# Feminized Seeds Hermie Test - 14 strains, which are high risk; frequency; DM Reverse;



## Hobbes (Apr 9, 2009)

There's a lot of interest in *feminized seeds*, for obvious reasons, and we've had some discussion on the susceptibility of plants grown from feminized seeds to turn *hermaphrodite*. I'm going to *track 14 feminized seeds for 14 strains from seed to harvest *to see how they fare during flower, as well as experimenting with ways to stop the banana production once hermieing begins, and ways to keep the plant from hermieing to start with.


My feminized strains are:


*Alaskan Ice* - Greenhouse
*Arjan's Haze #3* - Greenhouse
*Blueberry* &#8211; Dutch Passion
*Blue Moonshine* - Dutch Passion
*Big Bang* - Greenhouse
*Cheese* - Big Bhudda
*Flo* - Dutch Passion
*Jack Flash #5* - Sensi
*Red Diesel* - Barney's Farm
*Strawberry Cough* Dutch Passion
*Super Silver Haze* - Greenhouse
*Taiga* (autoflower) - Dutch Passion
*TrainWreck* - Greenhouse
*White Widow* - Seedsman 


_***thanks to Pick n Mix for the fem singles_


I have already flowered out Dutch Passion's Blueberry and Strawberry Cough a couple times and have Barney's Red Diesel at 6 weeks flower. I'm going to germ a new strain every 2 to 4 weeks, depending on space in the garden. All plants will be grown in Pro Mix with Fox Farm nutes for soiless and General Hydroponics for hydro; good, dechlorinated water; 1000W 2100K Hortilux HPS during flower (air cooled hood for no heat stress) and 125W 10,000K HO CFL for veg, UVB lighting in late flower.


I only know a few gardening issues to keep plants from hermieing &#8211; consistent lighting, med-light nutes, good water, good air. Once the plant turns hermaphrodite I only know to uses tweezers and Dutch Master Reverse. We'll all have to all chip in to develop a strategy for growing feminized seeds without having Herman messing with our garden.


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*Blueberry (fem) - Dutch Passion*
*1**st* grow: the mother and 4 clones hermied only slightly, very few bananas. I just picked bananas.
*2nd *grow: 16" double topped in RDWC, virtually no bananas
*3rd* grow: clone in pro mix, 29&#8221; single cola &#8211; quite a few bananas that grew back when picked. Sprayed with Reverse. Still some banana production after 2 days, re apply Reverse after 10 days if needed. This will be the last grow for this strain, the current plant has been a poor producer, probably the bad pheno I read about. Beautifull plant though, starting to turn purple hues the last few days.


*Strawberry Cough (fem) &#8211; Dutch Passion*
*1st* grow: mother in pro mix and 4 clones in RDWC, a few banana bunches, picked now and again but not a problem
*2nd* grow: 18" double topped in RDWC, virtually no bananas.
*3rd *grow: 2 clones in RDWC with General Hydroponics, not a single banana 6 weeks into flower. No need to spray with Reverse.


*Red Diesel (fem) &#8211; Barney's Farm*
*1st *grow: mother in pro mix, 18&#8221; clone in RDWC. The clone was packed with bananas, I picked once and none grew back, sprayed with Reverse anyway. The clone was in the same RDWC as the 2 Strawberry Cough clones from above, that didn't hermie. The double topped mother in pro mix is still producing bananas after being sprayed with Reverse.


*Flo (fem) &#8211; Dutch Passion* 1 week into veg
*Taiga (fem) &#8211; Dutch Passion* 1 week into veg


As my control strains, to be sure it's the seeds and not my gardening causing hermieing, I have these strains:


*Big Laughing (reg) &#8211; Dr Greenthumb*: 2 years in garden, never a problem &#8211; 6 weeks into flower
*Kali Mist (reg) &#8211; Serious Seeds*: 2 weeks into flower
*Bubblegum (reg) &#8211; Serious Seeds*: 6 weeks into flower


*Super Strawberry Diesel (reg) &#8211; Elite*: 1 week into veg


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Add ideas as you have them, lets find a way to grow these beasts into beauties.


Any stories of plants hermieing, things that worked, things that didn't work, anything that will help us develop tactics and a strategy for growing fems with no hermies.


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## snewww (Apr 9, 2009)

I love you, I can't help out with my experience as I have none, but this is gonna be hell of a help for people all around here.

Many thanks man, can't wait to see what's gonna happen


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## MOONSTAR8595 (Apr 9, 2009)

I have Jack Flash #5 (sensi) and Blue Moonshine (DP) over 6 weeks into flowering and no sign of a hermie yet....Looking beautiful too. I also have feminized SSH, Hawaiin Snow, and Arjan's Haze babies coming up for next garden. So far so good...Hope my good luck continues with that lack of hermies.


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## Hobbes (Apr 16, 2009)

From other threads:

*"I would like to know if it is worth the extra money to order feminized seeds."*

I feel that fem seeds are worth the money TO TRY A STRAIN and that Pick n Mix is the best way to try a lot of great strains, inexpensively. (more to your answer soon)

(ok, more to your answer now)

*"do they have a very high chance of being herm?"*

I have 3 strains from feminized seeds in my garden, 4 strains from regular seeds. All three strains from feminized seed plants have hermied slightly or excessively, all 4 of the regular seed plants are perfect.

.

The feminized seeds are made by hermieing a great pheno clone by using a chemical, then using the plants own pollen to pollinate the clone or other clones from that pheno-mother, to produce all feminized seeds. Since the hermieing is a result of chemicals/stress and not of poor genetics there should be no more hermieing traits passed on to the S1 seeds than the parent had.

Here's where the problem starts. Except for IBLs like Bubblegum or Rez Sour Diesel inbreeding two children (F1s) will produce less stable offspring. For those not familiar with this - White Russian seeds are made by crossing White Widdow with AK47. When Serious Seeds wants to make more White Russian seeds they would cross the WW x AK47 again, not let a male white russian pollenate a female white russian - because that would produce less stable seeds. Except in stabilized InBred Lines like RSD and BG.

So, your S1s are going to be slightly less stable than their parent. If I want a mother to take clones off for years I'll order a set of regular seeds and pick the best female as my mother. If I want to try a lot of strains quickly and inexpensively to decide which strains I want in my garden - while doing the least amount of work planting, caring for and weeding out males and caring for extra females - I'll order feminized.

Both have their places, both strengths and weaknesses. 

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## Hobbes (Apr 16, 2009)

*.if you do get some slight hermi going on all the seeds should in theory be feminized correct?"

*The seeds from a self pollinating S1 would be an S2 I believe, feminized for sure. A study a read a few months ago said that by the time breeding gets to S3 or S4 the plant is so unstable it's ungrowable for our purposes. The S2 would be less stable than the S1, which hermied to make the seeds for the S2.

My feeling is that any pollen from a plant that hermies when you don't want it to is not pollen you want to make seeds with. (Except for late flowering hermieing of course)

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*.im really hoping one hermi doesnt ruin the whole bunch. that is possible right?"*

Yes it's possible. The pollen could float around your room and pollinate all of your plants. Most likely only those close by would be heavily seeded anyway. Get some tweezers and pick out every banana.

*".....now would those seeds be considered femenized? because they were pollenated by a hermi? or is it only when a bitch knocks herself up they are femenized?"*

It's only when a plant self pollinates that feminized seeds are made. So hermie pollen on a sister plant will not make fem seeds, but hermie pollen from a clone from the same mother as the female clone being pollenated, will produce feminized seeds.

If a plant from a feminized seed (S1 - Self Pollinated Generation 1) hermies for no reason and pollinates herself to make S2 seeds we can expect the S2 to be less stable than the S1. A study I read a few months ago said that by the time a breeder gets to S3 or S4 the plant is too unstable to grow for our purposes.

If you don't know why a plant hermied it's probaby because of poor genetics, and in my opinion you don't want to use pollen from an unstable plant for breeding. You'll just produce unstable offspring. 

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## Hobbes (Apr 16, 2009)

*Pick n Mix* for feminized singles (no USA delivery)
*Attitude* for fem singles - smaller selection (USA delivery)
*Greenthumb* for fem packs - (USA delivery)

http://www.pickandmixseeds.co.uk/

http://www.cannabis-seeds-bank.co.uk/

http://www.drgreenthumb.com/cannabis_seeds_GreenthumbSeedsEntrance.htm


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## cocoxxx (Apr 16, 2009)

i read on the greenhouse website that there feminised seeds are 100% female and 100% hermie free, is this 100% bullshit???


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## bicycle racer (Apr 16, 2009)

cocoxxx said:


> i read on the greenhouse website that there feminised seeds are 100% female and 100% hermie free, is this 100% bullshit???


nothings 100% any plant female fem or not can herm. anyways ive grown seeds that were from grows that hermed and i had good results no herm issues so far and these were seeds made from herm grows but when i grew them they stayed female.


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## Hobbes (Apr 18, 2009)

It'll be interesting to see how stable Greenhouse's fem seeds are - they've perfected color coding their seeds and they have lots of great strains. I've got feminized Greenhouse seeds for 5 strains waiting to germ, I'll run them close together and keep a tally. 

*Greenhouse Strains waiting to germ:*
Alaskan Ice
Arjan's Haze #3
Big Bang
Super Silver Haze
TrainWreck

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## Hobbes (Apr 18, 2009)

I sprayed my feminized seed plants with Reverse again last night - after the first dose of Reverse last week both the Red Diesel and Blueberry's bananas dried up for a few days, then came back at a slower rate - a half dozen to a dozen each day. I picked the bananas every day this week before re-spraying last night, there were no bananas grown back this morning.

The Red Diesel clone in RDWC had only a couple of bananas for the whole week, amazing difference from it's mother in Pro Mix. The two Strawberry Cough clones in RDWC have produced no bananas 8 weeks into flower, while all other SC clones and the SC mother have hermied in past grows.

My control plants from regular seeds - Big Laughing, Bubblegum and Kali Mist - are all flowering perfectly. The 2 BL are at 7 weeks (1 pro mix, 1 RDWC); the two BG are at 8 weeks (both pro mix); and the Kali Mist is at 4 weeks (pro mix). My growing seems OK, at least for not overly stressing the plants.

I'm doing a preemptive spray on the next Red Diesel clone going into flower this weekend. I want to see if a few small doeses of Reverse during transition into flower will keep the plant from hermieing, rather than using a lot of Reverse to stop a hermie 4 or 5 weeks into flower. This Red Diesel clone is a good test since the mother and first clone hermied so excessively. 

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## Hobbes (Apr 18, 2009)

*"Dutch Master&#8482; Reverse is a ready to use (no dilution required) foliar spray that quickly and efficiently brings peace to a grower's worst nightmare... awful seed problems! Fix it simply and quickly (as little as 2 sprays) with this unique formulation of specialty minerals & amino acids.

Modern Science allows Reverse to achieve this remarkable feat by channelling selected minerals and amino acids into the Mesophyll layer of the plant. This layer is responsible for most of a plants energy production (Photosynthesis) and more importantly is the starting point of all the metabolic pathways.

Simply put, the selected minerals and amino acids in this product assist the plant in channelling the correct metabolites in the pathways responsible for flowering, correcting any imbalances like the one that causes hermaphrodism (male flowers).

Directions for Use:
1.) Pour the amount you need into a spray bottle. Typically 1-pint (16 oz.) is enough for one application for the average sized garden.

2.) Add Penetrator at the rate of 2 teaspoons per quart.

3.) Shake the spray bottle with the solution to make sure it is well mixed.

4.) Important you must spray the solution within 15 minutes of adding.

5.) Make sure your lights are a minimum of 24 inches from the tops of your plants then spray your plants until the leaves are evenly coated with the solution. You only need to spray the top surface of the leaf because Penetrator will deliver absolutely everything you need inside the leaf.

6.) Spray your plants once, then once again 10 days later making sure you spray any male flowers you see."

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*


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## haze2 (Apr 18, 2009)

Subscribed, Ill be following along.


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## cousinvenny (Apr 18, 2009)

Great Post Hobbes, Can't wait for the GHS to come up really interested on how those turn out. SSH looks like a great strain and will be watching closely to those results. Subscribed.

Venny


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## pinkus (Apr 18, 2009)

yep, subscribed. I haven't followed it lately but a while ago panhead had great results w/reverse 


think i'll search for that now 

hope you don't mind hobbes 

https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/139699-dutchmasters-reverse-study-hermies.html


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## bicycle racer (Apr 18, 2009)

hmmm maybe ill try reverse when i grow some fem seeds just to be on the safe side.


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## bicycle racer (Apr 18, 2009)

i have one issue with what youve wrote. in saying if a clone self pollinates it creates s-1 fem seeds but using pollen from 1 female clone and pollinating another stable female clone creates herms and not fems. i dont understand this logic as i myself and quite a few breeders do this all the time to make fem seed crosses that are no more prone to herming than self pollinated females. in fact alot of breeders say the opposite that self pollinated females are more prone to herming than fem crosses. anyways good work on this thread im interested.


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## Hobbes (Apr 19, 2009)

*i have one issue with what youve wrote.*


I don't want to come across as a presumed expert, I'm just an average grower having some fun experimenting and posting the results and my research. If I'm wrong about something please correct me, I'd rather be right than be right.


*in saying if a clone self pollinates it creates s-1 fem seeds *_[1]_* but using pollen from 1 female clone and pollinating another stable female clone creates herms*_[3]_* and not fems.*_[2]_**

_( this is how I understand it)_

_[1]_ So long as the clone is from an F1(etc) and not from a self pollinated parent, which would make a less stable S2.


_[2] a: _If the two female clones are from the same parent then the offspring seeds would be feminized. 


_b:_ If the hermie female clone was from an F1 mother from seed A, and the second stable female clone from an F1 mother from seed B (same strain), *as I understand*, the offspring would be an F2, non feminized. 


** I haven't come across any articles saying that using hermied pollen from one clone - on a clone from a mother from a different seed  would produce feminized seeds. I assumed that the hermie's pollen could only produce feminized seeds with clones from the same mother. I'll research this tonight.


_[3]_ You're suggesting a stable mother, and the hermie pollen donor hermied because of  poor genetics or inducement. If the mother is *another* stable female then the pollen donor must have been induced to hermie  so the genetics could still be good. It's the plants that hermie because of poor genetics that I don't feel should be used for breeding, but people like yourself who've been into breeding for awhile may be able to breed out the hermaphrodism.


If I don't understand the above please point out my errors.


 *i dont understand this logic as i myself and quite a few breeders do this all the time to make fem seed crosses that are no more prone to herming than self pollinated females.*


I've been following Rez, Subcool and Elite and getting an idea of the lengths they go to to stabilize a clone only line. The Sour Diesel IBL project is phenominal. I have to stand by my observation for the above average grower, but obviously not for people who are practicing and studying breeding. Breeding seems as far above growing kine bud as growing kine bud is above buying a dime bag of swag from the stoner at the mall.


*in fact alot of breeders say the opposite that self pollinated females are more prone to herming than fem crosses. anyways good work on this thread im interested. *


I see the logic in that  crossing a fem with a stable strain could breed out much of the hermaphrotism, while self breeding then cloning the weaker offspring from S1 seed creates less stable plants.


Thanks for the critic, any other help you can give would be appreciated. Anything that's bullshit in my response please point it out. I'll do some research later tonight and maybe update my understanding on some of these issues.


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## SpruceZeus (Apr 19, 2009)

cocoxxx said:


> i read on the greenhouse website that there feminised seeds are 100% female and 100% hermie free, is this 100% bullshit???


I've grown Greenhouse's The Church, Arjans ultra haze #1 and Cheese from feminized seeds. I havn't had a single pollen sac from any of them, and i'm already onto the 4th generation of clones from the AUH#1.

Honestly, and i can say this after alot of research, as well as the experience of having grown their genetics. Greenhouse is a great breeder. There is alot of Arjan bashing around these forums, and in my experience, its mostly unfounded. They have a state of the art breeding facility that puts out Cup winner after Cup winner (some say they buy the cup...)
I'll be the first to admit that their Haze strains are full of retards. (as a matter of fact, my AUH#1 has the stupidest growth i've ever seen, and takes 15-16 weeks to flower) BUT, even the retarded strains are _great_ weed. 





Look at this stupid leaf. It looks like its parents took lsd. My AUH is full of them. 





Right around 9 weeks when you're imagining the hairs will start receding and bud will start filling out, she starts a secent stretch, Stupid stupid growth.
But still, shes never spat out so much as nanner one. Also its probably the best high i've ever had from marijuana. Euphoric, soaring high that pumps you full of energy and has no comedown to speak of.
Anyhow i'm getting off topic a little bit.

When i started growing, my dad gave me about 75 seeds he got from a bag of weed.
These turned out to be Feminized seeds with about 15% of the plants being genetic 50/50 hermies. Of the females that remain, i've never had any staminate growth. As a matter of fact, i've let plants go well past ripe in hopes of harvesting a few late appearing pollen sacs. Unfortunately they just don't seem to want to give me any. I'd imagine light stress would probably do it, but i'd rather not herm them just to say that i did.





I dont know if anyone else has had the pleasure of getting feminized bagseed, but now i'm at the point where i wish i had a male, i'd hate to lose these genes with a cloning fuckup or something.

Anyhow, long story short, I Highly reccomend GH feminized seeds.
Also if anyone has a link to a good tutorial on how to make feminized seeds i would gladly drop some rep and some good karma.

sorry for the rambling and slightly off topic post.


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## cocoxxx (Apr 19, 2009)

im on my 2nd grow with white rhino (feminised) and havnt had a hermie yet


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## guudbud (Apr 19, 2009)

Iv'e found that I get a high ratio of hermies with fem seeds and once in a blue moon I get one from regular seed , I dunno maybe it's just me?


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## Hobbes (Apr 19, 2009)

*"dont know if anyone else has had the pleasure of getting feminized bagseed, but now i'm at the point where i wish i had a male, i'd hate to lose these genes with a cloning fuckup or something."*

Me, my first grow, seeds a friend had swiped from his father's drawer 15 years earlier, incredible clear euphoric sativa high, didn't know how to clone, lost the genes.

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## bicycle racer (Apr 19, 2009)

i guess what im saying is if i were to make a pre98 bubba female clone produce pollen with c.s. or g.a. not stress and then selfed it the resulting seeds would have a higher herm ratio than say if that same bubba pollen was used to pollinate an entirely unrelated female clone like blue dream creating hybrid vigor and more stress resistance. those crossed fem seed would have less herm percentages than the selfed pre98 bubba would. does that make sense? the funny thing is many breeders feel one way or the other about this i think it should not matter if the fems are crosses or s-1's what matters is the level of stress resistant traits of the plants used to make and receive the fem pollen. i think the key with fem seeds is to pre stress a test clone of the strain you want to use to make fem seeds. if it herms from stress easily it is not a good candidate for chemically producing fem pollen as the offspring will herm easily also. if your making fem crosses the other strain would also need to be stress tested( llight poisoniong etc..) for stability before using in a cross. i think if one is careful with picking strong stress resistant candidates for fem seeds selfing or crosses should both be relatively herm free.


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## bicycle racer (Apr 19, 2009)

ive grown bagseed fems i grew some great abusive og kush and master og kush from herm grows but when i grew them they showed no bannanas lucky me. i sometimes buy seeded bud from dispensaries of good strains as i know there herm/fem seeds in doing this i have been lucky but ive heard horror stories as well.


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## Hobbes (Apr 27, 2009)

The Red Diesel mother in pro mix and clone in RDWC are both still producing bananas. I've given them their 3rd dose of Reverse tonight, it slows the banana growth for a few days but I've never had a plant where Reverse reversed the hermaphrodism. 

I put another RD clone in RDWC last week, at 5". I sprayed both the leaves and the roots with Reverse before putting it in 12/12 and again for a second time tonight. I'm not sure if it'll help with hermieing but I think it's stunting the growth of the clone, making it branch out and not grow tall. That was eloquent.

So far Barney's Red Diesel has been the worst hermier of the 3 fem strains (RD, Blueberry, Strawberry Cough)

The last two Strawberry Cough clones were harvested virtually banana free throughout flower, very heartening. 

DP Blueberry fem kept producing banans until I chopped it, slower rate than Barney's Red Diesel fem.

All of the regular control strains are growing perfectly - not a banana to be seen (I'd be ashamed), yield is good, lots of trichs, ripening regularly. Bubblegum (Serious) is one beautiful plant, amazing production of top tier bud, bag appeal through the roof.

I'll be putting the Dutch Passion Taiga fem autoflower into 12/12 this week, the DP Flo fem will be another week or two. Big Bang (Greenhouse) is on deck to be germed next, then Blue Moonshine (Dutch Passion). I'll alternate the Greenhouse strains with the others - see if Greenhouse is herm free (as talked about online) while the other breeder's strains hermie.

Anyone have ideas I can try on the next RD clone? It'll be my hermie control strain, I'll assume the clones will hermie if I don't interviene. 

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## GrnMtnGrowr (Apr 30, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> I sprayed my feminized seed plants with Reverse again last night - after the first dose of Reverse last week both the Red Diesel and Blueberry's bananas dried up for a few days, then came back at a slower rate - a half dozen to a dozen each day. I picked the bananas every day this week before re-spraying last night, there were no bananas grown back this morning.
> 
> The Red Diesel clone in RDWC had only a couple of bananas for the whole week, amazing difference from it's mother in Pro Mix. The two Strawberry Cough clones in RDWC have produced no bananas 8 weeks into flower, while all other SC clones and the SC mother have hermied in past grows.
> 
> ...


 You keep saying "bananas" don't you mean pods? From everything I have experienced bananas are formed by a female when it is grown past it's peak ripeness and the pollen in them would be the stuff to use to make TRUE feminized seeds,..... But I didn't know hermies would put out bananas especially in their earlier growth..........?


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## Hobbes (Apr 30, 2009)

I've had my share of F2 hermies over the years and I've never seen a pod - like those seen on male plants. The bananas grow individually or in bunches inside the buds, turn yellow and curve like a banana.

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## bicycle racer (May 1, 2009)

i have seen pods and female pistils on a bagseed grow of unknown strain i think you could call that a true genetic herm the seeds were standard male females not femmed. otherwise i mostly just see a few bannanas late in flower on some clones never seen full pods on a true female.


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## Bodders (May 1, 2009)

bicycle racer said:


> i have seen pods and female pistils on a bagseed grow of unknown strain i think you could call that a true genetic herm the seeds were standard male females not femmed. otherwise i mostly just see a few bannanas late in flower on some clones never seen full pods on a true female.


 Heres my experience with HERMIES i have had BANANAS from REGULAR seeds when leaving the buds to ripen thres been pollen inside these sacks?.My argument is this they all seem to do this its their own NATURES way of surviving which you all probable know this when theres only females somehow they can tell so they do this to carry on there life cycle.To me Bananas are a part of ripening its When you flip the clock to 12/12 and when the buds are developing at that stage you should be able to tell or see male/female flowers together if they are Hermie's.Honest if i dont see them at the begging of the first 3weeks of 12/12 then to me they are ok unless they are excessive(heavily seede with bananas) toward the end are they not wanted.I atm am on some Crimea Blue from BARNEY'S and they all seem all female so far so good and i no i will probaly pick if i have to but i dont mind this at all.Like someone said this is good for someone like myself who cannot clone or does not have a 18/6 grow.And its a great way if you want to try plenty of strains.But however if i had the facilities of having a good major grow i would be patient and deal with regular.Female seeds make it alot easyer for the ruky grower who likes to taste many strains.But ya pro's go with regular all the way well i would anyway.kiss-ass


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## raiderman (May 1, 2009)

Bodders said:


> Heres my experience with HERMIES i have had BANANAS from REGULAR seeds when leaving the buds to ripen thres been pollen inside these sacks?.My argument is this they all seem to do this its their own NATURES way of surviving which you all probable know this when theres only females somehow they can tell so they do this to carry on there life cycle.To me Bananas are a part of ripening its When you flip the clock to 12/12 and when the buds are developing at that stage you should be able to tell or see male/female flowers together if they are Hermie's.Honest if i dont see them at the begging of the first 3weeks of 12/12 then to me they are ok unless they are excessive(heavily seede with bananas) toward the end are they not wanted.I atm am on some Crimea Blue from BARNEY'S and they all seem all female so far so good and i no i will probaly pick if i have to but i dont mind this at all.Like someone said this is good for someone like myself who cannot clone or does not have a 18/6 grow.And its a great way if you want to try plenty of strains.But however if i had the facilities of having a good major grow i would be patient and deal with regular.Female seeds make it alot easyer for the ruky grower who likes to taste many strains.But ya pro's go with regular all the way well i would anyway.kiss-ass


finishd a crop ofblue moonshine feminized seeds and hermiedin the 4 to 6 week. picked off the male bananas through off. got 17 seeds total out of 7 plants. 14 dry oz.real purple in my avitar.go with big buddah ,flying dutchman, paradise seeds,Dna genetics feminized,to nbame a few. . dutch passion hermied on me twice in a row wen under optimum conditions,, the other was orange bud.


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## Hobbes (May 1, 2009)

raiderman have you done any Greenhouse strains? Big Bang? I'm doing a fem BB next and hope it's not as bad as Barney's RD.

I gave my 6 late flowering plants a full dose of Kool Bloom and a half dose of Cha Ching, with no other nutes - (except supplements Hygrozyme, Liquid Karma and Dark Energy - which I feed every watering) - the Red Diesel mother in pro mix popped bananas everywhere, one of the Bubblegum late in it's 9th week popped up 3 bananas, the other Bubblegum was clean and the two Big Laughing (9 weeks) were rock solid as expected. The 2 BL look like someone vandelized them with a bag of iceing sugar.

The Red Diesel clone 2 weeks into 12/12 in RDWC is 10" from a start of 5", very healthy but no buds starting yet. The Bubblegum is 12" from 5". The two Kali Mist clones flowered the week before at 5" are 27" and 30" with bud sites at each node. 

I put 2 Kali Mist and 1 Bubblegum in flower at 4", and 1 Kali Mist at 2" tonight to see if I can get a more manageble height.


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## dannyking (May 3, 2009)

I've just pulled 2 hermies and 3 full blown males from my greenhouse grow. 
Himilaya gold gave me the males and Great White Shark gave me hermies.


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## raiderman (May 3, 2009)

dannyking said:


> I've just pulled 2 hermies and 3 full blown males from my greenhouse grow.
> Himilaya gold gave me the males and Great White Shark gave me hermies.


 yea dutch passion and greenhouse seeds suk wen it comes to feminized.youd thgink theyd be up with the bes,, hell tryin to pass hermie seeds to us,assholes.kiss-ass


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## Bodders (May 5, 2009)

Sorry have i miss understood you MALES


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## bicycle racer (May 5, 2009)

thats odd that the breeders fems herm out ive grown many fem that were from hermed bagseeds with no problems at all go figure.


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## Hobbes (May 5, 2009)

I did too b.r. My first grow was from bag seed a friend had swiped from his father's stash about 12 years before. Out of about a hundred seeds 12 germed and were all female, a sativa I now know, and not a banana nor seed produced by any of the 12. 

I've done 3 feminized strains by established breeders and every plant hermied.

Go figure.

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## Hobbes (May 5, 2009)

The bananas on the Red Diesel have virtually dried up - a half dozen a day at most - and I feed with Kool Bloom which stresses the plant into producing more resin (supposedly) which produced massive banana population last feeding. Bubblegum and Big Laughing rock solid as expected.

So, either the Reverse is working or towards the end of a hermie's life it stops producing bananas. Or something else.

I've been out of OverDive and my order came in the mail yesterday - I've put the RDWC Big Laughing in a bath of it and I'm going to soak all of the dirt plants tomorrow when the pots dry up. See if OD has any effect on the Red Diesel hermie that it doesn't have on the good strains. (ZING!)

.


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## ONEeyedWILLY444 (May 5, 2009)

i have two greenhouse white widow both hermie one is not too bad but the other was fuckin riddled with bananas. and my last grow i had three himalayan gold thats genetics are totally all over the place when they where flowering looked like three different strains one of which had bananas on the main bud. greenhouse fuck with there shit too much. and i really did,nt like big bang at all. that said i do think greenhouse have some amazing strains shame about the fuck ups


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## bicycle racer (May 5, 2009)

pre stress testing of females considered for breeding to check for herm tendencies is the key. if a strain resists herming from light stress fert stress temp stress etc.. it is a good candidate for making fem pollen through chemical means. i think some 'pro breeders' dont do things properly. i myself plan on starting a seed business when i do i will make proper fem seeds and regular seeds of clone only genetics.


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## Hobbes (May 5, 2009)

*"i will make proper fem seeds and regular seeds of clone only genetics."*

I'd like to RSVP for your first commercial offering, hats off to you!

.


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## raiderman (May 5, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> *"i will make proper fem seeds and regular seeds of clone only genetics."*
> 
> I'd like to RSVP for your first commercial offering, hats off to you!
> 
> .


would like to let you know there are some good female seed breeders. big buddah. did 16 in 2 gal. container, no hermie pure female .flying dutchman, paradise seeds. thier good, but dutch passion and greenhouse seeds females suk big ones,lol.kiss-ass


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## ONEeyedWILLY444 (May 6, 2009)

bicycle racer said:


> . i myself plan on starting a seed business when i do i will make proper fem seeds and regular seeds of clone only genetics.


if you can do it go for it. if i could open a seed company i would sell nothing but my own breeds, not that i have any too date but plan on breeding in the future.


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## bicycle racer (May 6, 2009)

thanks it will be awhile as my problem now is space. currently i have some og clones a tahoe og and hells angel og of good stock from reputable breeders im making some ionized silver and am going to make some s-1's and hells angel og/tahoe og fem crosses with hopefully a bit more vigor than either parent. i going to preserve some pollen also for use on some other fem crosses i made using the rodelization technique they include pre98 bubba kush/larry og and pre98 bubba kush/blue dream both of those crosses are sprouts currently. all seeds germed perfectly though so thats good i still have to test there resilience to stress etc... very tedious and time consuming all plants i use are tried and true clone only plants. i may send out some early batches of seeds to med card carrying friends to test grow to speed up the whole process.


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## ONEeyedWILLY444 (May 7, 2009)

raiderman said:


> would like to let you know there are some good female seed breeders. big buddah. did 16 in 2 gal. container, no hermie pure female .flying dutchman, paradise seeds. thier good, but dutch passion and greenhouse seeds females suk big ones,lol.


i had three big buddha blue cheese one i topped and was fine the over two riddled with bananas so i myself dont rate them. plus i had belladonna from paradise and half of what i grew was hermie. companys that did,nt hermie where white label seeds, world of seeds (landraces), and nirvana.



bicycle racer said:


> thanks it will be awhile as my problem now is space. currently i have some og clones a tahoe og and hells angel og of good stock from reputable breeders im making some ionized silver and am going to make some s-1's and hells angel og/tahoe og fem crosses with hopefully a bit more vigor than either parent. i going to preserve some pollen also for use on some other fem crosses i made using the rodelization technique they include pre98 bubba kush/larry og and pre98 bubba kush/blue dream both of those crosses are sprouts currently. all seeds germed perfectly though so thats good i still have to test there resilience to stress etc... very tedious and time consuming all plants i use are tried and true clone only plants. i may send out some early batches of seeds to med card carrying friends to test grow to speed up the whole process.


sounds good i wish i could get my own breed into a seedbank so the world can taste my shit.me and a friend are looking for some cheese clones so we can cross it with something we already have, too make our own strain hoping its gonna be a killer.


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## kremnon (May 7, 2009)

the reason ur gettin bannanas on ur girls is not because theur hermie its a light leak or something. u cant turn a plant hermie it is or it isn't. u can light poison a plant to produce bananas but that does'nt make it a hermie


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## kremnon (May 7, 2009)

RODELIZATION: SOMA'S WAY TO FEMALE SEEDS

Heres an easy, environmentally friendly method for breeding feminized seeds.

by SOMA
Wed, Jul 30, 2003 12:00 am
more: grow articles, soma, breeding, seed company, strains


Story by Soma

Creating feminized cannabis seeds is an art. Just like art, there are a few different methods of application. I have written about some of my different methods of making seeds in previous HIGH TIMES articles. I have used gibberellic acid, pH stress, light stress, and fertilizer stress to force my female plants to make seeds. All of these methods are harsh on the plants, and some, like the gibberellic acid, are not organic. In my search for cleaner, more earth-friendly ways of working with the cannabis plant, I have found a new way to make feminized seeds. Feminized seeds occur as a result of stress, rather than genetics. All cannabis plants can and will make male flowers under stress. Certain strains like a higher pH, some a lower one. Some like a lot of food, some like much less. There is quite a lot of variety in marijuana genetics, and you cant treat every plant the same way.

It takes many harvests before you really get to know a particular strain. Just like getting to know human friends, it takes time. I have grown the same strains for close to a decade, and am truly getting to know every nuance the different plants exhibit. I can recognize them from a distance. I must say that I get a lot of help from my friends, both in making seeds and in learning new and better ways of working with this sacred plant.

I named this new method "Rodelization," after a friend who helped me realize and make use of this way of creating female seeds. After growing crop after crop of the same plants in the same conditions, I noticed that if I flowered the plants 10-14 days longer than usual, they would develop male "bananas." A male banana is a very slight male flower on a female marijuana plant that is formed because of stress. Usually they do not let out any pollen early enough to make seeds, but they sometimes do. They are a built-in safety factor so that in case of severe conditions, the plant can make sure the species is furthered.

To me, a male banana is quite a beautiful thing. It has the potential of making all female seeds. Many growers out there have male-banana phobia. They see one and have heart palpitations, they want to cut down the entire crop, or at the very least take tweezers and pluck the little yellow emergency devices out. I call them "emergency devices" because they emerge at times of stress.

In the Rodelization method, the male banana is very valuable. After growing your female plants 10-14 days longer than usual, hang them up to dry, then carefully take them off the drying lines and inspect for bananas. Each and every banana should be removed, and placed in a small bag labeled very accurately. These sealed bags can be placed in the fridge for one or two months and still remain potent.

For the next phase, you need to have a separate crop thats already 2 1/2 weeks into flowering. Take your sealed bags of pollen out of the fridge, and proceed to impregnate your new crop of females. To do this, you must first match the female plant and the pollen from the same strain in the previous crop. Shut all the fans in the growroom down. Then take a very fine paintbrush, dip it in the bag of pollen, and paint it on the female flower. Do this to each different strain you have growing together. I have done it with up to 10 different kinds in the same room with great success.

I use the lower flowers to make seeds, leaving the top colas seedless for smoking. This method takes time (two crops), but is completely organic, and lets you have great-quality smoke at the same time you make your female seeds. If youre one of those growers whos never grown seeds for fear of not having something good to smoke, you will love this method.

You can also use this pollen to make new female crosses by cross-pollinating. The older females with the male bananas can be brought into the room with the younger, unpollinated females after they are three weeks into flowering. Turn all of the circulation fans on high, and the little bits of pollen will proceed to make it around the room. Do this for several days. Six to seven weeks later, you will have ripe 100% feminized seeds; not nearly as many as a male plant would make, but enough to start over somewhere else with the same genetics.

As a farmer who has been forced to move his genetics far away from where they started, I know very well the value of seeds. My friend Adam from ThSeeds in Amsterdam has a motto that I love to borrow these days: Drop seeds not bombs.


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## raiderman (May 7, 2009)

kremnon said:


> the reason ur gettin bannanas on ur girls is not because theur hermie its a light leak or something. u cant turn a plant hermie it is or it isn't. u can light poison a plant to produce bananas but that does'nt make it a hermie


 i'm sure because i jus did 16 big buddah b. cheese and all mine were very doin consistant,no hermies,,excellent weed.doin another 16 presently.


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## ONEeyedWILLY444 (May 10, 2009)

kremnon said:


> the reason ur gettin bannanas on ur girls is not because theur hermie its a light leak or something. u cant turn a plant hermie it is or it isn't. u can light poison a plant to produce bananas but that does'nt make it a hermie[/quote
> 
> i have grown 10 crops in my grow room too date only three of which had a couple of hermies in. all where grown in the same way with same light and nutes and everything.
> p.h is kept at 6.5
> ...


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## mared juwan (May 11, 2009)

Hey Hobbes, I just planted all 5 seeds from a Green House fem mix pack. It was the Indica Mix H (GreatWhiteShark, Lemon Skunk, White Rhino, Trainwreck, Cheese). I'll report back in a couple months with the results.


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## Junker (May 24, 2009)

If its a bad thing for reviving a topic that hasn't been posted in for 2 weeks, my bad...My first post here as well.

I've been looking at Nirvana's feminized strains, AK-48, Aurora Indica, and Papaya to be specific. This will be my first time ordering seeds, as I'm tired of growing bagseed to save a few bucks. Basically I just wanna know if anyone has experience with Nirvana's female seeds, mainly if they went hermie, or not. Many Thanks.


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## Hobbes (May 24, 2009)

*"If its a bad thing for reviving a topic that hasn't been posted in for 2 weeks, my bad"*

No worries Junker, I sometimes post a response in a thread and afterwards see that the last post was 2 years old. I know nothing about Nirvana fem seeds but someone should be along who's grown plants from them.

.

*"I just planted all 5 seeds from a Green House fem mix pack. It was the Indica Mix H (GreatWhiteShark, Lemon Skunk, White Rhino, Trainwreck, Cheese). I'll report back in a couple months with the results."*

Excellent! I've got Trainwreck out of that mix, the White Rhino wasn't in stock when I ordered or I would have gotten that strain too.

Let's keep up posting about Greenhouse, they're claiming 0 (yes *Zero*) hermies. I'm going to germ a Greenhouse strain as soon as my Super Strawberry Diesel and Flo go into flower. I believe I'll go with Trainwreck - I'd like a strain that'll send me spinning - My Greenhouse fem seeds: Alaskan Ice; Arjan's Haze #3; Big Bang; Super Silver Haze and Trainwreck.

.

The Barney's Red Diesel stopped producing bananas completely since I harvested the top 1/2. Not a single banana. I'm letting the bottom part of the plant fill out, RD isn't a great multiharvester like Bubblegum but it has filled out some.

The Barney's RD clone in the Aquamist is producing flowers, to young yet to see bananas but I've sprayed it with Reverse 3 times during transation (including the roots) and will hit it again tonight.

The two Bubblegum and the two Big Laughing haven't had a banana, very stable. All three full size Kali Mist are perfect.

.


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## Reeny (May 24, 2009)

Have two Lemon Skunk from Greenhouse going atm. One is close to harvest (9Weeks) and the other has about two more weeks. No signs of bananas on either on. Easy grow and amazing smelling plants. Smoke report to follow in a few weeks .

Also have a White Rhino in flowering with about 2 1/2 weeks till harvest. No problems with that one either. Was a slow starter for me but sure looks pretty now.


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## raiderman (May 24, 2009)

Reeny said:


> Have two Lemon Skunk from Greenhouse going atm. One is close to harvest (9Weeks) and the other has about two more weeks. No signs of bananas on either on. Easy grow and amazing smelling plants. Smoke report to follow in a few weeks .
> 
> Also have a White Rhino in flowering with about 2 1/2 weeks till harvest. No problems with that one either. Was a slow starter for me but sure looks pretty now.


thats wat i wanna hear.i want feminized seeds jus want good stable hybrids .got 15 femiized b.cheese big buddah , second grow,unbelievable for 50.00 for 10 beans,well underrated plant.doin a few pacs of querkle nex.grow on bro.update a pic if you would.


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## bellairedude (May 25, 2009)

Ive got greenhouse white shark, rhino and trainwreck goin. Woke up this morning and noticed the wreck has balls. I dont even see pistols yet it might be a straight up male. 100% bullshit.


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## raiderman (May 25, 2009)

bellairedude said:


> Ive got greenhouse white shark, rhino and trainwreck goin. Woke up this morning and noticed the wreck has balls. I dont even see pistols yet it might be a straight up male. 100% bullshit.


 mine hermied couple yrs ago or so.so i immediately changed seed breeders, never looked bak,,sorry about that.i'm doin 15 bluecheese fem,las grow perfect all 16 ,, they are showing hairs like a eg fem. big buddah is the way to go.also threads on flying dutchman are excellent as well,, i have two pacs of blueberry skunk fem.but i'm goin bak to reg seeds to be safe though.


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## Hobbes (May 25, 2009)

That's tough bellairedude. I've only had balls on a hermie once, a Blueberry from an F2 producer. It's always bananas groing out of the buds now.

.


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## Hobbes (May 25, 2009)

raiderman I've got Big Bhudda Cheese (fem) - have you grown this one? Glad to hear they have good beans, I'm looking forward to this Cheese.

.

bongsmile


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## raiderman (May 25, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> raiderman I've got Big Bhudda Cheese (fem) - have you grown this one? Glad to hear they have good beans, I'm looking forward to this Cheese.
> 
> .
> 
> bongsmile


 not the cheese,but the blue cheese,yea every plant on las grow beautiful,no real runts,, bes deal for 50.00 for 10 good stable beans and good yielder.weed is very strong.sweet to taste.


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## bicycle racer (May 25, 2009)

a rabbit with pancakes on its head lol the things us smokers do with animals hilarious.


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## mared juwan (May 25, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> *"I just planted all 5 seeds from a Green House fem mix pack. It was the Indica Mix H (GreatWhiteShark, Lemon Skunk, White Rhino, Trainwreck, Cheese). I'll report back in a couple months with the results."*
> 
> Excellent! I've got Trainwreck out of that mix, the White Rhino wasn't in stock when I ordered or I would have gotten that strain too.
> 
> Let's keep up posting about Greenhouse, they're claiming 0 (yes *Zero*) hermies. I'm going to germ a Greenhouse strain as soon as my Super Strawberry Diesel and Flo go into flower. I believe I'll go with Trainwreck - I'd like a strain that'll send me spinning - My Greenhouse fem seeds: Alaskan Ice; Arjan's Haze #3; Big Bang; Super Silver Haze and Trainwreck.


Yea I don't know what to believe when it comes to seeds and strains anymore. 1/2 people say Green House is great, very reputable breeder of the finest strains. The other 1/2 say they are shit, don't ever buy. I guess like with most of the rest of the stuff you need to know about growing you just have to figure it out for yourself. My GH seedlings did start off kind of slow but they are all doing great now. Still in veg but growing fast. 

I also got the GH "Sativa Mix" which is basically all of their hazes. Since we're evaluating Green House I should mention that I originally germed six beans. All 5 from the Mix H and the Super Silver Haze from the Sativa Mix. The Mix H beans all cracked in 1 day and had 1/2 inch tap roots by day 2. The SSH took 3 days to crack even though it was the biggest seed by far. Then its tap root grew very slowly and it wasn't until 6 days after the beginning of germ that I finally planted it. It never made it out of the ground. So that sucked because I was probably most interested in the SSH out of all of them.


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## ONEeyedWILLY444 (May 26, 2009)

it piss,s you off. you pay good money for good seeds and get complete and utter shit. i got 2 big buddha blue cheese that are hermie and had too cut one down early. i would,nt trust greenhouse anymore they are a set of cum drinking queers and over the past three years there genetics/seeds have become fucked. every other guy tells how there greenhouse seeds grow has gone tits up due too hermies/males. all greenhouse seeds do is say they are the best so people think they are (theyre not).
and i hate the way that arjan names all them strains after himself as if he is the highest athourity on weed. i would never buy fuck all with that pricks name on it. 

sorry if i am sounding a bit too angry but there is a reason for this. you see i was a devoted greenhouse seeds grower then one year i get a couple of bananas popping out of my himalayan gold, i thought nothing of it ripped the few off and carried on. then the next grow of himalayan my three plants had three different pheno,s. one was so bad that after 12 weeks of flowering it was mostly leaf and hardly any bud(what the fuck). then next grow was big bang bought ten seeds only 6 cracked no hermies but a serious loss considering my seeds where fem. then finally my latest crop greenhouse white widow FULL OF BANANAS AND SEEDS WTF. so thats it for me i gave them many chances.


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## raiderman (May 26, 2009)

ONEeyedWILLY444 said:


> it piss,s you off. you pay good money for good seeds and get complete and utter shit. i got 2 big buddha blue cheese that are hermie and had too cut one down early. i would,nt trust greenhouse anymore they are a set of cum drinking queers and over the past three years there genetics/seeds have become fucked. every other guy tells how there greenhouse seeds grow has gone tits up due too hermies/males. all greenhouse seeds do is say they are the best so people think they are (theyre not).
> and i hate the way that arjan names all them strains after himself as if he is the highest athourity on weed. i would never buy fuck all with that pricks name on it.
> 
> sorry if i am sounding a bit too angry but there is a reason for this. you see i was a devoted greenhouse seeds grower then one year i get a couple of bananas popping out of my himalayan gold, i thought nothing of it ripped the few off and carried on. then the next grow of himalayan my three plants had three different pheno,s. one was so bad that after 12 weeks of flowering it was mostly leaf and hardly any bud(what the fuck). then next grow was big bang bought ten seeds only 6 cracked no hermies but a serious loss considering my seeds where fem. then finally my latest crop greenhouse white widow FULL OF BANANAS AND SEEDS WTF. so thats it for me i gave them many chances.


my las big buddah did perfect las time,i'm doin it again,will post if it happens...i'm jus stayin reg. seeds.. jus ordered bluemoonshine again amazing plant..105. for ten beans at rhino seeds and the y charged my cc only 170' instead of 225. w/ ship. thats the strain.beautiful plant. nug in my avitar is moonshine,lter.


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## Hedgehunter (May 26, 2009)

i can confirm about 30% hermie rate on 20 greenhouse fem BIGBANG , small amounts of seeds were found, not happy !!!!!!!!


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## raiderman (May 26, 2009)

Hedgehunter said:


> i can confirm about 30% hermie rate on 20 greenhouse fem BIGBANG , small amounts of seeds were found, not happy !!!!!!!!


 yea its all about reg. seeds for me now on.. theres a simple way. i put mine in 5 inch containers,at 3 weex start flowering, wen sex is determined put in the bigger container,put under 24 hr light to put bak in veg or keep flowering them the yield will be still nice.i sur hope my b.c. dont fag out on me,,lol,i think i'm gonna get stoned.


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## Cheech Wizard (May 26, 2009)

I came home last night and my 3 ft tall Skywalker was a full-blown tranny! It was gross, within one day all these hermie flowers formed all over it. No light leaks or anything, Im assuming it was just because of the fem seeds... Never happened with any of my other fem seeds tho...


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## raiderman (May 26, 2009)

Cheech Wizard said:


> I came home last night and my 3 ft tall Skywalker was a full-blown tranny! It was gross, within one day all these hermie flowers formed all over it. No light leaks or anything, Im assuming it was just because of the fem seeds... Never happened with any of my other fem seeds tho...


 omg dont tell me you bot DP fem. skywalker,the horror the horror.lol.my orange bud and bluemoonshine did. and i picked them off,not throwin my shit away,, somebody is jus gonna hava few seeds in thier bag,lol,peace.


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## Dutch1976 (May 27, 2009)

Over here we only fuck with fem seeds. Mostly Dutch Passion and Sensi Seed fems. We've pushed literally 100's of fem'd seeds thru flowering and have never seen a hermie. But when I sign on to this website everyone and they mammas are somehow growing hermies.....strange.


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## raiderman (May 27, 2009)

Dutch1976 said:


> Over here we only fuck with fem seeds. Mostly Dutch Passion and Sensi Seed fems. We've pushed literally 100's of fem'd seeds thru flowering and have never seen a hermie. But when I sign on to this website everyone and they mammas are somehow growing hermies.....strange.


 lol..i also think environment may play a role..i got hermies twice ina row off dutch passion. never stressed.


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## Hobbes (May 27, 2009)

*"But when I sign on to this website everyone and they mammas are somehow growing hermies.....strange."*

You guys may be better growers than a lot of us Dutch, I've been growing for years but I'm sure I'm still stressing the plants somehow.

We're trying to find the stress factors that are causing hermies in our gardens, and rate the strains and breeders on tendencies to hermie, how much stress is required to hermie. You might be able to walk into my garden and say "Oh yeah, that's a stressor, change that, move this up, use this ph, ..." and problem solved. But in most countries help from a friend or mentor isn't feasable. 

.

*Ask Ed*

_Plants turn hermaphroditic in two ways. Some plants are programmed genetically as hermaphrodites. These plants will produce male flowers on female plants no matter what environmental situations they face. Other plants are induced to grow male flowers under stress conditions. 
_

_Some plants may be more genetically predisposed to hermaphrodite under stress, but all plants may exhibit male flowers as a sign of stress created by growing conditions. This hermaphroditism is not genetic and does not affect the plant's progeny. Sometimes plants that aren't hermaphroditic outdoors will grow male flowers when grown indoors as a stress response. Stresses can include lighting regimen irregularities, low light conditions or response to hormones. _
_




_


_If a genetic hermaphrodite is crossed to a non-hermaphroditic female, about half of the resulting plants will be hermaphroditic. If the hermaphroditism was caused by environmental factors, then none, some or all of the progeny will exhibit male flowers depending on whether the plants have inherited a tendency towards hermaphroditism under stress conditions and whether the plants face those conditions._

_If you have only a few plants and are willing to spend the time making daily inspections for male flowers, you can produce a sinsemilla crop. It's important to remove the male flowers before they open and release pollen._


_._


_
_


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## Reeny (May 27, 2009)

To add information. I have a White Rhino from Greenhouse as well. Fem seeds. Its looking great huge main cola and no signs of bananas. What a pretty indica plant this is. 

In my garden presently I have several Greenhouse Fem seeds going. Two Lemon Skunk, White Rhino and Hawaiian Snow. They are in various stages of flower between week 5 and week 9. I have seen no signs of Hermis and will be harvesting my first Lemon Skunk in a few days. 

I am not sure if I am lucky, if it's the strains or the enviroment but I have had one hermi in my last grow and it was bag seed. I do not know the history behind it so it could have been from a hermi, the smoke was decent for bag seed but thought I would give it a try. It show signs of hermi at the very end of the flowering at about week 7.

Hope this information helps. I can only tell you my experiences and so far I have had no issues with Greenhouse. My next purchase will be Kali Mist from Serious seeds because I have heard such good things about it. It is not because I have had issues with Greenhouse.


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## Stussy (May 27, 2009)

Awesome thread guys, helped me alot, CHEERS


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## Cheech Wizard (May 27, 2009)

My skywalker fem turned into a full blown transexual within one day. It was bizarre... little hermie flowers everywhere. I have been keeping a close eye on my others and they seem fine... Raiderman, have you noticed a difference between the fem ducth passion blue moonshine and the regular DP Blue Moonshine? In terms of quality of finished product?


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## raiderman (May 27, 2009)

yes did since you menton it..these were taller than avg..my other crops were always more short fat.i got 17 hermie seeds out of it,,may do


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## NewHiddenGrower (May 27, 2009)

Im on the 2nd day of flowering should i spray reverse on my plants?


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## pinkus (May 27, 2009)

raiderman said:


> yes did since you menton it..these were taller than avg..my other crops were always more short fat. i'm seeding a branch this round,, and doin crosses. i done settup a area for


I see you're having posting problems too...it's not just my connect...or yours 
I'll just have to take hits while it's loading


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## raiderman (May 27, 2009)

pinkus said:


> I see you're having posting problems too...it's not just my connect...or yours
> I'll just have to take hits while it's loading


 lol,and i'm real impatint ,very stoned rite now, aint heppin my patience.


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## pinkus (May 27, 2009)

raiderman said:


> lol,and i'm real impatint ,very stoned rite now, aint heppin my patience.



ain't heppen mine niether 

well, maybe a little...Hey RaiderMan, you in tejas?


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## Hobbes (May 27, 2009)

*"Im on the 2nd day of flowering should i spray reverse on my plants?"*

NHG are you growing from seeds you think will produce hermies? Or from the clones of a hermie mother?

*If so* you can try spraying once a week as soon as you'd like - I sprayed my clone the first day of 12/12 and each weak since. Its growth wasn't stunted and it's fine about 4 weeks into flower, buds forming, no bananas. 

*If not* - don't fix what isn't broken. I don't know what Reverse would do to a stable plant, but at the very least it would be expensive and unnecessary. If the plant hermies from stress hit it with Reverse once a week, as soon as you see the first banana. My excessive hermie from an S1 took 3 applications to stop producing bananas - but I caught it late, if you catch it when the bananas first start it may take less Reverse to stop the hermieing. 

.


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## raiderman (May 27, 2009)

pinkus said:


> ain't heppen mine niether
> 
> well, maybe a little...Hey RaiderMan, you in tejas?


 yea, i think so.lol. las time i went outside i was. +  = = Now i'm better,lol.gro on bro.


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## pinkus (May 27, 2009)

raiderman said:


> yea, i think so.lol. las time i went outside i was. +  = = Now i'm better,lol.gro on bro.


If I just found major hermis I'd be frustrated too. All I can do is +rep and smoke a bowl....and go check for bananas.


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## raiderman (May 27, 2009)

pinkus said:


> If I just found major hermis I'd be frustrated too. All I can do is +rep and smoke a bowl....and go check for bananas.


 i pull mine off, its a threat wen they open.always chek under neath the plant under the lowes branches as well.theyll sneak up on ya and seed your stuff. i would never ditch any plant . jus make daily walks in the garden..i dont have any hermie not as of yet anyway;first hairs showin.BB i'm growin gonna be some real nasty stuff.snowcap purple buds.


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## bicycle racer (May 28, 2009)

shit im always trying to get bannanas to grow on good females. i light stressed a deep chunk/strawberry cough and a jack the ripper and there producing some pollen it took a while though there almost at harvest im going to cross to tahoe og kush clone hopefully the resulting fems will be more or less herm free.its one thing to buy seeds and make a mistake that causes stress its another when you do everything right and it herms on you that sucks. i have heard of reverse i have not used it as i have not had issues but i wonder what the active ingredient is.


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## Hobbes (May 28, 2009)

bicycle racer have you tried leaving part of your plant growing weeks past the harvest date to get late flower hermies? As I understand it they come out in all (most?) strains in late flower as a desperate attempt to pollinate itself. Some of the breeders on here mentioned that they collect pollen this way.

.


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## Hobbes (May 28, 2009)

*"have heard of reverse i have not used it as i have not had issues but i wonder what the active ingredient is. "*

I've been wondering that too, I'm going to put some more time into research now that I've got my garden rearranged. I'll see what I can dig up on Dutch Master Reverse and post what I can find over time.
*

Dutch Master Reverse


*From Dutch Master: *"the selected minerals and amino acids in this product assist the plant in channelling the correct metabolites in the pathways responsible for flowering, correcting any imbalances like the one that causes hermaphrodism (male flowers)."*

*Questions:*

1. What are the minerals and amino acids in DMR? (can we make it ourselves inexpensively?)

2. How do they really stop hermaphrodism? 

3. What internal processes cause hermaphrodism in genetic and stress hermies?

.


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## bicycle racer (May 28, 2009)

yeah thats how i made my pre98 bubba kush fems and fem crosses. it works with most strains but is time consuming but yeah it works most the time. im testing gibberelic acid and coloidial silver also im trying to find the best way. i have heard some people use aspirin which is synthetic salicyclic acid which is found in willow trees people use it as a rooting compound or as a stress inducer to protect against insect problems. some say they have used aspirin on females as a way to force pollen production but im not sure on that one. if that was true it would be great i think the dosage is like 800 to 1000mg a gall as a foliar spray early or 2 weeks before 12/12 ill do a test with that method at some point. i have also heard of using ionized cobalt though i have done little research on that method. i figure there must be more ways not yet discovered to make fem seeds as basically most foliar spray methods have an effect on ethylene production. well see how the pollen i collected from light stress works in a cross and what % of herms if any it produces.


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## bicycle racer (May 28, 2009)

maybe reverse does the opposite of what people do when making fem seeds it may increase ethylene production im interested in any info you find on it. so do you feel the product works well? i have not used it myself. but if it works well it would be good to have on hand my local hydro store stocks it always.


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## pinkus (May 28, 2009)

Hey BikeR, I was wondering if you were using the colloidal silver or not. Seems like the way to go to me, but that is based on some ideas I'm not sure are true. I seem to recall someone talking about using it on one branch and the effect being isolated to that branch. That would be ideal because you could grow a whole crop and _theortically_ finish a cycle with no extra hassles of extralong flower or two cycle to see the results. 

One treated and bagged branch for pollen and One pollinated branch for seed. Plus making colloidal silver is cool.


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## raiderman (May 28, 2009)

pinkus said:


> Hey BikeR, I was wondering if you were using the colloidal silver or not. Seems like the way to go to me, but that is based on some ideas I'm not sure are true. I seem to recall someone talking about using it on one branch and the effect being isolated to that branch. That would be ideal because you could grow a whole crop and _theortically_ finish a cycle with no extra hassles of extralong flower or two cycle to see the results.
> 
> One treated and bagged branch for pollen and One pollinated branch for seed. Plus making colloidal silver is cool.


 i've removed branches that were infected and remove them ,the res of the plant done fine,lol.funny, i never got hermies till everyone started talkin about it.carma,lol.


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## bicycle racer (May 28, 2009)

yes you can treat 1 branch with coloidial silver and only that branch will be affected so the remaining crop can be smoked besides silver is relatively non-toxic compared to sts even ga is not really that toxic at all there is a lot of misinformation concerning ga. sts is very toxic but works the best but i dont use it because it is so toxic. i make my silver with a battery charger and ro or distilled water. its best if the ppm is around 1000 it should be sprayed at 3 day intervals a week or two before 12/12 and then for a few days in 12/12. i started spraying a tahoe late in flower so we will see if it works at all i have some pollen from a jtr and a deep chunk/strawberry cough i will use if i cant make s-1's of the tahoe. at least then i will have preserved the tahoe dna in a cross.


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## NewHiddenGrower (Jun 1, 2009)

I ordered Nirvana feminized SEEDS!

im 1 week into flowering and saw that 3 plants out of 28 start to grow nuts! No white hair just nuts!

I mean when does it show signs of nuts + white hair so its hermies.

I only see signs of nuts!!! that means its 100% male. But how is it possible when i ordered feminized seeds from nirvana!!!!!!


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## Cheech Wizard (Jun 2, 2009)

Nirvana fem seeds and greenhouse fem seeds suck. Ducth passion fems arent so hot either... imo


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## Hobbes (Jun 2, 2009)

I'm 5 weeks into flower for a Barney's Red Diesel clone. It's in the same res as a Bubblegum clone (same time in flower), and 3 Kali Mist which are 2 weeks younger. I had excessive hermieing in both the mother and a clone my last grow, this time I sprayed the Red Diesel with Reverse once a week for 3 weeks (roots as well) - so far not a hint of a banana.

Check in next week.

.


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## haze2 (Jun 3, 2009)

I can vouch for this I had 2 Blueberry DP 2 Super Lemon Haze GH 2 Alaskan Ice GH and 1 Diesel G13 and 4 clones of Ultra Haze2 going and sure enough the fuckin DP Blueberry got to all but 3 of my females. I can def say watch the fuck out if you are interested in the BLUEBERRY Dutch Passion.


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## Hobbes (Jun 3, 2009)

Haze2 were the Greenhouse or G13 strains feminized?

.


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## zuckerman (Jun 3, 2009)

Those are all very reliable companies from what i have read but i'm very surprised you have not included anything from Paradise Seeds mainly their feminized products.
The strains i use are whiteberry and sheherazade feminized. The results are fantastic with no hermie issue whatsoever in 18 months. I give them top marks in each of the categories mentioned in the seedbank reiews. Check out their product info from their website. Paradise does not ship to the USA. I currently operate 2 1000w HPS ballasts (air cooled) with Eye Hortilux bulbs in a 4x8 area for 80 plants and get between 40-42 ounces per harvest of whiteberry in 45 - 50 days. Fucking gorgeous babes they are. Btw, I AM CANADIAN AND LIVE IN ONTARIO AND LOVE IT. Peace fellas


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## haze2 (Jun 3, 2009)

Yes everything was female 100% Hobbes


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## Stoney McFried (Jun 3, 2009)

I am personally growing a feminized big buddha g bomb.I'm 7 weeks into flower, so far, so good.I'm impressed with the size of the plant, even though it is only under a 150 watt hps.It blows my first grow of ice away.Both ice went hermie.


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## bicycle racer (Jun 3, 2009)

im growing some fems of my own creation some pre98 bubba kush crosses and also some bag seed og kush fems that were probably from a herm issue in a big grow. well see how the og's go i have grown seeds that were from similar situations that grew out fine with no herming well see. i normally would not bother but it might be a good og so worth testing.


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## REEFS (Jun 7, 2009)

I believe the problem is inferior genetics or just the method they use to produce female seeds. I have grown Warlock fem. several times never had a hermie. The last crop I had all kinds of issues. First of all it got nute burn really bad, then the 400 watt hps bulb burnt out (I had to switch it with a metal halide for about a week until I got my new bulb) Then we lost power for two days. After all that stress still no hermie. Then there is dp. blueberry you can do everything perfect dont check the growroon for two days and guess what nuts everywere. Around christmass I ordered some seeds for my old man and one of his friends from Attitude and I got 1 Seedsman fem. White Widow out of the deal. That seed was not fucking feminized it was a male. I really dont have too much exp. with feminized seeds but the only ones I have ever had that were worth a shit was Warlock.


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## ONEeyedWILLY444 (Jun 7, 2009)

there is alot of bad stigma about fem seeds, i have had a few strains go hermie but most of them i have grown seed too maturity with no problems. i reckon i have a 90% success rates with fem seeds. but you have to exspect some hermie traits when dealing with fems. i am on sog from now on so wont be dealing with many seeds anymore.


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## bicycle racer (Jun 7, 2009)

my worst herm experience was with normal male female seeds on the other hand i have grown out bagseed fems without issue go figure.


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## ONEeyedWILLY444 (Jun 7, 2009)

bicycle racer said:


> my worst herm experience was with normal male female seeds on the other hand i have grown out bagseed fems without issue go figure.


this is exactly what i mean, there is alot of bad said about fem seeds people blame it on the seeds but i think its more down too the breeder,s myself. breeders like greenhouse seem too care more about marketing than actually producing a stable product. i had three himalayan golds from them that had three different pheno,s, one was so leafy i had to let it go 12 weeks at which point there was still hardly any bud, the whole plant went into some cannabutter. i mean dont get me wrong i had some nice strains from greenhouse before but i choose to not risk using them anymore


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## bicycle racer (Jun 7, 2009)

nothing worse than growing a plant not worth trimming at all i have had bad strains i make the whole plant into bho.


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## Hobbes (Jun 7, 2009)

Week 6 for the feminized Red Diesel clone. 

To recap for anyone who didn't read the whole thread: I had a Red Diesel from a Barney's Farm feminized seed, the mother in Pro Mix hermied excessively. A Red Diesel clone from this mother was flowered in hydro at the same time, it produced bananas excessively. Both mother and clone were sprayed with reverse once a week for 3 weeks and the bananas slowly stopped being produced by the 8th or 9th week. Several different strains were grown at the same time, in pro mix and hydro, and no other plants hermied.

I rooted another Red Diesel cutting to be grown in hydro, and sprayed both the leaves and roots with reverse once a week for three weeks starting the first day of 12/12. So far the clone hasn't produced a single banana at 6 weeks of 12/12 while the other two Red Diesels were producing bananas excessively by 4 weeks.

Spraying with Reverse for the first few weeks of 12/12 may prevent a high hermie risk plant from producing bananas. We'll see how things go from now til harvest.

*.

" breeders like greenhouse seem too care more about marketing than actually producing a stable product."*

I've been noticing this too Willy, it seems that the best seeds I'm getting come from small breeders. And Serious Seeds.

.


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## bicycle racer (Jun 7, 2009)

right on so true smaller breeders cant afford to screw seeds up when there trying to get established against the big boys.


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## REEFS (Jun 7, 2009)

Small breeders are usually concentrating on just a few strains. Quality not quantity


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## haze2 (Jun 8, 2009)

Hobbes, do you think that the Pro-Mix had anything to do with the hermie rate or.......? The reason I ask is because Im using some Pro-Mix BX and like I said got lots of herms this round.


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## Hobbes (Jun 8, 2009)

Hey haze

No, I don't think it's the pro mix. I grow 5 or 6 strains at the same time - I'll have one strain like Barney's Red Diesel feminized hermie horribly in pro-mix, and on both sides have a Bubblegum and Big Laughing in pro-mix with no bananas and growing perfectly.

It's something in the breeding, I don't know enough about breeding to know what. Breeding for characteristics other than stability maybe. Obvious example is an S1 - breed to produce feminized seeds at the cost of sexual stability.

.

*"The reason I ask is because Im using some Pro-Mix BX and like I said got lots of herms this round. "*

Was it just the 2 DP Blueberry that went hermie or did some of the others as well? I've had two breeder's Blueberry strain and both hermied - DP's Feminized and another F2 pollen chucker's regular. Tough strain to grow well or tough strain to breed out instability. Next blue strain for me will be Subcools Querkle - consistent grape taste and sounds much more potent than Blueberry.

.


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## haze2 (Jun 8, 2009)

Well the 2 BB were the first to start showing about 3 days or more before then I started to see single balls on the rest of the 7 that went. I was cutting the balls off for about a week before I decided to chuck them only because I didnt have the space to keep them indoors or out so yeah I was bumbed. I honestly think that they could have hermed from heat issues it got up to around 80+ for a few days and shortly after that is when I started to notice. Oh does Subcool have a website??


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## pinkus (Jun 8, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> I've had two breeder's Blueberry strain and both hermied - DP's Feminized and another F2 pollen chucker's regular.


ever run the peak seeds bb yet? still love good bb but opted for Satori for my next addition.


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## pinkus (Jun 8, 2009)

haze2 said:


> Oh does Subcool have a website??


no but you can find stuff in his organics section here, thcfarmer he has a section too and at breedbay his stuff is featured

www.breedbay.co.uk/auction/

http://www.thcfarmer.com/forums/classifeds/index.html


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## Hobbes (Jun 8, 2009)

pinkus I have Peak's Blueberry seeds packed away in my seed box, waiting for an opening in the garden. I checked their website a dozen times a week for a year and a half while they were out of stock and as soon as they stocked some BB beans I ordered just to have them, even though I've got lots of strains to go in the garden before BB. Next I'm waiting for Texada Timewarp, still out of stock. They're on Vancouver Island (or one of the little Islands) so I'm hoping they'll have pure TT genetics instead of the crosses most breeders have. They've got (TT X BB) and (TT X Skunk), I might pick up the BB cross.

I've read some very good things about their Blueberry. Skunkberry, Northern Lights and Northern Berry were some of the most healthy and robust strains I've grown - short with huge nugget buds hanging. Easy to grow, excellent yields, great breeding. They're Blueberry might just not hermie without excessive stress.

.


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## haze2 (Jun 8, 2009)

Whats that website Hobbes?? Peaks


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## haze2 (Jun 8, 2009)

pinkus said:


> no but you can find stuff in his organics section here, thcfarmer he has a section too and at breedbay his stuff is featured
> 
> www.breedbay.co.uk/auction/
> 
> http://www.thcfarmer.com/forums/classifeds/index.html


 
How reputable are these sites.


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## Hobbes (Jun 8, 2009)

(Breedbay / Bidzbay / Cannaseur) sites are all linked and I assume they're they same company, or owners. Subcool recommended these guys specifically as his main listing site - that's as good a recommendation as I could ask for. I ordered JTR, Pandora & Jillybean from them last week, probably another 3 or 4 weeks for the seeds to be delivered - have to mail in payment if you live outside the UK (inside can use credit cards).

THC farmer I know nothing about.

.

http://www.peakseedsbc.com/seeds.htm - good people.

.


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## Hobbes (Jun 8, 2009)

*Peak Seeds - Customer Testimonials* 

- a 4 star on www.seedbankupdate.com

- _"...I can honestly say that these guys and their genetics are medical grade! Peak had been a supporter of ours from the very beginning and continue to support the med community."

- "I just wanted to thank you for your outstanding seeds, I received 15 of each skunk and taxada timewarp. I thought that you would like to know that i got not only 100% germimation, but also 100% female for my outside garden!!!!!!!!!!!!!.. this was a 1st!!"

- "...that was so fast. great service. I'll be recomending your seedbank to friends."

- "Hi, Congrats on your new site - looks very professional, simple, informative w/ great pics - good job! I will send my Order by mail today! You are the BEST as far as my vote - and I will continue to pass it on to the Seed Banks and friends!"

.

http://www.peakseedsbc.com/testimonials.htm

.


_


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## haze2 (Jun 8, 2009)

Thanks Hobbes thats just what I was looking for.


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## haze2 (Jun 8, 2009)

Thanks for that link.


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## laserbrn (Jun 15, 2009)

haze2 said:


> Thanks for that link.


Interesting thread. Way more interesting than I thought it would be. I just sprouted 12 feminized seeds. 8DP White Widow and + BB Blue Cheese.

I have them all starting in my veg room right now. I am planning to mark all of the plants and take clones before they go into flower. I am going to flower the originals and note which of them hermie's up. If it hermies I'll kill it's clone back in the veg room. Hopefully in the end I'll have plenty of dank buds and a few mothers that don't seem to have the hermie genetics.

Does this sound like good logic? Trying to avoid growing regular seeds and basically achieving the same things, but with less bud from the original run.


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## haze2 (Jun 15, 2009)

I think so laser ?? Um I think


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## Hobbes (Jun 16, 2009)

*Red Diesel Clone - Barney's Farm:* Week 7

. 7-8 weeks in 12/12 (estimate 3-4 weeks left)
. Sprayed once a week (leaves and roots) for three weeks with Reverse from onset of 12/12
. No bananas to date
. Mother and previous clone hermied excessively, even when sprayed with Reverse. 
. Spray for mother and first clone started about 6 weeks into flower.

I've been waiting to see if the RD clone will turn hermie but a little Reverse at the start of flower seems to work better than a lot of Reverse when the plant is bigger and is popping bananas.

.

*Taiga - Dutch Passion**:* 

Taiga is a Ruderalis / Power Plant cross (with a little indica in there). The ruderalis should help with sexual stability. I've got lots of fluffy white pistols around small buds starting to form so it should be a week or two before I see any bananas, but I don't think there will be any. Full grown at 29", but grown in 12/12 for the past 4 weeks, might hit 3' if grown under proper lighting.

.


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## laserbrn (Jun 16, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> *Red Diesel Clone - Barney's Farm:* Week 7
> 
> . 7-8 weeks in 12/12 (estimate 3-4 weeks left)
> . Sprayed once a week (leaves and roots) for three weeks with Reverse from onset of 12/12
> ...


So you would say that spraying preemptively on feminized plants made the largest difference? Was this applied during veg or just early on in flower?


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## Hobbes (Jun 16, 2009)

Hey laserbrn!

*"So you would say that spraying preemptively on feminized plants made the largest difference?"*

Yes, it's the only difference in my hydro grow set up from the last clone that continued to produce bananas untill the top cola was chopped. And it took very little reverse compared to the earlier clone since the new clone was so small at the start of 12/12. 

I let the clone hang in an empty bucket before spaying the roots - so the water would drip off - then after spraying I put the clone back in the same empty bucket for 5 minutes to give the roots time to absorb the Reverse. 

*"Was this applied during veg or just early on in flower"

*The first day I put the clone into the flower room for 12/12. I was thinking that the switch into flower might stress the plant so hitting it with Reverse then might give the best results. Or the plant was so small, and I let the roots absorb the Reverse, maybe .... something ... change hormone output ... for life of plant. I don't know, I gotta find out the mechanics of a female plant producing bananas.

If you haven't flowered a plant from this set of seeds it may be best to see if the breeder made the seeds sexually stable, let them flower without Reverse until you see excessive banana production. Reverse is expensive, extra work, and the maxim "if it's not broke don't fix it or something else will fuck up" applies.

.


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## bicycle racer (Jun 16, 2009)

normally im trying to make bannanas on purpose but im growing some og seeds fem/herm from an unknown source so i dont know how much tendency they will have towards herming the reverse might be a good thing t0 use on these.


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## Hobbes (Jun 16, 2009)

*"I just sprouted 12 feminized seeds. 8DP White Widow and + BB Blue Cheese."*

Two fantastic strains, sounds great.

*"I am planning to mark all of the plants and take clones before they go into flower."*

Excellent. Do you use colored beer cups and masking tape? Always interested in how people mark their plants, I'm looking for simpler ways. When mine go into flower I make a tag using masking tape folded so the sticky sides together, write the strain, plant number, date of flower, height at flower. Then take clear packing tape and encase the masking tape, and put a piece of twist tie through to hang it from the plant. Probably more than I need but it's fun having the info handy. Pain in the ass to make though.
*
"I am going to flower the originals and note which of them hermie's up. If it hermies I'll kill it's clone back in the veg room. ... Does this sound like good logic?"* 

Yes, excellent. Be sure to have control strains to be sure it's the genetics and not something that's happened during your grow. It'd be awful to throw out a good plant.
*
"Trying to avoid growing regular seeds and basically achieving the same things, but with less bud from the original run."*

Why avoid regular? To skip caring for twice as many plants during veg as you'll get to keep in flower?

Cool, thanks.

.


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## Hobbes (Jun 16, 2009)

bicyle race have you breed with sexually unstable strains? If so, how do you breed out the instability? How many generations does it take?

thanks

.


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## laserbrn (Jun 16, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> bicyle race have you breed with sexually unstable strains? If so, how do you breed out the instability? How many generations does it take?
> 
> thanks
> 
> .


I mark mine much the way that you do. I fold tape in half and place on a stake and stake it into the rockwool cubes. I like the idea of laminating it in plastic to protect them a little bit better. I'll definitely be doing that. 

I went with feminized seeds instead of regular because I wanted to do a quick grow this time. Normally I would start with regular seeds, take clones and kill the males and male clones and move on. Because I flower when the plants are pretty small I figured I'd try feminized seeds and this way I don't have to kill any of the smaller plants, just the clones and pick bananas the first time around to hopefully steal yeild a good return.

After I have everything up and running I'll go back to getting regular seeds. I am looking to just get a healthy number of mothers of some good strains. 

I am just ordered a second flowering tent so I can harvest once/month. 

I now have two flowering tents and one veg room. So I stagger my starts by one month and I'm hoping it will be fantastic. I'm also upgrading from 2 400w lights in a single room to 1 600w per 4x4 flowering tent.

I'll see how this works out and how I like it, but for now it seems like it's going to awesome.


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## bicycle racer (Jun 16, 2009)

no i try to avoid that it would be too time consuming but i will still grow for bud from herm grows if the plant they came from is top notch. i may try in the future if something excellent came along. i will sometimes make crosses with said plants but only for myself. truthfully i have grown seeds from grows that hermed on someone else but for me they normally dont if they do its a minimal amount of pollen and i get a couple dozen seeds total. anything i trade or sell to others i make sure is stable enough for normal amounts of stress though some people can herm anything.


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## mared juwan (Jun 21, 2009)

Hey Hobbes, just a little update on my own foray into feminized seeds. The five plants from the Green House fem mix pack that I talked about a couple pages ago are all in their first week of flower now. So far they all have only female preflowers. So that's one hurdle crossed. I guess I just have to watch carefully for pollen sacs as flower goes on.


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## Hobbes (Jun 21, 2009)

Good stuff mared! 

I've only seen male preflowers in a Blueberry F2 strain I got from a pollen chucker. There was a straight horizontal line across the plants from the time of 12/12, all female below and all male above.

The rest are bananas growing out of the buds, sometimes inside the seed pods.

Keep us posted regularly on their progress, it'll be interesting to see how Greenhouse's 100% hermie free claim holds up.

.


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## Hobbes (Jun 21, 2009)

*Red Diesel - Barney's Farm* - Sprayed with Reverse once per week for the first 3 weeks, leaves and roots.

Week 8 - perfectly healthy, no sign of bananas.

.

*Taiga - Dutch Passion* - I looked back to the first post - dated April 9 - and it looks like the seed sprouted around the first week of April. That would make it 70 - 75 days. The flowering period is suppose to be 56 - 70 days and the buds on my plant have hardly started to develop. Lots of white pistols. The extra time could be from my light system - I had it in 24 hour light (14 hrs of 125W and 10 hrs of 1000W) for the first 6 or 7 weeks and in 12/12 for the rest.

I thought the plant would finish in 8 - 10 weeks regardless of photoperiod.

No sign of hermieing.

.


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## bicycle racer (Jun 21, 2009)

here is something that might be useful info for this thread im growing some og kush seeds that hermed in a grow from an unknown source the seeds were big and healthy and im vegging them now. im going to give them good care and they will be flowered outdoor i think i can grow them to harvest with no bannanas not counting any that appear very late in flower which sometimes happen naturally. i will let everyone know how it pans out.


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## Hobbes (Jun 21, 2009)

*"im growing some og kush seeds that hermed in a grow from an unknown source the seeds were big and healthy and im vegging them now."*

It'll be interesting to see if the plant was pollinated by a male or hermied, let us know if you get any males when you put them into flower. Is OG Kush usually a stable strain?

Keep us updated in this thread if you can. Thanks.

.


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## haze2 (Jun 21, 2009)

Yo Hobbes what makes a strain so stable??


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## Hobbes (Jun 22, 2009)

haze that's beyond what I've researched, I've never done any breeding on purpose. From what little I learned stability has a lot to do with picking the best parent stains, and parent plants out of batches of germinated seeds and chucking any parents that produce unstable offspring.

Sometimes a breeder wants to preserve a certain characteristic - diesel taste, soaring head high, purple color - and the stability of other characteristics are of secondary importance during the breeding process. So if a breeder looking for a strong diesel taste had the choice between two parents - one with the right taste but less sexual stability vs a poorer tasting plant with good sexual stability - the breeder has a choice between a new strain that may hermie more and taste great, or be more sexually stable but not have as pronounced a taste.

And sometimes it's a crappy breeder producing F2s or not knowing how to pick proper parents that produce stable characteristics. Very stable strains like Northern Lights are often used in crosses to help with stability, among other things.

Maybe a breeder could help us out here. Please and thank you.

.


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## bicycle racer (Jun 22, 2009)

the og seeds were from a herm grow of very good bud no males. i purchased them very cheap knowing that they may herm on me there very healthy seeds. well see if they herm its no big deal as its all for me anyways. in the past i have grown out herm source og phenos with no issues it normally is a stable strain.


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## Mindmelted (Jun 22, 2009)

3 grow using feminized seeds
# of hermies from these grows ZERO


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## pinkus (Jun 22, 2009)

Mindmelted said:


> 3 grow using feminized seeds
> # of hermies from these grows ZERO


which breeds and seed banks?


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## LAX Skunky BwS (Jun 22, 2009)

does DNA Genetics have good fem seeds .. cuz i got 3 kushberrys feminized going at 1.3 wweks old


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## Mindmelted (Jun 22, 2009)

pinkus said:


> which breeds and seed banks?


Snow White From Nirvana

White Berry from Paradise

Train Wreck from GreenHouse


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## Hobbes (Jun 22, 2009)

Hey Mindmelted!

*"Snow White From Nirvana, White Berry from Paradise, Train Wreck from GreenHouse"*

I don't know much about Nirvana seeds, but I've read consistently good reports on White Berry and Paradise, and I've read around the forum that Greenhouse is advertising zero hermies. Good to hear you've gone hermie free. I've got a Trainwreck fem seed waiting to germ, it'll be great if it's sexually stable.

What was the high like for your Greenhouse Trainwreck? Did it hit fast or creep? Potent? Both head and body? How trippy? Anything else you can think of 

thanks!

.


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## Mindmelted (Jun 22, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> Hey Mindmelted!
> 
> *"Snow White From Nirvana, White Berry from Paradise, Train Wreck from GreenHouse"*
> 
> ...


 
Hobbes,
The Train Wreck was a Good all around high. Solid body and Head high


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## LAX Skunky BwS (Jun 22, 2009)

does DNA Genetics have good fem seeds


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## haze2 (Jun 22, 2009)

Thanks for the input Hobbes!! Anyone else would be great too.


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## Cinderella99 (Jun 30, 2009)

Hobbes, thank you for the excellent and on point thread. And I say on point because it seems like this may be the wave of the future.

My Hermie to Fem seed ratio theory is this: It is largely a riddle of Statistics and Probabilities.

Yes, there are certain strains that are feminized that have "weaker", more hermie prone tendencies and this IS a genetic factor...

But also, the devil is in the details in that even sts is a stressor of sorts....When you have a large seed manufacturing co. that stresses whole-scale, the larger proportion of those fem seeds will be from those male flowers that were stressed earlier--because they were weaker to the herm tendency-- and to a greater extent than those with more feminine solid tendencies...So, it would stand to reason that a larger proportion of those fem seeds will be from more easily stressed, earlier male pollen parents.

If you combine this with the concept that selfing exponentially doubles any weak genes, Voila...

I am not a genetics person by training, but if you take 1) breed genetics 2) early flower weakness probabilities and 3) magnification of the previous by exponential combination...That stands to reason for me. Peace.


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## syze (Jul 1, 2009)

ONEeyedWILLY444 said:


> kremnon said:
> 
> 
> > the reason ur gettin bannanas on ur girls is not because theur hermie its a light leak or something. u cant turn a plant hermie it is or it isn't. u can light poison a plant to produce bananas but that does'nt make it a hermie[/quote
> ...


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## Hobbes (Jul 1, 2009)

*"The Train Wreck was a Good all around high. Solid body and Head high "*

Thanks Mindmelted. 

.

*"does DNA Genetics have good fem seeds"

*I don't know much about DNA, anyone else?

.
*
"the larger proportion of those fem seeds will be from those male flowers that were stressed earlier--because they were weaker to the herm tendency-- and to a greater extent than those with more feminine solid tendencies...So, it would stand to reason that a larger proportion of those fem seeds will be from more easily stressed, earlier male pollen parents."*

Very interesting, I've never thought of early flower weakness. Nor the probability of S1 children hermieing because of that. Sounds like solid reasoning, does anyone else have knowledge of early flower weakness?

A way around this for home S1 breeders would be to take a solid mother and let a clone flower until late flower bananas pop.

.


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## Hobbes (Jul 1, 2009)

*Week 9*

Solid as ever, not a sign of a banana to come. A little Reverse during the first 2 weeks does amazing things, the Red Diesel feminized is as beautiful as the Bubblegum clone next to it, with more solid denser buds.

The Taiga fem is starting to fill out, no sign of hermieing. It has an amazingly tall skinny cola.

I'm going to post some pics of my garden this week, I'll post a pic of both plants on this thread.

.


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## haze2 (Jul 1, 2009)

Hobbes what the best place to get some of that reverse??


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## Hobbes (Jul 1, 2009)

Most local hydro shops should have it, here's a couple online spots - I've ordered from both several times and had great service. Be sure to get some Penatrator, it helps the Reverse absorb.

Canada & US: http://www.progressive-growth.com/dutch_master_nutrients_fertilizers.php

World: http://cgi.ebay.com/Dutch-Master-Reverse-Hydroponics-Feminizer_W0QQitemZ230250866655QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item359c0567df&_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116

.


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## LAX Skunky BwS (Jul 1, 2009)

well i got 3 Kushberry Fem seeds (DNA Genetics) going right right now .. almost 3 weeks old and one Blue Hash Fem seed (Dinafem) ... i hope i dont get any Hermies


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## Ellis D. Williams (Jul 1, 2009)

I grew out 3 fem. Chocolope (DNA) seeds and had no problems with herms. Only one of the 3 cloned with any success but no male flowers on any of the mothers or clones. I also grew 2 G13 Haze fem. from Barney's Farm and had no herms from either of those, they both cloned excellently too.


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## Hobbes (Jul 1, 2009)

I wouldn't worry too much LAX, get some Reverse and Penatrator to have on hand just in case. My Barney's Farm Red Diesel hermied like a banana tree while a Dutch Pasions Taiga (ruderelus cross) looks like it has rock solid stability. Strain, breeder and grower.

.


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## LAX Skunky BwS (Jul 1, 2009)

Ellis D. Williams said:


> I grew out 3 fem. Chocolope (DNA) seeds and had no problems with herms. Only one of the 3 cloned with any success but no male flowers on any of the mothers or clones. I also grew 2 G13 Haze fem. from Barney's Farm and had no herms from either of those, they both cloned excellently too.


 
one of the reasons why i went with DNA.. heard some good things.. bout them .. anyways.. the Kushberry is looking awsome .. cant wait till i start to flower


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## LAX Skunky BwS (Jul 1, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> I wouldn't worry too much LAX, get some Reverse and Penatrator to have on hand just in case. My Barney's Farm Red Diesel hermied like a banana tree while a Dutch Pasions Taiga (ruderelus cross) looks like it has rock solid stability. Strain, breeder and grower.
> 
> .


 
u say u can get some of that at a Hydro store? .. gonna have to go check it out... +Rep


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## mared juwan (Jul 2, 2009)

So Hobbes, it sounds like the DM Reverse works awesome. Would you recommend any preemptive strikes on a strain you are growing for the first time? Or would you wait until you know it has a herm history?

My Green House girls still looking great BTW....


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## Hobbes (Jul 2, 2009)

*"Would you recommend any preemptive strikes on a strain you are growing for the first time? Or would you wait until you know it has a herm history?"*

Definitely wait, it may not hermie and you'd be wasting your time and money. And if it's not broke don't fix it, I don't know if Reverse would help or hurt a stable plant but it's definitely not needed.

That being said: as soon as you see the first banana take the plant away from the hot light; let it cool, soak with Reverse and Penetrator and let dry slowly out of the light so the Reverse absorbs rather than dries on the leaf; Soak once per week - 3 times - and see if the bananas stop, they may or may not depending on how unstable the strain is.

I hope your Greenhouse plants all come up with no hermies, it'd be great to know that some day we could get all strains in a stable S1. Plus I have around 5 Greenhouse fem strains waiting to germ.

.


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## Cheech Wizard (Jul 2, 2009)

Hey Everybody,
Speaking of DNA, my fem Sharksbreath is at 9 weeks today and looks amazing. Gonna pull it in a day or two.. Also, my Barneys farm fem Nightshades are looking great too. Two different phenos but each one is looking great. Only fem seeds I have had any issues with are from Ducth Passion


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## laserbrn (Jul 2, 2009)

Ahhh...don't say that, I'm working with 10 Dutch Passion White Widows right now. I really don't want to start dealing with bananas. I should've ordered regular seeds.


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## Cheech Wizard (Jul 2, 2009)

Im sure you'll be ok. I just had problems with a skywalker and a brainstorm... both got the bananna things..... executed them... but the others were all great. The Skywalker was looking especially great, Im sorry that I had to kill it.


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## laserbrn (Jul 2, 2009)

Cheech Wizard said:


> Im sure you'll be ok. I just had problems with a skywalker and a brainstorm... both got the bananna things..... executed them... but the others were all great. The Skywalker was looking especially great, Im sorry that I had to kill it.


Well fortunately I'm currently vegging 16 plants and only really have a 4x4 space. I'm going to have to start culling at some point so I guess the nanners will be the deciders.


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## nickbbad (Jul 2, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> Well fortunately I'm currently vegging 16 plants and only really have a 4x4 space. I'm going to have to start culling at some point so I guess the nanners will be the deciders.


Underfeed don't overfeed I have dutch passions white widow and out of 7 clones I have one that I keep having to pick bananas off of and I am pretty sure its because its the only one to have a bit of nute burn. I have 14 - 20 days left Im trying to figure out if I should just keep picking off bananas or harvest her early. My worry is that she will seed the others if I miss one and she produces more and more nanners every day. Any suggestions?


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## laserbrn (Jul 2, 2009)

nickbbad said:


> Underfeed don't overfeed I have dutch passions white widow and out of 7 clones I have one that I keep having to pick bananas off of and I am pretty sure its because its the only one to have a bit of nute burn. I have 14 - 20 days left Im trying to figure out if I should just keep picking off bananas or harvest her early. My worry is that she will seed the others if I miss one and she produces more and more nanners every day. Any suggestions?


 
ahhh man, fuck this. I'm just gonna dump the seedlings....son of a bitch. They're growing REALLY slow and having a hard time as it is. I think my T5HO is burning them and they just haven't been off to a great start. I don't really want to deal with the banana's problem and I'm going to do a lot of cloning. I just want to get off to the right start.

I have 4 clones from the local dispensary that I'll keep going and the BB blue cheese (fem) and WW (fem) I think I'll just trash. They've already wasted 3 1/2 weeks of my life anyway.


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## kyoinidaho (Jul 2, 2009)

i'm growing feminized White Queen from amsterdam seeds. does anyone have any experience, + or -, with fem seeds from the same place? anyone grown or growing fem White Queen?


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## nickbbad (Jul 2, 2009)

Sorry to be the barer of bad news laserbrn. But I hear you on starting off right. After this grow I will be staying away from feminized seeds. I would rather have to wait and sex them then go through all the trouble of inspecting each bud daily for a little yellow flower. For everyone I pull it seems to produce 2 in its place. I hope people who are thinking about getting fem seeds read this thread, I wish I had before getting them...


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## laserbrn (Jul 2, 2009)

nickbbad said:


> Sorry to be the barer of bad news laserbrn. But I hear you on starting off right. After this grow I will be staying away from feminized seeds. I would rather have to wait and sex them then go through all the trouble of inspecting each bud daily for a little yellow flower. For everyone I pull it seems to produce 2 in its place. I hope people who are thinking about getting fem seeds read this thread, I wish I had before getting them...


Exactly, I just wish I knew it was this bad. I knew it was a potential problem but I can see myself getting pretty angry picking nanners for the rest of my days. The hell with that....I'll grow out my clones and start all over. I mean back to the website style to order more beans...unbelievable.


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## bicycle racer (Jul 2, 2009)

bro if you can go to dispensaries why did you start fem white widow seeds anyways? if you have access to good dispensaries there is no reason to buy seeds from europe there are better strains in cali to grow. besides if you want w.widow clones are available most the time uk cheese also not to mention the ogs chems and bubbas.


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## laserbrn (Jul 2, 2009)

bicycle racer said:


> bro if you can go to dispensaries why did you start fem white widow seeds anyways? if you have access to good dispensaries there is no reason to buy seeds from europe there are better strains in cali to grow. besides if you want w.widow clones are available most the time uk cheese also not to mention the ogs chems and bubbas.


 
Dispensaries are a genuine pain in the ass. About 60% of the time they just flat out lie about what the clones are. The rest of the time it's the vendor that sells them the clones. There is no way to guarantee what you're growing with the broken dispensary system.

I want to know what I grow brotha. I've seen the same bullshit strain under at least 4 - 5 different names from Bubba Kush, to Green Crack to OG (they try to claim every damn clone in the world is OG) and it's just this lame ass sativa strain that has always failed to impress.

I'll still use dispensary strains when I come across some good ones, but I want to get some good phenos of these well known strains and keep on smokin' them up.


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## bicycle racer (Jul 2, 2009)

seriously you have gone to the wrong dispensaries i once purchased seeds also no more. i have gotten clones that were not what they were supposed to be once or twice other than that out of over 20 strains all have been spot on good phenos of what they should be. i have traveled to amsterdam a few times cali buds and clones/seeds are so much better. what spots have you got clones from?


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## laserbrn (Jul 2, 2009)

bicycle racer said:


> seriously you have gone to the wrong dispensaries i once purchased seeds also no more. i have gotten clones that were not what they were supposed to be once or twice other than that out of over 20 strains all have been spot on good phenos of what they should be. i have traveled to amsterdam a few times cali buds and clones/seeds are so much better. what spots have you got clones from?


 
I'm down in So Cal and I've always gotten them from RDC or NHCC and a few times at CEO. I've never found the Pheno's to spot on by any stretch. If someone knows where to get the real shit, I would be much appreciative.

Skeptical still, it's been like this for years now. I've been so dissatisfied it's disgusting. Don't get me wrong, the buds always great and I'm never dissapointed with the harvest, it's just I get things like "blueberry" that are just obvious sativas after a couple of weeks. Disgusting.


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## bicycle racer (Jul 2, 2009)

man you have had some bad experiences. i have not gotten clones from those spots though.


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## pinkus (Jul 2, 2009)

laserbrn said:


> I'm down in So Cal and I've always gotten them from RDC or NHCC and a few times at CEO. I've never found the Pheno's to spot on by any stretch. If someone knows where to get the real shit, I would be much appreciative.
> 
> Skeptical still, it's been like this for years now. I've been so dissatisfied it's disgusting. Don't get me wrong, the buds always great and I'm never dissapointed with the harvest, it's just I get things like "blueberry" that are just obvious sativas after a couple of weeks. Disgusting.


check out DJ's history of Blue Berry. lots of sativa in it's background. Thai in fact. sorry it's not more stable though.


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## LAX Skunky BwS (Jul 2, 2009)

u should try ... LAX Compassionate


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## LAX Skunky BwS (Jul 2, 2009)

or try some in the Valley


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## laserbrn (Jul 2, 2009)

LAX Skunky BwS said:


> or try some in the Valley


All the ones I named are in the valley. I expect better, and I know that others have noticed the same. There have been threads about it already.

I'll work on getting some bomb shit crackin' soon enough. Just need to get in the know somehow.

Is this so cal shit really that good compared to the euro beans? I figured the beans would be as good as if not better than the shit clones from the dispensaries.


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## Hobbes (Jul 3, 2009)

*"Is this so cal shit really that good compared to the euro beans? I figured the beans would be as good as if not better than the shit clones from the dispensaries. "*

Even if you buy beans from the best European seed breeder - lets say Serious for this discussion - you could still get a bad batch of seeds or just bad luck and poor phenos - low yield, low potency, no taste, etc ...

With a clone from the dispensaries you're getting an exact copy of the genetics that an experienced grower cloned, and the value of the genetics in the clone judged by everyone who grows it - possibly hundreds of growers with an exact genetic copy every time. You could get a clone from an unknown bag seed cross and the grower could have gotten one phenominal plant out of a thousand seeds. It's like having hundreds of people germ seeds and grow the plants for you, then you only take the best plant in your garden.

I've found some of the best beans to come from North American Breeders - (I'll probably fuck up and put some European breeders down) - Elite, Rez, DJ Short, BOG, Subcool and TGA (?), Peak, Dr Greenthumb, Federation. (How many do I have wrong?) A lot of them stay under the radar because of our darconian drug laws.

.


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## bicycle racer (Jul 3, 2009)

i did a lot of looking on w.t. and visited many dispensaries before i purchased any clones as with anything you have to shop around and find what you want from reputable sources some clones from some spots are not what they say. if you know where to go its never an issue and i have never reached the quality with seeds that i have with good socal clones like larry og other ogs some purples chems etc.. these cant be found overseas in pure form. i have many strains in seed mostly for males and breeding projects other than that i like clones.


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## bicycle racer (Jul 3, 2009)

i also prefer clones even if its a strain that can be found in seed because someone has already picked a good pheno. i have grown black domina la con jack the ripper and a few others from clone that are available as seeds no problems or issues.


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## siltysand (Jul 7, 2009)

Hi all. First post here. The first two strains I grew were DP Blueberry and Durban Poison, both feminized. They all went hermie. This time I have gone with Northern Lights fem (not DP, but can't recall where it was from). The plants are gorgeous, but just yesterday, just starting week 4 of flowering, I noticed some banannas . Bummer! I think I will just try to de dilligent and inspect the plants daily and pick the male flowers off. I don't know if its the predisposition of the fem strains to go hermie, or something I'm doing wrong, or a combo. The plants always look healthy...


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## syze (Jul 10, 2009)

syze said:


> ONEeyedWILLY444 said:
> 
> 
> > isnt that a HUGE temperature drop at nights? damn 10 degrees should be the limit, it costs you weight!
> ...


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## chemdawg (Jul 13, 2009)

I've grown quite a few Dr. Greenthumb feminized strains and have not had anything but 100% fems and no problems with hermies, so I don't buy anywhere else now. Who can afford the time, never mind the money, of messing with questionable genetics?


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## Hobbes (Jul 13, 2009)

I agree 100% chemdawg, Dr Greenthumb is one of my favorite breeders. I'm not suprised that his fem seeds are stable.

What Greenthumb strains have you grown? Which are the more potent? If you've done Cheese S1 could you describe the high, compare it to another cheese cross if you've grown one please and thank you.

.

*Who can afford the time, never mind the money, of messing with questionable genetics?*

Truer words were never said.

.


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## bicycle racer (Jul 13, 2009)

i always notice true hermies either when they show presex or in the first few weeks i really dont understand the problems people have i have grown seeds from herm grows and get perfect fems. i think grower conditions are often the cause of issues or i simply have been lucky.


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## LAX Skunky BwS (Jul 13, 2009)

bicycle racer said:


> i always notice true hermies either when they show presex or in the first few weeks i really dont understand the problems people have i have grown seeds from herm grows and get perfect fems. i think grower conditions are often the cause of issues or i simply have been lucky.


 
maybe a combination of both Lucky and Conditions... i have 4 fem seeds I started 4 1/2 weeks ago.. and started flowering last monday.. so far all are Females so signs of hermies Yet "Knock on wood"


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## bicycle racer (Jul 13, 2009)

cool good luck. me i actually look for seeded og kush and other good strains from dispensaries and grow the seeds for bud to smoke (not for breeding) so far i have only gotten pure females go figure i guess whoever hermed them fucked up badly. which makes me wonder how hard most breeders try to make stable fems.


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## Hobbes (Jul 14, 2009)

*"tarted flowering last monday.. so far all are Females so signs of hermies Yet "Knock on wood"*

The three fem strains that hermied on me started to show bananas about 4 weeks into flower - they started growing out of the bud pods (seed pods I guess, with no seeds in them). Very likely you'll get no hermies though, I can't see the seeds being bad with all the breeders (or strains for each breeder). I got hermies from Dutch Passion Blueberry and Strawberry Cough but their Taiga fem is a week or two from finish and not a hint of a banana.

.

*"so far i have only gotten pure females go figure i guess whoever hermed them fucked up badly."*

I wonder that with my fem hermies - am I stressing the garden enough to hermie less stable genetics but not the control stains. Would a better grower be able to grow the same seeds and not get hermies? 

I've kept a mother for the Red Diesel that hermied so bad on me twice. When I've got room in the garden I'll run two clones side by side - one with Reverse from the start of flower and the other without. Get a little better idea of how unstable it is.

.


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## Hobbes (Jul 20, 2009)

I harvested the feminized *Red Diesel* clone Saturday - 18" and I speculate a bit over an ounce when dry. Not a single banana anywhere on the clone throughout flower, the plant finished earlier than the mother and other clone that hermied. I baked a few nugs and there's a bit of a high already, but it's a bit harsh before the cure. 

I've done nothing different than last time except the 3 treatments of Reverse in the first two weeks of flower. Seems we have a strategy for preventing hermie clones from a known unstable mother - like a vaccination - but still no clear cure once the plant has started to hermie.

I'm going to run 2 more Red Diesel clones: one with the 3 treatments of Reverse in the first two weeks; one without. I'll grow them like all the other plants in the flower room to see if either hermies, and try some Reverse if one does. Small clones, 8-12".

.

The *Taiga* is finishing beautifully, almost all the pistols are reddish brown and a few tricomes are turning cloudy. If all fems could be like this that's all I'd grow. I want to start another feminized strain but my garden is going to be overflowing with Subcool and Rez's strains in a few weeks so I'm going to hold off for a couple of months. I may start *Blue Moonshine, Trainwreck *or* White Widow* and keep the mother in the veg room and put out an 8" clone along side the Red Diesel clone.

.


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## bicycle racer (Jul 20, 2009)

well im going to be putting some strains outdoor soon its very hot and conditions will be far from perfect. one strain is og kush grown from seeds from a grow that hermed they were given to me well see what they do. did not want to infer everyones making herms through there own errors but in some cases thats i think what happens.


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## Cannabis Corpse (Jul 21, 2009)

so hobbes im guessing its more than worth it to just get the regular red diesel for 15 odd dollars more if i were wanting to try it out?


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## Hobbes (Jul 21, 2009)

Absolutely CC, The Red Diesel fem seed mother and clone I got hermied when all the other strains in the garden were fine. I treated them both with Reverse after they stated showing bananas but both kept producing bananas to the end. It's going to be interesting to see how potent this strain is. The taste is nice but not a pronounced Red Grape taste. No Diesel taste at all.

Are you set on Red Diesel or would you just like a good Diesel strain? Check out Elite, great prices and fantastic beans.

http://elitegenetics.webs.com/list.htm

.


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## Hobbes (Jul 21, 2009)

*"did not want to infer everyones making herms through there own errors but in some cases thats i think what happens."*

I always wonder if someone came into my garden would they immediately say "WTF are you doing there? That's what's causing the hermies." 

I think my garden is fairly low stress but I keep checking the web to see what I could be doing wrong. My next step is to put an RO system in.

.


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## chemdawg (Jul 21, 2009)

Hobbes

Dr.Greenthumb fems I have grown are 
Endless Sky
Chemdawg Kush
747
OG Kush
Original Cheese
Bubba Kush
Fire Hydrant 
There all potent just different. I tried the Cheese crosses in the Dam but I think Docs Original Cheese was the best of the lot. Right now I have Greenthumbs version of C99 going and she is beautiful.


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## Hobbes (Jul 21, 2009)

Thanks Chemdawg, I've been wondering about his Cheese S1 - how much better it is than the crosses other breeders are selling. Endless Sky and Cheese S1 are the two Doc strains I want to grow most. Maybe Jazz.

.


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## chemdawg (Jul 21, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> Thanks Chemdawg, I've been wondering about his Cheese S1 - how much better it is than the crosses other breeders are selling. Endless Sky and Cheese S1 are the two Doc strains I want to grow most. Maybe Jazz.
> 
> .


They were all good but the Original Cheese was the best tasting and if i'm going to grow a fem I'm not risking the other banks


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## Cannabis Corpse (Jul 21, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> Absolutely CC, The Red Diesel fem seed mother and clone I got hermied when all the other strains in the garden were fine. I treated them both with Reverse after they stated showing bananas but both kept producing bananas to the end. It's going to be interesting to see how potent this strain is. The taste is nice but not a pronounced Red Grape taste. No Diesel taste at all.
> 
> Are you set on Red Diesel or would you just like a good Diesel strain? Check out Elite, great prices and fantastic beans.
> 
> ...


 


thanks hobbes you already steered me in there direction before and im so excited about elite. im likin the super strawberry diesel and its price is more than dec. also im intrested in that lemon thai crossed with the serious ak-47...well that one aint elite but still drooooooool. i heard u grew the ssd i think i read that...didnt? howd that go? or u got a thread to show me abooot it?


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## Hobbes (Jul 30, 2009)

CC I hope your Elite order is in or you haven't ordered yet.

https://www.rollitup.org/seed-strain-reviews/218439-warning-exercise-caution-elite-genetics.html

.

The only fem I have left flowering is Taiga, Dutch Passion at about 11 weeks. It's an autoflowering Power Plant cross. It's in the early stages of it's harvest window, a few trichomes are turning amber, more cloudy, still mostly clear.

There were a couple of bananas last night but I think they were late flower bananas - Dutch Passion says 8 - 10 weeks and I'm at 11. Excellent strain for stability.

I've got 14 Subcool and Rez seedlings in veg, in 3 or 4 weeks I'll germinate another feminized seed. My remaining feminized inventory is:

*Alaskan Ice* - Greenhouse
*Arjan's Haze #3* - Greenhouse
*Blue Moonshine* - Dutch Passion
*Big Bang* - Greenhouse
*Cheese* - Big Bhudda
*Jack Flash #5* - Sensi
*Super Silver Haze* - Greenhouse
*TrainWreck* - Greenhouse
*White Widow* - Seedsman 

I'd like something < 10 week flower and potent or cheesy. 

I'd also like to avoid a hermie this time around, I'd love to do Blue Moonshine but Dutch Passion has let me down twice (Blueberry and Strawberry Cough), not bad hermies but crap bud. And come through once with a perfect grow. What do you guys think?

.


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## mared juwan (Jul 30, 2009)

The Green House has been solid for me. Ending week 6 of flower here and still no banannas. All are looking and smelling great too.


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## drewbert33 (Jul 30, 2009)

I looked in Newbie Central on the page for key terms having to do with marijuana.
What are bananas?


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## nickbbad (Jul 30, 2009)

bananas are what a male flower looks like in a female bud. It will usually be yellow and look like a banana. Here are a few pics.


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## Hobbes (Jul 30, 2009)

Great pics Nick, perfect size and quality to see the bananas coming out of the bud.

Drewbert and anyone else that have questions please ask, this isn't one of those "You should have searched the forum first" threads.

.


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## drewbert33 (Jul 30, 2009)

Wow thanks a lot man. Those pics help big time, I had a guess but it's always good to know for sure. Anyways, thanks again for helping me out.


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## kyoinidaho (Jul 30, 2009)

i'm growing fem. white queen, from amsterdam seeds...i'm finding next to no info on the strain, let alone how prone she is to herming...
i have some DM reverse, just in case, but would it also be good to spray them down preemptively? my plants are just now in their 6th day of 12/12, but vegged for 11 weeks, all showing pistils and staggered nodes...
in my head i thought maybe spraying them a few times around week 3, but would spraying as early as week 2 be better?


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## Mr.Therapy Man (Jul 30, 2009)

Hobbes get rid of the pro mix and replace it with oceans forest and worm castings also sounds like stress to me because all these female seeds are made with sts not hermied with a stamen.The more nitrogen the less likely for your plant to hermie.I have two greenhouse seed var. that I cant get to hermie even under light stress


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## Cannabis Corpse (Jul 31, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> CC I hope your Elite order is in or you haven't ordered yet.
> 
> https://www.rollitup.org/seed-strain-reviews/218439-warning-exercise-caution-elite-genetics.html


 
ya iheard and am pretty dissapointed that i cant try ssd . i replaced it with purple diesel from high grade, only 60 CAD for ten i thought id give them a chance too and if it is real purple oregon thai in the mix its so worth it. 


also had a question for you about peak. i like a sativa buzz right and i need a cheap-o outdoor plant so i was thinkin the two timewarp crosses blueberry and skunk. but im uncertain about the blueberry, think it will turn out shittay like yours? im already growing two skunk dominant strains and would perfer not to get another one but if i have to to get the best timewarp i can i will................so wat do u think mang?


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## That 5hit (Jul 31, 2009)

get reg. seed dont do fem if you want to have more seed you could make your own. even sell them to your friends. you cant do this with fems to unstable they will herm .for this reason i think fems should be cheaper the regs. i could take regs and make more of that same strain with out haveing to reorder more seeds, but with fems i have to keep going back to the dealer. maybe one day they will think of this and change it around or even stop selling regular seeds all together male pollen will become exspensive just like in the dog or horse worlds the seed industry is assbackward in that respect. they charge you less and give you more, but charge you more and give you less i would rather have the ablity to make my own seeds for ever then to have to keep buying fems but thats just me. and i live in the usa,and i dont have acces to seed banks the way other countries do canada , amsterdam, UK so for them i guess it would be too time comesuming to have to remove males. but all i do is take 4 of my 10 seeds and veg then sex all need is 1 female then ,clone, clone, clone, then take that male you kept and pollenate one of the clones then you have seeds for life didnt even need to use the other 6 seeds. and all this for a fraction of the price of fem seed,
so you can kindof see why i say reg. seeds are a still, for where im siting its a still, i guess you could pollenate a fem but you would have to pollenate with a differant strain and this would make it too unstable, not to mention a new strain all together which could be good or bad most likely bad if you are crossing with bagseed. or you could be like that other guy who posted that he buys fem seeds every year theres nothing wrong with it at all you have to find whats best for you - where i live its not ez to come by good gens..............................


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## LAX Skunky BwS (Jul 31, 2009)

That 5hit said:


> get reg. seed dont do fem if you want to have more seed you could make your own. even sell them to your friends. you cant do this with fems to unstable they will herm .for this reason i think fems should be cheaper the regs. i could take regs and make more of that same strain with out haveing to reorder more seeds, but with fems i have to keep going back to the dealer. maybe one day they will think of this and change it around or even stop selling regular seeds all together male pollen will become exspensive just like in the dog or horse worlds the seed industry is assbackward in that respect. they charge you less and give you more, but charge you more and give you less i would rather have the ablity to make my own seeds for ever then to have to keep buying fems but thats just me. and i live in the usa,and i dont have acces to seed banks the way other countries do canada , amsterdam, UK so for them i guess it would be too time comesuming to have to remove males. but all i do is take 4 of my 10 seeds and veg then sex all need is 1 female then ,clone, clone, clone, then take that male you kept and pollenate one of the clones then you have seeds for life didnt even need to use the other 6 seeds. and all this for a fraction of the price of fem seed,
> so you can kindof see why i say reg. seeds are a still, for where im siting its a still, i guess you could pollenate a fem but you would have to pollenate with a differant strain and this would make it too unstable, not to mention a new strain all together which could be good or bad most likely bad if you are crossing with bagseed. or you could be like that other guy who posted that he buys fem seeds every year theres nothing wrong with it at all you have to find whats best for you - where i live its not ez to come by good gens..............................


 
well said.. i got some fem seeds going right now.. and i wanna do my own breeding.. like u said gotta get some reg seeds...


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## Hobbes (Jul 31, 2009)

*"Hobbes get rid of the pro mix and replace it with oceans forest and worm castings also sounds like stress to me because all these female seeds are made with sts not hermied with a stamen.The more nitrogen the less likely for your plant to hermie.I have two greenhouse seed var. that I cant get to hermie even under light stress"*

Thanks TM, that's a great tip. I've been wanting to run some Ocean Forest but it hasn't been sold in Canada except by mail order and it's expensive to ship in a dozen bags for each grow. But I'll order a couple of bags this weekend and mix them with some worm castings I bought a while back and threw in a box.

*"all these female seeds are made with sts not hermied with a stamen."* 

What does "*sts*" mean?

"*The more nitrogen the less likely for your plant to hermie."

*Where did you read this? It's opposite of what I've been able to find.

"*Nitrogen fertilizers masculinize the phenotype by stimulating the formation of male flowers. The proportion, number and degree of monoecious plants increases with increasing N, and the total N content is always higher in monoecious individuals than it is in females. (79)"*

.


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## Hobbes (Jul 31, 2009)

Hey CC

*"but im uncertain about the blueberry, think it will turn out shittay like yours? im already growing two skunk dominant strains and would perfer not to get another one but if i have to to get the best timewarp i can i will"

*Texada Timewarp is, I believe, a clone only strain from around Vancouver Island in BC, Canada. I'm not sure if anyone has back crossed to get an IBL or if it may have been breeding on the Islands for so long it can be considered a landrace strain. I've seen other breeders TT and it's always a cross unfortunately. I'd love to get some TT not crossed.

I have Peak's Blueberry and Skunk seeds in storage, I haven't grown either yet but from what I've read of their BB it should be sexually stable. Sagarmatha, Dutch Passion and DJ Shorts genetics is a good combination.

Crossing Peak BB with TT should improve the stability in the cross. The Skunk cross will probably be amazing and may not have dominate Skunk Characteristics. I think TT x BB will grow out fine, but email Peak and look through their testimonials.

I think your best course of action is to email Peak with your questions. They are very good (if a little slow) in helping out. Give them a link to this thread and this page number so they can find your questions quickly, ask them to post the answers here if possible. It'll be good for everyone to know and public injuries often get quick answers.

* "- ordering questions not answered here? Email us @ [email protected] "*

.


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## Hobbes (Jul 31, 2009)

*"
Feminizing your crop - In Depth
* 
*Feminizing: All You Ever Wanted to Know About Sexual Expression*, *and changing it*


*[This is from rexresearch.com, an excellent site for anything to do with growing cannabis.]*


*The sexual expression of cannabis is determined by its genetic makeup, and by its metabolic temper, which is regulated by the male enzyme andrase and the female enzyme gynase. Environmental conditions (light, nutrients, soil and water) may suppress the formation of the dominant enzyme, and allow the opposite sex to express itself partially (hermaphroditism) or completely (sex reversal). (71, 72)

* *[About this next paragraph: I thought that normal levels of N with lowered levels of K were ideal for producing fems in early veg...]


* *Nitrogen fertilizers masculinize the phenotype by stimulating the formation of male flowers. The proportion, number and degree of monoecious plants increases with increasing N, and the total N content is always higher in monoecious individuals than it is in females. (79)


* *Treatment of hempseed with ethylene gas will increase the resulting number of female plants by about 50%. Ethylene is produced by certain plants (i.e., bananas, cucumbers and melons), and these can be used to treat hempseed in a simple manner. About two weeks before you plan to sprout the seeds, place them in a paper bag or envelope and put that in a plastic bag with the peels of a ripening banana or cucumber. Replace the peels after a couple of days, and change the bags to prevent mold. 



* *Hempseed can be feminized while they are forming on the plant. Fruit peels are spread around the area for two weeks before the plants enter the flowering phase. Remove the skins when the plants begin to flower. Otherwise, treatment with Etephon will accomplish the same effect. 



* *When hempseed is treated with the female hormone estrogen, percentage of females that are produced will increase by about 10%. Dissolve a birth control pill in water and soak the seeds overnight in the solution. After the initial soaking, continue to treat the seeds by sprouting them on a paper towel soaked in the solution. (80)


A.I. Zhatov tested the effects of ethrel on hemp:
"Treatment of hemp plants with an aqueous solution of ethrel changed the ratio of male to female flowers. The greatest effect was observed when plants were treated during flowering of male flowers." * *(81)

Electricity also can change the sexual expression of cannabis; B.R. Lazarenko and I.B. Gorbatovskaya reported: 

"Under the influence of the electrical current, the numerical proportions between hemp plants of different sexes was changed by comparison with the control to give an increase of female plants by 20-25%... The characteristics acquired by the plants in electrically treated soils are transmitted by inheritance to the third generation..." [emphasis added] (82)


Photoperiodism is a most useful tool with which to control the sexual expression of cannabis. For example, J. Limberk made a careful study of lighttime on the sexual index of hemp, and reported thus: 
"Male plants usually flowered earlier than female. Female plants flowered only when the period of daylight was shorter than 14 hours; male plants flowered even when the day was longer than 14 hours. Reduction of light intensity in the first stages of plant development lead to increases of female plants by 4.3%. Intersexual plants (22-30% of the total) were present in conditions of 11-13 hours light per day. Grafting of plants did not change sex." 



* *The probable future sex of a pre-floral hemp plant can be guessed at by calculating the Leaf-Mass Index (LMI): Count the points (3, 5, 7) on 3 leaves in the center of a cluster. Divide that number by 3 to determine the average number of points. Repeat the process several times, and figure that average also. Multiply the two averages to determine the LMI. A high LMI indicates that the plant will be female. 



The phyllotaxy changes to alternate just before the onset of flowering. Then the sex of the plant can be determined by making a close examination of the upper nodes of the main stem. The onset of flowering is indicated by the appearance of undifferentiated primordial buds behind the stipules at the nodes of the petioles (along the stem at the base of branches). Within a few days they differentiate. The male pistils are flat or knobby with a curved shape and 5 open petals about 5 mm. long; they have a single tiny stalk. Overlapping vegetation often disguises their appearance. 



The female develops pairs of flowers surrounded by pointed bracts of protective leaves that will enclose the seed. The female stigma usually appear as 2 fuzzy white hairs forming a "V" that protrudes from a bract. Resinous hairs (glandular trichromes) cover the calyx (2-6 mm long). 



Gibberellin will inhibit the formation of flowers on cannabis, but sometimes it will otherwise cause the growth of fertile female flowers on genetically male plants. Silver nitrate or cobalt chloride causes masculinization of flowers of female hemp, possibly due to blockage of ethylene synthesis. * *High levels of N salts --- and long photoperiods --- have a masculinizing effect on hemp.(74-76)

"Dioecious hemp plants were grown to an age of 20 days in a day-length of 21-22 hours, then given an inductive treatment of ten 8-hour days to initiate flowering. After return to long days and during the period of differentiation of flower buds, a total of 0.5 gr lanolin paste containing 0.5% NapthaleneAcetic Acid (NAA) was applied to leaves at the 3rd and 4th nodes. In genetically male plants, female plants were subsequently formed in sites which would normally be occupied by males, a result which appears to be regulated by the level of native auxin in the vicinity of meristems during the period of differentiation of flower primordia. Secondary effect of auxin treatment were evident in an over-all reduction in intensity of heteroblastic development, the trend towards a reduction of leaf lobing and serration which normally accompanies plants passing through a period of flowering than in untreated controls." * *(7
"

 .



*_Disclaimer: I do not vouch for the veracity of the information in this post._


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## Hobbes (Jul 31, 2009)

I'm researching this info, very interesting. Any botanists on here who can confirm or deny this?

.

*"The sex of the plant is determined by diffuse genetic markers (probably spread across the genome) not x and y chromosomes. This is why there is so much sexshifting with the Cannabis.

Doesnt a good 100-300 ppm GA3 spray give you localized (to the area of applicaiton) pollen production? You can get GA3 cheap from supergrow.biz

I dont believe it is possible to get 100% true fems, just 100% fem expression with a higher then normal percentage of true fems. This is because a true fem cant produce pollen and cannot be selfed. Fem seeds seem a waste to me, but if people want em. This is becasue Im pretty sure one could get consistantly 75% fem expressing plants from normal seed with a proper production schedule which includes ethylene and auxin treatments. 

Also, if one wants to weed out fem expressing plants with male markers one might try giving male treatments to the seedlings and keeping the resulting female plants. They will most likely be heavy or true fems. I think BAP works good cause it tends to produce healthy, bushy plants but mostly male.* *"*

.



_Disclaimer: I do not vouch for the veracity of the information in this post._


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## Mr.Therapy Man (Jul 31, 2009)

STS is achemical agent that all breeders are using to reverse the sex of female plants.It can be puchaced at GH hydro.All breeders including soma are using these.Paradise seeds have ayou tube vidio showing aplant reversedat last years cup.It was of delahaze.Lucs gear is so stable it is unbelievable.I have grown opium twice from seed and now have been cloning a mother for six months without any hermie.I also understand you have alaskin ice,get it out of your grow now before you waist time and space with that bullshit.Too stretchy and no freakin BUZZ.I have GHS trainwreck ,opium, Mandala#1and hybrids i have bread myself.All are about done but this site wont let me post pic.Trainwreck in the 8th week with no hermie.


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## Hobbes (Jul 31, 2009)

*"STS is achemical agent that all breeders are using to reverse the sex of female plants.It can be puchaced at GH hydro."*

Thanks MTM. I've heard of colidal(?) silver but never the other, and you can order it online. Imagine that. (Forest Gump reference)

I'm going to get a bottle of the stuff, fantastic.

*"I also understand you have alaskin ice,get it out of your grow now before you waist time and space with that bullshit.Too stretchy and no freakin BUZZ."
*
Thanks again, you've saved me from a huge disappointment.
*
"I have GHS trainwreck ... Trainwreck in the 8th week with no hermie."*

I'm thinking of growing Trainwreck as my next Fem, have you grown this strain before? Wondering about the potency, type of high. How many more weeks do you think until harvest?

.


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## Mr.Therapy Man (Jul 31, 2009)

The Trainwreck is super smoke,9out of 10 on potency.There are three phenos ,I am cloning off of the sativa phenoand it is mind blowing.The indica phenos are great too but I am a sativa lover.The indica pheno grows rock hard nugs and the sativa is somewhat purple.I wish I could upload pics but I am not the only one having trouble.Hey man you really have to try the Opium from paradise,any of lucs gear is stable and I guarantee you wont have any hermies.Opium has a sativa pheno and a indica pheno,I currently have both in mothers.I have harvested on run of GHS ice and wreck and there was no comparison ,the ice stretched beyond belief and harvested only 30 grams per plant.I fell for Arjan THC ploy on the ice just like you did.You wont be dissapointed with the wreck.If that ice is 23percent thc I will kiss Arjan and Francos ass.I dont know know why I cant upload pics or I could show you some buds .,that are going to finish next week.I also have several jars curing.Maybe in the next few days it will let me post pics so it will help you pick your favorite pheno.I gave you the wrong website for the STS ,I fond it in high times new products about 6 months ago.I am trying to find it but I have all weed mags for the last 10-years.Good luck with the wreck.PS I also was a pro mix fan but not anymore,oceans forest with castings just yield twice as much medication


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## Mr.Therapy Man (Jul 31, 2009)

The top bd is GHS trainwreck and the bottom picture is opium from my last grow ,my daughter puts all these fancy logos on my pics .I dont know how she does it.This is on my login name it still wont let me post pics


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## nickbbad (Jul 31, 2009)

try making your pictures smaller


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## bicycle racer (Jul 31, 2009)

i have produced pollen with ionized silver and or giberellic acid both methods can work if done propely. i am aware of the sts method also which is effective although sts is highly toxic and somewhat dangerous while ga and ionized silver are much safer to work with. in fact to purchase sts a government form is needed at least in the us.


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## Hobbes (Jul 31, 2009)

*"i am aware of the sts method also which is effective although sts is highly toxic and somewhat dangerous while ga and ionized silver are much safer to work with. in fact to purchase sts a government form is needed at least in the us."*

I think I'll stick to late flower bananas. 

.


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## bicycle racer (Aug 1, 2009)

ionized silver is safe and easy to make and works well on most strains otherwise ga is another relatively safe alternative. i have done the late flower method also at least with some strains and it works.


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## That 5hit (Aug 1, 2009)

is this true i found this on here somewhere 

https://www.rollitup.org/marijuana-pics/index.php?n=30591

looks cool to me


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## pinkus (Aug 1, 2009)

That 5hit said:


> is this true i found this on here somewhere
> 
> https://www.rollitup.org/marijuana-pics/index.php?n=30591
> 
> looks cool to me


i'm doubting it...seems like Phrenology for seeds to me. I could easily be wrong.


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## bicycle racer (Aug 2, 2009)

false seeds depending on strain come in all shapes and sizes that includes males and females.


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## Hobbes (Aug 3, 2009)

Thanks That 5hit, interesting theory. I'm going to give it a shot and make a note on each germination cup what my "educated guesses" are.







.


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## bicycle racer (Aug 3, 2009)

seriously this is not an accurate way to determine sex.


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## Hobbes (Aug 3, 2009)

I don't think so either, but it'll be a fun test to amuse next time I germinate. I'd have to be pretty damn sure of the process before I'd chuck a seed because the shape suggested that it was male. Reminds me of measuring a person's skull to determine if they're a criminal. 

.


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## That 5hit (Aug 4, 2009)

i dont think it works either
but i also want to try 
just ordered some rigular seeds so ill be germing the dented seed first


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## bicycle racer (Aug 4, 2009)

well no harm in experimenting and testing new theories


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## haze2 (Aug 5, 2009)

Yo I just pulled 2 seeds out of some Ultra Haze #2 that was pollinated by some DP Blueberry ( of course ) and they both look like beans 1 3 5 so Ill be planting them soon and I will post to let you guys know. They look nothing like 2 or 4.


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## superdave5 (Aug 5, 2009)

Couldnt find what you got out of the White Widow. Im doing a fem grow from WW from nirvana and last night I found what appeared to be a ball but it was literally growing off a branch in between nodes/bud site/leaves. I mean literally just a bare branch with a wierd ball. Any thoughts?


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## Hobbes (Aug 5, 2009)

Dave I've had balls on a set of female plants once, instead of bananas (staminate flowers). I had 4 female blueberry from an F2 pollen chucker and every one hermied, but no bananas - at the level on the plant when I switched to 12/12 there were female flowers below and bunches of balls above. Bizare.

Are you getting single balls or bunches? Using a magnifiying glass can you see a ball-on-a-stick at the node?

.


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## superdave5 (Aug 6, 2009)

Hey sorry for the delay, but I literally found one ball that was in a really odd place. It was in between nodes. It was like it just popped out of a stem. It was a good inch from any leaf or flower, but Im sure it wasnt a bug or anything like that. Im almost a week into 12/12. Will a hermie produce pollen saks or no?


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## Hobbes (Aug 6, 2009)

Dave I wouldn't worry about the single ball - it sound like an anomaly. Leave the ball for observation, to see if you start getting bananas, and check over the plant regularly. How many nodes is the plant now? Only one ball? Hanging or sticking straight out on a short "stick" (ball on stick).

*"It was in between nodes. It was like it just popped out of a stem"*

That does sound weird, not a normal hermie.

If you get bananas popping from the ball pluck the whole bunch and check the rest of the plant regularly. I haven't heard too many complaints about Nirvana's fems, but it is Nirvana and you could be getting an S1 from F2 parents, I found nothing on their site about WW genetics other than "Hybrid".

It's always a good idea to have a bottle of Dutch Master's Reverse and Penetrator on hand.

.


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## bicycle racer (Aug 6, 2009)

my pre98 bubba fem hybrids are flowering now no issues only female growth i made them in a proper way so i should get no herm issues all the way to harvest well see.


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## superdave5 (Aug 6, 2009)

I have dutch master liquid light and penetrator. The ball was not on a stick either but when I removed it I squeed it and 4 little points popped out it was kinda wierd. What will the reverse do from dutch master and thanks for the replies


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## Hobbes (Aug 6, 2009)

*"What will the reverse do from dutch master and thanks for the replies"*

Basically it is suppose to stop the development of current male flowers and stop the growth of new male flowers, on a hermaphrodite. I've had mixed results and find it works best if you hit the plant with Reverse and Penetrator at the first banana. I've used it on hydro clones (leaves and roots) during the first 2 weeks of 12/12 and stopped a clone from a bad hermieing mother, from hermieing. 

I'm going to be lazy and work on my copy and paste 

.

*"Reverse will stop male flowers and hermaphrodites in problematic plants such as pumpkins, watermelons and any flowering crop that has a tendency to hermaphrodite or show male flowers. Dutch Master Reverse has a fast knowckdown action against existing male flowers as well as previnting more male flowers from forming due to their unique technology.

Reverse can detune the plant receptor cells that are responsible for gibberellin reception and secondary biosynthesis that is responsible for over 95% of the cases of unwanted male flower expression."* 

http://www.dutchmaster.com.au/?language=english&page=product&product=REVERSE

.


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## Hobbes (Aug 12, 2009)

Dutch Passion feminized seed info:

In an experiment done in 1999 we grew 15 varieties of "feminized" seeds. We started with 30 seeds per variety. The goals were: 

1) to determine the percentages of female, male, and hermaphroditic plants. 
2) to compare the uniformity (homogeneity) among plants from "feminized" seeds with those grown from "regular" seeds.

1. The results were excellent. Nine out of fifteen varieties had 100% female offspring. Percentages of female plants from the other 6 varieties were between 80 and 90%. These plants were all hermaphrodites, producing their male flowers at the end of their lifecycle. Seed-setting hardly took place. No males were found.

2. Approximately 70% of the plants of varieties grown from "feminized" seeds were far more uniform than plants grown from "regular" seeds of the same variety. About 20% of the varieties were a little more uniform, while in 10% of the varieties no difference in uniformity was seen.

From literature and our own findings it appears that the growth of a male or female plant from seed, except for the predisposition in the gender chromosomes, also depends on various environmental factors. 

The environmental factors that influence gender are:



a higher nitrogen concentration will give more females.
a higher potassium concentration will give more males.
a higher humidity will give more females.
a lower temperature will give more females.
more blue light will give more females.
Fewer hours of light will give more females.
 
It is important to start these changes at the three-pairs-of-leaves stage and continue for two or three weeks, before reverting to standard conditions.

To produce our feminized seeds, we start with selected female clones. Under standard conditions these female clones do not produce any male flowers. By the method we found, we are able to have these female clones produce abundant male flowers and pollen (see photos). The pollen thus produced we use for the production of our "feminized" seeds.








http://www.dutch-passion.nl/index.php?p=feminized

.


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## bicycle racer (Aug 12, 2009)

wait so are they using chemicals to produce fems which is the proper way or simply enviromental influences(stress)?


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## Hobbes (Aug 12, 2009)

*"By the method we found, we are able to have these female clones produce abundant male flowers and pollen"*

They probably keep their secrets close to the chest, an advantage over competition. They don't say the method of producing male flowers but I'd suspect it is an added chemical (like colloidal silver) or a hormone, combined with adjusting environment according to the findings they listed. And probably one or two they didn't list, conspiracies everywhere!

.


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## bicycle racer (Aug 12, 2009)

yeah your probably right.


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## XxNinjaxX (Aug 14, 2009)

I have GreenHouse Super Lemon Haze Feminised Seeds, i will let u kno how they go, its a shame to think i got the shits with Hermaphrodites so i decided to buy fem seeds - if only i had known this then!
I am 8 weeks in2 veg and will be turning in 2 weels. So -Watch This Space-
Peace - XxNinjaxX


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## Hobbes (Aug 14, 2009)

Ninja most people grow fine with feminized seeds, and Greenhouse has reviewed very well for sexual stability in it's fem strains. Most likely you'll have no problem at all, just be prepared with some Reverse and Penetrator for the worst outcome. 

How many weeks in flower 12/12 does your calendar system translate to? 

.


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## SnowWhite (Aug 14, 2009)

Interesting thread hobbes. I grew Nirvana fem snow white my first grow a few years ago. Totally stable females. Great genetics.

Since then, I've actualy had more hermie issues with non fem seeds. Mandala Satori hemied on me real bad, was it something I did wrong? IDK! But I've grown Cheese from clone and Black Dominia in the same environment without any hermie problems, so I have to think the Satori was a bit unstable and they weren't even fem seeds.

I'm just in week 2 of growing GH Trainwreck, Super Silver Haze and BB Blue Cheese, all fem seeds. I'll let you know how stable they are for me. I can't be doing with unstable genetics in my grow room though man!


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## Hobbes (Aug 14, 2009)

Good stuff SnowWhite. GH Trainwreck is the next fem seed I'm germing next, you'll be a few weeks ahead of me so I'll get a heads if there're problems with the fem strain. 

.


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## Hobbes (Aug 15, 2009)

*Flo - Dutch Passion* (feminized): 12/12 start on June 26. *Day 50*.

I'm starting to see a few bananas. I picked 2 or 3 dozen off tonight, later I'll go over it with tweezers then soak with Reverse and Penatrator. I could ignore the existing bananas because the Reverse will kill them, but I like to get an idea of the growth rate the next time I spay. I'll pick the Bananas again and get an idea if I'm properly treating the hermaphrodism. 

The banana production is bad enough to be a nuisance if I don't stop it. Dutch Passion feminized seeds suck fucking shit. 3 of 4 hermied - while growing beside other strains that did not hermie. And dollars to donuts I would have gone 4 for 4 if I hadn't picked a Runderalis cross.

*BEWARE DUTCH PASSION FEMINIZED SEEDS. USE AT YOUR OWN PERIL.*

Interesting buds though - small conical shaped, solid. And the leaves are turning shades of purple. 

This is so dissapointing, I was hoping to get a pheno that was good enough to keep as a mother. Never again will I settle for knockoffs. Should have gone directly to DJ Short.

The beast is in front, flat circle grow. Behind is a SSD sativa pheno.







.


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## THseaman (Aug 19, 2009)

cocoxxx said:


> i read on the greenhouse website that there feminised seeds are 100% female and 100% hermie free, is this 100% bullshit???


YES! Add, Himalaya Gold to the confirmed hermie risk list. Noticed last night that a specimen of a HG plant had turned hermie on me. It was on day 52 when I chopped it. It had 10-12 slightly opened sacs. 20-30 premature seeds also noticed throughout plant when I trimmed. 

This is my first Hermie and also my first batch of HG. I have been hyping up GH fem seeds for a while now after several successful grows with no hermies. This grounds me a bit. I had my guard down checking for hermies. When I first started growing fem seeds I was hypervigilant about checking for hermies but then I got comfortable after I never found any. I guess it's just certain strains eh?


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## THseaman (Aug 19, 2009)

ONEeyedWILLY444 said:


> it piss,s you off. you pay good money for good seeds and get complete and utter shit. i got 2 big buddha blue cheese that are hermie and had too cut one down early. i would,nt trust greenhouse anymore they are a set of cum drinking queers and over the past three years there genetics/seeds have become fucked. every other guy tells how there greenhouse seeds grow has gone tits up due too hermies/males. all greenhouse seeds do is say they are the best so people think they are (theyre not).
> and i hate the way that arjan names all them strains after himself as if he is the highest athourity on weed. i would never buy fuck all with that pricks name on it.
> 
> sorry if i am sounding a bit too angry but there is a reason for this. you see i was a devoted greenhouse seeds grower then one year i get a couple of bananas popping out of my himalayan gold, i thought nothing of it ripped the few off and carried on. then the next grow of himalayan my three plants had three different pheno,s. one was so bad that after 12 weeks of flowering it was mostly leaf and hardly any bud(what the fuck). then next grow was big bang bought ten seeds only 6 cracked no hermies but a serious loss considering my seeds where fem. then finally my latest crop greenhouse white widow FULL OF BANANAS AND SEEDS WTF. so thats it for me i gave them many chances.


DUDE!....I'm having the same experience with HG and BB! Only 5/10 germ'd for the BB and 7/10 for the HG. And then 1 of the HG grew bananas and the other 4 grew totally different. And I also had one that was 90% sugar leaf with almost no bud too that I chopped week 6. What a joke that plant was. I have never seen anything like it.

Greenhouse claiming their fem seeds are 100% female is 100% bullshit! I think I am going to try out flying dutchman.


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## JackHerer (Aug 19, 2009)

Im almost done with Greenhouse White Rhino and I have one hermie, but that is probably because I nearly killed it two months ago and after one month of the plant doing nothing Im luckily still gonna get at least a slice of decent bud. I think Greenhouse probably is alright if you stick with their older stuff and there are quite a few good grows on here of SLH. Im gonna try out some more expensive genetics the next 2 grows and see if it is worth it. Its not like the WR I have isnt good it smells nice and if this wasnt my first time they would be really nice Im sure. For something $200 I better get something that is AWESOME

good luck with the train wreck, do you think he actually got the arcata clone? and if you havent seen it the youtube video for trainwreck by Arjan its the worst one he has its pretty funny that sidekick of his should dress up like robin


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## Hobbes (Aug 19, 2009)

.

My Dutch Passion Bastardized Flo looks like it has fertilizer burn on the leaves, buds ... very severe, just horrible. 

I used 1/2 recommended strength Fox Farm granular nutes and mix 4 gallons of water and nutes in a 5 gallon bucket for watering. I'm flowering BF (Bastardized Flo), Super Strawberry Diesel, Bubblegum, Kali Mist and Big Laughing - all get the same nutes and Flo is the only one with even a hint of "what looks like" burn. And the burn is massive, I've never had it so bad and it all came in 48 hours after spraying with Reverse and Penatrator - and after the second feeding after changing from Fox Farm Liquid to Fox Farm Granular

I soaked her in Reverse and Penetrator, but I've done more to other plants and had no problem. The Penetrator concentration may have been a bit high (read A LOT) because I mixed a small amount for only 1 plant. I did mist the Flo with distilled water 3 times after applying the Reverse so it should have help more absorb rather than sit on the leaf and bud and do nasty stuff. Nothing I've ever read suggests that Reverse will burn leaves or buds, it has to be the nutes. 

The Reverse mixture spraying and subsequent distilled water misting was done outside the grow room - so the light through the liquid wouldn't burn the plant. I thought I left the plant long enough after the last misting but it's possible that the light prismed through the water drops and burnt the plant. I'll check in what would be shaded areas tonight, if they are/aren't burnt it'll give another clue as to what happened.

I watered with a gallon of clear water but I should have flushed with 5 - 15 gallons. If it's any worse tonight I'll do that. 

Strange problem, I'm thinking that Flo - coming from the Blueberry family - is very nute sensitive, much more so than SSD or Bubblegum. I've been searching the web for problems with Reverse or Penetrator causing burn but have found nothing.

And BF is Dutch Passion. F^#@!$# C^&$#!

.

I was reading Subcool's Chernobyl writeup and he said that he didn't like the Arcata Trainwreck cut because it tended to hermie - from clone. I'm switching my next fem germination to *White Widow* by *Seedsman*. I'd really like to run a trouble free feminized plant, and if someone can't get White Widow right (them breeding / me growing) there is no hope for growing fems.

.


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## msgmehere1 (Aug 20, 2009)

has anyone tried any of these breeders?
CH9 female seeds or Femaleseeds . nl (X-Line)


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## Hobbes (Aug 21, 2009)

This is a Flo that I burnt the leaves and buds. I think it's from a poorly mixed solution of Reverse and Penatrator I was using to stop the hermieing. I believe that I used about 5 times as much Penetrator as I should have: I poured a small amount of Reverse for one plant and I used a full batch portion of Penetrator. 

It also could have been from fertilizer burn, so I flushed with 5 gallons of clear water. I have 6 other plants feed on the same mixture so unless Flo is really fert sensative, which it might be being from the blue family, it's probably not the problem.

The other possibility I ruled out is burning the leaves: I sprayed the Reverse out side the grow room so the liquid would have longer to absorb before it evaporated. I misted 3 times after the leaves dried to be sure there was no Reverse left on the leaf. There were dead and burned leaves in the shade, so I don't think the problem was burn from the HID light being prismed by water drops.

On the bright side its 3 days after spraying and there's no banana re-growth, which means there's a good chance that the hermieing can be stopped.







.


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## bicycle racer (Aug 21, 2009)

ouch that sucks.


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## siltysand (Aug 21, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> This is a Flo that I burnt the leaves and buds. I think it's from a poorly mixed solution of Reverse and Penatrator I was using to stop the hermieing. I believe that I used about 5 times as much Penetrator as I should have: I poured a small amount of Reverse for one plant and I used a full batch portion of Penetrator.
> 
> It also could have been from fertilizer burn, so I flushed with 5 gallons of clear water. I have 6 other plants feed on the same mixture so unless Flo is really fert sensative, which it might be being from the blue family, it's probably not the problem.
> 
> ...


I accidently used twice the amount of penetrator and burned the leaves. The same strain plants that recieved the correct amount were fine.


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## Mr.Therapy Man (Aug 21, 2009)

Hey hobbes ,how long did your order off bidzbay take,Its been two weeks and its still showing unpaid on that fucked up site


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## Hobbes (Aug 21, 2009)

Bidzbay took about 3 - 4 weeks, yeah it's fucked. I've never seen a marijuana seedbank web site that looks like it was designed by someone on acid. 

I've found them to be good people, but their order system is a nightmare.

.


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## Hobbes (Aug 21, 2009)

*"I accidently used twice the amount of penetrator and burned the leaves. The same strain plants that recieved the correct amount were fine"

*I think the mystery is solved. More Penetrator is not better than the manufacturer suggested amount.

I clipped all the dead leaves, most of the fan leaves. I'll clip some of the dead buds for my hash bucket once the plant stabilizes, leave the green and get rid of anything dead.

.


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## haze2 (Aug 21, 2009)

Yo Mr therapy I just placed an order 2 days ago and Its still telling me the same thing so I dont know what thats all about. Please let me know or post or something if anything changes I will do the same. Hobbes sorry for posting off subject.Haze2


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## Hobbes (Aug 22, 2009)

I harvested the burnt Flo (Dutch Passion) today, 56 days of flower which is pretty good for me. Some of the buds' trichomes were 100% amber, some 20%. No bananas grew back after the Reverse application. 

If I clipped the burnt bud and waited for new bud to grow the plant would be 100% amber long before I made up the weight. It was like Dutch Passion's Blueberry, poorly formed buds, not good weight. 

The taste is like a musky berry, very heavy. A tingling on the back center and sides of the tongue, very satisfying taste. The first bag I had I was confused and blurry headed but the last couple have been clear headed. Just a cup of bud baked cured @ 110 C for an hour. I've got the rest hanging, it's cool the way it hangs in a circle.

.

*August 22* - *White Widow* - *Seedsman* (Feminized): *germinated*.

Time to start it all over. Again.

http://www.cannabis-seeds-bank.co.uk/seedsman-seeds/seedsman-seeds-feminized/seedsman-seeds-white-widow-feminized/prod_433.html
.


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## bicycle racer (Aug 23, 2009)

my own fem creations and a few other hybrids are in 6 weeks of flower outdoor all are perfect so far no reverse application as of yet needed i think they will go to harvest with no issues.


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## donkeyote (Aug 24, 2009)

i just started to germ a fem. WW from Seedsman this weekend as well, lol. Will take a couple pics once a week and see how they compare to yours. I'm doing a micro, organic soil grow with CFLs, should be interesting.


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## Scamstopper (Aug 27, 2009)

I just saw this thread and can&#8217;t believe anyone would want to use hermaphrodites or any other freak plant as seed stock. If you use freak parent plants you will get freak seeds and on and on.

In short, buying feminized seeds, making them from hermaphroditic parents and or hormonal alteration, picking off male parts and hoping to not pollinate your whole crop is all a waste of time and the wrong way to go. 

Use natural genetic variations from un-altered male and females seeds, look for a super-breed (the best characteristics you want) out of as many as possible. Then clone! clone! clone!

There&#8217;s no need to buy feminized seeds over and over. It&#8217;s too much money, hassle dealing with orders, hermaphrodites, mutant plants, etc. 

This article explains what I have posted in more detail.
http://www.cannabisculture.com/v2/node/394


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## Mr.Therapy Man (Aug 27, 2009)

Scamstopper,Not all female seeds hermie and I agree with everyone one else,Your just looking for a place to shed more tears


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## Scamstopper (Aug 27, 2009)

Mr. Therapy Man,

I didnt say all feminized seeds turn hermaphrodite, but to clarify a growing percentage of them are.

I have no need to shed tears anywhere; you should spend more time understanding what is posted rather than coming up with clever insults.


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## bicycle racer (Aug 27, 2009)

you have not grown too many properly produced fem seeds that much is clear as i have said before i have had as many if not more herm issues from standard male/female seeds as i have had with fems. i dont know what people do to make plants herm so easily. i have even grown seeds from grows i knew were produced from a herm situation and grew them to harvest without issue. i have properly produced fems of my own creation right now in week 6 or so of flower in 100 plus temps theyll be fine and wont herm. its all a matter of method regarding selection of female candidates and proper chemical induced reversal very simple.


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## Scamstopper (Aug 27, 2009)

bicycle racer,

Your right, I dont buy fem seeds and do not reproduce with herms. So I must defer to your experience with them.

It seems that if a chemically induced fem is made from what would have been a male, that the amount of that chemical must be enough to fully reverse its natural gender. Too little and it would produce some halfway hem.

Also, if a hem pollinated its self or another hem it would produce hem seeds. I know there is always some genetic diversity and throw backs but I mean in general.

Do you think chemically induced hems that dont make it to full fems can pass on that trait in its genetics? 

Also do you think the hormone used for feming may interact with the hormone responsible for triggering the flowering stage? The freaks I got seemed to lack the light sensitive hormone responsible for flowering.

I know in genetic research they are finding that when one trait is altered that it can alter other traits. This was fruit flies but plants may be the same. I think this field of science may be to young to know yet but so far it seems there may be a connection.

What do you think?


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## SnowWhite (Aug 28, 2009)

Scamstopper said:


> I just saw this thread and cant believe anyone would want to use hermaphrodites or any other freak plant as seed stock. If you use freak parent plants you will get freak seeds and on and on.
> 
> In short, buying feminized seeds, making them from hermaphroditic parents and or hormonal alteration, picking off male parts and hoping to not pollinate your whole crop is all a waste of time and the wrong way to go.
> 
> ...


As the title says, it's a 'test'. He's testing the stability of feminised genetics. How can he test feminised genetics and not use feminised seeds? I think you're missing the point. Don't be a hater just cos you personally don't like fem seeds. Lots of people grow with them and are interested in this little experiment hobbes has going on.


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## Scamstopper (Aug 28, 2009)

SnowWhite,

I don&#8217;t mean to discourage testing, I am big on testing myself.

It just seems like to clone a known fem supper plant is more efficient. But if he is doing it just for the fun of it, that wouldn&#8217;t mater. I may be to into results, than having fun with my tests. 

I do put hems and mosquitoes in the same category so I may be predigest against them. Thanks for the comment. I will be more open minded.

I am curious about the technology though.


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## SupraSPL (Aug 28, 2009)

As far as I can tell all of Greenhouse offerings are all fem now. Arjan explained his interest: http://www.youtube.com/user/greenhouseseeds
So far the fem seeds I have seen have been negative (naners on Dutch Passion Blueberry). 

Despite that, I cannot deny that I am interested in the color code Sativa Mix Greenhouse is offering. Mared Juwan, did you make it all the way to harvest banana free?


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## SnowWhite (Aug 28, 2009)

Scamstopper said:


> SnowWhite,
> 
> I dont mean to discourage testing, I am big on testing myself.
> 
> ...


cool man. No one wants hermies, but shit sometimes happens. Even with non fem seeds. Hobbes is trying to 'treat' the hermies and see how they respond. I love it, fair play to him! 

But there is no reason you can't select a good stable mother from fem seeds.


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## haze2 (Aug 28, 2009)

Supra what strain is that in your pic Ive seen that strain somewhere?


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## ONEeyedWILLY444 (Aug 31, 2009)

haze2 said:


> Supra what strain is that in your pic Ive seen that strain somewhere?


looks like belladonna


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## haze2 (Aug 31, 2009)

sounds right actually lol


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## oscaroscar (Aug 31, 2009)

I've looked through this thread and i can't see a report on sensi's Jack Flash #5 at the start you mentioned it. Is it to come? I've currently got 3 on the go, 2 weeks into 12/12, a bit early to herm yet but i've heard they do herm quite easily. I'll give you report every couple of weeks as they progress.


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## Hobbes (Aug 31, 2009)

*"sensi's Jack Flash #5 at the start you mentioned it. Is it to come?"*

Oscaro I've still got the feminized seed. I've got Kali Mist flowering and waiting through another long flowering strain put me off JF#5 for now.

Please report on your grow as often as you'd like, I'd like to know what I'm getting in to when I germ my seed.

.


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## oscaroscar (Aug 31, 2009)

You can check out my journal, the JF#5 starts at about page 40 i think


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## oscaroscar (Aug 31, 2009)

its called a grow journal, nuff said, btw


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## Hobbes (Aug 31, 2009)

Is it in this forum? Thanks, I'll be keeping up with your grow.

.


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## oscaroscar (Aug 31, 2009)

Yes its in the grow journals, i'd put a link in but i'm a bit thick when it comes computers lol


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## oscaroscar (Aug 31, 2009)

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/183193-grow-journal-nuff-said-39.html
i think i've done it right


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## Hobbes (Aug 31, 2009)

No worries. This place is simple, highlight and copy the url in your browser url box above, then paste it in this dialog box. I'm quite the expert at copy and paste. 

.

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/183193-grow-journal-nuff-said.html

.


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## oscaroscar (Sep 8, 2009)

Here are my Sensi jack flash#5 at just over 3 weeks in 12/12. I've got 3 of them all from seed and showing 3 different phenos one is big which i think is probably the sativa dominant and one short and bushy and the other is in the middle. There is no sign of herming yet (he crosses his fingers). They have had a bit of stress which was the light being too close (a 600w hps in a cooltube) they've had a bit of bleaching coz of that but they didn't burn thanks to the cooltube.
The last pic is of a Greenhouse super silver haze which is the same age as the jack flash and has been flowering for the same time too with no sign of herming (yet). The SSH has been a real pain in the arse to grow. I have 2 SSH both from fem seeds and they have been growing really slow and look feeble and weak the pic is of the best one. I can't remember if the SSH was on the list at the start of this thread, i'll include it in my weekly updates in this thread if you want me to.


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## oscaroscar (Sep 8, 2009)

I've just gone back and looked at the 1st page again and the GH SSH is on the list so i'll include it if you'd like me to.


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## DontDoDrugs (Sep 13, 2009)

this is a great thread. but im looking for info on Seedman Fem seeds. are they good fem seeds or will they go hermi? im thinking of getting a few strains from them but idk if it will be a waste of money.


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## Hobbes (Sep 13, 2009)

.*

Contributed by HHF from another thead*:

.

*If you reverse a polyhybrid that is not stableised you will see different plant phenos. If you reverse a stable strain, you will not. Reversal is useful in this regard for checking parental composition.

STS is a chemical composition SILVER THIOSULFATE (STS) SOLUTION and is used to reverse females to males to make female seeds.

Here is the recipe:

* .

*PREPARATION OF **Silver Thiosulfate (STS)*
*
Silver Thiosulfate (STS) is commonly used to block the action of ethylene in plant cell cultures.
Ethylene is a hormone that is present in the gaseous state. Ethylene increases during
senescence and ripening, and has been shown to increase in plant cell cultures due to
wounding or the presence of auxins. Silver nitrate may be used alone to block the action of
ethylene but it is not transported as well as STS thus is seldom used alone.

Prepare a 0.1 M Sodium Thiosulfate (STS) stock solution by dissolving 1.58 g of Sodium
Thiosulfate (Product No. S 620) into 100 ml of water. Prepare a 0.1 M Silver Nitrate stock
solution by dissolving 1.7 g of Silver Nitrate (Product No. S 169) into 100 ml of water. Store the
stock solution in the dark until needed to prepare the STS.

The STS solution is prepared with a molar ratio between silver and thiosulfate of 1:4,
respectively. Nearly all of the silver present in the solution is in the form of [Ag (S2O3)2]3-, the
active complex for ethylene effect inhibition.

Prepare a 0.02 M STS by slowly pouring 20 ml of 0.1 M silver nitrate stock solution into 80 ml of
0.1 M sodium thiosulfate stock solution. The STS can be stored in the refrigerator for up to a
month. However, preparation of the STS just prior to use is recommended. * 

.


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## DontDoDrugs (Sep 13, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> .*
> 
> Contributed by HHF from another thead*:
> 
> ...


hey i saw you were growing seedsman white widdow. did it go hermi? or do you have any exp with seedsman fem seeds?


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## Hobbes (Sep 13, 2009)

.

Hey DDD

*"I'm looking for info on Seedman Fem seeds. are they good fem seeds or will they go hermi?"

"seedsman white widdow. did it go hermi? or do you have any exp with seedsman fem seeds"

*I'm just at 2 or 3 weeks of veg for my Seedsman WW, it's growing well.

I have no other personal experience with Seedsman but I've read good reviews. I'm not expecting it to hermie, that and it's potency are the reasons I'm germinating this one now. I don't want to go through another hermie grow.

Seedsman WW is suppose to be a sativa pheno with more of a head high than Black Widow.

.


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## DontDoDrugs (Sep 13, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> Hey DDD
> 
> ...


yah its probably the best weed i ever smoked.. my friend grew it last year and it had the funkyest smell and BEST high ever. it was very intense but not paranoid, but it sure was on the edge lol. i just dont know if their fem seeds are good. 

im doing an ebb & flow grow and i dont wanna have to pull males out which might damage roots. i think im going to end up buying the regular seeds so i dont dissapoint myself if they do go hermi.. 

When do you plan on flowering that WW?

and thanks for the quick reply +rep


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## gotthat (Sep 13, 2009)

good thread.nice read so far. thanks


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## Hobbes (Sep 13, 2009)

*.

"When do you plan on flowering that WW?"*

I'm going to top when the plant is 3" above the 3rd node (to clone for a mother) and flower in a CCOB when the topped plant is at 20" above the top - circles the bucket. Probably 4 or 5 weeks, I'm going to have a full flower garden for a while so I'm not concerned about time.

.


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## DontDoDrugs (Sep 13, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> *.
> 
> "When do you plan on flowering that WW?"*
> 
> ...


alright then, im just going with the reg seeds and maybe next time ill go with the fem if ur grow goes well. good luck!


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## donkeyote (Sep 13, 2009)

ive got 2 seedsman WW fems seedlings going right now too, gonna put one in flower after a two week veg, and get clones off the other one, will update my results


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## Cheech Wizard (Sep 14, 2009)

Hey Hobbes, I know this is off topic but I just ordered Subcools Vortex and Flying Ducthman Early Durban.... heard anything about those?


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## Hobbes (Sep 14, 2009)

Sorry Cheech, nothing on either.

.


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## donkeyote (Sep 14, 2009)

i thought Subcool didn't do fem seeds.


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## bicycle racer (Sep 14, 2009)

he does not last time i checked.


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## Hobbes (Sep 14, 2009)

.

About 3 weeks ago I posted this picture of a Dutch Passion feminized Flo that hermied, then I burnt it with too much penetrator.







I harvested because I didn't think much bud would grow back (poor producer) and I could salvage the burnt bud. The trichomes had turned mostly amber, I'm not sure it that had anything to do with the burn. The smoke had been interesting but harsh after bagging and I thew the bud in a jar. 

I wasn't expecting much from it and was packing some up as a gift for a friend. I vaporized a half teaspoon and it was beautiful, musky mild grape and smooth. A confusing high: forget what you're doing or why you're where you are. But that's OK. Yep.

The effects may change in time but - although this is not what I expected from Flo - the effects are very pleasant and enjoyable. DJ Short's regular Flo is back on the list.

.


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## Brick Top (Sep 14, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> About 3 weeks ago I posted this picture of a Dutch Passion feminized Flo that hermied, then I burnt it with too much penetrator.
> 
> ...


 

The first portion above in red explains the second portion in red above. 
&#12288;
Mostly amber trichomes means THC has begin to oxidize and creates increased levels of CBN. 
&#12288;
Increased levels of CBN cause a confused messed up effect. 
&#12288;
Some people do not manage to connect those dots. (Not meaning YOU, just meaning "some people.")


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## bicycle racer (Sep 14, 2009)

i thought it was cbd which increases or is it both regardless im an indica lover so i love such cannabinoids sativas are not best for me only sometimes.


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## Hobbes (Sep 14, 2009)

*.

"The first portion above in red explains the second portion in red above."*

Yes I agree, thank you for posting it for everyone. What suprised me was the extent of the change from what I thought the high would be like to what the stone actually was. I'm really surprised at the degree of change. The amber caught me by surprise, there was a speckling and I must have missed a few days and it was ripe.

.


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## bicycle racer (Sep 15, 2009)

i normally harvest at a point when there are mainly cloudy trichs and maybe a touch of amber works for me.


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## wheezgethigh (Oct 11, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> There's a lot of interest in *feminized seeds*, for obvious reasons, and we've had some discussion on the susceptibility of plants grown from feminized seeds to turn *hermaphrodite*. I'm going to *track 14 feminized seeds for 14 strains from seed to harvest *to see how they fare during flower, as well as experimenting with ways to stop the banana production once hermieing begins, and ways to keep the plant from hermieing to start with.
> 
> 
> My feminized strains are:
> ...


i jus red some of this thread i have to bounce cant finish reading it yet , but i have white widow, king kush fem from wwms i c the w.w is on ur list how did it turn out, i hope my k.k isnt hermie, peace


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## Hayduke (Oct 11, 2009)

My Red Diesel (regular) all hermmied really bad...they had to go!

I have K-train and Headband that through a banana here and there around 5 and 9 weeks. I get an occasional seed from where (I believe) the banana does not erupt from the calyx. Both strains were originally clones and were revegged. After several generations the trait is close to gone...at least it is no big deal....they do not swell up and burst like real male flowers.


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## mv400 (Oct 12, 2009)

subscribed.... thanks for this informative post


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## mv400 (Oct 13, 2009)

I read some of you guys grew Blue Cheese from Big Buddha. How was the taste and high? I ordered one from pick and mix seeds to try it out with some others.


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## polishfalcon420 (Oct 13, 2009)

hey whats up hobbes? I have read this post a couple of times but I have a memory issue and was wondering how the greenhouse trainwreck went as I have a pack of them on the way along with k-train, Barneys bluecheese, lsd, querkle, and purple wreck, OG #18. have you seen any problems with these going hermi? I just finished a grow and had a NL regular bean from KC brains go hermi on me real bad. that plant itself filled a whole film cannister with beans and Im sure Ill find plenty more. the other plants that it pollinated on me werent bad though a few beans here and their. it had to be the plant that I couldnt get to for inspection of coarse so I didnt catch it till about 6 weeks in flower.


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## Hidden Agenda (Oct 22, 2009)

I just had a seedsman WW seed go male on me. Not even herm!



I took a bunch of clones off of this thing before putting it into flower. Not happy!!!

Now I have to start over!


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## mv400 (Oct 22, 2009)

Hidden Agenda said:


> I just had a seedsman WW seed go male on me. Not even herm!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ouch  .... that sucks man...


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## greengenius (Oct 22, 2009)

I read through almost all of this thread. I couldn't seem to find if this scenario was covered:
I received 4 'female' clones from a grower who breaded a 'stable' pineapple x SSH which he calls Hawaiin punch. Of the 4 clones, I mothered 1 and flowered 3. I noticed in week three of flowering 1 of the plants had hairs and balls. Im currently growing 5 different strains and none of the others became hermie though they did undergo the same stress. I removed the plant and a week later noticed a Second Hawaiin Punch hermie... Though i was too late... The sacks had opened up and polinated all my other girls.

Questions
Was the hermie caused by stress since there is still 1HP clone flowering that is 100% female?
Are the seeds that the other strains are now producing likely to carry this hermie trait?
Are the seeds from the only female HP clone going to be considered 'feminized'?

I ask because the genetics of the hawaiin punch are supposed to be of some really amazing sativas. Im hoping this grow wasn't all a wash because of the hermie. I can stand looking at seedy bud so long as the seeds could be useful in the future. Im in no way a breeder, I only got stuck with seeds because Im obviously not that observant. So any help, even layman explanations would be useful and appreciated.


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## donkeyote (Oct 22, 2009)

Here's my Seedsman WW fem at 22 days of flower. No problems at all thus far. I have noticed that the clones i took are taking a lot longer to root than the NL i have going, but other than that, no complaints.


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## Hobbes (Oct 22, 2009)

.

Thanks donkeyote, beautiful plant. My Seedsman WW is just 2 nodes over the top (~1 1/2") and I won't put it into flower until it's 22". I've got it under a weak florescent to slow the grow, my flower garden is starting to overflow from 3 Subcool and 1 Rez strain that I'm running for the first time with my keeper strains. I would really like to be able to keep a mother from this WW.

.


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## donkeyote (Oct 22, 2009)

i put it in flower at about 5 inches and it still exploded vertically for ten days before putting on buds.


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## Hobbes (Oct 22, 2009)

.

*"Was the hermie caused by stress since there is still 1HP clone flowering that is 100% female?"*

Impossible to be sure but from the way things are playing out the sexually 'stable' clones are probably less stable than the other strains you are growing - from established breeders? I have similar problems - I run Serious Kail Mist and Bubblegum fine but Barney's Red Diesel and 3 of Dutch Passion feminized strains hermied. I wonder if someone else grew those feminized beans if they would not hermie - if there is a threshold level of stress that causes hermieing, or if the seed is going to hermie regardless of the grower. It's possible that the strain is sexually stable for your friend's grow set up but not yours.

Have you harvested yet? If you haven't it's very possible the 3rd plant could hermie.

.

*"Are the seeds that the other strains are now producing likely to carry this hermie trait?"*

That's one for a breeder. There's a member called HHF who is a commercial breeder and very helpfull - if you do an advanced search for HHF's posts and post the question and this URL for him I'm sure he will give you an answer that's not pulled out of his ass. As mine would be. I'm not sure how familiar you are with our forum, your post count is still low, to do an advanced search click on the *Search* button at the top of the page, click *Advanced Search*, then use the *User Name* field to find *HHF*'s latest posts.

.

*"Are the seeds from the only female HP clone going to be considered 'feminized'?"*

If pollenated by itself or one of the other clones from the same mother then it should produce 100% female or hermie seeds. S1s are seeds from a plant pollenated with it's own pollen, since a two clones from the same mother are genetically identical, one clone pollenating another will produce S1s.

But you probably aren't going to want to flower plants from those seeds - unless the bud is phenominal or you want to experiment. Even the best S1s are slightly less sexually stable than the parent.

.

*"Im in no way a breeder, I only got stuck with seeds because Im obviously not that observant."*

I think we'd be hard pressed to find anyone who's been growing for awhile who hasn't had some beans, don't smack your head against the wall for that. 

.


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## greengenius (Oct 22, 2009)

Thank you so much for the quick response as this provided much insite. I've been visiting these forums for the past couple years and have had a lot of my questions answered through the search function. I'll look in to HHF's wisdom in addition to this thread.

I've always been interested in breeding as I've seen some crosses that I wish I could tweak a little. I understand a lot of it is left to chance... however by chance, I happened to pollinate a lot of established indica's with a fantastic Super Silver Haze cross. Im hoping for that hallucinogenic, euphoric head high in a fast flowering plant.... but without the balls. You're saying this is hard to accomplish in the first run?

Once again thank you for the insite.


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## Hobbes (Oct 22, 2009)

.

*"Im hoping for that hallucinogenic, euphoric head high in a fast flowering plant.... but without the balls. You're saying this is hard to accomplish in the first run?"*

I'm not sure I understand - the first run being the first cross strain F1 or the S1?

.

*"I've always been interested in breeding as I've seen some crosses that I wish I could tweak a little."*

Dank by Subcool is suppose to be a great book on breeding, I'm not ready for breeding yet but I'm going to pick the book up for a good read. 

If memory serves, and it often doesn't, HHF and Subcool are connected through Cannaseur ... HHF sent free seeds to a forum member who's Subcool seed order and money didn't reach Cannaseur. I think.

.

*Dank: The Quest for the Very Best Marijuana*
*
Dank - * *$34.95 US / $46.95 INT / $42.95 CDN shipping incl.*

A Breeders tale, By Subcool 

-37 varieties lovingly described by the breeder 
-Vibrant color photos of buds at peak of ripeness 
-Photo essays showing growth from seed to bud
-Progenitors of all varieties described in detail.

Based on the authors 20 years of passionate selection and experience, Dank: The Quest for the Very Best Marijuana is the story of one breeder's quest for pot perfection. Author Subcool, both a talented photographer and a well known breeding whiz, describes each step of his journey toward ganja heaven; raising each strain, mixing and matching traits, and ultimately choosing the offspring that will advance to become the newest pinnicle in pot-the newest Dank. 

Revealing his thought process as he assesses the traits that will go forward. Subcool provides an intimate portrait of each variety's personality. Beautifully lit photos and full-color spreads accompany these complete descriptions of over 35 varieties, with detailed profiles of each strain's aroma, taste, and high, as well as how it grows, and what it looks like. Useful appendices feature full genetic tress of each strain discussed.


http://dankgearonline.com/store/product5.html



.


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## greengenius (Oct 23, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> *"Im hoping for that hallucinogenic, euphoric head high in a fast flowering plant.... but without the balls. You're saying this is hard to accomplish in the first run?"*
> 
> I'm not sure I understand - the first run being the first cross strain F1 or the S1?


The nearby pollinated indicas... so the F1 I believe. My question is aimed at finding stable desireable traits on the first cross. Is this unrealistic?


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## Hobbes (Oct 24, 2009)

.

gg I'm not absolutely sure about this, you really need a breeder, but hermie traits usually follow to the seed. Breeders might flower out a hundred seeds and look for the offspring that doesn't hermie and use a clone from that plant in their second cross for more sexually stable strain.

You should germinate some of those seeds anyway, get some Dutch Passion Reverse and Penatrator, if they hermie too bad chop them.

A safer option for you would be to:

- germ as many seeds as you can handle 6" pots in a free part of your garden, 20 oz cups for the mother in veg. You can use 20 oz cups for 8" clones in flower but the yield will be smaller and watering is a lot more work. I've had a Northern Lights mother in a cup for over 2 years and it's 12" tall with about 4 nodes to the inch. Looks kind of gross.
- top to take a clone from each seed plant.
- label everything so you can later match clone to mother.
- keep the topped plant from seed as a potential mother
- flower a large number of short clones to see which are going to be sexually stable and which will hermie
- chop the hermies and their mothers immediately when the clones show bananas.
- flower out and harvest the clones that don't hermie, hang/bag/cure and keep the mother for the best bud / best yielder / fastest finisher - or whatever traits are important to you.
- take a clone from your keeper mothers, to be the next mother, and put the keeper mothers from seed into flower in 5 gallon buckets for your main bud for the strain.

You get to test each bean for sexual stability, you'll hopefully get some plants that finish to get some bud, it won't take up much room in your garden.

That's the best answer I can come up with right now. Again, you need HHF or another breeder to get good advice.

.


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## Hobbes (Nov 19, 2009)

.

I harvested another Flo clone today, 15%-20% amber. A banana here and there but nothing I haven't seen on even Serious Bubblegum.

The strain was so great to vaporize last time - musky grape taste, really does have a happy motivational high - that I had to try it again. I went really light on the nutes and it grew like a gem. I have a hypothesis that clones will get more sexually stable both the older they get and the more generations removed from the mother. Maybe the latter is a function of former.

I harvested on flower day 55, 8 week strain. One of the few I've gotten to finish on time, the mother from seed finished on time too. This pic was from last night, the HPS light washes out the color. It turns purple under the leaves first, the tops stay green. Then the purple spreads to the little leaves, then buds, and through that the tops of the leaves. Beautiful little plant but not a good producer. 

I'm going to go through a few more generations of this clone, I may pick up DJ's version too.







.

This is from 2 weeks ago (left), you can see some of the purple under the leaves starting back then. To the right is a Serious Bubblegum that I harvested last weekend.







This Flo has redeemed feminized (and Dutch Passion) seeds for me. I have a better idea what to expect from them and what they can be used for. I know enough now to know that buying 1 feminized seed for a strain will probably not give us the pheno and plant that we are looking for - we will probably need to germinate a batch of seeds and pick the best as a mother, the same as regular seeds. 

I germinated Blueberry, Super Silver Haze, Cheese, Strawberry Cough (4), Train Wreck, Jack Flash and Blue Moonshine on Monday - all but Blue Moonshine popped the soil under 36 hours, I'm still waiting on the Blue Moonshine. A couple more months and I'll have some more info to post.

.


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## mv400 (Nov 19, 2009)

Such informative topic. Thank you for sharing with us


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## Mindmelted (Nov 19, 2009)

fem. snow white from nirvana no hermies
fem. white berry from paradise no hermies
fem. apple jack from seedism no hermies
fem. super silver haze from greenhouse no hermies
fem. train wreck from greenhouse no hermies

5 grows all fem seeds and no hermies....lol

Thanks for the info hobbes


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## SnowWhite (Nov 20, 2009)

yo hobbes...good to see your still doing your thing man. Looking good.

I told you a while back I was doing a fem seed grow with GHS Trainwreck and Super Silve Haze and Buddha's Blue Cheese. 9 seeds, 3 of each. No hermies at all. Totally solid females all round. Very pleased!


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## indica44 (Nov 22, 2009)

_I can speak up for PEAKSEEDSBC they are simply some of the best genetics out thier I have personaly grown skunkberry an northern lights an they are very heavy very potent smoke. I have TTXSK AN TTXBB AN BB AN SKB AN NB IN MY stash of peak seeds. I have a BIG BANG GREEN HOUSE FEM four weeks into flowering I have been picking off DINGLEBALLS for two days now got them all in premature stage I will just check it every night. I got one seed to srpout out of ten I got them from THE HEMP DEPOT I have had good sucsess with other Hemp depot products but these BIG bang fem seeds sucked. PEACE_


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## strain stalker (Dec 23, 2009)

Soma Seeds, "New York City Diesel Fem."....came from World Wide Seeds. *Hermie*_(Chop! Chop!)_


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## DankyKush1 (Jan 3, 2010)

My plant was exposed to a male pollen sack opening while flowering. Do you think this is a hermie now? or useless? 



















Thanks


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## speedyseedz (Jan 3, 2010)

how many of each are you running?


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## DankyKush1 (Jan 3, 2010)

well, I had two running, one was male, then this one, and now I was starting a new plant cause I thought this was a hermie. But if this is a female ill just start using this plant. I only had 3 seeds and they were from clinc bud so there not fem seeds, and I dont want to waist my time on a new plant if this is a female.


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## NickNasty (Jan 3, 2010)

If it was exposed to pollen then you will probably get seeds from it but that has nothing to do with if it will hermie or not. You should be fine.


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## DankyKush1 (Jan 3, 2010)

Okay thanks so im going to set it back to a 24/7 light cycle.
The plant should then grow fine and bud properly? (with seeds)


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## Hayduke (Jan 4, 2010)

DankyKush1 said:


> Okay thanks so im going to set it back to a 24/7 light cycle.
> The plant should then grow fine and bud properly? (with seeds)


If you switch the lights to 24/0, it will re-veg...it will take longer than seeds. You plant looks like it have been flowering for much longer than just for sexing, and is kinda small. If you are trying to take clones, unless this is some bomb bud that you just have to save...this is not a good idea. re-vegging takes a long time, again longer than from seed...flip the lights today to 24...you can look for a harvest date of the beginning of May.


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## doowmd (Jan 4, 2010)

so wats the final verdict? fems produce hermies alot or wat? from wat i read on here that seems to be the case, which sucks cause i was wanting to buy fem seeds.


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## Hobbes (Jan 5, 2010)

.

No verdict yet Doowmd, but fems are worth a try. Plants from feminized seeds will be slightly less sexually stable than the parent, but that doesn't mean we'll get hermies all the time. I'm growing feminized Flo again and haven't had a hermie problem over several grows, I've got 7 new feminized strains to go into flower in about 3-4 weeks.

My feelings - If you want a mother for cloning go with regular seeds for the best possible genetics; if you grow only from seed or want to try a strain without taking males to flower, and you want a better chance of getting a female that resembles the mother, then go feminized.

.


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## MEANGREEN69 (Jan 5, 2010)

kool thread..subed


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## panhead (Jan 5, 2010)

Hobbes said:


> I sprayed my feminized seed plants with Reverse again last night - after the first dose of Reverse last week both the Red Diesel and Blueberry's bananas dried up for a few days, then came back at a slower rate - a half dozen to a dozen each day. I picked the bananas every day this week before re-spraying last night, there were no bananas grown back this morning.
> 
> The Red Diesel clone in RDWC had only a couple of bananas for the whole week, amazing difference from it's mother in Pro Mix. The two Strawberry Cough clones in RDWC have produced no bananas 8 weeks into flower, while all other SC clones and the SC mother have hermied in past grows.
> 
> ...



Dont waste your time or cash on Dutchmasters Reverse as it has been proven to be complete snake oil & does nothing to stop the spread of polen or the production of pollen sacks in hermies,it is also not effective for using as a pollen knock down agent.

A year or so back myself & a few other members did a in depth study of all its intended uses & the effects of using reverse,there is a thread somewhere on this site you might saearch out if the sites search engine ever got upgraded to a working feature,if not google reverse a study of hermies to get the link.

I spent months testing the product on dozens of plants before making my mind up that the product is snake oil.

The only thing that Dutchmasters will reverse is your cash flow into the negative.


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## Hobbes (Jan 6, 2010)

.

Panhead did you find that Reverse dried up bananas that were growing and slowed new growth for a few days, before the plants continued to hermie as if not sprayed? I got temporary results with most applications but I certainly wouldn't call the product "Reverse", maybe "Slow" or "Time Out" but not Reverse.

Did you get any 100% stoppage of bananas with any trial? I had to give multiple applications to keep the banana production low but no 100% stoppage of new banana growth. In fact most times the banana production resumed as normal. I certainly agree with you that the product does not work as advertised and I don't know that it's any better than a pair of tweezers.

With your study what did you determine the best course of action when you have a plant that hermied? Either from stress or poor genetics. 

Thanks.

.

https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/139699-dutchmasters-reverse-study-hermies.html

Good looking thread (14 pages). I've read a few posts by Uncle Ben and yourself near the end, lots of info to absorb, I'll need a day or two to get up to speed just so I can ask sensible questions about Reverse.

.


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## Hedgehunter (Jan 10, 2010)

Can I add GreenHouse Himalaya GOLD to the list, mild hermies grown in good conditions.


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## Cheech Wizard (Jan 13, 2010)

Hey Hobbes... well, my paradise fem Nebulas grew out very uuniform, all produced top quality, resin-coated ganja, however, I discovered some seeds in the lower smaller buds. wtf! the Black Dominas i grew along with the Nebulas were regular seeds. I removed the males right away(.btw, I used 5 out of the 10 seeds that came in a sensi seeds reg pack, out of the 5 I germed 4 were female).. I didnt see any bannana things on the Nebulas, they just formed some seeds... only on lower buds,.. so, are these seeds good to grow? or will some hermie trait be embedded in them? Im confused... but, Nebula is some fucking amazing herb that I highly reccomend so I would totally grow those out if you think theyd be worth it. I actually ordered another pack from Paradise already I was so impressed with the quality of the nebula, although I ordered their regular seeds this time.


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## Hobbes (Jan 13, 2010)

.

Hey Cheech

*"I discovered some seeds in the lower smaller buds."*

I find bananas in the lower nodes during early flower in some strains, I pick them and nothing more for the grow. I get a few seeds down low on these strains too.

*"are these seeds good to grow? or will some hermie trait be embedded in them"*

From the research I've done with seed companies and gurus posting in the forums and writing articles - Self pollinated seeds will be slightly (at least) less sexually stable than the parent. S1 being Self pollinated first generation. Each successive generation will be less sexually stable than the parent, at an exponential rate, until the 3rd or 4th generation where the plants are useless for our purposes.

You may get a good plant from the seed, but if the parent hermied you can be sure the daughter will hermie worse. This is one of the reasons seed companies love feminized: grower's can't produce their own seeds; rip off breeders will have less sexually stable genetics if they buy an S1 and sell S2s. One extra level of security to protect the work they put into developing their genetics.

According to Dutch Passion's research a feminized offspring has a 70% chance of closely resembling the mother, less the sexual stability cascade. Some things I'd think about are - Was the mother that good that you want to see how the offspring turns out? Are you just curious? Nothing like trying a plant to see for yourself. If the mother was good and you have no clone if the dirt is still in the bucket you may be able to get a root clone which will be an exact duplicate, much better than seed.

I've grown hermie seed to see what happened but never got anything worth keeping. I believe in going through seed packs to find the best plant for a mother and cloning for exact duplicates.

.


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## el confusado (Jan 16, 2010)

Hola Hobbes, so how did the Taiga finish and what is your opinion of the buzz? I bought a few without having gone this deep in the research -- I'm a sucker for pot porn, and the pictures on Attitude were salacious, to put it mildly. Many people have said that Taiga MUST hermie, but they don't talk about grow routines, methods, light security or nutrients. It's like, if you give me the right hormones and flash some lights at me at the right time, perhaps I'll hermie, no?


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## Hobbes (Jan 16, 2010)

.

Hey el confusado!

The Taiga grew and harvested without a problem, no bananas worth worrying about. I grew mine in 12/12 with my regular plants instead of 20/4, I think it stretched and took longer to finish because of the short light time during flower. Probably lower yield and potency too. Perhaps because of this I didn't find the bud to give any special high, but I've got incredibly high tolerance too. Decent plant, I'm sure it can be grown out better than I did.

33" Taiga on the left, 24" Big Laughing on the right.







.


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## primo604 (Jan 16, 2010)

DONT BUY FEM SEEDS!!!!!!!!!!!
dont belive the hype ,companies are just trying cash in and make money of your dreams and thats wat they are selling us a dream. buy regular seed and take you r time and pick out good mothers that will never hermie on you . people wasting time and money thinking that they are getting something special regular seeds are good and cost much less. there is no such thing as 100% fem seed


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## migenetics (Jan 16, 2010)

primo604 said:


> DONT BUY FEM SEEDS!!!!!!!!!!!
> dont belive the hype ,companies are just trying cash in and make money of your dreams and thats wat they are selling us a dream. buy regular seed and take you r time and pick out good mothers that will never hermie on you . people wasting time and money thinking that they are getting something special regular seeds are good and cost much less. there is no such thing as 100% fem seed


That's not always true some breeders best strains are the same price reg or fem. Fem seeds have there place and I use them for guerrila grows and nice having plants that grow faster than clones and don't have to worry about males later on.


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## Cheech Wizard (Jan 18, 2010)

wow, thanks Hobbes.. as usual a very complete clear answer. Appreciate it! well, I have bought the rest of Paradise seeds library. well, Sugar Babe, Sheherezade, Magic Bud, Amsterdam Flame and Opium, and I have a pack of Flying Dutchman Early Durban and Sensi Seeds Skunk 1, so, I will do one of those next and save those seeds I found in my buds but I guess I wont use them unless I have nothing else to plant...


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## cynide357 (Jan 18, 2010)

I have a plant grown from seed that hermed out big time. There are so many sacks that it is hard to keep up with. I'm just wondering, how long will the pollen affect my grows? Will a HEPA type filter help me at all? Is there any way of killing the pollen?


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## Hobbes (Jan 18, 2010)

.

*"how long will the pollen affect my grows?"*

frmrboi: *" in high heat & humidity maybe a month tops. Plain water alone will destroy it. "*
*
.

"Is there any way of killing the pollen?"*

Wiping the grow room walls, floor and ceiling with bleach. Use a spray bottle. Do this 2 or three times.

.

*"Will a HEPA type filter help me at all?"*

Hepa filters advertise 99.97% removal of pollen, it will help considerably.

.


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## cynide357 (Jan 18, 2010)

Thanks man. One of these days I too will be a wealth of knowledge that I will pass on to noobs like myself. Sometimes a little answered question like that is all the encouragement a guy like me needs to sweep away the negative thoughts.


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## Hobbes (Jan 18, 2010)

.

cynide I've had plants I've picked 5 or 6 dozen banana bunches at a time, seemed to regrow 2 or three times a week. It's a nightmare, but it does end. 

Did you harvest the plant?

.


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## cynide357 (Jan 19, 2010)

Not yet, but it's still growing. I won't kill this one, but I'll kill any more I ever see. (Or plant them in the wild, Johnny Appleseed style.


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## Hobbes (Mar 14, 2010)

.

Sunday, March 14

.

I've got 6 new strains from feminized seed in flower, one each of: Dutch Passion Blueberry; Big Bhudda Cheese; Greenhouse Super Silver Haze; Greenhouse Trainwreck; Seedsman White Widow; and 4 Dutch Passion Strawberry Cough. 9 plants, 6 strains. As well I have my 3 year old Flo genetics at 8 weeks flower.

The Dutch Passion Flo is putting out a few late flower bananas, a couple here and there, nothing to be concerned about. There's always a rash of small flat banana bunches at 3-5 weeks but I might end up with a half dozen seeds for the plant. Just stay on top of the plant with a set of tweezers and a white flashlight after lights out - the white makes the bananas stand out.

The Blueberry was a nightmare today, I checked it with the lights off with a flash light and there were over a hundred bananas and bunches. I spent a half hour picking the plant clean, I expect the smaller ones to grow big enough to pick tomorrow or the next day. The last Blueberry from Dutch Passion did the same thing. I'll stick with the tweezers for this plant, stay away from Reverse, but unless the plant stops putting out bananas I'm going to chop the clone and start from seed with PeakSeedBc regular Blueberry that I have waiting to germ.

I'm also going to order a pack of DJ Short's Flo and pick a mother from the regular seeds. I love the effects and taste of this Flo I have now but the production is horrible and I don't like that it puts out bananas when the rest of the garden is clean.

Infact, I have 13 strains (15 plants) in flower now and only the 2 Dutch Passion strains have produced even one banana.


*Kramerize*! for a level canopy.






.







*Strawberry Cough (F)* (4) - Dutch Passion (had bananas last time from seed, great to reduce anxiety)
*Super Silver Haze (F)* - Greenhouse (first run)

The small holed (1/2") Air Pruning bucket on the left (single layer of screen) is working phenominally well. Multiple roots per hole, sometimes a half dozen. The root tips dried up and died and I'm expecting sugar to build up in the roots inside the bucket and branching off each root. I'll put a cover bucket on, water, then let the whole process start over again.

The 1 1/2" holed bucket with 5 layers of screen only put out the thickest roots, I'm hoping there's some root trapping. I'm going to pop the root ball and peal off the screen when it dries and shrinks, see how the root trapping is going. I'm going to switch the screen in this bucket for the landscaping fabric I'm using in the other buckets.

.






*Flo (F)* - Dutch Passion - Bananas (bringing in DJ Short seeds)
*Northern Lights (R)* - PeakSeedsBC (last run)

.






*Kali Mist* *(R)* - Serious Seeds (keeper)
*Blueberry (F)* - Dutch Passion - Bananas (last run)

.
*





Jack Flash (F)* - Sensi (first run)
*Trainwreck (F)* - Greenhouse (first run)

.

*Skunkberry (R)* - PeakSeedsBC (keeper)
* White Widow (F)* - Seedsman (first run)






White Widow






.






*Bubblegum* *(R)* - Serious Seeds (keeper)
*Super Strawberry Diesel (F)* - Elite (last run)


.

*Cheese (F)* - Big Bhuda (first run)
*Strawberry Cough (F)* - Dutch Passion (3 more, 4 total. 2nd run)

.


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## Hobbes (Mar 22, 2010)

.

Update

.

The bananas have all but dried up on the Dutch Passion Blueberry, I've watered/fed it since I cleaned out the last outbreak, very few returned. I'm just picking them with tweezers, no Reverse.

I took the first harvest from the top of the Flo (Dutch Passion, I'm getting DJ Short's) (Flo is a multi harvesting strain) and it's putting out the odd banana, nothing to be concerned about.

The rest of the females are perfect.

Seedsman's White Widow is a beautiful plant, solid chunks of bud. Very fast finisher, it's about 7-8 weeks now and half cloudy trichs.

Jack Flash - Sensi's feminized cross of Jack Herer, reduced to two pheno types from Herer's 4 - is going to be huge. It's only about 5 weeks in but the colas look like they're going to be enormous.

I've read that Trainwreck (Greenhouse) can have hermie tendencies but at about 5 weeks mine is fine.

The other feminized are less developed so I wouldn't expect any bananas yet - 4 Strawberry Cough (Dutch Passion), 1 Cheese (Big Bhudda), 1 Super Silver Haze (Greenhouse) - all fine, no sign of bananas.

.


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## Cheech Wizard (Mar 23, 2010)

Nice Hobbes!


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## Hobbes (Apr 1, 2010)

.

The *Dutch Passion* Blueberry's bananas came back with a vengeance, I'm tweezers picking 2-4 dozen every day.

Flo (*Dutch Passion*) continues to put out bananas even though I've harvested twice and am down to the base of the plant.

Those are the only strains hermieing, the genetics come from seeds I bought several years ago. Dutch Passion has an excellent reputation and has no doubt corrected problems in their feminized breeding process since my purchase - Blueberry and Flo are known for sometimes hermieing.

.

*Other Feminized strains* - no hermieing so far

Cheese - Big Bhuda: Just a week in flower.
Jack Flash - Sensi (Herer cross): excellent production (6 weeks)
Trainwreck - Greenhouse: excellent production(6 weeks)
Super Silver Haze - Greenhouse: Just a few weeks in flower
White Widow - Seedsman: fantastic, been sampling, tastes great (8 weeks, 1 or 2 left)
Strawberry Cough - Dutch Passion: 4 plants 1 - 3 weeks in flower.

.

*Regular control strains* (none have ever hermied)

Kali Mist - Serious: amazing (have had the genetic chain for 3 years)
Bubblegum - Serious: amazing
Super Strawberry Diesel - Elite: nothing special, last run. large yield.
Skunkberry - PeakSeedsBC: Chunky, uplifting yet relaxing stone.

I'm germing The Dope, an unreleased strain by Dr Greenthumb that a few other forum members are growing and posting journals, PeakSeedsBC Blueberry (get one that doesn't hermie), then I've got another 3 of Subcools strains to run. All regular.

I'm thinking of going feminized with Serious AK47 and White Russian to see how they do with their feminized seeds.

.


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## ultimate buds (Apr 13, 2010)

According to Dutch Passion's research a feminized offspring has a 70% chance of closely resembling the mother, less the sexual stability cascade. Some things I'd think about are - Was the mother that good that you want to see how the offspring turns out? Are you just curious? Nothing like trying a plant to see for yourself. If the mother was good and you have no clone if the dirt is still in the bucket you may be able to get a root clone which will be an exact duplicate, much better than seed.


just a quick question whats a root clone ?
how do you do this ?

also iv just had a hermie top skunk 44 so i threw it outside an il just see what happens (uk)

iv also germd 5 strawberry haze x thai (both greenhouse) but i know nothing about hight on either of these 

and germd 10 bag seed just cos i had them 

im also waiting on some replacement cheese seeds from greenhouse after non germinated from a fem 5 pack


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## ultimate buds (Apr 13, 2010)

iv just spotted this and thought you may find it interesting

In a single pack of feminized seeds a grower can produce:

Females.
Hermaphrodites.
Males.

Yeah, that&#8217;s right. Males! So where are these males coming from and how are they making there way into the feminized seed process. The answer is a very simple one. Sex is not completely determined in the cannabis plant until a few weeks before flowering. We will talk about this in a moment but now back to the feminized seeds.

In optimal growing conditions feminized seeds will kick out 100% females. This says a lot for growing conditions and the actual role they play on cannabis gender development. How many times have growers seen these effects of multiple genders from Feminized seeds? The answer lies clearly in how well they grow. Growers who are growing in non-stressful conditions will never see the male effect from feminized seeds and so hence it does not exist for them. However over periods time and different growing techniques the grower will eventually see these results when growing in less than optional environments. MALES!

For this reason growers who choose feminized seeds should be forewarned to get their growing environments down to a T. If you prevent stress then you prevent males and hermaphrodites appearing in a feminized seed population. It is as SIMPLY AS THAT.


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## cracker84 (Apr 13, 2010)

hey hobbes, i just finished my 1st grow with trainwreck with no hermie problems, i did have some mold issues with the bigger buds because of the density. fyi, good thread, havent had time to read it all, but very good.


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## MrSoloDolo (Apr 16, 2010)

+ REP Hobbes- VERY helpful Info!!!


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## reitme (May 28, 2010)

I brought Sensi super skunk back from Amsterdam years ago, they all turned Hermie grown outside. I suspect the Hot northeast summer. The next year I got a 2 Lb. plant from those hermies! These seeds we buy are grown in or around Holland, usually, they aren't accustomed to your/our climate and Any stress will cause hermie's, even regular seeds like I had. If you add in an unfavorable method of propagating Female seeds from the breeder, you're likely to get a few hermies, or if you stress them with improper heat, light, nutes, etc.. If you can make them grow and make a few seeds, the next season will Blow you Away with Hybrid vigor from Regular seeds. I'm not a fan of Female seeds, but it makes life easier if you don't want seeds, or the bother of making them. I do want seeds from my crop. Just a few will do...... and then I don't have to re-order the following 4-5 years. 
To each his own. Good Luck! 
I think the best way to grow "New" seeds is indoors under ideal conditions. Not an option for everyone.......I do like the freebie fem.'s and Auto flower seeds, I cannot lie.


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## sonar (May 28, 2010)

cynide357 said:


> Thanks man. One of these days I too will be a wealth of knowledge that I will pass on to noobs like myself. Sometimes a little answered question like that is all the encouragement a guy like me needs to sweep away the negative thoughts.


You came to the right place man. Most of the people here are friendly and eager to help. I don't even want to think of how my garden would look without the help.


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## EvenHatersShowUsLove (Jul 3, 2010)

awesome thread.... im on page 25 , but will have to finish it tomorrow ...

quick question though ... I think I bought _reverse_ for the wrong reason .... (and maybe I just need to save it for the future ? )

I thought it would keep a male from flowering and pollinating the fems.... but after reading this thread...Im under the impression it is really for controlling hermies (not converting males to females )

I used non fem seeds.... and am 4 days into flower ...so I expect to see something within a week or so.... I was gonna spray the plants and hope they would all end up being female...but now im thinking i was way off....

please advise me ...Im somewhat overcrowded right now anyways ...so pulling the males (assuming it would be 50% of them) I could live with .... should I just save my reverse for a potential hermie in the future ? (oppesed to trying to make a male a female ?)


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## BTL1384 (Jul 26, 2010)

hi, ive been reading here and i think someone could help me. i hope i can get a reply. no one has post here since the beginning of july. ok, this is it. i have 2 nirvana auto blue mystic plants. they are advertised as 100% female. im not much for certainty. about 3 weeks in, they both showed sex. 1 seems to be all fem, the other showed male sacks first but now i can see white hairs also.(herm?) but like i said they are advertized as 100% fem, but the 1 plant showed male first. what does this mean? i would like to make the most out of the situation, so im intersted in producing seed. can someone explain my options


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## hic (Jul 26, 2010)

Thanks for all the work your doing! This is one great thread!.


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## Hobbes (Jul 30, 2010)

Hey EvenHatersShowUsLove! 


*"quick question though ... I think I bought reverse for the wrong reason .... (and maybe I just need to save it for the future ? ) I thought it would keep a male from flowering and pollinating the fems.... but after reading this thread ... Im under the impression it is really for controlling hermies (not converting males to females ) - I used non fem seeds.... and am 4 days into flower ...so I expect to see something within a week or so.... I was gonna spray the plants and hope they would all end up being female...but now im thinking i was way off .... please advise me ...Im somewhat overcrowded right now anyways ...so pulling the males (assuming it would be 50% of them) I could live with .... should I just save my reverse for a potential hermie in the future ? (oppesed to trying to make a male a female ?)"*

Sorry about being so long getting back to you. Yes, save your reverse until you see yellow bananas growing from the buds, this type of hermie may be controllable. A true hermie with balls at the nodes and seperate male flowers near impossible. If you do get a hermie your best friend will be a pair of tweezers, just go around after lights out with a flash light and the yellow bananas will jump out at you. Just pluck them.

This is no doubt way too late to help you, my apologies.

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## Hobbes (Jul 30, 2010)

.

Hey BTL!

I'm only a few days late on your post so hopefully your still around.

I get the shivers just looking at that plant. I don't say this often but chop it, cut it into pieces, put it in a plastic bag and get it out of your grow room. I've literally still got goose bumps and shivers.

Nirvana are not always good quality beans. I believe they buy from several breeders and the quality is never consistent. If they breed all inhouse they need to do some house cleaning. Some people get phenominal phenos from Nirvana, and I believe from the good breeeders. Every now and again someone gets what you have. Solid genetics will not hermie like that even if you interupt their dark cycle.

If you'd like some suggestions on good beans at good prices tell me what type of effect you're after and I'll make some suggestions. Here's my favorite:

https://www.rollitup.org/smoke-reports/244210-kali-mist-serious-seeds.html

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## Hobbes (Jul 30, 2010)

.

*"Thanks for all the work your doing! This is one great thread!."*

Thank you hic!

Anyone who'd like to thank me for anything I may or may no have done, or just have some fun, please check out a thread I made on Jon Stewart's forum in my absence. I was designing a CO2 subcritical fluid extractor to replace butane extraction and the process was a hell of a lot of fun. Here's a link to the thread if you want to check it out - all the info for the extractor is in blue, I wove threads of information - technical, letters, comedy, philosophy, music, video - to make it like a fun park to visit while a person absorbs the extractor info. The info is all in point form - in blue - if all you want to do is breeze through that it's easy to pick out. 

Have a look, spin your mouse wheel, it doesn't matter where you start. Bookmark the thread, open an account, post a hello and drop back in again and again if you enjoy the place. If you want to build your own CO2 extractor and help the medical marijuana community - lower prices to patients and increase the potency and quality of their extracts - I'll work through the process with anyone who wants to understand it - but only on Jon Stewart's forum. I wrestled with that beast for two weeks, it would add and subtract lines and blocks of text at will and randomly. I just needed a quiet place and there is NO place quieter than Jon Stewart's forum. Ba ding bam!

It's formatted for a MacBook Pro 17" screen, there's a short introduction on the first page.

http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page..._id=28916&pg=1

To understand, construct and operate the extractor this is all you need - if you put enough time into thinking the process through.

http://i25.tinypic.com/35k4jnn.jpg

.

Drop in!

http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page=ThreadView&thread_id=28916&pg=1

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## Hobbes (Jul 31, 2010)

.

*"one question: is using the pvc necessary"*

LOL!! Good point!

The model is a conceptual - its a teaching model only, not a working model. That's made from stainless steel - all of the written: parts list, assembly instructions, operating directions and parts list are in BLUE text on Jon's forum.

Everything else you advanced is correct, and more. There are very few trace chemicals left after a butane extraction, the concern is more for impurities in the butane than actual butane itself. But ... emptying two cans of butane into a single tray of brownies makes me queasy. Butane leaches various heavy metals from PVC, there is a past about that on my "gifts" thread on Jon's forum.

NL if you could would you open an account on Jon's forum and copy and past the question there - I want to start a discussion ... with other people for awhile! 

Sometimes the journey is more important than the destination - I'm sure I could have made money selling these by now but if I start giving away fishes we're not going to go where we have to go. In pleasure boating there are two basic schools of thought - sailing and stink pots. In a power boat the destination is important - if going to an island a few clicks off shore you can power out in minutes and everyone can go about doing what they want to do. Sailing out requires time, skill and effort - people can get a ride out to the island and enjoy the scenery or they can chip in and help sail the boats: learning new skills that they can pass on, developing working friendships with their crew mates. 


We are rudderless with only one engine working on a side, spinning us in circles.

http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page=ThreadView&thread_id=28916&pg=1

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## BTL1384 (Jul 31, 2010)

thanks Hobbes, yeah i threw him outside. still gonna grow him just to watch and learn. as it turns out, Nirvana's home page has a statement about problems at the breeders with the fem auto blue mystic. so i thought i would check in to that. i purchased from The Attitude and inquired to both Nirvana and Attitude. now, i know how the Attitude got its name. in a snotty kind of way they asked if i contacted Nirvana on the issue, like they didnt know or even care if they are selling bad seed. very poor customer service. but before they replied Nirvana had already confirmed the problem and offered to send a pack of fem auto northern lights or any other strain i choose. i know the seeds have Nirvana's name, but i wouldnt have thought one store would credit anothers customer. but anyway it worked out. and thanks again. great thread.


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## MONEYDOESGROWSONTREES (Aug 1, 2010)

Hobbes said:


> Sorry about being so long getting back to you. Yes, save your reverse until you see yellow bananas growing from the buds, this type of hermie may be controllable. A true hermie with balls at the nodes and seperate male flowers near impossible. If you do get a hermie your best friend will be a pair of tweezers, just go around after lights out with a flash light and the yellow bananas will jump out at you. Just pluck them.
> 
> This is no doubt way too late to help you, my apologies.
> 
> .


Hi, 
1st I just wanted to say I love what you're doing, seems like you've got a great experiment going on. I've just found this thread today, however I've spent the last 4 hours or so reading the main points and overall very nice. I had just one question. Do you think that checking your plants while the lights are off with a white flashlight or any light that is not green (plants dont recognize green spectrum) could be accelerating or causing the herms? One quote you said you spent over 30 mins picking off nanners with tweezers and a flash light. Thats 30 min of interupted darkness which can cause a plant light stress in which everything but a "Double X cromo female" (i.e. True canidate for 100% female seed production, will not hermi under the worst conditions EVER because of the double X Cromozone) could possibly hermi. 
Not hating or anything , just a thought. I actually joined this site after reading this forum because I was impressed on the way it was formatted and just all around interesting to read. I read the comment about the flashlight and thought I might put my 2 cent in to help you get to the bottom of these hermi's, because I have dealt with fems from those companys (DP , GHS, Sensi, Seedsmans,nirvana, etc) and only had a few herms, a couple of random nanners, mostly at the main tops, which I believe is just the plant being sensitive to the hps i.e. why only the tops had them, they were the closest to the light. Which if I remember correctly you said you were having the same problem. Tops would hermi, so you cut them and let the rest fill out, so thats something to think about as well. Maybe some are more sensitive to light, i.e why the shorter diesel plants hermed less, further away from the light. It may have had nothing to do with the reverse root zone application other than it stunted the plant keeping it shorter and further away from the light... Anyway enough with my rambling, I'd love to hear what you think Hobbes and I really think there maybe something to it, as I have personal seen someone check there plants with a standard small mag lite for only a couple of times during the off cycle per night for multiple nights in a row and there were herms on a strain I know for a fact would never hermi at week 3 or 4. Maybe 8 or 9 slightly, but never full blown herm at week 3. I'd personally grown it for a year from unfem seed (nirvana) and gave him cuts off 1st gen clone so I now it was not genetics. I told him to switch to green light from hydro store. Next run no herms. I personally have forced certain strains to herm slightly from having the light to close. Radiant heat can build up in the plant tissue from the 800 degree hps bulbs even if youre air cooling, causing stress to the plant , its just depends on the stain how much light they can tolerate/require. Anyway hope some of this helps and again keep it up ,I like what you're doing, thanks. Hope to hear from you. Peace


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## Hobbes (Aug 2, 2010)

.


Hey MDNGOT!

*"Do you think that checking your plants while the lights are off with a white flashlight or any light that is not green (plants dont recognize green spectrum) could be accelerating or causing the herms?"*

Intuitively I'd say yes, but I've never had any problems with lights causing hermies - it's always poor breeding and they hermie grow after grow regardless of conditions. I never throw out clones if a plant hermies after one grow incase the problems were my fault - which I can be fairly certain they're not if I have 10 strains in a 12 plant garden and only the 3 plants of the same strain hermie. Good genetics, as from Serious have never hermied on me regardless of how I torture them. A few late flower bananas with Bubblegum if I leave it too long but that can be a good thing for amature breeders..

5 minutes to check your plants with a weak light shouldn't hurt unless the genetics are incredibly poor.

If you are hermieing already you can turn your overhead light off through the day and use a white flashlight then. Reduced light will be no problem through the day unlike interrupted dark periods at night. I have a green light for night but I haven't had any bananas lately to see if they show up, that would work well at night if that's you're only time free.

I've designed an elliptical trough reflector for LED lights, to focus the light into a tighter beam the deeper into the canopy it goes. One of the more interesting things I came across is the Emerson Effect - basically give the plant far red (730 nm) will keep the plant in flower even if the dark period is interrupted. I'm interested to see if this will reduce hermieing in poor conditions or stop existing hermieing. With poor genetics I don't think the far red light will help but it's worth a try.

I agree with you, if a plant is hermieing and you're concerned about it getting worse then do your checking through the day. I've got over 2 dozen strains growing (the newest for several grows, the oldest years) and rarely have more than 3 of one strain in my 12 plant flower cage, so interrupting the light cycle isn't a big deal for me - for newer grower you should listen to MDNGOT, better safe than sorry.








https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/314052-plant-light-receptors.html

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-room-design-setup/309037-solving-fatal-flaw-leds-experiment.html

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## wutangbud (Sep 2, 2010)

Hi Guys, long time reader 1st time poster! i was hoping to do my 1st post with a grow journal but to my horror i have found seeds in my Feminized Skywalker, Kushberry & Bubblegummer, i had 1 Bluemoonshine in there but pulled it after coiple of weeks as it looked weak and not prodicing quick enough, i am unsure whether they have hermied or the BM seed (which was also feminized) turned out male, i cannot see any bananas but when i open a bud it has small seeds all inside it, the bud still looks good very frosty but it looks like theres gonna be loads of seeds, is the grow going to be ruined???? the plants are currently on day 32 of 12/12.

I am inexperienced but read a hell of alot and bought PH & EC tests to do things properly so to say i am gutted is an understatement i just hope all is not lost.


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## Hobbes (Sep 2, 2010)

.

Hy wutangbud, welcome aboard RUI!

Can you post some pictures, up close of some colas, buds?

Are the seeds from the following breeders:

Skywalker - Dutch Passion
Kushberry - DNA
Bubblegummer - ? X-Line
Bluemoonshine - Dutch Passion

I've run several of Dutch Passion's lines with other strains in my garden and the DP strains would hermie while the other strains stay female. Good reputation but I've had trouble with them. Blue Moonshine is a slow grower and small producer, small hard buds. A tough strain to grow the first time around, tends to hermieing with or without stress. 

This is a Bubblegum by Serious Seeds, probably the same or very similar genetics to your Bubblegummer. Bubblegum is an In Breed Line (IBL) which means - for us - that it is very sexually stable and often the plants from seed will be so similar they look like clones. Feminized seeds have a much greater chance of resembling the desired mother than do regular seeds, another reason to be interested in them.

Sometimes I like to see what abuse I can subject a plant to and see if it will die, recover from the stress, or just grow through. I grew this Bubblegum clone: in a 2 litre pop bottle; no air, stagnant water; changed water and nutrients only once during flower. Slow growth, little yield, long flowering time - but sweet buds and not a sign of hermieing. If the genetics are good you'll be fine.







.

Are/were most of the seeds in the Blue Moonshine and Skywalker? 

.

*To check for bananas:* 

- Either take your plants out of the garden and put under a white light, or a light with a high color rendering index. The HPS has a very low Color Rendering Index (CRI) and bananas are hard to see - the yellow light washes the green of the leaves and buds and there's less contrast with the bananas. I use a white flashlight at lights out to check.







- Go over the plant slow. Pick one bud or cola and try to look into it, make the buds - then the individual calyx - grow in your minds eye until you can see each individual piece of the bud. The bananas should grow between the actual buds themselves, it's very rare to get a true hermie that hangs clumps of bananas. 





.






- Get a magnifying glass and go over the same bud again and again until you could take it apart and put it back together in your mind - if there are bananas there you will see them, then you'll never be able to look at a bud again without knowing if it's a hermie or not. Mature bananas will be yellow, young green. You'll only see half of the banana growing out of the bud.





.






.

*Check for light leaks*

Have you sat in your flower room for a half hour with the lights out? It takes time for the eyes to adjust to darkness, what seemed pitch black when the lights are turned out is often so light that you can see your hand moving around after 15 minutes. I spend a lot of time in my garden in the dark with a volcano bag, thinken 'n stuff.

I've found that it's genetics that cause most hermieing, but it's best to isolate your garden from stress.

.

*"is the grow going to be ruined?"*

Not at all.

The seeded bud will be less potent than it would have been sinsemilla but it will still be good. Don't sweat it. Pick out all of the seeds AFTER you harvest, don't bother the buds now except to *pick out the visible bananas with tweezers.*

Pick only the bananas visible, do not dig into the bud - the damage will further reduce yield & potency, and prolong flower. Toss the bananas, the pollen is worse than useless for you.

.

Post some pics if you can, as close up and still as possible. Take your plants away from the HPS for the pictures so we can pick out the bananas by color.

*DON'T WORRY!*

Easy to fix.

.


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## Short Bus (Sep 15, 2010)

Just chopped a Blue Cheese 2 weeks early last night, covered in plant-nads. It was one of many plants in my flower chamber, but the only BC. Any thoughts on how much seeding I'm going to see in the rest? PS-Blue Cheese is apparently real well known for going hermie, for anyone looking at running the stuff.


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## Hobbes (Sep 15, 2010)

.

Index: *Hermaphrodites*

Tags: *blue cheese, hermaphrodites, pollenation*

.

*"Just chopped a Blue Cheese 2 weeks early last night, covered in plant-nads. It was one of many plants in my flower chamber, but the only BC. Any thoughts on how much seeding I'm going to see in the rest? PS-Blue Cheese is apparently real well known for going hermie, for anyone looking at running the stuff."
*
*"Any thoughts on how much seeding I'm going to see in the rest?"*

Did you take a picture of a cola with bananas? If so could you post it please.

The profusion of seeds will depend on the ripeness of the bananas - if the bananas did not burst and release pollen then you'll have no seeds. If a lot of bananas burst then you'll get some seeds but don't worry too much about it, people have consumed seeded bud for millenia and have been happy doing it. One grow of many.

Check the colas that you chopped with a magnifying glass, look for bananas and what looks like tinged white banana skins that will be left when the banana bursts.

.

*"Blue Cheese is apparently real well known for going hermie, for anyone looking at running the stuff."*

Anything with Blueberry in the genetic makeup can have sketchy sexual stability. I have Peak's Skunkberry, one of the most stable forgiving strains I've had. The breeder has a lot to do with sexual stability - who breed your seeds?

.

Short Bus if you are concerned that some male flowers may have released pollen then I recommend moving all of your plants from your flower cage then spray all of the surfaces with a mild bleach solution, then clean the surfaces with a cloth. This will kill any pollen that stuck to the surfaces and that will seed your plants in the future.

.

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## THESkunkMunkie (Sep 15, 2010)

My 2 JackFlash#5 plants have hermied on me at day 16 of flowering!! Sweet Seeds BlackJack & DNA Genetic's Rocklock too!! I'm running a clean grow room/op no room light leaks or anything like that, or any signs of overfeeding/nutrient burn or stress to the plants either!! I managed to get them out before any "balls" popped. If you ask me feminised seeds just don't work. this is the second time this has happened to me this year!! My last grow was with Greenhouse Seeds "feminised" Super Lemon Haze, Kings Kush & Church
I'm only doin regular seeds from now on, thats the only way I'll get genetically real female plants!!...


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## doowmd (Sep 16, 2010)

I got Dinafem's Sweet Deep Grapefruit, and Cloud #9 thru one of attitudes freebie offers awhile back (jan. I think). Neither hermied, I've yet to harvest the #9 (its tall and lanky and suffering from a mild cae of nute burn atm but otherwise doing well), but the Sweet Deep Grapefruit was one of the best smelling/tasting strains I've ever had! Also, it was covered up in resin....the perfect 'sugar coated' look I thought. Literally made my mouth water when I smelled it!!! My only porblem w/ it, is that it turned out a little small (around 3.5 ft). But I'd get it again just for personal because it was so fuckin fire! Jury's still out on the #9,. but I'll report back on it in about a month or so.


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## Hobbes (Nov 21, 2010)

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## ABM2010 (Nov 25, 2010)

nice thread,ive sub'd
to be honest im sayin that greenhouse seeds r shit,well the super lemon haze
i bought 5 haze from greenhouse and 5 violator kush from barneys farm they germinated in under 40 hours then 2 days after that they wer out of the root riot with ther 1st leaves
2 of the haze died and now 1 is dying a bit,i know its not the way ther getting grew because the kush r fine
hope i dont end up with hermie


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## Hobbes (Nov 26, 2010)

.

Welcome aboard both the thread and RIU ABM!

I'm going to be compiling this thread into Weed Science this weekend, with a linkable index. I'll post here when the chapter is uploaded to my website (linked at the bottom of this post).

In early 2011 I'm going to be running trials on a new Elliptical Trough Reflector for both LED and Plasma flower lighting, I'm going to run some far red and orange spectrum tests on plant to see if I can get plants to produce flowering hormone while the lights are on. At the same time I'll do some stress test on clones - to see if the Emerson Effect also has and effect on sexual stability.

I'll write up my hypothesis on producing flowering hormone durning light periods next week, or a few weeks after that. Interesting concept with some basis in reality. I'll run clones for control:

1. No stress / no far red

2. Stress / no far red

3. Stress / far red

To see if there are any differences. I'll stress until I get hermies in group 2: stress with no far red light,

.


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## 9867mike777 (Nov 26, 2010)

*My dad-gummed Blueberry Gum went hermie on me 9 days into the light change. *

For now I just clipped all the balls and ordered some Dutch Master Reverse. I'll give it a few weeks and see how it goes. The plant is sure a beautiful healthy little plant besides the hermie crap. I think it is going to relatively compact so it should be easy to transport out of the grow room to neuter it every few days.


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## Hobbes (Nov 26, 2010)

.

What breeder Mike? Blueberry x Bubblegum? 

Blueberry is a bitch, it will hermie quicker than any strain I've grown. The least genetic weakness and there is NOTHING that can be done to stop the hermieing. I've ran a couple different breeders Blueberry and have had trouble every time. I got PeakseedsBC's Blueberry seeds in the que in my nursery waiting for some free space, other than DJ Short Peak's are the only Blueberry I trust - I'm sure that there are good ones out there, but when dealing with such dicey sexual stability it's better to go with what you're confident in.

Mike keep us updated, pics would be great. Solve Blueberry's S.S. problem and the rest of the strains will be simple in comparison.

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## 9867mike777 (Nov 26, 2010)

It is G13 Blueberry Gum. Here is a picture I took right before chopping the balls off. I am going to give it a couple of more weeks.


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## Hobbes (Nov 26, 2010)

.

That looks like a ... "true hermie"(?) ... I think they're referred as. All of the hermies I've had have been bananas growing out of the actual buds, I've never had male ball sacs.

Yes I have, my first blueberry. The very first hermie I had. It was female preflowers below the 12/12 line and male ball sacks above. Freaky. 

Is Greenhouse the breeder?

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## ABM2010 (Nov 26, 2010)

good to be here hobbes love what your doin for us all,need more people like u
nice work
i will be followin along,ive just had a look at your links i will defo have a read another day,not in the mood for readin now to high
rep to u


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## Hobbes (Nov 26, 2010)

.

*"not in the mood for  reading  now too high*

Check out the *Only In Dreams* video link, its an 8 minute introduction to Weed Science - meant to be watch while high. Not stoned. *Rejoice* is my current project, the other 4 are just slideshows to show a process or piece of equipment. I'll have the 125 images from *Rejoice* in an ebook by the end of the weekend if anyone wants any of the *Philisophicals*.

.

I was playing with the colour, size and font in your quote to see if I could fool my mind into an even transition of a curve rather than steps. Something I've been thinking about for the videos. What do you think? Did you see a smooth curve the first time or steps?

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## ABM2010 (Nov 26, 2010)

send me anythink worth lookin at,im intersted in anythink to do with weed or growing weed
and i would say it was more like steps
lol
nice 1


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## Hobbes (Nov 26, 2010)

.

LOL!

ABM click here: 

*Hobbe's video page: Only In Dreams - 8 minute music video covering 1000 page pictorial CCOB ebook : Rejoice . O Young Person . In Thy Youth - Hobbes 11:9 , chronicle of my eternal battle with the hippie menace to Adagio For Strings (Platoon theme).
*
I LOL'd because the links are all at the bottom of each of my posts in the signature section ( V Look Down V ) - the first link is for the video library. There are a couple of other videos, just slideshows of processes and equipment to songs that I like. The videos are an introduction to Crop Circle Of Bud technique and theory, made for the state of mind that you're in now. Only In Dreams is very light, I embedded sequences that mimic movies - a bud morphing into a sand worm from Dune and devouring a trichome - lots of fun. Just emptying my mind and seeing if I can make a useful tool for growers.

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## The45King (Dec 18, 2010)

I had 4 or 5 nanners towards the end on my whiteberry clone 
i picked them off and once the plant was cured 
it had like partialy grown seed in it awful taste
had to ditch it,its the only time ive had nanners and 
i believe it was because the mother i took the clone from
produced a few seeds towards the end other than that
ive had no probs with fem seeds apart from ceres orange bud
which was a full on herm and my friends had seeds in his.
Currently runnin bb blue cheese 7 weeks old no probs so far
fingers crossed


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## ABM2010 (Feb 10, 2011)

gotta question for u,hope u can help me out
i bought myself 5 super lemon haze seeds from greenhouse and 5 violator kush from barneys seeds
ive had them for 12 weeks now from germination and ther still in the veg cycle 
i dont know alot about hermie as this is my 1st time doin seeds my pre-flowers hav finally showed an the violator kush r showing male and female pre flowers and the super lemon haze havnt shown any male pre flowers
so does this mean that my super lemon haze will not hermie?
maybe a silly question but just want to be sure
im about to put them in flower in a few days,i will try and get some pics in

i would appreciate the help from u or any other person
ive tried asking a few people on this site and youtube but noone has shown with a answer

just want some good lookin bud like yours
peace


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## Maximus cannabis (Feb 11, 2011)

ABM2010 said:


> gotta question for u,hope u can help me out
> i bought myself 5 super lemon haze seeds from greenhouse and 5 violator kush from barneys seeds
> ive had them for 12 weeks now from germination and ther still in the veg cycle
> i dont know alot about hermie as this is my 1st time doin seeds my pre-flowers hav finally showed an the violator kush r showing male and female pre flowers and the super lemon haze havnt shown any male pre flowers
> ...


You néed to put your plants to flower before you can tell if it's going to go hermie. How big are your plants after that much veg time? I hope you have planned for the stretch that is coming.


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## Wav3F0rm (Feb 22, 2011)

This is a pretty amazing thread. I have some AK47 crossed with sativa spirit. However, i'm thinking it was actually some land race sativa, considering the flowering time and how big the plant got(saw pictures). Anyways, genetics aside, i'm late into flowering, around 7 weeks and one of my plants is going hermie pretty hardcore. Bananas all over the place, every day. I do not notice any pollen sacks, but, its started some really weird growth. Right now, i can't tell if its growing new calyxes or pollen sacs. I'd like to think calyxes because they have pistols coming out of them. However, the growth and bud growth is really weird. The buds are turning into branches basically and at the top of the plant same scenario only its producing a lot of leaves. Kinda like its going back into veg, but, its the only plant doing all this stuff, really odd. (but, looking over the "revival of the ultimate sativa thread, these buds looks similar, i dunno)

I was wondering if anyone else had anything like this happen. Thanks.


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## kermit2692 (Mar 11, 2011)

ive def. seen some weird growth before could be nothing but most likely your better off just scrapping that plant or finishing it somewhere away from the rest...put up pics


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## JustinThyme (Mar 13, 2011)

I've grown out many different strains, from many different breeders, and I have to say that I have had 75% Hermies from GHS feminized seeds, I just had to pull the most beautiful White Rhino out of my room last night. I have had EXcellent luck with Barneys and G13 Labs but GHS fems have not been good to me. Honestly I have had the worst luck with all of their Genetics. But to their credit, They have given me my favorite strain, "trainwreck", but that too starts putting out bananas about week 7 into flower, but I don't mind, smoke always comes out righteous, so I thank them for that.. We'll see. If I grow out this Super Lemon Haze and she herms, I will never buy anything from them again.


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## kermit2692 (Mar 17, 2011)

dont know from experience but from what ive seen greenhouse seems to spend too much time coming up with new strains and names to make a buck...ill give em a try to see for myself but i dont have too high of hopes


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## zels420 (Mar 18, 2011)

*I did a pack of super lemon haze seeds from greenhouse last year and all the seeds popped dicks by day 25 or so of 12/12
still have a few packs of greenhouse seeds to run but I know I will never buy fem seeds again ! 
*


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## Beansly (Mar 18, 2011)

I recently read that if you force your plant into 12/12 without letting it grow preflowers first, that it stresses out the plant big time and it has a better chance of hermie-ing


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## sir rance alot (Mar 19, 2011)

All of my fems have done well except for Sharksbreath.. Grew all mothers from seed, all strains showed sex in 23 days after sprouting. After 4 weeks, took clones and switched to 12/12 a week later. Harvested all strains in 65 days and everything was great. I put the clones in the flower chamber and from 2 clones from the same mother, one is female and one has turned completely male....No visible signs of any female organs.. These things came from the same mother, whom by the way came out great, but one clone turned full male.. WTF!!!


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## Beansly (Mar 19, 2011)

sir rance alot said:


> All of my fems have done well except for Sharksbreath.. Grew all mothers from seed, all strains showed sex in 23 days after sprouting. After 4 weeks, took clones and switched to 12/12 a week later. Harvested all strains in 65 days and everything was great. I put the clones in the flower chamber and from 2 clones from the same mother, one is female and one has turned completely male....No visible signs of any female organs.. These things came from the same mother, whom by the way came out great, but one clone turned full male.. WTF!!!


that must be that 1% error ratio they give. ie 99% female


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## vic420 (Dec 14, 2011)

SpruceZeus said:


> I've grown Greenhouse's The Church, Arjans ultra haze #1 and Cheese from feminized seeds. I havn't had a single pollen sac from any of them, and i'm already onto the 4th generation of clones from the AUH#1.
> 
> Honestly, and i can say this after alot of research, as well as the experience of having grown their genetics. Greenhouse is a great breeder. There is alot of Arjan bashing around these forums, and in my experience, its mostly unfounded. They have a state of the art breeding facility that puts out Cup winner after Cup winner (some say they buy the cup...)
> I'll be the first to admit that their Haze strains are full of retards. (as a matter of fact, my AUH#1 has the stupidest growth i've ever seen, and takes 15-16 weeks to flower) BUT, even the retarded strains are _great_ weed.
> ...



that second picture of the plant not filling it . and doing wierd growth could be a cou ple diff things.. genetics.. and or .. nutrients.. or ur timer has gone bad and ur light schedule is all over the place. i had this growth and i noticed my 2 timers werent in sync.. 1 came on hour early one went off hour late.. causing only 10 hours of dark.. maybe a little less. and i got same growth.. but anyways if u found out wat it waws let me knwo.


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## vic420 (Dec 14, 2011)

Maximus cannabis said:


> You néed to put your plants to flower before you can tell if it's going to go hermie. How big are your plants after that much veg time? I hope you have planned for the stretch that is coming.


not necc.. ive had plants show female and male parts in veg .. which is a hermi..


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## Mindmelted (Dec 14, 2011)

I must be lucky then,6 grows all fem seeds and NOT one of them hermied......


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## greenbomb (Jan 1, 2012)

i would love to pollinate santas hot assistant.


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## sonar (Mar 16, 2012)

I think this is an excellent thread and want to bump it back to the top.


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## dura72 (Mar 16, 2012)

lol, i was subbed to this thread but no-ones posted in months, i wondered what the fuck was goin on when it re-appeard!!


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## oiko (Mar 19, 2012)

fattest one as well out of four female seeds bubblegummers. 3-4 weeks from 12-12, grown from seed. its so early, so i had to chop it. buds are small, but pretty sticky, with a spicy fuel smell. could be ferts though. counted about 7-8 banana clusters, not yet mature, luckily, apparently.


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## oiko (Apr 6, 2012)

oiko said:


> fattest one as well out of four female seeds bubblegummers. 3-4 weeks from 12-12, grown from seed. its so early, so i had to chop it. buds are small, but pretty sticky, with a spicy fuel smell. could be ferts though. counted about 7-8 banana clusters, not yet mature, luckily, apparently.


Well, shouldnt badmouth female seeds for what was probably my own fault. I forgot. I cracked the stem on it one week earlier, but it quickly recovered (like a late supercrop ), but the stress was proboably too much for her/him and he/she started forming clusters.

However i spotted one male flower on another female, which i picked off, and it hasnt grown back, so i'm all over satisfied with female bg.


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## skunkone527 (May 3, 2012)

oiko said:


> Well, shouldnt badmouth female seeds for what was probably my own fault. I forgot. I cracked the stem on it one week earlier, but it quickly recovered (like a late supercrop ), but the stress was proboably too much for her/him and he/she started forming clusters.
> 
> However i spotted one male flower on another female, which i picked off, and it hasnt grown back, so i'm all over satisfied with female bg.


hi 
this is a great topic,
im no expert but i have been smoking weed for 37 years and am just wondering doesnt nature stress plants? perhaps in different ways but most of the stress you inflict nature will too plus much more except maybe abrupt mixed light cycles.its hard to say if female seed hermies are the result of manipulation or were to begin with and this surfaced the tendancy. do all plants respond to this hormone use?.i wonder if anyone has cloned and tried one outdoors and compared( if they have that option).if it does herm indoors but didnt outdoors then it must be indoor environmentally sensitive and maybe one can checklist and manage it to be suitable or maybe not. either way i throw em out i want plants that work with me and not have to pussyfoot around and know its worth it..if both hermy its in the seed.in regards to a statement earlier about all strains are hermy prone to a degree it may be true i dont know,i take it the author meant its a recessive gene because regular plants are the norm in cannabis especially indica and i dont remeber ever having a pure indica hermy,i think its a sativa trait and this then surfaces due to manipulation or stress..but i have deliberately stressed strains in many ways and some did not hermy .maybe i havent stressed those strains that didnt in the manner that would induce.also i read mel frank say that a lot of hermies arent hermies they are complete reversals and this occurs because they arent old enough yet when flowered and are confused but that would be hard to prove because you only have one shot (and most people wouldnt wait to see if the female flowers ceased thus making a full male plant, but now i will start some seeds take clones asap and flower one then after 3 -4months ill flower another) unless your comparing many seeds of the same batch differening flowering induction age.i stress all my potential plants and if they hermy i dont use them,(i dont care what seed bank they are from or if someone discovered the seed at the zoo in camel shit already sprouted and smuggled it into the governments private grow facilities then crossed it with a seed found pulled from a dying rastafarians hand as he took his last breath thrown from a derailed train or other nonsense. do we really need these stories to sell seeds?cant the product speak for itself?isnt that what breeding is?to supply us with seeds that exceed our expectations and take care of hermies and other problems so anyone can succeed? . because theres plenty of plants even within the same seed batch that dont.a few nonviable male flowers at the end of the cycle may be acceptable..simply not letting your plant make seeds is stressing it.when i try a new plant i label it alphabetically and this removes any bias and store a cross reference for the future if it is desirable i label it properly .i think the only way to eliminate undesirable plants is by stressing them,i dont want to work with a plant that doesnt cooperate,i want to work with a plant that i can abuse without surprises down the road,,i just lick my wounds and move on because they arent good for improving the gene pool and will just slow your world and you lose enthusiasm.you just have to keep planting ..by being very selective with culls you eventually get stability.excellent plants are very hard to come by and every ones plant seems to be the best since its theirs .and one mans version of potency may not be yours.a good way to select plants is to let some clones of the strain you have seed. the f2 line is where its at to select from when you have many seeds your odds really improve and plants segregate.. unless its shit to begin with you will always find great plants if enough seeds are planted. a lot of seed banks simply do that very thing .thats where individual super plants, are found,proper skunk#1 and northern lights inbred line strains wouldnt be foundation strains if they threw off hermies consistantly .its all the flooding with polyhybrids and people just putting any plants together with no real experience,like puppy mills that did this.making a shady buck.and pretending they are botanists and plant breeders ,which i definately am not...i dont buy female seeds regardless of the hermy thing,to me theres no improvent and eventually the gene pool will stagnate on us all and good true breeding strains will not be retrievable using them.its a step backwards ..in the end i dont think managing hermies is the way to go either ..any true hermy is unacceptable in comparison to whats available.i got ripped off many times buying seeds,quality has gone down in the last decade .when they say this isnt your grandfathers weed propaganda its true, grandfathers weed was consistant and dealers only sold shit weed once... if i give my friends clones then i know that it will be high quality no surprises and they dont end up with embarrasing weed bitching at me.soon female seeds will be a bygone fad and lose their appeal.and one final question some of these crosses seedbanks have are clone only crosses they maintain,why dont they self polinate these clone only parents?maybe they cant then that means ntot all plants can be feminised..wouldnt that make more sense because otherwise its not reproducable..sorry if i rambled .
thank you .


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## raiderman (May 3, 2012)

theres a member here had gottena few seeds off his blueberry and planted them,4 out of 5 of them were girls clean through.made awsome plants,they were hermie seeds cuz he had no male around.


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## canna_420 (May 4, 2012)

Beansly said:


> I recently read that if you force your plant into 12/12 without letting it grow preflowers first, that it stresses out the plant big time and it has a better chance of hermie-ing


Thats a good point alot of growers either forget or miss this point.


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## Aljazera (May 4, 2012)

canna_420 said:


> Thats a good point alot of growers either forget or miss this point.


But is it a true point.


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## deza (May 4, 2012)

canna_420 said:


> Thats a good point alot of growers either forget or miss this point.


What about 12/12 from seed?


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## raiderman (May 4, 2012)

it can get to the point of paranoia obviously.


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## WeedKillsBrainCells (May 6, 2012)

doowmd said:


> I got Dinafem's Sweet Deep Grapefruit, and Cloud #9 thru one of attitudes freebie offers awhile back (jan. I think). Neither hermied, I've yet to harvest the #9 (its tall and lanky and suffering from a mild cae of nute burn atm but otherwise doing well), but the Sweet Deep Grapefruit was one of the best smelling/tasting strains I've ever had! Also, it was covered up in resin....the perfect 'sugar coated' look I thought. Literally made my mouth water when I smelled it!!! My only porblem w/ it, is that it turned out a little small (around 3.5 ft). But I'd get it again just for personal because it was so fuckin fire! Jury's still out on the #9,. but I'll report back on it in about a month or so.


I know what you mean about sweet deep grapefruit. One of the best I've smoked. If I was in a position to grow properly I'd probably do that one. Didn't know it was dinafem though, interesting. Might have to check out a few plant pics.


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## WeedKillsBrainCells (May 6, 2012)

Hobbes said:


> ​


misspelling the actual acronym and still uploading it... You the monkey or the guy? Jk jk


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## raiderman (May 6, 2012)

Mindmelted said:


> I must be lucky then,6 grows all fem seeds and NOT one of them hermied......


i hear ya bro. yure an experience grower is wy.most ppl that get them need to look in the mirror first and one thing i know about reverse, i highly recommend not using this reverse seing it alters the genetics somewhat trying to stablize the plant.and hobbes that started this thread wasnt a very good grower so i know wy he had hermies.


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## deza (May 6, 2012)

Sprouted over 60 FEMs to date not one hermie bro!


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## jonblaze420 (May 13, 2012)

Is there page with any results or did this guy just get everyone pumped up and then leave?

This is bullshit. What page is the experiment's results on? Bummer.


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## raiderman (May 13, 2012)

he prob burned them all up,and gave up,lol.


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## jonblaze420 (May 14, 2012)

raiderman said:


> he prob burned them all up,and gave up,lol.


Arrrrrgggghhhh.... lol.


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## tobinates559 (Mar 2, 2013)

soo much to learn i love all you guys and the info everyone on RUI shares ive learned soo much just reading thread after thread and looking up and question that popped into my head 
, thanks everyone!


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## Inadaze69 (Jul 28, 2019)

cocoxxx said:


> im on my 2nd grow with white rhino (feminised) and havnt had a hermie yet


Which breeder cuz I just had .. in week 6 a chemdawg from Humbolt Seeds grow bananas on bottom buds ... but my pineapple chunk from barney's us doing fine ...


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## Shua1991 (Jul 29, 2019)

Inadaze69 said:


> Which breeder cuz I just had .. in week 6 a chemdawg from Humbolt Seeds grow bananas on bottom buds ... but my pineapple chunk from barney's us doing fine ...


This is a 6 year old thread. Good luck getting an answer


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