# Anyone listen to real music?



## Ganjatopolis (Feb 5, 2009)

I know that everyone has their own taste in music, and I'm gonna try not to offend anyone, but does anyone hear listen to good music anymore? I mean, the music that our lifestyle was started by, not rap and hip hop and whatnot. I can listen to rap when I'm at parties but only as a backdrop, not as music I would listen to in my spare time. What happened to bands like Simon and Garfunkel with their awesome vocals and guitar riffs, The Grateful Dead (even though we don't have a Jerry G.), Bob Dylan, etc. There are a couple new bands I ran across recently that I like, but I just can't stand today's angry metal (I had enough of it in the early 90's) or rap music because smoking pot is supposed to make you mellow, not angry about your bitches and hoes. Anyone else get me? Why can't anyone today enjoy The Allman Brothers, CCR, The Doors, Country Joe and the Fish, Pete Seeger, or Van Morrison. I have found some new guys showing promise though, Devendra Banhart and yesterday I heard this Ed Harcourt guy on the radio that sounded pretty good. Am I just lost in a culture that expands too quickly to keep up with, or do I have a killer taste in music? Well, thats just my little rant.


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## Lowkster (Feb 5, 2009)

You must be bored!!!lol


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## Ganjatopolis (Feb 5, 2009)

Better believe it...


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## chronik4lyfe (Feb 5, 2009)

wow... dude... ... man people have been smokin weed before we were even a civilized nation, so to say "our lifestyle" of smoking weed and listening to your definition of "good music" is completely off.. speak for your generation..not for the one before you.. and the one after you.. just my opinion.. "good music" is a personal preferance,


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## ROC1977 (Feb 5, 2009)

I listen to rap, rock, pop, soul, Blues, everything basically. All genres have good songs. Clasical music is great if your in the right mood. 
The cd's I make up for my car could have anything on it. 

At the moment I'm listening to Eric Clapton, Gun n Roses, The Who, Michael Jackson, Marvin Gay, Jamoriqui, Outkast (older stuff), and even a bit of Phil Collins. I just love the drums on In the Air tonight. lol


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## Psychedelics and Chronic (Feb 5, 2009)

Ganjatopolis said:


> I know that everyone has their own taste in music, and I'm gonna try not to offend anyone, but does anyone hear listen to good music anymore? I mean, the music that our lifestyle was started by, not rap and hip hop and whatnot. I can listen to rap when I'm at parties but only as a backdrop, not as music I would listen to in my spare time. What happened to bands like Simon and Garfunkel with their awesome vocals and guitar riffs, The Grateful Dead (even though we don't have a Jerry G.), Bob Dylan, etc. There are a couple new bands I ran across recently that I like, but I just can't stand today's angry metal (I had enough of it in the early 90's) or rap music because smoking pot is supposed to make you mellow, not angry about your bitches and hoes. Anyone else get me? Why can't anyone today enjoy The Allman Brothers, CCR, The Doors, Country Joe and the Fish, Pete Seeger, or Van Morrison. I have found some new guys showing promise though, Devendra Banhart and yesterday I heard this Ed Harcourt guy on the radio that sounded pretty good. Am I just lost in a culture that expands too quickly to keep up with, or do I have a killer taste in music? Well, thats just my little rant.


Go to a festival brotha. I listen to a shit load of music and I love the oldies as much as the new. Dead, Zepplin, CCR, Queen, Beatles, Doors, Allman, Warren Haynes, Hendrix, etc. etc. There is just so much new shit that is similar and good too


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## smartsoverambition (Feb 5, 2009)

i don't know what kind of rap u listen too but i believe it's one of the best to smoke to, especially when u've lived the life

ever heard life's a bitch by nas & AZ i listen to it at the highpoint of my high because the beat is smooth and every line has me saying "word"

i also like jazz in the background also


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## Ganjatopolis (Feb 5, 2009)

Hooray. Oh and I forgot to mention that I can listen to some Cypress Hill when I'm stoned. But still.


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## GrowTech (Feb 5, 2009)

yeah, if you turn on radio or music television these days, you will find out that (sadly) the guitar solo has died...


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## Ganjatopolis (Feb 5, 2009)

GrowTech said:


> yeah, if you turn on radio or music television these days, you will find out that (sadly) the guitar solo has died...


It most certainly has....


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## robert planter (Feb 6, 2009)

I'm with you ganja. No doubt your correct


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## Wild (Feb 6, 2009)

I basically listen to every style of music apart from Country and Skiffle haha. However I do prefer the old rock and blues, because the majority of the songs were made whilst high, rather than nowadays when there are very few songs made whilst high. The oldies are almost arranged to mess with your mind a little.


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## MTmix86 (Feb 6, 2009)

I completely agree. I do like a fair amount of rap/hip-hop myself but for the most part don't listen to it when I smoke. A lot of my friends always want to listen to rap when they smoke and I have never understood that. For me I like listening to some of the more mellow classic rock, jam bands, reggae etc.


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## Tizzle312 (Feb 6, 2009)

i HATE country music so much it is not even funny 
like whenever i hear a country song it just automaticly puts me in a bad mood , i dont know who started doing that god awful music
and i didnt even know people were really into it i thought it was like music for Farmers and shit


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## Brick Top (Feb 6, 2009)

GrowTech said:


> yeah, if you turn on radio or music television these days, you will find out that (sadly) the guitar solo has died...


 
I think that is in part because of the so-called evolution of music but also because in my opinion there just are not as many great guitarists out there and to write a song with a great guitar solo you need a great guitarist to play it. 
A number of big name bands have managed to not rely on hard charging knock you down guitar solos. The Beatles are considered by some to be the best ever and how many of their songs had hard charging guitar solos? Even the Rolling Stones did not rely on them all that much in many songs and when they did, while they were good, they were not really hard and were very simple compared to what other groups wrote/played. 
I think for some of us that are older we were almost spoiled in a way because at a time there were so many really talented guitarists and so many that some of them were very underrated in their era and would be considered far better than many playing today if they were still around and or active and of course as good. 
Alvin Lee of "Ten Years After" was fantastic. If you have not seen the flick "Woodstock" and saw them play live doing "Im Going Home" you have really missed something but with Jimi Hendrix around at the same time how much recognition could he have gotten? You can watch "Im Going Home" from "Woodstock" on youtube if you never had the chance to see Alvin Lee in action. 
Leslie West was another really talented guitarist but he never got the recognition from many what was due him. Toni Iommi of "Black Sabbath" was and is a great guitarist especially when you factor in that he lost the ends of two of his fingers and fingers the strings wearing rubber caps with pieces of leather attached to them so basically hes playing without feeling in two of his fingertips. Randi Rhodes was fantastic but tragically his life was cut short. Ask yourself how often an Eddie Van Valen come along? The answer is not often. Duane Allman was great but again his life ended far to soon. There were so many absolutely great guitarists for a while that as I said many did not get the recognition they really deserved and the fans almost expected most every group to have someone really good, or like in the case of some of the Southern Rock bands to have several that were really good. 
How about "The Motor City Madman" Ted Nugent or later George Thorogood? Neither were lacking in talent. Peter Frampton was no slouch when it came to making a hunk of wood scream and sing. 
But those days have gone the way of the full service gas station. Theyre history. 
Just a little side note or bit of trivia about a band from the past that few remember and most never heard about was an all girl band in 1977 to 1979 called "The Runaways." It was originally made up of Joan Jett, Cherie Currie, Lita Ford, Sandy West and Miki Steele (who was replaced but later made it fairly big with "The Bangles") and then Jackie Fox took over on bass. If I remember right Joan Jett was only 15 when the band was formed and the oldest members were 17 so they were from 15 to 17 years old and they were the fourth largest seller of albums in Japan at the time trailing behind only Led Zeppelin, ABBA and KISS and were a big hit in Australia and a number of other countries but they were seen as something of a novelty act by many in the U.S. so they never topped the charts in the U.S. even though they still had a large following. 
The U.S. just wasnt ready for a bunch of hard playing rockin adolescent girls. 
They were headliners and had "Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers" and "The Ramones" and "Cheap Trick" and "Van Halen" and others opening for them but how many people here know much if anything about them? 
Some of their songs are likely known to some here but thats because they were later covered by other bands like how "Quiet Riot" had a big hit with "Mamma Weer All Crazee Now" but it was a "Runaways" song. Some know the song "Cherry Bomb" because Joan Jett still does it in her act but it was something she wrote along with Kim Fowley and was first recorded by "The Runaways." 
You can find some videos of them on youtube and can also find out more about them at http://www.therunaways.com/ 
But to go back in time again we were spoiled by the likes of people like Jeff Beck and Eric Clapton and Jimmy Page and David Gilmour and another that was really good but was underrated was Carlos Santana. Another to add to the list of underrated guitarist would be Martin Barre of "Jethro Tull." Listen to some of his guitar solos and then try telling me he wasnt really good but Ian Anderson got most of the fame for the group and other guitarists got more media attention and many people even when "Jethro Tull" was at their peak didnt know the name Martin Barre and that was a real shame.
The list could go on and on and many were truly great but between there being one or two catching most of the attention in "Rolling Stone" and other publications and there being so many great guitarists we just did not realize at the time how many really standout guitarists there were and now that there arent a bunch of them in newer bands we miss it.


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## BooRadley (Feb 6, 2009)

TOOL, Sarah McLachlan, Third Day, Tori Amos, Loreena McKennitt, Frank Zappa, Primus, Declan Galbraith, October Project, [classic] Tina Turner, [classic] Teddy Pendergrass, Celine Dion (I know, I know), Waylon Jennings, Etta James, Trace Adkins, Johnny Cash, Disturbed, Burl Ives, Charley Pride, Loretta Lynn, Conway Twitty, Ray Charles, Julie Andrews, Willie Nelson...


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## chronik4lyfe (Feb 6, 2009)

BooRadley said:


> TOOL, Sarah McLachlan, *Third Day*, Tori Amos, Loreena McKennitt, Frank Zappa, Primus, Declan Galbraith, October Project, [classic] Tina Turner, [classic] Teddy Pendergrass, Celine Dion (I know, I know), Waylon Jennings, Etta James, Trace Adkins, *Johnny Cash*, *Disturbed*, Burl Ives, Charley Pride, Loretta Lynn, Conway Twitty, Ray Charles, Julie Andrews, *Willie Nelson*...


the *Bold* ones are the only artist i listen too out of that list


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## BooRadley (Feb 6, 2009)

> the *Bold* ones are the only artist i listen too out of that list


That's a start.


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## natmoon (Feb 6, 2009)

I like to have a listen to all different kinds of music.
I like seventh son of a seventh son,the evil that men do etc..by iron maiden but i also like techno,trance,classical music.....blah blah etc....the list goes on.
Who can figure it,my only real answer is that most peoples tastes in music broaden with age just like the foods that they like to eat.
We still like a choc bar but we also like hot chilli peppers


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## WhatAmIDoing (Feb 6, 2009)

I think everyone that's saying the guitar solo is dead, great guitarists are no more (or at least less common) now, etc. etc. (I'm stoned, I don't remember their sns, i don't feel like going back and quoting, this is my summary. lol)

...(and that wasn't a complete sentence. but that's okay )

There are plenty of good no-name bands w/good no-name artists.

If you're looking for a young band akin to phish, the dead, dylan, etc. I suggest Tea Leaf Green. They were influenced by such bands, and definitly rock the guitar solos. See them in concert if you can. That's the best way. It's how I first _really_ heard them. There were certain riffs that just sounded "Phish", others that were lyrically "Dylan", and stlyes that were definitly "Beatles", but it was originally done, and very well done indeed !!


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## edux10 (Feb 6, 2009)

its all about what mood you are in. There are times when you need something mellow to chill out to and smoke. Metal sounds good when you are drunk off cheap beer. Rap is something more upbeat to smoke too, all good at different times, and different mind states. 

maybe something happend to you and a ballad or a song with a story can relate really well to your situation. Another person may have nothing whatsoever in common with it. I think if you are not ignroant than you should listen to everything but there are bands and groups out there that are just put together to make a buck off stupid kids. That is the only type of music that I don't concider "real music" but those kind of bands never stay around and are lucky if they become one hit wonders. True talent always shines and real muscians get paid what they work for unless they die.


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## Brick Top (Feb 7, 2009)

WhatAmIDoing said:


> I think everyone that's saying the guitar solo is dead, great guitarists are no more (or at least less common) now, etc. etc. (I'm stoned, I don't remember their sns, i don't feel like going back and quoting, this is my summary. lol)
> 
> ...(and that wasn't a complete sentence. but that's okay )
> 
> There are plenty of good no-name bands w/good no-name artists.


Like I said I think there has been something of an evolution of music and the strong powerful hard charging guitar solo is not as much of most newer songs/bands as it was in the past and that in part explains why we dont hear great guitar solos like we did in the past. 
My ex-neighbor was from Boston and he had been in several bands there and formed one here and he was like 20-years or so younger than me and his bands always played much newer stuff than I normally listen to. They wrote a few songs of their own, not all that great, and covered other bands songs but most of what they played was almost like two rhythm guitars. They were loud and bold, more so than normal rhythm guitars are but still it was a lot of chords and not much if any fancy finger work. 
If you google using key words like best guitar solos you see lists mostly made up of the same people and sometimes songs and they are people/songs like "*Stairway to Heaven" - Jimmy Page, "*Eruption" - *Eddie Van Halen, "Freebird" - Collins/Rossington, "Comfortably Numb" - David Gilmour, "All Along the Watchtower" - Jimi Hendrix, "November Rain"  *Slash, "*One" - Kirk Hammet, "Hotel California" - Don Felder/Joe Walsh, "Crazy Train" - Randy Rhoads, "*Crossroads" - *Eric Clapton, "*Voodoo Chile" - *Jimi Hendrix, "Johnny B. Goode" - Chuck Berry, "Texas Flood" - Stevie Ray Vaughan, "Layla" - Clapton/D. Allman, "*Floods" - *Dimebag Darrel, "*Heartbreaker" - *Jimmy Page, "Cliffs of Dover" - Eric Johnson, "Little Wing" - Jimi Hendrix, "Highway Star" - Ritchie Blackmore, "Bohemian Rhapsody" - Brian May, "*Time" - *David Gilmour*  "*Sultans of Swing" - Mark Knopfler, and so on. 
Most groups/songs are from the 60s and 70s and of those that are later most are not all that new, like still around 25 or more years old and of the few newer than that the bands were around a while before getting a hit with a great guitar solo and arent new or newer bands. It is almost impossible to find anyone on the various lists that were formed in the 90s or later so you are now looking at 19 or more years since a top rated guitar solo has come out from a new/newer band. Older groups that are still playing and writing new music instead of just playing reunion tours of their old stuff will add something to the lists now and then but you just dont see the new/newer bands cracking the lists. 
So as I said I think it is in part a case of the evolution of music but also I really do think there just are not as many great guitarists in new/newer bands. 
The 60s and the 70s of rock music was in a way much like the 70s in boxing when there were a number of really great heavyweight boxers that if they were spread out over different eras each one could have been dominate but there could only be one champ at a time and for many years it was *_Muhammad Ali and even when he was not the champ he still got most of the attention so the others just did not seem as good as they really were. 
Rock music was flooded with really great guitarists back then and that just is not the case today. Again to return to the lists of great guitar solos if you look at a number of them, which will vary in ratings/rankings somewhat_* since it is opinion, it is subjective, still you will find that almost every band that hit it big has at least one song on a list of greatest guitar solos of all time. Not all of them but most of them. 
You dont find Beatles songs listed but for the most part that wasnt their style. About the only Rolling Stones song you find on any lists is "Sympathy for the Devil" so again for the most part it wasnt their style of music but it was the style for most bands of the past but it hasnt been the case for a number of years now. 
Maybe tomorrow or next month or next year some new/newer band will crack the charts of best guitar solos so it is not as if it is impossible but the way most new songs are written they just dont rely on a hard charging screaming lead guitar solo or even a strong lead guitarist without a incendiary solo. 
I think that also causes fewer kids to aspire to be the next Jimmy Page or Jeff Beck or Eddie Van Halen. They mainly listen to new/newer music and say I want to be like this guy or that guy and those guys are not guys like Ted Nugent or Randy Rhoads.
Now and then groups of the younger generations will get turned onto older music. I have three nieces and a few years back they were all in college and one time when they were all home for Christmas and we were talking my brother in law, their father, asked them what was up at college, what was new and my middle aged niece got all excited and told us about the "new group" she and all her friends were really into. It was Led Zeppelin. Of course she meant "new group" as in new to them but what happened is one of them heard some Zeppelin songs and turned on a few friends and all of a sudden it spread through N.C. State like wildfire and was the hot thing instead of the new/newer music they normally listened to. 
The one thing I can say about music is that regardless of what type or style it is the greats always remain great and like bell bottoms or miniskirts they seem to die out now and then but then you look around one day and theyre back and theyre all the rage. Good is good and it always remains good. It may not always be popular but it remains good and will resurface eventually among a younger generation and become popular again. 
The greats dont age, they remain timeless but they will go dormant now and then but like a seed in the ground when the conditions are right, no matter how long it takes, they sprout and people sit up and take notice even if the song or songs were from when their parents or maybe even grandparents were young. 
*


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## CrackerJax (Feb 7, 2009)

If you turn on the radio, you have lost most of your options to listen to good music. by the way, that has never really changed....radio has sucked for a very long long time. Remember when the Archies dominated the radio play? I rest my case...  

Of course Rap was started commercially by one of the whitest people on the Planet, Deborah Harry...  makes sense huh?


out.


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## Brick Top (Feb 7, 2009)

Tizzle312 said:


> i HATE country music so much it is not even funny


*I am anything but a fan of country music but after having lived in the South for almost 22-years now I have been subjected to a good deal of it and have found that there are a few good artists/songs that even people like me who love Black Sabbath and Ozzy and Lynyrd Skynyrd and Led Zeppelin and bands like that can enjoy. They are select songs from the many the country musicians write/play over their careers but they can still get you going. 
Dwight Yoakam has a few songs that are pretty good, songs like "Fast as You" and "Little Sister." Hank Williams Jr. has a couple that are pretty decent. Marty Stuart and Travis Tritt teamed up to do a pretty decent song "Honky Tonkins What I Do Best" and Travis Tritts "T-R-O-U-B-L-E" and a couple others arent bad at all. 
Not all country songs are she broke my heart so I broke her jaw sort of songs. 
I dont bar hop anymore but when I first moved down here I did and even at places that were mainly rock you would almost always hear one song at least once, normally very late when it was getting near closing time and everyone was drunk as sailors on shore leave. That was David Alan Coes "You Never Even Called Me By My Name." It is not anything close to being rock or even a fast country song like the others I mentioned but it gets people going for some reason, even rockers. Its also funny thanks to the last verse so that makes people like it too but for some reason it gets drunk and stoned rockers going even though it sounds VERY country. 
I very seldom listen to the songs I listed, though I do have them on my Windows Media Player, but there are just times when they really work. 
I prefer to listen to Bow Wow Wow or Billy Idol or better yet Black Sabbath or Lynyrd Skynyrd or something but the others do have their times and they really arent at all bad if you give them a chance. 
*


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## CrackerJax (Feb 7, 2009)

the only good country is the old country IMO.... Hank Williams Sr., not Jr. I could listen to patsy Cline all day....


out.


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## Brick Top (Feb 7, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> If you turn on the radio, you have lost most of your options to listen to good music. by the way, that has never really changed....radio has sucked for a very long long time. Remember when the Archies dominated the radio play? I rest my case...
> 
> Of course Rap was started commercially by one of the whitest people on the Planet, Deborah Harry...  makes sense huh?
> 
> ...


*I will agree that radio has changed and it has changed for the worst. When I was in high school and younger there were some really great FM channels that had very few commercials and would play a bunch of songs in a row and then some low voiced smooth as honey sounding DJ would just say that was  and then the music would start again and the best part was it was always a mix of different things. Most stations, even rock stations, are basically top hit stations. You may hear Black Sabbath or Ozzy or other great bands but they will only play their biggest hits. I cant remember the last time I heard "Fairies Wear Boots" or "Mr. Crowley" on the radio but I will hear "Black Sabbath" and "Paranoid" and "Crazy Train" and "No More Tears" etc. often. 
Just think about how often you will hear "Freebird" or "Sweet Home Alabama" or "Gimmie Three Steps" but when was the last time you heard "The Needle and the Spoon?"
When was the last time any of you heard Jeff Becks "Constipated Duck" or "Cause We Ended as Lovers" or "Freeway Jam?" Id bet some of you have never heard any of them on the radio.
Radio became to commercialized and to profit oriented and to much under the power or control of their sponsors to play many songs that were good songs and to give us a mix of songs from different bands and instead are top hit stations regardless of what they define themselves as being. 
Find a rock station and you will hear Ted Nugents "Stranglehold" but I will bet you will never hear Teds "*_Queen Of The Forest_." In the OLD TV show "WKRP in Cincinnati" when "Johnny Fever" was told in the middle of some elevator music song that he could change the format and play rock the very first song played was Ted Nugents "Queen of the Forest" so you know it had to be hot at the time and really rockin since that was what the new format was supposed to be for the station so they picked a really rockin song for the first to be played but I doubt that anyone here had heard it on the radio for a decade or more, maybe two decades or more. 
Sadly if you buy the old "WKRP in Cincinnati" on DVD you wont hear "Queen of the Forest" or most other songs that the station played because when the show was made they did not buy the rights to use them if transferred to another media and when the DVDs were going to be made the makers would not pay for the rights to use the songs again so a whole bunch of great tunes were taken out and cheaper or public domain songs replaced them on the DVDs. It doesnt work with many of the jokes and it just doesnt fit the show and the story line of the show so if any of you are fans of the old show dont waste your money on the DVDs because you will be disappointed. 
But again it points out how a once really hot rockin hit is never played on the radio stations of today.


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## Brick Top (Feb 7, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> the only good country is the old country IMO.... Hank Williams Sr., not Jr. I could listen to patsy Cline all day....
> 
> 
> out.


It all comes down to personal taste just like the foods we like the best. My ex-business partner loves the old country music like Hank Sr. but to me its like fingernails on a chalk board. 
I don&#8217;t know if its more of a case of to each their own or there is no accounting for taste but either way we all like what we like and that is all that matters regardless of what someone else may say is better.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 7, 2009)

Brick Top said:


> *I will agree that radio has changed and it has changed for the worst. When I was in high school and younger there were some really great FM channels that had very few commercials and would play a bunch of songs in a row and then some low voiced smooth as honey sounding DJ would just say that was  and then the music would start again and the best part was it was always a mix of different things. Most stations, even rock stations, are basically top hit stations. You may hear Black Sabbath or Ozzy or other great bands but they will only play their biggest hits. I cant remember the last time I heard "Fairies Wear Boots" or "Mr. Crowley" on the radio but I will hear "Black Sabbath" and "Paranoid" and "Crazy Train" and "No More Tears" etc. often.
> Just think about how often you will hear "Freebird" or "Sweet Home Alabama" or "Gimmie Three Steps" but when was the last time you heard "The Needle and the Spoon?"
> When was the last time any of you heard Jeff Becks "Constipated Duck" or "Cause We Ended as Lovers" or "Freeway Jam?" Id bet some of you have never heard any of them on the radio.
> Radio became to commercialized and to profit oriented and to much under the power or control of their sponsors to play many songs that were good songs and to give us a mix of songs from different bands and instead are top hit stations regardless of what they define themselves as being.
> ...


yah, i agree with you....it has definitely hit the skids compared to the 70's. I guess our parents said the same thing about the 50's  
Jeff Beck? Huh? who dat? And that man is still cranking out some terrific music, but he's far beyond needing or wanting a "commercial" hit, don't you think? 



Brick Top said:


> It all comes down to personal taste just like the foods we like the best. My ex-business partner loves the old country music like Hank Sr. but to me its like fingernails on a chalk board.
> I dont know if its more of a case of to each their own or there is no accounting for taste but either way we all like what we like and that is all that matters regardless of what someone else may say is better.


I agree 100%....that's why I put in the "IMO" bit  




out.


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## chronik4lyfe (Feb 7, 2009)

typical old people talk... haha


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## CrackerJax (Feb 7, 2009)

So you are different huh? 

You don't have preferences?

I'm glad you have risen above it all....let me just play a little Herb Alpert for yah...   (<---that's really old)


out.


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## Brick Top (Feb 7, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> Jeff Beck? Huh? who dat? And that man is still cranking out some terrific music, but he's far beyond needing or wanting a "commercial" hit, don't you think?


If Jeff Beck is one thing that is he is not commercial. Sure he&#8217;s made his bucks in life by any guy that would turn down a chance to join The Rolling Stones because he wanted to play his music and play it his way you know isn&#8217;t driven mainly by the desire to build up his bank account. He would have made a lot more money being in The Rolling Stones but that was less important to him than his music was. 
He was in some really old super groups and made a major mark on rock and roll in the past but he moved on and took a different route. 
One thing that he did that utterly amazed me is when he teamed up with Seal and did "Manic Depression," the Jimi Hendrix tune, for a tribute CD, called "Stone Free," where a number of really good musicians covered Hendrix tunes. All of them except Jeff Back and Seal did their own versions, none had the testicular fortitude to try to duplicate Hendrix but Beck and Seal not only duplicated Hendrix but out did him at his own song. 
A little game I like to play is to burn both versions of "Manic Depression" onto a CD and then play them back to back to people who claim to be big Hendrix fans and then ask which was Hendrix and which was the cover. To date not a single person has picked correctly. When I ask them why they picked the one they did most say because the guitar work was better and some say it was the vocals, Seal&#8217;s voice, and say it sounded more like Hendrix. Pink Floyd considered replacing Syd Barrett with Jeff Beck when Barrett became a handful to deal with and Pink Floyd did not have low standards. 
It took the two of them together to top Hendrix at one of his own songs but they did it and all I can figure for why people I have played both for and that all have picked the Beck/Seal version to be Hendrix is that in their minds Hendrix was the best so when they hear the better version they just assume it has to be Hendrix. 
You have to be one hell of a guitar player for people to listen to you play and Hendrix play back to back and pick you as being the better so that goes a LONG way to tell how fantastic Jeff Beck really is.


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## Brick Top (Feb 7, 2009)

chronik4lyfe said:


> typical old people talk... haha


You will be there one day. Some day you will be telling your grandkids how when you were a child you had to walk five miles to school everyday in the snow barefoot and it was uphill both ways. 
Thats just what happens to us old farts and not only will your day come it will come much faster than you expect it to.


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## tinyTURTLE (Feb 7, 2009)

Two words:
Mr. Bungle


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## chronik4lyfe (Feb 7, 2009)

yeah i see myself, .. 30 years down the road thinkin '.. god damn kids these days dont know music worth shit, but eh i still got a long way to go, and im gunna enjoy every step of the way... and when that time comes ima be stubborn as fuck just cause i can hahah


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## CrackerJax (Feb 7, 2009)

chronik4lyfe said:


> yeah i see myself, .. 30 years down the road thinkin '.. god damn kids these days dont know music worth shit, but eh i still got a long way to go, and im gunna enjoy every step of the way... and when that time comes ima be stubborn as fuck just cause i can hahah



 It's one of those natural processes in the phases of life.... like walking.... ur doing it but are not aware of it on the conscious level. Everything becomes like your favorite comfortable shoes. Of course bong hits keep everything just ducky when the radio suks....  

Here's hoping you make those next 60+ some odd years.... not everybody gets to stay on the conveyor belt of life.  


out.


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## chronik4lyfe (Feb 7, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> It's one of those natural processes in the phases of life.... like walking.... ur doing it but are not aware of it on the conscious level. Everything becomes like your favorite comfortable shoes. Of course bong hits keep everything just ducky when the radio suks....
> 
> Here's hoping you make those next 60+ some odd years.... not everybody gets to stay on the conveyor belt of life.
> 
> ...


i hear ya man, i can already see it happening, emo kids piss me off, but their like the new goth/prep/weirdos.. i almost hope i dont reach the age of 60.. so much stupid shit goin on in the world right now


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## CrackerJax (Feb 7, 2009)

chronik4lyfe said:


> i hear ya man, i can already see it happening, emo kids piss me off, but their like the new goth/prep/weirdos.. i almost hope i dont reach the age of 60.. so much stupid shit goin on in the world right now



 At some point you will only like the 50 yard kids. those are kids who are at least 50 yards from you...any closer and you will become agitated ...  JK!!! 


out.


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## chronik4lyfe (Feb 7, 2009)

haha carryin around a 50 yard stick beatin any kids entering the "safe zone"... screamin " god damn whippersnapperes these days, runnin around acting like HOOLIGANS" haha... those would be the prime years...


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## CrackerJax (Feb 7, 2009)

In the future I hope to invent a small portable EMP device....when I shuffle near a pack of kids (youth tend to congregate like used butts in a urinal), I will just hit the button and whuuuumppfffhtsss!!... crash all their gizmos and toys...knock down their grid, and then whip out my EMP protected sound projector(ill invent that too ) and blast them with some Barry Manilow and watch the quick scatter and the slow writhe in agony... muhahahahah!!

And I won't be wearing any under pants either, so don't chase me!!!


out.


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## dannyking (Feb 7, 2009)

Simon cowell has murdered any chance of real talent or culture ever being ''popular'' again. Can you imagine the kids of today listening to led zeppelin????


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## chronik4lyfe (Feb 7, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> In the future I hope to invent a small portable EMP device....when I shuffle near a pack of kids (youth tend to congregate like used butts in a urinal), I will just hit the button and whuuuumppfffhtsss!!... crash all their gizmos and toys...knock down their grid, and then whip out my EMP protected sound projector(ill invent that too ) and blast them with some Barry Manilow and watch the quick scatter and the slow writhe in agony... muhahahahah!!
> 
> And I won't be wearing any under pants either, so don't chase me!!!
> 
> ...


haahah... start a old people cult.. carryin around a cane with ur emp thing in it, big ass speakers strapped to the sides, listening to itunes while, screwin with the kids cellphones n shit


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## BackDoorMan (Feb 7, 2009)

dude, I almost got in a fist fight over Bob Dylan the other night.. fuck Bob Dylan... I'm sure that was the shit back in the day.. but today it's just shit.. 

I like CCR and The doors.. but I don;t consider it great music.. in my opinion, great bands are nightwish, Therion, Danzig, Slipknot.. those are great bands.. those are great artists.. 

But at the end of the day, it's all about what speaks to you and your personal experiance and what's inside of you..


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## Brick Top (Feb 7, 2009)

dannyking said:


> Can you imagine the kids of today listening to led zeppelin????


It happens. I previously mentioned how one of my nieces came home from college for Christmas and some of her big news was the "new group" that she and all her friends were into. That "new group" was Led Zeppelin. It hit N.C. State like a sledgehammer and was all the rage so it does happens.

The true classics always remain good and as I said like bell bottoms and miniskirts and hip hugger jeans things go out of style or fashion for a while but they do return and when they do they are BIG and they are loved and the true classic music of the past is no different. 

Not all of it is classic, some is just old. What stunk back then still stinks today but the true classics live on and on and while they may go dormant for a while they pop up again and again and they will keep doing so. 

Look at how long music like Bach and Beethoven have hung around. Look at how long some operas have hung around. What makes you think that in many years to come someone wont be playing "Layla" or "Freebird" or "Stairway to Heaven" and the "Dark Side of the Moon" songs and others like them? 

There will always be someone into them. That is inevitable. They are like the tides, they come in and they go out but they never remain out and instead always come back in.


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## dannyking (Feb 7, 2009)

Great post. I dont think in 50 years we will be hearing much from slipknot etc.


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## natmoon (Feb 7, 2009)

Brick Top said:


> It happens. I previously mentioned how one of my nieces came home from college for Christmas and some of her big news was the "new group" that she and all her friends were into. That "new group" was Led Zeppelin. It hit N.C. State like a sledgehammer and was all the rage so it does happens.
> 
> The true classics always remain good and as I said like bell bottoms and miniskirts and hip hugger jeans things go out of style or fashion for a while but they do return and when they do they are BIG and they are loved and the true classic music of the past is no different.
> 
> ...


Yeah true i have remade many classical tracks myself using synthesizers.
Sonic potential,is what its really about,on the human ear


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## mastakoosh (Feb 7, 2009)

nah i dont listen to real music.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 8, 2009)

mastakoosh said:


> nah i dont listen to real music.



So you listen to fake music? 



out.


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## Brick Top (Feb 8, 2009)

natmoon said:


> Yeah true i have remade many classical tracks myself using synthesizers.
> Sonic potential,is what its really about,on the human ear


It sounds like youve done the 1968, "Switched-On Bach" thing on your own. It must be fun to play with old classics and modernize them in some way or another.

While it is not a case of classical music it is an example of an old song updated but look what Jimi Hendrix did with the Star Spangled Banner at Woodstock. 

Another few examples, though not of songs as old as the Star Spangled Banner would be the Van Halen/David Lee Roth versions of "Thats Life" and "Im Just a Gigolo" and "(Oh) Pretty Woman" and "Dancing in the Streets" and ZZ Tops version of "Viva Las Vegas."

A good group can cover just about anything that was good if they are imaginative enough give it a new sound but still retain enough of what made it a hit in the first place and have a hit of their own. 

Quiet Riot did it with The Runaways 
"Mamma Weer All Crazee Now," though I admit that is not a good example because it was a rock song to begin with and just covered but it does show that if you take something good from the past, far enough back in time that it is not familiar with your present day audience, and do it well you have a hit on your hands. 

Music is like so many others things, and maybe even more so in that quality lasts, it is something timeless and it does not really age or become dated. 

Many songs of the 60's and 70's that were big then now seem really dated and just do not work, like most Emerson, Lake and Palmer songs, but some are as fresh today as the day they first came out and that is because that had something special to them, something that does not lose its power and feelings over time. 

A group can have a number of gold and platinum records and in ten years or more people hear them and want to stick their finger down their throats and puke but songs like "Sympathy for the Devil" live on and on.


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## mastakoosh (Feb 8, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> So you listen to fake music?
> 
> 
> 
> out.


 exactly.. now who is the one who defines what is real and fake music for all others....


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## Brick Top (Feb 8, 2009)

mastakoosh said:


> exactly.. now who is the one who defines what is real and fake music for all others....


 
Real music is what you listen to on the radio and from CDs etc. and fake music is what you hear in your head when nothing is actually playing. You know, like when dogs tell you to kill your ex-girlfriend or boss or something.

DONT LISTEN TO FAKE MUSIC!!!!!


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## mastakoosh (Feb 8, 2009)

so you are saying i shouldnt listen to mr. chompers when he says to kill people?? because he is my voice of reason..


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## panhead (Feb 8, 2009)

All i listen to is real music from highly accomplished musicians,ive got zero time or appreacation for one hit wonder rap stars looking tough/talkin shit & acting cool,all the while none of them can play a single musical instrument.

The Allman Bro's are one of my favorite bands & we've seen them live 3 times,my favorite version of the Allman's is with Derick Trucks on guitar,the whole multiple percusionest aspect of the Allman brohters is what makes their music hit me so heavily.

It's a shame that so many young people think that rap music is where it's at because they are missing some of the worlds greatest new talents develope right before their very eye's,their missing it all because all they crave is computer generated back beat music being looped in the back ground, while some fake ghetto tough guy raps,new world class artists like Les Claypool,Dweezil Zappa or Buckethead go totally un noticed and un apprecaited for the legandary musical abilities they are developing,all the while no musical talent rap hero's who sing about drinking syzrup or gang bullshit are emulated & adored as a person they should aspire to be.

I think its a great thread you started & one that young people should pay attention to,music is a very important part of life & is one of the most accomplished art forms we could ever have,an entire generation has lost any apprecaition for musical genious & has mistakenly replaced musical talent/genius with rap music that is written with target audiences in mind.

IMO rap music has done irreparible damage to the whole world of music & holds no more cultural value than a popular tv sitcom.


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## natmoon (Feb 8, 2009)

Brick Top said:


> It sounds like you&#8217;ve done the 1968, "Switched-On Bach" thing on your own. It must be fun to play with old classics and modernize them in some way or another.
> 
> While it is not a case of classical music it is an example of an old song updated but look what Jimi Hendrix did with the Star Spangled Banner at Woodstock.
> 
> ...


Dont know if i can embed any songs here but i will try
Nope cant embed them,but heres links to all of my work,some mental,some classical and some just plain weird.
Its real music because i really made it,lmfao 

a higher state
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2330877&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2330877&q=hi 
acid chaos
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3082355&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3082355&q=hi 
Adagio in G minor(synthremake)
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3309436&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3309436&q=hi 
adagio(softerandcleaner)
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3358946&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3358946&q=hi 
Alien Soul
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2332908&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2332908&q=hi 
alpha and omega
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2037897&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2037897&q=hi 
ambient noise
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2993638&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2993638&q=hi 
Andromeda 7.
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4736336&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4736336&q=hi 
BigSoundExperiment
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3902228&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3902228&q=hi 
Bollocks Knee Nuts
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3964935&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3964935&q=hi 
Breathe
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3988982&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3988982&q=hi 
carress
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3152502&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3152502&q=hi 
Chantra
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2332704&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2332704&q=hi 
christmas fun tune
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3166709&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3166709&q=hi 
Der Wanderer Trance Remix
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4162766&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4162766&q=hi 
distortion madness
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3110452&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3110452&q=hi 
drt+itssupposedtobeautomaticbutactually1
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3244447&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3244447&q=hi 
Electribal Drone
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4284566&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4284566&q=hi 
Entheogen
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6080645&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6080645&q=hi 
Etudes-Opus 25 No.12 in A#
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4242285&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4242285&q=hi 
Fluid Synth
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3963010&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3963010&q=hi 
for shadow at dr2
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2297370&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2297370&q=hi 
Forever Awake(Locutus remix by nat moon)
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3229998&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3229998&q=hi 
gouryella(ligaya)(synth)
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3299715&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3299715&q=hi 
Haunted Analog Synth
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3377201&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3377201&q=hi 
He Dreams Of Us?
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3757855&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3757855&q=hi 
Hear The Alien Orchestra
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4115861&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4115861&q=hi 
Heres to the impossible
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6873393&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6873393&q=hi 
Hypnosizer
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6293073&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6293073&q=hi 
I cant quite understand.
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4522977&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4522977&q=hi 
just loops
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2907493&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2907493&q=hi 
Lazy Space
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4405863&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4405863&q=hi 
Leyenda 2.2
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5027123&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5027123&q=hi 
leyenda(remake)
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3213984&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3213984&q=hi 
littleduck
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2037932&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2037932&q=hi 
madness
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2146748&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2146748&q=hi 
Maniacal Hard Synth
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4125913&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4125913&q=hi 
Marijuana Man
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4305444&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4305444&q=hi 
Mojo can go forever.
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4624261&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4624261&q=hi 
moon vs Bach
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5734017&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5734017&q=hi 
Moonweed.
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5818910&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5818910&q=hi 
Mozart The Magician
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6950577&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6950577&q=hi 
Never come down.
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4451428&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4451428&q=hi 
Odd Jiloppys Dreamwave
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4736316&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4736316&q=hi 
Oh come let us adore him.
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6096347&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6096347&q=hi 
Oh Xmas Tree
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4769550&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4769550&q=hi 
orchestral theme
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2700433&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2700433&q=hi 
Phantom Tribe
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4024305&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4024305&q=hi 
pygmysynth
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2954278&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2954278&q=hi 
quick sequence
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2144911&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2144911&q=hi 
rebirth
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2037869&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2037869&q=hi 
Redemption
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5001409&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5001409&q=hi 
rerecordnotfadeaway
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2037844&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2037844&q=hi 
Sadishe (remixed by natmoon)
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3237913&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3237913&q=hi 
Samples
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3286062&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3286062&q=hi 
Sine-Star Bass
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4208028&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4208028&q=hi 
some where in the future
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2051638&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2051638&q=hi 
Sonata No.1 (synthremake)
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3629864&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3629864&q=hi 
Space Temple
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4062226&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4062226&q=hi 
Space Temple(part 2)
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4073551&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4073551&q=hi 
Space Temple(part 3)
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4074534&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4074534&q=hi 
Space Temple(part 4)
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4095379&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4095379&q=hi 
Synthesizer ESP
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3863806&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3863806&q=hi 
Tales of the expected.
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5338121&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5338121&q=hi 
Technomage trance drone
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3276611&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3276611&q=hi 
The 80s Feel Good Factor.
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4482208&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4482208&q=hi 
The Death Of Ase.
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5517412&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5517412&q=hi 
The End.
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5126330&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5126330&q=hi 
The End.(funky remix)
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5150624&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5150624&q=hi 
The galaxy string theory
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2048267&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2048267&q=hi 
The Mad Synthesizer
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3152162&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3152162&q=hi 
TheEyeOfTheUniverse
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3425062&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3425062&q=hi 
themeliketrance
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2037790&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=2037790&q=hi 
Time and Peace
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4386880&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=4386880&q=hi 
Timeholes vs natmoon
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6493839&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6493839&q=hi 
Trip Drummer
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5277715&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5277715&q=hi 
Vivaldi four seasons piece
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6252575&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6252575&q=hi 
Waves
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3875643&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3875643&q=hi 
weirdittly odd and annoying
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3253213&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3253213&q=hi 
What does God dream of?
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3654556&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=3654556&q=hi 
Whats it like to be free?
lo-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6657302&q=lo
hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6657302&q=hi


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## ironheadxl (Feb 8, 2009)

Got In Memory of Elizabeth reed on now, by the Allman Brothers if you didn't know already. Thanks be to Shiva man I'm a child of the sixties and seventies..we still had music back then.... Saw Stevie Ray Vaughn twice in small venues, modern stuff I dig too I just prefer the vintage, plus I'm classically trained (12 years) so I have these "very serious opinions" that drives my ex wife a little crazy...


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## panhead (Feb 8, 2009)

GrowTech said:


> yeah, if you turn on radio or music television these days, you will find out that (sadly) the guitar solo has died...


Guitar solo,everybody plays guitar like a demon now days,kids lost interest in learning to play a real guitar & prefer to invest their time mastering how to play a fake plastic air guitar that hooks up to their X Box.

Kids think rap is music, which it is not,its spoken word entertainment at best but surely not music as we know it.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 9, 2009)

One of my all time fav travel album for the road is Eric Clapton's 651 Ocean Boulevard. Motherless children shows off his slide work.... 



out.


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## Brick Top (Feb 9, 2009)

mastakoosh said:


> so you are saying i shouldnt listen to mr. chompers when he says to kill people?? because he is my voice of reason..


 
You may be wise to consider getting a second opinion on such things.


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## Brick Top (Feb 9, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> One of my all time fav travel album for the road is Eric Clapton's 651 Ocean Boulevard. Motherless children shows off his slide work....
> 
> 
> 
> out.


 
While I normally go in for more heavy rock at times for long drives something more laid back works for me and one of them that does really well for me is "A Decade of Steely Dan." There are just so many great tunes on that CD that I dont find myself searching for something else to put it in after a few songs have played and there are several not so good songs between good ones. 

Another similar choice for me is "The Next Voice You Hear  The Best of Jackson Browne." Again so many great tunes that you dont get tired of it and you dont get bored waiting for something else really good to play. Its just one good one after another just like the Steely Dan CD.


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## fukdapolice (Feb 9, 2009)

panhead said:


> Kids think rap is music, which it is not,its spoken word entertainment at best but surely not music as we know it.


you should stop speaking on music that you have no idea about. just because you don't like it, it does not mean you know about it.


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## BadDog40 (Feb 9, 2009)

When rappers learn to play an instrument I'll consider it music.

MTV ruined music and turned it into show and image rather than substance.


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## fukdapolice (Feb 9, 2009)

BadDog40 said:


> When rappers learn to play an instrument I'll consider it music.
> 
> MTV ruined music and turned it into show and image rather than substance.


im not trying to be an ass about this... but...

it does not matter if you consider it music. just do not speak about it, if you have no clue about it.

it is like me talking about folk music - even tho i have never listened to it.

does that make sense? i am just trying to be clear as possible.


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## BadDog40 (Feb 9, 2009)

fukdapolice said:


> im not trying to be an ass about this... but...
> 
> it does not matter if you consider it music. just do not speak about it, if you have no clue about it.
> 
> ...



The difference is I have and do listen to some rap. So when does one 'have a clue about it'?


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## panhead (Feb 9, 2009)

fukdapolice said:


> you should stop speaking on music that you have no idea about. just because you don't like it, it does not mean you know about it.


I have ears as well as eye's,ive heard lots of rap songs all the way through,i can make decisions based on what i hear within the song,i do not need to be a fan of rap to form an opinion on what i hear nor do i need to enjoy listening to rap to hear exactly what the lyrics are saying,there are no deeply hidden messages in the content of the lyrics that one must be a rap lover to understand,nor does one have to be from "the hood" to understand the meaning of the lyrical content.

FYI i grew up in, & live in Detroit, i know all about hood life,im not a 19 year old kid fronting tough guy with daddy's BMW, then going back home to safteyville USA & having momma do my laundry.

Quote," Spoken word is a form of literary art,or artistic performance,in which lyrics,poetry or stories are spoken,rather than sung ".

I dont like rap music & im aware of why i find no value in its content & the negative social values it brings to the table,a thread on this site just last week where a very young member found out about drinking a narcotic drink called "Syzzzurp" from hearing his favorite rap heros rap about it in different songs,now that he has heard his favorite rap heros rap about it he wants to drink the narcotic,his words not speculation on my part,great role models i'd say.

I also dont like rap music because of the extreme simplicity of its content,no real musical talent on a real musical instrumet is demonstrated in any rap songs,most melodic content contained in rap songs comes not from real life musicians playing instruments,its computer generated back beats of the utmost simplistic nature,the beats are so very simple that any 2nd month drum or bass student would easily replicate any musical content,no heavy musical skills are displayed in any rap ive ever heard,just droning,endlessly simplistic bass beats recorded at extreme spl levels.

Ive told you why i dislike rap based on what i know about the art form,based on what i hear with my own ears,based on the definition of musical ability,and based on the negative social values i see children replicating based on what their rap idols preach to them,now you tell me why you think rap is so great & what social value its bringing to the table.


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## fukdapolice (Feb 9, 2009)

BadDog & Pan...

i would like to apologize. i made an ass out of myself by assuming.

you see, every time i see someone trash hip-hop they usually dont listen to it, have no knowledge, and just spew hate. but after reading your posts, i see that is not the same with you guys.

so i guess all i can say about hip-hop to you guys is this: dont listen to the "hip-hop" that they play on the radio - cause that is not hip-hop! that is HIP-POP!!! there is good hip-hop out there, you just have to find it. rappers with good content, and smart lyrics. there are groups that use live instruments(the roots, stetsasonic).

smoke on guys


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## CrackerJax (Feb 9, 2009)

Hip hop is certainly music by definition....but not much further than that. It's extremely simple music compared to say jazz or classical. While no one can say it isn't music, but in the gradations of musical complexity, it is near or at the bottom. Not a judgment, just a factoid. 


out.


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## mastakoosh (Feb 9, 2009)

sorry if you dont have knowledge on something you shouldnt judge it or speak on it. putting labels on things and judging is a habit i try to stay away from, but we are all human.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 9, 2009)

I believe I just displayed my knowledge of hip hop. It is music albeit very simple music. Listening to it doesn't make it more complex.....


out.


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## panhead (Feb 9, 2009)

fukdapolice said:


> BadDog & Pan...
> 
> i would like to apologize. i made an ass out of myself by assuming.
> 
> ...


Im responding not in anger of your post, nor am i trying to make you come around to my line of thought about rap,the reason behind my response is more to let you & other young folk know where i & alot of other anti rap guys are comming from,most anti rap people share the same issues about the negative aspects of modern rap.

Just so ya know,i have not allways loathed rap music,i was listening to rap & going to see the 1st rap artist live in 1968-69 or 70 when i was in NYC(too old to remember exact years),the genre was totally new & nobody had heard anything like the guy on stage with a full band & using spoken word instead of singing,it was pretty exciting to watch it all unfold when it was brand new,this was way before the sugar hill gang came out,i still listen to some very early rap from time to time,i hate what rap has become,nowdays its all about gang banging,pimping hoe's,killing,murder,dope & pretty much acting like assholes, punks & down right thugs,also along the way the need to have real skilled & talented musicians as part of the genre was replaced in order of importance,with the artists tough guy image being way more important than any musicianship he may have.

Also part of my extreme distaste of the genre of rap is its heavy influence on children where other than listening to rap these kids have no violence or drugs in their lives,its one thing for us adults who are aware of life to take drugs & to get into shit where people could get hurt or killed,but when little sissy kids from suburbia get their first ideas of doing hard drugs from the rap star they idolize its a pretty shitty scene,or lil johnny vanilla ice who gets his first ideas of carring a gun because he thinks it makes him hard like all his rap idols,these are not isolated instances either. 

A quick question for all the people in this thread who really enjoy rap music & prefer it over any other genre.

Can any of you guy's see yourselves sitting there in your car when your 60 years old,car stereo blasting out Lil Jon at 137 DB ,or comming home from a hard ass day's work & putting on some Lil Wayne & chilling out


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## fukdapolice (Feb 9, 2009)

panhead said:


> Im responding not in anger of your post, nor am i trying to make you come around to my line of thought about rap,the reason behind my response is more to let you & other young folk know where i & alot of other anti rap guys are comming from,most anti rap people share the same issues about the negative aspects of modern rap.
> 
> Just so ya know,i have not allways loathed rap music,i was listening to rap & going to see the 1st rap artist live in 1968-69 or 70 when i was in NYC(too old to remember exact years),the genre was totally new & nobody had heard anything like the guy on stage with a full band & using spoken word instead of singing,it was pretty exciting to watch it all unfold when it was brand new,this was way before the sugar hill gang came out,i still listen to some very early rap from time to time,i hate what rap has become,nowdays its all about gang banging,pimping hoe's,killing,murder,dope & pretty much acting like assholes, punks & down right thugs,also along the way the need to have real skilled & talented musicians as part of the genre was replaced in order of importance,with the artists tough guy image being way more important than any musicianship he may have.
> 
> ...


you'd have to ask people who listen to those guys. i don't listen to that bullshit music.

there's two sides...

i agree with you about the influence on the younger generations.... but that also has to do with the *parents not doing their job*. these young kids are so much *more easily influenced these days.*... growing up i knew the difference between right and wrong... its different now-a-days with these kids.

and to asnwer your question: yes and no. yes, i can see myself listening to the music. but no, not listening to those artists you named.


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## jea1 (Feb 9, 2009)

Not all rap is about murdering people, drugs, and fucking hoes. Underground rap is where it's at. I'll admit mainstream does blow for the most part though. 

If you want to listen to some rap with actual meaning, hit me up.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 10, 2009)

I have never had a problem with the content of hippy hop flop. I'm all for free speech and letting the market dictate the success of that speech. Except for Al Gore....that dude needs to STFU already .

out.


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## Brick Top (Feb 10, 2009)

fukdapolice said:


> you should stop speaking on music that you have no idea about. just because you don't like it, it does not mean you know about it.


 

I am not saying his/her opinion about rap was right or wrong but I will say that certain types of music last and others will be hot as hell fire for a while and then die out and later will seem very dated and not retain a following and not build new followers in years to come. 

Look at the punk phase for example. About the only good thing that punk rock ever did was give the ugly kids a chance to be popular. 

Pick one rap song that you think will be as played and as admired and as enjoyed and as appreciated in 50 years from now as Led Zeppelins "Kashmir" will almost certainly be.


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## fukdapolice (Feb 10, 2009)

Brick Top said:


> I am not saying his/her opinion about rap was right or wrong but I will say that certain types of music last and others will be hot as hell fire for a while and then die out and later will seem very dated and not retain a following and not build new followers in years to come.
> 
> Look at the punk phase for example. About the only good thing that punk rock ever did was give the ugly kids a chance to be popular.
> 
> *Pick one rap song that you think will be as played and as admired and as enjoyed and as appreciated in 50 years from now as Led Zeppelins "Kashmir" will almost certainly be.*


[youtube]OGHyutNq-S4[/youtube]


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## Brick Top (Feb 10, 2009)

I am not an expert on rap or hip hop but I have noticed that a fir number of at least somewhat big hits from some of the big names their songs in part or almost totally relied on music from the past, big hits from the past, that new lyrics have been put to. 

That is because those artists are smart enough to know that the music they use from the past is quality and it will never die and every time a new generation trots it out it excites people and it is loved so using it gives their songs a better chance to be hits and to last and endure than most others that heavily lack artistic musical style. 

Heck look at how Run DMC had a major hit doing Aerosmith&#8217;s "Walk This Way." They had their style, their kind of music but they also knew a hit when they heard it so they used it, along with Aerosmith&#8217;s help, and they raked in the cash and made a major name for themselves. 

Look how Nelly used Lynyrd Skynyrd&#8217;s "Sweet Home Alabama." Now that was intelligent. He used quality music and did his thing to it. 

You can&#8217;t kill quality music even with bad lyrics added. Now I am NOT saying that Nelly&#8217;s lyrics are bad. I am just saying that the music itself will always remain and will always draw people and even if there are crummy lyrics used what you hear behind it will still make many people enjoy it. 

There have been a good number of really great songs, meaning great music actually, that had weak or bad lyrics but they were still hits and they are still loved by many. You can write simplistic repetitive lyrics and add them to a great piece of music and they can top the charts and they can live on and on but regardless of how great some lyrics may be if put to a weak piece of music you can expect little from it and it will never be much of a hit and maybe at best be a trivia question some day. 

No style of music will ever hold/retain the full total size of the following it has when it is new and at its peak but only quality music lives forever and always has at least a respectable size following at all times. 

Bluegrass is an old style of music and it sounds like fingernails on a chalk board to me but it is very artistic and it retains a respectable sized following. Look at Alison Krauss for example. She is mainly Bluegrass with some Country mixed in and she has what, 22 Grammy&#8217;s now? That&#8217;s more than anyone else has ever won. Sure teaming up with Robert Plant didn&#8217;t hurt her any but then it is not like she changed to his old style of music either and the music retains its integrity and roots and along with it a following. 

Does anyone here think that in 50 years no one will know names like John Lee Hooker and B.B. King? They will be dust in the ground, well one already is, but their music will live on and many people will enjoy the heck out of it. 

I just have a feeling that even the biggest names of rap will not be remembered in 50 years from now. I may be wrong but to me what they consider to be artistic is not really artistic. It is an expression of and a reflection of the times and their lives but it is not really art and it is the true art found in songs that make them and those who created the music immortal musically and in name.


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## Brick Top (Feb 10, 2009)

fukdapolice said:


> [youtube]OGHyutNq-S4[/youtube]


 
What you have there is a piece of music of the time, of the present era and as times change its meaning will be lost in history and will not hit home to people they way it does now to some people. 

The music itself is not artistic enough to survive the struggle of time. The lyrics will not be anywhere as meaningful in the future when the things he sang about are history like WWI is. It lacks what is needed to survive the test of time. 

The lyrics say a lot to many people today and hit home with them but things will not remain the same over time and the lyrics will not remain as meaningful and there will not be anything else for the song to fall back on to keep it alive and to retain a following. 

The most famous of all music became so and lives on because of the music and not the lyrics. Heck many of the greatest works of music of all time never had lyrics and they live on and on and retain a following. 

It is the music that makes something great, not the lyrics. Lyrics can add to it if the music is quality to begin with but you cannot make chicken salad out of chicken shit no matter how much mayonnaise you add and that is what many modern artists, of different types of music and not just rap or hip hop, are trying to do.


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## fukdapolice (Feb 10, 2009)

Brick Top said:


> What you have there is a piece of music of the time, of the present era and as times change its meaning will be lost in history and will not hit home to people they way it does now to some people.
> 
> The music itself is not artistic enough to survive the struggle of time. The lyrics will not be anywhere as meaningful in the future when the things he sang about are history like WWI is. It lacks what is needed to survive the test of time.
> 
> ...


maybe for you. thats your opinion on the song.

and i think your opinion of the song is wrong.

Juicy will be a classic, that entire album is a classic. iduno anything about you, but i grew up poor, in the hood, and in the struggle. that song is about the struggle, and coming outta the struggle. it will never get old. maybe to the new generations, cuz all they listen to is lil wayne n his bullshit. i will forever keep GOOD music alive.

edit: and there will always be struggle in the ghetto, and in the hoods... so how would the song not last?


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## mastakoosh (Feb 10, 2009)

everyone has valid points but saying hip hop isnt music doesnt make it true. it may not be everyones cup of tea but to some it is important. some may say it is simplistic and it may be to them but to someone that has been listening since the early eighties not all beats and songs are created equal. if it were easy to create hip hop, why doesnt every tom, dick and harry create music that i actually like? why have some producers become legendary? because they are skilled at what they do. there is a lot of garbage out right now but i can look to the past to make myself happy, just as some of yall do with your preferred type of genre. hip hop may have had some influence on todays culture and youth but lets not point the finger directly at hip hop entirely. todays society is influenced by many negative things, for example grand theft auto. the game where you can shoot grandmas, fuck and kill prostitutes, sell drugs etc...i knew a woman who says her 7 year old plays ....wtf. what about babies raising babies with no guidance? what about maury povich show? what about our countries economic state, coupled with hard drugs and no jobs in many areas? there are a multitude of things that are shaping our youth, and there are many things to blame along with music..some of my favorite hip hop songs are about, faith, honor, family, love, friends.. i am not gonna change yalls minds, just as you wont change mine, but to that, i say good day sir hahaha.


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## jea1 (Feb 10, 2009)

A lot of rap songs will never lose meaning. I think you guys have to turn off the radio and listen to other kinds before you form that idea.


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## WoldofWeedcraft (Feb 10, 2009)

I think music is like a first impression, and you just have to make the connection. It just has to be presented to you appropriately for you to appreciate it. Being a younger adult, I didn't have to privelage to hear all of the classic rock bands while they were hot. But I still listen to them on occasion, and if they aren't presented in a way that I can appreciate them I label them no good. Like the eagles for example. I never really enjoyed their music until I heard them in concert.

But one of my favorite bands is TOOL. I think maynard is one of the best rock vocalists. He also sings in A Perfect Circle which is also an awesome band. Between the two bands, maynard has covered a lot of classic rock songs like led zepplin's "No Quarter" and "When the levee breaks" and also Ted Nugent's "Stranglehold." I love all three of these songs when maynard does them, I think he's so much better. But the led zepplin version of when the levee breaks just sounds like crap compared to the modern synths. 

I'll spare you with links, but if you like Led Zep or Ted Nugent, check out those songs by TOOL/APC. In my opinion the modern sound is much better, but that just may be my connection being young and all.


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## Brick Top (Feb 10, 2009)

fukdapolice said:


> maybe for you. thats your opinion on the song.
> 
> and i think your opinion of the song is wrong.
> 
> ...


 
Maybe I am basing my opinion on to high of hopes for the future but I do not believe there will always be ghettos and the same sort of struggle going on. 

For one even now everyone that is struggling their struggle can often times be very different, though just as difficult, and his music will not hit home with them in the least. 

As for ghettos look at Cabrini Green in Chicago, it was among the worst of the worst. I know because I lived outside of Chicago for 32 years, and now it is gone or at least almost totally gone. Its been torn down and nice expensive places are being built and the South Side is being not only returned to the nice place it once was but is being made even better. 

Most of the residents have moved to the outer suburbs and while still in low income and assisted income housing they no longer live in the same atmosphere or situation and while it is not as if suddenly their lives have become wonderful the same things that people in many rap songs sing about no longer directly apply to the new lives of those that have moved. 

The same thing has happened in much of Harlem and what was once a hellhole is now upscale and the former residents live in different locations and different situations and the same environmental influences no longer exist in their lives. 

It may take decades for all such places to no longer exist but that is what I am talking about, how things will be in decades from now and once you remove the environment the life is different and songs about that life that rely almost totally on their lyrics and not on quality music behind them will be meaningless and just be a part of history. 

I dont mean to knock your taste because music is after all a matter of taste as much as foods are and you will like what you like and if right now it hits home for you it has true meaning and it is strong and powerful for you but when the times change that same strength and power and meaning will not be felt by others like you feel it now. 

Try looking at it this way and see if it makes any sense to you. Consider some of the really powerful very meaningful very popular anti-war protest songs from the 60s and early 70s about the war in Vietnam. They hit home and hit it very powerfully to many people in that era but what are they today? They are nostalgia, they are a memory, they are still half liked by those of us who were of that generation but even among us they now totally lack the power and the meaning and are nothing but a blast from our past. Once we are gone who will listen to them and say wow, that was great, that was powerful, that had real meaning? The answer is no one.

If the County Joe and the Fish song "The Fish Cheer & I-Feel-Like-I'm-Fixin'-To-Die Rag" was played on the radio, if they could play the "fuck" part, or even if they just played the song minus the cheer how many people today would say wow that was a really great song! No one other maybe than us old farts and it would only be because it brought back a moment in time of peace, love and dope and protesting. To anyone else it would be like a gimmick song or half a joke and not be powerful or meaningful or hit home with them because they were not alive at the time and did not see and feel what we saw and felt at the time. 

The very same thing can honestly be said about the very greatest of all the protest songs of the era. Some were very powerful and very meaningful and absolutely hammered themselves home to us but today they are like looking at pictures of our 9th birthday or something and have about as much impact on the modern listener as it would be for us to show strangers the pictures of our 9th birthday and expect them to enjoy them. 

Times change and period music from each point in time dies out when its original audience dies out but true good music lives on and on.

You may not agree and that of course is your right. You may see the music you like as being truly good music but try to listen to it once without the lyrics and then ask yourself what is there that will create a new audience in 20 or 50 or more years because the lyrics will not be as powerful then and they will not be as meaningful then and they will not hit home with people then so once that happens what is left, what is truly artistic? Nothing. 

The art of rap is the lyrics and they are locked in time, they are a part of their era and they will not live on and evolve so new audiences will love and appreciate them but a song like "Kashmir" will be listened to many years from now and be very appreciated for its artistic quality. It will remain ageless and not locked in time or in any one era and that is the difference just like the great protest songs of the 60s and early 70s have become locked in time and now no longer in their era they do not hit home with anyone and are only audible memories of the past half enjoyed by people who lived in that era.


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## bulletproofhoodies (Feb 10, 2009)

i guess only the music you like is "real" music


P.S. Whoever was talkin bout lifes a bitch by nas your the man thats one of my favorite songs AZ's flow is so good
and i deff know what you mean about likin it when you live it im from camden and ive seen plenty of bad shit go down
lifes a bitch and then you die thats why we GET HIGH cuz you never know when you gonna go, im gonna make that shit my sig


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## WoldofWeedcraft (Feb 10, 2009)

In response to what Brick Top said (to spare the quotes) I think any form of art starts from a vision that the artist is trying to portray. In your reference to rap, I think many rap artists do a good job portraying a lifestyle that came from a vision that they have had whether it be fantasy or reality. You make a good point about how their era won't last as long since their lyrically based music tends to reflect their generations. Hip hop/rap has evolved, and many think it is dead. I think as long as the artist is able to connect listeners to his/her vision, the piece of art has served it's purpose regardless of how long it will be appreciated. So if you can connect to the lyrics from a song or if you just like the way they go together, you can appreciate the artist's work and you gain something from that experience.


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## Brick Top (Feb 10, 2009)

WoldofWeedcraft said:


> I'll spare you with links, but if you like Led Zep or Ted Nugent, check out those songs by TOOL/APC. In my opinion the modern sound is much better, but that just may be my connection being young and all.


 
Music, like I previously said, is a matter of taste and it is also somewhat generational. One thing I have noticed over my life is that each new generation seems to want or need to believe that their generation if not invented sex drugs and rock and roll it at least perfected it. That is not true though. 

Young people rebel against almost anything and that includes music of the past and of their parents generation and that is in both those who write and perform and those who listen. They may very much like the basics of of the music from the past but they have to change it and put their brand on it and it of course it is popular among those of their generation. 

But like natural selection only the best of the best survives the test of time regardless of how hot or how in or how cool it once was. 

True quality music has a structure to it regardless of what type it is. It may be Country and it may be Rock and it may be Jazz and it many be the Blues or whatever but no matter how many songs are written in each genre only the best of the best survive and if they are period pieces, things that rely on current events and feelings and experiences and mainly lyrics unless they have utterly fantastic music behind them they die out with time. That is how it has always been and that is how it will always be. 

At a time in the 70s Emerson, Lake and Palmer were hotter than the flames of hell. No one sold out large arenas better than they did for a handful of years. I saw then at Soldier Field in Chicago and there were 75,000 people there. They fill arenas of 60,000 to 80,000 people easier than most groups today will fill a 20,00 seat arena but how many Emerson, Lake and Palmer songs do you hear played today? What you will hear the most will be Karn Evil 9 but it will only be part 2 of the 1st impression and not parts 1 or 3. 

They were extremely artistic but most of their music was one-dimensional. They relied very heavily on synthesizers and once that craze died so did most of their music.

Why do you hear Jethro Tulls "Locomotive Breath" way more than Emerson, Lake and Palmers "Still You Turn Me On" or "Lucky Man?" Because the music was better constructed to stand the test of time, it was not so one-dimensional so its appeal lives on. Again Emerson, Lake and Palmer were incredibly artistic and amazingly talented but their music was one of an era and eras come and go and what only fits in one era will not be popular in another era. 

Why are so many Beatles songs still so loved and sell so well when you almost cant give away a Quiet Riot CD or a Mötley Crüe CD today? Why did Twisted Sisters "We're Not Gonna Take It" hit number 21 on the charts and stay there for a long time and made VH1s top 100 songs of the 80s but you almost never hear it get any airtime today and who is a fan of Twisted Sister today? What happened to The Sex Pistols and Slade? They drew fans like shit draws flies and now they are trivia questions today. 

Their music was one dimensional and it was part gimmick in that it was glam/rock and it was mostly period pieces and those things will never make up for quality music and they will fade out and die in time. 

Why was Lou Reed so big and then all but died out? Its because he got away from his roots, he stopped doing what he did best and he tried to become David Bowie. It just didnt work for him and his later stuff is not worth anything but his early work is still great. He transformed from being a great musician into trying to do what was popular in a period, doing what was seen as hot at the time, what was cool in an era and that stuff did not last because it lacked what is needed to live on while his early quality music lives on.

How many musicians have been bigger than Michael Jackson? Look at his major successes with CDs like "Thriller." It sold over 100 million copies and he won what was at the time a record 7 Grammy awards for it and who and what is Michael Jackson today? How well do you think his music is still selling considering that he is or was just about broke and had to sell his backyard amusement park and almost lost his home? When was the last time he filled an arena? Now the only seats he can fill are the seats in a court room. 

Do you see Paul McCartney in a similar situation? Nope. 

Much of the music he wrote/played/made with the Beatles is timeless and it lives on and still draws new followers and as the times changed he adapted and very little of what he ever did was one dimensional and because it was quality music and not some period in time piece or some gimmick it lives on and on and it will continue to do so. 

Sure someone who loves Tool may laugh at Ted Nugents music but I would bet anything and everything I have that in 20 or 50 years from now you will hear "Stranglehold" played and people will say Tool? Who or what was Tool?

Some people absolutely loved Hole but where is Courtney Love today? Her career dried up faster than Sarah Silvermans pussy around guys that cant help her in the business. 

Dont get me wrong because I like Courtney Love. Shes like the girl next door, if you happen to live next to a methadone clinic. 

But shes cool beans and she had talent but she didnt come close to lasting like the Rolling Stones have, has she? 

Will you hear her music in 20 or 50 years right after "Sympathy for the Devil" or "Tumbling Dice" or "Brown Sugar" is played? Id bet my soul you wont but you will hear the Rolling Stones. Not as much as today but you will hear them because they mostly wrote quality songs that are timeless. 

No matter how hot and popular some type of music is at a point in time there is no reason to believe that anyone in the future will have even the slightest interest in it if it lacks true artistic talent and quality of the actual music itself and many bands and songs and forms of music that lit the world on fire at some point in time are forgotten today and others will be forgotten in the future. Rap is almost certain to be among those that are forgotten.


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## bulletproofhoodies (Feb 10, 2009)

im not rebelling against older generations one of my favorite bans is toots and the maytals a band from 1963 i also love the adicts from 1976 or the varukers from 1978 or x-ray specs from 77 my musical taste has nothin 2 do with spiting my parents


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## WoldofWeedcraft (Feb 10, 2009)

Brick Top said:


> Sure someone who loves Tool may laugh at Ted Nugents music but I would bet anything and everything I have that in 20 or 50 years from now you will hear "Stranglehold" played and people will say Tool? Who or what was Tool?


Well yea of course, I wasn't saying that Ted Nugent and Led Zep are crap. I love both of them. But I'm referring to the technology behind the recording that makes the newer artists emulate the old ones better. The way things have become digital, high def, and the dynamic technology that has become available has allowed newer artists to make their music sound better. Of course a lot of it is artificial, I mean I know the history behind the Moog synth and how synths became what they are. It's not that I think older artists suck, they just weren't playing the same type of music. Their guitars didn't sound the same, their vocals weren't nearly recorded the same way. 

Just compare:

YouTube - Led-Zeppelin When the Levee Breaks

YouTube - 11. When the levee breaks

I love both of these artists, and they each recorded the same song but with different instruments/technology. I just prefer maynard's vocals and the rythm of a perfect circle. I'm not rebelling, just my preference. It sounds cleaner I guess...I dunno.


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## Brick Top (Feb 10, 2009)

WoldofWeedcraft said:


> Hip hop/rap has evolved, and many think it is dead. I think as long as the artist is able to connect listeners to his/her vision, the piece of art has served it's purpose regardless of how long it will be appreciated. So if you can connect to the lyrics from a song or if you just like the way they go together, you can appreciate the artist's work and you gain something from that experience.


 
You made a valid point but at the same time you validated what I have been saying about music withstanding the test of time. 

Connecting to a present audience or group or following is something in and of itself and as long as you can evolve to do that you will sell CDs and draw crowds. But if your music lacks the true requirements to withstand the test of time once you stop performing your music begins to die and in time as your past followers/fans die out so does your music and so does your legacy. 

True quality music can and will connect with generation after generation and by its structure and quality it lives on and it does not need to evolve because what exists is on its own enough to draw new followers. 

I dont know how many of you attend many concerts but I go to a bunch of them and I always look at the crowd and When I went to see Ozzy and when I went to see Black Sabbath and they played their old tunes the audience ate them up with a spoon and the audience was not filled with a bunch of old farts. It was largely younger people. 

The same goes with Lynyrd Skynyrd concerts. The guys on stage are as old or older than the parents of many of the people in the audience but the crowd absolutely loved them and went wild for the songs that came from the era of the original Lynyrd Skynyrd band. 

I mentioned how a few years ago one of my nieces came home for Christmas and told how Led Zeppelin was all the rage at N.C. State. Sure the girls still hit the dance floor and shook their asses to hip hop but in the dorms and in homes when there were parties Led Zeppelin filled the air far more than anything else at the time. 

Why is that?

Because what they did and what many other bands did was write things that keep connecting with people, new listeners, even though Led Zeppelin hasnt written a song or performed a new song or even their own songs for decades. 

Why do you think the "Dark Side of the Moon" CD still sells so well when you stop to think about how long it has been since Pink Floyd played and how a couple of them are now dead? Like other great bands of the past they created music that crosses generational barriers and it lives on. It like other music may be old now but it is not locked in the era in which it was created due to it being quality music and not something that relies on lyrics based on current times that will pass like rap will. 

Why do you think it is that until just a few years ago Peter Framptons "Frampton Comes Alive" was still the number one top selling album/CD and it is still one of the top sellers even though it was originally released in 1976? What did it have that kept it the number one selling album/CD for decades? It wasnt some gimmick and it wasnt just lyrics but instead it was because it was quality music that was created long ago but was not locked in that period of time. 

If someone creates music that connects with their followers through lyrics and even if they evolve and change their music to keep connecting through lyrics as the times change they will continue to have a following but if the actual music behind the lyrics lacks true quality once they eventually stop performing the evolution of their music then ends, which is what happens at that point, what connected throughout their careers will stop connecting with newer audiences/listeners and then you begin to hear a death rattle in their music when it is played and then not long after that it goes flat line and it is all over.

That is music. That is how it has always been and that is how it will always be. 

If someone can create music that does not connect because it is generational or because of current events/current life experiences but instead connects because it is truly quality music it will cross the generational barriers and it will live on and on. As I said it would not always retain as large of an audience or group of followers but look at Bach and Mozart and Beethoven. Why does music from those eras live on and so much music made since is totally unknown to people and is never listened to or played or given a single second of airtime? 

True quality survives the test of time and all else regardless of how hot it may be at some point in time dies off, it goes the way of the full service gas station and it is never heard from again.


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## WoldofWeedcraft (Feb 10, 2009)

Brick Top said:


> True quality survives the test of time and all else regardless of how hot it may be at some point in time dies off, it goes the way of the full service gas station and it is never heard from again.


That may be your opinion. I believe true quality can sometimes be undiscovered, and oftentimes be "niched" in places with low popularity. Just because certain bands were able to be popular at a particular time and since the media made it so doesn't mean that they were true quality. Of course quality is a matter of perspective, but I think there's more to it than building a legacy. Sure those older popular artists were successfull in their careers, and they may have been talented but that doesn't mean they were the most talented. Sure Beethoven and Mozart were famous worldwide fortheir classical music, and yes they were extremely talented. I'm not into music just because it's trendy, my appreciation for it goes much further.


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## Stoney McFried (Feb 10, 2009)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Quhj6PEboCU&feature=related


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## Brick Top (Feb 11, 2009)

WoldofWeedcraft said:


> Well yea of course, I wasn't saying that Ted Nugent and Led Zep are crap. I love both of them. But I'm referring to the technology behind the recording that makes the newer artists emulate the old ones better. The way things have become digital, high def, and the dynamic technology that has become available has allowed newer artists to make their music sound better. Of course a lot of it is artificial, I mean I know the history behind the Moog synth and how synths became what they are. It's not that I think older artists suck, they just weren't playing the same type of music. Their guitars didn't sound the same, their vocals weren't nearly recorded the same way.
> 
> Just compare:
> 
> ...


 
I will agree with your statement on the difference in technology but them many old songs have been broken down and digitally re-recorded and can match anything put out today when it comes to technology and the music itself is better. 

A crummy 60s era recording studio could never come close to what a modern one can do when it comes to sound but a better higher technology recorded song that lacks quality is not a better song just because of how advanced its recording technology is. 

I have heard old songs that were originally recorded in mono and where the entire band would play at once instead of separate tracks laid down that have been broken down and made digital and separated into different tracks and then re-recorded and they sound fantastic so it is not like a scratchy sounding 1960s or 1970s LP is the best many songs of the past will ever sound. It is just a matter of the older songs being good enough and still creating a new following to warrant the time and expense to do that to them. 

When it comes to synthesizers they have been in vogue and out of vogue several times over my life. Some people just refuse to accept it as being true music and see it as a gimmick so it is hard for such music to last and to live on. I gave the example of Emerson, Lake and Palmer as such a band that suffered from that. They were extremely talented and astonishingly artistic but what they used to create much of their music in time became frowned upon and it was no longer seen as real music and the result of talent and instead the results of gimmickry and equipment that could do what musicians themselves cannot do. That not only hurt them but it killed them and it will kill again. In time it will pop up again, not the old music but the use of synthesizers and it will again for a time be popular until some music snob critics write enough words saying if you take away their fancy equipment they are nothing and then people start to think that is true and once again it will die out at least for a period of time. 

Equipment that alters sound and creates artificial sound can be big at times but it does not last. As utterly fantastic as Jeff Beck was and is while he was one of the very first to make use of the "talk box" and then Joe Walsh used it with great success and then Peter Frampton became ultra famous using it and got rich as heck from it when was the last time any artist had a hit using a "talk box?" 

It became seen as a gimmick, a way to somewhat cheat. After Jeff Beck heard Peter Frampton use it Jeff Beck gave it up for good and never used it again. 

While at some point in almost every guitarists life/career they experiment with and use things like Wah wah pedals and things but the greatest of the greats normally over the careers get away from things that artificially alter what they do. A few years back in an interview Eric Clapton, one of the all time greats, was talking about how fantastic Jeff Beck is and he said; "he does it all with his fingers." Sure in the past Jeff Beck experimented with different things and used them at times but over time he got away from it and relied totally on his skills and talents and not on equipment. That is the mark of a true artist. They do not need things to enhance what they cannot do on their own so it sounds great. That is what separates the men from the boys, so to speak, when it comes to music. 

Musicians like Jeff Beck creates true music while may others create sound and noise. 

MarkKnopfler from "Dire Straits" has at times used various things to augment what he did but for the most part he didnt Heck he doesnt even use a guitar pick and instead only uses his fingers. How many guitarists can you name that do that? That is called talent my friend and no additional electronic device can ever replace it or make up for it.

I realize that when it comes to things like guitars not all musicians of the past had ones that were as good as some modern custom made ones are. Eddie Van Halen is a fanatic about his guitars and will at times design and oversee their production and then have a number of them made and play them all and pick the best of the best so again you do at least to a degree have a point.

But when you are talking about bands/guitarists that have not reached a level where they can do that and they still rely on what is factory made no one can honestly say a Fender of today matches up with the Fenders of old. That is just a fact that is irrefutable so in that when bands of the past relied on the old Fenders they were way ahead of the new upcoming bands who are not in a position like an Eddic Van Halen or Tony Iommi who can go to Fender or Gibson and say this is what I want and I want it made from this type of wood and that type of wood and use different combinations of woods for the body and the neck and I want it in this design and that design and then they test them all and use the very best of them all. 

You can go to any guitar shop and buy a Gibson Tony Iommi model SG but it will never play like the ones Tony uses. You can buy a Gibson Les Paul that is the Peter Frampton model or a Fender Stratocaster that is the Eric Clapton model and again they will not play like the ones that Peter or Eric play. 

But in the past those companies built very high quality models that could be bought at any guitar shop and they were better than what the average person can buy at a guitar shop and they are sought after and much prized by those who can find one in good condition because the only way to get a better one today is to be a Eddie Van Halen or a Eric Clapton or a Tony Iommi or someone where a guitar manufacturer, major brand name or totally custom builder will build exactly what you want and enough of them for at least some to meet your expectations and requirements and they do not come cheap and many bands that are not major yet cannot afford such things and do not have the name to get manufacturers to do just what they want and when they want it.

Again if you want to talk about modern technology and musical equipment look at the 80s, especially the early 80s when electronic drums were all the rage. Where are they now? What big name bands use them? They were considered to be an advancement in drum technology at one time but does Bill Ward play them? Has he ever played them? Nope. Where are the drummers that used to play them? They are in the audience watching Bill Ward pound away on the dinosaur technology set of drums like he always played. 

Technology can be a great thing when it comes to certain things but when it comes to others it cannot make up for true talent. Hand Jeff Beck a standard factory made Fender Stratocaster or Gibson Les Paul from the 60s and give some guitarist from some modern band a high tech custom made guitar and Id bet everything I have that Jeff will play circles around the other guitarist and sound much better. 

Do you think that Jimi Hendrix played some high tech custom made guitar? His Stratocasters were not even left handed models like he was and he took right handed ones and strung them different and the "Whammy Bar" was on top and at times hung down over the strings as he played but he played it and made it sing and scream and how many guitarists of today with their custom made high tech guitars would come close to matching let alone topping Jimi? 

All the technology in the world will never replace true talent or make up for a lack of true talent.


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## natmoon (Feb 11, 2009)

My hands ache from playing with my technology.
Does it matter that i play a synthesizer?
I dream of the day when i can plug a machine into my brain and download my brains tunes into my pc and upload them for you all to hear


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## Brick Top (Feb 11, 2009)

WoldofWeedcraft said:


> That may be your opinion. I believe true quality can sometimes be undiscovered, and oftentimes be "niched" in places with low popularity. Just because certain bands were able to be popular at a particular time and since the media made it so doesn't mean that they were true quality. Of course quality is a matter of perspective, but I think there's more to it than building a legacy. Sure those older popular artists were successfull in their careers, and they may have been talented but that doesn't mean they were the most talented. Sure Beethoven and Mozart were famous worldwide fortheir classical music, and yes they were extremely talented. I'm not into music just because it's trendy, my appreciation for it goes much further.


 
To a point I will agree that at times talent can go undiscovered. Over the years many greats played with bands where their style was not one where some member or members could really shine. But seldom if ever is the case where someone truly talented did not eventually emerge and their true talents refined and honed and then had a chance to shine. 

As for the media possibly making a band famous, well if you were alive in the 60s and 70s and of an age where you were old enough to remember Rolling Stone magazine ripped almost every album that Led Zeppelin did and the shredded the song "Layla" but what happened to Led Zeppelin and Eric Clapton and his song "Layla?" 

You had the biggest name in music writing, the most famous and highly regarded music critics of the time shredding those musicians and they still became among the most famous and best selling artists and they packed every venue they played and they are today considered to be among the very greatest most talented rock musicians of all time so what does that tell you about the medias influence on fans/listeners/followers. 

Music is not like politics where the media can take a fence turtle like President Obama and sell him to the public. Musicians either make it or do not make it based on their talent and their talent alone. 

Why do you think that "Queen" was able to create such incredibly amazing music? How do you think they were able to write and perform songs like "Bohemian Rhapsody?" They were not only highly talented but they were college educated and had degrees in music. They studied the greats of the past, they knew all styles and types of music from classical to opera to rock and roll and they combined them and that was what made them famous, not because the media told people they were great. 

They were not some garage band who covered other artists songs and then later tried writing a few of their own and worked and worked to attempt to get somewhere but never did. They were highly educated extremely talented true musical artists and it showed in their work and nothing the media did or could have done would either have made them a success or stopped them from being a success. Their music spoke for itself and it did not need the media to sell it to the public and to make them famous and successful. 

Ill tell you a little story that I find to be funny. My ex-neighbor was a bass player and drummer and he had been in several bands in Boston and then after moving here he again hooked up with a band. They were really pretty good even though they played the more modern style of rock music like has come out in the last decade or less. 

One day while hanging around over there the other members of the band stopped by and they had come up with something they thought was of major importance for them to have a chance to make it big. They decided that they needed to pump a lot of iron and get covered in tattoos so they would "look cool" on stage. That was their big plan to make it big. They had talent but they thought they had to have this certain image to make it. 

Take a look at the old Leslie West, "The Great Fatsby" and tell me a musician needs a bulked up body and to be covered in tattos to make it. These guys, like so many newer bands, believe that looks and image will get them places when all they need to make it is talent and determination. 

Consider the "Traveling Wilburys." George Harrison, Jeff Lynne, Roy Orbison, Tom Petty and Bob Dylan, maybe the ugliest collection of musicians ever assembled and anything but cool bulked up tattoo covered musicians and they made some damn good music. 

Today many musicians want to try to make it using appearance and image and gimmicks and electronics that alter what they can do into what they cannot do on their own so they sound good and look marketable. 

Does anyone here think that was the plan "The Yardbirds" came up with? Is that how the careers of Jeff Beck and Eric Clapton and Jimmy Page, who were all at one time or another members of "The Yardbirds" began, by trying to look cool and create a marketable image or was it based on their musical artistic talents? 

Does anyone here think that one day Ronnie Lane, Ian McLagan, Kenny Jones, Ron Wood and Rod Stewart, better know as "The Faces" said we need to bulk up and cover ourselves in tattoos so we "look cool" on stage? I have to think not. 

True musical artists only need their God given gifts, some time to write and some time to practice and then a few places to play and they will make it and they will make it big.


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## Brick Top (Feb 11, 2009)

WoldofWeedcraft said:


> Just compare:
> 
> YouTube - Led-Zeppelin When the Levee Breaks
> 
> ...


 
I do not mean to knock you or your preference in music but first listening to a youtube version of anything will not being out its full sound but I understand that it is the only way to offer a comparison but when I play "When the Levee Breaks" on my stereo or even on my computer using Windows Media Player it sounds a whole lot better than on youtube. 

Again not to knock you or your preference in music but to me and to many others, including many rock musicians, Robert Plant had the all time ultimate rock and roll voice. 

Your comparison of versions was not really, at least in my opinion, a valid or accurate comparison since the styles were to dramatically different. It was not really a cover so it was not really comparing apples to apples. It was a different version and that is comparing apples and zebras. 

One more time, not to sound like I am knocking you or your musical preference but the version you prefer is like taking sleeping pills to me. If Led Zeppelin were getting back together and playing only one show and it was in say San Francisco or something and Im way at the other end of the nation here in N.C. if I could get tickets I would gladly drive cross country, with a smile on my face the whole way listening to Zeppelin tunes, to see them but I wouldnt drive to the end up my street to see the version you prefer performed live if it was a free concert.

It is all a matter of taste and mine is no better than yours and yours is no better than mine. It is just what we each prefer and nothing more and there is no right or wrong, correct or incorrect involved. 

I love beef wellington and you may hate it and I love lobster and you may hate it and if so that does not mean I have better taste when it comes to food it only means I have different taste when it comes to food and music is no different. 

My only point has been not what someone likes when it is new or current or still fairly new music but how it will age, how well it will stand up against the test of time and as I keep saying only the best of the best manage to do that and no matter how well something else may be received/liked at some certain point in time it does not in any way mean it will stand up against the test of time especially if it is time/period based and mainly relies on lyrics that are also time/period/event based. 

Do you know how many times The Supremes song "You Keep Me Hanging On" has been covered over the years? The last time I counted it was 19 times. Aretha Franlkin and Rod Stewart among many others have covered it including Alvin and the Chipmunks but which one lives on and which one is considered to be the best? The Supremes. 

You can alter perfection and still make it sound good but you cannot improve on perfection.


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## WoldofWeedcraft (Feb 11, 2009)

Dammit Brick Top you must be the type guy that holds the joint for a really long time before passing it. lol just kidding. But I'm gonna +rep you since you put up with my objectivity without an attack. You seem to be very open minded, and you make a lot of excellent points. I understand the link i gave you is comparing apples to zebras, but I'm just trying to share my perspective. The old led zepplin song sounds like it would have been great for riding around in vans passing doobies the size of zepplins. And don't get me wrong, I love those classic bands, but it's not something that's going to remind me of _my_ youth. I just appreciate artists who put meaning into their music, like tool's stuff they actually created (not songs they re-made) has tons of deep meanings relating to philosophy, religion, spirituality, sexuality, censorship. None of their songs are just pointless ramble to give you your "warm inside" feeling to sing a repetitive chorus over and over that has linear lyrics. They are much more dynamic, as were led zepplin, which is why they took the time to honor them by remaking their music.


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## skippy pb (Feb 11, 2009)

Ganjatopolis said:


> I know that everyone has their own taste in music, and I'm gonna try not to offend anyone, but does anyone hear listen to good music anymore? I mean, the music that our lifestyle was started by, not rap and hip hop and whatnot. I can listen to rap when I'm at parties but only as a backdrop, not as music I would listen to in my spare time. What happened to bands like Simon and Garfunkel with their awesome vocals and guitar riffs, The Grateful Dead (even though we don't have a Jerry G.), Bob Dylan, etc. There are a couple new bands I ran across recently that I like, but I just can't stand today's angry metal (I had enough of it in the early 90's) or rap music because smoking pot is supposed to make you mellow, not angry about your bitches and hoes. Anyone else get me? Why can't anyone today enjoy The Allman Brothers, CCR, The Doors, Country Joe and the Fish, Pete Seeger, or Van Morrison. I have found some new guys showing promise though, Devendra Banhart and yesterday I heard this Ed Harcourt guy on the radio that sounded pretty good. Am I just lost in a culture that expands too quickly to keep up with, or do I have a killer taste in music? Well, thats just my little rant.



I like some one that stuff. Classic rock and stuff are were its at. I think your referring to the talented music, not just some guys in a studio using a M-Audio MIDI Keyboard and ProTools.


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## skippy pb (Feb 11, 2009)

WoldofWeedcraft said:


> Dammit Brick Top you must be the type guy that holds the joint for a really long time before passing it.


Hes sleeping on it. OH NO!!


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## CrackerJax (Feb 11, 2009)

I guess if Hip Hop could come up with songs like "Don't bogart that joint".....I might give it a listen 


out.


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## edux10 (Feb 11, 2009)

do you guys actually read posts this long?


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## edux10 (Feb 11, 2009)

Brick Top said:


> To a point I will agree that at times talent can go undiscovered. Over the years many greats played with bands where their style was not one where some member or members could really shine. But seldom if ever is the case where someone truly talented did not eventually emerge and their true talents refined and honed and then had a chance to shine.
> 
> As for the media possibly making a band famous, well if you were alive in the 60s and 70s and of an age where you were old enough to remember Rolling Stone magazine ripped almost every album that Led Zeppelin did and the shredded the song "Layla" but what happened to Led Zeppelin and Eric Clapton and his song "Layla?"
> 
> ...





Brick Top said:


> I do not mean to knock you or your preference in music but first listening to a youtube version of anything will not being out its full sound but I understand that it is the only way to offer a comparison but when I play "When the Levee Breaks" on my stereo or even on my computer using Windows Media Player it sounds a whole lot better than on youtube.
> 
> Again not to knock you or your preference in music but to me and to many others, including many rock musicians, Robert Plant had the all time ultimate rock and roll voice.
> 
> ...


???????????


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## CrackerJax (Feb 11, 2009)

Out of respect to the effort made by the person posting.... I read every line.



out.


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## Brick Top (Feb 11, 2009)

WoldofWeedcraft said:


> Dammit Brick Top you must be the type guy that holds the joint for a really long time before passing it. lol just kidding.


 
My smoking days go back to the late 60&#8217;s and back then, and later like into the 70&#8217;s or so, you took one hit and then passed it on. There was no puff, puff pass back then. It was take a toke and pass it to the left. While I have gotten used to the &#8216;new rules&#8217; when with older friends of my generation we still hit it once and pass it on, that is just natural to us and it still seems odd when I am hanging with a puff, puff pass crowd especially when it is passed to the right. 

I&#8217;m old and I&#8217;m old school and while maybe you can teach an old dog new tricks he won&#8217;t really enjoy doing them like he did the old ones and that&#8217;s me.

But if you haven&#8217;t noticed yet I am the kind of guy who if you ask me what time it is I will tell you how to build a watch. I don&#8217;t see any reason to say something with 50 words if you can say the same thing with 500 words. I think that is partially natural for me plus I spent my life in sales and in sales the last thing you want is air in the conversation so you just keep things flowing. You have to be born with the gift of gab and I most definitely was. 




> But I'm gonna +rep you since you put up with my objectivity without an attack. You seem to be very open minded, and you make a lot of excellent points. I understand the link i gave you is comparing apples to zebras, but I'm just trying to share my perspective. The old led zepplin song sounds like it would have been great for riding around in vans passing doobies the size of zepplins. And don't get me wrong, I love those classic bands, *but it's not something that's going to remind me of my youth.* I just appreciate artists who put meaning into their music, like tool's stuff they actually created (not songs they re-made) has tons of deep meanings relating to philosophy, religion, spirituality, sexuality, censorship. None of their songs are just pointless ramble to give you your "warm inside" feeling to sing a repetitive chorus over and over that has linear lyrics. They are much more dynamic, as were led zepplin, which is why they took the time to honor them by remaking their music.


 
There is validity to what you say. The part about how the old tunes do not remind you of your youth is very common and something that is important to many. 

Recently my brother in law, who is older than I am, said he heard a song that he was positive was an Eagles song and he said a line of lyrics took him back in time. The line was; "In sixty-five I was seventeen and running up one-o-one." Well I thought a moment and said that&#8217;s not the Eagles, it&#8217;s Jackson Browne&#8217;s "Running on Empty" which at first he doubted but later I showed him the lyrics online but again it took him back to his youth because in sixty-five he was seventeen and that meant something to him that I wouldn&#8217;t mean to many other people. 

I admit that there are some older songs that are not really all that great that I still really like just because they take me back to a time and or a place or some event that I really enjoyed so for that alone I like them but I know that for reasons like that unless someone else has an experience to look back on that is connected to the song that song might be totally unappealing to them now even if they liked it in the past. 

Some songs even from great and really famous bands just don&#8217;t age well. I used to be a big fan of Deep Purple and loved "Rat Bat Blue" and now I listen to it and ask myself how in the world did I ever think that was a great song? But then I hear "Highway Star" and the guitar solo that is rated as one of the top 20 or 25 guitar solos of all time by a number of sites that rate guitar solos and I still love it. Same band but different material and some not only aged well but like a fine wine got better with age and others turned to vinegar. That&#8217;s just how things work.

I don&#8217;t really have any problem with any type of music. It is not like I cannot listen to it and see some degree of artistic content. I am lucky enough to be an old guy but only old chronologically or mathematically but not in how I think or act or when it comes to maturity. I spent 15 years with a woman and she used to very often say that I was the world&#8217;s oldest adolescent. Sometimes she said it as a joke but other times it was anything but a joke. 

But because of that I have been able to mix with a much younger crowd. When my nieces all hit about 16 years old we began to party together. It would be me and there would be the three of them and a bunch of their friends and all their friends called me uncle because they all knew me since they were really little kids but I was not like their uncles or their parents. I fit in with them, I got high with them and we drank Irish Car Bombs and played asshole and stuff. Now they are all out of college and all three married but for all these years if they have some wing ding planned they invite their old uncle and I mix with them all and have a great time with them all and I have even been lucky enough to bed a few of their friends so I may be old when it comes to calendar years my brain keeps telling me that pretty soon I&#8217;ll turn 21. 

But hanging with them has exposed me to a lot of music that I would most likely not have chosen to listen to on my own and while I have to be honest and say that I do not believe that when it is compared to many older bands and songs that on a pure artistic level it does not stack up I can still understand its appeal. It is modern and a part of their present life and the girls can sure shake their asses to it better than they ever could to "30 Days in the Hole" so its damn good for that. 

But I honestly do not believe that in my case my beliefs about what will live on is based in my just preferring the music of my generation. I truly believe it is based in pure artistic value and I most definitely admit that there are far more songs of my era/generation that are totally forgotten about already than live on. But those that have lived on did so because of their pure artistic value and that will never die. They will not always have as large of a following as in the past but there will always be a number of people who hear it and love it and who will then turn on others to it. 

Like I previously said long after B. B. King is dust people will be listening to "The Thrill is Gone" and "Caldonia" and absolutely love it. It is a case of audible genius and that lives on and on. 

I can see and hear and feel an appeal to many newer songs and different types of songs but there is just something lacking that I have to believe I am not the only one noticing and that is sheer artistic talent and if I am right and it is lacking no matter how hot the sound is today it will cool off and then become cold and it will then be nothing more than a piece of history. It will be the "Macarena_._"

I don&#8217;t know if you have ever seen it or heard it but if not check out the video in the following link. It is Ten Years After playing "I&#8217;m Going Home" at Woodstock. Being a youtube video the sound is not high-def or anything but at the time Alvin Lee was so wasted that to me it was amazing that he could stand up and play let alone do what he did. If you've seen the flick "Woodstock" you might have noticed that he had to be led off the stage after their performance. The only time I ever saw a performer more wasted was Stevie Ray Vaughn. He didn&#8217;t come out to play when it was his time for about 45 minutes or more and then a guy brought out a chair and set it on stage and then two guys held him up and walked him to the chair and sat him down in it. He was in his stocking feet and he looked like he couldn&#8217;t even hold a guitar let alone play it but he proceeded to wail! Alvin Lee was close to that at Woodstock and he and Ten Years After gave what to me was the best performance of all that were shown on the movie "Woodstock" Check it out if you are not familiar with it. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHw9b4BBV9Y

I think that Alvin Lee may be the most or at least one of the most underrated guitarists of all time. He had Hendrix in his face all the time and while I think he was FANTASTIC it was hard to get attention with Hendrix around.


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## Brick Top (Feb 11, 2009)

edux10 said:


> do you guys actually read posts this long?


 
I have often times found that at various sites I frequent many people just skim what I write and some don&#8217;t even bother to read them. But then I more write them for myself, for my enjoyment than for any other reason so I really don&#8217;t mind if people just skim them or ignore them. I have my fun and that is all that matters to me.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 11, 2009)

Okay, now i have lost all respect for you....  jk!! 



out.


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## Brick Top (Feb 11, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> Okay, now i have lost all respect for you....  jk!!
> 
> 
> 
> out.


 
Welcome to the club. From what I understand it is a rather big one.


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## skippy pb (Feb 11, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> I guess if Hip Hop could come up with songs like "Don't bogart that joint".....I might give it a listen
> 
> 
> out.


Cypress hill, method man. Theres a couple ill listen too.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 11, 2009)

I always say, the more the merrier!! My glass is always half full, even if there's a crack in it. 


out.


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## cookin (Feb 11, 2009)

for people calling hip hop simplistic, so what? Even though some really isn't. I can see where you are coming from, but if you feel something you feel it. For all the genius of led zeplin, i can see what you mean i play guitar and appreciate it but still am not majorly into it, and that makes you all better than me.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 11, 2009)

Well i have not passed any judgment on anyone's taste in music. That's one of the joys of life, choice, at least in a free society. When I mentioned that hipoprocks was a more simple form of music, it was from a technical perspective, not a verdict of being inferior. I suppose if I was in my formative years, I might very well be attracted to Rap and such. That's why they call them the "formative" years. The driving and deep bass line in rap would be enough for me to listen. I do believe that some people do tend to judge a persons potential by lots of arbitrary means, but not me. It's sort of ridiculous for any person to categorically state that his/her taste in music is the correct one or that someone else's taste is inferior. 

having said that....smoke a nice big joint and listen to some Pat Metheny...  



out.


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## cookin (Feb 11, 2009)

yeah man . by the way that wasn't aimed at you, was just reading through it all and for some reason got that in my head


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## Brick Top (Feb 12, 2009)

cookin said:


> For all the genius of led zeplin, i can see what you mean i play guitar and appreciate it but still am not majorly into it,


 
Again its all just a matter of taste and there is no real true right or wrong answer or good or bad or correct or incorrect when it comes to taste. All that happens in some cases is what some people love lasts and what some people love dies out. 

Look at the big explosion of bands in the early 80&#8217;s and how big some of them were and the big hits they had. 

Where are they now? Instead of playing packed venues for a living they&#8217;re saying , uhhhh do you want fries with that? Do you want that supersized? Yet they were big stars, famous people at one time.

Some went on to do other things that were still music related and have done some really great work. If you watch many movies and pay attention to the credits you will see the lead singer for Oingo Boingo&#8217;s name very often. Danny Elfman has done the music scores for MANY major movies and lots of lesser ones so he still has an impact but not in a direct way like in the past. But many others are pure nothings now, just trivia questions. They were the Jerry Mathers&#8217; of their generation, they became "The Beaver." 


One of the things about true rock is that it had a major influence of blues in it originally. Many really major bands began as blues or mostly blues bands. Even some of the British invasion had a strong blues influence in their music and Led Zeppelin is one example. Much of their music has a strong blues influence to it. Another would be the Rolling Stones. 

Many American rock bands began with a very blues-like sound and some still retain a good bit if it. The Allman Brothers Band was one of them. When they were young their real life was almost like the Lynyrd Skynard song "The Ballad of Curtis Loew." Greg and Duane&#8217;s mom really didn&#8217;t care much for blacks and the black blues musicians they hung out with and played with but in time she came around and appreciated them and liked them. 

While it really didn&#8217;t show up much in their music later before Black Sabbath hit it big and kept changing names and were working day jobs so they could play at night and on the weekends they were into blues.

Its considered to be the first real American art form when it comes to music and it influenced British musicians heavily and true blues was sort of the rap of its era in that it was about struggle and survival and sadness, often about females instead of cops though and it wasn&#8217;t militant like some rap, but it was in part a reflection of the lives of those playing it and others like them and it hit home with a lot of people but the music itself was so good that those who did not feel or related to the message of the lyrics could still really enjoy the sound and then later enjoyed the same basic sound with a more rock edge to it in both British rock and American rock.

To me that is where rap is lacking and why I don&#8217;t think it will survive the test of time. It is only my opinion but I don&#8217;t see people in 50 years remembering and listening to even the biggest rappers of today but they will still know who John Lee Hooker was or who B. B. King was or who Bo Diddley was or who Albert Collins was and still enjoy their work. I may be wrong and due to my age I won&#8217;t be around to find out for sure but it is just something I really believe.


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## cookin (Feb 12, 2009)

yeah fair point, it will be a shame though if in years people aren't lighting up to smoke buddha by redman


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## indianaman (Feb 12, 2009)

Sublime!!!


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## Brick Top (Feb 12, 2009)

cookin said:


> yeah fair point, it will be a shame though if in years people aren't lighting up to smoke buddha by redman


 
As long as they are still lighting up I dont care what they are listening to. 

For all I care it can be music played on the "mouse organ" from one of the episodes of Monty Pythons Flying Circus is that is what they are into.


Its the lighting up thats the most important part of it all in my opinion.


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## cookin (Feb 12, 2009)

indianaman said:


> Sublime!!!


i don't practice santeria, I ain't got no crystal ball, they were sick


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## indianaman (Feb 12, 2009)

if i had a million dollars... well, i'd spend it all.


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## Brick Top (Feb 12, 2009)

indianaman said:


> if i had a million dollars... well, i'd spend it all.


 
If you had a million dollars you would not want to work and you would want to live off of it and try to turn it into two million too. That is what happens when you get that first million. Well at least if you earn it, if you had to work to get it. If you win a lottery or Aunt Ethel dies and leaves it to you then you might spend it like a drunken sailor on shore leave because you will think it is a ton of money and not really appreciate it and what it takes to earn it and the next thing you know you are selling your Porsche because you cant afford the insurance on it anymore and youre working at Lowes or Home Depot of at some job where your main duty is to say . Uhhhhh .. do you want fries that that? Do you want that supersized? 

If you work for it, if you earn it you will not want to spend it. Did you know that most self made millionaires mainly buy used cars? They know the value of a dollar and they know that the money they save buying used can and will work for them so they do not waste it and they let it work for them. Many will also finance a car instead of paying cash, as in a check, for it because they will normally have investments that will bring enough that it is worth it to pay interest and keep their money working for them. 

On the other hand most people that inherit large sums of money will buy new cars and spend like mad and that is because they do not know what it takes to earn that money and they tend to think that it will last forever. In some cases some are lucky to inherit enough that it will last forever but some dont and they learn a hard lesson in life.


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## indianaman (Feb 12, 2009)

if i had a million dollars i would build a million dollar grow-house with pudding pool and midget butlers. monkey chefs and topless supermodel maids, if the economy keeps getting worse i'll be lucky to get 49 hotpockets and a toyota corolla


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## CrackerJax (Feb 12, 2009)

Don't worry, u'll never have a million dollars.



out.


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## indianaman (Feb 12, 2009)

you know nothing of my fat chick fucking business cracker dude. make fun but 300 per head is the shit.


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## tusseltussel (Feb 12, 2009)

i only listen to what the media tells me is good!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grjmyCQmVjg


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## indianaman (Feb 12, 2009)

fluids dude.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdbs3lKEeBE


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## indianaman (Feb 12, 2009)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUroSlMWTbY&feature=related

holy shit dude....


watch this! we're all going to die, buy bottled water.


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## Brick Top (Feb 12, 2009)

indianaman said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUroSlMWTbY&feature=related
> 
> holy shit dude....
> 
> ...


 
What I found to be REALLY FUNNY was all the pictures of Dubya as if he was in some way responsible for the fluoridation of water when it began in the U.S. in the 1940s when FDR, a Democrat, was in the White House. 

Why didnt the video maker be intellectually honest and use FDRs picture and Trumans picture when they were the presidents that began it and then expanded its use? 

But by all means protect your precious bodily fluids there Brig. General Jack D. Ripper!


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## tusseltussel (Feb 12, 2009)

go argue that crap in the polatics threads

back to this thread now

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DU91POX33aE


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## CrackerJax (Feb 12, 2009)

He's an idiot. what's new. Go to the correct thread.




out.


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## Ganjatopolis (Feb 12, 2009)

cookin said:


> yeah fair point, it will be a shame though if in years people aren't lighting up to smoke buddha by redman


 I think it be more of a shame if they didn't know who the Dead where or Paul Simon.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 12, 2009)

Ganjatopolis said:


> I think it be more of a shame if they didn't know who the Dead where or Paul Simon.


Yah, I think every generation looks back and thinks that. Ever hear of Mitch Miller?


out.


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## indianaman (Feb 12, 2009)

You guys don't get it dude....

fluids are important.

i don't want to drink nazi water or water my plants with nazi water.

and crackerjax is a fucktard





out.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 12, 2009)

get off the thread if you are not discussing the topic..... GENIUS.
I smell a loaded diaper.

out.


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## indianaman (Feb 12, 2009)

pink floyd, old green day. sublime. pantera. what can i say..

I wasn't born in 1950's Alabama.


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## Brick Top (Feb 13, 2009)

cookin said:


> yeah fair point, it will be a shame though if in years people aren't lighting up to smoke buddha by redman


 
I am sure that at one time some people could not imagine that the Bee Gees would not get any airtime or that K.C. and the Sunshine Band would not get any airtime and even some may have not thought it possible that the day would come that The Village People would not get any airtime. 

But where are they now? Well a couple of the Bee Gees are in the ground. K.C. lives about 40 or 45 minutes from me down in Cary N.C. in a nice but not really large or fancy house, nothing any nicer than mine, and if you drive past on the weekends in the summer you might very well catch him out mowing his own lawn. You might not recognize him now because he looks like Elvis in his later years; hes ballooned up a good bit and I dont think hes just bulking up for the next Olympics. 

As for The Village People, well I think you can find then at the YMCA these days. 

The Bee Gees album E.S.P sold over 3 million copies. They sold over 220 million records and singles worldwide and how much airtime do they get today? You have to know at one time people had to believe their music would never die. But it did. 

While not in the same class or category as the Bee Gees when it comes to success The Village People sold over 85 million albums and singles. Someone had to at one time believe their music would live on, other than in just gay bars, considering how many albums and singles they sold. But it didn't. 

K. C. and the Sunshine Bands first album wasnt a big hit and only sold 11 million copies worldwide but their next one went triple platinum. With sales like that the sound had to be considered to be hot and in and cool and something that would last. But it didnt, did it? 

Where do you think the saying deader than disco came from? Well one day the new saying among those to young to remember disco may be deader than rap.


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## Ganjatopolis (Feb 13, 2009)

God forbid they get our fluids.... How did this thread get so off topic? In fact, don't answer that, start talking about music.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 13, 2009)

Anyone ever hear of maceo parker? he's got a great jazz cd out.... he used to play with Ray Charles and James Brown....he's a sax man.....and man can he blow that horn. To boot he's backed up by a 9 piece horn section playing very very tight.


out.


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## tusseltussel (Feb 13, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> Anyone ever hear of maceo parker? he's got a great jazz cd out.... he used to play with Ray Charles and James Brown....he's a sax man.....and man can he blow that horn. To boot he's backed up by a 9 piece horn section playing very very tight.
> 
> 
> out.


 got maceo on an old cd called broklyn funk essentials great stuff


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## CrackerJax (Feb 13, 2009)

hey Tussel (waves)!

hey, if you like that cd....this is a double with one side a tribute to ray charles...and maceo sings fantastic in it...and the second cd is called advanced funk....it's got a 17:30 rendition of james brown's 'pass the peas"....all of this is recorded live as well....alot of energy.

Worth a listen.


out.


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## newbie45 (Feb 13, 2009)

im a huge fan of slightly stoopid but g-love and jack johnson do a song together called rodeo clowns that is really good


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## tusseltussel (Feb 13, 2009)

newbie45 said:


> im a huge fan of slightly stoopid but g-love and jack johnson do a song together called rodeo clowns that is really good


maybe 10 years ago g love lived above me in the city


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## newbie45 (Feb 13, 2009)

tusseltussel said:


> maybe 10 years ago g love lived above me in the city


nice did you ever get to meet him


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## Brick Top (Feb 13, 2009)

Many years ago I lived two towns away from Muddy Waters. I never had a chance to meet him but a few of my friends did. They said almost any time of day you would go there he and his pals would be sitting at the kitchen table playing poker and drinking and getting high. He lived in a simple small home in an average suburb and was just the guy next door. There was nothing flashy about him. They said he was really cool and I always wanted to get a chance to meet him but something always came up and I couldn&#8217;t go and then he died. I missed my chance.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 13, 2009)

I met Spiro Agnew once...  That guy could ROCK!!! and his HAIR!!! 


out.


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## Brick Top (Feb 13, 2009)

CrackerJax said:


> I met Spiro Agnew once...  That guy could ROCK!!! and his HAIR!!!
> 
> 
> out.


 
Something always told me he was a real party commando.


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## CrackerJax (Feb 13, 2009)

Yah, he was actually the fun one of that group.... 


out.


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## tusseltussel (Feb 14, 2009)

newbie45 said:


> nice did you ever get to meet him


yea i met him (garret) plenty of times he is a douche bag, but i guess he is getting paid for his music not his personality, my buddy mike playd keyboards with him way back


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## UKcyrus (Feb 14, 2009)

I listen to insane clown posse do i qualify?


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## newbie45 (Feb 14, 2009)

that sucks at least he makes good music


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## CrackerJax (Feb 14, 2009)

For any of you warren Zevon fans, go to Archive.org 

They just released nearly every extant recording of him live in concert, totaling 89 shows (some 1,137 songs) between 1976 and 2001. the downloads are free and sanctioned by his estate.


That's a pretty sweet deal.


out.


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## Ganjatopolis (Feb 17, 2009)

UKcyrus said:


> I listen to insane clown posse do i qualify?


 For a second, I thought you where serious, lol.


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## Ganjatopolis (Feb 17, 2009)

I found a new dude today that sounds awesome, If noone has heard of Butch Walker, go check him out. Bad ass fella right there.


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## Slopy Joe (Feb 19, 2009)

I listen to both Hip Hop and Rock. When I say hip hop I don't mean the stuff that is on the radio. I gave up on the radio a long time ago. I listen to rappers from the 80's, 90's, and some underground rappers. The rappers from those times are nothing like the ones that are popular now. Artists like Common, A Tribe Called Quest, and The Roots have influences from Jazz, Blues, and Soul all over their music, and their lyrics are poetic and about interesting things. I also do listen to some more "hardcore" rappers like Wu-Tang Clan, Kool G Rap, Immortal Technique and many many more. Anyways the point I'm trying to make with this is that just because the popular form of hip hop is really bad, that doesn't mean that all forms of it aren't good music. That's as ridiculous as saying that rock in general sucks because you dislike Fallout Boy or some other lame band. I also really enjoy what people refer to as Classic Rock. Bands like Led Zeppelin, Queen, The Doors, Deep Purple, Pink Floyd, The Eagles, Bob Dylan, Blue Oyster Cult and many more. I do my best to not limit my taste in music; so I also listen to Jazz, Blues, Soul, Progressive, Metal, and stuff in my native language, Spanish. I think that real musical effort is what makes up good music.


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## fdd2blk (Feb 19, 2009)

[youtube]UFwf7gRiLYM[/youtube]


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## Ganjatopolis (Feb 19, 2009)

Cool shit fdd... Here's a Butch song I found called Bethamphetamine, not my favorite but still a good song:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMDMMfrDUBI


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## aknight3 (Feb 19, 2009)

Ganjatopolis said:


> I know that everyone has their own taste in music, and I'm gonna try not to offend anyone, but does anyone hear listen to good music anymore? I mean, the music that our lifestyle was started by, not rap and hip hop and whatnot. I can listen to rap when I'm at parties but only as a backdrop, not as music I would listen to in my spare time. What happened to bands like Simon and Garfunkel with their awesome vocals and guitar riffs, The Grateful Dead (even though we don't have a Jerry G.), Bob Dylan, etc. There are a couple new bands I ran across recently that I like, but I just can't stand today's angry metal (I had enough of it in the early 90's) or rap music because smoking pot is supposed to make you mellow, not angry about your bitches and hoes. Anyone else get me? Why can't anyone today enjoy The Allman Brothers, CCR, The Doors, Country Joe and the Fish, Pete Seeger, or Van Morrison. I have found some new guys showing promise though, Devendra Banhart and yesterday I heard this Ed Harcourt guy on the radio that sounded pretty good. Am I just lost in a culture that expands too quickly to keep up with, or do I have a killer taste in music? Well, thats just my little rant.


 


i agree 100 percent bro, rip jerry ''when he played the breeze would listen in, before going its way again''. anyway i hate rap and the grundge music and emo shit thats going on today, anyone can be an artist now though, get used to it bro it only gets worse from here


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## Ganjatopolis (Feb 19, 2009)

aknight3 said:


> i agree 100 percent bro, rip jerry ''when he played the breeze would listen in, before going its way again''. anyway i hate rap and the grundge music and emo shit thats going on today, anyone can be an artist now though, get used to it bro it only gets worse from here


 There are always bands like String Cheese. Around Ohio there's a band called Ekoostik Hookah that sounds pretty good, too.


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## aknight3 (Feb 20, 2009)

ive heard of ekoostik hookah, they are okay, try listening to tea leaf green, railroad earth, catch a dead show theyre back on tour if u can, i already got tickets for 5 shows, i like string cheese man but they arent even doingn ew stuff anymore, im waiting for phish's new album


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## fdd2blk (Feb 20, 2009)

[youtube]vMhCLs-zUaw[/youtube]


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## robert 14617 (Feb 20, 2009)

......................................


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## robert 14617 (Feb 20, 2009)

how do you get the u tube screen to come up like that FDD?


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## fdd2blk (Feb 20, 2009)

robert 14617 said:


> how do you get the u tube screen to come up like that FDD?


i'm fdd damnit, i can do anything. 

[youtube]HJ9y4jzwXaA[/youtube]




i do it like this, .................


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## robert 14617 (Feb 20, 2009)

.............


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## fdd2blk (Feb 20, 2009)

[youtube]OUrwa3TMSwE[/youtube]


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## robert 14617 (Feb 20, 2009)

i highlighted on the side bar where they show similar vids copy and past the little+ sign in the middle disappears when i pasted
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRYDetbwegs


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## hom36rown (Feb 20, 2009)

I prefer fake music I guess


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## Brick Top (Feb 20, 2009)

What can be called mainstream music, that which appeals to the largest percentage of the masses at any one time, is normally something that is generational. My parents and many others of their generation went wild for music like The Andrews Sisters and their "Beat Me Daddy, Eight To the Bar" sound. They would get on the dance floor and really cut a rug when "The Boogie Woogie Bugle Boy" (of Company B) was played. They would sure sing along with Benny Goodman and his band when they played "Pennsylvania 6-5000_"_ and the band and Benny would stop playing for a moment and sing/shout Pennsylvania 6-5000. That was hot stuff, that was the ticket back then.

I grew up loving Black Sabbath and Deep Purple and Led Zeppelin and others. 

Few styles or sounds of music have endured for as long as rock and roll has. That is in part because many performers began very young and achieved fame rather young while most musicians of the past were a good bit older when fame hit them so they did not perform for as long and that did not keep their style or sound of music alive for as many people. 

Back then you did not have bands made up of five 15 to 17-year old girls touring the world selling out large arenas like The Runaways did. Most of them went on to be nothing but one still can pack the seats and that is Joan Jett and she still does at least one Runaways song in most of her acts, that being "Cherry Bomb." So roughly 32-years after she became a Runaway Joan Jett is still playing her old work along with newer work and that introduced it to more generations than the older musicians ever did because of their ages when they first hit it big. That keeps the sound, the style alive. 

Look at The Rolling Stones and for how many decades they have been performing. I always have to laugh when I watch the movie "Almost Famous" because in one scene a manager sent by the record company to handle the band the movie is mostly about, Stillwater, he tells them that they have to make all the cash then can now and says something like, if you think that Mick Jagger will still be out there trying to be a rock star at 50 you are sadly mistaken. That makes me laugh since Mick will turn 66 this year and he and the rest of the Stones are still packing them in when they play. 

I have been to so many concerts like Black Sabbath and Jethro Tull and Lynyrd Skynyrd and Procol Harum and others where parents have taken their children and when leaving the concerts have heard the kids talk and heard them say how fantastic the band or bands were and how they loved it and wanted to by their CD&#8217;s. Sounds or styles like that have been passed down from one generation to another in a way that other music hasn&#8217;t been. 

There are always offshoots of certain types of music like bluegrass being a more elaborate and stylistic form of country music. There are also phases where something is in vogue for a short or fairly short period of time like disco and punk and the second British invasion of the very late 70&#8217;s and early 80&#8217;s with bands like Bow Wow Wow and Adam and the Ants that when the Ants left and picked up Annabella Lwin and became Bow Wow Wow Adam and the Ants died and Stuart Leslie Goddard, Adam, became Adam Ant. There was Billy Idol and Bananarama and the one hit wonders Dexy&#8217;s Midnight Runners and there was The Clash and Nina and Spandau Ballet and many others. But where are most of them today? The same place K.C. and the Sunshine Band are and where all the punk rock bands are. Their style or sound was short lived. If any of them toured today they couldn&#8217;t pack arenas like B. B. King could and he&#8217;s been performing for over four decades now. 

There will almost always be at least some small following for any style of music in any era but only the best of the best hangs on and survives the test of time and retains a large or at least respectable sized following. 

The Beatles had sold over one billion records and tapes by 1985 from just their primary label, EMI, so that dos not count the later Apple Records sales and of course nothing since 1985. In just the last several years there have been roughly 120 million sales of Beatles CD&#8217;s in the U.S. alone. Name me one single rap or hip hop singer/group that will ever get close to half that number of sales and that decades after they have stopped performing their music will still be selling like The Beatles music does.

I do not mean that to say that rap and hip hop stink because music like foods and many others things all depends on an individuals taste. I just used the comparison to draw attention to how quality lives on and on and on and that is it likely that in some number of years rap and hip hop will be like disco and punk rock and the second British invasion and likely be more of a passed phase then an ongoing style of music that lives on and on and on. 

Actually there is no "real music," there is only music and depending on its quality and how broad of an appeal it has will be what either keeps it alive or lets it die out over time.


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## hom36rown (Feb 20, 2009)

Brick Top said:


> The Beatles had sold over one billion records and tapes by 1985 from just their primary label, EMI, so that dos not count the later Apple Records sales and of course nothing since 1985. In just the last several years there have been roughly 120 million sales of Beatles CD&#8217;s in the U.S. alone. Name me one single rap or hip hop singer/group that will ever get close to half that number of sales and that decades after they have stopped performing their music will still be selling like The Beatles music does.


2 pac has sold hundred of millions of cds. IT would probably be in the billions if the still sold single like the beatless. Not to mention illegal downloading. He still makes ten of millions every year over 10 years after his death


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## SpruceZeus (Feb 20, 2009)

Real music nowadays eh?
Well right off the bat, gov't mule,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4s4hW-oGZ0
the derek trucks band 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2pZp4oBECV4
and breakestra come to mind.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sePe0nhX5BE
Also check out five horse johnson, they have a bit of a clutch feeling to them.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qWFQRZCEr2E
and the new meanies!!! 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Az5fr5lSZXE

And a million other bands!


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## Brick Top (Feb 20, 2009)

hom36rown said:


> *2 pac has sold hundred of millions of cds.* IT would probably be in the billions if the still sold single like the beatless. Not to mention illegal downloading. He still makes ten of millions every year over 10 years after his death


 
Like so many things when you research them online you can find very different information. 

*In an article from Hip Hop Press dated May 16th 2007 it says that 2Pacs record sales at that time had exceeded 67 million copies worldwide.* 

Now I know that information is close to being two years old but I tend to doubt that his sales have skyrocketed from something just over 67 million to hundreds of millions. 

Maybe that has happened but I do tend to doubt it. 

I read on a few sites where people, not people or sites that are in the industry or industry related, stated higher sales figures, one person claimed them to be as high as one billion copies sold, but myself I have to believe the figures coming from some industry related site or publication would most likely be more accurate. 

Even if he has sold say 200 million instead of the just over 67 million copies the article says he sold by 2007 that is what, 20% of what The Beatles sold from just EMI sales by 1985 and that does not count Apple Record sales or any sales since 1985. 

As for your point about singles being sold in the past you have to consider price as in cost in each era and also factor in things like CD clubs that exist today where you can get your first 10 cds for a PENNY and how many 2Pac sales may have been one or more of the CDs that only cost a PENNY. 

The average cost of a 45RPM in the 60s was only 29 cents but adjusted for inflation that comes to $1.66 per 45. That is still cheap but again when you factor in how many sales fall under the one PENNY CD club sales each $1.66 would buy a whole lot of CDs. 

Of course some Beatles sales would have fallen in to that one PENNY category too but using the total sales figures from any credible source The Beatles music in any form dwarfs that of 2Pacs. He has a damn long way to go to catch up and that will be difficult if not impossible unless sales of The Beatles music totally stops since they are still outselling him today. 

To use a comparison of sales between the two in just the last several years The Beatles songs have sold over 120 million copies in the U.S. alone and according to the 2007 article from Hop Hop Press 2Pacs sales totaled just over 67 million. That means in this era of rap and hip hope The Beatles have sold roughly 1.79 copies per every single copy 2Pac has sold. Actually more since the 120 million Beatles sales was just in the last several years and the 2Pac sales were total sales as of May 2007 which of course means all sales he had while alive and all sales he had had since he died, total sales. 

The Beatles were formed in 1960 but didnt really hit it big until their music was released in the U.S. in 1963 and they broke up in 1969 so they were together while big for 6-years. 2Pac first hit it big in 1992 and he died in 1996 so he was big for 4-years, 2-years shot of the period of time The Beatles were big. That is not a really large difference in length of time but the difference in total sales between the two is massive even if using total sales figures that are higher than what Hip Hop Press credited his sales as being as of 2007.


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## hom36rown (Feb 20, 2009)

haha, never believe wiki answers


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## meanmrmustard (Feb 21, 2009)

I feel the same most days. But fear not, you are in good company.


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## meanmrmustard (Feb 21, 2009)

hom36rown said:


> haha, never believe wiki answers


...and I'll second that


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## Gimix (Feb 23, 2009)

Ganjatopolis said:


> I know that everyone has their own taste in music, and I'm gonna try not to offend anyone, but does anyone hear listen to good music anymore? I mean, the music that our lifestyle was started by, not rap and hip hop and whatnot. I can listen to rap when I'm at parties but only as a backdrop, not as music I would listen to in my spare time. What happened to bands like Simon and Garfunkel with their awesome vocals and guitar riffs, The Grateful Dead (even though we don't have a Jerry G.), Bob Dylan, etc. There are a couple new bands I ran across recently that I like, but I just can't stand today's angry metal (I had enough of it in the early 90's) or rap music because smoking pot is supposed to make you mellow, not angry about your bitches and hoes. Anyone else get me? Why can't anyone today enjoy The Allman Brothers, CCR, The Doors, Country Joe and the Fish, Pete Seeger, or Van Morrison. I have found some new guys showing promise though, Devendra Banhart and yesterday I heard this Ed Harcourt guy on the radio that sounded pretty good. Am I just lost in a culture that expands too quickly to keep up with, or do I have a killer taste in music? Well, thats just my little rant.


YES YES!! and Derek Trucks is the answer


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## KQ10 (Feb 28, 2009)

for any rap lovers, a great CD to blaze to is Walk On Water - by J-Clash. hes a new up and comer on some AND1 mixtapes, freestyle tapes and has a few music videos you can youtube. Dude speaks about REAL LIFE issues, growin up on his own, trouble in streets but not wanting to follow the lives of his friends as jailbirds or hustlers, also addresses world issues like Bush, Obama, the War, Poverty, Police, so on and so forth. My description does not doe justice for the kids music. He brings Fire to the mic....check it out.


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## Herbal Overdoser (Feb 28, 2009)

Ganjatopolis said:


> I mean, the music that our lifestyle was started by, not rap and hip hop and whatnot.


Not to offend but...If you knew anything about hip hop, you'd know that it is extremely influenced by people who share "our lifestyle". In the words of Raekwon "Real reefer heads'll know the meanin of hittin glass"

So next time you decide to put off all rap/hip hop because you're sick of hearing lil wayne ramble about sugar candies(lollipop), think about how "real" rappers hold it down.


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## CrackerJax (Mar 1, 2009)

I thought Rap was an extension of Gillies?


out.


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## dannyking (Mar 4, 2009)

[youtube]HcOZ6xFxJqg[/youtube]


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