# Bleach instead of H2o2



## choempi (May 4, 2010)

I know I have seen threads on using bleach instead of h2o2 in hydro, but can not find the per gallon recomended dose. Fatman?


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## Dwight D. Schrute (May 4, 2010)

someone correct me if im wrong, but umm, i believe it is none.....


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## Michael Phelps (May 4, 2010)

Man i personally think your better off just getting some h202... Fatman is the only person ive ever heard talk about putting bleach in your reservoir and the thought honestly scares me..


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## choempi (May 5, 2010)

Michael Phelps said:


> Man i personally think your better off just getting some h202... Fatman is the only person ive ever heard talk about putting bleach in your reservoir and the thought honestly scares me..


I actually have run the last 2 days on a cap of bleach per gallon, but want confirmation


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## choempi (May 5, 2010)

Dwight D. Schrute said:


> someone correct me if im wrong, but umm, i believe it is none.....


corrected cause you are wrong, but thanks for reply...


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## Dropastone (May 5, 2010)

I haven't tried it yet but my buddy uses 8 drops per gallon and has had no ill effects and claims his roots are whiter than ever. He got the tip from a guy that works at a professional greenhouse. According to him that's what they use and they've been doing it for years to keep the roots clean and healthy.


Hope this helps you out.

Peace.


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## choempi (May 5, 2010)

Dropastone said:


> I haven't tried it yet but my buddy uses 8 drops per gallon and has had no ill effects and claims his roots are whiter than ever. He got the tip from a guy that works at a professional greenhouse. According to him that's what they use and they've been doing it for years to keep the roots clean and healthy.


 
Hope this helps you out.

Thanks, I think you are about right, I know it is used in commercial applications...

Peace.


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## fatman7574 (May 5, 2010)

Dwight D. Schrute said:


> someone correct me if im wrong, but umm, i believe it is none.....


Do you think the majority of commercial hydroponic green house growers are wrong. They use chlorine at 4 ppm or higher added into the pipesfeeding the irrigation spray heads so as to m not waster chlorine in the reservoirs through dissipation. I recommend 2.5 ppm as an initail treatment reduced to 0.5 ppm as a residual level of chlorine. Tap water is allowed to contain up to 4 ppm at customers faucets. Thousands of growers of mj use tap water without any removal of chlorine. 10's of thousands of people water their houseplants, flowers and lawns with water containiing up to 4 ppm of chlorine. Plants can tolerate extremely high anounts of chlorine. they ac not tolerate chloride. Fish can tolerate high levels of chloride but not chlorine. Salt is sodium chloride. Plants can not tolerate high levels of chloride Caphese.

Hydrogen peroxide is a much stronger oxidizer than chlorine. It is much easier to cause problems using hydrogen peroxide than to use chlorox bleach. 

Too many myths in forums and on the web. Have you heard of Pythoff. It is sold in two versions. Professional/commercial made with chloroamine or hobby grade made with chlorine.

http://www.flairform.com/Products/pythoff.htm http://www.urbangardenershop.com.au/product/457/default.asp 
the MSDS for hobby grade:
http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0oGklFzIeFLdm0AkIxXNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTEybGVibTBpBHNlYwNzcgRwb3MDMQRjb2xvA3NrMQR2dGlkA0g0NjVfNzk-/SIG=12mrpieok/EXP=1273131763/**http%3a//www.flairform.com/downloads/msds_pythoff_hobby_strength.pdf

When your wrong your wrong. This time your very wrong. Consider your self corrected.


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## fatman7574 (May 5, 2010)

choempi said:


> I know I have seen threads on using bleach instead of h2o2 in hydro, but can not find the per gallon recomended dose. Fatman?


 
*Read this page.* 
https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/286022-killing-root-rot-2.html


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## Dropastone (May 5, 2010)

Thanks fat man that was a very informative read. So Chlorine bleach would be the way to go because there are quite a few different kinds on the market?


*Types of Bleach* 
There are several types of bleach. Chlorine bleach usually contains sodium hypochlorite. Oxygen bleach contains hydrogen peroxide or a peroxide-releasing compound such as sodium perborate or sodium percarbonate. Bleaching powder is calcium hypochlorite. Other bleaching agents include sodium persulfate, sodium perphosphate, sodium persilicate, their ammonium, potassium and lithium analogs, calcium peroxide, zinc peroxide, sodium peroxide, carbamide peroxide, chlorine dioxide, bromate, and organic peroxides (e.g., benzoyl peroxide).
While most bleaches are oxidizing agents, other processes can be used to remove color. For example, sodium dithionite is a powerful reducing agent that can be used as a bleach.


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## fatman7574 (May 5, 2010)

Dropastone said:


> Thanks fat man that was a very informative read. So Chlorine bleach would be the way to go because there are quite a few different kinds on the market?
> 
> 
> *Types of Bleach*
> ...


*Blah sa, blah sa, blah. Most chlorine bleachs sold for laundry use do not contain anything but Chlorine and sodium from sodium hypochlorite plus water. Yes thare are chlorine cleaning products that contain many other ingrediants, such as toilet bowl, counter and tile cleaners etc. Just look at the labels. You want unscented houshold strength chlorine bleach such as Chlorox brand (not lemon scented) Regular Bleach. The same plain old Chlorox bleach that has been sold since 1913. A gallon would last the typical hobby grower a life time if used only for growing. *http://www.clorox.com/products/overview.php?prod_id=clb


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## choempi (May 5, 2010)

I think bleach is the way forward, have dropped the h2o2 and been running bleach for the last week...


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## choempi (May 5, 2010)

Thanks Fatman and Dropastone!


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## Wohjew (May 5, 2010)

wow im glad i came across this thred. a guy in b.c online shop said H202 was hard to get. so he suggested Growzyme and i love it . can i use bleach along with growzyme ?dont mean to hijack this thread


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## fatman7574 (May 5, 2010)

No chlorine or Hydrogen peroxide is used with chemical nutrients. Hygrozyme is used with organic nutrients. With organic nutrients solutions you need bacteria and enzymes to break down the organic susbstances into readily uptakable nutrients. With a chemical nutrients system you try to maintain a bacteria and enzyme free nutrient solutiom. All the chemical fertilizers are already in a form that they can be easily taken up by the plant roots. Except for the metalic trace elements and the chelates provided with the chelated iron make them readily usable by the plants. 

Hydgrozyme is supposed to compete with the pythium and bacteria causing root rot to rapidly spread, it is claimed they get more of the food (dying roots) before the bacteria thereby stopping the bacteria from multiplying. That is not true, they are ust some selected bacteria that are able to compete with the bacteria thereby slowing the root rot and pythium. They are bacteria and enzymes from South America that will live through the heat created when chicken manure is composted so they live while the other bacteria and enzymes are destroyed. The chicken manure piles are innoculatted with the bacteria early during the composting. However the other bacteria that are destroyed from heat during composting are air borne and quickly reestablish themselves in the compost so they are also present in the hygrozyme when you buy it. The Hygrozyme is the liquid that leaches from compost after watering the piles after the compost has cooled down (finished composting). The bacteria once killed off are also airbornes so establish them selves in your reservoir wiyth in days if there is not something their to kill them.

Chlorine actually kills the bacteria and pythium. It also kills enzymes. It does not kill enzymes living within the plants or its roots.


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## Wohjew (May 6, 2010)

i use advanced sensi grow A B bloom /grow along with 2ml of hygroyme per liter of water . in my res . is this wrong ? can you correct me please


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## fatman7574 (May 6, 2010)

Hydgrozyme is really made for organic nutrients and soil grows. While you can use it with chemical nutrients you are turning a near sterile and clean nutrient/growing system back into a bacterial/enzyme/pathogen laden system. Sort a step backward. One of the huge advantages of a hydroponic system is eliminating the presence of bacteria and enzynes by using nutrients that prevent their need. Hydroponic chemical nutrients preclude the need for bacteria or enzymes for nutrient uptake availability. Chlorine then prevents the growth or even the presence of nearly all bacteria/pathogens. Hygrozyme creates conditions supportive of bacteria and pathogens. It is sorta like adding the bacteria needed to process waste in a waste water (sewage) treatment plant to a drinking water treatment plant. IE a step backward or a step in the wrong direction. In a waste water treatment plant you need loads of bacteria to break down organic nutrients just as in an organic nutrient reservoir. In a drinking water plant all the organic nutrients were broken down before they entered the drinking water treament plant (as in a chemical nutrient reservoir) therefore a disinfectant (chlorine) is used to kill nearly al (99% to 99.9%) of all bacteria present as most bacteria are harmful rather than helpful. Hygrozyme is reputed to contain "0NE" helpful bacteria but it's use encourages conditions supportive of many non helpful bacteria and pathogens. This basically means unless you plan to empty and clean your reservoir very often and flush the sytem with H2O2 or chlorine to kill all bacteria, enzymes and pathogens to get rid of all the non beneficial ones, then you are providing a very bacterial, and pathogen laden sytem for the plants roots to deal. This mans you are expecting a "beneficial bacteria" to actually grow faster then them and take a larger proportion of the food available and therfore keep the "bad bacteria and pathogens" at low levels. Not gonna happen. Last I heard the hygrozyme people even quit adding the beneficial bacteria and are now just selling straight chicken manure water leachings. IE an organic fertilizer.


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## Wohjew (May 6, 2010)

i hear ppl praise hydrozyme like its the greatest thing. i dont really like paying 130$ for 4litres anyways . lol ok then so would just my sensi bloom / grow A B along with the recommened 8 drops of cloarox per gallon of water . is that a basic pathogen free mix for me to go with for now ?. ive been using the zyme with my grows with the same mix for a year now and ive had good results .


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## patlpp (May 6, 2010)

Fatman: I noticed Chlorine is one of the "16 essential elements" in Dyna-grow at .006%. Is chlorine in this form and quantity sufficient for pathogen abatement or is there another purpose for Cl ? Thanks. The avatar is not to piss u off.


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## fatman7574 (May 6, 2010)

0.006% is equal to 0.6 ppm. That is basically a residual dose that will keep a chemical nutrient reservoir disinfected if you are daily adding more nutrients to your reservoir. It is a bit light for a disinfecting dose though. I recommend an initial dose of about 2 ppm to 2.5 ppm and a residual level of 0.5 ppm. Higher doses such as used by commercial green house growers are because they quite often use surface water and water from open irrigation canals. These often have Pythium that are more resistant to chlorine that can require up to 4 ppm to kill. However a maintenance (residual) level of 0.5 ppm will keep re population of even the more resistant Pythium from reestablishing a population. Even the most resistance bacteria and pathogens are killed down to at least a 0.01 to 1 percent population by a 20 minute contact with a 2 ppm dose. So starting out with a 2.5 ppm dose nearly all chemical nutrient systems will maintain a dose high enough to kill all Pythium, bacteria or pathogens before the chlorine drops below 2 ppm. It will then 12 to 24 hours for the rest of the chlorine to dissipate down to around 0.5 ppm. 

If you have a root rot problem already established then a larger 4 ppm dose would be advised for an initial dose, then drop to 2 ppm the next day and 0.5 ppm each day after that until harvest. You can easily use dose 100 times larger initially without harming all but young seedlings. However with such high levels you will oxidize all your iron causing it to dissipate as rust. You would kill most of any hair roots but the regrow nearly daily.

I repeat, you should not use chlorine or H2O2 with organic fertilizers or with organic supplements as it will kill the bacteria and enzymes they contain. Remember also that agrozyme does not kill Pythium, allegedly it can not compete with the hydrozyme bacteria for food so they can not multiply quickly enough to cause problems. The commercial greenhouse industries does not support that claim. Hygrozyme does not even now claim to add the beneficial enzymes they once added. There adds and stories page is full of deceptive things. For an example they claim: &#8226;

The follwing sentences in quotes are from the Hyd grozyme site at the link provided. "Hygrozyme is the only known solution on the market that can be used in conjunction with hydrogen peroxide in a ppm of 1-2% solution, a combination used by many operators to clean, sterilize and oxygenate roots." http://www.hygrozyme.info/directions/world-garden/using-hygrozyme-in-pure-hydroponic-systems.html What does that mean ? We know that a 1% solution is 100 ppm and a 2% solution is 200 ppm. That concentration would be unusable in any hydroponic system (chemical or organic). Period. However consider a house hold bottle of H2O2 is 3.5%. Are they suggesting a to 1 ppm solution of a 3.5% solution. IE a 1 to 100 dilution of 350 ppm solution. That is 3.5 ppm. Now consider if it was the stronger 35% H2O2 used by most growers. That would mean a ppm of 35 ppm. That is absurd also as H2O2 is a stronger oxidizer than chlorine and Chlorine even at 2 ppm kills the "beneficial enzymes". I think they are about as credible as Fat Mikie at AN.

"It is important to note that Hygrozyme is a natural plant enzyme. *It does not kill anything.* To be effective, it is best used before bio film build up grabs hold in your system, causing complications and producing an environment ideal for problems such as Pythium." Duh, kill the bacteria with cholorine and maintan residual chlorine in a chemical nutrient solution and there is never a biofilm present.

"While some growers have reported Hygrozyme has arrested root rot, it has to be caught early and treated with vigilance It kills nothing but it is going to arrest root rot. Ie that is back to the claim that hygrozyme can out feed the food provided by the dead roots. It is no wonder no other hydro growers acre still using hygrozyme but mj growers. It is an absurd product for anyone but those growing with organic fertilizers in a clsoed sytem.

They make claims that certain PhD's I know personally have recommended their products. I know these men personally and that is not the case.


English is definitely not the first language of the person who writes their marketing adds. The sentenses in quotes were cut and psted add material. The only changes I made was to bold a sentence and add quote marks.

Not to pick on those with Down's syndrome, but does it kind alook like Fat Mikie has Down's syndrome.


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## patlpp (May 7, 2010)

Excellent post Fatman. Again thanks for all the contributions you have made to this forum. Rep for sure.

Edit I just tried and It won't let me!! Gotta spread it around it says.

Anyone else care to Rep this man?


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## Dwight D. Schrute (May 10, 2010)

corrected i stand, so i started getting a little algae growth in my res and i decided to give it a try, i dosed 5ml to a 25g res, im sure its not enough for root rot but with everything being discussed in ppm i wasn't sure and did not want to over do it, i think that should be enough to kill algae any ways....


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## Tiger Woods (May 14, 2010)

Dwight how are the plants reacting to it. Iam hoping ok being that fatman recommends only 1ml per 10 gallons.

Peace and good vibes


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## choempi (May 15, 2010)

6 to 8 drops per gal.


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## choempi (May 15, 2010)

check out my thread in my sig


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## JeffersonBud (Jun 17, 2010)

Thanks guys for the info!
Im running a chemical grow in an ebb and flow. I keep my water at 60 degrees and have been using Dutchmaster Zone and 1ml/g of h202. After 4 days my res starts to smell like pond water. My roots are white but notice a white slick residue on some of the plastic parts in the controller bucket. 
I will try the bleach @ 6 drops per gallon from now on.
I know the Zone is chloramine... should I ditch it all together and just run bleach or use it in conjunction? How often should I add the bleach, does it evaporate or dissipate like h202?


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## JeffersonBud (Jun 17, 2010)

Never mind fellas, I read through the posts again and saw Fatman posting a dissipation of 2ppm over a 24 hour period. I did just that to my res, 2 tsp for 50 gallons for a total of 2 ppm. The reservoir smells a lot better and the plants are perky! So I am thinking 2.5 ml a day to keep a .5 ppm constant of bleach. 
Fuck h202. I hate that shit.


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## johndoecangrow (Jun 18, 2010)

I would use the bleach to clean out your buckets and stuff when your done growing in it but would not use it one any living plant


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## patlpp (Jun 18, 2010)

johndoecangrow said:


> I would use the bleach to clean out your buckets and stuff when your done growing in it but would not use it one any living plant


Why? Should we regard all the above posts as wrong? State your case Yoda.


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## JeffersonBud (Jun 18, 2010)

John,
Look at your local water quality report. You are usually drinking 1-2 ppm of of chlorine at a time depending where you live (sometimes more). It is the same dose we are giving the plants. Actually slightly less @.5 ppm constant. If it is okay enough for us and your household garden, it is okay for cannabis as well. This only pertains to using chemical ferts.
Also, if commercial greenhouses are using it @ a rate of 8 times the normal dose recommended for our indoor gardens, then I am sure its okay. I have been running bleach for two days now and can see a much cleaner reservoir then h202 ever provided.

the only reason to de-chlorinate water as far as Im concerned is if you are running organic ferts or have an abnormally high concentration of chlorine to begin with.

Fatman chooses to share information with the community, not because he has to, but because he want's to. He has been solid so far!

2 weeks ago I would have thought the same thing as you, but it just goes to show you how much more there is to learn!


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## Someguy15 (Jun 18, 2010)

Nice post. I would run Chlorine but I'm using additives like Greenfuse and I think I would be defeating the purpose there. Hygrozyme seems to avoid me getting the alge more so then h2o2 ever did, so I guess I'm stuck with it unless I go purely synthetic nutes/additives.


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## JeffersonBud (Jun 18, 2010)

Someguy15 said:


> Nice post. I would run Chlorine but I'm using additives like Greenfuse and I think I would be defeating the purpose there. Hygrozyme seems to avoid me getting the alge more so then h2o2 ever did, so I guess I'm stuck with it unless I go purely synthetic nutes/additives.


I hear that!

I have $400 worth of Hydro organic ferts (Botanicares Pro complete line) and a gallon of hygrozyme. Such a waste.


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## Tiger Woods (Jun 22, 2010)

I agree organic nutes have no place in a hydro op period.

Hope know one takes offence, just my personal opinion.

Peace and good vibes


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## PDN247 (Jun 26, 2010)

not tryin to jack the thread but i'm confused. how can i be sure if and when i can run bleach? i've been running clorox 2drops / gallon for the last 2 weeks and using carbo load witch claims to be made 

of 100 organic carbohydrates. I was also planing on running "overdrive" witch contains "vitamins and organic materials". is the bleach destroying the organic carbs, vitamins, amino acids and organic 

material? if so should i just run a ph balanced bleach solution as a flush in between the weekly water change?? or should i be looking into more synthetic nutrients?

my soup ingredients are sensi bloom a+b, vitaboost pro, carbo load, liquid big bud, overdrive, final phase and little bit of snowstorm ultra . + rep for good info


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## Cissy (Jul 23, 2010)

Rather than telling us to add 2 or 4 PPM to our reservoirs, would any of you know how much bleach would be needed per gallon in order to raise it roughly 2-4 PPM? As in ____ML, rather than just suggesting we add a "few drops". I have a large reservoir and I don't want to sit there counting hundreds of drops. lol

Also, how often do we add it? Just one time or do we need a maintenance dose?

ty


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## krisko (Jul 25, 2010)

When you guys say "bleach" you guys are talking about the stuff we do laundry with correct? Its not some commerical growing bleach or a special bleach I need to buy. I can use the same bleach from my laundry room?


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## NLXSK1 (Jul 25, 2010)

krisko said:


> When you guys say "bleach" you guys are talking about the stuff we do laundry with correct? Its not some commerical growing bleach or a special bleach I need to buy. I can use the same bleach from my laundry room?


 
Yes, but make sure your laundry bleach does not have any scents, special disinfectants, etc... Just go buy a gallon of cheap generic laundry bleach and use that.

It is my understanding that 1 drop = 1 ppm in 1 gallon. Usually it is 2 drops per gallon to start and then 1/2 drop per gallon maintenance although this differs completely depending on if your resevoir is aerated or not and how much surface movement, etc..


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## krisko (Jul 25, 2010)

Alright someone was saying 7-8 drops per gallon in a few pages back in this thread. 7-8 drops is a big jump from 1-2 drops. Cany anyone confirm the correct number?


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## cephalopod (Jul 25, 2010)

Look at the % of the sodium hypochlorite of your bleach. Calculate your dose so it meets label below. If you find bleach at 7.5%, it should make figuring your application rate a little easier. If you look it's on riu somewhere, you probably need to look through a fatman thread to find it. http://www.flairform.com/downloads/pythoff_commercial_label.htm


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## wiseguy316 (Jul 25, 2010)

1 use 1 tsp per gal per day to kill brown algae. 1/4 tsp per day for pm measures.


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## choempi (Dec 21, 2010)

cephalopod said:


> Look at the % of the sodium hypochlorite of your bleach. Calculate your dose so it meets label below. If you find bleach at 7.5%, it should make figuring your application rate a little easier. If you look it's on riu somewhere, you probably need to look through a fatman thread to find it. http://www.flairform.com/downloads/pythoff_commercial_label.htm


Fatman actually pmd me the 6-8 drops per gallon


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## FirstGrowOHNO (Dec 23, 2010)

Best and most useful thread ever guys + rep u all +) I've been using hygro in my setup, and after reading these posts i was horrified, started adding bleach to kill off all the bacteria i caused in my rez with fuckin hygrozyme that i spent a fortune [email protected]


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## trunkneck (Dec 23, 2010)

fatman7574 said:


> Do you think the majority of commercial hydroponic green house growers are wrong. They use chlorine at 4 ppm or higher added into the pipesfeeding the irrigation spray heads so as to m not waster chlorine in the reservoirs through dissipation. I recommend 2.5 ppm as an initail treatment reduced to 0.5 ppm as a residual level of chlorine. Tap water is allowed to contain up to 4 ppm at customers faucets. Thousands of growers of mj use tap water without any removal of chlorine. 10's of thousands of people water their houseplants, flowers and lawns with water containiing up to 4 ppm of chlorine. Plants can tolerate extremely high anounts of chlorine. they ac not tolerate chloride. Fish can tolerate high levels of chloride but not chlorine. Salt is sodium chloride. Plants can not tolerate high levels of chloride Caphese.
> 
> Hydrogen peroxide is a much stronger oxidizer than chlorine. It is much easier to cause problems using hydrogen peroxide than to use chlorox bleach.
> 
> ...


Yes, commercial grows, but this is a hobby user. I don't see anyone corrected, this is as much an art as a science. Try not to be so rigid.


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## NLXSK1 (Dec 23, 2010)

trunkneck said:


> Yes, commercial grows, but this is a hobby user. I don't see anyone corrected, this is as much an art as a science. Try not to be so rigid.


 
You are arguing with someone that was banned months ago...


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## drgreentm (Dec 23, 2010)

choempi said:


> ha


 whats up man thanks for checking out my grow and for the rep i would throw you some to but dont know how this is some good info on here went out today and got some wal mart brand non scented bleach want to try this but im using tap water at about 150 to 160 ppm out the tap and my nutes are flora nova bloom and hg bud xl additive is any of this a problem or just the 6-8 drops per gallon thanks and if you tell me how to give rep i will give you some lol.


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## trunkneck (Dec 23, 2010)

NLXSK1 said:


> You are arguing with someone that was banned months ago...


Ah well, just going through all the forums as I'm new.


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## choempi (Dec 23, 2010)

drgreentm said:


> whats up man thanks for checking out my grow and for the rep i would throw you some to but dont know how this is some good info on here went out today and got some wal mart brand non scented bleach want to try this but im using tap water at about 150 to 160 ppm out the tap and my nutes are flora nova bloom and hg bud xl additive is any of this a problem or just the 6-8 drops per gallon thanks and if you tell me how to give rep i will give you some lol.


The star beneath a peeps post is for giving rep, and as long as your nutes are not organic bleach is good to go

And when you rep always leave your screen name so peeps know who repd them


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## drgreentm (Dec 23, 2010)

choempi said:


> The star beneath a peeps post is for giving rep, and as long as your nutes are not organic bleach is good to go
> 
> And when you rep always leave your screen name so peeps know who repd them


 cool man thanks o believe the flora nova is not organic will check on line real quick about to do my res changes tonight so i am going for it so the tap water doesnt make a diff i thought tap water was already treated with some cl


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## choempi (Dec 23, 2010)

drgreentm said:


> cool man thanks o believe the flora nova is not organic will check on line real quick about to do my res changes tonight so i am going for it so the tap water doesnt make a diff i thought tap water was already treated with some cl


If you are worried then only use 4 drops, though the amounts we are talking even with the tap is very small
bleach disipates after about 24 hours, so what I do is every 2 or 3 days add back to the amount of gals in your res, you could even go 4 or 5 days cause the bleach wipes shit out completely and takes a fair while for any bad shit to get back in your h20. It is so easy and so cheap and totally effective.
Your tap ppm is very good also


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## drgreentm (Dec 23, 2010)

it says flora nova is a mix of organic and chemical what you think


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## choempi (Dec 23, 2010)

drgreentm said:


> it says flora nova is a mix of organic and chemical what you think


I would ask around cause I do not know the answer to that, I have never done organic.


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## NLXSK1 (Dec 23, 2010)

drgreentm said:


> it says flora nova is a mix of organic and chemical what you think


The chlorine will kill the bacteria needed to break down the organic molecules into N-P-K for the plant to use. So by using chlorine you are neutralizing both the chlorine and the bacteria...

Best thing to do is get the resevoir temps below 70 degrees if at all possible.


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## drgreentm (Dec 23, 2010)

thanks for being honest i am going to give it a go in one res with 4 drops per gallon if i see any harm to the plants i will flush and stop using i will let you know so people in the future can use the info as well thanks again.


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## drgreentm (Dec 23, 2010)

NLXSK1 said:


> The chlorine will kill the bacteria needed to break down the organic molecules into N-P-K for the plant to use. So by using chlorine you are neutralizing both the chlorine and the bacteria...
> 
> Best thing to do is get the resevoir temps below 70 degrees if at all possible.


 pretty sure they are below 70 now not quite sure but i got a spare water thermometer will throw it in to be positive.


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## choempi (Dec 23, 2010)

drgreentm said:


> thanks for being honest i am going to give it a go in one res with 4 drops per gallon if i see any harm to the plants i will flush and stop using i will let you know so people in the future can use the info as well thanks again.


honest answers is what the whole idea is about, it's no shame to not know something, but talking out your ass may cost someone a grow


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## drgreentm (Dec 23, 2010)

choempi said:


> honest answers is what the whole idea is about, it's no shame to not know something, but talking out your ass may cost someone a grow


 absolutely worst comes to worst it will just not break down the organic parts right?? on the bottle it says it has .01% CL already in it so im curious.


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## thegreensurfer (Jan 7, 2011)

Ive got some green algae on my coco mat, gonna try 5 clorox drops per gal. Ill update you dudes in a few days


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## the raider (Jan 8, 2011)

Hypochlorous Acid is The same thing as Bleach. Hypochlorous Acid is in Bob's Brew and Clonex Cleaning Solution. Both at the same rates.Check out any label of Bob's Brew and I'm sure you can find what your looking for


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## choempi (Jan 8, 2011)

the raider said:


> Hypochlorous Acid is The same thing as Bleach. Hypochlorous Acid is in Bob's Brew and Clonex Cleaning Solution. Both at the same rates.Check out any label of Bob's Brew and I'm sure you can find what your looking for


Bleach is a bit cheaper


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## Highhopes99 (Jan 9, 2011)

How is the bleach working out? I'm using a flood and drain system in rockwool pots (al b fuct style) and had my roots turn brown the other day. Is bleach going to help me 6-8 drops per gallon.


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## flamdrags420 (Jan 10, 2011)

Fatman, can you cite any external resources for commercial green houses using bleach in this way? Have yet to find anything on this.
Thanks


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## Al B. Fuct (Jan 10, 2011)

Please oh PLEASE don't use laundry bleach in hydroponics. 

Just don't.


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## flamdrags420 (Jan 10, 2011)

Thank god a bigger voice of reason to come with a bigger yield sign.
Funny that you are back again Al. Had just started working on my grow room some more and re read your faq and harvest every two weeks threads to re learn my knowledge. Hope all is well.


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## Al B. Fuct (Jan 10, 2011)

flamdrags, good to hear that everything's working for you. I'll be haunting RIU for a few days on this thread.


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## thegreensurfer (Jan 13, 2011)

I tried using 5 drops per gallon to get rid of algae on my coco mat, the algae is still there after 3 days getting darker in color. Might take some time to break down?
The plants look super healthy though, no adverse affects.


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## NLXSK1 (Jan 13, 2011)

thegreensurfer said:


> I tried using 5 drops per gallon to get rid of algae on my coco mat, the algae is still there after 3 days getting darker in color. Might take some time to break down?
> The plants look super healthy though, no adverse affects.


It is not going to kill growing algae. You need to cover the mat with something that blocks light if you do not want algae.


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## thegreensurfer (Jan 14, 2011)

NLXSK1 said:


> It is not going to kill growing algae. You need to cover the mat with something that blocks light if you do not want algae.


 I am attacking the algae from 2 angles & have indeed covered the mat with foil in addition to adding the bleach. 
Does anyone else think bleach will have no affects on algae?
How long should it take for the algae to disappear?


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## Al B. Fuct (Jan 14, 2011)

Yes, you can clean algae from surfaces with bleach. However, you should never allow bleach to come in contact with plants, roots or with plant contact surfaces unless the bleach is rinsed fully from the surfaces before putting them in contact with plants again.


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## med4u (Jan 14, 2011)

i put 1 full cup in every time.....my socks and underwear come out dazzlin' white!


jus' sayin'...


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## tatamama (Jan 14, 2011)

Chlorine kills organic life! I use tap water straight. Chlorine is gone in 24 hours so not enough time to kill anything but the bad guys. Best environment is chlorine free period!!! h2o2 will fix many plant illness but only in moderation with organics of any type.. I used it when plants were dead and they mostly lived.. Have a couple, I will post pics in a day or so, they had no roots, they were real sick from white flies on late flower plants that I cloned to save the strain. The two that did not live, well they are still sort of alive, started putting out roots and two months later the roots are still growing but the few leaves that were on it are still almost the same, little tougher, like leather, dark dark green and now not doing well but the amazing thing was how the h2o2 made the things take root and saved most.. I am talking two month old clones that have not done any top growth but put out maybe 28 inches of new roots when none were there before the h2o2... As for tap water and or chlorine. A million and 2 growers will swear by RO water and well besides the bugs my tap water makes 18 inch colas and huge green plants for over 4 grows so I don't see the issue with it.. Used to put out for 24 hours but it just adds moisture to the room so straight in now. Chlorine is not ideal for any plant whether you like it or not. It is a sanitizer, means it is a posion of sorts and kills plant life..... U should never get a phylum if you clean your shit boys....





Wohjew said:


> i use advanced sensi grow A B bloom /grow along with 2ml of hygroyme per liter of water . in my res . is this wrong ? can you correct me please


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## Al B. Fuct (Jan 14, 2011)

Chlorine at the levels applied by municipal water treatment plants is harmless to plants and people.


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## thegreensurfer (Jan 14, 2011)

med4u said:


> i put 1 full cup in every time.....my socks and underwear come out dazzlin' white!
> 
> 
> jus' sayin'...


I'm not growing socks and underwear, so that is of no help.


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## thegreensurfer (Jan 14, 2011)

tatamama said:


> Chlorine kills organic life! I use tap water straight. Chlorine is gone in 24 hours so not enough time to kill anything but the bad guys. Best environment is chlorine free period!!! h2o2 will fix many plant illness but only in moderation with organics of any type.. I used it when plants were dead and they mostly lived.. Have a couple, I will post pics in a day or so, they had no roots, they were real sick from white flies on late flower plants that I cloned to save the strain. The two that did not live, well they are still sort of alive, started putting out roots and two months later the roots are still growing but the few leaves that were on it are still almost the same, little tougher, like leather, dark dark green and now not doing well but the amazing thing was how the h2o2 made the things take root and saved most.. I am talking two month old clones that have not done any top growth but put out maybe 28 inches of new roots when none were there before the h2o2... As for tap water and or chlorine. A million and 2 growers will swear by RO water and well besides the bugs my tap water makes 18 inch colas and huge green plants for over 4 grows so I don't see the issue with it.. Used to put out for 24 hours but it just adds moisture to the room so straight in now. Chlorine is not ideal for any plant whether you like it or not. It is a sanitizer, means it is a posion of sorts and kills plant life..... U should never get a phylum if you clean your shit boys....


Tap water might be good where you're at. A starting ppm of 650 here means its out of the question for me.
But tap water isn't the issue, I am experimenting with small doses of chlorine to break down the algae that has accumulated on the coco mat based on some of the recommendations earlier. Washing it down is not an option since the roots are grown into it already. Roots are nice and healthy, just the top of the coco mat is algaefied.
Has been covered for a few days now....


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## thegreensurfer (Jan 14, 2011)

Al B. Fuct said:


> Chlorine at the levels applied by municipal water treatment plants is harmless to plants and people.


 Hey Al B., I've heard of some long term effects chlorine has on the inner walls of veins & arteries, hardening them and making a good host for buildup of cholesterol & plaque, but that's in humans, another story....
But anyways, does anyone know if h202 will affect organic Ca?
I use cutting edge nutes, I believe it is all non-organic except for the plant amp which is a Calcium Chloride supplement made up of organic acids. 
I am aware of the affects h202 has on microbial life but what about plant amp?


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## Al B. Fuct (Jan 15, 2011)

thegreensurfer said:


> Hey Al B., I've heard of some long term effects chlorine has on the inner walls of veins & arteries, hardening them and making a good host for buildup of cholesterol & plaque, but that's in humans, another story....
> But anyways, does anyone know if h202 will affect organic Ca?
> I use cutting edge nutes, I believe it is all non-organic except for the plant amp which is a Calcium Chloride supplement made up of organic acids.
> I am aware of the affects h202 has on microbial life but what about plant amp?


H2O2 will break down organic compounds into the component elements; CaCl2 itself isn't an organic compound, though. Pretty good for melting ice on roadways. Why do you think you need a Ca supplement, anyway?


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## thegreensurfer (Jan 15, 2011)

Al B. Fuct said:


> H2O2 will break down organic compounds into the component elements; CaCl2 itself isn't an organic compound, though. Pretty good for melting ice on roadways. Why do you think you need a Ca supplement, anyway?


The bottle says omri certified organic, so somehow its organic.... I dunno how.
I need a Ca supplement because the ro water is stripped of it.


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## Al B. Fuct (Jan 15, 2011)

thegreensurfer said:


> The bottle says omri certified organic, so somehow its organic.... I dunno how.


hmm, ok



> I need a Ca supplement because the ro water is stripped of it.


hmm, ok again... Why are you using RO?


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## thegreensurfer (Jan 15, 2011)

Al B. Fuct said:


> hmm, ok
> 
> 
> 
> hmm, ok again... Why are you using RO?



As stated previously, my water quality is poor.
If I used tap, after nutes, my final ppms would be near 2000
In addition there is too much Ca in my tap which causes Mg complications
Believe me I wouldn't use tap if I didn't need to, RO is more time consuming & more expensive.


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## Al B. Fuct (Jan 15, 2011)

thegreensurfer said:


> As stated previously, my water quality is poor.
> If I used tap, after nutes, my final ppms would be near 2000
> In addition there is too much Ca in my tap which causes Mg complications
> Believe me I wouldn't use tap if I didn't need to, RO is more time consuming & more expensive.


Ah, OK, gotcha. You're one of the few ppl who actually do need Cal-Mag or equivalent Ca & Mg supplementation. 



choempi said:


> My God!
> 
> Al B. Fuct!!
> 
> I love your threads!!


Heh, thanks.


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## cthroo (Feb 7, 2011)

Omg......dudes if u want to clean use hygrozyme. Bleech is bad it kill mycorrihza and nutrients. Y do think pot grows r/o there water or let the water sit for a couple days its to evaporate the chlorine. Omg. Just cause u don't see a differance doesn't mean your not losing out on a better garden. Commercial isn't top shelf!


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## hellraizer30 (Feb 7, 2011)

well Ive been on the side of H202 for a month adding 7ML per gal every 3 days and the res problems are still there.
H202 seems to keep it a bay but if I forget to add on the 3rd day bam shit shows up ph goes up, so Im thinking
bleach would work. and trust me ive tryed all the zyme shit on the market is a huge waist of money. some might
say your res temp is to high well 66 dagrees to hot hell no. my friends are like dude whats rong with your water?
well im not sure guess well waters fucked up, but there on city water and they never have res water issue! well
I think its due to the clorine in the city water, its the only conclusion I can come up with. So how about a happy
medium if there could be a long standing affect to your plants due to bleach why not just use it for a small aplacation
and then move to using H202 that from what Ive seen cant hurt your plants.


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## choempi (Feb 7, 2011)

I have used bleach for about 7 months with no problems, 6-8 drops per gallon, add back every 3 days.


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## hadatrn2growin (Feb 7, 2011)

so I have read all 10 pages of this thread, and only one post made any distinction between 'household' H202 (i.e around 3%) and 'hydro' store H2O2 at 29%. I am trying to build my knowledge base, as I am buying an aeroponic system, and find this thread fascinating. I am keeping my options open, both to bleach and Hydrogen Peroxide. I guess my question would be, are those that are using H2O2 using 3% or 29%?


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## hellraizer30 (Feb 7, 2011)

hadatrn2growin said:


> so I have read all 10 pages of this thread, and only one post made any distinction between 'household' H202 (i.e around 3%) and 'hydro' store H2O2 at 29%. I am trying to build my knowledge base, as I am buying an aeroponic system, and find this thread fascinating. I am keeping my options open, both to bleach and Hydrogen Peroxide. I guess my question would be, are those that are using H2O2 using 3% or 29%?


I use and also most peeps do to use the highest % you can get most use is 29% its about 20$ a gal
7ML per gal and add back every three days


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## hellraizer30 (Feb 7, 2011)

choempi said:


> I have used bleach for about 7 months with no problems, 6-8 drops per gallon, add back every 3 days.


choempi what if I have H202 in the res and dont want to do a res change can I add the bleach on top of the H202?


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## choempi (Feb 7, 2011)

hellraizer30 said:


> choempi what if I have H202 in the res and dont want to do a res change can I add the bleach on top of the H202?


Yes, h2o2 dissipates at a similar rate to bleach.


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## hellraizer30 (Feb 8, 2011)

ok so 6 drops per gal x 55gals =330 drops that seems like alot of bleach.


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## frogster (Feb 8, 2011)

I have had issues with roots from the start of my grow.. I used h202 at first, got slime anyways,, switched to beneficial teas etc and I still have issues... thinking of using the bleach but I am using humboldts product line,, Amino acid based nutrients (master a&B) not sure if this will will be good with this product line... Also using flavor (humic acid) .. Im currently following the Heisenburg thread ( beneficial bacteria) had a horrible outbreak when I added hygrozyme to my rez,, fucked up everything.. had to do a heavy flush with h202 to try and get things back . still not on track, 4thweek of bloom and plants only uptaking 1-2 gallons a day (30plants). Any opinions on using a amino acid based nute with Bleach? Thx... May switch to novaflora bloom or dynagro... way cheaper than the humbolts crap...


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## poindexterous (Feb 8, 2011)

I often had well rooted clones in my ez-clones die from what I assume was bad bacteria and/or fungi, I tried h2o2(29%) at all different doses and it never helped one tiny bit, but adding the equivalent of about two drops per gallon bleach totally solved it and I can now let my cutting roots reach the bottom of the ez-clone without troubles. I actually dissolved two grams of calcium hypochlorite pool shock in a gallon of water and added one ounce of that solution per gallon of rez water.


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## choempi (Feb 8, 2011)

hellraizer30 said:


> ok so 6 drops per gal x 55gals =330 drops that seems like alot of bleach.


figure how much it is one time in a measuring cup.


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## choempi (Feb 8, 2011)

frogster said:


> I have had issues with roots from the start of my grow.. I used h202 at first, got slime anyways,, switched to beneficial teas etc and I still have issues... thinking of using the bleach but I am using humboldts product line,, Amino acid based nutrients (master a&B) not sure if this will will be good with this product line... Also using flavor (humic acid) .. Im currently following the Heisenburg thread ( beneficial bacteria) had a horrible outbreak when I added hygrozyme to my rez,, fucked up everything.. had to do a heavy flush with h202 to try and get things back . still not on track, 4thweek of bloom and plants only uptaking 1-2 gallons a day (30plants). Any opinions on using a amino acid based nute with Bleach? Thx... May switch to novaflora bloom or dynagro... way cheaper than the humbolts crap...


Can not use with any organics.


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## frogster (Feb 8, 2011)

Im thinking of killing off the organics... ie..screw the microbes... And going back to a regular nutrient line,,, something simple , ie novaflora or dynagrow.......


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## choempi (Feb 8, 2011)

frogster said:


> Im thinking of killing off the organics... ie..screw the microbes... And going back to a regular nutrient line,,, something simple , ie novaflora or dynagrow.......


heard good things about dynagrow, I use a 3 part dry, vitagrow, works a charm and cheap as fuck. You get total control with a 3 part and it is not complicated, you just use the proportions and then use your ec or ppm to get a level, add back to bring the ec down every 3 or so days, change res when you have added back the rez capacity. I change out every 3 weeks. And of course PH is a given and most important, I go for 5.7-5.9 every feed...


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## choempi (Feb 8, 2011)

frogster said:


> Im thinking of killing off the organics... ie..screw the microbes... And going back to a regular nutrient line,,, something simple , ie novaflora or dynagrow.......


hydro is built for non organics


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## nothingtodeclare (Feb 9, 2011)

hey chomp could i use this stuff this is what it says copy an paste====
Sodium Percarbonate (Synonyms: Sodium Carbonate Peroxyhydrate, sodium carbonate peroxide, PCS) is a free-flowing powder with a common name of solid hydrogen peroxide, it is an addition compound of sodium carbonate and hydrogen peroxide. Percarbonate has an active available oxygen content (13%) which is equivalent to 27.5% Hydrogen peroxide. 
It breaks down to oxygen, water and sodium carbonate upon decomposition. It is an environmentally safe bleaching agent. 
Sodium Percarbonate offers many of the same functional benefits as liquid hydrogen peroxide. It dissolves into water rapidly to release oxygen and provides powerful cleaning, bleaching, stain removal and deodorizing capabilities in addition to being highly effective at killing bacteria, fungus, viruses and algae. It has the added advantage of no odour, non toxic, and non polluting.
so yes could i use instead of normal bleach outta supermarket any info would be great or from fatman if he still around i see on thc farmer that there is an abundance of peeps over there using bleach instead of h202


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## frogster (Feb 9, 2011)

Sounds just like h202 in solid form?? cant see a difference..both of us are too lazy to google this a.m apparently. This thread covers bleach usage,,, using that product would be more inline with al b fucts ideas for sanitation... Im sure he will chime in after he sees your post, Al seems to really love the h202... hey, cant deny results! What are the cost savings for this solid form over the liquid? ie. LINK to the product being sold...


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## nothingtodeclare (Feb 9, 2011)

its actually on the bay http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/5Kg-Sodium-Percarbonate-Pure-Oxygen-Bleach-/110644472509?pt=UK_HomeGarden_CLV_Cleaning_CA&hash=item19c2ecaabd it says you use in aquariums etc


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## frogster (Feb 9, 2011)

Good news,, Humboldts guru said Im fine with h202 or bleach with the nute line Im using ,, wont effect the chelated amino acid based Master part a&b nute line ... of course they have an organic line that it couldnt be used with .... so , away we go tonight with bleach.... fingers crossed...


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## frogster (Feb 9, 2011)

8 drops per gallon is 1/2ml with my dropper..... so for 50 gallons 25ml. every 2-3 days for maintenance amounts? sound right?.. Im using 6% clorox.... Someone posted 2.5tsp (12.5ml) is 2ppm in 50 gallons... so the 8drop per gallon should be 4ppm if using the same bleach.... lots of assumptions here..!


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## frogster (Feb 9, 2011)

Nothingtodeclare... Go for it,,, just mix according to the directions.. "As rule of thumb the dosage level should be one kilo of sodium percarbonate to treat between 14000 and 28000 litres of water." Tell us how it works out..lol.. Seriously regular h202 is pretty damn cheap,, even the $1 bottles of 3% at walmart.. If I were going with h202 thats what I would use, as I don't give a crap to mess with the 30-50% stuff... just not something to spill on myself IMO..


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## nothingtodeclare (Feb 10, 2011)

i want to use bleach but in uk an cant get chlorox, i can get get 3%,6% an 9% h2o2 at all my local pharmacy's been so many threads going on about the stabalizers init to increase shelf life, all the bleach including regular says it has some disinfectant or perfume added if you are in uk what type of bleach do you use????? i think i might just go the zone route as i had the slime ,the thing is its really cold an i can keep my res in the 50 degrees but still got slimed


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## choempi (Feb 10, 2011)

frogster said:


> 8 drops per gallon is 1/2ml with my dropper..... so for 50 gallons 25ml. every 2-3 days for maintenance amounts? sound right?.. Im using 6% clorox.... Someone posted 2.5tsp (12.5ml) is 2ppm in 50 gallons... so the 8drop per gallon should be 4ppm if using the same bleach.... lots of assumptions here..!


Fatman said 3ppm I believe


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## hellraizer30 (Feb 13, 2011)

well I went 6 drops per gal and 35 gal was 10 ml and all my problems are gone like magic and no negative signs on plants at all


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## choempi (Feb 13, 2011)

hellraizer30 said:


> well I went 6 drops per gal and 35 gal was 10 ml and all my problems are gone like magic and no negative signs on plants at all


Good for you, that is why I switched, it worked.

Never harmed any plants.


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## SnakierGrizzly (Feb 13, 2011)

i wouldn't do that


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## hellraizer30 (Feb 15, 2011)

SnakierGrizzly said:


> i wouldn't do that


well you go ahead an use whatever you use, but bleach rocks at the right dose
and if you read this hole threead you would see the bleach was my last resort,
I tryed everything and endless amounts of $ just to find out some basic
over the counter bleach works. say what you want hate how you want,
kinda like like saying pots bad for you but you never even tryed it


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## choempi (Feb 16, 2011)

hellraizer30 said:


> well you go ahead an use whatever you use, but bleach rocks at the right dose
> and if you read this hole threead you would see the bleach was my last resort,
> I tryed everything and endless amounts of $ just to find out some basic
> over the counter bleach works. say what you want hate how you want,
> kinda like like saying pots bad for you but you never even tryed it


I have yet to find one person say they tried bleach and it hurt their grow in any way, and you would think a thread like this would bring them out in force. I trusted Fatmans data, and am satisfied.


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## frogster (Feb 16, 2011)

Yep. worked for me.... first time i have had white roots that are growing larger since the issues!! Im even dosing heavy according to everything...


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## first be (Feb 17, 2011)

As rule of thumb the dosage level should be one kilo of sodium percarbonate to treat between 14000 and 28000 litres of water.I trusted Fatmans data, and am satisfied.


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## choempi (Feb 17, 2011)

frogster said:


> Yep. worked for me.... first time i have had white roots that are growing larger since the issues!! Im even dosing heavy according to everything...


It is not that hard, peeps just resist, that is cool.


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## hellraizer30 (Feb 19, 2011)

just a update been a week sinse I last added bleach and no sign of any bactira or algie or negative affect


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## thegreensurfer (Feb 19, 2011)

ive used it. no noticeable problems with plants. it didnt break up the algae embedded on my coco mat but it did keep everything else algae free & clean. 
no aquarium smell from the rez either


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## Tiger Woods (Feb 25, 2011)

Fatman says 1ml per 10 gallons but also says to add 6-8 drops per gallon for regular pathogen control and its also strong enough for root rot. Obviously those are to huge differences. A drop being 0.05 - 0.06 ml. That's approximatly 1/2 ml per gallon. I've been using the 1ml per 10 gallon. Now thinking I haven't been adding enough. Fucking root rot. I use aero btw.

I've tried Great White before and it kicked the shit out of the rot. Tried it again (yes for the same problem) and it didn't work. Said fuck it and switched back to a full line of chems.(dyna-gro bloom/grow and supps pro-tek/KLN w/ added clorox every 2 days). I've read by fatman to add every 12-24 hrs and thought that was bit excessive should I be adding the bleach more often ? The debate is still out on which is better IMO on H2o2 vs. Clorox?

All advice and opinions welcome


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## hellraizer30 (Feb 25, 2011)

im doing somthing deferent, im adding bleach to start the week 15ml for 55gal and at day 3 I add h202 at 7ML per gal, then to start the new week back to bleach
and is working fucking awsome


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## Tiger Woods (Feb 26, 2011)

Hellraizer- so it looks like you lean more towards the 6-8 drops per gallon rule ? how long have you been doing this? Keep us posted on the results.

Thanks


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## poindexterous (Feb 26, 2011)

I used to have frequent trouble in my ez-cloners with roots dying after the cutting were well rooted, and to a lesser degree cuttings not rooting due to bacteria. I have never once had H2O2 be of any help at all having tried it at various strengths many times. Chlorine on the other hand had immediate results keeping roots white and growing. I use dry pool shock(calcium hypochlorite) instead of liquid bleach. I dissolve 2 grams in a gallon of RO water and add one ounce of that per 5 gallons of rez water, and re-dose every 2nd to 3rd day. Not saying this is any better than liquid bleach just another way to do it. Also pool test strips are handy to actually know the ppm's of chlorine in ones rez, they measure between 0.5 to 10ppm.


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## hellraizer30 (Feb 26, 2011)

Tiger Woods said:


> Hellraizer- so it looks like you lean more towards the 6-8 drops per gallon rule ? how long have you been doing this? Keep us posted on the results.
> 
> Thanks


been three weeks now and all is great. you cant even smell the the bleach in there and no plant problems
6-8 is good ive seen and read that 10 drops are ok never done it


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## frogster (Mar 11, 2011)

When I change my nutes out (50 gallons) , I just add tap, and 15-20ml ... then I add 15ml every 3 days ,,, works great... screw h202 by itself... I kinda like the idea of using a alternating combo... interesting


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## hellraizer30 (Mar 11, 2011)

update seems bleach and H202 is keeping things at bay but not killing the bactiria in my res so im looking into DM-zone or sm90
just cant get this shit to die keeps poping back up!!! I still stand by the use of it plants look great just not geting a rid of the shit
in the res


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## choempi (Mar 11, 2011)

hellraizer30 said:


> update seems bleach and H202 is keeping things at bay but not killing the bactiria in my res so im looking into DM-zone or sm90
> just cant get this shit to die keeps poping back up!!! I still stand by the use of it plants look great just not geting a rid of the shit
> in the res


skip the h2o2


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## hellraizer30 (Mar 11, 2011)

tryed that to no luck


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## Tiger Woods (Mar 11, 2011)

Hellraizer- I feel your pain. I was debating on either DM zone or sm90 as well. I've chosen sm90 for the extra shit it can be used for(foilage spray exc..). Its pretty fucking high though. Also was considering buying Nutriboost(also a nutrilife product) but been thinking the sm90 should be enough with the addition of h2o2 inbetween rez. changes. Bleach did knock out my rot but 3+ weeks really set back my preptual, gotta have something I can rely on. I've found cold rez temps is really the way to go but I'll still be using a preventive.


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## hellraizer30 (Mar 11, 2011)

Tiger Woods said:


> Hellraizer- I feel your pain. I was debating on either DM zone or sm90 as well. I've chosen sm90 for the extra shit it can be used for(foilage spray exc..). Its pretty fucking high though. Also was considering buying Nutriboost(also a nutrilife product) but been thinking the sm90 should be enough with the addition of h2o2 inbetween rez. changes. Bleach did knock out my rot but 3+ weeks really set back my preptual, gotta have something I can rely on. I've found cold rez temps is really the way to go but I'll still be using a preventive.


yah my res temp in the 60s f so im thinking any colder will slow growth  how is the sm 90 working for you?


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## frogster (Mar 11, 2011)

Im perplexed... Bleach WILL kill your shit in the rez..KEEP ADDING!! . but I imagine if you have any bugs at all left and you put in a low amount of h2o2 , this will just feed that crap... "miricle grow" and hygrozyme,,, and molasses ARE NO-NO'S ALSO,,,


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## hellraizer30 (Mar 12, 2011)

guess I could slowly up the amount of bleach, il add 15ML next time and watch for negative/positive results


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## zero1776 (Mar 12, 2011)

I started using bleach after being advised by fatman. It eliminated the root rot problem I now use it as a preventitive and am able to run higher res. temps. with no problems. He knows his stuff.


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## choempi (Mar 12, 2011)

zero1776 said:


> I started using bleach after being advised by fatman. It eliminated the root rot problem I now use it as a preventitive and am able to run higher res. temps. with no problems. He knows his stuff.


totaly agree, though my res is 68 average, no smells or growths using only bleach


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## hellraizer30 (Mar 12, 2011)

not dising bleach at all just cant get rid of this shit in my res, its not causing root rot my roots are white and nice looking. just around the edges and on the foam 
I see blown slime. Im going to try some DM-zone when it come on order, but for now im going to up the amount of bleach to 15ml per 55gal, thats about 10drops
per gal. hope see a change


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## frogster (Mar 12, 2011)

That amount is fine,, I added 25ml to 50 gallons to fresh tap water (2ppm? chlorine?) when I first started using bleach.. it will work,,, your "upper ring" may not be getting wet .. use a strong dose and fill higher than normal to soak the rez wall that may have stuff sitting on it... or make a solution and spray the upper walls if you can.. im using reg. clorox... .. forgot the %... I posted it way earlier in this thread..


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## hellraizer30 (Mar 12, 2011)

frogster said:


> That amount is fine,, I added 25ml to 50 gallons to fresh tap water (2ppm? chlorine?) when I first started using bleach.. it will work,,, your "upper ring" may not be getting wet .. use a strong dose and fill higher than normal to soak the rez wall that may have stuff sitting on it... or make a solution and spray the upper walls if you can.. im using reg. clorox... .. forgot the %... I posted it way earlier in this thread..


25ml IN 50 GAL and no signs of negative plant growth? Il work up from my 10ml now to 15ml and keep going up


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## frogster (Mar 12, 2011)

No neg signs.. matter of fact my plants are getting fatter,, im in final weeks of flowering.. The 25ml was a one time shock,, when I switched .. I usually put in 15ml.. every couple of days,,, even when I did a rez change,, thats on top of the chlorine thats there already...


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## hellraizer30 (Mar 12, 2011)

frogster said:


> No neg signs.. matter of fact my plants are getting fatter,, im in final weeks of flowering.. The 25ml was a one time shock,, when I switched .. I usually put in 15ml.. every couple of days,,, even when I did a rez change,, thats on top of the chlorine thats there already...


ok cool beans man thanks!!


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## Serapis (Apr 7, 2011)

BUMP

This thread may solve my problems. My very first EZC run with 15 cuttings ended in disaster. All of the stems got slimed and turned brown. This was WHILE using EZC's new product "Clear Rez". Clear Rez has a bleach like smell to it. I just think the amount recommended to use was too light. I am going to give 6-8 drops of bleach per gallon a try this time...

To those that have posted they would get back t us, please post your results.


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## poindexterous (Apr 7, 2011)

Serapis said:


> BUMP
> 
> This thread may solve my problems. My very first EZC run with 15 cuttings ended in disaster. All of the stems got slimed and turned brown. This was WHILE using EZC's new product "Clear Rez". Clear Rez has a bleach like smell to it. I just think the amount recommended to use was too light. I am going to give 6-8 drops of bleach per gallon a try this time...
> 
> To those that have posted they would get back t us, please post your results.


I tested clear-rez with a pool test kit, and to make a solution of the same chlorine level either add 12ml 6% bleach, or 1gram pool shock, to a gallon of water. 

I doubled it and add 2gram pool shock per gal of water. Then I add an ounce of that solution per 5gal just like clear-rez, but more often, every other day or daily. So about one ounce in my 30 and two in my 60.

This has made all the difference in the survival of cuttings in my ez-clones. The 6-8 drops recommended in this thread is much stronger than the clear-rez, or my level, so maybe I should go stronger, but this has worked consistently so I'm happy so far. I wouldn't even bother to use ez-cloners anymore without chlorine.


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## Serapis (Apr 7, 2011)

That is exactly the type of post I wanted to see. My first run killed 15 beaut cuttings of Pineapple Express... All the stems got slimy and turned brown. I'll use 6-8 drops initially and then go to 4-5 for maintenance.


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## Serapis (Apr 7, 2011)

I sent my Dad to the Food Lion to get me some Clorox, he comes back with Smart Option Bleach... bleach is bleach right? No... the cheap no name shit only has 2.75 available chlorine... Now I'm debating 12 drops per gal?


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## poindexterous (Apr 7, 2011)

Serapis said:


> I sent my Dad to the Food Lion to get me some Clorox, he comes back with Smart Option Bleach... bleach is bleach right? No... the cheap no name shit only has 2.75 available chlorine... Now I'm debating 12 drops per gal?


Usually bleach is 6% sodium hypochlorite, but as long as it doesn't have perfumes or other additives should be fine, you could up the dose but it shouldn't matter, I'm at 1/10 the 6-8drop level and it's working. My last two batches of clones in my 30 and 60 were both 100% survival and very well rooted. Before chlorine it was really hit or miss, some would just fall over, some stayed up but turned yellow and didn't root, some rooted but died after. Chlorine was a total cure. Still strongly bleach the ez-cloners between batches. Also pool test strips are handy to know ppm of chlorine, "Aquacheck Pro 5-in-1" test strips are my favorite for this.


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## dlively11 (Apr 18, 2011)

poindexterous said:


> Usually bleach is 6% sodium hypochlorite, but as long as it doesn't have perfumes or other additives should be fine, you could up the dose but it shouldn't matter, I'm at 1/10 the 6-8drop level and it's working. My last two batches of clones in my 30 and 60 were both 100% survival and very well rooted. Before chlorine it was really hit or miss, some would just fall over, some stayed up but turned yellow and didn't root, some rooted but died after. Chlorine was a total cure. Still strongly bleach the ez-cloners between batches. Also pool test strips are handy to know ppm of chlorine, "Aquacheck Pro 5-in-1" test strips are my favorite for this.


I started using the pool shock as well. Much easier to deal with then straight bleach. I used 24 grams per gallon and add 1 teaspoon for every 5 gallons of water and add it every other day if I remember. I beleive its 2X as strong as Clear Rez.

You dont think that changing the water out between runs and using fresh foam inserts would be sufficient? I have a huge 120 site that holds 20 gal and would be a PITA to clean out where it is located. Seems like fresh water and a string dose of the stuff run through the system would clean it all out.


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## SlimDigital (Apr 18, 2011)

My babies turned white then I said let me try again with another batch....they turned white also. Ill stick w/H202!


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## poindexterous (Apr 18, 2011)

dlively11 said:


> I started using the pool shock as well. Much easier to deal with then straight bleach. I used 24 grams per gallon and add 1 teaspoon for every 5 gallons of water and add it every other day if I remember. I beleive its 2X as strong as Clear Rez.
> 
> You dont think that changing the water out between runs and using fresh foam inserts would be sufficient? I have a huge 120 site that holds 20 gal and would be a PITA to clean out where it is located. Seems like fresh water and a string dose of the stuff run through the system would clean it all out.


Hey D, 

I've been trying a bit higher also for my most current ez-clone batch, 5g/gal base and 1oz/5gal of it to rez, so that's equal to 30g/gal at the teaspoon per 5gal ratio, so pretty close to what you're doing. At about 10 days most are showing roots now, so this level seems to be fine.

As far as additional bleaching/cleaning between rounds, I still do it to be safe but it may not be necessary. I like to at least bleach the pump/manifold/nozzle assembly, where any gunk is most likely to be, but that can be submerged and run in a 5gal bucket of bleach solution which is easier than bleaching the whole thing. Also I bleach the foam inserts. But the plastic body probably needs no more than a hose rinsing. Trial and error will tell, many more cuttings to take and learn from...


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## poindexterous (Apr 18, 2011)

SlimDigital said:


> My babies turned white then I said let me try again with another batch....they turned white also. Ill stick w/H202!


Never heard of that before? You're saying the leaves turned white? The chlorine levels we're using are little higher than most city water so that shouldn't happen. Please elaborate on your method...


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## dlively11 (Apr 19, 2011)

poindexterous said:


> Never heard of that before? You're saying the leaves turned white? The chlorine levels we're using are little higher than most city water so that shouldn't happen. Please elaborate on your method...


I think he must have been joking, like clothes turn white etc....


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## dlively11 (Apr 19, 2011)

poindexterous said:


> Hey D,
> 
> I've been trying a bit higher also for my most current ez-clone batch, 5g/gal base and 1oz/5gal of it to rez, so that's equal to 30g/gal at the teaspoon per 5gal ratio, so pretty close to what you're doing. At about 10 days most are showing roots now, so this level seems to be fine.
> 
> As far as additional bleaching/cleaning between rounds, I still do it to be safe but it may not be necessary. I like to at least bleach the pump/manifold/nozzle assembly, where any gunk is most likely to be, but that can be submerged and run in a 5gal bucket of bleach solution which is easier than bleaching the whole thing. Also I bleach the foam inserts. But the plastic body probably needs no more than a hose rinsing. Trial and error will tell, many more cuttings to take and learn from...


 
Going to go with a higher dose myself now after reading this. In hydroponics especially a sterile enviroment is essential. Bennificial baterias are almost impossible in a true hydroponic system. Plus you dont really need anythig to help uptake of nutes etc since they are all already available. You just dont have the issues you have with soil with lockout etc. I say kill them all !! =)


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## choempi (Apr 19, 2011)

dlively11 said:


> Going to go with a higher dose myself now after reading this. In hydroponics especially a sterile enviroment is essential. Bennificial baterias are almost impossible in a true hydroponic system. Plus you dont really need anythig to help uptake of nutes etc since they are all already available. You just dont have the issues you have with soil with lockout etc. I say kill them all !! =)


My feelings also


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## sirtom68 (May 12, 2011)

I have glazed through his thread and may have missed something, but in adding 6 to 8 drops per gallon...is that drops from a dropper? I researched drops per mill and it seems like the standard measurement is 20 drops per mill. Is this the measure that everyone is using? If that is the case then please let me know. Or if I should use a dropper and not the milliliter measurement please let me know. The milliliter measure seems very weak to me but Im just not sure.  My res. temps reach the mid 80's and there is no way around it....PEACE


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## choempi (May 12, 2011)

sirtom68 said:


> I have glazed through his thread and may have missed something, but in adding 6 to 8 drops per gallon...is that drops from a dropper? I researched drops per mill and it seems like the standard measurement is 20 drops per mill. Is this the measure that everyone is using? If that is the case then please let me know. Or if I should use a dropper and not the milliliter measurement please let me know. The milliliter measure seems very weak to me but Im just not sure.  My res. temps reach the mid 80's and there is no way around it....PEACE


just a eye dropper


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## poindexterous (May 13, 2011)

sirtom68 said:


> I have glazed through his thread and may have missed something, but in adding 6 to 8 drops per gallon...is that drops from a dropper? I researched drops per mill and it seems like the standard measurement is 20 drops per mill. Is this the measure that everyone is using? If that is the case then please let me know. Or if I should use a dropper and not the milliliter measurement please let me know. The milliliter measure seems very weak to me but Im just not sure.  My res. temps reach the mid 80's and there is no way around it....PEACE


I just did a little test to figure this out, and the standard dropper from a tincture bottle that I have made exactly 24 drops from one ML of water. This test is easy with an accurate scale, just drop water from your dropper on your scale till it reads exactly one gram, which one ML/CC of pure water does. For someone with a hundred gallon rez I can see counting 600 to 800 drops will be tedious.


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## Livetowin (May 14, 2011)

i have been using 5 drops /gallon of 29% H2o2 with Organic nutrients (Technaflora and now PuraVida). What destruction is this supposed to have caused me?


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## outofbodyspecial (Jan 18, 2012)

Reviving this great thread...

I'm an h2o2 user, and after reading all 15 pages in this theread, I will shift to bleach after finishing my remaining h2o2. 

H2o2 is relatively cheap compared to nutes, but I noticed that I use up a lot, coz I use it in my hydro reservoir, and for general cleaning. Ofcourse water is what I use the most in hydro, next is h2o2. Not expensive, but not cheap either when used reguarly, so there's still room for savings.

Based on what I've seen in the stores, bleach (Zonrox, don't know %)is about half the price of h2o2 (6%). Not much right? But the difference is in the usage- for h2o2 I use 10ml/gal. For bleach it's only gonna be .4ml/gal! Do the math, I'm too lazy, lol!

I only touched on the economics of it, and will reserve further judgement until I've actually tried it.


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## hellraizer30 (Jan 18, 2012)

https://www.rollitup.org/dwc-bubbleponics/361430-dwc-root-slime-cure-aka.html

Go to this link there info on alteratives to bleach and h202 and there way better for your plant


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## blacktourmaline (Jan 22, 2012)

Found out where the slime like to hide! Make sure to pop off the back of any pumps where the cord goes in, there are all sort of nasty shit hiding in there. just realized that you can take them off. and scrub like hell!!!


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## dbkick (Jan 22, 2012)

I've personally used bleach one time with great results, the tops of my plants went a bright yellow for a couple days but after that the roots never looked better. I'm on the fence over the sterile res vrs. bennies just because I run both. sterile in flower and bennies in veg. My bleach experience came awhile back in veg when it was warmer out , I have no chiller in veg and wasn't running bennies and ended up with a slight slime. h2o2 did help but in the end bleach was the sure thing.


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## thereflex (Apr 7, 2012)

hey guys , this pythium blight is doing my head in ! i think i contracted it by bringing in an external cutting from a friend which had been grown in soil, i cloned his purple haze and put it in my nft system along with some others. it went yellow, and i had no clue what it was. 

bottom line. i ve bleached i add h202 , i am 1 year on and i have just spotted the dreaded yellow dropping leaves. looked in my DWC tank and yep theres slime on the roots
i have caught it early this time so i think i will be able to control it.

still its a real fucker. basically i am now coming to the conclusion that in order to completely erradicate my pythium root rot infestation is to TRASH everything. i mean EVERYTHING. keep the light and the tent that it
.

maybe evenb the grow room should be changed. completely new strain new everything.

because it infects your entire strain....so every future clone will have the pathogen attached . this is what i am experiencing now. 

i thought i got away with it

. i have done lots of reading and i have been adding bottles of frozen water to bring down the nute solition temp. also adding 30% h202 every few days. 

its been fine for 5 weeks of VEG growth, with excellent root colour massive roots. 

1 church plant and 1 cheese plant in the same DWC. i think the last 3 days the temps have got up and i havent added enough peroxide so now i am fucked. it there i def have the pythium developing.


i cropped 4.5 oz of nice bud of a white widow plant which was badly effected with pythium. this was grown in soil though. i used a little bleach that time. so i reckon i will try adding bleach aswell as filtering dead matter from the nute solution, as well as having an air stone, as well as adding ICE bottles every other day. I have 2 plants ready to go on a 9 week flowering period today. so hopefully the bleach h202 and ICE will help . plus i will try doing water changes with my new water pump, as i dont usually bother changing the reservoir for months! probly why i am in this situation. 

basically what i have read is that bleach will control pythium, h202 will do the same. and low temps, so adding ice! pythium spores only start breeding etc when the water is lukewarm. i think when the grow room gets above 32c then you got problems!


what i would like to know is? how much bleach is too much? what sign do i look for on the leaves will they burn>? will the yellowleaves start goin a nice healthy green again? if not too damaged.

i also read that its good to plunge your roots into a STRONg H202 solution for 20 mins
and remove any dead slimney brown roots. you could use a gentle jet spray on the roots maybe.

anyway i would prefer to control my infection than start again


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## fandango (Nov 12, 2012)

Thanks for the info...choempi!...I am going with your advice here...just wondering why al b fuct dis-agrees?


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## mountainboy (Nov 12, 2012)

fandango said:


> Thanks for the info...choempi!...I am going with your advice here...just wondering why al b fuct dis-agrees?


Hate to speak for Al B., but I'm sure he disagrees because hes right. He doesent base his answers on guessing. He is renowned for his great knowledge and his decades of experience. He bases everything on scientific fact. His results speak for themselves. If I where you,I would read some of Al's sticky's and research alot more b4 you jump on board with choempi. No offense choempi,but you aint no Al. not even close.


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## THZZELJR (Nov 15, 2012)

I ran an experiment with bleach on clones. 20gal tote clones from a flowering plant at 11 days into 12/12, in bubblecloner. a few of these clones were from tops others from smaller bottom growth. after 14 days roots are great. never changed water once simply added half cap of bleach every other day. one clone of 10 died.


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## FilthyFletch (Nov 15, 2012)

To each their own but for me I would not use bleach to grow. It is used to clean after a grow but you have to rinse very well as very small amount can kill young plants. Then this is considered an edible or smokeable herb unlike many greenhouses that grow decorative flowers so ingestion of residual bleach can cause lung burn and further health issues. The H202 used for these grows is a food grade certified mix and strength. It can burn your skin right out the bottle but once mixed it disapates quickly and does the job while the left over is broken down into o2 into the water while the hydrogen is used released as a by product.I tried to g over 20 plus years growing I have never encountered a o the links to read the articles but they are not valid links and you get the yahoo error if you click them. me personally in over 20 years of growing have never seen a grower of edibles or smokeables use bleach during an active grow. The basis also follows the fact bleach will kill fungus , mold, bacteria, and algae ie all plants in their own right so to think that which is used to kill plants and those things that may benefit plants doesn't make sense to me. I do love Gro-tech super H202 myself but would never use pure cholrine bleach or smoke anything grown with it...Just the thought of the taste transfer makes me wanna vomit.


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## THZZELJR (Nov 15, 2012)

just something to think about algae are not plants. Any chemical can kill a plant including nitrogen phosphorus potassium. you drink bleach every single day if you live in America. I want a sterile environment so I am now switching to bleach. the plant will break down bleach it wont be sprayed directly on buds. bleach is simply sodium hydrochlorite salt and sodium water. it will redox with organic material and become innate. lots of fruits including tomatoes are curing by dipping in bleach. seeds are soaked in bleach of all types of fruits and vegetables. as well as some truly scary chemicals such as formaldehyde. and I just found sodium bicarbonate (baking soda) has fungicide properties as well especially useful for powdery mildew. A priori knowledge is not suitable to me though after reading give it try and see.
http://pnwhandbooks.org/plantdisease/node/6190/print
http://agriculturalindustry.info/Plant/Seed-liquor-processing-method-of-nine-14608.html#.UKWqOoZzVX8
http://www.hort.uconn.edu/ipm/homegrnd/htms/51pmorn.htm


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## THZZELJR (Nov 18, 2012)

found some research into every aspect of a healthy res: benes, sterilization. http://www.manicbotanix.com/hydroponic-grow-guide/root-disease-prevention-in-hydroponics.html?start=3
Also found the active ingredient of Clear Rez to be chlorine




WARNING - DO NOT USE OXIDANTS WITH ORGANIC MEDIAS OR ORGANIC ADDITIVES: monochloramine, chlorine and hydrogen peroxide are not suitable for use where organic media (e.g. coco substrate) or organic additives are used. These products are oxidants and oxidants break down organic matter.


Monochloramine in Hydroponics


Inorganic chloramines such as monochloramine are formed when chlorine and ammonia are combined in water. One of the key uses for monochloramine is it is used for disinfecting mains water supplies.


Monochloramine is an oxidant. It kills bacteria by penetration of the cell wall and blockage of the metabolism. Monochloramine is considered to have moderate biocidal activity against bacteria.1 While there are more effective products available for eradicating bacteria (e.g. chlorine) these have been deemed unsuitable for use in treating mains water supplies due to the byproducts they form when interacting with organic matter.2 Monochloramine hydrolyses (breaks down) slowly in aqueous solutions, producing hypochlorite (at alkaline pH) or hypochlorous acid (at acid pH).3


Research into the use of monochloramine in other areas suggests that where bacteria are able to attach to surfaces this provides a primary means for bacteria to survive disinfection. Research of K. pneumoniae grown in a high-nutrient medium attached to glass microscope slides demonstrated a 150-fold increase in disinfection resistance.4


Similar findings have been demonstrated in nursery fertigation systems where organic debris or particles prevented direct contact of chlorine (not to be confused monochloramine) with fungal propagules (Phytophthora spp.) and as a result reduced chlorine efficiency.5


This may have implications in hydroponic systems where hosing, pipes, pots, drip emitters and, for that matter, media may offer pathogens protection.


Because monochloramine hydrolyzes (dissipates) slowly careful use is advised. I.e. monochloramine is an oxidant and overuse can result in build up, resulting in fine root hair burning, which will reduce nutrient uptake.


*Use of Chlorine (not to be confused with monochloramine) in Hydroponics*


A handy tip. Monochloramine sold through the hydro industry can be replaced by chlorine at greatly reduced cost.


*Chlorine (Cl) is demonstrated to be a more effective sterilizing agent than monochloramine.1*


*Research has demonstrated that 0.5ppm (780 mV) of chlorine in greenhouse irrigation systems at pH 6.0 eliminated Phytophthora sp., Fusarium sp. and bacteria within 0.5 minutes of contact time.2 Chlorine efficiency is pH dependent and efficiency at pH 6.0 &#8211; 7.5 has been shown to be the ideal (maximum efficiency of chlorine is 6.5). Below pH 6.0 and toxic chlorine gas will be released. Because optimum pH in hydroponics is pH 5.8 &#8211; 6.0 this makes chlorine ideal as an effective and low cost sterilizing agent.*


*Products such as sodium hypochlorite (liquid typically 12.5% chlorine), calcium hypochlorite (bleaching powder/pool chlorine = approx 65% Cl), and chlorine dioxide are cheap sources of chlorine. Take for example calcium hypochlorite at 65% available chlorine. To achieve 0.5ppm chlorine in 100L of solution 0.08 grams would be required. This would mean that 250 grams of sodium hypochlorite would be good for 3125 treatments. The cost of 250grams of sodium hypochlorite is approximately £12.00 in the UK (in small volume purchased online &#8211; far cheaper in volume) or less than $20 USD. Now consider this; you would use only 14.6 grams a year to treat 100L every two days, so 17 years of chlorine treatment would cost less than $20.00 USD. When you consider that a 1L monochloramine product is sold through UK hydroponic stores for £30.00 - £34.99 ($49.00 -$57.00 USD) and is used at 0.2mL/L (50 treatments of 100L) the use of chlorine over monochloramine represents massive savings.*


*Chlorine - Potential Toxicity to Plants*
*

Chlorine obviously has some potential toxicity (phytotoxicity) issues associated to plants, if used at excessive levels &#8211; as does monochloramine and hydrogen peroxide. Sensitive plants such as lettuce may be detrimentally affected if chlorine is present in solution at even 1ppm. Less sensitive plants will be tolerant to higher levels.

Research has demonstrated that 2ppm of chlorine at riser outlet, in fertigation systems poses little or no risk of toxicity to the majority of ornamental crops.3 This indicates that treatment with 0.5ppm of chlorine poses very little risk to even sensitive plants.
*

Treatment

Chlorine hydrolyzes (dissipates) more quickly than monochloramine and, therefore, treatment should take place every two days. Directly after treatment the chlorinated nutrient should be cycled through the growing system to ensure pipes, pots, channels and media are adequately sterilized.


Measuring Chlorine in Solution


ORP Meters

It&#8217;s important to note that simply adding oxidants such monochloramine, chlorine and hydrogen peroxide to solution and hoping for the best can only be described as entering the realms of hydro cowboy country. Numerous factors will influence the levels of oxidant (e.g. temp, pH, ionic strength, organic content, dissipation rates, and existing chlorine or monochloramine in the water supply).

The most efficient means of accurately monitoring oxidant levels is through the use of an ORP meter.

ORP is a measurement of &#8216;Oxidation Reduction Potential&#8217; (mV) most commonly used to measure the effectiveness of water disinfection systems using sanitizers such as chlorine, bromine, ozone, peroxyacetic acid, hydrogen peroxide etc. ORP standards have been long established for water sanitation and are recommended over ppm measurements with traditional test kits. ORP meters are relatively inexpensive (a handheld pen meter should set you back approximately $100 -150 USD) and easy to operate and should be an essential piece of equipment for people using a chlorination system in hydroponics. Optimal ORP for Pythium control with chlorine = 780 mV at pH 6.0


Desired Chlorine in Solution: 0.5ppm &#8211; 780 mV

Optimum pH for chlorine treatment in hydroponics: 6.0 (below pH 6.0 will release chlorine gas &#8211; above pH 6.0 is less than optimal for nutrient uptake)

Treatment: every two days &#8211; if using an ORP meter maintain at 780 mV


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## oceangreen (Nov 19, 2012)

neither, use pondzyme, aquasheild, ect.


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## Nizza (Nov 20, 2012)

theres a cool product called S.O.S. check it  http://www.superorganicstimulator.com/


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## skunkd0c (Nov 20, 2012)

thegreensurfer said:


> I am attacking the algae from 2 angles & have indeed covered the mat with foil in addition to adding the bleach.
> Does anyone else think bleach will have no affects on algae?
> How long should it take for the algae to disappear?


algae will not harm your plants, but it does look ugly i guess, and could possibly help to block pumps etc
is this bleach addition for cosmetic value, i am aware dwc growers like to show off their root systems for some strange reason ?


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## marcy (Nov 21, 2012)

Sorry skunkd0c but I have to disagree.. Algae WILL harm your plants! I had a light leak in my dwc tank and got algae and the algae eats up your nutes and your plant don't get them, I no this from experience I got really bad nute lock out and had to clean tank,roots,air lines, air stones everything. Back on to the subject I have a really good grow book at home by a well none grower and it says in there you CAN use bleach and people have done for years but I'm the same as you lot I would much prefer to buy h2o2 just the fact of putting bleach in wouldn't make me sleep at night lol


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## glann (Dec 14, 2012)

THZZELJR said:


> found some research into every aspect of a healthy res: benes, sterilization. http://www.manicbotanix.com/hydroponic-grow-guide/root-disease-prevention-in-hydroponics.html?start=3
> Also found the active ingredient of Clear Rez to be chlorine
> 
> 
> ...


does anyone use an ORP meter? I just got one and would like to discuss experiences.


also...kind of funny, but umm.... i stumbled upon this experiment some kid did. I know cannabis isnt grass, but check it lol.

https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1y95-0ZjOf2S4FBds8UDOp0rOW_KNFSlswkE5VqgLf2M/embed?hl=en&size=s#slide=id.p20


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## ringlead3r (Dec 14, 2012)

Algae will only effect plants if you have a decent amount of algae small amounts really doesnt do much.. I've never had a bunch of algae, but I've notice no difference from a batch with very little algae and a batch with no algae.


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## choempi (Dec 17, 2012)

ringlead3r said:


> Algae will only effect plants if you have a decent amount of algae small amounts really doesnt do much.. I've never had a bunch of algae, but I've notice no difference from a batch with very little algae and a batch with no algae.


algae in hydro is not good, bleach works, it is only a very small amount 1ml gal or less. Better to get the setup right by eliminating any lingering fluid in the tub, I have no problems long time, but bleach does keep the hydro clean if u have a prob.


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## Gifted0ne (Aug 9, 2013)

Does anyone know why plants including cannabis outdoor fed with nothing but soil and 100% organic fertilizers are fed with this chlorine tap water (california area you can smell it in the water) and grow perfectly fine and healthy.. Specially looking at all the fruits and vegetables that are grown with tap, just curious where the nutrients are coming from since the beneficials are being wiped out according to ev 1 here.


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## karmeron (Aug 9, 2013)

Gifted0ne said:


> Does anyone know why plants including cannabis outdoor fed with nothing but soil and 100% organic fertilizers are fed with this chlorine tap water (california area you can smell it in the water) and grow perfectly fine and healthy.. Specially looking at all the fruits and vegetables that are grown with tap, just curious where the nutrients are coming from since the beneficials are being wiped out according to ev 1 here.




The ppms of chlorine in drinking water is so low that it doesnt really affect benificals as much as youd think. If they were they would do the cells in our body harm also, considering a lot of people drink litres of it everyday.


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## Gifted0ne (Aug 9, 2013)

Ahh so as i suspected a bit of this info with regards to beneficials and organics incompatible to chlorine just isnt the case. So seems that acids and enzymes still activate nutrient availability in soil with chlorine, so i suppose chlorine should be pretty standard in aeroponics etc.


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## HeartlandHank (Aug 9, 2013)

Gifted0ne said:


> Does anyone know why plants including cannabis outdoor fed with nothing but soil and 100% organic fertilizers are fed with this chlorine tap water (california area you can smell it in the water) and grow perfectly fine and healthy.. Specially looking at all the fruits and vegetables that are grown with tap, just curious where the nutrients are coming from since the beneficials are being wiped out *according to ev 1 here*.


There is no everyone here. Tons of opinions here on RIU... I kinda sense some pissy flavor in your post. No? If so, apologies.
Kinda like, you're not asking a question. You're making a point.

I agree. I don't think it is enough to kill everything in your soil.
It's like in my aquaponic system... I top it off frequently so I never add so much tap water that the chlorine kills off my bacterias/bio filter.
You can take it super far and feel good sleeping at night or you can say fuck it and just do what is easy. Either way, cannabis is a very easy plant to grow. You'll get buds with a little effort.


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## Gifted0ne (Aug 9, 2013)

HeartlandHank said:


> There is no everyone here. Tons of opinions here on RIU... I kinda sense some pissy flavor in your post. No? If so, apologies.
> Kinda like, you're not asking a question. You're making a point.
> 
> I agree. I don't think it is enough to kill everything in your soil.
> ...


No i just started using bleach for first time 2 days ago, ive been reading as much as i could and realized some pretty consistent misleading info.


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## needlesnpins (Aug 25, 2013)

^^The deeper you dig the worse it gets...

I just put in 2/ml per gallon of clorox..i had 3ppms of free chlorine (according to test strip) for about 20 mins then it fell back down to .5 ...BUT Bromine levels stayed around 10ppm ... who knows anything about the relation of the two? i don't wanna fry them


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## Amas (Nov 7, 2013)

Some thoughts....

Chlorine is far more reactive than bromine

Chlorine was used up by reacting with pathogens i.e. bacteria and fungi

So I would say it is doing it's job.


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## Frosty125 (Nov 7, 2013)

My 2 cents dont use bleach. Does it sound healthy since i assume you're going to be ingesting this stuff into your body.


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## Amas (Nov 10, 2013)

Frosty125 said:


> My 2 cents dont use bleach. Does it sound healthy since i assume you're going to be ingesting this stuff into your body.


Yes, bleach is healthy. The FDA recommends using it to disinfect drinking water in some situations. 



http://www.fda.gov/Food/ResourcesForYou/Consumers/ucm077029.htm said:


> If bottled water is unavailable and boiling water is not possible, then drinking water can be made by adding 1/8 teaspoon (or 8 drops) of regular, unscented, liquid household bleach to 1 gallon water.


Also you have to realize that just because bleach is put into the reservoir, does not mean that the bleach molecule remains intact inside the plant.
In fact, bleach dissociates into Na+ and OCl- and only some of the hypochlorite ions are transported into the plant itself where they are eventually metabolized.


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## JohnnySocko (Nov 14, 2013)

Amas said:


> Yes, bleach is healthy. The FDA recommends using it to disinfect drinking water in some situations.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


revising an old thread but +rep anyway .... the amount of ignorance & misinformation from uninformed amateur alarmist is a bit much on these forums...

...although personally I know little to nothing about chemistry, I do know that anyone who uses H2O2 and/or chlorinated water with muny tap and then turns around and blasphemies bleach, are either ignorant or uniformed and obviously know less about chemistry than I do....

Organic very likely works (I don't practice it but the logic is sound)
Bennies work (obviously)
...and 
the Sterile res/bleach/physan 2/et also works...none of the aforementioned chems are really all that systemic....


(I do agree we should watch what goes in our crops, but damn, enough already)


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## Rexdog (Mar 6, 2014)

In an ebb and flow system the roots are highly oxygenated as they're basically hanging in the air most of the day during the ebb, thus the name aeroponics 

In other systems where the roots remain submerged continuously, getting oxygen to the roots and preventing anaerobic conditions is a problem, especially if the water temperature exceeds 68 - 70 degrees. The amount of dissolved oxygen that water can hold decreases with increasing temperature. That is why chillers are sometimes employed in these closed systems to keep the water temperature down. In addition, hydrogen peroxide (H2O2) is used as a disinfectant as it has a spare oxygen present and saturates the water with oxygen. It can be an expensive proposition at $18 per gallon. There are no by products as once it loses the spare oxygen it is then H2O or water.

In the ebb and flow systems dissolved oxygen and water temperature are not of great concern due to the presence of air during a majority of the daily cycles. That is why this method is gaining in popularity as it has fewer variables/problems. In 55 gallon reservoirs using a mineral fertilizer i.e. Kind Base, Kind Grow, Kind Boom, chlorine is the chemical of choice to control slime, algae, and other organisms. Household bleach contains 4 to 6% chlorine and is cheap and readily available. Adding 5ml of bleach to a 55 gallon reservoir will result in a chlorine residual of <0.5 ppm. 10ml added to the same reservoir will keep the residual below 1.0 ppm. 

The best practice is to wait until the water is pumped back to the reservoirs where it will sit for several hours before gravity flowing back to the plant containers. This provides excellent contact time for the chlorine to do its job. It will generally, depending on the organic loading in the water, dissipate to zero before flowing back to the plants - an added safety measure. The buildup of salts or chlorinated compounds is negligible as the reservoirs are drained and refilled every 2 to 3 weeks.

Check the math you find on here I read where a 2% chlorine solution equals 200ppm. It equals 20,000ppm! ( 1,000,000ppm x .02 = 20,000) That dose will kill anything. Be careful!


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## Daithy (Jul 9, 2014)

How's the bleach going on for everyone? I hope it ain't gonna kill my plants. I have tried and put 0.8 ml per gal. Hope I won't regret it.


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## adower (Jul 9, 2014)

Ive used it for 5 years. Although i use 1ml/gal.


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## Daithy (Jul 9, 2014)

adower said:


> Ive used it for 5 years. Although i use 1ml/gal.


Thanks double


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## mmjmon (Jul 9, 2014)

All of this reading of bleach and oxygen reminds me of the OxiClean commercial. Anyone want to slap me around for asking if it's usable?.....even though I doubt it...sort of...


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## xwant2LeaRNx (Jul 9, 2014)

mmjmon said:


> All of this reading of bleach and oxygen reminds me of the OxiClean commercial. Anyone want to slap me around for asking if it's usable?.....even though I doubt it...sort of...


Yea its usable ive swapped out h202 for bleach long ago and will never look back. Saves allot. Bleach is derived from chlorine and plants actually uptake chlorine. The amount used wont hurt your roots i dose my resevoirs every 3 days with 1 ml per gallon. Seems to me the day after they get the bleach there really perky. If you were to smell my res right now it smells like a washing machine full of whites with bleach. I use clorox


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## xwant2LeaRNx (Jul 9, 2014)

*Chlorine*
Chlorine, as compounded chloride, is necessary for osmosis and ionic balance; it also plays a role in photosynthesis. This is from wikipedia


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## clownbow (Jul 11, 2014)

frogster said:


> When I change my nutes out (50 gallons) , I just add tap, and 15-20ml ... then I add 15ml every 3 days ,,, works great... screw h202 by itself... I kinda like the idea of using a alternating combo... interesting



do not use bleach and h2o together they countr act with each other ..also bleach will start gassing off at a pH under 6.0 .....bleach at pH of 6.0 will kill off everything in 30 seconds ...I learned this information along time ago from a website I do not remember the link but it is all scientifically proven


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## clownbow (Jul 11, 2014)

hellraizer30 said:


> update seems bleach and H202 is keeping things at bay but not killing the bactiria in my res so im looking into DM-zone or sm90
> just cant get this shit to die keeps poping back up!!! I still stand by the use of it plants look great just not geting a rid of the shit
> in the res


h2o and bleach do not work together have to pick one or the other but I do not believe h2o works very wellI i had your same problem plants were going good but the h2o2 would never kill everything


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## clownbow (Jul 11, 2014)

hellraizer30 said:


> yah my res temp in the 60s f so im thinking any colder will slow growth  how is the sm 90 working for you?



SM 90 is not a sterilising agent it will not get rid of root rot


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## Daithy (Jul 11, 2014)

THZZELJR said:


> found some research into every aspect of a healthy res: benes, sterilization. http://www.manicbotanix.com/hydroponic-grow-guide/root-disease-prevention-in-hydroponics.html?start=3
> 
> 
> 
> Treatment: every two days &#8211; if using an ORP meter maintain at 780 mV


My first week using bleach to fight smelly reservoir. After cleansing and cleaning I dared to use bleach, 0.5 ml/gal. Everything was immaculate. However, now on the 3rd day I got a pH fluctuation and the rez started to look cloudy. I was dumbfounded, but now I am realising that it MAY be because chlorine evaporates. Then I saw this. Will I be okay treating the res with 0.5 ml/gal of bleach every 2 days?

Also, bleach is not a 100% Chlorine, it may have some other substances.


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## bradburry (Oct 30, 2014)

xwant2LeaRNx said:


> Yea its usable ive swapped out h202 for bleach long ago and will never look back. Saves allot. Bleach is derived from chlorine and plants actually uptake chlorine. The amount used wont hurt your roots i dose my resevoirs every 3 days with 1 ml per gallon. Seems to me the day after they get the bleach there really perky. If you were to smell my res right now it smells like a washing machine full of whites with bleach. I use clorox


 is this true with the bleach ? what bleach would i use the thin or thick stuff


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## bradburry (Oct 30, 2014)

Dropastone said:


> I haven't tried it yet but my buddy uses 8 drops per gallon and has had no ill effects and claims his roots are whiter than ever. He got the tip from a guy that works at a professional greenhouse. According to him that's what they use and they've been doing it for years to keep the roots clean and healthy.
> 
> 
> Hope this helps you out.
> ...


 this helps greatly .......i am converted


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## bradburry (Oct 30, 2014)

fatman7574 said:


> *Blah sa, blah sa, blah. Most chlorine bleachs sold for laundry use do not contain anything but Chlorine and sodium from sodium hypochlorite plus water. Yes thare are chlorine cleaning products that contain many other ingrediants, such as toilet bowl, counter and tile cleaners etc. Just look at the labels. You want unscented houshold strength chlorine bleach such as Chlorox brand (not lemon scented) Regular Bleach. The same plain old Chlorox bleach that has been sold since 1913. A gallon would last the typical hobby grower a life time if used only for growing. *http://www.clorox.com/products/overview.php?prod_id=clb


 another post thats converted me....thanks


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## Yodaweed (Nov 2, 2014)

fatman7574 said:


> Hydgrozyme is really made for organic nutrients and soil grows. While you can use it with chemical nutrients you are turning a near sterile and clean nutrient/growing system back into a bacterial/enzyme/pathogen laden system. Sort a step backward. One of the huge advantages of a hydroponic system is eliminating the presence of bacteria and enzynes by using nutrients that prevent their need. Hydroponic chemical nutrients preclude the need for bacteria or enzymes for nutrient uptake availability. Chlorine then prevents the growth or even the presence of nearly all bacteria/pathogens. Hygrozyme creates conditions supportive of bacteria and pathogens. It is sorta like adding the bacteria needed to process waste in a waste water (sewage) treatment plant to a drinking water treatment plant. IE a step backward or a step in the wrong direction. In a waste water treatment plant you need loads of bacteria to break down organic nutrients just as in an organic nutrient reservoir. In a drinking water plant all the organic nutrients were broken down before they entered the drinking water treament plant (as in a chemical nutrient reservoir) therefore a disinfectant (chlorine) is used to kill nearly al (99% to 99.9%) of all bacteria present as most bacteria are harmful rather than helpful. Hygrozyme is reputed to contain "0NE" helpful bacteria but it's use encourages conditions supportive of many non helpful bacteria and pathogens. This basically means unless you plan to empty and clean your reservoir very often and flush the sytem with H2O2 or chlorine to kill all bacteria, enzymes and pathogens to get rid of all the non beneficial ones, then you are providing a very bacterial, and pathogen laden sytem for the plants roots to deal. This mans you are expecting a "beneficial bacteria" to actually grow faster then them and take a larger proportion of the food available and therfore keep the "bad bacteria and pathogens" at low levels. Not gonna happen. Last I heard the hygrozyme people even quit adding the beneficial bacteria and are now just selling straight chicken manure water leachings. IE an organic fertilizer.


Its not hydrozyme its hygrozyme. And it is the same as sensizyme the product RECOMMENDED by AN to use with their line up.


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## tomigreen (Jun 26, 2015)

adower said:


> Ive used it for 5 years. Although i use 1ml/gal.


Hi all, can you tell us , if you applly dis dossage every day, or every how many days?? thanks.


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## budafinger (Nov 6, 2015)

Looking all over the net I'm finding conflicting rates at which I should be running bleach in my res, some people use as little as 0.25ml per gallon (U.S) while others are saying upto 1.5ml? I'm guessing as most people suggest every 2-3 days it will need repeating. I'm just curious to see how much people use and how frequent? Any input would be helpful, thanks


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## blackforest (Nov 6, 2015)

I don't have the balls to do it, but I use this simple green pro3 to clean my room/tent, and I've always wondered if it would work in a hydro system...


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## redi jedi (Nov 6, 2015)

budafinger said:


> Looking all over the net I'm finding conflicting rates at which I should be running bleach in my res, some people use as little as 0.25ml per gallon (U.S) while others are saying upto 1.5ml? I'm guessing as most people suggest every 2-3 days it will need repeating. I'm just curious to see how much people use and how frequent? Any input would be helpful, thanks


That's mostly due to everyones water quality being different, or specifically how much bacteria is in the water.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 6, 2015)

Calcium hypochlorite over bleach any day. It's known as pool shock.


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## budafinger (Nov 7, 2015)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Calcium hypochlorite over bleach any day. It's known as pool shock.


Any recommendations on using pool shock?


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## Budley Doright (Nov 8, 2015)

mmjmon said:


> All of this reading of bleach and oxygen reminds me of the OxiClean commercial. Anyone want to slap me around for asking if it's usable?.....even though I doubt it...sort of...


Slap,slap, slap ..... Actually I have no clue...lol. check to see what's in it, if not pure bleach I would not. But hey I was not even sure about the bleach until two weeks ago lol.


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## Michael Huntherz (Nov 8, 2015)

Frosty125 said:


> My 2 cents dont use bleach. Does it sound healthy since i assume you're going to be ingesting this stuff into your body.


This is an incredibly ignorant thing to assert. Keep your two pence.


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## Budley Doright (Nov 8, 2015)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Calcium hypochlorite over bleach any day. It's known as pool shock.


Why? I have both but just found adding the 5% liquid was easier than mixing my powdered shock. Is the shock better? What's the difference


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 8, 2015)

budafinger said:


> Any recommendations on using pool shock?





Budley Doright said:


> Why? I have both but just found adding the 5% liquid was easier than mixing my powdered shock. Is the shock better? What's the difference


1. It's calcium based. Giving your plants atleast some form of nutrients they can use too. 
2. Breaks down much slower than bleach. 
3. Cheap as shit. 

Take one gram of pool shock, put it into a gallon of water. This is the exact same thing as ClearRez at this time. Concentrated to around 250 ppms. Now take 20 ml of that solution per gallon of water you want to treat. repeat once a week. Done. Sterile no worries.


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## budafinger (Nov 8, 2015)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> 1. It's calcium based. Giving your plants atleast some form of nutrients they can use too.
> 2. Breaks down much slower than bleach.
> 3. Cheap as shit.
> 
> Take one gram of pool shock, put it into a gallon of water. This is the exact same thing as ClearRez at this time. Concentrated to around 250 ppms. Now take 20 ml of that solution per gallon of water you want to treat. repeat once a week. Done. Sterile no worries.


20 ml per gallon? Seems quite a lot, anyone else used as much as this with good results? My res is a total of 12 gallon which would mean putting 240ml per week? Surely at that strength it'd be toxic to plants?


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## Budley Doright (Nov 8, 2015)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Calcium hypochlorite over bleach any day. It's known as pool shock.


My bleach is Calcium hypochlorite, at least that's what the bottle say's. So it seems it's the same as pool shock .


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## Budley Doright (Nov 8, 2015)

I have been using 15ml per 100L but think that's pretty strong, it's 5% btw.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 8, 2015)

budafinger said:


> 20 ml per gallon? Seems quite a lot, anyone else used as much as this with good results? My res is a total of 12 gallon which would mean putting 240ml per week? Surely at that strength it'd be toxic to plants?


It's like 1-2 ppms at the absolute most.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 8, 2015)

Budley Doright said:


> My bleach is Calcium hypochlorite, at least that's what the bottle say's. So it seems it's the same as pool shock .


The powder is 52-71% depending on brand. And is like $13 for a kilo. So for 13 bucks you can treat 198,000 gallons of water. (3960/20=198, 1 gram per gallon, 1000 gram package. 198x1000=198000)


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 8, 2015)

budafinger said:


> 20 ml per gallon? Seems quite a lot, anyone else used as much as this with good results? My res is a total of 12 gallon which would mean putting 240ml per week? Surely at that strength it'd be toxic to plants?


1 gram per gallon give you roughly 250 ppms. (Starting water RO) you then use that as a concentrate as 20 ml per gallon. That 20 mls is roughly 0.5% of that gallon. So then you take the 250ppm concentrate and multiply it by .005 giving 1.25 ppms.


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## Budley Doright (Nov 8, 2015)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> The powder is 52-71% depending on brand. And is like $13 for a kilo. So for 13 bucks you can treat 198,000 gallons of water. (3960/20=198, 1 gram per gallon, 1000 gram package. 198x1000=198000)


So it's the same thing, just cheaper? ?? Well my bleach cost $3 for 3L and I use 15ml at the most and 3 -5ml for maintenance so thats pretty cheap as well at 1000 treatments. But hey I guess it is cheaper lol. Like I said I have both, might just stick with the premixed stuff lol.


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## bird mcbride (Nov 8, 2015)

It appears as though non adulterated chlorine bleach is a winner...in the hydro section that is


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## bird mcbride (Nov 8, 2015)

By the way...the upper res on my 3' ebb and flo table is the stainless steel tub from a washing machine I love wash machine parts.


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## Budley Doright (Nov 8, 2015)

I have read that .5 ppm is what you want for preventative maintenance, 2 is the max,


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 9, 2015)

Budley Doright said:


> I have read that .5 ppm is what you want for preventative maintenance, 2 is the max,


All that information was sourced from my time working at commercial lettuce greenhouse. We ran those exact numbers to keep things sterile. It's crazy the cost cutting steps they take in commercial food production without a single loss of production. Our community could learn a lot from their methods.


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## bird mcbride (Nov 9, 2015)

If you only have a ph meter you can ph down a half point lower than bring the water up the half point with the bleach, then check the numbers in this thread and compare. I scale every thing with a good set of digital scales. I've never used a ppm meter and I'm interested in giving everyone a more accurate info with the ph kit calibrated with a ph formula Anyone?


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## Budley Doright (Nov 10, 2015)

bird mcbride said:


> If you only have a ph meter you can ph down a half point lower than bring the water up the half point with the bleach, then check the numbers in this thread and compare. I scale every thing with a good set of digital scales. I've never used a ppm meter and I'm interested in giving everyone a more accurate info with the ph kit calibrated with a ph formula Anyone?


You measure the amount of bleach by PH readings? How much bleach is needed to raise say 20 gallons .5?


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## bird mcbride (Nov 11, 2015)

I don't have a ppm meter and I'm guessing the water supply might play a role in how much bleach. I do everything with a ph test kit and point scales. City water is already treated so I guess that would play a role also. When I'm making a new mix for the res I do one gallon then I scale it to the res. Any known mixes are written on the wall I don't feel I need other equipment because even if I'm starting in a new location I start the fert level out in the res at 1/6 as recommended for outside use. Until the last decade even horticulturist didn't realize that altitute and climate play an important factor in fertilizer dissipitation. This is why there is not a one size fits all. Then I fine tune it incrementally until the plants come out right. When the res is swapped out and everything is fine it all goes to the green room and used once then disgarded. Proven res water is better for the moms and clones. Better to lose a few budders than lose the whole shit show


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## Budley Doright (Nov 12, 2015)

I don't mind spending $25 on a ppm meter as it also lets you know how the plants are feeding. The EC/ppm meters are the cheap things I don't sweat. It's the ph meters that are ridiculous.


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## swedsteven (Apr 16, 2016)

Just soak m'y plant root and the bottom of the clay in 500 ml of water and 10ml of javel wish it help m'y temps was high Last 2 days Just fix it omg this is bad


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## Budley Doright (Apr 16, 2016)

swedsteven said:


> Just soak m'y plant root and the bottom of the clay in 500 ml of water and 10ml of javel wish it help m'y temps was high Last 2 days Just fix it omg this is bad


Good luck . Even though it's pricey I have had great luck with saving the plants with hydroguard, hopefully you can get temps down.


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## swedsteven (Apr 16, 2016)

The one on the right is infected soak in strong javel mix 10ml javel 500ml water all they 9 other are top shape and temp was 30 celsius for 2 days i was busy then i saw that and fix it .it now 25 celsius ... any one think i should kick her out she is the bigger one they are 2 week in


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## Budley Doright (Apr 16, 2016)

At those temps it's only a matter of time before it hits them all IMO. It's a pain but what about ice bottles and insulation


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## swedsteven (Apr 16, 2016)

Ice bottle is note efficient enought 25 celsius is not good enought !


Budley Doright said:


> At those temps it's only a matter of time before it hits them all IMO. It's a pain but what about ice bottles and insulation


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## swedsteven (Apr 16, 2016)

I Will kill them all dont want to loose my time leave them 3 Day if it spread that it


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## Budley Doright (Apr 16, 2016)

Ok then, I would make an effort to save them as you can see if you look at my root rot thread, but I'm kind of stubborn lol. I also shut my indoor down in another 2-3 weeks due to heat. And it's cheaper outside.


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## swedsteven (Apr 17, 2016)

Budley Doright said:


> At those temps it's only a matter of time before it hits them all IMO. It's a pain but what about ice bottles and insulation


Im at 23 celcius right now and Will keep it like that i think i woul throw some javel in m'y réservoir and wait for a week if it help i Will keep them if not i have to kill those ladys


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## Budley Doright (Apr 17, 2016)

swedsteven said:


> Im at 23 right now and Will keep it like that i think i woul throw some javel in m'y réservoir and wait for a week if it help i Will keep them if not i have to kill those ladys


Still high IMO but if there's nothing you can do then that's that. Again you may be able to save them by insulating the buckets and Res, also try hydroguard if you can get a small trial container (possibly email them) or buy it to see what you think. Again I'm stubborn but came real close to quitting. I now have one of my best runs ever, albeit second generation .


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## Skylander (Apr 17, 2016)

Google Live or Sterile? Elevated my grow 100%!! If you can control your water temps and keep ideal environmental temps this Will help you! Seriously almost made a night and day difference for me. Google is a hell of a drug!LOL


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## Budley Doright (Apr 17, 2016)

Skylander said:


> Google Live or Sterile? Elevated my grow 100%!! If you can control your water temps and keep ideal environmental temps this Will help you! Seriously almost made a night and day difference for me. Google is a hell of a drug!LOL


Took a bit for me to get it. But yup environment is key to a good grow as opposed to just a grow .


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## swedsteven (Apr 17, 2016)

I Just put 150 ml bleachl in m'y 100 litter ŕeservoir after an hour 2 plant start to drop so iM Just empty the système and refile and put 20 ml this time


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## swedsteven (Apr 19, 2016)

I Just kill them with the bleach they dont Come back up all the root went yellow after the 150 ml of bleach .... this Nevers hapen to me 4 harvest in m'y setup and now fucking root rot .Im cloaning today and tomorow i Will empty and clan m'y setup a1. worst they dont sell hydroguard in m'y city or near it i have to travel 600milles and other option piranha from advanced nutrient maybe i could make à tea with the pirhana it's so expensif


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## swedsteven (Apr 19, 2016)

So bleach it's à no for me !!!


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## loftygoals (Apr 19, 2016)

swedsteven said:


> So bleach it's à no for me !!!


150ml... that's a LOT! You should be aiming for 1-4 ppm of chlorine.

Have a look at this bleach calculator:

https://www.publichealthontario.ca/en/ServicesAndTools/Tools/Pages/Dilution-Calculator.aspx

Typical bleach is like 5.25%. You should have put 2-8ml in TOTAL volume of 100L for 1-4ppm... not 150ml of bleach!!! You have like 80ppm bleach solution circulating. smh

Of course bleach is a no when you're putting insane concentrations into your nutrient solution. Chlorine gasses off at about 1ppm per day. It'll take 3 months for the bleach to dissipate from your system unless you drain it. If you want to save the plants you need to empty the system now. Run through plain water for 24 hours and then start with like 200ppm nute solution.

Edit: I was reading last night that upto 100ppm is ideal for immediate sterilisation of surfaces. Over 100ppm and the bleach starts to react with metals. 25ppm is recommended for ultra high purity water systems. 80ppm through your nutrient solution is crazy!


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## swedsteven (Apr 19, 2016)

True i did burn them it was bubling. i Just order some hydroguard and Will buy some sweet for my next batch .i was thinking can i feed the bacteria with molases or it's better sweet in a rdwc?


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## Budley Doright (Apr 19, 2016)

swedsteven said:


> True i did burn them it was bubling. i Just order some hydroguard and Will buy some sweet for my next batch .i was thinking can i feed the bacteria with molases or it's better sweet in a rdwc?


Don't feed the bacteria in your system, just replace the bacteria. I Replace the Rez water every 7 days and add the beneficials. I add 100 ml hydroguard to 100 litre Res.


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## Gregor Eisenhorn (Apr 22, 2016)

I use chlorimine and I'm liking the swimming pool smell that comes from my reservoir. Smells so clean.


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## Budley Doright (Apr 22, 2016)

http://www.chloramine.org/chloraminefacts.htm

May want to have a look/see lol.


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## Budley Doright (Apr 23, 2016)

I fought on here about using bleach and was ran out of the village by a torch wielding crowd lol. But......I am almost to the point of grabbing a torch lol. To much guessing, wondering about the amount of off gassing. And no real benefit that I can see for the roots other than disinfecting. As for H2O2, well it did work I guess, but not great, kept it at bay. The one thing is cost, I hear that all the time, bleach is cheap. Really when your talking a couple of thousand worth of product does it matter if you save $20, actually food grade H2O2 35% is getting to be hugely expensive and hard to get here, it's almost like your buying bomb materials. I started using hydroguard last fall due to a huge root rot problem. I did hook up a chiller as well but I have had nothing but a huge white root mat. It is my opinion that if you want to kill it in hydro and maximize the grow you need a chiller first, then you choose what's, if anything is needed. I myself have stopped using any sterilizing products. I'll try to get a pic up right after harvest which is in a week or two I hope.


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## Wastei (Apr 1, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> I fought on here about using bleach and was ran out of the village by a torch wielding crowd lol. But......I am almost to the point of grabbing a torch lol. To much guessing, wondering about the amount of off gassing. And no real benefit that I can see for the roots other than disinfecting. As for H2O2, well it did work I guess, but not great, kept it at bay. The one thing is cost, I hear that all the time, bleach is cheap. Really when your talking a couple of thousand worth of product does it matter if you save $20, actually food grade H2O2 35% is getting to be hugely expensive and hard to get here, it's almost like your buying bomb materials. I started using hydroguard last fall due to a huge root rot problem. I did hook up a chiller as well but I have had nothing but a huge white root mat. It is my opinion that if you want to kill it in hydro and maximize the grow you need a chiller first, then you choose what's, if anything is needed. I myself have stopped using any sterilizing products. I'll try to get a pic up right after harvest which is in a week or two I hope.


I don't really understand the logic behind fighting something that's clearly working out wonderfully for many people and is widely avaliable for everybody. The fact that it's being used safely on a industrial agricultural scale makes me wonder if you sell products or something? I really don't know. But for me the logic doesn't add upp. I've seen amazing result in both clear rez system and alive ones, that's not the point. For me it comes down to the amount of time I spend on a project, safety and stabililty.

PH stabilitly in hydroponics is key and I have personally never been able to keep as stable PH with alive rez as I now do with sterile system. Much lesser jobb and guessing game and as a byproduct also higher yields. I've been using sterile system for about 2 years now.

Follow directions and always do your own research, no reason to sit on the high horse...


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## Budley Doright (Apr 2, 2017)

The only time I get huge swings is when there are issues with the root mass, I didnt find any difference between live and sterile to be honest as long as the roots are healthy my PH will slowly rise which I like


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## PCXV (Apr 2, 2017)

Need some input. I'm dealing with fungus gnats. Soil has zero nutrients or mycos (Aged bark, peat moss, coconut coir, pumice, perlite, lime, dolomite, gypsum, and yucca) + 50% perlite, I'm full synthetic. I first used H202 seemed to help, then I got bti bacteria (mosquito bits), and now I'm considering 4ppm bleach through the soil. 

*Will bleach "kill" the "inactive bacteria" bti and thus be counter-productive, or does "inactive" mean the bacteria is already dead? *

*Will bleach kill fungus and gnat larvae? *


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## Budley Doright (Apr 3, 2017)

I haven't had them since switching to hydro, it was one reason I made the jump actually. I'm surprised the mosquito stuff didn't work. Not sure if I'd add bleach to soil as yes it will kill everything. Less watering, sharp sand, sticky tape, I tried everything and then went to hydro lol. They didn't seem to do any harm but just hated having them in my buds when I harvested.


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## PCXV (Apr 3, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> I haven't had them since switching to hydro, it was one reason I made the jump actually. I'm surprised the mosquito stuff didn't work. Not sure if I'd add bleach to soil as yes it will kill everything. Less watering, sharp sand, sticky tape, I tried everything and then went to hydro lol. They didn't seem to do any harm but just hated having them in my buds when I harvested.


Yeah I read here bleach reacts with the acids in soil: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/663052

That is a shroom site so IDK if it applies but I'm leaning against bleach right now. 

The mosquito bits are slowly working, just got done checking, killing, and cleaning, and it seems the population is declining. Still, I might try H202 again in higher concentration like 1:4 as Ive read in a few places online (I only did 2tsp per gallon before). 

*So I'm still curious if H202 will 'kill' or counteract the 'inactive' bti bacteria in the Mosquito Bits? *


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## Budley Doright (Apr 3, 2017)

PCXV said:


> Yeah I read here bleach reacts with the acids in soil: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/663052
> 
> That is a shroom site so IDK if it applies but I'm leaning against bleach right now.
> 
> ...


Yes probably, it's a bacteria killer. I tried it as well but perhaps not enough.


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## PCXV (Apr 3, 2017)

Budley Doright said:


> Yes probably, it's a bacteria killer. I tried it as well but perhaps not enough.


Seems logical, but I can't find the definition of 'inactive bacteria'. I read somewhere online that bti is an made inactive with enzymes, that the bacteria doesn't come back alive in the soil or get 'activated' it simply gets eaten by the larvae and kills them. That description makes it sound like there is no bacteria to kill, that the larvae are essentially eating dead bacteria specks.


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## Wastei (Apr 5, 2017)

PCXV said:


> Need some input. I'm dealing with fungus gnats. Soil has zero nutrients or mycos (Aged bark, peat moss, coconut coir, pumice, perlite, lime, dolomite, gypsum, and yucca) + 50% perlite, I'm full synthetic. I first used H202 seemed to help, then I got bti bacteria (mosquito bits), and now I'm considering 4ppm bleach through the soil.
> 
> *Will bleach "kill" the "inactive bacteria" bti and thus be counter-productive, or does "inactive" mean the bacteria is already dead? *
> 
> *Will bleach kill fungus and gnat larvae? *


I usually sort the fungus gnat problem with a dry period and blue/yellow sticky pads. I usally order them from china on ebay, very large and cheap yellow sticky sheets. I cut and glue them like a circle around the inside of the pot. I have some spacing from the top of the pot to the soil level just for attaching sticky pads on my promix girls. If the adult population can't reproduce they will soon decline. 

If I catch it early on it's usually not a big problem. You could try and add some neem meal to the soil to kill the gnat larvae. If you want faster result make a tea solution either by the boil and drain method or by aerate the solution with air pump in a bucket with neem meal/cake and mycos. Something that should also work is simply adding a layer of sand at the top layer of the pot, but have never tried this method myself.


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## kaoss_11 (Aug 22, 2017)

Just to help in a old as thread I put 200ml of bleach in a gal of water. From there I dose at 2-4ml per gallon. Much easier to work with in larger or smaller res. 

The logic i used was 
if 1 drop bleach = .05 ml 8.25% concentration is what i use
then 200ml bleach / 3785ml h20 = .05 diluted solution per ml

Been doing this for a month with no issues thus far.


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## Yodaweed (Aug 23, 2017)

mosquito dunks for fungus gnats good luck


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## Dennydank (Nov 24, 2020)

fatman7574 said:


> Do you think the majority of commercial hydroponic green house growers are wrong. They use chlorine at 4 ppm or higher added into the pipesfeeding the irrigation spray heads so as to m not waster chlorine in the reservoirs through dissipation. I recommend 2.5 ppm as an initail treatment reduced to 0.5 ppm as a residual level of chlorine. Tap water is allowed to contain up to 4 ppm at customers faucets. Thousands of growers of mj use tap water without any removal of chlorine. 10's of thousands of people water their houseplants, flowers and lawns with water containiing up to 4 ppm of chlorine. Plants can tolerate extremely high anounts of chlorine. they ac not tolerate chloride. Fish can tolerate high levels of chloride but not chlorine. Salt is sodium chloride. Plants can not tolerate high levels of chloride Caphese.
> 
> Hydrogen peroxide is a much stronger oxidizer than chlorine. It is much easier to cause problems using hydrogen peroxide than to use chlorox bleach.
> 
> ...


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## bleacher (Jan 4, 2021)

Okay I'm sold on using bleach to disinfect my water. To allay fears of toxicity, what if I use sodium thiosulfate to dechlorinate the water after letting it sit with bleach for a while? Sodium thiosulfate is used to remove chlorine from aquarium water so it's safe for fish. I like to use Azos which is a bacteria and I assume it would be safe to use this with dechlorinated bleached water.


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## kovidkough (Jan 4, 2021)

bleacher said:


> Okay I'm sold on using bleach to disinfect my water. To allay fears of toxicity, what if I use sodium thiosulfate to dechlorinate the water after letting it sit with bleach for a while? Sodium thiosulfate is used to remove chlorine from aquarium water so it's safe for fish. I like to use Azos which is a bacteria and I assume it would be safe to use this with dechlorinated bleached water.


the bleach will kill the azos, it kills covid lol


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## bleacher (Jan 4, 2021)

kovidkough said:


> the bleach will kill the azos, it kills covid lol


Of course chlorine will kill the azos. That's not what I'm asking. Reread my post about sodium thiosulfate. This removes chlorine. Use this after the bleach, then the azos.


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## kovidkough (Jan 5, 2021)

bleacher said:


> Of course chlorine will kill the azos. That's not what I'm asking. Reread my post about sodium thiosulfate. This removes chlorine. Use this after the bleach, then the azos.


does it remove bleach?


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## kovidkough (Jan 5, 2021)

bleach water + azos = dead azos chlorine has nothing to do with it


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## bleacher (Jan 5, 2021)

kovidkough said:


> bleach water + azos = dead azos chlorine has nothing to do with it


Please explain. I understand chlorine is the active killing ingredient in bleach. Shouldn't removing it make it harmless to all organic matter?


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## kovidkough (Jan 5, 2021)

bleacher said:


> Please explain. I understand chlorine is the active killing ingredient in bleach. Shouldn't removing it make it harmless to all organic matter?


ah you are correct sir, nevermind I wasnt thinking fully your theory sounds alot better then


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## kovidkough (Jan 5, 2021)

bleacher said:


> It removes chlorine. If it makes chlorinated water safe for fish, it should work for bacteria should it not?


id look up what other ingredients your messing with if its safe for fish then that's a good indicator


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## rkymtnman (Jan 5, 2021)

bleacher said:


> Okay I'm sold on using bleach to disinfect my water. To allay fears of toxicity, what if I use sodium thiosulfate to dechlorinate the water after letting it sit with bleach for a while? Sodium thiosulfate is used to remove chlorine from aquarium water so it's safe for fish. I like to use Azos which is a bacteria and I assume it would be safe to use this with dechlorinated bleached water.


your plants aren't gonna like much of that sodium. why not just bubble it for 24hrs to remove chlorine?


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## bleacher (Jan 5, 2021)

rkymtnman said:


> your plants aren't gonna like much of that sodium. why not just bubble it for 24hrs to remove chlorine?


4 NaClO + Na2S2O3 + 2 NaOH → 4 NaCl + 2 Na2SO4 + H2O This is the reaction according to Wiki. It does produce sodium chloride but enough to hurt the plants? I tried letting the bleached water sit in a open container and was still detecting chlorine days after but without using a bubbler. I'll give the bubbler a try. Thanks


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## rkymtnman (Jan 5, 2021)

bleacher said:


> 4 NaClO + Na2S2O3 + 2 NaOH → 4 NaCl + 2 Na2SO4 + H2O This is the reaction according to Wiki. It does produce sodium chloride but enough to hurt the plants? I tried letting the bleached water sit in a open container and was still detecting chlorine days after but without using a bubbler. I'll give the bubbler a try. Thanks


if i was going to add something, it would be vitamin C to remove chlorine. but bubbling requires least amount of effort.


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## mr4tune (Jan 5, 2021)

Why are you worried about the chlorine toxicity? I run sterile systems and I've never had any issues or signs of toxicity from chlorine.


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## bleacher (Jan 5, 2021)

mr4tune said:


> Why are you worried about the chlorine toxicity? I run sterile systems and I've never had any issues or signs of toxicity from chlorine.


Just for the beneficial bacteria and fungi. Actually I already tried using the dechlorinator and noticed some negative effects. I didn't know if it was residual bleach or the dechlorinator causing it. The plants turned a bit yellower with streaks on the lower leaves. They recovered after a week.


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## kingromano (Jan 5, 2021)

bleacher said:


> Just for the beneficial bacteria and fungi. Actually I already tried using the dechlorinator and noticed some negative effects. I didn't know if it was residual bleach or the dechlorinator causing it. The plants turned a bit yellower with streaks on the lower leaves. They recovered after a week.


chlorine contained in your tap water will not make plants yellow
plants can tolerate way heavier doses than the 1-2ppm of your tap water
city water is actually very well suited for sterile hydroponics
it's sterilised and sent to you with enough chlorine to reach you clean and free of pathogens

but to use your beneficials it's problematic
to run with bennies you need to use 100 % ro water, or recover the condensate water of your air conditionners/dehumidifiers
or eventually rain water if it's clean

dont forget to use soft water nutrients with RO water
don't do the regular nutrients+calmag thing
use soft water suited nutrients


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## pinner420 (Jan 5, 2021)

I'm wondering how many rdwc threads I've read over the years with guys seeking 2 gpw were just to cheap to buy a 300 dollar chiller. c'mon man.. H's and O's for me 29% h202 is cheap and don't need a chem degree to know that an 02 bond will just add O.


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## SuperiorBuds (Jan 5, 2021)

pinner420 said:


> I'm wondering how many rdwc threads I've read over the years with guys seeking 2 gpw were just to cheap to buy a 300 dollar chiller. c'mon man.. H's and O's for me 29% h202 is cheap and don't need a chem degree to know that an 02 bond will just add O.


Lots of ways to handle this for sure. Personally I like HTH Pool Shock, a $6 bag will treat thousands of gallons of water. Even with my chiller I prefer to run sterile, it's eliminated any problems I used to run into. And unlike bleach the shock is calcium hypochlorite not sodium hypochlorite. Breaks down cleanly within a few days, too.


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## bleacher (Jan 5, 2021)

QUOTE]


kingromano said:


> chlorine contained in your tap water will not make plants yellow


I used a lot of bleach, 1 ml per gal because I'm using stored rainwater which I know is full of pythium. Also could be the particular bleach I used. Noticed it said "with fabric protection" on the bottle. I'm going to try cutting it down to .5 ml/gal and use regular plain bleach. Then use a bubbler.


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## kingromano (Jan 5, 2021)

bleacher said:


> QUOTE]
> 
> I used a lot of bleach, 1 ml per gal because I'm using stored rainwater which I know is full of pythium. Also could be the particular bleach I used. Noticed it said "with fabric protection" on the bottle. I'm going to try cutting it down to .5 ml/gal and use regular plain bleach. Then use a bubbler.


are you using chlorine or beneficials ?
you can't use both

beneficials is the way to go for you
rainwater+beneficials=good


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## bleacher (Jan 5, 2021)

kingromano said:


> are you using chlorine or beneficials ?
> you can't use both
> 
> beneficials is the way to go for you
> rainwater+beneficials=good


I guess I have to explain again. I'm using stored rainwater that was comes off my roof and goes into my gutters. I know this is full of pythium. It must be from all the dust in the air and on the roof. I had several grows in coco with bad root rot. I want to disinfect my water with bleach, remove the chlorine, then use the benes. By removing the chlorine I mean either chemically with dechlor or bubbling it away. BTW there are dechlorination products specifically for hydroponics available.


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## rkymtnman (Jan 5, 2021)

bleacher said:


> I guess I have to explain again. I'm using stored rainwater that was comes off my roof and goes into my gutters. I know this is full of pythium. It must be from all the dust in the air and on the roof. I had several grows in coco with bad root rot. I want to disinfect my water with bleach, remove the chlorine, then use the benes. By removing the chlorine I mean either chemically with dechlor or bubbling it away. BTW there are dechlorination products specifically for hydroponics available.


i had to re-read your post but i figured out what you are trying to do. 

if you want to be really cost-effective, i'm pretty sure you can make your own filter of sand to run your rainwater thru which will remove any nasties too.


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## Jack James (Jul 12, 2021)

Just ran 10ml of bleach in my system of 35 gallons, it's only been 2 hours and two of my plants are wilting fairly badly? Is this somewhat normal / will resolve itself, or do I need to flush the system?


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## Wastei (Jul 13, 2021)

Jack James said:


> Just ran 10ml of bleach in my system of 35 gallons, it's only been 2 hours and two of my plants are wilting fairly badly? Is this somewhat normal / will resolve itself, or do I need to flush the system? View attachment 4942438


10ml doesn't tell us anything about the concentration. It's very important to use unscented sodium hypochlorite and nothing else if you use regular bleach.

I use 2ml 5% bleach in my 33 gallon reservoir. That equates to 1ppm residual. You should aim for 3ppm in DWC. Add 3ppm to anything going in to the reservoir, top off etc. Good luck!

You can follow my journal if you like. I've used bleach in hydro since 2010. Use this calculator to foolproof yourself: Chlorine dilution calculator


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## Budley Doright (Jul 13, 2021)

Jack James said:


> Just ran 10ml of bleach in my system of 35 gallons, it's only been 2 hours and two of my plants are wilting fairly badly? Is this somewhat normal / will resolve itself, or do I need to flush the system? View attachment 4942438


It’s not looking good. Empty and refill with straight water and flush it a few times and hope for the best. Then follow Wastei’s method. I always used hydrogen peroxide so know nothing of bleach except I had issues with it but it was all on me lol.


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## Jack James (Jul 13, 2021)

Wastei said:


> 10ml doesn't tell us anything about the concentration. It's very important to use unscented sodium hypochlorite and nothing else if you use regular bleach.
> 
> I use 2ml 5% bleach in my 33 gallon reservoir. That equates to 1ppm residual. You should aim for 3ppm in DWC. Add 3ppm to anything going in to the reservoir, top off etc. Good luck!
> 
> You can follow my journal if you like. I've used bleach in hydro since 2010. Use this calculator to foolproof yourself: Chlorine dilution calculator


I appreciate it, I will try that calculator once I get things squared away. Also I am using 6% and it is regular unscented bleach as described by a few people in this forum. Fatman recommended 6-8 drops per gallon, so conversion calculator states that 20 drops = 1ml. 35 gal x 6 (drops) = 210 drops ÷ 20 (to convert to ml) and you get 10.5ml so I did 10ml. Some even say you can go higher and I was on the low end of that spectrum. Not sure why this works for others so well and isn't for me.


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## rkymtnman (Jul 13, 2021)

Jack James said:


> I appreciate it, I will try that calculator once I get things squared away. Also I am using 6% and it is regular unscented bleach as described by a few people in this forum. Fatman recommended 6-8 drops per gallon, so conversion calculator states that 20 drops = 1ml. 35 gal x 6 (drops) = 210 drops ÷ 20 (to convert to ml) and you get 10.5ml so I did 10ml. Some even say you can go higher and I was on the low end of that spectrum. Not sure why this works for others so well and isn't for me.


did you add it to your control res? and did it have time to dilute before it went out to the plant sites?


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## Jack James (Jul 13, 2021)

Plants are beginning to bounce back, it has been 19 hours and parts of my two plants that were wilting are picking back up. My one larger plant never had a single negative effect from the bleach. Thinking either this particular strain got stressed from it, or 6 drops per gallon was a bit on the heavy end.


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## Jack James (Jul 13, 2021)

rkymtnman said:


> did you add it to your control res? and did it have time to dilute before it went out to the plant sites?


I did add it to my control res, I did 3ml three times and then 1ml to equal 10, however I did not wait but 30 seconds between dosing. At 400 gallon ls per hour on my recirculating pump, my system should do a full cycle every 5 minutes. I'm thinking my control became too strong and as it fed out into the system the plants were receiving a very strong shot of it.


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## newbplantgrower420 (Jul 14, 2021)

why not use calcium hypochlorite?

i do like the sound of bleach only cause its in liquid form vs mixing the pool shock.

only thing that sucks abt using chlorine is ive found i gotta dose it every 2 days ive found. i tried every 3-4 days but my rez gets dirty.... turns brownish from crystal clear... its probably bacteria forming. so i do every 2 days now and no problems


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## Jack James (Jul 15, 2021)

newbplantgrower420 said:


> why not use calcium hypochlorite?
> 
> i do like the sound of bleach only cause its in liquid form vs mixing the pool shock.
> 
> only thing that sucks abt using chlorine is ive found i gotta dose it every 2 days ive found. i tried every 3-4 days but my rez gets dirty.... turns brownish from crystal clear... its probably bacteria forming. so i do every 2 days now and no problems


Just out of curiosity what is your dose? I would think once the system is sterilized it would take longer than 3-4 days but I guess bacteria can hit fast


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## newbplantgrower420 (Jul 15, 2021)

Jack James said:


> Just out of curiosity what is your dose? I would think once the system is sterilized it would take longer than 3-4 days but I guess bacteria can hit fast


I go pretty heavy.

anywhere from 2-3g of 65% hypo cal in my 70 gal rez.

ive read chlorine evaporates into the air after 24 hrs so it makes sense to dose every other day at least. i think athena cleanse which is the same as pool shock ... they recommend to dose before every feed.


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## Jack James (Jul 21, 2021)

So all plants bounced back and then 4 days ago I dosed 1.5ml into my 35 gal res to see how they reacted and this time my big plant (which was uneffected by the big dose may have gotten to a point of no return as my smaller plants are doing just fine (other than minor yellowing of some leaves). Now this is a way smaller dose and actually less than 1ppm total using the calculator posted by Wastei. What is going on??? What am I not doing right??


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## Jack James (Jul 21, 2021)

Wastei said:


> 10ml doesn't tell us anything about the concentration. It's very important to use unscented sodium hypochlorite and nothing else if you use regular bleach.
> 
> I use 2ml 5% bleach in my 33 gallon reservoir. That equates to 1ppm residual. You should aim for 3ppm in DWC. Add 3ppm to anything going in to the reservoir, top off etc. Good luck!
> 
> You can follow my journal if you like. I've used bleach in hydro since 2010. Use this calculator to foolproof yourself: Chlorine dilution calculator


Forgot to reply to your post in the one I just posted but I am stumped here and am looking for a solution so I can use bleach because it seems like it would be a better solution than beneficial bacteria that I've used


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## Wastei (Jul 21, 2021)

Jack James said:


> So all plants bounced back and then 4 days ago I dosed 1.5ml into my 35 gal res to see how they reacted and this time my big plant (which was uneffected by the big dose may have gotten to a point of no return as my smaller plants are doing just fine (other than minor yellowing of some leaves). Now this is a way smaller dose and actually less than 1ppm total using the calculator posted by Wastei. What is going on??? What am I not doing right??


It's better to use an oxidizer from the get go. Don't only use 1ppm in DWC. You need to keep it at 3-5ppm if you're not running a chiller. Plants and particularly roots need time to adjust to it. 

If you had an ongoing root issue a dose of bleach could actually temporarily worsen a problem. 

What other things have you added to the res? I add that amount every third to 4th day to my res in Aero. Res changes about every two weeks.


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## rkymtnman (Jul 21, 2021)

Jack James said:


> So all plants bounced back and then 4 days ago I dosed 1.5ml into my 35 gal res to see how they reacted and this time my big plant (which was uneffected by the big dose may have gotten to a point of no return as my smaller plants are doing just fine (other than minor yellowing of some leaves). Now this is a way smaller dose and actually less than 1ppm total using the calculator posted by Wastei. What is going on??? What am I not doing right??


the big girl does not look happy at all. 

take a pic of her roots would help.


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## Jack James (Jul 21, 2021)

Wastei said:


> It's better to use an oxidizer from the get go. Don't only use 1ppm in DWC. You need to keep it at 3-5ppm if you're not running a chiller. Plants and particularly roots need time to adjust to it.
> 
> If you had an ongoing root issue a dose of bleach could actually temporarily worsen a problem.
> 
> What other things have you added to the res? I add that amount every third to 4th day to my res in Aero. Res changes about every two weeks.


That doesn't explain why a way smaller amount than you described is causing this, the roots were never bad and the plant was never in this state until bleach was added as an alternative to beneficial bacteria


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## Jack James (Jul 26, 2021)

Alright I wanted to give an update, as sad as my plants had been, I noticed bright white roots shooting out of the bottom of the net pots about 4 days ago. The new roots were doubling in size every day, plants began getting healthier and perked back up. Keep in mind I never laid off of the bleach solution completely, I took it down to 1ppm. It almost appears as if the old roots that had started turning brown were compromised and once I sterilized the system, the plant stopped using them and started making new roots. I cut out as much of the old roots that didn't look very good. This might be the most growth and healthiest these plants have been. My whole system is incredibly clean. I will continue this method and post updates. Not enough good videos or info online showing results and use of this method, so I would like to share it on here so people can see actual results. The whole system has officially bounced back. Photos don't show very well but these roots are bright white


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