# Grow Logic Vertical Socket??



## johndoe12345678 (Dec 16, 2019)

Has anyone used this product? Ive done vertical grows with HID SE bare bulb. Does having glass fixture surrounding DE bulb lose alot of PAR? And how hot do these things get?


----------



## gr865 (Dec 16, 2019)

I am using 2 - 315W NA's hung vertical bare bulb.


----------



## Renfro (Dec 16, 2019)

johndoe12345678 said:


> Has anyone used this product? Ive done vertical grows with HID SE bare bulb. Does having glass fixture surrounding DE bulb lose alot of PAR? And how hot do these things get?


Ya know, this is something I was always told you lose about 10% going through glass...

Now I have a PAR meter (apogee MQ-500) and I could actually test that but I have no reflectors with a glass piece anymore. Haven't in years. I would imagine the glass is special.


----------



## Renfro (Dec 16, 2019)

I am gonna see if one of my buddys has a sheet of glass out of a reflector. Then I will just setup my meter under a light and slide the glass between to see how much the numbers reduce.


----------



## Herb & Suds (Dec 16, 2019)

I run open bulb without issues


----------



## Renfro (Dec 16, 2019)

I can see someone in limited space using a cool tube type deal to pull the hot air off the bulb but the sacrifice in lumens will be there as will the infrared radiation. I would avoid using a layer of glass if at all possible.


----------



## johndoe12345678 (Dec 16, 2019)

Since its not aircooled and its DE how much more heat do they produce vs a SE vertical bare bulb. Ive havent seen anyone use these Grow logic vertical fixtures just want to know if anyone has any experience in these particular brand and model Grow Logic 1000watt DE vertical fixture? I haven't seen any other 1000wat vertical DE fixture on the market


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 18, 2019)

johndoe12345678 said:


> Since its not aircooled and its DE how much more heat do they produce vs a SE vertical bare bulb. Ive havent seen anyone use these Grow logic vertical fixtures just want to know if anyone has any experience in these particular brand and model Grow Logic 1000watt DE vertical fixture? I haven't seen any other 1000wat vertical DE fixture on the market


Buy LED lights. They'll work in any orientation, no glass needed, they run cooler.


----------



## OneHitDone (Dec 18, 2019)

johndoe12345678 said:


> Since its not aircooled and its DE how much more heat do they produce vs a SE vertical bare bulb. Ive havent seen anyone use these Grow logic vertical fixtures just want to know if anyone has any experience in these particular brand and model Grow Logic 1000watt DE vertical fixture? I haven't seen any other 1000wat vertical DE fixture on the market


I had kinda looked into this but it seemed a bit clunky and awkward.
There are now SE lamps with outputs that very closely match the DE's. That's what I've been running coupled with a remote DE ballast.
Check out the Ushio 5001671









HiLUX GRO™ Super HPS Single-Ended Grow Light | Ushio America, Inc.







www.ushio.com





Do to my situation I run them in Air-Cooled hoods. Ya I know, the glass loss. But I have no AC bill to contend with either


----------



## Renfro (Dec 26, 2019)

OneHitDone said:


> I had kinda looked into this but it seemed a bit clunky and awkward.
> There are now SE lamps with outputs that very closely match the DE's. That's what I've been running coupled with a remote DE ballast.
> Check out the Ushio 5001671
> 
> ...


You are running those Ushio SE's on a DE ballast? Wow I would love to see the numbers they are putting out with my PAR meter. The DE ballasts run the arc tube at a higher voltage I believe, 400V to the lamp. I wanna say a SE is normally at 360V to the lamp. Wonder if they would last a cycle at 1150 watts.

I have been on the Ushio HPS bandwagon for years. They are excellent lamps and they are cheaper than say Hortilux or Philips.

For example, the Philips DE EL 400V lamp is speced at 2120 uMols when driven at 1000 watts, 2400 at 1150 watts. The Ushio is speced at 2100 at 1000 watts so thats basically the same! And if you are driving it at 400V with a DE ballast then it might be putting out more.


----------



## OneHitDone (Dec 26, 2019)

Renfro said:


> You are running those Ushio SE's on a DE ballast? Wow I would love to see the numbers they are putting out with my PAR meter. The DE ballasts run the arc tube at a higher voltage I believe, 400V to the lamp. I wanna say a SE is normally at 360V to the lamp. Wonder if they would last a cycle at 1150 watts.
> 
> I have been on the Ushio HPS bandwagon for years. They are excellent lamps and they are cheaper than say Hortilux or Philips.
> 
> For example, the Philips DE EL 400V lamp is speced at 2120 uMols when driven at 1000 watts, 2400 at 1150 watts. The Ushio is speced at 2100 at 1000 watts so thats basically the same! And if you are driving it at 400V with a DE ballast then it might be putting out more.


Yes, I am running Ushio 5001671 Lamps









HiLUX GRO™ Super HPS Single-Ended Grow Light | Ushio America, Inc.







www.ushio.com





On Phantom PHB4015 Ballasts.





Amazon.com : Phantom Commercial DE 1000W HPS 240v E-ballast : Patio, Lawn & Garden


Amazon.com : Phantom Commercial DE 1000W HPS 240v E-ballast : Patio, Lawn & Garden



www.amazon.com





I can not tell if HydroFarm has discontinued this ballast or not but I sure hope not cause it's a nice piece!

I have maxed at 1000W so far but the current run will be hitting 1150 in another week or 2.
These lamps have performed Flawlessly even dimmed to 600W on these ballasts


----------



## Renfro (Dec 26, 2019)

OneHitDone said:


> Yes, I am running Ushio 5001671 Lamps
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for that info. I will have to grab some of the USHIO's when I replace my verticals. Incidentally I actually have 6 of those same ballasts in one of my flowering rooms, on DE overheads. A buddy has 9 of those phantoms. He tried to run a vertical SE HPS on one in the middle of his room and it was no go for him, failed to strike/hold an arc, so he should grab one if they are working for you. I think he was using a hortilux pink box lamp but I am not 100%.


----------



## OneHitDone (Dec 26, 2019)

Renfro said:


> Thanks for that info. I will have to grab some of the USHIO's when I replace my verticals. Incidentally I actually have 6 of those same ballasts in one of my flowering rooms, on DE overheads. A buddy has 9 of those phantoms. He tried to run a vertical SE HPS on one in the middle of his room and it was no go for him, failed to strike/hold an arc, so he should grab one if they are working for you. I think he was using a hortilux pink box lamp but I am not 100%.


Fires like a champ.
I could see a SE Ballast not being able to fire a DE lamp.


----------



## Renfro (Dec 26, 2019)

OneHitDone said:


> Fires like a champ.
> I could see a SE Ballast not being able to fire a DE lamp.


Yeah thats what I was thinking when we first thought of trying a center vertical light when one of his 9 plants just didn't perform leaving an empty space to fill. Figured delete the middle plant in the 9 plants (3x3), hang a bare vertical 1000 watter in that spot so it could hit the sides of the plants around it. He ended up buying a SE ballast.


----------



## OneHitDone (Dec 26, 2019)

Renfro said:


> Yeah thats what I was thinking when we first thought of trying a center vertical light when one of his 9 plants just didn't perform leaving an empty space to fill. Figured delete the middle plant in the 9 plants (3x3), hang a bare vertical 1000 watter in that spot so it could hit the sides of the plants around it. He ended up buying a SE ballast.


If you look at the spectral distribution on the Ushio 5001671 it looks awfully similar to a DE spectrum vs say - a Hortilux Super HPS
I am wondering if they are more or less using DE arc Tubes or at least more similar chemistry in these lamps.
But they do spec an ANSI code for a standard HPS ballast so not sure what's up with that.
Anyways, these lamps are no joke - your feeling like you've been sitting on the beach in no time under these bulbs. I'm looking forward to the results on my current run which is the first that has been fully back on track and ready to get whacked with 1150W


----------



## Renfro (Dec 26, 2019)

OneHitDone said:


> If you look at the spectral distribution on the Ushio 5001671 it looks awfully similar to a DE spectrum vs say - a Hortilux Super HPS
> I am wondering if they are more or less using DE arc Tubes or at least more similar chemistry in these lamps.
> But they do spec an ANSI code for a standard HPS ballast so not sure what's up with that.
> Anyways, these lamps are no joke - your feeling like you've been sitting on the beach in no time under these bulbs. I'm looking forward to the results on my current run which is the first that has been fully back on track and ready to get whacked with 1150W


I thought the big differences on the DE is having the power come from both ends and not having a wire down one side of the arc tube and using quartz instead of borosilicate on the outer jacket. Both SE and DE can run with ballasts that are high frequency so thats a level playing field. I am not aware of a chemical difference persay in the arc tube but I am sure each manufacturer has their tricks like hortilux and such.


----------



## OneHitDone (Dec 26, 2019)

Renfro said:


> I thought the big differences on the DE is having the power come from both ends and not having a wire down one side of the arc tube and using quartz instead of borosilicate on the outer jacket. Both SE and DE can run with ballasts that are high frequency so thats a level playing field. I am not aware of a chemical difference persay in the arc tube but I am sure each manufacturer has their tricks like hortilux and such.


You can see the spectral difference between DE and SE comparing these to Hortilux Spectrums. It was interesting that Hortilux stated that for Sole Source Lighting the SE spectrum is their preferred lamp. But then we all know people knock it out the park with Gavita De's so probably splitting hairs.


SE Hortilux Super HPS






DE Hortilux HPS


----------



## Renfro (Dec 26, 2019)

I also know there are claims that the frequency and amplitude of the input voltage has a lot to do with spectrum and lumen maintenance. This makes me wonder how the same lamp performs on different ballasts. Big old rabbit hole to go down when you start talking spectra.


----------



## OLD MOTHER SATIVA (Dec 27, 2019)

bare bulb hps vertical=awesome

air cooled cool tube vert hps = slightly less awesome but you can get so close..its still awesome

i just screw around so i like leds..lol


----------



## gr865 (Dec 27, 2019)

Two stacked 315W vertical works well for me.


----------



## OneHitDone (Dec 29, 2019)

Renfro said:


> I also know there are claims that the frequency and amplitude of the input voltage has a lot to do with spectrum and lumen maintenance. This makes me wonder how the same lamp performs on different ballasts. Big old rabbit hole to go down when you start talking spectra.


If you do get around to testing the Ushio lamp with the phantom de ballast with your par meter please be sure to post back your findings here


----------

