# T5 vs. HPS



## jake55 (Mar 1, 2011)

I am currently running a 1000 watt hps. I was talking to my local hydro shop expert about lighting b/c i am going to expand. He said i should use T5 lighting instead of HPS. Has anyone done a comparison grow with the two. I am concerned with yield. I dont think that the T5s will be as good but they advertise 40,000 lumens or more and you can run a better spectrum b/c you have multiple bulbs. Any help/advise would be great.


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## wyteberrywidow (Mar 1, 2011)

yield will suffer severly tho t5s have its pros and cons compared to hps...
You can save on elec bill,put lights closer and a few other things but i would just stick with the hps honestly.Thats all you need..


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## Little Tommy (Mar 1, 2011)

I love my T-5s for cloning but I don't think I would trade my HPS for them during flowering.


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## jesus of Cannabis (Mar 1, 2011)

I veg with my T5 and flower with my HPS(s)


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## jake55 (Mar 1, 2011)

My friend showed me some plants that he was growing under the T5s and the buds looked just as good as the ones i grow under my 1000 hps.


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## jesus of Cannabis (Mar 1, 2011)

pics woul dhelp with that but I will tell you HPS buds are denser and larger if grown right. T5's dont have the penetration power as the HPS so the tops of the T5 will be nice but the inner branches wont be as good as with a T5. How many plants are you growing?


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## jake55 (Mar 1, 2011)

i grow 8 under the 1000 hps. I was doing some math. Check this out. T5s put out 40,000 lumens at the light and you can pretty much set them ontop of the plant (not much heat) so i grow in a 2ftx4ft. thats 8 sqft = 5000 lumes per sqft. 1000 watt hps @ 2ft is 35,000 lumens = 4375 lumens per sqft. (mine is air cooled and i keep it at 2ft above the plants)


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## jake55 (Mar 1, 2011)

jesus of Cannabis said:


> pics woul dhelp with that but I will tell you HPS buds are denser and larger if grown right. T5's dont have the penetration power as the HPS so the tops of the T5 will be nice but the inner branches wont be as good as with a T5. How many plants are you growing?


i agree about the penetration.

Do you know if there is a diminishing point of t5s at a certain distance


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## Oldreefer (Mar 1, 2011)

I too start all my seedlings under T5HO for 3-4 weeks, then transfer to 400 + 150 w hps.....works great for me.


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## jesus of Cannabis (Mar 1, 2011)

I can just go from my results in vegging with a T5 and flowering with a HPS.
There has to be a diminishing point to a T5, IDK what it is but my T5 is no more than 4" off the top of my plants.


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## jake55 (Mar 1, 2011)

I have been trying to find what the lumens are at 1ft, 2ft, 3ft, ect on a T5. I have the stats for a HPS.


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## jake55 (Mar 1, 2011)

Here is my set up. running 8 plants now (4 others are mothers that i am budding out). Want to expand to 16 plants. Have two mothers (blueberry-widow)


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## jesus of Cannabis (Mar 1, 2011)

veg







flower







Good Luck Jake, I am out to get HIGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## NewGrowth (Mar 1, 2011)

Anybody who reccomends T5's over HPS is no expert, unless their reasoning is less heat.


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## golddog (Mar 1, 2011)

NewGrowth said:


> Anybody who reccomends T5's over HPS is no expert, unless their reasoning is less heat.


I know someone who grows all the way thru with T5's and swears by it ....

But it is not the quality of a plant grown with HPS lights.

He grows 100+ little bitty plants, because of the lack of light penetration. He is growing High Yield Blue Dreams. It is not even as good as my OD Blue Dream.

Rep+ NewGrowth


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## 333maxwell (Mar 1, 2011)

If you have a choice, stick with HPS... of course you can embellish that light additionally with t-5 or other.. 

Me myself, I would stick with HPS and toss some 6500k cfls around too.. 

IN fact, I will play Devils advocate and say I myself have found much better results with CFL than T-5 simply because I can pack more lumens in a smaller space and concentrate it where I like, and drop it into the actual plant at time.. vs T-5 which is fixed and you have one level playing field of light.. 


--

But no, for anything bigger than a very small space, stick with HPS if you got it already.. 

Just my thoughts.


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## HerbalPrincess (Jul 18, 2011)

jake55 said:


> . 1000 watt hps @ 2ft is 35,000 lumens = 4375 lumens per sqft.


 A 1000 watt bulb can produce as much as 135,000 lumens, not 35,000. In a 8sq. ft space that would put you at almost 17,000 lumens per sqft. Much more than the t5's, and probably much more than your plants could use if you built a proper tent with bright diffusive walls. A 400 w HPS or a 4' 8 bulb t5 setup would produce enough light for that space, although the t5 will use more watts and produce less lumens.

t5's are not more efficient in producing light. HPS is the most efficient way of producing light, followed by MH, then high efficiency fluorescents. Look at the lumens per watt of a high quality bulb and you will see for yourself. A nice 400w hps will produce almost 60,000 lumens while a 4' 8 bulb t5 setup will use over 400w and produce under 40,000 lumens.

fluorescent bulbs do produce much less heat than MH and HPS. This is because they don't have a filament burning at several thousand degrees. 

As for penetration, the light from a point source diminishes at 1/r^2. From a theoretical infinite line source light diminishes at 1/r. For a typical rectangular hood, the light will diminish somewhere between these two rates. The more surface area your hood has, the closer it will be to 1/r, which means more penetration. This is in addition to the effect of leaves being able to block light from a smaller source. So whether you use a bunch of fluorescents, or H.I.D.'s with hoods, your penetration will be based on surface area of the hoods and the total lumens produced. T5 hoods spread the light much more evenly than most HID hoods, mainly because of the size difference of the bulbs. On the other hand, as noted earlier, you can produce much more lumens with HID systems and I believe the raptor hood provides very even diffusion with a large surface area and dimensions that fit my room well.


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## cary schellie (Jul 18, 2011)

try doing a constant harvest leave ur hps on 12/12 and get some t5s for veg and clones. u'll save alot of electric not running a 1000 watt for veg, cut a few clones every few weeks


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## 40ozSkunk (Jul 18, 2011)

hps will no doubt yield more. if you wanna see how 4 plants flowered under t5s, check the link in my sig. i just put them under hps two days ago (getting my tent ready for the new and improved round 2). These plants were vegged under 6500k lamps and flowered with half 6500, half 3000k, plus a few 3000k cfls. The buds are small and airy looking, and forget about having any buds worth keeping underneath the canopy. all the lower buds are tiny little specks. 

I'm looking forward to my next grow, where i veg with the t5s and flower with the hps. Then i will truly be able to tell the difference in hps vs t5 yields.


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## Ctznsnips (Jul 19, 2011)

ive flowered under both hps and t5's with mixed spectrum bulbs. you will get a quality product it just wont be as dense as hps flowers.
this is a t5 flowered WW


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## Gary Jarcia (Nov 26, 2014)

From the standpoint of someone who has used both. T5 does not produce the lumens nor pentration of HPS. You get more watts per amp out of a T5 but less efficient light. I use a happy medium. I use a SCROG deep water culture setup with T5 fixtures. This way even though I'm not getting as many lumens, I'm making the best use of what I'm getting by scrogging and lowering lights. Not too close though or you lose the footprint. If they are too close the canopy between the fixtures suffers. This is particularly true if you're using multiple T5 fixtures. I find that 4-5" works well. I also use 240v for my T5s for lower amp consumption. If you're only using 1 or 2 lights this difference is negligible. I won't get the yield of you HPS growers, but my grow is very efficient for the small space I have and skinny wallet. I get between .5 and .75 g/watt so I'm happy. I grow for myself and patients in Colorado and competition here is fierce so keeping costs down is crucial.


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## greasemonkeymann (Nov 26, 2014)

Gary Jarcia said:


> From the standpoint of someone who has used both. T5 does not produce the lumens nor pentration of HPS. You get more watts per amp out of a T5 but less efficient light. I use a happy medium. I use a SCROG deep water culture setup with T5 fixtures. This way even though I'm not getting as many lumens, I'm making the best use of what I'm getting by scrogging and lowering lights. Not too close though or you lose the footprint. If they are too close the canopy between the fixtures suffers. This is particularly true if you're using multiple T5 fixtures. I find that 4-5" works well. I also use 240v for my T5s for lower amp consumption. If you're only using 1 or 2 lights this difference is negligible. I won't get the yield of you HPS growers, but my grow is very efficient for the small space I have and skinny wallet. I get between .5 and .75 g/watt so I'm happy. I grow for myself and patients in Colorado and competition here is fierce so keeping costs down is crucial.


i'm confused, do you mean more lumens per watt? More watts per amp? How does that work? Do you mean less wasted electricity? Considering the ballast on a HID always takes more than a T5. More electricity loss to BTUs on a HID?


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## Gary Jarcia (Nov 26, 2014)

Watts is output, not input, so it's not an accurate measurement of power consumption. Amps is how much the unit uses, not how much it puts out. Forget lumens. You will never get as many lumens per watt than you will from a HPS light. What you will get is more watts of output per kilowatt hour. The other thing to consider is bulb life. HPS bulbs lose considerable strength over time. Not so with T5. They lose very little strenghth between life & death. Let's be real too, any HPS bulb under S100 is pretty much crap. In a bag, HPS will get you bigger yields but at a higher cost. It's all about efficiency. As I said I get about .65g/watt on average. The commercial growers here (indoor anyway) go for 1g/watt. I go by 2 rules.

1. Watts=weight.
2. More root, more fruit


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## blendy (Nov 26, 2014)

Definitely a much bigger yield with the HPS bulbs. I grew with flouros/cfls for quite a while, and it does have its pros like cheap on the electric bill, low heat, low cost if you don't buy the ones specifically for growing. You can use single cfl bulbs to spot light and get some nice looking nugs. I never ended up getting very much on the bottom half of the plant and the nugs are much smaller and less dense, but hey its a good way to learn the basics if nothing else and its cheap.

I've been using CFLs/flouros this whole past grow while I get ready to build my new room in my new house. I ran 1 6-bulb t5 fixture for 3 plants with some spot lighting, just some clones that were almost dead so I didn't care much about them. Never gave them nutes or anything, just some quality soil and water. Bought the light fixture at home depot, it was nothing special just held a lot of 4ft lights. They grew to be about 6-7ft tall and I yielded 92g dry. Unfortunately I didnt take any pics while they were growing but I'll take some right now. They have been in the jar for about a week, still could probably use a final trim too. Didn't get much but the stuff I did get is very smooth and has a strong purple taste, with some pretty nice and unexpected expando. The clones were taken from an F1 grandaddy purp mother seeded from Nirvana, so I expect the strain has a lot to do with the result. Theres just something to the taste of organic soil grows ya know?

Edit: I'm with Gary. If your doing flouros train them plants so you can light the bud sites.


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## Rifleman420 (Nov 26, 2014)

jake55 said:


> My friend showed me some plants that he was growing under the T5s and the buds looked just as good as the ones i grow under my 1000 hps.


I'd have to see that to believe it. Not that I'm calling you a liar. But it's very, very difficult to believe that T5s can compete with HPS for flowering.

I veg with T5s just fine. But I flower with HPS.


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## Gary Jarcia (Nov 26, 2014)

I agree with rifleman on this. While some decent bud can be grown under T5 lighting, it would be very difficult to reproduce the bud size of HPS. Look at it this way. T5 is like someone knocking asking if the plant would like some light. HPS on the other hand is someone with a battering ram knocking the door down and forcing the light in, and penetrating the foliage well below the canopy. I use the SCROG plan because my T5 lights aren't going to penetrate very far anyway, so I concentrate on maximizing the foliage that does get light. Remember that these plants are like strippers. The worse you treat them the more they try to please you.A good part of the reason I decided on T5 was heat. My flower area is only 5X7 and vemtilation is nominal at best.


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## Gary Jarcia (Nov 26, 2014)

DON’T Do The Following:

RULE NUMBER 1
Don’t use electrical watts to compare grow lights

RULE NUMBER 2
Don’t use Lumens to compare grow lights

RULE NUMBER 3
Don’t be fooled by a company that claims to have a magical growth spectrum

RULE NUMBER 4
Don’t just look at a single PAR (PPFD) measurement directly under the fixture

RULE NUMBER 5
Don't focus on the wattage of the LED used in the fixture (1W, 3W, 5W, etc.)

In general, if you see a company using any of the above items to promote their horticulture lights, run away and don’t look back. Neither of these metrics, nor their derivatives, tell you anything about the performance of a horticulture lighting system. There is no "right" way to do this. There are a bozillion combinations possible. You have to find the right one for your budget, goals and setup. My recommendation if you can afford the electric bill and get rid of the heat, go HPS. Otherwise T5 is your best option.


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## jijiandfarmgang (Nov 26, 2014)

Gary Jarcia said:


> Watts is output, not input, so it's not an accurate measurement of power consumption. Amps is how much the unit uses, not how much it puts out. Forget lumens. You will never get as many lumens per watt than you will from a HPS light. What you will get is more watts of output per kilowatt hour. The other thing to consider is bulb life. HPS bulbs lose considerable strength over time. Not so with T5. They lose very little strenghth between life & death. Let's be real too, any HPS bulb under S100 is pretty much crap. In a bag, HPS will get you bigger yields but at a higher cost. It's all about efficiency. As I said I get about .65g/watt on average. The commercial growers here (indoor anyway) go for 1g/watt. I go by 2 rules.
> 
> 1. Watts=weight.
> 2. More root, more fruit


Not purposely trying to single anyone out, but its obvious you have no idea what your talking about. Please don't spread misinformation.

- Jiji


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## Banana444 (Nov 26, 2014)

Gary Jarcia said:


> Watts is output, not input, so it's not an accurate measurement of power consumption. Amps is how much the unit uses, not how much it puts out. Forget lumens. You will never get as many lumens per watt than you will from a HPS light. What you will get is more watts of output per kilowatt hour. The other thing to consider is bulb life. HPS bulbs lose considerable strength over time. Not so with T5. They lose very little strenghth between life & death. Let's be real too, any HPS bulb under S100 is pretty much crap. In a bag, HPS will get you bigger yields but at a higher cost. It's all about efficiency. As I said I get about .65g/watt on average. The commercial growers here (indoor anyway) go for 1g/watt. I go by 2 rules.
> 
> 1. Watts=weight.
> 2. More root, more fruit



Is it two rules? Or 5? Or 7 im confused...and dont go telling me there are more rules....


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## Gary Jarcia (Nov 26, 2014)

Ok so I guess you know more than a master electrician for Ford form38 years (my father in law). Congratulations on being all-knowing. My work here is done.


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## jijiandfarmgang (Nov 26, 2014)

Gary Jarcia said:


> Ok so I guess you know more than a master electrician for Ford form38 years (my father in law). Congratulations on being all-knowing. My work here is done.


 If he said that, then Fuck yeah I do. 

- Jiji


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## Banana444 (Nov 26, 2014)

When did 38 years of someone elses experience in the automotive industry all the sudden make you an expert in horticulture? Stick around though....its worth it.


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## Gary Jarcia (Dec 3, 2014)

ELECTRICIAN. It's about efficiency. I will never dipsute the fa c t that HPS will produce more. All these old schoolers just refuse to admit that HPS has distinct disadvantages and admit that t5 is the most EFFICIENT option. Every grow situation is different there is no right way to do this we all know that. it comes down to the fact that some of us are spenders and some of us are thinkers.


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## Randodred (Jan 10, 2018)

Please get back to me 


40ozSkunk said:


> hps will no doubt yield more. if you wanna see how 4 plants flowered under t5s, check the link in my sig. i just put them under hps two days ago (getting my tent ready for the new and improved round 2). These plants were vegged under 6500k lamps and flowered with half 6500, half 3000k, plus a few 3000k cfls. The buds are small and airy looking, and forget about having any buds worth keeping underneath the canopy. all the lower buds are tiny little specks.
> 
> I'm looking forward to my next grow, where i veg with the t5s and flower with the hps. Then i will truly be able to tell the difference in hps vs t5 yields.


on thia


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