# Verticle bare bulb cmh



## Flowki (May 20, 2016)

Are people using this in veg, what unit are you using if so?. Read it's not safe due to uv.


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## rkymtnman (May 20, 2016)

got one going right now. for the whole grow. start to finish. 

uv is great for plants. not so great for humans.


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## Flowki (May 21, 2016)

rkymtnman said:


> got one going right now. for the whole grow. start to finish.
> 
> uv is great for plants. not so great for humans.


What are the health risks?, say 315W if you turn it off when in the room surely it's little to no risk then?.


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## rkymtnman (May 21, 2016)

i wear welding glasses. and try not to spend too much time under it. i have the 315.


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## Flagg420 (May 21, 2016)

Think of it like a weak tanning bed.... you can spend 15mins in there and not have any problems...

Dont harvest your plants under it, you dont wanna sit there for 4+hrs.... will piss off your skin/eyes....

Don't stare at it, but thats a given... don't stare at any light source that you grow plants with.... Sun, HPS, MH, CMH, LED..... even CFL, if you are able to stare at it... it belongs on a night stand for reading a book..... lights that produce plants are painfully bright...


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## pinner420 (May 21, 2016)

Roll over to the 315 club and bask in the greatness of this bulb!


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## Flowki (May 22, 2016)

What type of hood/fitting did you buy/modify in order to hang it bare vert?.


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## ttystikk (May 22, 2016)

Flowki said:


> What type of hood/fitting did you buy/modify in order to hang it bare vert?.


They're called vertical socket cordsets, they're in both the Sunlight Supply and the Hydrofarm catalogs, versions vary somewhat based on plugs and such. They're very inexpensive because you aren't buying a reflector. 

Any HID lamp will emit some UV. Most such lamps have glass that impedes UV transmission because most lamps are made for humans to see things by (duh, lol but it does need to be said! ).

Only COB LED has zero UV emissions, which I think is a good thing on balance; first, my ladies don't seem to suffer for its lack and second, one could supplement with UV and run it on a separate circuit; one that shuts off anytime people are in there.


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## pinner420 (May 22, 2016)

http://growershouse.com/ceramic-science-315w-cmh-light-conversion-kit

Get cordset and 3100k bulb too.


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## Flowki (May 22, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> http://growershouse.com/ceramic-science-315w-cmh-light-conversion-kit
> 
> Get cordset and 3100k bulb too.


What if is only used for veg light?.


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## Flowki (May 22, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> They're called vertical socket cordsets, they're in both the Sunlight Supply and the Hydrofarm catalogs, versions vary somewhat based on plugs and such. They're very inexpensive because you aren't buying a reflector.
> 
> Any HID lamp will emit some UV. Most such lamps have glass that impedes UV transmission because most lamps are made for humans to see things by (duh, lol but it does need to be said! ).
> 
> Only COB LED has zero UV emissions, which I think is a good thing on balance; first, my ladies don't seem to suffer for its lack and second, one could supplement with UV and run it on a separate circuit; one that shuts off anytime people are in there.


Seems a lot of those fitting are US plug sockets ;/

Could you use this and cut the hood at the mounting?. The hood does not look like the right fitting though o0.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Omega-315W-Daylight-Ceramic-Metal-Halide-Grow-Light-Kit-Hydroponics-/262384774152?hash=item3d1759ec08:g:NnAAAOSwv~xXDg6I


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## ttystikk (May 22, 2016)

Flowki said:


> Seems a lot of those fitting are US plug sockets ;/


You can get them with mogul socket base in Hydrofarm, Sunlight Supply and regular 120V grounded for big CFL lamps.


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## Flowki (May 22, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> You can get them with mogul socket base in Hydrofarm, Sunlight Supply and regular 120V grounded for big CFL lamps.


Seems the shipping price etc works out almost the same price as just buying a horizontal hood local. If only for it's fitting.

Leading back to the other question. Are you able to take a standard horizontal hps/MH bulb, unscrew or cut off the cheap alum horizontal hood and then use the bulb vert?.

Similarly could you do it for this as well. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Omega-315W-Daylight-Ceramic-Metal-Halide-Grow-Light-Kit-Hydroponics-/262384774152?hash=item3d1759ec08:g:NnAAAOSwv~xXDg6I


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## ttystikk (May 22, 2016)

Flowki said:


> Seems the shipping price etc works out almost the same price as just buying a horizontal hood local. If only for it's fitting.
> 
> Leading back to the other question. Are you able to take a standard horizontal hps/MH bulb, unscrew or cut off the cheap alum horizontal hood and then use the bulb vert?.
> 
> Similarly could you do it for this as well. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Omega-315W-Daylight-Ceramic-Metal-Halide-Grow-Light-Kit-Hydroponics-/262384774152?hash=item3d1759ec08:g:NnAAAOSwv~xXDg6I


Yes but double check your lamp. Not all can stand being run vertically.


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## Flowki (May 22, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Yes but double check your lamp. Not all can stand being run vertically.


Ok will do, by lamp you mean only the bulb itself?, the hoods I've read up on have no warning of wrong orientation. Out of curiosity what is the outcome of verting a bulb not fit for it.


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## pinner420 (May 22, 2016)

Flowki said:


> What if is only used for veg light?.


Get the 4100k then... both are open rated and universal. The bulbs that go with it are coupled on the same shopping cart page as options...


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## Frajola (May 22, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> They're called vertical socket cordsets, they're in both the Sunlight Supply and the Hydrofarm catalogs, versions vary somewhat based on plugs and such. They're very inexpensive because you aren't buying a reflector.
> 
> Any HID lamp will emit some UV. Most such lamps have glass that impedes UV transmission because most lamps are made for humans to see things by (duh, lol but it does need to be said! ).
> 
> Only COB LED has zero UV emissions, which I think is a good thing on balance; first, my ladies don't seem to suffer for its lack and second, one could supplement with UV and run it on a separate circuit; one that shuts off anytime people are in there.


Hopefully my quote is pertinent to the topic, I run 2 bulbs 600w each hanging vert, hoodless , hps + mh spectrum along. An old school grower told me that as a tip for a set up and I don't see any thing wrong w that and I had to hang the bulbs w a vertical mogul socket w a 25 ft long cord so I could keep the ballasts out of the room and *made sure to get vertical bulbs as well.*
Does the combo w led + hids result in better yields ? 
peace.


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## ttystikk (May 22, 2016)

Flowki said:


> Ok will do, by lamp you mean only the bulb itself?, the hoods I've read up on have no warning of wrong orientation. Out of curiosity what is the outcome of verting a bulb not fit for it.


Premature failure.


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## ttystikk (May 22, 2016)

Frajola said:


> Hopefully my quote is pertinent to the topic, I run 2 bulbs 600w each hanging vert, hoodless , hps + mh spectrum along. An old school grower told me that as a tip for a set up and I don't see any thing wrong w that and I had to hang the bulbs w a vertical mogul socket w a 25 ft long cord so I could keep the ballasts out of the room and *made sure to get vertical bulbs as well.*
> Does the combo w led + hids result in better yields ? View attachment 3688386
> peace.


My plants responded better to the 315W CMH lights than they did to 600W HPS.


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## Flowki (May 23, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Premature failure.


Right, thnx. Theirs little to no worry on turning the actual hood fitting vert I take it.


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## ttystikk (May 23, 2016)

Flowki said:


> Right, thnx. Theirs little to no worry on turning the actual hood fitting vert I take it.


The hood itself is just sheetmetal and maybe a piece of glass; it doesn't care. Some hoods have gravity heat vents- they're on top because heat rises- but if you remove the glass it shouldn't matter.


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## Flowki (May 23, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> The hood itself is just sheetmetal and maybe a piece of glass; it doesn't care. Some hoods have gravity heat vents- they're on top because heat rises- but if you remove the glass it shouldn't matter.


All helpful, thnx again.


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## OneHitDone (May 23, 2016)

Frajola said:


> Hopefully my quote is pertinent to the topic, I run 2 bulbs 600w each hanging vert, hoodless , hps + mh spectrum along. An old school grower told me that as a tip for a set up and I don't see any thing wrong w that and I had to hang the bulbs w a vertical mogul socket w a 25 ft long cord so I could keep the ballasts out of the room and *made sure to get vertical bulbs as well.*
> Does the combo w led + hids result in better yields ? View attachment 3688386
> peace.


Which 600W MH are you running?

Hortilux Blue 600W horizontal (recommended) still running strong vertically


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## Frajola (May 23, 2016)

OneHitDone said:


> Which 600W MH are you running?
> 
> Hortilux Blue 600W horizontal (recommended) still running strong vertically
> 
> View attachment 3688877


 High One,
I's running both spectrum w a 600w mh digilux along a 600w hps powermax 18/6. I flipped yesterday 12/12 and start w 2x 600w hps (Powermax & Ushio opti-red) 2 vert bulbs . I picked vertical bulbs due my low budget at that time, and later , I also heard that the hoods could hold a serious heat in the grow room even more than a bare bulb, so that wasn't a option for me cuss my garden is in a attic, yeah some people say it is daunting or impossible, well I insulated the walls, put a ac unit , a fan and created an exit and an entrance for air from out side. It is dry as a desert most of the times, windy and I'm a 28ft high above the street, away from eyes and noses.


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## Frajola (Jun 4, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> My plants responded better to the 315W CMH lights than they did to 600W HPS.


r these CMH bulbs 4 magnetic ballasts?


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## ttystikk (Jun 5, 2016)

Frajola said:


> r these CMH bulbs 4 magnetic ballasts?


No. Run them on the square wave ballast for best results.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 23, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> No. Run them on the square wave ballast for best results.


Can you provide an example of one?

For a 3x3 tent would I get by well with one 315 CMH run bare or would (2) 315's be better, or something else completely? 

My current CMH is the Sunsystems 315w LEC running the phillips bulb


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## kiwipaulie (Jun 23, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Can you provide an example of one?
> 
> For a 3x3 tent would I get by well with one 315 CMH run bare or would (2) 315's be better, or something else completely?
> 
> My current CMH is the Sunsystems 315w LEC running the phillips bulb


How you going to deal with heat running two in a 3x3? 

I'd say one would be more than enough.


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## ttystikk (Jun 23, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Can you provide an example of one?
> 
> For a 3x3 tent would I get by well with one 315 CMH run bare or would (2) 315's be better, or something else completely?
> 
> My current CMH is the Sunsystems 315w LEC running the phillips bulb


Badass ballast, discontinued
Horti Platinum ballast, out of production
Revolution Micro integrated fixture
Sunplix is rumored to be coming out with one.

One 315W per 3x3 is right about the recommended density.


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## pinner420 (Jun 23, 2016)

My ceramic science ballast has been solid however I believe phantom also makes a square wave. If you hang them bare heat won't be as big of a limiting factor as one would think.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 23, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Badass ballast, discontinued
> Horti Platinum ballast, out of production
> Revolution Micro integrated fixture
> Sunplix is rumored to be coming out with one.
> ...


So then for right now I'm SOL lol.....


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## OneHitDone (Jun 23, 2016)

He isn't gonna want a philps 860 in a 3x3.

I think 2 315's spaced to give the vertical coverage desired would be doable


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 23, 2016)

kiwipaulie said:


> How you going to deal with heat running two in a 3x3?
> 
> I'd say one would be more than enough.


You think (2) 315 hung vertically bare bulb is too much?


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## pinner420 (Jun 23, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> You think (2) 315 hung vertically bare bulb is too much?


Noo


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## kiwipaulie (Jun 23, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> You think (2) 315 hung vertically bare bulb is too much?


In a 3x3, yes, unless you can deal to the heat. I have a 600w mh in mine horizontally, but that's in a cooltube.


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## pinner420 (Jun 23, 2016)

If properly exchanged every 30 seconds no problem.. vertical is a completely different heat signature.


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## ttystikk (Jun 23, 2016)

OneHitDone said:


> He isn't gonna want a philps 860 in a 3x3.
> 
> I think 2 315's spaced to give the vertical coverage desired would be doable


Even one would be fine. I was answering two different questions.


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## bottletoke (Jul 5, 2016)

kiwipaulie said:


> In a 3x3, yes, unless you can deal to the heat. I have a 600w mh in mine horizontally, but that's in a cooltube.


Heat? I would say a 315w lec/cmh puts out the same heat as a standard 100w incandescent lamp, maybe less.
The ballast is another story....


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## ttystikk (Jul 5, 2016)

bottletoke said:


> Heat? I would say a 315w lec/cmh puts out the same heat as a standard 100w incandescent lamp, maybe less.
> The ballast is another story....


My ballasts don't run too hot to touch.


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## bottletoke (Jul 6, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> My ballasts don't run too hot to touch.


What are you runnin(brand)? I'm running just the advanced ballasts wired to vert lamps.I'm guessing yours are wired @315w and not the lower 200 and something setting?? I'm running 2 sets of 4 & 4 in fan cooled enclosures and the heat pumping out is at least 140 deg....never touched it, learnt that the hard way but the lamp I just couldn't control myself. Lol


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## ttystikk (Jul 6, 2016)

bottletoke said:


> What are you runnin(brand)? I'm running just the advanced ballasts wired to vert lamps.I'm guessing yours are wired @315w and not the lower 200 and something setting?? I'm running 2 sets of 4 & 4 in fan cooled enclosures and the heat pumping out is at least 140 deg....never touched it, learnt that the hard way but the lamp I just couldn't control myself. Lol


Philips Advance lfsw ballasts and Philips 315W CMH lights. The lamps are in bare vertical sockets, hung between the plants. 

I also run Philips 860W CDM Allstart lamps on magnetic ballasts. They run at 1000W on my 240V service. These are not square wave ballasts, so the lamps are driven substantially less efficiently.


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## bottletoke (Jul 6, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Philips Advance lfsw ballasts and Philips 315W CMH lights. The lamps are in bare vertical sockets, hung between the plants.
> 
> I also run Philips 860W CDM Allstart lamps on magnetic ballasts. They run at 1000W on my 240V service. These are not square wave ballasts, so the lamps are driven substantially less efficiently.


What do u figure the ambient temp is that is radiating off your ballasts? Lower then mine?
Edit(I'm running advanced/Phillips square wave electronic ballasts wired to 240vac and 3100k Phillips agro lamps.


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## ttystikk (Jul 6, 2016)

bottletoke said:


> What do u figure the ambient temp is that is radiating off your ballasts? Lower then mine?


I run my ballasts on 240V service. This tends to help them run cooler. I'd say mine aren't running more than 110F, that's warm but not hot.

The mags are another story; that 30lb chunk of transformer gets to be 140F, that's uncomfortably hot.


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## bottletoke (Jul 6, 2016)

Interesting, gonna take the laser to them and see the temps individually.
Are yours enclosed or open air?


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## ttystikk (Jul 6, 2016)

bottletoke said:


> Interesting, gonna take the laser to them and see the temps individually.
> Are yours enclosed or open air?


Open, always. Heat is the enemy of electronic equipment, so effective cooling is important.


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## Frajola (Jul 6, 2016)

Does CMH bulbs generate less heat than hps and mh ? 
In comparison a 860w cmh generates the same heat as a 600w mh? 
Does cmh need a magnet ballast or it can be ran by eletronic or digital ballasts ? 
My next grow will be vert ( thanks TTY) , lol, so I want to make sure I have a better upgrade for my grow room. Im just waiting to chopp these ladies down. 
Thanks


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## ttystikk (Jul 6, 2016)

Frajola said:


> Does CMH bulbs generate less heat than hps and mh ?
> In comparison a 860w cmh generates the same heat as a 600w mh?
> Does cmh need a magnet ballast or it can be ran by eletronic or digital ballasts ?
> My next grow will be vert ( thanks TTY) , lol, so I want to make sure I have a better upgrade for my grow room. Im just waiting to chopp these ladies down.
> ...


CDM / CMH lights need low frequency drivers. Square wave ballasts make the lamp run much more efficiently, producing nearly 40% more light for the same watts expended.

Heat is about the same in a watt for watt basis.


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## pinner420 (Jul 7, 2016)

I'd venture a a guess of 2 people a month finding their way to vertical on this site! #crushnit$


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## Frajola (Jul 7, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> I'd venture a a guess of 2 people a month finding their way to vertical on this site! #crushnit$


Im just waiting for the last crop , clean up the room and start my 1st vert grow.


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## ttystikk (Jul 7, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> I'd venture a a guess of 2 people a month finding their way to vertical on this site! #crushnit$


Makes me so proud, I get all verklempt!


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 8, 2016)

You guys got to me, soon as I can get the NL out of the flower tent I have to see if the Blue Cheese will work for vert or not and them see about her three sisters, I would like to get the four of them in there vert style with the 600w but we will see. I don't want to break branches on the Blue Cheese if she's gone too far along already but she's still stretching. I working on it, but if the Barney's plants don't go vert I will be with the following one........


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## ttystikk (Jul 8, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> You guys got to me, soon as I can get the NL out of the flower tent I have to see if the Blue Cheese will work for vert or not and them see about her three sisters, I would like to get the four of them in there vert style with the 600w but we will see. I don't want to break branches on the Blue Cheese if she's gone too far along already but she's still stretching. I working on it, but if the Barney's plants don't go vert I will be with the following one........


My blue cheese loves to go vertical.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 8, 2016)

I will post a pic tomorrow she is stretching a lot for an Indica dominant "supposedly" hybrid............

Tonight I'm chopping my first girl so for now the Blue cheese has the 3x3 to herself.........


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## babe (Jul 9, 2016)

Frajola said:


> Does CMH bulbs generate less heat than hps and mh ?
> In comparison a 860w cmh generates the same heat as a 600w mh?
> Does cmh need a magnet ballast or it can be ran by eletronic or digital ballasts ?
> My next grow will be vert ( thanks TTY) , lol, so I want to make sure I have a better upgrade for my grow room. Im just waiting to chopp these ladies down.
> ...


Good Job! (and this) lol


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 9, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> My blue cheese loves to go vertical.



Here's my BC right now after taking the NL out last night. Not sure if it would be too late already to strap her to a trellis. The bulb, socket, and ballast for the 600W MH are all here.......


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## ttystikk (Jul 9, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Here's my BC right now after taking the NL out last night. Not sure if it would be too late already to strap her to a trellis. The bulb, socket, and ballast for the 600W MH are all here.......
> 
> View attachment 3728048


I let mine get bigger than that before I trellis them, so I'm sure there will be no problem.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 9, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I let mine get bigger than that before I trellis them, so I'm sure there will be no problem.


Even though she's flowering already?


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## ttystikk (Jul 9, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Even though she's flowering already?


before the end of week three? Sure!


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 9, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> before the end of week three? Sure!


awesome then I need to get to work and design/setup trellises


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## ttystikk (Jul 9, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> awesome then I need to get to work and design/setup trellises


Don't get too fancy, just get one up. Some hooks on the walls will do fine to hold it.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 9, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Don't get too fancy, just get one up. Some hooks on the walls will do fine to hold it.


This will be in a 3X3 tent  

Well it's over sized the actual dimensions are: 39" deep x 39" wide x 79" tall


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## Frajola (Jul 10, 2016)

Just a question.......Im in veg 12/12 accidentally ( duh) someone " " not me another retard"" , touched the timer and the schedule changed for 15/9 for about 6 days .......SO here is the question. Is that light change enough to cause light stress and therefore compromise the yield w seeds and shit ?? 

Peace , if u can have, if not rollitup. lol


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## babe (Jul 11, 2016)

No it wont, for sure it wont. No worries. That's what poor people run on their's the entire cycle. Even only 14 and their still good, dont get very tall, but limits their energy foot print. Poor people just go with 14-15 for 6 weeks, its enough for small yields. It may decrease your yields slightly, but ya get yer buds earlier. Fear not it's cool! Dont switch back though, stay at 12/12, till there done. Also if your going for seed remember that some seed breeders make their plants so that you can't get viable seed from them. It's called seed copyright or sumthing like that. I tryed it but didnt work. Later...


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## DesertGrow89 (Jul 17, 2016)

Nope, it won't cause seeds and shit. I've ran 12/12 from seed and would not recommend it especially for vert, there just isn't much vigor and they take forever to grow.


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## F1_Grower (Jan 16, 2021)

pinner420 said:


> I'd venture a a guess of 2 people a month finding their way to vertical on this site! #crushnit$


Thats me!


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## F1_Grower (Jan 16, 2021)

F1_Grower said:


> Thats me!


Hi fellow RIU members! 

Im new to indoor cultivation (first time indoor in week 7 flower day 54, open loop system no co2 except mycelium bags lol RH 38% to 48% T 64 F lights on 64 F lights off, running AN Conissuer a + b & line of additives,) so please bare with me. I decided to pull trigger on 4 SS LEC 315 RA cmh bare vert (experimenting with one opened ss hood for a lec 315 cmh re heat/par output)

Just placed an order 2 hours ago for four Sun System lec 315s RA REMOTE cmh, sockets, ballasts and cords to go vertical!

Thought I would also get mogul adapter to replace my current setup two 1k watt hid mh/hps to also hang bare-vert or within a ILuminar Vertical DE Lamp Fixture 315-1000W 120-480V. 

I also decided to get a Sun System LEC cmh 315 Remote hood (ballasts all detached/remote)
[*]Sun System LEC 315 RA Remote Reflector (x1)
[*]Sun System LEC Inner Sun PGZX Socket Assembly (x 3)
[*]Sun System 1 LEC 315 Watt Etelligent Compatible Digital Ballast, 120/240 Volt (x4) hope these are low frequency square wave
[*]Philips 3,100K (×3) & 4,200K (×3)CDM (Ceramic Metal Halide) 315 Watt Lamps 

Just under 1500$ :/ when I harvest in 10 to 14 days my current ice cream cake and katsu gals im going to pull trigger on MAIN lighting source which will be the 
Amare Bar 8 CannaSpec 
to compliment my 2 to 3 SS 315s cmh bare vert , this is after countless hours of research and wisdom from members like @hybridway2

This all to replace my current flip room lighting and add a veg room for gelato #41 cuts i just recieve:
+current lighting in flower room - two 1k watt aircooled hydrofarm and labyield mh/hps, 12 150w recessed full spec white and blue/red leds, and two 2bulb t5s with bloom led tubes. 

Sorry for winded post but Its been hard to fall asleep and run my lights 9pm to 9am so all 'Lux ' hitting my body working in the grow room from 9 to 11pm is messing with my circadian i think

Cheers!

Pics are week 6 flower, a little disappointed with bud size, had lil issue in beginning with aphids and gnats but lost coast /mammoth bt/bti and paint sprayer fogger got em ok and bigger issue week 5 flower had to leave town so now water and mech issue high Temps stress for 3 days. 
Fox farm O.F. med, stealth RO, ph 5. To 6.4 , ppm sitting at 1100, starting flush on katsu but waiting 3 more days on icc


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## gr865 (Jan 16, 2021)

I run depending on the grow two Nanolux 315W CMH. Will run these either vertical or horizontal.

5 plant vertical grow on screens.
Inside the tent. 


Outside the tent.


Facing right, with not net holding them back to the screen. One was added later to support the branches.


Single plant face on and facing right.



Horizontal grow


Both methods work well for me, but I do enjoy Vertical gardening.
Normally I will run a vertical on my first run of the season and the second run is usually a horizontal grow.


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## F1_Grower (Jan 18, 2021)

gr865 said:


> I run depending on the grow two Nanolux 315W CMH. Will run these either vertical or horizontal.
> 
> 5 plant vertical grow on screens.
> Inside the tent.
> ...


I admire your work! Great job.

I plan on making 12 of those trellis tomm. I love how portable, lightweight, and reusable they are. done this before outdoor never indoor and want to be able to walk through the 12 gals (6 on ea side to back 5 x 5 grow room(aka master bath lol) im also building tomm where there will b one hooded 315w lec remote cmh and one recessed covering a 4 x 3 bath tub im retrofitting with river rock, mesh covering hole and plastic liner, promix hp soil, pvc vertically submerged to perforated French drain at bottom helping drainge, watering etc. 

Im going to start new thread re Master Bathtub indoor grow to see if anyone has tips/tricks. I.E. Since ill have to still drag out tub after harvesting in 3 months, what is lighter to put at bottom of tub (and my 12 7gal containers)? I've heard of Styrofoam being used in indoor raised fabric garden bed , could I use 3 in layer of perlite? What about my 'dirt pots' that are fabric I use in horizontal scrog grow? Do yall use drainage rock at bottom or just make sure ur soil porosity on point?

This will be the first and maybe only time in my life ill be able to do such a thing (growing vert in master bath. since moving back in with the moms she wanted me to demo and take out tube so first ima do this with 3 wall trellis.

Are those 5gal, 10 or 15? What in pvc? And did you put a metal stake in back part first before putting the back 'leg' of frame on/in dirt? How tall and wide did ya make it? Im pretty good at topping, lst, hst, monster cropping as I think I did alright from pic above horizontal scrog under 2k watts se hps and recessed blurp/full spec leds.

I don't want be a copy cat re your trellis idea but its just too perfect, so thank you kindly! 

while I was at home depot wish I had material list @gr865 but ended up getting orange diamond plastic fencing instead of green color bc hole size differs, metal stakes 16inches to hold back in place not get dirt all stuck in pvc, 12 10ft 1in pvc, elbow 90 connectors, T connectors, and zip ties.
In my new 5 x 8 x 8 grow room im setting up tomm will have, 25lb co2 tank, 3 bare vert 2:1 4200k to 3200k bulbs with ballasts outside room, Amare bar8 solar spec and one 8" hurricane on minute timer exhausting hot air while c02 isn't running. 

Its my first time setting up co2 and sealed room but the exhausting of hit air will be through master bath hvac to attic/roof. And im using 7, 10 gals and 6 , 5 gals with promix hp. I wanted to use all 10 or 15 gals but hydro store dude said not for indoor bc I would need to veg for at least 6 weeks.... :/ I just thought from your pic those look like at least 10s...bc I was worried with 

I like the saying I heard on RIU , big roots = big fruits but I cant afford to do more than a 3 to 4 wk veg on these gelato 41 cuts that are plug n play ready in 'solo cup' size soil containers begging for those 315 cmhs to arrive tues and led in 7 days.

However, im now realizing this is the fun of growing and being a noob to indoor by having expanded my operations now without even harvesting first run of katsu kush and ice cream cake horizontal scrog pic above yet on day 55. Im also gonna do a thread on help deciding harvest time based on nug squeeze and trich pics, im nervous and upset I let Temps get high to 85 and mech error no water 4 days during wk 5 flower. As this is my first time and since August last year when I decided to take outdoor clones for indoor setup, I've also grown personally and learned so much which I can accredit to this community of fellow growers. 

Thank you.
Cheers! 

Here's some before pics of the 5 x 8 and 5 x 5 im setting up bare bulb vert, yep master bath tub lol

Ill keep ya all updated and shorten my posts my appologies.


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## F1_Grower (Jan 18, 2021)

gr865 said:


> I run depending on the grow two Nanolux 315W CMH. Will run these either vertical or horizontal.
> 
> 5 plant vertical grow on screens.
> Inside the tent.
> ...


I kinda wish I went with your design but all seems to b different is other use Doc https://www.rollitup.org/t/pi-wall-anyone.872303/post-11662706
Used orange fencing with slight backward tilt and a back leg positioned i soil and front secured to lib of grow container.


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## gr865 (Jan 18, 2021)

F1_Grower said:


> I admire your work! Great job.
> 
> Are those 5gal, 10 or 15? What in pvc? And did you put a metal stake in back part first before putting the back 'leg' of frame on/in dirt? How tall and wide did ya make it? Im pretty good at topping, lst, hst, monster cropping as I think I did alright from pic above horizontal scrog under 2k watts se hps and recessed blurp/full spec leds.
> 
> ...


For both of these grows I used 2 gallon smart pots (fabric). I have used 3 gallon but did not need that. I grow Drain To Waste in 70/30 Coco/Perlite using multiple water cycles and a two gallon smart pot out performs plastic pots big time.

The pvc are what the frames is made of.
This frame is attached to the wooden plant stand and is on rollers and can be pulled 20 plus inches front to back.
Space at the front of the tent.


And space at the back of the tent, when the stand is pulled all the way forward.
.

This was my previous grow, also on the rollers but I also put them on a Lazy Susan and can rotate the stand around 320 degrees.


The Lazy Susan


The pvc frame


And how it works.


https://i.ytimg.com/an_webp/rAh2YT2l6ys/mqdefault_6s.webp?du=3000&sqp=CO3TloAG&rs=AOn4CLDk6g9K9g3QD9GkO6gvvBoHHpODqQ



My next grow will be a vertical grow, but next springs grow will be a horizontal scrog and I am going to put the rectangle frame on the Lazy Susan. Got to make work easy on this old man.

Copycat, hell like you I used Marlo's idea, which is actually from IC Magazine, for my frames except I used 2x2 stainless screen. If interested I can give you his full thread on IC Mag. With your room size Marlo's setup would work great for you. Two lamps hung vertical on light movers would be Tit's!

A couple of shots of the plant frames I use in my vertical grows. I have since widened the frame to 22" from 16".


This is how I attach the plant to the screen, hobby pipe cleaners.


All in all it works good, a lot of work. About the same amount of work as a horizontal scrog.
My tent is a 4x4 so that is 16 sqft, with the 5 screens and running vertical it increases my grow square footage to around 30 sqft. each vertical screen is around 6 sqft.
My grows, no matter the grow method, produce 24 to 29 zips of smokable dried, cured buds in jars.
Good luck and if you need any help just ask.


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## F1_Grower (Jan 19, 2021)

gr865 said:


> For both of these grows I used 2 gallon smart pots (fabric). I have used 3 gallon but did not need that. I grow Drain To Waste in 70/30 Coco/Perlite using multiple water cycles and a two gallon smart pot out performs plastic pots big time.
> 
> The pvc are what the frames is made of.
> This frame is attached to the wooden plant stand and is on rollers and can be pulled 20 plus inches front to back.
> ...


Thank you! I do spend many hours a day dedicated to a grow should b automated,, learning each day.. Have a great one.


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## F1_Grower (Jan 19, 2021)

gr865 said:


> For both of these grows I used 2 gallon smart pots (fabric). I have used 3 gallon but did not need that. I grow Drain To Waste in 70/30 Coco/Perlite using multiple water cycles and a two gallon smart pot out performs plastic pots big time.
> 
> The pvc are what the frames is made of.
> This frame is attached to the wooden plant stand and is on rollers and can be pulled 20 plus inches front to back.
> ...


Please send Marlo's ! I git the 2 x 4 x 8 bath tub and that 5 x 8 x 8 thorough through. I would love to do this in bath tub up the walls


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## ttystikk (Jan 27, 2021)

gr865 said:


> For both of these grows I used 2 gallon smart pots (fabric). I have used 3 gallon but did not need that. I grow Drain To Waste in 70/30 Coco/Perlite using multiple water cycles and a two gallon smart pot out performs plastic pots big time.
> 
> The pvc are what the frames is made of.
> This frame is attached to the wooden plant stand and is on rollers and can be pulled 20 plus inches front to back.
> ...


Just out of curiosity, do you use the same lights and total wattage for vertical vs flatlander style?


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## gr865 (Jan 27, 2021)

ttystikk said:


> Just out of curiosity, do you use the same lights and total wattage for vertical vs flatlander style?


Hi there Stikk, 
Yes, I just remove the reflectors.


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## ttystikk (Jan 27, 2021)

gr865 said:


> Hi there Stikk,
> Yes, I just remove the reflectors.


That explains why your yields are the same.

With the greater canopy surface area of vertical, you might try throwing more light, stop your total watts per square foot remains admit the same. I'll bet you'd see better yields then.

Keep up the good work, brother! I always enjoy lurking your grows.


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## gr865 (Jan 27, 2021)

ttystikk said:


> That explains why your yields are the same.
> 
> With the greater canopy surface area of vertical, you might try throwing more light, stop your total watts per square foot remains admit the same. I'll bet you'd see better yields then.
> 
> Keep up the good work, brother! I always enjoy lurking your grows.


Thanks dude you know I appreicate your comments.
Not sure what you mean in the second paragraph? What is throwing more light, stop your total watts per SQFT remains the same?


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## ttystikk (Jan 27, 2021)

gr865 said:


> Thanks dude you know I appreicate your comments.
> Not sure what you mean in the second paragraph? What is throwing more light, stop your total watts per SQFT remains the same?


Jesus, my mobile phone really fucked that one up!

I'll try again:

Since you have more canopy surface area when you run vertical, instead of just using the same amount of light try increasing the amount of light so the vertical space gets as many Watts _per square foot _as the flat grow does.

I hope that's better!


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## gr865 (Jan 27, 2021)

ttystikk said:


> Jesus, my mobile phone really fucked that one up!
> 
> I'll try again:
> 
> ...


Not sure how I can add more light? Any ideas?


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## F1_Grower (Jan 31, 2021)

Hi guys-

Just wanted to thank you all for the inspiration and putting up with my long posts in beginning. Here's a post update of my new bare 315 cmh vert grow setup wk1 veg.

Closed loop running co2 50lb tank with splitter to also begin supplying existing 10 x 6 x 9 flower room(horizontal scrog setup) where ill b replacing my two 1k watt hids with two 250 w viaspectra full spec leds along side my gavita 1k w de slim pro.enabling a closed loop system. Only other way is to now cool those lights with carbon filter air but rather air from house 70 to 75F Outside nor cal bay area 35F to 55 F rH 70 to 85%.
The new bare vert cmh Its a 5 x 5 x 8 (bath tub) and a 5 x 8 x 8 master bath grow. Second ever indoor grow , first cmh, first bare vert.

Running gelato #41 clones, and pheno hunting for katsu in bathtub grow (5x5). 8in AC infinity intake collar, 8in hurricane on timer 'burping' room at 75F. Also will be adding 6in outtake connected to elbow ducting for vert hydrofarm cooltube to run either 315cmh via mogul adapter, or 1k w mh/hps bc of constant coolage which will be ducted out master bath vent via a 6 in to 4 in reducer. I have both 315 cmh ballasts outside grow rooms. Be sure to get 25ft extensions for this.

My first grow in my other flip room with two 1k watt hids and two vert t5s , and 12 recessed full spect/blue_red leds was great except for aphids and wk 5 flower temp/lack of water stress :/ 6in AC inline intake fresh cool air with filters and 6in hurricane on carbon pushing while another 6in pulling outtake. im harvesting first time indoor tomorrow at day 70 two wk flush. Ill attach pics of both grow rooms.

I had to undo hardwire in the phantom ballast/reflector kits I got and re-hardwired to light fixture bracket and yes I got my gfci outlets installed on my 20A lines no problem! Also will be finishing up portable 4ft pvc vert individual trellises tomorrow!

Have two viaspectra 250w leds (each supposedly replace a 600w hid) running at 60% , and two 315w cmh vert( will be adding a third) , the two t5s and gavita de 1000w are both off right now. Temps currently are 74 F lights on 66 F lights off and humidy 56 to 62 %.

Soil Promix HP, A&N Sensi A+B, plusb52, and voodoo juice, PPM 400 - 450,pH 5.8 to 6.4.

Open to any questions or inquiries

Cheers


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## F1_Grower (Jan 31, 2021)

gr865 said:


> Not sure how I can add more light? Any ideas?


Ever think of adding recessed leds or corn cob led bulbs? As supplementation to your 315 cmh


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## ttystikk (Jan 31, 2021)

gr865 said:


> Not sure how I can add more light? Any ideas?


Not sure because I'm having trouble visualising the space. If HID, pack the lamps more tightly. If bar shaped LED, run them closer together. Within a certain range, total light and output are pretty closely correlated.


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## F1_Grower (Feb 10, 2021)

F1_Grower said:


> Hi guys-
> 
> Just wanted to thank you all for the inspiration and putting up with my long posts in beginning. Here's a post update of my new bare 315 cmh vert grow setup wk1 veg.
> 
> ...


Almost complete. Thanks again for all the inspiration and mentorship. Esp @gre865

Im loving bare bulb vert but idk how many times I've almost burnt my scalp dipping and dogging through to vert cool tube,

Up stairs neighbors hear hollow sound from 4in inline if at 70% :/ so I can't run mh/hps so have a mogul adapter 315 cmh. all phantom ballasts out of grow room.


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## F1_Grower (Feb 11, 2021)

ttystikk said:


> Not sure because I'm having trouble visualising the space. If HID, pack the lamps more tightly. If bar shaped LED, run them closer together. Within a certain range, total light and output are pretty closely correlated.


See im just not that experienced with indoor so I have all these extra plants and probably unnecessary light but since I'm running a horizontal scrog 10 x 6 x 9 with 2k w mh/hps , 10 x 150w recessed leds and two 2 bulb T5 leds hanging where my hid par output on sides diminishes greatly. Difficult to have perpetual flower room with horizontal scrog unless portable. This is why I enjoy the portable vert method pvc. And that vert veg room 5 x 13 x 8 has 4 x 315w cmh phillips 4200k x2 and eye hortilux 4100k x 2, two 250w full spec viaspectra leds at 60%. With cool tube suited for either or cmh /1k w hos/mh hanging in master bath venting up through roof.

So far plants loving mixed lighting, internodal spacing and dark green foliage galore!


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## F1_Grower (Feb 11, 2021)

ttystikk said:


> Not sure because I'm having trouble visualising the space. If HID, pack the lamps more tightly. If bar shaped LED, run them closer together. Within a certain range, total light and output are pretty closely correlated.


I think scattered light pattern for overlay design best, and 2:1 hps, cmh for flower

I just finished my vert cmh and led and cool tube setup


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## ttystikk (Mar 4, 2021)

F1_Grower said:


> I think scattered light pattern for overlay design best, and 2:1 hps, cmh for flower
> 
> I just finished my vert cmh and led and cool tube setupView attachment 4822843


Looks clean. Why not start them someplace where they aren't taking up so much room?


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## F1_Grower (Mar 4, 2021)

ttystikk said:


> Looks clean. Why not start them someplace where they aren't taking up so much room?


Your right , its bc im pheno hunting bathtub just for katsu specific cut i lost track of in first grow due to lack of marking. Since thinning out and placing trellis to train they doing a lot better now. Some parts that revegged got so shaded out began to bud bc I didn't take off suckers soon enough .

All other gelato 41s from alien labs doing amazing given my constraints growing 3 rooms in an upside down 'L' shaped 10x6x9 connected to 5x5x8 and 8x5x8. I'm guilty of first mistake having too many plants but not guilty of poor air flow as seen by all my fans/AC infinity lol I know I could pull bigger numbers and save back/money electrical with 3 to 6 train scrog. Here is pics before wk 3 defoliation


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