# 4X4 1200w V-ScrOG Cage of Green



## Webbdtoez (Nov 8, 2013)

Just thought I would share my long awaited grow. Ive been wanting to test this method out for awhile now. & its relatively hard to find good information on this type of setup and technique, so i will try to post every detail to help future v-scroggers.

3-Berry Bomb & 3-Cinderella 99
2- 600w MH/HPS
4X4 tent
6- 5 gallon buckets circled around each other with 5 ft wielded wire attached

Currently germinating seeds but will post pics once I turn the lights on 

This is going to be fun!


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## Ammastor (Nov 8, 2013)

Cant wait to see what everything looks like and how it works for ya. Keep us posted.


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## whodatnation (Nov 9, 2013)

Be sure to keep us posted  What info are you having trouble finding?


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## Webbdtoez (Nov 12, 2013)

Heres a couple pics


Hoping you guys can help me with my setup in order to get my temps down and humidity up.
Current temps are 90-95 and Rh is 15%-20%.

My setup:

-1 6" intake fan pulling air from outside through a small opening in my window(trying to keep a low profile)(on the left top of tent)
-1 12" fan zip tied in front of the intake fan to help pull air in(not much room to stand the fan up anywhere and let it oscillate)
-1 6" exhaust fan connected to a stiro-foam cooler(best i could come up with)(I dont want to exhaust directly outside)(on the top right)
-1 12" fan zip tied 2 feet below the exhaust fan, blowing air through the middle area of the tent.
-1 8" fan sitting on the floor, cooling the lights.
-1 5-gallon cooler of water to help with humidity(not helping much at all)

Temps outside are 50 at night 35-40 during the day
very low humidity

What can i do?


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## Prawn Connery (Nov 13, 2013)

One thing that will help with humidity is growing in drain-to-waste coco. With large, moist pots (coco should be watered frequently, unlike soil) there will be a lot of evaporation and increased humidity in your room. In fact, this causes problems with mold sometimes in my grows - especially during the humid months.

If you are planning on growing in soil, have a think about it: those little soil cups can drop straight into bigger coco pots without any problems. Your yeilds will be better with coco compared to soil, and you can hand-water initially until you get the hang of automatic watering or drip-feeding. Plenty of info on this site.

Another thing that can help is to grow indica varieties or hybrids, as they actually like drier conditions and are more prone to mold than sativas. Indicas originate from the Hindu Kush and high-altitude areas of Central Asia, so are naturally grown in very dry conditions. Sativas originate from the tropics, so do better with a little more humidity.

As for being a little dry, I wouldn't worry about it too much: it may be a blessing when it comes time to harvest and you have no mold! We Aussie growers have been growing in much drier conditions than yours forever. It's not uncommon to have 5-10% humidity during the drier months here. It is dry, dry, dry!


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## Webbdtoez (Nov 14, 2013)

Alright guys, heres my scenario-

I need to exhaust either outside my bedroom window or exhaust into my adjoining bathroom.

I live on the second floor of an apartment building, facing the back of the property, no other neighbors. My question is, is how safe would it be to exhaust out of my window?
I plan on making a box for my window to keep it low profile if i do this.

My bathroom has a fan in it but no easy way to route the duct to the closed room.

The only thing i have for odor control is a gallon of Ona gel. It works very well, but i am assuming that if i did vent outside, i would need to position the ona gel to where it would be in front of the exhaust fan.

amirite? what are your thought RIU?


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## Webbdtoez (Nov 26, 2013)

As I said before, theres still problems finding a middle ground with managing temps.
Intake is coming from the outside. Temps are varying between high 40's during the day and low 30's during the night.
My light turns off at midnight and on at 6am. I know now that i should have had lights on at night to balance the chilly weather instead of during the day.

Is there anyway to adjust my schedule? I was thinking of running for 24 hours on and then adjusting within a day to 18/6 (on at 6pm-12pm. off at 12pm-6pm)

The exhaust is just venting into the room, with a fan directing it towards the bathroom, where the fart fan there slowly exhausts out.

Also, with endless searching and no results, im wondering what to do about my second 600w. How would having two 600w lights on during veg cycle differ from only having one? Would it only be beneficial if the second light was turned on during the flower cycle? (I like to understand things scientifically, so if anyone could explain it that way that's be awesome.

Pics-sry they're sideways :/


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## Prawn Connery (Nov 27, 2013)

You can reschedule your lights no problem at all. Run them 24 if you need to, and then have them off during the warmest time of day. Be sure to give them 4-6 hours of dark period to allow time for respiration and sugar transfer within the plant.

You probably won't need the second light during veg, as you can veg as long as you like. Flowering is more critical, as you only have a finite amount of time (8-9 weeks or so, depending on strain) to grow.

If you're worried about odour, then you really need a carbon filter. Having said that, I grew in an apartment for a while with a bathroom ceiling fan blowing straight into the eves with no carbon scrubber and no-one ever complained about the smell!

But if you're in doubt, play it safe 

Your system is very similar to mine - 4'x4 and 1200w inline vertical - so you can certainly be successful as long as you have good ventilation. A slightly bigger floor fan might be in order, and if that's nylon rope I can se in the first pic holding the bulb, I would replace it with metal chain or wire - nylon can melt and if the bulb falls and breaks, it could start a fire.

There's nothing wrong with running just one light - 600w - for your first grow until you get the hang of things. That's what I did before going to 1200w. It wil give you an idea of how to handle things like heat, humidity and ventilation. It's good to be ambitious, but skill comes with experience.


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## Prawn Connery (Nov 27, 2013)

I don't know if you've seen my set-up, but here's a glimpse if you haven't.


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## Webbdtoez (Nov 27, 2013)

Prawn, you da man! 

I plan on going 24 hours today and try to dial the 2nd HID in. Heres what im thinkin: Start by putting in another 6" exhaust fan (my intake), but leave the duct to have a passive flow of outside air while 2 6" fans are exhausting. Then start to tinker with the 2nd HID. Start with it on 25% for a few hours, record temps, turn till 100% and see where it sits with the new ventilation setup. Thoughts?

Awesome cage! Thats alotta potsicles! 
What was your distance between the light and buds during flowering? The cage looks smaller than mine and i was kinda freakin out over if my lights would be too close.

Would they veg faster with two lights or is it just not worth it overall to turn on until flowering? considering electric costs vs. faster growth


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## Prawn Connery (Nov 27, 2013)

Obviously they'll veg faster with two bulbs, but it's not the most efficient use of light until the plants get big enough to take real advantage of all that light. I veg under 250w MH before putting my plants under 1200w to flower.

Having said that, I don't think there's any harm in trying it to see how it produces.

My cage is about 2' in diameter, so about 1' at any point from the plants leaning against it. You need a good floor fan and overhead ventilation to get a column of cool air going past the lights to get your plants that close.


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## Webbdtoez (Dec 10, 2013)

So my girls are a little slow considering this is their 19th day of veg, but im assuming thats just from the extreme temp fluctuations i had early on.


However, my temps have been really consistent the last week or so, as well as humidity. Ive noticed a little new growth and all have healthy green colors. 


Im watering every other day 1 2/3 cups. 


Question: being that ive cut out 6 holes on the bottom of each bucket for drainage, should i prop the buckets up on pieces of wood to move air under the buckets? Would this deliver more O2 to the roots?

The first pic is the fastest grower, all the others are a little smaller and slower, similar to the second pic.


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## Canon (Dec 12, 2013)

Too much light. Plants are too compact because of light.
Decrease or raise the light. Better yet, set them to the side light. You want some stretch there sport. LOL

Remember.. vertical. No flat canopy. stretch it out some for the screen.


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## Webbdtoez (Dec 14, 2013)

Ok i raised the light 2 ft. Giving about 3-3.5 ft from plants. 
I also propped each bucket up to allow airflow underneath. 

Thinking of sticking numerous straws about 6" into soil to aid in O2 flow to roots. 

Also toying with the idea of building a turn table for all the plants to sit on. This way, when training ensues, the plants in the back wont be such a pain to manage. Anyone have any good leads i could look into that would do the trick?


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## Canon (Dec 14, 2013)

Did that.
48" Lazy Suzan. Works great too.

Metal piece in middle picture bolts to floor and the table's hole nestles around it for pivot. All wheels 90 deg. off centerline. 3/4 inch ply.
Also mount 26w X 40"tall welded wire fence screen to outside pot rim. All turns together. Light and fan in center are hung to avoid twisting. (V-SCROG style)


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## Webbdtoez (Dec 14, 2013)

Only problem is the bolting part. Without being able to bolt the center down, the lazy susana would not work. 

i was thinking of something that could turn within itself. Like a merch rack contraption. Heavy duty plastic full circle one hollow so a slightly smaller full circle can fit. With beebres or something to provide a smooth surface slide.


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## Canon (Dec 14, 2013)

Mount the pin on the other half piece of ply. 
48 X 48 square base, 48" diameter table = 1 piece of ply.


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## Webbdtoez (Dec 28, 2013)

How much longer do you think for veg?

i started training the 25th.


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## Prawn Connery (Dec 29, 2013)

I think one of your problems is your soil may be too wet. Small plants in big pots don't need that much water. In fact, you need to dry the soil out a little in-between waterings to promote vigorous root growth. I see you have used perlite, but really - in soil - your pots should be almost dry before each watering.

When I grow in soil, I always put my seedlings in smaller pots to begin with to promote root growth. Smaller pots dry out faster. As you water, you introduce fresh oxygen into the root zone (which is pulled in by the capiliary action of watering). As soil dries, it again draws air into the root zone. This constant wet-dry-wet-dry action is what promotes healthy, oxygenated root growth. If the soil remains wet, the roots suffocate as the water stagnates.

Once the plant is root-bound, you can then transfer it to a bigger pot and watch it take off!

There are two rules to growing in soil: don't overwater, and don't overfeed (soil already contains a lot of nutrient).


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## Cousined (Jan 2, 2014)

Canon said:


> View attachment 2929258View attachment 2929259View attachment 2929260
> 
> Did that.
> 48" Lazy Suzan. Works great too.
> ...


like your idea but its useless. the parts of the plant facing the light are always facing the light. whats the point to spin the plant around the bulb with one side always facing the bulb? lol. good idea but each plant needs to spin 360deg not stay stationary and spin around the bulb.

anyone pick up on something i dont?

edit: i see, its for access to back plants. good idea. i thought it was a plant mover style thing. sorry


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## kushdc (Jan 5, 2014)

Damn canon thows girls look so happy.


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 6, 2014)

Today is Day 45 since they were seedlings. 
I took your advice and am watering every 4-5 days, 4 cups each. 
They seem to like that better. 

Should i expect another 45 days from here? This is taking forever it seems. 
They MIGHT be growing an inch every 4-6 days...

Sry the pics are sideways


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## tobinates559 (Jan 6, 2014)

everything looks awesome!!! i feel at this point your plants should start to really take off, the first month from seed is painful!! how much have you yielded in the past with this 1200w setup?


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 7, 2014)

Thats great news!
This is my first grow with this setup.

expecting 2.5lbs tho


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## jswett1100 (Jan 7, 2014)

45 days? id say there a tad bit off for sure but dont even worry about it! they look super healthy , your gonna wanna make sure they have the right root space in those pots thou, a gallon per month, if they are in anything smaller then that i would suggest a transplant because that could be the cause of them not growing quite as fast as you would like! but its all based on the enviorment as well! anyways keep up the good work! cant wait to see those puppies budding, you got me subbed for sure! if you need help with anything dont be afraid to PM me  il never give you information that im not 100% on!


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## CCCmints (Jan 7, 2014)

Webbdtoez said:


> Thats great news!
> This is my first grow with this setup.
> 
> expecting 2.5lbs tho


what are you feeding them? what soil are you using? you're not going to get anywhere near 2.5lbs...your plants are waaaaay to small for their age. i'm on my first grow as well and here are my girls at day 39.





in my opinion your plants are stunted because of your lights. vegging with 1200w of mh is far from optimal. i'm in a 4'x4' tent as well and only using a mixed spectrum 8-bulb t5 which pulls 398 watts. i'm planning to grow these girls out in 7 gallon pots under 800 watts of hps. i'm doing a horizontal scrog, and expecting less than a pound.


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## Steelheader3430 (Jan 7, 2014)

Subbed. I'm planning something like this. I was thinking 4 plants one in each corner of my 4x4 tent, but this is giving me more ideas. keep up the good work.


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 8, 2014)

CCCmints said:


> what are you feeding them? what soil are you using? you're not going to get anywhere near 2.5lbs...your plants are waaaaay to small for their age. i'm on my first grow as well and here are my girls at day 39.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I prefer to grow organic with a soil recipe that ive used in the past. I will only add nutes when i start to see deficiency, which will most likely be in the last leg of the flowering stage. Figuring out potential yield is just math. My first grow ever, i reached .78g/watt. I am not vegging with 1200w, im vegging with 600w. Im waiting until the screen is 60% full to turn on the second 600w and begin flowering. Based on my math, if i achieve gram per watt i will have 2.6lbs. If i achieve my last record of .78g per watt, ill still have 2.09lbs. Where do you get your facts?


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## CCCmints (Jan 10, 2014)

I'm no expert..I just see someone a month in a half into veg with plants that look 2 weeks old asking if 45 more days of veg will be enough to produce 2.5lbs..

I thought I could help out by posting a pic of my first grow at day 39 to show you the size differences between our plants and also our yield estimates.

.78g/watt is excellent IMO, what setup were you running before?

Also, when you were running your last setup, were the plants still this small at day 45? Bet they weren't  



Webbdtoez said:


> I prefer to grow organic with a soil recipe that ive used in the past. I will only add nutes when i start to see deficiency, which will most likely be in the last leg of the flowering stage. Figuring out potential yield is just math. My first grow ever, i reached .78g/watt. I am not vegging with 1200w, im vegging with 600w. Im waiting until the screen is 60% full to turn on the second 600w and begin flowering. Based on my math, if i achieve gram per watt i will have 2.6lbs. If i achieve my last record of .78g per watt, ill still have 2.09lbs. Where do you get your facts?


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 10, 2014)

Question:

What do you all think about using MH for veg vs. HPS, and vise versa?

My first grows seemed to be more progressive as far as the veg stage when using HPS, as opposed to my grow now using MH. 
When i was refreshing for this current grow, i read that MH was better for veg. I feel like i should have stuck with HPS for veg.


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## FilthyFletch (Jan 10, 2014)

If those are 45 days old something has gone very wrong. I havent done soil in a while but I do keep my mothers in soil and those look like plants younger then 3 weeks from seed.


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## spandy (Jan 10, 2014)

CCCmints said:


> what are you feeding them? what soil are you using? you're not going to get anywhere near 2.5lbs...your plants are waaaaay to small for their age. i'm on my first grow as well and here are my girls at day 39.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


. You plants are toxic, back off the nitrogen. 



Webbdtoez said:


> Today is Day 45 since they were seedlings.
> I took your advice and am watering every 4-5 days, 4 cups each.
> They seem to like that better.
> 
> ...


What are you root temps? By chance are they sitting on concrete?


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 11, 2014)

spandy said:


> . You plants are toxic, back off the nitrogen.
> 
> 
> What are you root temps? By chance are they sitting on concrete?


No they arent on concrete. Idk what the temps are in the root zone. Temps vary drastically mostly because of the texas weather, as my passive intake is comin straight from outside, facing the north. Sometimes we'll have 25+ mph north winds and ill have to take the duct out of the tent so it doesnt freeze out the girls. Then some days itll be 10-15 mph south wind, which will create a negative pressure, making temps go up a little more than they are used to. They generally stay around 80degrees with lights on, and around high 60's with lights off. Like i said, the almost unpredictable texas weather keeps me busy all the time trying to negotiate the temps in the tent. The ph sits at 6.5-6.7. I will be getting another 6" intake fan for the duct running from the outside soon. I have two 6" exhaust fans now. Having two constantly running is what helps keep my temps around 80 degrees. The buckets are sitting off he ground about a quarter inch with a fan blowing air across the floor. Since lifting them off the ground ive noticed faster growth. Thats all i can think to say right now that you may be needing to know in oder to help me figure out what to do.


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 11, 2014)

I should have watered today but i am going to wait until the plants start to droop a little, just so i know all the stagnant water has been used before watering. 

Good idea?


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 11, 2014)

Since posting an update on the 6th, the girls have grown about an inch and a half.


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## Matt420Aus (Jan 11, 2014)

Seems like super slow growth, my plants jump an inch a day at the moment, they have slowed since transplanting a little but still, at 40 days I would expect a lot more growth as stated above










That is growth from 3 days, plants are about 2-3 weeks from seed


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 12, 2014)

Could it be the seeds? 

The only factor i can come up with is when my temps go a little crazy, that delays them from growing steadily.


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 12, 2014)

What would my outcome be if i all the sudden switched to flowering with 1200 w HPS? What would my yield look like, what would the plant look like? Would it resemble an autoflower strain with one massive cola?


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 16, 2014)

Cmon guys, need some good advice here.


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## Thundercat (Jan 16, 2014)

From what I've seen my guess is the root zone has been kept too wet from the beginning. Like it was said before seedlings in suck large pots do not need much water. I believe that Mh light will tend to allow the plant to stay more compact, but not to the point where it is not growing properly. I also have found great results flowering with MH just for the record. As far as flipping them now, you can flip when ever you want, but if the plant isn't growing well in the first place you most likely will be very dissapointed with the out come. I flower plants small all the time , but I run a single cola SOG grow, and in turn use smaller plants, and more of them. Seeing as I'm posative those plants aren't mature yet, then even if you switch to 12/12 light, there is a good chance it would take multiple weeks before them start to flowering. In that time they might fill in more and stretch up into the screen, but I would bet again that you'd be dissapointed.


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 16, 2014)

Thundercat said:


> From what I've seen my guess is the root zone has been kept too wet from the beginning. Like it was said before seedlings in suck large pots do not need much water. I believe that Mh light will tend to allow the plant to stay more compact, but not to the point where it is not growing properly. I also have found great results flowering with MH just for the record. As far as flipping them now, you can flip when ever you want, but if the plant isn't growing well in the first place you most likely will be very dissapointed with the out come. I flower plants small all the time , but I run a single cola SOG grow, and in turn use smaller plants, and more of them. Seeing as I'm posative those plants aren't mature yet, then even if you switch to 12/12 light, there is a good chance it would take multiple weeks before them start to flowering. In that time they might fill in more and stretch up into the screen, but I would bet again that you'd be dissapointed.


Thank you, Thundercat!
I just watered yesterday, 2 cups each, after 6 days of no watering. I watered because they were showing signs that i needed to, such as drooping of the leaves.


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## Thundercat (Jan 16, 2014)

Good. if possible try to see how wet the soil is in the bottom of the pot. What happens if the soil stays too wet is it won't allow oxygen into the roots. I've grown soil plants that I only watered once a week.


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## CannaBare (Jan 17, 2014)

Are you vegging with 1200w? I think that might be too much light. try just a 600w or 400w whatever you have and you will see improvement 

edit: 

More pics!


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## Prawn Connery (Jan 18, 2014)

Hi mate, what's the drainage like on those 20 litre (5 gallon) buckets?

As I mentioned earlier, there are two common things that will slow seedling growth: over-fertilising (burns the roots), and over watering (drowns the roots).

Under-fertilising is less common in soil, as potting mix etc already has lots of nutrient. It is possibile that if you use too much perlite or other innate substrate (which contains no nutrient), then your plants can suffer from a nutrient deficiency. However, this is also rare in seedlings as they don't require much nutrient until they get bigger. Plus I don't really see that with your plants - they don't look burned and they don't look like they're starving. In fact, with 20 litres of soil mix in there, they should not be suffering from a lack of nutrient. 

That basically leaves you with overwatering - or lack of drainage. You can try poking holes into the soil with a stick to help aerate it and make sure you have lots of drainage holes in the bottom of your buckets so that water can drain out and air can get in. 

If you have a look at all the other photos of healthy plants posted in your thread, you will see they all have one thing in common: the pots are the right size relative to the plants' stage of growth (even the ones that had recently been repotted).

The fastest-growing seedlings are usually the ones that are grown in smaller pots and then repotted each time they get root bound.

Other areas to look at are: 1200w is too much light for such small plants - you may inadvertently be introducing heat stress (I'm not sure how far away from the lights they are). 600w would be much better. Even 400w - as mentioned above - if you have it.

MH is better for vegging that HPS, but there's really not _that _much difference that it would slow your plants down. The difference between MH and HPS can be seen mostly during flowering. Plants will veg fine under HPS, but MH has a better spectrum for the vegetative stage of growth.

Finally, once you have done all the above (drainage, aerate the soil, cut down on the light etc), try watering with a root stimulant such as rhizotonic etc. Just give them one application at the next watering to see if it helps.

Now, the way to know when to water your plants is NOT when they are so dry that they start drooping: when your plants want water, the leaves will start to stand up and point towards the sky. This is the plant's natural reaction to drying conditions: as the leaves get drier, they become lighter (and dron't doop like they do when the plant is waterlogged). But this "praying" action of the leaves also reduces the surface area of each leaf that is exposed to light (the sun) which causes evaporation.

The time to water is when the top-soil is dry (poke your finger a coupe of inches into the soil) and the plants look nice and "perky". Hope this helps.


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## Prawn Connery (Jan 18, 2014)

Webbdtoez said:


> Question: being that ive cut out 6 holes on the bottom of each bucket for drainage, should i prop the buckets up on pieces of wood to move air under the buckets? Would this deliver more O2 to the roots?


Just saw this: the answer is yes. Also, what type of soil mix are you using? It looks like it has a lot of wood in it, which can tend to be a bit acidic.

I still think the large pots are your issue. What you have to remember is that once you water a large pot, there's really nowhere for the water to go. Excess is drained off, and the plants drink some, but if the plants are small, they won't drink much. What happens then is the pot remains wet - there's nowhere for the moisture to go (evaporation can be a slow process in such large pots) - and the water stagnates. The pots remain consantly wet in the middle, even if you don't water them much.

Now, the difference between large pots such as yours and growing in soil outdoors (in the ground), is that you have worms, bugs, nematodes, microbes etc constantly turning over the soil and aerating it outside, whereas your pots won't have anywhere near that soil-turning action. So again, there is nothing to disturb the soil under the surface to help aerate it - that's why you have to do it yourself by poking holes in the soil.

Keep us updated with pix if you can.


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## Canon (Jan 22, 2014)

Never grew Cherry Bombs,, but here is a Cindy 99 ready for chop tomorrow. I'll get to that in a moment.

Only talking veg here....

Lights - 18 / 6, 250w MH, Fans on timer and do not run when lights are off. Temp pretty constant 70 / 74F. 
Maybe you are, but if not... you may find it beneficial to run your lights during the colder period. Perhaps lights off from Noon until 4:00 pm? While I believe plants should have a "rest period",, still... maybe go 22 / 2 for the heat in veg if needed?

Water / nutes- I'll load up the nutes until I start to see tip burn,, then back off about 15%. In veg they take very little water even with my low, low, low humidity. In 3 gal. pots they may go through a 1/2 gal. watering every week to 10 days. I judge by the pot feel (weight) as to when and how much. Given your situation,, I'd probsably seriously consider adding 1/3 cup of 3% peroxide per gal. to insure oxygen at the roots. I'd certainly would flush just for a re-start to be confident I'm not loaded with salts at this point too.

Veg / flower- I like to match my veg times with flower times per strain. Just seems to work well for me in my environment. Genrally my Cindys go 6 to 8 weeks veg and after put to the screen they'll average 28 to 30 inch tall and spread to about 24 inch wide on the screen when added. I'll start training early in veg.

I keep pretty good logs on all my plants.

Here's the full "take" on the one showing.

VEG - 7 1/2 weeks, 250W MH, 18 / 6, 3 gal. pot after seedling, Jack's Chemical nutes, Pro-Tek, Cal-Mag, Soilless mix of 2 parts Pro-Mix & 1 part small Grow Stone. with 2 Tbs. Dolomite at start. I position the light (horizontal on veg) to control stretch the way I want it to finish. Training starts as soon as practical per growth. Temps constant at 70-74F.

FLOWER - 7 weeks from flip, 1K HPS 14 to 24 inch from plant. Grown V-SCROG style with bulb placement 1/3 below tip of top cola per plant height. Generally water / nute 1/2 gal. every 2 days. Nutes are substantially increased (3-4 times recommended). Water for run-off. Bloom boost added once every 2 weeks. Temps with light mid 80F, light off mid to upper 60's. 12 / 12. 

Typically, I'll fill my screen and may over run a little. Generally plants are about 40" high by 30 inch wide at harvest. Typically I'll harvest 5-6 oz per plant. While not any earth shattering harvest,, it's simple, easy, and predictably consistent. Since I'm running perpetual,,, I'll harvest one every 2 weeks give or take a little. This one may be a bit light in the bud dept. as I was trying a new POS bulb that I've since tossed to the dogs.

It's difficult to stay within my state's "Legal Medical Limits". It would be so easy to over do. There are potentials for doing way better if I wasn't so concerned with "being within limits". 

Hope something in there will be of help for you. Good luck & cheers.


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 23, 2014)

Thanks for all the tips, guys! Im slowly letting all that info sink in. 

I did aerate the soil yesterday by shoving a 1/4" plastic rod in and out of the soil, all around the plant, tried not to get too close to the stem tho. And watered each 2 cups. 

Here are the girls yesterday.


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## Canon (Jan 23, 2014)

Tell me those are NOT the same plants as you had in post #4 on 11 - 12 - 2013 of this thread!

From the stems in those last pictures,,, they look really stressed out big time. If left to guess,,, I'd be thinking water logged & oxygen starved galore. But, colors in picture don't mean much with some lighting.


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 23, 2014)

Sadly Canon, they are. 

I agree that they are water logged. I thought they would drain easily or the heat would ensue plenty of evaporation after they were watered. Dead wrong. 

Thats not even the worst as of today. 
I received a notice from my apartment complex that they are doing fire alarm checks tomorrow. Long story short, i disassembled the whole grow. Stuck the girls in a coat closet with a blanket thrown over them, along with some misc items to deter suspicion. Have no idea if they are even worth the trouble after tomorrow. Im sure this is just what they needed after recovering from weeks of water logging.(sarcastic). Sad days yall, sad days indeed.


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## Canon (Jan 24, 2014)

Sorry to hear that. 
Makes them about 10 weeks now?
That Cindy should be at least 26-28 inch tall by now.

Know you'll not like hearing this,,, but the plants are indeed fucked (IMHO). It would take some good experience to make them worth growing further... and that would only be IF there was something really special about them in particular (like genetics, etc.). Even with experience,, the roots appear damaged enough where they'll probably not produce much anyways,, plus with the stress shown it's possible you'd end up with hermies in the end.
Learning from mistakes is something we've all been through. Feel you'd save yourself a lot of grief by just letting them go and starting over... with a better growing medium.

Dealt lemons? Make lemonade!
Don't know how you are at cloning,, but topping them and using the tops for clones could be a valued learning experience in that direction. With proper technique the clones could be just fine since you're replacing the root system when cloned. Hermies may be possible even with cloning... but the odds would be much, much more in your favor (with better medium).

Isn't growing addicting & fun?


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## Canon (Jan 24, 2014)

Webbdtoez said:


> Thanks for all the tips, guys! Im slowly letting all that info sink in.
> 
> *I did aerate the soil yesterday by shoving a 1/4" plastic rod in and out of the soil, all around the plant, *tried not to get too close to the stem tho. And watered each 2 cups.
> 
> Here are the girls yesterday.


You do realize that by jabbing the dirt like that you were actually compacting / compressing the dirt even more for even less drainage don't you?
I often refer to that as, "Killing them with kindness".


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 24, 2014)

i made sure to probe the bottom as well, btw.


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## fir3dragon (Jan 25, 2014)

Prawn Connery said:


> I don't know if you've seen my set-up, but here's a glimpse if you haven't.


Wow looks dope man... Rep..


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## Webbdtoez (Jan 25, 2014)

Ill be experimenting sometime in the next couple of weeks with the same grow method, less water(lol), but with auto-flowers. 
1200w auto grow? 
Does the standard gram per watt still apply if doing it with autos?


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## Thc247 (Jan 26, 2014)

my thoughts exactly are we missing something



Cousined said:


> like your idea but its useless. the parts of the plant facing the light are always facing the light. whats the point to spin the plant around the bulb with one side always facing the bulb? lol. good idea but each plant needs to spin 360deg not stay stationary and spin around the bulb.
> 
> anyone pick up on something i dont?
> 
> edit: i see, its for access to back plants. good idea. i thought it was a plant mover style thing. sorry


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## Thc247 (Jan 26, 2014)

i wud get rid of those anyway 10 weeks they should be at least double this



this was taken at beginning of week 5

i would start again with decent genetics

dont water half as often and when u water give them good watering then wait till its dry to touch


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## Thc247 (Jan 26, 2014)

no it doesnt apply 1 gram a watt on auto's



Webbdtoez said:


> Ill be experimenting sometime in the next couple of weeks with the same grow method, less water(lol), but with auto-flowers.
> 1200w auto grow?
> Does the standard gram per watt still apply if doing it with autos?


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## Myles117 (Feb 20, 2014)

damn this thread is a giant bummer  from poor growing to fire alarm checks, ouch


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