# 3 1000W or 5 600W?



## legaleyes13 (Oct 4, 2012)

Over a 12 x 4 table. Its a closed room and the way each light is lined up, they're gonna need individual ventilation hookups which is kind of a pain in the ass. Either way I get good coverage, but I'm thinking that 5 600Ws would give me great coverage. I would be able to keep each light much less than 1' apart, but that means 2 more vent fans that I need to buy.


What do you guys think. Will 3 1000Ws give me just as good a coverage over the same space, or will 5 600Ws be slightly better or worse. Thanks in advance.


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## stumpjumper (Oct 4, 2012)

I think I would go with the 3-1k's. I don't see why each light would need it's own fan though. I'm sure you can figure out how to snake some ducting around..


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## legaleyes13 (Oct 4, 2012)

Thanks for the quick response stump, I appreciate it. I wanted to stay away from snaking the ducting because I figured heat would get trapped in there somehow, keeping it from being vented properly. If you think otherwise, I'm all ears and I'm eager to be convinced that I'm wrong as it would save me some cash...

But could you elaborate on why you would go with 3 1000Ws? Thanks again.


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## cannabineer (Oct 4, 2012)

Why not 3x600? It depends on what matters to you more: brute yield, or yield per kWh. If the latter, 3x600 should be near the optimum for that footprint. Jmo. 

Or 2x1000 on a light rail. Max performance. cn


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## superstoner1 (Oct 4, 2012)

3 1k's will be a perfect pattern for that size. i run 3 1ks in a 8x4-1/2 canopy and use a single vortex 6" fan for all three.


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## legaleyes13 (Oct 4, 2012)

cannabineer said:


> Why not 3x600? It depends on what matters to you more: brute yield, or yield per kWh. If the latter, 3x600 should be near the optimum for that footprint. Jmo.
> 
> Or 2x1000 on a light rail. Max performance. cn


Definitely going for brute yield.



superstoner1 said:


> 3 1k's will be a perfect pattern for that size. i run 3 1ks in a 8x4-1/2 canopy and use a single vortex 6" fan for all three.


Thanks on the vortex advice, but why do you say that 3 1ks would be perfect for a 12x4 table, then go on to say that you use 3 1ks on a 8x4-1/2 space. I don't quite follow.


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## danknugg (Oct 4, 2012)

id go with 600s but thats just me, it will look cooler with more lights plus you can put a metal halide in one for a mixed spectrum


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## frankfast (Oct 5, 2012)

danknugg said:


> id go with 600s but thats just me, it will look cooler with more lights plus you can put a metal halide in one for a mixed spectrum


sorry but that just sounds dumb "it will look cooler"

3 1k's would be awsome in that area and if you can swing it get dimmable ballast


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## bowlfullofbliss (Oct 5, 2012)

I run 3 1000's over a 5x12 area, roughly. I really wish I had 6 6000's instead, so I can be a bit wider with better coverage on the sides. My hoods are the xxxl's, which are junk.


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## obrienross1123 (Oct 5, 2012)

dude honestly more watts=more bud plain and simple and 600s are the most efficient energy consumption to lumen output plus it will be better coverage


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## IndicaDom (Oct 5, 2012)

I wouldn't buy that many lights, you are talking about a 12 foot table. Break that into two 6 foot sections, buy 2/1000W bulbs and throw them on light movers. A 1000W HPS' footprint is 5'x5'. Now if you have a 12x4 table it should easily be able to cover the width of that table. The interesting thing is with light movers and the footprint of (1)1000W HPS, at any given time only 1 foot on each section is going to be unlit. Plus that means you only have to move the light across a 1 foot linear path. This is the most efficient way to light the table and to save the most money. I mean seriously, (6) 600W ballasts? Fuck that, I guarantee the exact same yield from 2/1000W HPS on light movers covering that table. Why use so much electricity? An even better idea is to have two rooms with two 12x4 tables, buy 2/1000W HPS ballasts, buy a flip-flop relay and run both rooms on 12/12 all the time. Now you are running your ballasts 24 hours a day, lighting 2 rooms with 2, 12x4 tables. That is efficiency my friend.


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## supchaka (Oct 5, 2012)

I'll say 4 600's just to throw something different in there.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 5, 2012)

So no rhyme or reason, 4 600's just cause?


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## cannabineer (Oct 5, 2012)

bowlfullofbliss said:


> I run 3 1000's over a 5x12 area, roughly. I really wish I had 6 6000's instead, so I can be a bit wider with better coverage on the sides. My hoods are the xxxl's, which are junk.


Which hoods are better iyo? cn


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## Dookz (Oct 5, 2012)

this a debate of the century, but i say more lumens more buds and yeilds i choose 1k's


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## laced23z (Oct 5, 2012)

You should go with the six 600 watters you get more coverage and fuck a light rail that shit is Jank when u can just put a light over it all the time instead of having a lite over it partially of the time


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## legaleyes13 (Oct 5, 2012)

cannabineer said:


> Which hoods are better iyo? cn


Yes. I am also eager to hear which hoods you think are better. I already have a couple of XXXLs and I like them better than the regular hydrofarms.


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## legaleyes13 (Oct 5, 2012)

laced23z said:


> You should go with the six 600 watters you get more coverage and fuck a light rail that shit is Jank when u can just put a light over it all the time instead of having a lite over it partially of the time


Yeah, I hear you. I don't believe in that light mover stuff really. I don't buy the coverage claims of the light companies either. It's clear as day to see that those coverage claims are a little off. Anything not directly under the light greatly under performs. That's why I was asking really. I've never used 1000Ws before, and don't have any idea just how powerful they are.


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## legaleyes13 (Oct 5, 2012)

laced23z said:


> You should go with the six 600 watters you get more coverage and fuck a light rail that shit is Jank when u can just put a light over it all the time instead of having a lite over it partially of the time


Yeah, I hear you. I don't believe in that light mover stuff really. I don't buy the coverage claims of the light companies either. It's clear as day to see that those coverage claims are a little off. Anything not directly under the light greatly under performs. That's why I was asking really. I've never used 1000Ws before, and don't have any idea just how powerful they are.

But still, I'm completely open to hear someone convince me that 1000Ws are the way to go, because I just don't know much about how they perform.


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## legaleyes13 (Oct 5, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> I wouldn't buy that many lights, you are talking about a 12 foot table. Break that into two 6 foot sections, buy 2/1000W bulbs and throw them on light movers. A 1000W HPS' footprint is 5'x5'. Now if you have a 12x4 table it should easily be able to cover the width of that table. The interesting thing is with light movers and the footprint of (1)1000W HPS, at any given time only 1 foot on each section is going to be unlit. Plus that means you only have to move the light across a 1 foot linear path. This is the most efficient way to light the table and to save the most money. I mean seriously, (6) 600W ballasts? Fuck that, I guarantee the exact same yield from 2/1000W HPS on light movers covering that table. Why use so much electricity? An even better idea is to have two rooms with two 12x4 tables, buy 2/1000W HPS ballasts, buy a flip-flop relay and run both rooms on 12/12 all the time. Now you are running your ballasts 24 hours a day, lighting 2 rooms with 2, 12x4 tables. That is efficiency my friend.


I'll likely pass on the light movers, but your relay idea is intriguing. Thanks.


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## frankfast (Oct 5, 2012)

legaleyes13 said:


> Yeah, I hear you. I don't believe in that light mover stuff really. I don't buy the coverage claims of the light companies either. It's clear as day to see that those coverage claims are a little off. Anything not directly under the light greatly under performs. That's why I was asking really. I've never used 1000Ws before, and don't have any idea just how powerful they are.


the bud density of 1000's will make your mouth water

go for the 3 1000's im running 2 of them in a 8x4 area and loveing it huge change out from 600 watters in the density of the buds


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## Sencha (Oct 5, 2012)

You said sealed room, so I assume AC. 2-1000 watt hortilux bulbs with lumatek ballasts in large adjusta wings reflectors will work great. No need for more than two lights or a light mover. I know it's pushing it but I'd challenge you to find a dead spot of light.


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## legaleyes13 (Oct 5, 2012)

Sencha said:


> You said sealed room, so I assume AC. 2-1000 watt hortilux bulbs with lumatek ballasts in large adjusta wings reflectors will work great. No need for more than two lights or a light mover. I know it's pushing it but I'd challenge you to find a dead spot of light.


I'm trying to avoid using an AC at all cost. I think if I vent the lights, get a good dehumidifier and strategically place my fans, I can keep things under 90 degrees. Why do you say adjusta wings? Have you had experience with anything else?


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## laced23z (Oct 6, 2012)

U will find dead spots only using two 1000 watters I guarantee you and the dinstity of the bud is the same for a 600 as a 1000 saying there is diff is straight newbish and I take it you haven't done many diff grows using diff light wattages just my take on ur knowledge just cause there is light on the plant doesn't mean that that light will make the plant produce like u want it to it's about intensity and more coverage area will give you better intensity


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## frankfast (Oct 6, 2012)

laced23z said:


> U will find dead spots only using two 1000 watters I guarantee you and the dinstity of the bud is the same for a 600 as a 1000 saying there is diff is straight newbish and I take it you haven't done many diff grows using diff light wattages just my take on ur knowledge just cause there is light on the plant doesn't mean that that light will make the plant produce like u want it to it's about intensity and more coverage area will give you better intensity


I may be "newbish" but you can't read or understand what you are even righting

never said he should use 2-1000w for his area i said im useing 2=1000w for my area, i said he should use 3-1000watters

" You say " it's about intensity" 1000Watts is WAY more Intense Compared to a 600 watt


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## laced23z (Oct 6, 2012)

frankfast said:


> I may be "newbish" but you can't read or understand what you are even righting
> 
> never said he should use 2-1000w for his area i said im useing 2=1000w for my area, i said he should use 3-1000watters
> 
> " You say " it's about intensity" 1000Watts is WAY more Intense Compared to a 600 watt


Not compared to 2 600 watters it's not u just keep growin the way u do yo and be happy and worry about how I write


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## IndicaDom (Oct 6, 2012)

laced23z said:


> You should go with the six 600 watters you get more coverage and fuck a light rail that shit is Jank when u can just put a light over it all the time instead of having a lite over it partially of the time


Do I need to do the math for you (2)1000W HPS versus (6)600W? Let us say you pay 10 cents per kilowatt hour, and you are running these lights on a simple 12/12 schedule everyday for a year.

(2)1000W = 2kw per hour
(6)600W = 3.6kw per hour

365 days x 12 hours per day = 4,380 hours total

Now that we have the total hours, we can calculate the cost of each individual setup.

(2)1000W; 4,380 hours x 2kw per hour x .10 cents per kw = $876 per year to constantly run (2)1000W HPS bulbs 12 hours a day all year.
(6)600W; 4,380 hours x 3.6kw per hour x .10 cents per kw = $1,576.8 per year to constantly run (6)1000W HPS bulbs 12 hours a day all year.

Now since you are going to be growing over the exact same area, a 12'x4' table, why on earth would you run so much light, do you honestly believe that you are going to be able to yield such a substantial amount of marijuana in comparison to someone running 2 1000W? Do you believe you will make up for the amount of electricity used? I didn't even account for keeping temperatures cool and how much easier it is to run ducting to two lights as opposed to six lights.

If a 600W covers a 4'x4' area and a 1000W covers a 5'x5' area, and you are running a 12'x4' table which is a total of 48 square feet. Now since 1000W covers 25 square feet, and two cover 50 square feet, why on earth would you go with 6 600W that would give you a total of 16x6= 96 square feet. You are wasting light, and wasting money, and efficient growing is how we are going to save the planet.



legaleyes13 said:


> Yeah, I hear you. I don't believe in that light mover stuff really. I don't buy the coverage claims of the light companies either. It's clear as day to see that those coverage claims are a little off. Anything not directly under the light greatly under performs. That's why I was asking really. I've never used 1000Ws before, and don't have any idea just how powerful they are.


Don't believe in that "light mover stuff"? Tell me, do plants in nature get sunlight from one direction? Also on top of that, do you honestly believe that any plant not receiving direct sunlight "under performs"? If that was a reality then nothing would grow in the shade, all fan leaves under the canopy would immediately die and there would be no lower buds on the branches. Which clearly isn't true, so just because you have a bud 10" from the bulb and another bud 18" from the bulb you're trying to tell me that you could discern once dried and cured between those two top colas? No, you can't.



legaleyes13 said:


> I'll likely pass on the light movers, but your relay idea is intriguing. Thanks.


Its more than intriguing, it is the most efficient way to grow.



Sencha said:


> You said sealed room, so I assume AC. 2-1000 watt hortilux bulbs with lumatek ballasts in large adjusta wings reflectors will work great. No need for more than two lights or a light mover. I know it's pushing it but I'd challenge you to find a dead spot of light.


A light mover would cover the discrepancy of the 1 foot not being covered by the 5'x5' footprint of the bulbs. Also what do you mean by "dead spot", no light? Not going to happen, but take a meter for measuring light intensity and you will see towards the edges how much the intensity will drop off.


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## cannabineer (Oct 6, 2012)

In many locales, the math is worsened by the progressive electric rate scale. The extra wattage all comes out of the marginal (highest) rate. cn


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## MonsterBuzz (Oct 6, 2012)

there is a few posts in the thread that i think could use a little addressing in case someone who dont know much starts to read this.

But to the op first. your 4x12 table is 48sqft. if you go by the "the cannabis grow bible" (a good read for starters) you should start with 50w per sqft. making it a min. of 2400w that you need. yes more is better, so the comment tossed out about 4-600's would work but i am a firm believer in light rails. one reason is it will cost less to get a good light mover than it would be to buy a hood,light and ballast. your power consumption is decreased plus less need for the a/c and you can set it up to get an even better light pattern thus negating a need for an extra light. google agramover its the one i prefer. and the best part of all with a light mover, you could get your 1k's much closer to your plants and not burn them!! 

now i agree with IndicaDom and he makes some solid points. i would note that 2-1k's and a light mover is spot on and ill tell ya why. 
its proven that 1'ks can reach lower branches better than a 600w can. now that fact is ruined when your 1k's sit on top of your plants thus meaning you have to move them up so you dont burn the top of your plant. and the reason for the 1k's getting to lower branches is because of the inverse square law which is (intensity=light output/distance²).

but when your moving the lights the plants will have time to recover from the momentary stress from having the 1k's closer thus making the light able to hit your lower branches and allowing more flowering.

i will point out that 600's are more efficient than the 1k's by about 7%. but once again that is also a mute point when moving your lights and considering all other factors.

good luck with whatever you chose to do. 

btw i am not a master grower, never will be as i am always looking for a better way to grow and learn about growing. so if someone wants to pick my post apart thats cool.


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## a mongo frog (Oct 6, 2012)

light movers in flower? no thanks......


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 6, 2012)

legaleyes13 said:


> I'm trying to avoid using an AC at all cost. I think if I vent the lights, get a good dehumidifier and strategically place my fans, I can keep things under 90 degrees. Why do you say adjusta wings? Have you had experience with anything else?


3000w and no AC? Good luck keeping it under 90. I'm running 2600w of air cooled hoods and if I wasn't running AC in my sealed room it would rain in there all the time and be 120. Trust me I Tryed it. Well placed fans don't cool the air just move the heat around. Unless you deside to water cool the room that's a diffent story. But take my advice. Even in freezing temps with less light same area I need AC. So have a plan to install something after you try your first idea. And I'm not being a smart ass. Just stating I wasn't able to pull it off any way I Tryed.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 6, 2012)

Nothing wrong with movers. You just don't want to go crazy with the move ment. If you keep your lights over lapping and moving under 3 feet and reflective mat on the walls it's good.


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## a mongo frog (Oct 6, 2012)

light mover or another light? pretty easy quess. 
light movers r great in veg, leave them there. buy another light.
oh wait!! but the heat? get a fucking a/c for christ sake.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 6, 2012)

MonsterBuzz said:


> there is a few posts in the thread that i think could use a little addressing in case someone who dont know much starts to read this.
> 
> But to the op first. your 4x12 table is 48sqft. if you go by the "the cannabis grow bible" (a good read for starters) you should start with 50w per sqft. making it a min. of 2400w that you need. yes more is better, so the comment tossed out about 4-600's would work but i am a firm believer in light rails. one reason is it will cost less to get a good light mover than it would be to buy a hood,light and ballast. your power consumption is decreased plus less need for the a/c and you can set it up to get an even better light pattern thus negating a need for an extra light. google agramover its the one i prefer. and the best part of all with a light mover, you could get your 1k's much closer to your plants and not burn them!!
> 
> ...


I am on board with you, light movers are too awesome. I also am in pursuit of the most efficient and scientific way to grow, so I always want to see side by side grows, etc.




a mongo frog said:


> light movers in flower? no thanks......


Lol you see, some dogs can't learn new tricks. 



a mongo frog said:


> light mover or another light? pretty easy quess.
> light movers r great in veg, leave them there. buy another light.
> oh wait!! but the heat? get a fucking a/c for christ sake.


With the amount of electricity you are using, I would triple the yield you pull. You are an inefficient grower and the worse part about it? You're proud.


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## a mongo frog (Oct 6, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> I am on board with you, light movers are too awesome. I also am in pursuit of the most efficient and scientific way to grow, so I always want to see side by side grows, etc.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


what electricity am i using? u would tripple my yield? show me.
pics or your just a dumb fuck, running your mouth, insulting me cuz u dont have shit.


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## The New Jim Jones (Oct 6, 2012)

if your a good grower who gets a gram per watt, 5 600's is better, 3.6kw or 3.6kg, while the 3 1000's is 3kw or 3kg


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## IndicaDom (Oct 6, 2012)

a mongo frog said:


> *what electricity am i using?* u would tripple my yield? show me.
> pics or your just a dumb fuck, running your mouth, insulting me cuz u dont have shit.





a mongo frog said:


> light mover or another light? pretty easy quess.
> light movers r great in veg, leave them there. *buy another light.
> oh wait!! but the heat? get a fucking a/c for christ sake.*


"Pics or your just a dumb fuck" really, is that the ultimatum you're giving me? Oh noes, I better provide evidence or some guy who can barely keep his spelling in check might have a lower opinion of me! It is clear you are an inefficient grower by saying that buying another light and an additional A/C system to run that said light is just ridiculous. Then you go on to bash light movers, lol, I mean come on, you are just asking to be labeled as ignorant.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 6, 2012)

The New Jim Jones said:


> if your a good grower who gets a gram per watt, 5 600's is better, 3.6kw or 3.6kg, while the 3 1000's is 3kw or 3kg


Cooling 5 600's versus cooling 3 1000's, that is the reason your numbers don't work out when you start calculating costs of electricity.


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## GrnMn (Oct 6, 2012)

legaleyes13 said:


> Over a 12 x 4 table. Its a closed room and the way each light is lined up, they're gonna need individual ventilation hookups which is kind of a pain in the ass. Either way I get good coverage, but I'm thinking that 5 600Ws would give me great coverage. I would be able to keep each light much less than 1' apart, but that means 2 more vent fans that I need to buy.
> 
> 
> What do you guys think. Will 3 1000Ws give me just as good a coverage over the same space, or will 5 600Ws be slightly better or worse. Thanks in advance.


nothing beats the almighty 1k's. go with the 1000w. you won't be sorry.


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## legaleyes13 (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> 3000w and no AC? Good luck keeping it under 90. I'm running 2600w of air cooled hoods and if I wasn't running AC in my sealed room it would rain in there all the time and be 120. Trust me I Tryed it. Well placed fans don't cool the air just move the heat around. Unless you deside to water cool the room that's a diffent story. But take my advice. Even in freezing temps with less light same area I need AC. So have a plan to install something after you try your first idea. And I'm not being a smart ass. Just stating I wasn't able to pull it off any way I Tryed.



I was afraid of this. I'd rather search the ends of the earth for a way to keep things under 90 degrees while avoiding the use of an A/C, then actually having to use one. But unfortunately, it looks like that may not be possible. That amount of wattage would really effect my peace of mind, but if it has to be done, then it has to be done.

If any of you can enlighten me with some other solution, then please do so... Thanks


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

legaleyes13 said:


> I was afraid of this. I'd rather search the ends of the earth for a way to keep things under 90 degrees while avoiding the use of an A/C, then actually having to use one. But unfortunately, it looks like that may not be possible. That amount of wattage would really effect my peace of mind, but if it has to be done, then it has to be done.
> 
> If any of you can enlighten me with some other solution, then please do so... Thanks


Everyone runs A/C and ventilation when you're using the larger wattage HPS bulbs.


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## grower100 (Oct 7, 2012)

5 x 600 watts will be a better bet. You will only need all 5 running.. 6-8 weeks before floering as the plants need to grow to accommodate the light.

So only use what you need to use when you need to use it. Keep them a maximum 70-80cm away from the top of the plant.. Sounds like you need a 10 inch extractor.. 1 will do with a good filter..

Good luck and dont tell no one!


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

grower100 said:


> 5 x 600 watts will be a better bet. You will only need all 5 running.. 6-8 weeks before floering as the plants need to grow to accommodate the light.
> 
> So only use what you need to use when you need to use it. Keep them a maximum 70-80cm away from the top of the plant.. Sounds like you need a 10 inch extractor.. 1 will do with a good filter..
> 
> Good luck and dont tell no one!


You are wrong, 5 x 600W is not the better bet, this has been discussed in length in this thread, please read it.


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## legaleyes13 (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Everyone runs A/C and ventilation when you're using the larger wattage HPS bulbs.


Maybe. I've never done one without an AC either, but was hoping this time I could avoid it, as I've never done a grow with vented lights either, and don't know how effective they are. I could always use an ice box heat exchanger, but that is also more trouble than I'm currently willing to deal with. I'll have to weigh my options I guess.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

To tell you the truth if you have the power to run 3000w of lights and everything eles needed for a grow room that size a AC won't change your bill to much. Mine dosnt run 24/7 it's on a temp switch keeping it at 80. Took out 1 600 and added T5's for veg and my bill went down. And that was after adding a larger dehumidifier and more fans. I don't understand why you are so bent on not useing a AC to cool the room. There are tons of ways to hide them. And you don't need the expensive stand up units from the hydro stores. A cheep window one is what I use. And I can tell you how to create a hot room for it so you don't have to have it in a window. But anything used to cool a room will make heat. So if not vented right it's counter productive and waste of money.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> To tell you the truth if you have the power to run 3000w of lights and everything eles needed for a grow room that size a AC won't change your bill to much. Mine dosnt run 24/7 it's on a temp switch keeping it at 80. Took out 1 600 and added T5's for veg and my bill went down. And that was after adding a larger dehumidifier and more fans. I don't understand why you are so bent on not useing a AC to cool the room. There are tons of ways to hide them. And you don't need the expensive stand up units from the hydro stores. A cheep window one is what I use. And I can tell you how to create a hot room for it so you don't have to have it in a window. But anything used to cool a room will make heat. So if not vented right it's counter productive and waste of money.


Exactly, if HVAC trained people still make horrible decisions when running ducting and picking A/C tonnage, I can only imagine the complete lack of efficiency in the ventilation of all growers. Getting your ventilation in order will immediately cut all temperatures, and you might end up running your A/C even less than you did before.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> You are wrong, 5 x 600W is not the better bet, this has been discussed in length in this thread, please read it.


And most of those points are misinformed. I like the 5-600 better. Like grower100 said you can use what you need. Saving power and money. When plants are small use 1 600 to veg. Then go to 2. Then 3 and so on till all 5 are needed. It still gives you the same 3000w in flower. But less in veg when 3000w is to much. And alot of the info on the lights was given in lumens and that realy has nothing to do with plants. Plants don't use lumens. We see different lumens. Plants use the PAR from the lights. So as long as the bulbs are within proper spectrum plants are getting the PAR they need. Only draw back to 600 over 1000 is light penetration of the canopy. Even that's not that bog of a deal if plants are trained right.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Exactly, if HVAC trained people still make horrible decisions when running ducting and picking A/C tonnage, I can only imagine the complete lack of efficiency in the ventilation of all growers. Getting your ventilation in order will immediately cut all temperatures, and you might end up running your A/C even less than you did before.


Yup I Tryed many different ways of running duct. After 5 tryes I found one that works. And sence my light duct is fully sealed from room I run the heat into my house duct in winter and it keeps my house warm. Not making me run the heater. Another power saver.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> And most of those points are misinformed. I like the 5-600 better. Like grower100 said you can use what you need. Saving power and money. When plants are small use 1 600 to veg. Then go to 2. Then 3 and so on till all 5 are needed. It still gives you the same 3000w in flower. But less in veg when 3000w is to much. And alot of the info on the lights was given in lumens and that realy has nothing to do with plants. Plants don't use lumens. We see different lumens. Plants use the PAR from the lights. So as long as the bulbs are within proper spectrum plants are getting the PAR they need. Only draw back to 600 over 1000 is light penetration of the canopy. Even that's not that bog of a deal if plants are trained right.


You like 5/600W better, it really isn't relevant what you "like", we are talking about the cost of growing versus the return. The numbers were already run and 2/1000W HPS bulbs on light movers is the most efficient way to run those tables. I am not sure why you even brought up lumens, and started trying to talk about PAR, irrelevant. So you are suggesting having to put up and take down lights over and over and over, each grow? Does that sound very efficient to you? While I am sitting on my two flowering rooms with a 12'x4' table in each room, flip-flop relay, light movers, and I am only running two ballasts, and 4 hoods, and if you wanted to reproduce what I am producing you would need to run what, 10/600W lights, 10 hoods, ducting, how much to cool all those lights? When you start scaling the grow up it is easy to realize how inefficient running 5/600W bulbs is...

I mean seriously at the end of the grow you are running 3.2kW and I am still running 2kW consistently day in and day out, with my 1000W being closer than you can put your 600W to your plants, and I would argue that I would of course yield better because I was running 2kW in veg, and you were only running 600W.


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 7, 2012)

The New Jim Jones said:


> if your a good grower who gets a gram per watt, 5 600's is better, 3.6kw or 3.6kg, while the 3 1000's is 3kw or 3kg


lol 5 x 600 is 3600? I think it's 3000............
So If you are using the same amount of power I'd go with the 600's they give a more efficient lumen per watt ratio


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

When did I say taking down and putting up lights? Just leave them up and only turn on the ones needed at the given time. And your saying your 2 1000w would do better then 5 600w? I'm going to say what many others have said on this and other threads. Prove it. And I bright up PAR and lumens becouse that is how you judge lights effectiveness. Lumens we see and measure. PAR is what plants need. So if you think for one second that proper information isnt relevant and the only thing that is, is light coverage you have no idea what you are talking about.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> When did I say taking down and putting up lights? Just leave them up and only turn on the ones needed at the given time. And your saying your 2 1000w would do better then 5 600w? I'm going to say what many others have said on this and other threads. Prove it. And I bright up PAR and lumens becouse that is how you judge lights effectiveness. Lumens we see and measure. PAR is what plants need. So if you think for one second that proper information isnt relevant and the only thing that is, is light coverage you have no idea what you are talking about.


All you are looking at is 5/600W versus 2/1000W. You already said you are only running 1/600W in veg, that alone would allow me to get bigger plants than you faster, period. Oh and the fact that I am using light movers so my 1000W is either closer than your 600W or the same distance from the plant, which means better light penetration. So while I am running 2kW throughout veg and flowering at a closer distance than your 600W, you are going to what, run a 1/600W for veg, and then throw a few more on throughout your flowering? Lol, and you think you're going to out yield me?

Prove it? Sure, you build your two 12'x4' tables with 5/600W lights and I'll get my two 12'x4' tables with 2/1000W on light movers and we'll compare cost versus return. I guarantee you will be using more electricity, more money, and more time to maintain your room versus mine. Shit we'll even log hours in the grow room per week to see how much you have to maintain your room versus myself.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> All you are looking at is 5/600W versus 2/1000W. You already said you are only running 1/600W in veg, that alone would allow me to get bigger plants than you faster, period. Oh and the fact that I am using light movers so my 1000W is either closer than your 600W or the same distance from the plant, which means better light penetration. So while I am running 2kW throughout veg and flowering at a closer distance than your 600W, you are going to what, run a 1/600W for veg, and then throw a few more on throughout your flowering? Lol, and you think you're going to out yield me?
> 
> Prove it? Sure, you build your two 12'x4' tables with 5/600W lights and I'll get my two 12'x4' tables with 2/1000W on light movers and we'll compare cost versus return. I guarantee you will be using more electricity, more money, and more time to maintain your room versus mine. Shit we'll even log hours in the grow room per week to see how much you have to maintain your room versus myself.


Oh, and yes PAR is irrelevant because all WE have been discussing this entire time is the cost versus return of running multiple 600W bulbs versus two 1000W bulbs. If you don't understand the benefits I don't know what to tell you besides look at the electric bill versus mine.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

Did I say I ran 5-600w? No becouse I don't. My flower room is 2600w. I was going off what the op was asking.





Gets me 4-5 footers all day.





half way threw harvest.





And each string is 16 inch apart.
So now I showed my proof let's see yours smart ass.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

And cost? If your running over 2000w who cares about cost? And my bill with running the house is only $350-450 a month depending on how long lights are on.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

Funny how now you don't say something stupid about lighting and power vs yield. If you can't give full and complete info about the matter. Saying 2 1000's are better then simply steping up power as needed is a misinformed beginner that believes some of the hype hydro stores say. So just stop passing on your ideas as fact. That's the only thing pissing people off on here. Helping is great. But when you fight with people that show true fact and say it dosnt matter becouse you can do it better with no proof. Only makes you sound like a dumb ass.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> Did I say I ran 5-600w? No becouse I don't. My flower room is 2600w. I was going off what the op was asking.
> 
> Gets me 4-5 footers all day.
> 
> ...


Wait, so you say "PROVE IT", and when I respond with us doing a side-by-side grow experiemnt, your response is to throw up a bunch of pictures of your grow? Lol, and then you
try and call me a smart ass? Why, because I showed that numbers and science and improved efficiency that running with 5/600W is a bad idea? I mean hell even 3/1000W with no lights movers would be a better idea.



Warlock1369 said:


> And cost? If your running over 2000w who cares about cost? And my bill with running the house is only $350-450 a month depending on how long lights are on.


You are not running 5/600W bulbs now are you? If you would like me to run the numbers tell me how long you would be vegging under your 1/600W bulb and I can tell you the price discrepancy between your choice of running 5/600W bulbs and my choice of running 2/1000W on light movers. 



Warlock1369 said:


> Funny how now you don't say something stupid about lighting and power vs yield. If you can't give full and complete info about the matter. Saying 2 1000's are better then simply steping up power as needed is a misinformed beginner that believes some of the hype hydro stores say. So just stop passing on your ideas as fact. That's the only thing pissing people off on here. Helping is great. But when you fight with people that show true fact and say it dosnt matter becouse you can do it better with no proof. Only makes you sound like a dumb ass.


Nice rambling, you've been proven wrong multiple times with multiple examples with multiple numbers. I am not quite sure why you believe running 5/600W is the better idea, and the more laughable idea is you aren't even planning on running the lights throughout the entire grow, you're going to veg with 1/600W. Lol, you're hilarious, keep thinking you know what you're talking about and I'm the dunce. Oh, and throw up some more irrelevant budshots, that might help make your case.


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## a mongo frog (Oct 7, 2012)

HAAAAA HAAAAAA, what a fucking tool. i could be wrong but i think this is that one guy who runs 100 plants or 200 plants on 2 hoods and still claims hes running 1 light. i dont remember the thread but hes one stupid son of a bitch.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

a mongo frog said:


> HAAAAA HAAAAAA, what a fucking tool. i could be wrong but i think this is that one guy who runs 100 plants or 200 plants on 2 hoods and still claims hes running 1 light. i dont remember the thread but hes one stupid son of a bitch.


Stupid? Interesting because my education in a rather technical field tends to state otherwise. I have given examples, numerous ones and if you don't think it is possible to run 100 plants under 1/1000W in a SOG style grow, you're the stupid one.


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## a mongo frog (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Stupid? Interesting because my education in a rather technical field tends to state otherwise. I have given examples, numerous ones and if you don't think it is possible to run 100 plants under 1/1000W in a SOG style grow, you're the stupid one.


yea iam u fool, u need to log more grow time instead of pantie sippin on all your buddies 100-200 plant grow set ups.
get your own grow u legal douche, put down your books and get some work expirence. fucking quack. 
same guy who grows so much meds, hes smoking some kind of canadian brick. tool....


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

a mongo frog said:


> yea iam u fool, u need to log more grow time instead of pantie sippin on all your buddies 100-200 plant grow set ups.
> get your own grow u legal douche, put down your books and get some work expirence. fucking quack.
> same guy who grows so much meds, hes smoking some kind of canadian brick. tool....


I am sorry you are offended by someone with a high level of education and attention to detail. You have been shown numerous examples, you have been proven wrong. Why don't you man up and accept that YOU are the one who could learn more?


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

guys, quit bitching. I ran 6kw and gave my 600's away. I prefer set it and forget it rather than raising/lowering/moving lights. In the end, it's up to you. If you're confused, get one of each, try them, and use what works best for you and your situation. Fuck, who cares about who does what? Not fucking worth the energy it takes to type all that.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

GrnMn said:


> guys, quit bitching. I ran 6kw and gave my 600's away. I prefer set it and forget it rather than raising/lowering/moving lights. In the end, it's up to you. If you're confused, get one of each, try them, and use what works best for you and your situation. Fuck, who cares about who does what? *Not fucking worth the energy it takes to type all that.*


Yes, it is worth it, because knowledge is power and the grower community is filled with a lot of bogus rhetoric and a lack of competent readers. How do you plan to overgrow the planet if you can't even convey to someone else why you use the method you use? "Because it works! That is why I use it!" Well is it the best way? "I don't care, I'm too lazy to do anything other than what I know". That is your attitude, and I don't agree with it.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

Your a fool. You can't even get it threw your head that I was saying the 5 600 would be more cost effective for the op. Not for me. Even stated that I run 2600w in my room. That's 2 1000w and a 600. So why the fuck would I add my other 2 600's and dim my 1000's to prove your wrong? And I posted pics to prove I know what the fuck I'm talking about. All your doing is posting numbers. Anyone can post numbers but if you can't grow numbers mean shit. And even after you have been shown details showing light ranges and difference of lumens and PAR you still say everyone is wrong. Lmfao. You have made a few good points but then say shit like PAR and light penetration arnt important. Shit you might as well say ph and NPK have nothing to do with growing. You have your mind set that I was saying I grow with 5 600's so you can't even change your ideas. And growth is by strain dude. So even if we did do a side by side it wouldn't be right. Everything but lights would need to be the same. I'm hydro with co2 sealed and temps/humidity at levels I like. There is no way I'm down grading to your level to make you sound worse then you do now! And it's not only me that is saying this. It's in almost evey thread you post in. Somebody is always saying your wrong. I get miss understood from time to time. But I'm smart enough tochange how I said something so it's understood. Or better yet if I was proven wrong I accept it.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Yes, it is worth it, because knowledge is power and the grower community is filled with a lot of bogus rhetoric and a lack of competent readers. How do you plan to overgrow the planet if you can't even convey to someone else why you use the method you use? "Because it works! That is why I use it!" Well is it the best way? "I don't care, I'm too lazy to do anything other than what I know". That is your attitude, and I don't agree with it.


And that's just it. Your to fucken lazy. Many of us Tryed many different ways and still do. If I never changed I would be growing like I did in the 80's. Guess what! Without change there is no progression.


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Yes, it is worth it, because knowledge is power and the grower community is filled with a lot of bogus rhetoric and a lack of competent readers. How do you plan to overgrow the planet if you can't even convey to someone else why you use the method you use? "Because it works! That is why I use it!" Well is it the best way? "I don't care, I'm too lazy to do anything other than what I know". That is your attitude, and I don't agree with it.


So what, being a whiney bitch on the internet is ok because you just taught everyone something important? After reading your arguments, most people are going to consider this thread a waste of time. Good job. As for being lazy, mother fucker you have no fucking clue as to who I am and what I've done for these forums. You've got no idea how many thousands of threads I've posted, how many hundreds of thousands of posts I've made to help others, how many thousands of hours I've spent trying to help. It doesn't matter, this shit runs in a cycle. If you want to help, help those who ask for it and let the rest learn through their own experience. Don't pick a fight with me twatrocket, I don't give a fuck about you, and could care less what your education is. Fuck off.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> Your a fool. You can't even get it threw your head that I was saying the 5 600 would be more cost effective for the op. Not for me. Even stated that I run 2600w in my room. That's 2 1000w and a 600. So why the fuck would I add my other 2 600's and dim my 1000's to prove your wrong? And I posted pics to prove I know what the fuck I'm talking about. All your doing is posting numbers. Anyone can post numbers but if you can't grow numbers mean shit. And even after you have been shown details showing light ranges and difference of lumens and PAR you still say everyone is wrong. Lmfao. You have made a few good points but then say shit like PAR and light penetration arnt important. Shit you might as well say ph and NPK have nothing to do with growing. You have your mind set that I was saying I grow with 5 600's so you can't even change your ideas. And growth is by strain dude. So even if we did do a side by side it wouldn't be right. Everything but lights would need to be the same. I'm hydro with co2 sealed and temps/humidity at levels I like. There is no way I'm down grading to your level to make you sound worse then you do now! And it's not only me that is saying this. It's in almost evey thread you post in. Somebody is always saying your wrong. I get miss understood from time to time. But I'm smart enough tochange how I said something so it's understood. Or better yet if I was proven wrong I accept it.


Buddy, I know exactly what you were saying, and no 5/600W ISN'T THE MOST EFFICIENT WAY. That is what this entire thread is about, and I have given countless examples as to why and so have other people, you are wrong about 5/600W it is cool though, we're still friends. Posting pictures of you being able to grow weed doesn't make you a master grower, you understand that right? Winning a fight doesn't make you an elite level fighter. You're still talking about PAR and lumens, nobody is even discussing that, you are trying to pull some "I know something you don't card!" to give credibility to your failing argument. I know what PAR is, I know what lumens are, I know exactly what you are referring to, but it is irrelevant to what we are discussing. I never said PAR wasn't important, I never said light penetration wasn't important because that is my very argument as to why I can out grow you. "Down grading to my level." Haha, if you say so man, keep growing the way you're growing I don't really care, it isn't going to stop my pursuit of knowledge on the most efficient way to grow cannabis. 



Warlock1369 said:


> And that's just it. Your to fucken lazy. Many of us Tryed many different ways and still do. If I never changed I would be growing like I did in the 80's. Guess what! Without change there is no progression.


Lol, obviously I was calling GrnMn the lazy one...wow, as I said, a complete lack of reading comprehension in the growing community. Thanks for repeating what I just said.



GrnMn said:


> So what, being a whiney bitch on the internet is ok because you just taught everyone something important? After reading your arguments, *most people* are going to consider this thread a waste of time. Good job. As for being lazy, mother fucker you have no fucking clue as to who I am and what I've done for these forums. You've got no idea how many thousands of threads I've posted, how many hundreds of thousands of posts I've made to help others, how many thousands of hours I've spent trying to help. It doesn't matter, this shit runs in a cycle. If you want to help, help those who ask for it and let the rest learn through their own experience. Don't pick a fight with me twatrocket, I don't give a fuck about you, and could care less what your education is. Fuck off.


Who cares if "MOST" people find it a waste of time, if one person comes to this thread and has the ability to read they are going to learn something. You are lazy, you are uneducated, you are aggressive, and you are wrong. Your attitude is poor, and is exemplified in your inability to speak to me without cursing. You're not tough, and I am not concerned with what you think, I am here to help progress the knowledge of cannabis cultivation, not getting into a pissing contest. Oh and by the way it says your post count is 455, what hundreds of thousands of posts were you referring to? Also those posts are rather pointless if you've been handing out bad information. You've probably done more harm than good with your hundreds of thousands of misinformed posts.


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## a mongo frog (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> I am sorry you are offended by someone with a high level of education and attention to detail. You have been shown numerous examples, you have been proven wrong. Why don't you man up and accept that YOU are the one who could learn more?


i know i can learn more, and i will continue to learn. u havent shown me any examples of anything. i dont even know if u have ever grown any thing.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

a mongo frog said:


> i know i can learn more, and i will continue to learn. u havent shown me any examples of anything. i dont even know if u have ever grown any thing.


Then forever remain ignorant.


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

you are funny. I suppose your educated opinion is that people only use one site, and only have one account on that site, right? reinvent the wheel if you want. Technology advances, but plants are still plants. have been for thousands of years, and will be for thousands more. have fun being a dick and pretending you're changing the world.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

It's pointless fighting with this guy. Almost every thread he post in somebody says he's wrong. After throwing out numbers from books and what should add up he says we are wrong. Last I checked plants don't know how to read so they don't know that they are suppose to fallow what was said in the bible. Or even know what day it is.


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## a mongo frog (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Then forever remain ignorant.


dont be sad friend. everything is going to be alright. some one might listen to u. and then most likely get busted by the law. look man i love u, but u have alot to learn. just like we all do and want too.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

GrnMn said:


> you are funny. I suppose your educated opinion is that people only use one site, and only have one account on that site, right? reinvent the wheel if you want. Technology advances, but plants are still plants. have been for thousands of years, and will be for thousands more. have fun being a dick and pretending you're changing the world.


Multiple accounts on multiple websites, I guess I should take this as a positive characteristic? "Plants are plants!" Genius... 



Warlock1369 said:


> It's pointless *fighting* with this guy. Almost every thread he post in somebody says he's wrong. After throwing out numbers from books and what should add up he says we are wrong. Last I checked plants don't know how to read so they don't know that they are suppose to fallow what was said in the bible. Or even know what day it is.


Lol, just look at this line of logic. You think we're fighting? We're having a discussion you just find it hard to argue with facts and numbers, where I find it quite easier to argue with, "You're wrong because I say so!" There are countless grows on the web backing up exactly what I am saying in multiple threads. Why is it so hard for you to digest that the way you're growing could, OMGZ, not be as good as it could be? 



a mongo frog said:


> dont be sad friend. everything is going to be alright. some one might listen to u. and then most likely get busted by the law. look man i love u, but u have alot to learn. just like we all do and want too.


It is an ant speaking to a giant, and my friend, you are the ant. I like the touch of, "just like we all do and want too." underhanded jab followed by a "we are the world" message with crippling grammar, too cute.


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2H6mpUnsLI


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Multiple accounts on multiple websites, I guess I should take this as a positive characteristic? "Plants are plants!" Genius...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Then back what you say up!!! I never said I was the best or didn't have anything new to learn. Even the god himself Jorge learns everyday. Just ask him. I can prove I know more by showing what all I have Tryed and done. Ether it failed or worked. That is what learning and teaching is about. You my friend are to lazy (your words) to try anything different becouse it works for you. But when we say there are better ways and prove it you toss numbers. Like I said plants don't read so numbers mean shit to them. Each plant is different. Or are you gonna say you can flower a sativa with the same nutes and timeline as a indica? Or use the same for master kush for og kush?


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## a mongo frog (Oct 7, 2012)

GrnMn said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2H6mpUnsLI


i love that song.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> Then back what you say up!!! I never said I was the best or didn't have anything new to learn. Even the god himself Jorge learns everyday. Just ask him. I can prove I know more by showing what all I have Tryed and done. Ether it failed or worked. That is what learning and teaching is about. You my friend are to lazy (your words) to try anything different becouse it works for you. But when we say there are better ways and prove it you toss numbers. Like I said plants don't read so numbers mean shit to them. Each plant is different. Or are you gonna say you can flower a sativa with the same nutes and timeline as a indica? Or use the same for master kush for og kush?


Jorge Cervantes isn't a God, he is just an experienced grower. The Gods exist in the botany laboratories around the world. I don't have to prove anything, if you are unable to think about what I am saying in a critical manner and decide from your own growing experience if it is possible or not, then so be it. Is English your second language? You seem to simply be repeating everything I've been saying, and then turning it around as if you were the one with the original thought? Now you're just making shit up to try and sound more credible, "Flower a sativa with the same nutes and timeline as an indica", lol what are you talking about man? You've been proven wrong, just deal with it.


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

a mongo frog said:


> i love that song.


Me too brother, me too....


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

Hay guys I'm wrong. Lab rats proved it! Guess we all should shut down what we are doing and get this book and save to build the same rooms and never change from that. Books and numbers are better then mother nature and plant make ups. We have been doing it wrong for thousands of years. Let's leave it up to the lab rats that creat poisons and GMO plants to show us how to grow. Don't worry nobody will die. It was tested in a lab under FDA regulations. So how could it be wrong?


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> Hay guys I'm wrong. Lab rats proved it! Guess we all should shut down what we are doing and get this book and save to build the same rooms and never change from that. Books and numbers are better then mother nature and plant make ups. We have been doing it wrong for thousands of years. Let's leave it up to the lab rats that creat poisons and GMO plants to show us how to grow. Don't worry nobody will die. It was tested in a lab under FDA regulations. So how could it be wrong?


You really believe the indoor cultivation methods of today are the same as thousands of years ago? Do you really think there has been no innovation in irrigation systems since "thousands of years ago"? Have you graduated highschool by chance?


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

Let this thread die. The guy obviously needs validation for something. Just ignore him and listen to this song...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UE6iAjEv9dQ


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

GrnMn said:


> Let this thread die. The guy obviously needs validation for something. Just ignore him and listen to this song...
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UE6iAjEv9dQ


So why are you still posting? I am here to provide information to people who want it, and who need it. I am here to stop the bullshit rhetoric of the grower community, and if you really think I can be bullied over the internet then you are wrong. If someone comes in here and has the ability to read and to comprehend what someone is trying to relay to them, they will learn something. I have already accomplished my goal by presenting a solid argument, anyone that comes across here will be able to decipher that and make a decision based on the arguments presented.


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

No dude, you're here to be a know it all jack ass and try to convince people that you are right, and only your opinion matters. Do you masturbate while power tripping? I'm sorry for you if you have a small dick, but hey, lots of ladies like em little. Get a girlfriend, get a dog, or just get a life.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> You really believe the indoor cultivation methods of today are the same as thousands of years ago? Do you really think there has been no innovation in irrigation systems since "thousands of years ago"? Have you graduated highschool by chance?


No I still light my house with candles and make shadow puppets on the way to entertain my kids. Your just but hurt becouse most people won't listen to your bullshit. Why we fucken know better. And so far you haven't proven anything. Just that your a text book reader and not a grower. And yes I graduated. Even hold a top 5000 people in the world job. I don't need to spell right. I have people that correct it. I use my brain. And past testing to do my job. And it's football Sunday. Day of relaxing and not being sober. I prove eggheads wrong all the time with my testing in many other fields. So why would I even take there advise when it comes to growing? You pompis ass


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## a mongo frog (Oct 7, 2012)

i got my G.E.D in 95, im sorry.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

This thread needs to get back on track or locked. Anyone wanting to trust indicaDom's words look at all his post. Most get slammed for him being a dumb ass quoting books and text facts not showing any real grow experience. So take his words at your own risk. There is no need for me to try and give this thread back to the op. He is most likely lost by now. I would and am asking for it to get locked or edited by a mod. I vote lock


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## trouble27 (Oct 7, 2012)

Just got done reading this thread and my head hurts . Book smarts vs common sense and experience I'm going with common sense and experience


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

GrnMn said:


> No dude, you're here to be a know it all jack ass and try to convince people that you are right, and only your opinion matters. Do you masturbate while power tripping? I'm sorry for you if you have a small dick, but hey, lots of ladies like em little. Get a girlfriend, get a dog, or just get a life.


You haven't provided any evidence that you have a better method for growing than the one I've presented, until then I am right.



Warlock1369 said:


> No I still light my house with candles and make shadow puppets on the way to entertain my kids. Your just but hurt becouse most people won't listen to your bullshit. Why we fucken know better. And so far you haven't proven anything. Just that your a text book reader and not a grower. And yes I graduated. Even hold a top 5000 people in the world job. I don't need to spell right. I have people that correct it. I use my brain. And past testing to do my job. And it's football Sunday. Day of relaxing and not being sober. I prove eggheads wrong all the time with my testing in many other fields. So why would I even take there advise when it comes to growing? You pompis ass


You're the one talking about "plants are plants", "thousands of years ago", "shadow puppets", lol. Interesting that you boast such a high position, I wonder, do they care whether or not you know the difference between "your" and "you're"? I'm not butt hurt, a "text book reader", lol what exactly is a "text book" oh highly educated one? You obviously do NOT use your brain, if you did the simple math I've presented and the grows I've linked should show you your method is inefficient. "Eggheads", lol, for someone working with the elite I'm surprised you would condescend to the idea of education. Again, learn the difference between, "their", "they're", and "there". It might make it more believable when you try and convince people you've been to college. 



a mongo frog said:


> i got my G.E.D in 95, im sorry.


Don't be sorry, just pay attention.


----------



## a mongo frog (Oct 7, 2012)

pay attention to what? i still dont know what were arguing about. or what your stance was.
was it 2 hoods, 1 1k ballast, and 2 5x5 tents? 100 plants in each?


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## bigbudahluva (Oct 7, 2012)

lmfa indica dom ur a clever guy, stop getting ppls backs up though, put ur info across less dominating, everyone is unique and so is their logic. peace


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

Who said college? Not me. And I do know the difference. Just don't care when on this or other forums. I'm a grower here I don't need to be a grammar nazi. And that's why I like RIU. We are all growers here. Don't need to boast about education or financial status here. Just how to grow and help others not make the same mistakes we did. You want everyone fallowing your way and making yourself look like a guy that fallows what is in books and not trying anything eles. While the rest of us try different things and report if it is better or worse. Yes I try alot of different things and some fail bad but I pass it on so somebody other then your pigheaded self might not do the same mistakes. I have never said if you don't do it my way your doing it wrong. But that is how you are putting yourself as. I much rather teach by showing my failures of trying then preaching book facts. And if anyone here can say I don't do that I want banned now.


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## boedhaspeaks (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> You haven't provided any evidence that you have a better method for growing than the one I've presented, until then I am right.
> 
> 
> You're the one talking about "plants are plants", "thousands of years ago", "shadow puppets", lol. Interesting that you boast such a high position, I wonder, do they care whether or not you know the difference between "your" and "you're"? I'm not butt hurt, a "text book reader", lol what exactly is a "text book" oh highly educated one? You obviously do NOT use your brain, if you did the simple math I've presented and the grows I've linked should show you your method is inefficient. "Eggheads", lol, for someone working with the elite I'm surprised you would condescend to the idea of education. Again, learn the difference between, "their", "they're", and "there". It might make it more believable when you try and convince people you've been to college.
> ...


Sofar i have only seen hot air from you, throw in some pics dude, like someone asked you before.
Plants are still plants, they still need water light air and nutes, like thousand years ago.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

trouble27 said:


> Just got done reading this thread and my head hurts . Book smarts vs common sense and experience I'm going with common sense and experience


Hahahahaha, yeah you build a nuclear weapon with "common sense and experience" and I'll use engineering schematics, thanks. This is why most Americans deserve the situation their country is in, people that are unable to think critically or for themselves.



a mongo frog said:


> pay attention to what? i still dont know what were arguing about. or what your stance was.
> was it 2 hoods, 1 1k ballast, and 2 5x5 tents? 100 plants in each?


My stance is SOG straight from clones showing roots or 1 week veg time with 6 - 9 plants per square foot. I've said it a hundred times, I'll say it a hundred more. 



bigbudahluva said:


> lmfa indica dom ur a clever guy, stop getting ppls backs up though, put ur info across less dominating, everyone is unique and so is their logic. peace


Logic is a system of order, sets, and rules. Everyone's point of view is unique, however the interpretation of logic is not.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> Even hold a top 5000 people in the world job. I don't need to spell right. I have people that correct it. I use my brain. You pompis ass





Warlock1369 said:


> Don't need to boast about education or financial status here. Just how to grow and help others not make the same mistakes we did.


Lol, you done? You've been destroyed in this debate, you can crawl away now.



boedhaspeaks said:


> Sofar i have only seen hot air from you, throw in some pics dude, like someone asked you before.
> Plants are still plants, they still need water light air and nutes, like thousand years ago.


Nobody asked me for pictures, somebody demanded pictures, but I don't respond to demands. I don't really need to prove anything, if you need a picture of a SOG, go to google.


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## boedhaspeaks (Oct 7, 2012)

Sorry your highness, i hope they bow before they ask it again, if they dare


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## mr2shim (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Hahahahaha, yeah you build a nuclear weapon with "common sense and experience" and I'll use engineering schematics, thanks. This is why most Americans deserve the situation their country is in, people that are unable to think critically or for themselves.


I'm 100% certain you couldn't tell me one thing about nuclear fission without first googling it. Better yet, explain to me what nuclear fusion is mr. smarty pants. Go ahead and google it because I know you have no idea.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 7, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> I'm 100% certain you couldn't tell me one thing about nuclear fission without first googling it. Better yet, explain to me what nuclear fusion is mr. smarty pants. Go ahead and google it because I know you have no idea.


Was this supposed to be proving something other than how insecure you are with being proven wrong?


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## mr2shim (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Was this supposed to be proving something other than how insecure you are with being proven wrong?


No not really, just proving you like to blow smoke out of your ass. Still waiting on that explanation. I know google is faster than this.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Lol, you done? You've been destroyed in this debate, you can crawl away now.
> 
> 
> 
> Nobody asked me for pictures, somebody demanded pictures, but I don't respond to demands. I don't really need to prove anything, if you need a picture of a SOG, go to google.


We asked you to prove it. And when I proved I was a grower by posting pics of my grow you had this to say.



Originally Posted by Warlock1369 
Did I say I ran 5-600w? No becouse I don't. My flower room is 2600w. I was going off what the op was asking.

Gets me 4-5 footers all day.

half way threw harvest.

And each string is 16 inch apart.
So now I showed my proof let's see yours smart ass.
Wait, so you say "PROVE IT", and when I respond with us doing a side-by-side grow experiemnt, your response is to throw up a bunch of pictures of your grow? Lol, and then you
try and call me a smart ass? Why, because I showed that numbers and science and improved efficiency that running with 5/600W is a bad idea? I mean hell even 3/1000W with no lights movers would be a better idea.

Originally Posted by Warlock1369 
And cost? If your running over 2000w who cares about cost? And my bill with running the house is only $350-450 a month depending on how long lights are on.
You are not running 5/600W bulbs now are you? If you would like me to run the numbers tell me how long you would be vegging under your 1/600W bulb and I can tell you the price discrepancy between your choice of running 5/600W bulbs and my choice of running 2/1000W on light movers. 

Originally Posted by Warlock1369 
Funny how now you don't say something stupid about lighting and power vs yield. If you can't give full and complete info about the matter. Saying 2 1000's are better then simply steping up power as needed is a misinformed beginner that believes some of the hype hydro stores say. So just stop passing on your ideas as fact. That's the only thing pissing people off on here. Helping is great. But when you fight with people that show true fact and say it dosnt matter becouse you can do it better with no proof. Only makes you sound like a dumb ass.
Nice rambling, you've been proven wrong multiple times with multiple examples with multiple numbers. I am not quite sure why you believe running 5/600W is the better idea, and the more laughable idea is you aren't even planning on running the lights throughout the entire grow, you're going to veg with 1/600W. Lol, you're hilarious, keep thinking you know what you're talking about and I'm the dunce. Oh, and throw up some more irrelevant budshots, that might help make your case.


So like I said then back you shit up with real proof (please) or shut the fuck up. Now I asked with a please. But I'm sure you can't . And now we want a RIU sign with your user name and date on it in the pic. My lights come on in 1 hour and I'll do the same but you first.


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## mr2shim (Oct 7, 2012)

He can't prove what he doesn't have warlock.


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## boedhaspeaks (Oct 7, 2012)

10$ he doesn't show


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## mr2shim (Oct 7, 2012)

He's currently googling someones grow room to post it as his own and what nuclear fusion and fission are. He has to keep up this front. Be patient with him.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

He can't prove it. Was my point. Who on this site get bitchy when someone post pics of there room and plants like I did when asking for proof? Nobody but this pos. And why I'm asking for the sign with it. Fuck I even have vids in my sig that you cant find on the net. Why becouse they are mine and I only posted them here. And all mine match so no random pics taken. This guy is a fucken joke and I'm having fun pointing it out by this point.


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## mr2shim (Oct 7, 2012)

If someone asked me to put up a sign I would do it right now with a big fuck you below it.. This guy is a joke. Go skim through his posts. All he does is troll, and he's pretty bad at it.


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## OLD DUDE (Oct 7, 2012)

He goes directly from cloner to flower in a SOG, runs 200 plants in flower, and gets 1.5 gpw, he would get more but he is a solo grower!! He was spewing his bullshit on another thread


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## nick88 (Oct 7, 2012)

Got here late. Damn, wheres the popcorn and my bowl?


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

Dude's just a bitch looking for validation. He has to compensate for his inch long penis. So much cooler online....


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

OLD DUDE said:


> He goes directly from cloner to flower in a SOG, runs 200 plants in flower, and gets 1.5 gpw, he would get more but he is a solo grower!! He was spewing his bullshit on another thread


I'm a solo grower? Wtf dose that mean? 7 pages of the fucknut talking shut and can't pull up 1 pic. But says google it. And Tryed to bash me for putting up my bud porn. What grower dose that? None. Even if I had yellow leaves beer can colas are nice to look at. Right? Lol indicadom is a joke. Couldn't even tell that my plants are almost pure indica.


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## mr2shim (Oct 7, 2012)

Honestly, what was he expecting? Don't throw out ridiculous claims with 0 proof. I know some people here aren't firing on all 8 but damn. If you're going to bullshit at least make it somewhat believable.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

10 min nd I can take a pic with my sign already made. This is of my 4 days into flowering plant. I can and will prove what I say.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

Even if I have a shity looking grow I show it. So let Dom show anything but better prove it wasn't off google like he asked us to do. Oh hay my light just kicked on. Gotta let them warm up and photo will be posted.


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## mr2shim (Oct 7, 2012)

His grow must be in another state. That's why he had to sign off to get back to us with those pictures.


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## nick88 (Oct 7, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> His grow must be in another state. That's why he had to sign off to get back to us with those pictures.


 Another planet is more like it. He lost his signal and has to wait for the planets to realign before he can come back on.


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## bigbudahluva (Oct 7, 2012)

check my journal out guys, please. i added pics. lol might lighten the mood, peace


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

Here ya go. 4 days into flower. Almost pure indica Master Kush. Now talk shit bitch. Real grow vs book worm who wins? Get the fuck off our site.


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## nick88 (Oct 7, 2012)

bigbudahluva said:


> check my journal out guys, please. i added pics. lol might lighten the mood, peace


That's friggin sweet dude! Love those lil ladies


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## nick88 (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> Here ya go. 4 days into flower. Almost pure indica Master Kush. Now talk shit bitch. Real grow vs book worm who wins? Get the fuck off our site.


OUCH!!! Thats gonna sting like a mutha.. LMao Beautiful lady Warlock


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## a mongo frog (Oct 7, 2012)

and a Bud Light to boot, with a sexy girl?


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## mr2shim (Oct 7, 2012)

LOL You have inspired me warlock. I think this should be standard practice. Too many fake ass trolls here now days.



BTW this is lights off on day 45 if anyone is curious.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

11 more like it. Would have 14 if I didn't go to jail for a week when in veg. So my mistake can't be there down fall. And that's 3weeks under T5 and 2 under mh. Then 12/12 mh for 1 week then hps for 12/12 for 4 days. So I ask Dom 1 more time who is better? The fucken nook you quote or a real grower. I take thegrower anyday.


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> Here ya go. 4 days into flower. Almost pure indica Master Kush. Now talk shit bitch. Real grow vs book worm who wins? Get the fuck off our site.


You are my new best friend. Fuck yeah, and fuck that bitchy ass little pussy! (sounded like a porno for a sec...) +rep and +respect.


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

*sorry warlock, says I gotta spread it around...
*


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

I said I won't say anything if I can't back it up. And rep means nothing to me. Just like the post and let the world know. I don't like the rep and almost never use it.


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

yeah, well, fuck it. I just like your style. plant's nice too, btw


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> I said I won't say anything if I can't back it up. And rep means nothing to me. Just like the post and let the world know. I don't like the rep and almost never use it.


How do you use rep?
In rap videos?


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## a mongo frog (Oct 7, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> How do you use rep?
> In rap videos?


used only in the riu store.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> How do you use rep?
> In rap videos?


Rep is the star thing under each post. Like is the like button on the lower right hand side of the post.


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> Rep is the star thing under each post. Like is the like button on the lower right hand side of the post.


lol I know I'm just wondering what it's uses are


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 7, 2012)

a mongo frog said:


> used only in the riu store.


No Shit I didn't know that.
Thanks


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## mr2shim (Oct 7, 2012)

People with more rep suppose to be more reputable because their reputation is higher.


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 7, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> People with more rep suppose to be more reputable because their reputation is higher.


Lol Green squares aren't gonna make me respect anybody


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> Lol Green squares aren't gonna make me respect anybody


but they're so pretty....


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## mr2shim (Oct 7, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> Lol Green squares aren't gonna make me respect anybody


It's nothing personal, it's just that we're better than you. hahaha


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 7, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> It's nothing personal, it's just that we're better than you. hahaha


lol I will cry about it later shim I promise.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> Lol Green squares aren't gonna make me respect anybody


And that's why I say it's a joke. People in T&T can give rep. So green bars mean nothing to me. I much rather see a like under my post then a silent rep and green bar. Even post count dosnt faze me. I've been in fights with friends becouse I don't look at who is posting just the post. If you wrong I'll point it out. If I'm wrong I want it pointed out as well. But this indicadom fucker is wrong in almost all post when asked to go in detail so I have no problem calling his bs.


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## a mongo frog (Oct 7, 2012)

i feel sad now, i hope he isnt at home crying. he may think we hate him. gosh mannn lifes tough.


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## mr2shim (Oct 7, 2012)

a mongo frog said:


> i feel sad now, i hope he isnt at home crying. he may think we hate him. gosh mannn lifes tough.


Ran off two trolls in one day, him and that twelveone asshole.


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 7, 2012)

a mongo frog said:


> i feel sad now, i hope he isnt at home crying. he may think we hate him. gosh mannn lifes tough.


I'll be ok, I put down the razor and My Mother just txt reminding me I'm awesome so screw you guys Mummy says I'm the reppiest repper on the internet


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 7, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> Ran off two trolls in one day, him and that twelveone asshole.


Screw you I'm not entirely trollish
Plus I helped you with that twelveone douche


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## a mongo frog (Oct 7, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> I'll be ok, I put down the razor and My Mother just txt reminding me I'm awesome so screw you guys Mummy says I'm the reppiest repper on the internet


oh, i didnt mean u, the other guy. u know that one guy that was here before. the one guy.


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## cannabineer (Oct 7, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> lol I know I'm just wondering what it's uses are


It denotes our rank on the Death Star. cn


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## mr2shim (Oct 7, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> Screw you I'm not entirely trollish
> Plus I helped you with that twelveone douche


I'm sure he'll be back tomorrow making threads about me and how much I suck. I was lol'ing so much with that.


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## cannabineer (Oct 7, 2012)

The one thing that's been bugging me about 5x600 in a 4x12 space is best placement. i can't figure the optimum. For 3x lamps it's easy ... divide grow into three squares and center a lamp over each square. But five into three ~scratches chin~ cn


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 7, 2012)

a mongo frog said:


> oh, i didnt mean u, the other guy. u know that one guy that was here before. the one guy.


Ok
But just to be clear I have stopped crying now.
And I had just been cutting onions anyway so I wasn't crying, I was making a lasagne..............................for one ........................


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

I realy wanted this troll to try and fight me. He has been doing it all day. Not that he wasn't informative in some post but just not a real grower. Guess posting real pics got him scared. Fuck it. Now all now I realy grow. And back my shit up. Prove me wrong and I will thank you for it. I'm always looking for ways to improve my grow. But helping others not do what I did is my main goal.


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> Ok
> But just to be clear I have stopped crying now.
> And I had just been cutting onions anyway so I wasn't crying, I was making a lasagne..............................for one ........................


I feel you brother, making pasgetty for three and am home alone. Gotta love it!


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## a mongo frog (Oct 7, 2012)

GrnMn said:


> I feel you brother, making pasgetty for three and am home alone. Gotta love it!


yea but, do u have any beer or smoke?


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 7, 2012)

GrnMn said:


> I feel you brother, making pasgetty for three and am home alone. Gotta love it!


Sgetty wrestling?


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

cannabineer said:


> The one thing that's been bugging me about 5x600 in a 4x12 space is best placement. i can't figure the optimum. For 3x lamps it's easy ... divide grow into three squares and center a lamp over each square. But five into three ~scratches chin~ cn


Read all but indicaRETARDdons post and you will find the answers you want. That guy was a book smart idiot. Quote a book but not grow. Realy? And I'll be bashed before anyone I posted more pics proving his meatod wrong then any one. Bring it


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

a mongo frog said:


> yea but, do u have any beer or smoke?


got some rum and a half gram of some good no-name, and two types of really decent mersh. Working on the rum while cooking, will make a custom blend to go with the meal when the noodles are done...


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

GrnMn said:


> got some rum and a half gram of some good no-name, and two types of really decent mersh. Working on the rum while cooking, will make a custom blend to go with the meal when the noodles are done...


I feel like a real chef...


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## GrowinTheDank (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> I wouldn't buy that many lights, you are talking about a 12 foot table. Break that into two 6 foot sections, buy 2/1000W bulbs and throw them on light movers. A 1000W HPS' footprint is 5'x5'. Now if you have a 12x4 table it should easily be able to cover the width of that table. The interesting thing is with light movers and the footprint of (1)1000W HPS, at any given time only 1 foot on each section is going to be unlit. Plus that means you only have to move the light across a 1 foot linear path. This is the most efficient way to light the table and to save the most money. I mean seriously, (6) 600W ballasts? Fuck that, I guarantee the exact same yield from 2/1000W HPS on light movers covering that table. Why use so much electricity? An even better idea is to have two rooms with two 12x4 tables, buy 2/1000W HPS ballasts, buy a flip-flop relay and run both rooms on 12/12 all the time. Now you are running your ballasts 24 hours a day, lighting 2 rooms with 2, 12x4 tables. That is efficiency my friend.


Fucking genius lol. Same amount of yield in the same amount of time. You just harvest twice instead of one big harvest  Perfect..


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## a mongo frog (Oct 7, 2012)

what is a flip flop relay? where do i get one?


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 7, 2012)

a mongo frog said:


> what is a flip flop relay? where do i get one?


I think it's a relay race wearing thongs/jandels/flop flops


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## GrnMn (Oct 7, 2012)

rexell. a relay is a contact device that can be powered by a small cord from your timer and is activated (closes) when a small amount of power is supplied. The contact is an on/off circuit that can handle the power of several things at once (ie, multiple ballasts). A flip-flop relay is one that is always on, but the power supplied from your timer causes it to switch between one circuit and another (two rooms, half the ballasts). If you like, I can forward you a schematic. Peace frog.

Fuck off dom, plenty of us know what's up, and you're just a bitch.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

Put on sandles as you flip the switch? I don't know. Guy makes no sence to me.


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## cannabineer (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> Read all but indicaRETARDdons post and you will find the answers you want. That guy was a book smart idiot. Quote a book but not grow. Realy? And I'll be bashed before anyone I posted more pics proving his meatod wrong then any one. Bring it


I did read the entire thread, even if I skimmed some of the fest(er)ivities. I remember someone advocating 5x600, but don't recall mention of the placement pattern. I remain honestly curious, and am not looking to stir controversy. cn


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

The op droped out so I wasn't able to find out the real layout of the room. So that is why it got this far with the troll. I wish I knew more. So o could help the op. I was thinking 1 room veg to flower so that was my idea. Start under 1 600. As plants get bigger go 2 600 then start 3-4. Once tables are full and in flower go all 5 with hps and flower. But duckhead scared the op off so no real idea.


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## legaleyes13 (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> To tell you the truth if you have the power to run 3000w of lights and everything eles needed for a grow room that size a AC won't change your bill to much. Mine dosnt run 24/7 it's on a temp switch keeping it at 80. Took out 1 600 and added T5's for veg and my bill went down. And that was after adding a larger dehumidifier and more fans. I don't understand why you are so bent on not useing a AC to cool the room. There are tons of ways to hide them. And you don't need the expensive stand up units from the hydro stores. A cheep window one is what I use. And I can tell you how to create a hot room for it so you don't have to have it in a window. But anything used to cool a room will make heat. So if not vented right it's counter productive and waste of money.


I know all of this, and have always used a window unit. This time around I'll probably just go with a stand up, because I feel like I get room leakage when I cut a hole in the panda plastic for the window unit. I cut holes so the back of my dehumidifier doesn't let heat in the room as well. Basically I hate A/C because I've always had trouble completely sealing my room due to it's weird dimensions and the A/C is just another added hassle.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

You need the dehumidifier left alone to do it's thing. The air it puts out is the dry air if you evac. It you gain nothing from it being in the room. You realy need the air from the dehy going into the room. Or it's pointless. Hot dry air is what you need. But coolig the heated air is another thing.


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## legaleyes13 (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> You need the dehumidifier left alone to do it's thing. The air it puts out is the dry air if you evac. It you gain nothing from it being in the room. You realy need the air from the dehy going into the room. Or it's pointless. Hot dry air is what you need. But coolig the heated air is another thing.


Thank you very much. I just learned something...


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## trouble27 (Oct 7, 2012)

damn it realy takes a long time to water 200 plants under 1 light with an eye dropper .flip flop relay basically turns an 8 light grow into a 16 light grow only good for 12/12 keeps u from getting more ballasts kinda cool i need 1. here is some more bud porn forgot to shit on a sign with doms name on it .
unknown cali connection strain
tahoe week 6 

 whats ur book say bout that dom books only get u so far and i dont think they make a dummies guide to life u fucking wanker.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

Let me put it in better terms. The cool most air is sucked threw freezing coils. This traps the moisture to the coils. Sending dry cold air to the heat exchanger. This brings up the heat of the air but lower humidity. That air is displaced over the cooling coils melting it frozen water in the air. Creating RO water in the trap. Great for watering plants. But if you waste the hot dry air all it can do is freeze the moist air. Not bringing in any dry air. Much like adding air to the res but not gaveling it a airstone. Almost pointless.


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## legaleyes13 (Oct 7, 2012)

Hey guys, I tried to read through this thread from about pg. 6 on but couldn't make it through because of all of the useless bitching. I'm sure some of you were provoked and it wasn't your fault, but if you said anything informative in those pages, then feel free to repost...

And I'm sorry, I should have given you all a little more info on my grow as it has been tweaked a little. It's going to be perpetual with no veg (I'll have clones in the EZ clone for 2 weeks then straight to flower). And I hate to say it, but the entire premise of this thread has been tweaked because of this. I no longer have to worry about 600W or 1000W, because I will have four 4x4 tables, with 1000W lights over each... let me know if you think this is a good or bad idea... Thanks fellas...

I no longer need the question initially posed in this thread to be answered, but somebody else may, so feel free to further discuss...


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

dirtsurfr said:


> .........


Didn't need to see that!! But good one and now off to burn the ol lady's g that looks like the 2nd from the left. It's gonna creep me out. Lol


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

legaleyes13 said:


> Hey guys, I tried to read through this thread from about pg. 6 on but couldn't make it through because of all of the useless bitching. I'm sure some of you were provoked and it wasn't your fault, but if you said anything informative in those pages, then feel free to repost...
> 
> And I'm sorry, I should have given you all a little more info on my grow as it has been tweaked a little. It's going to be perpetual with no veg (I'll have clones in the EZ clone for 2 weeks then straight to flower). And I hate to say it, but the entire premise of this thread has been tweaked because of this. I no longer have to worry about 600W or 1000W, because I will have four 4x4 tables, with 1000W lights over each... let me know if you think this is a good or bad idea... Thanks fellas...
> 
> I no longer need the question initially posed in this thread to be answered, but somebody else may, so feel free to further discuss...


It wasn't you. We got a troll so there is no point in reading after Paige 4. But feel freeto read back if you want to laff.


----------



## dirtsurfr (Oct 7, 2012)

Sorry I jumped in like that removed.
Are you going to do a perpetual grow?


----------



## trouble27 (Oct 7, 2012)

so thats what trolling is guess its a nicer way of calling someone an asshole.


----------



## legaleyes13 (Oct 7, 2012)

cannabineer said:


> The one thing that's been bugging me about 5x600 in a 4x12 space is best placement. i can't figure the optimum. For 3x lamps it's easy ... divide grow into three squares and center a lamp over each square. But five into three ~scratches chin~ cn


This I can help you with. What you want to do is measure the width of your reflectors. Lets say they're 30 inches. Then you multiply that by 5 and you get 150. Then you convert 12' into inches and you get 144... And damn, I wasn't even expecting this... You could just line em up side by side, because they're bigger than the damn table... lol

I really wasn't expecting that. And yes I know I just pulled 30in out of thin air...

So lets say the width of each reflector is 20in. That gives you a total of 100in of reflector space. And with this info you know that you will have 7 total spaces of separation on either side of each light, and a 44in difference between total light reflector size(100in) and 12ft table(144in). So you then divide 44/7 and you get 6 and some change. So now you know you should keep each light 6 inches apart and the end lights, 6 inches away from the edge of the table...

So that is great coverage.


----------



## legaleyes13 (Oct 7, 2012)

dirtsurfr said:


> Sorry I jumped in like that removed.
> Are you going to do a perpetual grow?


yes, I will


----------



## legaleyes13 (Oct 7, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> It wasn't you. We got a troll so there is no point in reading after Paige 4. But feel freeto read back if you want to laff.



lol... cool. I normally like a good messageboard battle, but I just woke up and I'm a little groggy, so maybe another time.

But still, you seem quite informative. Do you have any knowledge of perpetual grows? This will be my first attempt at it. And I've heard the mantra "there is no such thing as too much light" but my goodness... 1000Ws over a bunch of plants that aren't even gonna be veg'd, on a 4x4 table may be too much light... no?


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

trouble27 said:


> so thats what trolling is guess its a nicer way of calling someone an asshole.


Think we called him a asshole and other things. Fucker has been on us all day. But yes troll is the nice way to put it.


----------



## supchaka (Oct 7, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> So no rhyme or reason, 4 600's just cause?


Honestly I'd probably run 3 600's over that space, I just threw in one more to be even better


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 7, 2012)

legaleyes13 said:


> lol... cool. I normally like a good messageboard battle, but I just woke up and I'm a little groggy, so maybe another time.
> 
> But still, you seem quite informative. Do you have any knowledge of perpetual grows? This will be my first attempt at it. And I've heard the mantra "there is no such thing as too much light" but my goodness... 1000W over a bunch of plants that aren't even gonna be veg'd may be too much light... no?


Just click my sig. If you don't find that I can help you just ask. This is just my last 4 years of growing. And in this thread I posted a few pics of new grow to shut the troll up. I won't get afforded if my style isn't yours. But if I can help feel free to ask. I'm not perfict I do make mistakes so don't hold me to everything I say.


----------



## cannabineer (Oct 7, 2012)

trouble27 said:


> so thats what trolling is guess its a nicer way of calling someone an asshole.


I doubt it. Dirtsurfr's "good people". cn


----------



## dirtsurfr (Oct 7, 2012)

Na I was joshing!! I'm a cheep Old schooler and grow my stuff out door. My first was in door I got Mites
they ate and made babys.... I got some fantastic bud at the end but the cost pushed me out doors were mites are a delicacy to 
everything that eats. 6 plants keeps me more than supplyed for the year. 

Good luck with you're grow it's habit forming no matter how or were you grow it's the fact that we all enjoy our herb grown by our selves.
Start a grow jornal and cruse read and ask, Theres tons of info if you read or heck just ask, don't fall for the trolls, I know I do BUT I"M OLDer
LOL. To be honest I learned every thing here mostly till I went out side. It's easy grow in soil with lots of worms in it and you'll grow alot.


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> No not really, just proving you like to blow smoke out of your ass. Still waiting on that explanation. I know google is faster than this.


You're irrelevant, don't you understand? 



Warlock1369 said:


> We asked you to prove it. And when I proved I was a grower by posting pics of my grow you had this to say.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Go away, I don't have to prove anything, accept it or don't, I don't really care. 



mr2shim said:


> He can't prove what he doesn't have warlock.


Yeah, you're right, I obviously have zero knowledge about cannabis cultivation, LOL. 



Warlock1369 said:


> He can't prove it. Was my point. Who on this site get bitchy when someone post pics of there room and plants like I did when asking for proof? Nobody but this pos. And why I'm asking for the sign with it. Fuck I even have vids in my sig that you cant find on the net. Why becouse they are mine and I only posted them here. And all mine match so no random pics taken. This guy is a fucken joke and I'm having fun pointing it out by this point.


Nobody cares about your grow, nobody is talking about the small amount of weight you pull, in the world of cannabis cultivation you are an amateur, deal with it. 



OLD DUDE said:


> He goes directly from cloner to flower in a SOG, runs 200 plants in flower, and gets 1.5 gpw, he would get more but he is a solo grower!! He was spewing his bullshit on another thread


You were proved wrong, deal with it. 



Warlock1369 said:


> I'm a solo grower? Wtf dose that mean? 7 pages of the fucknut talking shut and can't pull up 1 pic. But says google it. And Tryed to bash me for putting up my bud porn. What grower dose that? None. Even if I had yellow leaves beer can colas are nice to look at. Right? Lol indicadom is a joke. Couldn't even tell that my plants are almost pure indica.


Well it means when you start running 200+ plants, in multiple perpetual rooms, the work is a bit more than 1 person can handle, catch my drift? Guess not since you've never grown more than 10 plants at once.



mr2shim said:


> LOL You have inspired me warlock. I think this should be standard practice. Too many fake ass trolls here now days.
> 
> 
> 
> BTW this is lights off on day 45 if anyone is curious.


Too bad cannabis can't cure insecurities, eh? 



a mongo frog said:


> i feel sad now, i hope he isnt at home crying. he may think we hate him. gosh mannn lifes tough.


The fact that you're worried about me is really pathetic, lol, how insecure are you people? 



mr2shim said:


> Ran off two trolls in one day, him and that twelveone asshole.


You haven't ran anybody off, I am still here refuting everything you've said. You haven't even graduated highschool dude, stop spouting off about "trolls", stick the point, but you can't because you don't have one. 



cannabineer said:


> The one thing that's been bugging me about 5x600 in a 4x12 space is best placement. i can't figure the optimum. For 3x lamps it's easy ... divide grow into three squares and center a lamp over each square. But five into three ~scratches chin~ cn


That is because 5/600W is the dumbest thing you could do with a 12'x4' table, we've talked about it, these guys are just too ignorant to know they are wrong so they are resulting to name calling.



Warlock1369 said:


> I realy wanted this troll to try and fight me. He has been doing it all day. Not that he wasn't informative in some post but just not a real grower. Guess posting real pics got him scared. Fuck it. Now all now I realy grow. And back my shit up. Prove me wrong and I will thank you for it. I'm always looking for ways to improve my grow. But helping others not do what I did is my main goal.


Scared? Dude, you are insecure.



Warlock1369 said:


> Read all but indicaRETARDdons post and you will find the answers you want. That guy was a book smart idiot. Quote a book but not grow. Realy? And I'll be bashed before anyone I posted more pics proving his meatod wrong then any one. Bring it


You're dumb, I have already shown the numbers, 5/600W is the dumbest thing you could run on a 12'x4' table. 



GrowinTheDank said:


> Fucking genius lol. Same amount of yield in the same amount of time. You just harvest twice instead of one big harvest Perfect..


Thank you for your acknowledgement, you are a head above the rest of the class. 



GrnMn said:


> rexell. a relay is a contact device that can be powered by a small cord from your timer and is activated (closes) when a small amount of power is supplied. The contact is an on/off circuit that can handle the power of several things at once (ie, multiple ballasts). A flip-flop relay is one that is always on, but the power supplied from your timer causes it to switch between one circuit and another (two rooms, half the ballasts). If you like, I can forward you a schematic. Peace frog.
> 
> Fuck off dom, plenty of us know what's up, and you're just a bitch.


These guys don't even know what flip-flop relays are, you sure you still want to side with them? 



Warlock1369 said:


> The op droped out so I wasn't able to find out the real layout of the room. So that is why it got this far with the troll. I wish I knew more. So o could help the op. I was thinking 1 room veg to flower so that was my idea. Start under 1 600. As plants get bigger go 2 600 then start 3-4. Once tables are full and in flower go all 5 with hps and flower. But duckhead scared the op off so no real idea.


Horribly inefficient.



trouble27 said:


> damn it realy takes a long time to water 200 plants under 1 light with an eye dropper .flip flop relay basically turns an 8 light grow into a 16 light grow only good for 12/12 keeps u from getting more ballasts kinda cool i need 1. here is some more bud porn forgot to shit on a sign with doms name on it .
> unknown cali connection strain
> tahoe week 6
> 
> whats ur book say bout that dom books only get u so far and i dont think they make a diummies guide to life u fucking wanker.


Learn English please. 



legaleyes13 said:


> Hey guys, I tried to read through this thread from about pg. 6 on but couldn't make it through because of all of the useless bitching. I'm sure some of you were provoked and it wasn't your fault, but if you said anything informative in those pages, then feel free to repost...
> 
> And I'm sorry, I should have given you all a little more info on my grow as it has been tweaked a little. It's going to be perpetual with no veg (I'll have clones in the EZ clone for 2 weeks then straight to flower). And I hate to say it, but the entire premise of this thread has been tweaked because of this. I no longer have to worry about 600W or 1000W, because I will have four 4x4 tables, with 1000W lights over each... let me know if you think this is a good or bad idea... Thanks fellas...
> 
> I no longer need the question initially posed in this thread to be answered, but somebody else may, so feel free to further discuss...


The question was already answered and the most efficient arrangement is 2/1000W on light movers for a 12'x4' table. The 1000Ws will work fine over the tables, but there are better ways.



Warlock1369 said:


> Think we called him a asshole and other things. Fucker has been on us all day. But yes troll is the nice way to put it.


If troll means intelligent grower who proves you wrong, then yes I'm a troll. 



legaleyes13 said:


> lol... cool. I normally like a good messageboard battle, but I just woke up and I'm a little groggy, so maybe another time.
> 
> But still, you seem quite informative. Do you have any knowledge of perpetual grows? This will be my first attempt at it. And I've heard the mantra "there is no such thing as too much light" but my goodness... 1000Ws over a bunch of plants that aren't even gonna be veg'd, on a 4x4 table may be too much light... no?


Yes, you should of put 600W over the 4'x4' tables, oh well.


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 8, 2012)

Lmfao. The bitch still posts.


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> Lmfao. The bitch still posts.


I'm sorry you can't understand why I chose the arrangment of lights that I did, but 5/600W was bad advice and I am going to keep posting so that anyone who stumbles across this thread will get good information and not the crap you try to push by internet bullying.


----------



## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

He is rather bitch like isn't he


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 8, 2012)

No body cares what you say. You can't prove anything so bounce. You non growing fuck!


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> No body cares what you say. You can't prove anything so bounce. You non growing fuck!


"No body", lol, top 5000 positions in the world huh?

Nobody is trying to prove anything to someone as ignorant as yourself.


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 8, 2012)

I showed my grow all we ask is one from you. Can you do it? No why? You don't grow so blow me and piss off


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> I showed my grow all we ask is one from you. Can you do it? No why? You don't grow so blow me and piss off


You obviously speak English as a second language, you obviously believe that posting pictures up is "proof" you're a grower. Why are you still posting in this thread? You have nothing to offer except for bad advice like, running 5/600W bulbs for a 12'x4' table, and the worse part is you don't even understand why that advice is bad.


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> "No body", lol, top 5000 positions in the world huh?
> 
> Nobody is trying to prove anything to someone as ignorant as yourself.


id I passed my job out with 5000 of us how hard is it to find me? Fuck you. You are getting personal now.


----------



## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

this thread is an epic bitch fest!
Poor OP


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> this thread is an epic bitch fest!
> Poor OP


The OP's question has been answered numerous times, even after he changed the entire layout of his grow, those questions were answered as well. It isn't "poor OP", it is what a "lucky OP".


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> You obviously speak English as a second language, you obviously believe that posting pictures up is "proof" you're a grower. Why are you still posting in this thread? You have nothing to offer except for bad advice like, running 5/600W bulbs for a 12'x4' table, and the worse part is you don't even understand why that advice is bad.


Bitch please. I showed I grow now it's your turn. Sorry if you can't take the heat. You desided to jump in the kitchen.


----------



## GrnMn (Oct 8, 2012)

So what man, don't take the side of the people who aren't acting like they know everything in the universe? Or should I correct you on relays and explain to you the difference between a single pole single throw relay and a double pole single throw relay? Or that rather than saying flip-flop you should abbreviate to differentiate?

I can't say much, I've only grown pot for about 17 years. All the articles and books I've written don't account for much. Opinions are like assholes; everybody's got one. I've given up trying to preach and change the world. If someone asks me for help, I'm happy to oblige, but to try and force your account on someone is much like being a modern day nazi. If someone does not appreciate your advice, move on. Stop bitching, it is irritating.


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> this thread is an epic bitch fest!
> Poor OP


I already apologized for this. But a troll is not welcome. All we ask is 1 pic and you can't do it. Fuck you leave this thread and forum.


----------



## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> The OP's question has been answered numerous times, even after he changed the entire layout of his grow, those questions were answered as well. It isn't "poor OP", it is what a "lucky OP".


No you gave an answer that suited what you think is best not what the OP was asking.
You also kept saying 6x600w bulbs which shows you are too into stating your opinion on how "awesome" a grower you are and not about helping answer questions.
And my god are you a bitch!


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

GrnMn said:


> So what man, don't take the side of the people who aren't acting like they know everything in the universe? Or should I correct you on relays and explain to you the difference between a single pole single throw relay and a double pole single throw relay? Or that rather than saying flip-flop you should abbreviate to differentiate?
> 
> I can't say much, I've only grown pot for about 17 years. All the articles and books I've written don't account for much. Opinions are like assholes; everybody's got one. I've given up trying to preach and change the world. If someone asks me for help, I'm happy to oblige, but to try and force your account on someone is much like being a modern day nazi. If someone does not appreciate your advice, move on. Stop bitching, it is irritating.


It is funny, you are now trying to claim you need to "explain" something to me, lol. You sound just like Warlock, who brings up the most irrelevant information, for what? I'm impressed because you know what every electrician and electrical engineer on the planet knows? Double pole versus single pole, that all you got? Haha..."modern day nazi", "stop bitching, it is irritating".

Lol dude you're the only one bitching, you are the whiniest of everyone constantly popping off at the mouth. Nobody cares you've grown for 17 years, irrelevant from what we're talking about, please get your ego in check.



Warlock1369 said:


> I already apologized for this. But a troll is not welcome. All we ask is 1 pic and you can't do it. Fuck you leave this thread and forum.


Stop saying troll dude, saying it over and over doesn't make it true, just like you throwing a tantrum every time you're proven wrong won't make you right. I am sorry that you can't admit you gave poor advice, 5/600W for a 12'x4' is bad advice, just get over it already.


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> No you gave an answer that suited what you think is best not what the OP was asking.
> You also kept saying 6x600w bulbs which shows you are too into stating your opinion on how "awesome" a grower you are and not about helping answer questions.
> And my god are you a bitch!


I never said 6/600W, you haven't read any of this thread obviously. The answer I gave isn't my "opinion", it was the most efficient method of cost versus return. I am sorry you are incapable of understanding the difference.


----------



## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> I wouldn't buy that many lights, you are talking about a 12 foot table. Break that into two 6 foot sections, buy 2/1000W bulbs and throw them on light movers. A 1000W HPS' footprint is 5'x5'. Now if you have a 12x4 table it should easily be able to cover the width of that table. The interesting thing is with light movers and the footprint of (1)1000W HPS, at any given time only 1 foot on each section is going to be unlit. Plus that means you only have to move the light across a 1 foot linear path. This is the most efficient way to light the table and to save the most money. *I mean seriously, (6) 600W ballasts*? Fuck that, I guarantee the exact same yield from 2/1000W HPS on light movers covering that table. Why use so much electricity? An even better idea is to have two rooms with two 12x4 tables, buy 2/1000W HPS ballasts, buy a flip-flop relay and run both rooms on 12/12 all the time. Now you are running your ballasts 24 hours a day, lighting 2 rooms with 2, 12x4 tables. That is efficiency my friend.



What was that?


----------



## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Do I need to do the math for you (2)1000W HPS versus *(6)600W? *Let us say you pay 10 cents per kilowatt hour, and you are running these lights on a simple 12/12 schedule everyday for a year.
> 
> (2)1000W = 2kw per hour
> *(6)600W = 3.6kw per hour
> ...


Should I continue?


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 8, 2012)

Your a troll troll troll troll troll troll troll troll? Should I keep going you fucken troll. Nothing you have said or will say means shit. Your just a pos and desided to fuck up the op thread. If you went a pussy I would say meet me for lunch at echo park tomarrow. A bitch like you wouldn't even get near there.


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 8, 2012)

Or fuck it if you any where in so cal I'll meet you. If not give me the place and time to get there. 1on1 you skronny ass nerd that's been picked on on from day 1. Why? Your a bitch. Oh and trust me I'm small. 5'9" 130 lb with a gut and almost 40 years old. Still wip your ass. You fucken troll troll troll


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> Should I continue?


My the reading comprehension of the average cannabis grower, so poor...



gaztron3030 said:


> *No you gave an answer that suited what you think is best not what the OP was asking.
> You also kept saying 6x600w bulbs*


Some context...since you failed to provide any...



IndicaDom said:


> *I never said 6/600W, you haven't read any of this thread obviously.*


Someone posted saying to use (6)600W, I used that as an example to show a comparison in use of electricity...



laced23z said:


> *You should go with the six 600 watters you get more coverage*





The New Jim Jones said:


> *if your a good grower who gets a gram per watt, 5 600's is better*





IndicaDom said:


> *You are wrong, 5 x 600W is not the better bet, this has been discussed in length in this thread, please read it.*


6/600W wasn't my answer to the OP, 5/600W wasn't my answer to the OP either, learn what context is and stop looking like a freaking idiot.



Warlock1369 said:


> Your a troll troll troll troll troll troll troll troll? Should I keep going you fucken troll. Nothing you have said or will say means shit. Your just a pos and desided to fuck up the op thread. If you went a pussy I would say meet me for lunch at echo park tomarrow. A bitch like you wouldn't even get near there.


Look at how mad you are at being proven wrong, get over it.


----------



## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> My the reading comprehension of the average cannabis grower, so poor...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Actually you said that you NEVER said 6x600w and I just showed you a bunch of times you did. So what were you saying about reading comprehension?
And you also said 6 600s before anybody else if you go and read the thread.
LOL


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 8, 2012)

He is a troll. Mommy went to bed do that's why he is back online. Pussy troll troll troll troll. Grow a set and prove us wrong. Bitch ass loner.


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> No you gave an *answer that suited what you think is best not what the OP was asking*.
> *You also kept saying 6x600w bulbs*





IndicaDom said:


> *I never said 6/600W*





gaztron3030 said:


> Actually you said that you* NEVER said 6x600w* and I just showed you a bunch of times you did. So what were you saying about reading comprehension?
> *And you also said 6 600s before anybody else if you go and read the thread.*
> LOL


Post #16



laced23z said:


> You should go with the *six 600 watters* you get more coverage and fuck a light rail that shit is Jank when u can just put a light over it all the time instead of having a lite over it partially of the time


Post #27



IndicaDom said:


> Do I need to do the math for you (2)1000W HPS versus *(6)600W*? Let us say you pay 10 cents per kilowatt hour, and you are running these lights on a simple 12/12 schedule everyday for a year.


Pretty obvious that when reading IN CONTEXT, that when I said, "I never said 6/600W" it was referring to my answer to the OP's question. Which is true, I never was talking about 6/600W as an answer to the OP's question. Are you done reaching for straws now? You have poor reading comprehension and you are just looking more and more desperate, like the guy trying to challenge me to a physical fight on the internet, lol.


----------



## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

post 11 IndicaDom
But please tell me with all your wisdom does 11 come before 16 and 27?


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 8, 2012)

Well I'm out for the night gonna have sex with the mother of my kids so that indicadumb can dream about that. Oh troll troll troll. You little bitch.


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> post 11 IndicaDom
> But please tell me with all your wisdom does 11 come before 16 and 27?


Post #9


bowlfullofbliss said:


> I run 3 1000's over a 5x12 area, roughly. I really wish I had* 6 6000's* instead, so I can be a bit wider with better coverage on the sides. My hoods are the xxxl's, which are junk.


Why do I have to make you people look like morons before you will back down? Are you masochists? Next time make sure you're right before trying to be an asshole, it might not backfire as hard.


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 8, 2012)

And name a spot. I'll be there wouldn't care if you underage. I'll make you choke befor you can scream. Already looking at 8 years so what is 2 more. Bitch ass troll


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> And name a spot. I'll be there wouldn't care if you underage. I'll make you choke befor you can scream. Already looking at 8 years so what is 2 more. Bitch ass troll


You are not tough, you are just really, really sad.


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> This is post 11 so I don't know what you are on about?


Post #9



bowlfullofbliss said:


> I run 3 1000's over a 5x12 area, roughly. I really wish I had *6 6000's* instead, so I can be a bit wider with better coverage on the sides. My hoods are the xxxl's, which are junk.


You can go crawl back in your hole now worm, since you don't realize 9 comes before 11.


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 8, 2012)

And yes I'm masiockistic. Got my ol lady's real bite marks tated on me. So what is your point. Even let her lil Sis slash me with me own blade.


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

Warlock1369 said:


> And yes I'm masiockistic. Got my ol lady's real bite marks tated on me. So what is your point. Even let her lil Sis slash me with me own blade.


Yeah and you're almost 40 and fat, the point?


----------



## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Post #9
> 
> 
> Why do I have to make you people look like morons before you will back down? Are you masochists? Next time make sure you're right before trying to be an asshole, it might not backfire as hard.


Mate you are the moron,
Yea ok someone mentioned 6 600s before you, my bad. But you were still taking the original question out of context and arguing OPINION. Show me proof of your light moving theory, you say it isn't opinion but I don't see figures repeatedly confirming your theory.


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> *What was that?*





gaztron3030 said:


> *Should I continue?*





gaztron3030 said:


> *And you also said 6 600s before anybody else if you go and read the thread.
> LOL*





gaztron3030 said:


> *But please tell me with all your wisdom does 11 come before 16 and 27?*





gaztron3030 said:


> Mate you are the moron,
> *Yea ok someone mentioned 6 600s before you, my bad*. But you were still taking the original question out of context and arguing OPINION. Show me proof of your light moving theory, you say it isn't opinion but I don't see figures repeatedly confirming your theory.


Hard to argue I'm the moron wouldn't you agree? I mean you couldn't even read 9 posts in, and you think, "TAKING THE ORIGINAL QUESTION OUT OF CONTEXT", hahaha. You just can't help but try and re-frame your argument again can you?

I didn't take the question out of context, I specifically answered the OP's question and in the same paragraph commented on a person talking about 6/600W bulbs, and decided to use those numbers to crunch the cost of electricity. It isn't opinion, if you don't understand why it would cost less to run 2/1000W versus 5/600W, then I don't know what to tell you besides run the numbers yourself, or refer to post #27 of this thread.


----------



## Warlock1369 (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Yeah and you're almost 40 and fat, the point?


Point is I can and will wip your ass. And make you lick my asshole. Im a freak like that. And after 8 years it isn't gay. It's treating a bitch like a bitch.....


----------



## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

Of course it would be cheaper running 2000w over 3000, you said it effects yeild.
It's funny you say I couldn't read 9 posts in when you have been saying you didn't say things, when you have. I acknowledged my mistake but you are obviously too arrogant and pig headed.
Taking the original question out of context was the point of my argument! the OP never asked about 6 600s so regardless of whether somebody else misread the OP, you answered them instead of the original question because it suited your point better.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> Of course it would be cheaper running 2000w over 3000, you said it effects yeild.
> It's funny you say I couldn't read 9 posts in when you have been saying you didn't say things, when you have. I acknowledged my mistake but you are obviously too arrogant and pig headed.
> Taking the original question out of context was the point of my argument! the OP never asked about 6 600s so regardless of whether somebody else misread the OP, you answered them instead of the original question because it suited your point better.


Dude, when I said, "I never said 6/600W" it was referring to you saying I my answer to the OP was about 6/600W. You were wrong, you took what I said out of context, and if you put it in context, "I never said 6/600W" makes sense, and is true. Since I did answer the OP's question, I didn't bring up 6/600W, it was a comment on post #9 in this thread. You are desperate to save your fragile ego from shattering, you admitted your mistake? Yeah after acting like an ass and me having to prove you wrong, countless times. No shit the OP never asked about 6/600W and I never said he did, there you go again trying to re-frame the argument to make yourself feel right. I answered the OP, and if you don't understand my answer I can explain it again. 

The use of 6/600W in my chart to show use of electricity is an example. I never brought up 6/600W, why can't you get that? Why are you still desperately reaching for a failed argument? Ironic you are trying to say I'm arguing to suit my point, lol.


----------



## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

You obviously just want to state your "superiority" to people. 
LOL my fragile ego from shattering, how long and with how many people have you desperately been trying to prove your OPINION to? I'm not an egotistical person so I don't need to save anything.
I doubt you have put much of your OPINIONs to work as the others have stated, you are probably some smoker who reads alot. 
You can nit pick all you want. The fact remains you are all talk.


----------



## OLD DUDE (Oct 8, 2012)

I'm tired of this moron but, thought I would share what he thinks about how I clone I use an Aero cloner and have a 99% success rate! Others came up with it and I just copied and cherry picked things that different people did until I came to that rate. But, according to him, I'm doing it all wrong because that is not how they do it in a lab he needs to stick to making meth in his fucking trailer lab!!


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

Aw, I see indicadom is back with his undeniable logic. Getting his panties in a bunch because people don't give a shit about what he knows. You may know a thing or two about growing, any tool can read articles on the internet. Where's the pictures of your grow buddy. Oh right, you don't have any because you still live at home with mommy. You're pissed off at us because we can and do grow. You can't, all you can do is read and pretend you've grown. What a joke. You're probably heading off to high school right now so I guess we'll have to wait a while to read more of your bullshit.


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## bluntmassa1 (Oct 8, 2012)

OLD DUDE said:


> I'm tired of this moron but, thought I would share what he thinks about how I clone I use an Aero cloner and have a 99% success rate! Others came up with it and I just copied and cherry picked things that different people did until I came to that rate. But, according to him, I'm doing it all wrong because that is not how they do it in a lab he needs to stick to making meth in his fucking trailer lab!!


lol, I must really be doing it wrong I use pro-mix bx in a seed starter with a heat pad and 7" humidity dome wrapped with mylar and the biggest cfl I could find in walmart. it may not be the best but I get atleast 90% success which is good enough for me that I have no reason to switch unless I start doing hydro.


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## nick88 (Oct 8, 2012)

Damn, i knew i went to bed too early last night. Shit, its too early for pop corn. Where's by bowl and pop tarts then?


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> You obviously just want to state your "superiority" to people.
> LOL my fragile ego from shattering, how long and with how many people have you desperately been trying to prove your OPINION to? I'm not an egotistical person so I don't need to save anything.
> I doubt you have put much of your OPINIONs to work as the others have stated, you are probably some smoker who reads alot.
> You can nit pick all you want. The fact remains you are all talk.


Look at the numbers, it isn't an opinion, you are wrong. Get over it! 



OLD DUDE said:


> I'm tired of this moron but, thought I would share what he thinks about how I clone I use an Aero cloner and have a 99% success rate! Others came up with it and I just copied and cherry picked things that different people did until I came to that rate. But, according to him, I'm doing it all wrong because that is not how they do it in a lab he needs to stick to making meth in his fucking trailer lab!!


Another insecure person trying to use their baseless results as a generalized method, horrible. "ALL WRONG", who said that? Lol, your little ego hurt? 



bluntmassa1 said:


> lol, I must really be doing it wrong I use pro-mix bx in a seed starter with a heat pad and 7" humidity dome wrapped with mylar and the biggest cfl I could find in walmart. it may not be the best but I get atleast 90% success which is good enough for me that I have no reason to switch unless I start doing hydro.


You have a good rate of success, now imagine 1000 clones, 10% is quite a bit of loss, and 1000 is a rather low amount of plants. Why do you think the government gets so bent out of shape about plant numbers? You people are in the dark.


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

I can tell you live on the east coast. What grade are you in? Nobody ever argued that you don't know what you're talking about. I think you are pretty book smart. But where's your grow? It's ok to not have one or have never grown, but don't start being a dick because people are calling you out on it.

If you were so secure you wouldn't be scared to post pictures of your grow or admit you don't have one. You're the insecure one buddy.


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> I can tell you live on the east coast. What grade are you in? Nobody ever argued that you don't know what you're talking about. I think you are pretty book smart. But where's your grow? It's ok to not have one or have never grown, but don't start being a dick because people are calling you out on it.
> 
> If you were so secure you wouldn't be scared to post pictures of your grow or admit you don't have one. You're the insecure one buddy.


I'm not in any grade, I've completed my formal education. "Have never grown", whatever you say pal, but every time you give incorrect information don't throw such a tantrum when I'm there proving you wrong for the greater good.


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## OLD DUDE (Oct 8, 2012)

He's just like the Herpies, just won't go away!!


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## dirty11 (Oct 8, 2012)

whats up family, im trying to customize a grow tent and was wondering if 1000 watt dimmable ballast was too much or just right for 55x55x79? also if the 1000w is ok then how close can i run my lights to plants ?


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> I'm not in any grade, I've completed my formal education. "Have never grown", whatever you say pal, but every time you give incorrect information don't throw such a tantrum when I'm there proving you wrong for the greater good.


I'm not throwing a tantrum. Who's the one telling everybody they're insecure? Oh right, you.



OLD DUDE said:


> He's just like the Herpies, just won't go away!!


Quite scary isn't it.


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## cannabineer (Oct 8, 2012)

dirty11 said:


> whats up family, im trying to customize a grow tent and was wondering if 1000 watt dimmable ballast was too much or just right for 55x55x79? also if the 1000w is ok then how close can i run my lights to plants ?


Yes, and maintain at least two feet from tops to bulb axis. Your grow area temps will also have an effect on minimum practical distance. cn


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

dirty11 said:


> whats up family, im trying to customize a grow tent and was wondering if 1000 watt dimmable ballast was too much or just right for 55x55x79? also if the 1000w is ok then how close can i run my lights to plants ?


Never buy dimmable ballasts, or digital ballasts.


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## cannabineer (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Never buy dimmable ballasts, or digital ballasts.


Why do you dislike digital ballasts so strongly? cn


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Never buy dimmable ballasts, or digital ballasts.


Better listen to God. If you don't he will start calling you names. All the while not proving any of his claims with anything other than words repeated.



cannabineer said:


> Why do you dislike digital ballasts so strongly? cn


Probably because his internet research says magnetic ballasts give you optimal lumen. He has no real proof though. Don't ask for it either, he will start calling you names.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

cannabineer said:


> Why do you dislike digital ballasts so strongly? cn


In my experience they just aren't as efficient, the technology isn't quite there yet. The pulse to fire up the bulb isn't as smooth and this causes your bulbs to wear out faster, also I never buy these $90+ bulbs, that is just marketing hype the same as the car audio industry. Maybe in 5 - 10 years the digital ballasts might be worth it, but when I can buy a 1000W and wire it up myself for under $100, you just can't beat that type of durability and price.



mr2shim said:


> Better listen to God. If you don't he will start calling you names. All the while not proving any of his claims with anything other than words repeated.
> 
> 
> 
> Probably because his internet research says magnetic ballasts give you optimal lumen. He has no real proof though. Don't ask for it either, he will start calling you names.


Should I link you to some articles? I am not sure if you would be able to comprehend the terminology, but I am totally willing to share my resources with you.


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

I'd rather you show me your pretend grow. I've read plenty of articles stating what I said. Oh right, you are God and wrote the book on cannabis cultivation.


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## cannabineer (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> In my experience they just aren't as efficient, the technology isn't quite there yet. The pulse to fire up the bulb isn't as smooth and this causes your bulbs to wear out faster, also I never buy these $90+ bulbs, that is just marketing hype the same as the car audio industry. Maybe in 5 - 10 years the digital ballasts might be worth it, but when I can buy a 1000W and wire it up myself for under $100, you just can't beat that type of durability and price.
> 
> 
> 
> Should I link you to some articles? I am not sure if you would be able to comprehend the terminology, but I am totally willing to share my resources with you.


I understand the bit about the power pulse being rougher on the bulb. However, I formerly ran magnetics and now have a digital, and it's served me quite well. In operation, my digital has not proven inferior. I'm not using "digital-spec" bulbs but don't really care, since I'm gonna run them for much less than their rated life. I would call it a matter of taste rather than a growroom commandment. cn


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

cannabineer said:


> I understand the bit about the power pulse being rougher on the bulb. However, I formerly ran magnetics and now have a digital, and it's served me quite well. In operation, my digital has not proven inferior. I'm not using "digital-spec" bulbs but don't really care, since I'm gonna run them for much less than their rated life. I would call it a matter of taste rather than a growroom commandment. cn


Everything you implement in your garden, in my opinion should be tested by scaling it up in costs. Digital ballasts eat through bulbs, I doubt most people on here measure the intensity of a fresh bulb and every month there after. You need to be replacing bulbs not based on how much time has elapsed, but how much intensity they have lost over time. Digital ballasts will eat through bulbs, and if you do buy any type of grow bulb that is going to cost you more money.

If we were running 50 lights, all digital ballasts right off the bat let us look at costs of us wiring it ourselves and buying possible 50 ballasts 1000W. Ebay has them averaging at around $250 per ballast, not including a bulb, a Lumatek digital ballast.

50 x 250 = $12,500, quite a bit of money if you ask me, and I realize most people on here have very small arrangements, but it is impossible to see the difference in cost without scaling up your grow. Not everyone is going to do this, it is simply a model to follow.

1000bulbs.com, Plusrite 1000W ballast, 10+ @ $90 a pop.

50 x 90 = $4,500, now I don't know about you, but over the course of a grow, digital ballasts just don't perform as well when looking at cost versus benefit.


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## cannabineer (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Everything you implement in your garden, in my opinion should be tested by scaling it up in costs. Digital ballasts eat through bulbs, I doubt most people on here measure the intensity of a fresh bulb and every month there after. You need to be replacing bulbs not based on how much time has elapsed, but how much intensity they have lost over time. Digital ballasts will eat through bulbs, and if you do buy any type of grow bulb that is going to cost you more money.
> 
> If we were running 50 lights, all digital ballasts right off the bat let us look at costs of us wiring it ourselves and buying possible 50 ballasts 1000W. Ebay has them averaging at around $250 per ballast, not including a bulb, a Lumatek digital ballast.
> 
> ...


I have no issue with any of this. I am a one-lamp grower however, since I'm meeting a hobbyist/medicinal need and sell none of my crop. Should I have reason to expand, I'll keep those ballasts in mind. Fabricating a case wouldn't be a great hardship. cn


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## boedhaspeaks (Oct 8, 2012)

@indicadom
Still love to see your growroom, next year i want to expand my growroom and like to see how you did it.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

boedhaspeaks said:


> @indicadom
> Still love to see your growroom, next year i want to expand my growroom and like to see how you did it.


I will never post pictures of my grow, sorry.


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> I will never post pictures of my grow, sorry.


And I will never post pics of the Loch Ness Monster which I have chained in my back yard


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> And I will never post pics of the Loch Ness Monster which I have chained in my back yard


You're kidding right! So do I! They must be brothers. Bigfoot helped me find it. Took prolly 3 minutes. I have a meeting with Batman tomorrow to help me track down Robin Hood. Son of a bitch stole my gold the leprechaun gave me when I reached the end of the rainbow


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> You're kidding right! So do I! They must be brothers. Bigfoot helped me find it. Took prolly 3 minutes. I have a meeting with Batman tomorrow to help me track down Robin Hood. Son of a bitch stole my gold the leprechaun gave me when I reached the end of the rainbow


I bet those guys have all seen IndicaDoms grow. Being from the same realm of reality as his plants.


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> I bet those guys have all seen IndicaDoms grow. Being from the same realm of reality as his plants.


Good point, I should contact Batman to take pictures of IndicaDom's grow. You know he has all kind of gadgets in that utility belt. A camera is bound to be amongst them.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> Good point, I should contact Batman to take pictures of IndicaDom's grow. You know he has all kind of gadgets in that utility belt. A camera is bound to be amongst them.


Accept it or don't, doesn't alter my world.


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Accept it or don't, doesn't alter my world.


Is Thor your neighbor?

BTW, congrats on your 200th useless troll post.


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## cannabineer (Oct 8, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> Good point, I should contact Batman to take pictures of IndicaDom's grow. You know he has all kind of gadgets in that utility belt. A camera is bound to be amongst them.


~cannot resist~ cn


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> Is Thor your neighbor?
> 
> BTW, congrats on your 200th useless troll post.


Who cares about post count? I have probably contributed more accurate and useful information in 200 posts than in your 3,000+. Start focusing on the goal, efficient growing.


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Who cares about post count? I have probably contributed more accurate and useful information in 200 posts than in your 3,000+. Start focusing on the goal, efficient growing.


Thank you for the lol. You wish you were helpful. Do your parents hate you? Is that why you come here and act like a badass? Get picked on at school? You can go to your school counselor for that. Fantasy is better than reality for you. Is that why you refuse to stop living in it?


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Who cares about post count? I have probably contributed more accurate and useful information in 200 posts than in your 3,000+. Start focusing on the goal, efficient growing.



Not everybody has that goal, some grow for enjoyment or cheap smoke so being super efficient isn't everything. I bet you sell your "efficiently" grown herbs to kids etc


----------



## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> Thank you for the lol. You wish you were helpful. *Do your parents hate you?* Is that why you come here and* act like a badass*? *Get picked on at school?* You can go to your* school counselor for that*. *Fantasy is better than reality for you. Is that why you refuse to stop living in it?*


Derp, derp, derp...


----------



## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> Not everybody has that goal, some grow for enjoyment or cheap smoke so being super efficient isn't everything. I bet you sell your "efficiently" grown herbs to kids etc


I grow for enjoyment and not having to pay for smoke. I don't give two shits about what's most efficient or what gets me the best yield. i like my setup and I will continue using it. Billy badass over here can't seem to grasp that's what most of us here are doing.


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## a mongo frog (Oct 8, 2012)

dammmm, were still debating here. thank god. i thought it would of been over now. just got off work sorry im late.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> Not everybody has that goal, some grow for enjoyment or cheap smoke so being super efficient isn't everything. *I bet you sell your "efficiently" grown herbs to kids etc*


Lol, what? Well if someone does want to know how to grow efficiently they will read what I have to say, and if they want to know how to grow cheap smoke they will listen to what I have to say, and if they want to grow for enjoyment then they will simply follow what everyone has to say, either way, my input is reaching someone in a positive manner. Stop hating, get on board or get left at the station.


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Lol, what? Well if someone does want to know how to grow efficiently they will read what I have to say, and if they want to know how to grow cheap smoke they will listen to what I have to say, and if they want to grow for enjoyment then they will simply follow what everyone has to say, either way, my input is reaching someone in a positive manner. Stop hating, get on board or get left at the station.


So basically you want people to listen to you. You are a sad person. You need therapy. Or you need to learn to stand up for yourself in real life, not just on the internet. Go to school tomorrow and kick those bullies in the nuts. I know you can little buddy!


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## a mongo frog (Oct 8, 2012)

Dom, what u have to really realize is that everyone grows different. your definition of efficient from a thread before was
hey through 100 in a tent under one 1k boom 20 pounds. that efficiency would get most of us thrown in jail. we have plant counts to contend with here. now if u were to through 12-14 plants in that same tent people on this forum would blow u out the water. dont get me wrong your way of throwing 300 plants into one tent growing mini girls is awsome, but would never be tried by me or most people on this site. again remember every one grows different. its always been that way.


----------



## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Lol, what? Well if someone does want to know how to grow efficiently they will read what I have to say, and if they want to know how to grow cheap smoke they will listen to what I have to say, and if they want to grow for enjoyment then they will simply follow what everyone has to say, either way, my input is reaching someone in a positive manner. Stop hating, get on board or get left at the station.



My smoke costs me next to nothing as I grow veges indoors also so they pay for the power & nutrients, My system is very efficient for the setup costs.
You seem to think that you know the only efficient way, Your advise may be valid but it's the way you tell everyone they are wrong and you are right. There are many ways to get a result and I'm sure there are plenty of more efficient and cheaper ways than yours. So why would anyone listen to you when you are so arrogant and egotistical?


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

My setup only costs me 18 bucks a month in power and the yearly bottle of nova bloom. So far I've probably grown 7-8 grand worth of bud and the setup cost me $550 bucks. I'd say that's pretty damn efficient. And I have a digital ballast and have used the same bulbs too! I bet Dom is going to shit a cow after reading this blasphemy.

I would have a lot more but I only grow once a year.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

a mongo frog said:


> Dom, what u have to really realize is that everyone grows different. your definition of efficient from a thread before was
> hey through 100 in a tent under one 1k boom 20 pounds. that efficiency would get most of us thrown in jail. we have plant counts to contend with here. now if u were to through 12-14 plants in that same tent people on this forum would blow u out the water. dont get me wrong your way of throwing 300 plants into one tent growing mini girls is awsome, but would never be tried by me or most people on this site. again remember every one grows different. its always been that way.


You get thrown in jail by being stupid, doing things like running too much electricity for your house, stealing electricity, telling other people about your grow, showing other people your grow. Are you trying to tell me someone running a 1000W is going to get busted? Pfff, if someone wants to know how to save money, save time, save energy, and get good smoke they will try and understand what I am speaking about. Nobody on this forum is going to blow me out of the water with 12-14 plants, you are ignorant. 



gaztron3030 said:


> My smoke costs me next to nothing as I grow veges indoors also so they pay for the power & nutrients, My system is very efficient for the setup costs.
> You seem to think that you know the only efficient way, Your advise may be valid but it's the way you tell everyone they are wrong and you are right. There are many ways to get a result and I'm sure there are plenty of more efficient and cheaper ways than yours. So why would anyone listen to you when you are so arrogant and egotistical?


There is a more efficient way for you to grow, yes, and if you want to post up some pictures of your layout we can all put our heads together and help you come up with a better way. There is only one "most efficient" method in terms of cost versus return. You grow for fun, that is cool, but if someone wants to be a serious grower they can read what I'm saying.


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> There is a more efficient way for you to grow, yes, and if you want to post up some pictures of your layout we can all put our heads together and help you come up with a better way. There is only one "most efficient" method in terms of cost versus return. You grow for fun, that is cool, but if someone wants to be a serious grower they can read what I'm saying.


LOL! No you did not ask for pictures of his layout. Holy hell that made me laugh. How about YOU show pictures of your layout. Or is that crayon drawing not finished yet?


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

Dom sent me a picture of his setup.


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> There is a more efficient way for you to grow, yes, and if you want to post up some pictures of your layout we can all put our heads together and help you come up with a better way. There is only one "most efficient" method in terms of cost versus return. You grow for fun, that is cool, but if someone wants to be a serious grower they can read what I'm saying.


HAHAHAHAha ha ha
Please! how the hell do you know anything about my grow or how efficient it is? There is one "most efficient" way to each _specific_ environment but to say there is one way for all growing styles is just ignorant.
I don't risk getting thrown in jail or a criminal record for "fun" I grow because I enjoy gardening and I want a product I know is better quality than street deals and cheaper.
LOL so we have to be a tool with lots of words to be a serious grower huh? If someone wants to spend a whole lot of useless time and cash, only to realise their friend who spent half the amount of cash is pulling the same quantity and quality then yes they should listen to you


----------



## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> HAHAHAHAha ha ha
> Please! how the hell do you know anything about my grow or how efficient it is? There is one "most efficient" way to each _specific_ environment but to say there is one way for all growing styles is just ignorant.
> I don't risk getting thrown in jail or a criminal record for "fun" I grow because I enjoy gardening and I want a product I know is better quality than street deals and cheaper.
> LOL so we have to be a tool with lots of words to be a serious grower huh? If someone wants to spend a whole lot of useless time and cash, only to realise their friend who spent half the amount of cash is pulling the same quantity and quality then yes they should listen to you


Why do you hate God? Did you not know IndicaDom spelled backwards is God?!


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## dirty11 (Oct 8, 2012)

ok thx. as far as the reflectors to use , a 8" cool tube wud prob b the best outfit?


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## OLD DUDE (Oct 8, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> LOL! No you did not ask for pictures of his layout. Holy hell that made me laugh. How about YOU show pictures of your layout. Or is that crayon drawing not finished yet?


I actually laughed out loud before I read your post


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

dirty11 said:


> ok thx. as far as the reflectors to use , a 8" cool tube wud prob b the best outfit?


I use a 6" for my 400w. So I would say yes, go with the 8" cool tube


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> *if you want* to post up some pictures of your layout





mr2shim said:


> LOL!* No you did not ask for pictures of his layout*. Holy hell that made me laugh. How about YOU show pictures of your layout. Or is that crayon drawing not finished yet?


I said if he wanted to, I don't really care either way, and I already told you what my layout is and if you want me to draw you a picture I can?



gaztron3030 said:


> HAHAHAHAha ha ha
> Please! how the hell do you know anything about my grow or how efficient it is? There is one "most efficient" way to each specific environment but to say there is one way for all growing styles is just ignorant.
> I don't risk getting thrown in jail or a criminal record for "fun" I grow because I enjoy gardening and I want a product I know is better quality than street deals and cheaper.
> LOL so we have to be a tool with lots of words to be a serious grower huh? If someone wants to spend a whole lot of useless time and cash, only to realise their friend who spent half the amount of cash is pulling the same quantity and quality then yes they should listen to you


You're wrong, there is one efficient growing style period, and it is large plant numbers and small veg times.


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

You already sent me a picture of your actual setup buddy.



IndicaDom said:


> You're wrong, there is one efficient growing style period, and it is large plant numbers and small veg times.


Most efficient for your pretend situation. For me it's one plant, scrog in a waterfarm. 8-10oz of high quality cannabis will last me quite a long time.


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

> *Why do you hate God? Did you not know IndicaDom spelled backwards is God?! *


The 10 commandments of IndicaDom



Spend all your cash on equipment
Listen to one person only for advise
Be efficient
Be MORE efficient
You still aren't being efficient enough
Always listen to something written or spoken 
Never take self experience and study as real info
Be EVEN MORE efficient
Tell everybody you know all and they are inferior in every way.
Realise you weren't efficient enough which is why you suck and be more efficient next time


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> The 10 commandments of IndicaDom
> 
> 
> 
> ...


LOL! Golden.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> You already sent me a picture of your actual setup buddy.
> 
> 
> 
> Most efficient for your pretend situation. For me it's one plant, scrog in a waterfarm. 8-10oz of high quality cannabis will last me quite a long time.


That is cool, but not the most efficient way you could grow.




gaztron3030 said:


> The 10 commandments of IndicaDom
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I always advocate less equipment and less electricity, you're bad at trying hard.


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> That is cool, but not the most efficient way you could grow.


Until you have tried every possible way to grow you can not come to that conclusion. Oh wait, dammit. You're God. You've done everything.


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> That is cool, but not the most efficient way you could grow.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


light movers doesn't seem to be on the "less" equipment list


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## boedhaspeaks (Oct 8, 2012)

Less electricity and equipment , that sounds like guerillafarming. No moving parts except the sun sofar as i know.


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## a mongo frog (Oct 8, 2012)

did any one ever read the thread Dom started a while back? the one where he trolled himself off it.


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

a mongo frog said:


> did any one ever read the thread Dom started a while back? the one where he trolled himself off it.


Says he's only been a member for a few days and has no threads started.


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## a mongo frog (Oct 8, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> Says he's only been a member for a few days and has no threads started.


really, fuck i thought this was the guy who.... wait this guy started a new account. iam sure of it. ill try and find it.


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

His mom probably called him for dinner. That's why he all the sudden stopped posting. He'll be back in a bit to continue his bullshit.


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## a mongo frog (Oct 8, 2012)

i found it but how do i post the link to the thread. can some one do it. 
its a must read. 4 lbs per 1000w light. is the thread


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

https://www.rollitup.org/indoor-growing/563009-4-lbs-per-1000w-light.html

That?


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## a mongo frog (Oct 8, 2012)

yes, is this the same guy?


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

Would not be surprised.


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## DrOfWelshMagic (Oct 8, 2012)

obrienross1123 said:


> dude honestly more watts=more bud plain and simple and 600s are the most efficient energy consumption to lumen output plus it will be better coverage


yep. i'd go along with that


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

Don't think so that guy got really septic and started using really offensive names etc lol
Unless IndicaDom is him on ritalin?
Or maybe mummy gave him a good spanking and told him to watch his mouth?


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

Probably same kid, realized being a complete tool will get you banned. So he took it down a few notches, still is a huge douche though. Making ridiculous claims with no proof. Probably him, then again a lot of people do that here.


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

Yeah I'd say you are right. 
Lol I'm too paranoid at the moment to post pics but I'm taking some as I go and will post when I've cleaned the house ready to move and the paranoia's got no fuel lol.
Then again I don't think I make any ridiculous claims that need proving.


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

It's usually when you start making stupid ridiculous claims people ask for pictures. You shouldn't be too paranoid about it. Use a proxy and go to some wifi hotspot around down if you're really concerned.


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> It's usually when you start making stupid ridiculous claims people ask for pictures. You shouldn't be too paranoid about it. Use a proxy and go to some wifi hotspot around down if you're really concerned.


I'm only a couple weeks away so might just wait, I live rural so don't to get to town often. what's the deal with a proxy?


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

gaztron3030 said:


> I'm only a couple weeks away so might just wait, I live rural so don't to get to town often. what's the deal with a proxy?


Makes it a bit more difficult to trace.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proxy_server


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## stumpjumper (Oct 8, 2012)

The guy lost me when he claimed cervantes as being a "knowledgeable grower".. Lmao that in itself gives away that he doesn't know shit other then what he's read. 

He also continually states he's pursuing the most efficient way to grow, yet he isn't open to anybodys advise other than the shit he spews himself. 


Anyways, The ignore button is your friend.


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## mr2shim (Oct 8, 2012)

Thank you for noticing! Although I must admit, it has been rather entertaining.


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## supchaka (Oct 8, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Lol, what? Well if someone does want to know how to grow efficiently they will read what I have to say, and if they want to know how to grow cheap smoke they will listen to what I have to say, and if they want to grow for enjoyment then they will simply follow what everyone has to say, either way, my input is reaching someone in a positive manner. Stop hating, get on board or get left at the station.


You've constantly talked about what's more efficient, cost effective etc. The original post said quite simply which lighting setup would provide the most coverage. The answer, without a fucking bit of doubt is 5 600's. Question answered, thread complete.


Just to throw out a bit more info that wasn't asked for, 3k watts whether its by 3 1k's or 5 600's is going to out yield 2 1k's on a light mover, all day, every fucking day. I know because I've seen it firsthand, not read in a book. Rails are good for vegging but no serious (intelligent) grower is going to flower with them. Especially when you are dealing with grows with wattage in the thousands. Commercial op's are about one thing and that is yield. 


You're welcome.


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## cannabineer (Oct 8, 2012)

supchaka said:


> You've constantly talked about what's more efficient, cost effective etc. The original post said quite simply which lighting setup would provide the most coverage. The answer, without a fucking bit of doubt is 5 600's. Question answered, thread complete.
> 
> 
> Just to throw out a bit more info that wasn't asked for, 3k watts whether its by 3 1k's or 5 600's is going to out yield 2 1k's on a light mover, all day, every fucking day. I know because I've seen it firsthand, not read in a book. Rails are good for vegging but no serious (intelligent) grower is going to flower with them. Especially when you are dealing with grows with wattage in the thousands. Commercial op's are about one thing and that is yield.
> ...


supchaka,

how would you arrange those five lamps over a 4x12? cn


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## supchaka (Oct 8, 2012)

Personally I wouldn't use that many lights, but if you gave me the space and lights and said do it, It would be something like this... After drawing it I realized I used one too many lights! I'm getting greedy! So subtract a light and shift them all over a bit. Choo know what I mean, stagger them.


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## HeartlandHank (Oct 8, 2012)

I would do 4-600s or 3-1ks. 5-600s over 4x12 would make for an odd layout.
4-600s with silver star reflectors, in-line. each light covering a 4x3. Or, 3 1ks, each a 4x4, whatever reflector.

If you have the ability to cool 3 1ks, and you have the height to house 1k's, i would think you would get more weight with the 1ks. Probably more efficient with 4-600s though.

I like 600s covering a 4x3 with silver stars. 4 plants per light. 13-15 oz per light with higher yielding genetics.

Make sure you are realizing the cooling needs of 3 1ks. not just aircooling, but air conditioning as well. 4 600s cool much easier than 3 1ks. As always, just my opinions.


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## stumpjumper (Oct 8, 2012)

I would use 3 600's.. I lst though and could argue that lst'ing all your plants under 600's is going to be more efficient than using 2 1000's for sure.

I'm not here to argue though, I know what I can do by experience and 1 600 is all you need for a 4'x4' area, you would have perfect coverage with 3 600's. If you plan on growing 6' trees then you would be better off with 100's just because they penetrate more, but talking efficiency, lsting your plants and keeping a thick even canopy is more efficient then trees, imo.

That's what works for me. I won't persecute you for having a different opinion, until you disrespect me for having one of my own.


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## a mongo frog (Oct 8, 2012)

stumpjumper said:


> I would use 3 600's.. I lst though and could argue that lst'ing all your plants under 600's is going to be more efficient than using 2 1000's for sure.
> 
> I'm not here to argue though, I know what I can do by experience and 1 600 is all you need for a 4'x4' area, you would have perfect coverage with 3 600's. If you plan on growing 6' trees then you would be better off with 100's just because they penetrate more, but talking efficiency, lsting your plants and keeping a thick even canopy is more efficient then trees, imo.
> 
> That's what works for me. I won't persecute you for having a different opinion, until you disrespect me for having one of my own.


oh he will, were all just a bunch of did shits.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

stumpjumper said:


> The guy lost me when he claimed cervantes as being a "knowledgeable grower".. Lmao that in itself gives away that he doesn't know shit other then what he's read.
> 
> He also continually states he's pursuing the most efficient way to grow, yet he isn't open to anybodys advise other than the shit he spews himself.
> 
> Don't worry, if this shit keeps up he wont be around long.


I said Jorge Cervantes was a very experienced grower, but not a God, the God's exist in the laboratories across the globe. Your reading comprehension is comparable to these other hethens.




supchaka said:


> You've constantly talked about what's more efficient, cost effective etc. The original post said quite simply which lighting setup would provide the most coverage. The answer, without a fucking bit of doubt is 5 600's. Question answered, thread complete.
> 
> 
> Just to throw out a bit more info that wasn't asked for, 3k watts whether its by 3 1k's or 5 600's is going to out yield 2 1k's on a light mover, all day, every fucking day. I know because I've seen it firsthand, not read in a book. Rails are good for vegging but no serious (intelligent) grower is going to flower with them. Especially when you are dealing with grows with wattage in the thousands. Commercial op's are about one thing and that is yield.
> ...


Inefficient, sorry you're wrong.




supchaka said:


> *Personally I wouldn't use that many lights*, but if you gave me the space and lights and said do it, It would be something like this... After drawing it I realized I used one too many lights! I'm getting greedy! So subtract a light and shift them all over a bit. Choo know what I mean, stagger them.


You people contradict yourself at every corner.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

stumpjumper said:


> I would use 3 600's.. I lst though and could argue that lst'ing all your plants under 600's is going to be more efficient than using 2 1000's for sure.
> 
> I'm not here to argue though, I know what I can do by experience and 1 600 is all you need for a 4'x4' area, you would have perfect coverage with 3 600's. If you plan on growing 6' trees then you would be better off with 100's just because they penetrate more, but talking efficiency, lsting your plants and keeping a thick even canopy is more efficient then trees, imo.
> 
> That's what works for me. I won't persecute you for having a different opinion, until you disrespect me for having one of my own.


No it isn't because you don't understand that he isn't vegging his plants, LST? Get out of here dude, and 2/1000W on a light mover is the most cost effective way to light those tables, period, end of discussion. The numbers have been ran, sorry. LSTing is for hobby growers.


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## cannabineer (Oct 8, 2012)

supchaka said:


> Personally I wouldn't use that many lights, but if you gave me the space and lights and said do it, It would be something like this... After drawing it I realized I used one too many lights! I'm getting greedy! So subtract a light and shift them all over a bit. Choo know what I mean, stagger them.


My point of interest is that I do not know the optimal packing of five lamps into a 4x12 rectangle. Four and six are trivial ... but five is not. cn


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## stumpjumper (Oct 8, 2012)

I have went through this guys posts and I don't really think he is a troll. You guys can't really blame someone for not wanting to post pictures, growing is still illegal federally and in most states also. Not everyone has the balls to put up incriminating pics.

This guy definitely has a unique personality and it is going to rub the vast majority here the wrong way. The worst attitude to come in to these forums with is that of "I know what I'm talking about and the rest of you are dumb asses" it don't fly and you all know those kind of guys come and go about as quick as they got here. 

Please put him on ignore instead of arguing with him. Be the bigger man. It's tough to do on a forum but keeping the fight going back and forth isn't going to solve the problem and if he is indeed trolling then getting no response is going to irritate him more than you arguing back. That's what they want you to do.

You should all know this anyways.  

There's no fun in trying to irritate people when they ignore you.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 8, 2012)

stumpjumper said:


> I have went through this guys posts and I don't really think he is a troll. You guys can't really blame someone for not wanting to post pictures, growing is still illegal federally and in most states also. Not everyone has the balls to put up incriminating pics.
> 
> This guy definitely has a unique personality and it is going to rub the vast majority here the wrong way. The worst attitude to come in to these forums with is that of "I know what I'm talking about and the rest of you are dumb asses" it don't fly and you all know those kind of guys come and go about as quick as they got here.
> 
> ...


It doesn't matter, after realizing the admins on this forum will give up personal information I will no longer be posting, your prayers are answered, have fun with bliss.


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## nick88 (Oct 8, 2012)

cannabineer said:


> My point of interest is that I do not know the optimal packing of five lamps into a 4x12 rectangle. Four and six are trivial ... but five is not. cn


Only way i see to get 5 is to run down center and narrow area used by 6in on each outside edge.


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## cannabineer (Oct 8, 2012)

I guess. I could pose it as a math problem: you have the rectangle and five dots. Place the dots so that their shortest distance from each other and from the rectangle's walls is as great as possible. I don't have the coding skills to run the sim, however. cn


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## stumpjumper (Oct 8, 2012)

Jorge Cervantes gained his knowledge from other growers, I don't think I've EVER seen a plant that he grew himself. 

Ugh I refuse to let you drag me into this bullshit however I will say that you are full of shit, nobody is giving out your personal information. Nobody even has access to it except for Rolli and the site owner. Nice try though.


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## supchaka (Oct 8, 2012)

He got you man!


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## stumpjumper (Oct 8, 2012)

Yeah I guess so lol...


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## gaztron3030 (Oct 8, 2012)

where did he get the giving personal info bit from? did I miss a post or did he just pull that out of his arse with all the rest?


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## supchaka (Oct 8, 2012)

He's from Texas apparently. Houston or DFW, Im still backtracing the DNS logs to locate his exact whereabouts so I can forward them to the proper authorities.


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## boedhaspeaks (Oct 9, 2012)

I want to use this opportunity to thank indicadom for the good laughs i got here.
Bye dude.


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## IndicaDom (Oct 9, 2012)

supchaka said:


> He's from Texas apparently. Houston or DFW, Im still backtracing the DNS logs to locate his exact whereabouts so I can forward them to the proper authorities.


Well luckily I am a cautious person who knows a little bit about network security and run a proxy so that vindictive and ignorant admins could never threaten my way of living.


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## mr2shim (Oct 9, 2012)

Is the best grower on plant earth still here or did he get banned?


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## stumpjumper (Oct 9, 2012)

I'm still here??? 

You're all just average people......


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## mr2shim (Oct 9, 2012)

hahaha. I was referring to your creator, IndicaDom


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## stumpjumper (Oct 9, 2012)

mr2shim said:


> hahaha. I was referring to your creator, IndicaDom


 I think he got mad at our admin and left... "crosses fingers"


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## bigbudahluva (Oct 9, 2012)

i do agree inicadom does get ppls backs up, but it concerned me him saying admins can give ur details out, is this true that they can?


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## mr2shim (Oct 9, 2012)

GrassCity needs to keep a tighter reins on their omnipotent wanna be growers.


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 9, 2012)

bigbudahluva said:


> i do agree inicadom does get ppls backs up, but it concerned me him saying admins can give ur details out, is this true that they can?


This is not true. That know no more then you put on when you signed up. And anyone can ping your ip but with proxys and other things it's safe.


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## stumpjumper (Oct 9, 2012)

bigbudahluva said:


> i do agree inicadom does get ppls backs up, but it concerned me him saying admins can give ur details out, is this true that they can?


NO.

Admin made a joke about cocky people "especially Texans"

Then this tool piped up and said that he was from Texas and admin gave out his location.

Then admin messaged him and said it was all a joke was he really from Texas and Tool said, no I'm not really from Texas.

If I had a ban button he would be gone without further a due.


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## nick88 (Oct 9, 2012)

If the dude is so worried bout security, why is he still on here posting? Damn dude, go lay in the corner and lick your nuts or something. Find something else to keep your feeble ass mind occupied other than coming on here with your bullshit.


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## tusseltussel (Oct 9, 2012)

What's going on in here...I personally think your all wasting your money....


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## Sencha (Oct 9, 2012)

tusseltussel said:


> What's going on in here...I personally think your all wasting your money....


I agree. 3 600s is enough.


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## Friendly Caregiver (Oct 9, 2012)

Check out my grow in my signature. 3 1000w on 6ft light movers. Covers a great space. I am in the midst of harvesting so I cannot update for a little bit, but update coming soon.


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## bigbudahluva (Oct 9, 2012)

cool, i trust riu admins then, gta be cautions as we all know a little anonymity goes along way. 3 x 1000w dam thats alot of lumens.


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## HeartlandHank (Oct 9, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> Hahahahaha, yeah you build a nuclear weapon with "common sense and experience" and I'll use engineering schematics, thanks. This is why most Americans deserve the situation their country is in, people that are unable to think critically or for themselves.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


6-9 plants per sq ft?? I know you said you are nervous about pics... but I would really like to see that. Rockwool flood and drain? I'm curious.

On a side note. You shouldn't lump all Americans into one statement like that. It's true, the general population in the US is a pretty easy target. But good, bad and neutral people are on every continent.

Back to the subject. I'de like to hear about 6-9 plants per sq ft. How tall do these plants get?


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## GrnMn (Oct 9, 2012)

IndicaDom said:


> I said Jorge Cervantes was a very experienced grower, but not a God, the God's exist in the laboratories across the globe. Your reading comprehension is comparable to these other hethens.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You fucking idiot, the knowm doesn't grow, he goes around the world taking pictures of cool ops he finds on these forums!

I bet you don't know larry or dianne or brooke or ben either...


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## Warlock1369 (Oct 9, 2012)

Jorge started off growing. And I bet he still dose. Just videos them as others. And a few other names. Nico, Dean. But if they don't work in a lab he dosnt call them good growers. So they only grow but arnt good growers.


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## OGilostmypassword (Oct 9, 2012)

Nico can't even transplant a plant properly. I have my doubts about his experience. Probably has read a lot.

Anyway, if you really want to maximize your yield, light effiency and space you should check this out:

https://www.rollitup.org/hydroponics-aeroponics/149998-heaths-flooded-tube-vertical.html


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## KP2 (Oct 9, 2012)

Looks sweet OG. We did it old school. Flat table, experimented with every type of hydro situation we could dream of. 

To all, this is Grnmn, Brooke's little brother. Brooke passed away almost three years ago, after moving to GA and marrying a member of a different web site. I've tried to access her old accounts, but either they are banned, or I can't remember her passwords. Many of you I remember from our escapades; I posted under Brooke's accounts on occasion. I remember several participants in this thread. Brooke, my sister, Kindprincess, Kindprincesss, ~kp~, KP2, Scarlette Sky, Scarlet Sky, Scarlette Skye, Scarlette_Sky, Scarlette_Skye, and a few dozen others died of a heart attack after battling cancer. 

I will try to find her diy's and tutorials and links and re-post them. To the douche bag, fuck off man. I have posted mostly bullshit, but Brooke dedicated her life to do what you're saying you're trying to do. She may have fought trolls like you on occasion, but Brooke was ALWAYS a kind and loving soul, willing to sacrifice herself and time and effort for the needs of others. I'm trying to do the same in her honor, but I'm not as sweet as she was, and I'm not terminally ill. I will say fuck you, and hope to meet you some day if you decide to be a dipshit bastard know-it-all. 

The biggest thing is you are wrong. Circumstances are always different, and most aren't in it for the money. Your information and advice is mostly irrelevant in this thread. 

The really fucked up thing is that I think I know who you are, and where you live. You didn't just make an account and start badgering for the sake of humanity. If I find out it IS who I'm thinking of, remember Brooke, and remember her brothers. If you are that person, you are thunderfucked.


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## cannabineer (Oct 9, 2012)

I miss Overgrow. cn


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## devolv (Oct 21, 2012)

legaleyes13 said:


> I know all of this, and have always used a window unit. This time around I'll probably just go with a stand up, because I feel like I get room leakage when I cut a hole in the panda plastic for the window unit. I cut holes so the back of my dehumidifier doesn't let heat in the room as well. Basically I hate A/C because I've always had trouble completely sealing my room due to it's weird dimensions and the A/C is just another added hassle.


 get a mini one ton or two ton split system... check out frost box a/c you can self install them and you put the cooling unit on the wall in ur op. then run the small piping out through ur panda wrap and that pipe goes to a small slim stand up unit outside. well...thats if you have an outside place to put it.....you could build a hot box for the outside unit and then vent it well enough to run the whole system inside. then just have the smaller venting holes. just a thought...


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## brownskin (Jan 31, 2013)

I would go with 5x600w. explaination: 3x 1000w=420,000 lumens 5x600=450,000. just saying same amount of watts but more lumens with 600


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