# Using energy from crystals and pyramids to increase plant success



## StoopidLungs (Oct 12, 2012)

Crystals and weed growing. I have been on a spiritual journey lately which has brought me to love the effects that different types of crystals can have on people and the energy that surrounds them. So I had an idea to use crystals in my grow room and I researched which crystals work best for plant growth. So I ordered a pyramid shaped moss agate (pyramid-shaped crystals contain even more energy) and also a whole pound of rough green calcite. I am going to put the moss agate pyramid in between the 2 buckets on the ground and scatter the pound of green calcite around the buckets and grow room. Here are the benefits of each stone:

&#8220;Moss agate is probably the most beneficial stone when you want increased plant growth. It is known as &#8220;the gardener's talisman&#8221; for this very reason. Moss agate is often used to attract prosperity and abundance. It's also a healing stone. This crystal is associated with nature spirits. Wearing moss agate while gardening can increase your energy, relieve a stiff neck, and &#8220;tune&#8221; you in to the energies of your garden. Placing moss agate stones in a container pot or in the ground will increase flower and plant growth. I made a moss agate wind chime suspended from three bamboo stakes tied together at the top and placed this &#8220;tee-pee&#8221; in a part of my garden where the Phlox weren't doing so well. Within a couple of weeks, I was overrun. A little goes a long way when it comes to crystals. If you have fruit trees, try hanging a small moss agate stone from one of the branches to promote a healthy harvest.&#8221;

"Another crystal useful in the garden is Green Calcite, a pale green stone that is said to belong to the small earth spirits of the woods and meadows. Offering a small stone with thanks to these elementals can result in a lush and beautiful garden. Green calcite is also a healing stone and is often used to calm and soothe. If your property is too loud, crowded or over active, you can place a green calcite crystal in a flowerpot or under a tree to soothe the area.&#8221; 

There is a ton of info on the positive effects of crystals on gardening, but little to no info that is cannabis specific. I think I only found 1 report of somebody using crystals in their grow room and he said the effects were incredible and surprising. Anybody heard of this? I will let yall know how it goes when my crystals arrive!!!!


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## facestabber (Oct 12, 2012)

Thanks for including a link to your site.


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## StoopidLungs (Oct 13, 2012)

I realize now that I shouldn't post links so I went back and omitted it. Sorry I am new. I was posting the link to avoid plagiarism and to give you a starting point on your quest for knowledge on the topic, not to advertise. I am so used to citing my sources. Anyway, I recommend checking it out for yourself with a simple google search of the benefits of crystals- and no, I do not work for google lol  This is an interesting topic that has very little exploration and even less documentation. Which is interesting, because in my experience I have found that those who smoke weed (most of you lol) are often times on spiritual journeys and more likely to practice things like meditation, lucid dreaming, and crystal healing. It just seems like there would be more information out there or stories of using crystals in weed gardens. But since there isn't, I thought I could get it goin!


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## budman111 (Oct 13, 2012)

No mumbo jumbo needed for nice buds...


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## mewton (Oct 13, 2012)

If you believe that crap, you´ll belive anything. So just try it. Nothing we can tell you will make you stop believeing this nonsense.


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## superstoner1 (Oct 13, 2012)

why dont use just dance naked and chant?


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## scroglodyte (Oct 13, 2012)

superstoner1 said:


> why dont use just dance naked and chant?


now........THAT works.............................


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## Amaximus (Oct 13, 2012)

Hooray, More voodoo!


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## Scroga (Oct 13, 2012)

Trolled out before you even got going....bummer ... Ugly little trolls.


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## scroglodyte (Oct 13, 2012)

trolled out? lol
laughed out.


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## VTMi'kmaq (Oct 13, 2012)

superstoner1 said:


> why dont use just dance naked and chant?


dude, i talk, rant, destress while watering to my plants! have for many moons! I have no idea why the crystals my wiccan sister has in the SAME exact room as my tent hasnt effected my grows yet, that being said something tells me i'd better focus on soil improvements over crystals in the room! Talking, dancing, being naked whilest among the ladies----all good habits that are good for the ladies!


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## Blue Wizard (Oct 13, 2012)

LOL! Crystals and wiccan crap don't work. 

Everyone knows if you want big buds you've got to worship Satan. 

[video=youtube;QhH3xho0woU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhH3xho0woU&amp;feature=relmfu[/video]


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## Geronimo420 (Oct 13, 2012)

superstoner1 said:


> why dont use just dance naked and chant?


Dancing nude will only work if you also cover your head with a Dogon mask, chanting is a good idea but you should also consider playing tambourine or shaking some maracas.


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## Amaximus (Oct 13, 2012)

What I've learned: A lot of you guys like to dance nude...


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## Geronimo420 (Oct 13, 2012)

Amaximus said:


> What I've learned: A lot of you guys like to dance nude...


so many thing in life feel better when done as nude as a worm


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## tip top toker (Oct 13, 2012)

Don't forget to cleanse your chakras before you enter your grow room else you will compromise the awesome of the pyramid.


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## Geronimo420 (Oct 13, 2012)

I think pyramid are only good for growing dead _Pharaohs_


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## lokie (Oct 13, 2012)

My step daughter used to believe in crystals and candles and aroma therapy 
and some other unique free thinking fluffy not stuffy things.

She lost her job and was still able to provide for her children but soon found there was no
$$ for the fluff any longer. her situation did not change for the better or worse when the "feel good
wishful thinking" purchases stopped.

Lesson learned: all of the shit they sell to increase anything does exactly what it is designed to do.
Which is to part a fool from their money.


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## sorethumb (Oct 13, 2012)

just look at how many posts they have made and it says it all . all of them useing hps and the most expensive fertilizers there is.aka snake oil lol
.talk shite and buy shite its all they do. ive been a member for almost a year 200 or so post look at the rest 1000 2000 post and most have joined after me this tells you one thing trolls lmao true things r funny


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## scroglodyte (Oct 13, 2012)

i know a guy that believes in crystals..........................he's a tweeker. he believes in crystal meth


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## sorethumb (Oct 13, 2012)

how do you get 6,814 post since dec 2011 oh yeah just troll along .


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## marc88101 (Oct 13, 2012)

Its so bizarre how people believe crystals and other crap have some magical power. People believe anything, its so odd!


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## StoopidLungs (Oct 13, 2012)

Haha goodness... Let me guess, you guys don't believe in aliens either?  LOL It is funny how crystals work, as I was typing this my roommate knocked on the door and handed me the package that just got here. Moss Agate pyramid. I am excited!!! As for the money, I am still waiting on a pound of green calcite that I got for just 10 bucks. If you are gonna use snake oil, let it be beautiful and cheap, right? I'm not saying that they could make a bad grow go good, but I can't imagine somebody already growing medical quality trying it out. "Grown with Crystals". Then when you smoke it, knowing that fact adds a whole new dimension. I'll let you all know how it goes for me since you all seem so interested!!!


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## marc88101 (Oct 13, 2012)

StoopidLungs said:


> Haha goodness... Let me guess, you guys don't believe in aliens either?  LOL It is funny how crystals work, as I was typing this my roommate knocked on the door and handed me the package that just got here. Moss Agate pyramid. I am excited!!! As for the money, I am still waiting on a pound of green calcite that I got for just 10 bucks. If you are gonna use snake oil, let it be beautiful and cheap, right? I'm not saying that they could make a bad grow go good, but I can't imagine somebody already growing medical quality trying it out. "Grown with Crystals". Then when you smoke it, knowing that fact adds a whole new dimension. I'll let you all know how it goes for me since you all seem so interested!!!


I have some brown crystal fecalate, its from the Hindu mountain range. Place the said crystals in the bathroom and watch the fecies fly. I can sell them to you real cheap, $20 a log..I mean &#8221; crystal&#8221;


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## sorethumb (Oct 13, 2012)

they dont trust me lol i heard for pyramid growing the plants are inside near the kings chamber ofset of the apex but yeah give it go sounds fun


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## sorethumb (Oct 13, 2012)

marc88101 said:


> I have some brown crystal fecalate, its from the Hindu mountain range. Place the said crystals in the bathroom and watch the fecies fly. I can sell them to you real cheap, $20 a log..I mean &#8221; crystal&#8221;


 did you know you have huge troll problem see this troll apr2012 948 post hes been trolling fast lmao


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## marc88101 (Oct 13, 2012)

sorethumb said:


> did you know you have huge troll problem see this troll apr2012 948 post hes been trolling fast lmao


Lol, yep i'm trolling...what a Moron!! Trust me when your on movie sets all day and there is nothing to do, this fills a lot of time.


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## cannawizard (Oct 13, 2012)

--cheers


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## sorethumb (Oct 13, 2012)

marc88101 said:


> Lol, yep i'm trolling...what a Moron!! Trust me when your on movie sets all day and there is nothing to do, this fills a lot of time.


 lmao ok got me on that go right on trolling then have fun


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## scroglodyte (Oct 13, 2012)

i've helped a lotta new growers with those 6K posts. go back to your Warcraft game, Napoleon Dynamite


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## D3monic (Oct 13, 2012)

I guess i'm the only one actually interested in what the OP posted.... 

But I guess only a select few actually view growing as a spiritual journey.


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## Indagrow (Oct 13, 2012)

I know a bunch of kids who believe In Crystals met them at festivals and they sell them I have seen someone buy one of their rocks for four hundred dollars !!!! I mean if you believe in their energy then go for it don't neglect the plant otherwise... It's really a matter of opinion I can wrap my head around the crystal thing but I also know way more people who believe there is a man with a large white beard behind pearly gates that you can hangout with for eternity if your good in this life


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## D3monic (Oct 13, 2012)

Ive owned a sentient stone before... you get the real deal they are worth believing in. I wore mine for several years until the necklace broke and got ran over by a car. Still have part of the crystal but there is no life left in it that I can sense.


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## scroglodyte (Oct 13, 2012)

sorethumb said:


> i seen your help we could do without it trust me your not that special here


who's we. are you more a member of this community than me? or you got a mouse in your pocket?


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## scroglodyte (Oct 13, 2012)

i've been doing soil rows since 1977. indoor and out. with great success. that's what i bring. so ingest feces and perish


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## Blue Wizard (Oct 13, 2012)

bat boy found in cave


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## StoopidLungs (Oct 13, 2012)

D3monic said:


> I guess i'm the only one actually interested in what the OP posted....
> 
> But I guess only a select few actually view growing as a spiritual journey.


I guess so. Sometimes I think more people are into it, since pretty much everyone I come into contact with is on a similar journey. I forget that my sample size is probably not representative of the population! Haha either my friends and I are strange or we are further along in the evolution of consciousness... I'll go with the second one!   To me, planting a seed that you nourish until it gives you a crystal that you inhale to alter your reality is like pulling magic out of thin air. Doesn't get much more awesome than that. Haters gon hate, but have they not fully faced the fact that THC is a crystal itself? Think about it like this... if you have 1 bunny rabbit in your closet and then you add another bunny rabbit, you have created a new energy system in the room. Adding an extra bunny effects the other bunny even if they never even come into physical contact with each other. Since they are breathing the same air, the extra bunny changes the levels of certain gases in the air, which directly effects the other bunny. The same thing with crystals. The THC crystal effects the energy in the room; you guys know that unexplainable feeling you get when you walk into your grow room? Ok, well place some other crystals in the room, especially ones specific for gardening, and they will magically interact with the THC crystals, forming a new, more powerful energy system. It only takes 20 years for a wild idea to become common knowledge... Just in the last 20 years through advancements in technology we have gotten the potency of our cannabis up to ~20%. You think it is just gonna stop there? In 20 years we should be smokin on ~50% nugs, and we will reach that level with new technology that isn't widely understood or perfected right now- and might even be shot down and trolled hard by "experts" when it is first brought into light... Just like they shot down those who thought the earth was flat. It takes real revolutionary thinkers to make any real progress.


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## StoopidLungs (Oct 13, 2012)

Indagrow said:


> I know a bunch of kids who believe In Crystals met them at festivals and they sell them I have seen someone buy one of their rocks for four hundred dollars !!!! I mean if you believe in their energy then go for it don't neglect the plant otherwise... It's really a matter of opinion I can wrap my head around the crystal thing but I also know way more people who believe there is a man with a large white beard behind pearly gates that you can hangout with for eternity if your good in this life


Haha damn that is expensive man!!! Yeah I love festivals. That is definitely the place to meet interesting people with interesting ideas. Pearly gates.... beautiful metaphor.... Effing the ineffable


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## sorethumb (Oct 13, 2012)

right its me .im the one going to new comers threads to shite on them what thread are you on a new guy with a crystal idea. then you post about what shite you get off .and im proud to be a freak thanks


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## scroglodyte (Oct 13, 2012)

it was a "Tin Foil Hat" thread. they elicit humorous responses.


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## Blue Wizard (Oct 13, 2012)

StoopidLungs said:


> I guess so. Sometimes I think more people are into it, since pretty much everyone I come into contact with is on a similar journey. I forget that my sample size is probably not representative of the population! Haha either my friends and I are strange or we are further along in the evolution of consciousness... I'll go with the second one!   To me, planting a seed that you nourish until it gives you a crystal that you inhale to alter your reality is like pulling magic out of thin air. Doesn't get much more awesome than that. Haters gon hate, but have they not fully faced the fact that THC is a crystal itself? Think about it like this... if you have 1 bunny rabbit in your closet and then you add another bunny rabbit, you have created a new energy system in the room. Adding an extra bunny effects the other bunny even if they never even come into physical contact with each other. Since they are breathing the same air, the extra bunny changes the levels of certain gases in the air, which directly effects the other bunny. The same thing with crystals. The THC crystal effects the energy in the room; you guys know that unexplainable feeling you get when you walk into your grow room? Ok, well place some other crystals in the room, especially ones specific for gardening, and they will magically interact with the THC crystals, forming a new, more powerful energy system. It only takes 20 years for a wild idea to become common knowledge... Just in the last 20 years through advancements in technology we have gotten the potency of our cannabis up to ~20%. You think it is just gonna stop there? In 20 years we should be smokin on ~50% nugs, and we will reach that level with new technology that isn't widely understood or perfected right now- and might even be shot down and trolled hard by "experts" when it is first brought into light... Just like they shot down those who thought the earth was flat. It takes real revolutionary thinkers to make any real progress.


What are you smoking and where can I get some? When I think "advancements in technology" probably the last thing to come to mind is "MAGIC ROCKS"


"magically interact with the THC crystals" Really?


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## StoopidLungs (Oct 13, 2012)

Blue Wizard said:


> What are you smoking and where can I get some? When I think "advancements in technology" probably the last thing to come to mind is "MAGIC ROCKS"
> 
> 
> "magically interact with the THC crystals" Really?


Hahaha I am just a writer man I don't literally mean magically in the way that you think I mean. Just trying to paint a picture that organisms interact with each other in ways that are difficult for us to understand right now. But just by experience, you can feel the interaction and you know it is real. I am not expecting you to believe me because I had this experience, but I am explaining that you can have the experience for yourself so you don't have to believe anyone. That's the magic


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## Geronimo420 (Oct 13, 2012)

[video=youtube;k0Rbidbx-7U]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0Rbidbx-7U[/video]
Magic-crystal for you're plants


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## Scrotie Mcboogerballs (Oct 13, 2012)

Blue Wizard said:


> View attachment 2371872 bat boy found in cave


I love how f'ing everybody remembers this one cover. It was like when news of the weird hit peak crazy.


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## budman111 (Oct 14, 2012)

StoopidLungs said:


> they will magically interact with the THC crystals, forming a new, more powerful energy system.


So that is what Harry 'Pothead' Potter was up to at that magic school LOL


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## budman111 (Oct 14, 2012)

Geronimo420 said:


> [video=youtube;k0Rbidbx-7U]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0Rbidbx-7U[/video]
> Magic-crystal for you're plants



You really got to be shitting me...the plants 'eat the energy' from the crystals LOL


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## Mister Sister (Oct 15, 2012)

Hey brother,

Just found your thread, and was very excited to find this 'diamond in the rough'. 

I appreciate the way you're handling the criticism.

At any rate, I feel I am in a similar place in my journey. Growing spiritually has opened many doors for me, and it has also made things a bit 'harder' in a sense as well. I am very interested in your endeavors.

I am not concerned with being a fool whose money has departed. I honestly believe that the fool is actually the guy who places value in having money above trying new things or experimenting with 'taboo'. For many different reasons, on many different levels..I will humbly digress....

I would like to suggest to you to open another avenue in your grow that you may or may not already be participating in. Try asking the plant a question and _feeling_ for a response. Some people will get impressions, some ringing in a left or right ear, and some may get responses in a different way. The plants are more than willing to communicate with you. Assuming that you are 'conscious' (and assuming you know what I mean by that), the plants are oh so happy to co-create with you. The natural state of plants is action - anything outside of this is alien to them - and they will teach you through action. You will co-create with them through action. 

Thank you for your information. Feel free to PM me with your findings and results/anything related. I am open to listening and learning and growing with you.

MS


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## hejsan75 (Oct 15, 2012)

Interesting! Have you noticed that the high gets much more intense when meditating/concentrating?


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## Scroga (Oct 16, 2012)

It doesn't feel right to me to meditate while under the influence..(feel the fear)


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## StoopidLungs (Oct 16, 2012)

Mister Sister said:


> Hey brother,
> 
> Just found your thread, and was very excited to find this 'diamond in the rough'.
> 
> ...


Awesome!  It is easy for me to handle criticism because I figured as long as I can positively effect just 1 person out of a 6 page thread, it is worth it  I appreciate your feedback man! I haven't asked the plants any questions, I will definitely give that a try. But I have talked to them. Sometimes I tell them goodnight, and that they are the best, dankest, most beautiful plants ever. They love it!!! So far my plant has reacted greatly to the moss agate pyramid. I put it right in between the 2 buckets on the ground. My root mass has increased incredibly the past few days. Granted I have been using h2o2 and switched out the water with fresh nutes. It is important that you don't just expect the crystal to do all of the work for you. I am not challenging people to use crystals in place of lights and nutrients. I am challenging the growers who are already producing medical quality buds to give it a try and see what happens. If you aren't quite there yet, you could use all the help you can get! I am very excited for the rest of my crystals to arrive, given the positive reaction I have had from my plants in such a short amount of time. PEACE


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## Kervork (Oct 16, 2012)

Crystals only work for mushrooms. Weed requires blood sacrifices.


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## hejsan75 (Oct 16, 2012)

Scroga said:


> It doesn't feel right to me to meditate while under the influence..(feel the fear)


I use meditation (Concentration) to handle the fear. No negative thoughts or emotions if one can control the mind and chose what to focus on.
+ the high gets much higher 
Just reading the book - Cannabis and meditation, an explorers guide.


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## silusbotwin (Oct 16, 2012)

Mister Sister said:


> Hey brother,
> 
> Just found your thread, and was very excited to find this 'diamond in the rough'.
> 
> ...


Without a doubt the best post I've ever seen on RIU in years. Feels good and refreshing to know there are like minded individuals out there. Unlike those calling bullshit, I've done the same research and I've learned plenty enough about crystals to be really inspired to add some to the mix. 

Thanks a TON OP! I'm going to order a Moss Agate pendant tonight 

Ya'll need some spirit science.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6pYAiRqhio

I feel sorry for the folks who are so close minded that they immediately dismiss and try to segregate and ridicule. No matter, I'm glad to know there are at least two others here on RIU who are on a journey similar to my own


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## D3monic (Oct 16, 2012)

Kervork said:


> Crystals only work for mushrooms. Weed requires blood sacrifices.


good thing a living sacrifice and a drop of my blood goes in with every seedling.


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## Shaggn (Oct 17, 2012)

http://www.theverge.com/2012/9/27/3417918/hitachi-quartz-glass-data-preservation

Hmm... Crystals and the power with-in them


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## Coho (Oct 17, 2012)

Whatever works for you...


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## StoopidLungs (Oct 19, 2012)

Just for an update... I just got my green calcite in!! It just happened to be the perfect amount of crystals to form a torus around the buckets. The torus is the shape of earth's magnetic field. And in the middle of the torus sits the moss agate pyramid!


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## navyvet (Oct 19, 2012)

I tried the dancing naked and chanting... still only got 1zip from my banana kush. I think I may have sent it into shock.


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## unknown1231 (Oct 19, 2012)

crystals and pyramids dont do anything but jesus can make them grow huge bro!


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## scroglodyte (Oct 19, 2012)

dude........you grow with yer fancy crystals. it ain't gonna hurt anything.


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## polyarcturus (Oct 19, 2012)

well im here to say this straight up. i would be interested in DC voltage in the soil in combination with quartz and other dielectric minerals.

also there is some science to particular sounds and electromagnetic properties i imagine the idea of these pyramids and crystals run along the same lines and is a fairly logical and cheap way to manipulate theses.


plus i just believe in positive energy, some forms of energy can only be explained by the actual connection between things, and not the energy itself. with this said you can believe in a god or no god yet still put off positive energy.
http://www.nytimes.com/1985/04/09/science/electricity-may-play-role-in-plant-growth.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dielectric
http://ezinearticles.com/?Grow-Plants-in-Total-Darkness&id=7224411
http://mschien.com/documents/guss_exhibition.pdf
http://www.pjoes.com/pdf/11.5/527-530.pdf

sometimes we make science overly complicated and fail to study simple objects tha can preform the same task at lesser levels, live the pyramids and shapes of things, in the universe, a mere mm or a planets position can affect so many things, i believe the same could be said on smaller level to.


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## StoopidLungs (Oct 19, 2012)

polyarcturus said:


> well im here to say this straight up. i would be interested in DC voltage in the soil in combination with quartz and other dielectric minerals.
> 
> also there is some science to particular sounds and electromagnetic properties i imagine the idea of these pyramids and crystals run along the same lines and is a fairly logical and cheap way to manipulate theses.
> 
> ...


Welp. I tried praying to jesus and chanting around naked. But they didn't seem to work as much as the crystals and pyramids!  Awesome links man!!! How could I forget about sound frequencies? It is great to finally get some real reactions on this thread. We will not reach 50% THC strains without progressive thinkers like ourselves. As we master and perfect current cannatechnology, such as LEDs, CO2 injection, and nutrients, we will also uncover completely new cannatechnologies in the next decade. In the beginning, these technologies will be shot down by the seasoned vets. How will we get to the next level of dank? The thing is, I have no fucking idea. I'm not positive that it will be with crystal energy technology. I'm just trying to get some ideas churning outside the box. The next generation of futuristic growing. Get ready for the dankest nugs imaginable.... because if there is one thing that we can ALL agree on.... it is that we all love the dankest nugs imaginable.


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## VonNonymous (Oct 19, 2012)

I just have a round-bottomed Voodoo mama to help chant and roll the bones. Works for me. Sometimes I reward her with trinkets, crystals and charms.


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## ProfessorPotSnob (Oct 19, 2012)

I have just the product for the Earth loving grower .. Its simple and there is no mystery to grounding inside plants to Mother Earth ..

For the record I do have a White Cloud Katchina Doll in my flower room and its a blessing no matter who calls American Indian Shamanic Witchcraft lmao


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## polyarcturus (Oct 20, 2012)

ill be honest even i take part of the voodoo i always keep a dream catcher above my grow so it catches my dreams of big dank nugs. im serious. do i beleive it will help? not because its a dream catcher but rather the thought it puts in my head is positive thereby having direct impact on me subconsciously imparting that positive energy into everything i do.

yeah but for the most part i stick to science, but sometimes myth has its place in science oddly enough.

yeah keep thinking outside the box. i imagine somehow making the pyramids vibrate or even electrically charging them could help you understand or even take it farther and actual make electromagnetic feilds with some power and even greater reaction in the plants..

here i got another example
http://www.biowaveindustries.com/products.htm
what do you see when you look at that? i see a bunch of fucking pyramids.

anyways haters gonna hate. if it isnt science its not gonna work lol if that was true i think wed be fucked cause theorys arnt science.

anyways keep at it im interested if it has any effect.


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## Scroga (Oct 20, 2012)

hejsan75 said:


> I use meditation (Concentration) to handle the fear. No negative thoughts or emotions if one can control the mind and chose what to focus on.
> + the high gets much higher
> Just reading the book - Cannabis and meditation, an explorers guide.


What I mean is when I get to that tipping point, when I'm about to go inside
that almost vertigoey feeling..staying awake whilst asleep...when its about to happen it doesn't feel right to be letting go whilst inebriated....thats all..i was taught to trust my instinct, if it don't feel right don't do it.....


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## Trousers (Oct 20, 2012)

empirical evidence
scientific method
repeatable results

Anthropomorphism, table for two.


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## Clown Baby (Oct 20, 2012)

where do you buy your acid?


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## cannabineer (Oct 20, 2012)

scroglodyte said:


> dude........you grow with yer fancy crystals. it ain't gonna hurt anything.


Scrog, you could harness this as an apologia for growing outdoor. Those quintillions of clay nanocrystals _have _to be doing something. cn


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## wernzz (Oct 20, 2012)

StoopidLungs said:


> Crystals and weed growing. I have been on a spiritual journey lately which has brought me to love the effects that different types of crystals can have on people and the energy that surrounds them. So I had an idea to use crystals in my grow room and I researched which crystals work best for plant growth. So I ordered a pyramid shaped moss agate (pyramid-shaped crystals contain even more energy) and also a whole pound of rough green calcite. I am going to put the moss agate pyramid in between the 2 buckets on the ground and scatter the pound of green calcite around the buckets and grow room. Here are the benefits of each stone:
> 
> Moss agate is probably the most beneficial stone when you want increased plant growth. It is known as the gardener's talisman for this very reason. Moss agate is often used to attract prosperity and abundance. It's also a healing stone. This crystal is associated with nature spirits. Wearing moss agate while gardening can increase your energy, relieve a stiff neck, and tune you in to the energies of your garden. Placing moss agate stones in a container pot or in the ground will increase flower and plant growth. I made a moss agate wind chime suspended from three bamboo stakes tied together at the top and placed this tee-pee in a part of my garden where the Phlox weren't doing so well. Within a couple of weeks, I was overrun. A little goes a long way when it comes to crystals. If you have fruit trees, try hanging a small moss agate stone from one of the branches to promote a healthy harvest.
> 
> ...




you are caught up in some Illuminati satanic shit.....


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## wernzz (Oct 20, 2012)

Clown Baby said:


> where do you buy your acid?


BAHAHAHAHAHAHA too hilarious


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## Blue Wizard (Oct 20, 2012)

wernzz said:


> you are caught up in some Illuminati satanic shit.....


Hey man! Don't give Satanism a bad name.


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## polyarcturus (Oct 20, 2012)

Blue Wizard said:


> Hey man! Don't give Satanism a bad name.View attachment 2380352


as if it doesnt do that by itself. lol

another religion another problem.


----------



## Scroga (Oct 20, 2012)

Lost in translation......


----------



## budman111 (Oct 21, 2012)

polyarcturus said:


> as if it doesnt do that by itself. lol another religion another problem.


 Every religion is a problem except Rastafari


----------



## THC&STDs4All (Oct 21, 2012)

scroglodyte said:


> i've helped a lotta new growers with those 6K posts. go back to your Warcraft game, Napoleon Dynamite



^^^^^this man has helped me a lot. keep on trollin champion, i do not give 2 fucks.


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## dbkick (Oct 21, 2012)

ah, an led grow, all the voodoo in the world won't help you.


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## StoopidLungs (Oct 21, 2012)

dbkick said:


> ah, an led grow, all the voodoo in the world won't help you.


I understand your skepticism but LED is definitely where we are heading. It will be the norm within the next decade. Once we learn more about what frequencies the plants actually need, and then get some super legitimate companies making them affordable, I just don't see how they couldn't be the absolute best for plants. Im talking HIGH powered cannabis specific LEDs. No bullshit. People always mention trying to mimic nature, but this is the wrong path to take. We have the opportunity to be better than nature, CO2 injection for example. Becoming better than nature is the only way that the quality of buds will just keep on climbing. They certainly don't need the entire light range of the sun. Or HPS/MH lights either. So much wasted heat energy. Granted, my LED light probably does suck lol. Just wait till we get some seriously on point LED lights man. Don't give up on em!


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## Coho (Oct 21, 2012)

Well..I think plasma will take off..


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## polyarcturus (Oct 21, 2012)

budman111 said:


> Every religion is a problem except Rastafari


even rastafari.

its not so much the belief, but the organization of a belief. everyone should not believe the same thing, because there is no one answer.


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## polyarcturus (Oct 21, 2012)

StoopidLungs said:


> I understand your skepticism but LED is definitely where we are heading. It will be the norm within the next decade. Once we learn more about what frequencies the plants actually need, and then get some super legitimate companies making them affordable, I just don't see how they couldn't be the absolute best for plants. Im talking HIGH powered cannabis specific LEDs. No bullshit. People always mention trying to mimic nature, but this is the wrong path to take. We have the opportunity to be better than nature, CO2 injection for example. Becoming better than nature is the only way that the quality of buds will just keep on climbing. They certainly don't need the entire light range of the sun. Or HPS/MH lights either. So much wasted heat energy. Granted, my LED light probably does suck lol. Just wait till we get some seriously on point LED lights man. Don't give up on em!


you need to start being more ligh hearted as the guy your talking at, hes grown with leds much longer than you with, as you put "high powered cannabis specific leds" with that being said you have the right idea be better than nature, but that does not mean DISSIMILAR! you want to be similar to nature but better when it come to light you need yellow green blue and red as they all have a purpose as the plants have adapted to use them there are no specific spectrum's only blends that are better than sunlight.

more red more blue does not = more bud. more light all together does though. keep this in mind also it is very hard to beat the sun as far as light goes. LED definitely will not cut it.


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## StoopidLungs (Oct 21, 2012)

polyarcturus said:


> you need to start being more ligh hearted as the guy your talking at, hes grown with leds much longer than you with, as you put "high powered cannabis specific leds" with that being said you have the right idea be better than nature, but that does not mean DISSIMILAR! you want to be similar to nature but better when it come to light you need yellow green blue and red as they all have a purpose as the plants have adapted to use them there are no specific spectrum's only blends that are better than sunlight.
> 
> more red more blue does not = more bud. more light all together does though. keep this in mind also it is very hard to beat the sun as far as light goes. LED definitely will not cut it.


Didn't mean to sound like that man I just like to talk about the future lol. This is my first grow. I don't really "know" anyone yet so Im just gonna be preachin' about the ideas that come to my mind when I read a post. I'm sure I will get a better feel for it. When I respond to someone, I'm pretty much just responding to anyone who might be reading these threads. Peace


----------



## Heisenberg (Oct 21, 2012)

https://www.rollitup.org/spirituality-sexuality-philosophy/388385-correct-use-word-energy.html

Energy is a science word that means only one thing, the ability to do work. A measurable work potential. Energy can be used, it can be stored, but it can not be imprinted onto a house, or felt from negative thoughts.

When someone is trying to explain a scientific concept, and misuses such a basic scientific word as energy, that person probably doesn't know what they are talking about.


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## copperheadroad1 (Oct 21, 2012)

i just play them rock, nroll, ac/dc, deep purple etc.. might get some kinda sparkly fake crystals, for my leds to bounce off n hang round the tent, like a wind chime, good thread bro


hey i could get some of those mini novely disco balls and hang it in there as the plants, rock out 


sweet!


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## copperheadroad1 (Oct 21, 2012)

Coho said:


> Well..I think plasma will take off..


but is it ever going to be available, i cant find anything on them, in retail


but when it does im getting one


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## copperheadroad1 (Oct 21, 2012)

polyarcturus said:


> you need to start being more ligh hearted as the guy your talking at, hes grown with leds much longer than you with, as you put "high powered cannabis specific leds" with that being said you have the right idea be better than nature, but that does not mean DISSIMILAR! you want to be similar to nature but better when it come to light you need yellow green blue and red as they all have a purpose as the plants have adapted to use them there are no specific spectrum's only blends that are better than sunlight.
> 
> more red more blue does not = more bud. more light all together does though. keep this in mind also it is very hard to beat the sun as far as light goes. LED definitely will not cut it.



im just chimming in here, and by no means do i have much proof of what im about to say, but, i think the red/blue spectrums leds put out are best used in tric production, and if used to early in the flowering cycle over hps you may loose some overall yeild

dont get me wrong tho im crazy about my 600w led, its like going inside an alien spaceship in there, with weed


----------



## dbkick (Oct 21, 2012)

StoopidLungs said:


> I understand your skepticism but LED is definitely where we are heading. It will be the norm within the next decade. Once we learn more about what frequencies the plants actually need, and then get some super legitimate companies making them affordable, I just don't see how they couldn't be the absolute best for plants. Im talking HIGH powered cannabis specific LEDs. No bullshit. People always mention trying to mimic nature, but this is the wrong path to take. We have the opportunity to be better than nature, CO2 injection for example. Becoming better than nature is the only way that the quality of buds will just keep on climbing. They certainly don't need the entire light range of the sun. Or HPS/MH lights either. So much wasted heat energy. Granted, my LED light probably does suck lol. Just wait till we get some seriously on point LED lights man. Don't give up on em!


LED has its place for me and that's in veg, after that make mine hps.


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## silusbotwin (Oct 22, 2012)

polyarcturus said:


> even rastafari.
> 
> its not so much the belief, but the organization of a belief. everyone should not believe the same thing, because there is no one answer.


Ahhh, quite the contrary, the answer IS "one". The entire planet is one huge living creature and we, the human race, are the cancer that is killing the Earth. But when you look at the big picture, we are all a collective "one" who manifests reality, from a collective whole of thoughts put into action. Each of us contributing, some more than others, to the growth of the organism that is the cosmos.



Heisenberg said:


> https://www.rollitup.org/spirituality-sexuality-philosophy/388385-correct-use-word-energy.html
> 
> Energy is a science word that means only one thing, the ability to do work. A measurable work potential. Energy can be used, it can be stored, but it can not be imprinted onto a house, or felt from negative thoughts.
> 
> When someone is trying to explain a scientific concept, and misuses such a basic scientific word as energy, that person probably doesn't know what they are talking about.


Ahhhh, but what are thoughts on a completely physical scientific level? 
What are thoughts made of if you had to place them into a category? 
Is your brain not just a high tech machine designed to transmit and receive electronic pulses or "energy"?

Never consider something impossible just because you cannot see it. The human eye can only see 3% of the matter that takes up space on Earth. That leaves 97% in a dimension that cannot be seen by the human eye. But we know from modern science, that it is definitely there. Think of infrared spectrum, radio waves, radioactivity.

Well, thats my thoughts anyway. I LOVE talking about this stuff


----------



## Heisenberg (Oct 22, 2012)

silusbotwin said:


> Ahhhh, but what are thoughts on a completely physical scientific level?
> What are thoughts made of if you had to place them into a category?
> Is your brain not just a high tech machine designed to transmit and receive electronic pulses or "energy"?
> 
> ...


I invite you to the philosophy section to discuss this as it is off topic here. I enjoy these types of conversations as well.


----------



## polyarcturus (Oct 22, 2012)

silusbotwin said:


> Ahhh, quite the contrary, the answer IS "one". The entire planet is one huge living creature and we, the human race, are the cancer that is killing the Earth. But when you look at the big picture, we are all a collective "one" who manifests reality, from a collective whole of thoughts put into action. Each of us contributing, some more than others, to the growth of the organism that is the cosmos.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



wish i could like this again +rep


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## polyarcturus (Oct 22, 2012)

copperheadroad1 said:


> im just chimming in here, and by no means do i have much proof of what im about to say, but, i think the red/blue spectrums leds put out are best used in tric production, and if used to early in the flowering cycle over hps you may loose some overall yeild
> 
> dont get me wrong tho im crazy about my 600w led, its like going inside an alien spaceship in there, with weed


all the links and reading on the subject here
https://www.rollitup.org/indoor-growing/545857-advanced-lighting-spectrums-t5-floro.html

and some info on UV for ya 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfiI78uN3Ks


all the colors are important, in the proper ratios of course.


----------



## polyarcturus (Oct 22, 2012)

Heisenberg said:


> https://www.rollitup.org/spirituality-sexuality-philosophy/388385-correct-use-word-energy.html
> 
> Energy is a science word that means only one thing, the ability to do work. A measurable work potential. Energy can be used, it can be stored, but it can not be imprinted onto a house, or felt from negative thoughts.
> 
> When someone is trying to explain a scientific concept, and misuses such a basic scientific word as energy, that person probably doesn't know what they are talking about.


maybe it should be rephrased car batteries got me thinking... it does contain potential energy though? and the definition, "to do work" on a microscopic level this applies much differently... hmm good food for thought.


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## dubalchemist (Oct 22, 2012)

Tourmaline mixed in the soil is supposed to ionize the soil and help with plant growth.


----------



## Heisenberg (Oct 22, 2012)

polyarcturus said:


> maybe it should be rephrased car batteries got me thinking... it does contain potential energy though? and the definition, "to do work" on a microscopic level this applies much differently... hmm good food for thought.


The point I was trying to make is that before someone goes to the trouble and expense of ordering crystals they may want to ask themselves a few basic questions.

If the premise is that crystals/pyramids give the plants energy, what kind of energy is it? Where does it come from? How is it stored? How is it transferred to plants? Does this energy follow the laws of thermodynamics?

The answer to all these questions are quite easy when you are talking about systems that actually use energy. If the energy can not be described or measured, it is not, by definition, energy.


----------



## polyarcturus (Oct 22, 2012)

Heisenberg said:


> The point I was trying to make is that before someone goes to the trouble and expense of ordering crystals they may want to ask themselves a few basic questions.
> 
> no we are on the same page that is what i was implying in my original post, that there needs to be some science to it.


----------



## trumpy (Oct 23, 2012)

Dont buy just any random goddamn crystals. Order now... exclusive _cannabis specific_ crystals from advanced nutrients. We have put years of serious f'in research into crystal plant technology. Just sprinkle 4 tsp per pot of our super bad ass chelated crystal powder onto each plant for out of this world phat nugs. 

Product analysis - N - .07 - derived from ammonium nitrate.


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## Trousers (Oct 24, 2012)

inching back to reality

as heisenberg said,

energy is measurable


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## copperheadroad1 (Oct 29, 2012)

someone was on about telling your plants, how they gonna grow big and strong, and getting feed back from your plants, and i gotta admit i had a little snicker and thought what a looney or whatevere, as i read through...

anyway the next day im in with my girls and no one was arround, cause it was early, so, i started saying, stuff, like you girls are nice and safe and im gonna water them every dsay till the grow big etc..., then i kinda said , in my cheech, voice, "so like kinda tell me if there any problems or anything bothering, you, and just as i was feeling completely stupid..

then one of my plants, said, "hey get this caterpiller off me bro"


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## robert 14617 (Oct 29, 2012)

if it makes you feel good do it , just please don't try and sell me on your snake oil


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## theexpress (Oct 29, 2012)

robert 14617 said:


> if it makes you feel good do it , just please don't try and sell me on your snake oil


how is lil tess these days robert?


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## robert 14617 (Oct 29, 2012)

that little girl is still getting by we have to carry her out side to do her biz yet she is the first one in the kitchen when my wife calls them in for dog cookies


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## theexpress (Oct 29, 2012)

robert 14617 said:


> that little girl is still getting by we have to carry her out side to do her biz yet she is the first one in the kitchen when my wife calls them in for dog cookies


there is a man that lovews his dog!!!!!!


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## StoopidLungs (Oct 29, 2012)

robert 14617 said:


> if it makes you feel good do it , just please don't try and sell me on your snake oil


I feel you man, if you aren't into it then you aren't into it.... I can show you the door but can't walk through it for ya. Some crystals are super cheap though man. If you're gonna use snake oil, let it be the cheap stuff eh? lol


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## copperheadroad1 (Oct 31, 2012)

polyarcturus said:


> all the links and reading on the subject here
> https://www.rollitup.org/indoor-growing/545857-advanced-lighting-spectrums-t5-floro.html
> 
> and some info on UV for ya
> ...



liked the utube video,


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## bushwickbill (Oct 31, 2012)

crystals and pyrmids have no energy. gezus christ people believe anything


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## robert 14617 (Oct 31, 2012)

everyone should have something they believe in , i believe i'll have another beer


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## silusbotwin (Nov 1, 2012)

bushwickbill said:


> crystals and pyrmids have no energy. gezus christ people believe anything


Yeah but the thing is Crystals DO have energy! Research em man, the things are alive. Like someone said earlier, we can show you the door but cant force you through it.


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## Trousers (Nov 2, 2012)

silusbotwin said:


> Yeah but the thing is Crystals DO have energy! Research em man, the things are alive. Like someone said earlier, we can show you the door but cant force you through it.


You haven't shown me the door, you have just made a claim and didn't back it up with anything. 
If crystals do have energy, it would be measurable.

What do you mean by "the things are alive?"


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## Hal Incandenza (Nov 2, 2012)

I use the Spice to increase yields ten fold, and then flush with the Water of Life two weeks before harvest. IMO way easier than the crystal/pyramid method, but to each his own.


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## iamAK47 (Nov 4, 2012)

Hal Incandenza said:


> I use the Spice to increase yields ten fold, and then flush with the Water of Life two weeks before harvest. IMO way easier than the crystal/pyramid method, but to each his own.


what is the spice?


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## polyarcturus (Nov 4, 2012)

iamAK47 said:


> what is the spice?


he is referring to the book called "DUNE" good book BTW, the whole series in fact.


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## iamAK47 (Nov 4, 2012)

lol, ok thanx for clearing that up man, I was suspecting he was being sarcastic or something. Just googled it, sounds like some kind of a Star wars style books or something.


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## Hal Incandenza (Nov 4, 2012)

Great scifi series adapted into a terrible movie by a great director


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## iamAK47 (Nov 6, 2012)

Might try read this shit then, seems little something like Star wars had sex with lord of the rings and this series was the baby


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## StoopidLungs (Nov 6, 2012)

Trousers said:


> You haven't shown me the door, you have just made a claim and didn't back it up with anything.
> If crystals do have energy, it would be measurable.
> 
> What do you mean by "the things are alive?"


He showed you the door by making that claim and telling you to do some research. Now, I will put my hand on the doorknob for you. Open it man!!!!!! 
http://www.mycrystalaura.com.au/webcontent24.htm
http://www.theliquidcrystals.com/faq/are-crystals-alive
http://www.smithsonianeducation.org/educators/lesson_plans/minerals/minerals_crystals.html
http://www.unz.org/Pub/LiteraryDigest-1904may28-00771
http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/gen01/gen01810.htm

Are they alive? Maybe, maybe not. Depends on what you consider to be alive. Do they have energy? I believe they do because I can experience it directly, and I do not think we have figured it out yet. We can't measure the energy because we do not have sophisticated enough technology yet. Just because we can't understand it yet doesn't mean we won't be able to in the future.


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## silusbotwin (Nov 7, 2012)

StoopidLungs said:


> He showed you the door by making that claim and telling you to do some research. Now, I will put my hand on the doorknob for you. Open it man!!!!!!
> http://www.mycrystalaura.com.au/webcontent24.htm
> http://www.theliquidcrystals.com/faq/are-crystals-alive
> http://www.smithsonianeducation.org/educators/lesson_plans/minerals/minerals_crystals.html
> ...


The natural human instinct to have to have everything figured out and categorized holds us back so much its sad. We will not reach better states of consciousness as long as people are afraid to consider the impossible. Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't it scientific fact that the Earth was flat at one time?


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## Heisenberg (Nov 7, 2012)

silusbotwin said:


> The natural human instinct to have to have everything figured out and categorized holds us back so much its sad. We will not reach better states of consciousness as long as people are afraid to consider the impossible. *Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't it scientific fact that the Earth was flat at one time?*


No, that belief was delivered by intuition. When you look out and observe flat land as far as you can see, intuition tells you the land is flat. When you look up and see the sun rise and set everyday, intuition tells you the sun revolves around the earth. It wasn't until careful observation and testing, aka science, that we discovered the truth.

Science relies very much on considering the impossible. It thrives on new ideas and ways of thinking, but it also demands evidence and logic as a structure. Science is a process, a systematic way of carefully and thoroughly observing nature while using consistent logic to evaluate the results. It's not simply a collection of knowledge that never changes.


"Every working scientist's career is defined by his new discoveries; there is no work to be done, and no salary to be found, in accepting irrefutable truths and doing nothing. Nobody funds research that's intended to not learn anything." - Brian Dunning


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## silusbotwin (Nov 7, 2012)

Heisenberg said:


> No, that belief was delivered by intuition. When you look out and observe flat land as far as you can see, intuition tells you the land is flat. When you look up and see the sun rise and set everyday, intuition tells you the sun revolves around the earth. It wasn't until careful observation and testing, aka science, that we discovered the truth.
> 
> Science relies very much on considering the impossible. It thrives on new ideas and ways of thinking, but it also demands evidence and logic as a structure. Science is a process, a systematic way of carefully and thoroughly observing nature while using consistent logic to evaluate the results. It's not simply a collection of knowledge that never changes.
> 
> ...


Tell that to the scientists who refuse to mix religion or spirituality with science.

My point was, scientists of those times KNEW it to be FACT the world was flat. They laughed and scoffed when first confronted with the theory of a round Earth. I think you get my point.


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## Heisenberg (Nov 7, 2012)

silusbotwin said:


> Tell that to the scientists who refuse to mix religion or spirituality with science.
> 
> My point was, scientists of those times KNEW it to be FACT the world was flat. They laughed and scoffed when first confronted with the theory of a round Earth. I think you get my point.


I do get your point. A great example is when experimentation falsified the idea of the ether. Physicists were pretty confident in that idea, and it took great evidence to accept that space is a vacuum, which lead to the understanding that time and space are relative.

Science changes it's mind when the evidence warrants it. When it is appropriate to do so, science has no problem admitting that it is wrong. Science is self-correcting. This is one of the key reason science and religion do not mix. Religion thinks it got all the answers right centuries ago, and almost never corrects itself. Religion prides itself on ignoring or dismissing counter-evidence, makes a virtue of faith aka wishful thinking.

Spirituality does not mix with science for a different reason. Spirituality is the efforts and achievements some people make to overcome the sense of being separate from nature, often by means of altering consciousness. While this may be a worthy goal, it differs from the concerns of science. Science is concerned with the outer objective reality, while spirituality is concerned with inner subjective reality. Science does not have a problem with spirituality, but science does not have the tools or methods that are compatible with spirituality, and so has nothing it can say about it.

When spirituality attempts to have something to say about science, or the physical world, is when the two clash. Nature is the domain of science, and faith, intuition and even instinct can not be allowed to trump real world data.

Now to bring it back to crystals. Science is more than willing to accept that crystals have energy, but the only evidence we have is that some people 'feel' it. Energy is a precise word and it is being used here in more colloquial terms. It's fine to use the word energy as a sort of place holder term for something but people are not being scientific or explaining anything meaningful when they do so. It is basically a statement that says, "crystals have some influence that I can't describe working through some mechanism that I can't describe, but I can feel it." That isn't really saying much at all in terms of explanation. We understand how to measure energy, we can accurately predict how it behaves, and we know what laws it follows. Crystals would have to have some special energy that can not be detected or measured or predicted or explained, which means whatever property they may have is not energy. The more careful and controlled we are in our observations the less we see any effect crystals have on reality.

We do have well documented knowledge of all the ways people make mistakes of perception, memory and logic. We know many forms of confirmed cognitive bias and methods of self deception. It's rather easy to explain why people _think_ crystals have some power, and when we carefully study the phenomena, mistakes and self deception are exactly what the evidence suggests.


&#8220;In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion.&#8221; 
&#8213; Carl Sagan


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## Trousers (Nov 7, 2012)

StoopidLungs said:


> He showed you the door by making that claim and telling you to do some research. Now, I will put my hand on the doorknob for you. Open it man!!!!!!
> http://www.mycrystalaura.com.au/webcontent24.htm
> http://www.theliquidcrystals.com/faq/are-crystals-alive
> http://www.smithsonianeducation.org/educators/lesson_plans/minerals/minerals_crystals.html
> ...


The first link you gave me is a blog about crystals written by someone who sells crystals.

Put the doorknob in your ass. You are not more enlightened than me because you believe rocks have or create energy. 
Would you like me to show you the door to the scientific method?

If someone could set up an experiment that could be repeated over and over again, I'll read about it. 
Energy is measurable. You are asking me to take your word for it. I will when you set up an experiment with repeatable results.
Until then you are just blowing hot air.


----------



## skuba (Nov 7, 2012)

This is from the World Book Science Annual of 1974. No crystals involved, but it's about an Indian guy Swami Rama who moves a needle without touching it, can stop his heart, make his hand heat up by 10 degrees, and voluntarily produce different kinds of brain waves. Pretty cool, and i'd say it's a mixture of spirituality and science. 

http://swamij.com/pdf/swami-rama-world-book-1974.pdf


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## Trousers (Nov 8, 2012)

skuba said:


> This is from the World Book Science Annual of 1974. No crystals involved, but it's about an Indian guy Swami Rama who moves a needle without touching it, can stop his heart, make his hand heat up by 10 degrees, and voluntarily produce different kinds of brain waves. Pretty cool, and i'd say it's a mixture of spirituality and science.
> 
> http://swamij.com/pdf/swami-rama-world-book-1974.pdf


definitely cool
If it can be explained then is it no longer spirituality? (What does that even mean?)

I have read of monks that can raise their body temperatures. They learned how to do it to survive being trapped in a blizzard on the way to their monastery at the top of a mountain. People can lower their heart rate to the point that they appear dead.

I know a person that can completely beat a lie detector test because he has such control over his body. He will would not call it spirituality, he calls it a trick that anyone can learn to do. 

Personally I believe that we are only limited by our imaginations. The old saying that we only use 10% of our brains may not be literally correct, but I believe we haven't even come within sniffing distance of what we are capable of.

That doesn't mean we should spend time flapping our arms and jumping out of trees to try and fly. If someone had a technique that could be taught to someone else that allows for humans to fly, great, let's try it. But when someone says, "Hey, flap your arms and jump out of a tree and you can fly," you will have to excuse my skepticism.


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## silusbotwin (Nov 8, 2012)

It's threads like these that keep me sticking around this place. It's not often I get to discuss topics like this without complete derailment. These types of threads are always so prone to trolls, butthurt, insulting people, etc. It's refreshing to see people actually discuss these kinds of things here, without taking anything personal enough to start spewing hatred and such. Kudos to all of you fo being free independent thinkers! I know this is sort of tangential, but I had to say it.


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## ArCaned (Nov 9, 2012)

Not sure if trolling or stupid.


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## silusbotwin (Nov 9, 2012)

ArCaned said:


> Not sure if trolling or stupid.


Whatever helps you feel most comfortable.


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## copperheadroad1 (Nov 10, 2012)

i would have thought the crystals, due to the arrangement, of their internal structure, are more likely to channel any given energy, by the user, or light source.

they do grow over millions of years, but im not sure that means they are alive? they just pretty little rocks, arent they


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## DVXSteverino (Nov 11, 2012)

Damn, and I thought I was the only one here that does that....NOT trolling,...working on movie sets.... Cool Beans!..ANother brother here!




marc88101 said:


> Lol, yep i'm trolling...what a Moron!! Trust me when your on movie sets all day and there is nothing to do, this fills a lot of time.


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## thagooroo (Nov 11, 2012)

The earth is alive it also grows so how could something alive produce anything but what is alive and also this sounds like confusion between life and consciousness and there is more than one level consciousness or perception of consciousness


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## budman111 (Nov 12, 2012)

The pyramid does have some sort of accepted energy and it is also known to keep food fresh longer, energise water - seems to mummify food/water to keep them fresh. It also can prolong the life of new razor blades - the pyramid seems to remove the fine particulars of water that is left on the blades after shaving to keep them sharper longer. We have also found that ailing plants often to come to life, while cats and dogs love to sit and sleep in pyramids. In ancient times sick people would often sleep overnight in pyramids as part of their healing process.


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## Heisenberg (Nov 12, 2012)

budman111 said:


> The pyramid does have some sort of accepted energy and it is also known to keep food fresh longer, energise water - seems to mummify food/water to keep them fresh. It also can prolong the life of new razor blades - the pyramid seems to remove the fine particulars of water that is left on the blades after shaving to keep them sharper longer. We have also found that ailing plants often to come to life, while cats and dogs love to sit and sleep in pyramids. In ancient times sick people would often sleep overnight in pyramids as part of their healing process.


Wow, 70's retro-myths, disproved many times including recently on mythbusters. What is energized water exactly? The term makes no sense. 

Pyramid vs Control


> Roses: Both dried out similarly
> 
> 
> Apples: No visible difference.
> ...


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## echlectica (Nov 12, 2012)

As a gem and mineral dealer(as a side line) I feel it would be unethical to say there is benefit to using crystals and minerals for their metaphysical properties. Often people will approach me at a gem show or a festi where I'm vending and ask if I have a stone that is good for this or that, and I simply say that they should look at the stones and pick one that appeals to them. You can look in books and try to learn about the metaphysical prorperties of crystals but you'll find that at one time or another someone has used every stone for just about anything. 
So that said if anyone needs a Moldavite I have a surplus of that, pm me.


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## Trousers (Nov 13, 2012)

echlectica said:


> As a gem and mineral dealer(as a side line) I feel it would be unethical to say there is benefit to using crystals and minerals for their metaphysical properties. Often people will approach me at a gem show or a festi where I'm vending and ask if I have a stone that is good for this or that, and I simply say that they should look at the stones and pick one that appeals to them. You can look in books and try to learn about the metaphysical prorperties of crystals but you'll find that at one time or another someone has used every stone for just about anything.
> So that said if anyone needs a Moldavite I have a surplus of that, pm me.




What rocks help with brewer's droop and herpes?


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## Jennylasting (Nov 13, 2012)

JUST to let whoever said it know, there has NEVER been consistent evidence that anyone ever thought the earth was flat, it was made up by someone in the 20th century, Columbus actually thought the earth was pear shaped..... but most on here are right, people have to be ready to accept the impossible, im just afraid that the impossible wont be found in those little shiny rocks...


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## Domed (Nov 13, 2012)

I put sacred mold spores in my soil, I've been seeing a lot more THC on my buds!!


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## budman111 (Nov 14, 2012)

echlectica said:


> they should look at the stones and pick one that appeals to them.


 That's mind over matter...


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## thagooroo (Nov 14, 2012)

I think you meant the mind molds matter  as thoughts create reality what you believe and think will change what is seen and how you experience what is seen everyone's opinion is right if they believe with no doubt right and wrong what works and doesn't work just look at this forum there are so many people getting the same results growing flowers with different methods because they found what they believe in and that extends to every part of life. be love and find love, look for love and find that love is missing


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## Heisenberg (Nov 14, 2012)

thagooroo said:


> I think you meant the mind molds matter  as thoughts create reality what you believe and think will change what is seen and how you experience what is seen everyone's opinion is right if they believe with no doubt right and wrong what works and doesn't work just look at this forum there are so many people getting the same results growing flowers with different methods because they found what they believe in and that extends to every part of life. be love and find love, look for love and find that love is missing


What about people who are on drugs and believe they can fly? What about mental patients who believe their loved ones have been kidnapped and replaced with an exact impostor? If I believe that gravity takes the day off for Thanksgiving, can I leave the house through my third story window and not fall? If I believe that MJ grows best when it's covered in mustard, will I grow good bud?

Conviction or popularity of a belief has nothing to do with reality. If everyone on earth held the perfect belief that the moon is made of cheese, it wouldn't change the moon.


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## thagooroo (Nov 14, 2012)

Well I can't argue what you said and I wouldn't try but I don't live a life with duality and from my understanding of life and science and ancient teachings what you see may not be the same as I and that goes for what you said about crazy people I understand what your saying though  good luck


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## Mohican (Nov 14, 2012)

It would be interesting to see if plants in the rain forest grow differently or better in areas of high crystal concentrations. Should be easy to see. And isn't soil just a collection of tiny bits of crystals and decomposing organic matter?


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## Mister Sister (Nov 19, 2012)

I don't know about plant growth, but I have just recently had a crystal coincidence that I felt might be nice to share here. So a friend gave me a crystal to put in my pocket for reasons that have no context to this story. I always held it in the same pocket as my keys because I didn't want it to scratch my phone. On my keyring is a key-fab that hasn't worked in at least 2 years. One day I gave them to my daughter to play with and realized that the batteries in the key-fab were working because my panic alarm was going off. Confused, I went outside to see if it just had some weird-fluke-type-power left in the battery. The strange part is, the key-fab works like brand new. Doesn't miss a beat and has been that was for about a week now, at least. Was it the crystal that reinvigorated the batteries or was it something completely different? The world may never know. Either way I'm glad I can unlock my car from more spots than the drivers side door! At any rate, MS


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## The Mantis (Nov 27, 2012)

Here's the funny part:

Most of you are laughing so hard about the crystals. I am too. But, here's a link to a site that will also break down the walls of all the other illusions most people harbor. 

http://www.skeptic.com/



- a fool and his money are easily parted.


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## silusbotwin (Nov 27, 2012)

The Mantis said:


> Here's the funny part:
> 
> Most of you are laughing so hard about the crystals. I am too. But, here's a link to a site that will also break down the walls of all the other illusions most people harbor.
> 
> ...


"A fool sees not the same tree that a wise man sees."

"In the vain laughter of folly wisdom hears half its applause."

"It is the peculiar quality of a fool to perceive the faults of others and to forget his own."


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## Trousers (Nov 28, 2012)

Found anything to back up your bullshit claims besides stories and quotes?


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## silusbotwin (Nov 28, 2012)

Trousers said:


> Found anything to back up your bullshit claims besides stories and quotes?


Can I ask what it is you're trying to accomplish?


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## Trousers (Nov 29, 2012)

If you want people to buy into your ideas, why not post something compelling?
Before you mentioned 'spirituality' and how scientists refuse to consider it.
What do you mean by spirituality? Why should scientists 'mix religion or spirituality with science'?

How would they do that? Do they put on wizard hats and say incantations over bubbling cauldrons?


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## silusbotwin (Nov 29, 2012)

Trousers said:


> If you want people to buy into your ideas, why not post something compelling?
> Before you mentioned 'spirituality' and how scientists refuse to consider it.
> What do you mean by spirituality? Why should scientists 'mix religion or spirituality with science'?
> 
> How would they do that? Do they put on wizard hats and say incantations over bubbling cauldrons?


Yea but it seems as though you're talking to ME as though I am the one who claimed it to be an absolute fact. I never once claimed that. In fact, I thought Heisenberg did a pretty good job of explaining why it doesn't add up.

I am simply trying to get a point across that you are obviously missing entirely. If you haven't got it yet, you aren't ready.


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## MajorCoco (Nov 29, 2012)

Hehe.."You aren't ready".

That'll calm em down  

<sits down, opens beer and popcorn, lights spliff>


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## Trousers (Nov 30, 2012)

silusbotwin said:


> Yea but it seems as though you're talking to ME as though I am the one who claimed it to be an absolute fact. I never once claimed that. In fact, I thought Heisenberg did a pretty good job of explaining why it doesn't add up.
> 
> I am simply trying to get a point across that you are obviously missing entirely. If you haven't got it yet, you aren't ready.


You are not ready yet to understand my point.
I guess we have us a good old fashioned "not getting the point" Mexican standoff.


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## silusbotwin (Nov 30, 2012)

Trousers said:


> You are not ready yet to understand my point.
> I guess we have us a good old fashioned "not getting the point" Mexican standoff.


This made me lol quite literally


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## The New Jim Jones (Nov 30, 2012)

this is an absurd thread.


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## MajorCoco (Nov 30, 2012)

Forget crystals...the real trick is building a pyramid around your plants. Pyramids (as all egyptians once knew well) are powerful channels for psychic energy, and if you grow in the heart of a pyramid then it helps channel that energy into your grow. Its exactly the same energy that they used pyramids for keeping razors sharp back in the old days. I'm currently looking to sell a range of pyramid-shaped grow tents. Good, tubed aluminium construction; especially designed to help channel energy, angled perfectly to allow it to pass unimpeded through the substructure. Each pyramid's proportions are carefully chosen to maximize the energy released, and each, patented Pyramirical-growtent (tm) now comes complete with tri-tinfoil lining, scientifically proven by scientists to be *the* superior modern material for the easy transmission of cosmic energy, whilst still remaining 100% light-proof!!!
The basic 5ft pyramid is good for 1 plant, and retails for just $499.99

PM me if you want one...


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## silusbotwin (Nov 30, 2012)

MajorCoco said:


> Forget crystals...the real trick is building a pyramid around your plants. Pyramids (as all egyptians once knew well) are powerful channels for psychic energy, and if you grow in the heart of a pyramid then it helps channel that energy into your grow. Its exactly the same energy that they used pyramids for keeping razors sharp back in the old days. I'm currently looking to sell a range of pyramid-shaped grow tents. Good, tubed aluminium construction; especially designed to help channel energy, angled perfectly to allow it to pass unimpeded through the substructure. Each pyramid's proportions are carefully chosen to maximize the energy released, and each, patented Pyramirical-growtent (tm) now comes complete with tri-tinfoil lining, scientifically proven by scientists to be *the* superior modern material for the easy transmission of cosmic energy, whilst still remaining 100% light-proof!!!
> The basic 5ft pyramid is good for 1 plant, and retails for just $499.99
> 
> PM me if you want one...


I'm pretty sure you're goofing but be careful playing with the rules man, it really looks like you're serious. Such a good troll, I couldn't even tell you were trollin at first lulz


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## Heisenberg (Nov 30, 2012)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe's_law

Poe's law states:


Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humor, it is impossible to create a parody of fundamentalism that someone won't mistake for the real thing.


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## MajorCoco (Dec 1, 2012)

True, but I was very drunk and laughing a lot to myself at the time...drunk enough to forget that my mirth might not fully translate online....I shoulda known a winking smiley face was more appropriate than the normal smiley hehe.

It's funny though. When I was growing up, there were playground tales about how pyramids kept razor blades sharp. Even as an 8yr old I knew it was fishy, and very soon after that the story was proven, of course, to be nonsense. I think it was some april fool BBC joke, like their classic spaghetti tree news story....I've enjoyed a good spoof ever since falling for that one I guess


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## Greggos88 (Dec 31, 2012)

I am growing 4 plants. In 1 pot I used quartz crystal and blue agate in the bottom for drainage and the others got regular rock/hydroton to see in a side by side comparison if any energetic benefits were to be had. The plant with the energy containing stones at the bottom has been more resilient and grown larger and healthier than the others! Even after transplanting and switching to hydroton. The plant is the one indica that I have so _maybe_ it still has some of that Blue/purple energy in there! I may use the crystals again when I transplant and add some more purple quartz, maybe moss agate and green calcite  I have a Malachite pyramid would that aid in any way? I'll have to research or get a crystalology book. Thanks for posting, have been wondering about this subject!


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## Trousers (Jan 1, 2013)

...........


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## unknown1231 (Jan 1, 2013)

please let this thread die. 

Might as well put up pictures of jesus in your grow room.


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## Fruitbat (Jan 1, 2013)

I stuffed some quartz up my ass now I am more resilient and healthy. I think I'm gonna stick one in my pee-hole and see what happens.

It's just good science.


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## silusbotwin (Jan 2, 2013)

Fruitbat said:


> I stuffed some quartz up my ass now I am more resilient and healthy. I think I'm gonna stick one in my pee-hole and see what happens.
> 
> It's just good science.


I'm 12 and what is this?


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## Coho (Jan 2, 2013)

I tried talking to my plants..they don't answer..I think their stoned.


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## atlantaboy (Jan 9, 2013)

Peace first. Then a big thank you for the original author of this thread for affording us this opportunity to delve into the thoughts of (those who took the thread seriously and those who didn't) and appreciate the insights offered by the People; however sarcastic, ignorant or inappropriate they may have been from time to time. 
Having said that, I think that a few people brought up some good questions about the validity of the subject matter. I think that the vocabulary and explanations used and offered may have been misleading to readers, perhaps, especially to the scientists (count me in that number) in our community. However, I believe that I have an understanding of what the author was/is trying to convey in his/her description of this experiment. 
1. On "Energy" - Someone (heisman sp?) brought up the proper use of the term energy. I agree that when used can be deceptive because of the ambiguity of the term; maybe due to improper connotations ascribed or just lack of understanding. In this context I think the more appropriate terminology would be frequency, which can also be broken down further ie. electromagnetic, resonant, etc. Further, some energy must present, because frequency implies movement which requires some energy to occur. Now whether that energy is "in" the crystal or comes from some other phenomenon is beyond our scope.
2. On "Crystals Giving the Plants Energy" - the first usage/misuage of the word "energy" (1.) probably led to these next comments about crystals giving the plants energy, which admittedly does sound a bit absurd. Reexamining this statement with the afore mentioned clarification, this quote can be reinterpreted as "Crystals providing another frequency output in the room that, perhaps, was not present or is enhanced by its presence."
Now, with these two clarifications (1. & 2.) in mind let us also remember that plants are acceptors and transmitors of frequency much like ourselves. Yes, the very obvious ears that hear and eyes that see are recieving transmissions as well as the mouth that speaks and our physical bodies transmitting frequencies (vibrating ie. colors). Everything is in constant flux (vibration). As a simple example for examination to be paralleled to the author's proposed experiment, let's look at music. One simple chord or note (frequency =>crystal) effects each person (plant) differently. The sound may freighten one while exciting another or even bring another to tears. One other simple example being a facial expression which can be perceived (frequencies being accepted and interpreted) and possibly affect mood in certain subjects. 
Crystals have been shown to have specific resonant and electromagnetic frequencies, which can be manipulated by its shape and other physical and chemical processes. Quartz is probably the most used in our everyday society. Magnets and crystals are very similar as I understand. I think magnets are even of crystalline microstructure. Just as magnets absorb electro frequency and attract or repel metal objects with that energy (over long periods of time) i believe crystals do store and transmit energy similarly. (Have you seen a woman's mood when she's wearing that diamond?? And say that's your girl...shoooooot how you feelin???) However, I can't find much respectable "University" research to substantiate. Of course there is Rife, well respected, published and awarded in his day, (http://www.rife.org/ -for those truly interested) but his work has been swept under the rug and I haven't heard of many grants or research $$ being given for any real experimentation since. My bet is pharmaceutical companies at it again...but thats another thread im sure lol! I digress..
Although plants don't have ears or eyes (that I know of), I believe,along with many other growers (author included I'm sure...rather I suppose) who take time to care for any plant that have found, that they are able to be affected by frequencies; whether that be music...or LIGHT of course and, perhaps, countless others. 
With that being said, I think the hypothesis that crystals, if outputting a frequency that is agreeable with the strain of plant, can have a positive effect on said plant is not far fetched, although from what I can find has not tested thoroughly.
Truly appreciate this thread! Please keep updating, for inquisitive minds are eager to know...I know I am!
And Peace again.
Many Blessings on your spiritual journey 

*sparx1


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## Fruitbat (Jan 9, 2013)

Diamond? You mean a compressed piece of carbon that is far more prevalent than DeBeers would have you think? I know I still get yelled out when my women is wearing hers. The only thing mood altering about it is...nothing. 

Just because we are stoners doesn't mean we have to be stupid. Put on your critical thinking caps folks.


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## tombombadil (Jan 10, 2013)

marc88101 said:


> Hey soaranus, do you even grow? Your an idiot! WE don't want you on this forum, everyone thinks your an idiot....look at your other thread about trolling..LMAO. Go away your not welcome here! Freak!


  this is you buddy


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## atlantaboy (Jan 10, 2013)

Fruitbat said:


> Diamond? You mean a compressed piece of carbon that is far more prevalent than DeBeers would have you think? I know I still get yelled out when my women is wearing hers. The only thing mood altering about it is...nothing.
> 
> Just because we are stoners doesn't mean we have to be stupid. Put on your critical thinking caps folks.


Ya woman..inexistent. Her diamonds..inexistent. If I was looking from another planet you'd look a lot like that compressed carbon.. But I guess yours is not so much stupidity as it is ignorance. I guess food is just crap to stuff in mouth and magnets just work.. Stupid to think a dumb rock could have properties


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## budman111 (Jan 11, 2013)

As we are talking about pyramids...

http://www.latest-ufo-sightings.net/2012/12/new-ancient-aliens-secrets-of-pyramids.html


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## magnus1 (Jan 11, 2013)

[h=1]wilhelm reich[/h]


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## billy4479 (Jan 22, 2013)

Well since crystals and science seem to be all over this thread we don't we talk a little about ..this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crystal_oscillator


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## Figong (Jan 22, 2013)

billy4479 said:


> Well since crystals and science seem to be all over this thread we don't we talk a little about ..this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crystal_oscillator


haha.. good ole' Curie - [video=youtube;rY0WxgSXdEE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rY0WxgSXdEE[/video]


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## billy4479 (Jan 22, 2013)

http://www.radio-electronics.com/info/data/crystals/quartz-crystals-resonator.php


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## billy4479 (Jan 22, 2013)

what crystals are used in radio and other electronics ..


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## Figong (Jan 22, 2013)

billy4479 said:


> what crystals are used in radio and other electronics ..


 It is the oscillator, but I'm sorry.. you didn't put your answer in the form of a question!


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 23, 2013)

I have been experimenting with half burried quartz crystals in my pots.. the crystals are small.. roughly an inch long and no more than 1/4 inch diameter. I stick the crystal halfway into the dirt about 3 inches from the stem.. 2 crystals in each pot. I then take a Malachite quartz (deep green stone, great for cleansing negative energy) and I form an energy grid with the quartz and malachite each day after watering. This has resulted in FAR more controlled grows.. I rarely have pest, mildew and mold problems... in fact.. I cant really remember the last time my garden was plagued by anything other than buds that were too heavy and snapped off during the humidity spike over night! Say what you want about the science of vibration... but this information is proven... documented.. and scientifically measureable. Everything exists as the result of a vibrational frequency.. this is proven fact.. Every crystal resonates at a very precise and measureable frequency, which in turn effects the frequency of objects around it, which are also emmiting a frequency. This is science folks.. and just because you dont understand it.. doesnt mean its not real! A person who doesnt believe in magic.. will never find it!  

Here are a few pics of ONE plant from my garden.. I used LST and Topping to achieve this result.. this plant is at day 15 of flower.. strain is called "Critical Mass". The one pic shows the quartz crystals in the soil.. The last feed I gave her was a little strong so shes showing some signs of stress... But still nice and healthy   Great thread dude... Cheers!


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## Trousers (Jan 23, 2013)

It is great when another believer shows up and schools us stupid people that believe in science, logic and critical thinking. 





Jay3Lee said:


> I have been experimenting with half burried quartz crystals in my pots.. the crystals are small.. roughly an inch long and no more than 1/4 inch diameter. I stick the crystal halfway into the dirt about 3 inches from the stem.. 2 crystals in each pot. I then take a Malachite quartz (deep green stone, great for cleansing negative energy) and I form an energy grid with the quartz and malachite each day after watering. This has resulted in FAR more controlled grows.. I rarely have pest, mildew and mold problems...



Neither do I and without crystals.
Do you have anything to back your story up with?
So as you gained more experience you had less problems?
Or you have not gained experience and the crystals saved your plants from your inability to grow them properly?
Or varieties that were more susceptible to pests, mildew and mold?




Jay3Lee said:


> in fact.. I cant really remember the last time my garden was plagued by anything other than buds that were too heavy and snapped off during the humidity spike over night! Say what you want about the science of vibration... but this information is proven... documented.. and scientifically measureable.


Scientifically measurable? Great, let's see it. Until then you are just another guy with a story. Correlation does not imply causation. 
I haven't been able to find anything but stories about crystals helping plants grow. 



Jay3Lee said:


> Everything exists as the result of a vibrational frequency.. this is proven fact..


Then it would be easy to provide a link.




Jay3Lee said:


> Every crystal resonates at a very precise and measureable frequency, which in turn effects the frequency of objects around it, which are also emmiting a frequency.


I would like to read about this. 






Jay3Lee said:


> This is science folks.. and just because you dont understand it.. doesnt mean its not real! A person who doesnt believe in magic.. will never find it!


We will just let that rude comment go. No need foe me to insult you back. 


Which is it, magic or science? If it is indeed science, then us unenlightened folks could read about it. 
Solar eclipses used to be magic, until they could be explained. 






Jay3Lee said:


> Here are a few pics of ONE plant from my garden.. I used LST and Topping to achieve this result.. this plant is at day 15 of flower.. strain is called "Critical Mass". The one pic shows the quartz crystals in the soil.. The last feed I gave her was a little strong so shes showing some signs of stress... But still nice and healthy  View attachment 2493225View attachment 2493226View attachment 2493227View attachment 2493229 Great thread dude... Cheers!



The crystals do not seem to stop the stress. 
My plants without crystals aren't stressed. 
Maybe the crystals are stressing the plant.


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## Heisenberg (Jan 23, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> I have been experimenting with half burried quartz crystals in my pots.. the crystals are small.. roughly an inch long and no more than 1/4 inch diameter. I stick the crystal halfway into the dirt about 3 inches from the stem.. 2 crystals in each pot. I then take a Malachite quartz (deep green stone, great for cleansing negative energy) and I form an energy grid with the quartz and malachite each day after watering. This has resulted in FAR more controlled grows..


What did you use for a control group? It appears you didn't attempt to account for any factors or bias. If not, your experiments aren't really experiments, at least not the kind that could tell us anything definitive or scientific.




> I rarely have pest, mildew and mold problems... in fact.. I cant really remember the last time my garden was plagued by anything other than buds that were too heavy and snapped off during the humidity spike over night!


I have no pests or disease problems. I get large heavy flowers. I use no crystals.



> Say what you want about the science of vibration... but this information is proven... documented.. and scientifically measureable. Everything exists as the result of a vibrational frequency.. this is proven fact.. Every crystal resonates at a very precise and measureable frequency, which in turn effects the frequency of objects around it, which are also emmiting a frequency. This is science folks.. and just because you dont understand it.. doesnt mean its not real! A person who doesnt believe in magic.. will never find it!


Please provide some sources for this proven, documented science. It seems the information on how and why crystals work is conflicting, with many 'experts' disagreeing with each other on mechanism and result. In fact IndianReikiMasters.com states "The main problem in providing hard core scientific data that would be acceptable to scientists at large is that the sensitive equipment necessary to measure these energy changes is not available today" So some crystal masters seem to think that crystals are beyond current scientific study, while you are suggesting the science is tried and true. Other crystals proponents admit that observation of the energy in crystals is dependent on one's intention and attitude, something that would be very hard to measure.

There are so many conflicting claims among crystal 'masters' that one, Olga Rasmussen, attempts to explain it with this explanation "If you read ten books on which crystals or stones you should use in healing and balancing the chakras, you will get ten different opinions...Remember that ultimately these stones represent a broad range of suggestions-perhaps much broader than those you have consulted. Ultimately you must learn to cultivate and develop your intuition and see what you are drawn to using." <-- Doesn't sound very scientific.

I think you would get better results with your plants if you could manage to get bigfoot to shit on them.


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 23, 2013)

Just because I am new to this forum.. does NOT mean Im a noob! I have been growing for most of my life, My father has a Phd in horticulture. I grew up in northern Canada and have been growing my own food.. and medicine for most of my life. Once I moved to a more temperate climate, the pest and mildew problems became much more apparent in such a humid climate. The first few crops were not great.. and after using sulphur burners, pesticides and many other home made remedies that did the trick... I have now been using crystals alone for the last year or so.. and have had great success without the use of any other control method. Quartz crystals have been used for decades as the basis of most technology because it has a very strong and measurable frequency... Not all crystals produce such strong results.. and therefore it does not surprise me that there is no instrument that could possibly measure every frequency of every crystal.. Human technology has its limits.. the universe does not! 

These experiments were conducted and documented in the 1960s by Dr. Hans Jenny. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05Io6lop3mk It shows the effect of sound frequencies when passed through a form of medium. In this video you can clearly see how vibrational frequencies can produce what would appear to be a solid structure.. This is what our entire existence is based on.. We are all connected by this same vibrational frequency and everything you know to be true is a result of variations in this frequency. Your consciousness is directly connected to this vibration on an energetic level.. This is where the "law of attraction" and all that type of stuff comes from.. Higher vibrations attract other higher vibrations.. so if you are living in a vibration of love, prosperity and happiness.. you will naturaly draw more of these things into your life.. Have you ever noticed that those people who speak most of success generally have it? And the ones who speak most of illness and hardship.. also have it? I dont need documentation to know this to be true in my own life.. just because your not willing to believe it.. doesnt make it un-true!

This video shows the correlation between vibration and our existence.. its called the unified feild.. which is physics on a quantum level. Nassim is at the top of his feild.. and questions EVERYTHING.. It is of course just a theory.. But so is the Theory of Relativity.. but people have been basing our lives on this theory for decades.. Even though its now being proven innaccurate.. If you actually take the time to research it.. it makes a hell of a lot more sense than "the invisble man that created the universe" story we are all force fed pretty much from birth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Y5bXdx5UrE Quantum physics are so infinitley fractile.. that it is said to be impossible for us to completely understand at our current level of consciousness.. Im sure you are aware that most humans only use about 10% of thier brains capacity throughout our life.. Until we figure out how to use the other 90%.. I believe this information will always be beyond our comprehension. Im glad you grow well.. Im glad I grow well.. I believe the use of crystals has helped both my life.. and my garden.. and I think the 3p per 1000w I get quite regularly would agree with me.. Good luck!


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## Heisenberg (Jan 23, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> Just because I am new to this forum.. does NOT mean Im a noob! I have been growing for most of my life, My father has a Phd in horticulture. I grew up in northern Canada and have been growing my own food.. and medicine for most of my life. Once I moved to a more temperate climate, the pest and mildew problems became much more apparent in such a humid climate. The first few crops were not great.. and after using sulphur burners, pesticides and many other home made remedies that did the trick... I have now been using crystals alone for the last year or so.. and have had great success without the use of any other control method. Quartz crystals have been used for decades as the basis of most technology because it has a very strong and measurable frequency... Not all crystals produce such strong results.. and therefore it does not surprise me that there is no instrument that could possibly measure every frequency of every crystal.. Human technology has its limits.. the universe does not!


No one has said anything about you being an noob, just that it is misleading to suggest there is any science backing up the claim of crystals helping plants grow. Hearsay and speculation are not scientific.



> These experiments were conducted and documented in the 1960s by Dr. Hans Jenny. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05Io6lop3mk It shows the effect of sound frequencies when passed through a form of medium. In this video you can clearly see how vibrational frequencies can produce what would appear to be a solid structure.. This is what our entire existence is based on.. We are all connected by this same vibrational frequency and everything you know to be true is a result of variations in this frequency. Your consciousness is directly connected to this vibration on an energetic level.. This is where the "law of attraction" and all that type of stuff comes from.. Higher vibrations attract other higher vibrations.. so if you are living in a vibration of love, prosperity and happiness.. you will naturaly draw more of these things into your life.. Have you ever noticed that those people who speak most of success generally have it? And the ones who speak most of illness and hardship.. also have it?


Please explain how cymatics enable crystals to stimulate plant growth. Dr Jenny's experiments are used to support everything from psychic healing to sacred geometry to crop circles to water memory to fountain of youth machines to UFO propulsion to govt weather control. It seems to be a favorite body of experiments for the pseudoscience crowds, despite the fact that many claims contradict each other in that they require radically different and conflicting sets of unknown laws and physics. 

Meanwhile you have provided no links to sources as asked, even though you claim it's science.



> I dont need documentation to know this to be true in my own life.. just because your not willing to believe it.. doesnt make it un-true!


An appeal to intuition, which isn't science, followed by a misunderstanding of how burden of proof works. 



> This video shows the correlation between vibration and our existence.. its called the unified feild.. which is physics on a quantum level. Nassim is at the top of his feild.. and questions EVERYTHING.. It is of course just a theory.. But so is the Theory of Relativity.. but people have been basing our lives on this theory for decades.. Even though its now being proven innaccurate.. If you actually take the time to research it.. it makes a hell of a lot more sense than "the invisble man that created the universe" story we are all force fed pretty much from birth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Y5bXdx5UrE Quantum physics are so infinitley fractile.. that it is said to be impossible for us to completely understand at our current level of consciousness.. Im sure you are aware that most humans only use about 10% of thier brains capacity throughout our life.. Until we figure out how to use the other 90%.. I believe this information will always be beyond our comprehension. Im glad you grow well.. Im glad I grow well.. I believe the use of crystals has helped both my life.. and my garden.. and I think the 3p per 1000w I get quite regularly would agree with me.. Good luck!


Well this explains your claim of crystals being backed up with science, you don't understand what science is. A scientific theory can run the gamut from disproven to unified. Saying something is "just a thoery" doesn't really tell us anything. Evolution is a theory and so is creationism, both competing and very different. A theory should be judged on it ability to explain and predict, not simply by it's title.

After throwing in a fallacious appeal to ignorance of quantum theory, you go on to repeat the well disproven myth that humans only use 10% of our brains. Why would we spend energy to evolve and preserve an organ that is 90% useless? 

http://theness.com/neurologicablog/index.php/reviving-the-10-brain-myth/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_percent_of_brain_myth

http://faculty.washington.edu/chudler/tenper.html

http://www.snopes.com/science/stats/10percent.asp

While you may not be a noob to growing, it seems you have a lot to learn about skepticism and critical thinking.


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 23, 2013)

Trousers said:


> It is great when another believer shows up and schools us stupid people that believe in science, logic and critical thinking.



Ahh yes.. such is the nature of progress..







Trousers said:


> Neither do I and without crystals.
> Do you have anything to back your story up with?
> So as you gained more experience you had less problems?
> Or you have not gained experience and the crystals saved your plants from your inability to grow them properly?
> Or varieties that were more susceptible to pests, mildew and mold?



I grew up in Northern Canada, My dad has a Phd in Horticulture and was the local food supplier for our town. I have been growing my own food, and medicine indoors for most of my life.. just because Im new to this forum.. does not mean Im a noob! Once I moved to a more arid and temperate climate about 5 years ago.. I noticed the pest, mold and mildew problems popping up alot more.. these things dont typically happen in a climate that has an average annual temp of -32 C. I tried many different sprays, sulphur burners and other home remedies with great success... but since beginning with the crystals about a year ago.. I have not needed any other forms of control for these issues. I have been growing this same strain for about 3 years now.. and have noticed a definate improvement after starting with the crystal grids. 






Trousers said:


> Scientifically measurable? Great, let's see it. Until then you are just another guy with a story. Correlation does not imply causation.
> I haven't been able to find anything but stories about crystals helping plants grow.


Ask and you shall recieve http://www.theochem.unito.it/crystal_tuto/mssc2008_cd/tutorials/vibfreq/vibfreq_tut.html





Trousers said:


> Then it would be easy to provide a link.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05Io6lop3mk






Trousers said:


> I would like to read about this.


Didnt you already ask this question? I guess you just like typing usless shit... 
http://www.theochem.unito.it/crystal_tuto/mssc2008_cd/tutorials/vibfreq/vibfreq_tut.html









Trousers said:


> Which is it, magic or science? If it is indeed science, then us unenlightened folks could read about it.
> Solar eclipses used to be magic, until they could be explained.



when most people dont understand something they call it magic.. When the white man came with thier fire sticks.. was this not seen as magic by the natives? Even though it was actually just science? Pretty weak arguement there.. 


Trousers said:


> The crystals do not seem to stop the stress.
> My plants without crystals aren't stressed.
> Maybe the crystals are stressing the plant.


As previously mentioned, I over fed them last feed.. My feeding schedule ramps up week over week.. I was in a hurry and read the chart wrong so it singed the tips a bit.. Im sure if you overfeed your plants they would produce similar results. 


Trousers said:


> What did you use for a control group? It appears you didn't attempt to account for any factors or bias. If not, your experiments aren't really experiments, at least not the kind that could tell us anything definitive or scientific.



I used the previous 4 years of growing experience as my control group. I think that works well enough for me..



Trousers said:


> I have no pests or disease problems. I get large heavy flowers. I use no crystals.



That is wonderful.. I am extremely happy for you.. and would also like to know how many different spray bottles you have kicking around your grow room... Also.. you claim nice and dense flowers? thats also wonderful.. but compared to what? My average yeild is usually between 2.5 and 3p per 1000w HPS light.. I think Im doing pretty good from what I have seen on these sites. and the crystals have allowed me to cut out the chemical component all together.. which cant possibly be a bad thing!



Trousers said:


> Please provide some sources for this proven, documented science. It seems the information on how and why crystals work is conflicting, with many 'experts' disagreeing with each other on mechanism and result. In fact IndianReikiMasters.com states "The main problem in providing hard core scientific data that would be acceptable to scientists at large is that the sensitive equipment necessary to measure these energy changes is not available today" So some crystal masters seem to think that crystals are beyond current scientific study, while you are suggesting the science is tried and true. Other crystals proponents admit that observation of the energy in crystals is dependent on one's intention and attitude, something that would be very hard to measure.



This does not surprise me.. the energies emitted by crystals are so complex, and so infitely fractile.. that it would be impossible for us to understand every aspect of this energy at our current level of technology and understanding. Humans only use 10% of their brain throughout thier lifetime.. I have a feeling we will need the other 90% before this type of thing can be comprehended. Technology has its limits.. The universe does not. But a clear example of the frequency emitted by crystals would be found in Quartz. Quartz crystals vibrate at a very strong and measureable frequency, and thus.. it has been the basis of most technolgy over the last several decades. If a quartz crystal can vibrate at a measureable frequency.. what leads you to believe that other crystals can not do the same thing? 



Trousers said:


> There are so many conflicting claims among crystal 'masters' that one, Olga Rasmussen, attempts to explain it with this explanation "If you read ten books on which crystals or stones you should use in healing and balancing the chakras, you will get ten different opinions...Remember that ultimately these stones represent a broad range of suggestions-perhaps much broader than those you have consulted. Ultimately you must learn to cultivate and develop your intuition and see what you are drawn to using." <-- Doesn't sound very scientific.




You are right, Consciousness does play a HUGE part.. we are all conscious beings connected by a living force.. or vibration that binds us all. Different people are at different levels of vibration and therefore precieve their reality differently. This is all covered in Sacred Geometry and Unified Feild studies... quantum physics if you will.. Here a great video by Nassim Haramein.. a brilliant quatum physicist that has been studying the unified field since a very young age. His approach is somewhat unorthodox compared to most physicist.. but his information is sound.. accurate.. and lets face it.. it makes a hell of a lot more sense than the "invisible man" theory we have pretty much all been force fed since birth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Y5bXdx5UrE

I dont blame you for not understanding this stuff.. Its incredibly complex and takes years of patience and research to fully grasp and understand. I hope you consider this the start of your learning curve.. good luck!





Trousers said:


> I think you would get better results with your plants if you could manage to get bigfoot to shit on them.



Common... bigfoot? Now thats just crazy talk 

Namaste


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 23, 2013)

Heisenberg said:


> No one has said anything about you being an noob, just that it is misleading to suggest there is any science backing up the claim of crystals helping plants grow. Hearsay and speculation are not scientific.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If you read back.. I never said that Crystals helping plants grow is tried and tested.. I said that crystals resonate at a measureable frequency.. which is tried and tested.. Plants also vibrate at a measurable frequency.. which is tried and tested.. and freqencies interact with each other to cause change.. which is also a proven fact.. If all of the components that lead up to crystals helping a plant grow are proven facts... what leads you to believe that the theory is not sound? I personally do not have the capacity to conduct an experiment on thousands of plants at a time to have a large enough control group to produce documented and varifiable results.. But I do have several years of experience with this same strain, and have seen definate improvements and ultimately the elimination of pest control measures needing to be taken in my garden. Critical thinking is what has brought me to this level of understanding of the universe.. I believe it is you that has many lessons yet to learn..


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## Xrangex (Jan 23, 2013)

StoopidLungs said:


> Crystals and weed growing. I have been on a spiritual journey lately which has brought me to love the effects that different types of crystals can have on people and the energy that surrounds them. So I had an idea to use crystals in my grow room and I researched which crystals work best for plant growth. So I ordered a pyramid shaped moss agate (pyramid-shaped crystals contain even more energy) and also a whole pound of rough green calcite. I am going to put the moss agate pyramid in between the 2 buckets on the ground and scatter the pound of green calcite around the buckets and grow room. Here are the benefits of each stone:
> 
> Moss agate is probably the most beneficial stone when you want increased plant growth. It is known as the gardener's talisman for this very reason. Moss agate is often used to attract prosperity and abundance. It's also a healing stone. This crystal is associated with nature spirits. Wearing moss agate while gardening can increase your energy, relieve a stiff neck, and tune you in to the energies of your garden. Placing moss agate stones in a container pot or in the ground will increase flower and plant growth. I made a moss agate wind chime suspended from three bamboo stakes tied together at the top and placed this tee-pee in a part of my garden where the Phlox weren't doing so well. Within a couple of weeks, I was overrun. A little goes a long way when it comes to crystals. If you have fruit trees, try hanging a small moss agate stone from one of the branches to promote a healthy harvest.
> 
> ...





StoopidLungs said:


> I realize now that I shouldn't post links so I went back and omitted it. Sorry I am new. I was posting the link to avoid plagiarism and to give you a starting point on your quest for knowledge on the topic, not to advertise. I am so used to citing my sources. Anyway, I recommend checking it out for yourself with a simple google search of the benefits of crystals- and no, I do not work for google lol  This is an interesting topic that has very little exploration and even less documentation. Which is interesting, because in my experience I have found that those who smoke weed (most of you lol) are often times on spiritual journeys and more likely to practice things like meditation, lucid dreaming, and crystal healing. It just seems like there would be more information out there or stories of using crystals in weed gardens. But since there isn't, I thought I could get it goin!


You and I would get along very well dude. Very cool shit, never thought to bring the enegergy in crystals to the garden.


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## Heisenberg (Jan 23, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> If you read back.. I never said that Crystals helping plants grow is tried and tested.. I said that crystals resonate at a measureable frequency.. which is tried and tested.. Plants also vibrate at a measurable frequency.. which is tried and tested.. and freqencies interact with each other to cause change.. which is also a proven fact.. If all of the components that lead up to crystals helping a plant grow are proven facts... what leads you to believe that the theory is not sound?


Because that same logic is used to justify all kinds of claims, such as this below... 



> *Recently, in Germany, researchers took the DNA of a 17-year-old boy, recorded its sound frequencies, and saved them. The boy was accidentally killed, but the scientists still had his DNA frequency patterns. Later, the DNA frequencies of the 17-year-old were transmitted into the body of a man in his late thirties. And the man almost became the young boy. His skin became youthful, he became slim, his hair went back to its natural color. Today hes in his forties and he still looks like a much younger man.
> 
> In the early 18th century, the German physicist Ernst Chladni, the father of acoustics, covered plates with thin layers of sand, set them vibrating, and observed the patterns that were made in response to different sound stimuli.
> 
> ...


and as I said, I can quote similar pseudoscience about UFO's, crop circles, water memory, ect. In science, you have to actually do the work and demonstrate your claims, you can't simply make assumptions. This is either science, or your personal ideology. Since you can not show that it is science, it must be the latter. I don't begrudge you your faith but you can't expect it to mean anything to anyone but yourself.



> I personally do not have the capacity to conduct an experiment on thousands of plants at a time to have a large enough control group to produce documented and varifiable results.. But I do have several years of experience with this same strain, and have seen definate improvements and ultimately the elimination of pest control measures needing to be taken in my garden. Critical thinking is what has brought me to this level of understanding of the universe.. I believe it is you that has many lessons yet to learn..


The situation you describe here is not science, it's uncontrolled anecdotal information, which has almost no value in science. You gloss over the 10% brain myth you perpetuated while telling me I have lessons to learn? Pretty arrogant and self serving. You make contradictory statements like saying this is science and then saying is not well understood, talking as if it's a proven fact while you show it's actually only passed your personal standards of credulity, which are obviously lax; it seems you really haven't thought much about this as you can not keep your sentiments consistent. You don't understand the scientific method or scientific terms, like energy, yet you want to pretend science backs up your mental masturbation. It appears you are more invested in magical and wishful thinking than critical. Critical thinking and science both demand that you follow the evidence no matter where it leads. What you are following is ideology.


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## Trousers (Jan 23, 2013)

* Jay3Lee 
*
Since you can not back up your claims, why not make your own experiment? Grow some plants with and without crystals, perhaps try the scientific method. I'm not going to read heisenberg's post, because I am sure he is saying what I am trying to communicate in a smarter and more effective way. 

You are just telling us stories and making assumptions. Stories are great, but I can tell you a lot of stories about growing plants. They would all sound more believable than yours and they would all be false. 

I would be happy to entertain your ideas if there was something that would actually back them up.

*I am just asking to see an experiment with results that could be repeated elsewhere. *
I am not looking for some snotty, "You just don't get it" comment. That is rude and dumb. 




Heisenberg said:


> I think you would get better results with your plants if you could manage to get bigfoot to shit on them.


Best idea in the thread so far.


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## ArCaned (Jan 24, 2013)

So, you fixed your bug problem at the same time as putting these rocks in your grow room.


gratz.


Anyone who truly believes crystals will make your plants grow better...


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 24, 2013)

ArCaned said:


> So, you fixed your bug problem at the same time as putting these rocks in your grow room.
> 
> 
> gratz.
> ...


No actually... I put the crystals in my grow room.. and then had no more bug problems...

Anyone who truley believes that they understand the infinite potential of universal energies (or that they dont exist) is far more retarded in my opinion!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Y5bXdx5UrE


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## Heisenberg (Jan 24, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> No actually... I put the crystals in my grow room.. and then had no more bug problems...
> 
> Anyone who truley believes that they understand the infinite potential of universal energies (or that they dont exist) is far more retarded in my opinion!
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Y5bXdx5UrE


What are universal energies? One of these?
Thermal energy
Chemical energy
Electric energy
Radiant energy, the energy of electromagnetic radiation
Nuclear energy
Magnetic energy
Elastic energy
Sound energy
Mechanical energy
Luminous energy
Mass (E=mc²)

Energy is a very specific word with a hard definition. All energy follows the laws of thermodynamics. One thing we understand about energy is that it does not have infinite potential.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_death_of_the_universe

While energy can not be created or destroyed, it can and will be rendered useless which would seem to negate it's potential. It seems your opinion is uninformed and devoid of merit. 



12 steps to critical thinking

1) We admit that our cognition, perception, and memory are flawed and pseudoscience and gullibility are rampant.




2) We come to accept that the process of thinking critically is more important than any belief.




3) We acknowledge the utility of methodological naturalism as a way of empirically understanding the world.




*4) We make a thorough study of the various mechanisms of self-deception, cognitive biases, and logical fallacies.*




5) We vow to explain what a logical fallacy is to those that make one instead of just calling out the logical fallacy.




6) We acknowledge to ourselves, others, and on the internet that we are skeptics.




7) We will always listen to and consider new ideas and welcome challenging views.




 We will endeavor to examine our premises and logic and correct any misinformation or misconceptions we may have spread.




9) We will correct errors and false statements on blog posts and within forums unless doing so would make us a dickish troll.




10) We will continue to keep all opinions and conclusions tentative and revise them in the face of new information.




11) We will seek through study and research to improve our critical thinking skills and keep up to date on basic scientific literacy.




12) Having become more skeptical ourselves, we will engage in skeptical activism and outreach to help make the world a more skeptical place.


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## Heisenberg (Jan 24, 2013)

As for Sacred Geomoetry and Ancient Aliens, there are plenty of extensive threads in the spirituality section debunking this nonsense.


http://thrivedebunked.wordpress.com/tag/sacred-geometry/

Is Nassim Haramein Right About the Things He Says in Thrive?


Not very much of the time. A lot of what Mr. Nassim states in Thrive is simply false. On this blog we have already debunked much of the material he presents. For example, we&#8217;ve already noted that his claim about the &#8220;Flower of Life&#8221; in the Osirian Temple is incorrect. It is not &#8220;burned into the atomic structure of the rock.&#8221; In this article, which debunks the idea of &#8220;ancient astronauts,&#8221; I explain at length how and why Mr. Haramein&#8217;s assertions about ancient civilizations and ancient history are wrong. For instance, the Egyptian and Mayan &#8220;sun gods&#8221; had nothing to do with science or engineering. A case can be made that the Incan &#8220;sun god&#8221; did supposedly teach some knowledge to the Incas, but the context in which Mr. Haramein employs this idea&#8212;supposedly to illustrate that &#8220;ancient astronauts&#8221; exist&#8212;is totally incorrect. There is not a single piece of evidence anywhere in the world indicating that aliens visited ancient civilizations thousands or hundreds of years ago. The only basis for the &#8220;ancient astronaut&#8221; claims is the supposition that particular structures, such as pyramids, were beyond the capability of ancient peoples to construct, and therefore they must have been built by aliens. As I explained in the article debunking ancient astronauts, that supposition is totally unsupportable. Furthermore, he&#8217;s also wrong about the Forbidden City being &#8220;where the sun gods reside.&#8221; The Forbidden City, built in Beijing in the early 1400s, was where the terrestrial emperor resided, not the &#8220;sun gods.&#8221;


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## PetFlora (Jan 24, 2013)

To all you fun makers

Have you forgotten that crystals are used as power sources, in cell phones, laptops, radios... or did you somehow never come across this? 

Let's say you have a dog (you know, man's best friend) only you don't treat him that way, instead you treat him with disdain, even make fun of him (as you are here towards things you don't understand, solely because it is beyond your present state of awareness/ consciousness) I wouldn't count on his protection, should the time come. And he's libel to escape the first chance he gets. He feels your negativity

The potential of crystal energy depends on you. Don't believe, and you won't see any benefits. If a crystal amplifier is being short circuited, it can't amplify until the obstruction is removed, pretty much the same in your tents or grow rooms.

I have crystals everywhere, + I use Orgone mixed with semi-precious stones and metals, and in my rez, whose water goes through an RO. I use RO for cooking and drinking. 

Next Step 

I run the RO water through a _water- vortex energizer_ to clear the water of all the negative effects caused by the toxic energy residues of chlorine, flouride, and pharmaceuticals (from people flushing their meds) that remain, in minute amounts. 

Vortexing helps to restore the original energy and cell memory to the water so it can be beneficial. Think of a fast moving mountain stream and the plant life that thrives along the shore, or how energizing it is to swim in it

I often hear that my mmj does things for those ho get to enjoy it that other stuff they smoke doesn't. Because they don't have a preconceived opinion, it is opening them up to new experiences- conscious awareness


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## Heisenberg (Jan 24, 2013)

Many electronic devices utilize crystals, yet none of these devices are dependent on your attitude towards it or your feelings about it. In fact the none of the energies science has defined depends on your believing in it. This crystal energy doesn't seem to share any of the properties that all other energy does, meaning it does not fit the definition of energy.

http://www.skepdic.com/crystals.html

"We can dismiss the pre-scientific belief in the magical powers of crystals and gemstones as due to the lack of scientific knowledge. Modern occultists, however, *distort and falsify scientific knowledge in order to promote belief in their crystal products.* According to the purveyors of this crystalline pseudoscience, crystals channel good "energy" and ward off bad "energy." They carry "vibrations" that resonate with healing "frequencies," work with the chakras and help balance yin and yang. Crystals allegedly affect the emotions and can be used not only for physical healing, but for emotional problems as well. Crystals can not only help with emotional healing, but with self-expression, creativity, meditation, and the immune system. None of these claims is backed by any scientific evidence.

"The New Age idea that crystals can harness and direct energy seems to be based upon a misunderstanding of one of the more curious characteristics of certain crystals, namely, that they produce an electrical charge when compressed. This is known as the piezoelectric effect and was discovered in 1880 by Pierre and Jacques Curie. Other technological developments had to occur before the piezoelectric effect could be put to use, however, and it was not until the 1950s that the piezoelectric effect could be put to general use in record player needles and a variety of measuring devices. Nowadays, these devices "*are used in almost every conceivable application requiring accurate measurement and recording of dynamic changes in mechanical variables such as pressure, force and acceleration.*"


"The piezoelectric effect, however, does not give crystals healing or protective power, despite the claims of those who use and sell crystals in New Age and neo-pagan occultist shops. However, wearing crystals seems to give some people a feeling of protection. This, and their aesthetic qualities, seem to be the only virtues of crystal jewelry."


The idea that something only works if you believe in it is a common claim by many pseudoscientific proponents and is known as special pleading. My (esp,crystals,health drink,time machine,ghost phone) is beyond your science and therefore can not be judged by it. The very controls which make science accurate are the ones that special pleading attempts to circumvent, because it is those quality controls which filter pseudoscience out. Meanwhile these same proponents are more than happy to use science to support their claims if they feel it backs them up. They want to eat their cake and still have it.


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 24, 2013)

If you can debunk this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Y5bXdx5UrE be my guest... His math is sound.. and it makes a hell of a lot more sense than the explination we are givin as children as to how the world works.. and how things come into existence. The entire theory of relativity that your entire life is based on has been in question by the scientific community for the last decade.. Physicis are freaking out because this guy actually makes sense.. and has been able to solve equations that have perplexed the greatest minds in our history. Your stuck believing what you were taught in 3rd grade.. and thats fine with me.. Ive chosen to open up my mind to the possibility that maybe the theory of relativity (which doesnt make much sense to begin with) is wrong? And that the fundamental physics we base creation on are flawed at their most basic levels? This theory goes beyond dogma and religion and bases its theory in mathematical fact. Think of it this way.. the atom that makes up the solid world is composed of 99.99999% empty space.. which in turn means that the solid reality you and I live in is really just 0.0000000001% of actual existence. For centuries scientists have been focusing on the 0.000000000001% of the matter that makes up existance.. and IGNORING the 99.999999999999% of SPACE that makes up EVERYTHING! SO.. what is this space made up of? In short.. its ENERGY.. did you know that the density of a proton is calculated to be MORE than the density of the entire visible universe? There are MANY things you.. nor the general scientific community are not able to explain.. and the transfer of energy is one of those things that is only looked at from the perspective of the 0.00000000001%. Once you stand back and realize that everything is both infinitly big.. and infinitly small at the same time.. this type of energy begins to make a LOT more sense. Watch Nassim's video before you make another comment.. anything said before researching this view point is only continuing the dogmatic rituals that have kept man kind in the dark about this kind of thing for thousands of years. Unification theory is the new physics.. throw out what you know.. because I guarantee you this will be taught in schools everywhere in the VERY near future!


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## Heisenberg (Jan 24, 2013)

Ahh so your crystals which a few pages ago were backed up with science, now depends on overturning the entire theory of relativity? Your ideology seems to drift wherever you sense support. The theory of relativity is well defended in the science section of this site, which is where you should go if you are looking for discussion. As for debunking Nassim, there is an entire page devoted to exposing his quackery at http://thrivedebunked.wordpress.com/2012/03/09/who-is-nassim-haramein/


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 24, 2013)

And just for the record.. wordpress.com is one of the biggest sites for misinformation available. It is controlled by the same people that control your government, your media, and for the most part.. YOUR LIFE.. Math doesnt lie... but sites like this can.. because they rely on closed minded people like yourself to just "take their word for it" rather than doing the research for yourself.. But then again.. we are all taught not to question authority from a very young age.. so how could I expect you to question something you read on the internet? Your in the dark man.. math doesnt lie.. and Nassim does the math..


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 24, 2013)

Oh.. and by the way.. that article you posted is talking about the movie Thrive.. which only has snippits of info from Nassim.. it mentions nothing of his unification theory... How much more useless shit are you going to post before you actually do some work yourself?


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## Heisenberg (Jan 24, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> And just for the record.. wordpress.com is one of the biggest sites for misinformation available. It is controlled by the same people that control your government, your media, and for the most part.. YOUR LIFE.. Math doesnt lie... but sites like this can.. because they rely on closed minded people like yourself to just "take their word for it" rather than doing the research for yourself.. But then again.. we are all taught not to question authority from a very young age.. so how could I expect you to question something you read on the internet? Your in the dark man.. math doesnt lie.. and Nassim does the math..


So now there is a conspiracy to hush the insights of Nassim? One that extends even to wordpress! Well lets see you have so far engaged in just about every tactic defenders of pseudoscience like to use.

You first misrepresent science as if it backs up your claims.

You back up your myth with others myths

You then devalue science and appeal to ignorance (what we don't know) as if ignorance of the world somehow supports your claims

You suggest science is closed minded

You evoke a shadowy conspiracy that intends to downplay your claims and keep everyone in the dark except those who agree with you


"Every working scientist's career is defined by his new discoveries; there is no work to be done, and no salary to be found, in accepting irrefutable truths and doing nothing. Nobody funds research that's intended to not learn anything." - Brian Dunning


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## Heisenberg (Jan 24, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> Oh.. and by the way.. that article you posted is talking about the movie Thrive.. which only has snippits of info from Nassim.. it mentions nothing of his unification theory... How much more useless shit are you going to post before you actually do some work yourself?


I am required to do no work. The burden of proof falls to the party making the claim. It's not my fault that the sources you sight have already been analyzed and discredited.


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 24, 2013)

Last post for this thread... I have "experimented" with 2400 plants over 3 years, the first 1600 grew well with use of chemical sprays and sulphur burners. The last 800 plants grew well without use of chemical sprays and sulphur burners. The ONLY difference was the crystals, and I no longer use chemical sprays or sulphur burners. Once you have "experimented" with 2400 plants and gotten different results.. feel free to post.. Untill then.. you are in NO POSITION WHATSOEVER to argue the validity of this. I may not have documented proof.. but I DO have experience.. which is more than ANY of you can say... SO untill you have the EXPERIENCE to back up your claims.. run along kiddies!


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## Heisenberg (Jan 25, 2013)

"If an opinion contrary to your own makes you angry, that is a sign that you are subconsciously aware of having no good reason for thinking as you do. If some one maintains that two and two are five, or that Iceland is on the equator, you feel pity rather than anger, unless you know so little of arithmetic or geography that his opinion shakes your own contrary conviction. So whenever you find yourself getting angry about a difference of opinion, be on your guard; you will probably find, on examination, that your belief is going beyond what the evidence warrants." &#8212;Bertrand Russell


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 25, 2013)

Heisenberg said:


> "If an opinion contrary to your own makes you angry, that is a sign that you are subconsciously aware of having no good reason for thinking as you do. If some one maintains that two and two are five, or that Iceland is on the equator, you feel pity rather than anger, unless you know so little of arithmetic or geography that his opinion shakes your own contrary conviction. So whenever you find yourself getting angry about a difference of opinion, be on your guard; you will probably find, on examination, that your belief is going beyond what the evidence warrants." &#8212;Bertrand Russell


Have you grown 2400 plants yet? Something tells me you havnt... Until you have.. I believe I am the only person ive ever seen who has first hand experience with this on a large scale using cannabis. SO.. untill you can produce different results on a similar control group, Your point of view is meaningless. My opinion is contrary to you yours because I actually have experience and am speaking from first hand knowledge.. You are speaking from assumptions and quoting resources that have literally nothing to do with crystals helping plants grow. If you really want to prove me wrong.. get off the fucking internet and do some experiments yourself. Once you have a control group of 2400 plants.. come talk to me.. Untill then.. you are going off hearsay and assumptions... which are completely worthless in any faction. Good day to you sir!


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 25, 2013)

Lets see who else is preaching unification theory... humm... it seems we have Stephen Hawking PhD. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4TO1iLZmcw (Last I checked he was the smartest guy on the planet...) John Hagelin PhD. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fqdcdky9wR4 (Head of Physics, Maharishi University). Nassim Haramien (Director of Research at The Resonance Project) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Y5bXdx5UrE. Alber Einstein (I think we all know who he is) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4_uFU-fKTM... To make a long story short.. The Greatest minds of the last 100 or so years have been working on a unification theory that encompasses eveything in the known universe into a mathematical formula. Einstein never finished his unification theory.. Hawking, Hagelin, and Haramein have found the answer! All of this information has only been uncovered within the last decade or so.. So its no real surprise that it is largely unaccepted by the scientific community. But.. such is the nature of change.. It took nearly 100 years for the Germ theory of disease transmission to become accepted as common knowledge.. But the first person to come up with the idea was demonized and commited as insane because of his beliefs. Just becaaluse this isnt common knowledge YET.. doesnt mean it is not factual... Even Einstein knew his theory of relativity (the idea that everything is seperated from each other.. or relative to each other.. and only forces that are seen and can be measured in the physical world actually exist) was flawed.. and hence.. he spent the last few decades of his life working on Grand Unification Theory.. Even Einstein wasnt satisfied with using made up numbers like "Strong and Weak force" to complete his calculations.. And fortunately for us... Brilliant minds of today have worked out the bugs and brought a solution to Einstein's theory. Science is moving through new discoveries at an incredible pace.. A pace never seen before in Human History.. What used to take 100 years to become common knowledge has been accelerated by means of the internet so that everyday average joes like you and me have access to this wealth of information.. and can see the logic in the equations ourself. Unification Theory states that everything is connected by space, that space is filled with an infinite amount of polarized energy which can be transmuted from postive to negative by means of interaction with other energies. So.. in short.. If everything is connected, and everything is energy.. and the energy of one object directly effects the energy of other objects around it, and crystals have an energy that can be measured... what leads you to believe that this is false? Im sorry.. but the outdated physics model you are currently governing your rebuttal on are simply this... OUTDATED.. and INACCURATE! And I have some of the greatest minds in history backing me up... Not some blogger on wordpress... Go back to school noob!


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## Heisenberg (Jan 25, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> Have you grown 2400 plants yet? Something tells me you havnt... Until you have.. I believe I am the only person ive ever seen who has first hand experience with this on a large scale using cannabis. SO.. untill you can produce different results on a similar control group, Your point of view is meaningless. My opinion is contrary to you yours because I actually have experience and am speaking from first hand knowledge.. You are speaking from assumptions and quoting resources that have literally nothing to do with crystals helping plants grow. If you really want to prove me wrong.. get off the fucking internet and do some experiments yourself. Once you have a control group of 2400 plants.. come talk to me.. Untill then.. you are going off hearsay and assumptions... which are completely worthless in any faction. Good day to you sir!


I've been inclined to believe you have grown these plants so far, but now I am beginning to wonder as I have never seen an experienced grower brag so much about so little. No matter anyhow as it is beside the point. You could grow ten thousand plants and it still wouldn't rule out things like confirmation bias, observation bias, logical mistakes, and human error in reasoning, such as confusing correlation with causation. You also apparently do not understand what a control group is, or the concept of burden of proof. These terms have actual definitions you know...

You have basically come on and said crystals help plants grow, and I have asked questions; questions which should have easy answers. Instead of being able to answer them, your story falls apart and becomes you saying "Crystals do this thing to my plants that I can't really explain using some mechanism I can't really describe, and unless you can prove otherwise, it's true!". Along the way you have perpetuated some known nonsense such as the 10% brain myth, misunderstanding of what energy is, the law of attraction, and finally you culminate in trying to overturn relativity. Rather than acknowledge any of these mistakes, you attempt to spin them with more nonsense, such as a global conspiracy. I guess you are not big on self correction. 

Which assumptions have I made? If you look you'll see I am simply questioning your assumptions, and who is the one bringing up shit that has nothing to do with crystals? These are the places you take us when you attempt to back up your nonsense. Now you want me to do your work for you and prove you wrong. I could say the same thing about a unicorn living in the center of the sun. Get off your ass and prove there isn't one. See how it's not fair to ask you to do my work?

Rarely does a sound concept depend on personal abuse and name calling, yet that seems to be all that you are left with, that and empty threats to leave the thread. Doubt seems to make you angry, while science depends on doubt and asking questions. What you embrace is pseudoscience, and like all pseudoscience yours requires a measure of faith. Your faith is fine to have, but don't expect it to mean anything to anyone but yourself.


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 25, 2013)

Heisenberg said:


> I've been inclined to believe you have grown these plants so far, but now I am beginning to wonder as I have never seen an experienced grower brag so much about so little. No matter anyhow as it is beside the point. You could grow ten thousand plants and it still wouldn't rule out things like confirmation bias, observation bias, logical mistakes, and human error in reasoning, such as confusing correlation with causation. You also apparently do not understand what a control group is, or the concept of burden of proof. These terms have actual definitions you know...
> 
> You have basically come on and said crystals help plants grow, and I have asked questions; questions which should have easy answers. Instead of being able to answer them, your story falls apart and becomes you saying "Crystals do this thing to my plants that I can't really explain using some mechanism I can't really describe, and unless you can prove otherwise, it's true!". Along the way you have perpetuated some known nonsense such as the 10% brain myth, misunderstanding of what energy is, the law of attraction, and finally you culminate in trying to overturn relativity. Rather than acknowledge any of these mistakes, you attempt to spin them with more nonsense, such as a global conspiracy. I guess you are not big on self correction.
> 
> ...


I think Im going to agree with Mr. Hawking, Mr. Hagelin, Mr. Haramein, and Mr. Einstein on this one.. Even Einstein knew Relativistic Physics was fundamentally flawed.. Why is it so hard for you to believe? In all actuality.. I really dont care if you believe me or not. I have been researching Unified Theory for about 5 years now, how much research have you done on the subject? All Im saying is that I have current information that overturns the Theory of Relativity which you are basing your rebuttal on. You dont see it now.. but you will in the very near future.. Of that I am sure! Once again.. do some experiments and get back to me.. Untill then.. this is all hearsay.. and you sir are a closed minded fool!


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 25, 2013)

Basic relitavistic physics states how "Dimensions" work.. Dimension 0 = a dot (which does not exist) Dimension 1 = A series of dots that form a line (which also does not exist) Dimension 2 = A series of lines that enclose a surface plane (but also does not exist) and Finally Dimension 3 - A series of surface planes arranged to form a cube... which now holds volume.. and thus.. it exists.. we all learned this in Grade 3... And it is THE MAIN FLAW in relitavistic physics!! Think of it this way... if you have a dot that doesnt exist.. that makes a line that doesnt exist.. that makes a plane that doesnt exist... how can all of these non existant things.. make something real??? It doesnt make any sense at all.. And Einstein KNEW this.. and THAT is why the theory of relativity is so fundamentally flawed! the simple fact of the matter.. is that the dot is EVERYTHING.. ranging from infinitly big.. to infinitely small.. And rather than trying to find the fundamental base particle that creation is based on.. we should be looking for a fundamental pattern of division. The universe is infinitely fractile.. dots making up other dots making bigger dots etc. All of these dots exist due to enegry.. and all energy is connected. This is the new physics.. Your still in the dark bud!


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 25, 2013)

This tosses your Dogmatic views out the window.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olve8kwBKIw Last time i checked.. Numbers dont usually lie....


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## Trousers (Jan 26, 2013)

Why do you feel the need to be such a douche while not proving that crystals benefit plants?
When you are telling someone they are not smart, you should spell the word "you're" correctly.


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 26, 2013)

Trousers said:


> Why do you feel the need to be such a douche while not proving that crystals benefit plants?
> When you are telling someone they are not smart, you should spell the word "you're" correctly.


Are you serious? "You're" connotates "You Are" which is not correct for the context of that sentence.. "Your" connotates posession... as in "whats mine is YOURS" so.. In fact.. When I am talking about YOUR dogmatic views.. YOUR would be the grammatically correct spelling. Unification theory states that ALL THINGS ARE CONNECTED BY ENERGY.. therefore.. Crystals are connected to plants by energy.. and all energry can be transmuted from positive to negative. I believe you sir are the douche that has failed to even read any of the information I have posted.. let alone research it. Math doesnt lie bud... Scientists DO!


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 26, 2013)

I would like to thank the people in this forum for giving me reason to research the fundamental ideas behind the use of crystals. Because of you, I now have a physical, mathematical evidence that this theory is correct. 

The mass of the universe is calculated to be the SAME as the mass within each proton within our physical reality. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olve8kwBKIw This equation shows that from the largest macrocosmic scale... right down to the smallest microcosmic/sub-atomic levels.. the level of energy is CONSTANTLY divided in a very definate pattern from infinintely big THROUGH YOU, THROUGH PLANTS, and THROUGH CRYSTALS down to infinitely small.. This energy creates an incredibly complex resonant frequency that resonates at a potentially infinite number of wavelengths. These wavelengths can interact with each other.. the same way sounds interact with each other (eg. many instruments in a band create a single cohesive sound). These wavelengths change the structure of other wavelengths as they come in contact with each other. Crystals have a very precise and measureable frequency.. http://www.theochem.unito.it/crystal_tuto/mssc2008_cd/tutorials/vibfreq/vibfreq_tut.html, all biological life also emits a frequency http://www.electronichealing.co.uk/articles/bio_spectrum.htm which is effected by the frequency of other things around it.. SO.. if all the things that lead up to crystals effecting plant growth are all physical, mathematical facts... Why is it so hard for you to believe that Crystals actually DO effect plant growth? There are crystals in your computer that emit frequncies when electricity is passed through them.. that is how your computer does what it does.. You say that your consciousness has nothing to do with your computer working?? Try not touching your computer and see what happens... Im sure you will find that NOTHING happens untill YOUR CONSCIOUS EFFORT is applied to your computer.. You MUST consciously move your hand to the mouse, or keyboard and transfer the energy from your mind to your hands.. through the keys that produce elecrical signals that are transmitted through the crystals to produce the result you desire from your computer. This all really basic stuff folks.. we think about things before we do them.. its just the way the world works! So for you to say that consciousness is not a factor because it can not be measured is simply ludicrous! EVERYTHING YOU HAVE EVER TOUCHED is a result of consciousness interacting with the physical environment!

In addition to this scientific, mathematical evidence I have collected.. I also have grown approximately 2400 plants in the EXACT same environment, with the EXACT same food, EXACT same lights, EXACT SAME EVERYTHING.. And seen a definate improvement in the overall health of my plants, I maintained a VERY high yeild.. and was able to rid my garden of chemical pest, and disease control. As far as Im concerned I have enough factual evidence to promote with full confidence that Crystals DO help your plants! And untill someone can provide evidence that these mathematical facts are false... OR can conduct an experiment with a simlar control group and provide different results.. Please feel free to share.. Until then.. I believe this discussion is closed


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## ginjawarrior (Jan 26, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> This tosses your Dogmatic views out the window.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olve8kwBKIw Last time i checked.. Numbers dont usually lie....


lol numbers are numbers, how they are interpreted however is a much different matter

and youtube videos certain can be full of lies

but its cute your think its proof of anything


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 26, 2013)

ginjawarrior said:


> lol numbers are numbers, how they are interpreted however is a much different matter
> 
> and youtube videos certain can be full of lies
> 
> but its cute your think its proof of anything


When math adds up.. its true math.. This math adds up.. relativistic physics does not.. I fail to see you point in this...


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## ginjawarrior (Jan 26, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> When math adds up.. its true math.. This math adds up.. relativistic physics does not.. I fail to see you point in this...


LOL a man on youtube has thrown a bunch of numbers at you and told you what they're supposed to mean 

you've bought it hook line and sinker well thats good for you

go off and play with your crystals if that what you wish 

but dont try to get us to believe this bullshit


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 26, 2013)

That man calculated the size and volume of the universe, and then cross referenced it with the size and volume of a proton and found the same value.. he then reversed his caluclations to check his math and found the same result. If you can find flaws in his calculation be my guest.. I have not found them.. and I am most certain I have done more research on this than you have. Your opinion is dogmatic and holds no substance.. This formula is EXACT and can be back referenced for accuracy to a billionth of a billionth of a billionth of a percent.. I think Im going to believe the math.. not some guy who's still stuck on 3rd grade physics.. Try actually learning something instead of making assumptions all the time.. you might be surprised what you learn!


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 26, 2013)

OH... and by the way.. Stephen Hawking agrees with me... Last time I checked.. he was a little bit smarter than you!


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## ginjawarrior (Jan 26, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> That man calculated the size and volume of the universe, and then cross referenced it with the size and volume of a proton and found the same value.. he then reversed his caluclations to check his math and found the same result. If you can find flaws in his calculation be my guest.. I have not found them.. and I am most certain I have done more research on this than you have. Your opinion is dogmatic and holds no substance.. This formula is EXACT and can be back referenced for accuracy to a billionth of a billionth of a billionth of a percent.. I think Im going to believe the math.. not some guy who's still stuck on 3rd grade physics.. Try actually learning something instead of making assumptions all the time.. you might be surprised what you learn!


and what? he did a couple of sums and has done nothing apart from that to back it up?

no predictions?
no experiments?
nothing at all just a youtube vid and a gaggle of gullible idiots who lap it up without question?

well thats me sold


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## sunni (Jan 26, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> OH... and by the way.. Stephen Hawking agrees with me... Last time I checked.. he was a little bit smarter than you!


no insulting please


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 26, 2013)

ginjawarrior said:


> and what? he did a couple of sums and has done nothing apart from that to back it up?
> 
> no predictions?
> no experiments?
> ...


If you would do a little research you could find that out for yourself! But oh wait... You would rather make assumptions based on your dogmatic views instead of actually learn something new... I forgot.. My bad... Im sorry but its not my job to render the hundreds of hours of research I alone have done on the subject.. I have shown you the facts.. if you would like to see where they come from.. I have also given you every avenue to check that out.. Im not on salary bud.. Im just trying to help you learn something.. Its up to you if you want to follow through and actually learn something new!


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## sunni (Jan 26, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> If you would do a little research you could find that out for yourself! But oh wait... You would rather make assumptions based on your dogmatic views instead of actually learn something new... I forgot.. My bad...


dude what did i just say? relax man if you cannot act civil dont type


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## bde0001 (Jan 26, 2013)

lol.............


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## Figong (Jan 26, 2013)

Hocus pocus rocks? No... pH shocking the shit out of them and potentially getting lucky you didn't wipe out your crop? More(most) likely.. 

From Lawrence Livermore National Labs.. I cite:

_"A single-pass, flow-through apparatus was used to determine the dissolution rate of quartz at 70°C as a function of pH and time.* Dissolution rate data were obtained over the pH range 1.4 to 11.8 in nine separate experiments each lasting 50 days.* The quartz dissolution rates were defined by the silica release rate to solution. Speciation-solubility calculations using the geochemical modeling code EQ3/6 indicate that the fluid was maintained far from equilibrium with respect to quartz and well-undersaturated with respect to all possible secondary minerals in all runs. The dissolution rates were independent of pH at values (10[SUP]&#8722;15.3[/SUP] mol/cm[SUP]2[/SUP] · s) consistent with the data of Rimstidt and Barnes (1980) up to approximately pH 6, but at higher pH the rates increased with increasing pH, proportional to__, being almost four orders of magnitude higher at pH 11.8. The rate constants for quartz dissolution at 70°C were 10[SUP]&#8722;15.3[/SUP] mol/cm[SUP]2[/SUP] · s in the pH-independent region extending from acid through neutral solutions, and 10[SUP]&#8722;17.8[/SUP] mol/cm[SUP]2[/SUP] · s in more alkaline solutions. Etch pits were strongly developed in the runs with the more alkaline solutions (pH > 8 ), in which the rates were the highest. This appears consistent with a surface reaction-controlled dissolution mechanism."_

...

This also assumes that the quartz is superheated to 70C, but fact remains.. if it in a liquid form can run a 1.4 to 11.8 range.. why can't it be worn off the very same stones/rocks/hocus pocus magical things with normal liquids? Maybe this is a hint that we need to buy diamonds for the females... afterall, diamonds are a girls best friend.. ?

Fi-

Edit: Something in the above text did not agree with the security settings for the forums, first time I tried to submit it... I got this msg:

*What happened?*

The security system for this website has been triggered because of a phrase or content in your submission. If you are reading this, you are most likely a human visitor trying to log in or post a comment that triggered the system.


Any idea what word(s) or combination used in either my word choices or citing that could have triggered it? If so, will do my best to dodge those so I don't have to play with the anti-bot screen. In retrospect, was probably the clickable link embedded... blah.


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## ginjawarrior (Jan 27, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> If you would do a little research you could find that out for yourself! But oh wait... You would rather make assumptions based on your dogmatic views instead of actually learn something new... I forgot.. My bad... Im sorry but its not my job to render the hundreds of hours of research I alone have done on the subject.. I have shown you the facts.. if you would like to see where they come from.. I have also given you every avenue to check that out.. Im not on salary bud.. Im just trying to help you learn something.. Its up to you if you want to follow through and actually learn something new!


lol you think that as you've just now found out about this guy that no one else has heard it before? that your the first to start spreading the nonsense that is crystal energy?

hundreds of hours of research? lol well lets put it this way not all research if done equally especially if your prone to believing stupid shit like you seem to be

your not new or original and shout that we're dogmatic doesnt make what your saying any more real


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 27, 2013)

Ok.. so you all keep taking shots at me.. But none of you have done the math? I have provided a verifiable, mathematical evidence that Crystals help plants grow... I have also provided information on the thousands of plants I have grown using this method.. You all keep posting shit that has NOTHING to do with the evidence of proof I have provided! What does crystal Ph have to do with its energy? Not to mention the calculations you listed were for a quartz crystal that is heated to 70c? Do any of you keep your grow room that warm? I fail to see how this has any relevance at all to this discussion... I have been aware Mr. Haramein's work for about 5 years now.. So no.. I didnt JUST hear of him.. this is just the first time I have ever taken the time to back check and verify the factual conculsions he has come too.. and it seems that some of the greatest minds alive today agree with this theory.. I wasnt insulting anyone by saying Stephen Hawking is smarter than them.. He has been stated as the most intelligent person on the planet.. So fo you to say its not warranted for me to point out the fact he is smarter than ALL of us is not overstepping any bounds.. If your insulted by this.. Its probably because you KNOW Im right.. and are just grasping at straws to try and over turn the PROOF I have uncovered. For the last century Physicists have been trying to solve Einstein's feild equations.. Haramein has done it... and his math is verifiable. Now.. are you just going to keep posting useless shit? Or is someone acutally going to PROVE ME WRONG! Unification Theory is now closer to fact than Relativity has EVER been! Remember.. Relativity is a THEORY.. it has NEVER been proven.. So for you to site relativistic physics as proof.. when the math doesnt add up.. is just plain ignorant! The math adds up for unification theory.. it does not add up for Relativity.. This is a plain and simple fact.. you can ignore it if you want.. but your only holding yourself back!


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 27, 2013)

Figong said:


> Hocus pocus rocks? No... pH shocking the shit out of them and potentially getting lucky you didn't wipe out your crop? More(most) likely..
> 
> From Lawrence Livermore National Labs.. I cite:
> 
> ...


So pulling 3lb per 1000W HPS on a consistant basis is just "luck".. well then I guess Im pretty lucky eh.. Ive been pulling 3lb per light for close to 15 years now consistantly.. Something tells me luck doesnt have much to do with it


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 27, 2013)

ginjawarrior said:


> lol you think that as you've just now found out about this guy that no one else has heard it before? that your the first to start spreading the nonsense that is crystal energy?
> 
> hundreds of hours of research? lol well lets put it this way not all research if done equally especially if your prone to believing stupid shit like you seem to be
> 
> your not new or original and shout that we're dogmatic doesnt make what your saying any more real


Dogma is belief without factual evidence.. If you believe in relativity.. you believe in a dogmatic veiw as there is NO PROOF that it factually exists. If you actually look at the way Relativistc physics are experimented with.. all of the laws are based on the function of a substance within an ISOLATED SYSTEM. By definition.. an Isolated System is a system that is completly cut off from the rest of the universe and can not... or does not interact with its physical surroundings.. This definition also states that Isolated Systems are NOT FOUND ANYWHERE IN NATURE?!?!?!?!? So.. in a nutshell.. this basically means that ALL of the natural laws that have been developed by relativistic physics are NOT based on something that NATURALLY occurs in nature?!?! Do you not see a fundamental flaw in this approach? How can we judge how an object interacts with its natural environment.. when we are doing experiments in an environment that doesnt occur naturally? It just doesnt make sense.. just like all of the arguements I have heard rebuting this theory. Im just looking for some proof.. Not some smart ass comment saying "haha your a retard if you believe in this".. cause you know.. so much progress is made with that kind of thing..........


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## Murfy (Jan 27, 2013)

be careful with this-

there is a reason the energy isn't detectable. i personally think all of science is flawed, as it will not recognize its own "faith" . boson-higgs exists? it must. but we can't see it or detect it, same as the flat world. but yet they will stretch for the theory based on accurate assessment of the unseen.

pyramids work. due to recognition algorithms, the are discovering them at an overwhelming rate. even so thought mountains may be pyramids. the crystals work, orgone blasters work. i have seen it, and i consider it to be of an esoteric nature of which i won't engage. i believe that if i could see the other 97%, my head would explode.

there are plenty of examples of unmeasurable energies that exist. the russian government is doing extensive work with this, and their experiments are reproducible. build a cardboard pyramid, with golden geometry and see what it will do. it will scare you.

also, just by chance, i was introduced to electro-magnetic pulse induction in the garden. same result. amazing, and scary.


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 27, 2013)

sunni said:


> no insulting please


Ok so why are people allowed to insult me? 



ginjawarrior said:


> hundreds of hours of research? lol well lets put it this way not all research if done equally especially if your prone to believing stupid shit like you seem to be


If you scroll back you will see probably a dozen more insults directed at me.. people calling me a retard etc.. If your a moderator.. should you not be moderating everyone equally?


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## Murfy (Jan 27, 2013)

http://www.lakhovsky.com/


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## sunni (Jan 27, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> Ok so why are people allowed to insult me?
> 
> 
> 
> If you scroll back you will see probably a dozen more insults directed at me.. people calling me a retard etc.. If your a moderator.. should you not be moderating everyone equally?


I do moderate everyone equally. thanks though if you think im centering you out believe me im not


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 27, 2013)

So calling me a retard isnt an insult? Id like to see some of this equal treatment you speak of...


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## sunni (Jan 27, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> So calling me a retard isnt an insult? Id like to see some of this equal treatment you speak of...


dude, i was talking to everyone when i said to be civil not just you..stop.oh and i read the entire thread not one person called you a retard.


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## Figong (Jan 27, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> So pulling 3lb per 1000W HPS on a consistant basis is just "luck".. well then I guess Im pretty lucky eh.. Ive been pulling 3lb per light for close to 15 years now consistantly.. Something tells me luck doesnt have much to do with it


Grow video, beginning to end of harvest.. with no cut-away and scale shots.. or it did not happen. (Unless it's a 20ft+ tall Afghani) That said, I completely entrapped you with my post, as my post mentions -nothing- of the magical crystals in the original post, simply quartz - I believe that'd be a check, and mate.. sir.  For being a master grower who's done this for 15 years, you sure as hell are either A) incapable of reading or B) trolling (see: following the original clown with no background, hence why you jumped on the quartz like flies on a pile of shit.. and no one else did.)


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 27, 2013)

Figong said:


> Grow video, beginning to end of harvest.. with no cut-away and scale shots.. or it did not happen. (Unless it's a 20ft+ tall Afghani) That said, I completely entrapped you with my post, as my post mentions -nothing- of the magical crystals in the original post, simply quartz - I believe that'd be a check, and mate.. sir.  For being a master grower who's done this for 15 years, you sure as hell are either A) incapable of reading or B) trolling (see: following the original clown with no background, hence why you jumped on the quartz like flies on a pile of shit.. and no one else did.)


What are you even talking about? You presented this information as if it was relevant to the discussion.. which it clearly is not? I simply pointed out that fact... How did you entrap me? All I did was show that your not making any sense.. just like you are right now.. Im not a scientist, I dont have a camera that I can run perpetually crop after crop after crop and I only have one flower room.. so to do an actual side by side experiment is impossible in my situation. I do however have my last 3 years experience growing the same strain in the same environment.. and although it is not fully documented.. I assure you that 3lb is a very achievable yeild on a constant basis for me.. With or without the use of crystals.. The main difference is the use in chemical pest and disease control. You can shoot me down all you want.. I will keep knowing what I know.. you can keep thinking what you think.. Either way.. Im ahead of the game.. so it really makes no difference to me wether you believe it or not. I have provided mathematical, physical evidence from several different sources that all lead up to crystals helping plants grow.. thus far.. not one of you has been able to provide the same in contrary. The burden of proof is now on you.. I have provided my factual mathematical physical evidence.. and it is staggeringly accurate.. down to hundreds of billionths of a percentage point.. well within the margin of error for any experiment. If you have proof these calculations are wrong.. please share it.. Or.. maybe you should try some crystals in your garden so your plants can look like this without the use of chemicals!


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## drugSNIFFINGdawg420 (Jan 27, 2013)

Good stuff OP i've read through this post and its intresting. I've pondered getting some crystals for my room but haven't. Reading about some research done in japan using positive words and frozen water I conducted my own experiment. I named all my seedlings,one in particular after citrine a crystal with the power of abundance. As the seed sprouted it did't have any MJ characteristic. After its first set of baby leafs it continued to grow round circular leaves for two weeks untill the top yellowed and died, the bottom howerver continued to stay green. I was about to trash it but was talked out of it and kept it in the growroom despite fear of it herming. Somehow she topped her self and continues to thrive today 127 days from seed, she has two good size top colas equal in size and a few nuggs at the bottom, needless to say im impressed. Now i dont buy every bottle of "snake oil" I see but i do have an open mind and can make my own opinion seeing what the hoop la is. Im not done testing yet but I'll try to follow up when im done.


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## Figong (Jan 27, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> What are you even talking about? You presented this information as if it was relevant to the discussion.. which it clearly is not? I simply pointed out that fact... How did you entrap me? All I did was show that your not making any sense.. just like you are right now.. Im not a scientist, I dont have a camera that I can run perpetually crop after crop after crop and I only have one flower room.. so to do an actual side by side experiment is impossible in my situation. I do however have my last 3 years experience growing the same strain in the same environment.. and although it is not fully documented.. I assure you that 3lb is a very achievable yeild on a constant basis for me.. With or without the use of crystals.. The main difference is the use in chemical pest and disease control. You can shoot me down all you want.. I will keep knowing what I know.. you can keep thinking what you think.. Either way.. Im ahead of the game.. so it really makes no difference to me wether you believe it or not. I have provided mathematical, physical evidence from several different sources that all lead up to crystals helping plants grow.. thus far.. not one of you has been able to provide the same in contrary. The burden of proof is now on you.. I have provided my factual mathematical physical evidence.. and it is staggeringly accurate.. down to hundreds of billionths of a percentage point.. well within the margin of error for any experiment. If you have proof these calculations are wrong.. please share it.. Or.. maybe you should try some crystals in your garden so your plants can look like this without the use of chemicals!


You completely missed where I was going with that. My point was that if quartz was not something you would use (due to massive pH flux) and you had -any- of your own research done and knew this.. you would have specified that you in no way would have used quartz. That's the focus of my last statement, I do not discredit any other types of crystals that may work - I was simply illustrating that you're running blindly on the information of others, and it's seemingly successful. That said, what specific 'crystal'(s) are you using? I can not attempt to discredit every possible mineral/crystalline structure/geode that exists, simply not feasible.

Edit: I will, for the sake of argument, entertain the concept of any crystal you name until such time as I can prove it works / disprove it - out of fairness in this discussion.


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 28, 2013)

Figong said:


> You completely missed where I was going with that. My point was that if quartz was not something you would use (due to massive pH flux) and you had -any- of your own research done and knew this.. you would have specified that you in no way would have used quartz. That's the focus of my last statement, I do not discredit any other types of crystals that may work - I was simply illustrating that you're running blindly on the information of others, and it's seemingly successful. That said, what specific 'crystal'(s) are you using? I can not attempt to discredit every possible mineral/crystalline structure/geode that exists, simply not feasible.
> 
> Edit: I will, for the sake of argument, entertain the concept of any crystal you name until such time as I can prove it works / disprove it - out of fairness in this discussion.


I have already stated that I use 2 quartz chards in each pot, formed in a energy grid with a Malachite Quartz as the master crystal. Your info on quartz effecting ph is not relevant to this discussion as the research states the quartz must be heated to 70 degress CELCIUS.. Thats 158F!!!! So.. in order for my quartz crystals to have an effect on my Ph.. I would need to maintain a constant temperature of 158F in my grow room... which CLEARLY is not the case! That is why your theory holds not merrit, makes no sense.. and has no bearing on this conversation! I have not made any suggestions as to what crystals will work better than others.. I have simply stated the crystals I use, and then backed up my theory with mathematical physical evidence stating that all crystals emit energy that can be absorbed by other things in proximity to it. Still waiting for someone to proove the math wrong...


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 29, 2013)

drugSNIFFINGdawg420 said:


> Good stuff OP i've read through this post and its intresting. I've pondered getting some crystals for my room but haven't. Reading about some research done in japan using positive words and frozen water I conducted my own experiment. I named all my seedlings,one in particular after citrine a crystal with the power of abundance. As the seed sprouted it did't have any MJ characteristic. After its first set of baby leafs it continued to grow round circular leaves for two weeks untill the top yellowed and died, the bottom howerver continued to stay green. I was about to trash it but was talked out of it and kept it in the growroom despite fear of it herming. Somehow she topped her self and continues to thrive today 127 days from seed, she has two good size top colas equal in size and a few nuggs at the bottom, needless to say im impressed. Now i dont buy every bottle of "snake oil" I see but i do have an open mind and can make my own opinion seeing what the hoop la is. Im not done testing yet but I'll try to follow up when im done.



Ahh yes.. Dr. Emoto.. Brilliant man! Discovered many things about water that have been puzzles for centuries! I keep a Rose Quartz the size of a softball in my res SOLEY based on Emoto's research... Happy water = Happy plants 

The simple fact of the matter is that the scientific community is moving at record speed. The same amount of knowledge that used to take years.. even DECADES to accumulate.. is now being done on a DAILY basis! Here are some amazing breakthroughs that were brought about JUST LAST WEEK!!! 
- Tractor beam: http://bit.ly/Y7vF0i
- Temperature of the universe: http://bit.ly/XZB9tQ
- DNA storage: http://bit.ly/WnyLLj
- Dung beetles: http://bit.ly/Y9XLIf
- Proto-bird: http://bit.ly/14e5k4V
- Quadruple helix DNA: http://bit.ly/VQmZf6


All of this stuff has now been proven to be facutal.. Did you know tractor beams actually exist? Anyone who hasnt seen this article would swear up and down that your crazy if you believe in such sci-fi nonsense.. And such is the nature of using crystals to help your plants.. Just because you havnt taken the time to research the factual information behind it.. DOES NOT mean it doesnt work!

It really doesnt surprise me that most of you dont believe in this stuff, The scientific community doesnt even want to believe it... Think of it this way.. If you were a well renowned physicist who has spent their life working on Relativistic theory.. then all of a sudden all of this proof starts popping up stating your lifes work is WRONG... how inclined would you be to try and supress the information? People with power will generally do whatever it takes in order to maintain that power.. including discrediting factual scientific information. I have yet to see any rebuttal that holds merit against the mathematical caluculations I have provided, These are true numbers and have not yet been disputed neither by the people of this site.. nor the scientific community. You can try to discredit my sources all you want.. Backrounds and credentials are meaningless in the face of mathematical proof... The density of a Proton is calculated to be the SAME as the Mass of the Universe.. This is a mathematical truth that can be cross referenced and back checked against EVERYTHING IN EXISTENCE.. everything lines up from the largest macrocosmic scale.. right down to the smallest sub-atomic level.. This is mathematical proof that all things are connected, and if all things are connected.. then crystals DEFINATELY effect your plants! 

Class Dismissed  lol


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## Heisenberg (Jan 29, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> Ahh yes.. Dr. Emoto.. Brilliant man! Discovered many things about water that have been puzzles for centuries! I keep a Rose Quartz the size of a softball in my res SOLEY based on Emoto's research... Happy water = Happy plants
> 
> The simple fact of the matter is that the scientific community is moving at record speed. The same amount of knowledge that used to take years.. even DECADES to accumulate.. is now being done on a DAILY basis! Here are some amazing breakthroughs that were brought about JUST LAST WEEK!!!
> - Tractor beam: http://bit.ly/Y7vF0i
> ...


A question. How is it that there is absolutely no support from any part of the scientific community for any of Nassim's ideas, talks, or research? None of his papers have been published in any scientific journal &#8211; certainly not one subject to proper peer review. Scientists seem to either treat him as a crank or dismiss him altogether. Which of the following reasons sounds most plausible? Is it...


(a) because the scientific establishment are afraid of having all their precious theories overturned?


Science loves having theories overturned. It's true that individual scientists are human and can be reluctant to accept when their way of seeing things is revealed to be false. Some will be slower to accept new things than others. But all will agree that this is part of the job of being a scientist. In addition, many scientists are deeply competitive, and for every theory beloved to one set of scientists, there'll be another set that is devoted to looking for any serious evidence they can use to pull the rug out from under it.


The world scientific community is an extremely diverse and argumentative bunch. Surely it would be crazy to imagine them being capable of unanimously agreeing to dismiss perfectly good ideas sitting right under all their noses.


This is a fact compatible with even the most cynical view of scientists &#8211; that they're more often out to prove each other wrong, even to backstab, than to back each other up. It makes it implausible that any scientist actually sees Nassim's ideas as any sort of threat. His ideas have simply never been taken seriously.


(b) because scientists are incapable of seeing outside the box that they were trained to think in, and are too proud to accept radical suggestion from an outsider?


Scientists can be guilty of narrow thinking. If you specialise in an extremely complex area, the effort of getting your head around the ideas within one framework might be so taxing that the last thing you want to be doing is considering the possibility that the whole framework might be wrong. At the same time, there are many scientists who are mavericks and ready for change, ready to throw it all up in the air. They also have all manner of values, and all manner of spiritual outlooks and practices.


There are hundreds of thousands of scientists in the universities of the world, and their ways of thinking are as various as any other group of hundreds of thousands of human beings - if not more so. There'll always be plenty of scientists hungry for any radical idea, especially in topics as hot as grand unified theories, provided it's got some substance.


There may well be unanimous skepticism about things which have utterly no scientific basis, such as someone claiming to have a theory that the moon is made of green cheese. But this is not because of any inability to think outside of the box.


Regarding outsiders &#8211; yes, pride and over-cautiousness can get in the way of scientists taking suggestions seriously from people not affiliated to a university. But would every single one of them fall prey to this? Again, scientists, and even scientific establishments, are surely too numerous and too diverse for this to be plausible.


When Garrett Lisi submitted a potentially revolutionary theory for the unification of particle physics, he was an unemployed surfer living in a camper van on a Hawaiian island with no university affiliation. (Aside from now renting a room in a shared house, it seems he still is.) Perhaps the majority of physicists initially did not take him seriously. But there were certainly plenty who did, who were waiting for someone like this to challenge everything, who looked at his work and thought "you know, this guy really does know what he's talking about. He could be onto something here. And I want in on this."


There are so many other examples of theories being accepted from outsiders (Einstein, for one) that this answer doesn't hold any water. If he isn't getting taken seriously, it certainly can't be blamed on a complete worldwide closed-mindedness among all respectable scientists.


(c) because they haven't come across his ideas yet?


Nassim and his Resonance Project have a massive internet presence, and they've been promoting their ideas to scientific bodies, presenting at university conferences (alongside student projects and industry researchers) throughout the world, and submitting papers to peer-review journals at every opportunity for most of the last decade. Not to mention training hundreds of people to promote their ideas for them.


There have been considerable efforts to put an article about Nassim Haramein, the scientist, on Wikipedia. The results can be seen here &#8211; I think you'll find the discussion revealing.


(It's worth noting that all Garrett Lisi did to set the academic world abuzz was to present his ideas at a single relatively obscure conference in Iceland.)


(d) because anyone with an understanding of science can see that his claims and his methods are not scientific in any sense of the term, and that he doesn't actually know what he's talking about?


I reckon so.
The Schwarzschild Proton and other ideas from The Resonance Foundation have also been discussed in depth at sciencefile.org.

http://azureworld.blogspot.com/2010/02/nassim-haramein-fraud-or-sage-part-2.html
http://azureworld.blogspot.com/2010/06/whats-so-misleading-about-nassim.html#s2


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## StoopidLungs (Jan 29, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> Ahh yes.. Dr. Emoto.. Brilliant man! Discovered many things about water that have been puzzles for centuries! I keep a Rose Quartz the size of a softball in my res SOLEY based on Emoto's research... Happy water = Happy plants
> 
> The simple fact of the matter is that the scientific community is moving at record speed. The same amount of knowledge that used to take years.. even DECADES to accumulate.. is now being done on a DAILY basis! Here are some amazing breakthroughs that were brought about JUST LAST WEEK!!!
> - Tractor beam: http://bit.ly/Y7vF0i
> ...


Awesome stuff, glad to see this thread is up and running again. Looks like I have some reading to do tonight


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 30, 2013)

Heisenberg said:


> A question. How is it that there is absolutely no support from any part of the scientific community for any of Nassim's ideas, talks, or research? None of his papers have been published in any scientific journal &#8211; certainly not one subject to proper peer review. Scientists seem to either treat him as a crank or dismiss him altogether. Which of the following reasons sounds most plausible? Is it...
> 
> 
> (a) because the scientific establishment are afraid of having all their precious theories overturned?
> ...


Or is it "E" the general consensus of the "Establisment" is to keep people in the dark about the true nature of their connection to the universe and its infinite potential. Anyone who has a serious intention of a career in physics would be commiting "Career Suicide" by backing up Nassim's ideas. The scientific community recieves BILLIONS of dollars in funding from the establishment... but ONLY if they research and release the information that THEY want you to see! Look at Cannabis for example.. The biggest drug companies in the world have spent BILLIONS of dollars trying to find a sythetic "THC" that worked as well.. or better than the natural thing... And low and behold.. they could not find it.. so instead of releasing the info that Cannabis is a miracle plant.. they have burried the info for decades to keep us buying drugs we dont need! Is it really so hard for you to believe that the same establisment is discrediting Harameins work? If you were a renowned physicst that was well respected.. and you seen validity in Harameins theory.. would you back him up if it meant the end of your Career? The simple fact of the matter is the "General" scientific community is HIGHLY profit drivin.. just like most of the rest of society. And if the establishment says they arent going to pay you to research something.. you find something else to research that they WILL pay for.. Its all about money man.. it has very little to do with releasing factual information to the public.. Its about CONTROL.. and they are obviously doing a very good job at controlling YOU!


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 30, 2013)

Oh and by the way... You still have not addressed the MATH? You keep poking at character flaws and other things unrelated... but you completely avoid the fact that the math adds up... Still waiting............. The thing about all of the sources you listed.. is that they IGNORE THE ENERGY DENSITY OF THE VACUUME! If you had done any research on Harameins work yourself.. you would see that this is a BIG factor... Not once does your source mention the density of the vacuume.. and this is something that is COMPLETELY ignored by the scientific community.. Haramein CLEARLY states in his presentation that he is "Not going to do like everyone else and IGNORE THE DENSITY OF THE VACUUME". The main problem with main stream physics.. is the theories between microscopic and macroscopic dont line up! Its as if relativistic physics thinks it has NOTHING to do with the rest of the universe! This is clearly not the case.. as Im sure your aware that BIG things are ALWAYS made up of SMALL things... Haramein is 2 steps ahead of the game.. its no wonder a lot of people think hes a crackpot!


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 30, 2013)

Another point... the video this blog is reviewing is a presentation from 2005! Haramein has had 8 more years of research added to this... here is a more recent video that has the complete theory displayed.. He addresses most of the "holes" that your blog resource pokes... But... You would have to watch the video to find that out I guess... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1JDMToJDe0


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 30, 2013)

I believe I have already stated this point.. but it is worth re-mention in light of the recent rebuttal.. You put so much belief in the experiments done by the general scientific community. The natural laws of the universe are ALWAYS tested in an ISOLATED SYSTEM.. Here is Wikipedia's definition of an Isolated System http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isolated_system. The first paragraph of this definition reads "In the natural sciences an *isolated system* is a physical system without any external exchange &#8211; neither matter nor energy can enter or exit, but can only move around inside. _*Truly isolated systems cannot exist in nature*_,_* other than possibly the universe itself, and they are thus hypothetical concepts only*_.[SUP][1][/SUP][SUP][2][/SUP][SUP][3][/SUP][SUP][4][/SUP][SUP][5][/SUP] It obeys, in particular, to the first of the conservation laws: its total energy - mass stays constant."

So even the scientific community and wikipedia agrees that Natural Laws... are NOT based on something that occurs in nature?!?!?! All of our "Laws" are actually "Hypothetical Concepts" BY DEFINITION! Do you not think this would be a bit of a problem if you are trying to figure out how the universe actually works? Mr. Haramein sure does!


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## mindphuk (Jan 30, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> I believe I have already stated this point.. but it is worth re-mention in light of the recent rebuttal.. You put so much belief in the experiments done by the general scientific community. The natural laws of the universe are ALWAYS tested in an ISOLATED SYSTEM


WTF are you talking about? By definition, a law in science is based on repeated observation that describes something about how the world works. There is no requirement for an isolated system. Same as with a scientific theory. Isolated systems are _sometimes _created in order to control variables, but even then, the phenomena being tested is still part of the natural world. Your fallacious reasoning would suggest that if I try to make an isolated system to test gravity, like rolling balls down a ramp in a vacuum, then because I isolated gravitation from other effects like air resistance, you suggest that my results are hypothetical. 

Your lack of understanding of the scientific method is what is allowing you to be persuaded by con-artists and pseudoscience.


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 31, 2013)

mindphuk said:


> WTF are you talking about? By definition, a law in science is based on repeated observation that describes something about how the world works.  There is no requirement for an isolated system. Same as with a scientific theory. Isolated systems are _sometimes _created in order to control variables, but even then, the phenomena being tested is still part of the natural world. Your fallacious reasoning would suggest that if I try to make an isolated system to test gravity, like rolling balls down a ramp in a vacuum, then because I isolated gravitation from other effects like air resistance, you suggest that my results are hypothetical.
> 
> Your lack of understanding of the scientific method is what is allowing you to be persuaded by con-artists and pseudoscience.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_law Taken STRAIGHT out of Wikipedia 

*Conservation law*

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


In physics, a *conservation law* states that a particular measurable property of an _*isolated physical system*_ does not change as the system evolves.
One particularly important physical result concerning conservation laws is Noether's Theorem, which states that there is a one-to-one correspondence between conservation laws and differentiable symmetries of physical systems. For example, the conservation of energy follows from the time-invariance of physical systems, and the fact that physical systems behave the same regardless of how they are oriented in space gives rise to the conservation of angular momentum.



And Im the one that doesnt understand the scientific method???? Fuck off troll!


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 31, 2013)

mindphuk said:


> WTF are you talking about? By definition, a law in science is based on repeated observation that describes something about how the world works. There is no requirement for an isolated system. Same as with a scientific theory. Isolated systems are _sometimes _created in order to control variables, but even then, the phenomena being tested is still part of the natural world. Your fallacious reasoning would suggest that if I try to make an isolated system to test gravity, like rolling balls down a ramp in a vacuum, then because I isolated gravitation from other effects like air resistance, you suggest that my results are hypothetical.
> 
> Your lack of understanding of the scientific method is what is allowing you to be persuaded by con-artists and pseudoscience.


If you actually knew ANYTHING about how natural laws come about.. You would know that they are ALWAYS tested within an ISOLATED SYSTEM.. Scientists do this in order to try and ISOLATE the behaviour. This approach is fundamentally flawed because objects ALWAYS interact with thier surroundings in nature. So to think we are getting completely accurate results when removing something from its natural environment is grossley ignorant assuming that it is possible for something to be COMPLETELY ISOLATED from its environment. This CAN NOT and DOES NOT happen in nature.. so how is it we can base such fundamental laws of nature.. on something that DOESNT OCCUR IN NATURE.. 

Im still waiting for someone to prove the math wrong...................................


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 31, 2013)

Lets look at it this way... Lets say you take your right hand and hold it up in the air.. Then you move your hand from right to left in order to measure the speed and velocity of your hand. The measurement you come up with would be true in the "isolated system" that is Planet Earth.. However.. if you really wanted to get an accurate measurement of how fast your hand is actually moving.. you would take the movement of your hand.. plus the speed of the rotation of the earth, plus the speed of the orbit of the earth around the sun.. plus the speed of the solar system moving through the galaxy, plus the galaxy through the universe.. Once you add in all of these factors.. your hand is actually travelling close to the SPEED OF LIGHT! 

BOTH of these figures are "true" in their own right... but in the grand scheme of the universe.. which one is more relevant?? THIS is why Isolated systems tell us NOTHING about the UNIVERSE.. they only give limited information based on the function of objects within an ISOLATED SYSTEM! 

Go back to school kiddies.....


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 31, 2013)

mindphuk said:


> WTF are you talking about? By definition, a law in science is based on repeated observation that describes something about how the world works. There is no requirement for an isolated system. Same as with a scientific theory. Isolated systems are _sometimes _created in order to control variables, but even then, the phenomena being tested is still part of the natural world. Your fallacious reasoning would suggest that if I try to make an isolated system to test gravity, like rolling balls down a ramp in a vacuum, then because I isolated gravitation from other effects like air resistance, you suggest that my results are hypothetical.
> 
> Your lack of understanding of the scientific method is what is allowing you to be persuaded by con-artists and pseudoscience.


I love the hypocricy in your signature "For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. ~Carl Sagan"

You claim its far better to grasp the universe as it really is... and yet you base your beliefs on isolated properties of Planet Earth.. instead of the properties of the whole universe?!?! 

It seems you are just full of contradictions that make no sense! Just like relativistic physics! LOL


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## sunni (Jan 31, 2013)

its ok to debate but stop with the personal attacks or i will close the thread i aint kidding i will put my foot down.


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 31, 2013)

This is seen as the WORST prediciton physics has ever made.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vacuum_catastrophe The numbers between quantum and relative threory produced a discrepency of 107 ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE.. due to the calculations generated from Isolated Sytems theory. This is the LARGEST PROBLEM PHYSICS HAS EVER FACED! And Haramein has solved it with provable... back-checkable MATH... This is a problem that physicists have been working on for nearly 100 years... Its no wonder the scientific community is trying to bury it... Heaven forbid this "crackpot" that eveyone has dismissed for 25 years is actually RIGHT! You people have a LOT to learn about how this profit drivin world we live in ACTUALLY works!


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 31, 2013)

sunni said:


> its ok to debate but stop with the personal attacks or i will close the thread i aint kidding i will put my foot down.


How is this a personal attack? I simply stated his views are contradicting themselves? Is proving someone wrong now seen as an insult?


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## sunni (Jan 31, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> How is this a personal attack? I simply stated his views are contradicting themselves? Is proving someone wrong now seen as an insult?


insulting his signature, telling people to go back to school , ect ect which clearly is adding fuel to the fire in this thread, I love to have debate topics, lets just do it without getting overly upset, no matter how hard to throw facts at people sometimes people are not willing to accept or believe them, therefore this thread is becoming you beating a dead horse;.....pointless. So if you guys (and say this to everyone I am not singling you out like you think) cannot debate properly I will close the thread . end of discussion;.


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## Jay3Lee (Jan 31, 2013)

How did I insult his signature??? I simply pointed out a contradiction between his signature.. and the beliefs he posted. How is this insulting when its true??? And my apologies for the "Go Back To school" comment, I was simply trying to elaborate the fact that many of these arguements relate to an outdated model that is no longer being practiced by many physicists today. I was trying to be funny.. Im sorry it was taken as an insult....


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## mindphuk (Jan 31, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_law Taken STRAIGHT out of Wikipedia
> 
> *Conservation law*
> 
> ...


You referred to 'natural laws of the universe' and to support your contention, you pull up the definition of a conservation law, a subset of scientific laws? Do you also realize that laws are not the explanatory part of science, they are merely observable phenomena? Scientific theories incorporate laws but they are not constrained by isolated systems. Yes, you don't understand the scientific method, or apparently science in general for that matter. 

Cursing and calling me a troll is so helpful to your argument.


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## Fruitbat (Jan 31, 2013)

Please kill this thread. Good God euthanize it.


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## mindphuk (Jan 31, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> Lets look at it this way... Lets say you take your right hand and hold it up in the air.. Then you move your hand from right to left in order to measure the speed and velocity of your hand. The measurement you come up with would be true in the "isolated system" that is Planet Earth.. However.. if you really wanted to get an accurate measurement of how fast your hand is actually moving.. you would take the movement of your hand.. plus the speed of the rotation of the earth, plus the speed of the orbit of the earth around the sun.. plus the speed of the solar system moving through the galaxy, plus the galaxy through the universe.. Once you add in all of these factors.. your hand is actually travelling close to the SPEED OF LIGHT!


 It seems you have a rudimentary grasp of the principle of relativity, you seem to misunderstand the fundamental concept that the laws of physics are identical in ALL frames. 


> BOTH of these figures are "true" in their own right... but in the grand scheme of the universe.. which one is more relevant?? THIS is why Isolated systems tell us NOTHING about the UNIVERSE.. they only give limited information based on the function of objects within an ISOLATED SYSTEM!


You are conflating isolated systems with frames of reference. They are different concepts entirely. 


> Go back to school kiddies.....


You should take your own advice.


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## Scroga (Feb 1, 2013)

so umm..back to the crystals please?


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## Kite High (Feb 1, 2013)

superstoner1 said:


> why dont use just dance naked and chant?


I do. Doesn't do much for the plants but is fun none the less. If he thinks this helps his plant he would be much better off learning how to grow properly.


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## Kite High (Feb 1, 2013)

Methinks he should go to deep space and grow a plant there and enjoy his quantum high in the Universe rather than our poor lil isolated Earth. Then he and the op can enjoy chunking crystals at us while we sit comfortably at home, on Earth, which last time I checked it is in The Universe, smoking good weed and not having to bear his self fluffing impossible arguments. His problem with gravity is nothing more than we haven't gotten to the understanding of why it is so weak. Like his character.


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## Kite High (Feb 1, 2013)

And Sunni this thread should be closed. If he wants to grow crystals he should be making meth.


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## Scroga (Feb 1, 2013)

Sunni, why does jay3lee get his balls busted but no one else?


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## sunni (Feb 1, 2013)

Scroga said:


> Sunni, why does jay3lee get his balls busted but no one else?


he was not the only one i called everyone out, that is not singling out. 


sunni said:


> its ok to debate but stop with the personal attacks or i will close the thread i aint kidding i will put my foot down.


He was singled out AFTER i told everyone to stop but he couldnt do that and continued to do what i asked him not too. I am a pretty relaxed mod, I will always give warning to stop before I close.


----------



## Scroga (Feb 1, 2013)

I'm not talking about him, I'm talking about the fool before me that keeps wanting to add fuel to fires everywhere he goes.. why can't these stooges go elsewhere? I came here to read this topic not slag people off for their beliefs...


----------



## ginjawarrior (Feb 1, 2013)

Scroga said:


> I'm not talking about him, I'm talking about the fool before me that keeps wanting to add fuel to fires everywhere he goes.. why can't these stooges go elsewhere? I came here to read this topic not slag people off for their beliefs...


isnt the validity of the premise part of the topic?

this is the science section "beliefs" do not trump reality here and everything should be questioned


----------



## Scroga (Feb 1, 2013)

Whatever...i wish someone would do a grow with the variables along side a control..so we can talk about the grow! Instead of the sly mud slinging..calling people weak of character,/saying crystals users should be making crack.instead of coming to this thread to discuss their benefits....maybe yall should go start a thread.about how you don't give a fk about crystals....p.s the horse being flogged is dead because of the poachers...


----------



## ginjawarrior (Feb 1, 2013)

Scroga said:


> Whatever...i wish someone would do a grow with the variables along side a control..so we can talk about the grow! Instead of the sly mud slinging..calling people weak of character,/saying crystals users should be making crack.instead of coming to this thread to discuss their benefits....maybe yall should go start a thread.about how you don't give a fk about crystals....p.s the horse being flogged is dead because of the poachers...


to discuss benefits first you have to show the benefits exist

you right an experiment with controls would be a good start to get that information but i dont see most people here bothering to waste their grow time messing about with crystals and i wouldnt trust jay3lee's methods or data when it came to it

if your interested enough why dont you do that experiment?

if you do you can post everything here from your pre experiment planning to full journal and smoke test


----------



## Scroga (Feb 2, 2013)

Would love to but alas my situation does not permit...there are others on riu that are experimenting with crystals.among other innovative techniques....electroculture, lavoshky.coils ect


----------



## Dr Kynes (Feb 2, 2013)

LoL crystal power. 

but not ALL crystals, no. 

Just the "Crystals" which form "naturally" right? 

like say... 

SALT




Or Rock Candy. 



or i dunno, goddamn Bismuth? 



this thread:


----------



## Scroga (Feb 2, 2013)

View it as entertainment people if it upsets you..
Or change strains! Lol


----------



## Jay3Lee (Feb 2, 2013)

mindphuk said:


> It seems you have a rudimentary grasp of the principle of relativity, you seem to misunderstand the fundamental concept that the laws of physics are identical in ALL frames.
> 
> You are conflating isolated systems with frames of reference. They are different concepts entirely.
> You should take your own advice.


Ok.. thats your take on it.. Have you disproven the math? As far as I know.. Haramein is the only person to ever live that has completed a unified theory with verfiable math that actually adds up.. and works on all levels of quantum theory. Im tired of argueing with you about all this stupid shit that has nothing do with the fact that crystals help plants... So what if you can twist my words around.. big deal dude.. You keep pointing at shit that makes no sense.. you keep twisting my words around to make me look like an idiot (all the while not answering the question at hand). and for what.. to try and piss me off? To try and discredit the factual information that you cant disprove?? The simple fact of the matter is physics has changed DRASTICALLY in the last decade... Your clearly not on top of the changes.. and thats cool with me.. But just because you dont understand, or fail to comprehend how to answer a simple question is not my fault! I have provided mathematical proof that crystals help plants... You keep slinging mud.. Hopefully the people that actually do believe in truthful science can find some answers here... OR maybe you can show me the error in the math.. Either way.. your wrong.. and I have proven it.. so if im wrong PROVE IT! All the mud in the world cant cover up proof bud.. wheres your proof?? Common now.. Ive been asking for like 5 pages! There must be some PROOF that the facts I have givin are wrong?? Or..... maybe you need to come to grip with the fact that you could be WRONG for once?


----------



## Jay3Lee (Feb 2, 2013)

Let me help you out with this... Do you remember how to check math? As in.. if you have an equation like 2+2=4 and you wanted to check to see if your right.. you would reverse the operation and get 4-2=2.. this reverse operation is called CHECKING YOUR MATH.. and its the BIGGEST problem a physicist will face when coming up with a theory... Haramein has determined the energy denisty of the vacuume, the density of the universe, and the density of each single proton in existence.. He then cross references this information between all 3 levels of existence INCLUDING non existence (Microscopic, Macroscopic, and the Vacuume). All of the numbers add up.. forwards.. backwards.. sideways.. all the way across quantum theory... You saying it holds no relevance.. is like me saying 2+2=5 and expecting YOU to just take my word for it... Show me some proof bud.. thats all Im asking for.. if your so sure of yourself it should be easy to find without having to twist my words around some more...


----------



## Heisenberg (Feb 2, 2013)




----------



## mindphuk (Feb 2, 2013)

You presented no math to disprove. I commented on your stupid criticism of the 'general scientific community' and your incorrect characterizations of only testing in isolated systems. Now the only thing you seem to be doing is changing the subject and accuse me of twisting your words, in spite of the fact that I'm quoting you directly. Now you are saying physics has changed drastically yet it still doesn't support you fringe theories. When you say something stupidly wrong, don't blame me for slinging mud when all I do is point it out. You want me to check math, then present something coherent. You want your hypothesis about the power of crystals, then present something that has adequate controls and documentation. Just making claims that you did something doesn't make it true. Anyone can come on here and say they performed tests and found something works for growing plants, it's quite another thing to demonstrate it. Asking someone to disprove something you did without presenting the all of the data in a manner that can be examined is just plain ridiculous and demonstrates a complete lack of understanding of scientific peer review. I can't review, let alone comment on an experimental study that doesn't exist in a format I can replicate (then attacking people for not having done the same tests as you is just more grandstanding stupidity). In fact, I never once made mention of your testing or criticized your conclusions about crystals, I made a specific comment about your generalizing isolated systems to all of science. Nor did I mention anything about Hararmein. You are getting me confused with another poster. You should be careful as to who you speak to about scientific knowledge or lack thereof. I probably read and critique more scientific papers in a month than you have read in a lifetime.


----------



## Figong (Feb 2, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> -snip quantum theory -snip-


Well said... you're arguing with something that's not a scientific law - why isn't it a law? That question sort of answers it self, I do believe. I can make up math where numbers fit too, but since there is no standardization or real acknowledgement or *proof* (see: Law) it's all heresay anyway. Volley, your turn on how this 'theory' is proven, yet it's not a law.


----------



## Jay3Lee (Feb 3, 2013)

This theory was published in 2011, it generally takes a few years for other physicists to test the theory before it becomes feasible to call it a law.. And Im sorry I dont have the time to spend 2 hours writing out feild equations in this thread for you to check out... I have however.. provided a video of Nassim Haramein laying out these caluculations in laymans terms. If you would actually watch the video.. you would see the math.. you would see that it works.. and you would see that your WRONG... but.. I guess 2 hours of your time to learn something about the universe is just too much to ask.... Afterall.. Ive been asking for over a week now! Here is the math.. yet again.. Come proove me wrong please! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1JDMToJDe0


----------



## ginjawarrior (Feb 3, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> This theory was published in 2011, it generally takes a few years for other physicists to test the theory before it becomes feasible to call it a law.. And Im sorry I dont have the time to spend 2 hours writing out feild equations in this thread for you to check out... I have however.. provided a video of Nassim Haramein laying out these caluculations in laymans terms. If you would actually watch the video.. you would see the math.. you would see that it works.. and you would see that your WRONG... but.. I guess 2 hours of your time to learn something about the universe is just too much to ask.... Afterall.. Ive been asking for over a week now! Here is the math.. yet again.. Come proove me wrong please! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1JDMToJDe0


why the fuck are you linking a youtube video if he's published it?

published means he's had a paper accepted by a journal and it will be there for us to read you shouldnt have to transcribe anything

why dont you go find this 2011 papaer for us and link it back here


----------



## Jay3Lee (Feb 3, 2013)

Figong said:


> Well said... you're arguing with something that's not a scientific law - why isn't it a law? That question sort of answers it self, I do believe. I can make up math where numbers fit too, but since there is no standardization or real acknowledgement or *proof* (see: Law) it's all heresay anyway. Volley, your turn on how this 'theory' is proven, yet it's not a law.


E=MC2 is a theory... and yet most of the physical world we live in is based on this calculation.. yet it is used EVERYWHERE even though it has never been proven... Why would sooooo many people spend soooooo many years on something that is a theory? Maybe it makes sense.. but doesnt add up? Maybe the fact it doesnt add up is whats holding us back? Haramein is the first person in history to make this equation add up.. So.. even though there is no PROOF that relativity is factual.. why do you keep siting it as proof that Im wrong? Nassims math works.. plain and simple.. and if you would do a little bit of research instead of trolling every word I say.. you might actually learn something!


----------



## Jay3Lee (Feb 3, 2013)

I figured you would be more likely to watch a 2 hour laymans video.. than read a 21 page paper... But.. ask and you shall recieve! http://theresonanceproject.org/pdf/scalinglaw_paper.pdf


----------



## Jay3Lee (Feb 3, 2013)

And my mistake.. it was published in 2008..


----------



## Jay3Lee (Feb 3, 2013)

Seems like the more I search.. the more people I find backing nassim up with more FACTS!! http://blog.icresource.com/2009/01/17/harameins-universal-model-receives-one-of-its-largest-confirmations-the-resonance-project/


----------



## Figong (Feb 3, 2013)

E=MC2 is a law, not a theory.


----------



## Dr Kynes (Feb 4, 2013)

Figong said:


> E=MC2 is a law, not a theory.


E=MC2 is an equation not a law. 

 

Judge Dredd is the Law.


----------



## eye exaggerate (Feb 4, 2013)

...drokk it


----------



## Figong (Feb 4, 2013)

Dr Kynes said:


> E=MC2 is an equation not a law.
> 
> 
> 
> Judge Dredd is the Law.


Good point, however.. it's tied to 3 laws directly.


----------



## PetFlora (Feb 4, 2013)

[h=1]NEW! Mehran Keshe: How World Peace can be a byproduct of Keshe Technology [/h]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=piT7Vgc9sCw&feature=em-uploademail


----------



## Dr Kynes (Feb 4, 2013)

why do these "visionaries" with "incredible new technology" never have a working model to show? 

one would think if he had crated a "plasma nuclear reactor" he could build one in the glorious islamic republic of iran, and PROVE that it works. 

in B4 "thats why the israelis and the US are bombing their nuclear facilities"


----------



## Figong (Feb 4, 2013)

Dr Kynes said:


> why do these "visionaries" with "incredible new technology" never have a working model to show?
> 
> one would think if he had crated a "plasma nuclear reactor" he could build one in the glorious islamic republic of iran, and PROVE that it works.
> 
> in B4 "thats why the israelis and the US are bombing their nuclear facilities"


Exactly why he said.. theory. If they tried to make it a reality, based on any law they thought was created.. there'd more than likely be mass catastrophe.


----------



## buckaroo bonzai (Feb 4, 2013)

I use them in some of my favorite plants---

crystals give off a vibration.....frequency-

like all rocks- 

I believe good crystals are beneficial same as I believe in bio -dynamics-


i met a guy that grinds them up and ruby dust emerald dust herkamer diamonds and feeds it to his wermz --


----------



## Beefbisquit (Feb 6, 2013)

Heisenberg said:


>


Holy shit, Heis... I swear I was going to post this exact fucking picture!


----------



## Heisenberg (Feb 6, 2013)

Jay3Lee said:


> This theory was published in 2011, *it generally takes a few years for other physicists to test the theory before it becomes feasible to call it a law*.. And Im sorry I dont have the time to spend 2 hours writing out feild equations in this thread for you to check out... I have however.. provided a video of Nassim Haramein laying out these caluculations in laymans terms. If you would actually watch the video.. you would see the math.. you would see that it works.. and you would see that your WRONG... but.. I guess 2 hours of your time to learn something about the universe is just too much to ask.... Afterall.. Ive been asking for over a week now! Here is the math.. yet again.. Come proove me wrong please! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1JDMToJDe0


I have a hard time watching a video on your recommendation seeing as how you do not know the difference between a scientific law and a theory. I don't believe you understand relativity, math, or physics well enough if you misunderstand such basic science.



Advice for ATM posters

5. Whenever possible, defend your points with published research  and make sure you can provide some explanation in your own words as to how that research supports what you are saying.* Quoting articles or providing links to on-line videos with no explanation is not evidence. *

6. Remember you will not convince everyone in one or two posts. Take your time to build your argument and be prepared for a long discussion. If you think you've refuted Newton, Relativity, Quantum Mechanics, and the Big Bang all in one post  you havent. Whole books have been written challenging those theories. *Youre not going to do it single handedly in a few hundred words on an Internet discussion board.*

11. Dont accuse people of being closed minded just because they disagree with you.* Throwing a tantrum because your theory is not accepted will not win you support.* Have a sense of humor, be friendly and be polite. Taking yourself too seriously usually leads to frustration.

14. Be realistic. Youll have better luck trying to convince people your alternative is possible than you will have trying to convince everybody your idea is right  and everybody else is wrong.


----------



## Dr Kynes (Feb 6, 2013)

buckaroo bonzai said:


> I use them in some of my favorite plants---
> 
> crystals give off a vibration.....frequency-
> 
> ...


you BELIEVE "crystals" give off a "vibration" but no vibration or cycling has yet been recorded without an outside energy source (and thats actual real energy, not "energies") to agitate the crystalline structure. 

you BELIEVE "crystals" give off a "frequency" but they only do that when you apply outside (actual) energy to them, and then they make radio waves. 

curiously you seem to also believe "all rocks" do this too. but thats just silly. dump all the electrical current you want into a lump of shale and its still just a lump of shale. 

"good crystals"? some "crystals" have turned to the Dark Side? 

what "crystals" are non-beneficial? 
proving harm seems to be the easiest thing on the planet for nutbars, so this should be a snap. 
show me one "crystal" who's presence will damage my dope's growth cycle or hinder my harvest.
show me one, ill test it, and if it's true ill be a believer too.


----------



## Figong (Feb 6, 2013)

Dr Kynes said:


> you BELIEVE "crystals" give off a "vibration" but no vibration or cycling has yet been recorded without an outside energy source (and thats actual real energy, not "energies") to agitate the crystalline structure.
> 
> you BELIEVE "crystals" give off a "frequency" but they only do that when you apply outside (actual) energy to them, and then they make radio waves.
> 
> ...


Non-beneficial crystal would be crystal meth.


----------



## sunni (Feb 6, 2013)

Figong said:


> Non-beneficial crystal would be crystal meth.


LOL i dont think there is any NON beneficial crystals, as they all work for supposed different aspects and elements,


----------



## Dr Kynes (Feb 6, 2013)

Figong said:


> Non-beneficial crystal would be crystal meth.


if ya wanna stay up for 6 nights straight and install sprinkler systems in stranger's yards, meth is AWESOME!


----------



## Dr Kynes (Feb 6, 2013)

sunni said:


> LOL i dont think there is any NON beneficial crystals, as they all work for supposed different aspects and elements,


the Paris Hilton data set evidence seems to conclude that "Swarovski Crystals" turn people into dumb sluts with VD. 

can we get a double blind on that?


----------



## Heisenberg (Feb 6, 2013)

Dr Kynes said:


> the Paris Hilton data set evidence seems to conclude that "Swarovski Crystals" turn people into *dumb sluts with VD.*
> 
> can we get a double blind on that?


You didn't back up your data with sources.


----------



## Figong (Feb 6, 2013)

sunni said:


> LOL i dont think there is any NON beneficial crystals, as they all work for supposed different aspects and elements,


With the lol, could not tell if you were being serious, or quite facetious given the topic at hand.. and am not sure anyone would really want to spend the time, and/or $ to make said crystal meth as a test for mj plant growth.. that said: I guess it could work if you pH check it first.. found a study of 29 different meth samples: 

Citing:_ "The pH levels varied from 3.02 to 7.03 with an average of 5.0."_

Semi-workable, or massive pH down, and soil toxicity would also depend on how pure the mix was, as well..


----------



## sunni (Feb 6, 2013)

Figong said:


> With the lol, could not tell if you were being serious, or quite facetious given the topic at hand.. and am not sure anyone would really want to spend the time, and/or $ to make said crystal meth as a test for mj plant growth.. that said: I guess it could work if you pH check it first.. found a study of 29 different meth samples:
> 
> Citing:_ "The pH levels varied from 3.02 to 7.03 with an average of 5.0."_
> 
> Semi-workable, or massive pH down, and soil toxicity would also depend on how pure the mix was, as well..


sorry i was LOLing at what you said, then said my own piece, but I only said what i did because supposed there is no bad crystals, because they supposed work for all different things, but im iffy on the subject honestly which is why i use the words "supposed"


----------



## Figong (Feb 6, 2013)

sunni said:


> sorry i was LOLing at what you said, then said my own piece, but I only said what i did because supposed there is no bad crystals, because they supposed work for all different things, but im iffy on the subject honestly which is why i use the words "supposed"


I think it's a joke, same as 'healing crystals' that people wear on their wrists to well.. heal, and ward against disease.


----------



## sunni (Feb 6, 2013)

Figong said:


> I think it's a joke, same as 'healing crystals' that people wear on their wrists to well.. heal, and ward against disease.


Eh It doesn't bother me honestly maybe just the hope of it allows them to heal or at least feel better. I like the look of them though there are some quite pretty crystals haha


----------



## cannabineer (Feb 10, 2013)

I wonder if the deleterious effects of drinking methanol were subjected to a double-blind study ... cn


----------



## ultraviolet pirate (Feb 15, 2013)

to anyone who believes in magic crystals to help em grow...well, i got some magic gravel from my drive way- i mean from a chinese guy i know- that will give you ten pounds per plant. hit me up.











and yo, im not serious.


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## PetFlora (Feb 15, 2013)

It's amazing how close minded many of you are, in spite of the fact that oscillating crystal amplifiers have been used for decades. 

http://www.electronics-tutorials.ws/oscillator/crystal.html

Everything physical has a frequency. Lifeforms frequently exposed to sufficient quantities of inharmonious frequencies (EMF/RFI) will eventually become diseased.


----------



## Figong (Feb 15, 2013)

PetFlora said:


> It's amazing how close minded many of you are, in spite of the fact that oscillating crystal amplifiers have been used for decades.
> 
> http://www.electronics-tutorials.ws/oscillator/crystal.html
> 
> Everything physical has a frequency. Lifeforms frequently exposed to sufficient quantities of inharmonious frequencies (EMF/RFI) will eventually become diseased.


I could entertain that idea, if you can show me where the current loop is with no short that could trigger a piezo-electric effect in a pot. Without the loop to conduct, the crystal amplifier sits there and does nothing.

http://phoenixvibrationalhealing.com/articles/attuneyourself.html

According to this link .. everything also vibrates per cosmic law.. but there is no such law.


----------



## PetFlora (Feb 15, 2013)

It would need to be part of a circuit tuned to desirable frequency range via a speaker. Plants respond to external influences (see the book Secret Life of Plants) 

Studies exist for various types of music and how they affect plant growth


----------



## Figong (Feb 15, 2013)

PetFlora said:


> It would need to be part of a circuit tuned to desirable frequency range via a speaker. Plants respond to external influences (see the book Secret Life of Plants)
> 
> Studies exist for various types of music and how they affect plant growth


I understand the concept of the electronics and circuitry.. the OP was referring to taking normal pieces of quartz, cramming it in the soil, and having it do magical things. A tad different from a bridge circuit, FET-based circuitry, bridges, or anything else used and/or paired with the crystal amp, I'd say.


----------



## StoopidLungs (Feb 18, 2013)

I just came across this article from Spirit Science:

"Scientists Create Near-Living Crystal" - Science

We know that crystals have been proven to store information, harness the energy of consciousness, have many technological functions, and contain silicon and carbon - the building blocks of life. The also possess energetic qualities that have promoted healing and emotional, physical, and spiritual well-being. They have been used throughout history as a conduit between the world of life (as we know it) and inanimate matter, but the life-like properties of crystals may be more literal than previously thought.

Physicists at NYC University have this month published the results of their experiment on the lifelike behaviours of a newly-synthesized chemical compound. Taking hematite (a compound of iron and oxygen) as the particle basis, they added a spherical polymer coat. Leaving a corner of the hematite particle exposed and subjecting the compound to blue light, the particles began moving, breaking apart and reforming in a &#8216;lifelike&#8217; manner. The physicists have uploaded this clip displaying the behaviour of the &#8220;light-activated colloidal surfers.&#8221; - http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=jqwOYh5hUlc

The particles aren't truly alive -- but they're not far off, either. Exposed to light and fed by chemicals, they form crystals that move, break apart and form again. "There is a blurry frontier between active and alive," said biophysicist Jérémie Palacci of New York University. One of the physicists involved, Chaikin acknowledges that a definition of life is a difficult one to make. He comments that one definition of life is possessing metabolism, the ability to self-replicate and the ability to move and that the &#8216;colloidal surfers&#8217; satisfy two of these criteria. They lack only the ability to self-replicate.

http://myscienceacademy.org/2013/02/18/scientists-create-near-living-crystal/

http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/2013-02/01/living-crystals

"Living Crystals of Light-Activated Colloidal Surfers." By Jeremie Palacci, Stefano Sacanna, Asher Preska Steinberg, David J. Pine, Paul M. Chaikin. Science, Vol. 339 No. 6119, 1 February 2013.""​


----------



## GOD HERE (Feb 19, 2013)

StoopidLungs said:


> Crystals and weed growing. I have been on a spiritual journey lately which has brought me to love the effects that different types of crystals can have on people and the energy that surrounds them. So I had an idea to use crystals in my grow room and I researched which crystals work best for plant growth. So I ordered a pyramid shaped moss agate (pyramid-shaped crystals contain even more energy) and also a whole pound of rough green calcite. I am going to put the moss agate pyramid in between the 2 buckets on the ground and scatter the pound of green calcite around the buckets and grow room. Here are the benefits of each stone:
> 
> Moss agate is probably the most beneficial stone when you want increased plant growth. It is known as the gardener's talisman for this very reason. Moss agate is often used to attract prosperity and abundance. It's also a healing stone. This crystal is associated with nature spirits. Wearing moss agate while gardening can increase your energy, relieve a stiff neck, and tune you in to the energies of your garden. Placing moss agate stones in a container pot or in the ground will increase flower and plant growth. I made a moss agate wind chime suspended from three bamboo stakes tied together at the top and placed this tee-pee in a part of my garden where the Phlox weren't doing so well. Within a couple of weeks, I was overrun. A little goes a long way when it comes to crystals. If you have fruit trees, try hanging a small moss agate stone from one of the branches to promote a healthy harvest.
> 
> ...


Yeah you tell me how that turns out.


----------



## Dr Kynes (Feb 19, 2013)

StoopidLungs said:


> I just came across this article from Spirit Science:
> 
> "Scientists Create Near-Living Crystal" - Science
> 
> ...


dude, if one of those physicists at NYCU called their crystals "alive" ill eat my fucking hat. 

when your source starts out "*We know that crystals have been proven to store information, harness the energy of consciousness, have many technological functions, and contain silicon and carbon - the building blocks of life. The also possess energetic qualities that have promoted healing and emotional, physical, and spiritual well-being. They have been used throughout history as a conduit between the world of life (as we know it) and inanimate matter, but the life-like properties of crystals may be more literal than previously thought." 

*then you should realize it's pure BULLSHIT. 


"We" Know No Such Thing! this shit is just nonsensical garbage from some asshole who will offer to sell you "magic healing crystals" or homeopathic "structured water"*

*


----------



## Beefbisquit (Feb 20, 2013)

*

"Scientists Create Near-Living Crystal" - Science

Did "Science" say this? 



​




*


----------



## GOD HERE (Feb 20, 2013)

Dr Kynes said:


> dude, if one of those physicists at NYCU called their crystals "alive" ill eat my fucking hat.
> 
> when your source starts out "*We know that crystals have been proven to store information, harness the energy of consciousness, have many technological functions, and contain silicon and carbon - the building blocks of life. The also possess energetic qualities that have promoted healing and emotional, physical, and spiritual well-being. They have been used throughout history as a conduit between the world of life (as we know it) and inanimate matter, but the life-like properties of crystals may be more literal than previously thought."
> 
> ...


You are the voice of reason.


----------



## Beefbisquit (Feb 21, 2013)

Dr Kynes said:


> dude, if one of those physicists at NYCU called their crystals "alive" ill eat my fucking hat.
> 
> when your source starts out "*We know that crystals have been proven to store information, harness the energy of consciousness, have many technological functions, and contain silicon and carbon - the building blocks of life. The also possess energetic qualities that have promoted healing and emotional, physical, and spiritual well-being. They have been used throughout history as a conduit between the world of life (as we know it) and inanimate matter, but the life-like properties of crystals may be more literal than previously thought."
> 
> ...



You didn't know water has memory? PFFFFFFTTTTTT.... you obviously didn't graduate from the Homeopathic training Center....


----------



## Figong (Feb 21, 2013)

Beefbisquit said:


> You didn't know water has memory? PFFFFFFTTTTTT.... you obviously didn't graduate from the Homeopathic training Center....


*passes the pipe with some quartz and black onyx in it* Here, this will help with your lack of energy.. will completely revitalize you. .. hahahaha


----------



## Beefbisquit (Feb 21, 2013)

Those aren't the right type of crystals to smoke!


----------



## Figong (Feb 21, 2013)

Beefbisquit said:


> Those aren't the right type of crystals to smoke!


Supposedly they work if you cram them in mj plant soil, so why not just cut out the plant and time and smoke the rocks? (bad pun, I know)


----------



## Beefbisquit (Feb 21, 2013)

Figong said:


> Supposedly they work if you cram them in mj plant soil, so why not just cut out the plant and time and smoke the rocks? (bad pun, I know)


[video=youtube_share;8UrDvruoubA]http://youtu.be/8UrDvruoubA[/video]


----------



## VLRD.Kush (Feb 25, 2013)

some kid at Electric Forest tried explaining the whole crystal/ energy thing to me... I couldn't help but giggle. He was like, "dude I lost this for like a week and just wasn't the same. It found it's way back to me though, and I just felt 1000x better physically and spiritually."


----------



## Dr Kynes (Feb 25, 2013)

VLRD.Kush said:


> some kid at Electric Forest tried explaining the whole crystal/ energy thing to me... I couldn't help but giggle. He was like, "dude I lost this for like a week and just wasn't the same. It found it's way back to me though, and I just felt 1000x better physically and spiritually."


everybody's got a gris gris. 

i feel naked if i doint have a pocketknife on me. but only the truely stupid think their trinkets and personal effects are magical, and they do something other than reassure you with their presence, or provide sentimental comfort. 

but then if you need to cut something or stab somebody, a knife is always handy. a leaded glass pendant not so much....


----------



## JayDiggz (Mar 25, 2013)

StoopidLungs said:


> Crystals and weed growing. I have been on a spiritual journey lately which has brought me to love the effects that different types of crystals can have on people and the energy that surrounds them. So I had an idea to use crystals in my grow room and I researched which crystals work best for plant growth. So I ordered a pyramid shaped moss agate (pyramid-shaped crystals contain even more energy) and also a whole pound of rough green calcite. I am going to put the moss agate pyramid in between the 2 buckets on the ground and scatter the pound of green calcite around the buckets and grow room. Here are the benefits of each stone:
> 
> Moss agate is probably the most beneficial stone when you want increased plant growth. It is known as the gardener's talisman for this very reason. Moss agate is often used to attract prosperity and abundance. It's also a healing stone. This crystal is associated with nature spirits. Wearing moss agate while gardening can increase your energy, relieve a stiff neck, and tune you in to the energies of your garden. Placing moss agate stones in a container pot or in the ground will increase flower and plant growth. I made a moss agate wind chime suspended from three bamboo stakes tied together at the top and placed this tee-pee in a part of my garden where the Phlox weren't doing so well. Within a couple of weeks, I was overrun. A little goes a long way when it comes to crystals. If you have fruit trees, try hanging a small moss agate stone from one of the branches to promote a healthy harvest.
> 
> ...


Hey, did you ever find if this made a difference? Sorry, I skipped all the way to the end without reading much of the thread... too many trolls.


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## Mister Sister (Mar 26, 2013)

VLRD.Kush said:


> some kid at Electric Forest tried explaining the whole crystal/ energy thing to me... I couldn't help but giggle. He was like, "dude I lost this for like a week and just wasn't the same. It found it's way back to me though, and I just felt 1000x better physically and spiritually."


The problem is that people actually believe these things are needed to make them better. They might help, but in most cases it seems to me more a case of spiritual materialism...completely missing the point.


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## Doer (Mar 27, 2013)

JayDiggz said:


> Hey, did you ever find if this made a difference? Sorry, I skipped all the way to the end without reading much of the thread... too many trolls.


Well, yeah. I don't want to read it either, because I don't want to troll. 

There only one way to prove anything. Double blind study. So without that, it is called woo.

And you will find, if you look hard for a lifetime, as I have done, that in every single solitary corner of para-normal whatsit, there can NEVER be a successful double blind study. (SDBS)

If there was it would be mainstream science and not woo. Science is built up this way, and when we get to life science and our hope, dreams, fear, cult longing belonging, and yes, brag and ego, money, etc, we get woo.

This is why Life Sciences, especially, are conducted toward SDBS. Everything that fails that rigor, is either Snake Oil, if it is a product for sale. Or in the case of raw beliefs, of forces outside of Science ABILITY to define, are indistinguishable from Religion.


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## Nader (May 8, 2013)

of the lesser-known species:

bastnasite (zagi mtn) -- get one. i bought a fucking monstrous one for $500 but you can definitely find perfect ones for less than $20 
phenakite -- if you made quartz into bho, you'd get phenakite! haha
benitoite -- not a coincidence that it's Cali's state stone lol
tenebrescent burmese hackmanite -- put in sunlight for 5 mins to durn dark purple colour
bright orange spessartite


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## Scroga (May 8, 2013)

Got any links where these.calm be obtained?


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## StoopidLungs (May 15, 2013)

I have never grown weed without crystals, so I am not sure if it made a physical difference on my plants. But it still had a real difference on my perception of reality. Because of that, I will never grow without them. I like knowing that the weed was "grown with crystals." It is important to stress that crystal pyramids probably aren't going to overpower the environment. Shitty conditions + crystals will not make Grade A nugs. But take someone who is already producing Grade A+ nugs in the perfect environment and add crystals to that? Now THATS that shit I like!!!!


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## d3dm4n (May 25, 2013)

I have a bowl that has a big quartz on it and i swear it gets me higher than any other bowl i have...


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## cues (May 25, 2013)

I can see this working. 
Maybe if they are positioned in such a way as to reflect more light onto the plants.
Personally, I'll stick with mylar. Cheaper and more efficient.
p.s. Is science and tech really the right place for this thread?


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## silasraven (May 25, 2013)

that whole shakra stuff and crystals with powers and rocks that can heal. IS A LOAD OF ..... well you get the idea


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## Potent Enigma (Mar 17, 2014)

The Secret Life of Plants 

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/0060915870

Double Slit Experiment

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=DfPeprQ7oGc

Crystal Properties 

http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2013/01/living-crystal/

Pyramid Properties 

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/piramides/esp_piramide_18.htm

The Ra Material 

http://www.lawofone.info/


There's much science behind these... The fact is, quantum mechanics destroyed the predictable physics of the foundation of science. Intention changes everything. If you read or watch any of these links... Make sure you include the one called The Double Slit Experiment. I will be posting my grow soon... It'll have pyramids and crystals... But im more on the fun, experimental, adventurer side of life, and even if all effects i perceive are mental, they will nonetheless become my waking experience, making it real for me. Perception is just signals, if i can boost or alter my perception, my reality has just been altered. Skepticism is incredibly ironic to me in this forum. It's like arguing why our bodies produce dmt, and then trying to scientifically prove for or against the trip that ensues upon smoking it. Anyways, I'm looking forward to a colorful, wide array of reactions to my grow. Love to all. =P


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## Heisenberg (Mar 17, 2014)

"Quantum physics is claimed to support the mystical notion that the mind creates reality. However, an objective reality, with no special role for consciousness, human or cosmic, is consistent with all observations."  Victor J. Stenger, professor of physics and astronomy at the University of Hawaii.

http://www.csicop.org/si/show/quantum_quackery/



"Somehow the word 'quantum' manages to sound simultaneously mysterious and scientific, and so people attach it to things that they want to sound simultaneously mysterious and scientific, like diets and the power of positive thinking, or even theology."  Michelle Francl-Donnay


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## Potent Enigma (Mar 18, 2014)

Ok so first, lol, it isn't a claim, it is fact. Objective reality and observation are all dependent on the object of observation. You observe as you perceive. Your perception is a choice. Not what you look at, but how. 

And the second quote is just a useless observation of an occuring circumstance which exists amongst specific people. It makes no discernment, nor does it confirm nor deny or even provide an opinion on the correctness of described observation. Its like saying people with electric cars think they can race fast while saving the environment. It is an absolutely pointless arrangement of words describing a neutral reality while providing no argument or proposition... But yes. Thanks for that contribution.


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## Potent Enigma (Mar 18, 2014)

Meditation alters DNA. 

http://www.news.wisc.edu/22370

Organic life is most susceptible to quantum effect, as it has billions of micro connections which we can't see enough to solidify with logical limitations. Crystals vibrate, pyramids are a mathematical funnel of vibration of the earth. Make a pyramid out of sticks to the scale of Giza, put it above incense smoke, the smoke straightens and funnels to the center. But i think im done, il post my grow, we'll see what happens. Namaste. /\<3


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## Heisenberg (Mar 18, 2014)

Potent Enigma said:


> Ok so first, lol, it isn't a claim, it is fact. Objective reality and observation are all dependent on the object of observation. You observe as you perceive. Your perception is a choice. Not what you look at, but how.
> 
> And the second quote is just a useless observation of an occuring circumstance which exists amongst specific people. It makes no discernment, nor does it confirm nor deny or even provide an opinion on the correctness of described observation. Its like saying people with electric cars think they can race fast while saving the environment. It is an absolutely pointless arrangement of words describing a neutral reality while providing no argument or proposition... But yes. Thanks for that contribution.


The arguments were in the link, the quote was an afterthought. Since you simply reiterated the claim debunked by the article, I'll assume you didn't read it, or perhaps you did, and didn't bother to fashion a response.



> Organic life is most susceptible to quantum effect, as it has billions of micro connections which we can't see enough to solidify with logical limitations. Crystals vibrate, pyramids are a mathematical funnel of vibration of the earth. Make a pyramid out of sticks to the scale of Giza, put it above incense smoke, the smoke straightens and funnels to the center.


"*It is an absolutely pointless arrangement of words describing a neutral reality while providing no argument or proposition"
*
You have linked to a press release that doesn't even name the study it's talking about. That leaves me with no way to actually see this information or examine the methodology. It amounts to "take my word for it."


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## Potent Enigma (Mar 18, 2014)

The article debunked nothing. Lol it is saying that any sort of measurable change has never been observed of a quantum origin. Ummm... Dis you watch the double slit experiment video? It clearly demonstrates that the instrument which observed and measured the nature of the photons, forced them to behave in ways we currently agree to be possible/logical with our understanding of third dimensional reality. The observer has everything to do with the outcome. You can't pretend to believe something, you can't prove something to a skeptic. Their presence and observation will not allow it. Then there is the subconscious of the person which can prevent an "impossible" outcome. Plants give physical, electromagnetic signals, which have been proven to be triggered by thought or intention, and are synched unbound by space time. I will not sit here and hope to make anyone realize anything, lol its absurd I'm even taking the time to experiment or consider something with the intention of helping others. There is such a cling to the prevention of evolution that it boggles the mind. The plants were experimented on using lie detectors, the meditation altering dna was a legitimate recent scientific study, but it is of no use whatsoever to do any work for another in an attempt to show them how something may benefit them. What i don't understand is, why people take the time to refute something, rather than let it be or try to encourage it. Science and its "laws" constantly change, why are so many bravely guarding it as if it is the representation of their own being? Does it threaten you? Does it confuse you? Does it make you feel like losing this grasp will leave you with nothing to be anchored to? If no, then why not allow it to exist without your friction? Why not say that your completely skeptical, but look forward to the outcome? Why must you make it your mission to disprove something that is literally set out to reveal more information about what you are so convinced is not possible? Reactions like this is exactly why revolutionary secrets in technology aren't revealed to the public, why they naturally end up in private circles and communities. People will more readily fight for the old, than protect the possibility of the new. Lol this is what makes me want to not even post publicly any outcome, as the information would almost completely be put to waste. Lol my plants will enjoy a cozy little ecosystem, with crystals and pyramids, and i will be happy getting to know them. I will thank them for the sacrifice, and infuse their energy with mine when i smoke. I observe these approaches and their effects as beneficial, just as many observe their own diseases as obstacles through which to learn, and become free of their ailments. I wish that your imagination may one day lay way to magnificent things, because as it may be observed, all things were impossible until someone did them. Good day my friend...


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## Heisenberg (Mar 18, 2014)

Potent Enigma said:


> The article debunked nothing. Lol it is saying that any sort of measurable change has never been observed of a quantum origin. Ummm... Dis you watch the double slit experiment video? It clearly demonstrates that the instrument which observed and measured the nature of the photons, forced them to behave in ways we currently agree to be possible/logical with our understanding of third dimensional reality. The observer has everything to do with the outcome.


The observer simply collapses the wave. The observer can be a mindless robot or sensor, no consciousness or life is necessary. If we can remove consciousness as a factor and still get the same results, then consciousness is not part of the mechanism. http://www.csicop.org/sb/show/mindless_quantum





> You can't pretend to believe something, you can't prove something to a skeptic. Their presence and observation will not allow it. Then there is the subconscious of the person which can prevent an "impossible" outcome. Plants give physical, electromagnetic signals, which have been proven to be triggered by thought or intention, and are synched unbound by space time


. 

This is the same way every quack, psychic and snake oil salesman have always responded to doubters. It's called special pleading. It suggests your particular brand of nonsense need not prove itself to scientific standards. That believing in a phenomenon is a per-requirement for proving it. It might be nice for you if science worked this way, but it doesn't. 

"In essence, it is the arbitrary introduction of new elements into an argument in order to fix them so that they appear valid. A good example of this is the ad-hoc dismissal of negative test results. For example, one might point out that ESP has never been demonstrated under adequate test conditions, therefore ESP is not a genuine phenomenon. Defenders of ESP have attempted to counter this argument by introducing the arbitrary premise that ESP does not work in the presence of skeptics. This fallacy is often taken to ridiculous extremes, as more and more bizarre ad hoc elements are added to explain experimental failures or logical inconsistencies." http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Special_pleading




> What i don't understand is, why people take the time to refute something, rather than let it be or try to encourage it. Science and its "laws" constantly change, why are so many bravely guarding it as if it is the representation of their own being? Does it threaten you? Does it confuse you? Does it make you feel like losing this grasp will leave you with nothing to be anchored to? If no, then why not allow it to exist without your friction? Why not say that your completely skeptical, but look forward to the outcome? Why must you make it your mission to disprove something that is literally set out to reveal more information about what you are so convinced is not possible? Reactions like this is exactly why revolutionary secrets in technology aren't revealed to the public, why they naturally end up in private circles and communities. People will more readily fight for the old, than protect the possibility of the new.


Wow, that is a lot of cognitive dissonance reduction going on there trying to explain why I don't believe. The answer of course is that if you show me real evidence, I will believe. The way science works is that it tries to falsify ideas, not prove them. Or, you could say it tries to prove itself right by failing to prove itself wrong. No scientific subject ever started out with belief, it had to be demonstrated. Should drug companies not have to prove their drugs work before they market them? Should airplane design based on aerodynamics not have to prove its safety before we offer commercial flights? Should genetically engineered crops not have to prove their worth before we implement them? Is it just your special idea that escapes criticism?


All you have done is explained the particular ways in which you have fooled yourself.


View attachment 3027199


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## Potent Enigma (Mar 18, 2014)

I actually explained where my particular viewpoint stands, chiming in as i will also be implementing a study regarding the subject matter. I understand your world. Prove you love someone. Prove consciousness. Prove you don't need proof. I wish you the best...


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## tyler.durden (Mar 19, 2014)

Heisenberg said:


> The observer simply collapses the wave. The observer can be a mindless robot or sensor, no consciousness or life is necessary. If we can remove consciousness as a factor and still get the same results, then consciousness is not part of the mechanism. http://www.csicop.org/sb/show/mindless_quantum
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Awesome post. It's gonna be difficult to refute any of these specific points...


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## Potent Enigma (Mar 19, 2014)

I thought everyone has had AT LEAST one psychic phenomenon happen to them, and it gradually, naturally becomes more common and eventually understood as a sense. There is nothing i can say here that won't be attacked regarding this, but hey at least it brings naysayers together, so that's good.


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## Potent Enigma (Mar 20, 2014)

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/piramides/esp_piramide_18.htm


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## tyler.durden (Mar 20, 2014)

Potent Enigma said:


> http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/piramides/esp_piramide_18.htm


Flanagan is a pseudo-scientist whose junk science has been debunked - 

http://www.chem1.com/CQ/FlanBunk.html

http://www.healthwatcher.net/Quackerywatch/colloidal-minerals/patrickflanagan.html


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## Potent Enigma (Mar 20, 2014)

Lol didn't know that thanks... I probably really should invest myself fully into replies rather than sharing random things i come across on my phone at work. Either way ill be posting my stealth box and grow, will have crystals, pyramids, lol even thought bout trying playing music with small speakers haha, also cool tube hps 150 and some cfl action. The first grow will be auto but i plan to at some point get clones of white widow for a controlled experiment. Thanks for everyone's input...


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## Potent Enigma (Mar 27, 2014)

Jack herer auto has been put into rapid rooter then into soil. Waiting for sprout. Also i will rig up an electric fertilizer system when i get home. I will be starting a grow log after it sprouts, and am thinking of setting up an experiment box, strictly for experimenting with sound, crystals, electricity and pyramids. Lol. Guess ill need a mother chamber as well. Happy everything all! =D


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## Potent Enigma (Mar 27, 2014)

Oh Whoops meant to share this for inquiring minds... 

http://electricfertilizer.com/


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## Ravikaleova (Apr 25, 2014)

silusbotwin said:


> Without a doubt the best post I've ever seen on RIU in years. Feels good and refreshing to know there are like minded individuals out there. Unlike those calling bullshit, I've done the same research and I've learned plenty enough about crystals to be really inspired to add some to the mix.
> 
> Thanks a TON OP! I'm going to order a Moss Agate pendant tonight
> Mini Projector
> ...


Well! am challenging the growers who are already producing medical quality buds to give it a try and see what happens. If you aren't quite there yet, you could use all the help you can get! I am very excited for the rest of my crystals to arrive, given the positive reaction I have had from my plants in such a short amount of time.


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## CannaBare (May 1, 2014)

This is pretty neat! Yesterday I played around and made a pyramid to hang over my bed since I was not sleeping well. Well I slept great! and the odd thing is that my Girl seemed to absorb all the negative energy it gave off. I understand belief is its own placebo but I really found that cool. Because she did not believe and I did.

Anyway very cool and I will be hanging pyramids in my grow room for sure! How many do you place around? And do you like to hang them or set them on the ground? As for the crystals, since pyramids make crystals "grow" would it be a good idea to place a crystal in the soil along with pyramids? Thanks!

I would love to see more results also


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## Dr Kynes (May 8, 2014)

CannaBare said:


> This is pretty neat! Yesterday I played around and made a pyramid to hang over my bed since I was not sleeping well. Well I slept great! and the odd thing is that my Girl seemed to absorb all the negative energy it gave off. I understand belief is its own placebo but I really found that cool. Because she did not believe and I did.
> 
> Anyway very cool and I will be hanging pyramids in my grow room for sure! How many do you place around? And do you like to hang them or set them on the ground? As for the crystals, since pyramids make crystals "grow" would it be a good idea to place a crystal in the soil along with pyramids? Thanks!
> 
> I would love to see more results also


if pyramids made crystals grow,

1: buy a tiny diamond
2: put it under a big ass pyramid
3: ????
4: profit.


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## ghostdriver (Jul 6, 2014)

pagan black magic.... dude has no idea what he is doing..


You NEED TO SEEK THE LORD JESUS CHRSIT SON of GOD
put your wegi board and crystal and pyramid trash down...


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## Scroga (Jul 6, 2014)

Why not seek god ?


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## ODanksta (Jul 16, 2014)

Idk about crystals but I have a very strange phenomenon that happens to me every day. I see the number 33 hundreds of times a day. Supposedly it means the spirits are watching over you or something. Sometimes it kinda scares me. There will be times i see it like 10 times in a matter of seconds.. idk i just thought i would share that with y'all


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## Dr Kynes (Jul 16, 2014)

ODanksta said:


> Idk about crystals but I have a very strange phenomenon that happens to me every day. I see the number 33 hundreds of times a day. Supposedly it means the spirits are watching over you or something. Sometimes it kinda scares me. There will be times i see it like 10 times in a matter of seconds.. idk i just thought i would share that with y'all


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## Dr.Pecker (Jul 18, 2014)

StoopidLungs said:


> Crystals and weed growing. I have been on a spiritual journey lately which has brought me to love the effects that different types of crystals can have on people and the energy that surrounds them. So I had an idea to use crystals in my grow room and I researched which crystals work best for plant growth. So I ordered a pyramid shaped moss agate (pyramid-shaped crystals contain even more energy) and also a whole pound of rough green calcite. I am going to put the moss agate pyramid in between the 2 buckets on the ground and scatter the pound of green calcite around the buckets and grow room. Here are the benefits of each stone:
> 
> &#8220;Moss agate is probably the most beneficial stone when you want increased plant growth. It is known as &#8220;the gardener's talisman&#8221; for this very reason. Moss agate is often used to attract prosperity and abundance. It's also a healing stone. This crystal is associated with nature spirits. Wearing moss agate while gardening can increase your energy, relieve a stiff neck, and &#8220;tune&#8221; you in to the energies of your garden. Placing moss agate stones in a container pot or in the ground will increase flower and plant growth. I made a moss agate wind chime suspended from three bamboo stakes tied together at the top and placed this &#8220;tee-pee&#8221; in a part of my garden where the Phlox weren't doing so well. Within a couple of weeks, I was overrun. A little goes a long way when it comes to crystals. If you have fruit trees, try hanging a small moss agate stone from one of the branches to promote a healthy harvest.&#8221;
> 
> ...


Dr.Pecker reads this facepalms himself shakes his head and reads no farther.


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## heckler73 (Jul 18, 2014)

Dr.Pecker said:


> Dr.Pecker reads this facepalms himself shakes his head and reads no farther.


I stopped reading at the thread title. Then I saw activity and wondered how the hell it had 18 pages.
Then I read your post.
Now I'll stop again... _unless _someone is wrapping quartz with 1000-turn coils and hooking them up to 10kV supplies, then we're partying.
*SHOW ME THE GAUSS!!!*


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## stooy (Jan 16, 2017)

StoopidLungs said:


> Crystals and weed growing. I have been on a spiritual journey lately which has brought me to love the effects that different types of crystals can have on people and the energy that surrounds them. So I had an idea to use crystals in my grow room and I researched which crystals work best for plant growth. So I ordered a pyramid shaped moss agate (pyramid-shaped crystals contain even more energy) and also a whole pound of rough green calcite. I am going to put the moss agate pyramid in between the 2 buckets on the ground and scatter the pound of green calcite around the buckets and grow room. Here are the benefits of each stone:
> 
> &#8220;Moss agate is probably the most beneficial stone when you want increased plant growth. It is known as &#8220;the gardener's talisman&#8221; for this very reason. Moss agate is often used to attract prosperity and abundance. It's also a healing stone. This crystal is associated with nature spirits. Wearing moss agate while gardening can increase your energy, relieve a stiff neck, and &#8220;tune&#8221; you in to the energies of your garden. Placing moss agate stones in a container pot or in the ground will increase flower and plant growth. I made a moss agate wind chime suspended from three bamboo stakes tied together at the top and placed this &#8220;tee-pee&#8221; in a part of my garden where the Phlox weren't doing so well. Within a couple of weeks, I was overrun. A little goes a long way when it comes to crystals. If you have fruit trees, try hanging a small moss agate stone from one of the branches to promote a healthy harvest.&#8221;
> 
> ...



Wow thanks for the info, very nice, i'm getting a moss agate pyramid and the Green Calcite for sure ^^ and i'm absolutly SHOCKED over the extremly IGNORANT responses to this post, i thought better of stoners but i guess i was wrong, they are so asleep.
Smoking pot is supposed to have you get High, as in getting knowedge from the higher up, it can help you reach god, that is what shamans etc did in rituals, but these fools missuse and overuse, then to come to a post of value to shit on it? i am actually agitated.

Here is a message to you ignorant sleepers
Instead of doing whatever you can to break down something, why not explore it? make tests? a gardren with crystals and one without, you will see, instead of being a TOXIC JACKASS!

Love
-Stooy


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## alwayslearning777 (Jan 16, 2017)

Frequencies do have an effect on everything, for example the light posts in the ground are specifically tested to withstand a low sweep in frequency, why because the earth has it's own frequency that has major effects, especially on sensitive electrical equipment, 

When it comes to living things such as plants I am not experienced so I cannot say but most people are of the mind that they can't see it it doesn't exist and ur crazy if u believe in something like that.. 

Crystals contain their own specific frequency, I do not think it will have any effect personally because you have a ton of equipment cycling at 60hz that will far out weight the effects of the frequency the crystal has 

I do think if u were outside away from everything it may help but I think indoors you have way to much working against that theory


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## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 16, 2017)

A brief search shows only placebo effect in clinical research testing. 

People who were believers were more likely to say their crystal had effects when they were holding a fake stone. 

We see and believe what we want to see and believe. And the more like pseudo science someone's beliefs are the more they seem to need to convince others of their validity. 

See the LED or Organic sections here for more info


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## alwayslearning777 (Jan 16, 2017)

I think its just amazement .. Pezioelectricity, crystal radios, even LCD , all use a crystal or crystal structure to transmit information 

But when people believe they can also pick up information or energy from them I do agree that most likely it is all in their minds .. Maybe some people can but most just want to believe, 

Now if you were to grow inside a crystal pyramid maybe there is something to how it refracts the light ? Not sure but cool concept lol


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## Rizlared (Mar 11, 2017)

Tesla, upon discovering that atoms were over 99% empty space, said "the next major advance in human evolution will be consciousness"

100 years later there is a woman in China who, under scientific conditions, has germinated a seed within 2 hours using consciousness.

Typically, that type of seed takes up to two days.

Until you know something, you don't know.

The suggestion that anyone could massively speed up the germination process of a seed by using consciousness sounds ridiculous to many.

Now the article I read could be bs but until i know I'll keep an open mind.

I wish others would take the same approach

edit; the report i read said she had achieved the same results on over 20 different occasions under scientific conditions


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## heckler73 (Mar 11, 2017)

Rizlared said:


> Tesla, upon discovering that atoms were over 99% empty space, said "the next major advance in human evolution will be consciousness"
> 
> 100 years later there is a woman in China who, under scientific conditions, has germinated a seed within 2 hours using consciousness.


What are these "scientific conditions"?



> edit; the report i read said she had achieved the same results on over 20 different occasions under scientific conditions



Without _*knowing *_what those "scientific conditions" are, it is meaningless hearsay, at best. 
Also what does "consciousness" mean in this context?


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## mauricem00 (Mar 11, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> A brief search shows only placebo effect in clinical research testing.
> 
> People who were believers were more likely to say their crystal had effects when they were holding a fake stone.
> 
> ...


LEDs are made from silicon crystals that seem to have magical properties . but I have to admit that I talk to my plants. don't know if it does any good but it can't hurt


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## heckler73 (Mar 11, 2017)

mauricem00 said:


> LEDs are made from silicon crystals that seem to have magical properties . but I have to admit that I talk to my plants. don't know if it does any good but it can't hurt


It gives them a shot of CO2, at least.


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## Rizlared (Mar 11, 2017)

heckler73 said:


> What are these "scientific conditions"?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I knew I'd get this reply.

I figured that anyone interested would look it up...anyone not looking it up but being negative well, that speaks for itself


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## Rizlared (Mar 11, 2017)

Rizlared said:


> I knew I'd get this reply.
> 
> I figured that anyone interested would look it up...anyone not looking it up but being negative well, that speaks for itself


As alluded to, i only read the report. 

I did not then cross reference the sources.

I make no claims other than i keep an open mind about it


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 11, 2017)

mauricem00 said:


> LEDs are made from silicon crystals that seem to have magical properties . but I have to admit that I talk to my plants. don't know if it does any good but it can't hurt


I hate to be scientific in this particular thread but I talk to them a lot too. But I do it for me mostly. They like me to vent. That way they get a nice blast of CO2.


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## heckler73 (Mar 11, 2017)

Rizlared said:


> As alluded to, i only read the report.
> 
> I did not then cross reference the sources.
> 
> I make no claims other than i keep an open mind about it


You must be high. I am asking for the report's name, by extension. 
Does the name Chulin Sun ring a bell?
http://zeniclinic.com/2011/04/dna/


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## Rizlared (Mar 11, 2017)

tbh mate, wish i was high...I'm very tired, working nights and for a change, busy.

Intriguing isn't it (the study, not my working nights)


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## Heisenberg (Mar 12, 2017)

Rizlared said:


> I knew I'd get this reply.
> 
> I figured that anyone interested would look it up...anyone not looking it up but being negative well, that speaks for itself


There is nothing negative about asking honest questions, and asking questions does indeed indicate an open mind. Having an open mind doesn't mean we have to be convinced, it just means we have to be willing to be convinced. 

I understand you don't have the answers, and that's fine, but alluding that those wanting the answers are somehow being negative is going a step too far.


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## Rizlared (Mar 12, 2017)

Heisenberg said:


> There is nothing negative about asking honest questions, and asking questions does indeed indicate an open mind. Having an open mind doesn't mean we have to be convinced, it just means we have to be willing to be convinced.
> 
> I understand you don't have the answers, and that's fine, but alluding that those wanting the answers are somehow being negative is going s step too far.


Isn't my point.

The internet has more information than me.

Use your intrigue to find your answers.

SOME posts on this thread are from people with genuine interest, some are just haters... however they choose to articulate that hatred

It takes less energy to Google search some keywords from the info some give than it does to type a reply....so what is the motive of these people?

So, if you have an 'honest' question, ask it.

If you load that question with barbed comments...you reveal your true motive.

I've replied to you as you missed my point but, although I've read this entire thread, i didn't make a mental note along the way of your comments so do not know if this is applicable in your case...and I'm simply not petty enough to waste my time finding out 

Either way, have a nice day


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## Heisenberg (Mar 12, 2017)

Whether I missed your point or not, the point I was making is that there is nothing negative or hateful about being skeptical. It's totally legit to point out that there is a difference between something claiming to be scientific and something actually being scientific. And, you don't have to hate anything to point out that, without knowing those conditions, what you've brought to the table is hearsay. There is nothing barbed about that statement. It also doesn't indicate negativity that someone didn't "google it" before commenting, even if it is easier. You've merely answered skepticism with cynicism.

Even if we accept the premise, that, under scientifically controlled conditions these things were observed, we still wouldn't have anything suggesting that chi or consciousness was the cause. We would have merely established an effect. Certainly, an effect worthy of further study, but still just an effect. I've read three articles reporting this phenomenon and the abstract of the study they seem to be based on, and in each case the cause is assumed. That alone is very unscientific. The only thing a study like this could hope to do is reject the null hypothesis, which would indeed be remarkable, yet still wouldn't speak to a cause.


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## Rizlared (Mar 12, 2017)

none of what you've said is news.

In my spare time i read up on studies and watch lectures on quantum physics and and the nature of reality.

I know how the scientific method works.

I also know how pleased some people get lecturing at others online...or trolling

I mentioned, in a previous post, that i was very tired working nights... insinuating that i may have misread negativity in a reply.

MAY HAVE

Now, this has little to do with the OP so i will comment no more.

An open mind is healthy, we should all view life (and the claims of others) with one or risk misleading ourselves


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## Rizlared (Mar 12, 2017)

Heisenberg said:


> Weather I missed your point or not, the point I was making is that there is nothing negative or hateful about being skeptical. It's totally legit to point out that there is a difference between something claiming to be scientific and something actually being scientific. And, you don't have to hate anything to point out that, without knowing those conditions, what you've brought to the table is hearsay. There is nothing barbed about that statement. It also doesn't indicate negativity that someone didn't "google it" before commenting, even if it is easier. You've merely answered skepticism with cynicism.
> 
> Even if we accept the premise, that, under scientifically controlled conditions these things were observed, we still wouldn't have anything suggesting that chi or consciousness was the cause. We would have merely established an effect. Certainly, an effect worthy of further study, but still just an effect. I've read three articles reporting this phenomenon and the abstract of the study they seem to be based on, and in each case the cause is assumed. That alone is very unscientific. The only thing a study like this could hope to do is reject the null hypothesis, which would indeed be remarkable, yet still wouldn't speak to a cause.


After re-reading this, fair points made actually.

It's the 'barbed' comments people reply with that highlights the negativity, and in my opinion, true motive for the replies

As you were


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## Potent Enigma (Mar 12, 2017)

Rizlared said:


> I knew I'd get this reply.
> 
> I figured that anyone interested would look it up...anyone not looking it up but being negative well, that speaks for itself


I appreciate you posting it thanks. As far as im concerned, a belief, if not taking away from results, is harmless to have, it basically can't hurt unless you rely on it too much. I do find it funny that in an age of discovering quantum entanglement, storing data on dna strands, that people still have a huge commitment to denying unknown possibilities and discoveries. 

It isn't hurting anyone, why not leave it alone and ignore it if you don't agree, instead of spending energy to oppose it? Seems like wasted energy honestly.


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## Potent Enigma (Mar 12, 2017)

All skeptics of the world of telepathy or thought... I advise you look into Remote Viewing, namely Ingo Swann's experiments at Stanford Research Institute. The information comes from unclassified documents about the governments extensive remote viewing program.

... Then realize that between the strands of the fabric of reality, lies the immaterial blueprint of the material world.


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## Rizlared (Mar 12, 2017)

Quantum entanglement is a great example of the unknown.

Something, a force? a method of communication? Something is working at faster than light speed over vast distances.

Mind blowing and fascinating


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## mauricem00 (Mar 12, 2017)

Rizlared said:


> Quantum entanglement is a great example of the unknown.
> 
> Something, a force? a method of communication? Something is working at faster than light speed over vast distances.
> 
> Mind blowing and fascinating


or perhaps a misinterpretation of data by people who do not understand the mechanics of the machine used to perform these test. if their is a rational explanation based on mechanics (applied physics) they ignore it possibly out of ignorance and chose the "magical' interpretation that supports their beliefs.factor in wave mechanics and the effects of standing waves on the generator (photonic compression) and the interpretation of data would be radically different. the "entanglement" is occurring at the point of origin and not at some distance from that point.


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## Rizlared (Mar 12, 2017)

mauricem00 said:


> or perhaps a misinterpretation of data by people who do not understand the mechanics of the machine used to perform these test. if their is a rational explanation based on mechanics (applied physics) they ignore it possibly out of ignorance and chose the "magical' interpretation that supports their beliefs.factor in wave mechanics and the effects of standing waves on the generator (photonic compression) and the interpretation of data would be radically different. the "entanglement" is occurring at the point of origin and not at some distance from that point.


oh ok, that's interesting.

My understanding is that, once 'entangled' the effects happen instantaneously regardless of distance and that this has been proven by multiple experiments.

Is this not the case?

For clarity, I'm only interested in learning and not trying to prove you right/wrong


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## Potent Enigma (Mar 12, 2017)

mauricem00 said:


> or perhaps a misinterpretation of data by people who do not understand the mechanics of the machine used to perform these test. if their is a rational explanation based on mechanics (applied physics) they ignore it possibly out of ignorance and chose the "magical' interpretation that supports their beliefs.factor in wave mechanics and the effects of standing waves on the generator (photonic compression) and the interpretation of data would be radically different. the "entanglement" is occurring at the point of origin and not at some distance from that point.


So you think quantum physicists CHOSE to interpret something as magic? Ummm I'm pretty certain you could break a scientists arms before they'll consider anything of the sort. Quantum physics probably broke their world. I suppose the double slit experiment was also an effect of the device? (ironically it was, but not how one would assume)


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## Rizlared (Mar 12, 2017)

Some people look at evidence/results and say "that's interesting" and consider the possibilities.

Some look and say "proves nothing" and continue as they were

Words change nothing but i know which mindset brings about change

For the record, i neither support the claims some make about crystals nor deny them.

I have too little knowledge on the subject so keep an open mind


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## mauricem00 (Mar 12, 2017)

Potent Enigma said:


> So you think quantum physicists CHOSE to interpret something as magic? Ummm I'm pretty certain you could break a scientists arms before they'll consider anything of the sort. Quantum physics probably broke their world. I suppose the double slit experiment was also an effect of the device? (ironically it was, but not how one would assume)


throughout history theorist have made wrong assumptions out of ignorance. from planks experiment on. the outcome could be explained using standard mechanics.even theorist admit plank made an error in his math by inverting a value sign but go on the claim his theory is right even if the math was wrong.apply our current understanding of molecular resonance and wave mechanics to his data and you would see that what he discovered was the shortest wavelength (highest energy level) that we can detect and that wavelength comes close to the natural resonance frequency of an electron. the active particle in his experiment. theorist are trained in math. not mechanics or engineering. field theory explains the actions of sub atomic particles and light using mechanics and does not require quantum correction factors, an unlimited number of parallel universes, or a large number of exotic particles that can not be captured and studied. in lab test small metal shears behaved like sub atomic particles under the right conditions.Einstein and others rejected quantum theory. in the real world light always acts as a wave. never a particle. parallel realities only need to exist to address a paradox created by the particle theory of light.under special relativity any object with a mass greater than 0 would have infinite energy at the speed of light. Einstein said that under general relativity space had to have substance and could not be an empty void as quantum theorist claim. in every field of applied science the Bohr atomic model is used and works great but 2 years after Neils Bohr introduced this model theorist "proved" it did not work. theorist do make mistakes because of limited knowledge. I search for knowledge and understanding but never believe a person is right simple because they have a title.my doctor told me to take prescription drugs for my medical problems and other drugs to address the side effects. as an MMJ patient I ignored his advice and found that cannabis works better and does not have the side effects of prescription drugs. I have no formal training in medicine but I know what works best for me.choosing to interpret data in a way that supports a theory is a common error known as confirmation bias and frequently ideals have been rejected by the main stream for years because the challenged current beliefs only to be accepted in time


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## Rizlared (Mar 12, 2017)

mauricem00 said:


> throughout history theorist have made wrong assumptions out of ignorance. from planks experiment on. the outcome could be explained using standard mechanics.even theorist admit plank made an error in his math by inverting a value sign but go on the claim his theory is right even if the math was wrong.apply our current understanding of molecular resonance and wave mechanics to his data and you would see that what he discovered was the shortest wavelength (highest energy level) that we can detect and that wavelength comes close to the natural resonance frequency of an electron. the active particle in his experiment. theorist are trained in math. not mechanics or engineering. field theory explains the actions of sub atomic particles and light using mechanics and does not require quantum correction factors, an unlimited number of parallel universes, or a large number of exotic particles that can not be captured and studied. in lab test small metal shears behaved like sub atomic particles under the right conditions.Einstein and others rejected quantum theory. in the real world light always acts as a wave. never a particle. parallel realities only need to exist to address a paradox created by the particle theory of light.under special relativity any object with a mass greater than 0 would have infinite energy at the speed of light. Einstein said that under general relativity space had to have substance and could not be an empty void as quantum theorist claim. in every field of applied science the Bohr atomic model is used and works great but 2 years after Neils Bohr introduced this model theorist "proved" it did not work. theorist do make mistakes because of limited knowledge. I search for knowledge and understanding but never believe a person is right simple because they have a title.my doctor told me to take prescription drugs for my medical problems and other drugs to address the side effects. as an MMJ patient I ignored his advice and found that cannabis works better and does not have the side effects of prescription drugs. I have no formal training in medicine but I know what works best for me.choosing to interpret data in a way that supports a theory is a common error known as confirmation bias and frequently ideals have been rejected by the main stream for years because the challenged current beliefs only to be accepted in time


In the interest of balance, theorists have also proven to be correct...but that's a great post.

To be fair though, a lot of what is theorised is impossible to prove given the limitations of modern technology...but theories drive experimentation so, whether or not they prove to be correct, they advance technology.

A recent lecture on string theory i watched stated that, if you magnified an atom to the size of the planet, the string would be the size of a tree.

Nothing we have can detect anything so small...yet

Fascinating subject though


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## mauricem00 (Mar 12, 2017)

Rizlared said:


> In the interest of balance, theorists have also proven to be correct...but that's a great post.
> 
> To be fair though, a lot of what is theorised is impossible to prove given the limitations of modern technology...but theories drive experimentation so, whether or not they prove to be correct, they advance technology.
> 
> ...


true theorist are not idiots. but truth can only be learned thru experiments.I'm a PU MMJ closet grower. I use T5s but conduct test grows with LEDs. at 60 im not to old to learn new things but I am a skeptic.this is probably not the best forum to discus these matters but it is an entertaining subject


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