# Trichomes & Harvesting



## k0ijn (Mar 27, 2012)

Harvesting your weed based on trichomes is probably the easiest way for most growers to harvest as close to peak harvest as possible.


The difficulty in the method comes with how to determine the state of the trichomes and what each state means.
If you have the equipment needed it is however very easy and with experience it gets even easier.


To explain how to harvest by trichomes properly I will go into detail as to how to determine when trichomes are at their peak and which substances these trichomes contain, which are desirable and which are not.






The first thing you need to know is that there are 3 "states" in a trichomes development.




The first state is _clear_. Clear trichomes contain precursor cannabinoids (cannabinoids are the different substances in cannabis).
These precursor cannabinoids are not psychoactive (they do not produce a 'high') yet and harvesting clear trichomes will not give you a proper harvest.




The second state is _cloudy/milky_. Cloudy trichomes contain fully realized THC (the by far main contributing substance in any cannabis high).
You want to get as close to 100% cloudy trichomes @ harvest to get the most potency out of your plant. It's impossible to get 100% cloudy trichomes, since trichomes are always being produced and are always maturing, even after harvest the trichomes will continue to develop. 




The third state is _amber_. Amber trichomes contain degraded THC --> CBN. CBN represents a loss of 90% potency (from THC).
CBN is not desirable in any harvest, since it not only represents a huge loss of potency but research into the substance has also shown that CBN does not produce a high like THC does, CBN produces a more sickly feeling not a true high.




Understanding the difference between clear - cloudy - amber trichomes is essential in getting a proper harvest with a peak potency.




This image is a good helper to remember the differences:











To understand how substances change and are developed in cannabis you will need to read extensively on each substance to understand what each substance does and how they affect each other.


This image is helpful in getting a vague knowledge of substances in cannabis and how they develop:













I will not go deeper into what each substance (CBG, CBD, CBC, CBN, THCV etc.) do, suffice to say they all play a part in the cannabis high, albeit a minor part for most of them, since THC is the main factor in a cannabis high.
Some provide pain relief, some reduce muscle spasm, the list goes on and research is still being done to figure out all of the benefits of these substances.


I can however post an image that explains rather well which effects the substances have on the human body:

















Trichomes are of course not the only indicator of when to harvest.
There are other factors that should be taken into account when determining when to harvest.


Calyxes on the plant will swell up, these swollen calyxes are a sign of maturity.
The pistils (what some new growers call hairs) will change colour (often to an orange tinge) and recede into the calyx.
Receding pistils are also a sign of maturity.
Then there is the overall look of the plant. Many experienced growers simply go by this factor, they can determine peak harvest just by looking at the plant and seeing how it looks from afar regarding colour tinge and the look of the calyxes.


All these factors should be taken into account when harvesting. All of these factors usually align when peak harvest approaches.






The best way to check how the trichomes on your plant are doing is by means of a loupe or a microscope.
I would recommend getting ones that can at least go to 60x magnification.
Getting one that can go to 100x would be even better, but the more magnification the more cost.


All you have to do is take a small sample of a leaf with trichomes on it, or if you have a loupe or a USB microscope simply look at the trichomes on the plant to determine their 'state'.
It's important that you check all over the plant, since trichomes will usually develop and produce faster at the top(s) of branches and slower and the bottom of the plant.


Some people choose to harvest the tops first and let the bottom nugs grow a bit more to let the trichomes mature and develop further but also to let the buds fatten up more. It's a judgement and preference call really.




It's almost impossible to harvest without at least some amber trichomes (and some clear), keeping the amber trichomes to the minimum is key if you want maximum potency out of your plant.
Usually if you are careful and watchful you will end up with around 5% clear trichomes, 10% amber and 85% cloudy trichomes.
That is a very reasonable % split and is what you should be aiming for.









References & sources:

http://montanabiotech.com/

Marijuana Chemistry:
Genetics, Processing And Potency


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## KINGEBK1 (Mar 28, 2012)

thanks this help me


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## Supersoul (Mar 29, 2012)

Awesome what a thread with pics and all. But i do have one question. I am not sure if you are familiar with purple kush and what the despensary preffer. I read somewhere that they preffer purple kush to be about 60% amber and the rest milky and clear. if you have any knowledge of this please inform me. This is my first grow and i will be having some left overs. i am also using it for my arthritist. And also read it was suppose to give a couch lock high when it is 60% amber. I have recently started using cannabis to relieve pain and muscle tension. i am at day 56 into flowering and everything is sticky.


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## k0ijn (Mar 30, 2012)

Supersoul said:


> Awesome what a thread with pics and all. But i do have one question. I am not sure if you are familiar with purple kush and what the despensary preffer. I read somewhere that they preffer purple kush to be about 60% amber and the rest milky and clear. if you have any knowledge of this please inform me. This is my first grow and i will be having some left overs. i am also using it for my arthritist. And also read it was suppose to give a couch lock high when it is 60% amber. I have recently started using cannabis to relieve pain and muscle tension. i am at day 56 into flowering and everything is sticky.



The strain phenotype (wether it's a Sativa or and Indica) determines overall wether you get an energetic high or a couch lock high.
It's a common misunderstanding that amber trichomes produce a couch lock high, it's mainly because wrong information has been spread around and people keep perpetuating it, in the end everybody believes it's fact when in reality it isn't.
As already stated in the thread; amber trichomes contain degraded THC --> CBN.
CBN does not really produce a high, it does affect the high but not in a positive way.
CBN is pain relieving (as are most cannabinoids) but it does not reduce muscle tension/spasm.
Cannabinoids like CBD, CBG and CBC affect the high more than CBN does.


If you are looking for pain relief I would suggest you grow Indica strains and preferable ones with a decent % of CBD and CBC.
CBD is not only analgesic (pain relieving) it also reduces muscle spasm and it's a muscle relaxant (a very relevant cannabinoid for you). 
CBC is also analgesic and it has a sedative effect as well.
THC however is also analgesic, therefore CBC should not be the end all of your search for a perfect strain.


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## FrostyTheBudMan (Mar 30, 2012)

Not exactly newbie here, but first grow in a long time, trying to find just the right time to chop. Borrowed a friends digital microscope and have attached the images. Seeking expert advise. I have learned so much here.


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## k0ijn (Mar 30, 2012)

FrostyTheBudMan said:


> Not exactly newbie here, but first grow in a long time, trying to find just the right time to chop. Borrowed a friends digital microscope and have attached the images. Seeking expert advise. I have learned so much here.
> View attachment 2098432View attachment 2098433View attachment 2098434


Seems to be a combination of cloudy and clear trichomes as far as I can see from the images.
You should let your plant(s) flower a bit more, hard to be specific without more info (length of flowering so far, strain etc.) but I would say at least 2 weeks as I see no amber trichomes and still quite a few clear.


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## FrostyTheBudMan (Mar 30, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Seems to be a combination of cloudy and clear trichomes as far as I can see from the images.
> You should let your plant(s) flower a bit more, hard to be specific without more info (length of flowering so far, strain etc.) but I would say at least 2 weeks as I see no amber trichomes and still quite a few clear.


So far they have been 57 days flowering, it is some sort of Blueberry, got as clones from a friend. They were vegged 12 weeks prior to the 12/12. Thanks so much for your help, I am hoping to get a few more weeks out of them.


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## k0ijn (Mar 31, 2012)

FrostyTheBudMan said:


> So far they have been 57 days flowering, it is some sort of Blueberry, got as clones from a friend. They were vegged 12 weeks prior to the 12/12. Thanks so much for your help, I am hoping to get a few more weeks out of them.


Alright, well let them flower for a few more weeks but keep a close eye on them, sometimes the trichomes can 'change' rather quickly


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## FrostyTheBudMan (Mar 31, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Alright, well let them flower for a few more weeks but keep a close eye on them, sometimes the trichomes can 'change' rather quickly


That was my plan, I had read elsewhere that they can change quickly, but good to confirm that directly from someone that has the knowledge. Thanks so much!


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## FrostyTheBudMan (Apr 2, 2012)

Looks like time, got a chance to check this morning and seeing amber! Darkness for two days then chop chop, so close I can taste it now!
View attachment 2102387


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## Supersoul (Apr 2, 2012)

hi, i just took these pics of purple kush and they are in day 60 of flowering and just turn the lights on from a 2 days darkness. I dont have a loupe microscope and this is my first grow. Should i chop today? Like now?...i waited so long because i was away on a vacation. I dont want to lose potency and not sure on the color of the trichs without a microscope. maybe a veteran can eye ball the pic and have a good guess.


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## panhead (Apr 2, 2012)

Supersoul said:


> hi, i just took these pics of purple kush and they are in day 60 of flowering and just turn the lights on from a 2 days darkness. I dont have a loupe microscope and this is my first grow. Should i chop today? Like now?...i waited so long because i was away on a vacation. I dont want to lose potency and not sure on the color of the trichs without a microscope. maybe a veteran can eye ball the pic and have a good guess.View attachment 2102853View attachment 2102854View attachment 2102855View attachment 2102857View attachment 2102858


One bit of additional info,you mentioned being at 60 days flower,when did you start the day count ?

If you started counting as soon as you went 12/12 then you skipped a step,all strains have a transition period where the plants metabolism switches gears from veg to bud phase,this is also when the plants will stretch out,you shouldnt start a day count until the plants fully transition from veg to bud.

Keep in mind most strains have a different length of transition,some as fast as 5-7 days & others as long as 14-18 days,most indica dominant strains are around 7 days & the more sativa in the strain the longer the transition period.

Transition from veg to bud is complete once most of the stretching out of the plant is finished & when the plant starts putting out new pistils. 
I dont start a day count till see new pistils comming out of most bud sights.

If you started counting as soon as day 1 of 12/12 then you still have atleast 7 days.


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## Supersoul (Apr 2, 2012)

Feb 4 was when i took them out of 3 days of darkness to get them to flower then went to 12/12 that should be 53 days and purple kush is an 8 week strain. And they all showed sex around the 8th of feb. Question: since i am not able to cut and manicure all of them in one day. where should i put the plants that i cant get to?..in the darkness or cfl's 24/7 or leave them in the flowering room with 1000 watt hps with the 12/12


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## k0ijn (Apr 2, 2012)

FrostyTheBudMan said:


> Looks like time, got a chance to check this morning and seeing amber! Darkness for two days then chop chop, so close I can taste it now!
> View attachment 2102387



Yeah I see three amber trichomes there.
Have you checked all over the plant? Chop chop if you have


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## k0ijn (Apr 2, 2012)

Supersoul said:


> Feb 4 was when i took them out of 3 days of darkness to get them to flower then went to 12/12 that should be 53 days and purple kush is an 8 week strain. And they all showed sex around the 8th of feb. Question: since i am not able to cut and manicure all of them in one day. where should i put the plants that i cant get to?..in the darkness or cfl's 24/7 or leave them in the flowering room with 1000 watt hps with the 12/12



I think you still have a week or so left, based on the images and the info.
If you can, I'd advise you get a loupe or a microscope, they are fairly inexpensive and they can really help a lot.


I'd leave those plants you can't harvest and process in the flowering room.
I usually harvest my plants in stages if there are large differences in trichomes from top nugs to bottom nugs.
That is to say I harvest the largest and most advance calyxes first and the lower bottom popcorn ones later.

You can easily leave the plants in the flowering room for a day or two without causing any problems.


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## FrostyTheBudMan (Apr 2, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Yeah I see three amber trichomes there.
> Have you checked all over the plant? Chop chop if you have


I have and amber is slowly popping up all over so chop chop time tomorrow!


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## Supersoul (Apr 2, 2012)

*

I usually harvest my plants in stages if there are large differences in trichomes from top nugs to bottom nugs.
That is to say I harvest the largest and most advance calyxes first and the lower bottom popcorn ones later.​
​

*Did you mean chop off the top part of the plants first? Like cut the stem where there is amber or the whole stem? and take it as it comes and work it downward? and leave the unready ones in the soil? if so would you split a bud?
I have a veg area that is lit with cfl's should i move the plants that i am working on there?, since my clones are now ready for bigger lights and move them to the flowering room and adjust the time to 18/6? or should i leave the ready plants in the flowering room at 12/12 until i start chopping it? I should beable to get a loupe by tommorrow i hope


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## k0ijn (Apr 3, 2012)

Supersoul said:


> *
> 
> I usually harvest my plants in stages if there are large differences in trichomes from top nugs to bottom nugs.
> That is to say I harvest the largest and most advance calyxes first and the lower bottom popcorn ones later.​
> ...


No I don't chop of any part of the stem really (if possible).
I take off the top nugs, damaging the plant as little as possible.
You can easily harvest the top part (leaving as many branches and stems intact as you can) without killing the plant.
Thereby retaining branches where I can and leaving the bottom calyxes to still develop.

I would not split a bud no. I'd harvest all the mature buds and leave the underdeveloped ones to develop for a few more days or maybe even a week.
It depends on how much time you have and how you prefer harvesting really.
It's not as easy as just harvesting the whole plant and if you're very new to growing I would not recommend you do it but it is a viable option.
If it's small plants it's usually not worth doing this, this method only works on large plants where there can be huge differences in how the bud sections develop.

I would leave the plants in the flowering room to avoid light stressing them.
Light stress is some of the worst stress there is.
You can manhandle plants, cut them, split them, top them without much trouble.
Change the light schedule or move them from flower to veg and you could end up with huge problems rather quickly.


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## Supersoul (Apr 4, 2012)

I got a 10x loupe scope this morning and most of them are cloudy but i did one or two amber ones but to look hard for them...im guessing i have to wait before chopping. How much longer would you say the wait will be?? Also i cut one of the lower branch with some small buds to practice manicuring a bud. Could you tell me if this looks right, i tried to get all the surrounding leaves off.


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## k0ijn (Apr 4, 2012)

Supersoul said:


> I got a 10x loupe scope this morning and most of them are cloudy but i did one or two amber ones but to look hard for them...im guessing i have to wait before chopping. How much longer would you say the wait will be?? Also i cut one of the lower branch with some small buds to practice manicuring a bud. Could you tell me if this looks right, i tried to get all the surrounding leaves off. View attachment 2106283


If you see hardly any clear, mostly cloudy and a few amber it's a good time to harvest.
You might be able to let your plants flower a few days to a week more or so, but I wouldn't let them flower more than that if you are seeing mostly cloudy a few amber.

You can leave some of the smaller leaves (sugar leaves) on the buds.
These leaves can help avoid a too quick dry and they can also add some good properties to your buds (flavour etc.).
But it's a preference call, if you prefer without leaves, do it that way, just make sure you don't dry too quickly (you want a dry period of ~6-7 days (slow & steady)).


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## Antihero17 (Apr 6, 2012)

In the beginning of the thread it was mentioned that the trics will continue to change so that being said. If I chop my girls down at say 80% cloudy trics what percentage of cloudy/amber could I expect once they are completly done? This is my first grow and I'm fixing to harvest soon and this is the only knowledge I haven't been able to scour off the Net so any input is appreciated. 
Good Luck and Good Grow!!


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## k0ijn (Apr 6, 2012)

Antihero17 said:


> In the beginning of the thread it was mentioned that the trics will continue to change so that being said. If I chop my girls down at say 80% cloudy trics what percentage of cloudy/amber could I expect once they are completly done? This is my first grow and I'm fixing to harvest soon and this is the only knowledge I haven't been able to scour off the Net so any input is appreciated.
> Good Luck and Good Grow!!



The trichomes continue to develop even after you harvest.
But it doesn't mean that you can harvest early and let the trichomes mature while you dry & cure since your buds will not be fully developed and you'll end up with airy/small/underdeveloped buds.
I cannot give you a precise answer regarding your early harvest chop without knowing more about strain, conditions etc.
There are so many variables that play into it, no one could possibly answer that question fully or factually.
If it's a slow flowering plant, you might not see much change if it's not you might see 5%-10% change, but then again, temp, RH, drying time, curing time etc. all affect this.

You just need to keep in mind that the trichomes will keep developing and that you should take care in the drying & curing process (especially with temp and light exposure and handling) to not lose any trichome nor cause any THC to degrade more than what is normal (exposing your buds to UV light and high temps can cause this).
What you should take away from the 'trichomes keep developing' statement is that you should never harvest too late, since you won't end up with the amber % you had when you harvested (because trichomes keep degrading (in case of cloudy to amber) / developing).


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## JJFOURTWENTY (Apr 14, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> The third state is _amber_. *Amber trichomes contain degraded THC --> CBN. CBN represents a loss of 90% potency (from THC). CBN is not desirable in any harvest*, since it not only represents a huge loss of potency but research into the substance has also shown that CBN does not produce a high like THC does, CBN produces a more sickly feeling not a true high.


Couldn't agree with this more! _Soooooooo_ much MISinformation pertaining to amber trichs on this site and a whole lot of others as well. "Don't chop until you see at least 30% amber." WTF??!! I hear that bullshit all the time. My first harvest I let it go a week too long and consequently started flushing way too late as a result. Bud was still bomb, but it was very noticeable at least to me that the overall effects had drifted far from the psychoactive to the medicinal part of the scale. Now don't get me wrong I love a little bit of couchlock, but my ass being put straight to sleep after a few hits is not exactly what I'm aiming for.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Apr 15, 2012)

panhead said:


> One bit of additional info,you mentioned being at 60 days flower,when did you start the day count ?
> 
> If you started counting as soon as you went 12/12 then you skipped a step,all strains have a transition period where the plants metabolism switches gears from veg to bud phase,this is also when the plants will stretch out,you shouldnt start a day count until the plants fully transition from veg to bud.
> 
> ...



That's the first time ive ever heard that. i always have been counting from the day I flip. Do you have a source for this info?


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## Supersoul (Apr 22, 2012)

Hi again, I'm stumped again. I had one plant that i chopped 2 weeks ago with 20% amber. Now the other plants are just stubborn and now they are at 71 day into flowering and 84 days since i shut the lights out for 2 days to trigger the flowering stage. They are purple kush grown in FF soil. I stopped giving them nutes about 23 days ago. Most of the plants are all cloudy and no sign of going amber. 18 days ago i did a 2 days lights out so i can get more trichomes but now the plants are not turning amber...is it because of the lights out or is it because i stopped giving nutes?? Oh and the plant that i did harvest....are the leaves suppose to be brown?....I thought all buds are suppose to be green and where is the purple in the purple kush. Yes this is my first grow and i am stumped at the end...atleast i get to smoke one plant until i figure it out,...thanks for any help.
these pics of the purple kush that is so brown.
these are the stubborn plants


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## Supersoul (Apr 23, 2012)

is'nt purple kush an 8 week (56 days about) strain?


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## k0ijn (Apr 23, 2012)

I don't follow, why did you stop giving nutes 23 days ago? Your plants look famished, they are basically eating themselves to stay alive.
I don't understand why you did a 2 day light out either, that has undoubtably stressed your plants.

The third picture plants look alright but they look famished as well, all fan leaves look mostly dead or well on the way.
You should never stop giving nutes at the end of flowering, it's the critical time, when your plants really need nutrients to grow calyxes and produce.


If you want to speed up flowering you can change the light schedule to 10 (ON) / 14 (OFF).
It's shown to speed up plants, making them finish quicker, however it's not scientifically proven yet.

Your plants look almost finished though, don't be discouraged that no amber trichs are present, it's a good thing.
By the size and colour tinge of your plants they mostly look ready, taking into account what you have done with the nutrients and the light schedule I'd advise you harvest.
You won't get much more out of those plants in the state they're in, you should harvest before the plants start eating more of themselves to survive.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Apr 23, 2012)

Supersoul said:


> Hi again, I'm stumped again. I had one plant that i chopped 2 weeks ago with 20% amber. Now the other plants are just stubborn and now they are at 71 day into flowering and 84 days since i shut the lights out for 2 days to trigger the flowering stage. They are purple kush grown in FF soil. I stopped giving them nutes about 23 days ago. Most of the plants are all cloudy and no sign of going amber. 18 days ago i did a 2 days lights out so i can get more trichomes but now the plants are not turning amber...is it because of the lights out or is it because i stopped giving nutes?? Oh and the plant that i did harvest....are the leaves suppose to be brown?....I thought all buds are suppose to be green and where is the purple in the purple kush. Yes this is my first grow and i am stumped at the end...atleast i get to smoke one plant until i figure it out,...thanks for any help.
> View attachment 2134293View attachment 2134294these pics of the purple kush that is so brown.
> View attachment 2134296these are the stubborn plants


I like to harvest when all are Cloudy personally. Waiting until Amber is the point of degredation to many people and not necessary. I run my Indica 60 days and Hybrid 70.


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## Supersoul (Apr 24, 2012)

*

I don't follow, why did you stop giving nutes 23 days ago? Your plants look famished, they are basically eating themselves to stay alive.
I don't understand why you did a 2 day light out either, that has undoubtably stressed your plants.​
​

*I stopped the nutes to clear out any chemical taste in the organic FF soil and nutes that i was using, seems like i did it prematurely because i was timing it according to the schedual of an 8 week strain. Was that the wrong thing to do since i read in many places to do that. To stop the nutes a week before cutting?

Also i heard that 2 days of darkness before cutting brings out more crystals. Is that a myth also?


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## k0ijn (Apr 24, 2012)

Supersoul said:


> *
> 
> I don't follow, why did you stop giving nutes 23 days ago? Your plants look famished, they are basically eating themselves to stay alive.
> I don't understand why you did a 2 day light out either, that has undoubtably stressed your plants.​
> ...



Nutrient storage in cannabis plants is rather complicated, I've written extensively about it on this forum, you can find it if you search my nick and nutrient storage so I won't go into much detail here.
Suffice to say that you cannot 'clear' chemical taste out of cannabis, since it won't have any chemical taste in the first place, unless the particular strain you're growing has that trait.
Nutrients are not stored directly in the buds or calyxes. Nutrients are stored in the leaves and roots and transported around to fit the needs of the plant.
But nutrients moved to the calyxes are used up very fast, it's almost impossible to have an abundance of nutrients in the calyxes, where it is quite possible to have that in the leaves and roots.

Therefore there is no need to clear anything out of your plant.

You should not stop giving nutrients to your plants at all, it will slow growth and production in the most critical phase of flowering (end flowering).

Yes that is also a myth.
Most of the stuff you hear or have heard about 'bringing out more crystals, pushing out more crystals, explosive growth due to bla bla bla' is here say and a myth.

What you can trust to work is giving a balanced nutrient supply so your plants are as close to critical nutrient mass (neither abundance nor deficiency), which will allow critical production (get most out of your plant possible).
Keeping a proper light schedule is also key, as is air circulation and a ton of other things.


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## JJFOURTWENTY (Apr 24, 2012)

Why do people _abuse_ their plants *so* much in the end????

This I will never know...


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## FrostyTheBudMan (Apr 25, 2012)

JJFOURTWENTY said:


> Why do people _abuse_ their plants *so* much in the end????
> 
> This I will never know...


From all of the reading I did here, in books and growing sites I was completely confused and had no clue what to do on my first run, flush, not flush. My gut instinct was why would you deprive the plants at the time they needed nutrition most. But all I read was Flush, Flush, Flush. So Flush I did, but luckily it was short lived as with the help of k0ijn I found that my trichs had just started turning amber.https://www.rollitup.org/members/k0ijn-355103.html I will not make that mistake again. It can be hard sifting through all the information available. An experienced grower friend stated that "You really hit the landing" on my first crop, to this I credit and THANK k0ijn and his straight forward advice!!


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## k0ijn (Apr 25, 2012)

FrostyTheBudMan said:


> From all of the reading I did here, in books and growing sites I was completely confused and had no clue what to do on my first run, flush, not flush. My gut instinct was why would you deprive the plants at the time they needed nutrition most. But all I read was Flush, Flush, Flush. So Flush I did, but luckily it was short lived as with the help of k0ijn I found that my trichs had just started turning amber. I will not make that mistake again. It can be hard sifting through all the information available. An experienced grower friend stated that "You really hit the landing" on my first crop, to this I credit and THANK k0ijn and his straight forward advice!!



You're most welcome Frosty 

I'm glad it worked out well and that you got a great start to growing and all the wonderful joys that brings!


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## Lucius Vorenus (Apr 25, 2012)

FrostyTheBudMan said:


> From all of the reading I did here, in books and growing sites I was completely confused and had no clue what to do on my first run, flush, not flush. My gut instinct was why would you deprive the plants at the time they needed nutrition most. But all I read was Flush, Flush, Flush. So Flush I did, but luckily it was short lived as with the help of k0ijn I found that my trichs had just started turning amber. I will not make that mistake again. It can be hard sifting through all the information available. An experienced grower friend stated that "You really hit the landing" on my first crop, to this I credit and THANK k0ijn and his straight forward advice!!


So now you're not flushing?


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## FrostyTheBudMan (Apr 25, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> So now you're not flushing?


I grow in somewhat "organic" soil now, don't overdo the nutes, Fox Farm trio, CalMag and some molasses as flowering moves on to benefit the Mycro I have added at transplant and feedings, no I will no longer flush. The one "flush" I did the first time did probably benefit my first run, as I had over fertilized an already hot soil. Live and learn. Such a great and rewarding hobby! We learn from experience and we learn from each other.


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## notaskunkboffin (Apr 26, 2012)

how long u watch tricholmes for and do i flush while waiting cos my strains flower for 7 /8 weeks max and just passed 6 weeks going to start flushing for last week or so thx for any info


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## Supersoul (Apr 27, 2012)

see another person that thought as i did that flushing is require before harvesting


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## Lucius Vorenus (Apr 27, 2012)

I've not flushed before and had weed that would not stay lit in joints (nitrogen) and also would occasionally spark (phosphorous)

That was before I started using straight Maxibloom though for flower. Maybe i'll give it another go.


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## k0ijn (May 1, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> I've not flushed before and had weed that would not stay lit in joints (nitrogen) and also would occasionally spark (phosphorous)
> 
> That was before I started using straight Maxibloom though for flower. Maybe i'll give it another go.



How do you attribute the fact that it won't stay lit to nitrogen? The same with question with regards to your phosphorous statement.
If that would even be possible (I have never seen or heard of it before) you must have overfed your plants with extreme doses to attain such high nutrient levels in the calyxes that what you describe would even be possible. 

Tbh I think your weed was just too wet/damp to stay lit. The part about phosphorous being the spark could just as easily have been a stem bursting from the heat.


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## East Coast Pro (May 1, 2012)

OK, so in organic soil when I have mostly cloudy trichs, would it be enough to just flood them good once the last 2-3 days before chop? Also when you curing, how do you know when the bud will be fine in the jars without burping daily anymore..will the moisture quit building up in the jars when it's time?


----------



## rocpilefsj (May 2, 2012)

East Coast Pro said:


> OK, so in organic soil when I have mostly cloudy trichs, would it be enough to just flood them good once the last 2-3 days before chop? Also when you curing, how do you know when the bud will be fine in the jars without burping daily anymore..will the moisture quit building up in the jars when it's time?


Try using a hygrometer. Here is a good thread on the subject: https://www.rollitup.org/harvesting-curing/514841-perfect-cure-every-time.html


----------



## k0ijn (May 2, 2012)

East Coast Pro said:


> OK, so in organic soil when I have mostly cloudy trichs, would it be enough to just flood them good once the last 2-3 days before chop? Also when you curing, how do you know when the bud will be fine in the jars without burping daily anymore..will the moisture quit building up in the jars when it's time?


I don't pre-harvest flush my plants at all. I see no reason to do it.
I rarely flush, and only do so if I have problems with salt buildup, nutrient levels or the like (which happens very rarely in my current hydro setup).

As roc said, get a hygrometer if possible. 
Makes it a lot easier for you and it's not that expensive (you can get reliable hygrometers for ~$20 where I live).
It will ensure a properly executed cure, even if you're new to curing.


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## Lucius Vorenus (May 2, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> How do you attribute the fact that it won't stay lit to nitrogen? The same with question with regards to your phosphorous statement.
> If that would even be possible (I have never seen or heard of it before) you must have overfed your plants with extreme doses to attain such high nutrient levels in the calyxes that what you describe would even be possible.
> 
> Tbh I think your weed was just too wet/damp to stay lit. The part about phosphorous being the spark could just as easily have been a stem bursting from the heat.


Listen to a commercial growers take on it I guess.

[video=youtube;SX91ABT-gns]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SX91ABT-gns[/video]


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## SimonD (May 2, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Listen to a commercial growers take on it I guess.
> 
> [video=youtube;SX91ABT-gns]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SX91ABT-gns[/video]


Heh, let me share a small tidbit with you. At the end of a long day tending the op, when I want to relax and have a few laughs, I roll a fat one and fire up one of these videos. It doesn't matter which: Urban Grower, Jason Wilcox, or any of the Youtube canna people. We actually had a thread about the same thing on another forum. These folks really have no idea as to what they're talking about, unlike the information provided in this thread. Sure, once in a while they'll say something that sounds right to someone who solely reads growbooks, but on an applicable level they're a joke. Really. A comical outing. Laughs galore. Please understand that this particular discussion is a bright light in a sea of absolute stupidity. Folks can only hurt themselves by ignoring the information. Good luck.

Simon


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## Lucius Vorenus (May 2, 2012)

SimonD said:


> Heh, let me share a small tidbit with you. At the end of a long day tending the op, when I want to relax and have a few laughs, I roll a fat one and fire up one of these videos. It doesn't matter which: Urban Grower, Jason Wilcox, or any of the Youtube canna people. We actually had a thread about the same thing on another forum. These folks really have no idea as to what they're talking about, unlike the information provided in this thread. Sure, once in a while they'll say something that sounds right to someone who solely reads growbooks, but on an applicable level they're a joke. Really. A comical outing. Laughs galore. Please understand that this particular discussion is a bright light in a sea of absolute stupidity. Folks can only hurt themselves by ignoring the information. Good luck.
> 
> Simon


And you are????????


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## SimonD (May 2, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> And you are????????


Honestly, if you can't gather the fortitude to click on the links in my sig... Google works, too. Best of luck with your grow. 

Simon


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## Lucius Vorenus (May 2, 2012)

SimonD said:


> Honestly, if you can't gather the fortitude to click on the links in my sig... Google works, too. Best of luck with your grow.
> 
> Simon


Those plants look nice. But I was expecting a large commercial grower the way you were bashing Remo. I guess I was a tad defensive because Remo has helped me out in the past when I was in Vancouver and that guy grows 1lb plants indoors pretty regularly.

I'm sure you're better though.


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## SimonD (May 2, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Those plants look nice. But I was expecting a large commercial grower the way you were bashing Remo. I guess I was a tad defensive because Remo has helped me out in the past when I was in Vancouver and that guy grows 1lb plants indoors pretty regularly.
> 
> I'm sure you're better though.


 Can anyone really be this stupid? It's as if you want to flame and argue solely for the sake of flaming and arguing. And here I thought this forum was supposed to help other grow. Instead of trying to comprehend the information presented, you're debating factors compelely outside of your reach, just for the sake of disagreeing. It's absurd. I so regret ever posting here. Honestly.

Simon


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## Lucius Vorenus (May 2, 2012)

Not sure what you're trying to prove by posting a pic of what looks to be 2.5lbs. I grow that in a bedroom. I was talking about large commercial growers.

No biggie. You seem very defensive. Guess no one better question you ever about laughing at large commercial growers. LOL


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## SimonD (May 2, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Not sure what you're trying to prove by posting a pic of what looks to be 2.5lbs. I grow that in a bedroom. I was talking about large commercial growers.
> 
> No biggie. You seem very defensive. Guess no one better question you ever about laughing at large commercial growers. LOL









^^^ This must exemplify the 2.5lbs you dreamt about harvesting. No wonder you have such an err... astute sense of scale.

Here's the ironic thing about all this. You were asking about starting a commercial grow not too long ago. Clearly, your personal cultivation efforts leave a bit to be desired, yet, at this very moment, you're talking to a grower who can pull up to 4oz dry/cured for every square foot of his room. And what do you do? Instead of maybe trying to find out how it's done, for your own benefit no less, you play games and argue endlessly. Stupid is as stupid does.

I wish the mods would delete all this, my (latter) posts included. Why is it that so many threads here turn into some blowhard kid trolling the population? This is a joke. Not in a good way. These events are actively driving real growers away from this forum, that seem to get replaced by more trolling children. WTF?

Simon


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## SimonD (May 2, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> so you pick a pic of 3 plants from week 3 of a grow to somehow reflect something? Yea I bet you want mods to delete this man. You come off as a douche. You started attacking a couple of really quality growers who help a lot of people out and saying you laugh at them. Now you want to back peddle? You coward?
> 
> Fuck you.


I don't question their intentions; no doubt they're very good. It's the pseudo-scientific gibberish, highly suspect assertions of cousal relationships, and of course the relatively uneventful plants. Amateur stuff. Nothing wrong with that in itself, other than the humor behind someone presenting himself as an expert with such a limited level of skill and general comprehension of the process, but I digress. You chose to present one of these silly videos as a rebuttal to someone for more educated than yourself, as if the fact the video exists, in itself, is some kind of lamebrain proof. What I told you, as an actual grower, was that folks like me watch that stuff for laughs and you should listen more closely to the info in this thread. Apparently you found that concept very upsetting. Sorry.

Simon


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## k0ijn (May 2, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Listen to a commercial growers take on it I guess.
> 
> [video=youtube;SX91ABT-gns]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SX91ABT-gns[/video]



I didn't get much from that video other than his personal opinion. He sounds like he's a fan of flushing, which would explain his opinion on the matter.
I'd like to see some links to scientific information showing proof of what he's talking about (You are welcome to PM me the info).
I don't want to get into a large discussion about flushing in this thread since this is a sticky ment to assist people in the harvesting process.
It's not really a discussion based thread for theories and personal opinions, it's ment to contain purely factual information.



I have presented my proof of how nutrient storage, transportation and consumption within plants work, you can find it (as I've already mentioned in this thread) if you search for my nick and check my previous posts.

I'm repeating myself, but for the sake of the argument I will.

Cannabis nutrient storage and transportation around the plant is very complicated. I'm not fully explaining every aspect of the processes in the following;
Basically the nutrients are "stored" in the leaves and roots, fan leaves more so than sugar leaves.
Stems also contain a lot of nutrients but this is more to the fact of the xylem, phloem and other plant mechanisms being the main way of transporting water (and therefore nutrients) around.

The ratios are different depending on which nutrient we're talking about and also which supply (deficient vs critical vs abundant).
For example nitrate ions are 'stored' ~3:1 in leaves compared with the roots.
Whereas phosphate ions are 'stored' ~2:1 in roots compared with the leaves.
Suffice to say that there is a reason why fan leaves (and roots which is readily visible in hydro grows) react to overfeeding and underfeeding first and most severely.

The calyxes themselves do not contain an abundance of nutrients at any point in the growth, unless you heavily overfeed your plants. And you have to overfeed _A LOT_.
Most abundance nutrients by far end up in the leaves, roots and stems. 
Cannabis plants are highly efficient, they use up the nutrients supplied to the calyxes very quickly, almost entirely eliminating any chances of nutrients building up in the calyxes, except for extreme cases.
This is evident in the scientific information I have provided in past posts.



I will just end with saying that I don't want to see any more arguments in this thread, I have deleted some of your posts, Lucius & Simon. 
I hope you understand that it's so we can keep this thread on topic, easy to navigate for people who need help and useful throughout.


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## nedguy (May 4, 2012)

brilliant thread man !


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## Cataben (May 6, 2012)

great info thank you


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## rockinriggin (May 14, 2012)

Nice thread thanks! and about the videos on You Tube.....there is sure a lot of bad info out there. I learned the hard way. More than once.


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## bramwell73 (May 15, 2012)

its been asked before but can i put a plant in the dark for 2 days harvest the buds that are ready , then put here back to mature the bottom plant? or would this bugger it up?
also one of my plants is taking ages to mature-loads of clear trichs some cloudy, hairs are still comming out white, some are orange , 
thanks guys, if you need pics i will get some up ,


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## Burn604 (May 16, 2012)

Awesome, very informative. Thanks a lot man.


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## Subu (May 16, 2012)

bramwell73 said:


> View attachment 2168882View attachment 2168883its been asked before but can i put a plant in the dark for 2 days harvest the buds that are ready , then put here back to mature the bottom plant? or would this bugger it up?
> also one of my plants is taking ages to mature-loads of clear trichs some cloudy, hairs are still comming out white, some are orange ,
> thanks guys, if you need pics i will get some up ,


The buds in both pics don't look near ready, as to your question i'm not sure but i'll say anyway "It will stress the plant" lol.


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## bramwell73 (May 17, 2012)

its a bugger as the days are getting short , i guess ill take em in at night(to avoid frost ) and keep them as long as i can outside.i uess thats better than harvesting early ,
any advise would be great, its mid autumn now.


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## tharoomman (May 19, 2012)

bramwell73 said:


> View attachment 2168882View attachment 2168883its been asked before but can i put a plant in the dark for 2 days harvest the buds that are ready , then put here back to mature the bottom plant? or would this bugger it up?
> also one of my plants is taking ages to mature-loads of clear trichs some cloudy, hairs are still comming out white, some are orange ,
> thanks guys, if you need pics i will get some up ,


You can do a 1/2 harvest and then flower some more. A lot of people do it. Depending on strain it may take a week or more for the plant to recover from a partial harvest and to start flowering again.


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## k0ijn (May 19, 2012)

bramwell73 said:


> View attachment 2168882View attachment 2168883its been asked before but can i put a plant in the dark for 2 days harvest the buds that are ready , then put here back to mature the bottom plant? or would this bugger it up?
> also one of my plants is taking ages to mature-loads of clear trichs some cloudy, hairs are still comming out white, some are orange ,
> thanks guys, if you need pics i will get some up ,


I would not recommend putting the plants in a dark room for two days, harvest some of it and then put them back into the flowering room.
You would stress the plants a lot if you did that.
They could survive, but it would slow their progress and might harm them.

Some strains take longer than others.
Sativas generally take a good while longer than Indicas, just keep an eye on them.
The colour of the pistils (hairs) don't really point to optimum harvest time, I've seen plants harvested with all white pistils (80% cloudy, 15% amber, 5% clear) and I've seen plants with coloured pistils (other than white) still not near ready.
You should never go by pistil colour to determine peak harvesting window.


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## nameno (May 19, 2012)

*

k0ijn 




Thank you,from nameno on the eastcoast



*


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## Vikingo (May 20, 2012)

Great Thread! I have 2 Critical Mass at final stages of flowering and should be ripe for chop in about a week!

This Thread by K0ijn is excellent. 

Being in Spain, I have checked both Spanish (www.lamarihuana.com) and www.rollitup.org sites for information during my first grow and I have to admit that you guys are the most informative. On the Spanish Site there is alot of Newbees posting ridiculous things!

Looking forward to my first chopping and drying in a few days, and will looking for more information on the "perfect" way to do this, step by step.

Thanks Again everybody!

Buenos Humos (Happy Smoking)


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## k0ijn (May 20, 2012)

Vikingo said:


> Great Thread! I have 2 Critical Mass at final stages of flowering and should be ripe for chop in about a week!
> 
> This Thread by K0ijn is excellent.
> 
> ...



I'm glad you found what you were looking for and it helped you =)

I hope your harvest goes well, don't hesitate to make a thread in the Harvesting & Curing forum if you have any questions regarding harvesting and/or curing, there are a lot of helpful people here.


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## bramwell73 (May 20, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> I would not recommend putting the plants in a dark room for two days, harvest some of it and then put them back into the flowering room.
> You would stress the plants a lot if you did that.
> They could survive, but it would slow their progress and might harm them.
> 
> ...


thanks mate.


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## DJScooter (May 29, 2012)

Great thread! Made me make up my mind and do some cutting xD


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## CisGreen (Jun 3, 2012)

Great thread. Thank you.

I'm a long-time grower but just recently joined after I saw a ridiculous comment on the thread "average amount of red hairs at harvest" posted by a user named t0k3s. I was browsing forums looking for a simple yet informative thread to send to a friend in need of schooling about when to harvest, and I came across that thread then you.

Why some think amber is a good thing to shoot for I'll never understand. Whether indica or sativa it's something to avoid at all costs. The 5% clear, 10% amber and 85% cloudy is a good look to shoot for. I sure wish you would of been at that thread back in 2009 to school those amber lovers. 

Your thread is on it's way to my friend. Peace


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## lordjames (Jun 4, 2012)

awesome post


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## salzar (Jun 20, 2012)

Day 50, unkown genetics. Sorry for being out of focus I didnt have a tripod. From the image I am not sure if the Trichs are cloudy, or if it is an artifact of the image.


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## k0ijn (Jun 21, 2012)

salzar said:


> Day 50, unkown genetics. Sorry for being out of focus I didnt have a tripod. From the image I am not sure if the Trichs are cloudy, or if it is an artifact of the image.


As I specify in the thread, you need a loupe or a microscope to determine the colour of the trichomes correctly.
If you have a good digital camera (4MP+) you can take high resolution pictures and determine it that way but a loupe or microscope is easier and more reliable.

If you want a guess, I'd say mostly clear, few cloudy just based on the non-receded pistils and 50 day flowering.


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## luckybleu (Jun 21, 2012)

k0ijn,threads like this are why I joined riu. thanks


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## k0ijn (Jun 22, 2012)

luckybleu said:


> k0ijn,threads like this are why I joined riu. thanks


Good to 'hear' luckybleu 
I hope you found what you were looking for.


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## mofropoly (Jun 23, 2012)

k0ijn, if my trichromes are cloudy, but most of my pistils haven't receded yet should I wait? Today is day 56 of flowering both a Master Kush and an Aurora Indica. Thank you and this thread has been very helpful!


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## k0ijn (Jun 23, 2012)

mofropoly said:


> k0ijn, if my trichromes are cloudy, but most of my pistils haven't receded yet should I wait? Today is day 56 of flowering both a Master Kush and an Aurora Indica. Thank you and this thread has been very helpful!


I would always go with how the trichromes are looking more than how the pistils are looking but the two should align at peak harvest.

Have you checked trichomes all over the plant? Are there any amber trichomes?
How are the calyxes looking? They should fatten up nicely.

56 days is not a lot of time but I know those strains have a short flowering period.

You're welcome


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## Doctor John (Jun 24, 2012)

K0ijn Thanks for the clear obviously informed thread. This is the best simplest info that I as a newbie have come across. I have bought a 60x loupe and now can see my trics clearly and now know what to look for. I also love your simple clear approach on things such as no flushing (never made sense to me) steady nuts and keep schedule going to harvest, which all say not to do. I will be looking at all your posts with great interest. picture attached 4 weeks into flowering.

THANKS FOR THE HELP

Doctor John


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## k0ijn (Jun 24, 2012)

Doctor John said:


> K0ijn Thanks for the clear obviously informed thread. This is the best simplest info that I as a newbie have come across. I have bought a 60x loupe and now can see my trics clearly and now know what to look for. I also love your simple clear approach on things such as no flushing (never made sense to me) steady nuts and keep schedule going to harvest, which all say not to do. I will be looking at all your posts with great interest. picture attached 4 weeks into flowering.
> 
> THANKS FOR THE HELP
> 
> Doctor John



You're very much welcome Doctor John, it's exactly why this thread was made and I'm happy it helps you out.
I'm also very glad that you're taking the scientific & factual route with regards to growing, I can promise you that you will get more out of it and also have more fun along the way!

People usually take hold of all the old myths surrounding growing without checking out the facts (especially when it comes to pre-harvest flushing) but hopefully science will trump all the myths one day  

I don't see any picture attached though, try uploading/attaching it again.


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## Doctor John (Jun 24, 2012)

Thanks for the response. I screwed up the pic. I'll try again but they are with hps on because I didn't want to screw around with my lights


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## mofropoly (Jun 24, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> I would always go with how the trichromes are looking more than how the pistils are looking but the two should align at peak harvest.
> 
> Have you checked trichomes all over the plant? Are there any amber trichomes?
> How are the calyxes looking? They should fatten up nicely.
> ...


k0ijn, I looked over the rest of the trichromes and noted that majority are cloudy - approximately 95% cloudy and maybe 5% amber. Calyxes are chubby and a significant amount of pistils have aligned. Yesterday morning when the lights turned off, I went ahead and let it go into the 24-hour dark period. I cut them down this morning, trimmed, and hung them up to dry (at the moment, they are in the dark in my grow space at 75 degrees F and 54% RH). Thanks for the support!


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## k0ijn (Jun 24, 2012)

Doctor John said:


> Thanks for the response. I screwed up the pic. I'll try again but they are with hps on because I didn't want to screw around with my lightsView attachment 2226384View attachment 2226387View attachment 2226388


Looks nice and healthy, you can see they are fighting for the light though hehe but that is quite common.
When you have tried growing a few times you should maybe try out LST (low stress training), it works wonders for yield and it makes it easier to keep control of the plants once they start flowering rapidly.


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## k0ijn (Jun 24, 2012)

mofropoly said:


> k0ijn, I looked over the rest of the trichromes and noted that majority are cloudy - approximately 95% cloudy and maybe 5% amber. Calyxes are chubby and a significant amount of pistils have aligned. Yesterday morning when the lights turned off, I went ahead and let it go into the 24-hour dark period. I cut them down this morning, trimmed, and hung them up to dry (at the moment, they are in the dark in my grow space at 75 degrees F and 54% RH). Thanks for the support!


Those are better %s than most people could ever ask for.
I don't know what you mean 'pistils have aligned', pistils have receded? Either way it sounds like it was a peak time to harvest.

Keep an eye on them, it's critical to get a proper dry & cure to bring out the full potential in your plants.
Sounds like you got complete control though


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## HapaHaole (Jul 1, 2012)

panhead said:


> One bit of additional info,you mentioned being at 60 days flower,when did you start the day count ?
> 
> If you started counting as soon as you went 12/12 then you skipped a step,all strains have a transition period where the plants metabolism switches gears from veg to bud phase,this is also when the plants will stretch out,you shouldnt start a day count until the plants fully transition from veg to bud.
> 
> ...


TY panhead~

In all my reading I have never come across this and this is very important to a new grower such as myself, so thank you so very much! (makes sense to me now that I think about it tho.)


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## KINDCANNABIS (Jul 2, 2012)

Dont forget to flush properly. I am currently, being patient to see some pistils and trichomes cant wait!


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## Luke123 (Jul 4, 2012)

+ Rep. Nice job


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## CatatonicChronic (Jul 6, 2012)

So how about this for a thought, not trying to hyjack a thread or anything but was very much enjoying this one. My thought I think will turn into a conversation so don't take offense. I have grown for a few years now. I have been only growing bag seed for I've saved a lot of seeds and stems throughout my youth up till now for some reason or another(also I've saved most of my beer bottle caps and the figure 8 on cans, don't know what they're called), and have them seperated in good sacks in which they were rare finds in $45-$65 eighths, then I had a good sack from mostly swag, reggies, mexican weed, etc., that I noticed was nice and different with good highs, and then all the rest in a big bag of all mexican weed bag seed. Throughout growing these I've had some killer success and have gotten quite a few different kinda plants that were just awesome. No matter what, what I've produced is definately incredibly better than any thing from Mexico. I just recently harvested one of my ladies that grew really skinny jagged leaves, it grew tall and thin, not bushy at all and had the most mesmorizing smell. I wish I would of cloned her but I seem to suck at cloning. So before I cut her down I would look at the trichs and I would see almost all clear and some that were kinda cloudy but not like milky. Then almost in no time she went from clear to pinks and ambers, there was no crazy amounts stress or anything, but it seemed to skip the cloudy faze and turned different hues of pinkish amber to dark amber. The trichs are still like 50% clearish and kinda cloudy, about 15% pinkish and the rest amber. My topic is that trichomes of different strains look different, and probably are meant to be picked at different times. For instance, are sativas supposed to be harvested with more clear/cloudy cause I've heard that amber can ruin a good heady high, or is it a compliment? Also are Indicas supposed to be harvested late to produce zombie weed, I've heard that naturally they produce more cannabinoids than Sativas. What exactly is ripe bud, does it differ per strain? If you want a pain killing smoke or a "high" smoke. Also I've heard and noticed that either you feel that thc is the pure and the only sought after thing in mary, and your understanding of the transition of cloudy trichs to amber is degradation of thc. While the others make the case that there are cannabinoids in mary and it needs to equal parts for peak high, or mostly one way or the other and they mostly view amber trichs as the aging of thc, not degradation. What do you all think is the best combo of trichs are and what are the best other indicators other than trichs to determine bud ripeness? Personally I think the swell and the nutrition leaving the plant, when the fan leaves are all yellow and burnt your bud is getting there if not done. I find after you think your plant looks pretty bad, try to get another 2 or 3 waterings in with unfiltered honey or molases or both, this gives the plant a bit of energy and b vitamins to get its give just a bit more work to those buds. I then take the plants out after its last watering day's night cycle and put it in a seperate dark room for 2 days with no light. I've tried drowning her right after this dark period and I've also tried scouring hot water for the roots as a shock treatment, I haven't noticed if it helped either way with nothing to compare it to. Also, the white hairs or the plant, you have to watch and make sure you really see whats going on. The buds stretch and grow new pistols in different parts of the floweing stage. They will grow all these new white pistols after a stretch and you may not think the buds are ready because of this but they may have been ready before the stretch and now you will let the trichs go to amber because you are only watching the hairs. Okay your thoughts???


----------



## Lucius Vorenus (Jul 6, 2012)

CatatonicChronic said:


> So how about this for a thought, not trying to hyjack a thread or anything but was very much enjoying this one. My thought I think will turn into a conversation so don't take offense. I have grown for a few years now. I have been only growing bag seed for I've saved a lot of seeds and stems throughout my youth up till now for some reason or another(also I've saved most of my beer bottle caps and the figure 8 on cans, don't know what they're called), and have them seperated in good sacks in which they were rare finds in $45-$65 eighths, then I had a good sack from mostly swag, reggies, mexican weed, etc., that I noticed was nice and different with good highs, and then all the rest in a big bag of all mexican weed bag seed. Throughout growing these I've had some killer success and have gotten quite a few different kinda plants that were just awesome. No matter what, what I've produced is definately incredibly better than any thing from Mexico. I just recently harvested one of my ladies that grew really skinny jagged leaves, it grew tall and thin, not bushy at all and had the most mesmorizing smell. I wish I would of cloned her but I seem to suck at cloning. So before I cut her down I would look at the trichs and I would see almost all clear and some that were kinda cloudy but not like milky. Then almost in no time she went from clear to pinks and ambers, there was no crazy amounts stress or anything, but it seemed to skip the cloudy faze and turned different hues of pinkish amber to dark amber. The trichs are still like 50% clearish and kinda cloudy, about 15% pinkish and the rest amber. My topic is that trichomes of different strains look different, and probably are meant to be picked at different times. For instance, are sativas supposed to be harvested with more clear/cloudy cause I've heard that amber can ruin a good heady high, or is it a compliment? Also are Indicas supposed to be harvested late to produce zombie weed, I've heard that naturally they produce more cannabinoids than Sativas. What exactly is ripe bud, does it differ per strain? If you want a pain killing smoke or a "high" smoke. Also I've heard and noticed that either you feel that thc is the pure and the only sought after thing in mary, and your understanding of the transition of cloudy trichs to amber is degradation of thc. While the others make the case that there are cannabinoids in mary and it needs to equal parts for peak high, or mostly one way or the other and they mostly view amber trichs as the aging of thc, not degradation. What do you all think is the best combo of trichs are and what are the best other indicators other than trichs to determine bud ripeness? Personally I think the swell and the nutrition leaving the plant, when the fan leaves are all yellow and burnt your bud is getting there if not done. I find after you think your plant looks pretty bad, try to get another 2 or 3 waterings in with unfiltered honey or molases or both, this gives the plant a bit of energy and b vitamins to get its give just a bit more work to those buds. I then take the plants out after its last watering day's night cycle and put it in a seperate dark room for 2 days with no light. I've tried drowning her right after this dark period and I've also tried scouring hot water for the roots as a shock treatment, I haven't noticed if it helped either way with nothing to compare it to. Also, the white hairs or the plant, you have to watch and make sure you really see whats going on. The buds stretch and grow new pistols in different parts of the floweing stage. They will grow all these new white pistols after a stretch and you may not think the buds are ready because of this but they may have been ready before the stretch and now you will let the trichs go to amber because you are only watching the hairs. Okay your thoughts???


How about this for a thought. 


PARAGRAPHS


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## HapaHaole (Jul 13, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> That's the first time ive ever heard that. i always have been counting from the day I flip. Do you have a source for this info?


A source would be excellent! It was the first time for me hearing it too.

roflmao @ "PARAGRAPHS"


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## Geezy101 (Jul 13, 2012)

Im no expert. but from my understanding of clear and cloudy. i would have to say the middle picture is more clear than the first lol just sayn



View attachment 2254217


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## Amaximus (Jul 14, 2012)

Geezy101 said:


> Im no expert. but from my understanding of clear and cloudy. i would have to say the middle picture is more clear than the first lol just sayn
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 2254217


You'd be wrong. First picture is obviously clear, You can tell because, Well, It's clear.


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## k0ijn (Jul 14, 2012)

Geezy101 said:


> Im no expert. but from my understanding of clear and cloudy. i would have to say the middle picture is more clear than the first lol just sayn
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 2254217


I don't understand how you came to that conclusion.

The first image pictures see-through /clear trichomes.
The second image pictures cloudy/milky trichomes.


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## hippy132 (Jul 15, 2012)

HapaHaole said:


> A source would be excellent! It was the first time for me hearing it too.
> 
> roflmao @ "PARAGRAPHS"


 I heard it also and it makes more sense to start counting when they show their sex, 7 -10 days after light switch... IMHO, based on strain info


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## Mithrandir420 (Jul 20, 2012)

hippy132 said:


> I heard it also and it makes more sense to start counting when they show their sex, 7 -10 days after light switch... IMHO, based on strain info


Actually, it doesn't matter once you know your plants. If I know that my plants have a 7 day transition, and a 60 day flower and I am running the same plant every time, then I can count from 12/12 flip and know it will take 67 days. 

Either way, with any new strain or variety you are running you should check trichs AND do user testing to determine your plants peak harvest window. Once you have determined that it doesn't really matter where you count from. In fact the only time it really matters if you are trying to go off of the breeders info and it's the first time you are running a strain.


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## LizRoll (Aug 5, 2012)

Hey everybody - This is my first grow and I think my plants are just about ready, but I'd like some feedback on whether they need more time.
This is from an AutoFem Northern Lights and I'm two days shy of 9 weeks flowering (assuming I started counting at the right time - and I've read so much info since then I don't remember what indicator I used haha).
I hope these images will do. Thanks in advance 

Two buds from top:

Bud from base


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## k0ijn (Aug 5, 2012)

LizRoll said:


> Hey everybody - This is my first grow and I think my plants are just about ready, but I'd like some feedback on whether they need more time.
> This is from an AutoFem Northern Lights and I'm two days shy of 9 weeks flowering (assuming I started counting at the right time - and I've read so much info since then I don't remember what indicator I used haha).
> I hope these images will do. Thanks in advance
> 
> ...



Ello,

The images are not high enough resolution to get a good look really but of what I did see were some clear and some cloudy trichomes.
It's hard to give you a proper judgement, if you could get a microscope you would have a much better sense of the trichomes appearance. 

My guess would be about 10 days left.


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## LizRoll (Aug 5, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Ello,
> 
> The images are not high enough resolution to get a good look really but of what I did see were some clear and some cloudy trichomes.
> It's hard to give you a proper judgement, if you could get a microscope you would have a much better sense of the trichomes appearance.
> .


I have a 40x loupe - I used that plus the digital macro setting on my camera to get the pics. The magnification when looking through the loupe is better, but my camera removes some of the magnification I guess. Thanks for the reply - appreciate it!


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## East Coast Pro (Aug 10, 2012)

How long does it take to see changes in the trics? When you go from clear to cloudy, how long does it normally take to go from cloudy to starting of amber? Trying to get a idea of the time so I'll know when to start flushing..


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## Ellewood (Aug 11, 2012)

I would suggest reading this thread from the beginning. I'm a newbie, but from what I've read, how quickly the trics change depends on the strain and the growing conditions. Also, as mentioned around page 3-4 in this thread, flushing isn't necessary.


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## k0ijn (Aug 11, 2012)

LizRoll said:


> I have a 40x loupe - I used that plus the digital macro setting on my camera to get the pics. The magnification when looking through the loupe is better, but my camera removes some of the magnification I guess. Thanks for the reply - appreciate it!


But you must've had low resolution settings on the camera? 
I can see that you uploaded the images in ~219 x ~295 which is quite low resolution.

I'd suggest you set a resolution of at least 1MP (1280 x 960) or if possible 2 or 3MP (it'll improve zoom quality a lot and make the image a lot clearer).
I use 4-5MP when I take macro shots of my plants, and it's actually possible to just use a camera and zoom in on the pictures of the trichomes to see their 'state' because a 4-5MP image is of so high resolution and so clear on a computer you won't even need a loupe.
A loupe saves time though but doesn't allow you to share images as easily.


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## k0ijn (Aug 11, 2012)

Ellewood said:


> I would suggest reading this thread from the beginning. I'm a newbie, but from what I've read, how quickly the trics change depends on the strain and the growing conditions. Also, as mentioned around page 3-4 in this thread, flushing isn't necessary.


Well done, you pick up the information very quickly 
Ellewoods post has perfect answers to your questions East Coast.


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## East Coast Pro (Aug 11, 2012)

Thanks guys, sorry I didn't research it myself, it was late I was stoned..my bad. Thanks for the info!!


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## Brandawg92 (Aug 11, 2012)

I have a microscope that zooms between 60 and 100x. I used to go by this but now im relying one the best method... pick smoke, decide if you got blasted or not. The reason is my chemdawg #4 is 31 days and covered in cloudy trichs. Didn't get me high. And seriously for every 30 cloud's there's about one amber and 2 clears. So I suggest sampling to know if its stoney yet or not


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## Brandawg92 (Aug 11, 2012)

Same plant different lighting


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## East Coast Pro (Aug 12, 2012)

So I don't have to cut my Indica with amber trics? If I cut it with mostly cloudy and no amber it'll still knock me down so to speak?


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## Brandawg92 (Aug 12, 2012)

Don't trust time frames and take trichs with a grain of salt. The best way to know how stoney it is, is to try and get stoned


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## rocpilefsj (Aug 12, 2012)

I cut when there is no more visible clear trics, they will mostly all be cloudy at this point with a little amber kickin around.


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## rocpilefsj (Aug 12, 2012)

Brandawg92 said:


> I have a microscope that zooms between 60 and 100x. I used to go by this but now im relying one the best method... pick smoke, decide if you got blasted or not. The reason is my chemdawg #4 is 31 days and covered in cloudy trichs. Didn't get me high. And seriously for every 30 cloud's there's about one amber and 2 clears. So I suggest sampling to know if its stoney yet or not


Why are you even bothering to check your trics @ 31 days? Of course it isn't going to get you high!


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## rocpilefsj (Aug 12, 2012)

Brandawg92 said:


> Don't trust time frames and take trichs with a grain of salt. The best way to know how stoney it is, is to try and get stoned


Or you can read what else Koijn wrote:

*

Trichomes are of course not the only indicator of when to harvest.
There are other factors that should be taken into account when determining when to harvest.


Calyxes on the plant will swell up, these swollen calyxes are a sign of maturity.
The pistils (what some new growers call hairs) will change colour (often to an orange tinge) and recede into the calyx.
Receding pistils are also a sign of maturity.
Then there is the overall look of the plant. Many experienced growers simply go by this factor, they can determine peak harvest just by looking at the plant and seeing how it looks from afar regarding colour tinge and the look of the calyxes.


All these factors should be taken into account when harvesting. All of these factors usually align when peak harvest approaches.​
​

*You should not even bother with checking trics until these signs appear!


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## Brandawg92 (Aug 12, 2012)

rocpilefsj said:


> Why are you even bothering to check your trics @ 31 days? Of course it isn't going to get you high!


This is why. It was hard but I got a pic through my microscope. Bottom line is you cannabinoid receptors are the only way to know for sure if yo shits dank.


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## thehole (Aug 12, 2012)

Most accurate trichome post on all of the internet. 

Chopping when you have about 5-10% clear, 5-10% amber and the rest cloudy is the best overall time to chop. 

Use your flowering times(start from first white pistils showing, not 12/12 switch) and this trichome formula to chop at the best time. It's not rocket science people.


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## thehole (Aug 12, 2012)

Some stains never amber. I've chopped many times with no or very little amber and I have had no complaints.


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## thehole (Aug 12, 2012)

LizRoll said:


> Hey everybody - This is my first grow and I think my plants are just about ready, but I'd like some feedback on whether they need more time.
> This is from an AutoFem Northern Lights and I'm two days shy of 9 weeks flowering (assuming I started counting at the right time - and I've read so much info since then I don't remember what indicator I used haha).
> I hope these images will do. Thanks in advance
> 
> ...


The first two pics you can see most of those glands are still clear. How long did you grow them out before counting flower weeks? That is an important question when referring to autos, even ones that are crossed with regular fem strains like this one is. I hope you did not harvest them yet, a good two weeks to go yet. 9 weeks can mean 10 or 11 many times. I just don't know about those autos.


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## thehole (Aug 12, 2012)

If you are referring to "the best way to know is to know" is by testing your bud right off the plant then fine. I myself would never test bud fresh off the plant, I allow mine to dry and be cured for at least 2 weeks before I touch mine. But that's just me. If you pluck a bud off a flowering plant and it gets you high then you know that after drying and curing it will be twice as potent. 
But, this IS IN NO WAY the proper way to judge when to chop. 

Flowering time is MORE accurate when starting the count on the first sign of pistils, not the switch to 12/12 lighting. The seed shops may use the times they give for flowering specific strains from 12/12 switch, maybe that's why I have never had a strain finish on or before those times.
You use flowering times from first pistils to BE MORE ACCURATE, not to calculate exact harvest times. 

But to say tricohmes are not a good accurate way to judge when to chop is a ridiculous statement. It is the best way to determine harvest time. 

Your way is actually more inaccurate being the THC isn't even fully processed until dried. 

I suggest you refrain from calling others retards, not only won't you last long on here with that attitude but you won't be taken seriously.


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## Brandawg92 (Aug 12, 2012)

Look at the pic. According to what you all say, that 31 day old (or as you say 25) is ripe... its simply not. You can't see THC but you can definitely feel it. How is that inaccurate? Who said I was smoking wet shit. This is socal I can dry it super fast if I want a sample (not that that's proper, to defend against your next attack.) Checkmate?


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## rocpilefsj (Aug 12, 2012)

Brandawg92 said:


> Look at the pic. According to what you all say, that 31 day old (or as you say 25) is ripe... its simply not. You can't see THC but you can definitely feel it. How is that inaccurate? Who said I was smoking wet shit. This is socal I can dry it super fast if I want a sample (not that that's proper, to defend against your next attack.) Checkmate?


For the second time... Trics are not the only sign of ripeness. Calyx swell, hairs reddening off and receding into the bud, the overall look of the plant need to be in line BEFORE even bothering to check your trics. So I will ask again, if you are the expert grower and we are all the newbs why are you even bothering to check your trics @ day 32? Anybody can dry superfast, being in cali is pointless to your argument as is testing a bud at that time to determine "ripeness. If you want to discuss the issue further start your own thread instead of junking up Koijn's which is full of scientific evidence and facts.


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## Brandawg92 (Aug 12, 2012)

The thread says look at trichs under a microscope and pick if theyre cloudy. Id be misinformed by his "scientific facts" if I didn't know better than to take this as fact


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## thehole (Aug 12, 2012)

Put up a better pic! I can't tell how many clear or cloudy or amber glands you have in "your" pic. I've scoped in an area of leaf or bud many times and got a bronze-amber shade before I got the focus correct and it turned out to be no amber trichs, just shade in color while focusing from other objects. 

For all anyone knows your 30 days is 50. IDK. For all I know that pic is off google. IDK 

Point being, correct flower timing(first day from first sign of white pistils) and viewing trichomes is the best way to estimate harvest time for most. If you wish to pick at your plant like a child does their food go right ahead.

You do it your way, we'll do it our way.


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## rocpilefsj (Aug 12, 2012)

Brandawg92 said:


> The thread says look at trichs under a microscope and pick if theyre cloudy. Id be misinformed by his "scientific facts" if I didn't know better than to take this as fact


For the third time... It says to look at the other signs that your plant is ready as well as the trics. If you want to have an informed discussion try acting like an adult instead of acting like a child who isn't getting there way. Anymore posts with your immature bs will be deleted. Thank you.


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## Brandawg92 (Aug 12, 2012)

Thank you. I was actually hoping to talk to someone who knows what they're talking about. I disagree with this thread and I have provided photos of why. (Apparently unbelievable ones!) An unfinished bud that is ready by your standards. Why defend someone else's opinion so fiercely when all I've done is poke a hole in this theory. Calm your tits.


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## rocpilefsj (Aug 12, 2012)

Brandawg92 said:


> Thank you. I was actually hoping to talk to someone who knows what they're talking about. I disagree with this thread and I have provided photos of why. (Apparently unbelievable ones!) An unfinished bud that is ready by your standards. Why defend someone else's opinion so fiercely when all I've done is poke a hole in this theory. Calm your tits.View attachment 2292799


Nowhere in this thread does it say just to check the trics and that is all... I think this would be for the fourth time. Post a pic of your plant and some bud shots and I will explain in detail why your buds aren't ready @ day 32 without having to smoke them.


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## rocpilefsj (Aug 13, 2012)

Brandawg92 said:


> Same plant different lightingView attachment 2291291View attachment 2291292


Do you really need me to explain why these are not ready yet? 

1) They are not even buds yet they are so early into the flowering stage, you are not even halfway through (5+ weeks remaining IMO)
2) No sign of calyx swell (Obviously)
3) The few hairs that are there are white as can be (Premature)
4) They are nowhere near done

Trics are a way of verifying what the rest of your plant is telling you when you are close to harvest time, I do not check my trics until at least week 7ish or the signs I have mentioned and Koijn mentioned fall into place. I don't understand the issue you are having with being told it is WAY to early for you to be checking your trics, there is no reason for it at this time.


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## Amaximus (Aug 13, 2012)

I think it is utterly fantastic that people have no idea when to harvest when there is so much literature out there explaining exactly when to.

Party on, Wayne.


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## k0ijn (Aug 13, 2012)

Brandawg92 said:


> I have a microscope that zooms between 60 and 100x. I used to go by this but now im relying one the best method... pick smoke, decide if you got blasted or not. The reason is my chemdawg #4 is 31 days and covered in cloudy trichs. Didn't get me high. And seriously for every 30 cloud's there's about one amber and 2 clears. So I suggest sampling to know if its stoney yet or not



Did you read the entire first post?
It clearly states that there are other factors important when determining 'peak harvest'.
Such as; 

Calyx development, pistils and the general look of the plant.

You aren't seriously asking why a 31 day plant is not ready to be harvested based on the info you gave, are you?






Brandawg92 said:


> This is why. It was hard but I got a pic through my microscope. Bottom line View attachment 2292095is you cannabinoid receptors are the only way to know for sure if yo shits dank.



There are a lot of clear trichomes in that image, I assume it's of the same underdeveloped 31 day plant you spoke of before?

I think you are misunderstanding the chemistry and the biology.
_Cannabinoid receptors_ are in the brain, they are the ones which are activated when they come in contact with _ligands_, _plant cannabinoids_, _endocannabinoids_ or synthetic _cannabinoids_.
The group called plant cannabinoids is the one which contains the well known cannabinoids such as; THC, CBD etc.





Brandawg92 said:


> The thread says look at trichs under a microscope and pick if theyre cloudy. Id be misinformed by his "scientific facts" if I didn't know better than to take this as fact



I clearly state in the first post what factors contribute to determining peak harvest.
If you have not read through the entire post or not understood the entire post you are welcome to ask questions in a polite manner.
This is a sticky, it's meant to help people out it's not a discussion thread.

This has already been stated by roc, but I will reiterate.
If you want to have a discussion on the subject you can open up your own thread.




Brandawg92 said:


> Thank you. I was actually hoping to talk to someone who knows what they're talking about. I disagree with this thread and I have provided photos of why. (Apparently unbelievable ones!) An unfinished bud that is ready by your standards. Why defend someone else's opinion so fiercely when all I've done is poke a hole in this theory. Calm your tits.



I'm sorry that you don't understand the chemistry and the biology that goes into Cannabis but this is not the thread in which to discuss how and why you are mistaken, repeatedly.
People have given you straight forward answers and you have failed to grasp the science, reason and logic behind their arguments.
If someone does not believe in logic, rationale or reason then what logical, rational and/or reasonable argument can one use to convince him otherwise?
Do you see what I mean? This is a futile exercise.
This whole discussion should have been over after the first time roc and hole, rather politely I might add, explained why you are mistaken.

You have poked no hole in any theory, period.
You have poked as much a hole in the science behind trichomes, the rationale, reasoning or logic used in the scientific arguments in this thread, as religious people have poked holes in evolution; which is to say _none.

_


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## k0ijn (Aug 13, 2012)

thehole said:


> Most accurate trichome post on all of the internet.
> 
> Chopping when you have about 5-10% clear, 5-10% amber and the rest cloudy is the best overall time to chop.
> 
> Use your flowering times(start from first white pistils showing, not 12/12 switch) and this trichome formula to chop at the best time. It's not rocket science people.



Very much appreciated 

And on the note of strains which never amber, I have experienced that just once, and I think it might have been down to genes acting up or disease/mutation, but who knows really. 
I have also experienced pistils not turning any other colour than white, yet still receding.

I have even heard stories of purple and green trichomes, never seen it for myself. 
We certainly don't lack myths and legends regarding Cannabis growing, the oddities just makes it all the more fun though.


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## Amaximus (Aug 14, 2012)

Someone needs to click "*First*"

*eyeroll*


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## RedWhiteBlueGreen (Aug 15, 2012)

Firstly, cheers very much to Koijn for providing such helpful information & secondly, i just wanted to advise anybody who needs to buy a cheap mini-loupe/magnifier that i got a 60x one with 3 LED's on it for £2.86 (about $4.20) off some Chinese seller on Ebay. For such little cost, it is a very worthwhile investment as it saves alot of guesswork & means u don't have to keep fooling yourself into believing your naked eye can see that magnification as equally well! As Koijn rightly said, being able to naked eye view flowering plants & telling if they're done or not is a good ability to have, but i've found it always helps as well to have a microscope/loupe to check trichs as extra confirmation.


Oh, and also, how much are the clones of these 31 day flowering plants being sold for, cause i've got my credit card ready now if that's true!! lol! He brings the revolution & we put his head on a stake outside the city gates!! hehe!


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## RedWhiteBlueGreen (Aug 15, 2012)

In fact, as a slight side issue (and i promise i'm not a Chinese ebay power seller doing self advertising!) these cheap mini-loupes are also a great present for any kids aged 5+ as they're a brilliant fun & educational toy - my mates kids had a go on mine when they came round once & spent all night looking at every different piece of fabric & surface in my house! They loved it & is a good way of teaching them abit of science & showing them a few different perspectives on the world.

Plus mine has a blue LED so i can check fake banknotes too - useful for when i start money-laundering for my Chinese power seller mates! Oops, gave the game away then! lol!


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## LizRoll (Aug 17, 2012)

I haven't harvested yet. Most trichs are now cloudy with a few tinges of amber showing up (in one plant anyway). I can't remember when I started counting the flowering weeks - it seems that I saw buds before the plants fully showed their sex. I forget what info I knew at the time and used to determine when to start counting. I started counting the flowering on June 5, I remember that much. They were slow to get going, and have heard that time frames listed on many sites are 'best case' and more often than not, another week or two is needed. So I thought I might need to wait a bit longer. I'll try to get some better photos posted later today.
Thanks all!


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## LizRoll (Aug 18, 2012)

Ok, fought with my camera for a good long while and this is as good as it's going to get haha. Trichs seem mostly cloudy, some clear - didn't see any obvious ambers (hard to tell sometimes if it's amber or just how the light hits it). It's been 13 days since I posted my question. I'm at 10 weeks, 4 days of flowering (I remember that my plants had shown sex before I started counting the flowering days. Is there a percentage of the plant that needs to have pistils before you start your count? Or just as soon as it shows sex?).
According to the site I purchased the seeds from, the flowering period is 7 - 9 weeks. I've read that it's not uncommon to need to wait another 2 weeks beyond the range listed. I'm 3 days shy of 11 weeks of flowering. How much longer should I give them?
Thanks again everyone!


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## RedWhiteBlueGreen (Aug 19, 2012)

LizRoll - as u say the pics aint the best but from what i can see i'd say u've got quite a high percentage of cloudy/milky trichs & i can only see about 20% clear ones still. Normally i'd say wait another few days but then u do say they been flowering near 11 weeks already - so i'd ask what are the seeds called & also what light are u growing under? I've heard of old-school sativas taking between 11 & 14 weeks and also if ur using CFL's that can sometimes add a week onto normal flowering periods compared to HPS. (ur probably gonna tell me its an auto-flowering indica cross under a 1000W HPS now & i'll be stumped! lol) 

I know what u mean about it being hard to tell colour of trichs & sadly only increased magnification will really improve identification. But if ur camera is having trouble distinguishing clear from amber, then i'd say just base ur harvest time on milky alone - if it looks like 85% are milky/cloudy, then u'll just have to ignore the unidentified 15% - and as an uneducated guess, i'd say at 11 weeks ur more likely to find those identified trichs to be more on the amber side than the clear. I could well be wrong but i'd say a chop in a few days would be ok. But i would advise to try posting elsewhere in forum quickly first tho to see what others think - start a new thread maybe as at 12 pages long, a few people might not see this one.

Best of luck tho & i hope at the least its a good learning experience!


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## LizRoll (Aug 19, 2012)

Thanks RedWhiteBlueGreen (what a name, haha!)
It's a AutoFem Northern Lights. I started growing under regular incandescent & fluorescent bulbs, swapped the incandescent to CFL about 4 weeks into flowering. I haven't been able to get more light in the closet and stay at an acceptable temp. Lumens have been around 20k (and from what I've read that's half of what it should be). Even with that low amount of lumens, I'm sitting at 80 degrees most of the time.

Given the amount of clear trics, I'm going to wait another week and see how things look. I check trics everyday, since they may change quickly. I can see the trics better with my loupe; and my camera can zoom a little more than what these pics show, but I can't hold it steady enough to not have a blurry pic. Hopefully a week will be enough to get another 5-10% of the clear to at least turn milky, not too concerned with getting amber since that's THC degrading. My mom has informed me she's coming for a visit "soon"  and I need to get the harvest done and start curing before she comes.

This is my first grow and I've learned a lot. I've grown a lot of different plants & veggies in my life and never had something so finicky! Haha! But, there is so much misinformation out there, it's easy to follow the wrong advice.
Next grow I'll need to have: more light, better ventilation/cooler temps, & better nutes.

Thanks again to all who've provided feedback - much appreciated!


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## Budman5250 (Aug 21, 2012)

im growing outdoors my girls are starting to bud i have pollen to make some seeds going to X lambsbread with chocolope for next summer ii have some outrageous plants growing 6 to 8 feet tall 21 plants in the garden i love growing my meds i have not hade to by weed for 17 years thats how long i been growing 






Edit: I edited your post because you had quoted the entire first post without quote marks, so essentially you had copied the entire post into yours.


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## bullwinkle60 (Aug 21, 2012)

If your trichs are mostly cloudy with some amber I'd harvest now.


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## jokerindustries187 (Aug 23, 2012)

OK...so since you said the trichomes with still develop after harvested should you pay more attention to see how they react daily so you can harvest it so by the time they stop developing its at its peak?


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## Reelfish2 (Aug 23, 2012)

At the bottom of one of the psost the guy said TWO DAYS OF DARKNESS? is this true, I am ready to chop tonight or tomorrow which is best? i hope you get this in time for me to do it right.
Tnx,

-B


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## dank smoker420 (Aug 23, 2012)

i personally do not think extra darkness is nessesary. the best time to harvest any type of plants are in the morning. or begining of the lights on cycle.


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## k0ijn (Aug 23, 2012)

jokerindustries187 said:


> OK...so since you said the trichomes with still develop after harvested should you pay more attention to see how they react daily so you can harvest it so by the time they stop developing its at its peak?


The final stage in a trichomes development is turning amber.
Therefore you cannot just wait for every trichome to stop developing.
Since you will end up with a majority of amber trichomes and a product which is much less potent than what it potentially could have been.

You won't have to check daily but it would be unwise to not check the trichomes several times during a week.
Perhaps every other day (during final bloom) if you have time for it.


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## k0ijn (Aug 23, 2012)

Reelfish2 said:


> At the bottom of one of the psost the guy said TWO DAYS OF DARKNESS? is this true, I am ready to chop tonight or tomorrow which is best? i hope you get this in time for me to do it right.
> Tnx,
> 
> -B



Who said two days of darkness?
The thing about darkness before harvesting is the same discussion as pre-harvest flushing.

Those who speak for doing so, have no scientific evidence or research proving it works.
People claim all sorts of miracles will happen, like the plant pushing out more trichomes, calyxes growing rapidly etc.
It's all hearsay and it has no value to any rational person who can see the value of reason and scientific evidence.

I'd prefer if we could leave out all the myths, miracles and hearsay from this thread.

I've worked hard to provide scientifically proven evidence of my arguments, research and theses regarding the processes of the Cannabis plant.
Let's not stain it with superstitious nonsense.


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## East Coast Pro (Aug 24, 2012)

Coco and coco specific nutes..no flush as well?


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## boedhaspeaks (Aug 25, 2012)

Great post, thank you !

Was wondering when i had to cut my arjans haze3. Its a 70 day sativa and im at day 72 with 30-70 clear/milky trichomes.

But what is the best for a sativa? 0-5% amber and mostly cloudy?


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## k0ijn (Aug 26, 2012)

boedhaspeaks said:


> Great post, thank you !
> 
> Was wondering when i had to cut my arjans haze3. Its a 70 day sativa and im at day 72 with 30-70 clear/milky trichomes.
> 
> But what is the best for a sativa? 0-5% amber and mostly cloudy?



As high a percentage of cloudy as possible is the best for any strain, of any phenotype (Indica, Sativa).
Since clear trichomes contain nothing but precursor cannabinoids it's preferable to have amber over clear since amber trichomes do contain some psychoactive cannabinoids.
But trichomes are constantly produced and it is near impossible to end up with 0% clear or 0% amber.
Just try to get as close to a max cloudy percentage as possible.

Pure Sativas and 'mainly' Sativas take quite a lot longer to fully bloom than hybrids and Indicas.
I don't know the particular strain but if it's a full Sativa or a majority Sativa then it could quite a while longer to finish than 72 days.


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## boedhaspeaks (Aug 26, 2012)

Thank you, gonna check the trichomes twice a day from now on to pick the best harvest moment.


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## k0ijn (Aug 27, 2012)

Funny how all of a sudden this post is only rated 3 stars when it was rated 5 2 days ago.

I wonder who did that..

Probably someone who didn't read all the information and has a hard time understanding the difference between facts and beliefs.


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## mantiszn (Aug 27, 2012)

5 * vote bump



k0ijn said:


> Funny how all of a sudden this post is only rated 3 stars when it was rated 5 2 days ago.
> 
> I wonder who did that..
> 
> Probably someone who didn't read all the information and has a hard time understanding the difference between facts and beliefs.


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## k0ijn (Aug 27, 2012)

mantiszn said:


> 5 * vote bump











Very nice of you mantiszn ^^


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## East Coast Pro (Aug 28, 2012)

Same go for coco and coco specific nutes? No flush needed?


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## k0ijn (Aug 29, 2012)

East Coast Pro said:


> Same go for coco and coco specific nutes? No flush needed?


I don't quite follow.
Can you elaborate on the questions? 



*Edit: *

There is no need to pre-harvest flush if you haven't heavily overfed (in which case the plant would be visibly damaged and probably beyond rescue).

Organic nutrients, synthetic nutrients, soil, hydro (nor any mediums in those systems) doesn't matter in that sense. 
Flushing is useful for clearing a salt build up, correcting a solution (balance wise), correcting (reverting) pH levels etc.



If that's what you meant ^^


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## East Coast Pro (Aug 29, 2012)

Yeah, I was asking if pre harvest flush is needed with coco and coco specific nutes?


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## boedhaspeaks (Sep 2, 2012)

Flushing sucks, I have Arjans haze and flushed it. Result: a plant what is almost 10days (day79/70) over time and ALL my leaves are yellow and 80% felt off and my plant still doesnt have amber trichomes. The buds look great.
Too ashamed to post a picture


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## Budman5250 (Sep 2, 2012)

boedhaspeaks said:


> Great post, thank you !
> 
> Was wondering when i had to cut my arjans haze3. Its a 70 day sativa and im at day 72 with 30-70 clear/milky trichomes.
> 
> But what is the best for a sativa? 0-5% amber and mostly cloudy?


harvest that shit now


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## rocpilefsj (Sep 2, 2012)

Budman5250 said:


> harvest that shit now


30% clear is too much in my opinion, I prefer to have almozt zero clear if at all possible.


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## thehole (Sep 2, 2012)

boedhaspeaks said:


> Flushing sucks, I have Arjans haze and flushed it. Result: a plant what is almost 10days (day79/70) over time and ALL my leaves are yellow and 80% felt off and my plant still doesnt have amber trichomes. The buds look great.
> Too ashamed to post a picture


Flushing is good in both chem and organic grows. You don't need amber trichs, cloudy will do. And it's more your timing issue then a flushing issue.

I agree with OP. Flushing isn't a must if you haven't been feeding heavy. But who doesn't fed heavy in mid flower? I do. So for me flushing works just fine.


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## thehole (Sep 2, 2012)

I threw you an excellent for this thread, I had no idea we could rate threads.


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## boedhaspeaks (Sep 2, 2012)

Agree my timing was bad. It was my first indoor grow and tried different strains and grow methods to look what the ladies and the boss liked. Downside is no uniformity under the plants.
I checked today again, still no amber but also very little % clear ones, tomorrow morning its harvest time  
80 days for a 70day strain is for sure not too soon 

For the next round i better plan and organise my stuff. Also i am going to count from first flowers/pistils and not from flipping the lights to 12/12, thats more realistic then the seedbank marketingtalk 

Thanks for the advice.


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## hydrosoil78 (Sep 4, 2012)

just took microscope photos of chocolope (or arjans haze 1)? whatever almost threw them out before it sprouted and allkush , I dried it fast but its doin its job

critical sensi star


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## thehole (Sep 4, 2012)

Yes. My first grow I flushed way too early and went almost 30 days. With mostly cloudy I'd harvest to. Remember, the trichs still change when drying from what I've read and my experiences so you could have some amber in there by cure time, not that it matters being amber is degraded thc. 
Good to jump in head first if you have most things down. I also started with multiple strains and techniques and it's worked out well.

Count from both 12/12 and first signs of pistils, it's good to have this on record for any journal work. 

I'm harvesting now, you can see my first of four here on the last entries,

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/556624-new-grow-4-girls-super-2.html

That one was a 7 week strain that went to day 65(pistil) 80(12/12) 90% cloudy, over 1/2 lb. 

Good Luck


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## boedhaspeaks (Sep 5, 2012)

Checked random while manicuring before hanging them and found a bud with a lost amber trichome, it looks like i harvested it spot on, maximal cloudy 
Good tip about taking both times of flowering and flipping the switch, it wil give me more insight in my strains and future grows.


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## longshot8541 (Sep 5, 2012)

Awesome thread! If I hadn't read this I'd have started flushing tomorrow.  +reps for you sir!


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## RedRick (Sep 12, 2012)

Brilliant information and great diagrams and pictures. I'll be referring to this when the time comes...


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## feliks420 (Sep 18, 2012)

This thread is awesome, well worth the read! Looks like I have all clear right now...a little hard to get right up close with my camera, but it's all I've got. What do you guys think, all clear? I'm thinking 2 more weeks and they'll be real close to ready, and now thanks to k0ijn, I know exactly what to look for!


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## Freaxovna8r (Sep 18, 2012)

Awesome thread. Got 5-6 wks left before harvest and the info I've gained from taking the time to read this is brilliant. 

Major rep to you koijn.

I'll try and get some decent pics up in a few wks so ya can see where I'm at.


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## k0ijn (Sep 19, 2012)

feliks420 said:


> This thread is awesome, well worth the read! Looks like I have all clear right now...a little hard to get right up close with my camera, but it's all I've got. What do you guys think, all clear? I'm thinking 2 more weeks and they'll be real close to ready, and now thanks to k0ijn, I know exactly what to look for!
> 
> View attachment 2339143


You're welcome.

I think you would benefit from getting a microscope or a loupe.
They are fairly inexpensive and can really help you out a lot.

Regarding the picture, I see some clear and some cloudy trichomes.
It's hard to judge based off just a few trichomes and just one spot on the plant.

I would estimate that you have at least 2 weeks to go.


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## k0ijn (Sep 19, 2012)

Freaxovna8r said:


> Awesome thread. Got 5-6 wks left before harvest and the info I've gained from taking the time to read this is brilliant.
> 
> Major rep to you koijn.
> 
> I'll try and get some decent pics up in a few wks so ya can see where I'm at.


I'm glad you found it helpful.

Remember to use a loupe, (USB) microscope or a high MP camera to take the images.


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## chrisuuu (Sep 20, 2012)

i looked through a telescop thing and i could see that the tricomes are cloudy n i saw a few amber ones n idk when to cut it


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## k0ijn (Sep 20, 2012)

chrisuuu said:


> View attachment 2342379i looked through a telescop thing and i could see that the tricomes are cloudy n i saw a few amber ones n idk when to cut it


Buds look small-ish and the pistils have not receded into the calyx.
I would say at least another week, if not more.


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## chrisuuu (Sep 20, 2012)

alright thanks n the leaves are starting to turn purple but im pretty sure that from it starting to get cold cause ive been growing it outside n this is my first grow so hopefully it comes out good. also i spotted the first hair in flowering exactly 77days ago


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## Nightbird (Sep 21, 2012)

I know it's harvest time pretty soon for this one but looking for other opinions. Nature is killing me! Grape Ape. Outdoor. Central Valley, CA. Appreciate any input. Thank you!!


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## k0ijn (Sep 21, 2012)

Nightbird said:


> I know it's harvest time pretty soon for this one but looking for other opinions. Nature is killing me! Grape Ape. Outdoor. Central Valley, CA. View attachment 2343836Appreciate any input. Thank you!!


Need more information.

How are the trichomes looking? 
How long has the plant been flowering for?
Any chance of a side view picture of the calyxes?


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## Nightbird (Sep 21, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Need more information.
> 
> How are the trichomes looking?
> How long has the plant been flowering for?
> Any chance of a side view picture of the calyxes?


Here's a couple more pics from different camaras. Can't get focused on closeups for some reason. Trichomes are probably 20 to 30% amber but I still have ALOT of clear ones. Top leaves curling up and buds seem to be pulling into themselves...sorry. Can't think of how to describe it exactly. Pics don't appear that way so much but I see it. I'm afraid I don't know how long they've been flowering. Mid - end July? Haven't done this in awhile and not many times so consider me semi-clueless (but I have been reading alot-wish I would have done so sooner!) Thank you!


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## abuilder (Sep 21, 2012)

View attachment 2344356View attachment 2344360View attachment 2344361&#9754;&#9754;&#9756;&#9756;&#9756;Lights on..kinda arty

I quit nutes over a week ago in my flowering time. Barney's LSD and Violator Kush..2 of each. 60 days veg under one 600wMh and now day 57 in flower (600w hps)..trichs are mostly all cloudy as of the past 2-3 day..no amber..I'm thinking 60-70 days is about right. Did I fug up by quitting the nutes....using straight rainwater now the past week+
Was using all FF nutes to their schedule..you read so many different things from respected growers that you just never really know till you do it...well..guess I'll letcha know how it goes with probably two weeks of no nutes..next time I'm doing the nutes longer...ugh..Still looks pretty good I have to say! How long is your guesstimates? Been a long time-a-comin'!
Day 57 Photos with Lights out&#9758;&#9758;&#9758;&#9755;&#9755; View attachment 2344350View attachment 2344351View attachment 2344352View attachment 2344353


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## k0ijn (Sep 22, 2012)

Nightbird said:


> Here's a couple more pics from different camaras. Can't get focused on closeups for some reason. Trichomes are probably 20 to 30% amber but I still have ALOT of clear ones. Top leaves curling up and buds seem to be pulling into themselves...sorry. Can't think of how to describe it exactly. Pics don't appear that way so much but I see it. I'm afraid I don't know how long they've been flowering. Mid - end July? Haven't done this in awhile and not many times so consider me semi-clueless (but I have been reading alot-wish I would have done so sooner!) Thank you!


Based on that information I would give it at least two more weeks (depending on trichome development).
Just keep an eye on the trichomes (with a loupe or microscope or powerful camera).


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## k0ijn (Sep 22, 2012)

abuilder said:


> &#9754;&#9754;&#9756;&#9756;&#9756;Lights on..kinda arty
> 
> I quit nutes over a week ago in my flowering time. Barney's LSD and Violator Kush..2 of each. 60 days veg under one 600wMh and now day 57 in flower (600w hps)..trichs are mostly all cloudy as of the past 2-3 day..no amber..I'm thinking 60-70 days is about right. Did I fug up by quitting the nutes....using straight rainwater now the past week+
> Was using all FF nutes to their schedule..you read so many different things from respected growers that you just never really know till you do it...well..guess I'll letcha know how it goes with probably two weeks of no nutes..next time I'm doing the nutes longer...ugh..Still looks pretty good I have to say! How long is your guesstimates? Been a long time-a-comin'!
> Day 57 Photos with Lights out&#9758;&#9758;&#9758;&#9755;&#9755;


At least another 2 weeks.
Pistils have not receded and the buds look small-ish.

If you want maximum production (and maximum harvest) then you did 'fug' up by quitting feeding.
Stopping feeding the plants in the most important stage of growth (late bloom) will lead to deficiency and reduce the production efficiency of the plant.
Plants don't store nutrients the way many people think they do, which is the main factor regarding the misunderstanding of the "pre-harvest flushing" myth.

It's up to you to do what you want, I'm just letting you know what is best for the plant.

Let the plants bloom until you see amber trichomes, then judge how the pistils are looking relative to the calyxes.
Or wait a few weeks and post some new pictures


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## abuilder (Sep 22, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> At least another 2 weeks.
> Pistils have not receded and the buds look small-ish.
> 
> If you want maximum production (and maximum harvest) then you did 'fug' up by quitting feeding.
> ...


So do you think it's ok to start feeding them "again" even though I stopped? will that shock them?
I was using FF Tiger Bloom and Big Bloom..and the ChaChing and Beastie Bloomz every other watering...


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## perdrick l. hapley (Sep 22, 2012)

hey i'm on my second grow here and finally just got a good enough magnifying glass to take decent macros with on my phone. this is a blueberry hybrid (not sure with what, definitely an indica dom strain) that's been in flowering for 26 days. i started this girl from bagseed, so i'm really thankful the blueberry smell is so powerful otherwise i wouldn't have a clue as to strain. anyway, i was wondering based on these pics if any experienced growers could give me a ballpark estimate as to when it would be done. obviously i dont expect anything too exact but it looks to me like it should be closer to 4 more weeks rather than 6 or 7 more, as i already see some clouding up around the plant. also any advice would help, still a nub.


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## mugsyy (Sep 22, 2012)

hi this my 1st grow the other day i looked at the *trichomes and i sa about 3 amber , next day i saw about 10 that not worrying me it the **trichomes that have broken heads thats worrying me am on my 10 week flowering it a sativa but i dont know what strain it is, does this mean the **trichomes are degrading ((.

*


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## abuilder (Sep 22, 2012)

mugsyy said:


> hi this my 1st grow the other day i looked at the *trichomes and i sa about 3 amber , next day i saw about 10 that not worrying me it the **trichomes that have broken heads thats worrying me am on my 10 week flowering it a sativa but i dont know what strain it is, does this mean the **trichomes are degrading ((.
> 
> *


soundz like chop time is past due bro...get to it!


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## mugsyy (Sep 22, 2012)

cheers m8, i havent even flushed them yet am using organic what shall i do m8 ? should i flush them and put them in darkness for 48hrs or just chop it now ?


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## abuilder (Sep 22, 2012)

mugsyy said:


> cheers m8, i havent even flushed them yet am using organic what shall i do m8 ? should i flush them and put them in darkness for 48hrs or just chop it now ?


I've heard some very respected growers say they don't bother to stop the nutes at all right up to harvest and others say one week..others say two...
If I were in your situation I'd probably give it one or two more heavy waterings to wash out what you can...then chop when that dries out. Whats two more days at this point? The rap about putting the plants in the dark some think is just a myth..no one really knows is how it appears to me but I do it cause it can't hurt. I do it on my last watering....water than let it go dark for 24+ hours...then in the morning chop..I'd just be sure the soil was pretty dry so your trimming goes a bit easier...jmo man  As long as your trichs are getting amber you know it's past due so....others may weigh in differently...good luck brutha!


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## mugsyy (Sep 22, 2012)

abuilder said:


> I've heard some very respected growers say they don't bother to stop the nutes at all right up to harvest and others say one week..others say two...
> If I were in your situation I'd probably give it one or two more heavy waterings to wash out what you can...then chop when that dries out. Whats two more days at this point? The rap about putting the plants in the dark some think is just a myth..no one really knows is how it appears to me but I do it cause it can't hurt. I do it on my last watering....water than let it go dark for 24+ hours...then in the morning chop..I'd just be sure the soil was pretty dry so your trimming goes a bit easier...jmo man  As long as your trichs are getting amber you know it's past due so....others may weigh in differently...good luck brutha!



1st thing m8 u been a great help and thanks. see i have heard amber is bad then i have read this


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## abuilder (Sep 22, 2012)

mugsyy said:


> 1st thing m8 u been a great help and thanks. see i have heard amber is bad then i have read this View attachment 2345490


yeh well...amber means it's degrading fast...plus that couch lock is more like drugged than being high...I personally don't wanna be knocked on my ass unless I really have a bad medical condition that has me in lots of pain which I don't.
I like to just feel nice and high of varying plateaus ...just not melting into the floor. I'll save that for shrooms....lol. I got Barney's LSD ready to harvest in a week or two so that should hold me over on a new plateau for a spell...HA!
I'm waiting for the trichs to just get to one or two amber and then I'll water and go dark for 24 hours and chop in the morning...after I say a prayer over them first......ha


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## k0ijn (Sep 22, 2012)

abuilder said:


> So do you think it's ok to start feeding them "again" even though I stopped? will that shock them?
> I was using FF Tiger Bloom and Big Bloom..and the ChaChing and Beastie Bloomz every other watering...


It won't shock them. 
Just don't feed substantially more than you did before.


----------



## k0ijn (Sep 22, 2012)

perdrick l. hapley said:


> hey i'm on my second grow here and finally just got a good enough magnifying glass to take decent macros with on my phone. this is a blueberry hybrid (not sure with what, definitely an indica dom strain) that's been in flowering for 26 days. i started this girl from bagseed, so i'm really thankful the blueberry smell is so powerful otherwise i wouldn't have a clue as to strain. anyway, i was wondering based on these pics if any experienced growers could give me a ballpark estimate as to when it would be done. obviously i dont expect anything too exact but it looks to me like it should be closer to 4 more weeks rather than 6 or 7 more, as i already see some clouding up around the plant. also any advice would help, still a nub.



Anything from 4-6 weeks depending on your setup and a lot of variables.

Do you have a loupe or a microscope?
They could help you determine the state of the trichomes.


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## k0ijn (Sep 22, 2012)

mugsyy said:


> 1st thing m8 u been a great help and thanks. see i have heard amber is bad then i have read this View attachment 2345490



That is an incorrect image, fact wise.
I've posted an image in the first post of this thread which is the factual version of this image.

Amber trichomes are not the cause of a couch-lock high.

Read my first 2 posts in this thread for more information, I don't want to repeat myself in the same thread.


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## mugsyy (Sep 23, 2012)

well u better tell ryan riley and peace soma. you keep saying there no need to flush and go on about proof what proof have you got that there no need to flush and i aint getting at you am just wandering what experiance you have when there so many books and guys that work in hydrophonic shops and even on nutrient feed cards about flushing. i just think common sense would say flushing would get rid off the nutrient taste etc. and you say am wrong about amber trichomes well you not tell me am wrong you tell ryan and some soma with 30 years experience.

and i know you give out alot of great info to guys and you know alot.


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## Buzzo (Sep 23, 2012)

Fuck this flushing business man! Grow in organic soil and blow sweet trees. End of story. Fuck, man. Hydroponics... lol


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## abuilder (Sep 23, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> It won't shock them.
> Just don't feed substantially more than you did before.


Thanks..yeh I did start the nutes again the same day you first replied to me and I upped the nutes by almost 50% and the girls seem happy as can be again!! No signs of stress at all..quite the contrary. I'll probably give them nutes every other watering for the rest of the week before I go back to straight rain water again. Quick question: Do you have any idea if the Fox Farm product SledgeHammer can be used as a final flush "in lieu of" a straight water flush if one feels more comfortable trying to flush out the chemicals from the fertilizers used..


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## lokie (Sep 23, 2012)

On my last harvest I found 1 or 2 that looked like this.

All others looked healthy like in the pics. some amber some cloudy and few clear.

Anyone else see this type of tric? sorry I do not have a camera that will take micro pics.


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## mantiszn (Sep 23, 2012)

is that the infamous matchstick trich?



lokie said:


> On my last harvest I found 1 or 2 that looked like this.
> 
> All others looked healthy like in the pics. some amber some cloudy and few clear.
> 
> Anyone else see this type of tric? sorry I do not have a camera that will take micro pics.


----------



## firsttimeARE (Sep 23, 2012)

I think they're dead trichomes.

Sometimes i'll see on some really late flowered buds that some amber trichomes have a tinge of black to it at the top and some will be black completely or with a tinge of amber. I think thats thc degraded completely.


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## mugsyy (Sep 23, 2012)

i do use organic and i dont think it end of story end of


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## perdrick l. hapley (Sep 23, 2012)

mugsyy said:


> well u better tell ryan riley and peace soma. you keep saying there no need to flush and go on about proof what proof have you got that there no need to flush and i aint getting at you am just wandering what experiance you have when there so many books and guys that work in hydrophonic shops and even on nutrient feed cards about flushing. i just think common sense would say flushing would get rid off the nutrient taste etc. and you say am wrong about amber trichomes well you not tell me am wrong you tell ryan and some soma with 30 years experience.
> 
> and i know you give out alot of great info to guys and you know alot.


maybe one day people will stop using "common sense" to grow pot and start relying on science.


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## k0ijn (Sep 23, 2012)

mugsyy said:


> well u better tell ryan riley and peace soma. you keep saying there no need to flush and go on about proof what proof have you got that there no need to flush and i aint getting at you am just wandering what experiance you have when there so many books and guys that work in hydrophonic shops and even on nutrient feed cards about flushing. i just think common sense would say flushing would get rid off the nutrient taste etc. and you say am wrong about amber trichomes well you not tell me am wrong you tell ryan and some soma with 30 years experience.
> 
> and i know you give out alot of great info to guys and you know alot.


First of all we need to be clear here.
There is a difference between 'flushing' and 'pre-harvest flushing'.
Flushing can be helpful when correcting a salt build up, correcting overfeeding etc.
Pre-harvest flushing is a complete and utter myth with no evidence provided.
People claim it provides better taste (removes chem taste they say), bigger buds, better high etc.


What I have disproved is pre-harvest flushing.
I don't see a problem in flushing your crop if you have a problem with pH, nutrients etc.
But pre-harvest flushing based on the reasons I mentioned is ridiculous and not proven to be in any way factual.



If you search my nick on the forums you could find the information yourself.
We have already had a lengthy discussion on pre-harvest flushing.
I will provide you with the link this time:

https://www.rollitup.org/harvesting-curing/496111-i-dont-starve-my-plants-15.html

You should read the entire thread (there are many others who rationally argue against pre-harvest flushing) but you can also just read what I've written.
I'm one of the few who provided scientific evidence (research, and books written by educated scientists).
The discussion started earlier than page 15, but I'm providing you the link to what I've written and what I stand by.

In that thread I explain;
How and where nutrients are stored in the plant.
Why they are not stored in the calyx (bud).

Those are the two main points of the main discussion I had in that thread with Gastanker.
If you read the thread entirely you will see how I disprove his statements with scientific evidence and how in the end he simply stops posting because he has nothing left to say, he was proven wrong.


Finally, a lot of these people you speak of are authors and normal people.
They don't have scientific degrees. They don't know everything.

You should trust science over personal belief ANY day of the week.
Many of the most celebrated cannabis authors have been proven wrong many times.
People just take their word for it without any evidence, which is a huge mistake to make, you should question everything unless provided proof.


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## willie163 (Sep 23, 2012)

I was hoping someone can help me out.

i have a new plant i tried outside this year, you never really know when you get clones from someone what the strain really is but it was called MOB which i figure is maine original bluberry.
i was gettin a lot of mold so i choped it and hung some of it till it dried and now all the tricomes went from good looking to brown during drying. does anyone know why this happened?


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## lokie (Sep 23, 2012)

willie163 said:


> I was hoping someone can help me out.
> 
> i have a new plant i tried outside this year, you never really know when you get clones from someone what the strain really is but it was called MOB which i figure is maine original bluberry.
> i was gettin a lot of mold so i choped it and hung some of it till it dried and now all the tricomes went from good looking to brown during drying. does anyone know why this happened?


Rip? is that you?


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## MrN1ceGuy (Sep 24, 2012)

View attachment 2348360View attachment 2348361View attachment 2348362should i cut these puppies down or leave them for a bit more any input would be nice


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## MagillaGorilla (Sep 26, 2012)

Really nice thread. It's not rocket science, it's botanical science. SOOO much misinformation on the web that people forget how much misinformation is in print. If you can't back your arguement up with more than "I read Smarty McExpert's book on infections and it said I should cut my foot off because there is an infection" than that is your bad. Science says hydrogen peroxide will knock that mofo out then I'm gonna give that a try FIRST. If that doesn't work out we'll revisit the whole amputee thing.

As for flushing, *what else on earth stops feeding before DEATH??? *Why would starving anything be good for it???
There is a difference between 'flushing' and 'pre-harvest flushing'.

Instead of worrying yourself into a frenzy over something so simply explained just follow the advice given, it wasn't presented with arrogance or a Nelson "Ha-Ha", it was just put out there as fact. 

Thanks again k0ijn for the post and I have should have quoted the trolls stirring the pot instead of your retorts but I digress.



k0ijn said:


> First of all we need to be clear here.
> 
> 
> Flushing can be helpful when correcting a salt build up, correcting overfeeding etc.
> ...


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## abuilder (Sep 26, 2012)

MagillaGorilla said:


> Really nice thread. It's not rocket science, it's botanical science. SOOO much misinformation on the web that people forget how much misinformation is in print. If you can't back your arguement up with more than "I read Smarty McExpert's book on infections and it said I should cut my foot off because there is an infection" than that is your bad. Science says hydrogen peroxide will knock that mofo out then I'm gonna give that a try FIRST. If that doesn't work out we'll revisit the whole amputee thing.
> 
> As for flushing, *what else on earth stops feeding before DEATH??? *Why would starving anything be good for it???


Regarding your answer Magilla....ya'll might find this interesting if nothing else. Not sure if any of you ever heard of Helen and Scott Nearing but they were/are a huge inspiration to me...always were and always will be..ya'll should look into them. Both are now deceased but before Scott died....well...read it for yourself..it's really touching and apropos as far as their lives went...btw...he left this world with just water : )
http://www.context.org/iclib/ic26/nearing/


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## MagillaGorilla (Sep 26, 2012)

That is a very interesting tidbit on a very unique and eccintric life.I'm too far away from 100 to put myself in his shoes. He lived a full life for sure although I would say his trichs were definately amber )



abuilder said:


> Regarding your answer Magilla....ya'll might find this interesting if nothing else. Not sure if any of you ever heard of Helen and Scott Nearing but they were/are a huge inspiration to me...always were and always will be..ya'll should look into them. Both are now deceased but before Scott died....well...read it for yourself..it's really touching and apropos as far as their lives went...btw...he left this world with just water : )
> http://www.context.org/iclib/ic26/nearing/


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## abuilder (Sep 26, 2012)

MagillaGorilla said:


> He lived a full life for sure although I would say his trichs were definately amber )


Great response Magilla...lol


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## wavz (Sep 26, 2012)

k0ijn...GREAT info!

Just curious...does the 48hr dark period help any?
Also, ever used hydrogn peroxide (food grade) to get O2 to the roots?

Thanks!!!


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## k0ijn (Sep 26, 2012)

MrN1ceGuy said:


> View attachment 2348360View attachment 2348361View attachment 2348362should i cut these puppies down or leave them for a bit more any input would be nice


They look done, hard to say definitively without more info but the calyxes look swelled, pistils receded and has a nice hue to it.


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## k0ijn (Sep 26, 2012)

wavz said:


> k0ijn...GREAT info!
> 
> Just curious...does the 48hr dark period help any?
> Also, ever used hydrogn peroxide (food grade) to get O2 to the roots?
> ...


I've seen people proclaim is pushes out trichomes, makes the calyxes grow more etc.
But there is no evidence for a dark period 'helping'.

I use Hydrogen peroxide a lot. I use it in my spray mixes (if I have pests or need foliar feeding).
I also use it in my reservoir(s). It's great at combating algae growth and clearing the roots up.
H2O2 is a great tool for any grower.


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## jbleez (Sep 27, 2012)

Hey yall... I'm about 90% cloudy trics on a outdoor sativa dominant strain. The weed looks good but some of the hairs are still white. Should I wait and see or just go off trics??


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## zaza2609 (Sep 27, 2012)

*I have a swiss cheese about to be harvested. I got the seeds from Nirvana ...I must say they were easy to deal with and plan on ordering again. The 5 Fem seeds I got all sprouted. My problem was I used M G ....When I transplanted them outside I got a bad rainstorm and so much water allowed for the nutes to destroy them...all but one thank god! I nursed it to health and now I am two weeks (maybe less to harvest) The plant needed little attention and is not about 4 1/2 feet tall...I was not getting a full eight hrs direct sunlight but as the season changed the plant started to get at least eight hrs I was pinching over the plant from time to time to keep it low and out of sight.....let me tell you the plant has some nice fat buds with a few colas that I never seen anything like. It is now late in the season and I have been taking small samples and looking at them with a magnify glass from Radio Shack (as I was advised on this sight...thanks )  The trics are turning amber on the leaves with few on the buds but trics are cloudy....I figure in at least 1 1 /2 to 2 weeks I will harvest the baby  ....as you can see I cant stop smiling !Question is that The plant now has many yellow leaves(from end of its flowering) There are anber trics on leaves and few on the buds....so should I harvest it or wait a bit more? dont want to wait to long to lose potency....Please advise someone?*


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## k0ijn (Sep 28, 2012)

jbleez said:


> Hey yall... I'm about 90% cloudy trics on a outdoor sativa dominant strain. The weed looks good but some of the hairs are still white. Should I wait and see or just go off trics??


Some strains are harvested with the pistils not changing colour.
It's down to the genetics.

You should go off trichomes and the general look of the plant and calyxes in this case.


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## k0ijn (Sep 28, 2012)

zaza2609 said:


> *I have a swiss cheese about to be harvested. I got the seeds from Nirvana ...I must say they were easy to deal with and plan on ordering again. The 5 Fem seeds I got all sprouted. My problem was I used M G ....When I transplanted them outside I got a bad rainstorm and so much water allowed for the nutes to destroy them...all but one thank god! I nursed it to health and now I am two weeks (maybe less to harvest) The plant needed little attention and is not about 4 1/2 feet tall...I was not getting a full eight hrs direct sunlight but as the season changed the plant started to get at least eight hrs I was pinching over the plant from time to time to keep it low and out of sight.....let me tell you the plant has some nice fat buds with a few colas that I never seen anything like. It is now late in the season and I have been taking small samples and looking at them with a magnify glass from Radio Shack (as I was advised on this sight...thanks )  The trics are turning amber on the leaves with few on the buds but trics are cloudy....I figure in at least 1 1 /2 to 2 weeks I will harvest the baby  ....as you can see I cant stop smiling !Question is that The plant now has many yellow leaves(from end of its flowering) There are anber trics on leaves and few on the buds....so should I harvest it or wait a bit more? dont want to wait to long to lose potency....Please advise someone?*


The plant has yellow leaves because a deficiency is occuring.
You have not raised the nutrient levels or kept an eye on the solution.
Therefore your plant reacts by using up it's stored nutrient depots (roots & stems primarily but also fan leaves and new growth).

It might be too late to do anything now, I would raise the nutrient levels a bit anyway, just to make sure your plant is @ 90%-100% production levels and not 60%-80%.
Deficiencies change the production levels in the plant and everything from the roots to new growth is affect, which in turn affects the yield.

It's hard to judge without pictures and more info.
Is there any chance you could take some high res pictures and upload them?


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## Mrskye (Sep 29, 2012)

First time grower here kinda confused on when. To harvest 75 percent the hairs are red and The tricones are a like a very stand out white hope someone can give a hand thanks 
skye.


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## k0ijn (Sep 29, 2012)

Mrskye said:


> First time grower here kinda confused on when. To harvest 75 percent the hairs are red and The tricones are a like a very stand out white hope someone can give a hand thanks
> skye.


Read the first post of this thread please.


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## tech420 (Oct 4, 2012)

Thank you it helped me a lot!


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## green4gold (Oct 5, 2012)

Just wanted to get some opinions if this ready to pull. First time grower. Doing this outside. Weather is barely cooling off here in SoCal.

Hope this is posted in the right spot. I have a hard time telling what color these trichomes are. Being colorblind doesn't help. 

Took these photos with my cell phone. From what I can tell, I think it's ready. But I was hoping to get some more growth out of it. If the pros here say chop it. I'm chopping it. Thanks for the help..


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## obijohn (Oct 5, 2012)

Looks to me like any time. It does look like you have some amber trichs there, so how long past now you wanna go is personal preference. But definitely get more opinions first, no rush


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## jbleez (Oct 9, 2012)

I see alot of amber on the leaves but I can't really tell on the buds. Shit looks rad though. I bet its ready or very close


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## abuilder (Oct 9, 2012)

OK, I'm back..two weeks later from the last time I posted photos. I'm at day 75 of flower from the day I went 12/12...still feeding the four Barney girls nutes about 3x a week(2-LSD & 2 Violator Kush).
Trichs are cloudy but I see none that are amber yet...and the pistils have been turning as you can see in the photos. Barney's says 65-70++ days but I'm guessing thats from the time the pistils appear which would have been about 4-5 days after I went 12/12...I'm thinking maybe another week..but I'm not that experienced to really know so I could use your help..please 
Any clue how much longer?
Thanks!


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## k0ijn (Oct 9, 2012)

abuilder said:


> OK, I'm back..two weeks later from the last time I posted photos. I'm at day 75 of flower from the day I went 12/12...still feeding the four Barney girls nutes about 3x a week(2-LSD & 2 Violator Kush).
> Trichs are cloudy but I see none that are amber yet...and the pistils have been turning as you can see in the photos. Barney's says 65-70++ days but I'm guessing thats from the time the pistils appear which would have been about 4-5 days after I went 12/12...I'm thinking maybe another week..but I'm not that experienced to really know so I could use your help..please
> Any clue how much longer?
> Thanks!
> View attachment 2366880View attachment 2366882 View attachment 2366883 View attachment 2366887 View attachment 2366891 View attachment 2366895 View attachment 2366896 View attachment 2366907


Plants look nice and healthy, they are loving the nutrients 

They are definitely fattening up as well and most pistils seem to have receded.
I see a fair bit of foxtailing but the plants look very nice.

Take them as far as they want. 
When you start seeing a lot (5%-10% of overall trichomes) of amber popping up; harvest.


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## abuilder (Oct 9, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Plants look nice and healthy, they are loving the nutrients
> 
> They are definitely fattening up as well and most pistils seem to have receded.
> I see a fair bit of foxtailing but the plants look very nice.
> ...


Yeh..thanks to you for slapping me upside my head about stopping the nutes kiss-ass ...whewwww..they are loving them and I am going "slightly" heavier than recommended but I don't mean with each feeding...I mean per week. FF says 2x a week and I'd been doing 3x...mainly because I fucked up for a week and I am paying attention to be sure I don't overdo it cause I know what over nute-ing can do....but like you said...at this stage of the game they have to be loving the nutes. I did notice on a Barney's website they were saying it could take up to 79 days. No idea where they came up with seventyNINE from but OK...sounds right to me from where my girls are now. Maybe they're overcompensating for newbies like me that think flower mode starts with the day you go 12/12 and not from the day you start seeing the pistil hairs.. Live'n learn, huh? I am getting mucho better at this thinking back to the day I started. Lots top learn and patience is sure a virtue when it comes to growing the ganja!!! Thanks again my brother and I'll repost right before I'm ready to harvest


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## green4gold (Oct 9, 2012)

Here we are four days later. Trichomes have gotten a lot more cloudy with more ambers popping up. Real nervous about chopping it too soon. I've been reading on curing and will be going to buy a hygrometer today. Also, it seems to have lost some of its smell. Is this normal? Or am I waiting to long?


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## abuilder (Oct 9, 2012)

green4gold said:


> I've been reading on curing and will be going to buy a hygrometer today.


Here's the least expensive one I could find for you of the Caliber 3 which I think is the best out there for the money. I just paid $15.50 last week..the price goes up and down on these like the weather...so to speak...lol..but this is still a real good price w/the shipping ($16.50ish)...good luck
http://www.amazon.com/HIGHLY-RATED-DIGITAL-HYGROMETER-AMAZON/dp/B005N06OU2/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1349816312&sr=8-4&keywords=caliber+iii+digital+hygrometer


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## k0ijn (Oct 11, 2012)

abuilder said:


> Yeh..thanks to you for slapping me upside my head about stopping the nutes kiss-ass ...whewwww..they are loving them and I am going "slightly" heavier than recommended but I don't mean with each feeding...I mean per week. FF says 2x a week and I'd been doing 3x...mainly because I fucked up for a week and I am paying attention to be sure I don't overdo it cause I know what over nute-ing can do....but like you said...at this stage of the game they have to be loving the nutes. I did notice on a Barney's website they were saying it could take up to 79 days. No idea where they came up with seventyNINE from but OK...sounds right to me from where my girls are now. Maybe they're overcompensating for newbies like me that think flower mode starts with the day you go 12/12 and not from the day you start seeing the pistil hairs.. Live'n learn, huh? I am getting mucho better at this thinking back to the day I started. Lots top learn and patience is sure a virtue when it comes to growing the ganja!!! Thanks again my brother and I'll repost right before I'm ready to harvest


Hehe np, I hope your harvest goes well


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## k0ijn (Oct 11, 2012)

green4gold said:


> Here we are four days later. Trichomes have gotten a lot more cloudy with more ambers popping up. Real nervous about chopping it too soon. I've been reading on curing and will be going to buy a hygrometer today. Also, it seems to have lost some of its smell. Is this normal? Or am I waiting to long?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The smell should be present but it will come back tenfold if you dry & cure the product properly.
You'll be needing a hygrometer to make sure you are in the correct range so it's good you're getting one.


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## MajorCoco (Oct 11, 2012)

The buds in those last photos look ready to chop to me. Hope you've chopped by now!


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## green4gold (Oct 11, 2012)

MajorCoco said:


> The buds in those last photos look ready to chop to me. Hope you've chopped by now!


Chopped her down last night. Got more than expected. Here is a photo of an old box retrofitted for drying and a lil popcorn nug. 



Weather is perfect out here for drying in the garage. Temp. is sitting at 73 with humidity at 47%.


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## k0ijn (Oct 12, 2012)

green4gold said:


> Chopped her down last night. Got more than expected. Here is a photo of an old box retrofitted for drying and a lil popcorn nug.
> 
> View attachment 2370058View attachment 2370059
> 
> Weather is perfect out here for drying in the garage. Temp. is sitting at 73 with humidity at 47%.



Grats on your harvest.
You should probably cut some holes in the sides of the box though to allow for proper airflow.
If you have a fan, use it in the drying room to move air around, don't blow on the buds but just keep a nice flow around the room.


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## cadillacs (Oct 15, 2012)

But won't u still get the newt taste if u don't flush??


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## k0ijn (Oct 15, 2012)

cadillacs said:


> But won't u still get the newt taste if u don't flush??


Pre-harvest flushing is a myth. I don't want to repeat myself so if you want all the sources and facts you can search the forum or my nick and look through my posts.

But just to bring it to rest; nutrients are not stored in the calyxes. There literally is nothing to 'flush out'.
You need to massively overfeed to attain high enough levels, which is very rare even for newbies.


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## poplars (Oct 15, 2012)

very good thread 

chitowns sk, 4 days before harvest (10/7/12)


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## k0ijn (Oct 16, 2012)

poplars said:


> very good thread
> 
> chitowns sk, 4 days before harvest (10/7/12)



Never grown that strain before myself looks like a very resinous one, can never go wrong with strains like that ^^


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## poplars (Oct 16, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Never grown that strain before myself looks like a very resinous one, can never go wrong with strains like that ^^


yep I agree, its the best smoke I"ve tried yet (but juries still out on these og kushes) its a private strain for now, but it is a F5 of pre98 bubba kush and east coast sour diesel.

www.photobucket.com/thebudjar password "medical" theres my photo journal, lots of good shit in there!


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## k0ijn (Oct 16, 2012)

poplars said:


> yep I agree, its the best smoke I"ve tried yet (but juries still out on these og kushes) its a private strain for now, but it is a F5 of pre98 bubba kush and east coast sour diesel.
> 
> www.photobucket.com/thebudjar password "medical" theres my photo journal, lots of good shit in there!


Pre98 Bubba is a great strain, so many great offspring! 

I particularly liked the look of the *Pre98 Bubba x Tahoe OG *in the photo journal


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## poplars (Oct 16, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Pre98 Bubba is a great strain, so many great offspring!
> 
> I particularly liked the look of the *Pre98 Bubba x Tahoe OG *in the photo journal



yeah I'm seriously super stoked to try some of that stuff!!! we'll see if it stacks up to sour kush hehe.


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## toronjadeoro (Oct 21, 2012)

I'll be the 100th person to tell you thanks a million for this great thread, k0ijn, and I have read THE ENTIRE thing, so I don't think my question is going to be redundant. I _am_ a first-time grower, but I've read the Cervantes and Riley books, and have been gratefully sucking up a ton of info here over the past several months, but I'm no pillar of knowledge. 

I started a Shaman from seed (classified as a sativa) in a super soil recipe that's been kept on a balcony in a 3 gallon pot with about 6-7 hours direct sunlight, and I am in the Caribbean. I've also got a Super Lemon Haze and a Tangerine Dream I started at the same time, but they are not of any concern and doing great. The Shaman, however, exploded in growth from the beginning (that part not of concern) but it began flowering on its own about 29 days later. I had already been LSTing it, and yesterday it completed 42 days of flowering with a pretty grand cola and several other impressive bud sites, all looking very healthy and fat. I've been watching the evolution of the trichomes since about the third week of flowering when they started to appear. I know it is silly to have expectations of it to finish any sooner than it is scheduled to (8-9 weeks according to Dutch Passion), especially with a sativa-dominant strain. But here's the thing....

I have a magnifier and have found that on one of the colas, has about 2-5% amber trichomes, and a couple others are about to head down this path also. Believe me, I've been looking at them everyday witnessing the changes. The pistils on all colas are about 20-30% reddish while the others remain white, but they don't appear to be receding (at least judging from the photos I've seen about what "receding" is supposed to look like). The pistils aren't exactly standing at attention, but they aren't completely wilted either. 

I guess my question is this: Would it be possible that the hot-ass Caribbean sun can exponentially accelerate flowering time or am I completely delusional? I have found very little information about any tropical outdoor grows. Meanwhile, the Tangerine Dream is burdgeoning with growth in vegetative somewhat closely followed by the SLH.

I don't have a camera to upload a photo, so I'm afraid you'll have to rely on what I've recounted above if you have an answer. If not, hey, this is such a great thread, and I've learned a ton of indispensable stuff.


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## k0ijn (Oct 21, 2012)

toronjadeoro said:


> I'll be the 100th person to tell you thanks a million for this great thread, k0ijn, and I have read THE ENTIRE thing, so I don't think my question is going to be redundant. I _am_ a first-time grower, but I've read the Cervantes and Riley books, and have been gratefully sucking up a ton of info here over the past several months, but I'm no pillar of knowledge.
> 
> I started a Shaman from seed (classified as a sativa) in a super soil recipe that's been kept on a balcony in a 3 gallon pot with about 6-7 hours direct sunlight, and I am in the Caribbean. I've also got a Super Lemon Haze and a Tangerine Dream I started at the same time, but they are not of any concern and doing great. The Shaman, however, exploded in growth from the beginning (that part not of concern) but it began flowering on its own about 29 days later. I had already been LSTing it, and yesterday it completed 42 days of flowering with a pretty grand cola and several other impressive bud sites, all looking very healthy and fat. I've been watching the evolution of the trichomes since about the third week of flowering when they started to appear. I know it is silly to have expectations of it to finish any sooner than it is scheduled to (8-9 weeks according to Dutch Passion), especially with a sativa-dominant strain. But here's the thing....
> 
> ...



First off, you're welcome 

Sounds like your grow is going really well.


The amount of light (measured in lumen) and the length of exposure to this light affects how the plants grow.
Especially if it's sunlight, since it's the strongest form of light you can utilize (and it's free ^^).

So if you were to have a long exposure without any pauses (clouds or bad weather) then your plants would increase production and thus grow faster, taller and produce more cannabinoids (and precursors).
As long as we assume that the light / dark cycles are still kept within proper ranges so you don't stress the plant(s).

The problem with identifying what is the key is that there are so many variables to account by with regards to growing.
Everything from temperature to relative humidity to CO2 levels affect how your plants grow.
Perhaps you live in an area with perfect ranges in all of these matters, in which case you are extremely lucky (or very wise).

When all these factors coalesce and are within the optimum ranges you will see a better grow environment than you would in say, Scandinavia (we're talking outdoors still).

So to answer your question; No, you are not delusional.

But without more data it's difficult to pinpoint whether it's the variables of the weather or if its the genetics of the particular seed(s) which are causing this.
It's fair to say that even with the perfect genetics, a seed not exposed to proper conditions (temp, RH, CO2, light, darkness, nutrients) will never produce results which are on par with a regular seed in proper conditions.

The most important thing to remember is that this is a living entity we're talking about.
You cannot take the breeders schedule for granted.
Everyone has different results because the variables are different.
I've seen plants scheduled to have an 8 week flowering period go well beyond 12 weeks.

Always go by what your plants 'tell' you.
They will let you know when they've had enough.


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## toronjadeoro (Oct 22, 2012)

That's exactly what I wanted to hear: I have to listen to what the plant tells me. It's science, but the conditions of the variables are what define one's results. Thank you again, K0ijn, and I will let you know the results after I make up my mind.


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## k0ijn (Oct 22, 2012)

toronjadeoro said:


> That's exactly what I wanted to hear: I have to listen to what the plant tells me. It's science, but the conditions of the variables are what define one's results. Thank you again, K0ijn, and I will let you know the results after I make up my mind.


No problem, hopefully the harvest goes well ^^
Read up on drying & curing so you're ready when the time comes.


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## dankydonk (Oct 24, 2012)

ok so when do you flush , iff you decide to , is like last week before harvest , does that mean chopping it ...


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## dankydonk (Oct 24, 2012)

got another question to , i dont have any irrgation stuff , well i do have a irrigation tank with heat mat , but no cfl or t5 lights , can i start seed in rockwool in irrigation tank , and put under 400 wattmetal halide ...then transfer to pebbles and bucket , iff i can how long do i run the light for and how many weeks till i transfer , 3 ..

after that is it just veg from there 18, 6 ...

thanks , ive done alot of reading , but im completely new to this ..thanks mate .


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## k0ijn (Oct 24, 2012)

dankydonk said:


> ok so when do you flush , iff you decide to , is like last week before harvest , does that mean chopping it ...


I only flush to correct errors in my grow.
If there's a salt buildup or an incorrect pH balance or nutrient balance.

You don't have to pre-harvest flush your plants.
Nutrients are not stored in the calyxes, there is nothing to flush out.
Pre-harvest flushing doesn't improve taste, odour, high or anything else either.

There's no logical reason to do it.





dankydonk said:


> got another question to , i dont have any irrgation stuff , well i do have a irrigation tank with heat mat , but no cfl or t5 lights , can i start seed in rockwool in irrigation tank , and put under 400 wattmetal halide ...then transfer to pebbles and bucket , iff i can how long do i run the light for and how many weeks till i transfer , 3 ..
> 
> after that is it just veg from there 18, 6 ...
> 
> thanks , ive done alot of reading , but im completely new to this ..thanks mate .


It sounds like you need to research the basics of growing a bit.
It would take me quite a long time to explain everything, I think the best way for you to understand it is to read an substantial and educational new growers guide.
Like this one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabis_cultivation#Stages_of_development

That's just a wiki entry but it's very informational regarding basics.

There are also a lot of good guides on this forum you could read.


But just to answer your questions very shortly:

1. Yes that would be possible but you need to germinate the seeds properly first and you need to have a good setup to allow for transfers later on.
2. People have different ways of germinating seeds. Some use cups of water or a wet paper towel. When the seeds open and the root appears you can transfer them to a grow medium and put them under 18 hour on / 6 hour off light. The light schedule for seedlings should be 18 hours on / 6 hours off (but it's possible with other variations of cycles).
3. That depends on a lot of variables; size of seedlings, environment (and space), bucket sizes, grow medium sizes and a lot of other variables.

People usually have a setup where they can either switch really easily from germination to seedling to veg or simply a collective system.
So that the germinating seeds and the young plants and the mother plants share a space (and light cycle).


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## dankydonk (Oct 24, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> I only flush to correct errors in my grow.
> If there's a salt buildup or an incorrect pH balance or nutrient balance.
> 
> *ok thanks for the advice ...*
> ...


*Sorry im not making myself fully clear , i hve a 10 bucket DWC , set up it is recirc , and im gona get rockwool sqaures and a electric Heated Plant and Seed Propagator , 

So i germinate in paper towlels wait for them to split and shoot slightly , then i was going to soak the rockwool in a slight nute and water formula , then put into the propagator and put into the tent , 

The question was really can i put them in a tent with a 400 mh i have aircooled hood lights and how high above the little plants does it need to be to veg from there on and 18 6 form there , or am i missing something ...

One more thing when it comes to harvest , can i just chop off clones from the finished plants and start over veging again ...thanks for your help mate , ive not even started yet and im new to this but just want to clear some things up , i have watched a few growing videos but i was like the guy at school who needed to go into detail or be shown by hand and im good from there ... thanks *


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## k0ijn (Oct 24, 2012)

dankydonk said:


> *Sorry im not making myself fully clear , i hve a 10 bucket DWC , set up it is recirc , and im gona get rockwool sqaures and a electric Heated Plant and Seed Propagator ,
> 
> So i germinate in paper towlels wait for them to split and shoot slightly , then i was going to soak the rockwool in a slight nute and water formula , then put into the propagator and put into the tent ,
> 
> ...



I would not mix nutrients into the solution when germinating. Wait until you have seedlings and only go with a 1/4 strength solution until they "grow up".

Yes you can use a 400 watt MH without problems but it's not ideal, it's a bit overkill for germinating and seedlings.

There's a good trick with holding you hand between the plant and the light (palm towards the plant), when the top of your hand feels uncomfortable from the heat the plants will as well.
Since it's a 400 watt bulb it'll need to be pretty far away (I'm guessing at least 30cm - 40cm).

It's a lot of trouble to reveg chopped off parts of a flowered plant (since you have to bring it back to vegetation from flowering).
Especially for a newbie, I'd not recommend fiddling with clones or trying to reveg anything before you have a lot more experience.

It'll be much quicker and easier for you just to get more seeds and grow them.


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## dankydonk (Oct 24, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> I would not mix nutrients into the solution when germinating. Wait until you have seedlings and only go with a 1/4 strength solution until they "grow up".
> 
> Yes you can use a 400 watt MH without problems but it's not ideal, it's a bit overkill for germinating and seedlings.
> 
> ...


its just gona double my time to grow , guess il have to get a t5 and some other stuff just dont have the doe yet .. one more question mate , my tent is 2.5 x 2.0 x 1.5 = 7.5 x 20 = 

150m3/h

i have found an intake fan at 183 m3/h a four inch inline ... is this right , ..

so iff the above is right what would i need to extract .. my lights are airtight sealed units with a 6" hole on each side but i can get 4 6 to 5 inch reducers 

*5" HYDROPONIC VENTS TT INLINE TEMPERATURE & SPEED CONTROL EXTRACTOR FAN*

Air flow 280 m3/h 37 Watts, sound level at 3m 36 (dBA) 
​
with a 5'' 125mm RHINO PRO CARBON FILTER 125x300 500m3/HR

will the above be suitable for my tent ... the inline fan is top , and the filter and extractor is above , remember the extractor has adjustable temp and fan speed , would this set up be fine ...

many think's

another thing its getting really cold now over here , how would i stop my intake fan running at night when its freezing would this freeze the plants or damage them < edit , found a tube heater for night time with thermostat ...

but still the fans would they be fine for the job , and also what nutrient do you use for hydro , iwas gona go for advanced sensi , flower and bloom , 1 ltr each bottle and advanced bloom ... 

you got any advice on nutes , im hearing mixed things about advanced , like i need loads of different things , i just want a good all on one grow , a good bloom and one for bud size ...thanks for your help by the way


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## k0ijn (Oct 25, 2012)

dankydonk said:


> its just gona double my time to grow , guess il have to get a t5 and some other stuff just dont have the doe yet .. one more question mate , my tent is 2.5 x 2.0 x 1.5 = 7.5 x 20 =
> 
> 150m3/h
> 
> ...



That sounds like a proper setup but the most important thing you have to remember is to keep a nice airflow inside your grow tent/space.
You need to be able to move the air around and extract it constantly.
Turning off fans is never a good idea.

You can use any hydro nutrients you like.
I use GHE but most nutrients do what they should, there's not one brand which is vastly superior to the others.

Just make sure you have an EC meter or another way of keeping control of the PPM levels.
Keeping a proper solution is a challenge and it's very important.

Don spend tons of money on nutrients of all sorts if it's your first grow, just go with some basic veg - bloom nutrients until you learn more about growing.
Practice makes perfect.


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## dankydonk (Oct 25, 2012)

thankyou very much , im gona start with ionic i think , veg and bloom , and some advanced nute bud bloom , im getting a ec metre truntion pen and ph metre and il get my pics up soon , thanks man ...


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## toronjadeoro (Oct 25, 2012)

Hi K0ijn,
As one of the last to beg your valued advice on this wonderfully thorough thread, I am left with one question. You will recall my concern for a Shaman sativa in the Caribbean already showing some amber trichomes at only 6 weeks of flowering. I did find another thread regarding my question, but the way it was asked and answered left me uncertain at best. As you're always succinct and lucid with your explanations, I'm thankful in advance for your input. The question is where is it exactly I should be taking the reading of ideal trichome color distribution. 

If I am going to harvest individual buds as they become ready, I assume I will be taking a trichome reading of the entire individual bud site. In doing so, I have found that the trichomes on the smallest of leaves (the"sugar leaves" as I've heard them called which are anywhere from about 3-15mm in length, sometimes curled a bit) are 85% cloudy/15% clear and have the highest concentration of trichomes; whereas the leaves farther down (anywhere from about 3-4 cm in length) have far less trichomes towards the tips than at the base--but these trichomes--especially those towards the tips--are already at about 10% amber, 85% cloudy and 5% clear. Hence, my dilemma. Should I be reading the ideal distribution of trichomes from the tiny sugar leaves or from the larger leaves below? Or perhaps I need to factor both large and small leaves? 

Thanks again in advance, and I'm already voraciously reading the drying and curing info in anticipation!


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## toronjadeoro (Oct 25, 2012)

Okay, I found some new insight regarding the apparently 3 different types of trichomes: capitate-stalked trichomes, bulbous trichomes & capitate-sessile trichomes. According to the article to which I credit a fellow of the moniker "Elephantman" at marijuanapassion.com, this is how each is defined:

"Bulbous: 
The bulbous type is the smallest (15-30 micron). From one to four cells make up the "foot" and "stalk," and one to four cells make up the "head" of the gland. Head cells secrete a resin - presumably cannabinoids, and related compounds which accumulate between the head cells and the cuticle. When the gland matures, a nipple-like protrusion may form on the membrane from the pressure of the accumulating resin. The bulbous glands are found scattered about the surfaces of the above-ground plant parts. 

Capitate-Sessile: 
The second type of gland is much larger & is more numerous than the bulbous glands. They are called capitate, which means having a globular-shaped head. On immature plants, the heads lie flush, appearing not to have a stalk and are called capitate sessile. They actually have a stalk that is one cell high, although it may not be visible beneath the globular head. The head is composed of usually eight, but up to 16 cells, that form a convex rosette. These cells secrete cannabinoids, and related compounds which accumulate between the rosette and it's outer membrane. This gives it a spherical shape. The gland measures from 25 to 100 micron across. 

Capitate-Stalked: 
Cannabinoids are most abundant in the capitate-stalked gland which consists of a tier of secretory disc cells subtending a large non-cellular secretory cavity. During flowering the capitate glands that appear on the newly formed plant parts take on a third form. Some of the glands are raised to a height of 150 to 500 micron when their stalks elongate. These capitate-stalked glands appear during flowering and form their densest cover on the female flower bracts. They are also highly concentrated on the small leaves that accompany the flowers. The male flowers have stalked glands on the sepals, but they are smaller and less concentrated than on the female bracts. Male flowers form a row of very large capitate glands along the opposite sides of anthers." (end of citation)

So, since cannabinoids are most abundant in the capitate-stalked glands, maybe it is to these which I should be paying most close attention for determining ideal trichome color distribution? The 10% amber I've seen on mine on the "lower, longer" leaves along the bud (how about that for eloquence?) I believe are the bulbous type trichomes; they appear to lie flat on the leaf. The article did not mention anything about which trichomes form first, so that may be a contributing factor as well. 

I thought this was very interesting information and thought it might help us arrive at the answer I'm still looking for. Here's the link to the full article if any are interested:

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1938

Thanks again in advance, K0ijn!


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## k0ijn (Oct 25, 2012)

dankydonk said:


> thankyou very much , im gona start with ionic i think , veg and bloom , and some advanced nute bud bloom , im getting a ec metre truntion pen and ph metre and il get my pics up soon , thanks man ...


You're welcome


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## k0ijn (Oct 25, 2012)

toronjadeoro said:


> Okay, I found some new insight regarding the apparently 3 different types of trichomes: capitate-stalked trichomes, bulbous trichomes & capitate-sessile trichomes. According to the article to which I credit a fellow of the moniker "Elephantman" at marijuanapassion.com, this is how each is defined:
> 
> "Bulbous:
> The bulbous type is the smallest (15-30 micron). From one to four cells make up the "foot" and "stalk," and one to four cells make up the "head" of the gland. Head cells secrete a resin - presumably cannabinoids, and related compounds which accumulate between the head cells and the cuticle. When the gland matures, a nipple-like protrusion may form on the membrane from the pressure of the accumulating resin. The bulbous glands are found scattered about the surfaces of the above-ground plant parts.
> ...



I don't see any references or sources listed by the author.
I'm not sure where he got the information from.

And he posted this: http://www.marijuanapassion.com/foru...4&d=1190805159 at the bottom of the post, which is an outdated and factually incorrect image.
So if the author can believe CBN is responsible for the couch-lock high (and not know that it's in fact phenotypes which determine this) he cannot be very scientifically acurate or knowledable in a credible way.

I'm sure some of the information is credible, but without sources or references it's hard to believe in it.


What I do know about the particular trichomes listed is that capitate-stalked trichomes are by far the most common trichomes during flowering.
I'll look into it and see if I can find some scientific sources, we need credible sources before we take anything as fact, at least in my thread.


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## toronjadeoro (Oct 26, 2012)

Great. I appreciate your skepticism, and will wait patiently.


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## k0ijn (Oct 26, 2012)

toronjadeoro said:


> Great. I appreciate your skepticism, and will wait patiently.


It's hard to judge when it doesn't have any references or sources.

The stuff about the different evolutions in trichomes sounds correct.
From what I could tell it's a passage from a book (a book I've used many times in University).
I think it's from K. Esau's Plant Anatomy from 1965 (checked on google, the original 2nd edition is from '65, I couldn't remember).
It's a plant structual biology textbook.


But some of the other information posted is just old propaganda. 
But that might be because the thread was started in 2006 (the one on marijuanapassion).

All in all the information is outdated, except for Katherines fine work on trichomes which has been known since 1965 and appears to have been directly stolen by whomever authored those posts on the forum with zero reference to her.
She is one of the most famous plant anatomists who has ever lived.


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## toronjadeoro (Oct 26, 2012)

Thanks for your diligence, K0ijn. I'm going to look for that book to try to learn more. In the meantime, what do you think about my original question? 

If I'm going to harvest individual bud sites as each becomes ready, should I be taking more into account the trichome color distribution of the tiny "sugar leaves" where there is a larger concentration of trichomes (in my case 85% cloudy/15% clear), or do I need to be taking into account the trichome distribution on the larger leaves sprouting down along the shaft of the bud where there is a smaller concentration of trichomes (in some cases the distribution is about 10% amber 85% cloudy and 5% clear)? Or perhaps I need to combine the two readings, take an average and then decide when to harvest? 

Thanks again!


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## k0ijn (Oct 26, 2012)

toronjadeoro said:


> Thanks for your diligence, K0ijn. I'm going to look for that book to try to learn more. In the meantime, what do you think about my original question?
> 
> If I'm going to harvest individual bud sites as each becomes ready, should I be taking more into account the trichome color distribution of the tiny "sugar leaves" where there is a larger concentration of trichomes (in my case 85% cloudy/15% clear), or do I need to be taking into account the trichome distribution on the larger leaves sprouting down along the shaft of the bud where there is a smaller concentration of trichomes (in some cases the distribution is about 10% amber 85% cloudy and 5% clear)? Or perhaps I need to combine the two readings, take an average and then decide when to harvest?
> 
> Thanks again!



Right, I completely forgot that while looking for the answer to the stuff about trichomes ^^
I think the book is available online in pdf form.
If not, you can get it from any serious bookstore, it's a book which is still being used to this day and has been used for the past 40+ years in Universities around the globe.

If it's your first time growing I'd not bother with tryint to harvest too many individual calyx sections.

But to answer you question I'd take into account the entire plant, from old growth to new growth.
You need to get a full picture of how the trichomes are developing.
Probably best to combine readings and then make an informed decision


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## toronjadeoro (Oct 26, 2012)

Sounds good. Thanks again for the analysis and the info on the book! Will try to post some results of the harvest after drying/curing as this is a curious case of a sativa seeming to mature extremely quickly (though it does have about 25% indica in the mix). Cheers.


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## k0ijn (Oct 26, 2012)

toronjadeoro said:


> Sounds good. Thanks again for the analysis and the info on the book! Will try to post some results of the harvest after drying/curing as this is a curious case of a sativa seeming to mature extremely quickly (though it does have about 25% indica in the mix). Cheers.


No problem.
Sativas generally have a wider window of harvest than Indicas but if it is getting close just remember than the trichomes will continue to develop (and degrade) after harvesting.
So don't cut it too late


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## abuilder (Oct 27, 2012)

OK..quick question...My four Barney's plants (LSD & Violater Kush) are in day NINTY of flower..WTF?? Hardly any amber tichs. Most all the trichs are very cloudy but no amber? Will it EVER get any amber trichs or is this it? I mean it's been three full months in flower already. I think they started to foxtail a cpl of weeks ago when my inline fan blew and I had to use just a booster fan in it's place. The temps reached around 83-85 deg for about a week during the day until I devised a plan that brought the temp down to around 80ish. Not sure if that stopped their progress or not but 90 days in flower? Any suggestions? Think I should just chop em'..or what?

Photos are from this past Thursday night..


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## LeafGnosis (Oct 27, 2012)

Great thread!!! will definitely use this in a couple of weeks when I will start looking at trichs. My only plant is of bag seed so I have NO clue on what average flowering time is. I do know that I am in week 4 to 5 so I am thinking about at least 3 more weeks to start checking.. and a quick question.. going to be using the fox trio and the schedule.. though I think that they just want you to use more and more of their products  specially when it says to flush between veg nutes and flowering nutes... I will have to see what transition I should give them rather than flushing. Did not want to spend more money of flush liquid anyway. May I get input on that aspect please K0ijn?


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## k0ijn (Oct 28, 2012)

abuilder said:


> OK..quick question...My four Barney's plants (LSD & Violater Kush) are in day NINTY of flower..WTF?? Hardly any amber tichs. Most all the trichs are very cloudy but no amber? Will it EVER get any amber trichs or is this it? I mean it's been three full months in flower already. I think they started to foxtail a cpl of weeks ago when my inline fan blew and I had to use just a booster fan in it's place. The temps reached around 83-85 deg for about a week during the day until I devised a plan that brought the temp down to around 80ish. Not sure if that stopped their progress or not but 90 days in flower? Any suggestions? Think I should just chop em'..or what?
> 
> Photos are from this past Thursday night..



The flowering periods you get told to follow by the companies are not always on the money.
I've had an 8 week strain go to 11 weeks without problems (no high number of amber trichs or anything).
I've also had a 12 week strain be ready in 10 & 1/2 weeks.

You can just follow their guidelines unquestionably.
You need to follow your plants and what they tell you.

Some genetics are just superior to others and it seems like you've got a very Sativa dominant plant which is exceeding your expectations.
I would let the plant flower as much as it wants, if you aren't seeing any problems (like foxtailing you mentioned or a breakdown of trichomes) then by all means let the plant swell up and continue to gain weight, in the end it's all the better for you.

Judging by looks some of you top colas seem to be very near ready, perhaps it's just the lighting or the camera doing trichs but they seem to have an orangy tinge about them.
Especially picture 2, 4, 5 and 7.
Just make sure you keep a good eye on them so you aren't going in your room one day and the amber trichomes have taken over.
Sometimes it can sneak up on you.

But tbh your plants look good, I wouldn't be worried at all.


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## k0ijn (Oct 28, 2012)

LeafGnosis said:


> Great thread!!! will definitely use this in a couple of weeks when I will start looking at trichs. My only plant is of bag seed so I have NO clue on what average flowering time is. I do know that I am in week 4 to 5 so I am thinking about at least 3 more weeks to start checking.. and a quick question.. going to be using the fox trio and the schedule.. though I think that they just want you to use more and more of their products  specially when it says to flush between veg nutes and flowering nutes... I will have to see what transition I should give them rather than flushing. Did not want to spend more money of flush liquid anyway. May I get input on that aspect please K0ijn?


Good to hear you find the information helpfulp.
First of all I need some more info to give you a pertinent answer.

Are you growing in soil or hydro?
And what system are you using within those two categories?

In soil it can be very useful to flush the soil (not pre-harvest, but flush in general).
Because salts can build up in the soil and affect the way your plant grows.
It's recommended to flush soil every 2-4 weeks depending on the nutrient levels you use and your equipment.
Soil tends to hold on to the minerals and salts and needs cleaning and attending much more so than a proper hydro setup does.

If you are growing hydro there really is no need for it.
Unless you are trying to correct an error (wrong pH, unbalanced nutrient solution etc.).
But you should still change water every 4-8 weeks (depending on how good your setup is, vulnerability to root slime and the like) or so just to keep the environment fresh and balanced.
It is possible to grow out the plants without changing the water but in small reservoirs and in places affected/vulnerable to/by root slime or any other kind of problem its best to keep the environment fresh and clean.

Regarding pre-harvest there is no need to do anything, whether soil or hydro (assuming you haven't let the solution stand there for 8 weeks without changing the water).


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## firsttimeARE (Nov 11, 2012)

Hey K0ijin,

Going on week 8, I have this G13 Genetics Pineapple Express thats an 8-9 week, her pistils aren't receded but all her pistils are orange and shriveled, trichomes are mostly cloudy. She's been sitting this way for the past week and her pistils still won't recede.

Just let it go longer? I'll get some pictures up.



I think she already hit her swelling point and the buds just look tiny because of a P def. from too high of PH. Stopped giving it nutes 9 days ago when she started to look ready. Trichs are clear/cloudy/amber like 15%/83%/2%

This is another seed of same strain that is apparently of the fatter pheno and it's pistils despite being orange less time have already begun to recede.


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## k0ijn (Nov 11, 2012)

firsttimeARE said:


> Hey K0ijin,
> 
> Going on week 8, I have this G13 Genetics Pineapple Express thats an 8-9 week, her pistils aren't receded but all her pistils are orange and shriveled, trichomes are mostly cloudy. She's been sitting this way for the past week and her pistils still won't recede.
> 
> Just let it go longer? I'll get some pictures up.


Are there any amber trichomes?
How about the calyxes, have they swelled up?

I'll wait for the pictures before I give you my advice


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## k0ijn (Nov 13, 2012)

firsttimeARE said:


> Hey K0ijin,
> 
> Going on week 8, I have this G13 Genetics Pineapple Express thats an 8-9 week, her pistils aren't receded but all her pistils are orange and shriveled, trichomes are mostly cloudy. She's been sitting this way for the past week and her pistils still won't recede.
> 
> ...



You should not have stopped feeding.
That'll cause a deficiency and lower the productivity of your plant(s).

I would let it go for another week or so, with nutrients.
Depending on how the plant reacts and how it already has reacted to the lack of nutrients.


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## firsttimeARE (Nov 14, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> You should not have stopped feeding.
> That'll cause a deficiency and lower the productivity of your plant(s).
> 
> I would let it go for another week or so, with nutrients.
> Depending on how the plant reacts and how it already has reacted to the lack of nutrients.


I always thought the last week you just go without nutes as the plant doesn't really grow too much and because of taste and burn(the old flushing myth that I subscribed to). Although i'm stabbing this myth in the neck. I only let a branch go 2 days with just water and another only 5 days. Well having smoked them both, I can say the 5 day flushed plant matter burned no different than the 2 day flushed plant matter. In a few more days I can test how good the 7 day flushed buds turned out.

This is only my 2nd grow so i'm still sorting out what myths are accurate. I know some people don't feed last week not because of taste but because they feel its a waste of nutrients as a plant doesn't pack on much weight during the last week.

I know you, and other seasoned growers, don't buy into the flushing idea. But some other seasoned growers do and their buds come out good, so I was trying to form an opinion of my own. There is so many different ideas and opinions and facts and myths that it's hard for a new grower to figure out what is real and what isn't. It is my assumption that the cannabis plant can handle some extreme conditions and just because you grew buds, doesn't mean it was the correct or ideal way, but the output of buds regardless confuses the line of myth and truth. It is only when you dig deep and figure out myth from truth for yourself can you grow as a grower and get to that optimum level.

So do you reduce feeding at all during end of harvest? I've seen other growers recommend starting low EC(1.0) in flower and working up high(1.5EC) and then back low towards the last week or two.


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## k0ijn (Nov 14, 2012)

firsttimeARE said:


> I always thought the last week you just go without nutes as the plant doesn't really grow too much and because of taste and burn(the old flushing myth that I subscribed to). Although i'm stabbing this myth in the neck. I only let a branch go 2 days with just water and another only 5 days. Well having smoked them both, I can say the 5 day flushed plant matter burned no different than the 2 day flushed plant matter. In a few more days I can test how good the 7 day flushed buds turned out.


The last week(s) of the plants life are the most crucial parts of the plants life, in terms of productivity (new growth, trichomes etc) & weight gain.
Nutrients are not stored in the calyxes. There is no evidence for non pre-harvest flushed weed tasting/burning/looking worse than pre-harvest flushed.
So it's without warrant to think it will improve taste, burn, high or whatever people might claim, if you pre-harvest flush.

However that is not to say you can't do whatever you want, it's your plants.
I can't stop you from seasoning your meat after you've cooked it either, but there's a reason why every professional chef and knowledgeable cook season meat before cooking it.
Anyway, that was a tangent.




firsttimeARE said:


> This is only my 2nd grow so i'm still sorting out what myths are accurate. I know some people don't feed last week not because of taste but because they feel its a waste of nutrients as a plant doesn't pack on much weight during the last week.


Well that is incorrect. The final weeks are the most important weeks in the plants growing life.
It's in the final weeks the plants calyxes swell up and most trichomes have reached a cloudy state.
End flowering is peak productivity.




firsttimeARE said:


> I know you, and other seasoned growers, don't buy into the flushing idea. But some other seasoned growers do and their buds come out good, so I was trying to form an opinion of my own. There is so many different ideas and opinions and facts and myths that it's hard for a new grower to figure out what is real and what isn't. It is my assumption that the cannabis plant can handle some extreme conditions and just because you grew buds, doesn't mean it was the correct or ideal way, but the output of buds regardless confuses the line of myth and truth. It is only when you dig deep and figure out myth from truth for yourself can you grow as a grower and get to that optimum level.


The burden of proof falls on the one who makes the claim, not on those who refuse to believe it without evidence.
It's not that we don't buy into it, it's that there is no proof of it working.
Unlike the tons of scientific evidence there is for the many processes and methods we use for growing in general.

I know there is a lot of crap posted on the internet.
Probably around 90% of what is written about cannabis on the net is false.
Nearly 99% of it is posted without references.

Which is why I always reference and quote scientific publications and books, so that people can see my workings.
What I write is not my opinion, it's scientific fact.

I'd never try to cram my opinion down the throat of anyone, that won't help me or them.
Always trust evidence and facts over opinion.




firsttimeARE said:


> So do you reduce feeding at all during end of harvest? I've seen other growers recommend starting low EC(1.0) in flower and working up high(1.5EC) and then back low towards the last week or two.


No I don't reduce feeding at all, in fact my feeding schedule climbs towards harvesting.
I start off with low PPM levels and end up with high PPM levels.
I don't follow a particular formula, I always go by what the plants tell me.

I see no reason why I should lower the amount of 'food' I give my plant at the stage of it's life when it needs the most food.
A plant requires most nutrient at the end of it's flowering period and to remove the nutrients is equivalent of starving the plant.
And that is the result people get, you get a deficiency.
This deficiency reduces productivity, the plant starts to consume itself to stay alive, new growth is stunted and you are reducing the potential of the plant.

You can do whatever you want but the advice I give out is purely scientifically based, you can choose to follow that or you can go with personal opinion that is your prerogative.


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## aurora stardust (Nov 16, 2012)

Hello everyone and k0ijn!

I am a first time grower and would love to hear from you on how ready my baby is.

First, some information about my girl. Grew her from seed in mid August. Fed on nothing but pure sunshine, rain, organics, and love, here in the tropics. Early October she showed pre-flowers, and about two weeks later, she started to bloom. The monsoon season started at around the same time, but she seems to be doing fantastically in the heavy rainstorms. It's been a month since. She's now 3.5-4 feet tall (counting from where she exits the soil, not from where the pot sits on the ground). She's from Ceres Seeds, the John Sinclair Sativa 'Trans-Love'.

Info from their website:

*- Breed: (Sativa x Indica) x Sativa
- Flowering: 70-75 days
- Yield: 0.9-1.1 gram per Watt of light*

I am growing outdoors, so i'm not sure how these numbers apply, but they're here just in case they can help.

For an apparently Sativa dominant strain, she's not that tall. I've noticed that she started growing with what looks to me like more Indica dominant leaves, but since she started flowering, the newer blades are now lanky.

I've read every single post on this thread, which is the first time i've ever done that on any forum! A big thank you k0ijn for dispelling some myths and providing some very wonderful insights. Before this thread, it was all about trichs. Now, at least i know about the swelling of calyxes and retraction of pistils.

My girl doesn't look ready yet. She's much too skinny, the calyxes aren't fully swollen, and there's only very minor retraction of pistils. The trichomes however, seem to be telling a different story. Overall, it seems, to my novice eye, that it's mostly cloudy with very little clear, and even less amber. I do think that some of the amber looking ones aren't true amber, but reflections on a cloudy or clear trich. Reflections of the sun's rays, maybe? And a few rare ones even look like they've gone past amber. Could that be due to injury, rather than maturity? On a few flowers though, there are quite a number of ambers already. She's only been flowering for a month.

I'd like to get a second opinion on my observations and will provide as many photos as possible for this process.

Thank you all in advance!


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## beuffer420 (Nov 16, 2012)

Flushing is no myth my son! Your plant stores nutes as it grows, it is real important to purge these buildups out of your ladies so your not smoking it. While it may seem the same as 2 days to 5 once it's all the way dry and cured your gonna notice it. plus it's not healthy for u. Flushing is a purging process, I used to flush insane amounts of water through my pots until I found I wasn't purging at all but soaking the main stalk wterlogging u can call and actually making it harder for the plant to take up the water for the purge. So now my flushes consist of a gallon and a half of water a nite for two weeks instead of running 10 gals or more through the pot at once. It seems to give a plant the chance to use it built up nutes thus expelling them from the smoke. Didn't want to write a novel so tried to get it to the point in the short.


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## k0ijn (Nov 16, 2012)

beuffer420 said:


> Flushing is no myth my son! Your plant stores nutes as it grows, it is real important to purge these buildups out of your ladies so your not smoking it. While it may seem the same as 2 days to 5 once it's all the way dry and cured your gonna notice it. plus it's not healthy for u. Flushing is a purging process, I used to flush insane amounts of water through my pots until I found I wasn't purging at all but soaking the main stalk wterlogging u can call and actually making it harder for the plant to take up the water for the purge. So now my flushes consist of a gallon and a half of water a nite for two weeks instead of running 10 gals or more through the pot at once. It seems to give a plant the chance to use it built up nutes thus expelling them from the smoke. Didn't want to write a novel so tried to get it to the point in the short.


It is though.
I have provided scientific evidence which shows pre-harvest flushing is a myth.

First of all you must make a distinction between flushing and pre-harvest flushing.
Nobody is saying flushing is a wrong thing to do, if you have grow medium imbalances or salt build up for example.

Pre-harvest flushing is based on a fallacy.
Nutrients are not stored in the calyxes, there is literally nothing to flush out.

I have provided all the info and links to references & sources in many threads, you can find the info with a simple search.
But for the sake of the argument I will show a quote of a post I've made:



k0ijn said:


> All the information is out there, you can find it with a simple search of the forums.
> 
> But just to rest the case I've gathered up the points and links in one post (this is quotes of what I've written):
> 
> ...



Read the publications, the books and the studies I've linked to and see if you come to a different conclusion.

In the end it's about whether you value science most or personal belief most.


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## k0ijn (Nov 16, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> Hello everyone and k0ijn!
> 
> I am a first time grower and would love to hear from you on how ready my baby is.
> 
> ...



First of all, thank you for your kind words, I'm happy you found the information helpful.

With regards to the trichomes of your plant I see a majority of clear trichs.
I do spot some amber and some cloudy but it looks to me as if the majority are clear.
And with the extra info of 1 month blooming and the general look of your plant I would say you she has at least a month left.
But I would not follow a strict timeline, I would check the plant every day, watch out for changes, try to take in as much information about how and where it's changing so you can follow what the plant tells you and not what some seed company tells you.
Always go with what the plant tells you.

I hope that was specific enough, if not just let me know and I'll go into more detail


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## aurora stardust (Nov 16, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> First of all, thank you for your kind words, I'm happy you found the information helpful.
> 
> With regards to the trichomes of your plant I see a majority of clear trichs.
> I do spot some amber and some cloudy but it looks to me as if the majority are clear.
> ...



You are most welcome for the kind words as you certainly deserve them. 

Thanks for being an extra pair of eyes for me. That's what i was hoping to hear... that she's got another month left! There's no rushing, I'm just going to let her take her time. I'll let her tell me when she's ready. I've just added more photos to my post. The last few show quite a bit of amber. Have a look and let me know what you think.

I agree that there is no strict timeline as it depends on many factors. But according to your estimate, the seed company is in the ballpark, as it suggests another 35-40 days left of blooming for her.

You were specific enough, but if you still want to go into more detail, I'm not going to stop you.


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## k0ijn (Nov 17, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> You are most welcome for the kind words as you certainly deserve them.
> 
> Thanks for being an extra pair of eyes for me. That's what i was hoping to hear... that she's got another month left! There's no rushing, I'm just going to let her take her time. I'll let her tell me when she's ready. I've just added more photos to my post. The last few show quite a bit of amber. Have a look and let me know what you think.
> 
> ...


Cheers 

Yes exactly, let her take her time.
I looked through the photos again and I do see more cloudy and a few more amber but the overall feel I get is that clear is the most prevalent.
However that can change rather quickly, so keep a good eye on them.
I can't know exactly where you've taken the images though, have you split them out between top and bottom of the plant and calyx and leaves?
You need to get an overall view of how the trichomes develop, and you have taken quite a few good pictures, just trying to make sure it's an overall view and not a specific location.

I usually harvest when I have around 5%-10% amber trichomes (and a large majority of cloudy).
I would estimate your plant does not even have 2% amber, so you still have a while to go.
But again I'm basing this not just on the trichomes but on the look of the calyxes as well.
The calyxes look very young, I hardly see any formation and I don't spot any swollen pods.

I have quite a busy day today so I will hold off with the details for now, most of the details are in the original post of this thread (and the referenced links) anyway 
Don't be afraid to check back in in some time if you have any questions!


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## aurora stardust (Nov 17, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Cheers
> 
> Yes exactly, let her take her time.
> I looked through the photos again and I do see more cloudy and a few more amber but the overall feel I get is that clear is the most prevalent.
> ...



I do agree that the calyxes look young. They're growing fast though, so I'll be checking on them regularly. I hope there's at least a month left, but if she tells me she's ready next week, then next week it'll be. 

As for the photos, I take shots of whole flowers with a macro lens, and on the highest resolution possible. The trichome shots are just cropped portions of the flower shots. The flowers presented were just the ones I was worried might be getting mature, the ones at the tips of stems, from top to bottom of my girl. The lower flowers closer to the main stem definitely are too young, babies... The trichome shots are mostly calyxes. The shots with the leaves are where there is more amber (than on the calyxes), and some trichomes that look like they have gone beyond amber and popped.

If most of the details are on the first page of this thread (and patiently repeated throughout the rest of the thread), then please don't waste your time anymore. You already have spent too much of it repeating what you said in your original postings. I've read it a few times as well. I can just refer to it again if necessary. As for any other details that haven't been presented yet, I will not mind learning more whenever you have the time or the mood to post. 

Enjoy your weekend!


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## k0ijn (Nov 18, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> I do agree that the calyxes look young. They're growing fast though, so I'll be checking on them regularly. I hope there's at least a month left, but if she tells me she's ready next week, then next week it'll be.
> 
> As for the photos, I take shots of whole flowers with a macro lens, and on the highest resolution possible. The trichome shots are just cropped portions of the flower shots. The flowers presented were just the ones I was worried might be getting mature, the ones at the tips of stems, from top to bottom of my girl. The lower flowers closer to the main stem definitely are too young, babies... The trichome shots are mostly calyxes. The shots with the leaves are where there is more amber (than on the calyxes), and some trichomes that look like they have gone beyond amber and popped.
> 
> ...


Good. 
It sounds like you've taken pictures from all over so it's a good overall view of the plant we're getting.
That makes it much easier to determine when it's @ peak potency.

I do the same myself with my digital camera, I hardly ever use my USB-microscope anywhere, although it's cool to play with.

The publications and books I reference are great reads.
They are quite long and technical but if you have the time and the interest I'd advice you take a look at them.

Hehe thanks, I've wasted a lot more time discussion pre-harvest flushing though so I'm alright with repeating pertinent info ^^

Thank you, and likewise, time to relax and enjoy some good Sativa


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## aurora stardust (Nov 18, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Good.
> It sounds like you've taken pictures from all over so it's a good overall view of the plant we're getting.
> That makes it much easier to determine when it's @ peak potency.
> 
> ...



Alright, I'll read those up if I find myself with some extra time.

Right now, I have a bit of trouble. One of my flowers seems to have a sudden onset of an infestation problem. What should I do? I just doused it with organic pesticide. Should I cut off that flower tomorrow morning, or should I leave it to heal?

View attachment 2414468View attachment 2414465View attachment 2414464View attachment 2414463View attachment 2414462

Thanks again. Hope I'm not disturbing you from enjoying some good Sativa!


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## Shaggn (Nov 18, 2012)

Hmm, very interesting!! I don't have any scientific backed facts on my own little experiment, but I will say some variation is inevitable. I personally try to harvest my plants as close to cloudy w/o any or close to no amber trichs, As I really do not enjoy the couchlock effect at all. I've taken cuttings from the same plant and harvested during the 3 phases (clear/cloudy/amber) and noticed the differences in the high. The main difference between clear and cloudy was strictly potency, while they both had a sativa/social buzz. The more amber they had, the more I noticed the dreaded couchlock effect. An example is a sativa I just took down is mostly amber and it knocks me down n out. But the cuttings of the same plant that I took down earlier in the season has a really nice up social/get things done high. Just wanted to share my own personal findings and not to down anything you've shared. Finally someone out there blowing all the misleading statements. I have also tried the flush and non flush of my plants and only noticed one difference (yield). I was very surprised as i realized I had fallen victim to misleading info myself. Btw I have always grown in soil. 

Keep up the good work k0ijn, props!!


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## k0ijn (Nov 19, 2012)

Shaggn said:


> Hmm, very interesting!! I don't have any scientific backed facts on my own little experiment, but I will say some variation is inevitable. I personally try to harvest my plants as close to cloudy w/o any or close to no amber trichs, As I really do not enjoy the couchlock effect at all. I've taken cuttings from the same plant and harvested during the 3 phases (clear/cloudy/amber) and noticed the differences in the high. The main difference between clear and cloudy was strictly potency, while they both had a sativa/social buzz. The more amber they had, the more I noticed the dreaded couchlock effect. An example is a sativa I just took down is mostly amber and it knocks me down n out. But the cuttings of the same plant that I took down earlier in the season has a really nice up social/get things done high. Just wanted to share my own personal findings and not to down anything you've shared. Finally someone out there blowing all the misleading statements. I have also tried the flush and non flush of my plants and only noticed one difference (yield). I was very surprised as i realized I had fallen victim to misleading info myself. Btw I have always grown in soil.
> 
> Keep up the good work k0ijn, props!!


It's always good to do small experiments but I would say your premise is flawed.
Is the strain you're growing 100% Sativa?

Allow me quote myself from the first page of this thread:



k0ijn said:


> The strain phenotype (wether it's a Sativa or and Indica) determines overall wether you get an energetic high or a couch lock high.
> It's a common misunderstanding that amber trichomes produce a couch lock high, it's mainly because wrong information has been spread around and people keep perpetuating it, in the end everybody believes it's fact when in reality it isn't.
> As already stated in the thread; amber trichomes contain degraded THC --> CBN.
> CBN does not really produce a high, it does affect the high but not in a positive way.
> ...



It's not well known that it's the phenotype which determines the high, not the trichomes themselves.
People get hung up on fairy tales and myths which have no backing evidence.
I'm not sure if it's purely ignorance or it's a lack of critical thinking or what it is but there is deep underlying misunderstanding of facts when it comes to growing.

CBN (which is what amber trichomes contain) does have a sedative effect, but so does most other cannabinoids (even THC does).
We cannot stipulate that amber trichomes lead to a couch-lock effect because it goes against the science, research and understanding we have of cannabinoids.

I don't quite understand how you could not spot a potency difference between the majority cloudy & majority amber in regards of potency.
CBN represents at least a 90% loss of potency when compared to THC.
Some researchers say it might be as high as 260% loss of potency, there's a debate in the community over which number is correct, but it's somewhere between 90%-260%.

So any plant grown out with a large amount of amber trichomes should be significantly less potent than a plant with a majority of cloudy trichomes.
That goes for any plant, any phenotype.

Clear trichomes are obviously even less potent than amber ones.
Clear trichomes contain mainly precursor cannabinoids (acids) and has a near 0% potency level.
In comparison to CBN which does have some potency.


I'm not trying to pick on your experiment or call you out, I'm just stating facts.
I've done experiments myself and I have friends who have as well and most of the time (dependent on setup, experience etc.) the experiments tend to follow the science.
I appreciate you took the time to read the info and I hope you learned from it.

I can only assert that you should read the publications and books I've referenced, it'll give you a lot deeper knowledge of cannabinoids and trichomes than what I've written.
My work does not go into as much detail as the educated scientific researchers do, I've simplified a lot of it so it's readily available for a layman.


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## Shaggn (Nov 19, 2012)

Very good point!! I forgot to mention that the same strain that was left till mostly amber did have a significant loss in potency, compared to the clear/cloudy harvest times. That being said it was also a completely different high and was cuttings from the same mother. I'm sure phenotype plays a major roll as well, except mine were all from the same mature mother. Another point I missed that you stated was that your right, It is not a pure sativa and will have variation dependant on phenotype. I have played around with harvest times and try to get as close to having no amber trichs as possible because I do not enjoy the couchlock effect being the basis of the high. My question then is if I have a, lets say 50/50 hybrid. I take one of the moms and make a bunch of clones. I then harvest them at different times and they produce different types of highs but they are all from the same mom. Wouldn't that mean that the harvest time based on the trich stage plays a key role also? I'm no scientist but I do experiment with every strain i've played with to find the best time to harvest to get the up high that I enjoy. That also being said most of the time I get a mixed hybrid high with the up part being the dom part of the high. I thank you for taking the time to break it all down for easy, to the point reading, but also for including where your getting your scientific facts. I look forward to reading any references you have. Peace!!


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## k0ijn (Nov 19, 2012)

Shaggn said:


> Very good point!! I forgot to mention that the same strain that was left till mostly amber did have a significant loss in potency, compared to the clear/cloudy harvest times. That being said it was also a completely different high and was cuttings from the same mother. I'm sure phenotype plays a major roll as well, except mine were all from the same mature mother. Another point I missed that you stated was that your right, It is not a pure sativa and will have variation dependant on phenotype. I have played around with harvest times and try to get as close to having no amber trichs as possible because I do not enjoy the couchlock effect being the basis of the high. My question then is if I have a, lets say 50/50 hybrid. I take one of the moms and make a bunch of clones. I then harvest them at different times and they produce different types of highs but they are all from the same mom. Wouldn't that mean that the harvest time based on the trich stage plays a key role also? I'm no scientist but I do experiment with every strain i've played with to find the best time to harvest to get the up high that I enjoy. That also being said most of the time I get a mixed hybrid high with the up part being the dom part of the high. I thank you for taking the time to break it all down for easy, to the point reading, but also for including where your getting your scientific facts. I look forward to reading any references you have. Peace!!



Alright then it makes sense.
The reason why it's a different high is because the cannabinoids interact with each other to form the high.
So if you grow out your plant with loads of amber trichomes you will dilute the THC high with the sort of sickly amber high.
This might resemble a couch-lock high but it's in no way the same as a pure Indica high (with near 100% cloudy trichs).

The best way to notice this is to grow a pure Indica to peak potency (near 100% cloudy trichs) and compare that high to a pure Sativa grown to 50% amber trichs.
You'll notice how the highs are very different and how a CBN high is very different from a couch-lock high.

Since the plant is not a pure Sativa the high will always have hints of an Indica high.
This might be an even stronger effect if you let the plant go to say 50% amber.

The stage of trichomes do play a role in the high but not in whether you end up with an energetic high or a couch-lock high.
CBN does produce a more sickly high feeling (feeling ill, drowsy etc.) which is comparable with a couch-lock high but not the same at all.


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## Shaggn (Nov 20, 2012)

Thank you for clearing that up for me. The way you have explained it, now makes perfect sense. I completely understand what you mean now  Damn, now i'm going to have to hunt down a pure indica and a pure sativa... Peace!!


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## k0ijn (Nov 20, 2012)

Shaggn said:


> Thank you for clearing that up for me. The way you have explained it, now makes perfect sense. I completely understand what you mean now  Damn, now i'm going to have to hunt down a pure indica and a pure sativa... Peace!!


You're welcome.
I like hybrids myself but I prefer pure strains even though some of the best strains in the world today are hybrids.
There's nothing like a pure Sativa imho.


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## annnnie (Nov 20, 2012)

So, slightly new at this. Ran into a problem this time I've never encountered... Hurricane Sandy knocked out my power for 7 days, so my plants were pretty much in darkness besides one small window letting in lame stormy light in 45 degree weather about 6 weeks into flowering. 

60 days into flowering my white russian and no amber tricomes at all. Everything I've read says WR has a flower of about 50-63 days. The buds are pretty small too.... Would the stress of that one week have anything to do with this? It wouldn't just put the process on hold and add another week, would it? Maybe I'm just being impatient... but I'm worried that one week screwed everything up and this is all I should be expecting. Do some plants just never get amber tricomes?


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## MajorCoco (Nov 20, 2012)

annnnie said:


> So, slightly new at this. Ran into a problem this time I've never encountered... Hurricane Sandy knocked out my power for 7 days, so my plants were pretty much in darkness besides one small window letting in lame stormy light in 45 degree weather about 6 weeks into flowering.
> 
> 60 days into flowering my white russian and no amber tricomes at all. Everything I've read says WR has a flower of about 50-63 days. The buds are pretty small too.... Would the stress of that one week have anything to do with this? It wouldn't just put the process on hold and add another week, would it? Maybe I'm just being impatient... but I'm worried that one week screwed everything up and this is all I should be expecting. Do some plants just never get amber tricomes?


It could slow things down yes. All trichomes will eventually turn amber if left long enough. It's chemistry in action..give it another week more I'd say..


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## watbol (Nov 21, 2012)

FrostyTheBudMan said:


> They were vegged 12 weeks prior to the 12/12.


What would the effect be if I added another stage of 15/9 between the 18/6 & the 12/12,With a light from the Veg and a light from the bloom at a 15/9 cycle?Would this give the plant less of a shock going from 18/6 to 12/12 overnight?Wouldn't this give a more natural transition for the plant?


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## MajorCoco (Nov 21, 2012)

Lots have tried it, and the evidence shows that it doesn't help in the end...plants seem well able to deal with the change, and you aren't losing grow hours leading up to your flowering period.


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## k0ijn (Nov 21, 2012)

annnnie said:


> So, slightly new at this. Ran into a problem this time I've never encountered... Hurricane Sandy knocked out my power for 7 days, so my plants were pretty much in darkness besides one small window letting in lame stormy light in 45 degree weather about 6 weeks into flowering.
> 
> 60 days into flowering my white russian and no amber tricomes at all. Everything I've read says WR has a flower of about 50-63 days. The buds are pretty small too.... Would the stress of that one week have anything to do with this? It wouldn't just put the process on hold and add another week, would it? Maybe I'm just being impatient... but I'm worried that one week screwed everything up and this is all I should be expecting. Do some plants just never get amber tricomes?


Your plants have without a doubt been stressed by the lack of light.
It might take a while for them to return to normal bloom, it's hard to say exactly how long and if they will get better but your best bet is to just wait and see and judge them as you go along.


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## k0ijn (Nov 21, 2012)

watbol said:


> What would the effect be if I added another stage of 15/9 between the 18/6 & the 12/12,With a light from the Veg and a light from the bloom at a 15/9 cycle?Would this give the plant less of a shock going from 18/6 to 12/12 overnight?Wouldn't this give a more natural transition for the plant?


You don't need to, the change of light is gradual in the real world (outside, using the sun) but the plants can take a swift change without any issues.
It takes a few days, maybe even a week or so, before you'll see the plants reacting to the light and begin flowering but there is no stress in that process.


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## aurora stardust (Nov 23, 2012)

Hello!

It's been a week since I first posted photos on this thread. Here's how some of the flowers look like now. Are the pistils retracting? Are the calyxes swelling? Any guesses on when she'll reach full bloom?  If you want photos of the trichomes, I can post them.

Thank you!

View attachment 2417547View attachment 2417548View attachment 2417549View attachment 2417550


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## Shaggn (Nov 23, 2012)

Not done, from the look of the trichs, they look mostly clear with a few starting to milk up. Just have to keep checking till u get the mostly cloudy. Peace!!


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## k0ijn (Nov 24, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> Hello!
> 
> It's been a week since I first posted photos on this thread. Here's how some of the flowers look like now. Are the pistils retracting? Are the calyxes swelling? Any guesses on when she'll reach full bloom?  If you want photos of the trichomes, I can post them.
> 
> ...


You're still quite a bit time away from peak potency.
The calyxes don't look swelled, in fact calyx formation doesn't seem very prevalent. 
Pistils don't look to be retracting yet either, you can see they haven't changed colour fully yet.

If I have to guess, 3-4 weeks left still, at least.
We'll see how she develops.


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## aurora stardust (Nov 25, 2012)

Thank you good people! Will keep a watchful eye on her... had some mite and caterpillar problems the past week. Heartache!


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## budzrus (Nov 27, 2012)

As a new grower I found this info to be invaluable, thanks a bunch it was very helpful.


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## k0ijn (Nov 30, 2012)

@ mr. green thumb 01

I didn't delete any pages, in fact I didn't delete your latest duplicated threads.
Your threads were deleted by the admin and I suggest you calm down because you're just making this worse for yourself.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 1, 2012)

So, it has been another week. I will post photos of 3 random bud sites, and some trichome shots as well. 

2 weeks ago, I had to snip off some buds that had mite infestation and rot. Whatever that could be salvaged, I dried and cured. Tried some last night... it was very nice. Smelt complex and interesting. Everyone asked what was in the joint. One person had a sniff of basil, another said thyme, and another oregano. Its aroma was a mixture of herbs, citrus, sweet and sour. We actually just kept sniffing it for a bit before lighting up!  But the aromas were only released after grinding though. It smelt more like tea leaves before that. Tasted lovely and was very smooth. Can't imagine what it'll be like when fully mature!!


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## k0ijn (Dec 1, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> So, it has been another week. I will post photos of 3 random bud sites, and some trichome shots as well.
> 
> 2 weeks ago, I had to snip off some buds that had mite infestation and rot. Whatever that could be salvaged, I dried and cured. Tried some last night... it was very nice. Smelt complex and interesting. Everyone asked what was in the joint. One person had a sniff of basil, another said thyme, and another oregano. Its aroma was a mixture of herbs, citrus, sweet and sour. We actually just kept sniffing it for a bit before lighting up!  But the aromas were only released after grinding though. It smelt more like tea leaves before that. Tasted lovely and was very smooth. Can't imagine what it'll be like when fully mature!!
> 
> View attachment 2426890View attachment 2426887View attachment 2426885View attachment 2426870View attachment 2426871View attachment 2426873View attachment 2426874View attachment 2426878


Can you take some pictures of entire calyx sections and the entire plant.

Of what I can see the calyxes don't look very swollen but the pistils seem to be receding.
I still see quite a few clear trichomes though.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 1, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Can you take some pictures of entire calyx sections and the entire plant.
> 
> Of what I can see the calyxes don't look very swollen but the pistils seem to be receding.
> I still see quite a few clear trichomes though.


Okay, sure thing. I've gone out and taken those photos and will post them up now.

The main cola has been devastated due to the infestation, which also ended up causing rot because of heavy webbing. Two other sections have also been slightly affected.


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## k0ijn (Dec 1, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> Okay, sure thing. I've gone out and taken those photos and will post them up now.
> 
> The main cola has been devastated due to the infestation, which also ended up causing rot because of heavy webbing. Two other sections have also been slightly affected.
> 
> ...



Do you think the infestation is spreading? 
What I mean is do you think it could get much worse if you let the plant go longer?

I think your plant needs a few more weeks for it to be nearer peak harvest.
But if the infestation & mold might get worse I'm not sure if I would gamble it.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 2, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Do you think the infestation is spreading?
> What I mean is do you think it could get much worse if you let the plant go longer?
> 
> I think your plant needs a few more weeks for it to be nearer peak harvest.
> But if the infestation & mold might get worse I'm not sure if I would gamble it.


Well, i have been fighting it since mid-November. I have stopped infestations on the other sections, but with the main cola, because I didn't want to cut off too much of it, I ended up letting the infestation there get worse. After taking the photos, I cut off the whole main cola. Didn't have much of a choice. Should've cut off more of it earlier on to save the rest of it. But yeah, it's a good lesson to learn on a first grow.

I will post up photos of trichomes taken today at some point later. It does seem to me that there are quite a lot of amber ones already. But then again, my eye is untrained, and until this girl reaches full maturity, I won't have the experience needed to see it right.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 2, 2012)

Okay, as promised, trichome shots from today. Again, I've taken photos of flowers from all over the plant. The trichome shots are also from a variety of places.


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## k0ijn (Dec 2, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> Well, i have been fighting it since mid-November. I have stopped infestations on the other sections, but with the main cola, because I didn't want to cut off too much of it, I ended up letting the infestation there get worse. After taking the photos, I cut off the whole main cola. Didn't have much of a choice. Should've cut off more of it earlier on to save the rest of it. But yeah, it's a good lesson to learn on a first grow.
> 
> I will post up photos of trichomes taken today at some point later. It does seem to me that there are quite a lot of amber ones already. But then again, my eye is untrained, and until this girl reaches full maturity, I won't have the experience needed to see it right.


Alright, well that's sad to hear but that's how it goes with growing.
I've had my fair share of infestations as has other people.

I'll take a look at the trichome shots.


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## k0ijn (Dec 2, 2012)

I still see a fair bit of clear trichomes but it might just be a specific low hanging calyx.
Some calyxes do look to have about 5-10% amber so you're getting close.

If the infestation is getting much worse I'd chop soon, if you feel like it can be kept under control, I'd give a week or two more.
Just to let the calyxes swell up a bit more and let some trichomes mature.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 3, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Alright, well that's sad to hear but that's how it goes with growing.
> I've had my fair share of infestations as has other people.
> 
> I'll take a look at the trichome shots.


Thanks for the consoling words. Next round, I will be even more diligent. I actually was, but then i read someone say on a forum that outdoors, he just lets nature take its course. It made sense to me, so I gave it a shot and sat back. I guess I got unlucky. Either that, or i sat back a little too much. 



k0ijn said:


> I still see a fair bit of clear trichomes but it might just be a specific low hanging calyx.
> Some calyxes do look to have about 5-10% amber so you're getting close.
> 
> If the infestation is getting much worse I'd chop soon, if you feel like it can be kept under control, I'd give a week or two more.
> Just to let the calyxes swell up a bit more and let some trichomes mature.


I do plan to harvest in stages, and also to re-veg the plant. I feel the flowers still have the potential to mature more and to get bigger, but the amber I am seeing makes me unsure. Should I leave the calyxes with 5-10% amber to grow some more, or should i harvest them already?

Thank you for your advice thus far. I really appreciate you taking the time to do this.


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## k0ijn (Dec 6, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> Thanks for the consoling words. Next round, I will be even more diligent. I actually was, but then i read someone say on a forum that outdoors, he just lets nature take its course. It made sense to me, so I gave it a shot and sat back. I guess I got unlucky. Either that, or i sat back a little too much.


Sometimes you have to take action, especially outside, since there are so many things that can cause infestation.
But it can be very hard to combat it outdoors, perhaps some form of oily bug/infestation spray could be useful but it's hard to say if that would've saved the calyxes.





aurora stardust said:


> I do plan to harvest in stages, and also to re-veg the plant. I feel the flowers still have the potential to mature more and to get bigger, but the amber I am seeing makes me unsure. Should I leave the calyxes with 5-10% amber to grow some more, or should i harvest them already?
> 
> Thank you for your advice thus far. I really appreciate you taking the time to do this.


Why do you want to reveg the plant?
It's already taken a lot of damage and it would probably be quite hard for it to survive a reveg, let alone produce anything afterwards.

Revegging is quite hard, takes a long time and if the plant is weak and/or disease ridden it's not worth it.

I would harvest soon, it's been a few days since you posted this so I would say the plant is probably near peak harvest, however if you feel the plant can take longer then by all means do it, always go with what the plant tells you.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 8, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Sometimes you have to take action, especially outside, since there are so many things that can cause infestation.
> But it can be very hard to combat it outdoors, perhaps some form of oily bug/infestation spray could be useful but it's hard to say if that would've saved the calyxes.
> 
> Why do you want to reveg the plant?
> ...


Agreed. The next round, I will take harsher action. I've already cut off the top of the main cola, and some of the sides. But I should've done it sooner instead of hoping to control the infestation and save the colas. It's better now, but the mites are still around.

The reason for wanting to reveg the plant is a sentimental one. She's my first, and I am hoping to keep her around. It won't matter to me if she won't be able to produce much after. I also don't mind if it takes a long time. I am in no rush.

Have a look at the plant... I think she can still continue blooming. Still seems a bit skinny to me. What do you think?



Let's look at the trichomes flower by flower this time...

No.1:



No.2:



No.3:



No.4:



The ambers are growing in number, but there are still a lot of clears. Am I correct? I am trying my best to listen to what my plant is telling me, but this is my first time, so I guess you could say that there could be a bit of a language barrier.


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## k0ijn (Dec 8, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> The reason for wanting to reveg the plant is a sentimental one. She's my first, and I am hoping to keep her around. It won't matter to me if she won't be able to produce much after. I also don't mind if it takes a long time. I am in no rush.


Alright, well just to be clear, it's quite an undertaking, and especially if you're new to growing.
But perhaps it's a good way of learning for you, I wouldn't expect too much though if I were you.




aurora stardust said:


> Have a look at the plant... I think she can still continue blooming. Still seems a bit skinny to me. What do you think?
> 
> View attachment 2435008View attachment 2435007View attachment 2435006
> 
> ...



I can see more amber than before yes and some clear, but it seems like the cloudy are in a clear majority.
I wouldn't take it much further, you've got to remember that the trichomes will keep maturing even after you harvest.
Perhaps give it a few more days, but I wouldn't compromise the main colas just because of some clear trichomes on lower (less significant) calyxes.
There will also be a continual production and maturing of trichomes, so you should always go with the main calyxes and not with the new growth.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 8, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Alright, well just to be clear, it's quite an undertaking, and especially if you're new to growing.
> But perhaps it's a good way of learning for you, I wouldn't expect too much though if I were you.
> 
> I can see more amber than before yes and some clear, but it seems like the cloudy are in a clear majority.
> ...


Understood... I will try my best to bring her back, but at the same time I'll be prepared for the possibility that she may not return.

Thanks for your advice. I'll give her a few more days. But I do want to know what you think of her size. Or rather the size of her flowers. I want to train my eye and currently I have nothing to go by, but photos online. In comparison to the photos I see of other plants, her flowers seem skinny. To help you imagine, since you aren't here to look at her in person, she is about 3 1/2 feet tall.


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## k0ijn (Dec 8, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> Understood... I will try my best to bring her back, but at the same time I'll be prepared for the possibility that she may not return.
> 
> Thanks for your advice. I'll give her a few more days. But I do want to know what you think of her size. Or rather the size of her flowers. I want to train my eye and currently I have nothing to go by, but photos online. In comparison to the photos I see of other plants, her flowers seem skinny. To help you imagine, since you aren't here to look at her in person, she is about 3 1/2 feet tall.


I think the size is rather good for a first grower and for a plant which has had infestation problems.
It's not big calyxes really but it probably because of the conditions, the infestation and possibly the strain as well.

Huge calyxes comes with experience and perfection of variables. 

I wouldn't say it's bad though since I've seen much much worse, plants with literally just leaves for calyxes which would yield only a few grams (if even that).

At least you'll get something out of your grow and with time you'll learn how to perfect nutrient solutions and the other variables and that will add a lot to the size of your harvest.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 9, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> I think the size is rather good for a first grower and for a plant which has had infestation problems.
> It's not big calyxes really but it probably because of the conditions, the infestation and possibly the strain as well.
> 
> Huge calyxes comes with experience and perfection of variables.
> ...


Thank you for your comforting words. I have definitely learnt a lot with all the trial and error in this first grow. I stopped vegging because it was already getting too tall. Any taller and she might have been too obvious for the neighbours to see. Next round, I may fim and train, then veg even longer. Maybe that may help. Now I've fine tuned my feeding and spraying routine. Let's see how it works out for the next grow. Thank you again for all your advice so far. I will update you about my plant over the next few days.


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## gardens (Dec 9, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> ...snip...
> CBN (which is what amber trichomes contain) does have a sedative effect, but so does most other cannabinoids (even THC does).
> 
> We cannot stipulate that amber trichomes lead to a couch-lock effect because it goes against the science, research and understanding we have of cannabinoids.
> ...





k0ijn said:


> ...snip...
> I can see more amber than before yes and some clear, but it seems like the cloudy are in a clear majority.
> 
> *I wouldn't take it much further, you've got to remember that the trichomes will keep maturing even after you harvest.*
> ...snip...


Thanks for the great thread k0ijn, read the whole thing. I am a first time poster and noob working on my first grow. Well I actually started in 1973 and took a few decades off, so I am still a noob. What I was curious about was whether the trichomes can _significantly_ change color during curing (it has been mentioned in the thread that they can continue to turn amber after harvest)

I harvested a hermie after about 6+ weeks of 12/12 that seeded my entire garden. When I harvested the hermie I noticed that the trichomes were clear wherever I checked. I dried for a week then put into the jars with a hygrometer. I burped regularly and watched the humidity, without really checking the trichomes after being put into jars. After a month and a half cure I scoped things out (same microscope) and the trichomes were almost all cloudy white. I had considered throwing away the "clear buds" at harvest after a smoke test. Later I tried the properly cured smoke and it was pretty good. Not killer by any means, and not as good as the bag that supplied the seeds, but still good (I have bought worse in a bag). It appeared to be an indica dominant indica/sativa cross.

I am a noob on first grow, so I can't rule out "sampling error" (looking at different parts than I did when I harvested), but I did do a rather thorough spot check and I honestly didn't see cloudy white trics anywhere on the plant at harvest. Now I can't find more than a few clear trichomes. 

From what I have read on the forum a lot of people say that the cure not only improves taste but makes it stronger (I thought cannabis was decarboxylated when smoked too). This is hardly scientific, but from my experience that seems to be true. When I put the stuff into jars, it was "very weak" with clear trichomes, to the point of being almost worthless. Now after the cure the cannabis is much stronger.

Being a noob it is safe to say that I stressed the living crap out of everything in the garden, which helps explain the hermie. Now I have hundreds of seeds on the non-hermie plants, all from hermie pollen. I let all the seeds mature since fully developed seeds are easier to extract from buds. This is a medical grow, so I actually prefer the couchlock (and also take Marinol - nowhere near as effective as cannabis, but pure THC without other cannabinoids). Thanks for the clarification on amber trics not being the source of my desired couchlock!

You mentioned above that _"Clear trichomes contain mainly precursor cannabinoids (acids) and has a near 0% potency level."_, and on the first post of the thread the image shows decarboxylation from THCA to THC and CBDA to CBD. So the question I am asking is whether it was the loss of the -cooh group during cure that resulted in the evident change from clear to cloudy trics? I was seriously thinking about throwing out the clear buds (not even QWISO), until I tested after the cure. Glad I was patient enough to try a formal cure on clear buds.

Am I reading too much into the comments about _"Clear trichomes contain mainly precursor cannabinoids (acids) and has a near 0% potency level."_, and that perhaps there is something else going on besides the decarboxylation from the precursor acids to the active components (THC, CBD, etc.) that might explain the transition from clear to cloudy trichomes?

Sorry for the lengthy first post and noob question, but I am just trying to understand why my "clear buds" went from pure garbage at harvest to reasonable smoke a couple of months after a proper cure.


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## k0ijn (Dec 9, 2012)

gardens said:


> Thanks for the great thread k0ijn, read the whole thing. I am a first time poster and noob working on my first grow. Well I actually started in 1973 and took a few decades off, so I am still a noob. What I was curious about was whether the trichomes can _significantly_ change color during curing (it has been mentioned in the thread that they can continue to turn amber after harvest)


You're welcome 

It depends on how you handle the weed.
If you have control over the variables and carry out a proper dry & cure you won't see a significant change, but you will see some change (again, depending on the variables).

The variables which can highly affect the outcome are; light, humidity, aging & temperature (heat really).
If you store/cure your weed in an improper way then you can see a huge change in the potency, high and general appeal of your weed (even ruin it (mold for example)).

So it all really comes down to how much you take care of the harvest.
But the degradation and maturing of the trichomes will always be ongoing.
If you let the weed store for long enough in the right conditions you could stay the degradation of the THC.
On the other hand, if you do it wrong you could speed up the degradation and possibly even ruin the weed.




gardens said:


> I harvested a hermie after about 6+ weeks of 12/12 that seeded my entire garden. When I harvested the hermie I noticed that the trichomes were clear wherever I checked. I dried for a week then put into the jars with a hygrometer. I burped regularly and watched the humidity, without really checking the trichomes after being put into jars. After a month and a half cure I scoped things out (same microscope) and the trichomes were almost all cloudy white. I had considered throwing away the "clear buds" at harvest after a smoke test. Later I tried the properly cured smoke and it was pretty good. Not killer by any means, and not as good as the bag that supplied the seeds, but still good (I have bought worse in a bag). It appeared to be an indica dominant indica/sativa cross.


That is quite normal, since the regular maturation of the trichomes will continue to go on even after you harvest the weed.
But since it was harvested early the calyxes had probably not matured enough, the weed was likely stringy and airy but of course it could bring some effect if you smoke it.
At least you got something out of it but I doubt it was the full potential of the plant.




gardens said:


> I am a noob on first grow, so I can't rule out "sampling error" (looking at different parts than I did when I harvested), but I did do a rather thorough spot check and I honestly didn't see cloudy white trics anywhere on the plant at harvest. Now I can't find more than a few clear trichomes.
> 
> From what I have read on the forum a lot of people say that the cure not only improves taste but makes it stronger (I thought cannabis was decarboxylated when smoked too). This is hardly scientific, but from my experience that seems to be true. When I put the stuff into jars, it was "very weak" with clear trichomes, to the point of being almost worthless. Now after the cure the cannabis is much stronger.


Curing doesn't affect potency (other than it's a controlled environment which allows for a slow decarboxylation) but it can improve immensely on flavour and odour.
The potency is determined by the amount of cloudy trichomes and thus the amount of THC-A/THC present in the plant @ harvest.
Curing is just a good way of controlling hydration and decarboxylation of the dried weed.
It allows for the release of certain substances in the plant material as well (mainly Chlorophyll) which improves flavour and odour.




gardens said:


> Being a noob it is safe to say that I stressed the living crap out of everything in the garden, which helps explain the hermie. Now I have hundreds of seeds on the non-hermie plants, all from hermie pollen. I let all the seeds mature since fully developed seeds are easier to extract from buds. This is a medical grow, so I actually prefer the couchlock (and also take Marinol - nowhere near as effective as cannabis, but pure THC without other cannabinoids). Thanks for the clarification on amber trics not being the source of my desired couchlock!
> 
> You mentioned above that _"Clear trichomes contain mainly precursor cannabinoids (acids) and has a near 0% potency level."_, and on the first post of the thread the image shows decarboxylation from THCA to THC and CBDA to CBD. So the question I am asking is whether it was the loss of the -cooh group during cure that resulted in the evident change from clear to cloudy trics? I was seriously thinking about throwing out the clear buds (not even QWISO), until I tested after the cure. Glad I was patient enough to try a formal cure on clear buds.


That sounds like quite a seed infestation, do you have segregated areas to grow? 
It's very helpful to remove hermied plants to enclosed areas quickly so they don't affect the rest of the bunch.

That's quite a good question but I cannot say I have scientifically backed information to answer that fully.
The reason is that we don't fully know what exactly the specific substances in the trichomes are at certain points in time.
We know that clear trichomes contain precursor acids, most likely with a majority of Olivetolic acid & Cannabigerolic acid.
The amount of THCA, CBDA, CBGA etc which is present in these trichomes is likely very low and whether they all are present and in what quantities is not fully known.

I don't personally think the loss of the carbon group is the reason it changes colour, but I guess there are a multitude of possible factors which could either produce this or catalyze the effect.

It's a hard question to answer because we don't really know all we could know about the individual trichomes, their stages and what exactly their properties are in each stage.
I wish a proper study would be done on this, but due to the illegal nature of the substances it's not likely to happen yet.
People are very busy studying particular substances like THC and CBD but no the intricate processes which control the aging and maturation of trichomes.




gardens said:


> Am I reading too much into the comments about _"Clear trichomes contain mainly precursor cannabinoids (acids) and has a near 0% potency level."_, and that perhaps there is something else going on besides the decarboxylation from the precursor acids to the active components (THC, CBD, etc.) that might explain the transition from clear to cloudy trichomes?
> 
> Sorry for the lengthy first post and noob question, but I am just trying to understand why my "clear buds" went from pure garbage at harvest to reasonable smoke a couple of months after a proper cure.


I think you are, the processes which affect and control the maturation and aging are not very well researched.
The only indicators we have are the colours really, the specific subject has never been researched properly other than by a few people.
I got the information from an excellent book I've referenced in the first post but the study did not go much into detail.
I wish the particular transitions and processes could be researched in depth, and it will likely happen one day, who knows when though.

That's quite alright, I hope I answered the questions well enough


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## aurora stardust (Dec 10, 2012)

Firstly, I need to apologise for the photos today. There was very little light and I could not get good shots. 

She seems to be pushing out new pistils still. Does this mean I should hold back on harvesting? If not, I will harvest tomorrow morning as you suggested.



Here are what 2 random flowers look like today.


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## gardens (Dec 10, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> That is quite normal, since the regular maturation of the trichomes will continue to go on even after you harvest the weed.
> 
> But since it was harvested early the calyxes had probably not matured enough, the weed was likely stringy and airy but of course it could bring some effect if you smoke it.
> 
> At least you got something out of it but I doubt it was the full potential of the plant.


You are spot-on. Stringy airy buds on the chopped hermie. The rest of the crop matured fine with compact buds (but filled with seeds). It was nowhere near the potential given the early chop of the hermie, and the non-hermies focused on producing healthy seeds! Lesson learned: Pay attention to the garden.




k0ijn said:


> That sounds like quite a seed infestation, do you have segregated areas to grow?
> It's very helpful to remove hermied plants to enclosed areas quickly so they don't affect the rest of the bunch.


I have a dedicated flower room, veg room, and lung room. The dedicated lung room pisses off the wife, so I have to work on that! The minute I spotted the hermie it was chopped down and put into the drying room (not so dedicated - one of our bathrooms). The flower room was hard to inspect though, so I found the hermie after one day noticing the pistols changing color. I was careful not to carry pollen from the drying room to the flower room. I think the seeding came from the initial pollination. I sprayed the flower room after I noticed the hermie, but it was too late for most of the seeding.

I am a grower from the early seventies... just an old dog trying to learn new tricks. The seeded garden reminds me of Columbian or Mexican weed decades ago, where you had to de-seed before smoking.




k0ijn said:


> I think you are, the processes which affect and control the maturation and aging are not very well researched.
> 
> The only indicators we have are the colours really, the specific subject has never been researched properly other than by a few people.
> 
> ...


Thanks again, and you have done an excellent job of answering questions. I read a long time before the first post, trying to exercise due diligence on the change in trichome color during drying/curing (which is why I posted in this thread - relates to harvest/trichomes). In my initial search I was looking for a detailed discussion of the chemistry of the maturation process. Your point is well taken, that a lot of the research hasn't been done for legal reasons.

I suppose we are looking at a 50% probability (or greater) that the seeds carry the hermie trait. The non-hermies were noob-stressed like everything in my garden and appear stable, which *might* mean that the hermie trait was carried solely by the sex-determining chromosome of the hermie. If that trait was only on one chromosome then I suppose we are looking at a 50% probability of passing to the next generation, and if both chromosomes on the hermie carry the trait then we are looking at 100% probability that the trait will be passed to the seeds. Whether the hermie trait is expressed or not (epigenetics?) is another matter. The debate continues on whether epigenetic factors are heritable. I just don't want the trait in the gene pool, expressed or not. (Just a side comment since this thread is about trichomes and harvest, not epigenetics.)

Right now I am halfway into a colloidal silver experiment... and lots of good friends in Seattle are sending primo seeds for the next crop. I have learned so much from this site... things have progressed quite a bit since the early seventies, in spite of the lack of formal research.

Thanks again for the great thread, and thanks for moderating. I know it is a lot of work.


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## ArCaned (Dec 10, 2012)

Great thread, loads of accurate infomation here.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 10, 2012)

So, I went out to harvest the plant. I took down one of the side colas, but I didn't feel right taking the rest down.

I know everyone is saying to harvest already, but I just want to be doubly and triply sure...

I am trying to understand the plant and letting it tell me when she's ready. But as I am new, I can read her signs wrongly. That's why this community has been great and I appreciate all the sharing that happens here.

The few things I noticed that made me reconsider harvesting:

i) She's putting out even more new pistils.
ii) There seems to be more new growth on the calyxes.
iii) She's even frostier than yesterday.

I wonder if these signs are saying that she's still blooming and that this isn't her peak yet. Maybe this could be the final 100m sprint of the 400m race. What do you all think? Should I stop being silly and just harvest already? Or should I let her continue pushing?

Have a look at the flowers and discuss with me my observations...

View attachment 2437886View attachment 2437885View attachment 2437884View attachment 2437887
View attachment 2437888View attachment 2437889View attachment 2437890


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## k0ijn (Dec 10, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> Firstly, I need to apologise for the photos today. There was very little light and I could not get good shots.
> 
> She seems to be pushing out new pistils still. Does this mean I should hold back on harvesting? If not, I will harvest tomorrow morning as you suggested.
> 
> ...



It's hard to see clearly but it might be foxtailing, I would base the harvest on the "old" growth not the new growth.
So I still think you're near harvest, especially with the infestation problems.

But that doesn't mean that you cannot take the plant another 1-2 weeks if it's reacting well to the extra time.


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## k0ijn (Dec 10, 2012)

gardens said:


> You are spot-on. Stringy airy buds on the chopped hermie. The rest of the crop matured fine with compact buds (but filled with seeds). It was nowhere near the potential given the early chop of the hermie, and the non-hermies focused on producing healthy seeds! Lesson learned: Pay attention to the garden.


Alright, it behaved as I expected then.
The learning comes with experience in growing and you seem like a person who pays attention so I'm sure you'll pick it up quickly.






gardens said:


> I have a dedicated flower room, veg room, and lung room. The dedicated lung room pisses off the wife, so I have to work on that! The minute I spotted the hermie it was chopped down and put into the drying room (not so dedicated - one of our bathrooms). The flower room was hard to inspect though, so I found the hermie after one day noticing the pistols changing color. I was careful not to carry pollen from the drying room to the flower room. I think the seeding came from the initial pollination. I sprayed the flower room after I noticed the hermie, but it was too late for most of the seeding.
> 
> I am a grower from the early seventies... just an old dog trying to learn new tricks. The seeded garden reminds me of Columbian or Mexican weed decades ago, where you had to de-seed before smoking.


Well you did what you could do then, the rest was up the plants really.
Yeah I can imagine how the weed must have been back then, wonderful time in history, not so wonderful weed ^^






gardens said:


> Thanks again, and you have done an excellent job of answering questions. I read a long time before the first post, trying to exercise due diligence on the change in trichome color during drying/curing (which is why I posted in this thread - relates to harvest/trichomes). In my initial search I was looking for a detailed discussion of the chemistry of the maturation process. Your point is well taken, that a lot of the research hasn't been done for legal reasons.
> 
> I suppose we are looking at a 50% probability (or greater) that the seeds carry the hermie trait. The non-hermies were noob-stressed like everything in my garden and appear stable, which *might* mean that the hermie trait was carried solely by the sex-determining chromosome of the hermie. If that trait was only on one chromosome then I suppose we are looking at a 50% probability of passing to the next generation, and if both chromosomes on the hermie carry the trait then we are looking at 100% probability that the trait will be passed to the seeds. Whether the hermie trait is expressed or not (epigenetics?) is another matter. The debate continues on whether epigenetic factors are heritable. I just don't want the trait in the gene pool, expressed or not. (Just a side comment since this thread is about trichomes and harvest, not epigenetics.)
> 
> ...


Good to hear.
It sounds like you have experience in genetics, I'm not very knowledgeable about genetics but I agree with your assumptions.
Hermies tend to carry the trait through to seeds, which is why most people destroy any hermie and 'infected' plants in their garden.
I don't think there's much to be gotten out of growing those seeds but it might be worth it if you're lucky with the genetics.
I wouldn't waste time on them though.

Good, I'd go with those primo seeds and focus on controlling the variables.
It seems like you've already learned loads of lesson so your next grow should be much easier for you to control.
Things have progressed but we still wish there'd be a higher focus on cannabis research, it seems like most companies focus on how to take cannabinoids and distill them into a proprietary drug they can make money off of.

You're welcome, I'm glad you found it helpful


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## k0ijn (Dec 10, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> So, I went out to harvest the plant. I took down one of the side colas, but I didn't feel right taking the rest down.
> 
> I know everyone is saying to harvest already, but I just want to be doubly and triply sure...
> 
> ...



A plant will continue to grow and produce new growth. That doesn't have any say in maturity really.
That's just how a plant reacts to the light and the variables.

If you let it, the plant would keep growing and producing but you would of course lose a lot of potency due to degradation.

If you think the plant is still within a good mature state (not too many amber trichs in particular) then by all means let it go further.
The thing that concerns me most is that you've had infestation problems and the plant is rather damaged, it'd be sad if you were to lose what you have now due to further complications.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 11, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> It's hard to see clearly but it might be foxtailing, I would base the harvest on the "old" growth not the new growth.
> So I still think you're near harvest, especially with the infestation problems.
> 
> But that doesn't mean that you cannot take the plant another 1-2 weeks if it's reacting well to the extra time.


Thanks for that. Will keep the old growth in mind. Maybe I'll harvest a few sections and leave the rest to see how they go. I don't have the experience to be fully sure if she's reacting well or not. If we go by the flowering time given by Ceres, she's due between 27th December - 1st January. But I am aware that there are many factors that come into play, and the numbers don't matter as much as what the plant tells me. If only I could understand her better. 



k0ijn said:


> A plant will continue to grow and produce new growth. That doesn't have any say in maturity really.
> That's just how a plant reacts to the light and the variables.
> 
> If you let it, the plant would keep growing and producing but you would of course lose a lot of potency due to degradation.
> ...


I agree. That is my main concern. I'm trying to find a balance between letting her reach her full potential, and not losing the harvest due to complications or degradation.

I do notice that the amber trichs are concentrated on the bigger sugar leaves. The flowers are mostly cloudy with some amber. And the parts that are in the shadows (that's why I don't post trichs from those parts, because they're hard to see) are also mostly cloudy, but with some clear. I've noticed that trichome production is still active and some of them have formed clusters. Basically, there's less and less empty space.

I'm sorry I am being so particular. It's almost the end, and I want to do the best for my first plant.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 11, 2012)

Now I have another important question... I apologise in advance if this is not the right place for it, but you've been guiding me along thus far and you did mention that you've dealt with infestations before. So I'm thinking you'll have something up your sleeve to help me out with. 

I am wondering if soaking mite infested calyxes in a container of water for 5 minutes right after chopping is a good idea. Will this drown the mites and their eggs, and prevent them from causing more damage during the drying process? If not, what's a good way of getting rid of them during the harvest?

Although they aren't there in large scale anymore, I can still see them in the photos. I am worried that if I leave them there while drying, the eggs may hatch and they'll consume the drying flowers. I didn't spray neem oil for the past 3 days as I was preparing for the harvest. I also didn't hose her down with water because the last few times I did that, I don't think she was very happy with it. The neem oil helped a lot though.


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## k0ijn (Dec 11, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> Now I have another important question... I apologise in advance if this is not the right place for it, but you've been guiding me along thus far and you did mention that you've dealt with infestations before. So I'm thinking you'll have something up your sleeve to help me out with.
> 
> I am wondering if soaking mite infested calyxes in a container of water for 5 minutes right after chopping is a good idea. Will this drown the mites and their eggs, and prevent them from causing more damage during the drying process? If not, what's a good way of getting rid of them during the harvest?
> 
> Although they aren't there in large scale anymore, I can still see them in the photos. I am worried that if I leave them there while drying, the eggs may hatch and they'll consume the drying flowers. I didn't spray neem oil for the past 3 days as I was preparing for the harvest. I also didn't hose her down with water because the last few times I did that, I don't think she was very happy with it. The neem oil helped a lot though.


That's okay, it might help other people who read it.

Actually, making an H2O2 bath for freshly harvested cannabis can be useful to get rid of a lot of stuff.
Like powdery mildew and infestations.
But it's a lot easier (if we're just talking insect infestation) to spray your plants with a mixture of organic insect repellent, water & H2O2.

The bath is not really needed unless you got powdery mildew or mold (as in water curing).

But it's possible for you to do this and it will work, it's just a lot easier to spray when you haven't got mildew or mold.

Since you are thinking of letting the plant go, I would just spray vigorously with the neem oil (and maybe add some H2O2 diluted) which should clear up the infestation rather quickly.

In fact, H2O2 is probably one of the most wonderful solutions I use in growing, I don't know what I would do without it.
It's great in reservoirs, it's great for clearing infestations and helping to vitalize a solution.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 11, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> That's okay, it might help other people who read it.
> 
> Actually, making an H2O2 bath for freshly harvested cannabis can be useful to get rid of a lot of stuff.
> Like powdery mildew and infestations.
> ...


Cool... this thread has already been so helpful, so why not, eh? 

Let me clarify. I plan to harvest the bigger colas, but let the rest go on. I know from the photos that there are mites on some of the flowers. Enough for me to be concerned about, but not enough for another round of a full-on infestation. I can spray the neem oil on the remaining flowers. And H2O2 after I do more research on how. Of course, if you want to share your recipe here, I'm sure there will be no complaints. 

But I was wondering if you have a suggestion of getting rid of the mites on the flowers that I am harvesting, that won't taint the flavour and aroma. Do you think a 5 minute water soak will suffice? Someone else mentioned running it under tap water.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 11, 2012)

k0ijn, I harvest most of the plant this morning. I only left the immature flowers, and 2 colas which didn't seem as ripe yet. Thank you very much for taking the time to guide me through the flowering stage. Appreciate it very much! 

View attachment 2439250


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## k0ijn (Dec 12, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> Cool... this thread has already been so helpful, so why not, eh?
> 
> Let me clarify. I plan to harvest the bigger colas, but let the rest go on. I know from the photos that there are mites on some of the flowers. Enough for me to be concerned about, but not enough for another round of a full-on infestation. I can spray the neem oil on the remaining flowers. And H2O2 after I do more research on how. Of course, if you want to share your recipe here, I'm sure there will be no complaints.
> 
> But I was wondering if you have a suggestion of getting rid of the mites on the flowers that I am harvesting, that won't taint the flavour and aroma. Do you think a 5 minute water soak will suffice? Someone else mentioned running it under tap water.



You have to do the cleansing bath right after you've harvested, don't dry the bud first.
You should give it at least 5-10 min and then clean up the water surface (or change the water) and then rinse the plants with a hose (light pressure) afterwards.
You can do this multiple times and make sure all the insects are off but again, it's much easier to spray.




aurora stardust said:


> k0ijn, I harvest most of the plant this morning. I only left the immature flowers, and 2 colas which didn't seem as ripe yet. Thank you very much for taking the time to guide me through the flowering stage. Appreciate it very much!
> 
> View attachment 2439250



Congratulations on the harvest and you're welcome 

You should make some holes in that box though, make sure you've got proper ventilation & air circulation.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 12, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> You have to do the cleansing bath right after you've harvested, don't dry the bud first.
> You should give it at least 5-10 min and then clean up the water surface (or change the water) and then rinse the plants with a hose (light pressure) afterwards.
> You can do this multiple times and make sure all the insects are off but again, it's much easier to spray.
> Congratulations on the harvest and you're welcome
> ...


Thanks! 

I did shower the whole harvest, bit by bit, to try and get rid of the mites as much as possible. Then I let it dry up in the open for an hour before putting them into the drying box.

I do have holes in the box, at the upper sides and lower sides. You can see from the photo. I didn't want to make the holes too big so that less light will enter. The holes are big enough to comfortable thread the wicks through. I used a small screwdriver to make the holes. Have a look at the photo again. You can see the holes on the upper sides. If you feel that i should make either more similar sized holes, or make the holes bigger, let me know.


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## k0ijn (Dec 12, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> Thanks!
> 
> I did shower the whole harvest, bit by bit, to try and get rid of the mites as much as possible. Then I let it dry up in the open for an hour before putting them into the drying box.
> 
> I do have holes in the box, at the upper sides and lower sides. You can see from the photo. I didn't want to make the holes too big so that less light will enter. The holes are big enough to comfortable thread the wicks through. I used a small screwdriver to make the holes. Have a look at the photo again. You can see the holes on the upper sides. If you feel that i should make either more similar sized holes, or make the holes bigger, let me know.


I meant big holes, not drill holes, as in cut out rectangular 4-5 inch long holes on both sides of the box so the air can be moved around in the box. 
If you have problem with light then use a drying room or set up a drying room, you should never dry near light.
You should also have air circulation (use a fan or the like) and make sure you've got the RH under control.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 12, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> I meant big holes, not drill holes, as in cut out rectangular 4-5 inch long holes on both sides of the box so the air can be moved around in the box.
> If you have problem with light then use a drying room or set up a drying room, you should never dry near light.
> You should also have air circulation (use a fan or the like) and make sure you've got the RH under control.


Okay, understood. The box is currently in my room. I thought the small holes would be enough to allow air to flow and ventilation to exist. My room has a ceiling fan, which I only use at low, just to get air to circulate in my room. A gentle breeze.

RH in the box is currently high, in the mid-80s.

Here's what it looks like after about 20 hours in the box:


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## k0ijn (Dec 14, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> Okay, understood. The box is currently in my room. I thought the small holes would be enough to allow air to flow and ventilation to exist. My room has a ceiling fan, which I only use at low, just to get air to circulate in my room. A gentle breeze.
> 
> RH in the box is currently high, in the mid-80s.
> 
> ...



Okay but you will need bigger holes. It's the reason why most people hang it on drying lines or don't use a box but just string.
The RH is way too high in that box if it's in the mid 80s.
Mold can easily develop, you should be really careful.

You want around 45-55% RH in a drying room.

If you can, put up some string and hang them there or make huge holes in that box, otherwise the weed will get damaged by the high RH.


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## aurora stardust (Dec 16, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Okay but you will need bigger holes. It's the reason why most people hang it on drying lines or don't use a box but just string.
> The RH is way too high in that box if it's in the mid 80s.
> Mold can easily develop, you should be really careful.
> 
> ...


Thanks k0ijn. The initial high humidity was due to the harvest being fresh. The humidity has been dropping steadily every day, and now it's about the low 60s in the day time and high 60s in the night. It's pretty much the same as the rest of the room at the moment. I think this means it's almost ready for curing. I didn't get huge colas, so the drying time I assume would not take as long. Not that I'm rushing, I'm more than happy to just let them keep hanging there.


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## TheEvilBanana (Dec 17, 2012)

Yet another well articulated and scientifically supported post by K0ijn. +rep. 

I have 18 bananarama (sativa dominant hybrid) in flower now. 65 days from pre-flowers will be Christmas Day. Merry Christmas to me best present I could have asked for... Though it won't be till atleast the end of Jan till I'm smoking them.

I'm utilizing a 40x loop, 60-100x microscope, and my 16.4 MP digital camera to keep an eye on my trichs. I would say I'm about 40/60 clear/cloudy right now. No sign of ambers yet. At first sign of amber trichs I plan to harvest thanks to the info provided in this thread. I will upload some pics later when I get home. 

Side note to k0ijn: 
thank you for your scientific approach to growing and your willingness to share your research with the RIU community. I know scientific research regarding floral biology in cannibis is not always easy to find. And as an attorney in CA I'm not easily swayed by opinions and suggestions. I look for facts and utilize analytical reasoning when it comes to my grow, thus I've found many of your posts to be insightful and helpful.

Recently I've been arguing with my wife over the pre-harvest flush and 48 hour dark before harvest because one of her friends told her we would have chemical tasting buds without it. And she's worried about me ruining the whole run by not flushing. I keep telling her they are stoner myths that science does not support and that taste comes from a good/slow dry and cure. And thanks to one of your post regarding pre-harvest flush I was able to convince her otherwise by utilizing the scientifically sound reasoning you provided. (Namely storage in leafs and mobile and immobile nutes needed for metobiloc processes within the plant which when taken into consideration tells you flushing is clearly not good for the plants especially at the point of peak production.) Thanks!

I will not be flushing. So I've ran a low EC throughout flower with a weekly flush before res-change to cut back on any salt build up since I use veg+bloom 1 part powder nutes.


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## k0ijn (Dec 17, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> Thanks k0ijn. The initial high humidity was due to the harvest being fresh. The humidity has been dropping steadily every day, and now it's about the low 60s in the day time and high 60s in the night. It's pretty much the same as the rest of the room at the moment. I think this means it's almost ready for curing. I didn't get huge colas, so the drying time I assume would not take as long. Not that I'm rushing, I'm more than happy to just let them keep hanging there.


Alright, well it sounds like the weed escaped the mold danger.
I hope it's all still going to plan.


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## k0ijn (Dec 17, 2012)

TheEvilBanana said:


> Yet another well articulated and scientifically supported post by K0ijn. +rep.
> 
> I have 18 bananarama (sativa dominant hybrid) in flower now. 65 days from pre-flowers will be Christmas Day. Merry Christmas to me best present I could have asked for... Though it won't be till atleast the end of Jan till I'm smoking them.
> 
> ...


Thank you very much for your kind words.
Sounds like you got a proper Sativa grow going, I'm getting a bit jealous (my new tent grow is getting setup over the holiday).

Sounds like you've got the grow under control, with 60/40 you still got a bit of a journey left on those calyxes, but it shouldn't be too long.

Flattering words again, though I must stress that it's not my personal research, I'm not equipped nor knowledgeable enough to perform proper molecular scientific research. 
I do get what you meant though, it is my research and my own writing but some people like to twist words and take things out of context, so to put those troglodytes down in advance, I felt it must be mentioned.
But I do take my time to sniff out and attain proper scientifically backed research which I base most of my writing on.
I try to focus on the science as much as possible and I hope it shows in my work.

It is indeed very hard to find the proper peer reviewed research, which might be why many people simply choose to make theories up on the spot or cling on to age old disproved myths.
I can tell that you do a fair amount of critical & analytic thinking, it comes across in your posts, it's the kind of posts I enjoy reading and replying to the most, I always feel both parties get most out of it if they both exercise proper reasoning and presentation.
I'm glad you find my posts helpful, some people take offense to my writing and others wave it off as scientific wishful thinking (which is kind of ironic), so it's satisfying to see that people actually do get something from my (horrendously) long posts.

You're welcome, I'm glad you convinced the missus, it would be a shame to cause a deficiency and possibly lower the potential yield and effect of the final product of your harvest.
It's honestly heartwarming to know that my reasoning actually promoted scientific understanding, I couldn't ask for more. 
Now just don't mess up the dry & cure or I will get a bollocking 


I wish you all the best with your grow, don't hesitate to ask if you have questions, and thank you once again for your kind words


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## roachfinder (Dec 17, 2012)

how powerfull of a magnifying glass or micoscope do you need?


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## aurora stardust (Dec 18, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Alright, well it sounds like the weed escaped the mold danger.
> I hope it's all still going to plan.



I think it is... Since it's so humid here (60-82%, with temperatures of 26-32C), I think I might let it dry 8-10 days without it getting too dry for curing. That's another 1-3 days more. What do you think? Is that too much or should I let it dry even longer?


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## Purpsdro420 (Dec 20, 2012)

Hey guys. This is my first grow and I'm close to harvest most pistols have turned red and orange and some of the leaves are yellowing and falling off. I have a scope and to me they look mostly milky with a few amber but I'm only on day 50. My grower friend who I got the strain from( black domina) says it should take about 60-65 days I have pictures of the plant and the trics. Just need a more experienced growers opinion


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## Purpsdro420 (Dec 20, 2012)

Here's a few more pics of the trics


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## AmIhighYet (Dec 21, 2012)

would appreciate your input. 4th crop using CFL and a bit of window light a couple of hours a day. think I have been harvesting a bit early. I've actually extended this one 2 weeks longer than I have been.


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## k0ijn (Dec 22, 2012)

roachfinder said:


> how powerfull of a magnifying glass or micoscope do you need?


60x-100x is best.


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## k0ijn (Dec 22, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> I think it is... Since it's so humid here (60-82%, with temperatures of 26-32C), I think I might let it dry 8-10 days without it getting too dry for curing. That's another 1-3 days more. What do you think? Is that too much or should I let it dry even longer?


I assume you've already completed the dry since it's been 4 days since the post you made.
But since you have such high RH levels I would let it dry longer than most, you need to be sure that the buds hover around 60-65% RH so you get a proper cure and also eliminate the chances of mold developing.


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## k0ijn (Dec 22, 2012)

Purpsdro420 said:


> Hey guys. This is my first grow and I'm close to harvest most pistols have turned red and orange and some of the leaves are yellowing and falling off. I have a scope and to me they look mostly milky with a few amber but I'm only on day 50. My grower friend who I got the strain from( black domina) says it should take about 60-65 days I have pictures of the plant and the trics. Just need a more experienced growers opinion


I see quite a few clear trichomes, a few amber and a few cloudy.
I would estimate anything from 2 weeks - 3 weeks left.
Don't go with what the seed guy says, no plant follows a prescribed grow period.
You should always judge the plant and go by what the plant tells you (read first post of the thread for info).


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## k0ijn (Dec 22, 2012)

AmIhighYet said:


> would appreciate your input. 4th crop using CFL and a bit of window light a couple of hours a day. think I have been harvesting a bit early. I've actually extended this one 2 weeks longer than I have been.View attachment 2450879View attachment 2450885


It's very hard to see anything in those pictures.
Too light magnification to see trichomes and too high magnification (centering) to see the calyxes as a whole.
Of what I can see it looks like you might have some foxtailing, could you possibly take some sections pictures (calyxes top & bottom full view) and some overall plant pictures?


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## aurora stardust (Dec 25, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> I assume you've already completed the dry since it's been 4 days since the post you made.
> But since you have such high RH levels I would let it dry longer than most, you need to be sure that the buds hover around 60-65% RH so you get a proper cure and also eliminate the chances of mold developing.


Yes, I have. I didn't want to let them get too dry before the cure. They are now curing in a few glass jars. Love having a whiff each time I air the jars. The harvest was a very light 31g dry.  Everything else is wonderful though. Aroma, flavour, smoothness, and potency.


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## roachfinder (Dec 25, 2012)

ok I just got a microscope, and i took a leap torwards th top and i saw a bunch of clear trichomes, and a bunch a amber trichomes everywhere but no cloudy trichomes. just mostly clear ones. does anyone know whats going on?? oh yea there are still a decent amount of whit pistols...but the calyxes are kinda big too...


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## roachfinder (Dec 25, 2012)

leaf torwards the top*


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## roachfinder (Dec 26, 2012)

how much longer for the first plant. its about 10 weeks into flowering. there are a decent amount of amber trichs and clear and cloudy ones


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## k0ijn (Dec 26, 2012)

aurora stardust said:


> Yes, I have. I didn't want to let them get too dry before the cure. They are now curing in a few glass jars. Love having a whiff each time I air the jars. The harvest was a very light 31g dry.  Everything else is wonderful though. Aroma, flavour, smoothness, and potency.


Good to hear that it's all going well, it's a fair amount for a first harvest I'd say.
Especially since the harvest, dry and cure is done properly so you will get the full effect of the strain.


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## k0ijn (Dec 26, 2012)

roachfinder said:


> ok I just got a microscope, and i took a leap torwards th top and i saw a bunch of clear trichomes, and a bunch a amber trichomes everywhere but no cloudy trichomes. just mostly clear ones. does anyone know whats going on?? oh yea there are still a decent amount of whit pistols...but the calyxes are kinda big too...


What light did you grow this under?
I'm sorry but the plants looks very airy in the first, third and fourth pictures, I can hardly see any calyxes apart from the main calyx on the 2nd picture, everything else looks like bunches of pistil groups.

If it's been flowering for 10 weeks then it is all you're going to get, I'm afraid there's no way of correcting the end result.
You might get some weed out of the plant in the second picture but it looks like the plants are under stress and with the trichomes being like you've said I don't think you'll get much out of the weed.


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## Guitar Man (Dec 27, 2012)

This is an excellent Thread! I've done enough research on growing MJ, that my fingers have almost fallen off from typing! LOL Your approach, detailed information, and advice are balanced to give a grower an optimum harvest. The 3 girls in my grow are about to come down, so I decided to do a "Refresher" and found your great Thread on the subject of Trichomes.

I'm not a long time grower, but I'm very quick to learn and do things right the first time. My first grow did have some challenges, but the finished product blew people away! My wife gave me an A++ and she says this current grow is even better!

I'm sure you have covered this subject, but proper light penetration is critical for good Trichome/Bud development. Indoor grows suffer from lack of light because of space limitation, and making sure that as many buds as possible receive adequate light is crucial for a solid, potent grow. This is the main reason you see weak or struggling buds on the lower branches, and, poor light can cause a plant to mature in a very uneven fashion.

Ive also noticed that my eyes are becoming familiar with how a plant looks before harvest, without the use of a magnifying glass. Like you and others have mentioned, there are more signs that a plant is ready besides just the tint of the Trichs. Strain, color of leaves, swollen calyxes are just some of the other things to watch.

Maybe you could say something about this one thing Ive noticed; water absorption begins to decrease towards the end of a plants cycle.


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## k0ijn (Dec 28, 2012)

Guitar Man said:


> This is an excellent Thread! I've done enough research on growing MJ, that my fingers have almost fallen off from typing! LOL Your approach, detailed information, and advice are balanced to give a grower an optimum harvest. The 3 girls in my grow are about to come down, so I decided to do a "Refresher" and found your great Thread on the subject of Trichomes.
> 
> I'm not a long time grower, but I'm very quick to learn and do things right the first time. My first grow did have some challenges, but the finished product blew people away! My wife gave me an A++ and she says this current grow is even better!
> 
> ...


I'm glad you found it helpful 

Hopefully your next harvest will be even better than the previous!

I'm not sure exactly what you mean about the decrease in water absorption. 
I haven't spotted this myself, in fact my plants usually get more 'hungry' the older they get.


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## TheEvilBanana (Dec 30, 2012)

Here's those pics I promised like a week ago......! The forum resized them so you can't see the trichomes as well as I would have liked but let me know what you think. I think they're ready.
 Lights on.
 Lights off.


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## VLRD.Kush (Dec 31, 2012)

TheEvilBanana said:


> Here's those pics I promised like a week ago......! The forum resized them so you can't see the trichomes as well as I would have liked but let me know what you think. I think they're ready.
> View attachment 2460926View attachment 2460929 Lights on.
> View attachment 2460928 Lights off.


how long have you been flowering? still looks like they got a bit of weight to pack on


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## TheEvilBanana (Dec 31, 2012)

They are at 70 days in flower. It is a sativa dominant strain so I guess 70 isn't too bad. But ya how long do you think? These pics are lower branch buds because pics of top colas always seem to come out blurred when I try to use them to look at the trichs. But ya I'm starting to see amber trichs on the leaves so I figured its gotta be close... Thanks for your insight as this is my first grow and I'd hate to harvest prematurely.


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## k0ijn (Dec 31, 2012)

TheEvilBanana said:


> Here's those pics I promised like a week ago......! The forum resized them so you can't see the trichomes as well as I would have liked but let me know what you think. I think they're ready.
> View attachment 2460926View attachment 2460929 Lights on.
> View attachment 2460928 Lights off.


Your plants look healthy but I don't think they're quite there yet.
How many amber trichomes would you guesstimate? 

Based on the pictures and info I'd say about 1-2 weeks left.
But some of the pictures look a bit like foxtailing which might mean you're closer to peak harvest than 1-2 weeks.

You should be very happy with the result so far, it seems like you've grown the plant properly, with proper amount of nutrients and under proper conditions.


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## TheEvilBanana (Dec 31, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Your plants look healthy but I don't think they're quite there yet.
> How many amber trichomes would you guesstimate?
> 
> Based on the pictures and info I'd say about 1-2 weeks left.
> ...


Thanks K0ijn. I think I may have bit off a little more than I could chew with 18 plants for this first timer but it seems like they are doing well. I'd estimate around 1-5% amber, 70-80% cloudy and somewhere around 15% clear. I'm very happy with the results so far but the true test will come when I'm able to enjoy the finished product. I've ordered a couple of the western caliber III hygrometers to use after drying so hopefully my cure turns out well! 

Here's some pics of the canopy rather than close ups of the trichomes.
View attachment 2461453lights on 
View attachment 2461454View attachment 2461456lights off


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## k0ijn (Dec 31, 2012)

TheEvilBanana said:


> Thanks K0ijn. I think I may have bit off a little more than I could chew with 18 plants for this first timer but it seems like they are doing well. I'd estimate around 1-5% amber, 70-80% cloudy and somewhere around 15% clear. I'm very happy with the results so far but the true test will come when I'm able to enjoy the finished product. I've ordered a couple of the western caliber III hygrometers to use after drying so hopefully my cure turns out well!
> 
> Here's some pics of the canopy rather than close ups of the trichomes.
> View attachment 2461453lights on
> View attachment 2461454View attachment 2461456lights off



You're welcome 
Tbh it doesn't look like you've bitten off more than you could chew.
With the pictures you just posted I can honestly say I'm impressed, you should be very proud of what you've achieved.

The calyxes look very good and swollen but with the numbers you've given me about the trichomes I'd still hold fast.
The plants could use 1-2 weeks more, to let them fully bloom, trust me it'll be worth it.

You're going to get a great harvest, just make sure you've got drying & curing under control.

For someone who hasn't grown a lot you're doing really well.
It's actually one of the finest 'amateur' grows I've ever seen. 

It seems like the scientific and analytic approach is doing you very good


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## aurora stardust (Dec 31, 2012)

k0ijn said:


> Good to hear that it's all going well, it's a fair amount for a first harvest I'd say.
> Especially since the harvest, dry and cure is done properly so you will get the full effect of the strain.


Thanks again k0ijn. The information you've put together, as well as the advice you gave, were very helpful for the flowering period. I want you to know how truly appreciative I am. Your kind words about my humble first grow are also very encouraging. 

I will be curing for a while. Every day when I air the jars, the aromas seem to become more intricate, more complex. It's thrilling to say the least...


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## Guitar Man (Jan 1, 2013)

k0ijn said:


> I'm glad you found it helpful
> 
> Hopefully your next harvest will be even better than the previous!
> 
> ...


In the research I did, I found where some said that MJ will not use as much water towards the end of its life. In both of my grows, when the leaves turned yellow and the plant was winding down for harvest, I did not have to water my plant as often. I recorded every watering cycle throughout both grows, and water consumption decreased before chop, chop. In fact, this is 1 of the last signs I look for before cutting.


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## leadtrimmer1 (Jan 4, 2013)

Although it doesn't make as big as a difference as Sativa V Indica, amber trichomes actually do add to the more sedative high. CBN is psychoactive and it's what gives most of sedation of the high. It DOES help with anti-inflammatory too. CBD gives the pain relieving and all that good stuff. It wouldn't make a HUGE difference really, but it would definitely help.


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## k0ijn (Jan 5, 2013)

leadtrimmer1 said:


> Although it doesn't make as big as a difference as Sativa V Indica, amber trichomes actually do add to the more sedative high. CBN is psychoactive and it's what gives most of sedation of the high. It DOES help with anti-inflammatory too. CBD gives the pain relieving and all that good stuff. It wouldn't make a HUGE difference really, but it would definitely help.


Well I'm sorry, but there's no proof of that being true.
CBN is 90-260% less psychoactive than THC, the exact number is not know for sure but it's somewhere between those two numbers.
THC is also sedative. As are most other cannabinoids.

To say CBN is what gives most of sedation of the high is ridiculous. Because it's so much less psychoactive than THC which itself has sedative properties.
And many other cannabinoids affect the high much more so than CBN (since most experienced growers don't let their plants attain a high number of amber trichomes (CBN)).
CBD is not the only cannabinoid which is analgesic. THC is also analgesic, as is CBG.

It sounds a bit like you're grasping at straws trying to prove an irrelevant (and wrong) point.


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## k0ijn (Jan 5, 2013)

Guitar Man said:


> In the research I did, I found where some said that MJ will not use as much water towards the end of its life. In both of my grows, when the leaves turned yellow and the plant was winding down for harvest, I did not have to water my plant as often. I recorded every watering cycle throughout both grows, and water consumption decreased before chop, chop. In fact, this is 1 of the last signs I look for before cutting.


Well if you let the leaves turn yellow (invoke a deficiency basically) then of course the plant wouldn't require as much feeding, since parts of it has died (or is in the process of feeding on itself).
If you don't cause a deficiency then your plant will still require the same (maybe even greater) amount of feeding throughout flowering.


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## shadeforlife (Jan 8, 2013)

Very nicely said, but aren't you supposed to harvest indica when it's mostly amber and sative when it's mostly cloudy? Someone told me sativa is ready to harvest when it's 80% Cloudy and 20% amber and indica when it's 3/4 amber and 1/4 cloudy. He told me both of his indica strains are cloudy from the start.
(Short rider and some cheese strain)


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## TheEvilBanana (Jan 8, 2013)

shadeforlife said:


> Very nicely said, but aren't you supposed to harvest indica when it's mostly amber and sative when it's mostly cloudy? Someone told me sativa is ready to harvest when it's 80% Cloudy and 20% amber and indica when it's 3/4 amber and 1/4 cloudy. He told me both of his indica strains are cloudy from the start.
> (Short rider and some cheese strain)


Hey shadeforlife. I think that's the point if the thread. There is a lot of misinformation about the best time to harvest, specifically in this post, utilizing trichomes to know when to harvest. k0ijn makes the point that despite what you've been told. The best time to harvest is with the highest percentage of cloudy trichomes because that is when the THC is most potent. Amber trichomes means they have degraded from their most potent form. Therefore indica or sativa would not matter. You just want the highest percentage of cloudy trichomes though indicas will most often reach that point sooner than sativas. Which may have led to the myth that you want more amber trichomes in indicas.


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## shadeforlife (Jan 8, 2013)

Oh ok, thanks for the advice... TheEvilBanana? lol awesome name xP That makes sense though.


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## roachfinder (Jan 12, 2013)

hey i got my internet turned off the other day and since then I harvested. but before i did i had it in the dark for about 50-51 hours. what exactly does it do for the bud and trichomes???


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## Trousers (Jan 14, 2013)

OP
Thanks for the actual information with something to back it up.


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## yesum (Jan 14, 2013)

k0ijn said:


> Well I'm sorry, but there's no proof of that being true.
> CBN is 90-260% less psychoactive than THC, the exact number is not know for sure but it's somewhere between those two numbers.
> THC is also sedative. As are most other cannabinoids.
> 
> ...


 Well whatever does it, more amber equals more sedative for me.

I find if I get quite a few amber( 10 to 20%), then if I look elsewhere on the buds I can still find quite a few clear. So letting some amber does not make for less cloudy trichs than not letting them amber up.
If I were to chop at first sign of amber or even before that would make for a lot of clear trichs. Also, I do not like the high of earlier chopped buds.


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## charles0011 (Jan 14, 2013)

This may be a bit off toppic. I am growing AK-48 along with Blue mistic. I am in my 7th week into flowerering. The tops are almost ready for harvest. Can I cut the top part of the plant and keep growing the bottom part of the plant. I am growing in soil and the girls are under a 400w light. The bottom half of my girls are just starting to get signs of the trichomes and the pistals are no ware showing signs of changing color the are still white and are starting to grow very well and filling out. I rased all the shorter plants up to the hight of my larger plants and have removed all the larger leaves for more light and have been feeding molasses the last week. any imput bwould be welcomed


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## chrisd0301 (Jan 15, 2013)

do u think these are ready? I am kind of monitoring them remotely (confusing story) and havent gotten a chance to go check on them but these are the pix i just had sent to me. they are at 9 weeks if you include the week for transition.thanks for your advice


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## mike.hotel (Jan 16, 2013)

Great guide. Thank you.


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## k0ijn (Jan 16, 2013)

yesum said:


> Well whatever does it, more amber equals more sedative for me.
> 
> I find if I get quite a few amber( 10 to 20%), then if I look elsewhere on the buds I can still find quite a few clear. So letting some amber does not make for less cloudy trichs than not letting them amber up.
> If I were to chop at first sign of amber or even before that would make for a lot of clear trichs. Also, I do not like the high of earlier chopped buds.


Have you grown pure Sativas and pure Indicas?

The phenotype determines the high, not the trichomes (when we're talking energetic high vs. couch-lock high).

Nobody has said anything about chopping @ first sign of amber, nor has anyone said you should do that and nobody likes early harvested buds.
It seems like you've misunderstood the point.


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## Calismoker24 (Jan 16, 2013)

Good post this is the only way to havrest. I always look through a scope its the surefire way to get good product


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## Canna Connoiseur (Jan 16, 2013)

Cloudy trichromes = THC


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## nobby1000 (Jan 16, 2013)

FrostyTheBudMan said:


> Looks like time, got a chance to check this morning and seeing amber! Darkness for two days then chop chop, so close I can taste it now!
> View attachment 2102387


 how long do you think this og has left,it's day55 just starting to see visible tricomes with naked eye but havnt a microscope,please help


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## Richie Bud (Jan 19, 2013)

they are mostly clear I would leave it for another few weeks wait for as much cloudy as possible 80 to 90% cloudy trichomes is peak time to harvest
I have 4 Dinafem Moby Dick a month in to flowering they are looking great I would highly recommend this strain to any one who wants huge harvests with minimum effort I have them under 750 wats of red spectrum CFL They will be ready early march


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## chrisd0301 (Jan 19, 2013)

Anyone have any tips on this one? Cant quite determine how much longer to go


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## BrianR (Jan 20, 2013)

Thank you for your information. sounds like a lot of things in life, personal prefrence. I tend to count down the nutes really close to the end...say 3-4 days before the harvest only cause i seem to think that a good flush at the end is a bit refreshing. But then again 3-4-5 days before harvest is only one watering anyway so i guess i'm just as bad as everybody else. Good to know I dont have to cause I thought I was being a rebel.


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## Richie Bud (Jan 21, 2013)

great thread really helpfull as a lot of people think that the more amber the better Not so the more milky the better I am growing Dinafem Moby Dick at the mo using 600 wats cfl they are a month into bud and are looking great really swelling up I will need to support the lower branches soon as the weight of the buds can bend the branches my last grow of moby I got around 3 ounces dry off each plant this grow looks even better as I used the best girl as the Mammy plant she made a great clone giver Wlii post pics soon


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## chillyb (Jan 27, 2013)

Excellent thread kOjin?? I'm working with limited space. Have 2 unknown strains just about finished grown in a tent. Unfortunately, I didn't pre flower properly, with 3 plants, 2 were nice and green, etc, 3rd stunted and just not good. I think that was the male that I didn't get out in time. So now, both plants have beautiful bud sites, pistils, etc, but alas, they also have seeds. So I have a 100x carson, and from what I can tell, they're both starting to show a lil milkyness. lol But, I haven't done a full top to bottom on both, so I'm concerned the tops need to be harvested now, and if after checking the bottom halves, they're still clear, should I just go ahead and do a full harvest. Ideally, I was going to use a cardboard box with string in a closet to hang the milky ones, and let the rest turn as well. 

But as stated I think I'm just going to use the tent for a total harvest due to odor control and space. I've been flushing with Clearex the past 2 wks, 1 plant every 2-3 days to control humidity. And every time I do, the pistils stand on end and the buds take on a nice color. 

Thanks for all the great info here, sub'd and will continue to follow your threads.

Further background info:
250 HPS
Botanicare Readygro Aeration 
2 lb grow bags
Nutes: Veg: Biobizz Grow - Bloom: Combination of Biobizz Grow/Bloom/Top Maxx for first month, then rotated some H&G Budswell, I think.

Thanks again for any feedback/knowledge!

Chillyb


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## k0ijn (Jan 31, 2013)

chillyb said:


> Excellent thread kOjin?? I'm working with limited space. Have 2 unknown strains just about finished grown in a tent. Unfortunately, I didn't pre flower properly, with 3 plants, 2 were nice and green, etc, 3rd stunted and just not good. I think that was the male that I didn't get out in time. So now, both plants have beautiful bud sites, pistils, etc, but alas, they also have seeds. So I have a 100x carson, and from what I can tell, they're both starting to show a lil milkyness. lol But, I haven't done a full top to bottom on both, so I'm concerned the tops need to be harvested now, and if after checking the bottom halves, they're still clear, should I just go ahead and do a full harvest. Ideally, I was going to use a cardboard box with string in a closet to hang the milky ones, and let the rest turn as well.


Are you saying you have/had males in your garden? 
Follow the percentages I've posted in the first post of this thread and you'll do fine.
Be sure to keep the other pointers in mind as well.
If you want more precise advice, post some pictures.


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## k0ijn (Jan 31, 2013)

charles0011 said:


> This may be a bit off toppic. I am growing AK-48 along with Blue mistic. I am in my 7th week into flowerering. The tops are almost ready for harvest. Can I cut the top part of the plant and keep growing the bottom part of the plant. I am growing in soil and the girls are under a 400w light. The bottom half of my girls are just starting to get signs of the trichomes and the pistals are no ware showing signs of changing color the are still white and are starting to grow very well and filling out. I rased all the shorter plants up to the hight of my larger plants and have removed all the larger leaves for more light and have been feeding molasses the last week. any imput bwould be welcomed


It depends on how your plants are looking really.
It's doable but it's hard to tell without seeing the plant(s).
The bottom flower nodes might not even be worth growing out, I don't know, because I can't see your plant(s).

You should not remove fan leaves though.


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## drew425 (Feb 1, 2013)

The description of when to harvest due to the trichome color seems pretty simple. I got a small microscope that has from 60x to 100x magnification. But due to my high anxiety levels at times my hands shake a lot and I can't keep steady long enough to view the trichs. Would it work if I just took one of the upper leafs off so I can put it on a table and keep my hand steady? Or do I have to view the whole flower on the plant? From what I can see most of them are cloudy. Thanks

Heres a few pics but im sure you can't tell from these. A lot of the hairs have receded back into the flower. There are a few smaller white ones that haven't


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## bellcore (Feb 2, 2013)

Hi, Any advice on the color on my trichomes? I apologize on the focus and the lighting.....$6 iphone 60x lighted microscope from ebay and poor photo skills. Thanks


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## Dendrophilly (Feb 5, 2013)

Do the trichomes inside of the buds mature more slowly? Do the trichs on the outside of the bud represent a small portion of the totally trichome count, or is it a fair judge for all trichomes on the plant?


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## chrisd0301 (Feb 6, 2013)

koijn can u give me some pointers on these. cant decide whether or not its time


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## k0ijn (Feb 8, 2013)

drew425 said:


> The description of when to harvest due to the trichome color seems pretty simple. I got a small microscope that has from 60x to 100x magnification. But due to my high anxiety levels at times my hands shake a lot and I can't keep steady long enough to view the trichs. Would it work if I just took one of the upper leafs off so I can put it on a table and keep my hand steady? Or do I have to view the whole flower on the plant? From what I can see most of them are cloudy. Thanks
> 
> Heres a few pics but im sure you can't tell from these. A lot of the hairs have receded back into the flower. There are a few smaller white ones that haven't
> 
> View attachment 2506322View attachment 2506323


You should just make sure you look at trichomes from all over the plant so you get a proper average.
If you do not own a high res digital camera or any other way of looking at trichomes then yes I'd say you should just cut off some tips of the leaves so you can look at that thoroughly.

The calyxes look good, just try to get a proper feel for the trichomes and you should do fine!


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## k0ijn (Feb 8, 2013)

bellcore said:


> Hi, Any advice on the color on my trichomes? I apologize on the focus and the lighting.....$6 iphone 60x lighted microscope from ebay and poor photo skills. View attachment 2507639View attachment 2507640View attachment 2507641Thanks



Clear trichomes, still has a while to go.




Dendrophilly said:


> Do the trichomes inside of the buds mature more slowly? Do the trichs on the outside of the bud represent a small portion of the totally trichome count, or is it a fair judge for all trichomes on the plant?


I'm not sure what you mean exactly.
Trichomes do not grow inside buds.
Usually trichomes on lower calyx sections mature and appear slower than the upper calyxes.
But in general you should be able to get a feel for the overall state of the trichomes by look at a few calyxes.




chrisd0301 said:


> koijn can u give me some pointers on these. cant decide whether or not its time


While not knowing how the trichomes are doing I would just comment on what is visible.
The calyxes look nice and swollen, the pistils have receded and the tinge of the calyxes look very nice.
I would say you are very close to harvest.

It also seems like you have foxtailing going on, which could be an indication of stress.
I wouldn't let the plant go for much longer.


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## loudpackfarmer (Feb 11, 2013)

About to make my first harvest, just wanted some advice on when to chop. Was planning on harvesting tomorrow morning, anyone have any objections? Here are a couple of pics...


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## drew425 (Feb 11, 2013)

loudpackfarmer said:


> About to make my first harvest, just wanted some advice on when to chop. Was planning on harvesting tomorrow morning, anyone have any objections? Here are a couple of pics...
> View attachment 2520566View attachment 2520567


Just from those pics id wait longer. Are those main colas? Were you able to check trichome color with a microscope? How far along are you in flower?


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## loudpackfarmer (Feb 13, 2013)

Yes those are the top two colas, we kept it small due to limited space. Through veg we honestly didn't have enough light on them but the buds look like they're doing nice. We have about 350 watts on the two plants now. But no we don't have a microscope I figured I could look at the buds and tell when they were done. We're about 6 1/2 weeks into flower.


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## drew425 (Feb 14, 2013)

loudpackfarmer said:


> Yes those are the top two colas, we kept it small due to limited space. Through veg we honestly didn't have enough light on them but the buds look like they're doing nice. We have about 350 watts on the two plants now. But no we don't have a microscope I figured I could look at the buds and tell when they were done. We're about 6 1/2 weeks into flower.


Id say your about 2 weeks away. For almost any strain I would wait at least 60-65 days. I've been taking advice from a seasoned grower and he said anytime he cut before 60 days it affected potency and his overall yield


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## Toneloke619 (Feb 20, 2013)

so this is my first gro and it soo close to harvest I can taste it! I need your help since I am a "noob". I am wondering if it is time to harvest! I have pictures and will show you  any input as fast as possible would be great! I am thinking with the milky trics and orange pistles with the things that I have readit is time. my cousin wants to say we keep flowering help us! thank you in advance!! keep on growin keep on smoking!


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## drew425 (Feb 20, 2013)

Toneloke619 said:


> so this is my first gro and it soo close to harvest I can taste it! I need your help since I am a "noob". I am wondering if it is time to harvest! I have pictures and will show you View attachment 2534854View attachment 2534855View attachment 2534856 any input as fast as possible would be great! I am thinking with the milky trics and orange pistles with the things that I have readit is time. my cousin wants to say we keep flowering help us! thank you in advance!! keep on growin keep on smoking!


How many days are you into flower?


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## graydrake (Mar 8, 2013)

Hello all

I just wanted to know what you thought about the readiness of this girl?


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## KINGJOHNC (Mar 12, 2013)

interesting information


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## Hugo Phurst (Mar 12, 2013)

To the last three sets of pics.

NO!!! You're nowhere near done. Way too many white hairs, and the trichs are all clear.

When your plants look like this you've still got days, if not a week left. And I'm going crazy waiting.

View attachment 2565254View attachment 2565256View attachment 2565260View attachment 2565257View attachment 2565259View attachment 2565261View attachment 2565262View attachment 2565264View attachment 2565266


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## hpyhgryslpy (Mar 14, 2013)

Great thread koijn, I've learned so much! I have a few girls that have been flowering 56 days this Saturday. Strain is hogs breath, indica hybrid. Soil grow, fox farms nutes, 1k watt cfl's, small dresser grow 30"x16"x42". They look amazing and at times I think they're ready but I don't want to rush. Both are from seed, veged 13 weeks. I'm having difficulty distinguishing between clear and milky trichs. Your expertise is greatly appreciated.


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## hpyhgryslpy (Mar 14, 2013)

Great thread koijn, I've learned so much! I have a few girls that have been flowering 56 days this Saturday. Strain is hogs breath, indica hybrid. Soil grow, fox farms nutes, 1k watt cfl's, small dresser grow 32"x16"x42". Trichs are clear and milky, I'd say 40/60 ratio. New pistils have appeared over night and calyx are swollen. This is an 8 week flowering plant and the new pistils threw me for a loop. Buds don't look ready, pistils have not recened fully but I expected these girls to be ready fairly soon. Any advice? I'll post pics shortly, I'm new to this forum and not sure how to upload my pics yet..


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## bullwinkle60 (Mar 14, 2013)

I'd wait for another week. I never harvest anything until it's at least 63 days into flowering.


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## hpyhgryslpy (Mar 14, 2013)

Thanks bullwinkle60!


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## hpyhgryslpy (Mar 14, 2013)

Here are a few pics. 54 days into flowering today, Indica hybrid, 8 week flowering strain. New pistils threw me for a loop. Anyone have any advice on how much longer to flower. Original post has more info.


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## ninobrown413 (Mar 15, 2013)

I would give your gorgeous girls one more week what could it hurt lol..I was wondering after harvest when drying what is the ideal humidity for drying? mines is staying between 35 and 40% is this dangerously low or manageable?thanks in advance!


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## graydrake (Mar 17, 2013)

Thanks you were so right. I chopped two buds for a test and there were no where near done.


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## pippinpoppinjay (Mar 25, 2013)

It was my understanding that running really low humidity during drying was a good thing? The whole aim is to 'dry' the material right,and to advert a mold outbreak...?


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## drew425 (Mar 26, 2013)

pippinpoppinjay said:


> It was my understanding that running really low humidity during drying was a good thing? The whole aim is to 'dry' the material right,and to advert a mold outbreak...?


If you have a constant breeze blowin in your drying room that should be a problem. Just don't have it right on the bud so they won't dry too fast. Target humidity should be right abound 30-50%. But now matter how humid or lack of humidity theres been in my area, 5 days seems right. Unless your at a very high temp.


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## drew425 (Mar 26, 2013)

ninobrown413 said:


> I would give your gorgeous girls one more week what could it hurt lol..I was wondering after harvest when drying what is the ideal humidity for drying? mines is staying between 35 and 40% is this dangerously low or manageable?thanks in advance!


Thats pretty close to prefect. 4-5 days hanging and 1-2 in paper bag and youll be golden. If you really want to get technical get a hygrometer (spelling) to put in the jar when your curing


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## David the Gnome (Mar 26, 2013)

Has anyone ever tried using this stuff called RhinoRub to get resin off your hands? I just got a free sample at this pot expo. Any thoughts?


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## chris 71 (Mar 26, 2013)

hi.. ok so i was going to do a flush on my first harvest, but now after reading about the whole second half of this thread.
im thinking better to not, and keep feeding the final weeks. but im wondering about the sugar leafs?
and the tiny leafs embeded right in the bud? is there nutrients stored in these? and if so then a real tight trim would be the way to go? i was going to leave some sugar leaves to kind encase the buds... but would they be holding nutes that i wouldnt want to be smoking ?


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## Ganjagreat91 (Mar 28, 2013)

I used non organic veg nutes but now using botinicare pure blend pro bloom organic with ff kangaroots and superthrive also one week of carbo load and pk1020 any advice now on week 3 bud plus 1 week transition


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## k0ijn (Apr 1, 2013)

chris 71 said:


> hi.. ok so i was going to do a flush on my first harvest, but now after reading about the whole second half of this thread.
> im thinking better to not, and keep feeding the final weeks. but im wondering about the sugar leafs?
> and the tiny leafs embeded right in the bud? is there nutrients stored in these? and if so then a real tight trim would be the way to go? i was going to leave some sugar leaves to kind encase the buds... but would they be holding nutes that i wouldnt want to be smoking ?


The fan leaves are the main nutrient sinks with regards to Cannabis.
You won't get a nutrient build up in the sugar leaves (unless you severely overfeed).


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## RT420Revolution (Apr 1, 2013)

Hi Everyone - this is my first grow (hydroponic in deep water reservoir with drip system; LED for veg & first half of flower; 400 Watt HPS for second half of flowering);
So, I've been checking the trichomes regularly and they have developed from clear to milky/cloudy, but I still can't spot a single amber trichome. The overall condition of the plant is fair, and I've had nutrients under 500ppm for the last few days;
My questions are:
1) is it time to flush
2) is it almost time to harvest
Note: Images are not as magnified as I'd like, but this is the best I could do with my iPhone and the attachment macro lense


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## tarks (Apr 2, 2013)

I was under the impression that you harvest when the hairs ( pistil? ) turn amber? I haven't harvested anything ever but I always thought that was when you are supposed to do it. So to get this straight , the pistil hairs can turn amber but you want to pay attention to the tricomes that are ON the hairs and over the leaf? Is that right?


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## k0ijn (Apr 3, 2013)

tarks said:


> I was under the impression that you harvest when the hairs ( pistil? ) turn amber? I haven't harvested anything ever but I always thought that was when you are supposed to do it. So to get this straight , the pistil hairs can turn amber but you want to pay attention to the tricomes that are ON the hairs and over the leaf? Is that right?


That is correct, the pistils (what some people call hairs) will shrivel up and turn amber-ish.
However some plants fully mature without the pistils necessarily changing much, you should always go by the pointers I give in the first post of this thread.
Trichomes appear on the leaves and calyxes, not the pistils themselves.


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## Moldy (Apr 3, 2013)

FrostyTheBudMan said:


> Looks like time, got a chance to check this morning and seeing amber! Darkness for two days then chop chop, so close I can taste it now!
> View attachment 2102387


Would you happen to have the brand name of the microscope you used? I use a loop but I'm color blind and typically just chop when all are cloudy. I'd like to be able to see the amber trichs. Thanks!


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## si. (Apr 6, 2013)

Ok Folks, first plant I've ever grown... Auto organic outdoor (very late in growing season - S. hemisphere).... but is she ready??? Thanks!


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## Jerome952 (Apr 30, 2013)

Thanks for the great read!!!! It was a lot of help. + rep.


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## MarWan (May 1, 2013)

thank you very much for such great info, and the efforts you went through

good luck


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## Herb Man (May 11, 2013)

si. said:


> Ok Folks, first plant I've ever grown... Auto organic outdoor (very late in growing season - S. hemisphere).... but is she ready??? Thanks! View attachment 2603184


She doesn't look anywhere near ready to me. 

Way too green, looks like you've got a ways to go yet.


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## blaze131 (May 12, 2013)

What do you think?? Didn't think it was near ready but looks like amber trichs


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## abuilder (May 12, 2013)

blaze131 said:


> View attachment 2653757What do you think?? Didn't think it was near ready but looks like amber trichs


gettin' there...what kind of camera you shooting that close with?


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## blaze131 (May 12, 2013)

If you take the lense out of a laser pointer and hold it over camera lense it works great.. That was on a itouch


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## kennyp02 (May 17, 2013)

Should i flush or just harvest and cure with the nutes still in the medium?
You think shes about done?


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## maraman (May 17, 2013)

hi everyone. 

Im currently growing auto acid, its been growing for the past 82 days and is very near harvest time (according to strain information). about 70/80 percent of the pistils have turned brown (only on the top half of the plant), i have been checking trichome development using my pocket microscope and very few however seem to have turned cloudy. Im unsure whether to go on pistil colour or wait until a higher percentage have went cloudy, but do not want to miss my plants peak thc point.
Any advice will be appreciated


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## blaze131 (May 18, 2013)

Any advise?? Think I should feed one more time then start flushing.. Week 8 starts Monday, unknown strain believed to be sativa dom but starting to show amber trics.. Any thoughts??


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## k0ijn (May 18, 2013)

kennyp02 said:


> Should i flush or just harvest and cure with the nutes still in the medium?
> You think shes about done?
> View attachment 2660354View attachment 2660355View attachment 2660356View attachment 2660357



Have you checked the trichomes?
It looks like it could go longer and swell up a bit more but I'd go by trichomes if it's your first grow.

Not sure what you mean by 'nutes still in the medium', it won't affect your grow unless you are overfeeding or causing a deficiency.
Flushing is for toilets.




maraman said:


> hi everyone.
> 
> Im currently growing auto acid, its been growing for the past 82 days and is very near harvest time (according to strain information). about 70/80 percent of the pistils have turned brown (only on the top half of the plant), i have been checking trichome development using my pocket microscope and very few however seem to have turned cloudy. Im unsure whether to go on pistil colour or wait until a higher percentage have went cloudy, but do not want to miss my plants peak thc point.
> Any advice will be appreciated


The answer to your question is on the first page of this thread; receding pistils, swollen calyxes and cloudy trichomes are all indicators of when a plant nears peak harvest (if you want maximum potency). All should be taken into account but the state of the trichomes is of highest importance.




blaze131 said:


> View attachment 2661475Any advise?? Think I should feed one more time then start flushing.. Week 8 starts Monday, unknown strain believed to be sativa dom but starting to show amber trics.. Any thoughts??


Pre-harvest flushing does not improve your weed nor does it remove any undesirable "chemicals" from the weed.

I see several clear trichomes, a few cloudy and a few amber.
The picture is unfocused so it doesn't really give the full picture of the part of the calyx photographed but from what I see it could use a week (if not two) more.


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## blaze131 (May 19, 2013)

I have heard both views on flushing and it makes sense that it is not needed bc of how nutes are transported in the plant. I have flushed all my prior grows to be safe but may keep feeding this run to test any differences. Does it really not matter? Even if using chem nutes(maxi bloom)? And I agree on the couple weeks left. I thought they were mostly sativa but they look like they will be done around day 60, and I'm under cfl? Could there be another growth explosion in the next couple weeks? I have only done sativa outdoor befor so I only know what an indica grows like on a daily basis inside


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## blaze131 (May 21, 2013)

So a couple plants are nearing harvest. They are covered in red hairs but have minimum trics. Seeds from local grower unknown strain but the bud was good. Any ideas? Havnt looked under a scope but I will take pics under a scope soon as I can. By eye u can see some very small trics but not like my other plants


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## k0ijn (May 21, 2013)

blaze131 said:


> I have heard both views on flushing and it makes sense that it is not needed bc of how nutes are transported in the plant. I have flushed all my prior grows to be safe but may keep feeding this run to test any differences. Does it really not matter? Even if using chem nutes(maxi bloom)? And I agree on the couple weeks left. I thought they were mostly sativa but they look like they will be done around day 60, and I'm under cfl? Could there be another growth explosion in the next couple weeks? I have only done sativa outdoor befor so I only know what an indica grows like on a daily basis inside


First of all, you have to distinguish between flushing and pre-harvest flushing.
But I will not go into the debate again here since I've already settled the matter in several other threads.
You can find the info if you search the forum for my nick & pre-harvest flushing.

Using regular nutrients (what you call chem nutes) and/or using organic nutrients make no difference with regards to nutrient storage, usage & transportation in the particular plant. 
A nitrogen ion is a nitrogen ion.

Sativas tend to go longer than the prescribed date set by the breeder.
You should never base the harvest off those dates but instead rely on what the plant tells you. 




blaze131 said:


> So a couple plants are nearing harvest. They are covered in red hairs but have minimum trics. Seeds from local grower unknown strain but the bud was good. Any ideas? Havnt looked under a scope but I will take pics under a scope soon as I can. By eye u can see some very small trics but not like my other plants


The images are of very bad quality, it's basically impossible to see how the calyxes are doing.
But based off of the tinge and general state of the plant from what I can see, those plants have a long while to go (3-4 weeks if not more).
Pistils don't looked to have been receding, the calyxes don't look very swollen and the plant itself looks somewhat nutrient deficient (underfed).


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## swaff (May 23, 2013)

i love smart stoners always so much info


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## MuckyDucky (May 23, 2013)

Hey guys! Whatdoya think? I don't see many amber trichs yet but I sampled 3 hits and went out and chopped down a cherry tree. I usually just couch lock and put off what needs doing until tomorrow. I'm not worried about volume. Do you think I would loose much quality by chopping in a few days?


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## ineverveg (May 27, 2013)

say mucky, those pistols look to have been squashed in a bag rather than curled in , looking nice though, however the difference will be massive imo if you wait a week or so.

the odd time i have taken them down early i noticed that even a couch lock strain would feel like a sativa head high when early and the smell when cured suffers for the early bird , i have found anyways.


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## abuilder (May 27, 2013)

I'd wait a week or so at least Mucky. Looks real sweet. BTW whatcha use to photograph those trichs?


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## reyesplants (May 30, 2013)

Can u help me out ? This is my first grow and was wondering what if I cut my plant right now in hole the plant is about 50percent brown in hairs and there also curling, but I'm wondering what type of hi ill get since all the lil mushroom things are all white still. Idk I think I'm about ready to harvest but idk need help Iflushed it about three times already alll mycolas r deasint size I guess there filld with crystals everywhere there coming out better then expected but I do not no if I should harvest or not.??...


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## onebadSandman (Jun 1, 2013)

Blue-Mystic
Not sure if she is ready, flowered on the 4/14 the appearance of the flowers are not what Iam used to seeing compared to the trichromes. This is the first time growing this strain. Any help would be appreciated

It seems to early, considering 8weeks would put me around 6/14 and from what I have read about this pheno. It takes anywhere from 8-9 wks. Not six!!!


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## onebadSandman (Jun 4, 2013)

thehole said:


> If you are referring to "the best way to know is to know" is by testing your bud right off the plant then fine. I myself would never test bud fresh off the plant, I allow mine to dry and be cured for at least 2 weeks before I touch mine. But that's just me. If you pluck a bud off a flowering plant and it gets you high then you know that after drying and curing it will be twice as potent.
> But, this IS IN NO WAY the proper way to judge when to chop.
> 
> Flowering time is MORE accurate when starting the count on the first sign of pistils, not the switch to 12/12 lighting. The seed shops may use the times they give for flowering specific strains from 12/12 switch, maybe that's why I have never had a strain finish on or before those times.
> ...


really? can't decide who your response was for...but just to CMA I never mentioned any member being a "retard". Just needed a little FRIENDLY advice about the clear to milky white trics. not being as advanced as the flowers look/appear( pistils and calyx's recessed and swollen,majority of the pistils are also org/amber, plus the terpins are soooo. strong right now I can smell it outside my casa). I would never be as disrespectful as you just portrayed your self to be, so lighten up, smell the roses, enjoy life, smoke a bowl for fucks sake! Also I've never been able to dry AND CURE any bud I've ever grown in two weeks


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## Impman (Jul 12, 2013)

k0ijn said:


> Nutrient storage in cannabis plants is rather complicated, I've written extensively about it on this forum, you can find it if you search my nick and nutrient storage so I won't go into much detail here.
> Suffice to say that you cannot 'clear' chemical taste out of cannabis, since it won't have any chemical taste in the first place, unless the particular strain you're growing has that trait.
> Nutrients are not stored directly in the buds or calyxes. Nutrients are stored in the leaves and roots and transported around to fit the needs of the plant.
> But nutrients moved to the calyxes are used up very fast, it's almost impossible to have an abundance of nutrients in the calyxes, where it is quite possible to have that in the leaves and roots.
> ...


NICE! This is something you RARELY hear on this site or anywhere on the net or in grow books!!


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## abuilder (Jul 12, 2013)

Impman said:


> NICE! This is something you RARELY hear on this site or anywhere on the net or in grow books!!


couldn't agree more..thanks compadre


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## Lady Helena (Jul 13, 2013)

Hey K0ijn, would you be kind enough to tell me what you think of these please?

Strain : Jamaican Pearl from Sensi Seeds (sativa)
Switched to 12/12 : 7 weeks ago tonight (Day 49)
Flowering period (according to the seller) : 50 to 75 days

If I count from when I switched then am about at the min flowering stage, but if I count from when the pistils started to show then its only about 40 days. The pics aren't great. What do you think? Having looked at your pics first and then with my untrained eye at mine, they look cloudy to me....but she can't be ready yet.



Thanks for your help! Lady Hx


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## k0ijn (Jul 13, 2013)

Lady Helena said:


> Hey K0ijn, would you be kind enough to tell me what you think of these please?
> 
> Strain : Jamaican Pearl from Sensi Seeds (sativa)
> Switched to 12/12 : 7 weeks ago tonight (Day 49)
> ...


Hello Lady Hx,

I would always, as a rule of thumb, go by the date when flowering showed on the plants, not by the date when you switched the light schedule.
Which would make your plants 40 days old (in flowering terms).

From what I can see you have a mixture of clear & cloudy trichomes.
The pictures are not of high enough resolution for me to be able to see every trichome but to me it looks like you have more (slighty perhaps) clear trichomes.
Which would make sense (regarding the 40 day flowering) & the plants being Sativa.

I think you still have a while to go, I can still see some fairly young looking pistils and not many of the coloured pistils seem to have receded fully (from what I can tell by the pictures).
I also can't quite see fully developed calyxes yet, it might just be how you zoomed the pictures to get proper shots of the trichomes, but my spidey senses tell me the calyxes have yet to fully develop.
If possible, could you take some overview shots, of the entire plant(s)?

If I would have to take a guess I'd say these plants have at least 2-3 weeks to go (quite possibly more depending on development).


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## Lady Helena (Jul 13, 2013)

k0ijn said:


> Hello Lady Hx,
> 
> I would always, as a rule of thumb, go by the date when flowering showed on the plants, not by the date when you switched the light schedule.
> Which would make your plants 40 days old (in flowering terms).
> ...


Hey Thanks K0ijn!

Yeah, I have a shitty little Sony CyberShot, can't do much better than that I'm afraid. I'm sure you are right, I feel she has a few more weeks but after reading your excellent thread I had a look just to check. They looked cloudy to me so I was a bit shocked. hehehehe. I think your Spidey senses are spot on. There are a few swollen calyxes but not many.

I have a ton of pics for you to look at. I have LST'd and defoliated her from 3 weeks so she's small but compact. Tell me what you think.

View attachment 2735016View attachment 2735017View attachment 2735018View attachment 2735019View attachment 2735020

It's my first grow and my only lady left as 2 out of 3 turned out to be male. Feels good to be entering the home straight at last!

Lady Hel x


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## Impman (Jul 13, 2013)

dude i trip out on this concept. i see so much bud porn on here with dead and dying leafs all around the buds! its like the norm. then all this talk about flushing to improve taste. then there is so many ways to cure weed you could make it into a 4 year college course on the nonsense. If Your weed tastes funky it is cuz you treat your plant like shit, kill all its leaf and energy production and stress it to no end! then everyone is like duuuudei didnt get the cure just right.
Best weed i ever smoked was guerilla grown humboldt that was dried in the sun and only fan leafs pulled off. 
although there may be some value to these concepts I have began to hate them and caste it off as myths (as far as practicality vs cost and over all quality ) I submit : PHing is not at all required, tap water is fine, Co2 not worth the time or cost, potassium boost is way over rated, curing = drying slow and helps so little, stressing your plant is ALWAYS a bad idea. 
I grow so basic now its crazy from when i started. i began growing by jorges and eds stupid books. i read them cover to cover a few times. my ignorant ass did not think to pick up a plant science book and get real. my buds taste so clean and get so fat just by keeping one simple concept: keep your leafs green and healthy! duh!!! 
why was that so hard for me to do? why is there so much ,misinformation on growing a plant? 
You can achieve amazing results with a 3$ bottle of MG with the correct NPK and inexpensive potting soil.


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## abuilder (Jul 13, 2013)

To me I've always thought of plants as needing similar treatment like humans do. everything is so similar....so it'd be like telling a woman in her last few weeks of pregnancy to go on a fast before giving birth...makes zero sense..thats when she really needs to keep up her nutes.....and I couldn't agree more with K0ijn about getting back to basics..I've also read time'n time again how people are feeding nutes to their girls every other watering which seems crazy to me...two times a week seems perfect usually. I stick to the FF feeding schedule and almost always get optimum results...


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## abuilder (Jul 13, 2013)

2 months veg and nowI'm in almost six weeks of flower from firsts signs of pistils..all with the FF scheduling system...Hoping to get another 2-3 weeks of flower to put on some more nuggy weight..the left airpot is Violator Kush and the right is Samsara's Sweet BlackAngel...a freebie


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## k0ijn (Jul 15, 2013)

Lady Helena said:


> Hey Thanks K0ijn!
> 
> Yeah, I have a shitty little Sony CyberShot, can't do much better than that I'm afraid. I'm sure you are right, I feel she has a few more weeks but after reading your excellent thread I had a look just to check. They looked cloudy to me so I was a bit shocked. hehehehe. I think your Spidey senses are spot on. There are a few swollen calyxes but not many.
> 
> ...



You're welcome!

The attachments seem to not have worked properly btw, I cannot open them.


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## k0ijn (Jul 15, 2013)

Cheers Imp & abuilder for the kind words


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## Julius Caesar (Jul 17, 2013)

Skunk #1 from Sensi Seeds - Day # 67 and not a single amber trichome. I keep noticing growth spurts and foxtails so I have no idea what the inside of the buds look like. I am thinking of cutting one open to see what is going on in there. I did a final flush 8 days ago so I am hoping the lack of nutrients will force the plant to stop the growth spurts and begin to age the trichomes.

View attachment 2740683View attachment 2740684


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## Lady Helena (Jul 18, 2013)

Hey K0ijn

I'm trying to upload some more pics of the whole plant for you. I am guessing she started to show signs of lowering from 6/06 so yesterday (date of pics) it was day 43 of flowering. She's nearly ready and I'm getting itchy fingers! What do you reck? Lady Helena x



And although they are still too low res, here's a couple of close ups from yesterday.


Thanks for your help. x


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## k0ijn (Jul 20, 2013)

Lady Helena said:


> Hey K0ijn
> 
> I'm trying to upload some more pics of the whole plant for you. I am guessing she started to show signs of lowering from 6/06 so yesterday (date of pics) it was day 43 of flowering. She's nearly ready and I'm getting itchy fingers! What do you reck? Lady Helena x
> 
> ...



The plant looks great, it looks healthy!
Which is more than I can say for most people who post their plant pictures (especially those who pre-harvest flush).

I would still give it another two weeks if it was my plant though.
The pistils have not fully receded and I see new growth still sprouting up from the calyxes.
I also think the calyxes could swell up more if you give the plant a bit more time.

I cannot see the trichomes fully, but based off of the previous pictures and the ones you posted now and how the plant looks I don't think the trichomes would suffer, in fact I think they would improve given extra time.
I see a fair amount of cloudy trichomes and some spots of clear & amber, which is the norm at this stage of flowering.

The only thing I would say though is that you should keep an eye out for how many amber trichomes are "popping up".
If you start seeing too many amber trichs I would harvest, but as you are looking now, my guesstimate is another ~two weeks (just keep close supervision on the trichs).
Patience is key in growing and I think you'll be even more jubilant if you give it just a bit more time.


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## Lady Helena (Jul 21, 2013)

k0ijn said:


> The plant looks great, it looks healthy!
> Which is more than I can say for most people who post their plant pictures (especially those who pre-harvest flush).
> 
> I would still give it another two weeks if it was my plant though.
> ...


Thanks so much K0ijn for taking a look. Don't know how I'm going to get through another two weeks! May have to tape some big-ass woollen mittens to my hands to stop myself from sipping bits off! The last bit of the waiting game is always the hardest hey! Must be patient. Must be patient.

I'm with you on the timescales but someone mentioned fox tailing and re-veg to me yesterday. The fox tail thing doesn't sound like it will affect the bud/yield any but I don't want Pearl to re-veg! Would this influence your call on when to harvest her?

Thanks Lady H x


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## k0ijn (Jul 24, 2013)

Lady Helena said:


> Thanks so much K0ijn for taking a look. Don't know how I'm going to get through another two weeks! May have to tape some big-ass woollen mittens to my hands to stop myself from sipping bits off! The last bit of the waiting game is always the hardest hey! Must be patient. Must be patient.
> 
> I'm with you on the timescales but someone mentioned fox tailing and re-veg to me yesterday. The fox tail thing doesn't sound like it will affect the bud/yield any but I don't want Pearl to re-veg! Would this influence your call on when to harvest her?
> 
> Thanks Lady H x


You're welcome 
I was on a long "weekend" holiday, therefore the delayed response.

That is always the hardest part of growing imo, you have to be very patient, unless you've grown Cannabis for a while and you know exactly what you're doing it's quite hard to not get excited and want to get the harvesting under way asap.
Even experienced growers can't help but get somewhat excited about a really nice looking harvest.

I don't see any signs of fox tailing, which in any case won't ruin your harvest if it does set in, and takes weeks to form fully.
Re-veg is something else entirely.
You won't see your plant re-veg by itself if it's under a flowering schedule, I wouldn't worry about that at all!

So I wouldn't let this influence what I see from your plant directly from the pictures, the two things that person mentioned are in one case, a very low chance possibility which only happens in certain genes and strains or under high stress, and in the other, a near impossibility unless you intently put it into motion yourself.

I think your mantra will suit you well btw ^^


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## ant88 (Jul 25, 2013)

i have read alot about drying and curing, but what is a prime temperature for drying? Can anyone help with this question? thanks, btw here are my ladies 4 weeks into flowerView attachment 2749812


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## ant88 (Jul 25, 2013)

this is a mid-grade bag seed grow also.


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## k0ijn (Jul 28, 2013)

ant88 said:


> i have read alot about drying and curing, but what is a prime temperature for drying? Can anyone help with this question? thanks, btw here are my ladies 4 weeks into flowerView attachment 2749812View attachment 2749813View attachment 2749814View attachment 2749815View attachment 2749816View attachment 2749817View attachment 2749818


I usually dry my plants around 16-21 degrees C.
You want to make sure you have proper ventilation, proper light control (you want a very dark room) and a somewhat stable temperature.


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## ant88 (Jul 28, 2013)

Thank you Koijn! ive got a little while before harvest ,about two three weeks but i just want to be ready for it


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## mrCRC420 (Jul 28, 2013)

ant88 said:


> i have read alot about drying and curing, but what is a prime temperature for drying? Can anyone help with this question?


I dry at 45-55% Humidity, 65-75 F . My Humidity is usually at 60% but I try to keep it lower; takes about 8 days to dry a few ounces in a medium closet like space.

ALSO - I used to be a big fan of checking my trichomes and shit but I don't do it anymore. I recognize when a plant is in maturity and ready to be harvested; and, personally, I'm happy with whatever ratio of head-high/couch-lock that my plants give me. I'll check trichs when I come across a strain that I need to be custom to my needs but I don't usually need to be so picky. Happy growing!


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## ant88 (Jul 28, 2013)

mrCRC420 said:


> I dry at 45-55% Humidity, 65-75 F . My Humidity is usually at 60% but I try to keep it lower; takes about 8 days to dry a few ounces in a medium closet like space.
> 
> ALSO - I used to be a big fan of checking my trichomes and shit but I don't do it anymore. I recognize when a plant is in maturity and ready to be harvested; and, personally, I'm happy with whatever ratio of head-high/couch-lock that my plants give me. I'll check trichs when I come across a strain that I need to be custom to my needs but I don't usually need to be so picky. Happy growing!




Nice time frames Mr. that sounds like about how long my buds will take, i clipped a sample and it took six days and i agree with your approach on ripeness but seeing as this is my first grow i at least want to know what the trichs look like.


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## Crankyxr (Jul 28, 2013)

ant88 said:


> i have read alot about drying and curing, but what is a prime temperature for drying? Can anyone help with this question? thanks, btw here are my ladies 4 weeks into flowerView attachment 2749812View attachment 2749813View attachment 2749814View attachment 2749815View attachment 2749816View attachment 2749817View attachment 2749818


I would kill for a girl with purple pistils..


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## ant88 (Jul 28, 2013)

i wish i knew what strain it is, i am trying to start a clone of it but its all new to me. its mid-grade bagseeds


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## Crankyxr (Jul 28, 2013)

ant88 said:


> i wish i knew what strain it is, i am trying to start a clone of it but its all new to me. its mid-grade bagseeds


Well, purple pistils are a recessive trait and only show up on a few plants. It's not really strain dependent.
Also, just because the weed you bought was mid-grade, that doesn't mean yours will be. They could have grown it from seed from a seed bank. 
Potency is based on how well you treat your girls and feed them what they need. Who knows, you might have some kick-ass genetics. With the right genetics, the right pheno, and a good environment, you can grow some kill.


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## ant88 (Jul 28, 2013)

it is pretty stinky and covered in trichomes


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## Crankyxr (Jul 28, 2013)

See, grow it better than the last person and you'll have even better shit


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## KsloPokerPro (Aug 5, 2013)

I am a few weeks away I think from harvest on my first grow and i'm going to let the plant tell me when it's done. I think I have a good idea of what that will look like.

However, I would still like to have the ability to check the tri's. 

Can someone give me a tip on a cheap piece of equipment, whether that's a loupe or a microscope and where to look?

Thanks for any help


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## abuilder (Aug 5, 2013)

KsloPokerPro said:


> I am a few weeks away I think from harvest on my first grow and i'm going to let the plant tell me when it's done. I think I have a good idea of what that will look like.
> 
> However, I would still like to have the ability to check the tri's.
> 
> ...


Out of all the cheap hand held microscopes I found this one to be the best ...mainly b/c it has an LED light which is much brighter than all the other scopes...and I've had three others. If anyone knows of one for under $50 thats better than this one I wouldn't mind getting an even better one...although this one is fine as long as you're patient..
http://www.amazon.com/Carson-MM-200-Micromax-60X-100X-Microscope/dp/B000P8AUMU/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1375745530&sr=8-2&keywords=hand+held+microscope


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## piffsmokingmaniac (Aug 9, 2013)

FrostyTheBudMan said:


> Looks like time, got a chance to check this morning and seeing amber! Darkness for two days then chop chop, so close I can taste it now!
> View attachment 2102387




Whats the point of darkness for two days before chopping? never tryed it but heard about it im close to choppin already flushed


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## stealth808 (Aug 12, 2013)

i dont know about this NO flushing thing. the best breeders/growers in the world flush. wtf?


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## k0ijn (Aug 12, 2013)

stealth808 said:


> i dont know about this NO flushing thing. the best breeders/growers in the world flush. wtf?


The science speaks for itself, you can look up any thread/post I've written on the subject if you need more information.

This thread is not the place to discuss a settled issue.


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## abuilder (Aug 12, 2013)

stealth808 said:


> i dont know about this NO flushing thing. the best breeders/growers in the world flush. wtf?


..and it's not just kOijn that's saying that..I've read some extensive posts regarding this as well from some pretty serious growers on another site. I couldn't agree more. I'm at the last cpl of weeks of some seriously juicy looking full bodied girls, and there's no way I'd stop feeding them now of all times....maybe..maybe, 2-3 days before I chop but thats about it...and 24 hours of that time they'll be in darkness with not even another watering anyway....The way I look at it is...do pregnant woman that are ready to give birth stop feeding themselves and start a cleanse?? No!


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## abuilder (Aug 12, 2013)

stealth808 said:


> why 2-3 days then? PROVES MY POINT


I said, "maybe, Maybe".....and the reason for me is b/c "sometimes" I tend to overfeed my plants towards the end so the last cpl of days I abstain if thats the case...big deal! Like I said..one of those days it's in the dark 24 hours getting no food OR water. Your point is pointless! Keep denying your plant food all you want.


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## BlazedAndConfused (Aug 22, 2013)

So I have a few plants that I do not know the flowering time of. This is my second time growing, has been pretty foxtaily but that was mainly due to me putting the 1000 watt uncooled at like 12" for 2 weeks. What I noticed is that a lot of the outer trichromes are more amber but the calyxes on the more inner parts of the bud are clear/cloudy. Could the heat and stress have made these trichromes mature faster? 
I harvested 4 of the 8 plants, just the tops there is still the lower half of the plant. The stems weren't very hollow and I saw that to be a possible problem. The buds dried pretty quickly and the smoke isn't that intense. They seemed to lose a lot of their body, and I would compare the high to some good mids maybe shitty crip but nothing special. the plants look like they have sativa leaves so could I possibly have taken the tops a few weeks early and they didn't get a chance to mature fully or cover themself with enough trichs?


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## itsraininbuds (Sep 2, 2013)

i know this thread was posted quite some time ago but your details on the subject lead me to believe that your expertise could give me an answer. my pineapple chunk has developed a handfull amber tri's on the kola but the rest of the plant is still about 50-50 clear/cloudy. should i look into a selective harvest method or wait for the rest of the plant to follow suit? i know that tri's will still mature after harvest so what is my window on that? any info you have is much appreciated


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## k0ijn (Sep 3, 2013)

BlazedAndConfused said:


> So I have a few plants that I do not know the flowering time of. This is my second time growing, has been pretty foxtaily but that was mainly due to me putting the 1000 watt uncooled at like 12" for 2 weeks. What I noticed is that a lot of the outer trichromes are more amber but the calyxes on the more inner parts of the bud are clear/cloudy. Could the heat and stress have made these trichromes mature faster?
> I harvested 4 of the 8 plants, just the tops there is still the lower half of the plant. The stems weren't very hollow and I saw that to be a possible problem. The buds dried pretty quickly and the smoke isn't that intense. They seemed to lose a lot of their body, and I would compare the high to some good mids maybe shitty crip but nothing special. the plants look like they have sativa leaves so could I possibly have taken the tops a few weeks early and they didn't get a chance to mature fully or cover themself with enough trichs?


I'm sorry but I don't quite understand what question you want answered, no offense but you seem a bit confused about the situation.
Could you perhaps post some pictures and give a bit more detail?

To answer a general question if that was what you were looking for: Many new growers harvest too early, and when you harvest too early you end up with predominantly clear trichome harvests which don't give very powerful highs, because of the immature nature of the substances.


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## k0ijn (Sep 3, 2013)

itsraininbuds said:


> i know this thread was posted quite some time ago but your details on the subject lead me to believe that your expertise could give me an answer. my pineapple chunk has developed a handfull amber tri's on the kola but the rest of the plant is still about 50-50 clear/cloudy. should i look into a selective harvest method or wait for the rest of the plant to follow suit? i know that tri's will still mature after harvest so what is my window on that? any info you have is much appreciated



I would need more general information to answer that question and some pictures if possible.
Normally I wouldn't recommend selective harvesting to new growers but every case is different and without me seeing what is going on for myself it's hard to call (sometimes new growers get confused and report things differently than they actually are).


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## itsraininbuds (Sep 3, 2013)

k0ijn said:


> I would need more general information to answer that question and some pictures if possible.
> Normally I wouldn't recommend selective harvesting to new growers but every case is different and without me seeing what is going on for myself it's hard to call (sometimes new growers get confused and report things differently than they actually are).


well im using a jewler's loop to look at the trichomes but here are some pictures of the plant. in the past few weeks i have had some trouble with what im guessing is ph. i am using ff ocean forest and this isnt my first grow, but it is my first time using ocean forest. i tried everything i could to fix the ph but the soil remains around 7.2. i've already flushed it and all that but to no avail. regardless of that, the buds still seem to be producing ok for a small plant. but you can critique for your self. all help is appreciated.


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## k0ijn (Sep 4, 2013)

itsraininbuds said:


> well im using a jewler's loop to look at the trichomes but here are some pictures of the plant. in the past few weeks i have had some trouble with what im guessing is ph. i am using ff ocean forest and this isnt my first grow, but it is my first time using ocean forest. i tried everything i could to fix the ph but the soil remains around 7.2. i've already flushed it and all that but to no avail. regardless of that, the buds still seem to be producing ok for a small plant. but you can critique for your self. all help is appreciated.View attachment 2803383View attachment 2803384View attachment 2803385



Well that certainly is a bit high pH, if possible I would switch soil or perhaps try to flush it properly several times before use and test it to see how the "base" pH is fluctuating.

Your plants look fairly healthy though, I see some tip damage but the colours of the leaves have a good dark green tinge.

Your plant is nowhere near finished though, the calyxes have not swelled up, nor have the pistils changed colour really.
You still have quite a few weeks to go.


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## Sand4x105 (Sep 4, 2013)

> i dont know about this NO flushing thing. the best breeders/growers in the world flush. wtf?The science speaks for itself, you can look up any thread/post I've written on the subject if you need more information






> This thread is not the place to discuss a settled issue.



Thank you k0ijn Nothing like the expert ending BS


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## itsraininbuds (Sep 4, 2013)

k0ijn said:


> Well that certainly is a bit high pH, if possible I would switch soil or perhaps try to flush it properly several times before use and test it to see how the "base" pH is fluctuating.
> 
> Your plants look fairly healthy though, I see some tip damage but the colours of the leaves have a good dark green tinge.
> 
> ...


well thank you very much! i will be buying a new ph meter immediately because the one i just bought is definitely giving me trouble. and as far as the soil goes, everyone gave me the advice to use ocean forest so i went with it. but it does seem to be coming with some ph problems. thanks again for the expertise. namaste


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## perplexus (Sep 5, 2013)

K0jin thank you for your time here. Youve helped so many people out. Well done. I tried to read tge entire thread, but skipped most of the 30's, as many questions were redundant. I hope i dont ask another redundant question as a result. 

First: trying real hard to believe the no flush assertion. I mean, i do, in theory. Ive done the research, i seen your arguments, i understand the science. Now why, in spite of all of this, do i still think im going to do a final water and 1-2 days of rest just before i take my "A" buds? I feel like a supersticious Old fool. Ha! I wont be doing any extended final darkperiod either. This is impossible anyway due to daytime temps.

Second: can you talk a little about sugars? Many nute programs add a final sugar type product, others do not. Im running GO in soil in a greenhouse. The GO line does not include a "sweetener", per se. my questions are.... Should i add an additional sugar product? If so what? What kinds of sugars are best utilized by root zone organisms? Do any sugars actually get absorbed by the roots, or do they soley feed these organisms? 
What is the science behind the sugar?

Third: I would like to take the upper branches, colas and some of the lower terminal buds, letting the lower inner stuff fluff a little. what should i do to the stem where i take the cola? Duct tape? Cloning gel would seal it, but would the hormones screw with my girls? Any advice would be hugely appreciated.

I have several ladies coming in hot and will probably post some pictures soon re: trichs. And again, thank you for all of your time and patience here.

"90% of weed growing knowledge is monkey see, monkey do"


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## k0ijn (Sep 5, 2013)

perplexus said:


> K0jin thank you for your time here. Youve helped so many people out. Well done. I tried to read tge entire thread, but skipped most of the 30's, as many questions were redundant. I hope i dont ask another redundant question as a result.
> 
> First: trying real hard to believe the no flush assertion. I mean, i do, in theory. Ive done the research, i seen your arguments, i understand the science. Now why, in spite of all of this, do i still think im going to do a final water and 1-2 days of rest just before i take my "A" buds? I feel like a supersticious Old fool. Ha! I wont be doing any extended final darkperiod either. This is impossible anyway due to daytime temps.
> 
> ...


Thank you for your kind words.

I guess it does come down to tradition and routine for some people, it can be hard to let go of things you've done for a long time, and certainly the brain can easily be taught/fooled into taking fiction for facts even when faced with evidence.
I don't personally have anything against people who pre-harvest flush, the only thing I ask is that people don't claim it's scientifically proven to work and/or try to teach it as fact/evidence to impressionable people.

Regarding sugar/molasses (or even honey which some people use) I would say that we need to make a distinction between the fictional, subjective fantasy part of the argument and the scientific.
The discussion surrounding sugars is very muddled and has as much to do with personal preference as it has to do with science, which is why the distinction is important to make.
Some of the things these formulas are mentioned to help with include; hardening the buds, growth spurts & flavour improvements.
I would argue that these three topics are highly mythical and subjective, some have to do with the conditions of the grow, some have to do with genetics & strains and some are just flat out myths. 
I would not use any sugar additive to achieve any of these things since I personally see it as fairy stories and placebo/marketing successes.
What I mean is there is no concrete science backing up the claims. 

I do think however that molasses & sugar formulas can help with stimulating the enzymes and beneficial bacteria environment in the grow medium.
This subject is not really up to debate (in contrast to the three previously mentioned), it's scientific fact that these sugars have their uses in soil and/or mediums which have an active living root system (presence of -and thriving Mycorrhizae). 
In basic terms: The sugars & carbohydrates feed the bacteria which helps maintain a thriving root environment which in turn produces healthy plants. 
If you do have access to molasses for example I would give it a go to see if you can improve the general well-being of your plants.
The root environment is also stimulated, however saying which exact formula works best is difficult as it depends on a lot of variables.
I would go with the basic molasses though and not fall into the marketing trap of the huge companies trying to make a quick buck.
I hope that explained it well enough.


If you do want to cut off parts of the plant while leaving the rest to flourish a bit longer I would just make sure the equipment used is as sterile as possible and then make sure you do not touch or add anything to the "open wounds" for at least 24h-48h after cutting, to reduce the chance of diseases.
You always run the risk though, you can never be 100% sure of no diseases setting in, but as long as you keep a clean environment and don't purposefully try to infect the plants with bad crap then you would probably be surprised at exactly how resistant some strains are to diseases etc.
Just try to cut off as little surface area as possible.

You're welcome, I hope the info helped


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## perplexus (Sep 6, 2013)

Great, thanks again! Lastly, i know that this is slightly off thread, but as it applys this this phase of the show, im gonna go for it. 

Is there any other, science based advice that you would give for improving yeild/flavor in the final weeks of flowering? Do high p levels really help or just poison your plant? What are the substances needed to push tons of huge trichs? Oh and... Ive heard some auto/early flowers never really amber. Is this true? Am i waiting for amber that will never come?

Sorry, barrage of questions... I cant turn down science.


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## k0ijn (Sep 6, 2013)

perplexus said:


> Great, thanks again! Lastly, i know that this is slightly off thread, but as it applys this this phase of the show, im gonna go for it.
> 
> Is there any other, science based advice that you would give for improving yeild/flavor in the final weeks of flowering? Do high p levels really help or just poison your plant? What are the substances needed to push tons of huge trichs? Oh and... Ive heard some auto/early flowers never really amber. Is this true? Am i waiting for amber that will never come?
> 
> Sorry, barrage of questions... I cant turn down science.


Yw.

Apart from keeping the growing environment within the various parameters and making sure you feed your plants properly all the way until the end of flowering there isn't much else which can "push out trichs".
Whenever you hear that phrase you should be careful believing what follows it, there is a lot of misinformation on the internet about Cannabis and a lot of straight up wishful thinking and age old myths.
You should just stick to the basics and try to filter out as much of the bullshit as possible.
Getting the best results is just about giving the plants what they need and making sure you pick a strain which suits what you want.
How a plant grows and what it produces is in effect controlled by genetics and the growing variables (light, air, CO2, nutrients etc. etc.).

Regarding the "auto/early flowers", I'm not quite sure exactly what you mean but I assume we're talking about autoflowering strains.
I have heard of people claiming to have grown strains which did not produce amber trichs during flowering at all, whether it's really a problem is another question, since it seems to almost never happen (we're talking 0.01%) and when it does happen it happens across strains and breeds and isn't centralized on certain species (like auto).

I would worry about it, if it does happen I would take it as a positive, since if you would be able to grow out a plant to near 100% cloudy trichs without any clear and without any amber you would end up with near perfect potency potential in that particular strain.

You should just focus on keep the parameters and variables under control, keep giving the plants what they are asking for (look at your plants and make informed decisions) and don't be impatient, patience is key in growing.


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## spontcumb (Sep 12, 2013)

abuilder said:


> ..and it's not just kOijn that's saying that..I've read some extensive posts regarding this as well from some pretty serious growers on another site. I couldn't agree more. I'm at the last cpl of weeks of some seriously juicy looking full bodied girls, and there's no way I'd stop feeding them now of all times....maybe..maybe, 2-3 days before I chop but thats about it...and 24 hours of that time they'll be in darkness with not even another watering anyway....The way I look at it is...do pregnant woman that are ready to give birth stop feeding themselves and start a cleanse?? No!


Do pregnant women smoke their newborn child?


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## gwailo (Sep 12, 2013)

I just got my 100x loupe today and I'm seeing a few amber trichomes. Looks like I need to harvest as soon as possible. Here are some pics i took today.


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## Father Ramirez (Sep 13, 2013)

RIU has proved a soothing and restorative sanctuary in the disappointing climate of fantasy based cannabis cultivation forums. This is an exciting time in this industry's evolution. Knowledgeable, hard working people will advance it. Superstitious, text talking, always baked slackers will cling to their medieval methods. The gap between the two will widen. In the next decade cannabis science will grow as quickly as the plant itself, but there will continue to be no shortage of 'myth based' growers. k0ijn, you, sir, are an enigma! I like your holistic blending of science with a Native American like belief that all things speak if we can calm ourselves enough to listen.


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## k0ijn (Sep 13, 2013)

Father Ramirez said:


> RIU has proved a soothing and restorative sanctuary in the disappointing climate of fantasy based cannabis cultivation forums. This is an exciting time in this industry's evolution. Knowledgeable, hard working people will advance it. Superstitious, text talking, always baked slackers will cling to their medieval methods. The gap between the two will widen. In the next decade cannabis science will grow as quickly as the plant itself, but there will continue to be no shortage of 'myth based' growers. k0ijn, you, sir, are an enigma! I like your holistic blending of science with a Native American like belief that all things speak if we can calm ourselves enough to listen.


Thank you for your kind words Father Ramirez.

I must say you have without a doubt given me the most eloquently written compliment I've ever gotten.
I'm not really spiritual but your description is heartwarming and quite fitting now that I think about it.


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## abuilder (Sep 13, 2013)

k0ijn said:


> Thank you for your kind words Father Ramirez.
> 
> I must say you have without a doubt given me the most eloquently written compliment I've ever gotten.
> I'm not really spiritual but your description is heartwarming and quite fitting now that I think about it.


Yep...I loved Father Remirez's post to you as well...great post F.R!!
EDIT: and if you're really a minister of sorts...sorry about my icon if you find it offensive...lol


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## Father Ramirez (Sep 14, 2013)

Offensive, abuilder? Hardley, friend! Being a man of the cloth does not preclude having a diverse sense of humor. I have learned from you as well, so thanks.


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## abuilder (Sep 14, 2013)

Father Ramirez said:


> Offensive, abuilder? Hardley, friend! Being a man of the cloth does not preclude having a diverse sense of humor. I have learned from you as well, so thanks.


and as a man of the cloth you must have great respect for my man Abbie Hoffman, may he rest in peace.... so bless you my son , or would that be my father..or..well..you know what I mean my brother ....and I'll leave you with a flash from the past by a great fighter of human rights.. http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/chicago7/hoffman.html


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## Father Ramirez (Sep 14, 2013)

Abbie's heart was in the right place, but he was too much of a wise ass to be effective at winning over the other side. He was part revolutionary, part stand up comic. Interesting read...I like that 'the witness' confirmed exorcising evil spirits from the Pentagon -LoL. Throughout history, sadly, arms and religion (or just a crazy belief system in Hitler's case) have made for a tragic combo.


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## abuilder (Sep 14, 2013)

Father Ramirez said:


> Abbie's heart was in the right place, but he was too much of a wise ass to be effective at winning over the other side. He was part revolutionary, part stand up comic. Interesting read...I like that 'the witness' confirmed exorcising evil spirits from the Pentagon -LoL. Throughout history, sadly, arms and religion (or just a crazy belief system in Hitler's case) have made for a tragic combo.


He did a lot most people don't even know about. they only know him for his wise guy street theater antics, which btw, wasn't just about being a wise guy. It was about shocking people into see what was going on in Nam, Washington, the court system, public education...so on and so forth and did you know while he was underground disguised as mild-mannered citizen activist Barry Freed, he was appointed to a federal environmental commission by President Carter....and awarded a citation from New York Gov. Hugh Carey for his environmental work. After the disguised Hoffman..aka Barry Freed, in a suit and tie, gave calm and reasoned testimony to a U.S. congressional committee, Sen. Daniel Patrick Moynihan leaned into his microphone and reportedly said, &#8220;Mr. Freed, after listening to you, now I know that the &#8216;60s are finally over.&#8221; 
It was absolutely amazing that abbie made many many newspapers in photo ops with Daniel Moynahan and others in Congress and no one knew he was wanted by the FBI. One amazing man....


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## Father Ramirez (Sep 15, 2013)

ab... If somehow my post inspired your memory of this man you find inspirational, I'm happy to have done so. Lest others think I did not give props to k0ijn after he graciously acknowledged my post, I had answered him directly after his post in a thread I started; "What a treat to receive your thorough reply! Thanks, k0ijn. I've listened to her from the start, when we set the estimated harvest date as Sept 19, the harvest moon, but we had no idea how the plant would grow, or even if it was female. We're very lucky our unskilled hands have tended this beauty. The aroma! Grapefruit and pine cones: care to guess at a strain? I wish we could let it fill the house. (apology for lack or new paragraph - this tablet just won't do it!) Fresh question k0ijn; - and I reluctantly ask it because I so want to believe the answer is YES. Having learned about coconut water on orchid and pepper forums as well as here, I used it at 15:1 and the buds appeared to spurt. A few days ago I opened a fresh coco, not a can, and overnight they grew nearly 1" and are clearly loaded with fattened calyxes. *Did coco water have anything to do with it, or is it just the plant's natural timing?* ty, k!


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## Crankyxr (Sep 15, 2013)

gwailo said:


> I just got my 100x loupe today and I'm seeing a few amber trichomes. Looks like I need to harvest as soon as possible. Here are some pics i took today.


DO NOT HARVEST YET.
you have at the VERY least 5 weeks to go until harvest


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## k0ijn (Sep 15, 2013)

Father Ramirez said:


> Fresh question k0ijn; - and I reluctantly ask it because I so want to believe the answer is YES. Having learned about coconut water on orchid and pepper forums as well as here, I used it at 15:1 and the buds appeared to spurt. A few days ago I opened a fresh coco, not a can, and overnight they grew nearly 1" and are clearly loaded with fattened calyxes. *Did coco water have anything to do with it, or is it just the plant's natural timing?* ty, k!


Well that is a tough question.
I would like to say yes and it probably is a yes, the only issue I have is that we do not have much research on this subject.
I do think however that certain aspects of coconut water and how people use it to stimulate growth & prevent diseases in plants is rooted in facts and does have positive effects.

I haven't read all this research but what I've found is this:

http://www.pakbs.org/pjbot/PDFs/40(6)/PJB40(6)2355.pdf
http://connection.ebscohost.com/c/articles/47364201/mature-coconut-as-bio-fermentor-multiplication-plant-growth-promoting-rhizobacteria

What we can take from this research is that coconut water has properties which highly stimulate beneficial bacteria growth.
The type of bacteria in question is Rhizobacteria, which stimulates rapid root growth and helps prevent diseases.
If plants mediums are started out with a dose of coconut water the beneficial bacteria growth is increased and the plants will most likely show an increased growth rate compared to non treated mediums.

Another study showed that the growth of kiwi fruits were significantly higher when treated with coconut water, also the decay of the fruits was more rapid in plants not treated with coconut water, and this decay would reverse when put on a coconut water solution.


On top of what I mentioned above coconut water is also highly sought after because of plant growth hormones which it carries, the Cytokinins.
Let me quote a passage about these hormones:



> some respects they are similar to human hormones with a similar name of cytokines. Cytokinins are also known as anti-aging hormones. Cytokinins regulate cell division and influence the rate at which plants age. Depending on the amount of cytokinins present, the aging process in plants can be either accelerated or retarded. One of the active sites of cytokinin production is in the roots. From here the hormone is carried by the sap throughout the plant&#8212;much like our bloodstream disperses hormones. Portions of plants that are deprived of cytokinins age faster than normal, Conversely, if additional cytokinins are added to a plant, normal aging is retarded.


Reference:
http://www.coconutresearchcenter.org/Coconut%20Water%20Dew%20from%20the%20Heavens.htm
There are references to scientific papers at the bottom of the page I linked above.

All of this is quite interesting and proves that coconut water has many benefits, not just to plants but also to humans, since the human cells react in a similar fashion to the Cytokinins as plants do.
Again, not as many studies have been done on this subject as we would like, but there is definitely scientific basis and evidence for the beneficial effects.


So to answer your question, yes coconut water does help stimulate growth, improve disease defenses & somewhat halt aging in Cannabis, whether it works flawlessly in every situation and how the variables affect this is however not really known.


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## abuilder (Sep 15, 2013)

k0ijn said:


> All of this is quite interesting and proves that coconut water has many benefits, not just to plants but also to humans, since the human cells react in a similar fashion to the Cytokinins as plants do.


This is one of THE reasons I became an indoor farmer....the correlation between plants and people is a mirror image in so many ways. Growing plants is one of the greatest tools in understanding how we as humans grow...get sick and get well...and when done right..it'll even get you high in all kinds of healthy ways...


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## Father Ramirez (Sep 15, 2013)

k0ijn; "So to answer your question, yes coconut water does help stimulate growth, improve disease defenses & somewhat halt aging in Cannabis, whether it works flawlessly in every situation and how the variables affect this is however not really known."

Great articles referenced, and I will read those, so thanks again for more than thorough work, k0ijn!


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## Father Ramirez (Sep 15, 2013)

abuilder: "

Growing plants is one of the greatest tools in understanding how we as humans grow..."​





Over the course of growing this plant, I began to pay better attention to what I fed myself. I made sure I gave myself the right nutrients at the right times, and I stayed hydrated. I exercised a lot. I've lost 25 lbs since April and I've built muscle mass. I feel fantastic, and I don't think I'd have gotten into such good shape had not my caring for this plant been my inspiration.


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## Father Ramirez (Sep 16, 2013)

k0ijn, thanks again for the coco water analysis links. I found it helpful, and curious, to learn that a 20:1 ratio delivered more vigorous growth than either 15:1 or 25:1. It also retards aging and heals sick plants; could that account for the fresh growth spurt as the plant was nearing maturity? HA... one more way I messed with its bio-engineering. 

Today's coco contained 14oz of water, so I drank half myself, and added the rest to a gallon for feed. Let's hope it retards aging in humans too. 

The bud below is typical of the 14 small colas. The sample for the microscope was taken from the single most mature bud, and from deep in the top. While I can't steady the camera better than that, it looks to me like that one cola is done. The others show more clear and less amber trichomes, and fresh pistils at the top and perimeter. We had loosely planned to harvest on day 70, September 19, the Harvest Moon, months ago, and now she looks like that could be the day.


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## k0ijn (Sep 17, 2013)

abuilder said:


> This is one of THE reasons I became an indoor farmer....the correlation between plants and people is a mirror image in so many ways. Growing plants is one of the greatest tools in understanding how we as humans grow...get sick and get well...and when done right..it'll even get you high in all kinds of healthy ways...


It is indeed a pretty great addition to the already wonderful experience of growing.


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## k0ijn (Sep 17, 2013)

Father Ramirez said:


> k0ijn, thanks again for the coco water analysis links. I found it helpful, and curious, to learn that a 20:1 ratio delivered more vigorous growth than either 15:1 or 25:1. It also retards aging and heals sick plants; could that account for the fresh growth spurt as the plant was nearing maturity? HA... one more way I messed with its bio-engineering.
> 
> Today's coco contained 14oz of water, so I drank half myself, and added the rest to a gallon for feed. Let's hope it retards aging in humans too.
> 
> ...



You're welcome,

And yes that probably is why the growth spurt occurred, although there were probably several factors involved in what happened.


The cola does look near peak, although it isn't really as swollen as I would like to see it, but that might be because of other variables (I'm thinking your lighting setup).
Giving it until the 19th sounds like a good idea, you could probably go a few days more if you wanted to, but who can argue with the Harvest Moon.


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## smokin away (Sep 17, 2013)

k0ijn said:


> Thank you for your kind words.
> 
> I guess it does come down to tradition and routine for some people, it can be hard to let go of things you've done for a long time, and certainly the brain can easily be taught/fooled into taking fiction for facts even when faced with evidence.
> I don't personally have anything against people who pre-harvest flush, the only thing I ask is that people don't claim it's scientifically proven to work and/or try to teach it as fact/evidence to impressionable people.
> ...



Your tip about using molasses is the rave. I used it on a bud with clear going to cloudy tri chromes. I could actually see the bud fatten up overnight. Just simply amazing and wonderful idea. Enclosed is a link from eHow explaining and backing up what you said. I went with Dark Molasses at 1Tbs/gal. I just love simple organic items for final stage as it's much safer than "God knows what's in the other stuff".


http://www.ehow.com/info_8787392_molasses-water-plant-food.html


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## Father Ramirez (Sep 19, 2013)

k0ijn wrote:


> The cola does look near peak, although it isn't really as swollen as I would like to see it, but that might be because of other variables (I'm thinking your lighting setup).


 I know you need big light if you want big buds, but I believe that pH imbalance, nitrogen deficiency, and maniacal defoliation were other factors in this grow. I'm confident that correcting those conditions will improve yield even with those household LEDs.


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## k0ijn (Sep 19, 2013)

Father Ramirez said:


> k0ijn wrote: I know you need big light if you want big buds, but I believe that pH imbalance, nitrogen deficiency, and maniacal defoliation were other factors in this grow. I'm confident that correcting those conditions will improve yield even with those household LEDs.


In either case you should be happy with the result given what you're working with.
Many people who have better setups end up with less.


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## k0ijn (Sep 19, 2013)

smokin away said:


> Your tip about using molasses is the rave. I used it on a bud with clear going to cloudy tri chromes. I could actually see the bud fatten up overnight. Just simply amazing and wonderful idea. Enclosed is a link from eHow explaining and backing up what you said. I went with Dark Molasses at 1Tbs/gal. I just love simple organic items for final stage as it's much safer than "God knows what's in the other stuff".
> 
> 
> http://www.ehow.com/info_8787392_molasses-water-plant-food.html


I'm glad to hear you found it helpful.
I wish ehow would use scientific references though.


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## pinkymalone (Sep 19, 2013)

My first time growing(SD). All of the hairs are orange. Got a loupe & think the trichomes are clear. Is it a noticeable difference when they get milky?


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## pinkymalone (Sep 19, 2013)

What's the 2 days of darkness about?


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## k0ijn (Sep 20, 2013)

pinkymalone said:


> My first time growing(SD). All of the hairs are orange. Got a loupe & think the trichomes are clear. Is it a noticeable difference when they get milky?


I suggest you read (or reread) the first post in this thread.


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## Medipablo (Sep 20, 2013)

2nd time grower here. Trichs trichs trichs, the only sure fire Way of knowing when to harvest. If you harvest too early you will want to chop your balls off later. Also, check the trichs all over the plant. Tops mature faster. 

You will know the difference of clear, cloudy, and amber, trust me. Ignore the trichs that are close to red hairs, they arent really amber, especially if you use those pocket scopes with led lights on them. Seriously, harvesting early sux donkey balls. Your weed will suck, will not be potent, will not last long(the high), and you will want to sever your balls, or vagina.

I Díd, Saved them in a jar though, to remind me to always be patient, cuz its a virtue bitches







pinkymalone said:


> My first time growing(SD). All of the hairs are orange. Got a loupe & think the trichomes are clear. Is it a noticeable difference when they get milky?


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## Father Ramirez (Sep 24, 2013)

Bumbling and faltering at nearly every step like a pregnant teen caught by surprise, thanks to the good folk on RIU we managed to finish with a small volume of top tier product. Thanks to all. I'm officially hooked. I even experienced something like post partum depression:_ I miss the bright lights!_


----------



## chuck estevez (Sep 24, 2013)

smokin away said:


> Your tip about using molasses is the rave. I used it on a bud with clear going to cloudy tri chromes. *I could actually see the bud fatten up overnight*. Just simply amazing and wonderful idea. Enclosed is a link from eHow explaining and backing up what you said. I went with Dark Molasses at 1Tbs/gal. I just love simple organic items for final stage as it's much safer than "God knows what's in the other stuff".
> 
> 
> http://www.ehow.com/info_8787392_molasses-water-plant-food.html


Gonna stir up the hornets nest here a little. First, I'm calling Bullshit on this claim. Second, i only read this last page, and it appeared to me that Kojn said 

_egarding sugar/molasses (or even honey which some people use) I would say that we need to make a distinction between the fictional, subjective fantasy part of the argument and the scientific.
The discussion surrounding sugars is very muddled and has as much to do with personal preference as it has to do with science, which is why the distinction is important to make.
Some of the things these formulas are mentioned to help with include; hardening the buds, growth spurts & flavour improvements.
I would argue that these three topics are highly mythical and subjective, some have to do with the conditions of the grow, some have to do with genetics & strains and some are just flat out myths. 
I would not use any sugar additive to achieve any of these things since I personally see it as fairy stories and placebo/marketing successes.
What I mean is there is no concrete science backing up the claims. 

_
​


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## chuck estevez (Sep 24, 2013)

and trace amounts of micronutes?? go spit in the ocean, there is now trace amounts of your spit in there. A good read on molasses http://www.thesoilguy.com/SG/Molasses


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## smokin away (Sep 24, 2013)

chuck estevez said:


> Gonna stir up the hornets nest here a little. First, I'm calling Bullshit on this claim. Second, i only read this last page, and it appeared to me that Kojn said
> 
> _egarding sugar/molasses (or even honey which some people use) I would say that we need to make a distinction between the fictional, subjective fantasy part of the argument and the scientific.
> The discussion surrounding sugars is very muddled and has as much to do with personal preference as it has to do with science, which is why the distinction is important to make.
> ...




_
I'm photographically challenged at the moment otherwise I could show you a photo. Kojin also went on to say:



I do think however that molasses & sugar formulas can help with stimulating the enzymes and beneficial bacteria environment in the grow medium.
This subject is not really up to debate (in contrast to the three previously mentioned), it's scientific fact that these sugars have their uses in soil and/or mediums which have an active living root system (presence of -and thriving Mycorrhizae). 
In basic terms: The sugars & carbohydrates feed the bacteria which helps maintain a thriving root environment which in turn produces healthy plants. 
If you do have access to molasses for example I would give it a go to see if you can improve the general well-being of your plants.
The root environment is also stimulated, however saying which exact formula works best is difficult as it depends on a lot of variables.
I would go with the basic molasses though and not fall into the marketing trap of the huge companies trying to make a quick buck.
I hope that explained it well enough.

This is pretty much what is said on the site you posted. ​
_​_The results I achieved were on an outside grow planted in the soil. I have been adding it once week at a Tbs/gal. and getting great results. I use Dark Molasses made from sugar in Louisiana. It has great flavour as well. 

_​


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## k0ijn (Sep 24, 2013)

Father Ramirez said:


> View attachment 2833952Bumbling and faltering at nearly every step like a pregnant teen caught by surprise, thanks to the good folk on RIU we managed to finish with a small volume of top tier product. Thanks to all. I'm officially hooked. I even experienced something like post partum depression:_ I miss the bright lights!_


Congrats on your harvest, now comes to hard wait for the cure to work its wonders.


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## chuck estevez (Sep 24, 2013)

smokin away said:


> _
> I'm photographically challenged at the moment otherwise I could show you a photo. Kojin also went on to say:
> 
> 
> ...


again, bullshit. It does Nothing for flavor


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## smokin away (Sep 24, 2013)

chuck estevez said:


> again, bullshit. It does Nothing for flavor




Granted it could be a trait of the Indica strain. There are certainly many factors for flavor. It really does taste very sweet.

I like your fancy highlighting. That's a real neat trick.

Maybe you could answer the question of the season sir? What is one supposed to use on a bud that will be harvested within two weeks? It certainly doesn't need any more nutes because she has already consumed them. It does however need more than just water but not as much as it was using. This is outside in soil where a garden was worked previously. I have limited budget and do not have time to order something. I grow strictly organic.


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## joedaddy805 (Sep 25, 2013)

well i just the best pic i could and i see alot of amber in it. can you let me know what you think


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## chuck estevez (Sep 25, 2013)

smokin away said:


> Granted it could be a trait of the Indica strain. There are certainly many factors for flavor. It really does taste very sweet.
> 
> I like your fancy highlighting. That's a real neat trick.
> 
> Maybe you could answer the question of the season sir? What is one supposed to use on a bud that will be harvested within two weeks? It certainly doesn't need any more nutes because she has already consumed them. It does however need more than just water but not as much as it was using. This is outside in soil where a garden was worked previously. I have limited budget and do not have time to order something. I grow strictly organic.


That is a can of worms i would rather not open up. I grow indoor with veg nutes start to finish.


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## johnp410 (Sep 27, 2013)

Quick question my buddy is growing berry bomb, he says trichs are 70% amber i passed on this info to him. He also has alot of white hairs still. What should I tell him?


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## smokin away (Sep 29, 2013)

I've been using molasses in a soil grow with good results. I found this link on eHow that explains how to use it in a hydroponic system as well. It can be as easy as spraying the leaves with it. It was discussed earlier in this thread so this is just another item to add.

http://www.ehow.com/how_8280854_use-molasses-hydroponics.html


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## smokin away (Sep 29, 2013)

johnp410 said:


> Quick question my buddy is growing berry bomb, he says trichs are 70% amber i passed on this info to him. He also has alot of white hairs still. What should I tell him?


How come you ain't smokin it yet? If you would have been reading most posts suggest 10 to 15% amber. Now if you know how many you have - how come you ain't smokin it yet?


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## Sire Killem All (Oct 3, 2013)

too HARVESt? or not to harvest


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## abuilder (Oct 3, 2013)

Sire Killem All said:


> too HARVESt? or not to harvest


photos aren't that clear but I think I see white pistils...so I'd wait till they all recede..and I'd check the trichs with a scope to be sure..


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## smokin away (Oct 8, 2013)

I suppose everyone hangs the buds up different. I just wanted to pass on a tip I tried this week. Just take a twist tie and wind it around as usual. Instead of using a hanger or rope use a piece of foil tape (like used on ventilation pipes) and stick to the ceiling of a cabinet. Shut the door and leave it hang. It really saves space in case you don't have a closet handy.


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## Steelheader3430 (Oct 8, 2013)

I'm stumped here I got half of my pistils still white, but at least 30% of my trics are amber. Not many cloudy ones that I can see seems they are changing quickly. The strain is ak48. they started showing flower 37 days ago, 11 days after flip to 12/12.View attachment 2851148 I'm having trouble uploading pics from my phone I'll try again.


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## Steelheader3430 (Oct 8, 2013)

View attachment 2851149 Finally. I'm getting anxious which is bad. Thanks guys.


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## fuking (Oct 9, 2013)

Steelheader3430 said:


> View attachment 2851149 Finally. I'm getting anxious which is bad. Thanks guys.


The old "white hairs no chop" bullshit is strain dependent. If you have checked the majority of the plant and are seeing 30% amber then it's time.


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## giggle stick (Nov 2, 2013)

All my buds have about 50 to 70% pistols turn orange and curl but the very top cola hairs are still white the trichomes are very milkey does the top Cole change last? thank you for the post and ur time


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## TDM (Nov 26, 2013)

Takes an eye at first but is very obvious when using right magnification, some say you can use 10x mag, but is much better at 60x-100x


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## TDM (Nov 26, 2013)

Impossible to tell from here, looking good though.


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## JosHendi (Nov 26, 2013)

Every strain is different, but a good general belief is that Indica/Sativa is the main factor in type of high (Sativa=uplifting and Indica=couchlock). From my experiences, it seems that if you harvest the specific phenotypes somewhat according to the general assumptions (Sativas early, Indicas late), you get the best high that strain can offer. (Ideally you know what pheno you are growing anyways)


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## k0ijn (Nov 27, 2013)

JosHendi said:


> Every strain is different, but a good general belief is that Indica/Sativa is the main factor in type of high (Sativa=uplifting and Indica=couchlock). From my experiences, it seems that if you harvest the specific phenotypes somewhat according to the general assumptions (Sativas early, Indicas late), you get the best high that strain can offer. (Ideally you know what pheno you are growing anyways)


You shouldn't harvest Sativas and Indicas differently, they should both be harvested when they are at peak potency as already specified and explained in this thread.
If you harvest a Sativa or Indica early, you are not getting the full potential of the particular strain, due to the cannabinoids not "maturing" fully.
If you harvest a Sativa or Indica late, you are not getting the full potential of the particular strain, due to an increased percentage of CBN relative to THCA. 

In both cases (early & late harvesting) you are hurting the potential potency of your plant(s).


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## gary3059 (Dec 3, 2013)

whats up folks ? newbie here with a question..i am using promix for soil..i want to use the general hydroponics go box for my nutes..will these nutes take me from veg to harvest without purchasing any other nutes and not sacrifice quality of nuggs?


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## Father Ramirez (Dec 11, 2013)

k0ijn said:


> Congrats on your harvest, now comes to hard wait for the cure to work its wonders.


It wasn't too hard on us, k0jin, as we had commercial product to see us through until now. What a taste! What a high! We're at it again, and lessons learned here are paying off big time. I'll post pics of the fresh grow; in LED section only because I'm using household bulbs. I am NOT an LED techy.


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## gunslinger13 (Dec 13, 2013)

very informative thread, thank you for sharing


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## k0ijn (Dec 31, 2013)

Father Ramirez said:


> It wasn't too hard on us, k0jin, as we had commercial product to see us through until now. What a taste! What a high! We're at it again, and lessons learned here are paying off big time. I'll post pics of the fresh grow; in LED section only because I'm using household bulbs. I am NOT an LED techy.


I'm glad to hear it worked out, it'll only get better with experience if you keep up the work ethic.
I'll check out your LED grow when I have more time to be on the forums ^^


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## Littlebigpap (Jan 12, 2014)

I thought hairs was just
..hairs..the darker the hair is the better.... thanks brah!


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## CannaCole (Jan 13, 2014)

k0jin,

Awesome thread! First grow.

So just to be clear if you're using proper nute amount no water or flush in general is needed? 

Also no 2 day black out helps oils build up before chop?

How do these trichs look?

View attachment 2961606
View attachment 2961607


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## Raoul Duke1 (Jan 14, 2014)

FrostyTheBudMan said:


> Looks like time, got a chance to check this morning and seeing amber! Darkness for two days then chop chop, so close I can taste it now!
> View attachment 2102387


I personally wait 4 to 5 days after I know they are done always does me right


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## k0ijn (Jan 15, 2014)

CannaCole said:


> k0jin,
> 
> Awesome thread! First grow.
> 
> ...


Hello CannaCole,

Flushing in general is used as an error-correcting measure, if you for example have fluctuating pH-levels or if you have a salt buildup in your medium.
Pre-harvest flushing is a variation of flushing in which some people flush near harvest to rid their plants of "bad stuff", it's an old tale, used over a lot of years which has no basis in science.
I've written a lot about this topic on this forum, everything is there for people to read if they want to.

I don't know what the other thing is you're talking about, it sounds like some of your friends are telling you fairy tales.
I mean 2 days of darkness should help oils (what oils?) build up before harvesting? Sounds ridiculous.

I cannot see the trichomes properly, the pictures you've taken are very low res and bad quality, either get a loupe and take a look or use a camera with ~5+MP so you can take high res pictures.
From what I can see (reflection wise), whatever part of the bud that is and how big those buds are, the trichomes don't look very mature.


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## CannaCole (Jan 15, 2014)

k0ijn said:


> Hello CannaCole,
> 
> Flushing in general is used as an error-correcting measure, if you for example have fluctuating pH-levels or if you have a salt buildup in your medium.
> Pre-harvest flushing is a variation of flushing in which some people flush near harvest to rid their plants of "bad stuff", it's an old tale, used over a lot of years which has no basis in science.
> ...


Thanks! 

The 48 hours I meant Resin not oil. Read Jorges book and he said 48 hours lights out help resin production. 

I bought a new scope so I'll try and take better pics.


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## k0ijn (Jan 16, 2014)

CannaCole said:


> Thanks!
> 
> The 48 hours I meant Resin not oil. Read Jorges book and he said 48 hours lights out help resin production.
> 
> I bought a new scope so I'll try and take better pics.


I don't mean to disrespect Jorge or any of his peers but he is just a writer, he is not educated in biology, although he does know his fair share of science.
I haven't seen any proof of a darkness period assisting in resin production and neither has the scientific community.
I wouldn't take these kind of theories that those types of writers come up with too seriously, they are just that, theories.

It might be hard for you to take pictures through a scope/loupe, but at least you'll be able to see for yourself.
I'd might add that a 5MP camera really isn't that expensive these days, many phones actually have more than 5MP in the built-in camera.


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## OneloveGrower (Jan 16, 2014)

Hello k0jin and all other members who have made this thread the most informative I have ever read!

It has come to my attention that the "color of light" has a tremendous effect on bud growth, ripening 
of white pistils to orange, as well as the production - quantity/size of trichomes.

I have also noticed that the aging of trichomes seem to be similar on the same plants using the same 
hydro reservoir but under different 12/12 bloom lights.

So, I have come to the conclusion that the color/quality of light plays a dramatic role in the pistils ripening,
but not so much in the aging of trichomes. 

As far as I can tell, the more blue spectrum - 480nm, 460nm, 440nm, 415nm - you have, the longer it will take for the pistils to turn orange.

 Some people may think that it is a specific genetic trait of the particular plant that controls this transformation, I have found it not to be true.

Your thoughts?


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## CannaCole (Jan 16, 2014)

k0ijn said:


> I don't mean to disrespect Jorge or any of his peers but he is just a writer, he is not educated in biology, although he does know his fair share of science.
> I haven't seen any proof of a darkness period assisting in resin production and neither has the scientific community.
> I wouldn't take these kind of theories that those types of writers come up with too seriously, they are just that, theories.
> 
> ...


Thanks. Understood. It will be in the dark hanging after chop :thumbup:

The better scope showed mostly clear so alittle bit longer.


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## k0ijn (Jan 17, 2014)

OneloveGrower said:


> Hello k0jin and all other members who have made this thread the most informative I have ever read!
> 
> It has come to my attention that the "color of light" has a tremendous effect on bud growth, ripening
> of white pistils to orange, as well as the production - quantity/size of trichomes.
> ...


Hello OneloveGrower,

I'm not quite sure what your questions are but it is correct that the colour band is relative to how plants grow.

For example the 380nm - 400nm range is the start of the visible spectrum and is the band range where chlorophyll absorption begins.
The 400nm - 520nm range is where peak absorption of chlorophyll is observed, it is also the range which promotes vegetative growth.
The 610nm - 720nm range is the red band of the spectrum and is the band which promotes flowering.
The range in between 520nm and 610nm includes green, yellow and orange bands, and has far less pigment absorption.

These range bands directly relate to the colour spectrum which is why you might have read about the violet, blue & green bands referring to vegetative growth, and why you've might have read about the red band referring to flowering.


The points you bring up are from home experiments I assume?
Do you have any scientific research which backs up your theories or are you just sharing your personal findings?

The reason why the violet/blue part of the band affects how quickly the plants (including the pistils) matures is because that band range promotes growth, not flowering/budding, vice versa with regards to the red band.

This is also why growers use specific lights which promote the kind of growth or maturity that the growers want.
Just make sure that you remember the difference between the wavelength and the colour temperature (measured in Kelvin), it can be confusing if you don't remember that they are two different ways of plotting colours in the spectrum.


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## OneloveGrower (Jan 19, 2014)

Hello k0jin,

No question... just wanted your thoughts on spectrums of light and how cannabis reacts,
while trying to keep it in the context of this thread. Thank You!

Also, no scientific research backing up my experiences - just what I observed in the flower room.

Thanks again!


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## OneloveGrower (Jan 21, 2014)

Hello Everyone!

SLH at 60 Days!
Looks like a week/10 days more?

Maybe hard to tell, but more ambers on the lower 
leaves than on the tops of the colas.


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## k0ijn (Jan 25, 2014)

OneloveGrower said:


> Hello Everyone!
> 
> SLH at 60 Days!
> Looks like a week/10 days more?
> ...


If you want a proper guesstimate then you need to take some pictures which show the entire cola (or even plant).

From what I can tell you have an abundance of clear trichomes and just a few cloudy, I'd say that the plant can take at least 2 weeks until it's properly matured.


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## OneloveGrower (Jan 27, 2014)

Hello k0jin,

Day 66 - SLH Images.

Trichomes are a bit more amber on the leaves.
Your estimate of 14 more days from the last images (day 60) are probably accurate.

Let me know what you think after reviewing the images below.


Thanks again!


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## Macto (Jan 27, 2014)

Yeah they look almost done dude, maybe just a couple more days, that's just me doe


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## OneloveGrower (Jan 28, 2014)

Macto said:


> Yeah they look almost done dude, maybe just a couple more days, that's just me doe


Hey Macto,

I think you are right... this batch is going to run about 70 days!
This is my first attempt at Super Lemon Haze.


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## k0ijn (Jan 31, 2014)

OneloveGrower said:


> Hello k0jin,
> 
> Day 66 - SLH Images.
> 
> ...


The last image of one calyx looks mature but the two first ones look youngish imo. 
Some of the images display young growth but I assume that might be because you took images of lower calyxes as well.
I would still keep to my initial estimate, if you just keep an eye on the trichomes and let the top calyxes (at least) swell up nicely at their own pace you should end up with a good harvest.


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## Macto (Jan 31, 2014)

this is from 1 plant, and it looks like the others are heading that direction, should i flush and get ready for harvest??? can a plant keep going without sugar leaves? happy growing everyone.


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## m.kafi (Feb 2, 2014)

I have 22 babies and 5 of them are like this...


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## k0ijn (Feb 6, 2014)

m.kafi said:


> View attachment 2982187
> I have 22 babies and 5 of them are like this...


If you are referring to the height of the sprout; the light is too far away (it stretches to get the light it needs).


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## k0ijn (Feb 6, 2014)

Macto said:


> View attachment 2980306View attachment 2980307View attachment 2980308View attachment 2980309 this is from 1 plant, and it looks like the others are heading that direction, should i flush and get ready for harvest??? can a plant keep going without sugar leaves? happy growing everyone.


Seems like you have a severe nutrient deficiency, you should recheck your feeding dosage.
However at this stage it might be too late to reverse successfully before harvest.
Flushing will only exacerbate the problem. Pre-harvest flushing doesn't do what you think it does anyway, I suggest you read up on it.


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## k0ijn (Feb 6, 2014)

Macto said:


> this is from 1 plant, and it looks like the others are heading that direction, should i flush and get ready for harvest??? can a plant keep going without sugar leaves? happy growing everyone.



Seems like you have a severe nutrient deficiency, you should recheck your feeding dosage.
However at this stage it might be too late to reverse successfully before harvest.
Flushing will only exacerbate the problem. Pre-harvest flushing doesn't do what you think it does anyway, I suggest you read up on it.


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## charleyharle (Feb 8, 2014)

Albino Rhino, most buds of mine are clear or cloudy with just a few turning amber, the top tops have strange looking leaves on them and the top looks like it's trying to get taller, should I harvest now or wait a few more days.


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## k0ijn (Feb 8, 2014)

charleyharle said:


> Albino Rhino, most buds of mine are clear or cloudy with just a few turning amber, the top tops have strange looking leaves on them and the top looks like it's trying to get taller, should I harvest now or wait a few more days.


There's not enough information in your post to give you a decent answer.

Post some high-res pictures of the entire plant and the sections you are worried about.


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## Sleepybud (Feb 12, 2014)

Hi, I'm just finishing my first grow. Already have 4 of 6 chopped and hanging. The trichomes appeared mostly cloudy. So far, I'm very pleased. 

Do you think I should not take a plant out of the flower room for 48 + or - hrs before chopping?

I grew in 50/50 Pro mix/ FFOF and used the Fox Farm 'Soil Feeding Schedule' using their liquid and dry products. Followed the feeding schedule to the T and at the end I fed and watered a couple days later, then began harvesting.

My question(s) about this is: Should I have waited any period of time between Veg and Flower? And should it be in complete darkness? And what type of feeding should I do during this period of time?


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## curiousuk (Feb 15, 2014)

Sleepybud said:


> Do you think I should not take a plant out of the flower room for 48 + or - hrs before chopping?


Ive been putting my plants into 48 hour darkness since i first read about it back in 2005 an it hasnt harmed any of my harvests. So unless anyone with more experince claims different i would stick to 48 hours before chopping.




Sleepybud said:


> My question(s) about this is: Should I have waited any period of time between Veg and Flower? And should it be in complete darkness? And what type of feeding should I do during this period of time?


If your vegging an decide tis time to jump into flowering stick to the flowering. switching back an forth may not be harmful to see the sex of the plants. But switching back from veg to flowrinring to often migth mentally screw the plants an i dont even want to think what that could result in.

During the lights out timing YES it means FULL darkness. as your plants will need time to rest at some point. If your sticking to the nute schedule and theres nothing wrong during the vegging then you ONLY need to change from the vegging nutes over to the flowering nutes when you decide to go from vegging over to flowering period.

Few things to remember with nutes


Grow nutes = Vegging period
Bloom Nutes = Flowering period

A tip many growers will hint about nute feeding an it is pretty wise. Less nutes is sometimes better than more nutes. 
(sounds confusing but underfeed nutes is not as harmful as overfeeding them...)


with any nutes feeding its always ideal to begin feeding them half the recommended doze to slowly introduce your plants to the new nutes. And then slowly build up the nute dosage as you keep the feedings going to ensure you dont give them a doze which will drop them on there butts at the first herdle.

In time your plants will show you how there are handling the additions to there feeding. I didnt realise this until i begin to see it during the grows.


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## Skunkd91 (Feb 18, 2014)

What's up guy. So I'm growing a few plants right now that are pretty late in the flower stage. About week 9. My problem is I'm always unsure when to cut. I have a 100x magnifier so I can see the trichomes well. Their all milky white with a few amber here and there. So I started my flush. I'm growing dwc by the way. This is my first time with hydro. With past harvest I've always cut too early or too late and haven't gotten the curing process down yet. But what worries me with them now is they seem to have stopped swelling although they still have lots of white hairs. Trichomes like I said are milky. But the buds are softer to the touch. I harvested late once before and the bud turned out almost spongey. Not compressed at all. Ill see if I can attach some pics with this and hope to get some feedback.


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## hawks29 (Feb 19, 2014)

Hey man i'm on my first grow here, Nirvana Snow whites. Currently on day 75 of flowering and wondering if these are ready... Looked at them under a scope and its pretty much clouds and maybe 1 percent amber.


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## Sleepybud (Feb 26, 2014)

Curiousuk, thanks man! I did exactly what you said. Fed the last week of Veg nutes, watered(flush) and when they were ready, fed them Flower nutes and flipped from 600W MH @18hrs to a 600W HPS @12 hours and voila, I was in flower! I had read earlier in this post(maybe I misunderstood, could also be the case) that between Veg and Flower, you should keep your plants in the dark for a period of time(like two days...) before introducing to the Flower nutes and the 12hr light period. I didn't do this.

I also do understand that lights-out time is in complete darkness. Thank you very much for the response!


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## StykyBudz (Mar 19, 2014)

I'm starting week 8 of flower on this special queen plant. Can anyone tell if she is close to being ready?


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## chuck estevez (Mar 19, 2014)

StykyBudz said:


> I'm starting week 8 of flower on this special queen plant. Can anyone tell if she is close to being ready?


 another week or 2


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## lilmafia513 (Mar 19, 2014)

hawks29 said:


> Hey man i'm on my first grow here, Nirvana Snow whites. Currently on day 75 of flowering and wondering if these are ready... Looked at them under a scope and its pretty much clouds and maybe 1 percent amber.
> View attachment 3000108


Looks like about a week yet and she could come down


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## lilmafia513 (Mar 19, 2014)

StykyBudz said:


> I'm starting week 8 of flower on this special queen plant. Can anyone tell if she is close to being ready?


I agree with chuck, another 1-2 weeks.
Next time you take pics thru the loupe try zooming in after you put the loupe up to the lens. It will eliminate the bubble view in the pics.


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## StykyBudz (Mar 19, 2014)

Thanks for that suggestion I'll try it lol my scope just snaps to my phone I didn't even think about using zoom cause its already a 60x didn't think I'd get a clear view but I got another this morning that shows trichomes pretty clearly some look cloudy some clear I haven't seen any amber yet


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## kingfisher021 (Mar 20, 2014)

Ok so here is the story,

1/11/2013 put the seed in.

3/11/2013 : Seed popped. Was supposed to be an auto but this plant never autoflowered. It kept growing till third week of january, which is very close to three months of veg time. Survived the coldest months of the year, with tempratures going as low as 5-7 Degrees Celcius. (about 41 degree F). also turned hermie i think because of the cold or bad genetics, either way, i must have pulled off 3-4 nanners during the course of its growth. However very lucky that it has produced ZERO seeds. So not really sure what genetics it is.

22/01/2013: Finally I decided to try light deprivation, which i started in the third week of jan. started covering the whole plant with a big cardboard box a bit before sunset, 

27/01/2013 : Within 3-4 days i noticed the pistils forming and the start of flowering. continued with the light dep for about 10 or 12 days, and when i was sure it has started flowering i stopped putting the cardboard on top of it. so basically now this has been in flower since last week of january. probably at day 53-58 now.

02/03/2013 to 10/03/2013: Lots of un-seasonal rain. I think the rain water caused a nute lock out. started losing the fan leaves very rapidly, the buds started to dry out too and become lifeless. 

11/03/2013: Flushed the plant and it seemed to have worked. Although i lost all the fan leaves, the buds came back to life, the smell returned and how, and i could see the life come back.

14/03/2013: took a small sample from one of the lower branches. dried for three days and smoked it. very nice energetic high with a slight smile on the face. this smiling effect is completely missing from the hash i have been getting over here.

20/03/2014: lt seemed to me that a couple of the branches were ready to be chopped off. most of the pistils had turned, the color changed to brown/red from white. so today i copped of one of those branches. will dry it for a few days and see how it smokes.


I was wondering if the more experienced people here could help me determine how close is this to being ready? 



Overall look of the plant.....

i cant decide if they look clear or cloudy.....will someone please give me their inputs on this??? 

Some Amber trichomes making an appearance here....what do you think??? 

bud closeups.......


Through the shitty loupe......



BTW....it smells just GREAT 

cheers

KF


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## pixils (Mar 21, 2014)

I just went through this,does medicine that makesyou paranoid have anything to do with the amber trichomes ?


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## BWG707 (Mar 22, 2014)

Amber trics are usually associated with a "couch lock" high, very sedative. Some people tend to get that paranoid feeling when smoking more of a pre mature plant with no or minimal amber trics. Also some people are more apt to becoming paranoid from smoking Sativas as opposed to Indicas. You can google "paranoid when smoking cannabis", or something similar, to find more info.


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## chuck estevez (Mar 22, 2014)

BWG707 said:


> Amber trics are usually associated with a "couch lock" high, very sedative. Some people tend to get that paranoid feeling when smoking more of a pre mature plant with no or minimal amber trics. Also some people are more apt to becoming paranoid from smoking Sativas as opposed to Indicas. You can google "paranoid when smoking cannabis", or something similar, to find more info.


I was under the impression paranoia comes from very high THC% and low Cbd/n's. a high cbd/n % reduces paranoia, so I was led to believe.


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## BWG707 (Mar 22, 2014)

I'm not an expert by no means but what you stated is something I have heard also. High CBD's and low THC usually has a very slight if any "high" to it. If you still want a good "high" (everybody has their own opinion about what a good "high" is) without the paranoid feeling you could try a pure Indica (it's more of a body high). That paranoid feeling brought on after smoking bud can be due to many varibles. Are you prone to panic attacks, do you worry a lot, does getting high intimate you, are you getting high in uncomfortable surroundings, etc. There are many reasons why you have those paranoid feelings. All I can suggest is that you do your own research about your condition. I do understand what you are talking about though. I've had that paranoid feeling before. GL.


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## OneloveGrower (Apr 16, 2014)

Are We Ready?


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## k0ijn (Apr 20, 2014)

BWG707 said:


> Amber trics are usually associated with a "couch lock" high, very sedative. Some people tend to get that paranoid feeling when smoking more of a pre mature plant with no or minimal amber trics. Also some people are more apt to becoming paranoid from smoking Sativas as opposed to Indicas. You can google "paranoid when smoking cannabis", or something similar, to find more info.


It's a common misconception that amber trichs are responsible for the 'couch lock' high.
In fact it's the phenotype which determines the type of high you get (speaking energetic vs couch lock).
I wrote about this on the first page of this thread if I recall correctly so I won't repeat myself.


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## k0ijn (Apr 20, 2014)

OneloveGrower said:


> Are We Ready?


It's hard to make an informed decision without seeing the entire plant as well but I would say you aren't far off, the only stipulation I have is that the calyxes don't seem very swollen.


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## BWG707 (Apr 21, 2014)

k0ijn said:


> It's a common misconception that amber trichs are responsible for the 'couch lock' high.
> In fact it's the phenotype which determines the type of high you get (speaking energetic vs couch lock).
> I wrote about this on the first page of this thread if I recall correctly so I won't repeat myself.


That's very interesting and something that I haven't been able to find any data about. Could you supply your sources please. Thanks


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## Sativied (Apr 21, 2014)

k0ijn said:


> It's a common misconception that amber trichs are responsible for the 'couch lock' high.
> In fact it's the phenotype which determines the type of high you get (speaking energetic vs couch lock).


Well, you seem to think those are mutually exclusive and that's not the case. You are both correct. It's not only the phenotype OR the amber trichs, it's a combination of both. The article you quoted on the first page is based on the same research as Mel Frank's a Time to Reap article in hightimes years ago. The common misconception is actually that it's always the strains that produces a couch lock effect while it's often the amber (CBN) causing a sickly/slow feeling and people erroneously associate with high CBD strains that gives a body-relax/body-stones effect rather than a head-high, and not really a couchlock.

You are correct that "in fact it's the phenotype which determines the type of high you get", but as you quoted from the article, more amber is more CBN which "_produces a more sickly feeling not a true high_", which obviously influences hence also determines "the type of high you get". The fact the strain determines the type of high you get is a reason to get another strain if you want 'body-stoned' rather than wait for a certain % of amber.


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## k0ijn (Apr 23, 2014)

Sativied said:


> Well, you seem to think those are mutually exclusive and that's not the case. You are both correct. It's not only the phenotype OR the amber trichs, it's a combination of both. The article you quoted on the first page is based on the same research as Mel Frank's a Time to Reap article in hightimes years ago. The common misconception is actually that it's always the strains that produces a couch lock effect while it's often the amber (CBN) causing a sickly/slow feeling and people erroneously associate with high CBD strains that gives a body-relax/body-stones effect rather than a head-high, and not really a couchlock.


First off let me start by saying that we do not know everything about the interaction between cannabinoids nor everything about how they individually produce and/or alter psychoactive effects on our bodies.
But we do know a fair amount about a certain number of cannabinoids.

He was asking about "couch-lock, very sedative" which is by definition what a pure Indica strain will deliver.
The question whether a strain will deliver a head-high or a body-high relates purely to the phenotype (including hybrid vs non-hybrid). It has nothing to do with CBN nor CBD.

CBN is hardly psychoactive at all (in fact it's 90% less psychoactive than THC), and the properties it has are usually associated with a sickly ill feeling not anything related to a 'real high' (whether that be a head or a body high).
CBD is non-psychoactive so I don't know why you are talking about CBD strains giving a 'body-relax', CBD does not have any psychoactive properties and thus does not produce a high.

The interaction between the cannabinoids in the individual strain is what produces the specific high of a given strain.
Obviously not all Indicas or Sativas are the same and the highs have different properties, not only related to individual strains but also relative to the individual who ingests the Cannabis.
But the main effects (body vs head) is solely determine by phenotype and/or mixing of different phenotypes (hybrids).

All in all I don't get the point of your post, the phenotype is the main factor in determining whether a strain gives you a body-high or a head-high, which is what the initial question was about.
It wasn't about the finer details of the high which can be attributed to the interaction between the different cannabinoids.
And what you wrote about CBD is just wrong.


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## Sativied (Apr 23, 2014)

Point of my post was the same as pretty much all my posts. Discussion forum mean anything to you?  If you want to incorrectly claim the existence of a non-existing common misconception you should start a blog.

CBD does influence the high by counteracting the effects of THC but that's besides the point. You contradict yourself (and obviously don't really understand) what it means what you quoted from another article. You claim CBN does not influence the high while it gives a sickening feeling as you wrote in your first and last post. One could say it factually doesn't influence the 'high', it influences the effect you get from using, which indirectly obviously affects the feeling you get hence the high as well.



k0ijn said:


> and the properties it has are usually associated with a sickly ill feeling not anything related to a 'real high'


Oh, so we're talking about a 'real high' only...  I however choose what my response is a response to, not something you decided afterwards. In this case it was obviously the first sentence if post #552. Amber trichs DO increase the couch lock feeling and while you claim that is a common misconception you actually explained the reason for it several times in this thread.



k0ijn said:


> CBD is non-psychoactive so I don't know why you are talking about CBD strains giving a 'body-relax',


It's called experience rather than blindly copying an article and pretending to understand it. Have you ever even smoked a high CBD strain or hash? High CBD strains have inherently low THC, CBD counteracts the effects of THC (high), which relatively increase the effects that cause a body relaxed stoned.



k0ijn said:


> The question whether a strain will deliver a head-high or a body-high relates purely to the phenotype (including hybrid vs non-hybrid). It has nothing to do with CBN nor CBD.


Sure, genotype is not related at all. You're wrong in any case because you say 'purely', and if you had any experience growing or even smoking early vs late harvested you'd know that is most definitely not the case. For example, grow any 'high' foxtailing haze strain, wait for the foxtails to become cloudy, by then the main bud is turning amber, and try the difference. I have used the research the article you quoted is based on to write an article in dutch (to avoid amber for the same reason you wrote in this thread...) where it was common to wait for 20-30% amber.

It is in fact the combination of cannabinoids and terpenes and our unique cannabinoid receptors that determines the effect. That in turn is largely determined by the genetics (what you refer to as phenotype...), 'largely' not 'purely' and 'solely' as you claim. If you don't get why, after the above on top of what you wrote yourself then I don't see the point of your entire thread...


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## Sativied (Apr 23, 2014)

For completeness of the thread, here's a post with a scanned version of Mel Frank's article in High Times, A Time To Reap:
https://www.rollitup.org/t/bud-porn-take-a-look.655923/page-7#post-9143010

And in regards to the previous couple of posts:
"There is now great interested in varieties that produce both THC and CBD because of the latter's medicinal properties, including the relieve of pain, nausea, spasm and anxiety, as well as its _*sedative*_ and anti-inflammatory effects."


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## BWG707 (Apr 23, 2014)

I just spoke from my 40+yrs of experience with smoking cannabis. I do qualify what I state with "usually". Also I have lots of experience with early harvesting, on time harvesting and late harvesting. Another point I think you have completely looked over is my point about trying a PURE Indica (landrace). I've been growing TNT Kush a pure Indica from Pakistan, in the the Kush Belt. It doesn't have much of a range of pheno types that I'm aware of. All the seeds always grow the same phenos, I've never seen an obvious different pheno. With that said I agree with what Sativied posted, it's a combination and nothing is written in stone. Effects tend to vary from one individual to another. I think we can say in general Indicas tend to produce more of a body type high and I think most will agree that early harvested buds tend to be more racey than later harvested buds. I know for a fact that the pure Indica I smoke gives me a obvious body high, even compared to some of the hybrids. I admit I have a hard time distinguishing between some Indica Dom. hybrids and Sativas. Try smoking "pure" Indicas and "pure" Sativas and I think you will definitely notice the difference, although highs seem to vary from person to person from my experience anyway. I have no studies to support anything I've stated: "This is strictly my experiences."


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## k0ijn (Apr 24, 2014)

Part 1/2:

I will try to make this response as respectful as I can but I am finding it very hard to do so.
Given that you have a severe misunderstanding of what you are talking about, but you are writing as if you have complete knowledge.
I will have to reply in two messages as I cannot fit my entire post into 1 post (character limit rules of this forum).



Sativied said:


> Point of my post was the same as pretty much all my posts. Discussion forum mean anything to you? If you want to incorrectly claim the existence of a non-existing common misconception you should start a blog.


The point of your post was to bring up stuff which has nearly no significance to the original questions, just purely for the effect of looking like the smarter person for calling me out.
I hope people reading what follows in my post here can make out who is actually wrong.
If people choose to buy into your bullshit then by all means, let them.

The guy was asking about the couch-lock high, you are reading way, way too much into this.
I was not trying to explain the intricate differences between various high but I simply stated the fact that it is the phenotype which determines whether you get a head-high or a body-high.
I wasn't bringing any other cannabinoids into the discussion because; first of all we know VERY LITTLE (and you seem to have gravely misunderstood basic properties about certain cannabinoids) about the interaction between said cannabinoids and we do not know which ones exactly interact which each other and cause certain effects.
If you want to assume and make presumptions based on no evidence then go ahead, but don't try to divert the original point.




Sativied said:


> CBD does influence the high by counteracting the effects of THC but that's besides the point. You contradict yourself (and obviously don't really understand) what it means what you quoted from another article. You claim CBN does not influence the high while it gives a sickening feeling as you wrote in your first and last post. One could say it factually doesn't influence the 'high', it influences the effect you get from using, which indirectly obviously affects the feeling you get hence the high as well.


Cannibinoids do interact and cause different effects based on the different levels in the particular strains but that has nothing to do with the fact that it's the phenotype which determines the overall high.
I already said that the interaction between cannabinoids affect the high, I don't know why you feel like you have to divert a simple damn question into this time wasting discussion about stuff nobody really knows the facts about.
I have tried high CBD strains (relative 1:1 ratio of CBD:THC) and I have still found the phenotype to be the overall determining factor, sure high CBD strains have different properties than most other strains, which mostly is due to the low amount of THC relative to the other cannabinoids, compared to most strains which for a long time have been grown to maximize THC.
I don't see how high CBD strains have anything to do with the original questions.

I have not contradicted myself once, I will however prove how you are sorely mistaken in your assumptions.
I cannot bring up caveats and hedges in everything I write here just because you think I should explain everything (when we don't even know the true interaction, and thus I would just be guessing very much like you are).




Sativied said:


> Oh, so we're talking about a 'real high' only... I however choose what my response is a response to, not something you decided afterwards. In this case it was obviously the first sentence if post #552. Amber trichs DO increase the couch lock feeling and while you claim that is a common misconception you actually explained the reason for it several times in this thread.


Yes I was talking about the real high, not some made up stuff about CBD having sedative properties.

My response was directed at a particular question and I was not trying to bring the interaction between cannabinoids we know very little about into a simple fucking question.
Again here you are reading way too much into the me writing "real high".
What I mean by that is simply the overall, underlying high we get from Sativa vs Indica dominant strains.
I don't know why you think you have caught me contradicting myself, you are a sensationalist trying to stir shit up for no reason.



Sativied said:


> It's called experience rather than blindly copying an article and pretending to understand it. Have you ever even smoked a high CBD strain or hash? High CBD strains have inherently low THC, CBD counteracts the effects of THC (high), which relatively increase the effects that cause a body relaxed stoned.


It's called being arrogant, thinking you can add to a simple question by bringing up false information and trying to twist the attention of people reading this.
Instead of dabbling into discussions like this I like to stick to the *facts*.

Which also is why I answer simple questions in the simplest fashion instead of trying to impress people, bringing up interactions, which while they do exist and PROBABLY have an effect, have zero relevance to the question that was posed.
I could also go into the chemistry underlying the various cannaibinoids but I was simply trying to answer a simple question in a simple way.
That does not mean I don't know that there is a huge amount of information omitted in my original answer but all that information is not always necessarily critical to a simple damn question.


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## k0ijn (Apr 24, 2014)

Part 2/2:



SativiedSure said:


> Sure, genotype is not related at all. You're wrong in any case because you say 'purely', and if you had any experience growing or even smoking early vs late harvested you'd know that is most definitely not the case. For example, grow any 'high' foxtailing haze strain, wait for the foxtails to become cloudy, by then the main bud is turning amber, and try the difference. I have used the research the article you quoted is based on to write an article in dutch (to avoid amber for the same reason you wrote in this thread...) where it was common to wait for 20-30% amber.


Now you are just assuming stuff to continue your tirade.
You know why I said purely and you are just reading too much into it thinking you have caught me in the act of misunderstanding the intricate processes and interactions, you also think I am at fault for not including information about every cannabinoid that affects the high of a given strain, why are you the police here telling people they should sit here, like I am now, writing an entire essay just to answer a ONE SENTENCE QUESTION.
Especially since you yourself have made a GRAVE error in assuming stuff based off of a magazine article.

I have grown Cannabis for over 10 years and I have smoked for even longer.
I hardly need some random guy on the internet telling me I should include every fucking single aspect on cannabinoids dealing with a simple questions.





Sativied said:


> For completeness of the thread, here's a post with a scanned version of Mel Frank's article in High Times, A Time To Reap:
> https://www.rollitup.org/t/bud-porn-take-a-look.655923/page-7#post-9143010
> 
> And in regards to the previous couple of posts:
> "There is now great interested in varieties that produce both THC and CBD because of the latter's medicinal properties, including the relieve of pain, nausea, spasm and anxiety, as well as its _*sedative*_ and anti-inflammatory effects."



If you have read on this long then please carry on, my final and conclusive point is imminent;

I would like to point out to you that I have not used that article as a source, I don't know where you got it from that I was basing my opinions on some article from a high times magazine.
I haven't even read that article until you brought it up here and in fact I am questioning some of the information in that article.
I can only go by the scientific research, but from what I've read from peer reviewed journals, CBD does not have any particular sedative effect.
CBD is non-psychoactive, it reduces muscle spasms, it's a muscle relaxant and it's analgesic (mean it's relieves pain).
That is the information I have on CBD and it stems from Trends in Pharmacological Sciences, you know, real science, not a magazine article.
In fact, research has shown that THC has sedative properties NOT CBD.
Basing your entire fucking argument on a magazine article is pretty embarrassing, especially when that article has facetious "facts" in it.

Allow me to quote something I think will wake you up once and for all:

_


Real science said:



Many people claim that high amounts of CBD in marijuana causes that body stone/sedative effect associated with indica plants. However, there is much scientific evidence against that idea. Indeed, studies have shown that adding CBD to THC causes one to be more awake!
By contrast, THC alone has more sedative effects. Indeed, CBD is just an antagonist of CB1 receptors. It is probably true then that indica plants have a very high THC % compared to sativas and this has a stronger biphasic stimulant/sedative effect (CB1 receptors are the most widespread receptors in the brain, so its not unlikely that they can do both). The amount of CBD in most drug strains probably has no effect at all since CBD is not present in large amounts and has a much lower affinity for CB1 receptors compared to THC.

Click to expand...

_


Real science said:


> Here are some articles to prove my point.
> Cannabidiol, a constituent of Cannabis sativa, mod... [FEBS Lett. 2006] - PubMed result
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16844117
> 
> ...



What I just quoted there is links to scientific studies, I would trust the position and findings of professionals who have degrees and who carry out peer reviewed research over your wordplay any day of the week.
Your entire argument on how CBD can affect the high and cause a body stone because it has sedative properties is just false.
There is no evidence for it, either you have been mislead or you have just made a mistake of trusting an article from some magazine.
In any case you have made a significant and serious error, I think 'just' out of ignorance, but an error none the less.

And having you come here and attack me like this trying to make me explain everything about cannabinoids and the interaction between said cannabinoids when we have very little research on the subject and when you have GROSSLY misunderstood basic properties of some cannabinoids honestly just makes you look really bad.



TL;DR:
CBD does not have sedative properties, the entire argument that CBD can cause a body high is simply false.
The phenotype is OVERALL what determines whether you get a head high or a body high.
BUT; The specific interaction between the relative amounts of cannabinoids in a given strain is what produces the unique high you get from a strain.
There are also loads of other variables (I will not name them all), including; the person who ingests it, the mindstate of said person, possible unknown interactions in Cannabis (between cannabinoids and the user); we have NOT yet researched cannabinoids fully, not even close.


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## k0ijn (Apr 24, 2014)

BWG707 said:


> I just spoke from my 40+yrs of experience with smoking cannabis. I do qualify what I state with "usually". Also I have lots of experience with early harvesting, on time harvesting and late harvesting. Another point I think you have completely looked over is my point about trying a PURE Indica (landrace). I've been growing TNT Kush a pure Indica from Pakistan, in the the Kush Belt. It doesn't have much of a range of pheno types that I'm aware of. All the seeds always grow the same phenos, I've never seen an obvious different pheno. With that said I agree with what Sativied posted, it's a combination and nothing is written in stone. Effects tend to vary from one individual to another. I think we can say in general Indicas tend to produce more of a body type high and I think most will agree that early harvested buds tend to be more racey than later harvested buds. I know for a fact that the pure Indica I smoke gives me a obvious body high, even compared to some of the hybrids. I admit I have a hard time distinguishing between some Indica Dom. hybrids and Sativas. Try smoking "pure" Indicas and "pure" Sativas and I think you will definitely notice the difference, although highs seem to vary from person to person from my experience anyway. I have no studies to support anything I've stated: "This is strictly my experiences."


Don't get me wrong, I'm not putting any of this on you, you asked a simple question and I gave you a simple answer.
Now you have a much fuller and detailed answer, now that I have had to pick apart Sativieds arguments and prove how false they are.

I hope you got the answer you were looking for, if you have any questions please don't hesitate to ask or make a thread and pose questions, we have a lot of knowledgeable people on this forum (and some delusional ones who will believe anything on zero evidence).


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## Sativied (Apr 24, 2014)

k0ijn said:


> The guy was asking about the couch-lock high, you are reading way, way too much into this.


 "I" am the one reading too much into this.... ahum. See above.



k0ijn said:


> (and some delusional ones who will believe anything on zero evidence).


Trying to downplay arguments by attacking the opponent may have have worked on your typical RIU member (like yourself...), anyone who reads my posts and knows a little about my approach knows you got the wrong guy...

I will try not to join your poor attempts at personal attacks which are so obviously caused by you being butt hurt for me correcting you. The keyboard-warrior act makes that all to obvious. Nevertheless, I skimmed through the pages you posted, stopped at:



k0ijn said:


> Yes I was talking about the real high, not some made up stuff about CBD having sedative properties.


Made up? That was a quote from a reliable source, and just one of many. Seems like your googling and reading comprehension attempts are heavily influenced by confirmation biased.



k0ijn said:


> *it reduces muscle spasms, it's a muscle relaxant *and it's analgesic (mean it's relieves pain).


*Muscle relaxant*... (hint: what do you think causes a body to relax? Did I not mention the for you incomprehensible body-relax effect...)

Your desperate attempt to turn this into a discussion about what CBD actually does isn't working out well. After so much text and you're still missing the point. Try again, maybe I will take the time and create a simple graph for you to show you what factually happens to the cannabinoid ratio and hence their relative amounts when you wait for amber, according to what you wrote yourself several times...

I smoked hundreds of different strains and more different types of high cbd import hash than you will ever in a lifetime. I KNOW the effects of high amber, and of low thc +high CBD (for decades kid), you're just merely rehashing info of which I can easily find what you call "Real Science" resources that claim the opposite. As you mentioned a while back, there is still a lot to discover about the effects of the cannabinoids, yet you pretend to have all the answers, yet _you_ call _me_ arrogant. All just pot-kettle from another poser. The fact remains you erroneously claim there's a misconception that a. isn't there, b. isn't entirely a misconception but has a lot of truth in it.


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## BWG707 (Apr 24, 2014)

k0ijn said:


> Don't get me wrong, I'm not putting any of this on you, you asked a simple question and I gave you a simple answer.
> Now you have a much fuller and detailed answer, now that I have had to pick apart Sativieds arguments and prove how false they are.
> 
> I hope you got the answer you were looking for, if you have any questions please don't hesitate to ask or make a thread and pose questions, we have a lot of knowledgeable people on this forum (and some delusional ones who will believe anything on zero evidence).


I did not ask any questions, just to let you know.


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## k0ijn (Apr 25, 2014)

Sativied said:


> Trying to downplay arguments by attacking the opponent may have have worked on your typical RIU member (like yourself...), anyone who reads my posts and knows a little about my approach knows you got the wrong guy...


I am not downplaying anything.
You claimed that CBD has sedative properties and you quoted a magazine article written by some journalist as your "proof".
I provided TWO peer reviewed scientific studies.
If anyone has any doubts which they should trust then I wouldn't even want to waste my time on those people because they will clearly believe anything they want on bad evidence, much like creationists do, stick your head in the stand after you think you have made a compelling scientific argument, when in fact all you did was quote some facetious material written by a layman.
I can tell you didn't even read what I wrote, otherwise you might be a BIT more embarrassed about making such a huge error.

The studies showed that CBD INCREASES alertness, even with it inherently being a muscle relaxant (which has NOTHING to do with a body-high or a sedative effect).
I mean the fact that you can't even understand the differences between the terminologies makes me think you are just trolling, nobody can be this ignorant.



Sativied said:


> I will try not to join your poor attempts at personal attacks which are so obviously caused by you being butt hurt for me correcting you. The keyboard-warrior act makes that all to obvious. Nevertheless, I skimmed through the pages you posted, stopped at:


You are the one throwing around emoticons and mocking me, all I've done is call you arrogant and ignorant, which are both truthful.
Providing proper sources and writing up your arguments in a post is apparently being a "keyboard-warrior".
I mean how much more childish can this discussion get, you are throwing up strawmen left and right and pulling out every damn fallacy in the book to try and stick to your misinformed argument.
You are using wrong information to form your opinion and then you blasting people on the internet.
Your claim about CBD having sedative properties IS made up.
I provided your with two studies and you are still looking the other way, putting your trust in some magazine article instead of real science.



I stand by what I said and that I called you out for using wrong information.
You are basing your opinions on information which is just flat out wrong, and when you still stick to that even when presented with scientific studies which show you are in the wrong just proves how blind you are, you will stand by your opinion no matter what I do.
If a person does not listen to reason, what reason can be used to make the person change his/her mind.
If a person does not value logic, then what logical argument can used to make the person change his/her mind.
I'm beginning to understand that you are a lost cause, you will believe whatever you want to, on bad evidence.

Either way I am done with this "discussion", I have provided my sources and the scientific studies behind my thinking and arguments, you can continue to believe whatever you want, including that CBD being a muscle relaxant is now the reason why you get a body-stone.
Before you said it (CBD) had sedative properties, now you say it's the muscle relaxant which does it, even though the damn study which showed it has muscle relaxing properties proved that CBD INCREASES alertness and counteracts THCs sedative properties.


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## FLkeys1 (Apr 26, 2014)

wouldn't it be cool if we could create plants that had the little thing pop out like when the turkey is ready.. just a simple green stem that could pop out at the base to let us know it is time to harvest..


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## zmansmoke (Apr 27, 2014)

hey boss are theses finish 1 day flower 2/16 outdoors thin mint cookies


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## zmansmoke (Apr 28, 2014)

thin mint cookies day 67 flowering outdoors close up


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## k0ijn (Apr 28, 2014)

zmansmoke said:


> hey boss are theses finish 1 day flower 2/16 outdoors thin mint cookies


Have you looked closely at the trichomes (with a loupe or microscope) on several different calyxes (different branches as well perhaps)?

The plants look very nice, the colours are vibrant and the plants look very healthy.
The only stipulation I would have is that from some of the pictures I still see a fair amount of clear trichomes which would speak to the fact that they are not fully matured yet (but that could be twisted view if you have only macro-shot the least matured calyxes).

I'd say they could take another week but if you are in a hurry you could harvest now with good results.
If it's your first grow you should be very proud, I rarely see plants looking this healthy in a first grow.


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## zmansmoke (Apr 29, 2014)

THIS IS MY 3RD BUT EVERY TIME I HARVAST NO SMELL AND IT TASTE LIKE HAY
RIGHT NOW I FEEL LIKE THEY ARE REVEGGING CAUSE THERE IS MORE LIGHT OUTSIDE AND ITS BEEN 67 DAYS SINCE I TOOK THEM OUTSIDE AND I SEE TONS OF FOX TAILS WITH WITH GREEN AND WHITE HAIRS ILL TAKE A CLOSE UP TOMORROW THANKS FOR THE HELP


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## dochickory (Apr 29, 2014)

Nic


zmansmoke said:


> thin mint cookies day 67 flowering outdoors close up


e very nice but I have read plenty and experienced "the ninth week" and on... Not enough people do....and some strains seem to make another vigorous push all over, if you have the environment to support it let them go another week for sure. I don't see many if any tall trichomes know what I mean You should just check out this article if ya really care 
American Society of Plant Biologists www.plant.org article by George J. Wagner I think www.plantphysioi.org is a file link to the article whew toke toke good luck I 'm at exactly the same point in growth and decision  Keep it up your plants look great!


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## zmansmoke (Apr 29, 2014)

ok ill give them another week im in no rush. here are todays pics
the full image is the only one without that much new growth. l have been flushing them last 10 days all 5 plants


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## dochickory (Apr 30, 2014)

Those look great! Wish I could grow outside, maybe in Costa Rica 
Thanks for sharing, keep up the good work!


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## dochickory (Apr 30, 2014)

zmansmoke said:


> ok ill give them another week im in no rush. here are todays pics
> the full image is the only one without that much new growth. l have been flushing them last 10 days all 5 plants


I am writing so soon again to let you know I am experiencing another push I mentioned day 63 in Flower cycle and she's stretching in Flower again only at this stage it's all flower sites no stem, this is where they get fat all over look close at yours with all the little pistils reaching out of the pods. I love it this is good stuff


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## narkush (May 1, 2014)

This is the most amazing thread I have read on this site on a very, very important subject "When is my plant ready to harvest", which, after all it is ultimately about.
Thank you for your informed scientific info k0ijn, I have learned a hell of a lot reading your posts.


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## k0ijn (May 2, 2014)

zmansmoke said:


> ok ill give them another week im in no rush. here are todays pics
> the full image is the only one without that much new growth. l have been flushing them last 10 days all 5 plants


Looking good, hopefully you got the drying & curing department controlled as well.


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## k0ijn (May 2, 2014)

narkush said:


> This is the most amazing thread I have read on this site on a very, very important subject "When is my plant ready to harvest", which, after all it is ultimately about.
> Thank you for your informed scientific info k0ijn, I have learned a hell of a lot reading your posts.


Thank you for your kind words narkush, I appreciate it a lot.


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## kagecog (May 7, 2014)

Turns out your wrong about clear trichs only containing precursor cannabinoids... Check out this segment from a high times article I recently read!

"Dr. Paul G. Mahlberg who found that THC in the resin head is at it's peak when it's still _clear _- not opaque and certainly not amber. Dr. Mahlberg stuck a tiny syringe into the bulbous head of the trichome and extracted it's contents, then analyzed it for THC. The result: Without a doubt, THC is at it's highest *before* the trichome turns opaque"


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## k0ijn (May 8, 2014)

kagecog said:


> Turns out your wrong about clear trichs only containing precursor cannabinoids... Check out this segment from a high times article I recently read!
> 
> "Dr. Paul G. Mahlberg who found that THC in the resin head is at it's peak when it's still _clear _- not opaque and certainly not amber. Dr. Mahlberg stuck a tiny syringe into the bulbous head of the trichome and extracted it's contents, then analyzed it for THC. The result: Without a doubt, THC is at it's highest *before* the trichome turns opaque"


First of all I never said that clear trichomes _only_ contain precursor cannabinoids.
I suggest you check out the entire post, I also posted visual aids.

I haven't read the article so I can't commentate on the references and science used in it.
It worries me that they are not distinguishing between THCA and THC and that no references are posted, I'm not sure how a quote is supposed to prove anything.

Then we have the issue of THC not being the only psychoactive cannabinoid present in Cannabis.
The high is influence by a lot of different compounds interacting with each other and we do not entirely know the process behind this yet.
A given plant will most likely not be fully matured when it's displaying only clear trichomes, you will not see swollen calyxes nor a fully grown plant, perhaps not even a full development of terpenes, I don't think I've ever seen a 100% clear trichome plant which looked fully matured in the host of other variables which are crucial in growing.

I suggest you try to grow a plant and harvest it while it's still 100% clear trichomes vs a near 100% cloudy.
The size of the calyxes and the overall look of the plants will be very different.


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## dboy464 (May 8, 2014)

Can I post pics and sum 1 tell me if my plants are ready for harvest?


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## k0ijn (May 9, 2014)

dboy464 said:


> Can I post pics and sum 1 tell me if my plants are ready for harvest?


I'd prefer if you'd make your own thread but what am I to say at this point, this thread was meant to be a sticky about how to distinguish optimal harvesting signs but a lot of people have posted here with pictures looking for help, it would take a while to clean up.


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## kagecog (May 9, 2014)

k0ijn said:


> First of all I never said that clear trichomes _only_ contain precursor cannabinoids.
> I suggest you check out the entire post, I also posted visual aids.
> 
> I haven't read the article so I can't commentate on the references and science used in it.
> ...


Distinguishing between THC and THCa is not necessary. The samples were taken from freshly harvested buds and any freshly harvested bud contains mostly THCa whether they were harvested with the majority or the trichs being clear or the majority of the trichs being cloudy. It takes proper environmental conditions and a lot of time for the process of decarboxylation to occur naturally.

In response to the issue of THC not being the only psychoactive cannabinoid present in cannabis; the only psychoactive cannabinoid that cloudy and amber trichomes contain more of than clear trichomes is CBN, which as you said is "not desirable in any harvest". You gave the impression that peak THC levels was the only thing your really looking for when harvesting when you said it was "the by far main contributing substance in any cannabis high."

I do agree with you on not being able to harvest when 100% clear, the bud density would be an issue. I believe when the trichomes are half cloudy and half clear would be the most efficient time to harvest if your looking for a peak THC to bud density ratio.

You also said a few things I believe are untrue. You say clear trichomes contain precursor cannabinoids while cloudy trichomes contain fully realized THC. Correct me if i'm wrong, but both clear trichomes and cloudy trichomes contain THC mostly in the THCa form.


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## k0ijn (May 10, 2014)

kagecog said:


> Distinguishing between THC and THCa is not necessary. The samples were taken from freshly harvested buds and any freshly harvested bud contains mostly THCa whether they were harvested with the majority or the trichs being clear or the majority of the trichs being cloudy. It takes proper environmental conditions and a lot of time for the process of decarboxylation to occur naturally.


I know that Cannabis contains mostly THCa with a fraction of THC, that was my entire point, why is the author not making the distinction? Decarboxylation is an entirely different issue but it's an important distinction to make, knowing the metabolic chain is crucial to this discussion.
You see when people just bring up stuff like this which has no references and which incorrectly talks about THC (while in fact meaning THCa) it makes me wonder exactly how much they know about the subject.
You would be surprised how many ignorant people I deal with regarding these highly technical subjects.
You seem to at least know the basics but omitting the evidence makes me a bit uneasy.




kagecog said:


> In response to the issue of THC not being the only psychoactive cannabinoid present in cannabis; the only psychoactive cannabinoid that cloudy and amber trichomes contain more of than clear trichomes is CBN, which as you said is "not desirable in any harvest". You gave the impression that peak THC levels was the only thing your really looking for when harvesting when you said it was "the by far main contributing substance in any cannabis high."


I'm not so sure about CBN being the only other psychoactive cannabinoid nor whether being psychoactive is the determining factor all together.
We lack a lot of research on these subjects, I don't see how you can categorically say this.
What about THCV, CBN is not the only psychoactive cannabinoid besides THC? What about CBD which has so far been shown to highly affect high even though is inherently non-psychoactive?

I never gave off any impression of peak THC levels being the only thing to look for.
Where on earth did you read that?
If you got that impression then that just represents what you yourself read into it, we've actually had this discussion before in this thread, someone else blamed me for only caring about THC and trichomes when I in this thread also deal with the host of other variables (calyxes, pistils, overall look of the plant etc.) AND claim them to be just as important for the overall end product.
High != end product.

The fact that I call THC the main contributing substance in any Cannabis high is because it is.
Regarding the high itself (which is what I was talking about in that specific quote, not the growing, not the look of the plant nor the weight/density/smell/etc) THC is without a doubt the primary psychoactive component, that's just a fact.
CBD, CBC and CBG all play their part and affect the high (in ways we might not even know about yet) but THC is the primary component of a Cannabis high.




kagecog said:


> I do agree with you on not being able to harvest when 100% clear, the bud density would be an issue. I believe when the trichomes are half cloudy and half clear would be the most efficient time to harvest if your looking for a peak THC to bud density ratio.
> 
> You also said a few things I believe are untrue. You say clear trichomes contain precursor cannabinoids while cloudy trichomes contain fully realized THC. Correct me if i'm wrong, but both clear trichomes and cloudy trichomes contain THC mostly in the THCa form.



I don't see half clear / half cloudy being the most efficient time to harvest.
I still haven't seen any references regarding the statements this doctor made nor have I seen the science behind it.
It's impossible for me to agree with you on this matter unless you show the evidence, if you were to show me however, and the evidence is clear that THCa peaks while the trichomes are clear, that CBDa, CBCa etc. are present in high concentrations in the clear trichomes then I would change my view on this.

Both clear & cloudy trichomes contain THCa that is correct, but the percentage of THCa relative to the other compounds in the trichomes is the important issue.
The biosynthesis pathway of cannabinoids is still a source of debate, we do not know everything about it but we do know the metabolic chain.
Trichomes have a development, a biosynthesis pathway, they produce the various cannabinoids by vacuoles and plastids combining in the bulbous head and being hit with UV-B light, thus forming cannabinoids (very simply put).
The point is that clear trichomes have not been proven to contain the fully realized cannabinoids, or at least I have not seen any evidence of this, nor has anyone else I know, and if it was the case I think a lot more people would be happy with their early harvest, since the potency and effect should be the same, if not better, according to you (you said THC peaks in clear trichomes).
What we see is that the process of hexanoate --> cannabigerolate takes place in the immature trichomes (we get all the major cannabinoids from CBGa, it's at this point we longer consider it "precursor") and it leaves matured trichomes without the precursors, with the cannabinoids we seek.


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## tstick (May 21, 2014)

What about _*harvesting for best taste and terpene development*_? I can get high on any strain that has a decent % of THC….but it's usually the flavor that makes me "like" a strain enough to keep coming back.

I've had buds that tested out to be 28% THC (supposedly) and they got me high….but didn't taste good. The trichs were everywhere, sparkling like diamonds. And there was another strain that twas a high THC strain and it also tasted light and flavorless…but got me very high….just not a memorable flavor.

I realize that terpenes develop during curing but there also must be some development during growth, too….because the plants stink!

I guess I'd rather have the flavor and then bump up the potency, if needed, by dabbing some hash oil in addition to smoking a bit of the flower. Tell me how to get the flavors happening!


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## Trainwrek'd (May 23, 2014)

Same thing is happening to me. Stinks during grow, then not memorable smell at all after 30 day plus cure. Looks great high is great, but not enough smell Curious to know how to rectify this. Almost as if terpines dissipate after plants are cut.


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## k0ijn (May 27, 2014)

Trainwrek'd said:


> Same thing is happening to me. Stinks during grow, then not memorable smell at all after 30 day plus cure. Looks great high is great, but not enough smell Curious to know how to rectify this. Almost as if terpines dissipate after plants are cut.


Normally when you dry weed too fast (and sometimes too much) a lot of the odor dissipates but if you carry out the cure properly you should be able to slowly bring the odor back (assuming you have not passed the point of no return).

You want to make sure you have a nice and slow drying phase of about ~6 days (depending on RH, temp etc.) and then when you cure you need to keep up the burping regularly and also moving the buds around a bit (rotation of buds) in the jars, making sure to carry out a nice leveled RH throughout the cure, slowly bringing down the RH, thereby infusing the weed with it's own moisture.

If you notice a very high loss of odor then you quite possibly made a few mistakes in the drying & curing phase.


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## digimidgi (May 27, 2014)

For the last 4 years I've been flushing the shit outta my girls and wondering why they stop responding and drinking VERY slow.
I wish I'd not assumed what i was reading back then to be true and found this. Thank you SOO much!!
Sorry to ask.. but.. do you reduce your nutrients in the last few weeks or keep giving them their regular dosage? 
I'm in Coco/fabric pots with coco nutes.
I was thinking I might reduce their nutrient dose to half when I see mostly milky Trich's and stop with the harsh acid and PH with lemon juice or apple cidar vinegar. 

Thank you for sharing your wisdom


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## Trainwrek'd (May 28, 2014)

Thank you for the response. To further polish up my practices, what do you recommend for drying time (temps, rh, length in days?) I have a climate controlled drying room this time around. Last time I dried in my garage (california early spring) temps were fluctuating, couldnt say for certain what the temps were. It took about 7 days for the stems to snap. I did trim wet. Cured in 1/2 gallon mason jars, which this time will be 1 qt jars. Burping several times a day (in the garage once again)for the first two weeks, ill be curing in the climate controlled room this time as well. I also picked up a caliber IV hydro meter to make sure my min and maxs are regulated. I got about 2 wks left for some awesome smelling: royal highness, strawberry dlite, and double bubbleberry. I also flushed for a week with pure ro water 0 ppm that probably messed it up as well. After reading this i wont be flushing anymore either. Last question is what is your ppm the last two weeks, recipe and why you use those nutrients. Sorry i wrote a mini novel here, but hopefully this clears up a few important details for everyone. Thanks in advace for your wisdom.


k0ijn said:


> Normally when you dry weed too fast (and sometimes too much) a lot of the odor dissipates but if you carry out the cure properly you should be able to slowly bring the odor back (assuming you have not passed the point of no return).
> 
> You want to make sure you have a nice and slow drying phase of about ~6 days (depending on RH, temp etc.) and then when you cure you need to keep up the burping regularly and also moving the buds around a bit (rotation of buds) in the jars, making sure to carry out a nice leveled RH throughout the cure, slowly bringing down the RH, thereby infusing the weed with it's own moisture.
> 
> If you notice a very high loss of odor then you quite possibly made a few mistakes in the drying & curing phase.


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## k0ijn (May 28, 2014)

digimidgi said:


> For the last 4 years I've been flushing the shit outta my girls and wondering why they stop responding and drinking VERY slow.
> I wish I'd not assumed what i was reading back then to be true and found this. Thank you SOO much!!
> Sorry to ask.. but.. do you reduce your nutrients in the last few weeks or keep giving them their regular dosage?
> I'm in Coco/fabric pots with coco nutes.
> ...


It must have been extremely frustrating for you to do what you thought was the right thing and experiencing problems with the plants but at least you realized your mistake, I've seen people who have had these issue who still held their ground on their assumptions, however baseless they might be.

Every grow is different because every strain is different, so unless you roll with a continuous cycle of the same strain through the seasons then you have to adjust every time.
Usually I start off slow (1/4 recommended for sprouts) and amp it up through veg.
And I will also start off relatively slow when I start the flowering phase for a given plant and then amp it up as the plant sees fit, if I can tell my plants are starting to show signs of weakness, discolouration etc. I will dose accordingly and try to keep them at the optimal levels, again if I see my plants starting to darken heavily with deep greens and the edges of leaves start curling/burning I would reset the medium and then readjust the dose.
I almost never run into these problems because it's one thing that comes with experience, you can tell how your plants are doing and thus you can adjust before anything bad happens (be it under- or overfeeding).

Sometimes I even give really high dosages right up until harvest, because I can tell the particular plant can take it, for example; it has not reacted negatively to upping the dosage through flowering and is still blooming, swelling and filling in.

Flowering is without a doubt the phase where your plants are most dependant on a proper nutrient dose, if you do not feed them properly you cannot expect them to produce properly.


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## k0ijn (May 28, 2014)

Trainwrek'd said:


> Thank you for the response. To further polish up my practices, what do you recommend for drying time (temps, rh, length in days?) I have a climate controlled drying room this time around. Last time I dried in my garage (california early spring) temps were fluctuating, couldnt say for certain what the temps were. It took about 7 days for the stems to snap. I did trim wet. Cured in 1/2 gallon mason jars, which this time will be 1 qt jars. Burping several times a day (in the garage once again)for the first two weeks, ill be curing in the climate controlled room this time as well. I also picked up a caliber IV hydro meter to make sure my min and maxs are regulated. I got about 2 wks left for some awesome smelling: royal highness, strawberry dlite, and double bubbleberry. I also flushed for a week with pure ro water 0 ppm that probably messed it up as well. After reading this i wont be flushing anymore either. Last question is what is your ppm the last two weeks, recipe and why you use those nutrients. Sorry i wrote a mini novel here, but hopefully this clears up a few important details for everyone. Thanks in advace for your wisdom.


There are a lot of good threads on this subject so I won't go into too much detail, I believe this sub-forum has a nice sticky about this very subject as well.

Near optimal ranges:
Temp range: 16 degrees celcius - 23 degrees celcius
RH: 45% - 65% (the higher, the longer the dry will take)
Days: It's different for every setup due to all the variables but generally ~6 days
One of the most overlooked factors is air flow, be sure to keep a proper and continuous air flow or you will wind up with stale, crappy or even moldy weed.

You don't want the stems to snap, you want them to still be able to bend without snapping, sounds like you dried out your weed too much.
How long did you burp the jars for when your burped?
Did you move the buds around in the jars (cycling)?

Flushing isn't going to ruin your harvest but it would definitely have impacted your end product and the overall productivity of your plants.

Regarding your last questions it's very hard to give a generalized answer, because everything is relative, to the environment, your setup, your plants etc. there are just too many variables.

But I would say for late harvest I generally stay within Hanna 1000ppm - 1600ppm (depending on the strain and the variables).
That's around 2.0 EC - 3.2 EC.
I use some pretty basic GHE hydro nutrients, regular ratio, no special stuff (bloom buddy, extra bloom, whatever else these marketing people call their shite).

Nutrients are nutrients, whether they are organic, hydro or whatever other variant you find, obviously you want to match soil nutrients with soil mediums and hydro nutrients with water based mediums but other than that it's mostly nitpicking and superstition/assumptions, don't believe the overhyped marketing machines.


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## Trainwrek'd (May 29, 2014)

I burped ten to 15 mins 3 times a day for the first week in 1/2 gallon mason jars. I think those jars are to big because it held alot of moisture in between burps. I bought a caliber IV to monitor rh within the jars better. I found a thread on cure zone rh and what to do t keep it there. (65%). Thanks again


k0ijn said:


> There are a lot of good threads on this subject so I won't go into too much detail, I believe this sub-forum has a nice sticky about this very subject as well.
> 
> Near optimal ranges:
> Temp range: 16 degrees celcius - 23 degrees celcius
> ...


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## Bowser123 (Jun 5, 2014)

k0ijn said:


> I don't pre-harvest flush my plants at all. I see no reason to do it.
> I rarely flush, and only do so if I have problems with salt buildup, nutrient levels or the like (which happens very rarely in my current hydro setup).
> 
> Love this. If true it makes scheduling harvest sooo much easier.


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## testiclees (Jun 11, 2014)

ive had nice results using boveda packs for curing. anyone else tried them?


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## Trainwrek'd (Jun 11, 2014)

testiclees said:


> ive had results using boveda packs for curing. anyone else tried them?


I use them after curing for storage. I can confirm it does keep the enclosed environment close to 62 percent @ around 78-80 degrees. It averages at 64 percent @80 degrees.


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## tstick (Jun 14, 2014)

RE: Drying….


Okay, first of all, I've only got one plant in my tent and she's almost ready to harvest. My plan is to chop her and then hang her up in the same tent and use the inline fan to keep the air flowing through the tent -without having anything blowing directly on the plant…In other words, the inline fan is pulling air out of the tent and fresh air is being drawn in through the vent flaps. I can increase/decrease the amount of airflow via my Variac switch.

My question is: "HOW MUCH air movement is necessary to dry the plants slowly?" I don't want them to dry out too fast, but I don't want them to get moldy from drying too slowly, either! Is there some kind of tip anyone can give as to how much air movement? Thanks


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## AlaskaHashMan (Jun 14, 2014)

I put mine after trim upside down in my tent/room and after the second day just had no fans running but kept a humidity gauge in with them and watched carefully. But I live in a dry state, unless it's raining it's pretty dry up here.


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## davidryanturner (Jul 7, 2014)

my plants have stopped flowering been tooo long flower started in april! has a lot of the white/clear hair just wont ripen, what should i do??


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## Trainwrek'd (Jul 8, 2014)

davidryanturner said:


> my plants have stopped flowering been tooo long flower started in april! has a lot of the white/clear hair just wont ripen, what should i do??


Cut the light cycle back. 10 on 14 off.


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## SlowMotions (Jul 12, 2014)

Hello! These are my flowers in 74 days of flowering ready to harvest? I want maximum potency of high ?

O.G Kush - Royal Queen Seeds -      

Chemdawg - Humboldt Organisation Seeds -


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## Fangule (Jul 12, 2014)

Can a plant be ready to chop (via tric's) even if it still has white hairs?


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## Milidin (Jul 13, 2014)

First time grower and my unknown strain is about 6 weeks into flowering. I'm having a hard time determining trichome color with the standard 60-100x lighted microscope I hear most people use. It's very hard to get a good view with such a small viewing port and keeping the plant still while looking/focusing is even harder. I'm basically trying to find out if there's a technique people use with these microscopes or of I just need more practice. I have a loupe too but they don't magnify enough. 

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Rollitup mobile app


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## Milidin (Jul 13, 2014)

Slow motions what are you using to take those pics? 

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Rollitup mobile app


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## Trainwrek'd (Jul 14, 2014)

View attachment 3201313 View attachment 3201315 View attachment 3201316 View attachment 3201311 View attachment 3201319 View attachment 3201317

Chemdawg - Humboldt


SlowMotions said:


> Hello! These are my flowers in 74 days of flowering ready to harvest? I want maximum potency of high ?
> 
> O.G Kush - Royal Queen Seeds - View attachment 3201313 View attachment 3201315 View attachment 3201316 View attachment 3201311 View attachment 3201319 View attachment 3201317
> 
> Chemdawg - Humboldt Organisation Seeds -View attachment 3201322 View attachment 3201323 View attachment 3201324 View attachment 3201325


Organisation Seeds -View attachment 3201322 View attachment 3201323 View attachment 3201324 View attachment 3201325[/QUOTE]
You are at the beginning of the harvest window. Maybe another 2-3 wks. Wait till about 30 percent amber on the buds. I dont see any amber on the pics you took. You have minimal pistils receding, and your leaves are at the beginning of the end of its lifecycle (fall). My opinion wait 2 or 3 weeks. Looks great. Keep an eye on you humidity (below 55). You will suffer from but rot if not kept in check. Peace.


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## Fangule (Jul 14, 2014)

Milidin said:


> First time grower and my unknown strain is about 6 weeks into flowering. I'm having a hard time determining trichome color with the standard 60-100x lighted microscope I hear most people use. It's very hard to get a good view with such a small viewing port and keeping the plant still while looking/focusing is even harder. I'm basically trying to find out if there's a technique people use with these microscopes or of I just need more practice. I have a loupe too but they don't magnify enough.
> 
> Sent from my SCH-I545 using Rollitup mobile app


I cut a piece of bud and put it in the microscope stand but not all scopes come with stands.


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## SlowMotions (Jul 15, 2014)

Thanks guys! 
Hi guys, the pictures were taken of microscope 45x. 
These are pictures of trichomes daylight. 
I think it's almost ready, will keep 5 days, what do you think?
What levels you would specified in clear,milky,amber in % 

Chemdawg trichomes of 76 day flowering -


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## Milidin (Jul 19, 2014)

Is it completely OK to harvest plants sections at a time? The top Cola's look like they are ready but not the bottoms. Also, I only started flushing 6 days ago. I'm stuck in a spot where I don't think I've been flushing long enough (2 weeks) but it seems like the buds are ready (amber and cloudy trichomes). So am I stuck either dealing with harsh smoke if I harvest now or depleted thc if I wait for the flushing to be done? 

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Rollitup mobile app


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## chuck estevez (Jul 19, 2014)

Milidin said:


> Is it completely OK to harvest plants sections at a time? The top Cola's look like they are ready but not the bottoms. Also, I only started flushing 6 days ago. I'm stuck in a spot where I don't think I've been flushing long enough (2 weeks) but it seems like the buds are ready (amber and cloudy trichomes). So am I stuck either dealing with harsh smoke if I harvest now or depleted thc if I wait for the flushing to be done?
> 
> Sent from my SCH-I545 using Rollitup mobile app


flushing is BS, harsh taste is from sugars being left in the plant when not dried and cured properly. You actually cause more problems and cut the plant off from the food it needs at the most important time. And yes, you can harvest it in sections.


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## NyQuilkush318 (Jul 19, 2014)

If the top done an the bottom got a week left how u going to flush her toxic


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## NyQuilkush318 (Jul 19, 2014)

chuck estevez said:


> flushing is BS, harsh taste is from sugars being left in the plant when not dried and cured properly. You actually cause more problems and cut the plant off from the food it needs at the most important time. And yes, you can harvest it in sections.


toxin wouldn't it be


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## Milidin (Jul 20, 2014)

Maybe Flush her, harvest top, Fertilize, and Flush again before final harvest? 

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Rollitup mobile app


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## NyQuilkush318 (Jul 25, 2014)

So u 
sayin still feed her for harvest timeg


NyQuilkush318 said:


> toxin wouldn't it be


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## Conshroomer (Jul 30, 2014)

chuck estevez said:


> flushing is BS, harsh taste is from sugars being left in the plant when not dried and cured properly. You actually cause more problems and cut the plant off from the food it needs at the most important time. And yes, you can harvest it in sections.


Wouldn't harvesting in sections hermie the remaining buds due to the stress?


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## greasemonkeymann (Jul 30, 2014)

chuck estevez said:


> flushing is BS, harsh taste is from sugars being left in the plant when not dried and cured properly. You actually cause more problems and cut the plant off from the food it needs at the most important time. And yes, you can harvest it in sections.


 Man Chuck, I admire you actually taking the time to squash all these flushing threads.
I don't have the time or patience


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## chuck estevez (Jul 30, 2014)

greasemonkeymann said:


> Man Chuck, I admire you actually taking the time to squash all these flushing threads.
> I don't have the time or patience


I have a lot of time


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## greasemonkeymann (Jul 30, 2014)

chuck estevez said:


> I have a lot of time


haha, I gathered that, my friend
this site can be a lil much sometimes
Between the flushing questions and the damn reptile uv lamps.....SIGH
Seriously..


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## k0ijn (Jul 30, 2014)

greasemonkeymann said:


> Man Chuck, I admire you actually taking the time to squash all these flushing threads.
> I don't have the time or patience


I hope you don't mean this thread.
This thread is about as far from flushing centered as you can get.


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## jackdavid123 (Aug 14, 2014)

Hey guys should I harvest this NL Şensi seeds at 9.5 weeks flowering?


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## Julius Caesar (Aug 14, 2014)

jackdavid123 said:


> Hey guys should I harvest this NL Şensi seeds at 9.5 weeks flowering?


I would wait one more week.


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## sativaallday (Aug 18, 2014)

if you want yeild a week if you wanna get more cbn cbdn and baked stonded wait a week or 2 ! and if not and you aant a nice high from it uplifiting pick it asap , all depends on strain to....


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## MARVEL0US (Aug 21, 2014)

I read this post some time ago and used it as a guide2 get stupendous results. Then alas, I also read that High Times article and tried my haul with as much clear as I can get. Nearing harvest I am back2 revisit this information and make the wrong things right.
With clear tri's I was happy with the high and the results, but there was overall lack. The high could have been righter, the taste wasn't as pure, and the bag quality was not smiling as much. The smell was still killer. I concluded that the extra wait time for full development is well worth it. The fullness and potential is reached and these women are not little girls anymore. As is stated repeatedly in this thread: Patience is key.


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## trippnface (Aug 27, 2014)

hmm interesting thread! i know it is not about flushing specifically but i have some things to add. besides the debated flush for taste/smoke ; i was under the impression you would want to remove nutes from the regimine so the plant knows it is nearing the end of its cycle ( im sure it does anyway) and it will focus more energy in producing its final lifeline of sticky flowers. or os this incorrect?

also; i have asthma; and i am quite sure i can tell the difference between flushed & unflushed bud. improperly cured or dried weed will not send me into a mild asthma attack; but unflushed bud certainly will. or am i placebo-ing that lol?


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## FATNIZZLE420 (Aug 28, 2014)

Im a noob and this is my first official grow.These are some pics of my girl. Day 49 of flower phase. By looking at the pics, how long before harvest? I don't have a microscope to check the trics. Thanks in advance. The strain is Lemon Kush.


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## swagslayer420 (Aug 28, 2014)

Two more weeks and about a pound.


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## k0ijn (Sep 1, 2014)

MARVEL0US said:


> I read this post some time ago and used it as a guide2 get stupendous results. Then alas, I also read that High Times article and tried my haul with as much clear as I can get. Nearing harvest I am back2 revisit this information and make the wrong things right.
> With clear tri's I was happy with the high and the results, but there was overall lack. The high could have been righter, the taste wasn't as pure, and the bag quality was not smiling as much. The smell was still killer. I concluded that the extra wait time for full development is well worth it. The fullness and potential is reached and these women are not little girls anymore. As is stated repeatedly in this thread: Patience is key.


I'm glad you found it helpful


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## k0ijn (Sep 1, 2014)

trippnface said:


> hmm interesting thread! i know it is not about flushing specifically but i have some things to add. besides the debated flush for taste/smoke ; i was under the impression you would want to remove nutes from the regimine so the plant knows it is nearing the end of its cycle ( im sure it does anyway) and it will focus more energy in producing its final lifeline of sticky flowers. or os this incorrect?
> 
> also; i have asthma; and i am quite sure i can tell the difference between flushed & unflushed bud. improperly cured or dried weed will not send me into a mild asthma attack; but unflushed bud certainly will. or am i placebo-ing that lol?


Plants react to sunlight with regards to growing & flowering, it's why we indoor growers have to make sure we control the amount of light the plants get, we can thus push the plants into flowering by lowering the amount of light (we are essentially mimicking autumn).

It doesn't have anything to do with "removing nutes".
Nutrients are essential to plants, they determine how much a plant can grow and if it will even survive but it has nothing to do with the change of the season and the change in sunlight (short days vs long days).

I cannot comment on your remarks about improperly cured weed vs un-flushed weed, since I have no clue what setup you used, how you tested it and what parameters were used.
What I can say is that I have tested un-flushed weed against 'normal' weed a lot of times, as have many other people, and the only real difference is the size of the harvest, because people who flush stifle the growth of their plants due to restricting the amount of nutrients their plants can have, it's also why you often see famished, stunted plants when people have flushed.


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## GardenBearz (Sep 1, 2014)

That part is pretty easy for me to determine now, but I am wondering how should watering be handled up to the harvest? Is it better to hold off watering and let the plants wilt slightly since they need to be dried anyway? Although this seems like it would make for a shorter dry cycle, it seems that it might not be the best way to go. Any help on this would be very much appreciated =)


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## lilmafia513 (Sep 1, 2014)

GardenBearz said:


> View attachment 3243556 View attachment 3243557 That part is pretty easy for me to determine now, but I am wondering how should watering be handled up to the harvest? Is it better to hold off watering and let the plants wilt slightly since they need to be dried anyway? Although this seems like it would make for a shorter dry cycle, it seems that it might not be the best way to go. Any help on this would be very much appreciated =)


I would check the temps and humidity of your drying area, and see what those are first.
If your area is low in RH, then i would say keep a little moisture in the plants before hanging. If high RH then let get dryer before cutting. 
I judge when to cut this way, and also put them in 24 hrs dark the night before chopping.
More on topic with this thread, I choose to flush the last 1-2 weeks (depending on the look of the plant) but I add 2 Tbsp. molasses per gallon during this time span. This way i am cleaning out any build ups, and i know theres something else the plant produces and stores.....too high to think lol


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## Tim MacIntyre (Sep 4, 2014)

Supersoul said:


> Hi again, I'm stumped again. I had one plant that i chopped 2 weeks ago with 20% amber. Now the other plants are just stubborn and now they are at 71 day into flowering and 84 days since i shut the lights out for 2 days to trigger the flowering stage. They are purple kush grown in FF soil. I stopped giving them nutes about 23 days ago. Most of the plants are all cloudy and no sign of going amber. 18 days ago i did a 2 days lights out so i can get more trichomes but now the plants are not turning amber...is it because of the lights out or is it because i stopped giving nutes?? Oh and the plant that i did harvest....are the leaves suppose to be brown?....I thought all buds are suppose to be green and where is the purple in the purple kush. Yes this is my first grow and i am stumped at the end...atleast i get to smoke one plant until i figure it out,...thanks for any help.
> View attachment 2134293View attachment 2134294these pics of the purple kush that is so brown.
> View attachment 2134296these are the stubborn plants


HEY supersoul i was lookin at ur pics and reading what u been doing with your grow!! and i must stress to you that doing that 2 day dark period in the middle of your plants life cycle like that is very bad and will stress the hell out of your crop, also the only time u should lay off the nuets is during the last week or two during your flush period b4 harvest right b 4 harvest is the appropriate time to give a 2 to 3 day dark period for a thric boost hope this helps ya and ur crop out good luck my friend happy growing!!!!


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## FlyBySoHigh (Sep 6, 2014)

I did what I could with my phone camera, from what I see they are milky, only a couple amber. This isnt a main cola but its not a popcorn, but this is basically what it looks like all over.

I'm thinkin its getting real close
Anyone have an opinion or should I wait for a loupe to get a closer look?


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## chuck estevez (Sep 6, 2014)

FlyBySoHigh said:


> I did what I could with my phone camera, from what I see they are milky, only a couple amber. This isnt a main cola but its not a popcorn, but this is basically what it looks like all over.
> 
> I'm thinkin its getting real close
> Anyone have an opinion or should I wait for a loupe to get a closer look?


still a couple weeks left. I like for all the white hairs to recede before i even start looking at trics.
Your plants look like they are N toxic. I would just use plain water for awhile.


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## FlyBySoHigh (Sep 6, 2014)

I just changed the res, it bounces back within a day or two. Its a single plant about 4 1/2' tall stalk is about the diameter of a half dollar with a root structure that could probably wrap around the block twice. It's in a 5 gal bucket with clay peb in a 6" net pot. 

I will drain about 1/3 of the res and replace with balanced fresh, should that suffice?

Thanks for the super fast response!

How do you p.m. up in this b?


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## chuck estevez (Sep 6, 2014)

FlyBySoHigh said:


> I just changed the res, it bounces back within a day or two. Its a single plant about 4 1/2' tall stalk is about the diameter of a half dollar with a root structure that could probably wrap around the block twice. It's in a 5 gal bucket with clay peb in a 6" net pot.
> 
> I will drain about 1/3 of the res and replace with balanced fresh, should that suffice?
> 
> ...


They are super dark green, they have to much nitrogen, cutting them off from anymore will help them use it up and the plants will finish properly, to much N will lower potency and make it taste like Chit.


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## FlyBySoHigh (Sep 6, 2014)

chuck estevez said:


> They are super dark green, they have to much nitrogen, cutting them off from anymore will help them use it up and the plants will finish properly, to much N will lower potency and make it taste like Chit.


-shudder/chills/gasp!-
No one likes Chitty taste!

I'll dilute and cut back with next res change, thanks for the advise!


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## FlyBySoHigh (Sep 6, 2014)

FATNIZZLE420 said:


> Im a noob and this is my first official grow.These are some pics of my girl. Day 49 of flower phase. By looking at the pics, how long before harvest? I don't have a microscope to check the trics. Thanks in advance. The strain is Lemon Kush. View attachment 3240487View attachment 3240489 View attachment 3240491


Nice girl, where did you get your strand?


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## Cbez (Sep 21, 2014)

Hi.
Just want to say thank you to Koijn for this excellent thread!! Best harvesting
thread I have seen.


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## MrRare (Sep 22, 2014)

Well having read the entire thread I am feeling much more informed and confidant on when to harvest and how to dry and cure. I appreciate the scientific approach Koijin employ's and the support for his statements. The art and science of growing is highly technical and filled with years of fabels and misinformation. Thanks Koijin for your knowledge ,time and patience in addressing so many questions and challenges.


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## Clink78 (Sep 29, 2014)

My Purple Paro trichs look ready, right? Mandala says this is a mid-end of October strain but she looks ready to me. What do you think?


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## IvyPirate (Sep 30, 2014)

Thanks also for kOijn for this thread.

I have had small outdoor grows (2-6 plants) over the past few years and always wondered about the flushing process. This year I have two very healthy plants due to maintaining a regular feeding schedule. I'm coming up on harvest time- probably 1 more week for my indica, 2 weeks for my Jock Horror cross- and, based on the first three pages of this thread, will keep feeding up until the end and passing on flushing the plants this year.

Getting ready to go home and take a new look at the trichomes to see if any have turned cloudy/amber in the past few days.


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## MrRare (Sep 30, 2014)

Clink 78
What did you use to take that awesome photo?


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## Clink78 (Oct 1, 2014)

MrRare said:


> Clink 78
> What did you use to take that awesome photo?


I have a Nikon D90 with a macro Lens 

Basically you just shoot a focused close up of a bud, then just crop a small part of it to get in really close.


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## MrRare (Oct 1, 2014)

Thanks for your response.
Time to buy another lens.


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## WazzaX (Oct 25, 2014)

hi and thanks in advance if someone can help me 

are these trics considered clear or milky?..


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## MuckyDucky (Oct 25, 2014)

WazzaX said:


> hi and thanks in advance if someone can help me
> 
> are these trics considered clear or milky?..


I am having problems seeing them but I believe they are mostly clear because I can just see a few amber specks. I am having problems telling clear from cloudy too. Even with better pictures for me it is hard to tell if some of the trichs are cloudy or they just look cloudy because of the way the light is reflecting.

I would like to harvest when they are prime. Opinions anyone? I am not seeing many amber on mine and I am not sure if I'm seeing a lot of cloudy or just the way the lights are reflecting..


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## MrStickyScissors (Oct 31, 2014)

The pic of the example of a mature cloudy trich looks immature still mine get white as snow solid white


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## CashCrops (Nov 13, 2014)

Clink78 said:


> My Purple Paro trichs look ready, right? Mandala says this is a mid-end of October strain but she looks ready to me. What do you think?View attachment 3263851


Looks good to me


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## anthone bonder (Nov 13, 2014)

Think these are done yet? Day 60 from flip... SinmintCookies 

Sent from my VS985 4G using Rollitup mobile app


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## MrRare (Nov 13, 2014)

It appears there are still some clear tricomes but most are cloudy.
I would continue to watch it and wait till the majority are cloudy but harvest before they start to turn amber.


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## anthone bonder (Nov 13, 2014)

They're on day 63

Sent from my VS985 4G using Rollitup mobile app


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## WestDenverPioneer (Nov 13, 2014)

anthone bonder said:


> They're on day 63
> 
> Sent from my VS985 4G using Rollitup mobile app


I'd let it go to week 10


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## anthone bonder (Nov 14, 2014)

WestDenverPioneer said:


> I'd let it go to week 10


Thanks

Sent from my VS985 4G using Rollitup mobile app


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## WestDenverPioneer (Nov 14, 2014)

Remember... you don't have to cut the whole plant down. Use your own judgement and cut only the ripe parts down. Go back 2 days later for some more, and so on. I rarely see a strain come out all at once for me.


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## SwankyDank (Nov 26, 2014)

Thank-you k0ijn, that first page was exactly what I needed. Now I know when to harvest and can do so with confidence.


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## JJ43 (Nov 27, 2014)

What do you think of these?
Ready to go?


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## AdamVoid (Dec 20, 2014)

Day 55 12/12 THC Bomb, any guesses how long do i have left?


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## JJ43 (Dec 27, 2014)

AdamVoid said:


> Day 55 12/12 THC Bomb, any guesses how long do i have left?


Try this:
http://www.radioshack.com/illuminated-microscope/6301313.html#q=Microscope&start=8


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## MuckyDucky (Dec 28, 2014)

JJ43 said:


> Try this:
> http://www.radioshack.com/illuminated-microscope/6301313.html#q=Microscope&start=8


Most of your pistils are not only still green but they still look very long and fresh. Wait until the green pistils have shrunken down in size... most closer to the size and length of your amber pistils, and you have more amber pistils... Then look at your trichs and post again.


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## PhlipMode (Feb 6, 2015)

Hi y'all, was wondering if anyone could give me advice on if there is a preferred time of day that would be ideal to chop plant?
If not then I'm literally about to chop my colas off to allow lil nugs to mature more!


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## chuck estevez (Feb 6, 2015)

PhlipMode said:


> Hi y'all, was wondering if anyone could give me advice on if there is a preferred time of day that would be ideal to chop plant?
> If not then I'm literally about to chop my colas off to allow lil nugs to mature more!


right before lights on


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## PhlipMode (Feb 6, 2015)

chuck estevez said:


> right after lights go off


Why would you cut just after lights off? wouldn't you wanna do it in the morning when nutrients are at there lowest within the roots, stems an leaves?


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## chuck estevez (Feb 6, 2015)

PhlipMode said:


> Why would you cut just after lights off? wouldn't you wanna do it in the morning when nutrients are at there lowest within the roots, stems an leaves?


oops, sorry, meant to say right before they go on after they have spent all night breaking down sugars and starches.


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## PhlipMode (Feb 6, 2015)

chuck estevez said:


> oops, sorry, meant to say right before they go on after they have spent all night breaking down sugars and starches.


Thanks for the advice.... I will be chopping in the morning then


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## GSquaredFarm (Feb 17, 2015)

Looking for a little advice from any of you who have a good eye without the use of 60x magnification. I have a USB microscope on its way, but it can't get here fast enough. Tomorrow will be week 11 from switching to 12/12. So realistically, probably about week 9 of flowering. This one plant "looks" to be ready, but I don't have enough experience to be confident in my assessment. I think it is ready because: top leaves yellowing and working its way down the branches, pistils seem to have mostly retreated and changed color (even on lower buds), and calyxes seem pretty swollen. I would hate to wait on the microscope and miss out on the peak production of this plant. Bottom line, do I cut her down tomorrow or wait another week for a microscope to see the trichomes for sure?


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## k0ijn (Feb 20, 2015)

GSquaredFarm said:


> Looking for a little advice from any of you who have a good eye without the use of 60x magnification. I have a USB microscope on its way, but it can't get here fast enough. Tomorrow will be week 11 from switching to 12/12. So realistically, probably about week 9 of flowering. This one plant "looks" to be ready, but I don't have enough experience to be confident in my assessment. I think it is ready because: top leaves yellowing and working its way down the branches, pistils seem to have mostly retreated and changed color (even on lower buds), and calyxes seem pretty swollen. I would hate to wait on the microscope and miss out on the peak production of this plant. Bottom line, do I cut her down tomorrow or wait another week for a microscope to see the trichomes for sure?


Hello GSquaredFarm,

Your plants do not look like a near harvest crop.
I would guesstimate at least another 2 weeks before you see proper calyx swelling (bud formation and development) and overall tinge.

You should be able to wait for the microscope.

I have a question about the netting. Do the plants rest on the netting?
From the pictures it seems like the netting is resting on the plants.
I would try to slightly bend and move the extended calyces around, make them interact with the netting, as to not just give more light to other branches with calyces but also make the plants work as many tips to the top.

To sum up; you want to aim for a fully developed calyxformation, if possible (this varies with strain and experience of course) something like this:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ec/Cannabis_Plant.jpg


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## GSquaredFarm (Feb 20, 2015)

k0ijn said:


> Hello GSquaredFarm,
> 
> Your plants do not look like a near harvest crop.
> I would guesstimate at least another 2 weeks before you see proper calyx swelling (bud formation and development) and overall tinge.
> ...


Thanks for the tip about the netting.

I should have ensured that only the plant in question was in the pics. She is surrounded by plants that are not ready.

Luckily the microscope came today. The first 3 pics are from higher on the plant. The last three are from the bottom of the plant. If the lower leaves had more amber trichomes I would feel confident harvesting her tomorrow. What are your thoughts, and thank you.


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## fandango (Mar 8, 2015)

OneloveGrower said:


> Are We Ready?View attachment 3130352 View attachment 3130353


Super Great Photo.


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## fandango (Mar 8, 2015)

k0ijn said:


> First of all I never said that clear trichomes _only_ contain precursor cannabinoids.
> I suggest you check out the entire post, I also posted visual aids.
> 
> I haven't read the article so I can't commentate on the references and science used in it.
> ...


I just finished an experimental grow of several cookie strains...I counted the flower days wrong(count started at 12/12 cycle)instead of signs of first flower,than a run of 60 days!sure the size could have been better if the plants were a live longer.
Well the smoke test was done yesterday,the trics were more clear than cloudy with a 5% amber at most.
I smoked 1 half of a pre roll and my day was done all doped up and had to waste away on the couch!


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## KittyBudette (Mar 12, 2015)

Fantastic thread!.......Whole lot of info here.Thanks,
was just wondering when really to harvest.Now I know
You know so much,I can only hope to know a fraction of
this by the time I am old


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## Nor-Cal Cuttings (Apr 9, 2015)

k0ijn said:


> Harvesting your weed based on trichomes is probably the easiest way for most growers to harvest as close to peak harvest as possible.
> 
> 
> The difficulty in the method comes with how to determine the state of the trichomes and what each state means.
> ...


Very helpful thanks keep up the good work man knowledge is power


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## joespit (Apr 10, 2015)

i think I'm 5> days away.... probably 3?


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## HollyD (Apr 16, 2015)

I just finished reading this whole thread, and k0ijn, you're a candidate for sainthood. 

My question: should I start counting the dark period from the beginning of the flush or from when I drove the nail through the stem and should I use a metal nail or a wooden stake and when is the best time for the chocolate syrup feeding to make it push out the maximum resin? Here's a picture, is it time to chop?











Hey, what's that axe for? 


Seriously, though, thank you for the thread. I'm getting better at guessing about other peoples' photos and have some confidence that I won't be in here asking when it's time for mine to come down.


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## k0ijn (Apr 24, 2015)

HollyD said:


> I just finished reading this whole thread, and k0ijn, you're a candidate for sainthood.
> 
> My question: should I start counting the dark period from the beginning of the flush or from when I drove the nail through the stem and should I use a metal nail or a wooden stake and when is the best time for the chocolate syrup feeding to make it push out the maximum resin? Here's a picture, is it time to chop?
> 
> ...


Thank you for your kind words, as well as the good laugh


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## Indian Spices (Apr 28, 2015)

its good to check your trichomes with a magnifier glass.

but after you have grown your strain a few times, you know exactly when its time. and after a few grows you may know it on every plant  experience is the best! 

don't let yourself hang if it isn't working the first time! you will learn from mistakes


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## SPLFreak808 (Apr 30, 2015)

what do yall think? just waiting on a little more amber tri's. its only at 5%.


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## OldSoul777 (May 21, 2015)

HEY ALL! THIS STUFF GREW SUPER FAST! I AM GROWING SUPER SKUNK, DAY 45 OF FLOWER, 52 OF 12/12 SHE WAS SHOWING PRE FLOWERS WHILE IN VEG. It is in my attempt at a SCROG. I am growing in hydro using GH 3 part with Liquid Karma and Cal mag. I am using RO water. I WANT TO CHOP ONE OF THE FOUR PLANTS AS I AM RUNNING OUT OF BUD. I NORMALLY WOULD JUST BUY SOME BUT THESE ARE SO CLOSE. ALL THE trichs ARE 100% CLOUDY WITH NO AMBER BUT THIS IS ALREADY AN INDICA DOMINANT STRAIN AND IS WHAT I LIKE. THIS PHENO IS REALLY SMALL COMPARED TO THE REST AND LOOKS LIKE SHE IS DONE PRODUCING BUD WHILE THE OTHERS ARE STILL FATTENING. WILL IT STILL PRODUCE GOOD SMOKE AT 45 DAYS? IS IT WORTH IT TO CHOP? here are some pics. You can see the Trics pretty clear if you zoom in. the fatter cola is what the others plants look like while the smaller on is what I am considering harvesting. There are 4 plants total for a 4x4 space pictured as well. Thanks for your opinions!


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## Fease (May 21, 2015)

I know this sticky is old but CBN does not really produce a sickly feeling unless you consume a lot of it at once. It can create some dizzyness or spins like feeling. CBN slow release patches and some amber on your plants when smoked will create a feeling of well being, anti anxiety, and very slight drowsiness. The patches are actually amazingly medicinal to the point where it surprises me that people have not noticed yet.


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## OldSoul777 (May 22, 2015)

Fease said:


> I know this sticky is old but CBN does not really produce a sickly feeling unless you consume a lot of it at once. It can create some dizzyness or spins like feeling. CBN slow release patches and some amber on your plants when smoked will create a feeling of well being, anti anxiety, and very slight drowsiness. The patches are actually amazingly medicinal to the point where it surprises me that people have not noticed yet.


This is exactly what I look for. I was saying the other day "now this is some MEDICINE!" All medicinal properties come from the indica strain from what I understand. I look for higher CBN and CBD levels. Even with the lower THC count it is much more enjoyable for me. Anxiety being the number 1 reason! then to enhance my appetite as well as for nausea in the morning. I dont know why but I almost always wake feeling sick upon waking. The MJ takes it right away! I love it when I am sick. It gets me back to eating so much faster not to mention makes it all much more tolerable. I can honestly say that I really dont care too much for sativas or sativa dominant strains. You are so right though. For most its all about that high THC count.


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## HectoBerlioz (May 22, 2015)

Hello!

I have two Acid plants, they are in 12/12 for 62 days now and I'm travelling from June 1st to June 11th, so I must decide to harvest next friday (May 29th) or only when I come back... I took 10 tiny bud pieces to make those shots...














































































thank you all!


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## Fease (May 22, 2015)

that's great it works for u!Sativa can also contain cbd and cbn but tends to be more upper in general which is potentially anxiety causing.


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## Fease (May 22, 2015)

are those nugs sativa or indica dominant? Indica finishes earlier. You can probably harvest next friday. They look almost done. If u let them go too long they could herm on ya.


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## Fease (May 22, 2015)

well I've smoked sativa with high cbd and I grow high cbd indica. Both exist. Also ya they should affect everyone the same but clearly something is different between the two. I'd guess that DNA, other chemicals/cannibinoids and terpenes create different effects.


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## Árboles verdes (May 25, 2015)

Hi guys, can you guys help me out, I'm having trouble with knowing when to harvest, this is my first grow, the crystals have more milky and very few Amber color than clear, I was just wondering about the (red hairs) that are still clear, should I worry about that?


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## Fease (May 25, 2015)

they should be 50%+ colored in. Some clear is fine, they'll color in after harvest


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## anzohaze (May 25, 2015)

HectoBerlioz said:


> Hello!
> 
> I have two Acid plants, they are in 12/12 for 62 days now and I'm travelling from June 1st to June 11th, so I must decide to harvest next friday (May 29th) or only when I come back... I took 10 tiny bud pieces to make those shots...
> 
> ...


What camera Did.you use for them shots


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## Árboles verdes (May 25, 2015)

I'm pretty positive I have 50% but not on all buds, do I just cut the bud by itself?


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## Árboles verdes (May 25, 2015)

U  
Do you guys think it's ready?


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## Fease (May 26, 2015)

wait another week o so


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## Árboles verdes (May 26, 2015)

Fease said:


> wait another week o so


Alright man, thanks


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## laubs (May 26, 2015)

k0ijn said:


> Harvesting your weed based on trichomes is probably the easiest way for most growers to harvest as close to peak harvest as possible.
> 
> 
> The difficulty in the method comes with how to determine the state of the trichomes and what each state means.
> ...


----------



## laubs (May 26, 2015)

Thank Koijin much good information. Clears up many questions. Knowledge is good!


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## Thc247 (Jun 6, 2015)

Supersoul said:


> Hi again, I'm stumped again. I had one plant that i chopped 2 weeks ago with 20% amber. Now the other plants are just stubborn and now they are at 71 day into flowering and 84 days since i shut the lights out for 2 days to trigger the flowering stage. They are purple kush grown in FF soil. I stopped giving them nutes about 23 days ago. Most of the plants are all cloudy and no sign of going amber. 18 days ago i did a 2 days lights out so i can get more trichomes but now the plants are not turning amber...is it because of the lights out or is it because i stopped giving nutes?? Oh and the plant that i did harvest....are the leaves suppose to be brown?....I thought all buds are suppose to be green and where is the purple in the purple kush. Yes this is my first grow and i am stumped at the end...atleast i get to smoke one plant until i figure it out,...thanks for any help.
> View attachment 2134293View attachment 2134294these pics of the purple kush that is so brown.
> View attachment 2134296these are the stubborn plants


i would take them down


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## Leandrobcool (Jun 12, 2015)

Hello everyone this is my first grow, I flushed them 5 days ago do u think they r ready for harvest or I should a bit longer?


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## laubs (Jun 12, 2015)

Leandrobcool said:


> View attachment 3438904 View attachment 3438905 Hello everyone this is my first grow, I flushed them 5 days ago do u think they r ready for harvest or I should a bit longer?


Looks damn good check tric. for clarity


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## Leandrobcool (Jun 12, 2015)

thank u, in terms of trichs mostly is cloudy with few amber and few clear..i m thinking more 5 days tops what u think?


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## laubs (Jun 12, 2015)

Leandrobcool said:


> thank u, in terms of trichs mostly is cloudy with few amber and few clear..i m thinking more 5 days tops what u think?


Cloudy is good I think your ready hope she's got fire grow on!


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## Leandrobcool (Jun 13, 2015)

I hope that also
It's a auto flower strain should I put it in darkness before harvesting?like 24-48h in darkness


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## Fease (Jun 13, 2015)

auto flower or not a little dark period can help prep the plant for harvest. Some ppl do it, some don't...


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## Leandrobcool (Jun 13, 2015)

Thks for info, I just have one more question the lower buds r smaller, should I harvest by sections to fatten up the lower buds?but to do so without breaking the branches or the main stem...


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## laubs (Jun 13, 2015)

Leandrobcool said:


> I hope that also
> It's a auto flower strain should I put it in darkness before harvesting?like 24-48h in darkness


I've heard the same. doesn't always work on all plants


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## laubs (Jun 13, 2015)

Leandrobcool said:


> Thks for info, I just have one more question the lower buds r smaller, should I harvest by sections to fatten up the lower buds?but to do so without breaking the branches or the main stem...


Yeah trim from top down. give you a little extra herb


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## randomgrow (Jun 13, 2015)

This has been the most helpful and informative thread on trichrome color and harvesting I've come across. It appears that I'm nearing the end of my first grow and I'm stressing over harvesting too soon or too late. I'm growing two strains. Heavyweight Fruit Punch (~8 week flowering time/first flower 5/6) and Super Lemon Haze (~9 week flowering time /first flower on 5/10). Here are some images of the trichrome and buds. Thoughts?


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## laubs (Jun 13, 2015)

randomgrow said:


> This has been the most helpful and informative thread on trichrome color and harvesting I've come across. It appears that I'm nearing the end of my first grow and I'm stressing over harvesting too soon or too late. I'm growing two strains. Heavyweight Fruit Punch (~8 week flowering time/first flower 5/6) and Super Lemon Haze (~9 week flowering time /first flower on 5/10). Here are some images of the trichrome and buds. Thoughts?
> 
> View attachment 3439499View attachment 3439500 View attachment 3439501 View attachment 3439502 View attachment 3439504 View attachment 3439505 View attachment 3439506 View attachment 3439507


Looks nice look for clear trichs very slight Amber grow on!


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## laubs (Jun 16, 2015)

k0ijn said:


> Harvesting your weed based on trichomes is probably the easiest way for most growers to harvest as close to peak harvest as possible.
> 
> 
> The difficulty in the method comes with how to determine the state of the trichomes and what each state means.
> ...


Great thread! Cleared up many questions. Thanks


----------



## laubs (Jun 16, 2015)

laubs said:


> nice look for cloudy trichs.


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## Sunspot (Jun 23, 2015)

This is a excellent thread, it proves to me in the past I have probably pulled plants way too early. Had I know about the trichs in the past I'm sure it'd of made a huge difference.

That said this is my first time using this method and while I do have a microscope it is tough to tell colour on but I saw a few amber and clear ones for sure. Using my zoom on a camera things look much more cloudy so now I'm not sure where I'm at.
I have a few pics of different areas, what would others do if they see what is in my pics?


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## laubs (Jun 23, 2015)

Sunspot said:


> This is a excellent thread, it proves to me in the past I have probably pulled plants way too early. Had I know about the trichs in the past I'm sure it'd of made a huge difference.
> 
> That said this is my first time using this method and while I do have a microscope it is tough to tell colour on but I saw a few amber and clear ones for sure. Using my zoom on a camera things look much more cloudy so now I'm not sure where I'm at.
> I have a few pics of different areas, what would others do if they see what is in my pics?


Cloudy is good with a touch of Amber looks like your ready


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## Sunspot (Jun 24, 2015)

That is what I was thinking, it definitely looks and smells ready too. I was kinda expecting a couple of weeks more though as it's been just over a month of flowering but it does look the pa rt.


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## Fease (Jun 24, 2015)

just over a month?!? What genetics, cuz that is fast. Really at a minimum I've never seen less then 7 full weeks


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## Sunspot (Jun 24, 2015)

It's a Nirvana seeds Bubblicious. Even they state expect around 60 days of flower. I'm growing it outdoor but bringing it in at night for its 12\12 and have been doing this since may 21. 

It is showing all the right signs though with the sugar leaves starting to curl upwards as well. Some of the bottom nugs are not ready but the top two thirds are looking good.

Only thing I can think of is it may have turned before I started bringing it in.


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## FlyBySoHigh (Jun 29, 2015)

These milky enough?


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## laubs (Jun 29, 2015)

FlyBySoHigh said:


> These milky enough?


Sure looks like it nice looking herb!!


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## laubs (Jun 29, 2015)

laubs said:


> Sure looks like it nice looking herb!!


 Check with a good magnifying lens maybe leave lower nugs on a little longer


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## FlyBySoHigh (Jun 30, 2015)

I check it with I think is a 10c mag.. I tries to take photos with phone through the mag. Glass but it ends up super blurry.. this is my first "all the way" grow, finally got shit dialed in and a safe place to do it. Just need to get the funds for the proper lightings and wall coverings

Ones been topped and trained (Improperly, waited to late I'm pretty sure) and the other was just let free minus cutting a few stragglers from the bottom area

They are fem'd super lemon haze from Herbies.. <~ awesome site and stealth shipping BTW!

here are some overall pics of the girls


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## laubs (Jun 30, 2015)

FlyBySoHigh said:


> I check it with I think is a 10c mag.. I tries to take photos with phone through the mag. Glass but it ends up super blurry.. this is my first "all the way" grow, finally got shit dialed in and a safe place to do it. Just need to get the funds for the proper lightings and wall coverings
> 
> Ones been topped and trained (Improperly, waited to late I'm pretty sure) and the other was just let free minus cutting a few stragglers from the bottom area
> 
> ...


Nice bud.I know it takes time to get it down. Had my own up and downs. I even take some of the big fan leaves off towards the end. Found a100x mag. 18. bucks at nut. store stay with it. product looks sweet! Grow on!


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## Discoballs (Jun 30, 2015)

randomgrow said:


> This has been the most helpful and informative thread on trichrome color and harvesting I've come across. It appears that I'm nearing the end of my first grow and I'm stressing over harvesting too soon or too late. I'm growing two strains. Heavyweight Fruit Punch (~8 week flowering time/first flower 5/6) and Super Lemon Haze (~9 week flowering time /first flower on 5/10). Here are some images of the trichrome and buds. Thoughts?
> 
> View attachment 3439499View attachment 3439500 View attachment 3439501 View attachment 3439502 View attachment 3439504 View attachment 3439505 View attachment 3439506 View attachment 3439507


MMMMMmmm! Yum


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## FlyBySoHigh (Jun 30, 2015)

laubs said:


> Nice bud.I know it takes time to get it down. Had my own up and downs. I even take some of the big fan leaves off towards the end. Found a100x mag. 18. bucks at nut. store stay with it. product looks sweet! Grow on!


Thanks for the advise and info!! I'll keep posted on how it goes for me! Thanks again

ROLL IT UP I THE DANKEST!!


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## laubs (Jun 30, 2015)

FlyBySoHigh said:


> Thanks for the advise and info!! I'll keep posted on how it goes for me! Thanks again
> 
> ROLL IT UP I THE DANKEST!!


Please do. Will have some pics to share soon


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## randomgrow (Jul 3, 2015)

Slight problem. Due to plant weight, my plant has broken through the lid of my hydroponic system. I've been rigging stuff to keep it upright but it is becoming more difficult. It appears that the majority of the trichomes are milky but I don't see any amber yet. Can someone take a look at these trichome photos and let me know if I can harvest? Thank you in advance.


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## laubs (Jul 3, 2015)

randomgrow said:


> Slight problem. Due to plant weight, my plant has broken through the lid of my hydroponic system. I've been rigging stuff to keep it upright but it is becoming more difficult. It appears that the majority of the trichomes are milky but I don't see any amber yet. Can someone take a look at these trichome photos and let me know if I can harvest? Thank you in advance.


Looks like there ready to go try for a couple of days more and enjoy!


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## devinthegeneral (Jul 28, 2015)

help, how much longer?


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## laubs (Jul 28, 2015)

Looks like your ready for harvest.nice looking product!


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## devinthegeneral (Jul 28, 2015)

another pic


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## laubs (Jul 28, 2015)

Wow looks good!


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## devinthegeneral (Jul 28, 2015)

thanks


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## laubs (Jul 28, 2015)

No just took some down that had that same look. Tasty!


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## laubs (Jul 28, 2015)

Meant to say no problem!


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## devinthegeneral (Jul 28, 2015)

So should I flush, and how long?


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## laubs (Jul 28, 2015)

I usually flush 3 times I'm using dirt so it might be different for you but at least 2 should work


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## mathematician1.618 (Aug 1, 2015)

k0ijn said:


> Harvesting your weed based on trichomes is probably the easiest way for most growers to harvest as close to peak harvest as possible.
> 
> 
> The difficulty in the method comes with how to determine the state of the trichomes and what each state means.
> ...


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## laubs (Aug 1, 2015)

Very true! I have a 100x magnifying glass works great only 18 bucks


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 3, 2015)

First grow and I was curious to know if these tricombs are considered clear or milky


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## laubs (Aug 3, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> First grow and I was curious to know if these tricombs are considered clear or milky


They look milky. How long into flowering?


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 4, 2015)

laubs said:


> They look milky. How long into flowering?


Three weeks but mostly all the hairs are white a few of them are starting to turn Orange and the ones at the bottom have much more orange hairs than the top here's a pic of the whole plant then the next pic is the whole plant and the last is a better view of the tricombs


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## laubs (Aug 4, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Three weeks but mostly all the hairs are white a few of them are starting to turn Orange and the ones at the bottom have much more orange hairs than the top here's a pic of the whole plant then the next pic is the whole plant and the last is a better view of the tricombs


Having trouble picking up pics
Should go 7 to 9 weeks depending upon strain. Are they auto flowers?


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 4, 2015)

laubs said:


> Having trouble picking up pics
> Should go 7 to 9 weeks depending upon strain. Are they auto flowers?


Yeah they are autos .. And 7 to 9 weeks sounds just about right for harvest the rate that they are growing now


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## laubs (Aug 4, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Yeah they are autos .. And 7 to 9 weeks sounds just about right for harvest the rate that they are growing now


Yeah maybe a little less. Have 1 auto going now, will look up flowering time and let you know


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## laubs (Aug 4, 2015)

laubs said:


> Yeah maybe a little less. Have 1 auto going now, will look up flowering time and let you know


It says 18 to 20 hrs light 6 to 8 weeks to finish


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## laubs (Aug 4, 2015)

laubs said:


> It says 18 to 20 hrs light 6 to 8 weeks to finish


Start to fimish


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## laubs (Aug 4, 2015)

Start to finish


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 4, 2015)

I have 2 a


laubs said:


> It says 18 to 20 hrs light 6 to 8 weeks to finish


I have 2 blueberry autofems going right now ... I started them off with 18/6 400w metal halide ... I also have a 3 month old photoperiod afghan goo..so I leftthe afghan in veg while I waitedfor the autos to start to flower once they started cola growth I switched to 12/12 and eye hortilux HPS bulb and now both autos will finish first then the afghan will finish ... I did it this way so I would have a constant supply of medication ... All you have to do is keep your autos in 18/6 ... Light doesn't matter for a new time grower ... Personally though I'd veg them with MH and then once they start to bud go with HPS ... You will obtain a better yield and more potency.. Andyou can't really go by what "it" says... With auto fems the genetics are very unstable and certain phenotypes will vary depending on the individual seed... For example one of my blueberry plants grew to its maximum hight really fast and the other one it took a lot longer because of differences in the growth phenotype ... Just go by the Q's that your plant gives you like the smell, color of the calyxes ( hairs ) which will turn from white to orange and of course the tricombs will become more milky in color ... These are the best ways to tell when your girls will be ready for harvest


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## laubs (Aug 4, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> I have 2 a
> 
> I have 2 blueberry autofems going right now ... I started them off with 18/6 400w metal halide ... I also have a 3 month old photoperiod afghan goo..so I leftthe afghan in veg while I waitedfor the autos to start to flower once they started cola growth I switched to 12/12 and eye hortilux HPS bulb and now both autos will finish first then the afghan will finish ... I did it this way so I would have a constant supply of medication ... All you have to do is keep your autos in 18/6 ... Light doesn't matter for a new time grower ... Personally though I'd veg them with MH and then once they start to bud go with HPS ... You will obtain a better yield and more potency.. Andyou can't really go by what "it" says... With auto fems the genetics are very unstable and certain phenotypes will vary depending on the individual seed... For example one of my blueberry plants grew to its maximum hight really fast and the other one it took a lot longer because of differences in the growth phenotype ... Just go by the Q's that your plant gives you like the smell, color of the calyxes ( hairs ) which will turn from white to orange and of course the tricombs will become more milky in color ... These are the best ways to tell when your girls will be ready for harvest


True but autos can be done under hps. You still have to study each plant. Found blueberries tend to stretch alot. Look for a 100x mag glass makes things easier to look at. This is my first time an auto. Give white widow a try. Easy to grow and is bomb


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## laubs (Aug 4, 2015)

Info I got was from seed company


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 4, 2015)

laubs said:


> Info I got was from seed company


You're 100% right blueberries auto femmes do actually stretch quite a bit and you can also start an auto Fem under high-pressure sodium but you will get a much better yield if you start them under a metal halide and then switch over to high-pressure sodium... It's just their natural response to bud more in an orange dominant light spectrum


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## laubs (Aug 4, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> You're 100% right blueberries auto femmes do actually stretch quite a bit and you can also start an auto Fem under high-pressure sodium but you will get a much better yield if you start them under a metal halide and then switch over to high-pressure sodium... It's just their natural response to bud more in an orange dominant light spectrum


That's good to know being first time with auto flowers. Makes sense!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 5, 2015)

laubs said:


> That's good to know being first time with auto flowers. Makes sense!


Yeah they will flower without change in light... But like all cannabis it increases the bud size and just overall


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## laubs (Aug 5, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Yeah they will flower without change in light... But like all cannabis it increases the bud size and just overall


Agreed I'm doing mine in two stages not sure that one light thing works


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 5, 2015)

laubs said:


> Agreed I'm doing mine in two stages not sure that one light thing works


If you have an auto flower you can use a single cfl( curly light bulb) per plant at an inch away From veg to harvest that's the nice thing about autos, the bulb is cheap and doesn't produce a lot of heat and won't raise your electric bill but... I also grow photoperios plants in between the autos so I need to use two stage light growth.. MH for veg and HPS as soon as preflowers appear and once preflowers turn to solid flowers I'll then start 12/12.. The autos take about 80 days to fully bud out and photos can take up to 8 months I have smaller quicker harvests from my autos and then huge yields with afghan broadleaf, you may know it as "afghan goo" (I just perfer afghan broadleaf because that strain is super resilient to shock , under watering, overwatering I know exactly how much nutes to give to it at certain times and I'm familiar with how it grows) and every plant I harvest I just replant another seed... But you can definetly use just one type of bulb just make sure it's either CFL,HPS, or MH. I know you can use LEDs but I never used them before so I can't tell you how autos do with them but autos are fun to grow just don't move it at all... I learned the hard way on my first grow by moving it from my porch for sunlight to my closet for CFL it was in a constant state of shock and I just didn't know what shock for cannabis looks like so It died.. I went out and bought a 400w digital ballast light fixture ( got it used for 150) made by hydrofarm and I got the MH and HPS bulbs and ever since my grows have been really on point


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## laubs (Aug 9, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> If you have an auto flower you can use a single cfl( curly light bulb) per plant at an inch away From veg to harvest that's the nice thing about autos, the bulb is cheap and doesn't produce a lot of heat and won't raise your electric bill but... I also grow photoperios plants in between the autos so I need to use two stage light growth.. MH for veg and HPS as soon as preflowers appear and once preflowers turn to solid flowers I'll then start 12/12.. The autos take about 80 days to fully bud out and photos can take up to 8 months I have smaller quicker harvests from my autos and then huge yields with afghan broadleaf, you may know it as "afghan goo" (I just perfer afghan broadleaf because that strain is super resilient to shock , under watering, overwatering I know exactly how much nutes to give to it at certain times and I'm familiar with how it grows) and every plant I harvest I just replant another seed... But you can definetly use just one type of bulb just make sure it's either CFL,HPS, or MH. I know you can use LEDs but I never used them before so I can't tell you how autos do with them but autos are fun to grow just don't move it at all... I learned the hard way on my first grow by moving it from my porch for sunlight to my closet for CFL it was in a constant state of shock and I just didn't know what shock for cannabis looks like so It died.. I went out and bought a 400w digital ballast light fixture ( got it used for 150) made by hydrofarm and I got the MH and HPS bulbs and ever since my grows have been really on point


Yeah good information! Going to stay with what's working! Lot easier. Sometime simple is better.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 10, 2015)

laubs said:


> Yeah good information! Going to stay with what's working! Lot easier. Sometime simple is better.


Yeah dude if it ain't broke don't fix it ... I'm actually about to harvest one of my autos in the next few days... I'm pretty sure that I can harvest now but not all the hairs are orange only about 40% and the top hairs are still white with orange hairs around them... Here's a picture tell me what you think ... The second picture is my photoperiod tell me what you think about it does it look healthy too you?


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## laubs (Aug 10, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Yeah dude if it ain't broke don't fix it ... I'm actually about to harvest one of my autos in the next few days... I'm pretty sure that I can harvest now but not all the hairs are orange only about 40% and the top hairs are still white with orange hairs around them... Here's a picture tell me what you think ... The second picture is my photoperiod tell me what you think about it does it look healthy too you?


I would look in to a mag glass for the auto. Looks like it needs a bit more not familiar with them got my first one going so you can assist me. Second one looks good! Finishing up some purple rhino. Buds size of beer bottles. White widow next


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## laubs (Aug 10, 2015)

laubs said:


> I would look in to a mag glass for the auto. Looks like it needs a bit more not familiar with them got my first one going so you can assist me. Second one looks good! Finishing up some purple rhino. Buds size of beer bottles. White widow next


Looked again, photo looks real good, many nugs!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 10, 2015)

laubs said:


> Looked again, photo looks real good, many nugs!


Ths is a lot man... Yeah I still haven't chopped her yet.. I got a jewelers scope and the tricombs are 2/3 cloudy and I like more "couch lock" buds where you want to sleep since I'm an insomniac and very little meds help me but weed just helps 2x as well as any meds will


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 10, 2015)

laubs said:


> Looked again, photo looks real good, many nugs!


Thanks a lot man ... I still haven't chopped yet ... I got a jewlers scope and 2/3 of the tricombs are milky so I'm gonna wait until I just start to see a little bit of Amber in the tricombs for that "stoned" high ... And the photoperiod is starting to really bud here's an updated photo of the newly formed buds... P.s I want to see your baby's lol


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## Joedank (Aug 11, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Thanks a lot man ... I still haven't chopped yet ... I got a jewlers scope and 2/3 of the tricombs are milky so I'm gonna wait until I just start to see a little bit of Amber in the tricombs for that "stoned" high ... And the photoperiod is starting to really bud here's an updated photo of the newly formed buds... P.s I want to see your baby's lol


nice buddy looks good . way to be patient!! 
man its been a long time since i tried a kickflip front blunt . last time was a 6 stair hand rail (long steps ) and i ate it .. ouch ... tough trick even after years of landing them...


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 11, 2015)

Joedank said:


> nice buddy looks good . way to be patient!!
> man its been a long time since i tried a kickflip front blunt . last time was a 6 stair hand rail (long steps ) and i ate it .. ouch ... tough trick even after years of landing them...


Haha thanks man ... Someone asked me if kick flip front blunt was a strain of weed so I just went with it ... I can do them on smaller stuff but I like switch nose blunt better ... And I've come too far to chop early ... Im not too crazy about "energetic" bud


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## laubs (Aug 11, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Thanks a lot man ... I still haven't chopped yet ... I got a jewlers scope and 2/3 of the tricombs are milky so I'm gonna wait until I just start to see a little bit of Amber in the tricombs for that "stoned" high ... And the photoperiod is starting to really bud here's an updated photo of the newly formed buds... P.s I want to see your baby's lol


Sounds like your ready to go.will get some pics to you. Hope your is some good fire!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 19, 2015)

laubs said:


> Sounds like your ready to go.will get some pics to you. Hope your is some good fire!


You think this is ready for harvest


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## laubs (Aug 19, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> View attachment 3482630
> You think this is ready for harvest View attachment 3482628


Wow nice! I think your ready if not close. A touch of Amber isn't bad


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 19, 2015)

laubs said:


> Wow nice! I think your ready if not close. A touch of Amber isn't bad


Thanks man yeah I might wait a day max and harvest then but I could harvest now and start curing


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## laubs (Aug 19, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Thanks man yeah I might wait a day max and harvest then but I could harvest now and start curing


Yeah looks good!! What flavor? Got some widows coming


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 19, 2015)

laubs said:


> Yeah looks good!! What flavor? Got some widows coming


It's blueberry 420 super excited just trimmed all sun leaves for harvest tomorrow here's an up date ... Sorry my photoperios afghan broadleaf photo bombed the background lol


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## tazz&indy (Aug 23, 2015)

Not yet, the buds need to fatten up until the white pistils hardly show, wait until the trichomes are mostly all cloudy white. You have a lot to gain by waiting a bit. Good luck, nice plant.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 23, 2015)

tazz&indy said:


> Not yet, the buds need to fatten up until the white pistils hardly show, wait until the trichomes are mostly all cloudy white. You have a lot to gain by waiting a bit. Good luck, nice plant.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


I harvested already and it's curing ... I know for next time... But it does smoke nice ... I took a small bud and held it under a blowdryer( I know that the best way) but it tasted great and had a nice smell... it worked and I felt the benefits ... I know the buds could of gotten fatter and I could of waited , which is what I'll do with the the other blueberry and my ak-47.. Here's a pic of the blow dried bud


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## laubs (Aug 23, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> View attachment 3484877
> I harvested already and it's curing ... I know for next time... But it does smoke nice ... I took a small bud and held it under a blowdryer( I know that the best way) but it tasted great and had a nice smell... it worked and I felt the benefits ... I know the buds could of gotten fatter and I could of waited , which is what I'll do with the the other blueberry and my ak-47.. Here's a pic of the blow dried bud


Looks pretty pretty good maybe a little longer, if it works that's what counts. Curious to see the other ladies! Will update the the widows soon


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 24, 2015)

laubs said:


> Looks pretty pretty good maybe a little longer, if it works that's what counts. Curious to see the other ladies! Will update the the widows soon


Just a question... My buds are still drying out .. But they have this "earthy" smell but when you smell the inside of the bud it smells really good ... Kinda citrusy .... With that earthy smell or cut grass smell will that start to break down ( I'm guessing it's chlorophyll ) and start to smell like real bud ... My buds are on day 4 of drying waiting for the smaller stems to snap then off to the jar... And here's the other blueberry and my ak-47 still working on their buds ... Finally found out what strain the big girl was ... How does the big one look .. He colas are getting heavy so I had to take another plant pot fill it will bricks stick a pole in it and tie it to the main stem so it would stand straight up


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 24, 2015)

laubs said:


> Looks pretty pretty good maybe a little longer, if it works that's what counts. Curious to see the other ladies! Will update the the widows soon


And this is the half dried bud but it looks nothing like it did when it was on the plant ... Does it look like it's gonna be good ... Haven't tried it yet so maybe you guys can give me an idea


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## simchaleh (Aug 25, 2015)

hi there everyone.
i ive been lookn around alot to try figure out this whole harvesting time thing.
ive read all those posts about clear triches=cleaer high, and cloudy mix, amber heavy. and that amber is just degrading THC.
but that doesnt make sense to me, since we have so many different genetics and options. wouldnt the best be to carefully choose ur genetics, and then grow the bud to its full potential ripeness.?

which brings me to the question of, what is actually the full potenetial of ripeness?

there are many many very knowledgable growers, who says full potenetial is 75%amber usually. and that people that harvest at just clear/cloudy are losing out on the full potenetial of the bud. so if i want a clear headed cerebral sativa, to use genetics of a strain known for clear headed cerebral, and grow it to 75% amber. and the best is to just grow out the plant to its full potential, and letting the genetics control the type of high.
so if u want a cerebral clear upper, go sativa and grow to full potential,
and if u want an indica downer, go indica and grow full potenetial.
like in this post over here: https://www.rollitup.org/t/anyne-ever-smoked-overripe-buds.111444/page-12


on one hand i read many opions about harvesting when triches are cloudy,and a touch amber, to get full ripeness.
and to avoid amber.

also ive read that 'amber' only actually degrades the THC and turns the smoke into a downer, is when ur dealing with 100% amber, and letting it sit several many weeks like that. 


what is the real deal?
is i actually true that if u grow out a good sativa strain, that is known for a clean focused high, and grow it to 75% amber, that it will become a tiring, confused, drowsy type of smoke?
or if you cut a clean focused high sativa at 50/50 cloudy/clear , that ull be losing out on its full potential?

can anyone with actual expereince doing this please chipe in?

ive put so much time and effort into this grow, i dont wanna chop early. and also i dont wanna chop too late.
looking forward to seeing actaul opinions here  thnks!


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## Budget Buds (Aug 25, 2015)

simchaleh said:


> hi there everyone.
> i ive been lookn around alot to try figure out this whole harvesting time thing.
> ive read all those posts about clear triches=cleaer high, and cloudy mix, amber heavy. and that amber is just degrading THC.
> but that doesnt make sense to me, since we have so many different genetics and options. wouldnt the best be to carefully choose ur genetics, and then grow the bud to its full potential ripeness.?
> ...



IMO when the trichomes are full blown cloudy the plant is at it's peak potential , As they turn amber the thc is degrading to other cannabanoids responsible for the couch lock kind of buzz you speak of. I dont prefer sativa's but I have had them that are full blown amber and they are much more like an indica in buzz comparison. The plant IMO will never be all cloudy at one time, rather a mixture of clear, cloudy and amber with time being the major factor in what ratio they are at. If you like a more upbeat head high then chop it when there clear/ cloudy. If you desire couch lock then chop when they are more cloudy/amber. It really is up to you and what you like and honestly only hands on experience will show you. Hope this helps  BB


----------



## simchaleh (Aug 26, 2015)

hey there everyone.
do you think anyone could give me experience if these buds look ready?
theyre both sativa dom strains. week 10 into flower.
i bought these strains cause i was looking for something that has a focused, cerebral high, and still be functional. some ambers are popping up. however i dont wanna harvest to early and lose potential of the genetics.

*STRAIN 1: CBD medi haze (breeder flower time 9-11 weeks)*
notes: mostly cloudy, some clear, some amber.
(p.s. CBD crew told me to harvest it when 75% amber in order to maximize potential. however i dont want couchlock. this is a CBD 2:1 strain. but wahts unique about it, is that its sativa dominant.)
    





*STRAIN B: Maui waui. (breeder time. 9-10 weeks)
notes:* this one is confusing me. i see a mix of cloudy and clear, and at the same ambers have started popping up over the last week. but the ambers seem to be coming on, while the clears are staying cloudy. for example, i see a clear triche, that starts becoming amber, without becoming cloudy. and i see cloudy triches that are not amber yet.


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## rocpilefsj (Aug 26, 2015)

simchaleh said:


> hi there everyone.
> i ive been lookn around alot to try figure out this whole harvesting time thing.
> ive read all those posts about clear triches=cleaer high, and cloudy mix, amber heavy. and that amber is just degrading THC.
> but that doesnt make sense to me, since we have so many different genetics and options. wouldnt the best be to carefully choose ur genetics, and then grow the bud to its full potential ripeness.?
> ...


Many many growers can say whatever they like, if you chop at 75% amber then 75% of your tric's have degraded to the point where you have lost up to 90% thc to cbn. It's science!


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## simchaleh (Aug 26, 2015)

rocpilefsj said:


> Many many growers can say whatever they like, if you chop at 75% amber then 75% of your tric's have degraded to the point where you have lost up to 90% thc to cbn. It's science!


ok.
how do the plants look overall, and by the triches?
do u think its time to chop?

should i wait longer with the MEDI Haze and especially the maui waui, since theres still a bunch of clear triches, even though amber is starting to set in?


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 26, 2015)

simchaleh said:


> hi there everyone.
> i ive been lookn around alot to try figure out this whole harvesting time thing.
> ive read all those posts about clear triches=cleaer high, and cloudy mix, amber heavy. and that amber is just degrading THC.
> but that doesnt make sense to me, since we have so many different genetics and options. wouldnt the best be to carefully choose ur genetics, and then grow the bud to its full potential ripeness.?
> ...





simchaleh said:


> ok.
> how do the plants look overall, and by the triches?
> do u think its time to chop?
> 
> should i wait longer with the MEDI Haze since theres still a bunch of clear triches, even though amber is starting to set in?


its alllll subjective ... If you like a speedy high then chop with 40percent clear tricombs if you want a mix of speedy and a nice body high ( which for me is my preference ) wait for all tricombs to be cloudy with just a hint of Amber at the tips and not on all of the tricombs just around 10-15 percent of them ... I chopped one plant with 40% clear and 60% cloudy and it was a speedy high ... A functioning high if you will ... With my next harvest I waited for 10% Amber and not ful blown Amber either just a small percent and I got the perfect combination for me ... Here's the pic


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## simchaleh (Aug 26, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> its alllll subjective ... If you like a speedy high then chop with 40percent clear tricombs if you want a mix of speedy and a nice body high ( which for me is my preference ) wait for all tricombs to be cloudy with just a hint of Amber at the tips and not on all of the tricombs just around 10-15 percent of them ... I chopped one plant with 40% clear and 60% cloudy and it was a speedy high ... A functioning high if you will ... With my next harvest I waited for 10% Amber and not ful blown Amber either just a small percent and I got the perfect combination for me ... Here's the pic


the problem here, is that ive theres a still a good mix of cloudy and clear. but at the same time im having a bunch of triches already going amber at the tips on the clear triches (with the maui waui strain.)
the medi h seems about 70 cloudy, 30 clear, with ambers thrown in all around.

im definately not into a body high. especially not a tiring or cloudy head type of one. which is why i picked these genetics...

the pics i posted dont help? im having trouble deciding how much percentage is actually there.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 26, 2015)

it's nice to know that somebody did their homework on strains before they went out and bought seeds...but anytime you see Amber on any type of tricombs that means that that specific trichomes are degrading and the THC levels in it are decreasing and CBN levels are increasing which is what creates couch lock if you don't like the couch lock higher that very stoned feeling I would chop now ... You seem right in the sweet spot for the type of meds your growing... you have mostly cloudy try combs with just a touch of Amber the longer you wait the more Amber is going to show the more couch lock hi you're going to get...this is a bud of mine in the cure state


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## simchaleh (Aug 26, 2015)

ok. thnks.
yeah i researched for hours using the filters on the seedbanks, and reading up online. i bought 3 different strains, to suit for different purposes that i want.
*1)dutch passion durban poison*,(mostly/or perhaps pure sativa) for clear focused energized smoke
*2)nirvana maui waui,*(sat dominant)for mellow but also energized chillling, happy enjoyable high. not too intense
*3)CBD medi haze*(80 percent sativa. 2:1 cbd/thc) for daytime work when needed for headaches, and to still be able to work.

btw have u actually tried growing out a sativa strain to amber before and has it caused a couchlock effect? its so hard for me to believe it. i would love to hear first hand experience.

how do the pics of the second strain, the maui waui look to you? do they also seem like mostly cloudy?


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 26, 2015)

simchaleh said:


> ok. thnks.
> yeah i researched for hours using the filters on the seedbanks, and reading up online. i bought 3 different strains, to suit for different purposes that i want.
> *1)dutch passion durban poison*,(mostly/or perhaps pure sativa) for clear focused energized smoke
> *2)nirvana maui waui,*(sat dominant)for mellow but also energized chillling, happy enjoyable high. not too intense
> ...


Beautiful pics.. But I can't tell because of the lights ... I'm not sure what kind they are they're deffinetly not HPS ... Is it l.e.d... But the tricombs look more on the clear side ... I couldn't see any Amber but it still has a little bit more to go before harvest.... And I never let a saliva get to Amber tricombs reason being im growing my first photoperiod now actually ... I stRted with autos and perfected my technique with those ... So now I'm on my first photoperiod so I know what I'm doing ... It's sativa dominant and I beleive it to be an Afghan broadleaf but I'm not too sure maybe you can help me with that... But deffinetly try turning lights off and then taking a pic so I can see the true color of he tricombs but they look beautiful... Here's the pic of my afghan .. Btw there's the last blueberry autofem waiting for harvest in front of the big girl ... Tell me what you think since you have grown photos before.. Second picture is a close up of the photoperiod


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## simchaleh (Aug 26, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Beautiful pics.. But I can't tell because of the lights ... I'm not sure what kind they are they're deffinetly not HPS ... Is it l.e.d... But the tricombs look more on the clear side ... I couldn't see any Amber but it still has a little bit more to go before harvest.... And I never let a saliva get to Amber tricombs reason being im growing my first photoperiod now actually ... I stRted with autos and perfected my technique with those ... So now I'm on my first photoperiod so I know what I'm doing ... It's sativa dominant and I beleive it to be an Afghan broadleaf but I'm not too sure maybe you can help me with that... But deffinetly try turning lights off and then taking a pic so I can see the true color of he tricombs but they look beautiful... Here's the pic of my afghan .. Btw there's the last blueberry autofem waiting for harvest in front of the big girl ... Tell me what you think since you have grown photos before.. Second picture is a close up of the photoperiod


hey there.
its actually my first time ever grow. so i cant comment on ur pics at all. they look sweet though.
the light is a LED.
ur right, the light confuses some of the pics. but if u look at the close up triches pics i posted previously, ull see plenty of amber triches.
LOOK at picture 1, and 2 of the medi haze strain (first strain i posted).
and at picture 2 of the Maui waui (second strain).
after that u may also be able to identify them in the other pics


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 26, 2015)

simchaleh said:


> hey there.
> its actually my first time ever grow. so i cant comment on ur pics at all. they look sweet though.
> the light is a LED.
> ur right, the light confuses some of the pics. but if u look at the close up triches pics i posted previously, ull see plenty of amber triches.
> ...


Ok so the medi looks ready..very few clear tricombs mostly cloudy and just the right amount of Amber color on a few... And I didn't see any hairs sticking straight up either ... And if there are virtually no white hairs then chop it and cure it ....the rest of them I couldn't tell you honestly what to do .. I can't get a good look at the pics cause the lighting
And btw did your photo plants look similar to mine when they were in early cola growth


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## simchaleh (Aug 26, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Ok so the medi looks ready..very few clear tricombs mostly cloudy and just the right amount of Amber color on a few... And I didn't see any hairs sticking straight up either ... And if there are virtually no white hairs then chop it and cure it ....the rest of them I couldn't tell you honestly what to do .. I can't get a good look at the pics cause the lighting
> And btw did your photo plants look similar to mine when they were in early cola growth


hard for me to say, about pics of ur plants. i grew sativa dom plants witha very slow scrog screen. definately ask other people. open up a grow journal is the best advice i can give u.
btw when ur giving me this advice about when to chop, and concerning amber triches. is this from ur own personal experience, with a sativa strain with amber triches? or just from what uve read online in the forums etc? im trying to research this whole idea correctly.
ive read many threads and info in my research on this topic. where they say that the actualy high of the plant is cause 95% by the strain, and 5% by triche color harvest time. and that the amber triches only will cause the heaviness to the high, when ur dealing with over 75% amber, and when u let it sit several several weeks that way. i read that back in the day, only buds that were 75% amber were allowed in coffee shops in amsterdam, otherwise they were considered not fully ripe and at their potential.


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## rocpilefsj (Aug 26, 2015)

The old clear is an upbeat high, amber is for couchlock is in my opinion the wrong way to do things and mostly bs, again my opinion. If you want a certain kind of high choose the strain that delivers what you want and grow it until majority of tric's are cloudy then chop. You want a couchlock high grow indica dominant strains, you want a more energetic high then grow sativa dom strains. All chopping with clear tric's does is rob you of yield and precursor cannibinoids have nowhere near the thc of cloudy fully realized tric's.


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## rocpilefsj (Aug 26, 2015)

simchaleh said:


> ok.
> how do the plants look overall, and by the triches?
> do u think its time to chop?
> 
> should i wait longer with the MEDI Haze and especially the maui waui, since theres still a bunch of clear triches, even though amber is starting to set in?


I find it hard to tell under led light, if you are seeing the majority cloudy with a few clear and amber then it is time to chop! You will never have all cloud but the closest you can get it the better. Plants looks good what kind of led and wattage were you running?


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## simchaleh (Aug 26, 2015)

rocpilefsj said:


> The old clear is an upbeat high, amber is for couchlock is in my opinion the wrong way to do things and mostly bs, again my opinion. If you want a certain kind of high choose the strain that delivers what you want and grow it until majority of tric's are cloudy then chop. You want a couchlock high grow indica dominant strains, you want a more energetic high then grow sativa dom strains. All chopping with clear tric's does is rob you of yield and precursor cannibinoids have nowhere near the thc of cloudy fully realized tric's.


wow, its good to hear someone say that aobut that theory. im trying to get most cloudy. but im having trouble with the maui waui strain. the medi haze is gradually getting cloudier, and little by little more amber. however alot of the maui waui clear triches, are going amber at the tips, without turning cloudy. really wierd.

about not being able to see triches in the pics i put above, the light confuses some of the pics. but if u look at the close up triches pics i posted previously, ull see plenty of amber triches.
LOOK at picture 1, and 2 of the medi haze strain (first strain i posted).
and at picture 2 of the Maui waui (second strain).
after that u may also be able to identify them in the other pics


the light is a 96x3 mars hydro. actual draw is around 180W. im going at about 50W per sq foot.


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## hellmutt bones (Aug 26, 2015)

Sticky!!


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## simchaleh (Aug 26, 2015)

hellmutt bones said:


> Sticky!!


? 
i dont get it....


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 26, 2015)

simchaleh said:


> hard for me to say, about pics of ur plants. i grew sativa dom plants witha very slow scrog screen. definately ask other people. open up a grow journal is the best advice i can give u.
> btw when ur giving me this advice about when to chop, and concerning amber triches. is this from ur own personal experience, with a sativa strain with amber triches? or just from what uve read online in the forums etc? im trying to research this whole idea correctly.
> ive read many threads and info in my research on this topic. where they say that the actualy high of the plant is cause 95% by the strain, and 5% by triche color harvest time. and that the amber triches only will cause the heaviness to the high, when ur dealing with over 75% amber, and when u let it sit several several weeks that way. i read that back in the day, only buds that were 75% amber were allowed in coffee shops in amsterdam, otherwise they were considered not fully ripe and at their potential.





Budget Buds said:


> IMO when the trichomes are full blown cloudy the plant is at it's peak potential , As they turn amber the thc is degrading to other cannabanoids responsible for the couch lock kind of buzz you speak of. I dont prefer sativa's but I have had them that are full blown amber and they are much more like an indica in buzz comparison. The plant IMO will never be all cloudy at one time, rather a mixture of clear, cloudy and amber with time being the major factor in what ratio they are at. If you like a more upbeat head high then chop it when there clear/ cloudy. If you desire couch lock then chop when they are more cloudy/amber. It really is up to you and what you like and honestly only hands on experience will show you. Hope this helps  BB


thats what I grow by ... Just harvested my first blueberry 420 and couldn't be happier ... Waited for 75% clouded tricombs chopoed ... Hung it for 4 days in darkness and a constant RH of 63 and a temp range of 70-75... Now they are inason hard and just about cured... Here's a pic


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## simchaleh (Aug 26, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> thats what I grow by ... Just harvested my first blueberry 420 and couldn't be happier ... Waited for 75% clouded tricombs chopoed ... Hung it for 4 days in darkness and a constant RH of 63 and a temp range of 70-75... Now they are inason hard and just about cured... Here's a pic


u must mean theyre just about dried, not cured right?
doesnt it take like 2 months to cure properly?


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Aug 26, 2015)

simchaleh said:


> u must mean theyre just about dried, not cured right?
> doesnt it take like 2 months to cure properly?


Yeah they are being cured right now...I wrote that wrong they are all dried and in jars ... Waiting for that earthy smell to diminish... It's almost there


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## Crazytrain420 (Sep 1, 2015)

Thanks man!


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## tazz&indy (Sep 2, 2015)

simchaleh said:


> hi there everyone.
> i ive been lookn around alot to try figure out this whole harvesting time thing.
> ive read all those posts about clear triches=cleaer high, and cloudy mix, amber heavy. and that amber is just degrading THC.
> but that doesnt make sense to me, since we have so many different genetics and options. wouldnt the best be to carefully choose ur genetics, and then grow the bud to its full potential ripeness.?
> ...


I for one could only speak clearly about the strains that I personally grow and harvest first hand.


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## hellmutt bones (Sep 2, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Yeah they are being cured right now...I wrote that wrong they are all dried and in jars ... Waiting for that earthy smell to diminish... It's almost there


Earthy?. Bro your doing it wrong its supposed to smell like dead skunks..


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 2, 2015)

hellmutt bones said:


> Earthy?. Bro your doing it wrong its supposed to smell like dead skunks..


Yeah I didnt trim enough of the outer greener leafs off and it wound up having a tint of an earthy smell ... Smoked nice though ... My second plant of the same species ( autofem blueberry) was harvested 2 days ago ... These are some pics of the tricombs from the actual buds .. I trimmed this plant the correct way and I used my pocket microscope 100x to obtain the photos .. I also threw a photo of the actual bud itself before the final manicure ... Tell me what you guys think


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## hellmutt bones (Sep 3, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Yeah I didnt trim enough of the outer greener leafs off and it wound up having a tint of an earthy smell ... Smoked nice though ... My second plant of the same species ( autofem blueberry) was harvested 2 days ago ... These are some pics of the tricombs from the actual buds .. I trimmed this plant the correct way and I used my pocket microscope 100x to obtain the photos .. I also threw a photo of the actual bud itself before the final manicure ... Tell me what you guys think


Might of cut her just a week or two too early but it still should be some good smoke just get deep and trim most of the sugar leafs


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 3, 2015)

hellmutt bones said:


> Might of cut her just a week or two too early but it still should be some good smoke just get deep and trim most of the sugar leafs


Are these buds trimmed enough ... My second grow ... First grow I left a lot of the greener leaves on the buds .. Here's the buds of from the tricombs pics .. Tell me if it looks at least "okay"


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## hellmutt bones (Sep 3, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Are these buds trimmed enough ... My second grow ... First grow I left a lot of the greener leaves on the buds .. Here's the buds of from the tricombs pics .. Tell me if it looks at least "okay"


Thats what im talking about! Mouth watering!.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 3, 2015)

hellmutt bones said:


> Thats what im talking about! Mouth watering!.


But I definetly do agree I should of waited another week or so ... But so far I have dried them for 3 days in a pinewood cabinet temps from 70-76 and now I have trimmed the "hang" stems off so I just have buds ... Now there're in a pasta strainer in a closet in my basement ..my basement has a dehumidifier so I put them in my linen closet lol ... Just for the next few hours ... I'll take them out in the morning ... See if they have dried enough .. If so its off to the jars ... They should be considering they were already dried on the outter most part of the bud ... Just want to get some of that wetness out from the center bringing some more scent wih it .. How does that sound to you? Sorry if I'm bothering you im new grower and want to get it right the second time lol since I have improved this grow substantially from my first grow I want to keep on the right track and your advice helps


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## hellmutt bones (Sep 4, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> But I definetly do agree I should of waited another week or so ... But so far I have dried them for 3 days in a pinewood cabinet temps from 70-76 and now I have trimmed the "hang" stems off so I just have buds ... Now there're in a pasta strainer in a closet in my basement ..my basement has a dehumidifier so I put them in my linen closet lol ... Just for the next few hours ... I'll take them out in the morning ... See if they have dried enough .. If so its off to the jars ... They should be considering they were already dried on the outter most part of the bud ... Just want to get some of that wetness out from the center bringing some more scent wih it .. How does that sound to you? Sorry if I'm bothering you im new grower and want to get it right the second time lol since I have improved this grow substantially from my first grow I want to keep on the right track and your advice helps


Yes the drying is a bit of trial and error when your starting. Ur doing everything accordingly.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 4, 2015)

hellmutt bones said:


> Yes the drying is a bit of trial and error when your starting. Ur doing everything accordingly.


Ok awesome and the smell should start to become more prevelant .. Cause right now it still has a "planty" smell


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## hellmutt bones (Sep 4, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Ok awesome and the smell should start to become more prevelant .. Cause right now it still has a "planty" smell


Yes check out more forums on here theres a wealth of knowledge from seasoned growers. They know there stuff. Good luck and happy harvest!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 4, 2015)

hellmutt bones said:


> Yes check out more forums on here theres a wealth of knowledge from seasoned growers. They know there stuff. Good luck and happy harvest!


Thanks for your help!


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## laubs (Sep 7, 2015)

Wow, lot of great info! Buds look great also. Found the clear / cloudy works good.I find that the best. Been experimenting a little bit with different strains to see what happens


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 7, 2015)

laubs said:


> Wow, lot of great info! Buds look great also. Found the clear / cloudy works good.I find that the best. Been experimenting a little bit with different strains to see what happens


Thanks man.. The next strain is chemdog and light of jah hybrid here's a newer picture ... How's she look too you


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## laubs (Sep 7, 2015)

Looks sweet!! Trying get some pics of the widow I just took down. Next up grapefruit and psyco crack. The latter was a freebie


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 7, 2015)

laubs said:


> Looks sweet!! Trying get some pics of the widow I just took down. Next up grapefruit and psyco crack. The latter was a freebie


Thanks man... That's awesome dude good luck with those and sometimes you need to be recourseful ... Im using plastic buckets with bricks and a stick in the middle to support the bigger colas on the plant from the picture


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## laubs (Sep 7, 2015)

Buckets work great!! Use sticks all the time, have had to use string alot


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 7, 2015)

laubs said:


> Buckets work great!! Use sticks all the time, have had to use string alot


lol I like zip ties ... And if Its too far for Zipties I just make a tight chain of Zipties lol


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## laubs (Sep 7, 2015)

Got to be creative!!


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## bubblenut (Sep 8, 2015)

Day 65 of 70 day auto strains Think Different and Blue Mammoth: 
    Unfortunately i dont have a loupe or magnifiyer of any kind, just my camera with an 8x zoom. Going to havest according to breeders timeframe. So they will go to day 70 then 5days water and 48hours darkness then chop. I think they would be ready now but im gonna wait....


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## laubs (Sep 8, 2015)

Stunning!!! Looks like your there check your local grow store, got a 100x lens lighted for 18 bucks. Nice job!!!


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## bubblenut (Sep 8, 2015)

laubs said:


> Stunning!!! Looks like your there check your local grow store, got a 100x lens lighted for 18 bucks. Nice job!!!


Yeah i have taken a cheeky sample to speed dry today and test with the wife when she gets back from work bloody sticky.... and my local grow store is about 475klms away. Lol. Just gonna wing this crop. I have just popped 2 trans siberian auto, 2 auto pounder with cheese and 1 fast n vast. All going RDWC this time around!!!


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## laubs (Sep 9, 2015)

Sounds good! Keep the updates coming. Nice to hear others are doing!


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## laubs (Sep 9, 2015)

Also got some grapefruit and bubblegum going, will update later!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 9, 2015)

bubblenut said:


> Day 65 of 70 day auto strains Think Different and Blue Mammoth:
> View attachment 3496191 View attachment 3496192 View attachment 3496195 View attachment 3496198 Unfortunately i dont have a loupe or magnifiyer of any kind, just my camera with an 8x zoom. Going to havest according to breeders timeframe. So they will go to day 70 then 5days water and 48hours darkness then chop. I think they would be ready now but im gonna wait....


I grow a lot of auto fems but switched over to photos due to yield issues... You should wait another week I can see white hairs still sticking straight up .. With autos and a lot of other strains white hairs are indication of plants not reaching full potential yet ... Here's my Chem dog hybrid with light of jah.. Last photo is tricomb growth on the photoperiod used a electric pocket microscope 150x .. What you guys think


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## hellmutt bones (Sep 9, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> I grow a lot of auto fems but switched over to photos due to yield issues... You should wait another week I can see white hairs still sticking straight up .. With autos and a lot of other strains white hairs are indication of plants not reaching full potential yet ... Here's my Chem dog hybrid with light of jah.. Last photo is tricomb growth on the photoperiod used a electric pocket microscope 150x .. What you guys think


Yes the white hairs your refering to are pistols and they must turn red or brown and recede. I can guestemate another 2-3 weeks but still keep an eye on your trics if they start ambering then its a week window where you should chop. usually I like about 10-30% amber depending if its a haze or hybrids, usually indica turns amber quick so dont let it get more than 10% amber but then again i also like with full cloudy trics but most if not all the trics should be cloudy.


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## laubs (Sep 9, 2015)

Sounds right, good advice . there looking good!!!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 9, 2015)

hellmutt bones said:


> Yes the white hairs your refering to are pistols and they must turn red or brown and recede. I can guestemate another 2-3 weeks but still keep an eye on your trics if they start ambering then its a week window where you should chop. usually I like about 10-30% amber depending if its a haze or hybrids, usually indica turns amber quick so dont let it get more than 10% amber but then again i also like with full cloudy trics but most if not all the trics should be cloudy.


How's my plant looking ?


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## laubs (Sep 9, 2015)

Very nice!! May need a bit longer keep an eye in the trichs. Cloudy a bit of Amber but very little amber


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## hellmutt bones (Sep 9, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> How's my plant looking ?


Look good next time try not to let ur plant strech too much. Also try and keep the buds on the top ends and remove the lower buds but only when in veg never remove buds after 2 weeks in flower. Also get the light about 20-30 inches from the tops that would give u a more compact plant with less spacing and also more buds.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 9, 2015)

Th


hellmutt bones said:


> Look good next time try not to let ur plant strech too much. Also try and keep the buds on the top ends and remove the lower buds but only when in veg never remove buds after 2 weeks in flower. Also get the light about 20-30 inches from the tops that would give u a more compact plant with less spacing and also more buds.


good information thank you


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## laubs (Sep 9, 2015)

Nice to know about bud removal, been doing it later than that thanks


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 9, 2015)

hellmutt bones said:


> Look good next time try not to let ur plant strech too much. Also try and keep the buds on the top ends and remove the lower buds but only when in veg never remove buds after 2 weeks in flower. Also get the light about 20-30 inches from the tops that would give u a more compact plant with less spacing and also more buds.


The main stem snapped fully off 1.5 months into veg so the longer horizontal branches started to recieve more light and then started to grow vertical... That's why it looks so stretchy ... But it was in severe shock so i had to rehab her ... That's why she has four tops lol


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## laubs (Sep 9, 2015)

Nice recovery doc.lol


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 9, 2015)

laubs said:


> Nice recovery doc.lol


Lol .. Thanks laubs... At first I thought all hope was lost and turns out cannabis is extremely resilisant to certain "injuries" like fully snapped main stems...but... The plant must reset its clock so you may have a fully vegged plant but it's like starting from day one interns if bud growth.. For example it was 45 days into veg and then the injury occurred so the next day started day one for ... If that makes sense lol ...that was my expirence... Many other people may have had a different expirence with broken main stems but it just seemed to top the plant 4 times and massive bud growth in the center of the plant where the main stem would of been


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## laubs (Sep 9, 2015)

Oh ya, many injurys along the way, found electrical tape to work well lol found them to be very resilient.


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## bubblenut (Sep 10, 2015)

hellmutt bones said:


> Look good next time try not to let ur plant strech too much. Also try and keep the buds on the top ends and remove the lower buds but only when in veg never remove buds after 2 weeks in flower. Also get the light about 20-30 inches from the tops that would give u a more compact plant with less spacing and also more buds.


That would explain the foxtailing on my think different correct??? Light has only been about 12 inches max from main cola whilst my rather shorter blue mammoth has dense arse nuggs and only half the height!!!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 10, 2015)

laubs said:


> Oh ya, many injurys along the way, found electrical tape to work well lol found them to be very resilient.


Yeah electrical tape works wonders ... My other job involves me to do a lot of splinting on people and when my plant has an accident ( usually caused by my dumb ass) I splint my plant lol... But of course I use Zipties and a kebab skewer ... Use the kebab skewer to straighten out the break to the original position before it broke then just Ziptie above and below the break works really well ... My friend actually breaks the branches into the way he wants the plant to grow and secures the break eventually the break heals and he does this throughout the entire veg stage ... He's had plants that he "Trained" to grow In a spiral and once flowering starts he stops the training and the tops eventually grow vertically from the center ... It's sounds weird but it works and is super space efficient ... Especially if you have a vertical space deficiency in your grow space... Kinda looks like this


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## hellmutt bones (Sep 10, 2015)

bubblenut said:


> That would explain the foxtailing on my think different correct??? Light has only been about 12 inches max from main cola whilst my rather shorter blue mammoth has dense arse nuggs and only half the height!!!


Yes it could be..fox tail happens with high heat. 
But yeah that could b.


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## laubs (Sep 10, 2015)

Kebob sticks, never thought of that.your friends idea is really cool. Seen simaliar methods but not like that. Had the foxtail problem didn't realize from heat good info!! Always learning something new lol


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 11, 2015)

laubs said:


> Kebob sticks, never thought of that.your friends idea is really cool. Seen simaliar methods but not like that. Had the foxtail problem didn't realize from heat good info!! Always learning something new lol





bubblenut said:


> That would explain the foxtailing on my think different correct??? Light has only been about 12 inches max from main cola whilst my rather shorter blue mammoth has dense arse nuggs and only half the height!!!


yep... Happened with my first autofems .. Blueberry420 .. One had a taller phenotype so it was taller than my other one and the cola was made up of 4-5 big nugs but I could still see the main stem .. My other which wasn't As close to the light had a nice conical cola and was packed nice and tight i then realized the reason why the taller of the two was foxtailing...so I raised the lights and instead of shining directly down I tilted the light fixture so it spreads the light over a greater area and decreases "hotspots" ... And if you grow in a closet put a fan/ small air circulator at the back of the closet behind the plants and pointed towards the closet door/ main opening it will push that heat out of the closet ( just point the fan on an upwards angle ... Heat rises...lol) .. And you can also TRY a light spreader that attaches right to the light bulb ( assuming your using a digital ballast fixture I.e HPS and or metal halide it will help to decrease heat but he reason why I say try is because it might also increase heat ... It works well with rooms with good ventilation and large space


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## laubs (Sep 11, 2015)

I found tilting the light as you said helps alot as well as the fan


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 11, 2015)

laubs said:


> I found tilting the light as you said helps alot as well as the fan


You tried it? I learned to do that with autos .. And also to wait until there is absolutely no whites hairs ( 1-2 are okay) to harvest and really let them cure other wise you will get an earthy smell to them 1-2 weeks in glass jars should be fine


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## laubs (Sep 11, 2015)

Kind of did it by accident needed some headroom worked great!! Helps to rotate them.I thought jars were for canning only lol


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 11, 2015)

laubs said:


> Kind of did it by accident needed some headroom worked great!! Helps to rotate them.I thought jars were for canning only lol


I cut the plant hang the whole thing upside down and trim... Then I'll let it hang in a seperate DARK closet with a RH of 60-65 %... I'll let it dry out until the outter most buds are dry (usually 4-10 days depending on conditins) then I'll cut the plant up into buds and place them in mason jars for 1-2 weeks opening the jars every day for 5 min to "burp" them... It replaces the stagnant humidified air with fresher more oxygenated air ... That's how I fully cure... And yes This process will also allow you to store your weed... sorry I didn't mean to be misleading in my last post


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## laubs (Sep 12, 2015)

No confu


Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> I cut the plant hang the whole thing upside down and trim... Then I'll let it hang in a seperate DARK closet with a RH of 60-65 %... I'll let it dry out until the outter most buds are dry (usually 4-10 days depending on conditins) then I'll cut the plant up into buds and place them in mason jars for 1-2 weeks opening the jars every day for 5 min to "burp" them... It replaces the stagnant humidified air with fresher more oxygenated air ... That's how I fully cure... And yes This process will also allow you to store your weed... sorry I didn't mean to be misleading in my last post


No confusion! Didn't know about the dark room going to try it! Have a white widow ready for chopping. See how that works


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 12, 2015)

laubs said:


> No confu
> 
> No confusion! Didn't know about the dark room going to try it! Have a white widow ready for chopping. See how that works


Awesome yeah your plant needs dark to start the drying phase but everybody has their own way... Make sure there are absolutely no white hairs(1-2 are okay) like I said ... I used to just grow autofems but the yield on them are no contest to photoperiods so I just grow photos now ... And it REALLY helps to have a pocket microscope with a little light in it ... They are 20 bucks and its the ultimate way to find out if your plant is ready Auto fems or photos ...I use calyx color ( little hairs) as a second resort for timing my harvest only because some strains can actually have ALL white hairs and I have seen it... Tricomb color is your best bet ... Never failed me yet lol


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## laubs (Sep 12, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Awesome yeah your plant needs dark to start the drying phase but everybody has their own way... Make sure there are absolutely no white hairs(1-2 are okay) like I said ... I used to just grow autofems but the yield on them are no contest to photoperiods so I just grow photos now ... And it REALLY helps to have a pocket microscope with a little light in it ... They are 20 bucks and its the ultimate way to find out if your plant is ready Auto fems or photos ...I use calyx color ( little hairs) as a second resort for timing my harvest only because some strains can actually have ALL white hairs and I have seen it... Tricomb color is your best bet ... Never failed me yet lol


Going to try the dark room! Found one of those mag. glasses. Works great! Great info always helps getting others input.


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## laubs (Sep 12, 2015)

laubs said:


> Going to try the dark room! Found one of those mag. glasses. Works great! Great info always helps getting others input.


Also staying with photos too. Not to sure about those autos


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 12, 2015)

laubs said:


> Also staying with photos too. Not to sure about those autos


Oh I was under ther impression all you grew was autos for some reason lol but it works the same with both


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## New Age United (Sep 12, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Awesome yeah your plant needs dark to start the drying phase but everybody has their own way... Make sure there are absolutely no white hairs(1-2 are okay) like I said ... I used to just grow autofems but the yield on them are no contest to photoperiods so I just grow photos now ... And it REALLY helps to have a pocket microscope with a little light in it ... They are 20 bucks and its the ultimate way to find out if your plant is ready Auto fems or photos ...I use calyx color ( little hairs) as a second resort for timing my harvest only because some strains can actually have ALL white hairs and I have seen it... Tricomb color is your best bet ... Never failed me yet lol


Yes quite a few strains have all white hairs, especially ruderalis, you have to wait till all the hairs curl in, then check it with a loupe. I go by all cloudy white and at the first sight of amber chop. But on here I've heard many different opinions and I hear amber can help with anxiety.


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## laubs (Sep 12, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Oh I was under ther impression all you grew was autos for some reason lol but it works the same with both


yeah wasn't real clear, trying first one not exactly sure what I'm doing about 20 inches tall under M H now,going to flower under hps any info lol


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## laubs (Sep 12, 2015)

laubs said:


> yeah wasn't real clear, trying first one not exactly sure what I'm doing about 20 inches tall under M H now,going to flower under hps any info lol[/QUOTE


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## laubs (Sep 12, 2015)

I've been staying with cloudy trichs with good success


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 12, 2015)

New Age United said:


> Yes quite a few strains have all white hairs, especially ruderalis, you have to wait till all the hairs curl in, then check it with a loupe. I go by all cloudy white and at the first sight of amber chop. But on here I've heard many different opinions and I hear amber can help with anxiety.


yes Amber is the break down of THC which is CBN... CBN is the substance that causes a lazy stoned feeling some call it "couch lock" you need to find a nice balance between Amber trics and cloudy ... Personally I wait for 50% Amber i like that narcotic high which helps whith anxiety by the way ... But all strains are different like my Chemdog is still growing white calyxes and its starting to Amber on some trics but it's just the start so Ill wait for the hairs to turn orangey/ red at that point I'll probably have more than 50% more like 65%


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 12, 2015)

laubs said:


> yeah wasn't real clear, trying first one not exactly sure what I'm doing about 20 inches tall under M H now,going to flower under hps any info lol


Ok sounds like a good start keep the light at least 20 inches from the top of the plant ...and keep temps low to help reduce foxtailing when you switch over to HPS ... Your buds will be more fuller and grow further down on the stem ( some as thick as soda cans) and what's your medium.. Like soil or hydro... And here's an updated photo of a smaller cola only chemdog


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 13, 2015)

The last time I grew weed Nixon was in office. They got about 6" tall, fell over and died. This year is the first time I have tried since and I must say 3 of my 4 girls look like sugar frosted flakes. Been following this thread as I don't know what I'm doing when it comes to harvest, cure etc. Girls grown outdoors in containers, southern exposure. Have not played with light or anything, just letting nature take its course. Don't know days flowering, didn't count. Only know what I see. Ordered 60x led scope will be here next week. Now to be sure cloudy trichomes are what I'm looking for? I'm a rec user and just enjoy the buzz. I always go for the Higher THC%.
By the way the girls are 2 Purple Kush feminized, 1 Grape Ape clone (given to me), and 1 Ice Wreck. The Ice Wreck and Purple Kush from seed. Also what about being in the dark for a couple of days? Before or after harvest? Stop feeding 2 weeks before harvest? Flush?


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## laubs (Sep 13, 2015)

Looks like your on the right track! Strains sound good also. Start flush last 2 wks. Mag glass is good, look for cloudy trichs.can cut when ready and hang in the dark for a few days, low humidity. When slightly crispy on the outside put in jars and allow to sweat out usually a day or so. Will be damp again dry till crispy, back in jars and burp daily(take lid off) they should cure nicely. Has worked good for me. Takes a little practice. Be sure to not let them stay damp in jars. Good luck, hope you get some great herb. Stay in touch!!!


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 13, 2015)

laubs said:


> Looks like your on the right track! Strains sound good also. Start flush last 2 wks. Mag glass is good, look for cloudy trichs.can cut when ready and hang in the dark for a few days, low humidity. When slightly crispy on the outside put in jars and allow to sweat out usually a day or so. Will be damp again dry till crispy, back in jars and burp daily(take lid off) they should cure nicely. Has worked good for me. Takes a little practice. Be sure to not let them stay damp in jars. Good luck, hope you get some great herb. Stay in touch!!!


Thanks, appreciate the info. You'll probably see me alot as I go thru this process.


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 13, 2015)

Mag glass? Is that the name of the product? Where can I get it? Are there alternatives? What does flushing do?


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## laubs (Sep 13, 2015)

Magnifying glass available at your local grow store about 20 bucks.flushing will wash out any nutrients and salt build up. Make for a tastier product!!


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 13, 2015)

laubs said:


> Magnifying glass available at your local grow store about 20 bucks.flushing will wash out any nutrients and salt build up. Make for a tastier product!!


Have 60X loupe coming next week. In the meantime I took some pics a minute ago using my phone cam thru a 4X jewlers loupe. Grape Ape not so clear but will try for better pic later. Purple Kush come out great. What do you flush with? Just water? Seems I read something about sugar being involved?


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## bubblenut (Sep 13, 2015)

There is a cattarpillar eating your purple kush and spider mites webbing up top....
Last pic


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 13, 2015)

bubblenut said:


> There is a cattarpillar eating your purple kush and spider mites webbing up top....
> Last pic


Thanks, you're right I see them how do you deal with mites? I can pic catapillars off


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## bubblenut (Sep 13, 2015)

Neem oil spray solution. Get it from any gardening store. The mites are a huge issue though, and this close to harvest a drench of neem oil may not help much. Im no pro with that shit, i live in australia and hardly have any mite issues apart from benificial mites in my garden.


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## bubblenut (Sep 13, 2015)

Get some (lots of lady beetles in there)!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 13, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> Thanks, you're right I see them how do you deal with mites? I can pic catapillars off


Your plants look good...the catapillars and mites are common for outdoor grows but read this thread from the beginning ... You will learn everything you need to know ... Mostly indoor information but most of it can be applied to outdoor grows... But you did a nice job with the timing of the seasons and the flowering of your plants


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## laubs (Sep 13, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Your plants look good...the catapillars and mites are common for outdoor grows but read this thread from the beginning ... You will learn everything you need to know ... Mostly indoor information but most of it can be applied to outdoor grows... But you did a nice job with the timing of the seasons and the flowering of your plants


Try a product called ultimate wash a npk product can be used as a weekly preventive measures or when infested won't hurt plants all natural


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 13, 2015)

laubs said:


> Try a product called ultimate wash a npk product can be used as a weekly preventive measures or when infested won't hurt plants all natural


where can I find this. Common in garden supply stores?


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 13, 2015)

bubblenut said:


> There is a cattarpillar eating your purple kush and spider mites webbing up top....
> Last pic


Catapillar dead now.


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 13, 2015)

Found the Ultimate wash at a nearby garden supply. Thanks for the tip. I hope this doesn't effect harvest so close now.


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## laubs (Sep 13, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> Catapillar dead now.


Found it at local store that caters to growers one less pest to deal with lol


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## laubs (Sep 13, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> Found the Ultimate wash at a nearby garden supply. Thanks for the tip. I hope this doesn't effect harvest so close now.


No its a ionized water of some sort, won't hurt anything your dsfe


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## laubs (Sep 13, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Your plants look good...the catapillars and mites are common for outdoor grows but read this thread from the beginning ... You will learn everything you need to know ... Mostly indoor information but most of it can be applied to outdoor grows... But you did a nice job with the timing of the seasons and the flowering of your plants


Been using soil called pro mix organic sea based compost great stuff 6.88 a bag


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 13, 2015)

laubs said:


> Try a product called ultimate wash a npk product can be used as a weekly preventive measures or when infested won't hurt plants all natural


All fertilizers have NPK ... It's nitrogen potassium and phosphate which All plants need to veg preflower and flower ( and of course changes in lighting and time) nitrogen gives the leaves a nice green color ... And I'm pretty sure Potassium and phosphate help with root growth and stem growth... So I'm guessing it's a solution that has nutrients in it that kill mites... And also different levels of NPK are needed when using nutrients to help with leaves and buds ... But I never heard of mite control with nutes in it ... But on the other hand I've only have 2 out door grows which was simultaneously and I had no problems other then timing ( but it all worked out )


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 13, 2015)

laubs said:


> No its a ionized water of some sort, won't hurt anything your dsfe[/


 OH I SEE what it is ok ... Forget my last post ... It's good to know that about nutes though and to start off all nutes with 1/4 the strength ... Here's a properly nuted chemdog in full flower .. This is a smaller cola .. There are 5 because the main stem snapped 45 days into veg and all horizontal growth grew vertically


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## laubs (Sep 13, 2015)

Npk was the company name, npk industries. On the flush, try clearex, fox farms sledge hammer also good


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 13, 2015)

laubs said:


> Npk was the company name, npk industries. On the flush, try clearex, fox farms sledge hammer also good


Yeah I looked it up im sorry .. I Jumped to conclusions ... But it's one of the reasons why I like to grow inside among other things .. And I know you can still get mites even indoors .. It's just easier to control


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## laubs (Sep 13, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Yeah I looked it up im sorry .. I Jumped to conclusions ... But it's one of the reasons why I like to grow inside among other things .. And I know you can still get mites even indoors .. It's just easier to control


I'm inside, mites a f ing problem, summer bad with humidity, that's where that wash works good!!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 13, 2015)

laubs said:


> I'm inside, mites a f ing problem, summer bad with humidity, that's where that wash works good!!


Yeah my climate is never above 45-50 so it's nice I've never had mites, although I do get gnats but sticky strips works wonders ... How do my plants look ... I posted a couple pics 3 posts above tell me what you think


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 13, 2015)

laubs said:


> Been using soil called pro mix organic sea based compost great stuff 6.88 a bag


I used Fox Farm Ocean Forest soil


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 13, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> OH I SEE what it is ok ... Forget my last post ... It's good to know that about nutes though and to start off all nutes with 1/4 the strength ... Here's a properly nuted chemdog in full flower .. This is a smaller cola .. There are 5 because the main stem snapped 45 days into veg and all horizontal growth grew vertically


Been using Dyna Gro Grow for veg and Dyna Gro Blossom for flower. I'm happy with results


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 13, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Yeah my climate is never above 45-50 so it's nice I've never had mites, although I do get gnats but sticky strips works wonders ... How do my plants look ... I posted a couple pics 3 posts above tell me what you think


The Chemdog is looking real good.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 14, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> The Chemdog is looking real good.


Thanks dude.. It's my first photoperiod ... Autofems just didn't have the yield so I tried chemdog and the yield is 10 fold


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 14, 2015)

Okay, went to store they don't have Ultimate wash. Had Power and Mega wash from NPK but no Ultimate. Talked to clerk about issues with girls, our kind of garden supply store, and he recommended "Green Cleaner" from central coast. Gonna treat the girls with that starting today. It's organic concentrate and can be used the day of Harvest(so it says) Anyway I'll let you know what I think of this stuff. If anyone has used this stuff let me know what you thought. New pics of girls to follow soon.......without the catapiller!


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 14, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Thanks dude.. It's my first photoperiod ... Autofems just didn't have the yield so I tried chemdog and the yield is 10 fold


My first real grow and I'm a novice newbie(that's bad) so I'm not into phenoms, auto, etc. yet anyway. My Purple Kush girls are from feminized seed. The Ice Wreck is from regular seed. And the Grape Ape was a clone that was given to me.


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 14, 2015)

new pics of the girls taken 5 min ago........no catapillars!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 14, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> new pics of the girls taken 5 min ago........no catapillars!


They are looking very healthy my friend ... Keep up the good work and never stop educating yourself ... The more you grow the more you know


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## laubs (Sep 14, 2015)

Ahhhh very nice Mr Midnightwolf. Looks big and tasty. Grown on!!!


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 14, 2015)

I'm hopin' it's as good as it looks. Now goin thru the old mother hen syndrom. When to harvest(scope here tomorrow or next day) gotta do right on cure etc., why Is Ice wreck late flowering and at 10 week flower is she gonna make it? You know the nightmares of a first time grower. This is a great place to kinda vent or whatever.


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## laubs (Sep 14, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> I'm hopin' it's as good as it looks. Now goin thru the old mother hen syndrom. When to harvest(scope here tomorrow or next day) gotta do right on cure etc., why Is Ice wreck late flowering and at 10 week flower is she gonna make it? You know the nightmares of a first time grower. This is a great place to kinda vent or whatever.


It can be a pain in the ass, this forum is great! Lot of good info. Been at it a number of years, always learning, it gets better and more fun. Grow on!!


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## laubs (Sep 14, 2015)

laubs said:


> It can be a pain in the ass, this forum is great! Lot of good info. Been at it a number of years, always learning, it gets better and more fun. Grow on!!


Flowering times seem to vary . I've found even same flower time plant very a bit. Be patient!!!


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## laubs (Sep 14, 2015)

laubs said:


> Flowering times seem to vary . I've found even same flower time plant very a bit. Be patient!!!


Plants vary


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 14, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> I'm hopin' it's as good as it looks. Now goin thru the old mother hen syndrom. When to harvest(scope here tomorrow or next day) gotta do right on cure etc., why Is Ice wreck late flowering and at 10 week flower is she gonna make it? You know the nightmares of a first time grower. This is a great place to kinda vent or whatever.


Let her take her course .. All the flowering times and time tables are all just generalilzations ..some can take longer to get to harvest than others ... Even though it's the same exact strain in the same exact conditions ... it's called phenotypes.. Same reason some humans are shorter and some taller .... She looks fine just keep doing what your doing it seems to be working just fine


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 15, 2015)

Thanks for positive feed back. Ice Wreck was germinated same time as Purple Kush. Ice Wreck showing explosion of flowers now. Amazing, almost overnight. I am big on having nature take her course. I'm sure nature is a better gardener than I. Am staying the course. Too bad we couldn't get together for a swap meet.


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## laubs (Sep 15, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> Thanks for positive feed back. Ice Wreck was germinated same time as Purple Kush. Ice Wreck showing explosion of flowers now. Amazing, almost overnight. I am big on having nature take her course. I'm sure nature is a better gardener than I. Am staying the course. Too bad we couldn't get together for a swap meet.


That would be sweet!!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 15, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> Thanks for positive feed back. Ice Wreck was germinated same time as Purple Kush. Ice Wreck showing explosion of flowers now. Amazing, almost overnight. I am big on having nature take her course. I'm sure nature is a better gardener than I. Am staying the course. Too bad we couldn't get together for a swap meet.





laubs said:


> That would be sweet!!


That would be awesome... Nature IS the best horticulturist ... No matter how many mistakes ( other than damaging roots and not watering) you can almost always nurse a plant back to full health ... It may not be that perfect looking cola that is as thick and big as a 24 oz beer ... But it will still produce buds that are potent depending on Strain and time of harvest ... So many uses for cannabis... It's amazing


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 15, 2015)

I see they do a BBQ in Cali. Found that on the forums here. I'm in Southern Colo. Anybody close?


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## laubs (Sep 15, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> I see they do a BBQ in Cali. Found that on the forums here. I'm in Southern Colo. Anybody close?


I'm in MN. Can always road trip!!!


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 15, 2015)

LOL. Dude, you do the road trip, I'll put you up


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## laubs (Sep 15, 2015)

Will let you know, love Colo


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 15, 2015)

laubs said:


> Will let you know, love Colo


Lmao what just happened here...


----------



## hellmutt bones (Sep 15, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Lmao what just happened here...


I think he meant I love Culo..wich means i love ass in spanish.


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## laubs (Sep 15, 2015)

hellmutt bones said:


> I think he meant I love Culo..wich means i love ass in spanish.


Now that's funny! Lmao. So there's no confusion that's Colorado!!!


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 15, 2015)

laubs said:


> Now that's funny! Lmao. So there's no confusion that's Colorado!!!


Wow. That conversation kinda took a zinger. Gonna have to go smoke a fat one to keep up.


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## laubs (Sep 15, 2015)

Indeed, got some grapefruit to try.I find Mr. Bones quite funny as well as knoweagable, keep it up my friend!!!


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## laubs (Sep 15, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> LOL. Dude, you do the road trip, I'll put you up


May take you up on that invite, have family there. Will let you know.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 15, 2015)

Hahaha this is great ... Started this thread off for my blueberry autofems ... It ended in marriage


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## laubs (Sep 15, 2015)

How sweet it is!! Great banter!!!


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## 2014LML (Sep 16, 2015)

I would use a loupe, but I live in the sticks and with my job I'll be leaving tomorrow so I don't have means of getting one. I just want someone's opinion on what these trichs look like? Clear and Milky, or still clear?


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## laubs (Sep 16, 2015)

Little hard to tell how long into flowering? They look good!!


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## 2014LML (Sep 16, 2015)

laubs said:


> Little hard to tell how long into flowering? They look good!!


8 weeks...10 week strain but they're not doing the best. With my job I'm gone a week at a time, sometimes longer. I've pulled off two little pieces of bud rot this morning & the temps have been in the 50s the past few nights and 75-80 during the day. I just don't want to be gone and come back to a whole lot of disappointment lol


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## laubs (Sep 16, 2015)

Time line looks good. I've had some take up to 12 wks. Tempature sounds good, warm days cool nights.the bud rot sometimes to much humidity, but doesn't sound like that. How much water? If you can find a arts and craft store they sometimes have small magnifying glasses that can get you through. What strain do you have?


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## 2014LML (Sep 16, 2015)

laubs said:


> Time line looks good. I've had some take up to 12 wks. Tempature sounds good, warm days cool nights.the bud rot sometimes to much humidity, but doesn't sound like that. How much water? If you can find a arts and craft store they sometimes have small magnifying glasses that can get you through. What strain do you have?


humidity ranges daily, 50-90%. Nope, the only thing we got in hickville is Ace hardware, food lion & mcdonalds/burger king lmao


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 16, 2015)

2014LML said:


> I would use a loupe, but I live in the sticks and with my job I'll be leaving tomorrow so I don't have means of getting one. I just want someone's opinion on what these trichs look like? Clear and Milky, or still clear?


Still clear... White hairs that stick straight up are another indication that it's not ready and I can tell by expirence even if there is orange hairs the tricombs could still all be clear ... Your almost there probably another week or two


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## laubs (Sep 16, 2015)

I agree with Dr Kick, humidity sounds OK, not sure about bud rot are you indoors or outdoors?


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## 2014LML (Sep 16, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Still clear... White hairs that stick straight up are another indication that it's not ready and I can tell by expirence even if there is orange hairs the tricombs could still all be clear ... Your almost there probably another week or two


That's what I figured, but wanted a few other opinions. I stuck it inside, under 8 t5's on timers for now. @laubs it's an outside plant.


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## laubs (Sep 16, 2015)

That should work 12 on 12 off good luck, keep me posted! Grow on!


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 16, 2015)

I can't tell. Maybe some in here can, but I would need more mag. I ordered a 40x led loupe from ebay for $4.85. Had good reviews too


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## laubs (Sep 16, 2015)

40 will work, if you can look for 100x loupe with a light works great !!!


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## bubblenut (Sep 16, 2015)

2014LML said:


> I would use a loupe, but I live in the sticks and with my job I'll be leaving tomorrow so I don't have means of getting one. I just want someone's opinion on what these trichs look like? Clear and Milky, or still clear?


They look mostly cloudy with a few amber not many clear. Chop when you want as far as i can see.....


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## laubs (Sep 18, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Still clear... White hairs that stick straight up are another indication that it's not ready and I can tell by expirence even if there is orange hairs the tricombs could still all be clear ... Your almost there probably another week or two


Suddenly having top buds getting dry and somewhat crispy not sure if its heat, don't see any more issues. Need help lol


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 18, 2015)

laubs said:


> Suddenly having top buds getting dry and somewhat crispy not sure if its heat, don't see any more issues. Need help lol


I'm not sure what could be the problem maybe RH to low? But for my first photo most all the tricombs are cloudy some clear and some even has a tinge of Amber but... There is still a few clusters of white hairs ... Is that normal for a photoperiod and should I wait for all hard to turn orange or cut now ... Believe the strain to be chemdog hybrid with light of jah


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## laubs (Sep 18, 2015)

It sounds like your good to go !!!


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## 2014LML (Sep 18, 2015)

bubblenut said:


> They look mostly cloudy with a few amber not many clear. Chop when you want as far as i can see.....


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## laubs (Sep 18, 2015)

Looks good!! Enjoy


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 18, 2015)

2014LML said:


>


That's exactly the stage my plant is at now here's a pic


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## 2014LML (Sep 18, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> That's exactly the stage my plant is at now here's a pic


Some of my colas still have longer white pistils. I think i'll just let it go for another week, maybe two. All according


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 18, 2015)

2014LML said:


> Some of my colas still have longer white pistils. I think i'll just let it go for another week, maybe two. All according


Yeah mine too ... Except there is 5 of them ... When she was vegging she was getting too big so I tried LST and the main stem snapped leaving the center of the plant exposed to more light so the horizontal growth turned into tops ... I'm going to wait another week.. I want the top calyxes ( hairs) to start to curl up and get a tinge of orange then I'll chop.. I could chop now but I want this to be the best potency I can get obviously so in a week or so I'll post the chop/trim and buds


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## laubs (Sep 18, 2015)

Sweet looking bud!!!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 18, 2015)

laubs said:


> Sweet looking bud!!!


Whose plant you talking about lol


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 19, 2015)

2014LML said:


> Some of my colas still have longer white pistils. I think i'll just let it go for another week, maybe two. All according


I same took a little sample from my plant and let it dry until the outter parts were dry out it in a grinder and boy was that a pleasant surprise ... I think I'm gonna chop tomorrow ...the tricombs are starting to turn Amber under a 100x microscope with a light ... And that quick dry sameple got me stoned so after I cure it properly I'm expecting an amazing harvest


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## Leandrobcool (Sep 20, 2015)

This my 2 ww auto i was wondering r booth plants ready for flushing?
They r in the end of 12 week


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 20, 2015)

2014LML said:


> Some of my colas still have longer white pistils. I think i'll just let it go for another week, maybe two. All according


Im chopoing today guys... The tricombs are 75% cloudy 20% clear and 5 % Amber ( just a tinge) ... I'll post pictures as I go but here's the before the chop... Last picture before she gets dismantled


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 20, 2015)

Fianlly got loupe. 60X. Trichomes are still mostly clear. 2 more weeks? Can't show trichomes that I see through loupe. Pics are from this morning, about 5 min ago and are of Grape Ape and Purple Kush. Also curious about harvest. After chop, place in dark room to dry, before cure?


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 20, 2015)

Remember I'm a newbie and don't know my ass from a hole in the ground when it comes to this. RIU has gotten me this far so I'm depending on your advice to get me the rest of the way. No pressure...lol


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 20, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> Fianlly got loupe. 60X. Trichomes are still mostly clear. 2 more weeks? Can't show trichomes that I see through loupe. Pics are from this morning, about 5 min ago and are of Grape Ape and Purple Kush. Also curious about harvest. After chop, place in dark room to dry, before cure?


Yeah dark room with a small air circulator or fan ... Relitive humidity should be between 60-65% and temps around 70 f .. Do this for 4-10 days ( depending on how fast outer buds dry) Then cut into buds and place in an airtight jar about an inch below the rim letting them " burp" AKA opening the jar for five min everyday .. This replaces the humidified air with fresh new air give the buds a stir and this should be done for at least a week but some properly cured buds can be cured for a year or two! Hope this helps!


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## laubs (Sep 20, 2015)

Trying this method now, 2 days in. I take leaves to be trimmed!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 20, 2015)

laubs said:


> Trying this method now, 2 days in. I take leaves to be trimmed!


Chopped ... Here's a few pics ... Let me know what you guys think...the tricombs are a bit clear in that pic but there's 75% cloudy and 3% Amber...22% clear would be my best guess


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 21, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Yeah dark room with a small air circulator or fan ... Relitive humidity should be between 60-65% and temps around 70 f .. Do this for 4-10 days ( depending on how fast outer buds dry) Then cut into buds and place in an airtight jar about an inch below the rim letting them " burp" AKA opening the jar for five min everyday .. This replaces the humidified air with fresh new air give the buds a stir and this should be done for at least a week but some properly cured buds can be cured for a year or two! Hope this helps![/QUOTE





Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Chopped ... Here's a few pics ... Let me know what you guys think...the tricombs are a bit clear in that pic but there's 75% cloudy and 3% Amber...22% clear would be my best guess


Girls look good to me. How'd you get the pic of the trichomes? I suppose I could try holding loupe to camara. I'll try.


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 21, 2015)

I'm concerned about flushing. If I screw up the flushing, not get flushing done, will it effect smoke? How long to flush before harvest?


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 21, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> I'm concerned about flushing. If I screw up the flushing, not get flushing done, will it effect smoke? How long to flush before harvest?


To be honest I only gave nutes to my girls just to inhibit flowering and about 3 weeks after they flower hen I stop all nutes and just water ... But flushing should be done a week before and the way I do it is just pour copious until the water flows from he bottom about 3 liters


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## ShabbaDanks (Sep 21, 2015)

I don't feel so bad about harvesting when I did now based on this document. I did wait another week after this pic though because too many of you were on my a$$ about them not being done.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 21, 2015)

ShabbaDanks said:


> I don't feel so bad about harvesting when I did now based on this document. I did wait another week after this pic though because too many of you were on my a$$ about them not being done.


Don't let other people tell you when to chop that's all subjective... Good advice though is to wait for at least 50% cloudy tricombs the rest is up too you ... If you like a speedy more clear high go with a ratio involving more clear tricombs ... If you like a more of "stoned" narcotic high wait for more Amber ( which is an indication of degrading THC aka CBN)... The cloudy tricombs is the THC at the hight of its potency so mostly cloudy is a good base then choose the type of high you like. More Amber means more " I'm not moving off this couch" .. More clear means "let's go build us something awesome"


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## ShabbaDanks (Sep 21, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Don't let other people tell you when to chop that's all subjective... Good advice though is to wait for at least 50% cloudy tricombs the rest is up too you ... If you like a speedy more clear high go with a ratio involving more clear tricombs ... If you like a more of "stoned" narcotic high wait for more Amber ( which is an indication of degrading THC aka CBN)... The cloudy tricombs is the THC at the hight of its potency so mostly cloudy is a good base then choose the type of high you like. More Amber means more " I'm not moving off this couch" .. More clear means "let's go build us something awesome"


Cool... great post!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 21, 2015)

ShabbaDanks said:


> Cool... great post!


No problem!


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## Leandrobcool (Sep 22, 2015)

Can someone plz help me with my post?
Thank u


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## laubs (Sep 22, 2015)

Leandrobcool said:


> This my 2 ww auto i was wondering r booth plants ready for flushing?
> They r in the end of 12 week


They look good, if there at 12 weeks probably ready to go, flush good, let water flow through pots.check trichs for cloudiness


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## laubs (Sep 22, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> To be honest I only gave nutes to my girls just to inhibit flowering and about 3 weeks after they flower hen I stop all nutes and just water ... But flushing should be done a week before and the way I do it is just pour copious until the water flows from he bottom about 3 liters


Interesting on the nuts, have been curious about the amount to use. So many products. May cut back on use.


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## laubs (Sep 22, 2015)

Nutes


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 22, 2015)

laubs said:


> Nutes


I use nutes just to inhibit bud site growth and once I start to see flowers I stop... But if you do this you need to pay attention to the color of the leaves for example if your fan leaves are starting to turn limegreen add a little bit of nitrogen to the soil to keep your leaves greener but like I said I only give nutes when the plant seems like they need it otherwise I just use nutes to inhibit flowering and inhibit bud sites


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 22, 2015)

laubs said:


> Nutes


Oh


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## laubs (Sep 22, 2015)

Great thanks, been over doing it. So much hype about what to use. Going to scale back and try your method, ses to make sense. Thanks again!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 22, 2015)

laubs said:


> Great thanks, been over doing it. So much hype about what to use. Going to scale back and try your method, ses to make sense. Thanks again!


Here's the result of that method ... Just finished snipping buds ( took me 2 hours) ... This was my first photoperiod and the smell is 20x more powerful than my auto fems and about 10x more yield ... Bud is still a bit moist in the middle which will start to come to the outer dryer parts of the buds increasing smell and potency... That's why its a little dark ... Tell me what you think.. Does it look normal lol


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## laubs (Sep 22, 2015)

Looking good!! They look like some damn good bud!! Got some white widow hanging now. Starting to look much like that. Trying the dark room technique. Hope mine turns out like yours lol!


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 22, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Here's the result of that method ... Just finished snipping buds ( took me 2 hours) ... This was my first photoperiod and the smell is 20x more powerful than my auto fems and about 10x more yield ... Bud is still a bit moist in the middle which will start to come to the outer dryer parts of the buds increasing smell and potency... That's why its a little dark ... Tell me what you think.. Does it look normal lol


Buds look awesome. When I was trimming the girls, I knocked a nug off so I've got that in a jar, curing. Let it sit out in the garage in the dark for to days before putting in the jar. Parent plant still in ground, trichomes are still mostly clear. I figured waste not want not.


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 22, 2015)

laubs said:


> Looking good!! They look like some damn good bud!! Got some white widow hanging now. Starting to look much like that. Trying the dark room technique. Hope mine turns out like yours lol!


They were out of White Widow when I bought seeds. Got the Purple Kush instead. Let me know how your widow turns out. Gonna grow some next year.


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## Leandrobcool (Sep 22, 2015)

Thanks


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 22, 2015)

Leandrobcool said:


> This my 2 ww auto i was wondering r booth plants ready for flushing?
> They r in the end of 12 week


They look good, right path but you still have a lot of white hairs at the top that are standing straight up ... Wait till these curl up and turn orange/red ... Stop all nutes once white hairs start to curl and flush with 3-5 liters of water


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## Leandrobcool (Sep 23, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> They look good, right path but you still have a lot of white hairs at the top that are standing straight up ... Wait till these curl up and turn orange/red ... Stop all nutes once white hairs start to curl and flush with 3-5 liters of water


thats what i thought, the last 2 waterings i gave them nutes and the top hairs r more orange but still not curl in, maybe just add some water until the flushing?or u still advice to continue with nutes?
Normally i flush arround 8L(for pots of 4L)is it too much?in the first flushing with FF and the second with plain water


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 23, 2015)

Leandrobcool said:


> thats what i thought, the last 2 waterings i gave them nutes and the top hairs r more orange but still not curl in, maybe just add some water until the flushing?or u still advice to continue with nutes?
> Normally i flush arround 8L(for pots of 4L)is it too much?in the first flushing with FF and the second with plain water


To be honest I only give nutes when the plant is in veg stage ... Then once I start to see pre flowers and Bud sites I stop all nutes and just give them water .... this works extremely well for me .. But you need to keep a close eye on he leavesif they start to turn lighter green give a little nitrogen ( although it is normal for fan leaves to turn yellow and die towards harvest time) make sure the leaves you check are the ones protruding from the buds


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## ShabbaDanks (Sep 23, 2015)

How much does temperature effect your trichome production? I got one plant that lets just say... is not so frosty. She was furthest away from my cooling system. I wonder will it still smoke good with a nice cure?...Hmmmm


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## laubs (Sep 24, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> To be honest I only give nutes when the plant is in veg stage ... Then once I start to see pre flowers and Bud sites I stop all nutes and just give them water .... this works extremely well for me .. But you need to keep a close eye on he leavesif they start to turn lighter green give a little nitrogen ( although it is normal for fan leaves to turn yellow and die towards harvest time) make sure the leaves you check are the ones protruding from the buds


Any good sites for beans?


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## daloudpack (Sep 24, 2015)

laubs said:


> Any good sites for beans?


midweeksong.com use promo code roll20 for 20% off and u get to pick ur freebees


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 25, 2015)

laubs said:


> Any good sites for beans?


I like amsterdamseeds.com ... If any dont sprout send the unsprouted ones back and they will replace them plus 20 free seeds


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## laubs (Sep 25, 2015)

Thanks have used bonza but problems logging in


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 25, 2015)

laubs said:


> Thanks have used bonza but problems logging in


Chopped 5 days ago it's officially been one full day in the jar ( buds were a little to moist the first try around) and that skunky smell is slowly comming around... I get that brief wiff when I burp it ...in about a weeks time at this rate it will be a really nice scent ... And it's a really citrusy ... Here's a picture of a bud to get an idea ... Tell me what you think ... Be honest lol


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 25, 2015)

laubs said:


> Any good sites for beans?


I used Crop King. Very easy site to navigate. My first purchase but the results I am seeing is looking very nice. Don't know about quality of smoke yet.


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 25, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Chopped 5 days ago it's officially been one full day in the jar ( buds were a little to moist the first try around) and that skunky smell is slowly comming around... I get that brief wiff when I burp it ...in about a weeks time at this rate it will be a really nice scent ... And it's a really citrusy ... Here's a picture of a bud to get an idea ... Tell me what you think ... Be honest lol


Sweet looking buds. I've got a large nug that fell off one of my Purple Kush when I was trimming. Curing in a jar. Nose is of chlorophyll with slight hints of skunk butt.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 25, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> Sweet looking buds. I've got a large nug that fell off one of my Purple Kush when I was trimming. Curing in a jar. Nose is of chlorophyll with slight hints of skunk butt.


Yup that's where I'm at now ... As The clorophyll breaks down will that skunk smell come out more


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## laubs (Sep 25, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> I used Crop King. Very easy site to navigate. My first purchase but the results I am seeing is looking very nice. Don't know about quality of smoke yet.


Thanks, that helps


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 26, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Yup that's where I'm at now ... As The clorophyll breaks down will that skunk smell come out more


That's what I understand. As the chlorophyll fades, the skunk invades.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 27, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> That's what I understand. As the chlorophyll fades, the skunk invades.


Awesome yeah it's slowly morphing into a nice Danky skunk smell... Still not there yet but getting there


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 27, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Awesome yeah it's slowly morphing into a nice Danky skunk smell... Still not there yet but getting there


Same here. Slowly morphing. Maybe if I stop watching the jar?


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## laubs (Sep 27, 2015)

I have the same problem, might have started with that paint thing! Lol


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 27, 2015)

laubs said:


> I have the same problem, might have started with that paint thing! Lol


Lmao yeah we're all right.. Every time I burp it the smell changes... The whole jar has the beginning of the skunk smell... But each individual bud smells like cinnamon on the outside and the inside smells like someone killed a skunk with grapefruits... I'm waiting for all that to come out ... But jeeze chlorophyll takes a while to break down


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## laubs (Sep 27, 2015)

Got some widows at the same stage gets better each day,but damn can't it hurry up!!


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## laubs (Sep 27, 2015)

Sweet citrus like smell!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 27, 2015)

laubs said:


> Got some widows at the same stage gets better each day,but damn can't it hurry up!!


Haha I know right everything that is associated with horticulture takes soo damn long ... But yeah loving the smell can't wait until it's fully cured


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## laubs (Sep 27, 2015)

True, perfection takes time!!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 27, 2015)

laubs said:


> True, perfection takes time!!


Almost guys ... How's it looking


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## laubs (Sep 27, 2015)

Wow! Looks good!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 27, 2015)

laubs said:


> Wow! Looks good!


Thanks ... Man I wish you could try it when it done... You have been with me and my first photoperiod the whole time from veg to bud


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 28, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Almost guys ... How's it looking


Looks real good. I'm holding back a little based on a friend of mine and his opinion. I want to chop, but he advises holding off for another week or two. He's grown before and I'm like a little kid on Christmas eve. What strain are your buds? My Ice Wreck started flowering about 2 weeks ago and now is going mental. I started feeding the Ice Wreck again. Flushing the other 3 plants as they are the ones that are close to harvest.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 28, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> Looks real good. I'm holding back a little based on a friend of mine and his opinion. I want to chop, but he advises holding off for another week or two. He's grown before and I'm like a little kid on Christmas eve. What strain are your buds? My Ice Wreck started flowering about 2 weeks ago and now is going mental. I started feeding the Ice Wreck again. Flushing the other 3 plants as they are the ones that are close to harvest.


ThAnks man ... I beleive the strain is chemdog .... I know its a afgahn broadleaf species but not 1000% sure on strain


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## MidnightWolf (Sep 28, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> ThAnks man ... I beleive the strain is chemdog .... I know its a afgahn broadleaf species but not 1000% sure on strain


I wouldn't know an Afgan broad leaf or not. Just learning. Chemdog is a pretty good smoke, I've had it before.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 28, 2015)

MidnightWolf said:


> I wouldn't know an Afgan broad leaf or not. Just learning. Chemdog is a pretty good smoke, I've had it before.


Yeah it just takes a bit longer to cure ... It's deffintetly on its way to that skunky grapefruit smell but it still has more to go


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## Saving Money (Sep 28, 2015)

What is a good temp and RH for drying. Controlling with a fan. Temp went from 19.5 to 21.5 F and RH Is sitting around 69% and climbing. Rain tomorrow, more humiidity. Fan has been running all day. Fan leafs come off tomorrow will be 48 hrs. Do not want to dry to fast.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 28, 2015)

Saving Money said:


> What is a good temp and RH for drying. Controlling with a fan. Temp went from 19.5 to 21.5 F and RH Is sitting around 69 and climbing. Rain tomorrow, more humiidity. Fan has been running all day. Fan leafs come off tomorrow will be 48 hrs. Do not want to dry to fast.


Your RH is a bit high... I cure 70-75 degrees Fahrenheit and RH45-50


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## Saving Money (Sep 29, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Your RH is a bit high... I cure 70-75 degrees Fahrenheit and RH45-50


OK thanks. You say that is a cure. I'm drying right now. And isn't a good cure 55 in the jar. I might have to turn my Ac on.


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## Leandrobcool (Sep 29, 2015)

I m gonna flush them today, but the lower buds r ridiculously small what I can do for them, harvest first the top half of the plant and give a bit more time for them develop?
And what type of nutrient deficiency I have with that leaf?


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 29, 2015)

Leandrobcool said:


> I m gonna flush them today, but the lower buds r ridiculously small what I can do for them, harvest first the top half of the plant and give a bit more time for them develop?
> And what type of nutrient deficiency I have with that leaf?


None that's your plants way of telling you it's ready ... Fan leaves turn yellow and die as he plant puts all the energy into making buds ... It's on a great course don't mess with it too much and I would deffinetly flush today... Flush with copious amounts of water until it starts to flow from the bottom of the pot ( about 3-4 liters)


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 29, 2015)

Saving Money said:


> OK thanks. You say that is a cure. I'm drying right now. And isn't a good cure 55 in the jar. I might have to turn my Ac on.


For drying I cut the whole plant from bottom hang upside down for 3 days in a pine cabinet with a air circulator ( not a fan) temp of 75 and a RH of 50-55 then cut all fan leaves and smaller leaves( they will wrap around your buds when they are ready to be trimmed) then after you trim let hang another day then break down the whole plant into sections and let that dry a day then chop into buds and when the stems at the base of the buds snap clean off its jar time ... You can get away with a bending stem too but the cure might take longer ... That's what did iff you look up a few posts you will see my buds


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## Leandrobcool (Sep 29, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> None that's your plants way of telling you it's ready ... Fan leaves turn yellow and die as he plant puts all the energy into making buds ... It's on a great course don't mess with it too much and I would deffinetly flush today... Flush with copious amounts of water until it starts to flow from the bottom of the pot ( about 3-4 liters)


Thanks for the tip, and what about harvesting in two times is it worthy?
Because the lower buds they r really under develop..


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 29, 2015)

Leandrobcool said:


> Thanks for the tip, and what about harvesting in two times is it worthy?
> Because the lower buds they r really under develop..


Then give it more time ... Are you checking tricombs? ... That's the truest way to tell if your plant is ready to chop of not... And I personally chop all at once instead of stages because the plant then sends energy and sugars that would normally be used for bud production to the "injured" site ... Buts it's all subjective everyone has their own opinion


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## Saving Money (Sep 29, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> For drying I cut the whole plant from bottom hang upside down for 3 days in a pine cabinet with a air circulator ( not a fan) temp of 75 and a RH of 50-55 then cut all fan leaves and smaller leaves( they will wrap around your buds when they are ready to be trimmed) then after you trim let hang another day then break down the whole plant into sections and let that dry a day then chop into buds and when the stems at the base of the buds snap clean off its jar time ... You can get away with a bending stem too but the cure might take longer ... That's what did iff you look up a few posts you will see my buds


Thank you Sir


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## Saving Money (Sep 29, 2015)

Saving Money said:


> Thank you Sir


Thank you. I am on course for separating the plant. It's for science for me. Others to follow. It was a 2 'er. Stunted it with bug spray early on. Took this one all cloudy. Hoping it works out. Saw trics only on the sugar leaves.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 29, 2015)

Saving Money said:


> Thank you. I am on course for separating the plant. It's for science for me. Others to follow. It was a 2 'er. Stunted it with bug spray early on. Took this one all cloudy. Hoping it works out. Saw trics only on the sugar leaves.


You need a mag glass to get a good idea on tricombs and if they are on the outer sugar leaves then they should be on the inner buds aswell... But it's all about trial an error


----------



## Saving Money (Sep 29, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> You need a mag glass to get a good idea on tricombs and if they are on the outer sugar leaves then they should be on the inner buds aswell... But it's all about trial an error


Have a loupe 30x. Checked today. Not ready yet. Do you recommend cloudy or mix amber. Pure tangerine powerplant. Smelled awesome about two weeks ago. Then lost that tangerine smell. Does that matter.


----------



## Leandrobcool (Sep 29, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> Then give it more time ... Are you checking tricombs? ... That's the truest way to tell if your plant is ready to chop of not... And I personally chop all at once instead of stages because the plant then sends energy and sugars that would normally be used for bud production to the "injured" site ... Buts it's all subjective everyone has their own opinion


The tricombs r mostly cloudy with some amber, I flushed it now so i ll give it 7 to 10 days..
Then harvest time


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 29, 2015)

Saving Money said:


> Have a loupe 30x. Checked today. Not ready yet. Do you recommend cloudy or mix amber. Pure tangerine powerplant. Smelled awesome about two weeks ago. Then lost that tangerine smell. Does that matter.


I like 25% Amber 70 % cloudy and 5% clear ... Those are my golden numbers lol... And it also depends on strain pics would help and maybe a stronger mag glass... I use an electric microscope with a light that looks like a "v" when opened ... It's 100x mag and it's inly 20 bucks ... Hydrofarm makes them and it is the best way to check tricombs while still on the plant ... Other than that you would have to chop a sample and use a 2 million dollar micronmicroscope lmao


----------



## Saving Money (Sep 30, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> I like 25% Amber 70 % cloudy and 5% clear ... Those are my golden numbers lol... And it also depends on strain pics would help and maybe a stronger mag glass... I use an electric microscope with a light that looks like a "v" when opened ... It's 100x mag and it's inly 20 bucks ... Hydrofarm makes them and it is the best way to check tricombs while still on the plant ... Other than that you would have to chop a sample and use a 2 million dollar micronmicroscope lmao


Thanks for the info Sir.. will let you know. Going to get an air circulator.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Sep 30, 2015)

Saving Money said:


> Thanks for the info Sir.. will let you know. Going to get an air circulator.


No worries ... Good luck and happy growing!


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Oct 1, 2015)

Saving Money said:


> Thanks for the info Sir.. will let you know. Going to get an air circulator.


Here's my buds under 100x mag ... Tell me what you guys think ... The skunk smell is really prevalent and the buds are turning a lighter color green


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## Saving Money (Oct 2, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> View attachment 3511959 View attachment 3511958 View attachment 3511957
> Here's my buds under 100x mag ... Tell me what you guys think ... The skunk smell is really prevalent and the buds are turning a lighter color green


Wow thanks man. Awesome pics.


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## Saving Money (Oct 2, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> View attachment 3511959 View attachment 3511958 View attachment 3511957
> Here's my buds under 100x mag ... Tell me what you guys think ... The skunk smell is really prevalent and the buds are turning a lighter color green


Are these tricomes in bubble look or buds through the glass mag.. awesome pic.


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## Saving Money (Oct 2, 2015)

Saving Money said:


> Are these tricomes in bubble look or buds through the glass mag.. awesome pic.


Buds I see now. Thanks again.


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## Saving Money (Oct 2, 2015)

Saving Money said:


> Buds I see now. Thanks again.


What would you be looking for here when ripe.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Oct 2, 2015)

Saving Money said:


> What would you be looking for here when ripe.


You see the last pic with the cloudy tricombs ... You want that with some Amber and a bit clear but I used a 100x microscope which is the best way to tell when ripe ... But those pics are ripe bud ( maybe a bit later in ripeness but I like Amber lol


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## Saving Money (Oct 2, 2015)

Kickflipfrontblunt said:


> You see the last pic with the cloudy tricombs ... You want that with some Amber and a bit clear but I used a 100x microscope which is the best way to tell when ripe ... But those pics are ripe bud ( maybe a bit later in ripeness but I like Amber lol


Thank you. Need to get this I hope. Thank you.


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## Kickflipfrontblunt (Oct 2, 2015)

Saving Money said:


> Thank you. Need to get this I hope. Thank you.


Everyone speculates about all this so I figured I'd just show you guys since I have an active cure and the right tools ... Hope it helps ... Expirenced growers tell me if you think this bud looks good or kinda sparse with the tricombs I can't really tell


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## DeeCos (Oct 23, 2015)

Hi folks,

First time grower here. Northern Light feminized, day 47 since I switched to 12/12. Have a couple of snaps of various sections of one plant - in order of top to bottom of plant. Seed instructions said 55 days for flowering but I'm not really sure. Should I be getting ready to harvest? Would appreciate any tips or comments any of you may have. Cheers.


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## wns99 (Oct 30, 2015)

Hey guys! How can i know my plant is done if i dont have a microscope??


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## GreenStick85 (Nov 2, 2015)

Leandrobcool said:


> I m gonna flush them today, but the lower buds r ridiculously small what I can do for them, harvest first the top half of the plant and give a bit more time for them develop?
> And what type of nutrient deficiency I have with that leaf?


You're growing with CFL's so when buds mature on top, they just focus that on the top and not worry about small stuff. Granted it may help you with some edibles but nothing much. I have heard good and bad about CFL's that the spectrum they give out is ok but you're talking about taking it to a very simple grow. The buds will probably be ok but far cry from fire that the spectrum metal-halides give off. I don't wanna step on your toes here, looks like they did great as a small grow on a personal level.
Hopefully you'll make more improvements from here on out. I mostly like outdoor grow. Free light and all that jazz.


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## wns99 (Nov 2, 2015)

GreenStick85 said:


> You're growing with CFL's so when buds mature on top, they just focus that on the top and not worry about small stuff. Granted it may help you with some edibles but nothing much. I have heard good and bad about CFL's that the spectrum they give out is ok but you're talking about taking it to a very simple grow. The buds will probably be ok but far cry from fire that the spectrum metal-halides give off. I don't wanna step on your toes here, looks like they did great as a small grow on a personal level.
> Hopefully you'll make more improvements from here on out. I mostly like outdoor grow. Free light and all that jazz.


Hey man! Since your talking about cfls not giving enough light for the lower plant, i am using a 400W HPS and i have the same problem my plant is growing buds from up but very tiny ones from down! What do you suggest i do?? Plz help


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## GreenStick85 (Nov 2, 2015)

wns99 said:


> Hey man! Since your talking about cfls not giving enough light for the lower plant, i am using a 400W HPS and i have the same problem my plant is growing buds from up but very tiny ones from down! What do you suggest i do?? Plz help


Well I would do a couple things, if you can find a white drop cloth or something reflective, you could get some better exposure from the light above. I've thought of simple aluminum foil shiny side up and glue that to a cardboard box panel. This may be good if you're on a budget. Set up a few of those and see how that works. If you got an emergency blanket that can just go on the floor and set pots on it. Otherwise they have reflective sheeting that is almost like and emergency blanket but more durable and has sort of a faceted surface for more refraction. One thing that you want to be careful though is how much light is being reflected. Keep an eye out on it, plastic melts and whatnot but my buddy has used a big mirror in the past but I kept that out because it's bulky material. Give yourself a range of options


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## mid-western outdoor (Nov 4, 2015)

Looking at these trichomes of my crop I'm probably gonna push them a about a week longer or so keeping a close eye on them what do some of the pros in here think? Are they good or should I push them longer? Also I took this photo with my iphone you can buy easy to use lenses for your phone and one lense is the macro it works very well and only cost about 20 bucks at the most and takes amazing pictures


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## cowboyferg (Nov 11, 2015)

k0ijn said:


> How do you attribute the fact that it won't stay lit to nitrogen? The same with question with regards to your phosphorous statement.
> If that would even be possible (I have never seen or heard of it before) you must have overfed your plants with extreme doses to attain such high nutrient levels in the calyxes that what you describe would even be possible.
> 
> Tbh I think your weed was just too wet/damp to stay lit. The part about phosphorous being the spark could just as easily have been a stem bursting from the heat.


the onlything I could remotely agree on with the flushing myth is maybe... maybe straight ph'd water on your last feeding I personally feed right up to the big chop


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## tazz&indy (Nov 24, 2015)

If you have problems with the lower buds, you can slightly alter your method as I do. I bend and tie the plant in a arch figure, light can then reach everywhere and the buds are bigger.
Something to think about.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## zed52 (Dec 7, 2015)

hippy132 said:


> I heard it also and it makes more sense to start counting when they show their sex, 7 -10 days after light switch... IMHO, based on strain info


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## laubs (Dec 25, 2015)

FrostyTheBudMan said:


> That was my plan, I had read elsewhere that they can change quickly, but good to confirm that directly from someone that has the knowledge. Thanks so much!


Like your input,thoughts on trimming fan leaves at flowering?


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## Megalomando (Dec 30, 2015)

How does this look? it's week 8 of bloom, Cherry Pie with one week of nutes ahead and one week of water till harvest. 

Must have some fert issues, the largest fan leaves are turning red, small fans are still looking just fine.

The top leaves are curling inwards (Canoeing?) but the temp inside the 4X4 area is upper 70's to a high of 82.

Cree Cob panels, three of them at 200W each 2700K, 3000K and 3500K.

Thoughts?

Thanks


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## Megalomando (Jan 1, 2016)

I'm surprised there's no replies.

Regardless, Happy New Year, everyone


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## k0ijn (Jan 1, 2016)

Megalomando said:


> How does this look? it's week 8 of bloom, Cherry Pie with one week of nutes ahead and one week of water till harvest.
> 
> Must have some fert issues, the largest fan leaves are turning red, small fans are still looking just fine.
> 
> ...


The trichomes look fine in that picture, they look cloudy.
If you see this across most of the calyces you can safely harvest, assuming you have checked for all the other signs & criteria of peak harvest.

With regards to the leaves, that could be loads of different issues. If you are close to harvest and your calyces look fine I wouldn't worry about it much though.

The one thing I would advise against though is cutting off nutrients in the last week. I have written a lot about _pre-harvest flushing, _and it always saddens me to see people cut off their plants food in the most critical part of flowering.


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## Budtasticmike (Jan 4, 2016)

KINGEBK1 said:


> thanks this help me


Three other signs or stages in trichone growth are 1 bulbous. Where the thrich is visible but small. Almost flat. And clear yes. The second # 2 is bulbous half stock. Now the trich is not flat but rising up. Filling up with THC! The third and final #3 stage! Bulbous FULL StOCK? Now the trich has reached its full potential! The stock is longer. Not flat. Not half . but full! Of THC. The color will be clear. Them milky. When individual trich reaches 20-25% amber. Its DONE! I think any amber is simply degenerating THC. Or cbd. CBN? I love THC! Any feedback on this I would appreciate


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## Budtasticmike (Jan 4, 2016)

Budtasticmike said:


> Three other signs or stages in trichone growth are 1 bulbous. Where the thrich is visible but small. Almost flat. And clear yes. The second # 2 is bulbous half stock. Now the trich is not flat but rising up. Filling up with THC! The third and final #3 stage! Bulbous FULL StOCK? Now the trich has reached its full potential! The stock is longer. Not flat. Not half . but full! Of THC. The color will be clear. Them milky. When individual trich reaches 20-25% amber. Its DONE! I think any amber is simply degenerating THC. Or cbd. CBN? I love THC! Any feedback on this I would appreciate


I am at week ten of flower on my second go round of bubba kush. Trichs are All fullstock. And milky! Been flushing 4 days. Should I go dark last 3 days 72 hours?


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## warren kirk (Jan 8, 2016)

k0ijn said:


> Harvesting your weed based on trichomes is probably the easiest way for most growers to harvest as close to peak harvest as possible.
> 
> 
> The difficulty in the method comes with how to determine the state of the trichomes and what each state means.
> ...


U the man,best info I've read so far.


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## warren kirk (Jan 8, 2016)

mid-western outdoor said:


> Looking at these trichomes of my crop I'm probably gonna push them a about a week longer or so keeping a close eye on them what do some of the pros in here think? Are they good or should I push them longer? Also I took this photo with my iphone you can buy easy to use lenses for your phone and one lense is the macro it works very well and only cost about 20 bucks at the most and takes amazing pictures


I see lot of clear, I'm I wrong?


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## warren kirk (Jan 8, 2016)

Megalomando said:


> How does this look? it's week 8 of bloom, Cherry Pie with one week of nutes ahead and one week of water till harvest.
> 
> Must have some fert issues, the largest fan leaves are turning red, small fans are still looking just fine.
> 
> ...


They look cloudy.


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## warren kirk (Jan 8, 2016)

Budtasticmike said:


> I am at week ten of flower on my second go round of bubba kush. Trichs are All fullstock. And milky! Been flushing 4 days. Should I go dark last 3 days 72 hours?


They say if u do that, Tricones get more resin, what I read, never tried.


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## tazz&indy (Jan 9, 2016)

A very good detailed answer


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## William Shatter (Jan 17, 2016)

Kinda lost tract of my days lol but it's either 41 or 47. I'm not harvesting yet. I just finally got some decent pics so I wanted to share lol. I love the purple trichs


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## Alfonsi (Jan 19, 2016)

Need help... Haven't been able to get my hands on a loop so I can't check my trichs properly... I'm 11 weeks and 2 days out of the 12 week flowering time estimate my strain has


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## Alfonsi (Jan 26, 2016)

Do you think my plant is ready based on these trichs

She's been on 12/12 for 12 weeks (the recommended time) and is a dominant sativa from the haze family


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## tazz&indy (Jan 27, 2016)

Hi, first, it does not matter how many days since seed or flowering etc, the only thing that matters is how the plant is doing, from the pictures I can't give a proper answer. You should definitely get a loupe or magnifier, if you don't, look at the pistils, wait until they turn amber, most should recede into the buds, now this is a good indication that she should be ready but not as good a indication as a loupe.


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## Alfonsi (Jan 27, 2016)

tazz&indy said:


> Hi, first, it does not matter how many days since seed or flowering etc, the only thing that matters is how the plant is doing, from the pictures I can't give a proper answer. You should definitely get a loupe or magnifier, if you don't, look at the pistils, wait until they turn amber, most should recede into the buds, now this is a good indication that she should be ready but not as good a indication as a loupe.


Here's a few pics using a loupe I'm getting mixed feed back on cutting now and waiting a couple weeks... Either ones fine for me as I'm in no rush and hope to get the most out of my little plant... Here are the few things I've notice
Her odour has changed from fruity to skunked
Her calyx look swollen
Her trichs are cloudy but no Amber yet
Her pistils are Amber but she's got a few new pistils popping up
I'm trying to avoid the couch lock feel and I've read that amber trichs don't effect the feeling as much as the genetics do so I'm stumped and chopping now or waiting for the Amber trichs to start showing themselves


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## Jeanpaulsastre (Jan 31, 2016)

Is it rdy yet guys ? I don't have a microscope :/


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## tazz&indy (Feb 5, 2016)

Jeanpaulsastre said:


> Is it rdy yet guys ? I don't have a microscope :/


Without a micro there is no way to know what stage she's at, but the pistils seem amber in colour and most seem receded into the buds so my guess would be to cut it.


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## Takster (Feb 7, 2016)

This is my first post after being a lurker here during my entire first grow (some sage advice taken for sure though) anyway I stuck an extremely cheap chinese ebay macro lens on a samsung phone and bypassed getting off my ass to buy anything decent for my viewing pleasure. I think I'm getting close now...


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## Jeanpaulsastre (Feb 8, 2016)

tazz&indy said:


> Without a micro there is no way to know what stage she's at, but the pistils seem amber in colour and most seem receded into the buds so my guess would be to cut it.


yeah i cut them just in time, I think the receded pistils were the most significant clue thank you


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## Jeanpaulsastre (Feb 8, 2016)

Takster said:


> This is my first post after being a lurker here during my entire first grow (some sage advice taken for sure though) anyway I stuck an extremely cheap chinese ebay macro lens on a samsung phone and bypassed getting off my ass to buy anything decent for my viewing pleasure. I think I'm getting close now...


Too many clear trichomes getting close though!


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## Madagascar (Feb 9, 2016)

Looking cloudy to me should i wait?


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## STEAKFINGERS (Feb 12, 2016)

I was told that if you have more Amber that your product will create a couch lock high even though thc is degrading, and that the milky would be optimal but more Amber makes it seem stronger bc your almost a retarded potato on the couch.
I'm guessing it's all on the person?


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## pdgenoa (Feb 17, 2016)

Much appreciated. This is the only place I've seen that specifies where on the plant you should check the trichomes. 

I'm getting very close to harvest and was wondering if you could go into a little more detail on starting at the top and letting the bottom flower a little longer? 

Is there maybe a link that goes into more detail on this? I've looked around but haven't seen anything but I could just be bad at googling! 

I'm a first time grower and this is where I'm at currently. These are from top, middle and bottom in order.
.


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## GreenThumby (Mar 24, 2016)

Great guide. Super simple. much appreciated lad!


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## GreenThumby (Mar 24, 2016)

pdgenoa said:


> Much appreciated. This is the only place I've seen that specifies where on the plant you should check the trichomes.
> 
> I'm getting very close to harvest and was wondering if you could go into a little more detail on starting at the top and letting the bottom flower a little longer?
> 
> ...


I'm not an expert but have read a lot. It looks too soon bud. Give it another 5 days.


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## 024deeweed420 (Mar 24, 2016)

First post, first grow, can I get some advise as to how close I am to harvest? Got microscope pics of trichomes. Outdoor grow large pot, single plant , had a bit of sea sol as ferilizer twice monthly then a few doses of canna 13-14 since flowering started. Starting to get a few brown pistils unknown strain but was from nice weed. Gave it last canna dose today. Been dosing half recommended canna as to make sure I don't burn. Was grown in potting mix, soil, horse shit, chicken shit water crystals mix.


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## WestDenverPioneer (Mar 25, 2016)

024deeweed420 said:


> can I get some advise as to how close I am to harvest?


Close. I see clear and milky but no amber. Give it 2-3 days and post again.


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## 024deeweed420 (Mar 25, 2016)

WestDenverPioneer said:


> Close. I see clear and milky but no amber. Give it 2-3 days and post again.


Cheers! Shall do


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## harris hawk (Mar 25, 2016)

024deeweed420 said:


> View attachment 3640720 View attachment 3640723 View attachment 3640724 View attachment 3640725 First post, first grow, can I get some advise as to how close I am to harvest? Got microscope pics of trichomes. Outdoor grow large pot, single plant , had a bit of sea sol as ferilizer twice monthly then a few doses of canna 13-14 since flowering started. Starting to get a few brown pistils unknown strain but was from nice weed. Gave it last canna dose today. Been dosing half recommended canna as to make sure I don't burn. Was grown in potting mix, soil, horse shit, chicken shit water crystals mix.


at least a week more if you want all cloudy/milky tic's (my be 2 weeks) depends if you want any brow/amber tic's color - if so time will be longer may be 3 weeks _Good pictures !!


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## 024deeweed420 (Mar 25, 2016)

harris hawk said:


> at least a week more if you want all cloudy/milky tic's (my be 2 weeks) depends if you want any brow/amber tic's color - if so time will be longer may be 3 weeks _Good pictures !!


Thanks for the advise and re the pics, I've got a proscope micro mobile that attaches to my iPhone that I ussually use for work related applications, yeah it does a nice job for close ups of yummy sticky trichomes! I think that the proscope can fit many different smartphones , you just buy the relevant bracket for your phone. Not cheap though. (The scope that is).


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Mar 28, 2016)

A 100 times magnifier is good if you plan to take a sample and look at it on a steady surface, i got a 100x pocket microscope from amazon and its useless to look at a bud on the plant, i have a pretty steady hand and the image was just way too jittery, i went with this http://www.amazon.com/TOOGOO-Jewelers-Lighted-High-Power-Loupe/dp/B009WG1MQY?ie=UTF8&psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=od_aui_detailpages00 and it works great, not quite as clear as a 100x on a steady surface but WAY better for looking at a bud on the plant. all the trichomes look cloudy if you look at them head on, you have to find a spot where you can look at the ones sticking out past the edge, then you can see if they're actually clear or not. the only problem i had with the jewlers loupe i bought was that it shipped from China, which i didn't notice till i went to track the package, and it took 7 weeks to leave China, then another 2 to get here, so find a similar item shipping from the U.S.


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## timbo_slice (Mar 30, 2016)

Hi could anyone tell me if this looks ready not the best pic tho


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Mar 30, 2016)

timbo_slice said:


> Hi could anyone tell me if this looks ready not the best pic tho


i would say not yet, but one sample from a plant isnt enough to say for sure. i'm sure at least half the members will disagree with me, but my general rule is when i start to see Any amber trichomes, its time to harvest. if you harvest when they're all clear, its not very strong, if you wait till its about half clear/ half cloudy you get a daytime buzz, a nice high you can function with, if you wait till you just start seeing amber, thats the peak of strength, the plants going to start declining, no point waiting anymore. you'll get that severely messed up, time to watch a movie and eat cookies buzz.


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## timbo_slice (Mar 30, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> i would say not yet, but one sample from a plant isnt enough to say for sure. i'm sure at least half the members will disagree with me, but my general rule is when i start to see Any amber trichomes, its time to harvest. if you harvest when they're all clear, its not very strong, if you wait till its about half clear/ half cloudy you get a daytime buzz, a nice high you can function with, if you wait till you just start seeing amber, thats the peak of strength, the plants going to start declining, no point waiting anymore. you'll get that severely messed up, time to watch a movie and eat cookies buzz.
> View attachment 3645407


Hi thanks for the advise I just had a good look at a couple buds from the top and most of them look cloudy sort of look like pearls so I think I'll will harvest the top section and let the bottom go a bit longer


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## WestDenverPioneer (Mar 30, 2016)

timbo_slice said:


> Hi could anyone tell me if this looks ready not the best pic tho


more/better pics would help... but it looks close but NOT YET.
I can see a few amber but more clear than cloudy so give it a few more days and post again.


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## timbo_slice (Mar 30, 2016)

I'll try and get a couple more pics and post them up thx for the advice


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## yeatster (Mar 30, 2016)

I'm looking for a smart phone compatible microscope to check trichomes. This is my first harvest coming up so I don't mind spending more than the $10 junk I have seen. On the other hand, I don't want ti spend $100 either. 

Please help


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## timbo_slice (Mar 30, 2016)

Here is a couple more pics the darker one is from the bottom


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## yeatster (Mar 31, 2016)

timbo_slice said:


> Here is a couple more pics the darker one is from the bottom


I see amber trichomes on top. In my novice opinion, I say she's ready!
Maybe harvest top buds that are ready.
Interested to see other opinions.

Peace


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## timbo_slice (Mar 31, 2016)

Thx that's what I was thinking I'll wait to early in the morning to harvest the top and leave the rest for a bit longer


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## 024deeweed420 (Mar 31, 2016)

Ok it's been 9 days since last photos What do you think guys? I can see a couple of ambers, more on another pic but can't seem to upload im in an internet dead spot here.


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## yeatster (Mar 31, 2016)

024deeweed420 said:


> View attachment 3646655 View attachment 3646660 View attachment 3646639 View attachment 3646655 View attachment 3646660 View attachment 3646639 Ok it's been 9 days since last photos What do you think guys? I can see a couple of ambers, more on another pic but can't seem to upload im in an internet dead spot here.


I see too much clear, not enough amber. 10% amber, as much cloudy as possible is my goal. Imo, you need a few days.

Let's see what others think.

Peace


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## 024deeweed420 (Mar 31, 2016)

Yeah thanks, I think 


yeatster said:


> I see too much clear, not enough amber. 10% amber, as much cloudy as possible is my goal. Imo, you need a few days.
> 
> Let's see what others think.
> 
> Peace


I was all geared up to harvest today but I can wait another week. The plant is in a remote area so I can only get here weekly. The buds are getting juicier and fatter I might give it another canna 13/14 dose. Still warm weather too. Interested to hear others opinions too. Cheers!


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## 024deeweed420 (Apr 1, 2016)

Here's the other pics, can still harvest Tommorow or next week.


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## yeatster (Apr 1, 2016)

I don't feel comfortable giving advice on this, specifically. If it were a matter of checking everyday I would feel much better saying, I would wait. Next week...? I just don't know.
Hopefully someone with more experience will come along.

Edit: I would, however, pay morw attention to trichomes on the bud, rather than sugar leaves. 
Also, a picture of the whole plant might help


----------



## 024deeweed420 (Apr 1, 2016)

yeatster said:


> I don't feel comfortable giving advice on this, specifically. If it were a matter of checking everyday I would feel much better saying, I would wait. Next week...? I just don't know.
> Hopefully someone with more experience will come along.
> 
> Edit: I would, however, pay morw attention to trichomes on the bud, rather than sugar leaves.
> Also, a picture of the whole plant might help


Yeah thanks for advise not getting any other comments.... I'll go take a few more snaps now. Be back in 20mins


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## yeatster (Apr 1, 2016)

I figured at least if I commented, it would bump your thread. Don't worry, more help will come.


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## yeatster (Apr 1, 2016)

yeatster said:


> I figured at least if I commented, it would bump your thread. Don't worry, more help will come.


Just realized this isn't a thread you started. This thread seems dormant. Might wanna start one for this.


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## 024deeweed420 (Apr 1, 2016)

Ok these are all taken right in the top two colas , me thinkin a week not gonna hurt , well it would be 5 days. The microscope photos I lowered the resolution because the Internet 3G is so shit here. And yes I should start new thread maybe but I'm noob and I was a bit wary. And to reupload these photos with this Interweb speed may drive me nuts! Bump?!


----------



## yeatster (Apr 1, 2016)

024deeweed420 said:


> View attachment 3647509 View attachment 3647514 View attachment 3647515 View attachment 3647516 View attachment 3647517 View attachment 3647518 View attachment 3647519 Ok these are all taken right in the top two colas , me thinkin a week not gonna hurt , well it would be 5 days. The microscope photos I lowered the resolution because the Internet 3G is so shit here. And yes I should start new thread maybe but I'm noob and I was a bit wary. And to reupload these photos with this Interweb speed may drive me nuts! Bump?!


I'm gonna stick with my original thoughts. Wait.
Nice plant!


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## 024deeweed420 (Apr 1, 2016)

yeatster said:


> I'm gonna stick with my original thoughts. Wait.
> Nice plant!


Thanks Yeatster, yeah pretty proud, first real attempt minus a few half assed attempts as a teenager years ago. Actually pretty lucky because I ended up with only 1 seedling that survived so I had to cross fingers it was girl. It was also a very tiny seedling so I didn't have my hopes up. I know it's nothing compared to some of the monsters on this site but yep pretty proud . From the photo what do you think I might yield from this puppy? I'm guessing 50 to 100 grams dried weight at the max. Just for me anyways , more than enough for a year with the vaporizer. Might make some green dragon with the trimmings as well.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Apr 1, 2016)

i'd give it another 3 days at least, if you had to harvest now it wouldn't be bad, but if you can wait till you can see a few ambers starting to appear, thats the prime time.


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## 024deeweed420 (Apr 1, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> i'd give it another 3 days at least, if you had to harvest now it wouldn't be bad, but if you can wait till you can see a few ambers starting to appear, thats the prime time.


Thanks Roger, yes I think I'll wait till next Wednesday night , fatten up those buds a bit more. That's four days from today where I am. Weather still good this week as well , mid 20s ( centigrade)


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## iHearAll (Apr 2, 2016)

024deeweed420 said:


> View attachment 3647509 View attachment 3647514 View attachment 3647515 View attachment 3647516 View attachment 3647517 View attachment 3647518 View attachment 3647519 Ok these are all taken right in the top two colas , me thinkin a week not gonna hurt , well it would be 5 days. The microscope photos I lowered the resolution because the Internet 3G is so shit here. And yes I should start new thread maybe but I'm noob and I was a bit wary. And to reupload these photos with this Interweb speed may drive me nuts! Bump?!


Good ol burried plastic pot


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## 024deeweed420 (Apr 2, 2016)

iHearAll said:


> Good ol burried plastic pot


LOL, actually not even , it's just the photo angle , the pot is just placed in the middle of a shrub for stealthiness. In its veg stage it was completely hidden but now it's just a bit too high and sticks out like dogs balls!


----------



## iHearAll (Apr 2, 2016)

024deeweed420 said:


> LOL, actually not even , it's just the photo angle , the pot is just placed in the middle of a shrub for stealthiness. In its veg stage it was completely hidden but now it's just a bit too high and sticks out like dogs balls!


You could bury the container to the pot's soil level. Just dig deeper then he container to break up the hole it's in. You wouldnt want it to get root rot from pooling water. But shit idk why you'd care at this point. If you're at all worried someone may steel it then id go ahead and cut her down. Save the branches left on the roots and veg her out over the summer!!! Boom full pounder in fall. But you'll need some serious uninterupted work space.

Im flowering 6 right now and am going to reveg for clones. Iv got to move residences at the end of summer and clones will be a bajillion times easier to move than 6 fully vegged mothers lol


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## 024deeweed420 (Apr 2, 2016)

I'm not in USA, it's autum/fall here now so don't think I could reveg unless I get some lights which I don't have. But looking into it for next grow. Growing is addictive!
The plant is pretty safe in a remote area, I'm gonna leave it for a week then do the chop! Thanks for advise.


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## iHearAll (Apr 2, 2016)

024deeweed420 said:


> I'm not in USA, it's autum/fall here now so don't think I could reveg unless I get some lights which I don't have. But looking into it for next grow. Growing is addictive!
> The plant is pretty safe in a remote area, I'm gonna leave it for a week then do the chop! Thanks for advise.


How? What? Where? Are you heading into winter? What planet? Im so confused. Obviously i need to educate on geography. April fools day?


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## 024deeweed420 (Apr 2, 2016)

iHearAll said:


> How? What? Where? Are you heading into winter? What planet? Im so confused. Obviously i need to educate on geography. April fools day?


I'd rather not say where I am, (plausible deniability) but very far from North America. I'm in the , Southern Hemisphere where when it's summer here it's winter in northern hemisphere and vice versa. Weed is loved all over the world Yes it's autumn here and heading into winter, winter starts here in June. You flush the toilet here it even spins the other way .


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## iHearAll (Apr 2, 2016)

I thought the backwards toilet was a myth....


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## 024deeweed420 (Apr 2, 2016)

Yeah actually I think it is lol.


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## WestDenverPioneer (Apr 3, 2016)

Not done in those pics. You're doing the right thing by being patient.


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## 024deeweed420 (Apr 3, 2016)

WestDenverPioneer said:


> Not done in those pics. You're doing the right thing by being patient.


Thanks WDP ( if I may be so informal to call you that ) I can see the calyxes getting fatter and I'm in no hurry really, could even go 2 weeks if needed. The weather here is still great so she's only gonna benefit till I start seeing the Amber Trikes.


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## timbo_slice (Apr 7, 2016)

I think its time to harvest its hard to tell with this pic but there amberish and I think its starting to get a seed pod here and there


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## 024deeweed420 (Apr 7, 2016)

I'm not really qualified to give an opinion here because I'm about to harvest too and need advise from the experts here but your picture isn't magnified enough for me to even make out the trichomes let alone their colour. I can see them but they're just dots. Does the camera your using have a digital zoom ? Might help to get a bit closer in if possible.


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## timbo_slice (Apr 7, 2016)

Yeah I couldn't find the attachment for the phone to soon right in I'll take some more and post them


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## Huckster79 (Apr 8, 2016)

Which side of snippet is more accurate? Top or underside? Top side appears further along than the underside... Which one is more accurate?


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## 024deeweed420 (Apr 8, 2016)

So I've harvested, can see Amber trikes but to be honest some other pics they are all cloudy only. But was time, going to have a really cold snap here next week other reasons it had to go . Very happy though for my first grow attempt. Thanks for all the advise! I sampled her last night with the portable vape, very nice alert sativa high. But harsh cause I over microwaved the poor bastard. Got em drying then gonna cure with the bodeva humidor packs in jar. I recon I got coupe ounces. Got the bug now. Might try a cheap cfl indoor this winter. Thanks everyone for all the advise!


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## bro54209 (Apr 9, 2016)

024deeweed420 said:


> View attachment 3652892 View attachment 3652891 View attachment 3652889 View attachment 3652886 View attachment 3652882 View attachment 3652884 View attachment 3652888 So I've harvested, can see Amber trikes but to be honest some other pics they are all cloudy only. very nice alert sativa high. But harsh cause I over microwaved the poor bastard.


Alert high for sure with more clearish trichs, id have honestly waited a few more days for a trippier cannabinoid profile, like all milky and 5-10% amber rather than 5% clear 5% amber 90% milky. Hopefully a couple weeks cure will help the harshness, did you flush for 1-2 weeks? a couple flushes works but I noticed a good 4 flushes or so over 2 weeks gave a nice white ash smooth burn. no nutes near the end help it to mature


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## timbo_slice (Apr 10, 2016)

Here is another pic let me know what u think , I think its ready but want another opinion


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## IronLunG710 (Apr 20, 2016)

very interesting, I may do a test myself by doing a same strain side by side, one harvest at a specific time with trichs being cloudy, no amber, and one with a large amount of amber trichs and then send them out to VerdeLab for testing. Will also send both fresh and cured samples.


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## 024deeweed420 (Apr 21, 2016)

That image is amazing! Well I'm gonna make sure I really get some decent Amber trikes next grow. I'm guessing most weed is harvested early because it's been illegal and a business and people wanna get the crop in before it's Discovered and busted or stolen.


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## nyceone (May 16, 2016)

How long before i chop ?


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## Roger A. Shrubber (May 16, 2016)

nyceone said:


> How long before i chop ?


quite a while, most of those are still clear, just a few milky, didn't see any ambers. probably another 2 to 3 weeks.
when about 75% to 80% are cloudy, 10 to 15% are clear, and 5 to 10% are amber. definitely no more than 10% amber, thats actually a little past peak


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## nyceone (May 16, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> quite a while, most of those are still clear, just a few milky, didn't see any ambers. probably another 2 to 3 weeks.
> when about 75% to 80% are cloudy, 10 to 15% are clear, and 5 to 10% are amber. definitely no more than 10% amber, thats actually a little past peak


Thanks bro


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## WestDenverPioneer (May 17, 2016)

nyceone said:


> How long before i chop ?


NOT YET! 
Soon.
At least a week. Maybe two. Post pics in a week and we'll see.

Keep feeding. Don't starve or flush your plants.
Looking good. Keep on keeping on.


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## nyceone (May 27, 2016)

UOTE="WestDenverPioneer, post: 12603222, member: 769037"]NOT YET! 
Soon.
At least a week. Maybe two. Post pics in a week and we'll see.

Keep feeding. Don't starve or flush your plants.
Looking good. Keep on keeping on.[/QUOTE]
Up
update


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## WestDenverPioneer (May 27, 2016)

Not yet. At least 3 more days and post again. Pics of the entire plant are helpful too.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (May 27, 2016)

trichomes don't all mature at the same time. clear ones are premature, milky ones are ripe, and amber ones are past ripe. they'll never all be at the same stage at the same time. so what you want is the majority to be cloudy, and just a few scattered around to be amber. thats pretty much peak. if you let it go much past 5% amber before you harvest you're just letting it get overripe, like a banana turning black.
if you have to go looking for ambers to find any, its not ready yet. there should be a few here and there over most of the plant.
i know it sucks, i'm at about the same point you are at the moment, waiting for a plant thats 90% cloudy to start producing a few ambers to let me know its actually there. just keep checking daily


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## pookat (May 27, 2016)

Ambers have a higher C.B.D content, after the T.H.c has degraded, more of a medicinal use than the desired stone...kinda like the 70's 80's stone if you catch at the right %


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## nyceone (May 28, 2016)

WetDenverPioneer said:


> Not yet. At least 3 more days and post again. Pics of the entire plant are helpful too.


Ok bro no problem will do and im moving today but moving the girls on monday


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## nyceone (May 28, 2016)

[QUOTRoger A. Shrubber, post: 12634526, member: 925384"]trichomes don't all mature at the same time. clear ones are premature, milky ones are ripe, and amber ones are past ripe. they'll never all be at the same stage at the same time. so what you want is the majority to be cloudy, and just a few scattered around to be amber. thats pretty much peak. if you let it go much past 5% amber before you harvest you're just letting it get overripe, like a banana turning black.
if you have to go looking for ambers to find any, its not ready yet. there should be a few here and there over most of the plant.
i know it sucks, i'm at about the same point you are at the moment, waiting for a plant thats 90% cloudy to start producing a few ambers to let me know its actually there. just keep checking daily[/QUOTE]
Then again over ripe banana is sweeter too


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## RM3 (May 28, 2016)

nyceone said:


> [QUOTRoger A. Shrubber, post: 12634526, member: 925384"]trichomes don't all mature at the same time. clear ones are premature, milky ones are ripe, and amber ones are past ripe. they'll never all be at the same stage at the same time. so what you want is the majority to be cloudy, and just a few scattered around to be amber. thats pretty much peak. if you let it go much past 5% amber before you harvest you're just letting it get overripe, like a banana turning black.
> if you have to go looking for ambers to find any, its not ready yet. there should be a few here and there over most of the plant.
> i know it sucks, i'm at about the same point you are at the moment, waiting for a plant thats 90% cloudy to start producing a few ambers to let me know its actually there. just keep checking daily
> Then again over ripe banana is sweeter too


and degrading trics are brown ,,,not amber and it is CBN not CBD


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## pookat (May 28, 2016)

Subtle difference...cheers, it dont help when you got bad eye's...lol


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## Budley Doright (May 28, 2016)

RM3 said:


> and degrading trics are brown ,,,not amber and it is CBN not CBD


Do you know of any studies done that actually measure the different compounds and percentages at different stages?


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## Roger A. Shrubber (May 28, 2016)

RM3 said:


> and degrading trics are brown ,,,not amber and it is CBN not CBD


i said absolutely nothing about cbd or cbn, and im far from the first to call them amber....look back for years at old forums....


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## RM3 (May 28, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> i said absolutely nothing about cbd or cbn, and im far from the first to call them amber....look back for years at old forums....


never said you did


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## Budley Doright (May 28, 2016)

RM3 said:


> Plenty of studies, the one that led to the amber is bad myth is linked in my free chapter


It was the amber that I was i interested in yes. Where is your free chapter?


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## Budley Doright (May 28, 2016)

Thanks RM, I had actually read that before but could remember where. And just to not confuse people here I think when talking about Amber most if not all are talking the typical cloudy milky turned Amber, and not one of the few clear Amber strains. I like to pull my cloudy milky before I get a lot of Amber/brown and have for years, just my preference. Not sure how long I let the only strain I've had that had purple triches go but it was a bit longer into the finish. (15,years ago) I don't base my pulling on triches only. Usually base it on my running low unfortunately lol.


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## Grandamigo (Jun 3, 2016)

Should i give em another week lads?


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## pookat (Jun 3, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> i know it sucks


It was me that said about the CBD, got mixed up with CBN...sorry
CBD's got potential for de-calcifying the neurons in Alzheimer treatment, I've been doing some research for a friend who has it.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jun 3, 2016)

i'd say one more. i'd give it a light flushing now and leave it alone for 7 to 10 days.


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## WestDenverPioneer (Jun 3, 2016)

Grandamigo said:


> Should i give em another week lads?


At least a week. Keep running to the end.


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## roots2branches (Jun 6, 2016)

hi everybody, the trichomes look ready maybe a third are Amber
but outdoor tangerine dream only started flower around April 10
so that's about 57 days
don't wanna harvest to early
from what I read this should be a 70 plus days on flower strain


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jun 6, 2016)

unless thats one of the amber strains RM3 was talking about, those trichomes look ready to me.


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## roots2branches (Jun 7, 2016)

thanks roger I'll have to look into that rm3 
the tiny bud leaves on some of the top flowers may have got sun burned, 104 the other day here in the high desert
the buds look and feel airy


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## WestDenverPioneer (Jun 8, 2016)

There you go - the heat and conditions caused the color change. It needs more time, the rest of the trichomes are still clear.


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## roots2branches (Jun 8, 2016)

thanks west Denver 
yea the intense all day sun
burnt the flower tips
I am anxious to harvest
but as you said trichomes to many clear


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## roots2branches (Jun 11, 2016)

today sat getting close
starting a drying box, the fan is gonna draw air thru the box
it is a air purifier I got at a garage sale


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## nyceone (Jun 12, 2016)

Is it time now?


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jun 12, 2016)

i would still say no, i don't see any amber at all, looks like about 60% milky 40% clear, which is way too many clear.


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## nyceone (Jun 12, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> i would still say no, i don't see any amber at all, looks like about 60% milky 40% clear, which is way too many clear.


Today is day 69 and they day its supposed to finish in 50-60 days. I've been giving it water for about 2 weeks now


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jun 12, 2016)

can't help it, they don't look ready


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## sunandsky (Jun 13, 2016)

Question: On the first page of this thread it shows a chart that i have attached here. It shows that thc degrades to cbn but that cbc and cbd do not degrade. So if you were to try and harvest buds to have a high cbd content with minimal thc, would it work to simply let the plant go longer until the thc degrades, or would that cbn then give you a sickly high and it wouldn't really help the effect of the cbd at all?


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## WestDenverPioneer (Jun 14, 2016)

nyceone said:


> Is it time now?


No.


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## WestDenverPioneer (Jun 14, 2016)

sunandsky said:


> buds to have a high cbd content with minimal thc


That is not related to harvesting.


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## sunandsky (Jun 14, 2016)

WestDenverPioneer said:


> That is not related to harvesting.


I'm asking if it is possible to harvest with degraded thc without problems. That is very related to harvesting.


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## WestDenverPioneer (Jun 14, 2016)

sunandsky said:


> I'm asking if it is possible to harvest with degraded thc without problems. That is very related to harvesting.


You would have a hard time reaching that point with a living plant. Harvest would be long over before that THC degraded enough to leave "low" levels behind.

Synthesis is caused by enzymes. Degradation is caused by heat, or time.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jun 14, 2016)

i'm not trying to be nosey, but what kind of health problems preclude the use of thc?


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## sunandsky (Jun 14, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> i'm not trying to be nosey, but what kind of health problems preclude the use of thc?


mental health issues. It isn't very fun to "trip out" these days. I try to keep my mind as still as I possibly can


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## jacrispy (Jun 14, 2016)

another week it is


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## roots2branches (Jun 16, 2016)

well I was thinking it was time to start at least taking some buds of some of the 6 Tangerine plants
even at only around 60 days of flower UNTIL I saw these what appear new pistils


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## RM3 (Jun 16, 2016)

roots2branches said:


> well I was thinking it was time to start at least taking some buds of some of the 6 Tangerine plants
> even at only around 60 days of flower UNTIL I saw these what appear new pistils


Tis done, the new stuff is just foxtails


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## roots2branches (Jun 16, 2016)

yikes! on one hand I want to get em done and dried and put away in cure before the 4th July ( in laws coming into town) on the other hand I was hoping the buds would swell up some more
thanks rm3 I like your threads
I guess the 70-80 day thing for flower may not apply to these stressed out girls, which is fine
gonna do the drowning method that you wrote about in the past
lots of Amber anyways
BTW for some reason I gave em a shot of Epsom salts and mollases
yesterday cuz I really thought I kick em into overdrive.
I hope I didn't mess up considering I will start the harvest today, first grow jitters


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## RM3 (Jun 16, 2016)

roots2branches said:


> yikes! on one hand I want to get em done and dried and put away in cure before the 4th July ( in laws coming into town) on the other hand I was hoping the buds would swell up some more
> thanks rm3 I like your threads
> I guess the 70-80 day thing for flower may not apply to these stressed out girls, which is fine
> gonna do the drowning method that you wrote about in the past
> ...


you're good


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## roots2branches (Jun 16, 2016)

thanks ! I just got off another thread " the truth about flushing"
I got to page 19 or so and was convinced to try the drowning method
But then I jumped to last pages where riddle has now switched to boiling water method to kill roots
because of mold issues
I live in the desert with low low humiidty I don't think I'll have a problem just cold water drowning vs boiling water, I may not even do either... just chop and hang in my drying box and just cure longer
time not on my side thanks again rm3


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## roots2branches (Jun 16, 2016)

well here I go 
first plant
first cola
first harvest on about 42 years


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## nyceone (Jun 21, 2016)

Yea its getting real close about a week or two left


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## Chizzarules (Jun 24, 2016)

Hey guys, i have five autoflowers, just gave them a look over and most trichomes are cloudy, a few are Amber here and there, I'll be harvesting in the next day or two!


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## yeatster (Jun 24, 2016)

Chizzarules said:


> Hey guys, i have five autoflowers, just gave them a look over and most trichomes are cloudy, a few are Amber here and there, I'll be harvesting in the next day or two!


Trichomes on the buds, or sugar leaves?
2nd pic looks a little early


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jun 24, 2016)

i was just sitting here looking at pics and it occured to me that we ought to be more careful about casual things, R2B lives somewhere close to quartz hill and tehachipi in california, and either that picture was taken sometime around the end of june in 2015 or he saves newspapers. 
i'm not the most observant person in the world, wonder what they could deduce


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## Chizzarules (Jun 25, 2016)

yeatster said:


> Trichomes on the buds, or sugar leaves?
> 2nd pic looks a little early


Pics are over a week old, I snip samples off all parts of the plant


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## godvolcano (Jun 30, 2016)

So incredibly eye opening. The more and more I read about Marijuana, the more I'm in awe. 

Thanks for the good read!


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## k0ijn (Jul 1, 2016)

RM3 said:


> Except it takes a year (on average) to lose just 7% THC
> The science
> http://www.unodc.org/unodc/en/data-and-analysis/bulletin/bulletin_1997-01-01_1_page008.html
> 
> So, No, it won't work. Best to get a high CBD strain if that is what you want, there are plenty of em out there, I've grown a few


You are quoting the science wrong.
Dried plant material loses, on average, 16.6% of THC over a year of storage, according to the study you linked.
The 7% you are quoting, which is in fact 7.4%, is the _standard deviation_, a measure of how much the results deviate from each other. In essence you are misrepresenting the findings of the scientists you are quoting, by a factor over 2.

Another study found that THC, stored in a formulated system @ -18, 0, 4 & 25 degrees centigrade, degraded by ~15.8% to 20% in 10 days, with the numbers rising over the range of 15 months to 20+%, which seems to fit well with the correct percentage of 16.6% in the study you linked (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2921171/). 

THCA can be, and is converted to CBNA over time (with CBNA then converting to CBN), and that is why CBN is reflective of the age of a given developing plant, as much as it is reflective of the age of stored plant material.
Of course the amount of CBN in a given plant is also reflective of the particular strain.
But to say that CBN is not present in growing plants, or that it takes a year to see just a 7% degradation into CBN, or that we cannot use the development of trichomes to determine the age and levels of different cannabinoids is just wrong.


Furthermore I'd like to add that scientists on this topic argue that THC + CBN reflects the total THC content of a given plant, regardless of degradation;



M. Stefanidou et. al. said:


> In some cannabis products the low proportion of THC is not incompatible with their resinous character, as CBN (a degradation product of THC) in these samples is presented in large proportions. This leads to the suggestion that THC plus CBN content in fact reflects the total THC content, irrespective of degradative changes


This means that THC content can be understood as THC _and_ CBN, since CBN (the degradative product of THC) can be directly attributed to THC.

Ref; M. Stefanidou, S. Athanaselis, G. Alevisopoulos, J. Papoutsis, A. Koutselinis, D9 - Tetrahydrocannabinol content in cannabis plants of Greek origin, Chem. Pharm. Bull. 48 (5) (2000) 743–745.


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## RM3 (Jul 2, 2016)

k0ijn said:


> You are quoting the science wrong.
> Dried plant material loses, on average, 16.6% of THC over a year of storage, according to the study you linked.
> The 7% you are quoting, which is in fact 7.4%, is the _standard deviation_, a measure of how much the results deviate from each other. In essence you are misrepresenting the findings of the scientists you are quoting, by a factor over 2.
> 
> ...


What I quoted from the study,,,,,,,

the degradation of THC appears to proceed at a higher rate for the first year than subsequent years and levels off after two years to a rate of *loss of approximately 7 per cent per year.* Therefore, studies carried out with "old" material could feasibly report a 7 per cent loss per year. It is believed that the percentage loss in THC content is also a function of the initial THC concentration. The higher the concentration of THC, the faster the degradation over the first one or two years.


----------



## k0ijn (Jul 2, 2016)

RM3 said:


> What I quoted from the study,,,,,,,
> 
> the degradation of THC appears to proceed at a higher rate for the first year than subsequent years and levels off after two years to a rate of *loss of approximately 7 per cent per year.* Therefore, studies carried out with "old" material could feasibly report a 7 per cent loss per year. It is believed that the percentage loss in THC content is also a function of the initial THC concentration. The higher the concentration of THC, the faster the degradation over the first one or two years.


You are completely misunderstanding, or more likely, misrepresenting what the scientists found in the study.
What you just quoted again, is what the average loss in the _subsequent years_ *AFTER TWO YEARS* of storage is; 7% accumulative. That means that after losing 26.8% THC by being stored for _two years_ (see table 2), the plant material following that period (that means year 3 and year 4 consecutively) loses around 7% a year.
The scientists are *NOT* saying that you "only" lose 7% THC per year. In fact if you look at the science in the study, without misrepresenting what they found, you can see that after 4 years of storage the plant material has lost 41.4% THC, on average, with some samples losing well over 50%. So when you say that you "only" lose 7% per year, you are misrepresenting the data and the findings, by a factor over two! That is wildly dishonest.

If you look at the tables in the study (table 1 through 4), you can see how after *1 year* of storage the plant material, on average, has lost 16.6% THC. After 2 years of storage it has lost, on average, 26.8% THC.
It seems like you don't understand what statistics are, and that you don't know how to interpret the numbers.
The scientists aren't saying that it takes 1 year to lose 7% THC, they are saying that *AFTER TWO YEARS* of storage, the subsequent years the loss _levels out_ somewhat from the 16.6% per year to 7% in year 3 and year 4, on average.


I would warn anyone against taking what you are saying about this topic seriously, when you cannot even interpret a simple statistical analysis correctly.
The scientists, in my opinion, were very clear, and even wrote their findings in very readable language, even to a layman like you;


Study said:


> ...the degradation of THC *appears to proceed at a higher rate for the first year* than subsequent years *and levels off after two years* to a rate of loss of approximately 7 per cent per year.


I am not sure if I am getting through to you here, but either you are misrepresenting what the scientists found in this study, or you are being facetious. In either case, you are not respecting the science behind the study.


----------



## haight (Jul 2, 2016)

k0ijn said:


> You are quoting the science wrong.
> Dried plant material loses, on average, 16.6% of THC over a year of storage, according to the study you linked.
> The 7% you are quoting, which is in fact 7.4%, is the _standard deviation_, a measure of how much the results deviate from each other. In essence you are misrepresenting the findings of the scientists you are quoting, by a factor over 2. .


Yes the square of the variance from the mean or such. But what is your level of confidence in this crap? To be 99.6% confident and have an r-square approaching one is quite impressive. Figures don't lie. Of course liars figure too. So much for my understanding of probability and regressing on a multitude of variables.


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## k0ijn (Jul 3, 2016)

haight said:


> Yes the square of the variance from the mean or such. But what is your level of confidence in this crap? To be 99.6% confident and have an r-square approaching one is quite impressive. Figures don't lie. Of course liars figure too. So much for my understanding of probability and regressing on a multitude of variables.


I don't understand what you asking; my level of confidence in what 'crap' exactly?
I feel like you are being sarcastic and making a joke, but I can't be sure, based on the kind of ridiculous logic I've seen on this forum before.


----------



## Fogdog (Jul 3, 2016)

haight said:


> Asking? Do you see any question marks? No?
> Listen, statistical theory tends to boggle most peoples minds. Thazz all. And like I said, how accurate was that report? How many reviews of said report were critical of methodology, assumptions, and double blind controls.


Did you read the report? I did and it wasn't all that complex and nothing to do with statistical theory. It was a simple test that tracked change in THC and CBN content over time. They did have controls for the analytical equipment. The error of the measurement was high, but we are talking about extraction of plant material and all the error inherent in the method. Sample sizes were large enough to overcome measurement error.

The figure below was copied from the report. In the first year, %THC weight loss was very fast, roughly 17% and then slowed down thereafter, leveling off to roughly 7%-9% per year after the first year. The change in rate of THC loss indicates there was a different mechanism or process driving early weight loss with a shift to another mechanism, I'm guessing rate limited by diffusion, after the first year.






One problem with using this study to discuss THC loss in our weed it that the THC content of the study weed was pretty low ~2%-4%. Good commercial weed is what, 15%-25% THC? Would THC loss rate be higher at higher concentrations or would it be slower? All I'm saying is that we are extrapolating results from a study using low THC weed to guesstimate what happens with today's commercial weed. Not saying that results from the study aren't useful.

So, leaving the issue of extrapolation error aside, what does it mean really? If I have a sample of weed with 20% THC and 17% degradation during the first year, that weed will contain about 17% THC. After year 2, assuming 8% wt loss, it will have 15% THC and 14% THC after year 3. 

Maybe for somebody with high tolerance to THC, the amount lost over 3 years would be significant. To a lightweight like me, probably not.


----------



## RM3 (Jul 3, 2016)

Fogdog said:


> Did you read the report? I did and it wasn't all that complex and nothing to do with statistical theory. It was a simple test that tracked change in THC and CBN content over time. They did have controls for the analytical equipment. The error of the measurement was high, but we are talking about extraction of plant material and all the error inherent in the method. Sample sizes were large enough to overcome measurement error.
> 
> The figure below was copied from the report. In the first year, %THC weight loss was very fast, roughly 17% and then slowed down thereafter, leveling off to roughly 7%-9% per year after the first year. The change in rate of THC loss indicates there was a different mechanism or process driving early weight loss with a shift to another mechanism, I'm guessing rate limited by diffusion, after the first year.
> 
> ...


I actually did a test of sorts, took a bud that tested 25% THC and left it sit out on my coffee table for a month, then tested it again it was now 22% in the first test there was zero CBN, in the 2nd test there was 1% CBN which jived with what was said in the report.


----------



## Fogdog (Jul 3, 2016)

RM3 said:


> I actually did a test of sorts, took a bud that tested 25% THC and left it sit out on my coffee table for a month, then tested it again it was now 22% in the first test there was zero CBN, in the 2nd test there was 1% CBN which jived with what was said in the report.


25% THC going down to 22% THC in the first month would be about 12% change in total THC by weight, so yes that jibes pretty well with the UNODC study. Thanks.


----------



## haight (Jul 3, 2016)

Fogdog said:


> 25% THC going down to 22% THC in the first month would be about 12% change in total THC by weight, so yes that jibes pretty well with the UNODC study. Thanks.


My God man, 12% vs.17% ? The report results are 42% higher. Jive? You bet.
(Ain't statistics fun?)


----------



## Fogdog (Jul 3, 2016)

haight said:


> My God man, 12% vs.17% ? The report results are 42% higher. Jive? You bet.
> (Ain't statistics fun?)


People making hash out of statistics can bring a chuckle. I wonder if that would be bubble hash or kief?

RM3's data was in line with the data in the report. Doesn't prove anything because we can't know what the UNODC test samples would have shown had they been tested in one month. 

You confuse statistics with data. Just saying.


----------



## k0ijn (Jul 3, 2016)

Keep your posts relevant to the discussion at hand or the general point of the sticky.
Asking stupid questions and then acting like you didn't ask any questions is not pertinent to the discussion we are having here.

This thread is not a place for you to act out your personal frustrations.


----------



## k0ijn (Jul 3, 2016)

Fogdog said:


> People making hash out of statistics can bring a chuckle. I wonder if that would be bubble hash or kief?
> 
> RM3's data was in line with the data in the report. Doesn't prove anything because we can't know what the UNODC test samples would have shown had they been tested in one month.
> 
> You confuse statistics with data. Just saying.


It can indeed be fun to see people stumbling trying to understand a simple statistical analysis.

What I find more interesting though, is the fact that a 12% drop in potency, in just 1 month, isn't considered a large drop off in potency by some people in this thread. I'd say that losing 12% of anything, in the span of just 1 month, is a pretty tough loss.

In any case, you summed it up very well, it does not prove anything, since the real data from the study didn't test samples after such a short period.
It would be fun to see what actual scientific results would be in short periods of time, perhaps 1 week, 2 weeks and a month, to get a better understanding of the potency loss.


----------



## Fogdog (Jul 3, 2016)

k0ijn said:


> It can indeed be fun to see people stumbling trying to understand a simple statistical analysis.
> 
> What I find more interesting though, is the fact that a 12% drop in potency, in just 1 month, isn't considered a large drop off in potency by some people in this thread. I'd say that losing 12% of anything, in the span of just 1 month, is a pretty tough loss.
> 
> ...


Yes, as a producer, a 12% loss in THC content would, I think, be a big deal. No argument there. The problem would be larger variability so more samples but not that much of a complication.


----------



## k0ijn (Jul 3, 2016)

Fogdog said:


> Yes, as a producer, a 12% loss in THC content would, I think, be a big deal. No argument there. The problem would be larger variability so more samples but not that much of a complication.


Indeed, and I truly hope that we will see a lot more in depth studies on the complexity of cannabinoids and their development in the future, both in vivo and in vitro.

I try to keep up to date on the science, although this specific area is not my speciality. But I do have access to most scientific databases, so do please let me know if there are any specific studies you'd like me to link/upload.
I found a rather interesting, but very specific, study on Albanian Cannabis plants yesterday, which details how cannabinoids mature and convert in that specific region.
It is usually very hard to find broad studies which apply directly to the discussion in this thread, since most studies are very specific. But I do believe we are inching closer to what we are seeking, as Cannabis studies are becoming more and more respected in the scientific community.


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Jul 4, 2016)

i find that most of the studies that people are still quoting were done at least a decade ago, some as much as 50 years ago. the greek study being quoted above is from 99.
i'd really like to see some current studies of new strains that are much more potent than those grown 20+ years ago.
places like NIDA do studies...how can you expect a place named the Nation Institute for Drug Abuse to do a fair, non biased study?
is anyone aware of a non-govermental institute doing fair, even handed research thats not aimed at demonizing marijuana and its users?


----------



## Dmm (Jul 4, 2016)

Wrong spot I apologize..drying issue(where to?)
Made changes to my setup and forgot about drying woops...now I'm running a one room setup so I obviously only have my venting system in there...I know it's not best but I think my best bet short term is to dry them in there till I can cure...any suggestions,pointers advice..
I run 400's..rooms never about 75...exhaust/Fa and all that good stuff..using stackable mesh drying racks..im contemplating putting them anywhere outside the room but I realize how important my ventilation system is


----------



## Lucky Luke (Jul 4, 2016)

Dmm said:


> Wrong spot I apologize..drying issue(where to?)
> Made changes to my setup and forgot about drying woops...now I'm running a one room setup so I obviously only have my venting system in there...I know it's not best but I think my best bet short term is to dry them in there till I can cure...any suggestions,pointers advice..
> I run 400's..rooms never about 75...exhaust/Fa and all that good stuff..using stackable mesh drying racks..im contemplating putting them anywhere outside the room but I realize how important my ventilation system is


im not a hydro guy.
Why carnt you just dry them in another room, garage, somewere else? Just have a fan circulating the air like most of us do.
That way u can get on to your next grow.


----------



## Dmm (Jul 4, 2016)

Lucky Luke said:


> im not a hydro guy.
> Why carnt you just dry them in another room, garage, somewere else? Just have a fan circulating the air like most of us do.
> That way u can get on to your next grow.


Smell mainly. I very well may do it that way..haven't decided yet...stinky house or expose buds to light something Ive never done


----------



## Lucky Luke (Jul 4, 2016)

Dont expose them to light!

If you have to go 4 to 7 days without a grow..do that rather than wreck your work.


----------



## Dmm (Jul 4, 2016)

Lucky Luke said:


> Dont expose them to light!
> 
> If you have to go 4 to 7 days without a grow..do that rather than wreck your work.


 Its not that ll have to go without a grow..I have many still on the way..hence my problem or I'd just shut off the lights.. but by putting them outside the room I don't have the exhaust carbon filters and etc..either way I lose.
You're probably right tho


----------



## Lucky Luke (Jul 4, 2016)

Dmm said:


> Its not that ll have to go without a grow..I have many still on the way..hence my problem or I'd just shut off the lights.. but by putting them outside the room I don't have the exhaust carbon filters and etc..either way I lose.
> You're probably right tho


You carnt use a garage or shed? (i use my shed for large amounts)
I use a cupboard in a spare room for drying small amounts and it doesnt stink the house out.


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## k0ijn (Jul 5, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> i find that most of the studies that people are still quoting were done at least a decade ago, some as much as 50 years ago. the greek study being quoted above is from 99.
> i'd really like to see some current studies of new strains that are much more potent than those grown 20+ years ago.
> places like NIDA do studies...how can you expect a place named the Nation Institute for Drug Abuse to do a fair, non biased study?
> is anyone aware of a non-govermental institute doing fair, even handed research thats not aimed at demonizing marijuana and its users?


I agree that we need more hard data, more science in general and specifically more studies on cannabinoids and their development over time in relation to conversion, oxydation & decarboxylation etc.
However, I do believe that we are seeing an increase in these sorts of studies, but since the nature of scientific studies are very specific, it's hard to get exactly what you want.
And much of the science being done on Cannabis and cannabinoids is rather elementary if you will, not that it's too basic or useless, but we haven't had a free flow of Cannabis research and science for a long time, we still don't in much of the world, and there is a hell of a lot of research to be done on these subjects. Most of what is done is studying the effects of the biology of the receptors and how the human body reacts to specific compounds, not broad studies on the cannabinoids themselves and their development.

I found a really nice study on the difference between vaporizers, including one I own, which is how I found it, and I must say that it's nice to see studies on cannabis, cannabis products, cannabinoids and tools are becoming much more respected and prevalent in the scientific community.
The study I found on vaporizers and how efficient they are; http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0147286


With regards to your question, I think there are a lot of institutions and organizations who carry out great objective research, but if you are looking for hard science the best place to look is in _scientific journals_.
Much of the research being done is very specific though, and you'll have to spend a long time researching all the different studies to find something that resembles the holy grail of the study you are after, which I presume to be something like; "In vitro & in vivo quantitative analysis and validation of cannabinoid development and conversion in Cannabis".
A study like that does not really exist at this moment, hopefully it will in the future.


----------



## Psyphish (Jul 5, 2016)

My plants are always frostiest after a few hours of lights ON. I always harvest before lights come on, and preferably after 24h in the dark, but the harvested stuff is never as frosty as the samples I take with lights on. Do the trichomes fill out with the starches etc. that people are trying to avoid?

my previous harvest was some of the frostiest stuff I've ever grown, but after harvest it seems like all the trichomes just disappeared and I don't handle the buds rough during harvest.


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## bgmike8 (Jul 11, 2016)

k0ijn said:


> I agree that we need more hard data, more science in general and specifically more studies on cannabinoids and their development over time in relation to conversion, oxydation & decarboxylation etc.
> However, I do believe that we are seeing an increase in these sorts of studies, but since the nature of scientific studies are very specific, it's hard to get exactly what you want.
> And much of the science being done on Cannabis and cannabinoids is rather elementary if you will, not that it's too basic or useless, but we haven't had a free flow of Cannabis research and science for a long time, we still don't in much of the world, and there is a hell of a lot of research to be done on these subjects. Most of what is done is studying the effects of the biology of the receptors and how the human body reacts to specific compounds, not broad studies on the cannabinoids themselves and their development.
> 
> ...


First, thank you for the thread.

Do you believe in an extended dark period before harvest?
Do you believe in flushing?


----------



## RM3 (Jul 11, 2016)

bgmike8 said:


> First, thank you for the thread.
> 
> Do you believe in an extended dark period before harvest?
> Do you believe in flushing?


No


----------



## bgmike8 (Jul 11, 2016)

RM3 said:


> No


Haha. I know you don't @RM3. 

Just trying to get more opinions. I'm not doing a flush. But I haven't looked into the dark period thing just heard ppl saying.

So do you think I should just chop them right before the lights come on?

Does that even matter? Because it would be nice to have the lights on to see better...


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## RM3 (Jul 11, 2016)

bgmike8 said:


> Haha. I know you don't @RM3.
> 
> Just trying to get more opinions. I'm not doing a flush. But I haven't looked into the dark period thing just heard ppl saying.
> 
> ...


I chop durin lights on but I think everyone should try things and see for themselves


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## bgmike8 (Jul 11, 2016)

I guess the idea is that lights on draws nutrients and water into the buds right before you chop. But even if this is true it should be negligible anyway right?

I don't have the latitude to just try shit right now. It's profit or loss . Continue or fail.

If I make it then next grow and thereafter can be experimented on....


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## RM3 (Jul 11, 2016)

bgmike8 said:


> I guess the idea is that lights on draws nutrients and water into the buds right before you chop. But even if this is true it should be negligible anyway right?
> 
> I don't have the latitude to just try shit right now. It's profit or loss . Continue or fail.
> 
> If I make it then next grow and thereafter can be experimented on....


The way I do things that can't happen but what do I know


----------



## testiclees (Jul 11, 2016)

Ive never flushed on past grows but this time Ive got a plant going a little longer than i expected so I'm using it as an oppty to test out 2 weeks water only. I have zero experience with this strain so no real point of comparison. On the other hand I do find that there is a benefit to a period of dark before chop. I was very skeptical for a long while until Spurr over on TLG suggested I try it out. 

This is 8ballKush day 55. 12.5 /11.5


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## bgmike8 (Jul 11, 2016)

Why 12.5?

I'm running 12 12


----------



## testiclees (Jul 11, 2016)

bgmike8 said:


> Why 12.5?
> 
> I'm running 12 12


I was copying from captain morgan and church haze and others. We use 730nm @ lights out to extend the perceived dark period. Im switching them to 13.5 / 10.5 today. So i do a few weeks close to 12 12 then add longer lights on for like 3,4 or 5 weeks then back closer to 12/12 to finish.


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## k0ijn (Jul 13, 2016)

bgmike8 said:


> First, thank you for the thread.
> 
> Do you believe in an extended dark period before harvest?
> Do you believe in flushing?


Yw, glad you found it helpful.
No I don't believe in turning off grow lights to 'push out more trichomes' or whatever it is people think happens by doing that.
It's an unproven step that makes very little sense.
I would obviously change my view if I were presented with proper evidence.

Flushing in general can be helpful, if you understand the difference between 'flushing' and 'pre-harvest flushing'.
Flushing can help clear a growing medium of a build up of salts, or correct errors in pH values etc.
Flushing is used by most growers during a grow, but in particular it's useful for new growers to correct errors.

However, I think you are asking about pre-harvest flushing, which is an unfounded procedure that has no basis in science and is myth based in it's supposed advantages. I've heard everything from clearing out chemical taste to pushing out trichomes, none of it has been proven. I've written extensively on this subject, but just to mention one fact that utterly shatters pre-harvest flushers fantasies; Nutrients aren't stored in the calyces, there is nothing to 'clear out'. Furthermore, nutrients are nutrients, whether synthetically manufactored or organic, plants cannot distinguish between an organic or synthetic fertilizer. Thinking that you can improve yield or taste by feeding just water to a plant is wishful thinking at best.

I would _not_ recommend that anyone should deprive their plants of nutrients in the most critical phase of growing; late blooming.


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## bgmike8 (Jul 13, 2016)

k0ijn said:


> Yw, glad you found it helpful.
> No I don't believe in turning off grow lights to 'push out more trichomes' or whatever it is people think happens by doing that.
> It's an unproven step that makes very little sense.
> I would obviously change my view if I were presented with proper evidence.
> ...


Yeah. I'm done with worrying about it. Can't find any science. It's just that every tutorial from high times to growweedeasy says to flush.

No flushing for me.


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## bro54209 (Jul 13, 2016)

Been waiting 12, almost 13 weeks on this blue dream sativa, smells like turkey ginger, its going to be great 
I've been telling myself that I'll chop tomorrow every night for the past 3 weeks with my nails in my thighs, but I've waited watching it get milkier fatter purplier and stinkier than the times I chopped at week 9, bit anxious but the patience will probably blow my mind, CBN could help too. I'm so excited im probably going to chop in a few hours if noone relpies, if anyone thinks another day could help pack extra punch please let me know I think this batch will make the other batches uncomparable, Based on what I see most areas are (I think) 10% clear/milky, 80% milky, 5% milky/amber, 5% amber. some of the milkyish look clear to me cause i see some clear trich heads with tiny amber dots. some buds with shade patches didnt get as purple are more like 10% clear 10% clear milky 79% milk 1% amber. 2 weeks till lift off
Update: I just put her in so that she'll get 5 more hours hps give 12hrs darkness chop then try leaving her dipped in a cup of water for the first day to try to prolong drying a few extra days this time


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## westbmorekush (Aug 2, 2016)

abuilder said:


> yeh well...amber means it's degrading fast...plus that couch lock is more like drugged than being high...I personally don't wanna be knocked on my ass unless I really have a bad medical condition that has me in lots of pain which I don't.
> I like to just feel nice and high of varying plateaus ...just not melting into the floor. I'll save that for shrooms....lol. I got Barney's LSD ready to harvest in a week or two so that should hold me over on a new plateau for a spell...HA!
> I'm waiting for the trichs to just get to one or two amber and then I'll water and go dark for 24 hours and chop in the morning...after I say a prayer over them first......ha


Looks like blue dream, what ok booster so you use.

If I don't fly imma die anyway!


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## BusterVAP (Aug 4, 2016)

Hey fellow cannabis goers. How does this look. I picked 1 stock trichs were a little cloudy and 30 percent red hairs. What's your opinion strain is white widow. Thanks everyone


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## BusterVAP (Aug 4, 2016)

It's my very first grow


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## bigt4172 (Aug 13, 2016)

Would you harvest this plant based on the amber %? First time doing this any info would be great. This is a autoflower


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## RM3 (Aug 13, 2016)

bigt4172 said:


> Would you harvest this plant based on the amber %? First time doing this any info would be great. This is a autoflower


Helps to include a full plant pic and a shot of the cola

But to answer your question, I would not


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## bigt4172 (Aug 13, 2016)

RM3 said:


> Helps to include a full plant pic and a shot of the cola
> 
> But to answer your question, I would not


 Heres a pic of bud, don't have apic with me of whole plant. The way I understood it plant itself doesn't matter, just the trichomes .


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## RM3 (Aug 13, 2016)

bigt4172 said:


> Heres a pic of bud, don't have apic with me of whole plant. The way I understood it plant itself doesn't matter, just the trichomes .


Thank you, I stand on my first post, I would wait another week at least 

check out the are they done link in my sig


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## bigt4172 (Aug 13, 2016)

Thank


RM3 said:


> Thank you, I stand on my first post, I would wait another week at least
> 
> check out the are they done link in my sig


thanks for the help, I have really bad vision and cant tell cloudy. amber etc


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Aug 13, 2016)

bigt4172 said:


> Would you harvest this plant based on the amber %? First time doing this any info would be great. This is a autoflower


no, i wouldn't harvest that plant yet, those both look like sugar leaf pics, get in there and get calyx pics. the trichs on sugar leaves will turn quicker than the ones on the buds, and even at that i'd wait, there doesn't look like there are that many on the leaves, really


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## bigt4172 (Aug 13, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> no, i wouldn't harvest that plant yet, those both look like sugar leaf pics, get in there and get calyx pics. the trichs on sugar leaves will turn quicker than the ones on the buds, and even at that i'd wait, there doesn't look like there are that many on the leaves, really


IDK what calyx even is?


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Aug 13, 2016)

the bud part of buds, calyxes form the mass of the bud, the pistils or hairs grow out of the calyxes, and the sugar leaves are the single bladed leaves that grow down among the calyxes


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## Reeves (Aug 31, 2016)

Day 49 flowering. What do you guys think. Usb microscope pics aren't the best. Seems the software won't let me change the resolution. How many days would you say I have left.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Aug 31, 2016)

looks like a good long time, only a very few brown trichs, and i'll bet they're on leaves, not on calyxes. another 3-4 weeks i'd say


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## Reeves (Aug 31, 2016)

You are absolutely correct. They were taken from leaves but from leaves as close as possible to the calyxes (pretty much touching). Not keen on cutting calyxes to check. I've used my usb microscope with an otg cable, but it's near impossible to hold the scope still longer enough to snap a clear pic. Hahaha

So now if I wait until my sweet leaves are 60/70% amber will that mean my flowers will be in their peak? Ready for the snips??


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Aug 31, 2016)

you dont have to cut anything , just look at the trichs on the surface of the buds, not the ones on the sugar leaves sticking out of the buds. while some would tell you to wait that long or close to it, my philosophy with most strains is about 10% amber/brown. they continue to mature for at least a week after you cut them, so if you cut at 10 %, by the time its dried and cured you're going to be at 15 to 20%, which seems prime to me.


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## BusterVAP (Sep 1, 2016)

And take note on everything like the smell the taste the high. This is what I did for my first and second harvest. It's really hard to not cut things down and be patient. So iam 8 days away from my deadline of 56 days 8 weeks. I have all milky trichomrs and almost no brown. And I thought well I've never really tested out cbd and thc. Which one I prefer more. I wasn't sure. So every two days until harvest iam cutting down one stalk and drying it. Making sure to keep track of the date so for this strain in the future I will know exactly when I want to harvest it for the high that I like


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## Stickyicky42O (Sep 2, 2016)

k0ijn said:


> If you see hardly any clear, mostly cloudy and a few amber it's a good time to harvest.
> You might be able to let your plants flower a few days to a week more or so, but I wouldn't let them flower more than that if you are seeing mostly cloudy a few amber.
> 
> You can leave some of the smaller leaves (sugar leaves) on the buds.
> ...


Thank you for the great info... I had a question... I'm going to be drying in spare room and wanted to know how I should set it up... I worry bout temp my house can get up in the 80s if I don't run the AC but if I do it's 77-79.. I was also thinking of adding a dehumidifier would that be ok... thank you


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Sep 2, 2016)

if you can get the temps into the mid to high 70s and the rh down under 60% you're good, keep a fan running in the room but not directly on the drying plants, depends on the size of the buds, usually takes 5-10 days for the initial drying


----------



## Stickyicky42O (Sep 2, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> if you can get the temps into the mid to high 70s and the rh down under 60% you're good, keep a fan running in the room but not directly on the drying plants, depends on the size of the buds, usually takes 5-10 days for the initial drying


Thanks bro


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## nyceone (Sep 3, 2016)

She's coming real nice #greenkingdom from #overgrowncanada #outdoor smells very nice can't wait to taste. How much longer u guys think she have


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## Stickyicky42O (Sep 4, 2016)

nyceone said:


> She's coming real nice #greenkingdom from #overgrowncanada #outdoor smells very nice can't wait to taste. How much longer u guys think she have


Looks happy.. u need to get a jewelers lop and check ur trichomes for signs of milky to amber trichomes.. I was told 50-70%


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## Stickyicky42O (Sep 5, 2016)

Reeves said:


> Day 49 flowering. What do you guys think. Usb microscope pics aren't the best. Seems the software won't let me change the resolution. How many days would you say I have left. View attachment 3769777 View attachment 3769292 View attachment 3769319View attachment 3769294 View attachment 3769297 View attachment 3769298 View attachment 3769301


Man u r Close


----------



## nyceone (Sep 6, 2016)

Stickyicky42O said:


> Looks happy.. u need to get a jewelers lop and check ur trichomes for signs of milky to amber trichomes.. I was told 50-70%


Thanks bro


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## Stickyicky42O (Sep 7, 2016)

nyceone said:


> Thanks bro


Anytime...


----------



## VTMi'kmaq (Sep 7, 2016)

bigt4172 said:


> IDK what calyx even is?


sometimes the best way to learn is from your own trial and error. every strain is diff. every smoker has their preferences in regards to trichs. Find what works best for you. ask questions man....it's a good way to learn


----------



## nathan white (Sep 13, 2016)

k0ijn said:


> Harvesting your weed based on trichomes is probably the easiest way for most growers to harvest as close to peak harvest as possible.
> 
> 
> The difficulty in the method comes with how to determine the state of the trichomes and what each state means.
> ...


----------



## nathan white (Sep 13, 2016)

Thanks for the real deal on a subject that I must of heard a thousand opinions on .i'm going to invest in a hundred power loupe tomorrow.peace.


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## eezycropper (Sep 15, 2016)

testiclees said:


> Ive never flushed on past grows but this time Ive got a plant going a little longer than i expected so I'm using it as an oppty to test out 2 weeks water only. I have zero experience with this strain so no real point of comparison. On the other hand I do find that there is a benefit to a period of dark before chop. I was very skeptical for a long while until Spurr over on TLG suggested I try it out.
> 
> This is 8ballKush day 55. 12.5 /11.5
> View attachment 3729575


looking good buddy!


----------



## eezycropper (Sep 15, 2016)

BusterVAP said:


> It's my very first grow


Looks nice matte!! congrats


----------



## Nugachino (Sep 21, 2016)

What about a 10x loupe? They any good.


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## nathan white (Sep 21, 2016)

I just chopped down some chem sis,I too just used water the last two weeks,this time I used some Blackstrap molasses during flush and the results were incredible! 1tsp.per gal.last 2weeks density,and yield increased and not to mentioned flavor! Not bad on pancakes either.peace


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## gwailo (Sep 22, 2016)

I'd like to get someone's opinion on my plant. I think she's getting close to harvest, but I don't have a good loupe to check trichomes. Breeder says harvest at the end of September.


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## twalte (Sep 22, 2016)

Nugachino said:


> What about a 10x loupe? They any good.


Not really...at a minimum a 30x loupe. 40x is even better like this one for less than $10.

https://www.amazon.com/Boruo-Illuminated-Quality-Optical-Magnifying/dp/B015MLQEDS/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1474558666&sr=8-5&keywords=40x+loupe

If you really want to geek out though, the 150+x zoom digital USB microscopes really make it more entertaining
.


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## 4nikator (Sep 22, 2016)

Just what I was looking for exactly. I was concerned that the pistils on my GSC are turning dark brown, withering and disintegrating, and wondering If It's o.k. to take the two tops of these plants and let the other lower branches mature longer.

So as long as the TRICHOMES are as you said, in the second picture, I should not worry about the pistils of the tops turning brown?


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## CriticalCheeze (Sep 22, 2016)

gwailo said:


> I'd like to get someone's opinion on my plant. I think she's getting close to harvest, but I don't have a good loupe to check trichomes. Breeder says harvest at the end of September.



you got a couple weeks. breeder info is under perfect. PERFECT conditions. example. breeder says 8 weeks it will most likely go 9 or possibly even 10


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## CriticalCheeze (Sep 26, 2016)

If it is ready it is ready man! Right on. Just can be hard to tell from just a picture  Good luck on the yield man, let us know how it turns out.


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## gwailo (Sep 26, 2016)

CriticalCheeze said:


> you got a couple weeks. breeder info is under perfect. PERFECT conditions. example. breeder says 8 weeks it will most likely go 9 or possibly even
> 
> Sorry I meant to post pics


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## CriticalCheeze (Sep 26, 2016)

Oh fuck yeah. she looks good man. You check some individual calyxs'? She sure does look ready to be whacked though.


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## gwailo (Sep 26, 2016)

CriticalCheeze said:


> Oh fuck yeah. she looks good man. You check some individual calyxs'? She sure does look ready to be whacked though.


I pulled a couple leaves from the top of the cola, right next to the flower.


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## twalte (Sep 26, 2016)

The trichs on my leaves turned amber weeks before my plant was ready...definitely check the trichs on the buds before you chop. The pistils didnt look ready yet in your earlier photo, and you can't judge on the leaves. Just my experience.


----------



## CriticalCheeze (Sep 26, 2016)

gwailo said:


> I pulled a couple leaves from the top of the cola, right next to the flower.



Yeah bud, your gonna wanna check some on the calyx itself. Leaves turn early 90% of the time like twalte said.


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## CriticalCheeze (Sep 26, 2016)

Thats a spot i just checked on my purple express. I go right in the middle of a cluster of calyxs' Almost inside the bud a bit


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## CriticalCheeze (Sep 26, 2016)

I think im getting pretty close myself lol.


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## gwailo (Sep 26, 2016)

I'm still trying to get used to this camera but this is a flower I snipped right off the top.


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## twalte (Sep 27, 2016)

gwailo said:


> I'm still trying to get used to this camera but this is a flower I snipped right off the top.


I still see a lot of clear...especially in that second photo. I don't think your harvest window has opened yet, but it's looking close.


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## CriticalCheeze (Sep 27, 2016)

twalte said:


> I still see a lot of clear...especially in that second photo. I don't think your harvest window has opened yet, but it's looking close.



I just looked over them again i do aswell see a few clears in the photo. He is getting close.


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## PungentPete (Sep 28, 2016)

One of my plants that I think could be close still has mostly white pistils with some curled back and turning color but some trichomes are already turning amber. The trichs say yes but the pistils say no. What should I do.? Don't want to wait to long for the pistils while the trichs are turning amber quickly. Suggestions please..


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## twalte (Sep 29, 2016)

PungentPete said:


> One of my plants that I think could be close still has mostly white pistils with some curled back and turning color but some trichomes are already turning amber. The trichs say yes but the pistils say no. What should I do.? Don't want to wait to long for the pistils while the trichs are turning amber quickly. Suggestions please..


Are you looking at the trichomes on the leaves or the buds? The trichomes on the leaves often change color earlier than the buds. If your pistils are still white, the trichomes are likely still clear on your buds.


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## PungentPete (Sep 29, 2016)

Thank you twalte i will look later and see if that is the case. Good call.


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## darkzero (Sep 29, 2016)

week 9 will be week 10 tomorrow been watching the trichomes for week was clear diamond 2 days ago first 2 crit + last sweet cheese what do u think


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## HazednConfused (Oct 10, 2016)

So according to this, as long as the majority of "older" trichomes are cloudy or amber, my plant is ready to harvest? Does my plant look ready? The trichs are all milky/cloudy, 50-70% hairs amber. The plant is 19 weeks since sprout, and 15 week flowering. Sativa dominant.


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## Vnsmkr (Oct 10, 2016)

I dont think any one is going to be able to tell anything from those pictures. Need bud closeups, all you can see is leaf


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## HazednConfused (Oct 10, 2016)

Vnsmkr said:


> I dont think any one is going to be able to tell anything from those pictures. Need bud closeups, all you can see is leaf


So I take it that the info that I have stated alone isn't enough to say yes or no to whether it is done or not? 100% Milky trichs+50%+ amber receded hairs? That sucks. I'll post some magnified pictures tonight though. Thanks man.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 11, 2016)

first off, look at trichs on calyxes, not on sugar leaves. the ones on leaves age faster than the ones on calyxes.
young trichs are clear, mature trichs are cloudy, over ripe trichs are amber/brown.
the plant is always producing new trichs, so you'll always have a small percentage of clears, no matter what stage you're looking at.
what you want is the smallest percentage of clear, a medium percentage of amber, and a high percentage of milky. exactly what ratio is right is really dependent on you, some say they get a better day time buzz with more cloudy and less amber, and more of a couch lock if they let the number of ambers go up.

it is hard to tell from the pics you posted, but they look pretty ready, most of the hairs look like they've receded, and it looks like you're starting to get a little foxtailing. i'd chop on the available evidence, but the trichs always tell the tale true


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## twalte (Oct 11, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> first off, look at trichs on calyxes, not on sugar leaves. the ones on leaves age faster than the ones on calyxes.
> young trichs are clear, mature trichs are cloudy, over ripe trichs are amber/brown.
> the plant is always producing new trichs, so you'll always have a small percentage of clears, no matter what stage you're looking at.
> what you want is the smallest percentage of clear, a medium percentage of amber, and a high percentage of milky. exactly what ratio is right is really dependent on you, some say they get a better day time buzz with more cloudy and less amber, and more of a couch lock if they let the number of ambers go up.
> ...


These photos may help you @HazednConfused


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## HazednConfused (Oct 11, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> first off, look at trichs on calyxes, not on sugar leaves. the ones on leaves age faster than the ones on calyxes.
> young trichs are clear, mature trichs are cloudy, over ripe trichs are amber/brown.
> the plant is always producing new trichs, so you'll always have a small percentage of clears, no matter what stage you're looking at.
> what you want is the smallest percentage of clear, a medium percentage of amber, and a high percentage of milky. exactly what ratio is right is really dependent on you, some say they get a better day time buzz with more cloudy and less amber, and more of a couch lock if they let the number of ambers go up.
> ...


Thanks for the info man. I'm on board with with checking the trichs, and I never look at the sugar leaf trichs because as you've stated, a lot of them are already amber and I didn't plan on smoking the leaves. I just needed to know if they "looked" ready to the naked eye."Then there is the overall look of the plant. Many experienced growers simply go by this factor, they can determine peak harvest just by looking at the plant and seeing how it looks from afar regarding colour tinge and the look of the calyxes." <<<This is what I'm looking for. An experienced grower who can look at it "from afar" and be able to tell me it's ready. I wish I had a way to take zoom pics. I'm glad you feel that they are about finished by the info I've given. Thanks again bro.


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## HazednConfused (Oct 11, 2016)

I'm hoping these pictures can help a little more. I can't take zoom pictures, but I did clip all sugar leaves to reveal the buds better. Thanks for any input, friends.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 11, 2016)

look done to me.


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## cannapharm (Oct 11, 2016)

HazednConfused said:


> I'm hoping these pictures can help a little more. I can't take zoom pictures, but I did clip all sugar leaves to reveal the buds better. Thanks for any input, friends.


No offense bro, but you cant tell shit from those photos. Need pictures of the actual tricomes...I can say "looks ready" but only a microscope can tell....


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 11, 2016)

i agree, but he obviously doesn't have a camera capable of taking trich pics. so, gotta work with what ya got


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## testiclees (Oct 11, 2016)

nathan white said:


> Thanks for the real deal on a subject that I must of heard a thousand opinions on .i'm going to invest in a hundred power loupe tomorrow.peace.


those cheap usb microscopes are super useful as well


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## HazednConfused (Oct 11, 2016)

cannapharm said:


> No offense bro, but you cant tell shit from those photos. Need pictures of the actual tricomes...I can say "looks ready" but only a microscope can tell....


Does the fact that all trichs are milky/cloudy and the majority of pistils are receded and amber mean anything? I thought if these two things were in check then they should be read? If I'm telling you what I see then what is it that you would be looking for in these "closeups" that I'm not givinng to you? Thanks for the repl!


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## HazednConfused (Oct 11, 2016)

testiclees said:


> those cheap usb microscopes are super useful as well
> 
> View attachment 3802722


I'll definitely check into getting one of those. I have a 60x mic from Amazon, but the sight hole is too small to get a good shot with my phone. Thanks for the heads up


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## testiclees (Oct 11, 2016)

HazednConfused said:


> I'll definitely check into getting one of those. I have a 60x mic from Amazon, but the sight hole is too small to get a good shot with my phone. Thanks for the heads up


i bought a real cheap one<$20. It's great but I'd def spend 2x as much to get better images.

If there was something really sharp for more $, even a lot more, id be really interested


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 11, 2016)

it very much depends n the strain you're growing and the conditions its been grown in how it looks at the end, some are very obvious about being ready, some look ready before they are, and some stay very fresh looking right to the end and can get over ripe on you if you don't look at the trichs. from the looks of the plant and you saying the trichs are all milky, i'd actually wait a few more days, i like to get 10 to 15% amber trichs before i harvest, but thats a personal preference, its ripe now, but ripe like a banana that still has a touch of green on the skin, i like to wait till it gets that first brown spot


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## HazednConfused (Oct 12, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> it very much depends n the strain you're growing and the conditions its been grown in how it looks at the end, some are very obvious about being ready, some look ready before they are, and some stay very fresh looking right to the end and can get over ripe on you if you don't look at the trichs. from the looks of the plant and you saying the trichs are all milky, i'd actually wait a few more days, i like to get 10 to 15% amber trichs before i harvest, but thats a personal preference, its ripe now, but ripe like a banana that still has a touch of green on the skin, i like to wait till it gets that first brown spot


Exactly what I wanted to know. I'll definitely wait longer and check the trichs daily. I really needed to chop it 2 weeks ago, but I couldn't find the nerve to actually ruin a harvest that has taken 4+ months to get to. I'm glad I didn't chop. Thanks again for the time and info bro. Appreciate it.


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## atrumblood (Oct 14, 2016)

I have read pretty much every post on this thread, but I am still not sure I trust my judgment. 

Would you guys say this is ready?

The trichomes appear to be mostly all cloudy.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 14, 2016)

it looks like at least one, maybe two of those are from leaves, you have to go with calyx (bud) pics.
leaf trichs age faster than bud trich, they can have a good bit of amber and your buds are barely cloudy.
it looks harvestable from what you show, but its just barely harvestable, check those bud trichs, you want at least 10% brown/amber, if you got that you're good, if not, i'd wait


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## atrumblood (Oct 14, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> it looks like at least one, maybe two of those are from leaves, you have to go with calyx (bud) pics.
> leaf trichs age faster than bud trich, they can have a good bit of amber and your buds are barely cloudy.
> it looks harvestable from what you show, but its just barely harvestable, check those bud trichs, you want at least 10% brown/amber, if you got that you're good, if not, i'd wait


The last pic was from a calyx. Also I should mention the the hairs (pistils) are still mostly white. Though they are starting to turn red/brown. With the little information I have given. Would you say one or two more weeks?


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 14, 2016)

two, maybe even three. let all the hairs recede, you probly still have a good swell coming, the buds will put on a lot of weight in the last two weeks. and look at bud trichs, try to get a good view from the side so you can see the heads clearly, when you start to see ambers on calyxes you're getting close, up to you when to call it then.


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## atrumblood (Oct 14, 2016)

Thank you for your help. I will try to get some better pics. It is hard to snap a good photo when the damn thing won't hold still.


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## atrumblood (Oct 17, 2016)

Starting to swell up like you said.


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## atrumblood (Oct 22, 2016)

Nearly there I think. I really need to get me a better microscope.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 22, 2016)

looks pretty close, use your discretion, its hard to say without being able to see it in person. if you look close theres hardly any amber/brown trichs, i think i'd wait till i saw a few more


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## atrumblood (Oct 23, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> looks pretty close, use your discretion, its hard to say without being able to see it in person. if you look close theres hardly any amber/brown trichs, i think i'd wait till i saw a few more


Awesome. Might just have some Halloween treats after all .

Thanks.

I'm sure I'll make another post before then. Someday I will have the confidence to judge it my self.


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## TripleMindedGee5150 (Nov 2, 2016)

What do you guys think ? It kinda has a brownish tinge to it to the naked eye. Medical quality or not


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Nov 2, 2016)

i'd smoke it


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## alwayshigh1 (Dec 6, 2016)

TripleMindedGee5150 said:


> View attachment 3821331 View attachment 3821332
> 
> What do you guys think ? It kinda has a brownish tinge to it to the naked eye. Medical quality or not


I have a amnesiac in flower, its ment to be grown for medical uses. What difference are you looking for? Trichs? Sorry newb here...


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## twalte (Dec 6, 2016)

alwayshigh1 said:


> I have a amnesiac in flower, its ment to be grown for medical uses. What difference are you looking for? Trichs? Sorry newb here...


We're looking at the trichomes for color changes.


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## alwayshigh1 (Dec 6, 2016)

Apo


twalte said:


> We're looking at the trichomes for color changes.


Apologies, I thought he was meaning there was a difference to look for in medical quality buds. Dam I need my scope to arive


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## haight (Dec 6, 2016)

Nice chart anyway


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## 420herbalist (Dec 26, 2016)

Have been able to get some decent pics of my trichs. (Nirvana BlackBerry) Nirvana says 9-11 week flower.

*Day 34 Flower*
 
 
 

*Day 42 *
 
 
 
*Day 48*


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## 420herbalist (Jan 3, 2017)

keeping it going. 
Day 55 Flower

Tip top
 
 

Little further down (different bud)
 
 

Little while longer..Every time I go down it seems like she sprouts new tufts of white hairs all over..


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## Huckster79 (Jan 3, 2017)

I heard it said for every plant harvested late 100,000 where taken early. Good job on waiting her out. I added a week to my gg4 and go approx 70 days for top harvest, madeva huge difference in quality. I grow flad boroad 
LSTed girls so this last time i took top layer off at 69 days, used to go 60 to 65. Dairing those ambers made a good difference. But anyway about trichs. Lower stuff looked "young" to naked eye, so we scoped Em: clear as a bell. Took another 4 weeks for them trichs to mature, and holy hell it went from popcorn bud hash bag quality to some of strongest herb iv ever smoked. Just anecdotal tail of why that trich maturity is what matters most.


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## SPLFreak808 (Jan 4, 2017)

420herbalist said:


> keeping it going.
> Day 55 Flower
> 
> Tip top
> ...


Damn dude nice pics, what camera have you been using?


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## 420herbalist (Jan 4, 2017)

Huckster79 said:


> I heard it said for every plant harvested late 100,000 where taken early. Good job on waiting her out. I added a week to my gg4 and go approx 70 days for top harvest, madeva huge difference in quality. I grow flad boroad
> LSTed girls so this last time i took top layer off at 69 days, used to go 60 to 65. Dairing those ambers made a good difference. But anyway about trichs. Lower stuff looked "young" to naked eye, so we scoped Em: clear as a bell. Took another 4 weeks for them trichs to mature, and holy hell it went from popcorn bud hash bag quality to some of strongest herb iv ever smoked. Just anecdotal tail of why that trich maturity is what matters most.


Thanks! I still see a lot of clear stems in there, so letting it go. The girl likes a sleep aid so if it goes a bit longer I don't think there will be any complaints  Also thanks for the second harvest info, trying to figure out how to pull it off.



SPLFreak808 said:


> Damn dude nice pics, what camera have you been using?


It's an older sony digital. I have a 200mm zoom with a conversion lens on it (60$) If you have a decent zoom lens you can get really close with a converter.


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## Huckster79 (Jan 4, 2017)

Yea search the threads theres ppl been doing it with more experience than me. At first after letting em go thought id wasted the 4 weeks, itbwas so bushy their werent any big colas to watch and it seemed like not much had changed. Once we started chopping i knew id made right call. Usually i do one big 3x5 or 6 girl and two smaller ones. Now im thinking if i did two full sized and staggered their time id have a perpetual harvest out of a small lil room...


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## mk3tokinwagin (Jan 8, 2017)

You guys think its time? This is my first grow, ever. Im close to harvest, i think. I would love your feedback!


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## danbridge (Jan 8, 2017)

Yes this method is known today as "triching" the bud. Thanks for posting this vital info.


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## mk3tokinwagin (Jan 9, 2017)

danbridge said:


> Yes this method is known today as "triching" the bud. Thanks for posting this vital info.


thanks for all the tips guys. I haven't needed to post any thing really, this forum has all the answers to all the questions i had up until this point.

Im on week 7, and after checking my buds, only a few look ready. so since this is my first grow, and from bagseed, I cut a few buds that had some milky trichs and i'll let the rest just go for another week or two.


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## hellmutt bones (Jan 10, 2017)

danbridge said:


> Yes this method is known today as "triching" the bud. Thanks for posting this vital info.


I think I just triched the bud now...


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## zypheruk (Jan 10, 2017)

jewelers loupe 30x or 60x stick it to the camera lens on your mobile phone and of you go.


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## hi ryder (Apr 18, 2017)

hi iv,e got a few auto lennons in full bloom right now and i,m realy looking forward to that euforic hi and so i was wondering if any one has any experiance with them or other jack herer crosses sative dominant i spose the trichromes are all very cloudy milky with a few bronzed over here and there as they are only 13 % thc i,m guessing the hi is in the cbd,s or the plant itself should i wait until i got loads of bronzed over ones or when it,s milky or just normal 20 30 %


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Apr 18, 2017)

i've always found the herrer high to be kind of light, i'd wait till i knew they were all as ripe as possible, to get the most out of it, let them get to about 10% amber/brown, then cut it


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## Danielson999 (May 7, 2017)

Thought I'd post a few trichome pics of a Pineapple Express 2 plant I have going right now. She's just about ready, just letting her fatten a bit more before I chop.


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## bullSnot (May 16, 2017)

under a hand held they look Milky - with this zOrb you cannot tell


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## Smellinsweet (May 18, 2017)

Lost Coast OG
Clone from a friend
Flowering for 63 days

Just wondering if this looks good enough to cut. This is a bottom bud, the top buds look about the same. Maybe more cloudy by a little. I know the pic isn't that good but all I have is my loop and a cell phone. 
Thanks for any advice.


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## bullSnot (May 19, 2017)

Smellinsweet said:


> Lost Coast OG
> Clone from a friend
> Flowering for 63 days
> 
> ...


I go with this rule of thumb when mostly Indica

_*If you are growing mostly Indica hybrids, it is better to harvest your plants when the resin glands are completely developed but not fully ripen – before they turn amber – unless you want to be glued to your sofa*_

What I do is wait till I see ALL CLOUDY/MILKY or just a couple (very few like one of 30 trichomes) amber - then chop.


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## haight (May 19, 2017)

Smellinsweet said:


> Lost Coast OG
> Clone from a friend
> Flowering for 63 days
> 
> ...


63 days huh? Maybe invest in a more/ better light. I like to wait until there are a few dark amber ones. If you cut while cloudy there almost certainly will be a lot that ain't cloudy at all. By the time they start turning yellow then amber then most all the others are cloudy and ready to cure. I didn't see any yellowing let alone amber.


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## Smellinsweet (May 19, 2017)

haight said:


> 63 days huh? Maybe invest in a more/ better light. I like to wait until there are a few dark amber ones. If you cut while cloudy there almost certainly will be a lot that ain't cloudy at all. By the time they start turning yellow then amber then most all the others are cloudy and ready to cure. I didn't see any yellowing let alone amber.


Do you mean invest in more lighting in the room? I have 9x 1000 hps in 8" vented hoods and a rather small area. Or did you mean better lighting for pics? Sorry just confused.


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## bullSnot (May 20, 2017)

Smellinsweet said:


> Do you mean invest in more lighting in the room? I have 9x 1000 hps in 8" vented hoods and a rather small area. Or did you mean better lighting for pics? Sorry just confused.
> View attachment 3945779


Holy solar radiation batman. That is a lot of light, heat and electricity in a small room. Make sure you wear some sunscreen before entering


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## Igaroutt (May 21, 2017)

First time grower and I'm not sure if it's early or not, should I be harvesting this?


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## bullSnot (May 21, 2017)

This is what I go by
https://www.alchimiaweb.com/blogen/harvest-marijuana-plants-trichome-ripeness/


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## Budley Doright (May 21, 2017)

Igaroutt said:


> First time grower and I'm not sure if it's early or not, should I be harvesting this?


Got a whole bud pic? Looking close


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## haight (May 21, 2017)

Smellinsweet said:


> Do you mean invest in more lighting in the room? I have 9x 1000 hps in 8" vented hoods and a rather small area. Or did you mean better lighting for pics? Sorry just confused.


Well you certainly appear to be light 'rich'. Not sure why after 9 weeks you're not showing any color.


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## haight (May 21, 2017)

bullSnot said:


> This is what I go by
> https://www.alchimiaweb.com/blogen/harvest-marijuana-plants-trichome-ripeness/


Good site but 30% amber seems excessive alough I've never waited that long. This page is more to my liking:
https://www.alchimiaweb.com/blogen/harvest-marijuana-plants/


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## OZAK47 (May 23, 2017)

She's going on week 6, Neville haze from female seeds 8 weeks breed.


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## OZAK47 (May 23, 2017)

Better view


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## Budley Doright (May 23, 2017)

Very nice!!!


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## SuperChef (May 28, 2017)

7 weeks in now with WWxBB (#1-2) Lemon Kush (#3) and Fruit Punch (#4). What is everyone's guess on the harvest time?


----------



## haight (May 28, 2017)

SuperChef said:


> 7 weeks in now with WWxBB (#1-2) Lemon Kush (#3) and Fruit Punch (#4). What is everyone's guess on the harvest time?
> 
> A week or two.


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## Budley Doright (May 28, 2017)

SuperChef said:


> 7 weeks in now with WWxBB (#1-2) Lemon Kush (#3) and Fruit Punch (#4). What is everyone's guess on the harvest time?
> 
> View attachment 3950487 View attachment 3950488 View attachment 3950490 View attachment 3950489


Also very nice and yes I would say a good chunk of two weeks.


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## BillyBlanks420 (May 29, 2017)

Hello Roll it up Crew,
Was hoping you guys could give me an opinion on the stage of these trichomes. It is a Indica dominant hyrbid 58 days into Flower. Is it ready for harvest?


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## bullSnot (May 29, 2017)

I can't tell from any of tnese pictures...they are not magnified enough.


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## BillyBlanks420 (May 29, 2017)

Damn ok I'll try n get a pic with the loupe in front of it


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## SuperChef (May 29, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> Also very nice and yes I would say a good chunk of two weeks.


Right on, they'll get another good two weeks before chopping. Hoping they'll bulk up a bit more. Thanks for the props back to it after a few years and first time with organics as well.


----------



## ThatSpudGuy (Jun 3, 2017)

Hey guys.

Currently on day 35 of flower of a 60 day strain. Just curious to see if anyone thinks my girls will get any bigger caz at the moment they dont look near as big as my last 2 grows buds. Still have to add my pk13/14 for a week. 600watt dual spectrum hps. 50/50 coco/perlite




View attachment 3953991View attachment 3953995View attachment 3953996


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## Budley Doright (Jun 3, 2017)

^^^^^ Yes they will get bigger I would think.


----------



## ThatSpudGuy (Jun 3, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> ^^^^^ Yes they will get bigger I would think.


Thanks mate


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## applepoop1984 (Jun 8, 2017)

haight said:


> Well you certainly appear to be light 'rich'. Not sure why after 9 weeks you're not showing any color.


if temps are too high during dark period no color will develop. typically 70 degrees f and below causes the production of anthocyans


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## Budley Doright (Jun 8, 2017)

applepoop1984 said:


> if temps are too high during dark period no color will develop. typically 70 degrees f and below causes the production of anthocyans


Their talking about trichomes I think


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## 024deeweed420 (Jun 24, 2017)

What do people think, close? From a black diesel auto grown under cobs in coco. These are super closeups of the calyxes , which are quite big and fat almost 1cm high each calyx. Sigar leaves are cooooaaated in trichs as well, like snow.


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## 024deeweed420 (Jun 24, 2017)

Just to give an idea of the plant , this was taken 15 days ago, buds are quite hidden Under a lot if leaf.


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## Budley Doright (Jun 24, 2017)

Auto's tend to be leafy in my experience


----------



## 024deeweed420 (Jun 24, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> Auto's tend to be leafy in my experience


Thats good to know, thanks. But how close to harvest donyou think it is by the trichomes color?


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## Budley Doright (Jun 24, 2017)

024deeweed420 said:


> Thats good to know, thanks. But how close to harvest donyou think it is by the trichomes color?


I never wait for amber unlike a lot, my thoughts differ lol. I pull mine when they stop growing and eating, if those were mine I would be trimming but again I differ from most here. I'm in hydro so easy to tell when water intake slows, I start watching triches and pistils then


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## 024deeweed420 (Jun 24, 2017)

Thanks Budley, Im hydro but using drain to waste in coco so I cant tell if it needs less water so u are saying pull em now yeah.Anyone else have an opinion?


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## Budley Doright (Jun 24, 2017)

024deeweed420 said:


> Thanks Budley, Im hydro but using drain to waste in coco so I cant tell if it needs less water so u are saying pull em now yeah.Anyone else have an opinion?


LOL I'm saying I would start thinking about it . I'm typically running out to so that plays a roll lol.


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## 024deeweed420 (Jun 24, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> LOL I'm saying I would start thinking about it . I'm typically running out to so that plays a roll lol.


I seem to always have some weed laying around so i am in no hurry, want to pick it just right.


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## Budley Doright (Jun 25, 2017)

024deeweed420 said:


> I seem to always have some weed laying around so i am in no hurry, want to pick it just right.


I would say your real close .


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## stawawager (Aug 16, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> I never wait for amber unlike a lot, my thoughts differ lol. I pull mine when they stop growing and eating, if those were mine I would be trimming but again I differ from most here. I'm in hydro so easy to tell when water intake slows, I start watching triches and pistils then


Teaches take a ling


CatatonicChronic said:


> So how about this for a thought, not trying to hyjack a thread or anything but was very much enjoying this one. My thought I think will turn into a conversation so don't take offense. I have grown for a few years now. I have been only growing bag seed for I've saved a lot of seeds and stems throughout my youth up till now for some reason or another(also I've saved most of my beer bottle caps and the figure 8 on cans, don't know what they're called), and have them seperated in good sacks in which they were rare finds in $45-$65 eighths, then I had a good sack from mostly swag, reggies, mexican weed, etc., that I noticed was nice and different with good highs, and then all the rest in a big bag of all mexican weed bag seed. Throughout growing these I've had some killer success and have gotten quite a few different kinda plants that were just awesome. No matter what, what I've produced is definately incredibly better than any thing from Mexico. I just recently harvested one of my ladies that grew really skinny jagged leaves, it grew tall and thin, not bushy at all and had the most mesmorizing smell. I wish I would of cloned her but I seem to suck at cloning. So before I cut her down I would look at the trichs and I would see almost all clear and some that were kinda cloudy but not like milky. Then almost in no time she went from clear to pinks and ambers, there was no crazy amounts stress or anything, but it seemed to skip the cloudy faze and turned different hues of pinkish amber to dark amber. The trichs are still like 50% clearish and kinda cloudy, about 15% pinkish and the rest amber. My topic is that trichomes of different strains look different, and probably are meant to be picked at different times. For instance, are sativas supposed to be harvested with more clear/cloudy cause I've heard that amber can ruin a good heady high, or is it a compliment? Also are Indicas supposed to be harvested late to produce zombie weed, I've heard that naturally they produce more cannabinoids than Sativas. What exactly is ripe bud, does it differ per strain? If you want a pain killing smoke or a "high" smoke. Also I've heard and noticed that either you feel that thc is the pure and the only sought after thing in mary, and your understanding of the transition of cloudy trichs to amber is degradation of thc. While the others make the case that there are cannabinoids in mary and it needs to equal parts for peak high, or mostly one way or the other and they mostly view amber trichs as the aging of thc, not degradation. What do you all think is the best combo of trichs are and what are the best other indicators other than trichs to determine bud ripeness? Personally I think the swell and the nutrition leaving the plant, when the fan leaves are all yellow and burnt your bud is getting there if not done. I find after you think your plant looks pretty bad, try to get another 2 or 3 waterings in with unfiltered honey or molases or both, this gives the plant a bit of energy and b vitamins to get its give just a bit more work to those buds. I then take the plants out after its last watering day's night cycle and put it in a seperate dark room for 2 days with no light. I've tried drowning her right after this dark period and I've also tried scouring hot water for the roots as a shock treatment, I haven't noticed if it helped either way with nothing to compare it to. Also, the white hairs or the plant, you have to watch and make sure you really see whats going on. The buds stretch and grow new pistols in different parts of the floweing stage. They will grow all these new white pistols after a stretch and you may not think the buds are ready because of this but they may have been ready before the stretch and now you will let the trichs go to amber because you are only watching the hairs. Okay your thoughts???


Do the trichomes change to Amber pretty much all at once? Thanks.


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## haight (Aug 16, 2017)

stawawager said:


> Teaches take a ling
> 
> Do the trichomes change to Amber pretty much all at once? Thanks.


No. They change gradually over a week or more. Depending on a million things including where they are on the plant and even the flower.


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## Budley Doright (Aug 16, 2017)

*"Teaches take a ling"*
Not sure what you mean? And yup gradual and sometimes never lol.


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## stawawager (Aug 17, 2017)

haight said:


> No. They change gradually over a week or more. Depending on a million things including where they are on the plant and even the flower.


Wow. Thanks. So, you could harvest some now and let the rest keep ripening.

I must admit that it's been pretty difficult even seeing the little suckers. Let alone when they turn Amber. 

I'm thinking about increasing their dark period, maybe that'll stimulate them.


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## stawawager (Aug 17, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> *"Teaches take a ling"*
> Not sure what you mean? And yup gradual and sometimes never lol.


Sorry for the idiot grammar.

Should read: "trichomes take a long time" to turn amber.

Last time, I started seeing some seeds, freaked out and whacked them, I didn't have any (unseen) pollen anywhere.

So, they stop consuming as much water at the end of their life cycle. Make sense. Thanks.


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## stawawager (Aug 17, 2017)

haight said:


> No. They change gradually over a week or more. Depending on a million things including where they are on the plant and even the flower.


I imagine the tops mature sooner and others getting full light. I wish the trichomes were easier to see! 

When they turn Amber are they opaque? Thanks.


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## haight (Aug 17, 2017)

stawawager said:


> I imagine the tops mature sooner and others getting full light. I wish the trichomes were easier to see!
> 
> When they turn Amber are they opaque? Thanks.


 No but certainly darker than the clear. And it doesn't necessarily mean the tops get amber first. The lower part is little older than the newer growth on the tops. Personally, when I see about 10% amber I harvest. No matter where the concentration of amber is.


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## stawawager (Aug 17, 2017)

haight said:


> No but certainly darker than the clear. And it doesn't necessarily mean the tops get amber first. The lower part is little older than the newer growth on the tops. Personally, when I see about 10% amber I harvest. No matter where the concentration of amber is.


Thanks, so interesting. You guys save me from more screw-ups, and I've had several screw-ups but I'm finally starting to get proficient. Seems like there's something always to improve upon!


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## Budley Doright (Aug 17, 2017)

There are a couple of different shades of amber but the clear amber and sometimes purple that can appear early are not the same as cloudy amber signaling the end. The early clear amber is elusive but typically something special .


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## stawawager (Aug 21, 2017)

Today is the beginning of harvest day! Time to get my handy / dandy drying cart out.


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## Nugachino (Aug 21, 2017)

I still got about couple months to go. Staggered harvest. 3 plants. One mystery mother on second round. A Pineapple Chunk. And Mystery Mother's first clone when ready.


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## Kush Dreamz (Aug 24, 2017)

Hey everyone first timer here with a Auto Northern Lights strain, pics taken are at 43 days into flowering. Had to pick a nug due to bud rot setting in. I'd love some expert advice on how my girl looks and how much longer you think she has? I dont have a hand scope yet to check my trichs - ive been using a cell camera for close-ups. Any advice or help is very much appreciated.


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## stawawager (Aug 24, 2017)

Kush Dreamz said:


> Hey everyone first timer here with a Auto Northern Lights strain, pics taken are at 43 days into flowering. Had to pick a nug due to bud rot setting in. I'd love some expert advice on how my girl looks and how much longer you think she has? I dont have a hand scope yet to check my trichs - ive been using a cell camera for close-ups. Any advice or help is very much appreciated.
> View attachment 3999640 View attachment 3999642


Is the rot, the dark edges? What's your humidity running at?


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## Budley Doright (Aug 24, 2017)

Keep an eye on the rot and pull a couple of buds away from the stalk and have a look, she can go longer IMO but you could take it if needed at any time. What is the total time from seed? I typically have them finish at 10 weeks from seed. I grew Nl auto and lost a bit to rot as well .


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## Kush Dreamz (Aug 24, 2017)

@stawawager 
No, im not sure what the dark edges are since i'm a first timer but ill get there. I noticed the rot on the inside of the bud while doing some inspecting so I pulled it off of the stalk itself. And as for humidity, I have no clue sorry. This is an outside grow.

@Budley Doright 
Tomorrow 8/25/2017 will make 16 weeks since sprout. 
And total time since flowering is 6 weeks so far.
My NL went through quite a bit of stress in the beginning idk if that resulted in a stunted growth or lower yield. If you guys would like any more info on the NL feel free to ask and ill provide any information at the best of my knowldge and id also like to say thx again in advance for taking the time to help a newb out.


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## Budley Doright (Aug 24, 2017)

Kush Dreamz said:


> @stawawager
> No, im not sure what the dark edges are since i'm a first timer but ill get there. I noticed the rot on the inside of the bud while doing some inspecting so I pulled it off of the stalk itself. And as for humidity, I have no clue sorry. This is an outside grow.
> 
> @Budley Doright
> ...


16 weeks??? That seems like a long time for an auto. Who's the breader? And nope not bud rot in the leaves. Every one of the plants I grew developed rot. I just finished up a auto blue mazar grow that is pretty good for an outdoor auto grow. It takes a lot for me to be impressed and I was impressed, again "for an auto" lol.


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## Kush Dreamz (Aug 24, 2017)

yea anywhere from 14-16 weeks, i know it seems like a long time but at the beginning of the grow she was only getting like 2-3 hours of sunlight which i know is not good at all. Thats why i mentioned she's been put through alot of stress in her life time and im not sure if that resulted in a stunted growth. But as you said you would give it a bit more time so ill take that advice into consideration. Im pretty sure the breeder is Pyramid seeds if thats what you mean.


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## Kush Dreamz (Aug 24, 2017)

Here's a better look at what Im working with, she's very small compared to many of the grows out there. First time grow.


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## MuckyDucky (Aug 29, 2017)

Do these look ripe for harvest? I really need to flush for a few more days.


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## RobBush (Sep 16, 2017)

k0ijn said:


> If you see hardly any clear, mostly cloudy and a few amber it's a good time to harvest.
> You might be able to let your plants flower a few days to a week more or so, but I wouldn't let them flower more than that if you are seeing mostly cloudy a few amber.
> 
> You can leave some of the smaller leaves (sugar leaves) on the buds.
> ...


I am in a very dry climate, I don't see my drying period lasting more than 5 days max. How important is slowly drying them and how can I prolong that period? I feel like having a humidifier is counterproductive


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## SPLFreak808 (Sep 16, 2017)

RobBush said:


> I am in a very dry climate, I don't see my drying period lasting more than 5 days max. How important is slowly drying them and how can I prolong that period? I feel like having a humidifier is counterproductive


Try hanging the whole plant & keeping temps low?

Drying and curing ime, is just as important to the end result as the entire grow.


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## bullSnot (Sep 16, 2017)

SPLFreak808 said:


> Try hanging the whole plant & keeping temps low?
> 
> Drying and curing ime, is just as important to the end result as the entire grow.


yup the more stem you hang with it the longer the drying period.


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## HazednConfused (Sep 21, 2017)

*Ready?*


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## SPLFreak808 (Sep 21, 2017)

I'd wait a week or two before any further judgment, what is it? @HazednConfused

you may have also had it too close to your bulb,hard to tell... Nice


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## HazednConfused (Sep 21, 2017)

SPLFreak808 said:


> I'd wait a week or two before any further judgment, what is it? @HazednConfused
> 
> you may have also had it too close to your bulb,hard to tell... Nice


A double dream clone, day 54; it's said to be a 56 day strain.
Yeah, man my cobs are like 6" from my tops. 
I cant move them up any further, height is already maxed out in my cab. I guess they're too intense at 200watts.
I'll probably dim to 150 watts or less next run, and scrog my box out super low.
Thanks bro.


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## bullSnot (Sep 22, 2017)

Depends what you prefer - cannot be sure unless you scope the tri's. I would think once the purple that is showing on the top cola starts a bit lower, you will be around peak T


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## SPLFreak808 (Sep 22, 2017)

HazednConfused said:


> A double dream clone, day 54; it's said to be a 56 day strain.
> Yeah, man my cobs are like 6" from my tops.
> I cant move them up any further, height is already maxed out in my cab. I guess they're too intense at 200watts.
> I'll probably dim to 150 watts or less next run, and scrog my box out super low.
> Thanks bro.


You could attempt training the plant and running the same power level, for a 200watt draw thats not bad at all for a single dom cola plant.

Did you build the panel or buy it?

While I've never ran double dream yet that one looks pretty good, looks like the fruity/sweet stuff i like to run lol, i save all that for myself lmao..

It's finishing up, shouldn't be long from here. I second the scope that bullsnot talked about, especially if your going to run that pheno again.


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## HazednConfused (Sep 22, 2017)

SPLFreak808 said:


> You could attempt training the plant and running the same power level, for a 200watt draw thats not bad at all for a single dom cola plant.
> 
> Did you build the panel or buy it?
> 
> ...


That's good to know that's it's not too powerful; I'm assuming my PAR at my tops level is pretty good, lol.
I built the panel with 4 CXM22s, a 240 54b meanwell, and a dimmer.
Bro, it's definitely that! I've been telling myself that this is my private reserve bud, since I'm not going to pull a whole lot off of the plant and it's fruity/sticky as hell. 
Yeah, thanks for the rec on the trich check. I have a 60x mini scope that I've been using. There's definitely a bunch of cloudy trichs with amber ones scattered in there, on the cola area. They get less cloudy and amber as you go down the plant. 
No way am I cutting this girl early, lol. A week or two more is fine with me. 
Thanks again bro.


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## Daiw1987 (Oct 2, 2017)

Hey guys can anyone tell me by this this picture does this look like it might/might not be done? Its the best photo I could take. Thanks


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## Budzbuddha (Oct 2, 2017)

Daiw1987 said:


> Hey guys can anyone tell me by this this picture does this look like it might/might not be done? Its the best photo I could take. Thanks


Looks like there are weeks to go ....


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 3, 2017)

long way, all white pistils, no reddish tinge to the trichs,


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## HazednConfused (Oct 4, 2017)

HazednConfused said:


> *Ready?*
> View attachment 4014419 View attachment 4014421 View attachment 4014423


Day 60 chopped
80% cloudy/10% clear/10% amber trichs
10 grams/ second part of the 25 grams(dried) from this plant
Curing
Straight


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## Fornfrussen (Oct 18, 2017)

Having a hard time deciding if this Ghost Train Haze is done. Day 85 from flip, what do you guys think?


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## yosim (Oct 20, 2017)

MuckyDucky said:


> Do these look ripe for harvest? I really need to flush for a few more days. View attachment 4001974 View attachment 4001977 View attachment 4001978


hi, was wondering what you used to take this pic? really easy to see a lot of the trichomes in the same shot, thanks


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 20, 2017)

i think i'd give it another week to ten days


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## MuckyDucky (Oct 21, 2017)

yosim said:


> hi, was wondering what you used to take this pic? really easy to see a lot of the trichomes in the same shot, thanks


Whenever a lens is used extremely close the depth of field(in focus part) of the photo is very thin. Think of only the thickness of a sheet of paper as being in focus. I used a Nikon dslr, a 90 mm macro lens, at least 40 photos taken at different focus depths and Zerene focus stacking software. Zerene combined the infocus part of each photo to produce the photo. Maybe someday we will have a tiny little camera that will take a closeup photo like this in one quick click but sadly not today.


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## yosim (Oct 21, 2017)

MuckyDucky said:


> Whenever a lens is used extremely close the depth of field(in focus part) of the photo is very thin. Think of only the thickness of a sheet of paper as being in focus. I used a Nikon dslr, a 90 mm macro lens, at least 40 photos taken at different focus depths and Zerene focus stacking software. Zerene combined the infocus part of each photo to produce the photo. Maybe someday we will have a tiny little camera that will take a closeup photo like this in one quick click but sadly not today.


thanks for the info


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## JesusFreakier (Oct 22, 2017)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> i think i'd give it another week to ten days


Hey Ya'll, 
Can anyone tell me what concentration H2O2 / Water solution to dip trimmed buds into, to kill possible mold spores, before dipping into rinse water? High pressure shower spray no longer an option within a week to harvest, where that pressure can break off Tric' mushroom heads.

Please advise.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 22, 2017)

nope, never felt the need to do that, so no idea


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## -DreamK (Oct 29, 2017)

Im at the end of flowering and trichomes are around 0-15% amber. I would like to destroy the THC (only with 1 plant or 1/2 plant) cause I can't stand high THC strains anymore. I know people will say that "You should pick low THC strain from the get go..." and I have done it. I have a CBD strains also that is ready in few weeks but it would be nice to get as much CBN as possible from those THC strains.

Is there any negative effects if I let my girls flower for let's say 4 more weeks to get more CBN? What should I take in consideration when doing something like this? This is my first time trying to harvest as much CBN as possible so I have no idea whats going to happen in the next couple of weeks.

Im already flushing the plants (have been the last 7-10 days). Is this a mistake?

I really appreciate all tips from you guys.

Ps. I bought this Japanese microscope from 70's-80's for 10€ (9USD) and it's fucking amazing. I tried 2 different modern pocket micros before this and you can't even compare these two. If you are after a good microscope you should check these old ones from a second hand store.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 29, 2017)

i don't know what to tell you, i've never done that, i always understood that cbd and cbn are different things, and that there wasn't much value to cbn.
i understand thats not necessarilly true, but all i really know about it is that it comes from thc breaking down, so i guess if you want more of it, let them go a while, the more amber trichs you see, the more cbn you're going to get


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## -DreamK (Oct 29, 2017)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> i don't know what to tell you, i've never done that, i always understood that cbd and cbn are different things, and that there wasn't much value to cbn.
> i understand thats not necessarilly true, but all i really know about it is that it comes from thc breaking down, so i guess if you want more of it, let them go a while, the more amber trichs you see, the more cbn you're going to get


CBD and CBN are definitely different things but also little same. CBD in my opinion just calms you down and counteracts THC a little. I heard that 5mg of CBN is as strong as 10mg Diazepam so you could imagine that it would also counteract thc, make the high little bit mellower and less trippy. 

It really sucks that THC makes me anxious now days and I have to play with this stuff but theres nothing I can do. I have an addictive personality and think weed is the wisest choice if you "need" to consume some shit everyday...


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## MuckyDucky (Nov 2, 2017)

-DreamK said:


> CBD and CBN are definitely different things but also little same. CBD in my opinion just calms you down and counteracts THC a little. I heard that 5mg of CBN is as strong as 10mg Diazepam so you could imagine that it would also counteract thc, make the high little bit mellower and less trippy.
> 
> It really sucks that THC makes me anxious now days and I have to play with this stuff but theres nothing I can do. I have an addictive personality and think weed is the wisest choice if you "need" to consume some shit everyday...


Age and light will degrade it getting rid of more of that nasty thc. You could also vape the thc off. Get a good vape like an ExtremeQ, invite some people over and save all of their leftover vape poooo...

Also, I found you can't store thc in a vape balloon very long or it it looses its kick. Maybe balloon vape stored in a balloon for a few hours first would give you what you are looking for.


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## Aero guy (Nov 4, 2017)

On week 8. How long do you think she needs to go?


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Nov 4, 2017)

at least 2 or 3 more weeks, too many white pistils, and i like to see the trichs on the leaves start to get a reddish tinge, means the ones on calyxes are getting close


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## Aero guy (Nov 4, 2017)

I was thinking 3 weeks. Maybe 4.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Nov 4, 2017)

nice lookin plant


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## Aero guy (Nov 4, 2017)

Thanks. Mosca pink lemonade.


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## Mass Medicinals (Nov 4, 2017)

Super Hash Plant Day 50. Thoughts?


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## Mass Medicinals (Nov 4, 2017)

Super Silver Haze - Day 50. Again thoughts


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Nov 5, 2017)

both lookin pretty good, keep on doin what yer doin


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## Mass Medicinals (Nov 5, 2017)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> both lookin pretty good, keep on doin what yer doin


So possibly many weeks each?


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Nov 5, 2017)

they both look pretty well along, but i'd say at least two weeks, maybe three for the hash plant. a few too many fresh looking pistils, don't like they're quite tight enough


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## Mass Medicinals (Nov 6, 2017)

Thanks for the feedback. We'll check back in 2 weeks then. About how long should the flush take place?

We have one other grow in a separate tent. Wanted to also get opinions on this one: https://www.rollitup.org/t/would-these-be-close-northern-lights.952726/


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## -DreamK (Nov 6, 2017)

Mass Medicinals said:


> Thanks for the feedback. We'll check back in 2 weeks then. About how long should the flush take place?
> 
> We have one other grow in a separate tent. Wanted to also get opinions on this one: https://www.rollitup.org/t/would-these-be-close-northern-lights.952726/


I recommend to flush at last 2 weeks. 1 week might not be enough... It doesn't harm your yields don't worry.


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## Mass Medicinals (Nov 6, 2017)

-DreamK said:


> I recommend to flush at last 2 weeks. 1 week might not be enough... It doesn't harm your yields don't worry.


Thanks. When we get a little closer, we will begin feeding with just water that has been pH'd to 6.0. Any feelings about elongated dark cycle before chopping? Is that real or just a myth?


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Nov 6, 2017)

Mass Medicinals said:


> Thanks for the feedback. We'll check back in 2 weeks then. About how long should the flush take place?
> 
> We have one other grow in a separate tent. Wanted to also get opinions on this one: https://www.rollitup.org/t/would-these-be-close-northern-lights.952726/


i would say those are damn close as well, you can cut now if you want a little more cerebral high, if you wait another week, you should get a good relaxing physical high


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Nov 6, 2017)

a lot of people have tried the prolonged period of darkness before chop, the general consensus is that it doesn't really make much of a difference.
i myself am not a proponent of flushing. i won't go off on a long diatribe (which i have been known to do), i'll just say that if you do your own research into flushing, you will see that it is a myth, that does nothing its supposed to do. nothing.


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## -DreamK (Nov 6, 2017)

Mass Medicinals said:


> Thanks. When we get a little closer, we will begin feeding with just water that has been pH'd to 6.0. Any feelings about elongated dark cycle before chopping? Is that real or just a myth?


Just forget elongated dark cycles. 

Maybe you flush few plants so you can compare the results? 

I like flushing and I can tell the difference. I can tell the difference even though I use 100% organic soil and nutes (Maybe this doesn't make a difference so please don't attack me because this statement). Also there is no harm done by flushing so why not? (I don't know about hydro/aero grows)? You only save some nutrients for next grow. I have been flushing for 3-4 weeks few times and there was no difference in yield. Your soil and plants can hold a lot of these needed nutrients.


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## Mass Medicinals (Nov 6, 2017)

Hi quick note. That wasn't to bait anyone into a long discussion. We appreciate the rapid feedback and will read up on the other subjects further.

Appreciate the feedback on our plants, and thoughts on flushing and dark period. Period.


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## kristoffolese (Nov 8, 2017)

panhead said:


> One bit of additional info,you mentioned being at 60 days flower,when did you start the day count ?
> 
> If you started counting as soon as you went 12/12 then you skipped a step,all strains have a transition period where the plants metabolism switches gears from veg to bud phase,this is also when the plants will stretch out,you shouldnt start a day count until the plants fully transition from veg to bud.
> 
> ...


hmmm... either iv had strains finish in 28 to 35 days... or you are grossly incorrect. 42-49 days from initiating 12/12, my skunk #1 was ready to chop. So youre trying to tell us that the actual flowering time of my skunk #1 grows, were 28-42 days? You dont know what youre talking about, man. When seed companies give estimated flowering times, they are referring to the number of days/weeks between initiating 12/12, and harvest. If u were correct, itd take 63-70 days from initiating 12/12, to finish an 8week strain. Yet, the 8 week strains I run, always finish in 55 days, give or take a few days.So any nubes out there, ignore what homeboy is saying. There IS a transitional period between veg and flower, but is included in most seed co's flowering period. An 8 week strain should finish around 56 days after initiating 12/12


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Nov 8, 2017)

i actually don't count flowering days till i see actual buds, got to be masses of white hairs, not just one here and there
as far as the breeders estimates, i don't even pay attention to those, i've never had one be even close to accurate. some finish quite a bit sooner, some a whole lot later, you can never tell till you're growing one what its going to do


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## Aero guy (Nov 9, 2017)

I agree with Roger on this one. Usually 7-14 days in pre-flower before the countdown starts.

If seed companies added this it would make the advertised flower time longer. Shorter flower = more sales.


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## CanadianDank (Nov 19, 2017)

I personally read the first 20 pages of this thread and it was great.
K0ijn is a smart grower and has many many times dispelled the myth of flushing.



Mass Medicinals said:


> Hi quick note. That wasn't to bait anyone into a long discussion. We appreciate the rapid feedback and will read up on the other subjects further.
> 
> Appreciate the feedback on our plants, and thoughts on flushing and dark period. Period.





-DreamK said:


> Just forget elongated dark cycles.
> 
> Maybe you flush few plants so you can compare the results?
> 
> I like flushing and I can tell the difference. I can tell the difference even though I use 100% organic soil and nutes (Maybe this doesn't make a difference so please don't attack me because this statement). Also there is no harm done by flushing so why not? (I don't know about hydro/aero grows)? You only save some nutrients for next grow. I have been flushing for 3-4 weeks few times and there was no difference in yield. Your soil and plants can hold a lot of these needed nutrients.


The plants store their nutrients in the roots and leaves and move them around with the stems.

Nutrients are not stored in the calyces, they are simply used by them.

All you need is a gradual reduction in your feeding schedule leading up to harvest, maybe one or two of final waterings could be plain water. But don't stress your plants by flushing unless you have nutrient or ph problems in your medium.

Peace.


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## CanadianDank (Nov 19, 2017)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> i actually don't count flowering days till i see actual buds, got to be masses of white hairs, not just one here and there
> as far as the breeders estimates, i don't even pay attention to those, i've never had one be even close to accurate. some finish quite a bit sooner, some a whole lot later, you can never tell till you're growing one what its going to do


Same, usually around ten days after flip.


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## dnt420 (Jan 14, 2018)

help on harvest time ? is my first time, not feeling is her time yet

more pic here: https://www.rollitup.org/t/surge-la-weeda-unknown-strain-white-widow.955513/#post-14009489


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jan 14, 2018)

i think you got at least a month yet, looks like it may be getting ready to do its swell, no reddish tinge to the leaf trichs, still too many white pistils.
looks good


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## Unit Farm System Supply (Jan 18, 2018)

dnt420 said:


> help on harvest time ? is my first time, not feeling is her time yet
> 
> more pic here: https://www.rollitup.org/t/surge-la-weeda-unknown-strain-white-widow.955513/#post-14009489


Looks really nice!!  if you ask me, 2~3 more weeks


----------



## dnt420 (Jan 18, 2018)

Unit Farm System Supply said:


> Looks really nice!!  if you ask me, 2~3 more weeks





Roger A. Shrubber said:


> i think you got at least a month yet, looks like it may be getting ready to do its swell, no reddish tinge to the leaf trichs, still too many white pistils.
> looks good


thanks, I think 2 weeks too, she is getting fatter day by day  , I'll put another pic next week.

Is it normal that the stems are yellowing too?


----------



## Unit Farm System Supply (Jan 19, 2018)

dnt420 said:


> thanks, I think 2 weeks too, she is getting fatter day by day  , I'll put another pic next week.
> 
> Is it normal that the stems are yellowing too?


Stocked on your updation. any pic to show the yellow stem?


----------



## chiqifella (Jan 19, 2018)

CanadianDank said:


> I personally read the first 20 pages of this thread and it was great.
> K0ijn is a smart grower and has many many times dispelled the myth of flushing.
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## dnt420 (Jan 19, 2018)

Unit Farm System Supply said:


> Stocked on your updation. any pic to show the yellow stem?


I took some pics 

yellowing stem 
 

group's photo 
 

low bud


----------



## chiqifella (Jan 19, 2018)

lol @ _updation_


----------



## dnt420 (Jan 31, 2018)

chiqifella said:


> lol @ _updation_


----------



## Unit Farm System Supply (Feb 1, 2018)

dnt420 said:


> View attachment 4082318


Yummmy.  chopped down?


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## dnt420 (Feb 2, 2018)

Unit Farm System Supply said:


> Yummmy.  chopped down?


yess  I've chopped a half and after a week the other half, left the plant outdoor in my garden for that week, we'll see if differs from the younger one.
I can't really judge the smoke yet, cause is not perfectly dried yet, but the smell, that is not very strong, remember the peanut butter shell, with a citrus scent too, I love it 
Any hint to track down the strain? 

edit: using leafly filtered search, I came out with a Haze strain, looks close, has that kiwi smell, so I think it might be, but I'm a completely noob, it's my first weed.


----------



## SavannaHilt (Feb 13, 2018)

Hello,
this is my first grow- Wonder Woman fem, 4 plants in RDWC 25gal using General Hydro nutes, 1000wMH veg, 1000HPS flower- getting anxious to harvest, the girls have been on 12/12 for 68 days, and have been in flush for last 5 days. I got a dig microscope and took some pics, still not 100% sure if I'm ready or not. Some expert advise would be much appreciated.


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Feb 13, 2018)

i'd wait till i saw less clears, maybe start seeing a few amber trichs.
gettin close, though, a week, maybe ten days


----------



## Budzbuddha (Feb 13, 2018)

Yep AT LEAST 10 days ... They are barely turning.


----------



## SavannaHilt (Feb 14, 2018)

thanks for the quick response guys. well now I have 3 plants still going, upon going back to the garden some diy supports i had gave and one plant toppled, so i harvested it. hope it still does the trick!! gonna keep the other ladies going for another week or so.


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## grilledcheese101 (Feb 19, 2018)

I have a dinfem bluecheese week 7/Day 50.       under 5000k spectrum 200w of diy led lights. Organic liquid fed, soil, cut my base nutes last week and have been feeding with finisher, molasses, liquid w8, massive and mammoth p.. i figure a straight RO water flush and another 7-10 days ?? Opinions are greatly apreciated, this is my first (super quality) personal indoor grow and i want it to finish to perfection


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Feb 20, 2018)

very nice lookin plant. at least another week to ten days, you still have a lot of clear trichs


----------



## haight (Feb 20, 2018)

2-3 weeks


----------



## Unit Farm System Supply (Feb 22, 2018)

wow, decent shots 2~3 weeks at least


----------



## Unit Farm System Supply (Feb 22, 2018)

SavannaHilt said:


> thanks for the quick response guys. well now I have 3 plants still going, upon going back to the garden some diy supports i had gave and one plant toppled, so i harvested it. hope it still does the trick!! gonna keep the other ladies going for another week or so.View attachment 4089401 View attachment 4089402 View attachment 4089403


Nothing can beat harvest. whats yield weight?


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## dnt420 (Feb 23, 2018)

I have a question, actually I'm waiting to harvest a white widow, it's my second plant so I still have lot to learn, watching my plants flowering, I've saw that there are like two phases of flowering, the first one is the actual bud, the second phase is when there's an additional boost, the buds swell, new calyx grow, and you get again a bloom of white pistils from them, after this, when they go dark orange, and I harvest at this time. Now my plant is in this situation with the second wave of pistils getting orange, the leafs are fading, should I cut or wait for a third wave of growth ?  have a happy day


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Feb 23, 2018)

they don't swell twice, once the swell is done, watch your trichomes, when they turn, it's ready


----------



## grilledcheese101 (Feb 23, 2018)

Unit Farm System Supply said:


> wow, decent shots 2~3 weeks at least


Thankyou! Just a samsung galaxy s6 - no lenses or apps just put it in pro mode and fuck around till i get some clear shots lol


----------



## Unit Farm System Supply (Feb 24, 2018)

grilledcheese101 said:


> Thankyou! Just a samsung galaxy s6 - no lenses or apps just put it in pro mode and fuck around till i get some clear shots lol


Thanks for info bro.Seems I need a new phone, lol lol


----------



## 5P4RK4 (Feb 24, 2018)

White widow X GSC, under 130W LED in soil. 

Been 8-9 weeks since visible flowers, ~10 weeks since flip. Trichomes look ready to me but still a fair number of white pistils. Maybe another day or two?


----------



## Unit Farm System Supply (Feb 25, 2018)

5P4RK4 said:


> White widow X GSC, under 130W LED in soil.
> 
> Been 8-9 weeks since visible flowers, ~10 weeks since flip. Trichomes look ready to me but still a fair number of white pistils. Maybe another day or two?
> 
> ...


For me, 90% amber trich would be better


----------



## 5P4RK4 (Feb 26, 2018)

Hehe one day I'll have that kind of patience. Chopped, washed, and hung last night. 

I wish I let (what little remained through flower) the lowers hang out for another couple days but never care too much about the stuff below the canopy with my casual ass light setup. Tops look perfect on the line.


----------



## Snail1976 (Mar 1, 2018)

I don’t have anything but a pocket microscope and I can’t get a good look at the trichomes. So, I was wondering if anyone can tell if I’m at mostly cloudy from these pictures? Any help would be appreciated. I know my pictures aren’t perfectly clear.


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Mar 1, 2018)

they do look milky, but...not the best pics, and i wouldn't want to make any definitive statements based on them.....and those are mostly sugar leaf trichs, get down in there and get some calyx shots, those are the ones that count.


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## dnt420 (Mar 2, 2018)

white widow, my guess on harvest is 3 weeks still. what do you think ?


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Mar 2, 2018)

sounds about right. pretty plant


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## dnt420 (Mar 2, 2018)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> sounds about right. pretty plant


Thanks man, surprises myself too, to anyone who knows the strain, when the best to get a celebral high ?


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Mar 2, 2018)

if you don't want the heavy narcotic high, cut them when you just start to see any ambers on the calyxes. 
is that an auto? pretty plant, but doesn't look like any of the white widow i've grown out


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## Snail1976 (Mar 2, 2018)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> they do look milky, but...not the best pics, and i wouldn't want to make any definitive statements based on them.....and those are mostly sugar leaf trichs, get down in there and get some calyx shots, those are the ones that count.


Thank you! I know the pictures suck. I will try harder.


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## dnt420 (Mar 3, 2018)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> if you don't want the heavy narcotic high, cut them when you just start to see any ambers on the calyxes.
> is that an auto? pretty plant, but doesn't look like any of the white widow i've grown out


It's a seed from an auto white widow from greenhouse, that's what the man who gave me the seed said


----------



## Snail1976 (Mar 3, 2018)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> a lot of people have tried the prolonged period of darkness before chop, the general consensus is that it doesn't really make much of a difference.
> i myself am not a proponent of flushing. i won't go off on a long diatribe (which i have been known to do), i'll just say that if you do your own research into flushing, you will see that it is a myth, that does nothing its supposed to do. nothing.


Good to know!


----------



## hardknock (Mar 28, 2018)

You are blessed for sharing this wonderful and cherished piece on this thread so far. I love this so much. Thanks a lot. If there is any way you can tag me along whenever you put up informative posts like this, please do so.


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## Unit Farm System Supply (Mar 28, 2018)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> if you don't want the heavy narcotic high, cut them when you just start to see any ambers on the calyxes.
> is that an auto? pretty plant, but doesn't look like any of the white widow i've grown out


useful


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## Unit Farm System Supply (Mar 28, 2018)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> sounds about right. pretty plant





Snail1976 said:


> Good to know!


ok,learnt,thank you


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## Unit Farm System Supply (Mar 30, 2018)

dnt420 said:


> white widow, my guess on harvest is 3 weeks still. what do you think ?


Hi, thank you for sharing.May i know how to pack them? smell proof bag or something else?


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## Snail1976 (Mar 31, 2018)

Unit Farm System Supply said:


> Hi, thank you for sharing.May i know how to pack them? smell proof bag or something else?


Why are you packing them? Just curious.


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## Snail1976 (Mar 31, 2018)

Unit Farm System Supply said:


> Hi, thank you for sharing.May i know how to pack them? smell proof bag or something else?


Looking at the amber, curled pistils with my untrained eye I’d probably have snatched that up already. I just got a jewelry glass to see the trichomes. Back in the day we didn’t know shit about trichomes and went by amber pistils.


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## GrowerCy (Apr 6, 2018)

Hello, im thinking on harvesting this girl in around 10 days (now shes 59 days ) breeder says 65-70 days for full mature.What do you think? i want to chop for highest THC level.


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## Snail1976 (Apr 11, 2018)

GrowerCy said:


> Hello, im thinking on harvesting this girl in around 10 days (now shes 59 days ) breeder says 65-70 days for full mature.What do you think? i want to chop for highest THC level.


I’ve found that a couple of weeks can be added to what they say. Just buy a jewelry loupe, learn about trichomes, and harvest when they’re right for your personal preference. I like to harvest when I see all or 90% milky trichomes. That’s when the max THC is acquired. If you want couch lock medicine wait until most trichomes are amber.


----------



## skiz (Apr 22, 2018)

Great post, thank you!


----------



## slipperyslut (May 13, 2018)

Supersoul said:


> Awesome what a thread with pics and all. But i do have one question. I am not sure if you are familiar with purple kush and what the despensary preffer. I read somewhere that they preffer purple kush to be about 60% amber and the rest milky and clear. if you have any knowledge of this please inform me. This is my first grow and i will be having some left overs. i am also using it for my arthritist. And also read it was suppose to give a couch lock high when it is 60% amber. I have recently started using cannabis to relieve pain and muscle tension. i am at day 56 into flowering and everything is sticky.





k0ijn said:


> If you see hardly any clear, mostly cloudy and a few amber it's a good time to harvest.
> You might be able to let your plants flower a few days to a week more or so, but I wouldn't let them flower more than that if you are seeing mostly cloudy a few amber.
> 
> You can leave some of the smaller leaves (sugar leaves) on the buds.
> ...


K0ijn is right. I’ve always harvested Old School rule: when the trichomes are cloudy amber its harvest time! Old school became “New School” when I got my new dry “bladeless” trimmer. I got it because amber “ripe” trichomes make buds sticky and hard to hand trim wet or in bladed trimmers for wet. These auto-trimmers designed for wet are crazy and gum up and if you’re hand-trimming you lose a lot when they (trichomes) get stuck to your blades and gloves. I cure my buds so they’re moist enough to keep the potency but the sugar leaves are dry. Then with my new TTT’s (I got 4 now) they trim my Buds to perfection in appearance, but most importantly my new Tom’s Tumble Trimmer LEAVES MOST of the trichomes on the Buds where they belong!


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## TheCatOutRanksYou (May 19, 2018)

Very helpful to any first time grower, thanks for taking the time to explain this all so well.


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## Beachwalker (May 19, 2018)

dnt420 said:


> Thanks man, surprises myself too, to anyone who knows the strain, when the best to get a celebral high ?


I've been running ilgm ww on and off for 3 years, I like it when there is as much cloudy as possible, no amber (got enough sleep meds)

I smoke it almost every day at the beach, it's my go-to beach walking weed LOL (that's a thing!) 

Couple ww pics from this year..


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## dnt420 (May 20, 2018)

Beachwalker said:


> I've been running ilgm ww on and off for 3 years, I like it when there is as much cloudy as possible, no amber (got enough sleep meds)
> 
> I smoke it almost every day at the beach, it's my go-to beach walking weed LOL (that's a thing!)
> 
> Couple ww pics from this year..


That's exactly what I like to do, go to the beach enjoy the sun and roll one


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## Terpteem (May 25, 2018)

https://www.rollitup.org/t/first-harvest-of-the-year.965067/#post-14269167


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## Grow Harder (May 31, 2018)

So according to these pics, how close am i to harvest, and should i consider starting the flush?


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## reallybigjesusfreak (Jun 2, 2018)

Grow Harder said:


> So according to these pics, how close am i to harvest, and should i consider starting the flush?


are those photos of the calyx or the leaves? leaves mature faster, so if you're going by that, then check the calyx. If that is indeed the calyx, then I'd say you got 2 more weeks or so. Personally, that's how long i'd take it. however, more experienced people may or may not agree.


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## Grow Harder (Jun 2, 2018)

reallybigjesusfreak said:


> are those photos of the calyx or the leaves? leaves mature faster, so if you're going by that, then check the calyx. If that is indeed the calyx, then I'd say you got 2 more weeks or so. Personally, that's how long i'd take it. however, more experienced people may or may not agree.


Thank u
Pics are from calyxs . I posted in another part of the site and got lots of similar answers.. Everyone is agreeing on 2 to 3 weeks.. i did some defoliating and discovered i had thrips. Im going to start a flush soon and wrap this thing up. My aurora indica is smelling GREAT and i cant wait until she finishes. I believe she has 6 to 8 weeks left


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## PigKiller (Jun 2, 2018)

I was thinking of letting this one go another 3 weeks. It's 'Blue Dream' and under my 30x lupe the trichomes look milky.
What do you all think?


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## Grow Harder (Jun 2, 2018)

PigKiller said:


> I was thinking of letting this one go another 3 weeks. It's 'Blue Dream' and under my 30x lupe the trichomes look milky.
> What do you all think?


I lack the experience to be sure but that looks damn close. And DANK to, i might add.. look at the frost on her! .. great job, let us know how she burns and tastes when the time comes


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jun 2, 2018)

PigKiller said:


> I was thinking of letting this one go another 3 weeks. It's 'Blue Dream' and under my 30x lupe the trichomes look milky.
> What do you all think?


at least two. its kind of hard to tell clears from milkies in those pics, but an almost total lack of amber says at least a couple more weeks, to me


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## Vthippy74 (Jun 21, 2018)

Im thinking 2 weeks any inputs.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jun 21, 2018)

Vthippy74 said:


> Im thinking 2 weeks any inputs.


at least. make sure you're looking at calyx trichs, and not leaf trichs, and try to get a side on look, they tend to look milky when they're not yet, from overhead


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## Vthippy74 (Jun 21, 2018)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> at least. make sure you're looking at calyx trichs, and not leaf trichs, and try to get a side on look, they tend to look milky when they're not yet, from overhead


Seems like forever almost 11 weeks into flower


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jun 21, 2018)

must be a sativa heavy plant, indicas are usually done before ten


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## RIBrian (Jun 23, 2018)

I’m in week 7 with Tahoe OG and gorilla cookies. I’ve read (first grow so no experience) that these are 9-10 week strains. 
I had some fan and light issues (corrected) this week causing two different periods where temps went to 110f in my closet for a couple of hours. One time was during dark hours and the lights were on and they weren’t supposed to be. Both times it was heavy fragrances in the house that led to the discovery of the issue. 
Trichome heads were mostly clear with a cloudy here or there before and directly afterwards.
Because the darkness was interrupted, I reset them by leaving the light off for a full 24 hours, turning them back on at the next scheduled time.
Yesterday one of the Tahoe’s started to show nute issues which I’m assuming was due to all the water that she drank while I was trying to cook her. 
This morning I have quite a few amber heads and most of the pistals orange. 
I think it’s a couple of weeks early but I think I need to harvest?? 
I can’t take pics through my scope but I’ve attached what I can. Any words of advice would be appreciated 

Thanks
RIBrian


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jun 23, 2018)

i go by trichs mainly. when you've got a good amount of amber, its time to cut, if some of your pistils are still white, that's ok, they'll turn quick enough when you chop


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## RIBrian (Jun 23, 2018)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> i go by trichs mainly. when you've got a good amount of amber, its time to cut, if some of your pistils are still white, that's ok, they'll turn quick enough when you chop


Thanks kindly for the advice


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## Imaginathan (Jun 27, 2018)

I’m thinking 4-5 days, anyone with more experience have a suggestion?


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jun 27, 2018)

looks pretty close, still see some clears, but there are always some. i'd say 4 to 7


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## Imaginathan (Jun 27, 2018)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> looks pretty close, still see some clears, but there are always some. i'd say 4 to 7


Thanks bud! It’s so hard when to cut! Want to get this first in the bag so I can know from now on


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jun 27, 2018)

it's at that point, check it daily, and when you like the ratio of cloudy/amber/clear, chop her down


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## 1212ham (Jul 25, 2018)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> a lot of people have tried the prolonged period of darkness before chop, the general consensus is that it doesn't really make much of a difference.
> i myself am not a proponent of flushing. i won't go off on a long diatribe (which i have been known to do), i'll just say that if you do your own research into flushing, you will see that it is a myth, that does nothing its supposed to do. nothing.


Glad I found this thread! What about reducing or stopping nutes the last week or two?


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jul 25, 2018)

reducing, and i do it for the whole last month in stages. by the time i get to chop, i'm down to 150-200 ppm


----------



## TheCatOutRanksYou (Jul 25, 2018)

Imaginathan said:


> I’m thinking 4-5 days, anyone with more experience have a suggestion?


Update on how she's looking??


----------



## BegbieCL (Jul 27, 2018)

Hi, hope someone can help me with this. 
This is my second grow, I'm doing the process with some friends. They are now on a holliday so I'm The one taking care of the plants in their final weeks. This Time, we went with AutoFlowering seeds, indoor style: Tangie Matic and Girls Scout cookies from FastBuds, and AutoBlackberry Kush from Dutch Passion. All of them were a 7-9 week total period, in The info given by Their seeds Banks.
Everything has Been going perfect so far(except for the Girl Scout having some weak roots at the first weeks, but it was fixed).
Yesterday was officially their Week 9 birthday, And I will have to travel for work in 7 days. We always had in mind that they could take a bit longer, so we set for Harvest in Week 10, (it seamed likely, giving that they have advanced in like a text book rhythm).

So, I have the thrichomes pictures here, hopefully someone could tell me if they are ready or, if you think they could be ready by next week, before my travel. I really don't want to leave them alone while we are away, my roommate said she could keep up with the flushing but she doesn't really smoke so I doubt she Will be as invested in looking after them. My main problem Is with the Tangie Matic, she Is the bigger of the 3, and Is the strain that I choosed because it's a súper sativa, I really like the euphoric highs in weed, and avoid the couch lock indicas. So, I want to avoid that the Tangie Matic looses it's euphoria and want to cut it as soon as I see an.amber in.her.
The auto BlackBerry kush Is a full indica and it's the only one were I have seen some ámbar thrichomes so far. Im hoping I could Harvest this Two before my trip (I Will be away for a week, but read here that in those final days the thrichomes can change really quickly to Amber). The Girls Scout Is still full of.white pistils in contrast with the other Two, so Im accepting that she could take a.bit longer.
This was the Tangie Matic yesterday, in her week 9. The Photos are a mix of top thrichomes from the high buds, and from the Botton ones, as well as the main cola.


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## Jefferson1977 (Jul 27, 2018)

They look pretty close to ready, could use another week. Don't stress about it man. Cut them as close as you can to leaving and the weed will be ok.


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Jul 27, 2018)

looks like a lot of clears yet, another 2 weeks easy


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## BegbieCL (Jul 27, 2018)

This Is the auto BlackBerry Kush, which I find it has More of those cloudy thrichomes. Is she ready? In The pictureS she Looks More White than she Is, pistils are 90% brownish, except for new growths.

How much More time could they take? More than a week? Is it just my idea or does the Blackberry actually Is More cloudy/ready than the Tangie?


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Jul 27, 2018)

BegbieCL said:


> This Is the auto BlackBerry Kush, which I find it has More of those cloudy thrichomes. Is she ready? In The pictureS she Looks More White than she Is, pistils are 90% brownish, except for new growths.
> 
> How much More time could they take? More than a week? Is it just my idea or does the Blackberry actually Is More cloudy/ready than the Tangie?


that one looks a lot closer than the other one.


----------



## Imaginathan (Jul 30, 2018)

TheCatOutRanksYou said:


> Update on how she's looking??


 She was great! 3.9 oz dry, super smooth and perfect high for me. She’s just now finished three weeks of cure, lots of compliments from friends . Thanks!

https://imgur.com/a/9VPstB5


----------



## Lennut (Aug 11, 2018)

k0ijn said:


> I'm glad you found what you were looking for and it helped you =)
> 
> I hope your harvest goes well, don't hesitate to make a thread in the Harvesting & Curing forum if you have any questions regarding harvesting and/or curing, there are a lot of helpful people here.


I have read a lot looking for answers on flushing and harvesting/curing and Thank you for all you have posted. You surely have helped this new grower!!!! Thanks a lot


----------



## Northwood (Aug 13, 2018)

One thing I noticed in a lst crowded environment especially is that trichomes are not homogeneously ready top-to-bottom on a plant. What I mean is that the top upper-most part of the colas may be perfectly ready while the buds further down the stem and more shaded are still developing with mostly clear trichomes. While I know staggered harvesting doesn't really increase yield under most conditions, I think that maybe it might improve quality if the lower buds are given an extra week or so to ripen further. Thoughts?


----------



## Lucky Luke (Aug 24, 2018)

Northwood said:


> One thing I noticed in a lst crowded environment especially is that trichomes are not homogeneously ready top-to-bottom on a plant. What I mean is that the top upper-most part of the colas may be perfectly ready while the buds further down the stem and more shaded are still developing with mostly clear trichomes. While I know staggered harvesting doesn't really increase yield under most conditions, I think that maybe it might improve quality if the lower buds are given an extra week or so to ripen further. Thoughts?


It certainty does increase yield and some learned growers on this site say that the middle harvest is the better smoke.
Trichome colour is not as important as people think. Firstly it should be taken from the bud, not a leaf. Secondly you should have a mature flower before worrying bout any trichome colour and thirdly some strains don't amber.(I haven't seen this but more experienced growers than me say it)


----------



## Master_Tabi (Aug 27, 2018)

May I have some advice please? How's she looking?


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Aug 27, 2018)

Master_Tabi said:


> May I have some advice please? How's she looking? View attachment 4187931


well, that small section seems to be fine, post a couple of whole plant pics if you want a real opinion


----------



## Master_Tabi (Aug 27, 2018)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> well, that small section seems to be fine, post a couple of whole plant pics if you want a real opinion


 Will do, from the looks of this section though, harvest time or waiting yet?


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Aug 27, 2018)

Master_Tabi said:


> Will do, from the looks of this section though, harvest time or waiting yet?


hard to say, looks close but its hard to see the trichs clearly, doesn't look like enough amber to me yet, though. the sugar leaf trichs will amber way before the calyxe trichs, and they don't look like they have very many yet, so the calyxes probably don't have any


----------



## Master_Tabi (Aug 27, 2018)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> hard to say, looks close but its hard to see the trichs clearly, doesn't look like enough amber to me yet, though. the sugar leaf trichs will amber way before the calyxe trichs, and they don't look like they have very many yet, so the calyxes probably don't have any


Got busy today maybe tomr get a pic posted, thank you for your response and tips


----------



## Darr26 (Aug 28, 2018)

Hello all. This is my first time growing anything. I'm growing feminized superb og and Afghan feminized. Both are at 50 days of flower tomorrow Aug 29th. Afghan isn't ready by looks, but my superb has two big colas that look close to done if not done. Need some assistance. A few white pistils. My trichomes look all mostly cloudy, and some are amber on the closest fan leaf from under the bud. I lost my jewelers loupe and am now forced to use binoculars. Here is a few pics


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## Darr26 (Aug 28, 2018)

Few more pics


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## Northernone666 (Sep 1, 2018)

k0ijn said:


> Harvesting your weed based on trichomes is probably the easiest way for most growers to harvest as close to peak harvest as possible.
> 
> 
> The difficulty in the method comes with how to determine the state of the trichomes and what each state means.
> ...


Good stuff thanks.


----------



## MinnesotaTwinsCeleb (Sep 7, 2018)

Hey there group could anyone tell me about how much longer this plant might have


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Sep 7, 2018)

MinnesotaTwinsCeleb said:


> Hey there group could anyone tell me about how much longer this plant might haveView attachment 4194640


the little bit of the plant i can see looks pretty ready. maybe a few more days to lets those pistils draw up a little more. no more than another week, i'd say


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## Solis Altilis (Sep 8, 2018)

Hello all,

This is an outdoor plant. Total newb. First grow, and it was unplanned. 
Just one plant from a single bag seed from diamond OG.

I’m in socal. Figured shed be done in october from what I’ve read, but there seems to be alot of cloudy trichs for the 1st week of september, and her pistils aren’t retracting much, and doesnt seem like she has swelled nearly enough. It has been a rough ride for her though. But am I seeing the trichs wrong? I feel like I am seeing a majority of cloudy?


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Sep 11, 2018)

Solis Altilis said:


> Hello all,
> 
> This is an outdoor plant. Total newb. First grow, and it was unplanned.
> Just one plant from a single bag seed from diamond OG.
> ...


that plant isn't ready. ignore the trichs on leaves, they age faster than the trichs on calyxes. when you get down and look, twist and turn till you can see the trichs from the side. when you look at them from directly above, a lot of them will look cloudy, but it's just the base of the "stalk". if you look at them from the side, a lot of them will still look clear.
nice looking plant, let it finish and you won't be sorry


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## Solis Altilis (Sep 11, 2018)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> that plant isn't ready. ignore the trichs on leaves, they age faster than the trichs on calyxes. when you get down and look, twist and turn till you can see the trichs from the side. when you look at them from directly above, a lot of them will look cloudy, but it's just the base of the "stalk". if you look at them from the side, a lot of them will still look clear.
> nice looking plant, let it finish and you won't be sorry


Gotcha, That makes sense. Thanks for the good tips.


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## MinnesotaTwinsCeleb (Sep 11, 2018)

Hello Gents can anyone tell me how things are looking...i see a bunch of amber trichs on leaves...


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## JayBio420 (Sep 16, 2018)

A small lense from a $2 laser pointer, my phone camera and a bud. May help you.


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## SweetestCheeba (Sep 21, 2018)

Wats up folks. I already plan on letting her run another week or two, jus lookin for some insight. 
12/12 from seed Day 82.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Sep 21, 2018)

SweetestCheeba said:


> Wats up folks. I already plan on letting her run another week or two, jus lookin for some insight.
> 12/12 from seed Day 82. View attachment 4202819View attachment 4202820


not lookin bad, but i'd say another ten days or so, still a fair amount of clears and no ambers


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## SweetestCheeba (Sep 21, 2018)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> not lookin bad, but i'd say another ten days or so, still a fair amount of clears and no ambers


Thanks. 
I figured about the same. I probably will chop the last day of the month.


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## SweetestCheeba (Sep 30, 2018)

Wats up ppls. My second girl here is jus finishing up. Thinkin about taken her down early for some Trippy butter. Jus lookin for a few different options.


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## LuisOkc (Oct 4, 2018)

Do these look ready


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## LuisOkc (Oct 4, 2018)

??


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 4, 2018)

LuisOkc said:


> ??


i dunno, get a better picture, that one is useless


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## ILLwannabe (Oct 6, 2018)

Here is my Painkiller XL #1, very larfy growing and hard to read, but I believe this plant is close to being ready.

The second image is Banana OG, which I think is also ready. been flowering since July 25th or so.

Any second opinions?


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## ILLwannabe (Oct 6, 2018)

JayBio420 said:


> View attachment 4200031 View attachment 4200032 View attachment 4200035 A small lense from a $2 laser pointer, my phone camera and a bud. May help you.


Awesome Idea with the laser pointer lens, great photos


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 6, 2018)

ILLwannabe said:


> Here is my Painkiller XL #1, very larfy growing and hard to read, but I believe this plant is close to being ready.
> 
> The second image is Banana OG, which I think is also ready. been flowering since July 25th or so.
> 
> Any second opinions?


first one looks pretty close, maybe ten days? the second still has at least two or three weeks. from what i can see.....


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## JayBio420 (Oct 7, 2018)

ILLwannabe said:


> Here is my Painkiller XL #1, very larfy growing and hard to read, but I believe this plant is close to being ready.
> 
> The second image is Banana OG, which I think is also ready. been flowering since July 25th or so.
> 
> Any second opinions?


Why don’t you invest $10-50 in one of the many options for looking closely at your trichomes?

Asking for internet opinion from non micro photos is not going to get you an accurate answer at all. Find/buy a USB scope, a lens for your phone, a jewellers loupe, the lens from a quality flashlight etc. Worth your time and money if you’re serious about your harvest window.


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## ILLwannabe (Oct 7, 2018)

JayBio420 said:


> Why don’t you invest $10-50 in one of the many options for looking closely at your trichomes?
> 
> Asking for internet opinion from non micro photos is not going to get you an accurate answer at all. Find/buy a USB scope, a lens for your phone, a jewellers loupe, the lens from a quality flashlight etc. Worth your time and money if you’re serious about your harvest window.


Those are macro photos... I have a scope but cannot hold it steady, so I use a camera, you just have to open the photo in a new window and then zoom in to see trichomes


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 7, 2018)

ILLwannabe said:


> Those are macro photos... I have a scope but cannot hold it steady, so I use a camera, you just have to open the photo in a new window and then zoom in to see trichomes


those are never clear enough to be able to say...they all look cloudy, all the time


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## JayBio420 (Oct 7, 2018)

ILLwannabe said:


> Those are macro photos... I have a scope but cannot hold it steady, so I use a camera, you just have to open the photo in a new window and then zoom in to see trichomes


I did open and zoom, and although it is a fairly detailed photo, due to the angle of lights usually you have clear that light up and cloudy that appear to twinkle like clear trichomes. Ambers can often be illusive and blend into the background. Please see attached picture of a trichome with amber forming at its base, with a $0.99 laser pointer focus lens, on my phone, held by hand. It’s possible, and cheap, to get quality trichome photos.

For your scope, grab a stool and something to use as a rest for stability.


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## ILLwannabe (Oct 7, 2018)

Okay I took your advice, went to the local grow shop they had an attachment for the phone for 8$. Still kind of hard to hold steady but much easier nonetheless. 

Anyways, the first and 3rd photo are the BOG, and the 2nd is the PK 1.


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## ILLwannabe (Oct 7, 2018)

Here is another painkiller trichome shot


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 7, 2018)

ILLwannabe said:


> Here is another painkiller trichome shot


that one looks pretty damn close, as long as that's a calyx shot. ignore the trichs that are out on sun leaves, only look at the ones on calyxes. if those are calyx trichs, i'd say it's ready


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## Scottmurphy12 (Oct 7, 2018)

Should you reduce co2 levels down to atmospheric levels towards the end of flowering, as increased levels of co2 prohibits the production of ethylene, vital in the maturation of trichome?

Also foxtailing is new growth and thus immature compared to the rest of the calyx and its purported that it is only cosmetic but surely it would reduce overall potency as opposed to only being aesthetically unappealing?

How are plants utilising increased levels of co2 towards the end of flowering? Is it a balancing act to acquire adequate trichome maturation and yield or is increased co2 production in the latter stages superflous?

Disregard the foxtailing question if it is deemed off topic, great thread

Thanks


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## JayBio420 (Oct 13, 2018)

Hey harvesters!

Please find my microscopic photos attached of my Skywalker OG Kush from Reserva Privada at 49 days (7 weeks) of flowering.

Definately the most challenging thing I have done today, my heartbeat is visible to a huge degree! 

Please follow me and check out my
Grow journal for this weekends update!


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## ILLwannabe (Oct 13, 2018)

Hey jay bio, in your 5th photo do those look more clear or cloudy to you? Kind of hard for me to distinguish the two. 


Also here is an updated trichome photo of my plants


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 13, 2018)

JayBio420 said:


> Hey harvesters!
> 
> Please find my microscopic photos attached of my Skywalker OG Kush from Reserva Privada at 49 days (7 weeks) of flowering.
> 
> ...


looks like a couple of weeks left to me, look at the ones sticking up past the edge of the leaves, still a lot of clears.
nice pics


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## JayBio420 (Oct 14, 2018)

ILLwannabe said:


> Hey jay bio, in your 5th photo do those look more clear or cloudy to you? Kind of hard for me to distinguish the two.
> 
> 
> Also here is an updated trichome photo of my plants


Definately more clear than cloudy in mine, the opposite in yours.


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## Sammo0331 (Oct 21, 2018)

Hey guys. Just wanted to post some pics of some diesel 7 weeks into flower. I do not have a loupe. Should be here soon!


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## Randomestguy (Nov 1, 2018)

Yo here to join the bandwagon, I got a few mamamia and blueberry, I think I should start the flush right now, my clone had very occasional amber trichomes and it was ahead of the rest possibly because the lesser veg time the mother of it is mostly clear compared to it, but they are close imo, lmk what u guys think.


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## Benji12090 (Nov 8, 2018)

Hey there, hi there. New to growing, this is my first grow. I didn't put much money into it and realized my lighting was not what it needed. This is making it hard to tell if they are ready to harvest. I would love your guys opinion.


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## ZootAllure (Dec 4, 2018)

1st grow in 30yrs. A Mama Mia and an LSD in rear (seedsman) Im thinking around 5-7 days to go. About 10 weeks into bud.
Thanks


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## RyanjMaine (Dec 10, 2018)

JJFOURTWENTY said:


> Couldn't agree with this more! _Soooooooo_ much MISinformation pertaining to amber trichs on this site and a whole lot of others as well. "Don't chop until you see at least 30% amber." WTF??!! I hear that bullshit all the time. My first harvest I let it go a week too long and consequently started flushing way too late as a result. Bud was still bomb, but it was very noticeable at least to me that the overall effects had drifted far from the psychoactive to the medicinal part of the scale. Now don't get me wrong I love a little bit of couchlock, but my ass being put straight to sleep after a few hits is not exactly what I'm aiming for.


I did this same thing,I don’t know if this is to far back of a comment to get your help and understanding,but it’s worth a try.I really hope I didn’t mess these up to bad lol.I have a few going and the first few I think I waited to long and started flushing to late ,which made more amber tricked.My question is,I am in coco and used advanced nutrition and flushed 2 days with flawless finish 2days water and then another flawless finish because the leaves are not turning yellow really,only on one and I have another question with that lol.Some leaves are yellowing on that one but few,the sugar leaves and the top of the buds that start with c lol sorry can’t remember are like yellowing almost like new growth,it’s only the top so I think it is but not sure.Sorry I have been none stop studying all this stuff.should I just harvest with the little fishing I’ve done?Should I just go cut them ones before lights come on and before it’s ruined?


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## Mullumbimby (Dec 20, 2018)

RyanjMaine said:


> I did this same thing,.... started flushing to late ,..... flushed 2 days with flawless finish 2days water and then another flawless finish because the leaves are not turning yellow really,....Some leaves are yellowing .... blah blah...... yellowing almost like new growth....blah...


Flushing schmushing.. 
Read some more of the early pages of this thread. They are pretty old now, but still gold.. The whole flushing debate is certain never to end until the dinosaurs that are still doing it have died, but it was pretty solidly debunked by the guy that started the thread.
I'm not really sure that is does any harm, but it certainly contributes to unnecessary complexity, particularly for new growers, who can tend to be experiencing a bit of anxiety and over-thinking at this critical stage in the process.
Ditch the whole flushing stage and you'll massively simplify not only the process, but your thinking too, making it easier to pick the correct time to harvest. 
Once you are confident with your timing and a few of the other components that make for a solid grow, knock yourself out with a flushing regime and tell us if you can really measure a difference.


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## grower411 (Mar 29, 2019)

These all look cloudy to me but I’m noob. And I know it’s too soon, how will I know even better ? How can I be sure? See pics


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Mar 29, 2019)

grower411 said:


> These all look cloudy to me but I’m noob. And I know it’s too soon, how will I know even better ? How can I be sure? See pics


first off, those are on a leaf...not a valid indicator. you have to look at the trichs that are growing on calyxes to get the real picture. leaf trichs are more exposed and age faster, they can be starting to amber while calyx trichs will barely be starting to get milky.
the biggest thing to know, imo, is to look at them from the side, and not from the top down. when you look from the top down, the base of the stalk they sit on will reflect light and make them look white when they're actually still clear. looking at them from the side gives you a much better picture of whats actually going on


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## grower411 (Mar 29, 2019)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> first off, those are on a leaf...not a valid indicator. you have to look at the trichs that are growing on calyxes to get the real picture. leaf trichs are more exposed and age faster, they can be starting to amber while calyx trichs will barely be starting to get milky.
> the biggest thing to know, imo, is to look at them from the side, and not from the top down. when you look from the top down, the base of the stalk they sit on will reflect light and make them look white when they're actually still clear. looking at them from the side gives you a much better picture of whats actually going on


Thanks man, do you have any pictures you could show as example. It would help a lot as I am a visual learner


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Mar 30, 2019)

its kind of hard to illustrate unless you can look at some from overhead, then look at the same ones from the side and see the difference, but these kind of illustrate what i'm talking about
  look at the ones directly facing the camera, they all look cloudy, while the ones you can see from the side are still obviously clear


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## Budley Doright (Mar 30, 2019)

I go by the whole picture and not trich alone. Hairs receding, growth stopped (easier to monitor in hydro), all signs of finished. I’ve had strains that don’t amber so it can fool you if waiting for it.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Mar 30, 2019)

Budley Doright said:


> I go by the whole picture and not trich alone. Hairs receding, growth stopped (easier to monitor in hydro), all signs of finished. I’ve had strains that don’t amber so it can fool you if waiting for it.


very true, but most of them will at least go milky, haven't seen one yet that was ready while it still had a lot of clears


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## grayeyes (Mar 30, 2019)

Last year I had the opportunity to harvest the top cola of a bubblegum I grew. I harvested when the tricomes on that top were actually gold, not milky, clear but still no matter what angle I looked at it the tricomes were gold.

Best damned pot I ever smoked.


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## Budley Doright (Mar 31, 2019)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> very true, but most of them will at least go milky, haven't seen one yet that was ready while it still had a lot of clears


Yup that’s true.


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## Budley Doright (Mar 31, 2019)

grayeyes said:


> Last year I had the opportunity to harvest the top cola of a bubblegum I grew. I harvested when the tricomes on that top were actually gold, not milky, clear but still no matter what angle I looked at it the tricomes were gold.
> 
> Best damned pot I ever smoked.


Clear amber is a special girl .


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## Bloodshed0510 (Apr 6, 2019)

How do my trichomes look??? Does it look like I'm ready to harvest??? Sorry if the pictures arent better than what it is my hand isn't that steady nomore lol


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## Budley Doright (Apr 6, 2019)

Bloodshed0510 said:


> How do my trichomes look??? Does it look like I'm ready to harvest??? Sorry if the pictures arent better than what it is my hand isn't that steady nomore lol


Did you happen to read the prior posts?


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## Bloodshed0510 (Apr 6, 2019)

Budley Doright said:


> Did you happen to read the prior posts?


I did but I dont want all gold trichomes I'm more going for milky but my eye is catching clear....is that clear or milky to you ???


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Apr 6, 2019)

Bloodshed0510 said:


> I did but I dont want all gold trichomes I'm more going for milky but my eye is catching clear....is that clear or milky to you ???


still mostly clear


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## Bloodshed0510 (Apr 6, 2019)

Thanks roger that's what I was thinking but wasn't to sure


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## Fliperion (May 29, 2019)

Hello happy growers. Can I ask you when this will be cca ready?
Sweet skunk auto. start 9th week from seed


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## Squidrun (Jun 16, 2019)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> its kind of hard to illustrate unless you can look at some from overhead, then look at the same ones from the side and see the difference, but these kind of illustrate what i'm talking about
> View attachment 4309195 View attachment 4309196 look at the ones directly facing the camera, they all look cloudy, while the ones you can see from the side are still obviously clear


What magnification is that on your first pic? And what camera? Superb clarity, i like it alot.


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## Renfro (Jun 16, 2019)

Fliperion said:


> Hello happy growers. Can I ask you when this will be cca ready?
> Sweet skunk auto. start 9th week from seed


Getting close, a week or two left if it were me.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jun 20, 2019)

Squidrun said:


> What magnification is that on your first pic? And what camera? Superb clarity, i like it alot.


won't lie to you, those are pics i found online that illustrated the point i wanted to make.
i bought one of these, https://www.amazon.ca/HUASOET-Microscope-Rechargeable-Electronic-Detection/dp/B074CJFJG3 which apparently aren't available at the moment, but it works awesome. you do have to put a card in it and then put the card in your computer to save pictures, but it will hold 1000s. the pics on it are just as clear as those i posted though, just a pain in the ass to transfer them back and forth, when it has a screen of its own


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## SAMMYB913 (Jun 20, 2019)

This is no longer a problem , I finally said the hell w/ jewelry loupes & got a cheap 5mp digital microscope that runs on windows 7-10 on eBay for $19.20 & had to give it a try unfortunately it’s coming ups ground shipping so my plants should be fully mature when it gets here


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## Nizza (Jun 20, 2019)

https://www.rollitup.org/t/are-these-ready-w-microscope-pics.991235/

got a bunch of pics here please chime in! trying to harvest some tonight asap


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## SAMMYB913 (Jun 21, 2019)

SAMMYB913 said:


> This is no longer a problem , I finally said the hell w/ jewelry loupes & got a cheap 5mp digital microscope that runs on windows 7-10 on eBay for $19.20 & had to give it a try unfortunately it’s coming ups ground shipping so my plants should be fully mature when it gets here
> View attachment 4352793


Unfortunately the douchebag cancelled my order , refunded my money & relisted it for $8 more so I went to Amazon & It’ll be here Thursday :0)


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## SAMMYB913 (Jun 21, 2019)

Nizza said:


> https://www.rollitup.org/t/are-these-ready-w-microscope-pics.991235/
> 
> got a bunch of pics here please chime in! trying to harvest some tonight asap


Looks good , if you’re an Amazon Prime member then spend $20 on the scope I just bought & just posted, you’ll get it in 2 days if not they have delivery options , might be $27-$30 for 1 day delivery just make sure you get one that’s compatible w/ your laptop or computer I see a lot of people have trouble w/ phone app. , I’m a non member so I paid $20 + $5 shipping for standard 1 week delivery , just make sure to also check reviews before buying. I’ll never have to ask anyone’s opinion again about harvest time


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## SAMMYB913 (Jun 21, 2019)

Nizza said:


> https://www.rollitup.org/t/are-these-ready-w-microscope-pics.991235/
> 
> got a bunch of pics here please chime in! trying to harvest some tonight asap


I got an email it’ll be here tomorrow & just ordered it yesterday :0)


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## Nizza (Jun 21, 2019)

let me know how it works bro. I used a dino-lite usb microscope to take mine i believe they cost 100-200$ but i borrowed it from a friend

A buddy of mine had one of those microscopes maybe a different brand, take special care with where it plugs in and bending the cord cause he had his have a problem where it would rapidly disconnect-reconnect.

for 20$ though i mean the thing worked kick ass!


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## SAMMYB913 (Jun 21, 2019)

Nizza said:


> let me know how it works bro. I used a dino-lite usb microscope to take mine i believe they cost 100-200$ but i borrowed it from a friend
> 
> A buddy of mine had one of those microscopes maybe a different brand, take special care with where it plugs in and bending the cord cause he had his have a problem where it would rapidly disconnect-reconnect.
> 
> for 20$ though i mean the thing worked kick ass!


My friend has one & bought one for his buddy who runs windows 10 & that’ll be what I’m running it on so I’m very confident it’ll be awesome , Hard to believe w/ it being so cheap I was gonna spend $70-$100 but said hell w/ it I’ll give this a try first :0)


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## PadawanWarrior (Jun 21, 2019)

Renfro said:


> Getting close, a week or two left if it were me.


Same here. I'd wait too if it were me. But my wife likes it harvested earlier I realized when I found a couple bananas on a Sunset Sherbert at 27 days and chopped it. Totally my fault from stressing her too much at early flower. She can just hope I screw up again though if she wants it chopped that early again. Haha.


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## PadawanWarrior (Jun 21, 2019)

Haha, I just realized that was a month ago. I'm sure he's harvested by now.


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## olaf687 (Jul 4, 2019)

I know this thread started in 2012. But im not sure if I agree with the OP about amber trichromes. I like strains that knock me out and put me to sleep for the most part. And prefer the the heady energetic highs in the day. What I hate is that shit clean functional high shit thats been a new fad recently. I really dont think telling insomniacs to chop early is smart sorry. Yes for energetic crack head stoners yes sure they would love that feeling. But sorry I dont want my weed to be functional high unless im growing specfically for energy. All though the best sativas i smoked in high school got you mind fucked and bit of energy but than 2 hours later you slept like a rock. Trainwreck and super silver haze back in san diego was what a true sativia high is for me. Even sativias back in the day at least towards the end made you tired. My opnion is since the landrace ancestors naturally grew in long summers and very short winters. I believe the longer the better qualtity. I was reading way back on this thread and guy said the thc wasnt degrading but becoming more mature! Also I think people forgot about the other canbinoids that need to mature.


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## olaf687 (Jul 4, 2019)

My question to the op if hes still active do you prefer energetic highs? Do you not like couch lock and knock out sleepy strains. Because if you do like energetic highs than this might be personal preference rather than really being scientifically proven.


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## Renfro (Jul 4, 2019)

olaf687 said:


> My question to the op if hes still active do you prefer energetic highs? Do you not like couch lock and knock out sleepy strains. Because if you do like energetic highs than this might be personal preference rather than really being scientifically proven.


I wonder if he is still active, it's been a little while, the site says he hasn't been seen since December 6th 2018

https://www.rollitup.org/members/k0ijn.355103/


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## 58Doug19 (Jul 5, 2019)

I'm growing a purple strain and all my sugar leaves and buds have either clear trichomes or trichomes that are turning dark purple. Will they go amber or stay purple?


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## PadawanWarrior (Jul 5, 2019)

58Doug19 said:


> I'm growing a purple strain and all my sugar leaves and buds have either clear trichomes or trichomes that are turning dark purple. Will they go amber or stay purple?


Take a pic for us. We want to see em. I've seen em before in other pics and they're beautiful. But I don't know why or how it happens.


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## 58Doug19 (Jul 5, 2019)

PadawanWarrior said:


> Take a pic for us. We want to see em. I've seen em before in other pics and they're beautiful. But I don't know why or how it happens.


Wouldn't even know how as it took buying a cheap 120x pocket microscope to even see them.


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## hellmutt bones (Jul 5, 2019)

Renfro said:


> I wonder if he is still active, it's been a little while, the site says he hasn't been seen since December 6th 2018
> 
> https://www.rollitup.org/members/k0ijn.355103/


Rip op


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## Nonna (Jul 11, 2019)

Thank you for posting that! I wish mine were that simple though. About 85% of my trichomes are headless and/or deformed.Then there are these weird small amber caps on a great number of them. There are a few clear, and a smaller number cloudy, a tiny bit amber.hat could have caused this? Should I harvest? Northern Lights Auto from Crop King, into its 10th week of flowering. Grown under led for veg, then outdoors.


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## Sivart1210 (Jul 12, 2019)

Are these trichomes cloudy enough or would you consider this still clear?


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## Dr.J20 (Jul 16, 2019)

Sivart1210 said:


> Are these trichomes cloudy enough or would you consider this still clear?


still a lot of clear there; let 'em go a little while longer.


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## Dr.J20 (Jul 16, 2019)

Nonna said:


> Thank you for posting that! I wish mine were that simple though. About 85% of my trichomes are headless and/or deformed.Then there are these weird small amber caps on a great number of them. There are a few clear, and a smaller number cloudy, a tiny bit amber.hat could have caused this? Should I harvest? Northern Lights Auto from Crop King, into its 10th week of flowering. Grown under led for veg, then outdoors.


What's the medium and nutes? I'd say yeah, go ahead and harvest. the deformity seems more likely genetic, but could be metabolic--she might just not like what you've been feeding her, or the switch from LED to good ole sunshine. 

best of luck,

be easy,


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## IvcusLongDankus (Jul 29, 2019)

How much longer y'all think


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## Palckl899014 (Oct 9, 2019)

Hi guys I'm on my second grow and I'm trying to figure whether it's time for me to chop. I've bought 2 jewelers loupe but I just can tell any help would be greatly appreciated.


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## Renfro (Oct 9, 2019)

You could chop them now or wait for more amber. Or do some of each.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Oct 9, 2019)

Renfro said:


> You could chop them now or wait for more amber. Or do some of each.


not really sufficient magnification...from what i can see, you're pretty close, but to really tell, you have to be able to clearly see the resin heads clearly.


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## Palckl899014 (Oct 9, 2019)

What would you reccomended I buy to to magnify close enough to see? I've bough a jeweler loupe and is just wasnt enough


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## Imaginathan (Oct 9, 2019)

Palckl899014 said:


> What would you reccomended I buy to to magnify close enough to see? I've bough a jeweler loupe and is just wasnt enough


Something like this, a USB microscope that connects to a laptop/computer. Even takes great photos!


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## GrowbudsStarter (Oct 9, 2019)

Help! Someone! how many more days I have before harvest?! Or if it does look ready ?! Thanks


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## PioneerValleyOG (Oct 11, 2019)

once again bunch of bad information. yes, you can check trikes, but they MUST BE CHECKED ON THE CALYX! a check of trikes on the leaves or bud can mislead you and cause you to harvest WEEKS early! everyone says tricones, but no one ever finishes the sentence. check them on the calyx. just my opinion.


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## belvmont (Oct 23, 2019)

I can recommand to buy a cheap usb microscope, paid like 30-40 euro and you can tell so much more than just some slowly changing trichoms.
How the juice gets pumped up in the cells and building up to the head . How different circumstances like high temp/ligth burn, also changes them and Fertilzer.
It will mostly absorb from the bract, if the leaf/bud is purplish sometimes they abosrb it from the bract too, and you have purple trichs.


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## PioneerValleyOG (Oct 24, 2019)

GrowbudsStarter said:


> Help! Someone! how many more days I have before harvest?! Or if it does look ready ?! Thanks View attachment 4405721View attachment 4405722View attachment 4405723View attachment 4405724View attachment 4405725View attachment 4405726


very nice crop, still looks pretty vibrant, soon though.


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## Dashiznit12369 (Nov 5, 2019)

Will it be easier to tell when this is ready if I used a white light to look? Hairs are starting to bend and trics slowly have the mushroom top but look clear


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## CucksCuckClan (Nov 7, 2019)

So i guess people are going for what color the trichs are on the MAIN bud? Because i doubt e.g lower and smaller buds all of a sudden are in the same stage? 

Doesn't this kind of make it rather uninteresting, well, apart from knowing that the main bud (which, of course might be a big part of the yield) is finished? 

I'm thinking maybe i should get the main bud to get mostly amber so that all the lower buds can grow much larger and get milky with some amber. Bad idea? How big will the lower buds get if you really let them grow out? 

Probably not gonna cut the main bud, wait for recovery etc, wait for lower buds to grow, that will probably take too long due to big recovery of getting the main stem cut.. 

Thanks.


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## anthony1 (Nov 10, 2019)

How long do I guys think on day 70


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## zypheruk (Nov 10, 2019)

If your trichomes look like this then your no where near harvest time, I would imagine this particular plants going to need another 3 weeks of food.
The photo is what the trichomes look like deep down into the bud.
This is HSO - The New - at day 46 flower and is a lower airy bud. 65-70 days is what the breeder says is harvest time but from what a group of us that where running test seeds found was 73-80 days.


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## anthony1 (Nov 11, 2019)

zypheruk said:


> If your trichomes look like this then your no where near harvest time, I would imagine this particular plants going to need another 3 weeks of food.
> The photo is what the trichomes look like deep down into the bud.
> This is HSO - The New - at day 46 flower and is a lower airy bud. 65-70 days is what the breeder says is harvest time but from what a group of us that where running test seeds found was 73-80 days.
> 
> View attachment 4419095


Mine are all milky


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## Dashiznit12369 (Nov 13, 2019)

Updated pics. Taken last night at 1115pm. 30 min after lights came on


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## giannoulis (Dec 17, 2019)

ok here‘s the situation. 
I have an NL#5 Haze from Sensi Seeds, flowering time according to them is 65-75 days, at today we’re at day 70. 
I‘m leaving for a trip either Thursday or Friday and I’m going to be out for a week. Thursday will be day 72 of flowering and when I come back day 79 of flowering. 
I have two options, one is to cut the plant today and trim it until I leave and the other one is to water it on Thursday (or Friday) before I leave and harvest as soon as I come back. Trichomes are as far as I can see 90% cloudy, 5% clear and maybe 5% amber. What would you do???

I would rather leave it for 9 more days but I have two concerns:
1. That the trichomes will become amber at more than 25%
2. If I water the day I leave, the soil will dry out in 3-4 days, so it will remain for 3 more days without water


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Dec 17, 2019)

water it heavily, get rid of any run off, then add a little extra to your run off tray. leave it till you come back. NL haze is mostly sativa, and i've never seen a sativa that was hurt by an extra week of flowering time.


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## hellmutt bones (Dec 17, 2019)

Just chopp it or leave it to dry out in the pot. Either way all signs point to kill her. IMO I would just cut her down.


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## hoots123 (Jan 1, 2020)

These close or wait for more amber also why does it look sticky like honey on the right side


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## jungle666 (Jan 2, 2020)

hoots123 said:


> View attachment 4447989
> These close or wait for more amber also why does it look sticky like honey on the right side


Give it a week and report back


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jan 2, 2020)

hoots123 said:


> View attachment 4447989
> These close or wait for more amber also why does it look sticky like honey on the right side


wait a lot. one or two ambers among a field of clear trichs means nothing, that plant is weeks out still.
i'm not willing to say definitively, but those sticky looking threads look like spider mite webs to me...but it could be where something has damaged that bud, and ruptured some of the trichome heads, and that's resin.....hope for the resin


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## Kronicle420 (Jan 2, 2020)

PioneerValleyOG said:


> once again bunch of bad information. yes, you can check trikes, but they MUST BE CHECKED ON THE CALYX! a check of trikes on the leaves or bud can mislead you and cause you to harvest WEEKS early! everyone says tricones, but no one ever finishes the sentence. check them on the calyx. just my opinion.


thats the only way to do it. if youre checking trichomes on leaves your bud isnt ready!


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## Cleanfinish93 (Jan 29, 2020)

I have now taken her out the tent I just hope it isn't too early... thrichomes are co dusing me most patches look ripe then others still clear... it was a scrogg but I'm not sure .... its day 65 of flower and it was a 45-50 strain so 2 weeks over already so it's now in darkness.. what do you guys think ?


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## [email protected] (Feb 7, 2020)

k0ijn said:


> Harvesting your weed based on trichomes is probably the easiest way for most growers to harvest as close to peak harvest as possible.
> 
> 
> The difficulty in the method comes with how to determine the state of the trichomes and what each state means.
> ...


Does the resin or stickyness indicate maturation


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## Dankman32 (Feb 10, 2020)

"Amber trichomes contain degraded THC --> CBN. CBN represents a loss of 90% potency (from THC). "


I keep hearing people say this, where is the science behind it tho?


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## Dankman32 (Feb 10, 2020)

I wouldnt personally let trichomes dictate harvest time over every single other factors, overall look of the plants, density of buds, pistil colors and them receding into the calyxes. 

Sometimes i see people harvesting plants filled with white hairs because of the trichome color. They like to say its genetics that the plant will have white hairs when harvest time, but i have yet to see a strain that actually does that.


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## MIKE GROEZ (Mar 5, 2020)

Sounds like theyre going to stay purple.E="58Doug19, post: 14976798, member: 1017533"]
I'm growing a purple strain and all my sugar leaves and buds have either clear trichomes or trichomes that are turning dark purple. Will they go amber or stay purple?
[/QUOTE]


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## MIKE GROEZ (Mar 5, 2020)

Palckl899014 said:


> Hi guys I'm on my second grow and I'm trying to figure whether it's time for me to chop. I've bought 2 jewelers loupe but I just can tell any help would be greatly appreciated.View attachment 4405488View attachment 4405489View attachment 4405490View attachment 4405491


I say wait another week..they look almost ready


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## MIKE GROEZ (Mar 5, 2020)

zypheruk said:


> If your trichomes look like this then your no where near harvest time, I would imagine this particular plants going to need another 3 weeks of food.
> The photo is what the trichomes look like deep down into the bud.
> This is HSO - The New - at day 46 flower and is a lower airy bud. 65-70 days is what the breeder says is harvest time but from what a group of us that where running test seeds found was 73-80 days.
> 
> ...


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## MIKE GROEZ (Mar 5, 2020)

I'm still too early for harvest almost there though.


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## MIKE GROEZ (Mar 5, 2020)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> its kind of hard to illustrate unless you can look at some from overhead, then look at the same ones from the side and see the difference, but these kind of illustrate what i'm talking about
> View attachment 4309195 View attachment 4309196 look at the ones directly facing the camera, they all look cloudy, while the ones you can see from the side are still obviously clear


Almost ready


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## CraigMk (Mar 10, 2020)

** super orange glue** day 54 flower . Swelled up nicely, I have seen ambers at tops and on buds bellow .I have burnt it a little with nutrients and I think lights. How does this look to any pros out there.


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## RBGene (Apr 24, 2020)

Harvested this using Ice water and Bubble Bags.
Also use Dry Ice.


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## Renfro (Apr 24, 2020)

RBGene said:


> Harvested this using Ice water and Bubble Bags.
> Also use Dry Ice.
> View attachment 4543786


Man I would love to press that into some rosin.


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## Greenlane (May 9, 2020)

What stage is this went over 70 days did I time it good? At what week do new trichomes stop being produced? Black candyland by JOTI


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## grower411 (May 10, 2020)

I can figure out why 75 days in maybe more these are the trichomes, when do I harvest? When do you start counting flowering day, right after light change?


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## Greenlane (May 10, 2020)

grower411 said:


> I can figure out why 75 days in maybe more these are the trichomes, when do I harvest? When do you start counting flowering day, right after light change?
> 
> View attachment 4561125
> 
> ...


Looks early, needs to swell more and cross set of trichomes to be more cloudy and amber. 10 days at least.


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## TS23 (May 13, 2020)

Ice cream cake from bag seed. Day 51 flower


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## Puff_Dragon (May 19, 2020)

Here is some more anecdotal evidence 

imho, each strain is different and needs to be tested with a first grow to get the harvest time really dialled in (after this, you use clones).
With that in mind, Sativa dominant should be run for 12 weeks first grow (longer for a 'pure' Sativa). And 10 weeks for an Indica.
Staggering the first harvest (over a week or more) will also help you to taste/feel any changes in the expression of the high, flavour and smell in the time (helping you gauge things for later harvests, using clones).

btw, I came to those harvest numbers after learning (first hand) the old growers adage:
If you think they are ready to harvest ..wait, at least one more week 

Pistil hairs (colour/stages)
For me, all have basically turned red, shrunk back and matted to the bud (with only a few new hairs poking out over the whole bud). If I see lots of white hairs still (irrespective of the number of reds) I wait longer. I want to see pistil production dropping heavily, before I harvest.

Tricone colours
I grow more Sativa dominant (but this may be true of Indica dominant too), I learnt to never view the resin glands as simply clear, milky and amber (just three stages).
At least for the strains I grow, there are: Clear, Clear/Milky, Milky, Milky/small dot of amber inside, Amber red, Amber brown, Amber black.
Amber brown and Amber black are the real 'sleepy sleepy' part of the high (for my strains anyway), so I avoid them as much as possible.

For a balanced high and good flavour, I harvest when there are: Milky, Milky/small dot of amber inside, Amber red, some Amber brown (there will be a few Clears too)
This 'usually' corispodes with the flower times I mentioned originally.

Peace.

*Edit*
I should have added: I start counting flower days from the first day I see white pistils. Thats normally, about 7 days after the flip to 12/12


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## Nefrella (May 19, 2020)

grower411 said:


> I can figure out why 75 days in maybe more these are the trichomes, when do I harvest? When do you start counting flowering day, right after light change?
> 
> View attachment 4561125
> 
> ...


What electronic microscope are you using? Looking for something to take some photos with.


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## WintersBones (May 25, 2020)

Got a new a toy, thought I'd share some trichome shots of my current grow. Pineapple Express 5 weeks into flower.


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## manalicream (Jun 5, 2020)

Heres my easy bud at 10 weeks. Getting close I think?


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## testology1980 (Jul 7, 2020)

Great comment about harvest time checking 





__





Should I harvest? On 9th week of flower


Wondering if I should pull her, but new hairs suddenly started popping up but the thc is almost all milky at this point. Any help is appreciated!



www.rollitup.org


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## abf89 (Jul 13, 2020)

hey,

these girl is my first  i feel harwest time is coming.. but when is the right time? can u check the pics and advice me?










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## TMoney69 (Aug 19, 2020)

k0ijn said:


> Seems to be a combination of cloudy and clear trichomes as far as I can see from the images.
> You should let your plant(s) flower a bit more, hard to be specific without more info (length of flowering so far, strain etc.) but I would say at least 2 weeks as I see no amber trichomes and still quite a few clear.


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## Agraves (Sep 8, 2020)

I’m new to growing and received a young plant as a gift back in June. I’m not sure of the strain but she’s been a slower grower and has been flowering for roughly 6 weeks now. The problem is, I can’t tell if she’s ready for harvest. I have a 30x jewelers loup and the trichromes all look white to me, however, I’ve actually never seen them look translucent. I can’t tell if that’s just light reflecting or if I need a stronger loup, but I’m hoping some seasoned growers might be able to determine whether or not she’s ready. Despite the inconsistencies with how “ripe” some the pistols look, these pics are all from the same plant.


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## MajorCoco (Sep 11, 2020)

Agraves said:


> I’m new to growing and received a young plant as a gift back in June. I’m not sure of the strain but she’s been a slower grower and has been flowering for roughly 6 weeks now. The problem is, I can’t tell if she’s ready for harvest. I have a 30x jewelers loup and the trichromes all look white to me, however, I’ve actually never seen them look translucent. I can’t tell if that’s just light reflecting or if I need a stronger loup, but I’m hoping some seasoned growers might be able to determine whether or not she’s ready. Despite the inconsistencies with how “ripe” some the pistols look, these pics are all from the same plant.


Not ready. Too many new pistils for it to be even close to finished. 3 weeks at least...

Just to clarify, those white hairs are each attached to a calyx (sometimes two hairs per calyx). Calyxes provide the bulk of the weight and surface area of a bud. When the hair is white it means that the calyx it is attached to is immature, meaning it is small. The calyx is only at full size once the pistil hair has turned orange or orangey-brown.

If you harvest a plant when it still has white pistils you are losing YIELD. Potentially a significant amount, since a lot of strains don't bulk up properly until the very last 2 weeks.


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## MajorCoco (Sep 11, 2020)

I recently read some stuff from Cannoli about this topic, and he suggest leaving plants until there are 60% amber trichs. "Dimensions of Ripeness 3" it was called. 

An interesting read, but I wondered if anyone on here had personal experience leaving harvests that long?


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## Agraves (Sep 11, 2020)

MajorCoco said:


> Not ready. Too many new pistils for it to be even close to finished. 3 weeks at least...
> 
> Just to clarify, those white hairs are each attached to a calyx (sometimes two hairs per calyx). Calyxes provide the bulk of the weight and surface area of a bud. When the hair is white it means that the calyx it is attached to is immature, meaning it is small. The calyx is only at full size once the pistil hair has turned orange or orangey-brown.
> 
> If you harvest a plant when it still has white pistils you are losing YIELD. Potentially a significant amount, since a lot of strains don't bulk up properly until the very last 2 weeks.


This is great info - thanks so much. I also invested in a more powerful magnifier since I posted, so I can see the trichomes more clearly and can actually see if some ARE clear (which there are some). I’m brand new to all of this and have been taking a crash course in cultivating since (unexpectedly) receiving this beauty. Thanks again for your help!!


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## MajorCoco (Sep 11, 2020)

Agraves said:


> This is great info - thanks so much. I also invested in a more powerful magnifier since I posted, so I can see the trichomes more clearly and can actually see if some ARE clear (which there are some). I’m brand new to all of this and have been taking a crash course in cultivating since (unexpectedly) receiving this beauty. Thanks again for your help!!


Glad to help. In an effort to be helpful I'll also add...which hopefully you won't mind since this is your first grow...these are not entirely healthy looking plants. Healthy enough to finish probably, but your yield is unlikely to be good even if you do leave them 3 more weeks.

I can't tell what hasn't gone right from what you've told us, but they really should be much bigger buds than they are at 6 weeks. Don't sweat it, as your first grow is always a steep learning curve, but do go through each part of your grow (lighting, growing environment, watering and nutrition etc) and be sure to check that each was within the correct range.


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## Agraves (Sep 11, 2020)

MajorCoco said:


> Glad to help. In an effort to be helpful I'll also add...which hopefully you won't mind since this is your first grow...these are not entirely healthy looking plants. Healthy enough to finish probably, but your yield is unlikely to be good even if you do leave them 3 more weeks.
> 
> I can't tell what hasn't gone right from what you've told us, but they really should be much bigger buds than they are at 6 weeks. Don't sweat it, as your first grow is always a steep learning curve, but do go through each part of your grow (lighting, growing environment, watering and nutrition etc) and be sure to check that each was within the correct range.


So, I just went outside to check on it and it broke in half. I have no idea what happened. Could have been a squirrel or could have just been weak from improper care. I’ve been learning as I go, which probably hasn’t been easy on my plant.


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## MajorCoco (Sep 11, 2020)

Sorry to hear. That's always a bummer...They are much bigger plants than I thought from the first pics, so you've done good anyway. Stems look a little woody perhaps, which can be a sign of problem, but generally they don't look bad. Not very bushy though...which makes me wonder what sort of pruning you've done.

They look like pretty big container. Are they in dustbins?! (garbage containers...if you're american!). If they are then make sure they dry out properly between waterings as they could hold a lot of water at the bottom...! (sometime having too big a container makes is difficult to know whether the bulk of the root-ball is in the dry or wet part of the container!)

Also..when you say 6 weeks since flowering...how sure are you? Outdoors plants usually have localised end-dates (e.g Late Sept in Northern Europe), rather than flowering periods (which is for indoor plants, where the change to 12/12 is sudden.) Each variety actually starts to flower at slightly different photo period. Many will start to flower at 13/11, or even 14/10...but doing 12/12 guarantees that 100% of known strain will flower...so that is why everyone goes 12/12.

Outdoors, where the photoperiod changes slowly flowering is usually longer than with indoor grows.


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## Agraves (Sep 11, 2020)

MajorCoco said:


> Sorry to hear. That's always a bummer...They are much bigger plants than I thought from the first pics, so you've done good anyway. Stems look a little woody perhaps, which can be a sign of problem, but generally they don't look bad. Not very bushy though...which makes me wonder what sort of pruning you've done.
> 
> They look like pretty big container. Are they in dustbins?! (garbage containers...if you're american!). If they are then make sure they dry out properly between waterings as they could hold a lot of water at the bottom...! (sometime having too big a container makes is difficult to know whether the bulk of the root-ball is in the dry or wet part of the container!)
> 
> ...


I found a pic from when I first started to see white pistils popping out and it was dated Aug 6th, which I thought occurred in week 2 of flowering, but Im just going by something I read, so I may have started tracking this stage too soon.


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## trinketswittrichs (Oct 2, 2020)

FrostyTheBudMan said:


> Not exactly newbie here, but first grow in a long time, trying to find just the right time to chop. Borrowed a friends digital microscope and have attached the images. Seeking expert advise. I have learned so much here.
> View attachment 2098432View attachment 2098433View attachment 2098434


what kind of scope you have?I have a 5 dollar loupe its 40x it says but it sucks bad i need a better one i cant tell and i need to know when to chop im screwed here


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## JonnyGrows (Oct 3, 2020)

Hey all, new here...doing my first indoor grow, any thoughts on harvesting with 5% amber coverage ? Currently in week 9 & see more cloudy trichomes...I was wondering if any has harvested with 5% amber and how it turned out ?
Negative & Positive feedback appreciated

Thanks


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## StoneyJake (Oct 5, 2020)

trinketswittrichs said:


> what kind of scope you have?I have a 5 dollar loupe its 40x it says but it sucks bad i need a better one i cant tell and i need to know when to chop im screwed here


i just bought a $25 digital scope from amazon that is amazing. You should check them out


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## LuisOkc (Oct 5, 2020)

What you guys think it's ready


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## LuisOkc (Oct 5, 2020)

More


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## LuisOkc (Oct 5, 2020)

These are a different plant


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## StoneyJake (Oct 5, 2020)

LuisOkc said:


> What you guys think it's ready


Doesnt seem like it< Maybe half way through flowering. was it from a bagseed?


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## LuisOkc (Oct 5, 2020)

StoneyJake said:


> Doesnt seem like it< Maybe half way through flowering. was it from a bagseed?


Yeah the pic is from the middle as I cannot reach the top it's 12 ft


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## Uber Auxintaller (Oct 11, 2020)

Are we there yet? Some skilled eyes would be appreciated. About 2 weeks ago it was suggested that I wait 1 - 2 weeks. Should I wait longer or do you think it's good to go? Not all buds are at the same stage so I'm thinking I'll have to work my way down the plant in stages.


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## Puff_Dragon (Oct 11, 2020)

looking at those pics, and trying to compare to what I grow; those could still go another two weeks (or so). 
It is hard for me to say, you might be at the early part of your harvest window(s). imo: I'd give it (at least) another week. As I don't see much amber over all the pics. 
Also, when you do harvest; harvest during a night cycle when the plants are particularly smelly (as opposed to night cycles when the plant smell drops). Total 'bro science' there, but I find good success harvesting when they smell particularly 'ripe' (and are in my favourite tric colouration).

Peace.


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## Uber Auxintaller (Oct 11, 2020)

Much appreciated, Puff. I was kinda thinkin the same thing myself... didn't want to accept it but I was thinkin it. A friend gave me this plant at the beginning of veg. It's now going into it's 10th week of flower. I guess I got one of them 10 to 12 plants. Talk about trying someone's patience on their first grow... . It's all good, though, I got lots to smoke while I wait. Thanks again and Happy thanksgiving


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## Puff_Dragon (Oct 11, 2020)

Uber Auxintaller said:


> Much appreciated, Puff. I was kinda thinkin the same thing myself... didn't want to accept it but I was thinkin it. A friend gave me this plant at the beginning of veg. It's now going into it's 10th week of flower. I guess I got one of them 10 to 12 plants. Talk about trying someone's patience on their first grow... . It's all good, though, I got lots to smoke while I wait. Thanks again and Happy thanksgiving


np.
fyi - I start counting flower days from when first pistils appear (about 7-10 days after flip). 
Most of my strains are 70% (plus) Sativa. 12 weeks is the standard flower time  I can cut off a week ..but I lose some quality (flavour+high).
I have a Malawi x Panama (100% Sativa) that I might take 14 weeks (currently at 82 days *84 days=12 weeks*)

Saying that, even the indica strain I grow takes 10.5 weeks (in flower) to really express itself.
And I always grow (now) using clones from a mother plant (as opposed to seed). Which gets my veg time down a little.


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## Cappuchino (Oct 13, 2020)

Yesterday I watched a lecture of a hash maker and he said interesting thing about when trichomes are ready to harvest (starts on 19 minute): 



 How does it correlate with your experience?


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## Uber Auxintaller (Oct 13, 2020)

Interesting.... Thanks Cap! If this really is the case... that there is a more obvious uniform indicator of ripeness across the entire plant taking guess work out of the equation... harvest time will become fool proof and quality will be optimal. Great benchmark... if this truly is the case across all strains.


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## tko2184 (Oct 20, 2020)

Question on taking plants early I have 5 in a tent pure headstash and I have spider mites it is day 56 week 9 beginning I’m thinking of pulling them here is why I need advice bc I did the alcohol spray thing and it worked but they came back of course then I vaccines but too time consuming and vac was big I was doing more damage than help and lastly bc o or two of the tops don’t snell like banana anymore but hey and the bud is slowly turning brown when cal ax and trich checked cloudy w amber and some clear but they apple fritter and banana og only need a week more and the fatso needs two roughly what should I do carry on or pull them if I pull am I sacrificing I just want the buds to smoke and get me high I was only getting a feel for them any advice is hella appreciated


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## wadehump (Nov 14, 2020)

I think I’m still 2-3 weeks away


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## ujay (Jan 12, 2021)

Hii guyss!!! Im a bit of a newbie here how far still do u think this plant has to go? its in its 43day of flower but i am a bit confused on what day it went into flower and what strain so i would appreciate some help plzz!! on the strain sidde it could be super silver or critical cheese the plant looks indicaish bushy and fat and it flowered fast.

I think i will look at it again at day 55?


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## Budzbuddha (Jan 12, 2021)

ujay said:


> View attachment 4794202View attachment 4794203
> 
> Hii guyss!!! Im a bit of a newbie here how far still do u think this plant has to go? its in its 43day of flower but i am a bit confused on what day it went into flower and what strain so i would appreciate some help plzz!! on the strain sidde it could be super silver or critical cheese the plant looks indicaish bushy and fat and it flowered fast.
> 
> I think i will look at it again at day 55?


Pic of whole flower and plant ....


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## ujay (Jan 13, 2021)

Budzbuddha said:


> Pic of whole flower and plant ....




They are outdoor plants


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## Pineapple_Purps (Jan 13, 2021)

Sveiki vaikinai. Kaip manote, kiek jis galėjo likti? : bigjoint: Tai saldaus sūrio autoflower. Now it's 62 days from seed.: piktžolė:


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## Puff_Dragon (Jan 15, 2021)

If you are new to growing, I would advise:
70 days for indica dominant. And 85 days for a sativa dominate.

The number of flowering days seed banks state are in the 'perfect' world (i.e. when you get the right genetic from a seed*each and every seed from the same strain will have a different flower time*).
The only times I've found seeds flowering at the times the breeders state ..is when I have paid way over £100 for a pack of 5 seeds (basically, the very high end seed banks - they seem to, generally, have more consistency in the genetics). dark horse genetics have been good for me (with the flower times). For lower end breeders (where you are paying under,say, £60 for a pack of 5 seeds), adding two/three weeks onto the flower time is a general rule for me. Although, this is just my experience mind 

One last thing, the time it takes for the flowers/buds to 'go off' (going past the harvest window) is FAR longer (with most strains) than people generally think.
I still haven't got to 'that point' with any of my strains ..and I've left them over two/three weeks beyond the time I know I can harvest.
100% indicas do seem to have a smaller harvest window than sativa's. But, hybrid strains (so common now) are weird. They often reflect both types. Basically, giving you much bigger harvest windows than some believe (generally).

Peace.


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## Pineapple_Purps (Jan 15, 2021)

[QUOTE = "Puff_Dragon, paštas: 16074806, narys: 921141"]
Jei dar nesate augęs, patarčiau:
70 dienų, kai dominuoja indica. Ir 85 dienos už sativa dominuoja.

Žydėjimo dienų skaičius sėklų bankuose yra „tobulame“ pasaulyje (kai kai iš sėklų gausite reikiamą genetinę medžiagą, * kiekviena pati padermės sėklos žydėjimo laiko autobusų sijonas *).
Vieninteliai atvejai, kai veisėjai nurodo žydinčią sėkmę, yra laikas, kai už 5 sėklų pakuotę sumokėjau daugiau nei 100 svarų sterlingų (iš esmės labai aukštų sėklų bankų - atrodo, kad jie turi daugiau genetinių nuoseklumų). tamsių arklių genetika man buvo gera (su žiedų laikais). Žemesnės klasės selekcininkams (kur mokate, tarkime, 60 svarų sterlingų už 5 sėklų pakuotę), man pridedant dvi / tris savaites į gėlių laiką yra įprasta taisyklė. Nors tai tik mano patirtis 

Paskutinis dalykas: laikas, per kurį žiedai / pumpurai „nuvažiuoja“ (praeina pro derliaus langą), yra TOLIAU ilgesnis (su daugeliu atmainų), nei žmonės paprastai mano.
Aš vis dar nesugebėjau dabar „to taško“ nė su viena savo atmaina.
Atrodo, kad 100% indikatorių derliaus langas yra mažesnis nei sativos. Tačiau hibridinės padermės (tokios dabar paplitusios) yra keistos. Jie dažnai atspindi abu tipus. Iš esmės, suteikiant jums daug didesnius derliaus langus, nei kai kurie mano (paprastai).

Ramybė.
[/ QUOTE]
Labai ačiū, pasirodo, kad aukščiausia klasės sėklos nurodo tikslesnį laiką, o žydėjimas trumpesnis, ar ne?
Ką manote apie „Hash Plant“ (132 reguliatorių sėklos kainuoja 132eur.) Ar šis bankas priskiriamas labai dideliam? Https://sensiseeds.com/es/semillas-de-cannabis/sensi-seeds/hash-plant


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## Puff_Dragon (Jan 15, 2021)

Pineapple_Purps said:


> [QUOTE = "Puff_Dragon, paštas: 16074806, narys: 921141"]
> Jei dar nesate augęs, patarčiau:
> 70 dienų, kai dominuoja indica. Ir 85 dienos už sativa dominuoja.
> 
> ...



I've heard Hash plant is nice. Though I have never grown it. 
And to be honest, I haven't bought from Sensi Seeds for a long time. I found they dropped in quality quite some years back. 
I think (I heard) they lost their original seed stock (in a police raid). 
And so Sensi had to 'reinvent' a lot of its strains (if not all). Sadly, that took the old mojo away. 
The last seeds I tried were Nl3 (northern lights 3) x Skunk no1. This strain was 60%Indica and 40% Sativa. I made a mother plant and cloned it for a few seasons.
It took 16 weeks to flower it successfully! And that was after growing it for three seasons before hand (with shorter flower times). 
The first time I flowered for 60 days = meh. 
Then 85 days (just a bit better then 'meh' quality - high was ok but the taste and smell were 'home grown' style).
Finally, while flowering others strains, I grew one more and just let it ride out till I saw some decent amber trics over the whole plant+buds (for the longest time the trics stayed clear / half clear / some cloudy / a few amber). 
16 weeks = BooYaa! (high, taste, smell ..perfect)

However, that was just too wild a flower time for me to consider (the same as some 100% landrace Sativas). 

A well priced Indica strain I would recommend (flowers in around 68 - 75 days) is a strain called Goldmine (Heavyweight Seeds). This is actually a cheaper strain but if your like that Afghani/spicy tasting indica vibe. It will hit the spot for you 




*Engaging attempt at Lithuanian translation *

Aš girdėjau, kad „Hash“ augalas yra gražus. Nors niekada jo neauginau.
O jei atvirai, seniai nebepirkau iš „Sensi Seeds“. Pastebėjau, kad jų kokybė prastėjo jau kelerius metus.
Manau (girdėjau), kad jie prarado savo pradinį sėklų kiekį (policijos reido metu).
Taigi Sensi turėjo „išradinėti“ daug savo padermių (jei ne visas). Deja, tai atėmė senąjį mojo.
Paskutinės bandytos sėklos buvo Nl3 (šiaurės pašvaistės 3) x „Skunk no1“. Ši padermė buvo 60% Indica ir 40% Sativa. Aš padariau motininį augalą ir kelis sezonus klonavau.
Užteko 16 savaičių, kad ją sėkmingai pagražintume! Taip buvo auginant tris sezonus prieš ranką (su trumpesniu žiedų laiku).
Pirmą kartą žydėjau 60 dienų = meh.
Tada 85 dienos (tik šiek tiek geriau nei „meh“ kokybė - aukšta buvo gerai, bet skonis ir kvapas buvo „namuose užauginto“ stiliaus).
Galiausiai, žydėdamas kitus įtempimus, aš auginau dar vieną ir tiesiog leidau jam važiuoti, kol pamačiau padoraus gintaro trišakius per visą augalą + pumpurus (ilgiausiai trikai liko skaidrūs / pusiau skaidrūs / kai kurie debesuoti / keli gintarai) .
16 savaičių = BooYaa! (aukštas, skonis, kvapas .. tobulas)

Tačiau tai buvo tiesiog per laukinis gėlių laikas, kurį galėjau apsvarstyti (tas pats, kas maždaug 100% „Land Satras“).

Geros kainos Indica padermė, kurią rekomenduočiau (žiedai maždaug per 68 - 75 dienas), yra padermė, vadinama aukso kasykla (sunkiasvorės sėklos). Tai iš tikrųjų yra pigesnė padermė, bet jei jums patinka tas afganų / aštraus skonio indica. Tai jums patiks


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## Pineapple_Purps (Jan 17, 2021)

[QUOTE = "Puff_Dragon, paštas: 16075924, narys: 921141"]
Aš dirėjau, kad „Hash“ augalas yra gražus. Nors niekada jo neauginau.
O jei atvirai, seniai nebepirkau iš „Sensi Seeds“. Pastebėjau, kad jų kokybė prastėjo jau kelerius metus.
Manau (beltėjau), kai jie prarado savo pradines sėklų atsargas (policijos reido metu).
Taigi Sensi jau „išradinėti“ daug savo padermių (jei ne vizos). Deja, tai atėmė senąjį mojo.
Paskutinės bandytos sėklos buvo Nl3 (šiaurės pašvaistės 3) x „Skunk no1“. Ši padermė buvo 60% Indica ir 40% Sativa. Aš padariau motininį augalą ir kelis sezonus klonavau.
Užteko 16 savaičių, kad ją geriau pagražintume! Taip buvo auginant tris sezonus prieš ranką (su trumpesniu žiedų laiku).
Pirmą kartą žydėjau 60 dienų = meh.
Tada 85 dienos (tik šiek tiek geriau nei „meh“ kokybė - aukšta buvo gerai, bet skonis ir kvapas buvo „namuose užauginto“ stiliaus).
Galiausiai, žydint kitus įtempimus, aš auginau dar vieną ir tiesiog radau jam važiuoti, kol pamačiau padoraus gintaro triukus per visą augalą + pumpurus (ilgiausiai trikai liko skaidrūs / pusiau aiškūs / kai kurie debesuoti / keli gintarai).
16 savaičių = BooYaa! (aukštas, skonis, kvapas .. tobulas)

Bet tai buvo tiesiog per laukinį gėlių laiką, kurį galėjau apsvarstyti (tas pats, kas maždaug 100% „Land Satras“).

Geros kainos Indica padermė, kurią rekomenduočiau (žiedai maždaug per 68–75 dienas), yra padermė, vadinama aukso kasykla (sunkiasvorės sėklos). Tai iš tikrųjų yra pigesnė padermė, bet jei jums patinka tas afganų / aštraus skonio indica. Tai jums patiks




* Įtraukiantis bandymas versti į lietuvių kalbą *

Aš dirėjau, kad „Hash“ augalas yra gražus. Nors niekada jo neauginau.
O jei atvirai, seniai nebepirkau iš „Sensi Seeds“. Pastebėjau, kad jų kokybė prastėjo jau kelerius metus.
Manau (vyriškas), kai jie prarado savo pradinį sėklų kiekį (policijos reido metu).
Taigi Sensi jau „išradinėti“ daug savo padermių (jei ne vizos). Deja, tai atėmė senąjį mojo.
Paskutinės bandytos sėklos buvo Nl3 (šiaurės pašvaistės 3) x „Skunk no1“. Ši padermė buvo 60% Indica ir 40% Sativa. Aš padariau motininį augalą ir kelis sezonus klonavau.
Užteko 16 savaičių, kad ją geriau pagražintume! Taip buvo auginant tris sezonus prieš ranką (su trumpesniu žiedų laiku).
Pirmą kartą žydėjau 60 dienų = meh.
Tada 85 dienos (tik šiek tiek geriau nei „meh“ kokybė - aukšta buvo gerai, bet skonis ir kvapas buvo „namuose užauginto“ stiliaus).
Galiausiai, žydėdamas kitus įtempimus, aš auginau dar vieną ir tiesiog radau jam važiuoti, kol pamačiau padoraus gintaro trišakius per visą augalą + pumpurus (ilgiausiai trikai liko skaidrūs / pusiau aiškūs / kai kurie debesuoti / keli gintarai).
16 savaičių = BooYaa! (aukštas, skonis, kvapas .. tobulas)

Bet tai buvo tiesiog per laukinį gėlių laiką, kurį galėjau apsvarstyti (tas pats, kas maždaug 100% „Land Satras“).

Geros kainos Indica padermė, kurią rekomenduočiau (žiedai maždaug per 68 - 75 dienas), yra padermė, vadinama aukso kasykla (sunkiasvorės sėklos). Tai iš tikrųjų yra pigesnė padermė, bet jei jums patinka tas afganų / aštraus skonio indica. Tai jums patiks

[/ QUOTE] Ačiū, mielas drauge , : piktžolė: o tas augalas turi ne tik atpalaiduojantį jausmą, bet ir sunkumą bei įkvėpimą? Beje, gal ką rekomenduotum iš greitai žydinčių indikacijų, apie kuriuos nori daug juoktis ir kurie labiau veikia dėl sekso?  : „Saunus“: [/ QUOTE]


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## SuperbUdDJ (Jan 23, 2021)

CBN is good it makes the THC more potent, where the heck are you getting your information from?


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## Pineapple_Purps (Jan 24, 2021)

Ei, draugai, nuo mano sėklų (7-8 savaičių žydėjimo) praėjo 72 sėklos. I was only able to find a magnifying glass 8 times, I took a picture, is it possible to figure out which stage the trichromes are in? I will be grateful for the help, friends


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## Deusracing (Jan 26, 2021)

k0ijn said:


> Harvesting your weed based on trichomes is probably the easiest way for most growers to harvest as close to peak harvest as possible.
> 
> 
> The difficulty in the method comes with how to determine the state of the trichomes and what each state means.
> ...


Especially when it comes to haze strains which may take upwards to 90-120 days to mature. None of mine after 70 days of 12/12 showed any promise of amber. But all the other signs of maturing and ripening were there


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## living gardening (Mar 1, 2021)

k0ijn said:


> Nutrient storage in cannabis plants is rather complicated, I've written extensively about it on this forum, you can find it if you search my nick and nutrient storage so I won't go into much detail here.
> Suffice to say that you cannot 'clear' chemical taste out of cannabis, since it won't have any chemical taste in the first place, unless the particular strain you're growing has that trait.
> Nutrients are not stored directly in the buds or calyxes. Nutrients are stored in the leaves and roots and transported around to fit the needs of the plant.
> But nutrients moved to the calyxes are used up very fast, it's almost impossible to have an abundance of nutrients in the calyxes, where it is quite possible to have that in the leaves and roots.
> ...


I would like to state that you can taste the difference between organic and salt grown . . .


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## A Scanner Dankly (Mar 1, 2021)

living gardening said:


> I would like to state that you can taste the difference between organic and salt grown . . .


I reduce feed last two weeks and then to nothing last few days and definitely notice the difference. Burns cleaner faster with less cure. Have you ever smoked bud that sparked, crackled and popped? That is overfed bud, the joint ash burns black and the thing keeps going out. And the post you quoted is inaccurate. Some nutrients are mobile and and trasported through the plant, but others are immobile and once deposited in plant tissues are not.


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## living gardening (Mar 2, 2021)

A Scanner Dankly said:


> I reduce feed last two weeks and then to nothing last few days and definitely notice the difference. Burns cleaner faster with less cure. Have you ever smoked bud that sparked, crackled and popped? That is overfed bud, the joint ash burns black and the thing keeps going out. And the post you quoted is inaccurate. Some nutrients are mobile and and trasported through the plant, but others are immobile and once deposited in plant tissues are not.


That is true. That is why cannabis/hemp is a known bio-accumulator. In new living soils, we're told to discard all first grow fan leaves due to the accumulation of possible heavy metals. If you're only growing with salts/chems are you really understanding what parts and pieces of those chems you are consuming yourself? For me feeding SST's and lacto and molasses are all continuing because you're priming the soil for the next grow. Also it is wise to figure sourcing on ferts and nutes. Just my .02


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## Northwood (Mar 2, 2021)

A Scanner Dankly said:


> Have you ever smoked bud that sparked, crackled and popped?


I remember weed like that. Sometimes I'd miss a seed or two in that 1970s Mexican stuff when rolling a joint. I had so many burn spots in the seat of my car


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## jambud (May 30, 2021)

Agraves said:


> So, I just went outside to check on it and it broke in half. I have no idea what happened. Could have been a squirrel or could have just been weak from improper care. I’ve been learning as I go, which probably hasn’t been easy on my plant.


 Those damn squirrels, I feed them and they still cause mischief! But you could save that - I've been shocked at how many horrible breaks with just a little left attached I"ve saved by just putting it together and holding with some scotch tape. If you still want her to keep growing try it - they repair very well.


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## living gardening (May 30, 2021)

jambud said:


> Those damn squirrels, I feed them and they still cause mischief! But you could save that - I've been shocked at how many horrible breaks with just a little left attached I"ve saved by just putting it together and holding with some scotch tape. If you still want her to keep growing try it - they repair very well.


I agree. I straight broke some limbs. If you brace it and keep the area together it can be pretty amazing what can heal.


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## Splash Gordon (Jun 24, 2021)

Thoughts, I’m debating whether to leave here in dark for 48 then harvest or wait a few days ?


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## Budley Doright (Jun 25, 2021)

Just curious about why the darkness? And yes it looks good to go IMO. All I do is stop watering a couple of days before as it seems to help with the drying process and may possibly stress it into its final push to produce resin (no proof though) and I also reduce humidity but again no proof it helps lol. And if I’m running out I just cut it, dry it, and jar it .


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## Splash Gordon (Jun 25, 2021)

Budley Doright said:


> Just curious about why the darkness? And yes it looks good to go IMO. All I do is stop watering a couple of days before as it seems to help with the drying process and may possibly stress it into its final push to produce resin (no proof though) and I also reduce humidity but again no proof it helps lol. And if I’m running out I just cut it, dry it, and jar it .


There was a study done by, The Stichting Institute of Medical marijuana (SIMM). SIMM’s growers separated a crop of mature plants, harvested half of them and kept the other half in absolute darkness for 72 hours before cutting and drying. Analysis of the resulting dried buds showed that some varieties had seen an increase of THC of up to 30%, while CBD and CBN remained the same.

I plan on experimenting on my own crop to see if there’s a noticeable difference, but that’s down the road lol.


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## Budley Doright (Jun 25, 2021)

Splash Gordon said:


> There was a study done by, The Stichting Institute of Medical marijuana (SIMM). SIMM’s growers separated a crop of mature plants, harvested half of them and kept the other half in absolute darkness for 72 hours before cutting and drying. Analysis of the resulting dried buds showed that some varieties had seen an increase of THC of up to 30%, while CBD and CBN remained the same.
> 
> I plan on experimenting on my own crop to see if there’s a noticeable difference, but that’s down the road lol.


Yes I would suggest trying it on your own as the study you posted is not anywhere to be found so I really don’t think it exists. I’m not saying it doesn’t work somehow. As with anything re growing I say try it and see for yourself due to the amount of bro science out there.


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## 1212ham (Jun 25, 2021)

Splash Gordon said:


> Thoughts, I’m debating whether to leave here in dark for 48 then harvest or wait a few days ?


I saw Dutch Passion suggest it for one of their strains


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## jambud (Jun 27, 2021)

IMO its just another one of several techniques used to "STRESS" the plant out just for harvesting...ie darkness, cutting, no water all stressers. The idea is that stressing her out causes a reaction that tends to increase THC &/or trichomes but ymmv and its very hard to know how much difference. That said it makes sense and I do find a bit of a difference and usually do some form of mild stressor myself. 

But I'm against the method of blowtorching alternated by acid baths -- seem like a tad overkill to me  jk, of course.


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## JanisJ (Oct 26, 2021)

k0ijn said:


> Harvesting your weed based on trichomes is probably the easiest way for most growers to harvest as close to peak harvest as possible.
> 
> 
> The difficulty in the method comes with how to determine the state of the trichomes and what each state means.
> ...


Can you tell if you don't have a loupe or microscope? Tomorrow is 8 weeks flowering


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## Budzbuddha (Oct 26, 2021)

JanisJ said:


> Can you tell if you don't have a loupe or microscope? Tomorrow is 8 weeks floweringView attachment 5017106View attachment 5017104View attachment 5017105


Keep going


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## Budzbuddha (Oct 26, 2021)

First of all … congrats on a beautiful girl.

Take breeder harvest estimates with a grain of salt.
2 weeks from now flower will look even better.


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## JanisJ (Oct 26, 2021)

Budzbuddha said:


> First of all … congrats on a beautiful girl.
> 
> Take breeder harvest estimates with a grain of salt.
> 2 weeks from now flower will look even better.


Thank you! I started withholding added nutrients 2 weeks ago and have flushed, which looks like I shouldn't have after reading more on here...should I start nutrients again, although I also have them in a sort of "super soil" with all the macros/micros....its been a hot mess at times because it just became recreational here so it's my first real grow. Thank you for your time and mind!


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## PioneerValleyOG (Oct 26, 2021)

JanisJ said:


> Can you tell if you don't have a loupe or microscope? Tomorrow is 8 weeks floweringView attachment 5017106View attachment 5017104View attachment 5017105


Nice. See how the shiny-ness is gone and your more fuzzy? Good... but could be better. Just dont fall into the 'let it go until it's even better.' The older the plant gets, the weaker it becomes re: resistance, disease, mold rot, etc. I've lost great plants waiting a couple few weeks past when I should have harvested. Nice work tho.


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## PioneerValleyOG (Oct 26, 2021)




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## Budzbuddha (Oct 26, 2021)

JanisJ said:


> Can you tell if you don't have a loupe or microscope? Tomorrow is 8 weeks floweringView attachment 5017106View attachment 5017104View attachment 5017105


what strain ?


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## JanisJ (Oct 26, 2021)

Budzbuddha said:


> what strain ?


I dont know the strain because I've been collecting seeds for years and planted around 30, only 9 came up 5 females, then 3 cause of hermies, now just the one cause the 2 outdoors started getting bud rot & I had to harvest...they all looked different...this one smells very diesel though. I started it from seed in Late April, early May


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## JanisJ (Oct 26, 2021)

PioneerValleyOG said:


> Nice. See how the shiny-ness is gone and your more fuzzy? Good... but could be better. Just dont fall into the 'let it go until it's even better.' The older the plant gets, the weaker it becomes re: resistance, disease, mold rot, etc. I've lost great plants waiting a couple few weeks past when I should have harvested. Nice work tho.


Thank you!


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## Clink78 (Oct 29, 2021)

Looks fire to me, I’d cut in a few days.

Trichs are a good indicator, but it’s the individual seed pods that are more important to me. I only consume the pods nowadays, no sugar leaves, so I want well-formed juicy pods. When 95% of the pistils have browned it’s usually a good sign.


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## JanisJ (Oct 30, 2021)

Okay, it's just been a few days but I got a macro lense now.... so still another week + ?


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## JanisJ (Oct 30, 2021)




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## JanisJ (Oct 30, 2021)

Clink78 said:


> Looks fire to me, I’d cut in a few days.
> 
> Trichs are a good indicator, but it’s the individual seed pods that are more important to me. I only consume the pods nowadays, no sugar leaves, so I want well-formed juicy pods. When 95% of the pistils have browned it’s usually a good sign.


Thank you!


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## 75triumph (Nov 8, 2021)




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## 75triumph (Nov 8, 2021)

Fast Buds 8 weeks Black Berry Close???


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## jambud (Nov 11, 2021)

75triumph said:


> Fast Buds 8 weeks Black Berry Close???


I'd say yes before I saw it shooting all those new white pistils. Did you start flushing or anything different? IMO, she 'ain't done yet'. I'd never cut something that's growing that much new stuff. I'd watch trichome colors carefully but IMO she's still bulking up!


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## NanoGadget (Nov 11, 2021)

75triumph said:


> Fast Buds 8 weeks Black Berry Close???


check back in 10 to 14 days.


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## 75triumph (Nov 11, 2021)

Thanks see some clouding up. Purple tones hard to see trichomes. Flushing now getting ready


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## sunwestgenetics2021 (Nov 21, 2021)

Thanks! this helps first timers on their first harvest


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## stawawager (Dec 3, 2021)

Hmmm? Can you do selective havesting. My top canopy has matured faster than anything below the canopy. Can I let the lowers go for another week or 2 and chop da top?


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## 75triumph (Dec 6, 2021)

Just chopped mine after 10 weeks. And yes an unusual color. Your tops look like more time needed as mine were advised. 
Small return with harvest, a wait and see now.


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## Doleritejack (Jan 20, 2022)

I'm just finishing my first grow of Pineapple Express (or that was what I bought?). But right near the end we had a massive heat wave and the grow room temp went as high as 47C!!! I've managed to salvage some of it but the yield is way down and buds ae loose and leafy The trichomes are 90% cloudy and approx 10% amber but there's also a few distorted trichomes that are PURPLE. The bulb on the end of these ones is not circular. It's long, thin and straggly. Anyone seen this before? I use a 20 times loupe for first inspection and then use a microscope at about 40 times. So the definition is pretty clear and it's definitely purple. The heat wave of 40C+ is still with us and drying slowly is a major prob. Curing is and keeping it from turning crispy is also a battle. I've found a cool space and got the temp down to about 24C. But I fear damage has been done. Smells OK though, but no sweet aroma yet, only hay.


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## Mullumbimby (Jan 27, 2022)

stawawager said:


> Hmmm? Can you do selective havesting. My top canopy has matured faster than anything below the canopy. Can I let the lowers go for another week or 2 and chop da top?


Yes, and some people get good results from this approach, but remember your plant will be using up space and light that another plant coud be using to get started, so nothing comes for free.


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## Kipkib (Feb 9, 2022)

k0ijn said:


> Harvesting your weed based on trichomes is probably the easiest way for most growers to harvest as close to peak harvest as possible.
> 
> 
> The difficulty in the method comes with how to determine the state of the trichomes and what each state means.
> ...


Hello am I ready for harvest? Thanks


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## Northeastskier (Mar 31, 2022)

k0ijn said:


> The strain phenotype (wether it's a Sativa or and Indica) determines overall wether you get an energetic high or a couch lock high.


Incorrect and a well propagated fallacy. Sativa or Indica determine the plants morphology (shape) and nothing else. You could obtain various chemotypes of Sativa or Indica with completely different psychoactive qualities, or different morphologies with the same psychoactive qualities.


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## Mudstone (Apr 13, 2022)

Hi All, appreciate any advice you can give. Growing 3 females of unknown strain, pretty sure they're are two stubby little indicas and one sativa. Im battling to pick the right time to flush. On one indica, hairs are just starting to go red, bottom leaves are yellowing and I think trichs are going cloudy, but its bloody hard to tell, thats the first three shitty photos. If this looks a little cloudy, and about another two weeks to harvest, and I can flush nowish to you guys, Im think im on the right track. Other two pics are the other two, any thoughts/feedback would be good. Cheers


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## Caleb222 (Apr 29, 2022)

Any one tell me if this looks ready


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## StoneyJake (Apr 30, 2022)

Caleb222 said:


> Any one tell me if this looks ready


a couple more weeks IMO


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## hillbill (Apr 30, 2022)

Too much N and flowers will be diminished, get ya a 30x Glass or handheld Microscope.


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## Caleb222 (Apr 30, 2022)

Can’t be to much n I only use half strength of wat it says


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## RealG8R95 (Jul 10, 2022)

k0ijn said:


> Harvesting your weed based on trichomes is probably the easiest way for most growers to harvest as close to peak harvest as possible.
> 
> 
> The difficulty in the method comes with how to determine the state of the trichomes and what each state means.
> ...


Appreciate you posting this, I learned a few things I thought I knew.


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## PioneerValleyOG (Jul 10, 2022)

RealG8R95 said:


> Appreciate you posting this, I learned a few things I thought I knew.


I believe you left out the most important element.
You must check the trikes on the calyx, not the leaf, not the bud.
Only the calyx trikes will reveal the stage you desire


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jul 11, 2022)

PioneerValleyOG said:


> I believe you left out the most important element.
> You must check the trikes on the calyx, not the leaf, not the bud.
> Only the calyx trikes will reveal the stage you desire


think you misspoke, calyxes ARE the buds...at least the constituent components


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## PioneerValleyOG (Jul 11, 2022)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> think you misspoke, calyxes ARE the buds...at least the constituent components


Pardon me.

Seems to be a very small bud, if so.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jul 11, 2022)

PioneerValleyOG said:


> Pardon me.View attachment 5161789
> 
> Seems to be a very small bud, if so.


buds are stacks of calyxes...peel a bud apart, and you get a pile of calyxes and sugar leaves.
CALYX:
Botany
the sepals of a flower, typically forming a whorl that encloses the petals and forms a protective layer around a flower in bud.
the white pistils or stigma come out of the calyxes, all those white hairs are on separate calyxes.

https://www.royalqueenseeds.com/blog-getting-to-know-the-cannabis-calyx-resinous-to-the-top-n414


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## PioneerValleyOG (Jul 11, 2022)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> buds are stacks of calyxes...peel a bud apart, and you get a pile of calyxes and sugar leaves.
> CALYX:
> Botany
> the sepals of a flower, typically forming a whorl that encloses the petals and forms a protective layer around a flower in bud.
> ...


Actually, the calyx is the protective layer if the sepals. However, I am not disagreeing with you. We seem to both be referring to factual information we have learned.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jul 11, 2022)

PioneerValleyOG said:


> Actually, the calyx is the protective layer if the sepals. However, I am not disagreeing with you. We seem to both be referring to factual information we have learned.


yeah, the calyx is part of the sepal, but its the part you see, so i tend to refer to the whole structure as the calyx. guess i should say sepal, but habits are hard to break


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## PioneerValleyOG (Jul 11, 2022)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> yeah, the calyx is part of the sepal, but its the part you see, so i tend to refer to the whole structure as the calyx. guess i should say sepal, but habits are hard to break


All good. I consider myself a student of the art, and have learned and continue to learn much here. Thank you for your contribution always good know the intricacies.


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## Ryax (Jul 19, 2022)

do you guys think my autoflower wedding cake is ready?


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## Nope_49595933949 (Jul 19, 2022)

Ryax said:


> do you guys think my autoflower wedding cake is ready? View attachment 5165897


Do you see all those white hairs?


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## Jafo232 (Jul 19, 2022)

Whatayall think? Gorilla Glue #4 auto, approaching week 10. Sorry for some of the fuzzy photos. My Iphone 12 just isn't up to it I guess.


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## Nope_49595933949 (Jul 19, 2022)

Jafo232 said:


> Whatayall think? Gorilla Glue #4 auto, approaching week 10. Sorry for some of the fuzzy photos. My Iphone 12 just isn't up to it I guess.


All the white hairs say not ready.


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## Jafo232 (Jul 19, 2022)

Nope_49595933949 said:


> All the white hairs say not ready.


Thanks. I should have mentioned that I am as colorblind as a dog. Often some shades of green look white to me (think stop light green) so assuming the hairs are white is usually a bad idea for me.  Thanks for the feedback.


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## Nope_49595933949 (Jul 19, 2022)

Jafo232 said:


> Thanks. I should have mentioned that I am as colorblind as a dog. Often some shades of green look white to me (think stop light green) so assuming the hairs are white is usually a bad idea for me.  Thanks for the feedback.


I'm colorblind as well, white hairs stand out.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jul 19, 2022)

Ryax said:


> do you guys think my autoflower wedding cake is ready? View attachment 5165897


it would get you high right now, but in another week to ten days, it will get you a lot higher...


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## PioneerValleyOG (Jul 19, 2022)

Ryax said:


> do you guys think my autoflower wedding cake is ready? View attachment 5165897


Not quite done.


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## PioneerValleyOG (Jul 19, 2022)

Jafo232 said:


> Whatayall think? Gorilla Glue #4 auto, approaching week 10. Sorry for some of the fuzzy photos. My Iphone 12 just isn't up to it I guess.


Looking good, still a ways to go.


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## Jafo232 (Jul 19, 2022)

PioneerValleyOG said:


> Looking good, still a ways to go.


I checked it with the loupe this afternoon and the trichomes on the buds of the main cola are definitely no longer clear like they were 3-4 days ago. They have turned slightly cloudy. What should I go by, the white hairs or the trichomes? 

I was hoping not to have to harvest this right now, maybe in a couple weeks, but this has me a little concerned.


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## Nope_49595933949 (Jul 19, 2022)

Jafo232 said:


> I checked it with the loupe this afternoon and the trichomes on the buds of the main cola are definitely no longer clear like they were 3-4 days ago. They have turned slightly cloudy. What should I go by, the white hairs or the trichomes?
> 
> I was hoping not to have to harvest this right now, maybe in a couple weeks, but this has me a little concerned.


Look at the tricomes once the hairs have all turned.


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jul 19, 2022)

Jafo232 said:


> I checked it with the loupe this afternoon and the trichomes on the buds of the main cola are definitely no longer clear like they were 3-4 days ago. They have turned slightly cloudy. What should I go by, the white hairs or the trichomes?
> 
> I was hoping not to have to harvest this right now, maybe in a couple weeks, but this has me a little concerned.


going a couple of weeks long is a minor problem compared to going a couple of weeks short...
there are a few strains that don't show amber trichs, but most do, and you want to see about an even number of ambers and clears, with the large majority being milky...you'll always have a few clears, but you want as few as possible.
if you never see ambers on that plant, go when there are less than 15% clear, and mostly cloudy/milky.
as far as the hairs...the more that have turned brown and kinked up, the better, but as long as at least 75-80% have, and the trichs look good, i'd go with it


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## Jafo232 (Jul 24, 2022)

I wish I had a good microscope for taking photos, so open to any suggestions. Anyway, I believe the hairs are changing color but it could also just be my colorblindness. What do you all think?


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## Roger A. Shrubber (Jul 24, 2022)

Jafo232 said:


> I wish I had a good microscope for taking photos, so open to any suggestions. Anyway, I believe the hairs are changing color but it could also just be my colorblindness. What do you all think?


starting to, but still a long way to go, at least three weeks, maybe a little more.


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## PioneerValleyOG (Jul 24, 2022)

Jafo232 said:


> I wish I had a good microscope for taking photos, so open to any suggestions. Anyway, I believe the hairs are changing color but it could also just be my colorblindness. What do you all think?


Here's a amazon clip-on to my android. New it comes with white and infra blue light, but my batteries have long since died.

Works better with my wife's iPhone. And new batteries. Look on the calyx for accurate trike readings.
Lastly, I have a lot of red hairs on my autos, and they just don't show in the pics for some reason. Bizarre.


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## Jafo232 (Aug 10, 2022)

Ok, here is an update after a couple weeks now. Whataya all think?


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## DrOgkush (Aug 10, 2022)

That’s done. But always remember it’s your plant. Your only going off opinions. Unless you display the exact info. We can’t accurately predict your harvest. And check your trichs on actual flower. Or a good section of calyx stacked. We’re harvesting flower. THC concentration levels are located in the trichs heads. That’s what we’re harvesting. Not pistils. It just turns out that 90% of the time. Your ripe flowers will have all orange hairs. But again. That’s assuming a perfect environment and perfect feed rate. Take a sample. Dry it out a few days. Smoke it. You like it. Chop. A few days late will not hurt your harvest.


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## SamRD (Sep 7, 2022)

Help me out, I have no idea whats going on. This is "supposedly" a fast plant that flowers in 7 weeks. Today is the first day of week 9 and this is what it looks like.


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## Nope_49595933949 (Sep 7, 2022)

Keep feeding


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## ClaytonNewbilFontaine (Sep 7, 2022)

SamRD said:


> Help me out, I have no idea whats going on. This is "supposedly" a fast plant that flowers in 7 weeks. Today is the first day of week 9 and this is what it looks like.


Hi I'm a new grower but on my first grow this is what my buds were looking like towards the end. I'm sure someone more experienced will chime in, but it looks like you've got some foxtailing. I had the same. Mine came from a heat wave we were going through raising my tent temps to 93°+. Where they had always been in the mid 70's. Also bc of that heat I believe some of my trichs ambered up and I think I chopped to early. When I started going over more pics, after I chopped, I was seeing a lot of clear trichs. Vs the ones on the top being at least 10% amber and cloudy. Someone told me my trichs look like they had heat damage and that the amber wasn't from it maturing. That's when I looked at more pics and he was right. I'm just relaying my exp. Yours look like they might be done. But I'm not saying that you should chop. I'm not exp enough to give you that info. But they do look like they're foxtailing a bit. Maybe they're too close to the light? They look really freaking awesome though, you've done an awesome job.


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## xtsho (Sep 7, 2022)

SamRD said:


> Help me out, I have no idea whats going on. This is "supposedly" a fast plant that flowers in 7 weeks. Today is the first day of week 9 and this is what it looks like.


You can't go by the stated flowering time. Outfits use numbers lower than what it really takes because people want fast flowering plants and they want to sell seeds. Had they stated that it would take 10-11 weeks would you have still bought the seeds or would you have bought something else that had a faster stated flower time? Basically many seed suppliers lie.


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## SamRD (Sep 7, 2022)

ClaytonNewbilFontaine said:


> Hi I'm a new grower but on my first grow this is what my buds were looking like towards the end. I'm sure someone more experienced will chime in, but it looks like you've got some foxtailing. I had the same. Mine came from a heat wave we were going through raising my tent temps to 93°+. Where they had always been in the mid 70's. Also bc of that heat I believe some of my trichs ambered up and I think I chopped to early. When I started going over more pics, after I chopped, I was seeing a lot of clear trichs. Vs the ones on the top being at least 10% amber and cloudy. Someone told me my trichs look like they had heat damage and that the amber wasn't from it maturing. That's when I looked at more pics and he was right. I'm just relaying my exp. Yours look like they might be done. But I'm not saying that you should chop. I'm not exp enough to give you that info. But they do look like they're foxtailing a bit. Maybe they're too close to the light? They look really freaking awesome though, you've done an awesome job.





xtsho said:


> You can't go by the stated flowering time. Outfits use numbers lower than what it really takes because people want fast flowering plants and they want to sell seeds. Had they stated that it would take 10-11 weeks would you have still bought the seeds or would you have bought something else that had a faster stated flower time? Basically many seed suppliers lie.


You're right, there's foxtailing because it's too close to the light, it's a closet grow and I don't have more vertical space. That's why I'm confused, are they ready and look like this because they are too close to the light and hence foxtailing or do they simply need more time?

I understand that suppliers lie. I just wanted to try a fast plant but it ended up having the same flowering time as a normal fem. I've been growing a while with canuk seeds and I'm done, thinking I'm being smart buying always on those 50% discount days. I bet this is just some random seed, I feel like they just sort seeds to indica and sativa and sell it like that to small customers like myself and then quality to bulk and big spenders. Yesterday I ordered a batch from Tiki Madman, paid 4x the price but I bet it's quality genetics.


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## ClaytonNewbilFontaine (Sep 7, 2022)

SamRD said:


> You're right, there's foxtailing because it's too close to the light, it's a closet grow and I don't have more vertical space. That's why I'm confused, are they ready and look like this because they are too close to the light and hence foxtailing or do they simply need more time?
> 
> I understand that suppliers lie. I just wanted to try a fast plant but it ended up having the same flowering time as a normal fem. I've been growing a while with canuk seeds and I'm done, thinking I'm being smart buying always on those 50% discount days. I bet this is just some random seed, I feel like they just sort seeds to indica and sativa and sell it like that to small customers like myself and then quality to bulk and big spenders. Yesterday I ordered a batch from Tiki Madman, paid 4x the price but I bet it's quality genetics.





SamRD said:


> You're right, there's foxtailing because it's too close to the light, it's a closet grow and I don't have more vertical space. That's why I'm confused, are they ready and look like this because they are too close to the light and hence foxtailing or do they simply need more time?
> 
> I understand that suppliers lie. I just wanted to try a fast plant but it ended up having the same flowering time as a normal fem. I've been growing a while with canuk seeds and I'm done, thinking I'm being smart buying always on those 50% discount days. I bet this is just some random seed, I feel like they just sort seeds to indica and sativa and sell it like that to small customers like myself and then quality to bulk and big spenders. Yesterday I ordered a batch from Tiki Madman, paid 4x the price but I bet it's quality genetics.


I've def wondered about that myself. With my exp level I would never even know. My first order came from ilgm. They made me feel like that. It was their genetics not any popular breeder, they could've thrown anything in there. Now I order from nasc and multiverse. I would like to order directly from the breeders themselves but the seed banks have those sales and I end up taking advantage of them. 

As far as the foxtailing, when it was happening to mine someone on reddit said they'd just chop now bc it was just going to keep happening. But I didn't feel very good about that advise, so I didn't take it. I got another ac and got my temps down. I did chop about a week after though. I think yours need a bit more time, but hopefully someone else will help with that. Do you have any close ups of the trichomes from different areas of the plant?


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## SamRD (Sep 7, 2022)

ClaytonNewbilFontaine said:


> I've def wondered about that myself. With my exp level I would never even know. My first order came from ilgm. They made me feel like that. It was their genetics not any popular breeder, they could've thrown anything in there. Now I order from nasc and multiverse. I would like to order directly from the breeders themselves but the seed banks have those sales and I end up taking advantage of them.
> 
> As far as the foxtailing, when it was happening to mine someone on reddit said they'd just chop now bc it was just going to keep happening. But I didn't feel very good about that advise, so I didn't take it. I got another ac and got my temps down. I did chop about a week after though. I think yours need a bit more time, but hopefully someone else will help with that. Do you have any close ups of the trichomes from different areas of the plant?


It's hard to take proper pics through the magnifier but here are some


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## ClaytonNewbilFontaine (Sep 7, 2022)

SamRD said:


> It's hard to take proper pics through the magnifier but here are some


There's a couple pics that still look pretty clear. But you've def got some cloudy going on. I think you've got a couple weeks yet, maybe more, but those are decent pics for what you've got to work with.


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## berrybad (Sep 13, 2022)

would be great if someone could update OP with new images


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## raratt (Sep 30, 2022)

I have some hemp plants that have cloudy trichomes. Wondering if there is any difference of when to harvest them as opposed to regular weed. I was gong to go until 30% amber but not sure if that is correct for CBD.


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