# Opinions About Death



## Dislexicmidget2021 (Aug 31, 2011)

so i was wondering and thinking about this subject,We have life and while we are in life we view death in many ways.My thought is that death is a transition not a means to an eternal end ,though this form we currently manifest will cease to be when transition occurs, this much we do understand.While it is my belief that that everything is made of energy condensed to make the form physicaly manifest. Energy that can never be created nor destroyed,we have come to understand this in Science.We only transfer energy or are rearranged when changing forms.In this happening it is unknown if memories of past energy forms could transfer into the new form,yet I do not view as an impossibility,yet that is beside my point.What is death to you?

So what are your thoughts people?


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## Joedank (Aug 31, 2011)

I believe our oversoul exists a sort of energy sink that our beings spiral around in unison with the cosmos and await our next chance to excape the mortal coil and let our energy flow INTO the oversoul and realize our true potential to be one with the godhead as we began a peice of energy with purpose(soul).
Just my veiw


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## Luger187 (Aug 31, 2011)

Dislexicmidget2021 said:


> so i was wondering and thinking about this subject,We have life and while we are in life we view death in many ways.My thought is that death is a transition not a means to an eternal end ,though this form we currently manifest will cease to be when transition occurs, this much we do understand.While it is my belief that that everything is made of energy condensed to make the form physicaly manifest. Energy that can never be created nor destroyed,we have come to understand this in Science.We only transfer energy or are rearranged when changing forms.In this happening it is unknown if memories of past energy forms could transfer into the new form,yet I do not view as an impossibility,yet that is beside my point.What is death to you?
> 
> So what are your thoughts people?


our bodies just decompose and all the molecules break down into smaller chains so other organisms can use it. our memories are nothing but complexed connections between neurons in our brains, so no, our memories dont go with us. if you kill a rat, where does his memory go? if a cat eats that rat, will the cat take on the rats memories and possibly personality? no...

what makes us any different than a rat? why do people believe rats decompose and get eaten by other organisms, but humans dont? why would humans be special and have a 'soul' that goes up into heaven? it just sounds nice to us, so we believe it. we would like to think death is not the end, and there is a great afterlife waiting for us after. but of course, this is just all in our heads.


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## mccumcumber (Aug 31, 2011)

Thinking that death=end shows a that one does not really understand how time works.
Read Vonnegut's _Slaughter House Five_ it will do you wonders.


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## Luger187 (Aug 31, 2011)

mccumcumber said:


> Thinking that death=end shows a that one does not really understand how time works.
> Read Vonnegut's _Slaughter House Five_ it will do you wonders.


i believe that our thoughts, experiences, senses, memories, etc. are all just a function of the brain/body. when the brain doesnt work anymore, those all cease to function as well.

the book looks interesting, i will read. thanks


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## Heisenberg (Aug 31, 2011)

Death is something we understand pretty well. The afterlife is something we do not understand at all, not even to the point of knowing if it exists. The best answer anyone can come up with is "I don't know". There are some philosophical arguments for consciousness surviving physical death that are compelling and do not make that many assumptions to get there, but they sound nothing like typical ideas of the afterlife.

Which do you fear most, your own death, or the death of the people close to you? I do not relish the thought of my death, but IMO it is likely to be no different than sleep; no different than before my birth, so it is not likely to include awareness. That is something I experience nightly and do not fear. I do not like the idea that I will have to leave the party forever while everyone else gets to stay, but that is not fear. I am scared that I may get sick and suffer before I die, but that is fearing the process of death, not being dead. What I fear most is the utter sorrow i'll feel when death claims those I am close to.


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## asafan69 (Aug 31, 2011)

I have only one thought about death, and that is this: It sucks.


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## Dislexicmidget2021 (Sep 1, 2011)

Luger187 said:


> our bodies just decompose and all the molecules break down into smaller chains so other organisms can use it. our memories are nothing but complexed connections between neurons in our brains, so no, our memories dont go with us. if you kill a rat, where does his memory go? if a cat eats that rat, will the cat take on the rats memories and possibly personality? no...
> 
> what makes us any different than a rat? why do people believe rats decompose and get eaten by other organisms, but humans dont? why would humans be special and have a 'soul' that goes up into heaven? it just sounds nice to us, so we believe it. we would like to think death is not the end, and there is a great afterlife waiting for us after. but of course, this is just all in our heads.


I can agree with your response completely Luger it makes perfect sense however the energy properties we inhabit in our form are still 
not completeley known.take for example a train moving along on its tracks,well you have a running engine and when the engine dies or turns off the
train is still in motion even after the brakes are applied to slow its momentum to a stop.So my thought would be
if your brain shuts off and you die,and the body ceases to function,dose the energy inside the body instantly disapate or is there
a period where the brakes are being applied to this part so to speak,soul/essence/leftover energy/momentum leaving 
the body or perhaps this is not a scientificaly sound thought?The idea being that there is a possibilty of an 
aftereffect of our concsiousness when death occurs and because the theorized aftereffect isnt physicaly witnessed we cant put it
into a form of logic that is palpable.
Now mind you i think that the heaven/hell idea is whats in our heads,yet thats another topic discussed ad nauseum but we know this.


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## Joedank (Sep 1, 2011)

I just wonder if we are just complex connections why am I a ME and you you? How are we identifying our selves?? Energy space time= life But where is the I"?? I like the slowing of the train analogy it seems to be a interesting idea . Energy cannot be destroyed only manipulated.


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## Luger187 (Sep 1, 2011)

Dislexicmidget2021 said:


> I can agree with your response completely Luger it makes perfect sense however the energy properties we inhabit in our form are still
> not completeley known.take for example a train moving along on its tracks,well you have a running engine and when the engine dies or turns off the
> train is still in motion even after the brakes are applied to slow its momentum to a stop.So my thought would be
> if your brain shuts off and you die,and the body ceases to function,dose the energy inside the body instantly disapate or is there
> ...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_of_energy
the energy from that train is all still there. the momentum turns into heat and friction on the wheels, along with a small amount of wind resistance. it takes a loooong time for the train to stop because just the wheel friction doesnt transfer energy very well(that is the point of a wheel). you can shorten the time it takes to stop the train by applying brakes, which get really hot, and transfer the momentum energy into heat. all this heat dissipates into the air. of course brakes arent perfect transferers(word?) of heat, so it still takes time.

BUT if you had a big mountain sitting on the train tracks, that train would stop pretty quickly. if this were to happen, the energy would be changed into heat from friction through metal-on-metal and rock-on-metal contact, also the metal frames of the train would bend and break until all the energy is absorbed.

all of the energy stays in the system. nothing disappears.

now lets look at the body. the energy in the body is inside of our cells, and includes our heat too, and maybe something else i cant think of ATM. when we die, bacteria attack our cells and poop out stuff that either other bacteria or plants like to eat. bugs like worms also do this. the bacteria also release heat and O2 or CO2(dont remember which). if you take all of this energy(including the energy inside the bugs) and added it all up, it would equal EXACTLY the energy that was in your body beforehand. of course, this gets very complicated because you have to determine how much heat was produced, how much O2 or CO2, etc etc.
but they can do these types of experiments in small scale with multiple methods.

i believe you are mistaking the word energy for what most would refer to as a soul. many people have tried to find it within the body, but all have failed. i remember one experiment where a guy weighed patients as they died to see if the soul left, and made them lose weight in the process. it didnt work 

as i said before, i believe(pretty much fact) once our brain stops functioning, so do our mental capabilities. this includes the senses, memory, logic, thought, *consciousness*, etc. without these things, it should not matter if there is an afterlife for us, because this is what makes *us*. we wouldnt even realize its an afterlife because we would not be aware of our current lives.



im high


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## direwolf71 (Sep 1, 2011)

Death is the great unknown, period. Only those who have gone before us know whats on the other side. One day we will all get to experience it for ourselves, that is certain.


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## Luger187 (Sep 1, 2011)

Joedank said:


> I just wonder if we are just complex connections why am I a ME and you you? How are we identifying our selves?? Energy space time= life But where is the I"?? I like the slowing of the train analogy it seems to be a interesting idea . Energy cannot be destroyed only manipulated.


that is exactly what we are; complexed connections. we are a collection of trillions of cells, each with their own function and job. just the human brain alone is the most complexed single thing we know of. the complexity of it is astonishing to say the least.

this thread reminded me of these. this guys got a lot of good ones.
[video=youtube;VdRCPjXn1DY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdRCPjXn1DY[/video]
[video=youtube;jyjNXdEGjO4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyjNXdEGjO4[/video]
[video=youtube;r6w2M50_Xdk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6w2M50_Xdk[/video]


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## Luger187 (Sep 1, 2011)

direwolf71 said:


> Death is the great unknown, period. Only those who have gone before us know whats on the other side. One day we will all get to experience it for ourselves, that is certain.


ahh but what if we DONT experience it? the word experience means you have to sense it in some way, correct? if so, those already dead may not be able to sense/experience it and thus would not know. there would have to be some COMPLETELY different system of reality and thought processing for us to experience an afterlife. our senses, memories, etc. are merely a collection of neurons connected to eachother. they do not go with us. so how would we process thoughts? how would we comprehend what is happening?

not arguing, im just high and shouting questions =]


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## Dislexicmidget2021 (Sep 1, 2011)

It is an endless nameless that you describe,without the brain.the body we dont process anything,theorizing the afterlife is all we can do at this point,but it is a possibility that we are still
taking on another form of life,the complexity of it is on a scale that is next to mentaly intangible.The only phenomena that never ceases is change this much seems certain,perhaps memories, experience of life itself is only occuring in the moment they are realized in the mind and do not carry over after transition of form.That seems nominal.Energy and the soul are 2 different things because energy is physical, a soul is but a thought and theory to comfort those who are uncomfortable with the thought of it being just as such.Do i ask that you think about it as a possibility of being a form of energy?Yes.But i wont try to win you over with the jelly in the center of donut,Good vids though.


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## Luger187 (Sep 1, 2011)

Dislexicmidget2021 said:


> It is an endless nameless that you describe,without the brain.the body we dont process anything,theorizing the afterlife is all we can do at this point,but it is a possibility that we are still
> taking on another form of life,the complexity of it is on a scale that is next to mentaly intangible.The only phenomena that never ceases is change this much seems certain,perhaps memories, experience of life itself is only occuring in the moment they are realized in the mind and do not carry over after transition of form.That seems nominal.Energy and the soul are 2 different things because energy is physical, a soul is but a thought and theory to comfort those who are uncomfortable with the thought of it being just as such.Do i ask that you think about it as a possibility of being a form of energy?Yes.But i wont try to win you over with the jelly in the center of donut,Good vids though.


yes we are all energy. atoms are just energy taking the form of mass. too stoned to think right now haha


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## Zaehet Strife (Sep 2, 2011)

no one knows...

to to presume that you do... is one of the most arrogant thoughts in human history. all we have is an idea, our beliefs... they are just ideas too. accepting my own ignorance of the universe was pretty hard at first, but it brings you a certain unexplainable feeling of peace, happiness and freedom as well. 

the past lives only in memory, the future lives only in imagination... the only real tangible thing in existence is the here and now, right here, right now. 

dont fear the unknown, accept it. dont fear death, accept it... theres not much else you can do except be afraid lol.

the only thing we can do is be positive, set a good example for others... and just pretty much love life to the fullest.


ps. i enjoyed reading all of your cool thoughts and ideas =D thank you for sharing


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## Dizzle Frost (Sep 2, 2011)

death completes the cycle of life, its nothin to be afraid of. The thing i dont get is .when some folk have this romance bullshit with death...ive watched people die, and there aint no romance in it lol , its just a part of life.

Im with Strife....live life to the fullest cuz you never know when your clocks gonna get punched.


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## metaltooths (Sep 2, 2011)

death is what happens before reincarnation.


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## Zaehet Strife (Sep 2, 2011)

metaltooths said:


> death is what happens before reincarnation.


if believing that helps you sleep better at night, i guess you gotta do what you gotta do...millions of other people do it too.


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## bicycleday (Sep 2, 2011)

Why worry about things you can't control?


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## Apathy One x (Sep 2, 2011)

Ahem.... when you die you get everything you wished for.
so for example, if you believed there was a heaven and you were a good girl then you go to heaven
if you were a atheist, and you believed that you cease existing, then you cease to exist

you direct your energy


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## Dislexicmidget2021 (Sep 2, 2011)

bicycleday said:


> Why worry about things you can't control?


True indeed why,but in this case whos worried?


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## tyler.durden (Sep 3, 2011)

The idea that we can somehow 'survive our own deaths' (it sounds more ridiculous each time I hear it) is part of Cartesian Dualism. Descartes reasoned that the mind was made up of a 'non-physical' (again, a silly term) substance. It it used to reason souls, and it is the idea behind those switch movies whereby one person's mind can inhabit another's body. For a long time I was into a philosophy that professed that our consciousness will be preserved by other advanced civilizations through out the universe at the moment of our deaths, as consciousness was the highest value in the universe. I really liked that idea, I still do. We can speculate on all sorts of exotic ideas about if there is experience after our physical deaths, but all we know to date indicates there is nothing. Realizing this has really lit a fire under my ass (you mean this life isn't just a dress rehearsal, and it's all I'll ever have? Shit, I'd better get a move on and appreciate everything NOW!) Children are natural dualists, but I think it's proper, even noble, that we grow out of it...


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## metaltooths (Sep 3, 2011)

Zaehet Strife said:


> if believing that helps you sleep better at night, i guess you gotta do what you gotta do...millions of other people do it too.


it doesn't get me to sleep. it's an opinion. millions of them as well..


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## dukeanthony (Sep 3, 2011)

No Human will ever understand Death
Death = non existance
And you cannot truly imagine what that means to not exist

try it. Imagine you dont exist and there is no sense and no thoughts
Its an impossible thing to imagine

Like dividing by zero


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## mexiblunt (Sep 3, 2011)

Can you imagine what happens to the electrical energy in our bodies when we die? What is one milli volt divided by zero?


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## Zaehet Strife (Sep 3, 2011)

tyler.durden said:


> The idea that we can somehow 'survive our own deaths' (it sounds more ridiculous each time I hear it) is part of Cartesian Dualism. Descartes reasoned that the mind was made up of a 'non-physical' (again, a silly term) substance. It it used to reason souls, and it is the idea behind those switch movies whereby one person's mind can inhabit another's body. For a long time I was into a philosophy that professed that our consciousness will be preserved by other advanced civilizations through out the universe at the moment of our deaths, as consciousness was the highest value in the universe. I really liked that idea, I still do. We can speculate on all sorts of exotic ideas about if there is experience after our physical deaths, but all we know to date indicates there is nothing. Realizing this has really lit a fire under my ass (you mean this life isn't just a dress rehearsal, and it's all I'll ever have? Shit, I'd better get a move on and appreciate everything NOW!) Children are natural dualists, but I think it's proper, even noble, that we grow out of it...


 
very awesome bro, i really like that. the only thing we know for sure what happens when you die... your body is made up of energy litterally, and it gets released into the universe, weather it be like final fantasy shit we dont know about, or when your body degrades into the soil and the planet turns us into food for plants. either way, the energy you once had gets released... ats all we know.


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## tyler.durden (Sep 3, 2011)

Zaehet Strife said:


> very awesome bro, i really like that. the only thing we know for sure what happens when you die... your body is made up of energy litterally, and it gets released into the universe, weather it be like final fantasy shit we dont know about, or when your body degrades into the soil and the planet turns us into food for plants. either way, the energy you once had gets released... ats all we know.


Exactly. It's as if every living creature lucky enough to be born gets to borrow some energy from the universe for a short while to exist, and when that time is up you simply give it back to the universe. Of course, our sense of I-ness dissipates along with our physical body (that's the part most find hard to accept)...


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## Luger187 (Sep 3, 2011)

mexiblunt said:


> Can you imagine what happens to the electrical energy in our bodies when we die? What is one milli volt divided by zero?


electricity is nothing but electrons being transferred from one atom to another. the electrons in our body would be absorbed by atoms that lack electrons. and i think anything divided by zero is infinity, but i dont see what that has anything to do with what were talkin about haha


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## Heisenberg (Sep 3, 2011)

Our body is a source of potential chemical energy that can be harvested when we die. In this sense our energy is returned to the cosmos. I think it's important not to confuse this with indication that our consciousness represents some sort of energy and that this energy is released from our bodies when we die. Energy must be precisely quantifiable and adhere to the laws of thermodynamics or else it is not energy as defined by science. If we are using the word for lack of a better term then fine, but then we can't say "we know". What we do know is if we damage a part of the brain we can affect different aspects of consciousness. We can lose the ability to recognize faces, to talk, to perform music, or even the capacity for intellectual thought. Given this knowledge, it does not follow that if we damage ALL of the brain via death our consciousness somehow survives with faculties in tact. The brain utilizes energy to store information, and once destroyed that information is lost. Like a book after it's been burned, the information is technically still there, but it is in a meaningless form.


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## Zaehet Strife (Sep 3, 2011)

there for, taking into consideration what heisen said... i think logically, and reasonably speaking... that humans as individuals do not stay indivuduals when we die, or that a part of you, stays forever. pretty sure we just get recycled into everything else. and i just hope that me being a good person will give the universe some kinda goodness when i die, to help battle the badness out there. if not, oh well..

but if theres anything im completely sure of...its that nobody really knows, and to claim that you do... is one of the most arrogent things any human could ever do, and has ever done. silly fuckin religios and spiritual people trying to give themselves hope in a universe that has unanswerable questions. hehehehe


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## Dislexicmidget2021 (Sep 3, 2011)

Most are not content with the idea that they will die someday,but what really scares the hell out of them is that when they die,they will not be anything but the fertilizer for grass or the food for the animals/bugs to put it mundanely, not to mention the relinquishing of consciousness at all levels of the self concept can be hard to grasp,but at the same time if your really open to the thought, its a comfort.


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## Midace1.2 (Sep 3, 2011)

Luger187 said:


> our bodies just decompose and all the molecules break down into smaller chains so other organisms can use it. our memories are nothing but complexed connections between neurons in our brains, so no, our memories dont go with us. if you kill a rat, where does his memory go? if a cat eats that rat, will the cat take on the rats memories and possibly personality? no...
> 
> what makes us any different than a rat?


I'm not disagreeing..however...the fact that we STUDY rats (and many other species) to further our knowledge about anything and everything...unbeknownst to the rat, I think that makes us kinda special. I think you'd have to be very closed minded not to see a difference between Humanity and any other species on this planet. Look what we've accomplished....we're different.

In regards to the topic question....many different cultures have come to identify "Chi Energy" in various ways. I haven't definitely settled on any possibility after physical death..but I "feel" as if there's something. Good enough for me..


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## RawBudzski (Sep 3, 2011)

Life's a [email protected] & then you Die.


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## Heisenberg (Sep 3, 2011)

Midace1.2 said:


> I'm not disagreeing..however...the fact that we STUDY rats (and many other species) to further our knowledge about anything and everything...unbeknownst to the rat, I think that makes us kinda special. I think you'd have to be very closed minded not to see a difference between Humanity and any other species on this planet. Look what we've accomplished....we're different.
> 
> In regards to the topic question....many different cultures have come to identify "Chi Energy" in various ways. I haven't definitely settled on any possibility after physical death..but I "feel" as if there's something. Good enough for me..


Unfortunately none of those 'various ways' are verifiable, which makes chi nothing more than unsupported speculation. There is nothing about any understanding of chi that is demonstrable, repeatable, or would let us make testable predictions even on the level of proof of concept. 

The fact that we study and learn from animals for 'anything and everything' would suggest to me that we are very much like them. We have higher awareness, higher reasoning, higher communication, but we have nothing that is totally absent from the rest of natures creatures. That you consider a feeling to be evidence of objective claims is concerning. If you walk outside and look around, do you feel that the earth is flat or spherical? A feeling, or observation, is sufficient evidence to begin inquiry, but has no value beyond that without support.


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## Luger187 (Sep 3, 2011)

Midace1.2 said:


> I'm not disagreeing..however...the fact that we STUDY rats (and many other species) to further our knowledge about anything and everything...unbeknownst to the rat, I think that makes us kinda special. I think you'd have to be very closed minded not to see a difference between Humanity and any other species on this planet. Look what we've accomplished....we're different.


rats are smarter than goldfish. are they 'different'?(in the context that you were saying. obviously they have differences lol)

yes, we are different from the rat. but we are both life, and come from the same bloodline. i think it is close minded to say humans are special just because we HAPPEN to be on top of the intelligence chain. you could say blue whales are seperate than everything else just because they happen to be the biggest. doesnt make it right


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## Zaehet Strife (Sep 3, 2011)

people are just so afraid of death, because they are so afraid that a part of themselves might not exist after death. so instead of accepting the truth within themselves... that humans nor any creature known to us has the ability to know, they are so terrified of not knowing, they make up comforting fairy tails that they believe in, so they can cope with their own fear of the unknown. 

you cannot get rid of the fear, it stays with you always. kinda like how you cant stop someone from startleing you, from scaring you... no matter how hard you try you jump when someone jumps out at you. but its your decision weather or not you scream...or if you stop, think, assess the situation... and then make a decision.

you cannot control fear, but you can decide what you want to do with it if you try.

nothin in life is for certian, especially what happens when you die... can you handle the truth. or will you continue to believe in your comforting fairy tails like a weak, pathetic egotystical tiny spec of a human being.

accept your ignorance to be free from it, it is the only way to be truely happy in this existance.

the past lives only in memory, the future lives only in imagination. the only thing that truly exists is the here and the now. live in the moment, appreciate everything.. what ya got right here right now... its only gonna happen once my friends.


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## Midace1.2 (Sep 4, 2011)

Heisenberg said:


> The fact that we study and learn from animals for 'anything and everything' would suggest to me that we are very much like them.


How? What animal studies US in laboratories with Computers and Massive Databases of stored information?? Or did I miss that part?



Heisenberg said:


> We have higher awareness, higher reasoning, higher communication, but we have nothing that is totally absent from the rest of natures creatures.


Sure do. Civilization, Culture, War, Poverty....name an animal that comes close to replicating any of that. 




Heisenberg said:


> That you consider a feeling to be evidence of objective claims is concerning.


It's thinking like that which leads us nowhere. And since you seem so high on proper grammar, a slight correction for you: I clearly said " I haven't definitely settled on any possibility after physical death..but I feel as if there's something" The fact that I'm relying on feeling makes this a subjective claim...not objective.




Heisenberg said:


> If you walk outside and look around, do you feel that the earth is flat or spherical? A feeling, or observation, is sufficient evidence to begin inquiry, but has no value beyond that without support.


...mmmmkay...So, tell me then how I'm supposed to go off anything BUT my feelings in regards to the Afterlife?? Unless you have some kind of research stashed away that Humanity doesn't know about..


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## XRagnorX (Sep 4, 2011)

Death..... What we see now is only a dim reflection in the mirror, then we shall see face to face. 
I have been outside this mortal frame, I have traveled through space and time and have spoken to spiritual and astral beings. I have seen the formation of space and time. There was a time I felt so detached I just felt like I was a pilot inside this mortal frame. "what where those tiny pills anyway?" 
When we die we will awake into another reality, good for some , no so good for others. We are in fact immortal energy beings, we are in some weird tailored reality created of energy and somehow formed and controlled through electro-chemical reactions.

Before I became enlightened as a youth I seriously contemplated suicide and thought about it long and hard. I realized that even if I closed my eyes, or I was in complete darkness I still have an overwhelming sense of self, I am more than just the some of my parts. I somehow knew that if I blew my brains out I would just enter into another reality and what if it was just dark and empty as the dispair that existed inside my mind? So, I didnt do it.... would hate to make a mistake and end up in a worse way.
After I met God by playing Ozzy backwards at 48 speed(chong<<<Joke) I realized just how serious a mistake I could have made.
Death is stepping through the doorway into eternity.


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## Zaehet Strife (Sep 4, 2011)

yet more comforting fiary tells, because to not know is seriously scary. if you need to make them up to feel good about yourself, then thats what you must do. almost everyone on the planet does, there are very few of us who have awakened to the truth, there are very few of us who realize our own ignorance and accept it in the face of the biggest fear in the existance of humans. we must all get past our fear to be truly happy, to be free from fear we must face it and say I DONT CARE IF I DONT KNOW, IM GONA LIVE, IM GONNA BE A GOOD PERSON AND A GOOD EXAMPLE TO THE WORLD! IM NOT AFRAID ANYMORE!!!

its not that you have a weak mind, its just that you must look within to find the courage to accept your ignorance of the universe, and accept that there is one thing in life that is for certian... no matter how much lsd you take, no matter how many hours of meditation you put in (i have experimented with both profusely to find answeres to these unanswereable questions) you do not know what happens when you die, no one does.

uncertianty in the presence of vivid hopes and fears is so very hard, and even more painful... but must be endured if we humans wish to live life without the support of comforting fairy tales. this is the only way to truly be free from our fear.

i state yet again, nobody knows... and to claim that you do, is by far one of the most arrogent things any human could ever claim. lol

the things people will tell themselves so they arent scared anymore, you must control your fear, or the fear will control your life.


WAKE UP, TAKE RESPONSABILITY FOR YOUR THOUGHTS 

WAKE UP MY FRIENDS!!! your beliefs... hey are just your thoughts, your beliefs... they are just your ideas. keep them that way.


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## Heisenberg (Sep 4, 2011)

Midace1.2 said:


> How? What animal studies US in laboratories with Computers and Massive Databases of stored information?? Or did I miss that part?


How does our study of animals constitute a distinct difference? Animals study other animals and even humans. How do pets learn where the food is stored or when their keeper is leaving to go outside? This is not training, it is observing behavior and learning from it; study. So then your only distinction is that we use computers, laboratories, and keep written data. I am unable to see the logical connection here, and wonder how that makes me close minded.




> Sure do. Civilization, Culture, War, Poverty....name an animal that comes close to replicating any of that.


Civilization represents the idea that we are advanced in our intellect, record keeping, social behavior, and material development. As stated before, these are not unique to humans, just more refined.

Animals engage in learned behavior that is taught to peers and offspring, such as the use of tools or communication methods, which are used for greater well being. IOW culture. 

Ants wage war for territory and food. Bacterial colonies have been known to engage in warfare as well when they send a 'poison' member of the colony over to join an adjacent one. 

Poverty is a term that reflects the need for nutrition, health care, clean water, ect. Poverty was invented to describe the conditions of humans not having these things, but animals can obviously lack these things as well.

There are certain concepts which arise only in the presents of higher intelligence, such as sentiment, but again, animals have intelligence, just not as advanced as ours.



> It's thinking like that which leads us nowhere. And since you seem so high on proper grammar, a slight correction for you: I clearly said " I haven't definitely settled on any possibility after physical death..but I feel as if there's something" The fact that I'm relying on feeling makes this a subjective claim...not objective.


The objective claim is that there is an afterlife. This afterlife would exist or non exist independent of you or your feelings. You said you feel there is something to it and indicated that this feeling is 'good enough'. I only pointed out that intuition can and often does lead us to false beliefs, which is worse than nowhere. A feeling is not good enough for anything but the beginning of inquiry. BTW you will not find one post of mine on here where I insult someone for grammar or spelling errors.




> ...mmmmkay...So, tell me then how I'm supposed to go off anything BUT my feelings in regards to the Afterlife?? Unless you have some kind of research stashed away that Humanity doesn't know about..


You can go by your feelings and it is indeed the only thing you have to go on, but that is not justification for drawing any sort of conclusions.


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## DrFever (Sep 4, 2011)

make what ever you want from it but from the moment your heart stops your brain will still continue to live for approx 1 hr sending signals to your organs for oxygen and as your brain dies flashes of your life will start goin on as your brain starts combating its own death 
making a story short once the light goes off so does everything you ever new and you just become nothing ashes to ashes dust to dust


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## Midace1.2 (Sep 4, 2011)

Thank you for clarifying. +rep


One person could tell you the differences of an Apple & Orange, while one could tell you the similarities, all in how you look at it really. Wasn't trying to get heated, it just felt like you dismissed what I said earlier without much explanation. If there's one thing Science tells us, it's that the Universe is beyond a size we can fathom....which tells me there's a WHOLE lot of stuff we don't know. But I guess realistically we all find out in the end so why concern ourselves with it.


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## sso (Sep 4, 2011)

.. i personally just tried out of body experiences. (obe, astral travel) (easily researched on the internet, with lots of techniques to do it, took me about 2 weeks, (though i have some meditation experience and whatnot)

soon after that i got my own proof of live after death.

lets just say, thoughts of death do not bother me overmuch, other than missing close one´s (gonna be ashit load of time before i see them again..)

the death of animals does not bother me either, since i know they have a soul too (or whatever you want to call it, they do live after death too)

--

i do not offer this knowledge to convince you, your fear of death or unwillingness to explore does not concern me.

i simply offer this for those that want to try. 

astral travel took about 2 weeks for me to master, with about 5-10 minutes most day devoted to it.


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## Luger187 (Sep 4, 2011)

Midace1.2 said:


> How? What animal studies US in laboratories with Computers and Massive Databases of stored information?? Or did I miss that part?


they dont study us. he meant the main reason we study most animals is because they are like us. we study and use rats for experiments because they are very close to us genetically and they produce quickly. we also use monkeys. if they werent like us, there would be no reason to do experiments with them, other than to find out what they are like.




> Sure do. Civilization, Culture, War, Poverty....name an animal that comes close to replicating any of that.


many primates have a social hierarchy, cultures, and wars. cant think of an example for poverty right now.



> ...mmmmkay...So, tell me then how I'm supposed to go off anything BUT my feelings in regards to the Afterlife?? Unless you have some kind of research stashed away that Humanity doesn't know about..


its okay to have 'feelings' about the afterlife, as long as that feeling is based on facts. if i had the feeling that when we die, we actually turn into stars, and that is why there are so many stars, what would you say? you would ask for evidence, right?

i dont think its possible for our conscious selves to go into the afterlife. i believe this because i know our conscious self is nothing but a collection of neurons. when our brain stops working, our consciousness goes away. so even if some sort of 'soul' did exist that we dont know about, it wouldnt take our consciousness with it. for this reason, i dont think the soul would even recognize ANYTHING, have any memories, have senses, etc. it would be like being born into this world. nothing but new experiences.
i think its funny that angels just so happen to see in our visible light spectrum. also somehow they can process the information, which means they have some sort of brain. so if i hit an angel over the head with a brick, what happens?


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## Prefontaine (Sep 4, 2011)

Dislexicmidget2021 said:


> so i was wondering and thinking about this subject,We have life and while we are in life we view death in many ways.My thought is that death is a transition not a means to an eternal end ,though this form we currently manifest will cease to be when transition occurs, this much we do understand.While it is my belief that that everything is made of energy condensed to make the form physicaly manifest. Energy that can never be created nor destroyed,we have come to understand this in Science.We only transfer energy or are rearranged when changing forms.In this happening it is unknown if memories of past energy forms could transfer into the new form,yet I do not view as an impossibility,yet that is beside my point.What is death to you?
> 
> So what are your thoughts people?


 What makes you think this is life? how do you know your not floating in a eternal limbo shadowing your memories of life? I think there for I am, but you have no proof that you are not simply a thought passing through the cerebellum of an autistic child?


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## Luger187 (Sep 4, 2011)

DrFever said:


> make what ever you want from it but from the moment your heart stops your brain will still continue to live for approx 1 hr sending signals to your organs for oxygen and as your brain dies flashes of your life will start goin on as your brain starts combating its own death
> making a story short once the light goes off so does everything you ever new and you just become nothing ashes to ashes dust to dust


i dont think the brain lasts quite that long. i think what happens when the brain is dying is it starts to reverts back to a 'primitive state'. it senses the low O2 levels, and switches to visuals of flashing memories of your life, or strange hallucinations based on ones beliefs. it also pumps a shitload of dopamine to make you feel great i think


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## sso (Sep 4, 2011)

hmm, well, you could also say about the astral travel, that it only happens in the brain..

as, its heavily connected to the dream world and there you can practically create everything, in your mind you are god.

but, its also possible to enter other dimensions and including our own.

example.

i went from the dream world to the real world and into my kitchen where my mother was doing the dishes. (this was back when i was in school)

i was just energy so invisible (though you arent always apparently, according to other experiences, but i have not looked heavily into the astral, i have other concerns now and interests=)

but still, i was able to confirm that my mother was indeed doing the dishes.

now for me, entering the real world was exhausting and required alot of energy. so only possible for short moments, but i hear with practice you get stronger.

there have been some research on this, but i can not offer any claims of validity, i prefer to get my own proofs anyway and especially on such a controversial subject.


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## Luger187 (Sep 4, 2011)

sso said:


> hmm, well, you could also say about the astral travel, that it only happens in the brain..
> 
> as, its heavily connected to the dream world and there you can practically create everything, in your mind you are god.
> 
> ...


that is nothing but hallucinations. we can recreate those experiences by taking certain drugs. they also have a magnetic device that can make you have a very real spiritual experience. just like prayer, it is all a trick of the mind.

also, please look up what energy is. you dont seem to understand what that means


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## Zaehet Strife (Sep 4, 2011)

sso said:


> hmm, well, you could also say about the astral travel, that it only happens in the brain..
> 
> as, its heavily connected to the dream world and there you can practically create everything, in your mind you are god.
> 
> ...


dude, ive been lucid dreaming for 8 years now, ever since i was little and gained the ability to remember my dreams. astral traveling, alien abductions, night terrors, sleep parylsis. they are all different forms of lucid dreaming that you either have control over, or dont, either way... its becoming concious in your dreams. 

i have flown through space to different planets, met aliens and conversed with them, saw many different kinds of plants and alien animals...but the difference between us is. i know that its a dream, and you think its real...LOLOL!!!!!


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## Heisenberg (Sep 4, 2011)

sso said:


> hmm, well, you could also say about the astral travel, that it only happens in the brain..
> 
> as, its heavily connected to the dream world and there you can practically create everything, in your mind you are god.
> 
> ...





Astral projection is one of the easiest concepts to prove. Simply supply some information that you couldn't have otherwise. For example, we could place a random number generator in the room next to a subject, and he could view it and tell us the sequence. This would be strong evidence for remote viewing or astral travel, yet it has never been done, despite many many many attempts. You can test this yourself. Have someone write something completely random on a paper and leave it in another room. If you don't cheat and apply controls (such as no contact with the person after writing) and you can view what was written, you have significant evidence. In fact, if you can do this, you qualify to win the million dollar prize from James Randi.


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## Zaehet Strife (Sep 4, 2011)

yet again i state;

Uncertianty in the presence of vivid hopes and fears is so very hard, and even more painful... but must be endured if we humans wish to live life without the support of comforting fairy tales. if we wish to live life being true to ourselves. this is the only way to truly be free from our fear.

but all of you who hold onto your beleifs, all of you who are too scared to admit that you dont know, i feel an empty sadness for you, that you are so scared you must fill the holes inside yourselves with made up truths so you can be comforted in knowing 100% that you will exist after this existance (if you can even claim this reality exists, no one knows that for sure either) 

because if you do that, you have an excuse to keep living the life your living, to keep wasting your life away, instead of appreciating every moment of your existance. because for us who realize the truth, we know that this just might be... reasonably, logically speaking, the last chance we are going to have to be a concious being. 

so waste your days away, continue to live life like a zombie, a robot... an ant. beleive in your thoughts, or how you would put them.. your beliefs lol. when anyone who has any intelligence at all can tell you that your beliefs are all just thoughts and ideas anyways lmfao.

its so interesting to observe fear in humans, and the things they make up so they can cope with that fear. very very sad indeed. 

asral traveling...lol, comon man, its called LUCID DREAMING


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## Dislexicmidget2021 (Sep 4, 2011)

Prefontaine said:


> What makes you think this is life? how do you know your not floating in a eternal limbo shadowing your memories of life? I think there for I am, but you have no proof that you are not simply a thought passing through the cerebellum of an autistic child?


I dont think anything within the contexts to which I would delve a critical response to the question,anything is possible yet it is ones perspective that determines if he/she is in the limbo you describe and to not need proof if they are just a thought or a memory,we are here and now this is what i know to be true.


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## sso (Sep 4, 2011)

Luger187 said:


> that is nothing but hallucinations. we can recreate those experiences by taking certain drugs. they also have a magnetic device that can make you have a very real spiritual experience. just like prayer, it is all a trick of the mind.
> 
> also, please look up what energy is. you dont seem to understand what that means


*well, its possibly a trick of the mind, i never said it wasnt.

not totally sure how you think i dont understand energy, care to explain? doesnt really matter either, we are not energy, but what controls the energy (imo)*



Zaehet Strife said:


> dude, ive been lucid dreaming for 8 years now, ever since i was little and gained the ability to remember my dreams. astral traveling, alien abductions, night terrors, sleep parylsis. they are all different forms of lucid dreaming that you either have control over, or dont, either way... its becoming concious in your dreams.
> 
> i have flown through space to different planets, met aliens and conversed with them, saw many different kinds of plants and alien animals...but the difference between us is. i know that its a dream, and you think its real...LOLOL!!!!!


 *its rather inconsequential to me if real or not, but how are you so sure it isnt real? how are you so sure its all a dream? (dreams have a totally different feel for me..and i never lose consicousness moving into the astral.)*


Heisenberg said:


> Astral projection is one of the easiest concepts to prove. Simply supply some information that you couldn't have otherwise. For example, we could place a random number generator in the room next to a subject, and he could view it and tell us the sequence. This would be strong evidence for remote viewing or astral travel, yet it has never been done, despite many many many attempts. You can test this yourself. Have someone write something completely random on a paper and leave it in another room. If you don't cheat and apply controls (such as no contact with the person after writing) and you can view what was written, you have significant evidence. In fact, if you can do this, you qualify to win the million dollar prize from James Randi.


well i cant do it, i rather offered that astral stuff for fun and my thoughts with it.
why cant i do it?

well last times i tried to go astral, i failed to do so. i always needed quite a bit of energy to do it and especially to do what you describe.

it always also seemed to me that this would need quite a bit of devotion to master, which i never tried to do, just dabbled in it bit as well as lucid dreaming (mostly i dont dream and dont give a fuck, my dreams are no mystery to me)

this might seem as excuses, but i really have nothing to prove here, dont give a damn even if im totally wrong on everything i said.
if you can prove me wrong, ill happily retract everything i said.

this bit of information is not important to me and very little informationvise really is..

there are some notions i would be devastated if proved wrong, but i simply enjoy talking about these things.

who can really know what death is, till tasted?

who can prove anything of the sort till we have some handy machine to test it or open a portal into the other side?

personally i find comfort in thinking i will live forever, always a new and new adventure.

sometimes ive found great discomfort in that thought, but on the whole it works.

then i just let it go.

i am here and now and this is what i like to do.


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## Zaehet Strife (Sep 5, 2011)

... im callin shananagins on that one


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## bicycleday (Sep 5, 2011)

Dislexicmidget2021 said:


> True indeed why,but in this case whos worried?


umm read some of the posts


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## Luger187 (Sep 5, 2011)

> sso said:
> 
> 
> > *well, its possibly a trick of the mind, i never said it wasnt.
> ...


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## Dislexicmidget2021 (Sep 6, 2011)

So many people think within the concept that we have this "soul" which leaves the body at death while preaching 
about something that cannot be fused with evidence on any level then want to have you believe that youre a fool for
not seeing what they do and call you blind,its some level of ego that makes these people believe that they are
an enlightened person,and having this sense that you do not.When in actuality it is the foolhardy notion
that drives there way of thinking to the lines of pshychological insanity.Once they actualy do understand that once 
the end of life has occured and are no longer of this world a profound sense can take place, that is the 
enlightenment needed to extract the illusion of eternal life out of the line of reasoning.Fear is the key 
player in this,but to have someone tell you that your blind while they cling to their blanket of
nonsense security is just laughable......some people.


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## Zaehet Strife (Sep 6, 2011)

Dislexicmidget2021 said:


> So many people think within the concept that we have this "soul" which leaves the body at death while preaching
> about something that cannot be fused with evidence on any level then want to have you believe that youre a fool for
> not seeing what they do and call you blind,its some level of ego that makes these people believe that they are
> an enlightened person,and having this sense that you do not.When in actuality it is the foolhardy notion
> ...


that was one of the most beautiful things i have ever read, bravo Dis, bravo man. you said it right all right there. congratulations, i have been looking for words like this for a long time, thank you for putting them in a way the lamen can understand. 

true wisdom Dis, true wisdom


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## Luger187 (Sep 9, 2011)

bump. id like to hear more peoples thoughts on this


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## Farfenugen (Sep 12, 2011)

Death is not an end. I have been there. No need to go into the details, it would take up too much time. Needless to say, as I was dying, I felt this rush of energy and a sort of heaviness at first, like I was punched in the chest, then everything was lifted. This is a cliche, but I was pulled out of my body, it was very electrical, my thoughts (my own) were very clear, as my sense of self, my body, my physical sense was still with me. I felt like a glass human, still with form but made of light energy. I don't believe in God or religion or any of that nonsense but I do believe in continuing on. And no, I wasn't high at the time. No dream, or trance, just the reality of knowing that it wasn't an end, death (the death that I had always though of) wasn't real. It was no big deal what all the fuss was about. Do I wish I was still there? No. I want to live for a long, long time, 100, 200 years if that were possible. It will always be there waiting for us, so I see no need in escaping it, just making my life as happy and easy as I can with those that I love. This includes my free will, not fearing the big bad meanines who think they control everything and these silly stupid rules about what I can and cannot grow or put into my body.


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## Luger187 (Sep 13, 2011)

Farfenugen said:


> Death is not an end. I have been there. No need to go into the details, it would take up too much time. Needless to say, as I was dying, I felt this rush of energy and a sort of heaviness at first, like I was punched in the chest, then everything was lifted. This is a cliche, but I was pulled out of my body, it was very electrical, my thoughts (my own) were very clear, as my sense of self, my body, my physical sense was still with me. I felt like a glass human, still with form but made of light energy. I don't believe in God or religion or any of that nonsense but I do believe in continuing on. And no, I wasn't high at the time. No dream, or trance, just the reality of knowing that it wasn't an end, death (the death that I had always though of) wasn't real. It was no big deal what all the fuss was about. Do I wish I was still there? No. I want to live for a long, long time, 100, 200 years if that were possible. It will always be there waiting for us, so I see no need in escaping it, just making my life as happy and easy as I can with those that I love. This includes my free will, not fearing the big bad meanines who think they control everything and these silly stupid rules about what I can and cannot grow or put into my body.


just curious, how did you die?
and how do you know that experience was 'real' and not a hallucination? maybe that is just the brains way of shutting down. some people have flashes of memories throughout their life. i believe the memories are also from the dead persons perspective, so its what they saw at the time, you know? thats one of the reasons why i think it may be all in the head. we can have very crazy experiences on drugs like DMT, so isnt it at least possible for it to be in the brain?

not tryin to argue...


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## Dislexicmidget2021 (Sep 13, 2011)

The chemical reactions in the brain are truely fantastic,at the prospect of exiting the world even the brain itself will throw out its own going away party on a colossal scale.The very realization of passing inside the mind at this point becomes comfortably numb ,realizing "hey im goin out might as well make the most of it"then the ultra high sh*t occurs from the reaction.Then maybe you could see the soul out of the body,but it will only be the chemicals working to ease the panic and pain of the exit.You wont see souls/spirits that are actualy there in front of you in a manifest tangibility that can be seen by any other person nearby spiritualists/religious or not,this being from a logical standpoint.It dosent matter what god you believe in this is what will occur,im not trying to be bias or opinionated with that statement,just being realistic.


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## Luger187 (Sep 13, 2011)

also, if you see family members as 'spirits', they probably have clothes on, which you either remember them wearing or know that is their style. why would people have clothes in the afterlife? it seems meaningless, unless they have a nervous system like ours and can feel cold, which means its not very heaven-like because you can feel uncomfortably cold. this also shows that people can feel shame about being naked. also i think heaven would be better if everyone was naked, as that would also add to the heaven-like experience.
anyways, that shows to me that its just your brains interpretation of seeing that person again, and not really the spirit of them.


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## blazinkill504 (Sep 13, 2011)

i feel that just like you said we have energy "spirit" that carries on past our death. where that goes or what that means i have no clue i hope i just get to fly around the universe for the rest of time checkin all that shit out! it hurts me more to think about the people i care about bein laid to rest more than my actual death...how am i gonna feel shit if im dead ya know. i hope they got some kinda cosmic afterlife dank tho!


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## cannabineer (Sep 13, 2011)

Dislexicmidget2021 said:


> The chemical reactions in the brain are truely fantastic,at the prospect of exiting the world even the brain itself will throw out its own going away party on a colossal scale.The very realization of passing inside the mind at this point becomes comfortably numb ,realizing "hey im goin out might as well make the most of it"then the ultra high sh*t occurs from the reaction.Then maybe you could see the soul out of the body,but it will only be the chemicals working to ease the panic and pain of the exit.You wont see souls/spirits that are actualy there in front of you in a manifest tangibility that can be seen by any other person nearby spiritualists/religious or not,this being from a logical standpoint.It dosent matter what god you believe in this is what will occur,im not trying to be bias or opinionated with that statement,just being realistic.


Overall, I agree with you. I have had amazing things shown to me in dreams, waking visions, ketamine voyages. However i have this underlying suspicion that it's all just neurons firing non-randomly. 
But I have to admit that my certainty that "I am my meat", and when my meat ends so will I, is a statement of faith. I know in my bones that it is so. But that does not mean that I can tell anyone else that it is so. 
cheers 'neer


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## Farfenugen (Sep 13, 2011)

I was electrocuted by accident. And I "knew" it was real because it was as if I was nothing happened. Until it happens to you, then you'll find out I guess. But for me, I don't need to write a book about it or go on talk shows, I know it was real and not the brain's reaction to shutting down.


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## Luger187 (Sep 13, 2011)

Farfenugen said:


> I was electrocuted by accident. And I "knew" it was real because it was as if I was nothing happened. Until it happens to you, then you'll find out I guess. But for me, I don't need to write a book about it or go on talk shows, I know it was real and not the brain's reaction to shutting down.


what do you mean by it was as if nothing happened?


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## Farfenugen (Sep 13, 2011)

it was as if everything was normal, before the accident


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## Luger187 (Sep 13, 2011)

Farfenugen said:


> it was as if everything was normal, before the accident


i take it you mean both emotionally and physically? no pain, not scared or worried...


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## Underthelight (Sep 13, 2011)

I think we just cease to exist as a conscious entity, same as the frog I killed as a child or the deer I shot and had for supper. As far as folks whom have near death experiences, in my opinion it is just the brain misfiring in odd ways, smoke some DMT and you can see how brain chemistry can cause all kinds of odd experiences, and not have to die to experience it.

A person that has a head injury can also be a window into how changes in the brains function can destroy the person they were, did there previous identity we all relate to go onto another place, or do folks think the new damaged identity will continue on? We are just biological machines that are made up of the same of the same basic building blocks that the rest of the physical universe is made from whether it be alive as we like to define it or not. A lot of folks just could never come to terms that there existence it a nut shell means nothing really, and must define a meaning to it all to ease there mind. The creativeness of these beliefs I find truly engaging as our species is always coming up with new and vastly varies ones. And many insist we need these to live fulfilled and moral lives.

Humans tend to think of our selves as some special case versus all other life forms, I just don't think this is true. We all came from stardust in the beginning and to dust I think we shall return. I don't need to believe there is more then that to enjoy my brief blip I call my life, in this vastness of space and time we all occupy.


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## sailjg2sea (Sep 15, 2011)

Reading this post "opinions about death" got me thinking. lets imagine that there are no ways to die except old age. what triggers our bodies to grow old and eventually die? is it caused by a lack of brain stimulation and too much redundancy from day to day. Is it due to our nutrition over the years? what is the true effect that gravity has on our bodies? just some questions that popped into my while reading this forum and floatin on cloud nine


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## grizlbr (Sep 15, 2011)

blazinkill504 said:


> i feel that just like you said we have energy "spirit" that carries on past our death. where that goes or what that means i have no clue i hope i just get to fly around the universe for the rest of time checkin all that shit out! it hurts me more to think about the people i care about bein laid to rest more than my actual death...how am i gonna feel shit if im dead ya know. i hope they got some kinda cosmic afterlife dank tho!


I have been on three sides: normal then step thru the looking glass: OH -hell :migrain! Then the big one left me with seizures. So how do you explain I have never been able to "time" a ora but I know I am going down. When you feel like your water running out on the ground. And the Dr. asks why does he NOT have an IV? And reply Did not think he needed one!


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## grizlbr (Sep 15, 2011)

There are Laws that over rule regular laws like aerodynamics over come the law of gravity. So the Law of life and spirit over come the law of sin and death!


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## Luger187 (Sep 15, 2011)

sailjg2sea said:


> Reading this post "opinions about death" got me thinking. lets imagine that there are no ways to die except old age. what triggers our bodies to grow old and eventually die? is it caused by a lack of brain stimulation and too much redundancy from day to day. Is it due to our nutrition over the years? what is the true effect that gravity has on our bodies? just some questions that popped into my while reading this forum and floatin on cloud nine


the reason you get old is because you system quite literally just shuts down. things dont work as efficiently anymore. the processes that go on inside cells can either slow down or maybe even not work. plus the cells make mistakes in dna replication and protein synthesis. hormone levels change also for various reasons. diet and activity probably have a big role in these things i would think. oh also you dont digest things as well probably. so for X amount of food intake, you absorb less energy at an older age than you did when you were younger, relatively speaking.

gravity affects us in a few ways. one is muscle strength. the constant getting up and down, lifting things, etc. will work out your muscles. obviously the stronger gravity is, the stronger your muscles would be because they lift heavier objects. although it could get so strong you cant lift anything haha.
another one is bone strength and i think density. im not exactly sure how this works though. i know the cartilage in your spine will shrink throughout the day. if you measure yourself in the morning, you will be a bit shorter than at night. when you sleep, it stretches out the cartilage again to get ready for another day of work.


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## Dislexicmidget2021 (Sep 17, 2011)

Every subatomic interaction consist of the annihilation of the original particles and the creation of the new subatomic particles.The subatomic world is a continual dance of creation and annihilation,of mass changing into energy and energy changing to mass.Transient forms sparkle in and out of existence,creating a never-ending forever newly created reality.What is our life but this dance of transient forms?Isnt everything always changing?Dosent everything reside in impermanence?Death is uncomfortable in the ideas of a traditional sense,because of its negative association we have placed upon it for so long,being the ending of something we would like to see last forever.Until one faces that moment it can and will be dismissed by the mind.If contemplated daily the meaning of death takes on redefinition.


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## sailjg2sea (Sep 17, 2011)

im gonna go measure myself lol.
i accept time as being relative. Based upon this, how then would we "grow old", if we're just on a big ball spinning around in space will time exist outside \our solar system and if i leave the gravitational pull of it, am i outside of "time"? i believe "time" only exists because people started counting and keeping track of the day/night cycle of our planet and things just progressed from there. (on a side note, its very hard to speak a language without making any references to time, future tense and past tense, the only one that works is the present tense). why does our body start to wear out like a used tyre? could "aging" be a thought process or attributed to stress and/or something to do our brain chemistry? I would think if it was mental we should be able to control it. AHHH my head is full of questions, that can only be answered by asking what others opinions are about my questions and through their responses re-formulate the philosophy of my life, until i find myself asking new questions...it's quite a cycle, that sometimes drives me a nuts lol.


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## Luger187 (Sep 17, 2011)

sailjg2sea said:


> im gonna go measure myself lol.
> i accept time as being relative. Based upon this, how then would we "grow old", if we're just on a big ball spinning around in space will time exist outside \our solar system and if i leave the gravitational pull of it, am i outside of "time"? i believe "time" only exists because people started counting and keeping track of the day/night cycle of our planet and things just progressed from there. (on a side note, its very hard to speak a language without making any references to time, future tense and past tense, the only one that works is the present tense). why does our body start to wear out like a used tyre? could "aging" be a thought process or attributed to stress and/or something to do our brain chemistry? I would think if it was mental we should be able to control it. AHHH my head is full of questions, that can only be answered by asking what others opinions are about my questions and through their responses re-formulate the philosophy of my life, until i find myself asking new questions...it's quite a cycle, that sometimes drives me a nuts lol.


time is a VERY hard concept. even physicists dont really get it haha.


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## mattman (Sep 17, 2011)

when you die.... you meet God again

I am not a bible scholar, nor very religious, but there is two very important statements in the bible

One writes that God knew you before you were born, and when God was talking about making the world he states that he is "replenishing it" meaning that there were people on it before he put Adam on it.


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## sailjg2sea (Sep 17, 2011)

i sometimes like to think of my life as time spent in a cocoon. my mind/spirit/energy/consciousness, whatever, is trapped in this body, growing and changing all through my days, "death" will be the exit from my cocoon and i will transform. I dont really expect to consciously know anything after my "death" but theres always a possibility  (btw chemical breakdown still a transformation of sorts). i have no idea what comes after this cocoon stage all i can do is speculate. more than likely i will re-join mother earth, if there is a god it's her, without her i would not be alive, none of us would. ANyways, dunno if its weird to be excited about one's death, i am, its a lot of fun speculating about what comes after, life,.Im in no hurry for it to happen though. just very very curious about wahtagwan and hopefully, one day (fingerscrossed) ill know the true answer. buh until then im gonna keep on guessing, BTW religion is for those who are afraid of death, and need to be comforted by the placebo of an afterlife, i'll be quite comfortable without one, just as long as i find out if theres a purpose to life, or whether it's an anomaly, or what, in a way its what keeps me going.


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## Marlboro47 (Sep 17, 2011)

After doing a bunch of drugs and thinking about life and death, the worse case scenerio of death to me is that after death we wait until the universe ends(whether we know were dead or just waiting for a different feeling other then being dead).

Then when the big bang occurs everything happens in the same exact order, just to do it again. I think that there are things alot bigger when it cames to my existance. My existance just makes me feel insuperior to someone who never existed. Because someone who never existed is fresh, pure, clean and completely undefiled.

The universe is just in the backround, resetting just like a dvd.
Except somehow with drugs I became something new, and learned a new emotion completely.
Now I try to change my destiny, even if it means just realizing that I can't.
Shrooooooms


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## weedss (Sep 27, 2011)

I feel like i am in tha ethic class lol


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## sso (Sep 27, 2011)

hmm, im perfectly content with the idea of life after death and leave it at that.
if im wrong, It would be like sleeping and id never know.
see you again, instead of goodbye forever, suits me much better.
can just focus on the now and forget death.

i dont think about it anymore than i do 20-30 years into the future. occasionally but just out of curiousity not dread.


worrying about death... thats like going to a party and spend the entire time obsessing about the end of the party and how much its going to suck. 

missing the party.


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## sso (Sep 27, 2011)

forgetting that there might be other parties, but they are kinda irrelevant at the moment, you are allready in a party.


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## Dislexicmidget2021 (Sep 28, 2011)

Generealy speaking it seems the that every race of humanity has followed the idea of an afterlife since the
times of old antiquity,But as knowledge increases about the world of science we continualy debunk the afterlife or merely
attempt to in theory.If the idea of an afterlife is only theory,then how is it humankind has held this idea for
so long with the theory only changing through different religions and its conveiyance.Of course this isnt asking if
we keep our minds or thoughts after dying but it hasnt been truely debunked 
to were its busted as a myth would be,we just understand that what we see of the dead person is no longer physicaly active in 
this world and that it dosent seem possible that anything is underlying in the background so to speak.


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## eye exaggerate (Sep 28, 2011)

Dislexicmidget2021 said:


> Generealy speaking it seems the that every race of humanity has followed the idea of an afterlife since the
> times of old antiquity,But as knowledge increases about the world of science we continualy debunk the afterlife or merely
> attempt to in theory.If the idea of an afterlife is only theory,then how is it humankind has held this idea for
> so long with the theory only changing through different religions and its conveiyance.Of course this isnt asking if
> ...




...I don't know how much time any discipline has spent in a post mortem state. Surely not enough time to formulate spiritual or scientific law. I know that I'd be like "...sht!" 

In terms of a continuation of life as it was on earth? Death is change too, so I don't know.


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## eye exaggerate (Oct 4, 2011)

...more on change and evolution. The context for soul here is 'sol', the sun, psyche... an energy that cannot be destroyed - only changed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metempsychosis


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## POLICEMATRIX (Oct 4, 2011)

death is the end of everything ,i dont know why people still debate such things , like death can be compared to going asleep in that when it happens you wont know about it ,thats it simple but hard to take in thats why we have religion for people who cant except these things , if you believe otherwise well thats nice for you nothing wrong with it , I have had lots of these debates with friends and we mull over the same stuff for instance ill say it says in the bible god made the earth in 7 days well 6 he took a break on the seventh day and science proves the earth took millions of years to form and millions more to cool from molten form ,also ill say if god made everything who made god ,but then they say well if you believe in the big bang who made the stuff for that or were did it come from and so on and on we go...
Anyway the trouble for me in people believing in an after life or heaven is that they treat THIS life as something thats not so important ,for me this planet is heaven + hell all in one it can be whatever we choose to make it , if we all get greedy then the earth will turn to a hellish planet fire in the seas and such like , if we take only what we need then the earth has enough for everyone 
But just think there is no proof whatsoever of any ghosts or spirits or whatever actually existing so for me its quite simple it doesnt exist like aliens and the kraken a certain portly gentleman in a red cloak springs to mind , i know it is hard maybe impossible to think one day you wont exist in any shape or form and eventually all memories of you will be gone and all the people you knew will be dead but this is a good thing because you still have time to tell them people you love them and hug them so enjoy life thats what its for.

sorry but i once met a man who said he found god when he was 19 and now he was like 75 and he was trying to get me to pray (his dog attacked me on a field so we got talking) i said i dont want to pray i dont believe so he said hed pray for me i said ok (sos not to offend him ) anyway he prayed then he started crying i asked what was up ,he said he had cancer and he was sad because it was unlikley he would be cured . ok 2 points 1 if you believe in god why would you want a cure he has given you illness for a reason surely and besides its your ticket to heaven . 2 Why cry if you belive you go to a better place surely some sort of celebration is in order.
And if any of you religious people even have had a jab this makes no sense at all ,if you truley believe you wouldnt even go to doctors youd be looking forward to death, but sadly this is why even people who say they believe cry at funerals because deep down they know the truth


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## eye exaggerate (Oct 4, 2011)

POLICEMATRIX said:


> And if any of you religious people even have had a jab this makes no sense at all ,if you truley believe you wouldnt even go to doctors youd be looking forward to death, but sadly this is why even people who say they believe cry at funerals because deep down they know the truth



...well, I think they tend to have loved the deceased also. I know from personal experience that when I can't talk to people I loved while in this state (of living), I am usually not partying much.

I see what you're saying, but do you know what it takes to be completely unaffected by death? Yes, dead.


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## stillfree (Oct 28, 2011)

simple all yuh really have in this life is life and death.. so death is nothing and now is all yuh have! 
N.I.A.Y.H


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## Landmark (Oct 29, 2011)

To die the death of the self one my discover what it is to live. Are you willing to die? (to be responsible I am not talking about the physical death)


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## Dislexicmidget2021 (Nov 5, 2011)

true landmark to true.It makes one think about how precious life really is when you think about how no one will be here again as they are in body and mind.A one time experience of the instance we are living in is part of the beauty of life.One could say the death of the self could be the death of the ego and in return having selflessness with liberation of the multitude of petty desires of the self ,everyone dies not eveyone truely lives,are you willing to live?


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## dar.ko7 (Nov 10, 2011)

Hi there, Speaking of death prediction, I find it really odd that one of the on-line death prediction services showed me the same death date that I was foretold in my dream about a year ago. http://yourdeathdate.info/1/index.html - I cant explain this coincidence in any other way except that there must be some kind of magic involved here.


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## sso (Feb 9, 2012)

about getting old.


take a look at most of the presidents that went into office with dark hair and 4 years later had mostly grey hair. (or any high ranking politician or person under stress)

did you know that when you are afraid, the bloodflow gets restricted (you hunch you shoulders, pucker your ass and whatnot)

did you know that most people that reach a high age, had something to keep them happy? (one 100+ thanked his long life to cigars and cognac (stuff he enjoyed very much(without a care about what other people said about it (no stress))

did you know that many people when retiring , die quite soon after, if they didnt have any hobbies? (stuff to keep them interested in life..)

?




Luger187 said:


> > my bad i guess i misread your post. but yes we are made of nothing but energy. what do you mean by we control the energy?
> >
> >
> > *simply that if everything is "energy", we are the only controllers of it( visible anyway..)
> ...


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## Brick Top (Feb 9, 2012)

mccumcumber said:


> Read Vonnegut's _Slaughter House Five_ it will do you wonders.




Most readers interested in the fantastic in literature are familiar with Kurt Vonnegut, particularly for his uses of science fiction. Many of his early short stories were wholly in the science fiction mode, and while its degree has varied, science fiction has never lost its place in his novels. Vonnegut has typically used science fiction to characterize the world and the nature of existence as he experiences them. His chaotic fictional universe abounds in wonder, coincidence, randomness and irrationality. Science fiction helps lend form to the presentation of this world view without imposing a falsifying causality upon it. In his vision, the fantastic offers perception into the quotidian, rather than escape from it.


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## Brick Top (Feb 9, 2012)

Maybe Emerson, Lake & Palmer were onto something when they sang; "There's no end to my life, No beginning to my death: Death is life."


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## bud nugbong (Feb 9, 2012)

i died for a little while once, was on life support for like 30 hours all machines. and it seemed like 2 seconds. no clouds, no visions, no nothing. so im 99% sure once you go your gone. No heaven or hell. just blank peacefullness.


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## eye exaggerate (Feb 9, 2012)

"some people think they gonna die someday 
i got news - you never got to go"

_The Nuge_


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## WileyCoyote (Feb 9, 2012)

Dislexicmidget2021 said:


> so i was wondering and thinking about this subject,We have life and while we are in life we view death in many ways.My thought is that death is a transition not a means to an eternal end ,though this form we currently manifest will cease to be when transition occurs, this much we do understand.While it is my belief that that everything is made of energy condensed to make the form physicaly manifest. Energy that can never be created nor destroyed,we have come to understand this in Science.We only transfer energy or are rearranged when changing forms.In this happening it is unknown if memories of past energy forms could transfer into the new form,yet I do not view as an impossibility,yet that is beside my point.What is death to you?
> 
> So what are your thoughts people?


I think the nuclear particles that make up our being in an organized manner cease to be organized when we die, thereby rendering us as though we never lived. Out time is here and now, and never otherwise. There is no life after death; not even one second's worth. Live for the moment, because that's all you're guaranteed.


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## thump easy (Feb 9, 2012)

im gona tell you about a story a true one of my best friends who is older white fellow totaly diffrent on our life specturm he saved my ass but that not the story he was coming home one day from work their was a high speed chase on the free way they let off the helecopter was no were near. they left the car go to recless is what the high speed chase officers sead my budy all american white male looks like a push over but he is a good hearted man. got home from construction jumped in the shower when the police kicked in the door he was in the shower he gets out in his towle and the cops are in his house.. they YELL HANDS UP he had no clue what was going on.. so the cops open fire he died...


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## thump easy (Feb 9, 2012)

so all he remembers he was telling me while i helped him take down his 12 trees cliping away i asked him about his scares on his neck.


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## thump easy (Feb 9, 2012)

he tells me it was a mistaken number on the vihical... and he remembers his wife and kids yelling he fell into a sleep the ride the lights everything seemed not to mater he left his body there was a piece that he could not explain.


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## thump easy (Feb 9, 2012)

he walked into the light he felt eturnal bliss and he was so fucken happy.. then he was drawn back into his body he woke up and he was fucken pissed his wife yelled im gona say a difrent name.. JAMES YOU FUCKEN WAKE UP DONT YOU DO THIS MOTHER FUCKER YOU COME BACK YOU HEAR ME BREETH>> BREATH YOU SON OF A BITCH DONT YOU DO THIS TO US he had a daughter and son..


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## ChronicObsession (Feb 9, 2012)

Dislexicmidget2021 said:


> so i was wondering and thinking about this subject,We have life and while we are in life we view death in many ways.My thought is that death is a transition not a means to an eternal end ,though this form we currently manifest will cease to be when transition occurs, this much we do understand.While it is my belief that that everything is made of energy condensed to make the form physicaly manifest. Energy that can never be created nor destroyed,we have come to understand this in Science.We only transfer energy or are rearranged when changing forms.In this happening it is unknown if memories of past energy forms could transfer into the new form,yet I do not view as an impossibility,yet that is beside my point.What is death to you?
> 
> So what are your thoughts people?


I believe death is good for people. After all, what would happen if people had masturbated without limit and didn't die? Yes, death helps earth's microorganisms have lunch and multiply


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## thump easy (Feb 9, 2012)

and he remembers telling his wife NO LET ME GO LET ME GO. she like DONT YOU LEAVE US JAMES BREATH.. crying..


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## ChronicObsession (Feb 9, 2012)

LOOOOL. I've thought I heard all the funny names but NOW... BREATH! LMAO Have a good night ladies and Gents


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## thump easy (Feb 9, 2012)

HE sead it was the worst he had a nurse over him literaly grabing him for 12 hours with charchole in his lungs and he had to breath he wanted to go back and he rememberd his kids and he made it threw he sewd and won but his doctor bills and lawer fees just about did the same amount as the hole ordeal sad but true he told me over a few trees he isnt scared to die he knows its not bad.. he donsnt hold the police acounted all those problems but somehow he doesnt care smilling all the time good guy i love that guy.. im glad he is still with us.


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## cannabineer (Feb 9, 2012)

I'm almost certain Thump meant "Don't you leave us, James! Breathe!" cn


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## thump easy (Feb 9, 2012)

so the suspense didnt work i suck lolz but the story is true best grower i ever did see. good night


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## PbHash (Feb 10, 2012)

Good topic, lots of different thoughts and perspectives. In my experience with dying people (i've seen a lot of people die, more than I can remember or even care to) and to me all of the out of body experiences and spiritual feelings are a result of physiological mechanisms. 

You hear a lot about people seeing and hearing things "they could never know", like what the MD or RN said but you dont hear about the the people who have near death experiences and say they remember the MD doing something that didn't happen, the person just thought it happened.

When someone slowly dies, bleeding out, you see strange and interesting things happen. They will start getting very anxious and tell you some weird shit. They then start hallucinating and can go in and out of consciousness. All of what they are experiencing can be attributed to the lack of blood therefore the lack of O2 to their brain. Once they lose consciousness their brain can still be active, neurons are firing all over and the brain will still try to make sense of it all. Decrease in blood, increase in crazy talk and hallucinations.

Example: "I felt myself come back and I had a feeling of spiritual euphoria and a pressure lift off of me"
What really happened: one of the medical staff stopped doing CPR because your heart started to beat again and you got blood back to your brain. The euphoria is probably result of all the powerful hormones and chemicals your body pumped out.

Have you ever been asleep and dreaming and hear a conversation in your dream that was happening between two people next to you? Your dream may start turning into something more like what is being talked about outside of the dream. This is your brain trying to make sense of a sensory input taking place outside of its consciousness. Would you call this spiritual? Prob not. This is the same with an unconscious person near death.

Hypoxic insult to your brain will cause many crazy things to happen. You have people who lose lot of their frontal cortex due to a serious injury and they will be a different person. They could have been a very kind person and a devout Catholic before the injury and after the will be an athiest who is a very mean person. Was this a spiritual change or a physical change of their brain structure? It can be the same for a person who was an athiest, had a traumatic brain injury, then becomes very spiritual.

All in all I think a lot of the spiritual feelings around dying are lazy thinking and putting God in as the answer for something that is not understood. Hope this makes sense, its hard to condense so many thoughts.


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## Zaehet Strife (Feb 10, 2012)

very insightful mr. hash, i enjoyed the logistics of what you said there. i totally agree, i think when we die thats it, that the human animal is no more special than an ant or a spider, one squish and we will be gone forever (although our energy(heat) and body will decompose and feed the earth/universe). personally, imo the thought of existing forever is quite depressing. i would much rather think that right before i die ill get to go into a lucid dream for a few days (dream time) and ill get to fly one last time. if not? oh well, i guess ill find out eventually right? until then...

i don't really know what happens when something dies, but i do have some cool ideas.

that reminds me, my christian father used to say that animals and bugs went to animal heaven and bug heaven lol!!! what a sap.


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## Capt. Stickyfingers (Feb 10, 2012)

I agree. When you die that's it. No more existence. Which is really depressing and makes me wish I had some kind of faith, but I don't believe in mumbo jumbo. I wish I did, then dying wouldn't seem so tragic to me.


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## Dislexicmidget2021 (Feb 10, 2012)

Originally Posted by *Dislexicmidget2021*  
So many people think within the concept that we have this "soul" which leaves the body at death while preaching 
about something that cannot be fused with evidence on any level then want to have you believe that youre a fool for
not seeing what they do and call you blind,its some level of ego that makes these people believe that they are
an enlightened person,and having this sense that you do not.When in actuality it is the foolhardy notion
that drives there way of thinking to the lines of pshychological insanity.Once they actualy do understand that once 
the end of life has occured and are no longer of this world a profound sense can take place, that is the 
enlightenment needed to extract the illusion of eternal life out of the line of reasoning.Fear is the key 
player in this,but to have someone tell you that your blind while they cling to their blanket of
nonsense security is just laughable......some people.

*yet you do not have any evidence of your own. 
*
*without any proof, do you call them insane. and laughable fools. 
**maybe they had an experience which you havent had. probably misunderstood it to heck and back, but it gave them security and comfort.
**something they wished to share with you. (though they were wrong on calling you a fool)
**dunno...even it were a fairy tale, its a bit better than "we are all meat robots decaying in time, till the end of time, when it maybe starts up again, meatrobots to infinity and beyond"
*
*though, ina way, those who think they wont exist after death, are right, but ill get to that later.


*I dont have any evidence of what?Delusional fools preaching and bible thumping about an afterlife?I need no evidence to provide in this because it is rampantly self evident,I merely point out realizing the truth about living and the attainable peace from its realization,so a greater and more mindful appreciation of life could be found from it.


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## Farfenugen (Feb 10, 2012)

Consciousness _is_ the immortal_ being_ in that when our bodies no longer function, like a chrysalis it sheds and we develop into another form of life (not consciousness). Our mind, that which we think with and not the brain that controls the functions of this body, is a part of the conscious _being_ inside this shell. Humans have the possibility to live many hundreds of years, given the right parameters and if cellular decay is slowed down or even halted. Perhaps regenerative cells can be achieved, and life can be extended, but I highly doubt the human body could withstand such a long time. Eventually the_ being_ (that is you, your conscious self) would be drawn onto the next process. Just like a caterpillar cannot remain in his cocoon forever. 

Where do I think we go? *Occam's Razor*: "*The simplest explanation for some phenomenon is more likely to be accurate than more complicated explanations.*" Genuinely the most simplest explanation is more likely than the more complicated one. Why go to Heaven where there's streets paved in gold and you're sitting across the table from some bearded hippie in a robe, or having to satisfy thirty virgins when at best in life, you could hardly satisfy but one. Or going from this human form to a bug. Being downgraded isn't what I want to sign up for, nor for that matter do I believe that a Buddhist would want that either. Death is no great mystery. But what happens afterwards, is. No one really knows, not even I, nor do religions or people who claim to talk to spirits. No one really knows. Perhaps some do know, but going on a drug-induced trip isn't going to convince me otherwise. DMT and shamanistic compounds that induce an truly amazing experience might be a glimpse into the_ spirit/mind_ connection, but until I delve into that myself, I cannot truly say what there is other than it's going to be an interesting quest. Until then, I want to have as much fun as possibly, eat delicious foods, see great visuals in the form of landscapes and wonders, hump my wife as much as I can, explore books and new places, meet interesting people, watch programs that make me laugh and cry at the same time, enjoy beer and wine and pot like I have done for years and not worry about the big bad Blue Meanies that seem to want to dumb me down or control my thoughts on what sort of life I should be living based on some silly ape morality that really, in the end, don't mean a whole lot when you think about it.


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## cannabineer (Feb 10, 2012)

Interesting. Physics (and learning dexterity in a physical world) teach us the conservation laws - of momentum, mass, energy, etc. Physics gives us the quantities; sports, hunting etc. teach us the intuitive end of things. 
So it's natural and unserstandable that we'd have an inclination to believe in Conservation of Spirit. Easterners have recycling schemes, while the Abrahamics prefer a one-pass assembly-line approach serving a separate afterlife.
I personally doubt there even is such a thing as spirit ... it's a sort of conscious shorthand that our mind uses to conceptualize continuity of awareness, memory, cognition. (Maybe.) As a result, I consider it unlikely that even a trace of it persists beyond death. The metaphor that seems most apt and natural to most is that the spirit is the engine that drives the biological body. And there is some probable truth to that ... dying people have been proven to be able to prolong their lives by a fierce and sustained act of will. Phidippides at Piraeus (the original Marathon runner, who delivered his message and keeled over) was a leading example, and soldiers everywhere have corresponding stories. 
But imo a more useful metaphor is that spirit is the visible flame coming off the metabolic bonfire of all our nerve tissue, and when that goes out, the flame goes zoop. 
But none of that is science or otherwise amenable to learned discussion. In the end, it is one internet itinerant's individual and indefinite ideations on the ineffable. cn


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## eye exaggerate (Feb 10, 2012)

cannabineer said:


> But imo a more useful metaphor is that spirit is the visible flame coming off the metabolic bonfire of all our nerve tissue, and when that goes out, the flame goes zoop.


...this is a rather selective slice of what you've written here, but it's for good reason. Interesting that you say 'spirit is the visible flame'. I was just listening to a lecture in which the speaker said "even darkness is flame - we just don't see it". He went on to say that a visible flame is contained within the unseen flame. (unseen because of our inability to see it - "if thine eye be single" comes to mind - and a dude looking into a microscope  ).

In this metaphor we see the relationship between Christ and Lucifer, "the light bringer / phosphorus".


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## WileyCoyote (Feb 10, 2012)

Capt. Stickyfingers said:


> I agree. When you die that's it. No more existence. Which is really depressing and makes me wish I had some kind of faith, but I don't believe in mumbo jumbo. I wish I did, then dying wouldn't seem so tragic to me.


Yeah, when I was a believer in Christianity, I didn't dread death. But since I've become an "unbeliever", I do dread death. Bummer.

Oh how do I become a believer again?


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## bud nugbong (Feb 11, 2012)

i cant say i dread death now, it just makes me want to enjoy my life and live it to the fullest. when its done thats it, but thats more motivation to go out and make the best of every day. Fuck spending valuable time on this earth doing pointless things. do what you enjoy while being productive and thats heaven on earth right there.


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