# Better Hydroponic Nutrients



## Captain Trips (Nov 3, 2008)

i've been growing with

1) Advanced Nutrients-SensiGrow/Bloom
2) FoxFarms-Open Sesame/Beastie Bloom/Cha Ching
3) Botanicare- Liquid Karma 
4) Root Excalerator until the 2 week of 12/12 cycle

and i use a DWC system. i have no complaints with how its been turning out i just can't help but thinking that maybe theres a nutrient set-up thats better than what i'm using. i've also been thinking about adding a flavor/aroma enhancer like Advanced Nutrients-SweetLeaf, General Hydroponic-FloraNector, or Botanicare-Sweet but i don't know if that would just be overkill. any advice would be greatly apreciated.


----------



## Mr. Skunk (Nov 3, 2008)

Don't worry about overkill, I use a full line of advanced nutrients (about 8 different nutrients) and my babies thrive, If your looking for a sweetener go with sweetleaf hands down. It will greatly enhance the flavor and aroma of the plant.


----------



## TheFaux (Nov 5, 2008)

I would just use NPK; how do you know all that stuff isn't reacting together to fuck your shit up? Have you ever done a side-by-side comparison to see if you aren't just throwing your money away? I bet you'd get the same results with just NPK.


----------



## Captain Trips (Nov 5, 2008)

whats NPK?


----------



## TheFaux (Nov 5, 2008)

nitrogen phosphorous & potassium

It means just regular ol' veg and/or bloom formula.


----------



## widowman (Nov 5, 2008)

i use cornicoupia works good, anyone else use it?


----------



## Mr. Skunk (Nov 5, 2008)

N-P-K is going to give you the necessities for the plants, but if you want to use additional nutrients you can, this will cause your resin and thc production to escalate.


----------



## TheFaux (Nov 5, 2008)

Mr. Skunk said:


> N-P-K is going to give you the necessities for the plants, but if you want to use additional nutrients you can, this will cause your resin and thc production to escalate.


Oh great! Mr Skunk is giving us permission to use additives.  Thanks man!


----------



## Mr. Skunk (Nov 5, 2008)

No not you asshole, everyone else is allowed though


----------



## specialkayme (Nov 5, 2008)

Haha. I've used sweetleaf. Can't really say that I could tell a large difference though. If you can get it cheap and have some money to spend, why not. I clearly wouldn't call it a necessity though. Personally I go with sensi grow/bloom, big bud, overdrive, and sweetleaf, with root juice in the veg stage. I would highly recommend the big bud and overdrive though. I think that stuff works great, but not everyone would agree.


----------



## Mr. Skunk (Nov 5, 2008)

I was talking about the elements when I said necessity, and the flavor is much more enjoyable in my opinion. Have you ever used carboload by AN.


----------



## drifter1978 (Nov 6, 2008)

this is what i use and get good results start them off with rootblast when they are about a week old and from then my nutes are superthrive and i use canadian express for coco there full range from root repair,bio balancer,and essintal nitroand growth A-B and there flower A-B formula as well as there superior potash and headmaster super bud formula this is fromthe budzilla range i think and also sometimes i use the ozi tonic for late flowering depending what the plants look like


----------



## twinturbochronic (Nov 6, 2008)

Hesi or foxfarm with additives. Hesi is nice cause its chelated which my hydroguy says is what GHE and the expensive brands do. It is a one bottle for grow and the other is bloom and then a PK13/14 addon if needed and then SuperVit, Hesi enzymes, and Rootstimulator. Its not too expensive, but i just read in high times that jorge cervantes likes Hesi, among others too. BUT IM NOT SAYING HESI IS BETTER THAN ALL SOLUTIONS, BUT IT IS ONE FINE SOLUTE TO ADD TO MY SOLVENT. If i didnt get my first Hesi kit free a year ago, i would be using fox farm(which kicks ass), but i just keep buying it, cause it works and that is what matters. I like to buy a litre of one brand and a litre of another to test them first and compare to my main fert that i use im ny trays


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Nov 6, 2008)

My advice would be to try a straight Advanced Nutrients grow with at least a base nute, Big Bud, Bud Blood, Overdrive, and Carboload. If you can, use Tarantula, Piranha, and Voodoo Juice too.

Those, all together, work together so beautifully it's awesome. You can practically sit there and watch them grow.


----------



## specialkayme (Nov 7, 2008)

hooked.on.ponics said:


> My advice would be to try a straight Advanced Nutrients grow with at least a base nute, Big Bud, Bud Blood, Overdrive, and Carboload. If you can, use Tarantula, Piranha, and Voodoo Juice too.
> 
> Those, all together, work together so beautifully it's awesome. You can practically sit there and watch them grow.


While I would agree with you in part, I'm going to have to disagree with you in part. The sensi base nute works great, no doubt. I'm also quite a fan of Big Bud, and Overdrive. I personally can't say that Bud Blood does anything at all. I was very disappointed with this product. And I substitute Carboload with molasses. It's cheaper and does the same thing.

I havn't tried Tarantula, Piranha, or Voodoo Juice because of the price. The guy at my hydro shop told me about a new product, that is supposed to be all three of these, with trace B vitamins, and carbohydrates in it, but is made by a "local" botanist/chemist. Supposedly (so the shop owner says) it was designed by the same individuals that produced AN's line. The only difference is that you get five items in one, and it's like 1/3 the price you would pay. I think he said it was like a 1/2 lb for like $50. Plus, with it being made in the US and not in Canada, it's easier to get, and cheaper for the stores to stock up on, so they can pass the savings on to you.

I was going to wait to get it till my next grow. I don't remember the name, but if you are really interested I can go back and ask more about it.


----------



## Mr. Skunk (Nov 7, 2008)

I would get more information on that, sounds very promising.


----------



## mane2008 (Nov 7, 2008)

Mr. Skunk said:


> I was talking about the elements when I said necessity, and the flavor is much more enjoyable in my opinion. Have you ever used carboload by AN.


yea i use it in conjunction w/ sweetleaf.


----------



## specialkayme (Nov 7, 2008)

Mr. Skunk said:


> I would get more information on that, sounds very promising.


Sounds good. I'm out of town, so I'll stop in next monday and re-ask. Shoot me a pm on tuesday if I don't get back to you.


----------



## OverD0se (Nov 7, 2008)

OMG !!! NPK is not enough my friend... go and read more ... Its not wasting the money and if you dont use these ind of stuffs,it doeasnt mean you are right


----------



## GrowTech (Nov 7, 2008)

you should check out what they've got goin' on over here: Nutrient : Hydroponics, Hydroponics - Horticulture - Gardening


----------



## specialkayme (Nov 9, 2008)

specialkayme said:


> The guy at my hydro shop told me about a new product, that is supposed to be all three of these, with trace B vitamins, and carbohydrates in it, but is made by a "local" botanist/chemist. Supposedly (so the shop owner says) it was designed by the same individuals that produced AN's line. The only difference is that you get five items in one, and it's like 1/3 the price you would pay. I think he said it was like a 1/2 lb for like $50. Plus, with it being made in the US and not in Canada, it's easier to get, and cheaper for the stores to stock up on, so they can pass the savings on to you.
> 
> I was going to wait to get it till my next grow. I don't remember the name, but if you are really interested I can go back and ask more about it.





Mr. Skunk said:


> I would get more information on that, sounds very promising.


Alright, apparently I was alot higher than I thought I was when I talked to my local hydro shop last week. The products they were talking about was Mayan Microzyme (a substitute for voodoo juice) and Myco Maxium (a subsitute for paranaha and tarantula, with carbohydrates and trace B vitamins). When I was there I heard "Mayan Microzyme Myco Maxium" and it all flowed into one word. It sounded like a miraculous product.

Anyway, both products are cheaper than their AN byproducts, and work just as well from what I hear. I hope to try them in my next grow.


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Nov 15, 2008)

I don't think that's accurate, about it being made by the same people. I could be wrong, I'm no expert or anything, but I hadn't heard anything about any of Advanced Nutrients' guys jumping ship.

Not saying it's no good, I've never even heard of it. I'm just thinking that it sounds like a rumor started to give their products more street cred is all.



specialkayme said:


> I personally can't say that Bud Blood does anything at all. I was very disappointed with this product. And I substitute Carboload with molasses. It's cheaper and does the same thing.


Well I think it works. Try it side-by-side sometime if you can. Nothing proves it like seeing it for yourself.

The molasses works great in soil, but it's dangerous in hydroponics so I just can't go that route myself.


----------



## specialkayme (Nov 15, 2008)

I may try doing a side by side next time. I'll see if I like it. I have it lying around, so why not.

I do hand watering coco hydro. So molasses is an option for me. If I did an ebb and flow, or a drip I would switch to carboload.


----------



## dazed76 (Nov 15, 2008)

scorpion juice a must when vegging


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Nov 21, 2008)

dazed76 said:


> scorpion juice a must when vegging


I've come to this conclusion as well.


----------



## specialkayme (Nov 21, 2008)

I'm still confused with what exactly Scorpion Juice is. Anyone want to clue me in, or tell me why it's so important?


----------



## EeekAmouse (Nov 22, 2008)

If you grow indoors you need more than just Nitro -phos - potas you need the trace minerals that plant require. Just stick with the Fox Farms Trilogy it has all the goodies in it. I flush my hydro units every 30 days to remove un wanted salts. I also use a home made CO2 set up. for 120 sq ft closet 3 aerogardens and 3 1 gallon milk jugs pumping nitrogen to 1400 ppm its made all the difference. I would like to know more about flavor enhancers.


----------



## dazed76 (Nov 24, 2008)

scorpion protecs from viruses and root issues kinda like a flu shot with vitamin c eqinasia and tylenol put together. makes sure ur lant doesnt get sick, if you really are a biginner im gona give a lil advice, sensi pro ready made powder mixes it comes in light medium and heavy feeding boxes, with 1 box per week at 550 bucks lol but it has everything i mean everythng in it, made by dr hornby to just mix lol but the 4rth week one has to b bought seperate its 100 bucks i guess ur paying for the formula but it really fucking works. ps if your smart youll buy the heavy feeding one at 1600 ppm the red boxes and use at half strength that way you get 2 runs out of it hehehehhhehehe


----------



## specialkayme (Nov 24, 2008)

That's the information I saw online about scorpion juice. What I didn't understand is how does a plant 'vaccination', if you will, improve your harvest? all I thought it did was prevent against sicknesses.

Thanks for the heads up on sensi pro. I havn't seen it before, do you have a link?


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Nov 27, 2008)

A stronger immune system means a stronger plant with less chance of it being slowed down by whatever problems might strike. A minor problem often won't really become visible before the plant overcomes it, but the effort it took to fight it off steals resources that could have been used to grow even bigger.

So it can hurt yield.

I'd rather take a few extra steps to avoid a problem than to try to fix it later.


----------



## specialkayme (Nov 28, 2008)

Oh yeah. That makes total sense. I used to work out fairly hardcore, and we used to take alot of dietary supplements. In addition, we also took alot of vitamins. It was the same thought process.

I just wasn't aware that it would make THATmuch of a difference on yield.


----------



## dazed76 (Dec 2, 2008)

ya how hard can u lift on a cold, compared to when fully healthy and well fed.


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Dec 5, 2008)

dazed76 said:


> ya how hard can u lift on a cold, compared to when fully healthy and well fed.


That's a really good analogy. A cold isn't likely to kill you, or necessarily stunt your growth, but it can sure slow you down for awhile. Plants are the same except their colds can stunt them a bit.


----------



## mared juwan (Dec 6, 2008)

How about bloom boosters like AN Overdrive or Hammerhead? These are essential for fat buds IMO. I use AN's coco nutes (Moneky Juice) for veg and flower but midway through flower if I don't drop the bloom formula to reduce N and replace it with bloom booster which is almost pure P-K then I get deficiencies of all sorts. I think of my main feeding program as three parts - veg, bloom, and bloom booster. Everything else is add-ons. Carboload is good stuff though.


----------



## unity (Dec 6, 2008)

I've been reading this thread and all I can say is: Thank God I'm off the magic sauces!
I think if people spend half the time or money that they spend on nutrients on environment they would not have to constantly buy additives to counteract problems that are caused by a poor environment to begin with.

Unity


----------



## Broozer Bud (Dec 6, 2008)

does anybody know if it would be a good idea to use cha-ching, beastie bloomz, and open sesame, with my general hydroponics fiora series, or is it unesasary?


----------



## TOKEMASTERFLEX (Dec 6, 2008)

I only use canna nutes myself. Never had a problem. Always get a good harvest. Been using for almost five years now


----------



## Green Dave (Dec 10, 2008)

I am a newbi, only 3-4 grows and still working out kinks.
I use GH Flora Nova 1 bottle for grow and one bottle for Bloom.
Can someone give me a link that will exsplane how to use all the diffrent aditives as I dont know how to add them (mix in addition to the normal or mix in seperate water and add to plants as a seperate water) There are so many to look at its overwelming
Thank and Happy Growing
Green Dave


----------



## BUDGI (Dec 26, 2008)

anyone use PureBlend Nutes


----------



## aknight3 (Dec 26, 2008)

i think regular gh nutes work fine


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Jan 29, 2009)

Here's how I see it:

If you don't have your basics worked out - temp, light, humidity, etc - you're not going to see impressive yields no matter what you pour in the res.

And if you've got everything but nutrients nailed down 100% perfect you're going to grow pretty well no matter what you use for nutrients. Well, as long as your nutes aren't complete crap. I mean if you're just filling your res with urine or something you're gonna have trouble.


In my experience you'll always get more using better nutes, but when everything else is right the difference becomes obvious. I'm really curious about the new stuff AN is putting out.


----------



## holmes (Jan 29, 2009)

brother, i have never read a post from you that did not involve how bomb AN is.
do you sell their stuff?

what is your experience like with connie?


----------



## Mr. Skunk (Feb 2, 2009)

dazed76 said:


> scorpion juice a must when vegging


Have you tried barricade?


----------



## Aztros (Feb 2, 2009)

hooked.on.ponics said:


> The molasses works great in soil, but it's dangerous in hydroponics so I just can't go that route myself.


Two words Sugar Daddy... I was interested in making my buds sweeter both in smell and taste so I did some research. Everyone kept barking molasses at me over and over again. Being that I am doing flood and drain rockwool, I know molasses would have been the wrong path to take. I talked to my hydro guy and he introduced me to Sugar Daddy. It's like molasses for hydro setups. My buds which were already pretty impressive, got so much sweeter. I've even heard that you can flush with just the Sugar Daddy and phd water, though I've never tried this myself. Anyway, there is my two sense. This is a great thread and will be used in the future as a good reference for me.

Everything I use:

1. Aquaflakes A&B Components
2. BN / NPK / 0 - 13 - 14
3. Bloombastic (AMAZING!!! Expensive, but AMAZING!) Won all major awards in Europe.
4. Sugar Daddy

Any suggestions any of you might have as to things I could change or add to the mix would be appreciated. You've all been a huge help, hope I was the same. Take care and happy growing!


----------



## Kant (Feb 2, 2009)

Aztros said:


> Two words Sugar Daddy... I was interested in making my buds sweeter both in smell and taste so I did some research. Everyone kept barking molasses at me over and over again. Being that I am doing flood and drain rockwool, I know molasses would have been the wrong path to take. I talked to my hydro guy and he introduced me to Sugar Daddy. It's like molasses for hydro setups. My buds which were already pretty impressive, got so much sweeter. I've even heard that you can flush with just the Sugar Daddy and phd water, though I've never tried this myself. Anyway, there is my two sense. This is a great thread and will be used in the future as a good reference for me.
> 
> Everything I use:
> 
> ...


So i'm not sure if they are the samething but technaflora make a thing called sugar daddy that kicks major ass.

Actually technaflora's entire line of hydro nutes are really effective. they also are really stable as far as ph and nut balance is concerned.

here's a link to the stuff I use:
http://www.technaflora.com/products.php?product=20

they actually now have a organic line of hydro nutes.


----------



## holmes (Feb 2, 2009)

> Two words Sugar Daddy... I was interested in making my buds sweeter both in smell and taste /QUOTE]
> 
> i dont understand when people here talk about sweeting there buds
> what i do understand ( at least i think i do) is that any form of glucose does not get abosorbed by the roots, its there to feed bacteria only.
> ...


----------



## Mr. Skunk (Feb 2, 2009)

holmes said:


> > Two words Sugar Daddy... I was interested in making my buds sweeter both in smell and taste /QUOTE]
> >
> > i dont understand when people here talk about sweeting there buds
> > what i do understand ( at least i think i do) is that any form of glucose does not get abosorbed by the roots, its there to feed bacteria only.
> ...


----------



## holmes (Feb 2, 2009)

Aztros

what has bloombastic done for you to call it "amazing"
im interested to pick one up


----------



## Aztros (Feb 2, 2009)

holmes said:


> Aztros
> 
> what has bloombastic done for you to call it "amazing"
> im interested to pick one up


Well, my buds have always had a glisten to em... I was hesitant to try it at first, but my shop here in town was giving loyal customer free samples when it first came out. It was just enough for the whole second month of flowering. I didn't think it was possible, but when comparing pictures... sure my previously grown bud was covered in crystals, but this bud once it was finished just blew me away. There were so many crystals you couldn't even see green in some areas. My shit looks better than stuff you would see in high times. Ask your grow shop if you can try a sample... couldn't hurt. I mean the shit is $200.00 and I definitely wouldn't have bought it if I hadn't gotten a sample first. Glad I did though, good luck.


----------



## Aztros (Feb 2, 2009)

holmes said:


> > Two words Sugar Daddy... I was interested in making my buds sweeter both in smell and taste /QUOTE]
> >
> > i dont understand when people here talk about sweeting there buds
> > what i do understand ( at least i think i do) is that any form of glucose does not get abosorbed by the roots, its there to feed bacteria only.
> ...


----------



## holmes (Feb 2, 2009)

anyone else using a sweetener that can describe what the difference in smoke "taste" like
im thinking its a very subtle difference, i probably wont even notice, its like wine...people swear on wines with certain characteristics, but when i try it, it still taste like shit to me


----------



## Aztros (Feb 2, 2009)

holmes said:


> anyone else using a sweetener that can describe what the difference in smoke "taste" like
> im thinking its a very subtle difference, i probably wont even notice, its like wine...people swear on wines with certain characteristics, but when i try it, it still taste like shit to me


It is a lot like wine... You definitely have to develop your pallat for weed. It will come with time. You probably can already tell the difference in tasts and what not, you might just not care cause your going to the abyss anyway right!?!?


----------



## holmes (Feb 2, 2009)

thats for certain

good luck to you brother, i hope you find a recipe for the most delicious tasting dank you could hope for.

when you use bloombastic do you add other flowering stimulators?, and at what rate do you apply it


----------



## Aztros (Feb 2, 2009)

holmes said:


> thats for certain
> 
> good luck to you brother, i hope you find a recipe for the most delicious tasting dank you could hope for.
> 
> when you use bloombastic do you add other flowering stimulators?, and at what rate do you apply it


Me too man, me too. If I find it, you better believe I'll throw it your way. 

I'm not too sure about adding additional flowering stimulants, I'll ask my guy and get back to you on that one. As for the application rate, I have a 35 gallon reservoirs. I start out the first 3 weeks at 1.5oz, then bump it to 3.0oz at week 4-6 and finish out however long the rest of the flowering time is with 4.5 oz each reservoir change up until my flush. If you decide to go with it, try to remember me and let me know what you think in a couple months 

Take care man and be safe!


----------



## holmes (Feb 3, 2009)

hello aztros

i cant find anywhere how much 1ml per liter of the bling bling will raise the ppm 

anyone out there using dutch master gold?


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Feb 8, 2009)

holmes said:


> brother, i have never read a post from you that did not involve how bomb AN is.
> do you sell their stuff?
> 
> what is your experience like with connie?


Yeah, I'm a bit of a cheerleader when it comes to AN, it's just cause it makes such a difference in my grows. Maybe I'm a nute snob, but I think the buds speak for themselves. I think of AN as my secret ingredient - I talk about it a lot here but I keep it a secret otherwise cause I want to always be the guy with the best bud around.

I don't sell their stuff or anything, I'm just a big fan. I even snuck their logo into my avatar. That just how much I like their nutes.

Conni is just plain awesome stuff. It's as simple as that. I don't really know how to explain it, but the way I think of it is like this. If you were to picture your ideal MJ plant, then take that plant and run it through a blender and get it completely liquified, and then pump that into an IV into another plant, that's kind of what Conni does.

It's like weed squared. I'm not saying it's made of ground up plants or anything cause that's silly and it wouldn't work anyway. What I mean is that the plants I grow with it seem just way "more" alive, vital, like they're concentrated somehow.

See, I said I was a bit of a cheerleader...


----------



## holmes (Feb 8, 2009)

its not the price tag of the conni that turns me off, but that fact that i have read that it came in bad batches, that the B bottle has a tendancy to solidify. that just doesnt makes sense, your paying double for the best and for it to come fucked up turns me off.
i asked a AN seller, and he said that it is common for "floaties" in the bottles, but assured me that he tried it and worked just fine. 
i dont know


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Feb 11, 2009)

holmes said:


> its not the price tag of the conni that turns me off, but that fact that i have read that it came in bad batches


I've read a lot of stuff. Doesn't make it true.

All I can say is that I've never had any trouble with it and I don't know anyone who has. There's people who seem to spend a lot of their time trying to convince people that Advanced Nutrients is bad in some way. Since I've had not a single negative experience with their stuff I'm suspicious of the accuracy of the naysayers claims.


----------



## Mr. Skunk (Feb 11, 2009)

I use a full line of AN but have never heard of connie, anyone want to fill me in?


----------



## holmes (Feb 11, 2009)

yes that is true
but i also said that i emailed the discount advanced nutrients website
they said it is common for floaties in the bottles

the salts are solidifying or something, and that just aint kool if you paying top dollar for the best.
eventually ill get a small quantity and give it a try

mr.skunk.......connie is an A & B ultra premium flowering nutrient from advanced nutrients, it cost something like 80$ a liter. the nutes are chelated witch makes them more readily available.

hooked on ponics, do you know when adavanced new line will be out, the one that self ph's and ppm's itself?


----------



## Mr. Skunk (Feb 11, 2009)

holmes said:


> yes that is true
> but i also said that i emailed the discount advanced nutrients website
> they said it is common for floaties in the bottles
> 
> ...


Thats weird. I'm down south and have never heard of it, the new line definitely sounds interesting though, my ph is a bitch every grow.


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Mar 5, 2009)

holmes said:


> hooked on ponics, do you know when adavanced new line will be out, the one that self ph's and ppm's itself?


I heard mid-march which means it should be out pretty soon. But I heard that a couple weeks ago and haven't heard anything new since then so I don't know for sure.


----------



## Big P (Mar 8, 2009)

i keep it simple, 









sweetner


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Mar 12, 2009)

And people say Advanced spends too much money on advertising...

IMO that "classic" pitch is a way of upselling an absence of innovation.


----------



## Big P (Mar 12, 2009)

hooked.on.ponics said:


> And people say Advanced spends too much money on advertising...
> 
> IMO that "classic" pitch is a way of upselling an absence of innovation.


 
Hows this for absence of innovation:










those are 2-liter colas not just a can of soda pop


----------



## mared juwan (Mar 13, 2009)

You can't go wrong with GH 3-part. hooked.on.ponics, you have to know your credibility suffers when you have AN's logo in your avatar. That shit is overpriced. Get over it. You dismissed what I said earlier in this thread without obviously knowing what you are talking about. Have you ever done any grows replacing Overdrive with Ionic Boost to see what actually happens? Doubt it. Have you ever done any side by side grows comparing AN base nutes to GH 3-part? Doubt it. Half of that shit is snake oil, dude. BTW I know this rebuttal is about a month late but Ionic Boost is considerably cheaper than Overdrive.

Nice plants, Big P.


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Mar 18, 2009)

mared juwan said:


> hooked.on.ponics, you have to know your credibility suffers when you have AN's logo in your avatar.


LMAO

Yeah, not like it does when you slap giant ads in a post.

I stuck that in my avatar because when I was making it I did everything but that part and thought it looked too plain, too much like the phonics one. So I thought "what would make it clear I'm talking about _hydro_ponics?"

Advanced Nutrients, obviously. And the colors even matched up nicely.

Nothing more to it than that.



As far as the whole "have I done this" and "have I done that" thing, stop beating around the bush. What exactly did I say that you think was wrong? Don't pussy-foot around and ask me what I have and haven't done, SAY where you think I'm wrong because I don't have time to double-check every damn thing I've said to see if it maybe fits with what you might disagree with. I don't read minds.

You don't like AN. Fine, I don't give a shit. I don't make a penny when AN or anyone else sells stuff so it's no skin off my nose.

Certain things cost more than other things. That's the nature of any free market.

I don't like or dislike products based upon the price tag, I like or dislike them based upon performance. I see results with AN so I pay for it. If you don't then I recommend buying whatever cheaper thing makes you happy.


But if you call a more expensive product is "snake oil", you're effectively calling the consumers of that product stupid, gullible, or any number of other insulting judgments.

I'm not saying anyone is stupid for using something other than what I like. I'm saying this is what I like and why I like it.


----------



## Az613 (Mar 18, 2009)

I use GH 3 part, never had a problem with it... I do add some big bud during flower of course


----------



## mindphuk (Mar 19, 2009)

holmes said:


> i dont understand when people here talk about sweeting there buds
> what i do understand ( at least i think i do) is that any form of glucose does not get abosorbed by the roots, its there to feed bacteria only.
> so how in a hydro setup, with no bugs, does adding sugar "sweeten buds"
> can someone explain to me, how adding sugar can make it taste sweet?
> i mean your smoking the dope you know, your not eating it with a glass of milk or coffee


Where do you hear these things? I'm curious because your post isn't the first one claiming that plants can't take up sugars at the root. We know that the phloem is the area where carbohydrate transport occurs from sugar sources to sugar sinks. Yes, plants do make their own, but they are very capable of taking up carbohydrates in the root area and move it to other parts of the plant. Sugar beets are well known for this process. Carbohydrates can be radioactively tagged, fed to the plants at the roots, and the transport of those sugars can be observed. We also know that the root supplies mycorrhizae with carbohydrates, there's no reason to expect that they can only go in one direction.


----------



## mared juwan (Mar 19, 2009)

hooked.on.ponics said:


> As far as the whole "have I done this" and "have I done that" thing, stop beating around the bush. What exactly did I say that you think was wrong? Don't pussy-foot around and ask me what I have and haven't done, SAY where you think I'm wrong because I don't have time to double-check every damn thing I've said to see if it maybe fits with what you might disagree with. I don't read minds.



OK, well to remind you. .. I tried to save everyone who reads this some money by telling them I have done several grows comparing AN Overdrive to Ionic Boost and I have found that Ionic Boost produces better results. Not only did your next post say that you obviously didn't believe me but also that Overdrive does not cost much more than Ionic Boost. It is nearly double the price at some places. But I didn't really care that much so I didn't say anything. 


Then I come back to this thread months later to find several pages of you praising AN for their great nutes. All I'm asking is how exactly do you know they are so great. I am not an AN hater by any means. I use some of their stuff - big bud and carboload. I'm just saying that to claim that something is better because it is more expensive without actually TESTING it out is not responsible in a learning forum. I know you didn't test AN base nutes against GH 3-part or AN Overdrive vs Ionic Boost because you are wrong about them. Had you actually done the tests you wouldn't be saying AN is best hands down all the time. You are actually a teacher here whether you know it or not. People new to growing trust what they see here for better or for worse.

And to say I meant that everyone who buys expensive nutes is stupid is a bit of a leap. So because you don't like cheap nutes you hate poor people??? LOL Don't put words in people's mouths.

But look, I hate to argue or be insulting on the internet - it doesn't do anyone any good. My only intention is to point out that AN is not the end-all-be-all to nutes and everyone should try many different types of nutes in order to find what truly works best for them. I think you limit yourself by being convinced that only AN will produce "the best" buds.

-/\/\ared


----------



## Big P (Mar 19, 2009)

mared juwan said:


> OK, well to remind you. .. I tried to save everyone who reads this some money by telling them I have done several grows comparing AN Overdrive to Ionic Boost and I have found that Ionic Boost produces better results. Not only did your next post say that you obviously didn't believe me but also that Overdrive does not cost much more than Ionic Boost. It is nearly double the price at some places. But I didn't really care that much so I didn't say anything.
> 
> 
> Then I come back to this thread months later to find several pages of you praising AN for their great nutes. All I'm asking is how exactly do you know they are so great. I am not an AN hater by any means. I use some of their stuff - big bud and carboload. I'm just saying that to claim that something is better because it is more expensive without actually TESTING it out is not responsible in a learning forum. I know you didn't test AN base nutes against GH 3-part or AN Overdrive vs Ionic Boost because you are wrong about them. Had you actually done the tests you wouldn't be saying AN is best hands down all the time. You are actually a teacher here whether you know it or not. People new to growing trust what they see here for better or for worse.
> ...


 

yes i agree, ill admit myself that i have only ever use GH FLora series nutes and never tested another brand myself

but that was after consulting with several growers who have use many of these brands. some have gone as far over the years to seem to have tried them all

this is how I came to choose GH nutes

and here is why I conclude it is one of the best out there if not the actual best:

*FLORA SERIES IS THE MOST WIDELY USED HYDROPONIC FERTILIZER IN THE WORLD BECAUSE IT IS THE BEST!*

&#8226; GH Flora Series is the original Building-Block Nutrient System &#8211; imitated but never duplicated.
&#8226; Contains complete Primary, Secondary and Micro Nutrients &#8211;for enhanced yields and better crop quality.
&#8226; Users can adjust mixtures to suit specific plant needs.
&#8226; Enhances flavor, nutrition, aroma and essential oils in both hydroponic and soil cultivated plants.
&#8226; Contains highly purified concentrates for maximum solubility.
&#8226; pH balanced for ease of use.
&#8226; NASA and Antarctic research scientists choose Flora Series -- because of its superior formulation and reliability.
&#8226; The General Hydroponics Flora Series is known throughout the world as the industry standard.


.FloraGro®, FloraBloom® and FloraMicro® comprise General Hydroponic's nutrient flagship. Recognized world-wide as the most advanced hydroponic nutrient line ever developed, the Flora-series is used by NASA, Argonne National Laboratory, Los Alamos National Laboratory and has been specified for research using hydroponics by Laboratories, Universities, Government Agencies, and Scientists throughout the world. *The Flora series is the result of the collective contributions of many famous scientists in the fields of hydroponics, agriculture and chemistry. 

*


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Mar 27, 2009)

That's pretty much just a cut and paste job right there... you "conclude that GH is the best" because you read something written by GH?



mared juwan said:


> I tried to save everyone who reads this some money by telling them I have done several grows comparing AN Overdrive to Ionic Boost and I have found that Ionic Boost produces better results.


This is a monumental load of bullshit. This is by my count your third post in this thread. The first post is on page 4 (number 34), and speaks only of how you like AN nutes. Your second post is on page 6 (number 66), gives me shit about my avatar and calls me out for disregarding what you said before. And what I'm quoting here is your third post.

So all this crap about how you said Ionic Boost was the best and I dismissed what you said is just that, crap.



mared juwan said:


> Not only did your next post say that you obviously didn't believe me but also that Overdrive does not cost much more than Ionic Boost. It is nearly double the price at some places.


And not in some other places. Guess which I live in? Maybe I just figured if it was okay for you to speak as though everyone experienced the same things you did that I could do it too.



mared juwan said:


> Then I come back to this thread months later to find several pages of you praising AN for their great nutes. All I'm asking is how exactly do you know they are so great.


How do you think? I tried different things, AN worked better than anything else... so I came to the logical conclusion that the product that works better is the product that is better. Controversial, I'm sure.



mared juwan said:


> I am not an AN hater by any means. I use some of their stuff - big bud and carboload. I'm just saying that to claim that something is better because it is more expensive without actually TESTING it out is not responsible in a learning forum.


I never claimed that it was better BECAUSE it was more expensive. I said that it was better, and that in my opinion you got what you paid for.



mared juwan said:


> I know you didn't test AN base nutes against GH 3-part or AN Overdrive vs Ionic Boost because you are wrong about them. Had you actually done the tests you wouldn't be saying AN is best hands down all the time. You are actually a teacher here whether you know it or not. People new to growing trust what they see here for better or for worse.


Why bother talking to people if you already know everything? You "know" what I have and haven't done without any actual evidence of any kind.

Which then begs the question why I would bother talking to you if there's no chance in hell that you'll believe anything I have to say since, as you and I have both stated, you already "know" things that you couldn't possible know even though these things contradict what I say.

I mean if talking to you accomplishes nothing because you've made your decision and that decision has nothing to do with anything I have or might say, what possible purpose might it serve?

Short answer is that this isn't for you. You've made it abundantly clear you don't care what I think - or say - so I'm simply returning the favor.



mared juwan said:


> And to say I meant that everyone who buys expensive nutes is stupid is a bit of a leap. So because you don't like cheap nutes you hate poor people??? LOL Don't put words in people's mouths.


Glass houses...

Re-read the post you're complaining about. You'll find the word "if" in the allegedly offending sentence. This clearly means that under the condition that one part is true, the other is also true. There's nothing to say that you do or don't make those claims.


Obviously this whole post is more for everyone else, but I address you on the outside chance you decide to read anything I say for more reason than to simply find ways to pick it apart.


----------



## Big P (Mar 27, 2009)

hooked.on.ponics said:


> That's pretty much just a cut and paste job right there... you "conclude that GH is the best" because you read something written by GH?
> 
> Actually no, since you want to lie while the truth is plainy readable right in my post, let me re-educate you on how to read.
> 
> ...


----------



## mared juwan (Mar 27, 2009)

hooked.on.ponics. I have no hostility towards you bro believe me. I have seen you around and for the most part you steer people right. It's just that I have seen you touting Advance as the only way to go in more than one place and I disagree. In fact the comments I was thinking of are from another thread but it did happen just as I said... Please read. https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/118943-do-you-use-dr-hornsbys.html Your aim seems to be to knock everything that is not AN and I don't like it, that is all. And I think I've made it abundantly clear that I DO care what you say. Saying AN is better hands-down is misleading to people who don't know better.


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Apr 4, 2009)

Big P said:


> Actually no, since you want to lie while the truth is plainy readable right in my post, let me re-educate you on how to read.


 I didn't lie. I called your post a cut-and-paste job BECAUSE IT IS.

Do you deny it's a word-for-word copy of this
https://www.grownhydro.com/flora-bloom-p-42.html?osCsid=b61bcb4db08da996cec75dece13e3496

and this

http://www.planetnatural.com/site/flora-bloom-hydroponics.html

That's GH advertising you're spouting off like it's the Holy freakin' Bible.



Big P said:


> in my post I said I concluded GH is one of the best because I talked to several people who have tried every nute imaginable over the years. And they suggested GH is one of the best they ever tried.


Oh I see. Other people said it's best so it must be true. Whatever.



Big P said:


> what I posted after that was some simple facts, which you seem to try to coverup becuase it does not fit with your ill-advised position.


No, what you posted was GH company line verbatim.



Big P said:


> Fact # 1: GH Flora is used by NASA, Argonne National Laboratory, Los Alamos National Laboratory and has been specified for research using hydroponics by Laboratories, Universities, Government Agencies, and Scientists throughout the world


Appeal to tradition fallacy. Because something has been done that way it should be done that way.

Besides, government agencies are HARDLY the place to look for A: cost-effective spending practices or B: the right way to grow weed.

The government doesn't use something because it's the best. Hell, they don't use ANYTHING that's the best. People win government contracts based on money - usually money that magically finds its way into campaign funds.



Big P said:


> Fact # 2: The General Hydroponics Flora Series is known throughout the world as the industry standard


Easy to say, hard to prove right or wrong. Standard advertising double-talk. Sounds great, says little.



Big P said:


> Fact # 3: The Flora series is the result of the collective contributions of many famous scientists in the fields of hydroponics, agriculture and chemistry.


 Ah, because it's printed in an online advertisement of the product it must be a fact, right?

Makes me wish I were a salesman... you'd be my favorite customer.



Big P said:


> Why are you trying to mis inform the students learning on this website just because you find yourself on the shit end of the stick?


Simply because I don't agree with you doesn't make me wrong. It's easy to want to believe that truth lives only within your own mind and that the whole world revolves around you, but it doesn't actually work that way.

Neither of us, by merit of simply being us, is correct or incorrect.



Big P said:


> you wanna pay extra for the same thing or for somthing worse, you are welcome to do it, but pls dont advise others to do the same when there are better and cheaper alternatives out there. Its kind of selfish of you dont you think?


Selfish? You mean kind of like telling someone that they can't express an opinion you don't agree with? Perhaps.



mared juwan said:


> hooked.on.ponics. I have no hostility towards you bro believe me. I have seen you around and for the most part you steer people right. It's just that I have seen you touting Advance as the only way to go in more than one place and I disagree. In fact the comments I was thinking of are from another thread but it did happen just as I said... Please read. https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/118943-do-you-use-dr-hornsbys.html Your aim seems to be to knock everything that is not AN and I don't like it, that is all. And I think I've made it abundantly clear that I DO care what you say. Saying AN is better hands-down is misleading to people who don't know better.


I disagree with you, you disagree with me. The only difference between us is that I recognize that what I'm saying is my opinion. I'm not touting this as some incontrovertible fact. This is simply what I've found to be true in my experience.

It is equally as inappropriate for me to say that you should not post your opinions as it is for you to say I shouldn't post mine. The nature of a public forum is that everyone gets a voice. We don't have to agree. We don't have to like everything everyone else has to say.

But trying to censor me because you disagree with me isn't any different than the people who decide that MJ should be illegal because they disagree with those who don't.

I'm not wrong because I disagree with you any more than you're wrong because you disagree with me.


----------



## Big P (Apr 4, 2009)

hooked.on.ponics said:


> I didn't lie. I called your post a cut-and-paste job BECAUSE IT IS.
> 
> Do you deny it's a word-for-word copy of this
> https://www.grownhydro.com/flora-bloom-p-42.html?osCsid=b61bcb4db08da996cec75dece13e3496
> ...


 

post a pic of your grow ponics I posted pics of my grow. put your plants where your big mouth is, lets see if they are the same size  im tired of arguing in the school yard

.


----------



## mared juwan (Apr 4, 2009)

hooked.on.ponics said:


> I disagree with you, you disagree with me. The only difference between us is that I recognize that what I'm saying is my opinion. I'm not touting this as some incontrovertible fact. This is simply what I've found to be true in my experience.
> 
> It is equally as inappropriate for me to say that you should not post your opinions as it is for you to say I shouldn't post mine. The nature of a public forum is that everyone gets a voice. We don't have to agree. We don't have to like everything everyone else has to say.
> 
> ...


 
Nobody is trying to censor anyone. Other people will read this thread besides you, me, and Big P. All I wanted is for them to see that I disagree with your opinion and I think it's weird that you put AN's logo in your avatar. I've accomplished that so I'm done.

And I will take up Big P's challenge even though I know he wasn't talking to me. I really hope to see your buds too, h.o.p. Here's what you get even if you DON'T use all AN products.... <GASP>


----------



## mared juwan (Apr 4, 2009)

No man. I'm on your side LOL. I use only one AN product and my point is that other stuff works just as well or better in combination. You don't need the entire line of AN stuff for it to work. All I use in flower is GH bloom, AN Big Bud, Ionic Boost, and Botanicare Liquid Karma and Calmag. That's four different brands I'm mixing. Try em all!!


----------



## Big P (Apr 4, 2009)

oh shit never mind i thought it was hooked on ponics i was replying to ,nice plant


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Apr 22, 2009)

Big P said:


> post a pic of your grow ponics I posted pics of my grow. put your plants where your big mouth is, lets see if they are the same size  im tired of arguing in the school yard
> 
> .


You're tired of arguing in the school yard, but you want to play "who's got the biggest dick"?

That's a stupid game to play online. How do you know my pics would be mine? How do I know your pics are yours? Maybe we could both post pictures of ourselves holding our ID's up for the camera.

I haven't missed what's going on here. I wrote an intelligent post laying out my side of the issue quite nicely, I thought. And the response was what was "school yard" here. You took one look at my post, realized you had nothing to actually say in response, and immediately went to the equivalent of "oh yeah, well you stink!"

If you can't counter the argument, just try to distract everyone from it, eh?


----------



## Psychopassive (Apr 22, 2009)

mared juwan said:


> Here's what you get even if you DON'T use all AN products.... <GASP>


Nice buds,  but it looks like a bit of nute burn on the tips of those leaves. 

(Sorry, couldn't resist)

<Rant>
I do however agree with you 100% on the subject of AN. I've looked at their marketing stuff and it is complete unmitigated bullshit. They make a big deal out of employing two or three qualified researchers to develop their magic juices. The reality is that there are tens of thousands of highly qualified academics researching agricultural feeds all across the world in universities and manufacturers. 

Despite their limited numbers they come up with new products at a faster rate than the entire agricultural industry put together. If you took their claims seriously it would appear that three scientists and a fat marketing man were at least ten years ahead of the world's leading experts. 

It's a complete rip off and I hold them in complete contempt. 
</Rant>


----------



## Big P (Apr 22, 2009)

hooked.on.ponics said:


> You're tired of arguing in the school yard, but you want to play "who's got the biggest dick"?
> 
> That's a stupid game to play online. How do you know my pics would be mine? How do I know your pics are yours? Maybe we could both post pictures of ourselves holding our ID's up for the camera.
> 
> ...


 
it took you 18 days to come up with that response, i didnt start a thread saying my dick was the biggest, you did, thats why i whipped out my cock and showed what it looks like. 

i had to show you my cock cuz your dippin' and dappin' when you don't know whats happenin'

just give it up man, why keep reviving this thread.


----------



## mared juwan (Apr 22, 2009)

hooked.on.ponics said:


> You're tired of arguing in the school yard, but you want to play "who's got the biggest dick"?
> 
> That's a stupid game to play online. How do you know my pics would be mine? How do I know your pics are yours? Maybe we could both post pictures of ourselves holding our ID's up for the camera.
> 
> ...


Where was your "intelligent post." I must have missed it LOL. You have provided no actual evidence that AN is superior to anything else. All you have done is claim you've seen it for yourself. But then when challenged to produce pictures of your experience you pull this "school yard" BS. 

Big P, this is like arguing with a 5-year-old. We should just give up.


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (May 1, 2009)

Big P said:


> it took you 18 days to come up with that response


Did it take you 2 hours and 42 minutes to type up this response? Or was there some time that elapsed between when I hit Submit and you came along to read my reply?

I don't live on this board, so I don't check to see if you've said anything interesting with any significant frequency. Between my garden and running my business I only drop in around here once a week or less.

If you want to believe it takes me days and days to formulate a response to you, well far be it from me to deflate your ego. You're clearly convinced of a great many things I don't believe to be true and you're not the slightest bit interested in what I have to say except to think of ways to disagree.




Big P said:


> i didnt start a thread saying my dick was the biggest, you did, thats why i whipped out my cock and showed what it looks like.


Sorry, I'm not interested in your equipment. I wish you all the best in finding someone who is.



mared juwan said:


> You have provided no actual evidence that AN is superior to anything else.


Because I'm not an idiot. First, I won't be baited into photographing my op. I will never be caught because I am meticulous about security.

Second, it doesn't matter what kind of evidence I could provide. No matter how well AN performs in my garden it won't prove a single thing if you want to believe that what you use would do better. I can't go around testing every single combination of every single nutrient, and even if I did anyone who wants to hate AN would just decide that I wasn't objective in the first place.

Ergo, there can be no proof because in this situation opinion and belief will always trump it.


----------



## Big P (May 1, 2009)

hooked.on.ponics said:


> Did it take you 2 hours and 42 minutes to type up this response? Or was there some time that elapsed between when I hit Submit and you came along to read my reply?
> 
> I don't live on this board, so I don't check to see if you've said anything interesting with any significant frequency. Between my garden and running my business I only drop in around here once a week or less.
> 
> ...


 
congrads on you business guess your some sort of big shot. I have freinds like you who always trying to make thier shit seem so cool or so important, its cool man, im friends with people like that and have fun with them. they are the type that will find out somthing cool, and then rather than show thier friends how to do it also, and let them enjoy it too, they say figure it out for yourself and dont share knowledge.

Dont worry I get,


im just the total opposite. if I find out somthing cool that is hard to figure out I tell all my freinds and show them how to do it. even if they didnt work hard for it. You know why? cuz who gives a shit.

you just got this self rightousness about you that is off putting I think.


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (May 6, 2009)

Big P said:


> congrads on you business guess your some sort of big shot.


There's three kinds of business owners. Those who are big shots, those who only think they are, and those who know they aren't. Very, very few big shots in the group - most business owners are small business owners (something like 99% of us).

I'm not a big shot. I could make more money working for someone else and spend fewer hours doing it but I like the freedom of being my own boss. The point of me bringing it up wasn't to convince you I'm important or something, but to illustrate why I don't spend a lot of time here.



Big P said:


> you just got this self rightousness about you that is off putting I think.


I would call it self confidence, not self righteousness. It may be off-putting but I won't apologize for being confident in myself and my knowledge.


----------



## mared juwan (May 6, 2009)

hooked.on.ponics said:


> Because I'm not an idiot. First, I won't be baited into photographing my op. I will never be caught because I am meticulous about security.


I just think it's interesting that this guy got all up in arms when I criticized expensive nutes. Remember, he even implied that I said anyone who buys expensive nutes is stupid (when in reality I said nothing of the sort). Now here he is CLEARLY saying that anyone who posts photos of their op is an idiot. That's a lot of people here on this site, buddy. I guess we're all idiots so why are you here? Your "self confidence" or whatever you want to call it is quite off-putting indeed.


----------



## Toohighmf (May 7, 2009)

Hello, some of you might remember me from the ol AN forums. I used to own a shop called hooked on ponics, and was an advanced nutrients tech rep for mondo pro shop. (US distributor)

I googled hookedonponics.com to see who bought the domain when I came across this link to this thread mentioning hooked on ponics and AN!!! WTF? Are you biting on my style? 
AN was a job, I've been pretty successful with it. About as successful as running GH Lucas formula (1part micro, 2 parts bloom) AN was great when it was free, though you wouldn't catch me using the whole line. To find the right products of line, feels similar to sifting through elephant dung to find a peanut. I used elephant dung to describe how BIG a FARCE AN is. They have 4-5 products that I can say are innovative, but the rest of the line is cheap Copies of proven products like GH grow micro bloom, SBA/B, nitrozime, dry flowers, supernaturals terra, and the list goes on and on.
Big bud, overdrive, voodoo juice, scorpion juice, and iguana juice were the only products they didn't copy, aside from their beneficials which are crap incomparrison to most $10 pales of mycs, or trichoderma. 

AN's New PH/PPM PERFECT LINE is living proof that a sucker is born every day. If you believe that after 4 reformulations on connoisseur, 3 nutrient calculator revisions that are still completely off, 60 products in their line, short shelf life, ridiculous price increases, unbelievable claims, ENJOY!

Thanks for having me!


----------



## YouGrowBoy (May 17, 2009)

Big P said:


> some have gone as far over the years to seem to have tried them all
> 
> this is how I came to choose GH nutes
> 
> and here is why I conclude it is one of the best out there if not the actual best:


I have a serious question related to this topic that I hope someone can answer.

If the Flora Series is a complete package of nutes, why do you think GH produces their own additives like KaBloom, Diamond Nectar and others? 

Is it just to get more money from products that really don't add anything above what the Flora Series does or do additives really create bigger buds, higher yields and better tasting smoke?

I know, I just took a baseball bat to a hornets nest.

YGB


----------



## Mr. Skunk (May 19, 2009)

I've been using AN for awhile now and had good results, but I wouldn't mind giving something else a try with the price differential. I use

Sensi 2 Part-Grow A
Grow B

Big Bud
Barricade
Carboload
B-52
Voodoo Juice (when needed)
Overdrive
Final Phase
Sweetleaf

All you AN bashers want to give me some good alternatives, GH, Botanicare, Canna, etc.


----------



## unity (May 20, 2009)

Flora Nova/ Flora Bloom, that might be way to simple though 
Unity


----------



## Toohighmf (Jul 7, 2011)

where you at hooked on ponics? you hiding under an AN poster with fat mike?


----------



## watchhowIdoit (Jul 7, 2011)

You have to blow the dust off this thread before posting. Sorry but you guys are a couple of years too late. Its great how so many pay attention around here.


----------



## hooked.on.ponics (Jul 14, 2011)

No posters here, just some MASSIVE nugs.


----------

