# Can I cool a 4k room with 14,000 BTUs?



## Sencha (Feb 14, 2014)

Sealed rooms. Air cooled raptor hoods 8", one 8" vortex fan cooling all 4 lights. 4x 1000watts. Yes I'll be using a CO2 generator and a dehumidifier. 

I've read that the bare minimum for sealed rooms "BARE BULB" is 14,000 BTUs. I know the recommended is 16,000. I will be cooling my lights.

I'm just trying to decide if I can get buy with a dual zone, 30,000 BTU mini split, for side by side rooms. It's rated for 14,000 BTUs per head unit, 2x head units. One for each room.

I also know that cooling my lights prevents me from running a truly sealed room. I'll be scrubbing the heated air from the lights. That should stop a few trolls.....

Cheers, and 
thanks in advance!


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## Aeroknow (Feb 14, 2014)

Sencha said:


> Sealed rooms. Air cooled raptor hoods 8", one 8" vortex fan cooling all 4 lights. 4x 1000watts. Yes I'll be using a CO2 generator and a dehumidifier.
> 
> I've read that the bare minimum for sealed rooms "BARE BULB" is 14,000 BTUs. I know the recommended is 16,000. I will be cooling my lights.
> 
> ...


I always figure 4k btu's per 1000w of air-cooled light, just to be safe these days. Now, i've gotten away with a 24k window unit w/ 8000w's(air-cooled) before. Winter was no problem, summer it barely kept up. Out side temps at this location hit 100 degrees regularly in the summer. This room was upstairs, and that didn't help either. Hence why i always figure 4000 btu's. This might not be what you wanted to hear, just adding my real life experiences here.


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## superstoner1 (Feb 14, 2014)

I run a 12000btu inverter mini split with 3-1k lights all air cooled and in an extremely sealed room with co2 gen and ballasts and it just does it. An 18000btu would have been better.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 14, 2014)

4000 x 3.41 = 13,640 btu/hr for lights alone.

Dehu, building heat load, CO2 generator... im gonna say no unless your lights are air cooled.


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## Sencha (Feb 14, 2014)

Thanks guys. Good to see you SS1.

Couple other things to consider. Basement grow so a little cooler. Plus the rooms are on a flip, only one side running at a time. 

I just cant find a unit with 18,000 on both sides. Found one with 18000 one side 12000 the other.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 14, 2014)

If using a mini split with inverter technology then you could oversize without freezeups.


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## kinddiesel (Feb 14, 2014)

what some serious advice. get air cooled lighting and vent the heat out side the room. and a small 10k btu will be more then plenty to cool those lights. if not possible then a 30 thous btu split into 2 zones will cool all that but murder the electric bill. 3000 watts of cooling wasted . I under stand possible better yields open hood more light no light radiation stoped by the glass but have to keep in mind the energy to cool the hotter rooms. it will not pay off. but yes a 30 thous btu is very large will cool 2000to 2500 thousand square feet entire house


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 14, 2014)

kinddiesel said:


> what some serious advice. get air cooled lighting and vent the heat out side the room. and a small 10k btu will be more then plenty to cool those lights. if not possible then a 30 thous btu split into 2 zones will cool all that but murder the electric bill. 3000 watts of cooling wasted . I under stand possible better yields open hood more light no light radiation stoped by the glass but have to keep in mind the energy to cool the hotter rooms. it will not pay off. but yes a 30 thous btu is very large will cool 2000to 2500 thousand square feet entire house


It can pay off. If your going with large trees in rdwc using bare verticals and CO2. Also not venting and going sealed / CO2 has the additional advantage of minimizing odor leakage.

Both ways work. I know, done both.


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## Aeroknow (Feb 14, 2014)

Anything other than doing vertical lighting, just makes sense to me to have glass in the hood and air-cooled in a sealed grow room. Sure you lose a little light with that glass, but save some serious power costs from less ac needed. Now, of course this doesn't matter to people who spank it. But i don't!
I've built so many rooms over the years, still do, as that is how i make most of my living nowadays. 4000 btu per 1000w of AIR-COOLED light is the normal here in Norcal period.
Sure less btu's MIGHT work(many factors at play), and if it does, will help keep humidity in check= less dehu when lights are on. MIGHT! 4000 Btu works every single time though, with dehu,burner/s, and ballasts in room.


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## Sencha (Feb 14, 2014)

I will use Magnum XXXL 8" or Blockbuster 8" with a 700+ CFM inline fine cooling 4 lights. Ballasts outside the room.


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## anzohaze (Feb 14, 2014)

I use to run a 12000btu mini split w 2 8 inch block buster hoods both 1000 watts with 1200cfm fan for lights, co2 generator, dehumidi multi fans and if it was not winter I could not grow. The temps would sit at 85-90. Thats lights on during the day amd off at night. Summer ger 100+ and I run lights on during day for I live within a mile of a small airport. The police and coast guard keep there choppers there so I have no heat sig. I have always said 6kbtu is minimum per 1000watt. Your location also makes a difference to that as well.


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## Aeroknow (Feb 14, 2014)

Sencha said:


> I will use Magnum XXXL 8" or Blockbuster 8" with a 700+ CFM inline fine cooling 4 lights. Ballasts outside the room.


Basement grow, air-cooled good, ballasts outside, I would say, your 3500 btu per would work. You are the exception the 4000 btu rule! Lol  What kinda temps you see in the summer? Cause if you got mild temps to flow through them hoods, the formula Snaps displayed shows it'll work.


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## anzohaze (Feb 14, 2014)

700cfm and 4 1000 watts would build to much heat even if he only reached 80s outside


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## kinddiesel (Feb 14, 2014)

I suggest min 500 cfl fan per 1k light to vent out side. those 1 k lights are stupid hot. glad I switched all to 600.


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## Aeroknow (Feb 14, 2014)

anzohaze said:


> 700cfm and 4 1000 watts would build to much heat even if he only reached 80s outside


Naturally, we are all talking about using a seperate outside source/destination to cool the hoods with rite? Cause if someone is using air from inside the room, to push through the lights, then out, this is not remotely even close to a "sealed growroom". It doesn't allow the ac to do an efficient pulldown. And everything i've been saying, does not apply


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## Sencha (Feb 14, 2014)

Air from outside the room, cool ambient basement air will cool the lights. High of 100 for a few weeks in the summer. Nothing crazy. Mid west.

These will be two side by side rooms on a flip. I can run the 8" duct work continuous, through both rooms. That way I can put one 750 CFM fan in each room, both fans can stay on 24 hrs, while only one room will be on at a time.

Confused yet?


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## Aeroknow (Feb 14, 2014)

Sencha said:


> Air from outside the room, cool ambient basement air will cool the lights.
> 
> Confused yet?


I'm only confused by this part^^^
You aren't going to be bringing any "fresh" air into this room rite? Your going to air cool the hoods with air seperate from the grow room rite?


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## Sencha (Feb 14, 2014)

Right and right


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## Aeroknow (Feb 14, 2014)

Sencha said:


> Right and right


Ok, yeah dude, 3500btu's should do it considering those other conditions you mentioned earlier. The ONLY concern is with the room that will be on during the day, and hoods being air cooled with those hot summer day temps. For that reason alone, i cannot say for sure that 3500btu per will work for sure. Cool them at all times with mild/cool temps, and yes! Can you not pull enough juice to run both at night? I really can't explain the people having problems cooling there sealed rooms with at least 4000 btu per 1k of air-cooled lights though.


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## superstoner1 (Feb 14, 2014)

Aeroknow said:


> Ok, yeah dude, 3500btu's should do it considering those other conditions you mentioned earlier. The ONLY concern is with the room that will be on during the day, and hoods being air cooled with those hot summer day temps. For that reason alone, i cannot say for sure that 3500btu per will work for sure. Cool them at all times with mild/cool temps, and yes! Can you not pull enough juice to run both at night? I really can't explain the people having problems cooling there sealed rooms with at least 4000 btu per 1k of air-cooled lights though.


Lay out your personal experience with this set up for us please. I do have a very sealed, very well built, basement room with excellent air flow on the lights but anything less than 4000btu per light is going the put tremendous stress on a crucial system. This is the 4th different cooling system I have had, including water cooling, and minis are definitely the way to go and the inverters are worth it, but a few hundred more for a better system that doesn't struggle is worth it many times over.


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## Aeroknow (Feb 14, 2014)

superstoner1 said:


> Lay out your personal experience with this set up for us please. I do have a very sealed, very well built, basement room with excellent air flow on the lights but anything less than 4000btu per light is going the put tremendous stress on a crucial system. This is the 4th different cooling system I have had, including water cooling, and minis are definitely the way to go and the inverters are worth it, but a few hundred more for a better system that doesn't struggle is worth it many times over.


Personal experience is 20 yrs indoor all up and down cali. 10 of those without doing sealed rooms, ten with. I have an electrician brother, a plumber brother, and an hvac cousin. I am a union drywall/lather by trade. I've personally built, and run shit loads of setups. Please don't take this as bragging, just laying out some cred. Lol. There's got to be something wrong when someones sealed growroom is not working well with the formula i mentioned. There are mathematical formulas to figure out heat, and how to combat it. Then there is real world experience. I always go over minimum requirements.


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## Aeroknow (Feb 14, 2014)

Check out the first part of this link please. It explains the many factors that go into sizing of an ac for a sealed room: http://www.weedguru.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=27924


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## Sencha (Feb 15, 2014)

If I could find a dual zone unit that did 16000 per side, that's what I would do. They simply don't exist. I may end up buying two 20,000 BTU units but I don't want to make that commitment until I know for sure.

The rooms are side by side on a flip because I don't want to pull 8k all at once. The rooms are 15' x 12.5' x 6'9" ceilings.


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## Aeroknow (Feb 15, 2014)

Sencha said:


> If I could find a dual zone unit that did 16000 per side, that's what I would do. They simply don't exist. I may end up buying two 20,000 BTU units but I don't want to make that commitment until I know for sure.
> 
> The rooms are side by side on a flip because I don't want to pull 8k all at once. The rooms are 15' x 12.5' x 6'9" ceilings.


I know using window units sound getto, but sometimes it makes more sense for smaller setups than a split or mini-split. Stealth. No compressor unit outdoor. Many different sizes. No hvac person needed. If you cant put one in a window, put it thru-wall, and the back of unit into a "plenum" room, and air-cool the plenum.


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## Sencha (Feb 15, 2014)

I can't do that. Walls to the "plenum" room are concrete. I would hardly call 8k a small setup. Thanks for all the help.


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## Sencha (Feb 17, 2014)

I'm still, only slightly, up in the air on this.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 17, 2014)

Sencha said:


> If I could find a dual zone unit that did 16000 per side, that's what I would do. They simply don't exist. I may end up buying two 20,000 BTU units but I don't want to make that commitment until I know for sure.
> 
> The rooms are side by side on a flip because I don't want to pull 8k all at once. The rooms are 15' x 12.5' x 6'9" ceilings.


They make 3 ton mini splits that run 18000 on each of two air handlers. One condenser.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 17, 2014)

Installing a mini is pretty easy. Get a set of gauges, vacuum pump and unless you have to extend linesets you won't need to braze with sil phos or staybrite. Order right lengths on linesets. Seal linesets, connect vacuum and gauges, pull vac hard and then let sit to verify it doesn't leak and only then release charge in condenser.

You will need to have a feed / disconnect installed to feed the condenser, it in turn feeds air handlers via cable provided with linesets. Spec feed wire gauge and OCPD (breaker) according to installation papers that come with the unit.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 17, 2014)

Oh yeah first run you verify the gauge reading to mfgr specs. Also can do with thermocouple on linesets.


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## budleydoright (Feb 17, 2014)

I'm curious, when air cooling your sealed hoods and removing the heat they generate you obviously reduce the need for AC. Without that AC running and removing the moisture, how do you deal with the humidity? Do you run a dehumidifier? Are you removing heat from one source only ro replace it with another?
I have found running an 8-10k sealed room, that running my hoods open keeps my AC running the amount needed to keep my humidity in check. When things are cooler outside and there is less load on the AC as a result, adding another light will often ad the heat needed to keep the balance. Currently @ 9k and out of room, when things are big I do need to run a dehuey a bit and always need one at night.

When I ran water cooled light fixtures I found that I was having to run a dehuey 100% of the time and often needed an AC to remove the heat from the dehuey! So 3 refrigeration units cycling constantly. 2 to remove the heat and one putting some back in!

How do you balance that?


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## Sencha (Feb 17, 2014)

I run a dehuey 24/7, gets about 4 pints during lights on. I have never tried bare bulb. I'm also having to scrub the heated air, off the lights, because it picks up odor.


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## Aeroknow (Feb 17, 2014)

budleydoright said:


> I'm curious, when air cooling your sealed hoods and removing the heat they generate you obviously reduce the need for AC. Without that AC running and removing the moisture, how do you deal with the humidity? Do you run a dehumidifier? Are you removing heat from one source only ro replace it with another?
> I have found running an 8-10k sealed room, that running my hoods open keeps my AC running the amount needed to keep my humidity in check. When things are cooler outside and there is less load on the AC as a result, adding another light will often ad the heat needed to keep the balance. Currently @ 9k and out of room, when things are big I do need to run a dehuey a bit and always need one at night.
> 
> When I ran water cooled light fixtures I found that I was having to run a dehuey 100% of the time and often needed an AC to remove the heat from the dehuey! So 3 refrigeration units cycling constantly. 2 to remove the heat and one putting some back in!
> ...


^^^This is what happens when you oversize on the ac. I would add though, that certain hydro setups are going to add more humidity than others.
When ac is sized right, usually, humidity when lights on is ALMOST taken care. The dehu/s are mainly used during the night cycle.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 17, 2014)

Aeroknow said:


> ^^^This is what happens when you oversize on the ac. I would add though, that certain hydro setups are going to add more humidity than others.
> When ac is sized right, usually, humidity when lights on is ALMOST taken care. The dehu/s are mainly used during the night cycle.


No.

If you have more biomass you get more humidity.

I've run a 8kw sealed room with three tons and still HAD to run a drizair dehu in the room. Reason, massive trees that were 65 inches tall and 45" wide. Without dehu the AC ducts for upstairs rained condensation into my basement grow with lights on. Ambient here in Colorado is dry too.


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## budleydoright (Feb 17, 2014)

Aeroknow said:


> ^^^This is what happens when you oversize on the ac. I would add though, that certain hydro setups are going to add more humidity than others.
> When ac is sized right, usually, humidity when lights on is ALMOST taken care. The dehu/s are mainly used during the night cycle.


So a correctly sized ac with vented hoods would accomplish enough dehumidification? That doesn't seem possible. 
I wasn't asking about my kit. My system runs nice and balanced, when it's in the cold of winter, all I do is ad another 2k to the equation.

My question is how do you balance a vented hood system when you are removing the heat? You are removing the need for AC which removes your dehumidification. Do you just ad a dehumidifier? Wouldn't you be better off leaving the heat load on the AC to keep things in balance?

I'm just curious how you guys do it. I have never run a vented room. Always sealed.


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## budleydoright (Feb 17, 2014)

Aeroknow said:


> ^^^This is what happens when you oversize on the ac. I would add though, that certain hydro setups are going to add more humidity than others.
> When ac is sized right, usually, humidity when lights on is ALMOST taken care. The dehu/s are mainly used during the night cycle.


So a correctly sized ac with vented hoods would accomplish enough dehumidification? That doesn't seem possible. 
I wasn't asking about my kit. My system runs nice and balanced, when it's in the cold of winter, all I do is ad another 2k to the equation.

My question is how do you balance a vented hood system when you are removing the heat? You are removing the need for AC which removes your dehumidification. Do you just ad a dehumidifier? Wouldn't you be better off leaving the heat load on the AC to keep things in balance?

I'm just curious how you guys do it. I have never run a vented room. Always sealed.


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## Aeroknow (Feb 17, 2014)

I said almost. You gotta agree though that if you have too big of an ac, usually, the ac is going to cylcle on/off more frequently, thus more time for humidity to build up in between cycles. Twas just a point i was trying to make


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## superstoner1 (Feb 17, 2014)

One thing that I never even considered is not having a stand alone dehumidifier. Humidity and temperature are two completely different but equally important environmental factors and if you have gone to the trouble to have a well built grow why would you not want the most control of every factor? A benefit of an ac is the removal of water, but it is not its built function, its a result of its function.


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## Aeroknow (Feb 17, 2014)

SnapsProvolone said:


> No.
> 
> If you have more biomass you get more humidity.
> 
> I've run a 8kw sealed room with three tons and still HAD to run a drizair dehu in the room. Reason, massive trees that were 65 inches tall and 45" wide. Without dehu the AC ducts for upstairs rained condensation into my basement grow with lights on. Ambient here in Colorado is dry too.


And absolutely, more biomass is gonna add more humidity also. Agreed


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## budleydoright (Feb 17, 2014)

Aeroknow said:


> I said almost. You gotta agree though that if you have too big of an ac, usually, the ac is going to cylcle on/off more frequently, thus more time for humidity to build up in between cycles. Twas just a point i was trying to make


C'mon, everyone knows that! That's like the gieco commercial!

Really, to me it seems like air cooling your hoods is no more effecient but like I said I have never done it. Just doing the math.


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## Aeroknow (Feb 17, 2014)

superstoner1 said:


> One thing that I never even considered is not having a stand alone dehumidifier. Humidity and temperature are two completely different but equally important environmental factors and if you have gone to the trouble to have a well built grow why would you not want the most control of every factor? A benefit of an ac is the removal of water, but it is not its built function, its a result of its function.


Read my post again. I never said dehu is NOT needed while lights on


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## budleydoright (Feb 17, 2014)

SnapsProvolone said:


> No.
> 
> If you have more biomass you get more humidity.
> 
> I've run a 8kw sealed room with three tons and still HAD to run a drizair dehu in the room. Reason, massive trees that were 65 inches tall and 45" wide. Without dehu the AC ducts for upstairs rained condensation into my basement grow with lights on. Ambient here in Colorado is dry too.


Open or vented hoods? I'm just down the road from you where it's a little hotter and drier. High desert just the same.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 17, 2014)

Open in there.

I have three rooms in 1300 sqft and two adults with high counts. One veg room for moms, clones and preflower veg. One flower room with 8k x three tons and trees with open hoods and CO2. One with 6 - 8k (8 in winter), trays, no AC, 12" exhaust pulling air thru hoods and out thru cd-1200 ozone gen and out via wall vent. 10" intake pulling outside air thru a dust shroom on cooling thermostat. There are 12x39 phat filter scrubbers running in these rooms. So far I am more pleased with the non CO2 enriched room for margins.


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## Aeroknow (Feb 18, 2014)

budleydoright said:


> I'm curious, when air cooling your sealed hoods and removing the heat they generate you obviously reduce the need for AC. Without that AC running and removing the moisture, how do you deal with the humidity? Do you run a dehumidifier? Are you removing heat from one source only ro replace it with another?
> I have found running an 8-10k sealed room, that running my hoods open keeps my AC running the amount needed to keep my humidity in check. When things are cooler outside and there is less load on the AC as a result, adding another light will often ad the heat needed to keep the balance. Currently @ 9k and out of room, when things are big I do need to run a dehuey a bit and always need one at night.
> 
> When I ran water cooled light fixtures I found that I was having to run a dehuey 100% of the time and often needed an AC to remove the heat from the dehuey! So 3 refrigeration units cycling constantly. 2 to remove the heat and one putting some back in!
> ...


Ok, ok. Let me try to explain myself a little better this morning. I was liquered and high as shit from trimming on holy grail all day 
When you air cool the lights, in a sealed room, there's still a shit load of heat put off btw. Just not as much(of course rite). Dehu/s, ballasts in room, and generator/s generate lot's of heat too. A sealed room is gonna need an ac no matter what. Ok, lets say you have an ac correctly sized for a bare bulb sealed room. For an example, 4500 btu's per 1000w, and all is good. Then, in that same setup, you were to aircool them hoods, your ac would obviously be oversized now. The ac would not stay on for as long of periods, and the dehu's would need to do more work, therefore making heat, and more ac needed to combat that heat.(Gieco commercial, i guess?)
Now, if you used a smaller amount of ac, lets say 3500-4000 btu's per 1000w's, after you air-cooled them hoods in that same room, well, it would work virtually the same as the bare bulb setup w/4500btu's, but not cost as much to run the ac, because the "smaller" ac doesn't use as much juice. 
In both situations, a dehu is also still needed during the light cycle, USUALLY. Example when it wouldn't: IF I am just starting a room, and it's not perpetual yet, i sometimes need a HUMIDIFIER when lights are on, in the winter, because it's dry as fuck, and there's not as much foliage(plant biomass)in the room creating as much humidity yet. Dehu at night for dehu purposes and heat.
Btw, In the winter, i also usually, de-air-cool some lights, or add lights to make a room work more symbiotically. Whatever's clever rite?
You follow what i'm saying this time?
I've never ran both sealed room scenario's side by side, with separate meters, but i just cannot see the bare bulb setup costing the same amount of $ to run. And i'll give this to ya: the air cooled lights sealed room, WILL most likely need a little more dehumidification, compared, as the smaller ac won't dehu as much as a bigger unit would  i still can't see that the little bit of extra dehu needed, would equal the same power as the bigger ac, throughout the grow. And i know, dehu's are pigs!
I hope you understand what i'm trying to say here


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## Aeroknow (Feb 18, 2014)

SnapsProvolone said:


> So far I am more pleased with the non CO2 enriched room for margins.


I killed it for years without sealing it up, and adding co2. I grew up in a very mild weather area of California. But then i started setting up shop in parts that get hotter than snot in the summer, and normal ventilation in the
Summertime=boo-boo. I sometimes, if climate permits, still hook people up with fresh air ventilation, and well, they kill it. And i'm just not that into using an ac in a fresh air ventilated room.
And Btw Snaps, have you ever had a room full of aeroponic tubes? That room with all the tubes and rezy's, will make more humidity vs. growing with MOST(not all of course) other setups, if both setups being compared had the same amount of biomass in them


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## budleydoright (Feb 18, 2014)

> I hope you understand what i'm trying to say here


I do understand what your saying. So it's basically the same dance, just have to keep a balance. I know when I dial my room perfect. I need no dehuey during the day, the AC balances it out perfectly. I am perpetual so there's always something going on in there.

It's just so perfect when it's all in synch, the thought of cooling my lights gives me nightmares! Makes me curious how the other half does it. I've never been able to vent out and all of my experience is with sealed rooms.


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## Aeroknow (Feb 18, 2014)

budleydoright said:


> I do understand what your saying. So it's basically the same dance, just have to keep a balance. I know when I dial my room perfect. I need no dehuey during the day, the AC balances it out perfectly. I am perpetual so there's always something going on in there.
> 
> It's just so perfect when it's all in synch, the thought of cooling my lights gives me nightmares! Makes me curious how the other half does it. I've never been able to vent out and all of my experience is with sealed rooms.


The ONlY problem i ever experience with air-cooled hoods in a selaed growroom, is when the air used to "air-cool" the sealed hoods is too cold. It will straight rain from the hoods. That sucks! To much of anything good, ends up a bad thing i guess. I thank you for understanding what i was trying to say. I'm still in the stone age, as far as how to communicate via forums....peace


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## budleydoright (Feb 18, 2014)

Aeroknow said:


> The ONlY problem i ever experience with air-cooled hoods in a selaed growroom, is when the air used to "air-cool" the sealed hoods is too cold. It will straight rain from the hoods. That sucks! To much of anything good, ends up a bad thing i guess. I thank you for understanding what i was trying to say. I'm still in the stone age, as far as how to communicate via forums....peace



Appreciate the dialog. I have extensive experience but only one style. As we approach full on legalization in my state, I believe the most well rounded growers will be the most successful. I would like to turn this into a profession so I like to axe questions!


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## Sencha (Feb 18, 2014)

I've still not decided on a unit. I need a dual zone option for under 4k. I'm still going to air cool my hoods but if you find a unit that does 16,000 per zone, please link it.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 18, 2014)

Aeroknow said:


> The ONlY problem i ever experience with air-cooled hoods in a selaed growroom, is when the air used to "air-cool" the sealed hoods is too cold. It will straight rain from the hoods. That sucks! To much of anything good, ends up a bad thing i guess. I thank you for understanding what i was trying to say. I'm still in the stone age, as far as how to communicate via forums....peace


If the cool is that cool it doesn't sound like you have a cooling problem, more humidity that heat means slow or stop the blower cooling lights, intake cool air seperately on a thermostat and run a big dehu.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 18, 2014)

I've had rooms with 3 - 4 kw in basement not need any cooling when it was super cold out, like 0F and colder. As outside temps vary so must our environmental controls.


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## Sencha (Feb 18, 2014)

This isn't helping me....lights will be cooled with 70 degree air.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 18, 2014)

http://www.minisplitwarehouse.com/category/36000_btu_mini_split_prices

Look at the dual zone 18k + 18k units on that list.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 18, 2014)

I have personally run Mitsubishi, LG and Midea. Mitsubishi is the grail. Midea would be my second choice but no mfgr support...


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## Sencha (Feb 18, 2014)

Thank you. I've been using google instead of going right to a wholesaler's page. I feel dumb, lol.

I found this. What do you think? http://ecomfort.com/cu-4ks24nbu-2cs-mks18nku-dual-zone-wall-mounted-cooling-only-mini-split-system-35000-btu-28553.html?utm_source=adwordsfroogle&utm_medium=product_search&utm_campaign=adwordsfroogle&utm_content=28553&gclid=CM3NjZ261rwCFUhgMgodAV8AKA

It's cooling only, but I don't need the heater.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 18, 2014)

http://www.minisplitwarehouse.com/2x18000_Btu_Dual_Zone_16_Seer_Inverter_Mini_Split_Heat_Pump_AC/p315964_7696110.aspx

Either or..


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 18, 2014)

I've installed YMGI and Panasonic's as well for MMC's out here but not for personal use. No complaints.

If money was no object I would go Mitsubishi just because they are tanks. Otherwise they all work. Just be sure it will resume setting when power goes out (most do - server room). Also look for low ambient function if running it when cooler than 60 f outside.


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## Aeroknow (Feb 18, 2014)

SnapsProvolone said:


> If the cool is that cool it doesn't sound like you have a cooling problem, more humidity that heat means slow or stop the blower cooling lights, intake cool air seperately on a thermostat and run a big dehu.


It's just condensation, but it sucks. This will happen while room is 50% and 82 degrees. And only happen when it's snowing cold outside. I betcha i would have to get down to 30% to help that way. Answer has been, to not use freeeeezing cold air to air-cool. If you put the air-cool fan on thermostat, hoods would be sealed, yet not being cooled(i no likey that)at times. Now slowing them fans down in that situation, def might work though, along with a little lower, say, 40% humidity. Next time it snows, and that works, i'll post. It might just help
someone down the road. Thanks man


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## Sencha (Feb 18, 2014)

They should all work down to 4-12 F. I ran one this year WITHOUT the cold weather attachment. It only stopped working when it got below zero. That happened two times this year, for about 3 days each time. I was able to cool my room with ambient air at that point though. I have a closed 8" duct that I can add a fan too, just for that reason.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 18, 2014)

I've seen some rated in the 20's...


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## Sencha (Feb 18, 2014)

Ok, thank you for you help.


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## superstoner1 (Feb 18, 2014)

Spend the money and get one with the cold ambient temp on it. Why worry about it not working?


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## superstoner1 (Feb 18, 2014)

http://www.westsidewholesale.com/ductless-air-conditioning
Check these guys out. I did a lot of looking and the lg works great.


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## Sencha (Feb 18, 2014)

Sucks they want over 800 for each head unit. That Panasonic I linked comes with two.


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## Sencha (Feb 18, 2014)

http://www.minisplitwarehouse.com/AirCon_Dual_Zone_18000_+_18000_Btu_16_Seer_Mini_Split_Heat_Pump_AC/p315964_7294658.aspx


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 18, 2014)

Sencha said:


> http://www.minisplitwarehouse.com/AirCon_Dual_Zone_18000_+_18000_Btu_16_Seer_Mini_Split_Heat_Pump_AC/p315964_7294658.aspx


Toshiba compressor, should be ok. Note warranty only valid after a licensed contractor fills out install papers and provides license #. So forget warranty if diy. Be sure to know your unit. Never run in economy mode and watch out for timer features (you'd be suprised how many times I hear "it keeps shutting down" when the client had a timer mode active)


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## adower (Feb 18, 2014)

Whats your thought on fujitsu minisplit quality.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 18, 2014)

adower said:


> Whats your thought on fujitsu minisplit quality.


I like their smaller units. High SEER. Plastic is a bit flimsy but not a game ender.


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## Sencha (Feb 18, 2014)

I know you get what you pay for. I don't need to cheap out, but I don't want to blow my wad on a Mitsu again. Still looking for something middle of the road. Maybe the Panasonic. 

Thanks for all your help guys. I think I rep'd everyone.


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## Sencha (Feb 19, 2014)

I know I said I wasn't going to buy another Mitsu , But, I think I've finally decided.

http://ecomfort.com/mxz-3b30na-1-2msz-ge18na-8-dual-zone-wall-mounted-heat-pump-mini-split-system-36000-btu-26997.html

I'll call tomorrow and double check operating temps but I think the Mitsu goes down to 0 F.

It's really hard not to cheap out though http://www.airconminisplits.com/product/dual-zone-18000-btu-16-seer-mini-split-heat-pump-ac-aircon-a16ci4h4r36


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 19, 2014)

Just checked spec sheet for that Mitsubishi, shes good down to 14F.


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## Sencha (Feb 19, 2014)

I can't catch a break.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 19, 2014)

In all honesty back in Missouri I had a 12kW room with CO2. Ran a 4 ton Mitsubishi unless it was in the 20's. Then I switched to a massive blower with filtered intake. The large cfm squirrel cage air handler came from the split ac evaporator that I tore out to empty the basement for growing. This blower and the CO2 generators controller were run off a green air environmental controller. Instead of being at 1500 ppm constantly, it was more like 75-85%, colder the better.

Run an exhaust that's larger than the intake and use inline ozone to scrub odor.

Winter runs were always very comparable in yield to summer. Quality of winter run was just a cunt hair better.


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## Remi1 (Feb 19, 2014)

Sencha said:


> I can't catch a break.


I have a 10'x12' flower room in the southwest U.S. where sumertime temps are easy 115 for a moth straight. I have 4 1k lights on a closed system. Pulling from another area & expelling in another, never touching the flower room.
4- magnum xxxl 8' hoods
1-760cfm fan moving air for them.
1- 12,000 btu window a/c
promix- no need to cool water.
I run my lights at night 6pm-6am
6' fan & filter scrubbing air.
all ballasts kept out of room. 
no heaters
dehumidifier in room
the 12,000 btu works great with all 4 lights in winter. 2 months a year in the summer time I shut down 1 light & run 3 lights or the a/c would be running more than I want it to. It will cool the room but really working for it.


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## Sencha (Feb 20, 2014)

Thanks Remi1. I'm at the point now where I've found the dual 18000 btus that I need, and I can afford it. Right now, I can't find a dual that will still cool when in drops below 10 F outside.

Cheers


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 20, 2014)

https://www.theacoutlet.com/MXZ3B30NA-MSZFE18NA-MSZFE18NA-36000-Btu-17.5-Seer-Mitsubishi-Dual-Zone-Mini-Split-18K-18K-Heat-Pump-System.htm


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## greentrip (Feb 20, 2014)

Sencha said:


> I will use Magnum XXXL 8" or Blockbuster 8" with a 700+ CFM inline fine cooling 4 lights. Ballasts outside the room.



better make that 2 fans


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## Sencha (Feb 21, 2014)

2 4k rooms, side by side, on a flip. each 4k room will have it's own inline fan. both fans will be on 24/7, so I'll be stacking 2-700 cfm fans to cool 4k.


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## adower (Feb 21, 2014)

Sencha said:


> I know I said I wasn't going to buy another Mitsu , But, I think I've finally decided.
> 
> http://ecomfort.com/mxz-3b30na-1-2msz-ge18na-8-dual-zone-wall-mounted-heat-pump-mini-split-system-36000-btu-26997.html
> 
> ...


You get what you pay for. You will be kicking your ass if that mini dies during a summer run cause you got a cheaper one.


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## SnapsProvolone (Feb 21, 2014)

adower said:


> You get what you pay for. You will be kicking your ass if that mini dies during a summer run cause you got a cheaper one.


The Mitsubishi is tits. That is what he said he's doing. He's smart to stay that course.


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## adower (Feb 21, 2014)

SnapsProvolone said:


> The Mitsubishi is tits. That is what he said he's doing. He's smart to stay that course.


Yep. Just giving him some encouragement!!


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## Sencha (Feb 22, 2014)

It's been ordered. Thanks everyone.


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## PowerFlower420 (May 16, 2015)

Thanks for the thread Sencha, very helpful


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## Don Geno (May 20, 2015)

kinddiesel said:


> what some serious advice. get air cooled lighting and vent the heat out side the room. and a small 10k btu will be more then plenty to cool those lights. if not possible then a 30 thous btu split into 2 zones will cool all that but murder the electric bill. 3000 watts of cooling wasted . I under stand possible better yields open hood more light no light radiation stoped by the glass but have to keep in mind the energy to cool the hotter rooms. it will not pay off. but yes a 30 thous btu is very large will cool 2000to 2500 thousand square feet entire house


How do you calculate how muc . Power is being drawn without blowing a breaker? In a small older style townhouse so must be precautious any advice would be much appreciated


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