DrChronic and I'm trying out some Sagamartha NL#9 as I'm still keen to grow low odour strains where I can. I'll be checking out Chronic after these.
The brews I'm trying are as much about CO2 as alcohol to begin with, so flavour will need to be tweaked as I go but if I get anything really unpalatable I can just stick it in the freezer so the water freezes and I can pour off the neat alcohol which will be much like the poteen I'm used to.
I do like those mini fridges and if I had 1 it would already be in use!


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## v12xjs (Jul 21, 2010)

I'm starting to get things together for the new grow so it shouldn't be long now.
The homebrew rig is producing masses of CO2 so I just need to perfect the delivery method for getting it to the clones and I'll start up the new journal.


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## tamjam69 (Jul 21, 2010)

cant wait for pics! gotta love your inventions


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## gumball (Jul 21, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> I'm starting to get things together for the new grow so it shouldn't be long now.
> The homebrew rig is producing masses of CO2 so I just need to perfect the delivery method for getting it to the clones and I'll start up the new journal.


Just remember, gravity is on your side. Just place it under your brewery.


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## v12xjs (Jul 22, 2010)

Cheers guys.
I'm going with a new plan after pricing up the LED's. I'm just going to gut an old Dell CRT monitor and work inside that. I have 1 on order that should be here tomorrow. I'm not looking forward to gutting it though.
Hey gum, you're spot on as usual. Gravity is my friend indeed


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## kilpox (Jul 26, 2010)

Hi.
When u start a new journal? Do u post link at this journal?


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## v12xjs (Jul 26, 2010)

It's coming soon kilpox, things are shaping up nicely. I'll post a link here when I start it.


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## tamjam69 (Jul 31, 2010)

hey v12, hope you dont mind me ransacking your thread, i couldnt think of a way so you could see some of them and as you are starting a new thread now it wouldnt hurt. just thought i would post up some pics of my old spiders and centipede  at one point i had over 70 arachnids  then just lost interest and sold them all  all i have at the minute is a baby gramastola pulchra ( brazilian black ) that has a 4cm leg span. the pics are small as i lost all the original when my pc went bang!! we are gonna start collecting them again as now im a total stoner again it would be awesome holding them. 

i used to hold the centipede but that one died then i bought a subspinipe specie that was 11.5" long!! and would cause a very very very painful bite that would need a trip to the hospital for some morphine  also the black and white stripie tarantula was also had a very nasty bite that unfortunatly i never experienced lol i have been bitten a few time from other species and some times was very uncomftable

anyway heres quite a few pics for you to see  let me know if you want me to delete them


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## v12xjs (Jul 31, 2010)

Thay are awesome pics tamjam, really appreciate you posting them.
You had 70! Bet there were no flies on you 
That has to be the most incredible shade of blue ever. I'd choose that 1 for my avatar too.


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## tamjam69 (Aug 1, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Thay are awesome pics tamjam, really appreciate you posting them.
> You had 70! Bet there were no flies on you
> That has to be the most incredible shade of blue ever. I'd choose that 1 for my avatar too.


cheers v12 glad you liked them  ha ha nope no flys lol.

the blue one was called charlotte, a haploplelma lividum ( cobalt blue ) get some yourself mate they are so easy to look after

this is where i bought most of them

http://www.thespidershop.co.uk/insect/index.php?cPath=21&osCsid=3424136c171a8bdfee07b829169b116e

you also see alot of private sellers on preloved 

http://www.preloved.co.uk/fuseaction-adverts.listadverts/sec-Home+and+Family/cat-Pets+and+Livestock/fb06fbe8.html


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## v12xjs (Aug 2, 2010)

Thanks tamjam. I'll have a look.
I'm still in shared accomodation and can't keep animals just now but that won't be for much longer hopefully.

I was recently offered a free holiday to New Mexico that I sadly had to turn down due to other commitments. It sounds like an ideal place for you as it's home to a huge population of Black Widows and numerous other big spiders. I was gutted to have to say no


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## kushbluntz420 (Aug 4, 2010)

Hey v12xjs ive been reading alot about your pc grow and have taken alot of pride in your work im starting a pc grow myself but i havent gotten seeds yet im not really sure what to buy i want something with a decent yield and that i could clone got any suggestions?


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## v12xjs (Aug 5, 2010)

Hey kushbluntz.
I'm fast becoming a fan of northern lights for my grows. They are odour free so no need to bother with carbon scrubbers and the growth pattern is ideal for a case grow. I'm using sagamartha seeds atm and I've taken 2 cuttings from the lower branching that are doing very well. Being NL the potency will be a given. Just make sure that any beans you buy are feminised, there's nothing worse than nurturing a plant that turns out male.
Good luck with the grow. There's some great pc setups around just now to pick up pointers. Check out crazytrain, CHIEF PUFF PUFF and gumball's grows for great tips on hydro, LST and case construction.

Here's some pics from my phone taken last night. The main plant is a sagamartha NL#9 at about 32 days and the 2 cuttings on the windowsill were taken on Sunday, just after she showed sex.


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## gumball (Aug 5, 2010)

Nice to see some action in that case v12! Everything is looking. GOOD! I want some NL, some many nice things have been said about it, and I haven't heard a single bad thing


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## 88malice (Aug 5, 2010)

Hey V, just got in to check ya out. Did ya veg or start off 12/12? Just curious. What else have ya grown since i'v been gone? Any suggestions? How about any auto's?


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## kushbluntz420 (Aug 5, 2010)

What kind of nutes do you use?


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## Phase420 (Aug 6, 2010)

glad to see your back with girls in the box! I've got about 3 or 4 little sprouts in mine right now.


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## maturesmoker (Aug 6, 2010)

yep, great to see the case gradually filling up again  Good luck with those 2 cuts V12, just keep em warm as you can and they will root for sure.


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## v12xjs (Aug 6, 2010)

Cheers gum. It's good to have a grow running again. Afraid I'll be taking it to thctalk when I get my camera back this weekend though as there's still no sign of the mods creating anywhere specific for microgrowers on here and I'm a bit sick of waiting. Seems dumb really as we all need a new seed for every plant and the main site sponsor is a seed company trying to increase business, but who am I to question the wisdom of the mod team?
Seems easier just to move somewhere that embraces 12/12 and microgrows.


hey malice, good to see you back.
Since the beginning of the year I've been experimenting with Afghani genetics. They have been a bit of a mixed bag but some of the NL's I grew out were very impressive so I'm going to concentrate on those for now. If I was looking for an auto I'd prolly be checking out Joint Doctor's Diesel Ryder but it would have to be pretty special to displace the NL & Purple Haze I have on the go.
It's still basically 12/12 from seed but I'm going to start working with cuttings in the next few weeks.


Greets kushbluntz. I'm trying out some different nutes atm but the GH Flora Nova stuff has served me well in the past, as has the Canna Terra line. 


Thanks Phase, not seen a grow from you for a bit. Hope you have something in the offing we can all drool over 


Cheers for the advice ms, feels good to be back in the saddle. The 2 new cuttings seem to be doing ok. I was a little worried about them as they are very small and the plant had already shown sex.
I was thinking about cuttings and wondered if you'd read anything on auxins. They are responsible for the upward growth of plants and the main concentration is in the very top shoot. I'm wondering if cuttings lose their vigour after time due to us taking cuttings from low down with reduced levels of auxins and then taking further low cuttings from those. It's just a thought.


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## CHIEF PUFF PUFF (Aug 6, 2010)

*great to see you back on the block your baby looks so healthy, i'm sure the clones will grow as good as their mother.*


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## v12xjs (Aug 8, 2010)

Thanks CHIEF.
There's nothing better than knowing I'm going to be dealer free for another couple of years at least 
Just 61 days now and counting...

Glad you got the privacy thing sorted out.
Sassy es lindo


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## kilpox (Aug 9, 2010)

Hi,V12.
Tell me,when you start to count flowering period? When plant show sex? Or when plant sprout from soil?


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## maturesmoker (Aug 9, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> feels good to be back in the saddle. The 2 new cuttings seem to be doing ok. I was a little worried about them as they are very small and the plant had already shown sex.
> I was thinking about cuttings and wondered if you'd read anything on auxins. They are responsible for the upward growth of plants and the main concentration is in the very top shoot. I'm wondering if cuttings lose their vigour after time due to us taking cuttings from low down with reduced levels of auxins and then taking further low cuttings from those. It's just a thought.


Hi V12,
You could well be right about that, I have always felt that its better to keep dedicated mothers and take cuts from the vigorous tops, but since losing mine I have been taking them the lowest shoots as they are the slowest to show those pre-flowers and often just 2 to 3" tall. But what I have learned from this is that rooting tends to be slower from these small cuttings, however I'd say in 95% of cases they will still root. While some can seem to root cuttings in 10 to 12 days (and this was the case of those initial Snow White cuts that tamjam sent me being big strong cuts with quite thick stems) on average for me with small bottom cuttings its around 3 weeks! I bet this is more common than a lot will admit, main thing is to keep them green and healthy by keeping humidity high. I generally find it best to forget about them for the first week, I don't even uncover them to look, then second week I open them up for a few minutes each day and introduce the spray gun, around every 2nd/3rd day. generally by end of week 2 a very gentle tug will tell you if you have tiny roots or not as they will grip the soil slightly. But I'd still give them 3 weeks before removing the dome/bag and by then the roots should begin to go. of course with dedicated clone/bubbler systems its easier and faster but this basic method is still very reliable. 

I find too many people get to about 12 -14 days and then give up! Its a real shame as just another week or so will see roots. Hows your doing mate? 

I have a new SW seedling on the go, might have to start a new thread myself


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## v12xjs (Aug 9, 2010)

Hey kilpox, the usual pattern for the plants is 25 days to show sex from seed. I give them 2 weeks from then to switch from preflowering into full bloom and then I start the countdown in accordance with what the breeder suggests.

Greets ms, loving the Bez avatar. Good to hear you have the seedling op underway.
My routine for the cuttings is very similar to what you do, same timescales as well. 
I'm going to assume those auxin levels have some influence so I'm thinking I'll top plants to produce the next generation and leave the lower section to grow 4 tops like Uncle Bens Topping technique before putting it in the case to flower.
I'm working on an 8 week period for each cutting to be big enough to provide a new cutting and an established plant with 4 growing tips, so 3 different cuttings should amply cover my needs and provide a little insurance against any future problems.

It's all looking rosy for the cuttings so far but they still don't have a permanent home, I just can't decide what to put them in.


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## gumball (Aug 9, 2010)

sounds cool v12, glad to hear of some good progress your way!!


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## Ludicium (Aug 12, 2010)

Hey v12. I haven't posted here yet but I have been going through your whole thread for the past few days. I think I've read 99% of it in a total of about 8 - 10 hours. 

I must say I am extremely impressed and I will be attempting a very similar grow.

I bought a Full tower server case of off eBay for only $12!! Great deal. The case dimensions are about 21" (H), 12" (L), 6" (W). I've gutted it, and it now looks like this:

(Sorry for the bad quality, it was taken wit my webcam.)













Stealth is very important for my grow, so my plan is to put 2 120mm intake fans on the front bottom section of the case, and 2 120mm outtake fans on the backside upper portion of the case. This is about a total of 160 CFM. 

For lighting I am planning on using CFL's at least for my first grow. I was thinking 4 CFL's on top and a couple on each side. The max ambient temp in my room would be about 80F.. and thats only during the day, at night the ambient temp will be about 70F, and with the fans I believe it wont go over 75 at the most. 

I'll be using the guide you posted earlier on the fans, and Ill be adding fan controllers that you did.  Thanks for the idea.

The strains Ill be growing are NL Feminized Auto flowering. After I read your thread I wish I would have gone with the non auto flowering variety, but since I have already purchased the seeds, Ill just use what I have for my first grow. For the auto flowering do you think I should do a 12/12? Or a 18/6. And since it's auto flowering I know the light spectrum they say doesn't matter, but do you think I should still use a mixture of the 6500k and 2700k throughout the grow?

Oh, by the way Ill be adding a small 80mm fan with about a 40-50 cfm rating to blow across the top CFL's for cooling as well, so Im pretty sure the temps will be fine.

Anyways, so sorry for the long ass post, if you have any suggestions for me and my case construction please tell me. I'll be more than happy to apply them to my case, seeing as how your grow is going great.

oh and nice job with dusty, your achievements are my goals. 

EDIT: Forgot to mention, I plan on using a PSU to power my fans and fan controller, so it will look a lot more like a working computer. What are your thoughts on this? I'll also be trying to make this a perpetual grow as well.

Cheers.


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## v12xjs (Aug 12, 2010)

Hey Lucidium, thanks for reading. Appreciate the nice comments.
Your case looks great and the price was right for sure 

The 12x6 dimensions makes it a little smaller than mine so maybe think about doing 2 or 3 plants rather than 4. I suspect you'll lose too much space with sidelighting as well unless you go with T4/T5 flouro tubes, so measure everything up before you make your final plans.
At 12 inches across you should get a good breeze blowing over the plants so you can prolly dump the internal circulation fan. I find they really mess with the front to back airflow anyway so I don't use them anymore. Also remember that 4 x 120mm fans equates to 64 sq inches of openings that will need lightproofing. If you can find 80mm or 92mm fans with a similar output it will make lightproofing everything a little easier. 

You will be absolutely fine running auto's at 12/12 and I've long wondered why nobody thought to produce an auto NL, glad Nirvana rectified it at last. I'll be very interested to see how they turn out.
As they go directly into flower I'd be using mostly red spectrum from day 1, but a dash of blue in there would be a major benefit. I spent a long time trying to cure leaf yellowing in my plants until I rumbled that they were simply lacking a bit of blue light.

If you go for an internal psu then try to get something at 300w or less as they really do kick out some heat, that's why they often have 2 dedicated fans for cooling. Personally I think it would limit you to 2 bulbs along the top as well and I'd prolly opt to fit a bulb in there instead.

It sounds like you've done all the background work so you'll do well. Link me when you get a grow going.
Best of luck.


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## Ludicium (Aug 12, 2010)

Hey v12, thanks for your reply. I actually have some extra money and decided I will be purchasing a new better more permanent case for this. I recall you posting a link for the Broadway Com Corp R-900 case on Newegg, so I took a look and found the newer version, the R-910 and will be purchasing that for my PC grow case. 
(http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811162054)

My plan now is to put one 120mm fan on the front bottom and one 120mm fan on the back top with a 90CFM rating. The case already has fixtures for them and I can build a couple simple light traps for light proofing. I will connect those fans to a fan controller and use a simple power adaptor to power the fan controller because I agree with you that the PSU might raise the temps a bit too much. I'll then plug the charger into a power strip on the backside of the case. Because of the high priority for stealth I had this idea of taking a broken/old PSU and gutting it and using the frame. Mount the frame where the PSU would go and have the power strip cord coming out of it. I think that will take care of my stealth needs and not bring any unneeded heat into the case. 

Now the thing I need some input on is the lighting. I also agree that side lighting will take too much space, so do you think 5 CFL light bulbs in total mounted on top, 4 will be 26 watt 2700k bulbs and 1 will be a 26 watt 6500k bulb is enough for 3 plants, 4 at most in a perpetual grow?
I think that amount of lighting is just enough where it wont make the case overheat, but I'm not sure if it's enough for the plants?

Heres my crappy sketch of my design, tell me what you think:






I'll also try to make some kind of system where I can lower the lights maybe.

Anyways, I think I've covered everything I need to. I hope I'm not hi-jacking your thread and taking attention away from your beautiful grow, it's just your opinion is important to me seeing as how long you've been doing successful grows in a PC. But who knows, maybe my poorly drawn diagram will help someone or motivate someone to start another PC grow.

PS: I agree RIU needs a dedicated section for micro grows because we have plenty of successful ones full of good information. But, if they don't make one soon and you decide to move your grow to a different forum please inform us because I will go register at that forum for the sole purpose of following your thread . Thanks for your help. When I start my grow I'll definently shoot a PM your way with the link. I think I should stop typing now.  Cya.


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## gumball (Aug 12, 2010)

Ludicium-nice design! A few things to take into account. The powerstrip idea in the PSU is great, but it will generate heat, especially with everything plugged in. I actually have a ballast in my PSU, but without a fan pulling air through it temps raise several degrees. V12 was right about pushing air into a case, of just about any size really. The air just kinda swirls and sits there a little longer raising temps, normally. But if you leave the fan off the bottom front, and have an 80mm blowing through your PSU it may work better for ya. Hope I might of helped ya out and good luck with your grow!!


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## v12xjs (Aug 14, 2010)

Hey Lucidium.
I'd forgotten how good that broadway case was, I'm totally jealous 
Your plans look good mate.

There's a couple of issues around fan placement that I'd consider changing. If you look where the bottom fan is you can see that the intake could easily get blocked by the pots. 
I also like to draw an imaginary line from the top of the cold air intake to the top of the exhaust because I think it shows exactly where the cooling will be effective. As cold air is heavier than warm air there will be no cooling above the line. That's the reason I place an intake at the top of the case.

To get free psu's just visit local pc repair shops and ask if they have any busted units you can have, tell them you are doing an elecrtical class and need to practice soldering and they will just give them to you.

Gumball and I are both using a most ingenius light trap idea posted here:
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=135524

It's prolly easier to raise the plants up rather than dropping the lights down, besides, if you have a perpetual going on you will always have a full sized plant in the case so the lights will need to be at the top all the time anyway. CD covers are ideal to stand the plants on.
For a guide on bulbs you will have 1.3 sq ft in the new case so 12,000 lumens total is the max you could use and 9,000 lumens would be the minimum I'd be happy with. Anything between those numbers will produce great plants.

I have everything more or less as I want it now and my case is bursting with activity so I'll get on with another journal tomorrow. I'll let you know where to find it.


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## wbarber69 (Aug 15, 2010)

------------------------------->Not Trying To Hijack This Post<------------------------------------

I'm just starting out with my pc box here are some early shots. 



Any suggestions for a newbie


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## v12xjs (Aug 15, 2010)

Hey wbarber69.

Just a polite notice that I consider your post to be a hijack of my thread.
You made no reference to me, my grow, my friends or anything else mentioned in this journal. You didn't even say hello. 
I will not tolerate SPAM.

Please delete your post using the edit button below it and don't post in here again. I'll refer it to the mods for deletion otherwise.

I would have sent you a more subtle version of this via private message but you have blocked all users from contacting you. I guess you know your way around public forums.


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## ghettofabulous (Aug 16, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Hey wbarber69.
> 
> Just a polite notice that I consider your post to be a hijack of my thread.


Not to placate but, I just laughed my ass off at that post. 

This thread is still my PC Grow bible, I actually saved the entire thing to a .txt file to have it on one f'n page. It sucks to see the micro-grows not get any respect. I would have to guess that the PC Case/Grow Box'trepeneurs make up the biggest growth spike in growers overall.

It's a great thing for everyone. There is a lot to be learned and shared between warehousers and micro-growers. There is such a large group of experienced growers here, it's really stifling to push people away out of convenience.

Anywho, I'd rep v12 every time I logged on if I could...props brother.


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## gumball (Aug 16, 2010)

^ditto^
sorry 
lol


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## wbarber69 (Aug 16, 2010)

its okay guys its his thread and there are just 111 pages of other people posting on his thread. And he's right I do know my way around a forum. Chances are some of you may even belong to one of the other 100's of forums I've posted in over the years, and if you've ever come across any of the thousands of posts I have out there you'll see that about 5% are me asking a question and the other 95% are of me helping out other posters with their issues. Which is why I figured it would be okay to post a little info on what I got and see if anyone could help me. Mainly, because I do "know my way around" a PUBLIC forum. 


Now if anyone is interested, I am so new to growing, that right now I'd ask a newbie for help. I've always wanted to get into my own grow, and after stumbling across the pc box method, and something called LST I think I may be able to get one or two little plants to grow. I've never really grown nything in my life. But I love weed, and it loves me. I'm tired of paying out my ass for something that comes from the earth, and I'm tired of trying to track down the "Good Shit". I (like most of the forums I frequent) found a community here that seems to be filled with like minded souls, who seem to have pure intentions and helpful spirits. I have no prior knowledge as to what I am doing, and am basing every action I take from info I acquire from this forum. I first started out by accidentally finding the pcgrowbox.com website and then started to dig around looking for more info on the subject and have been amazed at what I found out. I never knew that one could grow with cfl's or could use such a small space or even produce small high yielding plants. I became fascinated by the idea and decided that the only way I would be happy would be to try. I being a real tech enthusiast was able to procure everything I needed to get the box underway by just reaching over there and over there a right here... And in less than a day I was on my way. Now I am in the process of reading up on everything from soil composition to nutrients and timing. I have come to one conclusion through all my research. Learn everything I can for next time, Right now just put some bag seeds in some dirt and wait. And until I can even prove to myself that I can at least get them to sprout then I am not moving on to the next step 

I will be right here every day looking for more info. I don't care if every moderator goes ahead and deletes my account. I can still read everything that has been posted. I will do whatever I can to learn how to do this. And once I have some experience under my belt I will be right back here helping others. Because thats what I do when I join a forum.

I will keep detailed logs and pics of everything I attempt and every success I make. I will start my own thread on this subject someday. I just can't right now, because I have no clue what I am doing or where I will go from here.

Thanks all for your patience and understanding.


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## gumball (Aug 18, 2010)

well at least they didnt have to come back and edit that one to make themselve look good!!!


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## v12xjs (Aug 18, 2010)

WOW! Where have all the good times gone 

Hey gum, sorry you spoke too soon. 
Thanks for the props. Same for you ghetto.

A few posts have been edited or deleted in here recently so just in case anybody missed it, wbarber69 used the classic police tactic of pretending he was an absolute newbie looking for help but his actions betrayed him and he is not what he seems.
Just be aware.


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## gumball (Aug 18, 2010)

Right on there v12! We are a funny creature, us humans. Maybe one day some of us will de-evolve back too apes?


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## v12xjs (Aug 18, 2010)

Sorry gum, needed to reboot.
LOL. Might be a better world if we all changed to apes. I don't think they have traffic wardens


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## maturesmoker (Aug 19, 2010)

Sorry to see this great thread interrupted like that, I saw the original post and thought the guy should have asked before posting up those pics like that, it was out of order to just post up pics in somebody elses thread as it can cause confusion and ruin the flow for other readers. Glad its sorted.

Looking forward to the next update V12 

Btw, have you had a run in with a traffic warden?


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## gumball (Aug 19, 2010)

maturesmoker said:


> Sorry to see this great thread interrupted like that, I saw the original post and thought the guy should have asked before posting up those pics like that, it was out of order to just post up pics in somebody elses thread as it can cause confusion and ruin the flow for other readers. Glad its sorted.
> 
> Looking forward to the next update V12
> 
> Btw, have you had a run in with a traffic warden?


You know I was wondering bout the traffic warden statement!! They get the best (or worse) of us sometimes!!


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## v12xjs (Aug 19, 2010)

Greets ms and thanks.
Been meaning to pop over to your new thread, really glad you got it started.

I take someone to hospital on a regular basis and the visits can take longer than expected sometimes but the wardens on site are all egocentric power crazy dictators on speed, so I'm getting parking tickets at the rate of 3 or 4 a month!
Sorry about the obscure reference.
Kind of cool you changed your avatar btw. I like Bez but he was convicted of beating up his gf in front of their young child at Manchester Crown court last week. I can't respect a guy who could hit a woman.

Sorry I've been so remiss with a new journal.
I posted some very recent updates in the pc growers gang group last night as it didn't look right having a tent grow up in there.
I know I said I'd have a new journal on the go by now but things haven't really been going my way lately and I've had no time to make a permanent home for the clone op yet. I'm still a bit torn between a couple of new systems I'd like to try as well. Things are looking really good though, so I just need to get my act together and decide on the new approach.

Here's a few pics by way of an update:

Miss July: Began germing 1st July, 1st flower 30th July. Sagamartha NL#9 fem seed.




Miss August: Began germing 1st August, just started shaping the stem to keep her within the pot. Another NL#9.



Bella and Stella: cuttings taken from Miss July around 1st August. Located either on a windowsill during the day or under the cmh through the night. Both need repotting urgently.



Molly and Dolly: Top and bottom of same Purple Haze cutting, they were split 2 days ago with Dolly being rerooted and Molly set up in the Uncle Ben style to provide 4 tops. Molly is in 100% sphag moss and will either go into the case in the next 2 weeks or possibly become a mother plant. If she goes to flowering she will be treated as a moss hempy bucket and prolly fed with orchid nutes as they are specifically designed to work with a moss medium.



There is another clone called Dirty Mary but I have no pics of her. She's from a reveg violator kush and was taken at the same time as the Purple Haze but has failed to shine. I only took her as a backup but I'm thinking I will keep her in the case under 12/12 until September 25th when natural light outdoors hits 12/12. With any luck she will have done 4 weeks in flower by then and she could possibly finish outdoors before the frost comes.


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## kilpox (Aug 19, 2010)

Hey,Dude.
I have a pretty strange request. Can u post all strains names what u grow in pc case. Hard to read all 112 pages.


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## gumball (Aug 19, 2010)

Thanks for the update v12, everything looks good in your world!! 

Didn't you start the summer with an outdoor grow also?


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## v12xjs (Aug 19, 2010)

Hey kilpox, that apology was mostly for you.
I'd have to read all those pages myself mate, I'm a stoner too you know 

From memory:
Amstel Gold - short compact plant, easy to grow. Low yield due to abuse but great stone with nice flavour.
Paradise Seeds Ice Cream - short compact plant, very vigorous and easy to grow. High yield. Wonderful flavour with powerful dreamy high.
CH9 Jack - leggy plant, easy to grow. Low yield due to heavy sativa influence. Not suitable for a pc grow.
Sensi Seeds White Label Northern Lights - vigorous, compact, very difficult to grow (2 of 5 died on me). Awesome yields, great flavour, strongest mainstream weed available IMO.

I'm sure there's others but I can't recall them just now.


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## v12xjs (Aug 19, 2010)

Hey gum, you're talking about my sons


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## gumball (Aug 19, 2010)

Oh, sorry to hear, I guess it turned out male 

If you remember without having to go through your journal, what do you think the problems were with the white label NL that caused them to die? I want an NL so bad, I think I will try Nirvanas first, a little more affordable. I hate to be cheap about seeds, but them damn things cost so much!! My wife looks at me stupid whenever I bring it up. But I found her one, psicodelicia I think. Has coffee and caramel aromas/flavor. She's a coffee nut!!


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## gumball (Aug 19, 2010)

Oh, sorry to hear, I guess it turned out male 

If you remember without having to go through your journal, what do you think the problems were with the white label NL that caused them to die? I want an NL so bad, I think I will try Nirvanas first, a little more affordable. I hate to be cheap about seeds, but them damn things cost so much!! My wife looks at me stupid whenever I bring it up. But I found her one, psicodelicia I think. Has coffee and caramel aromas/flavor. She's a coffee nut!!


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## v12xjs (Aug 19, 2010)

Prolly sounds stupid but from the moment the seeds cracked they seemed allergic to water. I killed 1 by putting it in a moist rootriot cube. The following morning it looked like a fountain, just pumping water out between the cotelydons really slowly. Another seemed to drown while it was germing. I checked it and saw a small tail so I put it back for a few hours and it was dead when I checked again. 
All the other plants were tough to deal with because it's a really heavy feeder but always responds badly to water. Most of the people who shared it rated it as the strongest they had ever smoked though and I liked it a lot.


EDIT: Forgot to say I love coffee too, so I'll check out that strain. I have a little FrancisFrancis X1 to wake me up each day, maybe that's why I like a couchlock at night


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## maturesmoker (Aug 21, 2010)

gumball said:


> I want an NL so bad, I think I will try Nirvanas first, a little more affordable. I hate to be cheap about seeds, but them damn things cost so much!!


I hate reading these reports of failed seeds, especially when from the more expensive seedbanks. You know Gumball, I have used *Nirvana* seeds for over 10 years now off and on and NEVER had a bad one or one that failed to germinate, honestly! Quality of the Nirvana NL is very good, (well at least it got me well stoned every spliff I smoked  ) I think given the years they have been established and working with seeds they have got things well under control. Give them a try, you wont regret it. 

V12, cheers for the cider recipe, I'll be making a start today  Very strange about those seeds, something well amiss there.


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## gumball (Aug 21, 2010)

maturesmoker said:


> I hate reading these reports of failed seeds, especially when from the more expensive seedbanks. You know Gumball, I have used *Nirvana* seeds for over 10 years now off and on and NEVER had a bad one or one that failed to germinate, honestly! Quality of the Nirvana NL is very good, (well at least it got me well stoned every spliff I smoked  ) I think given the years they have been established and working with seeds they have got things well under control. Give them a try, you wont regret it.
> 
> V12, cheers for the cider recipe, I'll be making a start today  Very strange about those seeds, something well amiss there.


thanks mature, i couldnt get much better a rating from anyone else.

v12, i know you mentioned not having a home for the clones. have you ever thought of building an armoir type grow box like maturesmoker? you could use it to flower, and your pc for clones, and still be rather stealthy. i know matures may be a tad big for your needs probably, but the one I attached may be just right. then just set your television on top and voila. just something i thought about and wanted to share.


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## farmboss (Aug 21, 2010)

hey v12, nice work. was wondering your personal opinion on this.


would you think you could do a pc grow like yours here, but use maybe a 150w HPS for flowering?

i was thinking maybe put glass on top of the PC, put the light (thinking an enclosed sun systems) on top of the glass, and maybe add a small fan to cool it and keep its heat away from the case. *kinda thinking here to REMOVE the heat from the light from the case, not having to worry about it after doing that.*

do you think just the radiant heat from the beams of a 150w HPS would heat it up too much?


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## gumball (Aug 21, 2010)

farmboss said:


> hey v12, nice work. was wondering your personal opinion on this.
> 
> 
> would you think you could do a pc grow like yours here, but use maybe a 150w HPS for flowering?
> ...


hey farmboss, whats happening! well v12 can definitely give you great advice, but i too have HID in a PC (100 watt CMH) and thought I would lend my thoughts, hope thats ok. i think unless you have 1.5-2 sq ft a 150 watt HPS would be out of the questions, IMO. but, in an average size case, i think one of the 70 watt HPS you see at lowes and homedepot for cheap would work great! dont forget you have to maintain the ballast somewhere, so keep that, and the heat it produces in mind. plus with the 70 watt HPS, you can maybe add cfls for daylight temp lighting. these are just my thoughts, hope they help you out.


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## farmboss (Aug 21, 2010)

My idea would be that the case and the light would be separated by a glass window. Are you familiar with the sun system 150w HPS? the light, reflector, and ballast are all one.

the ballast would vent out the top of the fixture, a good 8" higher than the top of the PC case.

i would modify the sun system enclosed ballast/reflector to have a small hole, to maybe put a case fan, just to ENSURE that no heat permiates down to the box.

*FYI, i am VERY VERY familiar with the 150 and the 70watt fixtures you are talking about, and how much heat they generate. i HAVE used a home depot 50 or 70 watt HPS before.*


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## crazytrain14 (Aug 21, 2010)

hey farm how hot do the 70 w hps get in a cpu case? i have a 125w cfl in it now.

peace


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## v12xjs (Aug 24, 2010)

Sorry guys, been away for a few days.

Hey gum, I wish I had the space to do something just a little bigger but I don't. The pc will have to do for now.

Thanks farmboss.
Heat isn't the problem with a 150w, it's the light that would hurt the plants.
I work on the basis that the max output of the sun measured at the surface of the earth is 10,000 lumens per square foot. This is only in places like Death Valley or the Sahara, so I figure 9,500 lumens per sq ft is the max the plants will thrive in. A 100w HPS will output that figure but a 150w would be closer to 15,000 lumens and the plants wouldn't do well.
You could still use it but you need to keep it further from the plants than most pc cases would allow or as gumball says, spread the light over a larger area. Cheers gum.


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## kilpox (Aug 26, 2010)

What you think about white widow,v12? I'm micro grower too,but i have more space than pc case. Need your advice,becouse i never grow White Widow,but i dream about that strain.


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## v12xjs (Aug 26, 2010)

Hey kilpox
I love White Widow and it's the first stash I buy when I get to Amsterdam. I've never grown it myself but have seen it cultivated indoors a few times. It seems easy to grow and it's very compact but maybe not the best yielder.
I haven't tried it in the case because it needs at least 70 days flowering and that's just too long for me. If I had a few extra inches of space or I was looking to do a scrog grow I'd definitely consider it though.


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## "SICC" (Aug 31, 2010)

how things going?


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## v12xjs (Aug 31, 2010)

Greets SICC.
It's all good but it's a bit manic atm, I'm trying to get a crop asap to keep me smiling and I'm also trying to switch over to clones so I kind of have 2 grows in the box just now.
I'm using your party cup grows as a bit of a template for the new clone plants so I'll be rereading a lot of your posts in the next week or 2. Hope I can do as well as you.

Lights have just come on so here's what it looks like in there, the biggest plant is just over 8 weeks old so it's gonna get even more cramped in there soon


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## gumball (Aug 31, 2010)

HOLY SHIT BUD!!! I have never seen that case that fool, bravo!! you shall be harvesting something soon. and the blocked out lighting is perfect for the clones at the bottom. you need a lamp that is translucent which you can store your clones in during veg light, or a very bushy houseplant which you could hang by a window, then just hide your clones under the over hang!!! 

anyhows, looks great, i bet your glad to see it that way.


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## v12xjs (Aug 31, 2010)

Cheers gum, it's good to see some frost again 
You're right about the clones tucked away under the canopy, they love it there!
I've got the fixtures to kit out a little clone box so I'll prolly do that tomorrow just so I can keep it manageable.


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## Phase420 (Aug 31, 2010)

looking freaking awesome!!


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## maturesmoker (Sep 1, 2010)

Beautiful once again V12  back with a vengenance. Everything looks so healthy. Funny you mention SICC's PC thread as I'm also using it as a reference for my small pot grow. What did you settle on for a clone box? I know you had considered the monitor, are you going with that idea?


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## gumball (Sep 1, 2010)

Yeah, a monitor with that glass you can only see through in one direction would be great. That glass is prolly expensive as get out!!


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## "SICC" (Sep 1, 2010)

The cups will be perfect for the clones, i got 5 clones sitting in cups right now.


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## CHIEF PUFF PUFF (Sep 2, 2010)

*Hey V, looking very blue in that pc case You should be smoking soon! What size containers are you using? They look perfect for your case. 

*


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## v12xjs (Sep 3, 2010)

Thanks Phase. Hope we can expect another grow from you soon enough.

Hey ms
There's some tips got burned while I was away but considering they did 5 days without any attention at all I'm pretty pleased.
I worked on the monitor casing yesterday but it just isn't the right shape for what I want. Shame really as I've spent a few quid on it. I'm going to have to bite the bullet and get another pc case for the clones.

My month away from RIU payed top dividends by the way. I got my grades this morning and I passed everything with enough marks to gain a distinction overall.
Better lock your daughters up mate as there will be much rejoicing this weekend 

You're on it there gum.
It took me a while to figure out how to make a fake screen for the monitor. I considered using an old laptop as that would have allowed me to make the case/monitor into a live pc, but the laptops I have are all A4 and the monitor is a 17inch. I ending up scrounging one of those old anti glare screens and painted the rear side black. It would fool anybody but it needs to live at the side of my bed next to the case and while it does actually fit, there isn't enough room to open it. DOH!

Greets again SICC. You more than proved the suitability of those party cups for growing clones, even to a doubter like me. I'm very thankfull to you for those posts.

Thanks CHIEF.
In the interests of recycling I'm currently using washing powder containers. Over here we can get liquitabs that just go in with the laundry. They are like clear squares filled with detergent that come in packs of 11 or 22 and the containers are 1 or 2 litre. Being rectangular the containers are really easy to fit together in the case and I can train the plant along the length of the pot to keep everything tidy. I use the smaller container until they begin to flower and then pop them into the bigger one for the final push.

I'm so excited about my exam results I just had to tell the girls 
Here's Miss July looking as excited as me. She's grown a bit in the last 3 days as well


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## gumball (Sep 3, 2010)

Congratulations on those scores v12, I will drink a tall one and smoke a fat one for u this weekend in celebration. 

Sweet pics, miss july is a bute!

Bummer on the monitor, was a nice idea. Anyway to lift the top of the monitor or fold down the screen with a hinge of sorts on the bottom. 

Maybe u can find one of the small cube pc cases, like 12x12x12, haven't seen them in a while, but they were a new design that didn't wo over the ATX design so well. I am sure the cases are out there still though


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## Phase420 (Sep 3, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Thanks Phase. Hope we can expect another grow from you soon enough.


Yes im still growing away but have moved out of the box for flowering and moved them in to the closet. Witch i just bought a tent to fit in there to help control smell and light. Still useing the pc box for seedlings and clones. your stuff is looking great as always. still keeping watch, cant wait to see how these turn out!


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## CHIEF PUFF PUFF (Sep 4, 2010)

*Congratulations V on your achievement!!!! You deserve to celebrate after passing all your exams.*


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## "SICC" (Sep 4, 2010)

Hell yeah, this ones for you 

The ladies are lookin great


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## maturesmoker (Sep 5, 2010)

Congratulations V12 on those results, here's hoping your hard work is rewarded in career terms too, but I hope you never move out of that PC case, we're all far too attached to it here  Glad the plants survived that period, just goes to show how resilient these things are. The offer of the mini fridge still stands BTW if you want it for a clone box? I'm not sure how you would fit light etc in there but if anyone could make it work its you!

As for Miss July, she's a beauty, I can feel another Red Bull can shot coming up soon


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## tamjam69 (Sep 6, 2010)

Its a bit late but heres one from me  congrats v12  that month break from here payed off mate well done

some fast process there with the ladys, good to see that case nearly filled up, whens the next seed set for germination?


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## v12xjs (Sep 7, 2010)

Hey guys, really appreciate all the kind words. Take it as read that I saluted you all back with a tipple and a toke 

Thanks again for that offer ms but it looks like I underestimated the size of unit I would need to run the clones. I bit the bullet today and bought a small pc case. I'm back in familiar territory now so they should do ok.

Hey tamjam, great to see you back online.
I'm dropping the seeds in favour of a clone op for the next run, Miss July and August are just there to get me some stash while I figure out the timings and expected yields for the clones. Once I have those I can work out a planting schedule and get things underway. Here's most of the family posing for the cam:


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## v12xjs (Sep 9, 2010)

Got myself sorted at last. The new case needs some work but it's stealthy already and the plants have given the thumbs up after 24 hours.
I've got all the timings down and all I'm waiting for now is a couple of harvests from the cuttings so I can work out how many I can fit in the flower case at any given time.
The main case has 2 x NL seed plants and a Purple Haze cutting that has been topped. The cuttings are preflowering after a week of 12/12 so I can flo both strains to a harvest in 60-65 days now. That can only be good.
Check this:


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## gumball (Sep 9, 2010)

loving the momma and mini case setup!!  you will soon be reaping many rewards from your garden!


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## CHIEF PUFF PUFF (Sep 9, 2010)

Hey v, your ladies are looking good in all their different stages i'm sure that extra pc case helps out a bunch. Man it's a lot of work keeping track of the different watering and feeding schedules. I have sassy, 2-blue mystic, kim (sassy's clone), wendy (clone from kim), and another red spice hash growing and trying to keep it all straight is a full-time job.


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## v12xjs (Sep 10, 2010)

Cheers gum. It's a bit of a new chapter so there will be mistakes but I'm getting the hang of this pc growing lark now so I'll sort it all out eventually.
As it happens, the Purple Haze cutting in the middle of the pic above had a crown of little lady flowers on her this morning. She's been on the windowsill for a couple of weeks but I didn't expect that!
Looks like a need a plan B, quick!

Wow CHIEF, Sounds like you are almost carbon neutral now 
Feeding can be a pita with a perpetual for sure.
My routine last time was to make up 2 litres of full strength for the big plant & feed her half, then top up the remaining nutes with ph water to get half strength for the smaller plant and top up once again for the babies. The houseplants usually got the rest.
I ended up making a 4x mixture once a week and diluting some of that for each feeding which also made things a bit less time consuming. I just used a measuring jug with 3 parts ph water to 1 part of the 4x for each feed. It seemed to last ok for a week, although molasses came out of the solution within 36 hours when I tried using it. If you want to add molasses then always make a fresh batch up.
I'd seen Kim but it sounds like you've been busy recently. I'll go catch up.


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## maturesmoker (Sep 11, 2010)

Loving the 'Little & Large' set up mate  Everything looking healthy too. I'm guessing that P haze cut was taken from an early flowering mother? Most of my cuts were taken from flowering mothers and never lost those pre-flowers, but she should still veg up normally under 18/6 or whatever you use, I'm not sure if this is what you mean?

I like the way you work out your watering regime, and its funny that you give the rest to houseplants as I do the same. We have a beautiful big spider plant that's been fed bio bizz leftovers for 2 years and its amazingly healthy with a mess of roots dangling out the bottom that just seem to stay white and healthy even as it dries out. Its what inspired me to try this 'dangly root' grow thing i got going atm.

Buds look amazing too V12


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## CHIEF PUFF PUFF (Sep 11, 2010)

Hey V, I like your feeding routine, I will use it because it's less of a hassle than what I do. Thanks for the info! Great idea about using the remaining nutes for the house plants. Also, I got some grow bags to help give a little more space in my pc case for my Blue Mystic girls, their pots are taking up too much space and blocking the intake fans. I'm wondering should I transplant them again since I transplanted them in the pots they are in now Sept 5. What do you think?


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## v12xjs (Sep 12, 2010)

Cheers ms, great minds think alike huh 
I noticed your new dangly root feeding style and it's most interesting, and that's a great name for it 
Hope it proves itself, I'll be keeping an eye on it for sure.
The little plant is set on flowering so I've moved her in to the big case. I've put Miss July outdoors to finish off, it's all but 12/12 now and she was causing a bit of a heat issue by blocking all the fans off. Eats all her greens does that one 

Hey CHIEF, hope the feeding thing works out for you.
You should be fine to repot the mystics again at this stage, just be gentle. I'd prolly do it sooner rather than later as the roots will form a rootball fairly soon and you might have problems making them fit in a growbag. 
I tend to spread the roots around the top of the pot when I first transplant mine into the 1 litre pots. Once I cover them over with soil they really seem to fill out quick.


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## tamjam69 (Sep 17, 2010)

hell yeah that veg box sure is gonna make your life easier v12  how much are you planning on pulling from that flower cab a month now then? 2 ounces!!!!!?????


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## v12xjs (Sep 18, 2010)

I wish tamjam 
The changes I'm making aren't aimed at a yield increase tbh, although I'm sure I could think of things to do with a few extra buds .

The current rethink is more about improving my initial perpetual design, which was pretty good but came to a grinding halt when the fem seeds I bought turned out to be male.
It seems that the only way to ensure a perpetual supply of quality female plants is to clone them, so that's the new plan.

Here's a pic of Miss July from yesterday and I'm struggling to make the clones put out like she is doing, so I'm looking at a drop in yield until I get my shit together. She has about 10 days left IIRC, I just hope the slugs leave me something to harvest!


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## gumball (Sep 18, 2010)

hey v12, i know you have done bout everything in your case. but have you thought of a little dwc/bubbler setup for your clones? wouldnt that get the clones growing faster than other methods, hopefully pushing them to put out more faster. listen to us, sounds like we're pimping out some bitches!!

have you ever thought of trying to make fem seeds?

miss july looks awesome basking in the sun right there!!


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## v12xjs (Sep 18, 2010)

Cheers gum, she's a little honey isn't she?
I've been timing the clones and they are taking 4 weeks to produce a new top I can cut from, leaving a rooted base I can throw into flower. I have 4 cuttings so I can already produce a plant a week which is more than I need, so a bubble cloner would prolly be overkill for me.
I keep considering doing a hermie seed run but like sisters in any family, they would all have different traits. Using clones I should get exactly the same plant with the same growth characteristics and feeding traits which will make for an easy life overall. 
That works for me


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## gumball (Sep 18, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Cheers gum, she's a little honey isn't she?
> I've been timing the clones and they are taking 4 weeks to produce a new top I can cut from, leaving a rooted base I can throw into flower. I have 4 cuttings so I can already produce a plant a week which is more than I need, so a bubble cloner would prolly be overkill for me.
> I keep considering doing a hermie seed run but like sisters in any family, they would all have different traits. Using clones I should get exactly the same plant with the same growth characteristics and feeding traits which will make for an easy life overall.
> That works for me


and thats all that matters, is a system that flows for you and your needs. 

i would like to try the seed thing myself, but that sounds troublesome, stinky (flowering plant being moved about), and removes the stealth altogether. not to mention extra space required for flowering plant.


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## v12xjs (Sep 18, 2010)

gumball said:


> and thats all that matters, is a system that flows for you and your needs.


Bullseye my friend.


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## tamjam69 (Sep 19, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Bullseye my friend.


miss july looks booootiful!!


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## v12xjs (Sep 20, 2010)

Cheers tamjam. I'm chomping at the bit to give her a try 
Only a few more days now....


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## CHIEF PUFF PUFF (Sep 20, 2010)

*Ms July is definitely a show off *


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## v12xjs (Sep 21, 2010)

Thanks CHIEF.
I'm afraid I've been treating her mean though, so she doesn't look quite so hot today. 
She's been outdoors for over a week while I fill up the case with experimental plants and the overnight temps dropped to 4C a couple of nights ago! I couldn't take her back indoors in case she brought some unwelcome guests in with her so she just had to grin and bear it. Poor little mite.
Combined with the slug damage she is in a sorry state and I think the sharp drop in temps has slowed down the plumping process a little. My tin needs an urgent top up though, so she's getting chopped in 7 or 8 days regardless.

  

Feels good to post some trich porn again


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## gumball (Sep 21, 2010)

WOW! Glad to see the refill your tin will get!! 

Have you thought of "blanketing" the soil about and around her to keep it warmer? You may be able to dig a hole and place her pot in it, then maybe cover that up with something to hold the heat in the pot. Should keep the roots warmer and help with the slow growth. Just some thoughts to get her to Plump up a little more in the next week for ya.


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## v12xjs (Sep 21, 2010)

Cheers gum, some good ideas. 
I didn't think about the roots but I used my old melted plexiglass and some glass out of the skip to make a mini greenhouse for her now. She should be ok so long as there's no lasting effects from the cold snap.


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## gumball (Sep 21, 2010)

Sounds good v12. I was reading where folks will take old deep freezers and bury them, leaving a foot or so above ground. They then build a greenhouse to the buried freezer. They stated they could grow, clone, and root seedlings through the freezing months this way cause the colder temps would not get to the roots. The cold roots are what actually slows down the growth, from my reading at least. I am sure she will be happy with your makeshit green house, and I am sure some saran wrap will work great too!


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## crazytrain14 (Sep 21, 2010)

lookin very tasty V. thats some crazy stuff bout the fridge story. im lookin forward to seeing buds again.

peace


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## "SICC" (Sep 23, 2010)

mmmm, porn


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## v12xjs (Sep 23, 2010)

You can't whack some good bud porn can you SICC? 

Bad news since then though. The weather has been unclement here for a little while and today's inspection revealed signs of bud rot in the main cola 
I thought I'd get away with putting her outside so I could get to understand the clones, but it looks like a bad call.
I've only ever seen bud rot on badly stored buds before now, never on a living plant. I chopped her there and then and I've cut out the rot in 2 places so hopefully I'll salvage over half the main bud. There was another 4 nice tops and 3 or 4 popcorns that are all fine so all is not lost. I don't have my cam atm so no pics I'm afraid.
It's 54 days from first flower and the breeder notes say 55 days flowering so I'm hopeful it will be fine once it's dry. She only took 7 days to go from 1st flower to having a fully flowering top so she's no more than 8 days short of full maturity and tbh, NL at full maturity can be a bit daunting 


In other news I got my invitation to reconfirm my account here today. I've just done a cursory check on the email and I'm not going to do it. I'll post my reasoning in the appropriate thread in the support forum in a minute or 2.


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## "SICC" (Sep 23, 2010)

Sorry to hear about the bud rot, im not doing the email thing either, alot of people aren't gonna do it.


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## floridasucks (Sep 23, 2010)

lookin very nice v12, are those pics from the plants in the pc case?


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## v12xjs (Sep 25, 2010)

Hey fs, the plant was grown in the case but I tried to take advantage of the natural 12/12 conditions so I put her outside for the last week and put some clones in her place.
Looks like it wasn't my best move


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## v12xjs (Sep 25, 2010)

Sorry guys, I've had issues with this site for a while and now they have released my email address to a 3rd party without my consent or prior knowledge I've had enough.
I'm all done here.
Bye.


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## tamjam69 (Sep 25, 2010)

v12xjs said:


> Sorry guys, I've had issues with this site for a while and now they have released my email address to a 3rd party without my consent or prior knowledge I've had enough.
> I'm all done here.
> Bye.


you will be missed v12, gonna be a dark place here without you now  be good and stay green 

looks like its deffo aswell as hes ditch all the images


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## gumball (Sep 25, 2010)

that is a real pitty, really is. you have shown everyone here how to harvest out of one of the smallest possible containers, yet get maximum yield out of the system, approx a gram a day, or an ounce a month. if you scaled your entire system up as much or more than about any other grower in a large system. Your PC will be a learning tool for many as long as RIU still displays the thread. you will be remembered. peace v12xjs


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## CHIEF PUFF PUFF (Sep 25, 2010)

*Hey V, hate 2 see you leaving the site, it won't be the same without you and your experience with growing in a pc case!!!*


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## Phase420 (Sep 25, 2010)

Sad to hear about the misfortunate circumstances with the site! I wounder why this happened?? i kept getting a think the other day that everytime i ented the site it said my computer was trying to being attacked/ hacked. Your a great grower and hope to meet with you again on another site then. Keep it real V.


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## eps (Sep 29, 2010)

I liked this thread!


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## gumball (Sep 29, 2010)

Yes, its sad. 

I say we all still stop in from time to time and post our PC case bud porn, to honor what v12 did for us all in his way. 

I believe v12 will never login again, but I can't believe he won't lurk through some of his fav threads!


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## maturesmoker (Sep 29, 2010)

I just posted in that 'support' thread. I'm angry that good people are walking away from the forum over this reconfirmation request and to lose V12 is a step too far for me so I wont be doing it either. 

V12, if you read this could you PLEASE let us know where you're going before you finally walk away. How about UK420?


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## v12xjs (Sep 30, 2010)

Hey guys, really appreciate the kind comments and pm's.

Sorry I deleted all the pics but they contained metadata I didn't clear before they were posted.
I like thctalk ms.
12/12, micro and auto sections works for me.
I took some pics last night I'll use to get the ball rolling. Be good to keep in touch.





gumball said:


> I can't believe he won't lurk through some of his fav threads!


You know me so well gum


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## maturesmoker (Sep 30, 2010)

Great V12, I'll take a look over there  Thanks.


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## gumball (Sep 30, 2010)

Yes, thanks!


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## tamjam69 (Sep 30, 2010)

hell yeah cheers v12  would have missed not following you, may be moving into a pc case very soon


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## NLNo5 (Oct 18, 2010)

Yo V12,

Where can we find you? Are you at another forum? I'd like to stay in touch, on the forums anyway.

Best Regards,

NLNo5


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## CHIEF PUFF PUFF (Oct 18, 2010)

*Hey V it's hard to be here on RIU and you are not around. I hope you come back or join another site. Keep in touch.*


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## NLNo5 (Oct 19, 2010)

CHIEF PUFF PUFF said:


> *Hey V it's hard to be here on RIU and you are not around. I hope you come back or join another site. Keep in touch.*


V12 is at THCtalk. I signed up just to say hi.


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## tags (Oct 27, 2010)

Anyone know what username he is operating under?


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## maturesmoker (Oct 27, 2010)

tags said:


> Anyone know what username he is operating under?


V12xjs. On thctalk forum. Case is still bursting with quality.


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