# Stepped out of my comfort zone.



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 2, 2016)

So I've been SCROGing for a few years and decided I'm sick of dealing with it. Don't get me wrong it's done me well but it's just too hard to maintain in my little room. It's hard to reach the back of the plant to trim under growth, hard to check for problems and if I have to do a filter or fan change mid grow it's impossible. So I figured low stress training was the way to go. This way I can rotate the plant and if need be, remove it from the room. I can also cut down on my veg time. Hopefully my quality will go up. Don't really care about quantity anymore. I was producing way more than I could ever smoke. Any pointers or concerns are appreciated.


----------



## Chunky Stool (Dec 2, 2016)

I'm not a big fan of SCROG either. It definitely has advantages, but I'd rather just grow nine well-trimmed plants instead of six brushy ones under a net. Easy to rotate and pull out of the tent if they need individual attention.


----------



## Tim Fox (Dec 2, 2016)

selfmedicator462 said:


> View attachment 3843968 So I've been SCROGing for a few years and decided I'm sick of dealing with it. Don't get me wrong it's done me well but it's just too hard to maintain in my little room. It's hard to reach the back of the plant to trim under growth, hard to check for problems and if I have to do a filter or fan change mid grow it's impossible. So I figured low stress training was the way to go. This way I can rotate the plant and if need be, remove it from the room. I can also cut down on my veg time. Hopefully my quality will go up. Don't really care about quantity anymore. I was producing way more than I could ever smoke. Any pointers or concerns are appreciated.


that looks great,, but works best in soil containers i guess,, cant rotate and lift out in most hydro or SIP type grows, I suppose you could lift out and rotate in DWC


----------



## Chunky Stool (Dec 2, 2016)

Tim Fox said:


> that looks great,, but works best in soil containers i guess,, cant rotate and lift out in most hydro or SIP type grows, I suppose you could lift out and rotate in DWC


Yep. I hand water my plants. It's a hassle, but it's nice to be able to use nutes that would cause problems in hydro systems. 
Everything is a trade off. 
I'm still on the fence about my next grow. Can't decide between a coir mix or organic water-only soil. I've already got everything I need to do either one. 
Hmm...


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 2, 2016)

Tim Fox said:


> that looks great,, but works best in soil containers i guess,, cant rotate and lift out in most hydro or SIP type grows, I suppose you could lift out and rotate in DWC


I hand water. Smart pots and promix


----------



## Chunky Stool (Dec 2, 2016)

selfmedicator462 said:


> I hand water. Smart pots and promix


Can't go wrong with promix HP. 
Ever thought about mixing in a little kitty litter? 
$4 at wal-mart


----------



## pookat (Dec 2, 2016)

i use clear rubble bags peat +50-75% kitty litter sort of organic.
if i got a good mum then she gets a bed box aswell, slice the base of the bag -ya can see the root's- on to the extended root base, she can get big n bushy, great for cuts.
lol chunky £3.75 at tesco


----------



## Tim Fox (Dec 2, 2016)

Chunky Stool said:


> Yep. I hand water my plants. It's a hassle, but it's nice to be able to use nutes that would cause problems in hydro systems.
> Everything is a trade off.
> I'm still on the fence about my next grow. Can't decide between a coir mix or organic water-only soil. I've already got everything I need to do either one.
> Hmm...


my current grow is a water only soil grow, so i am partial to grows that way now


----------



## Tim Fox (Dec 2, 2016)

selfmedicator462 said:


> View attachment 3843968 So I've been SCROGing for a few years and decided I'm sick of dealing with it. Don't get me wrong it's done me well but it's just too hard to maintain in my little room. It's hard to reach the back of the plant to trim under growth, hard to check for problems and if I have to do a filter or fan change mid grow it's impossible. So I figured low stress training was the way to go. This way I can rotate the plant and if need be, remove it from the room. I can also cut down on my veg time. Hopefully my quality will go up. Don't really care about quantity anymore. I was producing way more than I could ever smoke. Any pointers or concerns are appreciated.


outstanding mainlining by the way!!! 2 thumbs up


----------



## Chunky Stool (Dec 2, 2016)

Tim Fox said:


> my current grow is a water only soil grow, so i am partial to grows that way now


What's your mix? 
I was thinking about using 3 cubic feet of "torn bag" soil from home depot (half price). I believe it's Dr. Earth brand. Add 1 cubic foot of worm castings, 1 cubic foot of special kitty, and a cup or two of Epsoma tomato (dry fert).


----------



## Tim Fox (Dec 2, 2016)

i got some soil amendments from "Buildasoil.com" i used some left over dirt from a container tomato from last summer,, i also put in some horse manure compost ,,( we have 2 horses),, some chicken manure compost ( used to have about 20 chickens, plenty of poop out there where they used to be,, has cooked for about 4 years),, I added domolite lime and some happy frog dry nute, the little bit of old soil started life as FFOF,, so its a missh mash of this and that,, 
the plants are kickin ass in it,, healthy ist grow i have ever had,, water only so far,, i have put a little cal mag in the water,, because i am under cobs, and the plants were demanding it when they were little, I think the lime is starting to break down now,, the last to res fills were just plain water,,, water comes out of my faucet at 6.5 ph,, we are on a well,, ppm is close to zero ,,


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 2, 2016)

Chunky Stool said:


> Can't go wrong with promix HP.
> Ever thought about mixing in a little kitty litter?
> $4 at wal-mart
> View attachment 3844017


I use Promix HP and a bunch of perilite and some lime. Whats the advantage of kitty litter?


----------



## Tim Fox (Dec 2, 2016)

selfmedicator462 said:


> I use Promix HP and a bunch of perilite and some lime. Whats the advantage of kitty litter?


i am wondering also,, my only guess is it retains water,, the clumping?,, unless they use the older non clumping stuff


----------



## Chunky Stool (Dec 2, 2016)

selfmedicator462 said:


> I use Promix HP and a bunch of perilite and some lime. Whats the advantage of kitty litter?


Improves aeration while holding a little water. I've also heard that it provides sulfur. 
And it doesn't float, which I really like. 
My plants *really* dig it. 
Hell, I put 100 lbs of special kitty in my garden and grew 10 foot sunflowers! And we had a SHLOAD of zucchini. Couldn't give it away fast enough...


----------



## Chunky Stool (Dec 2, 2016)

Special Kitty natural cat litter is calcined clay. Same as Turface. 
Consistency of ground up clay bricks.
Definitely non-clumping.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 2, 2016)

Couple hrs later and she already adjusted. Love these plants!


----------



## Tim Fox (Dec 2, 2016)

selfmedicator462 said:


> Couple hrs later and she already adjusted. Love these plants!View attachment 3844061


totally radical


----------



## Chunky Stool (Dec 2, 2016)

selfmedicator462 said:


> Couple hrs later and she already adjusted. Love these plants!View attachment 3844061


I was surprised how much abuse young plants can tolerate. I have taken long lanky plants & pinned the meristems down in a circle around the pot. They were a little annoyed at first, but adjusted within a few days. 
Don't try to LST mature plants. They will snap.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 2, 2016)

Might veg this one 2 more weeks or so. This is Cali connection CBD OG by the way.


----------



## Nugachino (Dec 4, 2016)

Never done scrog. But that topping-lst method you're using works a treat. You're still getting a canopy of sorts. Just that instead of one main cola. You're getting a whole bunch of them.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 4, 2016)

This thing is coming alive!


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 4, 2016)

selfmedicator462 said:


> View attachment 3845564 This thing is coming alive!


Thirty years ago, I trained just as you're doing. I usually got 4 zips per plant and occasionally one would hit 8.

Looking good, brother!


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 4, 2016)

How much bigger should I go before I flip? I used to veg till the 3x3 screen was full, about 6 weeks give or take. It's a 5 gallon pot so it can get good sized I've had the trunk get about 1.75". Usually pulled 11-14 oz.


----------



## phantumstranga (Dec 5, 2016)

Crazy nice. Two week flip


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 7, 2016)

I think I'm gonna like this lots better than scrog.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 7, 2016)

Nice training!

I like to hand water and individually mix and feed even. 

One tip. I have always heard and now know from testing it is better to veg seeds until maturity before flowering for best potency and terpene content. 

So I veg seeds with little or no LST about 35 to 45 days until it shows pistols or asymmetric growth before I move them to flower. 

Everyone has noticed and it was a matter of one more week veg. 

Then I bend by week 2 in flower to form a bush.


----------



## Chunky Stool (Dec 8, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Nice training!
> 
> I like to hand water and individually mix and feed even.
> 
> ...


You start LST during the stretch?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 8, 2016)

Chunky Stool said:


> You start LST during the stretch?


Yup. Usually by day 10 I support the stem and bend them in half and tie down to the pot. Then just stake and tie and train as necessary.

If they get to tall in veg I will bend them then though. I grow a perpetual so it can depend on what spaces are available.

Sorry to clutter the original op's thread but this is another way to do it. Lots of ways work.

Here's some pics.


----------



## WeedFreak78 (Dec 8, 2016)

I use these things for LST training. 





They are for making wreaths, like $1.50 ea at hobby stores. All diameters from 4" up. I drill holes in the lip on the edge of bucket lids and zip tie them on. I've staked them down in soil.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 8, 2016)

WeedFreak78 said:


> I use these things for LST training.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Very cool! I am considering using a 2 ring tomato cage set up. I would have to put it in the pot when it got to the flower room as I grow all different size plants at the same time and it would not fit under the t-5's. For now I still bend, stake, tie and supercrop as needed to keep my plants around 2' x2' from canopy to soil.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 8, 2016)

selfmedicator462 said:


> I think I'm gonna like this lots better than scrog. View attachment 3848191


I am excited to see this plant develop. It looks awesome!


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 8, 2016)

How much trimming should I do on this? On scrog I cleaned house below the screen. Obviously I won't let this plant get that big. Right now it appears the lower limbs might actually see some light. We will see in a week.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 8, 2016)

I never remove any healthy leaves or growth. 

Well maybe the 2 lowest branches in veg if I want clones.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 9, 2016)

Damnit! One branch broke off when I was watering it. Looks like the top split away a few days ago and it tore the rest of the way when I touched it. Wasn't one of the top two thank god but a nice middle branch. I moved one of the center scronny ones over in its place. Maybe it will fill in.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 11, 2016)

Little lopsided now but it will fill in. PS. I don't normally leave trim lay like that. It normally goes outside but it's cold and I'm a puss.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 12, 2016)

Oops. Water is important. I'll post a pic in a few hrs. She will be back to normal.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 12, 2016)

Literally 30 minutes later


----------



## Indacouch (Dec 12, 2016)

selfmedicator462 said:


> Oops. Water is important. I'll post a pic in a few hrs. She will be back to normal. View attachment 3851866





selfmedicator462 said:


> Literally 30 minutes laterView attachment 3851899


Can I have permission to steal these pics to show new members what it looks like when a plant asks for water .....and how it's not a big deal to wait for this to dial in watering .....I'm always trying to explain it but don't have my own pics for example ......beautiful plant btw


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 12, 2016)

Sure. No problem. It freaked me out the first time it happened but now I think it's fun.


----------



## Indacouch (Dec 12, 2016)

selfmedicator462 said:


> Sure. No problem. It freaked me out the first time it happened but now I think it's fun.


I find myself trying to explain exactly what you have pictures of above ....new growers often overwater like crazy and they don't realize how quickly these plants bounce back after recieving there water .....thank you for allowing me to use those before and afters .....you may see them later in posts about watering .....perfect example of how to dial in watering .....TY


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 17, 2016)

Flipped it today. About 5 weeks into veg. It's been a challenge. It's cold so I had to add heat. Humidity is low so I added a humidifier. I'm able to keep it around 35%. Winter grows used to be great with mh/hps bulbs cause of the added heat. With the LED i have to compensate but my summer grows are much cooler.


----------



## mauricem00 (Dec 17, 2016)

selfmedicator462 said:


> View attachment 3843968 So I've been SCROGing for a few years and decided I'm sick of dealing with it. Don't get me wrong it's done me well but it's just too hard to maintain in my little room. It's hard to reach the back of the plant to trim under growth, hard to check for problems and if I have to do a filter or fan change mid grow it's impossible. So I figured low stress training was the way to go. This way I can rotate the plant and if need be, remove it from the room. I can also cut down on my veg time. Hopefully my quality will go up. Don't really care about quantity anymore. I was producing way more than I could ever smoke. Any pointers or concerns are appreciated.


looks great. I have used SOG for a few years now with great results but am planing on giving up my MMJ card and growing under the new recreational law. this reduces the number of plants that I can grow so my last grow I topped twice without a net and got as much from 3 plants as I did with 6 plants in SOG. this time i'm adding a net.have found that SOG reduces veg time by about 2 weeks.but LE seems to harass MMJ patients a lot and RECREATIONAL GROWING creates no record of activities


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 21, 2016)

Filled in nicely. Really stretched. I feel like I need to tie down a second time further out on the branch to get more horizontal growth. Next time. Just tying to a cloth pot probably isn't the best. Too much flex. I'm still kicking around the idea of switching to either an ebb n Flo type set up. In flower I'm watering every other day. Sometimes it's hard to get away for a weekend.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 26, 2016)

Couple issues. The main trunk split right where it was topped. Did a quick tie job so it can't split anymore. Been a few days and that branch seems fine. The other thing.....this bitch took off straight up! I would have ran out of height before it even had half grown flowers. So I had to supercrop. Didn't want to. That's the one nice thing about scrog...grown till it's just thru the screen, flip it then start weaving. They usually only end up 12-14" about the screen when done. Might have to flip sooner next time.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 26, 2016)

selfmedicator462 said:


> View attachment 3861548 View attachment 3861549 Couple issues. The main trunk split right where it was topped. Did a quick tie job so it can't split anymore. Been a few days and that branch seems fine. The other thing.....this bitch took off straight up! I would have ran out of height before it even had half grown flowers. So I had to supercrop. Didn't want to. That's the one nice thing about scrog...grown till it's just thru the screen, flip it then start weaving. They usually only end up 12-14" about the screen when done. Might have to flip sooner next time.


Careful with that twist tie. It needs to be loosened or the branch will grow around it and maybe get cut or pinched. But I have done this before and it never poses a problem. I just loosely tie stuff together. 

And I supercrop like that and bend and tie branches all the way through flower as needed. 

Great job. Awesome plant. I like eatching this progress.


----------



## andlund0930 (Dec 30, 2016)

Wow man that plant is a beast? How far into flower? Looks like that bad girl has a lot of stretch left. Really well done. I use a 2x4x5 so I have height limitations. My first handful of grows were all scrog but for the same reasons I just switched to mainlining as well as made it perpetual now, which is great. Anyways here is my non scrog canopy. And an old pic of the scrog. You can see between the two pics I've almost doubled my production since. Well done man that plant is a beast!


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 30, 2016)

andlund0930 said:


> Wow man that plant is a beast? How far into flower? Looks like that bad girl has a lot of stretch left. Really well done. I use a 2x4x5 so I have height limitations. My first handful of grows were all scrog but for the same reasons I just switched to mainlining as well as made it perpetual now, which is great. Anyways here is my non scrog canopy. And an old pic of the scrog. You can see between the two pics I've almost doubled my production since. Well done man that plant is a beast!


Right now im at 2 weeks. Im just excited I get to cut the branches and hang them at harvest instead of having to disect a plant bud by bud.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Dec 30, 2016)

Crazy stretch. Gonna have to supercrop some more.


----------



## andlund0930 (Dec 31, 2016)

Don't think she will go to much further, buds look set. Bet you'll get 4-6 oz off that girl. Dare I say more.....


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 31, 2016)

selfmedicator462 said:


> View attachment 3864461 Crazy stretch. Gonna have to supercrop some more.


Don't super crop again, it's done stretching. Spread it out a bit more and clean up the interior larf and you'll get a nice harvest in 6 weeks or so. 

Your watering interval issues have solutions like ebb n flood or timed irrigators or blumats.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Jan 1, 2017)

Did some trimming. Got rid of everything that wouldn't get to the canopy.


----------



## nl5xsk1 (Jan 1, 2017)

Is this an 8 COB setup, and what size room? Im running 8 COBS in a 42"x42"x72", and haven't made up my mind about cobs yet, second run, still dialing in


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Jan 1, 2017)

nl5xsk1 said:


> Is this an 8 COB setup, and what size room? Im running 8 COBS in a 42"x42"x72", and haven't made up my mind about cobs yet, second run, still dialing in


yeah its an 8. My build thread should be around somewhere. Im in about a 3x3x5. I definetly like it over HPS because of the heat reduction. Its a more even light too. I dont get hot spots or bleaching.


----------



## nl5xsk1 (Jan 1, 2017)

selfmedicator462 said:


> yeah its an 8. My build thread should be around somewhere. Im in about a 3x3x5. I definetly like it over HPS because of the heat reduction. Its a more even light too. I dont get hot spots or bleaching.


Thanks for quick feedback


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Jan 4, 2017)

She's a thirst girl. Dries the 5gal pot in 2 days.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Jan 8, 2017)

Just finished week 3 on Friday. Been supercroppin like a mofo to keep 10" of space between my light. She got outta hand quick. Won't happen next grow.


----------



## ttystikk (Jan 8, 2017)

selfmedicator462 said:


> Just finished week 3 on Friday. Been supercroppin like a mofo to keep 10" of space between my light. She got outta hand quick. Won't happen next grow. View attachment 3871367


As problems go, it's really not a bad one to have, right?


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Jan 17, 2017)

Little night shot. I'm not a photographer by trade. Week 5.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Jan 22, 2017)

Well here it is starting week 6. How's it look? I've been feeding every water which is about every other day but I've been using a minimal amount of nutes. Usually around 500-600 of base. I've just started noticing the slightest of yellow tips so I might just water this week. The other pic is just to give you an idea of the stretch. Definetly going to make a "halo" of some sort to widen out the base before it goes vertical.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Jan 22, 2017)

Also.....it's sooooo nice being able to turn the whole plant to trim. Before because of the screen I had to lay on my back under the thing.


----------



## hillbill (Jan 22, 2017)

I use 1 1/2 gallon or so containers with a rim where I drill holes for ties for training. Mine are waste baskets and are about 9 years old. I use a pretty intense mix and at most times get by with weak alfalfa teas and compost teas. 

NAPA 8822 floor dry is a great component for a soil mix and it both drains and retains water. Very useful.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Jan 27, 2017)

Week 6 is in the books.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Feb 3, 2017)

Week 7 is done. They are gaining weight. Had to tuck one to keep it from falling. That's why it looks like there's a gap.


----------



## clorbag (Feb 4, 2017)

selfmedicator462 said:


> Week 7 is done. They are gaining weight. Had to tuck one to keep it from falling. That's why it looks like there's a gap. View attachment 3892939


im doing my first scrog but damn lst seems to be doing the trick! i am alos a vet grwoing my own meds after a long pill filled bvattle with the va. 
glad you made it home.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Feb 5, 2017)

It took me several years to figure out the VA was doing to me. All they wanna do is keep you numb so you don't complain. I'm off of almost all my mental health related meds since I started smoking.


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 5, 2017)

selfmedicator462 said:


> It took me several years to figure out the VA was doing to me. All they wanna do is keep you numb so you don't complain. I'm off of almost all my mental health related meds since I started smoking.


Good on you. Don't let the pill pushers win, no matter who they say they work for.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Feb 5, 2017)

all seriousness, i used to be like everybody else......was totally against cannabis cause it was illegal. Never even smelled weed till i got into the service. Then after it soaked in that none of these "pot heads" were dying, losing their jobs or raping their sisters I said fuck it and tried it, got so fucked up i slept like 18 hours. Woke up alive and in one piece. Kinda laid off for job purposes for the better part of 20 years then woke up one day feeling like a zombie and just said hell with it and started smoking daily. That was 5 years ago. Im still alive.


----------



## farmerfischer (Feb 5, 2017)

Lookin good..


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 5, 2017)

selfmedicator462 said:


> all seriousness, i used to be like everybody else......was totally against cannabis cause it was illegal. Never even smelled weed till i got into the service. Then after it soaked in that none of these "pot heads" were dying, losing their jobs or raping their sisters I said fuck it and tried it, got so fucked up i slept like 18 hours. Woke up alive and in one piece. Kinda laid off for job purposes for the better part of 20 years then woke up one day feeling like a zombie and just said hell with it and started smoking daily. That was 5 years ago. Im still alive.


You didn't mention if it helps make your life better or not. I do because I like the effects, lol


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Feb 5, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> You didn't mention if it helps make your life better or not. I do because I like the effects, lol


Ha ha guess I didn't. Yes I think it helps and I like how I feel. It's mellowed me out a lot. I used to be wound pretty tight. I don't have any anxiety or panic when I'm smoking. Used to have daily attacks at one point.


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 5, 2017)

selfmedicator462 said:


> Ha ha guess I didn't. Yes I think it helps and I like how I feel. It's mellowed me out a lot. I used to be wound pretty tight. I don't have any anxiety or panic when I'm smoking. Used to have daily attacks at one point.


I'm glad you found something that calms you down. I'm even more glad it's a dangerous, harmful drug that we should be locking people up and throwing away the key for, like weed. 

Because it easily could have been a lot of things for me, and I suspect for a lot of folks.


----------



## a senile fungus (Feb 5, 2017)

Awesome documentation here! Very cool to see the progression.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Feb 10, 2017)

Starting week 9. It's getting close to done. I hope it turns blue like the last grow did. Buds are getting hefty. Even spotted a double bud. I've kept my base nutes around 500-600ppm and just watered after every 2 feeds. Don't appear to be getting salt buildups like I have in the past. Some slight bleaching from running out of height but other than that it looks ok. Even the popcorn buds down low look like they are maturing good. For some reason I can't load pics but I'll try later.


----------



## Bowtieguy77 (Apr 18, 2017)

Where did this go???


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Apr 29, 2017)

Sorry. I havent been on much. I couldnt post pics so It kinda killed it. It ended up finishing good.


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 29, 2017)

selfmedicator462 said:


> Sorry. I havent been on much. I couldnt post pics so It kinda killed it. It ended up finishing good.


Sorry to hear that you couldn't post pics.

Glad it turned out well.


----------



## selfmedicator462 (Apr 30, 2017)

I have started another grow already. La Plata Quin N Tonic. Just staked down 6 main stems! Not sure how it happened but i topped it early and ended up with 4 nice mains and 2 that are just a hair smaller in diameter. I switched from Promix HP to Promix Organic soil this time. Im already liking not watering so much and not having to mix nutes every time. Ill start a new grow thread.


----------

