# Electric Bill



## SirSmokealot55 (Aug 4, 2009)

Is there any type of electric filter that I can plug my cords into to mask how much electric that I am using?????????


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## Dirty Harry (Aug 4, 2009)

Nope. The electricity enters the meter first and flows into your home. There is nothing you can put onto your cords to cheat the meter. Tampering with your meter is a very big NO NO.

There are things that will tell you how much your using so you can get an idea, but nothing to give free electricity.


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## ZaVe (Aug 4, 2009)

The power company isn't the one who fucks you over.. 

Think of it like this.. Gas companies.. Each winter EVERYONE who uses GAS heating, their bill goes up. The gas company doesn't care, and it's not a red flag. They are happy you are using more, and paying for it.

Electric companies - THEY COULD CARE LESS. If you are using their power, at any amount. If you AREN'T stealing it, and are paying for it, they are happy.

BUT - IF the police get word of anything that's going on at your place, they can and WILL goto the power company to view your meter usage. ANYONE can do this, there is NO warrant needed.

Before I moved into my new house, I went to the electric company, and asked what the current monthly bill was at the residence I was moving into. They showed me EVERYTHING. When it went up, down, and the dollar amount of the bill.

In the summer people have central air, Air conditioners, pool heaters, pool filters, a LOT of other power consuming appliances. 

As long as no one gets a RED FLAG that your growing weed, your power consumption should not be a concern. Pay for it, don't steal it or try to 'cheat' the system.

PS, the average toaster oven is 1200WATTS+ , just to put it into perspective.


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## High&Hopefull (Aug 4, 2009)

L.E.D. lights are still new to the scene but I just bought one that is equal to a 400hps and it only uses 90 watts thats the equivalent of one light bulb


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## crazy7605150 (Aug 4, 2009)

how much that set u back .... and how good does it work


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## SirSmokealot55 (Aug 4, 2009)

thank you all very much I have the room to grow alot just wondering what I can get away with. I here people on here running 12 1000 watt I just dont see how they can do this and not get caught.


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## bulletproofhoodies (Aug 4, 2009)

you could drop like 1000$ on a generator and plug your stuff into that then its free


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## Mindmelted (Aug 4, 2009)

High&Hopefull said:


> L.E.D. lights are still new to the scene but I just bought one that is equal to a 400hps and it only uses 90 watts thats the equivalent of one light bulb


Keep on thinking that and you will not be disappointed.


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## growone (Aug 4, 2009)

SirSmokealot55 said:


> thank you all very much I have the room to grow alot just wondering what I can get away with. I here people on here running 12 1000 watt I just dont see how they can do this and not get caught.


police may access to your power usage, but much tougher to say 'that's a grow'
from pottery kilns to big entertainment centers - lot of electric being used for all kind of things


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## RickWhite (Aug 4, 2009)

SirSmokealot55 said:


> Is there any type of electric filter that I can plug my cords into to mask how much electric that I am using?????????


You can buy a generator - I'd use a natural gas model. Or you can stick to smaller lights and use light movers.

I wouldn't try to steal electricity if that's what you are suggesting. A lot of people just got caught doing that where I live.

But power use alone tells them nothing. If you stay low key and don't have 10 car loads full of teenagers pulling in and out of your driveway every day you can fly under the radar.


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## born2killspam (Aug 4, 2009)

You'll be paying atleast 5x as much/kWh running a generator, and if you live in the city I'd say thats a pretty big red-flag right there, I mean how do you explain running a generator when there is cheaper power in the wall..


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## JuicyBuds (Aug 4, 2009)

I don't see how a power bill is enough to give a reason for a search warrant, think about it like ZaVe said; there are a lot of things around your house that draw electricity, unless you're stealing power and not paying your bills I don't see how someone could use it against you. Even if they looked at the time intervals (if they could) and saw you were drawing X amount of current on a plant light schedule there is a lot of people with fish tanks, terrariums, etc. that use timers.


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## JuicyBuds (Aug 4, 2009)

SirSmokealot55 said:


> Is there any type of electric filter that I can plug my cords into to mask how much electric that I am using?????????


Yes, you can build a generator system using electric motors instead of gasoline. You would still be drawing current from your home power, but it would be a lot less. 
I saw an entire machine shop run multiple 3 phase machines off one 110v standard wall outlet using this method.


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## johnny961 (Aug 5, 2009)

Pay for your electric & u will be fine. There is no way an led will put out as much light as an hid as of 08/05/2009.


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## johnny961 (Aug 5, 2009)

+ I AM not 100% sure but i thought 3 phase was all 220v or more


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## skunkiefun (Aug 5, 2009)

Check this out.

Video Link: https://www.energyindependencestartshere.com/pages/KVAR-Energy-Controller-Video/9/

The product demo starts at 2:48

Product Link: https://www.energyindependencestartshere.com/products/Medium-Residential-KVAR-Energy-Controller-PU-1200/1/


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## born2killspam (Aug 5, 2009)

JuicyBuds said:


> Yes, you can build a generator system using electric motors instead of gasoline. You would still be drawing current from your home power, but it would be a lot less.
> I saw an entire machine shop run multiple 3 phase machines off one 110v standard wall outlet using this method.


Can I buy one of these perpetual motion machines on ebay??
Sorry but you'd be wasting energy using electric motors.. Just a damned thermodynamic law.. The rig you saw 'allows' you to run a 3-phase motor on typical 110V, and that privledge comes at an energy conversion cost too..


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## RickWhite (Aug 5, 2009)

JuicyBuds said:


> Yes, you can build a generator system using electric motors instead of gasoline. You would still be drawing current from your home power, but it would be a lot less.
> I saw an entire machine shop run multiple 3 phase machines off one 110v standard wall outlet using this method.


See, this is the problem with our current education system. LOL!

Not trying to bust your balls but that is incredibly stupid. You are talking about a perpetual motion machine. When ever you convert one form of energy to another there is always a net loss - never a gain. But I digress.

What you guys need to understand is that we no longer have 4th amendment rights because judges hand out search warrants like hot dogs at a ball game. All the cops need to do is say we suspect them for reasons x,y & z. The thing is not to draw suspicion to your self and not not get crazy with your operation. Cops don't like to waste their resources on small fish.


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## SirSmokealot55 (Aug 5, 2009)

I didnt want to steal anything first off. I just wanna be as safe as possible. I think Im gonna buy a few solar panels and call it a day. Plus they will help with the rest of the house as well thank you all for your input.


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## Mindmelted (Aug 5, 2009)

Solar panels are not cheap.My friend had his house checked out for solar,and to pay for a $200 a month electric bill it would cost him almost $60,000.So in 20 years it is still not paid for itself.


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## Green Cross (Aug 5, 2009)

bulletproofhoodies said:


> you could drop like 1000$ on a generator and plug your stuff into that then its free


Generator runs on gasoline, unless you're generating wind power or something. 

A small gasoline generator probably burns 150 us gal. a month x $3 a gallon = $450


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## Green Cross (Aug 5, 2009)

RickWhite said:


> See, this is the problem with our current education system. LOL!
> 
> Not trying to bust your balls but that is incredibly stupid. You are talking about a perpetual motion machine. When ever you convert one form of energy to another there is always a net loss - never a gain. But I digress.
> 
> What you guys need to understand is that we no longer have 4th amendment rights because judges hand out search warrants like hot dogs at a ball game. All the cops need to do is say we suspect them for reasons x,y & z. The thing is not to draw suspicion to your self and not not get crazy with your operation. Cops don't like to waste their resources on small fish.


Reps LMAO


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## Puna Bud (Aug 5, 2009)

let me try to educate some of you about electricity. First off get the fucking notion out of your head that as long as your electric bill is paid you're safe! That is straight up bullshit!!!! But perhaps it makes some of you 8 to 5 workers who grow a sense of security,...so be it! But here is the reality of the situation. You have an electric bill that has "spiked" over the past several months, I promise you that your electric company has already given up your name & address to the Feds as a possible indoor grower. Paying your bill on time has noting to do with your freedom.

Personally, I've been an outdoor grower for over 35 years. This year I was gonna try a few plants indoor. But without abusing electricity, where I live has the highest rates in the nation! On average my electric bill is in the neighborhood of about $275.00 a month!!! That's for a family of four, and not using either lights in either room. If I use the lights for the month and my bill falls in somewhere in the neighborhood of $325.00 to $500.00. Back in the 70's growing up on Maui, we use to run our electric metor in reverse on weekends to lower our bill. The electric company worker never noticed that we broke the seal & lock to the metor box. So come Friday night we'd pull it out. Then turn it upside down and slide the "buggar" back in it's slot and run it all weekend like that! Before going to bed Sunday night, put the box back in the proper way. Make sure it doesn't look like it's been tampered with. I did this for several years with no problem. But today's metor box locks are more secure than the old days.

As for generators,.. I highly suggest them too! What a wonderful tool they make. I have one too. I bought mine to help with my electric bill. Generators run the spectrum too. They have em in all shapes & sizes . Take your time when looking for one. I highly suggest you keep your neighbors in mind when shopping for your generator. Another words you don't want some loud cheap beast running in your backyard 24/7?
I truly worried about people hearing a generator even though I live in rurual Hawaii. So I spent the extra $$$, and got me the Cadillac of generators. I got Camouflage, Honda suitcase generator! Small, quite and camouflaged for outside use. Hands down it's anybodys solution to their problems. But the main thing is you folks need to stop thinking that paying your electric bill means security as far as feds go.

You, indoor growers might even do what one of you posted. Go out and convert your light setup from HID to LED. I truly believe LED is the future for several reasons,and number one being "no thermal footprints". Something everybody should consider. Especially the teenagers here who are doing indoor grow ops right under the nose of their parents in their closets. What happens when the FED seize your parents home?


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## born2killspam (Aug 5, 2009)

A buddy of mine had RCMP come to his door because his electric bill instantly tripled.. (He was in Thunder Bay, and cranked his poll heater in May-June because his granddaughter was coming)..
So an otherwise unsuspicious older guy with a friendly rep with neighbours got noticed and called on within 75 days of cranking the juice..


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## farmmefreddie (Aug 5, 2009)

*Here's a site that has instructions on do it yerself solar and wind energy,*

*"greendiyenergy.com". *

*They give u a half off special the first time u access the site. Reg price is $50 US dollars. I haven't purchased the plans yet and when I do I'm going to do it from a friends computer to get this discount hee hee. The utility company will buy yer unused watts if u have any remaining. So u can think of it as a steal *

*The info I've gathered is u can build yer own solar panel for less than $100. I've concluded they sell u the parts after u buy their plans? Not sure but thats what it looks like to me.*

*P.S. please let us know if u purchase? I'll update here when I do but for the moment I'm too busy with other grow projects till the end of 2009.*


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## z4qqqbs (Aug 5, 2009)

when i get my house im getting solar panels so i can rig my grow up to that and still not break the bank on power.


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## JuicyBuds (Aug 5, 2009)

born2killspam said:


> Can I buy one of these perpetual motion machines on ebay??
> Sorry but you'd be wasting energy using electric motors.. Just a damned thermodynamic law.. The rig you saw 'allows' you to run a 3-phase motor on typical 110V, and that privledge comes at an energy conversion cost too..


No, the 3 phase side actually had a fly wheel and the 110v motor would only kick on when the RPMS dropped below a set limit, also the 110 motor was very small, it looked like it was from a bench grinder and had a gear ratio system to provide for the 3 phase generator. It really only took a few minutes to spin up enough juice to run the whole place and then the 110v motor would come on for a few minutes here and there to keep the RPM's up.


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## JuicyBuds (Aug 5, 2009)

Green Cross said:


> Generator runs on gasoline, unless you're generating wind power or something.
> 
> A small gasoline generator probably burns 150 us gal. a month x $3 a gallon = $450


The gasoline part isn't the generator, the electric motor that generates the current is.


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## LowEnder (Aug 5, 2009)

Wouldn't it just be feasible to get a nice large diesel generator and start making your own bio-diesel for free?


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## GrowTech (Aug 5, 2009)

Volt * Amps = Watts = What you're paying for.


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## That 5hit (Aug 5, 2009)

yeah a good crock pot uses 250w min. and you would probly run that for 8 - 12 hrs


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## born2killspam (Aug 5, 2009)

So where can I buy one of these perpetual motion machines?? Seriously though, the 3 phase side won't be kicking out as much energy as it draws on the single phase side side.. What he has is a rotary phase converter.. Esentially a 3-phase phase motor being run on only 2 poles at reduced power, and inducing current through 3rd pole 120° out of phase as it drives the fly-wheel..


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## That 5hit (Aug 5, 2009)




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## MidnightJester (Aug 29, 2009)

Well I know this for sure every room in my house and alot of houses I have been usuallly in the range of a 1000w per room if stocked with electronic and that is a lower range number some are 1500w a room..A medium sized jacuzzi in the winter can draw 3000W-5000W a hour all day long so you can have decent amount of lights from the jacuzzi alone and not get that uptight but that is my opinion ~i~ If you need to you can slowly ramp up your use with bullshit electronics for a few months that draw alot of electricity then just turn them off and replace with lights then you cant tell the jump : )


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## born2killspam (Aug 29, 2009)

Its drastic changes that will trigger notice..


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## lumbo (Aug 30, 2009)

This thread will scare the pants off ya. I wonder just how many busts are from tips from elec co. Many larger companies are in the process of upgrading to "smart meters" which document usage down to the minute. Easy to spot a high wattage device coming online and dropping out each day at the same time.


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## born2killspam (Aug 30, 2009)

Smart metering does scare the fuck out of me.. If that came, I'd waste hydro just to keep the records off a 12/12 scale..


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## xXAfghanKushXx (Aug 30, 2009)

haha my mom asked me why the elextric bill was so high and i was like idk, she was like are you growing weed? that would explain it.hahah funny shit


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## YourUsernameHere (Sep 3, 2009)

Amerifags, you might wanna consider getting 230V (british/european) grow lights, and wiring them into your 208V circuit. In general, higher voltage=higher efficiency=lower power consumption. Thats why your water heater and air con probably run off 208V. (Here in the UK, we use 230V for everyday stuff around the house, then 415V for heavy duty stuff). If anyone knows america better than me, please feel free to correct me.

Anyone know if 2-phase power's cheaper, kWh-for-kWh?


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## Green Cross (Sep 3, 2009)

ZaVe said:


> The power company isn't the one who fucks you over..
> 
> Think of it like this.. Gas companies.. Each winter EVERYONE who uses GAS heating, their bill goes up. The gas company doesn't care, and it's not a red flag. They are happy you are using more, and paying for it.
> 
> ...


Who runs a toaster oven 18 hrs a day? LOL


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## Green Cross (Sep 3, 2009)

born2killspam said:


> Its drastic changes that will trigger notice..


If you put a jacuzzi in, do the cops show up, because you're using a lot more electricity? No


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## born2killspam (Sep 3, 2009)

Well RCMP did show up at my buddy's place due to his electric bill because he cranked his pool heater early in Thunder Bay to prep for his grand-daughter's visit that summer.. His bill tripled the typical for May-June, then the cops showed up July 12th IIRC


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## Yota (Sep 4, 2009)

I think this all depends were you live. In some states, im sure spikes in electricity will trigger some suspicion. In other states, cops are too busy. In California, feds have much more to worry about then some 400w closet grow. Keep everything in perspective!


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## born2killspam (Sep 4, 2009)

But a 400W closet grow won't trigger anything anywhere.. Even a renter who's landlord pays the bill could get away with that if they aren't otherwise wasteful..


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## fireduck (Sep 4, 2009)

you can reduce a chance of being spotted by splitting your big room into two, and run opposite cycles (watch for light leaks). so for 12/12 cycle it will be constant current draw throughout the day. for 18/6 it's not that good, but still gonna look less like a grow-related energy consuption

Also, if you do split room setup for flowering, you can get away with one ballast and two lights. just put a relay on a timer making it switch the ballast from one room to another. just make sure your relay can handle the voltage and current being drawn by the light bulb itself. never tried it in practice - just a theory


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## born2killspam (Sep 4, 2009)

Alternating schedules will only help that if you're smart metered.. If not, then the total will be the same at the end of the month..
And I suppose it might make the electric dial spin less suspiciously, but if the police are peeking at that, you're already burned anyways..


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## macwmv (Sep 4, 2009)

everyone says not to seal power but most big grows 50 to 75 1000w lights all steal power you just have to know the right people ......


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## macwmv (Sep 4, 2009)

this is a good read http://www.cannabisculture.com/articles/3268.html


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## YourUsernameHere (Sep 9, 2009)

Ok, heres an idea:
I expect there are two reasons people get busted for energy use:
1. Higher power consumption, as has already been discussed.
2. Regularity of switching. If you have a mechanical timer, the lights will switch on and off at exactly the same time each day
So heres my idea:
It would be fairly simple to make an electrical circuit which switches your lights on and off at random times. I don't mean completely random, but like, switch on at a random time between 7am and 8am and off at a random time between 7pm and 8pm. I might try to design such a circuit myself, and if I'm sucessful, I'll make a thread about it.


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## born2killspam (Sep 9, 2009)

Times only matter if you're smart-metered, and plants need expected light periods..


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