# Pulling 4oz off 1 plant ?



## doug henderson (Feb 17, 2011)

*I'm going to get a hydro or aero setup going this summer and I was wondering what I could do to get 4 dry ounces per plant. i know that different strains produce different yields but all that aside. Mainly just wondering about veg time really. I will be doing this in a basement so total plant height including hydro table cannot be more than 7ft tall. maybe topping and giving the plant more top colas would increase yield per plant. I dont really want to do a ScrOG or use LST. Is this possible or are my expectations just way too high. Any suggestions welcomed. 

PEACE *


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## Fluxcap (Feb 17, 2011)

Large bushes under lots of light, in at least 7 gallon pots or bubble buckets


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## Mother's Finest (Feb 17, 2011)

With a high-yielding strain, 1/4lb isn't all that difficult and doesn't require plants bigger than about 2.5'. We regularly get 4oz well trimmed and dried after flowering plants at about 7" tall. That's after topping three stalks. The plants end up with six colas each, each 1/2oz.


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## Harrekin (Feb 18, 2011)

6 colas x 1/2oz = 4oz? Wish my plants grew like that


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## webb107 (Feb 18, 2011)

Fluxcap said:


> Large bushes under lots of light, in at least 7 gallon pots or bubble buckets


I did 1 wappa plant under a 600w hps light in a 5gal pot with organic nutes with molasses and got 175g dry


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## ataxia (Feb 18, 2011)

it's all dependent on the strain ....if you have something that produces nice dense buds ... I would suggest ... veg for two months using UB's topping technique and a bit of list maybe ..... I pulled about 3 oz off each plant under less than optimal condition under a 600 in 4 gallon pots. 
It really has to do with genetics, veg time, and lighting AND optimal conditions


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## Wolverine97 (Feb 18, 2011)

It comes down to your environment, the genetics being grown, and your skill level. I routinely yield 4+ oz per plant with about a month of veg time (some strains are less than that, but 4 is an average). I run a modified SCROG so that I can have many different varieties and keep an even canopy. It can be done no problem, but if this is your first venture, expect about half of that. Rather than focusing on per plant yield, you should concentrate on grams/watt of light.


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## Mother's Finest (Feb 18, 2011)

Harrekin said:


> 6 colas x 1/2oz = 4oz? Wish my plants grew like that


(6 colas x 1/2oz) + [6 x (weight of all other buds on each stalk)] = 4oz The colas aren't the only buds on the plant, just the largest. Ours typically have a few big-ish buds just under the colas and then the standard popcorn buds at the very bottom nodes.

I so told my better half that this would come up when she posted that


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## Icannabis (Feb 19, 2011)

It's all depends on many many factors...How many plants? How close are they? How good is air flow? Is C02 and option? Root conditioning? Super cropping or topping? Veg time? Flowering time? Pot size? ok I'm done


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## doug henderson (Feb 19, 2011)

Icannabis said:


> It's all depends on many many factors...How many plants? How close are they? How good is air flow? Is C02 and option? Root conditioning? Super cropping or topping? Veg time? Flowering time? Pot size? ok I'm done


*I realize there is a lot of variables you dont have to tell me what they are just tell me what, if any, is your experience pulling 4oz off of a single plant. kind of like everybody else did that replied to this post.*


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## Icannabis (Feb 19, 2011)

Yeah Doug it takes experience is my point. To reliably do it. I just pulled 3oz off some 2 foot autos with nothing more.


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## collective gardener (Feb 19, 2011)

Check out our thread. Most of the plants are in 10 gallon pots. I am estimating 6-8 ounces per plant. Basicall, we top them one time when they are very small. Then, alot of bending down and out. Everyttime we transplant, we cut all ties and re-tie the plant. Large shoots too stiff to bend are super cropped (broke). Small shoots too high are lopped off.

Forget 7' tall unless you're using side lighting. Go wide, not tall.

https://www.rollitup.org/indoor-growing/407048-20-000-watt-medical-grow.html


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## Parker Lemire (Feb 21, 2011)

VERY TRUE!!!! couldnt have said it better!


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## hellraizer30 (Feb 21, 2011)

veg a month and top them, have good genetics and good lighting 1000wat!! and 5 gal+ buckets and hydro 4 ounces could be a low number.
I flowered a mother out and she was 5 foot and the light was almost touching but there was no choise, and she yielded 3/4 of a pound dry
with a 1000 hps all to her self.


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## JLStiffy (Feb 21, 2011)

Hi, _I hope to_ be the barren of good new for yea! After a few years of experience with this one strain I have, I always flowered out 21-24 plants in two rooms. Each room had two 600HPS and two 1000HPS. I used two gallons and three gallons but always all three or all two in one room at one time-I never mixed two and three gallons in one room. I always ranged from 3-4.5 Oz a plant with this set up. It all really depends on variables etc. No bullshit. Questions on set up or details, u can ask. My system is different now. NOt because I was getting over 5LB on 3200Watts, but because I grow al year, and even in Canada it gets +35 C out. So in the summer is tough, now I use Aircool shades and added more lights   But I keep 600HPS open. 
BTW, I don't mess around with any stress, or toping or oversized grow bags and hardly fill with dirt but use it for it's wider bottom circumference, I also dont use big pots like 5 gallons since those are a waste of time! I also do it with avg 27 daays veg but done mostly under one 600HPS and in six inch pots, than transplant into two gallons or three and veg for about 10 days or two weeks MAX. 
Best of luck man! I know a strain u might like. Mine I made so thats out, but I can give u a a hint on one strain.


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## legallyflying (Feb 21, 2011)

My last grow (aka my first grow) I pulled 5.7 oz per plant average. 5 weeks of veg, fimmed and trained in a SCROG. I was stoked but I think I am going to do better this round with a little less veg time. 

Keep in mind though, I spend allot of money and time to build a dedicated, climate controlled, sealed room. 

7' trees and growing one plant under one bulb don't go together that well. Get a high quality 400 HPS bulb with an ebb and grow system (super cheap and easy for one plant), topp it twice or three times and SCROG it in a 3 x 3 foot screen and you'll easily pull 4oz. Going to take a month of veg at least.


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## hellraizer30 (Feb 21, 2011)

JLStiffy said:


> Hi, _I hope to_ be the barren of good new for yea! After a few years of experience with this one strain I have, I always flowered out 21-24 plants in two rooms. Each room had two 600HPS and two 1000HPS. I used two gallons and three gallons but always all three or all two in one room at one time-I never mixed two and three gallons in one room. I always ranged from 3-4.5 Oz a plant with this set up. It all really depends on variables etc. No bullshit. Questions on set up or details, u can ask. My system is different now. NOt because I was getting over 5LB on 3200Watts, but because I grow al year, and even in Canada it gets +35 C out. So in the summer is tough, now I use Aircool shades and added more lights   But I keep 600HPS open.
> BTW, I don't mess around with any stress, or toping or oversized grow bags and hardly fill with dirt but use it for it's wider bottom circumference, I also dont use big pots like 5 gallons since those are a waste of time! I also do it with avg 27 daays veg but done mostly under one 600HPS and in six inch pots, than transplant into two gallons or three and veg for about 10 days or two weeks MAX.
> Best of luck man! I know a strain u might like. Mine I made so thats out, but I can give u a a hint on one strain.


so what the hint?


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## smokebros (Feb 21, 2011)

I just got 3 oz off a topped snow white plant. [under a 250 hps]


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## JLStiffy (Feb 22, 2011)

Smokebros that sounds like a good strain. 
Helraiser, hi, In the past i thought I grew a strain that gave me a very good yeild. Now I order seeds, sex them, and take cutting I let my friend flower them out under three 1000HPS on his room A flop. He did not to bad. The strain yeild one week early on three 1000HPS bulbs with 15plants 5oZ a plant in three gallon pots. BUT BUT, the some plants were 5.5 feet talk including the pot and the others grew to the top of the rafters in the floor and just above the shade. The stain is called Chronic. Now, it's worth trying for someone who use's a 1000HPS in flower because of it's penetration. My Friend is not an experience grower. He just followed some ABC and tries not to be a robotic grower  Keep it simple too. Keep the grow room controlled. 
Unfort, my strain is obv not avail but only in clone form. And the cross is not an available genetic anymore. It came from Portland Oregon. But its the money maker/dream strain for quality.


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## ataxia (Feb 22, 2011)

if you could sum all this up in a good answer ( i know i'll catch shit) it seems as though the best yields are coming from plants in larger containers ... bigger root zone = bigger plants = bigger yields..


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## hellraizer30 (Feb 22, 2011)

ataxia said:


> if you could sum all this up in a good answer ( i know i'll catch shit) it seems as though the best yields are coming from plants in larger containers ... bigger root zone = bigger plants = bigger yields..


to add to that would be a perfect room/co2 and alot of light.


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## smokebros (Feb 22, 2011)

the more room the roots have to grow, the bigger the plant. (there are always hereditary things that effect this as well)


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## medicine21 (Feb 22, 2011)

JLStiffy said:


> I used two gallons and three gallons but always all three or all two in one room at one time-I never mixed two and three gallons in one room. I always ranged from 3-4.5 Oz a plant with this set up.


Was there a big difference in yield between using the 2 gallon vs 3 gallon pots?



smokebros said:


> the more room the roots have to grow, the bigger the plant. (there are always hereditary things that effect this as well)


I wonder how much of a factor this really is for hydro especially. I have grown in 4x4x2" AND 4x4x4" (twice as big) RW cubes side by side and the plants were exactly the same. So although I doubled my grow media, the plants so no difference in a flood and drain.


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## Wolverine97 (Feb 22, 2011)

medicine21 said:


> Was there a big difference in yield between using the 2 gallon vs 3 gallon pots?
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder how much of a factor this really is for hydro especially. I have grown in 4x4x2" AND 4x4x4" (twice as big) RW cubes side by side and the plants were exactly the same. So although I doubled my grow media, the plants so no difference in a flood and drain.


Well I can't speak to rockwool, don't touch the stuff, but in soil it makes a HUGE difference. I run 5 gallon+, and I"m thinking about going bigger.


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## JLStiffy (Feb 22, 2011)

Hi,
The two v. three gallon is a really big controversy and that holds true for those commercial growers. I find, that most people on these forums grow for fun or personal and for friends. In most cases, and again I have two friends who each own their grow shops and they sell to large set ups; they both agree that two gallon is point blank the most bought. Then you get people coming into the grow shops thinking they know best, or always tryng to make it' like they have it right or dialed in. The GOOD news is that they generally agree on these two basic things; 1) two gallons are great since you can get six to nine plants a light. If you can average 3OZ a plant you can get over 1.5lb a bulb. Second, some people switch over in three gallon pots for summer time since plants tend to intake more water generally but even more in the summer time for several obv. reasons. A good rule of thumb amongst use growers in BC, Canada is that, get an OZ for every gallon you use. But thats just being the basics. I can get 4oz or close to, every time, with just two gallon pot. BUT thats not with every strain. 
Bigger roots, equal bigger plant, thats right, but theirs a point when that rule is not applicable. That's an argument thats not happening on this forum. But here is a point to make about that; you can do better with 6 plants under a 1000HPS in 2 gallon pots than what you can with plants in 3 gallons that grow all branchy- train if you want, I mean, I help lead the lower growth, but I also train the top of the plant with the light. Big thing is, maybe you can't grow with two gallon pots but always had good growth with three gallons- than that's what works for you and the grow environment. But try to realize were people might be coming, some do this for fun or a living. 
I find two gallons rock, they are a place just to hold roots, no live soil etc. I control what they eat. I also want my pots packed-root bound before flower. I always dont want to veg for 4-5 weeks. If you go bigger pots, means more veg time. If you dont veg long, you will just get a weaker root system that sits in a larger amount of soil that tends to never dry out. So if you go bigger pots, have to veg longer, but than you get more plant that does not get much light! But, again, this is one view vs. many other self acclaimed guru growers!


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## Mother's Finest (Feb 22, 2011)

Pot size doesn't increase yield, it can only decrease it. Once a plant is in a container where it won't encounter any restriction to root growth, it will grow to it's normal maximum size (max for all other growing variables). No amount of extra pot size will cause it to grow bigger. The only question is whether or not the roots become restricted by the end of flowering and if so, how much.

The other thing we want to mention is that, in our experience, cannabis roots tend to grow more downward than outward. When different shapes of containers are considered, you can't say any specific volume is perfect for a given plant. Pots having equal height and diameter don't last quite as long as some pots that are slightly taller than they are wide, even if they are each the same volume. Quite often, roots will have more time to grow when taller pots of the same diameter are used. The grower can flower for longer with fewer problems and the new pots don't take up any extra floor space.


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## Wolverine97 (Feb 22, 2011)

Mother's Finest said:


> Pot size doesn't increase yield, it can only decrease it. Once a plant is in a container where it won't encounter any restriction to root growth, it will grow to it's normal maximum size (max for all other growing variables). No amount of extra pot size will cause it to grow bigger. The only question is whether or not the roots become restricted by the end of flowering and if so, how much.
> 
> The other thing we want to mention is that, in our experience, cannabis roots tend to grow more downward than outward. When different shapes of containers are considered, you can't say any specific volume is perfect for a given plant. Pots having equal height and diameter don't last quite as long as some pots that are slightly taller than they are wide, even if they are each the same volume. Quite often, roots will have more time to grow when taller pots of the same diameter are used. The grower can flower for longer with fewer problems and the new pots don't take up any extra floor space.


This is very true, and a good way of looking at it. The one caveat I'd throw in there pertaining to the issue of container width/depth ratio is that it's true for most containers, but I think the new "smart pots" and their ilk are the exception to that rule.


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## JLStiffy (Feb 22, 2011)

So are you saying that when I root bound my plants in two gallons and get my 3-4oz a plant is generally is true- lets say' and that when I increase my pot size-three gallon and root bound my plants my yield will not go up? I see your point in reaching whats called' plant potential' but the way the info is stated is skewed largely to fit this thread. What your saying would hold true outside, not inside, since we are always holding our plants back either with one thing or another! I guess an interesting argument would be against those growing in a vertical system, or those who believe more dirt volume is better; that is, they do use larger containers such as 5 gallons. In this case their yield would increase.

I do agree with the 'weather or not the roots become restricted by the end of flowering and if so, how much'. But I would not read any more from that book. It does not sound very applicable since no matter what pot you use inside, you will restrict your root growth; in turn, yield. I am a little confused on' normal maximum size' are you saying you can get larger than the max size but that would be rare to happen? And another confusion is how larger pot size decrease yield. I want to hear more about it, not to mock, but to hear you out, and it could be interesting. But what about those organic growers? They grow larger plants in large pots to help increase their yields; yes it is also for holding a larger, rich food supple, but also holding a larger root structure. 

In all seriousness, the 5 gallon pot is the only true pot that is equal, the rest is off in proportion.


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## Wolverine97 (Feb 22, 2011)

JLStiffy said:


> So are you saying that when I root bound my plants in two gallons and get my 3-4oz a plant is generally is true- lets say' and that when I increase my pot size-three gallon and root bound my plants my yield will not go up? I see your point in reaching whats called' plant potential' but the way the info is stated is skewed largely to fit this thread. What your saying would hold true outside, not inside, since we are always holding our plants back either with one thing or another! I guess an interesting argument would be against those growing in a vertical system, or those who believe more dirt volume is better; that is, they do use larger containers such as 5 gallons. In this case their yield would increase.
> 
> I do agree with the 'weather or not the roots become restricted by the end of flowering and if so, how much'. But I would not read any more from that book. It does not sound very applicable since no matter what pot you use inside, you will restrict your root growth; in turn, yield. I am a little confused on' normal maximum size' are you saying you can get larger than the max size but that would be rare to happen? And another confusion is how larger pot size decrease yield. I want to hear more about it, not to mock, but to hear you out, and it could be interesting. But what about those organic growers? They grow larger plants in large pots to help increase their yields; yes it is also for holding a larger, rich food supple, but also holding a larger root structure.
> 
> In all seriousness, the 5 gallon pot is the only true pot that is equal, the rest is off in proportion.


No, he's not saying that increasing the pot size won't increase your yield. He's saying that pot size should be thought of as a limiting factor in potential plant size, not necessarily that bigger pot= bigger yield. It's true. If you are reaching your plant's peak genetic potential in 2 gallons, then you would not see any more yield by going to a three gallon. I doubt that would be the case, as most plants are capable of yielding far more than four ounces under ideal conditions.

Edit: after re-reading my post, it comes off a bit scattershot, basically the pot is almost always the limiting factor indoors. I just smoked a nice blueberry joint, so I'm not fixing my post because it'll probably only get worse. Oh well.


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## JLStiffy (Feb 22, 2011)

Oh thank God  lol Otherwise we would have to go after the publisher of that book!


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## Icannabis (Feb 22, 2011)

Root size and condition determines every other factor in plant growth...but I guess DWC and aero guys are wrong about more root surface area...right?


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## slk (Feb 22, 2011)

What would your prefered strains be to get 4 oz's from a single plant?


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## NightbirdX (Feb 23, 2011)

I have a friend who grows hydro like a dick (he doesn't do it well...) and still pulls 5 oz per plant under 1 1000w light 4 plants per light.


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## Wolverine97 (Feb 23, 2011)

NightbirdX said:


> I have a friend who grows hydro like a dick (he doesn't do it well...) and still pulls 5 oz per plant under 1 1000w light 4 plants per light.


That's actually not very impressive at all for hydro.


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## doug henderson (Feb 23, 2011)

*thanks for the input guys. So if i do an aero setup it should be no problem pulling 4oz a plant with a good light and co2. good to hear. *


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## Wolverine97 (Feb 23, 2011)

doug henderson said:


> *thanks for the input guys. So if i do an aero setup it should be no problem pulling 4oz a plant with a good light and co2. good to hear. *


It depends on plant density, veg time, your skill, etc.. If you run between 9-12 plants under 1-1kw HPS with about a month of veg, you should be able to pull 1-2lbs depending on strain and the factors I listed previously. I usually get around 2, and that's in dirt.


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## wiseguy316 (Feb 23, 2011)

i would be disappointed in anything less than 4 per plant in an aero setup.


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## wiseguy316 (Feb 23, 2011)

lot more initial costs to fire up an aero set up right.


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## hellraizer30 (Feb 23, 2011)

ebb&grow system with 30 day veg would put out with the right strain around 6 ounces per plant


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## Wolverine97 (Feb 24, 2011)

hellraizer30 said:


> ebb&grow system with 30 day veg would put out with the right strain around 6 ounces per plant


The thing people keep leaving out of this equation is planting density. 6oz per plant is great, but is that with four plants under 1kw or is it with 12 plants? There's a big difference there.


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## JLStiffy (Feb 27, 2011)

Hi, 
I really hope you dont rely on the areo set up to 'grant you' the four oz a plant. More often you see in hydro, people with more plants per bulb and try to veg half or original thought about veg time. This is true because roots do grow fast in a hydro set up. So, again, when you think about what factors will give you four oz a plant, it really starts at what light source you have. Than look at how many plants and system you want to run. Pick your strain carefully because their are lot of people saying alot of stuff and they really just repeat what they hear. Make sure you pick a plant that loves a hydro set up if you insist on hydro. 
I know theirs going to be people argue this one but they are arguing on this fact just because they are more interested in talking about themselves. Expect a better yield per plant in soilless medium than soil and hydro (hydro in most case's) Hydro is better PRIMARY for cutting veg time back- not for bud size (love the misconception!). I mean, aruge if you want, just so happens I know the true basis of hydro because of some very important people that prob are responsible for alot of the food you eat. They are educated in their fields. 

So, your in areo, try it out, see if it's for you. Dont expect to get what others claim on the web  When someone say's they got 2lb with it, you know they got 1lb  They new readily available G13 strain looks interesting.. I would look into that. its 100% indica too. Think it is by barneys or DNA, its on the new skunk and high times.


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## Jozikins (Feb 28, 2011)

High quality lights, high quality nutrients, attention to detail, and a good training technique and it is totally possible with less than 4 ft of head space. Scrog or LST is your best bet, honestly. Topping is great too, but personally I can LST to be 2-3ft wide in all direction with no additional support. All you need is a strong stem from excellent veg practice and diet, and some constant training, and you can pull 4oz off a plant if you are pro, maybe 2.5-3oz your first time with a good strain. But SCROG seems to be the absolute most effective method. I still haven't tried it though, but have observed several grows in person and online. I have used topping, FIM, and LST, and I love them all, but LST is my favorite.

You need at least 2 lamps, 600w+
That's assuming you aren't the next Jack Herrer.


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## JLStiffy (Feb 28, 2011)

Jozikins, prob one of the most honest person i meet on this forum in a while!


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## JLStiffy (Feb 28, 2011)

Rep for that


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## medicine21 (Feb 28, 2011)

JLStiffy said:


> Hi,
> They new readily available G13 strain looks interesting.. I would look into that. its 100% indica too. Think it is by barneys or DNA, its on the new skunk and high times.


Dr. Greenthumb has a claimed G-13. He has an impressive reputation but also is very expensive. 



Jozikins said:


> High quality lights, high quality nutrients, attention to detail, and a good training technique and it is totally possible with less than 4 ft of head space. Scrog or LST is your best bet, honestly. Topping is great too, but personally I can LST to be 2-3ft wide in all direction with no additional support. All you need is a strong stem from excellent veg practice and diet, and some constant training, and you can pull 4oz off a plant if you are pro, maybe 2.5-3oz your first time with a good strain. But SCROG seems to be the absolute most effective method. I still haven't tried it though, but have observed several grows in person and online. I have used topping, FIM, and LST, and I love them all, but LST is my favorite.


Jozikins, how long do you think you need to veg to shoot for 3-4oz/plant if you topped via Uncle Ben's method for example? Would LST or SCROG provide similar results? I have only done 5 day veg single cola SOG for now, but would like to reduct my plant count to 12 for each 4x4' area. The plan is to veg for 4 weeks, Uncle Ben top, and shoot for 3oz/plant in a flood and drain. Not sure if that is realistic or not...


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## Wolverine97 (Feb 28, 2011)

medicine21 said:


> Dr. Greenthumb has a claimed G-13. He has an impressive reputation but also is very expensive.
> 
> 
> 
> Jozikins, how long do you think you need to veg to shoot for 3-4oz/plant if you topped via Uncle Ben's method for example? Would LST or SCROG provide similar results? I have only done 5 day veg single cola SOG for now, but would like to reduct my plant count to 12 for each 4x4' area. The plan is to veg for 4 weeks, Uncle Ben top, and shoot for 3oz/plant in a flood and drain. Not sure if that is realistic or not...


That should be very doable, if the genetics are capable. I veg 4-6 weeks, depending on strain and I get an average of around four.


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## phyzix (Feb 28, 2011)

I can get 70+ grams for every 100 watts of light with a basic soil SoG and 6-8 week vegetative period. 

Not sure of g/kwh off the top of my head, which is a better measure of yield, albeit still somewhat flawed for direct comparison.


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## medicine21 (Feb 28, 2011)

Wolverine97 said:


> That should be very doable, if the genetics are capable. I veg 4-6 weeks, depending on strain and I get an average of around four.


Is it possible to fit 12 of those 3-4oz topped plants in a 4x4' area?


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## phyzix (Feb 28, 2011)

medicine21 said:


> Is it possible to fit 12 of those 3-4oz topped plants in a 4x4' area?


You're going to need some serious light to get that kind of weight from a 4x4.


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## Jozikins (Mar 1, 2011)

Thanks for the kind words everyone  Being as realistic as possible keeps your expectations from getting to high, and you'll end up extremely pleased with your results. Is that a picture of your own crop JL? If so, I'm very jealous of the successful outdoor grower!

Realize if you want 12 plants with 4oz each in a 4x4 space you will be growing very tall, very thin plants with a lot of fluff on the bottom. I think we need to rethink this. Less plants, more bush.

Let's think about strains. Grape Kush is a easy favorite of mine right now, super easy to grow with excellent buds, and huge huge yields! So is AK 47. Larry's OG and SFV OG can make any first time grower feel like a stud. Right now I am having my mind blown by Strawberry Cough, which is usually a very small grower. It was originally a mom from seed I had to flower, it was to gorgeous to clone to death once it got big. I vegged her for about 5 weeks, and at week 5 I cut her in half. I topped her too low and she had a big fat hole in her stem, so I clamped it with a paper clamp and left 6 sets of branches on, let her veg for another week and threw her into flower. OMG she is huge! But not too big for my 600w, she takes up at least a 2.5'x2.0 footprint, and I have a feeling she is going to yield a bit more than a qp. She is in a soiless medium with organic additives, and I agree with JL when he says you can get more off one single plant without SCROG in soiless than you can in hydro. But hydro is so versatile, and the word "hydro" means a lot of different growing styles, and I'm sure someone on here could prove me wrong with their hydro set up.

If you really want to get a lot of plants in a small space, with lots of dank herb, Northern Lights is a excellent choice, and should be put at the top of your consideration list.

A grow like this in a 4x4 space is very ambitious, but it is not unfeasible! If you scrog it is not impossible to pull a pound off a single lamp, I've seen it done. Keep it simple, keep your attention on it, keep a check list, and don't skip steps. Anybody who has been browsing here a while remembers Integra21's legendary SCROG grow! He had 2 3x4 screens (correct me if I'm wrong), in a DWC unit no more than 11" high, his max head height was 3 1/2 feet in his crawl space, and he pulled a pound on each screen! He had two 600w air cooled Sun System Yield Master II deluxe hoods with digital ballasts, and I believe either Sun Master or Hortilux bulbs. He used the Technaflora Recipe to Success kit, it is 35 dollars and one of the VERY BEST nutrients I have EVER used, and I have spent 350+ on House & Garden line ups. The bastard's first grow was the same deal but with one screen and only 1 430w aircooled HPS, and he still pulled just under a pound! That is in a 3x4 space. Integra's grow was the poster boy grow of how to simply produce lots of killer dank buds! Strains I can remember him using were Blue Kush, Piss, and he had some papaya for a while he didn't much care for. Blue Kush and Piss were local strains, and you would be hard pressed to find them outside the southwest.

Pulling more than a pound in a 4x4 space starts with a lot of reading, and replicating success.

I'm going to post some pictures of some plants, something I seldom do on here. Pictures come tomorrow though, I need a better camera, and have to bring them out of the garden. I'll tell you the veg time, the flower time, and weather or not it is in soiless or DWC. I'm starting to prefer potted plants. The veg time and training technique will allow you for the weight you want, but they won't fit in the space unless you are just down-right crappy at vegging. If you LST them you can kind of abuse them to fit in any space you want, I usually train them into different shapes and fit them together like tetris, that way I waste no light on the ground, and I don't have plants shading each other that way. Right now I have a bunch of Christmas trees growing, and as pretty as they are I much much much prefer the LST. I have so much light on my tray right now it's fading, what a horrific waste! I'm about to throw 3 more plants in there right now. What do you think? I'm thinking my purple Old Skool Kush could get a lot of attention 

But a 4x4 space is probably going to take at least a 1000w bulb, if not, 2 600w bulbs. I am not a 1000w grower, and if you go that route, you just read all this for nothing, but 1000w growing is not like 600w growing. 600w is the most efficient bulb available, so my grows are all about keeping temps way down, and getting my bulbs as close as freaking possible without burning my plants at all times. you can do one bulb, but 200 more watts with two 600w bulbs would give you a lot more, even light.


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## Wolverine97 (Mar 1, 2011)

medicine21 said:


> Is it possible to fit 12 of those 3-4oz topped plants in a 4x4' area?


Yes, I usually run 12 in a 5x5 footprint.


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## Jozikins (Mar 1, 2011)

Wolverine97 said:


> Yes, I usually run 12 in a 5x5 footprint.


 I think a picture of your garden would probably give him the more insight than anything.


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## Jdubb203 (Mar 1, 2011)

You need the right strain,pheno and I lst the shit out of them in veg. I had a bubblelicious Qtr pound plant my last harest grown in soil with 2 vertical 600 hps.


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## tafbang (Mar 1, 2011)

get good soil and a decent strain, I feel I could pull it off using my ceiling lights


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## medicine21 (Mar 1, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Realize if you want 12 plants with 4oz each in a 4x4 space you will be growing very tall, very thin plants with a lot of fluff on the bottom. I think we need to rethink this. Less plants, more bush.


The idea was to do Uncle Ben's topping for 4 colas and trim inner leaves to focus all plant energy on those 4 colas. I'd rather not get into LST or scrogging, if I could avoid it, to retain plant mobility and avoid all that rope/canopy management. The footprint would be smaller, I think, if I focus on those 4 colas and I should be able to fit 12 in a 4x4'.



Jozikins said:


> She is in a soiless medium with organic additives, and I agree with JL when he says you can get more off one single plant without SCROG in soiless than you can in hydro. But hydro is so versatile, and the word "hydro" means a lot of different growing styles, and I'm sure someone on here could prove me wrong with their hydro set up.


What do you mean by soiless here? Aero? I am doing RW cubes in a flood and drain now, not sure if 6" cubes (1gal) would be enough to pull 3oz/plant.



Jozikins said:


> A grow like this in a 4x4 space is very ambitious, but it is not unfeasible! If you scrog it is not impossible to pull a pound off a single lamp, I've seen it done. Pulling more than a pound in a 4x4 space starts with a lot of reading, and replicating success.
> 
> But a 4x4 space is probably going to take at least a 1000w bulb, if not, 2 600w bulbs. I am not a 1000w grower, and if you go that route, you just read all this for nothing,


I am in fact doing a 1000W HPS over the 4x4', but your input is still very much appreciated. To be honest I would be disappointed if the 12 plants topped didn't produce 1.5-2lb, since this is what I'm getting now with 30 plant SOG 5-day veg. I figure with 4 week veg and topping it should be achievable with 12 plants, but no real experience with this method to base this on. To hit 1.5-2lb I would need the 12 plants to average 2-2.7oz/plant in the 4x4'.



Wolverine97 said:


> Yes, I usually run 12 in a 5x5 footprint.


 Nice to know I'm not that far off.



Jozikins said:


> I think a picture of your garden would probably give him the more insight than anything.


It would indeed be great to see what your canopy looks like in this setup. +rep to both of you for your input.


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## bob harris (Mar 1, 2011)

ataxia said:


> if you could sum all this up in a good answer ( i know i'll catch shit) it seems as though the best yields are coming from plants in larger containers ... bigger root zone = bigger plants = bigger yields..


Yup..bushes, wide plants in big containers with healthy roots equal yield.


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## Wolverine97 (Mar 1, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> I think a picture of your garden would probably give him the more insight than anything.


I don't do pictures, sorry.


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## Jozikins (Mar 1, 2011)

If you top them while they are small I bet you could get them all together in there, with 12 plants in a 4x4 space, 2.0-2.7 oz off each plant is much more realistic, especially since you haven't tried this before. I am so very unfamiliar with rockwool, I usually avoid it like the plague (but I do start clones in it), not that there is all that much wrong with it, I just don't like it. However, I do know that in any flood and drain system, you can always put a mat at the bottom of the tray, and your cubes will grow into it. They sell coco mats, and giant wrapped rockwool slabs, but it allows your plants to continue growing, long after you thought it was too late to change anything about it. LST probably would be a fracking pain in the ass in rockwool cubes because you would need a counter tie for every bend you make. You can try the lost and forgotten art of super cropping: Squeeze and bend, squeeze and bend!

Soiless is a medium that mimics soil, but contains none. A basic soiless mix is often pete fiber, coco fiber, pumice, and perlite. There are certain things that qualify soil as soil, and as long as I keep that out of my mix, I get to retain my beautiful hydroponic formula with the same pH. You can throw a bunch of organic additives in there and it still wont be considered "soil." But you now get the organic benefit of soil. And I know how plants take in organics, and I know that organic doesn't mean a whole lot when you already have a safe and balanced diet, but it does add a little flavor, and it's worth the money to me.

When are you thinking about starting this? I think we should do a side-by-side with our preferred techniques. I would shit bricks if I could pull 4 pounds out of my 4x8 garden!!


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## Wolverine97 (Mar 1, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> If you top them while they are small I bet you could get them all together in there, with 12 plants in a 4x4 space, 2.0-2.7 oz off each plant is much more realistic, especially since you haven't tried this before. I am so very unfamiliar with rockwool, I usually avoid it like the plague (but I do start clones in it), not that there is all that much wrong with it, I just don't like it. However, I do know that in any flood and drain system, you can always put a mat at the bottom of the tray, and your cubes will grow into it. They sell coco mats, and giant wrapped rockwool slabs, but it allows your plants to continue growing, long after you thought it was too late to change anything about it. LST probably would be a fracking pain in the ass in rockwool cubes because you would need a counter tie for every bend you make. You can try the lost and forgotten art of super cropping: Squeeze and bend, squeeze and bend!
> 
> Soiless is a medium that mimics soil, but contains none. A basic soiless mix is often pete fiber, coco fiber, pumice, and perlite. There are certain things that qualify soil as soil, and as long as I keep that out of my mix, I get to retain my beautiful hydroponic formula with the same pH. You can throw a bunch of organic additives in there and it still wont be considered "soil." But you now get the organic benefit of soil. And I know how plants take in organics, and I know that organic doesn't mean a whole lot when you already have a safe and balanced diet, but it does add a little flavor, and it's worth the money to me.
> 
> When are you thinking about starting this? I think we should do a side-by-side with our preferred techniques. I would shit bricks if I could pull 4 pounds out of my 4x8 garden!!


Supercropping is where it's at.


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## Jozikins (Mar 1, 2011)

Jdubb203 said:


> You need the right strain,pheno and I lst the shit out of them in veg. I had a bubblelicious Qtr pound plant my last harest grown in soil with 2 vertical 600 hps.


 Bubbalicious is a EXCELLENT strain for this kind of grow. Extra-dank and dense nugs, monster yields, happy and easy plants. It is also the best outdoor plant I've ever had the pleasure of chilling with 

I'm fraking going insane, my care taker gave away his bubbalicious mom without giving me another clone to carry it on first!! I was so sad, I never kept mom's of his clones... that was his job!!


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## Wolverine97 (Mar 1, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> Bubbalicious is a EXCELLENT strain for this kind of grow. Extra-dank and dense nugs, monster yields, happy and easy plants. It is also the best outdoor plant I've ever had the pleasure of chilling with
> 
> I'm fraking going insane, my care taker gave away his bubbalicious mom without giving me another clone to carry it on first!! I was so sad, I never kept mom's of his clones... that was his job!!


Never cared for it...


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## 671dragon (Mar 1, 2011)

what ive tried and proved that worked for me in trying to yielding the most out of a small space in the least amount of time is alot of little plants under 400w lights. My method would be putting about 40 of these small plants per 400w vegged for about a day or two in square 1.5 liter pots with a soiless mix then start flowering from there (never change pot from start to finish). The pots are placed side by side no space in between them but i would trim them to be single cola plants and make sure each cola grows straight up not leaning into the other plants space. I would also set it up as a perpetual grow space dividing flowering time between how many 400s usually by 3 or 4 harvesting every 2weeks to 2 weeks and 5 days also by alternating big and small rows of plants to improve air circulation and light penetration. My lamps are usually around 5-8 in above the tallest cola which usually isn&#8217;t more than 2 feet in height including pot height and younger plants are placed on pots one to double pot height to get the younger plants closer to the lights instead of moving the lights closer to it so all of the plants are pretty much mixed up in a orderly chaos of plants starting to flower next to ones just about to finish all pots are put in trays of 8 that perfectly fit the 8 and is thin enough to keep the pots right next to each other. Ive tried a few different strains this way and they always came out nicer looking buds then its bigger counter part. Doing it this way pending on strain would get you an average of 12-18g per plant. Ive grown a few that hit above 20g per very rare but it happend a few times. You would get some that weigh less about 8 grams was the lowest ive ever recorded but thats also rare if everything is healthy without bugs!!! (the few last batches i had got hit by stupid spider mites but they averaged around 8 grams some hit 12-14 but keep in mind this is when everything was sick with bugs and chopped early but still produced danky buds around 6 1/2 to 7 weeks. Also im all the way out on Guam so access to a hydroponic shop (for good organic pesticides or any other good types of bug killers so i was stuck with the bug with no way of getting rid of them and i tried ciggerates in water with hot pepper and all those homeade crap that didn&#8217;t do anything) or any place to get lighting equipment cause i dont want to use a credit card to purchase equipment in fear of BS coming to my door with it im using 400w HPS flood lights like the ones on top the buildings to light up the parking lot i took it apart and made me a homemade grow lamp. Its all backyard stuff i have a big c02 tank but no regulator so i dont use c02 in my rooms either and im attaining these numbers per plant. All in all it takes from start to finish mostly pending on flowering time of strain around 8 weeks (sometimes even 7 1/2 weeks) and 2 days (1-2 days for veg) to the max 9 weeks i dont take on sativas unless im gonna do a whole batch of em cause they usually gain about a foot over everything else and like i said we are going for most bud in the least amount of time. So everybody is saying 2 gallons with like 3-4 week veg time and flowering about 12 of em under a 1000w making about 2 3 maybe 4 Os per plant thats 4 at max in a 4x4 (16 sqft) space 12x4Oz= 48 Oz under a 1000w light in 3 months about max. My space is a 3.5x6 for 3 400w lamps (5 sq pots x 8 sq pots per lamp) cut that in 2/3 to try and match the 1000w with 800w in a 3.5x4 (14 sqft) space lets say all of them my way hits max (remember im lacking alot of stuff cause its a backyard setup so if i added c02, better aircooled 400w lights, and mylar instead of just flat white, my best was over 20g without the use of any of these) 80x18g= 1440g = 51.42Oz under 800w in about 2months i can harvest 2 times more in a years time by taking alot of time out of vegging and straight into flowering. Pros and consCONS) this way is alot of work cause u have 80-160 individual plants in individual pots so u have to make sure u dont miss any when u water i missed alot cause i was plain ol lazy and the next day they&#8217;re wilting so i know now which to water they take watering everyday especially towards the end, moving them around cause of constant growth i dropped at least one if not more a week had to move them around at least 3 times a week, getting enough clones to supply ur flowering room this came as a problem cause u have to constantly make clones so you need space for more mothers or a really big one. (PROS) THIS WAY WILL PRODUCE MORE BUD in a SMALLER SPACE in LESS TIME with LESS POWER. Just think about it a smaller plant means it needs less to survive and less light to flower cause theyre so small so it needs less to be a fully healthy plant and a fully healthy plant produces very good bud. Cutting down your time means you have more time to grow different stuff and another benfit of cutting time is the shorter it is less time that something can go wrong. I dont have any pics because we have a rule about having incriminating photos anywhere but if u dont believe try growing a few plants in a square 1.5 liter pot and see what numbers your making just 1-2 days veg and the rest flowering in the same pot also another test is take 2 clones put one in a small pot and on in a big pot and check the quality change if any. Ive tried alot of different supercropping from fiming, snapping branches, to LST with a hard flexible wire and placing each tip where i wanted it, they worked yea but even at that couldnt touch the yield i got in the same time as my little ones. You guys probably wont believe but try a few small one single cola and see how it goes thanks for reading


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## georgiagrower (Mar 1, 2011)

Look at this and tell me it has to be complicated to grow massive plants and produce over a lb of bud... This guy produced lbs per plant and used nothing more than nitrogen, water, and bloom. so its not that hard. and he didnt use no 10 gallon pot either. he had 7 - 8 ft trees. talk to this guy. you will learn alot. Plus he even used the EVIL miracle grow soil...hahahahaha!


(Thread) https://www.rollitup.org/outdoor-growing/24703-its-all-bullsh-t.html


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## georgiagrower (Mar 1, 2011)

All you need is organic soil, water, perlite, the sun, nitrogen, and bloom formula. id use all organic if i was you. And your ready to go, if you have good beans that is


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## medicine21 (Mar 1, 2011)

Dragon, I do agree that SOG is likely the best way to get the most yield out of a given area, as I am doing it right now.  You forget one BIG con to SOG. The plant numbers. Many of us work under some restriction whether to stay legal or keep the penalties lower. Everyone's case is different, but in some areas the difference between growing 50 plants and 200 is paying a fine or doing time.


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## jakester34 (Mar 1, 2011)

Hang your 1000 Watter on a tracked light mover and double up to 4X8'.


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## medicine21 (Mar 1, 2011)

Jozikins said:


> If you top them while they are small I bet you could get them all together in there, with 12 plants in a 4x4 space, 2.0-2.7 oz off each plant is much more realistic, especially since you haven't tried this before. However, I do know that in any flood and drain system, you can always put a mat at the bottom of the tray, and your cubes will grow into it. They sell coco mats, and giant wrapped rockwool slabs, but it allows your plants to continue growing, long after you thought it was too late to change anything about it. LST probably would be a fracking pain in the ass in rockwool cubes because you would need a counter tie for every bend you make. You can try the lost and forgotten art of super cropping: Squeeze and bend, squeeze and bend!


Yes, laying down that mat is indeed an option to expand the root zone from just the cube. I would lose plant mobility though and somehow the prospect of having that mat doesn't excite me. I see potential issue that I can't flush it in case of nute build up or other issues. RW cubes are tough to dial in as is, having a whole mat of RW.... well I just don't like the sound of it.



Jozikins said:


> When are you thinking about starting this? I think we should do a side-by-side with our preferred techniques. I would shit bricks if I could pull 4 pounds out of my 4x8 garden!!


I have to complete my last SOG (2 weeks) and then do some construction to split current room into a perpetual setup. I will start from seed this time, so it will take me a while to get the cycle running. I will hit you up when I do though. How much light do you have over your 4x8' anyway?

Speaking of media, anyone use higromite or diatomite? It sounds good on paper but all I could find in terms of grow journals was one guy loving it. He put a cuting into a rapid rooter and then right away into diatomite-filled net pots in a flood and drain. The plant just took off.


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## Wolverine97 (Mar 2, 2011)

671dragon said:


> what ive tried and proved that worked for me in trying to yielding the most out of a small space in the least amount of time is alot of little plants under 400w lights. My method would be putting about 40 of these small plants per 400w vegged for about a day or two in square 1.5 liter pots with a soiless mix then start flowering from there (never change pot from start to finish). The pots are placed side by side no space in between them but i would trim them to be single cola plants and make sure each cola grows straight up not leaning into the other plants space. I would also set it up as a perpetual grow space dividing flowering time between how many 400s usually by 3 or 4 harvesting every 2weeks to 2 weeks and 5 days also by alternating big and small rows of plants to improve air circulation and light penetration. My lamps are usually around 5-8 in above the tallest cola which usually isn&#8217;t more than 2 feet in height including pot height and younger plants are placed on pots one to double pot height to get the younger plants closer to the lights instead of moving the lights closer to it so all of the plants are pretty much mixed up in a orderly chaos of plants starting to flower next to ones just about to finish all pots are put in trays of 8 that perfectly fit the 8 and is thin enough to keep the pots right next to each other. Ive tried a few different strains this way and they always came out nicer looking buds then its bigger counter part. Doing it this way pending on strain would get you an average of 12-18g per plant. Ive grown a few that hit above 20g per very rare but it happend a few times. You would get some that weigh less about 8 grams was the lowest ive ever recorded but thats also rare if everything is healthy without bugs!!! (the few last batches i had got hit by stupid spider mites but they averaged around 8 grams some hit 12-14 but keep in mind this is when everything was sick with bugs and chopped early but still produced danky buds around 6 1/2 to 7 weeks. Also im all the way out on Guam so access to a hydroponic shop (for good organic pesticides or any other good types of bug killers so i was stuck with the bug with no way of getting rid of them and i tried ciggerates in water with hot pepper and all those homeade crap that didn&#8217;t do anything) or any place to get lighting equipment cause i dont want to use a credit card to purchase equipment in fear of BS coming to my door with it im using 400w HPS flood lights like the ones on top the buildings to light up the parking lot i took it apart and made me a homemade grow lamp. Its all backyard stuff i have a big c02 tank but no regulator so i dont use c02 in my rooms either and im attaining these numbers per plant. All in all it takes from start to finish mostly pending on flowering time of strain around 8 weeks (sometimes even 7 1/2 weeks) and 2 days (1-2 days for veg) to the max 9 weeks i dont take on sativas unless im gonna do a whole batch of em cause they usually gain about a foot over everything else and like i said we are going for most bud in the least amount of time. So everybody is saying 2 gallons with like 3-4 week veg time and flowering about 12 of em under a 1000w making about 2 3 maybe 4 Os per plant thats 4 at max in a 4x4 (16 sqft) space 12x4Oz= 48 Oz under a 1000w light in 3 months about max. My space is a 3.5x6 for 3 400w lamps (5 sq pots x 8 sq pots per lamp) cut that in 2/3 to try and match the 1000w with 800w in a 3.5x4 (14 sqft) space lets say all of them my way hits max (remember im lacking alot of stuff cause its a backyard setup so if i added c02, better aircooled 400w lights, and mylar instead of just flat white, my best was over 20g without the use of any of these) 80x18g= 1440g = 51.42Oz under 800w in about 2months i can harvest 2 times more in a years time by taking alot of time out of vegging and straight into flowering. Pros and consCONS) this way is alot of work cause u have 80-160 individual plants in individual pots so u have to make sure u dont miss any when u water i missed alot cause i was plain ol lazy and the next day they&#8217;re wilting so i know now which to water they take watering everyday especially towards the end, moving them around cause of constant growth i dropped at least one if not more a week had to move them around at least 3 times a week, getting enough clones to supply ur flowering room this came as a problem cause u have to constantly make clones so you need space for more mothers or a really big one. (PROS) THIS WAY WILL PRODUCE MORE BUD in a SMALLER SPACE in LESS TIME with LESS POWER. Just think about it a smaller plant means it needs less to survive and less light to flower cause theyre so small so it needs less to be a fully healthy plant and a fully healthy plant produces very good bud. Cutting down your time means you have more time to grow different stuff and another benfit of cutting time is the shorter it is less time that something can go wrong. I dont have any pics because we have a rule about having incriminating photos anywhere but if u dont believe try growing a few plants in a square 1.5 liter pot and see what numbers your making just 1-2 days veg and the rest flowering in the same pot also another test is take 2 clones put one in a small pot and on in a big pot and check the quality change if any. Ive tried alot of different supercropping from fiming, snapping branches, to LST with a hard flexible wire and placing each tip where i wanted it, they worked yea but even at that couldnt touch the yield i got in the same time as my little ones. You guys probably wont believe but try a few small one single cola and see how it goes thanks for reading


Holy shit man, breathe...
I'm not reading all of _that_. Paragraph breaks are your friend, man.


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## 671dragon (Mar 2, 2011)

sorry was really gone while i was typing and i wanted to get everything out so now that i look at it it was a bit much but hey at least it was detailed


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## 671dragon (Mar 2, 2011)

medicine21 said:


> Dragon, I do agree that SOG is likely the best way to get the most yield out of a given area, as I am doing it right now.  You forget one BIG con to SOG. The plant numbers. Many of us work under some restriction whether to stay legal or keep the penalties lower. Everyone's case is different, but in some areas the difference between growing 50 plants and 200 is paying a fine or doing time.


Right on but i was just wanting a lil feed back on if this would be the best way if there was no restrictions as i am a rebel and dont care to be restricted cause i live out on Guam and there is no prop 15 here so its a penalty either way and im just trying to see if there is another method that would best what i have suggested or any way i can tweek it other than buying stuff i wont get cause its to much of a problem. And if anybody knows how to get stuff through the mail cause out here a oz can run you 1000$ and its not even as good as stuff that ive seen go for 300$ out there and it can as bad as 20$ for 0.15g so thats basically 3,733$ a oz so if anybody wants to make alot of money Guam is the spot


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## 671dragon (Mar 2, 2011)

Wolverine97 said:


> Holy shit man, breathe...
> I'm not reading all of _that_. Paragraph breaks are your friend, man.


Its not that bad it only take about 5 min to read but sorry basically i was saying that i can do alot more with less power less time and less space than you the way im doing it then the way your doing it. Just thought you would like to know in detail how so u can learn cause your making about 100 oz less a year with more power and more space


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## Wolverine97 (Mar 2, 2011)

671dragon said:


> Its not that bad it only take about 5 min to read but sorry basically i was saying that i can do alot more with less power less time and less space than you the way im doing it then the way your doing it. Just thought you would like to know in detail how so u can learn cause your making about 100 oz less a year with more power and more space


No, there's not a lot I can do to better my yield at this point, I've been tweaking and fine tuning for years to get to this point. I'm in a medical state and have plant limits to contend with, and I would like to stay legal. And your light setup doesn't work for my space anyway.


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## dlively11 (Mar 2, 2011)

I used to get 3 to 3.5 OZ off plants I had in soil 2 gal buckets vegged to one foot. Ended up aroun 30 inches tall. Now I do higher numbers smaller yield per plant in hydro . If you are in hydro you wont need over a one gal container, veg to about a foot and let them grow.


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## Jozikins (Mar 3, 2011)

671dragon said:


> what ive tried and proved that worked for me in trying to yielding the most out of a small space in the least amount of time is alot of little plants under 400w lights. My method would be putting about 40 of these small plants per 400w vegged for about a day or two in square 1.5 liter pots with a soiless mix then start flowering from there (never change pot from start to finish). The pots are placed side by side no space in between them but i would trim them to be single cola plants and make sure each cola grows straight up not leaning into the other plants space. I would also set it up as a perpetual grow space dividing flowering time between how many 400s usually by 3 or 4 harvesting every 2weeks to 2 weeks and 5 days also by alternating big and small rows of plants to improve air circulation and light penetration. My lamps are usually around 5-8 in above the tallest cola which usually isn&#8217;t more than 2 feet in height including pot height and younger plants are placed on pots one to double pot height to get the younger plants closer to the lights instead of moving the lights closer to it so all of the plants are pretty much mixed up in a orderly chaos of plants starting to flower next to ones just about to finish all pots are put in trays of 8 that perfectly fit the 8 and is thin enough to keep the pots right next to each other. Ive tried a few different strains this way and they always came out nicer looking buds then its bigger counter part. Doing it this way pending on strain would get you an average of 12-18g per plant. Ive grown a few that hit above 20g per very rare but it happend a few times. You would get some that weigh less about 8 grams was the lowest ive ever recorded but thats also rare if everything is healthy without bugs!!! (the few last batches i had got hit by stupid spider mites but they averaged around 8 grams some hit 12-14 but keep in mind this is when everything was sick with bugs and chopped early but still produced danky buds around 6 1/2 to 7 weeks. Also im all the way out on Guam so access to a hydroponic shop (for good organic pesticides or any other good types of bug killers so i was stuck with the bug with no way of getting rid of them and i tried ciggerates in water with hot pepper and all those homeade crap that didn&#8217;t do anything) or any place to get lighting equipment cause i dont want to use a credit card to purchase equipment in fear of BS coming to my door with it im using 400w HPS flood lights like the ones on top the buildings to light up the parking lot i took it apart and made me a homemade grow lamp. Its all backyard stuff i have a big c02 tank but no regulator so i dont use c02 in my rooms either and im attaining these numbers per plant. All in all it takes from start to finish mostly pending on flowering time of strain around 8 weeks (sometimes even 7 1/2 weeks) and 2 days (1-2 days for veg) to the max 9 weeks i dont take on sativas unless im gonna do a whole batch of em cause they usually gain about a foot over everything else and like i said we are going for most bud in the least amount of time. So everybody is saying 2 gallons with like 3-4 week veg time and flowering about 12 of em under a 1000w making about 2 3 maybe 4 Os per plant thats 4 at max in a 4x4 (16 sqft) space 12x4Oz= 48 Oz under a 1000w light in 3 months about max. My space is a 3.5x6 for 3 400w lamps (5 sq pots x 8 sq pots per lamp) cut that in 2/3 to try and match the 1000w with 800w in a 3.5x4 (14 sqft) space lets say all of them my way hits max (remember im lacking alot of stuff cause its a backyard setup so if i added c02, better aircooled 400w lights, and mylar instead of just flat white, my best was over 20g without the use of any of these) 80x18g= 1440g = 51.42Oz under 800w in about 2months i can harvest 2 times more in a years time by taking alot of time out of vegging and straight into flowering. Pros and consCONS) this way is alot of work cause u have 80-160 individual plants in individual pots so u have to make sure u dont miss any when u water i missed alot cause i was plain ol lazy and the next day they&#8217;re wilting so i know now which to water they take watering everyday especially towards the end, moving them around cause of constant growth i dropped at least one if not more a week had to move them around at least 3 times a week, getting enough clones to supply ur flowering room this came as a problem cause u have to constantly make clones so you need space for more mothers or a really big one. (PROS) THIS WAY WILL PRODUCE MORE BUD in a SMALLER SPACE in LESS TIME with LESS POWER. Just think about it a smaller plant means it needs less to survive and less light to flower cause theyre so small so it needs less to be a fully healthy plant and a fully healthy plant produces very good bud. Cutting down your time means you have more time to grow different stuff and another benfit of cutting time is the shorter it is less time that something can go wrong. I dont have any pics because we have a rule about having incriminating photos anywhere but if u dont believe try growing a few plants in a square 1.5 liter pot and see what numbers your making just 1-2 days veg and the rest flowering in the same pot also another test is take 2 clones put one in a small pot and on in a big pot and check the quality change if any. Ive tried alot of different supercropping from fiming, snapping branches, to LST with a hard flexible wire and placing each tip where i wanted it, they worked yea but even at that couldnt touch the yield i got in the same time as my little ones. You guys probably wont believe but try a few small one single cola and see how it goes thanks for reading


Say what now? I read as far as flowering in 1.5 L pots and I, in all honesty, sobbed the rest. What do your buds look like? I rather crop a half pound of solid danks, than 2 pounds of chronic. And if it ain't chronic you better post some pics for me to shit my pants over, lol.


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## penguinking (Mar 6, 2011)

bigger, healthier root zone means higher yields. I have a buddy that pulls 1 lb off of one plant under a 600 hps. he puts his girls in 25 gallon totes and uses regular topping techniques


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## 0blivious (Jun 27, 2011)

Hi There

Just thought I'd give you my two cents on this one.

Just finished my first grow and I ended up with a little ove 3.5oz dry weight from a 20L DWC Bubble Bucket, basic nutrients and 2 x 300watt equivilant cfl's, the root mass filled the damn bucket by the end and she drank about 3 litres of water a day in the last 2 weeks!

I've just bought a 400w HPS, 400w Metal Halide, 1m x 1m x 1.8m tent, extractor / filter etc for the next one so I'm hoping that I'll be getting around 5oz per plant with the extra available light (and the range of advanced nutrients i've bought!!)

4oz from 1 plant doesnt seem like it'll be all that hard to be honest if you give the plant everything it needs and the environment is right


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## 0011StealTH (Jun 27, 2011)

webb107 said:


> I did 1 wappa plant under a 600w hps light in a 5gal pot with organic nutes with molasses and got 175g dry


nice....


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## randomseed (Jun 28, 2011)

Almost full organic month veg averaging 3+ per depending on strain (3+ is total average, some strains are hard to get past 2.5)
Pushing for 4 is proving tough without C02 but we get there sometimes. Only on the big yeild strains though. Finishing at 3-4 feet.


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## randomseed (Jun 28, 2011)

671dragon said:


> Right on but i was just wanting a lil feed back on if this would be the best way if there was no restrictions as i am a rebel and dont care to be restricted cause i live out on Guam and there is no prop 15 here so its a penalty either way and im just trying to see if there is another method that would best what i have suggested or any way i can tweek it other than buying stuff i wont get cause its to much of a problem. And if anybody knows how to get stuff through the mail cause out here a oz can run you 1000$ and its not even as good as stuff that ive seen go for 300$ out there and it can as bad as 20$ for 0.15g so thats basically 3,733$ a oz so if anybody wants to make alot of money Guam is the spot


Where the shit do you live, lbs of medi are cheaper then that around here.

Oh duh, Guam.
isnt it a death penalty to get caught?


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