# Veg and Bloom Grow



## Cuebossa (Mar 18, 2012)

Hey all! Looks like my Veg+Bloom test thread was lost in the recent site crisis. For those just checking in, it goes a little something like this;

I was given a sample of a 1 part dry powder nutrient called Veg+Bloom. There was a buzz going around that this was what growers have been waiting for, A 1 part powder nutrient for vegging and blooming your favorite plant. It was cheap and simple to use, and best of all, produced big sticky results. It includes silica, aminos, and a vast array of other vitamins and such. I was given the hard/tap water formula and told to use with my tap water at the rate of .5-1tsp per gallon and plant in Aurora Roots soilless coco. So I did. And ohhh shit I grew the best bud I've ever grown  And this was my first run with this stuff! A 5lb tub will make 500-700+ gallons of solution that's enough for an army of green! 

my first run beginning to end;

day 1 12/12





8 weeks in 12/12


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## Cuebossa (Mar 18, 2012)

some nugs from a friend of mine running veg+Bloom in rockwool; I've seen dozens of batches from this guy and this run was absolutely en-crusted!

OG





Blackberry twist


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## AltarNation (Mar 18, 2012)

Looks pretty good... who makes it? Where can I find a spec sheet on it? What are the NPK values? How does this work?


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## Cuebossa (Mar 18, 2012)

It's made by hydroponic-research. Their addy is www.hydroponic-research.com. not sure what you mean by how does it work?


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## AltarNation (Mar 18, 2012)

Thanks for the link and info... disregard that question for now. 

16-10-30... interesting... not sure I understand how they can get away with that ratio throughout when others all have to switch it up. I don't know much about this stuff though.

This is synthetic, yes? Is it salt-based?


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## LaudanumRx (Mar 19, 2012)

AltarNation said:


> Thanks for the link and info... disregard that question for now.
> 
> 16-10-30... interesting... not sure I understand how they can get away with that ratio throughout when others all have to switch it up. I don't know much about this stuff though.
> 
> This is synthetic, yes? Is it salt-based?


I want to know more about this stuff too. Apparently the company is making formulations for the tap water of various cities. Already you can get San Diego formulated because that's where the company is based.


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## missnu (Mar 19, 2012)

I got some of this the other day in the mail. I haven't tried it yet, but as far as I can tell most people on the internet claim it to be awesome...I just want to be able to try it on a plant from veg into flower....the whole time...so when my next ones are ready for nutes I think I will give one this.


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## missnu (Mar 19, 2012)

that way I know it can do what it claims and go veg to bloom...although I have one plant that I know won't be able to have it in veg as it uses almost no freaking nitrogen somehow...it always needs some in flower though...


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## bird mcbride (Mar 19, 2012)

I don't know...I get similar results using MG for flowering plants. I use the spent water from my budders to feed my moms.


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## squarepush3r (Mar 19, 2012)

veg+bloom is more like a bloom only formula, the 16-10-30 formula is clearly meant for bloom, and it is similar to other popular name brand cannabis formulas from Advanced Nutrients, Canna, etc

My guess is they just assume people don't veg for longer than 1-2 weeks, therefore the actual makeup of the veg nutrient is not important (ie: you can use a blooming formula to veg just like if you used Dyna Grow Bloom or Advanced Nutrients Sensi Bloom). For people who do any significant amount of vegging over a few weeks, this formula will be incomplete.

Also, the price from what I saw isn't impressive, it equates to slightly less than AN costs if I did the maff right. ($20 / lb plus shipping?)


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## Cuebossa (Mar 19, 2012)

squarepush3r, it actually works very well for veg too. I have everything on the veg+Bloom now. Moms, babies, teens, all my flowering girls. They are all smiling back at me. Seriously man, not to knock the NPK ratios and all that but it just plain works. I can't imagine my plants being any healthier! I feeling like I'm trying to keep things from getting root bound and overgrown they are pushing so much lush growth. And dood, the price, it's cheap! I'm getting like 100 gallons for every pound, for 20 bucks..... Just can't lose bro!

So for my next test I am going to run a Super SIlver and Romulan cut side by side. I'm gonna cut back on the feed strength to 3/4tsp per gallon every watering and leach every 5th watering. I vegged these babies with veg+Bloom rite out of the clone dome and they are cranking and ready for 12s....here we goooo!


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## LaudanumRx (Mar 19, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> squarepush3r, it actually works very well for veg too. I have everything on the veg+Bloom now. Moms, babies, teens, all my flowering girls. They are all smiling back at me. Seriously man, not to knock the NPK ratios and all that but it just plain works. I can't imagine my plants being any healthier! I feeling like I'm trying to keep things from getting root bound and overgrown they are pushing so much lush growth. And dood, the price, it's cheap! I'm getting like 100 gallons for every pound, for 20 bucks..... Just can't lose bro!
> 
> So for my next test I am going to run a Super SIlver and Romulan cut side by side. I'm gonna cut back on the feed strength to 3/4tsp per gallon every watering and leach every 5th watering. I vegged these babies with veg+Bloom rite out of the clone dome and they are cranking and ready for 12s....here we goooo!


That's funny you have a bag of roots soilless in the photo because I had heard that stuff works really well with that blend in particular. Guess word spreads though and people catch on.


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## Cuebossa (Mar 21, 2012)

Roots is what was recommended and is also surprisingly cheap. I just topped the above girls and will try to update today. Super dark lush green growth.


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## ATooDope (Mar 22, 2012)

How old are those plants pictured above Cue? thinking of doing this for my grow.


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## Cuebossa (Mar 23, 2012)

like 2 weeks out of the cloner. I'm slackin on the picks at the moment trimmin on some . I harvested way more from my last run with these nutes!


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## ATooDope (Mar 23, 2012)

wow very nice cue! you got some beautiful girls there


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## tbyles (Mar 24, 2012)

these nutrients wit a hydroponic system??


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## Cuebossa (Mar 25, 2012)

thanks atoodope!

tbyles, I'm growing in the roots coco soilless


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## Cuebossa (Apr 8, 2012)

this is the plant on the right in the pic above. I'm using 3 tsp per 5 gallon home depot paint bucket. I used 1 tsp per gallon last round and they took off a little faster but I think I might have over done it a little. I called hydroponic research and they recommend feed feed water feed feed water @ 1 tsp per gallon but I think I am gonna stay with 3 tsp per 5 gallon and feed with every watering.


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## Izoc666 (Apr 8, 2012)

this plant looks very healthy ! keep em greener bro !


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## Cuebossa (Apr 11, 2012)

at this point, 3 tsp per 5 gallon, I think they are doing great. I know they are going to start to bulk out now and good thing because I like them this size. So with 3 tsp per 5 gallon I could prolly fill around 30 5 gallon home depot buckets with nute solution and feed around 3kw with a lb, that's crazy cheap. I'm not gonna lie, I'm in love.


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## Dalek Supreme (Apr 11, 2012)

+rep Cue
I am doin my first run Lucas GH Maxibloom and loving it so far.


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## Cuebossa (Apr 29, 2012)

Thanks Dalek! I've been running 3 tsp per 5 gallon this whole run without any flushing and things seem to stay really well nourished.


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## Cuebossa (May 3, 2012)

doing a flush now every 3rd watering. The aroma is outstanding.


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## likethegood (May 3, 2012)

damn this looks very good..I wish I could get my hands on the product.


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## Cuebossa (May 6, 2012)

get your hands on it. I am finishing up these babies in my second round and good lord do they smell! I'll get some pics up today or tomorrow


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## Cuebossa (May 8, 2012)

finishing up yet another grow using Veg+Bloom in Roots soilless mix. The flowers are frosting up and the leaves fading as I have been feed at .25tsp per gallon for the last 10 days.


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## likethegood (May 9, 2012)

stop teasing me!! lol ....So did you use the product for veg and flowering?


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## Cuebossa (May 10, 2012)

Yeah, I'm teasing myself at this point. These are so close to the plucking, they are smelling very sweet.


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## sdgrower (May 11, 2012)

They look great cue!What day are those in?
I used 5 grams or 1 tsp per gallon until week 3 of flowering and then drop it down to 3 grams or 3 tsp per 5 gallon week 4. I am in week 5 now and they are rocking.
cheers!


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## Kite High (May 12, 2012)

gonna compare this stuff to my Dynagro regimen...received the free sample as well...looks like good stuff


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## Cuebossa (May 13, 2012)

Sdgrower that sounds like an excellent schedule. 1tsp per gallon produces lush thick growth but I started seeing claw around week 4 so good eye on reducing down to 3tsp per 5gallon around week 3-4. The last two I ran were at 3tsp per 5 gallon the whole run.
Kite High I have used Dyna and I must say Veg+Bloom produces a finer quality finished product. At 3 tsp per 5 gallon which is what I did on this last run a 1lb container will make 150 gallons of feed for $20.


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## Kite High (May 13, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> Sdgrower that sounds like an excellent schedule. 1tsp per gallon produces lush thick growth but I started seeing claw around week 4 so good eye on reducing down to 3tsp per 5gallon around week 3-4. The last two I ran were at 3tsp per 5 gallon the whole run.
> Kite High I have used Dyna and I must say Veg+Bloom produces a finer quality finished product. At 3 tsp per 5 gallon which is what I did on this last run a 1lb container will make 150 gallons of feed for $20.


well it has a very tall mountain to opvercome as dyna has produced the finest smoke I have ever had


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## sdgrower (May 13, 2012)

If it is okay with cue would you mind sharing your dyna receipe?


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## Cuebossa (May 13, 2012)

Of course, I'm all ears.


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## Kite High (May 14, 2012)

Foliage Pro Protekt and Mag Pro...all three all the way through adjusting the FP and MP mls to the plants needs...no set thing as the plants tell me what they want...usually start out ot 0.6 ec to 1.2 ec in flower down to 0.6 ec end of flower in soilless minerally amended medium


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## PetFlora (May 14, 2012)

Throw out everything you've been brainwashed to believe about nutes. This formula is right in the ball park. About 2 years ago I began studying a DIY nutrient thread and came across these words of wisdom:

 _There are mainly two types that are based on former and newer scientific results.


_

_1. about 180 N versus 220 P, is the more recommended formula for a hot, tropical or not fully climate controlled and rather warm indoor climate (high light heat output). 

_


_2. 220 N versus 180K (could vary but for the sake of simplicity, I'll just reverse it, as it is damn close) for a cooler climate or if you prefer, growing conditions clearly under 20-25° C. 
_


_The actual need of Phosphorus is even much lower as commonly believed and in fact under 30 ppm. The sole purpose of higher P in any commercial formula is for better pH buffer and to differentiate various products in terms of making the need for different growing stage formulas credible. Up to 50 ppm and exceptionally 60 can be used to better buffer pH.

_
_Above that level (or let's say 80), Phosphorus and Calcium antagonism (the more P the more likely) is inevitable. I agree with the earlier statement (don't remember who said so), as it confirms what I have posted here earlier - that the for grow/bloom stage, a higher nutrient concentration for bloom stage should be good enough. Slightly higher K content and still the same low P ratio for blooming could be modified and do no harm, but most chromatic analyses I've seen aren't even justifying this.

_


_*mj plants are actually capable of being selective in their nutrient uptakes if you get in the ball park of their needs without being deficient or going grossly over board in nitrogen or calcium. They are not high maintenance like old high school prom queens. Many people say they are weeds. I would not go so far to say that but I will say they are very resilient.*

_


_*DTW VEG 2010*

*ppm*
Nitrogen 360
Phosphorus 55
Potassium 300
Magnesium 50
Calcium 200
Sulfur 65
Iron 10.00
Manganese 5.00
Boron 5.00
Zinc 5.00
Copper 1.00

*Ounces*

*Part A*
Calcium Nitrate 13.2
Potassium Nitrate 4.0
Ammonium Nitrate 4.9
Iron Chelate 1.35

*Part B*
Potassium Nitrate 4.0
MonoPotassium Phosphate 3.5
Magnesium Sulfate 6.8
Manganese Sulfate .269
Boric Acid / Solubor .368
Zinc Sulfate .291
Copper Sulfate.059
Ammonium Molybdate .002

Volume of Stock Solutions 1
Dilution Rate 100
EC 2.23
TDS 1561
pH 5.7
Total Salt Weight 2926 mg/L

Ratios
N:K 1.2
Ca:N 0.6
K 5.5

*DTW Bloom 2010

ppm*
Nitrogen 400
Phosphorus 80
Potassium 430
Magnesium 50
Calcium 120
Sulfur 66
Iron 10.00
Manganese 5.00
Boron 5.00
Zinc 5.00
Copper 1.00
Molybdenum .09

*Ounces

Part A*
Calcium Nitrate 7.9
Potassium Nitrate 5.7
Ammonium Nitrate 7.8
Iron Chelate 1.35

*Part B*
Potassium Nitrate 5.7
MonoPotassium Phosphate 5.0
Magnesium Sulfate 6.8
Manganese Sulfate .269
Boric Acid / Solubor .368
Zinc Sulfate .291
Copper Sulfate .059
Ammonium Molybdate .002

Volume of Stock Solutions 1
Dilution Rate 100
EC 2.23
TDS 1561
pH 5.6
Total Salt Weight 3117 mg/L

Ratios
N:K 0.9
Ca:N 0.3
K 5.4

These are simple DTW Formulations using just standard fertilizer salts. The only thing that you need to watch for is the calcium content of the Calcium Nitarte used. These formulation were calculated for calcium Nitrate with 15.5% Nitrogen and 20% Calcium.

These are 100 X concentrations. This means by using 19 ml per gallon of each per each gallom of mixed nutes you will be able to prepare 200 gallons of nutes in the ppm strenth shown. Of course this is stronger than needed with most drain to waste systems. For an example with misted cyclic aero the TDS is 250 to 550 ppm during veg and 450 to 600 ppm during budding.

The pH will need to be raised by use of sodium silicate. The pH only needs to be adjusted once with DTW as it will not change while awaiting use.

The beneficial effects of silicon (Si) are threefold: 1) it protects against chewing insects, and 2) it protects against toxicity of metals, and 3) it lessens moldy mildew caused by high humidity at night during budding. I recommend adding silicon (at about 0.05 mM) to DWT nutrient solutions, both veg and bloom. 

I typically use a minimum of 0.05mM (millimole) and adjust the pH up with moreif needed or down with phosphoric if needed. 

A millimole is 0.001 millimole of pure Sodium Silicate. That is (122*0.0001) = 0.0122 grams. However, most sodium silicate is sold at 40% or 0.4 mole per liter. That means there is (122*0.4)= 49 grams per liter in the typical 40% strength sodium Silicate. (49/0.0122) = (1000/X) so, x= [(0.0122*1000)/49] = 0.248 ml per quart of nutrient water. There are 3.79 liters per gallon so (0.248*3.79) = 0.94 ml per gallon that is roughly one teaspoon per each 15 gallons of nutrient water as there are 15 ml to a teaspoon. That can raise the pH up to a full pH point. Therefore I suggest that you start by adding just 0.05 mM (1 teaspoon per 30 gallons).

Sodium Silicate Type N Grade Liquid 1 gal. - eBay (item 130342021432 end time Jul-02-10 07:55:52 PDT) A life time supply._

So I decided that when I finish off my Dutch Masters Gold Grow & Flower A/B/Add.27 to switch to DM ONE + DM Potash+. I ran out of Flower first and started using Grow only. 


I have an RO system, which can save a lot of money on shipping liquid formulas. If I didn't have a full 5L jug of ONE I would get this product for my HPA +* 21st Century Flood & Drain* (link in signature). I took them out to do some house cleaning


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## Cuebossa (May 14, 2012)

Kite High, I have not tried that combination. What is a*

soilless minerally amended medium?​
​

*I can't wait to see how you succeed with Veg+Bloom. It is truly remarkable!


Petflora, very interesting read although I can't imagine applying all of that information in the little time I have for my garden


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## sdgrower (May 15, 2012)

Petflora,

Aren"t those fatman's receipes?


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## Kite High (May 15, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> Kite High, I have not tried that combination. What is a*
> 
> soilless minerally amended medium?​
> ​
> ...


promix hp with azomite, dolomite, and diatomaceous earth as my medium


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## Cuebossa (May 15, 2012)

Kite High said:


> promix hp with azomite, dolomite, and diatomaceous earth as my medium


Alright! I'm only using Roots soilless with nothing added(except Veg+Bloom) so hopefully you will get even better results! 
this one might come down tomorrow, the other is just ripening up. nice and aromatic!








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## sdgrower (May 16, 2012)

I would like to put that in my pipe and smoke it.


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## PetFlora (May 16, 2012)

sdgrower said:


> Petflora,
> 
> Aren"t those fatman's receipes?


They could be. That was the thread I gleaned this info from.


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## sdgrower (May 16, 2012)

I always enjoyed Fatman's info. Following his and other similar threads lead me to mixing my own nutes. A friend recommended veg+bloom and when I saw his finished result I decided to give it a try. More expensive than mixing your own, but much easier to use.


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## PetFlora (May 17, 2012)

It's all relative. The cost of all the raw ingredients to make your own (if you can get all you need without special license) is probably quite a bit more than the $100 cost for 5 pounds of V & B, including shipping. Hell, one pound should easily last me a year of constant growing, especially since I learned there is no direct benefit to feeding > 600 in veg > 800 in flower, at least when using HPA or F & D. AND, if it is in fact pH balanced @ ~ 5.8 without needing adjustment that saves money on up/down. AND, if it contains Si that's another savings


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## Vindicated (May 17, 2012)

Thanks for sharing your pics with us. I just hit up Hydroponic-Research, the company behind Veg+Bloom, and they are sending me a free sample. I'm curious how they'll do in different potting soils, but I'll pick up some Roots Organic 707 for the first run and go from there. Do you remember what week in flower the plants started turning yellow & purple?


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## sdgrower (May 17, 2012)

PetFlora said:


> It's all relative. The cost of all the raw ingredients to make your own (if you can get all you need without special license) is probably quite a bit more than the $100 cost for 5 pounds of V & B, including shipping. Hell, one pound should easily last me a year of constant growing, especially since I learned there is no direct benefit to feeding > 600 in veg > 800 in flower, at least when using HPA or F & D. AND, if it is in fact pH balanced @ ~ 5.8 without needing adjustment that saves money on up/down. AND, if it contains Si that's another savings


Agreed. I have used over 5lbs so far this run and still have a few weeks left. The plants love it and that's all that matters to me.


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## Cuebossa (May 24, 2012)

The plants love it and I love these flowers. This strain has never given off the sage/rose/incense smells it has this run with Veg+BLoom. It also shines in the resin department. Very excited to sample this up tonight!


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## Vindicated (May 24, 2012)

Hey guys, I got my free sample and I'm about to try it out on a new plant. I have the version made for tap / hard water. The directions don't mention anything about pH, but when I mixed a batch and tested the pH, I got a range between 7.0 - 7.5. Are you guys adjusting the pH or using it as-is?


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## PetFlora (May 25, 2012)

I am very excited to start using V & B.

Say hi to Hermie. He/She is going to be my first Veg + Bloom test. It was raised from seed in Dutch Masters Gold A/B + Add.27 + Zone + Silica, and grew in my 21st Century F & D rig, hence the Air Pot with lava rock.

Seed is from my F1 cross (sat/indica). The other 3 are females. I moved Hermie out of the main tent and into my starter/cloner closet about 2 weeks ago. 

I tossed together a hydro rig that is a take off on an Under Current. I used a cleaning tub, put 4 large Oxystones under the 1G AP, filled the tub ~ 2" above the bottom. I also hand water from the top every couple hours. She/He has been filling in rather nicely

This photo is the before shot. Ths morning, I will be replacing the DM nutes with V & G. Will post follow ups ~ every 7 days.

Damn in trying to get the whole set up in the shot I cut off the nice nug at the top


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## Redoctober (May 25, 2012)

PetFlora brought me here, and I noticed that in one of the first posts, someone commented that it is mostly a bloom formula and the veg and bloom are the same. I was wondering about this as well, but I can say that, I'm not sure about the whole veg and bloom ratio theory. I've done it both ways and haven't noticed a difference. I am currently running House & Garden, and the veg and bloom base nutrient mix is 50/50 the entire way through; it does not change. On the other hand, GH instructs you to alter the ratios of grow and bloom from 3:1 in veg to 1:3 in flower. I didn't notice a difference except for perhaps a slight bit more stretch with the H&G, but it could be my imagination. H&G gave me more robustness overall. I am very anxious to try the V&B now! 

Cuebossa, is the yield comparable to other nutrient brands you have used? I just started a thread about how different nutrient brands might affect the strength of the aroma which is why PetFlora pointed me to your thread. I have noticed slight differences between brands. I really like your description of how powerful it made your buds smell as that is exactly what I'm looking for. There's nothing better than sticking your nose into a jar full of Kush and having that Diesel, pine sol scent smack you in the face!


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## Vindicated (May 27, 2012)

I had to shoot Hydroponic Research an email about the pH. They were pretty surprised that my pH is was at 7 after mixing in their nutrients to my water. It's supposed to be like AN's pH perfect meaning it should automatically adjust to the correct pH, but they acknowledged it doesn't always work with well water or water that has a high alkalinity. They recommended I continue to check pH and adjust as needed.


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## PetFlora (May 27, 2012)

Out with the old:

Hermie has been removed from the clone closet, now outside. Upstairs in the main tent I have 2 plants in my hpa, and 2 in my 21st Century F & D: an older clone of the original mother and a F1 cross of said mother with Indica pollen. My original plan was to do an AB hpa v my F & D, but the genetic expression of the cross in F & D is > 85% Sat. She is > 3ft tall has 10+ side branches (all > 12") that currently make her > 2ft diameter, so comparing hpa v F & D using identical nutes is moot. What to do? Since she is crowding the finishing clone, yesterday I moved the clone to the closet and put Hermie outside. This opens the door for me to finish the F & D using V & B. Wish I had thought this through BEFORE dumping/adding fresh DM nutes Friday. Oh, well, looks like my avocado tree is going to get ferted.

Here are pics of Mother clone & Sat dom in the F & D pod


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## PetFlora (May 27, 2012)

Out with the old:

Hermie has been removed from the clone closet, now outside. 

Upstairs in the main tent I have 2 plants in my hpa, and 2 in my 21st Century F & D: an older clone of the original mother that is ~ 2weks from done and a F1 cross of said mother with Indica pollen.

My original plan was to do an AB hpa v my F & D using the same genetics. The 2 in hpa are expressing > 85% Indica, the cross in F & D is > 85% Sat. She is > 3ft tall has 10+ side branches (all > 12") that currently makes her > 2ft diameter, so comparing hpa v F & D using identical nutes is moot. What to do? 

Since she is crowding the finishing clone, yesterday I moved the clone to the closet and put Hermie outside. This opens the door for me to finish the F & D using V & B. Wish I had thought this through BEFORE dumping/adding fresh DM nutes Friday. Oh, well, looks like my avocado tree is going to get ferted.

Here are pics of Mother clone (left) & Sat dom in the F & D pod. After taking this pic I replaced the elbow with a "T" to expand nute coverage over the lava rocks

View attachment 2186478View attachment 2186479View attachment 2186480


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## Cuebossa (May 30, 2012)

Wow Petflora, Looks to be a very sophisticated operation you have yourself there. 

Here are some pics of the Romulan I grew in the ROots Aurora soilless mix with Veg+Bloom. I sampled this with a friend, an organic grower, who remarked that the flavor was better than any of the same strain he has grown 100% organic. The smell is pungent fruit with a heavy skunky background aroma. Very potent with expando effects. Stone was very heavy with sleep induction. 

I am planning on starting a PRO-MIX HP grow with the Veg+Bloom next.


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## PetFlora (May 30, 2012)

^^^^ You're getting me all excited. 

In just 3 days being fed ~ 640 ppms V & B the pistil clusters have exploded to medium marble size all over the plant. Today I mixed a fresh batch of V & B to ~ 800ppms (up from 640) also upped the flood time from 1 flood/60 minutes to 1/30 minutes during 10 hours of lights on

I will be posting new pics in my journal Friday. If I remember, I will also post here. 

My *21st Century F & D *is far from sophisticated, but _rockin it!_

It consists of an oxygenated outboard rez, low pressure pump and some pvc tubing/fittings. Bulkhead fitting in bottom corner of large Rubbermaid tote/tray drains nutes back into the rez. The pump is on a simple analog timer with separate knobs to set on time and pause time. Minimum on is ~ 23 seconds so I sized the rez accordingly, to keep pump from running dry. 

This lp pump will suck 3g in ~ 20 seconds, so there is a bit of slurping. 

*DownstairsClone*

The calyxes on the clone, using V & B for like 5 days, have finally started fattening up + a lot more pistils. So it appears I am 2 for 2. 

*Mixing V & B

*It dissolves quickly in RO water < 10ppms, but, I have noticed a very small amount of precip, no big deal, just lettin people know


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## Kite High (May 30, 2012)

PetFlora said:


> ^^^^ You're getting me all excited.
> 
> In just 3 days being fed ~ 640 ppms V & B the pistil clusters have exploded to medium marble size all over the plant. Today I mixed a fresh batch of V & B to ~ 800ppms (up from 640) also upped the flood time from 1 flood/60 minutes to 1/30 minutes during 10 hours of lights on
> 
> ...


in most probability it is either cal and sulphur forming gypsum or even more likely the silica reacting to the drop in pH while still too concentrated...try filling the container with ro then while stirring add a lil at a time it may eliminate this...keep 'em green


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## Cuebossa (Jun 1, 2012)

Funny as I have not seen any precipitation. I agree with Kitehigh, you will need to add the powder slowly to your final volume of water and use a pump or stirring stick to agitate the water. 

I am preparing to start my PROMIX-HP test with Veg+Bloom today and am excited to see things get going. I'll be running a Subcool hybrid, Jack the ripper and an old school selection of OG.


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## Izoc666 (Jun 1, 2012)

Cuebossa bring ProMix HP in and start run !! im interesting to see the result with Pro Mix HP. Nice job , sir with buds !

Happy growing and peace


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## PetFlora (Jun 1, 2012)

I am using RO water (< 20ppm) I slowly add 1 tsp ( a little at a time) while hand stirring with a slotted paint mixer. Again, no biggie

I posted new pics today in my journal.


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## jpockets420 (Jun 1, 2012)

I just ordered my free sample today. Can't wait to try this stuff and see what all the hype is about. Im getting samples in the mail like crazy. Now I have 6 different companies to do side by side's with


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## likethegood (Jun 1, 2012)

just received my 1lb going to try it out on my veg garden and on 2 bagseeds that are in flowering mood. Im hoping for the best. PS received my tube in 3 days!!!


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## kilo810 (Jun 2, 2012)

really want to try this and do a side by side with the Dyna Gro Foliage Pro


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## Kite High (Jun 2, 2012)

kilo810 said:


> really want to try this and do a side by side with the Dyna Gro Foliage Pro


will be doing just that in about 2 weeks


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## kilo810 (Jun 3, 2012)

Kite High said:


> will be doing just that in about 2 weeks


I like it.....


----------



## missnu (Jun 3, 2012)

Redoctober said:


> PetFlora brought me here, and I noticed that in one of the first posts, someone commented that it is mostly a bloom formula and the veg and bloom are the same. I was wondering about this as well, but I can say that, I'm not sure about the whole veg and bloom ratio theory. I've done it both ways and haven't noticed a difference. I am currently running House & Garden, and the veg and bloom base nutrient mix is 50/50 the entire way through; it does not change. On the other hand, GH instructs you to alter the ratios of grow and bloom from 3:1 in veg to 1:3 in flower. I didn't notice a difference except for perhaps a slight bit more stretch with the H&G, but it could be my imagination. H&G gave me more robustness overall. I am very anxious to try the V&B now!
> Hmmm....I used some botanicare sweet that makes the end product so smelly you can't take it anywhere with you without reeking...
> 
> Cuebossa, is the yield comparable to other nutrient brands you have used? I just started a thread about how different nutrient brands might affect the strength of the aroma which is why PetFlora pointed me to your thread. I have noticed slight differences between brands. I really like your description of how powerful it made your buds smell as that is exactly what I'm looking for. There's nothing better than sticking your nose into a jar full of Kush and having that Diesel, pine sol scent smack you in the face!


Hmmm....I used some botanicare sweet that makes the end product so smelly you can't take it anywhere with you without reeking...


----------



## kilo810 (Jun 4, 2012)

SO what were your overall yeilds per watt????Thats the other thing we all need to know. Is it worth my money?


----------



## Cuebossa (Jun 4, 2012)

It's worth my money. I'm growing my best head stash to date with enough to freely share with friends! I really enjoy having a better looking bag then I ever have with the added bonus of stink through the sack aroma. None of what I run is for "yield" but more for overall quality. I've done the big bud cultivars of most dutch seed companies and they don't hold up to the quality of the clones I have been getting from close friends these days. 

The PROMIX-HP+VEG+BLOOM test begins, starring OG and Jack the Ripper. I am switching over to the RO Veg+Bloom formula. I'll be watering every 4th day to start and bumping it up as the roots sprawl.


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## Redoctober (Jun 4, 2012)

missnu said:


> Hmmm....I used some botanicare sweet that makes the end product so smelly you can't take it anywhere with you without reeking...


 Nice! I'll have to try some of that. Do you use it all throughout flower, or just at the end?


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## Redoctober (Jun 4, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> Alright! I'm only using Roots soilless with nothing added(except Veg+Bloom) so hopefully you will get even better results! this one might come down tomorrow, the other is just ripening up. nice and aromatic!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Beautiful plants Cuebossa! What strain is that? I love how the leaves changed from green to that deep purple color in the last week: stunning to look at. 

Did I hear that V&B was coming out with an experimental formula with an additive or two more than what's in the current V&B?


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## BrandonT (Jun 4, 2012)

*this seems too good to be true, i wont pay a penny untill i see a trusted member testing this product

seems like a sales pitch, i wouldnt buy in unless you try the same; or atleast get the free sample

but its not my money ;P*


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## semor90 (Jun 5, 2012)

hahahah the truth has come out. now get the fuck off RIU trying to sell this non sense. 

peace


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## Kite High (Jun 5, 2012)

semor90 said:


> hahahah the truth has come out. now get the fuck off RIU trying to sell this non sense.
> 
> peace


andagain


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## semor90 (Jun 5, 2012)

Kite High said:


> andagain


go fly your kite bud. its windy out.


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## 711grower (Jun 5, 2012)

i was given some by my grow shop to actualy run a test run of the product. i am using it on 2 different strains i grow. so far i like the product. i am growing a few in coco and one in soil. the grow shop is considering carrying the product but wont until i run it through a full cycle. the owner wants a product that is easy to use for new growers. the product mixes very easy and phs to a near perfect 5.9 everytime. i left some in a resevoir for a week and the ph was still dead on. i have emailed hydroponic research several times and each time i received a quick reponse. i always appreciate good customer service. my plants are a week in vedge and look great. then again anything i grow seems to look great in vedge. its to early for me to give a real review of the product but so far its really easy to use and is supporting vedge perfectly. now mind you i typically hate anything associated with this industry. you simply dont need expensive bottles to grow beautiful ripe lucious fruit. i usually grow in soil using dynamite time released fertilizer and some organics. my average cost for fertilizer per plant is about 5 bucks and i yield at least a qp per plant with out sacrifice in quality. i look forward to seeing the real results in flower.


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## semor90 (Jun 5, 2012)

Ok so why is cuebossa trying to act like he is not involved with the company ? Its obvious he is marketing this product on all the online communities and his only intension of being in these communities(RIU,GC,ICMAG,THCfarmer) is to advertise and sell this product ? Thats just all shady bizzness this company lost all respect and hopefully everyone sees what this company is all about.


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## 711grower (Jun 5, 2012)

did i miss something ? when was it found out cuebossa was trying to market this product ? personally cuebosas plants look descent but the yield is nothing to write home about. no offense. you would think he would show some monster yielding bitches if he was trying to fool the community here


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## likethegood (Jun 5, 2012)

DAMN IT!!!!! I hope I didnt get robbed ahhhhh.......well I guess ill find out...I am currently using it on 2 bagseeds and on my vegetable garden. Ill keep posted on the results


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## likethegood (Jun 5, 2012)

oh and ps I actually bought a 1lb tub.....


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## PetFlora (Jun 5, 2012)

BrandonT said:


> *this seems too good to be true, i wont pay a penny untill i see a trusted member testing this product
> 
> seems like a sales pitch, i wouldnt buy in unless you try the same; or atleast get the free sample
> 
> but its not my money ;P*


I got a sample a couple weeks ago. Started in my 21st Century F & D which was in early flower with my F 1 cross. I was/am very impressed at the fast (and big) bud development. About 5 days later I began using it on a slow budding clone. It took a few days, but since then, this clone has really taken off. 

If you've been growing long enough, you will realize that most nutes sold to mj growers is overpriced and over-hyped. Veg + BLOOM allows anyone to get really good results without spending a small fortune on complex nutes: I am coming off using the full DM Gold line. Results were always good, certainly no better, and from what I am seeing V & B is far superior.

I've been talking it up in my journal, where you can see how good it is so far.


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## Cuebossa (Jun 5, 2012)

I don't care if anyone buys this product. I do care about the craft and am excited to share something that has helped me succeed. I feel gratified knowing that if anyone were to follow my exact growing procedure, that which I have demonstrated on the previous pages, they will obtain the same results. I will continue to post results as my journey continue.


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## semor90 (Jun 5, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> I don't care if anyone buys this product. I do care about the craft and am excited to share something that has helped me succeed. I feel gratified knowing that if anyone were to follow my exact growing procedure, that which I have demonstrated on the previous pages, they will obtain the same results. I will continue to post results as my journey continue.


HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHA your full of it bro. You can play all these people for fools but your not fooling anyone. The only reason you are on RIU is to put your product out in the MMJ industry. On each forum all your post are only on your threads about this product. seems kinda strange to me you have nothing to contribute to the community other than your product. just my 2 cents.


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## kilo810 (Jun 5, 2012)

See I need to know what the yeild is to know if its worth my time. I have 4 patients that I care for and they go through quite a bit, (insomnia, Cancer, and severe abdominal issues). So not knowing if its going to produce what I need to have is kind of a bust for me. They look great yes. but I have been able to do great things with a mix of green planet and dyna gro. Would I like to make things easier yes of course who doesn't. But the information is crucial.


----------



## kilo810 (Jun 5, 2012)

kilo810 said:


> See I need to know what the yeild is to know if its worth my time. I have 4 patients that I care for and they go through quite a bit, (insomnia, Cancer, and severe abdominal issues). So not knowing if its going to produce what I need to have is kind of a bust for me. They look great yes. but I have been able to do great things with a mix of green planet and dyna gro. Would I like to make things easier yes of course who doesn't. But the information is crucial.


Shit! Id use fox farm if they could just manage to make the trichs better but its only standard with thier nutes at the current moment. LOL


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## Cuebossa (Jun 5, 2012)

*kilo810,semor90* what products do you recommend? have you done any full documented grows with these in different mediums? This is all I'm doing here. You see, growing cannabis is a passion for me. So much so that I enjoy sharing my results here. If you can't appreciate the efforts I have exerted than please leave, If you have anything productive to contribute then please continue to post.


----------



## semor90 (Jun 5, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> *kilo810,semor90* what products do you recommend? have you done any full documented grows with these in different mediums? This is all I'm doing here. You see, growing cannabis is a passion for me. So much so that I enjoy sharing my results here. If you can't appreciate the efforts I have exerted than please leave, If you have anything productive to contribute then please continue to post.


I won't leave this post until everyone sees that you are indirectly advertising your product. I recommend Super Soil created by subcool. So tell me why that all your post are ONLY about veg+bloom on your own thread? I highly doubt someone is going to join a forum and only post about 1 thing and not contribute anything else. And you don't post any techniques to your grows other than your generic pictures and rave and rant about veg+bloom. 


Just leave RIU and advertise else where. You are the cancer that is exactly what this community does not need.

peace


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## likethegood (Jun 5, 2012)

I just hope that* Cuebossa * is legit and as well as the product. My veggies and my babies so fare seem to be ok. I have added only twice.


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## kilo810 (Jun 5, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> *kilo810,semor90* what products do you recommend? have you done any full documented grows with these in different mediums? This is all I'm doing here. You see, growing cannabis is a passion for me. So much so that I enjoy sharing my results here. If you can't appreciate the efforts I have exerted than please leave, If you have anything productive to contribute then please continue to post.


Jeeze bro I wasn't hating on you or anything. LOL you got some testicular torsion or something going on that we need to know about? I was just saying that Yeild info is kind of a must for some of us that produce for patients, especially for patients that use on a very regular basis. I love growing as well. I have had done plenty of my own research but nothing posted on here. I will on the next grow tho just for you. LOL If your going to share info, share it all. Yeilds included. Your plants look great and the nugs do too. I want to try nthis product but I need to make sure its worth my time before I invest my space for it. money is no problem its the space of plants that I am concerned about. I dont want to waste 2x2 area of my 6x6 grow zones on a plant that isn't going to produce enough to keep my patients stocked. 

Im just asking questions and if we can't get all the answers then I can't waste my time at the current moment. In the future maybe I can spare the space but as of now I have to see solid results not flakey info in order to try this. Not hating man, just asking questions


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## kilo810 (Jun 5, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> *kilo810,semor90* what products do you recommend? have you done any full documented grows with these in different mediums? This is all I'm doing here. You see, growing cannabis is a passion for me. So much so that I enjoy sharing my results here. If you can't appreciate the efforts I have exerted than please leave, If you have anything productive to contribute then please continue to post.


As for my recommendations, Dyna Gro Foliage Pro-veg, dyna gro grow/bloom 50/50-flower with massive and liquid w8 from green planet. thats it. I use Humbolt organics soil, or ocean forrest. I have done roots organics and it worked great. Thinking about getting more for the next cycle.


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## missnu (Jun 5, 2012)

I've been a member for a long time and am not selling anything and it is a pretty good nute...I didn't get that great of results, but I was using a whole lot of different things at the time...I see this thread and I want to give it a shot again now that i am using coco


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## kilo810 (Jun 5, 2012)

And for the record I have done 3 grows with the structure posted above all highly successful. I have been experimenting with different products for the last 2 years. But for the last 6 months my demends have been so high that I have to go with what works, If they can give all the info I may try it but other than that I cant waste my time.


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## kilo810 (Jun 5, 2012)

missnu said:


> I've been a member for a long time and am not selling anything and it is a pretty good nute...I didn't get that great of results, but I was using a whole lot of different things at the time...I see this thread and I want to give it a shot again now that i am using coco


What all were you using? I thought this just came out. First time I have heard of it.


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## TogTokes (Jun 5, 2012)

I ordered some and it did fantastic to be honest.. 14 large bags, took only 2 weeks too arrive.


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## kilo810 (Jun 5, 2012)

TogTokes said:


> I ordered some and it did fantastic to be honest.. 14 large bags, took only 2 weeks too arrive.


HUH? 14 large bags? it comes in a plastic box 5lbs or 1 lb.


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## ScoobyDoobyDoo (Jun 5, 2012)

kilo810 said:


> Go back to your AN threads you troll. You obviously have no business being in here AN fanboy, We are all trying to learn abou this new product and I highly doubt your will to move off your AN line of nutes to try anything else. So please stop with the constant harassment. I have left you alone now to bask in your highly overpriced nutrients and I would respect it if you did the same.


funny how you attack. i actually use House and Garden in soil with a humisoil tea. nice try though. you should go tell collective gardener, lordjin, and some other very experienced growers what you think of AN. i'm sure they really want to hear what you have to say about AN since you have so much experience and knowledge about growing. i mean it's obvious based on your plant pics (wait...you have none) and the recent threads and posts you have begging for advice from everyone.


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## missnu (Jun 5, 2012)

kilo810 said:


> What all were you using? I thought this just came out. First time I have heard of it.


I got my sample probably 4 months ago or better...I use some botanicare nutes, some canna nutes, some organic amendments, some organic liquid additives, and for a bit I used some Veg + Bloom.... I am going to try it again as I said, now that I am using coco...then again my plants in coco with canna nutes look like his pics, so just like with most nutes and soil blends all items of a certain quality are similar amongst the difference brands...


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## ScoobyDoobyDoo (Jun 5, 2012)

missnu said:


> I got my sample probably 4 months ago or better...I use some botanicare nutes, some canna nutes, some organic amendments, some organic liquid additives, and for a bit I used some Veg + Bloom.... I am going to try it again as I said, now that I am using coco...then again my plants in coco with canna nutes look like his pics, so just like with most nutes and soil blends all items of a certain quality are similar amongst the difference brands...


the most experienced grower that i actually know swears by canna nutes in coco. i've been in his room a million times and he's probably taught me a ton of stuff over the years. he switched to coco about 18 months ago from an organic soil mix he would make. he uses a humisoil tea as well but absolutely loves canna nutes in coco.


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## missnu (Jun 5, 2012)

I had sent random requests for samples to all the larger nute companies and just anything that could get me free samples for plants...but then it was like christmas at my house and I had all these things to try, and I had new plants..so on and so forth...anyway I tried it a few times and nothing went wrong...


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## kilo810 (Jun 5, 2012)

ScoobyDoobyDoo said:


> funny how you attack. i actually use House and Garden in soil with a humisoil tea. nice try though. you should go tell collective gardener, lordjin, and some other very experienced growers what you think of AN. i'm sure they really want to hear what you have to say about AN since you have so much experience and knowledge about growing. i mean it's obvious based on your plant pics (wait...you have none) and the recent threads and posts you have begging for advice from everyone.


What are you talking about. I asked about Hi N Pro. yes. because its only available in 55 gallon drums and was wondering if its worth my money and time. HMMM. seem like I know a bit more than you give me credit for considering I have investors trying to set up a medical grow facility for me. SO yes Im looking at Nutes in bulk that aren't going to kill my pocket book. I have had questions in the past like last year. but its all good now. SO yea stop with the harassment and you've been reported.


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## missnu (Jun 5, 2012)

ScoobyDoobyDoo said:


> the most experienced grower that i actually know swears by canna nutes in coco. i've been in his room a million times and he's probably taught me a ton of stuff over the years. he switched to coco about 18 months ago from an organic soil mix he would make. he uses a humisoil tea as well but absolutely loves canna nutes in coco.


Well for real the plants in Coco with the Canna nutes look freaking awesome and it is my first time using coco..I mean I have used soil for a while, but no experience with coco at all..but I must say they look awesome!


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## ScoobyDoobyDoo (Jun 5, 2012)

missnu said:


> Well for real the plants in Coco with the Canna nutes look freaking awesome and it is my first time using coco..I mean I have used soil for a while, but no experience with coco at all..but I must say they look awesome!


what do you pH your coco at? i use soiless basically. sunshine #4 with worm castings and a little lime. after this harvest i've gotta change some things around to the rooms so i'm gonna try coco as well with H&G's coco 2 part. also gonna try my sunshine mix with 30% coco added. i love sunshine but the only complaint i have is i think it's a little perlite heavy. dries out too quickly. wanna see how it does with a little coco added. should be fun...side by side with coco and sunshine/coco.


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## sdgrower (Jun 5, 2012)

semor90 said:


> *
> 
> I won't leave this post until everyone sees that you are indirectly advertising your product. I recommend Super Soil created by subcool. So tell me why that all your post are ONLY about veg+bloom on your own thread? I highly doubt someone is going to join a forum and only post about 1 thing and not contribute anything else. And you don't post any techniques to your grows other than your generic pictures and rave and rant about veg+bloom.
> 
> ...


Who nominated you defender of roll it up? Haven't seen trolling this bad in awhile. veg+bloom works okay. Not the best not the worst. 
Let it go and smoke a dab to relax.


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## kilo810 (Jun 5, 2012)

So I take it we aren't getting any numbers? Oh well i suppose.


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## semor90 (Jun 5, 2012)

Yea your loss not mine. Sounds like this product licks balls. The only person saying it is amazing is the douche trying to sell it. He's obviously lying about who he is. And sdgrower go buy 100lbs of it you sound like a really educated. Person


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## Edgar9 (Jun 5, 2012)

Ok, here's the deal. 

1. After speaking with the owner of Hydroponic Research months ago about RIU in particular, even before the VB thread was created, I can assure you that he is not on this board. If he was he wouldn't get into a pissing match about his product. The guy has put his life into his business and with a strong foothold in his local area he not only doesn't want to expand too quickly but wouldn't stoop to the level that this thread has become. It's just not logical. He doesn't need exposure from a few growers on RIU, his business is doing fine.
2. The shit is nuclear. I used a tsp and it burned. I've switched to a 1/4 tsp per week and my mad scientist love it in veg.
3. The stuff is free. I don't know how the above poster can say it "licks balls" when I received my free sample and now don't have to buy nutes. I guess we'll have to see how it does in flower but I can tell you that after speaking with the owner I have no concerns.
4. The stuff is simple and cheap. If it does work out I must say it's a hell of a lot easier than the RF Success and a lot cheaper too. 
5. In conclusion I can say that this is free product that was sent to me as a sample by an owner that has demonstrated excellent customer service and so far a great product. Not sure what all of the oliver stone conspiracy theory stuff is all about but I will be sure to give a complete review when the time comes.


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## ScoobyDoobyDoo (Jun 5, 2012)

Edgar9 said:


> Ok, here's the deal.
> 
> 1. After speaking with the owner of Hydroponic Research months ago about RIU in particular, even before the VB thread was created, I can assure you that he is not on this board. If he was he wouldn't get into a pissing match about his product. The guy has put his life into his business and with a strong foothold in his local area he not only doesn't want to expand too quickly but wouldn't stoop to the level that this thread has become. It's just not logical. He doesn't need exposure from a few growers on RIU, his business is doing fine.
> 2. The shit is nuclear. I used a tsp and it burned. I've switched to a 1/4 tsp per week and my mad scientist love it in veg.
> ...


well said...makes me wanna try a sample.


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## sdgrower (Jun 5, 2012)

semor90 said:


> Yea your loss not mine. Sounds like this product licks balls. The only person saying it is amazing is the douche trying to sell it. He's obviously lying about who he is. And sdgrower go buy 100lbs of it you sound like a really educated. Person


And you're such a help to the community! I love getting advice from someone on his second grow. First since you were 15 right?


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## Vindicated (Jun 6, 2012)

I started feeding my house plants in the front yard .25 tsp / gallon following the directions on the package and they're all doing really good. Although I think it leeches to fast in my garden's soil to keep using it there, but I do like it for my container plants. I haven't burned any plants yet; knock on wood. It lowers pH, but in my case it's not lowering it enough. Support is hit or miss too. They answered all my initial questions, but never responded to several follow up emails. To be fair, I never bothered to call them. 

I loved that Hydroponic Research didn't make me pay for shipping on their free sample. And they didn't require it to be delivered to a hydro store. Also the free sample I got was actually their one pound tub, which retails on their website for $19.95. So even if all it does it equal my existing nutrients. I'm stoked. It's free fertilizer!


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## Cuebossa (Jun 6, 2012)

Redoctober said:


> Beautiful plants Cuebossa! What strain is that? I love how the leaves changed from green to that deep purple color in the last week: stunning to look at.
> 
> Did I hear that V&B was coming out with an experimental formula with an additive or two more than what's in the current V&B?


Hey there Redoctober. The strain turned out to be Chernobyl by Subcool. It was given to me as Super Silver but later determined Chernobyl. It has an amazing floral incense sage fragrance and very energetic buzz. I would guess I yielded 60-70 grams or so. The resulting nugs were saturated in sugar and a pure pleasure to burn. The coloration was very cool toward the end of it's cycle. I'm not sure about what V+B has in the pipeline but am very happy with my current results. I'll try to get some pics up tonight of my PROMIX-HP ladies. On that note are there any PROMIX-HP users in here? I'd love to get some feedback on watering schedules as I believe this hold 2-3x the water that the Aurora mix. thanks in advance everyone!


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## PetFlora (Jun 6, 2012)

Wow.

My experiment of switching from DM Gold to HR Vg + BLOOM is paying off already. I used a 4" magnifying glass to look closely at all 3 systems. Only the hpa is still getting DM Gold ONE Grow + Potash+. Both systems getting V & B now (~ 2 weeks) have ~ 5% trics, whereas the hpa < 1%.

Now this could simply be a matter of me not having added enough Potash+. I didn't want to over do it, so I just bumped the 5g rez with an other 6mls of Potash+: that may still not be enough 

Even if doing this jump starts the trics, V & B is so much easier all the way around. 

I ordered a pound today


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## jpockets420 (Jun 6, 2012)

it only took 5 days for my sample to get here! They too gave me the one pound container. I am going to use it with my sativa strain that is already on week 5 of flower. It is a 14-20 week strain so switching now should be ok. I am running this side by side with my sensi star which I use Jungle Juice Micro/Bloom Lucas formula with Bloombastic and Bud candy as supplements. I also add cal/mag every two weeks to the sensi star. There is really no comparison at the moment as the sensi is already flowering nicely while the sativa is taking its time like sativa's normally do. If you want to keep up with my journal follow this link...and thanks for the introduction to this nutrient company Cuebossa. I have a feeling I am going to like it!

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/527489-first-grow-journal-super-skunk.html


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## jimmy1life (Jun 6, 2012)

OK animosity vitamins and silca what else would be needed spittle kelp or seaweed supplement. It probally stop all beneficial bacteria instintly right Idk I like G h rapid start would it be OK to mix.


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## jimmy1life (Jun 6, 2012)

Aminos. Animosity LOL my damn phone.adds and changes my word's


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## sdgrower (Jun 6, 2012)

jimmy - if you ask chris at hr they will say that veg+bloom has aminoes and silica in it already fwiw
Not listed in the ingredients so who knows


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## Kite High (Jun 7, 2012)

RobotJr said:


> *Hello mates, thought to share my baby gal
> 
> 
> 
> ...


ummm and your point is? oh yeah rite...SPAMMING


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## sdgrower (Jun 7, 2012)

Any pictures?


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## PetFlora (Jun 7, 2012)

I have been posting weekly pics in my journal. Update tomorrow. I am totally impressed with V & B for flower. I do not have any seedlings/clones going at the moment, but anticipate similar results


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## sdgrower (Jun 7, 2012)

Actually I was asking robotjr for pics. I have been watching your thread Pet and like the progress. Keep it up!


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## jimmy1life (Jun 7, 2012)

What would be the best for supplement. I got this humic kelp fulvic amino blend from kelp4less. Or just liquid karma another free sample.staying cheap no advanced crap I do have a few thou but trying just use 1 main nute no other npk supplements during the veg to harvest.


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## sdgrower (Jun 8, 2012)

A humic fulvic ammino blend would be work for sure. I only used veg+bloom, ful power and moab.


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## jimmy1life (Jun 8, 2012)

Yea that's what I was thinking works with my other bases. Um that Chris Guy emailed me a tracking number that's pretty cool. Ivd always wanted to just try jacks classic or mg for the hell of it plus with alil experience but this will work.


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## PetFlora (Jun 8, 2012)

Here are pics from the 2 systems using HR Veg+ BLOOM. I am very happy

DIY 21st Century F & D

If you look closely you can see trichs on the leaves

View attachment 2204488View attachment 2204489


DIY Quasi Bubbler. She was switched over from DM Gold a week after F & D. I tossed this together on the fly. She was in the F & D. Had to move here as the plant above was crowding her out. This is a super simple system that is doing great for me. Clone is ~ 15" tall


View attachment 2204490View attachment 2204491View attachment 2204492


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## sdgrower (Jun 8, 2012)

jimmy1life said:


> Yea that's what I was thinking works with my other bases. Um that Chris Guy emailed me a tracking number that's pretty cool. Ivd always wanted to just try jacks classic or mg for the hell of it plus with alil experience but this will work.


Chris will also tell you a fulvic acid is worth adding. Personally I am switching back to jacks pro/cal nit/epsom for my next run of wifi's. I like the higher mg and sulpher levels in the jacks. The funny thing about jacks is the shipping cost to california costs almost as much as the nutes.


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## jimmy1life (Jun 8, 2012)

Ok man is on it i emailed maybe 4 days ago i got it here in MI with .5tsp i still need a .5tsp of GH dry ph down thats at 600ppm with my hard well water its around 375ppm on a good day. i do use purified for flushing and here and there i buy 2.5 gallon jugs for hell of it. After all this a nice water filter is all i need but i only have a 150 and 400w hps so idk if its all that worth plus might be moving out this damn appartment. So yes i know water is important.


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## jimmy1life (Jun 8, 2012)

PetFlora said:


> Here are pics from the 2 systems using HR Veg+ BLOOM. I am very happy
> 
> DIY 21st Century F & D
> 
> ...


Is that a revegged plant im used to kush and 50/50 hybrids with huge leaves, wouldnt need that high ppm for bubba kush grows on water lol.


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## Cuebossa (Jun 8, 2012)

Looking good Petflora! Looks like you are going to have yourself one big bud in that Quasi bubbler.

The PROMIX babies are lagging a little. I was definitely ahead of the slump at the end of week 1 on my last run and I'm thinking it's because the PROMIX is a tad heavier than the Aurora Soilless. I have only watered oce, not including at transplant, and they seem to be crawling towards starting the stretch. I usually hope for 2x the transplant size by the end of week 2. We shall see.


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## missnu (Jun 9, 2012)

ScoobyDoobyDoo said:


> what do you pH your coco at? i use soiless basically. sunshine #4 with worm castings and a little lime. after this harvest i've gotta change some things around to the rooms so i'm gonna try coco as well with H&G's coco 2 part. also gonna try my sunshine mix with 30% coco added. i love sunshine but the only complaint i have is i think it's a little perlite heavy. dries out too quickly. wanna see how it does with a little coco added. should be fun...side by side with coco and sunshine/coco.


I add a good bit of perlite to my coco...well enough so that I can water every other day usually..sometimes a plant starts to dry out too fast so I add a little straight coco on top...I was getting great results using and re-using FFOF...wanted to try the coco though. And boy am I glad I did...it is so much easier with so many fewer things to add..and so nice not having to switch between flowering and vegging nutes...makes feeding time go all that much smoother...I will probably switch everything over to coco as I go...I still have one new bag of FFOF to get through...the buds are just so much more dense and frosty even from strain to strain in the coco vs the FFOF...and I though the FFOF was great, but sweet heavens watch out with the coco...i adjust my pH to 6-6.5 ish...I still just use the color liquid...lol, so yellow..I adjust my pH to yellow.


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## jimmy1life (Jun 9, 2012)

Coco fruit of life good for clones to harvest just wash or flush the plants here and there. I started cloning using small cups of coco packed too works awesome not as fast but works. 
Its all I use I guess I put my plants on line here I used veg+bloom on everything. I got 4 blooming n 3 vegging. Coco man is da shiznit IV grew a plant 4ft in a party cup then threw it away LOL crapy grape God cutting. This here is tga Apollo 13 and its dank. 2.5oz maybe few jars anyways lots bubble hash LOL.


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## jimmy1life (Jun 10, 2012)

Hey my plants look better then they did before the feeding might just be I Ph and check ppms and kept them low Idk. I do forget and I always use like 1tsp Ph down and don't check but its always at 5.8 6 with a tsp. I'm gonna do a lite ppm flush to wash previous salts out of my coco and use this up.


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## PetFlora (Jun 10, 2012)

jimmy1life said:


> Is that a revegged plant im used to kush and 50/50 hybrids with huge leaves, wouldnt need that high ppm for bubba kush grows on water lol.


Actually she is pretty close to a reveg. She is a clone of the mother that I used to develop my F 1 cross. She has gone through hell and back. She regained some momentum in my DIY 21st Century F & D rig, but was getting crowded out by her much larger niece, so I moved her on the fly to my UFO closet. She was doing good, but after seeing what V & B did I decided to try it on her as well. It took about 5 days, then BAM!

Here's a few picks of my hpa taken 9 days ago. Not much different trich wise as of Friday so I did not take anther pic. Got my One pound jar yesterday and am going to start feeding them V & B today. This should prove interesting. Since taking these photos I snapped the taller plant thinking the shorter one was too far from the light

View attachment 2206695View attachment 2206697View attachment 2206698


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## jimmy1life (Jun 10, 2012)

This is my agent orange just flushed it with a lite nute mix of v&b. Il post a pic in few days just show if shes stll happy.she did poke right up after using these the other day. I was using sensi cal and floraduo A B. I feed almost every time i do flush and use some bene teas with alil humics too


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## jimmy1life (Jun 10, 2012)

Ah shiznit soaking some rockwool cubes with it 5.5ph 200ppm. Maybe Idk what hell I'm doing and was hurting my yield using all kinds of supplament and this fixed me Idk but looks GD so far and I'm excited about maybe crazy too LOL but this v+b is what I been looking for


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## Kronika (Jun 12, 2012)

Reading this thread has me intrigued. I just requested a free sample.


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## jimmy1life (Jun 12, 2012)

Hell yea I'm using it up really depends if It cuts it in flower if Ill buy more.I'm using rit on clones in rockwool and on coco and every things lookn fantastic.


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## Cuebossa (Jun 12, 2012)

Jimmy, you sound a lot like myself when I started using the Veg+Bloom. "Less is more" comes to mind. Here is the PROMIX-HP with 800ppm Veg+Bloom going on 9-10 days flower. I'm finally starting to see vigor, the PROMIX seems to lag a little at the start but I see things really picking up.


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## PetFlora (Jun 13, 2012)

jimmy1life said:


> Hell yea I'm using it up really depends if It cuts it in flower if Ill buy more.I'm using rit on clones in rockwool and on coco and every things lookn fantastic.


Hey, you been to my journal? Buds are fat and happy, gettin a bit trichy too


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## Kite High (Jun 13, 2012)

PetFlora said:


> Hey, you been to my journal? Buds are fat and happy, gettin a bit trichy too


So pf you are impressed with this product for use throughout the grow? Are you using just it alone? Thanx


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## jimmy1life (Jun 14, 2012)

So far nothing special with my plants flower progress. My strains have trichs with no nutrients LOL or I wouldn't keep it. I've been weeding through strains and my Apollo 13 and Bubba kush are keepers. I got agent orange but who knows if this cut is a keeper couple more days. O need just order a damn pack of plushberry but to caught up in bills. That's y I'm here LOL free sample so far AN 3 part has my back I might buy that again I see its more then sensi now Idk.


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## PetFlora (Jun 14, 2012)

Kite High said:


> So pf you are impressed with this product for use throughout the grow? Are you using just it alone? Thanx


Drop in on my journal to watch the progress. You can ask questions for me there as well


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## Cuebossa (Jun 15, 2012)

Your thread is great Petflora. A very different approach to my humble "container" style of gardening. 

I am entering the 2nd week and didn't get the stretch I am used to but The overall health is looking good.


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## PetFlora (Jun 15, 2012)

Blush. I seem to enjoy tweaking things. I am a damn good chef without using recipes. I see things and challenge myself _"Can I make them better (more efficient)?__"_ By far my biggest success is My *DIY 21st Century Flood & Drain*

I just increased nute ppms 10-20% today. That's only < 1000 to a max of 1200, No problem as the HR V & B does not have toxic percentage of P. I'm excited to see what this does


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## jimmy1life (Jun 16, 2012)

Hell yea I like 450 ppms of base. I have very few and harvest a plant every few weeks so I'm using this on clones in rockwool veg and bloom at once. That's the way I roll man with just a 400hps with ushio bulb then a 150hps. It works and I got my smoke. I'll post a pick in the morning of my best round with Apollo 13.


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## jimmy1life (Jun 16, 2012)

Using hard water too and only grow in coco besides using lil rooting block's of rockwool.


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## PetFlora (Jun 16, 2012)

I came across this on another thread. Gonna post it in my journal too

*environmental factors play a lot into the fact of whether a plant is female or not you can begin influencing your plant's sex the moment the seedling has three pairs of true leaves (cotyledons don't count!) 

This is from the Elite Growers Book: another thing a lot of you might be wondering why fem. seeds from seed companies don't follow the instructions from the picture that is because they all have hermaphrodite DNA they have lowered chances of hermie thru special breeding but especially all fem. seeds are hermie the better the environment the less chance of hermie

These factors are:

Humidity: *High humidity increases the chances of female plant
development. Low humidity increases male plants. Low grow medium
moisture also increases males. The same is valid for the moistness of the
seedbed.

*Temperature:* lower temperatures make for a larger number of female
marijuana plants, higher temperatures for more male marijuana plants.

*Lighting:* More blue spectrum light energy increases the number of
females, whereas red light increases males. Fewer hours of
daylight(about 14) increases the number of female plants. Longer light
exposure(18 hours+) will tend to make more male plants.

*Nitrogen:* Increasing the level of nitrogen(N) makes more female
plants, lowering creates more males.

*Potassium: *Lowering levels of potassium(K) encourages the
development of female plants, increasing potassium(K) increases the
male tendencies. (So for the first two weeks a higher level of nitrogen
and a lower level of potassium will encourage female plants to develop.)
*
Environmental Stress. *Any environmental stress will greatly increase
the chances of male plants growing from your seed.

*Colour of Light*: more blue light makes for female cannabis plants from
seed, more red light makes for more male cannabis plants.

*Hours of Daylight*: few hours of daylight(i.e. 14 hours) makes for
more female individuals, a long day(i.e. 18 hours) makes for more male
cannabis plants.

*Soaking:* Soaking your seed(s) in Gibberellic acid makes it/them more
likely to produce a female plant.


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## PetFlora (Jun 16, 2012)

delete double post


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## PetFlora (Jun 17, 2012)

*semor90. *Just to let you know, I am ignoring you. So is everyone else. Get over yourself. This is the last time I will address you. 

They have a saying Texas that describes you to a 'T' _"All hat and no cattle"_


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## jimmy1life (Jun 17, 2012)

Heres my apollo this time i kno ive only been using veg+bloom for about week so i cant say if its even made a difference or not. I grew this cutting with ever topping i did pinch the top stem and bent it over. last few have been topped and fimmed this time i want a nice top lol. Hey im using this stuff up and only using a 400w i got few kushs budding away. 1s about a week in so il really see what happens cause ive been growing these same strains for over year harvesting every 2 weeks. But honestly idk really care as long as shit grows and i have a decent yield i dont wanna run out of flowers im lucky to get 2.5 of a apollo. that was using 3part bud blood then big bud with bud candy.
Love the 1 scoop.


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## Cuebossa (Jun 17, 2012)

Jimmy that top cola is going to be huge! I would say that has at least two and a half weeks left on her.


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## Kronika (Jun 17, 2012)

I got my free sample in the mail on Friday. Yay!


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## jimmy1life (Jun 17, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> Jimmy that top cola is going to be huge! I would say that has at least two and a half weeks left on her.


 Oh yea seems like its not even thinking about ripening not one lil hair has turned orange. This strain after a year of smoking im still putting half doobies out. i like it right around 50 days at 60 it loses that lemon taste. I do have a microscope. seems to like the v+b

Hey petflora i checked ya out seems like you do tinker with alot stuff lol. whats your opinion on a good hps bulb. ive used digilux ushio and couple knock offs that came with my light the digilux had the most blue outa them. Im thinking about picking another up and dont quite understand all lite stuff. i only have a digital 400 mh hps ballast.


heres my last apollo 13 it was a good 2 jars tired of the small bud though i did chop the leafs off.


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## Kite High (Jun 18, 2012)

jimmy1life said:


> Oh yea seems like its not even thinking about ripening not one lil hair has turned orange. This strain after a year of smoking im still putting half doobies out. i like it right around 50 days at 60 it loses that lemon taste. I do have a microscope. seems to like the v+b
> 
> Hey petflora i checked ya out seems like you do tinker with alot stuff lol. whats your opinion on a good hps bulb. ive used digilux ushio and couple knock offs that came with my light the digilux had the most blue outa them. Im thinking about picking another up and dont quite understand all lite stuff. i only have a digital 400 mh hps ballast.
> View attachment 2216803
> ...


I find the Plantmax bulbs kick ass and are reasonably priced


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## PetFlora (Jun 19, 2012)

I never had the success with 400 watt hps, and my grow area would not allow for more, plus fear of high electric bill being a signal. 

When I gave up on my 400 I switched to a UFO 90 (2.5 years ago). If I knew then what I have learned using it to finish, I wouldn't have bought it. Still it works fine for seedlings and clones. When I need it in a pinch to finish a plant, I simply supplement with cfls.


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## jimmy1life (Jun 19, 2012)

the 2 in the back are bubba kush the lil one in front is the agent orange i showed once its been cloned off of since and transplanted.
All been on V+B when i 1st got the sample i did a light ppm flush of everything. I know they are growing realy nice i dont really see much of a differance thou. It does keep them pretty dark i need back off alil haha on ppms more water hell its 95 outside right now and everythings been alil warm bout 80 anyways. the agent orange plant is bout be in my closet on 12 12 I just got a pack of ripped bubba so it might replace my bubba strain and i wasnt going to run the A. orange again either.
Peace guys it works in coco


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## projectmayham (Jun 20, 2012)

How much is the Veg+bloom??? I like running powders. I have been using supernatural for a couple years now, i just love the stuff. Their 5lb bucket makes about the same amount of nutrient solution, about 400-600gal. Does it have ph buffering as well???


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## PetFlora (Jun 20, 2012)

$19.99 per pound. Discount on large quantities

It's working great in 3 different hydro/aero systems


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## kilo810 (Jun 20, 2012)

Gave my plants a little dose of this stuff. and to my surprise the plants love this shit. LOL. A ton of positive response over 2 days. Never seen a reaction like that from a change in nutes before. IDK WTF they did to make this right but whatever it is it works. Im content and Instead of purchasing 250 dollars in four gallons of nutes im just gonna drop 100 on 5 lbs. LOL fucking eh. cant beat the price. But this is only if it continues to out perform my dyna gro nutes. got a little side by side going on between 2 silver haze in flower. they both look great so far. guess weight and quality will tell. 

Im a bit concerned about flavor though. how sweet does this stuff make the buds taste or does it keep that original taste?? I would really like to know. Also should I back the lights down to 10/14 near the end to induce ripening?? keep seeing post about people at 50 days with plants not wanting to finish??


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## PetFlora (Jun 21, 2012)

*kilo: *My larger plant (in my hpa kit) was going nowhere fast, so after seeing how quickly my Big Girl responded in y DIY 21st Century Flood & Drain kit, I switched the hpa from DM Gold to HR V & B, too. It has taken awhile (~ 3 weeks) but damn that plant is bulking up fast now.

During flower, I run 12/12 for one week then drop to 11/13 until last 2-3 weeks then drop to 10/14; this simulates how winter light wanes

Can't help you on flavor


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## Cuebossa (Jun 21, 2012)

The PRO-MIX HP plants are finally done with the majority of their stretch and are really starting to flower. I am very excited to see them plump up!


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## PetFlora (Jun 22, 2012)

Here's a taste of what's happening with my girls

One of the plants in my hpa (now in 4th week of V & B) started taking off about 5 days ago. Probably another 5+" and doubling of the girth

View attachment 2223301View attachment 2223302

Big Girl (F & D)

View attachment 2223303View attachment 2223304View attachment 2223305View attachment 2223306


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## Cuebossa (Jun 25, 2012)

Nice buds Petflora! They are looking very dark green, almost black. 

The PROMIX-HP is looking great! Not as vigorous but seemingly sturdier growth! Not sure how the Aurora and the PROMIX differntiate but so far so good.


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## 711grower (Jun 26, 2012)

heres one of my babys growing in roots soil with lots of perlite using HR. its about a week into flower being grown under a philips 400 cmh bulb



below is a plant using 5 bucks worth of fertilizer. kinda hard to beat the price and smoke report is off the charts. sorry for the yellow shots its under a 1000 watt hps and i am just to lazy to move it into better light. 




i am a firm believer that the industry that caters to mmj growing is full of scam artists that lead newbs to thinking you need a shit ton ass fill of expensive nutes to grow successfuly. so far i am realy liking the hr nutes. cost wise i dont know how it will compare to my current technique just yet. its a quality product at a fair price without the hype. i have emailed HR several times with questions and have always gotten a quick response.


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## Cuebossa (Jun 28, 2012)

Very Nice 711, those are huuge! I have some OG kush going this round which seem to love the weaker strength of Veg+Bloom(1.4EC) and are starting to stack up and the Jack the Ripper appears to want a little stronger EC. Like the ProMIX at this point, it seems to hold a little more water then the Aurora and The plants seem to be a little sturdier


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## 711grower (Jun 28, 2012)

thanks cuebosa. i have another strain thats got more sativa in it that has seemed to exploded in growth in the las few day. i will get a pic of her up soon.


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## Kite High (Jun 29, 2012)

711grower said:


> heres one of my babys growing in roots soil with lots of perlite using HR. its about a week into flower being grown under a philips 400 cmh bulb
> 
> View attachment 2229922
> 
> ...


yes they replied quickly until I asked for a listing of elements percentages which their reply was "proprietary" and we will not reveal. That is bs but have the sample so will try it anyways.


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## PetFlora (Jun 29, 2012)

View attachment 2232975View attachment 2232976

Any Questions?


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## 711grower (Jun 29, 2012)

i could care less if they wont tell you all there elements. all i care about is how easy it is and how well it performs. if HR spent 1000 of hours creating an amazing nutrient recipe then i dont blame them for not wanting the giants stealing all there hard work. for all we know its powdered panda shit...


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## Gyroscope (Jun 29, 2012)

711grower said:


> for all we know its powdered panda shit...


lol.......


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## jimmy1life (Jun 30, 2012)

View attachment 2234795
Ive been using v+b and i gota say my plants just have this dark green idk but probably gonna take a good 2 weeks to flush.


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## jimmy1life (Jun 30, 2012)

this plant was bout 3 or 4 weeks in just so some know it wasnt used whole way. Plus i whipp up some crazy concoctions here and there with bacteria and humic fulvic acids but in coco you have to have a good base to keep plants green so this stuff works


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## 711grower (Jul 1, 2012)

heres a shot of another monster growing under a 400 watt cmh using HR in soil... 



and here is a shot from one of my 6 colas using 5 bucks worth of nutrients ( dynamite all purpose select ). i am all about bang for the buck. fucker yielded 6 oz dry

View attachment 2235393


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## jimmy1life (Jul 2, 2012)

711grower said:


> heres a shot of another monster growing under a 400 watt cmh using HR in soil...
> 
> View attachment 2235392
> 
> ...


Its tricky using coco but if has calcium it could possibly be good to go Ive never heard of that but nice cola man helluva job.


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## jimmy1life (Jul 2, 2012)

Heres a pic of veg set up i use .5 tsp gal plus ph down. 
Ive never had my bubba kush cut so happy. Been using 150w hps for veg. Im preyin for a new keeper out this seeds.


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## Cuebossa (Jul 6, 2012)

Looking great Jimmy! I ran Bubba a few years back and she sure was picky. I wouldn't mind giving her a run with Veg+Bloom and the ProMix. Here we are at 5 weeks and looking strong! I've bumped the EC to 1.6 to get the Jack the Ripper back to a dark green. I feel as though the OG would prefer a weaker feed strength but will be keep it 1.6 for both this week.


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## Kite High (Jul 6, 2012)

Cue, really nice...props there dude


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## PetFlora (Jul 7, 2012)

~ one week to harvest. The mother seeds that I made this cross from were gifted. I never saw the actual plant so I have no idea what normal tric production is. Hopefully she''ll frost up a good bit before she comes down. 

The nuggz are golf ball solid

Curious to try V+B that + fulvic acid. I have a couple late clones rooting in my DIY bubbler


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## jimmy1life (Jul 7, 2012)

Yea honestly I dont know much i read up on humic and fulvics alil and figured it be a good purchase. plus like liquid karma and other good nutes usually have humics um black diamonds a good humic. I already found out you need a good flush but i dont have the best drying cureing methods down hang till crispy then jar it and burp um alot. My last batch burnt funny always go out crispy ashes idk could be anything


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## Izoc666 (Jul 7, 2012)

Cuebossa, the update of pictures looks always good !

If you dont mind to share your thoughts about this medium, Roots Organic soilless coco vs ProMix ? they re easy to work with or what ? thanks !

happy growing and peace


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## Cuebossa (Jul 8, 2012)

Kite High said:


> Cue, really nice...props there dude


 Thank you sir



PetFlora said:


> ~ one week to harvest. The mother seeds that I made this cross from were gifted. I never saw the actual plant so I have no idea what normal tric production is. Hopefully she''ll frost up a good bit before she comes down.
> 
> The nuggz are golf ball solid
> 
> Curious to try V+B that + fulvic acid. I have a couple late clones rooting in my DIY bubbler


 I also heard about the fulvic acid amended Veg+Bloom from my retailer. I'm looking forward to trying it out.



Izoc666 said:


> Cuebossa, the update of pictures looks always good !
> 
> If you dont mind to share your thoughts about this medium, Roots Organic soilless coco vs ProMix ? they re easy to work with or what ? thanks !
> 
> happy growing and peace


 They are both easy to work with. The ProMix is a better value cash wise but the Roots Soilless seems to be better draining and more geared towards hydroponic fertilizers. I let you know when I burn my first bowl with the ProMix grown Bud. Both are good products.


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## WattSaver (Jul 8, 2012)

Just finished my way through this thread, and this HR V&G has sparked my interest. Hope the thread continues, I'm subbed to see a few start to finish results. My growing goal is cheapest, least labor intensive method possible. But if the results of the HR are great, I'd be willin' to add a little coin and labor for better results. 

Thanks for sharing your grows.


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## jimmy1life (Jul 9, 2012)

Its a good sample one that shouldnt go bad too but honestly im not gonna buy any. I just cant get over my flowers not burning right. With other nutes I have never ran into this. Even not flushing.
I always here oh everything going around is chemy tasting. I used say I use chems no bad taste but now people wouldnt even want more of my bud cause it burnt crazy wierd, even bone dry itd still race or go out idk im tripping out but il use this up on my veg plants my clones in RW love it lol all my veg plants love it and blooming plants too just gonna keep trying stuff


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## hydro30 (Jul 9, 2012)

Just curious here. Can anyone tell me what other additives are in veg+bloom? I currently use other nutrients that require bloom boosters, amino additives, fulvic acid and etc during flowering. I'd like to stop using the extra additives if possible.


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## PetFlora (Jul 10, 2012)

hydro30 said:


> Just curious here. Can anyone tell me what other additives are in veg+bloom? I currently use other nutrients that require bloom boosters, amino additives, fulvic acid and etc during flowering. I'd like to stop using the extra additives if possible.


In mid August he is releasing it with fulvic acid, which I have used in the past. So I am going to get it when it comes out. Other than that it is/was designed as a complete nutrient. 

If you follow their schedule over the weeks the increased ppms act as a booster.


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## Cuebossa (Jul 10, 2012)

It has aminos, a carb source, and silica. Also, as Petflora noted, will have fulvics soon. I haven't used any additives with it and my flowers are amazing. I get super clean burning head stash that results in full flavor with a white ash. I'll update the photos today, really happy with the way the OG and JTR are turning out. Very rich aroma!


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## jimmy1life (Jul 10, 2012)

Wells thats good to hear clean burning white ash,i might have,to try that promix out coco seems to hold alot of salts hell maybe I didnt flush enough I tend to wing stuff like ph and ppm checking plus it was super dark green still. And I never did check run off ppms. 
I am by no means saying V+B isnt good it 4sure grows mmj and ive used it on Indicas and sativas. Ill admit it I dont have huge grows just a closet and tent. 
Hey petflora hows your herbs burning,that u used v+b on. I kno flushing is a real important thing just ive randomly chop plants fed same day on bottle nutes and it was never this bad. Im going crazy cuz I love the 1 scoop aday lol. Heres a pic of my ripped bubba seeds on V+B they taking off real good too


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## Cuebossa (Jul 11, 2012)

Jim, it has to be your flushing routine. My flowers have been nothing but clean burning perfection! This will be my third run with it in different medias and all I can say is white ash soft smoke. Here they are almost 6 weeks. I was told the OG goes 9 so they should be nice and big by then.


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## PetFlora (Jul 11, 2012)

*Jimmy* I am a few days away from my first harvest using V + B.


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## jimmy1life (Jul 11, 2012)

Alrighty ive got a small bottle of that clearex i am diffently slamming that threw my plants a good week before harvest like right at cloudy trichs. And i only chop one evry week or two it seems to always taste better when i have a completly yellow or dieing plant too.


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## PetFlora (Jul 11, 2012)

why Clearex? By lowering your nute ppms ~ 200 for 5- days it will flush the plant just fine. I lower over the last few weeks by 200 ppms per week. Been at <200 for a few days.Also reduced feeding schedule from 3/hr to 2/hr and now 1/hr trics are increasing AND I am seeing more oily small leaves, I'm guessing in self defense


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## jimmy1life (Jul 11, 2012)

Yea ive always flushed with low ppms too but Im going all out now,using ro with a dash of clearex next time


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## PetFlora (Jul 13, 2012)

Big Girl F1 days away. Since reducing ppms and watering frequency over the last 2 weeks more trics and oily leaves


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## Cuebossa (Jul 13, 2012)

I find flushing extremely important. I plan on tapering down from an EC of 1.6 to around and EC of about .8 for the final two weeks with these girls. I was told it is beneficial to use a dilute strength vs. just plain water for flushing. Either way The OG is looking superb and the JTR filling in nicely! Great to see two totally different strains thriving on the same formula, really takes the guesswork out of the process.


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## Cuebossa (Jul 16, 2012)

Very excited to taste these. The JTR has a mango orange sweetness with a touch of skunk and the OG is just that fuelly rubber incense smell. Both are incredibly sappy and are begging to burn. I'm anticipating the best tasting smoke by the fragrance of these fine ladies.


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## Cuebossa (Jul 19, 2012)

The OG seems to be really happy with the Prom-Mix HP and Veg+Bloom. I am entering my 7th week and very happy with my results. I am watering on average every other day with approx 1L for each plant at about 1EC working my way down to an EC of .4 to flush


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## Chiggachamp (Jul 19, 2012)

U made me order sum of this stuff just by looking at ur results and how simple u made it seem. 
I orderd it on the 10th was supposed to be here the 12th. And i still havnt gotten it. I used the travking because they updated it often and it even said out for delivery in my city check yesterday and it was in az.. Went right on past me lol
Anywho im waiting still.
But as soon as its here im using it in my clones pre teens and moms. 
So u use anything when transplanting? Like great white?


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## Cuebossa (Jul 19, 2012)

No, I used Veg+Bloom by itself the entire run, nothing else. I didn't even need pH adjusters!


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## Chiggachamp (Jul 19, 2012)

Sweet. Ill def pm u when i finally get it and see how it works out
Thanks for ur insight


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## budybong (Jul 19, 2012)

Well peeps I got a fee sample of VB! Tried it on a 4 plant trial. Followed there schedule and this is what I found! Had to use PH down!, YELLOWING leafs, and a cal def. Started them with VB in veg threw weeks 3 of flower, Tried feeding a little sooner than normal, nothing! Flushed waited 2 days hit them with MB, LKB, and a little cal/mag and BINGO back on track! But my mother plants love the shit! Go figure! Gonna stick with MB for now, wait HG sample pack is here let you know how that goes!
Bsafe


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## Cuebossa (Jul 19, 2012)

Sounds like you ran too weak of a feed strength for your particular strain. I found that at 1.4 the JTR stayed a little pale and only darkened up if I fed at 1.6. Again, these plants were grown with Veg+Bloom only and this round I used Pro-Mix HP. There really aren't any other variables other then EC so this must be where you went wrong. Here is Jack The Ripper going on 7 weeks fed with an EC of 1.4


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## budybong (Jul 19, 2012)

Not Really sure if I did anything wrong! There hard water formula didnt drop my ph that much, and I increase strength to 1.5-1.6 after week one of flower! But in all fairness my water is jacked up. I have it MB dialed in. I ran AK48 and Pineapple express in the trial and they are heavy feeders! But I am seriously thinking about try VB in DWC! I am gonna continue feeding my mothers with it they love this stuff! 
Bsafe


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## Cuebossa (Jul 19, 2012)

I ran the Aurora Soilless with the Tap formula in the beginning of the thread with pretty bad tap water (.6-.8EC) and had pretty good results. Your water must be pretty bad. I would definitely consider the switch to RO if you are going to run DWC!


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## PetFlora (Jul 20, 2012)

budybong said:


> Not Really sure if I did anything wrong! There hard water formula didnt drop my ph that much, and I increase strength to 1.5-1.6 after week one of flower! But in all fairness my water is jacked up. I have it MB dialed in. I ran AK48 and Pineapple express in the trial and they are heavy feeders! But I am seriously thinking about try VB in DWC! I am gonna continue feeding my mothers with it they love this stuff!
> Bsafe


Yep, the hardness in your water is preventing V+B from being where it needs to be, so you will need some down


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## kilo810 (Jul 24, 2012)

SO just to be clear, you guys aren't adding anything else to your formulas, just the soil and Veg+Bloom? thats it?


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## mrcourios (Jul 24, 2012)

I emailed them last Thursday about getting a free sample.Got a email back Tuesday that they sent it priority mail and I should have it by the end of the week.


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## PetFlora (Jul 25, 2012)

kilo810 said:


> SO just to be clear, you guys aren't adding anything else to your formulas, just the soil and Veg+Bloom? thats it?


I am using it in both high pressure aero and My DIY 21st Century F & D. After hearing HR will be adding fulvic acid to their mix, I found a small bottle from when I supplemented with FA a couple years ago, so I am finishing it off now, but that's it


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## Cuebossa (Jul 25, 2012)

PROMIX-HP and Veg+Bloom RO formula and RO water. I have been flushing for two weeks at this point so I do think people should keep a good flush in mind with the combination of the heavier PRoMIX and the Veg+Bloom being such a concentrated nutrient. Both strains responded well but the Jack the Ripper could have been spiked a little earlier in EC. I ran an EC of around 1.2-1.4 the whole run.


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## tenthirty (Jul 29, 2012)

Just got 5 lb of veg-bloom. Mixed up 2 rez's, Ro water, soft formula, ec of 1.19 and .9, and the ph is at 5.7-5.8 right out of the box. (half strength and 3/4 strength)
Easy to mix and no adjustments were necessary.
So far so good.

By the way I've been using dyna-grow.
[h=1][/h]


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## Cuebossa (Jul 31, 2012)

easy to mix, easy to grow. I really feel that if anyone were to follow the 1-1.5EC feeding schedule with a clean water source they could replicate my results to a T. I haven't ph'd my solution the whole run. I have to say the PROMIX-HP is a good budget potting soil but was a little heavier then the Roots soilless. This made it a little more difficult to flush but easier on the watering schedule. Here are the two strains I ran this round finishing up around 9 weeks in. They both smell bomb but the OG smells atomic!


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## jimmy1life (Jul 31, 2012)

Dude nice yellowing thats what im trying for right there.


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## Smoothkicksandsmoke (Aug 2, 2012)

PetFlora what are you using for medium in your Flood & Drain set up? If its coco, what are you doing to keep the coco contained?


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## Lucius Vorenus (Aug 2, 2012)

I have been curious to try this stuf since i like 1 part forumulas but i hear that in the end it costs more because you need to use like 2-3tblsp per gallon and you go through a lot very quickly.

Thoughts?


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## mrcourios (Aug 2, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> I have been curious to try this stuf since i like 1 part forumulas but i hear that in the end it costs more because you need to use like 2-3tblsp per gallon and you go through a lot very quickly.
> 
> Thoughts?


Largest dose on the feeding chart is 1.5 tsp per gal in rockwool,soil is .5 tsp per gal.


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## Cuebossa (Aug 2, 2012)

Roger that Mrcourios. I've found that 1tsp per gallon is great for feed, water, feed, water or similar schedules in the soilless mixes I've run. 

I'm on the fence about what medium to try next... I have access to Canna coco and ocean forest, I've tried the Roots soiless and the PROMIX thus far, any suggestions would be appreciated!


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## Cuebossa (Aug 3, 2012)

OCEAN FOREST it is! Initial observations, dark & HEAVY. I am starting this girl @ .7EC and will adjust if necessary. Anyone hydro nute users using ocean forest feel free to give me your input on feed strength etc. I am running a JTR clone in PROMIX as well as I have a bale of it left.


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## hydro30 (Aug 5, 2012)

Anyone know when the fulvic will be added to the 1lb and 5lb? I asked Chris and he just said its being offered for the 100lb.


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## Cuebossa (Aug 7, 2012)

I'd be curious to know this myself hydro30. I heard this rumored and I believe the response was that they are selling through their inventory to get it out there. 

For the record, Jack the Ripper is some of the most psychedelic MJ I have smoked. The smell is mango baby poop, the flavor is incredible! THe high is uplifting, my lower back pain melts away. The flowers themselves are sugared over with resin. Awesome genetics.


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## Cuebossa (Aug 8, 2012)

5 days into 12/12 with Jack The Ripper. Ocean Forest hold a lot of water.





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## jimmy1life (Aug 9, 2012)

Yep soil should take twice as long as the soilless mix. Ive juat been using coco i found out the last brick had extrem ppm run off so alwways flush i had a huge cocogro block. Maybe thats why my bud burnt like wet shit bone dry lol.
It should be better. I would think but i hate gnats. I Havnt had one since using coco.


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## jimmy1life (Aug 9, 2012)

Knock on wood picking up guanos and worm castings 2moro. im a noobie bro and its fun tinkering. trying somn new. I heard fox farm had a organic dry blend of all the main Macro and micro nutes that works awesome with coco. So im thinking of more a base coco mix and worm - guano teas.


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## Cuebossa (Aug 10, 2012)

Gnats suck. Tinker in a simple manner brother! I'm adjusting the watering frequency to dry and accommodate for the density of this mix. So far I like the PROMIX better but it's the results that make the decision! The PROMIX JTR smokes incredibly smooth and was very psychedelic! WebRep


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## Cuebossa (Aug 13, 2012)

Bumped the EC to 1.5 for a feeding and she responded well. Ocean Forest 10 days 12/12


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## Cuebossa (Aug 16, 2012)

PROMIX on left, Ocean Forest on right. Amazing how soil changes phenotype


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## Lucius Vorenus (Aug 16, 2012)

So Cuebossa = The guy who owns Veg & Bloom correct?


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## PetFlora (Aug 17, 2012)

I doubt he has the time to post. I had great success using it last grow. 

New V+B has more Si + Fulvic Acid, but not shown on label

I emailed to ask about mixing my remaining V+B with the V+B+Fulvic. Was told Fulvic is for ~ 5 weeks into veg- harvest. 

Begs the question Shouldn't there be 2 formulas?


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## Cuebossa (Aug 17, 2012)

Sorry to disappoint you Lucius but I am not the owner nor do I work for Hydroponic Research. I'm merely an end user providing data on a product that , in a sea of incomplete formulas, exceeded my expectations. Maybe give Veg+Bloom a try in one of the mentioned planting mediums in my thread? If you follow my EC recommendations through this thread you will obtain the results I have. I wish more end users would provide the kind of data I have it would make RIU a much more productive and positive community. Anyhow, I will continue to post my findings for anyone interested. Thanks for checking out my thread!


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## Dalek Supreme (Aug 17, 2012)

I E-mailed HR a sample request.They responded they are sending me a sample.I will see how it stacks against Maxibloom and friends.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Aug 17, 2012)

Dalek Supreme said:


> I E-mailed HR a sample request.They responded they are sending me a sample.I will see how it stacks against Maxibloom and friends.


I just got a sample as well. It's a bit pricey and way more pricey than Maxibloom and Protekt but I hate how much Ph down you have to use with Protekt so we shall see.


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## Dalek Supreme (Aug 17, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> I just got a sample as well. It's a bit pricey and way more pricey than Maxibloom and Protekt but I hate how much Ph down you have to use with Protekt so we shall see.


Hey Lucius what dosage per gal and what is your lighting with Pro-Tekt and Maxibloom?What strain aswell?
I am just asking cause with for me at around 400 watts,3/4th tsp(5g)Maxibloom,.5ml Protekt per gal tap(7.8ph) my nute mix is 6ph.
I let the strength of Maxibloom dosage determine how much Pro-Tekt I use,and any additive.At .5ml of the Tekt I see the right amount of sillicon benefits I need for my setup.Trimming gives an ok pair of scissors trouble,and have to use diagonal pliers to cut the bottom main stem for harvest.This is passive hydro in 220z cups for a slightly Sat dom hybrid.

http://agr.wa.gov/PestFert/Fertilizers/FertDB/prodinfo.aspx?pname=6427

I want to do a modified side by side were I take out 1/4 tsp of Maxibloom and substitute Veg+Bloom starting around 1/8th tsp.The V+G has too much N for my taste/setup but if it performs in conjunction with my nute regimen,then I do not mind an extra step in an allready simple process.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Aug 17, 2012)

Maxibloom drops PH a lot so it's probably perfect with the Protekt. I currently use Botanicare but I'll probably be ditching it soon. I think Ita overrated. I also just prefer dry powders. I used Maxibloom before using Botanicare and the Maxi it blew it away.


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## squarepush3r (Aug 19, 2012)

PetFlora said:


> I doubt he has the time to post. I had great success using it last grow.
> 
> New V+B has more Si + Fulvic Acid, but not shown on label
> 
> ...


IMO, veg + bloom is a great formula, but yes they really need more than 1 product, its a nice marketing catch to have an "all in one product" but in reality its not the truth, you could arguable use 4 different formulas, or at least 2 different bases, then early flowering, mid flowering, and late flowering could use slightly different ratios. This is normally accomplished with blooming nutrient base + boosters applied at different times throughout bloom. At the minimum, 2 formulas (veg and bloom) should be available, not to mention hard water (for those who need it). Also, the all in one product concept has weaknesses to with the added carbohydrates/sugars I believe veg + bloom has, can hurt some grows especially DWC/RDWC and aeroponics (any grow where sterile environment is beneficial to prevent root issues/pathogens).


From the website







It seems to be missing a ton of micronutrients/trace elements for a complete formula, also it claims to have a ton of things like silicia (why no guaranteed analysis?), amino acids, carbohydrates, fulvics, etc... but can't be found on the label. Are they really included, why aren't they listed? Even Advanced Nutrients which is a shady company lists their amino acids and fulvics and silica.

Anyways, I think veg + bloom is a very good product and the pictures shown in this thread of V+B are quite impressive and delicious. Just giving a bit of analysis and critical opinion of the matter.


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## Cuebossa (Aug 21, 2012)

It works as advertised for me. I use it by itself all the way from rooted cutting to finished flower. It's simplicity is why I am promoting it. It has allowed me to succeed in not only producing higher quality flowers but an abundance of them. If I can help others succeed by recommending a product, I will. 

Ocean Forest vs. Promix. The Ocean Forest on the right is much darker and appears to be heavier setting flowers. I'm really liking the performance of the Ocean Forest at this point.


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## roller380 (Aug 22, 2012)

I'm quite impressed by this stuff. Twenty bucks for a lb and you only need 1/2tsp per gallon. Good bang for your buck


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## superjet (Aug 25, 2012)

i ordered a 1 pounder, was here real quick and i really liked what i saw so i ordered some more. their feeding ppms are in line with what i feed my plants and their ratios (low phosphorus) have me kind of exited! the larrys are getting this from start to finish, oh yeah.


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## Cuebossa (Aug 27, 2012)

It goes a long way. I am finding that needed EC will vary depending on what you are growing in. These two are both being fed 1.3-1.5 EC and the Ocean Forest(on right) is looking much greener and possibly in need of a flush. I will probably need to up the EC on the PROMIX plant(on left) to get it a little bit greener. I don't pH my water.


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## SoQuick (Aug 27, 2012)

I went to buy this product (I'm in Canada) and the order went through but they didn't charged me for shipping. Then they returned my charge via paypal. Do they not ship to Canada? if not that seems like a HUGE market base they are missing out on......anyone?


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## superjet (Aug 27, 2012)

i didn't get charged for shipping either. there was also an information card with my order stating "contains silica, fulvic acids and aminos" i'm stoked. i've gotten great results with just maxi and tap period, but always felt there was way too much phosphorus in it, let alone half the trace elements this stuff (veg&bloom) is supposed to have.


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## thehole (Aug 27, 2012)

San Diego has some of the worst tap water in the nation. HMM. Will have to look into this stuff.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Aug 29, 2012)

thehole said:


> San Diego has some of the worst tap water in the nation. HMM. Will have to look into this stuff.


Far from it. Maybe if you have never been to Phoenix


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## Cuebossa (Aug 31, 2012)

Promix on the left, Ocean Forest on the right. I started a light flush on the Ocean Forest and increased the feed strength on the Promix. These are truly very different products. I'm amazed at how different the two look and they are clones. Promix might out yield the Ocean Forest but the ocean forest seems to have more intense trichome production.


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## patlpp (Aug 31, 2012)

Just got my sample in... Test mixed in RO. 

1/2 tsp (2.75g) = ~ 400 ppm @.5 (.8ec)

1 tsp (5.5g) = ~ 800 ppm (1.6ec)

[email protected] 20$ lb: 24 cents/gal @ 1.6e

PH when mixed: 5.8


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## homebrewer (Aug 31, 2012)

patlpp said:


> Just got my sample in... Test mixed in RO.
> 
> 1/2 tsp (2.75g) = ~ 400 ppm @.5 (.8ec)
> 
> ...


Are you mixing those plant food measurements in a gallon of RO? If that's the case and if your numbers are correct, there are _several_ liquid plants foods that are cheaper than this dry food. _Usually_ dry food is the better value.


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## patlpp (Sep 1, 2012)

homebrewer said:


> Are you mixing those plant food measurements in a gallon of RO? If that's the case and if your numbers are correct, there are _several_ liquid plants foods that are cheaper than this dry food. _Usually_ dry food is the better value.


1 gallon correct
makes 81 gallons @ 1 tsp. given 5.5g/tsp. 448g/lb.


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## homebrewer (Sep 1, 2012)

patlpp said:


> 1 gallon correct
> makes 81 gallons @ 1 tsp. given 5.5g/tsp. 448g/lb.


Ok, so I did some quick math and it looks like a $20 tub would last about 9 weeks with feeding levels at 1.0 EC in my 15 gallon res. Don't get me wrong, this stuff clearly works, it's just not a great value compared to other liquid and dry food options. 

Where VEG+BLOOM is $99 for 5lbs, Maxibloom is $90 for 16 pounds (maxigrow is more comparable though). 

Simply an observation.


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## PetFlora (Sep 1, 2012)

IMO there is a lot more to V+B than reducing it to vol v vol of nutrient X

I just measured *ONE tsp* of the new V+B (more Si + fulvic). Now we all know there is some variation amongst commercial tsps, but

*MY 1 tsp= 3gms.*

Mixed into 2G of RO water (~20ppm) the readout is 590 ppms. As my seedlings are developing the 3rd leaf set, 200ppms is sufficient; it takes ~ 4 more gallons to dilute to 200 ppms...

As per their directions they recommendation ramping up/down the EC/PPMs.

You don't need anywhere near 500ppms until you are getting ready to flip. PLUS, <2 EC during height of flowering, then back off


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## patlpp (Sep 1, 2012)

@pet By no means am I writing V&B off. I always take extra ingredients into consideration. That is why I think PH-Sensi is a good value with its' Fulvic/humic/amino's and wetting agent added. I e-mailed V&B and he said the added Si of ~ 30 ppm is sufficient to reap the Si benefits yet not too much to comprimize PH stability. It sure mixes well, real clean like Dyna.


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## Cuebossa (Sep 1, 2012)

I decided to do some cost comparing. 
Dyna-gro's feed schedule;
Dynagrow Bloom @ Kmart 23.99 qt., suggested 10ml per gallon average, makes 94 gallons, $.25 a gallon
Dynagrow Protekt @ Kmart 17.99 qt., suggested 4ml per gallon average, makes 236 gallons, $.08 a gallon
Dynagrow Mag Pro @ Kmart 26.99 qt. suggested 1ml per gallon average, makes 946 gallons, $.03 a gallon

*Dynagro $.36 a gallon..... 
Veg+Bloom $.24 a gallon..... 

Veg+Bloom works out to be 30% less. Plus, I am using less than 5.5 grams Veg+Bloom per gallon so my cost is actually more like $.20 a gallon. 
*


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## homebrewer (Sep 2, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> I decided to do some cost comparing.
> Dyna-gro's feed schedule;
> Dynagrow Bloom @ Kmart 23.99 qt., suggested 10ml per gallon average, makes 94 gallons, $.25 a gallon
> Dynagrow Protekt @ Kmart 17.99 qt., suggested 4ml per gallon average, makes 236 gallons, $.08 a gallon
> ...


I wasn't comparing VEG+BLOOM to any liquid plant food in particular but since you used DynaGro, we can crunch some numbers to compare. 

1ml of a DG base into a gallon of RO is around 120ppm (.7 scale). So to get to 1.0 EC, you'd need 5.8 mls/gallon. The DG bases run about $50/gallon so that puts the cost of a ml at 1.3 cents ($50/3780mls). 

So to compare apples to apples here, it would cost 7.54 cents to get 1 gallon of RO to 1.0 EC with DG so in my 15 gallons res, a nine week flowering cycle would cost $10.17 (.0754*15*9) as compared to VB which is almost double to cost. 

I'm not saying one food is better than the other, I was just surprised at the cost of this dry food. It works though and your plants look great. Keep up the good work!


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## patlpp (Sep 2, 2012)

@HB you should add pro-tekt costs in also since VB has silica and fulvics and can not be segregated in the measurements. VG has free shipping when you buy 3lbs or more (about 3 lbs equals 1 gallon Dyna dosage wise). I can get dyna @50/gal free shipping all day. When I stated 5.5g/teaspoon I was going off the label. When I actually measured 10 level teaspoons I got 38g so 3.8 g/tsp (more inline with @petflora's measurement) With these amended numbers I get 2.3 grams for an EC of 1 in 1 gallon. 1 lb will feed 195 [email protected] or *10c / gallon*. 

DYNA: 7.5c/gal 
V&B : 10c/gal with silica/fulvic/amino's

@HB if you add pro-tekt what would the dosed per gallon cost be pushed up to ? (if you were to decrease your grow calc and add silica to reach the same EC of 1)? Probably close to 7.5c anyways?

All in all I think they are equal in value given the added stuff in VB


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## homebrewer (Sep 2, 2012)

patlpp said:


> @HB you should add pro-tekt costs in also since VB has silica and fulvics and can not be segregated in the measurements. VG has free shipping when you buy 3lbs or more (about 3 lbs equals 1 gallon Dyna dosage wise). I can get dyna @50/gal free shipping all day. When I stated 5.5g/teaspoon I was going off the label. When I actually measured 10 level teaspoons I got 38g so 3.8 g/tsp (more inline with @petflora's measurement) *With these amended numbers I get 2.3 grams for an EC of 1 in 1 gallon*. 1 lb will feed 195 [email protected] or *10c / gallon*.


Gotcha, that's more inline with what i'd think a dry food would cost.




> DYNA: 7.5c/gal
> V&B : 10c/gal with silica/fulvic/amino's
> 
> @HB if you add pro-tekt what would the dosed per gallon cost be pushed up to ? (if you were to decrease your grow calc and add silica to reach the same EC of 1)? Probably close to 7.5c anyways?


Protekt at a rate of 4mls/gallon and priced around $40/gal adds about $5 to the cost of a grow in my 15 gallon res and adds about 4 cents to the cost of a gallon. So 11.5 cents vs VB's 10 cents.

I'm all for 'cheap and easy' and it definitely looks like VB is easy. Your initial numbers surprised me but it actually does look like VB is cheap afterall.


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## Cuebossa (Sep 3, 2012)

homebrewer said:


> Gotcha, that's more inline with what i'd think a dry food would cost.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I find the simplicity of use a huge value factor as well. 1 part, nothing else to worry about....priceless. I also like that if you keep it in it's container it lasts forever and won't settle like liquids do. 

The Ocean Forest specimen is really putting out the pistils now, I've kept her around 1.3-1.5 EC


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## Lucius Vorenus (Sep 3, 2012)

homebrewer said:


> Gotcha, that's more inline with what i'd think a dry food would cost.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


4ml gallon of Protekt?? I have never used that much.


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## Kite High (Sep 3, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> 4ml gallon of Protekt?? I have never used that much.


I use up 10 ml/gal...upon research 140 ppm showed the most benefit


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## homebrewer (Sep 3, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> 4ml gallon of Protekt?? I have never used that much.


DG 'recommends' 5mls/gal and I use 3mls/gal in veg for my hydro girls. The combination of my base nutes and protekt always puts the pH in my hydro reservoirs at 5.8. I could use less Protekt but I'd be adding _pH up_ instead, pick your poison.


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## CaliMackdaddy (Sep 7, 2012)

Just started using V+B on my soil plants, so far 1 week in and their taking it on pretty well.. ill post pictures of the final results.

450ppm Ro/soft formula might bump it up a bit later in flower then lower it at the end for a flush
Ro water 6.5ph


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## Cuebossa (Sep 7, 2012)

Ocean Forest seems to be producing nice herbs. I am very impressed by how little I need to tend to it. I am watering every other day now and have recently flushed from the 1.4EC I was running due to super dark leaves.


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## CaliMackdaddy (Sep 7, 2012)

Lovely lady bossa, how many watts are your plants under?


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## Cuebossa (Sep 8, 2012)

I have the 4-5 of these under a 600 at all times. Need to stay medicated.


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## stumpjumper (Sep 8, 2012)

Nice! I need a ec meter I guess..

So break that down, how many teaspoons per gallon have you been using? Did you wait until flower to start feeding it VB or was you giving your vegging plant VB on top of the nutes already in the ffof?


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## Cuebossa (Sep 8, 2012)

Get an EC meter, it really helps you dial it in! I Stopped using teaspoons but I would guess it's around 3/4. Yes, I used it from day 1 as it's instantly available. I fed when I transplanted.


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## stumpjumper (Sep 8, 2012)

Wow. That's a lot of nutes, do you have pics of the different stages? My plants have always flourished up to week 4 with just what's in the soil.. I didn't really plan on starting the VB until I flipped. Unless they start acting hungry before of course.

I'd like to see a pic of that plant at 4 weeks veg..


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## Cuebossa (Sep 8, 2012)

Here is a day or two after I transplanted. I only veg for a couple weeks. 
cuebossa-153098-albums-veg-bloom-picture2280954-riu1.jpg 
and that was on 8/3 so I'm about 5 weeks in, I think it really helped build the bones by starting it earlier on


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## Cuebossa (Sep 10, 2012)

I looked back into my blog and noticed that I started my grow at .7 EC. I was then running about 1.3-1.4 through week 5 when I noted the need to flush. I am now on my second flush and will start to feed again at 1.4EC on my next watering. Looking good though and the oil production is great with the Ocean Forest!


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## captainmorgan (Sep 10, 2012)

I bought a TDS meter and should have it in a couple days. Would you guys recommend a feed schedule for Veg + Bloom in soil with FoxFarm happy frog and ocean forest mix. I'm in a late veg scrog 5.2 gal air pots and without a meter have been using .375 tsp per gal.


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## Cuebossa (Sep 11, 2012)

I don't know about Happy Frog, Maybe someone can chime in on how it is different from Ocean Forest. I started my clones out at .7 ec in the OF and started feeding 1.3-1.5 on the regular with occasional flushes. I do think I could have gone lighter now that I look back. The greeness of this girl has me thinking there is a lot of nitrogen hanging around in the OF.


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## stumpjumper (Sep 11, 2012)

Happy Frog is about half as hot as OF.. I mix 2 parts OF to one part HF, then I add a generous amount of perlite to the mix and from now on I will also be adding a handful of dolomite lime also. 

I really don't see a need to start feeding until they are switched to flower, or if you veg longer than 4 weeks then start feeding at week 5. However there are some beneficials in the G+B that would help like the fulvics, and Silica etc.. 

Here's a pic of some plants at week 3 in this mix. They did get a weekly dose of aquarium water though. I'm not saying not to use V+B in the beginning, just be careful because OF is a hot mix in itself.


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## CaliMackdaddy (Sep 11, 2012)

stumpjumper said:


> Happy Frog is about half as hot as OF.. I mix 2 parts OF to one part HF, then I add a generous amount of perlite to the mix and from now on I will also be adding a handful of dolomite lime also.
> 
> I really don't see a need to start feeding until they are switched to flower, or if you veg longer than 4 weeks then start feeding at week 5. However there are some beneficials in the G+B that would help like the fulvics, and Silica etc..
> 
> Here's a pic of some plants at week 3 in this mix. They did get a weekly dose of aquarium water though. I'm not saying not to use V+B in the beginning, just be careful because OF is a hot mix in itself.


Nice green plants, no deficiencies at all from what i can tell


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## captainmorgan (Sep 11, 2012)

stumpjumper said:


> Happy Frog is about half as hot as OF.. I mix 2 parts OF to one part HF, then I add a generous amount of perlite to the mix and from now on I will also be adding a handful of dolomite lime also.
> 
> I really don't see a need to start feeding until they are switched to flower, or if you veg longer than 4 weeks then start feeding at week 5. However there are some beneficials in the G+B that would help like the fulvics, and Silica etc..
> 
> Here's a pic of some plants at week 3 in this mix. They did get a weekly dose of aquarium water though. I'm not saying not to use V+B in the beginning, just be careful because OF is a hot mix in itself.


This is the meter I got coming.
http://www.tdsmeter.com/products/tds4.html

I would have to check the date but I know they are over 6 weeks veg on a 2' x 4' scrog screen which is almost full.I was playing with different lamps and was running too much blue early on and slowed the growth a bit.I haven't taken any pics in about a week,I'll try to take some later.


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## Cuebossa (Sep 14, 2012)

That looks great CM. The trick is to find the continous feed EC by strain/medium. The medium you are growing in has a huge impact on the EC you can or cannot feed your plant. I have flushed these for a couple of irrigations but will go back to 1.6 for the PROMIX and 1.2 for the Ocean Forest. 


PromIx on left, Ocean Forest on right.


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## captainmorgan (Sep 14, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> That looks great CM. The trick is to find the continous feed EC by strain/medium. The medium you are growing in has a huge impact on the EC you can or cannot feed your plant. I have flushed these for a couple of irrigations but will go back to 1.6 for the PROMIX and 1.2 for the Ocean Forest.
> 
> 
> PromIx on left, Ocean Forest on right.


Yea,i'm playing it safe at 300 right now.Going to switch to flower in the next couple days and will bump it up after that.


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## Cuebossa (Sep 18, 2012)

I fed the PROMIX 1.8EC two days ago and the OF 1.4EC two days ago and I am seeing a nice burst of new growth going on week 6 of flower. I plan on doing a good flush tomorrow followed by a feeding with the previously mentioned EC


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## Rcb (Sep 21, 2012)

How is everyone feeding? F,w,w,f,w,w? Or how does v+B work best


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## Cuebossa (Sep 21, 2012)

It really depends on what growing medium you are using and the genetics you have. Coco/peat mixes, 1.5EC every feed with a good flush weekly. Soil bases 1.0-.1.2EC every feed, flush weekly. This is what works with the strain I have been growing. I think the general rule is; the heavier the medium, the lighter the feed. The heavier the medium, the heavier the flush etc. I'll put some current pics up in a bit.


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## Rcb (Sep 21, 2012)

k, hmm well its 20 plants(kryptonite) in soil, Happy frog mixed with some Growstone Super soil Aerator(like perlite but better) so its a little light, and not hot at all, just wasnt sure about how to feed the V+B. Most of the time I F,w,w but I will try the every feed style, how are you flushing every week like a normal flush or are you just water? Im so excited about using this stuff i just hope i have enough to last all the way I got two sample jars. do you think I will need more?


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## Lucius Vorenus (Sep 21, 2012)

Im about 3 weeks in with this stuff. Plants seem happy. Definitely still need a Cal Mag additive though. 

I am feeding 350-400ppm in veg F,F, W

In Flower 600ppm (800 with additives) F, F, W


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## homebrewer (Sep 21, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Im about 3 weeks in with this stuff. Plants seem happy. Definitely still need a Cal Mag additive though.
> 
> I am feeding 350-400ppm in veg F,F, W
> 
> In Flower 600ppm (800 with additives) F, F, W


18% calcium, 6% magnesium and you STILL need more calmag? There is no way.


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## Cuebossa (Sep 21, 2012)

I agree with Homebrewer. With as much Ca and Mg as guaranteed in the product it just isn't possible. You probably just need to raise your EC. At the right EC I haven't run a strain yet that hasn't been happy. Pictures to come this afternoon. WebRep


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## Cuebossa (Sep 21, 2012)

Rcb said:


> k, hmm well its 20 plants(kryptonite) in soil, Happy frog mixed with some Growstone Super soil Aerator(like perlite but better) so its a little light, and not hot at all, just wasnt sure about how to feed the V+B. Most of the time I F,w,w but I will try the every feed style, how are you flushing every week like a normal flush or are you just water? Im so excited about using this stuff i just hope i have enough to last all the way I got two sample jars. do you think I will need more?


Find the EC your strain is capable of digesting. Factors to be considered include light intensity, temperature, and growing medium. Start at 1.2EC and work your way up. Feed,feed,feed at 1.2EC. If no tip burn occurs at 1.2EC after 3 feedings, flush and run 1.6EC for three feedings if tip burn occurs then flush and feed at 1.4EC with every watering and flush with plain water every 10-14 days. Immediately after a flush re-irrigate with Veg+Bloom at 1.4EC. Keep it consistent and your plant will reach it's full potential. I have been experimenting with above peak EC feedings, such as 1.8 in the previous example, with a good flush before each feeding to rinse the roots. It seems to be working well.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Sep 21, 2012)

homebrewer said:


> 18% calcium, 6% magnesium and you STILL need more calmag? There is no way.


I can try to run higher PPM's i suppose but as of late ive become a bigger fan of less is more.


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## homebrewer (Sep 21, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> I can try to run higher PPM's i suppose but as of late ive become a bigger fan of less is more.


What scale is your ppm meter on? If it's the .7 scale, your feeding levels look great. Maybe skip the 'water' day instead of increasing the amount of food. Also, make sure you're watering to the point of runoff. Salt buildup in the medium can cause all kinds of leaf discolorations.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Sep 21, 2012)

homebrewer said:


> What scale is your ppm meter on? If it's the .7 scale, your feeding levels look great. Maybe skip the 'water' day instead of increasing the amount of food. Also, make sure you're watering to the point of runoff. Salt buildup in the medium can cause all kinds of leaf discolorations.


I actually do a zero runoff and have been for the past year. I don't really have any leaf discolorations, just a CalMag deficiency that very well could correct itself. I am only using this stuff a few weeks, we shall see. I did a couple of grows making sure i had a 10% runoff and to be honest, it's not necessary.


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## captainmorgan (Sep 22, 2012)

This is my first grow set up and I'm in the first week of flower with 4 plants after a 8 week veg.
2.5' x 4.5' x 6.5 Cabinet scrog
4 - 5.2 gal airpots with ocean forest, happy frog soil mix
4' - 8 lamp T5 light with 2 - flora suns, 2 - aqua suns, 2 - quantum 2900k, 2 - red suns
Veg + Bloom nutrients
I'm using a HM Digital TDS-4 meter that uses a .5 conversion.
I'm wondering if I should stick to the recommended feed schedule or bump it a bit,seems like others are using a bit more.
With my R/O water I get a reading of 400 @ .5 tsp per gal.


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## jimmy1life (Sep 22, 2012)

I didnt have a problem in coco dtw thou. My plants got even greener then when i used a 3 part GMB with sensical. I still have like a full sample and back to using this with organic supplements. Just cant go wrong it works


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## Cuebossa (Sep 23, 2012)

PROMIX on left, OCEAN FOREST on right. The promix will definitely be heavier but the oil production on the foxfarm still seems a little better. If I had to decide to use one or the other I would lean towards going all promix. I'm doing the flush,feed 1.8EC with the promix and this seemed to help during the swell period, circa week 6.


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## Cuebossa (Sep 27, 2012)

Started these on 8/3. It's been 8 weeks. The Foxfarm really fell behind in the weight department. I am going to push these to 9 weeks and cut them. I have been feeding the PROMIX Veg+BLoom at 1.8EC with a good flush of straight RO before the 1.8 goes in.















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## Cuebossa (Oct 2, 2012)

Another harvest on record. I will get the weight data up as soon as dry. I am really amazed at the different pheno expressions between fox farm ocean forest and the ProMix. 

Ocean Forest





Promix





Ocean Forest





Promix





Ocean Forest





Promix


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## patlpp (Oct 2, 2012)

Are both clones? seems Pro-mix is fatter !! Nice plants regardless. Was it just 2 different mediums and both fed Pro-Mix? 
I'm doing a pro-mix vs AN vs Dyno and Pro-mix and AN are in a dead heat 2 weeks into flower. +REP


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## homebrewer (Oct 2, 2012)

patlpp said:


> Are both clones? seems Pro-mix is fatter !! Nice plants regardless. Was it just 2 different mediums and both fed Pro-Mix?
> I'm doing a pro-mix vs AN vs Dyno and Pro-mix and AN are in a dead heat 2 weeks into flower. +REP


Um, for the sake of your 'test', I hope you realize that promix is not a plant food nor an additive, it's a peat based medium.


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## patlpp (Oct 2, 2012)

Thanks HB. I totally brain-farted. I meant to say Veg-Bloom by Hydro research! While I'm on the subject: the Dyno is a tad behind but I think I overfed early on. I'm doing 5ml grow and 1.5ml Tek in Pro-mix BX feed feed water. Sound bout right? The strain is Super lemon haze . Seems to be somewhat a light feeder.


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## homebrewer (Oct 2, 2012)

patlpp said:


> Thanks HB. I totally brain-farted. I meant to say Veg-Bloom by Hydro research! While I'm on the subject: the Dyno is a tad behind but I think I overfed early on. I'm doing 5ml grow and 1.5ml Tek in Pro-mix BX feed feed water. Sound bout right? The strain is Super lemon haze . Seems to be somewhat a light feeder.


Your ratio of grow-to-protekt would put my pH pretty low and I personally work around a 1:1 ratio. Depending on the size of your plant, 1 tsp of grow is probably a good dose of plant food for a plant in the heat of flowering. Cut that in half for veg.


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## Cuebossa (Oct 4, 2012)

Yes, both clones. 
I'm contemplating which medium to run next. Canna, Happy Frog or Nutrifield?


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## CaliMackdaddy (Oct 7, 2012)

Just started using Veg+bloom on my clones, was using botanicare pure blend origonal.. which burned the hell out of my babies so i switched over, and so far a ton of lush green foliage nice and perky. A couple had damage by my dog, so the small one is still recovering gonna just use it as a mother anyway.

Week 1, Strain is purple barney, Pro-mix potting soil, Air pot .8 gallon, Ro+Ro Veg+Bloom at 400 PPM.


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## captainmorgan (Oct 9, 2012)

Day 20 of flower in 5.2 gal airpot FF soil scrog 8 week veg.From the top they feel like a solid root mass and they drink 16 to 24 ozs a day depending on the temp.I've been using 500 ppm with a .5 TDS meter since day 14 and they look healthy.How high should I push the V+B ppm and what do I look for that shows I need to back off?


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## Cuebossa (Oct 9, 2012)

assuming you are in ocean forest, you could hit the average feeding strain with 700-800 ppm on the .5EC scale. I would do a surge of plain water then hit with 700-800ppm.


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## captainmorgan (Oct 9, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> assuming you are in ocean forest, you could hit the average feeding strain with 700-800 ppm on the .5EC scale. I would do a surge of plain water then hit with 700-800ppm.



50/50 ocean forest and happy frog and at this point after 8 weeks of veg the airpots feel like a solid root mass.I followed their schedule for veg which was about 300 ppm with my R/O water.When I flipped to flower their schedule was 400 ppm,which I did for week 1 and 2. I then did a 3 gal per pot flush after day 14 and stepped up to 500 ppm.It's day 20 and their schedule has a drop in feed strength after week 3.How long would you run 700-800 ppm which for me would be a EC of 1400-1600 and would you cut back at some point except for the flush at the end?


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## Cuebossa (Oct 9, 2012)

Their feed chart isn't detailed enough in my mind. The teaspoon is a kitchen tool not a really accurate measuring device. I would go 700-800ppm or 1.4-1.6EC from weeks 2 on making sure to flush before every application. You might even be able to hit 1.8EC at peak flower. Cut back EC if you see any stress


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## captainmorgan (Oct 9, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> Their feed chart isn't detailed enough in my mind. The teaspoon is a kitchen tool not a really accurate measuring device. I would go 700-800ppm or 1.4-1.6EC from weeks 2 on making sure to flush before every application. You might even be able to hit 1.8EC at peak flower. Cut back EC if you see any stress



How important is the flushing,I really don't have the extra time?It's a scrog in a cabinet and takes a lot of time to flush.I've been watering with nutes twice a day with with smaller amounts and not flooding with overflow.It's usually 16 ozs after lights come on then 8 ozs a hour or two before lights out per pot. They are usually dry enough at lights on that in takes a moment for the water to start to soak in. The only flush I've done is the 3 gal per pot one,and I give them straight water with molasses once a week.Just mixed up a gal with 1 tsp which is twice their schedule and it comes out to 750 ppm or 1.5 EC.


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## CaliMackdaddy (Oct 10, 2012)

captainmorgan said:


> How important is the flushing,I really don't have the extra time?It's a scrog in a cabinet and takes a lot of time to flush.I've been watering with nutes twice a day with with smaller amounts and not flooding with overflow.It's usually 16 ozs after lights come on then 8 ozs a hour or two before lights out per pot. They are usually dry enough at lights on that in takes a moment for the water to start to soak in. The only flush I've done is the 3 gal per pot one,and I give them straight water with molasses once a week.Just mixed up a gal with 1 tsp which is twice their schedule and it comes out to 750 ppm or 1.5 EC.


To flush all you need to do is replace a feed with straight water, dosnt take anymore time then it normally would for a watering.


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## captainmorgan (Oct 10, 2012)

CaliMackdaddy said:


> To flush all you need to do is replace a feed with straight water, dosnt take anymore time then it normally would for a watering.


The term flush seems to mean more than one thing around here to different people.I've read that it's using large quantities of water to clean out a grow medium.Also used when stopping the feeding at the end of flower. And now to alternate between feeds with straight water.The first two make sense,your cleaning the medium and the plant.The last doesn't make as much sense to use that term.Your really just changing the feed schedule.Some of this is a little confusing to a newb.


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## CaliMackdaddy (Oct 10, 2012)

captainmorgan said:


> The term flush seems to mean more than one thing around here to different people.I've read that it's using large quantities of water to clean out a grow medium.Also used when stopping the feeding at the end of flower. And now to alternate between feeds with straight water.The first two make sense,your cleaning the medium and the plant.The last doesn't make as much sense to use that term.Your really just changing the feed schedule.Some of this is a little confusing to a newb.


Well the idea of the Feed Feed Flush is to rinse off salts from the roots so they can easily obtain nutrients when fed again, its very normal with almost all coco/soiless growers. Flushing at the end is to use up the last as of what the soil has in nutrients... Im not the best to explain it but these are very normal methods to growing.


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## CaliMackdaddy (Oct 10, 2012)

Bud shots after using veg+bloom, started 2 weeks into flower but still not bad frost, Also verrrry dense.


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## SoQuick (Oct 11, 2012)

So no reply about shipping to Canada? I'm pretty disappointed.


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## Cuebossa (Oct 12, 2012)

The Promix and Foxfarm came in at just around 70 grams per plant. The Promix is smoother yet the OF has a bit better nose on it. 

Here are a couple shots of the Promix grown Jack the Ripper, very light green and pungent. You can smell a small nugget across a large room


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## Cuebossa (Oct 14, 2012)

Wow, the flavor was outstanding from the PROMIX grown herb. I smoked out a group of 6 friends around the camp fire this weekend and everyone was blown away by how smooth and tasty these came out. The Foxfarm was a not as smooth.


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## CaliMackdaddy (Oct 15, 2012)

Check out the frost on these nugs, i lost a bit in yield running v+b but the quality is better then ive ever done. Couple more runs and i could prob yield a lot more then previously without a doubt. Also the smell is AMAZING It litterally blows me away everytime i smell my fingers.... Dont wanna sound like im trying to sell anything, i used the product and i love it, simple as that.
Blueberry kush nug shots... Cuebossa jelly?


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## Lucius Vorenus (Oct 15, 2012)

CaliMackdaddy said:


> Check out the frost on these nugs, i lost a bit in yield running v+b but the quality is better then ive ever done. Couple more runs and i could prob yield a lot more then previously without a doubt. Also the smell is AMAZING It litterally blows me away everytime i smell my fingers.... Dont wanna sound like im trying to sell anything, i used the product and i love it, simple as that.
> Blueberry kush nug shots... Cuebossa jelly?



Which additives are you using?


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## CaliMackdaddy (Oct 15, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Which additives are you using?


What additives, it was straight Veg+Bloom


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## WattSaver (Oct 16, 2012)

I got a little problem with the V&B in my trial run. When I mix it up, it gives me a ph of 6.5 or 6.6 which would be great if I was growing in soil. But I'm running passive hydro hempy buckets, and I want a ph of 5.8. And it takes just as much ph down to move it from 6.5 to 5.8 as it does to drop my regular water (50/50 tap & RO ph 7.0) down to 5.8. I'm using the RO V&B. Would using the tap/well V&B drop the ph down to the 5.5 to 6.0 I'm looking for???


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## Lucius Vorenus (Oct 16, 2012)

WattSaver said:


> I got a little problem with the V&B in my trial run. When I mix it up, it gives me a ph of 6.5 or 6.6 which would be great if I was growing in soil. But I'm running passive hydro hempy buckets, and I want a ph of 5.8. And it takes just as much ph down to move it from 6.5 to 5.8 as it does to drop my regular water (50/50 tap & RO ph 7.0) down to 5.8. I'm using the RO V&B. Would using the tap/well V&B drop the ph down to the 5.5 to 6.0 I'm looking for???


My only complaint with it actually. I end up at 6.3.

Also my Blue Dream definitely needs Cal Mag with it.


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## Cuebossa (Oct 16, 2012)

WattSaver said:


> I got a little problem with the V&B in my trial run. When I mix it up, it gives me a ph of 6.5 or 6.6 which would be great if I was growing in soil. But I'm running passive hydro hempy buckets, and I want a ph of 5.8. And it takes just as much ph down to move it from 6.5 to 5.8 as it does to drop my regular water (50/50 tap & RO ph 7.0) down to 5.8. I'm using the RO V&B. Would using the tap/well V&B drop the ph down to the 5.5 to 6.0 I'm looking for???


I started this thread using the hardwater formula. My tap water here is 8.0ph with 400 ppm(.5EC) hardness. At 1 tsp to a gallon it dropped my ph to around 6.0. I'm guessing the hardwater formula would be the solution to your needs. I've also noticed that anyone who has complained of Ca/Mg deficiency has only needed to slightly raise their EC to solve their problem...not use CalMag.


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## Cuebossa (Oct 16, 2012)

CaliMackdaddy said:


> Blueberry kush nug shots... Cuebossa jelly?


haha! Very impressive!


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## srfjay (Oct 17, 2012)

One thing I have to say is I ordered a sample and it got to me door in 3 days that has been better then a lot of stuff I payed for online haha. I am going to try if out on some early moms I have in coco and see how it does. It does seem there customer support is top notch .


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## Cuebossa (Oct 22, 2012)

I had several questions when I started using Veg+Bloom and was always given answers promptly when I emailed. 
I'll have some pics up by end of week. I have a Chernobyl going that is almost 2 weeks into flower in ProMix and looking great!


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## NoBarriers (Oct 22, 2012)

Just got an email that my sample is on the way. My clones are one week in the Cloner so the timing is perfect. I'm going to run 2 k using it and another 2 k running heavy 16. I'll see how it works out..


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## Cuebossa (Oct 25, 2012)

Back to the Promix for this Chernobyl lady. I'm running straight Veg+Bloom @ 1.6 EC. Already a couple of weeks into flower. This was given to me a little stunted so I don't think I will be getting much more vertical growth out of her. Here we go.


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## patlpp (Oct 25, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> Back to the Promix for this Chernobyl lady. I'm running straight Veg+Bloom @ 1.6 EC. Already a couple of weeks into flower. This was given to me a little stunted so I don't think I will be getting much more vertical growth out of her. Here we go.


I'm running mine in pro-mix at the recommended 3/4 tsp/gal. Aren't you running it a bit hot?


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## Cuebossa (Oct 25, 2012)

Not for this pheno. I've already narrowed it down to between 1.6-1.8 . I've had other strains start to curl at this EC but not Chernobyl. I try to find a strains tolerance during that first week or two of flower. I found the directions to be too light for the aggressive growth I like to see in my first 2 weeks.


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## patlpp (Oct 25, 2012)

I think you're on to something there. I'm finding at 3/4 tsp the buds seem a bit light but my god!! the trichs are fantastic! I'm growing Super Lemon Haze testing Dyna, Sensi and V&B and V&B is #1 in bud sites and trichs BUT less dense bud. Dyna has the best bud density but lacks the amount of bud sites and trichs. AN wins with good density, as numerous bud sites as V&B, and heavy trichs. (so far) . I would grow with any of these 3 nutes for sure. Seems each has it's pro's and con's.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Oct 26, 2012)

patlpp said:


> I think you're on to something there. I'm finding at 3/4 tsp the buds seem a bit light but my god!! the trichs are fantastic! I'm growing Super Lemon Haze testing Dyna, Sensi and V&B and V&B is #1 in bud sites and trichs BUT less dense bud. Dyna has the best bud density but lacks the amount of bud sites and trichs. AN wins with good density, as numerous bud sites as V&B, and heavy trichs. (so far) . I would grow with any of these 3 nutes for sure. Seems each has it's pro's and con's.


yea have TONS of budsites with the Veg+Bloom so far. Good size nugs as well. Im about week 5-6 now, density is def not there. Not sure why that is. Have TONS of lumens and temps in low 70's to see if that helps. I typically go around 77-80.


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## Cuebossa (Oct 26, 2012)

patlpp said:


> I think you're on to something there. I'm finding at 3/4 tsp the buds seem a bit light but my god!! the trichs are fantastic! I'm growing Super Lemon Haze testing Dyna, Sensi and V&B and V&B is #1 in bud sites and trichs BUT less dense bud. Dyna has the best bud density but lacks the amount of bud sites and trichs. AN wins with good density, as numerous bud sites as V&B, and heavy trichs. (so far) . I would grow with any of these 3 nutes for sure. Seems each has it's pro's and con's.


Try the flush/feed technique I was trying to communicate a few pages back. Flush your plants with lets say 1 litre and then follow that immediately with 1 litre of V+B,1.8EC or slightly above your regular feed strength, to surge growth. I have noticed this produces results when applied weeks 5,6,7. Something to play with at least.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Oct 26, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> Try the flush/feed technique I was trying to communicate a few pages back. Flush your plants with lets say 1 litre and then follow that immediately with 1 litre of V+B,1.8EC or slightly above your regular feed strength, to surge growth. I have noticed this produces results when applied weeks 5,6,7. Something to play with at least.


What is the purpose of that?


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## Cuebossa (Oct 26, 2012)

It helps harden up flowers. Strain mileage will vary of course. It's worth a try. I have been getting more aggressive in the ProMix and am trying to max out my growth potential in any way possible without complicating my regimen.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Oct 26, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> It helps harden up flowers. Strain mileage will vary of course. It's worth a try. I have been getting more aggressive in the ProMix and am trying to max out my growth potential in any way possible without complicating my regimen.



Never heard that before. What would cause that?


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## Cuebossa (Oct 27, 2012)

I'm not sure. Maybe it changes the water/nutrient ratio which in turn stimulates the roots? I'm liking it


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## Cuebossa (Oct 31, 2012)

the Chernobyl is moving along nicely. 1 week later and it looks like we should have colas soon.


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## Alter Ego (Nov 1, 2012)

Cue, I am vey impressed with your growing abilities. Thank you for providing raw data and keeping your cool when other members (haters) were trying to rain on your parade. I have a tub of V+B hard water formula sitting around. Just can't decide if I want to use soil or straight coco. I am thinking about 50% coco and 50% EWC. What is your take on that if I were to use V+B from seed to harvest?

TIA,
-Alter


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## Lucius Vorenus (Nov 1, 2012)

Conclusion. This nute is a great BASE. Do not assume it is as complete as a 2 part and definitely don't think it can be used in Flower alone and grow big buds. Its a good BASE. If you go into it with that knowledge and plenty of beneficials to add during flower, you might be impressed.

Here is why I do like it. No longer need Cal MAg, no longer need Silica. For that reason alone, its my new favorite BASE nute for flower and veg.


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## Cuebossa (Nov 1, 2012)

I'd like to hear about what you find using additives with Veg+Bloom. I'm always looking for something new to try and am at a point where I think I'm done testing soilless medias and ready to try an additive or two. 

Fwiw ProMix is my soilless media of choice. I'll be doing my testing from here out in Promix for consistency sake.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Nov 1, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> I'd like to hear about what you find using additives with Veg+Bloom. I'm always looking for something new to try and am at a point where I think I'm done testing soilless medias and ready to try an additive or two.
> 
> Fwiw ProMix is my soilless media of choice. I'll be doing my testing from here out in Promix for consistency sake.



Promix is great. I personally use Sunshine Advanced #4 but i think they are both on par. I believe less is more so I just use a Mychorrizae (Great White) and Floralicious Plus as well as a Bloom Booster (MOAB). I feed carbs as well week 2-7. Sweet Raw.


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## Alter Ego (Nov 1, 2012)

Well, FWIW...I know EWC has over 50+ trace elements. I would think that coco/EWC plus V+B would be a pretty solid platform for quality buds. I would like it if anyone with experience woulds chime in. I'm thinking in terms of simplicity.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Nov 1, 2012)

Alter Ego said:


> Well, FWIW...I know EWC has over 50+ trace elements. I would think that coco/EWC plus V+B would be a pretty solid platform for quality buds. I would like it if anyone with experience woulds chime in. I'm thinking in terms of simplicity.


what is EWC?


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## CaliMackdaddy (Nov 2, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> what is EWC?


Earth worm castings


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## Lucius Vorenus (Nov 2, 2012)

CaliMackdaddy said:


> Earth worm castings



ah gotcha. I always put a small amount ot EWC in my Sunshine Advanced #4 as well. Not sure if I get much benefit from it since I use synthetics but who knows.


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## CaliMackdaddy (Nov 2, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> ah gotcha. I always put a small amount ot EWC in my Sunshine Advanced #4 as well. Not sure if I get much benefit from it since I use synthetics but who knows.


has a small ammount of N, but other then that if your not feeding beanies on a regular basis.. probably not.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Nov 2, 2012)

CaliMackdaddy said:


> has a small ammount of N, but other then that if your not feeding beanies on a regular basis.. probably not.


The longer im growing the more im learning whats most important rather than what nutrient is doing what etc, is Oxygen to the roots and the importance of it. Lots of Bacterias being added to the medium and running lower PPMs (800-1100 in flower). I also Feed, Feed, Water now and its doing us up right.


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## CaliMackdaddy (Nov 2, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> The longer im growing the more im learning whats most important rather than what nutrient is doing what etc, is Oxygen to the roots and the importance of it. Lots of Bacterias being added to the medium and running lower PPMs (800-1100 in flower). I also Feed, Feed, Water now and its doing us up right.


Were all students of nature ;D


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## captainmorgan (Nov 4, 2012)

Day 46 of flower,I noticed a couple yellow spots along the sides of a few sugar leaves on the top half of a few buds and the rest are deep green.Been using only Veg+Bloom at 1.5 EC for probably 3 weeks and the only change was I applied some BMO super plant tonic in the last week.I've got 4 plants in scrog under T5 HO using 5 gal air pots with fox farm soil mix and noticed a growth spurt in the last week and I did a small flush a week ago and I give them molasses once a week.It's only noticeable on 6 or 8 flowers,any thoughts on this?
Fan leaves show mite damage,predators are working on that problem.


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## TheEvilBanana (Nov 5, 2012)

Hey guys. I also saw a mag deficiency in week 3 of veg with V+B. I ended up adding 50 ppm of cal/mag to my res then added my V+B nutes up to the ppm I wanted. The dificency went away but next time I will try bumping up the PPMs as suggested by other V+B users. Otherwise they are doing great. 4 week veg produced 18-22 inch plants with topping, supercropping, and FIMing.

As far as amount needed. I have a 40 gallon res. I run R/O water from my filter which produces 0 ppm, ph of 6.1 water. I'm in week 1 of flower (just switched on halloween) and I'm feeding my plants at 600 ppm right now. I just changed my res last night and it took 11 teaspoons of V+B for r/o to get to 600 ppm. It brought my ph down to 5.4 so I added a little bit of up and I'm good to go. 

I've been having issues connecting my camera to my computer but I'll put some pics up soon. I have 18 bananarama (banana Cush/trainwreck) under 2k hps in an ebb and flow system using rockwool cubes on a coco mat though I plan on switching mediums next round. I've found the rockwool holds a lot of salts and needs to be flushed quite a bit with V+B nutes. I'm annoyed I can't move them around. But that's a different issue. (user error in choosing my medium)

This is my first true hydro grow so I do not want to compare it with the results I've had with soil but I'm more than willing to share my experiences and results with veg and bloom. It seems to be working well but only time will tell.


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## WattSaver (Nov 6, 2012)

I've been trying a new medium called Basement Mix, it's coco based instead of peat based like pro-mix and sunshine, I like it alot so far


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## Lucius Vorenus (Nov 6, 2012)

WattSaver said:


> I've been trying a new medium called Basement Mix, it's coco based instead of peat based like pro-mix and sunshine, I like it alot so far View attachment 2400698


Looks pretty Gucci. how much it cost? I get like $45 for 6.0cf of Sunshine Advanced


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## Saran (Nov 7, 2012)

Way to organic for me. The Lava rock's a nice touch.


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## WattSaver (Nov 8, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Looks pretty Gucci. how much it cost? I get like $45 for 6.0cf of Sunshine Advanced


It's not that cheap. It's the same price at my hydro shop as FFOF soil $14/bag.

It works well in my growing system. I veg in soil (2 to 3 qts) then transplant to either coco, or perlite hempy buckets. The basement mix seems to be a better feeding medium than FFoF soil, in my side by side tests with my normal fert program, I'm going to run clones of my current seed run next to compare V&B against my normal fert program.


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## Cuebossa (Nov 10, 2012)

I'm using Happy Frog on one of my JTR ladies. Happy Frog is definitely a heavier mix but seems lighter than Ocean Forest . I've been right around 1.3 EC Veg+Bloom from the get go and nothing but steady sturdy growth thus far.


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## captainmorgan (Nov 12, 2012)

This is my very first grow and I used 432 watts of T5's only in 5 gal airpots.My friend that has grow for a few years looked at them yesterday and told me they are rock hard bud's and very sticky and he thought 12 to 15 ounces cured.It's day 54 and they're showing some amber so it's 48 hours of dark after lights out tonight and Wednesday night chop.I went up to 1.5 EC of Veg+Bloom in flower.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Nov 12, 2012)

captainmorgan said:


> This is my very first grow and I used 432 watts of T5's only in 5 gal airpots.My friend that has grow for a few years looked at them yesterday and told me they are rock hard bud's and very sticky and he thought 12 to 15 ounces cured.It's day 54 and they're showing some amber so it's 48 hours of dark after lights out tonight and Wednesday night chop.I went up to 1.5 EC of Veg+Bloom in flower.


Looks great. Using 3000k bulbs in your T5? Don't forget to flush


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## captainmorgan (Nov 12, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Looks great. Using 3000k bulbs in your T5? Don't forget to flush


Gave each of them a gallon of RO water this morning and cut all the long stemmed fan leaves off.My flower lamps are 2 Quantum 2900's,2 Zoomed Flora Sun's,2 UVL Red Sun's and 2 UVL 660's.


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## jstone1633 (Nov 20, 2012)

Can anyone who has gotten the free sample tell me how it comes packaged? Is it a plain package or does it say what it is coming to your door?


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## Cuebossa (Nov 25, 2012)

Very nice CaprtainM. Nice and organized. Current Happy Frog test running @ 1.2 EC on my favorite clone to date, Jack the Ripper. I have not flushed at all and have fed at this EC constantly


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## Cuebossa (Nov 28, 2012)

Really starting to swell


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## Cuebossa (Dec 7, 2012)

JTR in Happy Frog running at 1.4EC Veg+Bloom = Very happy plant


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## Cuebossa (Dec 10, 2012)

a couple more of JTR in Happy Frog with Veg+Bloom @ 1.4-1.6EC


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## robert030188 (Dec 12, 2012)

Looking good on the OG...just doin my first grow with veg+bloom and so far i cant complain, i even add a little more P-K when in flower. Here is a pic of mine in 2nd week flower


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## robert030188 (Dec 12, 2012)

Looking good on the OG...just doin my first grow with veg+bloom and so far i cant complain, i even add a little more P-K when in flower. Here is a pic of mine in 2nd week of flower


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## robert030188 (Dec 12, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> Looking good on the OG...just doin my first grow with veg+bloom and so far i cant complain, i even add a little more P-K when in flower. Here is a pic of mine in 2nd week flower...how do you add a pic on mobile?


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## robert030188 (Dec 12, 2012)

Mine is the short one in front, other two are my friends...he just switched to veg+bloom right before this pic. hoping his come out better than they look, i'll keep ya posted


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## Lucius Vorenus (Dec 14, 2012)

Been running this for awhile now. Definitely our new go to nute for Veg. In Flower however, we are getting all kinds of deficiencies running 800-900ppm. Def needed to start adding Cal Mag.


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## chuck estevez (Dec 14, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Been running this for awhile now. Definitely our new go to nute for Veg. In Flower however, we are getting all kinds of deficiencies running 800-900ppm. Def needed to start adding Cal Mag.


 what formula are you running? i am using the r/o that is suppose to have cal/mag in a higher ratio. Just used for the first time yesterday.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Dec 14, 2012)

chuck estevez said:


> what formula are you running? i am using the r/o that is suppose to have cal/mag in a higher ratio. Just used for the first time yesterday.


using the RO version and RO water. 400ppm in Veg has been working great on a Feed Feed Water schedule. In Flower we are struggling to dial it in. Have tried 800-900ppm every feed and every other thusfar. Plants yellowed out bigtime.


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## robert030188 (Dec 14, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> using the RO version and RO water. 400ppm in Veg has been working great on a Feed Feed Water schedule. In Flower we are struggling to dial it in. Have tried 800-900ppm every feed and every other thusfar. Plants yellowed out bigtime.


Are you growing hydroponic with a watering system? If so ppm should be like 1200...i've never had a cal/mag deficiency using this product...what straine are you growing?


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## Lucius Vorenus (Dec 14, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> Are you growing hydroponic with a watering system? If so ppm should be like 1200...i've never had a cal/mag deficiency using this product...what straine are you growing?



Top feeding in Coco.

And for you guys that are clearly working for Veg + Bloom ie you sign up just to post on this thread) you're not helping the product out. 

Its a good product.


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## ProfessorPotSnob (Dec 14, 2012)

This Product may be the newest rave and rant all in one , I think somebody needs to speak up and tell the truth here as well . Not just those that have interest in this company and product but the supposed man Chris behind this needs to speak up as well . 

Clearly the labeling issues are bound to confuse many and just about all , the same goes for the feeding schedule ect ... All the hype and nothing of Scientific basis to back this product posted within the company website . I have had a sample of this handed to me as well but after reading this shit I dont even know what to think .. Visited the website considering the product came with little consumer info , found nothing more there either .. 

I am not here to stand on either side of the fence as I have no intentions of taking sides here .. But with that said I have grown some Fire Ass Dank weed with Maxi products time after time . My wife thought Veg +Bloom was laundry soap initially due to its smell .. 

I suppose I ll have to run this one time for a real comparison .. I have to say though that I surely wont follow the suggested amount , I have come to conclusion that this companies Feed Schedule is just as questionable as the ratio of Nutrients within the product .. 

Game on , I am in and will post some shots when I actually have a Maxi comparison to post !


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## Cuebossa (Dec 14, 2012)

Starting this thread has been a great learning experience. I've now run 4-5 strains, in 4-5 different mediums, using one nutrient product. Veg+Bloom has consistently performed for me without any deficiencies in coco, soilless and soil. No cal/mag or pk boosts. The proof is in the pics. 

I'm running an White Fire OG right now(3 weeks in), Happy Frog with Veg+Bloom at 1.3EC occasionally 1.6EC and things are looking great! 







​


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## Lucius Vorenus (Dec 14, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> Starting this thread has been a great learning experience. I've now run 4-5 strains, in 4-5 different mediums, using one nutrient product. Veg+Bloom has consistently performed for me without any deficiencies in coco, soilless and soil. No cal/mag or pk boosts. The proof is in the pics.
> 
> I'm running an White Fire OG right now(3 weeks in), Happy Frog with Veg+Bloom at 1.3EC occasionally 1.6EC and things are looking great!
> 
> ...


The only problem is the pics you post have been posted on numerous forums under many different user names so we all kinda alreasdy know you ARE Veg+Bloom.

Like i said, that doesn't help you or other growers, we would rather you just post as Veg+Bloom.


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## Cuebossa (Dec 15, 2012)

Lucius, I'm not Veg+bloom. I use Veg+bloom, but thats where the relationship ends. You've actually presented this conspiracy before and I've answered the same. I'm a big beliver in finding things that work and sharing them. It makes me feel good. Maybe post some pics of your problematic plants and I can help you figure out why they are yellowing?? now that would be productive  I'll hve harvest pics by Monday. The JTR I am chopping are some of the best yet! Very excited to have some fresh smoke for new years!


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## PJ Diaz (Dec 15, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> The only problem is the pics you post have been posted on numerous forums under many different user names so we all kinda alreasdy know you ARE Veg+Bloom.
> 
> Like i said, that doesn't help you or other growers, we would rather you just post as Veg+Bloom.


Why can't he post under different user names on other forums? That's just silly.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Dec 15, 2012)

PJ Diaz said:


> Why can't he post under different user names on other forums? That's just silly.


dude he's a shill for veg+bloom. its nto big deal, Advanced has hundreds of them.


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## patlpp (Dec 15, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Advanced has hundreds of them.


Because it works !! . I go into hydro store after hydro store....all say Advanced is the best seller. Why? Because the shit WORKS


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## Lucius Vorenus (Dec 15, 2012)

patlpp said:


> Because it works !! . I go into hydro store after hydro store....all say Advanced is the best seller. Why? Because the shit WORKS


Of course it does. So does Miracle Grow and Osmocote. We have done side by sides and the bases are almost identical in growth.


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## chuck estevez (Dec 15, 2012)

patlpp said:


> Because it works !! . I go into hydro store after hydro store....all say Advanced is the best seller. Why? Because the shit WORKS


or the real truth, the mark up is 50% and they make the most $$$ on it. now what sounds more realistic?


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## patlpp (Dec 15, 2012)

chuck estevez said:


> or the real truth, the mark up is 50% and they make the most $$$ on it. now what sounds more realistic?


So the markup is 50% and that's why they buy it? Your statement as to why it is a best seller makes no sense. If you are saying AN makes 50% profit...so what. Study business and you will find that would actually be on the low side.

I get Sensi for $14/liter (A&B total). Sups just as cheap (25% cheaper than list) Notice also that on the Internet, AN usually ships free.


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## chuck estevez (Dec 15, 2012)

patlpp said:


> I get Sensi for $14/liter (A&B total). Sups just as cheap. Notice also that on the Internet, AN usually ships free.


 right, and that's what growers want, AN shipped to there door. So, you get the base for $14, now add in everything to make it complete.


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## patlpp (Dec 15, 2012)

chuck estevez said:


> right, and that's what growers want, AN shipped to there door. So, you get the base for $14, now add in everything to make it complete.


It is complete except for it is just a little light on Mg. Tell me what the base is missing?


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## Chiggachamp (Dec 15, 2012)

after seeing this thread i thought "ill give this nute line up a go" so i orf
derd a 1lb for 20 bucks. took like 2 weeks to get here. i ckmplained about how slow it was and they sent 2 free lbs too me for free and they over nighted em. so i got 3 lbs for 20 bucks. 
after having server cal mag def i finally added calmag to my soil-less mix and my growth took off. 
i just go to ppms and put about 350 of v+b and 150 ppm of calmag and about 75 ppm of silica product and sum ph down this product works. no doubt about it. i like it it dissolves easy and its gonna last me awhile and i have a perpetual set up.


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## Chiggachamp (Dec 15, 2012)

i agree with pat ^


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## patlpp (Dec 15, 2012)

Chiggachamp said:


> after seeing this thread i thought "ill give this nute line up a go" so i orf
> derd a 1lb for 20 bucks. took like 2 weeks to get here. i ckmplained about how slow it was and they sent 2 free lbs too me for free and they over nighted em. so i got 3 lbs for 20 bucks.
> after having server cal mag def i finally added calmag to my soil-less mix and my growth took off.
> i just go to ppms and put about 350 of v+b and 150 ppm of calmag and about 75 ppm of silica product and sum ph down this product works. no doubt about it. i like it it dissolves easy and its gonna last me awhile and i have a perpetual set up.


I'd go with 500 - 600 ppm (1-1.2 EC) v&G - Remember the micro's are in the base so it is good strategy to go with as much base as you can. V&G has Silica in it at the rate of 30 PPM. The scientist dude said that is all one really needs of silica. (unless UR in soil, in which case you need none) I don't see how you need cal/mag when it's loaded with it. Try it with more base and no cal/mag and see how it goes.


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## Chiggachamp (Dec 15, 2012)

patlpp said:


> I'd go with 500 - 600 ppm (1-1.2 EC) v&G - Remember the micro's are in the base so it is good strategy to go with as much base as you can. V&G has Silica in it at the rate of 30 PPM. The scientist dude said that is all one really needs of silica. (unless UR in soil, in which case you need none) I don't see how you need cal/mag when it's loaded with it. Try it with more base and no cal/mag and see how it goes.


Lemme explain my story....
i seen op post results with vb and roots organic. Thinking there is only one roots organic I asked my hydro shop for a couple bags and he brought them out. And I planted my tga gear they all were doing great until about 3 weeks in and they all started dying. I had my ph at 5.8 because I thought it was pure coco. (shoulda read the bagbut ima dummy) and once I talked to a friend he said I had the soilless mix of roots organic and to numb my ph up to 6.5. After I threw out my shitty plants that were over two months from seed and only 7 inches tall and really skinny. I started new gear same medium same vb. my growth took off. So I thought maybe I don't need calmag and my plants were a nice lush green. As soon as I stopped adding calmag I started showing signs of deficiency. As soon as I out back into my feed my plants look good. 
Should I bumb up my Ppms? Like I said my last feed was at about 400 of vb. they are really healty plants so I'm sure Icahn bumb it up but I don't wanna over do it.


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## Chiggachamp (Dec 15, 2012)

I'll def bumb my Ppms up too six and see how it goes bro. I'm gonna feed tonight so I'll get back to u in a couple days!


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## captainmorgan (Dec 15, 2012)

For what it's worth from a newb.I used veg+bloom from start to finish on my first ever grow and had nice results I'm told.Ran .6 to .8 EC in veg and up to 1.5 to 1.6 EC in bloom and only had some slight yellowing of leaves in the last week.


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## Chiggachamp (Dec 16, 2012)

i dknt kno hiw to read the ec. idk if my meter has that. im sure it does i just always went by ppms. 

did u use any aditives? and what did u run it in? coco soil hydro?


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## Lucius Vorenus (Dec 16, 2012)

Chiggachamp said:


> i dknt kno hiw to read the ec. idk if my meter has that. im sure it does i just always went by ppms.
> 
> did u use any aditives? and what did u run it in? coco soil hydro?


Just cut the number in half and add 2 zeros.. and you're close. 1.0 ec = 500ppm roughly but then again i don't use EC i use a Truncheon and go off of PPm. 400 in veg and 800ppm in Flower, sometimes a bit more.


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## Cuebossa (Dec 17, 2012)

Harvest time. Again I ran these in Happy Frog and Promix. The Happy Frog were definitely happier plants but the finished promix buds seemed a little more ripe. I think I may have been underfeeding the promix plants at 1.2-1.6EC which was definitely the right dose for the Happy Frog plants. So 500-800ppm seemed right for the Happy Frog but I think I could have gone 900-1000ppm with the promix. 












promix lower cola, bigger calyx


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## robert030188 (Dec 17, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Top feeding in Coco.
> 
> And for you guys that are clearly working for Veg + Bloom ie you sign up just to post on this thread) you're not helping the product out.
> 
> Its a good product.


Shit i'd bump it up a bit, by like 100 ppm or so...feed as much as they'll take. coco is real airy base so kinda like a water system. first grow on my own with veg+bloom, hopefully have more pics tonight


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## Chiggachamp (Dec 18, 2012)

I'm not having really any probs with vb now. I bumped up my Ppm's to 600. With no added calmag only ph up. 
They look happy but nly time will tell. 
PIE like this soiless mix but I think I should double up on the perlite to get it to dry quicker. I only feed twice a week maybe


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## robert030188 (Dec 18, 2012)

Chiggachamp said:


> I'm not having really any probs with vb now. I bumped up my Ppm's to 600. With no added calmag only ph up.
> They look happy but nly time will tell.
> PIE like this soiless mix but I think I should double up on the perlite to get it to dry quicker. I only feed twice a week maybe


I actually feed non stop while in flower too...just mess with your measurment some like more some less just depends on straine and lighting, post a pic i'd like to see your babies


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## robert030188 (Dec 18, 2012)

my baby as of today...let me know if their is anything that looks like it could use improvement


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## homebrewer (Dec 19, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> Lucius, I'm not Veg+bloom. I use Veg+bloom, but thats where the relationship ends. You've actually presented this conspiracy before and I've answered the same. I'm a big beliver in finding things that work and sharing them. It makes me feel good. Maybe post some pics of your problematic plants and I can help you figure out why they are yellowing?? now that would be productive  I'll hve harvest pics by Monday. The JTR I am chopping are some of the best yet! Very excited to have some fresh smoke for new years!


I love the paranoid, conspiracy theorist stoners on this forum. I can't tell if it's the herb or their age that makes them that way but one thing is for sure, they don't like it when their $500 collection of snake oils perform half as well as a simple base nutrient with good ratios.


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## Chiggachamp (Dec 19, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> I actually feed non stop while in flower too...just mess with your measurment some like more some less just depends on straine and lighting, post a pic i'd like to see your babies


What kinda light u using? 
And I will post sum in a week no computer just iPad aha. I got sum in veg and bloom (pun intended) lol but the ones in bloom suck ass. They are about done. They are all small as hell because I used a new medium thinking it was coco only to find it to be coco base soulless medium so my ph was off by almost a whole point completely locking out all my micro nutes. so they are tiny only flowered to see what I had cloning


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## homebrewer (Dec 19, 2012)

patlpp said:


> Dyna-gro (except foliage-pro) sucks ass for ratio's. *What is the advantage of 3x too much phosphorous and 50% ammoniacal nitro that makes it so good? *Dyna is a generic mix catering to too many type plants with too many compromises.
> The only time Advanced performed half as well is when you were doing the growing.


I can explain it to you if you'd like but I have a feeling you wouldn't get it, just like you generally 'don't get it' when I explain things to you. This is also the wrong thread for that. I've noticed you like throwing your two cents in on these different plant food brands whether it's pertinent or not yet you have no grow journals here. I guess we'll just take your word for it since you seem like such a level-headed and rational guy .


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## rocpilefsj (Dec 19, 2012)

Keep the posts relevant and please refrain from personal attacks or posting obscene pics please. Play nicely children!


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## Cuebossa (Dec 19, 2012)

Gentleman please.... Here is another older indica variety that I have in the promix and running at 1.2-1.6 and loving it. More pics as this lovely ladies fills out.


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## robert030188 (Dec 19, 2012)

Chiggachamp said:


> What kinda light u using?
> And I will post sum in a week no computer just iPad aha. I got sum in veg and bloom (pun intended) lol but the ones in bloom suck ass. They are about done. They are all small as hell because I used a new medium thinking it was coco only to find it to be coco base soulless medium so my ph was off by almost a whole point completely locking out all my micro nutes. so they are tiny only flowered to see what I had cloning


I use cfls personally and i know alot of people get bashed for it but i dont see why. i can get just as many lumens from cfls as hps, mh, or LED. Right now im on 12,000 lumens 3 65 watt 2700k for one plant and 10,000 is more than sufficient for one. $39 for all three i save energy out the ass compared to HPS. if you do the math you'll find the cost in the beginning may be higher to get 100,000 lumens but in the long run they'll spend more and get the same bud pretty much. How far from being done are you? Never give up even if it seems hopeless your girls are probably stronger than you think. if you can change medium i would if your PH is off


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## PJ Diaz (Dec 19, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> I use cfls personally and i know alot of people get bashed for it but i dont see why. i can get just as many lumens from cfls as hps, mh, or LED. Right now im on 12,000 lumens 3 65 watt 2700k for one plant and 10,000 is more than sufficient for one. $39 for all three i save energy out the ass compared to HPS. if you do the math you'll find the cost in the beginning may be higher to get 100,000 lumens but in the long run they'll spend more and get the same bud pretty much. How far from being done are you? Never give up even if it seems hopeless your girls are probably stronger than you think. if you can change medium i would if your PH is off


I don't know where you learned math or cost efficiency, but you are wrong.

You don't believe me? Let me prove you wrong then.

So, you say you have a CFL system which is more efficient than HPS, right? So, you have 12,000 lumens, right? That's running 195 watts of cfl, right?

195w cfl = 12,000 lumens (assuming what you say is true)
200w hps = 22,000 lumens (fact: http://www.lectrons.com/product/200-watt-et18-144.cfm )

So, please explain to me how HPS is costing more, and less effective than HID. Seems to me that you get almost twice as much output from the hps vs the cfl.

Honestly, your plants look very stretchy. I could tell you have light issues (which I already had assumed cfl) before you even said cfl.


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## robert030188 (Dec 19, 2012)

Correction 55 watt-150 watt incandescent equivalent. Now tack on cooling costs for the hps..the only reason my plant is stretched is because i was not the one tending it for a week. i have since fixed the problem and my later posts will prove that you should follow my thread. I dont expect you to agree. and these are low end cfls i can get 2 cfls doing 130 watts get 20,000 lumens, don't have to worry about heat, and the bulb lasts longer...you also need a ballast and hood. I can put cfl where ever i want w/o worry. But this argument will never end...


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## PJ Diaz (Dec 19, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> Correction 55 watt-150 watt incandescent equivalent. Now tack on cooling costs for the hps..the only reason my plant is stretched is because i was not the one tending it for a week. i have since fixed the problem and my later posts will prove that you should follow my thread. I dont expect you to agree. and these are low end cfls i can get 2 cfls doing 130 watts get 20,000 lumens, don't have to worry about heat, and the bulb lasts longer...you also need a ballast and hood. I can put cfl where ever i want w/o worry. But this argument will never end...


where are you coming up with this dude?

There's no way you can produce 20,000 lumens from 130watts of cfl. Heck, you can't even do it with 200w cfl. Go ahead, prove me wrong. I mean, try to prove me wrong.

I don't see why your plant stretched just because you weren't watching it. Do you have a sun-like glow that helps your plants grow better or something?

Additional costs to cool? It doesn't cost me anything extra to cool, aside from the extra length of ducting I bought at $10 to connect the exhaust fan I would need anyway (to get fresh air to the plants), and hook it up to my hood. In fact I only needed to do this for 600w HPS and above. 400w doesn't really need any extra cooling, aside from normal intake/exhaust which you need anyway. Anyhow, my fan only uses 60w, which is about 5% of my total power consumption for a small tent.

Not sure how you think the bulb is gonna last longer. CFLs are rated for 10,000 hours. HPS is rated for 24,000 to 40,000 hours depending on the specific lamp.

Oh, you are right about one thing -- you do need a hood and ballast. The hood and ballast for a standard 600w system is around $200, so there is some up front investment. However a god investment should last around 10 years. That investment only costs $20 a year. The total investment is $.33/watt. Look on craigslist, and you can get a setup for under $100. There is also investment in cfl however. You are going to need a clamp light or something of the sort, which will cost around $8 for every 55w cfl, plus random extension cords and stuff, not to mention the cfl itself. It's around $12 per cfl/light/cordset I'm guessing total. So your investment for the 3 cfls is prolly around $36 for 155 watts. That's $.23/watt for the investment. I guess you got me beat there. Congrats on saving $.10/w on the investment. Unfortunately you'll be blowing that savings real quick every month due to the low efficiency of cfl.

You can put a cfl wherever you want "without worry", but I don't have to, because I have one big light that covers all my plants with a strong sun-like intensity with a full light spectrum.

I think I just ended the argument.


----------



## robert030188 (Dec 20, 2012)

PJ Diaz said:


> where are you coming up with this dude?
> 
> There's no way you can produce 20,000 lumens from 130watts of cfl. Heck, you can't even do it with 200w cfl. Go ahead, prove me wrong. I mean, try to prove me wrong.
> 
> ...


at 2 inches away a 23watt cfl is pushing 3,300 lumens if i set up 8 anywhere i want i'd blow an hps outta the water pushing 26,400 lumens on 184 watts and to get 100,000 lumens = 697 watts...not sure about larger wattage cfl haven't measured the lumens on them yet, but this is where you start again sir, and no i dont admit a glow like the sun but it would be cool...they are at my cousins and he has never done cfl so i didn't know he changed the setup, last i saw they were really close...gotta know the story first, and my foliage has more than doubled after one night


----------



## robert030188 (Dec 20, 2012)

i can get 12 23 watt bulbs for $25, 2 bucks a light roughly 
sockets cost nothing really with splitters $18 
power cords $15
all together $58


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## robert030188 (Dec 20, 2012)

For my one plant 12,000 lumens is sufficient and was cheapest cost 
$36 for lights 
$7 for socket and splitters

expecting about a QP from just one if i can get 1g per watt or close


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## PJ Diaz (Dec 20, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> PJ Diaz said:
> 
> 
> > where are you coming up with this dude?
> ...


The cfl is only 2 inches away at the point where its 2 inches away. Blow hps out of the water? Are you high dude?


----------



## PJ Diaz (Dec 20, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> For my one plant 12,000 lumens is sufficient and was cheapest cost
> $36 for lights
> $7 for socket and splitters
> 
> expecting about a QP from just one if i can get 1g per watt or close


Will you be drying that QP down to an oz? Have you ever harvested a QP dry from a single plant cfl grow before? Pics? Do you own a light meter.


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## PJ Diaz (Dec 20, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> i can get 12 23 watt bulbs for $25, 2 bucks a light roughly
> sockets cost nothing really with splitters $18
> power cords $15
> all together $58


I said prolly $36 for 155w. You are saying $58 for 276w. What was your point again?


----------



## PJ Diaz (Dec 20, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> at 2 inches away a 23watt cfl is pushing 3,300 lumens if i set up 8 anywhere i want i'd blow an hps outta the water pushing 26,400 lumens on 184 watts and to get 100,000 lumens = 697 watts...


So obviously you don't own a light meter, but I do. So I decided to do a couple quick measurements. Guess what? At 2 inches a 23 watt CFL only measures just under 10,000 lux . Under a 200 watt metal halide lamp it measures just under 20,000 Lux at canopy level. The only way I could get a CFL to even come close to matching that is to have it almost directly touching the light meter sensor. By the way a 600 watt HPS lamp will produce 95,000 lumens so even if your measurements above are correct HPS will still beat you.


----------



## chuck estevez (Dec 20, 2012)

PJ Diaz said:


> So obviously you don't own a light meter, but I do. So I decided to do a couple quick measurements. Guess what? At 2 inches a 23 watt CFL only measures just under 10,000 lux . Under a 200 watt metal halide lamp it measures just under 20,000 Lux at canopy level. The only way I could get a CFL to even come close to matching that is to have it almost directly touching the light meter sensor. By the way a 600 watt HPS lamp will produce 95,000 lumens so even if your measurements above are correct HPS will still beat you.


can i solve your 2 guys whole argument? lumens are for humans. show me the p.a.r of those cfl's and i guarantee it doesn't come close to an hps. p.a.r is what plants use and all bulbs are being made now for p.a.r and not lumens.


----------



## PJ Diaz (Dec 20, 2012)

chuck estevez said:


> PJ Diaz said:
> 
> 
> > So obviously you don't own a light meter, but I do. So I decided to do a couple quick measurements. Guess what? At 2 inches a 23 watt CFL only measures just under 10,000 lux . Under a 200 watt metal halide lamp it measures just under 20,000 Lux at canopy level. The only way I could get a CFL to even come close to matching that is to have it almost directly touching the light meter sensor. By the way a 600 watt HPS lamp will produce 95,000 lumens so even if your measurements above are correct HPS will still beat you.
> ...


Yes, I know this. Unfortunately I don't have a par meter, only a lux meter.


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## robert030188 (Dec 20, 2012)

Like i said it will always be a continuing argument, yes i am high and i've seen yields as good as hps with cfls....you can keep trying to prove a point, when i was simply giving the man the opinion he asked for. Done with this "cfl vs hps thread" you will stick with what works and i'll do what works for me, oh and btw from 20 inches away a 23 watt cfl will produce 80 PAR. So 8 at 20 in. away would produce 640...dont need a light meter when someone has already written this up at another forum. And you just compared 1 23 watt too one 200w hps of course it'll be stronger than one 23w cfl. done with the off topic argument


----------



## PJ Diaz (Dec 20, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> Like i said it will always be a continuing argument, yes i am high and i've seen yields as good as hps with cfls....you can keep trying to prove a point, when i was simply giving the man the opinion he asked for. Done with this "cfl vs hps thread" you will stick with what works and i'll do what works for me, oh and btw from 20 inches away a 23 watt cfl will produce 80 PAR. So 8 at 20 in. away would produce 640...dont need a light meter when someone has already written this up at another forum. And you just compared 1 23 watt too one 200w hps of course it'll be stronger than one 23w cfl. done with the off topic argument


Whatever thread you are going off at another forum is wrong. You said that a 23w cfl will deliver 3300 lumens at 2 inches. I already proved that wrong. Besides lumens are lumens, it really doesn't matter what distance you measure at. Lux is a measurement of intensity. Lumens = lux/square meter. You can't increase lumens by moving it closer, only lux. My point is that the intensity of a 200w MH @ 8 inches will exceed that of a 23w cfl one inch away. 

I guess my real point is that all your beliefs about light are incorrect, and need a thorough reexamination.

You're not gonna get a QP dry off 8 23w CFLs. Prove me wrong.

Your right, this will obviously never end. That's because CFL growers need to feel good about their decision to use substandard lighting, so they defend without question.

Its cool dude, I'm sure that you'll be happy with your harvest. I just don't want you making noobs think that cfl is somehow better than hid. Its not.


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## robert030188 (Dec 20, 2012)

When i can i'll do a side by side study with the same straine on both, one all cfl and one hps....if i produce significantly more on hps i'll admit i was wrong.


----------



## Kite High (Dec 20, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> When i can i'll do a side by side study with the same straine on both, one all cfl and one hps....if i produce significantly more on hps i'll admit i was wrong.


save you the trouble...you are wrong...but ah you will see..also why would you want to fight the moving and heat of all those cfl's?


----------



## Kite High (Dec 20, 2012)

also tried veg bloom and compared to the DG regimen the results sucked...sticking with DG and gave the v+b away


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## robert030188 (Dec 20, 2012)

No heat, but im hard headed so i have to find out for myself....like i said im not above admitting i was wrong but i gotta do it first.


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## robert030188 (Dec 20, 2012)

Yeah i tweaked my v+b grow its at 16-25-42 now


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## robert030188 (Dec 20, 2012)

Gonna add some bone meal to raise p a lil more....so i'll be at 16-36-42 when im done and she's been takin 16-25-42 like a champ so i think she can take it


----------



## PJ Diaz (Dec 20, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> Gonna add some bone meal to raise p a lil more....so i'll be at 16-36-42 when im done and she's been takin 16-25-42 like a champ so i think she can take it


Adding bone meal is pointless. It taken months and months for that stuff to break down to a usable form for the plants. You will have harvested, dried, cured, and smoked the harvest before the bone meal becomes a usable plant nutrient.

You should add bone meal to your compost or outdoor garden 6 months before planting instead.


----------



## PJ Diaz (Dec 20, 2012)

Kite High said:


> also tried veg bloom and compared to the DG regimen the results sucked...sticking with DG and gave the v+b away


Interesting. Did you supplement either base with anything else?

I'm currently running one G13-Haze plant with V+B alongside a couple others cloned from the same mother at the same time, and the V+B one is doing better than my standard regimen (Botanicare PureBlend Pro, Hydroplex, Instant Kharma, Pro-Tek, and a home-blend carbo load) in coco.


----------



## PJ Diaz (Dec 20, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> No heat, but im hard headed so i have to find out for myself....like i said im not above admitting i was wrong but i gotta do it first.


Just save yourself some time and energy; buy a light meter, and don't look back!


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## robert030188 (Dec 20, 2012)

Preciate ya PJdiaz we all work toward the same goal


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## robert030188 (Dec 20, 2012)

PJ Diaz said:


> Adding bone meal is pointless. It taken months and months for that stuff to break down to a usable form for the plants. You will have harvested, dried, cured, and smoked the harvest before the bone meal becomes a usable plant nutrient.
> 
> You should add bone meal to your compost or outdoor garden 6 months before planting instead.


K thanks never done bone meal so didn't know glad i haven't bought
It yet...what would you reccomend for P alone?


----------



## robert030188 (Dec 20, 2012)

Also i use super thrive throughout flower...i believe V+B is a good base nute to use but i like to play with it a little


----------



## PJ Diaz (Dec 20, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> K thanks never done bone meal so didn't know glad i haven't bought
> It yet...what would you reccomend for P alone?



To be honest, I'm not really sure. I use Hydroplex as a PK booster, but that obviously has both P and K.


----------



## captainmorgan (Dec 20, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> Also i use super thrive throughout flower...i believe V+B is a good base nute to use but i like to play with it a little


Thought I read somewhere that something in super thrive was not good for flower and to only use it in veg.


----------



## PJ Diaz (Dec 20, 2012)

captainmorgan said:


> Thought I read somewhere that something in super thrive was not good for flower and to only use it in veg.


Some people do say that. There's so much debate about superthrive it's ridiculous. Personally I never use it. Kelp is better as has most of the same stuff naturally.


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## captainmorgan (Dec 20, 2012)

I used only V+B for my very first grow ever with 4 different strains and had two growers I know complement me on how healthy the plants were and the yield I got.If you had bad results using it you may have had other problems that had nothing to do with the V+ B.


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## robert030188 (Dec 21, 2012)

Captain do a side by side doing one ST til flush and one til flower...see what it does for you

got post 420 bong hit


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## robert030188 (Dec 21, 2012)

The root ball on the other 2 plants that were taken out of 1gallon pots were almost the length of the actual plant...looked like a bunch of spaghetti noodles from a distance


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## chuck estevez (Dec 21, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> Captain do a side by side doing one ST til flush and one til flower...see what it does for you
> 
> got post 420 bong hit


do yourself a favor and quit using that superjive. it really is a big joke and does more harm than good. i know the package says it's awesome.but if it did all it says. you wouldn't need anything else.


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## robert030188 (Dec 21, 2012)

Trust me i've seen the roots with and w/o...i'll continue to use thanks


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## chuck estevez (Dec 21, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> Trust me i've seen the roots with and w/o...i'll continue to use thanks


trust me, your throwing your money away, but you seem to like to argue with people who have much more experience than you. So, a fool and his money is all i'm gonna say. good luck with that.


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## robert030188 (Dec 21, 2012)

Whatever bro...seen it so not an argument take your shit elsewhere on ST thread and 7 dollars is killing me


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## chuck estevez (Dec 21, 2012)

you can lead a dumbass to water.


----------



## patlpp (Dec 21, 2012)

robert030188 said:


> .what would you reccomend for P alone?


Pro-tek, silica blast


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## PJ Diaz (Dec 21, 2012)

patlpp said:


> robert030188 said:
> 
> 
> > .what would you reccomend for P alone?
> ...


huh? Protek doesn't have any P.

ST is basically B vitamins and hormones in a fancy container. I prefer Liquid Karma for those needs.


----------



## patlpp (Dec 21, 2012)

oh,Scheiße,my bad, I was thinking K. Thanks for correcting me. Lets see.......P only.


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## robert030188 (Dec 21, 2012)

Actually AgGrand makes liquid bone meal 0-12-0 for quick phosphorus


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## Kite High (Dec 21, 2012)

PJ Diaz said:


> Interesting. Did you supplement either base with anything else?
> 
> I'm currently running one G13-Haze plant with V+B alongside a couple others cloned from the same mother at the same time, and the V+B one is doing better than my standard regimen (Botanicare PureBlend Pro, Hydroplex, Instant Kharma, Pro-Tek, and a home-blend carbo load) in coco.


i use DG Foliage Pro, Protekt, Mag Pro, Botanicare Cal Mag plus, Liquid Karma

Use the Mag pro as a flowering supplement with both.


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## Kite High (Dec 21, 2012)

captainmorgan said:


> I used only V+B for my very first grow ever with 4 different strains and had two growers I know complement me on how healthy the plants were and the yield I got.If you had bad results using it you may have had other problems that had nothing to do with the V+ B.


Well out of the four the one v+b while still nice and healthy didn't produce near as much, and was not as potent. Same strain. DG has won out everything I have ever run against it.


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## captainmorgan (Dec 21, 2012)

I'm a couple days into flower on my second grow with V+B and they look great.My first was very frosty and dense and just as potent if not more than my friend that spends a lot of money a bunch of expensive specialty nutes.


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## Kite High (Dec 21, 2012)

well Dynagro is good stuff, not canna specific, reasonably priced and I prefer it, but to each their own


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## captainmorgan (Dec 21, 2012)

There's more than one way to skin a cat.I got some free samples of V+B and am new to all this,but liked my first results.I'm planning to start making super soil and won't be spending a lot on nutes in the future.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Dec 25, 2012)

My GOD this bad internet info


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## Cuebossa (Dec 27, 2012)

I am running this sativa dominant hybrid at around 1.2EC and have been watering every other day for the last 10 days. She is in flower now and thriving. I am going to stick to 1.2 EC this round with a once every 10 day flush at .5EC. I am using PROMIX BX btw.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Dec 27, 2012)

Any of you running this in a peat based medium like Sunshine Advanced #4?


We are running it now, 800ppm in flower + additives like carbs and floralicious. No issues thusfar. Probably gonna try a flush every 14 days just to be safe.


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## homebrewer (Dec 27, 2012)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Any of you running this in a peat based medium like Sunshine Advanced #4?


In my experience, promix and sunshine mix are very comparable to one another. I think I used sunshine #8, not sure what the differences are.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Dec 27, 2012)

homebrewer said:


> In my experience, promix and sunshine mix are very comparable to one another. I think I used sunshine #8, not sure what the differences are.


Yea its about the same. If ran like Coco with Ph of 5.8 you will hit issues with the Sunshine and Promix IMO. Too much peat. If reused the ph should even be higher. We run it at 6.3 to start and by the end of flower 6.5-6.6


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## Chiggachamp (Dec 27, 2012)

i just transplanted into 3 gal pots and put in flower tent. 
im at 800 ppms now
i know some peoppe say to lower the ppms when i get into week 3-4.


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## Cuebossa (Dec 28, 2012)

From what I understand Veg+Bloom is pH ready and requires no pH monitoring in drain to waste applications. I have checked the pH of my feed solutions with veg+Bloom and they always fell into the 5.8-6.2 range. I haven't used a pH meter in months and this is probably one of the best parts of their product. To know that all essential elements for healthy growth are present and in sufficient quantity is to know my plants are fine dining.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Dec 28, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> From what I understand Veg+Bloom is pH ready and requires no pH monitoring in drain to waste applications. I have checked the pH of my feed solutions with veg+Bloom and they always fell into the 5.8-6.2 range. I haven't used a pH meter in months and this is probably one of the best parts of their product. To know that all essential elements for healthy growth are present and in sufficient quantity is to know my plants are fine dining.


im consistently coming out at 6.3 which is perfect for us


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## PJ Diaz (Dec 28, 2012)

Cuebossa said:


> From what I understand Veg+Bloom is pH ready and requires no pH monitoring in drain to waste applications. I have checked the pH of my feed solutions with veg+Bloom and they always fell into the 5.8-6.2 range. I haven't used a pH meter in months and this is probably one of the best parts of their product. To know that all essential elements for healthy growth are present and in sufficient quantity is to know my plants are fine dining.


That depends on your water. If I use tap water here I still need to use 5ml of ph down due to the super hard water @ over 330 ppm out the tap 8.5ph.


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## Cuebossa (Dec 30, 2012)

They make a hard water formula for your water PJ. I had the same alkalinity(330-370ppm) and it would bring my pH to 6.0 just about every time at full strength. The first 2-3 plants I ran on this thread were with the aforementioned water. 

Here is the WiFi OG I posted previously. It is in Happy Frog soil at 1.2EC Veg+Bloom. Very sticky and incredibly dense. Doesn't appear to yield much.


----------



## robert030188 (Dec 31, 2012)

Here is my baby as of today...just started 4th week running 16-25-42 v+b and flora bloom...will be reducing as soon as she starts to mature


----------



## captainmorgan (Dec 31, 2012)

Day 12 of my second run with V+B at 1.5 EC.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Dec 31, 2012)

^no thumbs came through


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## robert030188 (Dec 31, 2012)

I thought it was just my phone lol ^


----------



## captainmorgan (Dec 31, 2012)

One more try

I added this photo to another thread earlier and it worked fine but now it's gone from that post.

It won't let upload it again,I'll try to sort it out later.


----------



## captainmorgan (Dec 31, 2012)

Renamed it on my computer and it seems to be working now.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Dec 31, 2012)

looks good bruv


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## robert030188 (Dec 31, 2012)

Just changed one of the 4000 lumen cfls was going out and it was only pushing like a 1000 i'd say, replaced it so should see significantly more foliage by next post and some encrusted bud...my trichs just started developing


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 1, 2013)

This plant (G13 Haze) has been veg+bloom only since a week after 12/12:



Here's a few bud shots of that plant:



This Green Crack has been veg+bloom only since the start of flowering:



They all got a few weeks still, but looking good so far..


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## robert030188 (Jan 1, 2013)

I bet the smoke will put you on your ass...also i transfered to a 5 gallon today, she should be sweet in a couple days


----------



## Miles91Collins (Jan 1, 2013)

the posts are good.I like them


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 1, 2013)

PJ Diaz said:


> This plant (G13 Haze) has been veg+bloom only since a week after 12/12:
> 
> View attachment 2462031
> 
> ...


What medium and what is your feeeding schedule? Looks real nice man. Any ammendments or fungi added?


----------



## robert030188 (Jan 1, 2013)

I believe PJ is using coco right now...i think he says on another thread...let me find it


----------



## robert030188 (Jan 1, 2013)

Here it is Lucious... https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/602889-defoliation-question-anyone-familiar.html he told me his setup here pg. 14


----------



## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 1, 2013)

robert030188 said:


> Here it is Lucious... https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/602889-defoliation-question-anyone-familiar.html he told me his setup here pg. 14


Thanks man. I have some reading to do. Any idea on how they ended up recommending a method to defoliate? I did it on my last run and im not sure i saw a massive increase but i very well may have taken too many or not enough. In general i like to leave my plants alone after going into flower.


----------



## PJ Diaz (Jan 1, 2013)

robert030188 said:


> I bet the smoke will put you on your ass...also i transfered to a 5 gallon today, she should be sweet in a couple days


Yes it does. Grown this particular cut a few times now. It's really yummy too. To me it tastes and smells something like lemon yougert. My buddy things it smells like a lemony jack herer, which I could see as well.



Lucius Vorenus said:


> What medium and what is your feeeding schedule? Looks real nice man. Any ammendments or fungi added?


I'm growing in a coco/perlite mix. Running at full strength weeks 2- 5 of flower @ 1tsp/gal and backing off the 75% in week 5-6 and tapering to water for the last week. I have added a bit of mycorrhizae, but that's it. I'm testing against my standard feed solution of botanicare pureblend pro, hydroplex (pk booster), liquid kharma, and protek.


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## robert030188 (Jan 1, 2013)

Mmm sounds good PJ...im expecting 2 big smelly buds on mine by the time im done...i have 4 to 5 weeks left on her...valentines day should be sweeter than usual lol


----------



## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 1, 2013)

PJ Diaz said:


> Yes it does. Grown this particular cut a few times now. It's really yummy too. To me it tastes and smells something like lemon yougert. My buddy things it smells like a lemony jack herer, which I could see as well.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm growing in a coco/perlite mix. Running at full strength weeks 2- 5 of flower @ 1tsp/gal and backing off the 75% in week 5-6 and tapering to water for the last week. I have added a bit of mycorrhizae, but that's it. I'm testing against my standard feed solution of botanicare pureblend pro, hydroplex (pk booster), liquid kharma, and protek.


I would keep a Liquid Karma or Floralicious product going to help feed that Mychorrizae. Also some carbs.


----------



## PJ Diaz (Jan 1, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> PJ Diaz said:
> 
> 
> > Yes it does. Grown this particular cut a few times now. It's really yummy too. To me it tastes and smells something like lemon yougert. My buddy things it smells like a lemony jack herer, which I could see as well.
> ...


Yes, I do also use a home brew of carbs. Molasses, agave nectar, and barley malt syrup. Forgot to mention that. Supposedly v+b includes carbs too.


----------



## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 1, 2013)

PJ Diaz said:


> Yes, I do also use a home brew of carbs. Molasses, agave nectar, and barley malt syrup. Forgot to mention that. Supposedly v+b includes carbs too.


Where did you hear it includes carbs?


----------



## PJ Diaz (Jan 2, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Where did you hear it includes carbs?


The OP mentions it in this post: https://www.rollitup.org/nutrients/513971-veg-bloom-all-phase-all-19.html#post7693942

Another user says he talked to the owner about it here: https://www.rollitup.org/nutrients/591792-non-organic-really-works-3.html#post8337390


----------



## Chiggachamp (Jan 2, 2013)

top left is a bubba kush
top middle and top right and bottom left is tga gear 
and bottom middle and right are alian hullination pheno 1-2 
grown all from vb 
all about foot and a half tall on day 10 of flowwer. 
in soilless mix.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 2, 2013)

Ran Veg+Bloom at 800ppm in Peat/Coco/Perlite for 2 week veg and 4 weeks of flower thusfar, plants have a runoff of 2000ppm at week 4 flush. So although its good, it def has to have a lot of salts etc

Took 6 galls through each 3 gal container to get us down to 1000


----------



## robert030188 (Jan 2, 2013)

Actually the silica should help break down salts, im doing soil...only 2 flushes throughout flower one at 3-4 weeks and one the week before harvest, the week before this i dumb down nutes to about a 1/3 or 1/4...works for me and my straine


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## robert030188 (Jan 2, 2013)

My baby was just put into a 5 gallon pot yesterday in a few days im expecting her to settle in and blow up...


----------



## Chiggachamp (Jan 2, 2013)

i dont flush i should prob check my run off. 
thinking i might do a flush at around 3 weeks.


----------



## Cuebossa (Jan 2, 2013)

Or you can consistently run a more dilute EC. I'm doing 1.2-1.4 in Happy Frog with this WiFi OG and they buds are just incredible and the foliage dark black green. I could have run her 1.4 every feed but the alternating to 1.2 keeps the nutrients moving through the substrate. Kind of by the seat of my pants but next time I will have a solid point of reference.... experience.


----------



## PJ Diaz (Jan 3, 2013)

robert030188 said:


> My baby was just put into a 5 gallon pot yesterday in a few days im expecting her to settle in and blow up...


I don't really like to transplant during flower. I usually try to put her in the final size container right before the 12/12 switch. A couple weeks before is what I prefer, but space doesn't always allow for that. Looking good though.


----------



## robert030188 (Jan 3, 2013)

PJ Diaz said:


> I don't really like to transplant during flower. I usually try to put her in the final size container right before the 12/12 switch. A couple weeks before is what I prefer, but space doesn't always allow for that. Looking good though.


She should have little to no growth stunt...cracked the clay pot in half kept all soil in tact...she actually still grew over night so i would say no growth stunt this time...tried to get it in one before initial switch, but i've been out of work and money is tight so i just got the money to do it...she still has about 5 weeks i believe 8-10 week straine so i go between, if the plant looks ready before then i'll start flush and ready for harvest. Not saying its a good ideal to transplant during flower but i was extra delicate with my baby


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 3, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Where did you hear it includes carbs?





PJ Diaz said:


> The OP mentions it in this post: https://www.rollitup.org/nutrients/513971-veg-bloom-all-phase-all-19.html#post7693942
> 
> Another user says he talked to the owner about it here: https://www.rollitup.org/nutrients/591792-non-organic-really-works-3.html#post8337390


I sent an email to ask, and got this response from the company owner today:





> Yes. Veg+Bloom contains fulvics and carbohydrates. Our new label will indicate this. We are in the process of licensing with the department of agriculture to achieve this.
> 
> 
> 
> -Chris


----------



## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 3, 2013)

PJ Diaz said:


> I sent an email to ask, and got this response from the company owner today:


Not sure why they are saying their product contains, Silica, Cal Mag, Carbs, Fulvics etc etc its not starting to get hard to believe to be honest


----------



## PJ Diaz (Jan 3, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> PJ Diaz said:
> 
> 
> > I sent an email to ask, and got this response from the company owner today:
> ...


Why is it?


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 3, 2013)

PJ Diaz said:


> Why is it?


Because i have had to add both to our grows using it. Its still a great product still


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## Cuebossa (Jan 3, 2013)

What I have gathered is this: You don't have to add anything but you can if you choose to.
I have run multiple OG phenos as well as TGA type sativa hybrids and indicas without using any additives and succeeded in producing top shelf Meds.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 3, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> What I have gathered is this: You don't have to add anything but you can if you choose to.
> I have run multiple OG phenos as well as TGA type sativa hybrids and indicas without using any additives and succeeded in producing top shelf Meds.


Yes but so far its just been you on many forums saying that. Not saying most people aren;t going to get good results would just be great to see others chiming in.


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## Chiggachamp (Jan 3, 2013)

i always read what cub and sum other say about the product and i even bumbed up my ppms to double what i was using and i still had calmag def... 
so instead of adding more vb i am just goin to keep adding in calmag and 50 ppms of silica... 
also i dont remember what u guys are running the vb in so that could be our problem.


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## ProfessorPotSnob (Jan 3, 2013)

Veg + Bloom's is derived from Calcium Nitrate and fifth on the list is Magnesium Sulfate . No wonder why its highly advised for Coco growers and newbies . Trick is to find each strains sweet spot .. 

I have the hard water formula and run it from 1300-1600 ppm with no issues .. Not that impressed thus far myself being that Maxi grow is still a fraction of the price even with additives ..


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## Cuebossa (Jan 3, 2013)

I have run Veg+Bloom in soil, coco and now ProMix(peat) without issue from vegetative through flowering stages. I have found that strain EC will vary from 1.1-1.8 EC and that it is important to run 1/4 strength occasionally to prevent toxicity. 
I have run the Maxi series and it did not produce the resin Veg+Bloom does. I also noticed significant improvement in ripening time with VB. I grow mostly for myself so quality is no. 1 in my grow. Proof is in the pictures


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## ProfessorPotSnob (Jan 3, 2013)

Yes proof is in the photos but Maxi products consistently produce healthy plants and tons of resin at a fraction of the price . I am not one to bullshit and here is some proof of Maxi Bloom at work .. 

I am running the same cut as shown and will be cross comparing , but none the less this strain will shine no matter the brand of nutrients used .. Genetics are first and foremost , then nutrients .. 

No nute is going to make shit weed become Dank ... But no matter people will believe what they hear and read lmao ..


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 3, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Yes but so far its just been you on many forums saying that. Not saying most people aren;t going to get good results would just be great to see others chiming in.


I dunno. My V+B only plant looks as good if not better than my control group (PureBlendPro, Instant Kharma, Hydroplex, Carbs) of the same G13 Haze clone.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 3, 2013)

Prof- I used Maxibloom for awhile as well so can attest to it being legit. I did need Cal Mag with it for sure though.


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## CaliMackdaddy (Jan 3, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> Yes but so far its just been you on many forums saying that. Not saying most people aren;t going to get good results would just be great to see others chiming in.


Grew this with veg+bloom along with some other organic additives.. vermifire soil.


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## robert030188 (Jan 3, 2013)

I have always found florabloom capable of giving the plants what v+b lacks...works great IMO


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 3, 2013)

robert030188 said:


> I have always found florabloom capable of giving the plants what v+b lacks...works great IMO


Such as?

I have nothin but love for Gh and their products. Still a great product. Before V+B we were straight Maxibloom as our base with great success.


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## robert030188 (Jan 3, 2013)

Mag/cal is in florabloom http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CC0QFjAA&url=http://www.generalhydroponics.com/genhydro_US/product_labels/florabloom_qt.pdf&ei=GTTmULezFYSjiAK7koHIBA&usg=AFQjCNEYeLR2CAVN-PKiF8cfjk3ZcAw-9g which is what most say v+b doesn't have enough of


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 3, 2013)

robert030188 said:


> Mag/cal is in florabloom http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CC0QFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.generalhydroponics.com%2Fgenhydro_US%2Fproduct_labels%2Fflorabloom_qt.pdf&ei=GTTmULezFYSjiAK7koHIBA&usg=AFQjCNEYeLR2CAVN-PKiF8cfjk3ZcAw-9g which is what most say v+b doesn't have enough of


IMO when your plants seem low on CalMAg with V+B you need to raise your PPM. Thats what i have found. When i took my plants to 1000ppm range they got id of the mag deficiency.


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## robert030188 (Jan 3, 2013)

Oh i don't have any deficiencies with cal/mag my baby is fine the florabloom is basically for P-K in my grow....im using plenty of v+b in mine...


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## robert030188 (Jan 3, 2013)

Yeah 1000ppm sounds good i've heard most say 1200-1600 ppm can be done


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 3, 2013)

robert030188 said:


> Oh i don't have any deficiencies with cal/mag my baby is fine the florabloom is basically for P-K in my grow....im using plenty of v+b in mine...



ah cool. at week 4-5? 

im giving MOAB a try this time.


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## robert030188 (Jan 3, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> ah cool. at week 4-5?
> 
> im giving MOAB a try this time.


Im in week 4 right now she should be done around week 9....MOAB?


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## captainmorgan (Jan 3, 2013)

I never went above 1.5 to 1.6 EC last run in soil with 4 different strains and only showed a slight yellowing of my fan leaves the last week.Very solid buds with a lot of frost and never added anything but carbs.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 3, 2013)

robert030188 said:


> Im in week 4 right now she should be done around week 9....MOAB?


mother of all blooms


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 3, 2013)

captainmorgan said:


> I never went above 1.5 to 1.6 EC last run in soil with 4 different strains and only showed a slight yellowing of my fan leaves the last week.Very solid buds with a lot of frost and never added anything but carbs.


1.2 would be our highest EC and the plants are all fine.


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 3, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> IMO when your plants seem low on CalMAg with V+B you need to raise your PPM. Thats what i have found. When i took my plants to 1000ppm range they got id of the mag deficiency.





Lucius Vorenus said:


> 1.2 would be our highest EC and the plants are all fine.


How does 1000ppm = 1.2 EC? I'm confused. 

View attachment 2465915


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## captainmorgan (Jan 4, 2013)

All right guys,I'm the newb here and know that this is strain dependent.Some are heavy feeders and some not.From my limited experience it looks like a solid base and if you have a plant with heavy needs you might need to add something,case closed.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 4, 2013)

PJ Diaz said:


> How does 1000ppm = 1.2 EC? I'm confused.
> 
> View attachment 2465915


My bad. 1.4ec.

I don't really use EC when talking, i use a truncheon and our very max would be 1000ppm


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## Cuebossa (Jan 4, 2013)

Let's stick to EC guys. I think we will all be better off here if we speak the same lingo. If you are using PPM then do the conversion on your end but please keep it EC when you respond.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 4, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> Let's stick to EC guys. I think we will all be better off here if we speak the same lingo. If you are using PPM then do the conversion on your end but please keep it EC when you respond.


I know very few growers that talk in EC around these parts personally. We almost all use PPm.


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## Cuebossa (Jan 4, 2013)

just trying to keep it simple and help people succeed here. Please take the time to respond in EC as this is a much better scale considering PPM can be many different conversions of EC. Let's not get lost in translation.


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## Dr. Skunk Bud (Jan 4, 2013)

Just ordered some of the veg&bloom i hope it works as good as some of you say it does. Im planning on using it in soil is there a certain ratio I should mix it in?


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## Cuebossa (Jan 4, 2013)

I would start at about .7-1 EC or approx. .5-.8 teaspoons per gallon. Soils can vary in how heavy and rich they are. Start with lighter feeds if the soil is heavy and heavier feeds if the soil is sandy or lighter in texture. I would get a 20-30 gallon trashcan and mix it up to my desired EC and just use that.


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 4, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> Let's stick to EC guys. I think we will all be better off here if we speak the same lingo. If you are using PPM then do the conversion on your end but please keep it EC when you respond.





Lucius Vorenus said:


> I know very few growers that talk in EC around these parts personally. We almost all use PPm.





Cuebossa said:


> just trying to keep it simple and help people succeed here. Please take the time to respond in EC as this is a much better scale considering PPM can be many different conversions of EC. Let's not get lost in translation.


I use Hannah, so 1000ppm for me would be 2 EC. It does make a big difference.


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## Cuebossa (Jan 4, 2013)

Exactly. So PJ, your 1000ppm would be 1400ppm on Lucius' Truncheon meter etc. Let's end the confusion once and for all.


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## jstone1633 (Jan 4, 2013)

Anyone running this in a DWC? If so, Whats your feeding schedule like? EC at different stages?


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## CaliMackdaddy (Jan 4, 2013)

jstone1633 said:


> Anyone running this in a DWC? If so, Whats your feeding schedule like? EC at different stages?


I run .6-.9 EC on my mother plant, ive never gone beyond veg with veg+bloom in Dwc though.


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## Cuebossa (Jan 4, 2013)

Some more of this lovely picturesque OG. Happy Frog, 1-1.2EC Veg+Bloom, 70 degrees on average, 56 days into flower.


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## jstone1633 (Jan 4, 2013)

I have a really dumb question but i have to ask. I jus got an EC meter and my tap comes out at .8ec When you all say Ur running at 1.4ec is that on top of your tap? In my case my meter would read 2.2ec with nutes and water? Ive been organics up until now and never needed to know


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## captainmorgan (Jan 4, 2013)

Day 16 1.5 EC


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## CaliMackdaddy (Jan 4, 2013)

captainmorgan said:


> Day 16 1.5 EC


beautiful plants nice and healthy


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## chuck estevez (Jan 4, 2013)

jstone1633 said:


> I have a really dumb question but i have to ask. I jus got an EC meter and my tap comes out at .8ec When you all say Ur running at 1.4ec is that on top of your tap? In my case my meter would read 2.2ec with nutes and water? Ive been organics up until now and never needed to know


 no, that would be total including your taps.8
this is why r/o is better, you start at 0 and can add all nutes to get to that 1.4ec


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## robert030188 (Jan 4, 2013)

Well that would mean my girl is between 1.8 and 1.9 ec (1260-1330 ppm) im in soil and she'takin it like a champ...im even thinkin of goin a lil higher after hps gets put in


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## robert030188 (Jan 5, 2013)

Also im running 15ml a gallon florabloom 0-5-4 so i think my ec maybe a lil higher...i feed her a liter between the two...two cups of each


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## Cuebossa (Jan 5, 2013)

I would be careful when using tap water to increase the amount of "flushes" per cycle. For example, in RO I will run a 1/2 strength solution through my roots every 2 weeks, In tap water you will need to do this every week or possibly every other watering. 

So.... *if a strain requires 1 EC(in RO) to stay sufficiently fed and your tap is .3 EC then your feed strength will be 1.3 but will require extra flushes to offset that .3EC of "stuff" in your tap water. *You still wont get the rapid growth and yield that RO will yield.


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## Oghazybread (Jan 5, 2013)

Hmm im going to try this, I would like to see how it compares to my dry nute lucus formula.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 5, 2013)

Oghazybread said:


> Hmm im going to try this, I would like to see how it compares to my dry nute lucus formula.


You'll be happy. I switched to it from dry nute Lucas


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## robert030188 (Jan 5, 2013)

Day 33 flower roughly 37 days left


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## CaliMackdaddy (Jan 5, 2013)

robert030188 said:


> Day 33 flower roughly 37 days left


Why even post cfl pictures....


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## robert030188 (Jan 5, 2013)

CaliMackdaddy said:


> Why even post cfl pictures....


because i can...i didn't know it was a no cfl thread...oh thats right its not, why even ask stupid questions?


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## robert030188 (Jan 5, 2013)

And if you were following my thread at all you'd know it will be under a 600 watt hps tomorrow by its self...just needed my ballast


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## Dr. Skunk Bud (Jan 6, 2013)

im using miracle grow soil mix and my plants seem to be doing well hopefully the veg+bloom will work well with it also


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## robert030188 (Jan 6, 2013)

Be careful usin v+b with MG if it has time released nutes in it your ppms will be hard to control


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## robert030188 (Jan 6, 2013)

My baby under the 600 hps


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 6, 2013)

robert030188 said:


> My baby under the 600 hps


If you're not gonna cool it, I'd suggest replacing the cooltube with an open hood, even a cheap $30 batwing will be better.


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## robert030188 (Jan 6, 2013)

Already workin on it PJ tryin to get two fans for circulation soon...until then its in a room controlled at 74-76 usually and colder when lights go out


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## robert030188 (Jan 7, 2013)

5th week today


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## Cuebossa (Jan 9, 2013)

WiFi OG at 8.5 weeks and ready for harvest


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## robert030188 (Jan 9, 2013)

Looks great cuebossa...what are you thinkin of doin next?


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## captainmorgan (Jan 9, 2013)

Day 21 1.5 EC


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## robert030188 (Jan 9, 2013)

Lookin great captainmorgan


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## Cuebossa (Jan 10, 2013)

Looking great Captain!

Good question Robert. I've done so many different substrates that now I'm considering doing my next run with a PK or a Carb to see if I can get different results. Anyone using a PK product or Carb product with Veg+Bloom? At what rate?


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 11, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> Looking great Captain!
> 
> Good question Robert. I've done so many different substrates that now I'm considering doing my next run with a PK or a Carb to see if I can get different results. Anyone using a PK product or Carb product with Veg+Bloom? At what rate?


In week 5 right now on a 6k grow using these nutes. Cut back to 300ppm for the PK spike and used MOAB at half power as well as some carbs and Floralicious. Total PPM of 800. Plants are def not liking that move AT ALL.

Hope they snap back.


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## homebrewer (Jan 11, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> In week 5 right now on a 6k grow using these nutes. Cut back to 300ppm for the PK spike and used MOAB at half power as well as some carbs and Floralicious. Total PPM of 800. Plants are def not liking that move AT ALL.
> 
> Hope they snap back.


Are you saying you just fed with 500ppm of P and K?


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 11, 2013)

PPM is meaningless. Please use EC.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 11, 2013)

homebrewer said:


> Are you saying you just fed with 500ppm of P and K?


No the pK was about 300


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## homebrewer (Jan 11, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> No the pK was about 300


So your base was at 500ppm and your 'booster' added an additional 300ppm? That's kind of a lot of 'booster' relative to your base.


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 11, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> homebrewer said:
> 
> 
> > Are you saying you just fed with 500ppm of P and K?
> ...


PPM is meaningless. Please stick to EC so we're all talking the same language.


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## homebrewer (Jan 11, 2013)

PJ Diaz said:


> PPM is meaningless. Please stick to EC so we're all talking the same language.


_We're_ not talking to you .


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 11, 2013)

homebrewer said:


> _We're_ not talking to you .



exactly that. nobody uses fucking EC! around me anyway


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 11, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> homebrewer said:
> 
> 
> > _We're_ not talking to you .
> ...


I use ppm too, but since there are three different measurements of ppm, it's meaningless when used in a public discussion where not everyone uses the same ppm conversion. EC is EC is EC.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 12, 2013)

PJ Diaz said:


> I use ppm too, but since there are three different measurements of ppm, it's meaningless when used in a public discussion where not everyone uses the same ppm conversion. EC is EC is EC.



except no one uses it.

i use Truncheon. As should anyone. When I talk PPM, its truncheon PPM.


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 12, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> except no one uses it.
> 
> i use Truncheon. As should anyone. When I talk PPM, its truncheon PPM.


Are we all supposed to make a mental note of what tester everyone uses? What's wrong with Hannah?

I really think you're missing the point, but based on what I'm seeing in your posts, that's nothing new for you. Best of luck with your deficiencies.


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## homebrewer (Jan 12, 2013)

EC_ is_ universal and convenient but regardless of the measuring stick, nearly 40% of your total mix being made up of a bloom booster is usually not a good idea. Measure that on whatever scale you'd like, it's still nearly 40%.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 12, 2013)

homebrewer said:


> EC_ is_ universal and convenient but regardless of the measuring stick, nearly 40% of your total mix being made up of a bloom booster is usually not a good idea. Measure that on whatever scale you'd like, it's still nearly 40%.


I think its more like 20%, gotta take into consideration my tea, carbs and cal mag too is in that ppm


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## homebrewer (Jan 12, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> I think its more like 20%, gotta take into consideration my *tea, carbs and cal mag* too is in that ppm


Yeah, that crap isn't even needed either.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 12, 2013)

One thing ive been hearing is the the 16-10-30 of Veg+BLoom is probably going to kill your Mychorrizae since its higher in P. So if you're using it in Veg and inocculating with Mykos or something you are wasting your money.

Thoughts?


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## Cuebossa (Jan 12, 2013)

Lucius Vorenus said:


> One thing ive been hearing is the the 16-10-30 of Veg+BLoom is probably going to kill your Mychorrizae since its higher in P. So if you're using it in Veg and inocculating with Mykos or something you are wasting your money.
> 
> Thoughts?


 Not true. I researched this when I chose to use the Promix HP with mycorhizae. Veg+Bloom sits just below the threshold of P levels that can negatively affect beneficials. 

I'd like to point out that using any additives we will probably need to work by weight/volume rather than PPM or EC. P and K do not show up on a EC/TDS Meter with accuracy. 

Lucius, I would like to know how many grams of MOAB, milliliters of floraliscious you used per gallon. This might explain how you overdosed your garden.


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## robert030188 (Jan 13, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> Looking great Captain!
> 
> Good question Robert. I've done so many different substrates that now I'm considering doing my next run with a PK or a Carb to see if I can get different results. Anyone using a PK product or Carb product with Veg+Bloom? At what rate?


GH's florabloom 0-5-4 is what im using with mine in flower...works great, but recently i discovered i have a phosphorus deficiency but everything has been corredted and growth should proceed


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## robert030188 (Jan 13, 2013)

I use 15 ml of florabloom to the gallon and feed with v+b everytime


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## chuck estevez (Jan 13, 2013)

robert030188 said:


> GH's florabloom 0-5-4 is what im using with mine in flower...works great, but recently i discovered i have a phosphorus deficiency but everything has been corredted and growth should proceed


so your using a 16-10-30 along with a 0-5-4 and you think you had a phosphorus def? I highly doubt that. More like nute burn.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 13, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> Not true. I researched this when I chose to use the Promix HP with mycorhizae. Veg+Bloom sits just below the threshold of P levels that can negatively affect beneficials.
> 
> I'd like to point out that using any additives we will probably need to work by weight/volume rather than PPM or EC. P and K do not show up on a EC/TDS Meter with accuracy.
> 
> Lucius, I would like to know how many grams of MOAB, milliliters of floraliscious you used per gallon. This might explain how you overdosed your garden.


My garden is good pretty good thusfar. We are tapering off now completely. Just carbs and Floralicious.


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## hammer21 (Jan 13, 2013)

Lucius empty your in box


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 13, 2013)

ok. give me 2 mins


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## Cuebossa (Jan 16, 2013)

Blue Dream in ProMix @ 1.2EC, this one should be a good reference as Blue Dream is very well known and distributed. I flushed today for the first time in this particular plants life cycle.


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## robert030188 (Jan 18, 2013)

chuck estevez said:


> so your using a 16-10-30 along with a 0-5-4 and you think you had a phosphorus def? I highly doubt that. More like nute burn.


No actually i had calcium build up which showed as P deficiency...does this look burnt?


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 19, 2013)

no that looks more like its starting to get signs of overwatering to me


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## robert030188 (Jan 19, 2013)

Actually she was just watered today after not being watered for 4 days...most people say curling of the bud leaves are signs of a heavy resin producer, she's been triched up for a while now...but you know what, i'll wait a lil longer til my next watering...maybe 5 or 6 days, i'll let you know if it straightens them out Lucious


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 19, 2013)

I'm in the last week of flower now, and my V+B plant is yellowing quite a bit more than my control plants. I'm not sure, but it also looks like yield might be slightly less. Taste test in a couple weeks..


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 19, 2013)

Here's 4 plants. The two on the right are from the same mother as the V+B plant and grown exactly the same except the nutes. The one in the rear-left is the V+B plant. Started feeding all plants water only about 5 days ago.

The one in the front left is a different strain with a shorter veg time.


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## robert030188 (Jan 19, 2013)

Hmm wonder why man...i wonder if the veg+blom plant absorbed the nutes quicker...im only doin a one week flush for mine....how many days before do you flush PJ?


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## Cuebossa (Jan 19, 2013)

What kind of media are you growing in? It looks like under-feeding to me. If this is your first grow with veg+Bloom then you should be able to dial it a little closer on your next go.


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 19, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> What kind of media are you growing in? It looks like under-feeding to me. If this is your first grow with veg+Bloom then you should be able to dial it a little closer on your next go.


Coco with perlite. Drain to waste. 1tsp/gal, which is already on the heavy side according to their feed schedule. I don't think I'll be using it again, I like a little more control over my nutes than V+B allows.


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## Cuebossa (Jan 19, 2013)

"Control" isn't something I stress about anymore with my garden now that I know I can use a single product to keep my plants satisfied through their entire life. My plants are happy and the living is easy.


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 19, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> "Control" isn't something I stress about anymore with my garden now that I know I can use a single product to keep my plants satisfied through their entire life. My plants are happy and the living is easy.


Well, I'm glad that's working out for you. However, plants need different nutrient ratios during different periods of life. Also, not water is created equal. I already have a lot of calcium in my water, so I really don't need all the C they put into V+B. All it does for me is create water deposits and potentially locks out P, and makes me need more pH down. Not to mention that different strains have different requirements. Also, V+B only didn't keep my plant happy through it's entire life. It's a little sad the week before harvest, unlike the plants in my standard nute regime.


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## robert030188 (Jan 19, 2013)

While you're here PJ, see anything wrong with my girl? Im gonna be using MOAB next run for flower...can't wait, but it'll be a while before i hit another harvest probably four or so months...so yeah i have time to get my game up


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 19, 2013)

robert030188 said:


> While you're here PJ, see anything wrong with my girl? Im gonna be using MOAB next run for flower...can't wait, but it'll be a while before i hit another harvest probably four or so months...so yeah i have time to get my game up


It's really tough to say from pics especially under hps. I've never used MOAB. I've been using hydroplex for my PK booster, and my plants seem to like it. I dunno, but MOAB seems kind of extreme to me.

I'd suggest coco/perlite in place of soil. You can water/feed them every day without risk. The plants really seem to like fresh nutes every day too. Personally I think the best supplement out there is Liquid Kharma. If I was forced to run a base and one supplement only, LQ would be the one.


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## robert030188 (Jan 19, 2013)

My friend grows with MOAB and his nugs feel like rocks...you only use it twice in flower, i got the calcium issue fixed...i was just refering to the leaves curling down...can't be over watering it was almost bone dry when it was watered after 4 days


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## Bakatare666 (Jan 19, 2013)

robert030188 said:


> My friend grows with MOAB and his nugs feel like rocks...you only use it twice in flower, i got the calcium issue fixed...i was just refering to the leaves curling down...can't be over watering it was almost bone dry when it was watered after 4 days


I just got some MOAB, and was reading the label about only using it 2x, once at the beginning and towards the end of flower, I just added some and I'm getting into the 4th week, do you think it'll be OK to feed with it again in another 3 or 4 weeks?


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## robert030188 (Jan 19, 2013)

3 weeks should be fine i'd think, just flush a week before harvest...the directions are just a guideline in my book, i might use three times during flower...also i'll be getting great white supplement too, i'd go for it bro can't hurt


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## robert030188 (Jan 19, 2013)

How long does the strain normally take in flower that you're growin Bakatar


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## Bakatare666 (Jan 19, 2013)

robert030188 said:


> 3 weeks should be fine i'd think, just flush a week before harvest...the directions are just a guideline in my book, i might use three times during flower...also i'll be getting great white supplement too, i'd go for it bro can't hurt


Thanks, and I don't know how long on the flower, it's bagseed.
My last 4 out of 4 have all been ladies, but different ratios of Indica/ Sativa.
This one, started out looking heavy Indica, (which is what I wanted so I can finish and use this same area to veg for next outdoor season), but now she's looking almost 50/50.
Vegged for 30 days, pic at 21 daysView attachment 2487599
Fed at 25 days, pic at 28 days.View attachment 2487600
Pic at 31 days.
Pic at 38 days.
Pic at 52 days.
Until day 55, only 98w of CFL's, then added another 200w.
Pic at 66 days.


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## OldGrowth420 (Jan 19, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> Blue Dream in ProMix @ 1.2EC, this one should be a good reference as Blue Dream is very well known and distributed. I flushed today for the first time in this particular plants life cycle.


I feel like im slipping into a daydream just looking at these buds


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## robert030188 (Jan 19, 2013)

Yeah i'd go 3 weeks and do another or 4...you wanna do it right when your buds start to swell


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## Bakatare666 (Jan 19, 2013)

Thanks man!
I'm subbed to this thread now, so I'll keep ya posted.
I THINK, not sure, but THINK, she has grown since I turned lights on 6 hrs ago.
With my reg. nutes, I don't usually notice growth except from lights off to lights on, but I just went and peeked like I always do every couple hrs. while lights on, and I tied another branch because it was getting close to a bulb.
Last night when I few/ watered, I gave 1/2 tsp veg & bloom, along with a pinch of MOAB, so I know I was kinda strong compared to the 12-34-30 I normally give with molasses every third or fourth water.


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## Uncle Pirate (Jan 23, 2013)

I did a run of my Blueberry Headband with this. It stayed nice and green until the end, but the buds weren't as big or dense as they are with flora nova. The taste is so close, I'd say it's the same. Bud density and yield definitely went down though. V+B cost me more too. That's my experience.


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## Bakatare666 (Jan 23, 2013)

Uncle Pirate said:


> I did a run of my Blueberry Headband with this. It stayed nice and green until the end, but the buds weren't as big or dense as they are with flora nova. The taste is so close, I'd say it's the same. Bud density and yield definitely went down though. V+B cost me more too. That's my experience.


You can go to the V7B website, and request a sample, I just got the one I requested, they'll send you a small tub in about 3 days.


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## Uncle Pirate (Jan 23, 2013)

Bakatare666 said:


> You can go to the V7B website, and request a sample, I just got the one I requested, they'll send you a small tub in about 3 days.


Thanks, but I already went through almost a lb. of it. I just didn't get the same results as I do with FN, and I went through it faster too. So it actually cost more for me to use the V+B. It worked great in veg though, and I like how clean it is. It doesn't dissolve very well, but cleans up easy.


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 23, 2013)

I did side by sides of two different strains this run. Running identical clones in the exact same setup except for nutes. At harvest time the V+B plants yellowed earlier and have smaller buds than my control plants.


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## chuck estevez (Jan 23, 2013)

Uncle Pirate said:


> Thanks, but I already went through almost a lb. of it. I just didn't get the same results as I do with FN, and I went through it faster too. So it actually cost more for me to use the V+B. It worked great in veg though, and I like how clean it is.* It doesn't dissolve very well,* but cleans up easy.


 Found the same problem.


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## Cuebossa (Jan 23, 2013)

PJ, I honestly think your yellowing was user error and don't think you can blame it on the product. I just pulled this Kush down without any yellowing at 8.5 weeks






I had run Floranova in the past and didn't have as good of results and didn't like the sludgy mess. I also felt like I couldn't get all of it out of the bottle! Floranova is also more expensive off the shelf. With Veg+Bloom I am paying around $15 cents for a gallon of nutrient solution these days and my plants only need a liter or two every other day.


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## Uncle Pirate (Jan 23, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> PJ, I honestly think your yellowing was user error and don't think you can blame it on the product. I just pulled this Kush down without any yellowing at 8.5 weeks
> 
> 
> I had run Floranova in the past and didn't have as good of results and didn't like the sludgy mess. I also felt like I couldn't get all of it out of the bottle! Floranova is also more expensive off the shelf. With Veg+Bloom I am paying around $15 cents for a gallon of nutrient solution these days and my plants only need a liter or two every other day.


For $23 I get way more out of a bottle of FN than I did a lb. of V+B for $27 total. Way more. If you can't get all the FN out of the bottle, put some water in and shake. It's not a big deal to me. For my results using FN vs. V+B, it's FN all day for me. Honestly, it's obvious you're a rep for V+B, so of course your opinion of any competition would be biased. I'm just sharing my experience. I don't represent anyone but me.


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## ProfessorPotSnob (Jan 23, 2013)

Rep + 

Flora Nova MSRP $27.50


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## Bakatare666 (Jan 23, 2013)

Thanks Unc, Pirate, Chuck, all good info to think about while I'm trying it.


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## Cuebossa (Jan 23, 2013)

I picked up my last 1lb of Veg+Bloom for $17 at my local store. At 1.3EC a pound makes 106 gallons. Most importantly are the results. I have consistently dialed in every strain that has been thrown at me in a variety of mediums. If that's not something to get online and want to share with others about than I must be in the wrong place. I figure this of all places should be the spot to share useful tools with other gardeners. 

Blue Dream at 1.3EC from day 1 in Promix BX


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## patlpp (Jan 23, 2013)

Don't sweat it Cue. If the dude thinks you are a rep and have so much time as to compile a thread like this to influence a few people well.... it just shows how idiotic it sounds and he is just making a fool out of himself. Thanks for all your info on this product. 
+ rep to ya man if I could except I gotta spread it around according to the RIU Master Computer! .


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## Dr. Skunk Bud (Jan 23, 2013)

i just bought some payed for it on a friday received it next monday pretty quick shipping


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## Uncle Pirate (Jan 23, 2013)

patlpp said:


> Don't sweat it Cue. If the dude thinks you are a rep and have so much time as to compile a thread like this to influence a few people well.... it just shows how idiotic it sounds and he is just making a fool out of himself. Thanks for all your info on this product.
> + rep to ya man if I could except I gotta spread it around according to the RIU Master Computer! .


 If you don't think he's a rep, whatever. If he's not, whatever. I simply shared my experience and assumed this guy that plugs V+B was a rep. I don't see how I'm making a fool of myself. I see you making a dick rider out of yourself though. And cuebossa, I don't see how I can get that stuff for $17 when no one carries it. Great you can get it so cheap, you shouldn't assume everyone can. And it's great you have good results with it. Your results don't reflect mine at all. I get way better results with Flora Nova and it's cheaper for me in the end, sorry.


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## potroastV2 (Jan 23, 2013)

Of course he's a rep for the company! No one hawks a product like a TV commercial for this long without being on the payroll. 

It's obvious, and we've heard it all, so please stop your spamming.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 23, 2013)

Here is the deal. If these guys were NOT shills for the company the company would come on here and field questions from time to time.


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## Cuebossa (Jan 23, 2013)

This thread has been a journal of my using a product. I have shared how it has worked in different medias and what strength I am using it at. If one cannot share this type of information without being called a "shill" or "spammer" then god rest our souls. We will all be doomed to pop up ads and hydro-store hype. 

Here is an analogy; This guy walks into a bar, he orders a beer, he turns to his fellow beer drinking brethren and says "This sure is tasty beer". Does this mean he works for the brewer of that beer? 

Have a drink and a smoke gentlemen. Relax a little, it is not a conspiracy.


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## ProfessorPotSnob (Jan 24, 2013)

*

We will all be doomed to pop up ads and hydro-store hype. - Funny Shit here ! LMFAO​


*


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## Izoc666 (Jan 24, 2013)

Cuebossa, keep sharing with us !

happy gardening.


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 24, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> PJ, I honestly think your yellowing was user error and don't think you can blame it on the product. I just pulled this Kush down without any yellowing at 8.5 weeks
> 
> 
> 
> ...


User error? Then why did it happen on two different strains grown right next to their genetic clones, and it didn't happen using my standard nute regiment in the EXACT same conditions. The only thing different is the nutes. Maybe my measuring spoon is wrong would be the only possibility as I use a different device to measure dry nutes vs liquids. Also the buds on each v+B plant are lackluster compared to control. Perhaps my hard water plays a role which is why I don't really like all in ones.


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## homebrewer (Jan 24, 2013)

PJ Diaz said:


> User error? Then why did it happen on two different strains grown right next to their genetic clones, and it didn't happen using my standard nute regiment in the EXACT same conditions. The only thing different is the nutes. Maybe my measuring spoon is wrong would be the only possibility as I use a different device to measure dry nutes vs liquids. Also the buds on each v+B plant are lackluster compared to control. Perhaps my hard water plays a role which is why I don't really like all in ones.


Got any pics?


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 24, 2013)

homebrewer said:


> PJ Diaz said:
> 
> 
> > User error? Then why did it happen on two different strains grown right next to their genetic clones, and it didn't happen using my standard nute regiment in the EXACT same conditions. The only thing different is the nutes. Maybe my measuring spoon is wrong would be the only possibility as I use a different device to measure dry nutes vs liquids. Also the buds on each v+B plant are lackluster compared to control. Perhaps my hard water plays a role which is why I don't really like all in ones.
> ...


 Yes. I posted the G13Haze pic a few pages back. That just got chopped. 

I can take a pick of the J1 tonight. They are small in one gallon containers and close to chop time.


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## homebrewer (Jan 24, 2013)

PJ Diaz said:


> Here's 4 plants. The two on the right are from the same mother as the V+B plant and grown exactly the same except the nutes. The one in the rear-left is the V+B plant. Started feeding all plants water only about 5 days ago.
> 
> The one in the front left is a different strain with a shorter veg time.




These plants look pretty good, I assume all plants were being fed at the same EC or no?


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## PJ Diaz (Jan 24, 2013)

homebrewer said:


> These plants look pretty good, I assume all plants were being fed at the same EC or no?


Thanks. Yes, all plants were decent, it's just a subtle difference in yield and quality. I will admit that my control group was fed at a higher EC level, and perhaps more V+B at an equal EC would be a good test. I fed with V+B at max at 25% above their recommended dosage for drain to waste in coco (1 tsp/gal), so I didn't really want to go much higher (since that's what they recommend). My other nute consisted of Botanicare PureBlend Pro Bloom, Pro-Tekt, Liquid Kharma, Hydroplex, and a home made carb mixture of molasses and barley malt syrup to feed the mycros. I didn't add and carbs to the v+b plant as the owner informed me that it included carbs.


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## potroastV2 (Jan 24, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> This thread has been a journal of my using a product. I have shared how it has worked in different medias and what strength I am using it at. If one cannot share this type of information without being called a "shill" or "spammer" then god rest our souls. We will all be doomed to pop up ads and hydro-store hype.
> 
> Here is an analogy; This guy walks into a bar, he orders a beer, he turns to his fellow beer drinking brethren and says "This sure is tasty beer". Does this mean he works for the brewer of that beer?
> 
> Have a drink and a smoke gentlemen. Relax a little, it is not a conspiracy.




Oh, it's your Grow Journal, and not a blatant attempt to get free advertising. It appears obvious to me that you are spamming.

I'll move the thread to Grow Journals.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 24, 2013)

In have a harvest of V+B plants coming down in 5 days. Will try and post pics.


they got toasted by MOAB at week 5 by accident when i let someone else feed while I was out of town but they still look ok. Just burned


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## Cuebossa (Jan 31, 2013)

Here is the Blue Dream. I have started to leach the Veg+Bloom.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Jan 31, 2013)

got another group in flower now using Veg+Bloom and starting to see a lot of lower leafs with large rust colored spots, running it at 1000ppm, not sure why thats happening.


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## Cuebossa (Feb 1, 2013)

I've been running an EC of 1.2 on the pictured Blue Dream which would be 600ppm if using a .5 conversion scale. My thinking is you over-fertilized and forgot to flush with a more mild solution.


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## Lucius Vorenus (Feb 1, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> I've been running an EC of 1.2 on the pictured Blue Dream which would be 600ppm if using a .5 conversion scale. My thinking is you over-fertilized and forgot to flush with a more mild solution.


1.2 EC is 840ppm on any truncheon PPM meter.


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## Cuebossa (Feb 1, 2013)

and 600ppm on any Hanna meter. Hence the need to communicate in EC. I think I have mentioned this before....


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## ProfessorPotSnob (Mar 12, 2013)

Wow , this sure did end abruptly !


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## chuck estevez (Mar 12, 2013)

ProfessorPotSnob said:


> Wow , this sure did end abruptly !


 Everyone tried it and wasn't impressed, and that includes me.


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## ProfessorPotSnob (Mar 12, 2013)

chuck estevez said:


> Everyone tried it and wasn't impressed, and that includes me.


 With all the skepticism and hype how could this be ? lol 
I still have some and plan on using it as a bloom supplement as it was free and it will work fine for such in my opinion ..


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## Cuebossa (Mar 14, 2013)

Judging by the results I have seen on atleast 3 other forums I would say there are more impressed and now actively using veg+bloom users than not. It looks like it has definitely taken a hold of part of the community that is looking for ease of use with good results. Can't complain about that!


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## chuck estevez (Mar 14, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> Judging by the results I have seen on atleast 3 other forums I would say there are more impressed and now actively using veg+bloom users than not. It looks like it has definitely taken a hold of part of the community that is looking for ease of use with good results. Can't complain about that!


 Is that your last ditched sales pitch?


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## syndakitspypanda1777 (Mar 14, 2013)

chuck estevez said:


> Is that your last ditched sales pitch?


.............hmmm... after reading from start to end........... i have reached the conclusion that not only is cuebossa a veg+bloom rep .. but an illuminati member as well... when will the conspiracy end ? but in all seriousness im ordering some  i have some in soil going on the 4 week of flower and doing dwc along with outdoor dutch bucket system  if all goes well. and im gonna get some of this free stuff and try it for my self. oh i have been on the fox farm regiment by the way. but my hydro store is somewhat pricey.. also anyone try jacks pro >>??? im actually going to buy that and compare it to the veg+bloom free stuff well noodles...


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## syndakitspypanda1777 (Mar 14, 2013)

first week of flower i have yet to take pics but tomorrow will be five weeks and look to forward to pics . this is a experiment batch gettin back into this and really need the stress relief with all this bs. nothing like growing.....they look way better then this now of course but yea. i read somewhere a thread where some guy used fabric to make his own pots and would dip them in a 5 gallon bucket of his type of feed and what not. but yea anywho first time with pics so sorry if they dont look great


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## chuck estevez (Mar 14, 2013)

syndakitspypanda1777 said:


> .............hmmm... after reading from start to end........... i have reached the conclusion that not only is cuebossa a veg+bloom rep .. but an illuminati member as well... when will the conspiracy end ? but in all seriousness im ordering some  i have some in soil going on the 4 week of flower and doing dwc along with outdoor dutch bucket system  if all goes well. and im gonna get some of this free stuff and try it for my self. oh i have been on the fox farm regiment by the way. but my hydro store is somewhat pricey.. also anyone try jacks pro >>??? im actually going to buy that and compare it to the veg+bloom free stuff well noodles...


 Got the free samples, wasn't impressed. Am now using jack's classic 20-20-20 from start to finish and seeing the best results in over a year.


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## potroastV2 (Mar 14, 2013)

Of course he's a spammer, he just admitted to spamming at least 3 other forums.

Companies like this that abuse forums because they are too cheap to actually pay for advertising should be avoided.


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## Cuebossa (Mar 14, 2013)

Some of You guys are redefining the term "hater" here. Use what you want to use. It doesn't matter to me. When you accuse someone of something they are not it's just 4th grade behavior. Maybe my results are better than yours, don't let it get you down, learn, move on, try something new.


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## Guccizillaa (Mar 14, 2013)

RIU Troll Defense Network dispatching.


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## Cuebossa (Mar 14, 2013)

Seriously. It's a little police like actually. The last thing we need are paranoid police.


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## chuck estevez (Mar 14, 2013)

Cuebossa said:


> Seriously. It's a little police like actually. The last thing we need are paranoid police.


you aren't fooling anyone. But I'll give you 1star for trying.


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## Cuebossa (Mar 14, 2013)

Back to the grow... Canna coco has really been working well for me. I dumped the promix as I felt it was getting overpriced with a 20% increase in price. The Canna coco is nice and fluffy and very conductive to root growth.

3 gallon smart pot with canna coco freshly transplanted, 1 week into flower


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## homebrewer (Mar 14, 2013)

How do you like those smart pots? I've got some root maker containers coming in the mail for some experimentation, I like the concept of both products.


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## Cuebossa (Mar 15, 2013)

I like the smart pots. They are a little flimsy compared to the Geopots but have lasted me 3 grows now and I'm sure I can get a couple years out of them.


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## patlpp (Mar 15, 2013)

homebrewer said:


> How do you like those smart pots? I've got some root maker containers coming in the mail for some experimentation, I like the concept of both products.


I've tried smart pots , roots organic pots and gro-pro pots. The gro-pro's are the best IME. Very little side leakage when watering, are very durable and they stay firm in place when filled. Built very well. They are also half the price of Smart pots. You should be able to find them in Hydro stores where Sun System products are sold. Recommend 3 gallon pots. Do not try to up-pot with them. Not so easy. 

Click on here for a description. 








This is a 2 gallon which ended up too small. I tore away an area to give you an idea of lateral root density. The roots were so thick, when I watered them, it would slowly seep through. As the roots became thicker, I did notice I didn't need quite so much nutes either. Where I would normally see tip burn at 2 ec, With the pots I was seeing it at .9 ec. One more thing: with these pots, the medium becomes cooler due to the increased ventilation. This became a problem for me because I was battling low temps this winter so it did seem to effect my grow . Recommend not to use where temps average in the low 70's. If you keep em warm though, they will take off.


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## Newfriend (Mar 29, 2013)

Hi everyone, thanks for sharing. Lots of valuable info here. (my browser doesn't let my return key work) grrrr. I have just done a grow with GHS Powder Feeding Keep it simple. killer stuff. FEDX has tripled its shipping cost so I won't be ordering any more. I have just ordered 1 pound of the V+B, I hope it works as well. On a note GHS make PF for Moms, Indica, Sativa and mixed, slightly different formula for each type of plant. Thanks again all info appreciated


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## surferguysd (May 29, 2013)

Started using this product (veg+grow)
about 2 months ago its tap water friendly
1 part...u add .5-1tsp to gallon of water that it... 
i can say in veg state it works...
i use .5 teaspoon per gallon...
im on week 4 and here are results from clone


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## Cuebossa (Dec 29, 2013)

Hey Surferguysd, how'd it turn out?


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## TWS (Mar 30, 2014)

Hi,
I have been giving it a try. It seems like I can only use 1 tsp to 5 gallon water (tap 217 ppm )in my hempys in vegg . Any more n they turn to dark. Does this seem about right.. and do you use any bloom boosters or other supplements in flower or vegg ? Their P & K seem a little low for all the way thru flower. 
I all so have some trouble with purple stems in vegg so I started to add some Epsom salt and flora duo B 1-5-4 to help out. It seems to be getting better.
So far I like the stuff. A little hard to dissolve in larger amounts. I have a couple of soil grows at 5 weeks in flower that have only gotten vegg & bloom, some cal mag and floralicious and just finally got them up to 1 tsp per gallon . They are doing great, just wondeing if I should use a booster or add some Flora duo B ?

Thank you and if you have any tips on the stuff I would appreciate it .

Thanks, Tdub


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## Cuebossa (Apr 8, 2014)

I would run the dirty formula in soil. From what I have read it has large amounts of organic calcium and magnesium in it as well as plant extracts etc. You won't need cal/mag or floraliscous with it. I ran their RO/SOFT and TAP formulas in soil and had to watch my run off pH. I am trying out the +size PK they have and so far I've noticed more pistils at week 3 of flower.


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## chris buster (Apr 21, 2015)

I have been using Dirty for a few rounds now in my green house, I liked the results so much I started using the +size and +life.


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## Bigdog1980 (Apr 29, 2018)

Will bloom feed do anything for a plant in veg?


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