# What's the worst strain and breeder you've dealt with?



## puffntuff (Jan 14, 2013)

What strain was it? What breeder? Why do they suck?


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## Samwell Seed Well (Jan 14, 2013)

never have i made a choice in seeds i havent enjoyed


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## smoke and coke (Jan 14, 2013)

i had a pack of 10 reg. barney's farm red diesel and none of them germinated. i like barney's blue cheese and still have 2 beans left. but because of the whole pack duds, i am a hater of barney.

i should have notified the tude as soon as i opened the pack because they looked bad. they need to at least look viable to be kept as a souvenir.


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## Upstate2626 (Jan 14, 2013)

delta 9 labs- they suck! none germed. Second would be TH Seeds, the BUKU sucked ass!


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## puffntuff (Jan 14, 2013)

The only strain I grew out that I didn't care for was DNA's shark breath it was bitchy with the nutes and took forever to bloom. I finally got pissed after 84 days and chopped her.


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## puffntuff (Jan 14, 2013)

Heard a lot of complaints about th seeds too. Wonder if they ever fixed it or they still sucking the D


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## smellzlikeskunkyum (Jan 14, 2013)

Ive had a hard time with both Greenhouse and Barney's which goes to show that the cup awards are a joke for the most part.

Hard to choose which was the worst... 

GHS Bubba kush: certainly not the same as pre98. molds VERY easy. zero "kush" in it, other than landrace. weak potency.

GHS Super Lemon Haze: Looked beautiful, grew ok. Took forever to flower, and tasted like crap. zero potency too. wtf??

Barney's Vanilla Kush: Waste of time... grew very nice in veg. had a strong lavender smell, unusual. tiny tiny buds, hardly even smoke-able. 

the funny thing is these were all grown out next to perfectly fine plants. same conditions and all.

Ive also smoked a ton of barney's strains that i didnt grow myself, and they are almost never good. violator, vanilla, red diesel, tangerine d, liberty haze, etc...

only had one keeper from barney's ever: Crimea Blue.

Hard to say if any of the strains i tried were really GHS ones... kings kush sucks. and grape ape is awesome by itself, so i know its not that part that sucked.


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## racerboy71 (Jan 14, 2013)

puffntuff said:


> Heard a lot of complaints about th seeds too. Wonder if they ever fixed it or they still sucking the D


 i've growm th seeds mk ultra, and that shit is way beyond dank.. it's the only thing i have run by them, but i was impressed as were others..

the worst luck i had with any breeder has been alphakronik.. i got a 10 pack of the bubba loves and white diamonds, and got none of the bl's to germ... gave away the white diamonds with a warning they might not germ, and i think he said he got zero out of his pack too...

i was a bit of an ass with jay from alpha, i'll take my part in that, but i've never had that kind of problems with anyone's gear before..


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## smellzlikeskunkyum (Jan 14, 2013)

after reading thru alot of info online and even talking in person it seems Cali Con, Barney's, and Greenhouse all seem to have MAJOR issues. which is rediculous because they are all up high times' butt when it comes to awards. 

seems as tho ak-47 has been about the most deserving award winning strain as of lately. i find very few experienced growers complain about Ak-47 or serious seeds. except for the prices...


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## ChesusRice (Jan 14, 2013)

I heard Attitude had a promo and gave away a bunch of Dinafem 2nd grade haze autos that either didnt germ or didnt auto


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## racerboy71 (Jan 14, 2013)

smellzlikeskunkyum said:


> Ive had a hard time with both Greenhouse and Barney's which goes to show that the cup awards are a joke for the most part.
> 
> Hard to choose which was the worst...
> 
> ...


 i've actually heard that slh is a pretty good strain from a few people, not sure if it's pheno specific and the rest blow or watt, but i'd not take that chance honestly..


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## racerboy71 (Jan 14, 2013)

ChesusRice said:


> I heard Attitude had a promo and gave away a bunch of Dinafem 2nd grade haze autos that either didnt germ or didnt auto


 imo, i think breeders will often send in overstock for freebies that aren't in grade a shape.. they maybe premy, or cracked, or w/e a breeder thinks isn't worth charging money for but will surely give them away for free.. 
not sure how true it is, but i have a good feeling it holds some truth to it.


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## smoke and coke (Jan 14, 2013)

ChesusRice said:


> I heard Attitude had a promo and gave away a bunch of Dinafem 2nd grade haze autos that either didnt germ or didnt auto



dinafem was another i wasnt happy with. all 3 were freebies and grew fine but i wasnt satified with the quality and flavor overal. all 3 diff. strains.

most of the freebies i have grown have been good. i think some breeders are smart and give away decent genetics to get people to buy a pack. problem is getting a pack like the 1 freebie you grew and liked lol.

my jan. order came with 3 dna fems and 3 reserva privada fems for free. i think that alone was worth the money i spent.


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## puffntuff (Jan 14, 2013)

I usually give my freebies to my buddy who has a lil grow. He pulls an oz or so off of them and is pretty happy so fuck it.


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## jessica d (Jan 14, 2013)

cali cons Original Sour Diesel sucked for me. The breeder is younger then Mr.Nice parent stock


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## ChesusRice (Jan 14, 2013)

racerboy71 said:


> imo, i think breeders will often send in overstock for freebies that aren't in grade a shape.. they maybe premy, or cracked, or w/e a breeder thinks isn't worth charging money for but will surely give them away for free..
> not sure how true it is, but i have a good feeling it holds some truth to it.


These things were pure crap. And another member on this site had the same experience same promo

Maybe that is what they meant by "2nd grade"


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## kgp (Jan 14, 2013)

DR greenthumbs iranian g13 was pure ass. So what if it gave me huge buds, huge buds of crap. Worst plant I ever grew.


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## racerboy71 (Jan 14, 2013)

kgp said:


> DR greenthumbs iranian g13 was pure ass. So what if it gave me huge buds, huge buds of crap. Worst plant I ever grew.


 really? i've heard of a few people who have grown it and this is the first i've heard of someone not liking it..


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## racerboy71 (Jan 14, 2013)

ChesusRice said:


> These things were pure crap. And another member on this site had the same experience same promo
> 
> Maybe that is what they meant by "2nd grade"


 yeah, that's exactly what is meant by second class cheesus.. that's why i lol'ed when i seen one promo awhile ago when they were giving away those seeds.


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## ChesusRice (Jan 14, 2013)

racerboy71 said:


> yeah, that's exactly what is meant by second class cheesus.. that's why i lol'ed when i seen one promo awhile ago when they were giving away those seeds.


Well at the time no one here or on the internet could explain what "2nd grade" meant


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## puffntuff (Jan 14, 2013)

I've never grown Cali conn. from what I hear its hit or miss with them. Breeders read these threads and should answer and deal with problems people are having.


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## ChesusRice (Jan 14, 2013)

ChesusRice said:


> Well at the time no one here or on the internet could explain what "2nd grade" meant


https://www.rollitup.org/newbie-central/455605-what-second-grade-seeds.html


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## puffntuff (Jan 14, 2013)

Dinafems 2nds promo had us all laughing in our usual thread!! Think of 2nds of seeds like you would clothes. Obviously there is something flawed with them or they would be 1sts.


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## ChesusRice (Jan 14, 2013)

puffntuff said:


> Dinafems 2nds promo had us all laughing in our usual thread!! Think of 2nds of seeds like you would clothes. Obviously there is something flawed with them or they would be 1sts.


Hopeful idiot ended up being disappointed


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## kgp (Jan 14, 2013)

racerboy71 said:


> really? i've heard of a few people who have grown it and this is the first i've heard of someone not liking it..


Thats odd, because every other review I have read has been negative too. I did his chem and it was killer, but i did 6 ig13 and didnt have 1 that I would consider keeping.


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## puffntuff (Jan 14, 2013)

It happens cheesus. Same thing with dr greenthumb. I hear both good and bad things about his beans.


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## ryels1983 (Jan 14, 2013)

dna genetics cataract kusk....bought fem and all but one were strait mails,not even hermi just males.so i got ripped off and im mad cuz this is like the 5th dna grow and its been getting worse and worse.matrain mean green hermi too.


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## Kaleidoscope Mind (Jan 15, 2013)

I had VERY bad issues with Nirvana Bubblicious Autoflowering seeds. While all 5 germinated, 2 of them completely stopped growing after 1 week and remained 1 inch tall throughout the grow, producing absolutely nothing. The other 3 got no taller then 5 inches (I actually measured this) and produced, altogether, 7 grams of mediocre smoke. The freebie I got with the order was the only thing worthwhile about the whole experience. I emailed the company to let them know and got a polite and professional variation of "Sorry about your luck, kiddo, but thanks for your business."


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## althor (Jan 15, 2013)

ryels1983 said:


> dna genetics cataract kusk....bought fem and all but one were strait mails,not even hermi just males.so i got ripped off and im mad cuz this is like the 5th dna grow and its been getting worse and worse.matrain mean green hermi too.


 I have CK ceeds from years ago that is bad ass. It is great bud. 

I didnt even know CK came in regular ceeds.


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## brimck325 (Jan 15, 2013)

jc 2 was 1/2 full blown herms at 2-3 weeks, other
females that weren't full blown, spit out viable pollen just before chop. what do you think the (so called)breeder said? sorry hazey, but it is what it is...peace


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## puffntuff (Jan 15, 2013)

I think part of the problem is the so called breeders are rushing there unproven beans out on the market early to try and cash in on the flavor if the month.


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## althor (Jan 15, 2013)

Tangerine Dream from Barney's Farm was the worst plant I have grown.
The yield was pretty good, but everything else about the plant sucked.


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## Samwell Seed Well (Jan 15, 2013)

puffntuff said:


> I think part of the problem is the so called breeders are rushing there unproven beans out on the market early to try and cash in on the flavor if the month.


yup or they steal genetics from other breeders and make the original owners projects with em


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## racerboy71 (Jan 15, 2013)

Samwell Seed Well said:


> yup or they steal genetics from other breeders and make the original owners projects with em


 i don't really have a problem with people using other breeders gear, it's a plant imo, no one really owns it if you ask me.. there's not one breeder out there that doesn't use someone else's genetics, unless of course they're working with straight land race lines, but how many do that? lil to none?
but i do have a problem with rushing shit out that's not worked and tested, or at least tell me it's not worked and tested that way if i feel like rolling the dice at least i'll know up front to keep an eye on them..


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## racerboy71 (Jan 15, 2013)

and don't charge me $150 or so for ten beans of untested gear, that's just craziness imo..


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## BigBuddahCheese (Jan 15, 2013)

Barney Farms.. every genetic I tried from them either failed to germ, or germ and look like Corky from life goes on. Only to have troubles and fail some what... Never an issue with any other breeder or strain.. just ones from Barney. They were all purchased through the Tude but all my others are too.


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## Samwell Seed Well (Jan 15, 2013)

some breeder create . . . . . some cuts are no longer avaialble and have been kept and taken care of for decades . . . . idk, if people/breeders tke these and use them without permission its the same as any other theft(and im talkin g about theft from the breeder either in lies or straight up stealing it

if not worse as it is a specific attack on the profession of the breeder who worked to create vs copy

genetics is not a blanket statement, a f7 Jack H is way different then f3 and what males and what lines were used to stabilize or breeder vigor into a plant, every plant with a similar genetic stor4y is not the same imho and the work our breeders do deserves to be respected . . .. . its breeders that steal others work that say its genetics not your baby


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## dirtnap411 (Jan 15, 2013)

Barney's, I tried Top Dawg and Crimea Blue, none sprouted, they were crap.


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## wheelt01 (Jan 15, 2013)

Th seeds BUKU was the worst strain I ever tried. The vegetative growth was the slowest I have ever seen. Flowering was just as bad. The end result was just awful.


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## smoke and coke (Jan 15, 2013)

ryels1983 said:


> dna genetics cataract kusk....bought fem and all but one were strait mails,not even hermi just males.so i got ripped off and im mad cuz this is like the 5th dna grow and its been getting worse and worse.matrain mean green hermi too.



ive grown 3 of the cataract kush and i love it. i have 2 more beans left for next grow. like 99% of dna and reserva privada strains are fem only now, i almost want to get a male, but i hear you. i had a male from a pack of nirvana ak47 fems and i was mad as hell. i did not use the male because i am not a huge fan of nirvana's genetics. most of what i have grown of nirvana has been ok and i take it into account that you get what you pay for.


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## dankydonky (Jan 15, 2013)

hahaha the worst of the worse seems to be buku kush from what i've red everywhere..it's seems to be one of the most fails in canna history,always red epic shitty reports of it..THS you won this competition!


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## puffntuff (Jan 15, 2013)

Barney's is pretty high on the list as well


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## rocknratm (Jan 15, 2013)

seedism- diesel. crap, midgrade like bud, I did stress it some, but still, it was terrible.


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## RedMan420 (Jan 15, 2013)

ryels1983 said:


> dna genetics cataract kusk....bought fem and all but one were strait mails,not even hermi just males.so i got ripped off and im mad cuz this is like the 5th dna grow and its been getting worse and worse.matrain mean green hermi too.


I have grown a couple packs of cataract kush and it was dank, knock you out smoke , and never found a male.... So I would blame the Seedbank you got them from not DNA.


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## RedMan420 (Jan 15, 2013)

Arjan haze #1 from greenhouse seeds shit flowered for ever and the smoke was not worth the wait , and Pineapple Chunk from Barney's Farm shit had no flavor and shit wasn't potent at all.


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## Samwell Seed Well (Jan 15, 2013)

i no a guy who knows a rep or breeder from DNA, its kinda fuzzy, but the guy i know always has the fire genetics before they come out or at least did 5-6 years ago, and i see a lot of DNA stuff at "the thumb" and its all fire, great experienced growers though


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## OGEvilgenius (Jan 15, 2013)

Dutch Passion Think Different was largely a pile of crap. Didn't herm or anything. Just quite unstable and all but one phenotype was low quality smoke. The one that wasn't, was only decent. Grew out over 20 of em outdoors last summer. Yields are good I guess for an autoflower. Good luck getting someone to buy it. I have jars of it just sitting collecting dust because I'll never smoke it and no one will ever buy it.


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## Mrs. Rare Dankness (Jan 15, 2013)

Are you serious???? I sometimes just eat those. Nice snack.. Why would any breeder put that 
quality out there?


racerboy71 said:


> imo, i think breeders will often send in overstock for freebies that aren't in grade a shape.. they maybe premy, or cracked, or w/e a breeder thinks isn't worth charging money for but will surely give them away for free..
> not sure how true it is, but i have a good feeling it holds some truth to it.


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## smoke and coke (Jan 15, 2013)

Mrs. Rare Dankness said:


> Are you serious???? I sometimes just eat those. Nice snack.. Why would any breeder put that
> quality out there?



may i have some of what your eating please?


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## Kite High (Jan 15, 2013)

Nirvana...period

Have had great outcomes with Barneys' although I must admit it has been a couple of years since I ran them so may be as of late...LSD was potent as fuck and Utopia haze was an awesome clear high


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## nikk2051 (Jan 15, 2013)

Bomb seed's THC BOMB had giant buds, strong sour smell but the taste wasn't there


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## shaymuny (Jan 15, 2013)

i started growing the buku from th seeds and it was a mutant dud... olny grew about 6 inches and stopped while everything else around it flurished... including there sage that was some fire so as far as breeders cant say TH seeds is trash but there Buku sure is straight poop from my experience


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## dankydonky (Jan 16, 2013)

OGEvilgenius said:


> Dutch Passion Think Different was largely a pile of crap. Didn't herm or anything. Just quite unstable and all but one phenotype was low quality smoke. The one that wasn't, was only decent. Grew out over 20 of em outdoors last summer. Yields are good I guess for an autoflower. Good luck getting someone to buy it. I have jars of it just sitting collecting dust because I'll never smoke it and no one will ever buy it.


man..youcan turn it in some dry sift,mubblehash or shatter ftw


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## the bent botanist (Jan 16, 2013)

bubba76 Emerald Triangle. I'm almost certain the seeds were labelled or packaged wrong. was straight sativa. wont complain about the smoke, but it was the opposite then advertised.. hardly seemed like the offspring of ''2 indica legends''


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## ink the world (Jan 16, 2013)

Good friend that's a talented grower just had a problem w/ Sensi Seeds.

He bought the G13xHashplant after growing it out a few years back. The pack he got was mislabeled, a mistake that Sensi owned up to. His beans ended up being midgrade at best and not up to snuff for patients.

Sensi won't replace his beans because he got them @ Attitude, and Attitude won't replace them because it's not their fault. I won't buy gear from Sensi now. If you're considering buying their stock be warned they had a labeling issue and you might not get what you pay for.


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## ink the world (Jan 16, 2013)

Just got a message from my buddy.

He talked w/ Ben Dronkers and Ben is correcting my friends issue.


Big ups to Ben and Sensi for doing the right thing.


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## Randm (Jan 16, 2013)

RedMan420 said:


> Arjan haze #1 from greenhouse seeds shit flowered for ever and the smoke was not worth the wait , and Pineapple Chunk from Barney's Farm shit had no flavor and shit wasn't potent at all.


I'll second this one, I tried it outdoors last year and it was a ten foot plant without one decent keeper bud on it. Mid size buds with absolutely no trichs on them, couldn't even make hash with the crap. Pure junk.


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## trichome 1 (Jan 16, 2013)

ive just ordered greenhouse seeds white rhino,exodus cheese and super bud,along with a few others i hope the greenhouse ones do ok as white rhino is my favourite strain.


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## bigv1976 (Jan 16, 2013)

Greenhouse Seeds Kalashnikova was by far the worst genetics I have seen so far. 3/10 Germ rate and my biggest plant yielded 1 1/4 of b grade weed. I used to stick up for Greenhouse but I wouldn't waste another penny on them now. There is superior genetics out there for slightly more money.


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## peacenikchick (Jan 17, 2013)

ghs pretty much shit the bed for me: great white shark fem, pure male not herm, male. kings kush, wouldnt germ, big bang, el nino, white rhino, grew, like crap, kalashnikova and ladyburn, super crap! never again! all alongside g13 labs, sweet, moc, nirvana, dinafem, next gen, dna, soma, which ALL put greenhouse to shame, by far, like i was embarassed for ghs


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## Rising Moon (Jan 17, 2013)

Some sort of dirty connection between high times and greenhouse seeds...

Like how Kalashnikova got a 2 page centerfold in the Dec. 2012 "top 10 strains of 2012". 
Everything I have read about this plant is crap. How could it possibly be one of the best strains...
this is the kind of bullshit marketing that keeps bad companies in buisness. Shame on high times.


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## hazey grapes (Jan 17, 2013)

fucking vancouver island seedbank burmese bought from kindseed! i spend over $70 fucking dollars on that shit and got NOTHING but aborts that wouldn't even pop and a few mutants that died after vomiting twisted 1st leafsets. i found out after the fact that kindseed is sketchy, so it might have been on them. they were the only source for that strain at the time. i always wanted it as a compact, lemony and trippy pure sativa

i've seen a bunch of rants against KC brains for similar 0% grows.


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## teoborg (Jan 18, 2013)

Worst strains : Super Silver Haze, Super Lemon Haze and Auto Mazar
Worst breeders (?) : GreenHouseSeeds and Dutch Passion.


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## lahadaextranjera (Jan 18, 2013)

I don't like Dutch Passion either. Greenhouse are not essentially a breeding company but a merely a marketing house. I've not had problems with their seeds but of course there are better breeders. GH Seeds are cheaper than clones though. Serious seeds and Soma (who im meeting next month at Spannabis) know their stuff. I love the Dutch Co's on the whole.


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## OGEvilgenius (Jan 18, 2013)

dankydonky said:


> man..youcan turn it in some dry sift,mubblehash or shatter ftw


Yeah, I have a bag of dry sift from it. I'll eventually turn the rest, but I don't have time for now. Maybe it would work better in edibles. It's in a freezer right now. The sift is lower quality too. It's just got a bad profile. It's not something I like and I doubt I ever would. It also smells/tastes like shit largely. 

The one pheno that was decent smelled good. Pure bubblegum. The rest of them smelt fucked up and not appealing. You can't sell this stuff in any way shape or form in the market I am in. Maybe medibles like I said. I'm a horrible cook though.


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## zer0ed (Jan 18, 2013)

you guys are scaring me. lol

sounds like even even big breeders, are as about as hit and miss as bagseed.

even worse, the first packs i ordered, while doing my reading and re-search were 

GHS- Super Lemon Haze
Barney's - Vanilla Kush
Barney's - Utopia Haze
Reserva P. - O. G. Kush 

I based my early order almost solely on Cup Wins. and now i think i may have wasted my money. Did i fuck up?

it gets real confusing when people say "Genetics! Genetics! Genetics!" 
But even the "Top" so called breeders, are shit.

so where is the line between the shitty top breeders, and the no name cheap seeds, or even the guys in the middle like TGA have bad things said about them.
i'm starting to have a hard time finding that line.

so where is the good genetics. . . . . really?


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## Kite High (Jan 18, 2013)

zer0ed said:


> you guys are scaring me. lolsounds like even even big breeders, are as about as hit and miss as bagseed.even worse, the first packs i ordered, while doing my reading and re-search were GHS- Super Lemon HazeBarney's - Vanilla KushBarney's - Utopia HazeReserva P. - O. G. Kush I based my early order almost solely on Cup Wins. and now i think i may have wasted my money. Did i fuck up?it gets real confusing when people say "Genetics! Genetics! Genetics!" But even the "Top" so called breeders, are shit.so where is the line between the shitty top breeders, and the no name cheap seeds, or even the guys in the middle like TGA have bad things said about them.i'm starting to have a hard time finding that line.so where is the good genetics. . . . . really?


Utopia Haze was really good smoke. Clear and inspirational. I recommend female seeds c99; Positronics whatever flavor you like as excellent genetics; Ace Seeds; Cannabiogen; Paradise Seeds,World of Seeds;Serious Seeds; Dinafem; Sensi Seeds Hope it helps


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## Samwell Seed Well (Jan 18, 2013)

zer0ed said:


> you guys are scaring me. lol
> 
> sounds like even even big breeders, are as about as hit and miss as bagseed.
> 
> ...


every breeder you listed there is not at all top or even considered top of anything other than the fake as shit pile

please dont confuse proclaimed professionalism with the real breeders who work and stabilize lines and let the genetics and frost do the talking

*Reserva* is decent and i do see there strains around and some are nice that OG sucks though i have heard, but i may be thinking of the OG 18


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## Rising Moon (Jan 18, 2013)

Bodhi, Top Dawg, Tom Hill, Sannies, Gage Green are all legit breeders, and don't need any marketing ploys to sell seeds.

Also Reserva privada can be good, Soma is good. 

Even Dinafem can be good. My friend has an amazing critical jack. And moby dick is world famous.


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## trichome 1 (Jan 18, 2013)

i got my seeds from attitude gh white rhino,super bud,exodus cheese,g13 pineapple express,advanced seeds bio diesel mass(auto) and freebie mango by blimburn seeds,im gonna grow them using 6oow mh veg then switch to hps after about 6 weeks in 5gallon pots using coco,i was hoping to get 2oz aplant and an oz with the auto,after what ive read i worried i wont get an oz a plant and the smoke sounds like crap too,id prefer quality over quantity any day, with the cost of equipment elec etc i hope it to be worth it,and what if i veg for say 8 weeks grow them really big then flower them surely the yield would be a lot better,also i can top the plants,and i was planning to top each plant twice,but ive been reading that every plant wether topped or not will produce the same bud as its predetermined in the genetics,is this ture? thanks.


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## racerboy71 (Jan 18, 2013)

that last part about topping and untopping is definitely not true...


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## hellraizer30 (Jan 18, 2013)

Nothing against kos but deep chump has hit the alltime worst im my book right now!


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## racerboy71 (Jan 18, 2013)

hellraizer30 said:


> Nothing against kos but deep chump has hit the alltime worst im my book right now!


 you ever run any of their other gear hr? have you tried talking to the rev or greenman 420 and see what they say yet? i've wanted a few things from them but now not so sure..


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## hellraizer30 (Jan 18, 2013)

racerboy71 said:


> you ever run any of their other gear hr? have you tried talking to the rev or greenman 420 and see what they say yet? i've wanted a few things from them but now not so sure..


Not yet! Been stewing on it! 
Never run there gear, but i
have all there gear lol and thats
not the issue. I know they got fire
sh99! Deep chunk, deep phase are
dynamite but i didnt get close to lucky 
on this go! So dont take this as all there
gear sucks cause i have seen deep chunk
that was stellar!


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## racerboy71 (Jan 18, 2013)

hellraizer30 said:


> Not yet! Been stewing on it!
> Never run there gear, but i
> have all there gear lol and thats
> not the issue. I know they got fire
> ...


 that sucks, i was interested in their metal haze and a few others as well..


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## hellraizer30 (Jan 18, 2013)

racerboy71 said:


> that sucks, i was interested in their metal haze and a few others as well..


Like i said racer dont let just me sway yah from it!


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## OGEvilgenius (Jan 18, 2013)

zer0ed said:


> you guys are scaring me. lol
> 
> sounds like even even big breeders, are as about as hit and miss as bagseed.
> 
> ...


Sannie has plenty of great genetics. 

PeakseedsBC.com has fire for dirt cheap. *High*ly recommend their Sweet Skunk, Kushberry and NL and those are the only ones I've popped so far. Sweet Skunk being my favorite. Potent sativa. Bit of a creeper. 2 girls, one very very good the other outstanding. 1 girl for the Kushberry and a buddy of mine who's run more Kush clones than you can imagine would love a cut. 

The NL were the least potent but it had a really nice full body enjoyable and happy buzz. Relaxing. And they were strong enough to get me stoned despite being the weakest. My tolerance is very very high. Had 4 of them and they were all pretty similar and all were similarly good. 

Sannie - tonnes of great things have been written. His Sugar Punch (out of stock) is some of the most potent weed I have ever had. Killing Fields some of the best daytime I've ever had. Herijuana was nice pain relief. Extrema a nice all around smoke with dank smelling buds. However it is hermie prone, although I did not have any issues with them. Some strains are better for more advanced gardeners as they have bad tendencies. It's the price you pay for the best.

Peakseeds Blueberry is supposed to be incredible and I believe it after smoking his Kushberry which was blueberry dominant.

I got a couple nice phenotypes of MNS Black Widow as well. Currently running again. MNS is more expensive though and IMO it's not quite up to the same level as the Sugar Punch/Sweet Skunk and based on my luck you have to do a bit more hunting although my BW10 was super frosted and potent - it just didn't yield well (because of it's location relative light) so I don't have enough to say for sure, I'll know more after the second run.


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## puntagordared (Jan 22, 2013)

Sannies backs up his beans. I had an issue with one order, notified him and received free replacement even though it was probaly my fault that two of the five seeds failed. I used to deal only with the tude but they didn't stand behind the product they sold. I'm sticking with Sannie.


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## calicat (Jan 22, 2013)

For me I would say the worst breeder I have come across was several years back KC Brains. I believe there was a time they were considered reputable. But at the time when I grew their Cristal Limit that is probably when they were sliding in quality exponentially. The regular beans looked immature predominately. The ones that were mature I had to place nicks on them or I know they would not of germinated. The ones that germinated which were only 3 in a period of 4 days. Throughout the grow the plants were finicky which threw me off because previous cycle I ran Nirvana's Chrystal. They share the same genetics of white widow and northern lights only difference is the Cristal Limit had in it their secret KC 606 in it. The name they chose for that strain was right though but could of changed the arrangement of it to limited crystal because there was a lack of it. The taste was bland and the yield was abysmal. Maybe they are better now. I wont ever know cause I will skip them if given a choice.


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## Xrangex (Jan 22, 2013)

Barney's farms "dr. Grinspoon" looks pretty awful to me


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## joe blow greenthumb (Jan 22, 2013)

Xrangex said:


> Barney's farms "dr. Grinspoon" looks pretty awful to me


It does look rough but the quality is supposed to be thru the roof.


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## slim83 (Jan 22, 2013)

I grew some space Jill from tga that just got all stretchy and lanky and just produced hay


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## canna_420 (Jan 22, 2013)

Croppicanna freebies from seaofseeds.

Their all crap the finished product is totaly WANK.

Also found Nirvana an hit n miss company (well about 6 years ago they were good, but now they subcontract)

I even ad a few bad seeds from the god of breeding Shantibaba. G13skunk i found mildish but heavy yields and a waste of time was CBD crews Z6.

I noticed Racer mentioned Alpha.... I hope my eisbier goes ok....


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## canna_420 (Jan 22, 2013)

joe blow greenthumb said:


> It does look rough but the quality is supposed to be thru the roof.


theirs a few collectives in UK that as it every cpl mounths, its not bad yielding on a SCROG. Never tried any but seen tones up n running


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## peacenikchick (Jan 22, 2013)

imo ghs are poop......the ww was kinda ok


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## peacenikchick (Jan 22, 2013)

OGEvilgenius said:


> Sannie has plenty of great genetics.
> 
> PeakseedsBC.com has fire for dirt cheap. *High*ly recommend their Sweet Skunk, Kushberry and NL and those are the only ones I've popped so far. Sweet Skunk being my favorite. Potent sativa. Bit of a creeper. 2 girls, one very very good the other outstanding. 1 girl for the Kushberry and a buddy of mine who's run more Kush clones than you can imagine would love a cut.
> 
> ...


peakseedsbc is always cool with shipping? ever have any problems with packages getting to you?


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## OGEvilgenius (Jan 22, 2013)

peacenikchick said:


> peakseedsbc is always cool with shipping? ever have any problems with packages getting to you?


They are top notch.


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## ProfessorPotSnob (Jan 22, 2013)

Everything Dutch that I grew really sucked .. Enough said


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## hotrodharley (Jan 22, 2013)

I got a deal from Sweet Seedss - 6 seeds of 3 strains, all, autos, all supposedly proven. 100% germination but within a week one strain (Speed Devil) was dead, 1 seedling of Fast Bud was dead but both Big Devils were alive. 1 BD into 5 gallon DWC, 1 into dirt. My God what jokes. Both were runts and neither got over 10" tall. The Fast Bud? It looks like parsley on the top with the weirdest variegation I have ever seen in a pot plant. I will try to get a pic posted. Limbs branching off limbs that branch off limbs.


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## Kite High (Jan 22, 2013)

hotrodharley said:


> I got a deal from Sweet Seedss - 6 seeds of 3 strains, all, autos, all supposedly proven. 100% germination but within a week one strain (Speed Devil) was dead, 1 seedling of Fast Bud was dead but both Big Devils were alive. 1 BD into 5 gallon DWC, 1 into dirt. My God what jokes. Both were runts and neither got over 10" tall. The Fast Bud? It looks like parsley on the top with the weirdest variegation I have ever seen in a pot plant. I will try to get a pic posted. *Limbs branching off limbs that branch off limbs*.


Wow...please do post a pic I would love to see that...its a new one on me

ps-being meaning to say I love your sig


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## Kite High (Jan 22, 2013)

canna_420 said:


> Croppicanna freebies from seaofseeds.
> 
> Their all crap the finished product is totaly WANK.
> 
> ...


Z7 went well for me
http://library.constantcontact.com/download/get/file/1102675987015-259/NM_Z74_11_16_12.pdf

But I did not like the effect...much too stony for me so donated it to some indigent patients...yield was decent as well just not my thing. Figured it wouldn't be my type of buzz but really wanted to see the genetics effect on cbd and yep it is definitely there


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## doniawon (Jan 22, 2013)

super lemon haze was a wonderful plant in my experience. 

grew decently large but was frosty and tasty.. very stoney.


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## Kite High (Jan 22, 2013)

joe blow greenthumb said:


> It does look rough but the quality is supposed to be thru the roof.


Its is quite a superb high...clear clean and no stone...poor yield though...will run it and also cross something to it...was thinking maybe Positronics Claustrum or c99 x's Grinspoon would prove interesting


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## sworth (Jan 22, 2013)

Anything from "Doggies Nuts"...the prices!! wtf?

(An easier way to prove one's stupidity/gullability is to just burn money! lol!)


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## donmagicjuan (Jan 22, 2013)

d nuts is the worst weed i have ever even seen ever hardly recognizable as actual weed plants


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## Kite High (Jan 22, 2013)

donmagicjuan said:


> d nuts is the worst weed i have ever even seen ever hardly recognizable as actual weed plants


doggies nuts? Well those prices should keep one away to begin with


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## sworth (Jan 22, 2013)

My eyes have yet to be soiled by such "herbage"


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## thoumayest (Jan 22, 2013)

Ch9 Seeds Commercial

Worst strain I have ever dealt with or smoked period. It was so bad I actually saved a sample lol. The plant was a complete B. She would start to develop the prospect of massive buds but refused to dense out. She took up a massive portion of the garden like a F'ing light whore just to yield ...ditch weed (if that). I would have traded zip for a zip of down town Mex brown for it happily.


Yea I'm a little bitter lol. No more Ch9 for me...ever.


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## skuba (Jan 22, 2013)

Homie grew a room with a bunch of different GHS shit, the Church, White Rhino, Great White Shark, and Lemon Skunk. It was all super leafy, with little to no trichs, and hardly any smell. The lemon skunk came out ok, but everyone that smoked any of those GHS strains was pissed.


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## hazey grapes (Jan 23, 2013)

reserva privada is a sister brand to DNA i think and DNA kicks soooo much ass!!!!!! all three strains i tried from them stomped everything i've bought since 1987 and took a shit on it! sweet haze is probably a little watered down compared to the real deal, but it takes just 9 weeks and is trippier and fruitier than most generic hazes, their lemon skunk has a better buzz and flavor than skunk #1 and a cool golden glow look that only adds to it's quality and even stony but euphoric mid sour cream which smokes much like skunk #1, blueberry and masterkush etc. (not my favorite buzz mind you) has a delicious flavor that takes no prisoners! it the only indica (as in stoner bud) i have any real respect for so far as it's not a KO stone and the flavor is too yummy. i would have gotten the january reserva privada newsletter gear if only it weren't all skunky and stony stuff as i'd exprect the quality to match in anything they make.

TGA subcool has a lot of loyal fans who love almost every strain they put out including me as their jack's cleaner 2 has a nicelt balanced euphoric, trippy touchy feely buzz in a 9 week strain. there are a couple haters who don't like f1 hybrids and demand stabilized gear, but you lose hybrid vigor with that route.

you'll find few people that hate on sannies' gear either and see lots of love for it from the majority. that's why their jack f7 is at the top of my shopping list. if TGA lived up to the hype so nicely, i'd expect their stuff to too.

if no one mentioned TH seeds yet, they're respected, jordan of the islands is underrated, joey weed had a nice C99 if nothing else, serious seeds' gear is legendary, mr nice has few haters, DJ shorts always gets props, and i know i'm forgetting a bunch of other breeders that put love into their gear. mandala kicks much ass in the bargain basement end of the spectrum and gage green, as mentioned, gets respect for his gear as well as world of seeds, ace, and holy smokes for all making rare landrace gear that isn't watered down available.

you just need to do your homework to find the good shit and avoid the schwag. dinafem, short stuff, lowryder, & next generation are all considered good too.


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## Kite High (Jan 23, 2013)

Cannabiogenmdestroyer is delish as well as Positronics

hg...check out destroyer ^^and Cannalope Haze by DNA

Killing Fields is on deck for the near future


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## HeartlandHank (Jan 23, 2013)

Romulan - Federation Seed Co.. They weren't horrible or anything... but they were the worst I have dealt with. Powdery mildew prone, yield and quality were nothing special.
Critical Mass - Mr Nice.. planted 8 seeds, all fell to pythium.... planted 8 more, all fell to pythium. Another pack of a different strain was grown right along with them and did just fine. pythium prone.


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## HeartlandHank (Jan 23, 2013)

racerboy71 said:


> that sucks, i was interested in their metal haze and a few others as well..


I am interested in the metal haze as well. It was my planned next purchase. But, I ended up going with a Neville's Haze x SSH from Beanhoarder instead.

I think Hazey Grapes grew the Metal Haze.


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## hazey grapes (Jan 23, 2013)

nope, never grown metal haze, but i've talked about it a few times. i THOUGHT it was dr atomic and got confused as the cannabible author really like doc atomic's NL5 haze a lot, but that's mostly only available from sketchy bans, but i still trust hemp depot where i got all of my joey weed gear from. i wish i remembered where i read that metal haze gets it's name from being grown under halides which DJ shorts and jorge cervantes would agree is the best light to use if you're after quality.

the "haziest" gear i've popped so far is fussy hermie bitch sativa seeds' full moon highland thai which i'm far from considering in the short term until i have head stash, but did get a very authentic delicious tutti fruity flavor out of the hermie microbuds when i cut that down and holy smokes' malawi gold which co-operates much more and at least in early flowering is way less stony. i'm going to put that up against HQS haze x skunk, sweet haze & jack's cleaner 2 and maybe WoS NL5 columbian if i can get my last bean to co-operate, to re-organize my top 5 while waiting for 8 miles high to return.

never tried metal haze, but i'd like to. wherever i read about it, was POSITIVE it was in cannabible, it was sibling to another NL5 haze that sounds less interesting to me as it's purer.

two haze equivalents that i've seen raves for are ace panama and golden tiger. i'd go for oldtimer'shaze and gage green's columbian gold though myself before those.

nope... never sampled metal haze, but did make a mental note on it years ago. i'm always keeping my ear open for rare suggestions of better strains, especially at the more practical hybrid end of the spectrum like the faves in my signature.


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## JJ05 (Jan 23, 2013)

ChesusRice said:


> I heard Attitude had a promo and gave away a bunch of Dinafem 2nd grade haze autos that either didnt germ or didnt auto


Which autos were they giving away? I got a white widow auto from dinafem during a promo.


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## haulinbass (Jan 23, 2013)

worst strain: greenhouse kalashnikova(got them when first released, dumb ass $35 decision) all five plants hermied, producing big ugly seeded buds.
most dissapointing: dinafem industrial plant( also prone to hermie if too many limps are touched in early flower)
most suprising: royal queen special queen, but only one female out of five was special and the biggest yeilder i have ever grown in a 3 gallon bag. the other four hermied at day 59 of flower(i take all plants till caylxs buldge up)
best strain: green seeds Sour dieselx OG kush, got for free from gta seedbank but are no longer available. not a huge yeilder but the strongest high ive come across and with gorgeous violet hues in the buds. big plants, slngle stemmed sog and just normal plants all turned out great just needs allot of support during flower. I selfed the best female i had and am currently testing those out(and have given away about 50 beans and 200 clones locally of the first run best female). if they dont turn out well ill be searching again for my headtsash jar.


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## Omgwtfbbq Indicaman (Jan 23, 2013)

super lemon haze, started a few plants, they hermed in early flower, balls, not bananas. immediately culled. didn't even get to smoke the stuff. that was over a year ago, in recent times the worst plant i grew was the mentioned "2nd Grade Haze Auto" that dinefem offered, rediculous... didn't autoflower for 1, 2 they were leafy as fuck and the finished product seemed like it would never finish flowering, smokewise they were what i would call regs, not b grade, f grade.

barneys farm pineapple chunk was another failure, sativa pheno got culled, critical kush was a dud plant, flowered out and couldn't do a think to keep her pleased. little to no resin development. 

of all the tga gear ive grown, deep purple was disappointing overall, ir was the slowest vegging thing ive ever seen, they were uniformly slow, the nirvana blue mystics i had were doubling the nodes dp was putting out, and they aren't even that vigorous.

delicious seeds la diva, grew to 3 inches tall and had 1g bud growing at the top, i grew it in a 1/2 gallon pot and kept it until i couldn't laugh at it anymore. smoked good nonetheless.


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## peacenikchick (Jan 23, 2013)

Rising Moon said:


> Some sort of dirty connection between high times and greenhouse seeds... Like how Kalashnikova got a 2 page centerfold in the Dec. 2012 "top 10 strains of 2012". Everything I have read about this plant is crap. How could it possibly be one of the best strains... this is the kind of bullshit marketing that keeps bad companies in buisness. Shame on high times.


 i dunno man, my kalashnipooop plants looked like nettles,.....or pigeon feathers stuck in dirt, or something else really terribly awful, and i didnt fuck around with them....anything non ghs did great w/same treatment.......i even left kalashn out much longer hoping it might transform into something that actually resembled a pot plant, to no end....imo, nobody should ever grow this strain......sorry arjan, but it is what it is


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## HeartlandHank (Jan 23, 2013)

hazey grapes said:


> nope, never grown metal haze, but i've talked about it a few times. i THOUGHT it was dr atomic and got confused as the cannabible author really like doc atomic's NL5 haze a lot, but that's mostly only available from sketchy bans, but i still trust hemp depot where i got all of my joey weed gear from. i wish i remembered where i read that metal haze gets it's name from being grown under halides which DJ shorts and jorge cervantes would agree is the best light to use if you're after quality.
> 
> the "haziest" gear i've popped so far is fussy hermie bitch sativa seeds' full moon highland thai which i'm far from considering in the short term until i have head stash, but did get a very authentic delicious tutti fruity flavor out of the hermie microbuds when i cut that down and holy smokes' malawi gold which co-operates much more and at least in early flowering is way less stony. i'm going to put that up against HQS haze x skunk, sweet haze & jack's cleaner 2 and maybe WoS NL5 columbian if i can get my last bean to co-operate, to re-organize my top 5 while waiting for 8 miles high to return.
> 
> ...


Ever looked into F13?... probably a little more on the practical end than you want... but something like Malawi x F13... could be good.
Malawi x Sweet Tooth sounds real practical as well... 

I think it was Raceryboy who suggested Iron Cindy (KOS) in a thread months ago.... that looks like an excellent one that I have to get to..

Nevilles Haze x SSH looked practical to me. There are just a couple packs left on HD. I just got mine... I've grown the SSH and some of the plants finish in 8.5-9 weeks. The Neville's Benho works with is a fast one too, still trippy though.. So, I'm thinking this plant could be very good. Hoping to get a 14wk high in 12 wks... basically.

It's like.. no one wants to cross a fast but convincing sativa (c99, f13) to a long flowering one... ?. 
Malawi x Sweet Tooth #3 from Beanhoarder might be one.


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## HeartlandHank (Jan 23, 2013)

Omgwtfbbq Indicaman said:


> of all the tga gear ive grown, deep purple was disappointing overall, ir was the slowest vegging thing ive ever seen, they were uniformly slow, the nirvana blue mystics i had were doubling the nodes dp was putting out, and they aren't even that vigorous.


It sucks to hear more bad about TGA.. He was one I had not made it to yet and had high hopes... A friend of mine just had over half of his Jilly Bean females pollinating the room. Had to throw them out at week 4 of flower. This was after they already did some damage.... I guess one of them was *epic*.

As far as the slow veg... that's the Urkle... I thought about aborting ship before even leaving the dock on a P Urkle cross... It grew like a cactus.


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## ibitegirls (Jan 24, 2013)

hmm, never heard of a report where GHS Super Lemon Haze went hermy before, this is a first lol. GHS is not amazing by an standards, but they do carry few great 
top of the shelf strains, and with that said i would not purchase 90% of their beans.

personally, I have not had any terrible plants from seeds, but i did get XJ-13 clone (jack x g13) that went hermie due to stress or was just prone to hermaphroditism. I'll never buy clones from dispensary, again. the other clone, a white russian, picked up PM right away. needless to say i've grown from seeds since.

oh, and hazey grapes, please stop writing novels every time you make a post. condense that shit


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## OGMan (Jan 27, 2013)

Vancouver Island Seedbank. Ordered a bunch of strains and they were all shit, especially Swet Island Skunk. Said to be an auto and early finisher but some phenos went until October! phenos ALL over the place, finish times ALL over the place, potency medium to low


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## OGMan (Jan 27, 2013)

kgp said:


> DR greenthumbs iranian g13 was pure ass. So what if it gave me huge buds, huge buds of crap. Worst plant I ever grew.


Jeez, I thought Iranian G13 was one of the best outdoor strains I ever grew.


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## hazey grapes (Jan 27, 2013)

i can be pithy when trolls don't piss me off


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## BustinScales510 (Jan 27, 2013)

The worst seeds I ever grew by far were from beanho (beanhoarder). I did a 20 pack each of blockhead x paki chitral kush, haze x deep chunk, and mango x ssh. The blockhead grew extremely slow,very small and stunted looking..wouldnt take nutrients without slowing down even further. Some of the mango x ssh hermed,and the haze x deep chunk was just some low end regs..no frost or odor,potency was weak. That was a few years ago,Ive heard some people having success with his gear so maybe he's gotten better,but my experience was all stress.


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## HeartlandHank (Jan 28, 2013)

The best plant in my garden is from Beanho, picked up a few years ago... Super Silver Haze
I have a hard time imagining anything crossed with Deep Chunk (especially from Beanho) resembling low end regs... crazy. I didn't grow Beanho's Deep Chunk, but the DC I grew was one of the most resinous plants I have seen. 

That's the first negative feedback I've heard on Beanho. 3 packs too... damn.

Really, low end regs? When you say regs... you mean like brick, seeds, brown? 




BustinScales510 said:


> The worst seeds I ever grew by far were from beanho (beanhoarder). I did a 20 pack each of blockhead x paki chitral kush, haze x deep chunk, and mango x ssh. The blockhead grew extremely slow,very small and stunted looking..wouldnt take nutrients without slowing down even further. Some of the mango x ssh hermed,and the haze x deep chunk was just some low end regs..no frost or odor,potency was weak. That was a few years ago,Ive heard some people having success with his gear so maybe he's gotten better,but my experience was all stress.


----------



## BustinScales510 (Jan 28, 2013)

HeartlandHank said:


> The best plant in my garden is from Beanho, picked up a few years ago... Super Silver Haze
> I have a hard time imagining anything crossed with Deep Chunk (especially from Beanho) resembling low end regs... crazy. I didn't grow Beanho's Deep Chunk, but the DC I grew was one of the most resinous plants I have seen.
> 
> That's the first negative feedback I've heard on Beanho. 3 packs too... damn.
> ...


Oh no,not that bad. When I said regs I meant unimpressive mid grade, not shwag like crusty mexican brick weed. It was low potency and not frosty though..very dull with little odor. I had grown deep chunk before which is why I was excited to try that, but they just did not turn out well. There werent any problems with the grow either,my indoor environment was great,good HID lighting and nutrients etc.


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## basementgrower420 (Jan 28, 2013)

have had good experiences with Dinafem , had bad experience with Dinafem. i had good and bad with G13 Labs. ive had bad with all of KC Brains Gear.. i think it was good years ago.. but the new seeds made with diff parents for whatever reason.. isnt good seed. umm.. id say BC Bud Depot bad and good.. Seedsman have had good and bad. Th Seeds.. some good some bad.. there SAGE is SICK SHIT!!. honestly.. it seems like there are good and bad within every seed bank.. or breeder.. the thing is . when u breeder. u have some like mother . some like father.. and some blends in between. it sucks . but thats y u gotta look for IBL. or True Breeding Strains. if u want something that will be like clone in seed form. but other then that. support ur local growers that breed there own seeds.. shit ive gotten seeds from 2 friends that they made the selections for males n females.. and honestly.. have seen better weed from these seeds then most of the seeds ive bought.. 

i just got an order.. and will be popping some seeds very soon. Violator Kush , Skunkage, Mk Ultra, Blue Widow, BlackBerry, OG Kush, BubbleGum, and a few others i cant remember right now.. im hoping to find some keepers. but we shall see. im going to be gettin some clones from a new friend so im hoping the selections are as good as he says.


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## HeartlandHank (Jan 29, 2013)

I'm surprised to see how many people say seeds they purchased were not potent... I can't think of one plant I have had that has not been fairly potent. My only complaints have been susceptibility to fungus/molds. Most were strains that I was already aware that they could have those issues... like Romulan.


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## ibitegirls (Jan 29, 2013)

sanniesshop is killing me right now. ordered on the 3rd Jan. and still nothing. maybe their just super slow to the west coast 

fml


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## Kite High (Jan 30, 2013)

ibitegirls said:


> sanniesshop is killing me right now. ordered on the 3rd Jan. and still nothing. maybe their just super slow to the west coast
> 
> fml


mine have taken a bit as well...but worry not you will get them or he will send again....solid guy he is for sure....


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## drolove (Jan 30, 2013)

nirvana's white widow.
nirvanas reg seeds gave me tons of hermies.
their fems had tons of mutations.
their white widow looked good, gave big buds, BUT they didnt weigh shit and didnt have that great of a taste. WORST munchies ever too...


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## ibitegirls (Jan 30, 2013)

Kite High said:


> mine have taken a bit as well...but worry not you will get them or he will send again....solid guy he is for sure....


;

true. i should wait it out. i wonder why his delivery carriers are so damn slow compared to attitude. tude got me my stuff in about 18 days and it was misrouted to another city and still arrive quicker LOL. needless to say, my location is a disadvantage so i will probably not order very much from sannie.i wish his strains were available through the tude, that would be awesome!!


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## Kite High (Jan 30, 2013)

his come thru the Netherlands is why....but dude his gear is worth it and he is a truly a great dude...and heres a place with great prices and rock solid people too,,,they are on the border on NL and Belgium so it comes from theBelgium post so no "hmmm's" like the NL addy's cause

http://growshopalien.com/onlineshop/contents/en-uk/d40_cannabisseedsseedbank.html


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## billy4479 (Jan 30, 2013)

TGA was the worst seeds I ever got I was really stoked about Pandora's box I guess the had a good add or something she was a very small seedy hermaphrodite all 10 seeds ...The jack 2 or whatever they called it also got a lot of bananas..i grew them right next to my clones that did fine and did not hermie so knew there wasn't light leaks just bad genetics ....T


----------



## wyteberrywidow (Jan 30, 2013)

Well worst strain/cross I've dealt with from a breeder was from a couple but off the top of my head

Ghs arjans ultra haze. Was just weak..big bat cola that took 11 to 12 weeks to flower and was garbage. 
Although I grew some slh and bubbba kush from ghs and those came out better than expected def would run slh again.

Dna connie chong was again weak but that could've been my fault at that time in the grow but kushberry I got from them was good just a couple hermied at seperate times. I got a og kush 18 I'm adding to my grow soon and I want to try some of their new og crosses(I'm a og head lol).


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## hazey grapes (Jan 30, 2013)

*



The worst seeds I ever grew by far were from beanho (beanhoarder). I did a 20 pack each of blockhead x paki chitral kush, haze x deep chunk, and mango x ssh. The blockhead grew extremely slow,very small and stunted looking..wouldnt take nutrients without slowing down even further. Some of the mango x ssh hermed,and the haze x deep chunk was just some low end regs..no frost or odor,potency was weak. That was a few years ago,Ive heard some people having success with his gear so maybe he's gotten better,but my experience was all stress.

Click to expand...

*bummer. i was thinking of trying their trippy cherry super silver chitral. it sounds like what i wastrying to do with malawi gold and buddha's sister, and possibly something good to mix in with those.


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## Bigby (Feb 9, 2013)

Kosher Kush from Reserva Privada - that they are still selling those hermied motherfuckers is criminal!


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## tree king (Feb 9, 2013)

killing fields


----------



## Malevolence (Feb 9, 2013)

puffntuff said:


> The only strain I grew out that I didn't care for was DNA's shark breath it was bitchy with the nutes and took forever to bloom. I finally got pissed after 84 days and chopped her.


haha I was thinking about some shark breath cuz it's the only strain I've seen where I could have lambsbread... I would just prefer to have straight lambsbread.

Kinda sucks TH Seeds has a bad rep in this thread... I got 2 reg MK Ultra and 2 reg Lambo freebies I will be growing at some point. Kinda wonder if Lambo has lambsbread cuz it has jamaican haze and jamaican purple.

I grew some G13 Labs Sour AK that wasn't that great and had low frost and harvested at 11 weeks and it still wasn't ready (I had to move). To be honest, it was probably my setup/skills/light leaks.


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## Bigby (Feb 9, 2013)

Kite High said:


> mine have taken a bit as well...but worry not you will get them or he will send again....solid guy he is for sure....


I'll vouch for him too. Message him and he will make sure you're sorted out.


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## Bigby (Feb 9, 2013)

tree king said:


> killing fields



Worst? Why?

Mine were amazing, great taste, great smell - and trippy as all hell. Equal best I've grown.


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## tree king (Feb 9, 2013)

Bigby said:


> Worst? Why?
> 
> Mine were amazing, great taste, great smell - and trippy as all hell. Equal best I've grown.


ive debated that with too many people on this site already so dont wanna get into it again but the highs weak and the buds are airy


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## sonar (Feb 9, 2013)

I've been pretty lucky when it comes to genetics. It seems like anything I've tried from the low key or little known breeders I have been satisfied with . Kannabia, Homegrown Fantaseeds, Ceres, Emerald Triangle, Magus (part of Serious Seeds now) have all been good to be.

It seems like anything I've grown from the big guys have ben mediocre at best. For example, I grew a single Sensi Super Skunk last year and don't get me wrong, it was a decent plant. No mold, finished early, and wasn't picky with the nutes. But it didn't get very big, had poor branching, and not much in terms of flavor or smell. There was nothing "skunky" about it. The year before I grew out a single Kannabia Special freebie. Now THAT was a skunky plant. Much better yield, finished around the same time, no mold, hardy, low maintenance, and just an all around better plant.

Reserva Privada is another big name breeder I didn't really care for. Last year I grew out a single Sour Kush (Headband) freebie. For starters, RP advertises it as mostly indica, but this plant looked mostly sativa to me. I had nothing but trouble with it. Very picky eater, the bugs loved it, grew weak and lanky, and didn't start flowering until the middle of August. To be fair, it was one of my plants that got ripped last year, so I didn't actually get to try any, but when it got ripped 1st week of October it still had a good 2-3 weeks of flowering left. The Emerald Triangle Lost Coast OG plant I had 6 feet away totaly blew it out of the water.

I realize only growing single seeds doesn't give much of a sample size to properly judge a strain. However, over the past few years I've grown out around 30 or 40 plants from seed. The overall trend seems to favor the obscure "no-name" breeders. I have pics of every strain I've grown if anyone is interested.


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## Malevolence (Feb 9, 2013)

I'm going to run a fem ghs slh next grow despite this thread. I've smoked 2 different bags of slh. The first one tasted really good and got me and my girl in a happy fuck off day time mood. The second bag was the most flavorful fucking shit I have ever smoked, but potency and high seemed average.

It's my girl's favorite strain though and I like it too. Seen lots of good slh grows on RIU, hope I don't get pheno fucked.


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## puffdatchronic (Feb 9, 2013)

barneys farm.0 customer service 2/7 germ rate .


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## puffdatchronic (Feb 9, 2013)

I fucking hate breeders who dont respond to emails.This includes barneys farm ,thseeds and dna genetics for me.Barneys farm also has shit germ rates for me 2 out of 7, So i'm done with them.Can't say i am done with dna though ,they do have amazing stuff


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## hazey grapes (Feb 9, 2013)

Kite High said:


> Cannabiogenmdestroyer is delish as well as Positronics hg...check out destroyer ^^and Cannalope Haze by DNA, Killing Fields is on deck for the near future


 i'll smoke what you're growing! i ALMOST bought a destroyer bean, but, like so many great smoking sativa dominants like killing fields, it has a violent name i don't like, so i got another ace seeds NL5 columbian to test instead, though i've had terrible luck with that strain so far and will give it one last try. i swear some fucker sabotages every fucking sativa i try to grow! i had mutants with both malawi gold and columbian recently when the malawi, at least, was 100% just last year, and got 0% viability out of both jack's cleaner 2 x cindy apollo & a CH9 jack cross despite good viability from almost everything else i've crossed.

i wish killing fields and jack the ripper weren't celebrations of murder in name. those are 2 of the trippiest indoor strains according to reports, but i have sannie's jack f7 to test, more cleaner 2 on the way, and some malawi gold left i'm still eager to test.

i do want to try cannalope haze, only it's a little "expensive" for my tastes. it's reasonably priced, but i want to try cheaper gear first. i'll likely get it in the future though as attitude just made my FoaD list after selling me kannabia citrus described as a sativa when it's really a bubblegum chitral, and they don';t feel responsible for baiting and switching on me, so i'll be returning to gypsy and hemp depot probably besides ordering direct from sannies and mandala.

lately i've seen raves for destroyer, but back in '04, someoine was underwhelmed by it, but i'm starting to think that it's all just sativa hate from cash crapping losers like the pussy possee that stalks me here and the martian mean green grower in another forum. they'll do anything they can to keep anyone from going against their greedy flow and undermining the market they think is theirs.

i think when i DO grow columbian gold seriously, it will be gage green's "pure" gold, or his columbian jack cross if he ever releases it. those are my 2 favorite strains in the world so far, but maybe holy smokes' malawi will still deliver the goods.



> *I fucking hate breeders who dont respond to emails.This includes barneys farm ,thseeds and dna genetics for me.*


hmmmm... DNA responded to my request for a teeshirt that's just their logo, but not getting replies does suck. sometimes it takes a while to get replies from breeders though.

i hear you though, customer service should be ANY company's top priority.


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## Kite High (Feb 9, 2013)

hazey grapes said:


> nope, never grown metal haze, but i've talked about it a few times. i THOUGHT it was dr atomic and got confused as the cannabible author really like doc atomic's NL5 haze a lot, but that's mostly only available from sketchy bans, but i still trust hemp depot where i got all of my joey weed gear from. i wish i remembered where i read that metal haze gets it's name from being grown under halides which DJ shorts and jorge cervantes would agree is the best light to use if you're after quality.
> 
> the "haziest" gear i've popped so far is fussy hermie bitch sativa seeds' full moon highland thai which i'm far from considering in the short term until i have head stash, but did get a very authentic delicious tutti fruity flavor out of the hermie microbuds when i cut that down and holy smokes' malawi gold which co-operates much more and at least in early flowering is way less stony. i'm going to put that up against HQS haze x skunk, sweet haze & jack's cleaner 2 and maybe WoS NL5 columbian if i can get my last bean to co-operate, to re-organize my top 5 while waiting for 8 miles high to return.
> 
> ...



Some awesomeness I am about to order I have recently stumbled upon

COLOMBIA MANGOBICHE
*Bank: CannaBioGen**Highly reputed colombian line due its tasty aromas and its long lasting and strong effect, Mangobiche, line of uncertain origins, is one of the few old lines which still survive in the country. Highly branched plants with large colas full of flowers. Mango fruit and spicy aromas. It has a potent effect, cerebral and trippy and bit mellow at the same time, confortable and exciting, which last few hours. A classic among the best colombians classics

Type: sativa
Flowering: 16-24 weeks
Yiedl: medium/high












*



Zamal is an exotic african sativa from La Reunion Island, close to Madagascar, famous for its extreme vigor and legendary psychedelic effect.
An excellent Zamal mother selected for its trippy effect, fast flowering and remarkable sweet carrot and floral fragrances, was pollinated by the powerful Malawi 'killer' mum in order to create Zamaldelica, a new super sativa hybrid of terrific lysergic effect and amazing vigorous growth.
 F1 HYBRIDFEMINIZED - ONLY FEMALE PLANTS100 % SATIVAFLOWERING INDOORS: 11-14 WEEKS*FLOWERING OUTDOORS: END OF OCTOBER / NOVEMBER**YIELD / M2: AVERAGE - HIGH**RESISTANCE AGAINST SPIDER MITES: AVERAGE**RESISTANCE AGAINST MILDEW: AVERAGE - HIGH**RESISTANCE AGAINST BOTRYTIS: VERY HIGH**RESISTANCE AGAINST COLD: AVERAGE*


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## Kite High (Feb 9, 2013)

hazey grapes said:


> i'll smoke what you're growing! i ALMOST bought a destroyer bean, but, like so many great smoking sativa dominants like killing fields, it has a violent name i don't like, so i got another ace seeds NL5 columbian to test instead, though i've had terrible luck with that strain so far and will give it one last try. i swear some fucker sabotages every fucking sativa i try to grow! i had mutants with both malawi gold and columbian recently when the malawi, at least, was 100% just last year, and got 0% viability out of both jack's cleaner 2 x cindy apollo & a CH9 jack cross despite good viability from almost everything else i've crossed.
> 
> i wish killing fields and jack the ripper weren't celebrations of murder in name. those are 2 of the trippiest indoor strains according to reports, but i have sannie's jack f7 to test, more cleaner 2 on the way, and some malawi gold left i'm still eager to test.
> 
> ...


Some more




Golden Tiger is one of the most powerful and interesting sativa hybrids we have developed lately.
It's a straight hybrid derived from the 'killer' Malawi mother and a selected Meo Thai male. Meo Thai is an exceptional highland Thai selected by Cannabiogen.

In this hybrid, we have combined the 2 most potent and resinous landrace sativas we have ever worked with. The result is a plant with a great vegetative strength, remarkable for its overpowering potency and its exceptional floral traits. The flower bunches flare over forming
dense buds with small leaves. The trichomes are big, plentiful and loaded with powerful cannabinoids.
 *PURE SATIVA SEMI STABILIZED HYBRID*FEMINIZED - ONLY FEMALE PLANTS100 % SATIVAFLOWERING INDOORS: 11-14 WEEKS*FLOWERING OUTDOORS: END OF OCTOBER / NOVEMBER**YIELD / M2: HIGH**RESISTANCE AGAINST SPIDER MITES: AVERAGE**RESISTANCE AGAINST MILDEW: AVERAGE**RESISTANCE AGAINST BOTRYTIS: VERY HIGH**RESISTANCE AGAINST COLD: AVERAGE - HIGH*
 





 





After years of hard work and intense selections with sativas from all around the world, we can confirm that Malawi is the most powerful and psychedelic landrace sativa we know. Its dense flowers of enormous trichomes compete with the most powerful indica/sativa and indica hybrids on the market in reference to their size and cannabinoids
concentration.
The potency of their flowers is simply devastating, and it is especially
recommended for experienced smokers that seek extreme sativa effects without renounce to an abundant harvest.
 LANDRACE STRAINFEMINIZED - ONLY FEMALE PLANTS100 % SATIVAFLOWERING INDOORS: 11-14 WEEKS*FLOWERING OUTDOORS: END OF OCTOBER / NOVEMBER**YIELD / M2: HIGH**RESISTANCE AGAINST SPIDER MITES: AVERAGE**RESISTANCE AGAINST MILDEW: HIGH**RESISTANCE AGAINST BOTRYTIS: VERY HIGH**RESISTANCE AGAINST COLD: AVERAGE - HIGH*
 





 



Our Panama combines 3 excellent sativas from Panama. It is one of the most popular, powerful and high yielding sativa in our catalogue.
Very elaborated hybrid of great potency and vegetative vigor. It produces beautiful, large, dense flowers full of trichomes often showing reddish and pinkish shades when flowering. Its aroma and effect are reminiscent of the best red Colombian and Panamanian sativas from the 70&#8217;s.
 *F6 SEMI STABILIZED PURE SATIVA HYBRID*FEMINIZED - ONLY FEMALES100 % SATIVAFLOWERING INDOORS: 9-12 WEEKS*FLOWERING OUTDOORS: 3rd WEEK OF OCTOBER**YIELD / M2: HIGH**RESISTANCE AGAINST SPIDER MITES: AVERAGE - HIGH**RESISTANCE AGAINST MILDEW: AVERAGE**RESISTANCE AGAINST BOTRYTIS: HIGH**RESISTANCE AGAINST COLD: HIGH*
 





 
i read in the new High times that high THCV production ins inherent and unique to African strains. I am going to acquire these reallt soon...this and the others in my previous post...I believe the TRIPPY GRAIL will be in my possession soon..That Panama is very trippy as well


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## HazeHeaven (Feb 9, 2013)

Would have to be Rare Dankness - Ghost Train Haze 1..Not because the smoke was bad..Because I got only 2/10 to germ and those two ended up being males.  Never had problems like that with seeds sprouting. Got nothing for my time, effort, and money.


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## puffdatchronic (Feb 9, 2013)

yeah i don't think i'll be getting one now.. nearly a year later.In fact the more i think about it i might just steer clear of dna to.Female seeds have responded to every email i have sent ,as have paradise seeds ,sensi seeds and greenhouse seeds.


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## Kite High (Feb 9, 2013)

puffdatchronic said:


> yeah i don't think i'll be getting one now.. nearly a year later.In fact the more i think about it i might just steer clear of dna to.Female seeds have responded to every email i have sent ,as have paradise seeds ,sensi seeds and greenhouse seeds.


Dna has good gear... Cannalope Haze...Sensi has fallen a bit on quality but still good...paradise I like and believe their WW best. Female Seeds is awesome in my book.Avoid Greenhouse like the plague...money grubbing marketers not real about genetics...rip off artists that serve $$$ not growers and plants

I had good experience with Barneys but it was a good while ago so maybe things changed


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## Kite High (Feb 9, 2013)

tree king said:


> ive debated that with too many people on this site already so dont wanna get into it again but the highs weak and the buds are airy


You need to check your grow as killing fields produced well and potency was great in many many grows with me and associates... must be the AN you use


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## sonar (Feb 9, 2013)

puffdatchronic said:


> I fucking hate breeders who dont respond to emails.This includes barneys farm ,thseeds and dna genetics for me.Barneys farm also has shit germ rates for me 2 out of 7, So i'm done with them.Can't say i am done with dna though ,they do have amazing stuff


I agree. Don't remember ever emailing Barney's or THSeeds, but DNA/RP responded to me a few days later.


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## tree king (Feb 9, 2013)

Kite High said:


> You need to check your grow as killing fields produced well and potency was great in many many grows with me and associates... must be the AN you use


lol lightweights


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## Kite High (Feb 9, 2013)

tree king said:


> lol lightweights


lol at this then


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## tree king (Feb 9, 2013)

i meant smoke wise i know you do your thing. kf cant even hang with the outdoor in my area no one wants that shit here


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## Kite High (Feb 9, 2013)

tree king said:


> i meant smoke wise i know you do your thing. kf cant even hang with the outdoor in my area no one wants that shit here


Well we got potency I assure you as my lil test report shows here
http://library.constantcontact.com/download/get/file/1102675987015-272/NM_MW7_1_24_12.pdf

I will post the KF results once published


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## tree king (Feb 9, 2013)

do that.....


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## Bigby (Feb 10, 2013)

tree king said:


> ive debated that with too many people on this site already so dont wanna get into it again but the highs weak and the buds are airy


Thanks for replying. I'll agree on the airy buds - I found it really strong and stimulating though, going to run it again for sure.


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## althor (Feb 10, 2013)

Bigby said:


> Thanks for replying. I'll agree on the airy buds - I found it really strong and stimulating though, going to run it again for sure.


 Clearly he screwed his grow up and now hates on Killing Fields. Way, way too many people (including myself) have grown it out and it is plenty potent with a nice stimulating, active high.


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## Becorath (Feb 12, 2013)

I have had poor Germination rates with Nirvana.

Bomb Seeds "Cheese Bomb" I have had many problems with. Real problematic with nutes, It is either deficiency or extreme burn. The is no middle ground with this strain. Cloning is a joke. I am cloning 6 diff strains right now. I have close to 100% success with all but the cheese bomb. It is closer to like 10% rooting on clones. Have only had 1 successful grow with this strain. The smoke was good, and a real sleepy stone. Works great for insomnia, but a pita to grow. stay away unless you want a challenge.




Edit: I am still growing this because I am a glutton for punishment. If you do decide to grow this, I recommend starting VERY weak on nutes and slowly increasing. That's the only way I have been able to grow it.


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## Fruitbat (Feb 12, 2013)

Barney's LSD all turned to mush on germ. The worst was Onyx by Short Stuff. They mushed or ended up weak runts. Total garbage. 

I had some issues w/ Nirvana back when I ordered from them. No germ or mushing on maybe 30%. 

Best has been Sannie and ProfessorP. I think I've only one seed out of 50 + not germ. 

Regarding Killingfields - I live in a med state. If your shit isn't top shelf you can't give it away. Everyone loves the Killingfields both indoor and out. That's been my experience.


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## berrychronic (Feb 17, 2013)

sucks just recieved a bunch of fem strains from Barneys and GHS. Anyone ever worked with Arjans Haze #2 or The Church, Exoudos Cheese? Bomb seeds?


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## Kite High (Feb 17, 2013)

The church hermie prone and potency was mids....AH#2 is a joke...Personally I have had great success with Barney's Farm but it has been a couple of years


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## BleedsGreen (Feb 17, 2013)

Not bashing Barneys because there are some I love and have no problems with Blueberry being one. I have tried the Pineapple chunk now twice in aero and just can't get that shit to grow worth a damn. I will wait on the other 3 seeds until spring to try them outside in soil.


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## ace720 (Feb 17, 2013)

berrychronic said:


> sucks just recieved a bunch of fem strains from Barneys and GHS. Anyone ever worked with Arjans Haze #2 or The Church, Exoudos Cheese? Bomb seeds?


I love bomb seeds 
everything I grow from them came out nice (THC BOMB the shit tho)


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## bigv1976 (Feb 17, 2013)

Judging just from what I am reading here I think there should be a pre-qualification before being allowed to post in a thread like this. I have seen people trashing some of the best strains available in this thread and I am 100% convinced that there is a whole bunch of user error invloved.


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## bigv1976 (Feb 17, 2013)

berrychronic said:


> sucks just recieved a bunch of fem strains from Barneys and GHS. Anyone ever worked with Arjans Haze #2 or The Church, Exoudos Cheese? Bomb seeds?


GHS and BF are by far the 2 worse breeders out there. Many people are fooled by the fact that they win the cup every year. I am fully convinced that there is a direct connection to the 2 richest breeders (mostly due to propaganda) win the cup every year while 21 of the 30 most potent strains available are breed with Chem Dog yet Chem has yet to win a cup.


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## sonar (Feb 17, 2013)

bigv1976 said:


> Judging just from what I am reading here I think there should be a pre-qualification before being allowed to post in a thread like this. I have seen people trashing some of the best strains available in this thread and I am 100% convinced that there is a whole bunch of user error invloved.


Too many are lack of germination complaints. I've NEVER had a seedbank seed not germ. Maybe I'm just really lucky, but I think most non-germ issues are user error.


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## hotrodharley (Feb 17, 2013)

bigv1976 said:


> Judging just from what I am reading here I think there should be a pre-qualification before being allowed to post in a thread like this. I have seen people trashing some of the best strains available in this thread and I am 100% convinced that there is a whole bunch of user error invloved.


You think so? Poor is the carpenter who blames his tools. I know that I have grown for many years and if I try a strain that many rave about and mine turns out crap that I likely ended up with a sorry pheno. Now if it repeatedly happens then I can begin to rule out my part more. Like Barney's LSD. I tried 2 seeds. Both germed quickly. A sneak ferret attack took one out with the other untouched. It grew. And grew. And grews. Sparse as hell, slower than the second coming of Christ to flower, airy ass buds until adios! I yanked that bitch never to grow LSD again. But I can guarantee there are tons of others who have grown it out well and repeatedly. So no trashing Barney's LSD by me, boys.


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## biscuitkid (Feb 17, 2013)

althor said:


> Tangerine Dream from Barney's Farm was the worst plant I have grown.
> The yield was pretty good, but everything else about the plant sucked.


yeah i grew out that strain OUTDOORS worst mistake ever, it wouldnt flower till 12/12 or even less i think, it flowered fast but the end result straight up SCHWAG BUDS, fuck tangerine dream waste of 60 bucks, n the germination rate was shitty also out of 6 3 made it, 2 ended up doing somethen n the other one just stayed lame n wouldnt do shit,ended up pullin it out of the ground n throwin it over the fence


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## blindbaby (Feb 18, 2013)

marijuanaseeds.nl was bad luck for me. they gave me a random pack of mixed seeds, and ALL HERIMIED! the thai x skunk #!. only two out of ten germed. one was a female, and my so called freind, took it home for clones, and allways forgot to bring one back. i never got any. darn was i mad. so i booted the seed place, and my friend.


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## hatchett 214 (Feb 19, 2013)

dont buy anything from barney farm. they used to be a good company but somthing has happened thier in last 2 years and all they sell sucks. tryed tangerine dream 3 times and liberty haze 1 time pure garbage and i am not new to this at all my others greatfull casey, cheese dog,holly grail,apollo 13,and headband are awsome even spectacular.barney farms suck. order from california companies you should do great


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## Randm (Feb 20, 2013)

berrychronic said:


> sucks just recieved a bunch of fem strains from Barneys and GHS. Anyone ever worked with Arjans Haze #2 or The Church, Exoudos Cheese? Bomb seeds?


Arjans Haze # 2 was a complete disaster in my last outdoor grow. 8 ft. 'trees' that produced completely airy useless so called buds. Out of 3 plants all grown outside I think I actually harvested about 2 ounces worth of low grade. All 3 grew over 8 ft. and none produced anything worth a damn.


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## dankydonky (Feb 20, 2013)

Randm said:


> Arjans Haze # 2 was a complete disaster in my last outdoor grow. 8 ft. 'trees' that produced completely airy useless so called buds. Out of 3 plants all grown outside I think I actually harvested about 2 ounces worth of low grade. All 3 grew over 8 ft. and none produced anything worth a damn.


man.-.where are u from? i dunno for sure but i think that AH will take at least 11 weeks to be done,if this is a shitty strain this is another story.. lol


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## thecoolman (Feb 20, 2013)

the bent botanist said:


> bubba76 Emerald Triangle. I'm almost certain the seeds were labelled or packaged wrong. was straight sativa. wont complain about the smoke, but it was the opposite then advertised.. hardly seemed like the offspring of ''2 indica legends''


mine were all almost pure indica


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## thecoolman (Feb 20, 2013)

althor said:


> Clearly he screwed his grow up and now hates on Killing Fields. Way, way too many people (including myself) have grown it out and it is plenty potent with a nice stimulating, active high.


Its only potent to little kids and people that have never had good smoke.. Worst strain I ever grew


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## althor (Feb 21, 2013)

thecoolman said:


> Its only potent to little kids and people that have never had good smoke.. Worst strain I ever grew


 Funny how there are only two people on this entire site that feels this way, where as there are hundreds who say it is good.

You screwed up the grow, get over it.


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## tree king (Feb 21, 2013)

althor said:


> Funny how there are only two people on this entire site that feels this way, where as there are hundreds who say it is good.
> 
> You screwed up the grow, get over it.


you have no idea what the hell your talkin about theres a bunch of people that think that shit sucks.


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## Kite High (Feb 21, 2013)

Mostly cause they like stoned and not high. All a matter of preference and perspective. And simply you don't like it don't grow it. I like it I grow it. To each their own right? The reasoning behind so many strain choices is so you can find what YOU like


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## kgp (Feb 22, 2013)

I grew a couple killing fields, 3 green phenos and one purple. The green ones I really enjoyed. The purple, although very pretty, was lacking what the green one has. I know I can't judge it because I grew one plant, but this is my experience. Much more high than stone. Great smell and taste. I am planning on growing it again.

its the ones who like the og, chem, bubba, sour are the ones who usually bash kf. Believe me or not, I like them all.


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## smoke and coke (Feb 22, 2013)

kgp said:


> its the ones who like the og, chem, bubba, sour are the ones who usually bash kf. Believe me or not, I like them all.



i hope this statement is somewhat true because i wont try the KF now. not that i was planning on it anytime soon anyway, but i would hate to not try something because of reading a false statement. 

i would start a poll or a thread on this but i am too lazy tonight for that.


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## Doobius1 (Feb 22, 2013)

My worst experience was with Next Generation. Had a pack of Grape God zero germ. Talked to Jay directly, sent him my Attitude order proof, he got my addy from me, apologized and never sent shit. Jay Generation = Asshole


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## HalfSackZach (Feb 22, 2013)

*I will never again buy:*

Greenhouse Seed CO
Dutch Passion
THSeeds 

*I will continue to buy:*

TGA Subcool Seeds---- Ive grown almost all of them

Mandala Seeds- I Have only grown there Hashberry. I grew it outside along with a bunch of other and this strain was the highest yielder in my garden.. I had 2 phenos, one that was amazingly huge yielder, and another that didnt yield as high but i liked it better it had a very sharp and pungent smell that translated to an amazing taste. Huge favorite of mine I will definitely try other mandala seeds next order I make. 

CBD Seeds Critical has been a HUGE favorite amongst my friends---- and my friends are california weed snobs 

Dinafem has really blown me away from there freebies! Moby dick is fucking awesome


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## bigskymtnguy (Feb 22, 2013)

DNA's Cole Train has had the WORST germ rate of any variety I've tried in several years, 3 out of 18. Contacted them and got an answer quickly. Unfortunately they would not stand behind the product. At least they replied. Not very good luck with the quality from Barney's -- they just don't have the vigor or potency.

My top 3 --  I've had good experiences with the overall vigor and quality of DinaFem's Blue Widow, Karma Genetics White OG v2, and Jordon of the Islands God Bud (outdoor). Had very good germ rate from TGA and OG Raskal.


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## tree king (Feb 22, 2013)

Doobius1 said:


> My worst experience was with Next Generation. Had a pack of Grape God zero germ. Talked to Jay directly, sent him my Attitude order proof, he got my addy from me, apologized and never sent shit. Jay Generation = Asshole


me too i spent $500 on 50 grapefruit kush seeds and only 3 germed. never a fuckin gain!


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## skunkd0c (Feb 22, 2013)

overall it would have to be seedsman, i have run a fair few of their seeds, many of the plants were total shit
i did find 1 or 2 keepers for a while but it took many seeds, they are cheap for a good reason i guess

paradise seeds, belladonna this was very disappointing i had 4 females 3 of which were very similar looking
very uniform skunk type buds, but all had little to no flavour a medium yield and medium high the most boring strain i have grown in recent years 

peace


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## puffntuff (Feb 22, 2013)

Hopefully these hacks or so called breeders will see this thread and get their heads outta their asses. But prolly not so at least we can keep the uninformed people better protected against crap strains and hack job breeders


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## ataxia (Feb 23, 2013)

shaymuny said:


> i started growing the buku from th seeds and it was a mutant dud... olny grew about 6 inches and stopped while everything else around it flurished... including there sage that was some fire so as far as breeders cant say TH seeds is trash but there Buku sure is straight poop from my experience


if you're going back a year or so ago with all the THseeds freebies.. I too had the same problem with BuKu, sage, and Heavy duty fruity. Something about those beans in that promo were straight shit.

On my shit list....... GHS. i've only tried one strain Lemon Skunk. out of a 5 pack 3 germed and all took a dive for different reasons. I could be the blame but none of my other seedlings went through the same issues... Their Kalishkanova SUUUCKS. i didn't grow it but several grows i've seen came out to be total garbage to put it lightly ....

Last but not least. Barney's LSD. sucked also. Crazy these breeders win cups. Whether their fixed or not.


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## ataxia (Feb 23, 2013)

hellraizer30 said:


> Not yet! Been stewing on it!
> Never run there gear, but i
> have all there gear lol and thats
> not the issue. I know they got fire
> ...


i don't doubt what your feelings are about KOS. But keep in mind, they do recommend all organic soil growing for their beans. I'd imagine you ran in hydro. That's no excuse for shotty genetics. But i'll bet the Rev or Gman will compensate for any bunk gear.


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## rleezx (Feb 23, 2013)

kens gdp was absolute crap...worst beans ive tried in past 4 years


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## Killer Bud (Feb 24, 2013)

The worst strain I ever had by far was the super silver haze I grew out by green house. It was horrible. I thought it was gonna be amazing by everything I read but I was sadly disappointed, it was a heavy producer but it was very very weak, just horrible. This wasn't the only strain that I was disappointed With by green house either, I have had 5 strains and out of the 5, 4 were complete crap. The 1 that i did like was the bubba kush, great strain. Very taste not great producer but very tasty and nice high. The second worst strain was the kaia kush, tasted like rotten meat, very unpleasant tasting. Wasn't totally weak but wasn't potent by any means. I was very disappointed by green house.


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## HazeHeaven (Feb 24, 2013)

Killer Bud said:


> The worst strain I ever had by far was the super silver haze I grew out by green house. It was horrible. I thought it was gonna be amazing by everything I read but I was sadly disappointed, it was a heavy producer but it was very very weak, just horrible. This wasn't the only strain that I was disappointed With by green house either, I have had 5 strains and out of the 5, 4 were complete crap. The 1 that i did like was the bubba kush, great strain. Very taste not great producer but very tasty and nice high. The second worst strain was the kaia kush, tasted like rotten meat, very unpleasant tasting. Wasn't totally weak but wasn't potent by any means. I was very disappointed by green house.


I agree. GH SSH was very weak and for me also very light weight airy buds. ZERO potency. Had the same experience with GH Hawaian Snow. Very weak. Their Super Lemon Haze was quite decent though. Not really my favorite type of buzz but definitely had strong potency, taste, and bud density.


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## puffntuff (Feb 24, 2013)

Greenhouse is taking a beating on this thread! Lol so much for believing in the cup winners huh!!


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## althor (Feb 24, 2013)

puffntuff said:


> Greenhouse is taking a beating on this thread! Lol so much for believing in the cup winners huh!!



Yep, GHS followed by Barney's Farm seem to be the clear cut top 2 winners of this thread.


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## SSHZ (Feb 24, 2013)

kgp said:


> DR greenthumbs iranian g13 was pure ass. So what if it gave me huge buds, huge buds of crap. Worst plant I ever grew.



Well then, you obviously haven't grown out Dr. GreenThumbs "Endless Sky". Large airy buds of hay/straw that needed close to 80 days to kind of finish (this was supposed to be a 45 day strain). Worst plants I ever grew and I've been doing this consistently since the 80's. After some prodding, Doc eventually admitted he lost the original parent mother and was starting over with the strain. It was so bad, I crossed him off my vendor list and have never considered anything by him again!


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## Omgwtfbbq Indicaman (Feb 24, 2013)

Heard alot of good and bad about dr gt, i havent triend anything of his because his prices are a bit high, i like buying bulk without going broke, usually 30-40 seeds per order, sometimes much more if its something like nirvana or rare seeds that go out of stock quick.


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## blindbaby (Feb 24, 2013)

first, your profile pic, makes me wish i were a infant again. now, worst strein and breeder. strein. probably white skunk. weak taste.weak smoke. and grows airy. as for the breeders, ill not say anything, as i have not had many breeders to choose from.


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## blindbaby (Feb 24, 2013)

i just now got done jaring up my two lemon skunks from ghs. i got 1.5 oz off the two. LIMP!! lmao. good smoke. but no yield. the seed plants stretched. the clones from them, did not. so i ended up with two small plants, that had great smell, taste.(based on the seed plants qualityies), but no yield. in retrospect, i have four of my bc god, that are do anytime. im looking at 3 oz each..


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## BleedsGreen (Feb 24, 2013)

althor said:


> Yep, GHS followed by Barney's Farm seem to be the clear cut top 2 winners of this thread.


To be fair Barneys used to be great, but the past few years I think they have slipped. Hard for me to say that as I loved going to Barneys places back in 88- 92 when I was in Germany. I would drive over to Amsterdam at least over other month for a weekend and the cafe's that had Barney produce always got my money.


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## PersonalJesus (Feb 24, 2013)

Great... I got some Barneys Farm G13 Haze going right now... I ran it before and wasn't too impressed but I decided to give it one more chance, maybe I shouldn't of have.
---especially considering the TGA and Gage Green beans I got waiting


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## blindbaby (Feb 24, 2013)

I SEE i am not the only one! i got some from marijuanaseeds.nl and i suffered! i suffered. i have worked with a few since, with really no probs. the latest, and im hoping the best, is sannie, and so far, so good...


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## berrychronic (Feb 25, 2013)

NYPD, MASTER KUSH, THC BOMB, CLUSTER BOMB, EXODOUS CHEESE, SUPER CRITICAL AUTO, BIG BANG AUTO,CRITICAL HOG, PURPLE KUSH AUTO,SUPER AUTOMATIC, ARJANS #2, THE CHURCH, BLUE VENOM,PINEAPPLE CHUNK, G13 HAZE, AUTO AK, AND GIGABUD (ALL FEMINIZED) ANYONE EVER GREW ANY OF THESE STRAINS BEFORE? WISH I COULD FIGURE OUT HOW TO UPLOAD PICS jUST GETTING STARTED. 6K 10 X 15 COCO


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## berrychronic (Feb 25, 2013)

How is that g13 looking? Looks good online. I have 3 of them germn right now. Really hope they all pop


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## Doobius1 (Feb 25, 2013)

berrychronic said:


> NYPD, MASTER KUSH, THC BOMB, CLUSTER BOMB, EXODOUS CHEESE, SUPER CRITICAL AUTO, BIG BANG AUTO,CRITICAL HOG, PURPLE KUSH AUTO,SUPER AUTOMATIC, ARJANS #2, THE CHURCH, BLUE VENOM,PINEAPPLE CHUNK, G13 HAZE, AUTO AK, AND GIGABUD (ALL FEMINIZED) ANYONE EVER GREW ANY OF THESE STRAINS BEFORE? WISH I COULD FIGURE OUT HOW TO UPLOAD PICS jUST GETTING STARTED. 6K 10 X 15 COCO


I wish you could figure out where the caps lock button is


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## baddfish99 (Feb 27, 2013)

Worst seeds ever were the afghan seeds I got from Marijuana seeds NL, 20 seeds no keepers, only two of te plants were smokable, the rest were rope.

First runner up GHS - super silver haze, I got a five pack of femininzed seeds that all sprouted. Four of the five seeds shared a similar phenotype that had no flavor and couldn't ge me high. Its only use was giving you bad breathe. The other pheno looked like an exotic haze had a nice sandlewood flavor and a decent high.

Second runner up, Barneys farm blue cheese. It got me high and smelled good, it was just a mid level quality.


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## sonar (Mar 1, 2013)

SSHZ said:


> Well then, you obviously haven't grown out Dr. GreenThumbs "Endless Sky". Large airy buds of hay/straw that needed close to 80 days to kind of finish (this was supposed to be a 45 day strain). Worst plants I ever grew and I've been doing this consistently since the 80's. After some prodding, Doc eventually admitted he lost the original parent mother and was starting over with the strain. It was so bad, I crossed him off my vendor list and have never considered anything by him again!


What do you guys know about his Iranian Auto? I've been looking at that strain for a few years now. Every year, I put out a few autos and I am usually disappointed. I might give it a try this year. $150 is a lot to drop at one time, even for 10 fem seeds.


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## bigv1976 (Mar 1, 2013)

It is amazing to me that you can have 200 people have amazing grows with a strain and then a guy that doesnt even have a single succesful grow under their belt will completely shit on a company without ever considering that they just dont know how to grow. Lets take Killing Fields for an example. I have seen at least 50 awesome grows of Killing fields including 3 of my own and because YOU cant even get through the germination process or because YOU fuck with your plants til they hermi all of the sudden Killing Fields is bad genetics. Can we get someone shitting on Chem Dog please cuz I havent quite laughed hard enough to piss my pants yet but that will certainly do it.


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## aknight3 (Mar 1, 2013)

i have heard alot of badthings about greenhouse seeds, but In my experience theseeds were always OK, not great, but not bad either, barneys farm sucks i think, tried2 sstrains from barneys, both sucked, couldhave just been me though, IMO i try to NEVER discredit a breeder without a VERY GOOD reason and unless i try at least 3 of the breeders strains, otherwise your just judging on a little bit of the breeders work, everyone has some duds, thats how u find the great strains. just my 2cents


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## tree king (Mar 1, 2013)

bigv1976 said:


> It is amazing to me that you can have 200 people have amazing grows with a strain and then a guy that doesnt even have a single succesful grow under their belt will completely shit on a company without ever considering that they just dont know how to grow. Lets take Killing Fields for an example. I have seen at least 50 awesome grows of Killing fields including 3 of my own and because YOU cant even get through the germination process or because YOU fuck with your plants til they hermi all of the sudden Killing Fields is bad genetics. Can we get someone shitting on Chem Dog please cuz I havent quite laughed hard enough to piss my pants yet but that will certainly do it.


it took me a while to figure it out but one thing you have to realize is most people on this website have no idea what there talkin about so you have to be very careful who you listen to. the quicker you realize that the better off you'l be.


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## SSHZ (Mar 1, 2013)

Because seeds are a living entity, like humans, some turn out well and some don't. When considering a seed purchase, you have to look at generalities first. Then start researching for a specific strain. GENERALLY, seed companies like Sannies, Breeders Choice, Reserva Privada, Dinafem, Paradise and numerous others are fine and if you are a decent grower you'll get good results. Company's like Green House, Dutch Passion, Reeferman, Barney's and numerous others don't seem to care what they bring to the market (hermies, poor sprouting, bad results, etc.) and you'll see MANY more complaints. So, first choose a solid seed company and THEN read everything you can find before deciding on a strain......... but almost every company has 1 or 2 standouts that they build their reputation on.


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## Clankie (Mar 1, 2013)

bigv1976 said:


> It is amazing to me that you can have 200 people have amazing grows with a strain and then a guy that doesnt even have a single succesful grow under their belt will completely shit on a company without ever considering that they just dont know how to grow. Lets take Killing Fields for an example. I have seen at least 50 awesome grows of Killing fields including 3 of my own and because YOU cant even get through the germination process or because YOU fuck with your plants til they hermi all of the sudden Killing Fields is bad genetics. Can we get someone shitting on Chem Dog please cuz I havent quite laughed hard enough to piss my pants yet but that will certainly do it.


all this dude does is troll around bashing killing fields, and pretending to be the world's most awesome grower, that just can't seem to afford a camera. even if he's not full of shit, his whole complaint is "i wanted something at least half indica, but i bought a strain specifically bred fo a soaring sativa high because i'm a mental deficient.' 
or he bought one bag and had too high humidity levels and harvested a bunch of garbage. who gives a shit. everyone who has grown KF and knows what they are doing knows what the deal is. hands down the most popular sativa girl in my stable right now.


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## Jogro (Mar 2, 2013)

bigv1976 said:


> It is amazing to me that you can have 200 people have amazing grows with a strain and then a guy that doesnt even have a single succesful grow under their belt will completely shit on a company without ever considering that they just dont know how to grow.


Welcome to the internet! 



> Can we get someone shitting on Chem Dog please cuz I havent quite laughed hard enough to piss my pants yet but that will certainly do it.


OK. . .its hermie prone.


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## budbro18 (Mar 7, 2013)

I do this with every seed i plan to buy

first i think of a type of seed (white,purp,fruit,diesel)

Then ill go to a seed site and find 20-30 seeds that sound good.

Then group by breeder and check the breeders stats on the plant. (ghs has good grow videos of all their plants)

Then i usually eliminate a few that have too many random strain crosses. i like a solid motherxfather cross. (except for grape god but she was an unplanned gem) hahaha

So after all that i search them internets high and low until i find several grow journals about them. (grape god was so hard to find, so i had to make an in-depth journal)

Then based on how well they grow and the experience of the grower i cut it down to 2-4 strains.

Then ill talk it over with some friends and ask them what they like to smoke and what sounds appealing this time around.

And by then im usually set on what i want.

Also never be afraid to plant freebies because i have gotten some bangin bud outta some free seeds.


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## bigv1976 (Mar 7, 2013)

Jogro said:


> OK. . .its hermie prone.


There it is. I appreciate that dude. I just woke up from a nap that I took because my day was going real shitty and those 4 words just made it all better.


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## Alexander Supertramp (Mar 7, 2013)

Doggies Nuts hands down the most over priced junk on the market.


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## Kite High (Mar 7, 2013)

Alexander Supertramp said:


> Doggies Nuts hands down the most over priced junk on the market.


as proven by our brother cl


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## largebiffta (Mar 7, 2013)

worst strain ive ever grown Tangerine dream.. NEVER AGAIN .......


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## SSHZ (Mar 11, 2013)

sonar said:


> What do you guys know about his Iranian Auto? I've been looking at that strain for a few years now. Every year, I put out a few autos and I am usually disappointed. I might give it a try this year. $150 is a lot to drop at one time, even for 10 fem seeds.


There's a lot more bad about this strain than good, that's for sure. I just read a thread last night by a respected grower on another site and he tore into Dr. Greenthumb regarding this strain. I can't remember the specifics but he said it was terrible and a waste of time.......if I find it, I'll post the link.


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## SSHZ (Mar 11, 2013)

largebiffta said:


> worst strain ive ever grown Tangerine dream.. NEVER AGAIN .......



Never saw 1 positive grow on this strain.........LOL

Another cup winning bust!


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## 650baquet (Mar 12, 2013)

smellzlikeskunkyum said:


> Barney's Vanilla Kush: Waste of time... grew very nice in veg. had a strong lavender smell, unusual. tiny tiny buds, hardly even smoke-able.
> 
> the funny thing is these were all grown out next to perfectly fine plants. same conditions and all.
> 
> ...


I agree...i have not had much experience with purchasing online and having seeds not germ...only one and it was Pineapple Chunk and my first time with germing in a peat pellet, and my last time. Was really looking forward to the PC because i had some in Kona, HI that was awesome to say the least. Back to the Farm...i currently still have VanillyKush...only because i like a challenge, but i'm nearly done with the crap it pulls in flower in the same conditions as my Trainwreck(GreenHouse), Lost Coast OG(Emerald Tri.), and Chocolope(DNA Gen.) which are thriving. I used to have a Tangerine D but it would do the same...plus holy crap took a long time to flower as well as potency wasnt as high as expected; along with weak aroma, flavor, and very very fluffy. All of that combined with stretching pretty bad for my short room made me toss this strain after round 3. VK is on round 6 with potency better and nuggets more dense. Though, nowhere near the results of the LCOG and TW. The Chocolope is about to start flower in round 2, a very dark green plant that for me grows super slow in veg and can easy double size going into flower...idk but one odd thing that isn't happening with the clones that happened with the initial seed is the main top grew so slowly the lowing branches engulfed it (eventually i said screw it and topped it...i planned to anyways). The tops new growth looked kinda plump and fat somewhat twisted/mutated if that makes sense. Had massive fan leaves too.


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## 650baquet (Mar 12, 2013)

SSHZ said:


> Never saw 1 positive grow on this strain.........LOL
> 
> Another cup winning bust!


RIGHT!!!! It was my very first Cup winner grow that left me feeling like a shitty gardener haha...then it was followed by Lost Coast OG and Trainwreck which blew it out of the water. Waist of time and money...


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## sonar (Mar 15, 2013)

SSHZ said:


> There's a lot more bad about this strain than good, that's for sure. I just read a thread last night by a respected grower on another site and he tore into Dr. Greenthumb regarding this strain. I can't remember the specifics but he said it was terrible and a waste of time.......if I find it, I'll post the link.


Please do. I've only read one start to finish grow on RIU regarding this strain by sodalite and he had nothing but great things to say about it. All the photos were very impressive.


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## Hablamos (Mar 24, 2013)

thseeds - Heavy duty fruity order 2x 10 pack 0% germination rate. it's been 6 years I'm still angry


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## althor (Mar 24, 2013)

Hablamos said:


> thseeds - Heavy duty fruity order 2x 10 pack 0% germination rate. it's been 6 years I'm still angry


 My two HDF freebies popped no problems at all, gave them to my best friend. One was male, one was female, grew out big and thick with decent (skunk) potency.


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## OGMan (Apr 4, 2013)

bigv1976 said:


> It is amazing to me that you can have 200 people have amazing grows with a strain and then a guy that doesnt even have a single succesful grow under their belt will completely shit on a company without ever considering that they just dont know how to grow. Lets take Killing Fields for an example. I have seen at least 50 awesome grows of Killing fields including 3 of my own and because YOU cant even get through the germination process or because YOU fuck with your plants til they hermi all of the sudden Killing Fields is bad genetics. Can we get someone shitting on Chem Dog please cuz I havent quite laughed hard enough to piss my pants yet but that will certainly do it.


You're right. Its so typical. That guy above who claims Iranian G13 is crap obviously hasn't grown it because its a super potent outdoor plant and has been around for years now. I had to pre-order mine this year just to be sure I got some. It's so popular the seed company can't keep it in stock


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## brando980 (Apr 4, 2013)

HSO ( humbolt seed organization) Chemdawg. ordered 1 no luck , sent a replacement no luck either. the other 6 strains I ordered from different breeders were successful


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## brando980 (Apr 4, 2013)

hence (commercial) Don't commercial c9 only come in regular not feminized?


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## brando980 (Apr 4, 2013)

bigv1976 said:


> It is amazing to me that you can have 200 people have amazing grows with a strain and then a guy that doesnt even have a single succesful grow under their belt will completely shit on a company without ever considering that they just dont know how to grow. Lets take Killing Fields for an example. I have seen at least 50 awesome grows of Killing fields including 3 of my own and because YOU cant even get through the germination process or because YOU fuck with your plants til they hermi all of the sudden Killing Fields is bad genetics. Can we get someone shitting on Chem Dog please cuz I havent quite laughed hard enough to piss my pants yet but that will certainly do it.


HSO CHEMDAWG? DUDS!!! ordered 1 no luck, replacement no luck. They don't replace replacements. Well maybe ill try Cannaventure Chemdawg infused with garlic next time.


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## jimdandy (Apr 4, 2013)

ghs white rhino was a total waste of time and space. Have not given Arjan a dime since!


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## kushhound187 (Apr 9, 2013)

Ive never boght seeds i didnt like. i will not buy barneys. derry is a total queer. the names and pictures sound great, but ive never had good shit that was a barney strain sweet tooth has bounced around town a couple times, girls like it for its taste, but the high is shit. some of his phenos are suposedly mouth watering. i dont give a fuck what anyone says, somas nyc diesil is mouth watering. it just grows to tall for my space. i have some mandalas satori going now. smell and taste amazing. great high. this thread is primo tho. warns people about all the shit out there. i dont trust bad reports from 1 or 2 growers, who knows if they are stupid, dirty or doing something else to fuck up. but when many say the same thing i start to beleive. however, greenhouse gets mixxed reviews. i bought their gear before ever joining this site, or hearing all thier negative press. with them, ive had great luck. the plants i got are exactly what they sold me. if its not in the breeder pack from them, beware. who knows if people are stitching them. one thing ive noticed tho, the breeders with the really pretty looking packs( like barneys) usually have bad ratings. spending more money marketing thier shit, than on development of their gear. maybe that or not enough love. who can say for sure. As far as greenhouse tho, read tge mandala germ guide on their site. i killd more than a few seeds with rockwool, paper towels and peat. Drop the seeds right in your media and save them tonnes of stress. With greenhouse, i get perfect results doing this. i like thier genetics. im all on a mandala and greenhouse trip. im trying my first breeding program with satori and super bud.


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## Kite High (Apr 9, 2013)

so you're bigoted to a homosexual but ride a egomaniacs nuts....go figure


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## thekong (Apr 9, 2013)

Well, like everyone else, I like to read opinions on everything and take it with a grain of salt, wait until I have a shaker full, and then mark that vendor as not worth my time. I will say, by far, the BEST I have ever dealt with is Soma seeds, they are great, good communication, and all of the seeds I have got from them have done great, even the freebies. My advice for what it is worth, go with someone that you have experience with, take chances with others when you don't have anything to lose and aren't depending on it to make or break ya. I will buy a few seeds from other companies, there are a couple of strains I would like to try, but would I plan my whole bread and butter around those purchases? hell no. Just my thoughts.

K


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## Upstate2626 (Apr 9, 2013)

^ did you buy direct from Soma?????


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## kushhound187 (Apr 9, 2013)

Kite High said:


> so you're bigoted to a homosexual but ride a egomaniacs nuts....go figure


when i said queer, i meant it as in weirdo. I have no problem with homosexuals. and as far as riding a egomaniacs nuts,
read my thread about arjan. i think calling himself the king of cannabis is a shitty joke. i wont deny he is full of himself, however, i have had nothing but great luck with their products. and btw if you think im a beginner who dosent know anything, ive grown somas nyc diesel. i have mandalas satori and gannesh growing right beside the gh. the greenhouse i got are just as good as the rest. i talk from my personal experience. as far as the barney go, ive smoked tonnes of barnes strains, and wasnt impressed. ive never heard anything good, or ever seen any quality product that came from a barneys strain. i only promote greenhouse as i have had GREAT results with them. they are by no means my favorite, but ive had sucsess.


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## htidwelshy (Apr 10, 2013)

For me, dutch passion blueberries, it's like a woman with PMS, you even look at them wrong and you have a whole world of shit heading your way! in the end I threw them in the bin!


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## ProfessorPotSnob (Apr 10, 2013)

I can list just more than one shitty strain and breeder to be honest , the way things work in this time and era is not in our favor .. I think most breeders that have large facilities tend to have stray pollen and a shit load of over pollinating taking place from my experience , even some of the best went big and now there gear is like a roll of the dice sad to say .. 

I grew up growing bag seeds and land races , most of the beans I threw away are now par for sale .. Bullshit it is and I hate just about all commercial breeders in this day and age with exceptions for those such as Dj Short for example, those that have limited there production numbers for quality purposes and are true to there customers and the culture with all loyalty !

The majority of commercial seeds are made by outsourced growers in Spain and Holland sad to say .. I want beans from the source and I accept no bullshit or traded off work ..


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## Grandmah (Apr 10, 2013)

I grew out the doctor from green house seeds and it's pretty fantastic. I don't really hear a lot of good things about them but my experience with that one seed was awesome. The smell is horrible. The worst smelling weed I've encountered but the effect is knockout. I would grow it again. Maybe I got lucky


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## Sencha (Apr 10, 2013)

TH Seeds: Burmese Kush. 5 pack of females, all hermie around week 5 of bloom. REALLY hard to spot!!!

Spice of Life Seeds: Bluebonic. 12 regular seeds, only 3 sprouted (I've sprouted hundreds of seeds).


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## dolamic (Apr 10, 2013)

Samwell Seed Well said:


> some breeder create . . . . . some cuts are no longer avaialble and have been kept and taken care of for decades . . . . idk, if people/breeders tke these and use them without permission its the same as any other theft(and im talkin g about theft from the breeder either in lies or straight up stealing it
> 
> if not worse as it is a specific attack on the profession of the breeder who worked to create vs copy
> 
> genetics is not a blanket statement, a f7 Jack H is way different then f3 and what males and what lines were used to stabilize or breeder vigor into a plant, every plant with a similar genetic stor4y is not the same imho and the work our breeders do deserves to be respected . . .. . its breeders that steal others work that say its genetics not your baby


So who stole the original original ORIGINAL OG Kush from God?

If that's what you're saying to me right now. 

Breeders copy breeders like Adam begat Seth. 
It is not a fucking business. It is horticulture. 
One strain cannot be owned by any one person. 
If you notice every other facet of gardening, no one 
owns a particular apple tree or cherry tree. Etc. Etc. 
People _have _(to hold or maintain as a possession, privilege, or entitlement) 
these trees and sell or give away seeds. 
They do not _own (_to have or possess as property; to have control over_)_ them.
They are from that tree, not the people. 

Just like people plant a seed from a fruit they ate; 
or the way plants sprout out of bird shit; it's from the earth.
Bees pollinate flowers, as do birds, and grasshoppers, and 
God only knows what all else. Would then, the bees be guilty 
in a court of law for taking pollen from a Barney's Farm male, 
and alighting on a TGA Jillybean female? If he is thusly robbing 
the work of a breeder, and giving it freely to another breeder; 
it is obviously stealing and should be thrown in bee jail. 

Happy #420 post! yay.


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## ProfessorPotSnob (Apr 10, 2013)

Happy 420 

http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/pac/plant/
Plant Patent Info and Laws

And now we have a company making Sativex and they have geneticaly fingerprinted two strains in case of theft lol .. Silly world we live in aye !


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## pizzapuffer (Apr 10, 2013)

either dr grinspoon by barneys or holy grail kush by dna genetics. although i cant really blame the breeder. grinspoon is a bitch to grow. 1 of 3 turned out ok, the other 2 had almost no buds. but it is pure heirloom sativa. for the holy grail kush the seed was cracked. i got 3 from the single seed centre. maybe it got crushed in shipping i dunno. i told them but waited too long so they couldnt do nothing. but ever since the single seed centre wraps the packages in bubble wrap and it has been fine. i dont really try too many other seed companies. i like to just get anything by tga subcool from the single seed centre. they're both very reputable. im too scared to get fucked over or jepordize my credit card. i hear of a lot of these companies just take your money and send you either nothing or a bag seed they label as northern lights or hindu kush when it's just a random bag seed. i'll let other people take those chances with the less reputable companies. a lot of these companies on the net also have fake review. some people even think single seed centre is a scam but i assure you it is legit. yes you can just order 1 single seed but you pay up the arse for shipping for that 1 seed. all the free seeds i got from the single seed centre have been good except one time a gnomoautomatic didnt germinate. could have been me though that fucked up. kannabia is a decent company although fem seeds turn me off.


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## canna_420 (Apr 11, 2013)

ProfessorPotSnob said:


> Happy 420
> 
> http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/pac/plant/
> Plant Patent Info and Laws
> ...


GW won another one yesterday. They got their Sativex down as schedule 4, meaning its not the same as sched 1 . All they claim is clean and effective, nout else.
So does this make consentrates legal??? Not unless you own a corporation



http://www.pharmatimes.com/Article/13-04-11/Home_Offices_eases_restrictions_on_GW_s_Sativex.aspx


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## althor (Apr 11, 2013)

dolamic said:


> So who stole the original original ORIGINAL OG Kush from God?
> 
> If that's what you're saying to me right now.
> 
> ...



I disagree. Same as breeding horses or dogs. If you do the work and create something, then you get the rewards.


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## wil2279 (Apr 11, 2013)

I wouldn't say it was a "horrible experience" but the worst I have delt with is Barney's Farm pineapple chunk. Was supposed to be Indica and finished in 55 days. Well it seemed very Sativa like, grew huge, and finished about 3-4 weeks after every other strain.... It was the week before thanksgiving when I chopped it and it still didn't look quite ready. But the weather was killing it. It was very disease and mould resistant. I wouldn't mind growing it again but it would have to be an indoor grow so it will probably never happen.


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## dolamic (Apr 11, 2013)

althor said:


> I disagree. Same as breeding horses or dogs. If you do the work and create something, then you get the rewards.


I disagree with you, on these grounds.

You speak as if; I create a child then I could sell him since I created him. Right?
Maybe I could get a patent on my son so that no one else could create one 
like the one I created. If anyone _did_ create a son like mine, I could sue them!

Also, animals are different from plants.

Thank you.

-dolamic


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## althor (Apr 11, 2013)

dolamic said:


> I disagree with you, on these grounds.
> 
> You speak as if; I create a child then I could sell him since I created him. Right?
> Maybe I could get a patent on my son so that no one else could create one
> ...


 How does children come into play? That is one of those super extreme examples....


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## bradley104 (Apr 11, 2013)

and we have monsanto suing farmers for saving seeds instead of buying new ones each year. imagine getting sued for cloning instead of buying crappy seeds from unreputable companies. how awful.


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## dolamic (Apr 11, 2013)

althor said:


> How does children come into play? That is one of those super extreme examples....


I was talking about plants.

You were the one who started talking about breeding animals.

I tried to make you see the folly of your ways.

I succeeded.


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## Jogro (Apr 11, 2013)

dolamic said:


> It is not a fucking business. It is horticulture.


With due respect, horticulture _*is*_ a business.



> One strain cannot be owned by any one person.


The US Patent office disagrees with your "opinion":



> _*http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/pac/plant/
> 
> What is a plant patent?
> 
> ...


Now, you may not agree that living organisms "should" be patentable, but frankly, your opinion won't stop a Federal court from legally stripping your assets in civil action should you violate one of these patents. 



> If you notice every other facet of gardening, no one owns a particular apple tree or cherry tree. Etc. Etc.


How is this true? 

Everyone owns all the plants on their own property, just as every farmer owns their own crops. This type of plant property ownership has been recognized literally since biblical times (at the very least). See what happens if you walk onto a farm and try to take the plants growing there without permission. 

If you're talking about legal ownership of plant STRAINS, that's also incorrect (see above). 

Again, all sorts of plant cultivars are patented. There are all sorts of apples (just to name one of MANY examples) that you can't legally clone or sell without permission of the patent holder. 

These patents are limited, but they protect breeders intellectual property, given breeders the financial ability to create new lines. 



> People _have _(to hold or maintain as a possession, privilege, or entitlement) these trees and sell or give away seeds.
> They do not _own (_to have or possess as property; to have control over_)_ them.
> They are from that tree, not the people.


With due respect, plants are widely considered to be property just like bricks or cars, and there is a tremendous amount of legal and cultural precedent backing this up. 
That you don't think this is true, doesn't make it untrue. 



> Would then, the bees be guilty in a court of law for taking pollen from a Barney's Farm male, and alighting on a TGA Jillybean female? If he is thusly robbing
> the work of a breeder, and giving it freely to another breeder; it is obviously stealing and should be thrown in bee jail.


Straw man. Bees, obviously, can't be found "guilty" of anything in a court of law. Patent violation is also a civil (not criminal) matter. 

To the point, I strongly doubt that either the Barney's farm or TGA "strains" are patented, and therefore those breeders have no legal protection should a HUMAN decide to clone or cross them.


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## Kite High (Apr 11, 2013)

GW Pharmaceuticals has been getting granted US patents on mj strains and cannabinoid ratios this week at the rate of one per day...GET READY FOR FED RAIDS TO COMMENCE SOON


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## Kite High (Apr 11, 2013)

Jogro said:


> With due respect, horticulture _*is*_ a business.
> 
> 
> The US Patent office disagrees with your "opinion":
> ...


Well that was a ridiculous and moot point anyway as cannabis has no insect pollinators...only wind....and yes farmers have been sued by monsanto victoriously because the wind blew their pollen from the gmo plants to farmers that did not buy gmo seed from monsanto but dna of the monsanto gmo seed was identified in the corn they produced forcing many into bankruptcy... capitalism at its finest


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## Jogro (Apr 11, 2013)

dolamic said:


> I disagree with you, on these grounds.
> 
> You speak as if; I create a child then I could sell him since I created him. Right?


Wrong. 
Human chattel slavery is illegal. 
Selling plants or animals, not so much. 
The reason is that our society views human beings as being different than lettuce plants or mice, for example. 



> Maybe I could get a patent on my son so that no one else could create one
> like the one I created. If anyone _did_ create a son like mine, I could sue them!


Someone else could correct me if I'm wrong, but so far as I know, there is no legal precedent on patenting human organisms. 

In practice, then, *IF* you patented your son (or more precisely, his genome), *AND* said patent were later upheld (two very shaky propositions), THEN anyone later cloning your son without your explicit permission could be civilly liable for damages. 

I also think organism patents only last 20 years. . .so you might have to carefully consider WHEN you want to issue this patent. 

Try it and let us know how it works out for you.


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## Jogro (Apr 11, 2013)

Kite High said:


> GW Pharmaceuticals has been getting granted US patents on mj strains and cannabinoid ratios this week at the rate of one per day...GET READY FOR FED RAIDS TO COMMENCE SOON


Having the patents and enforcing them are two totally different things. 

If they've issued patents on what amount to "normal" cannabinoid ratios in normal drug cannabis plants, the patents will be void. 

EG, they can't hold a patent on say 15% THC cannabis plants, because those plants are/were recognized to grow widely all over the planet long before this company came along to issue their patent. 

If this company has bred special plants that express certain terpenes or certain esoteric cannabinoid ratios, I have ZERO problem with them issuing patents on the plants. The patents in question will only last twenty years and will protect others from commercially exploiting those plants during that time without licensing them. That won't affect anyone purchasing conventional ceeds from ceedbanks, nor growing any at home. 

GW pharmaceuticals can't possibly know what I'm growing in my backyard, nor do they likely care, so long as I'm not selling the plants or the genetics.


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## Kite High (Apr 11, 2013)

But the FEDS know and will shut you down for big business interests...that is why they drag their feet...not because of anything else but money...again get ready raids will commence with a fury...
the fed have and will continue to protect big business ....it is the reason mj was made illegal remember...HEARST AND DUPONT...big business big money rules 
Oh and btw slavery was NOT abolished...the rules were changed...now only convicted felons can be slaves...know those plants you are growing allow them to make you into a convicted felon then a slave


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## mytwhyt (Apr 11, 2013)

dolamic, If someone creates the same son you would, I'll sue you both... There are some parts of the gene pool we shouldn't be dipping into..


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## Kite High (Apr 11, 2013)

oh and they care cause they want to FORCE you to buy their Sativex...legal hash oil is all it is


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## kindnug (Apr 11, 2013)

I'll make sure I get the patent on that new dank strain > Dong
People will love the taste of Dong...and ofcourse the potency


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## Jogro (Apr 11, 2013)

Kite High said:


> Well that was a ridiculous and moot point anyway as cannabis has no insect pollinators...only wind


I think cannabis "can" be pollinated by insects, but unlike many plants it just doesn't "need" to be. 



> ....and yes farmers have been sued by monsanto victoriously because the wind blew their pollen from the gmo plants to farmers that did not buy gmo seed from monsanto but dna of the monsanto gmo seed was identified in the corn they produced forcing many into bankruptcy... capitalism at its finest


That's interesting. Do you have a source for this?

In Monsanto vs Schmeiser (which is the famous test case of this), the defendant Schmeiser could produce no evidence that his growing Monstanto's GMO canola was accidental, and in fact, just the opposite was true. . .he deliberately selected their Roundup resistant canola for growth on his own farm and fully admitted doing so and propagating multiple generations of ceeds from these strains. 

He claimed that since the original genetic material was blown onto his farm, he owned it and could use it as he pleased. 

Monsanto disagreed, saying that they didn't care if some of his plants made GMO ceeds because of wind pollination, but that didn't give him the right to isolate that trait and create his own line using their patented genes (which is, by his own admission, is what he did). The Canadian judge sided with Monsanto, saying that the patent protected the gene in question, regardless of how the farmer obtained it. 

Whether or not that "should" be the case is debatable, but I think its not a "crazy" decision inconsistent with patent law.


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## kindnug (Apr 11, 2013)

What if some1 had one of the strains they patented before the patent was issued?
Are they strains they specifically bred and don't release to anyone?
Just curious


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## kindnug (Apr 11, 2013)

I'm talking about the MJ plants not corn


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## Kite High (Apr 11, 2013)

Jogro said:


> Having the patents and enforcing them are two totally different things.
> 
> If they've issued patents on what amount to "normal" cannabinoid ratios in normal drug cannabis plants, the patents will be void.
> 
> ...


http://www.gwpharm.com/cultivation.aspx


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## Kite High (Apr 11, 2013)

kindnug said:


> I'm talking about the MJ plants not corn


*

http://www.gwpharm.com/cultivation.aspx​

But they need not even worry about suing you...the feds will come raid you confiscate all your stuff and make you into a slave...and if you still have money and the weed you had has gw's genetic markers they will take the rest of your money thast the feds didn't

*


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## brotherjericho (Apr 11, 2013)

Not been doing this long, but I've had very few bad grows since getting through my first successful full grow. Almost every strain I've tried has been pretty good, and I don't count failed germinations as "bad" because I typically only pop one strain at a time. So I've been happy with Female Seeds Pure AK, Neville's Haze, and C99. Same with Sweet Seeds Green Poison, Dinafem PPP, WoS AKxS (even with a partial reveg in flower!), and Delicious Fruity Chronic Juice. 

I have some G13 Pineapple Express in cure alongside of some Seedism Big Red, not bad grows but I let the PE dry out to much before jarring so I had to drop a leaf in to inject moisture. I hate that. I was more careful with the Big Red and they are in the jars at 60-61%. I didn't care for the yield on the Big Red, but it looks very nice and is very chunky and sticky. Fortunately I cloned both and I changed some things up for the clones. 

The worst I've run into thus far is Holy Smoke Nepali Rhukum, total shit, and Cali Con Buddha Tahoe OG (hermied 15-17 days into 12/12, only one I've ever had). The BToG looked nice, however, so I zapped it with reverse and put it outdoors. We had way too much rain and the plant was way too tight noded from growing inside so it suffered bud rot.


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## Jogro (Apr 11, 2013)

Kite High said:


> But the FEDS know and will shut you down for big business interests


Please explain to me how the Feds can possibly know which genetics I'm growing. 
I'd really like to hear this. 



> Oh and btw slavery was NOT abolished...the rules were changed...now only convicted felons can be slaves...know those plants you are growing allow them to make you into a convicted felon then a slave


I said "chattel slavery" (look it up) was illegal. 
I didn't say it doesn't exist. 




> oh and they care cause they want to FORCE you to buy their Sativex...legal hash oil is all it is


Unlike hash oil, Sativex is a pharmaceutically controlled product. . .ie every dose of it contains precise amounts of specific cannabinoids. 

You're right that there are big business interests that will push to have this be the only legal medical cannabinoid, but bluntly, the trend in the USA is going against it. If "recreational" cannabis is legal, then any particular formulation for medical purposes will also be legal. 

If you're a doctor and you're going to "prescribe" a cannabinoid, do you want to prescribe some shaky hash oil made with lighter-grade butane in someone's garage, or are you going to prescribe the consistent pharmaceutical grade product made by a recognized drug company? For the good of your patients, I think the latter is the ONLY appropriate choice, assuming its functionally equivalent. 

As a parallel to that, "if" Sativex is approved for domestic medical use in the USA (which may happen in the next few years) that will also open up the door to all sort of OTHER cannabinoid based pharmaceuticals too. So Sativex wouldn't be the "only game in town" for long.


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## Kite High (Apr 11, 2013)

Jogro said:


> I think cannabis "can" be pollinated by insects, but unlike many plants it just doesn't "need" to be.
> 
> 
> That's interesting. Do you have a source for this?
> ...


I'll try to dig it up...most were offered to contract to monsatan to buy their seed solely and the suits dropped upon that criteria

There are no sugars or nectar to attract pollinaters so they wont bother...that and the attraction colors are not correct for them to notice cannabis


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## Jogro (Apr 11, 2013)

Kite High said:


> http://www.gwpharm.com/cultivation.aspx


That's EXTREMELY interesting. 

So GW has complete genetic control over plant cannabinoids and can create any strain it likes to create cannabinoids in any ratio it likes. 

This is fawesome. 

Its probably cost them millions of dollars and years of research to do that. Why *shouldn't* they have a patent on any lines they've created this way? Good for them. 

So long as the patent is properly limited to 20 years (or some other reasonable time period) I don't have a problem with this at all.


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## Kite High (Apr 11, 2013)

Jogro said:


> Please explain to me how the Feds can possibly know which genetics I'm growing.
> I'd really like to hear this.
> 
> 
> ...


First the FEDS dont care what the dna is...MJ CULTIVATION IS A FED FELONY..you only need its presence regardless of strain

GW will be king for 20 years

Sativex looking to be approved THIS YEAR...they have been being "investigated " in the application process by the FDA for years now...FDA stated approval "likely "

Du Pont and Freon changing was nothing to do with fluorocarbons but rather the patent on r22 ran out..Now the new patented version is the ONLY one ..so GW could pull the same bs and keep the monopoly

This is the reason the FED wont change mj laws and they dont give a fuck about the state laws you know


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## Kite High (Apr 11, 2013)

Jogro said:


> That's EXTREMELY interesting.
> 
> So GW has complete genetic control over plant cannabinoids and can create any strain it likes to create cannabinoids in any ratio it likes.
> 
> ...


You will when DEA raids you on their behalf to eliminate competition to their $150 a pill SAtivex rather than allowing you to grow your own

Hopefully you are not a "State Registered and Licensed MMJ Grower" those lists gonna make it real easy for the DEA


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## Kite High (Apr 11, 2013)

Jogro said:


> Please explain to me how the Feds can possibly know which genetics I'm growing.
> I'd really like to hear this.
> 
> 
> ...


The Feds will not legalize mj and this is why...They do not give a fuck what the people nor the States are doing...its a farce....they let it go this long so they can get the lists and the raid and scare everyone into submission


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## Jogro (Apr 11, 2013)

brotherjericho said:


> I don't count failed germinations as "bad" because I typically only pop one strain at a time.


The topic of this thread is "worst strain and breeders", right?

Personally, I don't think its fair to trash a breeder just because one of their packs had a poor germination rate. 

There are a lot of different reasons why that can happen and many of them can be totally out of the hands of the breeder. For example, ceeds can be mishandled (eg exposed to high temperatures) in transport from the ceedbank to buyer, reducing their viability, or stored improperly by the ceedbank. That's not the breeder's fault. 

Seedstock could be old. . .for a variety of reasons, reducing the germination rate, and again, not necessarily the breeders fault. 

Don't get me wrong, poor germination CAN be a breeder issue, if they don't have proper quality control. . .I'm just saying you probably can't know what the problem is, or who is at fault with just one bad pack, that's all. 

IMO a "bad breeder" is one offering poor genetics. That could be consistently hermie-prone lines, low-potency/poor tasting/disease prone ones, lines producing plants completely unlike their descriptions or ad copy, or a variety of other issues.


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## Jogro (Apr 11, 2013)

Kite High said:


> First the FEDS dont care what the dna is...MJ CULTIVATION IS A FED FELONY..you only need its presence regardless of strain
> 
> GW will be king for 20 years


If they've earned it with a superior product, I don't mind. 

They've taken the financial risk and done the work, let them make the money with their patent. . .if they can defend it. 



> This is the reason the FED wont change mj laws and they dont give a fuck about the state laws you know


I disagree. 

You can't expect movement of this on a Federal level until/unless its captured a majority of States first. 

Right now legal marijuana is at a public policy tipping point with roughly half the voting population supporting it, and that support demographic only continues to get stronger. 

With increasing numbers of States legalizing MMJ, and now some even legalizing/decriminalizing recreational MJ, Its only a matter of time before this becomes forced as a federal issue. 

I wouldn't be holding my breath for full Federal legalization anytime soon, but I'd expect re-classification of cannabinoids out of medical schedule I in the next ten years, if not sooner. In the meantime, you can expect MMJ to reach several more states during that time, and probably legal recreational MJ in at least a few (I'm looking at you, Nevada, Oregon, CA, and maybe even Vermont). 

A good analogy is gay marriage. Eight years ago, Obama was against gay marriage. But SURPRISE. . .right before the last election, "all of a sudden" his position "evolved" and he became pro gay marriage. The same thing is going to happen with legal MJ, and for the EXACT same reason. . .with more and more voters supporting it, its going to become politically untenable for centrist politicians NOT to support it. 



> You will when DEA raids you on their behalf to eliminate competition to their $150 a pill SAtivex rather than allowing you to grow your own


In what universe is this going to happen? My three plants aren't a "threat" to GW's cannabinoid controlled pharmaceuticals. 

The BATFE isn't kicking down my door because I'm brewing a case of beer, and I wouldnt' expect them to do even if I distilled a few pints of whisky, so long as I kept my mouth shut about it. 

The DEA isn't going to kick down my door for a few opium poppies growing in my backyard. They're still a Federal agency with limited resources. Yeah, if I were growing a 1000 plant plot, I'd be worried. But there is simply no political impetus for the DEA to raid small individual growers right now, and I can't see that happening any time soon. 

And to the contrary, any administration making a policy of tossing cancer-stricken granny in jail for growing two weed plants is going to find itself on the wrong end of a major negative political backlash. 

I think your concern that the Fed gov't is going to try to carve out medical/pharmaceutical MJ as a drug-store pharmaceutical only, with the herb itself being illegal as another one, is perfectly valid. But there is only so far they can take that. The Fed can't kick down everyone's door, and if the States are permitting recreational MJ, medical MJ will have to be permitted too.


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## Kite High (Apr 11, 2013)

ok my friend but you can never say I didn't try to warn you


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## dolamic (Apr 11, 2013)

I just don't want to live in this world anymore. 
People think they own plants, when plants own you. 
It's fucking sadness at its finest not capitalism. 
You want to argue a moot point with me for what? 
To satisfy your ego? To make yourself sound right? 
Because a certain portion of the people agree on one 
thing doesn't make anything true or false. It's all up 
to opinion. If you're not here to open up your mind 
and to think differently; why are you still breathing? 

Am I the only one high on here?



.........



huh?


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## dolamic (Apr 11, 2013)

*Tongue-in-cheek* is a phrase used as a figure of speech to imply that a statement or other production is humorously or otherwise not seriously intended and it should not be taken at face value. The facial expression typically indicates that one is joking or making a mental effort.[SUP][1][/SUP] In the past, it may also have indicated contempt, but that is no longer common.[SUP][2][/SUP] By 1842, the phrase had acquired its contemporary meaning similar to "take what I am saying with a grain of salt," indicating that a statement was not meant to be taken seriously.[SUP][3][/SUP][SUP][4][/SUP][SUP][5][/SUP] Early users of the phrase include Sir Walter Scott in his 1828 _The Fair Maid of Perth_.


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## Kite High (Apr 11, 2013)

dolamic said:


> I just don't want to live in this world anymore.
> People think they own plants, when plants own you.
> It's fucking sadness at its finest not capitalism.
> You want to argue a moot point with me for what?
> ...


Very simple solution to your not liking to live in this world you know. See ya


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## dolamic (Apr 11, 2013)

Ahhhh lahkahhh lahkaakakakaakaa lahkkkka.

Shalakakakahhhkalahhhkalahhhka.


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## dolamic (Apr 11, 2013)

You wanna bump with me brah?!
You wanna bump? Huh?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Torch

!~


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## Prawn Connery (Apr 11, 2013)

DJ Short.

F13 was the hermiest, stringiest, low-potency strain I have grown in 30 years. Nice taste, pleasant high (even though it wasn't strong), but low vigour, stringy growth pattern and 6 out of 9 females turned hermaphrodite (and it wasn't environmental).

For US$160 for 10 seeds, the least he could have done was tested them before releasing them. I'm not the only one who has complained of hermies and poor yields, either - there have been many complaints about F13 since it was released.

I'll never trust a DJ Short strain again - I'll leave it to other breeders like Chimera and Steve (SOL) to work his genetics into their own crosses. Those guys know how to test and release a strain.


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## Jogro (Apr 12, 2013)

dolamic said:


> I just don't want to live in this world anymore. People think they own plants, when plants own you. It's fucking sadness at its finest not capitalism.


What strain are you smoking right now and where can I find some of it?



> Because a certain portion of the people agree on one thing doesn't make anything true or false. It's all up to opinion.


I agree that popular consensus doesn't, by itself, make things true, but ownership of property and the rule of law are pretty much universal human beliefs, true across every human society since the dawn of recorded history. You certainly don't have to respect the law or property rights, but they most certainly do exist, and if you ACT as if they don't you'll be setting yourself up for a BIG problem. 

As to everything being "opinion", I disagree (you could say I have a different opinion!). Empirically, certain things ARE true or false, whether you believe them to be so or not. 

Just because you believe that aliens from the planet Zog are controlling your thoughts, doesn't make that true. 

And just because the truth of something may not be known, or may not be widely appreciated, doesn't mean there is no truth. 



> If you're not here to open up your mind and to think differently; why are you still breathing?


Hey, _*you're*_ the one who says they don't want to live here anymore. Why are YOU still breathing? Don't you have some kind of work to do?

I'm all for keeping an "open mind", just not so open that my brains fall out of my head and go "splat" on the floor.


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## jessica d (Apr 12, 2013)

Jogro said:


> The topic of this thread is "worst strain and breeders", right?
> 
> Personally, I don't think its fair to trash a breeder just because one of their packs had a poor germination rate.
> 
> ...


a best b4 date is needed. also sealed breeder packs should be mandatory. good breeders stress test plants and throw out all hermies while in a breeding project. guys like swerve that just make crosses with low yieldnhermie prone and rip off customers with paypal fraud. even the guys humping his leg cant get yield lol


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## HazeHeaven (Apr 12, 2013)

Prawn Connery said:


> DJ Short.
> 
> F13 was the hermiest, stringiest, low-potency strain I have grown in 30 years. Nice taste, pleasant high (even though it wasn't strong), but low vigour, stringy growth pattern and 6 out of 9 females turned hermaphrodite (and it wasn't environmental).
> 
> ...


I thought his Blueberry was quite unimpressive in all respects also. Maybe I had bad phenos as I only ended up with two ladies. Sparse yielder, average at best buzz/effects, and not a standout taste like you'd expect. His True Blueberry (which gets much less promo) was much better in high/taste/yield across the board (especially taste - strongly Anise) but even that seemed a bit weak in comparison with what's out there nowadays. I really don't think DJS is the choice if you are looking for extra potent ganja. His reputation drew me in but from my experience and what I hear from others, the results (at least recently) don't really match the rep. Spice of Life's Blubonic blew the doors off DJ's two BB offerings by a wide margin.


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## fssalaska (Apr 12, 2013)

*Worst strain*, hmm want to say *AK48* the shit was like smoking horse hay also *blue berry*. *Worst breeder without a doubt Samsara seeds*, My last crop was Samsara seeds Crazy Miss Hyde 2 crops I had some hermaphrodites also with Samsara seeds Mazar, I know this is most the time the growers fult for stressing the plant in some way but I have been growing for 3 1/2 years now and only had hermaphrodites problems with that breeder. Crazy miss hide and there mazar is very good smoke but stay away from Samsara seeds fem seeds or watch your crop like a hawk.


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## althor (Apr 12, 2013)

HazeHeaven said:


> I thought his Blueberry was quite unimpressive in all respects also. Maybe I had bad phenos as I only ended up with two ladies. Sparse yielder, average at best buzz/effects, and not a standout taste like you'd expect. His True Blueberry (which gets much less promo) was much better in high/taste/yield across the board (especially taste - strongly Anise) but even that seemed a bit weak in comparison with what's out there nowadays. I really don't think DJS is the choice if you are looking for extra potent ganja. His reputation drew me in but from my experience and what I hear from others, the results (at least recently) don't really match the rep. Spice of Life's Blubonic blew the doors off DJ's two BB offerings by a wide margin.



When Blueberry first came around maybe it really did stand out as something really special compared to the strains available at the time. There are some good things about it and his other strains. I am not overly impressed. I also find it very odd that he uses herm males.


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## Prawn Connery (Apr 12, 2013)

I just think DJ's stuff is waaay overpriced. I respect the fact he did a lot of groundwork many years ago to develop his blue lines, but his seeds are amongst the most expensive - if not _the_ most expensive - out there, and they're just not that great. For that sort of money your expectations are high. Yet there are so many better strains for a fraction of the price - including his joint projects with Chimera and Steve (as already mentioned).

Case in point: I really fancied buying his Azure Haze the other day and agonised and agonised over it . . . Yet the bottom line was still the bottom line. I didn't want to get burned again spending $160+ for 10 poor-quality seeds. If they were more reasonably priced, I could put up with a herm or two - especially if what was left was quality smoke. But I haven't even found that . . . By all accounts, it's not just his F13 that's sub-par.


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## HazeHeaven (Apr 12, 2013)

Prawn Connery said:


> I just think DJ's stuff is waaay overpriced. I respect the fact he did a lot of groundwork many years ago to develop his blue lines, but his seeds are amongst the most expensive - if not _the_ most expensive - out there, and they're just not that great. For that sort of money your expectations are high. Yet there are so many better strains for a fraction of the price - including his joint projects with Chimera and Steve (as already mentioned).
> 
> Case in point: I really fancied buying his Azure Haze the other day and agonised and agonised over it . . . Yet the bottom line was still the bottom line. I didn't want to get burned again spending $160+ for 10 poor-quality seeds. If they were more reasonably priced, I could put up with a herm or two - especially if what was left was quality smoke. But I haven't even found that . . . By all accounts, it's not just his F13 that's sub-par.


I can no longer rationalize paying the HUGE price for companies like DJ Short, Sensi, and Mr. Nice just because they are older and have a longer track record. Companies like Bodhi, Rare Dankness, and Ace (just to name 3) have strains that I'm sure are way more dank overall and cost about half as much. I know the reputations link back to stability of their lines but I've grown from all 3 of those companies and found a good deal of variation and found quite a bit of disappointment. If I spend close to $200 (or more) on 10 beaners, it better be worth it! I learned the hard way years ago and found less expensive alternatives that were actually better.


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## diet coke (Apr 12, 2013)

First grow in years and I bought from single seed for assortment and free seeds. I got Nirvana< Blue Mystic(auto) and White Widow, Dinafem< Critical Jack(auto) and OG Kush, Seedsman< ATA Tundra and White Widow, Short Stuff< Himilayan Blue Diesel(auto) and Bomb< Berry Bomb. 

All were up and running in 3 days, Now @ 45 days, I like all of them and have no issues. I will run these for the next Grow with clones so I dont plan on buying again till fall. 

Good thread, if taken with a grain of salt.


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## Prawn Connery (Apr 12, 2013)

Well in Shanti and Neville's defence, as least when you buy a Mr Nice strain you get 18 seeds in a pack. And SSH is to this day still an outstanding strain, while Neville's Haze would have to be one of my all-time favourites. You're right about the variability, but the genetics are there. And with 18 seeds in a pack you can generally find a nice clone mother.


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## kindnug (Apr 12, 2013)

Mr. Nice isn't so expensive since you get more beans and personally never had a hermi bean. I've also had packs that were supposed to be 15 and had 18.
Hermi are more natural than everyone wants to believe. 60's-70's before indoor started I'm sure there were hermi, especially with commercial crops.
Sometimes it's stress, but it can just be that bean. Multiple hermi. with no light leaks or excess heat and it's in the strain genes.

What is the first killer female to be cloned and for how long it was kept?...I'd like to know that


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## Natural Gas (Apr 12, 2013)

fssalaska said:


> *Worst strain*, hmm want to say *AK48* the shit was like smoking horse hay also *blue berry*. *Worst breeder without a doubt Samsara seeds*, My last crop was Samsara seeds Crazy Miss Hyde 2 crops I had some hermaphrodites also with Samsara seeds Mazar, I know this is most the time the growers fult for stressing the plant in some way but I have been growing for 3 1/2 years now and only had hermaphrodites problems with that breeder. Crazy miss hide and there mazar is very good smoke but stay away from Samsara seeds fem seeds or watch your crop like a hawk.


Sorry to hear about your *Samsara* experience...One of my *Best experiences* is with *Samsara's (fem) Holy Grail 69*...I get monecious male flowering occasionally with f1s from different very reputable breeders...However, *NO MALE FLOWERING APPEARED ON MY SAMSARA GEAR*...Male flowering on a female plant is not always stress related and does not mean the plant is a hermaphrodite...It is really no big deal if you check your plants often...Just pluck them off early with a wet cotton ball...They don't "usually" come back...*Comes with experience*. I have been growing since "Tricky Dick" was prez...*Samsara is "Top Shelf"* gear...So we will have to agree to disagree on this one...FWIW


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## HazeHeaven (Apr 12, 2013)

Prawn Connery said:


> Well in Shanti and Neville's defence, as least when you buy a Mr Nice strain you get 18 seeds in a pack. And SSH is to this day still an outstanding strain, while Neville's Haze would have to be one of my all-time favourites. You're right about the variability, but the genetics are there. And with 18 seeds in a pack you can generally find a nice clone mother.[/QUOTE
> 
> MNS is nowhere near the money grubbers that Sensi are. $200+ for 10 seeds is just too much. Especially when it's not even close to the best stuff you can get. I think MNS is a bit overpriced but you are right in that you do get more seeds. There should be an option to buy 10 for a little less money. I think the reason MNS gives you so many seeds is that there _is_ a lot of pheno hunting to be done and they want to give you better odds.
> 
> I like to run 6-7 strains with 12-14 plants at once so I just really don't have the space or time to run out a whole 18 pack in a short time span. I like a lot of variety even though I only smoke once or twice a week. I think Sensi and DJ are much more overpriced for what you get than MNS but MNS still forces you to pay a lot of money to get their genetics because you are forced to buy 18 seeds.


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## brando980 (Apr 13, 2013)

Screw Monsanto aka The goverment


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## Omgwtfbbq Indicaman (Apr 13, 2013)

i've had real good experience with samsara as a whole, i got their freebies of crazy miss hyde, Spicy white devile and their green love potion. all of them were quality smoke. the green love potion is an indoor sativa, didn't fair too well outdoors compared to my indica and indica hybrid clones i've kept, nor as well as Samsara's crazy miss hyde. CMH is a sick NL hybrid, really stretchy, fast vegging plant that takes alot of abuse and flowers in 8-9 weeks probably faster if you know what you're doing. spicy white devil is indeed spicy, mine came out tasting like "hot tomales" candy but a little bit berry.


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## Omgwtfbbq Indicaman (Apr 13, 2013)

i didn't love the dj's bb that i've smoked, i prefer hybrids that use his BB, it seems to do great in hybrids but standalone its a hit or miss genotype.


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## goodro wilson (Apr 13, 2013)

I'd have to disagree with samsara being "top shelf" not the worst but there are much better did enjoy swd and some freebies from them turned out decent nothing to write home about 
The ONLY breeder I had problems with was cali connection and that was Tahoe og 4 of them did t germinate when 30 other strains a did fine in same conditions all diff breeders... However I'm not a swerve hater I blame it on them being pick n mix still haven't ran his gear bc that turned me off I guess 
Ghs lemon skunk was a very finicky plant had 5 of them with about 20 other stains and it was the only one to have problems... But smoke was decent and I'm sure I could dial it in 
Also ghs chemdog which I expected it was a beautiful plant as far as bud structure but def not the best chem out there ha
Let see had a dud pineapple chunk that stalled out at about 5 inches again with other plants thriving In same condition in Barney's defense pc turned out fire and one of my favs I've grown the ones that weren't runts
One company I would steer clear from is ch9 they have promising crosses but everything I ran from them was trash mostly free IRS though especially didn't like their jack33
Lets see ran nirvanas bubblicious bc it was cheap and I needed 50 of the same seeds some Hermes but I blame it on a bagseed that hermed
Had some light leaks I think and emerald triangles FEMs all hermed
Strawberry cough from sagarthma was trash and I THINK those are the only ones I had any problems with 
Don't make my opinion deciding factors bc lots of the 100's of strains I tried were pick n mix
And sometimes it takes a whole pack to find keepers


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## tampee (Apr 14, 2013)

HazeHeaven said:


> MNS is nowhere near the money grubbers that Sensi are. $200+ for 10 seeds is just too much. Especially when it's not even close to the best stuff you can get. I think MNS is a bit overpriced but you are right in that you do get more seeds. There should be an option to buy 10 for a little less money. I think the reason MNS gives you so many seeds is that there _is_ a lot of pheno hunting to be done and they want to give you better odds.
> 
> I like to run 6-7 strains with 12-14 plants at once so I just really don't have the space or time to run out a whole 18 pack in a short time span. I like a lot of variety even though I only smoke once or twice a week. I think Sensi and DJ are much more overpriced for what you get than MNS but MNS still forces you to pay a lot of money to get their genetics because you are forced to buy 18 seeds.


if you buy from the auction their dirt cheap I got mango haze for just over $100 and I got 22 beans. but you go to a seedbank your paying a lot more and getting less beans then you pay shipping and god knows how old they are. 
also every strain from every breeder takes some selection to find an elite pheno I don't care if its chemdog x og kush x blue dream your still going to find that 1 in 100 plant that dominates all. the way I see it mns just gives you a better shot in a pack to find that 1 in 100 pheno. but I got to agree their seedbank prices are high but not as bad as a lot but you go to their auction its about the cheapest place to get seeds when you figure you usually get around 20 seeds per pack.


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## xkushx (Apr 14, 2013)

racerboy71 said:


> i've growm th seeds mk ultra, and that shit is way beyond dank.. it's the only thing i have run by them, but i was impressed as were others..
> 
> the worst luck i had with any breeder has been alphakronik.. i got a 10 pack of the bubba loves and white diamonds, and got none of the bl's to germ... gave away the white diamonds with a warning they might not germ, and i think he said he got zero out of his pack too...
> 
> ...


the pheno that everyone calls the fabric softener pheno of mk ultra is amazing. its worth the small yeild. if you let it go an extra week it tastes and smells like bananas


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## texin (Apr 14, 2013)

[h=3]Big Buddha _Bubble Cheese_ had a bad hermie problem.[/h]


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## ggking (Apr 17, 2013)

Some distributers don`t store their seeds properly so you can`t blame it on the seed company itself.


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## MsMittens (Apr 18, 2013)

RedMan420 said:


> Arjan haze #1 from greenhouse seeds shit flowered for ever and the smoke was not worth the wait , and Pineapple Chunk from Barney's Farm shit had no flavor and shit wasn't potent at all.


dude ive grown Pineapple Chunk from BF like 15 times from seed and it even got accidentally hit w some Chem D pollen n grew out those too. it was hard to control and not a huge yeilder by itself but the smoke was so oily and expansive i could barely hit it when my stomach was acting up cuz the high was so intense it would turn my stomach for a minute till it hit me so hard i just layed down n eventually went to sleep completely baked, that was by itself, even tho i only got like an oz off of a 6 ft plant, it was my fault for not topping it that time. once it got crossed w the Chem D it was a huge yeilder and some of the most uniquely awesome smoke ive ever had. and i hate Barneys Farm, the worst plants/seeds ive ever had were from them, i bought a whole pack of Violator Kush that didnt even pop, but i gotta tell the truth about my experiance with the Pineapple Chunk


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## Yonofumo (Apr 19, 2013)

After reading this topic I will grow tomatoes, safe bet.


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## Natural Gas (Apr 19, 2013)

Yonofumo said:


> After reading this topic I will grow tomatoes, safe bet.


Collective Narcissism...FWIW


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## Hemlock (Apr 19, 2013)

DNA rocklock supposed to be fems all male/hermie


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## sonar (Apr 19, 2013)

goodro wilson said:


> I'd have to disagree with samsara being "top shelf" not the worst but there are much better did enjoy swd and some freebies from them turned out decent nothing to write home about
> The ONLY breeder I had problems with was cali connection and that was Tahoe og 4 of them did t germinate when 30 other strains a did fine in same conditions all diff breeders... However I'm not a swerve hater I blame it on them being pick n mix still haven't ran his gear bc that turned me off I guess
> Ghs lemon skunk was a very finicky plant had 5 of them with about 20 other stains and it was the only one to have problems... But smoke was decent and I'm sure I could dial it in
> Also ghs chemdog which I expected it was a beautiful plant as far as bud structure but def not the best chem out there ha
> ...


I never grew anything from GHS but I heard his Lemon Skunk was one of their better strains. Good to know.
I have GHS Trainwreck and Himalayan Gold but won't grow them out. Hear they are mediocre at best and hermie prone.


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## Pacificplanter (Apr 19, 2013)

After reading the reports here, I am almost afraid to grow out my Sensi seeds Hashplant and TH Seeds MK Ultra. Will I be wasting my time, space, and more money trying these two strains out, or has anyone here grown or smoked either can tell me if they're worth it? 
I can say this about what my least favorite breeders, those out there who sell only, or almost only feminized strains. Some people like them, that's fine by me. However, personally, I have had nothing but problems with them, even though I have had some mixed results. Some of Sannie's and DNA's feminized beans have been serious dank. Again, a mixed bag for me. From here on out, I grow only from regular seed stock, and avoid those breeders who refuse to sell regular beans. I ignore almost all Cannabis Cup results. We need a Pot Snob Cup with REAL Pot Snob judges who know and grow and/or medicate with a wide variety of strains. Oh yeah, Barney's, Greenhouse, and California Connection are banned from all Pot Snob competition! Peace.


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## Kite High (Apr 22, 2013)

THSEEDS S.A.G.E was an easy to grow strain, uniform outstanding potency


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## Frogmann (Apr 22, 2013)

tree king said:


> it took me a while to figure it out but one thing you have to realize is most people on this website have no idea what there talkin about so you have to be very careful who you listen to. the quicker you realize that the better off you'l be.


lmao .. word up!


Have had both good and bad experiences from most of the "original" seed companies/breeders. Nothing I feel needs to be said in this thread. Some breeders and resellers I refuse to send money to out of simple principal. I vote with my wallet.


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## ProfessorPotSnob (Apr 22, 2013)

Kite High said:


> THSEEDS S.A.G.E was an easy to grow strain, uniform outstanding potency


I grew the Hog last year and all of the plants wound up in my Garbage . It was a joke and the plants were more Hemp like than Marijuana . But yet the Bubble Gum pheno I favor came from them back when they were CIA .. I think everyone with a lineup has some hit and miss genetics .. 

I dont hold anything against THCSeeds but I wont grow Dutch gear ever again after that round .. On a note the freebies were winners once again from this order with Attitude


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## kindnug (Apr 22, 2013)

Kite High said:


> First the FEDS dont care what the dna is...MJ CULTIVATION IS A FED FELONY..you only need its presence regardless of strain
> 
> GW will be king for 20 years
> 
> ...


Had to bring it up: Something that is ILLEGAL FEDERALLY, can't be patented.
SO what was the point of the argument?


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## Jogro (Apr 22, 2013)

kindnug said:


> What if some1 had one of the strains they patented before the patent was issued?
> Are they strains they specifically bred and don't release to anyone?
> Just curious


If you really had something before its patented, depending on what it is and how you got it, that "could" invalidate the patent. IE if it were truly a novel creation of the patent issuer, how did you get it?

In this particular case, I don't think its possible for anyone to have any of these patented strains because exactly as you say, these were bred as proprietary strains and never released to the public. The only way you could have access to these genetics is if they were stolen, or if you violated the patent and recreated them yourself (which is probably not cost-effective, you'd be better off paying royalties, assuming GW were willing to license the genetics). . 

Also, in general patents only protect commercial use of the patented product. If you're not selling, breeding with, transferring, or otherwise commercially exploiting the patented material, I don't think there is cause for action here.


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## Jogro (Apr 22, 2013)

kindnug said:


> Had to bring it up: Something that is ILLEGAL FEDERALLY, can't be patented.
> SO what was the point of the argument?


This is complex. 

The patent in question refers to particular cannabis strains/genetics. 

It may well be legal to hold a patent on the genetics, yet still not be legal to grow the plants. 

In this particular case, there well may already be, or soon be specific Federal legal "carveout" for specific medical strains, so it may not be "crazy" to try to patent particular cannabis genetics, even if cultivation is currently illegal.


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## Frogmann (Apr 22, 2013)

The current supreme court case with Myriad, I feel will help determine whether or not "living things" can be patented and controlled by big business. I expect further similarly related cases will be brought forward accordingly. Science and profit don't have a beneficial correlation IMO. Obviously others see it differently though.


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## Lemon Haze Daze (Apr 22, 2013)

*I have been growing for over 25 years I have had good and bad from different breeders, I have read on here people had problems with SLH) how ironic its one of my favorite strains love the high the smell the taste everything, so I wont say that the breeders are bad cause I have had good luck with some bad luck with others to date the worst luck I have had was with BF (barneys-farm) and MNS (mr nice seeds) however lot of people I know have had great success with MNS) so instead of saying the breeder suxed I will just say I had bad luck with those 2 ........Keep it Dank *


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## Norblaze (Apr 23, 2013)

Sensi seeds: Northern light#5 x Haze. One out of five germed, and the one that did was a short indica with no strech what so ever, which is quite the opposite of their description. The other seeds that was germed in the same way had 100% germ rate, so im certain the blame belong to the breeders. A friend of mine got 1 out 10 on his Shiva Skunk. Barneys Farm was also a major disappointment.


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## tobinates559 (Apr 30, 2013)

people are quick to say a strain or breeder is crap, when they might have just done something wrong themselves? maybe not but Barneys Farm seems to be the most reoccurring answer people give. i got a world of seeds skunk47 freebie and it was awesome


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## idoitmovin (Apr 30, 2013)

Got a Cheesequake clone (TGA seeds) from a friend that grew next to others and stayed small for the entirety of it's 12/12, smell and potentcy was sweet and ok, but she had a weakness for pests and yield was an all time let down. Friend had same result with his as well. only problem strain i've had so far.


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## AliCakes (May 6, 2013)

I bought a few different seed packs from Barney's Farm - all were crap. Outside of Barney, I have nearly 100% germination rate. BF was less than 25%, and NONE were keepers.

Also, Serious Seeds Bubblegum. The whole pack hermied really really bad.


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## doniawon (May 6, 2013)

AliCakes said:


> I bought a few different seed packs from Barney's Farm - all were crap. Outside of Barney, I have nearly 100% germination rate. BF was less than 25%, and NONE were keepers.
> 
> Also, Serious Seeds Bubblegum. The whole pack hermied really really bad.


I think thats the first bad thing I have ever heard about serious seeds. They are usually spot on from description and super good?


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## AliCakes (May 6, 2013)

I had heard wonderful things as well - so that was part of why I bought them. Afterwards, I have met SEVERAL people who had major hermie issues with bubblegum. I think BF is truly a crappy seed company. SS makes some great stuff, but I don't think Bubblegum is one of their gems.


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## Botwin1 (May 8, 2013)

DNA or Cali connection (same company) black water. Shitty shitty shitty yield, almost no bud on the plant, and was flowered out next to some 3-5oz per plant monsters, under the same light, fed from the same reservoir. Also, their og kush was terrible. It was the first flowers I ever had returned to me. The best I've ever grown were two local strains that aren't commercially available.


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## HazeHeaven (May 8, 2013)

doniawon said:


> I think thats the first bad thing I have ever heard about serious seeds. They are usually spot on from description and super good?



Their White Russian turned out very shitty for me. It was like 6 years ago when I was sort of a newb but all the other strains I was growing at that time turned out fine. It was the lightest weight buds with D level potency. Buds had ZERO density and ZERO taste. Haven't tried Serious again but really intrigued by their Kali Mist.


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## SlaveNoMore (May 8, 2013)

I have never had any bad experiences but I research the hell out of strains. The one thing that I stay away from are seed companies that have just as many autos as they have photo strains. If they offer the same strain in both auto and regular red flags go up. I guess its not really justified but I don't want autos anywhere near the breeding process. There are too many stories of people getting seeds and they end up auto flowering. That shit would piss me off. I stay away from breeders that deal with autos. Not that I think growing autos is bad for people who have to but it's just not for me.


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## KendeFyah (May 24, 2013)

Botwin1 said:


> DNA or Cali connection (same company) black water. Shitty shitty shitty yield, almost no bud on the plant, and was flowered out next to some 3-5oz per plant monsters, under the same light, fed from the same reservoir. Also, their og kush was terrible. It was the first flowers I ever had returned to me. The best I've ever grown were two local strains that aren't commercially available.


DNA & Cali Con. is the same company? i dont understand.


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## Kite High (May 24, 2013)

Jogro said:


> This is complex.
> 
> The patent in question refers to particular cannabis strains/genetics.
> 
> ...


The FEDS own patents on cannabinoids for medical applications already...yes..its true

http://uspatent6630507.com/


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## brotherjericho (May 24, 2013)

KendeFyah said:


> DNA & Cali Con. is the same company? i dont understand.


I've found that it is best not to fully trust people with only a handful of posts until they've established their ability to tell the truth from time to time .


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## Wavels (May 24, 2013)

I would have to say that the biggest dissapointment geneticaly for me is GHS...recently grew out 8 Kalisnikova...mediocre is the best thing I can say about this waste of time "strain". Started 8 fem seeds...all germed quickly...they grew with decent vigor and finished flowering around 65 to 70 days...However the quality of the smoke is very low compared to the vast majority of strains I have grown out.
GHS should hang their heads in shame.
High Times needs to stop promoting their crap.
I would have been better off if these seeds never germed.


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## ganjaman87 (May 24, 2013)

Grew out Barneys Farm 8Ball Kush. Super leafy and took years to trim, the dried buds looked like crap and the smoke was crap as well....


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## Clankie (May 24, 2013)

Wavels said:


> I would have to say that the biggest dissapointment geneticaly for me is GHS...recently grew out 8 Kalisnikova...mediocre is the best thing I can say about this waste of time "strain". Started 8 fem seeds...all germed quickly...they grew with decent vigor and finished flowering around 65 to 70 days...However the quality of the smoke is very low compared to the vast majority of strains I have grown out.
> GHS should hang their heads in shame.p
> High Times needs to stop promoting their crap.
> I would have been better off if these seeds never germed.


*zappa lovefest*

test grown strains are the way to go for me. 
if i cant find at least solid documentation for a breeder's older strains, from 3rd party sources, they can take their game somewhere else. breedbay, and certain s&#8364;&#8364;d bank forums are veritable treasure troves of information. the attitude will sell anyone's seeds regardless of quality, as will some other banks.


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## bigworm6969 (May 26, 2013)

yeah I too grew out kilishnakova from ghs and it was a disapointment, also the flying dutchmans blueberry skunk was crap too.


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## bigworm6969 (May 26, 2013)

oh yeah dont let me forget purplechem from cali connections fucking garbage


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## trophy1 (May 27, 2013)

Greenhouse: 
The Church, not a bad strain, an occasional seed, just not a keeper. 
Himalaya Gold, tall with wispy buds (looked like ditch weed), low potency. 

Barney's: 
Tangerine Dream, hard to germ got 3 of 5 to pop, tall, takes 13 weeks to finish, though potency was great.

Dutch Passion: 
Orange Bud, tall lanky plant, mediocre potency.
Strawberry Cough, was awesome, had a pheno that yielded really well and had good potency. It's clones would produce 3 - 5 ounces on average, had one produce just short of 10 ounces indoors (my personal best indoors), lost that mom a couple years ago, been thinking of ordering them again, on the chance I could find that pheno again. 

Have had awesome success with pyramid seeds, all have had excellent potency and strong vigorous plants for the most part. The first tut I did from them struggled in veg but I flowered her out and she produced excellent top shelf smoke. Have 3 more tuts going now and they are way more vigorous in veg. Can't wait for them to finish!

Never have had any real Hermie issues with fem seeds, an occasional seed here and there, that doesn't bother me, I usually keep them for a rainy day since they are basically fem seeds.


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## silasraven (May 27, 2013)

sweet mango auto sucked for everything, shitty spindly weed, litt thc content though good for hash. double gum very open leaves lanky shitty growing. cheese for a free be.


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## kinddiesel (May 27, 2013)

kc seeds, called cyber crystal, after 5 clones. it lost its strength and thc. went to 20 % all the way down too 5 % and its used to average 6 oun not lucky to get 1 ! other strand is still going very strong. dna genetics, nl skunk , very good. so I say its the kc seeds brand I had another from them kc nl special. impossible to clone and the yield sucked , slow grow, also the cyber will herm in about 6 weeks of flowering . so forced to chop early, KC SEEDS COMPANY YOU FUCKING SUCK ! FUCK YOU COST ME THOUSANDS, ON YOUR BULL SHIT GENETICS ,


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## brotherjericho (May 27, 2013)

kinddiesel said:


> kc seeds, called cyber crystal, after 5 clones. it lost its strength and thc. went to 20 % all the way down too 5 % and its used to average 6 oun not lucky to get 1 ! other strand is still going very strong. dna genetics, nl skunk , very good. so I say its the kc seeds brand I had another from them kc nl special. impossible to clone and the yield sucked , slow grow, also the cyber will herm in about 6 weeks of flowering . so forced to chop early, KC SEEDS COMPANY YOU FUCKING SUCK ! FUCK YOU COST ME THOUSANDS, ON YOUR BULL SHIT GENETICS ,


Interesting. So are you saying that the 6 clones came from one mother, or did you clone from clones six times? Not that I've heard of the strain, just wondering because you sometimes see people saying that clones eventually lose potency.


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## beuffer420 (May 27, 2013)

See my problem lies in how many seeds were popped when u tried these junk strains. If u only had one seed and popped it and it sucks is that really enough to say what a breeder took his time to do is junk? What if you would have popped many seeds would the outcome had been different? I think so and have found this to b true. I've popped many of packs of seeds and yes while some may vary from others in certain traits, lets not forget you are not your brother or your sister. To take one or two seeds pop them and say oh this is garbage really isn't enough to go on. Now if you popped 10-20 seeds and all the ladies were terrible I could see that. In most the strains I've gone through there's always been a few phenos I wasn't impressed with. I guess I'm getting at the selection part of things if you don't pop many seeds how are we to know if its junk or if we just missed that seed where traits were lined up for our taste.

i did a run of Tahoe og from swerve popped the first ten was ok with the results but knew there was more in the line by what I was seeing in the first ten. Popped the other ten and bam there was what I was looking for. I guess it's all about selection and your preference in what u consider dank.


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## trophy1 (May 27, 2013)

I had a white rhino mom, that lost its potency, I actually had 2 moms of the WR and the other was just fine, same generation. I think its possible to stress out a mom and have it affect the clones negatively.


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## trophy1 (May 27, 2013)

I agree, with you. But when seeds are pushing $100 for a 5 pack its a pricey proposition to go pheno hunting thru 20 seeds. 

I usually figure if I don't find a keeper in a 5 pack of fems or 10 pack of regs, its time to try something else.

That being said, I have found keepers in single seed freebees before, but that is luck of the draw in alot of cases.



beuffer420 said:


> See my problem lies in how many seeds were popped when u tried these junk strains. If u only had one seed and popped it and it sucks is that really enough to say what a breeder took his time to do is junk? What if you would have popped many seeds would the outcome had been different? I think so and have found this to b true. I've popped many of packs of seeds and yes while some may vary from others in certain traits, lets not forget you are not your brother or your sister. To take one or two seeds pop them and say oh this is garbage really isn't enough to go on. Now if you popped 10-20 seeds and all the ladies were terrible I could see that. In most the strains I've gone through there's always been a few phenos I wasn't impressed with. I guess I'm getting at the selection part of things if you don't pop many seeds how are we to know if its junk or if we just missed that seed where traits were lined up for our taste.
> 
> i did a run of Tahoe og from swerve popped the first ten was ok with the results but knew there was more in the line by what I was seeing in the first ten. Popped the other ten and bam there was what I was looking for. I guess it's all about selection and your preference in what u consider dank.


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## Omgwtfbbq Indicaman (May 27, 2013)

trophy1 said:


> I agree, with you. But when seeds are pushing $100 for a 5 pack its a pricey proposition to go pheno hunting thru 20 seeds.
> 
> I usually figure if I don't find a keeper in a 5 pack of fems or 10 pack of regs, its time to try something else.
> 
> That being said, I have found keepers in single seed freebees before, but that is luck of the draw in alot of cases.


exactly why i am still a nirvana customer, 100 seeds for 220-250 dollars. weed out the bad plants and keep the very best.


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## chongsbuddy (Jun 12, 2013)

OGMan said:


> You're right. Its so typical. That guy above who claims Iranian G13 is crap obviously hasn't grown it because its a super potent outdoor plant and has been around for years now. I had to pre-order mine this year just to be sure I got some. It's so popular the seed company can't keep it in stock



i have read numerous reports on the iranian crosses being junk!sodalite is a liar too!greenthumb gave him the strain,then he just lied to keep getting free seeds!trust me,i got ripped by sodalite for over 125 seeds!just do a google search on iranian short season and iranian g13....its as easy as that...no finished reports,most reviews on the buds are bad!the only real good review i have heard is for the iranian/og.and only 1 report!

hey ogman why dont you ever talk about any other breeders or strains?


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## KushKrew (Jun 12, 2013)

I can find something good to say about everything I've ever grown, come to think of it. And I'm no breeder so I can't go judging guys for being BAD at it. Sometimes, they're just BETTER at marketing, that's all. They make you expect something that if you take one hit your grandpa feels it, but then it's just normal dank so you feel ripped off... Doesn't make them bad breeders, but excellent businessmen I guess.


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## Bxgrower81 (Jun 12, 2013)

I'm growing the Iranian chem outdoors right now, actually 9 of them out of 50 plants and literally,those nine and about 4-5 others that are growing much faster and with more vigor than anything else I have, I've smoked his chem4 grown by a friend maybe 2 years ago and it was some fire,I loved it I'm actually gonna purchase a few packs of it myself since my buddy had to shut down soon after and lost his mothers. I'd say the worst strain I've tried werea autos diesel Ryder, and himilaya blue diesel forgot who the breeder was they were freebies,my worst photo strain would be World of Seeds Afghan Kush but that was just a single seed,it was potent, but very bland taste,


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## Impman (Jun 12, 2013)

puffntuff said:


> What strain was it? What breeder? Why do they suck?


Greenhouse Seed Co. Hermaphrodite 'feminized seeds' they sell. Way overpriced and over hyped. I hate them!


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## Impman (Jun 12, 2013)

bigworm6969 said:


> yeah I too grew out kilishnakova from ghs and it was a disapointment, also the flying dutchmans blueberry skunk was crap too.


My kalishnikova's were hermys. GOD THAT SUCKED


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## chongsbuddy (Jun 12, 2013)

to be honest im growing 14 iranian/chem s2's from a trade right now...i just want to know once and for all...and if its good,ill say so and do a report either way,but ill be honest about it.


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## Bxgrower81 (Jun 12, 2013)

Hey chong, I'm trying to do the same thing as you,just wanna see how these Iranian crosses do outside for me and share my results with everybody,good or bad,like I said before the doc's chem4 that I smoked was some fire top notch smoke,so I'm sure the chem part of the cross is up to par,hopefully the Iranian is good as well to make this cross an outdoor winner for me,
maybe I shouldn't have said anything about the chem 4 because watch it sell out before I could pick up my packs in another 2-3 weeks, I know he cost a little more but it's not much more than other banks and we have the ability to speak to the breeder himself,so to me that's a plus


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## jazlm (Jun 13, 2013)

I got some fem. CH9 Jack as freebies from an order and they are great. No issues w/ germination or herms. Took several clones from them. I plan on keeping this strain around for a while. I also have had a lot of luck with Female seeds as well. I have a Barney's 8 Ball Kush that was very slow and didn't clone very well at all. I mean 100% of them never took. I have never had this issue before, they guess they just do't cone very well. My Jack clones had roots with in 5 days. Going to run Trainwreck & White Widow/Big Bud next.


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## eyeslow999 (Jun 13, 2013)

Shit- Barney's topdawg, Crimea blue, red diesel, Vanilla kush, 
Swerve(Cali conartists) chem 4 straight hermie in week 2 of flower, Larry og(hermie and male autflower)
Greenhouse-hit and miss super lemon had 2 great pheno's bubba kush str8 Hermies fucked up my crop with seeds, Kaia kush slow vegging garbage that taste like crap not kush, himalaya gold absolute shit! Super silver haze was awesome very uniform and amazing smoke. And mobs dick was also a great yielded and was very hazey and fast to flower.
alphakroniks - alpha dawg absolute hermie garbage with no potency.
mr nice master kush xskunk -mid grade bunk
ch9 seeds- green bud (waste of soil) sativa Dom took forever to flower and sucked balls


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## OGMan (Jul 6, 2013)

chongsbuddy said:


> to be honest im growing 14 iranian/chem s2's from a trade right now...i just want to know once and for all...and if its good,ill say so and do a report either way,but ill be honest about it.


You'd be honest about it!? LOL, stop it you're killing me!!! LMFAO
You weren't honest about selling seeds were you? You slagged everybody's seeds off but didn't tell anyone you were starting your own seed bank did you.

Iranian Chemdawgs S2s, how do you know they're legit? Just more bullshit I'd venture. If they were from Dr. Greenthumb I might actually believe you...hahaha, just kidding, your credibility was shot long ago


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## AlabamaRedneck (Jul 6, 2013)

puffntuff said:


> What strain was it? What breeder? Why do they suck?


The worst seedbank is Planet Skunk. Avoid them.

I made an order with them, and never got my seeds. And when I complained, the guy emailed me sexual insults.

Since then I've used The Attitude and never had a problem.


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## chongsbuddy (Jul 7, 2013)

what the fuck are you talking about me selling seeds idiot!never sold seeds,,,ever!stop telling lies to make other people look the other way from you.....yur a fucking snake!

you are the ONLY person who questions my credability asshole,the only one!
its your credability that is in question by everyone else..dont you get it stupid?you openly look like a liar,,,its not hard to see,and everyone is calling you out and yiou try and put someone alse under the truck,you are a lil bitch goof!


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## thenotsoesoteric (Jul 7, 2013)

Drama. Anyway worst breeders I've dealt with #1: cannaventure purple berry bxII; purple buds that grew slow and crinkled leaf, tasted like wood.#2 barney's farm pineapple chunk, was a 14 week monster, but nothing like description. #3 dutch passion blueberry and power plant. Had DP's bluberry in 02 and was bomb, since then 10 beans of bunk. the power plant was weak(nirvana's version blew it away).

By far the worst was purpleberry, I mean people would rather not smoke than smoke it, no shit. Everyone was like "holy crap, that stuff looks awesome" you hand them the pipe and let them green it and just watch their faces cringe like they just ate a lemon. Stuff is great if you want to put it in a glass jar as decor, but I like to smoke.


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## chongsbuddy (Jul 7, 2013)

i know they are legit because they are from a very solid breeder from unleash da green...see you wouldnt last too long over there ogspam,you are not liked over there at all,and neither is brownthumb...they all know the truth about you guys!lol


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## thenotsoesoteric (Jul 13, 2013)

AlabamaRedneck said:


> The worst seedbank is Planet Skunk. Avoid them.
> 
> I made an order with them, and never got my seeds. And when I complained, the guy emailed me sexual insults.
> 
> Since then I've used The Attitude and never had a problem.


I'm sorry had to comment because I laugh ever time I read this post. What an a-hole. It reminds me of the dave chapelle show,when they do the skit about the shitty service at kinkos print shop. 
I'm sure it wasn't funny to deal with though. Just thought what great customer service,lol. I'll stay away from them.


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## bigworm6969 (Jul 14, 2013)

The best seedbank is attude because i never order from anywhere else so i dont know of a better or worse one, best breeders 1 TGA 2 DNA 3RARE DANKNESS 4DINAFEM 5G13LABS 6THSEEDS 7SERRIOUS as far as worst i didnt like cali connect or greenhouse, flingdutchman, but so far im limited to the amount of breeders i have used so maybe this list will change the more different strain i grow


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## TN Jedeye (Sep 29, 2013)

Man, I tried one or two seeds from Such & Such Seed Co. and, get this, I did not find the holy grail, elite mother I was searching for. I simply can't figure out why...


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## Shannon Alexander (Sep 29, 2013)

Dinafem plants haven't liked my climate


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## TwooDeff425 (Sep 30, 2013)

^second that motion


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## dr.tree (Sep 30, 2013)

My saddest grow was tga vortex and 3d, very unstable 20 beans only one vortex keeper witch I gave the clones away and ran cheese instead.the keeper vortex was ok at best the yield made me cry myself to sleep, I think the cheeze was stronger/ better high and that not saying much. Tga gear can be very good show bud. I lot of people around here use to run it, I think it is fading out fast. Most of it I've tried has been the best I've ever seen or tasted but where is the high????


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