# Where to begin........



## Evil-Mobo (Jun 10, 2016)

Well because I can't stop reading and wanting to learn I have found my way to the vertical section. Where would I begin now if I wanted to proceed down this path.

I have not used a SCROG before but was planning it in the next few runs at some point, so what's the difference if the plants grow vertically or horizontally right, it's still something new for me to learn either way.

My issue, I grow in tents. An oversize 2'x 4' and a slightly oversize 3' x 3'. The 2' x 4' has more area inside.

My 2 x 4 is running an 8 bulb Quantum Bad Boy T5 with a mix of Agromax and Phillips bulbs, and the 3 x 3 is running a Sun Systems 315w LEC CMH light which is the light I have liked the most of all I have used so far, more so than my COB light even. 

I am a newb to growing, and researched for months before starting my first run, currently flowering my one plant left from run #1, and have my second run in veg. 

Shifting some things around and starting to prepare for what run 3 might/will be. Maybe it's time for a vert ent grow..... but with my spaces how would I prep the plants in veg for a vert grow in flower.....

I would assume my 315 CMH would need to be run bare .....?

Thanks for the help and chiming in


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 21, 2016)

No one?


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## kiwipaulie (Jun 21, 2016)

I recommend reading threads in this section and you should get it. 

There's not much to it. Just hang the bulb bare and grow around it.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 22, 2016)

kiwipaulie said:


> I recommend reading threads in this section and you should get it.
> 
> There's not much to it. Just hang the bulb bare and grow around it.


Well I'm considering this for my third run with the GG seeds which just started to pop. So being that I have never even done a SCROG before there's a lot new for me. Thought there would be more feedback here in this section is all...........

Appreciate the feedback


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## gr865 (Jun 23, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Well I'm considering this for my third run with the GG seeds which just started to pop. So being that I have never even done a SCROG before there's a lot new for me. Thought there would be more feedback here in this section is all...........
> 
> Appreciate the feedback


As Kiwi said, read all you can, if you have a specific question about a certain part of a grow ask.
You can line the 3x3 with plants to get equal distance all around. I can get 5 plants vertical in a 3x3, with screens.
here is an example, it is about 30" across, it is set up outside my tent in this pic.

 

GR


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 25, 2016)

gr865 said:


> As Kiwi said, read all you can, if you have a specific question about a certain part of a grow ask.
> You can line the 3x3 with plants to get equal distance all around. I can get 5 plants vertical in a 3x3, with screens.
> here is an example, it is about 30" across, it is set up outside my tent in this pic.
> 
> ...


Why I am not seeing this until now is beyond me. TY very much for that. 

What do you think if I do one of those for the front so I can move it, but grow three more on a trellis net tied directly to the frame of the tent on the sides and rear? Was there a reason you do not use the frame of the tent? I am just trying to learn here as much as I can because this would be great. I'm going to start running a flood table in flower soon just like my veg setup if that helps, but I hand water in coco and just have a catch pan underneath makes things easier "for me".


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## gr865 (Jun 26, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Why I am not seeing this until now is beyond me. TY very much for that.
> 
> What do you think if I do one of those for the front so I can move it, but grow three more on a trellis net tied directly to the frame of the tent on the sides and rear? Was there a reason you do not use the frame of the tent? I am just trying to learn here as much as I can because this would be great. I'm going to start running a flood table in flower soon just like my veg setup if that helps, but I hand water in coco and just have a catch pan underneath makes things easier "for me".


My tent is a 4x4, So I have room to move around and also move the plants in and out for maintenance, I just felt the 3x3 circle would work best in my situation. 
Yes as I get into veg I will be water/nutes the plants by hand until I get them into the tent then I will install the Blumats.
I think your idea about making one screen movable to be able to work on the other plants is a valid idea. I just did not want to have to work on the plants while under the HPS as I have already hurt my vision from being exposed to high intensity light. 
Good luck on you effort and be sure to keep us updated on your progress.

GR


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 26, 2016)

gr865 said:


> My tent is a 4x4, So I have room to move around and also move the plants in and out for maintenance, I just felt the 3x3 circle would work best in my situation.
> Yes as I get into veg I will be water/nutes the plants by hand until I get them into the tent then I will install the Blumats.
> I think your idea about making one screen movable to be able to work on the other plants is a valid idea. I just did not want to have to work on the plants while under the HPS as I have already hurt my vision from being exposed to high intensity light.
> Good luck on you effort and be sure to keep us updated on your progress.
> ...


With this setup you pictured are you pre training the plants in veg or just getting your desired size a and then tying them up when you flip the lights?


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## gr865 (Jun 26, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> With this setup you pictured are you pre training the plants in veg or just getting your desired size a and then tying them up when you flip the lights?


To be honest, that is a question that I have for the group.
How long to veg before beginning training? Also, do you cut off branches on the backside of the plant upon beginning tying it to the screen or bending them around to work into the overall vertical canopy?

I am thinking growing them to desired height, LST'ing them as they grow, then begin training to the screen when your desired height is reached. I think waiting until you reach you height that the back stem would be to large to LST. I am just not sure. Don't remember reading anything about this.
GR


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 26, 2016)

gr865 said:


> To be honest, that is a question that I have for the group.
> How long to veg before beginning training? Also, do you cut off branches on the backside of the plant upon beginning tying it to the screen or bending them around to work into the overall vertical canopy?
> 
> I am thinking growing them to desired height, LST'ing them as they grow, then begin training to the screen when your desired height is reached. I think waiting until you reach you height that the back stem would be to large to LST. I am just not sure. Don't remember reading anything about this.
> GR


I appreciate the honest feedback, maybe we get some answers here for the both of us, I REALLY want to run these GG beans vertically.........

What light do you use with this setup in your 4X4?

Thanks
Evil

@OneHitDone @ttystikk


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## gr865 (Jun 26, 2016)

Hey buddy, need some pics here.

GR


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 26, 2016)

gr865 said:


> Hey buddy, need some pics here.
> 
> GR


What would you like pics of?

I have links to my grow logs in my sig with plenty of pictures I assure you 

But I can post here too what would you like to see?


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## gr865 (Jun 26, 2016)

Sorry don't usually pay attention to sig's will take a look.


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## OneHitDone (Jun 26, 2016)

gr865 said:


> As Kiwi said, read all you can, if you have a specific question about a certain part of a grow ask.
> You can line the 3x3 with plants to get equal distance all around. I can get 5 plants vertical in a 3x3, with screens.
> here is an example, it is about 30" across, it is set up outside my tent in this pic.
> 
> ...


What lighting do you drop down in the middle of that?


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## gr865 (Jun 26, 2016)

OneHitDone said:


> What lighting do you drop down in the middle of that?


Going to be a 400W Eye Hortilux Super HPS!


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 26, 2016)

gr865 said:


> Sorry don't usually pay attention to sig's will take a look.


It's all good if you tell me what you want to see I can post pics I might go veretical sooner than later because my newest addition to the flower tent is blowing up very unexpectedly and she has three sisters I have yet to flip. This is my Barney's blue cheese that's about six weeks from "seed" about a week in flower almost.......

This was 6/5/2016



This was today:


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## OneHitDone (Jun 26, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> It's all good if you tell me what you want to see I can post pics I might go veretical sooner than later because my newest addition to the flower tent is blowing up very unexpectedly and she has three sisters I have yet to flip. This is my Barney's blue cheese that's about six weeks from "seed" about a week in flower almost.......
> 
> This was 6/5/2016
> 
> ...


Now your getting some growth fast enough to make it worth opening the tent every day


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 26, 2016)

OneHitDone said:


> Now your getting some growth fast enough to make it worth opening the tent every day


Yup thanks to the help of some crazy old bastard I know


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## kiwipaulie (Jun 26, 2016)

I as taught by ttystikk to grow the plants at least half the height of your grow space before topping which I did on my last one and then when I went into flower they were about 1.6cm high In a 2m tent. Once stretch is over they will no doubt be by the roof. 

I have been vegging horizontally and then on the flip tying them back. But I'm considering ditching the veg tent as its getting old and replacing with a 4x4 like my flower tent and start vegging horizontally as well. I think I would get better yield.


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## OneHitDone (Jun 26, 2016)

kiwipaulie said:


> I as taught by ttystikk to grow the plants at least half the height of your grow space before topping which I did on my last one and then when I went into flower they were about 1.6cm high In a 2m tent. Once stretch is over they will no doubt be by the roof.
> 
> I have been vegging horizontally and then on the flip tying them back. But I'm considering ditching the veg tent as its getting old and replacing with a 4x4 like my flower tent and start vegging horizontally as well. I think I would get better yield.


You mean veg vertically?


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## kiwipaulie (Jun 26, 2016)

OneHitDone said:


> You mean veg vertically?


Lol yeah that's what I mean


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## gr865 (Jun 29, 2016)

I think I will veg horizontally for a few weeks before switching to vert.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 29, 2016)

Well I was coerced into buying a 600W ballast and a MH bulb so something will be happening lol......


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## gr865 (Jul 3, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Well I was coerced into buying a 600W ballast and a MH bulb so something will be happening lol......


I bet you will like it!
I may go up to the 600W on my next grow, need to see how this 400W works in the new tent along with a vert grow.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 6, 2016)

My bulb came in busted, requested return and ordered another one elsewhere. Aside from that still brain storming a design for my stand/trellises for the plants. I'd like to run 4 plants each time going vert with the 600W MH hanging vertically in my 3x3 that's oversized @ 39"x39"x79"

The Hortilux Gold E-ballast 600W is here already


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## gr865 (Jul 6, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> My bulb came in busted, requested return and ordered another one elsewhere. Aside from that still brain storming a design for my stand/trellises for the plants. I'd like to run 4 plants each time going vert with the 600W MH hanging vertically in my 3x3 that's oversized @ 39"x39"x79"
> 
> The Hortilux Gold E-ballast 600W is here already


I believe you can go with 5 plants in that size tent. Be sure to control the heat.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 6, 2016)

gr865 said:


> I believe you can go with 5 plants in that size tent. Be sure to control the heat.


Yes but I'd rather keep it to 4 and have a larger trellis per plant, kind of like a plant per wall of my perfectly square 3x3 and yes controlling heat will be and always is a challenge in my area especially during these summer months.


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## shake&bake (Jul 6, 2016)

@gr865 if you want the highest yield possible you have to veg vertical as well a lot of people will say vert sucks but not vegging vertically is why it will greatly decrease yield.


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## gr865 (Jul 6, 2016)

shake&bake said:


> @gr865 if you want the highest yield possible you have to veg vertical as well a lot of people will say vert sucks but not vegging vertically is why it will greatly decrease yield.


Thanks I appreciate the response.

And the reason for vegging vertical is?
Is it to get the branches on the back side of the plant to swing themselves toward the lamp? I am not questioning you at all just need the logic.


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## shake&bake (Jul 7, 2016)

I'm guessing it has something to do with all the addition nodes created from the light penetrating from the side not the top. Try a side by side if you want I've only ever done small scale mostly CFL. With lights between the plants. It's just what I've always read from journals of those trying for the first time. When they veg horizontal and flower vertical they always say yield sucks and they're going back to flat growing. But when they veg vert and flower vert yield is amazing.

Also if you want to lower heat extraction needs or your electricity bill or both they now make led light bulbs that would work for vert style growing. Just something I've been waiting to try. Unfortunately I'm back living with rents so that will have to wait.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 10, 2016)

Well, socket, ballast, and bulb are in, time to get cracking on trellis design and get the flood table into the 3x3........


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## gr865 (Jul 10, 2016)

shake&bake said:


> I'm guessing it has something to do with all the addition nodes created from the light penetrating from the side not the top. Try a side by side if you want I've only ever done small scale mostly CFL. With lights between the plants. It's just what I've always read from journals of those trying for the first time. When they veg horizontal and flower vertical they always say yield sucks and they're going back to flat growing. But when they veg vert and flower vert yield is amazing.
> 
> Also if you want to lower heat extraction needs or your electricity bill or both they now make led light bulbs that would work for vert style growing. Just something I've been waiting to try. Unfortunately I'm back living with rents so that will have to wait.


My last grow was a horzonal sort of SOG, 12 plant total, HPS died about 5 weeks from finish. I have a LED for back up and I added some CFL's in between the plant. 
Hard to say how it all worked because I had a bad case of fungal gnats.
I had a pic of it but I took my laptop in to the shop for some work so I downloaded all my MJ pics to a USB drive and lost the fucking drive. Over 4,000 total MJ pics, yrs of work. 

GR


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## OneHitDone (Jul 10, 2016)

shake&bake said:


> I'm guessing it has something to do with all the addition nodes created from the light penetrating from the side not the top. Try a side by side if you want I've only ever done small scale mostly CFL. With lights between the plants. It's just what I've always read from journals of those trying for the first time. When they veg horizontal and flower vertical they always say yield sucks and they're going back to flat growing. But when they veg vert and flower vert yield is amazing.
> 
> Also if you want to lower heat extraction needs or your electricity bill or both they now make led light bulbs that would work for vert style growing. Just something I've been waiting to try. Unfortunately I'm back living with rents so that will have to wait.


Can you please point me to one of these Corn Cob Led lights that can crank out at least 145000 lumens at 150+ lumen/watt?


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## shake&bake (Jul 11, 2016)

@OneHitDone no they would work very well for veg but the highest lumens I've seen is around 31,600 135lm/w. I got mine from eBay from ngtled you can get them in almost any k and either e26 or 39 base, the highest watts is 250. I've seen a lux meter pic of one putting out 92k at 4 in so they are bright, and that was one of the lights from Amazon which I own and nowhere near as bright. I just thought they showed promise

I get where your going with this but just figured people could save on cooling bills over the summer with one of these. That's all


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## OneHitDone (Jul 11, 2016)

shake&bake said:


> @OneHitDone no they would work very well for veg but the highest lumens I've seen is around 31,600 135lm/w. I got mine from eBay from ngtled you can get them in almost any k and either e26 or 39 base, the highest watts is 250. I've seen a lux meter pic of one putting out 92k at 4 in so they are bright, and that was one of the lights from Amazon which I own and nowhere near as bright. I just thought they showed promise


I keep envisioning standing some 6ft heatsinks upright in a circular pattern with small cobs all over the place. And maybe air cooled up the middle.
Mega Corn Cob!!


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 11, 2016)

Any issues throwing topped plants into a vert setup?

@OneHitDone


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## shake&bake (Jul 12, 2016)

@Evil-Mobo you know you don't have to train your plants onto a net you can just put them around a bulb. I would assume with topped plants they would just spread wider on a screen versus up.

@OneHitDone i looked into doing just this taking four 3.945in profiles from heat sinks USA and having them milled down and welded together and it was more than I made in a week. I guess I need a better job.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 12, 2016)

shake&bake said:


> @Evil-Mobo you know you don't have to train your plants onto a net you can just put them around a bulb. I would assume with topped plants they would just spread wider on a screen versus up.
> 
> @OneHitDone i looked into doing just this taking four 3.945in profiles from heat sinks USA and having them milled down and welded together and it was more than I made in a week. I guess I need a better job.


I know that now but I was not originally planning on these in a vert grow it was a much needed after thought


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 13, 2016)

Light mover will be here tomorrow


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## pinner420 (Jul 14, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Any issues throwing topped plants into a vert setup?
> 
> @OneHitDone
> 
> View attachment 3730216


Do it.


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## pinner420 (Jul 14, 2016)

I'm currently getting a couple old light movers implemented. 5 lights two plants. 
...x......x.....
........o........
........x........
........o........
...x.......x....
Vertically moving the bulb 6 feet using pulleys a 3 movers.


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## OneHitDone (Jul 14, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> I'm currently getting a couple old light movers implemented. 5 lights two plants.
> ...x......x.....
> ........o........
> ........x........
> ...


Is that 5 1K's?


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## pinner420 (Jul 14, 2016)

OneHitDone said:


> Is that 5 1K's?


315 center stage with 4 600s on the parameter.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 17, 2016)

Some progress for my vert bro's....... bare with me guys my health prevents me from chopping away big chunk of work at a time but trust me I want this done more than anyone else lol....

  

Will get this in the flower tent in a bit and then I can start measuring up for the trellis setup for each plant/wall.........


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 17, 2016)

Had to add in a support beam in the center to help with weight like in my 2x4 setup. I thought I might get away without it this time but no go lol......

Now need to keep pushing on the progress........


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 20, 2016)

Slowly but surely, I will post a final pic later today and explanation of changes made along the way. I can tell you guys, I have a new found respect for anyone who grows vertically. Not for the faint of heart in the work ethic department lol.


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## WindyCityKush (Jul 20, 2016)

So this is where ya been ? Lol looks good! Im subd


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## OneHitDone (Jul 20, 2016)

All of this vert growing has me excited!
I can't wait till the next Party Cup Comp - Can someone say Vertical 16oz'er?


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## pinner420 (Jul 20, 2016)

OneHitDone said:


> All of this vert growing has me excited!
> I can't wait till the next Party Cup Comp - Can someone say Vertical 16oz'er?


Are we allowed to make a rdwc cup?


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## OneHitDone (Jul 20, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> Are we allowed to make a rdwc cup?


Last round it was acceptable but there's talk of some rule changes.
Honestly, DWC in a cup was problems. Root took up so much space there was no water left in the cup and had to go to drip for the finish


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 20, 2016)

I'm in on a vert cup comp


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 20, 2016)

Here's a pic it's all done except the light mover which will be done in the near future.


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## gr865 (Jul 20, 2016)

Looking good my friend! How far into stretch are you, is a light mover necessary?

Just wondering,
GR


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 20, 2016)

gr865 said:


> Looking good my friend! How far into stretch are you, is a light mover necessary?
> 
> Just wondering,
> GR


The plant up front is halfway through flower so that's why I made her portable she will be done first. The other three it's day 2 of 12/12 for them so there will be a lot of stretch yet to come lol. The mover is already on hand and will just make sure the light spread is more even vs having two 600w bulbs. We will see how it works.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 20, 2016)

Ok,

So now that things have calmed down here I can write some stuff out. First off big thanks to brother @OneHitDone for all of his help via PM. I am using a 3x3 tent from Agromax. I have a 3x3 OD flood table up on a frame I built from 2x4's and it drains into a bin underneath. I use 3 gallon coco fabric pots and Nova Grow/Nova Bloom. I have been very happy with this combo since making the switch and the current SIP will be my last for the time being. I decided to put the SIP in the front as the "portable" unit because it's half way through flower already and would be coming out first. It also needs water the most frequently so...... 

I first had put up frames like on the SIP on the sides of the tent. I was not happy with this because it left a lot of space empty. I was going through all this trouble for empty space on a wall, I think not. So I took down the panels and ran the trellis fencing I bought on the back wall and the sides. I got a block of 2x4 for my fan to sit on in the center pointing up, and I took down the 315w CMH and put up the Blue MH 600w from Hortilux. I am running the Gold Series E Ballast made by them with a socket I got from growershouse. With the ballast outside the tent, my temps are actually lower a few degrees so far than when I had the 315w CMH which did surprise me. 

I have a light mover sitting here that will get setup soon but it needs to wait a bit so I do not do it twice.

I just took down my first harvest recently and this will be my second run to flower. I am excited to see bigger buds than last time and more frost. 

Cheers


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## Flowki (Jul 21, 2016)

shake&bake said:


> @gr865 if you want the highest yield possible you have to veg vertical as well a lot of people will say vert sucks but not vegging vertically is why it will greatly decrease yield.


What type of topping technique do you use to cover the trellis?. And nice setup evil.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 21, 2016)

Everyone seems happy so far, it's neat to start seeing the fan leaves reaching out for the light : )

It's also neat that there are 4 plants in an area where there was only one plant flowering before.


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## gr865 (Jul 21, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I first had put up frames like on the SIP on the sides of the tent. I was not happy with this because it left a lot of space empty. I was going through all this trouble for empty space on a wall, I think not. So I took down the panels and ran the trellis fencing I bought on the back wall and the sides. I got a block of 2x4 for my fan to sit on in the center pointing up, and I took down the 315w CMH and put up the Blue MH 600w from Hortilux. I am running the Gold Series E Ballast made by them with a socket I got from growershouse. With the ballast outside the tent, my temps are actually lower a few degrees so far than when I had the 315w CMH which did surprise me.


I am not up on the Blue MH 600W, but I did not think you could hang a MH vertical.
I hope I am wrong, and it may be just the cheap bulbs you can't hang but that what I remember from memory, big mistake depending on this ol' memory.
I like your set up bud!

GR


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 21, 2016)

gr865 said:


> I am not up on the Blue MH 600W, but I did not think you could hang a MH vertical.
> I hope I am wrong, and it may be just the cheap bulbs you can't hang but that what I remember from memory, big mistake depending on this ol' memory.
> I like your set up bud!
> 
> GR


No issues hanging this one vertically for sure I checked into it. Gonna run these bulbs until they release the 600w CMH then I will give that a try.

I do appreciate your thread and help, your portable setup inspired mine for the bucket, and I will; be running a similar setup as yours once the bucket is done and a plant in Coco takes it's place.

May I ask, what do you use for the bottom panel on your setups?

http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/specific/600w-Hortilux-Blue


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## gr865 (Jul 21, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> No issues hanging this one vertically for sure I checked into it. Gonna run these bulbs until they release the 600w CMH then I will give that a try.
> 
> I do appreciate your thread and help, your portable setup inspired mine for the bucket, and I will; be running a similar setup as yours once the bucket is done and a plant in Coco takes it's place.
> 
> ...


Bottom panel?


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 21, 2016)

Yes sorry the panel your pots sit on, my fencing is a semi hard plastic but it won't do to hold the plant on it. Obviously as you know we want something that let's the water through. So I am just curious what you are using looks sturdy


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## OneHitDone (Jul 21, 2016)

Just use some pvc legs and slap the fabric pot right on top of it


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 21, 2016)

OneHitDone said:


> Just use some pvc legs and slap the fabric pot right on top of it


I just didn't want the pot to be lumpy at the bottom if that makes sense. From being wet and what not would't the pot form to the pvc?


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## gr865 (Jul 21, 2016)

MIne is .25" PVC coated welded wire. I use it in my little backyard business. You can buy wire for the stand by the foot. You could use like a shelf From a refrigerator.
GR


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 21, 2016)

gr865 said:


> MIne is .25" PVC coated welded wire. I use it in my little backyard business. You can buy wire for the stand by the foot. You could use like a shelf From a refrigerator.
> GR



Thanks for the reply


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## Tim Fox (Jul 21, 2016)

wow bro i am high,, like a blue dream


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 21, 2016)

Tim Fox said:


> wow bro i am high,, like a blue dream


Lol good for you bro me too


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## Tim Fox (Jul 21, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Lol good for you bro me too


seemed more fun that photos and protons,, hahaha


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 21, 2016)

I got all the protons I need in this joint of Incredible Bulk. It's crazy when the dying plant produces smoke better than some of the healthy stuff.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 22, 2016)

Watering the vert setup for the first time today since getting it setup.......


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## Tim Fox (Jul 22, 2016)

seriously nice


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## OneHitDone (Jul 22, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Watering the vert setup for the first time today since getting it setup.......
> 
> View attachment 3739014 View attachment 3739015


I still can't believe your using T5's for veg


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 22, 2016)

OneHitDone said:


> I still can't believe your using T5's for veg


Yup such an ancient and inefficient technology


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## Tim Fox (Jul 22, 2016)

those t 5 pics are the bomb,, keep it just for the pictures bro


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 22, 2016)

Tim Fox said:


> those t 5 pics are the bomb,, keep it just for the pictures bro


T5 ain't going no where right now it's on a roll in that tent I just had to go and fuck with the flower tent some lol.......


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## Tim Fox (Jul 22, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> T5 ain't going no where right now it's on a roll in that tent I just had to go and fuck with the flower tent some lol.......


that vertical hung bulb in your tent sure brings back memories


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 22, 2016)

Tim Fox said:


> that vertical hung bulb in your tent sure brings back memories


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 5, 2016)

Well, after a recent mishap I am down to three plants flowering right now. Of the three left two looking a little light to me so we will see. I lost one plant, and two really suffered due to me being away too long and thinking they could handle it. In the midst of this we had record highs for heat and I was not here to adjust accordingly.

So here's where the tent was at today. I will be setting up a second 3x3 and running the 600w horizontal in there and doing some comparisons in the future. Between vert and horizontal growing. This first vert run is not fair to gain judgement of final yield now since I botched the run lol.....





I did some tying back today on the girl on the back wall and the one on the left. They needed it so let's see how she keeps responding to the light in the middle. I can see the possibilities here, can't wait to start a run with four new healthy girls.......

@WindyCityKush


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## gr865 (Aug 5, 2016)

Looking good EM, I am about a week to flip. Hoping for 75 to 100% stretch, will see, they did not stretch in veg like I was hoping.
I have not done a lot of defo yet, been tucking fans behind the screens and still using there power. I remove them when the branch they are supporting has large enough new fan to support the buds.

GR


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## WindyCityKush (Aug 5, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Well, after a recent mishap I am down to three plants flowering right now. Of the three left two looking a little light to me so we will see. I lost one plant, and two really suffered due to me being away too long and thinking they could handle it. In the midst of this we had record highs for heat and I was not here to adjust accordingly.
> 
> So here's where the tent was at today. I will be setting up a second 3x3 and running the 600w horizontal in there and doing some comparisons in the future. Between vert and horizontal growing. This first vert run is not fair to gain judgement of final yield now since I botched the run lol.....
> 
> ...


I know you probably wouldn't agree but those babies look nice. They will bounce back im sure. 
Although i hate to admit it, making mistakes and bad shit happening in my grow is a good thing because i learn from them. 
Catastrophes have happened in everyone's grow. Now that your cherrys been popped, it should be smooth sailing. 
You got this broski


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 5, 2016)

WindyCityKush said:


> I know you probably wouldn't agree but those babies look nice. They will bounce back im sure.
> Although i hate to admit it, making mistakes and bad shit happening in my grow is a good thing because i learn from them.
> Catastrophes have happened in everyone's grow. Now that your cherrys been popped, it should be smooth sailing.
> You got this broski


Thanks bro, you have a bunch of stuff going on over there, I'm busy trying to just keep track lol. But everything is looking good. We will see what happens with the GG grow....... this to me was just such a silly mistake you know, and when you try so hard and are getting the results you want it's a blow to the growing ego, especially on my second grow 

This is my meds, and I have a close family member ill now too who needs some in the form of caps, so it's for us. I should know better. But yes I will learn from it. The last plant I grew out that everyone said to kill gave me almost two ounces of some of my favorite buds from the first run.


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 6, 2016)

gr865 said:


> Looking good EM, I am about a week to flip. Hoping for 75 to 100% stretch, will see, they did not stretch in veg like I was hoping.
> I have not done a lot of defo yet, been tucking fans behind the screens and still using there power. I remove them when the branch they are supporting has large enough new fan to support the buds.
> 
> GR


I'm trying my best to get what I can from the plants left in there. I am not expecting anything major. I just transplanted to lanky clones from solo cups to 1 gallon pots to see how they progress, plan is to pick the best between the two and up plant to a final container of 3 gal and put her into the spot on the wall where I lost a plant, or maybe leave both in 1 gal pots and run them simultaneously on the same wall we shall see. The plants will tell me what they want in due time.


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## DesertGrow89 (Aug 6, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> View attachment 3750393
> View attachment 3750394
> 
> 
> ...


Your garden looks kick-ass, good job! Were the fan leaves on the plant in the back lost because of excessive heat or did you prune them intentionally?


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 6, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> Your garden looks kick-ass, good job! Were the fan leaves on the plant in the back lost because of excessive heat or did you prune them intentionally?


I stepped away on vacation for a week and lost them to excessive heat and lack of water. It's my fault and on me so I am trying to salvage what I can on these girls. Thanks for the kind words. My absence in conjunction with record highs.......


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 8, 2016)

Here's a quick shot of the Blue cheese in my Sip contraption today before lights out:


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 9, 2016)

Started the flush on the Blue Cheese today, day 49. What's there looks good, but this run does not look like it will be pleasing in the end as far as yields, but that is on me for the week away where I lost a plant and had to trim a lot off of the two that didn't have buds yet, as well as cutting off a few big branches to force the Blue Cheese to go vert. 

Shameful pics, but pics none the less.............I have a lot to learn yet


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## pinner420 (Aug 9, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Started the flush on the Blue Cheese today, day 49. What's there looks good, but this run does not look like it will be pleasing in the end as far as yields, but that is on me for the week away where I lost a plant and had to trim a lot off of the two that didn't have buds yet, as well as cutting off a few big branches to force the Blue Cheese to go vert.
> 
> Shameful pics, but pics none the less.............I have a lot to learn yet
> 
> View attachment 3753625 View attachment 3753626 View attachment 3753627


Have you considered autopots?


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 9, 2016)

I have been plenty happy with the switch to fabric at this point honestly but never rule anything out.


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## OneHitDone (Aug 9, 2016)

Next thing we know @Evil-Mobo will have some dwc bubbling in his tents


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 9, 2016)

OneHitDone said:


> Next thing we know @Evil-Mobo will have some dwc bubbling in his tents


Working on researching that more. It has been my Achilles heel so far...........


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## gr865 (Aug 9, 2016)

You guys must not have a lot of heat in your living space, I gets damn hot around here, without a chiller it would be damn impossible to do. l have an AC where I draw my air, high 70's low 80's lights on, mid to high 60's lights off. But my rez to feed my Blumats is around 86 degrees. I am rerouting my intake air to exit onto the rez, also using some ice bottles.
I would love to try it, maybe someday.

GR


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 9, 2016)

gr865 said:


> You guys must not have a lot of heat in your living space, I gets damn hot around here, without a chiller it would be damn impossible to do. l have an AC where I draw my air, high 70's low 80's lights on, mid to high 60's lights off. But my rez to feed my Blumats is around 86 degrees. I am rerouting my intake air to exit onto the rez, also using some ice bottles.
> I would love to try it, maybe someday.
> 
> GR


That's exactly what my issue is the heat lol and why I have not yet been successful with DWC in my opinion. I would be interested in trying a recirculating system with larger containers to see if the larger volume of water stays cooler than single 5 gallon bucket DWC setups that also in my opinion do not hold enough water and are too unstable for PH etc as standalone units.


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## WindyCityKush (Aug 9, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> That's exactly what my issue is the heat lol and why I have not yet been successful with DWC in my opinion. I would be interested in trying a recirculating system with larger containers to see if the larger volume of water stays cooler than single 5 gallon bucket DWC setups that also in my opinion do not hold enough water and are too unstable for PH etc as standalone units.


Im considering making a reservoir outside of the grow room itself. Drip/timer setup nothing continuous so that noise wont be an issue. Summer months are killing me as well. I have central air but for security reasons grow room door must stay shut.
Oan: I've always wanted to try a good blue cheese strain so i def look forward to seeing the smoke report on this


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 9, 2016)

WindyCityKush said:


> Im considering making a reservoir outside of the grow room itself. Drip/timer setup nothing continuous so that noise wont be an issue. Summer months are killing me as well. I have central air but for security reasons grow room door must stay shut.
> Oan: I've always wanted to try a good blue cheese strain so i def look forward to seeing the smoke report on this


The BC smells out of control since it was a baby it was stinking up whatever space it was in. I just wish there was more of her lol. But I do have more of the same seeds from Barneys so not a big deal


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## OneHitDone (Aug 10, 2016)

gr865 said:


> You guys must not have a lot of heat in your living space, I gets damn hot around here, without a chiller it would be damn impossible to do. l have an AC where I draw my air, high 70's low 80's lights on, mid to high 60's lights off. But my rez to feed my Blumats is around 86 degrees. I am rerouting my intake air to exit onto the rez, also using some ice bottles.
> I would love to try it, maybe someday.
> 
> GR


Your res 6° above room temp?
Something is directly heating it up


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## gr865 (Aug 10, 2016)

WindyCityKush said:


> Im considering making a reservoir outside of the grow room itself. Drip/timer setup nothing continuous so that noise wont be an issue. Summer months are killing me as well. I have central air but for security reasons grow room door must stay shut.
> Oan: I've always wanted to try a good blue cheese strain so i def look forward to seeing the smoke report on this


If you are concerned about noise, check out Blumats, no noise at all.


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## gr865 (Aug 10, 2016)

OneHitDone said:


> Your res 6° above room temp?
> Something is directly heating it up


Yes, I believe it is the radiant heat from the bulb, I have put the intake air line right against the base of the rez. Yes it did make a diffference, The rez is the same temp as the room, 80 degrees with lights on, will check to tonight just before the lights come on. Should be a big difference.
I like the temp of the room now that I got rid of that faulty remote temp gage.
Thanks for the help.
GR


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 10, 2016)

Here's where the girls were a bit earlier today, the nugs on the Blue Cheese are getting very dense so maybe there is hope for it lol. 

Blue Cheese:
 

Here's the Critical Kush:

 

And here's the Pineapple Chunk:


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 13, 2016)

this fell off the Blue cheese while working in the tent today, will let it dry out and see what's up, she's only on day 53 so.......


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## DesertGrow89 (Aug 13, 2016)

gr865 said:


> Yes, I believe it is the radiant heat from the bulb, I have put the intake air line right against the base of the rez. Yes it did make a diffference, The rez is the same temp as the room, 80 degrees with lights on, will check to tonight just before the lights come on. Should be a big difference.
> I like the temp of the room now that I got rid of that faulty remote temp gage.
> Thanks for the help.
> GR


Ideally you want cold water it has more dissolved oxygen, in the sixties would be good not sure if you are able to hand water or not..


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## DesertGrow89 (Aug 13, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> this fell off the Blue cheese while working in the tent today, will let it dry out and see what's up, she's only on day 53 so.......
> 
> View attachment 3756770


Nice, I like to sample small nugs a week out from the minimum time they are done and continue until the high feels right. 

Also you obviously want swollen calyxes and most of the pistils to be fully colored.


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 13, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> Nice, I like to sample small nugs a week out from the minimum time they are done and continue until the high feels right.
> 
> Also you obviously want swollen calyxes and most of the pistils to be fully colored.


Yes this truly fell off by accident. the plant still has another week just to hit 60 days and all trichs are still clear so I would not think of pulling her down right now. She has beefed up a lot late here too so I'm not exactly in a hurry lol. I rushed my first plant and said I would not do that again. Was not worth it in the end to do so.


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 15, 2016)

Shot of the Blue Cheese today, still should be about a week to go.


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 18, 2016)

Well today was the day, here she was after a quick haircut before hanging up. We shall see when she dries what the yield is, the nugs are very dense but I am not expecting a miracle on this run here.


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## Frajola (Aug 18, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Well today was the day, here she was after a quick haircut before hanging up. We shall see when she dries what the yield is, the nugs are very dense but I am not expecting a miracle on this run here.
> 
> View attachment 3760737


I liked the style hair cut on tree, lol. I'm going vert for the next devil's lettuce grow, planning a mix w autos and vert4 photos. I had autos mixed w photos without knowing they were auto, and ended up loving then. Going vert will open some extra room right under the bulbs enough light 4 then, and Im having now some ak, hindu kush and lemon h all autos , can't complain at all ! Have some photos that I think will be done by Sunday I guess, survivors from a disastrous beginning. 
I liked ur net , plastic looks easier to handle, sorry gotta ask, that pipe is for watering?and which strain is that peat? 
thanks friend


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 18, 2016)

Frajola said:


> I liked the style hair cut on tree, lol. I'm going vert for the next devil's lettuce grow, planning a mix w autos and vert4 photos. I had autos mixed w photos without knowing they were auto, and ended up loving then. Going vert will open some extra room right under the bulbs enough light 4 then, and Im having now some ak, hindu kush and lemon h all autos , can't complain at all ! Have some photos that I think will be done by Sunday I guess, survivors from a disastrous beginning.
> I liked ur net , plastic looks easier to handle, sorry gotta ask, that pipe is for watering?and which strain is that peat?
> thanks friend


Yes it's PVC pipe, and the strain I am sorry is Barney's Blue Cheese


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## gr865 (Aug 18, 2016)

If compact as you say, 31 g's, that's my guess, nice grow there my Bud, I am at least 52 days behind you with my BC. Thanks for all your input.

GR


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 18, 2016)

gr865 said:


> If compact as you say, 31 g's, that's my guess, nice grow there my Bud, I am at least 52 days behind you with my BC. Thanks for all your input.
> 
> GR


Thanks we shall see. I try not to guess too much. This strain is very good to work with I just changed too many things through the grow. I do have more seeds though and will be running it again most definitely.


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 20, 2016)




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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 20, 2016)

95.75g in jars 

Much better yield than I expected from this one plant but I am not happy because I know she has more to give me. One of the two top colas was almost 10g, I will be running this strain again in the future I am not done with her.


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## gr865 (Aug 20, 2016)

/That has only dried for 3 days? Man you got lot's to go on that one. Get a good dry, jar and cure. Just my thought!
GR


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 20, 2016)

gr865 said:


> /That has only dried for 3 days? Man you got lot's to go on that one. Get a good dry, jar and cure. Just my thought!
> GR


Started it's cure tonight bro. Yes three days drying after hanging but it started drying in flush before chopping after the last watering, when I wet trim in my environment my buds usually dry in 3-4 days in my closet. It's what works for me. Branches almost snapping completely but not quite. I tried only pulling fan leaves last run with part of my harvest vs the wet trim. The wet trim dried faster and was fine. The other flowers took longer to dry and ended up with mold and in the garbage.


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## OneHitDone (Aug 20, 2016)

Your mold was in those buds before being hung to dry 

Over 3 zips from a single plants is nothing to sneeze at under any circumstances


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 20, 2016)

OneHitDone said:


> Your mold was in those buds before being hung to dry
> 
> Over 3 zips from a single plants is nothing to sneeze at under any circumstances


You really think so? (on the mold) Thing is why didn't the other half have mold then? She was a big bitch but she had the tent to herself maybe too humid during flower?

And thanks for the kind words, I will definitely be giving this a run again.


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## OneHitDone (Aug 20, 2016)

Could be any of what you mentioned. But I would bet 95% of bud rot is there before hitting the drying rack
Out west most agree plants hung dried, then manicured have better aromas
But as with everything in this game there are exceptions and everyone has their own conditions and ways of doing things


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 20, 2016)

A dehu is on the list but needs to wait a bit so for the time being I just feel safer knowing what works.......... I can revisit this later of curse things can always change and I am not closed off to a different way. This plant was easy because she has a good bud to leaf ratio. That's another reason I did the wet trim. I did it by hand with gloves on there was so little leaves lol.


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## gr865 (Aug 31, 2016)

HOw goes it bud, have not heard from you in a bit.


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 31, 2016)

gr865 said:


> HOw goes it bud, have not heard from you in a bit.


It's going good brother. Flowers smoke great and are almost out lol. I came to the conclusion as many have that to take full advantage of the vert grow setup you need to veg the plants vert also and they take quite a bit of light. It's just not for me and my setups at this time. In the process of expanding a little right now, getting the 240 in etc. You girls are looking great wish mine went that well in the vert grow. The other two in the tent with mine that got chopped were thrown out. They just didn't look to me like they would be worth the yield after the burning and drying from my time away not too long ago.


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## gr865 (Aug 31, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> It's going good brother. Flowers smoke great and are almost out lol. I came to the conclusion as many have that to take full advantage of the vert grow setup you need to veg the plants vert also and they take quite a bit of light. It's just not for me and my setups at this time. In the process of expanding a little right now, getting the 240 in etc. You girls are looking great wish mine went that well in the vert grow. The other two in the tent with mine that got chopped were thrown out. They just didn't look to me like they would be worth the yield after the burning and drying from my time away not too long ago.


I know what you mean, I am fairly down about my shit now. Working my ass off to try and get it right, and trying to figure out what the fuck caused it.
My best guess is some kind of lock out, not sure how when all my feeding were carefully measured and the numbers where always spot on. So I am flushing the crap out of them, have done a 2 gallon flush in each 2 gallon smart pot with 310 ppm/5.85 pH. I drained and refilled the rez with that same mix. Tonight after lights on I and going to pull the plants out again and flush this time with pH'ed RO, rain water mix with Drip Clean, my rain water is 2 ppm and 5.5 pH and fairly clean of trash, I strain it. I will be flushing each plant until the ppm is consistently low and the pH is near the 5.8 they will be flushed with. I will then refill the rez with low ppm and proper pH mix.
I am thinking trying to salvage BC1 is not going to worth it so I am going to chop the entire top of the bitch, see if I can do anything with the side branching and if not chop that whore to the ground.
Hope you start a new post when you begin the new grow.
Later,
GR


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## Evil-Mobo (Sep 6, 2016)

gr865 said:


> I know what you mean, I am fairly down about my shit now. Working my ass off to try and get it right, and trying to figure out what the fuck caused it.
> My best guess is some kind of lock out, not sure how when all my feeding were carefully measured and the numbers where always spot on. So I am flushing the crap out of them, have done a 2 gallon flush in each 2 gallon smart pot with 310 ppm/5.85 pH. I drained and refilled the rez with that same mix. Tonight after lights on I and going to pull the plants out again and flush this time with pH'ed RO, rain water mix with Drip Clean, my rain water is 2 ppm and 5.5 pH and fairly clean of trash, I strain it. I will be flushing each plant until the ppm is consistently low and the pH is near the 5.8 they will be flushed with. I will then refill the rez with low ppm and proper pH mix.
> I am thinking trying to salvage BC1 is not going to worth it so I am going to chop the entire top of the bitch, see if I can do anything with the side branching and if not chop that whore to the ground.
> Hope you start a new post when you begin the new grow.
> ...


I have a log going on my adventures with a pack of Gorilla Glue seeds from elev8 seeds:
https://www.rollitup.org/t/elev8-seeds-gorilla-glue-regs.912527/

Not sure how many more logs I will be doing, they take a lot of time to keep up on them properly but we will see. 

I got the 240 in already and the new tent up for flower, also built my first RDWC setup yesterday but it will be a bit before the plants are ready to go in there. We will see. Hope all is well with the grow.


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## Evil-Mobo (Dec 31, 2016)

Ok so rather than start an entirely new thread, I figured I'd jump in here again. 

I am "toying" with the idea of another vert style grow in the future. If you guys had 1/2 of a 5x9 tent to use for this endeavor, how would you set it up. I have vertical sockets and 1K HPS bulbs. 

Happy New Year Everyone.


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## Tim Fox (Dec 31, 2016)

Stadium seating


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## Frajola (Dec 31, 2016)

I cant find th e tread w the vert x spiral garden , a Canadian guy has over 200 plants ( soil less) in one small set up . I got find him again ....and a vert bare bulb also.


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## ttystikk (Jan 5, 2017)

Frajola said:


> I cant find th e tread w the vert x spiral garden , a Canadian guy has over 200 plants ( soil less) in one small set up . I got find him again ....and a vert bare bulb also.


I saw that grow. Awesome, but scary plant count.


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## ttystikk (Jan 5, 2017)

Tim Fox said:


> Stadium seating


This. 

Hang the two lamps as if your tent was two smaller square tents. Hanging the lamps in the middle will just starve the plants at the ends for light while frying the ones in the middle.


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## OneHitDone (Apr 16, 2018)

Giddy Up @Evil-Mobo , this project getting off the ground or what?


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

LOL

I am waiting for more input from a few folks.

I went back to this thread and saw that the grow really wasn't going bad I just screwed the pooch when I went away on vaca and let the plants dry out. Also guess moving towards LED after this grow kinda took me away from the vert idea.

Right now my head is spinning with ideas.

I just really can't find a lot of feedback on the use of cool tubes and would not mind running bare bulb at all but concerned with heat...................

Then back and forth on whether I should cage the plants or just let them rip straight up.............

For the rest of the world @OneHitDone I will explain the situation........

Short and simple I am finally in a spot where I can make a move towards hydro and with brother @OneHitDone help I am in the process of implementing that plan. I will be running a recirculating top feed using square 9" pots and 6" Flora Flex caps. After testing the veg with the 6" pots that came with the caps it's evident I need something larger for veg as I have roots out the bottom in just a hair over a week. So the switch to the larger containers for veg and flower will just make the grow all the more easier. Just move pots when it's time to flip no transplanting. 

Anyhow, I have a 400W blue MH hanging in my 3x3 running the veg setup, here's a pic from 5 days ago

 


My first question is this as I am actually running slightly cool in here but partly also because only one 600 watt HPS is on. IS there any benefit to just hanging the Blue MH bare bulb in here for veg?


So now moving on. After discussing the use of the "mega garden" with brother @OneHitDone I ordered one and fired up my closet again. It's a 2z2 F&D setup that is slick as all hell. I decided to shut down one of my tents to make it a dedicated dry space. This closet will keep a mom or to, get the clones going, and run the F&D, that's a two foot four bulb T5 in there which I just got in and I remember why I love T5 so much. 

 

 


So moving further along. Now the flower space. So here's where my vertical space starts to become a premium for real. In veg no biggie because I won't be vegging to the top of the tent lol. The switch to hydro here costs me 18" of vertical space, add that onto the 12" my Raptor hoods take up hanging at the highest possible setting and you're at 30". Now add the 9" from the pots and we are at 39". With only 6.5 feet of space floor to ceiling you see where the issue comes in. I would have very little space left even witrhout considering a decent amount of space between the lights and the canopy. 

The hydro setup will not be changed. I am disabled and this was all planned and designed to lessen my workload vs hand watering the entire garden DTW. And now with two of the spaces Hydro I can tell you the soil will keep for the outside veggies, indoors hydro for me whenever possible. 

So as much as I love my raptors I wanted to find another (Non-LED) @ttystikk solution and I havee on hand my 600 watt hortilux gold ballast and Blue MH and Super HPS bulbs as well.

My flower tent is a 4x8 and here's a pic from a few days ago. The right side is empty and I will be constructing my tray stand and setting up the hydro for that side soon for the girls currently in veg.

 

So then what's the best way to go about this, do I hang one 600 in the center of each tray bare bulb and let them rip? Plant natural with stakes or a cage? Cool Tubes? 

Do I stack both lights in the center between both trays? 

Cage around the lights or cage up the walls, etc? My head is spinning LOL.......


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

Well I ordered one of these a little while ago, figured I can test this out and see how the temps do.................when I build out the stand and what not for the empty side of the 4x8 this will give me a decent idea not exact on how bad temps might get I guess having both HPS running despite one being in a hood. 

Anyways it's $24 and can't be a bad thing to have lying around........

http://yourhydrostore.com/grow-lights/lighting-accessories/socket-assembly-5kv-w-15-ft-cord


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

Ok I got the breaker from the grow room switched from 15A to 20A.

Also came in to check on the closet and the veg tent.

Closet is rocking and rolling with the F&D and the clones look good. I am testing rooting right into rockwool and have a clone dome enroute right now the cuts are in my make shift dome. I am testing a couple before giving the cuts in the closet a haircut.

  

Here's a couple shots of the veg tent with the recirculating top drip setup. It's much cooler in here temp wise than I'd like I turned the adjustment on the exhaust fan down to the lowest setting to see of it helps.

Wonder if the 400 watt blue mh would be better hung vertically in here bare for me ?




And a shot of my outdoor veggies for this year which I put into the pots this last weekend as well as my sunflower that I started from seed indoors and put outside over this past weekend.



Thanks for checking in I will post pics of the flower tent later tonight when the lights come on. I run my 12/12 over night.


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## Cold$moke (Apr 17, 2018)

Make sure your setup can handle a 20 amp breaker

Other then that


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> Make sure your setup can handle a 20 amp breaker
> 
> Other then that


What the lights being used in the room? I'm at about 16.5 amps once I hang the second 600 watt in the 4x8 so it'll leave head room . Wire gauge was the same on the panel for both so I swapped the 20a not being used in place of the 15a


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## Cold$moke (Apr 17, 2018)

Can i ask why you want to go vert?

I never tried it my self but was wondering what convinced you?

I myself am thinking of adding about half my rooms square footage by 
Turning my production side of my room into 
A double stacked led strip grow.

Half my room Will be for running seeds out and the other half will be geared towards production.

Got the idea when i told myself i was making a seed setup but didnt want to lose half my room .

Then it hit me and i was like shit i can stack em


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> Can i ask why you want to go vert?
> 
> I never tried it my self but was wondering what convinced you?
> 
> ...


Because of the height I am losing going to hydro Inside the tents


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## Cold$moke (Apr 17, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> What the lights being used in the room? I'm at about 16.5 amps once I hang the second 600 watt in the 4x8 so it'll leave head room . Wire gauge was the same on the panel for both so I swapped the 20a not being used in place of the 15a


Cool just wanted to make sure dont want a homie to lose his place right 

Also make sure your Receptacles are also 20 amp  if so your g2g


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> Cool just wanted to make sure dont want a homie to lose his place right
> 
> Also make sure your Receptacles are also 20 amp  if so your g2g


Haha no fires brother I'm a retired Fireman god forbid. But good looking out


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## Cold$moke (Apr 17, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Because of the height I am losing going to hydro Inside the tents


Ok i think im following your reason now

Drop the light grow the plants taller in your tent type thing?


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> Ok i think im following your reason now
> 
> Drop the light grow the plants taller in your tent type thing?


Exactly


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## Cold$moke (Apr 17, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Haha no fires brother I'm a retired Fireman god forbid. But good looking out


Awsome, yea just dont want a dude to put a 20 on a barely able to hold 15 circut lol

But you know all about that shit lol

Edit to add that would be some ironic shit though


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## DST (Apr 17, 2018)

Will check things out more when I gotta min bru. Subbed.


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

DST said:


> Will check things out more when I gotta min bru. Subbed.


Thanks bro looking forward to your input


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## coreywebster (Apr 17, 2018)

I think having the MH horizontal lends itself better to flowering plants that you would rotate. Something like the bushes you already have.
But if you plan to train like Sedan or ttystikk and have a wall of bud or a circle of bud then probably better to veg vert too.

I also think you could carry on horizontal though and still be fine with your loss in height.
Ive always had 7ft tents but I can do everything I need in 5ft space, especially since I switched to led and more so started going to town with the super cropping. Having something which looks much like a scrog in canopy depth but without the hassle of training in a net.
I was running coco DTW, not full hydro but I did have the plants on big drain trays high enough to have a small res to catch run off under the trays. Probably about 1 ft of space used below the base of the cloth pots.
Looking at your flowing plants in post 127 you could just splay em after stretch, flatten them right out , you would probably up your yield just doing that alone.
Anyhow, Just my 2pence worth..


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

coreywebster said:


> I think having the MH horizontal lends itself better to flowering plants that you would rotate. Something like the bushes you already have.
> But if you plan to train like Sedan or ttystikk and have a wall of bud or a circle of bud then probably better to veg vert too.
> 
> I also think you could carry on horizontal though and still be fine with your loss in height.
> ...


Maybe I should do one side vert and keep the one raptor up where it is and see whats up lol.......


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## coreywebster (Apr 17, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Maybe I should do one side vert and keep the one raptor up where it is and see whats up lol.......


Sounds ideal if you can.


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## SheldonCooper (Apr 17, 2018)

I sub of for this adventure.


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## DST (Apr 17, 2018)

ok. so i have always wanted to do what i mentioned in the email and what you said you were planning....but never had the opporchancity!
Firstly. You can veg normally under horizontal lights....to a certain degree. I do. Then i "verticalise" the plant using stakes to stretch all the branches back so it looks like its been flattened. You can then train into a net.
I use cheap tomato nets meaning no worries when harvesting as you can cut away at the net and just hang another if left too scraggly. You could have that hung around all the walls of the room/tent. You could then have a middle parting to create the 2 seperate chambers using more netting. Perhaps a double layer with a space between for air flow as you would have 2 plants back to back. Some say rigid nets are best but i find the tomato nets allow the plants to lean forward slightly which gives them some space behind for air flow.
I would then sit a can filter in the middle of each space and if going for 2 lights on each side then i would stack 2 cool tubes on top of this (you can choose if you prefer the fan sucking or blowing through the tubes.) I would use a seperate inline fan for each side to be safe. Then just duct the air out from the top of the tubes out of the tent. Filters on the floor will allow for more height.
Place as many oscillating fans in there as possible. This way you can avoid worrying about heat going up top. With 2 fans you'd be shifting enough air in and out. Plenty air movement always helps in such a small packed space.
I would have 1 to 2 plants per wall depending on strain...i.e my dog fills a wall quicker than its sister strain blue pit or even gg4. As for access. With hydro i guess its a bit more difficult to have mobile plants. Maybe you could do a couple of organic soil plants in there.
Of course the lighing is questionable given the modern tech that is becoming available. However if you want to continue with the hid hps 6s (because we do love our 6s) i would then supplement with cmh/mh for spectrum.
I am off to finish my dram and my joint. Feel free to ask/comment whatev's.
Peace DST


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

DST said:


> ok. so i have always wanted to do what i mentioned in the email and what you said you were planning....but never had the opporchancity!
> Firstly. You can veg normally under horizontal lights....to a certain degree. I do. Then i "verticalise" the plant using stakes to stretch all the branches back so it looks like its been flattened. You can then train into a net.
> I use cheap tomato nets meaning no worries when harvesting as you can cut away at the net and just hang another if left too scraggly. You could have that hung around all the walls of the room/tent. You could then have a middle parting to create the 2 seperate chambers using more netting. Perhaps a double layer with a space between for air flow as you would have 2 plants back to back. Some say rigid nets are best but i find the tomato nets allow the plants to lean forward slightly which gives them some space behind for air flow.
> I would then sit a can filter in the middle of each space and if going for 2 lights on each side then i would stack 2 cool tubes on top of this (you can choose if you prefer the fan sucking or blowing through the tubes.) I would use a seperate inline fan for each side to be safe. Then just duct the air out from the top of the tubes out of the tent. Filters on the floor will allow for more height.
> ...


Is the net/cage a necessity? Can I just do the light in the center of the 4x4 and grow 4 plants in the corners of the 4x4 with stakes?

I went and measured and I would have 5 feet to the ceiling of the tent or subtract a foot with the raptor hoods. This does not account for distance to canopy...........if you look back in this thread I did the walls before but botched the grow letting the plants dry out. I had a 600 bare in the 3x3 but was getting a little burn.........

I'm basically just looking for the best way to use my space without it being a headache. The hydro took away me having to hand water the entire room so.........

And yes I want to use my HPS/Blue MH 600's I am taking down the COB's the plants just don't grow the way I like under LED and there's a couple of other things but I'm not trying to turn this into LED vs HID there's plenty of that shit elsewhere on the forum. I want to and am going to hang both 600's again and I got the Blue MH for veg up already and the T5 in the closet.


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## DST (Apr 17, 2018)

You could also do without the netting. it helps to get a more even vertical canopy. But enough stakes and using ties across the stakes also works.


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

DST said:


> You could also do without the netting. it helps to get a more even vertical canopy. But enough stakes and using ties across the stakes also works.


Ok i ordered one vert mount socket to try bare on one side before spending the $$ on the cool tube just to see how the temps hold up if not I will get two cool tubes in there with both 600's then later see if I need to supplement with more light


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

As promised pic of the 4x8 need to check the other log but we should be a few days past 30 days of 12/12 now. Smelling great in here and lots of trichs already.


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

Union break


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

Prepping for the new setup little by little. Got the COB's down and left the one ratchet hanger I will need for the vert socket . My veg tent is all clones and I can split them up evenly . I might do one side vert and leave the hood as is to see what performs how with cuts. Then after I can put the other hood up or set the left side up with a vert bulb we shall see decisions decisions.

Friday most likely the stand will get built for the tray on the empty side and I'll get the tray cleaned and the 600 in place as the socket should be here . By mid week next week the right side should be ready for plants but I'm not rushing the plants in veg no need to. So let's see what happens. I want to try bare bulb to see what happens with temps . If not I'll order a cool tube and we can go from there.


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

So I have seen a lot of talk as of late from some of the LED fan boys saying you can't get close to an hps A/C because you'll burn/bleach your plants. These folks have obviously never used an A/C HID because I never get that........ This plant is about 33 days into flower


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 17, 2018)

Checked the log we are at 33 days of 12/12 today. Stretch is over so i propped up the two smaller plants up front on empty #3 nursery pots to get them closer to the light . Right at 24" now



And a view from the Captains chair.....


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## zep_lover (Apr 17, 2018)

i veg horizontal and flower vert.i used to use 2 600 hps bare bulb in two 4 foot x4 foot x6 foot high osb cabinets.i had a third cabinet with cool tubes stacked and 2 600 hps in there also.all cabinets had 6 inch vans which i then up graded to 8 inch and bigger filters for better smell and heat.the cool tube cabinet actually ran a few degrees hotter if i remember correctly but all three were very close.all my plants were tied to screens on the walls.was a huge pain to get in and work on.when running vert,training is very important or you will end up with a ton of larf.i now do vert led with 4 cxb lights hanging about 18 inches from my screens.i find access ismuch easier.my patient caused me to start this way due to his bad back.he could roll around on a desk chair and do most of the work.this is one of my hps cabinets


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## zep_lover (Apr 17, 2018)

here is another few shots where you can see the filter at the top.very easy to get burned this way trimming and tieing when the lights are on.the back wall was the hardest.hope your tent opens from all sides will make much easier.the plant in front of the door was on a shelf mounted to door.the hydro system is a home made one i learned about on ic mag called a ppk .i also vegged in the cabinet for 3 to 4 weeks before flipping with the hps bulbs to get more stretch.back then i was running alot of strains that did not stretch much till i got gg4.she gives good stretch.


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 18, 2018)

So my 4x8 has access on all sides............

Was thinking maybe for this vert experience to combine what I wanted to do with your suggestion @DST.........

What if I did hang a trellis in the center to split the tent, and then run net up the back wall and the other side wall on the right, then setup two of the plant in the front with their own support or a tomato cage etc.............? I could access the back wall and the right side from their perspective sides, then access the left side wall from the front and the two front plants would be doing their own thing not on the wall? This should max out space right? Will just take some trial and error with strains to get plants that easily fill the wall. I was thinking since it will be hydro (2) plants per wall and two independent pots on the front ?

Then just hang the 600 in the center of the tray and let her rip.........if it's too hot bare get a cool tube........?

This is where my heads at right now.........

Thoughts?


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## OneHitDone (Apr 18, 2018)

The other thing to consider here if your talking a single 600 per 4x4 is "vertical coverage"
For those who have used vertical 600's, how many inches of vertical canopy can Mobo ecpext to have good light coverage on without moving the lamp up and down with a mover etc?
As we see @zep_lover has his lamps double stacked


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## GroErr (Apr 18, 2018)

Hey Evil, another twist in the adventures I see, subbed to see this beast!

One thought that came to mind in the latest conversation around the single 600, 2x 315w stacked CMH bulbs would provide nice coverage. Plus it's about the only tech you _haven't_ used in flowering


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 18, 2018)

GroErr said:


> Hey Evil, another twist in the adventures I see, subbed to see this beast!
> 
> One thought that came to mind in the latest conversation around the single 600, 2x 315w stacked CMH bulbs would provide nice coverage. Plus it's about the only tech you _haven't_ used in flowering


Not true I loved my.okd sunsytem 315 cmh and only sold it when I switched my old grow to 240v 

And good to have you tagging along

Actually I think back in this thread is a pic of the 315 over one of my Barney's plants

Edit: Check out page 3 G


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## GroErr (Apr 18, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Not true I loved my.okd sunsytem 315 cmh and only sold it when I switched my old grow to 240v
> 
> And good to have you tagging along
> 
> ...


Lol, ok then the new tech is off the table. Still not a bad option, better spread/coverage and close to the same power other than the extra ballast. Only thing is you probably don't have those around and they require those special ballasts...


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## vertnugs (Apr 18, 2018)

OneHitDone said:


> The other thing to consider here if your talking a single 600 per 4x4 is "vertical coverage"
> For those who have used vertical 600's, how many inches of vertical canopy can Mobo ecpext to have good light coverage on without moving the lamp up and down with a mover etc?
> As we see @zep_lover has his lamps double stacked


36ish inches is a safe guess.

But who's to say......i may be ok with those smaller nugs at the bottom on a 48 inch canopy......he might not want them.But after 6 years straight of a single 600 i'd go with 36ish inches of decent usable light.


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## DST (Apr 18, 2018)

OneHitDone said:


> The other thing to consider here if your talking a single 600 per 4x4 is "vertical coverage"
> For those who have used vertical 600's, how many inches of vertical canopy can Mobo ecpext to have good light coverage on without moving the lamp up and down with a mover etc?
> As we see @zep_lover has his lamps double stacked


i would say around 90cm max. I have double stacked lights for this very reason.


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 18, 2018)

vertnugs said:


> 36ish inches is a safe guess.
> 
> But who's to say......i may be ok with those smaller nugs at the bottom on a 48 inch canopy......he might not want them.But after 6 years straight of a single 600 i'd go with 36ish inches of decent usable light.


Thanks for the info


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 18, 2018)

If I double stack my lights I can only run the vert. This room cannot handle all that juice right now and I am not in a position to change that. 

Have to work with what I got to run


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 18, 2018)

Update for the morning and mid afternoon. I topped off the res in the closet F&D with water and nutes, and did the same to the veg tent. The plants in veg seem to be responding well to me lowering the light which is good. My worms came in for the outdoor pots, and I got them into the soil and gave the pots a light top watering. Also the slip fittings for the trays came in today. I think by Monday everything will be here but this weekend I'll be building the stand for the tray on the empty side and hanging the vert 600w to see if it will work for me and see what happens to the temps with it running along side the other 600w in the Raptor hood.

I do believe I will be watering and feeding the flower tent again tonight so I'll update there later.


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## zep_lover (Apr 18, 2018)

as long as you have a small fan blowing up on the bare bulb and a fan removing air from the top of the tent,you should be fine.since you have all those led lights,you can use those in conjunction with the 600 bare bulb to fill in poorly lit areas.the bottom fan needs to be on low so it doesnt blow the hot air up and around.proper vert training is very important.i started vert with 8 plants around 1 600.went to 6 plants around.added the stacked 600 hps.my best results were always running 4 plants around either 1 or 2 600 stacked.i am no master grower but going vert got me to hit around 1 gpw consistantly.having my led light bar hanging vertically in front of mt 2.5 foot wide by 6 foot high racks is the easiest vert i have done.that scrawny stripped down plant i have for my pic yielded 9 oz i think with 1 200 watt led and 1 in between it and another for 100 extra watts.i am away from my grow for up to two weeks at a time so i cant really dial in that great.think you will need a 8 inch fan sucking from top of the tent at least


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 18, 2018)

Ok, @DST here's what I got, what's your recommendation


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## DST (Apr 18, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Ok, @DST here's what I got, what's your recommendation
> 
> View attachment 4124151


how long you have you had the dog regs? some magic in them bx2s. (see pic)
 

the fireballs are a no brainer to germ. And the skxdb also have some really nice results from what i have seen. sour cherry will give you colour but is not my favourite in the flavour dept.


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 18, 2018)

DST said:


> how long you have you had the dog regs? some magic in them bx2s. (see pic)
> View attachment 4124155
> 
> the fireballs are a no brainer to germ. And the skxdb also have some really nice results from what i have seen. sour cherry will give you colour but is not my favourite in the flavour dept.


I got the Dog's when I first started on here, well a little after so let's call it like a year and a half that sound right? Gotcha on the Fireballs, what is the SK x DB I don't see it on the website...........?

Sick looking nug there wow FROSTY as hell


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## DST (Apr 18, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I got the Dog's when I first started on here, well a little after so let's call it like a year and a half that sound right? Gotcha on the Fireballs, what is the SK x DB I don't see it on the website...........?
> 
> Sick looking nug there wow FROSTY as hell


i think those were the first batch i ran in NL. the last lot we done in Spain. 
The skxdb are sour kush (headband basically) crossed with deep blue. its always been a freebie so was never added to the site. also some frosty as mofo in those genes.


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 18, 2018)

DST said:


> i think those were the first batch i ran in NL. the last lot we done in Spain.
> The skxdb are sour kush (headband basically) crossed with deep blue. its always been a freebie so was never added to the site. also some frosty as mofo in those genes.


Yeah my DOG is from thhe first batch. Another member here let me know when they were available and I ordered it and the fireballs the rest was freebies which was cool AF.

So what do you say start going though the DOG and the Fireballs first?


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 18, 2018)

Afternoon smoke


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## GroErr (Apr 18, 2018)

I definitely vote for the Fireballs to be in there...


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 18, 2018)

GroErr said:


> I definitely vote for the Fireballs to be in there...
> 
> View attachment 4124163 View attachment 4124166


Yeah that one was ordered for a reason I saw the genetics and it was a no brainier lol pic looks good brother .


----------



## DST (Apr 18, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Yeah my DOG is from thhe first batch. Another member here let me know when they were available and I ordered it and the fireballs the rest was freebies which was cool AF.
> 
> So what do you say start going though the DOG and the Fireballs first?


absodiddly....


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 18, 2018)

DST said:


> absodiddly....


Perfect I will start my germ process tonight


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 18, 2018)

Ok @DST here we go 5 beans of each went for a swim tonight 

 

And a preview of my transplanting tonight


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 18, 2018)

Ok here's a question for the HID guys . How does the spread of a DE bulb compare to a SE when they are bare (no fixture, vertically)?

Thinking of some madness but need to know the answer to this first ..........


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 19, 2018)

Nice trip down memory lane here.

Everything you're doing or considering, I've done the same.

In my case I was extremely happy with my LED lights on vertical trellis panels.

If people aren't happy with the frost from LED lighting, consider adding a florescent UV lamp.


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## Cold$moke (Apr 19, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Ok here's a question for the HID guys . How does the spread of a DE bulb compare to a SE when they are bare (no fixture, vertically)?
> 
> Thinking of some madness but need to know the answer to this first ..........


Haha mind bending lol

I know im stretching my little gavita that could
Haha poor girl is stretched thin


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## Cold$moke (Apr 19, 2018)

I dont know if you can run a de in vert unless you jerry rig a fixture(but i havent looked)

But they nomally throw a rectangluar pattern

Would be bout perfet for a 4x6 

And if you have issues like me then you stretch her over a 7.5x7.5 to see what happens lol

I would imagine that the bracket would still cause a shadow of some sort too


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## ANC (Apr 19, 2018)

ttystikk said:


> If people aren't happy with the frost from LED lighting


They are doing something wrong.


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## ttystikk (Apr 19, 2018)

ANC said:


> They are doing something wrong.


Well yeah lol


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## ttystikk (Apr 19, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> I dont know if you can run a de in vert unless you jerry rig a fixture(but i havent looked)
> 
> But they nomally throw a rectangluar pattern
> 
> ...


I spoke with several people about the idea. One problem is the frame, that could be fixed with a skinny metal piece, think of the frame of a micrometer.

The bigger problem is that in order to work properly, the DE lamp must operate at about 650F, or performance, efficiency and spectrum output all suffer. A bare DE wouldn't run hot enough, especially if there was a breeze.


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## Cold$moke (Apr 19, 2018)

I dont know about that



It really doesnt hold much heat but i could be wrong


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## ttystikk (Apr 19, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> I dont know about that
> 
> 
> 
> It really doesnt hold much heat but i could be wrong


Elsewhere in this section there's a discussion about a vertical DE fixture with built in cool tube. It's sexy but it's already obsolete.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 19, 2018)

ttystikk said:


> Nice trip down memory lane here.
> 
> Everything you're doing or considering, I've done the same.
> 
> ...


Don't recall saying anything about not being happy with the frost from LED lol......

Also if you're going to take an LED and add UV to it then what's the point put the HID/CMH back up and you don't need the "added" UV. This is where I don't get the arguments for LED. How can one say the spectrum is "complete" yet you're adding UV and Reds to your lighting setup. Guess what already has the reds and the UV.......

I'm not picking on you brother just discussing the topic.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 19, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> I dont know if you can run a de in vert unless you jerry rig a fixture(but i havent looked)
> 
> But they nomally throw a rectangluar pattern
> 
> ...


We are going to find out soon lol


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## Cold$moke (Apr 19, 2018)

That cool tube setup did look sweet

Id copy the design


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## Cold$moke (Apr 19, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Don't recall saying anything about not being happy with the frost from LED lol......
> 
> Also if you're going to take an LED and add UV to it then what's the point put the HID/CMH back up and you don't need the "added" UV. This is where I don't get the arguments for LED. How can one say the spectrum is "complete" yet you're adding UV and Reds to your lighting setup. Guess what already has the reds and the UV.......
> 
> I'm not picking on you brother just discussing the topic.


This is why i went with the gavita

Although i fully admitt to seeing great grows with leds.

But at the time (year or 2 ago)

I wasnt quite sold on the leds reading thing like needing to run high temps (i thought over 80 degrades terpines) to having mag deficiency just from using the lights

Plus the cost.....for 450 bucks my gavita is killing it for what im asking of her.


A comparable led seteup would cost arond 800 plus.
Thats the main reason i went with the gavita

I KNEW it would PRODUCE and i liked the price ...i also use the heat in the winter so dont have to pay for just heat...


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## OneHitDone (Apr 19, 2018)

There are SE lamps on the market that have a DE Arc tube in them...
Anyone who thinks that a DE has more output due to an SE having to pass it's current around the wire within the lamp should turn of the lights now and just pack it up.
It is about the "chemistry" in side the lamp, and the type of glass.
Plus as far as I know most all DE lamps have a specific Hz rating that they are supposed to operate at which is higher than most SE lamps.
And to top all that, Straight from the Hortilux reps - SE HPS has a better spectrum for use as a SOLE lamp source than a DE Hps.
Yes, less overall photons but better spectrum and we are taking about using these things in close proximity in the vertical section.
So, Screw in your economical SE lamp and grow some Dank!!!


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## Cold$moke (Apr 19, 2018)

My idea was since gavitas are meant for high ceilings if i could control the heat they would be more intense at shorter height.




*So now begins my great de/hps plus led*
Experiment.


If i set up the room like in my head i will have my scrog side double stacked with led strips (this will mean i just increased my footage by around half  )

Then in the other half ill run the gavita to make up for various strain heights in the seed running table.

*Im hoping *
That the light from the gavita will "spill" over to the led side there fore negating the need for uv lights (provided by gavita)

And HOPEFULLY this will mean a stanrdard nute solution and mabey i wont have to run at higher temps since the gavita will provide some i r light 

What do you fellas think


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## Cold$moke (Apr 19, 2018)

In my head it seems like a good idea .....but dark and scary things live in my head lol


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## Cold$moke (Apr 19, 2018)

OneHitDone said:


> There are SE lamps on the market that have a DE Arc tube in them...
> Anyone who thinks that a DE has more output due to an SE having to pass it's current around the wire within the lamp should turn of the lights now and just pack it up.
> It is about the "chemistry" in side the lamp, and the type of glass.
> Plus as far as I know most all DE lamps have a specific Hz rating that they are supposed to operate at which is higher than most SE lamps.
> ...


I could be very wrong cause i read way too much without retaining lol

But wasnt the gavita supposed to have a very full spectrum even though the light looks like hps?


----------



## OneHitDone (Apr 19, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> I could be very wrong cause i read way too much without retaining lol
> 
> But wasnt the gavita supposed to have a very full spectrum even though the light looks like hps?


It's just hps, unless of course you supplement with their plasma
The rumor is that the Hortilux DE lamp has a tad nicer spectrum and will run in Gavita's but not sure if they are doing a 750 yet


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## Cold$moke (Apr 19, 2018)

OneHitDone said:


> It's just hps, unless of course you supplement with their plasma
> The rumor is that the Hortilux DE lamp has a tad nicer spectrum and will run in Gavita's but not sure if they are doing a 750 yet


Nice yea i coulda swore reading something about it having more blue then hps


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## zep_lover (Apr 20, 2018)

OneHitDone said:


> The other thing to consider here if your talking a single 600 per 4x4 is "vertical coverage"
> For those who have used vertical 600's, how many inches of vertical canopy can Mobo ecpext to have good light coverage on without moving the lamp up and down with a mover etc?
> As we see @zep_lover has his lamps double stacked


i would say for premium light zone only 24 inches per bulb.that is why i used two stacked in each of my three cabinets.


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## ttystikk (Apr 21, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Don't recall saying anything about not being happy with the frost from LED lol......
> 
> Also if you're going to take an LED and add UV to it then what's the point put the HID/CMH back up and you don't need the "added" UV. This is where I don't get the arguments for LED. How can one say the spectrum is "complete" yet you're adding UV and Reds to your lighting setup. Guess what already has the reds and the UV.......
> 
> I'm not picking on you brother just discussing the topic.


No offense taken. 'People' in this case was just a placeholder for whomever might think there's inadequate frost. I'm not one of these people. I wasn't implying you were, either.

I have never added red or UV to LED and I've always been happy with the results.

Adding UV to LED does make sense for extra resin production. It is also true that very few HID lamps emit enough UV to make any different, because they're specifically made to shield it so as to avoid damaging the eyes and skin of people working under them.

People have shown that additional UV light increases potency when it's used judiciously.


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 21, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> This is why i went with the gavita
> 
> Although i fully admitt to seeing great grows with leds.
> 
> ...


If I had the ceiling height I'd be running the gavita 600/750 fixtures no questions asked .Especially like the controllers they have now for them . And for under $400 for the fixture in most places including the bulb you really can't beat it for something plug and play.


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 21, 2018)

Ok I'm exhausted it's been a long day non stop. The stand is built for the tray and the 600 is hung vert in the center over it. I would have 4 feet to the glass of the raptor or 5 feet to the ceiling with the bulb bare. I turned it on let it warm up no issues with the breaker etc. Just gonna slap up some pics. I need to order one fitting online and then the hydro will be ready to go on this side of the tent. Next is to get that done and get the trellis net setup around the sides and the back wall. This bulb is BRIGHT hanging bare let's see what happens. Need to get a fan under it too but I think this will work. Time for a smoke break I need some meds for pain. All this crap with a fractured shoulder is no joke helped my bro cut his grass too that was the trade of for his help running me around to the hardware store and helping me build stuff. I'm happy with how the stand turned out with the res and the lower height vs the veg tent. I don't think I will change the stand design in the veg tent as I don't see height being an issue there. Got the last two plants in veg into the 9" pots, topped off the res in veg and adjusted nutes accordingly, and the closet is rocking with the flood and drain and the clone dome as well with the T5 above. I took 5 cuts off of each of the moms the Peach Puree, Blood Diamond, and the Suzy Q. 

I am thinking of an 8 plant setup with the vert two up front on their own with stakes and then two on each of the three "walls" with the net. I think it would be better to just use the net as a guide and not necessarily stress the plants weaving them through, any thoughts on this?

Anyways here's a few pics, also the girls in flower have started to bulk up and really push out the frost wow..........

Thanks for checking in


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## OneHitDone (Apr 21, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I am thinking of an 8 plant setup with the vert two up front on their own with stakes and then two on each of the three "walls" with the net. I think it would be better to just use the net as a guide and not necessarily stress the plants weaving them through, any thoughts on this?


Sounds perfect, just use the net to hold them at the safe distance to the lamp.
Looks like Mobo's has got growing so fast his training wheels crumbled to pieces


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## DST (Apr 22, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Ok I'm exhausted it's been a long day non stop. The stand is built for the tray and the 600 is hung vert in the center over it. I would have 4 feet to the glass of the raptor or 5 feet to the ceiling with the bulb bare. I turned it on let it warm up no issues with the breaker etc. Just gonna slap up some pics. I need to order one fitting online and then the hydro will be ready to go on this side of the tent. Next is to get that done and get the trellis net setup around the sides and the back wall. This bulb is BRIGHT hanging bare let's see what happens. Need to get a fan under it too but I think this will work. Time for a smoke break I need some meds for pain. All this crap with a fractured shoulder is no joke helped my bro cut his grass too that was the trade of for his help running me around to the hardware store and helping me build stuff. I'm happy with how the stand turned out with the res and the lower height vs the veg tent. I don't think I will change the stand design in the veg tent as I don't see height being an issue there. Got the last two plants in veg into the 9" pots, topped off the res in veg and adjusted nutes accordingly, and the closet is rocking with the flood and drain and the clone dome as well with the T5 above. I took 5 cuts off of each of the moms the Peach Puree, Blood Diamond, and the Suzy Q.
> 
> I am thinking of an 8 plant setup with the vert two up front on their own with stakes and then two on each of the three "walls" with the net. I think it would be better to just use the net as a guide and not necessarily stress the plants weaving them through, any thoughts on this?
> 
> ...


sounds good. you will find out what works best through triall and hopefully not too much error


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## Cold$moke (Apr 22, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> If I had the ceiling height I'd be running the gavita 600/750 fixtures no questions asked .Especially like the controllers they have now for them . And for under $400 for the fixture in most places including the bulb you really can't beat it for something plug and play.


Technically the way im doing it you could get away with a 750 (not a 1k) with 8 ft ceilings but i dont know if your set up has that kind o height


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 22, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> Technically the way im doing it you could get away with a 750 (not a 1k) with 8 ft ceilings but i dont know if your set up has that kind o height


Nope the tents are only 6.5' from the floor to ceiling.


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 22, 2018)

DST said:


> sounds good. you will find out what works best through triall and hopefully not too much error


Hopefully not lol


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## Cold$moke (Apr 22, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Nope the tents are only 6.5' from the floor to ceiling.


Right on
I would say my light is right at 8 foot and my canopy is right at 4-4.5 ft and if i forget to turn my fan back on after a picture it gets warm real quick lol

But the light controller kicks in and dims it down
Works sick! (Want something like this for an led setup ...

I think i might even lower the height of my plants on the next run . As one or 2 leaves are fraying up (literally only 1 or 2 leaves)
But no foxtailing

I need to give leds a shot for my new room plan


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 22, 2018)




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## DST (Apr 23, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> View attachment 4125676


nice. I've got a bunch of sunflowers this year. thet are just wee bairns at the moment though.


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## coreywebster (Apr 23, 2018)

Was thinking of getting a sunflower for the new yard.
Don't know much about real plants though, how old is that one Evil?


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 23, 2018)

coreywebster said:


> Was thinking of getting a sunflower for the new yard.
> Don't know much about real plants though, how old is that one Evil?


Probably two months from seed now maybe a bit more will have to check my previous journal


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## Cold$moke (Apr 23, 2018)

That thing is definitely been well taken care of 

Going to be a beast


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 28, 2018)




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## Cold$moke (Apr 28, 2018)

Sorry bud im too baked to remember what variety you got but it looks good 

That bottom pic has some nice trichs


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 28, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> Sorry bud im too baked to remember what variety you got but it looks good
> 
> That bottom pic has some nice trichs


Thanks brother. I'm nicely baked as well lol. I have three Black Plasma a Jawa Pie and one of my Satori x Skywalker that's the one turning purple first girl of the cross . Buds are not as big as I had expected at this stage but the OG lineages usually fatten up late so we will see . But yeah the frost on that girl is nuts. I just sit and stare at them all the time and hope not to fuck them up lol .

Cheers


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## Cold$moke (Apr 28, 2018)

Very nice


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 28, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> Very nice


Today is day 45 of Flower so we are moving along .The bare bulb is hung vert on the other side. Just need a fan to blow up from underneath. Also got the parts to setup the hydro but the girls from veg are not ready yet so no rush really . Need to put the netting up on the empty side and clean the tray good before getting it running but aside from that it's good to go on that side. Then need to build one more stand for when the side currently flowering is done and that side will be setup as hydro as well. Then I will be completely hydro in the garden and I should be able to handle the workload a lot easier . Endurance is an issue so it's not easy for me to keep up on the perpetual but it gets me out of bed and keeps me busy . Just want (and need it ) to be a little less busy and so far it's working.


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 30, 2018)

Did a pump and dump on the res for veg, topped off the F&D, and started the flower tent on water only today .Day 46 of Flower want to do my first full 14 day flush, never tried that before we shall see. Sprayed the veg tent the F&D and the clones with my method 1/Rhizotonic spray .

Thanks for checking in


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## Cold$moke (Apr 30, 2018)

I dont think youll not like the flush if you like the best "smoking" weed 

I have no idea where people suddenly started with the whole dont need to flush bs.

I always taper my feed down AND flush 


Do a side by side flushed unflushed dry them the same i all but guarantee youll enjoy the flushed weed better 

In my opinion anyway


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## ttystikk (Apr 30, 2018)

Flushing is for toilets.


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 30, 2018)

I have been doing organics for a long time so trying flushing out and tapering down was not necessary before just cut hang and dry . I like to try different things and see what works best for me . In my short time growing I have found this best as many so called things set in stone I have found to not be correct. At least not for me .

Most of us in this group do things that are not "normal" so I feel I have found a good home here in this group.


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## Cold$moke (Apr 30, 2018)

I never cared what anyone did cuase its not mine
Flush, dont flush i never cared but i personally flush all my weed even though i taper it down..



ttystikk said:


> Flushing is for toilets.


Toilets where made to flush for a reason so your house doesnt smell like shit  same goes for weed in MY oppinon. 

I think peeps just convinced others its ok so at chop they "look" the best or just didnt want to have to flush,leech,plain water its all the same except with organics and microbes. Which even in organics its quite possible to produce weed that doesnt burn 

To A FINE WHITE ASH 

Its still somthing i look for when i smoke others weed is how fine and white the ash went 

Again since i dont have any papers published on the subject theses are my oppinon.


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## ttystikk (Apr 30, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> I never cared what anyone did cuase its not mine
> Flush, dont flush i never cared but i personally flush all my weed even though i taper it down..
> 
> 
> ...


If you don't run too much nutes in the first place then there's no need to flush that shit


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## Cold$moke (Apr 30, 2018)

ttystikk said:


> If you don't run too much nutes in the first place then there's no need to flush that shit


I never run high ppm still ALWAYS FLUSH

when my crop is done we can have a finished bowl pic to show ash


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## Cold$moke (Apr 30, 2018)

Sorry op


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 30, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> Sorry op


For what lol ?


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## Cold$moke (Apr 30, 2018)

The flush vs non flush debate haha


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 30, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> The flush vs non flush debate haha


It's all good like I said in the first post as long as it's civil I don't care. When we can talk and share info with each other even if we disagree we all learn something


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## ttystikk (May 1, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> I never run high ppm still ALWAYS FLUSH
> 
> when my crop is done we can have a finished bowl pic to show ash


I'm much less interested in white ash than I am in flavor and potency and IME flushing added nothing and occasionally took it away.


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## Cold$moke (May 1, 2018)

ttystikk said:


> I'm much less interested in white ash than I am in flavor and potency and IME flushing added nothing and occasionally took it away.


Oddly enough its my opinion that weed that burns clean always gave the best, unskewed high and had the best flavs.
My bowls always taste good to the last rip most everyone else's im tapping it out halfway cause it taste like shit 

I dont care if people dont flush.

So long as you can light a pipe with one light,

Smoke the whole thing down with no stirring,

Taste good to about the last hit last hit usually just taste like the lighter (im talking burning to the very end to examine ash)

And leave a fine white or very light grey ash white is preferred.

If you can do this without flushing i would smoke it and be happy


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## OneHitDone (May 1, 2018)

ttystikk said:


> If you don't run too much nutes in the first place then there's no need to flush that shit


That is just hogwash. I've ran hydro crops under every ec imaginable and if your shit is still green at harvest your not gonna get that connuseur smoke and white ash.
Sorry but your just not.
And if you want to ruin a perfect white ash flower just roll it in a RAW rolling paper


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## Cold$moke (May 1, 2018)

ttystikk said:


> I'm much less interested in white ash than I am in flavor and potency and IME flushing added nothing and occasionally took it away.


Dont mistake potency for chemicals skewed high
lol not saying you are but for others


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## Cold$moke (May 1, 2018)

OneHitDone said:


> That is just hogwash. I've ran hydro crops under every ec imaginable and if your shit is still green at harvest your not gonna get that connuseur smoke and white ash.
> Sorry but your just not.
> And if you want to ruin a perfect white ash flower just roll it in a RAW rolling paper


 except i dont mind raw papers lol


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## OneHitDone (May 1, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> Dont mistake potency for chemicals lol not saying you are but for others


I don't believe it is "Nutrients" people claim to taste. As in your not directly tasting fertilizer.
You are however tasting chlorophyl, nitrogen, etc.
I have noted the same thing in lettuce leaf. High N fert right to picking makes for a more bitter flavor.


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## Cold$moke (May 1, 2018)

OneHitDone said:


> I don't believe it is "Nutrients" people claim to taste. As in your not directly tasting fertilizer.
> You are however tasting chlorophyl, nitrogen, etc.
> I have noted the same thing in lettuce leaf. High N fert right to picking makes for a more bitter flavor.


I have grown side by side pure blend and gh trio

I flushed both EQUALLY which tasted better?
The pureblend by far

Gh trio grown weed has a particular note that i can always pick up...just like if they use guanos, or advanced nutes, and im Pretty sure i know how to taste for canna coco as well 

I believe flavors go like this
Strain 50% of flavor profile this ones obvious.

Enviroment 30% ie if you grow hot and cold with the same strain it will be differnt in flavor slightly to alot. (My room never goes over 77 )

Light spectrum 10% same i think you get slight flavor changes by spectrum, as the leds i have added always shown frostier plants that where directly under them. And some used to think you could get different profiles from mh and hps lighting

Nutes10%im a beliver that you can always taste slight notes of the nutes aromas.

Hard to explain easy to show with a side by side grow..even if your well flushed and burning to white ash i could taste a difference between gh trio and botanicare pureblend 

Peace to all flushers and non flushers


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## Cold$moke (May 1, 2018)

OneHitDone said:


> I don't believe it is "Nutrients" people claim to taste. As in your not directly tasting fertilizer.
> You are however tasting chlorophyl, nitrogen, etc.
> I have noted the same thing in lettuce leaf. High N fert right to picking makes for a more bitter flavor.


But i also HIGHLY agree with you on the chlorophyll

I want my girls faded so i can see their natural colors


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## OneHitDone (May 1, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> I have grown side by side pure blend and gh trio
> 
> I flushed both EQUALLY which tasted better
> The pureblend by far
> ...


Which PureBlend did you use and what was your overall experience with it?

I ran PureBlend Pro against Ionic. PureBlend you could pick out visually as a frostier nug, but when it met the lighter it was unanimous in a blind test the Ionic tasted better.


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## Cold$moke (May 1, 2018)

OneHitDone said:


> Which PureBlend did you use and what was your overall experience with it?
> 
> I ran PureBlend Pro against Ionic. PureBlend you could pick out visually as a frostier nug, but when it met the lighter it was unanimous in a blind test the Ionic tasted better.


Thats a big nute decision for me is the final taste 

It was long ago many moons since but i was using the pro im pretty sure plus a few of their additives


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## OneHitDone (May 1, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> It was long ago many moons since but i was using the pro im pretty sure plus a few of their additives


That product is virtually impossible to get a perfectly happy plant in hydro. Tried, like this......Tried like that ........ Finally threw in the towel on that one


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## Cold$moke (May 1, 2018)

OneHitDone said:


> That product is virtually impossible to get a perfectly happy plant in hydro. Tried, like this......Tried like that ........ Finally threw in the towel on that one


Worked tits in coco dtw i think thats about the time i retired from coco and went into water culture

cause i remember i think trying a run with pure blend in dwc and it turning to shit (probably just me) so i went to the cns 17 line . And back and forth with gh trio and botanicare

since the trio worked better for water culture even though the taste was better with the pureblend i went to the trio (didnt taste bad just not as good as the pb did)
Went that way for a couple years

Then i got bit by advanced nutes for nearly 7 years but i mainly just ran their base no additives 
Had a small stint with canna coco

Never tried the ionic . Though but now im fully conveted to the dry nutes at least for now


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## gr865 (May 1, 2018)

I do a minimum of one week to 10 days flush, I believe I get a better burn but to me what make the biggest difference is a good curing. 
This grow will sort of be a good test. This Monster Crop Pheno #5 was taken from it's mother plant at day 33 of flower.. I did not do a very good job of curing those jars of the mother, pheno #5 from the first run and they are harsh, don't burn well and the fragrance is just not there.
Now this grow, the MC, will get a full two to three week cure after a 10 day flush. Will be a good comparison

GR.


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## OneHitDone (May 1, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> Worked tits in coco dtw i think thats about the time i retired from coco and went into water culture
> 
> cause i remember i think trying a run with pure blend in dwc and it turning to shit (probably just me) so i went to the cns 17 line . And back and forth with gh trio and botanicare
> 
> ...


Which advanced base did you run in water culture and what is your opinion of it?
How were application rates?


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## Cold$moke (May 1, 2018)

Curing aside if all other parameters are the SAME in a blind taste test 

I can all but guarantee 8 out of 10 will choose the flushed bud.


OF course a shitty dry and cure will make shitty hey smelling buds that burn like shit


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## Cold$moke (May 1, 2018)

OneHitDone said:


> Which advanced base did you run in water culture and what is your opinion of it?
> How were application rates?


Ph perfect gmb 

Its kinda a long story with me and advanced ill get back here in a bit


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## Evil-Mobo (May 3, 2018)

Cold$moke said:


> Ph perfect gmb
> 
> Its kinda a long story with me and advanced ill get back here in a bit


Still waiting for the story


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## Cold$moke (May 3, 2018)

Ok my run with advanced started around 7 years plus ago.

I went through a phase of everything had to be on point or i wasnt happy.. this usually hits most growers at year 1 to 5 haha

So i switched to advanced so i "wouldnt" have to worry about ph lol.. and they additives where just too cool lol
And got great results* for the whole time.
* for the growth part not flavor though

Except the last few grows but i thinks it might have been my nutes being old more then anything..but it threw my plants into a werid deficiency that stunted the plant and i could not shake it.

I cut the additives after the first year 


Now ill fully admit to buying into the whole they use the best ingredients bs and its "tailored" for weed cause im always after quality...

...to to be fully honest i never cared for the taste that AN imparted. Like burnt soy sauce haha.
Especially if you didnt flush (unless you ran them REAL light lol) at least to me 

But being older and cheaper now lol dumping loads of it sucked. And yes i have gone many grows with out doing change outs and just top ups.

But this is what turned me from bottle to dry nutes.
Constant freshness 

I gave it any where from 2ml a liter to 4ml ler liter

But advanced runs on the hot side if you are using 4mls per liter lol.


I think i just got tired of them the price never botherd me too bad cause i only ran the base

Also advanced and mega crop(is just dry advanced lol)
have one thing that i hate and thats dark colored nutes.

My new nutes are almost crystal clear.

But proof will be in how everything finishes out to see if i like the new stuff .

So i far i like it a lot

And its different from what alot of people are running. 

Im sure theres more that i can go on about
But i gota lot of seedlings to transplant tonight haha


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## Cold$moke (May 3, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Still waiting for the story


Sorry bud not too much of one today lol

But if you have any questions i can answer about advanced nutes that i have used ill give it my best shot


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## Evil-Mobo (May 4, 2018)

There has been an unfortunate turn of events for me here at this locale and I had to chop down the entire garden . If and when I can get up and running again I will bring this thread back to life. 

Happy Growing Everyone


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## ttystikk (May 4, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> There has been an unfortunate turn of events for me here at this locale and I had to chop down the entire garden . If and when I can get up and running again I will bring this thread back to life.
> 
> Happy Growing Everyone


SHIT.

Sorry to hear it, brother.

Let me know what I can do to help?


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## gr865 (May 4, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> There has been an unfortunate turn of events for me here at this locale and I had to chop down the entire garden . If and when I can get up and running again I will bring this thread back to life.
> 
> Happy Growing Everyone


Tough luck buddy! 
Get it back in gear, look forward to your return. 

GR


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## Cold$moke (May 4, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> There has been an unfortunate turn of events for me here at this locale and I had to chop down the entire garden . If and when I can get up and running again I will bring this thread back to life.
> 
> Happy Growing Everyone


Soo sorry


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## BobBitchen (May 4, 2018)

I hate when that happens ....

GL


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## jacrispy (May 4, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> There has been an unfortunate turn of events for me here at this locale and I had to chop down the entire garden . If and when I can get up and running again I will bring this thread back to life.
> 
> Happy Growing Everyone


fuckin' bummer dude,
hope you get it sorted out....


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## Tim Fox (Sep 7, 2018)

and now he is just gone,,


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## ttystikk (Sep 8, 2018)

Bummer. I hope he's okay. Here's a good man and the lights he built and sent me are still running great!


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## Tim Fox (Sep 8, 2018)

ttystikk said:


> Bummer. I hope he's okay. Here's a good man and the lights he built and sent me are still running great!


i spoke with Evil in an email yesterday , i dont have much info, but at least he is alive, and I too have one of his cob lights, and its going to grow me some good stuff until i die,, since i am 55 and only doing 1 grow per year now


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## ttystikk (Sep 9, 2018)

Tim Fox said:


> i spoke with Evil in an email yesterday , i dont have much info, but at least he is alive, and I too have one of his cob lights, and its going to grow me some good stuff until i die,, since i am 55 and only doing 1 grow per year now


Have him drop me a line?


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## OneHitDone (Sep 25, 2018)

Brother @Evil-Mobo doing fine, just sitting on his nuts avoiding all the led section drama


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## ttystikk (Oct 10, 2018)

OneHitDone said:


> Brother @Evil-Mobo doing fine, just sitting on his nuts avoiding all the led section drama


Good to hear that. I've been worried about him.


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