# What is your faith, path or belief?



## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 4, 2008)

This being a weed forum and all, I am ubber-curious whatall kinda spiritualities lurk about here.




I am a heretic, a Valentian gnostic. I am also a beginner Kabbalist.

I am a vegan as well, and while going for LPN I am also a horse whisperer.

I am a pothead and a wino, but I can do without just as well. (Have to, sometimes.)


Tell me about yourselves, your faith or beliefs, and what you love, what makes you happy.


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## Microdizzey (Nov 5, 2008)

I believe in a creator of it all. But I'm curious to what is before him.

I definitely believe in an afterlife, a life beyond what we live now. I mean... what is the point of our expanding concentiousness...
Does it just end? Cease to exist? Or does it continue on through different phases through out eternity. We may not be able to comprehend what eternity is, but that does not mean it doesn't exist.




Only one way to find out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 5, 2008)

Very true. It is all heresay till you experience it for yourself.

Me, I have been there (where we all came from), I call it the Ground of Being, and it is most wonderous.

Nuttin to be scared of, that's for sure.


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## Dislexicmidget2021 (Nov 5, 2008)

Interesting topic puff, Its the most complicated thing to explain i think.I dont beleive that 'being' ever ends.When we die its not truly death, but a transition to the next being.I personaly beleive we live many times over,every life lived is another lesson learned in experience.I beleive there is a source creator or a God as everyone knows the entite to be.We couldnt have come from nothing and be nothing once gone from this world that just goes against everything i see around me,being cause and effect its everywhere and it holds true in all things this world and the next.I also find that time is just a state of mind we are in while living here,eternity is not time at all, but a constant state of any moment, at leaste thats how i view it.


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## trichopath (Nov 5, 2008)

im totally believe if i keep loving my family growing my weed and carry on being content with that everything ill ever need will always come up when i need it.i always say that im lucky for being unlucky. i,v had a fair few massive shroom experiences along the way that have helped me firmly believe, be a good person and the universe will be good to you. its working so far. i also lister to ALOT of jimi hendrix.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 5, 2008)

Hendrix is DA SHIT. 

Some seriously deep people here, I love it.

You guys ROCK.


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## FZZW3334 (Nov 5, 2008)

I am a naturalist, therefore I am an atheist and believe in nothing supernatural. When your brain function ceases and you are dead that is it; an eternal dreamless sleep. 



> [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=+1]It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.[/SIZE][/FONT]


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## illusionz1 (Nov 5, 2008)

Well, raised catholic... dating a preacher's daughter throughout high school... I think I've learned to think for myself and with an open mind and the closest thing I think I could be able to illustrate a "Faith" is Taoism.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 5, 2008)

Then why does matter move? There is nothing in an atom, what are we all experiencing, and more importantly, why?

I have stepped (breifly) over the threshold, and I KNOW (not believe) there is more than this physical existance. 

I know I am not my body, my physical being. I am just using it.


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## orangefrog (Nov 5, 2008)

I believe that to have a better afterlife (i wouldnt really call it an afterlife because its not your body and im pretty sure its nothing like this life) you have too be a compassionate loving forgiving person so giving fat counts ties into a lot of those 


I believe we were created by type IV extra terrestrials with their galactic sized "haydron collider" that caused this 3 dimensional physical and 1 dimensional time universe to be created and put life into it so that we could recycle ZPE energy (your afterlife is your ZPE energy) and to recycle zpe energy you have to be a compassionate loving forgiving person. the point of recycling zpe energy is so that eventually you could enter the chilled universe where you would be outside the 11 dimensions and live for infinite and by live i dont know what i mean but you can get there as a human, thats what type IV extra terrestrials are trying to do using the energy we recycle so that everything can live in peace.













and smoke weed and drop acid.




p.s. hopefully no one thinks im some crazy psycho :S i know this stuff might sound somewhat crazy to someone but seriously if you dont think aliens exist then seriously, i hate to say this, you are a failure. and if aliens exist then the other stuff isnt so far fetched. lol i think thats the first time ive ever sued far fetched.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 6, 2008)

Hay, man, you got a right to 'em, no matter how crazy or farfetched they sound. Doesn't sound that bad to me, most people point to the sky when asked where 'God' is (I would point to my own heart, but that is me) and that would be outer space, so most people prolly come pretty close to thinking 'God' is a space alien.

Me, it is an inner thing, not an outer, but that is just me.


Perhaps you would find much interest in this link, OrangeFrog, methinks it is right up your alley....
Divine Cosmos - Law of One Study Guide, Section One


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## Budsworth (Nov 6, 2008)

I'm Caucasion.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 6, 2008)

Umm, whazzat?


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## bobharvey (Nov 7, 2008)

After a lot of study and meditation this is what I believe.

There is God the Father (Infinite Consciousness)
God the Son (Christ consciousness)
And the Holy Spirit (nature/ the Cosmos/ all of Vibratory creation)

Infinite Consciousness is as well as manifested in vibratory creation. All creation is actually just one. God is everything and everything is God. We don't realize this because of the ego. The Ego separates the One (God/Infinite Consciousness) into several (You, Me, and Dupree). The Ego is what gives you the ability have experience and to unify all of your experience. But at the same time it is a facade or a delusion. 

There are two realities because there are two yous. Your true self which is the Spirit or Son of God (the direct reflection of God or Infinite consciousness). Then there is the material/physical world of illusion/delusion or as the Hindus called it...maya. 

The entire point of life is simple. The ONE wanted to be everything else so it could interact and experience itself. So the purpose of life is to fulfill the desires of your heart or natural impulses and become self actualized. Most people "sin" or miss the point of life because the hold themselves back from doing what they really want to do. If you want to be an artist but you don't because you would rather chase a dollar than you have sinned, or missed the point of your life. However, this is where reincarnation comes in to play. You will come back again and again until you have fulfilled your purpose and brought your mission or desires into manifestation on this physical plane. Once you have done whatever you are supposed to do then you evolve spiritually and move on to a greater existence. As your consciousness grows you grow more spiritually. I believe eventually everyone will evolve to become God. 

According to the Bible we are made in the Image of God. The first thing God does is create. We create and manifest at a much lower level. However we are one of the few creatures on this planet that is self aware and that can expand consciousness. Consciousness is the underlying thing of existence not matter. Science is starting discover that the observer directly affects what is being observed. This is because your consciousness is stronger than that of any material form. So if you grow your consciousness then you can actually create reality. But before you can do that you need faith that you can do it or it can't happen because the mental construct that your observing reality from won't allow it to.

Now...Jesus said "And you shall know the Truth and the Truth shall set you free." My evolve is that we are subject to laws of nature and the universe because we don't know the Truth. The Truth is that we can do whatever we want to do if we believe we can and then use the power of our consciousness to do it. Consciousness does not die. It is Immortal. Time is a mental construct and the people in power are afraid that you might find out that you really can do whatever you want, because then they can no longer control you. 

So.... Your true self, what you really are can never die. Only the form dies. But that is because the form is material and subject to the laws of nature. Your consciousness is not. Therefore if you realize this through selfreflection/meditation/prayer then you are no longer subject to the continuous cycle of life. You break the cycle, reach Nirvana, or the other side. You become enlightened. 

I think that the search in life is never fulfilled when you look externally. The search in life is to find out what you already are, remember where you came from, do what you came here to do, and Go back. 

Hope this makes sense.


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## hom36rown (Nov 7, 2008)

I don't believe in god, even though I have a crucifix as my av


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 7, 2008)

Wonderful, seriously deep. I for one am comfortable in deep waters, tho.

I personally feel the 'image of God' you speak of is more metaphorical to me (of course, I am a gnostic and a heretic). It means the I AM, the awareness of 'self'. 

I also see us more in the Manichean (and to some extent, kabbalistic) sense. We are tripartate beings. THere is the 'light' and the 'dark', they got into an awful battle and the Hyalic Man was created to keep the dark from attacking the light, and this being chased the dark into the lowest reaches of matter (the material world, or to use a neo-gnostic term, the matrix) and both defeated the dark and was completely consumed by it. There was the stuff of the material world, called 'admixed', then there was dark and light, and in this realm they got all mixed up together, and so the material world (with the planets and suns and beings like us) were created to to get the light back outta the dark and admixed matter. Why I don't eat meat. 

This is a good discussion, I really enjoyed Bob's post, very true and spiritual without getting 'preachy.' Awesome. I too find the common thread in all faiths.

HomeGrown- Issit that you don't believe in 'God' in the sense everyone else does, but you do think there is 'something out there,' so to speak, or do you think as FZZW does and this is 'all there is?' 

Not to pry, if it ain't none of my biznez you can tell me.


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## Seamaiden (Nov 7, 2008)

Horse whisperer is a profession?


Budsworth said:


> I'm Caucasion.


 Naw, you're just a dirty white boy.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 7, 2008)

Izzat what that means? 

Well, I guess I am one too, actually. I whisper to my horses, but they don't always listen.


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## hom36rown (Nov 7, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> HomeGrown- Issit that you don't believe in 'God' in the sense everyone else does, but you do think there is 'something out there,' so to speak, or do you think as FZZW does and this is 'all there is?'
> 
> Not to pry, if it ain't none of my biznez you can tell me.


I agree with FZZW.


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## hom36rown (Nov 7, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Then why does matter move? There is nothing in an atom, what are we all experiencing, and more importantly, why?


 Matter moves because of energy. Atoms are mostly space but they certainly arent nothing. As to why? No reason.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 7, 2008)

I have had seizures that 'mimic' the 'death experience.'

Having had those, I can tell you from expereince (not beliefs or heresay, I don't go for that) that there is SOMETHING that 'happens' when your body stops (or dies). I have had no heart rate, brain activity, or blood pressure or any of it for, like 4 minutes. (Validated by medical tests.) THen I 'pop' back (tho that is NOT how it happens from my end.)

Now, I ain't preachin heaven or hell, (cuz according to my 'faith' we are in 'hell' right now) but I can tell you from my own experience that there is something out there.

Have you ever had such an expereince? Do you think if you did it would change your mind?


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## hom36rown (Nov 7, 2008)

I was under the impression that once your brain stops functioning there is no coming back. I'm sure there is a scientific explanation for whatever you experiencd.


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## Seamaiden (Nov 7, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> I have had seizures that 'mimic' the 'death experience.'
> 
> Having had those, I can tell you from expereince (not beliefs or heresay, I don't go for that) that there is SOMETHING that 'happens' when your body stops (or dies). I have had no heart rate, brain activity, or blood pressure or any of it for, like 4 minutes. (Validated by medical tests.) THen I 'pop' back (tho that is NOT how it happens from my end.)
> 
> ...


Puff, you MUST read some Vilayanur Ramachandran!


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 7, 2008)

Science can't explain everything, and much of it they get only half right, tho in my personal opinion it does better than religion, with old books and heresay of long-gone people.

No, doctors can't even figure out what me and my dad have, it isn't epilespy, tho they have verified it in like 8 other people so far in the US. (Don't know about other countries, can't find the info.) But they love doing tests on us. They call it something-or-another syncopy (which basically means 'fainting spells') but they know it isn't epilespy, tho they think it might be a form of that. One difference is, they can 'tilt' us and trigger a seizure, whereas that isn't how you trigger an epileptic seizure.


All I know is I am way more than the skin suit I am draggin around. While I don't know what exactly, I KNOW (again, not believe) that when I die that it doesn't end.


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## Seamaiden (Nov 7, 2008)

You have got to get you some Ramachandran, puff, I'm tellin' ya. 
Vilayanur S. Ramachandran MD, PhD
Vilayanur S. Ramachandran - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 7, 2008)

Thanx, Seamaiden! Had heard of him before, but hadn't delved into his works-yet.

Readin...........


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## dannyking (Nov 7, 2008)

religion faith destiny etc etc = big pile of smelly shite.

Although I do believe in Cryonics and Life Extension. Very interesting indeed. Give it a read.

http://www.alcor.org/AboutCryonics/index.html


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## Seamaiden (Nov 7, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Thanx, Seamaiden! Had heard of him before, but hadn't delved into his works-yet.
> 
> Readin...........


I've only got one of his books, Phantoms in the Brain, but I love whipping it out when discussing human brainses. I avoid discussing human brainses when in the company of zombies, for obvious reasons.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 7, 2008)

Snort. You must not discuss it much.

Interesting reading, what I could get. The Illusions wouldn't work cuz I don't know what my bandwidth is.


Now, here is one I thought you mite like....

YouTube - Illusion of Reality (All is One) 1/3
YouTube - Illusion of Reality (All is One) 2/3
YouTube - Illusion of Reality (All is One) 3/3

Tell me whatcha think.


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## trippymonkey (Nov 7, 2008)

I think I believe in some kind of afterlife but I don't consider myself part of any specific religion. I've always had a problem with the whole faith thing, and believing in something that you don't know for sure exists. However, especially in the past few years, I've been getting a strange sense that makes me feel certain there has to be something after this (and that there is something big headed our way). I just try to be a good person and respectful of all living things and if there is some god who's going to send me to hell just because I didn't believe in him, then fuck it. Haha.
That's pretty cool you're a vegan  I've been a vegetarian since I was five. 
weeeeeeeeeee.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 7, 2008)

Trippy Monkey, you are so right, awesome.

I have a good friend that is a vegan, hindu I think (which means, like me, they can have milk and dairy products, just no 'flesh'- and that includes eggs) and he has a son who just had a birthday, 13 I think. He got so much shit for not eating meat, and 'depriving' his son, he finally decided to take him to the butcher shop (they live in the Phillipines) and let him get some meat, and when his son (and I am now quoting his son) saw the 'dead, skinned, headless animals' hanging in the shop, poor child got nauseated and ran out. 

Now, my family eats meat, but I don't. My oldest daughter (who hated meat as a baby, actually, the only 'meat' we could get her to eat was hot dogs and baloney) is now a vegetarian, and I suspect she will go completely meatless soon like mommy.


But they all have thier own faiths, my hubby likes the druidic thing, and they are rather eclectic now. How it should be.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 7, 2008)

Seamaiden and Danny King- Awesome reads, thanx so much! I love expanding my awareness of others and thier concepts of the brain, the mind (I consider them seperate) and what lies beyond the curtain. (Kabbalistic term, sorry, can't help meself.)


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 7, 2008)

Church of the HolySmoke 
This is looking good.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 8, 2008)

Interesting enough, Stoney, the so-called Magi (also were we get the root for the word 'magic'), the 'wise men' at the supposed nativity, or birth of Chirst, were Zorastrain priest, and the closest 'religion' we have like that today is the modern Essene/Rastafarian movement.

Just think, according to the Bible, sheperds and potheads were there.


Interesting reading, tho I already knew ALOT about the various names of the Earth-Mother Goddess. I liked what they pointed out about Eve, and in the gnostic texts the arguement against the Old Testament story shows that the serpent told the truth (they didn't die after eating of the tree, but as the serpent said they DID know the difference between good and evil after 'consuming'- imagine that, consumption of a herb that brings a higher state of consciousness, and it is in the stuffy ol' Bible!) and the Jewish Creator God (we gnostics call him the Demiurge, and he is NOT 'God') lied and told them they would die if they ate, and they didn't. Point blank. Snake freed them of ignorance, the demiurge wanted them easy to control, and our texts even tell you who, what and where the Tree of Knowledge itself came. The gnostics name for the femine divine is Sophia, also the Greek word for 'wisdom'.

Still goin thru the link, tho it is really late (or really early, however you look at it) and hubby is sleeping close by so I can't watch the You tube stuff yet.

Thanx, Stoney. Did you join?


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## Seamaiden (Nov 8, 2008)

Not too many are familiar with Mazda. 

Puff, are you familiar with the work of Joseph Campbell?


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 8, 2008)

Ummm, I know of a guy in like the 1800s that was responsible for the Methodist Churches, I think.

Issat the one you mean?


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## trippymonkey (Nov 8, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Trippy Monkey, you are so right, awesome.
> 
> I have a good friend that is a vegan, hindu I think (which means, like me, they can have milk and dairy products, just no 'flesh'- and that includes eggs) and he has a son who just had a birthday, 13 I think. He got so much shit for not eating meat, and 'depriving' his son, he finally decided to take him to the butcher shop (they live in the Phillipines) and let him get some meat, and when his son (and I am now quoting his son) saw the 'dead, skinned, headless animals' hanging in the shop, poor child got nauseated and ran out.
> 
> ...


Yeah that's how it was with me. My parents used to try and force me to eat it and finally they just gave up. Stopped eating it completely when I was five and haven't eaten it since. It's crazy how much shit I get from people for being a vegetarian. It's not like I question someone's choice to eat meat, but I can't tell you how many times someone has done that to me for NOT eating meat. haha. Nice to hear there's some fellow vegetarians in the worlddddddddd.


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## Seamaiden (Nov 8, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Ummm, I know of a guy in like the 1800s that was responsible for the Methodist Churches, I think.
> 
> Issat the one you mean?


No. Not a religious figure at all, but a philosopher and student of religion.
Joseph Campbell - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 8, 2008)

Yep, I do know of him.

He was very influential in relieving the church of it's tyranny over the common man.

But, as a gnostic, to me personally he still got the message wrong. He prolly wuddn't care much for my interpretation either. Heretic used to be a label that got you roasted, and your family, and your land, property and all your 'stuff' confiscated to the church. But heresy was such a loose term, tho it originated with the eridacation of my kind, starting with the Cathars.

Sorry, tend to ramble on about this shit..........


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 9, 2008)

Nah, I didn't.I'm kind of a loner, even when it comes to religion or lack of.Most of the time i just hide in my evil lair and think unfriendly thoughts.


puffdamagikdragon said:


> Interesting enough, Stoney, the so-called Magi (also were we get the root for the word 'magic'), the 'wise men' at the supposed nativity, or birth of Chirst, were Zorastrain priest, and the closest 'religion' we have like that today is the modern Essene/Rastafarian movement.
> 
> Just think, according to the Bible, sheperds and potheads were there.
> 
> ...


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 9, 2008)

Now THAT sounds like a religion I can cozy up to! You'd make a fine dragon, Stoney!


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 9, 2008)

Especially if I don't brush my teeth for a week!!


puffdamagikdragon said:


> Now THAT sounds like a religion I can cozy up to! You'd make a fine dragon, Stoney!


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 9, 2008)

trippymonkey said:


> Yeah that's how it was with me. My parents used to try and force me to eat it and finally they just gave up. Stopped eating it completely when I was five and haven't eaten it since. It's crazy how much shit I get from people for being a vegetarian. It's not like I question someone's choice to eat meat, but I can't tell you how many times someone has done that to me for NOT eating meat. haha. Nice to hear there's some fellow vegetarians in the worlddddddddd.


Now, I heard that wid my bad ear! I get alot of shit about not eating meat, hubby picks a little (says that 'vegetarian' is native american for 'bad hunter' kind of thing) and I pick on him ('would you like your dead corpse fried or roasted?') but some people get really outta joint when I talk about being vegan. But, what can you do? I even got accused on a political thread of being a lesbian cuz I didn't eat meat. Dumbasses.


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## trippymonkey (Nov 9, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Now, I heard that wid my bad ear! I get alot of shit about not eating meat, hubby picks a little (says that 'vegetarian' is native american for 'bad hunter' kind of thing) and I pick on him ('would you like your dead corpse fried or roasted?') but some people get really outta joint when I talk about being vegan. But, what can you do? I even got accused on a political thread of being a lesbian cuz I didn't eat meat. Dumbasses.



What the hell? That's redankulous. haha


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## Seamaiden (Nov 9, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Now, I heard that wid my bad ear! I get alot of shit about not eating meat, hubby picks a little (says that 'vegetarian' is native american for 'bad hunter' kind of thing) and I pick on him ('would you like your dead corpse fried or roasted?') but some people get really outta joint when I talk about being vegan. But, what can you do? I even got accused on a political thread of being a lesbian cuz I didn't eat meat. Dumbasses.


What's even funnier and sadder at the same time was when I was living in SoCal and a Buddhist monastery was built within a half mile of our home. Now, this is in the hills of Hacienda Heights, where there are wild animals (always have been wild animals in them thar hills). People's dogs and cats have always gone missing, they're often tasty coyote food. But! When the monastery went up people started accusing the Buddhist monks of stealing and eating their dogs and cats. 
I said, "I think they're strict vegetarians you guys. Couldn't it have been a coyote or hawk or owl or some such??"
They said, "No! Haven't you seen them shaving their heads and walking around in their saffron robes?"
"Yeah. So? What the hell does that have to do with you not watching your pets closely enough? What was happening to the small pets before they showed up, anyway?"



puffdamagikdragon said:


> Yep, I do know of him.
> 
> He was very influential in relieving the church of it's tyranny over the common man.
> *
> ...


How so? 

His main message was that all religions have common themes, and one main common theme, that being how to live "well", how to get along with others, have love and caring in your life and return it not just to those in your family but those around you. Through all his writings I've found that he endeavors to find the common thread among us all, and I think he did a fantastic job of it. He also spoke quite eloquently on the utility of religion in human society, something most people refuse to even consider, all the while complaining about how "our society" has gone down the tubes. 

He was a devout Catholic, and while at first that was difficult for me to understand, I finally wrapped my head around the idea of it. The common theme thing, though, is easily grasped if you're familiar with Jung and the concept of the collective unconscious.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 9, 2008)

I'm not atheist, nor am I agnostic, call it a rationalist belief that things do happen for a reason.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 9, 2008)

Stoney McFried said:


> Especially if I don't brush my teeth for a week!!


 
Ah, but you can't seduce donkeys that way..... (Shrek reference.)

Yeah, ya gotta pick the knights out every once in awhile. Helmets in the molars are such a drag.....


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## Seamaiden (Nov 9, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Ah, but you can't seduce donkeys that way..... (Shrek reference.)
> 
> Yeah, ya gotta pick the knights out every once in awhile.* Helmets in the molars are such a drag.....*


 That just made me remember a dream I had early this morning that I lost a crown and there was a hole in my jaw. 

Weirdness.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 9, 2008)

Please don't take this in a wrong way, Seamaiden, but gnostics are really opposed to the idea that God is the Jewish creator god of the old testament. We refer to that being (which in other cultures is still a creator-of-the-material-world-god) as the demiurge, and is the s. a. tan that Christ spoke of. This being is not in charge of the world, rite now, the God of the Forces, Sabboath, is, the demiurge was cast into chains. 
Our 'God' is the Father Christ spoke of (note the difference Christ made in speaking of YWHW or Jehovah, and then he refered to 'My Father' it was because (to us, now) it is two different beings. This is because certain, (but important to understanding of the whole) books were left outta the original scriptures. 
Our 'God' has no names, but Neo-Valentians refer to the 'Father.' But this is incorrect to think of as some divine man with the flowing beard and the throne and cloud thing, that is Sabboath, except in the creation story of Genesis and it is called Yaltaboath, or the demiurge. Our 'Father' is moer like a Light, and it is all giving. Sabboath balances the Forces, but the Light only gives light. This is the Father Christ spoke of, and in the Gospel of Phillip there is a passage (my most favorite of all the words of Christ)
_The kingdom of the Father is inside you, and all around you. _That means we carry a spark of the Light, the 'Father of the All' within every living thing (to us a mainstream religious term the 'Holy Spirit' but we (gnostics) refer to as the Epinoia. The aim is to become one with the True God, and to absorb and be aborbed back into the True God, the Light, when someone gains gnosis, which while directly translated from Greek means 'knowledge', to be more specific when we speak of it, it is 'knowledge of God.' To KNOW God, to touch it, to experience the reality of the Light, not just read about in books by people long passed, and pray to things we have doubts of the very existance of. Kinda like a tree. You KNOW it exists, you have experienced the reality of it. Imagine knowing God like that, to expereince it on such a level that leaves no doubt, or to use a Kabbalistic concept (gnosticism ancient roots are in Kabbalah) to 'have the veils lifted.' 

Our God wasn't the one who sent the flood, or the angel of death on the Egyptians (Sabboath again) but the eternal, loving Light we all come from and will return to.

Funny you should mention Jung, he was one of the Gnostic founders of most of the Neo-gnostic movements, and a hero to us. Also, he was helpful with our cousins, the Theosophisis movement, him and Blavatsky.

Hay, whose snoring?  Wake 'em up over there!


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 9, 2008)

Seamaiden said:


> That just made me remember a dream I had early this morning that I lost a crown and there was a hole in my jaw.
> 
> Weirdness.


Do dee do do, do dee do do (Twilight Zone theme).......


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## Seamaiden (Nov 9, 2008)

Um... why would I take your giving me a look into your personal beliefs the wrong way? Was there something more meant by you sharing it? I'm sorry, I'm a little confused by that. Unless you're actually telling me I have my head up my ass, then that's not so confusing.


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## Brazko (Nov 9, 2008)

I am, Everything, and belong to Nothing, I am


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## Lord Bluntmasta (Nov 9, 2008)

religiously, I believe in nothing

I don't eat beef either, because it's pretty nasty. Unless it's a bad-ass steak then I make an exception 

I respect people's views of vegetarianism and veganism but they are too unnatural for me


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 9, 2008)

Not at all, Seamaiden. I am just so used to apologising for what I know ahead of time, I guess I fall into old patterns.

When you tell someone that what someone else mite think to be God is really MY idea of Satam, they get a little bent outta shape.

I am ashamed for thinking you would ever had a problem with it. And a dragon ashamed is a pitiful thing. Please accept my apologies.


And now, for something completely different. 

Bluntmasta - I totally understand. I used to be like that too. But I had an experience that changed me totally. Would you feel sick, or even disgusted at the thought of someone tryin to serve you a nice, grilled, and saute'd hunk of human? That is what all flesh is like to a vegan, we see the face still on it, the parents it had.

Carrots don't have faces, or parents. Poor carrots.


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## vaporking (Nov 9, 2008)

DOLLARS...well actually POUNDS AND EUROS...HIGHER MARKET VALUE


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## vaporking (Nov 9, 2008)

saute'd hunk of human


mmmm human...can i have mine extra rare


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 9, 2008)

Ewww, steak tartar......


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## misterdogman (Nov 9, 2008)

I actually allow Jehovah Witnesses in my home. They listen to me preach. So do local hippies and other people because of my beliefs. I believe in Jesus and God but feel a lot of the message is lost. It just causes arguments...

Nowhere in the bible does it say you must be sin free and perfect to get into heaven...
It says to follow the golden rule and treat others as you want to be treated and believe Jesus died to allow you entry...
It says to not judge others for MAN is not a judge of anyone else.
Jesus himself said more than once in the bible if you have faith in him the size of a mustard seed you can tell a Mountain to move from your path to another place and the mountain will move...this is telekinesis..No?
The 10 commandments are a path to try to make your life and walk in life more like Jesus' not a rule book.
In the bible it says when 2 people are gathered in Gods name and talking of him they are in "church"- so technically I have been preaching to all of you the whole time you been reading this and you have been in a church...
God knows and created you to be Imperfect, with flesh..
We want lust pleasure and sin, Man was made for it.
Thats why we needed Jesus the only perfect man to reopen the gates to allow us sinners in...thusly the definition of faith

These are many reasons why Jews, Christians, muslims and other sects of each argue so much...Judgement!
these are also reasons why I dont go to a brick and mortar church, they are full of fake people more concerned with judging local people and who drives what and who has the most money and they gather with no Spirituality or faith...fuck that.

I go to church several times a week when someone shows up to talk about the bible...it happens all the time and when im done ranting about what I think the point is I ask people "When was the last time you went to church and didnt fall asleep or get annoyed or judged" They say they cant remember. Then I ask if they realize it had been an hour or even 4 in long rants and the whole time God sees us as in a church...this fascinates most people with a new definiton of church...it only takes 2. no building required...

Most of the shit people preach is total BS and I think that is one of the main turn off in spirituality and faith in Jesus.
I do my best not to judge anyone but of course I catch myself slipping occasionally...
I witness my point of view without preaching or holy rolling...
I sin all the time...I lust, I lie, I do bad things occasionally, everyone does somehow,...ITS HUMAN and expected from your flesh...and I love my weed beer shrooms etc...but I always ask for forgivness for things I do...

Most people have been convinced otherwise that theyre going to HELL...nah not true...The Jehovahs came over to talk one saturday asked if I knew where Id go after I died I opened the door and showed them my last supper tapestry on the wall...
They came back for 17 saturdays, rarely missed one to listen to me. Then one day they quit. Never came back...Imagine that.

If anyone wants to learn on a subject about faith or religion or spirituality, do your own research. Dont rely on some pastor or preacher or church holy roller to teach you...youll get mixed info 10 times out of 10 from 10 different preachers...

how much faith can a man place in that?


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 9, 2008)

In that last part, you nailed it, man. Don't let ANYONE tell you, take NO ONE'S word, you find the truth FOR YOURSELF.

Big fuckin amen.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 10, 2008)

I was raised a Jehovah's witness.Meh.


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## Budsworth (Nov 10, 2008)

What did you witness?????


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 10, 2008)

I witnessed brainwashing and mass stupidity.


Budsworth said:


> What did you witness?????


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 10, 2008)

And you didn't have a birthday party or holidays either.

Had to be raw.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 10, 2008)

I didn't mind that so much.I'm not into crowds.Dad wasn't one, so he'd get me a present or make mom make me a cake.I got to stay home from school at birthday parties.


puffdamagikdragon said:


> And you didn't have a birthday party or holidays either.
> 
> Had to be raw.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 10, 2008)

That had to be a perk. When I was a big-time pagan, we had 8 holidays a year, and of course Halloween (Samhain) and Christmas(Yule) were big deals. Huge. My hubby missed the 'olde ways' and wanted us to do the ol' pagan thing again, so we are. We celebrate Christmas for 12 days (then I have to spend the rest of the year tryin to lose the weight again from all the feasting!)


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 10, 2008)

That's really cool.The old Gods were the best gods.


puffdamagikdragon said:


> That had to be a perk. When I was a big-time pagan, we had 8 holidays a year, and of course Halloween (Samhain) and Christmas(Yule) were big deals. Huge. My hubby missed the 'olde ways' and wanted us to do the ol' pagan thing again, so we are. We celebrate Christmas for 12 days (then I have to spend the rest of the year tryin to lose the weight again from all the feasting!)


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## vaporking (Nov 10, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> That had to be a perk. When I was a big-time pagan, we had 8 holidays a year, and of course Halloween (Samhain) and Christmas(Yule) were big deals. Huge. My hubby missed the 'olde ways' and wanted us to do the ol' pagan thing again, so we are. We celebrate Christmas for 12 days (then I have to spend the rest of the year tryin to lose the weight again from all the feasting!)


thats it i am a pagan 
12 real days of yule feast..
thats why santa was so fat before the jews crucified him..


stoney you are right you witnessed mass brainwashing at its purist..
my x has recently drug my daughter into the moron ooppps mormon religion and i am pissed ..
at least my daughter laffed at their doctorine and is causing a bit of o ruckus..
she said she does like it but just because she really enjoys the company of the other kids..
she said most of her churcy magee friends families live alot with the same values as i have set ( treat people well with respect, take care of others who need it, love your family, all that stuff ) only here science explains everything just fine for us...
my daughter told them to piss off about the fact that she couldnt drink tea..


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## Seamaiden (Nov 10, 2008)

Just as with every one and every thing, there are good and bad things about Mormonism. This is also why I love reading Joseph Campbell, he never spent any time trying to tell anyone which was better, or truer, or falser. He spent his time tying it all together.


puffdamagikdragon said:


> Not at all, Seamaiden. I am just so used to apologising for what I know ahead of time, I guess I fall into old patterns.
> 
> When you tell someone that what someone else mite think to be God is really MY idea of Satam, they get a little bent outta shape.
> 
> I am ashamed for thinking you would ever had a problem with it. And a dragon ashamed is a pitiful thing. Please accept my apologies.


I will accept your apology, but there's really no need. You are simply firm in your beliefs, and mine are... a little more malleable. I just don't know, but try to live like a decent person and do good to and for others. I do disagree with your assessment of Campbell, but hey, it is what it is. 

See, I'm different from a lot of others here on this site in that even if I don't agree with you, I still have the ability to like you as a person. We just disagree is all.


> And now, for something completely different.


 I'm down with that, I like change. 


> Bluntmasta - I totally understand. I used to be like that too. But I had an experience that changed me totally. Would you feel sick, or even disgusted at the thought of someone tryin to serve you a nice, grilled, and saute'd hunk of human? That is what all flesh is like to a vegan, we see the face still on it, the parents it had.
> 
> Carrots don't have faces, or parents. Poor carrots.


 Jains take that to the extreme, don't they? Not so hung up on the faces as they are causing suffering. That's my hang-up, too. I can eat meat, I can slaughter my own meat, but to cause suffering? That I cannot do and cannot watch easily. Make it an instant, painless death and I can live well with that.


Stoney McFried said:


> I was raised a Jehovah's witness.Meh.


 My in-laws. And the husband. Oh. My. God. Is he a MORON!  I don't think that he's stupid _because_ he's a JW, I think he's always been stupid.


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## vaporking (Nov 10, 2008)

My in-laws. And the husband. Oh. My. God. Is he a MORON!  I don't think that he's stupid _because_ he's a JW, I think he's always been stupid. 
hahahahahahaaha, 
i try not to degrade anyone because of religious affiliation.. this makes me better than most of the zeolots i have to deal with...
i do feel strongly that religion is a stopping point in social evolution, and sometimes i let that belief frustrate me,but i will be the first to admit that society as we know it today would crumble tommorow if the theorys of god were dissproved.
having so many religions is kinda like a social safety net...
find out for sure there is no notorious G.O.D.
ther is allways buddah, or zues , or mother earth..to catch you from crashing in to hell..
i truly know people that need a god to force them to be decent people..just being good for societys benifit isnt enuff of a reward, they must be bribed with candy coated golden gates and such


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## Seamaiden (Nov 10, 2008)

You've just touched a point that was also made by Campbell, i.e. the utility of religion.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 10, 2008)

religion's utility is flawed. we don't need a set path.


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## vaporking (Nov 10, 2008)

FluffyToke said:


> religion's utility is flawed. we don't need a set path.


 it is flawed but alot of people do need a path, sincethe begining of your choice humans have had to live communaly for safety, food, etc... this means it is in our genetic code to follow or lead..alot of people need the leadership of religion to feel as they have purpose..and to reprogram this part of our genetic code would take a massive trauma to our species..sorry i will take billy graham over mass trauma...


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## Seamaiden (Nov 10, 2008)

Fluffy, if you're of a mind, try to watch the Bill Moyers series of interviews with Joseph Campbell (or get the book), The Power of Myth. It's far deeper than what we can effectively delve into here, and more far reaching as well. I think it's certainly something worth consideration, instead of immediate dismissal.


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## strangerdude562 (Nov 10, 2008)

*I have asked this question to myself many times, and my grandmother has exasperated me because I do not go to church. I don't know what to believe anymore, for now, I believe in living a happy and memorable life.*


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## Seamaiden (Nov 10, 2008)

If you need the path, I think you'll find it.  Tell your grandmother that your body is a temple of God and that's where you worship.


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## vaporking (Nov 10, 2008)

strangerdude562 said:


> *I have asked this question to myself many times, and my grandmother has exasperated me because I do not go to church. I don't know what to believe anymore, for now, I believe in living a happy and memorable life.*


 
isnt it a shame that to most that is just not enuff...


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## FluffyToke (Nov 10, 2008)

it's not immediate dismissal, I've been a lone trooper my whole life, friends are good, but in the end all we really have is ourselves. I'm a descartes man myself, I think therefore I am, I can't prove that you guys even exist, and vice versa.


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## vaporking (Nov 10, 2008)

FluffyToke said:


> it's not immediate dismissal, I've been a lone trooper my whole life, friends are good, but in the end all we really have is ourselves. I'm a descartes man myself, I think therefore I am, I can't prove that you guys even exist, and vice versa.


we dont exist we are electronic ghost voices ..left over in the long abandoned corridores of the machine..oooohhhhh ahhhhhh gigidy gigidy


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## FluffyToke (Nov 10, 2008)

sounds almost like sopsilism.


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## Seamaiden (Nov 10, 2008)

FluffyToke said:


> it's not immediate dismissal, I've been a lone trooper my whole life, friends are good, but in the end all we really have is ourselves. I'm a descartes man myself, I think therefore I am, I can't prove that you guys even exist, and vice versa.


That's fine, but I'm talking about in a much larger context. Most of us do have to live in a society, after all.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 10, 2008)

social dynamics aren't religion, religion is merely another place where social dynamics happen.


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## Seamaiden (Nov 10, 2008)

I don't completely disagree with that. But, where I'm coming from, where J. Campbell was coming from, was the effect of religion upon social dynamics.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 10, 2008)

all things have an affect on social dynamics, that's the kicker. religion is like a hobby, you can do it alone, or go to meetings and talk to other people about it. it's just like a book club. xD


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## Seamaiden (Nov 10, 2008)

I think that the communication issue we're having is that I think that I'm talking about not just a larger context, but about religion as it formed, not as it is now. I'm talking about what got us (collectively) here, where we are now, as _H. sapiens_. 

Really, look into the Campbell discussion on it, I found it very interesting and it's helped shape my own views on religion (I'm also not talking Abrahamic/monotheistic religions, or the popular religions, either, I do my best to be "all inclusive"). 

Shit, I have to go get dressed and I'll be gone most of the day. I enjoy discussing this sort of stuff, especially when someone brings in the philosophers. Well.. I'll be thinkin' on all this stuff, Fluffy!


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## FluffyToke (Nov 10, 2008)

nice dude, any talk is always welcomed, I make my living talking, so I guess I have to enjoy it. 

but yeah, campbell's work is nice, but sagan (in my eyes, a philosopher), Luther, Morton, Wells, they all have expansive works, and I believe I am well enough armed to do without campbell today. (but I will certainly read it sometime tonight)


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## strangerdude562 (Nov 10, 2008)

vaporking said:


> isnt it a shame that to most that is just not enuff...




It really is, I'm sure some people would think of me of less of a person because of this.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 10, 2008)

My faith is that I have none
My path is not having one



out.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 10, 2008)

we are all students of life, there is no guru, no ascension, no elightenment, it is all just a collective of intelligence among ourselves


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 10, 2008)

I actually give alot of credit to the collective brain thing, I have read some stuff was sent to me on it and it really made sense.

I have read bits and pieces of his work, (Campell) but nothing in its entirity. If you find some, Seamaiden, I would love to read some if you could pm me or something. 

This is awesome, ya'll.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 10, 2008)

heheh, yeah, but what IS awesome really? who defines what awesome is? and what is?


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 10, 2008)

And exactly what is 'what'?


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## FluffyToke (Nov 10, 2008)

that's my point. you got it. straight up.


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## misterdogman (Nov 11, 2008)

Duh its the government who decides all that...when to b happy, eat, sleep, work pay taxes, get paid, when to pay debts and actually they define what is and isnt...wow guys I figured it out Government is GOD.
Its an unseeable intangable entity thats omnipotent, omnipresent, able to do whatever it chooses and,... then it makes decisions... then later itll take them back and change their mind...go figure.

The GOVT is our new version of GOD is a woman.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 11, 2008)

everything plays a part. don't ever forget that.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 14, 2008)

And women inherit the earth....

I like it.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 14, 2008)

Lord, if it thy will that I be the last man on earth populated with only women......please take away my hearing. Amen. 



out.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 14, 2008)

heheheh I like that


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## Dfunk (Nov 14, 2008)

WOW...what a beautiful & extremely diverse thread this turned out to be. I commend all those who added their insight. I believe we are energy. I could really explain my whole theory, but it would take some time. I believe that several aspects of my theory have already been covered. Let me know if you would like to hear more puff.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 15, 2008)

I want to hear more.


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## Seamaiden (Nov 15, 2008)

What would Descartes say? Voltaire? Socrates? Homer (Simpson)? D'oh!


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## FluffyToke (Nov 15, 2008)

I think descartes would tell you that all you can trust is yourself, you can't really prove that anyone exists.


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## Budsworth (Nov 15, 2008)

Live and let live. Do the right thing or at least try. Lots of people won't even try.


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## Budsworth (Nov 15, 2008)

Must their really be religion, Do we not no wrong from right??? Ya know ying and yang
Is killing inocent people going to benifit you as the Islamic bastards think.. Are they
right and we being Jews Catholic or what ever, wrong???????? Whos right??? I think everybody being of sound mind and body knows right from wrong. Thats my religion


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## vantheman169 (Nov 15, 2008)

hom36rown said:


> its too damn hot for a penguin to just be waaalkin' around


 

Lmao i could totally hear Adam Sandler saying that and it cracks me up still!! lolz.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 16, 2008)

it's not about chastising a religion for their image. the image america wants to give the islams is "terrorists" but most islamic people are just people, not terrorists, extremist groups of less than 100 people can ruin the image of an entire people. If I remember correctly, someone once said that to unite a people, you need an enemy, a global enemy that everyone can unify against. you know who said that? hitler, when refferring to the jewish people. you know who else said it? bush, when refferring to "terrorists" weird huh?...


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## CrackerJax (Nov 17, 2008)

With all due respect, I think when Bush reeferred (<---) to terrorists, he meant terrorists.

No American administration has ever said that Islam or its faithful are to blame. However, it is a true statement to say that almost every terrorist is of the Islamic faith*.

Osama Bin Laden primary target has always been personal and aimed at Saudi Arabia. This is a struggle within the Islamic faith (think conservative vs. liberal **) and spill over onto the world stage has occurred. The stakes are high of course, and not to be underestimated.
Throw in Iran and Russia, along with Israel and you have a real pressure cooker building. 
==========================================

* There are many facets of Islam just as in Christianity.

** I am always amazed at American liberals giving quarter to Islamic terrorists, who would be considered to be the right wing nut jobs in the U.S. who blow up abortion clinics. Strange bedfellows indeed. 



out.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 17, 2008)

a terrorist isn't just a terrorist, it's anyone the government deems a "threat" but it's weird, because with our threat meter, aren't we scaring our own people, making our government the terrorists?


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## CrackerJax (Nov 17, 2008)

There's a vast difference from being scared of a color changing light (orange, yellow, red) and a car blowing up on the street as you pass by for lunch. If the Homeland Program scares you, WW2 would've made you commit suicide . 



out.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 17, 2008)

lol, it doesn't scare me, but it scares the public, makes people suspect other people, and yeah, I guess colors can scare people still; it happens, you can't argue that.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 17, 2008)

It's a dangerous world...it's pretty much filled up with two legged top predators. 



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 17, 2008)

Mixing religion with politics is a dangerous thing, reguardless of the faith or the nation.....


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## bacchante (Nov 18, 2008)

I'm a hellenic pagan. (zeus worship). for real

i love reading theogony by hesiod when i'm stoned.........it is so good....definitely believe in all that good stuff. ancient greeks gave us everything man. you know? fucking western civilization...they knew what was up...and that was before christianity was invented...


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## CrackerJax (Nov 18, 2008)

bacchante said:


> I'm a hellenic pagan. (zeus worship). for real
> 
> i love reading theogony by hesiod when i'm stoned.........it is so good....definitely believe in all that good stuff. ancient greeks gave us everything man. you know? fucking western civilization...they knew what was up...and that was before christianity was invented...


It's okay to have a fairy tale to believe in. Luckily the tradition of throwing unfit babies off of cliffs has not been passed down successfully from Greece to us. Yeah, they had it all going on. 





out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 18, 2008)

They beat the hell outta the Romans, tho, just me.

Most civilization owes a great deal to Alexander. Including ROme.


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## Dfunk (Nov 18, 2008)

This is for Fluffy & although I didn't get a response from you puff. I apologize for the wait Fluffy. As I originally stated I believe we are energy & this time I will elaborate...I think the appropriate way to describe the start of it all would be labeled Genisis(beginning). I think the entire universe is constructed of this genisis energy including us. This energy in it's original form is completly pure. This is how anything & everything is possible & also the reason everything just is until we apply labels & judgements. Over the course of a probably inmeasurable amount of time this energy has been continuosly warped & changed effected by everything within' itself. Time really can't be measured as it is merely an illusion meant to trick the human mind. Time never stops just like energy can never be destroyed. This is why I believe even though your physical exsistence ends you never really die. I like to think of life as experience & death as ascension. People always ask what's the meaning of life & my answer is rather simple. The purpose of life is that there is no purpose...let me explain. I believe in something called The Divine Mind & One Supreme Consciousness. I think in this experience(life) we are to just be & learn...kinda gather knowledge in a sense what ever that knowledge may be. I believe in ascension(death) your energy,soul, spirit or whatever you chose to call it delivers this knowledge to the Supreme Consciousness & recycles itself through all living genisis energy. If we use nature as an example & realize how it wastes very little it is easy to use logic to gather a conclusion that the universe operates the same since all creation is simply a mirror reflection of itself. The Divine mind inherently becomes more intelligent & aware of itself. Have you ever heard the statement - to thy own self be true? I really just think it's all a cycle & everthing is connected. Everything has an influence on everything else. I know alot of this sounds confusing, but it makes sense to me. I have attached a picture of this poster I have in my room that is called Genisis. It kinda helped me reach some of my conclusions as crazy as that sounds. I think have generally covered most of my viewpoints although I'm sure I forgot something. I hope that in sharing this with you I have opened your mind to new things & I look forward to hearing any questions anyone may have or discussions. Love - Peace - Together is the key to a bright future. Balance is the key to stability. The universe is a complicated thing that always works itself out.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 18, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> They beat the hell outta the Romans, tho, just me.
> 
> Most civilization owes a great deal to Alexander. Including ROme.



The reason you feel that Greece gave us more than Rome is because Rome preserved Greek knowledge, while some of Rome's greatest knowledge was lost at the end of their empire. Rome was sacked by barbarians and many secrets and wisdom was lost forever. The dark age had begun by snuffing out the light.....


out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 18, 2008)

Sorry, man, I didn't realise there was a question at me, I have been off the forum for awhile, bad elbow and typing with one finger is a bitch.

And hey, I cuddn't agree more!


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## pillarize (Nov 18, 2008)

God gave me power to become a son of God.
There is also the god of this world that has blinded the minds of men.
Any questions...just ask.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 18, 2008)

And he bases that on completely nothing......





out.


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## Dfunk (Nov 18, 2008)

No apologies necessary puff.......just wasn't sure if you were interested. I figured you didn't see my previous post, but I don't like to assume. I hope your injuries heal quickly & well.


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## Seamaiden (Nov 18, 2008)

bacchante said:


> I'm a hellenic pagan. (zeus worship). for real
> 
> i love reading theogony by hesiod when i'm stoned.........it is so good....definitely believe in all that good stuff. ancient greeks gave us everything man. you know? fucking western civilization...they knew what was up...and that was before christianity was invented...


  Carnage and Culture for you! Yes, the Greeks gave us more than we realize. And then there's the cheese.


CrackerJax said:


> It's okay to have a fairy tale to believe in. Luckily the tradition of throwing unfit babies off of cliffs has not been passed down successfully from Greece to us. Yeah, they had it all going on.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I believe that was specific to Sparta. And, oddly enough, Sparta had rather progressive attitudes towards women. I believe they were allowed to own property and vote.


This is why I so strongly suggest the perusing at least of Joseph Campbell. But, unless one avails themselves it's difficult to go beyond a rather cursory explanation.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 18, 2008)

Seamaiden said:


> Carnage and Culture for you! Yes, the Greeks gave us more than we realize. And then there's the cheese.
> 
> I believe that was specific to Sparta. And, oddly enough, Sparta had rather progressive attitudes towards women. I believe they were allowed to own property and vote.
> 
> ...



Oh, well then thats just ducky.....



out.


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## Cannabox (Nov 18, 2008)

Nature is the 1 true god. it exists everywhere, has always been, will always be, it is everything and nothing. it is all the rules and bounds inwhich our universe exists.

*can't disprove nature* it is our god.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 18, 2008)

nature didn't exist at one point; before the big bang? I also disagree with the whole "space is nature" natural in my eyes has always meant to some degree terrestrial.


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## Cannabox (Nov 18, 2008)

FluffyToke said:


> nature didn't exist at one point; before the big bang? I also disagree with the whole "space is nature" natural in my eyes has always meant to some degree terrestrial.


assuming there was a big bang, and that everything didn't just exist and is ever evolving.

also, to have a bang, there has to be something. so ... i dunno what to tell ya.. nature always has been and always will be.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 18, 2008)

that's wat I'm saying though, you consider space to be nature?


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## pillarize (Nov 18, 2008)

Its funny that freedom comes through God.

And people want freedom but not God...so how you all going to be free?


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## Seamaiden (Nov 18, 2008)

FluffyToke said:


> that's wat I'm saying though, you consider space to be nature?


Of course. Why wouldn't it be? Simply because it's beyond the normal human scope?


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 18, 2008)

Is this Sally Green AGAIN?


pillarize said:


> Its funny that freedom comes through God.
> 
> And people want freedom but not God...so how you all going to be free?


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## pillarize (Nov 18, 2008)

No sally here...but I have been taught by Christ.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 18, 2008)

So, schizophrenia........


pillarize said:


> No sally here...but I have been taught by Christ.


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## pillarize (Nov 18, 2008)

Where do your thoughts come from?


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 18, 2008)

There are many paths to the light, and all directions are allowed. All ends at the same place reguardless. We are all just tryin to get home.

I think therefore I am.


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## bacchante (Nov 18, 2008)

CrackerJax said:


> It's okay to have a fairy tale to believe in. Luckily the tradition of throwing unfit babies off of cliffs has not been passed down successfully from Greece to us. Yeah, they had it all going on.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'd have to say that is unfortunate rather than "lucky"
theres way too muhc breeding going on rigbht now
especially when you notice only stupid people are breeding


----------



## FluffyToke (Nov 18, 2008)

I've argued that point for years, but then you get into the whole eugenics arguement. it's a long road ahead of this convo.


----------



## Stoney McFried (Nov 18, 2008)

They come from.....



















Schizophrenia.


pillarize said:


> Where do your thoughts come from?


----------



## FluffyToke (Nov 18, 2008)

necrotizing fasciitis. ;D


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## pillarize (Nov 18, 2008)

Whats a conscience...who is that?


----------



## Stoney McFried (Nov 19, 2008)

It's you!You are your own governer, your own master, your own "god".


pillarize said:


> Whats a conscience...who is that?


----------



## CrackerJax (Nov 19, 2008)

The illusion of a duality within you has been shown by science to be a Darwinian survival tool. It obviously, like anything, has its drawbacks. 


out. :blsmoke;


----------



## pillarize (Nov 19, 2008)

Why does our being lead to death?
Why do we judge one another...that we might have them to fit our judgements.
Theres no freedom under our rules...the world is my prove.


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## Dfunk (Nov 19, 2008)

Depends how you view death...death is essentailly part of life & must be accepted. Life is not possible without death...think duality...this is how humans think. CrackerJax just pointed this out...humans like illusions. Judgement of another comes from the ego...no ego=no judgement. Freedom can only be achieved by self...You are not free if you are doing what someone else has laid out for you. It's takes hard work to be free in this world, but it's definately possible - anything is possible.


----------



## CrackerJax (Nov 19, 2008)

One might ask the question in reverse. 

Why would a G*D create a world based upon violence and death? The fact that organisms are "forced" to eat each other alive is a HORRIBLE plan. 
Who would do such a thing? Truly a maelevolent being, worthy of blind worship, or else? No Thanks...

If the glove doesn't fit....you must acquit.



out.


----------



## Dislexicmidget2021 (Nov 19, 2008)

Its the violence and death that makes love and peace more attractive, more appealing to most/Its the evil that gives good its balance /vice versa/ in the bigger spectrum, its all a balancing act so to speak.Action always has reaction,Its something so self evident that it goes farther than we are able to understand.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 19, 2008)

Along the lines of the earlier discussion on judgement, here is my feelings on it. Unfortunately, tho, I didn't write this, a friend did. But it is spot on, puts my thoughts into words better than I could.

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

Judgement, like other devices by which the world of illusions is maintained, is totally misunderstood by the world. It is actually confused w/ wisdom, and substitutes for truth. As the world uses the term, an individual is capable of "good" and "bad" judgement, and his education aims at strengthening the former and minimizing the latter.There is, however, considerable confusion about what these categories mean.What is "good" judgement to one may be "bad" judgement to another. Further, even the same person classifies the same action as showing "good" judgement at one time and "bad" judgement at another time. Nor can any consistent criteria for determining what these categories really are be taught. At any time the student may disagree w/ what his would-be teacher says about them, and the teacher himself may well be inconsistent in what he believes. "Good" judgement in these terms does not mean anything. No more does "bad".

It is necessary for the student/teacher of God to realize, not that he should not judge, but that he cannot. In giving up judgement he is merely giving up what he did not have. He gives up an illusion; or better he has an illusion of giving up. He has actually merely become more honest. Recognizing that judgement was always impossible for him, he no longer attempts it. This is no sacrifice. On the contrary, he puts himself in a position where judgement _through_ him rather than _by_ him can occur. And this judgement is neither "good" or "bad". It is the only judgement there is, and it is only one:"God's Son is guiltless, and sin does not(can not) exist."

...judgement in the usual sense is impossible. This is not an opinion but a fact. In order to judge anything rightly, one would have to be fully aware of an inconceivable wide range of things; past,present, and to come. One would have to recognize in advance all the effects of his judgement on everyone and everything involved in them in any way. And one would have to be certain there is no distortion in his perception, so that his judgement would be wholly fair to everyone on whom it rests now and in the future. Who is in a position to do this? Who except in grandiose fantasies would claim this for himself?

Remember all the times you thought you knew all the facts you needed for judgement, and how wrong you were! Is there anyone who has not had this experience? Would you know how many times you merely thought you were right, w/o ever realizing you were wrong?Why would you choose such an arbitrary basis for decision making? Wisdom is not judgement; it is the relinquishment of judgement. Make then but one more judgement. It is this: there is Someone with you Whose judgement is perfect. He does know all the facts; past,present and to come. He does know all the effects of His judgement on everyone and everything involved in any way. And He is wholly fair to everyone, for there is no distortion in His perception.

Therefore lay judgement down, not w/ regret but w/ a sigh of gratitude. Now are you free of a burden so great that you could merely stagger and fall down beneath it. And it was an illusion. Nothing more. Now can the student/teacher of God rise up unburdened, and walk lightly on. Yet it is not only this that is his benefit. His sense of care is gone, for he has none. He has given it away along w/ judgement. He gave himself to Him Whose judgement he has chosen now to trust, instead of his own. Now he makes no mistakes. His guide is sure. And where he *came* to judge, he *comes* to bless. Where *now* he laughs, he used to come to weep.

It isn't difficult to relinquish judgement. But it is difficult indeed to try to keep it. The student/teacher of God lays it down happily the instant he recognizes its cost. All of the ugliness he sees about him is its outcome. All the pain he looks upon is its result. All of the loneliness and sense of loss; of passing time and growing hopelessness; of sickening despair and fear of death; all these have come of it. And now he knows that these things need not be. Not one is True. For he has given up there cause, and they, which never were but the effects of his mistaken choice, have fallen from him. Student/Teacher of God, this step will bring you peace. Can it be difficult to want but this?

May the Holy Spirit Fill Yer Minds So You May See Truly.


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 19, 2008)

CrackerJax said:


> One might ask the question in reverse.
> 
> Why would a G*D create a world based upon violence and death? The fact that organisms are "forced" to eat each other alive is a HORRIBLE plan.
> Who would do such a thing? Truly a maelevolent being, worthy of blind worship, or else? No Thanks...
> ...


Ahh, now you are swimming in my waters. Us heretics ask those kind of questions, and others far more dangerous....


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 19, 2008)

1.We're food for the worms.
2.Because we want to be special.So we try to think we're better than others.
3.I'm free.


pillarize said:


> Why does our being lead to death?
> Why do we judge one another...that we might have them to fit our judgements.
> Theres no freedom under our rules...the world is my prove.


Exactly.


Dfunk said:


> Depends how you view death...death is essentailly part of life & must be accepted. Life is not possible without death...think duality...this is how humans think. CrackerJax just pointed this out...humans like illusions. Judgement of another comes from the ego...no ego=no judgement. Freedom can only be achieved by self...You are not free if you are doing what someone else has laid out for you. It's takes hard work to be free in this world, but it's definately possible - anything is possible.


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## pillarize (Nov 19, 2008)

Who was Jesus the Christ?

Man or Spirit?


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 19, 2008)

Myth.And a plagiarized one at that.Jesus Myth - The Case Against Historical Christ


pillarize said:


> Who was Jesus the Christ?
> 
> Man or Spirit?


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## FluffyToke (Nov 19, 2008)

what would chuck norris do?


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## pillarize (Nov 20, 2008)

If I say I know him not...that would make me a liar.

Also without faith in him...one will never know will they.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 20, 2008)

I say I know him not .. and I'm not a liar.

Also with faith in him .. one will never know will they.

It works both ways... I'll stick with the first one.



out.


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## pillarize (Nov 20, 2008)

If there were not an evidence of God...what would be the point.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 20, 2008)

There is no evidence of God sonny. You are missing the big point eh?


out.


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## pillarize (Nov 20, 2008)

You tell him that when you meet him...because he spoke to you today.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 20, 2008)

Since there is no evidence of me ever meeting him, I'm not worried. Fairy tales have their place in the world, but not as a guiding light. That only leads us down the wrong path, no matter how many candles are in the darkness.

Frankly, I prefer to hang with Jews and Buddhists..... they don't give a hoot if I believe them or not. That is true toleration...... and confidence. Christianity is an insecure faith, as well as Islam.

But enjoy your story.... whatever gets you through the day.

P.S. I'm done....

Good Luck!


out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 20, 2008)

Well, I DO believe in the existance of the being you speak of, just to me that is not 'God' (or should I say that is not MY God), nor is that the 'Father' that Yeshua spoke of.

Interpretation, like perception, is everything.


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## Dfunk (Nov 20, 2008)

^Well said.......I was just pointing that out to my mother yestarday about how perception is everything. I(28 years old) was explaining to my mother(60 years old) yestarday the misconception of traditional toothpaste. I'll tell everyone here even though some of you may know. The main ingredient & I believe only active one in common toothpaste is sodium fluoride...does anyone know what other product shares this ingredient? Rat poison! If you don't believe me go to the store & check it out. Why do you think it says contact poison control center immediately if ingested on the back of toothpaste. Interesting isn't it. Fluoride is bogus & actually not very good for your teeth. It sure does wonders for the dental industry though...I could explain further, but I think I'll stop now. My mother had no idea...see how people just don't know these things. She asked me how I knew about that & all this other stuff I've been telling her about & I told her I read constantly. The truth is out there...you just have to piece it together when you find it.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 20, 2008)

Yeah, I was the same way when I found out that aspertame (equal, splenda, all that) was orginally developed to kill ants, which it does very well. Sprinkle a pack of nutasweet or equal on an anthill and they will take it to the hive and it kills them, thier neurotransmitters go nuts and they attack each other(but they like it cuz of its sweetness.). The validated tests of the bad effects on humans ain't stopped its mass production and use either.


But I digress.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 20, 2008)

lol, if that wasn't a pro sidetrack, idk what is.


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## Dfunk (Nov 20, 2008)

yeah I did get off subject a little there didn't I...I should start another thread on perception.


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## pillarize (Nov 20, 2008)

God is the beginning of all creation...to know him is to know truth.
we are all brothers and sisters...we are not above one another
but if we are going to enter life eternal...we need to approach the truth.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 20, 2008)

man created god to explain shit he didn't understand. we don't need that anymore because we have science. you ever notice how god did way more shit back in the day? that's cuz we couldn't even explain fucking lightning. I agree that we have to unite as a people, but not under god, under ourselves.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 20, 2008)

No, it would make you an atheist.


pillarize said:


> If I say I know him not...that would make me a liar.
> 
> Also without faith in him...one will never know will they.


There is none.And if there were a god, allowing all the horrible things to happen that he has,wouldn't you say he's a bit of a dick?


pillarize said:


> If there were not an evidence of God...what would be the point.


Your voices aren't everyone's voices.


pillarize said:


> You tell him that when you meet him...because he spoke to you today.


Your truth isn't everyone's truth.


pillarize said:


> God is the beginning of all creation...to know him is to know truth.
> we are all brothers and sisters...we are not above one another
> but if we are going to enter life eternal...we need to approach the truth.


Exactly.


FluffyToke said:


> man created god to explain shit he didn't understand. we don't need that anymore because we have science. you ever notice how god did way more shit back in the day? that's cuz we couldn't even explain fucking lightning. I agree that we have to unite as a people, but not under god, under ourselves.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 20, 2008)

I can end this whole "god" thing right here, with a simple quote:

"Is god willing but not all powerful?
-then he is not omnipotent
Is god all powerful, but not willing?
-then he is malevolent
Is god both all powerful and willing?
-then whence cometh the evil
Is god neither all powerful nor willing?
-then why call him god?"

--Epicurus 33 A.D.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 20, 2008)

Nicely done.Now, look deeply into my sig.


FluffyToke said:


> I can end this whole "god" thing right here, with a simple quote:
> 
> "Is god willing but not all powerful?
> -then he is not omnipotent
> ...


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## FluffyToke (Nov 20, 2008)

lol, the dick on that fool is tiny.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 20, 2008)

It's his waxy smoothness that I find disturbing.


FluffyToke said:


> lol, the dick on that fool is tiny.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 20, 2008)

I see no smoothness, then again, that's like 200 pixels by 100 pixels. there wouldn't be good resolution anyway


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 20, 2008)

I'll change it to another soon to keep it fresh.


FluffyToke said:


> I see no smoothness, then again, that's like 200 pixels by 100 pixels. there wouldn't be good resolution anyway


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## FluffyToke (Nov 20, 2008)

that thing has long been not fresh.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 20, 2008)

I'll quit hijacking now.But I will say it looks fairly fresh.There's no scratch and sniff....


FluffyToke said:


> that thing has long been not fresh.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 20, 2008)

yeh, hijacking is bad 

anyway, I feel like we need to stop believing in our government. shit's bad.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 20, 2008)

Well, he ain't fluffy, heh heh.


On the God thing....

The particular heretic I am is we like to point out it is all interepretation. For instance, to us the "Word" of God (but then again, our 'God' isn't the Jewish-creator-of-the-material-world, either) isn't a book. It is, for lack of a better word, your 'conscience'. This can be proven by what is said of the 'Word'. Also, about that conscience; didn't the Jewish-creator God not WANT us to have that? He wanted us to remain ignorant to what was right and wrong. 

The snake set us free......


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 20, 2008)

Hay now, I started this, and I say Stoney can hijack away!!!


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 20, 2008)

Aw,thanks.I know I have a tendency to hijack.


puffdamagikdragon said:


> Hay now, I started this, and I say Stoney can hijack away!!!


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 20, 2008)

And to hit the nail on the head.....


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## FluffyToke (Nov 20, 2008)

my nail hit your head. oooo burn


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 20, 2008)

Thanks...I repped ya back.


puffdamagikdragon said:


> And to hit the nail on the head.....


Baby,it's a needle, not a nail.I luv ya.


FluffyToke said:


> my nail hit your head. oooo burn


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## FluffyToke (Nov 20, 2008)

owies. that one stung. maybe I should play the... BITCH CARD!!! muahahahaha!


(saving the cunt card for later when this gets more heated)


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 20, 2008)

Taking notes, I see!


FluffyToke said:


> owies. that one stung. maybe I should play the... BITCH CARD!!! muahahahaha!
> 
> 
> (saving the cunt card for later when this gets more heated)


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## FluffyToke (Nov 20, 2008)

notes? I'm taking the TEST! woooo


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 20, 2008)

Oh, you're just defensive cuz Stoney nailed it.

Kiddin, Fluffy. You're awright.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 20, 2008)

A TEST???  Nobody told me there was gonna be a test.

I forgot my pencil.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 20, 2008)

everyone on RIU so far is pretty alright, give or take a couple really nasty haters.


----------



## Stoney McFried (Nov 20, 2008)

Fluffy's got one! OOOOOhhhhh burn!


puffdamagikdragon said:


> A TEST???  Nobody told me there was gonna be a test.
> 
> I forgot my pencil.


----------



## FluffyToke (Nov 20, 2008)

it's more like a thick penis, but call it whatever you want. (~reality check~)


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 20, 2008)

Aw, I'm just playing.thick is better than long.


FluffyToke said:


> it's more like a thick penis, but call it whatever you want. (~reality check~)


----------



## FluffyToke (Nov 20, 2008)

heh, this reality check has been brought to you by fluffytoke, 

~keepin' it real since 1893


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 20, 2008)

Unless it's like an inch long and as big around as a folgers can, of course.Noone wants a wiggly pink hockey puck.


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 20, 2008)

And the more ya play with it, the thicker it gets (and longer, sometimes.)


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 20, 2008)

Stoney McFried said:


> Unless it's like an inch long and as big around as a folgers can, of course.Noone wants a wiggly pink hockey puck.


Bluwawhahahaha! Okay, I sprayed coffee all over my screen and keyboard that time.

Warn me next time!


----------



## Stoney McFried (Nov 20, 2008)

Sometimes,no matter how much you smack that soldier,he'll never stand at attention.i've run across that a tie or two in my many years.


puffdamagikdragon said:


> And the more ya play with it, the thicker it gets (and longer, sometimes.)


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 20, 2008)

Soldiers like that need a good flogging.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 20, 2008)

Then they'll suffer from ptsd!


puffdamagikdragon said:


> Soldiers like that need a good flogging.


----------



## FluffyToke (Nov 20, 2008)

heh, my soldier is well trained.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 21, 2008)

Is he ready for a medal?

Hmmm. Wear shall we pin it?


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## FluffyToke (Nov 21, 2008)

ahahaha, on his helmet (ouch!)


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 21, 2008)

Kinky.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 22, 2008)

So we start with philosophy and religion and end up on a PENIS!!! 



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 22, 2008)

Isn't the main religions claiming God has a dick anyway???

Stoney, love the siggy. You are so bad.


----------



## Dislexicmidget2021 (Nov 22, 2008)

Either God has one or he is one by the standard of the "Old Testament" he is One 
indeed!


----------



## FluffyToke (Nov 22, 2008)

I love watching the fights at religious seminars and shit, where someone says "She" and someone else says "He" in relation to god of course. and they get in dickfights about what/who god is. I say, fuck that fool.


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## pillarize (Nov 22, 2008)

Gods a Spirit

Just like you have one...can't see it until it speaks in words.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 22, 2008)

Then why is 'it' always refered to as 'he'? 

Words are also used to describe. In the two major monotheistic religions God (whether the Jewish creator god or Allah, the Islamic creator god) it is still a 'he'. Or the term Goddess which was/is used by Pagans.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 22, 2008)

Because they're patriarchal.And yeah.I like my sig too!


puffdamagikdragon said:


> Isn't the main religions claiming God has a dick anyway???
> 
> Stoney, love the siggy. You are so bad.


How do you know?Forgive me, but how can you,a limited creature, comprehend an unlimited one?How do you know what form it takes, or what it is or isn't?Can you please elaaborate?


pillarize said:


> Gods a Spirit
> 
> Just like you have one...can't see it until it speaks in words.


----------



## pillarize (Nov 22, 2008)

Jesus Christ was not of the natural mind set...his understanding came from God.

When one dies...they wait until the day of ressurection and must give an account of what they believed.

Some here might have heard the truth but made light of it...I hope it is not against there account.

I for one do not want to die in sin.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 22, 2008)

Well, you were born in it....


I for one do not believe in any way in a physical resurrection of the body. If you check your scripture Shaul (Paul) says that flesh cannot inherit the kingdom.




Stoney- You nailed it again, sugah. Methinks you are a Sagitarrian, maybe? Good shootin.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 23, 2008)

See, you didn't answer my question directly.Typical.Religion is just a way to include oneself and disinclude others.


pillarize said:


> Jesus Christ was not of the natural mind set...his understanding came from God.
> 
> When one dies...they wait until the day of ressurection and must give an account of what they believed.
> 
> ...


Yeah.I am a Sag.Good guessing!


puffdamagikdragon said:


> Well, you were born in it....
> 
> 
> I for one do not believe in any way in a physical resurrection of the body. If you check your scripture Shaul (Paul) says that flesh cannot inherit the kingdom.
> ...


----------



## FluffyToke (Nov 23, 2008)

someone should guess what I am. you'll never get it. ;D

and what happens when we die in sin? we go to "hell?"
weird, I could swear I saw "satan" in another religion older than christ, what was it again? oh yeah, wiccanism/paganism right? don't they have a harvest/fertility god named baphomet? I thought so.


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 23, 2008)

Offhand I would guess you were a water sign, a pisces or cancer maybe?

Me a Sag, too, Stoney. Takes one to know one, I guess...


----------



## Stoney McFried (Nov 23, 2008)

Yup, they do.Whattabout Pan? And...you're an aries.


FluffyToke said:


> someone should guess what I am. you'll never get it. ;D
> 
> and what happens when we die in sin? we go to "hell?"
> weird, I could swear I saw "satan" in another religion older than christ, what was it again? oh yeah, wiccanism/paganism right? don't they have a harvest/fertility god named baphomet? I thought so.


----------



## Stoney McFried (Nov 23, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Offhand I would guess you were a water sign, a pisces or cancer maybe?
> 
> Me a Sag, too, Stoney. Takes one to know one, I guess...


----------



## FluffyToke (Nov 23, 2008)

I am a cancer, puff got it. what gave me away?


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## pillarize (Nov 23, 2008)

Hell and sin are one of the same.

Whats wrong with the natural body...it dies because of sin.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 23, 2008)

No it doesn't.It dies because of degeneration.Telomeres, which are on your chromosomes, get shorter as we age, almost like a fuse.Cells stop regenerating.When an organism can no longer sustain itself, it dies.Pretty simple. Telomere - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


pillarize said:


> Hell and sin are one of the same.
> 
> Whats wrong with the natural body...it dies because of sin.


----------



## pillarize (Nov 24, 2008)

Is that mans science that you believe and when one believes...its made manifest.

Hell is created by the tongue and sets the world on fire...not a nice place to be...

Making fear of death a way of life...to those that made a covenant with death.


----------



## Stoney McFried (Nov 24, 2008)

Is this Prophecy? I mean really, come on now.You don't answer with real answers, just religious gibberish.Religion is man made.Science has always been there for us to discover.Religion is mind control, and it looks like you swallowed yours, hook and all.


pillarize said:


> Is that mans science that you believe and when one believes...its made manifest.
> 
> Hell is created by the tongue and sets the world on fire...not a nice place to be...
> 
> Making fear of death a way of life...to those that made a covenant with death.


----------



## potheadsmoker (Nov 24, 2008)

check out the documentary, "the god who wasnt there"
The God Who Wasn&#39;t There - History of the Gospels


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## pillarize (Nov 24, 2008)

I was once in religion...now I answer to no one.

Been set free from mans law...and yet you want me to follow more of mans gibberish.

Your religion is no different then bible religion.


----------



## Stoney McFried (Nov 24, 2008)

Ding ding, we have a winner!Another nut on the net!We seem to reel them right on in at Riu.


pillarize said:


> I was once in religion...now I answer to no one.
> 
> Been set free from mans law...and yet you want me to follow more of mans gibberish.
> 
> Your religion is no different then bible religion.


----------



## pillarize (Nov 24, 2008)

Truth does upset a few.


----------



## Stoney McFried (Nov 24, 2008)

Truth.Lol.It's your truth, not mine.Well....wonder if you have any other accounts here.Real curious whether we get the same ones back over and over, or new ones.


pillarize said:


> Truth does upset a few.


----------



## pillarize (Nov 24, 2008)

Its your truth or lie...there is only one that has truth within himselve.

Seek that truth that you may see mans truth is utterly lies.

Why will you die?


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 24, 2008)

FluffyToke said:


> I am a cancer, puff got it. what gave me away?


 I'm just guuuuuud.


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 24, 2008)

Everyone dies, Pillar, that is why we are born, no matter how close you come to ANY 'God' you are gonna die.

We die cuz we THINK we are our physical bodies. We aren't, but I don't suppose you could understand. If you think you are your body, then when it dies, you die. But if you come to the realization that you are NOT your body, then when the body ceases to function, you go on cuz you know you were never your body anyhow. You are in hell now, hon, and you can't see that either. You chose blindness over the accpetance of the truth. Stand in your burning house and deny it is burning all around you, denial is the main ingredient in religous types, and the more denial you show the more of a victim of religion you make yourself.

You seem to live only by your own gibberish. It is ok, at least it is yours, but it is definately gibberish. So I wouldn't go slamming others when you are obviously floating around in space, spewing religion while tryin claim it isn't.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 24, 2008)

Translation : I'm SPAYSHAL.Listen to me. Brother


pillarize said:


> Its your truth or lie...there is only one that has truth within himselve.
> 
> Seek that truth that you may see mans truth is utterly lies.
> 
> Why will you die?


----------



## pillarize (Nov 24, 2008)

Don't you know you are created by Gods word of understanding.

Why we die is because we believe not in God but our own imaginations.

Gods willing to change us into immortals...but without faith it won't happen.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 24, 2008)

No.Because your beliefs are different from mine.Period.Not gonna convert me, give up, bye, have a nice day.


pillarize said:


> Don't you know you are created by Gods word of understanding.
> 
> Why we die is because we believe not in God but our own imaginations.
> 
> Gods willing to change us into immortals...but without faith it won't happen.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 24, 2008)

lol cosmic zombie jewish man rises from the dead and turns into a copper giant and pulls a flaming sword out of his mouth in attempt to better the planet that his father, who's actually him[?] made in 7 days. (swear to god the bible says all of that)


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## CrackerJax (Nov 25, 2008)

There is not a single original idea in Christianity. It's merely repackaged old ideas.

I think my SIG says it all.....



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 25, 2008)

FluffyToke said:


> lol cosmic zombie jewish man rises from the dead and turns into a copper giant and pulls a flaming sword out of his mouth in attempt to better the planet that his father, who's actually him[?] made in 7 days. (swear to god the bible says all of that)


ROFLMAO Not only that, but according to them thier God is actually HAPPY we killed Him, and we are all blessed cuz we let a pacifist get brutally tortured and beaten and killed. Niiiiiiice.


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## pillarize (Nov 25, 2008)

I can't convert anyone to Christ...it is Christ that converts.

I am not of religion and if you think of my religion is of this world...you are wrong.

I can only speak of what Christ is...Christ can only reveal himselve to those that believe.

Religion of this world are not Christ...but one will have evidence of his existence if they sincerly seek him.

So conversion can only come if you receive Christ...for only Christ can open the eyes of the blind.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 25, 2008)

Here's a dose of reality for you pilly, Christ doesn't convert anyone. Not even sure he was real, but certainly he is long gone. No it's the penguins who convert, and the methods have been harrowing. I want no part of such a violent sect. I am a pacifist, unlike Christians.



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 25, 2008)

When you speak of 'conversion' you speak of a desire for world dominance. Religion.

When you speak of 'faith' you are obviously dedicating yourself to something you have not PERSONALLY experienced yet, or you would have no need of faith. Again, religion.

TRUE connection with the TRUE God requires only that you look within.

Gnothi Seauton, my friend. Wake up.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 25, 2008)

He is deep in the rabbit hole I'm afraid......



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 25, 2008)

Yep. That is how you can't tell the light at the end of the tunnel is really a freight train headed your way.....


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## pillarize (Nov 25, 2008)

Who in this world are seperated one against?

There are very few christians.

But as I said...you can't please God without faith.

For faith is looking for the evidence of God...and only selve can search for that evidence.

God comes to us...there is no way we can find him without faith.

The natural understanding that we have is also the enemy of selve...it hinders our faith.


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## pillarize (Nov 25, 2008)

In other words you believe what you see(understand)is this selve not the religion of this world?


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## CrackerJax (Nov 25, 2008)

I don't question your sincerity. I question your source of information.

As with UFO'S.... great claims require great proof..... this is where the wheels leave the cart me thinks.... 




out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 25, 2008)

pillarize said:


> Who in this world are seperated one against?
> 
> There are very few christians.
> 
> ...


See, that is the problem. You speak of seeking, and faith. Sounds like you still haven't experienced it. I KNOW 'God" (or MY God, anyway), I have experienced my 'God', I have no need of faith or seeking, I KNOW and I have FOUND what I sought. You are seeking a fantasy, that is why you must cling to knowing OF God, rather than KNOWING God. And God is inside you RIGHT NOW, you don't hafta go looking anywere but inside. It is only your enomous ego that blocks you. Your ego is convinced (cuz relgion has taught you this) that God is something outside of you that you hafta earn. NOthing is farther from the truth. Know yourself, and you will be known. Nosce ti epson, gnothi seauton, KNOW THYSELF. You ain't found God yet, that is why you must rely on faith. You ain't found God yet, so what would you know about it?

I'll try and make this simple for you. I KNOW my house, my bedroom, my bathroom. I know it personally, intimately, I have EXPERINCED it. I KNOW OF, say, Paris. Never been there, never walked the streets. Yet I know Paris exists, but I do not KNOW Paris, I know OF Paris. Same thing with God. You know OF God, but you don't KNOW God. If you KNEW, (rather than KNEW OF) you wouldn't need faith or belief. I don't need faith to know my house, but I do to know OF Paris. I have faith it is real, but I dont' KNOW.

Are ya diggin what I am laying down?


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 25, 2008)

pillarize said:


> In other words you believe what you see(understand)is this selve not the religion of this world?


Umm, I don't get this. Rephrase, and leave out 'selve,' and I mite understand your question. I'd be glad to answer, but I ain't understanding what you are asking.

And besides, I said this world was illusionary. Did you catch that?


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## pillarize (Nov 25, 2008)

If you believe God is in you...would you not say that God is able to speak to us?

What if your god is selve...would you not be breaking one of his commandments?

Saying that there should be no other gods before him.

I have been made known to God through his Christ...Who do you suppose Christ is?


----------



## barrgemike (Nov 25, 2008)

Microdizzey said:


> I believe in a creator of it all. But I'm curious to what is before him.
> 
> I definitely believe in an afterlife, a life beyond what we live now. I mean... what is the point of our expanding concentiousness...
> Does it just end? Cease to exist? Or does it continue on through different phases through out eternity. We may not be able to comprehend what eternity is, but that does not mean it doesn't exist.
> ...


I'll just second his answer, I kinda think that reincarnation would work..maybe.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 25, 2008)

But your GOd I call the Demiurge, it was the Jewish Creator God. Your God also killed the firstborn Egyptians, told 'his' people to kill every last woman and child of other nations, flooded the world, has a man sacrifice his beautiful baby girl to 'him'- need I go on? (Altho to me (and other Valentian gnostics) the Jewish Creator God and the one in charge SINCE the garden of eden are two different beings, the one in charge of the world now is Sabboath, or God of the Forces, the demiurge, the God of the Garden of Eden, was Yaltaboath. But they were both Archons, and not the TRUE God.)

What I worship, and was called by Yeshua 'My Father' (Yeshua is Jesus in Hebrew) is NOT YHWH, the Jewish Creator God, nor was it Sabboath, God of the Forces. That being is called Satan.

Now that would change everything, wuddint?

MY God never does anything but give Love and Light. MY God didn't create death, does not rule the world, didn't give the commandments to Moses. Remember how many times Yeshua said "Moses told you this but I say this....'' Reason for that.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 25, 2008)

barrgemike said:


> I'll just second his answer, I kinda think that reincarnation would work..maybe.


I am of the path that you are thrown back into the gilgumic cycle (to use a kabbalistic term) until you aquire gnosis (to use a gnostic term).

Basically, you are reborn over and over until you discover you are not of this world, you discover the connection to God within you, you aquire gnosis and you break from the gilgumic cycle at the moment of physical death, and you see your life was never about your physical existance, this is only a classroom where we all graduate, sooner or later, but some are further along, and have glimpsed gnosis, and know that they are not thier bodies. When you discover this, you will realise you are not your body and when it dies it doesn't mean YOU die, cuz you are independant of the physical state now.

Did I get too deep?


----------



## CrackerJax (Nov 25, 2008)

Who do you suppose Christ WAS is a better constructed statement.......

For the sake of civility, let's assume that there was a Jesus (it is an assumption).
I won't bother you with showing how the Bible is a compilation of "here say" and totally anonymous authors.

Jesus was a man who in my opinion emulated the ways of Ghandi (or vice versa) .. passive resistance combined with leading by example. Was Jesus trying to change the world? Certainly not. Jesus considered himself beyond anything a GOOD JEW. 
His message was for JEWS only. It was Paul of Tsarsus who took the word of Jesus to the gentiles because it was a complete failure with his own people. Jesus would not have approved, his message was for JEWS ONLY. In the end he miscalculated and violated his holy observances at the temple and paid the price of death at the hands of his own people. 

The myth making didn't occur for 60 or 70 years following his supposed death (there are no records of him even though COPIOUS records were kept in that city at that time).

Someone mentioned Joseph Campbell earlier and it is a good suggestion. Google up some of his books.....check out "the power of myth". It's a great read and may open your eyes to the larger picture. 



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 25, 2008)

pillarize said:


> If you believe God is in you...would you not say that God is able to speak to us?
> 
> What if your god is selve...would you not be breaking one of his commandments?
> 
> ...


 
Missed your last statement. Sorry.

Christ is within me, and you, and all of us. The _Christos_ wecall it. And Yeshua said, "_The kingdom of the Father is inside you, and all around you." Gospel of Thomas_


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 25, 2008)

Actually, Jax, you and I could get into a really good discussion about this. The same views were also later voiced by Buddha, Mani, and some Asian guy I can't think of his name now. THere have been many 'lightbringers' into the world.

WHile I am the first to recognise there is no hisotrical documentation of ANYTHING in the Bible, and I dont hold to the Bible cuz it is not complete, they left the most important parts out, still I do think that the stories of Yeshua (Jesus) to be a Jewish retelling of the Osirus/Dyonisis mythos, too many paralles. But that is becuz Constantine paganized the original words of Yeshua (all we had to begin with, the Gospel of Thomas that predates any of the texts in the Vatican) and there was a huge fight and what is now the Holy Roman Catholic Church won. Any dissidents were branded heretics and slaughtered. I think the only 'valid' text we have that isn't part of the paganization of Yeshua is the Gospel of Thomas. Even Shaul )Paul you mentioned) never once spoke of a virgin birth, or miracles, or any of the 'stories' used in the gospels. And most scholars agree that the Gospel of Thomas is Source Q for the other books, not only it's age but the COMPLETE verses are in the Gospel of Thomas.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 25, 2008)

Ommmmmmmmmmm.... I am the Alpha and the Omega, pass the salt please...

Yes, the Bible is an extremely difficult "book" to read. I believe this was done intentionally to maintain control. My sister goes to Bible Study every week for the last 8 years or so. So, I asked her, how many times have you read it through complete? Zero, she replies. And what does that tell you I asked. She's a good sport. 

I am an AVID reader and have always been. I have never had to read any book more than twice to know it. I have read the Bible through (although I haven't told my own sister this ) once. I will not read it twice I'm afraid, although there are some ripping good yarns in there. I will read parts now and again, but for the fantastic content, not the inner meaning of life.


Puff .. Gospel of Thomas. Thomas who? 



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 25, 2008)

Jax, gotta run, here is the link....
http://www.gnosis.org/naghamm/gosthom.html

Be back.


My turn. Out.


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## barrgemike (Nov 25, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> I am of the path that you are thrown back into the gilgumic cycle (to use a kabbalistic term) until you aquire gnosis (to use a gnostic term).
> 
> Basically, you are reborn over and over until you discover you are not of this world, you discover the connection to God within you, you aquire gnosis and you break from the gilgumic cycle at the moment of physical death, and you see your life was never about your physical existance, this is only a classroom where we all graduate, sooner or later, but some are further along, and have glimpsed gnosis, and know that they are not thier bodies. When you discover this, you will realise you are not your body and when it dies it doesn't mean YOU die, cuz you are independant of the physical state now.
> 
> Did I get too deep?


Not at all i enjoyed that, i'd like to read some more on that, If you have any links


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## pillarize (Nov 25, 2008)

Christ is the Spirit of God...and if the Spirit is in you...then God's understanding has enlightened our most inner spirit.

Thats just it...God opens our eyes to his understanding...so the bible is of no use without the Spirit.

His Spirit guides us through whats written...selve tries to reason within selve to understand.

The natural man can not receive the things that be of God.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 25, 2008)

It's your adherence to the Bible as the catalyst of understanding which runs you afoul......



out.  ( <-- I have that copywrited PUFF!!!)


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## FluffyToke (Nov 25, 2008)

I feel like religion is just another way to divide us. any religion cool or uncool, is just a dividing stone, to segregate our thought. I guess I'm hinting at collective thought[?]


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## CrackerJax (Nov 25, 2008)

So that would mean the bees and ants are way ahead of us....

I can buy that 


out.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 25, 2008)

sweet! I'm onto something!


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## pillarize (Nov 25, 2008)

Religion is divided in knowledge...because its man made.

Christ is not divided against himselve.

The bible only speaks of Christ in which we seek...the bible is not Christ.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 25, 2008)

pillarize said:


> Religion is divided in knowledge...because its man made.
> 
> Christ is not divided against himselve.
> 
> The bible only speaks of Christ in which we seek...the bible is not Christ.


You're entire perspective of the "Christ" eminates from a single source, the Bible. You are in a circular logic path sir. 
Can you not recognize it? I sure can.... 



out.


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## {ganjaman}420 (Nov 25, 2008)

i believe in a God or a creater i dont think we evolved from fuckin monkeys i believe that God put weed on this earth for people to enjoy i guess u could call me a christian but i dont go to church i just believe that jesus was gods only son and that if i keep growin and blazin trees that one day i will be in heaven blazin them with god u dig


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## pillarize (Nov 25, 2008)

All scripture is hidden in Christ...so if you were to read the bible...you will only understand with the carnal mind.

The reason Christ came is to renew our minds to the truth...the world is a world of lies...your living in a dream world neo.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 25, 2008)

You have hopelessly trapped urself pilly, lol.....




out.


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## pillarize (Nov 25, 2008)

Yes Christ trapped me...but where are you?

Has death trapped you in unbelieve?


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 25, 2008)

Is English your first language?Lemme break it down.In caps.





THE BIBLE IS A WORK OF FICTION.CHRISTIANITY IS A PIECEMEAL RELIGION THAT HAS STOLEN ITS MYTHS FROM OTHER, OLDER RELIGIONS.JESUS IS ONLY MENTIONED IN THE BIBLE, NEVER HISTORICALLY.THEREFORE, JESUS IS A MYTH.



IS THIS PROPHECY?YOU MAKE THE SAME GRAMMAR MISTAKES AS HE DID.


pillarize said:


> Yes Christ trapped me...but where are you?
> 
> Has death trapped you in unbelieve?


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## JNup (Nov 25, 2008)

*This is mine:* I am atheist i do not believe in god at all. I do think there could have been a dude names jesus back in the day but the bible is just a book. a story book. I have no prob with any religion or anyone believing in god. i think religion is kinda like laws in a nation. People wont do certain things because they believe its a sin or just wrong to do so it keeps order sometimes. i just believe in way more scientific theories and proofs.


edit: i had 2 (and)s b4 proofs


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## FluffyToke (Nov 25, 2008)

lol. I'm sick of this thread and it's tendency to turn towards violent convertism :3


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## CrackerJax (Nov 25, 2008)

FluffyToke said:


> lol. I'm sick of this thread and it's tendency to turn towards violent convertism :3




Hardly violent Fluffy. 

Put down the pipe and step away from the vehicle .. 






out.


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## pillarize (Nov 25, 2008)

God is in everyone of us...wether you have the son is another thing.

He promised that he would manifest himselve in a way...that will be rejected by those that have not the truth.

In this he was very sorrowful...knowing the end of all unbelieve.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 25, 2008)

You refuse to see any point but your own.I really don't think you understand us well enough to debate.Which doesn't make you bad, it just makes it tiresome to try to make a point with you.


pillarize said:


> God is in everyone of us...wether you have the son is another thing.
> 
> He promised that he would manifest himselve in a way...that will be rejected by those that have not the truth.
> 
> In this he was very sorrowful...knowing the end of all unbelieve.


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## mistacurious (Nov 25, 2008)

Stoney McFried said:


> Is English your first language?Lemme break it down.In caps.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You have an ugly means of expression. I hope you never raise children.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 25, 2008)

I raise children.They do fine.I'm just blunt.Frankly, I was trying to make a point, because none of his arguments seemed to have any logic behind them.I'll raise my children as I see fit.Hit ignore if you don't like me now, cuz you damn sure won't like me later.


mistacurious said:


> You have an ugly means of expression. I hope you never raise children.


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## JNup (Nov 25, 2008)

no one ever wins a religion debate all u can do is just say what u believe in and leave it as that.


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## mistacurious (Nov 25, 2008)

wheres the ignore button?


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 25, 2008)

Go to my rollitup, edit ignore list, ignore user.Make sure you don't misspell it.


mistacurious said:


> wheres the ignore button?


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## mistacurious (Nov 25, 2008)

I think that is the first post of yours that has made me glad I read it. Thanks.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 25, 2008)

Yep.Get on it.


mistacurious said:


> I think that is the first post of yours that has made me glad I read it. Thanks.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 25, 2008)

If you are going to delve into religious forums, you better thicken your hide.

Stony was just being honest albeit blunt, but this isn't the first page now is it...... the circular illogic is getting tiresome, that's all.



out.


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## pillarize (Nov 26, 2008)

God promises to make a new heaven and earth...where rightousness dwells in.

Now I know you don't understand the concept...but I will try and explain it to you

Righteousness is believing in God.

The earth is us...in all our natural glory...even our natural thoughts.

Heaven is the old testament...that is following the bible according to the natural understanding of man.

The new heaven is God's Spirit of which we follow...and the fruits of the Spirit are love joy and so on

The new earth is the renewed mind created by the heavenly Spirit 

So the world to come...which is upon us...is totally those the worship God in spirit and truth.

If you reject God's prophet...you will be cut off from among his people.

For the prophet speaks through the vessels of men.


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## longbaugh (Nov 26, 2008)

Stoney McFried said:


> You refuse to see any point but your own.I really don't think you understand us well enough to debate.Which doesn't make you bad, it just makes it tiresome to try to make a point with you.


I believe that back in the day of Socrates and Plato, the debates they had were for enlightenment...not to prove who was right ... or worse, that the other person is wrong. When debate degrades to that point, Stoney's right, it's useless.

God (if a god or spiritual realm exists) must be far too vast and infinite to be comprehended by any one person. His will is too complex to be spell out in any one book.

I'm also disappointed when people invoke Jesus while behaving in a way that's contrary to what we think he said. Jesus (whether or not he was real) was all about forgiveness and loving your brother. He gave hope. Now it's all twisted around ... The Jesus I understand would never condone violence ( in action or thought ).

Anyhoo, I could go on and on ... and on


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## CrackerJax (Nov 26, 2008)

There is no way to know what Jesus would do. There is only anonymous accounts of hear say and myth making. It's the source of all this "stuff" which is questionable...... debatable. 

I'm pretty sure debate was used as a means to get to the truth. To see which side was CORRECT. This goes on to this day in our Govt. and in our workplace, nothing has changed.

Pilly is a broken record of misinformation. It is pretty clear he is not able to debate, but to parrot circular gibberish.

If your gonna preach it, be able to back it up.


Perhaps this thread should be closed, it's run its course......



out.


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## pillarize (Nov 26, 2008)

Ahh words of those that have shut there ears and eyes.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 26, 2008)

This is the last thing I'll say to you on this.YOUR TRUTH IS NOT EVERYONE'S TRUTH.OUR EYES AND EARS ARE OPEN,WE JUST DIDN'T HAVE THE SAME"REVELATION" AS YOU.YOU'RE NOT A PROPHET, YOU'RE A PARROT.


pillarize said:


> Ahh words of those that have shut there ears and eyes.


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## pillarize (Nov 26, 2008)

Didn't say I was a prophet...but the word found no entrance.
Christ didn't come to please the flesh.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 26, 2008)

And I quote.


pillarize said:


> If you reject God's prophet...you will be cut off from among his people.
> 
> For the prophet speaks through the vessels of men.


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## pillarize (Nov 26, 2008)

Christ is that prophet not me...how can i cut you out of his people.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 26, 2008)

That's just your opinion pilly .. which extends as far as your nose. Just don't expect others to share yours. 

So far you have said almost nothing of consequence, after 29 pages......





out.


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## cluch (Nov 26, 2008)

i believe in dirt..i also believe in the book..another belief is dont bother me or mine or ill hit you in the head with a piece of copper coated led from about or around 250-300 yards giving the wether on that particular day.or night.


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## Dfunk (Nov 26, 2008)

Dirt is definately awesome!


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## JNup (Nov 26, 2008)

i used to work with this dude who was all about the SUN. and backed it up very well. Since w/o the sun there would be no life.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 27, 2008)

Stoney McFried said:


> This is the last thing I'll say to you on this.YOUR TRUTH IS NOT EVERYONE'S TRUTH.OUR EYES AND EARS ARE OPEN,WE JUST DIDN'T HAVE THE SAME"REVELATION" AS YOU.YOU'RE NOT A PROPHET, YOU'RE A PARROT.


It is only a projection, Stoney, Pill is the blind and deaf one, we can all see it but the one in denial. WOrse part about denial is you are IN denial about BEING in denial. And I ain't talkin about no river in Egypt.

Can you say, dee-ni-ahl?


Brackkkk! Conversion and faith. Tweet-eet. No other way to heaven than my way.

Woo hoo.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 27, 2008)

I love dirt. And the sun. I really like the sun.


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## diemdepyro (Nov 27, 2008)

I believe in Jesus, Buddha and Santa. I will not be taking chances.

My Faith and my cannabis are not dependent on one another


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## pillarize (Nov 27, 2008)

Wonder why the jews rejected Christ...oh yea they didn't believe him either.


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## cluch (Nov 27, 2008)

damn how could i forget the sun


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## CrackerJax (Nov 27, 2008)

Sun Ra shine down upon me 

Save me from the ones who make idols in their own image ....

The moon is much more SEXY tho....

Shakin shakin shakin that thing all over the night 
She's waxing she's waning, you know she's sexy, you know she's right
Shakin shakin shakin that thing all over the night, 



out.


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## longbaugh (Nov 27, 2008)

CrackerJax said:


> The moon is much more SEXY tho....
> 
> Shakin shakin shakin that thing all over the night
> She's waxing she's waning, you know she's sexy, you know she's right
> Shakin shakin shakin that thing all over the night,



Definitely...yeah... ... moon's definitely sexy


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## cluch (Nov 27, 2008)

tonight i will go out and jake off under the moonlight


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 27, 2008)

That sounds beautiful, man!


cluch said:


> tonight i will go out and jake off under the moonlight


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## CrackerJax (Nov 27, 2008)

moonlit pearl drops..... now THAT is romance!! 




out. :blsmoke;


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## NomadicSky (Nov 27, 2008)

I don't really know.

I practice Wicca I feel some connection to the ole times before the Christians murdered those who wouldn't accept their pagan beliefs.

Still though I honestly don't know.

I believe there must be something, but that is I have no idea. And what created that?

I guess I'll really know when I die. 

I do not believe we are alone in the universe but I don't think alien life looks anything like our ideas of life/ I actually believe there is life within our solar system Earth it's so alien that we can't understand it and don't recognize it as life. 

Or on worlds we can't probe I imagine a that big worlds like Jupiter are teaming with life in their atmosphere jellyfish like creatures and the like.

On Venus there's a kind of bacterial life in it's atmosphere. 

Intelligent life is however very rare.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 27, 2008)

That's interesting, you must have read Some Arthur C. Clark.He also hypothesized about bouyant creatures floating in the upper atmosphere of Jupiter.The chances for bacteria are probably better on Mars, however, even though I have always been fascinated by Venus.(it's probably the cloud cover that shrouds it.)Mysterious.And the fact that she's so close to us in size,but her day is longer than her year, and her rotation is retrograde.I thought maybe Venus was where the story of the garden of eden came from, a failed paradise where something went horribly wrong.It rains sulfuric acid there, and is hotter than an oven.Atmospheric pressure is 90 times ours, so it's like a big pressure cooker.If any bacteria are living there, they are some mean motherfuckers that I hope never find their way to earth, because we will be wiped out!Anyway...as for intelligence, that's relative...some life form may look upon us and not even recognize sentience, they're so much further along the evolutionary path.Didn't mean to ramble atcha.


NomadicSky said:


> I don't really know.
> 
> I practice Wicca I feel some connection to the ole times before the Christians murdered those who wouldn't accept their pagan beliefs.
> 
> ...


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## diemdepyro (Nov 28, 2008)

Was that Clarkes book about silicon based life Stoney?


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 28, 2008)

Stoney McFried said:


> That sounds beautiful, man!


Sniff sniff, that was so beautiful..... Just got to me right HERE. Ahhhhh...


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 28, 2008)

Well, it was touched upon in his 2001 space odyssey series.


diemdepyro said:


> Was that Clarkes book about silicon based life Stoney?


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## FluffyToke (Nov 29, 2008)

I hate jesus.


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## trichopath (Nov 29, 2008)

FluffyToke said:


> I hate jesus.


lmao .thats a bit harsh, you never even met the man


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## FluffyToke (Nov 29, 2008)

ehhh, (under the supposition that he existed) he was ignorant enough to believe that "mortals" wouldn't corrupt his beliefs while he was dead, which is fallacy, and fallacy means he is not perfect, which means he couldn't be part of the holy trinity because isn't the trinity a flawless, viceless god? I could swear that's what the bible says.

of course, that's if he existed.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 29, 2008)

Actually, Fluffy, in the regular Bible Yeshua (Jesus) said that He wasn't God, wasn't equal to God, and the whole trinity thing is manipulation of the translations went they went from Greek (and Hebrew) to Latin, and all subsequent Bibles have been translated from the very inferior Latin version, rather than going back to the Greek texts. 

But I didn't get the corrupted, death, mortal thing, and I definately know the shit inside and out......


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## FluffyToke (Nov 29, 2008)

corruption refers to exactly that; we translated and thus "corrupted" the original texts (which are still inferior in my opinion)

mortal refers to humans, as I always thought jesus was (somewhat) immortal[?]

death refers to when jesus was slain. 

PS: the past post from me was done while extremely baked, and I hold no responsibility to it.


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 29, 2008)

Heh heh. 


Ya better watch that bakin shit. Mess widcha head.


----------



## FluffyToke (Nov 29, 2008)

lol it's da black majik


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## CrackerJax (Nov 30, 2008)

Fluffy, Jesus wasn't black 



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 30, 2008)

Actually, there is a big debate about that.......


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## longbaugh (Nov 30, 2008)

I like the Jesus from "Jesus Christ Superstar". I think that the problem with modern conceptions of Jesus is that he's gone through a couple thousand years of fallible church doctrine. Same with all the other religions. Humans come up with a "good idea" to "help people". Then, over the years, more and more human stuff creeps in and it gets worse and worse.

To get at the heart of things, I believe in myself. I believe that through careful study and meditation, I can help myself have a good life....and God, if he or she exists, can help me out with that if he or she wants to. I could use all the help I can get.

I also believe that I'm usually way too serious. I'm reading some of my old posts with a new frame of mind eyesmoke and am realizing that I was wound up too tight. Sorry about that. I'll try to be more mellow.


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 30, 2008)

Smoke a fatty, that will help you mellow out. I don't think you are wound to tight (not rite now) and I also think you have the BEST spirituality yet. It is THAT kind of path that REALLY connects you to the reality of God, not taking someone else's word for it......

KUDOS!


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## CrackerJax (Nov 30, 2008)

All hail the Flying Spaghetti Monster......feel his noodly appendage.


out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 30, 2008)

I sense sarcasm, there, Jax, but I must warn you, the FSM is to be met with all honor and supplications....


And little hats made of tin foil....


----------



## CrackerJax (Nov 30, 2008)

SARCASM???? ME???!? 

I'm a BLOODY PIRATE!!!!




out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Nov 30, 2008)

Avast dare, matey! Har har.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 30, 2008)

har har indeed. good morning you religious/anti-religious zealots.


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## CrackerJax (Nov 30, 2008)

I prefer non-religious over anti-religious personally... I can tolerate the penguins...


AVAST YE!! 

Pirate factoid!!!

Pirates did indeed wear an eye patch, but not because they were blind. It was to keep one eye accustomed to darkness for fighting below decks....pretty smart. 


Noodly Appendages PORT SIDE!!!!



out.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 30, 2008)

I never really liked pirates (except for vikings) but I can tell you that they did wear eyepatches more commonly for missing eyes. the ones that wore them for nightvision were often the mates that ran inbetween decks constantly. like the boson perhaps? or maybe the quartermaster.


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## Stoney McFried (Nov 30, 2008)

I like pirates.Except for the scurvy and sodomy.


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## MisterMicro (Nov 30, 2008)

FZZW3334 said:


> I am a naturalist, therefore I am an atheist and believe in nothing supernatural. When your brain function ceases and you are dead that is it; an eternal dreamless sleep.


same exact wave lenth. Religion actually is almost sarcastic humor to me, the blind faith, complete lack of proof, the parrelles between all these religions, 12 disciples, born on the 25th of december (same exact day the 'son' reverts its schedule to longer days) dieing on the cross and being ressurected after 3 days, the egyptions had a god with all these exact parelles. Forget the name but it was the god of the 'son'. i feel like just tellng people to open there eyes you know? lol. ahh god i dont know i think its all funny. if it wasnt i might just go insane.


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## FluffyToke (Nov 30, 2008)

I like this guy's outlook. +rep


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 1, 2008)

FluffyToke said:


> I never really liked pirates (except for vikings) but I can tell you that they did wear eyepatches more commonly for missing eyes. the ones that wore them for nightvision were often the mates that ran inbetween decks constantly. like the boson perhaps? or maybe the quartermaster.


 
Vikings aren't pirates, silly. And I figured they got a hook for a hand THEN put their eye out. (JOKE) 

Btw, I am a decendant (one of many) of Edward Teech, better known as Blackbeard. I love pirate shit.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 1, 2008)

Stoney McFried said:


> I like pirates.Except for the scurvy and sodomy.


Aw, cum'on, Stoney, you don't REALLY mind a bit of sodomy once in awhile, do you?

Now, that scurvy would be a bitch!


----------



## Stoney McFried (Dec 1, 2008)

I mind, I mind.Nobody sodomizes pirate Stoney.


puffdamagikdragon said:


> Aw, cum'on, Stoney, you don't REALLY mind a bit of sodomy once in awhile, do you?
> 
> Now, that scurvy would be a bitch!


----------



## FluffyToke (Dec 1, 2008)

lol except jesus.


----------



## brianc01088 (Dec 1, 2008)

pillarize said:


> God is in everyone of us...wether you have the son is another thing.
> 
> He promised that he would manifest himselve in a way...that will be rejected by those that have not the truth.
> 
> In this he was very sorrowful...knowing the end of all unbelieve.


Gotta love this... preaching on a forum that supports illegal behaviors. Ha Ha! I'm Agnostic.


P.S. That kinda makes you a sinner, right?


----------



## Stoney McFried (Dec 1, 2008)

Jesus is as smooth as a Ken doll down there.


FluffyToke said:


> lol except jesus.


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## FluffyToke (Dec 2, 2008)

jeez. stoney has travelled through space and time apparently. fucking cosmic space priate.


----------



## Budda_Luva (Dec 2, 2008)

im catholic and im learning more of the buddhism ways


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## Stoney McFried (Dec 2, 2008)

Hell yeah, I play d and d.


FluffyToke said:


> jeez. stoney has travelled through space and time apparently. fucking cosmic space priate.


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## FluffyToke (Dec 2, 2008)

sweet!
I used to play D&D, but I couldn't find a good GM.


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## Stoney McFried (Dec 2, 2008)

Play neverwinter nights one or two on a server.


FluffyToke said:


> sweet!
> I used to play D&D, but I couldn't find a good GM.


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## FluffyToke (Dec 3, 2008)

no money to buy that game. and no space on my comp. 
I hit up rpol.net sometimes


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## Stoney McFried (Dec 3, 2008)

Wow.I have like....300 G free out of 500.4g ram.The old man built this, the only thing we used is the hard drive from our pre built computer cuz it had Windows on it.It cost us about 500 to tweak this system.I have a pretty good graphics card, it's an 8800GTX.WHat are you running?If you're ok with text based games...go here...it's free for 30 days.Stay in character, though.http://www.play.net/gs4/


FluffyToke said:


> no money to buy that game. and no space on my comp.
> I hit up rpol.net sometimes


----------



## shimmer (Dec 3, 2008)

I like the bit in Life of Pi "take two steps towards God, and He'll come running". It sounds pretty promising for those of us who would like a divine connection. It unfortunately doesn't elaborate on which shoes one should wear, the size of step to be taken, or if indeed you get all the other the variables right, that He won't just about turn because He had to get close before He noticed the dog shit residue on our soles{pun intended}.
My general beliefs are mutable. If a belief doesn't feel right, get it to fuck. Unfortunately, egoistic bureaucracy doesn't allow them to be shed at as useful a rate as would be preferable, but hey ho what you gonna do? I suppose the answer would come from the Zen direction. Train yourself to pay attention to everything all the time.
I can see absolutely no problem with paying attention, except that it's so hard to do without relentless commitment. A perception of the world with ever more detail, beauty and subtlety as a result of sincere effort{non-effort?}, would seem to me to be just the ticket to shake off the stink of the world. It is utterly non-partisan, so even fundies could do it if you changed the label...ahem.
Then there's all the weird and wonderful scientific stuff: quantum mechanics, m-theory, and seminal new thinking in the physics of penis enlargement. It all ties up pretty nicely.
Friends{platonic and non-platonic}, pot,alcohol,humour,food,kids,music,reading and reflection are all tools for me amongst many others i use to help me take those two steps to God, but they ain't workin'. I could do with some advice on how to grow my balls, and get jiggy with the psychedelics again. I do have faith though, i don't see how ultimately any of us can truly stray from the path. We are it, all of us, for ever...
ahem..amen.

Good thread Puff, nice little nucleus.


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## diemdepyro (Dec 4, 2008)

I had to wear an eye patch. Sodomy would have been difficult as the patch ruined my depth perception.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 6, 2008)

shimmer said:


> Good thread Puff, nice little nucleus.


Why, thank you!


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 6, 2008)

diemdepyro said:


> I had to wear an eye patch. Sodomy would have been difficult as the patch ruined my depth perception.


Heh heh heh. I'll smoke to that!


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 6, 2008)

I have learned thus so far.

Stoney likes pirates but not sodomy, is a Sagittarian, and is really a cosmic spce pirate posing as a pothead.

Fluffly is a Cancer and has very healthy religious sexual fantasies.

Jax and the pirate companions are hunting down the GSM. Also one funny muthafucka.

This HAS been such a good thread!!!


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## CrackerJax (Dec 6, 2008)

I shall add this thread to my humor sweater. I'll wear it on my sleeve. 


out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 7, 2008)

Right beside your heart.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 7, 2008)

Pit,Pit,Pit,Pituitary .... whew .. much better.


out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 7, 2008)

Heh heh heh...

You crack me up. If I'm broken, it'll be all YOUR fault!!!


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## CrackerJax (Dec 7, 2008)

I'll glue you back together with resin and hash.....and a touch of kief for aromatic effect....



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 8, 2008)

I am so glad you were able to JOIN me, Jax.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 8, 2008)

People let me tell you bout my best friend ba be da dum .. ba ba ba da dum.....

Remember that one? 



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 8, 2008)

I do.

Ur so bad.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 8, 2008)

Can I be Eddie??  You can be Mrs. Livingstone, she was SMOKIN' !!



out.


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## Stoney McFried (Dec 8, 2008)

I've tried so hard to forget it.Hate that song.


CrackerJax said:


> People let me tell you bout my best friend ba be da dum .. ba ba ba da dum.....
> 
> Remember that one?
> 
> ...


----------



## CrackerJax (Dec 8, 2008)

Haha... Just think of the theme song to "People's Court" That always knocks it out for me...  ba da Dum .. ba da Dum Dum .. ba da



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 8, 2008)

Quit it! Like Chinese water torture over the net!


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## CrackerJax (Dec 8, 2008)

Hahahah!! It can't be like Chinese Water Torture, the U.N. passed a resolution against that. It doesn't exist.... 

Da Da Dum....



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 8, 2008)

This goes against the Geneva Convention, I tell you!


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## CrackerJax (Dec 8, 2008)

Badges! We don't need no stinking badges!! da da dum...


out.


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## Mr. Maryjane (Dec 11, 2008)

I was raised as a protestant, but If you're a good person, I think you shouldn't go to hell, even if you've rejected christianity. And if god sends good people to hell, he can fuck off.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 11, 2008)

Can I get an amen?


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## CrackerJax (Dec 11, 2008)

Giant acne name?


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## Higher Education (Dec 12, 2008)

I am a christian. I believe jesus died on the cross and I believe God created the Universe. I base my believes of off science and logic, not something a pastor or my parents told me. I love everyone on this forum regardless of what you believe. Ask yourselves though, if you were on a plane that was about to crash and catch on fire and the flight attendant showed you the one and only emergency exit, then would you call her intolerant? Would you say she is just a bigot? Hopefully you would not because you realize that she just doesn't want you to burn to death in the plane. She just wants to show you the way out.


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## Higher Education (Dec 12, 2008)

I don't think weed is bad either as long as you don't make it an idol, which I do sometimes. I am no hypocrite.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 12, 2008)

Higher Education said:


> I am a christian. I believe jesus died on the cross and I believe God created the Universe. I base my believes of off science and logic, not something a pastor or my parents told me. I love everyone on this forum regardless of what you believe. Ask yourselves though, if you were on a plane that was about to crash and catch on fire and the flight attendant showed you the one and only emergency exit, then would you call her intolerant? Would you say she is just a bigot? Hopefully you would not because you realize that she just doesn't want you to burn to death in the plane. She just wants to show you the way out.


Jesus based on Science and logic, okay, that's a new one. Very funny indeed.

But what if the attendant who is BLINDED by the SMOKE (misinformation) and instead of pointing you to the exit (which is NOT APPARENT), she instead insists that you go into the smoke and once you are blinded, you will find the exit. Of course every other scrap of evidence says she is wrong, but she INSISTS it's true. Do you listen to her? Or do you simply walk in the other direction with calmness and figure your own way out since the attendant cannot produce the exit door.



out. 

Since we are being logical.....


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 12, 2008)

Number one, science and logic seem to think there is no 'God', and number two there is not one shred of archeological evidence for ANYTHING in the Bible. 


Despite the fact you don't believe cuz some pastor told you to, Higher, you still are taking the Bible the way it is told to interperete it. Where does Jesus EVER say that you have to do those things? I am studying the words of Yeshua in as close to the original language as possible, I have studied what He said, and it ain't at all what you think. Yeshua tried to free us from that kind of limited thinking, and instead they corrupted and twisted His message to serve the very powers He gave His life tryin to free us from. 

I bet there is shit in that Bible that you didn't even know of. For example, did you know it is a greater offense to eat shellfish than it is to endulge in fudgepacking, according to the Old Testament? And that it is ok to own slaves, and sell your daughters into slavery? And that if you cut your bangs (for guys) you are damned and cursed?


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## CrackerJax (Dec 12, 2008)

*WANTED

Puffdamajikdragon is wanted on egg abandonment resulting in a kidnapping and neglect resulting in a juvenile dragon death.

Do not try and copy/paste her or click on her links....she is considered a fugitive by:

D.I.A.P.E.R.
Dragon Infants Are Precious Endangered Reptiles

Dragon killer!! 



out. 




*​


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 12, 2008)

Iznot my fault the egg died..... I was framed, FRAMED I tell you!!!!!


(Damn, they're onto me!)


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## Higher Education (Dec 12, 2008)

CrackerJax said:


> Jesus based on Science and logic, okay, that's a new one. Very funny indeed.
> 
> But what if the attendant who is BLINDED by the SMOKE (misinformation) and instead of pointing you to the exit (which is NOT APPARENT), she instead insists that you go into the smoke and once you are blinded, you will find the exit. Of course every other scrap of evidence says she is wrong, but she INSISTS it's true. Do you listen to her? Or do you simply walk in the other direction with calmness and figure your own way out since the attendant cannot produce the exit door.
> 
> ...


You are ignoring the paremeters of this analogy. A flight attendant could not be misinformed about the location of an exit. She has been trained at a date prior to the accident. What she knows is the objective truth, not subjective. Same as a truely intellectual person who examines every possibilty and declares one more logical than the other. That being Christianity. I find it funny that the secular society believes Christians are the ignorant ones, yet they spend more time arguing with them than people from any other world view system.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 12, 2008)

Tell it to the D.I.A.P.E.R. patrol, they are flying in your IP direction. 

   yes they are on to you..... heee



out.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 12, 2008)

Higher Education said:


> You are ignoring the paremeters of this analogy. A flight attendant could not be misinformed about the location of an exit. She has been trained at a date prior to the accident. What she knows is the objective truth, not subjective. Same as a truely intellectual person who examines every possibilty and declares one more logical than the other. That being Christianity. I find it funny that the secular society believes Christians are the ignorant ones, yet they spend more time arguing with them than people from any other world view system.


How embarrassing for you....good luck with your logical life. An unexamined logical life based on hear say in anonymous authors. 

I think those parameters are spot on.


out.


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## Higher Education (Dec 12, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Number one, science and logic seem to think there is no 'God', and number two there is not one shred of archeological evidence for ANYTHING in the Bible.
> 
> 
> Despite the fact you don't believe cuz some pastor told you to, Higher, you still are taking the Bible the way it is told to interperete it. Where does Jesus EVER say that you have to do those things? I am studying the words of Yeshua in as close to the original language as possible, I have studied what He said, and it ain't at all what you think. Yeshua tried to free us from that kind of limited thinking, and instead they corrupted and twisted His message to serve the very powers He gave His life tryin to free us from.
> ...


 First of all, God is completely logical and scientific. I am double majoring in applied discrete mathematics and physics. The probability of autonomous life being self created is virtually zero. I am familiar with the principles of quantum mechanics, string theory, and M-theory. They all seek to show what occured before the big bang and they all have failed miserably. They are great theories none the less. You just cannot expect to explain away God.

Some of the greatest minds of all time had a strong believe in God. Neils Bohr, Albert Einstein, Sir Isaac Newton said the only thing he studied more than math and physics was the Bible. Francis S. Collins, the man who lead the team that cracked the human genome back in 1999, has a book entitled "The Language of God". Do not try to tell me he is outdated or unscientific.

Secondly, you right. I do not know everything about the Bible. I doubt that you do either. You throw around all of these assertions about what the Bible says, yet I see no scriptural references. Where is the credibilty?


----------



## Higher Education (Dec 12, 2008)

CrackerJax said:


> How embarrassing for you....good luck with your logical life. An unexamined logical life based on hear say in anonymous authors.
> 
> I think those parameters are spot on.
> 
> ...


I am actually basing my evidence of statistical probability and the opinions of several non-biased historians. Do not try to explain away God to help you sleep better at night when you do something that makes you feel guilty.


----------



## CrackerJax (Dec 12, 2008)

The fact that you equate biblical references with credibility says it all. Hoodwinked at a young age and not quite brave enough to figure it out on your own. Maybe even accepting that it cannot be figured out. It takes mental stamina to break free from brain washing. Here's hoping you develop some. 




out.


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## Mr. Maryjane (Dec 12, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> number two there is not one shred of archeological evidence for ANYTHING in the Bible.


there's a rock layer in the grand canyon that is the same level as another rock layer in a canyon...somewhere far away. it's been a long time since my pastor told me this. this is proof of the great flood



Higher Education said:


> First of all, God is completely logical and scientific.


 
I'm an extremely logical and rational person, and think about most things from an objective P.O.V, and I can say with certainty, god is not logical(well, not any logic a human could comprehend) and god's definately far from scientific


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 12, 2008)

Mr MaryJane- I heard about that layer, too. From sunday school. But when I tried to validate it, I could find none. Kinda a sunday school urban legend kind of thing. 

Higher- Exodus 21:7 (daughter in slavery)
Leviticus 11:10 (shellfish greater abomination than homosexuality)
Now, while you claim to not be the pastor following type, do you believe the Bible to be the 'Word of God'? Btw, textural critism is a hobby of mine, as is ancient texts. I know the 'Bible' better than most, obviously better than you. 
You should study the history of the book, what it left out, the battles over what was allowed to be deemed 'truth', and the horrible case of wool that has been pulled over your eyes. The Bible is nothing to do with the true message of Yeshua, and everything about control and religion corrupting His original message.

And I have no interest in 'explaining away God' (obviously a pet phrase of yours, you like to 'throw out' at every chance.) I totally know of the existance of what you call God. But I also know that is not the REAL 'God', the Living ONE, the 'Father' Yeshua spoke of.


----------



## Higher Education (Dec 12, 2008)

There were 336 prophecies fullfilled in the New Testament about Jesus. Some of them regarded his enemies. Why would Jesus' enemies want to fullfill prophecy to make him look like the Mesiah. Psalm 90 goes into a detailed description about the betrayal of Jesus. David wrote the Book of Psalms 900 years before the actual betrayal ever happen. David predicted that a close friend of Jesus would betray him for thirty pieces of silver. The interesting thing is that silver was not even the currency at the time David wrote this. The Book of Psalms and the Gospels have varified as authentic by several highly regarded historians of the biblical time period. I will be happy take the time to look them up and listen them if you doubt me.

I think it takes more stamina to be have a minority opinion. You doubt my logic so much, yet you have failed to offer a replacement. Please do not give me that bullshit of a theory evolution either. Actually you can if you want because I will it apart.


----------



## SmokeyMcSmokester (Dec 12, 2008)

good bedtime stories...


----------



## Higher Education (Dec 12, 2008)

CrackerJax said:


> The fact that you equate biblical references with credibility says it all. Hoodwinked at a young age and not quite brave enough to figure it out on your own. Maybe even accepting that it cannot be figured out. It takes mental stamina to break free from brain washing. Here's hoping you develop some.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


There are 336 prophecies fullfilled in the New Testament about Jesus. Some of them regarding his enemies. Why would Jesus' enemies want to fullfill prophecy to make him look like the Mesiah. Psalm 90 goes into a detailed description about the betrayal of Jesus. David wrote the Book of Psalms 900 years before the actual betrayal ever happen. David predicted that a close friend of Jesus would betray him for thirty pieces of silver. The interesting thing is that silver was not even the currency at the time David wrote this. The authors of the Book of Psalms and the Gospels have been varified by several highly regarded historians of the biblical time period. I will be happy take the time to look them up and list them if you doubt me.

I think it takes more stamina to be have a minority opinion. You doubt my logic so much, yet you have failed to offer a replacement. Please do not give me that bullshit of a theory evolution either. Actually you can if you want because I will rip it apart.


----------



## Higher Education (Dec 12, 2008)

Mr. Maryjane said:


> there's a rock layer in the grand canyon that is the same level as another rock layer in a canyon...somewhere far away. it's been a long time since my pastor told me this. this is proof of the great flood
> 
> 
> 
> ...


What do you have thats more logical? Do you believe we spontaneous came into existence from microbial soup? Hum, did God create man or did he come from soup? What is more logical? As I previously stated, Francis S. Collins believes in God and he cracker the human genome. Look up his book "The Language of God".


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 12, 2008)

Look dude, if you want civilitiy I would suggest you give it. You ain't 'rippin' anything apart, unless you are the one tha'll be hanging in parts later wondering what the fuck happened. We are all havin a nice discussion here, about God and our ideas of what she/he/it is, and you can keep your fucking hate and intolerance to your fucking self. Got me? Don't fuck with dragons, I would hate to have to burn you to a crisp before your ass has had a chance to learn summin.

Now, I don't technically ascribe to evolution, if it was a natural process then chimps and bunnies would be cave painting by now. But I also don't think the Bible is a history book either. Fact is YOU DON"T KNOW, NEITHER DO I. NEITHER ONE CAN PROVE SHIT. So that lets control and the other elements of scientific explanation out the window, eh? Fact is, you can't 'experiment' on spiritual things, you cannot create the exact same environment every time, you cannot control all the variables and you have no control set, as well. So you are really going into murky territory, while supposing to put yourseflf above all of us you are only making yourself really laughable, and NOT helping your 'side' one bit. If I were on your side, I would be BEGGIN you to shut up, and stop makin us all look as stupid as you are makin us look, but since I ain't on your side, go ahead.


----------



## Higher Education (Dec 12, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Mr MaryJane- I heard about that layer, too. From sunday school. But when I tried to validate it, I could find none. Kinda a sunday school urban legend kind of thing.
> 
> Higher- Exodus 21:7 (daughter in slavery)
> Leviticus 11:10 (shellfish greater abomination than homosexuality)
> ...


The specific case on of slavery in the bible is more complicated than it initially appears. The term slave is not synonymous with the term servant today, but is was in biblical times. The time period also had different socio-economic considerations than we do today. There is several models in the Old Testament that appear to be slavery to an uneducated twenty first century reader. Your the one who needs to look deeper into things. You take the words a man wrote over 3,400 years ago and expect them to have the same cultural implications. Silly stoner. I won't even look at the other verse because you have lost your credibility. That fossil layer with a tree through it has been varified by the way.


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 12, 2008)

You are a fucking joke, comin on here talkin about 'I can prove with God with crack pot science' and think yo uare gonna talk down to us and call ME a silly stoner? Dude, you have smoked yourself stupid. You don't know shit and I ain't havin a battle of wits with an unarmed person.

You speak of socio-economics, you are talkin about a book with *NO* archoelogocial evidence to back ANY of it up in the first place, where is the proof of the socio-economic shit you are talkin about? I know there are very detailed records from both Rome and Egypt, and NONE of them even mention this so-called nation of Isreal, there is no record of Christ's execution by the Romans (tho they do have execution records of the supposed time of Christ, right detailed ones.) If they can't even prove the Bible to be fact, then where are your facts about the social implications as well as economic ones of the time? And while you are at it, show me proof of this layer thing. I tried to tind it, and it wasn't there. THere is NO proof of ANYTHING in the Bible, I have proof to links of that as well. You didn't even know the shit I was talkin about was in the Bible, now you gonna claim I don't know enough about it when you didn't even know it was there in the first place.

YOU lack credibility, and you are losing what little you got with every post. Keep it up, here is some more rope, moron. God, what denial.


----------



## Higher Education (Dec 12, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Fact is YOU DON"T KNOW, NEITHER DO I. NEITHER ONE CAN PROVE SHIT. So that lets control and the other elements of scientific explanation out the window, eh? Fact is, you can't 'experiment' on spiritual things, you cannot create the exact same environment every time, you cannot control all the variables and you have no control set, as well.


I don't want to argue anymore. What you said above is completely true. I am just tired of being looked at as someone who is unintelligent because I believe in a higher power. I got criticized unconstructively first. Someone said "if you want to be logical" after they threw down one of my analogies. I don't know who it is though because I am too lazy to look. I am happy with you admitting that WE do not know. I respect the humility. I just go by what seems to be credible. If I felt you underminded the sources from where I have learned, then I would believe whatever you say. I still respect it even if I don't believe it. I was just mad because I was disrespected first. Our arguing does not help the other in anyway though. If I had a joint I would smoke it with you.


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 12, 2008)

It is fine to believe in a higher power, I believe in one. My God isn't your God, I think it is better to believe in something than nothin, but none of it can be 'proven', and proving is what science is all about. And I wasn't the one who disrespected you, (until I felt you were getting a little hostile, and I figgered getting a little of it back would settle you out, which it has. That is what us dragons are for) so make sure you DO know who to aim it at, and who to take it up with. This is a discussion, don't just spray bullets into the crowd.

My God is the one Yeshua called "Father'. Notice that Paul was a pharasee, and actually changed faiths? If he was worshiping the jewish creator god, and he had this experience that changed him so completely, then why talk about this Living ONE, as tho it was a different being than the jewish creator god? Cuz it was. Read what Yeshua said that you WEREN"T supposed to know about, dude, and all your questions will be answered, if you can handle the truth.

But don't mix 'science' and 'religion', unless you wanna get laughed at. You can believe both, but don't expect them to support each other.

And hay, puff puff pass!


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## Higher Education (Dec 12, 2008)

I am all about the truth. Thats all I want to know no matter how bad it upsets me. Your wording in about Yeshua was confusing. I am ignorant about your believe anyways. I cannot condemn something I know nothing of. I was just defending what I believe. What should I read to learn more about your "Yeshua"? I just know Yeshua was a common name in the second temple period and a lot of scholars believe it may have been Jesus' hebrew name. There are some really important people in the science community right now doing the faith and science thing. They are more respected than me though so people don't laugh, haha. Your humility, rather than your hostility, is what calmed me down. To me, when a person tells me that they can't prove or don't know something then they are admitting that they are still learning. Someone is still learning and is openminded in my book is logical.

Random, but I wish I could find weed for less than sitxy an eigth right now. I wanna get high and watch some cool tv show. Whats your favorite tv show dragon?

I just realize you started this thread. More respect to you for your curiosity. How old are you? Your going to live a long time being that your a vegan.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 12, 2008)

Thank you for your indulgence. Yeshua is the original peshitte aramaic name for Jesus, yes. I DO believe Yeshua existed, but the 'stories' about him came after Constantine took over the religion of Christianity. He was a pagan thug, you see, who remained a pagan, planning a deathbed conversion to save his damned soul. I have copies of his letters stating this. I think Constantine 'paganized' EVERYTHING about Christ, the only 'true' text we have of Yeshua is the Gospel of Thomas, and that is apochryphal (meaning the church deemed it heresy and banned it, destroying everyone that had anything to do with it). The story of Yeshua, from the virgin birth to the crucifiction is a retelling of the Osiris / Dionysis myths. (Alarmingly so). Also explains why all the sacraments were already being practiced long before the advent of Christianity by the Elusian priests. They were all stolen and bastardized by Constantinople in an attempt to make Christianity more palatable for the pagan masses. This is also why Shaul (Paul in the New Testament, also his Hebrew name) never speaks of Yeshua's virgin birth, miracles, or even of the crucifiction. That is cuz he didn't know the 'stories', they were created hundreds of years later by the powers that be for control.

But the Gospel of Thomas, which I DO think is the actual words of Yeshua, said 'The kingdom of the Father is inside you, and all around you.' Study THEM and you will know the truth.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 12, 2008)

I am 39, just turned it. (Sagittarian to my CORE!) I don't really like TV, I watch Two and a Half Men sometimes, or reruns of MASH. I used to watch the news, but I prefer my computer for that, and NPR. I'm kinda weird. My main use for a tv is to play video games and movies.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 12, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Thank you for your indulgence. Yeshua is the original peshitte aramaic name for Jesus, yes. I DO believe Yeshua existed, but the 'stories' about him came after Constantine took over the religion of Christianity. He was a pagan thug, you see, who remained a pagan, planning a deathbed conversion to save his damned soul. I have copies of his letters stating this. I think Constantine 'paganized' EVERYTHING about Christ, the only 'true' text we have of Yeshua is the Gospel of Thomas, and that is apochryphal (meaning the church deemed it heresy and banned it, destroying everyone that had anything to do with it). The story of Yeshua, from the virgin birth to the crucifiction is a retelling of the Osiris / Dionysis myths. (Alarmingly so). Also explains why all the sacraments were already being practiced long before the advent of Christianity by the Elusian priests. They were all stolen and bastardized by Constantinople in an attempt to make Christianity more palatable for the pagan masses. This is also why Shaul (Paul in the New Testament, also his Hebrew name) never speaks of Yeshua's virgin birth, miracles, or even of the crucifiction. That is cuz he didn't know the 'stories', they were created hundreds of years later by the powers that be for control.
> 
> But the Gospel of Thomas, which I DO think is the actual words of Yeshua, said 'The kingdom of the Father is inside you, and all around you.' Study THEM and you will know the truth.




I'm sorry, I didn't catch that last name, Thomas who? 



out.


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## Stoney McFried (Dec 12, 2008)

Every time I wanted to respond I saw that cracker jax or puff was already on the ball.So instead of arguing about it, I say.......ALL HAIL THE GREAT SPAGHETTI MONSTER!!!


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## CrackerJax (Dec 12, 2008)

Stoney McFried said:


> Every time I wanted to respond I saw that cracker jax or puff was already on the ball.So instead of arguing about it, I say.......ALL HAIL THE GREAT SPAGHETTI MONSTER!!!




He gives noodly appendages all around!! Finally a religion based on Science 




out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 12, 2008)

Don't forget the tin foil! Most sacred of foils.....

Thomas the Twin, interestingly enuff. Supposedly the twin to Yeshua. Some have said he was also the disciple known as 'Doubting Thomas.'

Here is a link to the text (and all the others the church didn't want you to see)
http://www.gnosis.org/naghamm/gthlamb.html


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## CrackerJax (Dec 12, 2008)

Puffy dear, one being less false than the other doesn't get it one iota closer to being true. 
Some have said .. supposedly .. 



I am donning my tin foil!!  Noodle protect me!



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 12, 2008)

The CHURCH may consider one false or falsier than the other, if that is a word, but I don't. I didn't call any of it false. But texts of any kind are only supposed to be guideposts, that is all. Not to be taken as the truth all by themselves, but hopefully they will give you the food for thought that will guide you to discover the truth for yourself, cuz it is all perspective anyway.

OH NO. I am outta tin foil! PANIC. PANIC. PANIC.


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## Stoney McFried (Dec 12, 2008)

Yes, I can prove the existance of the spaghetti monster.Portions of him are in my freezer.He's tasty.


CrackerJax said:


> He gives noodly appendages all around!! Finally a religion based on Science
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Damn meth heads stole my tin foil!Perhaps...mylar?


puffdamagikdragon said:


> Don't forget the tin foil! Most sacred of foils.....
> 
> Thomas the Twin, interestingly enuff. Supposedly the twin to Yeshua. Some have said he was also the disciple known as 'Doubting Thomas.'
> 
> ...


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 13, 2008)

They were seeking his Spaghetti greatness too, that's all.

Im not sure if Mylar will work. We must pray about it.



OOOOOOOOOOooooommmmm.


OOOOOOOOOooooooommmm.


Oooomm...... Mmm.... Zzzzzz.....


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## CrackerJax (Dec 13, 2008)

The Flying Spaghetti Monster gave us his only son Lasagna .. and we ate him.







out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 13, 2008)

Zzzzz. Znorp. Wha were we talkin about? Mmm, I smell lasgana.



But that is what makes him happy! The sacrifice, brother, the sacrifice...


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## CrackerJax (Dec 13, 2008)

So, I'll throw a monkey wrench into the entire kabash and ask is Scientology a religion?


Hey, and you know that Lasagna had extra cheese .. always. The dude had extra cheese .. always. The dude had extra cheese ..always. Yah, that's enuf cheese.



out.  (<---- bloody pirate!)


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## Dfunk (Dec 14, 2008)

Scientology is the way of life according to Tom Cruise!


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## CrackerJax (Dec 14, 2008)

Well that's enough for me! I'll give them one thing. They have a sweet headquarters in Clearwater, Floriduh. They dress nice too....



out.


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## Dfunk (Dec 14, 2008)

Scientology isn't broke...that's for sure!


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## CrackerJax (Dec 14, 2008)

Yeah, luckily that's the only religion which is run like a business. Right? 



out.


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## Dfunk (Dec 14, 2008)

That's what I hear.


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## Stoney McFried (Dec 14, 2008)

Brainwashing is brainwashing.So, yes.


CrackerJax said:


> So, I'll throw a monkey wrench into the entire kabash and ask is Scientology a religion?
> 
> 
> Hey, and you know that Lasagna had extra cheese .. always. The dude had extra cheese .. always. The dude had extra cheese ..always. Yah, that's enuf cheese.
> ...


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 14, 2008)

Believe me, ALL churches are run as a business. 

I went into one of those mega churches where they were selling CDs and household items with crosses and every damn thing else. "Izint this where Jesus takes off his belt and runs you guys out?' I asked. They didn't think it was funny.

You didn't REALLY think it wasn't about money, did you?


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## Dislexicmidget2021 (Dec 14, 2008)

LOL i couldnt agree with u more puff,U actualy went into the church and asked them that?If so Il have to +rep u then, it is truly sad what the churches have come to, did you watch inside edition where the TV priest who claims to have healing power was looking like a fraud when the reporter interviewed him,It was pretty funny.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 14, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Believe me, ALL churches are run as a business.
> 
> I went into one of those mega churches where they were selling CDs and household items with crosses and every damn thing else. "Izint this where Jesus takes off his belt and runs you guys out?' I asked. They didn't think it was funny.
> 
> You didn't REALLY think it wasn't about money, did you?



Uhhhhhh , no I didn't  Onward thru the fog!!!



out. :blsmoke;


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## tdashdene (Dec 14, 2008)

http://www.haworthpress.com/store/ArticleAbstract.asp?sid=TW3UX5E1V9K99MWSG7610MENG92C1077&ID=35583
Check this out 
ive been reading through google scholar
on the properties of mj. in this article states
tetrahydracannibinol-thc- offers properties 
such as antineoplastic (tumors) neruroprotection (increases motor function's)


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## Farmer 1 (Dec 17, 2008)

I am a born again Christian who loves my Creator.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 17, 2008)

Farmer 1 said:


> I am a born again Christian who loves my Creator.


 
Your fealty has been noted in the giant database keeping track of everything. You will receive a fantastic reward when you die. 



out.


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## nicktheburk (Dec 17, 2008)

orangefrog said:


> I believe that to have a better afterlife (i wouldnt really call it an afterlife because its not your body and im pretty sure its nothing like this life) you have too be a compassionate loving forgiving person so giving fat counts ties into a lot of those
> 
> 
> I believe we were created by type IV extra terrestrials with their galactic sized "haydron collider" that caused this 3 dimensional physical and 1 dimensional time universe to be created and put life into it so that we could recycle ZPE energy (your afterlife is your ZPE energy) and to recycle zpe energy you have to be a compassionate loving forgiving person. the point of recycling zpe energy is so that eventually you could enter the chilled universe where you would be outside the 11 dimensions and live for infinite and by live i dont know what i mean but you can get there as a human, thats what type IV extra terrestrials are trying to do using the energy we recycle so that everything can live in peace.
> ...


 


Please write a book. I want to know more. This has inspired me in a way that seems so weird. I feel like i now know the meaning of life.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 17, 2008)

I can save you so much trouble. 

The meaning of life is death...... it's a slow burner and will take you a bit. Let the idea ferment and it will come to you.



out.


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## Gryphonn (Dec 18, 2008)

CrackerJax said:


> So, I'll throw a monkey wrench into the entire kabash and ask is Scientology a religion?
> 
> 
> Hey, and you know that Lasagna had extra cheese .. always. The dude had extra cheese .. always. The dude had extra cheese ..always. Yah, that's enuf cheese.
> out.  (<---- bloody pirate!)


Scientology is a religion much the same as Amway is a religion...they employ similar recruitment tactics as well.



I would suggest that L. Ron Hubbard probably died from laughing so hard and so often as he watched the sheep embrace Dianetics and Scientology.

I mean seriously, didn't these people read his books?


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## CrackerJax (Dec 18, 2008)

Hey don't knock Amway, at least you get some shampoo... 



out.


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## Gryphonn (Dec 18, 2008)

Higher Education said:


> I think it takes more stamina to be have a minority opinion. You doubt my logic so much, yet you have failed to offer a replacement. Please do not give me that bullshit of a theory evolution either. Actually you can if you want because I will rip it apart.


Yes, it does. I'll take your creationism and raise it with two evolutionisms. 

You can rip apart any thoery with an opposing argument. You just have to ensure your opposing theory carries the same or more weight of evidence with it. 'God' and the holy trinity, Mohammed, Krsna and all the other creation based ideas are theories as well. The problem with the theory of God and creation is that the story has been handed down and rewritten over thousands of years. It has been adapted and modified to ensure that willing believers maintain a sense of awe and fear of their chosen god. If the story didn't sit well with the masses, it was adapted and modified to suit. It's ironic that Christianity and Islam have common origins don't you think?

There has been no control over maintaining the accuracy of the original texts in any creation based theory. 

The theory of evolution is based on physical evidence gathered and collated since at least 1699, when Edward Tyson dissected a chimpanzee and was shocked at the similarities of the animals organs to humans'. This evolution/survival of the fittest/adaptation evidence, amassed over the years, has been carefully studied, cross-checked, analysed and otherwise pulled apart by thousands of scientists and creationists alike. The theory ties in a number of different scientific areas. For example, geography and plate tectonics, archaeology, biology and also molecular biology. Modern gene mapping has found evidence in DNA that corroborates the theory that Darwin, Wallace and others were working on in the early 1800's.

The theory of evolution is one of the most stringently tested theories ever postulated. 

If creationists want to blow this theory out of the water, they'd best pray to Jesus or Allah, or god or whoever their preferred deity is, to get off the sun lounge and get down here soon, because the evidence for 'evolution' is mounting faster than the evidence for 'intelligent design' or 'creationism'.


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## Gryphonn (Dec 18, 2008)

CrackerJax said:


> Hey don't knock Amway, at least you get some shampoo...
> 
> Out.


...and you only need a dime/ten cent piece/drachma/peso sized squirt in the palm of your hand!


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## CrackerJax (Dec 18, 2008)

One need only look to the credentials of "evolution" vs. "creation" scientists.... it says it all about "intelligent design" ( <----- talk about narcissism!)


Pray to the mighty Amway .... Ommmm .. cheaper by the dozen ... amen.

out.


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## zurces (Dec 18, 2008)

if there is a god why have we not seen any god like things only science like or should i say related things in what about let's say 1000 years so you guy are telling me that god created aliens................god created another race outside ours to hurt us.....?
all the monsters told about in the bible were just animals probably dinosaurs they could not kill or could not eat and simply were seeing for the first time and since threre were not many of whatever it had to be a monster type devil of evil 666 yeah right!
just how stories get twisted today where do you think it came from?
humans has always be able to adapt man saw an opening to make money.
also think about this! church is just a pep talk for the week you get yourself feeling good about the holy ghost and if you do believe it you start to believe in yourself and then it's I TOLD YOU GOD HAS A PLAN FOR YOU HES WITH YOU bullshit!
you've just paid for a pep talk! church is a rip off and a fake created by man. football basketball and everyrthing in between are all the same think about when you were confident and what happened and how you delt with when you were in that state of mind. 
what els?
humans want to feel needed me also so in saying that i say this god church devil cult i think 
show me and i'll believe if not wtf?
for me to believe in something man made up is dumb i could see if man made god up to be a light or something. 

so you guys don't someone made up a god you've never seen and a son who died for our sins 
sin? what is it? cause we kill, steal, lie, cheat, god hates a thief and a lie well now were all going to hell then BS
the only difference between animals and us is that they are controlled for the most part and can't talk we all got along at one point until man got ideas to better enjoy himself.............. i won't talk about slaves and shit but it was a stepping stone for man but not a pleasant one. 
so we teamed up and started to network and each man saying to the next GET LIKE ME slowly but surely.

i'll leave you with this
the difference between a murderer and serial killer is that a murderer has a conscience serial killers don't cause we made them that way 
uh yeah i was born to kill i'll just wait until i get beat by my parents or um gee i duno watch some tv while my parents brush me off and i meet others like who fucked up in the head 
IT'S RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOUR EYES


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## CrackerJax (Dec 18, 2008)

Dude, u dropped your Zanex ...... here. 



out.


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## Gryphonn (Dec 18, 2008)

CrackerJax said:


> Dude, u dropped your Zanex ...... here.
> 
> 
> 
> out.


Mmmm, yep. I was thinking to myself, "someone needs a hug".

Emo wall is sad.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 18, 2008)

I love the little blue mushrooms at the bottom tho ...




out.


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## Gryphonn (Dec 18, 2008)

http://www.cracked.com/article_16054_6-endangered-species-that-arent-endangered-enough.html

"While the "intelligent designer" theory has lost steam of late, the "sadistic bastard creator" theory is single-handedly supported by the existence of this creature"

"This is a species for whom murdering parents and enslaving the children is genetically programmed. It's a hive-minded hybrid of Hannibal Lecter and Hitler with a suicidally dedicated army of millions. We can therefore at least say this one isn't made by Satan, if only because he wouldn't risk creating his own replacement."


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## Stoney McFried (Dec 18, 2008)

That's my desktop background,lol.


CrackerJax said:


> I love the little blue mushrooms at the bottom tho ...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Gryphonn (Dec 18, 2008)

Stoney McFried said:


> That's my desktop background,lol.


That pic is from http://www.digitalblasphemy.com

I've watched this guys art develop since about 1999 when he offered his work for free. Well worth a visit.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 19, 2008)

Gryphonn, I LOVE that guy! Didn't know who he was tho, thanx!


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## diemdepyro (Dec 19, 2008)

The Mormons sent some sweet young cheer leader types to recruit me. I had all kinds of questions about polygamy.

I told the wife she would have someone to play cards with when I was out of town...
The leader of the girls was called "sister Shipley" she was HOT. One Freudian slip later I called her sister "Shapley" I am still drooling still wishing to be a Moron.....Damn Freud


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 19, 2008)

Yeah, I had some mormon gentlemen come up to the house one day this past summer, and it was hot and I was wearing a tank top with no bra (we live out in the boonies, ya know?) and came from the barn and one of the two young guys was like 'Hellooooo there,' and was making eyes and talkin shit to me the whole time. His buddy was just tryin so hard to NOT look at my chest it was comical. Next time a completely different set of witnesses or whatever came, and much older guys, too.

I guess they got more concerned with the _creation_ than the _creator_......


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## CrackerJax (Dec 19, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Yeah, I had some mormon gentlemen come up to the house one day this past summer, and it was hot and I was wearing a tank top with no bra (we live out in the boonies, ya know?) and came from the barn and one of the two young guys was like 'Hellooooo there,' and was making eyes and talkin shit to me the whole time. His buddy was just tryin so hard to NOT look at my chest it was comical. Next time a completely different set of witnesses or whatever came, and much older guys, too.
> 
> I guess they got more concerned with the _creation_ than the _creator_......



Puffy, certain things are "hard" wired ..  .. no matter what you belief system.

When i was attending College, I worked for an electrical company in the summer and they had me and a friend named Jerry in a nice condo doing work out of town for the summer in Cocoa beach (it was a sweet summer .. but I digress ) 

Anyways one friday we get back from working on a nursing center and two houses down are some very HOT looking ladies who WAVE to us.... I go in to get a shower and get ready for a night out (of course), and when I reemerge Jerry is all excited.... the HOT ladies have paid him a visit and wanted to know if he wanted to he and I to have a three day miracle!! Jerry was beside himself with anticipation.... he is just yelling at me to hurry up and eat as he was going to take a shower so we could go over there PRONTO!! 
I calmly fixed some Capt. Crunch (nutritious) and watched some telly and waited for him. He comes running down the stairs all spastic and huffed up with cologne. 
I just looked up from my bowl of cereal and said, "dude, they are Jehovah Witnesses and they want you to help them build a "Hall" this weekend. That's what a three day miracle means." He just STARES at me COLDLY, and says, "those lying bitches." 
Sure enough when we went out to our motorcycles to go down to the Purple Turtle beach bar, there was a racket going on in the back of that nearby house. Jerry just cursed..... "lying bitches".... perception is everything  

P.S. the noise went on all weekend .. Jerry was fuming by sunday... 



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 19, 2008)

How diabolical. I'm so proud....


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## Stoney McFried (Dec 19, 2008)

Yeah, I never understood how women could get into a religion that tells them they are less than and subservient to, men.Sure, you can have a dozen wives, women have no real value!A dozen husbands??? WHORE! Blasphemer!


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## diemdepyro (Dec 19, 2008)

Big issue with sister shapley was the men studied the bible while the women learned how to be good women' cooking cleaning.....

We did not go for it, we had a daughter and no way would she be some old perverts downstairs maid.

If I was single and no kids sis Shapley and I would still be doing the horizontal cha-cha. I think they send Pretty women to men's houses on purpose .
Ever heard of a couple ugly mormen women going door to door?


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 20, 2008)

Stoney McFried said:


> Yeah, I never understood how women could get into a religion that tells them they are less than and subservient to, men.Sure, you can have a dozen wives, women have no real value!A dozen husbands??? WHORE! Blasphemer!


I'm widcha Stoney. I figger they must WANT to be _inferior_. Sick.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 20, 2008)

Pretty much every religion (however nutty) is implicit in the indoctrination of the faithfuls' children. The data which points to 90% of children carry the same faith as their parents is no coincidence.

So how do these women "get into " it? They are "born" into it. Even sadder.....like baby Hitler...OMG!









out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 20, 2008)

I love that pic. Even Hitler was a baby, once.....


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## diemdepyro (Dec 20, 2008)

I do not believe religion is evil just organized religion. It's the people. There is way too much happening for all this to be random.
You know we are spinning on the Earth. Flying through space and headed to the centre of the Milky Way galaxy.

Men made women subservient then wrote a religion put men in charge of interpretation of the religion. Remember the slave owners had a religious imperative to keep the negro from himself.

The bible says "GOD is dead" no bible banging bastard ever remembers that line but he does remember "Woman is the weaker vessel". I like the be fruitful and multiply part.

I do not like the hellfire and brimstone part. You see it is just as a cafeteria,
they take and eat what they want and leave the rest for the next slob. Because the leaders of religion are above the rules. They are just as *Ramesses God king. *Not like Santa, Jesus, Buddha or the square pantsed fellow sponging Bob that you all seem so fond of.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 21, 2008)

Hay, no SpongeBob bashing goin on HERE! 

Just kidding.


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## raoulduke2.0 (Dec 21, 2008)

I was raised baptist but unlike the rest of my family and everyone else in this region of the country, I grew out of it. I resent any group of people that look down on me for asking questions. Christianity is perpetuated by the herd mentality and nothing else. So I guess you could say I am NOT SUPERSTITIOUS.


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## We Love 1 (Dec 21, 2008)

I'm an open minded Christian!

I believe I will be Your Good King!

Check out My signature!

I am Christ!


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## diemdepyro (Dec 21, 2008)

We Love 1 said:


> I'm an open minded Christian!
> 
> I believe I will be Your Good King!
> 
> ...


I am going to assume your druggist was short of lithium again.


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## hom36rown (Dec 22, 2008)

diemdepyro said:


> I am going to assume your druggist was short of lithium again.


seriously


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## CrackerJax (Dec 22, 2008)

Shhh Learn the Secrets! They are SECRETS!! Shhh... I'll teach you the SECRETS!!! Lawdy...  deep in the rabbit hole that one is.






out.


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## We Love 1 (Dec 22, 2008)

CrackerJax said:


> Shhh Learn the Secrets! They are SECRETS!! Shhh... I'll teach you the SECRETS!!! Lawdy...  deep in the rabbit hole that one is.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and *We *will come to him and make Our home with him.

He who doesnt not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine but the Fathers who sent Me.

These things I have spoken to you while being present with you. But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, *He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.*

Peace I leave with you, My peace I give to you; not as the world gives do I give to you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid

You have heard Me say to you, "I am going away and coming back to you." If you loved Me, you would rejoice because I said "I am going to the Father" for My Father is greater than I.

And now I have told you before it comes, that when it does come to pass, you may believe.

I will no longer talk much with you, for the ruler of this world is coming, and he has nothing in Me.

But the world may know that I love the Father, and as the Father gave Me commandment, so I do.

Arise, let us go from here!


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## CrackerJax (Dec 22, 2008)

You have two good eyes and yet you cannot see..... Here's hoping you can someday break free from the deception and truly awaken, and it's no secret either.






out.


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## ESStlyes (Dec 23, 2008)

Phi = union without beginning or end
Fibonacci sequence = in the image of 'God' Geometry of divine
I agree with most of what I have read in the books by Drunvalo Melchizedek about the Flower of Life. I also agree with most if not all of what I have read by Ananda Bosman and his research about somenetics.
http://www.akasha.de/~aton/Somagenics.html
Its a trip.


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 25, 2008)

Its ok, they preach, get it outta their system, and go on to save someone else.




It's like your tryin swim in a creek and some idiot who thinks you are drowing drags you out and half kills you, then goes off patting theirself on the back....  Clueless. But I have come to discover some are better off with thier delusions... In other words.....


<bad Nicholson imitation> "You can't HANDLE the TRUTH....."


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## CrackerJax (Dec 25, 2008)

I think there is an IQ threshold for religious "FOLLOWERS" which seems to be horribly low. 
I view the religious "LEADERS" to be the true predators, taking advantage of the desperate and the non-thinkers. It's a shame and should be a crime....

Happy Yule Puff!!! 



out.


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## diemdepyro (Dec 26, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Its ok, they preach, get it outta their system, and go on to save someone else.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


i would not go so far as to call the religious low IQ as CJ does. I think a belief system is necessary for some even highly intelligent folks. All this crap has loads of perspective.
From the persons point of view that has seen a miracle They need a benevolent God to give credit for what they can not explain. When stuff goes all wrong blame the devil, lack of faith or sin. 
Not stupid just not wanting real responsibility. Kinda smart. 
The redemption for sale deal shows stupidity. Send reverend Soso 19.95$ and he will tell you how to get to heaven. 10 installments later.......You almost have it..

BTW I am selling the secret of eternal life this week only for $19.95 plus S&H. we are all friends here 18.95$


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 26, 2008)

Wow, S&H included? Better deal than my last guru, maybe THIS is truth??!!

Seriously tho, I have known some highly intelligent people involved in some religions that make me go 'huh?' and some really stupid people who have no spirituality at all. I can't say that is a barometer of IQ. But at some point you hafta question where it all comes from, and what it is all REALLY for. And one seed of doubt it all it takes. Then your path from religion is lost to you, but your path for the truth begins.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 26, 2008)

Yes I must concur and restate my IQ posit. I misspoke when I said low IQ. While there are many types of IQ, let me replace IQ with "gullible". Then I don't have to type so much . The flock is most definitely gullible and the shepherds are definitely preying upon them. 

I want to find out your secret but I have inadvertently boxed myself in with my own logic.... DOH!! I want to be GULLIBLE!!!!! 



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 26, 2008)

I lost or forgot all my secrets.


Its like UFOs. You believe cuz you WANT to.


----------



## CrackerJax (Dec 27, 2008)

Or perhaps need to....




out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 27, 2008)

Need to want? Or want to need?


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## longbaugh (Dec 27, 2008)

Since there's religions in pretty much all cultures and geographies, there must be something in our brain circuitry that lends itself to religions. Some power/knowledge systems have taken advantage of that and voila...religions.

Maybe there's some need to belong to something bigger. I could see how that would be an evolutionary uh ... whatcha call it ... uh, like, advantage. Maybe it has to do with the reality of death. A lot of religions say that after this you go on some more, albeit it a different state. I mean, how likely would you be to give up your life (or part of it) if you knew that this was it. (By the way...people do it all the time. Like kids in the military. I really appreciate those guys.)


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 27, 2008)

Most of it isn't voluntary, your parents get you in it, and often don't accept you if you don't join the cult. It is a form of group-think, to kill individuality of thought and spirit.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 27, 2008)

Yes, we a pre wired for duality..... science is proving that as we speak of it. Religion may end up another survival tool which will thankfully be phased out one day in the "BRITE" future society. Our so called "modern" society is going to seem awfully primitive and not so quaint when we finally emerge at te next level of advancement sans religion. .....



out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 27, 2008)

Hopefully science won't be the new religion...... Hopefully we get away from the need to have some giant parental figure, that perhaps we could.... dare I say it.... take ACCOUNTABILITY for ourselves?

There! I said it!


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## CrackerJax (Dec 27, 2008)

I don't think science can be religious..... it demands too much proof 



out.


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## R3F3RMADN3$$ (Dec 28, 2008)

There is no such thing as 'right' and 'wrong'.

There is no such thing as 'good' and 'bad'.

There is no such thing as 'normal'.

There is only perception.



$ Religion $-
It has served its purpose for advocating --even increasing-- the functionality of our society by MASKING the fact that we do not know what, who, why, where, or even when we are. The mask provided is that of DECEPTION-- they claim to know the origin and messages of the divine when they define such things as unknowable. They express THEORY as FACT using ideas CONCIEVED BY THEMSELVES as a basis to portray their thesis on ethic in order to execute their not-so-personal agenda: to make money and GAIN POWER by trying to instill Man Made Ideas into you and your children (future generations) without giving any consideration to what beliefs you may develop given their absence-- beliefs you may choose to shape your life around. THEY shape YOUR life for you via the manipulation of your thoughts so they may (1) Gain the privilege of TRUE freedom, and (2) Attempt to predispose you to a life of FEAR.

FEAR GOD.

FEAR PLAUGUE.

FEAR HELL.

-------dont worry about fearing purgatory, because they decided to get rid of it.-------.......?


!Existentialism!
People need to start THINKING FOR THEMSELVES and STOP taking ANY religious word for a reference to define positive and negative action. Citing religion is basically LYING without even putting forth the effort to come up with the lie yourself.

Develop your own beliefs
Learn to admit when youre wrong
OPEN YOUR MIND.

--No one is "right" (except for scientists and others who devote their lives to understanding how, not why, things that we can imperically verify work [if you disagree with that, you might as well disagree with the concept of atoms, chemical bondage, genetics, and all of the laws expressing the properties of the forces we know to exist] too) and no one is wrong (except for diehard creationists--if you disagree with that, sorry but I pity you. Oh to be one of the (sadly) many fools who actually believe the universe is 10,000 years of age..seriously? Who is counting? When did they start counting? Where did the start counting? Exactly--YOU DO NOT, AND CAN'T KNOW
THERE WILL ALWAYS BE THE CHANCE THAT ANY GIVEN THOERY IS INCORRECT. EVEN IF THE THEORY HAS BEEN PREVIOUSLY PROVEN TO BE CORRECT IN NATURE, WE ARE AND WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO PROVE THAT 3 SECONDS FROM NOW THE 'LAW'S OF EVERYTHING WILL SUDDENLY CHANGE. GIVE UP. UTILITARIAN EXISTENTIALISM IS TRULY THE MOST EFFECIENT WAY TO LIVE, AND IF YOU DISAGREE WITH THAT I FEEL SORRY FOR YOU THE SAME WAY I FELL SORRY FOR BRAINWASH VICTIMS.


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## Stoney McFried (Dec 28, 2008)

https://www.rollitup.org/spirituality-sexuality-philosophy/145009-religion-result-underdeveloped-area-brain.html Interesting thing I read...made a thread about it.


longbaugh said:


> Since there's religions in pretty much all cultures and geographies, there must be something in our brain circuitry that lends itself to religions. Some power/knowledge systems have taken advantage of that and voila...religions.
> 
> Maybe there's some need to belong to something bigger. I could see how that would be an evolutionary uh ... whatcha call it ... uh, like, advantage. Maybe it has to do with the reality of death. A lot of religions say that after this you go on some more, albeit it a different state. I mean, how likely would you be to give up your life (or part of it) if you knew that this was it. (By the way...people do it all the time. Like kids in the military. I really appreciate those guys.)


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## diemdepyro (Dec 28, 2008)

The brain or mind tends to fill in areas with data that is missing. That is how optical illusions work. Auditory data is handled similarly to optical data. Missing data is filled in with what the mind perceives as the best "fit".
The ink blot test is a good indicator of what would your mind fill in the blanks with. What appears to be a butterfly to me could appear to be an angel to you. The same butterfly ink blot would be an alien to your neighbor. No answer correct, after all it is just an ink blot. 
Now we must conclude that the human mind is flawed. We are all very poor witnesses. Our perspective clouds all we see and hear with what the mind determined that was the best fit for the situation.
This flawed perception due to our life's experience makes us human. Our mind needs answers so badly it makes them up. 
A mind is a terrible thing.


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## Stoney McFried (Dec 28, 2008)

If there were a god, and he was so perfect, how come he can't make his creations perfect?There's some proof right there that the whole god thing is faulty.


diemdepyro said:


> The brain or mind tends to fill in areas with data that is missing. That is how optical illusions work. Auditory data is handled similarly to optical data. Missing data is filled in with what the mind perceives as the best "fit".
> The ink blot test is a good indicator of what would your mind fill in the blanks with. What appears to be a butterfly to me could appear to be an angel to you. The same butterfly ink blot would be an alien to your neighbor. No answer correct, after all it is just an ink blot.
> Now we must conclude that the human mind is flawed. We are all very poor witnesses. Our perspective clouds all we see and hear with what the mind determined that was the best fit for the situation.
> This flawed perception due to our life's experience makes us human. Our mind needs answers so badly it makes them up.
> A mind is a terrible thing.


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## diemdepyro (Dec 28, 2008)

"If there were a god, and he was so perfect, how come he can't make his creations perfect?There's some proof right there that the whole god thing is faulty."Stoney McFried


Maybe God hates boredom. How boring would life be if we all had the same perspectives? Certainly we would be poor inventors and innovators. We would have never crawled out of the primordial soup. As humans we imagine the most beautiful things. Art,cinema, music, literature.......
We also imagine horrible things infanticide, torture, disco.....
One can not exist without the other. Yen and yang, light and dark, good vs evil. This absurdity of the human condition proves to some there is no God. To others it is definitive proof of a God.
It has got to be sweet. Blaming our success or failures on unseen forces.
We are all universally beautifully flawed. We are told you must worship in this religion or another.
We have been pushed to war, hatred, genocide all because of religion. We also have been pushed to charity, kindness and brotherly love. Seems as if we must separate God from religion.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 28, 2008)

Maybe.... one of my fav words..... maybe.

Humans aren't pushed to war, i.e. violence. We seem to take to it quite naturally. Almost by....gasp....design.


out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 29, 2008)

CrackerJax said:


> I don't think science can be religious..... it demands too much proof
> 
> 
> 
> out.


Proof isn't an issue. You can make a religion of anything. It begins with taking someone else's word for something (and like you don't do that with science? Science is, after all, very limited.) rather than discover the truth for yourself.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 29, 2008)

Stoney raises a great point, perhaps the greatest of all.

I have heard it reasoned out that the reason 'God' allows evil, or suffering, or however you wanna term it, is because it is a result of an environment of free will. But if that is so, and heaven has no evil, suffering, or whatever, then does that mean there is no free will in heaven?

I get out of that thorny nest of philosophical run around, MY God didn't 'create' anything in the material world. But MY God isn't everyone else's God, in fact, my 'God' isn't a 'god' at all.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 29, 2008)

Religion is a pre-science coping mechanism for living on an extremely violent and unfair planet. 

Being sentient has it's price, nothing is free. sigh....


out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 29, 2008)

Science is hardly a coping mechanism, delusions are better for coping I am sure. How most people I know cope, that or weed.

Scientists are no more to be trusted than the preistcraft is. They run tests (and alter them) as money and power dictate, don't fool yourself.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 29, 2008)

I didn't say science was a coping mech ..  


out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Dec 29, 2008)

It seems to be, for those who don't wanna use a different one....

Either science or 'belief', what else is there?m Neither one is the truth.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 29, 2008)

Oh, I would have to disagree about science not being the truth. Since the methodology of science is quite rigorous and only data which can stand up to actual and testable scrutiny is allowed to be passed onward and up, It is as close to the "truth" as you are ever going to get from a human species. Now you may not like some of the scientific conclusions, but that's another matter.

Religion has no such criteria for seeking the truth. It is more in the realm of Astrology..... 

Science & Religion are like apples and oranges. They don't really compare.......



out.


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## the beekeepers (Dec 29, 2008)

I try to "be present" or to "just be" ...trying not to assign labels of good or bad to people, circumstances or things.


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## Titan4jah (Dec 29, 2008)

rastafari stands alone. the one true livity of the creator.


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## CrackerJax (Dec 29, 2008)

I believe in False G*ds.... it's so much more convenient.  out.


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## Gryphonn (Dec 29, 2008)

Stoney McFried said:


> If there were a god, and he was so perfect, how come he can't make his creations perfect?There's some proof right there that the whole god thing is faulty.


Oh, Stoney! You know gods don't work that way.
The books tell you that we are made in 'his' likeness, but the gods just told the humans to write that to make us feel good. Gods are arses Stoney. We are their toy soldiers in the sandpit and they are the four year olds.
"It's my Judas and I'll smite him if I want!"
"No, he's mine! You had the carpenter's son!"
"Yeah, but the carpenter's son has holes in it and I can't find it anymore anyway."
"Well, go play with the L.Ron Hubbard and the Tom Cruise...oooooooh, make Tom jump on the couch again!!!! That was funny!"

If there was a 'God', she or he or it would have gathered together the Ayotollahs, the popes, the arch bishops, the clerics, extremists and all the politicians. She/he/it would then have smacked their heads together and told them to learn to play properly.

....or maybe Gods eyes were tired when he was making the gene pool and fucked a few up without noticing...ah shit, that won't wash. The God is 'perfect' hey...


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## misshestermoffitt (Dec 29, 2008)

I believe in the future of farming................


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## the beekeepers (Dec 30, 2008)

*If you die without loss, you are eternal.* _Lao Tzu "Tao Te Ching"_

This text was written 2500 years ago, amazing. I think most people are unenlightened and lack either the desire or intellect to achieve enlightenment. It's easier to latch on to a "do this / don't do that" religion thus mitigating the need to take responsibility one's own life or own path.


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## diemdepyro (Dec 30, 2008)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> Hay, no SpongeBob bashing goin on HERE!
> 
> Just kidding.


just as no body bashes the square pantsed guy sponging Bob!


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## CrackerJax (Dec 31, 2008)

Maybe enlightenment is unattainable. Perhaps it is an illusion. You get to play your hand, but you never get to see the deck of cards.... 




out.


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## Stoney McFried (Dec 31, 2008)

Do I get to keep my chips at least?


CrackerJax said:


> Maybe enlightenment is unattainable. Perhaps it is an illusion. You get to play your hand, but you never get to see the deck of cards....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## CrackerJax (Dec 31, 2008)

Chips, like money doesn't disappear, it merely changes pockets. No, your chips are left behind my friend......  



out.


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## misshestermoffitt (Dec 31, 2008)

Did someone say chips?


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## CrackerJax (Dec 31, 2008)

You dip... 



out.


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## R3F3RMADN3$$ (Jan 1, 2009)

Stoney McFried said:


> If there were a god, and he was so perfect, how come he can't make his creations perfect?There's some proof right there that the whole god thing is faulty.


 What about the idea of perfection in what is imperfect? If we were all perfect, none of us could grasp the idea of perfection because there wouldnt be any imperfections to define perfection by contrast; therefore our perfection would go unrecognized and become meaningless in that there would be no such meaning. Just like we wouldnt know what 'white' is without 'black', and vise versa.

there are ways around everything...<-thats the true reason religion doesn't quite work


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## CrackerJax (Jan 1, 2009)

So using that &quot;logic&quot; (ahem) since we are all imperfect and nothing is perfect, our imperfection is meaningless and would go unrecognized and have no meaning. So which came first? The imperfection or the story to make it fit? P.S. the egg came first.... out.


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## 420 (Jan 1, 2009)

zen
follow your bliss


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## R3F3RMADN3$$ (Jan 1, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> So using that &quot;logic&quot; (ahem) since we are all imperfect and nothing is perfect, our imperfection is meaningless and would go unrecognized and have no meaning. So which came first? The imperfection or the story to make it fit? P.S. the egg came first.... out.


I never said that nothing is perfect..the very idea of perfection (whether or not that pertains to the idea of god is up to you) that we all have innately stuck in our heads is perfect to each of us..If we recognize something as imperfect, we back it up with some reason- that reason being the difference between whatever holds the imperfection and what we each consider 'perfect'. Perfection is all in perception; it does exist.


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## CrackerJax (Jan 1, 2009)

really....name something which is perfect please. Perception is anecdotal..... G*d by consensus..... out.


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## diemdepyro (Jan 1, 2009)

people are perfectly flawed. The perfect joint after a bad day. for me it is perspective not perception.


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## CrackerJax (Jan 1, 2009)

You can't have perspective without first having perception.....nice try tho. Perfect joint? No, mine's better...  Oh yah, and so is my G*D.... . . . . out.


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## misshestermoffitt (Jan 2, 2009)

Perfection is in the eye of the beholder. What is perfect to me is a hot mess to someone else.


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## CrackerJax (Jan 2, 2009)

Eye of the beholder.....your back to perception Miss.....  help i want to get off this merry go round...... out.


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## 420 (Jan 2, 2009)

zen
let go
relax
no mind
peace
bliss


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## puffdamagikdragon (Jan 2, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> Oh, I would have to disagree about science not being the truth. Since the methodology of science is quite rigorous and only data which can stand up to actual and testable scrutiny is allowed to be passed onward and up, It is as close to the "truth" as you are ever going to get from a human species. Now you may not like some of the scientific conclusions, but that's another matter.
> 
> Religion has no such criteria for seeking the truth. It is more in the realm of Astrology.....
> 
> ...


Wow, this thread took off while I was having puter problems. 

Wasn't comparing them, just showing how they are used for the same reason. And no, science is not truth, cuz they haven't figgered out EVERYTHING, they lack 'peices' of the puzzle, and without seeing it in tis entirety, you cannot have the full picture, and cannot realise the truth.

There are different relgions, and the most popular would ban astrology if they could...... And some would ban astronomy as well....

Science bumbles about and tries to measure life, tries to put it on a scale or stretch it on a ruler. If you don't like the empirical dominance of the Church, would science with it's frankenstien tendencies be any better? If it is cut throat means to power, don't hink science would take a more gentle path than religion did, they both have the same agenda. To elicit belief without question or challenge.

If you worship science, what makes you different from anyone else who worhisps ANYTHING? Now, to catch up with the rest of the thread (if I stay connected long enuff......)


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## diemdepyro (Jan 2, 2009)

I believe in everything and nothing.


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## MisterMicro (Jan 2, 2009)

I beleive in the SIDnation, the nation where you seek the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.


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## MisterMicro (Jan 2, 2009)

Are we human, or are we dancers??


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## Stoney McFried (Jan 2, 2009)

I'm going with human, cuz I can't dance worth a shit.


MisterMicro said:


> Are we human, or are we dancers??


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## MisterMicro (Jan 2, 2009)

Stoney McFried said:


> I'm going with human, cuz I can't dance worth a shit.


 I second that. And They say God loves me when im thrown on stage and cheered to dance on. Im starting to wonder if god gives a SHIT! I think i might have dancedowns....


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## puffdamagikdragon (Jan 2, 2009)

Gryphonn said:


> Oh, Stoney! You know gods don't work that way.
> The books tell you that we are made in 'his' likeness, but the gods just told the humans to write that to make us feel good. Gods are arses Stoney. We are their toy soldiers in the sandpit and they are the four year olds.
> "It's my Judas and I'll smite him if I want!"
> "No, he's mine! You had the carpenter's son!"
> ...


OMG, Gryphon, it won't let me rep you again just yet, but that was so awesome......


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## diemdepyro (Jan 2, 2009)

Thanks now there is half a song... tiny dancer playing in my head
tina Turner is singing it....it will not stop....will not stop.


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## MisterMicro (Jan 2, 2009)

Gotchya BITch! Mwahahaha


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## vantheman169 (Jan 2, 2009)

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/

I am not really sure what I believe in anymore. I was brought up Catholic, and now at the age of 27, i dont know! I believe that your soul has to go somewhere, no just done dead, nothing drawing a blank line. F that. But watch that movie that shitz crazy if you got about 2 hours to spare. I am all into outerspace crap latley. The really interesting part of that movie is about a 1/4 of the way in dont watch the first part if you dont want, but it talks about Religion, quite a bit.


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## vantheman169 (Jan 2, 2009)

Oh make sure you watch THE MOVIE not the other one, well you can if you want, not sure what its about watching it now, lol.


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## MisterMicro (Jan 2, 2009)

zeitgeist virgin eh? Changed my life man, id love to beleive theres life beyond life, but just cant seem to accept that as making any sence. Dont know why, but i guess in your head your saying the same thing about atheism or what have you.

Ya the parallels it insists in religion make me really wonder.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Jan 2, 2009)

diemdepyro said:


> I believe in everything and nothing.


Now that is the deepest thing I have read on this thread yet. Kudos. Consider yourself + repped, Diem.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Jan 2, 2009)

There is no spoon.


----------



## MisterMicro (Jan 2, 2009)

zeitgeist is even a great group Zeigeist - Giving You Up


----------



## misshestermoffitt (Jan 2, 2009)

My belief is that right now, I'm a gonna smoke a hitter. I believe in my hitter, in 15 years, it's never let me down.


----------



## WhatAmIDoing (Jan 3, 2009)

My Logic: If there is an afterlife, there was a "before"life. If all there is is now, then the mere question of an afterlife is irrelevant. 

Personal Understanding: There is and was all and now at once.


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## CrackerJax (Jan 3, 2009)

WhatAmIDoing said:


> My Logic: If there is an afterlife, there was a "before"life. If all there is is now, then the mere question of an afterlife is irrelevant.
> 
> Personal Understanding: There is and was all and now at once.



If the afterlife was MERELY a question, we wouldn't have all this religious violence in the world.... 

I wish it was MERELY a question and not the driving force of illogic in our societies.....

out.


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Jan 3, 2009)

Wow, WhatamIdoing, that was great. If this thread gets any deeper, I'm gonna hafta buy some spelunking gear.....

Izzat a light at the end of the tunnel, or a train headed my way.......


----------



## a brasileira (Jan 3, 2009)

hi everyone!
well my spirituality is a bit complicated.
i'm a pagan, and an animistic pagan at that.
i draw influences from many different cultures, particularly celtic, hindu, and other ancient middle eastern religions.
errrrr...
i was raised catholic but it...is complete bullshit lol
:-]


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## Immortalica (Jan 3, 2009)

I am a Satanist.


----------



## a brasileira (Jan 3, 2009)

Immortalica said:


> I am a Satanist.


interesting...so as a satanist, is there a particular doctrine that you follow? i've dated a few satanists and i have friends who are, and it seems that the definition of "satanism" differs depending on who's talking about it.


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## Immortalica (Jan 3, 2009)

a brasileira said:


> interesting...so as a satanist, is there a particular doctrine that you follow? i've dated a few satanists and i have friends who are, and it seems that the definition of "satanism" differs depending on who's talking about it.


This is true. I think it's different for everyone, as are there various types of Satanism (theistic Satanism, atheistic/LeVayan Satanism, ect.). The basic idea of Satanism is the belief in and betterment of the self. There is no "God" according to Satanism, unless you follow the theistic Satanism in which one believes in an actual deity called Satan. We are our own god. I personally believe in an atheistic Satanism, LeVayan Satanism I most identify with. Here, "Satan" is merely a symbol of human nature.
If you're interested, you can read here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LaVeyan_Satanism


----------



## a brasileira (Jan 3, 2009)

Immortalica said:


> This is true. I think it's different for everyone, as are there various types of Satanism (theistic Satanism, atheistic/LeVayan Satanism, ect.). The basic idea of Satanism is the belief in and betterment of the self. There is no "God" according to Satanism, unless you follow the theistic Satanism in which one believes in an actual deity called Satan. We are our own god. I personally believe in an atheistic Satanism, LeVayan Satanism I most identify with. Here, "Satan" is merely a symbol of human nature.
> If you're interested, you can read here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LaVeyan_Satanism


hmmm...interesting. thanksfor explaining!
so satanism is...more like idolizing "satan" as a reference to the hidden, darker aspects of humanity, yes?

the only part i disagree with is the "we are our own god", to a certain degree... personally, i think god (goddess) is something inherant in nature, and thus inherant in humanity....not some force outside of space and time that is intent on punishing us all for making a mistake.

anyways, "god" has such a narrow definition nowadays...people think there's two options: christian or atheist, which isn't the case.


----------



## Immortalica (Jan 3, 2009)

a brasileira said:


> hmmm...interesting. thanksfor explaining!
> so satanism is...more like idolizing "satan" as a reference to the hidden, darker aspects of humanity, yes?
> 
> the only part i disagree with is the "we are our own god", to a certain degree... personally, i think god (goddess) is something inherant in nature, and thus inherant in humanity....not some force outside of space and time that is intent on punishing us all for making a mistake.
> ...


You're welcome. Sorry for being vague. When I say "we are our own god," I mean, as a basic belief in Satanism, we are the controllers of our lives, instead of an outside force or deity as many other religions would have you believe. It is only the individual who can control ones own destiny.


----------



## a brasileira (Jan 3, 2009)

Immortalica said:


> You're welcome. Sorry for being vague. When I say "we are our own god," I mean, as a basic belief in Satanism, we are the controllers of our lives, instead of an outside force or deity as many other religions would have you believe. It is only the individual who can control ones own destiny.


aaah, i see. i totally agree with that, except i feel there are certain...universal "tides" that we tend to flow with...not necesarily be "controlled" by, but...natural tendencies you know?
but that's cool, i've never really heard it explained like that before.
:-]


----------



## R3F3RMADN3$$ (Jan 3, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> really....name something which is perfect please. Perception is anecdotal..... G*d by consensus..... out.


 Anyone's individual idea of perfection is "perfect" to them. One could say that everything is perfect in that it is imperfect(refer to above). Thats what the fuck ive been trying to say..please ignore your obligation to attempt to find flaw in what i post just because you dont get it- maybe one day you'll realize..until then show some respect


----------



## misshestermoffitt (Jan 3, 2009)

I also believe that after I get done smokin, I'm going to take a clone off one of my plants. Isn't gardening fun? I believe it is.......


----------



## Brazko (Jan 3, 2009)

Immortalica said:


> This is true. I think it's different for everyone, as are there various types of Satanism (theistic Satanism, atheistic/LeVayan Satanism, ect.). The basic idea of Satanism is the belief in and betterment of the self. There is no "God" according to Satanism, unless you follow the theistic Satanism in which one believes in an actual deity called Satan. We are our own god. I personally believe in an atheistic Satanism, LeVayan Satanism I most identify with. Here, "Satan" is merely a symbol of human nature.
> If you're interested, you can read here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LaVeyan_Satanism


 



a brasileira said:


> aaah, i see. i totally agree with that, except i feel there are certain...universal "tides" that we tend to flow with...not necesarily be "controlled" by, but...natural tendencies you know?
> but that's cool, i've never really heard it explained like that before.
> :-]





Immortalica said:


> You're welcome. Sorry for being vague. When I say "we are our own god," I mean, as a basic belief in Satanism, we are the controllers of our lives, instead of an outside force or deity as many other religions would have you believe. It is only the individual who can control ones own destiny.


Thanks for sharing that knowledge and thoughts....I didn't realize how satanism was so much apart of my life....., everything so much clearer, so much....



PUFF This Is Some Good Stuff


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 3, 2009)

R3F3RMADN3$$ said:


> Anyone's individual idea of perfection is "perfect" to them. One could say that everything is perfect in that it is imperfect(refer to above). Thats what the fuck ive been trying to say..please ignore your obligation to attempt to find flaw in what i post just because you dont get it- maybe one day you'll realize..until then show some respect


Well that wasn't perfect and I wasn't attempting to find a flaw....it was self evident. 
Don't worry, you fell on relativism and only slightly bruised yourself. Nice save ..  Consensus?



out.


----------



## a brasileira (Jan 3, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> Well that wasn't perfect and I wasn't attempting to find a flaw....it was self evident.
> Don't worry, you fell on relativism and only slightly bruised yourself. Nice save ..  Consensus?
> 
> 
> ...


relativism...
ah, that takes me all the way back to philosophy 101...gotta love it.


----------



## R3F3RMADN3$$ (Jan 3, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> Well that wasn't perfect and I wasn't attempting to find a flaw....it was self evident.
> Don't worry, you fell on relativism and only slightly bruised yourself. Nice save ..  Consensus?
> 
> 
> ...


I didnt fall on relativism; everything i posted was dependant on the elements of my previous posts. There were no flaws if you read carefully..

dont want any beef, just saying


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 3, 2009)

mmmmm ... look it up. Your in the thick of it  don't worry it's all good here...


Yah remember those Phil classes? Gawd some of it was just awful....  and some was fantastic  


out.


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Jan 4, 2009)

misshestermoffitt said:


> I also believe that after I get done smokin, I'm going to take a clone off one of my plants. Isn't gardening fun? I believe it is.......


Wow. I can't beleive it. I think I have finally found something to beleive in. 

I believe..... In MissH's plants, too! Cool, I can handle this religion now...... Excuse me, whilest I go 'bless' myself.......


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Jan 4, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> mmmmm ... look it up. Your in the thick of it  don't worry it's all good here...
> 
> 
> Yah remember those Phil classes? Gawd some of it was just awful....  and some was fantastic
> ...


Phil who? Dr. Phil? Phil-anthropy?


----------



## misshestermoffitt (Jan 4, 2009)

All right !!! I have one follower. Come jion the "church of the cannibis" no dues or tithing required.


----------



## WhatAmIDoing (Jan 4, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> If the afterlife was MERELY a question, we wouldn't have all this religious violence in the world....
> 
> I wish it was MERELY a question and not the driving force of illogic in our societies.....
> 
> out.


maybe. but if if's and wishes were fishes there'd be no room in the ocean


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 4, 2009)

If "IF" and "Wishes' were fishes it would explain Jesus' feeding of the multitudes wouldn't it? 



out.


----------



## a brasileira (Jan 5, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> If "IF" and "Wishes' were fishes it would explain Jesus' feeding of the multitudes wouldn't it?
> 
> 
> 
> out.


oooh dude that was actually pretty good...

mwuah ha ha.

(*exiting*)


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 5, 2009)

We call that in forum land  .. the CLOSER .. BAM! 




out.


----------



## Brazko (Jan 5, 2009)

*Macrocosm and microcosm* is an ancient Greek schema of seeing the same patterns reproduced in all levels of the cosmos, from the largest scale (macrocosm or universe-level) all the way down to the smallest scale (microcosm or sub-sub-atomic or even metaphysical-level).

This is The God I Believe in......

GOD to ME = SOURCE

Understanding that, Understand that God is infinite.....NOT in Some respect.....But in All REspect. Infinitely Good / Infinitely Bad. Infinitely Perfect / Infinitely ImPerfect. Infinitley that and infinitely this, in every possible degree and combination.....Understand? God is all Possiblilities. God is also all things; not just some things, but everything that exists or does not exist , everything that has always existed, and everything that will never and can never exist. 

God is omnipresent; that is, God is everywhere, not just some places everywhere. God is not just in your body, but in every single cell of our body - every molecule, every atom, every boson, meson, quark, every subatomic paticle of your body. Nothing can exist outside of God. 

That having been said, you must understand that God has both a Manifest nature and an unmanifest nature. The Unmanifested nature = Unmanifested universe and the Manifested nature = Manifested Universe.

The Manifested Universe = Matter

Back before the creation of the physical universe, all was one with God and without defilement. That exalted state of immaculate existence will be achieved again when all physical matter is dissolved (via black holes maybe) and returned back into the pristine unmanifested nature of God. 

????


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 5, 2009)

The above post has not been verified. But don't let that stop you  wish away.....




out.


----------



## Brazko (Jan 5, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> The above post has not been verified. But don't let that stop you  wish away.....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


wish away to what......

what is there to verify........

my wording or the evidence........

and I thought I told you that we won't stop, thought I told you that we won't stop, eh, heh, eh heh...


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 5, 2009)

Since neither your wording or evidence is verifiable..... neither ... hence the word "wish" was used. 

All religious faith no matter the denomination, from paganism to catholicism, is a wish..... nothing more.



out.


----------



## Brazko (Jan 5, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> Since neither your wording or evidence is verifiable..... neither ... hence the word "wish" was used.
> 
> All religious faith no matter the denomination, from paganism to catholicism, is a wish..... nothing more.
> 
> ...


the wording can be verified in WebsTer Dictionary. The Evidence is either there or not, and indicated

Who said anything about a Religion 

So what am I wishing for......to be saved from something......being blessed to have something.  

Here is a micro example (you mom and dad thought about making sexy time, they did and you are here) thanks for helping me with some of the verification.


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 5, 2009)

When you mention the word G*D in any capacity....you are talking religion. 

The wording cannot be verified by Webster's ... only the spelling.

You need to brush up a bit.... 



out.


----------



## Brazko (Jan 5, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> When you mention the word G*D in any capacity....you are talking religion.
> 
> The wording cannot be verified by Webster's ... only the spelling.
> 
> ...


 Do you think I'm talking about religion (I'm NOT) . Although I understand your point of the word GOD, and really I do, I say God, but also give meaning and a certain understanding behind it as well. 

Why does God has to be own by Religion......? Why does me functioning as a part of Humanity alone has to be a Satanic religion....? When now if someone ask me if I'm a Satanist, I might have to say yes, depending on their meaning of Satanism.......This does not perplex life for me.....but has freed and opened me up further to the truth 


After the spelling / pronunciation Webster doen't define anymore too....? Not that it makes a differences. I'm sharing my knowledge and Intelligence with you, it's up to you to gain an understanding of my meaning. No word will ever be able to translate into a perfect meaning, but we can use them to convey a greater meaning than what they stand for alone.

That is also my claim to fame that Jesus was real.......the Word of God.....Because even today many don't understand b/c of their own lack of capacity to understand (yet anyway), and I understand he wasn't talking about Space God, not one verse he was, but it is the Capacity of Ignorance that continues to overshadow the true meaning of his words.


----------



## misshestermoffitt (Jan 5, 2009)

There is no proof of any kind of god or all powerful being. Since there is no such proof the below statement is not fact. It is a wish.  OH SNAP 





Brazko said:


> *Macrocosm and microcosm* is an ancient Greek schema of seeing the same patterns reproduced in all levels of the cosmos, from the largest scale (macrocosm or universe-level) all the way down to the smallest scale (microcosm or sub-sub-atomic or even metaphysical-level).
> 
> This is The God I Believe in......
> 
> ...


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 5, 2009)

Thank you Miss, i was getting tired.....

Ommmmm noodly appendage save me.....


out.


----------



## Brazko (Jan 5, 2009)

misshestermoffitt said:


> There is no proof of any kind of god or all powerful being. Since there is no such proof the below statement is not fact. It is a wish.  OH SNAP


In common usage, *matter* is _anything that has both mass and volume (takes up space)_. A more rigorous definition is used in science: *matter* is _what atoms and molecules are made of_. Matter is commonly said to exist in four _states_ (or _phases_): solid, liquid, gas and plasma; other phases, such as BoseEinstein condensates, also exist.
Matter, in the scientific definition, constitutes about 4% of the energy of the observable universe. The remaining energy is theorized to be due to exotic forms, of which 23% is dark matter[2][3] and 73% is dark energy.[


The *atom* is a basic unit of matter consisting of a dense, central nucleus surrounded by a cloud of negatively charged electrons. The atomic nucleus contains a mix of positively charged protons and electrically neutral neutrons (except in the case of Hydrogen-1, which is the only stable isotope with no neutron). The electrons of an atom are bound to the nucleus by the electromagnetic force. Likewise, a group of atoms can remain bound to each other, forming a molecule. An atom containing an equal number of protons and electrons is electrically neutral, otherwise it has a positive or negative charge and is an ion. An atom is classified according to the number of protons and neutrons in its nucleus: the number of protons determines the chemical element, and the number of neutrons determine the isotope of the element.
The name atom comes from the Greek &#7940;&#964;&#959;&#956;&#959;&#962;/átomos, &#945;-&#964;&#949;&#956;&#957;&#969;, which means uncuttable, something that cannot be divided further. The concept of an atom as an indivisible component of matter was first proposed by early Indian and Greek philosophers

lean wit,...rock wit,.....lean wit it, rock wit



CrackerJax said:


> Thank you Miss, i was getting tired.....
> 
> Ommmmm noodly appendage save me.....
> 
> ...


Just REmember NOt 2 fall asleep....


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 5, 2009)

you can copy paste all you want..... it's not helping your coherency. I'm sensing a lack of foundational knowledge....... 


I'm a bloody PIRATE!!!




out.


----------



## Brazko (Jan 5, 2009)

Here is Mona Lisa


----------



## Brazko (Jan 5, 2009)

OK....I SEE, I SAY........first you say provide evidence....now when I copy information to show you there is public information to this its hog wash.........Sarcasm....Have it your way bra, I'm not trying to make you a believer of something, or anybody else.........I have power over you, I drained your juicy little meaty brain, you omitted it, let's do this ...........not interact



Fart (poot)


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 5, 2009)

"let's do this ...........not interact"



That's the first thing you've said I agree with......





out.


----------



## misshestermoffitt (Jan 5, 2009)

Where is the proof of this all powerful being? Saything that matter exists is not saying anything at all. I'm here and so is my puter, therefore matter exists. 

I"m still waiting for the proof, the whole proof and nothing but the proof.


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 5, 2009)

Ur gonna wait a long time Miss... 

His powder is wet I'm afraid....




out.


----------



## IHaventGotAClue (Jan 5, 2009)

I believe in lots of things But to people that think a different view could think im crazy and vise virsa then evolves into a fight then the witch hunt is out .. 
Today the views and thoughts i believe to be true i keep to myself because i believe them so i have no need to prove them to any one.

People have killed each other from day one because of different beliefs and we have still not grew above it yet to this day there are wars world wide because of peoples beliefs ...... Crazy huh 

The easy answer is live your own life .............


----------



## Brazko (Jan 5, 2009)

misshestermoffitt said:


> Where is the proof of this all powerful being? Saything that matter exists is not saying anything at all. I'm here and so is my puter, therefore matter exists.
> 
> I"m still waiting for the proof, the whole proof and nothing but the proof.


that is the proof as far and as close as I can comprehend. In our simplest form, everything is the same from micro to macro. if everything is the same it must have originated from one or the same source.... the only thing that differentiate us from one another is the molecular make up of those atoms.......all originating at the first stage of hydrogen. 

So you are no different than your puter, splatcha, and thank almighty


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 5, 2009)

He just discovered atoms .. quick call somebody....


out.


----------



## Brazko (Jan 5, 2009)

IHaventGotAClue said:


> I believe in lots of things But to people that think a different view could think im crazy and vise virsa then evolves into a fight then the witch hunt is out ..
> Today the views and thoughts i believe to be true i keep to myself because i believe them so i have no need to prove them to any one.
> 
> People have killed each other from day one because of different beliefs and we have still not grew above it yet to this day there are wars world wide because of peoples beliefs ...... Crazy huh
> ...


that was one 10o, all you can do is live your life....1o0


----------



## misshestermoffitt (Jan 5, 2009)

You keep spewing stuff about matter, but you've yet to prove there is some kind of god. Do you have a picture of him, a hair sample maybe, how about an e-mail? 

Talking about mass and matter still doesn't prove anything. No one is debating that we are all here. I know I'm here, Jax, knows he's here. I asked god if he/she/it was here, but didn't get a response? Is that because there isn't a god, or because god sees us as matter that doesn't matter?


----------



## a brasileira (Jan 5, 2009)

misshestermoffitt said:


> You keep spewing stuff about matter, but you've yet to prove there is some kind of god. Do you have a picture of him, a hair sample maybe, how about an e-mail?
> 
> Talking about mass and matter still doesn't prove anything. No one is debating that we are all here. I know I'm here, Jax, knows he's here. I asked god if he/she/it was here, but didn't get a response? Is that because there isn't a god, or because god sees us as matter that doesn't matter?


no one asked my opinion, but im a girl so of course i'll give it anyways.

i think all of you have valid points, but here's an idea: maybe we all view "god" in a way...that is nothing like his/ her real nature...who says god is an all perfect ruler sitting somewhere in yonder cloud? nah. personally, i see god( Goddess actually) IN nature...i dont believe in Her, i connect with her...anybody know what i mean?
anyways, dude let's just keep this to an intellectual conversation, not a testosterone driven showdown of the faiths.
:-/


----------



## Brazko (Jan 5, 2009)

misshestermoffitt said:


> You keep spewing stuff about matter, but you've yet to prove there is some kind of god. Do you have a picture of him, a hair sample maybe, how about an e-mail?
> 
> Talking about mass and matter still doesn't prove anything. No one is debating that we are all here. I know I'm here, Jax, knows he's here. I asked god if he/she/it was here, but didn't get a response? Is that because there isn't a god, or because god sees us as matter that doesn't matter?


what are you talking about? for some reason......you just don't get it, huh......now your running.....so let it be 



a brasileira said:


> no one asked my opinion, but im a girl so of course i'll give it anyways.
> 
> i think all of you have valid points, but here's an idea: maybe we all view "god" in a way...that is nothing like his/ her real nature...who says god is an all perfect ruler sitting somewhere in yonder cloud? nah. personally, i see god( Goddess actually) IN nature...i dont believe in Her, i connect with her...anybody know what i mean?
> anyways, dude let's just keep this to an intellectual conversation, not a testosterone driven showdown of the faiths.
> :-/


brasileira, I know what you mean, but I don't necessarily think that the nature of God is male or female, but yes closer to being Goddess.


----------



## misshestermoffitt (Jan 5, 2009)

Honey, around here, nobody asks for your opinion, you just have to jump in feet first and give your opinion. It's like debate team for stoners. 

My arguments are estrogen driven 'cause I'm a girl.  






a brasileira said:


> no one asked my opinion, but im a girl so of course i'll give it anyways.


 
OK, I don't think you get it. I asked for proof of some kind of all powerful being and you spouted off about matter. Just because things exist doesn't mean a living being had to put them here. Things can just be without an intelligent force behind them. 

So once again what is your proof of some all powerful being? Saying that matter exists is proof of nothing more than us existing, which we all already know we exist. 






Brazko said:


> what are you talking about? for some reason......you just don't get it, huh......now your running.....so let it be


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 5, 2009)

Brazko said:


> what are you talking about? for some reason......you just don't get it, huh......now your running.....so let it be
> 
> 
> 
> brasileira, I know what you mean, but *I don't necessarily think that the nature of God is male or female, but yes closer to being Goddess.*



Uhhhh, can you spot the trouble?


Yo Bra  

Well that's the crux of the biscuit now isn't it...... once we invent a G*D how do we keep it homogenized for everybody? 
Answer: We don't. We just fill in our societal factor inputs and spin the wheel ... and then war with each other over the differences of what we have MADE UP!!! 

Yes, we should think of ourselves as so very smart, right? 


out.


----------



## Gryphonn (Jan 6, 2009)

By golly, there is some refinement of gods going on in here. Fancy god being the atom of existence! 

It seems a common thought amongst people as they grow up, to wonder if we are maybe an atom on the surface of an atom inside a jar on a table in a room on a planet somewhere...or something thereabouts.

Lets get down to basics. Aren't we all in a state of self-conciousness? 

Therefore, we are all following a path of 'being'. The only true faith to try and follow.

Disclaimer: I am a Devoted Happy. A Devoted Happy's only commitment is that they treat others as they would like to be treated themselves. Nothing more, nothing less.

Over the years we've also adopted the 'Benefit others. If you cannot benefit others, at least do them no harm' philosophy from the Dali Lama. 

We are still considering adopting the 'Be Excellent To Each Other' doctrine espoused by the famed time travellers, Bill and Ted.

'Easy Skanking' is our primary psalm. 

Sorry, gang, we have no gods in the closet.


----------



## misshestermoffitt (Jan 6, 2009)

I think I'll go with the Bill and Ted theory. Sounds like a winner.


----------



## Gryphonn (Jan 6, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> *snip*
> Answer: We don't. We just fill in our societal factor inputs and spin the wheel ... and then war with each other over the differences of what we have MADE UP!!!
> 
> Yes, we should think of ourselves as so very smart, right?
> out.


That's that 'Cultural Capital' thing my psychology lecturers loved to prattle on about. I mean, it's not prattle, it's just when they assign long, multi-syllable words and complex phrases to describe 'how you grew up', it becomes a bit of a wank...but it is excellent brain fodder to actually see people making money from describing the things we all 'know' but can't articulate...hang on, why did I have to take psychology based classed for an IT degree? Oh, that's right. It was an elective, 'An Introduction to ...blah blah Cultural Capital ... blah blah. BUT, it was really good in terms of helping to understand social engineering and how different humans react to different experiences... 

...oh, oh, I've gone all freaky again...hang on... need a billy...


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 6, 2009)

It must be true if they made a movie about it 



out.


----------



## misshestermoffitt (Jan 6, 2009)

you mean they make movies about things that aren't true?


----------



## Gryphonn (Jan 6, 2009)

misshestermoffitt said:


> I think I'll go with the Bill and Ted theory. Sounds like a winner.


A most excellent suggestion Sister hester! Consider it done!

'Be Excellent To Each Other' is now an official doctrine that should be followed by all Devoted Happys.

From 02:00 

[youtube]
<object width="480" height="295"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/WVXGC896Jdw&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/WVXGC896Jdw&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="295"></embed></object>[/youtube]


----------



## misshestermoffitt (Jan 6, 2009)

Man, freaking Bill and Ted, I had forgotten all about them and their excellent adventure. 

Be excellent to each other.


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 6, 2009)

Not that I know of..... hang on Superman can't get his uniform to fit. How many times have I told him to not wash Spandex in hot water....jeesh... he's strong but not too bright...



out.


----------



## Gryphonn (Jan 6, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> It must be true if they made a movie about it
> out.





misshestermoffitt said:


> you mean they make movies about things that aren't true?


Well, of course it was true! It was in colour/color. If it was in Black and White, we'd know it was all just make believe.


----------



## misshestermoffitt (Jan 6, 2009)

I wonder what kind of detergent he uses, his outfit never fades.


----------



## SlikWiLL13 (Jan 6, 2009)

okay, ive avoided this one as long as i could. here goes....

i dont believe in any form of organized religion. i think its the most concieted thing there is. millions of different beliefs and YOURS is right. please...

used to be the only thing i did believe in was karma, now im beginning to question that.


i used to do alot of bad things...ALOT. for many years now ive been living right(dont hurt or steal are the rules i live by) and i see the people i did bad with still doing bad and thriving. while i work my ass off to raise my daughter right and i struggle. 

kinda rambly...


----------



## CrackerJax (Jan 6, 2009)

misshestermoffitt said:


> I wonder what kind of detergent he uses, his outfit never fades.


He insists on Arm & Hammer .. such a show off.



gryph ... B/W .. so true  my nephews won't watch anything in B/W. "that's old" they say 


out.


----------



## Rebel Ops (Jan 7, 2009)

I believe that anything i possible but that nobody really knows the truth. I leave it at that because I've seen what religious obsession causes... for example USA (Christian government) gives Israel (Jewish government) nukes because they believe that god gave them that land, when in fact they stole it. Also we use it to justify murdering middle eastern families right now.


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Jan 8, 2009)

Wow. We dug so deep we found Bill and Ted.

Finally. I am a Devoted Happy as well. A label I don't mind at all, for some reason.

Be excellent to each other.

Party on, dude!



No wiser words have yet been spoken.  Outta the mouths of Bill and Ted... (Oh, right, we ain't supposed to make a religion outta THEM either....)

Seriously tho, this has been so great.

MissH, I want the proof the whole proof and nothing but the proof is so friggin funny, you need warning before you post that shit. Bout fell on the floor. I'm stealing it, btw.




Awesome, yall. It don't get better than this, kiddos.


----------



## misshestermoffitt (Jan 8, 2009)

Sorry Puff, the proof? You can't handle the proof !!!


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Jan 8, 2009)

But the proof is in the pudding!


And I like pudding.......


----------



## misshestermoffitt (Jan 8, 2009)

Pudding, is good stuff. I like pudding pies. 

I love religious debates, the bible is so contradictory, it's fun to point out all the little things that don't make sense.


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Jan 8, 2009)

Are you kidding? I love this shit. This makes for good thinking, good laughing, and good fun. As long as nobody takes it seriously.

I mean, it ain't like you are getting out in your skin anyhow. 

And that's the proof. I mean the troof. 



I believe, I beleive..... I believe...... I beleive I will roll another joint.


----------



## misshestermoffitt (Jan 8, 2009)

I still believe in my plants. I love them.


----------



## diemdepyro (Jan 8, 2009)

Be Excellent to each other(Bill and Ted) is a philosophy. Zen can be a faith or a philosophy. 
Jesus taught Zen.

There is a school of thought that insists that Jesus of Nazareth traveled to India during his teenage years.
He was traveling with his uncle Joseph of Aremethea. This is the man that provided Jesus with a tomb.
They have found ancient texts that confirm the story. there is lots more on this subject. If it is not true it is one hell of a good story. Look it up.


----------



## OregonMeds (Jan 8, 2009)

I believe in this:

Penn & Teller Bullshit, Religion episode

part 1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNzXsDvvFyk

Part 2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1R1usMsYU3Q&feature=related

Part 3

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RDjd3XtRzA&feature=related

It's good for some laughs if you haven't seen it.


----------



## the beekeepers (Jan 8, 2009)

diemdepyro said:


> Be Excellent to each other(Bill and Ted) is a philosophy. Zen can be a faith or a philosophy.
> Jesus taught Zen.
> 
> There is a school of thought that insists that Jesus of Nazareth traveled to India during his teenage years.
> ...


That is an incredibly enlightened and educated post. I agree with you completely


----------



## puffdamagikdragon (Jan 8, 2009)

misshestermoffitt said:


> I still believe in my plants. I love them.


I mite believe in your plants if you have proof. (HINT, bud porn, HINT)


----------



## diemdepyro (Jan 8, 2009)

the beekeepers said:


> That is an incredibly enlightened and educated post. I agree with you completely


I see there is another student of enlightenment. I have to ask.
Is your life fulfilled. My personal beliefs have given me true peace and fulfillment. This is what no organized religion could 
for me. Teacher teach yourself.


----------



## the beekeepers (Jan 8, 2009)

diemdepyro said:


> I see there is another student of enlightenment. I have to ask.
> Is your life fulfilled. My personal beliefs have given me true peace and fulfillment. This is what no organized religion could
> for me. Teacher teach yourself.


As long as I meditate everyday and practice mindfulness I do very well. If not the persistent and greedy ego tends to bubble up. For me it is the only path to enlightenment.

Organized religion is not my path.

"If you die without loss, you are eternal" Tao Te Ching


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## diemdepyro (Jan 8, 2009)

"Organized religion is not my path." beekeeper
That is the statement of a"satisfied mind"


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## the beekeepers (Jan 8, 2009)

diemdepyro said:


> "Organized religion is not my path." beekeeper
> That is the statement of a"satisfied mind"


Thanks diemdepyro! It works for me. It also makes perfect sense to me to respect that other people have their own path. This Way is accepting and without judgement. I don't know any other religions or philosophies that teach that.


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## diemdepyro (Jan 8, 2009)

This is it the secret of happiness right here on rollitup. Beekeeper just saved all you $19.95.


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## the beekeepers (Jan 8, 2009)

Lol...that is funny!


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## CrackerJax (Jan 8, 2009)

One need only look to Tibet to see that if only one side believes in a peaceful solution to life, it will end in tears under the jack boots who don't..... and so it continues. 

Religion is just ducky....


out.


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## misshestermoffitt (Jan 8, 2009)

oraganized religion = mass hysteria


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## humblesmurph (Jan 8, 2009)

i dunno, i see all these cats separating god and spirituality from religion. Seems weird to me. God and spirituality go hand in hand with religion. This whole "I'm spiritual but don't follow a religion" movement just seems like a cop out. Cats want the eternal bliss, but they kinda just want to do their own thing.

People think that religion was created as a subset of of god in order to control people. It's the other way around. God came about through religion. There had never been the separation before. Once man got it in his head that there was some sort of supreme being, we've been trying to please him with rituals ever since. Point being, simply believing in a god without going through the rituals is still being religious---and lazy. Without religion, none of you "spiritual, but not religious people wouldn't even believe in god....because there would be no god without religion. 

Ain't no god, ain' t no afterlife either. i just do what i can with the few years i got left.


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## diemdepyro (Jan 8, 2009)

humblesmurph said:


> Without religion, none of you "spiritual, but not religious people wouldn't even believe in god....because there would be no god without religion.
> 
> Ain't no god, ain' t no afterlife either. i just do what i can with the few years i got left.


WTF is that? Translate please!


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## diemdepyro (Jan 8, 2009)

LOL God is always before religion.
That is the problem people put religion before God and mold him to their beliefs.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Jan 8, 2009)

Everybody wants to go to heaven, but no one wants to die.


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## humblesmurph (Jan 8, 2009)

diemdepyro said:


> LOL God is always before religion.
> That is the problem people put religion before God and mold him to their beliefs.



Sure, you are taught that God is above religion--which he is of course. However, god as the concept we think of today didn't come before religion chronologically.


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## diemdepyro (Jan 8, 2009)

I do not know what we think yesterday so I can not agree or disagree.


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## CrackerJax (Jan 8, 2009)

Feel free to worship my avatar .. the true power over all of your lives .. and that's a no shit.



out.


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## WhatAmIDoing (Jan 10, 2009)

"heaven" is just a term. christianity makes a lot of sense in a certain respect: when it didn't matter so much, you just needed to live your life to live it well, and stay under control of some certain warring faction (king, queen, knight, duke, earl, w/e): speculation.


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## misshestermoffitt (Jan 10, 2009)

I just try to do the right thing. It's not a religion, it's a way of life for me. If I'm putting on a holiday dinner and I find out someone doesn't have anything to do for the holiday, then I set them a place at the table. 

I just think people should try to help each other a little more. It's not that much effort.


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## diemdepyro (Jan 10, 2009)

Yes I am a sucker for the human condition also......freaking life forms...


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## CrackerJax (Jan 10, 2009)

Sorry, I can't do that without a book. 


out.


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## a brasileira (Jan 10, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> Uhhhh, can you spot the trouble?
> 
> 
> Yo Bra
> ...


i don't think we invented God...we just define the ultimite force of life in the universe and CALL it "god". sure we make it look like us (if one is into idols and statues like me), because it helps us to see the divinity in everything (as part of the divine "spark" if you will.), especially in ourselves, and it helps us to connect with life, and to realize that we control our destinies, blah blah blah.

i don't think any of us is smart per se...except for the ones who realize that they are not.


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## CrackerJax (Jan 10, 2009)

So if we don't put the image of man in G*D we can't sense the divinity? I don't buy that.

of course you are missing the entire engine which produces "G*D", and that is death. It's a knee jerk response from a smart ape, nothing more.






out.


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## a brasileira (Jan 10, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> So if we don't put the image of man in G*D we can't sense the divinity? I don't buy that.
> 
> of course you are missing the entire engine which produces "G*D", and that is death. It's a knee jerk response from a smart ape, nothing more.
> 
> ...


good point. i guess what i mean is that having images helps many people to relate to that life force.

and i don't see anything wrong with worship of God being a result of the fear of death...for many who fear, God is just as real as death...

and as far as smart apes go...
different conversation.
:-]


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## CrackerJax (Jan 10, 2009)

If worship to assuage your fear of death was strictly a private matter and a wholly personal one, I might agree. However, most religions use the concept of building control through the populations of their particular faiths, giving rise to war and violence. 

If there was one PURE definition of G*D known and agreed on by all peoples, I might get on board with that. 

How's that going so far?  Just look to Israel and Palestine and feel the Muslim HATE for another religion.

I might have to take back the smart ape comment 


out.


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## a brasileira (Jan 10, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> If worship to assuage your fear of death was strictly a private matter and a wholly personal one, I might agree. However, most religions use the concept of building control through the populations of their particular faiths, giving rise to war and violence.
> 
> If there was one PURE definition of G*D known and agreed on by all peoples, I might get on board with that.
> 
> ...


my religious/spiritual views ARE strictly personal, i've never stood on a street corner ordering people to "yield their hearts to the words of the omnipotent Goddess!".

it is wrong when people use their "religion" to control others: however, that's not what pure religion is all about...it should be about connecting with divinity, about understanding your place in the universe...and sadly, religions that have good intentions have largely turned into political powerhouses and nothing more.

yea man, i have a huge problem with the way islam has turned out...i have my issues with it, specifically the violence that is manifesting all around the world, but especially in the middle east amongst their own people (religious-wise).


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## the beekeepers (Jan 10, 2009)

a brasileira said:


> i don't think we invented God...we just define the ultimite force of life in the universe and CALL it "god". sure we make it look like us (if one is into idols and statues like me), because it helps us to see the divinity in everything (as part of the divine "spark" if you will.), especially in ourselves, and it helps us to connect with life, and to realize that we control our destinies, blah blah blah.
> 
> i don't think any of us is smart per se...except for the ones who realize that they are not.


Brilliant! Very eloquent and very concise but more humbling is the level of enlightenment revealed. 

"there is nothing better than to know you don't know" _*Tao Te Ching *_~Lao Tzu


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## a brasileira (Jan 10, 2009)

the beekeepers said:


> Brilliant! Very eloquent and very concise but more humbling is the level of enlightenment revealed.
> 
> "there is nothing better than to know you don't know" _*Tao Te Ching *_~Lao Tzu


right on, brotha.


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## robert 14617 (Jan 10, 2009)

i still love pepsi cola............


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## diemdepyro (Jan 10, 2009)

I drink Dr. pepper its medicine ....right.....do not make me get up!


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## Stoney McFried (Jan 10, 2009)

When I was a kid, I thought George Burns was what God looked like....


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## misshestermoffitt (Jan 10, 2009)

Of course you did, he was in that movie "Oh God" that probably had something to do with it. I can agree, if there was a god, he'd look like George Burns, and I'd hope he'd have George's sense of humor too.


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## Stoney McFried (Jan 10, 2009)

Yeah, that would be nice, lol.


misshestermoffitt said:


> Of course you did, he was in that movie "Oh God" that probably had something to do with it. I can agree, if there was a god, he'd look like George Burns, and I'd hope he'd have George's sense of humor too.


----------



## YoungClover (Jan 12, 2009)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> This being a weed forum and all, I am ubber-curious whatall kinda spiritualities lurk about here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I am Agnostic, I really don't believe anything, it seems that nothing really seems to stick, but nothing doesn't work either, if that makes sense.

I plan on a career in software or game development, My main non work related hobbies are growing(of course), Gaming(I think that counts as one) and destroying entire continents with my eyes.

I am a pothead and tried salvia and shrooms, but I didn't like the loss of control so I won't be doing anything but pot ever again.


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## mr.red (Feb 16, 2009)

I am here to attempt to resurrect this thread.

I never post on here, but I just had to after reading all 62 pages of this amazing thread.

Personally.

I don't know. 

I truly believe no one ever will.

I like string theory, you know, the idea of everything being made up of tiny little strings vibrating at different frequencies.

Though I suppose a scientific theory can be somewhat like a belief system...


BUT

I keep it simple, I go back to worshipping the sun.

I can see it.

Without it I would die.

And if I pray to it I have the same odds of my prayers getting answered as any other religion. (poorly paraphrasing george carlin)

I remember a bit ago someone talking about the micro/macrocosm.

I actually understood what he meant... I think

The idea is actually fairly simple, and can be summed up by saying the same laws the govern the universe govern something as small as our cells.. atoms.. quarks etc.


And the only way I can see any kind of "god" in there is that god is simply the way nature works. (science)

And, even with science we still have trouble trying to explain certain things.

Which is why those crazy religions are still there.

But I go back to what I said before..

I don't know, no one does.

The possibilities are infinite for the concept of a god or afterlife, our brains cannot comprehend what it might be like.

Then again there is always the possibility that there is nothing.

I don't like people that seem they are certain either way.

You have to think logically. 

Lack of proof is not proof for nonexistence.

ie. There is no proof of unicorns... therefore they do not exist

Sorry, logically, it is a fallacy.

If it worked that way, I say there is not constitution.

Because I have never seen it in person, only heard about it.


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## Volcanus (Feb 16, 2009)

Nihilist.


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## TeaTreeOil (Feb 16, 2009)

Secular humanist. Also a *strong* atheist(I claim there are no gods, and those who believe in such things are uhm... haha, I don't want to be mean). I recognize that all gods we 'know of' have been created by humans and inherit their(human) fallacies.

Truly, a god would represent himself(herself, it self). Yes? Why rely on 'pitiful'/imperfect humans? That makes absolutely no sense! If I were a god with absolute dogma I'd be sure to make it personally known to all I 'tend to'.

No afterlife, no 'separate but tangled soul'. No heaven, no hell. No moral distinctions(good vs evil) beyond 'do no harm'. If only we could all live up to such a simple three-word ideal. Instead it becomes 'do as little harm as possible'. It sadly becomes even worse... heavily worded, hypocritical, bullshit, and ultimately nonsensical. No 'mind', there's only a physical BRAIN.

If I drill a hole into your head(or lobotomize)... you surely will not be the same. I don't see any reason to believe(have faith) in that which is unprovable.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 16, 2009)

Wow. Suprised this thread is still livin.

To TeaTree- Hay, lets not put down trepannin now. That mite have 'deeper' implications.

Substring theory, alternate universes and dark matter have just been 'spiritually' dealt with by my MOST favest of ALL authors, Phillip Pullman. Love his stuff. I have gone a little nuts over his stuff, actually.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 17, 2009)

I posted earlier on another thread about evolution and lactose intolerance (connected??? yes they are ) so, I'll put the same logic to work here...

Man is still in the process of evolution, and by some measures we are accelerating. 

About 50k years ago, most all humans were lactose intolerance once out of childhood. Evolution dictated that you did not need milk for nutrition after a certain age. but a funny thing happened on the way to the buffalo hunt....a mutation occurred in some of the population, an allele shifted and humans started to become tolerant of milk through adulthood. This gave these "mutated" humans a distinct advantage as they were then capable of drawing far more calories from a single cow via milk and eventually the meat, whereas the 'regular" humans could only eat the cow once. All other things being equal, the "mutated" humans replaced MOST of the "regular" humans. So when you meet someone who is lactose intolerant, you are meeting a "regular" human, a throw back.

Huh? What does this have to do with faith?  

Okay, In using the same methodology of mutation, it is conceivable that Agnostic/Atheism is the "mutation" and the Religious are the "regulars". It will take time but eventually as science peels the onion (tears for the faithful), athiesm/agniosticism will increase to displace the folks who believe in superstition. 

At some point we will grow up and face the reality of our situation.

We don't know who created all of this. We don't know the purpose. We don't know if there is an after life.

I for one am content to not know, as opposed to just filling in whatever i need to feel good....even if it is absolutely wrong. 


out.


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## TeaTreeOil (Feb 17, 2009)

Everyone is born atheist!

Then there's, &#8220;I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours.&#8221; - Stephen Roberts

The universe was never created. Similarly it will never be destroyed. Everything is energy. Matter is just condensed energy. They're both subject to laws of conservation. Never lost, merely transient.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 17, 2009)

In the end some people need the fairy tale, that's all..... 

We didn't climb out of the trees that long ago you know... work in progress we are... the next model will be much improved.

out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 17, 2009)

While I don't discredit one bit of evolution, or Darwin, there is not one point I disagree on. 

I just don't see why, if humans have evolved as 'animals' do, aren't we having bunnies and/or SOME other species doin some cave paintings and shit......

Other animals are just as they were when thier species developed and florished. Other animals create a symbiotic balance with themselves and thier surrounding environment. But not humans. Why? And why aren't other animals developing written language, technology, ect.

It ain't like humans aint' tryin to help them along, but they ain't pickin up on it......

Why have humans developed and not other animals?




The only problem I would have with 'atheism' as it is usually promoted, and with as much dogma and intolerance as any religious zealot, is the idea that there was nothing, and that nothing happened to nothing, and then nothing magically exploded for no reason, creating everything, and then a bunch of everything magically rearranged itself for no reason whatsoever into self-replicating bits which then turned into dinosaurs.

Makes perfect sense.



While I don't take the delusions of religion, I also don't think science has all the answers either. Tho they certainly have discovered alot, and explained alot, they are still missing alot, and it didn't just start existing cuz science just figgered it out. An absolute belief in science is as arrogant and delusional as any religious zealot, and they miss just as much as those they like to look down on so much.

Just my opinion, of course.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 17, 2009)

it's called species pressure. if you haven't noticed we have left no habitat untouched (ever wonder why?) Our hard wired brains give us the incentive to decimate any competition.

What do you think would happen to that poor bunny once man perceived a threat to his dominance? BANG!!! No more worries.... 

Animals need not exude any inherently advanced mutations to be wiped out...just getting in the way of our plans is enough to spell their doom...


out.


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## TeaTreeOil (Feb 17, 2009)

No offense, puff, but it's those kind of opinions which were responsible for the dark ages.

All the energy that ever was and ever will be is equal to the energy right at this moment, and every moment. Loss and gain are trade-offs(one does not happen without the other). Burn a piece of paper, you get ash, you say that ash is less than the paper was. You're right. But that ash PLUS the energy released from burning it is equal to that original paper. Plants don't grow without nutrients, water, air, and light. The sum of the plant is equal to that which went into creating it. 

I personally believe that, like every physical law, evolution a natural occurrence just like planets, moons, and stars, galaxies, gravity, etc.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 17, 2009)

If one digs deep enough down to the atomic level...we are not actually one person, but an almagamation of atoms under agreement to be YOU. When your life force has been spent, theirs will not be (the atoms)...but merely "agree" to be something else. So in a sense you are not you.... only in a strictly temporary condition of sentience. The atoms can finally look in the mirror and say...oh WE are wondrous indeed....and then enter a beauty pageant or somethin... 


out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 17, 2009)

To TeaTree-

What makes you think we ain't in the Dark Ages now, my enlightened freind?


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 17, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> If one digs deep enough down to the atomic level...we are not actually one person, but an almagamation of atoms under agreement to be YOU. When your life force has been spent, theirs will not be (the atoms)...but merely "agree" to be something else. So in a sense you are not you.... only in a strictly temporary condition of sentience. The atoms can finally look in the mirror and say...oh WE are wondrous indeed....and then enter a beauty pageant or somethin...
> 
> 
> out.


No, to quote Fight Club we are the all singing, all dancing crap of the universe.

You are starting to sound a little mystical, there, CJ. Careful now. You wouldn't wanna find some MEANING in so much meaningless chaos, now would you.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnriAm3FoAA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvRKB0yLuoI&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F65k4sfxVN4&feature=related

(sorry 'bout the links, still can't imbed a friggin youtube vid....)


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## TeaTreeOil (Feb 17, 2009)

...

That's all I got to say. We're all one, right? So you should know what that ellipsis means... A clue: it sure isn't agreement.


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## changalang (Feb 17, 2009)

i'm agnostic.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 17, 2009)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> No, to quote Fight Club we are the all singing, all dancing crap of the universe.
> 
> You are starting to sound a little mystical, there, CJ. Careful now. You wouldn't wanna find some MEANING in so much meaningless chaos, now would you.....
> 
> ...


Only the atoms have the means to find the true meaning of life. 
I'm fairly convinced, much to my consternation, it's not one of their objectives...  
No, my nihilism is quite intact tyvm  if my atoms spill the real beans, I'll let you know...


out.


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## WhatAmIDoing (Feb 17, 2009)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> While I don't discredit one bit of evolution, or Darwin, there is not one point I disagree on.
> 
> I just don't see why, if humans have evolved as 'animals' do, aren't we having bunnies and/or SOME other species doin some cave paintings and shit......
> 
> ...


Hey puff.

While you argue that humans are trying to help other animals understand things the way we do, why are we not trying to understand things the way other animals do?

Is it because we are "better" than them?


----------



## WhatAmIDoing (Feb 17, 2009)

TeaTreeOil said:


> All the energy that ever was and ever will be is equal to the energy right at this moment, and every moment. Loss and gain are trade-offs(one does not happen without the other). Burn a piece of paper, you get ash, you say that ash is less than the paper was. You're right. But that ash PLUS the energy released from burning it is equal to that original paper. Plants don't grow without nutrients, water, air, and light. The sum of the plant is equal to that which went into creating it.
> 
> I personally believe that, like every physical law, evolution a natural occurrence just like planets, moons, and stars, galaxies, gravity, etc.



Energy can be created and destroyed. Each "transition" of energy is a process of creation and destruction. If it cannot be created, then how is it here? 

(If you say, it's just one of those mystical aspects of life, that's cool w/me. But then, just don't try to disprove or discredit the belief in god, for that is the same belief.)

I feel that energy can both be created and destroyed; that energy is _everything_, and all of it is simply evidence of it's constant motion. Motion can also be evident in its absence. Newton called it "inertia". 

Transition is the loss of one, and creation of another. Thus, it is both creation and destruction, and the creation and destruction is thereby possibly by the constraints of science's own parameters.


----------



## TeaTreeOil (Feb 17, 2009)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_of_energy


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## WhatAmIDoing (Feb 17, 2009)

dude, i am all sorts of familiar with the scientific aspects of all this stuff. I grew up with my parents teaching me this stuff (my mom being a chemist/biologist and my dad a physicist). That doesn't make what I said untrue.


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## TeaTreeOil (Feb 17, 2009)

The second sentence: "A consequence of this law is that energy cannot be created or destroyed."

Yes, that's the opposite of what you said, "I feel that energy can both be created and destroyed; that energy is everything, and all of it is simply evidence of it's constant motion."


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## We Love 1 (Feb 17, 2009)

I believe in Jesus Christ/God. 

I believe science is the discovery/explanation of Gods ways.

I believe that I'm going to go to heaven after I die and have eternal life with Him!

I believe that everyone is special otherwise they wouldn't be born.

I believe that life is just a test for Our spirits, in the human body.

I believe that We are all connected in some way shape or form.

I believe in Love, peace, unity, justice, rightousness and prosperity. 

I believe Jesus/God loves Us all.

I believe and therefor I speak.

~PEACE~


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## WhatAmIDoing (Feb 17, 2009)

TeaTreeOil said:


> The second sentence: "A consequence of this law is that energy cannot be created or destroyed."
> 
> Yes, that's the opposite of what you said, "I feel that energy can both be created and destroyed; that energy is everything, and all of it is simply evidence of it's constant motion."



So you decide to believe somebody who told you something. That's fine. They can both be equally true. 

The greatest proof (for me) that energy can be created is its existence.


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## hom36rown (Feb 17, 2009)

They cannot be euqally true....energry is not created or destroyed


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## hom36rown (Feb 17, 2009)

We Love 1 said:


> I believe in Jesus Christ/God.
> 
> I believe science is the discovery/explanation of Gods ways.
> 
> ...


why jesus, why not mohammed, or vishnu


----------



## CrackerJax (Feb 17, 2009)

It's no coincidence that most religions desire the children to be indoctrinated at a young age. Imagine being sat down by your parents at the age of 15 or so and told these religious stories...  GTFO~!!!!! the kid would say..... ahh get'em while they are young and willing to believe anything...... 


out.


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## We Love 1 (Feb 17, 2009)

I do believe energy was ONCE created, that was the big bang. Gods creation.

After that I don't believe energy can be created or destroyed.

But it would seem like energy can be created through nuclear reactions when converting mass into energy. A tiny amount of mass can create an enormous amount of energy. If a glass of water was converted into pure energy by combining it with its anti matter it would probably be able to power the worlds electricity needs for 10 years or so.

You know whats cool, that the Earth is actually growing from absorbing the Suns energy and stardust. So gravity is never constant, its always slightly increasing proportional to the amount of added mass to Earth. But it would seem insignificant over the course of an average humans life.


----------



## We Love 1 (Feb 17, 2009)

hom36rown said:


> why jesus, why not mohammed, or vishnu


Whos the person in your avatar?

Are you a poser? 

Why sport around Jesus for your avatar when you don't believe?


----------



## TeaTreeOil (Feb 17, 2009)

WhatAmIDoing said:


> So you decide to believe somebody who told you something. That's fine. They can both be equally true.
> 
> The greatest proof (for me) that energy can be created is its existence.





hom36rown said:


> They cannot be euqally true....energry is not created or destroyed


I'm going to have to 'believe' home36rown on this one.



We Love 1 said:


> I do believe energy was ONCE created, that was the big bang. Gods creation.
> 
> After that I don't believe energy can be created or destroyed.
> 
> ...


But that energy could also conversely create that water. No net energy is lost. No net energy is created. Both sides of the equation are equal. It's equal exchange. The form has changed... like money.... Five dollar bills is equal to a single five-dollar bill(not in paper, obviously, but in value).

I use matter and convert it into energy all the time via digestion... the end product is I'm still alive and the excrement is flowing.

Gods are defined with terms like omnipotent, omniscience, omnipresent, etc. These are all infinite attributes. There's is never a way to balance the 'equation'. Infinity is an idea. Using it in math leads to erroneous results. There is no infinite amount of ANYTHING in the universe. Using infinity one can make all kind of illogical statements.

For example, if we state that anything divided by itself is 1...

where i=infinity:
i/i=1

That seems alright... but wait.

(i + i) / i = 1

Ok, sure i + i = i.. so simplified: i/i is still 1, and 1=1!

But wait... we can now split that fraction.

i/i + i/i = 1 or simplified: 2=1 or even 3=1 etc... You can make anything equal anything!! Regardless of equivalence.

Lets try it a different way:

i * 1/i = 1

That looks good, for any number x... x * 1/x = 1.

1/i is .0000...1 which converges to zero. See, if there was an infinite amount of something... then there'd be nothing else. That 1 doesn't exist. Those zeros are infinite. If you manually attempted to solve this you'd never reach an answer. You'd never be able to finish!

Anyway, so:

i * 0 = 1

Now we're really fucked! Do we go with the rule anything times infinity is infinity... or anything times zero is zero?! Either way this equation fails.


----------



## We Love 1 (Feb 17, 2009)

TeaTreeOil said:


> But that energy could also conversely create that water. No net energy is lost. *No net energy is created.* Both sides of the equation are equal.


Exactly right! 

I didn't say any energy was created. I said "*But it would seem* like energy can be created". The key word is "seem". It *seems* like energy is created when converting mass into energy.

I'd rather take the energy/electricity from a nuclear power plant over a piece of uranium. It SEEMS like energy is just created from a piece of rock. But its proportional to E=MC^2. 

C^2 is a BIG number. 



TeaTreeOil said:


> There is no infinite amount of ANYTHING in the universe. Using infinity one can make all kind of illogical statements.


There is infinite space, time and Gods love! 

Prove Me wrong!


----------



## We Love 1 (Feb 17, 2009)

hom36rown said:


> why jesus, why not mohammed, or vishnu


I believe Gods Son is reincarnated at every new age, which is ~2150 years or so. A new age is a change in the Zodiac sign.

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=zeitgeist&emb=0&aq=0&oq=zeig#

If You watch the first part of Zeigeist You will realize that these "Gods" all have the same things in common, just different names. You can either believe that these people are either fictional or were real. 

I believe Jesus was the last time Gods Son visited the Earth, and I've read about Him so I love Him because I believe He is My heavenly Father. He was the Lamb of God. He came to show Us how much He/God loves Us to the extreme of dying on a cross.

Theres a reason why so many people are Christian, thats because Jesus Christ was/is real. 

So thats My rationale. Does that make sense to You?


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## stonerboy (Feb 17, 2009)

illusionz1 said:


> Well, raised catholic... dating a preacher's daughter throughout high school... I think I've learned to think for myself and with an open mind and the closest thing I think I could be able to illustrate a "Faith" is Taoism.


Taoism requires no faith, only an understanding of the laws of nature and the universe.


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## hom36rown (Feb 17, 2009)

We Love 1 said:


> Theres a reason why so many people are Christian, that because Jesus Christ was/is real.
> 
> So that My rationale. Does that make sense to You?


oh so you believe it because a lot of other people believe...I get it. So you just go along with everyone else with no real reasoning behind it. Funny how you throw the word sheep around so much.


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## We Love 1 (Feb 17, 2009)

hom36rown said:


> oh so you believe it because a lot of other people believe....


Jesus is real. No doubt about it. If You don't believe than its your loss buddy.

Same as George Washington was real except Jesus is Lord and lives eternally.

"*Whos the person in your avatar*?

Are you a poser? 

Why sport around Jesus for your avatar when you don't believe?

"


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## hom36rown (Feb 17, 2009)

if you'll look closely you'll hes on a dollar bill, you know, mocking christianity. Also its an album cover...notcie how it says dead kennedys at the top. It was called in god we trust inc.


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## hom36rown (Feb 17, 2009)

jesus may or may not have been real, but how do you know he is the son of god. How do you know Mohammada is not a profit, or joseph smith, or that vishnu isnt a real god, or zeus. Why do you believe in chriastianity's fairytale but not the other ones.


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## We Love 1 (Feb 17, 2009)

hom36rown said:


> jesus may or may not have been real,
> 
> Why do you believe in chriastianity's fairytale but not the other ones.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A.D.

*Anno Domini* (sometimes spelled _Anno Domine_, abbreviated as *AD* or *A.D.*) and *Before Christ* (abbreviated as *BC* or *B.C.*) are designations used to number years in the Julian and Gregorian calendars. The calendar era that they refer to is based on the traditionally reckoned year of the conception or birth of Jesus Christ, with *AD* denoting years after the start of this epoch, and *BC* denoting years before the start of this epoch. There is no year zero in this scheme, so the year AD 1 immediately follows the year 1 BC.



*The whole world bases their time on the birth of Jesus Christ. *

*So I can conclude that unless the whole world is basing their dates and time on a nonexisting person than I'll be glad to admit that I'm wrong about Jesus too.*


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## hom36rown (Feb 17, 2009)

That is not proof of his existence, but thats irrelevenat. Like I said he may be a real person, but what leads you to believe he is the son of god?


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 18, 2009)

WhatAmIDoing said:


> Hey puff.
> 
> While you argue that humans are trying to help other animals understand things the way we do, why are we not trying to understand things the way other animals do?
> 
> Is it because we are "better" than them?


I do think that we are NOT better than animals. Personally, I don't see them stealin each other's young and raping them and cutting them into bits for kicks, pretty good sign they are better than us actually.

But I train horses, and while I am sure most humans are preoccupied with purse brands and Tommy Fuckin Hillfinger, I am not. I DO understand why animals function as they do (no 'try' to it) and I am a very good horse trainer cuz I work in the parameters of the animals' psychology.


But most humans don't think humans are animals. I do, which is why I don't understand why other animals aren't 'evolving' as we are, if the process is so, erhm, 'natural'...............


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 18, 2009)

We Love 1 said:


> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A.D.
> 
> *Anno Domini* (sometimes spelled _Anno Domine_, abbreviated as *AD* or *A.D.*) and *Before Christ* (abbreviated as *BC* or *B.C.*) are designations used to number years in the Julian and Gregorian calendars. The calendar era that they refer to is based on the traditionally reckoned year of the conception or birth of Jesus Christ, with *AD* denoting years after the start of this epoch, and *BC* denoting years before the start of this epoch. There is no year zero in this scheme, so the year AD 1 immediately follows the year 1 BC.
> 
> ...


It is well known that that designation was set up by a church-and-state-run operation, called the ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH, and up till recently scholars were nice enuff to use it.

THere is NO historical, archeological data to support ANYTHING in the Bible. That is one of the main reasons that Before Common Era is used rather than BC, it has long been known that it is not a specific time reference, reguardless of what term you use.

And I for one find your attitude VERY offensive, as would Christ. His message was NEVER used to put down, or attack, or judge, and since YOU have used it so it is YOU who will be up for a heavenly ass reamin, for someone using 'love' in your avatar you have a LOOOOOOOOOONG way to go to learn what it truly means. You shame the name of Jesus with your hate and intolerance.


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## TeaTreeOil (Feb 18, 2009)

We Love 1 said:


> Exactly right!
> 
> I didn't say any energy was created. I said "*But it would seem* like energy can be created". The key word is "seem". It *seems* like energy is created when converting mass into energy.
> 
> ...


If space where infinite there would be only space. I use to think like that(back in HS, even). Remember how .000...1 (infinite zeros, followed by a 1, or million or billions, etc... doesn't matter we never 'reach' it) equals zero? It's the same exact case. Infinite space... and that 1(matter/energy) doesn't exist!

Time was created based on observation of Earth's revolution and rotation. I suspect that this will eventually end.... So time in that sense is not infinite. Time in the universe (Planck time) is not infinite either, it may 'tend to' infinite, but being a really, really, really, really, really(ok, you got the point) massive quantity, versus infinity... is like comparing apples and oranges. You still have an infinite amount between any finite amount and infinite amount. That is: infinity minus 9,999,999,999,999,999..(ends eventually) = infinity.

I've never understood this concept people refer to as 'God's love'. When a serial killer strikes again... is that 'God's love'? When parents refuse to seek medical help for their daughter and choose to pray instead... and their daughter dies... is that 'God's love'? When a rapist gets his 'fix'... is that 'God's love'? How about pedophiles? When America decides to bomb (read: Shock and Awe, Bush put it) a nation and then civilians... innocent men, women, and children die horribly... is that 'God's love'? If slavery is more prolific than any time in known history and most of them are children... is that 'God's love'? When humans are treated like property and bought and sold for numerous unsavory reasons.... Where the fuck is this 'God's love'?! Why are all the bad things in life attributed to Man. While all the good things get attributed to God?! Your double-standard is fallacious!

"I pushed-a button and elected him to office and-a he pushed a buttoned and-a dropped the bomb. You pushed-a button and can watch it on the television. Those motha fuckas didn't last too long.... Trading in my god for this war, and he signs his name with a capitol G." - NIN - Capitol G

Ultimate creator... ultimate responsibility. Ultimate foresight. According to believers in this perfect all-powerful being called God(Yehwah, Allah, Zeus, whatever). Then by extension all of his creation is also perfect. Or can your god falter, make mistakes... act 'human'? I must ask you a question. Then why call it God?

"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" -Epicurus

Come on! His first mistake was clearly a talking snake.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 18, 2009)

Sorry to inform we love, but there are no references to Jesus other than using the Bible as a source.

Who wrote the bible? Names please? When was it written? Dates please? There is not a single eyewitness account of Jesus in the bible that is not hear say. Not one.


I'm very very sure George Washington existed. Jesus is a myth until anyone can prove otherwise..... I'm waiting.

Energy can only be transformed, not destroyed. This is making me pissed at the publik skool system.... folks, this is 6th grade stuff when I was in school. 


out.


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## We Love 1 (Feb 18, 2009)

There is most def infinite time and space. 

What was before the "begginning of time"? 

Where does space end, and whats beyond that?

I beleive time = space, which is infinite.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 18, 2009)

Since we have not developed the scientific knowledge to unravel the co relationship intertwining time and space, nothing can be stated with certainty,.....only time will tell.. . Something for future generations to work out...long after our atoms have dispersed and transformed.


out.


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## TeaTreeOil (Feb 18, 2009)

Time is not days, weeks, etc(we define this amounts based on rates, rotations and revolutions).This sort of time is based on time as a *rate of change*. It's like gravity is a rate of attraction between masses, light decay rates as distance increases, etc. It's neither constant or infinite. It may be applied infinitely(always has, always will, as far as we know) like gravity, etc.. that is, so long as the universe has existed time has existed with(in) it. To call gravity itself infinite would require infinite mass.

If time(amount, as we measure days/hours/etc) were infinite there'd be no distinction between one moment and another(no relativity). Things would never change. Now this amount tending towards infinity is a whole nother matter. It's still quantifiable, and distinctions are possible.


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## We Love 1 (Feb 18, 2009)

TeaTreeOil said:


> Time is not days, weeks, etc(we define this amounts based on rates, rotations and revolutions).This sort of time is based on time as a *rate of change*. It's like gravity is a rate of attraction between masses, light decay rates as distance increases, etc. It's neither constant or infinite. It may be applied infinitely(always has, always will, as far as we know) like gravity, etc.. that is, so long as the universe has existed time has existed with(in) it. To call gravity itself infinite would require infinite mass.
> 
> If time(amount, as we measure days/hours/etc) were infinite there'd be no distinction between one moment and another(no relativity). Things would never change. Now this amount tending towards infinity is a whole nother matter. It's still quantifiable, and distinctions are possible.


As long as there has been space there has been time. Even before the big bang there was space and therefor time. Even if all the stars in the sky burnt out, there would still be infinite space and therefor infinite time.



TeaTreeOil said:


> Time is not days, weeks, etc


Yes it is, measurements of time. *Time is a component of a measuring system* used to sequence events, to compare the durations of events and the intervals between them, and to quantify the motions of objects. The rate/quantity that We measure time is in seconds, hours, days, weeks, etc.



TeaTreeOil said:


> To call gravity itself infinite would require infinite mass.


I never implied that gravity is infinite. If something had infinite gravity than it would be a point of singularity with everything in it. Hard to imagine.




TeaTreeOil said:


> If time(amount, as we measure days/hours/etc) were infinite there'd be no distinction between one moment and another(no relativity)..


There are infinite numbers but yet We are still able to measure things inbetween the infinites, and the same holds true to time.

We can pick out any number between the infinites and use that as a reference point. Just as We used the birth of Jesus Christ to start Our current dating system inbetween the everlasting flow of time.

If time was an eternal flow of water in a stream, We would only be able to measure how much has passed since We picked a referance point somewhere inbetween. Than We would effectivly be able to measure the flow of time from this point. But any amount of measured time will be nil compared to the everlasting flow. Just as any number compared to infinity is nil.


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## mr.red (Feb 18, 2009)

Hmmm...

Even though energy cannot be created or destroyed that does not mean that time has always existed.

The energy that we now see as time could have been something else before "space-time" was created (transformed)

AND seeing as we can measure how large our universe is.. I am pretty sure it is not infinite... and since space is not infinite time cannot be either.

Just remember that the energy that makes up our universe might not have always been in the forms we see them now, but in different forms, and over time were transformed into the concepts we see now in our universe.

and Puff.. in regard to the evolution of animals thing... perhaps animals have finished evolving, and that is why they do not chop up their young and such... we just have a long way to go


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## hom36rown (Feb 18, 2009)

We Love 1 said:


> As long as there has been space there has been time. Even before the big bang there was space and therefor time. Even if all the stars in the sky burnt out, there would still be infinite space and therefor infinite time.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I see you just blew off my question. BAAAAAA


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## We Love 1 (Feb 18, 2009)

mr.red said:


> AND seeing as we can measure how large our universe is.. I am pretty sure it is not infinite... and since space is not infinite time cannot be either.


We can measure the expanse of matter into space-time. 

The matter of Our know universe is expanding into the infinite amounts of space-time.

Whos to say there wasn't another big bang trillions of trillions of trillions of etc light years aways from Our known universe? 

Just as there are + billions of galaxies in Our "known universe", there could be billions of "unknown universes" in the infinite space-time. When I say "know universe" I am referring to the edges of know matter in Our + billion galaxy big bang.

So there could be big bangs taking place all the time in parts of space that are in unfathomable (and unreachable) parts of infinite space.

Our known universe compared to the unknown universe could be like a cell compared the rest of the known universe.


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## Brazko (Feb 18, 2009)

We Love 1 said:


> We can measure the expanse of matter into space-time.
> 
> The matter of Our know universe is expanding into the infinite amounts of space-time.
> 
> ...


Yes!!....and Possibly only A thought


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## WhatAmIDoing (Feb 18, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> Energy can only be transformed, not destroyed. This is making me pissed at the publik skool system.... folks, this is 6th grade stuff when I was in school.
> 
> 
> out.


Yeah. Like I said. I've been told this before. I don't believe it. I've been told a lot of things i don't believe.
Just because someone in school tells you so, doesn't make it true.


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## TeaTreeOil (Feb 18, 2009)

We Love 1 said:


> As long as there has been space there has been time. Even before the big bang there was space and therefor time. Even if all the stars in the sky burnt out, there would still be infinite space and therefor infinite time.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


So you can quote Wikipedia as your own words...

Nice job. Demonstrates your lack of understanding. Time to humans is not the same as 'the universal law of time'. That's my point. It is _derived_ from the law.

Big bang is a theory. What was before it, if it happened, it unknowable. Regardless, prior to it is meaningless. To state the universe existed before 'Big Bang'(for any amount of time) is meaningless. It's unverifiable.

Space _is not_ infinite. Neither is time. Research it!

Infinite is *NOT* a number! It is an idea. Just like these days of which you speak. A day on our planet is not the same as days on other planets. Hours are not the same. Minutes are not the same. Seconds are not the same. We humans created these, not the universe.

There are an infinite amount of numbers between any two numbers that are not equivalent. Like between zero and one. Numbers are ideas in this sense. When numbers are applied to the universe they become much more restricted. You can not divide matter infinitely. There's the atomic(or sub atomic) level which become the smallest possible pieces. Time is the same way. You can only divide a second into so many parts before it becomes meaningless to do so.



> But any amount of measured time will be nil compared to the everlasting flow. Just as any number compared to infinity is nil.


Right!!! That's what I said several posts back.

If it is not nil(null, void, non-existant) then the fact that we exist and experience time as FINITE is proof 'infinite time' does not exist.

I love it when they learn from themselves.


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## TeaTreeOil (Feb 18, 2009)

We Love 1 said:


> We can measure the expanse of matter into space-time.
> 
> The matter of Our know universe is expanding into the infinite amounts of space-time.
> 
> ...


I don't think you understand space-time.

Let me give you an example.

I travel at 1 meter(space) per second(time). That's space-time.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 18, 2009)

WhatAmIDoing said:


> Yeah. Like I said. I've been told this before. I don't believe it. I've been told a lot of things i don't believe.
> Just because someone in school tells you so, doesn't make it true.


Then you should drop out. Also disregard math and languages and economics...only theories and just because it is taught in skool doesn't make them true.... right?  oh my....


You can measure time and space all you want....it doesn't bring you closer to understanding what time and space ARE. Our sciences are not advanced enough to unravel these questions....yet. 


out.


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## We Love 1 (Feb 18, 2009)

TeaTreeOil said:


> I travel at 1 meter(space) per second(time). That's space-time.


Thats speed! HAHA

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed

*Speed* is the rate of motion, or equivalently the rate of change in position: the distance traveled per unit of time.



Space time is like a fabric, they are interwoven.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space-time

In physics, *spacetime* is any mathematical model that combines space and time into a single construct called the *spacetime continuum*. Spacetime is usually interpreted with space being three-dimensional and time playing the role of a fourth dimension that is of a different sort than the spatial dimensions. According to certain Euclidean space perceptions, the universe has three dimensions of space and one dimension of time. By combining space and time into a single manifold, physicists have significantly simplified a large number of physical theories, as well as described in a more uniform way the workings of the universe at both the supergalactic and subatomic levels.
In classical mechanics, the use of Euclidean space instead of spacetime is appropriate, as time is treated as universal and constant, being independent of the state of motion of an observer. In relativistic contexts, however, time cannot be separated from the three dimensions of space, because the rate at which time passes depends on an object's velocity relative to the speed of light and also on the strength of intense gravitational fields which can slow the passage of time.


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## We Love 1 (Feb 18, 2009)

Infinity is the number before it plus one!

That was meant to be a joke for the tight arses.

I'm done refuting moot points. 



hom36rown said:


> BAAAAAA





hom36rown said:


> BAAAAAA





hom36rown said:


> BAAAAAA





hom36rown said:


> BAAAAAA


You said it, not Me! 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBEHFFnV3RY


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## poplars (Feb 18, 2009)

We Love 1 said:


> Thats speed! HAHA
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed
> 
> ...



all I've ever heard you say is bullshit or demonstrates a total lack of a intelligent brain.

thanks for quoting wikipedia but you still haven't shown you have a clue.


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## TeaTreeOil (Feb 18, 2009)

Speed combines space with time... though. Specifically velocity, which actually specifies the direction in space.. over a given time interval. Velocity represents those 4 dimensions.

Again with the lack of comprehension.... while pasting excerpts you clearly don't understand.



> ...as time is treated as universal and constant..


Thanks for agreeing with me.... I guess.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 18, 2009)

When the ABC's of something are not known to a poster...they quickly fill in the gaps with XYZ...thinking it is the same. NOT!!


out.


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## pitchforksandtorches (Feb 18, 2009)

i never played AD&D though i loved the neatness of their alignment system.

i am.. Chaotic/Good

as for the god type stuff, for me it is unimportant. lead a life that is not governed by selfishness, try to leave the world in a better state than how you found it, share your life and feelings with others. if there is a god and he/she/it doesnt like that then he/she/it can piss right off 
whatever i think about gods etc (and my mind does wander, and change), there is much to be gained from exploring religious thought and writings.. the works that have figured largest in my journey are mainly eastern - the dharmapadda (sp?), upanishads, the gita and tao te ching. 
i guess if there is anything i hold above all, then it's nature, but it's no god, just a pure expression of everthing i love


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 18, 2009)

Brazko said:


> Yes!!....and Possibly only A thought


 
Wuddn't let me rep+ ya, but you deserve a raincheck on that one.

Awesome.


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## WhatAmIDoing (Feb 18, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> Then you should drop out. Also disregard math and languages and economics...only theories and just because it is taught in skool doesn't make them true.... right?  oh my....
> 
> 
> You can measure time and space all you want....it doesn't bring you closer to understanding what time and space ARE. Our sciences are not advanced enough to unravel these questions....yet.
> ...


Yeah, that's why when i graduated high school i stopped w/school. it is just theory and inapplicable to real life. unless you consider fabricated life real life. that's just perception too.

I find faith in science faulty. Science was the Earth being flat, then it changed. It was the Earth as the center of the universe, then it changed. These are just a few examples of science's fickleness.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 18, 2009)

Well said, What. That is also an issue I have with science.

First, eggs are bad for you. And we bow and say 'oh mighty scientist in your empirical knowledge you have saved us.' Then they say eggs are good for us. And again we bow and say 'oh mighty scientist in your empirical knowledge you have saved us.' I think eggs are bad for us again, who knows.

Plus, science is as corrupt and money seeking as religion. The results of scientific tests can certainly be swayed by the ones payin for them....

To put your trust in scientists is as ignorant as putting your trust in the preistcraft....


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## AGSteve (Feb 18, 2009)

there is no god as described in the bible. in fact the bible, koran and every other religious book is a waste of space.

logically the universe has to exist somewhere. to those that say it exists in a multiverse then that must also exist somewhere. personally i reckon the real answer to that question will just blow all our minds and is weirder than we can imagine.

as for the after life... i don't think so. when your dead your worm food unless your cremated, in which case your carbon.

i would like to be cremated in a plasma furnace which would break me down into my basic atoms or even better fire me into a black hole.

peace to all. (yeah right you been watchin to much star trek).


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## hom36rown (Feb 18, 2009)

We Love 1 said:


> You said it, not Me!


so then you have no answer. I guess you just thought that was the best sounding fairytale?


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## hom36rown (Feb 18, 2009)

WhatAmIDoing said:


> Yeah, that's why when i graduated high school i stopped w/school. it is just theory and inapplicable to real life. unless you consider fabricated life real life. that's just perception too.
> 
> I find faith in science faulty. Science was the Earth being flat, then it changed. It was the Earth as the center of the universe, then it changed. These are just a few examples of science's fickleness.


No, the earth being flat and the world being the center of the universe were not science, jsut random speculation, science is what proved them to be false. And so what if weve gotten stuff wrong before, that means we should discard it altogether? Thats pretty fucken ridiculous. And Inapplicable to real life???? wow, you gotta be shitting me.


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## AGSteve (Feb 18, 2009)

hom36rown said:


> No, the earth being flat and the world being the center of the universe were not science, jsut random speculation, science is what proved them to be false. And so what if weve gotten stuff wrong before, that means we should discard it altogether? Thats pretty fucken ridiculous. And Inapplicable to real life???? wow, you gotta be shitting me.


touche. they probably believe the world is only 10000 years old, noah loaded up two of every animal, the bible is the word of god. ffs.


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## TeaTreeOil (Feb 18, 2009)

Why the fuck do so many people who have no grasp of science feel like they have some authority on the subject?

Hard sciences require NO faith. Theories can, but are not hard science. Science never made claims such as a flat Earth, it being the center of the Universe, or eggs being bad for you(they're the reference for soluble protein). The, I dare say it, exact opposites of scientists said such things. Those kind of people are called the faithful.

Science changes and evolves. Most religions are monolithic, that is:
"Having a massive, unchanging structure that does not permit individual variation." - http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/monolithic

Or herds of 'mindless robots', applied to the devout followers of such religions.

Not all religions are like this. Some actually encourage critical thinking, rationality, examination, and exploration.


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## We Love 1 (Feb 18, 2009)

TeaTreeOil said:


> Not all religions are like this. Some actually encourage critical thinking, rationality, examination, and exploration.


I believe in the above ^^^ too. I'm not a very religious person, I don't go to church but I do watch Christian shows on TV. I believe in Jesus/God.

I don't believe the bible is 100% factual, but I do believe most of it is true. 

Life is just utterly perplexing, one day Your born, the next thing You know Your a teenager, than you become an adult and eventually die. Do all the memories just fade away, or is there life after death? The world may never know for certain if some people get to go to heaven.


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## TeaTreeOil (Feb 18, 2009)

So.... What have you done for your community this week? How much do you volunteer a month? How much do you write off on your taxes as donations to charity for 2008?

Zero? And you think you're getting into heaven?

*roflmao*


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## CrackerJax (Feb 18, 2009)

WhatAmIDoing said:


> Yeah, that's why when i graduated high school i stopped w/school. it is just theory and inapplicable to real life. unless you consider fabricated life real life. that's just perception too.
> 
> I find faith in science faulty. Science was the Earth being flat, then it changed. It was the Earth as the center of the universe, then it changed. These are just a few examples of science's fickleness.


So you didn't advance your education because of science? Well, you sure showed science didn't you! 


out.


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## AGSteve (Feb 18, 2009)

jebus why have you forsaken me. oh yeah i forgot it must be because i don't believe the eyeball was a divine creation. your asshole however must be because thats where all you god freaks speak from.


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## WhatAmIDoing (Feb 18, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> So you didn't advance your education because of science? Well, you sure showed science didn't you!
> 
> 
> out.


You bet. And that's just the surface of all the bullshit i saw in school. School doesn't require learning, I just thought I'd point that out to you.


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## AGSteve (Feb 18, 2009)

WhatAmIDoing said:


> You bet. And that's just the surface of all the bullshit i saw in school. School doesn't require learning, I just thought I'd point that out to you.


i don't understand your point.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 18, 2009)

WhatAmIDoing said:


> School doesn't require learning, I just thought I'd point that out to you.


Now THAT'S the truth. Unfortunately.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 19, 2009)

Boy, he is sure proving a point!!! It's just not his own point... 


out.


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## WhatAmIDoing (Feb 19, 2009)

AGSteve said:


> i don't understand your point.


All I'm sayin is school is overrated, and just because someone doesn't go to school, or hasn't been to college, doesn't make them stupid. I flew through _high_ school, 14th in a class of 350, reputation as a smart kid from all the teachers, etc. i don't remember jack shit. none of it made much sense to me. In my opinion, school just turns people into little robots. (to a certain degree. obviously, not fully-fledged robots. Those dudes are politicians )


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## WhatAmIDoing (Feb 19, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> Boy, he is sure proving a point!!! It's just not his own point...
> 
> 
> out.


I don't have a point man. ...


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## CrackerJax (Feb 19, 2009)

Get a sharpener man!! 


out.


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## WhatAmIDoing (Feb 20, 2009)

lol. I'll see if i can find one


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 20, 2009)

<pats top of head>

Oh shit, I don't have a point either!


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## CrackerJax (Feb 20, 2009)

Me and my Arrow.... straighter than narrow.


Anyone remember that? 


out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 20, 2009)

I shot an arrow into the air. And where it falls, I do not care......


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## CrackerJax (Feb 20, 2009)

And when I looked up, it parted my hair.....


out.


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## misshestermoffitt (Feb 20, 2009)

it's too bad that hair was down there........


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## CrackerJax (Feb 20, 2009)

Luckily mine's thick, like a bear ....




out.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 20, 2009)

You guys can rhyme! 

Now that's not fair....


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## CrackerJax (Feb 20, 2009)

You'll get the hang of it Puff, don't despair....





out.


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## WhatAmIDoing (Feb 20, 2009)

If you've got pot, I think you should share...


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## CrackerJax (Feb 20, 2009)

WhatAmIDoing said:


> If you've got pot, I think you should share...


Well, for all the talk back and forth about the evils of the man and big business...... weed is treated the exact same way. There's a whole bunch of hypocrisy on these forums. 


You must be out! 


out.


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## TeaTreeOil (Feb 20, 2009)

What? No pastafarians?


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## Stoney McFried (Feb 21, 2009)

I have a seventh grade education.I went back later and got my G.E.D.So I'm living proof that someone can fake intelligence.....Uh, I mean..be intelligent, without a higher education.Yeah.


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## misshestermoffitt (Feb 21, 2009)

I don't need to pay someone 50K to tell me that I know what I know. It's a scam. When you think of all the graduates colleges turn out every year divided by the number of jobs that become available every year, shit just doesn't add up.


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 21, 2009)

I think most people are educated WAYYYY beyond thier intellegence, anyway. Myself included, why I dropped outta med school.......


The depth of my hyprocrisy knows no bounds..... (Val Kilmner said that in a movie, can't remember which one.)


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## Stoney McFried (Feb 21, 2009)

Yeah...college is useless unless you're a tech, or a doctor or some other field requiring a lot of specialized knowledge like that.


misshestermoffitt said:


> I don't need to pay someone 50K to tell me that I know what I know. It's a scam. When you think of all the graduates colleges turn out every year divided by the number of jobs that become available every year, shit just doesn't add up.


Val Kilmer used to be pretty hot.I saw him lately...he's slipping....


puffdamagikdragon said:


> I think most people are educated WAYYYY beyond thier intellegence, anyway. Myself included, why I dropped outta med school.......
> 
> 
> The depth of my hyprocrisy knows no bounds..... (Val Kilmner said that in a movie, can't remember which one.)


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 21, 2009)

I always thought he was cute, but obviously arrogant.

Now Heath Ledger, I coulda eat that boy with a SPOON, and he was sweet and humble, too. Too bad about him.


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## Stoney McFried (Feb 21, 2009)

Sad about him, yes.Never did it for me.I think we all know, since I've said it enough, that Benicio Del Toro is the guy I'd like to rape.


puffdamagikdragon said:


> I always thought he was cute, but obviously arrogant.
> 
> Now Heath Ledger, I coulda eat that boy with a SPOON, and he was sweet and humble, too. Too bad about him.


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## Brazko (Feb 21, 2009)

Stoney McFried said:


> Sad about him, yes.Never did it for me.I think we all know, since I've said it enough, that Benicio Del Toro is the guy I'd like to rape.


 
Ok let's NOt urn theis thread into Girl talk about some Hard Legs....... , but The Dark Knight was tha Shizznit, Ledger actually ruined any following attempts for anyone that tries to play JOKER.......I laugh at all the previous depictions after seeing POETRY like that ...OK OK Ok back to OMMmmm


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## Stoney McFried (Feb 21, 2009)

I still haven't seen it.I'll wait until it's on cable.


Brazko said:


> Ok let's NOt urn theis thread into Girl talk about some Hard Legs....... , but The Dark Knight was tha Shizznit, Ledger actually ruined any following attempts for anyone that tries to play JOKER.......I laugh at all the previous depictions after seeing POETRY like that ...OK OK Ok back to OMMmmm


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## puffdamagikdragon (Feb 22, 2009)

You said it, Brazko. No one will EVER top that performance. 

Oh yeah, back to topic! (Heath, get OUTTA my head! And put some clothes on while you're in there!)

OOooom. OOoommm. Oommmmm, mmm. Mmm zzz. ZZzzzzzzz.


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## misshestermoffitt (Feb 22, 2009)

The Dark Knight wasn't that good. Christian Bales voice as batman was retarded sounding. Yes Ledger played a decent joker, but I think Jack Nicholson was better.


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## Brazko (Feb 23, 2009)

misshestermoffitt said:


> The Dark Knight wasn't that good. Christian Bales voice as batman was retarded sounding. Yes Ledger played a decent joker, but I think Jack Nicholson was better.


Dark Knight was Awesome, the Best one I think since the Newly installments from 89. Jack is the Man, he did do a great job, actually he made that movie what it was as well, however Ledger embodied the role 10x greater. Jack was just being Jack ( 1 flew over the cuckoos nest, shinning).....Jack is Crazy....drugs not included .................

I agree w/ U 110% on that voice thing tho......like a mix b/t (oscar and cookie monster)


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## misshestermoffitt (Feb 23, 2009)

Maybe I'm biased. I've always been a Jack fan, "Wendy........ I'm home......"


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## DR.LEMON (Feb 25, 2009)

puffdamagikdragon said:


> This being a weed forum and all, I am ubber-curious whatall kinda spiritualities lurk about here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


relighion was forced on me as a young lad so i didnt get along to well with the regulor ones... i guess nothing really other than what we all are lol 
maybe buddist bc i dont like violence very much and am out to find that one path of inner peace


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## puffdamagikdragon (Mar 1, 2009)

Thing I like best about Buddhism is you technically aren't worshipping Buddha, just followin his path. You don't worship anything, really. Worship itself just don't sit well with me. Not even the sun, damn thing sets every nite then I am left with nuttin to worship.....




I will admit that Bale with his bad-imitation of Cheney with throat cancer cudda been better. But I gotta admit to being a Christian Bale fan from when he did that movie Empire of the Sun, or Kingdom of the Sun or something. He is a great actor, just didn't like his 'batman' voice. 

And while I will NEVER deny Nicholson's contribution to movies, I have other films Jack did that I liked better than his joker. He was ok, but Heath took it to the next level.

And Heath was STILL sexy, just in a twisted, unpreidictable way. Way sexier than Jack, even from his younger days of The One Who Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest.


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## CrackerJax (Mar 1, 2009)

It was Empire of the Sun and it was an EXCELLENT movie. Bale gave 100% in that film at an incredibly young age. 

"P51 Mustangs!...Cadillac of the skies!!!!"

out.


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## TeaTreeOil (Mar 2, 2009)

Many Buddhists would say they worship the Buddha-nature of all life. That they respect & cherish all life which they consider to have the potential for enlightenment.

This varies from school to school. Some forms are indirect off-shoots of Hinduism, which promotes the Caste system, and that some beings are at different levels of Buddha-nature, and enlightenment is *not* attainable until many rebirths(if ever). I don't care for these sects of Buddhism. Then there's Theravada(the oldest Buddhist school, and diverged from Hinduism) and Nicherien(off-shoot of Mahayana, which maintains the caste system) schools which promote equality of beings and the latter even supports the enlightenment of not only all humans, but all life within a single lifetime.


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## thecool (Mar 5, 2009)

I believe we were created by type IV extra terrestrials with their galactic sized "haydron collider" that caused this 3 dimensional physical and 1 dimensional time universe to be created and put life into it so that we could recycle ZPE energy (your afterlife is your ZPE energy) and to recycle zpe energy you have to be a compassionate loving forgiving person. the point of recycling zpe energy is so that eventually you could enter the chilled universe where you would be outside the 11 dimensions and live for infinite and by live i dont know what i mean but you can get there as a human, thats what type IV extra terrestrials are trying to do using the energy we recycle so that everything can live in peace.













and smoke weed and drop acid.




p.s. hopefully no one thinks im some crazy psycho :S i know this stuff might sound somewhat crazy to someone but seriously if you dont think aliens exist then seriously, i hate to say this, you are a failure. and if aliens exist then the other stuff isnt so far fetched. lol i think thats the first time ive ever sued far fetched.[/quote]

I know there are aliens, this universe is to great for there not to be.


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## CrackerJax (Mar 5, 2009)

I guess I am a semi failure. I certainly believe in life elsewhere, just not that anybody is coming out to no where land to check out some semi smart apes.....that's just your narcissism at work. As soon as we invented the mirror, we were screwed...


out.


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## WhatAmIDoing (Mar 5, 2009)

yeah, nothing against aliens. but they aren't on earth man. why would they be? who cares?we're pretty stupid creatures...


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## CrackerJax (Mar 5, 2009)

WhatAmIDoing said:


> yeah, nothing against aliens. but they aren't on earth man. why would they be? who cares?we're pretty stupid creatures...


yes we certainly are....on the evolutionary scale we just stopped flinging crap at each other from the trees last week.

Now we do the same thing, but we use forums to do it. 


out.


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## parajana (Mar 5, 2009)

well i believe in a creator of course has anyone yet researched the universe and how infinite it is..... its beautiful... we are all uncertain about why we are here where we are going and what was before. but we forget to focus on the giving thats why we feel so empty inside and are always focused on the the physical part of life what about the spiritual part of our lives the giving instead of the taking, putting aside our own egos. it all can change!!!! it is all infinite our bodies are not meant to be forever so use it as a tool. so much more to say this is my gist!!!!


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## Stoney McFried (Mar 5, 2009)

I don't dispute the possibility of aliens, I just don't think they come to earth for tea and anal probe parties.


thecool said:


> I believe we were created by type IV extra terrestrials with their galactic sized "haydron collider" that caused this 3 dimensional physical and 1 dimensional time universe to be created and put life into it so that we could recycle ZPE energy (your afterlife is your ZPE energy) and to recycle zpe energy you have to be a compassionate loving forgiving person. the point of recycling zpe energy is so that eventually you could enter the chilled universe where you would be outside the 11 dimensions and live for infinite and by live i dont know what i mean but you can get there as a human, thats what type IV extra terrestrials are trying to do using the energy we recycle so that everything can live in peace.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I know there are aliens, this universe is to great for there not to be.[/quote]


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## CrackerJax (Mar 5, 2009)

Don't tell me I missed another anal probe party??? Dammit!!! 


out.


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## Stoney McFried (Mar 5, 2009)

Yes, you did.But there will be cookies and a Heaven's Gate part two next Tuesday!


CrackerJax said:


> Don't tell me I missed another anal probe party??? Dammit!!!
> 
> 
> out.


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## CrackerJax (Mar 5, 2009)

Mmmm cookies. yes please!! 

I guess I would be an easy mark for satan (myth also folks). A few boxes of tollhouse cookies and I'd sign anything away!! woot!!

out.


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## Stoney McFried (Mar 5, 2009)

Satan makes good cookies.Be careful, though, he might grab your boobs.


CrackerJax said:


> Mmmm cookies. yes please!!
> 
> I guess I would be an easy mark for satan (myth also folks). A few boxes of tollhouse cookies and I'd sign anything away!! woot!!
> 
> out.


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## CrackerJax (Mar 5, 2009)

you wish... 


out.


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## Stoney McFried (Mar 5, 2009)

Well..I guess I could grab them, if you like....


CrackerJax said:


> you wish...
> 
> 
> out.


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## CrackerJax (Mar 5, 2009)

Ahhh, I c now...satan comes in many forms....dam tricky myths are always sneaking up on me for a boob squeeze. 


out.


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## Stoney McFried (Mar 5, 2009)

Titties, titties.


CrackerJax said:


> Ahhh, I c now...satan comes in many forms....dam tricky myths are always sneaking up on me for a boob squeeze.
> 
> 
> out.


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## CrackerJax (Mar 5, 2009)

I think you might be disappointed Stoney... 


out.


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## parajana (Mar 5, 2009)

for sure thanks!!!!


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## Schwaggg (Mar 6, 2009)

I am Ignostic. I believe that there is no clear definition of "god" so how can anyone say whether or not they believe in it. Everyone has a different definition or view of what god is. Apart from that concept I'm Agnostic. I believe its beyond our scope of knowledge to say whether there is or isnt a god. Its impossible to prove either way.


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