# end of cycle techniques. e.g. flushing, leaching, boiling. ice drying .....etc



## Anth88 (May 14, 2017)

hi. this post is for your end of cycle techniques. 
this could be anything that you do or dint do towards the the end of flower and to your plants. you might flush or you might leach instead. you may add cool air and ice or you might prefer to boil your root zone to start fermentation early. this post is for every1s routines, ideas and theory.


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## xmatox (May 14, 2017)

Anth88 said:


> hi. this post is for your end of cycle techniques.
> this could be anything that you do or dint do towards the the end of flower and to your plants. you might flush or you might leach instead. you may add cool air and ice or you might prefer to boil your root zone to start fermentation early. this post is for every1s routines, ideas and theory.


I use mountain dew, or the smoothie mix you get from costco. It makes the flavor really pop out


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## SouthCross (May 14, 2017)

Just when you think you've read it all.....boiling roots. Sticking them in ice...


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## cindysid (May 14, 2017)

I feed organic nutes right up to day of harvest. I'm not feeding for the plant's sake towards the end. I'm keeping my microbes well fed so they are ready to do their job with the next plant, since I reuse my soil. I've been using the same basic soil with amendments for over 18 months now, and it just gets better.


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## SouthCross (May 14, 2017)

I never understood why cutting out fertilizer developed a better bud. The last two weeks is when the magic happens.

The first time I heard of flushing was when watching Cannabis Kid. The dude with the glasses at the shop did his sales pitch about the bud being flushed. Came across at bull$hit. Makes you wonder who came up with the idea of flushing.

Has anybody grow the same strain next to each other? One plant flushed the other fed till dead? Then had it tested for what people describe as a 'pop and sizzle'? Another phenomenon I've never experienced on private grown weed. Mexican rag weed, maybe sure. Nothing I've ever grown. Fed to the end.

Who started this flush $hit? Where's he or she at?


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## Jon E. Doe (May 14, 2017)

Lotta farms around here. I never heard of any farmer intentionally denying his crop the elements it needs to grow. Not in the beginning, not at any point in the grow cycle, and certainly not near the end. Why abuse and potentially jeopardize your crop after many weeks of nurturing it?


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## Anth88 (May 15, 2017)

xmatox said:


> I use mountain dew, or the smoothie mix you get from costco. It makes the flavor really pop out


always 1 with the mountain dew post aint there. jog on off my post lad.


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## Anth88 (May 15, 2017)

I have friends that swear by boiling there root zone. I've smoked it boiled. iced. flushed. I'm looking for different techniques to try myself. or to see if anybody else has come across any good techniques they use


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## ANC (May 15, 2017)

Indoors I like to do 48 hours of darkness at the end of the cycle, to chow through some of the last nutrients left after flushing.


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## Budley Doright (May 15, 2017)

I'm old enough to remember reading some of the first grow guides in the old message boards and pretty sure the boiling root technique was mentioned in a few but with a twist. You were instructed to boil the root after it was pulled then hung upside down to let the THC run into the plant, yup I did it ....bahaha.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 15, 2017)

SouthCross said:


> I never understood why cutting out fertilizer developed a better bud. The last two weeks is when the magic happens.
> 
> The first time I heard of flushing was when watching Cannabis Kid. The dude with the glasses at the shop did his sales pitch about the bud being flushed. Came across at bull$hit. Makes you wonder who came up with the idea of flushing.
> 
> ...


The pop and sizzle is from smoking poorly dried weed. The myth is that it is nutrients left in the buds. 

And I have done the side by sides every which way the forum and guides suggest. 

Only plants grown healthy to the end have the highest quality and yield.


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## JDMase (May 15, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> The pop and sizzle is from smoking poorly dried weed. The myth is that it is nutrients left in the buds.
> 
> And I have done the side by sides every which way the forum and guides suggest.
> 
> Only plants grown healthy to the end have the highest quality and yield.


Do you think full nutrients till the end then? No autumn leaves just green till the chop? Im pretty sure ive seen people mention that no other industry flushes.. But saying that I don't know how I would be able to get over my nute lockouts or tox/def's any other way?


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 15, 2017)

JDMase said:


> Do you think full nutrients till the end then? No autumn leaves just green till the chop? Im pretty sure ive seen people mention that no other industry flushes.. But saying that I don't know how I would be able to get over my nute lockouts or tox/def's any other way?


I ramp up the nutes as they need to stretch and transition and start building flowers then taper them back down as they ripen and need less. 

I grow in ocean forest from sprout or clone so well water only as I transplant up through veg. 

I only feed what I feel the plants need and once I start I feed mild each watering. 

If I get it right they never need leaching and stay nice and medium green or turn purple or what their genetics want. 

It ain't easy. I grow 8 different plants from seed or clone at a time a week apart usually so I mix individual feeds for each plant in flower as they need to be watered. 

No schedules.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 15, 2017)

Hey @JDMase here is a plant at peak concentration. About half of the manufacturer directions at this point and is fed/watered every 2 days.

 

She is still growing and stretching. I just had to tie down her stubborn supercropped tops. But if I stay at the max strength I ended up with her for too long she will start to show stress from the rising ec in the pot and the out of balance NPK and micros. (We feed the soil in a potting mix grow)

Note: the plant above shows a slight potassium deficiency. I had to raise her ec last feed. The low fans are thick and dark and curling down on the tips a bit. 

So I watch the plants and I monitor the ec in and out the runoff each watering and make a note. I know it is not accurate but it is consistent if I take the reading the same way every time so I pull the first cup out and measure. 

If it is rising higher than the input I lower the strength. If it keeps going down lower than the input they are likely hungry or some elements are missing and the soil will attract them. 

When I fed the above plant the ec out was lower than what I had just put in. This means that the soil attracted the positive ions that are are minerals that we feed them. 

Search for citation exchange or CEC for how elements work in a pot of mix. 

Here is a mostly tapered off 9.5 week plant. She is almost done and her leaves are still mostly soft and happy and she has just about all of them. And the cmh can bring out great colors. 

She needs the same concentration as the little veg plant she started flowering as now.


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## JDMase (May 15, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Hey @JDMase here is a plant at peak concentration. About half of the manufacturer directions at this point and is fed/watered every 2 days.
> 
> View attachment 3942692
> 
> ...


Yeah do you know what, I reject the norm I want to grow this way! I can't think or find any other mention of people killing their crops before harvesting, and it just doesn't make sense to me.. Im goin green all the way to the end with my next lot, hopefully will increase my yields further. Thanks @MichiganMedGrower for the detailed response.


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## churchhaze (May 18, 2017)

SouthCross said:


> Just when you think you've read it all.....*boiling roots.* Sticking them in ice...


When you boil the roots, the THC rises from the roots up into the crystals.... You will see the crystals rise up the stem slowly as soon as you start boiling... this indicates the highest level of THC.

*THC comes from the roots!! *


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## churchhaze (May 18, 2017)

Jon E. Doe said:


> Lotta farms around here. I never heard of any farmer intentionally denying his crop the elements it needs to grow. Not in the beginning, not at any point in the grow cycle, and certainly not near the end. Why abuse and potentially jeopardize your crop after many weeks of nurturing it?


Because this is RIU and the motto here is "Starve your young and old plants"


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 18, 2017)

churchhaze said:


> When you boil the roots, the THC rises from the roots up into the crystals.... You will see the crystals rise up the stem slowly as soon as you start boiling... this indicates the highest level of THC.
> 
> *THC comes from the roots!! *



6 months on RM3 dot com and they couldn't convince me to boil my plants. 

But your explanation has me putting a pot on the stove asap!

L O fucking L


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 18, 2017)

churchhaze said:


> Because this is RIU and the motto here is "Starve your young and old plants"


It works because of the other motto. "Remove any leaf blocking the buds"


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## churchhaze (May 18, 2017)

ConArtist3.com knows everything.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 18, 2017)

churchhaze said:


> ConArtist3.com knows everything.


They helped me cut my yield 30%. And I saved $2 on nutes to put toward my $500 of flourescent tubes I will apparently need to grow quality buds. 

I hope you aren't being sarcastic.


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## churchhaze (May 18, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> They helped me cut my yield 30%. And I saved $2 on nutes to put toward my $500 of flourescent tubes I will apparently need to grow quality buds.
> 
> I hope you aren't being sarcastic.


http://rollitup.org/t/smashing-fluorescent-lamps.864130/


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## churchhaze (May 18, 2017)

Also, plants that aren't stressed don't smell, sulfur feeds the trichs, load your plant with excessive levels of potassium because just do it, use WAY too much blue... and pay 1500 dollars for my genetics because it's the best weed in the entire universe.

Oh, and put a nail in the stem for good measure... the sap that comes out is pure THC.


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## Budley Doright (May 18, 2017)

churchhaze said:


> Also, plants that aren't stressed don't smell, sulfur feeds the trichs, load your plant with excessive levels of potassium because just do it, use WAY too much blue... and pay 1500 dollars for my genetics because it's the best weed in the entire universe.
> 
> Oh, and put a nail in the stem for good measure... the sap that comes out is pure THC.


By golly I think I read that on the message boards as well....yes did it . Lots of things that were written about back then are still done today with a twist. The pulling of fan leaves was not done for light, it was done so the plant would develop more larg branches, yup did that one too lol.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 18, 2017)

churchhaze said:


> http://rollitup.org/t/smashing-fluorescent-lamps.864130/


I can't believe I just read that whole thread. But pretty damn entertaining it was.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 18, 2017)

churchhaze said:


> Also, plants that aren't stressed don't smell, sulfur feeds the trichs, load your plant with excessive levels of potassium because just do it, use WAY too much blue... and pay 1500 dollars for my genetics because it's the best weed in the entire universe.
> 
> Oh, and put a nail in the stem for good measure... the sap that comes out is pure THC.


Well I had a patient in Colorado meet and try the $1500 (now only $80) weed and he found it pretty lacking. 

I haven't grown any. I do have a bunch of prized riddler genetics from hopeful riddlers but the riddler grown top of the line buds given to me here layed on my coffee table for 3 weeks. I couldn't give them away. Seriously. Everybody donated for real meds instead of taking the free Colorado Thunder Fuck. 

With a name like that we all expected more.


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## RM3 (May 19, 2017)

You two deserve each other LMAO


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 19, 2017)

RM3 said:


> You two deserve each other LMAO



There he is. The self proclaimed myth propagating forum "expert" here to defend the boiling, over nuting, continuous flushing and generally complicating the growing of our beloved plant. 

You are stuck in "Neverland"

Rid Grows Mids. 

Seeing you made me lol too. Thanks. I needed the laugh.


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## jarvild (May 19, 2017)

I just love how the human race tries to control everything, 10,000+ years of evolution of this plant and we think we can make a difference in our short time on this world.


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## Budley Doright (May 19, 2017)

jarvild said:


> I just love how the human race tries to control everything, 10,000+ years of evolution of this plant and we think we can make a difference in our short time on this world.


Well we kind of have made a huge difference be it good or bad. When I first started growing all I could get my hands on were long finishing Mexican and south American bag seed, not conducive for my grow Zone lol, and the odd Eurasian stuff. Now we have hybrids, auto's, and femmed stuff. Like I said good and bad changes lol. Nothing wrong with progress as long as we don't lose site of the goals or do harm in the mean time IMO. As for this fued with Rid well that has been covered and is now getting a little overboard boardering stalkish lol ...... one love boys, one love lol.


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## jarvild (May 19, 2017)

churchhaze said:


> Also, plants that aren't stressed don't smell, sulfur feeds the trichs, load your plant with excessive levels of potassium because just do it, use WAY too much blue... and pay 1500 dollars for my genetics because it's the best weed in the entire universe.
> 
> Oh, and put a nail in the stem for good measure... the sap that comes out is pure THC.


 Or how we did it in the 70s'. Pull the plants whole and wrap some old towels around the root ball and soak the towels with sugar water and hang upside down in the dark for a week so the THC would drain from roots to the trichomes.


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## jarvild (May 19, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> Well we kind of have made a huge difference be it good or bad. When I first started growing all I could get my hands on were long finishing Mexican and south American bag seed, not conducive for my grow Zone lol, and the odd Eurasian stuff. Now we have hybrids, auto's, and femmed stuff. Like I said good and bad changes lol. Nothing wrong with progress as long as we don't lose site of the goals or do harm in the mean time IMO. As for this fued with Rid well that has been covered and is now getting a little overboard boardering stalkish lol ...... one love boys, one love lol.


 I never made any remarks personally against Rid, to each their own. And I've been there with trying to grow sativas in the midwestern climate since 71.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 19, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> Well we kind of have made a huge difference be it good or bad. When I first started growing all I could get my hands on were long finishing Mexican and south American bag seed, not conducive for my grow Zone lol, and the odd Eurasian stuff. Now we have hybrids, auto's, and femmed stuff. Like I said good and bad changes lol. Nothing wrong with progress as long as we don't lose site of the goals or do harm in the mean time IMO. As for this fued with Rid well that has been covered and is now getting a little overboard boardering stalkish lol ...... one love boys, one love lol.


I don't have a fued with rid. He wronged me in a very bad way and deserves punishment. Fuck one love. Rid is a rat. This online shit is just for entertainment purposes.


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## Budley Doright (May 19, 2017)

jarvild said:


> I never made any remarks personally against Rid, to each their own. And I've been there with trying to grow sativas in the midwestern climate since 71.


In no way was I referring to you, sorry for the misunderstanding, I should have broken up the quotes my bad


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## Budley Doright (May 19, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I don't have a fued with rid. He wronged me in a very bad way and deserves punishment. Fuck one love. Rid is a rat. This online shit is just for entertainment purposes.


It didnt seem like entertainment and until now thought it had been put to bed . And trust me I've always questioned his motives when there was denial of any intention of financial gain on his part 6-7 years ago. You know, when seed banks were evil lol. But I'm not attacking him for it and Karma is a bitch FYI so sit back and just be patient lol.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 19, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> It didnt seem like entertainment and until now thought it had been put to bed . And trust me I've always questioned his motives when there was denial of any intention of financial gain on his part 6-7 years ago. You know, when seed banks were evil lol. But I'm not attacking him for it and Karma is a bitch FYI so sit back and just be patient lol.


I don't believe in karma or hippie love everyone crap. And I meant entertainment for me. He wronged me personally and my friend. 

And he took action first. I only private messaged him my opinion. He made this public. 

He is not very smart. And now I don't read rm3 this and rm3 that around here anymore so much. So what I did was worth it. 

If he talked shit and had great weed instead of underdeveloped stressed out flowers making empty trichomes I would have showed more respect. 

He is over as far as I am concerned. I don't like him farming for noobs. And I don't like that he Cherry pics articles for manipulation without even quoting the author. Then he accepts compliments on the info as if he discovered something himself. 

No more without challenge. 

And he has every right to post his opinion too. Too bad his is wrong. Lol. 

I'm blocked from his and ttydicks journals. So they can hide in their room if they don't like to be proven wrong. 

And they will just keep pretending they are authorities there as internet fame is more important to both of them than meds are. 

Sorry Budly. I know it is out of hand. It is my choice. Until I can get to Colorado again to confront him I am holding on to a lot of anger about him. 

Like you said. It will eventually work itself out. Just Karma isn't involved. Rat justice is.


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## shortybeavers3000 (May 19, 2017)

subbed!


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## Dogenzengi (May 19, 2017)

Subbed!

Sulphur!


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## Budley Doright (May 19, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I don't believe in karma or hippie love everyone crap. And I meant entertainment for me. He wronged me personally and my friend.
> 
> And he took action first. I only private messaged him my opinion. He made this public.
> 
> ...


Well ok then carry on lol.


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## Budley Doright (May 19, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I don't believe in karma or hippie love everyone crap. And I meant entertainment for me. He wronged me personally and my friend.
> 
> And he took action first. I only private messaged him my opinion. He made this public.
> 
> ...


That's a Bob Marley song BTW not hippie shit lol.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 19, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> That's a Bob Marley song BTW not hippie shit lol.


Lol.


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## Dogenzengi (May 19, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> Well we kind of have made a huge difference be it good or bad. When I first started growing all I could get my hands on were long finishing Mexican and south American bag seed, not conducive for my grow Zone lol, and the odd Eurasian stuff. Now we have hybrids, auto's, and femmed stuff. Like I said good and bad changes lol. Nothing wrong with progress as long as we don't lose site of the goals or do harm in the mean time IMO. As for this fued with Rid well that has been covered and is now getting a little overboard boardering stalkish lol ...... one love boys, one love lol.



Yes very stalkerish


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## ALong14U (May 20, 2017)

Anth88 said:


> hi. this post is for your end of cycle techniques.
> this could be anything that you do or dint do towards the the end of flower and to your plants. you might flush or you might leach instead. you may add cool air and ice or you might prefer to boil your root zone to start fermentation early. this post is for every1s routines, ideas and theory.


Flushing is a muth. Grow in dirt it takes 5 to 7 days for crappy symptoms to arise whether overfeeding. Over water humid what not. Push the as high as you can until the first quarter inch of all leafs are Burnt from nutes. This means plant is using all it can and your not over feeding to kill leafs buds roots what not. Slowly increase. 1/⁴ to 1/³ to start and up ppms every feed until you notice what I described above. Last feeding before you chop plants flush container with 5x volume of any water pH don't matter. Leave in pots until you notice droop from under watering that's pretty severe. Then chop manicure and prepare for cure. Taste and smoothness comes from. Cure not flush!


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## RM3 (May 20, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I don't believe in karma or hippie love everyone crap. And I meant entertainment for me. He wronged me personally and my friend.
> 
> And he took action first. I only private messaged him my opinion. He made this public.
> 
> ...


It's a shame that my methods and results have been duplicated by many 

even more so that you can't seem to stop making threats 

Bein butt hurt in public does seem to be your karma?


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## RM3 (May 20, 2017)

Funny how you say I grow mids when there are several growers that put my CTF in their top 10 best strains list 

"blow some of those ctf's up and you wont need to search too much,she grows easy,yields medium to heavy,and clones like dandylions,buzz is a good blend of indie and sat,with nice flavor and bouquet ....sits high in my top ten fo sho.....js"


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## RM3 (May 20, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I'm blocked from his and ttydicks journals. So they can hide in their room if they don't like to be proven wrong.


You should call him so he can respond to your nonsense
@ttystikk


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

RM3 said:


> You should call him so he can respond to your nonsense
> @ttystikk


You don't even quote the writer of the review you post. We all know it's a friend invested in you. 

Still need money from internet noobs? I still don't get why the man with the best weed in the world is broke. Oh yeah. CTF is Mids. Better weed on every corner where you live. 

Wasn't a patient that needs meds review of your personal stash and me and my patients here all sampling your followers version enough to know it's weak and not medically viable at all?

The CTF I sampled here is the plant you put up on your seed sale page. It wasn't a good enough example?

The testers are all heavy daily users. Not a lightweight like you. 

If it was as good as you said I would grow it for sure. I am trying other plants your people love. Unfortunately so far. 

I gave plenty of you much better seeds. The ones I got back from the riddler collection have been problematic so far. Even your members favorites. 

I was going to send you a pack at my expense but you became even more of an ass to me. 

The breeder I use most has advanced MS. But because of his plants he is still able to tend to hundreds of plants every day. 

The same medicine is healing some people close to me as you know. Lab tests and specialists have confirmed it. We don't take pharmaceuticals or trust doctors much anymore. But hospital lab tests do not lie. 

You are a fraud who names his website after himself to feel important. And puts up donation pages for his own business agenda. 

And what are you breeding with? 8 fully seeded plants? How can you even guarantee stability? You sure must have a lot of untested seeds handy. You're not selling those I hope. Lol.

And your "expert" growing friend you are calling for assistance is shut down for breaking rule number one. Don't talk to cops. Duh!

A rat and an idiot. You two make a wonderful pair. 

All you had to do was respond to a patient (who did not have stellar feedback for you so you ignored him) and answer my private message challenging you rather than posting only one part of the conversation publically to make me look bad before you had to admit you are a complete fraud. 

The funniest part of all this is you invited me in to your little fraternity. And I was making fun of you and your methods when you did. 

You have discovered and invented nothing. You propogate myth only. Even your posts all scream permanent newbie. 

Still haven't seen a whole garden or even a whole plant pic from you here. 

Thanks for stopping in. Always a pleasure.


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## RM3 (May 20, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> All you had to do was respond to a patient (who did not have stellar feedback for you so you ignored him) and answer my private message challenging you rather than posting only one part of the conversation publically to make me look bad before you had to admit you are a complete fraud.


Dude only took 3 hits and said so in an email and you call me a light weight LMAO


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

RM3 said:


> Dude only took 3 hits and said so in an email and you call me a light weight LMAO


He took 3 hits per hour as you instructed. When he asked for more to be sure it wasn't him and maybe mood or tolerance you did not respond. 

And I told you he was trying to be nice to you for giving him the free weed. But "heady" means weak and no medical effect. 

He told you the weed was heady and the cob tasted delicious. And I am sure both of those things are true. 

If you stop over nuting and flushing and get some good light on your plants maybe they will get people high at least. Maybe. I'm sure the plants you started with were fine.


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## Dr. Who (May 20, 2017)

JDMase said:


> Do you think full nutrients till the end then? No autumn leaves just green till the chop? Im pretty sure ive seen people mention that no other industry flushes.. _But saying that I don't know how I would be able to get over my nute lockouts or tox/def's any other way?_



Don't over feed to start! Solves a shit ton of problems....


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## Dr. Who (May 20, 2017)

churchhaze said:


> When you boil the roots, the THC rises from the roots up into the crystals.... You will see the crystals rise up the stem slowly as soon as you start boiling... this indicates the highest level of THC.
> 
> *THC comes from the roots!! *


What? You don't really? Nah, you don't...........He's kidding kiddies!


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## RM3 (May 20, 2017)

You need to just get over your butt hurt and open your mind, you've been growin for 3 years, hell I've been postin on this site for 9 LMAO


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

RM3 said:


> You need to just get over your butt hurt and open your mind, you've been growin for 3 years, hell I've been postin on this site for 9 LMAO


You sure want your post count to be your growing credibility.

So your saying you have been posting 3x as long as I have been growing and that means your weed is better than we think?

And as usual. By open mind. You mean support you and your myth. 

Ahh. No.


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## SSGrower (May 20, 2017)

Can we start calling it bolting instead of streching? 
1. Bolting sounds cooler
2. It is in fact what they are doing

And though flushing does not happen in a natural situation leaching does.

Ice, snow, boil, rollin a fatty with wet popcorn and lettin it siit for a month.....


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## KryptoBud (May 20, 2017)

[QUOTE="ALong14U, post: 13541595, member: 968798"*]Flushing is a muth.* Grow in dirt it takes 5 to 7 days for crappy symptoms to arise whether overfeeding. Over water humid what not. Push the as high as you can until the first quarter inch of all leafs are Burnt from nutes. This means plant is using all it can and your not over feeding to kill leafs buds roots what not. Slowly increase. 1/⁴ to 1/³ to start and up ppms every feed until you notice what I described above.* Last feeding before you chop plants flush container with 5x volume of any water pH don't matter. *Leave in pots until you notice droop from under watering that's pretty severe. Then chop manicure and prepare for cure. Taste and smoothness comes from. *Cure not flush!*[/QUOTE]



What's 5x the volume of water do?


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## Budley Doright (May 20, 2017)

KryptoBud said:


> [QUOTE="ALong14U, post: 13541595, member: 968798"*]Flushing is a muth.* Grow in dirt it takes 5 to 7 days for crappy symptoms to arise whether overfeeding. Over water humid what not. Push the as high as you can until the first quarter inch of all leafs are Burnt from nutes. This means plant is using all it can and your not over feeding to kill leafs buds roots what not. Slowly increase. 1/⁴ to 1/³ to start and up ppms every feed until you notice what I described above.* Last feeding before you chop plants flush container with 5x volume of any water pH don't matter. *Leave in pots until you notice droop from under watering that's pretty severe. Then chop manicure and prepare for cure. Taste and smoothness comes from. *Cure not flush!*




What's 5x the volume of water do?[/QUOTE]
I believe it's a flush lol. And let 1/4" tip of plant burn, why? Why not get to just before the burning stage?


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## ALong14U (May 20, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> What's 5x the volume of water do?


I believe it's a flush lol. And let 1/4" tip of plant burn, why? Why not get to just before the burning stage?[/QUOTE]
5x volume on the very last watering in dirt. 
Most people in dirt flush for something crazy like 2 or 3 weeks. 

I explained why I burn just the very tip. To me it means plant is using everything it can. Without burning it with nutes. When I say burn the tip I mean a 1/8 in or less of the tips turn a little yellow. Nothing like a real nute burn.


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## ALong14U (May 20, 2017)

ALong14U said:


> I believe it's a flush lol. And let 1/4" tip of plant burn, why? Why not get to just before the burning stage?


5x volume on the very last watering in dirt.
Most people in dirt flush for something crazy like 2 or 3 weeks.

I explained why I burn just the very tip. To me it means plant is using everything it can. Without burning it with nutes. When I say burn the tip I mean a 1/8 in or less of the tips turn a little yellow. Nothing like a real nute burn.[/QUOTE]
Again this is just what works for me? To each his own.


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## ANC (May 20, 2017)

And then take a dump in the pot to show the plant who is the boss.


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## ALong14U (May 20, 2017)

KryptoBud said:


> [QUOTE="ALong14U, post: 13541595, member: 968798"*]Flushing is a muth.* Grow in dirt it takes 5 to 7 days for crappy symptoms to arise whether overfeeding. Over water humid what not. Push the as high as you can until the first quarter inch of all leafs are Burnt from nutes. This means plant is using all it can and your not over feeding to kill leafs buds roots what not. Slowly increase. 1/⁴ to 1/³ to start and up ppms every feed until you notice what I described above.* Last feeding before you chop plants flush container with 5x volume of any water pH don't matter. *Leave in pots until you notice droop from under watering that's pretty severe. Then chop manicure and prepare for cure. Taste and smoothness comes from. *Cure not flush!*




What's 5x the volume of water do?[/QUOTE]
I recycled my soil. So to me it's getting the dirt cleaned of salts before the chop. That's the only reason I do the 5x.


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## RM3 (May 20, 2017)

ALong14U said:


> What's 5x the volume of water do?


I recycled my soil. So to me it's getting the dirt cleaned of salts before the chop. That's the only reason I do the 5x.[/QUOTE]
Should try the boil, lot less water, same results


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

RM3 said:


> I recycled my soil. So to me it's getting the dirt cleaned of salts before the chop. That's the only reason I do the 5x.


Should try the boil, lot less water, same results[/QUOTE]

LOFL

Neither does anything but ruin the cec of the soil. Whatever the plant converted is there to stay. If you overfed it's way too late. 

And please don't start again with your cartoon pseudo-science about fermentation. 

Actually defends pouring boiling water in his garden. Continual LOLing. 

I still can't believe you got anyone else to do it with the shitty plants you have in your "books"


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## RM3 (May 20, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I still can't believe you got anyone else to do it with the shitty plants you have in your "books"


yeah so shitty
.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

RM3 said:


> yeah so shitty
> .
> View attachment 3945975


Pretty leafy bud. Looks tiny too. Why do you always crop the pics so tight? 

Newbies do that to hide their necrotic and missing leaves.


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## RM3 (May 20, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Pretty leafy bud. Looks tiny too. Why do you always crop the pics so tight?
> 
> Newbies do that to hide their necrotic and missing leaves.


I like lookin at the trics


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

RM3 said:


> I like lookin at the trics


Here look at these. Grown with very little experience in expensive fox farm soil and fertilized with your dreaded bottled nutes. 

I am sorry they are not as good as you think yours are. I'm doing my best. Glad I used verified quality genetics from a life long breeder who has been published numerous times. 

The last plant is from your guy. It's a Classic Seeds Headband. Potent for sure. But with a flat boring buzz that lasts about an hour and tastes and smells terrible. Obvious elite clone pollen chuck. And all leafy like your plants. 

Way better OG's and diesels out there. 

Except for your forums favorite Headband these are the plants that are melting Mrs. MMG's cysts. 

They also helped the patient in questions tinnitus when yours did nothing. And they have his nerve damaged immobile arm playing guitar for hours after years of inability. 

Again. Yours didn't help him at all. He got a light head buzz he could focus on is all he said. 

Great trippy uplifting highs with real medical effects proven from the below buds. 

You contribute nothing but what feeds your ego. 

    
This is a perfect example of terrible breeding. But it sure is frosty. Lol.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

Look at that @RM3 

Your buds are less frosty than mine now. I had been growing about 3 more months than when I met you for a couple of these pics. 

Maybe you should ditch the potassium sulfate. And the cat litter clogged compacted old used up peat. 

And your expensive aquarium bulbs are not doing their job. 

I expected much better even from you.


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## Budley Doright (May 20, 2017)

"And your "expert" growing friend you are calling for assistance is shut down for breaking rule numberone. Don't talk to cops. Duh!"
Say what???? Talking about what, this site?


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## Dr.Nick Riviera (May 20, 2017)




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## ttystikk (May 20, 2017)

RM3 said:


> You should call him so he can respond to your nonsense
> @ttystikk


Yeah, don't bother with him anymore. He can't be wrong, the rest of the world just needs to admit it.


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## juman (May 20, 2017)

> The last plant is from your guy. It's a Classic Seeds Headband.


Should be enough to show you know nothing of what you speak of. Classic isn't a member of RM3 forums, I don't even know if Rid and him have ever spoken but Classic's a good dude breeding good plants, just doing his own thing. So, you in your infinite wisdom have decided to start lambasting someone without any association to Rid, solely to try and grow your "I'm right" boner (it's still tiny though). Boy you run around with something big between your shoulders, unfortunately it seems to be filled with rocks.


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## juman (May 20, 2017)

Also I want to point out, MMG, you were fully welcomed to our community, we supported your growing (I know you felt differently) and you were even given free seeds but what did you do with that? You turn you back, bash anyone from there and bitch about said free seeds. Sounds like you have earned your reputation and I would highly advise anyone else thinking of meeting/talking/working with MMG on any sort of level to be very weary. He is THE reason to distrust people online.

Sorry for derailing your thread Anth88 but that dude is a douche. To keep on-topic, I go with none, plants get some light 'flush' but not really, keep them green as can be and harvest. After years of growing I've found it's whatever you feel most comfortable with and what you like the results from best, it's subjective.


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## Budley Doright (May 20, 2017)

Could be me but I think they all look like nice plants ..... . and as Juman says it's really up to you wether you actually flush, or tapper off, or do nothing IMO. I have flushed plants that actually did get rid of a taste from an additive that should never have been used but was recommended by, what I thought, was a knowledgable person. Mostly though it doesn't do anything when grown properly and not force fed in my setup. Yup try a couple of different ways and see what works with what you do.
Edit: if I've learned one thing here it is keep em green as long as you can, makes for a better tasting, higher yielding plant if you don't take em early.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

juman said:


> Should be enough to show you know nothing of what you speak of. Classic isn't a member of RM3 forums, I don't even know if Rid and him have ever spoken but Classic's a good dude breeding good plants, just doing his own thing. So, you in your infinite wisdom have decided to start lambasting someone without any association to Rid, solely to try and grow your "I'm right" boner (it's still tiny though). Boy you run around with something big between your shoulders, unfortunately it seems to be filled with rocks.



I meant the RM3 genetics "expert". Tjack. It's you who seems to be arguing about nothing. I actually expect more from you. 

And I never said the classic dude wasn't a good guy. I don't know him. I just know his plant was the only plant out of 12 that sucked at the time and my patients did not want it over any other strain offered. 

i would think what he did to me on his site would bother you. But you are invested in the idiot. 

I really thought you were much smarter than your comment shows.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Yeah, don't bother with him anymore. He can't be wrong, the rest of the world just needs to admit it.


You are talking about yourself goof ball. 

And did you read about and contact Natural Opthalmics? They really may be able to help with the Macular degeneration you are always talking about. It was curable the whole time. 

I have years of experience with them in the natural eye care industry. 

Hope it helps. 

Glad you stopped in. You are the biggest fraud here.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> "And your "expert" growing friend you are calling for assistance is shut down for breaking rule numberone. Don't talk to cops. Duh!"
> Say what???? Talking about what, this site?


Talkin about dumb ass @ttystikk 

He had a thread about how important he is as a spokesperson for legal marijuana so he invited the cops right in. They sighted him. They came back and fucked him out of everything. 

And it's because he didn't trim his crop near a carbon filter and pissed his neighbor off. 

You don't talk to cops willingly and you obviously don't want your neighbors knowing. 

He is fucking terrible at this grower thing. Every aspect.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

Dr.Nick Riviera said:


>



Lol

At you.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

juman said:


> Also I want to point out, MMG, you were fully welcomed to our community, we supported your growing (I know you felt differently) and you were even given free seeds but what did you do with that? You turn you back, bash anyone from there and bitch about said free seeds. Sounds like you have earned your reputation and I would highly advise anyone else thinking of meeting/talking/working with MMG on any sort of level to be very weary. He is THE reason to distrust people online.
> 
> Sorry for derailing your thread Anth88 but that dude is a douche. To keep on-topic, I go with none, plants get some light 'flush' but not really, keep them green as can be and harvest. After years of growing I've found it's whatever you feel most comfortable with and what you like the results from best, it's subjective.



I didn't feel that way about any of you but rm3. He is the one who continually "corrected" my info and said stupid growing shit. 

And I got free seeds. Many are bad. The seeds I gave out were at my own expense and bred and tested by a professional breeder. 

I got s-1's of pollen chucks mostly. I'm sorry I fell for any of the rm3 lie. 

And I am still friends with people there. Just not anyone who defends rm3. He is a known public rat. It's funny how many of you think he is an idiot. 

I am surprised you support him after what he did.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> Could be me but I think they all look like nice plants ..... . and as Juman says it's really up to you wether you actually flush, or tapper off, or do nothing IMO. I have flushed plants that actually did get rid of a taste from an additive that should never have been used but was recommended by, what I thought, was a knowledgable person. Mostly though it doesn't do anything when grown properly and not force fed in my setup. Yup try a couple of different ways and see what works with what you do.
> Edit: if I've learned one thing here it is keep em green as long as you can, makes for a better tasting, higher yielding plant if you don't take em early.


Your last statement is something I agree with whole heartedly. 

But nothing was ever "flushed"out of your plant. You can wash out the medium only. If it was taken up by the plant it is converted and in it already.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

You are down to 2 weak defenders @RM3 

And one of them is the biggest joke on this site. 

The other is a kind, smart individual who I can't figure out why he doesn't see through your crap. 

But I have said this before. I did not join your site to make friends. I wanted to read your over sold "books" there. 

You never even wrote any book. Just more ego threads. 

And your methods and results are funny.


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## Budley Doright (May 20, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Your last statement is something I agree with whole heartedly.
> 
> But nothing was ever "flushed"out of your plant. You can wash out the medium only. If it was taken up by the plant it is converted and in it already.


I've asked many people how it was possible that it took the taste away because, yup it did, and everyone was stumped as am I but again it did work and saved half a run. It was Kinetin (sorry for spelling). After harvesting a few of the early plants from the tray I noticed the taste which was unsmokable. The other half was run to finish two weeks later with just plain water and those plants were fine, not sure why but I did flush .


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> I've asked many people how it was possible that it took the taste away because, yup it did, and everyone was stumped as am I but again it did work and saved half a run. It was Kinetin (sorry for spelling). After harvesting a few of the early plants from the tray I noticed the taste which was unsmokable. The other half was run to finish two weeks later with just plain water and those plants were fine, not sure why but I did flush .


I had to look that hormone up. 

Maybe the substance has a half life in the plant and is eliminated eventually like avid or other chemical pesticides. 

that kinetic was isolated from herring sperm for its cell deviding properties from what I just read. 

Yuck!


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## Budley Doright (May 20, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I had to look that hormone up.
> 
> Maybe the substance has a half life in the plant and is eliminated eventually like avid or other chemical pesticides.
> 
> ...


Nope it's plant derived growth regulator. And possible, all I do know is the smell/taste was gone after two weeks of flushing. As I will never use it again I'll never know lol.


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## MichiganMedGrower (May 20, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> Nope it's plant derived growth regulator. And possible, all I do know is the smell/taste was gone after two weeks of flushing. As I will never use it again I'll never know lol.


Read this link below. It's originally derived from the sperm of a herring. It causes cell division and is used as a plant growth hormone.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinetin


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## Budley Doright (May 21, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Read this link below. It's originally derived from the sperm of a herring. It causes cell division and is used as a plant growth hormone.
> 
> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinetin


Cool I didn't know where it "originally" was isolated but the product I used was derived from plants, kelp I thought, but as I said I don't use it as I didn't see any thing good, just a horrible taste lol. I have a lab close by that is always producing new plant nutrients for agro buisness and use their stuff, they have actually stopped making that particular product, they are concentrating on lots of organic with one being for hydro, not brave enough to try that one lol.


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## Dr. Who (May 21, 2017)

Hm


SSGrower said:


> Can we start calling it bolting instead of streching?
> 1. Bolting sounds cooler
> 2. It is in fact what they are doing
> 
> ...


Ah! The "let the plant use up whats left" argument?

Consider the fact that your attempting to lower nutrient levels in the buds, right? Yet where do you think the plants nutrition is going , when it moves to other parts of the plant? TO those buds your attempting to remove it from!

Doesn't work then does it?

Unless your simply removing excess salts for reusing the soil.


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## Budley Doright (May 21, 2017)

Perhaps using queen Ann's lace potted plants and adding food color until it changes color then flushing for two weeks to see if you can revert it back to white would provide some insight into anything leaving the plant could be cool. Any thoughts? I won't be doing it soon as I just had a giant hole cut into my butt . I'm bored and thinking way to much lol.


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## Budley Doright (May 21, 2017)

Dr. Who said:


> Hm
> 
> 
> Ah! The "let the plant use up whats left" argument?
> ...


But what if after all of the nutrients are gone and no more are moved to the buds would it not use those up as well? Just asking as you guys are way more into the science of it than I am, I'm a water, add nutes, grow and smoke kinda guy lol.


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## BobCajun (May 21, 2017)

I think the main thing flushing does is to stop supplying nitrates so that the plant will use up all that it has absorbed to makes proteins etc, which are less harmful and harsh than nitrates. Apparently it takes plants some time to use up the nitrate that way so at least a few days of no nitrates is advisable. They reduce nitrates in vegetables the same way, cutting back on nitrate fertilizers before harvest. It's the only way to reduce them. You could still use other types of nitrogen, like urea. I don't know what the effect of phosphates are, I guess not as bad as nitrates since you never hear about too much phosphate in vegetables.


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## Budley Doright (May 21, 2017)

Well I must admit that even as a non flusher I am curious and open to all aspects of growing methods and yes, now that I'm eligible for Denny's discount, the whole learning the science thing has become less and less important lol. Most of my learning is/has been done by fucking things up and learning not to do that again lol. The flushing debate has always intrigued me .


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## Jon E. Doe (May 21, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> Well I must admit that even as a non flusher I am curious and open to all aspects of growing methods and yes, now that I'm eligible for Denny's discount, the whole learning the science thing has become less and less important lol. Most of my learning is/has been done by fucking things up and learning not to do that again lol. The flushing debate has always intrigued me .


Yep


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## Dr. Who (May 21, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> But what if after all of the nutrients are gone and no more are moved to the buds would it not use those up as well? Just asking as you guys are way more into the science of it than I am, I'm a water, add nutes, grow and smoke kinda guy lol.


The plant won't live that long - You'll have gone way past the harvest point.

Keep 'em green..... I do a multiple harvest on many of my plants. I want the successive harvests to be as ripe as the first. I tend to keep those green also. You tend to get the plant dropping it's NPK use and/or I might use more K and influence the coloring some more.....If time is in my favor.


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## Budley Doright (May 21, 2017)

Dr. Who said:


> The plant won't live that long - You'll have gone way past the harvest point.
> 
> Keep 'em green..... I do a multiple harvest on many of my plants. I want the successive harvests to be as ripe as the first. I tend to keep those green also. You tend to get the plant dropping it's NPK use and/or I might use more K and influence the coloring some more.....If time is in my favor.


Makes sense but if a two week flush effects yield then things happen quickly and to effect yield it must be due to lack of nuetrients. The thing that is bulking up is the buds at this point so if yield is effected they must be at the point that there is little or no food left to feed on. Sorry Doc, just thinking out loud here, and again I've not seen a difference between flushed and not, other than some partly harvested plants I've left with no food and just water floods limited almost seem to go dormant with hairs staying white and no growth, but not dying. Probably left a few weeks before pulling them.


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## SSGrower (May 21, 2017)

Dr. Who said:


> Hm
> 
> 
> Ah! The "let the plant use up whats left" argument?
> ...


Apreceiate the response sir and no disrespect but not quite. I am quasi rols and believe the cold ice/snow does something more. I wont likely boil again bad for the microbes and such. Progressive harvest is good too. I fertilize with home made ferments lately...

The litin it sit for a month was in referenc to the joint rolled, i do my best to keep em green, but I f it up now and agian.

I'm glad to try any of your suggestions and have gaind much insight from your posts already.


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## BobCajun (May 22, 2017)

Maybe more important than stopping supplying nitrates is to give the plants 24 hours of darkness before harvest. Why? Because of starch. If you harvest at the end or even middle of the light period there will be a lot of starch stored up and that will result in more weight but also more harshness and lower potency, because obviously more inert weight will lower the overall THC percentage of that weight. Say there's 10% starch, potency is 10% lower. That's significant and I think plants store more than 10% starch though I don't have figures on it. Most starch would be used up for energy by the end of a 12 hour night but 24 hours makes sure it's all gone. 

If you read about science class experiments about starch in leaves you'll see that they recommend 24 hours darkness to get a starch free leaf. That's my basis for suggesting 24 rather than 12 or more than 24. After 24 I assume a plant would start using up other compounds for energy. Might be good, might not. Nobody ever did real scientific experiments to find out. Maybe it starts using cannabinoids as an energy source eventually or maybe it uses up stuff that's not good anyway, like say proteins. Smoking protein isn't a great idea. All those legal Cannabis groweries in several states and nobody bothered to investigate the results of extended darkness and also nobody in Holland.


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## SSGrower (May 22, 2017)

BobCajun said:


> Maybe more important than stopping supplying nitrates is to give the plants 24 hours of darkness before harvest. Why? Because of starch. If you harvest at the end or even middle of the light period there will be a lot of starch stored up and that will result in more weight but also more harshness and lower potency, because obviously more inert weight will lower the overall THC percentage of that weight. Say there's 10% starch, potency is 10% lower. That's significant and I think plants store more than 10% starch though I don't have figures on it. Most starch would be used up for energy by the end of a 12 hour night but 24 hours makes sure it's all gone.
> 
> If you read about science class experiments about starch in leaves you'll see that they recommend 24 hours darkness to get a starch free leaf. That's my basis for suggesting 24 rather than 12 or more than 24. After 24 I assume a plant would start using up other compounds for energy. Might be good, might not. Nobody ever did real scientific experiments to find out. Maybe it starts using cannabinoids as an energy source eventually or maybe it uses up stuff that's not good anyway, like say proteins. Smoking protein isn't a great idea. All those legal Cannabis groweries in several states and nobody bothered to investigate the results of extended darkness and also nobody in Holland.


Why would this be necessary? The plants cells will live for days and even weeks after being cut. If you are curing in darknees how would 24 HR dark make any difference?


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## churchhaze (May 22, 2017)

BobCajun said:


> Maybe more important than stopping supplying nitrates is to give the plants 24 hours of darkness before harvest. Why? Because of starch. If you harvest at the end or even middle of the light period there will be a lot of starch stored up and that will result in more weight but also more harshness and lower potency, because obviously more inert weight will lower the overall THC percentage of that weight. Say there's 10% starch, potency is 10% lower. That's significant and I think plants store more than 10% starch though I don't have figures on it. Most starch would be used up for energy by the end of a 12 hour night but 24 hours makes sure it's all gone.
> 
> If you read about science class experiments about starch in leaves you'll see that they recommend 24 hours darkness to get a starch free leaf. That's my basis for suggesting 24 rather than 12 or more than 24. After 24 I assume a plant would start using up other compounds for energy. Might be good, might not. Nobody ever did real scientific experiments to find out. Maybe it starts using cannabinoids as an energy source eventually or maybe it uses up stuff that's not good anyway, like say proteins. Smoking protein isn't a great idea. All those legal Cannabis groweries in several states and nobody bothered to investigate the results of extended darkness and also nobody in Holland.





SSGrower said:


> Why would this be necessary? The plants cells will live for days and even weeks after being cut. If you are curing in darknees how would 24 HR dark make any difference?


It takes exactly 1 dark period's worth of time for the _leaves_ to use nearly all of their stored starch. The plant remembers how long nights last and burns starch at a rate where it will run out after exactly 1 dark period. Assuming the dark period is 12 hours, it will take 12 hours for the leaves to use all their starch. After 12 hours of darkness and the plant will simply stop growing in an attempt to survive long enough for the lights to come back on.

Will this make a difference in the final product? It's hard to say...


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## SSGrower (May 23, 2017)

churchhaze said:


> It takes exactly 1 dark period's worth of time for the _leaves_ to use nearly all of their stored starch. The plant remembers how long nights last and burns starch at a rate where it will run out after exactly 1 dark period. Assuming the dark period is 12 hours, it will take 12 hours for the leaves to use all their starch. After 12 hours of darkness and the plant will simply stop growing in an attempt to survive long enough for the lights to come back on.
> 
> Will this make a difference in the final product? It's hard to say...


Hey Church, you related to Stephen A Smith (the sports analyst)? You very effectvely talk without saying anything specific. When you use terms like exactly and nearly in the same sentence, I'm not saying what your saying doesn't make any sense, I'm just sayin....

 out


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## BobCajun (May 23, 2017)

churchhaze said:


> It takes exactly 1 dark period's worth of time for the _leaves_ to use nearly all of their stored starch. The plant remembers how long nights last and burns starch at a rate where it will run out after exactly 1 dark period. Assuming the dark period is 12 hours, it will take 12 hours for the leaves to use all their starch. After 12 hours of darkness and the plant will simply stop growing in an attempt to survive long enough for the lights to come back on.
> 
> Will this make a difference in the final product? It's hard to say...


Yeah supposedly they use it all up during the usual night length but I've also read about there still being a considerable amount in some plants. I know for sure that all starch is gone in 24 hours dark, from the classic experiment I mentioned. You could do a test yourself as described in the experiment which is easy to find. I really doubt that there will be no starch at all after 12 hours dark. Interestingly, this page says 48 hours; "Keep enough plants for the investigation in a dark place for 48 hours so that they use up their stored starch." source They usually say 24 though.http://www.nuffieldfoundation.org/practical-biology/identifying-conditions-needed-photosynthesis


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## churchhaze (May 23, 2017)

SSGrower said:


> Hey Church, you related to Stephen A Smith (the sports analyst)? You very effectvely talk without saying anything specific. When you use terms like exactly and nearly in the same sentence, I'm not saying what your saying doesn't make any sense, I'm just sayin....
> 
> out


Okay.


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## SSGrower (May 24, 2017)

churchhaze said:


> Okay.


I dont think we differ too much on the idea of 24 hr dark advantage/disadvantage question, and didnt mean to offend, i just found it amusing the way you presented it


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## BlueRidgeGrower (May 30, 2017)

Dr.Nick Riviera said:


>


I see you all over RIU trollin. Stay on it. Got me dying.


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## JDMase (May 30, 2017)

So, summing up, reduce nutes until harvest then 24-48 hours of dark before chop? 

Got it


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