# JB's New Growroom with Graphics



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

What's up, RIU? 

I wanted to share my new grow room designs, parts, costs, and ideas with everyone, with the goal of teaching some noobs a few things, and getting advice from the Ganja Growing Gods. 

I've posted a few threads recently that have gotten attention for the 3d renderings I've been sharing. I've gotten some really nice comments and I thought that others might find the method in which I'm designing this grow room really helpful on some of their own projects. The type of build I'm doing is fairly advanced (RDWC UC under a COB array) and thought the graphics could provide a good visual for others to use for their setup.

First I'll say that I'm not an expert grower who's been doing this for decades. I actually only grew for a few years, from '08 to '11, but I built some pretty sophisticated hydro setups and had really good yields. I'm a self taught engineer, specifically with computers, programming, and databases, but I'm an engineer all around. I converted my garage into a dedicated room within a room, home theater for example. Being an engineer, I've got a knack for problem solving. So I used what I had learned (which was all from RIU and my own successes and failures) and I designed a system that I'm hoping to start within the next couple months.

Here are a few samples of the renderings I did while designing my RDWC UC system and COB array. I'll be explaining everything and these will all be put into context in the upcoming posts. But these are pretty cool to look at if you're into 3d design.

This is my 10x16x8 shop. Everything is to scale and I built all the objects as close to the originals as I could:


----------



## Olive Drab Green (Nov 4, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> What's up, RIU?
> 
> I wanted to share my new grow room designs, parts, costs, and ideas with everyone, with the goal of teaching some noobs a few things, and getting advice from the Ganja Growing Gods.
> 
> ...


I actually hate your SIMs style conceptualization. What emitters, drivers, at what amperage? How exactly do you plan to configure yo' shit?


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

To answer some of the already known questions, I use Google Sketchup 2016 for the design and vray 2 for the renderings. I'm not a professional 3d modeler or anything. I just have an affinity for computer graphics and animation. These are like my PC games, as I don't really play games. I've also had a home recording studio. I played guitar, bass, a little keyboards, but mostly what I liked was the engineering. So, basically I like everything computers.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

Olive Drab Green said:


> I actually hate your SIMs style conceptualization. What emitters, drivers, at what amperage? How exactly do you plan to configure yo' shit?


I just started dude. Give me a chance to get going!


----------



## Olive Drab Green (Nov 4, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I just started dude. Give me a chance to get going!


I was only busting your balls. But what are you thinking for your config?


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

Olive Drab Green said:


> I actually hate your SIMs style conceptualization. What emitters, drivers, at what amperage? How exactly do you plan to configure yo' shit?


16x CXB-3590's
2xMeanWell HLG-3420H-1050A drivers
Pin heatsinks


----------



## Olive Drab Green (Nov 4, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> 16x CXB-3590's
> 2xMeanWell HLG-3420H-1050A drivers
> Pin heatsinks


Sounds good to me.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

Olive Drab Green said:


> I was only busting your balls. But what are you thinking for your config?


lol

Alright man. Thought I was starting off on the wrong foot already


----------



## Olive Drab Green (Nov 4, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> lol
> 
> Alright man. Thought I was starting off on the wrong foot already


Nah, bro. Maybe I came off a bit more asinine than I intended. My bad.


----------



## a mongo frog (Nov 4, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> What's up, RIU?
> 
> I wanted to share my new grow room designs, parts, costs, and ideas with everyone, with the goal of teaching some noobs a few things, and getting advice from the Ganja Growing Gods.
> 
> ...


Your plants look nice and green!!! Have you checked for pistols on the back right one? It looks different then the rest? Did you get that alloy powder coated? Nice grow so far!!!!!


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Nov 4, 2016)

a mongo frog said:


> Your plants look nice and green!!! Have you checked for pistols on the back right one? It looks different then the rest? Did you get that alloy powder coated? Nice grow so far!!!!!


Are you really that retarded? It's a rendering not real plants........?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Nov 4, 2016)

So any changes since we last discussed your room bud? @JSB99


----------



## Olive Drab Green (Nov 4, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Are you really that retarded? It's a rendering not real plants........?


I was going to ask the same thing, but I was sure they were being facetious. I was praying they weren't that dumb.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Nov 4, 2016)

Olive Drab Green said:


> I was going to ask the same thing, but I was sure they were being facetious. I was praying they weren't that dumb.


Given the source on this one.......lol........


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

By the time I decided to start growing again I was still a year out from getting the funds that would cover this. It forced me to sit down and think about everything in advance before buying a single item. There were some very specific things I wanted in my room. First, I wanted to be able to have access to 3 sides of the tent. I also wanted it to be reliable (as much as possible), wanted it to be leak proof, and I wanted to use a tent as a sealed environment and treat the external environment. I also want it to look cool! This is something I'm going to have for years. I want it to be clean and professional.

With all these goals I had to come up with a lot of different layouts, but ultimately I think I've got a layout I like. Working in a 3d modeler is such an awesome tool for being able to solve problems in the design instead of trying to figure things out in the middle of the build. This can be done with as little as a piece of paper, a tape measure, and a pencil. But the 3d environment allow you to walk around and see the scale of everything. There are a number of free CAD programs out there, as well as more professional one's.

So I know I've got a lot of equipment and take up a lot of space for a 4-plant grow. But there are some valid reasons. I had posted this in an earlier thread and could probably work here as well...

"I find it so easy to continuously think "bigger" and "more". So I started thinking of growing 6, and then 8. But then I remember how much extra work each plant presents. And that's from sprout to trim. Each plant also adds onto power consumption, nutes, water, etc...and it adds to the budget. If I'm not selling it to make my money back, which I'm not, then it's really not benefiting me in any way. I vape about 2oz a month, and want another 2oz to make edibles. I would also like to have some to store so that I could grow different strains and have them all available (think sativas for the day and indicas for bedtime). Here in Oregon, I can grow 10 plants and have 24 starts no taller than 12". So I have the ability to grow much more. But I suffer from Fibromyalgia and chronic pain from injuries from the military, and it doesn't take much to get me worn out.

I kind of want to talk about this for noobs who are trying to design their grow. I think all of us, when we were noobs, were obsessed with growing as many plants as we could. I remember adding so many suspended CFLs in my grows to get every last drop of THC out of those plants that I could. I remember pushing my nutes to the max, just below burning them (and I did burn them from time to time). But it gets very time consuming and expensive having a ton of plants to manage. So I would recommend to the noobs, to look at how much you really plan to consume, if this is purely for personal use. If you're on a limited income and you're spending all your money on all this extra equipment to grow big, the expenses don't stop there. You now have an increased power bill and water bill (for hydro), and you need to buy more nutes, which aren't always cheap.

That's just my humble opinion and others will have their's. But we're all civil, and its a friendly environment "


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Are you really that retarded? It's a rendering not real plants........?


LOL


----------



## BuddyColas (Nov 4, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> By the time I decided to start growing again I was still a year out from getting the funds that would cover this. It forced me to sit down and think about everything in advance before buying a single item. There were some very specific things I wanted in my room. First, I wanted to be able to have access to 3 sides of the tent. I also wanted it to be reliable (as much as possible), wanted it to be leak proof, and I wanted to use a tent as a sealed environment and treat the external environment. I also want it to look cool! This is something I'm going to have for years. I want it to be clean and professional.
> 
> With all these goals I had to come up with a lot of different layouts, but ultimately I think I've got a layout I like. Working in a 3d modeler is such an awesome tool for being able to solve problems in the design instead of trying to figure things out in the middle of the build. This can be done with as little as a piece of paper, a tape measure, and a pencil. But the 3d environment allow you to walk around and see the scale of everything. There are a number of free CAD programs out there, as well as more professional one's.
> 
> ...


I like the hinged top of your DWC pots...that way you can catch a little root porn whenever your want!

I'll be watching on the sidelines as your project becomes reality. Thanks for sharing.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

Originally I was going to use my shop, but I want to park my car in the garage now, and my garage is a home theater. So, I've since decided to convert the shop into a single-car garage and move the grow into a spare bedroom. So I've been adjusting my model to work in the room. The reservoirs are backed up to a wet wall, so I'll be tapping into that for grow, utility sink, and sprayer for cleaning.

Fist thing's first though. I'm removing the carpet and putting in a pond liner. I'm also putting a 4" drain and p-trap into the floor that'll drain into the yard right outside the room.

I'll also be adding dedicated 120v and 240v lines. I'll have the drivers on 240v, and everything else at 120v.

I'll also have the following:

1/4 hp chiller
window ac (I don't really need a mini-split)
Alita 80 LPM air pump
Danner Supreme 1800 GPH water pump for the under current
VenTech 440CFM exhaust fan w/scrubber
Ventech 440CFM active intake w/mushroom filter 
So here's what I have so far for the new grow room:


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

Here are a few pics from my old RDWC under a 600w HPS


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

BuddyColas said:


> I like the hinged top of your DWC pots...that way you can catch a little root porn whenever your want!
> 
> I'll be watching on the sidelines as your project becomes reality. Thanks for sharing.


Thanks Man 

The buckets and lids are from here:
http://www.mbferts.com/13-Gallon-DIY-Undercurrent-Hydroponic-Grow-Buckets-DWC-Hydro-880.htm

I was debating using totes. I've always used them before, but I couldn't find the exact size I wanted. The 2" pipes for the undercurrent take up a lot of space in the tent. These were a perfect fit. I'll be using the 13 gallon buckets.


----------



## BuddyColas (Nov 4, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Here are a few pics from my old RDWC under a 600w HPS


Very nice. It looks like you have the 4x4 with 4 plants growing down well. I like bigger plants myself. 

So on your drawings you have 3 reservoirs...wouldn't 1 be good enough?


----------



## Rottedroots (Nov 4, 2016)

Hey JSB riddle me this. In your renderings can you tell me how far it is between COBS or are there no actual distances or measurements?? Let's say your planning and designing a six COB array and want everything on a ten inch center Can you extrapolate what length to cut the stock to complete the project or are they just "ideas". They sure do look cool in any event


----------



## Olive Drab Green (Nov 4, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Here are a few pics from my old RDWC under a 600w HPS


Holy dogshit, what strain is that?


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

Rottedroots said:


> Hey JSB riddle me this. In your renderings can you tell me how far it is between COBS or are there no actual distances or measurements?? Let's say your planning and designing a six COB array and want everything on a ten inch center Can you extrapolate what length to cut the stock to complete the project or are they just "ideas". They sure do look cool in any event


Thanks!


Right now they are just ideas, but the model is scaled to actual size. The cobs have 12" between them. I think that would cover the footprint of a single plant (2x2), but I can't say for sure.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

Olive Drab Green said:


> Holy dogshit, what strain is that?


I believe that was either Grand Daddy Purps, or Blackberry Kush. The colas are Super Silver Haze. They were huge, but hard to control height. I think they take 16 weeks. I know the season here in Oregon is too short to grow them.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

Rottedroots said:


> Hey JSB riddle me this. In your renderings can you tell me how far it is between COBS or are there no actual distances or measurements?? Let's say your planning and designing a six COB array and want everything on a ten inch center Can you extrapolate what length to cut the stock to complete the project or are they just "ideas". They sure do look cool in any event


I'm still really new to COBs so the designs I have were from the last couple days.

But I would highly recommend you check out this thread. 
https://www.rollitup.org/t/my-amare-hydroponics-hut-suncloak-grow.916789/

Big Smo's got some killer setups and knows a ton about this. He's been helping me out with all of this (as well as some others)


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

BuddyColas said:


> Very nice. It looks like you have the 4x4 with 4 plants growing down well. I like bigger plants myself.
> 
> So on your drawings you have 3 reservoirs...wouldn't 1 be good enough?


That was from my old grow. My new one will be just four plants in a 4x4. I'm with you. I like growing them out and natural. I've grown SCROG and had some great yields, but you had to work for the increase. Its true that what you put into it, that's what you'll get out of it. I could be in and out of there every hour, just tweaking things. Moving a light a few inches to the left, turn this plant a little so a leaf gets some light, etc...but that's not really my goal with this build. 4 plants is plenty for me. Yeah, I'll have a little bit less of a yield, but my back won't be killing me and I'll be able to leave it alone for a while and work on other things.

Hydroponics is very hands on and it takes a lot more of your time. You're tied to it. You can't just pack up and head out of town for a few days with it up and running. Anything can go wrong and it takes a quick response to avoid losing your crop. But at the same time, I believe I can make it dependable enough to not have to be right on top of it.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Hydroponics is very hands on and it takes a lot more of your time. You're tied to it. You can't just pack up and head out of town for a few days with it up and running. Anything can go wrong and it takes a quick response to avoid losing your crop. But at the same time, I believe I can make it dependable enough to not have to be right on top of it.


That's for the noobs who are on the fence with going soil or hydro


----------



## Olive Drab Green (Nov 4, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> That's for the noobs who are on the fence with going soil or hydro


Go soilless. Coco/peat/perlite/pumice. Best of both soil and hydro. I love Roots Organic.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

I'm outta here, but tomorrow I'll start posting descriptions about my setup, the reservoirs (and why I want three of them), piping, drainage, etc...and I'll get the parts and prices listed from my spreadsheet.

later


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

Olive Drab Green said:


> Go soilless. Coco/peat/perlite/pumice. Best of both soil and hydro. I love Roots Organic.


I had thought about that. It's a pretty easy setup, that's for sure. Do you just top feed them on a timer?


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I had thought about that. It's a pretty easy setup, that's for sure. Do you just top feed them on a timer?


As much as I really like my RDWC UC setup, I also like the thought of just doing something simple. I'm going to have to think about that and do some more research.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

If I went soilless, I like the idea of using hydroton.

With coco, peat, perlite, etc...do you reuse the same mix for each grow?


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 4, 2016)

I'm reading up on growing in 100% hydroton as an alternative to the DWC. I'll see if it sways me. I know I can't do soil because of the constant heavy lifting (bad back and knees). 

bbl


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Nov 4, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I'm reading up on growing in 100% hydroton as an alternative to the DWC. I'll see if it sways me. I know I can't do soil because of the constant heavy lifting (bad back and knees).
> 
> bbl


No till, you re -use the soil you don't lift anything once your pots are set  I am loving it and glad I went this route over RDWC............


----------



## Olive Drab Green (Nov 5, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I had thought about that. It's a pretty easy setup, that's for sure. Do you just top feed them on a timer?


I just hand feed once a week. And I also reuse my medium, yes.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 5, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> No till, you re -use the soil you don't lift anything once your pots are set  I am loving it and glad I went this route over RDWC............


I've thought long and hard about this (Peter Griffin laughs in the background). I think I am going to go with an ebb and flow using hydroton and a bottom reservoir.

The RDWC UC would be so cool to build and see it work, but I think, after the initial excitement wore off, I would be stuck with this beast of a grow to maintain. Not to mention power, water, and time consumption. I think a fill and drain is going to be much easier, cheaper, and a ton less work to build and maintain.

So I'll probably start a new thread today after I modify my design. If any noobs out there want me to go over the DWC, in detail, for their own projects, I certainly will. RDWC UC is a bad-ass system, and the yields would be scratching at the ceiling for the amount you can get out of a plant. DWC has always been my favorite system and I always had great yields.

The couple pics I posted of my original grow were RDWC.

Anyways, I'll work on a new thread today...if anyone really cares (LOL)

Peace


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 5, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I've thought long and hard about this (Peter Griffin laughs in the background). I think I am going to go with an ebb and flow using hydroton and a bottom reservoir.
> 
> The RDWC UC would be so cool to build and see it work, but I think, after the initial excitement wore off, I would be stuck with this beast of a grow to maintain. Not to mention power, water, and time consumption. I think a fill and drain is going to be much easier, cheaper, and a ton less work to build and maintain.
> 
> ...


Well I'll give you my two cents; having run RDWC for years, I switched to Tupur Royal Gold soilless media. I run it with dry hydroponic nutrient salts. They work like the business, very good at buffering both pH and EC. It happens to work very well in ebb n flood tables as well. 

I'm getting excellent results with less finicky bullshit and a lot more consistency;


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 5, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Well I'll give you my two cents; having run RDWC for years, I switched to Tupur Royal Gold soilless media. I run it with dry hydroponic nutrient salts. They work like the business, very good at buffering both pH and EC. It happens to work very well in ebb n flood tables as well.
> 
> I'm getting excellent results with less finicky bullshit and a lot more consistency;
> View attachment 3823392 View attachment 3823393


Cool, I'm going to check out your thread!

Thanks Man


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 5, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Well I'll give you my two cents; having run RDWC for years, I switched to Tupur Royal Gold soilless media. I run it with dry hydroponic nutrient salts. They work like the business, very good at buffering both pH and EC. It happens to work very well in ebb n flood tables as well.
> 
> I'm getting excellent results with less finicky bullshit and a lot more consistency;


Awesome pics, btw!!!


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 5, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Cool, I'm going to check out your thread!
> 
> Thanks Man


The modern era starts on page 129.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 5, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> The modern era starts on page 129.


Cool, thx


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 5, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Awesome pics, btw!!!


Thanks, brother. That cola is ISS Bubblegum (afaik, anyway) and the tree is blue cheese, in this case Blueberry x Cheese. For scale, those are 4" squares on the trellis panel. She got tall, over 6' above the bucket;


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 5, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I switched to Tupur Royal Gold soilless media. I run it with dry hydroponic nutrient salts.


Do you mix that with anything, or do you use it right out of the bag? I've seen lots people making their own soil mixes and wasn't sure if it was the same for soilless, like peat, vermiculite, etc...


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 5, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Do you mix that with anything, or do you use it right out of the bag? I've seen lots people making their own soil mixes and wasn't sure if it was the same for soilless, like peat, vermiculite, etc...


I run it straight from the bag, but I'm also running pure hydroponics. Of course you can mix all sorts of goodies in there if you like, from microbial inoculants to earthworm castings and such. It doesn't have much nutrition in it, it's ready for whatever the grower wants. The same company also sells a soil mix with lots of goodies, ready for use. 

One reason I switched was to play with some goodies and see how that affects my results. It's something that just can't be done with RDWC.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 5, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Thanks, brother. That cola is ISS Bubblegum (afaik, anyway) and the tree is blue cheese, in this case Blueberry x Cheese. For scale, those are 4" squares on the trellis panel. She got tall, over 6' above the bucket;


LOL, Holy shit, dude! I think she needs a haircut...just a little off the top.

Those are damn impressive! 

I'm starting to get torn between what you're doing, which is growing them just like a plant in soil, or having some sort of active system like a top feed or flood n drain. I like the thought of things being automatic, but I'm going to be in there everyday as it is. I really like the idea of having a buffer. I remember having to always stay on top of it with my RDWC.

Hmmmmm...starting to like the minimalist approach.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 5, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I run it straight from the bag, but I'm also running pure hydroponics. Of course you can mix all sorts of goodies in there if you like, from microbial inoculants to earthworm castings and such. It doesn't have much nutrition in it, it's ready for whatever the grower wants. The same company also sells a soil mix with lots of goodies, ready for use.
> 
> One reason I switched was to play with some goodies and see how that affects my results. It's something that just can't be done with RDWC.


Yeah, I'd do what you do and use hydro nutes with feeding. I like Fox Farms, myself. I wouldn't bother adding anything to the mix, unless the results were significant.


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 5, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Yeah, I'd do what you do and use hydro nutes with feeding. I like Fox Farms, myself. I wouldn't bother adding anything to the mix, unless the results were significant.


I'm a long time advocate of using dry hydroponic nutrient salts. I found an agricultural supplier here in Colorado that mixes them for tomato, cucumber and flower greenhouses in the region and I get their Jacks equivalent mix, which already has all the micros and base nutes. I add a few more double salts like epsom salt, MKP and calcium nitrate- and that's it. It's SHOCKINGLY CHEAP compared to anything at the hydro store, exposing them for the racket they are. How cheap? 50 gallons of plant ready nutrient solution costs me less than a dollar.

That said, there are surely many plant active compounds that aren't nutrients. An example would be the slime of earth worm castings. This substance increases soil wettability and helps promote beneficial microbes. That's distinct from the work poop itself, who knew?

That's why I want to play with some soil additives; I think there are synergies to be gained. I can't do this in a bare root hydro approach.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 5, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I'm a long time advocate of using dry hydroponic nutrient salts. I found an agricultural supplier here in Colorado that mixes them for tomato, cucumber and flower greenhouses in the region and I get their Jacks equivalent mix, which already has all the micros and base nutes. I add a few more double salts like epsom salt, MKP and calcium nitrate- and that's it. It's SHOCKINGLY CHEAP compared to anything at the hydro store, exposing them for the racket they are. How cheap? 50 gallons of plant ready nutrient solution costs me less than a dollar.
> 
> That said, there are surely many plant active compounds that aren't nutrients. An example would be the slime of earth worm castings. This substance increases soil wettability and helps promote beneficial microbes. That's distinct from the work poop itself, who knew?
> 
> That's why I want to play with some soil additives; I think there are synergies to be gained. I can't do this in a bare root hydro approach.


I didn't know that about the salts. I actually used salts for quite a while with my old DWC. Yeah, I'll definitely go that route then.

Thanks!


----------



## PetFlora (Nov 6, 2016)

From my DIY MiniMme F & D

One plant in a 30 x 30 under 250w Amare. i gave a nice top cola to a friend + a fair amount of sugary leaf

3 gallon tote with 3" net pot

Ornamental stones are much much better than hydroton


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 6, 2016)

PetFlora said:


> From my DIY MiniMme F & D
> 
> One plant in a 30 x 30 under 250w Amare. i gave a nice top cola to a friend + a fair amount of sugary leaf
> 
> ...


You rock, dude


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 6, 2016)

Well, after some thought I've decided to stick with RDWC UnderCurrent. 

I was first looking at gravity ebb & flow (reservoir underneath), but I wanted a much larger reservoir and I didn't want to lose at least a foot of grow space, 'cause I like growing full-sized plants. So I was looking at active ebb & flow with a multiflow controller and a 55 gallon drum. I was looking at all the components, and the room layout. But I started thinking that this was, once again, turning into a complex hydroponic system. I don't mind complex things so this didn't deter me. But I realized that I'd be setting something up nearly as complex as the DWC. I love DWC and have always had great results, so that's what I'm going with. 

I'm not going to have three reservoirs though. The thought behind having 2 extra was to have one filled with tap water and the other filled with purified water. The first (tap) would be used to flush the system and the second (pure) to refill it. But I was overthinking it. The water here is around 180ppm, so I should have no problem just using tap water. That's all I used before and I never had problems.

I'll put some pics up a little later.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 9, 2016)

I've been working on my layout quite a bit. I'm sticking with RDWC and decided to make 2 x 8 COB arrays, which will be powered externally by 2 x MW HLG-320H-C1050's

Next I'll be adding the pond liner frame, as well as the air pump & lines, and the active intake and exhaust fans. I also plan on posting my parts list and links soon. I've had everything planned out with costs and links for a while.

The tent will be a Gorilla Lite 4x4. I know they are a little more expensive, but they've got a great reputation, and I like the extended height option.
https://gorillagrowtent.com/product/lite-line-44-grow-tent-kit/

Here are a few. You can take a look at all the renderings I've got for this set at http://imgur.com/a/XTx3j

PS: The little canister looking things to the left and right of the tent in these first couple pics are recessed lights I'll be putting in the ceiling. 












































*Eye Candy*


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 9, 2016)

Can everyone follow the flow of the re-circulation?

The external inline pump, to the left of the chiller, draws the water starting from the reservoir. Water goes from the reservoir, though the top green 2" pipes along the wall, through the tent, and between the buckets. Then it drops down and tee's the water to the buckets for the return. The water flows through the buckets on the way back through the bottom 2" green return pipe, which is below the feed pipe. Then it follows the wall back until it arrives at the water pump which pumps it into the chiller, and the out of the chiller back into the reservoir.

Couple notes:
Green pipe is 2" PVC
Red pipes are drain
Blue pipes are water feeds from the house

I plan on cutting the tent and running the pipes through. I'll modify anything to make it work just the way I want, so this doesn't bother me. Haven't decided for sure, but I'll probably use a bulkhead fitting with the tent holes clamped in between and a pipe passing through it.

The chiller I'm getting allows for nutrients to be run through it. I wasn't sure about going with a sealed system with a dedicated pump and coil, allowing for a less expensive chiller, or just using a single pump and a more expensive chiller. The later is what I chose.

The chiller will be a Hamilton 1/4 hp chiller
https://www.amazon.com/Hamilton-Technology-Aqua-Aquarium-Chiller/dp/B004LPMOTU/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top?ie=UTF8

Note to the noobs: If you're going to get a chiller, there are two different kinds. One's that allow for nutrients to be run through it, and one's where you can't. The one's that you can't you have to use a dedicated pump and run hoses from the chiller to a copper coil that sits in the reservoir, and then back to the pump which pumps it through the chiller. This is a "sealed" system. The more expensive chillers are aquarium chillers that have titanium heat exchangers.

The water pump I'll be using is a Danner Supreme Mag-Drive 18 (1800 gph) run inline (outside of the reservoir). The reservoir is 55 gallons and the buckets are 13 gallons. I'll say 50 actual gallons in the res and 40 gallons combined in the buckets. The lines carry a few gallons, but its not a big enough system where the pipes are going to be negligible. I'll be running a 90 gallon RDWC.

I may go down to the Danner 1200 gph pump. I don't know if the 18 is overkill. I calculated it out once and came up with the 1800.

Feedback is always welcome. I know everyone's going to have their favorite brands, but I'm pretty happy with my choices. I probably won't change anything unless I get a consensus about how flawed one of the components is. But adjusting sizes of components to fine tune this grow room and not go overboard on anything is totally up for debate.

And thanks again for any feedback. I hope the visuals help some folks who are new to this.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 11, 2016)

Here are some pics of how it'll look with my pond liner. Around the walls, the pond liner will go over the baseboard and anchored to the walls with strips of building lumber. The outer board is anchored with hurricane straps. I won't really have laminate flooring in there. The carpet will be rolled up, exposing the plywood flooring underneath.

One thing that I wanted to mention - This room will be totally reversible. All the modifications I make, and all the holes I cut, will be able to be easily fixed if/when the room is no longer used as a grow room. 

*Collection:*
http://imgur.com/a/4FTmV


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 11, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Here are some pics of how it'll look with my pond liner. Around the walls, the pond liner will go over the baseboard and anchored to the walls with strips of building lumber. The outer board is anchored with hurricane straps. I won't really have laminate flooring in there. The carpet will be rolled up, exposing the plywood flooring underneath.
> 
> One thing that I wanted to mention - This room will be totally reversible. All the modifications I make, and all the holes I cut, will be able to be easily fixed if/when the room is no longer used as a grow room.
> 
> ...


Standard L brackets would likely work better for your application than the hurricane straps and cost less, but it's a minor quibble. I'm enjoying watching your design process unfold.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 11, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Standard L brackets would likely work better for your application than the hurricane straps and cost less, but it's a minor quibble. I'm enjoying watching your design process unfold.



Thanks! I wasn't really sure what would work best here. So I'll use larger L brackets instead. Probably 4" since that's a 2x6.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 11, 2016)

Oops, just noticed that I need to flip my drain pipe junction so that the side feed points down.


----------



## potpimp (Nov 11, 2016)

JSB99 said:


>


LOL, "Colas". Super nice!!


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 11, 2016)

potpimp said:


> LOL, "Colas". Super nice!!


Pun intended


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 20, 2016)

I've got quite a bit more planned out in my room. I'll add some brief descriptions, but the images themselves in the collection have a lot more info. There's still a whole lot more to do, so if you don't see something, chances are I just haven't gotten to it yet.

I'm going to have an active intake and I was curious about something. As recommended, I'll be running the intake fan a little slower than the exhaust to create a little negative pressure in the tent. For noobs, you do this so that you're not blowing up your tent like a balloon and pushing odors out of the seams. You want ALL the air to leave through the scrubber.

So I'm going to have 2 fan controllers. What I was thinking was that I could plug the intake controller into the exhaust controller, and then set the intake controller to 75% of max. I can control both fans from a single controller and the intake fan will always be 1/4 less than the exhaust fan. Is this a common practice?


Check out the collection: http://imgur.com/a/y3OMK

*Scrubber:*






*Exhaust fan and noise suppressor (muffler):*







*Replaced COB shells with glass domes:*






*
Close-up:*







*Active air intake with foam "mushroom" filter. The aluminum duct was really tricky, but I think I made it pretty accurate:*







*Whole room:*






*
One of several night shots I'm working on. I made the hoses "glow" a bit. There's a lot more technical description for what's going on here, but I'll just stick with "glowing" to keep it simple  :*






*
Chiller, Air and water pumps. Added glowing labels:*







*Air pump and line:*







*A little eye-candy :*







*Air tube and RDWC pipes:*


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Nov 20, 2016)

may want to raise your air pump a little higher, might get some water in the line if its that low. i don't trust check valves.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 20, 2016)

One of the things I did was add the extra tent extension Gorilla sells for their tents. The room has 9' ceilings, so I wanted to take advantage of that. You can't have enough height, right?

Well, looking at the images, I don't see where I would ever need that much. Especially since I'll be using lower heat components. So I'm probably just going to cap it at 8' (actually 7' 7").


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 20, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> may want to raise your air pump a little higher, might get some water in the line if its that low. i don't trust check valves.


Great catch! Thank you!

What I'll do then is zip tie the hoses to the water pipes, which is plenty high.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 20, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> may want to raise your air pump a little higher, might get some water in the line if its that low. i don't trust check valves.


Re-read this and realized you mentioned raising the pump. I'll make the platform a couple inches taller. That should help.


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 20, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Re-read this and realized you mentioned raining the pump. I'll make the platform a couple inches taller. That should help.


The idea is that you want the air pump above the level of the water it's stones are sitting in, because sometimes the pump will pull a vacuum when it gets shut off and the lines cool. This draws water up the air lines and possibly siphons into the pump itself if the pump is below the waterline.


----------



## Maine_Coast (Nov 20, 2016)

Great Thread, I am following along! I am in the process of designing my first RDWC UC system and am looking forward to your parts list. The bucket link you provided was just what I have been looking for. Thank you! I am leaning towards a 9 or 12 site system in a 12x12 room*.*


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 20, 2016)

Maine_Coast said:


> Great Thread, I am following along! I am in the process of designing my first RDWC UC system and am looking forward to your parts list. The bucket link you provided was just what I have been looking for. Thank you! I am leaning towards a 9 or 12 site system in a 12x12 room*.*


Very cool! Thanks 

I actually do have my parts list with links and prices. I'm going to do that very soon.

Let me know if you have any questions or advice.

See ya


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 20, 2016)

Maine_Coast said:


> The bucket link you provided was just what I have been looking for. Thank you!


I had trouble finding those, and at that price. I was looking for the right size tote forever. Those (8 and 13 gallon) really are the most perfect for an RDWC.

The reservoir is online though. Searched for a long time for that as well.

Check it out...

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Sterilite-50-gal-Stacker-Tote-Black/43393267


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 20, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> The idea is that you want the air pump above the level of the water it's stones are sitting in, because sometimes the pump will pull a vacuum when it gets shut off and the lines cool. This draws water up the air lines and possibly siphons into the pump itself if the pump is below the waterline.


I sort of remember that from when I was growing years ago. Thanks for that. 

This is one of the reasons I'm laying this out graphically. It allows people to help me analyze the room and correct problems before it's built.

I appreciate all of the advice!


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 20, 2016)

Does anyone know if I can put code in here? I'm going to start posting my parts list and it'd be great if I can format some of it. Maybe make a table.

I meant HTML tags


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 20, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I had trouble finding those, and at that price. I was looking for the right size tote forever. Those (8 and 13 gallon) really are the most perfect for an RDWC.
> 
> The reservoir is online though. Searched for a long time for that as well.
> 
> ...


My RDWC grow sites were 27 gallon tubs.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 21, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> My RDWC grow sites were 27 gallon tubs.


Wow! Your plants must get huge! Pics? I'd love to see your setup.


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 21, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Wow! Your plants must get huge! Pics? I'd love to see your setup.


My biggest hit two pounds. 

Look in the vertical section; ttystikk's vertical goodness. The modern era starts on page 129.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 21, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> My biggest hit two pounds.
> 
> Look in the vertical section; ttystikk's vertical goodness. The modern era starts on page 129.


Saw those. I didn't realize that's where you were using them. Really cool setup!


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 21, 2016)

*The Price List:*

The price list is fairly complete, but there are a few small things that I didn't bother with. There are also a couple things I'm still up in the air about.

I wish I could posted a block of html here at RIU, but I tried a number of different things with no luck. So I'll just post pics of the budget and put all the links down below. I'm looking at around $4,000 to build this. It was about $1,000 less when I was going to be using an HPS and t5 for the mums. However, the cost savings will add up in no time! And the lights will last for a really long time (10 years or more, with no loss of intensity, from what I remember). Plus I won't be fighting nearly as much heat, and wasting all that extra electricity to do it.




















*LINKS:*

*Tent COB Array:*
COBs - CXB-3590
Drivers - HLG-320H-C1050B
Heatsinks
COB Glass Lenses

*Mothers COB Rail (single rail with 4 COBs):*
COBs (same as above)
Driver - HLG-185H-C1050B
Bar Heatsink
COB Glass Lenses (same as above)

*Main Grow:*
Grow Tent 
Fan/Filter/Controller
Active Intake Fan 
Active Intake Filter 
240v timer 
240v Extension cord 
Water Pump 
Air Pump 
Inline Y-Filter 
Air Stones 
Buckets and Lids 
Controller Reservoir 
Incremental timer 120v 
Chiller 
tri-meter 
Pipes, adapters, bulkheads 
Mother Keeper 
Mother lights timer 120v 
window AC 
Pest Control 
Sulpher Burner 
Sulpher Prills

I'm also going to buy a 110v and 220v breaker, 14-3 and 12-3 Romex, gang boxes, outlets, etc...but that's just for my room and not necessarily what everyone would do.

I know everyone's going to have their favorites, but I've chosen my components based on the popular opinion here at RIU. So point the finger at yourselves before you point it at me LOL If there's a component here that's prone to fail or an absolutely horrible choice, then please let me know. Otherwise I'm pretty happy with my selections.

I know this goes without saying, but your feedback is welcome. 

Now open the floodgates!!!


----------



## Jubilant (Nov 21, 2016)

Man this thread is just so fascinating to read. Keep it up brother


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 21, 2016)

Jubilant said:


> Man this thread is just so fascinating to read. Keep it up brother


Thanks Man, I really appreciate that 

If people are finding this helpful or interesting, or even if they just like the pics, I'll keep posting away


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 21, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Thanks Man, I really appreciate that
> 
> If people are finding this helpful or interesting, or even if they just like the pics, I'll keep posting away


Please do.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 21, 2016)

I just realized I'm not using a tent for the mothers anymore. That was for when I was planning on using the shop. The grow room has a 2x4 closet, which couldn't be any more perfect.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 21, 2016)

I'm relocating the air pump as we speak, so you'll actually see the results of your advice taking place LOL


----------



## Rottedroots (Nov 21, 2016)

HaHa. it'll be cool to see how close your cost estimate is to the finished price. Have you decided on how exactly your going to build your frames? I went with aluminum and rivets but I wish I could have set it up to be more adjustable. Right now everything is 11 inches on center but it might be nice to change it up or add suplimental lighting without a rebuild. I tried like hell to use sketch up to design my frames but I had trouble assigning actual usable measurements. Will you be able to cut all your stock like PVC and aluminum based on your plans? Much better than a tyvek and sharpie drafting table.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 21, 2016)

Rottedroots said:


> HaHa. it'll be cool to see how close your cost estimate is to the finished price. Have you decided on how exactly your going to build your frames? I went with aluminum and rivets but I wish I could have set it up to be more adjustable. Right now everything is 11 inches on center but it might be nice to change it up or add suplimental lighting without a rebuild. I tried like hell to use sketch up to design my frames but I had trouble assigning actual usable measurements. Will you be able to cut all your stock like PVC and aluminum based on your plans? Much better than a tyvek and sharpie drafting table.


I'm going to use extruded aluminum and tee inserts to mount the heat sinks. I'm not too familiar with extruded aluminum, but someone here said I was looking at 80/20. It's 1/2" aluminum. I may go up to 3/4", but I'll throw that question out there a little later. I don't know how sturdy the elbows are for the cross sections. If they don't hold up that well, I'll probably take it to a welding shop and have them tack it together, or just learn how to do it myself with a torch. I'll be cutting my own rails and the 2" PVC with my chop saw. Pretty sure I've got a Diablo 180 around. If not, then I'll get a 200 tooth blade. I can take down the rough edges with my Dremel.

I'm not too concerned with it being adjustable. it's 12" centers for the model I built. I did everything to scale and I can print out blueprints with measurements on everything with Sketchup. Even though Sketchup is one of the easier CAD programs, it is still very complex. There are things you have to learn no matter what 3D app you're using. Just being able to navigate in a 3D space is really tricky when you're first learning, and you can't really be productive until you've gotten comfortable with that. I've been doing it long enough now that it's like driving a standard. After a while you're not even thinking about the clutch or shifting. What's funny though is that I'm so used to using my mouse that way that I try navigating like that on web pages, documents, and pictures. What I really need is a 3D mouse. its specially made for working in 3D space. I've been playing around with 3D apps for about 8 years, but just as a hobby. To me it's like painting on a canvas. I've done plenty of projects on paper, but I really wanted to be able to walk through my environment and see the space I'm working with. 

It's really important to me that I plan this is well as I can ahead of time. There are too many things that just can't be easily adjusted after the fact. Not to mention that I don't want to be working on it every day like my old setups. It's fun and all, but I don't want to have to work on it when I don't want to .

The cost? I'm sure that'll creep up. All the little stuff adds up, but it's okay. I'm prepared for it. It's an investment and I plan on using the room indefinitely. The ROI on it for me is about 5 months.

Alright, I've babbled enough and my dog's begging for my attention. Kids! LOL


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Nov 21, 2016)

i really like the 80/20, but the shit is spendy, can't find a local source of it, and online they charge you to cut every damn piece of it, then you have to pay shipping.


----------



## Rottedroots (Nov 21, 2016)

What's 80/20? You have a lot of time invested in the 3D modeling bud and it shows. I was initially going to have each six COB frame support the drivers but I don't think it's necessary and that's where the weight seems to be. 3/4 X 1/16th L's and flats end up making a very solid frame. Well you went with 12 inch on center and I went with 11 inches on center. Maybe i need to adjust things already....


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 21, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> i really like the 80/20, but the shit is spendy, can't find a local source of it, and online they charge you to cut every damn piece of it, then you have to pay shipping.


They have it on Alibaba, but I haven't researched it enough to get prices yet.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 21, 2016)

Rottedroots said:


> What's 80/20? You have a lot of time invested in the 3D modeling bud and it shows. I was initially going to have each six COB frame support the drivers but I don't think it's necessary and that's where the weight seems to be. 3/4 X 1/16th L's and flats end up making a very solid frame. Well you went with 12 inch on center and I went with 11 inches on center. Maybe i need to adjust things already....


Not sure of the meaning of "80/20" is myself. Roger, or one of the others, might be able to explain it. I'll look into this a bit more and see what's involved.

I didn't want to mount my drivers to the frame because I didn't want the weight or the heat. I'll have a control board to the side of the tent where they'll be mounted. Even though I'll be running extra wire and a heavier gauge, I think I can still make it look clean and keep the wires out of the way.


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Nov 21, 2016)

80/20 is actually a company that makes extruded aluminum with T channels in it, and a big array of connectors and accessories to go with it. other companies make it, and probably have trade names for it, but 80/20 has become the generic term for it, as well as this companies brand

https://www.8020.net/attitude


----------



## Rottedroots (Nov 21, 2016)

So that's what that stuff is called. pricey but very cool. I'm not sure where I'd even find it but I'll be watching with interest to see how it comes together. Is it something that can be welded?


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Nov 22, 2016)

aluminum is weldable, but you need special equipment, an arc welder will melt it into slag, need something like a tig or mig wire welder


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 22, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> 80/20 is actually a company that makes extruded aluminum with T channels in it, and a big array of connectors and accessories to go with it. other companies make it, and probably have trade names for it, but 80/20 has become the generic term for it, as well as this companies brand
> 
> https://www.8020.net/attitude


Awesome info!

Thanks


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 22, 2016)

Roger A. Shrubber said:


> aluminum is weldable, but you need special equipment, an arc welder will melt it into slag, need something like a tig or mig wire welder


I was thinking that if welding didn't look feasible I could use long bolts to go through the sides of the outer rails and through the center circle of the cross bars. I'd need to drill holes in the sides of the outer rails to pass the bolt through. I think I'd probably use thread locker on the bolts and cut off the remainder of the bolt to clean it up.

I have not idea if thin bolts over 12" are available. I have to imagine so. I'm sure there are applications in the world of industry where bolts like that are being used. If not, I'll see what else I can come up with.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 22, 2016)

I'll only have to weld or bolt together the frame IF the adapters aren't strong enough to hold the frame together tightly. I'm really hoping that the adapters are adequate.

Can anyone give some feedback of their experience with 80/20 and the adapters?


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 22, 2016)

I was just thinking that another option to using long bolts would be to tap the center holes so I could use a short bolt on each side of the outer rails that would screw right into the cross sections.


----------



## Roger A. Shrubber (Nov 22, 2016)

you can get threaded rod in pretty long pieces, lock washers and lock-tite on both ends


----------



## Rottedroots (Nov 22, 2016)

Those long pieces threaded rod are great to work with. Just beware that when you cut it you had better make a clean cut or you're just about guaranteed to have cross-threaded bolts. I think that 80-20 stuff is pretty cool especially with the threaded T's which allows for a lot of adjusting. As cool as it is its almost an overburdened to carry six COBs with no drivers on board. I'm glad I didn't think about using 80/20 before I went with simple 1/16 aluminum stock. if I had found it is would have used it as I'm a big fan of over building chit. I could have saved hundreds by purchasing unnecessary stock. I used a lot of 3/4 inch plywood instead of 1/4 inch. it's a long list of ways I could have saved but hopefully it's a one and done build. your build will be one for the ages JSB. Have fun.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 22, 2016)

Rottedroots said:


> As cool as it is its almost an overburdened to carry six COBs with no drivers on board. I'm glad I didn't think about using 80/20 before I went with simple 1/16 aluminum stock. if I had found it is would have used it as I'm a big fan of over building chit.


This is the great unknown for me because I've never worked with extruded aluminum channels before. I have no idea of it's strength or weaknesses. I was going to overcompensate by using 3/4", but even then, I'd have no idea of whether it'd work.

I could very easily use angle iron to build the frames, but I wanted to take a different approach. I thought the aluminum would not only be lighter, but it would look really cool.

When you say "1/16 aluminum stock", can you give me a link so I know exactly what you're referring to? I'm going to choose stability over asthetics, so if it looks like a more feasible option then I'd probably go that route. Especially since it has already been tested by you.

Thanks


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 22, 2016)

Rottedroots said:


> I went with simple 1/16 aluminum stock..


Could you post a pic of your frame so I can see how you did yours? I can't remember if you had posted pics earlier, so I apologize in advance.

Thanks Man


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 22, 2016)

Are these the stock aluminum bars you were talking about?

Aluminum Bars, Flats, and Tubes


I was thinking I could use 3/4" solid angle aluminum






LINK

and flat aluminum for the cross sections:






LINK


If I'm on the right track, what sizes do you think would be adequate to build the frame I designed? Should I use steel or aluminum?

Thanks


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 22, 2016)

I'm looking on the 80/20 site and what I'm seeing, as far as the rails and fasteners, looks very strong and durable.

I'm not sure what would constitute "high cost" for this material, but for an example I picked a 1" extruded channel, and set the length needed as 96". The price came to $52.83. If I had to use a lot of material to make my frames I would think about using a less expensive material. But I don't think it's going to be all that expensive for the little amount of material I need. Plus, I'll be cutting all my bars, so if there was a cost per cut, I'm getting away from that.

LINK






There are also options to have mounting holes drilled at the ends for corner brackets.


Check out these corner brackets. With parts like these I'm sure I can make a durable frame out of 80/20.
LINK

This site allows you to send them your plans and they'll analyze it to see what materials I would need to build a sturdy frame. Wonder if they'd powder coat it green for me so I don't have to paint it myself? I saw black and yellow parts, so maybe.


----------



## qballizhere (Nov 22, 2016)

Here you go for T slot aluminum http://www.tnutz.com/


----------



## Rottedroots (Nov 22, 2016)

I had contemplated welding some steel stock to make the frames and it would have been the cheapest route. I wasn't aware of 80/20 as a material so I just hit the depot. The aluminum cuts and drills easily and a ten dollar rivet gun did the rest. I really just copied Gromaus. He dah     man.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 23, 2016)

Rottedroots said:


> I had contemplated welding some steel stock to make the frames and it would have been the cheapest route. I wasn't aware of 80/20 as a material so I just hit the depot. The aluminum cuts and drills easily and a ten dollar rivet gun did the rest. I really just copied Gromaus. He dah View attachment 3837491 View attachment 3837492 View attachment 3837493 View attachment 3837495 man.


That came out really good!

I've been contemplating getting a rivet gun after seeing people putting these together with them. Looks really simple.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 23, 2016)

Ugh! Lost a few days work last night from corrupting my own files. Stupid mistake and the symbolic link I created to one of my cloud folders was severed and my work wasn't backed up.

Being a long time programmer, I have had lots of experience with crashes and data loss, and I've looked back several times to see what I could've done better. But computers are smarted than people and will find a way to ruin your day no matter how much you prepare (LOL)

I didn't lose all that much. 80% of the time was spent trying to figure things out or find a location for something. It shouldn't take me too long to catch back up.

Give me a couple days folks, I'll be back up soon.


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 23, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Ugh! Lost a few days work last night from corrupting my own files. Stupid mistake and the symbolic link I created to one of my cloud folders was severed and my work wasn't backed up.
> 
> Being a long time programmer, I have had lots of experience with crashes and data loss, and I've looked back several times to see what I could've done better. But computers are smarted than people and will find a way to ruin your day no matter how much you prepare (LOL)
> 
> ...


Shit. You're waaaaaay ahead of most of us as it is.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 23, 2016)

Holy shit!!! I was able to recover it from an unlikely place after a 5 hour verbose scan and recovery!


----------



## Rottedroots (Nov 23, 2016)

Shit yeah. I hate it when my symbolic links to my cloud get severed b4 I back up my work. ...
I bought my rivet gun and about 1000 rivets in different sizes for under 15 buckski's at Harbor Freight. Its very easy to work with the stuff as far as cutting and drilling and I'm sure that the frames would comfortably carry their own drivers. I'm not sure exactly how much I paid because I used the cheapo Depot card that the wife pays and I use.


----------



## Rottedroots (Nov 23, 2016)

Oh and I'm just going to use cheap chain and hooks to adjust the height as need be. I've had a ratchet fail which crushed a couple of girls. It's easier to use a chain and hook on each corner instead of rigging up a single rachet to adjust things.
I also purchased a few plastic cement mixing troughs for flood trays instead of purchasing something proprietary to MJ. 
Ramble on!


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 23, 2016)

Rottedroots said:


> Oh and I'm just going to use cheap chain and hooks to adjust the height as need be. I've had a ratchet fail which crushed a couple of girls. It's easier to use a chain and hook on each corner instead of rigging up a single rachet to adjust things.
> I also purchased a few plastic cement mixing troughs for flood trays instead of purchasing something proprietary to MJ.
> Ramble on!


I never did like the yo-yo's. I always thought they were a pain. I always hung my hoods with pulleys, 550 cord (military peeps will know what this is), and a cleat.

I've actually got a design for a motorized light lifter. Concept is to use a bike hanger like this:






and mount a bi-directional servo to the side of the hanger to lift and lower it. I could use a remote control, but I think manual switches would do just fine.

Bet I could make it for under $100. The bike lift shown in the picture is $12.99 at amazon. I was going to build it to lift the blockbuster hood I was going to use for a 1k hps. That thing was fairly heavy. I'm thinking the COB array would be a bit lighter.

I might still build it at some point, but it would probably be done after things were up and running. I'm going to have a lot to do as it is.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 23, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I never did like the yo-yo's. I always thought they were a pain. I always hung my hoods with pulleys, 550 cord (military peeps will know what this is), and a cleat.


Even without the motor, this seems like an easier (and cheaper) route than the yo-yos


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 23, 2016)

Rottedroots said:


> I had contemplated welding some steel stock to make the frames and it would have been the cheapest route. I wasn't aware of 80/20 as a material so I just hit the depot. The aluminum cuts and drills easily and a ten dollar rivet gun did the rest. I really just copied Gromaus. He dah man


Growmaus rocks! Learned everything about COBs in a day or two from his vids!

I'm thinking that if the 80/20 turns out to be too expensive, or it's too much of a pain in the ass, I'll take your design. I really like that! I was on their site and they had pics of people's projects with 80/20, and I can't imagine it being so expensive when you see what people built with it. Like a racing console for games (I built one myself a few years ago lol), and other things that would have been too expensive to build given the amount of material and parts that would be required.

So I'll send my design to them and I'll post the results. I'll tell them if it's made cheap enough I would flood his store with new customers


----------



## Rottedroots (Nov 23, 2016)

I just like the simplicity of the hook and chain method. It'll be easier to precisely adjust the frame height and it will be a lot easier to balance than from a single point. plus I have chain but I don't have ratchets. prolly doesn't make much difference. WTH


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 24, 2016)

Rottedroots said:


> I just like the simplicity of the hook and chain method. It'll be easier to precisely adjust the frame height and it will be a lot easier to balance than from a single point. plus I have chain but I don't have ratchets. prolly doesn't make much difference. WTH


Sometimes simple is "simply the best"...and cheapest


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 24, 2016)

Rottedroots said:


> Shit yeah. I hate it when my symbolic links to my cloud get severed b4 I back up my work. ...
> I bought my rivet gun and about 1000 rivets in different sizes for under 15 buckski's at Harbor Freight. Its very easy to work with the stuff as far as cutting and drilling and I'm sure that the frames would comfortably carry their own drivers. I'm not sure exactly how much I paid because I used the cheapo Depot card that the wife pays and I use.


What do you use for your links? 

I've used LinkShellExtension for quite a while now. Has always worked really well.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 24, 2016)

qballizhere said:


> Here you go for T slot aluminum http://www.tnutz.com/



They have some really good prices!

I'm thinking that if I'm concerned about how 80/20 will hold up with the weight, I'd probably go overboard and go 1" instead of 1/2" or 3/4". The prices are reasonable enough. The brackets seem to be quite a bit less expensive as well.

Thanks for the post!


----------



## qballizhere (Nov 24, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> They have some really good prices!
> 
> I'm thinking that if I'm concerned about how 80/20 will hold up with the weight, I'd probably go overboard and go 1" instead of 1/2" or 3/4". The prices are reasonable enough. The brackets seem to be quite a bit less expensive as well.
> 
> Thanks for the post!


Yes they are not bad they dont have the selection 80/20 has but for basic t slot its hard to beat....... I was able to configure a 2x4 frame for $90 each the only thing is I would need 8 of them for my room  and cant justify that cost yet


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 24, 2016)

qballizhere said:


> Yes they are not bad they dont have the selection 80/20 has but for basic t slot its hard to beat....... I was able to configure a 2x4 frame for $90 each the only thing is I would need 8 of them for my room  and cant justify that cost yet


Yeah, I noticed they were lacking the adapters I was looking for to mount the heatsinks to.

I hear ya about the price. For 1 or 2, sure. But for multiples, gotta go cheap.


----------



## qballizhere (Nov 24, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Yeah, I noticed they were lacking the adapters I was looking for to mount the heatsinks to.
> 
> I hear ya about the price. For 1 or 2, sure. But for multiples, gotta go cheap.


Have a look at the value pack 4 foot price https://www.metals4uonline.com/aluminum-angle-6061-3_4thsx3_4thsx1_8th


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 25, 2016)

qballizhere said:


> Have a look at the value pack 4 foot price https://www.metals4uonline.com/aluminum-angle-6061-3_4thsx3_4thsx1_8th


Right on!

Thanks


----------



## OrganicCanuck (Nov 25, 2016)

Nice work man, those heat sinks are great looking, sure beats my 2 year old design with fans and wires strewn about lol. From your graphic design it looks like you will be using PVC as a frame for the "grow" space?. Have you used this material before with success? I would advise against using 1/2" if that's the case, unless you fill it with sand or put threaded rod through the PVC with nuts and washer to give it more rigidity. I have built shelving with PVC, outdoor greenhouse, and even with glue the 1/2" PVC alone gets a bit warped over time. Indoors you may not have temperature changes large enough to cause issue though.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 25, 2016)

OrganicCanuck said:


> Nice work man, those heat sinks are great looking, sure beats my 2 year old design with fans and wires strewn about lol. From your graphic design it looks like you will be using PVC as a frame for the "grow" space?. Have you used this material before with success? I would advise against using 1/2" if that's the case, unless you fill it with sand or put threaded rod through the PVC with nuts and washer to give it more rigidity. I have built shelving with PVC, outdoor greenhouse, and even with glue the 1/2" PVC alone gets a bit warped over time. Indoors you may not have temperature changes large enough to cause issue though.


Thanks, I appreciate the compliments  It takes a real nerd to get more involved with the graphical design than the project itself. LOL

The tent is actually a Gorilla Grow Tent, and I went with that for a few different reasons. One of which was how strong both the frame and the fabric was. Advice is always welcome though, and if I hadn't known that before, it would have definitely taken your device.


----------



## OrganicCanuck (Nov 25, 2016)

Right on brother, so you go everything up and going i take it. You are obviously interested in the LED's, i was just watching this youtube video on water cooled DIY LED modules, the guys builds them for a high speed filming light. The idea looks killer has me interested in trying a version like it. Well maybe not 1 KW on one small module like that...but as far as the cooling goes, it seem legit, and i like the direction it takes LED's.


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 25, 2016)

OrganicCanuck said:


> Right on brother, so you go everything up and going i take it. You are obviously interested in the LED's, i was just watching this youtube video on water cooled DIY LED modules, the guys builds them for a high speed filming light. The idea looks killer has me interested in trying a version like it. Well maybe not 1 KW on one small module like that...but as far as the cooling goes, it seem legit, and i like the direction it takes LED's.


Interesting stuff! I've built my own water cooled systems.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 25, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Interesting stuff! I've built my own water cooled systems.


I was always afraid of having water around equipment, in the case of a leak. Those liquid-cooled HPS bulbs are a really cool idea, but could you imagine the damage if something went wrong? I like the Ice Box coolers for air cooled hoods. Thought that was cool, except for the condensation that it must drip.

Anyone running an Ice Box on their hood(s)?


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 25, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I was always afraid of having water around equipment, in the case of a leak. Those liquid-cooled HPS bulbs are a really cool idea, but could you imagine the damage if something went wrong? I like the Ice Box coolers for air cooled hoods. Thought that was cool, except for the condensation that it must drip.
> 
> Anyone running an Ice Box on their hood(s)?


I ran cold water through my COB LED modules. Works great!


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 25, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I ran cold water through my COB LED modules. Works great!


 I was just thinking that I'd feel pretty safe liquid cooling LEDs. Would it be necessary? Do they put out that much heat? 

Btw, anyone know how much an entire COB light (cob, heatsink, lens) weighs?


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 25, 2016)

OrganicCanuck said:


> Right on brother, so you go everything up and going i take it. You are obviously interested in the LED's, i was just watching this youtube video on water cooled DIY LED modules, the guys builds them for a high speed filming light. The idea looks killer has me interested in trying a version like it. Well maybe not 1 KW on one small module like that...but as far as the cooling goes, it seem legit, and i like the direction it takes LED's.


I love everything filmed with a high-speed camera! Cool stuff!

Guess it takes a lot of light for filming high speed. Who here is going to be the first to build one for their grow? Should we start making bets?


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 25, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> The tent is actually a Gorilla Grow Tent...


The tent in the renderings is scaled to the actual size. I have it showing the second height extension on top, but I'm actually not going to get it. I'll adjust the pictures soon. If it wasn't for the renderings I wouldn't have know that I'm really not going to need it. 

Extra space, in a tent, is more air that has to be cooled and replaced, so it's usually better not to have a whole bunch of space.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 28, 2016)

Hey everyone!

Got some stuff figured out in my room and I finished laying out the air lines to the reservoir and buckets. I also raised the air pump higher than the waterline, as recommended. 

I secured the window with 3/4 plywood. I may or may not laminate it. It's going to be there for many years so I might go through the extra effort. After all, I do plan on painting everything the way it is in the renderings. I've been gathering info on how to paint pvc, since pvc is so finicky with everything. I'll leave a gap on the ends for pvc glue as well. The strips around the edges are screwed into the wall to secure the board.

I'm going to be using a 5,000 btu window a/c and dehumidifier. The majority of the year here in Oregon is fairly cool. I keep my house around 66 in the Winter. I won't have to use the a/c much, but I think it'd be okay to run it as a dehumidifier in the Winter. Can anyone tell me if it's the same, better, or worse doing that would be compared to using a dedicated dehumidifier?

Something odd that I'm noticing is the size of the air pump. When I made that, the water pump, and the chiller, I didn't bother going through the effort of making it look exact. I just built boxes using the size of the item it represented. Amazon states that the Alita AL-80 air pump I'll be using is 7.3 x 8.8 x 11.2 inches. I can't seem to find any other sources with the dimensions. I've had a pretty hefty commercial pump, and I don't remember it being that big. Could that possibly be the measurement of the box? Not that it'd change my mind about the pump or anything. Just wondering.

The way I laid these out, it follows the path of the air lines to the manifolds. I'm going to be pumping some serious air, but really, it's the recommended size pump. That's from the advice I got here, as well as Alita recommending the AL80 for 80 to 95 gallons.

*Alita AL-80*

You can see the whole collection here -> *PICS*

Added some posters to liven up the room 












I've been experimenting with different glass and plastic textures for the hoses. You can get some really cool images with caustics (even though I didn't use any here).







I'll point out something kind of cool here. If you look at the wood legs, you can see the grooves in the wood and the little hairs sticking out. That's called a "bump map" and is an attribute to textures. The walls have an orange peel texture as well. That's your nerd news of the day 

















































The air line is secured to the top of the green pipe. I may strap it below when I build it. Not sure yet. I still have to figure out how I want to secure the pipes themselves.
























4 port manifold to the buckets. I have to redo the small lines here. The number of segments that make up those curves is too low and I can't figure out how to adjust it! Or, I could just say "Screw it! We get the point!". That does sound easier.






























*Still to come:*

Removing top tent extension
Draw the straps suspending the exhaust fan/muffler, and the flexible duct, from the ceiling
Add existing outlets to the wall, as well as my dedicated 110 and 220 lines. I should have quite a bit I can run on 220v
Tapping the plumbing on the reservoir wall for the room.
Adding the floor drain and p-trap
Laying out the 4x2 mother closet. That closet couldn't have been a more perfect size my me 
Everyone enjoy


----------



## a mongo frog (Nov 28, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Hey everyone!
> 
> Got some stuff figured out in my room and I finished laying out the air lines to the reservoir and buckets. I also raised the air pump higher than the waterline, as recommended.
> 
> ...


Fucking nice!!!!! Those plants are going to be monsters. How long in veg before your first topping? What strain is that?


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 28, 2016)

a mongo frog said:


> Fucking nice!!!!! Those plants are going to be monsters. How long in veg before your first topping? What strain is that?


These pictures are actually computer generated images I created using a 3D CAD program called "Sketchup". I use another tool called "VRay" to render my images and give it that realness. You're not the first who's been fooled  

But I really hope no one gives you crap about that. The whole point of approaching my plan in this way, is to create something that looked real and accurate. This is so that I can make adjustments and fix issues ahead of time instead of trying to do it in the middle of a grow, when you first realize there's a problem.

The strains I plan on growing are LSD, GrandDaddyPurps, Blue Dream, and Lemon Kush. Not at the same time though. I'm going to have a small mother of each living in the 2 x 4 closet. I'll be growing those via the "Bosai-mums" method. Check it out BOSAI MUMS


----------



## a mongo frog (Nov 28, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Check it out BOSAI MUMS


Sick!!!!!!! I love mother plants.


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 28, 2016)

a mongo frog said:


> Sick!!!!!!! I love mother plants.


I know what you're doing. You're hunting for a cougar, aren't you? 

THAT'S why you're really into moms!


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 28, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> These pictures are actually computer generated images I created using a 3D CAD program called "Sketchup". I use another tool called "VRay" to render my images and give it that realness. You're not the first who's been fooled
> 
> But I really hope no one gives you crap about that.


Oh, no- this is RIU, there shall be no such opportunity missed!


----------



## a mongo frog (Nov 28, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> But I really hope no one gives you crap about that.


I did it on page 1 here i think, and someone gave me shit. It was funny though. I enjoy getting shit on here.


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 28, 2016)

a mongo frog said:


> I did it on page 1 here i think, and someone gave me shit. It was funny though. I enjoy getting shit on here.


Lol There's no doubting you're a good sport about it, just teasing bro!


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 28, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I know what you're doing. You're hunting for a cougar, aren't you?
> 
> THAT'S why you're really into moms!


LMAO!


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 28, 2016)

a mongo frog said:


> I did it on page 1 here i think, and someone gave me shit. It was funny though. I enjoy getting shit on here.



I knew someone had posted that before, but i had no idea it was you and you'd do it again, knowing the shit you'd get


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 28, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I knew someone had posted that before, but i had no idea it was you and you'd do it again, knowing the shit you'd get


Some people enjoy abuse. 

How else to explain the politics section?


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 28, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Some people enjoy abuse.
> 
> How else to explain the politics section?


I'm a CNN junky, and I'm just so burnt out by all the shit that's happened over the last year. After the election I turned the TV off and went to the computer LOL


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 28, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I'm a CNN junky, and I'm just so burnt out by all the shit that's happened over the last year. After the election I turned the TV off and went to the computer LOL


Fair nuff.

I'd love to have you draw some of my setup sometime.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 28, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I'm a CNN junky, and I'm just so burnt out by all the shit that's happened over the last year. After the election I turned the TV off and went to the computer LOL


THANK GOD FOR FOOTBALL! LOL


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 28, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Fair nuff.
> 
> I'd love to have you draw some of my setup sometime.


A setup that you've already got built, or a future grow?


----------



## a mongo frog (Nov 28, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I've never grown them but I've been wanting to for a long time now. It looks fairly simple and you can fit them into some really small spaces (or have a lot of them in a larger space).


Yea, i do moms. The way i keep them they take up a lot of space.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 28, 2016)

Check this one out. Playing with lights and optics.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 28, 2016)

a mongo frog said:


> Yea, i do moms. The way i keep them they take up a lot of space.


Very cool!


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 28, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> A setup that you've already got built, or a future grow?


Mine! The one I already have, and who knows? Maybe future upgrades too?


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 28, 2016)

Be back tomorrow in the am


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 28, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Mine! The one I already have, and who knows? Maybe future upgrades too?


I'm going to have my hands full for a while, but after I've got everything rolling, that's be cool. I would be more inclined to build a future design. Kind of like a blank canvas. In fact, I was floating the the idea of be a Grow Room Design Specialist, where I'm provided the room dimensions and other information, and I could design different layout options based on the space and budget available. 

Wow, that was a long sentence. But I did a dab right before i got on here so that would explain a lot lol

Anyways, maybe down the road a little bit. I'm learning a lot with Sketchup by building this layout. I really like it and I'd rather keep designing stuff than lose what I've learned. So we'll see. Maybe in a year. I'll know in February if I'll have the funds available to build this, or if i can raise the money via FundMe.com 

Catch y'all later


----------



## ruwtz (Nov 28, 2016)

Amazing work. I can see the hours put in here, having done it all myself on SKetchup, albeit on a quicker scale before I started the actual build. In my sig if you're interested. 

It's definitely a useful way to organize and design and anticipate issues. You also seem smart enough to realize you can't plan for everything. So much more is learned in practice, so much about growing has to become intuitive and can only come from experience. 

That's how I'm feeling anyways as I come towards the end of my first indoor cycle in my purpose built setup. So much of my original design ended up changing as I used it and found better ways to work. 

One thing is for sure, if you have the same application to growing as you do CAD engineering then you're gonna do just fine!

Good luck. I'll be sticking around for sure.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 28, 2016)

ruwtz said:


> Amazing work. I can see the hours put in here, having done it all myself on SKetchup, albeit on a quicker scale before I started the actual build. In my sig if you're interested.
> 
> It's definitely a useful way to organize and design and anticipate issues. You also seem smart enough to realize you can't plan for everything. So much more is learned in practice, so much about growing has to become intuitive and can only come from experience.
> 
> ...


Thanks, I really appreciate that. I'm definitely going to check out your shed thread tomorrow! I'm real interested to see how you did everything. I have so much to learn, but it's just for fun. I'm really glad i had gotten to where I could work fairly well in SU by the time I was considering growing again. My skills have increased quite a bit by having a project with a lot of learning and problem solving in order to get the layout that I really wanted. There were a lot of things that i could have glossed over, but I really wanted to learn even the little things. The little things often are necessary to accomplish some of the more difficult tasks. Habits from the programming days 

Look forward to talking to you a bit more.

See ya


----------



## qballizhere (Nov 29, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Hey everyone!
> 
> Got some stuff figured out in my room and I finished laying out the air lines to the reservoir and buckets. I also raised the air pump higher than the waterline, as recommended.
> 
> ...


I saw you mentioned painting pvc will furniture grade pvc not work for a hydro system? Can get it in several colors https://candsplastics.com/ or https://formufit.com/pages/color-pvc-pipe-and-fittings


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 29, 2016)

qballizhere said:


> I saw you mentioned painting pvc will furniture grade pvc not work for a hydro system? Can get it in several colors https://candsplastics.com/ or https://formufit.com/pages/color-pvc-pipe-and-fittings


No, looked into that. Furniture grade will leech chemicals from the paint because the inside is painted as well as the outside (they dip them). Plus, PVC glue won't work unless the surface is bare. When I paint them I'll be pre-cutting the PVC to size, then taping the ends off to leave room for PVC cement. I'll just take my time prepping the surface and set up a temporary clean room with poly plastic for painting.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 30, 2016)

I'm going to preempt every post where I talk about working with electricity with:

*"WARNING! Do not do what I do with electricity unless you are an electrician or have adequate skills and experience! I cannot stress this enough! Electricity can kill you real quick, and without warning. It's very easy to kill yourself messing with electricity! I am telling you NOT to do this and I won't be responsible for your actions."*


I gathered all my power necessity info for the dedicated 120v and 240v lines I'm going to run. I wanted some extra eyes on this. The cost each month is based on max load, which would only happen on the hottest days of Summer. With my old 600w RDWC, I think my bill jumped about $40 or $50 a month. But that was smaller (66"x30"), my pumps weren't nearly as robust as the pumps I'll be using this time, I'll have a dedicated ac (which probably won't run much), a 1/4hp chiller, and an extra fan for the active intake. I know I haven't got the calculations correct for the cost increase. It's way too much. Could you give me some direction? My increase is probably way out of whack. I've probably got it calculating for every hour of the month (lol). I've just never had to calculate to cost of my power usage.

I haven't heard any negative feedback on the equipment I'll be using. Not sure if that's a good thing or if people aren't interested in glancing at it. I'm pretty sure I've chosen some real quality and high performing equipment, but I think I was interested in hearing if any of it's overkill. Like the air and water pumps. If you've read this much, could you provide a little feedback? Just a "looks good", or "that Alita air pump is overkill". I'd appreciate it.


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 30, 2016)

I'm probably going to run the AC from the room's power. Both rooms on the breaker are empty. You're supposed to run them on their own breaker. I suspect because of the compress kicking on and creating a heavy initial load. The room's on an AHCI breaker. I know they're prone to tripping, but with the small AC, I don't thing that's going to happen. With the other breakers, I'm well below the 80% threshold. 120-15a and 240-20a.


----------



## ruwtz (Nov 30, 2016)

I have a comment: Your kWh rate is a bargain!


----------



## JSB99 (Nov 30, 2016)

ruwtz said:


> I have a comment: Your kWh rate is a bargain!


It's not too bad here in Oregon 
Property taxes are steep though.


----------



## ruwtz (Nov 30, 2016)

I will also say I hope you're ready to blow the budget. It's the way these things go. Any project at any scale is prone to it.

I put together a 3 part budget, phase 1 build and phase 2 fitout, and a final phase for starting up (consumables etc).

This took a shit ton of research, based off my design and config, to price every last nail and nute bottle into enormous spreadsheets.

Then I ran expenditure on a sub sheet, totally itemized, and I can tell you the build one in particular is at least twice as big as the original budget. I planned for $6k, and spent more like $15k by the time I called it finished. Totally blew it.

Now I know this has a lot to do with my amateur building skills; I was going to Home Depot 3 or 4 times a week - sometimes twice in a day - for this thing or that item etc. a proper builder would know better but I had to learn as I went along.

Yet still, the budget went out the window, purely in favor of a mindless determination to do every last little task as good as I could manage.

All for one end game: great plants.

Work in progress.

You seem to be similarly minded and very motivated, to whatever end.

Just watch them pennies, friend. They'll slip away and no mistake!


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 30, 2016)

ruwtz said:


> I have a comment: Your kWh rate is a bargain!


No kidding, right?


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 1, 2016)

ruwtz said:


> I will also say I hope you're ready to blow the budget. It's the way these things go. Any project at any scale is prone to it.
> 
> I put together a 3 part budget, phase 1 build and phase 2 fitout, and a final phase for starting up (consumables etc).
> 
> ...


I've blown my budget on so many projects 

I'm sure I'll go over all this because there are so many small items (screws, hooks, brackets, etc...) that I haven't listed on my price sheet. But all of the major things are online and when I get ready to start buying stuff, I'll research the best prices one last time. It will have been 6 months or longer between when I was looking up prices and when I actually buy them. So heatsinks, COBs, and other things very well may have dropped in price over that time.

I'm going to search for the right method of calculating energy costs with this room. Not that it would discourage me from building it or anything. Its just out of curiosity. I'm guessing an average of around $50 - $60 increase each month to run this tiny beast.

The more things I can buy on Amazon the better. I've got Prime and I get free 2-day shipping on everything! Of course, most places offer free shipping anyways.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 1, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I've blown my budget on so many projects
> 
> I'm sure I'll go over all this because there are so many small items (screws, hooks, brackets, etc...) that I haven't listed on my price sheet. But all of the major things are online and when I get ready to start buying stuff, I'll research the best prices one last time. It will have been 6 months or longer between when I was looking up prices and when I actually buy them. So heatsinks, COBs, and other things very well may have dropped in price over that time.
> 
> ...


I've blown my budget so hard there's dollar bills all over the floor when I'm done. 

Funny how it all seems to come back, though.


----------



## OrganicCanuck (Dec 1, 2016)

Why worry about calculations . Why not just get a CT(current transformer) with small lcd. And have the CT coil around your main feed to this room. That way you can monitor current draw, works particularly well if you plan to "dim" your light, using a potentiometer. You can monitor how much current draw there is while set to lowest setting of the potentiometer then to the highest setting, and everything in between.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 1, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I've blown my budget so hard there's dollar bills all over the floor when I'm done.


That's what happens when you're blowing money (LOL)


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 1, 2016)

OrganicCanuck said:


> Why worry about calculations . Why not just get a CT(current transformer) with small lcd. And have the CT coil around your main feed to this room. That way you can monitor current draw, works particularly well if you plan to "dim" your light, using a potentiometer. You can monitor how much current draw there is while set to lowest setting of the potentiometer then to the highest setting, and everything in between.


Good idea, but I'm not all that concerned with it. I'll figure it out when I get my bill. My main goal was to make sure I had all the power I needed without going above 80% of the breaker's capacity. Looks like everything's good, so I'm happy


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 2, 2016)

*Flood Examples:*

I wanted to make sure that my pond liner and frame were adequate enough to handle the 90 gallon capacity of the RDWC. I also wanted to get a visual of what it would look like in the worst case scenario.

According to my calculations, I'll have plenty of room available in my flood tray (pond liner). So much room that I've decided not to put a drain in the floor. What I'll be doing is running a 3/4" drain port through the wood window covering. I won't go into the specifics yet. I'm going to add a valve and pipe to the water pump that will sit just above the floor. The pump will act like a sump pump.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 3, 2016)

I was thinking about adding foam insulation panels between the green pipes and the back of the chiller, and between the reservoir and the chiller.

The heat transfer created by the chiller cooling the water is going to create a little heat pocket there. With the moving liquid, it may not make any difference. It takes 4 times the time and energy to heat and cool water than it does air.

What do y'all think? Should I create a little insulation barrier between the chiller and the water?


----------



## OrganicCanuck (Dec 5, 2016)

I love the .."toe rail." Extra reassurance, "if something can go wrong, it will go wrong" usually how it works with me. And If your whole res unloaded it wouldn't be so much trouble and/or damage to worry about, just great!..... If that were ever to happen, you could just pop in a few fish and turn your whole system into one of those aquaponic systems, you feed the fish, fish feed the plants  .


----------



## OrganicCanuck (Dec 5, 2016)

Also i looked back at all your examples, it looks like you have 2 blowers, one intake and one exhaust. And on the exhaust you have 2 "can" style scrubbers, and one mushroom filter on the intake. Have you ran a system like that before? I assume you will be supplementing Co2? Those scrubbers, even one tiny one would be sufficient for your size set up, but bigger definitely assures that, and its better at removing heat. I'v never seen 2 filters on one blower that is why i ask, seems like it could put stress on that blower. And the intake blower, you decided on this.. i assume to bring in air without letting in light? I am just curious is all, you obviously know your location better than anyone else, every space has different needs.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 5, 2016)

OrganicCanuck said:


> Also i looked back at all your examples, it looks like you have 2 blowers, one intake and one exhaust. And on the exhaust you have 2 "can" style scrubbers, and one mushroom filter on the intake. Have you ran a system like that before? I assume you will be supplementing Co2? Those scrubbers, even one tiny one would be sufficient for your size set up, but bigger definitely assures that, and its better at removing heat. I'v never seen 2 filters on one blower that is why i ask, seems like it could put stress on that blower. And the intake blower, you decided on this.. i assume to bring in air without letting in light? I am just curious is all, you obviously know your location better than anyone else, every space has different needs.


The second scrubber, post-exhaust, is actually a muffler for sound suppression. Here's an EXAMPLE

Yes, I have set up systems like this before. Both the exhaust and intake fans will be on speed controllers. The intake fan controller will be plugged into the exhaust fan controller and set to 75% (or whatever it takes to achieve a slight negative pressure in the tent). Whatever I set the exhaust fan to, the intake fan will only ever be a percentage of that.

Running two fans allows you to run them both at slower speeds, which should help reduce the noise a little more.

I've decided to go with the Vortex S-Line fans. The CFM is a bit lower at 375, compared to the 440 CFM I was originally getting. However, I doubt I will even use 375 CFM with two fans, COB LEDs, externally mounted drivers, and a well controlled environment (tent in an independently air conditioned room, within a house with central AC).

Vortex Fan

The Vortex doesn't suppress sound like they're advertising, but every little thing counts. I'll also be using insulated flexible ducting and I'll be surrounding the fans in sound reduction boxes I'll build with acoustic foam pads. The fans will also be suspended by bungee cords preventing vibrations through the studs. In the next release of renderings I'll be showing how I plan on suspending the intake fan.

I appreciate the advice. Keep it coming. I've done tons of research and know some things from past builds, but you never know when you're going to miss something.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 5, 2016)

OrganicCanuck said:


> I assume you will be supplementing Co2?


Yes, but that's going to be a little down the road. We'll say that'll be done in Phase 2 

Some of the reasons for the active over passive:

Help prevent tent frame from flexing due to too much negative pressure and not enough open ports, when running fast
The fans will run slower with less load, so they should last longer and may be quieter, even with two
Sealed environment for pest control
Filtered environment so dust and other micro-crap doesn't get sucked into the tent all day
Light control
And yes, someday co2 injection


----------



## OrganicCanuck (Dec 6, 2016)

That answered my question well, of course it's a muffler... that was my second guess. Actually i didn't even know mufflers were available, probably not anywhere close to me, and in good ol' Canada, a heavy unit like that would cost more in shipping than anything. Even common Amazon items are unavailable to Canadians, and i swear i have seen ads for things that are listed @ $3.99, but shipping is $199.00. Really, how does amazon allow this, well i guess if your dumb enough to accept the sale......

Have you ever seen those Secret Jardin grow... "tent?" its not really a tent but like made from sheet metal, steel frame. Comes in same standard sizes. I have not physically touched or seen one, but the idea looks cool, all solid. Maybe its Canadian, Jardin sounds French.


----------



## WeedFreak78 (Dec 6, 2016)

You need a disclaimer on those photos, they are way to realistic. I thought you ran acrylic pipe and custom bent it. I should've known, it was too clean. I love the thought going into it, don't see that much around here most of the time.... I geek out on this stuff to much as well. 

When I designed my room I went as deep as figuring out flow rates and restriction through the furnace filters I use on my room intake to calculate the proper passive intake size to just maintain a negative [email protected]% fan speed. I wanted to install a manometer to monitor room pressure, it could be an indicator to replace filters, or of a dying fan. 2 walls of the flower room are built as light traps with voids that were sized based on my fans max cfm. Air enters through filters, through light trap wall at floor level on flower side, goes out up high, through another light trap wall, exits veg side at floor level, goes out through fan/ filter up high into. Most of my electrical is run above 4', all my water is run below 4', for the safety issues you mentioned. The containment floor is a great idea, I did 2x6 border, with vinyl flooring up to the top, and caulked the corners. 

One tip, I noticed it looked like you had the exhaust on the bottom. Put it up high, and your intake down low. It'll draw cooler, dry air in across the buckets, keeping them cooler, and then up through the canopy, which helps with humidity control in flowering.



JSB99 said:


> A setup that you've already got built, or a future grow?





ttystikk said:


> Mine! The one I already have, and who knows? Maybe future upgrades too?


 People pay good money for grow room design, with your graphics skills and financial breakdowns, you could make a killing. Find a good GC and team up. 

I saw a comment about liquid cooling leds. Why not, computers are liquid cooled. Run soldered copper tubing on the circuits the same way. Have braided SS line running from those to the chiller if you're really concerned.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 6, 2016)

OrganicCanuck said:


> That answered my question well, of course it's a muffler... that was my second guess. Actually i didn't even know mufflers were available, probably not anywhere close to me, and in good ol' Canada, a heavy unit like that would cost more in shipping than anything. Even common Amazon items are unavailable to Canadians, and i swear i have seen ads for things that are listed @ $3.99, but shipping is $199.00. Really, how does amazon allow this, well i guess if your dumb enough to accept the sale......
> 
> Have you ever seen those Secret Jardin grow... "tent?" its not really a tent but like made from sheet metal, steel frame. Comes in same standard sizes. I have not physically touched or seen one, but the idea looks cool, all solid. Maybe its Canadian, Jardin sounds French.


I could've sworn the Secret Jardin's were fabric like most other tents. Are you sure they're metal? Do me a favor and post a link so I can check it out. I'm very curious about this.

I don't think mufflers are all that common even though they are readily available. But this is something you can easily build yourself. I would imagine there are DIY threads on mufflers, but if not, just follow a DIY carbon scrubber thread for the frame of it. Instead of using carbon in the middle, get a 1" or 2" thick foam (like for a mattress topper) and roll it up inside. Don't expect miracles with a muffler, though it does help. If you use a muffler along with insulated flexible duct and a few other tricks, you can greatly decrease the noise. Then instead of using a duct cap at the other end, use a flange like the one used on the front. One of the individual methods, by itself, won't do all that much. But with a few of them together, it can make a drastic difference. 

In the renderings I show flexible aluminum duct hose, but that's only because it looked cooler in the pics. The white just kind of washed out when I tried it.

That sucks about the cost of shipping to Canada! My vaporizer is made by a Canadian company (Arizer), When I order replacement attachments the shipping is usually asd much, if not more, than the part itself. It's not like Canada's an ocean away or anything! Someone's pockets are getting lined with gold I bet (LOL).


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 6, 2016)

WeedFreak78 said:


> You need a disclaimer on those photos, they are way to realistic. I thought you ran acrylic pipe and custom bent it. I should've known, it was too clean. I love the thought going into it, don't see that much around here most of the time.... I geek out on this stuff to much as well.


LOL, thanks! Working in 3D you can make things look realistic, or even beyond realistic  I really don't think I would have sat here and designed it all in 3D if I had the money on-hand. I have to wait until at least February for some funds to come in, so I'm forced to wait. But if something happens and I don't get the money, at least I can see it brought to life this way. And if it helps noobs who need visuals, then I'm glad I could help.



WeedFreak78 said:


> When I designed my room I went as deep as figuring out flow rates and restriction through the furnace filters I use on my room intake to calculate the proper passive intake size to just maintain a negative [email protected]% fan speed. I wanted to install a manometer to monitor room pressure, it could be an indicator to replace filters, or of a dying fan. 2 walls of the flower room are built as light traps with voids that were sized based on my fans max cfm. Air enters through filters, through light trap wall at floor level on flower side, goes out up high, through another light trap wall, exits veg side at floor level, goes out through fan/ filter up high into. Most of my electrical is run above 4', all my water is run below 4', for the safety issues you mentioned. The containment floor is a great idea, I did 2x6 border, with vinyl flooring up to the top, and caulked the corners.


Something that has helped by using CAD with this project has been the ability to show, in great detail, a complex idea such as the one you described above. 



WeedFreak78 said:


> One tip, I noticed it looked like you had the exhaust on the bottom. Put it up high, and your intake down low. It'll draw cooler, dry air in across the buckets, keeping them cooler, and then up through the canopy, which helps with humidity control in flowering.


I need to put labels on some more equipment to clear up some confusion. The tent will have an active intake, which is what the fan/mushroom filter to the lower-left of the tent. The exhaust system is up above. It goes Scrubber->Fan->Muffler.

But thanks for keeping an eye out. I definitely incorporate good advice into my design, so I appreciate all the eyes on this 



WeedFreak78 said:


> People pay good money for grow room design, with your graphics skills and financial breakdowns, you could make a killing. Find a good GC and team up.


It's a good idea, and one I've thought about. I deal with a lot of chronic pain and Fibromyalgia. It suppresses my energy quite a bit. I won't go looking for a client, but if someone here has a larger project, with several sites and rooms for perpetual growing on a distribution level, then I would certainly consider it. Especially if it makes me the money I need for my own grow 



WeedFreak78 said:


> I saw a comment about liquid cooling leds. Why not, computers are liquid cooled. Run soldered copper tubing on the circuits the same way. Have braided SS line running from those to the chiller if you're really concerned.


Yeah, I saw that too! Really cool setup (no pun intended)! In the pic/vid I saw, it looked like he had a radiator or heat exchanger sitting on the COB frame. I could see having that outside the tent. But inside, it'd remove the heat directly from the COBs but retain that heat in the tent. Maybe I wasn't clear on that part. Maybe he'll chime in and go over it a little.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 6, 2016)

*This is the Active Intake Fan. It is the only source of air for the tent. On top is a foam mushroom filter. Having the fan here allows for the tent to open all the way on the sides. The flexible duct will sweep back towards the fan when opened.*






*The fan will be suspended with bungee cords so that the fan vibration doesn't bleed into the walls and studs. I'll figure out how to suspend it with the cords, but this is the general idea. The exhaust fan will be hung with bungees from the ceiling.*












*I started my control center for the grow. The equipment for the mothers will be in the closet. These outlets will be on the dedicated 120v and 240v run to the room.*






*I thought I'd be running more off the 240v, but it's only going to be the 2 drivers for the tent COB arrays, and then a 185 running 4 x 1050 COBs for the mothers.*






*My drivers are way prettier!*






*I built a couple timers based on the actual timers. The more stuff I make the faster I get *


----------



## WeedFreak78 (Dec 6, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> LOL, thanks! Working in 3D you can make things look realistic, or even beyond realistic  I really don't think I would have sat here and designed it all in 3D if I had the money on-hand. I have to wait until at least February for some funds to come in, so I'm forced to wait. But if something happens and I don't get the money, at least I can see it brought to life this way. And if it helps noobs who need visuals, then I'm glad I could help.


I used to use Solidworks at my last job as a machinist, that was sweet. I would design and machine something for myself and get paid for it.. lol . Idk how easily I could pick it up again, it's been a few years. 



JSB99 said:


> Something that has helped by using CAD with this project has been the ability to show, in great detail, a complex idea such as the one you described above.


I do everything on paper with pencil still, lol. Half of it is unintelligible to anyone but me. I'm looking at a pile of at least a dozen, better than half filled, pages of notes, parts lists, measurements, floor plans and random drawings of the room I'm currently planning. A few times I've come close to scribbling a drawing to explain something to someone on here, snapping a pic and posting it. But I hate dealing with photobucket, so it never happens.


----------



## 72camaross (Dec 7, 2016)

This thread just captured me for about 3 hours! Very impressive and looking forward to following along. 

I really wish I had your SketchUp skills, I'm planning my first room (also first grow) using the tool right now. I have a CS background so I can use the tool but the engineering part is lost on me. I really enjoy the design phase, though, and would totally do this for others if I was skilled enough. On to the youtube tutorials, I guess! I'm also waiting for the funds because I'll be building a space that will hopefully be permanent as well so the design will keep me from clicking 'Buy now.'

I love the look and usefulness of the 80/20 stuff and would love to build my own lights off GrowMau5's designs and teachings but I'm in Canada so getting parts feels like it's impossible. And, if it's not impossible, it is twice as much haha.

Keep up the great work! You've almost convinced this noob to go from soil to hydro! haha


----------



## OrganicCanuck (Dec 7, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I could've sworn the Secret Jardin's were fabric like most other tents. Are you sure they're metal? Do me a favor and post a link so I can check it out. I'm very curious about this.
> 
> 
> That sucks about the cost of shipping to Canada! My vaporizer is made by a Canadian company (Arizer), When I order replacement attachments the shipping is usually asd much, if not more, than the part itself. It's not like Canada's an ocean away or anything! Someone's pockets are getting lined with gold I bet (LOL).



Hmm, like i said i never actually seen the tents in person, so you are probably right. I thought for sure it looked like solid construction.


Yep the best vaporizer, i actually met the owner he used to sell the units him self in the Greater Toronto Area, would deliver it right to your house. I think this was before it was all CSA approved and on the actual market. He would charge i think like 80$ at the time, came with the remote, bag kit, whip kit, and the "aroma diffuser". This is going back 2004 i believe i bought the unit, still fully operational. The only issue is constantly breaking the whip elbow. Always my mistake though, knocking off table or getting up off the couch with the whip still in hand and you probably know what happens after that lol.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 7, 2016)

72camaross said:


> This thread just captured me for about 3 hours! Very impressive and looking forward to following along.
> 
> I really wish I had your SketchUp skills, I'm planning my first room (also first grow) using the tool right now. I have a CS background so I can use the tool but the engineering part is lost on me. I really enjoy the design phase, though, and would totally do this for others if I was skilled enough. On to the youtube tutorials, I guess! I'm also waiting for the funds because I'll be building a space that will hopefully be permanent as well so the design will keep me from clicking 'Buy now.'
> 
> I love the look and usefulness of the 80/20 stuff and would love to build my own lights off GrowMau5's designs and teachings but I'm in Canada so getting parts feels like it's impossible. And, if it's not impossible, it is twice as much haha.


Hey, thanks! I appreciate that 

Getting started with 3D was pretty tricky. But after I got past some of the basic stuff I found that I was able to concentrate more on the design than learning. I think I'm going to find other things to do in SU after this.



72camaross said:


> Keep up the great work! You've almost convinced this noob to go from soil to hydro!


I know, it's hard to resist! Its a lot of fun getting to see the system in motion, growing your plants. Soil is boring lol. But it can be a little (or lot) more time consuming and it's really touchy. You have to stay on top of it. I'm trying to design mine to be as maintenance free as possible with a hydro setup. I love tinkering with stuff, but I don't want to become a slave to it.

There are a lot of things you can build yourself, or cut corners, to save money. But if you want a very reliable system, you're going to have to pony-up and pay for some of the things that are specially suited for that kind of system. I always made my own bulkheads and used round buckets. But I know if I want reliability I need to use real bulkheads (not Uniseals) and square buckets (which cost more). If you're trying to build a Ferrari, putting Hyundai tires on it is going to cause some problems. So I'll spend the extra money so that I don't have to worry about leaks.

I know a lot of people have built great, proven components on their own. I have too. But I know which areas I had problems with that I'll eliminate by getting proven parts. When it comes to water, you wouldn't believe how persistent water is at getting out through the smallest places.

I keep writing these book-long posts as I'm working on a balloon LOL. Man, I can ramble on....


----------



## OrganicCanuck (Dec 7, 2016)

I also read you were going to use titan controls, timer or what have you. Did you already buy that? i have read they can be quite unreliable. I have had nothing but issue trying to automate my set up using similar digital products. I am currently working on a fully "arduino" controlled system, but its turning out to be complicated, writing program that is very specific to my needs and wants. I thought it would be cheaper to DIY, probably not, but its learning experience. In hind sight i should of just bought something for these guys. 

https://www.controlanything.com/Relay/Relay/TARALIST_RELAY 

Not all that expensive and everything is easy to set up, while still having total customization. Would work well with your setup, and really put the icing on the cake. There is still DIY work with this route as well, mounting the board in enclosure, adding receptacles, sensors what ever you want. : )


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 7, 2016)

OrganicCanuck said:


> Hmm, like i said i never actually seen the tents in person, so you are probably right. I thought for sure it looked like solid construction.


It's going to be fabric with mylar on the inside. I think they're 900D threaded and are are pretty durable.



OrganicCanuck said:


> Yep the best vaporizer, i actually met the owner he used to sell the units him self in the Greater Toronto Area, would deliver it right to your house. I think this was before it was all CSA approved and on the actual market. He would charge i think like 80$ at the time, came with the remote, bag kit, whip kit, and the "aroma diffuser". This is going back 2004 i believe i bought the unit, still fully operational. The only issue is constantly breaking the whip elbow. Always my mistake though, knocking off table or getting up off the couch with the whip still in hand and you probably know what happens after that lol.


That's cool! I bought a Volcano earlier this year and sold it after a couple months. I can get so much compressed vapor off one balloon, and it's heavy and dense like smoke. Incredible flavor! But it does have it's downsides. The glass parts break, and to fill my perfect balloons I have to run the fan on 2, which takes 3 minutes to fill a bag. Cleaning the parts kind of sucks, but I'm used to it. 

I'm not knocking the Volcano or anything. I'm saying that I have learned how to get the most out of my Arizer, and I wasn't able to achieve the same with the Volcano.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 7, 2016)

OrganicCanuck said:


> I also read you were going to use titan controls, timer or what have you. Did you already buy that? i have read they can be quite unreliable. I have had nothing but issue trying to automate my set up using similar digital products. I am currently working on a fully "arduino" controlled system, but its turning out to be complicated, writing program that is very specific to my needs and wants. I thought it would be cheaper to DIY, probably not, but its learning experience. In hind sight i should of just bought something for these guys.
> 
> https://www.controlanything.com/Relay/Relay/TARALIST_RELAY
> 
> Not all that expensive and everything is easy to set up, while still having total customization. Would work well with your setup, and really put the icing on the cake. There is still DIY work with this route as well, mounting the board in enclosure, adding receptacles, sensors what ever you want. : )


No, I haven't heard about the timers being unreliable. I haven't bought anything but have used these in the past. I didn't really give much thoughts to the timers, because it's just a timer. How could something so simple screw up, right? The Titans are popular, which is why I was going to go with them. I appreciate you bringing this up, because I'll do some research on them and may go a different route if they are flawed.


----------



## WeedFreak78 (Dec 7, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> There are a lot of things you can build yourself, or cut corners, to save money. But if you want a very reliable system, you're going to have to pony-up and pay for some of the things that are specially suited for that kind of system. I always made my own bulkheads and used round buckets. But I know if I want reliability I need to use real bulkheads (not Uniseals) and square buckets (which cost more). If you're trying to build a Ferrari, putting Hyundai tires on it is going to cause some problems. So I'll spend the extra money so that I don't have to worry about leaks


A little patience with a heat gun and a flat metal plate or an iron can make a flat spot on the side of a plastic bucket good enough for a bulkhead. Practice on a sacrificial bucket to get the hang of it, I melted through a couple times. Then there's always a plastic welder. Just weld the fitting on.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 7, 2016)

72camaross said:


> I love the look and usefulness of the 80/20 stuff ....


This is kind of the unknown variable, because I don't know the limitations. But, the 80/20 site is pretty helpful and you can send designs to them and they'll figure out what thickness is needed, or if it's even feasible. Part of the reason I want to use 80/20 is because it's just so cool looking (lol)! Another major reason was the weight. Being extruded, that stuff is pretty light. Keeping my fingers crossed about being able to use them


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 7, 2016)

WeedFreak78 said:


> A little patience with a heat gun and a flat metal plate or an iron can make a flat spot on the side of a plastic bucket good enough for a bulkhead. Practice on a sacrificial bucket to get the hang of it, I melted through a couple times. Then there's always a plastic welder. Just weld the fitting on.


LOL, never thought of that! Necessity is the mother of invention


----------



## WeedFreak78 (Dec 7, 2016)

OrganicCanuck said:


> I also read you were going to use titan controls, timer or what have you. Did you already buy that? i have read they can be quite unreliable. I have had nothing but issue trying to automate my set up using similar digital products. I am currently working on a fully "arduino" controlled system, but its turning out to be complicated, writing program that is very specific to my needs and wants. I thought it would be cheaper to DIY, probably not, but its learning experience. In hind sight i should of just bought something for these guys.
> 
> https://www.controlanything.com/Relay/Relay/TARALIST_RELAY
> 
> Not all that expensive and everything is easy to set up, while still having total customization. Would work well with your setup, and really put the icing on the cake. There is still DIY work with this route as well, mounting the board in enclosure, adding receptacles, sensors what ever you want. : )


I run Titans stuff, seems better quality to me than most of the other stuff I looked at. I always wonder about people's equipment failures. How/ where was it mounted, how was it cared for, was the case and cooling vents kept clean, did it experience extreme humidity or temp fluctuations that could cause condensation, was it accidentally sprayed with water, etc.

Arduino based room control is something I've looked into, but I don't need any more projects.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 7, 2016)

OrganicCanuck said:


> I also read you were going to use titan controls, timer or what have you. Did you already buy that? i have read they can be quite unreliable. I have had nothing but issue trying to automate my set up using similar digital products. I am currently working on a fully "arduino" controlled system, but its turning out to be complicated, writing program that is very specific to my needs and wants. I thought it would be cheaper to DIY, probably not, but its learning experience. In hind sight i should of just bought something for these guys.
> 
> https://www.controlanything.com/Relay/Relay/TARALIST_RELAY
> 
> Not all that expensive and everything is easy to set up, while still having total customization. Would work well with your setup, and really put the icing on the cake. There is still DIY work with this route as well, mounting the board in enclosure, adding receptacles, sensors what ever you want. : )


All of my Titan equipment has been nothing but bulletproof.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 7, 2016)

I've got most of the power laid out. I also labeled some of the equipment because of some confusion with the fans. 

I had talked earlier about getting the right equipment. I haven't seen any negative responses about the size of the pumps I'll be going with. To me, that is really good. I had done tons of research and asked lots of questions about what the actual ideal pump capacity should be for a setup like this. The two pumps are really powerful, but they are the correct sizes. So I'm interested to see what the "ideal" system is able to produce compared to the ad-hoc systems I put together before.

I met with my pharmer yesterday and was telling him about COB LEDs. He's got his doubts, but he also hasn't kept up with what's been happening over the past year or so. So I'm really hoping that they match, or exceed, the output of a 1k HPS. I'm hoping to prove him wrong, because I want really LEDs to work and have been waiting years for the technology to catch up!


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 7, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> All of my Titan equipment has been nothing but bulletproof.


I'm expecting to hear some positive feedback on the Titan's. I think this is the first I've heard of problems, but maybe its just with certain timers of their's. I remember when I got my first Titan in 2008. It took me a bit to get used to some of the things. Not everything worked in the way I expected it to, but it did work in the way it was intended to. After that, I never had a problem with mine.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 7, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> I'm expecting to hear some positive feedback on the Titan's. I think this is the first I've heard of problems, but maybe its just with certain timers of their's. I remember when I got my first Titan in 2008. It took me a bit to get used to some of the things. Not everything worked in the way I expected it to, but it did work in the way it was intended to. After that, I never had a problem with mine.


My advice is to avoid getting equipment with internal timers. It's too easy to plug the trigger cord into an external timer, easily replaced if it quits.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 7, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> My advice is to avoid getting equipment with internal timers. It's too easy to plug the trigger cord into an external timer, easily replaced if it quits.


Totally! If that timer goes and you're not comfortable digging into it with a soldering gun and a new timer, forget it. I take all my electronics apart for cleaning and always fix my own stuff. Saves so much money in repairs, especially if you keep your gear clean. My buddy gave me his 55" plasma years ago because it had a power problem. I replaced a couple blown capacitors and the TV last about 6 years. I had to replace the caps every so often, but for a free plasma, I'll spend a couple bucks every now and then


----------



## ruwtz (Dec 8, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> All of my Titan equipment has been nothing but bulletproof.


Are we talking about outlet timers? Because I have a bunch of the Titan digital timers all going strong. But they are clearly identical to literally every other China made outlet timer out there, just with a Titan badge. Harbor Freight, Amazon, eBay... all the same. 

Take that to mean whatever you like. No problems here.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 8, 2016)

ruwtz said:


> Are we talking about outlet timers? Because I have a bunch of the Titan digital timers all going strong. But they are clearly identical to literally every other China made outlet timer out there, just with a Titan badge. Harbor Freight, Amazon, eBay... all the same.
> 
> Take that to mean whatever you like. No problems here.


True enough, the point being if they quit the power controller isn't affected and a replacement is cheap.


----------



## WeedFreak78 (Dec 8, 2016)

ruwtz said:


> Are we talking about outlet timers? Because I have a bunch of the Titan digital timers all going strong. But they are clearly identical to literally every other China made outlet timer out there, just with a Titan badge. Harbor Freight, Amazon, eBay... all the same.
> 
> Take that to mean whatever you like. No problems here.


Ever take them apart and compare components? I haven't, but I'd be curious. After working somewhere that made their own control systems, I saw first hand the difference in component quality. We lost a contract because of circuit board failures, which were traced back to poor quality parts, which were bought due to a minimal cost savings over the components we usually used.

Kinda like flat screen TVs, as of 3 years ago there were only 4 actual flat panel display manufactures, but hundreds of component manufactures, that's why you can get a 50"tv for $500 or $2000. Screens probably the same, just cheap chips, capacitors, etc.

It used to be a company designed their whole product, it was unique to that manufacturer. Now, for something like a timer, they set their specs, then find components to build it: cases, knobs, circuits,etc,etc. There's probably one or 2 plastics companys pumping out all those timer cases.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 8, 2016)

ruwtz said:


> Are we talking about outlet timers? Because I have a bunch of the Titan digital timers all going strong. But they are clearly identical to literally every other China made outlet timer out there, just with a Titan badge. Harbor Freight, Amazon, eBay... all the same.
> 
> Take that to mean whatever you like. No problems here.


Exactly! An electronic timer is so simple, there's not much that messes up. If there is something messing up, I would imagine the fix would've been simple and already done.

Titan's have been around for years, and it's probably because they have good timers. I don't doubt people may experience problems. But I would bet that it has to do more with getting familiar with the timer and learning how it works. Like I said, I had some issues with my first Titan, but that's because I was trying to set it like my other two, non-Titan timers. Once I figured it out I never had an issue.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 8, 2016)

WeedFreak78 said:


> Ever take them apart and compare components? I haven't, but I'd be curious. After working somewhere that made their own control systems, I saw first hand the difference in component quality. We lost a contract because of circuit board failures, which were traced back to poor quality parts, which were bought due to a minimal cost savings over the components we usually used.
> 
> Kinda like flat screen TVs, as of 3 years ago there were only 4 actual flat panel display manufactures, but hundreds of component manufactures, that's why you can get a 50"tv for $500 or $2000. Screens probably the same, just cheap chips, capacitors, etc.
> 
> It used to be a company designed their whole product, it was unique to that manufacturer. Now, for something like a timer, they set their specs, then find components to build it: cases, knobs, circuits,etc,etc. There's probably one or 2 plastics companys pumping out all those timer cases.


Mass production is so much easier when multiple companies use the same components. But you're right, all those timers are made from the same circuitry. There is a standard clock chip, a couple relays, a timer chip, and a display chip that they all use. Even if you find a US company making them, the chips still come from China.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 8, 2016)

Got some more designed and new renderings.

The first set shows pretty much all the wiring routed. I've got a little bit more to do for the details. I also updated some of the labels for easier reading.

The second set shows the workbench and cabinets I'm going to put in. I had always planned on doing that but didn't think it would have an impact on where things are located. Right away I see that the pumps and chiller can easily fit under the workbench. So I'm going to slide the reservoir down and get them positioned underneath. I know there's going to be some standing heat under the bench. So what I'll do is get a couple 120mm case fans to exhaust the heat.

Doing this means I'm going to be running more 2" pipe. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the corners and length of the 2" pipe won't have an effect on the flow because the pump's input is either 5/8" or 3/4". I'll have very little in that size, and that's where any bottlenecks are going to occur. As long as there's an abundance of water where the smaller pipe meets the larger, there shouldn't be much, or any, resistance.

The bench frame and legs shown are 1" x 1" lumber (which is really 3/4" x 3/4"). I was trying to keep it light, but I know it'll be flimsy, especially the legs. So I'm going to do away with the legs and use cables to suspend it (think of a pick-up's tailgate). The bench top is split at about 60/40, but I might stiffen up the frame. I'll see how it looks once I have it rendered. 







*Added power lights and changed the driver's material to a metal with less reflection *






*Let me know if anyone has any questions on my wiring. BTW, can I run two drivers off a single dimmer?*












*Water pump*







*Workbench, soon to be changed. The little black squares on the wall under the cabinet, and on the bench top, are magnets to hold it upright*







*The chiller stand and pumps would fit very well under the workbench, which is 32" off the floor*







*A couple under-cabinet floro's*






*I'll be doing away with the fold-up legs*


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 8, 2016)

Just noticed I spelled "Exhaust" wrong on the fan speed controller


----------



## Uberknot (Dec 8, 2016)

You know if you made a game.....with growing in it....never know..


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 8, 2016)

You're making some big shoes for the talk thing to fill, lol


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 8, 2016)

Uberknot said:


> You know if you made a game.....with growing in it....never know..


If I don't get to build this, then that might be as close as I get 

That'd be pretty cool!


----------



## Uberknot (Dec 8, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> If I don't get to build this, then that might be as close as I get
> 
> That'd be pretty cool!



Every so many grows you can have the dreaded mite attack  over and under watering...

If set up right it would be a blast.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 8, 2016)

Uberknot said:


> Every so many grows you can have the dreaded mite attack  over and under watering...
> 
> If set up right it would be a blast.


How about when the mites attack it turns into a first person shooter, shooting bug spray at them


----------



## WeedFreak78 (Dec 8, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> The bench top is split at about 60/40, but I might stiffen up the frame. I'll see how it looks once I have it rendered.


So the bench will be 2 independent tops?


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 8, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> How about when the mites attack it turns into a first person shooter, shooting bug spray at them


Right, you could even take the place of a beneficial bug and go hunting!


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 8, 2016)

WeedFreak78 said:


> So the bench will be 2 independent tops?


Yes. Just to make it a little more sturdy. It's 82" long and I'm going to try and keep it fairly light. I think raising the entire top would cause a lot of flexing. But I might change that when I remove the legs and add the cables.


----------



## WeedFreak78 (Dec 8, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> Yes. Just to make it a little more sturdy. It's 82" long and I'm going to try and keep it fairly light. I think raising the entire top would cause a lot of flexing. But I might change that when I remove the legs and add the cables.


I'm was thinking more for access to the res, if its going under there, while also having a work surface.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 8, 2016)

WeedFreak78 said:


> I'm was thinking more for access to the res, if its going under there, while also having a work surface.


Yep, that's what it's for. I'm determined to make everything easily accessible


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 9, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> You're making some big shoes for the talk thing to fill, lol


IKR

Watch, I'll paint a beautiful picture and the actual will look like it was built with random junkyard parts LOL

Actually, I go through a lot of effort hiding wires. My 70" led and surround have no visible wires. I've cut open and patched so many of my walls, running power or AV cables for my setup. My home theater's the same. I like it "clean clean"  So this will probably turn out close to the renderings. It's going to take me a little longer because I am going to be painting the pipes and COB frame like in the pictures. This is going to take up a bedroom in my house, so I want to make it look professional and nice. But that's just me and my approach. When it was in my back closet, it was quite different. That looked like a permanent work in progress LOL


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 9, 2016)

JSB99 said:


> IKR
> 
> Watch, I'll paint a beautiful picture and the actual will look like it was built with random junkyard parts LOL
> 
> Actually, I go through a lot of effort hiding wires. My 70" led and surround have no visible wires. I've cut open and patched so many of my walls, running power or AV cables for my setups. My home theater's the same. I like it "clean"  So this will probably turn out close to the renderings. It's going to take me a little longer because I am going to be painting the pipes and COB frame like in the pictures. This is going to take up a bedroom in my house, so I want to make it look professional and nice. But that's just me and my approach. When it was in my back closet, it was quite different. That looked like a permanent work in progress LOL


I also had my home studio and I would spend hours, and even days, patching cords and hiding them.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 11, 2016)

I finished moving the chiller and pumps under the bench, as well as using cables to suspend the bench top. The bench is still split 60/40 (40 being above the chiller), though it's difficult to see the split in the images. I don't know if the tops are going to be rigid enough to where they don't flex much, or be able to hold some weight. I'm thinking 50 lbs each is what I'd be shooting for. One idea that just came to mind is to lag in 4 large brackets just below the bench top to support it more, but still leave room to easily get to everything under the bench.

BRACKET

You can see the whole collection HERE

























The blue valves/pipes going into the reservoir consist of a float valve feed and a fast feed. I'm rearranging the pipes so that both the feeds are towards the top. The feed will be coming directly from the bathroom's cold water line. I'm also going to have a hose attached with a sprayer for cleaning.

The air line and power cords are now tucked behind the top green pipe.








The vacuum hose to suck up water from a disaster or drain the remaining water in the buckets or reservoir.













Air line and cords















Some wiring


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 11, 2016)

I'm 6'3" and the bottom picture is how I see short people


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 19, 2016)

It's been a little while since I posted, but I got a lot figured out and I think I'm just about done.

What I've been working on is the 2x4x9 closet that will house the mothers and provide a space for clones.

The room in its entirety with the closet on the left (obviously) 







Got all the equipment laid out. The closet extends past the wall about 6 inches, which will be a real convenient place to pass the wires through.






The smaller wires are kind of difficult to see. I might render an extra large version of this and post it






I illuminated the timers, just for fun. Room with the lights off:






The space below is 24" high, which should be plenty of room. The bucket is to water the mothers on a timer. There will be a small water pump in there. It probably won't be exactly like this since it would prove difficult to add and remove the bucket with the pipes. 






I probably don't need air going into the reservoir (bucket), but it does circulate the water when adjusting pH levels or adding nutrients






I found what I'm hoping is a leak-proof tote to use for my cloner (link below). Above the cloner I'm going to have 2x700mA COB's on a dimmer. 
*TOTE*







The heatsink is 40" long and 5.886" wide. I don't know if I'll paint it or not. I'd have to tape the spots where the COB's would be mounted so there's good contact. I'm not even sure if the paint would effect the dissipation of heat.






Here's a shot of the 4" can-fan I'll be using for the closet. I haven't drawn it out yet, but the fan will exhaust the air through a register above the closet door. I'll probabaly also mount a small register in the door to provide air.






Top shot of the Bonsai Mums






It's hard to see the driplines because they're black. I've changed them to blue to stand out more and will probably repost a couple of these






I've got an overflow valve here just in case they mistakenly get over-watered.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 19, 2016)

This is better. I think I made the tubes to small. Oh well, the point is still made


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 19, 2016)

Here's an extra large image of the components and wiring


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 20, 2016)

Here's what it'll look like with the vents and the 4" exhaust fan for the closet.




















I'm going to have vents on both sides of the door to help with light control. It's not crucial that light escapes, but I think it would be an eyesore with a bunch of light shining through. The weird colors on the vent are the reflections from the intake fan label.












This is the backside of the closet.






I didn't do anything with the inside of the fan






There's going to be a board mounted on the wall with a hole for the fan's exhaust to blow through. I'll leave enough of a gap to where the fan isn't touching the wood. That'd cause noise.


----------



## PetFlora (Jul 6, 2017)

JSB99 said:


> I also had my home studio and I would spend hours, and even days, patching cords and hiding them.


You need to gt one of these Equi-Core 1800. Here's where I listen to well recorded music


----------



## PetFlora (Jul 6, 2017)

Yes, a simple F & D for the win. Since I have a mosquito problem I have to put lids on my totes

I use 3" net pots with a coco insert to start, then transfer o f&d with large netpot partially filled with stones for roots to anchor. easy to remove and clean when harvested, 100% recyclable, and no hydroton mess 

Inside the cooler/tote are 2 pumps, one for f & d, the other n a deep cycle timer for oxygenating the nutes

hth


----------



## OldMedUser (Jul 6, 2017)

So how's the build going? 

Very interesting read but very over-engineered IMHO. One tall RubberMaid tub with four plants in that size grow space would do a great job and yield just as much without all the plumbing etc that you envision for what really is a simple concept.

Don't get me wrong here. I'm not dissing your concept. It looks great and after reading all 11 pages it's obvious that you've put a lot of thought into it all and really flexed your CAD muscles to good ends.

I'm adding on an 8x4 grow space to my grow room and have pretty much decided to go with 4 individual tubs that sit on their own dollies with ScroG screens attached. As I'll be running different strains I don't want one central reservoir plus if the dreaded root rot were to rear it's ugly head then only 25% of the crop is threatened. It's not a lot of work as I've done 40 - 50 DWC tub grows since 2001 and can deal with it in my sleep almost. Ain't gonna be a pretty as what you've dreamed up but as I already have most of the materials and gear it won't cost much or take a lot of time putting it all together.

Your thread has inspired me to lay it all out on paper as I haven't played with a CAD program for almost 30 years when I went back to school for chemistry. We had a basic drafting course so chem-sci students could at least put down on paper something they needed built then hand off the drawings to someone else to build. Still have all my drafting tools and now an itch to put them to work so thanks for that. 

I was planning to get into running a continuous grow with autoflowering plants and sketched up a simple NFT table idea I had. Build it out of plywood and coat it all with fiberglass tho it could be an open frame holding 6 or 8" plastic pipe cut in half lengthwise for the channels to set the pots in. Square tubing would be ideal but would have to source that outside my area.

The light(s) just stay on 18 - 20 hours/day and I'd feed smaller plants in one end as I removed ripe plants from the other. One pump to feed nutes into the top and gravity feed back to the rez. Airstones in the rez with an external pump for the nutes. Simple PEX or even garden hose for the feed line to the table.



This is the simple ScroG setup I came up with years back and have done a few like it and it works great.

 

Here are two of them as I plan to use going forward tho these aren't ScroGed and have way too many Afghani Kush plants in each tub. My DIY chiller works pretty good for the $28 it cost me for two fountain pumps to circulate the nutes from each tub thru coils of 3/8" tubing up to the chiller tank filled with anti-freeze and back to the tubs. I already had the tubing and the cooler was gifted a few years earlier so why not?  I'm going to use air cooling to chill the tubs in the new room as it's always cool in the utility basement where the magic happens. 58 - 60F is the warmest it gets down there so no A/C needed.

 

Each tall tub holds 50L/12.5USG and only need topping up every 3 or days and with pH Perfect nutes I just have to top up with RO water, check ppm and shoot some fresh nutes in to bring the ppm back up to target level. One nute change after the stretch for each is all I do so that's easy as well. I have a $3000 Polar Bear distiller that came with the house that I'm going to sell to buy an RO unit as it's a PITA and dangerous to haul the 5gal jugs down the narrow flight of stairs into the basement. Not to mention I'm 62 and pretty severe arthritis and possibly fibro as well tho the witch doctors from South Africa we have here have no clue how to do anything but hand out pills I don't need or want.

Sure wish I had cheap power like you. Here in Alberta, (the energy province), I'm paying almost $90/mth to run my 1000W light 12hrs/day at 23.5¢/KWH. Plan to go with 2 x 600W HPS on my light rail to do the 8x4 grow space. I have a tent that size but a room will be better in the basement as it gets close to freezing down there when it's -30C outside. The room itself will be 8x6 so I have 2' of space along the grow space to work on the plants without cold air blasting the plants. I may use the tent upstairs in the spare bedroom for a veg space but may just use the bare frame to get more height for hanging lights etc.

Maybe start with a simple grow room and with all the money you save not buying pot elsewhere you can pick up the gear to build your dream room in a year or so after you start cropping some real plants. I'm a little OCD myself but I think you might be further along that road than me. 

Two years of planning is enough. Time to grow some green!


----------



## JSB99 (Jul 6, 2017)

PetFlora said:


> You need to gt one of these Equi-Core 1800. Here's where I listen to well recorded music
> 
> View attachment 3973306


SWEET!


----------



## ttystikk (Jul 6, 2017)

OldMedUser said:


> So how's the build going?
> 
> Very interesting read but very over-engineered IMHO. One tall RubberMaid tub with four plants in that size grow space would do a great job and yield just as much without all the plumbing etc that you envision for what really is a simple concept.
> 
> ...


Cool stuff. Don't buy more HID lights, get COB LED lights or Quantum Boards instead. Both are available through vendors here on RIU. A bit more expensive up front but no bulb changes, better spectrum, less heat, less watts and they last nearly forever.

With hydro costs like yours, such a fixture would pay for itself in under a year.


----------



## JSB99 (Jul 6, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Cool stuff. Don't buy more HID lights, get COB LED lights or Quantum Boards instead. Both are available through vendors here on RIU. A bit more expensive up front but no bulb changes, better spectrum, less heat, less watts and they last nearly forever.
> 
> With hydro costs like yours, such a fixture would pay for itself in under a year.


Yeah, I really wanted to go LED, but right now the up-front cost is going to be out of my budget. When I designed this, I was expecting some funds that would cover this, but it looks like that money's not going to be available for a few years. But, I do plan on migrating to LED over time.


----------



## PetFlora (Jul 6, 2017)

JSB99 said:


> Yeah, I really wanted to go LED, but right now the up-front cost is going to be out of my budget. When I designed this, I was expecting some funds that would cover this, but it looks like that money's not going to be available for a few years. But, I do plan on migrating to LED over time.


I think you could market your graphic room design skills to variety of grow companies


----------



## JSB99 (Jul 6, 2017)

PetFlora said:


> I think you could market your graphic room design skills to variety of grow companies


Just a hobbyist


----------



## ttystikk (Jul 6, 2017)

JSB99 said:


> Just a hobbyist


Lots of people turn their hobbies into income.


----------



## OldMedUser (Jul 6, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Cool stuff. Don't buy more HID lights, get COB LED lights or Quantum Boards instead. Both are available through vendors here on RIU. A bit more expensive up front but no bulb changes, better spectrum, less heat, less watts and they last nearly forever.
> 
> With hydro costs like yours, such a fixture would pay for itself in under a year.


Thing is I need the heat or I'll be running a heater when the lights are on as well as when they aren't. I'm planning to incorporate two heat controllers to send one room's warm air into the dark room to keep heater use to a minimum. Both rooms will be used for flowering most of the time so they can take opposite shifts and keep each other warm. I'd end up using as much electricity and get less light on the gardens not to mention the extra cost up front to invest in LEDs. I may be selling the farm and getting back to BC permanently so it could be my last winter to grow for a while unless I hook up with a 420 friendly lady out there that has a place to grow already. I'm working on that.


----------



## ttystikk (Jul 6, 2017)

OldMedUser said:


> Thing is I need the heat or I'll be running a heater when the lights are on as well as when they aren't. I'm planning to incorporate two heat controllers to send one room's warm air into the dark room to keep heater use to a minimum. Both rooms will be used for flowering most of the time so they can take opposite shifts and keep each other warm. I'd end up using as much electricity and get less light on the gardens not to mention the extra cost up front to invest in LEDs. I may be selling the farm and getting back to BC permanently so it could be my last winter to grow for a while unless I hook up with a 420 friendly lady out there that has a place to grow already. I'm working on that.


That's not a heat issue, it's an insulation issue. LED still makes heat, just not as much. You get better quality as well, which goes a long way.


----------



## OldMedUser (Jul 7, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> That's not a heat issue, it's an insulation issue. LED still makes heat, just not as much. You get better quality as well, which goes a long way.


I still need the heat tho. Without CO2 I need some air exchange and have a temp/RH controller so the fan isn't running all the time and it can take a while until the heat and/or RH is enough to start the fan. The air coming in can be pretty cold. 35 -40F, and very dry like 10% RH so it doesn't take long for the fan to turn off again. I'm hoping to be able to get a CO2 controller and solenoid to hook up my welding tank and flow gauge to help with that. Go with a semi-sealed type of grow room. My basement is a concrete bunker underground and has 2" styrofoam insulation with 1/2" OSB on it already. I like that it's cool or I'd be needing A/C next and then the power bill takes another jump.

As to better quality than a Hortilux Super HPS can produce I gotta say I doubt it. I'd go with dual 630 CMH if I had deeper pockets but there ain't much more in my pockets than lint. 

"Pot gets me thru times of no money better than money gets me thru times of no pot!" (Freewheeling Franklin of the Fabulous Furry Freak Bros. fame.) Slightly mis-quoted.


----------



## ttystikk (Jul 7, 2017)

OldMedUser said:


> I still need the heat tho. Without CO2 I need some air exchange and have a temp/RH controller so the fan isn't running all the time and it can take a while until the heat and/or RH is enough to start the fan. The air coming in can be pretty cold. 35 -40F, and very dry like 10% RH so it doesn't take long for the fan to turn off again. I'm hoping to be able to get a CO2 controller and solenoid to hook up my welding tank and flow gauge to help with that. Go with a semi-sealed type of grow room. My basement is a concrete bunker underground and has 2" styrofoam insulation with 1/2" OSB on it already. I like that it's cool or I'd be needing A/C next and then the power bill takes another jump.
> 
> As to better quality than a Hortilux Super HPS can produce I gotta say I doubt it. I'd go with dual 630 CMH if I had deeper pockets but there ain't much more in my pockets than lint.
> 
> "Pot gets me thru times of no money better than money gets me thru times of no pot!" (Freewheeling Franklin of the Fabulous Furry Freak Bros. fame.) Slightly mis-quoted.


Having grown under HPS, CMH and LED, I can tell you that LED makes the best quality.

Big concrete basement and small grow means you can absorb the heat. 

If you draw your intake air from the house and exhaust it outside then you'll need less heat and the CO2 from the inhabitants will benefit your plants.


----------



## Jellypowered (Jul 7, 2017)

JSB99 said:


> Just a hobbyist


Go take a look at fiverr. You can sell graphic design gigs at your own price. You've obviously got a passion for it. From start to finish your skills have done nothing but improve. Why sell yourself short as "just a hobbyist" when this could bringing you in serious coin. 

Just my .02 cents.


----------



## JSB99 (Jul 7, 2017)

Jellypowered said:


> Go take a look at fiverr. You can sell graphic design gigs at your own price. You've obviously got a passion for it. From start to finish your skills have done nothing but improve. Why sell yourself short as "just a hobbyist" when this could bringing you in serious coin.
> 
> Just my .02 cents.


Cool! I'll check them out.


----------



## OldMedUser (Jul 7, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Having grown under HPS, CMH and LED, I can tell you that LED makes the best quality.
> 
> Big concrete basement and small grow means you can absorb the heat.
> 
> If you draw your intake air from the house and exhaust it outside then you'll need less heat and the CO2 from the inhabitants will benefit your plants.


All the air that gets drawn into the basement comes from the rest of the house. There are no inlets to the great outdoors leading in. I blocked the 2 - 4" pipes that were in there from the previous owner when I installed the 6" vent.

Still ain't buying LED when I got lots of HIDs to use now. Maybe if my lotto tickets pay off tonight I might get some good cobs and try them out in a proper side-by-side.


----------



## SSGrower (Dec 21, 2017)

JSB99 said:


> Hey everyone!
> 
> Got some stuff figured out in my room and I finished laying out the air lines to the reservoir and buckets. I also raised the air pump higher than the waterline, as recommended.
> 
> ...


I would truly appreciate an update on how this system is working. I hope it is working and hasn't sucomb to any misfortune or catastrophe.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 21, 2017)

SSGrower said:


> I would truly appreciate an update on how this system is working. I hope it is working and hasn't sucomb to any misfortune or catastrophe.


Actually, I built a variation of this, and it work awesome! Same room, RDWC/UC, 4x4 tent, but the COB LED array is on hold until I can afford it, and some of the gear is a little lower-end than what I initially wanted. To hold me over, I got a 600w hid. The thread for that grow is the "2017 Grow" link in my signature. There are a lot of pages, but I posted a lot of pics as I was building it.


----------



## SSGrower (Dec 21, 2017)

JSB99 said:


> These pictures are actually computer generated images I created using a 3D CAD program called "Sketchup". I use another tool called "VRay" to render my images and give it that realness. You're not the first who's been fooled
> 
> But I really hope no one gives you crap about that. The whole point of approaching my plan in this way, is to create something that looked real and accurate. This is so that I can make adjustments and fix issues ahead of time instead of trying to do it in the middle of a grow, when you first realize there's a problem.
> 
> The strains I plan on growing are LSD, GrandDaddyPurps, Blue Dream, and Lemon Kush. Not at the same time though. I'm going to have a small mother of each living in the 2 x 4 closet. I'll be growing those via the "Bosai-mums" method. Check it out BOSAI MUMS


Well color me fuckin stupid. Eyesight must be getting worse. I knew there was some tweaking to the pics but didnt realize how much, your actual build still looks nice though not as sanitary clean!

Did you end up with titan or any other automation controls like diy with arduino?


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 22, 2017)

SSGrower said:


> Well color me fuckin stupid. Eyesight must be getting worse. I knew there was some tweaking to the pics but didnt realize how much, your actual build still looks nice though not as sanitary clean!
> 
> Did you end up with titan or any other automation controls like diy with arduino?


LOL, when coloring someone stupid, is it important to stay in the lines? 

I'm not using any environment controllers. Not yet anyways. When I build the cob array, I may use a light controller that fades the light in and out for sunrise and sunset. I'll do lots of research ahead of time to see if this is actually beneficial, before I throw any money at it. I might also get a thermostat controlled fan speed controller, or switch, to help keep temps steady throughout the day. I was finding myself tweaking the fan speed throughout the day. Whether that was actually necessary is questionable, but I wouldn't mind automating that.


----------



## SSGrower (Dec 22, 2017)

JSB99 said:


> LOL, when coloring someone stupid, is it important to stay in the lines?
> 
> I'm not using any environment controllers. Not yet anyways. When I build the cob array, I may use a light controller that fades the light in and out for sunrise and sunset. I'll do lots of research ahead of time to see if this is actually beneficial, before I throw any money at it. I might also get a thermostat controlled fan speed controller, or switch, to help keep temps steady throughout the day. I was finding myself tweaking the fan speed throughout the day. Whether that was actually necessary is questionable, but I wouldn't mind automating that.


Necessary? 


Is it necessary for me to drink my own urine? No but I do it anyway cause it's sterile and I like the taste.

Look into meanwell d series drivers they seem to have many features you may find interisting. I'm particularly interisted in the remote control interface. Seems much simpler than my idea of a stepper motor mounted to the driver Io pot!


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 22, 2017)

SSGrower said:


> Necessary?
> 
> 
> Is it necessary for me to drink my own urine? No but I do it anyway cause it's sterile and I like the taste.


LOL! Good practice for when the world runs out if drinking water!

I had my eye on the MW drivers ending with the "B" code at the end, indicating that it's a dimmable driver. Is the "D" model different than that?


----------



## OldMedUser (Dec 22, 2017)

JSB99 said:


> LOL, when coloring someone stupid, is it important to stay in the lines?
> 
> I'm not using any environment controllers. Not yet anyways. When I build the cob array, I may use a light controller that fades the light in and out for sunrise and sunset. I'll do lots of research ahead of time to see if this is actually beneficial, before I throw any money at it. I might also get a thermostat controlled fan speed controller, or switch, to help keep temps steady throughout the day. I was finding myself tweaking the fan speed throughout the day. Whether that was actually necessary is questionable, but I wouldn't mind automating that.


You can decent rh/temp controllers for not a lot of coin and they are well worth it. Or make your own with a bathroom humidity fan controller wired with a heat/cool thermostat like the one I use and bought the parts to build another one. Going to mount them on an old metal Makita box a drill came in.


----------



## OldMedUser (Dec 22, 2017)

Forgot to mention the speed controller on the left side. Used a ceiling fan controller, (NOT a light dimmer), wired into a wall box and plug that into the rh/temp controller to run the fan at half speed.


----------



## SSGrower (Dec 22, 2017)

JSB99 said:


> LOL! Good practice for when the world runs out if drinking water!
> 
> I had my eye on the MW drivers ending with the "B" code at the end, indicating that it's a dimmable driver. Is the "D" model different than that?


There are others like cob kits that will be much better for info on drivers some have on board (a?) dimming others (the b I think) are dimable remotely by either a potentiaometer, voltage signal or pwm signal. 

It is my understanding that the D versions have either built in timers or can be configured for remote control via their proprietary software and controllers. One example given for why or how they would be used included a gradual brightening for street light applications as the sun sets and a gradual dimming as the sun rises. The way I interpreted it is that the driver (or controller or ?) was capable of receiving inputs from things like light intensity sensors, motion detectors or other switches and adjusting the driver output to the desired level.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 22, 2017)

OldMedUser said:


> You can decent rh/temp controllers for not a lot of coin and they are well worth it. Or make your own with a bathroom humidity fan controller wired with a heat/cool thermostat like the one I use and bought the parts to build another one. Going to mount them on an old metal Makita box a drill came in.
> 
> View attachment 4061833
> 
> View attachment 4061834


Oh cool! I'll do something like this.


----------



## Paracelsus (Dec 22, 2017)

The Dude can't abide



JSB99 said:


> What's up, RIU?
> 
> I wanted to share my new grow room designs, parts, costs, and ideas with everyone, with the goal of teaching some noobs a few things, and getting advice from the Ganja Growing Gods.
> 
> ...


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 23, 2017)

Paracelsus said:


> The Dude can't abide


Huh? Not sure what you mean by this.


----------



## OldMedUser (Dec 23, 2017)

JSB99 said:


> Huh? Not sure what you mean by this.


Got me scratching my head too. Or are the bugs back.


----------



## Iriemartin74 (Dec 23, 2017)

Be careful. That cola company could try to sue over copywrite issues.. J/k but they could. Crossout or remove lables. Car license plates ect. 

All in all.. Badass. My perfect grow would be underground fallout style.


----------



## Iriemartin74 (Dec 23, 2017)

JSB99 said:


> I'm reading up on growing in 100% hydroton as an alternative to the DWC. I'll see if it sways me. I know I can't do soil because of the constant heavy lifting (bad back and knees).
> 
> bbl


A system of balances and levers to save your back. A dumbwaiter of sorts to raise and lower soil. So u can work from the floor all the way to around a foot below your arm pits. Id buy that and my backs ok. Knock on wood. Not to mention the ease of draining your runoff without a pump. If u can get this right..??? And be first to do so... $$$$$$


----------



## Paracelsus (Dec 23, 2017)

The Dude can't abide


----------



## OldMedUser (Dec 23, 2017)

Paracelsus said:


> The Dude can't abide


So are you another one of these jerks who makes useless little posts to get his post count up without actually contributing anything?

If so I hope Santa brings you a lump of coal for Xmas.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 23, 2017)

OldMedUser said:


> So are you another one of these jerks who makes useless little posts to get his post count up without actually contributing anything?
> 
> If so I hope Santa brings you a lump of coal for Xmas.


No doubt!

Contribute, or just read quietly, please.


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 23, 2017)

Iriemartin74 said:


> A system of balances and levers to save your back. A dumbwaiter of sorts to raise and lower soil. So u can work from the floor all the way to around a foot below your arm pits. Id buy that and my backs ok. Knock on wood. Not to mention the ease of draining your runoff without a pump. If u can get this right..??? And be first to do so... $$$$$$


There are much easier solutions, including the one I recently completed (see the "2017 Grow Room" link below). I did end up building an rdwc/UC, and I couldn't be happier!


----------



## JSB99 (Dec 23, 2017)

Iriemartin74 said:


> Be careful. That cola company could try to sue over copywrite issues.. J/k but they could. Crossout or remove lables. Car license plates ect.
> 
> All in all.. Badass. My perfect grow would be underground fallout style.


Dude, you've smoked yourself paranoid LOL! I doubt they are at all concerned about my little picture.


----------



## OldMedUser (Dec 23, 2017)

JSB99 said:


> Dude, you've smoked yourself paranoid LOL! I doubt they are at all concerned about my little picture.


They would likely just consider it free advertising and keeping with their motto that Coke goes good with everything! 

I stopped drinking all pop years ago when I became aware of the adverse health effects of high fructose corn syrup and artificial caramel colour/flavour. 

When I got back from the hospital recently I heated up a can of Campbell's tomato soup, an old favourite, and it tasted like someone dumped a bunch of sugar in it. Read the ingredients list and instead of sugar it said Glucose-Fructose which is Canadian for HIGH FRUCTOSE CORN SYRUP !!! WTF! Already had hidden MSG, (spice extracts), but I had let that slide but HFCS means war!

Campbell's is now on my boycott list and I went to their website, WhatIsInMyFood.ca, and logged into my never used FB account so I could bitch them out. Politely of course so my comment wouldn't get deleted. Was a checkbox there to have it posted on my FB page so checked that off so my "friends" would see it too.

This is the kind of garbage we end up eating too much of and become one of those "People of WalMart" that everyone likes to make fun of. And our gov'ts worry about pot but let these guys poison us for profit. I still wear the same 32x32 jeans I've worn since I was 18 and they are loose on me because I won't eat junk food and know how to read the labels.

Rant over before I really get into it.


----------

