# Leaving lower branches for 2nd harvest??



## rickymac21 (Nov 18, 2012)

I have looked but can't find a definite answer. I'm always getting stuck with some of that popcorn on the lower branches at harvest time. I know I've heard of people leaving those buds to flower an extra week or two after the first initial cut 
So questions are. ...
1. Will this increase the bud density/weight. 
2. Since the colas have already been cut, will the plant be stunted for a solid week? Meaning this method is basically ineffective? 
All insight is appreciated. Thanks!


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## TokeHoldCough (Nov 18, 2012)

I don't know about chopping everything but popcorn buds.. But I do know if you let it flower(over ripe) the buds get heavier due to resin glands hardening.. Cash crops do it all the time. You gotta be careful though, mother nature will through pollen after being to over ripe so her genes don't die. You will have seeded bud, which, again is more potent and adds weight.


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## Ringsixty (Nov 18, 2012)

Just make Butter out of the Popcorn Budz. That's what I do.


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## rickymac21 (Nov 18, 2012)

Ringsixty said:


> Just make Butter out of the Popcorn Budz. That's what I do.


Well I've done that before but most people don't want to pay for an edible with no idea of what's in it. It's just easier to rid of nuggets. I suppose I can't lose any weight by doing it so ill just see what happens


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## Stellah (Nov 18, 2012)

Let those little nuggs stay and keep it goin.The smoke will be awesome.Use it as personal.


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## rickymac21 (Nov 18, 2012)

Stellah said:


> Let those little nuggs stay and keep it goin.The smoke will be awesome.Use it as personal.


That's good news. Would the reason for this just be due to the further development of the thrichs. And will they actually start to swell up and gain some density to them ? Right now there's nothing to them.


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## Flares (Nov 21, 2012)

Yup, you can do a number of things. You could also reveg. it if ya like. Could also take the lower under developed branches and make clones. YES it is possible as I have clones from 1 of my girls that I just cropped. when I started my flush I cut 3 lower branches off and cleaned,clipped and rooting hormone. 2 weeks later and there growing good. Also, when ya take a clone from a flowering plant you will have a very branchy female plant to take more clones off of.


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## ineverveg (Nov 21, 2012)

i let em go an extra week and they really harden up , i too use it as personal unless they are really under developed then they go in the oil pot


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## Sampras1489 (Nov 21, 2012)

How about avoid the popcorn buds all together and prune those nodes early on so all your left with is colas? Just a thought.


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## ineverveg (Nov 22, 2012)

If you grow 12/12 from seed which I do,there is no getting away from popcorn with some strains.with my current grow in my Sig i just lollipopped some og kush,although I hate cutting nodes off in flower I wanted to do a sog from seed


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## skunkd0c (Nov 22, 2012)

depends on the size of the plant mainly and strain too, if its just a small plant with a little bit of schwag at the bottom i wouldn't bother 
just take it all down, if it is a large plant and the lower bud is on solid branches but just got shaded and is less mature it could produce some good extra yield if you give it some extra time to finish off

peace


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## legallyflying (Nov 24, 2012)

Yeah. Ditto what Spock says. I always harvest the tips then lower th light fOr an extra week. They will put on weight and develop better color. 

If I have plants waiting to get in the flower room however, they all just go in the trash. Fuck hash and fuck
Oil.


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## ilikecheetoes (Nov 29, 2012)

lol i just dug out a bunch of trimmings ive had around and tried the iso thing. I only smoke bud but my buddys like all this new hocus pocus so i figured id give it a shot.
its easy but this damn iso isnt evaping as fast as I thought it would.


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## Budgoro88 (Nov 29, 2012)

harvest the whole plant 80 percent of the time the additions are minimal


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## Huel Perkins (Dec 1, 2012)

Add some side lighting and get thick mature buds top to bottom.


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## Greggos88 (Dec 30, 2012)

Hash it! I've been making dank BHO dispensary grade earwax for about 8 months now. 1 can 5x filtered butane can blow 1 oz of bud material and whip that up to 2-3g of fire. Never going to purchase hash again myself, still working on supplying myself with herb. But hey, that's why we're all here isn't it?


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## Moon Goblin (Dec 31, 2012)

I believe legallyflying and skunkd0c are correct. So does Steven Tuck- although he might be a little hard to understand, he is a botanist:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bj_pudE9iwE


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## Slab (Dec 31, 2012)

Moon Goblin said:


> I believe legallyflying and skunkd0c are correct. So does Steven Tuck- although he might be a little hard to understand, he is a botanist:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bj_pudE9iwE



thanks for this, he has some great topics up.


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## Uncle Ben (Dec 31, 2012)

Moon Goblin said:


> I believe legallyflying and skunkd0c are correct. So does Steven Tuck- although he might be a little hard to understand, he is a botanist:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bj_pudE9iwE


Most of what he relayed I've been writing about for 15 years. I've also posted many times about my double harvest drill and included photos, which is taking off buds as they are ready. Aint no different than picking peaches off the tree. I harvested outdoor plants about a month ago and did my usual drill - took out the bulked up colas and left the lower part of the plant out in the sun to bulk up. Like this guy said, it's all about apical dominance which also affects the lower buds, commonly referred to as popcorn buds. Most folks believe those airy buds are there because they don't get enough light. That is a false paradigm.

UB


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## Slab (Dec 31, 2012)

A secondary harvest is not the same as a second harvest ( revegging)?

Tuck mentions OverGrow and the wealth of knowledge that was lost, like the library in Alexandria.

He has MS if anyone was wondering about his appearence.


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## patlpp (Dec 31, 2012)

Uncle Ben said:


> Most of what he relayed I've been writing about for 15 years. I've also posted many times about my double harvest drill and included photos, which is taking off buds as they are ready. Aint no different than picking peaches off the tree. I harvested outdoor plants about a month ago and did my usual drill - took out the bulked up colas and left the lower part of the plant out in the sun to bulk up. Like this guy said, it's all about apical dominance which also affects the lower buds, commonly referred to as popcorn buds. Most folks believe those airy buds are there because they don't get enough light. That is a false paradigm.
> 
> UB


@UB - If those popcorn nugs are not from lack of light, what are they from? When I use your 2nd node top method, then follow with 1 more top of each (8 total colas) I seem to have much less popcorn, more so than just a 2nd node top by itself. I attributed that to a more even canopy. Isn't apical dominance the act of the main shoot growing taller to get closer to the light, kind of a competition thing?


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## Moon Goblin (Dec 31, 2012)

patlpp said:


> @UB - If those popcorn nugs are not from lack of light, what are they from? When I use your 2nd node top method, then follow with 1 more top of each (8 total colas) I seem to have much less popcorn, more so than just a 2nd node top by itself. I attributed that to a more even canopy. Isn't apical dominance the act of the main shoot growing taller to get closer to the light, kind of a competition thing?


It is my understanding that the hormone auxin is responsible for apical behavior-- or, in other words, the molecular tool for such behavior/ structure. 

The accumulation of auxin in a branch , such as in the main branch in an apical plant, will cause that branch to reach for the sky while having all other branches support it in it's venture. 
When topping your plants (removing the top node), applying the F.I.M. technique (Fuck I Missed = removing 80% of the top node), or applying LST (low stress training), the apical plant (such as cannabis) will reallocate the phytohormone (plant hormone) auxin to side branches,instead of to the main alpha branch, trying to maintain its apical structure. In other words, the plant is thinking its dominant branch is no longer able to be dominant and invests it's auxin in other contending (for dominance, or closest to the light) branches.
Read up on it, I think it will explain a lot:
http://www.plant-hormones.info/auxins.htm
http://www.thctalk.com/cannabis-forum/archive/index.php/t-17720.html

To answer your question, Patlpp, the popcorn bud is the result of a lack of auxin-- which typically means the lack of resources such as PAR (photosynthetically active radiation units).

atypical apical....


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## Slab (Dec 31, 2012)

hell yeah, blinding us with science. thanks for that MoonGoblin

there is a proximity awareness in Cannabis also, a lot of plants for that matter if I am not mistaken.

the sex life of plants is great doc if anyone wants some brain food.

sorry all over the place there, 

apical dominance determines resource allocation ?


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## Moon Goblin (Dec 31, 2012)

Slab said:


> apical dominance determines resource allocation ?


I think so, just look at the size difference of the alpha bud compared to the rest, if a MJ plant was not topped.


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## Moon Goblin (Dec 31, 2012)

Slab said:


> hell yeah, blinding us with science. thanks for that MoonGoblin


Let me know if I can explain something a little better, and my apologies for blinding you.


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## Slab (Dec 31, 2012)

well to be truthfull you've improved my sight !  

it seems cannabis has a few different situal awareness traits, mindblowing.


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## burwoodkush (Dec 31, 2012)

rickymac21 said:


> Well I've done that before but most people don't want to pay for an edible with no idea of what's in it. It's just easier to rid of nuggets. I suppose I can't lose any weight by doing it so ill just see what happens


I think;
if you're trying to make as much as you can from this plant.... then you are probably using the trimmings for hash correct?? just pick out your smallest unsaleable pieces, like the lower popcorn to throw in to make hash. 
HASH RULES man, trust me, you wont regret it lol


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## Moon Goblin (Dec 31, 2012)

Slab said:


> well to be truthfull you've improved my sight !
> 
> it seems cannabis has a few different situal awareness traits, mindblowing.


Then you need to check out the "Backster Effect"

And, if so inclined, read the _Secret Life of Plants_


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## Uncle Ben (Jan 1, 2013)

patlpp said:


> @UB - If those popcorn nugs are not from lack of light, what are they from?


I'll repeat what I wrote here and at Riddle:



> Used to think it was all about light canopy penetration too....it isn't. I've grown Mexican, pure sativa, the indica mutts, etc. outdoors and they all produce popcorn buds for the botanical reasons stated. Hate to pop peep's bubble (as this is a very popular paradigm) but the formation of popcorn buds has nothing to do with light quantity or quality.


and.....



> I just updated my post made a few minutes ago with another link to show that you'll get airy buds even on outdoor grown plants. Folks have it stuck in their minds that light has a direct effect on the lower buds.
> 
> When I do a double harvest (which I always do inside or out) I squeeze as much "goodness" out of the plant that I can. The lower popcorn buds will bulk up some, about double is a good educated guess. What I'm postulating which can be confirmed by analysing an outdoor grown plant is now that the upper half has been removed, the lower half (the popcorn buds) get ALL of the nutritional benefit of an established root system and auxins (which were in the top apical parts of the plant). The auxins which control growth (cell division/elongation) have now been redirected to the "new" apical terminal tips, or what's left. Useless if you lost your leaves down there, but that's never been an issue for me.
> 
> ...


....and here - https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/521700-fan-leafs-blockers-light-energy-18.html


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## VTMi'kmaq (Jan 1, 2013)

rickymac21 said:


> Well I've done that before but most people don't want to pay for an edible with no idea of what's in it. It's just easier to rid of nuggets. I suppose I can't lose any weight by doing it so ill just see what happens


that why you give them a sample to try if your a decent cook and know what your doing it'll gain its own fanbase, shit i make rice krispy treats and have become popular locally for them, lol too fucken popular!


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## patlpp (Jan 1, 2013)

Moon Goblin said:


> It is my understanding that the hormone auxin is responsible for apical behavior-- or, in other words, the molecular tool for such behavior/ structure.
> 
> The accumulation of auxin in a branch , such as in the main branch in an apical plant, will cause that branch to reach for the sky while having all other branches support it in it's venture.
> When topping your plants (removing the top node), applying the F.I.M. technique (Fuck I Missed = removing 80% of the top node), or applying LST (low stress training), the apical plant (such as cannabis) will reallocate the phytohormone (plant hormone) auxin to side branches,instead of to the main alpha branch, trying to maintain its apical structure. In other words, the plant is thinking its dominant branch is no longer able to be dominant and invests it's auxin in other contending (for dominance, or closest to the light) branches.
> ...





Uncle Ben said:


> I'll repeat what I wrote here and at Riddle:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for the response guys. I was aware of the auxins and all from UB's topping thread. I was under the impression though that the auxins disperse primarily by apical behavior but also that light intensity played a more or less secondary role. Much more reading on my end is needed for sure. Thanks again.


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## melissa70 (Feb 21, 2013)

patlpp said:


> Thanks for the response guys. I was aware of the auxins and all from UB's topping thread. I was under the impression though that the auxins disperse primarily by apical behavior but also that light intensity played a more or less secondary role. Much more reading on my end is needed for sure. Thanks again.


Hey UB, I have been loyal reader/follower of your treads for few years now. Nothing but respect with the effort you put into his hobby of ours. I have been doing the 4 main cola tech with awesome results....even with alternating nodes, just some lst leveling out works. I get the apical dominance behavior...but if light exposure to the lower buds does not impact the size density, then why does side lighting work to bulk up the lowers?


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## Uncle Ben (Feb 22, 2013)

melissa70 said:


> Hey UB, I have been loyal reader/follower of your treads for few years now. Nothing but respect with the effort you put into his hobby of ours. I have been doing the 4 main cola tech with awesome results....even with alternating nodes, just some lst leveling out works. I get the apical dominance behavior...but if light exposure to the lower buds does not impact the size density, then why does side lighting work to bulk up the lowers?


It doesn't. I gave you links which explains the factors involved.

UB


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## dopeboi69 (Feb 22, 2013)

Uncle Ben said:


> It doesn't. I gave you links which explains the factors involved.
> 
> UB


 so you're saying that if I stuck a cfl inside my plant to illuminate popcorn buds, they would still be popcorn buds no matter what? because those "popcorn" buds on my plants are getting fatter as I am typing this... So for you to say those popcorn buds will remain tiny like that regardless of how much light or light penetration is WRONG. WRONG WRONG WRONG. why? because I don't get popcorn buds. master grower? you sir need to rethink your profession. You're handing out advice that is certainly wrong. The other week I saw you telling someone that they can't top a plant effectively when it has alternating nodes. really? that is also WRONG. go ahead reread your posts. This site is pathetic. So many MASTER GROWERS handing out the most moronic advice.


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## Uncle Ben (Feb 22, 2013)

Don't twist my writings!



dopeboi69 said:


> so you're saying that if I stuck a cfl inside my plant to illuminate popcorn buds, they would still be popcorn buds no matter what? because those "popcorn" buds on my plants are getting fatter as I am typing this... So for you to say those popcorn buds will remain tiny like that regardless of how much light or light penetration is WRONG. WRONG WRONG WRONG.


As I've posted a dozen times, with photos, I do a second harvest after taking out the colas and what's left gets all the goodies at that point and yes light does play a part (the plant still needs to process photons using existing leaves) but as I explained elsewhere, quite thoroughly I thought, the new apical dominant points also get all the goodies from the root system and apical dominance hormonal responses. 



> The other week I saw you telling someone that they can't top a plant effectively when it has alternating nodes. really?


I never said that shit-fer-brains. You can top a frickin' carrot or your own head for all I care, but you can't top a plant with alternating nodes and expect 4 main colas. Read the frickin' 4 main cola thread. You lazy noobies not only can't read, you can't comprehend and then try and spin it with a crock of half-truths.



> that is also WRONG. go ahead reread your posts.


 Here, ya stupid little jerk, READ - https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/151706-uncle-bens-topping-technique-get-228.html

Post #4542

Got it?

Now....how does that crow taste?

UB


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## dopeboi69 (Feb 22, 2013)

lol I top with ALTERNATING nodes all the time and get MORE than 4 colas. If you can do it then why did you tell someone you couldn't???? how about you re post that... You also told someone that side lighting doesn't not work. Wrong. How about you repost that? I have read you 4 main cola "growing pot for retards" thread. and as I said and many other people have said THAT PRODUCES AVERAGE PLANTS AT BEST. how does THAT crow taste you fuckin moron. You were wrong you just aren't open minded enough to admit it or you already would have. Oh and you also called my a liar when in fact I have lied about nothing. How about you tell me what I lied about dumbass.


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## dopeboi69 (Feb 22, 2013)

oh and spank me harder next time i couldn't quite feel it. Imbecile.


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## hiitsbob (Feb 22, 2013)

you guys need to read more and get your heads out of your butts. 
yes you can top wherever you want but do not get the desire results he explains.
before spewing at the mouth like a bunch of uninformed idiots read read read.
you bring so much hostility for no reason and look like a complete ass.
mediocre plants my ass he has produced some of the biggest buds i have ever seen.
look at his avatar for christ sakes.
you are foolish to spew listen read and learn.
i hate getting into any of this but makes us all look bad.


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## dopeboi69 (Feb 22, 2013)

hiitsbob said:


> you guys need to read more and get your heads out of your butts.
> yes you can top wherever you want but do not get the desire results he explains.
> before spewing at the mouth like a bunch of uninformed idiots read read read.
> you bring so much hostility for no reason and look like a complete ass.
> ...


 Yes I understand what you are saying. I know that I look like complete ass right now but I have a few very valid points where I CLEARLY pointed out something he said wrong and he simply won't admit it. You can re read his posts yourself if you don't believe me. Instead he came back with insults and supposedly "spanked" me over the internet. That was more asinine that anything I could have EVER done. I just had the balls to call him out which no one else did.... so? if you don't like me calling out people's bullshit then sue me.


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## hiitsbob (Feb 22, 2013)

you can say what you like just validate it. 
sometimes comprehension is not easy to do in text.
most of his topping techniques are focused on the 1st and 2nd node.
not saying you are right or wrong just read a few extra times and comprehend better i bet you would find his posts make more sense.
and like i said to say his plants are average is a slight against humanity.
i am shooting for his quality plants. others out there have nice plants also just do not let shit go to your head.


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## Alexander Supertramp (Feb 22, 2013)

People are confusing 'tops' with main 'colas' quite often around here.


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## gagekko (Feb 22, 2013)

dopeboi69 said:


> lol I top with ALTERNATING nodes all the time and get MORE than 4 colas. If you can do it then why did you tell someone you couldn't???? how about you re post that... You also told someone that side lighting doesn't not work. Wrong. How about you repost that? I have read you 4 main cola "growing pot for retards" thread. and as I said and many other people have said THAT PRODUCES AVERAGE PLANTS AT BEST. how does THAT crow taste you fuckin moron. You were wrong you just aren't open minded enough to admit it or you already would have. Oh and you also called my a liar when in fact I have lied about nothing. How about you tell me what I lied about dumbass.


Can we see pictures of this or are you blowing smoke for the sake of not looking like a douche?


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## thewizard01 (Feb 22, 2013)

So are you guys saying when doing double harv. you cut the actual main stem below the colas or do you cut each individual node?


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## Uncle Ben (Feb 22, 2013)

dopeboi69 said:


> lol I top with ALTERNATING nodes all the time and get MORE than 4 colas..


You DON'T get 4 MAIN colas you little imbecile. Do you even know what a cola is? Doesn't sound like it.


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## Uncle Ben (Feb 22, 2013)

Alexander Supertramp said:


> People are confusing 'tops' with main 'colas' quite often around here.


Correctamundo. Hell, ask this retard what a leaf is and what it does. I doubt if he has a clue.


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## HeartlandHank (Feb 22, 2013)

Uncle Ben said:


> Correctamundo. Hell, ask this retard what a leaf is and what it does. I doubt if he has a clue.


Dopeboi is in quite a few threads throwing punches. I checked out some of his posts.. he's on the war path right now... bumping his fist against his mickey mouse shirt.

I like how your trolls have been criticizing your avatar lately. 
You are troll bait.


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## dopeboi69 (Feb 23, 2013)

I'm more educated on the subject than both of you twats put together. I just saw some bullshit and called you out on it. Are you mad?


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## hiitsbob (Feb 24, 2013)

show us then all i have seen so far is smoke. put up or shut up.


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## Uncle Ben (Feb 24, 2013)

dopeboi69 said:


> I'm more educated on the subject than both of you twats put together. I just saw some bullshit and called you out on it. Are you mad?


You just showed your ignorance, the fact that you don't know the difference between "tops" and "colas".


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## Apomixis (Feb 25, 2013)

All I know is that MJ is a monocarpic plant, so the completion of flowering and senescence are totally linked. It has always seemed (to me) to be a good idea to cut flowers as they reach maturity, at least for growers with one to few plants. This not only gives you more bud, but you also end up with more bud. Seems win win, no?


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## Alvaropuli (Jul 6, 2020)

How do u feed them for that second harvest?


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