# 6/12 bud



## weedyoo (Jan 18, 2009)

so is any one else doing 6hr days and 12 hour night in thus that every day is really 2 days, well 2 day cycles so in your plant only mesures cycles and not hours. 

i am on my second week with this cycle the only thing i have noticed is i have bud sites in 2 weeks when it usuly takes me 3 weeks to see them. 

so i need a 14 day 220v timmer been doing it with 24 hr timmer so i need to set it every day but.


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## l3ored (Jan 18, 2009)

Interesting concept. Why 6/12 though, I would think day/night timing should be equal as with 12/12. Maybe 8/8, so you get 3 cycles every 2 days.

Take note: this is just a suggestion for an experiment, most likely won't work, but would be cool.


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## weedyoo (Jan 18, 2009)

l3ored said:


> Interesting concept. Why 6/12 though, I would think day/night timing should be equal as with 12/12. Maybe 8/8, so you get 3 cycles every 2 days.
> 
> Take note: this is just a suggestion for an experiment, most likely won't work, but would be cool.


no you need the 12 hours of night to force bud


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## RinceW (Jan 18, 2009)

Yeah, longer nights cause the flowering hormone to develop


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## Jobo (Jan 18, 2009)

It would seem that the less light during the day would mean less bud growth. right?


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## weedyoo (Jan 18, 2009)

Jobo said:


> It would seem that the less light during the day would mean less bud growth. right?


well you still get the same amount of light in 24 hours just separated by 12 hours of night 
so you have 6 light 12 night 6light 

12 /12 just not the whole 12 at a time




now i read this here and on anther site but now i cant find it.


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## RinceW (Jan 18, 2009)

so its like.. light/dark/light every day? thats just off settings it by a few hours


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## darkdestruction420 (Jan 18, 2009)

RinceW said:


> Yeah, longer nights cause the flowering hormone to develop


 this made me wonder, once i get like halfway through flowering can i go and bump the lights up to like 15 or 16 hours?


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## SARSIPPIOUS (Jan 18, 2009)

weedyoo said:


> well you still get the same amount of light in 24 hours just separated by 12 hours of night


Nope.
Extend that formula for a three day run:
Monday 12 AM: 6 ON, 12 OFF, 6 ON
Tuesday 12 AM: 12 OFF, 6 ON, 6 OFF
Wednesday 12 AM: 6 OFF, 6 ON, 12 OFF

12 hrs light for the first day,
6 hrs of light for the second day,
6 hrs of light for the third day.
You'll lose 12 hrs of light in that 36 hr span.

You've added an extra "day cycle" by lowering the plants allotted time to convert food.
It seems off to me.
The more the plant can process, the better.
More materials, a bigger house. More slop, a fatter hog.


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## pacman (Jan 18, 2009)

i smell hermies but what the fuck do i know i say try it


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## [email protected] (Jan 19, 2009)

sounds like someone feed you a load of shit....but for real i got some seeds for you they only need two hours of light a day from a flash light you can get a pound if done right....pm me...lol


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## green livin (Jan 19, 2009)

daylight isnt going to determin sex


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## [email protected] (Jan 19, 2009)

green livin said:


> daylight isnt going to determin sex


 

Stressing your plant out by changing the light cycle daily will stress it out and (may) cause it to go herrmie' or any other types of stress....seacrest out!


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## M4A1 (Jan 19, 2009)

I just read about this the other day. Here's a C+p about it. Sorry forgot who orignal posted it, but I saved it on my CPU cause I wanted to try it as well. From the sounds of it, it will not stress your plant and cause it to hermi. The uninterrupted 12 hour dark cycle is the most important and shouldn't be interrupted. That will cause hermis.



> Growing with an 18 hour Day/Night Cycle
> 
> The Theory
> The theory behind the 18 hour Day/Night cycle is that during a normal 24 hour light cycle plants will
> ...


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## M4A1 (Jan 19, 2009)

Here's where I first read about it. Thanks Hobbes for the quote above.

https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/148819-growing-18-hour-day-night.html


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## weedyoo (Jan 19, 2009)

SARSIPPIOUS said:


> Nope.
> Extend that formula for a three day run:
> Monday 12 AM: 6 ON, 12 OFF, 6 ON
> Tuesday 12 AM: 12 OFF, 6 ON, 6 OFF
> ...


no no no 

you get two 6 hr days in one day 12 hours of light just split by 12 of night

so in one day (24h) i get two days 

and again no no no you dont ever chang 12 off 


my plant is still prossing the same food its just getting more days and night 


some where on riu theis a dig thred on this but the search on this site sucks.


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## RinceW (Jan 19, 2009)

okay, but if you like, have 6 hours of light every day at the begining, and six hours of light at the end, dosen't that mean that really its just a 12/12 cycle?


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## cookin (Jan 19, 2009)

definately worth a try, i've read all that stuff about plants being most efficient at the beggining of each period so maybe, but as someone has already said you could get hermies, still try it. also i know you say they'll still get the same light, but it could speed up the cycle, don't know how adaptive weed is but instead of getting used to it they could just blitz the whole flowering bit and you end up with less but quick, don't know you'll have to see if it outweighs all that efficiency stuff(if it really is true). Let us know when you finish how it all turns out


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## l3ored (Jan 19, 2009)

RinceW said:


> okay, but if you like, have 6 hours of light every day at the begining, and six hours of light at the end, dosen't that mean that really its just a 12/12 cycle?


no, you're looking at that other guy's post who got it wrong. the title says 6/12, so its an 18 hr cycle.

I have noticed the same thing, the plants grow fastest when you first hit them with the light. This might be worth an experiment if someone is willing.


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## weedyoo (Jan 19, 2009)

RinceW said:


> okay, but if you like, have 6 hours of light every day at the begining, and six hours of light at the end, dosen't that mean that really its just a 12/12 cycle?


yes but with more days and night in 24h i get 2 days


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## weedyoo (Jan 19, 2009)

pacman said:


> i smell hermies but what the fuck do i know i say try it





[email protected] said:


> Stressing your plant out by changing the light cycle daily will stress it out and (may) cause it to go herrmie' or any other types of stress....seacrest out!


hahah i dont know what happen to some people but i find it hard to make hermis. and have verry happy plants and am a avid gardener.

so the way i am lookin at it so far i got 3 weeks worth of groth in 2 weeks what will i get in the next weeks as the first few weeks are slow going if you ask me any way. so what will happen when i get to the last weeks where groth is speedy.


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## born2killspam (Jan 19, 2009)

How much water does it drink under this regimen as opposed to standard?


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## weedyoo (Jan 19, 2009)

i only water when dry right now its once a week but i have 3 gal pots any thing smaller 1 gal needs to be watered twice a week this didnt change my water cycle is the same wait till dry 

i put 8 plants in 3gal bucket and then i fill up what ever room i got left with clones put in as soon as they root 1 4oo hps and 1 10.0 uvb temp 71


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## born2killspam (Jan 19, 2009)

I'm more interested in a water consumption comparison of each light regime over a couple weeks or so..
What if I re-word the question.. Does your soil dry as quickly as you expect it would under 12/12??


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## weedyoo (Jan 20, 2009)

born2killspam said:


> I'm more interested in a water consumption comparison of each light regime over a couple weeks or so..
> What if I re-word the question.. Does your soil dry as quickly as you expect it would under 12/12??


yes i would say i try to water less in flower any way


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## born2killspam (Jan 20, 2009)

I'm not asking about your habits.. I'm asking about your plants 'requirements under 6/12 as compared to a 12/12 regimen.. 
I read once that a cannabis plant must process about 200kg of water to grow 1kg of dried plant material.. Following that logic you can estimate your yield by comparison if you keep track of the water requirements..


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## weedyoo (Jan 20, 2009)

born2killspam said:


> I'm not asking about your habits.. I'm asking about your plants 'requirements under 6/12 as compared to a 12/12 regimen..
> I read once that a cannabis plant must process about 200kg of water to grow 1kg of dried plant material.. Following that logic you can estimate your yield by comparison if you keep track of the water requirements..


i see what you are saying i would say their useing the same amount as 12/12
i am still getting 12 hours of light in 24 hours


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## born2killspam (Jan 20, 2009)

But your counting each 6hr period twice in that math when you expand to multiple days.. There is no denying you're only getting half the light time..


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## earlymorninstonepeomp (Jan 20, 2009)

a plant will produce as much as 50% MORE trichs when given 12 as opposed to 10 hours of light. All these "light tricks" are a waste of time. 12/12 for flower.....period. Scientific fact.


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## born2killspam (Jan 20, 2009)

Thats not quite right either.. Scientifically it would depend on the phytochrome activity cycle of an idividual plant.. DJ Short writes that he has adopted ideal secret light regimes for his strains.. (Sounds a little internet braggy I know, but hey its DJ Short..)
More light hours, more UVB, and more direct light in general though are all associated with higher quality..
On the other side of the coin though, light intensity can be too high to be sustained for too long, and that is what makes this interesting.. Maximum intensity can be upped by increasing CO2, and humidity, and reducing airborn O2 levels, but there is a maximum where if the light persists too long it can actually damage the chloroplasts.. Think of it like photosynthesis red-lined..
So if you are packing most everything the plant can accomplish into those 6hrs then it could definately be beneficial.. 
Personally though I found my plants used water steadily throughout the 12hrs (I had a pretty large hydro set up that drank up to 60L/day a while back)..


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## fdd2blk (Jan 20, 2009)

weedyoo said:


> well you still get the same amount of light in 24 hours just separated by 12 hours of night
> so you have 6 light 12 night 6light
> 
> 12 /12 just not the whole 12 at a time
> ...


and then the next day you only get 6 hours of light. =/


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## weedyoo (Jan 20, 2009)

fdd2blk said:


> and then the next day you only get 6 hours of light. =/


i thought their was 24 hours in a day last i checked 

stop thinking days and think hours in 24 hours i get 6 day 12 night 6 day 

everyday the math is their i am going to keep it up for the next 6 weeks at least


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## fdd2blk (Jan 20, 2009)

weedyoo said:


> i thought their was 24 hours in a day last i checked
> 
> stop thinking days and think hours in 24 hours i get 6 day 12 night 6 day
> 
> everyday the math is their i am going to keep it up for the next 6 weeks at least


you are losing 6 hours of light. why would you do that? 

day 1- 6l/12d/6l = 24 hours

day 2- 12d/6l/6d = 24 hours


the math is NOT there. you are depleting your plants of 6 hours of light for every 24 hours of dark. they use light to grow. if anything give them 18/12. 18 being light hours


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## cookin (Jan 20, 2009)

fdd2blk said:


> you are losing 6 hours of light. why would you do that?
> 
> day 1- 6/12/6 =24 hours
> 
> ...


shit that could be cool, do plants flower because of extended darkness or shorter days? would they still flower like that???


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## weedyoo (Jan 20, 2009)

fdd2blk said:


> you are losing 6 hours of light. why would you do that?
> 
> day 1- 6l/12d/6l = 24 hours
> 
> ...


yes but 18/12 i dont think that will speed anything up. 

the reason behind the theroy is more days and night or cycles less time to bud this is not my theroy i first read it here then a few of my friends were talking about it i am going to see what happens i will keep you posted


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## cookin (Jan 20, 2009)

yeah 18/12 would take longer but i bet you'd get shit loads if it worked, yours will be quicker but have less


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## fdd2blk (Jan 20, 2009)

why would it take longer? they are getting more light. it should be faster.

you all realize this was all tried 40 years ago? this is why we all are on 12/12. it's been proven.


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## cookin (Jan 20, 2009)

fdd2blk said:


> why would it take longer? they are getting more light. it should be faster.
> 
> you all realize this was all tried 40 years ago? this is why we all are on 12/12. it's been proven.


thought it would be like when people put their lights to 14/10 ( with 14 being light) was under the impression they got more but it took longer. but yeah maybe having the 12 hours of darkness would mean it would be quicker than that one


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## earlymorninstonepeomp (Jan 20, 2009)

fdd2blk said:


> why would it take longer? they are getting more light. it should be faster.
> 
> you all realize this was all tried 40 years ago? this is why we all are on 12/12. it's been proven.


Finally........thank you.


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## weedyoo (Jan 20, 2009)

fdd2blk said:


> why would it take longer? they are getting more light. it should be faster.
> 
> you all realize this was all tried 40 years ago? this is why we all are on 12/12. it's been proven.


thanks man i got nothing better to do so i am going to give it a go and see what happens


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## born2killspam (Jan 20, 2009)

As far as biological signals regarding photoperiod go, its the length of the dark cycle that is important.. The length of daylight is only an issue in the sense that I mentioned earlier about forcing the plants to work too hard.. Read up on phytochrome if you care about why.. Its directly linked to gene expression..
Personally though, I tend to believe that nature has brought plants to where they are today nearly as efficiently as possible at a 24hr day with the natural intensity of sunlight the plant evolved under.. 
I guess I'm thinking the relationship works more as if there is an ideal number of photons a plant can absorb in a light period before it needs a break to undergo its night-time processes..
But then again, does anybody know how a healthy plant knows lights out are coming, so it can relax its leaves a few minutes before the flip?? I've only observed it, I've never seen info regarding it..


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## AeroKing (Jan 21, 2009)

fdd2blk said:


> you all realize this was all tried 40 years ago? this is why we all are on 12/12. it's been proven.


So it has nothing to do with 24hr timers being the most common and custom cycling timers being more expensive and harder to find?

The way I've heard it, a 6/12 regiment sacrifices yield for an early harvest. >12/12 sacrifices early harvest time for bigger yield.

The plant considers every night of receiving 12hrs of darkness to be one day closer to death, thereby, being able to rough out weeks/flower. With an 8 week strain, if it receives 3 of these every two days, than it will finish in 37 days rather than the normal 56 days, at a loss of yield. 

This is of course hypothetical and theoretical.


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## weedyoo (Jan 21, 2009)

thats funney cuz i am lookin hard for a 14 day 220v timmer i cant find one yet


AeroKing said:


> So it has nothing to do with 24hr timers being the most common and custom cycling timers being more expensive and harder to find?
> 
> The way I've heard it, a 6/12 regiment sacrifices yield for an early harvest. >12/12 sacrifices early harvest time for bigger yield.
> 
> ...


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## born2killspam (Jan 21, 2009)

> So it has nothing to do with 24hr timers being the most common and custom cycling timers being more expensive and harder to find?


Methinks thats sarcasm Weedyoo..


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## weedyoo (Jan 21, 2009)

born2killspam said:


> Methinks thats sarcasm Weedyoo..


well even if it is you try and find one


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## born2killspam (Jan 21, 2009)

I meant: I think the point Aeroking is making is that non-standard timers are infact pretty tough to come by, and that is a major reason why alot of ppl never wander away from the 24hr day..


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## Nocturn3 (Jan 21, 2009)

I made a post a while back on another forum regarding this very subject. I'll paste what I said here:



> I read somewhere that plants use light most efficiently for only 6 hours per day, after which efficiency drops as low as 30%. Assuming that this is true (does anyone know?), and assuming that it is the first 6 hours of the day (again, any idea?), then the most efficient photoperiod would be 6/12. With this schedule, plants should finish in 3/4 of the time, with an obvious drop in yield, but a higher GPW.
> 
> This may all be bollocks, and there are a lot of assumptions involved, but has anyone ever tried anything like this? The only practical problem I can see with trying this schedule would be that 18 hour days are a pain in the arse, with regards to timer schedules.


Anyone shed any light on the two assumptions I made, and whether there is any truth to them?


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## born2killspam (Jan 21, 2009)

Under extreme lighting conditions there may be sense to it.. Photosynthesis can hit a red-line level where not only does it stop being constructive, but can actually be destructive.. As too many electrons become too energetic, they begin to reduce things they shouldn't.. On that note though, photosynthesis doesn't just turn on like a light, but builds up like a fire.. First the energy needs to go towards builing an electron transport gradient (basically chains of molecules that redox down the line)..
Again I'm unsure about numbers/timescales, I just know thats the gist of how it goes down..


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## vicbudz (Jan 21, 2009)

weedyoo said:


> i thought their was 24 hours in a day last i checked
> 
> stop thinking days and think hours in 24 hours i get 6 day 12 night 6 day
> 
> everyday the math is their i am going to keep it up for the next 6 weeks at least


LOL!

Dude you smoke way too much pot or need to learn some basic math....so many people are trying to tell you what's very obvious....

you can't go 6 day 12 night 6 day EVERRYDAY! Think about it, and REALLY think, 

DAY 1: 6 hours of lights on, 12 off, 6 on again 
and than, DAY 2: 12 off, 6 on, 12 off 

Notice how on day 2 you are only get 6 hours of light the WHOLE DAY.

Oh, and if you are honestly giving your plants 6 on, 12 off, 6 on EVERYDAY than you are on a 12/12 cycle!!!!!!!


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## born2killspam (Jan 21, 2009)

Hes not on a 12/12 cycle as the plants see it though, nocturn had it more correct I think.. It would be interesting to see if in fact the plant came to full maturity in 3/4 the time.. (ie the same number of light cycles as normal..)..


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## weedyoo (Jan 22, 2009)

vicbudz said:


> LOL!
> 
> Dude you smoke way too much pot or need to learn some basic math....so many people are trying to tell you what's very obvious....
> 
> ...


hahah sorry
well i know i am on 6/12 as far as day one and day two. step away from our time their on their own time 6/12 

you make a good point and i guess you need to look at the big picture i guess a plant wont know its 24 hr it will only know the day and night it gets 

i dont konw if this makes any sence


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## smokinshogun (Jan 28, 2009)

umm what about "Circadian rhythm"...plants have internal clocks

you guys need to learn more about plants....

this method will not work, plain and simple......unless hermies count, of course


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## fdd2blk (Jan 28, 2009)

smokinshogun said:


> umm what about "Circadian rhythm"...plants have internal clocks
> 
> you guys need to learn more about plants....
> 
> this method will not work, plain and simple......unless hermies count, of course



"you guys"? exactly who is "you guys"?


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## smokinshogun (Jan 28, 2009)

all of "you people" who posted on this topic....plants can tell when the sun should set, and not having a 24 hour cycle would only lead to problems...at least someones thinking outside the box though


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## fdd2blk (Jan 28, 2009)

smokinshogun said:


> all of "you people" who posted on this topic....plants can tell when the sun should set, and not having a 24 hour cycle would only lead to problems...at least someones thinking outside the box though


there is only one person here who thinks outside the 24 hours. all the rest of us are telling him he's wrong. you should read the whole thread.


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## natmoon (Jan 28, 2009)

Fdd is right.
A long time ago when it was noticed that plants that had had 6 hours of direct sunlight flourished better than plants that had had 12 in a growroom it was thought possible that you might be able to recreate this effect in a growroom but in all reality what had actually happened was that the plant was in fact still in 12/12.

The 6 hour period of intense and direct sunlight was not suddenly switched off but gradually reduced as the sun went down.
So all though the plant had appeared to enjoy 6 hours,really it had had 12.
Plants can photosynthesise very low level levels of sunlight and it actually has to be almost dark for them to enter the dark phase of their cycle.

If you wanted to recreate this effect you would be better of using a dimmer switch.
As far as i can remember the theory behind it all was that sometimes to much light can stress certain strains and that some strains and because of their natural and original habit had developed an obvious rapport with the suns times for blazing in their part of the world.

Many areas of the planet are lucky to get 6-8 hours of direct sunlight and when a plant is growing outdoors you will notice that actual direct intense sunlight will in most parts of the world be gone within that amount of time.
The plant is kind of winding down imo on its lower levels of sunlight.

Maybe its because the plant has had an intense workout so to speak and then as the light levels are slowly reduced by the suns passing the plant can then absorb more water and nutes from the medium,kinda like someone whos just done a workout and then goes for food and drink to replace their spent energy.

In all reality i have no idea what i am talking about,just theories and general assumptions,lol


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## AeroKing (Jan 28, 2009)

fdd2blk said:


> there is only one person here who thinks outside the 24 hours. all the rest of us are telling him he's wrong. you should read the whole thread.


I never said he's wrong. I actually think that there may be some merit to this and I don't believe it's been properly investigated to throw it out so quickly.


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## fdd2blk (Jan 28, 2009)

AeroKing said:


> I never said he's wrong. I actually think that there may be some merit to this and I don't believe it's been properly investigated to throw it out so quickly.


well then, what is it with "you people"? lol


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## winkdogg420 (Jan 28, 2009)

every day = a day and a quater for the plants.. your tricking them into thinking time is going faster ... get it?? i would like to try this maybe in a box with one plant but you need a digital timer that doesnt run 24 hour cycles...hmmmm




weedyoo said:


> yes but with more days and night in 24h i get 2 days


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## duff420 (Jan 28, 2009)

smokinshogun said:


> umm what about "Circadian rhythm"...plants have internal clocks
> 
> you guys need to learn more about plants....
> 
> this method will not work, plain and simple......unless hermies count, of course


just sayin they do always hermie out wouldnt you be able to take the hermie seeds and grow them and wont they be more adjusted to the 18hour day? hense the strain evolving to adapt to the changed light cycle?


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## rezo (Jan 28, 2009)

ok first where can i go that gets 18 hrs of sun and then suddenly one day switches to 12 hrs of sun.???????????????? nowhere. so all indoor growers are manipulating the light cycles of plants to begin with. i think what you are doing is good i just wish you would post pics and update this thread with how the plants are doing. since none of us have said weve tried this its all on you ... you will need to do two identical grows at the same time one with a traditional 12/12 and the other with your 6/12 to see the difference in yield , growth rate, and quality.


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## duff420 (Jan 28, 2009)

i think im moving soon within the next 2 months ill be tryin this but until then lets see somone else do it!


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## weedyoo (Jan 28, 2009)

rezo said:


> ok first where can i go that gets 18 hrs of sun and then suddenly one day switches to 12 hrs of sun.???????????????? nowhere. so all indoor growers are manipulating the light cycles of plants to begin with. i think what you are doing is good i just wish you would post pics and update this thread with how the plants are doing. since none of us have said weve tried this its all on you ... you will need to do two identical grows at the same time one with a traditional 12/12 and the other with your 6/12 to see the difference in yield , growth rate, and quality.


this is not my idea just something thats been thrown around by some people on here then i met some people at harvest fest in maine and we all talked about this their. so it not new. i am having hip replacment next week and i cant find the timmer i need so i had to go back to 12/12 untill i get better.


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## fdd2blk (Jan 28, 2009)

nobody will ever do this.


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## theganman (Jan 28, 2009)

fdd2blk said:


> nobody will ever do this.



exactly what im saying if its not broke dont fix it!


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## winkdogg420 (Jan 28, 2009)

This is a stoner website...




fdd2blk said:


> nobody will ever do this.


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## smokinshogun (Jan 29, 2009)

ok where to start...

nowhere on earth provides only 6-8 hours of light without freezing, around 30 lat. the shortest day is 10 hours and anything farther north occasionally has an early frost...

I dont believe the plant would adjust to an 18 hour day, no matter what...

I know that the light cycle in nature doesnt switch from 18/6 to 12/12 naturally, but its still a 24 hour cycle. 

just look around at all the experiments done with plants in relation to their circadian rythyms and you'll realize this will never work anywhere near as well as a 24ish hour cycle

also I did read the entire topic, but was amazed no one brought up the plants internal clock...wtf?


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## duff420 (Jan 29, 2009)

i actualy am starting to think this might work. DJ short or wut ever has strains that are ment for 24/0 lighting so why cant you change it to a 18 hour day? and even if the plants clock is set to 24 hours if you keep doin this theoreticly wont each generation of the strain become more acustom to the 18 hour day?


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## smokinshogun (Jan 29, 2009)

ya...go for it

prove me wrong

but heres some info for ya
http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?tool=pubmed&pubmedid=16595397


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## born2killspam (Jan 29, 2009)

But we're aiming for the same thing they're exploring in that link.. The means by which the clock functions, and from that, how to compensatively adapt it.. Remember, the chemical mechanisms responsible often calibrate themselves to equilibriums we can shift..
I did a crop once on 21:36/12 (That makes 5 full plant days on a 7 day timer).. Probably wasn't worth it, but I did notice that my plants quickly learned when to expect lights out.. Just over 21h into a light cycle the leaves would relax, and just before lights on they'd perk back up again..


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## MrBaker (Jan 29, 2009)

Wouldn't this be a pain if you wanna use a timer? I apologize if someone brought this up already.

12pm - 6pm light
6pm - 6am dark
6am - 12pm light
12pm - 12am dark
12am - 6am light
6am - 6pm dark
6pm - 12am light
12am-12pm dark
12am - 6am light
etcetera.

Fuck that. I understand how it's supposed to cut off the less productive end period of the light hours, but I'm not making a complicated system to turn my lights on and off. I also don't know if this wouldn't affect plants negatively or not. I'm pretty sure the plants would adapt to the new hours of light/dark, but this conflicts with a personal account from a friend of mine that swears by a 16/8 flowering day.


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## YaK (Jan 29, 2009)

smokinshogun said:


> ..
> 
> I dont believe the plant would adjust to an 18 hour day, no matter what...


you can't discount evolution. 

the timer thing is really the pain in the ass, as most are for 24 hour day, which means unless someone makes an 18 hour day timer, you just have to get an on/off cycle timer. 

http://www.intelli-cycle.com/information.php

that one is 275 dollars in Australia


I think it'd be fascinating to watch a test grow with this 'theory' and figure out the whole grams per watt thing.

Humans force plants and animals to evolve constantly, quicker harvests are SO enticing! I really like the saving energy part though, as it's not cheap to run HPS lighting.


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## fdd2blk (Jan 29, 2009)

evolution happens over MILLIONS of years.


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## born2killspam (Jan 29, 2009)

I was going to mention that the length of a day used to be as short as 6hrs, but that changes REALLY slowly..


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## MrBaker (Jan 29, 2009)

Plants use a chemical system to tell time. The chemical is degrades during the day and it builds back up at night (maybe the other way around). By monitoring the levels of the chemical in accordance with other factors the plant feels, the plant can tell if its day or not, and how far into the day or night it is.

Even though, just like us, it would be a shock to start a new sleeping schedule the plant would eventually used to it. However, I do think that just like us, plants of different varieties (and even individuals) can have different needs for sleep. Humans need around 8 hours of sleep, and some people use much more or less based on their own needs. Although in this case with plants we're talking about hours of light and not dark hours, I think the same may apply. It may not apply. I'm not sure. Is 6 hours of light twice a day the same or better than one burst of 12 hrs? Some people say no. I tried sleeping for two groups of 4 hrs instead of 8 at once and it worked alright...

Let's say the plant gets used to the timing, I still don't want to spend the money on the timer or sleep weird times.


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## born2killspam (Jan 29, 2009)

Granted humans can function on an altered sleep schedule, but its been proven that best physical and mental performance occurs on a stable early to bed, early to rise schedule..


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## millosevic (Jan 29, 2009)

born2killspam said:


> Granted humans can function on an altered sleep schedule, but its been proven that best physical and mental performance occurs on a stable early to bed, early to rise schedule..



I'm not saying that i'd advise it but there are those who would disagree - look up polyphasic sleep - there is a whole range of routines (uberman is one) I believe it is a bitch to adjust to, but some people (nutters mostly) swear by it. NASA has also experimented with this and i believe that it has been in use on the international space station..

http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/2005/10/polyphasic-sleep/ 

All that said i think 12/12 suits plants best and sometimes myself!! Yawn!


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## fdd2blk (Jan 29, 2009)

well apparently marijuana at the LEAST understands what 12 hours of dark are. think about that for a while.


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## winkdogg420 (Jan 29, 2009)

hey fdd you dont think this will work even if you keep the 12 hours of dark?? i think you can switch the cycle over a few generations...





fdd2blk said:


> well apparently marijuana at the LEAST understands what 12 hours of dark are. think about that for a while.


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## fdd2blk (Jan 29, 2009)

winkdogg420 said:


> hey fdd you dont think this will work even if you keep the 12 hours of dark?? i think you can switch the cycle over a few generations...


no it won't wok. you could have grown a normal crop in the time we've all rattled on about this. 

is this a race?


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## born2killspam (Jan 29, 2009)

But it clocks those hours with (atleast) one chemical equilibrium.. The ratio of red absorbing phytochrome to far-red absorbing phytochrome.. We can trick out that equilibrium to mimick more dark time with specific light.. There are most likely deeper layers of complexity, but phytochrome manipulation has shown positive effects in many experiments..


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## weedyoo (Jan 29, 2009)

YaK said:


> you can't discount evolution.
> 
> the timer thing is really the pain in the ass, as most are for 24 hour day, which means unless someone makes an 18 hour day timer, you just have to get an on/off cycle timer.
> 
> ...


yes thank you this timmer looks like it will work for what i want i have ben doing this buy hand every day i just sped the time up 6 hr


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## YaK (Jan 29, 2009)

fdd2blk said:


> evolution happens over MILLIONS of years.


I get that you dont like the idea of this. Hows about you just dont do it? that'd be just fine.

Evolution doesnt have to take millions of years, I can define it for anyone that is confused as to what evolution actually is... but I dont really want to debate this. (I can if requested, but .. otherwise... it's just splitting hairs)

we can take a plant from clone to flower in 9 weeks , or about that anyway, which means that a lot of generations can occurr in a short amount of time, . I'm not a biologist or a geneticist, but seriously, how easy is it to test this and debunk it? a 300 dollar timer, and a curious person. BOOYAH!

I get the whole "if it aint broke... dont fix it" thing, but that doesnt drive innovation. If something works for you.. then .. GREAT, if you're curious and want to try something that sounds feasible... even better.

I remember Fdd doing the glycerine thing and not being too happy, bummer you used all that hard earned product, but now you/we know that the results are lackluster.

Pioneering rocks.


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## weedyoo (Jan 29, 2009)

YaK said:


> I get that you dont like the idea of this. Hows about you just dont do it? that'd be just fine.
> 
> Evolution doesnt have to take millions of years, I can define it for anyone that is confused as to what evolution actually is... but I dont really want to debate this. (I can if requested, but .. otherwise... it's just splitting hairs)
> 
> ...


thanks as soon as i get this timer its back on. i have spent more then that on other equip.


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## born2killspam (Jan 29, 2009)

Specialty timers can be made far cheaper than they can be purchased.. Just need some heavy-duty relays, and a couple busted gadgets to harvest the rest from..


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## winkdogg420 (Jan 29, 2009)

Post some simple plans for the 18 hour timer!! I am pretty nasty with a soldiering iron!





born2killspam said:


> specialty timers can be made far cheaper than they can be purchased.. Just need some heavy-duty relays, and a couple busted gadgets to harvest the rest from..


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## born2killspam (Jan 29, 2009)

I'm not at home, but when I have time I'll whip one up.. I was thinking of something like a simple 555 circuit tied into a counter.. 555's themselves aren't suited for day long cycles, but with a counter you can set the 555 to pulse at a higher frequency, and count its cycles..


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## winkdogg420 (Jan 29, 2009)

Cool if you could come up with a easy directions using radio shack parts i will build it and take pics..





born2killspam said:


> i'm not at home, but when i have time i'll whip one up.. I was thinking of something like a simple 555 circuit tied into a counter.. 555's themselves aren't suited for day long cycles, but with a counter you can set the 555 to pulse at a higher frequency, and count its cycles..


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## fdd2blk (Jan 29, 2009)

YaK said:


> I get that you dont like the idea of this. Hows about you just dont do it? that'd be just fine.
> 
> Evolution doesnt have to take millions of years, I can define it for anyone that is confused as to what evolution actually is... but I dont really want to debate this. (I can if requested, but .. otherwise... it's just splitting hairs)
> 
> ...



so are you doing it?


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## YaK (Jan 29, 2009)

fdd2blk said:


> so are you doing it?


I'm tempted. I dont have the cycle timer though, and it really doesnt fit my current configuration. 

Still though, I appluad anyone willing to try it. sounds hypocritical, but there are limiting factors for me.



I still love innovation, sucessful or not, even if I'm not brave enough to experiment.


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## weedyoo (Jan 30, 2009)

http://www.newsweek.com/id/180103?gt1=43002




fdd2blk said:


> evolution happens over MILLIONS of years.


are you shure about this or are you going by what you have been led to believe 

Some water fleas sport a spiny helmet that deters predators; others, with identical DNA sequences, have bare heads. What differs between the two is not their genes but their mothers' experiences. If mom had a run-in with predators, her offspring have helmets, an effect one wag called "bite the mother, fight the daughter." If mom lived her life unthreatened, her offspring have no helmets. Same DNA, different traits. Somehow, the _experience_ of the mother, not only her DNA sequences, has been transmitted to her offspring.


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## AeroKing (Jan 30, 2009)

You can see the effects that humans have had on dogs and cannabis in much shorter time spans. Maybe unassisted it may take millions of years.


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## fdd2blk (Jan 30, 2009)

all this banter and not one person has gotten off the couch. even after my constant provoking. 


maybe if we build a rocket ship and find a planet that has shorter days we can really test this out. all we need is a rocket ship.

anyone?


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## winkdogg420 (Jan 30, 2009)

i saw some rocket ship plans on google just need some solid rocket fuel!!! ill check ebay!


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## fdd2blk (Jan 30, 2009)

winkdogg420 said:


> i saw some rocket ship plans on google just need some solid rocket fuel!!! ill check ebay!



this may just work.


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## YaK (Jan 30, 2009)

winkdogg420 said:


> i saw some rocket ship plans on google just need some solid rocket fuel!!! ill check ebay!


lol, that's some funny shit. I heard about a planet today on NPR with 34 hour days, which would mean buds the size of compact cars. nice!

Only problem is, the planet has an eliptical orbit that comes within 3 million miles of it's star (sun) and the temp gets to about 2000 degrees. which would burn the car colas.


Man... I hope he gets the timer and does this, sorry to hear about your hip replacement man, here's wishing you a speedy recovery Cheers!


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## born2killspam (Jan 30, 2009)

So we need to adjust its orbit?? Count me and my atomic discombobulator (patent pending) in...


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## fdd2blk (Jan 30, 2009)

if someone were really good at problem solving, i bet they could figure out a way to run a timer to a timer to a timer to a timer and somehow make it work.


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## Where in the hell am I? (Jan 30, 2009)

weedyoo said:


> so is any one else doing 6hr days and 12 hour night in thus that every day is really 2 days, well 2 day cycles so in your plant only mesures cycles and not hours.
> 
> i am on my second week with this cycle the only thing i have noticed is i have bud sites in 2 weeks when it usuly takes me 3 weeks to see them.
> 
> so i need a 14 day 220v timmer been doing it with 24 hr timmer so i need to set it every day but.


It takes you 3 weeks in flower to see bud sites?


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## YaK (Jan 31, 2009)

fdd2blk said:


> if someone were really good at problem solving, i bet they could figure out a way to run a timer to a timer to a timer to a timer and somehow make it work.


this is like rubics cube shit. 24 x 3 = 72 , which divided by 18 = 4

So... maybe you can do it by daisy chaining 3 timers. I pounded about 5 keystones and had that same thought, timer to a timer to a timer, then I gave up and figured it'd just be easier to spend the 300 bones for a digi.

I'd still like to know though if it's possible to put timers together, if so, you'd be able to make one for less than 30 dollars.


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## YaK (Jan 31, 2009)

born2killspam said:


> So we need to adjust its orbit?? Count me and my atomic discombobulator (patent pending) in...


lol. maybe we can take the rocket schematics that someone googled, buy some solid rocket fuel on ebay, and attach the rockets to the planet to adjust it's orbit.

The planet is like... 180 light years away, so I need to do some googling to figure out how to get there with said rockets, and slave alien labor for the installation.

This could work!


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## fdd2blk (Jan 31, 2009)

YaK said:


> this is like rubics cube shit. 24 x 3 = 72 , which divided by 18 = 4
> 
> So... maybe you can do it by daisy chaining 3 timers. I pounded about 5 keystones and had that same thought, timer to a timer to a timer, then I gave up and figured it'd just be easier to spend the 300 bones for a digi.
> 
> I'd still like to know though if it's possible to put timers together, if so, you'd be able to make one for less than 30 dollars.



i recently bought a digital "sprinkler timer" from home depot. it a really nice one. it's is set-up in weeks mode. Sunday thru Saturday. i think i can set 30 different on/off times. i paid 20 s0mething dollars for it. they had a shelf full. 


nobody will do this.


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## fdd2blk (Jan 31, 2009)

all this talk of rocket ships is making me want some orange juice.


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## weedyoo (Jan 31, 2009)

Where in the hell am I? said:


> It takes you 3 weeks in flower to see bud sites?


yes on some thing that takes 10 or 11 weeks to mature

as soon as i am walking good i will be back on this time in the 4 weeks that i did this experment my plants are fine


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## winkdogg420 (Jan 31, 2009)

you could have one timer running 18 on 6 off to create the cycle. a timer plugged into that set to 6on 12off when it finishes its 6/12 the other timer will kick it off for 6 hours before it runs another 6on 12 off ,would this work???


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## winkdogg420 (Jan 31, 2009)

nope then every other cycle would be 18 off..... hmmmm


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## born2killspam (Jan 31, 2009)

I did some preliminary work on an adjustable timer.. This isn't a finished work as of yet, I'm just putting it up for discussion..
Basically the circuit operation is ICs 1&2 + adjacent components create 1 minute pulses by counting the crystal oscillations.. These pulses are further counted by ICs 4&5 in the centre.. (Currently ICs 4&5 are wired for 24hr [1440min] days before resetting, but thats easily changed to 1080 minutes or whatever..)
ICs 6&7 on the left control the delays before powerup, and powerdown after initial startup by resetting ICs 4&5 respectively.. IC4 (top centre) turns on the relay once/day through the flipflop, IC5 below turns it off once/day.. (A day is defined by how many minutes IC's 4&5 are wired for..)
(Also note that ICs 6&7 are currently wired for 1440 minutes in this picture which is nonsensical)
So the circuit is powered up.. Lets say IC6 is wired for 60min, and IC7 for 780min.. After 60 minutes it will reset IC4's count, and turn on the relay.. IC4 will keep turning it on at the same time every day period.. 6 hours later IC7 will reset IC5's count and turn off the relay.. It will keep turning it off every day period at the same time..
ICs 6&7 are just one shots, they're there to reset 4&5 at the proper time on the first cycle only, and after that they're synced to the day rythm..
It runs off 9VDC, the battery is just there to keep its time synced with reality in the case of a power outage..
I adapted this from a circuit I downloaded ages ago..


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## winkdogg420 (Jan 31, 2009)

i could prob get a breadboard and get all this stuff together but wouldnt it be easier...(start pounding head now) just to take a single ic and change it to 1080 clicks or whatever then just have that trip a relay. again you are the expert here no doubt im just trying to simplify the build for myself. im not sure how many "things" the mentioned ic's can do??

thanks winkdogg! 




born2killspam said:


> I did some preliminary work on an adjustable timer.. This isn't a finished work as of yet, I'm just putting it up for discussion..
> Basically the circuit operation is ICs 1&2 + adjacent components create 1 minute pulses by counting the crystal oscillations.. These pulses are further counted by ICs 4&5 in the centre.. (Currently ICs 4&5 are wired for 24hr [1440min] days before resetting, but thats easily changed to 1080 minutes or whatever..)
> ICs 6&7 on the left control the delays before powerup, and powerdown after initial startup by resetting ICs 4&5 respectively.. IC4 (top centre) turns on the relay once/day through the flipflop, IC5 below turns it off once/day.. (A day is defined by how many minutes IC's 4&5 are wired for..)
> (Also note that ICs 6&7 are currently wired for 1440 minutes in this picture which is nonsensical)
> ...


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## born2killspam (Jan 31, 2009)

Well the thing is, crystals are the only trustworthy way to keep time, and they run at a pretty high frequency so they need to be frequency_divided with the 4040 counters.. Even timer chips need counters to get a period longer than a few seconds..
So we do need the crystal, we need the counters, and we need the flip-flop since our signals are pulses, and they hold their value once set..
I suppose IC6 could be eliminated, and altered so that the relay is powered immediately when the circuit is started, but we still need IC7 to set the turn off time.. It might be possible to eliminate a counter in the crystal area, but with both of them the pulses are calibrated to 1 minute which really makes usage easier..
There are other ways to cascade the counters.. eg, one to measure day length with one to measure on-time slaved after it, but this opposable setup is probably roughly as simple as any method would be.. It really isn't that complicated as far as circuits go..
If you're confused about how the counters reset themselves, notice their outputs are all tied to 9V, and to the reset pin.. when all the tied outputs are high, they stop sinking that 9V, so it triggers the reset and it starts counting again..


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## winkdogg420 (Jan 31, 2009)

Ive been out of high school for 13 years and that was the last time i did any serious circut building i guess im a bit rusty i will grab ic's for dummies (not kidding) and see if i can get a better understanding of whats going on. Now even if i dont grow this way i still want to build the timer just to get my skills sharpened! Are most of these parts standard stuff?? Like radio shack ? Im not sure what chips they stock anymore i worked there years ago and we had tons of parts i even took some training coarses for them but none of it stuck..






born2killspam said:


> well the thing is, crystals are the only trustworthy way to keep time, and they run at a pretty high frequency so they need to be frequency_divided with the 4040 counters.. Even timer chips need counters to get a period longer than a few seconds..
> So we do need the crystal, we need the counters, and we need the flip-flop since our signals are pulses, and they hold their value once set..
> I suppose ic6 could be eliminated, and altered so that the relay is powered immediately when the circuit is started, but we still need ic7 to set the turn off time.. It might be possible to eliminate a counter in the crystal area, but with both of them the pulses are calibrated to 1 minute which really makes usage easier..
> There are other ways to cascade the counters.. Eg, one to measure day length with one to measure on-time slaved after it, but this opposable setup is probably roughly as simple as any method would be.. It really isn't that complicated as far as circuits go..
> If you're confused about how the counters reset themselves, notice their outputs are all tied to 9v, and to the reset pin.. When all the tied outputs are high, they stop sinking that 9v, so it triggers the reset and it starts counting again..


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## born2killspam (Jan 31, 2009)

Its an all around useful project.. I can answer specifics..


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## winkdogg420 (Jan 31, 2009)

i will let you know when im near build stage i need to do some serious re-research i will go to the library tomorrow i seem to absorb more from books then the net. anything you can think i should check-out of the library?



born2killspam said:


> Its an all around useful project.. I can answer specifics..


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## born2killspam (Feb 1, 2009)

I'm gonna start up a thread on this in the DIY section sometime today.. It'll keep this thread cleaner, and this timer has alot of applications for cycling anything on a non 24hr basis.. (Like fans/pumps etc)..


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## weedyoo (Feb 1, 2009)

born2killspam said:


> I'm gonna start up a thread on this in the DIY section sometime today.. It'll keep this thread cleaner, and this timer has alot of applications for cycling anything on a non 24hr basis.. (Like fans/pumps etc)..


wow this is above my pay grade hahah i have no clue what is going on 

thanks you guys this is how you learn some thing new.


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## born2killspam (Feb 1, 2009)

Its actually a really simple circuit for its size.. Each area of the schematic does a stage..
ICs 1&2 and the components near them create the one minute clock, IC's 4&5 count these minutes and each trigger the relay once per day cycle.. (IC4 turns on the relay, IC5 turns it off).. ICs 6&7 just control when the relay gets triggered by counting up to their set delays, then resetting the counters in ICs 4&5 respectively (on the first cycle only).. Basically when the relay is supposed to come one, IC4 gets reset to 0.. It then counts as many minutes as are in a day cycle and then turns it on again.. Same thing with the off switch, IC7 waits until the relay is supposed to go off, then resets IC5 so that its sync'd to keep turning off at the same time each day.. In the original circuit, ICs 6&7 did not exist.. It was set up with normally closed push switches that manually got pressed the first day at the proper on/off times, then IC's 4&5 just repeated that process every day cycle.. (Again a day cycle is as many minutes as ICs 4&5 are set to count before resetting)..
I just noticed, I think I need a few more diodes on the outputs of ICs 6&7 going to the resets, and pins 1&2 of the IC3 4013 flip-flop..
BTW, the parts for this are probably $10-20.. Chip prices can vary dramatically depending on supplier.. Even paying top dollar though it probably won't cost as much as any standard timer walmart sells..


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## winkdogg420 (Feb 1, 2009)

i will start looking for the parts and find the new thread!




born2killspam said:


> Its actually a really simple circuit for its size.. Each area of the schematic does a stage..
> ICs 1&2 and the components near them create the one minute clock, IC's 4&5 count these minutes and each trigger the relay once per day cycle.. (IC4 turns on the relay, IC5 turns it off).. ICs 6&7 just control when the relay gets triggered by counting up to their set delays, then resetting the counters in ICs 4&5 respectively (on the first cycle only).. Basically when the relay is supposed to come one, IC4 gets reset to 0.. It then counts as many minutes as are in a day cycle and then turns it on again.. Same thing with the off switch, IC7 waits until the relay is supposed to go off, then resets IC5 so that its sync'd to keep turning off at the same time each day.. In the original circuit, ICs 6&7 did not exist.. It was set up with normally closed push switches that manually got pressed the first day at the proper on/off times, then IC's 4&5 just repeated that process every day cycle.. (Again a day cycle is as many minutes as ICs 4&5 are set to count before resetting) I just noticed, I think I need a few more diodes on the outputs of ICs 6&7 going to the resets, and pins 1&2 of the IC3 4013 flip-flop..
> BTW, the parts for this are probably $10-20.. Chip prices can vary dramatically depending on supplier.. Even paying top dollar though it probably won't cost as much as any standard timer walmart sells..


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## boston george 54 (Feb 1, 2009)

fdd2blk said:


> i recently bought a digital "sprinkler timer" from home depot. it a really nice one. it's is set-up in weeks mode. Sunday thru Saturday. i think i can set 30 different on/off times. i paid 20 s0mething dollars for it. they had a shelf full.
> 
> 
> nobody will do this.


 
nobodys gonna do it


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## fdd2blk (Feb 1, 2009)

boston george 54 said:


> nobodys gonna do it


well it sure looks like i pushed them enough to get the ball rolling, doesn't it? lol


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## born2killspam (Feb 1, 2009)

I got 2 similar timers at walmart a few years ago for $30.. They have 14 programs (14 on times, and 14 off times).. Are programmable on a daily/weekly schedule, have a countdown timer function, a random function, are easily over-ridable without messing up the program, has a battery backup, and even has a button to easily adjust for daylight savings.. They're waaay better than my project, but I can't find them in Walmart anymore..
They are: 
"Intermatic 7 day Timer Model DT 17"..


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## fdd2blk (Feb 1, 2009)

born2killspam said:


> I got 2 similar timers at walmart a few years ago for $30.. They have 14 programs (14 on times, and 14 off times).. Are programmable on a daily/weekly schedule, have a countdown timer function, a random function, are easily over-ridable without messing up the program, has a battery backup, and even has a button to easily adjust for daylight savings.. They're waaay better than my project, but I can't find them in Walmart anymore..
> They are:
> "Intermatic 7 day Timer Model DT 17"..




that's the same thing i'm using right now. i'm not sure if it's the "exact" same, but it sounds like it. my lights are out. i'll check later.

i found mine at home depot in the timer isle. they call it an "outside sprinkler timer". 

even if you had to restart every 7 days it wouldn't be so bad. or you could do the math.


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## born2killspam (Feb 1, 2009)

They're damn good timer circuitry thats for sure.. I used to use one to control a relay system that could handle more power than these are rated for for lights, and I was running a drip system, so coming on for watering every 2hrs during light was pretty perfect..
Still though, for our purposes, the design I posted can accomplish everything those timers did.. All I'd need to do to mimick my pump activity on a 24hr day would be to set my diy timer to come on for 20 min every 2 hrs, and have my timer plugged into a generic timer that kills it totally during lights out..
If I can crack into one of these timers without destroying them I'll reverse engineer one.. I assume there are proprietary ICs that make it a nuissance to recreate, but maybe....


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## winkdogg420 (Feb 1, 2009)

alot of the brinks timers are mechanical no chips inside i looked i was going to ask you how to mod it hahah. i have several timers even the digital one uses a mechanical clock mechanisim you set by hand...


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## fdd2blk (Feb 1, 2009)

born2killspam said:


> They're damn good timer circuitry thats for sure.. I used to use one to control a relay system that could handle more power than these are rated for for lights, and I was running a drip system, so coming on for watering every 2hrs during light was pretty perfect..
> Still though, for our purposes, the design I posted can accomplish everything those timers did.. All I'd need to do to mimick my pump activity on a 24hr day would be to set my diy timer to come on for 20 min every 2 hrs, and have my timer plugged into a generic timer that kills it totally during lights out..
> If I can crack into one of these timers without destroying them I'll reverse engineer one.. I assume there are proprietary ICs that make it a nuissance to recreate, but maybe....



pumps? every 20 mins? what? i thought we were flowering.


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## born2killspam (Feb 1, 2009)

No, I was talking about back in the day, when I had a drip table.. I used to run the pumps for 20 minutes every couple hours during light with these timers..
I was saying I could mimick that routine with my designed timer by setting the day length to be 2 hrs, start time = 0, and stoptime=20, and then plug my timer into a 24 hr timer (or another one of mine) set for 12/12.. Although with it plugged into another of mine you could make it any secondary master time-frame like 6/12..
Oops, no, for that to work you'd need to remove the 9V battery..


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## natmoon (Feb 1, 2009)

fdd2blk said:


> pumps? every 20 mins? what? i thought we were flowering.


Sounds like my missuses womanly needs


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## weedyoo (Mar 29, 2009)

so i am back on 6/12 so far so good


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## winkdogg420 (Mar 29, 2009)

keep up the updates let us know whats happening pics are great too.


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## Nancy Botwinz Budz (Mar 29, 2009)

I am so doing it, just up the number of plants. Sounds like a good way to get a round off 25% quicker if you are in a pinch.


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## winkdogg420 (Mar 29, 2009)

just be meticulous with the timing...


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## weedyoo (Mar 29, 2009)

winkdogg420 said:


> just be meticulous with the timing...


i have nothing else to do any way. 

i dont know about pics makes me nerves act up ; we will see 

the set up 
1 400 hps 
1 10.0 uvb
2 t5 HO with 3000K bulbs 
450 cfm fan 
Sunleaves Peruvian Seabird Guano (10-10-2) hit them befor they go 6/12 
Sunleaves Jamaican Bat Guano (1-10-0.2) about half way 
temps 73 day 63 night 
water once a week


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## born2killspam (Mar 29, 2009)

You don't want a ton of potassium as it can hurt yield if too much is applied in flowering, but I think you'll want more than that ratio-wise..


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## sobelsaint (Apr 22, 2009)

How did this turn out in the end? Was it worth it or not?


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## HarvestFest2010 (Apr 23, 2009)

i rad ed rosenthals book and it stated that plants tend to have spurts, wouldn't that effect this? what about natural time?


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## YaK (Jun 8, 2009)

where weedydoo at?


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## fdd2blk (Jun 8, 2009)

told you so.


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## kubrickzghost (Jun 8, 2009)

l3ored said:


> Interesting concept. Why 6/12 though, I would think day/night timing should be equal as with 12/12. Maybe 8/8, so you get 3 cycles every 2 days.
> 
> Take note: this is just a suggestion for an experiment, most likely won't work, but would be cool.


I've been reading up on this a lot but haven't seen any proven results. I gave my plants 36hrs of dark before 12/12 and I started seeing buds on Day 10 of flower.

I just started, so I'm happy with 12/12. But if I can cut my electric bill with some new lighting schedule, then it's worth a try.


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## petrock (Jun 9, 2009)

one idea as to your 220 v timer is to get a low voltage transformer and a relay that can switch your 220 volts on and off.
just use your 110v timer to run the transformer and pull in the 220 v relay


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## born2killspam (Jun 9, 2009)

There is a nice thread in the DIY forum that could be minorly adapted to achieve that.. Its a pretty easy task, but you need to know what you're doing for damn sure.. Its not quite the same as building your own cfl reflector..


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