# Decarb question



## mokuro (Feb 24, 2013)

Hello again great community

I wonder if you need to decarb your cannabis before make some oil/butter on recipes that you will heat, like brownie for example, it will be on oven for 30+min, does it still need to decarb? if not, will it make it 'stronger'?

same to making butter, if it is going to be many hours heating, no need to decarb, right?

only decarb if going to make capsules and etc, that dont go to oven for too long?
thx :]


----------



## technical dan (Feb 24, 2013)

if you are trying bud into brownie mix you will need to decarb and I dont know how well that will work it will depend on how much of thc, cbd, and such bond to the fats/ lipids in the oil or whatever is in your brownies. The decarb happens as you make your butter. 

Im not sure I havent made caps check the sticky.


----------



## mokuro (Feb 24, 2013)

technical dan said:


> The decarb happens as you make your butter.



this answer me, so if you make hot for long time it will decarb, even if you dont pre-decarb, for other purpouses that you dont heat for so long i have to decarb.
thanks for your help! much appreciated


----------



## hhel11 (Feb 24, 2013)

I have a very similar situation. I am looking to make a new batch of butter but the bud I have now is markedly fresher than the last batch. The last time I had about an ounce of shake from a quarter pound of Green Crack. The shake was already very dried and more than likely fully decarbed.

This new Blackberry Kush that I would like to cook up is very fresh and sticky. Now considering that I use the crock-pot method for the creation of my butter (set on low for 24 hours) is it recommended that I decarb first? Wont that extended time do my decarbing for me?

In reality 20 minutes of decarb time isnt the worst thing, but I would like to have an answer before I go and attempt something new...


----------



## trichmasta (Feb 24, 2013)

212 for 90 mins! Dialed homie! Gonna make some hash coconut oil pills myself...

bless up


----------



## 2Kushed (Feb 24, 2013)

You do not need to decarb unless you are going to consume the budder without baking. The older the dried cannabis is, the more it has been decarbed. It won't be fully decarbed until it has been baked, cooked, smoked, or heated enough to decarb.

When I decarb it is done @ 252F for 27 minutes. If I decarb a solvent extracted concentrate, when heated to 252F, CO2 bubbles form. After 20-30 minutes the bubbles stop, and decarboxylation has completed.


----------



## mokuro (Feb 24, 2013)

hhel11 said:


> I have a very similar situation. I am looking to make a new batch of butter but the bud I have now is markedly fresher than the last batch. The last time I had about an ounce of shake from a quarter pound of Green Crack. The shake was already very dried and more than likely fully decarbed.
> 
> This new Blackberry Kush that I would like to cook up is very fresh and sticky. Now considering that I use the crock-pot method for the creation of my butter (set on low for 24 hours) is it recommended that I decarb first? Wont that extended time do my decarbing for me?
> 
> In reality 20 minutes of decarb time isnt the worst thing, but I would like to have an answer before I go and attempt something new...


from what i read on this forum (i'm only theory, not pratical), its good to have it dry before cook or make anything else. 
but if you are 24hours heatting it, i think there is no need to decarb, only decarb when you not going to heat for long time, this is what i understood from the answer of technical dan.
Not sure if there is any problem if you decarb before heat it for 24h


----------



## Statutory Ape (Feb 24, 2013)

Never even heard of "decarbing" weed. I've been making budder for years. I wonder if I'm losing anything by not doing this. Off to search the forums more!


----------



## mokuro (Feb 24, 2013)

Satatutory ape:
http://cannabischris.com/2012/10/marijuana-decarboxylation-how-to-decarboxylate-medical-marijuana/#.USp7Xx03uOF


----------



## hhel11 (Feb 24, 2013)

Alright, well I went and decarbed anyway. Followed BadKitty's tutorial.

*Pre-heat your oven to 215 - 220 f... if you've never tested the heat of your oven, go for 210 - 215 f to be on the safe side. Decarboxylation is part of the natural aging process of canna, and decarboxylated material is somewhat fragile, because it's just a step before the material begins to actually lose the potency we're looking for as the cannabinoids continue to convert. Dry warm air is important for fast decarboxylation, but it's also a good way to quickly degrade your material by speeding up the rate of decomposition. The decarbing process continues in oil (picture how a wet potato, evaporates into a dry, but oily chip); so you're best off under-processing than over-processing, where the dry pre-decarb is concerned. Unfortunately there is a lot of discrepancy on decarboxylation. If you have freshly harvested wet cannabis, it's going to take several hours for it to first become smoke-dry, then decarb and activate. If you feel your material is very fresh, but smoke dry, feel free to experiment by adding an extra 10 - 15 minutes. If it's very old, a faded, more pale shade of green or brown, and you feel it may have crossed a border or two to get to your home, keep to the guide and do not exceed 20 minutes.

Grind your herb as finely as possible. Sprinkle evenly over the pie dish. 

Cover WELL with aluminum foil, crimping up the sides below the edge and trying to avoid folding it under the dish itself (a little movement or sliding into the oven disturbs the seal and usually causes that base foil to 'lift' open.. if you seal it up around the edges instead it stays in place).

Place in oven at 220 f, for 20 - 30 minutes (less for commercial, brown or older looking herb, more for something that seems like it may be more fresh). Once your timer has gone off, shut off heat and leave the dish in the oven, open slightly (the door has a few 'open' settings... just open it a crack) and remove in 10 minutes. Letting it cool down slowly gently continues the decarbing process, while allowing any potential vapor to settle back into the material you'll be working with.*

___________________________

Finished decarbing and now she's in the crock-pot..


----------



## mokuro (Feb 24, 2013)

just decarbed mine too, it's on oven now for 45min w/ oil, i'm trying w/ only 2g (commercial brown brick weed) and 4tbs of canola oil, to make 2x microwave mug brownies, not sure if it will it work, first try ^^~

hell11, wich edible you going to do? please post more info, i'm curious =]


----------



## hhel11 (Feb 24, 2013)

I have done quite a bit of research on the subject. If you check the links in my sig, you'll see I do quite a bit of research on every endeavor I undertake.

I take 1 ounce of Blackberry Kush and grind it up with a coffee bean grinder. Place the results in a small disposable aluminum baking tin, sealed with tin foil (tightly), and bake for 20 min at 220 (don't put it in while it's preheating, put it in when the oven hits 220F). Then toss it in the crock-pot on "Low" with TWO sticks of unsalted butter, filling it up the rest of the way with warm water. Wait 24 hours, then follow the usual butter straining tutorials.

As far as my recipe... Here goes,, its the first time i've shared it, but you seem worthy 

*HHEL11's CannaBUTTER BLONDIES*
-1 & 1/2 cups "Light Brown Sugar"
-3/4 cup "CANNABUDDER" ( I crock pot with two sticks of butter, but it usually reduces down to 3/4 to 1 cup) 
-2 "Eggs" (Lightly Beaten)
-1 tsp "Vanilla extract"
-1 & 1/2 cups "All Purpose Flour"
-1/2 tsp "Salt"
-1 cup (6oz.) "Semi-sweet Chocolate Chips"

Spread over 13"-9" disposable baking pan with spatula.
-Makes 18-20 squares that will RIP YOUR FACE OFF AND S**T DOWN YOUR THROAT! 



ENjOY


----------



## 2Kushed (Feb 24, 2013)

mokuro said:


> from what i read on this forum (i'm only theory, not pratical), its good to have it dry before cook or make anything else.
> but if you are 24hours heatting it, i think there is no need to decarb, only decarb when you not going to heat for long time, this is what i understood from the answer of technical dan.
> Not sure if there is any problem if you decarb before heat it for 24h


No, the only part of your statement that is correct is that your material should be dry to start. Nothing you do with heat should take 24 hr. You cook off turpens and cannaboids with time and temperature. Therefore, do not decarb unless you need to.


----------



## 2Kushed (Feb 24, 2013)

Statutory Ape said:


> Never even heard of "decarbing" weed. I've been making budder for years. I wonder if I'm losing anything by not doing this. Off to search the forums more!


Do not (ever) decarb if you are going to use your budder to bake with


----------



## 2Kushed (Feb 24, 2013)

If you have your cannabis tested the THC-A will be a # like 10-22% and THC will be 0 or close to it (unless it is old material that is already partially decarbed). After decarb those #'s are reversed. When THC-A is 0, it has been fully decarbed.
*
*


----------



## technical dan (Feb 24, 2013)

When you are making your butter or oil you heat it or simmer it for you desired length of time I do mine overnight, as it simmers two reactions (well probably more but we are interested in two) take place. The first is the decarboxylation of THCA, this reaction takes place over time as has been said the available energy the faster this reaction will take place weeks in a jar at room temp or 20-30 min in a pan at 210-252 degrees F or over the cooking time of your oil/ butter. The second reaction is the boding of the now decarbed THC with the lipids/ fats (or alcohol) so that a far greater amount of the THC in the food is able to be absorbed by the human digestive system. 

When I make butter all of the components (weed/ trim/ hash, butter/ oil, water- butter only) go into the crock pot immediately (plant material is broken up or hash is melted if melty) and then it hangs out in there for hours.

If you are making fire crackers then you would first need to decarb your bud, so it would go in the oven on by its self and then make your fire cracker and bake it to bond the THC to the fats in the peanut butter. 

Another time I stick my weed in the oven is if I am doing a QWET to make hash oil in this case the bud goes in at a lower temp approx 120 degrees F to dry it out to limit the amount of water that will need to be evaporated from the wash.


----------



## mokuro (Feb 25, 2013)

technical dan, thx for sharing your methods!!


my edible for yesterday went *wrong *and I dont know why, it got too soft, just a little bit high, less than smoking, what i did wrong?? :
(using commercial brown brick weed)
-decarbed for 20min, 2g of it
-baked at 220F on 4tbs of canola oil for 45min
-waited it cold enought to take it out of the oven, mashed it w/ spoon, 
-back to oven for more 45min
-freeze for 45min
-done


w/ this i made a Mug-cake.
Maybe it was too litle time on oven? the oil was not BLACK, only a bit green-ish
anyone would give a clue about what I did wrong maybe? I fallowed the BadKit's oil recipe...


I might try coconut oil to make it instead canola..
and maybe try using alchool to extract the canabioids before put to oil...because its bad quality brick?


----------



## technical dan (Feb 25, 2013)

Yes lower quality buds/ material could be the problem. I have run into the two things that might be causing problems here not having enough thc in the mix (quality and quality of material put in) which is thankfully no longer an issue for me, and the decarb/ getting the present thc and cbd into the food/ attached to fats. If you try your method/ recipe again you might have better results if you decarb at a higher temp like 200 degrees F or 250 if you are confident in your ovens accuracy. 

If you are able to better green will work far better, I used to live where it was much more expensive and harder to find than it is for me now and so the first times I tried making edibles I had poor results because I was not using enough bud and so I essentially wasted what i did use by not using enough to get good highs.


----------



## mokuro (Feb 25, 2013)

Ops, its 110C, 220F, did a mistake on last post because of the conversion.... i decarbed at 220F, baked at 220F for 45min and etc

I do think it's the poor weed too, i'm going try with more material for the same amount of oil today (going try a dose of 2g per edible) and see what happens, also this time i'll extract with alcohol first, and then put into oil, seems to be more efficient by what i read on the forum.
Unffortunally i cant get better weed where i live atm, neither do my own grow yet.

thx for your help thechincal dan


----------



## Statutory Ape (Feb 25, 2013)

mokuro said:


> Satatutory ape:
> http://cannabischris.com/2012/10/marijuana-decarboxylation-how-to-decarboxylate-medical-marijuana/#.USp7Xx03uOF


Thanks Mokuro


----------



## Statutory Ape (Feb 25, 2013)

2Kushed said:


> Do not (ever) decarb if you are going to use your budder to bake with


Thanks, I have ONLY used the budder to bake with. So I'm golden I'm guessing.


----------



## mellokitty (Feb 25, 2013)

the mug cake could be the problem; you can't really regulate temperature in the microwave, plus the heat is produced differently (internal agitation of molecules) than external heat like ovens and stovetops. that's theoretical though, i've never made medibles in the microwave so i can't say for sure.

as to why it turned out too soft, the canola is probably the culprit (unless you used a recipe that calls for liquid oil) -- when you substitute liquid oil for solid (butter, coconut, margarine etc) the resulting product will prety much always be softer than intended.


----------



## mokuro (Feb 25, 2013)

mellokitty said:


> the mug cake could be the problem; you can't really regulate temperature in the microwave, plus the heat is produced differently (internal agitation of molecules) than external heat like ovens and stovetops. that's theoretical though, i've never made medibles in the microwave so i can't say for sure.
> 
> as to why it turned out too soft, the canola is probably the culprit (unless you used a recipe that calls for liquid oil) -- when you substitute liquid oil for solid (butter, coconut, margarine etc) the resulting product will prety much always be softer than intended.



I made the mug-cake on the oven x], 30min on oven

I'll try another 2 methods: 
-using the same amount of weed, but cook on the oil for many hours instead only 1:30h
-using alcohol to dissolve the weed and then put into oil

going try the first one tonight


----------



## hhel11 (Feb 25, 2013)

Alright so I just ate one of the new batch of blondies and they are AMAZING.. The decarbing before I cooked the butter definitely improved the final product. Also, the inclusion of liquid lecithin as opposed to the granular or powder made for a much easier experience.

Anyway, I am floating away right now. Be back after I've landed


----------



## 2Kushed (Feb 25, 2013)

We normally use curve #4


Per Jump-Moscow


----------



## mokuro (Feb 26, 2013)

2Kushed,
why not decarb when making butter? will it heat enought to dont need decarb, and make the THCA into THC w/o decarb?


----------



## 2Kushed (Feb 26, 2013)

mokuro said:


> 2Kushed,
> why not decarb when making butter? will it heat enought to dont need decarb, and make the THCA into THC w/o decarb?


I make my budder @~180F. It might eventually decarb at that temp. If you usr your budder to bake with, it will decarb during the baking phase. THCA does not change to THC without decarboxylation. Decarboxylation partially occurs with time. It is not to say that you will not get "high" if you don't decarb, you just will not get as high. People have been eating hash for as long as it has existed, and getting high. That material usually sits around for a few months and longer. The reason that it was not consumed right away is the weather is not condusive to hash making after harvest. High humidity is not good to make hash, but wait until the weather gets dry. This material is partially decarbed, as is any older material. I have some that is 7 years old that someday I will test to see exactly how much THCA it has. It should be interesting. 

If you want to use your budder to apply topically or orally, decarb it. Sometimes the decarb process is done before making your product and sometimes it is done after. You will benefit from the THC in your budder, because I feel that it is partially decarbed. Before I learned from Jump, we were decarbing @ 180F and was happy. Now I am happier!


----------

