# Bubbleponics NooB!



## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 7, 2008)

Hey, EBay is a wonderland of cheaper alternatives to the $500 Stelth Hydro setup. I am currently using a 250 Watt ballast that has both MH and HPS and I started my seeds from bag seed. I have been at it in a closet which is about x2.5 and hung the ballast from the clothing rod. 
$170 for the light and bulbs and $40 for the hydro setup...good initial investment I'd say. Only looking for like 4-5 oz a month if I can get a SOG type thing going or invest in good fem. seeds in a fast grower such as Top 44, Lowryder or Hash Plant. 

I germinated the seeds directly in the rockwool (1.5inch) and had good germ in a few days. It's stoner ingenuity that saves me money by using tupperware partially covered on my CPU for warmth! However, the first one I did I let stretch by putting it on the kitchen counter under Fluor. lights for a few days. Now its like 6 inches high with 4 leaves on it! Hope it's a male I can get rid of and forget my mistake. The other ones (4) are right behind it though with leaves sprouting at only an inch or 2 high. I was using 24 hour light but now went to 16/8 because I went the polar opposite of the first attempt and put them under light a little early I think and possibly shit the bed on root development. They all look mostly good though and healthy. Im using GH Nutes and PH Tester. I'm not going nuts and getting a PPM Meter and all that mess. I just want to screw around and get healthy plants to bloom. I will post pics soon enough but I wanted to start a thread dedicated to BUBBLEPONICS only now, aero or NFT or Drip or Ebb n Flow which seems to dominate. Any pointers would help. It's a 5 gal res. with (5) 3 inch net pots and rockwooll inside of hydro rocks. ...any comments? Thanks stoners, stay safe!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 8, 2008)

They look whispy but the shorter ones are stout. after 8 hrs of darkness they all perked up alot and the greenery seems more solid. 2nd set of leaves coming in on the larger one.


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## StealthBud (Oct 10, 2008)

if your using flourecent light you should have those lights right on top of the plants, so there not stretching up towards the light. flouros are cool to the touch and your plants can grow right into the them without harm. i think the norm. is to have those lights 2 inches above the top of the plants.


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## Roseman (Oct 10, 2008)

Man, the light is too high up and away, and that is causing the stretching!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 10, 2008)

Yeah I am using a 250 Watt MH Bulb so the heat is an issue. They are stabilizing in height and starting to fill out a little bit, I need a fan to strengthen those stems. Also going to start 12/12 light next week after they bulk up a little. Thanks for your help so far


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## thepeopleschamp (Oct 10, 2008)

Jizz,

click on the search button and do a search on bubbleponics. Look for the thread by Roseman on bubbleponic systems. A lot of good information. Hope it helps.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 10, 2008)

I am going to do another week of Veg to stengthen the stems. I came up with a genius idea to shorten the res. to now have so much damn unused water in the thing that they dont drink anyway. I went with a Target Kitty Litter Pan with the tote lid fit right over top! I also lowered the lights and am on the way out for an oscillating stand fan. I scrubbed and cleaned the original tote and changed the nutes for a higher dosage and PH bal the water b4 setting the cover in. Roots starting to show. See my new pics...damn they are pathetic! The color is good though so I think they will fight back. Let me know what you think.


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## Roseman (Oct 10, 2008)

I'd say you have 3 to 5 weeks to go b4 starting the 12/12 BLOOM stage.
The most important thing I learned here was it is not normal for children to get pregnant.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 10, 2008)

Rose, what about the people who say they start 12/12 bloom phase right from seed? I am just interested in harvesting top colas. Fan will be here tonight, lowered light and monitoring temp, seems ok. also threw a 12" air stone in the new smaller res. Also the way the stems are any more than 12 hours of light is makin them droop bigtime. Let me know about the single cola thing, im not looking for monster bushes here, just want to get .5 per plant if poss. this is a trial run to see if I'm even really capable pf bringing a plant through its life cycle before I get good seeds. Thanks everyone for your help also


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## thepeopleschamp (Oct 10, 2008)

Oops.....this is why I shouldn't be on here when i'm high. Didn't realize that you were already talking to him


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## Roseman (Oct 11, 2008)

Jizzmaster0 said:


> Rose, what about the people who say they start 12/12 bloom phase right from seed?
> 
> They are doing a FAST Grow, a small yielding grow, a SOG Grow, in a very confined space. They are harvesting 1/4 ounce dried manicured bud per plant, at most.
> It is not normal or natural to make a child pregnant and have a baby. Only mature adults should have babies, same applies to plants too.


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## Roseman (Oct 11, 2008)

If your plants get mature, you will need the bigger tank. Root balls get as big as a commercial mop. To better control water temp, and the PH, you will need the bigger tank.


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## 1puff2puff3puff (Oct 11, 2008)

ROSEMAN!!!!! When did you start back up!!! We Missed you!!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 11, 2008)

I have the larger reservoir that came with my system (10 Gal) so I can switch back to that when they are actually using all that nute solution make to fill it. For the moment while they are small I will go w the small res. I also have noted improved posture with the light being lower, will put up a new pic in a few days. Rose, I messed up while stoned and have had them on 12/12 while giving them Grow nutes! Now Im torn to either go back to veg for a bit or follow thru with flowering a very small amount and going with bloom nutes next week when I change the water!!?!? Got a new Vaporizer and some kind bud, i haven't really been too keen on details for a few days!


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## Roseman (Oct 12, 2008)

1puff2puff3puff said:


> ROSEMAN!!!!! When did you start back up!!! We Missed you!!


 I saw that alot of the trouble makers and arguers had left, and I got invited back..........so I am checking it out.


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## Roseman (Oct 12, 2008)

IF you have the space for big plants, I'd suggest you go back to GROW and let them
get bigger.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 14, 2008)

OK here's the deal. I have cut some skewers short and staked the plants down. I have them back on a veg. schedule of 18/6 w the light lowered to beef them up more (starting today the day the pics were taken). I have an HPS replacement bulb on the way for a few weeks from now. Keeping them on a good growth nute w alot more air, should help them along. I have no fan still on them but that will b here Thu. Hope its not too late to help firm up the stems...anyone? Is this about normal for 10 days growth??


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## Roseman (Oct 15, 2008)

Jizz,
you have something WRONG, but I can not figure out what. Those plants should show 4 or 5 leaves at ten days old.
1,Might be the lights? Lights sold on ebey are all used up, or the owner would keep them. They might "light up" or "burn" or show light, but the lumens are not coming out because they are old and used up. Every few years, you ahve to toss lights and get new ones and those sold on ebey are the used up ones.
2, If you had an irrigation hub hooked to an irrigation submersive water pump, distributing nutrient enriched water to each cup, they would be much more bushier , even at two inches in height.
You might can save them. Try using some toliet paper rollers, the cardboard from an empty roll of toliet paper, to hold them up to see if they will leaf. But I really think you ought to start all over.
I am going to invite some BUBBLEPONIC experts to view your thread to help you, Gr3nthumb and Tesax Longhorn fan.


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## bobbyboy34 (Oct 15, 2008)

wow, those stems are super tall....i'd suggest getting some clones or starting over from seed...too many things have occured to the plant out of sequence for a noob to fix

no offense, just using your language, i'd start fresh and clean, thats just my opinion


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## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 15, 2008)

Well shit! OK I will scrap this grow and start all over. Possibly I went ahead too early on everything so the roots arent as developed to bring nutes to the plant up those srawney stems so growth is inhibited? I will try with new seeds today. Glad I didnt spend top dollar on seed until I can get something growing. Also will have the fan by the time they pop so I think I can go into it w alot more knowledge this time. Wish I knew someon who grew that could sell me some clones. OK, will be back w pics and news. Thank you all again for your help.


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## LonghornFan (Oct 15, 2008)

Jizz,

Just a thought...be glad you arent buying clones from anyone. Starting from seed and growing all the way will help you gain some valuable knowledge. I have learned so much from doing research on this site. I studied and read and read on here for over a month before starting. I also started with two bubbleponic systems and have had a very succesful grow so far. I will be happy to assist you..You might find it helpful to read through my grow journal. Myself and Gr33n started one and we have been posting since day one...let me know if it helps...shoot me a question if you have any..love to help!1


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## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 16, 2008)

Yeah Longhorn I read the journal about your competitive grows. Very informative. I think I should order quality, but not expensive seeds for my next attempt. The bag seed I am using is pretty old I think and not sure it's been kept in prime conditions. Thanks for your offer, I will try to be more patient this time and go for quality and knowledge vs. speed. Will continue thread after my seeds (same bag seed) sprout tomorrow and then start to look like something. Jesus shit GET A VAPORIZER! I'm so baked right now after a 12 hour night shift. God this weed is fantastic!


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## Roseman (Oct 16, 2008)

Jizz, seeds ten years old will still grow just fine, age doesn't have that much to do with it.
Are you aware there are two main species of pot, Indica and Sativa? Sativa is not for Hydro growing, they get 12 feet tall PLUS, at maturity. INDICA is what you need.
And Texas Longhornfan really knows his GROW and can really help you much!


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## Hydrokronics (Oct 16, 2008)

it looks like they are streching from the light being to far away


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## bobbyboy34 (Oct 16, 2008)

ive grown sativa indoors just fine, and boy was it some fire! WOW


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## Roseman (Oct 16, 2008)

bobbyboy34 said:


> ive grown sativa indoors just fine, and boy was it some fire! WOW


In Hydro? how tall did they get? I'd like to see that. I tried it and they got 6 feet tall in 5 weeks and was growing like a wild onion. i only have 8 ft tall ceilings.


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## bobbyboy34 (Oct 16, 2008)

i think i still have pics at home, i'll upload, but i starting flowering when they were like four feet, i have a big closet, closet is 10 feet tall by 12 wide and 4.5 deep

when i flowered i used all red spectrum lights so that the plant wouldn't grow vertically much if any

one was dutch dragon and the other was sour disel


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## bobbyboy34 (Oct 16, 2008)

found it, forgot how bushy it was
oh yeah, and it was a hybrid sativa/indica mix


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## Hydrokronics (Oct 16, 2008)

nice. i like how you used the t5 single and hung them all over. surprised they didnt fall


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## bobbyboy34 (Oct 16, 2008)

thanks, yeah i used some chain i bouight at the local hardware store then attached some hooks at the end, wrapped it around something and hooked the chain to itself, that was my first grow, this time im trying to make it look better, not as sloppy


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## Roseman (Oct 16, 2008)

bobbyboy34 said:


> found it, forgot how bushy it was
> oh yeah, and it was a hybrid sativa/indica mix


That is predominantly INDICA, or it'd be over 10 feet tall.


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## Hydrokronics (Oct 16, 2008)

sloppy works though!! obviously!! how was the harvest of the hybrids?


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## mixin (Oct 16, 2008)

super stretched


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## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 17, 2008)

OK Im starting w seeds again. 5 of the larger seeds are now in rockwool, 2 of them popped after 2 days. I'm going to leave them alone for 2 more days then transfer to the grow cups and put under the MH light for 18/6. The rest should have opened by then. I have no other grow area with just fluorescents other than the kitchen and I cant get the plants that close to the ceiling. So, water/nutes are ready as well as lighting which I lowered again. Will make sure the 250 Watt MH isnt burning them and the fan is kept going. Will post pics in a week or so if things go along well.


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## D2K (Oct 17, 2008)

ok this is my first grow, everything is going fine with the SH bubbleponics system.so far. today is day 1. everything is set up ready to go. Now im just not sure if i should put 1/2 and 1/2 of Grow and Micro nutrients into the tank or just poor alittle bit directly onto the rockwool cube. my seeds have been germinated. Anyone know the proper regement to apply SH nutrients on a daily basis? do i start with seedlings? or should i wait?


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## Roseman (Oct 18, 2008)

D2K said:


> ok this is my first grow, everything is going fine with the SH bubbleponics system.so far. today is day 1. everything is set up ready to go. Now im just not sure if i should put 1/2 and 1/2 of Grow and Micro nutrients into the tank or just poor alittle bit directly onto the rockwool cube. my seeds have been germinated. Anyone know the proper regement to apply SH nutrients on a daily basis? do i start with seedlings? or should i wait?


dude, you bought the system, spent that kind of money and are starting a grow and you have not even read the instructions? How wise is that? where'd you get pouring nutes on the cubes? Straight nutes on baby seeds and baby sprouts is not wise. 
And you are hi-jacking this man's thread? 
You need to go to the BUBBLEPONICS THREADS, 
You need to read the instructions that come with the SH system, read the instructions with the nutes and read the FAQ at Stealthhydroponics and you need to read the threads here on Bubbleponics. Anyone with the SH System can read how to introduce the nutes and in what quanities and when. 
Look here:
http://www.stealthhydroponics.com/page.php?xPage=grow.html
anyone here is glad to help you, but you got to do some reading on your own.
I'm glad to help you but do some reading and studying first!


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## D2K (Oct 18, 2008)

dude, ive read every piece of paper that came with the system, and ive been researching plenty. Ive asked A question that I could not find the answer to. Roseman im pretty sure it was your BIG Bubbleponics thread in the beggining where you stated to mix half of the nutes and poor some of it on the rock wool cubes. You must be mistaken. I am a forum NOOB so here is the quote from your thread.

"Now get a one gallon jug, and mix half the GROW nutes in it, and half the micro nutes, in warm water and stir it and stir it. Drain it through a tea strainer to catch any undisolved little rocks or clumps. Now pour some of it into each cup or cube, just enough to wet the cubes. If you over soak them, they can possible colapse and you don't want that now. If they colapse later,that is OK."


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## sinsemilla666 (Oct 18, 2008)

Man i hate when my seedlings look like that, i have some like that under a fluoro tube very close to them and i think that the main reason they look like that its because they were weak or inmature seeds.


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## LonghornFan (Oct 18, 2008)

Do not nute anything until you see the first set of leaves. Not necessary. The nutes are not doing anything until then and you also can over fertilize causing problems with the seedling. no nutes!!


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## LonghornFan (Oct 18, 2008)

Bobby,

Those tall nice ass looking girls are awesome...I bet that was some killer smoke huh?


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## LonghornFan (Oct 18, 2008)

Jizz,

I am glad you are starting over man, I can not wait to keep up with this grow...I want to see how attached you will be with your plants...woohoo!!!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 19, 2008)

OK here's the update. 5 good popped seeds, the one in the pic pushed the rockwool plug out of the damned way and shot out, this was in the dark on my cpu in a tupperware! I have them under 18/8 light for the moment waiting for the others to push through. As you can see the light is WAY closer than it was and there is a fan about 3 feet away making the little one vibrate a little to stim stem strength. The rest are moist and warm, i figure they are dark enough inside the cube and they already did crack so I'm not concerned...ok so far!?!??? Thanks for the support Texas, will be leaning on you over the next few weeks!


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## Roseman (Oct 19, 2008)

D2K said:


> dude, ive read every piece of paper that came with the system, and ive been researching plenty. Ive asked A question that I could not find the answer to. Roseman im pretty sure it was your BIG Bubbleponics thread in the beggining where you stated to mix half of the nutes and poor some of it on the rock wool cubes. You must be mistaken. I am a forum NOOB so here is the quote from your thread.
> 
> "Now get a one gallon jug, and mix half the GROW nutes in it, and half the micro nutes, in warm water and stir it and stir it. Drain it through a tea strainer to catch any undisolved little rocks or clumps. Now pour some of it into each cup or cube, just enough to wet the cubes. If you over soak them, they can possible colapse and you don't want that now. If they colapse later,that is OK."


That was talking about AFTER you see some leaves and then it is time to feed the sprouts. Or it was written three years ago when I first got started myself.
I must of misunderstood your question, sorry, I was stoned. I humbly ask you to forgive me, I was just stoned. 

Introduce 1/4 to half strenght nutes, when you see two leaves.


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## Hydrokronics (Oct 19, 2008)

Jizzmaster0 said:


> OK here's the update. 5 good popped seeds, the one in the pic pushed the rockwool plug out of the damned way and shot out, this was in the dark on my cpu in a tupperware! I have them under 18/8 light for the moment waiting for the others to push through. As you can see the light is WAY closer than it was and there is a fan about 3 feet away making the little one vibrate a little to stim stem strength. The rest are moist and warm, i figure they are dark enough inside the cube and they already did crack so I'm not concerned...ok so far!?!??? Thanks for the support Texas, will be leaning on you over the next few weeks!


 
things are looking better with her! she isnt as stretchy and looks to be healthy. just dont get too excited the next three weeks are the hardest imo. I would go for an 18/6 light cycle in the early stage to excelerate growth. Keep it up and be carful! 


Are you gonna use the nutes that came with the stealth?


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## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 19, 2008)

Thats good, I have them on 18/6 I keep getting that confused with 16/8...on top of it in my post B4 I put 18/8...i added more hours to your days kids! damn weed! Also no nutes came with my system, it was a good no frills one off ebay and I got GH Nutes I am cutting in with the water about 1/4 - 1/2 concentration. Also upgraded to a 12" air stone. Will post new pics when the others pop out. I also have been monitoring the temp on the tote lid and it is still under 78 so I lowered the light another 2 chain links. I fig if it is cool enough for the plant then go as close as possible, I dont want to fuck up and stretch these things like Goldmember's leg again.
Side Note: I hate my light ballast. This is a total lesson learned with going cheap. Heavy ass thing is also a "mini" meaning it is barely as wide as that tote lid. When I get proficient at this I am totally getting a different one.


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## Hydrokronics (Oct 19, 2008)

go digital if you ever buy another. quiet and WAY less heat


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## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 20, 2008)

Yeah totally, I looked them up and that's what I would be getting. OK the seedling that popped out is still super strong looking and leaves are being made. Of course there's a huge delay in the other 4 popping out, I pulled the plugs and saw the white taproots but they arent shooting out as fast as the first one AGAIN! Why is this so unbalanced yet so repetative? Will keep an eye on the temp n humidity I guess. Just gonna wait. Will post more pix this weekend.


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## Hydrokronics (Oct 20, 2008)

just keep it constant and be patient. thats the hardest part :\


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## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 26, 2008)

Ok finally a free moment to update. The plant that shot up is looking great. Under 4 inches tall in the pic. I think my other seeds dried out so I had reserves standing by. I have another sprout coming up who will be a little behind but I'm not sweating it. No real issues I see. Will keep it consistent from here. I'm thinking of getting some God Bud seeds if this grow comes out half decent.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Oct 29, 2008)

OK heres after another 2-3 days, cannot believe how much quicker the pace has gotten for growth. Only thing though is this is my only successfull plant. I'm missing a step between the seed shell cracking and putting them under the MH. I think a few days in the dark to enhance the roots????? Then another 2 days under Fluorescents???? IDK, but the one is lifting expectations so I think fem. seeds are in my very near future. Don't want to guess about sex and waste all the resources. Let me know what you think.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 2, 2008)

My feminized 5 pack of Vanilla Ice Cream from Attitude is en route. I switched my medium height little trooper to HPS and who was that a fuckin ordeal! I stood there and physically watched the temp rise to 102 in about 5 mins. My little closet is now completely useless for HID lighting unless I have a window wide open and now that it's Nov. I think I'm switching up my game plan to Fluorescents. 6-8 light T-5 unit is going to be bought in a few days I think...that way I can solve my early rooting/growth issues, temp and humidity while still having plenty of light for 5 plants plus more if I want to expand a little if this works. Talk about a learning experience! I have the HPS on 12/12 just to see what happens...the plant is holding up fine though. If I can at least get it to show sex I will be happy...I looked at the first node and I think I see 2 small green whispy looking things starting. Going to do it all right w the new seeds or just give up if that tanks on me lol. No pictures please, this is too embarassing lol...im going to pick up some weed!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 4, 2008)

Ok the stem looks like I been feeding the plant steroids so Im really impressed, also the leaf growth and new developments have been exploding out of the thing. One question though, why do the leaves droop so badly at night in the dark cycles? I went in there to take a peek with ambient light barely there and I noticed they were drooping down low. Perked up and firm all day in the light. Temp is in low 70's and humidity is at 40%. Not sure if this is normal or not..any info? I can see the little hairs on the stems though at the nodes, im super psyched now. Hope she perks up in the light again, will update next week


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## Roseman (Nov 5, 2008)

Give us an update, Jizz


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 5, 2008)

She perked back up again with the lights on. Looks great, fanning out nicely, leaves seem to be getting heavy and crystals showing. where do I look for the bud to emerge from? Also noticed some purple color in stem/leaf area. Looks great, cannot get pics with my cell, the light is too intense...will try with GF's cam this weekend. Thanks for checking in Rose...I also am thinking of sticking with HID lights but getting a digital ballast and a better reflector. My MH bulb seems so weak and the plants seem to lean alot when there are more then 3 of them growing like in the beginning. I switched to HPS and it blew the windows out compared to it. Will check out a local Hydro place this weekend also, hope they have decent prices.


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## Hydrokronics (Nov 5, 2008)

Why do things DROOP at night? anyone?


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## LonghornFan (Nov 5, 2008)

Jizzmaster0 said:


> Ok the stem looks like I been feeding the plant steroids so Im really impressed, also the leaf growth and new developments have been exploding out of the thing. One question though, why do the leaves droop so badly at night in the dark cycles? I went in there to take a peek with ambient light barely there and I noticed they were drooping down low. Perked up and firm all day in the light. Temp is in low 70's and humidity is at 40%. Not sure if this is normal or not..any info? I can see the little hairs on the stems though at the nodes, im super psyched now. Hope she perks up in the light again, will update next week


Jizz,

I cringe every time I type your name...yuck...LOL...anyways, that is normal for their leaves to droop at night in the dark, mine do it as well...Your temp and humidity is exactly at what mine are...matter of fact, mine may get a little cooler at night. They rock though...keep up the good work!!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 6, 2008)

Thanks Longhorn and Rose...you both have ben very helpful. Take a look at this beauty! OK i have to admit I was a little hasty in calling the sex a few days ago...whatever the hell is growing at the plant nodes is a mystery to me thus far. I know I see 2 vertical green spikey hair things growing to a point facing the light on the stems at the nodes but then there's something unraveling out of the leaf joints (pardon the pun) as well. IDK and the pics I have seen don't help me at this stage. However...the bigger point is I have grown a decent sized and healthy plant so I am happy even if its a male. My feminized seeds will be here this week so I can get rolling (pardon the pun) on them too...may go get a cheap single tube Fluorescent ballast to start my seedlings in B4 subjecting them to the MH light..seems the way to go. I really look forward to seeing this little beaut every day! The skunk smell is beginning as well if I get closer to it..beautiful. Checked Ph and nutes appear to be fine, im not fuckin with this thing for another week in any way. Any guidance with sexing would help but it sucks I cant get a good closeup with my shitty cell phone, im stealing my GF's camera Friday while she's stoned and helpless. Any and all comments welcome


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## LonghornFan (Nov 6, 2008)

Jizzmaster0 said:


> Thanks Longhorn and Rose...you both have ben very helpful. Take a look at this beauty! OK i have to admit I was a little hasty in calling the sex a few days ago...whatever the hell is growing at the plant nodes is a mystery to me thus far. I know I see 2 vertical green spikey hair things growing to a point facing the light on the stems at the nodes but then there's something unraveling out of the leaf joints (pardon the pun) as well. IDK and the pics I have seen don't help me at this stage. However...the bigger point is I have grown a decent sized and healthy plant so I am happy even if its a male. My feminized seeds will be here this week so I can get rolling (pardon the pun) on them too...may go get a cheap single tube Fluorescent ballast to start my seedlings in B4 subjecting them to the MH light..seems the way to go. I really look forward to seeing this little beaut every day! The skunk smell is beginning as well if I get closer to it..beautiful. Checked Ph and nutes appear to be fine, im not fuckin with this thing for another week in any way. Any guidance with sexing would help but it sucks I cant get a good closeup with my shitty cell phone, im stealing my GF's camera Friday while she's stoned and helpless. Any and all comments welcome


 
Jizz, 

You wont be able to determine the plants sex until you are in flowering. Hang tight, treat it like a woman, and wait out the ride!


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## Hydrokronics (Nov 6, 2008)

those growth spots on the nodes are leaves and the plant bushing outward. Sex wont be able to be determined till the 3rd week of growth at the eariest


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 9, 2008)

Thanks Hydro, looks like small leaves are budding out of thoe spots exactly as U said. The plant was wilting alot b4, had my GF bring me a larger fan and it is perking way back up now. Still bushing out and growing, new shoots at top keep popping out. Color is good and I made a new batch of Bloom nutes yesterday. Nothing great to report, some smaller leaves under canopy shriveling but not turning light or yellow so I won't mess w them yet. Fig I would trim at a time when they were realy not hanging on. Moved the light up a few inches and w the larger fan the light on temp is about 79-81...still getting a digital 400 HPS/MH light as soon as the new seeds come in. Will keep up on the forum every few days...hope I have a gender to report this week.


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## Hydrokronics (Nov 9, 2008)

be careful with the nutes. I wouldnt use "bloom" nutes either. I would find something with more nitrogen "grow" and use about a 1/3 Strengh at this stage in your girls life.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 11, 2008)

OK it's been a few days and the damn thing is like the incredible hulk. I still can't tell the gender but thats ok cuz my feminized Ice Cream seeds have arrived! Now I will get 3 females to start w 2beans in reserve should the shit hit the windmill. I am going to c the biggun through to the end for another week, since it's the only plant I'm not worrying about it. It has been on 12/12 since 11/2 so the grand total is 23 days old, 12/12 for the last 9 days. I will b patient w sexing...working alll week anyways. In addition to Ice Cream they sent me a single Durban Poison seed and 5 Power Skunk seeds, not bad really with a t shirt way too small for me! If this monster turns out to be a broad I think I will try the next stage (cloning) w/ it b4 going with the big money seeds. Couldn't hurt. Any questions/comments welcome as usual. The side shot is for height ref. only, no cracks about my kitty litter box reservoir setup.


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## Roseman (Nov 12, 2008)

Need help with Root Rot?

Thick, fat, white furry roots are what you most want to see - they are absolutely indicative of healthy root growth. Be aware however that the color of a nutrient solution will stain the roots, turning them yellow or brown. This is also true of many nutrient additives. Older, more mature plants will have a darker cream-colored root system, and some plants just tend to have a natural cream colored color pigment.
*Root Zone Temperature
*The temperature of the root zone and the temperature of the nutrient water solution can have a major effect on the healthy growth and appearance of the root system. In general the temperature should be between 68 and 72 degrees farenheit. Anywhee between 64 and 80 will be OK. Colder or warmer conditions can cause poor and stunted root growth, as the roots don't want to grow into the unhospitable nutrient solution. Major root death can occur in even brief periods of cold or heat stress. Poor temperature conditions leave the door open to root disease.

Some would argue that one of the strengths of hydroponics is its sterile environment, and the notion of exposing growing systems to bacterial and fungal organisms would be self-defeating, if not sacrilegious. These growers rely on sterile growing environments, strong disinfectants and a product like SM-90. Another option is Hydrogen Peroxide. Each of these offer their own protection and benefits. *But NEITHER SM-90 or Hydrogen Peroxide works well with organic nutes or organic additives in the reservoir*. *You can not try to kill the organic algae or pythium and add organic materials back.* *That just won't work!*
They do not work well together and SM-90 has also been known to react poorly with Superthrive.
In a sterile growing environment, your goal is to have a super clean reservoir. This is harder than it sounds. Folks who have been growing in the same area with the same equipment for years might find that they are suddenly having root problems when they never had them before. Or a new grower might begin having problems right from the beginning because of his water or temps. 
Keeping your reservoir totally sterile can work very well, but once you get a population of icky badness it will keep coming back again and again. Some pathogens such as pythium are almost impossible to get rid of completelely. No matter how many times you sterilize everything with a bleach solution, the problem returns. It can get very frustrating and expensive to constanly be battling. More and more innovative growers are moving toward a more wholistic approach of using good microbes in the reservoir with organic nutes or staying with strickly chemical nutes.. 
One option is to use no organic additives at all and to rely strictly on chemical nutrients based on fertilizer salts. We think a better choice is to continue using organic material, but also using an enzymatic addtive like Hygrozyme that will break down the unwanted organic matter in the reservoir . If you would like to use additives such as bat guano, compost or fish-based products, you might consider run to waste instead of a recirculating system.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 13, 2008)

My roots look fantastic, only problem is they are feeding a male plant. I noticed the balls today under the flowering pods. 2 light green furry balls. Im gonna let him live another 48 hours then yank him out of my res and smoke him...stem, leaves and balls...just to be a dick. Im starting my germ of the new feminized seed this weekend after my visit to the local (45 mins away) grow shop. Im also replacing my Shitty old school ballast and totally getting a DIGITAL 250 watt HPS/MH setup instead of spending twice as much on CFL's. I can leave a window cracked and point my fans into the closet from there, small room. I feel pretty knowledgeable going into my next grow and knowing they will be fem is a load off my mind not wasting nutes and power on a boy. Starting w 2 plants I think and seeing if I can clone properly if they grow as well as this one did. I have a 5 plant res but the damn things get huge and bushy, i kept the HPS close to it (12 inches) and it spread out pretty wide...I dont think 5 will fit! I think I will continue this thread instead of clogging the site with another journal...will be in touch next week


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## Hydrokronics (Nov 13, 2008)

damn. im sorry she turned out to be a he  If you can afford it. I would def go with a 400w. They will almost double your yeild and the bulds are pretty cheap. What kinda of hood did you say you have? you can most likly use the same hood that you have and you will be sooo happy you got it!! you can also us MH and HPS of you go digital. gl


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 13, 2008)

My hood is also the ballast, its a 250 w. magnetic coil ballast and I have both bulbs. The damn thing weighs like 35 lbs and gets pretty hot. I think I have the temp control down pretty well now esp. for HPS. I am still on the fence, i WANT the 400 digital but im just afraid of the heat, I know it would be better though for growing larger plants. Will talk to the hydro store people and see what they say...the ballasts are even the same amount of money! I might wind up w it. I was pissed about the male plant b4 but hey, it grew fantastic after losing like 3-4 seeds/seedlings so apparently I learned what to do so it's cool. Just got more money at work so I may take advantage and get something a little better. Will be in touch soon, paper towel treatment tonight for 3 of the new feminized seeds. I fig by the time I get everything Sat they should be ready to trans.


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## Hydrokronics (Nov 14, 2008)

Jizzmaster0 said:


> My hood is also the ballast, its a 250 w. magnetic coil ballast and I have both bulbs. The damn thing weighs like 35 lbs and gets pretty hot. I think I have the temp control down pretty well now esp. for HPS. I am still on the fence, i WANT the 400 digital but im just afraid of the heat, I know it would be better though for growing larger plants. Will talk to the hydro store people and see what they say...the ballasts are even the same amount of money! I might wind up w it. I was pissed about the male plant b4 but hey, it grew fantastic after losing like 3-4 seeds/seedlings so apparently I learned what to do so it's cool. Just got more money at work so I may take advantage and get something a little better. Will be in touch soon, paper towel treatment tonight for 3 of the new feminized seeds. I fig by the time I get everything Sat they should be ready to trans.


 
thats cool. If you can swing it i would def go with the 400w and get a Hydrofarm Daystar AC. They are really nice for 400w. it is air cooled and you can run 6inch duct to it and pump your hot air out and keep temps down. You will be sooooo happy if you go 400w. you will easily double your yeild. good luck bro. Let me know if i can help  [email protected]


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 17, 2008)

OK successfull pops on the 3 feminized Ice cream seeds. Set them into rockwool and keeping in dark moisture fora few days. As soon as they peak im putting them under light MH at a distance. The new ballast/reflector isWORLDS BETTER than the old piece of shit. Cannot wait to see them take to it. This strain projects an early finish (55-65 days) so hope the updates are frequent and positive. Nutes are batched up and the equipment is all clean, hope to have a good finish with these..also my friend brought over some "Sugar Bear" Sat night. That shit was a nice roller coaster ride out of my vaporizer, anyone smoked this? Comments...


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 19, 2008)

3 little girls, well 2 showing their pretty faces. The 3rd is in the rockwool cube but has popped and is making progress now, should be out by the end of the day. I have the MH light up way high and a cover over the container to keep in moisture. The pic is shit but they looks pretty good, so now I am doing nothing extreme or radical, just going to play it out safe. this grow log will start on 11/17 technically so these are only 2 days old. Will update every few days, I dont expect these to stay still very long.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 20, 2008)

quick reply since im dumb enough to try and kill plants that are days old and I paid good money for. I noticed the leaves curling under a little. Moved the light up and made sure the temp is not over 76. Humidity is low but it is winter time. I then tested the Ph and found it to be dark green which means way too high! I added some PH Down and brought it down slightly. I dont want to shock the plant...i figured i shit the bed w the rockwool and the air stone being out for a few days . I PH Balance my water before and after adding nutes, thought I had it licked. Hope they don't get too stressed out from it...they are still pretty strong looking and I think I caught it early. Lessened the water in res too to make sure I'm not water logging them. Going to dress them with water from the res. every few hours and see what happens.


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## Hydrokronics (Nov 20, 2008)

becarful! you dont want to over saturate the rockwool. you will choke what little roots you have. overwatering is easy. The curling under of the first leaves is "normal" it is nothing to freak out about. Just keep things constant and things will be ok. If you have an air stone in your nute solution then it is going to make the PH rise rapidly. All the time. until about day 5 it will level off ( my expirence) You should def get a cheap PH pen off Ebay because using the liquid test will get very annoying after a while. You want to check your res PH twice a day if you can. Good luck and go easy on precautionary messures  somtimes they hurt more then help


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 20, 2008)

Yeah you're totally right, I will look for the pen on EBay tomorrow. The liquid is geting annoying and I dont like how the results are "guesstimated" based on color perception. I agree with precautionary measures, hence why I'm just keeping water around and not mixing nutes ahead of time. that way I can dilute or strengthen as needed. The leaves look alot better now and the light will go off at midnight, the temps have been great, mid 70's so I think I can just chill for a week and let them do their thing. Will post pics mid week, thanks for the reply. Seems your the only one still paying attention lol.


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## spindoktor (Nov 20, 2008)

Quick question for you guys. This is my first grow with CFL's. I've one nirvana bubblicous plant going on three 65 watt bulbs giving off about 3800 lumens per bulb. Im onto day 36 of flowering and im wondering if this looks too small. Supposedly it finishes in 8-9 weeks, and every other plant i've looked at thats around 30-35 days flowering looks twice as big at least. If i could get some opinions i would be VERY grateful!!! Thanks


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 21, 2008)

You hijacked my thread for a lighting question? Yeah that's probably what I would do under a "Bubbleponics" heading. Especially since lighting threads are so hard to find on this site lol!


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## Hydrokronics (Nov 21, 2008)

Yea you did def just ijack his thread so im gonna be extremly breif with my answer. YOU NEED MORE LIGHT!  with 4000 lumens times three is only 12000 lumens. Thats less then a 150w HPS. I am surprised they look as good as they do. you must have done a decent job. I would finish this grow out and atleast double your light for next time if you want juicy fat flowers  


Back to the Jizzmaster...  The PH pen is a must. I have a cheap one at the moment and it tends to be a little off after about a week of use. If your going to go cheap then you should def get some calibrating fluid so you can check it every once and a while. It makes life sooo much easier when check PH of your system. And it does take all the guessing out. also.... what do you temps drop down to at night when the lights are off?? Good luck and keep it up [email protected]


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 21, 2008)

Thanks for the speedy reply bro. I have made some changes here's the sit. 
I moved the seedlings to a CFL 15 watt light in the kitchen inches from the tops. They seem to be laboring under the digital 250 so I thought better to head it off. The temps were really stable. No lower than 62 at night and no higher than 82 w the lights on. Now they are at about 75 constant under CFL. Im worried slightly because I paid for these seeds and im sorta lost right now in my methods. Will update tomorrow when the lights cycle through...I got high w Liz at dinner tonight so tomorrow should arrive in moments...NO HIJACKERS>>>>LETS ROLL!


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## Hydrokronics (Nov 21, 2008)

honestly bro i would use the 250 the whole time. people are gonna say its overkill but i run my 400 on my seedlings through harvest. why not give them the same light they are gonna get there whole lives? just an idea. Thye wont be overwhelmed by light, just by temps. as long as you keep the temps down you arnt gonna hurt the girls with too much light  the more the better again just my .02


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 23, 2008)

The 2 seedlings are under the MH again. Temps are good and they look better. Keeping up on the Ph of the nutes too every day just to be sure. I have 2 more cracked seeds in rockwool taking their time popping out. I put them in 2 tupperware containers with holes punched in the lids and in the closet for heat. Should prompt them along. Def. lost one to seed rot the other day so that's 2 plants growing 2 seeds cracked at best 4 plants. Going to always have one in veg I think when these mature and just clone...seeds are a def. ass ache. Will post pics this week.


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## Hydrokronics (Nov 23, 2008)

true that! Im also gonna atempt to clone when the time is right. I want to be able to keep the genetics that i like arond and get rid of the ones that i dont like. If you keep things going that way you should never have to buy beans again unless you want new genes.

The hardest part of seedlings is taking "too much" care of them. I have found that when germinating seeds and caring for seedlings it is best to just keep them in a humdity enviorment and just check them once a day for moisture and PH. Other then that they is nothing you can do. Let them do there thing and they wont let you down!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 24, 2008)

Ugh, OK im about at the end of my rope with this growing bullshit. Fucking bought everything within reason to "save" myself some buying cash and the goddamn things just don't want to grow well. One is growing great I guess, standing straight up and the othe rone is alimp dick for some unknown reason I canot begin to figure out. 2 more seeds have been siting in rock wool and there's the other fun part, they crack and begin to grow then fuckin stop all of a sudden just for fun! I'm going to ride out whatever survives, get a shitty yield then dump all this shit and just buy weed from whoever. Comments welcome of course!


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## Roseman (Nov 24, 2008)

Feed those babies, they should make it.


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## Hydrokronics (Nov 24, 2008)

Jizzmaster0 said:


> Ugh, OK im about at the end of my rope with this growing bullshit. Fucking bought everything within reason to "save" myself some buying cash and the goddamn things just don't want to grow well. One is growing great I guess, standing straight up and the othe rone is alimp dick for some unknown reason I canot begin to figure out. 2 more seeds have been siting in rock wool and there's the other fun part, they crack and begin to grow then fuckin stop all of a sudden just for fun! I'm going to ride out whatever survives, get a shitty yield then dump all this shit and just buy weed from whoever. Comments welcome of course!


 
I looks like your overwatering to me  That was my first mistake with rockwool  And by the look of the rockwool in your pic i would say you are def over saturating the rockwool. If you get them too wet they choke what little roots you have and you get droopy leaves. I would try to water a little less and/or put a fan right on your little babies, to help with the evaporation of the water in the rockwool. becarful if you do the fan thing though because it will dry them out quickly. just keep an eye on them and keep them "moist" not WET. Its a hard balance to find and is tricky to deal with. Good luck bro and dont give up just yet


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 24, 2008)

Well with the bubble system its hard to see where the water line hits all thepots. I do have a good sized fan moving the air around and the hunidity is non existent in the room even with a small humidifier. I helped another seed along, I an see the 2 emergengin leaves trying to fan open in the corner there. See what hapens. Plus I added 2 Power skunk seeds to the mix just as an exp to see if I am not waiting long enough before putting them into the rockwool. They are in an air holed tupperware sitting oin the ballast for the light keeping warm. We'll know this weekend how many viable plants we are working with and what strains. Cant get the 2 other seeds conf. with the feminized ones. Will check back later


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## Roseman (Nov 25, 2008)

Jizzmaster0 said:


> Well with the bubble system its hard to see where the water line hits all thepots. I do have a good sized fan moving the air around and the hunidity is non existent in the room even with a small humidifier. I helped another seed along, I an see the 2 emergengin leaves trying to fan open in the corner there. See what hapens. Plus I added 2 Power skunk seeds to the mix just as an exp to see if I am not waiting long enough before putting them into the rockwool. They are in an air holed tupperware sitting oin the ballast for the light keeping warm. We'll know this weekend how many viable plants we are working with and what strains. Cant get the 2 other seeds conf. with the feminized ones. Will check back later


The CDs Guide or Instruction Manual tells you how to determine the amount of water, did you read it?
It says to put 6 gallons of water into the empty tank and take a permanent magic marker and draw a line indicating the top of the six gallons. That shows the top of the water so you know how much to re-fill it later. That ensures the water does not touch the cups.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 25, 2008)

The large tub has the marker lines in it, this is the smaller tub I am using for the seedlings. I lowered the water level to JUST at the bottom of the net pots. The water does not come over the bottom so it will be IMPOSSIBLE to soak the rockwool too much. I am going on faith because I didn't think I was keeping the level too high but I guess I will find out tomorrow. Most of what I have read about drooping seedlings seems to be overwatering ...i just don't know why the larger plant just started drooping tonight then. Weird, will update tomorrow when I get in from work.


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## Hydrokronics (Nov 25, 2008)

is it a dwc? and does it have any type of water delivery system?


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 26, 2008)

I am using a 12" air stone in a bubbler system. I drained out some of the nute solution last night b4 leaving for work. Today the middle plant is laying on it's side (brave little trooper there goes how much more money spent) and the other one is still looking strong, root in the water but the water level still under the pot by a fraction. So, I will make sure the little one isn't getting abused by anything else that seems to have one common sympton of every problem..droopy plants. Got a bag of mexican seeds I will apparently have to put to use since I just flushed 4 out of 5 Bought seeds down the shitter. I am germinating some power skunk standar seeds, want to try using PH balance water with no nutes in it and leave them in vented tupperware longer b4 putting them under the big light. Also going to start the seedlings under CFL light for a week and make sure the root goes through the rockwool first. I think Im rushing them too much and they fail on me...I'm going to figure it out. I'm glad I just started smoking at 29...I figure the wasted money is balanced out by the amount of weed I didnt buy in my younger years...throwing myself a bone


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 27, 2008)

Major Thanksgiving breakthrough. I figured out I am being a total gimp and just not giving the little ones what they need. It's a humidity problem on top of me rushing them. Now I am giving the seeds heat and moisture in tupperware with holes in the lids sitting on the light ballast then after the taproot is pretty long I put in rockwool I soaked and put back in container on ballast until the seedling pops then it looks great. Total Noob mistake but I have a system now I am going to use from seed that is working well. My only case now is overwatering. the larger plant in the corner is still looking good, roots larger and in the res. Thats the fem. Ice Cream plant so I hope it grows well. I have 2 power skunk seedlings that are going to go in with her, they are regular seeds so I have to be watchful of the sex w my feminized plant. Will get more pics this week when the larger one grows more.


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## Hydrokronics (Nov 27, 2008)

The germination process doesnt have alot to do with a seedling that is 4-5 days old. If a plant has formed the first set of leaves and its living and then dies, it wasnt because you germed in a paper towel instead of a cup of water  That is a good method for germ but becarful with the ballast though it might get a little too hot for the beans. Plus you dont want ANY water around that thing. You are def having a problem with your system if those babies just up and died  Most common issue with using rockwool is overwatering. i dont mean to push this too hard but you should just try to have the rockwool just a little wet. Soak it nd then swing it in your hand like 4 times really hard so almost all the water is out. That is how damp you want it to stay all the time. You dont want to dump alot of water right on the cube. You should just mist it a little bit every once in a while and keep them covered for the first 3 days. sorry for being so long winded  but you should def try less water. I can tell by how excited you are to get started that you are most likly watering alot  just try using the less is more method. it works Good luck bro. You will get it


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 28, 2008)

Hydro, 

The long winded responses are fine, the more detail for me the better sometimes. The germ process was shitty for me because I had no consistent method. NOW i have the right steps going for me there and I am going to lower my water lev to just touching the bottom plastic of the net cup so the rockwool has moisture but not saturated. I know that was my problem because ever since I lowered the water b4 the weekend the larger plant stuck upright again. The one seedling that popped yesterday am is under a CFL and is looking emerald green and perfect. I figure I'd move it into the big room in a few days when the roots are visible at the bottom of the cube. Thanks again for the good advice. I will update if the new seedlings give me any trouble. I also will be keeping the humidity up higher for the young plants, I think they were being overwatered and still drying out from lack of moisture in the air.


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## seejay (Nov 28, 2008)

Hey Jizz, 

From seed to Vegitative Could take 4 - 14 days then anytime after that is up to you when to put into Flowering, the longer you wait to put into flowering the bigger yeild you shall get.

Best method I have found to germinate is what you are doing now, except I upgraded to a seed heating mat.

I Use the Paper Towel Method Inside a Plastic container with a lid to keep the humidity at its highest until the seed is more than half way open.

Then I put the Half cracked seed into rockwool cube soaked in 5.5 ph'd water(Rockwool was soaked for a good 6 hours, when recommended 24hours)
and I keep them inside the Plastic container until they are sprouting out about 3 inches

When I see the first set of leaves I put them into my Bubbler system. 


All The Best to You

Patience Is virtue!


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## Hydrokronics (Nov 28, 2008)

Jizzmaster0 said:


> Hydro,
> 
> The long winded responses are fine, the more detail for me the better sometimes. The germ process was shitty for me because I had no consistent method. NOW i have the right steps going for me there and I am going to lower my water lev to just touching the bottom plastic of the net cup so the rockwool has moisture but not saturated. I know that was my problem because ever since I lowered the water b4 the weekend the larger plant stuck upright again. The one seedling that popped yesterday am is under a CFL and is looking emerald green and perfect. I figure I'd move it into the big room in a few days when the roots are visible at the bottom of the cube. Thanks again for the good advice. I will update if the new seedlings give me any trouble. I also will be keeping the humidity up higher for the young plants, I think they were being overwatered and still drying out from lack of moisture in the air.


 

You sound like you are def getting the hang of things.  Keep it up


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## Roseman (Nov 29, 2008)

https://www.rollitup.org/hydroponics-aeroponics/7897-stealth-hydro-bubbleponics-systems-110.html
look at the pics on pages 110 to 118. The thread there offers great advise on this SH Bubbleponics system.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Nov 29, 2008)

Well the smaller plants look great, I took the one under CFL and put it under the MH light and raised the humidity in the room. It seemed like it was stretching under the cfl and the leaves weren't opening too swiftly so I am trying out the MH and see if she stands up for the day. The other one germinated beautifully and is under the CFL now and will prob go dark tonight then under the MH for daybreak tomorrow. Will get a group shot later on when they are all placed. Looks good though, I'm glad I got germination process down now I am just worried that my transitions to the MH light may be premature. Any thoughts on a 3-4 day old seedling going under 250 watt MH? Its over a foot away from the tops and the room temp is about 71 w humidity at 31. Comments??


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## Hydrokronics (Nov 29, 2008)

humidity pretty low but you can get by. I would raise the temp alittle as well to atleast 75. 78-80 is ideal


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 1, 2008)

Oh hell, Well i crisped up the larger plant by not checking the PH after I changed the nutes. It was way high, now the plant has withered and wont pick up. THe smaller plant that was in with it is fine though as the roots didnt touch the water yet. So i am going to scrap that plant tomorrow and I got 5 fresh seeds in just to fill space. I keep losing my plants, I think this is my last shot, no mater how well I do with something I miss a small detail and fuck the whole system up again. I am using the free seeds of g-13 power skunk and mexican bag seed just to see if I can actualy find a female plant or strain that will grow without me being here 24/7 to see what it needs. The smaller one under the VFL Dried out since it outgrew the plastic cover I had on it and I took it off...so my fears of overwatering helped destroy that one, hasnt fallen over yet but it will. Anyone know if the larger one is on nute lockup from the high PH? I fixed the res. but its not picking up.  I am so horrible at this...ugh, I think using sative/indica seeds wasn't a smart idea..should have gone with 100 indica or close to it. Going to stick w bag seed, no more buying of seeds and just forge ahead and see what happens.


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## dmoose (Dec 3, 2008)

Dont feel bad, I'm a Noob too, and I'm on my 3rd round of germination (bag seed till I get it right). Having the same prob's as you. I've been reading different threads for hours each night. I've come to the conclusion that I am overwatering too. Now I'm germing in paper towel, then putting it in sm rockwool cube after "Soak it and then swing it in your hand like 4 times really hard so almost all the water is out" like Hydrokronics said. Then into my new heated germination station with a 6 in vented lid open, directly under a 4 ft shop light (1 inch above the lid, 24/7). I plan on keeping the bottom of the tray wet to keep the humidity high and NOT watering the cube unless it REALLY needs it. I believe the rw cube will get all the water it needs from the humidity. I plan on keeping it there until the 3rd set of true leaves start to appear(7-14days?), and absolutely no nutes. Last time I took the lid off and fried the 1st set of true leaves. Once the 3rd set of true leaves start to show, I believe the roots should be good enough to put into my hydro system, and start with the MH at the top and bring it down slowly to get them used to the light.

From what I have been reading, the max light a seedling/clone can use is 375 Lumen. In veg, 1500 minimum/2500 max. and in Flower 2000 min/10,000 max. 

So I believe you need to wait until after you get the second round of true leaves before introducing her to her new home.

If anyone can confirm that, you could save Jizz and I alot of trouble, then we can work on the next set of problems....


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## Hydrokronics (Dec 4, 2008)

im pretty sure a plant uses alot more then 10,000 lumens during flowering. seems alittle low. and i would imaging plant size plays a pretty large part


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## LonghornFan (Dec 4, 2008)

Jizzmaster0 said:


> Well the smaller plants look great, I took the one under CFL and put it under the MH light and raised the humidity in the room. It seemed like it was stretching under the cfl and the leaves weren't opening too swiftly so I am trying out the MH and see if she stands up for the day. The other one germinated beautifully and is under the CFL now and will prob go dark tonight then under the MH for daybreak tomorrow. Will get a group shot later on when they are all placed. Looks good though, I'm glad I got germination process down now I am just worried that my transitions to the MH light may be premature. Any thoughts on a 3-4 day old seedling going under 250 watt MH? Its over a foot away from the tops and the room temp is about 71 w humidity at 31. Comments??


Way to go Jizz!! there is no issue I can see with you putting that under a 250, just watch the heat. over 12"?? is it that hot?


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 5, 2008)

Hey Tex good to see you back. I have about 20 seeds in paper towels trying to get like 5 good pops at the same time so I dont have all these plants at different maturity levels. I have rigged up some tupperware with 2 of them so far and waiting for them to surface. I am going to keep them under the CFL until the roots are really well established and I am using the tub that came with my bubbler system since it has the lines drawn where the water level should be. I am going easy on the lights unless I see them start to stretch or the temp stays down pretty low. I keep losing them between the CFL and the bubbler stages. Something keeps going wrong at this point so I have to be really cautious this time. I am using NO nutes during the first 2 weeks now and going to try not to over water but give the little ones humidity. After this I dont know what else to do. Will get some pics up as soon as there is something peeking, thanks again for the input fellas

Edit:
I also just put an order in for some feminized Diesel seed from Attitude. This is a good quality Indica dominant variety which I thought would benefit me in the ease of growing. It also was cheap. about 40 bucks w shipping for 5 fem seed. I really am hopefull. 2 seeds were cracked and are now in rockwool in my new dome setup i invented. one is peeking through the top of the cube, think it will b ready for light tomorrow. Got my large res working right now with the air stone to make sure the ph doesnt change and will monitor the ph every other day from there after putting the little ones in. I dont like the seeds I have right now. They are mostly pale and green with few black ones. They also are taking 3+ days to pop which seems way long since the ones I bought took less than 1. Could my problems be due to lack of quality seeds? I killed the good ones I had, no question about it but the bag seed just seems to be stunted in general. Let me know. Thanks all.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 7, 2008)

New ISSUE! I am keeping 4 gallons or so of plain PH balanced water in my res with the light on so I can get the ballast heat on my paper towel tupperware and the 5 netpots in it with the air stone going. Every few days, like every OTHER day the PH jumps way the fuck up to like aqua blue color. What could be causing the PH Spike? Is it the light, heat, air stone what? Is there a usual culprit or do I have to break my fuckin balls and check PH every single day and try to adjust it without shocking the seedlings. I have 4 that are going to be ready for the bubbler system in a few days. I dont want to fuck them up since they look good. Any info would help. 

4pm. OK this is ridiculous, I teste the Ph after adjusting it down to 5.5 almost on the nose and this was only a few hours ago. It is now right back up to top end measurement. I CANNOT put my plants in this system until I find out what is causing it...12" air stone on right now with the lights on the bubbler and half full of water...nothing else is touching the water, not the net cups, rockwool or hydroton and np plants or roots...Get back at me , i have 3 days about before im fucked witht he seedlings ready for transfer


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## Hydrokronics (Dec 7, 2008)

you should check you res PH atleast twice a day. it sounds like overkill but the more effort you put in, she puts out  the air stone raises the PH for the first 4 or 5 days of a new res. just my .02 keep it up youll get it


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## Hydrokronics (Dec 7, 2008)

and i would get a ph pen because the water color test is not very accurate. not to mention what would you do if you were colorblind??


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 7, 2008)

Ok well i went apeshit and dumped in enough Ph down to bring it to like 4. Seeing if it equalizes tomorrow...if not then im going to soak the stone in PH bal water with it of and try again befoe the kids go for a dip in the pool. I took pics of the new 2 seedlings of indeterminate seed origin and the exact condition of my bubbler so anyone can see if theres an obvious issue. the little ones look great, strong and vibrant yet again. I was thinking (hoping) that the Ph situation is what was fucking my little ones up since I was assuming once every few days was enough to check it. I also bought a no filter warm mist humidifier that is bringing the RH up to a much more suitable level. So i have a definite seedling care situation that seems to work until i change the scenery and put them in the bubbleponics setup...i think it was me overwatering and using nutes as well as PH, this should be a better time around im praying. My indica dominant seeds are also on the way. Diesel strain feminized..hope I got my shit together for that joyride. ok more to come.


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## LonghornFan (Dec 7, 2008)

Jizz,

How are you keeping the rockwool wet when you have them in the rubbermaid? Also, the pics you have here of the seedlings growing, why are they not in the tub?


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 8, 2008)

Texas, 

When they are in the rubbermade the bubbler system splashes oxygenated water onto the rockwool keeping it moist but not saturated. When the roots drop down into the water the rest is pretty easy. MY PH HAS STABILIZED! It is the same reading (ultra low) that is was yesterday so Im going to bump it up throughout the day when I wake up. 

As for the seedlings not being in said tub, I was being gentle with them under a CFL for the first week until the roots were strong enough. Actually I'm glad I did keep them out since the Ph shot up the wazoo and would have killed the little bastards anyway. I think im learning to anticipate problems before they happen now that I have a reliable starting system. I got 2 good seedlings now, 2 more which had great taproots and should peek today and another long ass taproot im soaking the rockwool for now which means a total of 5 plants which will be in the tub for the weekend and everything should be hunky from there (NOT) but i'm being hopeful. I'm completely out of weed and have no choice but to be. The little ones also are on 18-6 for now under the CFL in 35-45% humidity and they look stronger this way then starting them in the bubbler so I'm sticking with it. I just have to put them in net cups and pop them in with more PH bal. H2O. Any issues u foresee or steps I am taking that I may not need?


See pic, took these after waking up a little while ago. Those are about 3 days old and looking strong, I think i might place them in bubbler tomorrow. will check the bottoms of those cubes and see if I see anything. Also you cant rally see but all the other rock wool cubes have seed casings being puched out, 5 good plants started and the Ph in the reservoir they are going into is exactly 5.5 for now so I will check and see if it creeps up but hasnt in 24 hrs.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 9, 2008)

The big day has arrived. If you look at the 2 largest seedlings clearly they are doing well so I think I am going to get them in the main system in an hour or so. Oddl enough the smaller seedling has visible root for about an inch out of the rockwool on the side. Looks pretty robust. I hope I'm not being too hasty but I think they can handle it. The other 3 will stay for the rest of the week and bulk up. The res has Ph balanced plain filtered water, no nutes till next week I would think. Light is on and the guage is in the room to make sure I have a stable temp b4 putting them in then figuring it out. Will post more for the weekend, hopefully nothing happens before then. Keep the comments coming if anything seems off. Thanks again


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 11, 2008)

Thanks to the unseasonable warmth I think one of the little one cooked. See pic. The leaves are like folded under pointing down and it is sagging bigtime. The stem was really thin though from the getgo, the other plant is a trooper, wide leaves and thick stem coming in. Any idea's what may have caused this? I have 3 others going in later today though so I'm not too pissed I think some of the seeds are just weak personally...older bag seeds and all. PH is perfect, Temp was at 85 with 35% RH in the room until I blew the windows open and cooled down the apt. Is it too late to save the little one? Im keeping the fan on them and the temp lower in the upper 70's probably and the humidity up...can't think of much else to do..also the lights went on at 6am (< 2 hrs. ago)

8:15pm. I have been doing some reading on other forums and I think I know what i'm doing wrong this time. I had the 250 watt MH about 22 inches from the tote lid. Umm, 2 close for seedlings? This would explain why the larger plant is not as affected since it is a little more developed and why the smaller one just shepherds hooked down like that after looking good under the CFL. I raised the MH to about 2ft now from the tote lid which also lowered the temp down to 79-80 and the RH is still up in the 40's. I have 5 plants now, one on the way down the shitter and 4 viable little uns. Hopefully the light situation will rectify the little ones dying out on me. Can't believe I didn't check up on that ahead of time like the other details. Oh well, the feminized diesel should be here next week and I have a few weeks off from work to really keep an eye on them. I also changed the light schedule so they wont go on until about 5 mins before I walk in the door from work instead of being on while I'm not home. Hope these measures help out. The 3rd pic os of the whole big pic setup, I left the water jug in there for some scale but I think it's about right now. Comments always welcome


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 14, 2008)

Wow, what a difference moving the light up made, this was the missing piece it seems. I have 3 good looking seedlings growing pretty well now. The smallest one has a whispy stem so I give it 50/50 but I have the fan on them so hope it strengthens. The largest one is bushing outward and new leaves are growing vigorously but curling under as u can see. I also found a 2nd fatal flaw in my system from a week ago. When I was putting the setup back together after cleaning I forgot to plug the light into the timer, it was in the power stip meaning the plants were getting too much light/heat as well as 24 hours of it! (smacks forehead). So, with that all solved I dont go into that room expecting a nightmare anymore, they have been predictable and stable now so I will get pics up during the week when they look alot more substantial. the 2 smaller ones are about 4-5 days behind the larger one. 

Side note; I had some Sativa dominant weed this weekend, wow what a difference in the high. I couldnt stay still I was going from room to room switching from Youtube, Itunes, TV Shows on my DVR and whatever DVD i had going. Social buzz bigtime, might try to have both on hand and see what mood i'm in, i do love the couch lock high near bedtime.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 17, 2008)

And then there were 2. Well 1 and a half really. the smaller one is leaning for no reason and getting soft looking. Not over/under watering, PH is fine, RH is at 40 w temps in high 70's so it's inexplicable to me. Changed water yesterday and monitoring/raising the PH as needed 3 times a day. The light is still high enough off them to keep the temp low but the little one just doesnt want to hang in there it seems. Same as the others, I just let them go. These seeds are terrible. At this point I know what the plants need during all stages and have gotten my methods down so I think it's rotten luck/seeds as well as the learning curve. Hopefully my indica seeds arrive this week. I am off work until January 4th as of today so I have alot of time to devote to the little ones. Will start the larger plant flowering to determine sex late next weekend. Figure at about 8 inches or so and if it's a male then I don't waste as much time, if female I can always go back to vegging and cut clones. Wish me luck, comments not expected anymore at this point lol.


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## Roseman (Dec 18, 2008)

Adjusting pH more than .4 (four -tenths) in a 4 hour period will kill them dead! Going from 6.0 to 4.0 in one adjustment will surely stress them to death.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 18, 2008)

Well the current Ph is about 6.3
I have not changed it at that drastic a measure. Maybe about 1 full point in 3 hours. I have been on top of it since the water change. Hasnt risen over 7 or under 5.5 overall. The larget plant looks fine, roots are robust, white with little hairs on them and emerging like a banshee. no worries there. The smaller one has emerging roots but just doesnt seem to have the will to live. Oh well, got more cheap shit seeds soaking now in a shot glass of water, trying to sink some in water and see if they pop faster under heat in paper towels after 24 hrs. I also read that the aerated reservoir systems are the worst for beginners since they work so fast there's little margin for error. I gues an ebb n flow would have been a better choice. Oh well. working with it. More to come.

:-0 Oh haha, few hours later...found out a little nugget. There was a crack in my air line right at the connection to the air stone so no small oxygen bubbles were forming from the stone. Just a teady stream of large ass bubbles coming out of the crack not really doing much! I clipped the bad piece off and rehooked, works better than ever now. Lol. i am CURSED! Gotta keep jotting shit down to check every day. Thought that may be helpful. moved the small plant to a more bubbly spot now to see if underwatering and under oxygenated water was the culrpit...still looks good, may make a comeback. The larger one also still looks great and standing tall, roots look beefy and searching out water bigtime. Hope its female...really hope its a girl


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 19, 2008)

Well overnight and for some of the morning light the plants both look fine. The one that was lagging down looks a little firmer with the water level increased and the air stone fixed. Ph is still 6.3 and just waiting now. I noticed the leaves on the larger plants are curly at the ends except for the bottom 2 fan leaves. Weird looking but healthy and the stem is thickening up nicely. Pics tomorrow or later maybe if I get bored and they look perkier


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## bobbyboy34 (Dec 19, 2008)

Roseman said:


> Adjusting pH more than .4 (four -tenths) in a 4 hour period will kill them dead! Going from 6.0 to 4.0 in one adjustment will surely stress them to death.


 
well my friend, i initially set my ph to 5.3 and let it rise to no more than 6.1, once it gets there i put it back down to about 5.5 and it end up rising to 5.8 and hovering there for a couple days...my plants are still alive

maybe im misunderstanding you, but thats more that .4...also 4.0 is really low, who would go that loW? 5.0 is too low, but from what i hear flowering PH is supposed to be lower than veggin ph, have you heard anything about thiS??


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 19, 2008)

At this point I'm simply sticking with giving the plants what they need. My PH has leveled off about 6.0. 5.5-6.5 is the best range from what I've seen so I stick with it. The smaler plant seems to have bounced back for the time being. I think it was not getting enough spray from the dead air stone and such. Looks more stout now and the larget one...keeps getting larger but I dont like the leaf growth. PLUS My feminized Diesel strain arrived today. Not sure what to do with it though since I have 2 so far ahead. will wait for them to reveal sex and then go with the fem or whatever. Will post pix soon.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 21, 2008)

2 plants still growing pretty well now. I changed the water, got the Ph adjusted and stable and now I think they need nutes in greater concentration than I gave them. I only mixed in one gallon of water nuted with the rest plain. The stems and original 2 leaves are slightly yellowing as u can see. Nitrogen def.? The light level seems to be fine and the RH is also good. Just staying the course and I popped a few more seeds just for shits and giggles. Maybe I can add a few more strong ones to the party and flower them early with the larget ones. So, any comments on the yellowing welcome but I think it's ok. The new growth is coming in green and its still growing smaller leaves at nodes. Im optomistic about both of them especially since the smaller one came back so strong from its near death exp. More to come.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 24, 2008)

Here's the twins, still going strong. The smaller one seems to be really moving beter with a stronger root structure and better foliage. I am not sure what my Nute concentration is but it is really light. The leaves and new growth seem to be yellowish but then start synthesizing better and green up. Guess thats normal, I take a pic every day and see the progress. As you can see I used a few deli cups wgich I cut down to make mini domes for the 2 new seedlings which have been in there 2 days now with no issues. keeps the RH up for them higher and blox some of the harsh HID light for now. One of them already has an emerged root. 3 days old! So, nothing much else to report, seems like my thread is dead so I may discontinue it. Going away for 2 days this weekend, should be fine I wont change anyhing till I get back but mostly I just refill the humid and check Ph twice a day and dont worry about them anymore. Questions/Comments welcome...but before you say anything I know i need a combo PH/TDS meter...it's in the works. Happy Holidays to everyone.


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## dmoose (Dec 25, 2008)

Merry Christmas JizzMaster0,



Jizzmaster0 said:


> So, nothing much else to report, seems like my thread is dead so I may discontinue it.


Dont do that! We are very interested in your success!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 26, 2008)

So the plants are growing fine but are comin in pale now. I am pissed that I have 2 small ones in early development along with a 3 week old plant. Now the nutritional needs are different I think. I am going to change nutes today to make sure they have nitrogen which is why the yellowish new growth is also slow growing I would imagine. In addition I have leaf edges curling up see photo. Not sure if it is a heat or water issue. I have the water level lower than marked for adult plants w roots but not low enough for the seedling mark and the heat isnt going over 80 w the lights on. Humidity hovering at 35-45 w the light 2ft. off the tops. Any ideas would greatly be appreciated, leaving town for 2 days this weekend, dont want to come home to dead plants! Hope someone gets back at me quick...


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## Hydrokronics (Dec 26, 2008)

if you are about to leave town, dont change the nutes!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 26, 2008)

Understood, the water is back in the fridge....any takers on the curling yet? Am I right about the N deff. making them pale green?


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## Hydrokronics (Dec 26, 2008)

If you change the nutrient solution you will need to be round for the net 2-3 days to adjust the PH as it goes up from the airstones. I find that it always goes up for about that long and then levels out at what you set it at until it begins to go slightly acidic. If you dont have a PH pen then you NEED to get one because there is no way to tell if it is a nitrogen problem when you are not exactly possitive what your ph is. You could be locking out nitrogen if your ph is too high. The is a little chart that comes with the GH liquid test that shows you when what nutrients can be used and what PH is best. 

The hardest part is that every strain likes different PH (IMO) you should get a pen and use the GH PH up and Down and get things constant for your ladies 

Good luck but def dont change your nutes!! i have sen what happens when you leave and come back to a 7.5 PH because they were adjusted and maintained after they have an airstone added to them  GL

[email protected]


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## Hydrokronics (Dec 26, 2008)

hope that helps   GL bro!


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## Hydrokronics (Dec 26, 2008)

I have then same curling on my organic Hydro grows. What type of nutrients are you using. I still havnt identified exactly what it is, because it is def not a heat issue for me. I do know that as long as it doesnt get any worse then that you will be fine and she will still mature.


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## Hydrokronics (Dec 26, 2008)

also, are you using 1/4 strength still or have u started using alittle more? do you know your PPM?


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 26, 2008)

Damn Hydro you're allowed to edit your emails to add more if u forget something! No you're absolutely right though. This shit is bag seed that wasn't all that hot even the last time I got one to grow. I have my Diesel seeds Fem now and they are Indica dominant so i think they will be a little more stout and I can always look up the specifics on what she likes. As far as the Ph goes it's almost neutral. I don't think thats really an issue, the roots looks strong and are plump looking, I'm really not going to worry about it until they start drooping over. The scheduled nute change is monday so when I am home and have all day I will rip the system apart, clean it up and re nute with like 1/4 strength and see how the color improves. the adult plants are going to need it and I put alot of effort in so they are priority. I am using GH nutes Grow and I was topping the water of with a nute solution that was also light because I was going from just pure water and wanted to feed them slightly...so its not an overnute issue, it was lighter than 1/2 the whole time after pure from the start. I dont know my PPM, dont have one of those


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## Hydrokronics (Dec 27, 2008)

How may gallons is your res and how much GH floragrow are you adding?


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## Hydrokronics (Dec 27, 2008)

might be a def


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## netpirate (Dec 27, 2008)

your grow is looking good. The first one was a big stretch. Hopefully you get good things from this. I have a DWC setup with lighting that many ppl on here dont like. Im using cfl's and a small 70w HPS security lamp converted to grow light. All DIY!! This is my current (first) grow @ around 2wks of flowering.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 28, 2008)

Well I think I have about a 6 gallon tub. I was so worried about my babies over the weekend but when I came in the color looked good, they spread way out, got taller and got deeper in color in less than 48 hours. See the pics. I trimmed some leaves off the bottom that were in the shade before I left, want to trim the wider ones as they grow to keep them narrower while making sure they take enough light and respirate well. I'm going to change the nutes tomorrow to a fresh and precisely measured 1/4 strength. Will get more pics later this week if they keep doing well.


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## Roseman (Dec 29, 2008)

Jizz, yu have a 8 gallon tank that holds 6 gallons of water for optimum performance.
And your plants are ready for full strenght nutes.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Dec 29, 2008)

Rose, 
Thanks and I agree with you which is why I measure out from 3/4 strength to full strength nutes. I left one jug plain water just in case. I would hate to burn them and then have to flush and lose time or the plant. I did the changeover in record time with the small tub full of PH bal water and the air stone in it while I scrubbed the large one, was quick and clean. Pics will come this weekend supposing everything continues to go so smoothly, really have no complaints on this grow so far...seems I could be ready for the high quality seeds after I see this through. Hoping to show sex on the largest one in a few days. the largest one FYI is 23 days old The rest are from 5-whatever days behind..hope the largest is a female so i can clone off her and try that on for size. Will update soon


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## dmoose (Jan 3, 2009)

Hey Jizzmaster0 - just wanted to point out a new thread on Microsexing before taking clones. Earl shows how to tell sex before 12/12! Read the thread, he looks at the 8th node, which should be perfect timing for you. I am at day 18 from popping out of the soil. Yes, I said soil. Mine is 8.5 inches tall, and completely fills the inside of a 9.5 inch square bucket! The 8th node is just starting to form, so I will be hoping to get early signs of SEX! Good Luck! I hope they are all Females!

https://www.rollitup.org/hydroponics-aeroponics/38684-micro-sexing-before-taking-clones.html#post1864087


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## Jizzmaster0 (Jan 3, 2009)

Moose, thanks for the link! The lights are out right now ut I switched to HPS and 12/12 as of today. I will check them out in the AM when they go back on, They also go over this method of early sexing in the Jorge Cervantes book/DVD where u flip down the spike and see the little male nut or as u said, more obvious fem pistil. My kids are growing up slow as they are bag seed and probably not the hardiest strains! Thanks again for the useful info, happy growing and hope your kids grow up big and strong!


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## noonehome (Jan 4, 2009)

jUST CAUGHT UP ON THIS THREAD TOO BROS
hAD TO GET ME AN AVAATAR
WHAT DO THINK?


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## Jizzmaster0 (Jan 4, 2009)

NOONE, sweet avatar, I have to get a T shirt that has that printed on it just for shits n giggles. Update: The plants are growing well but I have a bad feeling about Gender again. I have the HPS on 12/12 as of yesterday lights on and they are growing very well but I looked at the spikes at the nodes up high and think there might be a bump indicating a male pre flower. I really didnt expect much out of these plants as I mentioned b4 they are bag seed from a non reliable source. I have just been having fun getting my methods down and having a consistent plan for my shit. I have the Feminized Diesel ready to go and more good news, I am moving to a HUGE place with my GF that has massive walk in closets and extra space for growing so it should work out very well with the new seeds in a few weeks. I will see these through to the end and hope for the best. As u can see the smaller ones are leggy and not that great looking but non of them were really super. I'm just happy I know what I'm doing now for real and think when I start the new seeds I will do 2 plants at a time. One reason being it's way easier to prove personal use and jesus these things turn into Azalea Bushes when they start eating! I think im going to get a new tote lid and cut 2-3 larger holes in it for 4-5" net pots and really give them their space to grow out. I may start a new thread/journal when the diesel seeds pop in a few weeks when Im situated so hopefully everyone stays interested. Largest plant age is approx. 29 days now. I am also in love with the 250 Watt Lumatek Ballast and Daystar hood, wish I had started with that. I also am going to go with GH Flora Nutes that are more liquid and less sludgey than the GH ones I have now. they are staining the roots and leaves a film on the tote. Ok no more huge entries...enjoy the pic and will update later in the week.


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## noonehome (Jan 4, 2009)

Bro I think your little ones are going to get covered
I got 5 out of 6 bag seeds left in my bubbleponics and just went to flower yesterday
Only one succesfully perfloered female, but if they are no boys I am going to have to wack a girl pretty soon
Bnut same as you just practicing this time

noone


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## Jizzmaster0 (Jan 7, 2009)

DISSAPOINTED! Ok not really I had an idea the little shits would be male but I had a percentage of hope hanging in there. I see little green bud heads at the nodes so I guess the largest one is male. 

Is there ANYTHING? I can do with it other than stuff it down the garbage disposal???

The rest look stout, Ph didnt skyrocket with the Bloom nutes like it usually does with the Grow nutes. That was nice. 

I started 2 seeds of the Fem Diesel late last night while cleaning. I'm not wasting any more time or resources. Gota get my green on. 

I am also going to get a 10 gal tote and rig it up for 3 plants with 4" netpots..this this is really small as u can see i dont think 5 plants would do a damn bit of good in it for 3 months. 

Thats about it, I will let them live a few more days since I just changed the nutes. Y not right? Any input on whether I can do anything with the leaves would help,,,i know it's not worth it but throw me a bone here. 

At least if I move in a few weeks they will be strong enough to take it and get them situated for flowering. Thanks for the support, enjoy the pic.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Jan 8, 2009)

Well fuck it I got too pissed to wait for replies to I stomped their asses down the disposal and now all 5 fem seed are in water. Another month of waiting and waiting and then some more waiting and waiting a little longer. Obama better fuckin legalize this shit im really getting tired of sneaking around and trying to grow my own shit and dealing with inconsistent sources in the meantime. 2 more smaller yet still stretched plants are waiting to show me gender...not like it will make much diff if they are stretchy. In any case, hopefully the new seeds will pop today. Had 2 of them in paper towels since Yesterday AM but no pops yet, the paper towel got a little dry though so i douched them and covered the tupperware back up. Looking at a temp layoff at work thank fucking god so I am booking a flight to Amsterdam for March Probably and going to get demolished every fuckin day im there. Then maybe with a few months off I can actually get some decent plants going. Wish me luck, I'm done with this thread, thanks for all the support and interest.


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## dmoose (Jan 9, 2009)

I wish I would have caught you Yesterday before you "stomped their asses down the disposal". I found out that even though
Males are generally a waste of time to smoke, you can use them to make Hash, and different Edibles. 

I hate to admit again that you are not alone, but I wanted to try to Micro Sex, and yes it does work, and Mine is Male too.

Here is a pic of Lil J at day 25 from seed, 24/7 veg under 2 - 4 ft flouro shop lights. GrowLux bulbs (2 - 6500, 2 - 3100)






Pic of Male sacs, and when they appeared, they apperared on Nodes 6,7 and 8. They first appeared on day 24 of veg.





I was gifted some Leonard Peltier seeds recently. I was told that 1 plant can fill a 3'x3'X6' area nicely. Has a 12 week Flower Period, 
and is supposed to KICK ASS! 

I think we both proved we can do it now. Hopefully the Ganja Spirits, will grant us Females this go-around!




_Entertainment purposes only, Blogger does not really grow/smoke marijuana?_


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## Jizzmaster0 (Jan 9, 2009)

Yeah moosey I feel the same way. Only problem is I have no source until I get my own grow going. The other 2 seeds havent popped yet but the other 3 are in water for 24 hrs so hope so. Fucking people we have been dealing with are such ass clowns. They say we can buy through them and its no problem but then when we call we get the fuckin story of how we can only get 1/4 at a time and they need weeks and weeks notice and then they fucking judge about how much we smoke. is 1/4 in 2 weeks that much? Apparently getting a direct source is impossible unless you knew the fucker since you were 12 also and no one over that age can cultivate (pun) a relationship. Sick of this bullshit legal system in this country. OK im done ranting. Good luck on your new seeds Moose, wih me luck in getting 1/8 if we beg hard enough and pray the planets are all in alignment and people arent too flaky to actually do us a favor when they say they will. I fuckin hate people. I really do.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Jan 12, 2009)

Just got back from target and upgraded my tub to a 10 gallon short style rubbermaid. It is thicker walled than the other one with a bigger lid. I am going to cut this one for 4 plants I think and give them alot of space. Here's a question though. If I was using 3" net pots still what is the best way to cut those holes in the tote lid? I have a cordless drill and a dremel rotary tool but not sure the easiest and cleanest way to make the holes. The 2 stretchy plants are still doing fine, no gender yet though. 2 seeds popped, one has peeked and the other 3 are on their way. Should work out fine and in 3 weeks when I move they should be strong enough to take the quick relocation. OK get back to me ASAp on the new tote lid I want it done by tomorrow, thanks all


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## Roseman (Jan 12, 2009)

I drew a circle around the cup, with a broad magic marker, and then used a drexel spinning wheel to cut it out, leaving the black marker still visable. Be sure to Make the hole smaller than the cirle.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Jan 12, 2009)

Rose, thats cool, I have the dremmel, just need to get a cutting disc then I think. I will work on that tomorrow. The plants will have a goodly amount of space to bush out now instead of getting in each others way. I fig I will have one mother plant going at the time under a CFL in another closet and then be able to cut and flower 4 clones when needed. Thanks again for the quick reply.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Jan 15, 2009)

Whoa, holy hell, this may be premature but the one largest plant of the 2 that were stretchy looks to be female. I am checking the topmost node and where the branches meet looks to be small whitish hairs emerging. Nothing like the balls I'm oh so used to seeing. I got 2 good strong seed pops out of the feminized stuff and they look great too so now I have another problem, how to keep flowering the one female, possibly revegging it and still making the new ones grow without stretching, I need a CFL fixture I think with a 100 watt min bulb for the little ones. I Have a 42 watt on them now at like 4 inches away so the roots should get nice and burly. Im really jazzed though, I am home until Sun night so I can keep an eye on them, will keep them on flower and see what develops. My seeds are a little dissappointing though. 2 have been in paper towels for 3 days now and havent popped, 2 have popped well and one I let dry the fuck out in the rockwool by mistake, oops. But not a bad average if I can get them growing again. Will update later, I know I said I was done with the log but fuck it, this is too good to not share, pics later, comments welcome


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## Jizzmaster0 (Jan 17, 2009)

Wow, I am pretty impressed. I see bud points now in several areas with double white pistils popping out. She is LEGGY! I am goin to get something out of it though. I decided to continue flowering and the 2 seedlings I have going will be under a dome with a CFL on them for the first 2 weeks. I HAVE to get my 2nd bubbler system put together today so they have a home when roots start needing real substance. I am thinking of getting another short/wide tote like the rubbermaid and having 3 plants per tub and have alot of bush room. wont be hard to make at all. Also will enable me to have 3 flowering and then 3 vegging in sep areas. So, see the pic, yes, I know she is stretched, see above posts for why. Will be changing her nutes today also, the other plant turned out to be male so I trashed him too. so one flowering female and 2 feminized diesel on the way, will update later in to next week.

Note: I also included a pic of the brandy new hydro setup i made from scratch. Pretty proud of it, this way the mature fems can have their space...prob cost me a grand total of 28 bucks to make so i think im going to have 2 of them cycling between veg n flowering. Cant wait to set my new place up with everything


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## dmoose (Jan 22, 2009)

Jizzmaster0 said:


> Wish me luck, I'm done with this thread, thanks for all the support and interest.


I am glad you didnt call it quits!



Jizzmaster0 said:


> Fucking people we have been dealing with are such ass clowns. They say we can buy through them and its no problem but then when we call we get the fuckin story of how we can only get 1/4 at a time and they need weeks and weeks notice and then they fucking judge about how much we smoke. is 1/4 in 2 weeks that much? Apparently getting a direct source is impossible unless you knew the fucker since you were 12 also and no one over that age can cultivate (pun) a relationship. Sick of this bullshit legal system in this country.


That Sucks! What general area do you live? City or State?



Jizzmaster0 said:


> Note: I also included a pic of the brandy new hydro setup i made from scratch. Pretty proud of it, this way the mature fems can have their space...prob cost me a grand total of 28 bucks to make so i think im going to have 2 of them cycling between veg n flowering. Cant wait to set my new place up with everything


You did an awsome job on that setup Jizz! OK, Here is where it gets interesting! You need to build 1 more, so you have 2 in the flower room under the 250w HPS. I measured my lid for the 18 gal, and it was 16" x 22", so yours should be slightly smaller. If you put them side by side, you would be using an area of about 22" x 32". Which would be just under 5 ft sq, so you would have just over 50 watts per ft sq. And by setting up a separate Mother/clone area with CFL's or even the 40 watt shop lights. You could have a 4 week Perpetual grow Set-Up, and Harvest 3 plants every 4 weeks! That would be 3 in veg for 30 days, 3 in 1st month of flower, 3 in 2nd month of flower. Take your clones from the veg plants just before putting into flower, as you harvest 3 plants. And if you make 2 more tubs, all the same size, it would be easy to move just the lids from veg to flower.

I recently built a Portable 2'x2'x4' Veg Box, which will go into my Flower Room when I finish building it in the Basement. I used two 4 ft - double bulb shop lights with 2 6500k Grow Lux bulbs, and 2 cheap 3100K bulbs. Here is a pic of my new Cabinet. BTW, the 3 on the left have been confirmed Females, the one on the right is the Male we previously talked about. I have been experimenting, and torturing him. I did LST and loved how it increased the Bud Sites! I may try topping it next to see how that effects it. I want to have the tecniques down before I perform them on the girls!







I plan on doing a similar Perpetual Grow, thinkin maybe even a 2 week/2 plant perpetual for starters, and when I have some stock curing, I would cut that back to a 4 plant/4 week Perpetual. Will probably be alot less work. I am a new Michigan Medical Marijuana Patient, and we are limited to 12 plants.

Well, Good Luck! I'm throwing some more Love your way (+1 rep)!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Jan 22, 2009)

Moosey, thats pretty amazing that you just wrote out the exact plan I had in mind getting more totes and having 3 plants veg and 3 flowering for a perp harvest. Glad I didnt quit too now, looks great although stretched but it will produce obviously...top cola coming in well and strong bud points throughout. The 2 seedlings are under a dome reflector w a 42 watt CFL but I am getting a 2nd dome and 2 55 watt CFL's so they have enough light spread for my veg area...plus Im getting another, smaller tote lid for seeds/clones with holes closer together to keep them straight and bushy. The CFL's seem to be good for gentle but efficient lighting with no temp worries so I like that. Then the 250 HPS for the flowering. I also ordered an electronic PH meter which should be here this weekend. Can't wait, no more drops!

My main objective is to have 3 cuttings going w 3 plants in mid veg and 3 flowering. Going from CFL for 2 weeks to 250 MH for 2 then 250 HPS for the flowering phase...should keep them shorter but not stress them at the early stages...i noticed how awesome root dev. is when you leave them under vented plastic under CFL for 4-5 days, was no question they were ready!

Here's an idea tell me if you're with me. I am thinking of getting a shitload of lowryder 2 seeds and having 2 totes with 6-7 holes in each under the 250 side by side. figure 3/4 oz per plant every 2 months from what I have been reading on them. The hybrid/auto dwarf strains are going to be HUGE in the next year or so I think. Attitude seeds has several varieties of improving quality...but we'll have to see what they come out with. Sucks you cannot clone them though. Speaking of Attitude I emailed them even though they say not to about the 3 out of 5 germ on fem seeds. I'm not impressed, didnt pay alot but still, I think im going to try someone else next time...dopeseeds.com seems to have a great selection. Speaking of seeds, I dropped 2 of the power skunk in a shot glass yesterday and they are soaking inpaper towels right now, fig y the hell not they were free...and the seedlings will be 2 weeks ahead of them. Will update more next week or over weekend if anything dev. Thanks for keeping in touch


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## dmoose (Jan 24, 2009)

Jizzmaster0 said:


> plus Im getting another, smaller tote lid for seeds/clones with holes closer together to keep them straight and bushy. The CFL's seem to be good for gentle but efficient lighting with no temp worries so I like that. Then the 250 HPS for the flowering.


I did the same thing with a 6 Liter Shoebox size. Made it a 12 site with 2 inch holes. Buy 2 so you can use one as a dome.



> I also ordered an electronic PH meter which should be here this weekend. Can't wait, no more drops!


Thats next on my list too, even though I went Soil. I have built up enough confidence to try my Ebb/Flow again, or convert it to Top Feed.



> My main objective is to have 3 cuttings going w 3 plants in mid veg and 3 flowering. Going from CFL for 2 weeks to 250 MH for 2 then 250 HPS for the flowering phase...should keep them shorter but not stress them at the early stages...i noticed how awesome root dev. is when you leave them under vented plastic under CFL for 4-5 days, was no question they were ready!


The cuttings should root in 7 to 14 days with the Humidity Dome and CFL's. Then 2 weeks under the MH. That should be 1st station. That would be 3 in clone/veg for 30 days, 3 in 1st month of flower, 3 in 2nd month of flower. Since flowering is generaly 8 weeks.



> Here's an idea tell me if you're with me. I am thinking of getting a shitload of lowryder 2 seeds and having 2 totes with 6-7 holes in each under the 250 side by side. figure 3/4 oz per plant every 2 months from what I have been reading on them.


I think putting 12 -14 plants under a 250 HPS is too many personally. You could totally fill the size of the tote lid with 2-3 plants each. And I Highly recommend that you look into LST. If you look at the pic of my Veg Box, the plant on the far right is only 1 week older than the other 3. I started LST on day 25, so 2 weeks now, and Check out how the undergrowth just took over and became Bud Sites. Atleast the other 3 are Female, and I just started LST'ing them. 



> Speaking of Attitude I emailed them even though they say not to about the 3 out of 5 germ on fem seeds. I'm not impressed, didnt pay alot but still, I think im going to try someone else next time...dopeseeds.com seems to have a great selection.


http://www.nirvana-shop.com/ Alot of people I know use Nirvana-shop, The seem to be Very Reliable and Discreet. I screwed up and mixed my Free Leonard Seeds with some bag seeds, so it about a 50/50 chance when I try, but I found a source for some MK Ultra clones, should have them next week. Look them up, they are supposed to be Awsome!

Keep Rockin'


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## dmoose (Jan 24, 2009)

I just wanted to show you how you could fill your space just by Bending them over once....... Mild LST? I set 2 of my 35 day old Veggin' Females on the 18 Gal Tote Lid. Can you see it under there? I paperclipped them to the side of my bucket on day 30. But there are alot of ways you could accomplish tying them down with your tote lid. 







I am so close to finishing off my new Grow Room, and just dying to throw them into 12/12! Should be only a couple more days if all goes smoothly


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## Jizzmaster0 (Jan 26, 2009)

Moose, Yeah those techniques really do seem to make a difference w bud points. I am pretty certain when the 1 big plant finishes and I can determine sex on these 2 seedling Power Skunk and the 2 Fem Diesel show as well then I will order the Lowryder 2 seeds. Growing a tub just for seeds and then having the rest started in veg to move over nd get u sum sticky seems way easier than 2 vegging and flowering areas. I got the idea how' I;m setting it up here, will have to wait til we move this weekend. will get good pics too. the 2 new fem seeds are the diesel strain and look way healthy. The one on the left is gonnna be a real shrub, I can tell. The other seems leggy and pale. She may make it through, at lease I know who mom will be if I go that route. Will keep informed, ttys


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## Jizzmaster0 (Jan 27, 2009)

Well the babies look a little haggard. This was my total mistake. I have had them on 24 hour light since seed pop so I think they are stressed a little. Color is good but yellowing in the center of the left one. Droopy and sad but stems are strong. I got the Ph to about 6 and gave them 8 hours of dark. The roots arent plowing through as well as I thought they'd be by now. Also raised the light on them to make sure they arent getting blasted. 

It has been 8 hours of dark and the lights have been on about 2 hrs, they look alot better. I think they needed a refresher, did some research and found out 24/7 lighting is not healthy for plants...who'da thunk it?! 

On the other side the mom is exceptionally huge. I dont know what to do with it! She keeps growing and the buds are getting larger but not crazy large. She is about 2 3/4 ft. tall now, stretchy as hell but holding her own. Keeping her fed and trying to raise the lights daily to keep the top cooler. Not much else to do but wait. Totally getting Lowryder hybrids as soon as I move, maybe even before then...this 3 months/3 ft tall plant shit is for the birds!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Feb 2, 2009)

MOVE IS DONE! Thank the fuck christ. However, the mom got beat up a little, she is WAY too big and top heavy for the 3" net cup she currently has. I am just winging it with her now until it finishes IF EVER! Totally different story with the 2 fem seedlings of Diesel. They LOVE the CFL light I put over them. 65 watt and they are branchy and stout with thickening stems. I might be trading in my HID for CFL! No I'm kidding, I am going to keep using the CFL for the first few weeks and then switch to HID for faster growth and better flowering. Also you will notice those funky white caps over the net cups. Paper bowls with wax coating cut to fit...keeps the light out of the res which seems to help w development. 
The new closet is kinda like another apartment and there is a window as you can see. Pretty perfect once I get it done. The single seedling up front in the pic wont make it but I dont care, was free power skunk seed w last order. 

20 mixed auto flowering dwarfs on the way, CAN'T WAIT! 2 months and done w 14" plants. Gonna be so much better I hope. Then I will be growing for my own seeds as well and won't have to order anymore. Comments or questions always welcome. Any ideas on Mom? Can I harvest early and be done with her or wait a few more weeks? I know the buds are hard to see but there's white hairs and not much body to them yet...looks like popcorn on the way


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## Jizzmaster0 (Feb 13, 2009)

Update: Well I hacked mom down, the bitch grew straight into the hood of my 250 with 2 flowering weeks to go and I was so disgusted I just ended it. The branches are mostly trimmed and drying off site. Should be pretty dissappointing but on the horizon are 4 new seeds soaking of the auto flowering mix and I have 2 diesel seedlings about 3 weeks old under the MH looking ok except for a few bottom leaves curling way down...kind of like a rolled inverted joint...any ideas? ... just like 2 on each plant with the rest looking fine...weird really. 


Here's a question id LOVE to get some answers on...do I keep a mom plant of diesel and clone or do I grow the auto dwarfs for seed and just go 8 weeks from seed to harvest? My principal concern is stealth and quick turnaround so I think im going to stick with the dwarfs and just cross pollinate them for seeds and make my life easier...COMMENTS?


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## Jizzmaster0 (Feb 14, 2009)

ATTENTION! Here are pics of my 4 week old (approx) Diesel Feminized babies. They seem to be doing quite well except fr those very few leaves not being all flat and happy looking. Is this normal? Water has plenty of O2 in the bubbler and the Ph is standing at 5.8-6. Nuting regularly (they started to pale slightly 2 days ago). they have aout 7 nodes each which are hard to see from all the leaf growth! They LOVED the CFL bulbs for the first few weeks. I'm really happy w this strain so far. 

4 auto dwarfs in paper towels, they are coming up next and I cant wait. I think I'm going to keep one of these as a mom and flower the other one with the dwarves. Hope they both come up female as they are supposed to! coments encouraged at this point, getting lonely over here!


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## Roseman (Feb 14, 2009)

Hang in there Jizz, you're getting it!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Feb 16, 2009)

Thanks Roseman, good to see you're still following. Texaslonghorn hasn't been around much either. I got 100% germination on my 4 Auto Dwarf mix and the 2 Diesels still look great. Having panic attacks praying they are female and the move didnt stress them into Males. So not im waiting for the little ones to peek above the rockwool and they go into the newly designed Vegging area under a 65 and 42 watt cfl duo. Will have pics of both in a few days, thanks for stopping by!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Feb 17, 2009)

Here are some pix from a few mins ago. PH is at 6.0 and the temps are in the low 70's. Water level is below net cups. Topping off with fresh grow nutes every other day or so for this week. Im getting some funky leaf curls now. Seems like they are not getting enough light to me....any thoughts? I try to turn them a quarter turn every day but maybe the light is too far off at 15 inches? Kinda weird, the color and stems are strong and I just got a larger fan on them for air movement. Just me worrying a little. the other 4 seedling auto flowering dwarfs are peeking way out and developing under a CFL. Pics to follow but i really could use an opinion on the larger plants and what may be def.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Feb 18, 2009)

So day 2 of my curiosity with the plants. They just look like they have a few bad leaves IMO. The rest of the plant seems to be in good shape. Good color, growth rate is fine, just those leaves curling down like that puzzles me. PH is at 6. roots look fine, brownish from nutes. Plenty of light and breeze, hmm. Any comments still wlecome. No sign of sex yet, probably end of week. 

Good news! Pic of my 2 day old babies looking strong. Auto Flowering Hybrids in a mix. They popped aggressively and the leaves that showed were so so tiny it was amazing, i didnt think they would live. They are buffing up now in a dark closet for a few hours then back under CFL. So precious...but im stoned so it's a big deal to me right now! Wil get their new home setup when done cleaning the older veg tub.

Will post more pics of the larger ones later. Going to tweak things a little until Im bored with it or until they look better. I'm debating whether to just change out the nute solution and flush with 1/2 strength. Any ideas would help.


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## Roseman (Feb 18, 2009)

There is absolutley nothing wrong with those two plants in the pic in the SH Bubbleponics tank. They look beautiful to me. As plants grow, a fan leaf ocassionally dies. 
ca sara, ca sara.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Feb 18, 2009)

Yeah I thought it was just me being paranoid. I think they are fine myself and am not worrying about it. If it were spreading or getting worse then i'd probably worry but it's been the same few leaves since it started. Ok thanks for the quick reply rosey, ttyl


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## Jizzmaster0 (Feb 20, 2009)

The seedlings are going on 4 days old now. They are rocketing out so far! 2nd set of true leaves coming in quick. I am going to put them in their new home in the bathroom under CFL's with 1/2 strength nutes today. The runt is so cute, I can't kill him, I gotta give him the chance! 

The larger plants look good, no problems at all with Ph or anything. I stopped the humidifier and the temps are down low, to 68 or so which sucks, it's cold here. but they dont seem to mind. Waiting for them to show me gender..they are so BUSHY i cannot see the stem near the top without moving branches out of the way...this is a super super stout, short plant but looks so nice and fits great with one other in that tote. Im going to veg for another 2 weeks or so then make up my mind to keep them as mothers or clone them or just let the auto flowering ones pass them by. Decisions all over the place. I can always just keep them alive and decide later depending how to auto dwarfs come out. will keep the thread going, i havent seen many good lowryder mix grow journals.

Also went to a hydro store nearby, good place, got 10/10 ft of black/white poly, more net cups, grow rocks and an ONA type gel block. Hope the new kids turn out ok after the move, i am so paranoid growing from seed anymore...read back in the journal just now to remember how dumb I was and look at me now! OK moment over


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## Roseman (Feb 20, 2009)

FROM NEWBIE TO GROW PRO! WOW!


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## dmoose (Feb 20, 2009)

Jizzmaster0 said:


> ...read back in the journal just now to remember how dumb I was and look at me now! OK moment over


Me2 Jizz. It is hard to remember back when I was killing everything that tried to grow in my vacinity. But things are going GREAT NOW! Sorry I wasn't around for the problems, but I have been working on my NEW space. I amaze Myself sometimes! Also picked up a SHITLOAD of new equiptment...lights, fans, filters, hydro buckets......etc. 

Oh, and dont worry about the temps, I run in the low 60's at night and only 68 during lights on, and the plants love it. It is also good to keep away some pests, and bad bacteria. The Girls are Beautiful! Your doing a GREAT Job!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Feb 21, 2009)

Hello all, thanks for the words of encouragement, it really is nice to klnow I have the ability now to make these plants thrive. I just hope my next problem is what to do with all the fine bud they produce!

I hung the black/white poly up as you can see. My GF is going to help me make a sheet that I will tack up and split down the middle to cover the whole area, gonna be a little light cube when I'm done, I took pics of the temp unit...styrofoam which glows like some sort of disturbing radiation leak. That little 250 is now kicking out like 30% more light that isn't being wasted on leaks, Im so proud of me.

The little ones seem fine, the leaf development isn't as quick now but I'm assuming the roots are where this type of plant concentrates to be able to flower immed. Usual BS with transporting and changes in environment and the PH being tedious since the water is new...they look ok though except for little Runtboy...who beter be a boy! It is amazing how fast the Auto dwarves start laying down roots, I had decent structure after 3 days in that little tupper. 

OK so you have a pic of the mostly finished setup, the ladies still not showing gender, and the little auto's coming in...I'm going to flower my ladies now I decided...that way they are out of the way and I can start the auto dwarf project with a 1-2-3 sort of system. Should work out fine, i have it mapped out in my head. I will miss the diesels but I can always get another 5 pack of fem. something, not like its hard to find anymore. will update in a few more days but I'm laid off now so I'm bored...might be a long journal!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Feb 22, 2009)

Tragedy! Well almost, not sure yet, spilled a bottle of PH UP over on the shitty shelving over top of the plants. It was dripping and splattering down the light and off the poly, it was a fucking mess. Not too much got on the plant, it was a smaller bottle of it. I am having HUGE problems regulating my PH in both res's. MY electronic PH Meter says its super low but then the drip test says otherwise. I dont have any buffer, storage or calibration fluid for my electronic PH meter though so I cant be sure how accurate it is..it came with one foil container of solution to calibrate and that was it. 

I switched the lighting as of tonight so the larger plants will begin flowering in a week or so and the seedlings seem ok except for the runt, no problems but for a lowryder hybrid they dont seem to be winning any speed records yet. Weird. 

Chemical burn starting on some of the leaf areas, how nice. Hope she makes it thru, Can't wait to have a house and a real grow room setup instead of this closet/bathroom shit. Went at the burned plant with some scissors to get rid of the dying leaves. Wasn't too much to trim but lost 1 of the HUGE shade/fan leaves at the bottom...looks ugly but perky witht he new curtain up too. Will post pics of the damage later as a learning experience. Also if anyone knows how to solve my PH issue let me know what they would do in that sit. I cant really go out and but a TDS/EC, god knows what else meter so I guess I have to try and fig it out for myself. Seems like the PH drops when there is more Nutes in the water solution. I was dumping PH UP into the res of the larger plants and the stupid Meter still says like 4.5. I tried to do a drop test and it looks like its green, impossible to tell for sure.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Feb 23, 2009)

Day later:
Everything looks pretty good really I was surprised to see when I woke up. The babies are starting to pick up speed again, i'm guessing the time they seemed to halt was to focus on root growth. The 2 DEFINITE females! are doing good despite my little accident yesterday. The affected leaves are holding on but are discolored and obviously not going to help much, will trim them down later. They have had 1 night of 12/12 and everything is looking fine, especially with my light trapper setup, they LOVE it now. So, i got 2 more seed pops with the auto flower strain. They were put in paper towels like 36 hours ago, very viable seeds, makes me wonder why the one is a runt then..oh well. I got a new table for my res. too. My gf had one of those 3 ft. white folding picnic jobs, gonna give me more space to work, cant have enough space to work I am finding out. Havent tested PH yet and I think I should wait for a bit and stop being a nut about it. The plants are alive, roots look good so I am not messing with them too much. I'm also at the point where I'm sort of regretting getting a 250 instead of 400 watt light setup. For the standard size strains anyway, that was another learning experience. Get good quality and alot of lighting right away. 400 Wats would have really lit the suckers up I think. Oh well. You can also tell when I turn the plants since they lean in different angles! maybe with a 400 they would be really straight and bushy. Oh well, the auto dwarves wont be so demanding so it was probably better after all...rambling, wake and bake morning for me! 

OK that's it, so what did we learn over the last few days.

As the TDS goes up the Ph seems to drop
DO NOT prep/mix or store chemicals near the plants! Have a separate area and bring only what you need with you.
Good quality seeds will get good germination and growth rates, shity bag seed is a gamble.
Contain all the light you can, light leaks cost you good growth, time and more importantly ... bud!

I'm totally picking up some Molasses for the last 2 weeks flowering phase...heard nothing but good things
and seen good evidence. Need all the help I can get with these! Also I am DONE with Metal Halide lamps. I just switched over to the HPS bulb on day 3 of flowering. I forgot how much more light you get out of the HPS...I think after these plants are done I'm getting a SUPER HPS with the little more blue spec for my 250. Should be good for all the growth and flowering I need when putting 2 week olds in there. Dont think Im going to have more than 4-5 plants flowering at a time and those will be the dwarves anyway.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Feb 25, 2009)

Hey kids. Everyone is doing great over here. In spite of my little spill the plants are super strong looking. Had to thin out some of the leaves in the bottom 1/3 of the plants though. The left plant was too bushy and those bud points werent getting light and the right plants had burned white leaves from the PH UP I dropped on it. 

The hairs are super pronounced now. I have had them 12/12 for 4 nights now I think and am going to change out the nutes to Bloom today later on. They are really great plants, I am hopefull for some substantial buds. The stems are like tree trunks and the nodes are super tight. Im keeping the HPS nice and tight on them just in case, cant have another stretched to hell plant. One more good thing about the 250 watter is the closeness you can get to the canopy. 

The Babies are adorable. Even that deformed phantom of the opera sprout wants to hold his own! Im naming him Rudy. I have 4 more in rockwool in the sealed tub getting ready to go into the main system. I have kept germ 2 seeds every 2-3 days and I think im going to have my system that way for good. That way im always cycling plants in and out without any waiting period. I am pretty stoked about these seeds and their vigor. 1 sickly/weak plants so far and 100% germination and peekage through the rockwool. Pretty damn good as far as I'm concerned. Hope there are more strong plants like those 3 on the way. OK more to come enjoy the pics.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Mar 1, 2009)

Hey all. Another few days have passed and things are going ok I think. The only concern I have is one of the young auto dwarfs with leaf discoloration (pic shown). If anyone knows what this may be please let me know. I drilled more holes in the veg station and sat the more developed seedlings in it. They all are fine even the runt has normal leaves growing and getting larger faster. The flowering female diesels are also looking bushy and taller. I am going to have to lower the table a few inches for them. So, nothing eventful really. Just playing the waiting game...if anyone knows what that bad leaf spot is let me know ASAP thank you so much.


Well I think it is a PH Fluctuation and that plant was just more succeptable to its negative affects. The other plants aren't doing anything weird. I found out my PH Meter is jacked up. It read under 2 for the Ph in the veg system with the young young plants but then I did a drip color test and it was high like 6.5 high. I lowered the Ph to 6 and did another test to confirm. IDK why one set of leaves would go bad but the new growth is OK so I am not going to worry about it but im def. not going w the pocket PH meter until I have it calibrated and reading consistently. Wonder why no responses...the views are up high. Wonder if the local Johnny Law is readin my shit...o well.


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## dmoose (Mar 2, 2009)

Jizzmaster0 said:


> I was dumping PH UP into the res of the larger plants and the stupid Meter still says like 4.5. I tried to do a drop test and it looks like its green, impossible to tell for sure.


Dont dump PH UP or Down directly into the res. Get a container and dip it in the res, add and MIX the PH Up or Down in the water you just pulled from the res. Then dump that back into the res, and mix well.

I find when I use my PH pen to measure PH in my tiny bubbler, the reading can change 0.5 just a couple inches away. So I would think just dumping it into the res would create some real Hot Spots. 

https://www.rollitup.org/marijuana-plant-problems/157345-have-plant-problem-check-here.html

Follow that link to Plant Problems and compare either the PH Flucuation 2nd pic, and/or the Magneseum Deficiency 2nd pic. Campare and follow the instructions on how to fix the problem. 

Hope this helps. Your doing GREAT!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Mar 2, 2009)

Thanks for the info Moosey. I did check out that thread under Plant Problems and seems like the PH may be off enough to affect the Mg. I have been checking the PH with the drops until my solutions arrive in a few days. Im going to take your advice and treat a larger amount of water w/ph up or down then dump that in the res to ensure no hot spots. Didn't think it would make much difference but apparently so. I got 2 new gallons of nutes mixed up with lower PH so maybe that will offset it enough when I top off. The flowering diesels are exploding. Going to start them on full strength bloom nutes today when I top off at night. The babies are all ok, I should have cut holes with a little more room between them. Even the dwarves are branching out sideways taking up some real estate. none of the babies seems to be affected by the PH/Mg issue even the smallest ones. Few more coming up in the little white tupperware and will go in the system tomorrow night I think. Will get pics late tomorrow when everything is done. What a pain in the ass keeping up with 2 different types of plants in 2 different stages of dev. like a FT job


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## dmoose (Mar 2, 2009)

I believe you should be OK now. Your Girls look like they LOVE the Black and White Poly that you hung on your walls. Now they are getting hit with light from all directions. Those leaves are looking Phat!

Running more rooms seems to be easier with Soil, but I took some clones of the MK Ultra and put them in my DIY Bubbler. Last time they were ready for transplant at about 10 days. But I really want to run some type of Hydro. Have the makings for DWC, Top Feed, and Flood and Drain. But I havent decided which way to go. Tell me, how do you like your system? And if you were starting over right now, which way would you go?


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## Jizzmaster0 (Mar 2, 2009)

I think I would have still started the way I did but not try and cut corners as much as I did in the beginning. I also would def. make my own system like I wound up doing. 

This seems to be a case where it's 90%preparation to have success. The proper lighting, test equipment and know how in case something simple does go wrong. The bubbler may have ben ambitious, soil may have been a better way to start but with all that waste material and dirt it wasn't quite good for my apartment lifestyle. 

The bubbler is good because there are very few parts to go bad. The aquarium pump can even crap out and you have some time to oxygenate the water...it's just that Ph is more crucial because the roots are sitting in it the whole time. I guess it's most like personal preference with the hydro systems. also if you're more into speed then go hydro but soil has been proven to produce more quality taste and smoke...i personally am looking for quick turnaround and stealth with the low ryder hybrids in a hydro system.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Mar 4, 2009)

Well all the kids seem to be coming along fine. I have lost some enthusiasm for the auto hybrids mostly because they just don't seem to have the vigor I expected. Also they are getting branchy which sucks because I have nowhere else to put them until the regular strains are done in 7 more weeks. 

I'm not germ any more seeds for now either for this reason. The 3 largest of the small ones are doing well though and should show gender any day now. I lost track of their age, isn't that horrible? I had to throw one seedling down the disposal though, it opened up looking like a Tulip! No split on the other side of the seed leaves so it was trying to open but couldnt! Weird, I tried cuting the leaves but it got really sad looking so i tossed the bugger...1 in 10 isnt too bad from what Im used to! 

As far as the 2 female diesels they look fantastic. Nice and bushy and really sucking down the nutes. Not messing with them AT ALL! 

So that's about it. I'd love to be able to have 3 area's for growth and constantly be cyclin shit in and out but I think just starting seeds every few days when the flowering area is unoccupied with Hannakuh Bushes will work out fine for a plant or 2 every week. Sucks not having the space to really make it worthwhile...these things take so bloody long it's getting tough to maintain the energy to keep them going.

One of the seedlings keeps twisting it's shade(wider botom leaves) pretty noticebly. The others are not, wonder why? 

In any case, one I think, is male and hopefully I get a few females out of the deal for seed breeding purposes. 

I also read somewhere that with Hydro the PH should be under 6 but over 5.2. I have been trying to shoot for 6 whether flowering or vegging just to keep it in between the extremes. 

PH test fluid came in today so I will have a calibrated instrument instead of guessing away at drops and shit. Just hope it works properly now. 

PS the runt is the seedling all the way on the right...the fucker pulled through and started growing normal leaves can u believe that?! The twister playing plant is all the way on the left and there are week old seedlings stuck in the middle NOT getting enough light as I'd like them to.
Also if u look closely near the white tub the babies are in...see how the leaf is curling tightly up on that side? what the hell causes that?! Looks like its trying to roll itself into a joint...wow, think of the possibilities!
Comments...questions...all are welcome


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## Jizzmaster0 (Mar 4, 2009)

OK THEN! Doing the happy dance, doing the happy dance, doing the happy dance...yes and singing the happy song. Just learned another valuable lesson; I calibrated my Hannah pocket Ph meter with the solutions. Got it perfect. Then Thanks to my buddy Moose up there, I took a small sample (2oz in Bahamas themed shot glass) and measured the PH AFTER checking it directly in the bubbler res. WHAT A FUCKIN DIFFERENCE! When you take readings near an air stone I guess it throws it off COMPLETELY! the sample read at exactly what I thought it would. 6.25. This is after I got a reading of like 2 in the res! I added PH Down to the sample and threw it in the res to mix so never adding up or down directly to the res without a buffer. The flowering res is at 5.8 which is perfect. So another huge lesson DO NOT TEST PH FROM RES! Take a small sample, test ph and add as needed up or down. Was reading high also almost .5 higher for both fluids. Thanks Moose for bringing that to my attention. Now I have to add an EC/PPM meter to my tool collection but not for a while I think. The small plants dont seem to want too much of a nute concentration so I am just waiting to see them pale a little then add 1/2 strength. The other down side to having plants at different stages in the same bubbler. WHOEVER READS THIS ADD TO MOOSE'S REP PLEASE!


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## dmoose (Mar 6, 2009)

Hey Jizz, You are way too Kewl! Thanks Bro.

Thought I would post a couple pics of my girls











They were vegged for 8 weeks while I built the Flower Room. These are at day 18 of 12/12.


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## dmoose (Mar 6, 2009)

Here are some Side shots for your viewing pleasure! LOL


















Here is a good pic to show LST


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## Jizzmaster0 (Mar 6, 2009)

Damn Moose, way to show me up lol! They look great. I am so worried about my little ones now. The seedlings that are larger in the veg area are really branchy and now hogging all the light from the recent additions. Totally sucks but there.s not much I can do about it. 

The diesels are still looking great. The one on the left grew overnight into the light hood and burned 2-3 leaves on the bulb. That'l teach her. Not much new and exciting unless you count Hempy Buckets. I'm totally switchin over this week. Probably going to just keep the totes and use them as drip basins with 6-8 plastic 2 liter bottles cut to size and drilled with a hydroton and vermiculite mix. That way I can move plants around more easily and no worries about different needs since they will all be contained and easily manipulated. Also no heavy ass res. full of slop to try and move around when it's time to clean them! So, will get some pics when I swap everything over. as far as gender goes for the auto dwarfs...i think I have 2 males and 1 femnale. Really hard to get down there and see. Another bitch of the job that will be solved when I can simply lift a small bucket up and look at it without worrying about roots dangling all over the place.


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## Jizzmaster0 (Mar 7, 2009)

I am so glad I moved those little seedlings to the kitchen. There seemed to have been some sort of radiation leak and it caused the dwarves to grow 100% overnight lol. They bushed out bigtime after upgraded the one light from a 42 to 65 watter. Now the 3 seedlings are under the 42 CFL in another spot. They look great and I will check for gender later on when I get in from riding. Everyone looks good, PH is no longer an issue and I got a big bag of vermiculite for the hempy pots im going to make soon. So, all is right with the world. Will put up some pics of the diesels when the difinitive flowering starts. BTW those dwarves are less than 3 weeks old! They really do start to blow up after rooting. I pulled one out and the root structure is about 2 ft. long in there. So, not mcuh else to say for now, going out on the motorcycle, this gang can be ok alone, I trust them


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## dmoose (Mar 7, 2009)

I think the hybrids would fit perfectly in the soda bottles and solve the width issue. You need to take a look at the roots of the Diesels, and figure out if you need to put those in a larger container, like a gallon milk container. They may allready be to big for the soda bottle. 

I Love how the Diesels have filled out! I think the Hempy idea will help you increase your yeild because you will be able to separate them a bit and rotate them 2. More Light = More Bud

I believe today is 2 weeks of 12/12. How about a close-up of the bud formation? I need some Bud Porn!


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## LonghornFan (Mar 7, 2009)

Jizz!!!!!

You old timer, you still on your first grow??? Just kidding...I am so glad to see you are enjoying growing your own. I had a blast and I am back for more. I am still catching up on your thread, but I will get there, and stop by and see me over on my Alaskan Ice page....Glad to be back and see you growin em like a weed!!!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Mar 8, 2009)

Texas u old sheep humper you! Good to see you back on my thread. Yeah still on first grow. I think in order to have a first grow though you have to stop changing methods and situations every few days lol. 

OK here's the scoop though. 2 nice diesel females about to be loving me from the unsulphured organic molasses I just picked up for them. Gonna try that in water tomorrow, im laying off the nutes this week. I also removed a male auto dwarf from the clan and identified a female I think so thats more good news. At this point im not keeping any males, I just want to see how the product is and decide if I want to use the last 10 seeds to propogate. 

Enjoy the pics. and is now too soon to start with some molasses? I was going to do 1 tsp. per gallon for both types of plants since the autos are flowering. Thanks !


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## hgr9000 (Mar 8, 2009)

Roseman said:


> Man, the light is too high up and away, and that is causing the stretching!



is stretching a bad thing?


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## llclowell (Mar 9, 2009)

use MH at 6-8 inch from plant. too much red light sepectrum makes stem growth. blue ight spectrum is waht you need and you get it real well frum a 600 MH Bulb


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## Jizzmaster0 (Mar 9, 2009)

POSTING ALERT:

Id much rather people who have questions cruise the noob threads before flaming my 19 page, 5 month old journal with day 1 questions. Not trying to be a dick but I prefer not to have a biblical story here. Also stop by the ettiquette section chances are if you have a question, someone else asked first and it is already out there...dont post your questions on someone elses thread..or repeat already answered questions from months ago...spank u for calling!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Mar 12, 2009)

And on that note I must inform all my adoring fans that I am no longer growing. Sad Sad Sad but my kids have found a new home with another dedicated stoner! I had the good fortune for being selected for a great job that has a not so great drug policy lol. Thanks for the advice, help and positive feedback on my thread, hope to be back again soon...hope it's not a recurring drug test thing! Thanks again all!


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## hgr9000 (Mar 19, 2009)

Jizzmaster0 said:


> I am going to do another week of Veg to stengthen the stems. I came up with a genius idea to shorten the res. to now have so much damn unused water in the thing that they dont drink anyway. I went with a Target Kitty Litter Pan with the tote lid fit right over top! I also lowered the lights and am on the way out for an oscillating stand fan. I scrubbed and cleaned the original tote and changed the nutes for a higher dosage and PH bal the water b4 setting the cover in. Roots starting to show. See my new pics...damn they are pathetic! The color is good though so I think they will fight back. Let me know what you think.



did you grown them in an incubator or did you just take the seeds straight into the bubbleponic system?


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## Jizzmaster0 (Mar 24, 2009)

I think those I grew right in the system with the light too high. It was a while ago, those plants are ancient history.


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## Jizzmaster0 (May 2, 2009)

Hey all. hope someone is keeping an eye out. Im back in the game for a few weeks until my auto's r done. I have some seedlings that r looking ok for the most part but r either over nuted or under nuted and IDK which. I have flushed them with mostly plain water last night until the res filled and the hempy cup holes ran out. They r not over watered then. I gave some of the yellowing ones 1/3 strength grow nutes for N and such. If anyone thinks I should be doing something diff. then let me know. Eventually these will be bogged into 1.5 gal hempy buckets already set up. 
These are 3 weeks old and have been feeding with a medicine dropper a few times per day with like 1/5 strength nutes, barely anything. auto flowering dwarfs also so they r flowering right now. under 2x65 watt CFL's for now until I get them under the 250watt HPS for flowering their last month. 

INFO APPRECIATED!


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## Jizzmaster0 (May 3, 2009)

Ok I panicked again. I DID burn them early in life slightly but they bounced right back after a flush and a day of good dry substrate and lighting. 3 Females so far and 2 males. The rest will show by tomorrow. Also have a Gigabud Fem. Seed in the covered cup, trying a 4 gal Hempy bucket with Perlite/water crystals and see how far I can go between waterings for vacations! I have 5 more of them anyways. 


YES I KNOW THEY STRETCHED GET OFF MY TITS! LOL

The Diesel Harvest was DISSAPPOINTING!! about 2 oz dry off both combined. Not enough light, stretching, nute burns, nute def. Im amazed they survived to harvest. GREAT SMOKE THO! Grapefruit and dank diesel mixed and a nice even high thats mostly body but clear headed. 

My 2 auto females yielded about the same as my Diesels in 8 weeks! Nice heavy smoke, heavy crystals, nice budding, taste can be harsh at times if it gets too hot in the vape but it hits hard and is a nice up high with energy. 

Thanks for everyone watching my threads. Appreciate the support and attention. Will be around here and there.


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## Jizzmaster0 (May 5, 2009)

Ok so I transplanted the 3 females into 1.5 gal hempy buckets and they r now resuming growth. Vertical growth i have noticed now the solid 6th node is finished, tight spacing between too after initial stretch to cotyledon. 

Got rid of the males, no seeds here, not with my feminized Gigabud in the room no thank u sir. 
This is easier to manage and now just have to worry about diff light schedules in another 13 days when seedling goes to 18/6.

Just a heads up, got the nutes right, they are not burning now, looks good to me, will give them all the time they need, they sure have the space now.


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## Jizzmaster0 (May 10, 2009)

Hi all, great news all is well. Gigabud fem. is extremely hardy and will not stop making progress so I haven't as much as looked at her sidewaysin days. This is day 9 of growth for her and day 31 of growth for those auto dwarfs. they are about 5, 6, 7, inches from smalles to largest and looking green and robust on the interiors. I can see multiple bud sites forming with gusto and the nodes r very tight after initial stretch so no worries. Going to finish them off under the HPS and put the Giga right into flower on Sat when its 14 day mark hits and I put it into the 4 gal. cont. Thats all for now!


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## Jizzmaster0 (May 12, 2009)

Quick info bite:
I learned today that the Miracle Grow brand Perlite contains trace amounts of Nutes. I was wondering how my new Gigabud seedling had burned leaf tips w no nutes at all added since germination. Those fuckwads at Miracle Grow apparently know whats best for all of us. I flushed the balls out of the giga and shook the damn cup to extract all the water I could. Will top off tomorrow afternoon w fresh water only and c how the leaves look. Thought this would help others...i never thought to check the bag. Oh and shit Giga female is only 10 days old, out of tent and looking healthy except for those leaf tips. Any othe rinfo would help if this isnt what I think. The new growth is fine and has no apparent burns or def. I think the flush will stop that in it's tracks.


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## Jizzmaster0 (May 18, 2009)

All is well, really no complaints, the gigs seedling is eating ferociously and has gotten deeper green. I added some grow nutes to the water contentrate. The auto Dwarf mixes are thriving and budding well. I hope the mid stem growth will make the plant disappear in a few weeks. Proj. finishing weekend is rapidly approaching. Added flowering nutes to their conc. too, no more nute burn for me. May also do molasses for the last 2 weeks with full strength nutes and a flush every 2-3 days. Hope some of my old friends r enjoying the thread still...it's totally shifted tho which is funny to me reading back again and again and laughing my ass off. Enjoy the pics.


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## Jizzmaster0 (May 29, 2009)

Ok so the hempy auto flowering dwarfs are looking stellar. I mean, loook at the pics. feeding twice a day or so but not until it pours out. just topping off some here and there and they love it. No real def. or burns to speak of and the bud is glistening for me. The gigabud is responding well to the LST I started about 10 days ago. she is at day 27 now and is bushing out nicely. The autos will be harvested on the 6th which is a few days past 8 weeks. Cant wait any longer, leaving for the shore right the next AM. will dry for the week n the box and be ready for my arrival home! I have nothing but good reports for Joint Doctor's Auto Flowering Dwarf Mix or G-13 Gigabud. Both are easy to read, easy to raise and the auto's are a great smoke and heavy producer. Will give weights at harvest this time wet and keep each plants bud sep. see who makes daddy feel sleepy and who makes daddy feel like building shit. Comments and questions welcome. The giga is also going in a 4 gal hempy bucket the day I leave and see if she can go a week without watering in a huge bucket with water crystals miced into the perlite. I think it will work. Later all


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## Jizzmaster0 (May 30, 2009)

well everything is fine but I have just osld my light setup on craigs. I have ordered a brand new setup consisting of a 400 watt HPS Bulb, Cool tube and Lumatek digital 400 watt ballast.

I also ordered a squirrel cage type exhaust fan I want to install on a piece of plyywood screwed into a window frame to vent hot air...however!

The ducting and clamps I bought are 4" just like the intake flange on the fan but the cool tube has a 6" opening to accept that hose. is there a way I can get an adapter to make the 6 inch come down to a 4". the air is only 95 cfm so it wont stress the motor much to restrict air flow, may even help suck out more heat. Any help would be great to save me a headach or a returned item, I need this shit now cuz my setup- goes in a few days! Thanks


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## Jizzmaster0 (Jun 2, 2009)

Thanks for all the help! I found a "reducer" at HD and things r fine now. New light system will b in this week and I sell the old on next week. Also not going to screw a plate into anything, just gonna paint the plywood black and slip it into the window and shut it slightly w the fan mounted to it then plastic trim it all in. 

Here's some new pics, im not posting shit anymore on here since nobody knows how to increase rep or make a cool comment. Found a way better forum with less pissing and moaning and arguing also


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## dmoose (Jun 4, 2009)

Nice job Jizz! I am tempted to grow some of those Auto's, and I agree, Hempy does RULE!


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## Jizzmaster0 (Jun 5, 2009)

Thank moosey you always were the man! Here's some new pics of the light setup and the auto's JUST before chopping. Super frosty and dense with nice sized nuggs. Pulled a small pieceof popcorn off the bottom and it's still a sizeable piece! 

The Giga is a goddamn bush worthy of the whitehouse lawn, nuff said.

Will get wet/dry weights and pics of harvest asap.


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