# New oxygen technology in RDWC DWC pot grows



## J Henry (Apr 10, 2016)

*Garden & Greenhouse Product Review - The O2 Grow Unit* http://gardenandgreenhouse.net/index.php/products-mainmenu-22/108-product-profiles/2078-garden-greenhouse-product-review-the-o2-grow-unit Anybody here using this new oxygen technology in RDWC DWC pot grows today? If so, how’s this working for you.

Type A grower prevents fungal outbreaks. Type B grower’s waits patiently for the root rot and just accepts it, then treat the disease outbreak when symptoms present?

Many/most RDWC DWC pot growers practice crisis intervention (treatment with chemicals) routinely when it comes to fungi and root rot diseases. It’s common and customary to wait till symptoms appear, brown slime fungus on the roots, you know the symptoms and the routine… the race is on to save the crop. Waiting and watching for the rot symptoms causes some growers a little angst, other growers know it’s coming and have the chemicals and teas on standby ready to roll, these are the growers that prefer to treat the disease vs. prevent the disease Growers always have a choice, the treatment or prevention.

“They” say that Pythium and other fungal pathogens are opportunist, they are ubiquitous and wait patiently for the right opportunity in nutrient solutions and root zones. “They” also say that the right opportunity is a “low oxygen” event.

“They” also say that preventing a “low oxygen” prevents any opportunity for a fungal disease outbreak.


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## redi jedi (Apr 10, 2016)

Nice sales pitch..lol

300 bucks for the 20 gal capacity electric fly swatters...LMAO

Do you believe J Henry is a shill...yes!


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## Psyphish (Apr 11, 2016)

I stopped growing in hydro because I got root rot every time, I couldn't keep the reservoir temperatures low enough in my tent. I even added H2O2 every time, but it wasn't enough, chlorine might've worked though.


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## ~CReePeR~ (Apr 11, 2016)

Psyphish said:


> I stopped growing in hydro because I got root rot every time, I couldn't keep the reservoir temperatures low enough in my tent. I even added H2O2 every time, but it wasn't enough, chlorine might've worked though.


You could keep the res outside the tent hooked up with a chiller


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## J Henry (Apr 11, 2016)

*Etiology and epidemiology of Pythium root rot in hydroponic crops: current knowledge and perspectives*

*John Clifford SuttonI, *****; Coralie Rachelle SopherI; Tony Nathaniel Owen-GoingI; Weizhong LiuI; Bernard GrodzinskiI; John Christopher HallI; Ruth Linda BenchimolII*

IDepartment of Environmental Biology, University of Guelph, Guelph, ON, Canada, N1G 2W1 
IIEmbrapa Amazônia Oriental, Caixa Postal 48, 66017-970, Belém, PA, Brasil http://www.scielo.br/scielo.php?pid=s0100-54052006000400001&script=sci_arttext

Concentration of dissolved oxygen in the nutrient solution is a critical factor influencing root rot and crop productivity (14, 38, 88, 120). In general, root rot increases when oxygen levels are low (14).

Gases move to and from roots of plants in many types of hydroponic systems chiefly by mass flow of gas dissolved in moving solution, which contrasts with diffusion through gas-filled pores as occurs in soils. [Air] Oxygen concentration in the root zone of hydroponic crops is commonly 6 to 8% (123) and growers have been encouraged to maintain a minimum of 5 mg oxygen L-1 nutrient solution (36). Concentration of dissolved oxygen can quickly decline, however, especially when temperature of the nutrient solution is high. In the absence of biological factors, the level of dissolved oxygen in water declines, for example, from about 9 to 7 mgL-1 as temperature increases from 20 to 35ºC at 101.3 kPa and 100% relative humidity. Of greater importance, however, is greatly increased demand for oxygen by roots and root-zone microbes as temperature increases, factors that become particularly important when crops have produced dense masses of roots and when microbial populations are high.

It has been further estimated that a crop that is environmentally stressed requires about ten times more oxygen than one not under stress (39, 94). While allowing the nutrient solution to free fall back into the nutrient recharge tank helps to maintain adequate oxygen levels, injection of oxygen directly into the solution may be needed, especially in continuously recirculating systems.

Oxygenation is one of the few practical measures available to growers when root rot is well advanced, and helps to avoid further necrosis, disintegration, and sliminess of the roots (39).

**** The observations of Chérif et al. (14) suggest that elevated levels (e.g. 11-14%) of oxygen would be advantageous in protecting roots and promoting crop productivity.*

**** Air/aeration is 20% oxygen - Oxygen concentration in the root zone of hydroponic crops is commonly only 6 to 8% or about 5 ppm DO concentration with mechanical aeration --- 11-14% of oxygen would be advantageous in protecting roots and promoting crop productivity. This would require supplemental oxygen in order to continuously sustain an oxygen rich environment (24% oxygen) or greater using supplemental oxygen. Air will not meet this oxygen requirement regardless of the volume of air pumped and bubbled into the water or flumed into the air*_._

Hydroponic systems are often extraordinarily conducive to root rot epidemics in part because the root zones lack communities of microbes that can effectively antagonize pathogenic species of _Pythium_ associated with the roots, rooting media, and nutrient solution.

Technologies to facilitate tracking of _Pythium_ spp. and root disease are an obvious step in optimizing effectiveness of root-zone treatments such as use of microbial agents and oxygenation of the nutrient solution, as well as other measures to control root rot.

Data banks of dissolved oxygen levels and temperature of the nutrient solution in relation to important variables such as _Pythium_, microbial agents, other microflora, root rot, and crop growth and productivity are needed to develop protocols for their rational use and to adequately understand the value of such use.

**** Root rot fungi do not discriminate between plant species or root zones, any “low oxygen” presents an excellent opportunity in any DWC RDWC whether it a pot grow or a tomato grow. So these researchers claim, this is their story and they are sticking with it.*


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## rkymtnman (Apr 11, 2016)

fellow readers, J Henry is a plagiarist and has been caught stealing other's posts and claiming them to be his own. 

fair warning. 

and on a personal level, he's a real asshole too.


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## rkymtnman (Apr 11, 2016)

and i'm a potty, potty mouth. 

that about cover it J? 

oh yeah, and he works for a company O2Grow that sells the equipment he is now trying to sell on here.


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## MeJuana (Apr 11, 2016)

<snippet taken from the link in the OP>
"The O2 Grow emitters will help achieve the maximum amount of dissolved oxygen that the water can hold in a shorter amount of time that air stone."

Anyone see the sneaky wording?


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## rkymtnman (Apr 11, 2016)

MeJuana said:


> <snippet taken from the link in the OP>
> "The O2 Grow emitters will help achieve the maximum amount of dissolved oxygen that the water can hold in a shorter amount of time that air stone."
> 
> Anyone see the sneaky wording?


yep! he's trying to sell a $1000 oxygen concentrator that you can find used on craigslist for $200. and he has yet to offer any proof that it even works. 

if you look at the high times review of his product, towards the end it says "increased levels of DO may or may not be helpful" to plants. wow!! that's a really glowing review huh??? 

j henry is a charlatan, a thief and a loser. all rolled into one big steaming pile in my opinion.


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## J Henry (Apr 11, 2016)

MeJuana said:


> "The O2 Grow emitters will help achieve the maximum amount of dissolved oxygen that the water can hold in a shorter amount of time that air stone."
> 
> Anyone see the sneaky wording?


You might want to rethink “sneaky wording.” There’s no “sneaky wording” at all, electrolysis of water is the decomposition of water (H2O) into oxygen (O2) and hydrogen gas (H2) due to an electric current being passed through the water. This technology has been around over 200 years. 100% pure oxygen is the maximum amount of oxygen possible, air has only 20% oxygen if you pump a little or a lot, doesn’t matter. No “sneaky wording” here. You just read it wrong or missed the point, that’s all.

Check it out, see how and why this works: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolysis_of_water

Maybe this wording is easier to understand… There’s a huge difference between air and pure oxygen. Air is 20% oxygen. Emitters make pure 100% oxygen. Nothing sneaky here, just science and old technology to fix “low oxygen” problems caused by air and aerators and failure to oxygenate safely. There’s nothing sneaky between 100% O2 - 20% O2 = 80% O2. Tomorrow, next year and a decade in the future that answer will still be the same.


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## blackforest (Apr 11, 2016)

Maybe if we are stuck on Mars like Matt Damon in The Martian we will hit you up for your space age technology. Back here on planet Earth there are more efficient ways to add O2 to water and max out DO.


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## J Henry (Apr 11, 2016)

blackforest said:


> Maybe if we are stuck on Mars like Matt Damon in The Martian we will hit you up for your space age technology. Back here on planet Earth there are more efficient ways to add O2 to water and max out DO.


Here's something stimulating and interesting about understanding dissolved oxygen. How about 300% DO Supersaturation here and now in RDWC DWC pot grows?

*Understanding Dissolved Oxygen* by _Kurt Becker_

GrowerTalks Magazine Monday April 11, 2016 Published 1/29/2016 http://www.ballpublishing.com/GrowerTalks/ViewArticle.aspx?articleid=22058

This is a little step up in the world of oxygenation, what you think about this higher tech stuff?


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## redi jedi (Apr 11, 2016)

J Henry said:


> Here's something stimulating and interesting about understanding dissolved oxygen. How about 300% DO Supersaturation here and now in RDWC DWC pot grows?
> 
> *Understanding Dissolved Oxygen* by _Kurt Becker_
> 
> ...


Copied from the link you posted...guess you didnt read it?..lol

Improving levels of dissolved oxygen can be done through various methods. Simple aeration or agitation can increase dissolved oxygen enough to prevent problems. Injecting air or, especially, pure oxygen can increase levels as well, but only as high as saturation levels. Paying attention to temperature can also help improve DO, as colder water can hold more oxygen. Additionally, water at atmospheric pressure will hold less oxygen than when under pressure. Think of a bottle of carbonated water: while under pressure, the water holds more carbon dioxide than it can when the cap is removed and the pressure is released. Once the bottle is opened, the CO2 begins to gas-off from the water, effervescing. The same is true with oxygen. Adding oxygen to a pressurized system can increase the level of DO.

So much for super-saturation...


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## WeedFreak78 (Apr 12, 2016)

Answer the question: How do you maintain an O2 supersaturated H20 solution at atmospheric pressure and average room temperatures?


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## WeedFreak78 (Apr 12, 2016)

redi jedi said:


> Copied from the link you posted...guess you didnt read it?..lol
> 
> Improving levels of dissolved oxygen can be done through various methods. Simple aeration or agitation can increase dissolved oxygen enough to prevent problems. Injecting air or, especially, pure oxygen can increase levels as well, but only as high as saturation levels. Paying attention to temperature can also help improve DO, as colder water can hold more oxygen. Additionally, water at atmospheric pressure will hold less oxygen than when under pressure. Think of a bottle of carbonated water: while under pressure, the water holds more carbon dioxide than it can when the cap is removed and the pressure is released. Once the bottle is opened, the CO2 begins to gas-off from the water, effervescing. The same is true with oxygen. Adding oxygen to a pressurized system can increase the level of DO.
> 
> So much for super-saturation...


But Henry's Law and FiO2!


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## J Henry (Apr 12, 2016)

WeedFreak78 said:


> How do you maintain an O2 supersaturated H20 solution at atmospheric pressure and average room temperatures?


Hat Freak - I apply a little gas chemistry with Henrys Law and it happens, nothing to it, Google Henrys Law, read it, then you will know how to do it too if you want to.


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## redi jedi (Apr 12, 2016)

J Henry said:


> Hat Freak - I apply a little gas chemistry with Henrys Law and it happens, nothing to it, Google Henrys Law, read it, then you will know how to do it too if you want to.


I think you need to read Henrys law yourself...considering you didnt even read the info you posted.

Or maybe you don't know that RDWC is not a pressurized system?


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## dstroy (Apr 12, 2016)

But you've got the cathode and anode at the bottom with no membrane barrier so it's not *JUST* 100% oxygen and hydrogen, it's also ozone and whatever other gaseous byproducts of electrolysis are created when you run electricity through nutrient salts. Ozone is good, since it's more soluble in water than pure o2.



J Henry said:


> Hat Freak - I apply a little gas chemistry with Henrys Law and it happens, nothing to it, Google Henrys Law, read it, then you will know how to do it too if you want to.


Henry's law states that you cannot increase saturation level above 100% at atmospheric pressure (not even taking temperature into consideration). If you're measuring dissolved o2 in the water right above your overpriced equipment then you're doing it wrong.

I can get the electrodes you are selling from china, and they're much larger and way cheaper for what you get. How you think you can get away peddling a switch-mode dc power supply and the cathode anode assembly in molded plastic for as much as you are is beyond me. 

I guess it might be convenient for some people?


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## jeffhan (Apr 12, 2016)

Pure bullshit. 
Just make sure not even a single light beam goes through the pot in your bubbler, specially through the net pot.
Wrap your bubbler and lid with a foil/bubble insulation, even if it's black.
Spray a bit of Trichoderma over your roots twice a week, if you can add some Mycorrhizae and Azospirillum it'd be a great add-on for your plants.
NEVER EVER USE H2O2 IN YOUR WATER CONTAINER.

Never had a chiller, frequently hit 80ºF, never had any fungus...

And that's it; try it out before coming back with some BS internet stories.


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## Rrog (Apr 12, 2016)

Soil


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## J Henry (Apr 12, 2016)

dstroy said:


> But you've got the cathode and anode at the bottom with no membrane barrier so it's not *JUST* 100% oxygen and hydrogen, it's also ozone and whatever other gaseous byproducts of electrolysis are created when you run electricity through nutrient salts. Ozone is good, since it's more soluble in water than pure o2.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Just to be clear and avoid any misunderstanding, Henry says, "At a constant temperature, the amount of a given gas that dissolves in a given type and volume of liquid is directly proportional to the partial pressure of that gas in equilibrium with that liquid." You might study up a bit on this. And you're absolutely correct, the average American does pay very well just for convenience.


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## J Henry (Apr 12, 2016)

jeffhan said:


> Pure bullshit.
> Just make sure not even a single light beam goes through the pot in your bubbler, specially through the net pot.
> Wrap your bubbler and lid with a foil/bubble insulation, even if it's black.
> Spray a bit of Trichoderma over your roots twice a week, if you can add some Mycorrhizae and Azospirillum it'd be a great add-on for your plants.
> ...


OK


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## J Henry (Apr 12, 2016)

Rrog said:


> Soil


Thank you for not responding.


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## dstroy (Apr 12, 2016)

J Henry said:


> Just to be clear and avoid any misunderstanding, Henry says, "At a constant temperature, the amount of a given gas that dissolves in a given type and volume of liquid is directly proportional to the partial pressure of that gas in equilibrium with that liquid." You might study up a bit on this. And you're absolutely correct, the average American does pay very well just for convenience.


No, I'm pretty sure he does mention something about temperature and solubility. So you might want to study up a bit on this.


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## WeedFreak78 (Apr 12, 2016)

J Henry said:


> Just to be clear and avoid any misunderstanding, Henry says, "At a constant temperature, the amount of a given gas that dissolves in a given type and volume of liquid is directly proportional to the *partial pressure of that gas in equilibrium with that liquid*." You might study up a bit on this. And you're absolutely correct, the average American does pay very well just for convenience.


Do you even understand what the part in bold means? 
Let's use a bottle of Coke. When it's new and sealed, the gas pressure above the liquid and in the liquid are in equilibrium. Once you open the bottle, and expose it to _*atmospheritc pressure, *_ the gas pressure above the liquid drops, creating an area of *partial pressure of the gas in equilibrium with the Coke, *meaning the pressure outside the liquid is less than the pressure of the gases dissolved in the liquid, allowing the supersaturated CO2 to escape the liquid.

Now answer my damn question, charlatan.


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## J Henry (Apr 12, 2016)

dstroy said:


> No, I'm pretty sure he does mention something about temperature and solubility. So you might want to study up a bit on this.


Yes, there, something about temperature and partial pressure of the gas here.


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## J Henry (Apr 12, 2016)

WeedFreak78 said:


> Now answer my damn question, charlatan.


OK, 1 more time, now really try to pay attention this time.

In a mixture of gases, each gas has a partial pressure which is the hypothetical pressure of that gas if it alone occupied the volume of the mixture at the same temperature. The total pressure of an ideal gas mixture is the sum of the partial pressures of each individual gas in the mixture.

Can you guess or determine what the partial pressure of 20% oxygen is when the source is gas mixture is air? How about 159 mm/hg or so at sea level. Now it should be easy for you to see the oxygenation problems with air.


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## PerfectGrower (Apr 12, 2016)

Oxygen levels are important in preventing root rot but temperature is just as important.


A water chiller is safer than "adding more oxygen"


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## KryptoBud (Apr 13, 2016)

redi jedi said:


> Nice sales pitch..lol
> 
> 300 bucks for the 20 gal capacity electric fly swatter
> Do you believe J Henry is a shill...yes!


I think he's waste of oxygen personally.


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## Rrog (Apr 13, 2016)

It's crazy ridiculous


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## Tripp2005 (Apr 13, 2016)

Hydroguard works way better 30 bucks a liter


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## J Henry (Apr 13, 2016)

Rrog said:


> It's crazy ridiculous


Great


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## PerfectGrower (Apr 14, 2016)

We've been around hydroponic grows for the last decade. Over that decade, we have across root rot. Every single time it was directly correlated to a temperature issue over multiple days (water chiller failing).


The day I see someone get root rot at 68F with enough oxygen enrichment will be the day I change my opinion on that. That day has not come yet


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## redi jedi (Apr 14, 2016)

PerfectGrower said:


> We've been around hydroponic grows for the last decade. Over that decade, we have across root rot. Every single time it was directly correlated to a temperature issue over multiple days (water chiller failing).
> 
> 
> The day I see someone get root rot at 68F with enough oxygen enrichment will be the day I change my opinion on that. That day has not come yet


I've had the snot looking clear slime develop in my systems even with chillers and plenty of aeration. Water quality differs from place to place and even people using RO have had problems. IMO, a good sterilization regime is more important than chillers.


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## PerfectGrower (Apr 14, 2016)

You could very well be right.....Ive personally never seen it.


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## redi jedi (Apr 14, 2016)

PerfectGrower said:


> You could very well be right.....Ive personally never seen it.


Browse through the hydro section threads...you'll see its pretty common.


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## brokencage (Apr 16, 2016)

PerfectGrower said:


> We've been around hydroponic grows for the last decade. Over that decade, we have across root rot. Every single time it was directly correlated to a temperature issue over multiple days (water chiller failing).
> 
> 
> The day I see someone get root rot at 68F with enough oxygen enrichment will be the day I change my opinion on that. That day has not come yet


This!


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## brokencage (Apr 16, 2016)

redi jedi said:


> I've had the snot looking clear slime develop in my systems even with chillers and plenty of aeration. Water quality differs from place to place and even people using RO have had problems. IMO, a good sterilization regime is more important than chillers.


I have got slime at low temps but never pythium. I run the lucas method and don't dump my res the entire grow. if I get a little slime I add h2o2 & wipe the sides of the res then filter the nutrient through a fish filter no active carbon for a day. slime stays gone for a few weeks or more. I keep my res temps between 67-70F I keep it insulated and use frozen water bottles.I found keeping crap out of the res works best. wipe the lid off before you open it &use a test jar so you can close the lid while you test.


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## SoOLED (Apr 16, 2016)

rkymtnman said:


> and i'm a potty, potty mouth.
> 
> that about cover it J?
> 
> oh yeah, and he works for a company O2Grow that sells the equipment he is now trying to sell on here.



if this is true, can we lock this -ish


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## J Henry (Apr 16, 2016)

PerfectGrower said:


> with enough oxygen enrichment will be the day I change my opinion on that. That day has not come yet


Just so we are all on the same page and have a clear understanding of what you are trying to say and what you really mean…

What exactly is your definition of “oxygen enrichment?”


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## Rrog (Apr 16, 2016)

Same as profit enrichment


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## J Henry (Apr 16, 2016)

Rrog said:


> Same as profit enrichment


An ODD syndrome...


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## dstroy (Apr 17, 2016)

J Henry said:


> Just so we are all on the same page and have a clear understanding of what you are trying to say and what you really mean…
> 
> What exactly is your definition of “oxygen enrichment?”


Any added dissolved o2 is enrichment. It doesn't matter where it comes from.

If you guys want to build your own electrolysis equipment you can find the iridium cathode/anode assemblies on alibaba. Then you just need a switch mode dc power supply.

Or you can just use an ozone generator since ozone dissolves much more readily into water and it decays into o2 with the added benefit of killing biologics. That would be ok if you weren't adding beneficial bacteria to your nute res., I'm guessing that a lot of us do add beneficials to our res. In which case ozone is bad and all water electrolysis produces ozone.


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## J Henry (Apr 18, 2016)

dstroy said:


> Any added dissolved o2 is enrichment. It doesn't matter where it comes from.


Air, a normal atmosphere contains between 20.8 and 21 percent *oxygen*, OSHA defines as *oxygen* deficient any atmosphere that contains less than 19.5 percent *oxygen*, and as *oxygen enriched*, any atmosphere that contains more than 22 percent.
PSA O2 Generator, VSA O2 Generator, Compressed oxygen, liquid oxygen,O2 Grow electrolysis.. you right about O3, it's an excellent disinfectant, kills microbes and bad odors, but it a very poor method if your interest is oxygenation (O2)... O3 is unstable with a very short half life.
If the plants and microbes are important and need more oxygen, give them more oxygen... that's only logical.
*Here's the big question: How do you know if your plants and microbes really need more oxygen?
Most people know when they see root rot symptoms and by then it's way to late.


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## Rrog (Apr 18, 2016)

This seems like a stretch to sell weedies


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## J Henry (Apr 18, 2016)

Rrog said:


> This seems like a stretch to sell weedies


It's the "ODD" Syndrome again...


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## Forrestfirebuds (Apr 27, 2017)

blackforest said:


> Maybe if we are stuck on Mars like Matt Damon in The Martian we will hit you up for your space age technology. Back here on planet Earth there are more efficient ways to add O2 to water and max out DO.


Which ways are more efficient?


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## FennarioMike (Apr 29, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Air, a normal atmosphere contains between 20.8 and 21 percent *oxygen*, OSHA defines as *oxygen* deficient any atmosphere that contains less than 19.5 percent *oxygen*, and as *oxygen enriched*, any atmosphere that contains more than 22 percent.
> PSA O2 Generator, VSA O2 Generator, Compressed oxygen, liquid oxygen,O2 Grow electrolysis.. you right about O3, it's an excellent disinfectant, kills microbes and bad odors, but it a very poor method if your interest is oxygenation (O2)... O3 is unstable with a very short half life.
> If the plants and microbes are important and need more oxygen, give them more oxygen... that's only logical.
> *Here's the big question: How do you know if your plants and microbes really need more oxygen?
> Most people know when they see root rot symptoms and by then it's way to late.


I'd like to see independent blind studies of your product with respect to OBSERVED DO levels in a traditional aeration technique at various temperatures. I'm thinking you don't have this. Not hydrolysis in general - but YOUR product.

Everything you're stating is theoretical but not ACTUAL product data.

Smoke and Mirrors...


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## J Henry (May 1, 2017)

FennarioMike said:


> I'd like to see independent blind studies of your product with respect to OBSERVED DO levels in a traditional aeration technique at various temperatures. I'm thinking you don't have this. Not hydrolysis in general - but YOUR product.
> 
> Everything you're stating is theoretical but not ACTUAL product data.
> 
> Smoke and Mirrors...


 Specifically what product would you like to see?


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## J Henry (May 1, 2017)

dstroy said:


> ...all water electrolysis produces ozone.


You should rethink this - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolysis_of_water


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## J Henry (May 1, 2017)

Forrestfirebuds said:


> Which ways are more efficient?


Water chillers is the only way so they say...


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## FennarioMike (May 1, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Specifically what product would you like to see?


The one you pimp all over the place.


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## Rrog (May 1, 2017)

Shamelessly. You forgot shamelessly pimping all over the place.


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## rkymtnman (May 1, 2017)

FennarioMike said:


> I'd like to see independent blind studies of your product with respect to OBSERVED DO levels in a traditional aeration technique at various temperatures. I'm thinking you don't have this. Not hydrolysis in general - but YOUR product.
> 
> Everything you're stating is theoretical but not ACTUAL product data.
> 
> Smoke and Mirrors...


they had a write up in High Times. does that count? lol. that J Henry's company paid for. and they still can't sell this crap. 

because in theory it "should" be better but it isn't. if it was, there would be side by side grows showing how much better it works. and his company could afford to pay for advertising here instead of random ad placements by Ms Henry.


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## rkymtnman (May 1, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Water chillers is the only way so they say...


so would you if you were a grower and not a failed salesman, Biff Loman Henry.


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## dstroy (May 1, 2017)

J Henry said:


> You should rethink this - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolysis_of_water


Ok I'll play your game.

"The relative amount of O3 produced (relative to molecular oxygen) depends on the overpotential, pH, radicals present and anode material. O2 evolution is greater than that for O3 due to the lower potential required. At low overpotentials, very little O3 may be produced but at high current densities and overpotential, up to a sixth (or more) of the oxidized molecules may be O3. As O3 is more much more soluble than O2, there may twice the dissolved O3 than O2 but the bubble gas will contain about 20 times the O2 than O3"

http://www1.lsbu.ac.uk/water/electrolysis.html

So yeah.... got anything else besides Wikipedia?


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## ANC (May 1, 2017)

WeedFreak78 said:


> Answer the question: How do you maintain an O2 supersaturated H20 solution at atmospheric pressure and average room temperatures?


One way of supersaturating water with O2, is counter-intuitive. 
Add a large planted aquarium to your reservoir system, then add CO2 to the water during lights on period. The plants 'exhale oxygen during photosynthesis' this pushes O2 saturation to above atmospheric equilibrium.


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## FennarioMike (May 1, 2017)

I think this guy has multiple accounts at all sorts of these forums and carries on "Threads" with himself with glowing "reviews" of the product. 

Shameless is right


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## FennarioMike (May 1, 2017)

I think he's also - Nunyabizz50

and - 4x4Gamer

and - TheGrowdaddy


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## rkymtnman (May 1, 2017)

FennarioMike said:


> I think he's also - Nunyabizz50
> 
> and - 4x4Gamer
> 
> and - TheGrowdaddy


he's not smart enough to have multiple accounts.


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## Rrog (May 1, 2017)

Yaaaaaawnn


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## Forrestfirebuds (May 1, 2017)

Yep good answer. It's best to leave it at that.


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## Rrog (May 2, 2017)

Another non-science thread, brought to you by the startup stooges You see these parasites anytime some new piece of shit concept is floated. Startup stooge arrives to tell you how great it is


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## Altered State (May 2, 2017)

It would be nice to see a start up company offering a device that costs less then the current options instead of costing more.

I currently use a 65 lpm aerator pump that passes 17 gallons of air per minute / 1020 gallons per hour for a costs of $100. As a bonus it also works as a water chiller keeping the nutrient temp the same as the pumps intake air temperature , which is kept in check be the pumps placement.

Which brings me to my next concern with the o2 generator , heat.
As the device is submerged in the water all heat generated will be passed into the nutrient tank , warming / heating it every minute its turned on.

I assume the heat varies according to watts being drawn.

For reference when a 18w water pump was added to a 23g rdwc system it increased the temperature by 5 degrees

````````


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## Logan Burke (May 3, 2017)

Bennies all the way... Ive no chiller, standalone DWC buckets with 60lpm of air running to each, 75F water, never had the root rot....


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## J Henry (May 3, 2017)

Logan right, he keeps the plants and microbes healthy, he know that a chiller is a sham, a waste of money. If you can't keep your plants healthy the get sick, die and the catch a dose of the root rot.

Try high 70's - 80F res water temp, the production is impressive and the grow-out time is much quicker?

The warmer the water the greater the plant, root and benny metabolism, the faster the crop and bennies grow the greater the yield, the more money you make. That's as simple as it can get and Logan's definitely got it.


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## Logan Burke (May 3, 2017)

Well, I'm not making any money haha, but I guess I am saving it by not having to go to these sleezy street dealers selling it with god-only-knows what on/in it. Anyway. I run between 70-77F. It is true that the roots metabolize their nutes more quickly at higher temperatures, however, just as with any living thing it is not quite that simple. Too high of temps will encourage bad microbes to grow, and in general, bennies prefer the same conditions as the roots do. In my opinion, you should try to avoid water temps above 75F no matter what even with bennies. I have seen people be successful with low 80's water temp for long periods of time using an array of bennies, not just Hydroguard. My water does get below 70 some days, for the first half of this grow, they stayed at or below 70F. I cannot say I have noticed any considerable difference in growth, but this would require a side by side for a definitive answer. I personally believe that, especially for us in standalone systems, bennies are not only a cheaper option vs chillers, but they clean your roots and break down things like dead roots, leaf matter, etc....some believe root rot is for water with temps above 72F...but I've seen many with chillers at a perfect 68F get root rot time and time again for various and diverse reasons. 
Thank you J Henry; I simply try to give back so much of the information I learned on this site! Happy growing everyone!


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## J Henry (May 4, 2017)

Actually fungi are ubiquitous little creatures and necessary. They are always on standby ready to jump into the colonization, feasting and reproduction mode and consume the dead, dying, sickly and decaying organic matter… like microscopic turkey buzzards always present, waiting, smelling the environment for the scent of death. They do not colonize and feast on healthy plants and Rhizomes. Death and decay comes first, then comes the fungal outbreak. You have not experienced a dose of the root rot because you maintain your grow in an excellent healthy condition all the time. You do what many hobby growers can only wish they could do.

Growers that can’t, don’t and won’t keep their plants and roots alive or healthy are the unfortunate ones that have fungal outbreaks and then the discovery of the crisis and off to the races seeking the cure for the infection. Prevention is really so much easier than the race for the cure.

Preventing fungal infestations is really simple as you know so well – just don’t kill the rhizomes or the beneficial microbial colonies and there will be nothing to attract fungal colonization, that’s all and clearly you are expert at keeping everything healthy. Others should pay attention to your growing technique and you are right - you don’t need a water chiller to keep res water cold like the chiller salesmen always tell you.


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## dstroy (May 4, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Actually fungi are ubiquitous little creatures and necessary. They are always on standby ready to jump into the colonization, feasting and reproduction mode and consume the dead, dying, sickly and decaying organic matter… like microscopic turkey buzzards always present, waiting, smelling the environment for the scent of death. They do not colonize and feast on healthy plants and Rhizomes. Death and decay comes first, then comes the fungal outbreak. You have not experienced a dose of the root rot because you maintain your grow in an excellent healthy condition all the time. You do what many hobby growers can only wish they could do.
> 
> Growers that can’t, don’t and won’t keep their plants and roots alive or healthy are the unfortunate ones that have fungal outbreaks and then the discovery of the crisis and off to the races seeking the cure for the infection. Prevention is really so much easier than the race for the cure.
> 
> Preventing fungal infestations is really simple as you know so well – just don’t kill the rhizomes or the beneficial microbial colonies and there will be nothing to attract fungal colonization, that’s all and clearly you are expert at keeping everything healthy. Others should pay attention to your growing technique and you are right - you don’t need a water chiller to keep res water cold like the chiller salesmen always tell you.


Just like you don't need to add an electrolysis machine to increase your DO when airstones exist?


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## WeedFreak78 (May 4, 2017)

I'm convinced most root rot issues are a product of heavy nutrient use or lack of reservoir maintainance, not lack of DO. Heavy nutrient use leaves excess nutrients in the solution the plants can't use, providing a buffet for bacteria. Dead leaves and roots do the same thing. 

Dead plant material and excess nutes will promote bacterial blooms. Keep your reservoir clean, run conservative nutrient levels and keep temps in check and a standard air stone is more than adequate. 

J Henry is a shill that's been run out of here at least once before. He makes wild claims with nothing to back it up and can't answer simple questions about HIS product HE keeps trying to hawk around here. 

I still want an explanation of how you control the hydrogen gas production from these O2 emitters. Or are you unconcerned with selling a product that could turn a well sealed reservoir into a small bomb in someone's house? Asshat.


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## J Henry (May 4, 2017)

dstroy said:


> Just like you don't need to add an electrolysis machine to increase your DO when airstones exist?


And how bout those high dollar water chillers everyone loves to buy, ice, res hypothermia and water falls, spray jets and an air venture or maybe double venturies (deliver 2 X more air)? Any opinion on all this stuff or what about just turning down the a/c temperature in your grow-room maybe? Or just open the window if you grow in the mountains (>1500 ft. - >1 mile high elevation) or maybe even move to Canada?

**** Here's a big, BIG question for you - what do you think is the optimal safe DO required to prevent suffocating the rhizomes and good bacteria in the res water and prevent fungal infestations? Ke word here is "prevent fungal infestations." not treat fungal infestation?


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## FennarioMike (May 4, 2017)

J Henry said:


> And how bout those high dollar water chillers everyone loves to buy, ice, res hypothermia and water falls, spray jets and an air venture or maybe double venturies (deliver 2 X more air)? Any opinion on all this stuff or what about just turning down the a/c temperature in your grow-room maybe? Or just open the window if you grow in the mountains (>1500 ft. - >1 mile high elevation) or maybe even move to Canada?
> 
> **** Here's a big, BIG question for you - what do you think is the optimal safe DO required to prevent suffocating the rhizomes and good bacteria in the res water and prevent fungal infestations? Ke word here is "prevent fungal infestations." not treat fungal infestation?


Answer us, oh wise one, and please let us buy your overpriced electrolyzer so we can grow our plants. There obviously is no other way!


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## Logan Burke (May 4, 2017)

Actually, I have had root rot, lol...just not since I started running hydroguard. And yes DO I doubt is ever the only contributing factor to root rot, there must be a source of the bad microbes, which is often there in the form of a dead root or flake of leaf. I think until someone creates something just as cost effective as air stones and an air pump, this product would likely be counterproductive to O2 levels especially for standalone's as I'm guessing it's heat output is at least that of a water pump, I would think more,diminishing the water's maximum DO capacity regardless of how much it creates, but idk this science very well, just basics.


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## rkymtnman (May 4, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Any opinion on all this stuff or what about just turning down the a/c temperature in your grow-room maybe?


proof right here you don't have a friggin clue about growing weed and just here to sell your crap.

optimal grow room temps are 75F. water temps will eventually climb to ambient temp ie 75F. water holds the most DO at 65F which is why a chiller is required. and even more so if you use CO2 and grow room temps approach 90F. 

you are a bad salesman and an even worse grower.


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## J Henry (May 4, 2017)

FennarioMike said:


> Answer us, oh wise one, and please let us buy your overpriced electrolyzer so we can grow our plants. There obviously is no other way!


O-simpleton, there are many other ways.

OK, Let’s see you will make a little effort today and then you answer back to me what you discover – Spend a quarter and call (952) 373-0424 ask for Ms. Ahmed Saidi, technical assistance. This will take motivation that you probably cannot muster-up.

I don’t do sales, I’m not in the sales racket, but I stayed at Holiday Inn last week up North and slept very well… you’re wrong again as usual.

Did you know “there is no muff too tough to dive, we dive at 5.” (Frogman, San Diego, CA 2001)


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## J Henry (May 4, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> Actually, I have had root rot, lol...just not since I started running hydroguard. And yes DO I doubt is ever the only contributing factor to root rot, there must be a source of the bad microbes, which is often there in the form of a dead root or flake of leaf. I think until someone creates something just as cost effective as air stones and an air pump, this product would likely be counterproductive to O2 levels especially for standalone's as I'm guessing it's heat output is at least that of a water pump, I would think more,diminishing the water's maximum DO capacity regardless of how much it creates, but idk this science very well, just basics.


Are you opposed to anything that might rate to just a little more than the bare-bones "basics?" Water, air, fire, earth...


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## rkymtnman (May 4, 2017)

J Henry said:


> O-simpleton, there are many other ways.
> 
> OK, Let’s see you will make a little effort today and then you answer back to me what you discover – Spend a quarter and call (952) 373-0424 ask for Ms. Ahmed Saidi, technical assistance. This will take motivation that you probably cannot muster-up.
> 
> ...


just put up pics of a side by side grow with o2 grow shit on one side of a tent and air stones on the other. we'll decide.

we dont' need a customer service rep for Directv in India telling us more of your bullshit. and phone calls don't cost a quarter anymore. what fucking century do you think this is?


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## rkymtnman (May 4, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Are you opposed to anything that might rate to just a little more than the bare-bones "basics?" Water, air, fire, earth...


KISS. keep it simple shithead.


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## Atomizer (May 4, 2017)

. Its the ideal gizmo for some types of roots, mainly, the "painted onto the back panel of a fishtank" variety


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## Logan Burke (May 4, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Are you opposed to anything that might rate to just a little more than the bare-bones "basics?" Water, air, fire, earth...


I'm opposed to claims being made without the support of either personal experience combined with facts or purely facts, then criticizing other people when they point out reasons they disagree with the one making that claim. Then when questions are asked (i.e. what kind of heat does it generate), more than once, and recieve no answer, it appears to be simply evasive. I've actually been much more understanding than other people who've replied here. But incredible claims require incredible proof; of which I see little or none.


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## dstroy (May 4, 2017)

J Henry said:


> And how bout those high dollar water chillers everyone loves to buy, ice, res hypothermia and water falls, spray jets and an air venture or maybe double venturies (deliver 2 X more air)? Any opinion on all this stuff or what about just turning down the a/c temperature in your grow-room maybe? Or just open the window if you grow in the mountains (>1500 ft. - >1 mile high elevation) or maybe even move to Canada?
> 
> **** Here's a big, BIG question for you - what do you think is the optimal safe DO required to prevent suffocating the rhizomes and good bacteria in the res water and prevent fungal infestations? Ke word here is "prevent fungal infestations." not treat fungal infestation?


Since water can only hold 18mg/l O2, any readings higher than this are physically impossible. There has been tons of research on optimal DO for plant growth, as long as you keep your DO in an acceptable range for the system that you are growing in your roots are excellent at repelling pathogens. Problems happen when DO dips too low, the roots get sick and can be attacked OR if temps get too high (because temp has an inverse relationship with DO). So again, all we need are airstones, and maybe a water chiller.

You are understating the importance of temperature in relation to dissolved oxygen as well. At 86f water will only hold 7.5ppm of DO, the exact same water at 68f will hold 9ppm of DO. The cooler the water is the more DO it will hold. It doesn't matter if you throw a fancy electrolysis heater into the water because the water will only be able to hold a certain amount of DO in relation to the temperature anyways. At the root level this oxygen starvation reduces the permeability of roots to water, and consequently the absorption of mineral salts, which will weaken the plant and eventually lead to a poor crop. Under continuing stress conditions, the roots will emit ethylene, a stress hormone that accumulates in the roots and participates to the slow degradation of the root system. Furthermore, ethylene is recognized by some pathogens as the sign for a weak individual, and a motivation to attack.

Would you look at that, all we need are airstones and maybe a water chiller. hurrrrrrrrrr


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## J Henry (May 4, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> I'm opposed to claims being made without the support of either personal experience combined with facts or purely facts, then criticizing other people when they point out reasons they disagree with the one making that claim. Then when questions are asked (i.e. what kind of heat does it generate), more than once, and recieve no answer, it appears to be simply evasive. I've actually been much more understanding than other people who've replied here. But incredible claims require incredible proof; of which I see little or none.


Didn’t mean to hurt your feelings. Do you think the International Space Station could be real or no? Now that’s really incredible.


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## Growdict (May 4, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Didn’t mean to hurt your feelings. Do you think the International Space Station could be real or no? Now that’s really incredible.


https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=8&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwii5eXbmdfTAhVG22MKHVCqB-4QtwIIQjAH&url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7eF7LQl0f0c&usg=AFQjCNEATfOK0N528X63JQexvILJMeWNMA
https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=14&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwii5eXbmdfTAhVG22MKHVCqB-4QFghoMA0&url=http://www.geek.com/geek-cetera/how-to-see-iss-using-a-telescope-and-a-little-help-from-nasa-1613851/&usg=AFQjCNEeqhbkOzoqoOCD4Fi-xA286yH6ow
that was easy, now your proof?


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## dstroy (May 4, 2017)

Growdict said:


> https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=8&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwii5eXbmdfTAhVG22MKHVCqB-4QtwIIQjAH&url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7eF7LQl0f0c&usg=AFQjCNEATfOK0N528X63JQexvILJMeWNMA
> https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=14&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwii5eXbmdfTAhVG22MKHVCqB-4QFghoMA0&url=http://www.geek.com/geek-cetera/how-to-see-iss-using-a-telescope-and-a-little-help-from-nasa-1613851/&usg=AFQjCNEeqhbkOzoqoOCD4Fi-xA286yH6ow
> that was easy, now your proof?


He seems to be just trolling


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## FennarioMike (May 4, 2017)

J Henry said:


> O-simpleton, there are many other ways.
> 
> OK, Let’s see you will make a little effort today and then you answer back to me what you discover – Spend a quarter and call (952) 373-0424 ask for Ms. Ahmed Saidi, technical assistance. This will take motivation that you probably cannot muster-up.
> 
> ...


I didn't ask the question - TOOL. You did - I was saying to - OK then, what's the answer? Instead you tell me to look it up. I actually don't give a shit - but if YOU'RE so smart - dazzle us with your brilliance and answer your own question then.

Nobody is asking these questions except you, but you obviously have the answer that no one else has - so tell us. Or shut up already.


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## Logan Burke (May 4, 2017)

dstroy said:


> Since water can only hold 18mg/l O2, any readings higher than this are physically impossible. There has been tons of research on optimal DO for plant growth, as long as you keep your DO in an acceptable range for the system that you are growing in your roots are excellent at repelling pathogens. Problems happen when DO dips too low, the roots get sick and can be attacked OR if temps get too high (because temp has an inverse relationship with DO). So again, all we need are airstones, and maybe a water chiller.
> 
> You are understating the importance of temperature in relation to dissolved oxygen as well. At 86f water will only hold 7.5ppm of DO, the exact same water at 68f will hold 9ppm of DO. The cooler the water is the more DO it will hold. It doesn't matter if you throw a fancy electrolysis heater into the water because the water will only be able to hold a certain amount of DO in relation to the temperature anyways. At the root level this oxygen starvation reduces the permeability of roots to water, and consequently the absorption of mineral salts, which will weaken the plant and eventually lead to a poor crop. Under continuing stress conditions, the roots will emit ethylene, a stress hormone that accumulates in the roots and participates to the slow degradation of the root system. Furthermore, ethylene is recognized by some pathogens as the sign for a weak individual, and a motivation to attack.
> 
> Would you look at that, all we need are airstones and maybe a water chiller. hurrrrrrrrrr





J Henry said:


> Didn’t mean to hurt your feelings. Do you think the International Space Station could be real or no? Now that’s really incredible.


Lol you really must be full of yourself to believe you could hurt my feelings....the only thing hurting me is my sternum that just got sawed in half 30 days ago; but if it helps ya sleep at night...
I'd say this thread's pretty much done in terms of proving/disproving the advertised product, yes?


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## Logan Burke (May 4, 2017)

dstroy said:


> He seems to be just trolling


Agreed.


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## Logan Burke (May 4, 2017)

You still never answered how much heat the product generates by the way....that's got my feelings hurtin' real bad....
Hehe.


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## rkymtnman (May 4, 2017)

dstroy said:


> He seems to be just trolling





Logan Burke said:


> Agreed.


I've been playing this same game with Ms Henry for probably a year now. I almost reported him for trying to get advertising for free but as you'll find out, it's much more fun to mess with him. 

He won't answer any ?'s, he plugs o2grow constantly, he doesnt' know shit about growing or DO at all yet he does copy Wikipedia alot and pretends he knows what's up.

Stick around! 

He used to call me and @Gary Goodson potty mouths and make fun of our moms and stuff. The dude is getting close to 60 and is completely out of touch.


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## Logan Burke (May 4, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> I've been playing this same game with Ms Henry for probably a year now. I almost reported him for trying to get advertising for free but as you'll find out, it's much more fun to mess with him.
> 
> He won't answer any ?'s, he plugs o2grow constantly, he doesnt' know shit about growing or DO at all yet he does copy Wikipedia alot and pretends he knows what's up.
> 
> ...


His level of maturity matches that of a teenager...if he is 60yrs old, it is just that much more of a funny observation lol. And yeah it is fun I hate to admit haha, but I try to give everyone a fair chance to explain their side ya know? And yeah I thought that looked like copy/paste (maybe I'm wrong)....anything I say can be confirmed by more than wikipedia, that much I do know.


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## FennarioMike (May 4, 2017)

He doesn't get it that his attitude and heavy product pitching just attaches a STINK to his product. Even if it WAS the shit, all of us would go out of our way to NOT buy it just because of that. Furthermore, because he's SUCH a douche about everything, we'll tell our friends, and local grow shops, and local consultants. That's karma, bitch. A little kindness goes a long way and the heavy hand goes the wrong way entirely.


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## FennarioMike (May 4, 2017)

He's as persistent as a god damned horsefly too


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## Logan Burke (May 4, 2017)

You are very right Fennario....anytime one comes accross as arrogant or having all of the answers, even if they do, no one wants to even be around that person. At least people like yourself are persistant in ensuring false information is not passed along as fact.


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## J Henry (May 5, 2017)

dstroy said:


> "Since water can only hold 18mg/l O2, any readings higher than this are physically impossible." I don't believe this any more than the cow jumped over the moon, show me how you arrived at this DO concentration limitation,
> 
> 
> "...optimal DO for plant growth, as long as you keep your DO in an acceptable range for the system that you are growing in your roots are excellent at repelling pathogens." You are correct, and what DO Sat do you consider an acceptable range that must be sustained continuously throughout the growing season?
> ...


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## FennarioMike (May 5, 2017)

FennarioMike said:


> He doesn't get it that his attitude and heavy product pitching just attaches a STINK to his product. Even if it WAS the shit, all of us would go out of our way to NOT buy it just because of that. Furthermore, because he's SUCH a douche about everything, we'll tell our friends, and local grow shops, and local consultants. That's karma, bitch. A little kindness goes a long way and the heavy hand goes the wrong way entirely.


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## J Henry (May 5, 2017)

This MoronMike is really scary, what a nut…


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## FennarioMike (May 5, 2017)

Shoo horsefly pest


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## dstroy (May 5, 2017)

1. Don't edit my posts.

2. since water can only hold 18mg/l O2, any readings higher than this are physically impossible." I don't believe this any more than the cow jumped over the moon, show me how you arrived at this DO concentration limitation,

http://www.ramp-alberta.org/river/water+sediment+quality/chemical/temperature+and+dissolved+oxygen.aspx
https://water.usgs.gov/software/DOTABLES/ (this is a good one)
http://www.water-research.net/index.php/dissovled-oxygen-in-water
there are literally HUNDREDS of government and educational websites that support my claim

3. "...optimal DO for plant growth, as long as you keep your DO in an acceptable range for the system that you are growing in your roots are excellent at repelling pathogens." You are correct, and what DO Sat do you consider an acceptable range that must be sustained continuously throughout the growing season?

It depends on what method you are using to grow. Using Kratky's non-recirculating method plants thrive from about 7ppm and up, commercial NFT requires about 40ppm, DWC is ideal above 9ppm. DO sat isn't commonly measured in aeroponic systems.

4. "Problems happen when DO dips too low, the roots get sick and can be attacked... You are correct, real big, serious problems. So what DO is too low in your opinion? And, by the way, just how do you accurately measure your DO?

Again, ideal DO sat is dependent on what growing method is used. With a fucking DO sensor like everyone else. You can also use colorimetric or titration. Winkler titration is the most accurate.

5. "OR if temps get too high (because temp has an inverse relationship with DO)." And we are back to the heart of the matter, DO -- insuring minimal safe elemental dissolved O2 continuously minute by minute for all the rhizomes and all the beneficial microbial colonies.

You actually meant "ensuring".

6. "So again, all we need are airstones, and maybe a water chiller." And your solution to insure minimal safe continuous O2 which is vital is airstones, [plenty air bubbles] and water chillers, right?

Yes, and proper circulation.

7. You are understating the importance of temperature in relation to dissolved oxygen as well." Yes the relationship is inverse. Lets not omit or discount the direct relationship O2 gas partial pressure has in the big picture, the greater the partial pressure of O2 in water, the greater the DO saturation that can be achieves - but greater than 105% DO Sat is unnecessary.

You actually mean how many atmospheres of pressure the solution you are working with is under. Which for everyone is a maximum of 14.7psi at sea level, and less at altitude. Partial pressure solubility is irrelevant in this application.

8. At the root level this oxygen starvation reduces the permeability of roots to water, and consequently the absorption of mineral salts, which will weaken the plant and eventually lead to a poor crop. Under continuing stress conditions, the roots will emit ethylene, a stress hormone that accumulates in the roots and participates to the slow degradation of the root system. Furthermore, ethylene is recognized by some pathogens as the sign for a weak individual, and a motivation to attack." Does this mean that insuring a constant supply of the element O2 is absolutely vital? If you are correct, and I believe you are, then what DO Saturation must be supplied 24/7 month after month throughout a growing season?

Well, I just don't really know how to respond to this. It seems like you are just asking rhetorical questions. Yes, plants require oxygen. I think everyone knows that. Again, the DO saturation depends on the growing method used. There are so many studies about this.

9. "Would you look at that, all we need are airstones and maybe a water chiller." I did and, the cow jumped over the moon.... hurrrrrrrrrr

durrrr


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## dstroy (May 5, 2017)

Lets talk about efficiency of electrolysis while I'm in here debunking your bullshit. There is absolutely NO WAY that your system is 100% efficient or you would not be trying to peddle it to pot growers, governmental agencies and companies would be THROWING money at you so fast. 

So, your claim that o2grow doesn't heat up water like an air pump and airstone (which they don't usually unless the intake air to the pump is hot.) is 

100% false

Even though they are relatively low power, it's still going to dump 30-50% of however many watts you put through it in heat straight into the water. You know, because of the "laws of thermodynamics" and all.


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## J Henry (May 5, 2017)

Hey-hey MoronMike, good news… expand your horizons, try on this read and report back.

*GrowerTalks* - Understanding Dissolved Oxygen by Kurt Becker
http://www.ballpublishing.com/GrowerTalks/ViewArticle.aspx?articleid=22058

*A healthier plant is a more efficient plant*

Ozonation is another method for increasing oxygen levels in solution. Like oxygen injection, injecting ozone gas will increase dissolved oxygen. However, ozone or O3 is almost 13 times more soluble in water than O2. This allows for much greater levels of oxygen to be dissolved into the water. As O3 is very unstable and reverts back to O2 quickly, it leaves super-saturated levels of dissolved oxygen in the water. As the system remains under pressure, the DO levels can be maintained at more than 300% of the saturation level of DO.

While adding dissolved oxygen, ozone has an additional benefit in that it oxidizes organic material and biofilm in the pipes, reducing the oxygen demand and helping to maintain higher levels of DO.

Trials were conducted at Metrolina Greenhouses in Huntersville, North Carolina. Utilizing a portable water-treatment unit consisting of filtration and ozonation, the benefits of water super-saturated with dissolved oxygen were tested against their standard water sources. Three greenhouses were tested side-by-side using identical benching and booms. One used their pond water, one used their well water and the third used their pond water treated with the trial system. Consistently, the plugs in the third greenhouse using the ozone treatment had higher germination rates, faster cropping times, better root growth (see photo) and better leaf development. Measurement of their dissolved oxygen in the irrigation water used in the third house was 300% greater than in the other two houses (see Figure 2).

In a final summary of the trial and of their first year using their own, complete treatment system, Metrolina reported that they saw an average of two weeks shorter cropping time on most liners, with complete cropping time reductions up to four weeks. More robust root systems with less damage and more drought tolerance were noted, as well as the removal of all biofilm from filters and pipes, and an overall reduction in their shrink by 66% from their previous three-year average.

These results are extremely impressive and achievable by others with proper equipment. However, growers can improve the health of their water in the short term by simply paying attention to the dissolved oxygen in their water. At a minimum, monitoring DO in irrigation water can help prevent problems or suggest different courses of action as problems arise. 

In the long run, the ability to optimize oxygen levels could improve plant health quality, reduce crop times and eliminate shrink, just as the focus on other input optimization has in the past.

Well, how about those ozone generators MM?


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## Growdict (May 5, 2017)

those ozone generators are bad for the health unless you wear SCUBA gear in your grow:

from wikipedia:
There is a great deal of evidence to show that ground level ozone can harm lung function and irritate the respiratory system.[34][44] Exposure to ozone (and the pollutants that produce it) is linked to premature death, asthma, bronchitis, heart attack, and other cardiopulmonary problems.[45][46]

Long-term exposure to ozone has been shown to increase risk of death from respiratory illness. A study of 450,000 people living in United States cities saw a significant correlation between ozone levels and respiratory illness over the 18-year follow-up period. The study revealed that people living in cities with high ozone levels, such as Houston or Los Angeles, had an over 30% increased risk of dying from lung disease
According to scientists with the US EPA, susceptible people can be adversely affected by ozone levels as low as 40 nmol/mol.


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## dstroy (May 5, 2017)

I linked this thread to all of the o2grow videos on youtube I could find


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## FennarioMike (May 5, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Hey-hey MoronMike, good news… expand your horizons, try on this read and report back.
> 
> *GrowerTalks* - Understanding Dissolved Oxygen by Kurt Becker
> http://www.ballpublishing.com/GrowerTalks/ViewArticle.aspx?articleid=22058
> ...


My point is that you are destroying the reputation of the product you shamelessly plug just because of your attitude. If you were chill about it, people might listen. But you're a bad used car salesman and everyone heads for the hills.

Nobody here is going to buy your garbage because of that alone - oh, and the price of it - oh and everything else...


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## Altered State (May 5, 2017)

J Henry said:


> In a final summary of the trial and of their first year using their own, complete treatment system, Metrolina reported that they saw an average of two weeks shorter cropping time on most liners, with complete cropping time reductions up to four weeks. More robust root systems with less damage and more drought tolerance were noted, as well as the removal of all biofilm from filters and pipes, and an overall reduction in their shrink by 66% from their previous three-year average.
> 
> *These results are extremely impressive *and achievable by others with proper equipment. However, growers can improve the health of their water in the short term by simply paying attention to the dissolved oxygen in their water. At a minimum, monitoring DO in irrigation water can help prevent problems or suggest different courses of action as problems arise.


Lets hear more , did the yield increase or was it unaffected ?

is there any danger of the added Ozone oxidizing the roots thus slowing growth ?

And most importantly have you tested the device with a DWC cannabis grow if so can you post photos ?


----------



## Logan Burke (May 5, 2017)

I still wanna know how much heat it creates....lmfao.


----------



## Logan Burke (May 5, 2017)

dstroy said:


> Lets talk about efficiency of electrolysis while I'm in here debunking your bullshit. There is absolutely NO WAY that your system is 100% efficient or you would not be trying to peddle it to pot growers, governmental agencies and companies would be THROWING money at you so fast.
> 
> So, your claim that o2grow doesn't heat up water like an air pump and airstone (which they don't usually unless the intake air to the pump is hot.) is
> 
> ...


I know this is the answer, but I've yet to hear him say how much heat it creates in relation, per say, to a submersible water pump.


----------



## J Henry (May 5, 2017)

Growdict said:


> those ozone generators are bad for the health unless you wear SCUBA gear in your grow:.


Bravo – at last real researcher has finally tuned in. Research CO2 gas today, that gas will really blow your dress up. EPA saysCO2 it will kill you in minutes, not 18 years like ozone. O3 also cleans up the smell stale pot smoke in your car and room in minutes… that’s a plus for smokers that drive and smoke. A double bang for your buck so to speak with O3. Don’t sweat the small pulmonary stuff with O3, that’s nothing for pot smokers.


----------



## J Henry (May 5, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> I still wanna know how much heat it creates....lmfao.


Growdik should be your mentor, he’s motivated and researches information on Wikipedia. You boys need to follow his lead and be motivated, use your clicker and look stuff up. I could research you questions for you, but I need to see you make a little effort and then post the answers to your questions. Just quit whining, asking the same questions over and over and show me you have a little motivation.


----------



## J Henry (May 5, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> I know this is the answer, but I've yet to hear him say how much heat it creates in relation, per say, to a submersible water pump.


Growdik should be your mentor, he’s motivated and researches information on Wikipedia. You boys need to follow his lead and be motivated, use your clicker and look stuff up. I could research you questions for you, but I need to see you make a little effort and then post the answers to your questions. Just quit whining, asking the same questions over and over and show me you have a little motivation.



Altered State said:


> Lets hear more , did the yield increase or was it unaffected ?
> 
> is there any danger of the added Ozone oxidizing the roots thus slowing growth ?
> 
> And most importantly have you tested the device with a DWC cannabis grow if so can you post photos ?


Growdik should be your mentor, he’s motivated and researches information on Wikipedia. You boys need to follow his lead and be motivated, use your clicker and look stuff up. I could research you questions for you, but I need to see you make a little effort and then post the answers to your questions. Just quit whining, asking the same questions over and over and show me you have a little motivation.


----------



## J Henry (May 5, 2017)

dstroy said:


> I linked this thread to all of the o2grow videos on youtube I could find


Try harder...


----------



## J Henry (May 5, 2017)

FennarioMike said:


> My point is that you are destroying the reputation of the product you shamelessly plug just because of your attitude. If you were chill about it, people might listen. But you're a bad used car salesman and everyone heads for the hills.
> 
> Nobody here is going to buy your garbage because of that alone - oh, and the price of it - oh and everything else...


Is that all there is?


----------



## Growdict (May 5, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Bravo – at last real researcher has finally tuned in. Research CO2 gas today, that gas will really blow your dress up. EPA saysCO2 it will kill you in minutes, not 18 years like ozone. O3 also cleans up the smell stale pot smoke in your car and room in minutes… that’s a plus for smokers that drive and smoke. A double bang for your buck so to speak with O3. Don’t sweat the small pulmonary stuff with O3, that’s nothing for pot smokers.


the epa does not say that. environmental co2 is 400ppm. 
wiki again: CO2 is an asphyxiant gas and not classified as toxic or harmful .. however, Concentrations of 7% to 10% (70,000 to 100,000 ppm) may cause suffocation, even in the presence of sufficient oxygen
telling people not to worry about ozone damage is stupid. do your research like growdik


----------



## FennarioMike (May 5, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Is that all there is?


nuff said already


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## Logan Burke (May 5, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Growdik should be your mentor, he’s motivated and researches information on Wikipedia. You boys need to follow his lead and be motivated, use your clicker and look stuff up. I could research you questions for you, but I need to see you make a little effort and then post the answers to your questions. Just quit whining, asking the same questions over and over and show me you have a little motivation.


You're the advertiser, that's your job to bring us the info? I'm not gonna do your work lmao.
Agreed, I'm up out of this thread as there are no more intelligible responses being given to inquiries.


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## Logan Burke (May 5, 2017)

Did you seriously type "don't sweat the small pulmonary stuff", like pot growers don't give a fuck about their health? LOL...ok sorry I just read that, now I am out of here because that statement is downright...well, wreckless. Yeah, don't worry about them pulmonary health concerns...ain't nothin' for you pot smokers...hahaha.

P.S. - How many of you growers use CO2 in concentrations high enough to cause any type of irreversible brain damage? And how long are you in your grow a day, to breath that CO2? You're right...research shows it is very bad...WHEN the concentration is too high and competes with oxygen to reach the brain; much higher than any supplemental CO2 system's grower will set it to.


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## dstroy (May 5, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Try harder...


No?

I've already refuted your ridiculous statements and debunked the impossible claims about your product.


----------



## WeedFreak78 (May 5, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> I still wanna know how much heat it creates....lmfao.


Screw the heat, I've been trying to find out how they deal with the hydrogen gas that's produced. He refuses to address it. Trying to turn everyone's res into a small explosive.


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## Altered State (May 5, 2017)

Does this jack ass pay to advertise on the site ?


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## ANC (May 6, 2017)

I fucking hate ozone, makes my ears feel like there are nails in.
I can't go into certain malls that use too much of the shit.


----------



## Logan Burke (May 6, 2017)

I'm guessing it's not conducive to good health either..lol. Unless you ask Jhenry up there.


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## J Henry (May 6, 2017)

FREE INFORMATION FOR THE LAZY JOKERS THAT WON’T CLICK THEIR CLICKERS

I did a little more research for you lazy guys always whining. Now don’t get your panties in a knot, but I don’t sell oxygen gas, ozone gas CO2 gas or light bulbs, no O2 machines, ozone machines, water chillers or pot growing equipment of any kind, super nutrients (including the most vital nutrient O2) or illegal drugs or sex toys – I know this will break your hearts and disappoint you tremendously, but I’m not in the sales game at all.

Check this out. If you are scared of Ozone gas Growdik and probably few other guys are, just man up to your phobia, admit it and don’t waste any more your time with this stuff and quietly move on. Don’t need to hear another long winded explanation like Growdik if your scared of it.

High output portable ozone generator/negative ion generator.

Ozone 500-i SALE Only $69.95 and is heck of a deal. http://www.cleanwaterstore.com/OS002290.html#tab=tab1

A double bang for your buck boys with this technology… This replaces using H2O2 for disinfecting res water and supplementing the most vital nutrient – O2.

What do you think about this ozone technology fellows?


----------



## Altered State (May 6, 2017)

Phobia my ass

*How is ozone harmful?*

The same properties that allow high concentrations of ozone to react with organic matter outside the body give it the ability to react with similar organic matter that makes up the body, and potentially cause harmful health consequences. When inhaled, ozone can damage the lungs. Relatively low amounts can cause chest pain, coughing, shortness of breath and throat irritation. Ozone may also worsen chronic respiratory diseases such as asthma and compromise the ability of the body to fight respiratory infections. People vary widely in their susceptibility to ozone. Healthy people, as well as those with respiratory difficulty can experience breathing problems with exposure to ozone. Exercise during exposure to ozone causes a greater amount of ozone to be inhaled, and increases the risk of harmful respiratory effects. Recovery from the harmful effects can occur following short-term exposure to low levels of ozone, but health effects may become more damaging and recovery less certain at higher levels or from longer exposures (US EPA, 1996a, 1996b).

http://www.allergyclean.com/problems-with-ozone-generators-and-ionizers-that-produce-

I'll Pass on the ozone for aeration thanks 

```````````````
``````````````````````


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## J Henry (May 6, 2017)

Before you get your panties tangled up in a knot in your ass there Buddy… there’s more to it. Read-up.

*Practical Hydroponics and Greenhouses *

*Issue 36: Introduction to Ozone Generation *

*Issue 36
September/October – 1997
Story Title: Introduction to Ozone Generation
Author: Steven Carruthers http://www.hydroponics.com.au/issue-36-introduction-to-ozone-generation/*

*Ozone is a powerful disinfecting and oxidising agent, successfully used in thousands of water treatment applications. STEVEN CARRUTHERS reports on its use in hydroponics.*

*Environmental and Health Aspects*
Because ozone has a very short half life in aqueous solutions, and *its degradation predominantly results in either oxygen or oxygenated by-products, waters treated with ozone will be less of an environmental hazard than the water left untreated or treated with halogens or related compounds, such as chlorine.* Ozone accelerates the natural oxidation process of both atmospheric and biological oxygen take up. Water treated with ozone can generally be recycled in the environment without fear of releasing toxic substances.

Although ozone in the gaseous form is both toxic and reactive, *it represents no safety handling problems in properly designed operating systems. Unlike most other oxidants which are stored on site in bulk form, ozone is produced on site in low concentrations and immediately consumed. Consequently, any accidental leakage can be easily controlled, as evidenced by ozone’s long safety history in many applications around the world.*

*Breathing traces of ozone in air for a few minutes is of little public health concern.* Even though throat and lung irritation plus oedema have been observed after extreme exposures to ozone, *it is important to recognise that during more than 100 years of commercial use, no deaths related to ozone exposure have ever been reported.*

Smells fresh, like minutes a spring lightning storm in the mountains… wonder what the O3 concentration is to smell it outside after the lightning storm?


----------



## Whats Saponin (May 6, 2017)

Enjoy


----------



## Logan Burke (May 6, 2017)

It's not harmful until it reaches a certian (high) concentration...don't need research to know that. And that guy up there sounds like he is reviewing your product, just labeled for a different purpose?...If it is the same concept, it sterilizes water...that's bad for the root zone, you want good bennies...but would work great in my fish tank. It also shows that he thinks it is not a good option for his aquariums...the same conclusion all of us here have come to for our hydro systems. And if you did want one, the video makes it appear that DIY would be wayyy cheaper than buying a product such as the one in your original post.


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## Whats Saponin (May 6, 2017)

I have no affiliation with any products, I just found it amusing that this guy built a unit for $8 dollars that does the same exact thing.


----------



## Logan Burke (May 6, 2017)

Yeah it's a testament to the greed of some people...*cough*...I've yet to see literally not one grower, not a single one, that has actually used one of these (with pictures) and successfully grown cannabis via DWC. I've read posts claiming they have...on a seperate thread advertising the exact same thing, just with much fewer responses. I think it is actually another account(s) Jhenry has made. But that's just opinion.


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## ALong14U (May 6, 2017)

jeffhan said:


> Pure bullshit.
> Just make sure not even a single light beam goes through the pot in your bubbler, specially through the net pot.
> Wrap your bubbler and lid with a foil/bubble insulation, even if it's black.
> Spray a bit of Trichoderma over your roots twice a week, if you can add some Mycorrhizae and Azospirillum it'd be a great add-on for your plants.
> ...


I know this post is old but liked what you said. Only thing I would add is keeping your ph in good range and checking it often will aid in the root system being strong enough to not get infected with fungus. Honestly in veg I have left my res for over a month just checking ph. The water turned to green algea and ppms went to somewhere around 900 and my roots never got fungus or root rot. I also do not use r.o. water. I use my tap water that must have chlorine in it and I have never had any issues. Even as you said temps being around 80. I try and keep my ph at 5.8 but as we know it likes to float as high as 6.3 sometimes. I monitor ph 2x a day. Like your post here.


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## Whats Saponin (May 6, 2017)

To be honest I almost purchased one. Review searching lead me here and now I feel like a ceramic diffuser would suffice. But I still kind of want to do a side by side just to test it for myself. Just wish it wasn't so damn expensive.


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## Logan Burke (May 6, 2017)

If you feel like dishing out the cash or making your own, please let me know, I'd love to see a side by side as no one else has been able to produce one.....or even just one as is...


ALong14U said:


> I know this post is old but liked what you said. Only thing I would add is keeping your ph in good range and checking it often will aid in the root system being strong enough to not get infected with fungus. Honestly in veg I have left my res for over a month just checking ph. The water turned to green algea and ppms went to somewhere around 900 and my roots never got fungus or root rot. I also do not use r.o. water. I use my tap water that must have chlorine in it and I have never had any issues. Even as you said temps being around 80. I try and keep my ph at 5.8 but as we know it likes to float as high as 6.3 sometimes. I monitor ph 2x a day. Like your post here.


What are you referring to?...Using the advertised product, and following these procedures is what you do for your grow?


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## Logan Burke (May 6, 2017)

I agree, no h202, run bennies, but this is about the advertised product/electrolysis not being nearly as effective at aerating your nutrient solution in hydroponics as well as just about any other method (Venturi, flooming, airstones, undercurrent), DWC/RDWC in particular.


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## Logan Burke (May 6, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Before you get your panties tangled up in a knot in your ass there Buddy… there’s more to it. Read-up.
> 
> *Practical Hydroponics and Greenhouses *
> 
> ...


Are you a grower?


----------



## ALong14U (May 6, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> Are you a grower?


Logan I do not use this product. Just throwing in my 2 cents. I don't believe there is a need for an overly priced product that can not out preform a 350$ chiller. It is true colder water holds more oxygen but neither is needed if you know your system and your plants. Not aiming comments at anyone just talking.


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## Altered State (May 6, 2017)

Why would you say that when your the one acting irrational ? 




J Henry said:


> Before you get your panties tangled up in a knot in your ass there Buddy… there’s more to it. Read-up.
> 
> Smells fresh, like minutes a spring lightning storm in the mountains… wonder what the O3 concentration is to smell it outside after the lightning storm?


----------



## J Henry (May 7, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> It's not harmful until it reaches a certian (high) concentration...don't need research to know that. And that guy up there sounds like he is reviewing your product, just labeled for a different purpose?...If it is the same concept, it sterilizes water...that's bad for the root zone, you want good bennies...but would work great in my fish tank. It also shows that he thinks it is not a good option for his aquariums...the same conclusion all of us here have come to for our hydro systems. And if you did want one, the video makes it appear that DIY would be wayyy cheaper than buying a product such as the one in your original post.


----------



## J Henry (May 7, 2017)

Hey, hey, look who’s back…. Logan’s back! I knew he only “shuck’in and jiv’in” when he said he was “outa-here” the other day. Logan lurks and he’s not about to leave. Nothing wrong with lurker’s. Glad you have reconsidered and your back now, your fun.

I bet Logan is in his late 20’s early 30’s, doesn’t work or have a job and his Mama probably gives him FREE room and board at her place.


Altered State said:


> Why would you say that when your the one acting irrational ?


----------



## J Henry (May 7, 2017)

Altered State said:


> Why would you say that when your the one acting irrational ?


Glad to see you are feeling better now and have settled down.


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## J Henry (May 7, 2017)

Whats Saponin said:


> Enjoy


Don't know about the disinfection ability but this $8 homemade rig is really a great deal for cash restricted hobby growers.
Electrolysis of water generates pure elemental oxygen (pure 100% O2 gas) never to be confused with environmental air. 
Not many, maybe 1 out of every 1000 hobby growers will "fail to insure minimal safe oxygen saturation in their DWC res water" regardless of the water temperature.
These less fortunate growers really do have serious problems with rhizomes dying, root rot, fungal infestations and crop failure should be interested, but probably not. These less fortunate growers are easy to spot, they are the ones that practice "crisis intervention." this group is fixated with :"the cure only" teas, chlorine, H2O2 and the race to kill fungi and all the other microbes living in the res water.

Even if the inventor actually knows nothing about his invention, the hallmark of his homemade electrolysis generator is cheap, cheap, cheap --- $8.00. This rig is priced tight for any hobbyist limited by cash.
This is way cheaper than the commercial electrolysis generators like, well, you know, the commercial brand rigs where this thread started.


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## WeedFreak78 (May 7, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Electrolysis of water generates pure elemental oxygen (pure 100% O2 gas) never to be confused with environmental air.


Listen up you fucking piece of shit, you're either a fucking moron, a troll, or, I'm guessing, both . You're promoting a product that creates O2 and *H*. You refuse to address the *H* byproduct. These are the same emitters used in hydrogen supplementation systems for internal combustion engines. Stop promoting a product that is inherently dangerous. 

Here you want people to do their own research.. fucking read this. 

*"*Electrolysis of water is the decomposition of water into oxygen and *hydrogen gas *due to an electric current being passed through the water. The reaction has a standard potential of −1.23 V, meaning it ideally requires a potential difference of 1.23 volts to split water."

Go suck start a shotgun, wash it down with some bleach.


----------



## J Henry (May 7, 2017)

Now this squirrel is really having a bad hair day, can you tell... you need your potty mouth washed with lye soap and sown tight with braid sutures. And y also need to go to church this morning and act right.

And that's my personal opinion of you today Bud.


----------



## WeedFreak78 (May 7, 2017)




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## KryptoBud (May 7, 2017)

Spams forum with hundreds of posts on the same subject, then tells you to do your own research when asked a question. A special kind of special.


----------



## dstroy (May 7, 2017)

WeedFreak78 said:


> Listen up you fucking piece of shit, you're either a fucking moron, a troll, or, I'm guessing, both . You're promoting a product that creates O2 and *H*. You refuse to address the *H* byproduct. These are the same emitters used in hydrogen supplementation systems for internal combustion engines. Stop promoting a product that is inherently dangerous.
> 
> Here you want people to do their own research.. fucking read this.
> 
> ...


It also makes ozone, and precipitates nutrient salts out of solution (which makes them unusable for plants). There is plenty of empirical evidence to support this. 

ON TOP OF ALL OF THAT,

You have to clean it with muriatic acid (hydrochloric acid)

Can't run it for more than a few hours a day

Emitter lifespan is quoted at "1600 hours" (less than 1.5 years of daily use)

The power supply is "UL recognized" which is not the same as "UL listed"

The components that I can see from their terrible photos are cheap chinese parts "assembled in USA" lol

The smallest unit costs $199

direct quote from their website: http://www.o2grow.com/faq

*Q: What is the best way to clean the emitter?*
*A:* Using muriatic acid is an easy way to clean the emitter. Please see our video demonstration at "removed link". We like to use "The Works" toilet bowl cleaner because you can find it at your local dollar store. The acid can be saved in a container and reused several times. Do not use brushes or abrasive sponges to clean the emitters. Spraying or dipping in the muriatic acid is sufficient. Dipping works best.

Yeah, use toilet bowl cleaner on something that comes into direct contact with things that you put in your body. That's totally an FDA approved sanitation method for things that come into contact with foodstuffs. lol

This turd is digging himself a hole so deep. Keep it up man.


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## J Henry (May 7, 2017)

KryptoBud said:


> Spams forum with hundreds of posts on the same subject, then tells you to do your own research when asked a question. A special kind of special.


My opinion of you Bud in unchanged, solid as a rock.


----------



## J Henry (May 7, 2017)

dstroy said:


> It also makes ozone...


Really? Oh my, still so confused,real messy disorganized mind in this num-skull. Were you like this at birth too?


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## dstroy (May 7, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Really? Oh my, still so confused,real messy disorganized mind in this num-skull. Were you like this at birth too?


http://biowellozone.com.au/technology/ozone_generator

You're just making yourself look silly.


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## Logan Burke (May 7, 2017)

ALong14U said:


> Logan I do not use this product. Just throwing in my 2 cents. I don't believe there is a need for an overly priced product that can not out preform a 350$ chiller. It is true colder water holds more oxygen but neither is needed if you know your system and your plants. Not aiming comments at anyone just talking.


100% agree, and no worries.


----------



## Logan Burke (May 7, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Hey, hey, look who’s back…. Logan’s back! I knew he only “shuck’in and jiv’in” when he said he was “outa-here” the other day. Logan lurks and he’s not about to leave. Nothing wrong with lurker’s. Glad you have reconsidered and your back now, your fun.
> 
> I bet Logan is in his late 20’s early 30’s, doesn’t work or have a job and his Mama probably gives him FREE room and board at her place.


Are you a grower?....And Myasthenias Gravis (autoimmune disease) kind of makes having a job hard, along with the immuno-suppressant therapy administered for it. So...no, I don't have a job? Lol now answer my question. Are you a grower? Like, are you growing pot?
P.S. You making personal attacks to avoid my primary question does make me come back...human nature.


----------



## ALong14U (May 7, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> 100% agree, and no worries.


Awesome. Lol thought I might have offended. Happy growing! You have a grow journal?


----------



## Logan Burke (May 7, 2017)

You know I've really been wanting to start one but idk how well a smartphone takes pics or if I need a good camera for decent ones to upload, lol. So far I haven't any, but on my upcoming grow I'm switching from 600w HID to 630w DE CMH fixture and I think I'll do a journal on that grow, my last two plants are flushing, then in about 1-2 months I'll be back in the flesh lol. How about yourself? I like the username by the way, lmfao.


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## KryptoBud (May 7, 2017)

J Henry said:


> My opinion of you Bud in unchanged, solid as a rock.


Fortunately for me the opinions of liars and thieves are of little concern.


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## Whats Saponin (May 7, 2017)

So if electrolysis is reliant (or more efficient) on dissolved solids how exactly would it affect pure salts i.e Hydro Nutrients. Could it cause it to precipitate?


----------



## Logan Burke (May 7, 2017)

That is precisely what Dstroy was saying above, that it precipitates the nutrients in your solution much more quickly than it naturally happens (if at all) using an airpump. But, lets not allow him to evade this simple question: Do you grow cannabis, Jhenry?


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## ALong14U (May 7, 2017)

Man. I have been watching this post now for 2 days. This is the best argument I have heard on his total BS. Your the man. This guy is selling HARMFUL EQUIPMENT at a premium. Dirt bag......the worst kind. Go organic and never look back!


----------



## ALong14U (May 7, 2017)

ALong14U said:


> Man. I have been watching this post now for 2 days. This is the best argument I have heard on his total BS. Your the man. This guy is selling HARMFUL EQUIPMENT at a premium. Dirt bag......the worst kind. Go organic and never look back!


Logan tried to post this earlier. It is supposed to be a reply to an earlier post. About emitting hydrogen during the process he is promoting.


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## Logan Burke (May 7, 2017)

While I do agree with that statement, I did not post such a thing...I do not make personal attacks, even if they are made on me. I find it to be a relatively useless excercise that clouds judgement and the ability to percieve right from wrong.
P.S. - I don't even grow organic?....Chem nutrients; GH Floranova.


----------



## ALong14U (May 7, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> While I do agree with that statement, I did not post such a thing...I do not make personal attacks, even if they are made on me. I find it to be a relatively useless excercise that clouds judgement and the ability to percieve right from wrong.
> P.S. - I don't even grow organic?....Chem nutrients; GH Floranova.


I'm the type that observes people being taken advantage of and will probably say something. But never hold a grudge lol. And I can't lie either. I really only have 11 organic....use GH 3 part for everything else because I can use it in my hydro tub ad well. BUT I do have every tiny scrap of the organic plants for personal smoke.....sad to say but it happens lol.


----------



## J Henry (May 8, 2017)

dstroy said:


> It also makes ozone, and precipitates nutrient salts out of solution (which makes them unusable for plants). There is plenty of empirical evidence to support this.... their website: http://www.o2grow.com/faq QUOTE]
> 
> I went to the website you recommended and read it @ http://www.o2grow.com/faq then I visited all the pages and read all the information on that site.
> 
> ...


----------



## Logan Burke (May 8, 2017)

ALong14U said:


> I'm the type that observes people being taken advantage of and will probably say something. But never hold a grudge lol. And I can't lie either. I really only have 11 organic....use GH 3 part for everything else because I can use it in my hydro tub ad well. BUT I do have every tiny scrap of the organic plants for personal smoke.....sad to say but it happens lol.


I think you put the wrong name in....you said I tried posting that earlier over the product I was promoting...I don't promote any product. And I do not grow organics. Nor does it fit the literature pattern of all of my 250+ posts on this site (cursing, personal attacks/character assasination, or even punctuation)...


----------



## dstroy (May 8, 2017)

You sound upset.

There you go editing my posts again.

Here: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=electrolysis+precipitate

This is good, I didn't catch this before. Thanks for feeding it to me. They don't even know the difference lol.

http://wikidiff.com/hydrolysis/electrolysis

Listen, it doesn't matter what the patent claim says. The patent is for "nanobubbles" (oxygenation). 

The actual process of electrolysis itself creates ozone as a byproduct, you can make very little with a low overpotential, or a lot with a high overpotential. 

This link explains that *no matter how pure your electrolyte, some O3 (ozone) will always be produced:*

http://www1.lsbu.ac.uk/water/electrolysis.html

*Q: How does it work? *

*A:* *The actual process is called hydrolytic electrolysis*. The O2 Grow emitter carries a positive charge on one screen and a negative charge on the other. *Once placed in the water, the emitter separates the water molecule into hydrogen and oxygen.* The larger hydrogen bubbles float up and dissipate into the air and the tiny oxygen bubble is so small it cannot break the surface of the water and is therefore reabsorbed back into the water, effectively increasing the DO saturation level.

This is also not true, because once the oxygen reaches maximum saturation the oxygen gets released. lol 

*AND IT STILL MAKES SOME OZONE

http://www1.lsbu.ac.uk/water/electrolysis.html *
There's the link for you again in bold, since you can't see past your own lies.

I'M NOT SAYING IT DOESN'T PRODUCE OXYGEN, OR THAT IT DOESN'T DO ITS' JOB WELL. I'M SAYING THAT IT'S A FUCKING WASTE OF MONEY.

But you know, since there are "flow through" (much better for commercial hydro) oxygen generators that do the exact same thing but much, much more efficiently that you probably shouldn't have invested as much into this company as you have.


----------



## dstroy (May 8, 2017)

Oh hey, this link also explains why salts precipitate out of solution and some of the side reactions that occur. lol this is so funny. You're about 1/2 way through the earth the hole you dug yourself is so deep

http://www1.lsbu.ac.uk/water/electrolysis.html


HAHAHAHAHAHA I totally missed where you said "I just went to that website" (o2grow) when the first time you posted about it was over a year ago AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

You must be their head of marketing too since your head is stuffed so far up your ass you can't see the truth.


----------



## J Henry (May 8, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> Are you a grower?....And Myasthenias Gravis (autoimmune disease) kind of makes having a job hard, along with the immuno-suppressant therapy administered for it. So...no, I don't have a job? Lol now answer my question. Are you a grower? Like, are you growing pot?
> P.S. You making personal attacks to avoid my primary question does make me come back...human nature.


Your MG sounds quiet advanced. When was your last pulmonary function test; what was your maximum inspiratory pressure, FEV1, FEV3?


----------



## J Henry (May 8, 2017)

dstroy said:


> I'M NOT SAYING IT DOESN'T PRODUCE OXYGEN, OR THAT IT DOESN'T DO ITS' JOB WELL. I'M SAYING THAT IT'S A FUCKING WASTE OF MONEY.


Eureka! Now you cooking, you finally got your real feelings out, I bet you feel a lot better now, You.ve been tied up in a knot about this thread for days. Your been boiling and upset because you think even the cheapest little O2Grow rig cost too much, at least too much for you.
I am chuckling out loud reading this. Yep, I'm laughing at you Bud... 

Oh, by the way, the O2 Grow device does not use tin oxide anodes.


----------



## dstroy (May 8, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Eureka! Now you cooking, you finally got your real feelings out, I bet you feel a lot better now, You.ve been tied up in a knot about this thread for days. Your been boiling and upset because you think even the cheapest little O2Grow rig cost too much, at least too much for you.
> I am chuckling out loud reading this. Yep, I'm laughing at you Bud...
> 
> Oh, by the way, the O2 Grow device does not use tin oxide anodes.


Now I know you're retarded. 

Cathode anode composition doesn't matter, all known alloys produce undesirable byproducts (ozone)

HAHAHAHA. J Henry is so mad


----------



## dstroy (May 8, 2017)

When your electrolyte (nutrient solution) has sodium in it, it can create chlorine and sodium hydroxide (caustic soda, lye) as well. Guess you didn't want to share that. 

https://www.electrochem.org/dl/interface/spr/spr06/spr06_p52-54.pdf

Lol


----------



## ALong14U (May 8, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> I think you put the wrong name in....you said I tried posting that earlier over the product I was promoting...I don't promote any product. And I do not grow organics. Nor does it fit the literature pattern of all of my 250+ posts on this site (cursing, personal attacks/character assasination, or even punctuation)...


I was talking about Henry's product. I just like the post about the hydrogen discharge into the air I think you posted in regards to one of his posts. New to the site could be mixing up names or quoting the wrong person. I know you grow with chemically derived nutes GH I think you said. I know you do not premots or sell any items here. Also know you don't grow organic. Sorry for the confusion.


----------



## J Henry (May 8, 2017)

dstroy said:


> When your electrolyte (nutrient solution) has sodium in it, it can create chlorine...


Oh Really, is that right?
Now how in the world can you split off Cl gas electrolyzing water that contains Na. I bet you failed basic Jr. High School chemistry. You got to be kidding me or you’re confused again today. I am really laughing at you now, my side hurts I’m laughing so hard.


----------



## dstroy (May 8, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Oh Really, is that right?
> Now how in the world can you split off Cl gas electrolyzing water that contains Na. I bet you failed basic Jr. High School chemistry. You got to be kidding me or you’re confused again today. I am really laughing at you now, my side hurts I’m laughing so hard.


You can read that link that I just posted. It explains that chemical process specifically. Guess you fail at life.


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## dstroy (May 8, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Oh Really, is that right?
> Now how in the world can you split off Cl gas electrolyzing water that contains Na. I bet you failed basic Jr. High School chemistry. You got to be kidding me or you’re confused again today. I am really laughing at you now, my side hurts I’m laughing so hard.


http://www.eurochlor.org/the-chlorine-universe/how-is-chlorine-produced.aspx

There is another link, commercial chlorine production using salt and water.

lol you're making this so easy for me


----------



## Logan Burke (May 8, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Your MG sounds quiet advanced. When was your last pulmonary function test; what was your maximum inspiratory pressure, FEV1, FEV3?


Inspiratory?...Really?...My last respiratory test was over 30 days ago, 60 days ago I had a sternotomy to remove the thymus. I'm only 21 years old, so it is quite an advanced state for the best MG treatment facility in the United States (UVA of Virginia; birthplace of MG's discovery) to tell me if I did not have the surgery, I would never work again, and even if I did have the surgery, I had a 50-70% chance of going into some form of remission; in which would be the only instance I could work anything beyond a class desk (am still in college nevertheless). Ontop of that, the results of the surgery can/will take up to four years to actually take full effect. So, for an esteemed cardiac surgeon to recommend open chest surgery to a 21 year old kid (me), yes I would consider that quite an advanced case of MG.
Now; You've evaded this question 3 times. Are you, Jhenry, a grower of cannabis? Just a yes or a no.


----------



## J Henry (May 8, 2017)

dstroy said:


> ...commercial chlorine production using salt and water.


You are quiet a little word manipulator and oh so smooth with that classic “Pivot." Now you changed your story, that electrolyzed water must contain more than just sodium to produce chlorine. Now the electrolyzed water must contain salt, like common table salt (NaCl) to make chlorine via electrolysis. Now that’s a PIVOT!
That chlorine gas is great for killing microbes. It was also popular in WW I, causes fulminating pulmonary edema, a bad, bad way to die.

A few minutes ago you shot-off a mindless bold statement saying,* “When your electrolyte (nutrient solution) has sodium in it, it can create chlorine…”* That’s really a dumb statement, of course that won’t work and will never work… no Cl with the Na.

I know no fools that would ever add salt (NaCl) to their res water and electrolyze the water even to increase the DO Sat and effectively killed all the microbes.

I believe you’ve smoked way to much dope this evening, your confused and will certainly get no boom-boom tonight.


----------



## Logan Burke (May 8, 2017)

J Henry said:


> You are quiet a little word manipulator and oh so smooth with that classic “Pivot." Now you changed your story, that electrolyzed water must contain more than just sodium to produce chlorine. Now the electrolyzed water must contain salt, like common table salt (NaCl) to make chlorine via electrolysis. Now that’s a PIVOT!
> That chlorine gas is great for killing microbes. It was also popular in WW I, causes fulminating pulmonary edema, a bad, bad way to die.
> 
> A few minutes ago you shot-off a mindless bold statement saying,* “When your electrolyte (nutrient solution) has sodium in it, it can create chlorine…”* That’s really a dumb statement, of course that won’t work and will never work… no Cl with the Na.
> ...


Stop changing the subject. Are you a grower? This would make at least the 3rd, I think maybe the fourth, time I've asked this.


----------



## dstroy (May 8, 2017)

J Henry said:


> You are quiet a little word manipulator and oh so smooth with that classic “Pivot." Now you changed your story, that electrolyzed water must contain more than just sodium to produce chlorine. Now the electrolyzed water must contain salt, like common table salt (NaCl) to make chlorine via electrolysis. Now that’s a PIVOT!
> That chlorine gas is great for killing microbes. It was also popular in WW I, causes fulminating pulmonary edema, a bad, bad way to die.
> 
> A few minutes ago you shot-off a mindless bold statement saying,* “When your electrolyte (nutrient solution) has sodium in it, it can create chlorine…”* That’s really a dumb statement, of course that won’t work and will never work… no Cl with the Na.
> ...


You apparently can't read. The chemical process is quite clear, I really can't spell it out for you anymore. Guess you're just too stupid to understand. Sad.


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## Logan Burke (May 8, 2017)

ALong14U said:


> I was talking about Henry's product. I just like the post about the hydrogen discharge into the air I think you posted in regards to one of his posts. New to the site could be mixing up names or quoting the wrong person. I know you grow with chemically derived nutes GH I think you said. I know you do not premots or sell any items here. Also know you don't grow organic. Sorry for the confusion.


It's all good bud, just making sure...perhaps I'm just grouchy today? Lol, my apologies man.


----------



## dstroy (May 8, 2017)

J Henry said:


> You are quiet a little word manipulator and oh so smooth with that classic “Pivot." Now you changed your story, that electrolyzed water must contain more than just sodium to produce chlorine. Now the electrolyzed water must contain salt, like common table salt (NaCl) to make chlorine via electrolysis. Now that’s a PIVOT!
> That chlorine gas is great for killing microbes. It was also popular in WW I, causes fulminating pulmonary edema, a bad, bad way to die.
> 
> A few minutes ago you shot-off a mindless bold statement saying,* “When your electrolyte (nutrient solution) has sodium in it, it can create chlorine…”* That’s really a dumb statement, of course that won’t work and will never work… no Cl with the Na.
> ...


http://purehydroponics.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Sodium-Accumulation-in-Hydroponic-Systems.pdf

https://cals.arizona.edu/hydroponictomatoes/nutritio.htm

Lol. You should do a little bit of research before you argue with someone who is much smarter than you.


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## dstroy (May 8, 2017)

It doesn't matter what's in the water when you electrolyse it. Any trace elements will react. That's where the precipitates come from, some are more toxic than others. 

Since your company didn't bother to research any of this like at all, water treatment with electrolysis as an antimicrobial step (ozone is good at killing bacteria) is typically very pure for the above reason.


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## J Henry (May 8, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> Now; You've evaded this question 3 times. Are you, Jhenry, a grower of cannabis? Just a yes or a no.


No, absolutely not today, or tomorrow or this week, because that is not a very wise thing to put on the internet in the State where I live. In the Baptist Belt of America many upstanding voters, politicians, preachers and school teachers are really opposed to recreational pot doping, growing dope, medical dope... any kind of dope. I anticipate no changes in attitudes or State Laws this year and Big Brother is always watching and listening. It's not paranoia it's just how it is in... my State today, that's all.


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## Logan Burke (May 8, 2017)

I am in the bible belt, have been on this site for 3 years...so no, you don't grow, and that's your best excuse as to why you won't admit whether or not you do. I'm from a law enforcement family, and that my friend, is a 100% pure excuse to not answer my question.


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## Logan Burke (May 8, 2017)

Or you are having issues with paranoia and distinguishing reality from your thoughts if you actually believe the government is about to raid your house over conversations on a public forum about growing weed...LOL.


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## Logan Burke (May 8, 2017)

I can put it in a much less "illegal" way to make it more comftorble for you though...do you operate a hydroponic system? "Big brother" can not use that as evidence of any wrongdoings and hydroponic farming is quite common in the US; so to refuse to answer is a confirmation that you don't grow anything but the grass in your yard.


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## J Henry (May 8, 2017)

dstroy said:


> It doesn't matter what's in the water when you electrolyse it.


“I'M NOT SAYING IT DOESN'T PRODUCE OXYGEN, OR THAT IT DOESN'T DO ITS' JOB WELL. I'M SAYING THAT IT'S A FUCKING WASTE OF MONEY.”

Like you said, this is the real stick in your eye about this thread.



Logan Burke said:


> Or you are having issues with paranoia and distinguishing reality from your thoughts if you actually believe the government...


No, no issues. I am older than you and I am not dying on the vine from a disease like you have. I have been around long enough to respect the laws of the land where I live.
How long have you had this debilitating disease?


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## J Henry (May 8, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> I can put it in a much less "illegal" way to make it more comftorble for you though...do you operate a hydroponic system? "Big brother" can not use that as evidence of any wrongdoings and hydroponic farming is quite common in the US; so to refuse to answer is a confirmation that you don't grow anything but the grass in your yard.


Is there something about No that you misunderstood?


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## J Henry (May 8, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> Or you are having issues with paranoia and distinguishing reality from your thoughts if you actually believe the government is about to raid your house over conversations on a public forum about growing weed...LOL.


Are you taking psychology in undergraduate school, chuckle, chuckle.


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## J Henry (May 8, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> I am in the bible belt, have been on this site for 3 years...so no, you don't grow, and that's your best excuse as to why you won't admit whether or not you do. I'm from a law enforcement family, and that my friend, is a 100% pure excuse to not answer my question.


Answer is the same and has not changed -- no.


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## Logan Burke (May 8, 2017)

So why are you on this forum if you have no experience growing?


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## Logan Burke (May 8, 2017)

And do not plan on it?


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## Logan Burke (May 8, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Are you taking psychology in undergraduate school, chuckle, chuckle.


Personal/character assasination is a way of deflecting attention from responding to the issues and/or questions at hand. So, everytime you make an insult, it is actually your ego trying to protect itself from any form of humiliation.


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## ALong14U (May 9, 2017)

Logan Burke said:


> It's all good bud, just making sure...perhaps I'm just grouchy today? Lol, my apologies man.


All good. Don't want people to be confused lol.


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## ALong14U (May 9, 2017)

J Henry said:


> Eureka! Now you cooking, you finally got your real feelings out, I bet you feel a lot better now, You.ve been tied up in a knot about this thread for days. Your been boiling and upset because you think even the cheapest little O2Grow rig cost too much, at least too much for you.
> I am chuckling out loud reading this. Yep, I'm laughing at you Bud...
> 
> Oh, by the way, the O2 Grow device does not use tin oxide anodes.


Instead of wasting money.......take a nylon stockings from the wife.......do it while she's gone so you don't get in trouble! Simply slide a 396 gph submersible pump into the stocking. Tie the end in a knot! Drop the pump I'd your Dwc bucket or tub.....and BOOM. As much oxygen as you need. Got my last pump used for 5 dollars..................


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## dstroy (May 9, 2017)

It doesn't matter what J Henry says, because there are scientific papers proving without a doubt that there will be side reactions with anything that is in the electrolyte. 

It doesn't matter what the electrode composition is. All of them still produce ozone, the chemical reaction that takes place is not up for debate. It is very well understood. What isn't as understood is exactly what other things get produced which is why on a commercial scale these are used for their antimicrobial properties (ozone) on pure filtered water. 

Trying to cherry pick things like ooooo NaCl is table salt and "I don't know anyone that puts that into their reservoir". It's in the tapwater, like everywhere. lol 

Trying to argue against proven chemical reactions. lol

Tries to say it doesn't produce any ozone, without producing any independent studies that say it doesn't (it for sure does).

Didn't say anything about the components being of chinese origin (they are). Or what the electrodes originally intended application was (nothing to do with touching food I'm sure). I bet they didn't spend the money for platinum/graphite though HAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

There aren't any product instructions on their website, but I'm pretty sure that they recommend that you keep your EC below a certain level because they know it precipitates nutrient salts out of solution (again another proven electrochemical process that he's trying to deny exists). lol

They don't own the patent btw, probably license it. I wonder if they'd produce the patent number if I asked. I bet they wouldn't.

Do you know why commercial hydroponics don't use this product?
a) It's ridiculously fucking expensive, and a waste of money.
b) It's cheaper to add venturi injectors that last decades vs. an electrode that needs to be replaced "every 1600 hours".
c) They have scientists that know that oxygenation of nutrient solution via electrolysis produces unknown (sometimes toxic) byproducts.
d) The air we breathe is generally considered safe, so why not use something that is free in a cheap manner to achieve the result you want. 

He's arguing up a mountain of evidence with.... nothing.


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## Logan Burke (May 9, 2017)

You are absolutely right Dstroy, I have been glad that someone can beat him at his own game over and over so other new growers will know this is basically a marketing ploy. I hope you do a grow journal, if you ever do I'll be following. 


J Henry said:


> “I'M NOT SAYING IT DOESN'T PRODUCE OXYGEN, OR THAT IT DOESN'T DO ITS' JOB WELL. I'M SAYING THAT IT'S A FUCKING WASTE OF MONEY.”
> 
> Like you said, this is the real stick in your eye about this thread.
> 
> ...


The fact that you said "dying on the vine" shows you don't even know about the Myasthenias Gravis that you googled about when I mentioned it. It's not a fatal disease....it CAN be fatal. Respiratory crisis is the closest to death it will bring you. Personally, I do not have or had any MG crisis events...my symptoms are just severe in my neck and arms enough that I can't work. Now, why are you on a forum for sharing experiences regarding the cultivation of plants, and in this specific sub-category, hydroponic growing if you do not and have not ever had any experience growing in any way? Unless you want to advertise and google all of your answers, and copy/paste from Wiki lol.
P.S. I've had this disease for a year and 4 months. I can tell you are trying to find a way to challenge the validity of such things to avoid the question of why are you on this forum? And bud, my dad was a federal U.S. Marshal and grandfather was the sherriff of my county...I know "the laws of the land". Posting "I grow weed" on a public forum isn't grounds for jack in a legal scope of view. Not even a little...like, not even in the slightest or close to...your age SHOULD make you more wise...


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## KryptoBud (May 10, 2017)

J Henry said:


> “I'M NOT SAYING IT DOESN'T PRODUCE OXYGEN, OR THAT IT DOESN'T DO ITS' JOB WELL. I'M SAYING THAT IT'S A FUCKING WASTE OF MONEY.”
> 
> Like you said, this is the real stick in your eye about this thread.
> 
> ...



You're a fuckin cunt! Why the fuck would you say something like that to someone? Upset that you've been proven to be a liar and thief? If you're so concerned and respect the law where you live why join a site about criminal activity? The only reason is to sell this $2000 piece of shit without paying to advertise. Congratulations on being the lowest for of human life. A thief, liar, and snitch!

*J HenryActive Member*
↑
I charge $200 an ounce
Bud, this looks to me like you are clearly you are selling dope for $200/oz on this site to me.... Advertising selling dope on the internet, hmmm. That's not very bright, that reaches into interstate commerce on the internet, that touched Federal Drug Regulations, red flags, people looking, shame on you... you may need a lot of good luck on this one after such a stupid statement.


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## HydroLynx (May 14, 2017)

Great thread guys. Skepticism is the sword of truth 

And I'm just gonna leave this here...


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## Logan Burke (May 14, 2017)

Lmfao nice HydroLynx!!


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## PetFlora (Jul 9, 2018)

Iv spent a lot of time researching this subject, and diligently hunting for an actual cannabis grow with ZERO result, I think it will work. 

The question is _is it worth it? _And I think that's a YES, too. Here's why.

I ve been saying it increases nutrient bioavailability, and here is the proof: https://www.just4growers.com/stream/...droponics.aspx

ALSO, smaller bubbles stay in suspension more than 4 hours, means you can eliminate a chiller, that alone means it could easily pay for itself. 

I think any negatives can be mitigated by only running it for ~ 3-5 minutes before and after each flood

So, if one is running say the OxygenGrow system (UC on roids) it's unlikely you would 'need' it for DO, but if it really allows for a huge reduction in nutrients , say with a 20 gallon rez (~ 6 pots)), AND, make the nutrients more bioavailable, OR, that because the O2 stays in suspension you can eliminate a chiller, it could easily pay for itself. But then there's a whole nother potential use- drinking it to keep healthy or get healthy

Comments


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## rkymtnman (Jul 9, 2018)

PetFlora said:


> Comments


are you J Henry's sock account?

don't you think if this pseudo science from o2grow increased yield by 2%, EVERY commercial hydroponic producer from apples to yams would use it?


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## dstroy (Jul 9, 2018)

PetFlora said:


> Iv spent a lot of time researching this subject, and diligently hunting for an actual cannabis grow with ZERO result, I think it will work.
> 
> The question is _is it worth it? _And I think that's a YES, too. Here's why.
> 
> ...


You buy it.

All of that other bullshit pseudoscience is bullshit.

Your "proof" is some random grow site, and the link is broken

You will never be able to "decrease" the amount of nutrient you feed your plants in any really meaningful way while being able to achieve the best results for a given space because you're taking away potential chemical energy and should see a proportional decrease in production.

You achieve the best results by:

1. Providing the proper environment
2. Providing the proper nutrients in the correct amount at the correct time

People have an extremely hard time with number one and that's where most of the yield problems are. 

People (observant people) generally don't make the same mistakes over/underfeeding for too long after a few grows because they begin to understand the feedback that the plant is providing them.

Until you master one and two, there is ZERO point in trying to add gimmicky things to your garden in an effort to increase yield.

Lets say that you have mastered 1 and 2, and then you decide that you want to try something. In this case, you know what you should yield without the equipment, THEN you can change variables and assign causality. But you can't do that, because you're not a master grower. I'm not one either.


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## PetFlora (Jul 10, 2018)

Of course this is all true, but,

I equate electrolysis to supercharging an already high performance engine (F & D or HPA)= 600/800 hp

Does anyone need 600 hp on the streets, let alone 800? But there's no question the extra 200 hp can be felt in the eyeballs and 1/4 mile times. Another engine example is replacing conventional oil with synthetic oils which do a much better job lubricating, and last far longer than conventional motor oil (though IMHO the filter still needs frequent changing)

Another issue for me is where I live, summer temps are 90*+ for 5-6 months. I was not able to keep the room cool enough and the HPA root chamber RH stayed too hot, causing all kinds of problems. But, the experience showed what ~ 100psi did to create microbubbles, which enhanced root hair development. Nanobubbles would likely not improve on that, but in a F & D rez?

Rez temps: we know the warmer the solution the faster DO dissolves. In my room, without supplementing with blue ice paks every couple hours, the rez temp easily exceeds 80*s, which I think you'll agree is not good. So, IF the nanobubble DO stays in suspension (said to stay for many hours if undisturbed) then I eliminate that problem by simply running the electrolysis on a separate timer for ~ 5 minutes to saturate a ~ 10 gallon rez after each flood. So, over the course of 4+ months of a typical grow, the electrolysis allows me more freedom to be away for 3+ hours at a time, AND eliminate a chiller, which costs as much as the O2Grow, though I think Dennis is a BS artist. Yesterday I reached out to Ed Rosenthal (High Times) to see whether Dennis told the truth about Eds O2Grow enthusiasm

Anyway, these are my thoughts.

As to reducing EC, don't you use far less than soil growers? I can get pistils @ < 400ppm and keep flower nutes @ ~ 800 ppm//1.2ish EC at peak flower, which is ~ 30% less than other mediums. No?

Here's one plant from my recent harvest. Note the small rootball, but it's loaded with super efficient root hairs. I flood every 2 hours and run either a water fall into stones, or a fountain fitting every hour on a 450 gph pump


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## dstroy (Jul 10, 2018)

PetFlora said:


> Of course this is all true, but,
> 
> I equate electrolysis to a 600 hp engine (HPA) to which a supercharger is added to increase to 800
> 
> ...



Everything you just said was complete nonsense. You can't compare apples to oranges, the drag racing analogy makes zero sense and doesn't correlate to anything plant related.

I do use less nutrient than some methods, but not by an appreciable amount 1.6EC.

The warmer the solution the faster the DO reaches equilibrium, not "dissolves", it's already dissolved.

An ideal, completely controlled environment would take you farther than adding this piece of equipment.

Yeah yeah, great, you grew a plant. How about a whole plant pic pre harvest? Does it look bad or something? 

I'm not poking fun, because I grew some shitty plants as well. But I learned from my mistakes from careful observation, which you seem to have a lot of trouble with and constantly look for bandaids to fix fundamental problems with your environment or nutrients.


----------



## PetFlora (Jul 10, 2018)

rkymtnman said:


> are you J Henry's sock account?
> 
> don't you think if this pseudo science from o2grow increased yield by 2%, EVERY commercial hydroponic producer from apples to yams would use it?


We both share the skepticism. i have searched diligently to find someone using it to no avail, BUT, my chief interest is rez temps and DO in suspension. Anything else would be a bonus


----------



## PetFlora (Jul 10, 2018)

dstroy said:


> Everything you just said was complete nonsense. You can't compare apples to oranges, the drag racing analogy makes zero sense and doesn't correlate to anything plant related.
> 
> I do use less nutrient than some methods, but not by an appreciable amount 1.6EC.
> 
> ...


Excuse me: Dissipates, not dissolves . 

Here she is pretrim


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## Logan Burke (Jul 10, 2018)

rkymtnman said:


> are you J Henry's sock account?
> 
> don't you think if this pseudo science from o2grow increased yield by 2%, EVERY commercial hydroponic producer from apples to yams would use it?



That's exactly what I was thinking myself Rky, that it reminded me of Jhenry, lol.


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## rkymtnman (Jul 10, 2018)

PetFlora said:


> i have searched diligently to find someone using it to no avail


so this tech is the best thing since sliced bread but nobody uses it? 

that "should" tell you something (I hope)


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## Logan Burke (Jul 10, 2018)

PetFlora said:


> Iv spent a lot of time researching this subject, and diligently hunting for an actual cannabis grow with ZERO result, I think it will work.
> 
> The question is _is it worth it? _And I think that's a YES, too. Here's why.
> 
> ...


Before and after each flood?...Are you referring to Ebb&Flow or Flood/Drain systems?...And leave the water to sit totally stagnat in between the 3-5 minutes before and after each flood? .Also, what do you mean drink it to keep or get healthy?...As in put your res water into your body?...I'm not sure what else to think 'Drink it to keep healthy or get healthy' would mean. If no one uses these devices then there is more than likely not enough research on the results of this device for anyone to objectively say it is beneficial, and I do not mean research about the biological and physics and chemisty the device utilizes, but the actual device itself, has literally no documented research by any professional that is willing to say 'I stand behind this device and it's producers'.


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## rkymtnman (Jul 10, 2018)

Logan Burke said:


> Drink it to keep healthy or get healthy' would mean


i think he thinks it would do something like alkaline water or water that has it's molecules "aligned" . aka snake oil.


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## Purpsmagurps (Jul 10, 2018)

lol what happened to just using air stones?


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## WeedFreak78 (Jul 10, 2018)

PetFlora said:


> Does anyone need 600 hp on the streets, let alone 800?


Yes.


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## WeedFreak78 (Jul 10, 2018)

Why does this keep getting revived...


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## mytwhyt (Jul 10, 2018)

I probably shouldn't comment in this thread because i don't use air stones and haven't used my new 1/0 hp chiller yet.. My grows have never seemed to have suffered from a lack of dissolved o2.. I'm only judging form the results i get from my highly modified waterfarm grows... I tried using one air stone in my reservoir, but found it added too much heat, and i took it out after a few days. I have to admit it was only a 5 gal reservoir for two waterfarms.. My waterfarms only circulate about 5-6 gals an hour each.. To keep down on the added heat i also don't use submersible or non submersible water pumps.. The drip ring in each WF is what i use to move the water from the reservoir.. Gravity returns the water to the reservoir..

I depend on the +/- 9 liters of hydroton in the waterfarms to keep the dissolved oxygen at a sufficient level... It's the surface area of the hydroton that adds oxygen to the water..I've never had any root rot.. I guess a couple pics of the WFs are in order.. here's a link in an attempt to avoid being hit with all the shit being passed around..

https://www.rollitup.org/t/sun-systems-lec-315-reviews.742794/page-12#post-12557511
https://www.rollitup.org/t/sun-systems-lec-315-reviews.742794/page-11#post-12522688

For some reason the second link comes out on a pic of a coco/perlite plant in the same room.. Scroll up to see the finished waterfarm plants..


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## PetFlora (Jul 11, 2018)

rkymtnman said:


> so this tech is the best thing since sliced bread but nobody uses it?
> 
> that "should" tell you something (I hope)



Nobody believed the steam engine (Fulton's Folly), or the horseless carriage... Let's face it, most of the population (including cannabis growers) are set in their ways, and don't care to think outside the box. The tech is sound, how much it will benefit cannabis is anybody's guess, BUT, it should replace a chiller for the same money, so ...


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## dstroy (Jul 11, 2018)

PetFlora said:


> Nobody believed the steam engine (Fulton's Folly), or the horseless carriage... Let's face it, most of the population (including cannabis growers) are set in their ways, and don't care to think outside the box. The tech is sound, how much it will benefit cannabis is anybody's guess, BUT, it should replace a chiller for the same money, so ...


You're stuck inside of a small o2grow box and can't think outside of it, there is no way that device can ever replace a chiller because it doesn't pump heat. Comparing apples to oranges again.

Why don't you just buy it instead of trying to convince someone else to buy into it?


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## rkymtnman (Jul 11, 2018)

PetFlora said:


> The tech is sound


you keep saying this and one sentence later you say you can't find anybody that is using it.

not sure if that qualifies as irony or just plain stupidity. 

like @dstroy said buy it yourself and show everybody in a side by side how great it is or isn't.


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## PetFlora (Jul 11, 2018)

Yes, that seems to be the consensus 

Her's an article that calls it into question, BUT, it does not include cannabis

http://www.just4growers.com/stream/hydroponic-growing-techniques/airing-out-the-truth-on-dissolved-oxygen-in-hydroponics.aspx


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## PetFlora (Jul 11, 2018)

dstroy said:


> You're stuck inside of a small o2grow box and can't think outside of it, there is no way that device can ever replace a chiller because it doesn't pump heat. Comparing apples to oranges again.
> 
> Why don't you just buy it instead of trying to convince someone else to buy into it?


"I" do not see my comparisons as _apples and oranges_, but you are entitled to your opinion

what doesn't pump heat?

the emitters only need to be on ~ 5 minutes after each flood, and even if the rez temps are higher without being cooled down and are ~ 80- 85*s way beyond optimal, the nanobubbles are said to stay in suspension (and not just by Dennis from O2Grow) until agitated (a flood)

So, yes I wiil stop bringing this topic up until I put one in use


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