# Reliable ppm chart for marijuana??



## Merlin85 (Jun 4, 2009)

I've been looking and looking but have not seen a reliable ppm chart for growing marijuana? I have heard people say use full strength, use half, use a quarter..I just want to know what you guys keep your ppm's at and when. If there is a nice chart somewhere out there that would be great too. Thanks!


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## Roseman (Jun 5, 2009)

Merlin85 said:


> I've been looking and looking but have not seen a reliable ppm chart for growing marijuana? I have heard people say use full strength, use half, use a quarter..I just want to know what you guys keep your ppm's at and when. If there is a nice chart somewhere out there that would be great too. Thanks!


 PPM for Hanna Chart PPM


Seedlings, Early Sprouts 100 to 250 

Early Vegging 300 to 400

Full Vegetation 450 to 700

Early Blooming 750 to 950

Full Mature Blooms 1000 to 1600

Note: EC Calculations are different, here's a conversion chart :
heres a great chart that shows how different PPM can be from meter to meter... EC is the only real universal language...







Remember to discount the ppm of your water.


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## sophanox (Jun 6, 2009)

Great post roseman nice one

By discount, do you mean you do not include the ppm of your water in the overall ppm or you do?

Cheers


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## Roseman (Jun 6, 2009)

sophanox said:


> Great post roseman nice one
> 
> By discount, do you mean you do not include the ppm of your water in the overall ppm or you do?
> 
> Cheers


My tap water is `120 ppm, out of the faucet. So if I want a ppm of 720, I set it at 840, so I have 720 of nutes, plus the 120 ppm of the water.


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## Boneman (Jun 6, 2009)

Nice chart Roseman, nice


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## Fman (Jun 6, 2009)

Both Canna, and General Hydroponics have nute calculaters on their sites. They dont say that they are for MJ. but Im sure they know what most people are using their nutes for. Im sure other nute co's. have the same info on their sites.

http://www.generalhydroponics.com/genhydro_US/feeding_schedule.html


http://www.generalhydroponics.com/genhydro_US/fchcol.html

http://www.generalhydroponics.com/calculator/index.html

http://www.canna-hydroponics.ca/growguide


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## Fman (Jun 6, 2009)

Also let the plant tell you how much nutes it needs. Not all strains take the same ppm's. Start weak and keeping raising slowly untill you see some burn starting. Use you ppm meter to keep track of how much your mixing to get a certain level. Of course this is just my opinon, and Im sure others here have other (better) advice.


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## Santos L Halper (Jun 6, 2009)

What kind of nutes are you using? If you are using General Hydroponic nutes I would recommend Lucas Formula that you can find here

It deviates from the GH chart, the Lucas Formula is 8ml/gal Micro and 16 ml/gal Bloom, no grow. iirc the increased proportion of micro provides enough nitrogen. The nute solution is about ~1300 ppm and is suitable for all stages of flowering.

I add 1ml/gal of Floralicious Plus and mix in Liquid Koolbloom at different stages (as in the GH chart), ~5-7.5ml/gal takes the ppm to about 1400-1500 for me. I put rooted clones right in.

Even if you don't use GH, Lucas stresses that you should always use FULL STRENGTH nutes.


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## Santos L Halper (Jun 7, 2009)

I use a Bluelab ppm Truncheon and it has all the different conversions on it: EC, CF, .5 ppm, and .7 ppm (Truncheon on the chart). Most people use the .7 conversion. It is the one on the left in the pic, was about ~$143 and worth every penny. It also has a five year warranty.


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## Merlin85 (Jun 10, 2009)

Roseman said:


> PPM for Hanna Chart PPM
> 
> 
> Seedlings, Early Sprouts 100 to 250
> ...


 
Hey thank you, that is exactly what I was looking for!


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## monster kush (Jul 23, 2009)

i have a hm digital ppm/ec meter com-100 does anyone know how this chart converts for my meter?


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## cashmunny (Aug 20, 2009)

Fman said:


> Both Canna, and General Hydroponics have nute calculaters on their sites. They dont say that they are for MJ. but Im sure they know what most people are using their nutes for. Im sure other nute co's. have the same info on their sites.
> 
> http://www.generalhydroponics.com/genhydro_US/feeding_schedule.html
> 
> ...


God bless you for posting these. I'd been to the GH site but never found this info. Good stuff!


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## justparanoid (Apr 24, 2010)

Just what i needed!


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## MX450 (Sep 4, 2010)

Im new to the Hydro game. Im using a simple ebb/ flo setup with Flora grow nova products. I noticed the PPM chart stating 100-250 PPM of nutes.. for seedlings. Question-, Is the PPM calculated after I add the required amounts of Nova grow and FLora Blend during the seedling stage? I am assuming that these nutes are combined in the initial watering. Thanks for the help... MX


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## Artificial emotion (Sep 4, 2010)

I think these charts are incredibly misleading. They are only meant to be a _guide_ and are not set in stone! You need to learn to read your plants and interpret what the signs are telling you i.e. whether it needs more nitrogen or some other macro or micro nutrient. Different strains/phenos will all have varying requirements so there is no one size fits all chart.


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## dmakk777 (Sep 5, 2010)

Not that i know much.....yet, but the calc on Adv Nutrients website seems kinda confusing and it say 1040ppm in week one of veg. This clearly is to much, don't ya think?


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## Artificial emotion (Sep 5, 2010)

^well that's a common problem (values being too high).


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## pointswest (Mar 29, 2011)

The charts posted by the various companies only apply to their specific line of nutrients. You can not use formulas from other suppliers sites on a different brand. Every fertilizer is different so you have to follow the directions for the brand you are using, ie: General hydroponics application rates will not work with the Canna schedules and vice-versa.

You eventually have to start reading your plants instead of the labels on the products. Good growers do not need pre-printed formulas and rely on the signs and symptoms of the plant to determine when to use additives and fertilizers, not some pre printed schedule on the back of the fertilizer product. The label does not have eyes and does not know the condition of your plants, the ultimate decision to feed or not must rely upon your good judgment and knowledge of plant growth.

Recommendations by fertilizer companies are usually the maximum the plants can tolerate without burning so they can sell more ferts. Anything above 1250ppm in flowering is causing soft rapid cell growth reducing the ability of the plants to adjust to disease and pest pressures and drastic environmental changes.

When it comes to fertilizing, less is best. You can always add more if needed, but if over fertilized it is much harder to remove excessive fertilizer salts once added to the media.


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## wiimb (Nov 18, 2011)

here you go............


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## fssalaska (Dec 7, 2012)

Hi guys I have never messed with checking ppm ec and all that, I been using general hydroponics Flora Series Recirculating (Expert & Simple) with rockwool small chucks and never had any problems for years, but now I have changed to coco tec as it's easier to order and works good just been adding the 5ml a gal calmag on top of the flora nutes. The other day I got a nice EC, PPM, temp, & a total of 8 things it test other than PH were to go to get a clue on the whole EC (ms) TDS NaCl info for dummies ? like charts stuff like that
thanks


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## hxvoc (Dec 8, 2012)

I gave up on getting the right mix. Every run I have a deficiency. low, medium, high ppm doesnt matter I consistantly get rust spots on all of my plants. I still get some bud so im just about over it. fuck it I just deal with the rusty ugly looking plants. still seems to smoke ok when its all said and done


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## frankpetersen (Mar 23, 2013)

sophanox said:


> Great post roseman nice one
> 
> By discount, do you mean you do not include the ppm of your water in the overall ppm or you do?
> 
> ...


My parents did Alot of ACID,& I'm related to the scarecrow from the wizard of oz.this is y I ask u .


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## Malevolence (Mar 24, 2013)

your parents must have dropped a lot of brown acid


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## farmerman421 (Mar 24, 2013)

does anyone have info on ppms of calcium and magnesium range they use through out a grow? I understand it is different in veg vs. bloom.


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## medhed (May 24, 2013)

One of the bestest posts I've seen,especially if a noob does yet understand the definition...


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## ProPheT 216 (Dec 7, 2013)

hxvoc said:


> I gave up on getting the right mix. Every run I have a deficiency. low, medium, high ppm doesnt matter I consistantly get rust spots on all of my plants. I still get some bud so im just about over it. fuck it I just deal with the rusty ugly looking plants. still seems to smoke ok when its all said and done


Just to state the obvious here, because no one else has yet. If your feeding your plants and they are getting everything they need n u see early leaf drop and rust spots 9/10 times your over feeding. Your ec is to high. Especially if you see contrasting signs, like clawing and upside down canoes on the top of the plant and rusty falling leaves at the bottom. Nuts are being locked out and the plant just isn't eating well because the salts in the soil are higher than the salts in the root zone, MJ eats when the salts in the soil or water is less than the salts in the roots.


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## Jerseykushface (Apr 2, 2015)

Roseman said:


> PPM for Hanna Chart PPM
> 
> Seedlings, Early Sprouts 100 to 250
> 
> ...


So lemme get this right if my tap water is at 100 ppm and i have a seedling i would want to add 100-150 more ppm from nutes to get my total ppm up to 200-250


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## Terry385 (Apr 2, 2015)

"i have a seedling" how old.. tap water is good for young seedlings 

*Reliable ppm chart for marijuana??*


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## Redvirgo (May 4, 2015)




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## CAREBEAR-666 (Jul 8, 2015)

Roseman said:


> PPM for Hanna Chart PPM
> 
> Seedlings, Early Sprouts 100 to 250
> 
> ...


Thanks Boss, this is just what this poor Welsh orphan needed, tidy boyo!


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## Rony Ahmedaziz (Mar 29, 2016)

Roseman said:


> My tap water is `120 ppm, out of the faucet. So if I want a ppm of 720, I set it at 840, so I have 720 of nutes, plus the 120 ppm of the water.


nice chart man.  Thanks


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## pinner420 (Mar 30, 2016)




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## Budley Doright (Mar 30, 2016)

When I first started hydro I fed half of what the chart for that product then used my meter to monitor the levels and if they dropped I would raise the EC next fill (every 7 days). I kept detailed records and when I started the next run I added the exact amounts for that EC. I did the same with the PH. As for rust spots, ya their a bitch and no it's not always caused by over feeding IMO. If you have unhealthy brown spotting then you should try to solve it as it does mean something is amiss, I was the same as I'm fuck it their ok lol, after doing some research with my particular setup and water (well) I was able to cure it and now plants are green till chop.


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## Gregor Eisenhorn (Apr 1, 2016)

Budley Doright said:


> When I first started hydro I fed half of what the chart for that product then used my meter to monitor the levels and if they dropped I would raise the EC next fill (every 7 days). I kept detailed records and when I started the next run I added the exact amounts for that EC. I did the same with the PH. As for rust spots, ya their a bitch and no it's not always caused by over feeding IMO. If you have unhealthy brown spotting then you should try to solve it as it does mean something is amiss, I was the same as I'm fuck it their ok lol, after doing some research with my particular setup and water (well) I was able to cure it and now plants are green till chop.


I remember I once raised the ppms to 800, but it was still dropping day after day 9somthign like 50-80 ppms daily). Does that still mean there's too little nutrients? I;m kind of scared of the thought of pushing it up to 1000.


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## Budley Doright (Apr 1, 2016)

Gregor Eisenhorn said:


> I remember I once raised the ppms to 800, but it was still dropping day after day 9somthign like 50-80 ppms daily). Does that still mean there's too little nutrients? I;m kind of scared of the thought of pushing it up to 1000.


LOL I know what your saying, been there. I really watch the plant more than the meter now and if the plants are happy, green, and growing I tend to feed the same and not push the limits. But yes most things I've read say if it's dropping then raise it.


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## Aeroknow (Apr 1, 2016)

Gregor Eisenhorn said:


> I remember I once raised the ppms to 800, but it was still dropping day after day 9somthign like 50-80 ppms daily). Does that still mean there's too little nutrients? I;m kind of scared of the thought of pushing it up to 1000.


I end up at 1.7-1.8 EC in most of my setups.


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## pinner420 (Apr 1, 2016)

rolling at 1.2 ~1.4 flower


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## WeedFreak78 (Apr 1, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> View attachment 3646984 rolling at 1.2 ~1.4 flower


How does that transfer over to ec/ppm? 

generally 1.8 -2.0ec here, as high as 2.3 on some before i see any issues, but i don't push anymore.


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## Aeroknow (Apr 1, 2016)

WeedFreak78 said:


> How does that transfer over to ec/ppm?
> 
> generally 1.8 -2.0ec here, as high as 2.3 on some before i see any issues, but i don't push anymore.


I found 1.7-1.8 ish to work great for me, around 20 yrs ago. It's what 1/2 strength floraseries is/was.
It's the set it and forget it number(work my way up to it of course) that still works fantastic with most every strain I grow, and in many many dif setups. The exception being soil.


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## Sativied (Apr 1, 2016)

WeedFreak78 said:


> How does that transfer over to ec/ppm?
> 
> generally 1.8 -2.0ec here, as high as 2.3 on some before i see any issues, but i don't push anymore.


Sufficient starts at roughly 0.8 EC and high ends at roughly 1.7. See this post for some relevant notes:
https://www.rollitup.org/t/why-does-it-seem-there-is-such-a-difference-in-nutrient-strenghts-between-the-growing-community.903672/#post-12472719


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## pinner420 (Apr 1, 2016)

WeedFreak78 said:


> How does that transfer over to ec/ppm?
> 
> generally 1.8 -2.0ec here, as high as 2.3 on some before i see any issues, but i don't push anymore.


So I made the decision to think in Ec as most of the top botanists think on this scale as it is universal. There are 3 ppm scales I'm aware of 500 650 and 700 so you have to translate what a ppm dude may be attempting to say and most aren't aware of what their meter is even calibrated to so massive swing in actual readings. At 1.2 Ec you can feed perpetually as a flush from higher Ec levels brings you back to the beginning. I found the minerals are Marshalled past the casperian strip easier allowing for continual easy feeding. Amino acids and kelp at a 5:2 ratio increase biochemical reactions 50% in the rhyzosphere. Hope that helps.


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## Sativied (Apr 1, 2016)

Yes people should stop using ppm. Those ppm values are estimates based on a conversion your ec meters make before displaying it. Even if they seem more accurate, they usually are not.


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## WeedFreak78 (Apr 2, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> So I made the decision to think in Ec as most of the top botanists think on this scale as it is universal. There are 3 ppm scales I'm aware of 500 650 and 700 so you have to translate what a ppm dude may be attempting to say and most aren't aware of what their meter is even calibrated to so massive swing in actual readings. At 1.2 Ec you can feed perpetually as a flush from higher Ec levels brings you back to the beginning. I found the minerals are Marshalled past the casperian strip easier allowing for continual easy feeding. Amino acids and kelp at a 5:2 ratio increase biochemical reactions 50% in the rhyzosphere. Hope that helps.


What I meant was what the hell is "interpretation index" on that chart and how does it relate to EC?


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## hot cheetos (Jul 21, 2016)

Roseman said:


> PPM for Hanna Chart PPM
> 
> 
> Seedlings, Early Sprouts 100 to 250
> ...


So if the PPM of my tap water is 500 and i add 300-400ppms of nutrients in it my final PPM solution should be 800-900 PPM for early veg?


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## b4ds33d (Jul 21, 2016)

hot cheetos said:


> So if the PPM of my tap water is 500 and i add 300-400ppms of nutrients in it my final PPM solution should be 800-900 PPM for early veg?


Just use ro water and don't worry about it.


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## hot cheetos (Jul 21, 2016)

b4ds33d said:


> Just use ro water and don't worry about it.


So when they say to add a certain ppm of nutrients it is just the nutrients and not the entire solution? If RO is practically 0 then I would still need to add 300-400 ppms of nudes to it?


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## pinner420 (Jul 21, 2016)

hot cheetos said:


> So when they say to add a certain ppm of nutrients it is just the nutrients and not the entire solution? If RO is practically 0 then I would still need to add 300-400 ppms of nudes to it?


The best way of thinking of those initial base water readings is passengers on a greyhound bus. Free up seats of unwanted passengers for the ones you want. Calcium carbonate wilst nice for ph buffer is immobile.


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## b4ds33d (Jul 21, 2016)

hot cheetos said:


> So when they say to add a certain ppm of nutrients it is just the nutrients and not the entire solution? If RO is practically 0 then I would still need to add 300-400 ppms of nudes to it?


You should add as many nudes as you can get in there. And share those nudes.


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## pinner420 (Jul 21, 2016)




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## hot cheetos (Jul 21, 2016)

Nutes lol fkin auto correct


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## Douglas.Curtis (Jul 27, 2016)

Read your plants first...
Once your plants are a medium green and growing super quick and healthy, THEN take a reading. Cannabis is extremely diverse. Dark green, soft leaves are way too much nitrogen/nutes, very light green with discoloration on lower leaves is a sign of not enough.

Let the plant tell you, then write it down.


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## Dumme (Jul 27, 2016)

Different carbonates have different EC values. The biggest cuprits in hard water are Calcium and Magnesium.
Lots of cities use Limestone clean the water, so your tap water will have a bunch of Calcium in it.

Calciums EC value will be different from say, the EC values of Nitrates with in the store bought premix.

The bottled premix uses a very specific combination of salts to get the values of EC that they're specified for, so if you mix them with Tap Water, your throwing the EC values off substantially and the total EC or ppm or CF or whatever, is accumulatively inaccurate.

This inaccuracy will increase even more with the combination of salt sources, especially if you mix name brands.


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## hot cheetos (Jul 27, 2016)

Appreciate the input guys, great info. I resorted back to RO and fed about 600ppm and growth exploded with nice medium green.


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## Douglas.Curtis (Jul 27, 2016)

hot cheetos said:


> Appreciate the input guys, great info. I resorted back to RO and fed about 600ppm and growth exploded with nice medium green.


BAM!


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## slinkysaurus (Jul 27, 2016)

Here's what I go by. As a rough guide for you, it won't be far off no matter what you're using brand wise.

I'll start off at 1/2 the recommended dose and work my way up from there to make sure I'm not gonna burn them.


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## Douglas.Curtis (Jul 27, 2016)

Working your way up is a great strategy.  Your plants will thank you, I'm sure.


Douglas


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## Diskokobaja (Mar 15, 2017)

Dumme said:


> Different carbonates have different EC values. The biggest cuprits in hard water are Calcium and Magnesium.
> Lots of cities use Limestone clean the water, so your tap water will have a bunch of Calcium in it.
> 
> Calciums EC value will be different from say, the EC values of Nitrates with in the store bought premix.
> ...



I find this interesting,cos my tap water is 481ppm, and when I add 3/4 strenght of AN nutes, my ppm goes waay above 2000pmm

plants dont show nute burn..


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## PeterPanne (Mar 15, 2017)

Just bought Canna Aqua, thanks for the schematics.


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## visajoe1 (Mar 15, 2017)

Diskokobaja said:


> I find this interesting,cos my tap water is 481ppm, and when I add 3/4 strenght of AN nutes, my ppm goes waay above 2000pmm
> 
> plants dont show nute burn..


you run hydro off 480 ppm tap water?


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## Diskokobaja (Mar 16, 2017)

I grow in soil


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## Dumme (Mar 17, 2017)

Diskokobaja said:


> I find this interesting,cos my tap water is 481ppm, and when I add 3/4 strenght of AN nutes, my ppm goes waay above 2000pmm
> 
> plants dont show nute burn..


I would say, test your testing equipment.


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## CobKits (Mar 18, 2017)

fwiw i had been using oakton tds meters for decades and finally got around to calling them to get a definitive answer on what factor they use. they say every oakton meter that has ever been is 0.5 scale. i couldnt find that published in any of their literature


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## Diskokobaja (Mar 19, 2017)

Dumme said:


> I would say, test your testing equipment.


Its ftom the box calibratet... i have turbo high hard tap water..


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## Dumme (Mar 19, 2017)

Diskokobaja said:


> Its ftom the box calibratet... i have turbo high hard tap water..


Again, I would say test your equipment, as they sometimes come DOA and miss-calibrated.


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## Diskokobaja (Mar 19, 2017)

I hear what you saying tho..


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## bckushman (May 5, 2017)

I'm gonna add somethinh others seem not to have. Different brands of nutrients will have different appropriate ppms especially depending on what your using. I'm running seedlings at 700 right now BUT this is because I use an assload of beneficial microbes, and enzymes to prevent slime.(I run aeroponics) plus some sugar to feed to microbes.
With this I'm actually using less than 1/4 strength base nutes and 3/4 strength rapid start, and 1/8 strength cal mag(you always need at least a bit of cal mag if you use an RO system)

Also if you have a ro system remember to sterilize it regularly. Theres quite a bit of data proving virus's and bacteria build up in filters; in tests where people drank ro water vs. tap water more people drinking ro water ended up with nasty gastrointestinal diseases


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## Altered State (May 5, 2017)

Santos L Halper said:


> I use a Bluelab ppm Truncheon and it has all the different conversions on it: EC, CF, .5 ppm, and .7 ppm (Truncheon on the chart). Most people use the .7 conversion. It is the one on the left in the pic, was about ~$143 and worth every penny. It also has a five year warranty.


Hey Santos , Its my understanding the .05 scale is used in North America with the .07 used in the Eu ?


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## Budley Doright (May 5, 2017)

Try this, it works for me. 
http://www.lenntech.com/calculators/conductivity/tds-engels.htm


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## tonetino (May 4, 2018)

is it possible to get a reup of the chart? Thank you!


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## Beachwalker (May 4, 2018)

Merlin85 said:


> I've been looking and looking but have not seen a reliable ppm chart for growing marijuana? I have heard people say use full strength, use half, use a quarter..I just want to know what you guys keep your ppm's at and when. If there is a nice chart somewhere out there that would be great too. Thanks!


I start them around 440ppm, heavy veg them 900-1100. Transition nutes at 1100 PPM, I run my normal flowering plants about 1100 and my heavy feeders about 1400PPM hope this helps, good luck!


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## Greez (May 29, 2019)

Hey Everyone!
I am using RO water, and it seems like my plants are yellowing from the center out. It is the top part of the plant, the new growth. I believe it is an Iron Deficiency. I add Cal-Mag Plus to my ro water, and use about 5 ml per gallon which makes it about 5-600 ppm. I just started an operation and am 6 weeks into vegging. I am using Growth Science organic line. 10ml each of grow, root magic, abundant-sea, and humic-tonic. The day after I gave them these nutes 2 of my plants started looking bad, now another is. While all the rest look great. So my question is, how do I correct this? Any pointers would be great.


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## OldMedUser (May 29, 2019)

Greez said:


> Hey Everyone!
> I am using RO water, and it seems like my plants are yellowing from the center out. It is the top part of the plant, the new growth. I believe it is an Iron Deficiency. I add Cal-Mag Plus to my ro water, and use about 5 ml per gallon which makes it about 5-600 ppm. I just started an operation and am 6 weeks into vegging. I am using Growth Science organic line. 10ml each of grow, root magic, abundant-sea, and humic-tonic. The day after I gave them these nutes 2 of my plants started looking bad, now another is. While all the rest look great. So my question is, how do I correct this? Any pointers would be great.


Measure the height on your plants and check a day or two later and I'll bet they are growing fast and that's why the grow tips are yellow in the center. It can take a day or two for them to green up during rapid growth. That's a good thing and tells you they are happy.

If low iron they will stay yellow as they grow out and low iron is pretty rare in soil grows. Generally when micro-nutrient deficiencies are found it's due to the pH being too high and locking them out.

Looks like pretty good nutes and probably have plenty of iron even if not listed from the ingredients they use. None in Canada tho as I'm weaning myself off hydro nutes for some of my medical growing.


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## Greez (May 29, 2019)

Sweet! Thanks! I am not sure If I can post pictures cause I am such a new member; however, I would like to. So you can see what I am dealing with.
 This is actually another plant that started showing symptoms MUCH earlier. And has now developed what you see in the picture.

I cant take pictures of the plant that lead me to believe it was an Iron deficiency, because the lights are off. But the upper half of the plant was droopy, and the center of all the tips were a yellow tint with the veins green and the outside tissue yellowing. In the center, but the outside was normal. It was strange because the plant was perfect, than I went in and saw that the upper half of the plant was droopy.


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## OldMedUser (May 30, 2019)

Got a bit of nute burn going on with that plant. Plants will go droopy at different times then stand up and pray to the light at others especially after a good watering. At least mine do.

Mine are lime-green in the centers too and up praying to the light right now. Got a good watering about 12 hours ago. Been having to raise the light at least an inch every day for the last week since repotting. 





I have 13 plants and 6 strains on the go atm. All under a 400W Philips CMH bulb. Nice white light so looks perfect with no white balance correction needed. Runs off a magnetic HPS ballast.

One of each Dutch Kush, Hindu Kush, Ayahuasca Purple and AK47 are all in bigger pots and going downstairs ASAP into even bigger pots and flipped in a couple weeks. The white pots are 4 - Island Sweet Skunk X DJ Short's Blueberry in 1L pots and 4 - Hi-CBD fem plants called Sebring's Revenge in 2L pots. And one Hindu Kush clone that's now as big as the others in another 1L pot. Not liking that one for growth traits but will see how it's mom is once flowered out before deciding to keep it or not. Want to start some more strains as well but don't want to get swamped.


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## Greez (May 30, 2019)

@OldMedUser 

Nice! I suppose people are a lot more open to sharing these days. I started my operation about 6 months ago. I am growing for a handful of cancer patients. I used to grow when I was younger and was told I was pretty good at it.

This time I am using Reverse Osmosis water, which is throwing some serious wrench's in my gears cause I have to add Cal-Mag, and constantly adjust the PH.

I got my seeds from PacificSeedBank. I got ACDC, Cannatonic, Blue Dream, Girl Scout Cookie, White Widow, California Big Bud. I got in touch with Resin Seeds, the Breeders of Cannatonic in Amsterdam. They informed me that PacificSeedBank is not selling their seeds and sent a cease and desist. With that said I really have no clue what I have.

I got in touch with Growth Science yesterday and sent them pictures of my plants, and they told me it is likely a PH lockout issue I am having. I calibrated my PH pen and it was showing 6.8 in 7.0 calibration solution. So I re-calibrated it, and it is likely that the PH was too Acidic or Low. So they told me to flush with 7.2-7.5, and refeed with 6.2PH. I also did not adjust my PH after I mixed my nutes together, and they explained they had a very low PH to increase shelf life. Also catalizing to a nutrient lockout of Cal, Mag, and Iron.

I never had to deal with all this PH and PPM and adding Cal-mag to RO water. Its very time consuming, but after not growing for almost 10 years. I absolutely LOVE it. Every second I am with my plants is a second I realize I belong. Its quite spiritual. xD


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## OldMedUser (May 30, 2019)

Greez said:


> This time I am using Reverse Osmosis water, which is throwing some serious wrench's in my gears cause I have to add Cal-Mag, and constantly adjust the PH.


I hope you're not testing pH of the RO water and making adjustments to it before adding your nutes and CalMag. 

RO and distilled water have no real pH of their own. They get their pH from whatever is added to them.

The hydro nutes I use are AN's pH Perfect nutes with RO so I never even think about the pH whether in DWC or soilless. The only time I check pH is if I'm adding silica to the water first and I use the AN Rhino Skin so don't really worry about it and just add 4 or drops of conc sulfuric acid after mixing in the silica then add my nutes.

I use CalMag at half the rate you do at 2.5ml/gal and only about half the time in DWC. The ProMix HP I'm using has lots of dolomitic and calcitic lime in it already so I use even less for plants growing in it. The first ten years I grew DWC I never used CalMag and never saw a calcium deficiency tho did seem to have low Mg at times and fixed that with Epsom salts.

A lot of growers here seem to think CalMag is some sort of magic bullet and advise people to use lots for every issue they may be having. It's not.

I'm pretty sure you don't have an iron deficiency. Just normal growth is all I see and new leaf growth needs exposure to light before it can turn green so when the plants are growing fast the newest growth looks yellowish until the chlorophyll gets active and greens up.

I've seen too many people mess up their grows tossing stuff at a perceived problem only to make it worse.

The forest fires here in northern Alberta have us socked in with smoke today. Visibility is down to about 300yds and I woke up thinking the house was on fire. Not even June yet so it's gonna be a hot and smokey summer for sure.


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## guitarguy10 (Jun 14, 2019)

You can't accurately (or safely without throwing off the pH pens references values) pH a low ionic solution like RO water or distilled water. You need to add a small amount of CalMag or something like OldMedUser said. Here is bluelabs document on this matter:
https://support.bluelab.com/hc/en-us/articles/203483414-Errors-when-testing-the-pH-of-pure-water.

Good EC/Hanna/Eutech/Truncheon/CF conversion chart:


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## Nugget1234 (Aug 17, 2019)

I have been looking into nute levels etc over the last few days, and was given this link by another member on this forum, it talks about 'usable PPM's' rather than the ones you'll get from your actual reader. 

For example, I am using the Botanicare KIND BLOOM, if I add 1ml to exactly 1 litre of RO water, my meter reads 332 uS/cm. However using the calculator in the link below, it suggests that there is only 246 uS/cm available to the plant. The reason being is that most liquid fertilizers use Phos P2 O5 - technically the plant only has access to 43.7% of what is on the label... 

Another example..

KIND BLOOM
0.0% N
6.0% P
6.0% K

Actually translates to:

0.0% N
2.62% P
4.98% K

I have an extremely complicated spreadsheet, which I can share if anyone wants it. You'd just need to swap out the products and the analysis to tailor it for yourself. Can have up to 11 different products on it in its current form. 

Link is here:

http://www.angelfire.com/cantina/fourtwenty/articles/profiles.htm

Annoyingly it keeps coming up with a Java pop up which I just close out, but it works pretty well.

Also a print screen of my PPMS based on 5 weeks of veg, 8 weeks of flower with a flush in the 9th week.


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## Nugget1234 (Aug 17, 2019)

Nugget1234 said:


> I have been looking into nute levels etc over the last few days, and was given this link by another member on this forum, it talks about 'usable PPM's' rather than the ones you'll get from your actual reader.
> 
> For example, I am using the Botanicare KIND BLOOM, if I add 1ml to exactly 1 litre of RO water, my meter reads 332 uS/cm. However using the calculator in the link below, it suggests that there is only 246 uS/cm available to the plant. The reason being is that most liquid fertilizers use Phos P2 O5 - technically the plant only has access to 43.7% of what is on the label...
> 
> ...


 Forgot to add, the plant can only use 83% of K20 - Potash


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## Nugget1234 (Aug 17, 2019)

This is the analysis for each product according to the calculator... based on TDS 0.7


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## Greez (Aug 19, 2019)

Its been awhile since I looked at this thread. You were all right, my plants were fine. But the bit about RO and all this is very useful. I am a little lost when reading the earlier thread about PPM and it being even less. But I am doing some Research now. @OldMedUser Hope the fires toned down over summer. Im in California and it seems to be pretty chill this year so far. Last couple of years were horrendous

I just harvested my first crop, 6 months is a long time, but I have been setting up a sea of green. So now I have mother plants, cloning station and flower room. It is TONS of work, but I do need something to eat up my time, otherwise I would go crazy.

This is ACDC, about 5 weeks into flowering and my wet trim. They got a lot smaller when drying. I was surprised, and sort of sad. I don't think it is true ACDC because it floors me when I smoke it. Im a super light weight though. I am going to get it tested. Just for the record, PacificSeedBank is an awful company. Resin Seeds, the breeders of Cannatonic sent them a cease and desist. Because I was wondering if the seeds they were advertising were really Resin Seeds. And I got an email back from Resin Seeds, which stated " The seeds they are selling, are not ours." Thanks for everything everyone, stoked to be part of this community.


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## OldMedUser (Aug 19, 2019)

Nice to finally get a crop in isn't it Greez.

Fires were really bad early in the year here in Alberta but we've had a record breaking amount of rain this summer so overall it's been much better.

There's a lot of bogus seeds floating around and way too expensive as well. Not only in cash layout but time invested to find out you didn't get what was expected. Looks like your doing OK.

I got some basically free seeds coming any day now. I'm at 7 weeks flower with one strain from them. A high CBD one called Sebring's Revenge. I ordered more of those and a few other ones like the Auto Fem CBDs for outdoors next year. Shipping for one was only $11.50 so I added 4 more to my order and it went up to $15.50 so nearly free. No charge for the seeds tho and as you are in the states I think shipping may be a few bux cheaper. 15 - 20 seeds in each pack.

https://www.sebringseeds.com/online-store/Free-Seeds-c34356405


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## Nugget1234 (Nov 13, 2019)

I think a lot of people get hung up on the headline figures when it comes to EC, like EC during seedling stage should be 400... I mean that's all well and good, but the breakdown of components that make 400 need to be well balanced, no good having 400 ec if 90% of it is nitrogen. Seedling needs to be around NPK 2 - 1 - 4 Mg 0.5 Ca 1. Humid acid, wetting agents and Silicon are always a good thing to add at normal recommended strengths throughout the grow.

I think the focus needs to be on the balance, then you can slowly turn up the strength depending on how the plant responds. More harm is going to come from over fertilising your ladies as a high EC hinders osmosis at the root zone. Go low, but make sure its balanced. Check EC daily and respond accordingly, EC rises as water level falls, just add water. If they both go down at a consistent rate, you're at the sweet spot, if the EC goes down, make the next batch of nutes a little bit stronger.

If you look at the back of your nutrient bottles, all of these companies that claim to be different, are all the same. They all use the same ingredients, just in varying proportions. Only quantifiable difference between them is marketing and price. I do believe once you have an understanding of what is inside these liquid ferts, the only thing that matters is how you apply them.


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## datshieeet (Feb 2, 2020)

Roseman said:


> PPM for Hanna Chart PPM
> 
> 
> Seedlings, Early Sprouts 100 to 250
> ...


Do these PPMS include the PPM of your water, or ontop of the ppm of your water. (IE: if i wanna feed 600ppm solution, and my water is 300ppm, should it be 900 ppm?)


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## Budley Doright (Feb 2, 2020)

datshieeet said:


> Do these PPMS include the PPM of your water, or ontop of the ppm of your water. (IE: if i wanna feed 600ppm solution, and my water is 300ppm, should it be 900 ppm?)


PPM is based on 0 ppm water. With a starting ppm of 300 you are throwing the dice re proper feeding but I do it with 200 but I rarely go over 600-700 total in my setup.


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## docuM3 (Apr 21, 2021)

Roseman said:


> My tap water is `120 ppm, out of the faucet. So if I want a ppm of 720, I set it at 840, so I have 720 of nutes, plus the 120 ppm of the water.


That's why your over nutrients your plants. Always include the ppm of your soil, not just the water. If you use Foxfarm soil it's ppm is 150ppm -200ppm. So if u are using soil you are giving way to much ppm if you are not subtracting 200ppm


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## Roy O'Bannon (Apr 21, 2021)




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## rkymtnman (Apr 21, 2021)

docuM3 said:


> That's why your over nutrients your plants. Always include the ppm of your soil, not just the water. If you use Foxfarm soil it's ppm is 150ppm -200ppm. So if u are using soil you are giving way to much ppm if you are not subtracting 200ppm


just so you know, this post is in the hydro thread. eventually the FF soil will be depleted of nutes so how do you factor that in?


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## docuM3 (Apr 21, 2021)

hxvoc said:


> I gave up on getting the right mix. Every run I have a deficiency. low, medium, high ppm doesnt matter I consistantly get rust spots on all of my plants. I still get some bud so im just about over it. fuck it I just deal with the rusty ugly looking plants. still seems to smoke ok when its all said and done


Right your killing your plants because you don't know what you are doing. 99% of people kill there plant and over nutrient and never ever caculate their ppm correct. The ppm isn't what you feed your plant, it's the amount the plant can observe. The rest just sits on the roots and stack up salt. Until you understand the basics you will always struggle. I suggest you go back to the basics and learn how a plant grows. You dont need to know how to grow, you just need to know how not to kill it.


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## kingromano (Apr 22, 2021)

there are no charts for ppm 
it will depends of your hyro system, your nutrient line,climate (temperature/rh) ...

for exemple with 2 rooms at 26 degree C, one at 35% rh and the other at 60%
the more humid room will propably need higher ec, because plants transpire less an eat more at high rh

only you can estimate the ec, i start around 2.0 in rockwool
quickly plants will start to eat and you will read different values in the return tank


if the ph goes down .. and the EC climb you need to reduce the EC value of the feed

if the ph stay stable/climb a little bit you're on the right spot. 

if the ph climb too much and the EC in the return tank decrease, you need to increase the feed


reading the plants will also tell you if you're in the right ppm zone 
they must be healthy green from the bottom to the top, not too dark or too light green


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