# Refine Your Cannabuter: Better Taste, Simple



## Hobbes (Nov 28, 2009)

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Refine your Cannabutter.

After you make your Cannabutter (by whatever method):

1. Bring a pot of water to a good boil and reduce heat to simmer.
2. Put all of your butter in the water, as soon as it's melted turn off the heat.
3. Stir for 15 minutes, taking the floating butter to the bottom of the water, stirring in a top to bottom circular motion.
4. Put the pot in the fridge (on a pad so the fridge doesn't melt) until the butter hardens, then put the pot into the freezer for a few minutes to make it more solid. (for ease of extraction)
5. Use a sharp knife tip to cut the butter from around the outside of the pot. Lift out the Cannabutter disk, let the water drip off.

Your butter, or oil, will have bonded with the cannaboids so when you put the butter in hot water the water soluble terpenes, chlorophyll and plant matter will go into solution with the water and the Cannabutter will float above the foul mix. You will have fantastic butter, like you made it from honey oil.

I started refining all of my butter after making Lava Butter from Volcano dregs, simple and makes eating canna-foods a whole new experience.

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## karmabud (Nov 28, 2009)

Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> Refine your Cannabutter.
> 
> ...


 I have heard of just straight up making cannabutter this way ( as opposed to making it first then doing this to it ) that way you dont have to strain the pot , it all sinks to the bottom and butter goes to the top . seems to sound like it should work well .


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## turkish420 (Nov 28, 2009)

Nice post Hobbes! We made some canna-butter the otherday. crock-pot 3/4 full of water, 1 pound butter, 1/2 oz dro. on high for 2hours, on low for 1 1/2. strained with cheese cloth. fridge over night. That shit came out pretty good for my first time makin it.


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## StreetRider (Nov 28, 2009)

You are right on.

If you make your butter, then run it in fresh clean water again it takes alot of that green taste that some people complain about.

I think alot of people are going to miss the fact that this makes it cleaner.


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## Hobbes (Dec 7, 2009)

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I found a simpler way to refine butter/oil:

Put the cannabutter in a large pyrex mason jar (the more water the better the refinining) and pour in steaming hot water, fill about 3/4. Have a second pyrex container on hand, the same size or larger than the first jar. I use a 2 liter pyrex measuring cup, you could use another mason jar but it must be a wide mouth to get the butter out easily when it hardens.

Put the top on the jar and shake. You'll need oven mitts or a dish town for the heat. Be careful when you shake the jar, the heat from the water will expand the air and if the lid isn't on perfectly tight hot butter will squirt out. Shake up and down easily once or twice to see if the lid is on well. After a couple of shakes it wouldn't be a bad idea to let some of the heated air out of the jar to lower the inside air pressure. Shake for a few minutes to get the chlorophyll, terpins and plant matter (bud & leaf bits, dregs flower, etc).

Pour the mix in the pyrex dish or wide mouth mason jar, or leave in the first jar if it's a wide mouth - less loss. Pour steaming hot water in the first jar, cover and shake to get the rest of the butter that's on the walls, I usually do this twice. Clean your tools (spoons, forks, strainers, etc) with hot water poured over the jar to get butter lost. Pour all this into the wide mouth mason jar.

Into the fridge or freezer to speed cooling and hardening. When the butter hardens into a hard disk cut around the container wall and lift out the butter disk with forks or a spatula. Get the bits of butter out with a spoon or strainer, pour out the foul water, scrape out the rest of the butter. A narrow mouth jar would make removing the butter more difficult.

I found that I lost butter during boiling and on the walls of the pot, and I had to boil out doors because of the smell of boiling Volcano dregs. Absolutely disgusting. I made my last batch of Lava Butter using Dr Jay's Black Out Budd Butter recipe, slow cooker in my grow room so the air filter could take care of the smell - there was hardly any smell except when I stirred the mix. The jar method for refining took care of the rest of the smell.

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_**edit**_

*Explosion Warning!*

I was walking my hounds, thinking about jar refining among other things, when it occurred to me how the shaking of the jar would make 750 ml of water - at 200F+ - contact 250 ml of air - at say an average of 100F. The water would stay about the same temperature but the air would heat up instantly, and try to expand - building pressure.

A rule of thumb for tire pressure is that for every 10 degrees F the temperature changes the tire pressure will change by 1 psi. If we heat the 250 ml (1 cup) of air in the 1 liter jar to 200F we get an increase of 10 psi. 

I learned the hard way that even if you think the top is on tight, it may not be. I lost a quarter of my butter on one run, scalding water and boiling fat all over my hands. It took me a second geyser to figure out something was wrong, then a few minutes to think through what I was doing. And that I got off lucky, if the jar had a hairline crack or wasn't a mason jar and the top was tight it could have exploded, scaling more of me with boiling oil and sticking me with with glass shrapnel.

When you have the hot water and butter in the jar put the flat lid on the jar (not the screw on part) and let the air heat up and pop the lid up a few times. It'll let the air inside heat up and the density and pressure won't be as high. It still would be a good idea to shake straight up and down, gently, once or twice and crack the lid to let some of the heated air out.

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## slabhead (Dec 7, 2009)

hey Hobbes, when I lift up the butter slab there is a thin lumpy whitish layer on top of the water. A lot of it sticks to the butter brick but can be rubbed off like a curd. 
My question is should I be using that strata or discarding it? 
Many thanks for the info


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## Hobbes (Dec 7, 2009)

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Hey Slabhead!

That white layer is the protein from the butter. By boiling the butter we are making a sort of ghee - the layers of the butter are separated by weight with the water on the bottom and the fat on the top.

I haven't found anything about cannaboids and protein binding, or if there will be cannaboids mixed in with the protein. I don't know how much foul taste is left in the protein. I'll look around the net and when I find something I'll post it in this thread.

If you're concerned about this a way around it is to boil your butter before making your cannabutter - make your own ghee and make cannaghee. There will be no protein to absorb foul taste or to loose cannaboids in. If you make a large amount of ghee at one time you'll have it on hand when you need it, save some time. Ghee in India is sometimes kept for years before eating, it's the protein that goes bad.

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## slabhead (Dec 7, 2009)

OK so that is normal then I guess. Do you use that along with the butter or scrape it off? Thanks for the knowledge.


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## Hobbes (Dec 7, 2009)

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I use it if I haven't made ghee ahead of time. I figure that most of the foul taste is in solution with the water and the protein should be as good as the butter. Ghee will give you a slightly more potent butter.

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## kappainf (Dec 11, 2009)

Refining butter is awesome, good thread!!


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## fdd2blk (Dec 11, 2009)

slabhead said:


> OK so that is normal then I guess. Do you use that along with the butter or scrape it off? Thanks for the knowledge.


i put it under cold running water. anything that rinses off, rinses off.


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## slabhead (Dec 11, 2009)

I'll have to do that next run. Thanks for the tip fdd.

Man, I wished I had learned about the butter ages ago. Incredible. canna-cinnamon toast is my new breakfast of choice. 10g per slice is nice.


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## fdd2blk (Dec 11, 2009)

i used vodka in my last batch. WOW. i could barely make my bed before i fell into it. 

i put 7 ounces of trim in the crop pot with a fifth of 100 proof stoli's. i let that soak overnight. the next day i added 2 pounds of butter and water and brewed it until all thje alcohol evaporated off. the taste is much more flavorful.


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## Hobbes (Dec 11, 2009)

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That's a fantastic idea! I've got to give that a try too. Thanks fdd.

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## regrets (Dec 19, 2009)

A friend of mine just told me about this alcohol method, but I wasn't really paying much attention honestly. I have a lot of left over Everclear from making a very small test batch of tincture, and I just made 7 sticks of cannibutter last night, would it be worth rerunning this batch in the alcohol and water, or would I be better off just making more butter (can't ever have too much really) using the alcohol method. My palate is very sensitive to weed, although I have gotten some recipes down to a science, anything that can decrease the green flavor would be great, and well worth the extra effort.


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## Hobbes (Dec 20, 2009)

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regrets I MacGyvered an Alcohol Reflux Extractor last night, I think if you used that on the remaining plant matter you will get out the most resin possible, then you can refine that with the Extractor to remove virtually all chlorophyll and terpin taste and distill out the alcohol if desired.

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*DIY:* crock pot *Alcohol Reflux*: resin *Extractor*, tincture *Refiner*, alcohol *Distiller* (and now cannabutter refiner)








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*Crock Pot lid with hanging coffee basket*






*1 hour of reflux extraction* (started with clear vodka solvent, 40% alcohol)*:*






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I followed a forum link to the Cold Finger Extractor by Eden (diagram and link below) and three things came to mind very quickly:



The diagram brought up an instant image of the evaporation/rain cycle poster in my grade 4 class 35 years ago;
I figured I could make one in less than an hour from kitchen items;
They were charging $395 for the equivalent of a Pyrex coffee pot, Pyrex cone shaped dish, and a metal coffee basket. About $385.05 more than I paid for a much tougher 16 cup Pyrex measuring cup at Canadian Tire and $389 more than i paid for the crock pot above.







http://www.edenlabs.org/home_light_commercial.html

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A reflux extractor is very simple:


In a closed system the alcohol is heated above it's boiling point (79C) but below water's boiling point (you gotta look that up yourself); 



the heated alcohol rises as steam until it hits the ceiling of our reflux system (upside down crock pot lid), the water stays liquid in the heated reservoir below;
we put ice/snow/cold water on the top of the reflux apparatus (crock pot concave lid turned upside down) so when the alcohol steam hits the cold glass/plastic it condenses and gravity pulls the water droplets down the convex upside down crock pot top until;
the alcohol droplets collect at the bottom/center of the upside down cover and drip downward to the metal coffee screen basket hanging from the cover;
The dripping alcohol (still warm), which is a higher percentage than the alcohol in the reservoir (but not 100% alcohol), drips through the marijuana in the coffee basket carrying: dissolved resin, terpins, chlorophyll and some plant matter into the heated reservoir below.
As well, alcohol steam will rise and work through the marijuana in the coffee basket. (the same way water steam in a coffee maker will rise and go through the coffee grinds and drip bitter coffee after a pot is done, so we remove the coffee grinds as soon as the hot water drips through).
 

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Now we can: refine the alcohol tincture; remove the honey oil for use elsewhere; and/or distil alcohol. This step couldn't be simpler:




Change the coffee filter for a sold metal cup. Done.
 

The alcohol (and some water) will collect in the cup, most of the water will stay below in the heated reservoir with the resin, water, chlorophyll, terpins and plant mater. If you are refining or extracting honey oil remember to add hot water to the reservoir after the alcohol is extracted to the cup, you want to keep the chlorophyll, terpins and plant matter in solution while letting the non water soluble resin sinks to the bottom. Put things in the fridge until the water is cold before pouring the water out  so all the resin falls out of solution.

The alcohol collected in the cup will be of a higher percentage than what you started with and will be much cleaner than the reservoir but you may want to distill it again, after cleaning out the reservoir, to make it taste better and to raise the percentage of alcohol. After several reflux distillings we can take 40% vodka up to 60% or 70% - a higher percentage will take a more complex reflux device.

I'm going to refine my tincture and do a butane extraction on the remaining grinds in the basket to see how efficient the reflux extraction was. I'll post some results later today. Anyone who gives this a try please post your results, pics and any advice you can give us.

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*Items needed:* (substitutions can be made, don't go out and buy anything until we go over what you can replace items with  ie crock pot  coffee pot with screw off handle and spout (flat rimed); flat rimmed Pyrex bowl, plate, cooking dish; stove)

- Crock pot 
- Coffee basket
- Wire / screws to connect coffee pot to basket
- Floating kitchen thermometer Fill your crock pot with water and check the temperature at the different levels - we need 80C+, the higher we go the quicker the extraction; if we go too high we evaporate more water.
- Ice
- Towel (to remove the melted ice water from the lid, stay low tech)
- I'm adding an I-bolt for a handle for the concave side, the screw has to hang below to hold the basket.
- Rubber washer to ease tension on the glass cover if you reverse the handle. If you have a glass knob handle just make a wire noose to hang the coffee basket.

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*Explosion, Fire, Disaster beyond Saving Private Ryan's beach scene warning!*

Alcohol is flamable in it's liquid form at 50%, or 100 proof that the press gang isn't watering down the crews rum. It is explosive in it's gaseous form - the alcohol steam we are refluxing. If a flame hit's that gas - or any gas escaping from the extractor - you are going to have an explosion. No smoking, no flames, no other heat sources, no electric sparks, no wearing wool on a dry day. 

Don't become a statistic. 

This is a relatively safe reflux apparatus because - very little pressure can be built up (the lid will pop up), there is no open flame, there is very little alcohol gas produced in the volume of a small crock pot. *BUT* operator recklessness will cause a problem.

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I'll be back with results from refining, distilling and running a butane extraction on the plant matter to see how efficient the reflux extraction was. I'll post design improvements and cooking dishes we can substitute for the crock pot and lid - the deeper the "cold finger" comes into the heating reservoir the quicker the extraction (more cold surface area for alcohol condensation). Anyone who has suggestions, advice or a better design please contribute all you can.

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## slabhead (Dec 21, 2009)

Say Hobbes, have you ever used acetone as the solvent for a tincture? Will it work like the ethanol does? Thanks for all the great info.


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## Hobbes (Dec 21, 2009)

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I've never used acetone as a solvent slabhead, I'm moving away from toxic solvents and butane SCFE and towards alcohol reflux and subcritical CO2 extraction. Acetone is thought of as the second best non critical cannabis resin solvent, after petroleum ether. 

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*Acetone* is the organic compound with the formula OC(CH3)2. This colorless, mobile, flammable liquid is the simplest example of the ketones. Owing to the fact that acetone is miscible with water it serves as an important solvent in its own right, typically as the solvent of choice for cleaning purposes in the laboratory. More than 3 million tonnes are produced annually, mainly as a precursor to polymers.[2] Familiar household uses of acetone are as the active ingredient in nail polish remover and as paint thinner and sanitary cleaner/nail polish remover base. It is a common building block in organic chemistry. In addition to being manufactured, acetone also occurs naturally, even being biosynthesized in small amounts in the human body.

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*Toxicology*

Acetone is believed to exhibit only slight toxicity in normal use, and there is no strong evidence of chronic health effects if basic precautions are followed.


At very high vapor concentrations, acetone is irritating and, like many other solvents, may depress the central nervous system. It is also a severe irritant on contact with eyes, and a potential pulmonary aspiration risk. In one documented case, ingestion of a substantial amount of acetone led to systemic toxicity, although the patient eventually fully recovered. Some sources estimate LD50 for human ingestion at 1.159 g/kg; LD50 inhalation by mice is given as 44 g per cubic meter, over 4 hours.


Acetone has been shown to have anticonvulsant effects in animal models of epilepsy, in the absence of toxicity, when administered in millimolar concentrations. It has been hypothesized that the high-fat low-carbohydrate ketogenic diet used clinically to control drug-resistant epilepsy in children works by elevating acetone in the brain.


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*Flammability*

The most common hazard associated with acetone is its extreme flammability. It auto-ignites at a temperature of 465 °C (869 °F). At temperatures greater than acetone's flash point of &#8722;20 °C (&#8722;4 °F), air mixtures of between 2.5% and 12.8% acetone, by volume, may explode or cause a flash fire. Vapors can flow along surfaces to distant ignition sources and flash back. Static discharge may also ignite acetone vapors.

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I see acetone as too dangerous for the non-chemist to use. For us attic scientists who may not have the first line of defense of training and safety procedures, the second line of defense of a non-toxic solvent that is relatively safe to use is a must.

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## slabhead (Dec 21, 2009)

Alrighty then. I wasn't gonna cook it off, just thought about doing a soak and evap <outside of course>. If that would work. I hear you on the inexperienced chemist blowing themselves up. Not bragging but I've got a few years of lab work under my hat from college to career. The acetone is available free whereas the ethanol is quite costly. Appreciate the words of wisdom. slabhead


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## Hobbes (Dec 21, 2009)

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Slabhead I'd put you in the chemist department with college chemestry lab experience, I don't imagine they'd let you in there without teaching safety. It's people like me - or those girls who roasted themselves by smoking while evaporating butane from a SCFE - who have to be so careful. There are things we take for granted that can put us in the hospital. Like taking a smoke after all the hard work is done. Common sense is not so common.

To evaporate butane I float a pyrex dish in a tub of steaming hot water out doors, acetone has a boiling point of 57 C so it would evaporate fairly quickly with a non flamable soak.

From what I can find on the net acetone doesn't leave any residue behind either, very nice end product.

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## Hobbes (Dec 21, 2009)

*.
*

*2 Arrested After Hash Oil Explosion In San Ramon*








Two brothers are out on bail following their arrest Tuesday after an explosion at their San Ramon townhouse, allegedly caused by the manufacture of hash oil.

21-year-old William and 24-year-old Ashley Stoeckel were at the home when a small *explosion blew the garage door off its hinges*_(note: this only happens when the extraction is done indoors and the door is closed. ANYONE who has done any research on BHOE knows better than to do an extraction or evaporation in a closed area. But they still did it.)_,and caused a small fire. Neither brother was hurt. 

Investigators say two brothers living on Joree Lane were manufacturing "honey oil," also known as hash oil. It's a potent product extracted from marijuana.

The process is cheap and simple. It involves PVC pipe and a canister of butane. But it's also dangerous, warns the Drug Enforcement Administration. It's like making a pipe bomb.

"You're putting it inside a piece of pipe, and you're adding a flammable material," said DEA Agent Javier Pena. "It's another form of a homemade pipe bomb."

The DEA says in the East Bay alone, at least 4 similar operations have been discovered in the past 6 months.

The police chief in Blue Lake, near Eureka, says a lesson in making honey oil made a big impression a couple of years ago. An explosion blew out the walls and windows in a house and burned two people.

An internet page claims a medical pot activist in Canada died in 2003 trying to make his own hash oil to treat his HIV.

Pena says some web site recipes even come with a disclaimer. "'Blank dot com will not be responsible for any burned down homes and burnt skin,' in parentheses it says, 'hey, it happens,' and it does happen."

The Contra Costa County Narcotic Enforcement Team says a search of the San Ramon townhouse uncovered more than 20 pounds of marijuana, almost $35,000 in cash, and candy bars and cookies containing honey oil.

http://cbs5.com/local/San.Ramon.hash.2.440497.html

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The idiots were running a butane SCFE in their garage with the doors shut. These aren't kids researching stuff on the internet - 20 pounds of marijuana, cash, edibles. They knew better but they still blew up real good!

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## (Butters) (Apr 7, 2010)

scribed since my current butter tastes like plant matter and is green. Yet another great info post Hobbes.

-Butters


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## mcgyversmoke (May 6, 2010)

Just made a batch of jays black out butter last night. 1hr on high 3 1/2 on low stirring every 20,
came out almost as black as the picture on their website. used 1 oz of high grade outdoor shake to 1 stick of butter,
I also used an amazing buttter i found, I highly =P recommend it its got 86% fat content its called kellys pure irish butter.
came out very dark now i just did this refining bout 20 mins ago so hopefully came out good !


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## Hobbes (May 7, 2010)

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Good stuff McGyver! Doc J's recipes are fantastic, cooking expertise with his knowledge of chemistry. Rock solid.

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## Hobbes (May 7, 2010)

*A few recipes for Ghee for anyone who doesn't have access to high fat butter. Ghee is normal butter with the protein removed (milk solids), just the fat remaining (~99%). Can bind with a few more cannaboids. Or you can order your Ghee online. Making it is very simple though, fun.

Instructions
* *Things You'll Need:

* 

* 2 pounds of unsalted butter (adjust butter for your needs)*
* A saucepan*
* A fine sieve, or a mesh strainer lined with cheesecloth*
* A quart-sized Mason jar, or comparable container*
*Step 1 * *


Melt 2 pounds of unsalted butter in a heavy saucepan over medium heat.*
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Step 2: * *

As soon as the butter begins to boil and foam, reduce the heat to a simmer. Keep the melted butter at a steady simmer until it is golden in color, and no foam remains on the surface. * *

.* *

Step 3: * ** *

Stir occasionally after the whitish curds sink to the bottom. When these curds turn light tan, the ghee is ready.* *

.* *

Step 4:* *
* *

Cool the mixture, and strain it through a fine sieve or a cheesecloth-lined strainer into a spouted bowl or measuring cup. Discard the curds which were strained from the ghee, as they are nearly pure cholesterol! Pour strained ghee into a sterile, quart-sized jar for storage.* *
*


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## mcgyversmoke (May 7, 2010)

awesome I will have to try it with ghee next time!
how does it taste? same as butter or more fat tasting(obviously)


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## sambo020482 (May 7, 2010)

Hobbes said:


> *.
> *
> 
> *2 Arrested After Hash Oil Explosion In San Ramon*
> ...


 
fucking divs! but what are the feds on about its like a pipe bomb lmao


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## hammer6913 (Nov 5, 2010)

hobbes. you are one smart person thanks for ALL of your posts. very informative. i have a Q? i made my butter by boiling watrer adding butter brought to simmer addes trim 3oz to a lb of butter. let simmer for 3 hrs. strained cooled and seperated from water. the butter had no effects. no releif from pain and no body buzz. i just refined that same butter and is still in fridge cooling. did i di something wrong with my initial cooking? and if it didnt work the first time do you think it will work this time or am i wasting my time and resources. thanks for any and all info hammer


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## fdd2blk (Nov 5, 2010)

wouldn't the can of butane itself be a pipe bomb?


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## Hobbes (Nov 5, 2010)

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Hammer it could be your ratios: *"trim 3oz to a lb of butter."*

Was that 3 oz baked dry, 3 oz clipped, somewhere in between? There is no need to dry the trim, just so we have common measurements. 

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- For 1 tray of brownies I use 1/4 cup (65 ML) of oil and 28 grams of baked dry trim. I would eat the tray in 3 servings, my friends literally 16 - 32 depending on how far baked they wanted to be.

- 1/4 cup of olive oil is about 61 grams >>> (450g per lb / 61g) = 7.4 trays of brownies from 1 pound of butter. From 3 oz of baked dry trim I would make at most 3 trays of brownies, perhaps 2 with a cooking method of resin extraction. 1/2 a tray if the 3 oz of trim was fresh clipped.

- For 7.4 trays of brownies I would use 7.4 oz of baked dry trim extracted with a non polar solvent (high efficiency) where you are using 3 oz - if your trim is dry you are still using half the trim that I do, if your tolerance is high you might not get the effects that you want. If your trim is wet it will loose 75% of it's weight when dry, multiply any difference in the relative trim that we use by 4.

- I've found that Dr Jay's Black Out Bud Butter is the most potent and simplest cooking method of making butter, the recipe is in Weed Science linked below. To refine simple let cool then shake in a mason jar with luke warm water, let gravity separate the foul taste from your butter.

- Refining will not increase potency, only wash out the water soluble terpins and chlorophyll to improve taste. You will loose some small amount of resin in the rinse water.

- save your butter and add more trim to make it more potent.

- A press bowl gave me 25% more yield, of the most potent butter trapped deep in the plant matter. (Weed Science, Cooking chapter)

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Good luck Hammer!

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FDD2BLK do you know if if I can get HTML privileges to edit older posts and thread titles? Thanks.

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## hammer6913 (Nov 5, 2010)

thanks hobbes, i will work on fig ratios and boosting up the butter i already have.. appreciate yor response +rep


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## fdd2blk (Nov 5, 2010)

i don't have those powers to give you.


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## Greather420 (Nov 7, 2010)

Nice thread man. I love the idea of refining the butter. Would you mind if I posted a link to this thread on my recipe thread? A lot of people ask me questions about making butter...they should know about this process! Just wanted to check with you first. +rep for you sir!


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## Hobbes (Nov 7, 2010)

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*"Would you mind if I posted a link to this thread on my recipe thread?"*

I would be honoured, thank you Greather!

Check out the cooking chapter in Weed Science (link below), more than 10 years after first stumbling into his site Dr Jay's Black Out Bud Butter recipe is still the most potent cooking method I've found to make cannabutter. There's a link to Doc's site with his BOBB method, more than a dozen great recipes there.

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## Greather420 (Nov 7, 2010)

Nice...I'll check that out, and I'll post a link now. Thanks for that, you'll help me answer a lot of people's questions!


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## Greather420 (Nov 7, 2010)

by the way, if you're ever looking for any recipes, check out my thread https://www.rollitup.org/medicating/372672-anyone-interested-cannabis-recipes.html ........ I take recipe requests! lol...thanks again!


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## Hobbes (Nov 7, 2010)

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*"if you're ever looking for any recipes ... I take recipe requests!"*

Canna Maple Butter

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It's one that I was going to make for Doc years ago for kids who couldn't hold down canna food, dissolves in the mouth and is very tasty. I made Canna Corn Syrup candies that work fantastic, I didn't get around to doing a Maple Butter recipe. 

Any type of treat food - fast absorbing and easy to hold down - that children on chemo will be able to keep in their system long enough for the cannabinoids to be absorbed. 

I'll check out your thread and if it's ok with you I'll include any recipes for sick children in Weed Science and the Body of The Academy.

Greather thank you so much for offering help.

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**** 

I'm also looking for a replacement solvent for alcohol for *sublingual* tinctures - many people don't want, or can't tolerate, any alcohol in their system. Any help you could give - even to rule out possibilities or point me down the right direction - would be greatly appreciated. Please see the Sublingual Tincture link in blue and red at the bottom right of this post.

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## Greather420 (Nov 7, 2010)

Hobbes, I'm gonna have to do a little bit of thinking to find something that would be good for people on chemo to eat. I know how hard it is for them to keep ANYTHING down for very long, but I'm sure I can think of something. Give me a day or two and I will come up with a few recipes that should be good. Don't worry, I will get back to you shortly!


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## Greather420 (Nov 7, 2010)

Still working on the recipes, but here is a link to a discussion I found at grasscity.com....it talks about a method for making tinctures using glycerin instead of alcohol; apparently it works faster than the alcohol based ones but takes longer to make. Good luck with that, let me know if you try it out!


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## Greather420 (Nov 7, 2010)

By the way, here is the link to the mysterious page I mentioned a minute ago! lol....knew I was forgetting something! http://forum.grasscity.com/incredible-edible-herb/382844-tinctures-using-alcohol-glycerin-based.html


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## Hobbes (Nov 7, 2010)

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Unfortunately glycerine isn't suitable for sublingual tincture - though it does make a fine drop tincture, substitute for sugar in coffee. We need a liquid solvent that will carry the cannabinoids through the membrane into the sublingual gland.

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## akgrown (Nov 8, 2010)

this is a great post, I have been trying to get people to do this as well, I just call it washing the butter, it is really the only way to make green butter if all you have is plant material. +rep for you for helping to spread the word.


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## [email protected] (Nov 8, 2010)

Like AK said great thread. Thanx Hobbes for the refining idea. Been looking into cannabutter making for a couple days before making my own and never seen anything about refining. I hope it helps with the strong taste it has now. I am up to 3 times refining.


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## Greather420 (Nov 10, 2010)

Hey Hobbes...been working on medicated snacks that would be good for chemo patients...I had an idea for making white bread or rolls that would be easy on the stomach but I'm worried it might not taste too good. For now, I have a couple of recipes that might be good. In my cooking thread, https://www.rollitup.org/medicating/372672-anyone-interested-cannabis-recipes.html, I have 2 recipes you might want to try. On page 2, there is a recipe for medicated english toffee, which uses a lot of butter and can be made to be VERY strong if you wish by increasing the cannabutter-regular butter ratio. The recipe calls for nuts to be added, but I have read nuts can be very hard on the stomach for most patients undergoing chemo, so you can always leave them out. This candy, cooked to the right temperature, has a very nice consistency and dissolves quickly, so should be easy to eat. 
I also posted a recipe on page 4 of my thread for medicated ice cream, which can be made into any flavor and can be good for people with sensitive mouths/throats. I'll let you know more if I think of them!


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## [email protected] (Nov 10, 2010)

Greather have you tried zucchini bread. One on my fav. next to bannana bread. Good strong taste. That might hide the taste. The recipe that I use calls for oil. Just an idea.


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## Greather420 (Nov 10, 2010)

hmm...that sounds pretty good, actually! I have a VERY good recipe for zucchini bread, if I can find it....thanks for the suggestion!


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## hammer6913 (Nov 10, 2010)

how bout infusing oil with milk for pudding or maybe in a jello how about a bread type pudding or even a custard just some thoughts good luck 

hammer


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## Hobbes (Nov 10, 2010)

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We need a delivery method that bi passes both the lungs and the liver because of:

- inability to inhale the irratizing resin vapour (lungs) for children and lung cancer patients
-  the first pass effect of the liver reducing bioavailability of cannabinoids 
- some people just throw up in the shower, if it's not staying down long we need quick absorption to reduce nausea so a second more potent application can be absorbed.

I've found that sublingual absorption is a good middle ground between fast acting vapourizing and edibles. I've developed a subcritical water (steam) extraction method to make honey oil so neither butane nor CO2 are needed to make a tincture of greater potency and quality than Sativex by GW Pharmaceuticals. Basic recipe in the Sublingual Tincture link at the bottom of this post.

Now that we can produce a potent cost effective tincture at home in our kitchens we need the proper solvents and delivery system. We want to avoid alcohol if possible, but I haven't taken the time to research alternative solvents. Sublingual tablets are also on the wish list.

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If someone wants to make a major contribution to the world medical marijuana community, if you can research: 

- possible non alcoholic, non toxic solvents; 
- spray bottles - where to get medical quality cheap; 
- how to clean clogged spray pumps; 
- is there a single solvent that we could use to replace the grape seed oil carrier / alcohol solvent mixture?

Thanks for any help that you can give.

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## hammer6913 (Nov 11, 2010)

http://www.midwestbottles.com/index.php?p=catalog&parent=60&pg=1 this may be a little more of what ur looking for will keep looking though

hammer


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## karri0n (Nov 17, 2010)

I'm surprised very many people don't just do this as part of the recipe. How do you cook the butter for long enough without burning it if you don't use a water method?


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## Hobbes (Nov 18, 2010)

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Karri0n Dr Jay's Black out bud butter recipe uses a crock pot, it keeps the butter just below or around simmer and makes a very potent, if nasty, cannabutter. Doc's recipe is in the cooking chapter of Weed Science, download link at the bottom of this post.

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## hammer6913 (Nov 18, 2010)

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/310353238/70ml_Plastic_Nasal_Spray_Bottle.html

spray bottlers for hobbes


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## Hobbes (Nov 18, 2010)

.

Thanks Hammer, I'll look through and find some options. I've been paying $6 for a Cetophyl bottle, $0.35 is a nice change! Plus we'll get better quality.

An asthma refillable bottle would be the best quality, something cheap that can be thrown out when clogged would be economical. We'll have to order a few of each and find the ones that work best within those ranges.

Thanks!

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## hammer6913 (Nov 18, 2010)

i found some better spray bottles these are nasal bottles and there is marijuana leaves with display. maybe the3re tincture bottles

http://1-800-medical.com/nasal/nasal.htm these might be the best 

http://www.aliexpress.com/wholesale?SearchText=plastic+bottle&CatId=0 not sure bout these i will keep looking hobbes let me know when u seen enough lol


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## karri0n (Nov 19, 2010)

Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> Karri0n Dr Jay's Black out bud butter recipe uses a crock pot, it keeps the butter just below or around simmer and makes a very potent, if nasty, cannabutter. Doc's recipe is in the cooking chapter of Weed Science, download link at the bottom of this post.
> 
> .


Yup I saw the picture in there, it looks DISGUSTING


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## Hobbes (Nov 21, 2010)

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## annette malto (Mar 4, 2011)

we made our butter for the first time in the crock and ,it seems like the thick stuff is all on the bottom ,it hasnt cooled 8 hrs yet but it looks watery on top


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## hammer6913 (Mar 4, 2011)

annette malto said:


> we made our butter for the first time in the crock and ,it seems like the thick stuff is all on the bottom ,it hasnt cooled 8 hrs yet but it looks watery on top


i havent had much luck with butteri used trim and some sm bud. i would harvest cook harvest cook etc. so it is 3 time cooked all that good trim gave me no buzz no pain releif nothin just a waste of my time. make either hash or oil or use the plant in ur brownies


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## ByNudge (Jan 30, 2021)

Hobbes said:


> .
> 
> regrets I MacGyvered an Alcohol Reflux Extractor last night, I think if you used that on the remaining plant matter you will get out the most resin possible, then you can refine that with the Extractor to remove virtually all chlorophyll and terpin taste and distill out the alcohol if desired.
> 
> ...


How did this turn out? I am trying to increase the potency of my oil, but I'm using old bbuds and I did your refining process twice to pull out the grassiness. Any advice would be excellent!


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## Hobbes (Feb 1, 2021)

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ByNudge the best way I've found to increase potency is to do an alcohol extraction, then reduce the extract in a sauce pan on a low heat until all the alcohol is boiled off and all that you're left with is the extract cannabinoids.

Then add enough oil to the concentrate to get the desired potency.

Here's a video from Magical Butter Machine doing just this:

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