# I am paying far to much for power,what can i do to pay less?



## headbandrocker (Aug 4, 2014)

I have a residential property and I am interested in ways to lower my pge bill,right now im being raped by pge and want to figure out if there is a program or some other way to drastically reduce my monthly bill.(besides cfl and led lol)
I have heard of agricultural meters,commercial rates,and medical baseline and even getting first tier electric prices by getting an electric vehicle.
Any help on this would be greatly appreciated.
Pretty sure my usage puts me outside of the care program,it was nice while it lasted but now im payin full price for power and need to solve this dilema soon.
What can i do to save money with the power co?


----------



## SnapsProvolone (Aug 4, 2014)

Every provider is different. 

Some plans charge less for nighttime kWh (off peak)


----------



## Diabolical666 (Aug 4, 2014)

What kind of equipment you running? Have you tried using timers to cut back on veg (18/6), fans etc? I saved myself $100 a mth unplugging unessessary bs around the house and adding timers


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 4, 2014)

Im running 9800 watts not including my 24kbtu ac and my fans run 24/7 I havent really ever put those on a timer but I am interested in saving atleast 600-1000 a month,to make it worth it for me.
Snaps-what kind of savings do you get from TOU discount?


----------



## a senile fungus (Aug 5, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> Im running 9800 watts not including my 24kbtu ac and my fans run 24/7 I havent really ever put those on a timer but I am interested in saving atleast 600-1000 a month,to make it worth it for me.
> Snaps-what kind of savings do you get from TOU discount?



It depends on what your provider usually charges per kWh and what the differential is between day and night.

Like he said every provider is different.


----------



## Yodaweed (Aug 5, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> Im running 9800 watts not including my 24kbtu ac and my fans run 24/7 I havent really ever put those on a timer but I am interested in saving atleast 600-1000 a month,to make it worth it for me.
> Snaps-what kind of savings do you get from TOU discount?


Run less wattage to pay less that's a lot of power man your gonna have to pay for it one way or another.


----------



## XXVII St. (Aug 5, 2014)

Bypass that shiiiiiiiiiiiiiit.


----------



## ElfoodStampo (Aug 5, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> I have a residential property and I am interested in ways to lower my pge bill,right now im being raped by pge and want to figure out if there is a program or some other way to drastically reduce my monthly bill.(besides cfl and led lol)
> I have heard of agricultural meters,commercial rates,and medical baseline and even getting first tier electric prices by getting an electric vehicle.
> Any help on this would be greatly appreciated.
> Pretty sure my usage puts me outside of the care program,it was nice while it lasted but now im payin full price for power and need to solve this dilema soon.
> What can i do to save money with the power co?


yea in a hypothetical, not reailty because it's illegal, but I would build a relay breaker that you wire in-line with your power coming into the house, split the power and run a *free* line where ever you want as long as the breaker is close to the original power main. wire the relay so that it's normally closed. have it powered by a breaker in you electrical box so when the company comes to check for ground readings and they pull your meeter, poof, the line you split stops drawing power and is invisible. In my fantasy world the electric company makes enough money that it never matters by the time I wake up..


----------



## Hydroburn (Aug 6, 2014)

long term you could supplement your own electricity with solar panels or whatever.

stealing power is illegal, but we are all breaking the law here so who cares... the real issue with stealing power is getting caught.


----------



## mainliner (Aug 6, 2014)

ElfoodStampo said:


> yea in a hypothetical, not reailty because it's illegal, but I would build a relay breaker that you wire in-line with your power coming into the house, split the power and run a *free* line where ever you want as long as the breaker is close to the original power main. wire the relay so that it's normally closed. have it powered by a breaker in you electrical box so when the company comes to check for ground readings and they pull your meeter, poof, the line you split stops drawing power and is invisible. In my fantasy world the electric company makes enough money that it never matters by the time I wake up..


 done the bypass thing the electric companys monitor everything all the spikes and fluctutioms in the readings , there clever like that, it took them a day to get me,, ? Isn't a petrol electric genorator cheaper than elecrtric ?? I don't know


----------



## waterdawg (Aug 6, 2014)

XXVII St. said:


> Bypass that shiiiiiiiiiiiiiit.


I know its way different up here. If we r caught growing and stealing power this is what could happen......first it is classed as a commercial grow op. They will try to seize the house, then you go to jail! Any grow that is 5 or more plants is mandatory 6 months.......Canada has harsher penalties than most States now, oh and you'll probably get another 6 months for the theft thing. Any whooo, I did try as an experiment, running my lights for a shorter period but staggered once. It worked well for keeping plants in veg but can't recall if quantity suffered, probably as I did it once lol. I think lots of commercial flower growers use it to keep costs in check. Other than that I run T5's for veg and supplement a 600 with them as well. Run all my lights at off peak. And move outdoors when weather allows. Good luck, electric bills are a bitch here as well, with the highest prices in North America I believe (peak rate .14 kwh) not to mention a whole bunch of extra bogus charges and tax, its around .17 kwh


----------



## Maris (Aug 6, 2014)

growin outdoor like normal cannabis lover. Inside grow just rookies.


----------



## waterdawg (Aug 6, 2014)

ElfoodStampo said:


> yea in a hypothetical, not reailty because it's illegal, but I would build a relay breaker that you wire in-line with your power coming into the house, split the power and run a *free* line where ever you want as long as the breaker is close to the original power main. wire the relay so that it's normally closed. have it powered by a breaker in you electrical box so when the company comes to check for ground readings and they pull your meeter, poof, the line you split stops drawing power and is invisible. In my fantasy world the electric company makes enough money that it never matters by the time I wake up..


I can see some real bad things happening with that lol. Although if done properly (as properly as u can when stealing power lol), not a bad concept. Wonder what their capable of monitoring re: load draws on grid sections? I think it is just asking for a whole shit load of troubles though lol.


----------



## mainliner (Aug 6, 2014)

Maris said:


> growin outdoor like normal cannabis lover. Inside grow just rookies.


 no indoor growers no sun outdoor growers no brain


----------



## Maris (Aug 6, 2014)

My wild love went riding, she rode all the day,
she rode to the devil, and asked him to pay,
The devil was wiser, it's time to repent,
He asked her to give back, the money she spent,

wy wild love went riding, she rode to the sea,
she gathered together, some shell for her hair,
she rode and she rode on, she rode on for a while,
then stopped for an evening, and laid her head down,

she rode on the christmas, she rode to the farm,
she rode to the japan, and re-entered a town,
by this time the wheather, has changed one degree,
she asked for the people, to let her go free,

My wild love is crazy, she screams like a brid,
she moans like a cat, when she wants to be heard,
My wild love went riding, she road for an hour,
she road and she rested, and then she road on,


----------



## budman111 (Aug 6, 2014)

XXVII St. said:


> Bypass that shiiiiiiiiiiiiiit.


Jail bate.


----------



## budman111 (Aug 6, 2014)

Maris said:


> Inside grow just rookies.


Coming from a Rookie member ROTFLMFAO


----------



## MightyMike530 (Aug 6, 2014)

Pics of your grow OP? I want to see what someone is pumping out with 98KW...


----------



## Maris (Aug 6, 2014)

ypu dont know but a litle girl understand


----------



## greasemonkeymann (Aug 6, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> Im running 9800 watts not including my 24kbtu ac and my fans run 24/7 I havent really ever put those on a timer but I am interested in saving atleast 600-1000 a month,to make it worth it for me.
> Snaps-what kind of savings do you get from TOU discount?


damn, seems like you'd have some extra herb to sell to compensate for that humongous bill, do your math, and see if it's better to run a smaller op, with smaller yields. But lets face it, if you are using almost 100kw? You aren't doing it for personal consumption. I imagine you are growing at least a 150 plants or so. That being said, you may want to see if you could dial in your strains or space to compensate for the larger electric bill.
sorry I can't offer a good alternative to that, it's like asking for good gas mileage on a big block V8. Ya just can't do it.


----------



## greasemonkeymann (Aug 6, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> I have a residential property and I am interested in ways to lower my pge bill,right now im being raped by pge and want to figure out if there is a program or some other way to drastically reduce my monthly bill.(besides cfl and led lol)
> I have heard of agricultural meters,commercial rates,and medical baseline and even getting first tier electric prices by getting an electric vehicle.
> Any help on this would be greatly appreciated.
> Pretty sure my usage puts me outside of the care program,it was nice while it lasted but now im payin full price for power and need to solve this dilema soon.
> What can i do to save money with the power co?


 I think you have the best idea, with commercial rates, get a different place, and some kind of commercial front to it, and the electricity is like half price or so, maybe 2/3rds


----------



## Prince4118 (Aug 6, 2014)

Put the girls outside, easiest way to save money while growing


----------



## Red1966 (Aug 6, 2014)

ElfoodStampo said:


> yea in a hypothetical, not reailty because it's illegal, but I would build a relay breaker that you wire in-line with your power coming into the house, split the power and run a *free* line where ever you want as long as the breaker is close to the original power main. wire the relay so that it's normally closed. have it powered by a breaker in you electrical box so when the company comes to check for ground readings and they pull your meeter, poof, the line you split stops drawing power and is invisible. In my fantasy world the electric company makes enough money that it never matters by the time I wake up..


Stealing power is the quickest way to get busted. The electric company doesn't pull meters to take a reading.


----------



## Lo Budget (Aug 6, 2014)

If only LEDs were better and cheaper. They will be, of course. Someday.
/jg wentworth
"*IT'S OUR LIGHT AND WE WANT IT NOW!*"
/jg wentworth

One of these days, I figure my grand kids will view hid bulbs with the same eye as we now do with vacuum tubes.


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 6, 2014)

MightyMike530 said:


> Pics of your grow OP? I want to see what someone is pumping out with 98KW...


I never said 98k watts its 9800 watts bud.


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 6, 2014)

greasemonkeymann said:


> I think you have the best idea, with commercial rates, get a different place, and some kind of commercial front to it, and the electricity is like half price or so, maybe 2/3rds


 I think this is the best idea,the savings makes sense.


----------



## TubePot (Aug 6, 2014)

Red1966 said:


> Stealing power is the quickest way to get busted. The electric company doesn't pull meters to take a reading.


Sometimes it's the only way to go. Wonder what the bill would look like on 18- 1000 watt lamps, 4- 30,000 btu ac units, fans, pumps, ect? 

Would it raise supission?


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 6, 2014)

I have heard of a friend running 60 x1k on ag rates paying 2000 a mo.. Not bad really


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 6, 2014)

But I have not verified this claim


----------



## ElfoodStampo (Aug 6, 2014)

waterdawg said:


> I can see some real bad things happening with that lol. Although if done properly (as properly as u can when stealing power lol), not a bad concept. Wonder what their capable of monitoring re: load draws on grid sections? I think it is just asking for a whole shit load of troubles though lol.


It was never a problem in my dreams, I had a friend, who "incepted this dream in me, that had the power company AEP come out and they to


Red1966 said:


> Stealing power is the quickest way to get busted. The electric company doesn't pull meters to take a reading.


So the way it works is the power company will track the usage to a block or transformer, from there they go to each house and pull the meeter. Once they do that there is no current drawing from the pole then they sweep the ground from the pole to see if you spliced in anywhere and see where it runs. If they find a hot line running to your home your fucked. with this device it's undetectable, in my dreams.


----------



## Red1966 (Aug 6, 2014)

ElfoodStampo said:


> It was never a problem in my dreams, I had a friend, who "incepted this dream in me, that had the power company AEP come out and they to
> 
> So the way it works is the power company will track the usage to a block or transformer, from there they go to each house and pull the meeter. Once they do that there is no current drawing from the pole then they sweep the ground from the pole to see if you spliced in anywhere and see where it runs. If they find a hot line running to your home your fucked. with this device it's undetectable, in my dreams.


" in my dreams." is right. They don't pull the meter. Period. They can measure the current from the pole. If it doesn't match your meter, you're busted.


----------



## waterdawg (Aug 7, 2014)

Red1966 said:


> " in my dreams." is right. They don't pull the meter. Period. They can measure the current from the pole. If it doesn't match your meter, you're busted.


I knew it sounded to easy lol. Also I'm pretty brave but screwing with live feed wires is a dance with death and I'm a terrible dancer lol.


----------



## Aeroknow (Aug 7, 2014)

SnapsProvolone said:


> Every provider is different.
> 
> Some plans charge less for nighttime kWh (off peak)


PG&E here in Ca, has a time-of-use rate plan. Sure, you save a very tiny bit during offpeak, but they fuck you up your ass big time, for any power used during reg hours. IMO its not even worth it for large grows.
There really is no cheaper than 34 cents(top tier) per kwh, where i live through the power co. Unless your in commercial zone building 
Just gotta grow more to offset their fucked up rates


----------



## Aeroknow (Aug 7, 2014)

waterdawg said:


> I knew it sounded to easy lol. Also I'm pretty brave but screwing with live feed wires is a dance with death and I'm a terrible dancer lol.


And just think......people used to do it by chopping the mains in half, stripping insulation off them big wires, and stuffing them into them insulated aluminum blocks. At least the thieves can use those self piercing EZ-taps now. Lol


----------



## a senile fungus (Aug 7, 2014)

Grow vertically.

For me in a 4'x8' space horizontal light placement of my 2 bulbs will get me 32ft² while vertical bulb placement and growing will allow me more like 120ft². This is in a 4'x8'x6.5' space. I triple my grow area by going vertical, you should look into it...

It won't save you on any power, but you can triple your square footage easily, and with those extra yields you can more easily justify your power expenditure.


----------



## SnapsProvolone (Aug 7, 2014)

And I was used to paying 7 cents a kwh back in Mo. Now doing 20 cents here in Co but it's legal. Sucks but better to pay it than steal it imo.


----------



## Aeroknow (Aug 7, 2014)

Back in the day, the power co would turn you in. And a large power bill was Exactly enough reason for a search warrant. Main reason allot of people spanked the power. Not sure why now.
This is 2014, and the power co don't give a shit anymore, as long as you don't blow up their transformer(here in cali at least)


----------



## SnapsProvolone (Aug 7, 2014)

Seen some bugbite taps in my day.. (electrician here)

I try, oh I try so hard to inform the user that power theft is a pretty thick penalty. 

As far as poco and warrants, well depends on the state.


----------



## Aeroknow (Aug 7, 2014)

SnapsProvolone said:


> Seen some bugbite taps in my day.. (electrician here)
> 
> I try, oh I try so hard to inform the user that power theft is a pretty thick penalty.
> 
> As far as poco and warrants, well depends on the state.


Oh, I know your a sparky 
I'm a union drywall/lather(metalstudframer) by trade. Remember?
Hey, you still need to borrow that stud stretcher, along with that structural tape? Lol


----------



## MightyMike530 (Aug 7, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> I never said 98k watts its 9800 watts bud.


Yeah, yeah, my bad, where are the pics? 9.8KW is still a shit ton of light, I bet your grow is badass, lets see your set up if you dont mind!


----------



## scarecrow77 (Aug 7, 2014)

a senile fungus said:


> Grow vertically.
> 
> For me in a 4'x8' space horizontal light placement of my 2 bulbs will get me 32ft² while vertical bulb placement and growing will allow me more like 120ft². This is in a 4'x8'x6.5' space. I triple my grow area by going vertical, you should look into it...
> 
> It won't save you on any power, but you can triple your square footage easily, and with those extra yields you can more easily justify your power expenditure.


Hey sensil...any chance at getting a look at your vertical grow..I'm very interested in growing vert...what size bulbs are you running.....vertical growing is all alien to me....happy growing


----------



## [email protected] (Aug 7, 2014)

scarecrow77 said:


> Hey sensil...any chance at getting a look at your vertical grow..I'm very interested in growing vert...what size bulbs are you running.....vertical growing is all alien to me....happy growing


DST on club 600 n bb stuff grows vert so keep an eye on his grows


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 7, 2014)

a senile fungus said:


> Grow vertically.
> 
> For me in a 4'x8' space horizontal light placement of my 2 bulbs will get me 32ft² while vertical bulb placement and growing will allow me more like 120ft². This is in a 4'x8'x6.5' space. I triple my grow area by going vertical, you should look into it...
> 
> It won't save you on any power, but you can triple your square footage easily, and with those extra yields you can more easily justify your power expenditure.


I have actually converted half of my space to vertical.
8 wire racks with 4 shelfs each, 18 gal tubs on each shelf all arranged in a football shape,lightrail with 6x600s traveling the length of the football.I love how easy it is to work in, i have a bad back and watering/working is a breeze ,and am planning to convert the other half soon...vertical rules...


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 7, 2014)

MightyMike530 said:


> Yeah, yeah, my bad, where are the pics? 9.8KW is still a shit ton of light, I bet your grow is badass, lets see your set up if you dont mind!


I have some pics in the vert section here,if you can't find em i can post one for you later tonight or tomorow. My camera sux but you will get the jist.


----------



## MightyMike530 (Aug 7, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> I have some pics in the vert section here,if you can't find em i can post one for you later tonight or tomorow. My camera sux but you will get the jist.


Ok yeah, I have seen you pics already, you've definitely got a sick grow going. Nice work!


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 7, 2014)

I did a journal a while back on flowering in a 6/12 light dark cycle ,If I can't get Pge to play ball then I may try that again...less weight but great product at the end with a good savings.


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 7, 2014)

I just checked on the pge website and it says i can save the most with the electric vehicle plan. This would save me 10k+ per year time of use only saves me 400-1k per year...Go figure,if this is the only way to play ball,i will tuck in my pride


----------



## scarecrow77 (Aug 7, 2014)

[email protected] said:


> DST on club 600 n bb stuff grows vert so keep an eye on his grows


 Thanks bud..i.l do that..


----------



## Red1966 (Aug 7, 2014)

SnapsProvolone said:


> And I was used to paying 7 cents a kwh back in Mo. Now doing 20 cents here in Co but it's legal. Sucks but better to pay it than steal it imo.


My local rate has DROPPED from 0.14/kw/h to 0.11/kw/h. They have off peak billing plan at 0.07/kw/h, but on-peak rate rises to 0.22/kw/h. 70% of my consumption is on peak, so off-peak billing would not be cheaper.


----------



## SnapsProvolone (Aug 7, 2014)

Red1966 said:


> My local rate has DROPPED from 0.14/kw/h to 0.11/kw/h. They have off peak billing plan at 0.07/kw/h, but on-peak rate rises to 0.22/kw/h. 70% of my consumption is on peak, so off-peak billing would not be cheaper.


Schweet...


----------



## Red1966 (Aug 7, 2014)

SnapsProvolone said:


> Schweet...


Yes, a very pleasant surprise.


----------



## UncleBuck (Aug 7, 2014)

Red1966 said:


> My local rate has DROPPED from 0.14/kw/h to 0.11/kw/h.


thanks, obama.


----------



## Aeroknow (Aug 7, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> I did a journal a while back on flowering in a 6/12 light dark cycle ,If I can't get Pge to play ball then I may try that again...less weight but great product at the end with a good savings.


So, did the flowering finish quicker? I didn't realize you had a journal(I'll check it out later), and I referred to a High Times article I had read years back, in a thread in the indoor forum,
Did you get the idea from HT?


----------



## a mongo frog (Aug 7, 2014)

im not understanding this electric vehicle plan. can some one explain?


----------



## Red1966 (Aug 7, 2014)

Aeroknow said:


> So, did the flowering finish quicker? I didn't realize you had a journal(I'll check it out later), and I referred to a High Times article I had read years back, in a thread in the indoor forum,
> Did you get the idea from HT?


A little off topic, but did you know the pic in your avatar is the subject of a lawsuit?


----------



## Aeroknow (Aug 7, 2014)

Red1966 said:


> A little off topic, but did you know the pic in your avatar is the subject of a lawsuit?


Nope, but i'm gonna change it back to my boy REX again anyways. Thx man


----------



## a senile fungus (Aug 7, 2014)

scarecrow77 said:


> Hey sensil...any chance at getting a look at your vertical grow..I'm very interested in growing vert...what size bulbs are you running.....vertical growing is all alien to me....happy growing



Mine is based from this.



There are two lights, attached to a pulley system that transfers the horizontal motion of the light mover into vertical motion for both bulbs, almost like a yo-yo, they go up and down.



Search wall of weed from icmag.

These pics I believe are 400w HPS and he later upgraded to 600w HPS.

I like these cdm lights better ... http://advancedtechlighting.com/cdmmw.htm


The details behind the massive increase of space is using the walls instead of floor space. So instead of 8x4 area I'm using (2) 8x5 and (2) 4x5 spaces. My height is 6.5ft so about 5ft of actual plant space...

Afterthought: also the bulbs/ballast I linked is 315w cdm. That'll also save on power, not to mention the reduced heat output from the bulb as well.


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 8, 2014)

a mongo frog said:


> im not understanding this electric vehicle plan. can some one explain?


You get a huge break on Pge if you own an electro vehicle...the savings is really worth leasing one... You get a car and still save big..


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 8, 2014)

Aeroknow said:


> So, did the flowering finish quicker? I didn't realize you had a journal(I'll check it out later), and I referred to a High Times article I had read years back, in a thread in the indoor forum,
> Did you get the idea from HT?


Years ago my friend cleared out his storage and gave me his old back in the day grow gear he'd been storing ,with all the junk came a bunch of resources he printed out,and on one of em was 1 sentence about how the author heard about flowering 18 hr days 6/12 ... So I tried it.
Result was less meds but great qual faster... Plants seemed to like it?! The yield wasn't great at all but that was most likely due to the shitty conditions I provided ...
It's worth trying and I heard can be done in the first few weeks of flower to stop stretch aswell but I haven't tried that.


----------



## Aeroknow (Aug 8, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> Years ago my friend cleared out his storage and gave me his old back in the day grow gear he'd been storing ,with all the junk came a bunch of resources he printed out,and on one of em was 1 sentence about how the author heard about flowering 18 hr days 6/12 ... So I tried it.
> Result was less meds but great qual faster... Plants seemed to like it?! The yield wasn't great at all but that was most likely due to the shitty conditions I provided ...
> It's worth trying and I heard can be done in the first few weeks of flower to stop stretch aswell but I haven't tried that.


Interesting. But, Yup! It was in a High Times many years ago. Wish I still had it to share with ya


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 8, 2014)

Have you tried it by chance?


----------



## Aeroknow (Aug 9, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> Have you tried it by chance?


If thats to me? No I haven't. Always wanted to try it but.......
Btw...it seems so hard to find a journal from my iphone(No app)
i will check it soon though! On my pc(gotta fire it up once in a while huh)


----------



## oracle3301 (Aug 10, 2014)

Hydroburn said:


> long term you could supplement your own electricity with solar panels or whatever.
> 
> stealing power is illegal, but we are all breaking the law here so who cares... the real issue with stealing power is getting caught.


I am an electrician and I have seen people get caught stealing power I watched Excell energy fine a client 15k for stealing power for a 1500 watt grow, its an easy way for the police to get a warrant? for me it's not worth it I would not steal power, also they can see if you steal power based on the readings from main line to tranformer to house meter with basic equipmemt, in my state it is a felony with a minimum 1 year jail time if convicted and that is only the theft charge.

I WOULD ENCOURAGE YOU TO NOT STEAL POWER BECAUSE IT IS NOT IF BUT WHEN YOU GET CAUGHT IT WILL RUIN YOUR LIFE.

1 YEAR JAIL FOR THEFT OF POWER
10K TO 15K IN POWER THEFT BACK CHARGES PLUS FINES
PLUS WHAT EVER MARIJUANA CHARGES YOU RECEIVE


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 10, 2014)

Thanks for the info,this thread isn't about that at all ,but more about what we can do to save with rate plans etc... I have no qualms with paying the power co,just looking for legal ways to save
Bless


----------



## Deusracing (Aug 10, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> I have a residential property and I am interested in ways to lower my pge bill,right now im being raped by pge and want to figure out if there is a program or some other way to drastically reduce my monthly bill.(besides cfl and led lol)
> I have heard of agricultural meters,commercial rates,and medical baseline and even getting first tier electric prices by getting an electric vehicle.
> Any help on this would be greatly appreciated.
> Pretty sure my usage puts me outside of the care program,it was nice while it lasted but now im payin full price for power and need to solve this dilema soon.
> What can i do to save money with the power co?


i run a shit load of stuff and still under 1k wattage
how much do you need to run


----------



## Deusracing (Aug 10, 2014)

oracle3301 said:


> I am an electrician and I have seen people get caught stealing power I watched Excell energy fine a client 15k for stealing power for a 1500 watt grow, its an easy way for the police to get a warrant? for me it's not worth it I would not steal power, also they can see if you steal power based on the readings from main line to tranformer to house meter with basic equipmemt, in my state it is a felony with a minimum 1 year jail time if convicted and that is only the theft charge.
> 
> I WOULD ENCOURAGE YOU TO NOT STEAL POWER BECAUSE IT IS NOT IF BUT WHEN YOU GET CAUGHT IT WILL RUIN YOUR LIFE.
> 
> ...


good to know.. i didn't know that if thats the case why meters on your house..just curious.. its easy to do around my area but wouldn't do it simply because its theft and I'm not a Real law breaker...


----------



## jacksthc (Aug 11, 2014)

Don't what your setup like but if you have 3 lines with 3 lights in each line ,so you 3 lenths of ducting going in the room and throw 3 lights out the the room with an 8" fan, as this should take 60% of the heat with air cooled lights and draw it in from a room with a 3kw ac so the air starts off really cool

this will bring the the temps down so you can save power on your ac and fans ect

never done a setup this big before so its just an ideal


----------



## ODanksta (Aug 24, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> I have heard of a friend running 60 x1k on ag rates paying 2000 a mo.. Not bad really



No way, im not calling BS but i just dont see that. But i could be wrong


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 25, 2014)

Ya that sounds way too low huh ,I have been talking with them about commercial power rates and have yet to ask about ag rates... So far the electric car plan saves the most hands down


----------



## Pass it Around (Aug 26, 2014)

ODanksta said:


> No way, im not calling BS but i just dont see that. But i could be wrong


8 x 1000w 
1 x ac
2 x exhaust can fans the huge ones

power bill = 10,000 a month.

I don't see how someone is using 60x 1000w and paying 2k a month.... I just don't see it.


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 26, 2014)

Pass it Around said:


> 8 x 1000w
> 1 x ac
> 2 x exhaust can fans the huge ones
> 
> ...


are you saying your using 10k watts or paying 10k per mo for pge? because I use 10k watts and my bill is 2k


----------



## jacksthc (Aug 26, 2014)

Pass it Around said:


> 8 x 1000w
> 1 x ac
> 2 x exhaust can fans the huge ones
> 
> ...


wow
how much electric does your ac use

when I run 2x 600w hps, small veg room, I use less than £80 pm

600w HPS x 2 = 1.2 kw x £0.09p (cost per kw) = £0.108 x 12 hours = £1.296 x 31 days = £40.18p
and say £30 for the veg room and fans, so less then £80 per mouth


would be less in a commercial property


----------



## headbandrocker (Aug 26, 2014)

How much are the large acs per mo? DOes mini split save over window ac?


----------



## jacksthc (Aug 26, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> How much are the large acs per mo? DOes mini split save over window ac?


sorry mate I don't know


----------



## ODanksta (Aug 26, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> How much are the large acs per mo? DOes mini split save over window ac?


Yes for sure. Less efficient to most efficient 

Portable...last
Window unit...
Mini split..
Central..
Homemade swampcoolers

And that list isn't accurate because the mini split can be the most efficient for individual rooms where your not trying to cool the whole house. I usually keep my grow rooms colder then the rest of my house.

The trick is to be over efficient, its better to have a AC run for 15 mins a hour rather then the whole hour. 

My brother had 5x10 room completely spray foamed up with a 24k btu mini split with 4k of HIDS, he could drop the room temps from 84f to 65f in less then 8 mins. that's dope! With that kind of cooling you easily make your stuff very colorful at harvest time.


----------



## ODanksta (Aug 26, 2014)

Pass it Around said:


> 8 x 1000w
> 1 x ac
> 2 x exhaust can fans the huge ones
> 
> ...



Yeah that's a little confusing bro.

If your paying that much that would be senseless to even grow. Think about it 10k for $10k a month. You usually pull 15 pounds off a 10k grow, so over a 3 month cycle that is $30,000 and at 3000 a pound that is only 15k profit if that.

A 10k run should only be about 1200 to 1600 a month


----------



## FLkeys1 (Aug 26, 2014)

not sure where you live but have you looked in to solar ??


----------



## ODanksta (Aug 26, 2014)

http://m.youtube.com/results?q=solar freakin roadways&sm=1

Lol....


----------



## clayawesome (Sep 1, 2014)

Pass it Around said:


> 8 x 1000w
> 1 x ac
> 2 x exhaust can fans the huge ones
> 
> ...


I run a very very similar setup with the addition of commercial dehumidifiers, a veg area, and a whole home. i really hope u mean $1,000.


----------



## clayawesome (Sep 1, 2014)

ODanksta said:


> Yeah that's a little confusing bro.
> 
> If your paying that much that would be senseless to even grow. Think about it 10k for $10k a month. You usually pull 15 pounds off a 10k grow, so over a 3 month cycle that is $30,000 and at 3000 a pound that is only 15k profit if that.
> 
> A 10k run should only be about 1200 to 1600 a month


Exactly. I anticipate between $75 and $100 per 1000w light per month


----------



## albert111 (Sep 1, 2014)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1KW-grid-tie-COMPLETE-KIT-10x100W-solar-panel-inverter-for-home-power-system-/191311195510?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c8b092d76 and ad a few batteries for night charge


----------



## bbxww (Oct 30, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> I have a residential property and I am interested in ways to lower my pge bill,right now im being raped by pge and want to figure out if there is a program or some other way to drastically reduce my monthly bill.(besides cfl and led lol)
> I have heard of agricultural meters,commercial rates,and medical baseline and even getting first tier electric prices by getting an electric vehicle.
> Any help on this would be greatly appreciated.
> Pretty sure my usage puts me outside of the care program,it was nice while it lasted but now im payin full price for power and need to solve this dilema soon.
> What can i do to save money with the power co?


Invest in LED's


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 31, 2014)

I'm in Colorado and I just had another water chiller fail on me. Instead of buying another unit right away, I went to the junkyard and got a radiator from a Mitsubishi Lancer. It even came with the two fans still in the shroud. I got a power supply and some fittings and now it cools my chiller circuit and that cools my whole grow. I don't know how much capacity it has, but it is clearly making a big difference.

That's sixty watts instead of thousands to run an AC compressor, and it seems to be doing a great job thus far!


----------



## Uncle Ben (Oct 31, 2014)

Hydroburn said:


> stealing power is illegal, but we are all breaking the law here so who cares... the real issue with stealing power is getting caught.


Getting caught is the real issue? Fuckin' dishonest loser.

I care because when dishonest low lifes like you steal what doesn't legally belong to you it drives my costs up. It's ethically flat ass wrong.

There's a big difference between stealing from someone who put in the time, risks and investments than some self centered petty little thief that's hung up on self induced medication....drugs.

Get a job,
Uncle Ben


----------



## Uncle Ben (Oct 31, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> I have a residential property and I am interested in ways to lower my pge bill,right now im being raped by pge


What are you paying on a KWH basis?

Seems to me if you can't afford the electricity costs then you need not be growing indoors.


----------



## Uncle Ben (Oct 31, 2014)

Hydroburn said:


> eat dicks you tomato growing piece of shit.* no one* gives a fuck about your ethics and opinions.


Hey ya little cheat.....talkin' to that mouse in your cup of Koolaid again, eh?


----------



## Hydroburn (Oct 31, 2014)

Uncle Ben said:


> Hey ya little cheat.....talkin' to that mouse in your cup of Koolaid again, eh?


----------



## DurbanP (Oct 31, 2014)

waterdawg said:


> I know its way different up here. If we r caught growing and stealing power this is what could happen......first it is classed as a commercial grow op. They will try to seize the house, then you go to jail! Any grow that is 5 or more plants is mandatory 6 months.......Canada has harsher penalties than most States now, oh and you'll probably get another 6 months for the theft thing. Any whooo, I did try as an experiment, running my lights for a shorter period but staggered once. It worked well for keeping plants in veg but can't recall if quantity suffered, probably as I did it once lol. I think lots of commercial flower growers use it to keep costs in check. Other than that I run T5's for veg and supplement a 600 with them as well. Run all my lights at off peak. And move outdoors when weather allows. Good luck, electric bills are a bitch here as well, with the highest prices in North America I believe (peak rate .14 kwh) not to mention a whole bunch of extra bogus charges and tax, its around .17 kwh


Just as an fyi, minimum sentencing doesn't kick in until 6 plants. You can grow 5 without facing the 6 months in jail. Not trying to be "that guy" just wanted to point it out.

http://www.marijuanalaws.ca/penalties.html


----------



## waterdawg (Oct 31, 2014)

I thought it was 5 or more my bad if wrong. But it doesnt matter cause no matter how I do it thats not enough lol. Tried to do 4, not enough, tried 6, not enough, at 12 now plus clones, may just do it lol.


----------



## DurbanP (Oct 31, 2014)

waterdawg said:


> I thought it was 5 or more my bad if wrong. But it doesnt matter cause no matter how I do it thats not enough lol. Tried to do 4, not enough, tried 6, not enough, at 12 now plus clones, may just do it lol.


Might as well grow 200, it is 6-200 so doesn't really make a huge difference on sentencing although 200 would probably get you more than the minimum. It really goes to show the stupidity of some laws. 

My point being, if you grow 6 might as well grow as much as you need because you hedge your risk in a sense. 4 is enough for my needs I just wish I could have 8 and do a veg and flower room. 

Cheers


----------



## churchhaze (Nov 2, 2014)

If you break the law by stealing, you're a thief and I don't want anything to do with you. You are not allowed on my property. I've got my eye on you. Don't touch any of my things.

If you break the law by smoking pot, you're a pothead. Big deal. In my mind, you did nothing wrong.

I can't see how these crimes are considered even remotely similar. They define your character. When you steal something tangible like power just to make some extra cash, it makes you a bad person.


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 2, 2014)

Hey look, build more energy efficient grows and you can have your cake and smoke it, too;

I just built a compressorless chiller that runs when it's cold outside and removes massive amounts of heat from my op. The colder it gets, the better the thing works!

Try running vertical grows; you get more square feet for your watts and it fits in smaller spaces.

You need to use liquid cooling to take advantage of the compressorless chiller idea, but that's its own dividend; they improve efficiency in many ways over simple AC.

The list goes on and on and on...


----------



## waterdawg (Nov 3, 2014)

Or grow outside!! But yes there are ways to lower the cost of a grow. Efficient grow methods, passive cooling (has its limits), energy efficient lighting and maximizing schedules. It should be a enviromental concern as much as a cost saving thing.


----------



## Flash63 (Nov 3, 2014)

I replaced any electrical appliances with gas,(stove) (dryer).and run the lights during off peak hrs....


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 3, 2014)

Flash63 said:


> I replaced any electrical appliances with gas,(stove) (dryer).and run the lights during off peak hrs....


These are good ideas, I've personally implemented both. When looking at gas ranges, beware of the dreaded dual fuel units; fuckers look fine with gas burners on top and all but underneath lurks an ELECTRIC OVEN.

WHAT IN THE EVER LOVIN' FUCK IS UP WITH THAT?!?


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 3, 2014)

Place your chiller inside for the winter and it will heat your home. Free of charge... after all, you're going to run it anyway, you may as well get the heat back and do something useful with it.


----------



## igothydrotoneverywhere (Nov 3, 2014)

grow in a basement to start, basements are very cool compared to above ground operations. a basement with outside windows can intake filtered cool air when it turns fall/winter, or you can filter the exhaust from your bloom room and connect it to your hvac system to heat your house in the cold days and months. in the spring and summer months it is almost impossible to reduce your cooling costs, but growing below ground, at night, and with LEC lights that dont generate alot of heat is a good start. I have a set of lec's and they have been killing it for me, over a gram/watt with no substantial heat signatures full, full white and uv spectrum including lots of uvb. i dont need a heater or a/c and i run 4 of them. 3.5lb harvest using 1260 watts(315w x 4).


----------



## headbandrocker (Nov 3, 2014)

I got temps under control by switching back to running at night,. What are Lec lights? Tty do you have a link to the heat exchanger you mentioned?
I am curious
has anyone here ran a solar grow room before?
Interested to hear back from you if so,please share your experience 
Bless


----------



## DurbanP (Nov 3, 2014)

igothydrotoneverywhere said:


> grow in a basement to start, basements are very cool compared to above ground operations. a basement with outside windows can intake filtered cool air when it turns fall/winter, or you can filter the exhaust from your bloom room and connect it to your hvac system to heat your house in the cold days and months. in the spring and summer months it is almost impossible to reduce your cooling costs, but growing below ground, at night, and with LEC lights that dont generate alot of heat is a good start. I have a set of lec's and they have been killing it for me, over a gram/watt with no substantial heat signatures full, full white and uv spectrum including lots of uvb. i dont need a heater or a/c and i run 4 of them. 3.5lb harvest using 1260 watts(315w x 4).


I like the HVAC idea. I have it set up in my grow room to exhausted in my kitchen venting during winter and outside during the summer. My basement keeps it right at the 78-83 mark with lights on and dehumidifier running. 

IMHO the upfront cost of solar is alot and the upkeep of the system is pretty bad as well. I installed a solar system when I built my house 2 years ago and if everything goes perfect it'll still take 15 year to recover the costs--we aren't allowed to sell back to the grid though which would make it much more cost effective. Having said that, costs are starting to come down on them so maybe things have changed since I purchased mine.


----------



## waterdawg (Nov 4, 2014)

Flash63 said:


> I replaced any electrical appliances with gas,(stove) (dryer).and run the lights during off peak hrs....


Thats all great until gas reaches $1.24 per liter like it did here last winter


----------



## Flash63 (Nov 4, 2014)

waterdawg said:


> Thats all great until gas reaches $1.24 per liter like it did here last winter


Natural gas....it is cheap


----------



## waterdawg (Nov 4, 2014)

Flash63 said:


> Natural gas....it is cheap


Cool I'll call embridge and get them to run a pipe over here lol.


----------



## waterdawg (Nov 4, 2014)

Actually I locked in this year at .59 so not bad like last winter. Still natural gas is like .43 here i think!!!


----------



## bradburry (Nov 4, 2014)

headbandrocker said:


> I have a residential property and I am interested in ways to lower my pge bill,right now im being raped by pge and want to figure out if there is a program or some other way to drastically reduce my monthly bill.(besides cfl and led lol)
> I have heard of agricultural meters,commercial rates,and medical baseline and even getting first tier electric prices by getting an electric vehicle.
> Any help on this would be greatly appreciated.
> Pretty sure my usage puts me outside of the care program,it was nice while it lasted but now im payin full price for power and need to solve this dilema soon.
> What can i do to save money with the power co?


 the 'candle light ' time method .....i cant remember but it goes something like 10 on 2 off 10 on 8 off <<seriously something like that its suppose to cut your bills in half ...idk some one will know........it might be called the lantern time ?idk


----------



## Flash63 (Nov 4, 2014)

14 cents a cubic meter here way cheaper,than hydro...


----------



## ODanksta (Nov 5, 2014)

bradburry said:


> the 'candle light ' time method .....i cant remember but it goes something like 10 on 2 off 10 on 8 off <<seriously something like that its suppose to cut your bills in half ...idk some one will know........it might be called the lantern time ?idk


Its called green lantern method, basically in veg you run you lights for 12 hours, off for 5.5, on for a hour, off for 5.5 then back to 12 hours instead of vegging under 24 or 18/6. I have heard a couple peeps say it cuts down on the yield too.


----------



## ODanksta (Nov 5, 2014)

Flash63 said:


> 14 cents a cubic meter here way cheaper,than hydro...


Huh? Cubic meter of what? Sorry I'm high.


----------



## waterdawg (Nov 5, 2014)

ODanksta said:


> Its called green lantern method, basically in veg you run you lights for 12 hours, off for 5.5, on for a hour, off for 5.5 then back to 12 hours instead of vegging under 24 or 18/6. I have heard a couple peeps say it cuts down on the yield too.


I tried it a few years ago but cant remember if it effected yield that much. I had just started hydro so pretty hard to judge effects of light versus me lol.


----------



## bradburry (Nov 5, 2014)

that's the one ^^^ it cuts your bill in half


----------



## kushlatte (Nov 5, 2014)

ODanksta said:


> Its called green lantern method, basically in veg you run you lights for 12 hours, off for 5.5, on for a hour, off for 5.5 then back to 12 hours instead of vegging under 24 or 18/6. I have heard a couple peeps say it cuts down on the yield too.


It's called the gas light routine (GLR, you can google info on this) and I switched to it a few weeks ago to cut down on energy costs. It takes a few days for the plants to respond to the different light schedule, but once they do veg growth is comparable if not exactly the same as 18/6 and I save 6 hours a day on lights


----------



## waterdawg (Nov 7, 2014)

I think I must have noticed a negative impact if I didnt use it again. I did read that many commercial flower producers use it to keep plants from flowering.


----------



## daybreaker (Nov 8, 2014)

budman111 said:


> Coming from a Rookie member ROTFLMFAO


some of the best growers don't have a RIU accounts cuz they're smart not to be in here ranting about whats on their property unlike us idiots who just wanna be cool up in this bitch...think about it.


----------



## waterdawg (Nov 8, 2014)

daybreaker said:


> some of the best growers don't have a RIU accounts cuz they're smart not to be in here ranting about whats on their property unlike us idiots who just wanna be cool up in this bitch...think about it.


Yet here you are lol


----------



## daybreaker (Nov 8, 2014)

waterdawg said:


> Yet here you are lol


hence the "us".


----------



## waterdawg (Nov 8, 2014)

Yup me bad I missed that lol.


----------



## StellerKeller (Nov 16, 2014)

Just curious. Would using a generator be cheaper?


----------



## clayawesome (Nov 17, 2014)

Aeroknow said:


> Back in the day, the power co would turn you in. And a large power bill was Exactly enough reason for a search warrant. Main reason allot of people spanked the power. Not sure why now.
> This is 2014, and the power co don't give a shit anymore, as long as you don't blow up their transformer(here in cali at least)


Shit in MI they just replace them and say thanks for ur business.


----------



## Aeroknow (Nov 17, 2014)

clayawesome said:


> Shit in MI they just replace them and say thanks for ur business.


Hehehehe.
I would much rather it doesn't go there though


----------



## spandy (Nov 21, 2014)

Hydroburn said:


> long term you could supplement your own electricity with solar panels or whatever.
> 
> stealing power is illegal, but we are all breaking the law here so who cares... the real issue with stealing power is getting caught.


Growing a plant that some assholes made illegal isn't comparable to being an asshole that steals.


----------



## Hydroburn (Nov 21, 2014)

I'm sure that defense would hold up great in court.


----------



## Medicanman (Dec 15, 2014)

Using a generator would cost you twice as much or more in fuel than what the power company charges. Plus, even a good CAT genset is going to be a costly maintenance problem running every single day for months or years on end. Besides, I think someone would notice a 20KW or more genset running all hours of the day or night.

If it were cheap and easy to run power everyone would be doing it.


----------



## nomofatum (Dec 16, 2014)

I think the best way to save power is to try to fight yourself as little as possible. It seems to me the folks having these problems are trying to grow inside while it's warm outside. They fight themselves by bringing heat in then trying to get rid of it. So before you try to get rid of it, lets first determine if it has to be here to begin with. If you can install some of the heat generating components outside of the envelope of your home, that is less for the AC to handle. This mainly means relocating the power supplies for lights and the air pump to either an outdoor box or your garage or similar. You can also add liquid cooling to your lights and pump the coolant through a radiator again outside/garage. And finally, choose lighting that produces less waste heat, especially waste heat that must be released indoors.

If you are crazy enough you can even bury a 55gallon drum, with a hose for a "snorkle" and put your air pump in there so it pulls air cooled by the earth.

BTW, I don't have this issue, so I just made up a few things that sounded good in my head.

I only run in winter and then it is about 2/3rd of my heating system, hum, maybe I should make it 1/3rd bigger? I do run my air pump in my garage so I can push cold/freezing air into the res and keep it in the 60's.


----------



## Knott Collective (Jan 4, 2015)

igothydrotoneverywhere said:


> grow in a basement to start, basements are very cool compared to above ground operations. a basement with outside windows can intake filtered cool air when it turns fall/winter, or you can filter the exhaust from your bloom room and connect it to your hvac system to heat your house in the cold days and months. in the spring and summer months it is almost impossible to reduce your cooling costs, but growing below ground, at night, and with LEC lights that dont generate alot of heat is a good start. I have a set of lec's and they have been killing it for me, over a gram/watt with no substantial heat signatures full, full white and uv spectrum including lots of uvb. i dont need a heater or a/c and i run 4 of them. 3.5lb harvest using 1260 watts(315w x 4).


We've been using the Sunlight Supply 315w Light Emitting Ceramics (LEC) in our veg rooms and I must agree that they kill it. According to the adverts they replicate the full spectrum of natural sunlight better than many other lighting systems. From our limited experience we've seen improved vegetative growth across the board with all our strains. Not just a small difference but dramatically improved vigor over the T-5's and even Metal Halides we used for vegging before. I was skeptical of the hype when they first came out, 'cause I was standing in a hydro store when I got the information. lol.

But since then I've become a believer in the LEC's. Next we're going to try cloning under them. I personally believe the full spectrum is really good for almost any stage of cannabis growth. I'd love to see similar improvements in vigor in the clone phase and I'm willing to risk a few trays to see if it works. I'm thinking that we'll keep the lights high enough to avoid scorching the babies but then the LEC's aren't really that hot in terms of ambient temperatures. I know that clones don't like too much of anything so the more robust output of the LEC could be a problem. But I'm curious so we're gonna find out.

Cutting a bunch of Gorilla Glue #4, Super Lemon Haze and Kryptonite later today. Will put a couple of trays under the good old T-5's for safety stock. Everything else will go directly under the LEC. Maybe 4-6 trays or so to get a good sampling. Each tray will hold 40 clones.

Got a pretty high bar to reach though, LEC results need to be better than these White Fire OG and Super Lemon Haze babies or it's back to the tried and true T-5s.

Super Lemon Haze


WiFi OG:


----------



## AverageJoe88 (Jan 11, 2015)

Geothermal.


----------

