# Club 315w lec



## bob223 (Mar 31, 2016)

Hello everyone,

Im a long time lurker but do not usually post. But i decided to take the dive and and switch from a 1000w hps to a 315lec for the warm summer months. I have been researching these light and reading posts on multiple forums. I find that most of the posts get off topic and lack any really information or pictures of what people are actually doing with these lights. 

My goal is to have a club for people to share their experiences with these lights.i will be swapping out my hps tonight and hanging up the lec so pictures will be coming soon. 

please feel free to post pictures, stats, questions, and feed back. Im hoping some of the more senior members will join in and bring their much needed expertise.

Well lets have fun and spread the word about these awesome lights!


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## kiwipaulie (Apr 1, 2016)

I'll be keen to see how this goes!!

@ttystikk has been running these so he can probably give some good feedback!


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## highdave (Apr 1, 2016)

Hell ya man. Are you replacing watt for watt? Or close so 3 315w, 945w per 1000?

First grow and jumped in with a 315 in a 3x3. Temp inside litterally runs 3 degrees warmer then the room(closet) it's sitting in. With the 6in fan set to low. I think 206cfm. I can put my hand on top of the hood after 10 hours of it being on. 

I'm loving this light and glad I grabbed it. Pics are 18 days into flower


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## bob223 (Apr 1, 2016)

highdave said:


> Hell ya man. Are you replacing watt for watt? Or close so 3 315w, 945w per 1000?
> 
> First grow and jumped in with a 315 in a 3x3. Temp inside litterally runs 3 degrees warmer then the room(closet) it's sitting in. With the 6in fan set to low. I think 206cfm. I can put my hand on top of the hood after 10 hours of it being on.
> 
> I'm loving this light and glad I grabbed it. Pics are 18 days into flower



I'm downsizing for the summer. so im going to run just one 315. if i get good results off of the one i will go to 3x 315's in a 4x8. If not i will switch back to the 1000watt in a 4x4 for the winter.

My first impression of the 315 is great. it runs cool so i was able to go from two inline fans (one in and one out) to just one for the exhaust. The exhaust fan is 400cmf so it is strong enough passively pull air into my tent through the in vent. after cutting out the fan and the light im saving just under1kw per hour.

I have the light about 16inches above the top of my largest plant. i feel like this may be to high so i will probably adjust in the next few days.

Im working on pictures but because of location im taking precaution.


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## highdave (Apr 1, 2016)

Right 


bob223 said:


> I'm downsizing for the summer. so im going to run just one 315. if i get good results off of the one i will go to 3x 315's in a 4x8. If not i will switch back to the 1000watt in a 4x4 for the winter.
> 
> My first impression of the 315 is great. it runs cool so i was able to go from two inline fans (one in and one out) to just one for the exhaust. The exhaust fan is 400cmf so it is strong enough passively pull air into my tent through the in vent. after cutting out the fan and the light im saving just under1kw per hour.
> 
> ...


 It is nice I can't lie. But one taking over for a 1000 I just can't see it compare. But The spectrum is better I think you will be quite surprised how these plants like it.

I have mine about 10 inches from the top. Maybe closer I've been just letting them grow up to the light still haven't seen any I'll effects. I'll measure when light come on


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## bob223 (Apr 2, 2016)

I'm fine with it not comparing to the 1k. my main goal is to save electricity in the summer months. 
I'm hoping to hit 1 gram per watt i think that is a realistic goal. 

i could probably hit more but i do not run very high yielding strains.


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## highdave (Apr 2, 2016)

I'm sure it's possible. I've seen side by sides on a 1000 on a mover and 3 315. Gotta say 315 side looked much better. You will save for sure my bill went up 40 bucks after I set the tent up. Fans and all.

I will know soon in about a month how much I yield. Shooting for first week of may. I have holes in my canopy so that will take away. I want at least .5 per watt on this first run. But still 150 gs or so for personal use should be fine.


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## Growdict (Apr 2, 2016)

Just chopping my first crop now. Should know in a few days yield. Visually looks about 6-8 oz. which is on the low side but it is my first grow and i know i can do better. i really like the light. Color is awesome and heat is low. Was actually too low when it was cold here and i had to add a heater.


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## highdave (Apr 2, 2016)

Growdict said:


> Just chopping my first crop now. Should know in a few days yield. Visually looks about 6-8 oz. which is on the low side but it is my first grow and i know i can do better. i really like the light. Color is awesome and heat is low. Was actually too low when it was cold here and i had to add a heater.


Ya man they stay barely warm. But hey half pound for a First run off 315watts ain't too shabby I think . That's all I'm hoping for. Any pics before the chop?


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## Growdict (Apr 2, 2016)

Couple pics.


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## bob223 (Apr 2, 2016)

Growdict said:


> View attachment 3648337 View attachment 3648338
> Couple pics.


That Looks Great!!!! 
Do you feel like you got good density to your buds?
Have you ran this strain under a different set up to be able to compare performance?

im in kind of a interesting situation when i was using the 1k i would run perpetual with 6 plants in various stages of flower.
I quit adding a few weeks ago and got the number of plants down to 4 in the flower room. I swapped out the hps and put in the lec.
These plants vegged under MH. started flowering under hps and will finish with Lec.

I plan on keeping going perpetual. i will keep 4 plants rotating in and out at all times. The only way i will change is if yield is really disappointing. then maybe i would consider SCROG.


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## Growdict (Apr 3, 2016)

Thanks bob. Nugs are solid. Very little larf. When i said first grow i meant ever,so no point of reference. Sorry. Scrog last time but this run will be mainlined. Hoping to get up to 1gpw this run


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## Growdict (Apr 3, 2016)

I also had 4 plants as well I didnt get as much stretch as i thought but it was cold during that time and i am still figuring out environmental.


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## Rooster96 (Apr 4, 2016)

Great thread Bob! I cant wait to see all the 315 grows. I just picked up a 315 recently and will have it up and running soon I hope.


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## Rooster96 (Apr 4, 2016)

Growdict said:


> View attachment 3648337 View attachment 3648338
> Couple pics.


What strain are you running? Plants look good by the way!


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## Growdict (Apr 4, 2016)

2x watermelon. Smells really nice but low yield. 
2x mystery "special k" clones i was given. Kinda diesel smell. All drying now. Going to mainline the next batch ,trimming took forever with all the scrog buds


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## highdave (Apr 4, 2016)

Growdict said:


> View attachment 3648337 View attachment 3648338
> Couple pics.


Dam man sexy! Just one 315? What size tent.


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## Growdict (Apr 4, 2016)

that a 4x5, but i am only using a 3.5ft turntable under the light. i have a dehumidifier and a floor fan in there as well. probably need to add an ac unit soon, getting warmer


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## highdave (Apr 5, 2016)

Hell ya. Its already in the 80s where I'm at. But I keep air running in the house and lights on at night. Hasn't gone above 78. Humidity mid to low 40s

Was thinking of A way to put my screen on a turntable for next run so I can see the other side of that back plant


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## Javadog (Apr 5, 2016)

Independent of yield, that Watermelon sounds and looks great!

I am interested in potentially trying this type of lighting out, and will lurk. :0)


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## hyroot (Apr 5, 2016)

Javadog said:


> Independent of yield, that Watermelon sounds and looks great!
> 
> I am interested in potentially trying this type of lighting out, and will lurk. :0)



I just bought a phantom 315 cmh. I'll have it up in a few days.


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## pinner420 (Apr 5, 2016)

hyroot said:


> I just bought a phantom 315 cmh. I'll have it up in a few days.


Looking For this.. Link me.


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## hyroot (Apr 5, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> Looking For this.. Link me.


Growers house, discount hydro, and monster gardens all carry it.


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## pinner420 (Apr 5, 2016)

Does the phantom come with the mogul conversation kit?


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## hyroot (Apr 5, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> Does the phantom come with the mogul conversation kit?



No. Its a ballast, hood and a philips t12 cmh bulb . It's the whole set up


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## ttystikk (Apr 5, 2016)

Somehow I missed the mention, nice thread! I'm using my 315W CMH lights in veg, but I'm happy with them so far; the plants are growing faster and I reduced my power consumption by almost half. 

FWIW, I hear guys saying that a 315W setup is roughly equivalent to 500W of HPS. In my case, they replaced (tired) 600W HPS lamps and the plants are responding better, I think the spectrum is making a big difference. 

315W in the foreground, 600W HPS in back;


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## bob223 (Apr 6, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Somehow I missed the mention, nice thread! I'm using my 315W CMH lights in veg, but I'm happy with them so far; the plants are growing faster and I reduced my power consumption by almost half.
> 
> FWIW, I hear guys saying that a 315W setup is roughly equivalent to 500W of HPS. In my case, they replaced (tired) 600W HPS lamps and the plants are responding better, I think the spectrum is making a big difference.
> 
> ...



ttystikk Welcome!!!!!

Those plants you are growing are huge!!!!!!!! 
I'm glad we are starting to get some veterans in this thread.

So far im still very impressed with the 315 my plants seem to be responding nicely to it.
I cant believe how manageable the heat is. i am running like 5-8 degrees cooler at all times compared to my air cooled 1k. it runs even cooler the the 400w MH that im using for veg. I do agree the plants really seem to love the spectrum. 

so if the 315 is comparable to 500w of hps do you think 2x 315 would be better the a 1k single ended Hps. I was planing on going back to the hps in the winter but depending on how this performs i may never go back.


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## ttystikk (Apr 6, 2016)

The guy who goes by the handle of Chemist or something like that has been testing these for some time against HPS lighting. He's one of those I mentioned equating a 315W CMH to 500W of HPS. 

He did a run of two 315W CMH lights back to back vs an HPS thouie and said the 315W CMH lights kicked ass. Yield was up marginally, and quality was a big step forward. 

IMHO, LFSW technology is what will give HID lighting in general a few more years before the onslaught of ever better, ever cheaper COB LED and its progeny make every other form of lighting obsolete as candles in a hurricane. The lamps themselves aren't going to get a lot better, the ballast is the innovation du jour. 

Plan your purchases accordingly.


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## pinner420 (Apr 17, 2016)

Ordered mine yesterday.


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## feloniousfunk (Apr 17, 2016)

nice, a place I can settle in and learn....just got my 315 phantom up and going last week. Hope to get pics up when I can.
I love these lights so far.
FF


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## ttystikk (Apr 17, 2016)

feloniousfunk said:


> nice, a place I can settle in and learn....just got my 315 phantom up and going last week. Hope to get pics up when I can.
> I love these lights so far.
> FF


Welcome!


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## feloniousfunk (Apr 17, 2016)

Here's hoping they turn into monsters ...a little info on my space...52" W x 42"D sort of weird I know. Height is normal 8'. Passive intake, 6x24 Phresh and fan for exhaust at about 60%. 

Hoping the humidity eases a bit higher as the mass grows.








A top down after some tie down love last night on my larger Truthband mom.
 


A look down at pheno hunting a couple packs.
 


Full 3x3 overview
 

Those are Cindy99 BX (mosca), and Blue Magoo (dynasty) running from seed.
A 707Truthband mom (center right), and a pre98BK mom (top left).
Scattered in there also are starter moms of Jillybean (tga), Grape Stomper BX(gage green),
Blueberry (dj short), triangle trip (grownout), 

All in 18/6 while i grow the babes out a bit. Then will separate and flower some.
FF


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## ttystikk (Apr 17, 2016)

Looking solid.


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## bob223 (Apr 17, 2016)

feloniousfunk that looks great! Are you planing on flowering under the 315? and if so how many are you going to flower at one time?


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## feloniousfunk (Apr 18, 2016)

Thanks, and yes I definitely will flower with this light. Hoping to flower 2-4 at a time depending. Have a second phantom still boxed if needed, but I really want to get a good baseline on what one of these lights will do. Hoping to possibly setup a 3x3 tent with the other 315 down the road.


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## GroErr (Apr 18, 2016)

Good spot to share 315w info. Been running 2 of them perpetual for close to 2 years now. They rock watt-for-watt against hps, typically about 25% more weight, and quality is better than hps imo. My son was a die hard hps grower until he saw what I was getting with these Sun Systems LEC's. We converted his grow watt-for-watt with these LEC's and he's been consistently pulling 25-30% more weight and is very happy with the quality. He just bought another 10 units for his expansion, no going back to hps for him if that tells you anything. I just swapped out one of the units to see how 3590 COBs stack against the LEC's but the LEC's aren't going away, will likely run a combo of COBs/LEC through summer and LEC's through the winter.



Cheers


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## ttystikk (Apr 18, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Good spot to share 315w info. Been running 2 of them perpetual for close to 2 years now. They rock watt-for-watt against hps, typically about 25% more weight, and quality is better than hps imo. My son was a die hard hps grower until he saw what I was getting with these Sun Systems LEC's. We converted his grow watt-for-watt with these LEC's and he's been consistently pulling 25-30% more weight and is very happy with the quality. He just bought another 10 units for his expansion, no going back to hps for him if that tells you anything. I just swapped out one of the units to see how 3590 COBs stack against the LEC's but the LEC's aren't going away, will likely run a combo of COBs/LEC through summer and LEC's through the winter.
> 
> View attachment 3659994
> 
> Cheers


Killin it!


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## highdave (Apr 18, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Good spot to share 315w info. Been running 2 of them perpetual for close to 2 years now. They rock watt-for-watt against hps, typically about 25% more weight, and quality is better than hps imo. My son was a die hard hps grower until he saw what I was getting with these Sun Systems LEC's. We converted his grow watt-for-watt with these LEC's and he's been consistently pulling 25-30% more weight and is very happy with the quality. He just bought another 10 units for his expansion, no going back to hps for him if that tells you anything. I just swapped out one of the units to see how 3590 COBs stack against the LEC's but the LEC's aren't going away, will likely run a combo of COBs/LEC through summer and LEC's through the winter.
> 
> View attachment 3659994
> 
> Cheers


mmmm! Looking sexy. I was also thinking about getting a few cobs and placing them around the 315 in the future. Will wait till I see what it can do when it's actually centered. (Centred?) Lol

Couple pics from a noob grower.
Day35 flower 103 days from seed


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## GroErr (Apr 18, 2016)

highdave said:


> mmmm! Looking sexy. I was also thinking about getting a few cobs and placing them around the 315 in the future. Will wait till I see what it can do when it's actually centered. (Centred?) Lol
> 
> Couple pics from a noob grower.
> Day35 flower 103 days from seed


Nice, looks like some quality bud coming up. The combo of the LEC's and COBs should make some quality and good amount of bud


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## ttystikk (Apr 18, 2016)

highdave said:


> mmmm! Looking sexy. I was also thinking about getting a few cobs and placing them around the 315 in the future. Will wait till I see what it can do when it's actually centered. (Centred?) Lol
> 
> Couple pics from a noob grower.
> Day35 flower 103 days from seed


Solid work right there, bro. You know what they say about fixing shit that isn't broken, right?


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## highdave (Apr 18, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Solid work right there, bro. You know what they say about fixing shit that isn't broken, right?


Haha true dat. Just this dark spot I got. Think it will have better coverage when I slide the light over a little. But gotta wait till there out so I can move the fan, re run duct, ect.


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## bob223 (Apr 18, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Good spot to share 315w info. Been running 2 of them perpetual for close to 2 years now. They rock watt-for-watt against hps, typically about 25% more weight, and quality is better than hps imo. My son was a die hard hps grower until he saw what I was getting with these Sun Systems LEC's. We converted his grow watt-for-watt with these LEC's and he's been consistently pulling 25-30% more weight and is very happy with the quality. He just bought another 10 units for his expansion, no going back to hps for him if that tells you anything. I just swapped out one of the units to see how 3590 COBs stack against the LEC's but the LEC's aren't going away, will likely run a combo of COBs/LEC through summer and LEC's through the winter.
> 
> View attachment 3659994
> 
> Cheers


GroERR Welcome to the party!!!!!
those plants look amazing. how many 315s are you running in that room?

A lot of the the reason i picked up the lec is because of the things i learned from GroErr's thread.

thank you for bring one of the first to actually put out really information about the light.


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## 6ohMax (Apr 18, 2016)

I'd love to rock one...but whew, pricey imo

Talking about the sun system lec315


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## bob223 (Apr 18, 2016)

6ohMax said:


> I'd love to rock one...but whew, pricey imo
> 
> Talking about the sun system lec315


I paid $450 for mine and it came with a bulb. if you add up the cost of a good hps ballast, hood, and bulb it is about the same as a hps set up.
I'm not sure if im ever going back to hps. i may need to buy a few more of the sun systems.

Does anyone know if any other lamp producers plan on getting into the LEC game? i would love to see more bulb options


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## 6ohMax (Apr 18, 2016)

bob223 said:


> I paid $450 for mine and it came with a bulb. if you add up the cost of a good hps ballast, hood, and bulb it is about the same as a hps set up.
> I'm not sure if im ever going back to hps. i may need to buy a few more of the sun systems.
> 
> Does anyone know if any other lamp producers plan on getting into the LEC game? i would love to see more bulb options



Now, do you use the lec315 for veg and flower? Just flip it when it's time?

Plugs into 110?


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## bob223 (Apr 18, 2016)

6ohMax said:


> Now, do you use the lec315 for veg and flower? Just flip it when it's time?
> 
> Plugs into 110?


I'm using a 400 mh currantly for veg and the 315 for flower. growing 4 plants perpetually. I was running a 1000w hps but wanted to down size.
i have not completed a whole run under it yet but i had a few that were already flowing under the hps then finished under the lec. It really seems like the plant matures faster under the lec. I will say the buds im currently growing seem to be larger the what i was doing under the 1000w.

i grew in a 4x4 with a 1k perpetual and the best i ever hit was .5 per watt. It appears that my first complete run with the lec i will hit well over 1 gram per watt.


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## Javadog (Apr 18, 2016)

Did someone post that (enormous) warehouse grow that someone was
setting up with, IIRC, LEC315s? It had to have 140 lamps...it was huge.


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## GroErr (Apr 19, 2016)

bob223 said:


> GroERR Welcome to the party!!!!!
> those plants look amazing. how many 315s are you running in that room?
> 
> A lot of the the reason i picked up the lec is because of the things i learned from GroErr's thread.
> ...


Cheers and thanks Bob, glad you got in on these! Have 2 sets in there, 4x 3gal at the back and just finishing up 9x 2gal at the front in a phenol hunt. I just try and fill 3x3' and up to 3.5x3.5' under each light. Good luck!


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## GroErr (Apr 19, 2016)

Javadog said:


> Did someone post that (enormous) warehouse grow that someone was
> setting up with, IIRC, LEC315s? It had to have 140 lamps...it was huge.


Hey JD, you mean this one? Awesome setup, I drool looking at that thread every few days 
https://www.rollitup.org/t/50000-square-feet-colorado-legal-rec-grow.883667/page-30#post-12520061


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## pinner420 (Apr 24, 2016)




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## ttystikk (Apr 24, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> View attachment 3664961


Is that lamp open rated?


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## pinner420 (Apr 24, 2016)

Hmm universal position but no open rated proclamation in the specs. Philips 315w/ 930 pgz18


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## ttystikk (Apr 24, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> Hmm universal position but no open rated proclamation in the specs. Philips 315w/ 930 pgz18


If the lamp does not have an O in the part number it's not open rated and must be run in an enclosed fixture. Mercury must not be allowed to escape the lamp and enter the growing space in case of lamp failure.


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## pinner420 (Apr 24, 2016)

Good looking out I think we're good then.


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## ttystikk (Apr 24, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> Good looking out I think we're good then.


That should be it. Just to make sure, do you see an inner jacket or glass layer to act as a scatter shield?

I looked at your pic of the lamp itself and it looks like there might be, but I can't see it very clearly.


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## feloniousfunk (Apr 25, 2016)

Same babies about 8 days later. Saw my first girl yesterday on a c-99, so hopefully they continue sexing and I can thin the numbers. *mental note* - when space is tight, just pop 1 pack, not 2 
So far, loving this 315...where were these my whole life!


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## GroErr (Apr 25, 2016)

3x 5gal at Day 1 under 300w of COBs at the front, 4x 3gal at 4 weeks under the LEC furthest from the camera. Between the two lights @615w total I'll be covering ~3.5 x 7.5' of bud 



Cheers


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## feloniousfunk (Apr 25, 2016)

Those are looking great GroErr, will be an interesting one to watch develop!


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## GroErr (Apr 25, 2016)

feloniousfunk said:


> Those are looking great GroErr, will be an interesting one to watch develop!


Thanks, had to hold those new one's in veg for ~2 weeks longer than anticipated, now they're the same height as the 4 week plants behind them. I'm expecting them to reach the height of where the COBs are right now when they finish stretching, or ~5 ft.


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## Growdict (Apr 29, 2016)

Day 21 of flower under LEC315. Lights just turned off so i grabbed a flash picture. Buds are popping. Need to do some defol this weekend of bottom


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## pinner420 (Apr 29, 2016)

5 weeks! Sticky sweet.


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## Growdict (Apr 29, 2016)

Nice coloring on that


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## bob223 (Apr 30, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> View attachment 3669473
> 5 weeks! Sticky sweet.


Looks a little droopy and the leaves are curling down..... maybe over watering?

color is crazy. whats the strain?


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## pinner420 (Apr 30, 2016)

bob223 said:


> Looks a little droopy and the leaves are curling down..... maybe over watering?
> 
> color is crazy. whats the strain?


I planted to deep in the hygroten and used to big of rockwool. BLACK ROSE.


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## DesertGrow89 (Apr 30, 2016)

bob223 said:


> Looks a little droopy and the leaves are curling down..... maybe over watering?
> 
> color is crazy. whats the strain?


Probably because it was taken during lights off?


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## pinner420 (Apr 30, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> Probably because it was taken during lights off?


True however it has been corrected in my veg techniques as I was first worried about the roots getting to the water fast enough. It seems it's always the little things that make big differences. Was .5 inches off bottom of net pot now I take the top of the rockwool flush to the top. Plenty of capillary action to get it to its destination.


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## DesertGrow89 (Apr 30, 2016)

The plant looks healthy I've never grown hydro so am not really familiar with it. Are you making beans with that plant? I've heard black rose is an excellent strain.


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## TheChemist77 (Apr 30, 2016)

ive joined the lec 315 watt club,, purchaced 4 boulder lamp 315 agros not long ago,, maybe in june or july of last year after reading about them in high times... best investment ive made, paid for the lamps plus pocket money with the first run.. with 2 315's i yielded 800grams, blew away my hps gram per watt averages..then ran 3 315's over the same 4x6ft table and yielded over 1200 grams,,so 3 315's or 945 watts is better than 1200 watts or 2 600 watt hps hands down... love the 315's,, check out my thred if u wish,, i havnt really added any pix since the 1k hps run that really sucked ass,, im just finishing a run* of mixed strains under 3 315's.. ill post new pix at the start of my next run..

https://www.rollitup.org/t/chemist77-315-watt-cdl-grow.880895/page-1

*


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## pinner420 (Apr 30, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> True however it has been corrected in my veg techniques as I was first worried about the roots getting to the water fast enough. It seems it's always the little things that make big differences. Was .5 inches off bottom of net pot now I take the top of the rockwool flush to the top. Plenty of capillary action to get it to its destination.


Collecting pollen after breakfast...


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## bob223 (Apr 30, 2016)

TheChemist77 said:


> ive joined the lec 315 watt club,, purchaced 4 boulder lamp 315 agros not long ago,, maybe in june or july of last year after reading about them in high times... best investment ive made, paid for the lamps plus pocket money with the first run.. with 2 315's i yielded 800grams, blew away my hps gram per watt averages..then ran 3 315's over the same 4x6ft table and yielded over 1200 grams,,so 3 315's or 945 watts is better than 1200 watts or 2 600 watt hps hands down... love the 315's,, check out my thred if u wish,, i havnt really added any pix since the 1k hps run that really sucked ass,, im just finishing a run* of mixed strains under 3 315's.. ill post new pix at the start of my next run..
> 
> https://www.rollitup.org/t/chemist77-315-watt-cdl-grow.880895/page-1
> *


Thechemist77 HOLY SHIT that was one hell of a grow! how much do the boulder agros go for? does it use the Philips ballast?


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## TheChemist77 (May 1, 2016)

bob223 said:


> Thechemist77 HOLY SHIT that was one hell of a grow! how much do the boulder agros go for? does it use the Philips ballast?


the boulder lamp 315 watt cdl's were $500.00 a piece, they run the bulb horizontally which i like.. a little more expensive than the sun systems or others,, but i didnt know about the others at the time,, had i known i may have gone with the greenbeams 315 cmh lamp but im very happy with the boulders and they are now coming out with a led attachment that will provide a larger coverage and uva,uvb, and uvc to kill bacteria and prevent bugs in the grow room...its not a phillips ballast, its made by boulder, specs are on page 1 of my thred. but it runs the phillips agro bulbs and very efficiently i may add.. i am now on my 3rd run using the ceramics and my gpw has gone up with each run..i will be starting my 4th run in a few days and plan to get 1.5 gpw or better.. im running 3 315's over a 6ftx6ft area but im still using a 400 watt mh in my veg room, my 4th cdl is over a 3ftx3ft area that i use for feminizing and breeding..

this next run im taking the cover off the table, ill pack in more plants and just run flood n drain like my first run. with the cover on, i get 30 plants and the entire table has a mat of roots by the 4th week into flower.. running it with out the cover i can put more plants on the table rotate the plants, and the roots stay in the cubes..
im also starting a few new strains, 2 blueberries by spliff seeds and 3 different 5-o fems by black skull seeds,,ill also be running more of the th seeds bubblegum, bomb seeds big bomb, and homegrown fantaseeds vikings..ill see how they all grow and keep only the best quality and producing strains for future runs.. this last run i ran a few misty's, incredible bulk, and ak-48's along with my bubble gum and the misty is pure shit,,the ak-48 has great structure and lots of bud sites but not dense and they need at least 9 weeks way past 48 days,,and the incredible bulk,,big dense buds,very little stretch,but not as good as the bubble gum... sorry i rambled on,,,be well and grow well to all...


----------



## DesertGrow89 (May 1, 2016)

Here's some sannies jackberry in week two of flower they are in fives and getting daily waterings. Noticed some yellowing on the lowest leaves and it turns out that my res water, which was replaced just a few days ago and pHed to 6.0 has drifted up to ~ 7.5... Wtf? That's something to watch closely but everything is going well so far with the exception of a minor burn from a full strength feeding a few weeks back. The room is 3.5x7', glad I didn't make it six feet long because it would get too cramped trying to get in there and water, fans would be too close to the plants. The only thing I'd add for convenience is removing panda film on one side and adding a movable reflective wall for easier access. Popped four regular beans and got lucky with three females. 

One SS fixture is running the 315 3k and another is running a 210w 4k.


----------



## DesertGrow89 (May 4, 2016)

Does anyone know is the sun systems can be run with the bulb positioned horizontally so the fixture would be pointed at a wall, for vert?


----------



## Growdict (May 4, 2016)

i dont think it would make any difference whatsoever if you were taking the whole thing and turning it on its side, i dont see how this would help you unless you vegged too long and dont have the head room and now need to flower to the side. anyone know if this would also reduce height stretch if you flowered this way?? @ttystikk uses them in vert without the reflector so you get 360degree


----------



## DesertGrow89 (May 4, 2016)

Yeah I know ttystikk uses them just don't want to invest in a vert system because I already have two fixtures. It would make a difference in yield because light use is more efficient


----------



## Growdict (May 4, 2016)

well if you flip the bulb and reflector on its side you will get the same 3.5x3.5 footprint towards the wall instead of floor, however you can aim it at bigger, more mature plants and you would probably yield more. I only got 225g out of my last 315w grow, so i am hoping to do better this round.


----------



## DesertGrow89 (May 4, 2016)

Growdict said:


> well if you flip the bulb and reflector on its side you will get the same 3.5x3.5 footprint towards the wall instead of floor, however you can aim it at bigger, more mature plants and you would probably yield more. I only got 225g out of my last 315w grow, so i am hoping to do better this round.


Yeah, just not sure if those bulbs are supposed to be run in a universal position or not, will have to look into that.
And would it be OK to run the fixture in that position?


----------



## ttystikk (May 4, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> Yeah I know ttystikk uses them just don't want to invest in a vert system because I already have two fixtures. It would make a difference in yield because light use is more efficient


Lol at 'invest in vert'. A bare socket cordset is $35.


----------



## ttystikk (May 4, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> Yeah, just not sure if those bulbs are supposed to be run in a universal position or not, will have to look into that.
> And would it be OK to run the fixture in that position?


Lamp should say U for universal, V for vertical only, or H horizontal only. It's in the part number.

If venting is vertical, I don't see a problem. They don't push enough heat to need more than natural convective cooling, so ducts and fans would be unnecessary.


----------



## rkymtnman (May 4, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> Does anyone know is the sun systems can be run with the bulb positioned horizontally so the fixture would be pointed at a wall, for vert?


it's a U and O rated bulb. can be run universal (vert/horiz) and open (no glass in reflector/no reflector)


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## rkymtnman (May 4, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Lamp should say U for universal, V for vertical only, or H horizontal only. It's in the part number.
> 
> If venting is vertical, I don't see a problem. They don't push enough heat to need more than natural convective cooling.


haha. beat me to it.


----------



## pug1010 (May 5, 2016)

Hi all …been reading for a while and think the cmh315s are the bee's knees. Am planning a new grow and was hoping someone might be from Canada and have details of how they purchased their lights - not many options in BC at the moment.

Thanks heaps and sorry if a bit off topic.


----------



## DesertGrow89 (May 5, 2016)

pug1010 said:


> Hi all …been reading for a while and think the cmh315s are the bee's knees. Am planning a new grow and was hoping someone might be from Canada and have details of how they purchased their lights - not many options in BC at the moment.
> 
> Thanks heaps and sorry if a bit off topic.


Maybe growershouse.com or just do a Google search and shop around. How many plants can you run legally in canada?


----------



## GroErr (May 5, 2016)

pug1010 said:


> Hi all …been reading for a while and think the cmh315s are the bee's knees. Am planning a new grow and was hoping someone might be from Canada and have details of how they purchased their lights - not many options in BC at the moment.
> 
> Thanks heaps and sorry if a bit off topic.


I'm from Canada, I've bought them at growershouse.com and bghrydo.com. Cheaper than anything up here even with exchange and duties.


----------



## pug1010 (May 5, 2016)

Thanks heaps DesertGrow and GroErr.

I was also looking at hortisource.com, but have heard mixed feedback. Were the duties very high on them GroErr? Did you get hit for sales tax as well? Also wondering about warranties if anything happens.

Not wrong about the prices here … wow.

Not legal here to grow … yet - except for some medical growers and the amount they can grow is based on what the doctor reckons the person needs. Most of us have fingers crossed that when legalisation comes in that we will be able to grow legally … I'd be happy with even 4-6 flowering plants. Have a feeling that big business and big pharma will try to influence things a fair bit. 

Thanks again


----------



## GroErr (May 6, 2016)

pug1010 said:


> Thanks heaps DesertGrow and GroErr.
> 
> I was also looking at hortisource.com, but have heard mixed feedback. Were the duties very high on them GroErr? Did you get hit for sales tax as well? Also wondering about warranties if anything happens.
> 
> ...


Warranty can be a pain in the ass if you get a dead unit or something but no different than buying here, some shipping costs might apply for warranty work. Haven't had any issues with these Sun Systems units.

Growershouse I didn't get hit with anything other than a brokerage fee like $30 using. BGHydro I had to pay GST and brokerage. Still cheaper though. Best price I found here was $700 + shipping + taxes.

Government is due to put back some form of program that allows home grows for medical by August of this year so you should be able to get a license soon. That was ordered in the Allard case by the Supreme Court so it's a done deal.


----------



## DesertGrow89 (May 6, 2016)

If I were to purchase the same setup again I'd probably go with just the ballast and bulb it requires a bit of wiring but $265 for the ballast and bulb, but you would also need to purchase a step up/down converter:

http://advancedtechlighting.com/cdmmw.htm


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## pinner420 (May 6, 2016)

http://growershouse.com/ceramic-science-315w-cmh-light-conversion-kit

Down to 165.00


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## DesertGrow89 (May 6, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> http://growershouse.com/ceramic-science-315w-cmh-light-conversion-kit
> 
> Down to 165.00


Is that as efficient as the philips ballast?


----------



## ttystikk (May 6, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> Is that as efficient as the philips ballast?


The key is to make sure it's LFSW.


----------



## bob223 (May 6, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> http://growershouse.com/ceramic-science-315w-cmh-light-conversion-kit
> 
> Down to 165.00


has anyone used these with good results. $165 sounds like a good deal. after you add the bulb your around $265. If money is not an option i would definitely go with a sun system. 

Does anyone know how the Square wave ballast drives the bulb more efficiently? Iam not sure on the science it just seems to work really well .


----------



## DesertGrow89 (May 6, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> http://growershouse.com/ceramic-science-315w-cmh-light-conversion-kit
> 
> Down to 165.00


Appears to be "low frequency" but I read nothing about low frequency square wave. Hum


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## ttystikk (May 6, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> Appears to be "low frequency" but I read nothing about low frequency square wave. Hum


Square wave drives the lamp to maximum output for a given wattage.


----------



## pinner420 (May 6, 2016)

She sparks it up lol. I thought all 315s had to be square wave to run the bulb idk. This was the only versatile all in one kit that I didn't have to hunt down parts for. The paperwork that came with it said 99.something efficient.


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## pug1010 (May 6, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Warranty can be a pain in the ass if you get a dead unit or something but no different than buying here, some shipping costs might apply for warranty work. Haven't had any issues with these Sun Systems units.
> 
> Growershouse I didn't get hit with anything other than a brokerage fee like $30 using. BGHydro I had to pay GST and brokerage. Still cheaper though. Best price I found here was $700 + shipping + taxes.
> 
> Government is due to put back some form of program that allows home grows for medical by August of this year so you should be able to get a license soon. That was ordered in the Allard case by the Supreme Court so it's a done deal.


Thanks heaps for the valuable info … it's a great help. I would love to get a medical licence to grow by August. I have been waiting to see what happens, as I didn't want to go through the whole process if things were going to be legalised (it would be a new application … not pre-2014) … however legalisation in action could take some time, so this is very good news.


----------



## feloniousfunk (May 6, 2016)

Glad to see the thread growing, everyone's stuff looking sharp.
I'm about to hit flower on one of my girls, so I thought I would show some CMH root porn 

This is a 707 Truthband, about 45-50 day veg from clone, in a Perfect Pot (8x8x7"tall). 

She was fed mainly Foliage Pro at 5ml per gal of RO water, with AZOS added for root love.






Here she is, sort of upskirt shot while transplanting to a 5 gal smart pot for the remainder of her time here.






And here she is moving into final home...apologies for less than stellar pics...will get better ones as the fun really starts.






She is going to flower out all by herself in a 39x39x79 tent, with her own phantom cmh kit. Hoping she fills the jars.

Have a great weekend guys!


----------



## Bad Karma (May 7, 2016)

Hello Club 315. Just found this thread today. Here's what I've got under my LEC's.


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## bob223 (May 7, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> Hello Club 315. Just found this thread today. Here's what I've got under my LEC's.
> View attachment 3675364


Looks amazing!
Whats the strain?


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## Bad Karma (May 7, 2016)

bob223 said:


> Looks amazing!
> Whats the strain?


Thank you. It's Sherbet.


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## highdave (May 9, 2016)

First plant harvested! These things kick ass.

Pheno 2 got a little too close. 12 inches apparently is too close. I call this one 3 sisters


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## bob223 (May 10, 2016)

highdave said:


> First plant harvested! These things kick ass.View attachment 3677822
> 
> Pheno 2 got a little too close. 12 inches apparently is too close. I call this one 3 sistersView attachment 3677821


highdave. that looks great. awesome size and density looks top notch.

i have noticed that the top buds on my plants are growing much larger under LEC then 1000w hortilux hps.
But the trade off is the bottom 1/3rd of my plants are much more airy and under developed then under hps.

how many plants are you guys growing per 315? i am running 4 per lamp but may consider doing less.
i really feel that with the size of colas and tops these lights would be perfect for some one growing SCROG. i may eventually take a stab at
it but i have a hard time trying to fix something that's not broken.


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## pinner420 (May 10, 2016)

bob223 said:


> highdave. that looks great. awesome size and density looks top notch.
> 
> i have noticed that the top buds on my plants are growing much larger under LEC then 1000w hortilux hps.
> But the trade off is the bottom 1/3rd of my plants are much more airy and under developed then under hps.
> ...


In vertical its the inverse how many lights per plant.!


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## DesertGrow89 (May 10, 2016)

feloniousfunk said:


> Glad to see the thread growing, everyone's stuff looking sharp.
> I'm about to hit flower on one of my girls, so I thought I would show some CMH root porn
> 
> This is a 707 Truthband, about 45-50 day veg from clone, in a Perfect Pot (8x8x7"tall).
> ...


Looking good how often are you feeding at 5ml/gal? I'm also using FP and am watering everyday with 1.25ml/gal


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## feloniousfunk (May 10, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> Looking good how often are you feeding at 5ml/gal? I'm also using FP and am watering everyday with 1.25ml/gal


She is getting fed every day (coco) with the 5ml of FP. 
Just under a gallon a day in the Perfect pot, now in the 5gal Smart pot she is at an even gallon a day for a touch of run off.


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## Mr420man (May 11, 2016)

highdave said:


> I'm sure it's possible. I've seen side by sides on a 1000 on a mover and 3 315. Gotta say 315 side looked much better. You will save for sure my bill went up 40 bucks after I set the tent up. Fans and all.
> 
> I will know soon in about a month how much I yield. Shooting for first week of may. I have holes in my canopy so that will take away. I want at least .5 per watt on this first run. But still 150 gs or so for personal use should be fine.


I saw that video he did a good comparison


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## feloniousfunk (May 11, 2016)

Howdy 315 gang, Just got my large Truthband into her final flower home.
Her set up is a 39x39x79 tent, 315 Phantom 3100K, couple clip on fans, and a Phresh 6x16 carbon/exhaust.
She is in a 5 gallon Smart pot, sitting in a 2x2 flood tray, drilled on the edge for tie downs. I've stopped the FP for now and she is on Emerald Harvest, the transition formula, and begins flower cycle tonight. 
Here she is from the side before moving into tent:
 

And here she is in her tent, getting the final tie down and judicious trim tonight:

 

I will tie her down to even the canopy out, and she should should fill out the tent nicely.

Well, wish it was more exciting ATM, but will keep you updated and the fun gets going.

Peace!


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## ttystikk (May 11, 2016)

feloniousfunk said:


> Howdy 315 gang, Just got my large Truthband into her final flower home.
> Her set up is a 39x39x79 tent, 315 Phantom 3100K, couple clip on fans, and a Phresh 6x16 carbon/exhaust.
> She is in a 5 gallon Smart pot, sitting in a 2x2 flood tray, drilled on the edge for tie downs. I've stopped the FP for now and she is on Emerald Harvest, the transition formula, and begins flower cycle tonight.
> Here she is from the side before moving into tent:
> ...


What are you talking about, not exciting? That girl looks great and it's fun to hear that you're using tie downs instead of the usual SCRoG screen. Back in the day, I did tie downs and it worked just fine. 

Good memories of good times! 

Keep up the great work!


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## Schmarmpit (May 11, 2016)

I am glad to join the club. Just got the 315w CDM $200 ballast + bulb from the ATS guy. Best price around and shipping was like Amazon Prime. 
http://advancedtechlighting.com/cdmmw.htm

I've got a 3' x 3' tent and have messed around with 400w HPS, 600w HPS, 400w CMH. and now this 315w LEC. It's only been a couple days but the light seems more penetrating than my previous 400w CMH bulb.


----------



## ttystikk (May 11, 2016)

Schmarmpit said:


> I am glad to join the club. Just got the 315w CDM $200 ballast + bulb from the ATS guy. Best price around and shipping was like Amazon Prime.
> http://advancedtechlighting.com/cdmmw.htm
> 
> I've got a 3' x 3' tent and have messed around with 400w HPS, 600w HPS, 400w CMH. and now this 315w LEC. It's only been a couple days but the light seems more penetrating than my previous 400w CMH bulb.


I've been running mine for awhile and I'm very happy with them.


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## GrumpyT0ker (May 11, 2016)

You'd you guys agree that scrog is the best setup for a 315 LEC


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## Growdict (May 11, 2016)

i think any training that gets your buds to an even canopy is best in any horizontal setup, although maybe it matters less in a really high powered setup. idk. my first run was 4 plants in scrog, this current one is more of a free style sog with 12 plants and the next one almost ready for the flowering tent will be 4 mainlined plants to 32 tops.


----------



## ttystikk (May 11, 2016)

GrumpyT0ker said:


> You'd you guys agree that scrog is the best setup for a 315 LEC


Not exactly... They work just fine vert and bare for vertical grows. I'm using them in just such a capacity with great success.


----------



## Growdict (May 11, 2016)

arent you still using your vert scrog ttystikk?


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## ttystikk (May 11, 2016)

Growdict said:


> arent you still using your vert scrog ttystikk?


I sure am, why?


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## Growdict (May 11, 2016)

Lol. His question was if it worked best with scrog. You also use a type of scrog. I listed a few other ways to get an even surface for those photons to hit.


----------



## pinner420 (May 12, 2016)

I don't want to cut the frost off..


----------



## Evil-Mobo (May 12, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> View attachment 3680295 I don't want to cut the frost off..


WOW! What is that??? 

Looks great!


----------



## ttystikk (May 12, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> View attachment 3680295 I don't want to cut the frost off..


Wow, that's gorgeous!


----------



## pinner420 (May 12, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> WOW! What is that???
> 
> Looks great!


Black rose.. Thank you @ttystikk for all the advice on my 315 selection it paid off. It literally smells like a rose sweet and robust will go good with a cup of huckleberry coffee.


----------



## Kasuti (May 13, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Wow, that's gorgeous!


Hey ttystikk, do the315lec promote more sidebranching and bud sites or is this just me being optimistic?


----------



## ttystikk (May 13, 2016)

Kasuti said:


> Hey ttystikk, do the315lec promote more sidebranching and bud sites or is this just me being optimistic?


Tough call for me to make; I'm gonna say they just encourage a lot more growth overall.


----------



## Kasuti (May 13, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Tough call for me to make; I'm gonna say they just encourage a lot more growth overall.


This is my first run indoors and I was very suprised at the amount of budding sites my girls have. They are doing a helluva lot better than they ever have outdoors. I'm sold on this light and I've still got a few weeks to go. great investment.


----------



## Kasuti (May 13, 2016)

Kasuti said:


> This is my first run indoors and I was very suprised at the amount of budding sites my girls have. They are doing a helluva lot better than they ever have outdoors. I'm sold on this light and I've still got a few weeks to go. great investment.


One more question for ya. what are the advantages of growing with a kickass vert setup like you use?


----------



## DesertGrow89 (May 13, 2016)

Kasuti said:


> One more question for ya. what are the advantages of growing with a kickass vert setup like you use?


Well it allows one to yield more in a given space due to the fact that you can grow a larger volume of plants that get an even distribution of light and they are easier to work on than horizontal grows. And trees look generally far more badass than a bush!


----------



## Kasuti (May 13, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> Well it allows one to yield more in a given space due to the fact that you can grow a larger volume of plants that get an even distribution of light and they are easier to work on than horizontal grows. And trees look generally far more badass than a bush!


I know what you mean when you said a nice big tree is much cooler than a small bush. there's nothing cooler than standing in the shadow of a 10ft monster!


----------



## ttystikk (May 14, 2016)

Kasuti said:


> One more question for ya. what are the advantages of growing with a kickass vert setup like you use?


Space efficiency and productivity.


----------



## ttystikk (May 14, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> Well it allows one to yield more in a given space due to the fact that you can grow a larger volume of plants that get an even distribution of light and they are easier to work on than horizontal grows. And trees look generally far more badass than a bush!


I second this.


----------



## pinner420 (May 14, 2016)

Kasuti said:


> One more question for ya. what are the advantages of growing with a kickass vert setup like you use?


To many to list but another favorite is less heat and light is nice and tight to the plant. So no cooling fan designated to cooling and expensive hood that reduces light by 10%. Oh and it's quieter.


----------



## highdave (May 14, 2016)

How my Friday night went
60 day veg from seed(lost 2 weeks of training due to work trip.)
57 days in flower
156.9g or 5.6 oz
Still have one plant to take down


----------



## Kasuti (May 14, 2016)

highdave said:


> How my Friday night went
> 60 day veg from seed(lost 2 weeks of training due to work trip.)
> 57 days in flower
> 156.9g or 5.6 oz
> Still have one plant to take down


Jars full of bud always makes me smile


----------



## feloniousfunk (May 16, 2016)

Hey gang, quick question for anyone with completed 315 cmh runs......what is the consensus for distance from hood to canopy?
Also, I would like to trim off anything below the optimal penetration distance from the bulb....anyone have a ballpark for that?

If it helps, my canopy if basically 3x3 with one plant tied down as best I could to keep it even.

Thanks for any guidance!


----------



## Growdict (May 16, 2016)

personally i was 20-22" away from light. canopy about 12" thick


----------



## feloniousfunk (May 16, 2016)

Thanks growdict, really appreciate the fast reply....sounds like decent parameters for me to start with.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (May 16, 2016)

Which Kelvin rating are you guys preferring for this light?


----------



## Growdict (May 16, 2016)

i have only used the 3100k


----------



## Kasuti (May 16, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Which Kelvin rating are you guys preferring for this light?


3100k and its doing a great job so far


----------



## ttystikk (May 16, 2016)

My lamps are the 4000K, working great in veg. I don't bloom with them.


----------



## GroErr (May 16, 2016)

feloniousfunk said:


> Hey gang, quick question for anyone with completed 315 cmh runs......what is the consensus for distance from hood to canopy?
> Also, I would like to trim off anything below the optimal penetration distance from the bulb....anyone have a ballpark for that?
> 
> If it helps, my canopy if basically 3x3 with one plant tied down as best I could to keep it even.
> ...


20-22" is good, you could go a bit higher if your plants are not too tall. At 20-22" they can grow decent bud as far down as 30" below the canopy.



Evil-Mobo said:


> Which Kelvin rating are you guys preferring for this light?


Have only used the 3100k's. Some have reported using the 4200k's for flowering and they'd probably do fine but the 3100k's provide a great flowering spectrum.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (May 16, 2016)

GroErr said:


> 20-22" is good, you could go a bit higher if your plants are not too tall. At 20-22" they can grow decent bud as far down as 30" below the canopy.
> 
> 
> Have only used the 3100k's. Some have reported using the 4200k's for flowering and they'd probably do fine but the 3100k's provide a great flowering spectrum.


How do you compare it to COB's?


----------



## Growdict (May 16, 2016)

it is apparently not quite as effiecient as cobs.
500w hps= 315w cmh=250w cobs? probably something like that.


----------



## GroErr (May 16, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> How do you compare it to COB's?


Can't really compare it yet as I haven't run through a whole grow with 3590's or comparable even after the first run I just started. Would have to do a side-by-side and quite frankly I don't expect there would be any _significant_ difference, explained below. Compared to some older COBs I've pulled higher gpw with same strains under the 315's.



Growdict said:


> it is apparently not quite as effiecient as cobs.
> 500w hps= 315w cmh=250w cobs? probably something like that.


Efficiency is only one factor though, there's a lot of talk about efficiency like it'll make or break a grow or yields. imo the difference between them in efficiency would be made up in the wider spectrum provided by the 315's if no other supplements like 660nm or 730nm triggers were used with the COBs.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (May 16, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Can't really compare it yet as I haven't run through a whole grow with 3590's or comparable even after the first run I just started. Would have to do a side-by-side and quite frankly I don't expect there would be any _significant_ difference, explained below. Compared to some older COBs I've pulled higher gpw with same strains under the 315's.
> 
> 
> Efficiency is only one factor though, there's a lot of talk about efficiency like it'll make or break a grow or yields. imo the difference between them in efficiency would be made up in the wider spectrum provided by the 315's if no other supplements like 660nm or 730nm triggers were used with the COBs.


Thanks for the reply, I am debating the 315 CMH or 3590's with UV for a tent........


----------



## ttystikk (May 16, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Thanks for the reply, I am debating the 315 CMH or 3590's with UV for a tent........


I've been running the CXB3590 and I've seen nothing that tells me the plants need UV.


----------



## pinner420 (May 16, 2016)

9 vert.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (May 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I've been running the CXB3590 and I've seen nothing that tells me the plants need UV.


It's a test and only because it's already on hand.


----------



## MurphyTLO420 (May 16, 2016)

I'm generally 1.5 to 2 feet above my canopy.. I'm running the sun system 315 lec on 220 and have had a great experience with them I have 5 and two LEDs in my flower room


----------



## Evil-Mobo (May 19, 2016)

MurphyTLO420 said:


> I'm generally 1.5 to 2 feet above my canopy.. I'm running the sun system 315 lec on 220 and have had a great experience with them I have 5 and two LEDs in my flower room


Which bulb are you running in your LEC's?


----------



## MurphyTLO420 (May 19, 2016)

The sunsystem Phillips bulb 3100


----------



## Evil-Mobo (May 19, 2016)

MurphyTLO420 said:


> The sunsystem Phillips bulb 3100


Thanks I submitted an offer on one let's see if they accept lol...... 

If not I will try to sell or trade my spare COB for one ..........


----------



## Schmarmpit (May 20, 2016)

Anyone else here use the 4K bulb for flowering? Advanced Technology Solutions guy definitely was pushing them.
"We sell all the lamps but In horticulture after real testing we like the 210 and 315 in 4K Mogul Format". 

I had two plants finishing flowering under my old 600w HPS. They looked just a day or two away from being finished so I swapped in my new 315w 4K to get ready for the next plants. The very next day they had new calyxes and white hairs popping up like mad. I'm having a hard time believing it was just coincidence. Now I'm going to wait a bit longer to see what this new growth does. 

Very excited from what I'm seeing so far from these lights. And for only $200 with free shipping for ballast and bulb I'm going to have to pick up another soon.


----------



## DesertGrow89 (May 20, 2016)

Yes in


Schmarmpit said:


> Anyone else here use the 4K bulb for flowering? Advanced Technology Solutions guy definitely was pushing them.
> "We sell all the lamps but In horticulture after real testing we like the 210 and 315 in 4K Mogul Format".
> 
> I had two plants finishing flowering under my old 600w HPS. They looked just a day or two away from being finished so I swapped in my new 315w 4K to get ready for the next plants. The very next day they had new calyxes and white hairs popping up like mad. I'm having a hard time believing it was just coincidence. Now I'm going to wait a bit longer to see what this new growth does.
> ...


Yes im almost in week five of flower and using one 315 3000k and one 210w 4200k seems to be working quite well. Will update this sunday


----------



## wowowee (May 20, 2016)

Schmarmpit said:


> Anyone else here use the 4K bulb for flowering? Advanced Technology Solutions guy definitely was pushing them.
> "We sell all the lamps but In horticulture after real testing we like the 210 and 315 in 4K Mogul Format".
> 
> I had two plants finishing flowering under my old 600w HPS. They looked just a day or two away from being finished so I swapped in my new 315w 4K to get ready for the next plants. The very next day they had new calyxes and white hairs popping up like mad. I'm having a hard time believing it was just coincidence. Now I'm going to wait a bit longer to see what this new growth does.
> ...


Just to confirm, all issues are resolved with the vendor? Also, do you have a suggestion for a solution from his site for a 2.5 'x 2.5' tent? Maybe a 210? Looking at budget/small space ideas with this spectrum.


----------



## Schmarmpit (May 20, 2016)

wowowee said:


> Just to confirm, all issues are resolved with the vendor? Also, do you have a suggestion for a solution from his site for a 2.5 'x 2.5' tent? Maybe a 210? Looking at budget/small space ideas with this spectrum.


Yeah, he shipped the order the same day and I had it 3 days later. I'm using a 315w in a 3x3. Not sure if I would drop the wattage for a slightly smaller space. Heat really isn't even a factor.


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## Evil-Mobo (May 20, 2016)

wowowee said:


> Just to confirm, all issues are resolved with the vendor? Also, do you have a suggestion for a solution from his site for a 2.5 'x 2.5' tent? Maybe a 210? Looking at budget/small space ideas with this spectrum.


I do not think the 314 will fit in the 2.5x2.5 but make sure. I have a 20" x 36" that it would not fit in.


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## DesertGrow89 (May 20, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I do not think the 314 will fit in the 2.5x2.5 but make sure. I have a 20" x 36" that it would not fit in.


It will they are 21.5" long. A 210 or 315 would do but in a tent that small @wowowee you may be fighting heat. If you have the space just build a frame out of 2x4s and panda film it. How small is your space?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (May 20, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> It will they are 21.5" long. A 210 or 315 would do but in a tent that small @wowowee you may be fighting heat. If you have the space just build a frame out of 2x4s and panda film it. How small is your space?


Well then he got lucky. I am fighting heat in my 20x36 so no biggie. 

I have a 2x4 right now with heat issues as well that will be moved tomorrow. I will be adding another tent soon and that's what I want the 315 LEC for to compare with my COB's......


----------



## DesertGrow89 (May 20, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Well then he got lucky. I am fighting heat in my 20x36 so no biggie.
> 
> I have a 2x4 right now with heat issues as well that will be moved tomorrow. I will be adding another tent soon and that's what I want the 315 LEC for to compare with my COB's......


Perhaps cut the top off if it's a tent and pull cool air in. People say exhaust hot air out but I've always found bringing cool air from the floor in works better..


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## Evil-Mobo (May 20, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> Perhaps cut the top off if it's a tent and pull cool air in. People say exhaust hot air out but I've always found bringing cool air from the floor in works better..


I will be rectifying this issue tomorrow by moving the tent from where it is to somewhere cooler. But thanks for the advice.


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## wowowee (May 20, 2016)

Schmarmpit said:


> Yeah, he shipped the order the same day and I had it 3 days later. I'm using a 315w in a 3x3. Not sure if I would drop the wattage for a slightly smaller space. Heat really isn't even a factor.


My 2.5 x 2.5 is what I intend to use for my closet. I could squeeze a 3 x 3 in there. What's the rest of your set up if you don't mind me asking, "I wanna be like you...."


----------



## highdave (May 22, 2016)

Cola from Pheno 2
Mmmmm
60 day veg
72 days in flower


----------



## DesertGrow89 (May 22, 2016)

Week five of flower is done and there's some good and bad news.. Bad news is that one of the jackberry phenotypes just doesn't want to ripen, pistils are remaining white. Some of the top colas on it are growing right next to each other, hopefully there won't be any mildew problems. The good news is that one pheno is beginning to express some nice traits, a pungent blueberry scent but subtle enough so that it doesn't smell outside of the apartment. Calyxes are beginning to turn purple on this one and she's maturing quickly. Some beans are forming in the lower buds, I sprayed them with tiresias mist for a couple weeks at the beginning of flower.


----------



## DesertGrow89 (May 22, 2016)

This is a Dr. Greenthumb OG Kush that was ran 12/12 from seed, confirmed female and is going back into veg as she was a little late into the flower area, upcanned into a five yesterday. 




The plan is to fasten some chicken wire to this wall for the next flowering cycle and grow them vertically against it, it's about 7 ft wide, two fixtures. Will be a bit of work rigging up something that will allow them to adjust up and down with growth but I'll figure something out.


----------



## pinner420 (May 22, 2016)

Weirdest thing my breaker tripped the other day same load as always...trippy..


----------



## ttystikk (May 22, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> Weirdest thing my breaker tripped the other day same load as always...trippy..


Yeah, same thing happened to me. Weirder, it happened during the one night I was out in like a month!


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## Kasuti (May 22, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> Weirdest thing my breaker tripped the other day same load as always...trippy..


Might be an old breaker. They're prone to tripping when they get old or have been tripped a lot of times.


----------



## ttystikk (May 22, 2016)

Kasuti said:


> Might be an old breaker. They're prone to tripping when they get old or have been tripped a lot of times.


Mine did it too- breaker and install are only a year old.


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## Kasuti (May 22, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Mine did it too- breaker and install are only a year old.


That's kinda odd to have happen if everything is wired up properly which I'm sure it must be or you would have had problems immediately. Maybe a power spike?


----------



## caumop (May 22, 2016)

Schmarmpit said:


> Anyone else here use the 4K bulb for flowering? Advanced Technology Solutions guy definitely was pushing them.
> "We sell all the lamps but In horticulture after real testing we like the 210 and 315 in 4K Mogul Format".
> 
> I had two plants finishing flowering under my old 600w HPS. They looked just a day or two away from being finished so I swapped in my new 315w 4K to get ready for the next plants. The very next day they had new calyxes and white hairs popping up like mad. I'm having a hard time believing it was just coincidence. Now I'm going to wait a bit longer to see what this new growth does.
> ...


$200 is a good price and with free shipping. Where did you score this at? Did a reflector come with it?


----------



## Schmarmpit (May 23, 2016)

caumop said:


> $200 is a good price and with free shipping. Where did you score this at? Did a reflector come with it?


No reflector, just ballast and bulb. You will also need a transformer if you want to run off 120VAC since the ballast is only 220V input. 
http://advancedtechlighting.com/cdmmw.htm


----------



## ttystikk (May 23, 2016)

Schmarmpit said:


> No reflector, just ballast and bulb. You will also need a transformer if you want to run off 120VAC since the ballast is only 220V input.
> http://advancedtechlighting.com/cdmmw.htm


I got a dozen of these kits from him. Getting him to actually package and ship them was interesting, fair warning. 

I'm running half of these in my prebloom veg, to great effect.


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## Growdict (May 23, 2016)

315 update. Pic 1 a ww and 2 crown royale 16" tall 2nd day of 12/12 mainlined to 8 tops
Pic 2 crown royale 30 days in 12/12. This thing is going to be a monster
Pic 3 -10x2 gallon watermelon clones i took during flower from last run 45 days at 12/12. Buds are growing a little wierd. Looks like trimmimg will be easy on these


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## Ryante55 (May 23, 2016)

Hey I don't think I've every posted here before but thought I should share my lec experience with everyone. I have 2 rooms that are 3x8 each room has 3 315watt nanolux fixtures all 3100k bulbs. The first room is in week 3 of flower 12 plants 5gal smart pots organic amended soil with a bloom top dress and some tea every week. Strain is citrus SAP picked up from harborside oakland. I'll post more pics soon and take some of the 2nd room


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## caumop (May 23, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I got a dozen of these kits from him. Getting him to actually package and ship them was interesting, fair warning.
> 
> I'm running half of these in my prebloom veg, to great effect.


Thanks for the warning. I found another review that said this guy was a thief. I think I will keep researching and look at what other companies have to offer.


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## ttystikk (May 23, 2016)

caumop said:


> Thanks for the warning. I found another review that said this guy was a thief. I think I will keep researching and look at what other companies have to offer.


Not a thief, just over worked. The equipment is fine.


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## hyroot (May 23, 2016)

caumop said:


> Thanks for the warning. I found another review that said this guy was a thief. I think I will keep researching and look at what other companies have to offer.



He has some condition. He's highly medicated all the time. He's not always coherent. He just lags on sending out items sometimes. Customer service is good but slow some of the time.

It's a good idea to call and make sure everything is being sent. I've bought all start 330's from there. I have a few friends who bought all start 860's and 330's from him


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## Ryante55 (May 23, 2016)

Here's a few more pics of the citrus sap the first pic is may 4th the rest are may 18th I'll make another post with current pics


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## Ryante55 (May 23, 2016)

Here's citrus sap today may 23


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## Ryante55 (May 23, 2016)

And room number 2 still in veg strain is clementine. Room 1 citrus sap lights were flipped may 7. Room 2 clementine will be flipped by may 30


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## Pig4buzz (May 23, 2016)

Ryante55 said:


> And room number 2 still in veg strain is clementine. Room 1 citrus sap lights were flipped may 7. Room 2 clementine will be flipped by may 30


How far are lights off plants? Looks high


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## Ryante55 (May 23, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> Weirdest thing my breaker tripped the other day same load as always...trippy..


 Happened to me before think the


Pig4buzz said:


> How far are lights off plants? Looks high


Pretty high I was trying to get them to stretch a little I'll put them around 18in when I flip to 12/12


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## KushyMcKush (May 25, 2016)

Hey guys, I just found this thread. I am on my first grow and after months of lighting research I settled on the Sun System 315 LEC. My plants have only been under it for 4 days (previously under 4x4' t5 HO). So far Im loving it, it feels very nice and comfortable in the grow area and the plants seem to be loving it. I have it in a 3.5'x4.5'x10'T closet, temps stay consistant at 75-78F with no heat exhause vents. I will be adding vents this week though for the warmer months.
Growing White Widow x 2, White Cookies x 2, Purple Kush x 2, and 2 mystery bagseed plants.
Light is at 21" for the 2 large, and 24" from the 6 small.

Im still adding to the room, so any suggestions are welcome. Ill be adding something to the bare wood floor to reduce chances of mold (tarp or some kind of plastic). Also need to do some elctrical work to clean it up a bit.


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## Pig4buzz (May 25, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Hey guys, I just found this thread. I am on my first grow and after months of lighting research I settled on the Sun System 315 LEC. My plants have only been under it for 4 days (previously under 4x4' t5 HO). So far Im loving it, it feels very nice and comfortable in the grow area and the plants seem to be loving it. I have it in a 3.5'x4.5'x10'T closet, temps stay consistant at 75-78F with no heat exhause vents. I will be adding vents this week though for the warmer months.
> Growing White Widow x 2, White Cookies x 2, Purple Kush x 2, and 2 mystery bagseed plants.
> Light is at 21" for the 2 large, and 24" from the 6 small.
> 
> Im still adding to the room, so any suggestions are welcome. Ill be adding something to the bare wood floor to reduce chances of mold (tarp or some kind of plastic). Also need to do some elctrical work to clean it up a bit.


You need a drain tray for sure to keep moisture off floor. Maybe transplant the babies in larger pots or get a plastic container to sit them on to bring them up even with large. Just what I might do. Love the light nice


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## KushyMcKush (May 25, 2016)

Thanks Pig. I plan on doing the floor soon here. Ill probably just get a tarp or something and cut/staple it down and come up a few inches from the ground on the walls to completely waterproof it. I do live in a very dry climate though which requires a humidifier running 18/6 with the lights to just keep the humidity within 45-50% so Im not overly concerned about mold or rotting until I move to larger pots.


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## Rhino king (May 26, 2016)

Growdict said:


> View attachment 3648337 View attachment 3648338
> Couple pics.


Looking good my man is that lec 315 or


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## Rhino king (May 26, 2016)

highdave said:


> Hell ya man. Are you replacing watt for watt? Or close so 3 315w, 945w per 1000?
> 
> First grow and jumped in with a 315 in a 3x3. Temp inside litterally runs 3 degrees warmer then the room(closet) it's sitting in. With the 6in fan set to low. I think 206cfm. I can put my hand on top of the hood after 10 hours of it being on.
> 
> I'm loving this light and glad I grabbed it. Pics are 18 days into flower





GroErr said:


> Good spot to share 315w info. Been running 2 of them perpetual for close to 2 years now. They rock watt-for-watt against hps, typically about 25% more weight, and quality is better than hps imo. My son was a die hard hps grower until he saw what I was getting with these Sun Systems LEC's. We converted his grow watt-for-watt with these LEC's and he's been consistently pulling 25-30% more weight and is very happy with the quality. He just bought another 10 units for his expansion, no going back to hps for him if that tells you anything. I just swapped out one of the units to see how 3590 COBs stack against the LEC's but the LEC's aren't going away, will likely run a combo of COBs/LEC through summer and LEC's through the winter.
> 
> View attachment 3659994
> 
> Cheers


Mean bro


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## Rhino king (May 26, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> View attachment 3669473
> 5 weeks! Sticky sweet.


Badass bro mutant very impressive


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## Rhino king (May 26, 2016)

highdave said:


> First plant harvested! These things kick ass.View attachment 3677822
> 
> Pheno 2 got a little too close. 12 inches apparently is too close. I call this one 3 sistersView attachment 3677821


Looks mean as


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## Rhino king (May 26, 2016)

MurphyTLO420 said:


> I'm generally 1.5 to 2 feet above my canopy.. I'm running the sun system 315 lec on 220 and have had a great experience with them I have 5 and two LEDs in my flower room


Nice bro nice hoods look a bit bigger than the sunsystem 315z


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## Rhino king (May 26, 2016)

highdave said:


> Hell ya man. Are you replacing watt for watt? Or close so 3 315w, 945w per 1000?
> 
> First grow and jumped in with a 315 in a 3x3. Temp inside litterally runs 3 degrees warmer then the room(closet) it's sitting in. With the 6in fan set to low. I think 206cfm. I can put my hand on top of the hood after 10 hours of it being on.
> 
> I'm loving this light and glad I grabbed it. Pics are 18 days into flower


----------



## Rhino king (May 26, 2016)

Hey bud im new to this site and dont know how to post storys and photos can you tell me how thanx


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## KushyMcKush (May 26, 2016)

Rhino, welcome to the forum man. I have also only been on here for a few days now. As far as online forums go the people here seem to be pretty helpful. 
To quote someone elses post and add your own text just hit the "reply" button at the bottom of their post. 
To post pictures, just hit the "upload a file" button ar the bottom of where your typing your post and it will have you select a file from your computer/phone. Ive also see people post photos using what looks like html in their actual posts instead of attaching as a file to the bottom. This is done by using an html code linking to a 3rd party file hosting site such as photobucket/flikr. 
I am using an iphone, but I imagine the options would be similar or identical on a pc.


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## Rhino king (May 26, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Rhino, welcome to the forum man. I have also only been on here for a few days now. As far as online forums go the people here seem to be pretty helpful.
> To quote someone elses post and add your own text just hit the "reply" button at the bottom of their post.
> To post pictures, just hit the "upload a file" button ar the bottom of where your typing your post and it will have you select a file from your computer/phone. Ive also see people post photos using what looks like html in their actual posts instead of attaching as a file to the bottom. This is done by using an html code linking to a 3rd party file hosting site such as photobucket/flikr.
> I am using an iphone, but I imagine the options would be similar or identical on a pc.


Thanks for your reply man ive got some awesome photos im going to take , can u upload a video and post or just photos i hope people comment always good to see what fellow growers think cheers bro grow hard


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## Growdict (May 26, 2016)

Do you have a 315 also rhino?


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## KushyMcKush (May 26, 2016)

Rhino king said:


> Thanks for your reply man ive got some awesome photos im going to take , can u upload a video and post or just photos i hope people comment always good to see what fellow growers think cheers bro grow hard


Im not sure about video, but I have seen people upload .gif's. Looking forward to seeing them brotha. Its always fun to see other people's setups and get ideas


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## Rhino king (May 26, 2016)

Growdict said:


> Do you have a 315 also rhino?


Yes im guna stick some photos up my man, got an ok setup always lookin at new tech , im likeing the lec at 4 weeks il put up the photos tonite when lights are fired up was to smashed lastnite lol smoking white rhino x and mean bubble hash lol look foward to putting up photos


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## Rhino king (May 26, 2016)

Any help my fellow freinds are turbokloners worth it .They are pricey things im looking at the t96 any help would be good 
Cheerz


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## Evil-Mobo (May 26, 2016)

Clone king on Amazon is $60 and works


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## Rhino king (May 26, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Clone king on Amazon is $60 and works


Cheers ive seen it etc i think il check out thanks bud


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## Evil-Mobo (May 26, 2016)

No sweat good luck my 315 comes tomorrow


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## Rhino king (May 26, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> No sweat good luck my 315 comes tomorrow


Kool is yours a sunsystem or something else. Ive seen the other usa brands etc they all look pretty good to me some vertical some horizontal etc. But from what ive seen they look pretty sharp and hopefully what ive been checking out isnt a optical illusion etc because they all look pretty badass the growoffs etc and videos etc kendo & cali crop doc. It got me pumped im 4 weeks in looking pretty mean bro you will see some shots tonite my time happy grow bud


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## Evil-Mobo (May 26, 2016)

Yes I got the Sun Systems brand couldn't pass on the price I got it for


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## Rhino king (May 26, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Yes I got the Sun Systems brand couldn't pass on the price I got it for


Sweet az i payed 890.00 ive got 2 and two galaxy 600 Selecta watt etc with 2 600 digimax hps


----------



## Evil-Mobo (May 28, 2016)




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## feloniousfunk (Jun 5, 2016)

Just a quick update tonight, here is my single girl on day 25 under her 315 in the 39"x39" tent.
I'll catch up soon, jobs been kickin my old ass.


----------



## Ryante55 (Jun 5, 2016)

Jun 3rd almost a month in flower


----------



## bob223 (Jun 6, 2016)

feloniousfunk said:


> Just a quick update tonight, here is my single girl on day 25 under her 315 in the 39"x39" tent.
> I'll catch up soon, jobs been kickin my old ass.
> View attachment 3700757



KILLLING THE SCROG!!!!!! what is the strain? 

So what is everyone's average yield? i have running 4 plants perpetually and averaging 2.5 to 3 ounces per plant. 
I do not see any reason with a good yielding strain that 1 lb per light would not be attainable? 

I dont run any big yielding strains they are all just average yield with high potency.


----------



## feloniousfunk (Jun 6, 2016)

bob223 said:


> KILLLING THE SCROG!!!!!! what is the strain?
> 
> So what is everyone's average yield? i have running 4 plants perpetually and averaging 2.5 to 3 ounces per plant.
> I do not see any reason with a good yielding strain that 1 lb per light would not be attainable?
> ...


HEy bob223, I suck at the net thing  First time not doing christmas tree style. So, really the nets are there for support as all the training was done with yarn prior to flower. I totally stripped her on day 20 and put the nets in at that time. Who knows how it will turn out, but so far, so good.

The strain is 707 Truthband....pheno'd cut passed to me by a friend. First time with this plant, and these 315s, so no clue on yields yet.
I'm hoping for something close to gram per watt when all said and done.


----------



## Ryante55 (Jun 6, 2016)

feloniousfunk said:


> Just a quick update tonight, here is my single girl on day 25 under her 315 in the 39"x39" tent.
> I'll catch up soon, jobs been kickin my old ass.
> View attachment 3700757


Soil or hydro? How big is that pot an what was your veg time? I wanted to do 1 plant per light but went with 4 plants per light in 5 gal soil to cut veg time. But I still ended up vegging like 3 or 4 weeks :/


----------



## DesertGrow89 (Jun 6, 2016)

Its the end of week seven for these two, one was culled because it just didn't want to ripen around week five of flower. That's OK, because these two are filling out the footprint of these lights decently, the plan is to take em' down this weekend. It's been hot as hell here, the past few days have been in the low 90s outside and ambient inside is in the low 80s. It would be nice to have central AC but I manage with a wimpy window AC, the cold air get blown from one room to the grow room with a fan.. lol. 

The pheno in the foreground is slightly higher yielding, jack leaning, while the one in the back is blueberry leaning. Unfortunately temps aren't cool enough to express da purps as Sannie has pictured on his site, but that's OK because the terps smell awesome! Their colas are still stacking and have become too much for the branches so they have been tied up, perhaps I should have abused them more in veg for strength.

 

Blueberry pheno, denser than the jack:

 
 

Jack pheno:


----------



## feloniousfunk (Jun 7, 2016)

Ryante55 said:


> Soil or hydro? How big is that pot an what was your veg time? I wanted to do 1 plant per light but went with 4 plants per light in 5 gal soil to cut veg time. But I still ended up vegging like 3 or 4 weeks :/


She is coco, 5gal smart pot, approx 6 week veg from rooted clone.


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## Ryante55 (Jun 7, 2016)

feloniousfunk said:


> She is coco, 5gal smart pot, approx 6 week veg from rooted clone.


Nice I hope she yields a pound for you I might have to start doing 1 per light


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Jun 7, 2016)

I am new to growing and to this light, and for her first run I have one plant under it and she's soaking it all up. Depending on the yield I might not go to 4 plants per run like I was planning.........

From my exp so far between T5, LED , and this CMH, this light has been the easiest to work with by far.


----------



## Ryante55 (Jun 7, 2016)

I like 4 because you can train less and get a really deep canopy but doing 1 per light perpetual with 3 lights sounds perfect ideally would be a pound a month


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Jun 7, 2016)

Ryante55 said:


> I like 4 because you can train less and get a really deep canopy but doing 1 per light perpetual with 3 lights sounds perfect ideally would be a pound a month


If I am not mistaken @Bad Karma has three 3x3's running a 315w CMH in each......... would definitely be a killer setup........


----------



## GroErr (Jun 7, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I am new to growing and to this light, and for her first run I have one plant under it and she's soaking it all up. Depending on the yield I might not go to 4 plants per run like I was planning.........
> 
> From my exp so far between T5, LED , and this CMH, this light has been the easiest to work with by far.


Number of plants has less to do with yields than square footage, actually cubic footage. So as long as you fill your space, including some height with these LEC's as they penetrate well, you'll maximize your yields in whatever space you're running. I find fewer, large plants easier to manage but I like variety so I change it up all the time. Regardless of what size pot or number of plants, I just try and fill the available space with tops and generally gives me decent yields.


----------



## Ryante55 (Jun 7, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> If I am not mistaken @Bad Karma has three 3x3's running a 315w CMH in each......... would definitely be a killer setup........


 Ya I was going to do that but its way cheaper to build a room I made a 3x8 its was like $150 for all the wood sheetrock and orca film plus I only need 1 exhaust fan. I'll probably just veg 1 plant at a time in a 2x2 from now on so I can throw a new plant in the flower room every 6 weeks


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Jun 7, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Number of plants has less to do with yields than square footage, actually cubic footage. So as long as you fill your space, including some height with these LEC's as they penetrate well, you'll maximize your yields in whatever space you're running. I find fewer, large plants easier to manage but I like variety so I change it up all the time. Regardless of what size pot or number of plants, I just try and fill the available space with tops and generally gives me decent yields.


I like variety too. My thinking for the moment is going forward two plants in the 3x3 with a decent veg time to get the plant structure I like, and then continue to run the auto's in my veg tent which takes care of the variety for me lol.....

But trust me I have a good amount of beans here and it's hard to not just start popping beans everyday.......lol........

Here's a couple pics of my NL lady under the 315, she's about a week and a half under it and 26 days or so into flower. These pics are from a couple of days ago.


----------



## Ryante55 (Jun 7, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I like variety too. My thinking for the moment is going forward two plants in the 3x3 with a decent veg time to get the plant structure I like, and then continue to run the auto's in my veg tent which takes care of the variety for me lol.....
> 
> But trust me I have a good amount of beans here and it's hard to not just start popping beans everyday.......lol........


Do you like the autos? I've tried a few they all had terrible smoke and yield. Weren't worth the electricity or soil but I would like to try again if I could find good genetics


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 7, 2016)

I should be harvesting my first auto in about 4 weeks I would imagine so can't say yet. Like I said before I am new to this. So right now my comments are based on the exp I have had thus far. The autos for me are cool, especially in the FFOF soil because it's basically set and forget. Just add water lol......

I placed one order a bit ago of just auto's for some variety, and recently found mephisto and they deliver in the US now so ordered with them recently to try his genetics out. Looks good and no more worries about customs. I am actually excited about the mephisto beans the grows on here (especially @TaNg PeNg ) look really good.


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## Ryante55 (Jun 7, 2016)

I think autos are cool but the added light ends up not being worth the cost extra 6 hours of light every day gets expensive


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## GroErr (Jun 7, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I like variety too. My thinking for the moment is going forward two plants in the 3x3 with a decent veg time to get the plant structure I like, and then continue to run the auto's in my veg tent which takes care of the variety for me lol.....
> 
> But trust me I have a good amount of beans here and it's hard to not just start popping beans everyday.......lol........
> 
> ...


Looking good, 4 of those would fill that space and maximize yield. They could be 4 different strains/phenos though


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## Ryante55 (Jun 7, 2016)

Citrus sap 30 days in flower about a 12 to 18in canopy depth room was getting to hot so I shut the middle light off hopefully the heat stress didn't stunt them to much


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## Ryante55 (Jun 7, 2016)

Ryante55 said:


> Citrus sap 30 days in flower about a 12 to 18in canopy depth room was getting to hot so I shut the middle light off hopefully the heat stress didn't stunt them to much


Wait I'm stupid this ruler goes to 18 in so about an 18 to 24in canopy


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 7, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Looking good, 4 of those would fill that space and maximize yield. They could be 4 different strains/phenos though


That's what my intention was/is for run #2 if I can hold off the plants in veg long enough for the NL to finish. I have 4 Barney's seedlings that are different strains but all indica doiminant to help with managing the canopy...........


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## Growdict (Jun 9, 2016)

oh man so excited with my 315w results. last run i only pulled 1/2lb, but it was my first and there is a learning curve to this growing thing. this run i had 10x2gal clones and one 5 gallon from seed. i weighed my first plant that was dried last night after 5 days hanging. and got 40g. it was even on the smaller side compared to a few in there still hanging. i burped the jar this morning and it is not damp inside ( i know i should get a small RH meter, just doing it by feel atm). i did add a blurple light in there for about half the flower time until it got too warm this summer, but still I am loving the size and smell of these plants on the 315w. This is going to be an awesome harvest.


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## bob223 (Jun 9, 2016)

I am kicking around the idea of adding 2 more sun system 315's.

would it be more efficient to run 3x 3x3 tents
or one 4x 8 with the 3 315's in it?

three 3x3 tents is 27sq feet

one 4x8 = 32 sq feet.

the perks of running three separate tents would be alternating light cycles and be able to run perptually and always be harvesting.

the perks of a 4x8 tent would be larger area to work with and possible overlapping of light making more usable space.

let me know what everyone thinks. i probably will not change anything till fall.


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## Ryante55 (Jun 9, 2016)

bob223 said:


> I am kicking around the idea of adding 2 more sun system 315's.
> 
> would it be more efficient to run 3x 3x3 tents
> or one 4x 8 with the 3 315's in it?
> ...


Run a 4x8 put 4 plants under each light every 3 weeks now you have a perpetual in 1 room its easier to run 1 exhaust fan an carbon filter


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## bob223 (Jun 9, 2016)

Ryante55 said:


> Run a 4x8 put 4 plants under each light every 3 weeks now you have a perpetual in 1 room its easier to run 1 exhaust fan an carbon filter


Yeah that is the way im leaning. i did like the idea of spacing out the power. i think the best results will be had in the 4x8


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## SomeGuy (Jun 9, 2016)

bob223 said:


> Yeah that is the way im leaning. i did like the idea of spacing out the power. i think the best results will be had in the 4x8


cross over lighting in a 4x8 will make it so much more effective. It is my plan to run three of these 315 fixtures on one side of my 8x8 in fall. Plus one large filter and fan is quieter IMO.


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## Ludovico (Jun 10, 2016)

Glad i found this thread, I'll be buying the sun system lec in two weeks along with a tent. I'm leaning towards a 4x4 just to have more wiggle room, I'll be flowering no more than 4 plants at a time but I've read that these lights are ideal in a 3x3 tent. What do you guys think, I've been debating this for a while and can't make up my mind. Anyone using one of these in anything bigger than a 3x3.
What kind of footprint will this light cover effectively without losing too much intensity around the perimeter.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 10, 2016)

My 3x3 is slightly over sized @ 39"x39" and it's good. I would imagine if I was pressed for an answer that over 3.5x3.5 it would start to drop off a lot towards the outside areas. I do not know if in a 4x4 (2) 315 would fit, maybe bare bulbs hung vertically? I would prefer two of these over one of the 630's myself to have the adjust ability, but check this thread out:

https://www.rollitup.org/t/630w-lec-4x4-tent-grow.899399/

@Ludovico


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## Growdict (Jun 10, 2016)

Ludovico said:


> Glad i found this thread, I'll be buying the sun system lec in two weeks along with a tent. I'm leaning towards a 4x4 just to have more wiggle room, I'll be flowering no more than 4 plants at a time but I've read that these lights are ideal in a 3x3 tent. What do you guys think, I've been debating this for a while and can't make up my mind. Anyone using one of these in anything bigger than a 3x3.
> What kind of footprint will this light cover effectively without losing too much intensity around the perimeter.


you could always veg in the 4x4, then when flowering add a few t5s low kelvin.


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## Ludovico (Jun 10, 2016)

Thanks for the reply guys, i may just end up picking up the light first and running it in an open space in my garage to get an idea of the light spread. I have never seen one up close but heard nothing but good things. Thanks again.


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## Sire Killem All (Jun 10, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> My 3x3 is slightly over sized @ 39"x39" and it's good. I would imagine if I was pressed for an answer that over 3.5x3.5 it would start to drop off a lot towards the outside areas. I do not know if in a 4x4 (2) 315 would fit, maybe bare bulbs hung vertically? I would prefer two of these over one of the 630's myself to have the adjust ability, but check this thread out:
> 
> https://www.rollitup.org/t/630w-lec-4x4-tent-grow.899399/
> 
> @Ludovico


Have you ran the 630w fixture? I have two of them about to purchase a 3rd. IMO it is similar to having 2 × 600w vs 1k


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 10, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> Have you ran the 630w fixture? I have two of them about to purchase a 3rd. IMO it is similar to having 2 × 600w vs 1k


No I have not ran one as it would be overkill for my spaces. But I run different strains simultaneously and I'm sure most do as well, so having the same watts in two separate fixtures gives you adjust ability for different strains that you won't get running just one.


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## Sire Killem All (Jun 10, 2016)




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## GroErr (Jun 10, 2016)

I'm coming up to 3 weeks with 5x 3gal stretched to 42x42" now. I have a little cross over on one end from some COBs running another batch beside the LEC but the other end is building bud just as well. Not seeing any issues with coverage If I stretch beyond 3x3' I put them to 24" above canopy (normally 20-22" above canopy in a 3x3') and they cover the larger footprint well..

I think the ideal tent with a single unit is 1M x 1M which is basically 40x40" like the tent @Evil-Mobo mentioned above. But in a room taking advantage of the bleed-over between the units works better. I'd go with the 4x8 room and multiple 315's in that config.

Here's the 42"x42"x32"H I'm running right now, not seeing any coverage issues. 4x 3gal different F2 phenos of Blue Ripper (JTR x Blueberry) and 1x 3gal Harlequin in that footprint @day 20.



Cheers


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## kingzt (Jun 10, 2016)

Hey everyone, what's the average light spread of one 315 lec? I'll be looking to replace my metal halides in veg and need to know how many to grab.


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## Growdict (Jun 11, 2016)

For veg you could do 4x4 with the 315. Grab a 4 kelvin bulb for that


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## DesertGrow89 (Jun 11, 2016)

kingzt said:


> Hey everyone, what's the average light spread of one 315 lec? I'll be looking to replace my metal halides in veg and need to know how many to grab.


3×3 is what they advertise. I have two of these and plan on buying another ballast from advanced lighting, much cheaper than the sun system fixtures. Always keep a backup bulb I've ordered two that didn't fire out of the box

Currently finishing a plant with a 4k bulb about to enter week 9, she keeps pushing new growth..


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## Ryante55 (Jun 11, 2016)

Am I the only one running the nanolux fixture? What did everyone pay for their fixtures? Nanolux was 280 without the bulb


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## DesertGrow89 (Jun 11, 2016)

Ryante55 said:


> Am I the only one running the nanolux fixture? What did everyone pay for their fixtures? Nanolux was 280 without the bulb


Is the nanolux ballast low frequency square wave?


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## Ryante55 (Jun 11, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> Is the nanolux ballast low frequency square wave?


I think so I think it says digital on the box my understanding was that it wouldnt work without lfsw. Whatever it is the plants love it


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 15, 2016)

Has anyone used this light in a 4'x4' and added supplemental lighting in flowering? I have mine in a 3.5'x4.5' and has been killing it for veg but as I read more Im getting a little concerned for the flower coverage. Im going to be flipping here in a week or so and want to make sure I have enough light to get some decent results. I do have a 4 tube 4' t5 pannel I could add all 3000k bulbs and hang it in there for supplemental lighting? Or maybe even pick up a cheap red ufo led. Ive also been considering just swapping out with my 1000w hps or even setting up a scond flowering room with the 1000w, but Id need to do some work and Im trying to flip next week. Not only that, I really want to see what this 315 can do for an entire grow veg/flower. I feel some supplemental lighting from the fluorescent would be my best/cheapset option.
What do you guys think? Here's a few pics from today.


And here's the t5 fixture I can use. Currently being used for a few purple kush seedlings and my first clones just for fun trying it out.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 15, 2016)

I'd want to see what the light can do as well, mine is surprising me a lot in my over sized 3x3. Keep on your defoliation of light blocking leaves and let her rip. That's what I am doing and she's not disappointing so far. You will know on the way if you do need more light then just hang the T5 don't waste $$ for no reason. Just my $0.02........


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## ttystikk (Jun 15, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Has anyone used this light in a 4'x4' and added supplemental lighting in flowering? I have mine in a 3.5'x4.5' and has been killing it for veg but as I read more Im getting a little concerned for the flower coverage. Im going to be flipping here in a week or so and want to make sure I have enough light to get some decent results. I do have a 4 tube 4' t5 pannel I could add all 3000k bulbs and hang it in there for supplemental lighting? Or maybe even pick up a cheap red ufo led. Ive also been considering just swapping out with my 1000w hps or even setting up a scond flowering room with the 1000w, but Id need to do some work and Im trying to flip next week. Not only that, I really want to see what this 315 can do for an entire grow veg/flower. I feel some supplemental lighting from the fluorescent would be my best/cheapset option.
> What do you guys think? Here's a few pics from today.
> View attachment 3708985
> View attachment 3708986
> ...


No way is she gonna replace a thouie. Two of them, on the other hand. ..


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> No way is she gonna replace a thouie. Two of them, on the other hand. ..


Oh, no way. I wouldn't expect anything close to that. From all I've read, most say these 315's are closer to a 600w hps. What Im saying is, Im considering just finishing the entire grow with the 1000 because I know Ill get bigger yields. Im more concerned with quality though, Im LOVING this lec so far, and from what Ive seen, the bud quality is fantastic. Im most likely going to buy a second one for my next run. 
I can also set up the 1000 in a different area (where the rack with the clones is at in the picture above), but it would require some construction and dialing in temps and all that. So, it would put me about 2-3 more weeks out from flowering. If I used the extra space though, I wouldn't need to worry about vegging longer as I could continue lst/super cropping to fill out the other 4x4 area. 

Its just something to consider. I could also just wait and do this next time and just finish out this run with the 315 and maybe the fluorescent to supplement later if needed.


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 16, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I'd want to see what the light can do as well, mine is surprising me a lot in my over sized 3x3. Keep on your defoliation of light blocking leaves and let her rip. That's what I am doing and she's not disappointing so far. You will know on the way if you do need more light then just hang the T5 don't waste $$ for no reason. Just my $0.02........


Man, you wouldn't believe how much Ive defoliated. I have a whole 5 gallon bucket half full of leaves from all the defoliation sessions Ive done! The Purple Kush (the big girl frond and center) was hacked to shit and lolipopped just 2 weeks ago. Now its mostly grown back, just not the lower branches. Its insane how quickly this light allows undergrowth to catch up when I defoliate, supercrop, or lst. Within days the newly exposed growth is caught up and filling out the center. Im just afraid to go too crazy with the lst becaus if I do decide to only use this small space, Im going to run out of floor space.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 16, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Man, you wouldn't believe how much Ive defoliated. I have a whole 5 gallon bucket half full of leaves from all the defoliation sessions Ive done! The Purple Kush (the big girl frond and center) was hacked to shit and lolipopped just 2 weeks ago. Now its mostly grown back, just not the lower branches. Its insane how quickly this light allows undergrowth to catch up when I defoliate, supercrop, or lst. Within days the newly exposed growth is caught up and filling out the center. Im just afraid to go too crazy with the lst becaus if I do decide to only use this small space, Im going to run out of floor space.


I defoliated yesterday and new growth today end of the day and I mean new buds coming up hairs and all with nothing in the way it's crazy lol......


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## Ryante55 (Jun 16, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Oh, no way. I wouldn't expect anything close to that. From all I've read, most say these 315's are closer to a 600w hps. What Im saying is, Im considering just finishing the entire grow with the 1000 because I know Ill get bigger yields. Im more concerned with quality though, Im LOVING this lec so far, and from what Ive seen, the bud quality is fantastic. Im most likely going to buy a second one for my next run.
> I can also set up the 1000 in a different area (where the rack with the clones is at in the picture above), but it would require some construction and dialing in temps and all that. So, it would put me about 2-3 more weeks out from flowering. If I used the extra space though, I wouldn't need to worry about vegging longer as I could continue lst/super cropping to fill out the other 4x4 area.
> 
> Its just something to consider. I could also just wait and do this next time and just finish out this run with the 315 and maybe the fluorescent to supplement later if needed.


Put 4 2700k cxb3590 around a 315 that would probably cover a 4x4 really well for flower and help keep the temp down. That's what I plan on doing next run


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## ttystikk (Jun 16, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Oh, no way. I wouldn't expect anything close to that. From all I've read, most say these 315's are closer to a 600w hps.





Ryante55 said:


> Put 4 2700k cxb3590 around a 315 that would probably cover a 4x4 really well for flower and help keep the temp down. That's what I plan on doing next run


From what I've read, seen and done with all of the above lighting options thus far, I've found that 'in rough terms', 
500W of HPS = 315W CMH = one of my 225W COB LED modules, running four Cree CXB3590 chips at about 56% efficiency. 

FWIW


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## Ryante55 (Jun 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> From what I've read, seen and done with all of the above lighting options thus far, I've found that 'in rough terms',
> 500W of HPS = 315W CMH = one of my 225W COB LED modules, running four Cree CXB3590 chips at about 56% efficiency.
> 
> FWIW


A dimmable 240w driver with 4 3590 around a 315 would be perfect for a 5x5 with that math its a 1000w hps replacement without the heat of hps


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## ttystikk (Jun 16, 2016)

Ryante55 said:


> A dimmable 240w driver with 4 3590 around a 315 would be perfect for a 5x5 with that math its a 1000w hps replacement without the heat of hps


My driver is 200W. Two of them pushing 4 chips each would replace a thouie, no need for the 315W CMH at all. 

As it is, two of them absolutely demolish a Mars 1600 on the veg setting. It's pulling 550W at the wall and doesn't give nearly the growth. And it's hot by comparison.


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## bob223 (Jun 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> From what I've read, seen and done with all of the above lighting options thus far, I've found that 'in rough terms',
> 500W of HPS = 315W CMH = one of my 225W COB LED modules, running four Cree CXB3590 chips at about 56% efficiency.
> 
> FWIW


the more i use the 315w the more like it. I would yield 16oz out of a 4x4 tent using a 1000w hps in an air cooled hood running a hortilux super Hps bulb.
The genetics i use i ran in that set up for years.

then i switched to the 315w LEC. i set it up in a 4x4 only utilizing a 3x3 section of the tent. In the excess space i have a carbon filter and oscillating fan. I have been consistently yielding around 12oz with the Lec. The top buds are actually larger under the LEC..... Bottom buds not as big as the hps i would say my buds under the lec are slightly more dense then the hps.` 

One 315 lec will not completely replace a 1000w but two Lec's will blow 1000w out of the water. I feel the 315w is closer to a 600w hps. Im sure grower that are running high yielding genetics could get well over a pound per light. The real awesome thing with the lec's seems to be when you run multiples. people are running 3 of them in a 4x4 and killing them. The guy in Colorado has a warehouse full of them and is hitting i believe like 1.5 lbs per light and shooting for two.

From what i am seeing i would also buy and run multiple 315's over buying 630's seems like if it would be more efficient to be able to space the bulbs out over a bigger area instead of having them right next to each other in the 630. ( now this is just my opinion maybe some one with a 630 or mutipuls can chime in).

Any one have any experience with the sun system 315 commercial fixtures?
how is the foot print on them


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 16, 2016)

Ryante55 said:


> Put 4 2700k cxb3590 around a 315 that would probably cover a 4x4 really well for flower and help keep the temp down. That's what I plan on doing next run


how would this work? I plan on someday building my own led pannel. When I was first researching lighting I was so so close to going with an led (either mars 2 or platinum) but in the end I just wasn't comfortable with the quality vs. price right now. I did look a little bit into building my own, but for my first grow I wanted more of a plug and play aet up. 
This is why I was thinking the red ufo's might work well, maybe 2 of them, one on each side. They are over $150 a piece though and Im not looking to spend that much more on lighting right now. How expensive would it be to do what you mentioned above? Or would it just be a better idea to add the fluorescent I alreay have?


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 16, 2016)

bob223 said:


> the more i use the 315w the more like it. I would yield 16oz out of a 4x4 tent using a 1000w hps in an air cooled hood running a hortilux super Hps bulb.
> The genetics i use i ran in that set up for years.
> 
> then i switched to the 315w LEC. i set it up in a 4x4 only utilizing a 3x3 section of the tent. In the excess space i have a carbon filter and oscillating fan. I have been consistently yielding around 12oz with the Lec. The top buds are actually larger under the LEC..... Bottom buds not as big as the hps i would say my buds under the lec are slightly more dense then the hps.`
> ...


I would be very happy with anything close to 12oz. I seriously doubt I will come close to this, being my first grow, but I would be happy with 6-8oz. Im more concerned wth quality than quantity, and from all my research before purchasing my light, these lec's are killing it in both quality and yield which had me sold. Plus, you can't beat that spectrum! The closer to natural sunlight the better. 
I am trying to keep my plants as tightly together as possible to keep it at a 3x3. Right now they are taking up the entire 3.5' width and 3' length of the room. I suspect they will fill out the entire 3.5x4.5 space by the end of it though. 
How tall are you letting your plants get before flowering? Im starting to think I may be rushing into the flowering. They are all between 15"-18" tall at the moment. Most on the 18" side measured from the top of the soil. In the room Im using I can let them go to a maximum of 36"-40" which would leave me 18-20" of distance from the light which is where Ive been keeping it and it seems to be doing well at this distance. The information on mycurrent strains Im running says the White Cookies are expected to stretch 3x the height. The White Widow expected to double, and the Purple Kush can double as well. Im doing what I can to keep the cookies shorter and bushier, but if I were to start flowering now, at their current height, they would just be within my maximum height if they were to stretch 2.5x their current height.


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## Growdict (Jun 16, 2016)

Kushy. You should just add the flouros you already have if you can control temps. My first run under lec in a 4x4 i got 8 oz. my second i added a blurple for a while but couldnt keep it under 80 so switched it to a pair of t8s. I have one plant left to harvest but will be 11-12 oz total


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## twistedentities (Jun 16, 2016)

This thread has me effing so stoked! I. Almost finished my new grow shed and will be using 315's. Awesome thread!
Here's a copy paste of my setup
Pretty much everything ordered is in and just waiting to be put together. Here's the official list

Clones
Super sprouter dome with t5

For clones after rooting
Bad boy 6 bulb t5
Bulbs- hortilux power veg x4
Power bloom x2

Veg for moms
Sunsystem 315 cmh 4200k
Organic soil

Bloom
Sun system 315 cmh 3100k

Air
2x 6" hurricane fan and 2x Carbon filters

Tent
Secret jardin 4'x4' veg tent
Secret jardin 2'x4' bloom tent

Strains
Gorilla glue #4
Cannatonic
Widow Cindy X Durga mata
Possible one more if I find a keeper in my outdoor this season.


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## Growdict (Jun 16, 2016)

You have two 6 inch filters in a 2x4'? Why such a small bloom tent?


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## twistedentities (Jun 16, 2016)

Growdict said:


> You have two 6 inch filters in a 2x4'? Why such a small bloom tent?


I'll have one filter in the bloom tent and another on the blower going outside. I went with a smaller bloom tent since I'll only be flowering clones. This is only for personal medical. Very little leaves my property.
Edit. I should have put a space separating air....fixed


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## Growdict (Jun 16, 2016)

Well a 3x3 probably would work better with the lec but i am sure you can grow some dank stuff with your 2x4


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## twistedentities (Jun 16, 2016)

Growdict said:


> Well a 3x3 probably would work better with the lec but i am sure you can grow some dank stuff with your 2x4


I agree with the 3x3 but I'm tight on room. The shed is 8x8 and I planned it as a 6x6 so I'd have room to move. I built platforms 15" off the floor for the tents and With the ceiling height and slant to the roof, I cut myself a little short on work area.


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## twistedentities (Jun 16, 2016)

I can always change tent sizes use the veg for flower but I'm not sure a 4x2 would be good for vegging 3 plants in 15g smarts. I'm always open to ideas to improve on my plan. Nothing is carved in stone other than the lights and equipment. I've redone my plans a few times.


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## twistedentities (Jun 16, 2016)

Now that I'm thinking about it, I don't need a tent for the moms. They can be in the open room. I'll just have to figure out my maintenance times a set the timers accordingly. That opens a lot of other options on flower tent size. The tents are from my local center and they'd have no prob switching them out. Just having one tent in there would give me a lot more room. I need easy lol. Broke my back and my rods don't like when I do a lot of bending


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## Growdict (Jun 16, 2016)

i built a 4' round turntable in my tent, with that and a stool you are good to go.


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## Growdict (Jun 16, 2016)

home depot sells a 6" round steel mount with ball bearing for like 8 dollars, screw it to some wood and cut a round out of thick plywood.


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## twistedentities (Jun 16, 2016)

Growdict said:


> home depot sells a 6" round steel mount with ball bearing for like 8 dollars, screw it to some wood and cut a round out of thick plywood.


I'll check that out. I think that would really benefit. Thanks!


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## bob223 (Jun 16, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> I would be very happy with anything close to 12oz. I seriously doubt I will come close to this, being my first grow, but I would be happy with 6-8oz. Im more concerned wth quality than quantity, and from all my research before purchasing my light, these lec's are killing it in both quality and yield which had me sold. Plus, you can't beat that spectrum! The closer to natural sunlight the better.
> I am trying to keep my plants as tightly together as possible to keep it at a 3x3. Right now they are taking up the entire 3.5' width and 3' length of the room. I suspect they will fill out the entire 3.5x4.5 space by the end of it though.
> How tall are you letting your plants get before flowering? Im starting to think I may be rushing into the flowering. They are all between 15"-18" tall at the moment. Most on the 18" side measured from the top of the soil. In the room Im using I can let them go to a maximum of 36"-40" which would leave me 18-20" of distance from the light which is where Ive been keeping it and it seems to be doing well at this distance. The information on mycurrent strains Im running says the White Cookies are expected to stretch 3x the height. The White Widow expected to double, and the Purple Kush can double as well. Im doing what I can to keep the cookies shorter and bushier, but if I were to start flowering now, at their current height, they would just be within my maximum height if they were to stretch 2.5x their current height.



I have 4 plants in flower under 1 lec i am running perpetually. i have them spaced out by about 2 and a half weeks. As soon as one plant comes out of the flower room i move one in from the veg room. When the plants get moved into flower they are between 18in and 2 feet. I have about 6 different mothers i use. they end up finishing up between 3.5 and 4.5 feet. each plant is between 2.5oz and 4oz when finished. average is 12oz for every complete cycle of 4 plants. i do think i could pull slightly more if i did it all at one shot instead of perpetual. i think i could prabably push it to 13.5 to 14 oz if all plants were in the same stage of growth. (More even canopy would help)

Kushy one thing that may help you hit a good yield on your first run would be genetics. If you are in an area where you have easy access to great genetics. All of my plants are from seed from various sources. I have some really great strains but they are quality and not quantity. If you were in Colorado, California, or Washington you could probably get something that would be a heavy yeilder with good quality. 

I think if you can get good genetics, control p.h. of water and nutes, Get on a feeding schedule and stick with it, Control temps and have proper air flow, use at least 5 gal pots and don't over crowd your light. you will hit 10 to 12 oz per light with the 315 lec. Good luck and keep us updated!


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## bob223 (Jun 16, 2016)

Growdict said:


> Well a 3x3 probably would work better with the lec but i am sure you can grow some dank stuff with your 2x4


i believe that the 3x3 would be best for the standard sun system 315 lec. I'm pretty sure the sun system commercial lec set up throws a 2x4 foot print.


----------



## KushyMcKush (Jun 16, 2016)

bob223 said:


> I have 4 plants in flower under 1 lec i am running perpetually. i have them spaced out by about 2 and a half weeks. As soon as one plant comes out of the flower room i move one in from the veg room. When the plants get moved into flower they are between 18in and 2 feet. I have about 6 different mothers i use. they end up finishing up between 3.5 and 4.5 feet. each plant is between 2.5oz and 4oz when finished. average is 12oz for every complete cycle of 4 plants. i do think i could pull slightly more if i did it all at one shot instead of perpetual. i think i could prabably push it to 13.5 to 14 oz if all plants were in the same stage of growth. (More even canopy would help)
> 
> Kushy one thing that may help you hit a good yield on your first run would be genetics. If you are in an area where you have easy access to great genetics. All of my plants are from seed from various sources. I have some really great strains but they are quality and not quantity. If you were in Colorado, California, or Washington you could probably get something that would be a heavy yeilder with good quality.
> 
> I think if you can get good genetics, control p.h. of water and nutes, Get on a feeding schedule and stick with it, Control temps and have proper air flow, use at least 5 gal pots and don't over crowd your light. you will hit 10 to 12 oz per light with the 315 lec. Good luck and keep us updated!


Thanks for this info! Eventually Id love to get a perpetual system in place, but for now with my space I can veg realistically veg 4-6 plants under my t5 fixture at a time and maybe fit a small cloning tray under that as well. 
I think once I get everything dialed in as you said, things will start running much smoother. I had some ph and nutrient issues at the beginning which set me back a bit, but I am slowly getting it figured out. Only issue to worry about now is the heat in the upcoming weeks. 
Im currently running Crop Kings genetics white Widow, White Cookies, and Purple Kush, along with 2 bagseed plants that have been doing amazingly well amd smell great... Both turned out female too. 
For my next grow Ive been looking at Cali Connection's Alien OG, Larry OG, or maybe one of their Cookies strains. Ive also been looking at Rare Dankness' 501st OG, and Star Killer. Im either ordering from The Dank Team, or James Bean. Ive also been checking out Bohdi's genetics on Great Lakes Genetics. I want to order 2 strains and find a good mother or two that I like and run the same strains for a while to really get things dialed in. Maybe toss in an odd strain here and there just to play around with. Im really loving all of the Skywalker crosses, and Im a Star Wars fan... So I think it would be fun and fitting to grow these Alien/Star Wars themed strains.


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## Sire Killem All (Jun 16, 2016)

Ryante55 said:


> Am I the only one running the nanolux fixture? What did everyone pay for their fixtures? Nanolux was 280 without the bulb





DesertGrow89 said:


> Is the nanolux ballast low frequency square wave?


They are high frequency. I run 3 of their 630w fixtures. Says it right on the box.


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## DesertGrow89 (Jun 16, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> They are high frequency. I run 3 of their 630w fixtures. Says it right on the box.


From what I understand the LFSW drives these bulbs harder, to their full potential.


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## rkymtnman (Jun 16, 2016)

i got the philips kit. have it in a 3x4 with just 3 plants. so far they are loving it. its the 4K


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## rkymtnman (Jun 16, 2016)

it replaced the retro white hps from philips. 400 cdm. had to run it on mag ballast


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 16, 2016)

I posted this in the plant problems forum as well, but this seems like an active group so Im hoping maybe you guys can help. I came home today and my favorite purple kush baby is drooping like crazy! The thing that scared the shit out of me is that every spot where I supercropped on Tuesday was completely bent over like it had never healed. But here is a picture 2 hours after the supercropping on Tuesday:
 
 


Front and center
 
 

Today... Wtf?
 
 
Both very bottom leaves look like this:
 

Already gave a good watering. Everything else seems fine so i dunno, but this is one of my favorite girls!


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## DesertGrow89 (Jun 16, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> I posted this in the plant problems forum as well, but this seems like an active group so Im hoping maybe you guys can help. I came home today and my favorite purple kush baby is drooping like crazy! The thing that scared the shit out of me is that every spot where I supercropped on Tuesday was completely bent over like it had never healed. But here is a picture 2 hours after the supercropping on Tuesday:
> View attachment 3709834
> View attachment 3709835
> 
> ...


Maybe turgor isn't doing so well was it watered before you supercropped? Not much you can do except wait it out or re straighten them.


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 16, 2016)

Well I just transplanted them all. Im gonna wait on this one to see what happens


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## DesertGrow89 (Jun 16, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Well I just transplanted them all. Im gonna wait on this one to see what happens


Are those in 5gal pots? What are your temperatures?


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## bob223 (Jun 16, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Well I just transplanted them all. Im gonna wait on this one to see what happens



To me it looks like a mix of high temps and to dry of soil.
I have a master Kush that is very very heat sensitive and acts similar to what you have go on.
in the pictures it does look like you need to water.


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 16, 2016)

bob223 said:


> To me it looks like a mix of high temps and to dry of soil.
> I have a master Kush that is very very heat sensitive and acts similar to what you have go on.
> in the pictures it does look like you need to water.


Temps stay about 75-78 lately. Although it is going to be getting hot here in the next week or so, and we did have a heat wave a few weeks ago where the room got up to 93 for 2 days, and was between 83-85 for about a week which didnt seem to bother them a whole lot at first, bit maybe this is an after effect? At the time they were just fine, no negative effects at all. I also kept up on watering and did cut some holes in the ceiling to vent hot air out. I now need to cut a hole on the outside of the attick space so that heat doesn't come back into the room which was an issue. Im gonna do that this weekend. 
Im also running Dyna-Gro Protect silica supplement which is supposed to do wonders protecting the plants against heat stress, cold, insects, all that stuff. It seems to be working. 

I went through today and transplanted into their 5 gallon smart pots. The Purple Kush that I was worried about actually started to perk up about an hour after I gave her a good watering. In the end Indecided to just transplant her too, we'll see if that was a good decision, but I was already out there doing all the others so I just said fuck it. It looked like it could take it. 

I did some work today like I said. Intransplanted, cut the floor tarp and made it nice and flat and sealed it all up. I organized and secured some extension cords that were in the way and a hazard. I centered the light perfectly to the grow area to get the most out of my coverage. It was off center toward the back by about 6" which is pretty significant. I also gave all the plants Mykos at the roots as I do with all transplants. And just cleaned up a bit and took some pics.


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## Ryante55 (Jun 17, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> how would this work? I plan on someday building my own led pannel. When I was first researching lighting I was so so close to going with an led (either mars 2 or platinum) but in the end I just wasn't comfortable with the quality vs. price right now. I did look a little bit into building my own, but for my first grow I wanted more of a plug and play aet up.
> This is why I was thinking the red ufo's might work well, maybe 2 of them, one on each side. They are over $150 a piece though and Im not looking to spend that much more on lighting right now. How expensive would it be to do what you mentioned above? Or would it just be a better idea to add the fluorescent I alreay have?


Get a diy cob kit a few company's make them all you need is a screwdriver to pu


Sire Killem All said:


> They are high frequency. I run 3 of their 630w fixtures. Says it right on the box.


Still seems to work really well lfsw isn't worth the extra few hundred. mine as well just build cob bars if your going to spend over 300 for a fixture


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## bob223 (Jun 17, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Temps stay about 75-78 lately. Although it is going to be getting hot here in the next week or so, and we did have a heat wave a few weeks ago where the room got up to 93 for 2 days, and was between 83-85 for about a week which didnt seem to bother them a whole lot at first, bit maybe this is an after effect? At the time they were just fine, no negative effects at all. I also kept up on watering and did cut some holes in the ceiling to vent hot air out. I now need to cut a hole on the outside of the attick space so that heat doesn't come back into the room which was an issue. Im gonna do that this weekend.
> Im also running Dyna-Gro Protect silica supplement which is supposed to do wonders protecting the plants against heat stress, cold, insects, all that stuff. It seems to be working.
> 
> I went through today and transplanted into their 5 gallon smart pots. The Purple Kush that I was worried about actually started to perk up about an hour after I gave her a good watering. In the end Indecided to just transplant her too, we'll see if that was a good decision, but I was already out there doing all the others so I just said fuck it. It looked like it could take it.
> ...


Kushy,

My room stays between 75 and 80 in summer months. for me it seems like the plants can handle high temps above 80 for short peirods of time.
around 82-86degrees the plants seem to start drooping and experience signs of stress. one thing that can help this is air flow in and out of the grow space as well as oscillation fans moving air in the grow space.

Another thing to remember is heat rises , it is very important to take accurate temps.

i recommend placing your thermometer at about lamp level.

each strain will react to heat differently. my headband can stand to be at 80 all day every day, but my master kush burns its fan leaves if it spend to much time at the same temp. so i only really run the kush in the cool months.

good luck your room looks great!

hey a few questions that im sure you have already answered

how many plants in your space? 
when are you switching to flower/ have you switched to flower?

you may end up with some over crowding in that room. having to many plants or to big of plants under one light can hurt your yield.


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 17, 2016)

bob223 said:


> Kushy,
> 
> My room stays between 75 and 80 in summer months. for me it seems like the plants can handle high temps above 80 for short peirods of time.
> around 82-86degrees the plants seem to start drooping and experience signs of stress. one thing that can help this is air flow in and out of the grow space as well as oscillation fans moving air in the grow space.
> ...


Well, I have a thermometer that measures ambient tenps as well as a temp gun to measure leaf surface temps. Even when the room was up in the high 80's the leaf temps remained around 75 all around. 
I have 6 smaller plants, my "main" plants, and 2 larger bagseed that I stared about a month before the others to experiment with while I got my ither parameters dialed in. I kept them well lst'd, topped, tied down, and supercropped to keep them as short/bushy as possible. 
I just transplanted them all into their final 5gal pots yesterday to get ready to switch to flower probably next week. They are currently between 16-18" tall. Shortest being 15", tallest (purple kush) being 18" and growing daily. 
It is getting a bit crowded and this js concerning me as well. If it does get too bad, I can set up my second room and put half of them under a 1000w hps, just need to do some contrusction cutting vents and such. Im hoping I wont need to. 
My plan for my next grow is to only grow maybe 4 total of all the same strain... Right now Im growing 4 different strains which was a bad idea. Its hard to get it dialed in when they all have different requirements.


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 19, 2016)

I know its the wrong forum, but I feel like u guys might read this more and since Ive been talking to a few of you lately, maybe you can help. 
Ive been seeing a little yellowing w/ brown spots on 2-3 of my plants on the lower leaves... Like the very first leaf set. One is worse than others. Top growth seems unaffected and otherwise they all look gorgeous. Just dont want this to spread. 
 
One I plucked off for a better shot:

Otherwise looking just fine (maybe just older growth?) about 45 days into veg, just flipped to 12/12 today.


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## Ryante55 (Jun 19, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> I know its the wrong forum, but I feel like u guys might read this more and since Ive been talking to a few of you lately, maybe you can help.
> Ive been seeing a little yellowing w/ brown spots on 2-3 of my plants on the lower leaves... Like the very first leaf set. One is worse than others. Top growth seems unaffected and otherwise they all look gorgeous. Just dont want this to spread.
> View attachment 3712392 View attachment 3712393
> One I plucked off for a better shot:
> ...


if its the bottom set its fine


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 19, 2016)

My NL is loving this light


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## DesertGrow89 (Jun 19, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> I know its the wrong forum, but I feel like u guys might read this more and since Ive been talking to a few of you lately, maybe you can help.
> Ive been seeing a little yellowing w/ brown spots on 2-3 of my plants on the lower leaves... Like the very first leaf set. One is worse than others. Top growth seems unaffected and otherwise they all look gorgeous. Just dont want this to spread.
> View attachment 3712392 View attachment 3712393
> One I plucked off for a better shot:
> ...


What is the root substrate/medium? 
What is your EC/PPM?
What is your pH?
What's your daily high/low and watering habits? How often are you feeding?

Increase your EC slightly during stretch it's one of the most critical times for plants to get nutrients because they pack on so much weight.


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 19, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> What is the root substrate/medium?
> What is your EC/PPM?
> What is your pH?
> What's your daily high/low and watering habits? How often are you feeding?
> ...


Substrate: FFOF w/ ~20-30% pearlite 
PPM from tap is 110. With feeding its typically around 650. 
Ph - water is always given between 6.4-6.6 with and without feeding. 
Daily high/low is between 75-78, every once in a while on hot days up to 83.
Watering habits I go by pot weight. In the 5 gal smart pots its usually every 3-4 days. 
Im using a feed-water-water-feed right now.


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## DesertGrow89 (Jun 19, 2016)

Did you add any lime to your soil? Preferably you want to get your lows lower than that, a 10-15 degree day/night temperature differential is optimal:

"Thermoperiod refers to a daily temperature change. Plants respond and produce maximum growth when exposed to a day temperature that is about 10 to 16 degrees higher than a night temperature. This allows the plant to photosynthesize (build up) and respire (break down), during an optimum daytime temperature and to curtail the respiration rate during a cooler night. Temperatures higher than needed cause increased respiration, sometimes above photosynthesis rate. This means that the products of photosynthesis are used more rapidly than they are produced. For growth to occur, photosynthesis must be greater than respiration."


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 19, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> Did you add any lime to your soil? Preferably you want to get your lows lower than that, a 10-15 degree day/night temperature differential is optimal:
> 
> "Thermoperiod refers to a daily temperature change. Plants respond and produce maximum growth when exposed to a day temperature that is about 10 to 16 degrees higher than a night temperature. This allows the plant to photosynthesize (build up) and respire (break down), during an optimum daytime temperature and to curtail the respiration rate during a cooler night. Temperatures higher than needed cause increased respiration, sometimes above photosynthesis rate. This means that the products of photosynthesis are used more rapidly than they are produced. For growth to occur, photosynthesis must be greater than respiration."


Oh, Im sorry I didn't actually include the nighttime lows. I included the temp fluctuation during the day which is 75-77ish as stated above. At night it gets to about 63-66. It has gotten to 55-56 on some of the cooler nights where I forgot to close the air vent, but it didnt seem to negatively impact them at all. Its difficult in my area because the whether changes can be pretty drastic from week to week or even day to day sometimes. I live in the nevada desert, so whether is pretty unpredictable sometimes. The space my grow area is in is fully insulated, which does help quite a bit. Even on 35-40 nights, the room has only gotten down to 55 at the least. On days where its over 100 outside, if I don't open the outer door much and let got air in, it will get up to 85-86 at the most. There were a few days where I was doing a lot of work in there and Inleft the door open for a few hours on a 100F day oitside and the room got up to 95 ambient. Although when I use a digital temp gun to check the leaves surface temps and various other areas of the plants, they were still at their normal 74-75 temps.
Temps stay relatively consistent, but I think until I live in a house where I can either have a tent(s) indoors, or in a more stable indoor area Ill either need to grow plants that are less sensitive to temp fluctuations, or find a way to heat/cool as needed without spending thousands on some sort of environmental control system (maybe theres diy ones?).


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## twistedentities (Jun 20, 2016)

Ecosunlite CREE LED said:


> win one free led grow light for your growing , https://www.rollitup.org/t/free-ecosunlite-full-cree-led-grow-light.912609/
> like and follow us ,comment with the number you choose .


Isn't this an LEC thread?".....................


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## DesertGrow89 (Jun 20, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Oh, Im sorry I didn't actually include the nighttime lows. I included the temp fluctuation during the day which is 75-77ish as stated above. At night it gets to about 63-66. It has gotten to 55-56 on some of the cooler nights where I forgot to close the air vent, but it didnt seem to negatively impact them at all. Its difficult in my area because the whether changes can be pretty drastic from week to week or even day to day sometimes. I live in the nevada desert, so whether is pretty unpredictable sometimes. The space my grow area is in is fully insulated, which does help quite a bit. Even on 35-40 nights, the room has only gotten down to 55 at the least. On days where its over 100 outside, if I don't open the outer door much and let got air in, it will get up to 85-86 at the most. There were a few days where I was doing a lot of work in there and Inleft the door open for a few hours on a 100F day oitside and the room got up to 95 ambient. Although when I use a digital temp gun to check the leaves surface temps and various other areas of the plants, they were still at their normal 74-75 temps.
> Temps stay relatively consistent, but I think until I live in a house where I can either have a tent(s) indoors, or in a more stable indoor area Ill either need to grow plants that are less sensitive to temp fluctuations, or find a way to heat/cool as needed without spending thousands on some sort of environmental control system (maybe theres diy ones?).


If you're using FFOF and dyna-gro I think the synthetics may be killing the organics but I don't think that's why you have a couple yellow leaves. Are you using DG foliage pro? As long as it doesn't spread don't worry about it.


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 20, 2016)

DesertGrow89 said:


> If you're using FFOF and dyna-gro I think the synthetics may be killing the organics but I don't think that's why you have a couple yellow leaves. Are you using DG foliage pro? As long as it doesn't spread don't worry about it.


Yea, Im using the Foliage Pro and ProTekt. Ive read that pretty much all synthetic nutrients will kill off microbial life, but then they get everything they need from the nutrients themselves so in the end it doesn't really matter all that much. 
Like you said, its just a few leaves on the oldest growth so Im not too worried. Everything else looks just fine. Just wanted to be sure it wasn't the beginning of something Im going to need to worry about.


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## twistedentities (Jun 20, 2016)

So, I did a heat check in my new room with a 600hps open. Temps 1' below the bulb are 80. Can I safely assume it'll be even cooler with the lec 315?


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 20, 2016)

twistedentities said:


> So, I did a heat check in my new room with a 600hps open. Temps 1' below the bulb are 80. Can I safely assume it'll be even cooler with the lec 315? View attachment 3712861


I have my plants 20-22" from my 315 and the surface temps of the leaves measured with a digital temp gun are typically between 70-75 depending on where the plants are spaced and abmients are between 75-80


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## twistedentities (Jun 20, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> I have my plants 20-22" from my 315 and the surface temps of the leaves measured with a digital temp gun are typically between 70-75 depending on where the plants are spaced and abmients are between 75-80


Awesome! If I have the ac running, I can get it as cool as needed. Real happy to have 80 with it being almost 90 outside. Only thing on now is an exhaust fan that pulls air from under the house. Can't wait to hook up the lec's


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 20, 2016)

twistedentities said:


> Awesome! If I have the ac running, I can get it as cool as needed. Real happy to have 80 with it being almost 90 outside. Only thing on now is an exhaust fan that pulls air from under the house. Can't wait to hook up the lec's


You'll love it man. Its a fantastic light! Heres my girls under mine


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## ttystikk (Jun 20, 2016)

twistedentities said:


> So, I did a heat check in my new room with a 600hps open. Temps 1' below the bulb are 80. Can I safely assume it'll be even cooler with the lec 315? View attachment 3712861


Yes. Half the watts.


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 20, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Yes. Half the watts.


It is half the watts, but doesn't the use of a ceramic arc tube instead of quartz allow the bulb to burn at a much hotter tempurature? Isn't this why the 315 can be compared to a 600w hps/mh? It would still be less heat of course only being 315w, but wouldn't the temps be similar? Or does this refer to the color tepurature (kelvin rating)... Though kelvin is the color temp, not hest produced so that may not apply.


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## ttystikk (Jun 20, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> It is half the watts, but doesn't the use of a ceramic arc tube instead of quartz allow the bulb to burn at a much hotter tempurature? Isn't this why the 315 can be compared to a 600w hps/mh? It would still be less heat of course only being 315w, but wouldn't the temps be similar? Or does this refer to the color tepurature (kelvin rating)... Though kelvin is the color temp, not hest produced so that may not apply.


Nope, no and no lol

315W is the actual watts used by the lamp, maybe 340 with ballast.

Kelvin temperature gives an idea of color and spectrum, but it's only a very general guide.

The reasons for its efficiency include both that its spectrum output is superior to HPS, plus the low frequency square wave ballast tech. This drives the lamp more efficiently.

Folks seem to be coming to agreement that a 315W CMH system is worth maybe 500W of HPS in equivalent growth performance.


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 20, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Nope, no and no lol
> 
> 315W is the actual watts used by the lamp, maybe 340 with ballast.
> 
> ...


Oh ok, that makes more sense. Thanks for the knowledge!


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## WattSaver (Jun 20, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> It is half the watts, but doesn't the use of a ceramic arc tube instead of quartz allow the bulb to burn at a much hotter tempurature? Isn't this why the 315 can be compared to a 600w hps/mh? It would still be less heat of course only being 315w, but wouldn't the temps be similar? Or does this refer to the color tepurature (kelvin rating)... Though kelvin is the color temp, not hest produced so that may not apply.


The difference in the amount of heat thrown off between a hps and a ceramic bulb has to do with the % of wattage that is converted to light and % converted to heat. The hps sports a higher % of heat compared to the ceramic bulb. I haven't used this 315W t12 bulb yet but have 6 yrs of use with the Philips 400W CMH retro white. My hood has has 3 sockets 2 are 400w the center is 1k. Running the 2 400's puts off way less than half the heat of running the 1 super hps. 

I doubt if the heat factor has little to do with the ballast that drives the bulb. It has to do with the construction of the bulb.


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## Growdict (Jun 20, 2016)

Great cri on the 315 too. Takes nice pictures under it


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## ttystikk (Jun 20, 2016)

Growdict said:


> Great cri on the 315 too. Takes nice pictures under it


Have you ever seen those funny fuzzy dark lines in some pictures week HID lights? That's because those lamps are driven by magnetic ballasts, running on 60Hz AC. The lamps are actually flickering, and those dark lines represent the time it spends NOT making light! 

The 315W CMH lights are driven at a similar low frequency, but in this case the ballast generates a square wave. Long story short, this one (relatively expensive) change in ballast design is responsible for all of the increased performance of the technology, by eliminating all that time the lamp spends not running at peak output. No more dark lines means much more light for the very same watts and thus higher efficiency. 

I'm hearing of several manufacturers coming out with low frequency square wave or LFSW ballasts that run at 1000W. I'm about to hook an 860W CDM Allstart lamp up to one in the next few days... 

Anyone interested in seeing what happens next?


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 20, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Have you ever seen those funny fuzzy dark lines in some pictures week HID lights? That's because those lamps are driven by magnetic ballasts, running on 60Hz AC. The lamps are actually flickering, and those dark lines represent the time it spends NOT making light!
> 
> The 315W CMH lights are driven at a similar low frequency, but in this case the ballast generates a square wave. Long story short, this one (relatively expensive) change in ballast design is responsible for all of the increased performance of the technology, by eliminating all that time the lamp spends not running at peak output. No more dark lines means much more light for the very same watts and thus higher efficiency.
> 
> ...


I am


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## ttystikk (Jun 20, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I am


It even goes to 1150W, lol


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 20, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Have you ever seen those funny fuzzy dark lines in some pictures week HID lights? That's because those lamps are driven by magnetic ballasts, running on 60Hz AC. The lamps are actually flickering, and those dark lines represent the time it spends NOT making light!
> 
> The 315W CMH lights are driven at a similar low frequency, but in this case the ballast generates a square wave. Long story short, this one (relatively expensive) change in ballast design is responsible for all of the increased performance of the technology, by eliminating all that time the lamp spends not running at peak output. No more dark lines means much more light for the very same watts and thus higher efficiency.
> 
> ...


This is fantastic!! I knew a bit about these before buying one as Im kind of an obsessive researcher on almost everything I buy, but having the technical information explained in a way thats a little easier to comprehend is always appreciated! As a first time grower, all of the new lighting technology thats coming out is fascinating to me and something I want to learn more about. Im actually looking into building a cob led pannel for my next grow to either use on conjunction with my lec, or maybe as a veg light. Im not sure yet, but I mostly want to do it for the project and to experiment/run a side by side with.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 20, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> It even goes to 1150W, lol


Can't wait to see it in action then


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## ttystikk (Jun 20, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> This is fantastic!! I knew a bit about these before buying one as Im kind of an obsessive researcher on almost everything I buy, but having the technical information explained in a way thats a little easier to comprehend is always appreciated! As a first time grower, all of the new lighting technology thats coming out is fascinating to me and something I want to learn more about. Im actually looking into building a cob led pannel for my next grow to either use on conjunction with my lec, or maybe as a veg light. Im not sure yet, but I mostly want to do it for the project and to experiment/run a side by side with.


The debate about whether COB LED is better than light bulbs is over. The only question is cost. 

My COB grown product is larger, tighter, frostier, heavier, smellier, harder and more resinous than anything I've ever grown under a light bulb. No one who sees the product disagrees. 

Any questions?


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 20, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> The debate about whether COB LED is better than light bulbs is over. The only question is cost.
> 
> My COB grown product is larger, tighter, frostier, heavier, smellier, harder and more resinous than anything I've ever grown under a light bulb. No one who sees the product disagrees.
> 
> Any questions?


And this is what Ive been seeing. I don't think theres any question of if I will build one, just when. I just need to do more research into it as far as assembly, components, colors... all of the options I guess. ive only done minimal research into building diy pannels, but theres no argument from me questioning the quality. I can't say for certain I've ever had product that was grown under led's, only that what I've seen online looks grade-A.


----------



## ttystikk (Jun 20, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> And this is what Ive been seeing. I don't think theres any question of if I will build one, just when. I just need to do more research into it as far as assembly, components, colors... all of the options I guess. ive only done minimal research into building diy pannels, but theres no argument from me questioning the quality. I can't say for certain I've ever had product that was grown under led's, only that what I've seen online looks grade-A.


Even my fuckups make weight and look good, lol


----------



## KushyMcKush (Jun 20, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> The debate about whether COB LED is better than light bulbs is over. The only question is cost.
> 
> My COB grown product is larger, tighter, frostier, heavier, smellier, harder and more resinous than anything I've ever grown under a light bulb. No one who sees the product disagrees.
> 
> Any questions?


Actually, I do have a few questions. First, can I see some of your COB LED grows... Or better yet, your build(s)? Or link me to any journals you may have? Second, if you have any links to build guides that would be the best for a 4x4 area, Id like to see more to kind of get an idea of what I want to build. Ive found several that are pretty good, but I can always use more. I found a few Ive been liking to model after in particular:
-https://www.thcfarmer.com/community/threads/diy-led-with-cobs-small-medium-and-large-grows.64252/
-
http://howtogrowmarijuana.com/diy-led-grow-light/

I have many more saved, and when Im ready Hopefully I can find someone to kind of consult with me and guide me through it. I was originally looking at the Mars2 1600 or 2x900, Platinum LED, and G8, but ultimately decided that if I was going to go LED, the best was out of my price range, and when I found out about these incredible DIY pannels people are making for around the cost or less of a low quality brand name one, I knew I would go this route someday. The LEC was the best in my price range that was ready to plug and go, and I am loving it. Its an incredible light... But these leds are just too tempting.


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## ttystikk (Jun 20, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Actually, I do have a few questions. First, can I see some of your COB LED grows... Or better yet, your build(s)? Or link me to any journals you may have? Second, if you have any links to build guides that would be the best for a 4x4 area, Id like to see more to kind of get an idea of what I want to build. Ive found several that are pretty good, but I can always use more. I found a few Ive been liking to model after in particular:
> -https://www.thcfarmer.com/community/threads/diy-led-with-cobs-small-medium-and-large-grows.64252/
> -
> http://howtogrowmarijuana.com/diy-led-grow-light/
> ...


There's an LED lighting section on this very forum that's got some of the best minds in the business contributing regularly. I'd go there and read up!


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 20, 2016)

Im not sure if it was this thread or not, but I had asked about maybe building a small single pannel led to add a little more coverage in my current 3.5'x4.5' room. I was trying to find something to hang next to my 315 lec to add a bit more light because I hear most people say that these are really best for a 3x3 in flower... Some even say 2.5x2.5, but most seem to agree that a 315 im a 4x4 is stretching it a bit and may not get the most out of the space. The diy leds intrigued me because they are low heat, inexpensive, and incredibly productive. I also thought it might be cool to build, like I said, a small led with one or two lights and then be able to add onto it later... Ive found some cool modular builds that can easily be added or subtracted to as needed.


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 20, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> There's an LED lighting section on this very forum that's got some of the best minds in the business contributing regularly. I'd go there and read up!


Oh, Ive been over there quite a bit recently. You just seem to know what your doing and wanted to chat with you a bit. I see Im kind of hijacking this thread with all this led talk :/ Ill head over there and bounce some ideas around. Thanks.


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## WattSaver (Jun 21, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> The debate about whether COB LED is better than light bulbs is over. The only question is cost.
> 
> My COB grown product is larger, tighter, frostier, heavier, smellier, harder and more resinous than anything I've ever grown under a light bulb. No one who sees the product disagrees.
> 
> Any questions?


I've got a question, with the LED does the spectrum run out of the visible range hi and lo into the infra red and ultra violet? The ceramic bulbs do run off the visible scale on both ends and the plants do use the UV and IR light. 

2nd question have they developed a diode that is true pure white, or do they still use a phosphorus coating to achieve white light?


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## Ryante55 (Jun 21, 2016)

End of week 6 citrus sap getting pretty frosty under the lec


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 21, 2016)

Ryante55 said:


> End of week 6 citrus sap getting pretty frosty under the lec


Looking good. Just flipped to flower 2 days ago. Can't wait to see what this light does for me.


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## ttystikk (Jun 21, 2016)

WattSaver said:


> I've got a question, with the LED does the spectrum run out of the visible range hi and lo into the infra red and ultra violet? The ceramic bulbs do run off the visible scale on both ends and the plants do use the UV and IR light.
> 
> 2nd question have they developed a diode that is true pure white, or do they still use a phosphorus coating to achieve white light?


Whatever UV or IR HID bulbs may put off is negligible. Plants grow better under COB LED. It's really a face value, take or leave it kind of statement.


----------



## Rooster96 (Jun 22, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Have you ever seen those funny fuzzy dark lines in some pictures week HID lights? That's because those lamps are driven by magnetic ballasts, running on 60Hz AC. The lamps are actually flickering, and those dark lines represent the time it spends NOT making light!
> 
> The 315W CMH lights are driven at a similar low frequency, but in this case the ballast generates a square wave. Long story short, this one (relatively expensive) change in ballast design is responsible for all of the increased performance of the technology, by eliminating all that time the lamp spends not running at peak output. No more dark lines means much more light for the very same watts and thus higher efficiency.
> 
> ...


Are you going to share here or in the led thread? Because I am very interested!


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## Tim Fox (Jun 22, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Actually, I do have a few questions. First, can I see some of your COB LED grows... Or better yet, your build(s)? Or link me to any journals you may have? Second, if you have any links to build guides that would be the best for a 4x4 area, Id like to see more to kind of get an idea of what I want to build. Ive found several that are pretty good, but I can always use more. I found a few Ive been liking to model after in particular:
> -https://www.thcfarmer.com/community/threads/diy-led-with-cobs-small-medium-and-large-grows.64252/
> -
> http://howtogrowmarijuana.com/diy-led-grow-light/
> ...


there are a couple of guys on here selling DIY COB KITS,, you get all the parts, and there is no drilling or fans to hook up they are passive cooled, very simple to put together, and you get the latest cree cob tech that way


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## ttystikk (Jun 22, 2016)

Rooster96 said:


> Are you going to share here or in the led thread? Because I am very interested!


Was gonna make a new thread for it, but post updates both here and in my thread. This is an up n coming thing, figured people would want to know.


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## Tim Fox (Jun 22, 2016)

here is a link to the DIY cob timber kits,, there are others 
http://timbergrowlights.com/products/diy-grow-light-kits/


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## Rooster96 (Jun 22, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Was gonna make a new thread for it, but post updates both here and in my thread. This is an up n coming thing, figured people would want to know.


Thanks for the reply ttystikk. Please put up link to your thread when you get it rolling if you don't mind.


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## ttystikk (Jun 22, 2016)

Rooster96 said:


> Thanks for the reply ttystikk. Please put up link to your thread when you get it rolling if you don't mind.


Link to my thread is in my signature line. Turn your phone sideways to see it lol


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## Rooster96 (Jun 22, 2016)

Tim Fox said:


> here is a link to the DIY cob timber kits,, there are others
> http://timbergrowlights.com/products/diy-grow-light-kits/


Thanks for putting this up Tim. I just read through it and it is a great thread.


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## pinner420 (Jun 22, 2016)




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## KushyMcKush (Jun 22, 2016)

Tim Fox said:


> here is a link to the DIY cob timber kits,, there are others
> http://timbergrowlights.com/products/diy-grow-light-kits/


Ive seen these guys and also another similar conpany... Can't remember the name. Im going to be expanding my grow for the next run into 2 4x4 spaces. Im currently looking into either building/buying a cob led or purchasing a second lec 315.


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## ttystikk (Jun 22, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Ive seen these guys and also another similar conpany... Can't remember the name. Im going to be expanding my grow for the next run into 2 4x4 spaces. Im currently looking into either building/buying a cob led or purchasing a second lec 315.


You'll be happier with COB LED.


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 22, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> You'll be happier with COB LED.


Im leaning towards that too. I made a post in the led forum asking for some advice on a proper setup I will be happy/successful with. I want to make sure I get it right the first time and plan on putting a good amount of $$ into it. check it out and maybe we can chat about this a bit more. 

https://www.rollitup.org/t/need-some-advice-here.912921/


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## friedkalamari (Jun 22, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> You'll be happier with COB LED.


howcome?


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## Tim Fox (Jun 22, 2016)

friedkalamari said:


> howcome?


there are many reasons I love my Cobs,, one reason near the top of my list is " No buying bulbs ever other grow, or every grow " 
eventually the cost will be cheaper for the cobs, I harvested 8.5 ounces dried last time around on only 208 watts of cree cob, I am not sure if anyone has harvested more than 1 gram per watt with the cmh,, 
I am not knocking 315's,,, never would do that, I have seen allot of awesome buds grown under them, 
but I went the cob route, and I am please that I did,


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## ttystikk (Jun 22, 2016)

friedkalamari said:


> howcome?


Better light and more of it. More forgiving. Less heat. Less watts. Lasts longer. Solid state, no parts that wear out- COB chips included.


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## ttystikk (Jun 22, 2016)

Tim Fox said:


> there are many reasons I love my Cobs,, one reason near the top of my list is " No buying bulbs ever other grow, or every grow "
> eventually the cost will be cheaper for the cobs, I harvested 8.5 ounces dried last time around on only 208 watts of cree cob, I am not sure if anyone has harvested more than 1 gram per watt with the cmh,,
> I am not knocking 315's,,, never would do that, I have seen allot of awesome buds grown under them,
> but I went the cob route, and I am please that I did,


I'm in the same boat. My new personal best is 32oz, from one plant. It was lit with 900W of CXB3590 COB LED. That's a gram per watt, it was a first effort and I fried the run early. There's much more potential than that.


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## friedkalamari (Jun 22, 2016)

Tim Fox said:


> there are many reasons I love my Cobs,, one reason near the top of my list is " No buying bulbs ever other grow, or every grow "
> eventually the cost will be cheaper for the cobs, I harvested 8.5 ounces dried last time around on only 208 watts of cree cob, I am not sure if anyone has harvested more than 1 gram per watt with the cmh,,
> I am not knocking 315's,,, never would do that, I have seen allot of awesome buds grown under them,
> but I went the cob route, and I am please that I did,





ttystikk said:


> Better light and more of it. More forgiving. Less heat. Less watts. Lasts longer. Solid state, no parts that wear out- COB chips included.


thanks guys. i'm pretty much set on going the cob route.

my tent dimensions are somewhat weird, at only 2.5x1.5x5. i made the most space out of what i had.

for this size, would you guys recommend this setup or can i find better value elsewhere? http://timbergrowlights.com/200-watt-cree-cxb3590-4-cob-kit-free-shipping/ 

i'm open to diy, not if it only saves me <$50 over a timber fixture though.


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## Tim Fox (Jun 22, 2016)

friedkalamari said:


> thanks guys. i'm pretty much set on going the cob route.
> 
> my tent dimensions are somewhat weird, at only 2.5x1.5x5. i made the most space out of what i had.
> 
> ...


I would have to say the timber kit is going to be too many watts for that space,, I would prefer just a 2 of the older cxa3070's in that space, plus the cxa's are half the cost


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## friedkalamari (Jun 22, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I'm in the same boat. My new personal best is 32oz, from one plant. It was lit with 900W of CXB3590 COB LED. That's a gram per watt, it was a first effort and I fried the run early. There's much more potential than that.


at what % were you running them?

if i go that timber fixture route, do i need anything else like a dimmer/controller so i can run them at a lower %?


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## friedkalamari (Jun 22, 2016)

Tim Fox said:


> I would have to say the timber kit is going to be too many watts for that space,, I would prefer just a 2 of the older cxa3070's in that space, plus the cxa's are half the cost


even if i run them at 50%? assuming that's possible...

is height mainly the issue here?


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## ttystikk (Jun 22, 2016)

friedkalamari said:


> at what % were you running them?
> 
> if i go that timber fixture route, do i need anything else like a dimmer/controller so i can run them at a lower %?


It will be a lot of light but if you take good care of your plants they'll reward you well. Just run the bar higher at first, then lower it incrementally to harden your girls off to the intensity.


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## ttystikk (Jun 22, 2016)

friedkalamari said:


> even if i run them at 50%? assuming that's possible...
> 
> is height mainly the issue here?


I like fried calamari, but I low squid lots of other ways, too. 

You can get them to dim, but 5' should be enough. 

Be sure to keep up with watering them.


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## Tim Fox (Jun 22, 2016)

friedkalamari said:


> even if i run them at 50%? assuming that's possible...
> 
> is height mainly the issue here?


they do sale a kit with the dimable driver, and yes you could dim them, and then do like @ttystikk suggests and see how much light you can throw at them, just be careful, you could over power them in that space with that big light, so go slow and wait for full power , but your ppfd's would be way up the chart


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## GroErr (Jun 22, 2016)

5x 3gal in a 3.5'x3.5' under 1x 315w Sun Systems LEC, Day 32. 2x 5gal at the back finishing up at Day 60 under 3590's. They both work 



Cheers


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## friedkalamari (Jun 23, 2016)

Tim Fox said:


> they do sale a kit with the dimable driver, and yes you could dim them, and then do like @ttystikk suggests and see how much light you can throw at them, just be careful, you could over power them in that space with that big light, so go slow and wait for full power , but your ppfd's would be way up the chart


i can always just do the diy route. what about doing 3x 3590's instead of 4? i'm really open at this point


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## Bad Karma (Jun 23, 2016)

This was a real nice LEC thread we had going here for a minute.
Guys, there is a whole sub-forum to talk about LED/COB related lights and this isn't it.
Let us poor LEC growers have a thread to ourselves, ffs.


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## ttystikk (Jun 23, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> This was a real nice LEC thread we had going here for a minute.
> Guys, there is a whole sub-forum to talk about LED/COB related lights and this isn't it.
> Let us poor LEC growers have a thread to ourselves, ffs.


I use them. In my veg, lol


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 23, 2016)

Let's get this back on track BK......

Here's my NL on day 41 of flower (not all 41 days have been under the LEC)


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## KushyMcKush (Jun 23, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> This was a real nice LEC thread we had going here for a minute.
> Guys, there is a whole sub-forum to talk about LED/COB related lights and this isn't it.
> Let us poor LEC growers have a thread to ourselves, ffs.


I believe all of us who have been discussing cob led also use lec. I currently use one and am loving it. No harm in discussing other secondary/additional lighting to add  
Ok back on track. Day 4 of flower under 315 lec. Did a little defoliation and supercropping today:


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## Ryante55 (Jun 23, 2016)

Clementine day 20


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## bottletoke (Jun 24, 2016)

GroErr said:


> 5x 3gal in a 3.5'x3.5' under 1x 315w Sun Systems LEC, Day 32. 2x 5gal at the back finishing up at Day 60 under 3590's.
> 
> Cheers


What do you have on your walls? How reflective is it?
I gawts to gets me sum of dat!


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## GroErr (Jun 24, 2016)

bottletoke said:


> What do you have on your walls? How reflective is it?
> I gawts to gets me sum of dat!


That's a specific type of Styrofoam insulation brand called DuroFoam, they come in 4'x8' sheets from 3/4" to 2" thick. It's meant for basement walls and floors and has one side with that reflective surface, it's around 95% and works great. I insulated, vapour barrier and then used the 3/4" sheets with the reflective side out for the "walls". I grabbed them here (Canada) at Home Depot and I think they carry it in the US as well.
https://www.homedepot.ca/en/home/search.products.html#!p=0&q=DuroFoam:relevance


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## Gonefishn7420 (Jun 24, 2016)

Going to be grabbing my first 315 and was wondering if any one has experience with the sun system or the hydrofarm. Can't see much of a difference in the two except ballast location and price(hydrofarm about 60 bucks cheaper) thanks in advance.


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 24, 2016)

Gonefishn7420 said:


> Going to be grabbing my first 315 and was wondering if any one has experience with the sun system or the hydrofarm. Can't see much of a difference in the two except ballast location and price(hydrofarm about 60 bucks cheaper) thanks in advance.


I have the sun systems and have absolutely no regrets on my purchase. Get it from growers house for the best price I had seen when I bought. Can't speak on the hydrofarm no exp with it, but the phillips ballasts and bulb with the sunsytems has been good to me thus far. Easiest light I have used so far and flowering my first plant out really nicely, making me look better than I am for sure lol.


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## GroErr (Jun 24, 2016)

Gonefishn7420 said:


> Going to be grabbing my first 315 and was wondering if any one has experience with the sun system or the hydrofarm. Can't see much of a difference in the two except ballast location and price(hydrofarm about 60 bucks cheaper) thanks in advance.


I have a couple of the Sun Systems. From a quality perspective imo the Sun Systems reflectors are the top of the line and you get what you pay for. Other than that the difference between the two is mainly around the package, the SS contains everything inside the hood, nice and neat. Many others including the hydrofarm have external ballasts which can be a good thing or a pain in the ass depending on your perspective.


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## dangledo (Jun 25, 2016)

anyone try out an lec kit yet?

ive looked around for more info on those 'kits' about the ballast. are they true square wave? wanting to drop another in the room, but if i could save a couple bucks and use an existing hood, all the better.


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## ttystikk (Jun 25, 2016)

dangledo said:


> anyone try out an lec kit yet?
> 
> ive looked around for more info on those 'kits' about the ballast. are they true square wave? wanting to drop another in the room, but if i could save a couple bucks and use an existing hood, all the better.


I have a full dozen of the 315W CMH kits. They're bulb with a mogul socket base plus the Philips Advance square wave ballast. I got my kits for less than $200 each. I needed to cut and kit bash with a ballast cord and a vertical socket cordset. They work great!


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## WattSaver (Jun 26, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I have a full dozen of the 315W CMH kits. They're bulb with a mogul socket base plus the Philips Advance square wave ballast. I got my kits for less than $200 each. I needed to cut and kit bash with a ballast cord and a vertical socket cordset. They work great!


Would you happen to have a link for this kit?? I'm on my last set of 400W Philips bulbs, and need a pair for my hood, might even put 3 in there.

Here's a few shots using the predecessor bulb to this newer more efficient bulb, the Retro White 100 - 400W bulb at $36/bulb. Over the past 5yrs I've used 2 in the same hood on a 4'x4' area.

Maui Bay One of my own crosses



Nine Pound Hammer


Maui Wowie


NLXBB


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## ttystikk (Jun 26, 2016)

Well dang. Looks like the guy is having business problems and his website is down. 

Surely he isn't the only one who sold these kits.


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## Growdict (Jun 27, 2016)

Day 67 for the cks crown royale. Chop day. Almost 2 weeks longer than my watermelon strain. Did a rough trim. Smell is great. Probably about 90-100g to add to my total for that run. Getting closer to 1gpw. Day 35 on my next run of CR and WW. Summertime now and can only run one light due to heat.


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## twistedentities (Jun 28, 2016)

I hung my lec today! I got the sun 315 with 3100k and wow! Very nice light. My canopy is a bit eft but I'll get that dialed in next round from the cuttings I took.
In the tent is 2 gg#4. One is in 15 gal smart the other in 10g, the cannatonic is 15galand on the right of the yellowish pic is major medic and cherry mint


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## bob223 (Jun 29, 2016)

twistedentities said:


> I hung my lec today! I got the sun 315 with 3100k and wow! Very nice light. My canopy is a bit eft but I'll get that dialed in next round from the cuttings I took.
> In the tent is 2 gg#4. One is in 15 gal smart the other in 10g, the cannatonic is 15galand on the right of the yellowish pic is major medic and cherry mint
> View attachment 3719670 View attachment 3719671 View attachment 3719673 View attachment 3719676


How big of an area is your light covering?

are you only using that light for flower?

it looks like those plants will stretch alot.
I see you are running two tents what kind of light are you using in the second?

besides that looks great. i really wish i could get my hands on the gorilla glue #4 everyone talks about!


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## ttystikk (Jun 29, 2016)

bob223 said:


> How big of an area is your light covering?
> 
> are you only using that light for flower?
> 
> ...


Plants don't tend to stretch as much under these, due to the spectral distribution. They grow plenty healthy, though! Also, as a rule of thumb, you only need about 60% of total wattage in 315W CMH lights as HPS, whether the mission is veg or bloom.


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## twistedentities (Jun 30, 2016)

bob223 said:


> How big of an area is your light covering?
> 
> are you only using that light for flower?
> 
> ...


The area is 3x5. I'll be hanging another 315 next week or closing the area to 3x3. I have 2 more 315's with 3100 and 4200 bulbs. The light is 2' over the lowest plant which is in the middle. Eventually I'll have Mylar on the walls and the other room finished. I planned this room for veg and figured a 3x5 would be plenty of room. Ended having to move my outdoor plants inside and flower them. Took some cuts and have them growing now to be moms. Things got backasswards for me this season lol. 
I can't wait to try the gg. I'm hoping it helps me sleep more than a few hours a night. Here's a few pics from today


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## Evil-Mobo (Jun 30, 2016)

Day 48 of flower Nirvana Northern Lights:



Such a beast but a beauty what a plant for my first run man!


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## Sire Killem All (Jun 30, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I use them. In my veg, lol


It seems you kept the kits just to come in here and try and keep up the LED vs HID shit.


----------



## KushyMcKush (Jun 30, 2016)

Gonefishn7420 said:


> Going to be grabbing my first 315 and was wondering if any one has experience with the sun system or the hydrofarm. Can't see much of a difference in the two except ballast location and price(hydrofarm about 60 bucks cheaper) thanks in advance.


I also have the Sun System. My hydro shop did have the other one with the conical shaped reflector and the external ballast and it was a little cheaper. I liked how he Sun System was all in one unit and it looked nice and well built. They did have several of the hydrofarm ones set up in their greenhouse over tomatoes and another one in the middle of the store set up over some kind of tree. All the plants and the tree looked amazing. For my room, the Sun System one just made more sense.


----------



## KushyMcKush (Jun 30, 2016)

bob223 said:


> How big of an area is your light covering?
> 
> are you only using that light for flower?
> 
> ...


https://www.greatlakesgenetics.com/listing/gorilla-bubble-bx1f1/833

Its Gorilla Bubble. (GG#4xSour Bubble) x (GG#4xSour Bubble). Looks super dank. I almost got this one, but went with a diffenrent vendor. Its bred by Bohdi, so its gotta be good.


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## ttystikk (Jun 30, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> It seems you kept the kits just to come in here and try and keep up the LED vs HID shit.


No. I kept the 315W CMH kits so I can use them in their most effective places in a setup that's otherwise advanced beyond the light bulb. 

Turns out that they're plenty effective in veg, in part because they're an omnidirectional light source, makes them great for training a bunch of plants to grow vert. 

If you just want a cheering section for your choice in lighting, that's cool but self limiting. If you want hard nosed comparisons of the tech vs other options, this is the right place.


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## bob223 (Jun 30, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Day 48 of flower Nirvana Northern Lights:
> 
> View attachment 3721408
> 
> ...


How is the smell on the northern lights? i have flowered out two phenos of nirvana's northern lights.

they both have the craziest smell. my friends call it "spicy pine tree's" 
Both phenos were keepers with one having a bigger yeild but less potency. the other is super potent and has smaller rock hard buds.
I will say both seem to throw a banana or two but i haven't had any issues with them.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Jun 30, 2016)

bob223 said:


> How is the smell on the northern lights? i have flowered out two phenos of nirvana's northern lights.
> 
> they both have the craziest smell. my friends call it "spicy pine tree's"
> Both phenos were keepers with one having a bigger yeild but less potency. the other is super potent and has smaller rock hard buds.
> I will say both seem to throw a banana or two but i haven't had any issues with them.


Mine smells exactly like that but with a small hint of lime like a refreshing spicy pine tree smell. She's my first grow so we will see but I like what I see so far pictures do no justice lol......


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## genuity (Jun 30, 2016)




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## bob223 (Jun 30, 2016)

genuity said:


> View attachment 3721535


That is a beautiful picture!


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## pinner420 (Jun 30, 2016)

Chop tomorrow for these two ladies.


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## 2 meanwell (Jul 1, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> View attachment 3721705 View attachment 3721709
> Chop tomorrow for these two ladies.


Awesome colors.
Meanwell


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## Pig4buzz (Jul 2, 2016)

Evil awesome plant. This is a auto? I read in one of your previous post you used FFOF and let it rip. no bloom or extra ferts? Again she is beautiful!


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 2, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Evil awesome plant. This is a auto? I read in one of your previous post you used FFOF and let it rip. no bloom or extra ferts? Again she is beautiful!


Thanks bro, she's not an auto but I do have two auto's that will be done about the same time as her. She's my Feminized Northern Lights from Nirvana. I have her in FFOF in a SIP and I started to feed her about three weeks ago with Nova bloom and yesterday started giving straight tap again to flush her out. The rest of the grow was straight PH tap water and FFOF. My two autos are in FFOF and no feeding until a week ago they have been fed twice and only because one of them is a heavy eater. I started them on straight water yesterday too. It's getting exciting over here because there's a lot going on at once lol.


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## Pig4buzz (Jul 2, 2016)

Congrats on your grow


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## Evil-Mobo (Jul 2, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Congrats on your grow


Thanks man so excited to be getting close to harvest on my first plants and the second round up in veg is looking nice and healthy..............

To get the thread back on topic, New baby under the 315w started to show flowers today.......... she has three sisters that will be joining her soon if they all fit lol......


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## pinner420 (Jul 2, 2016)

Feeling accomplished! Bestseedbank.com is using my Black Rose tree run in an article..


----------



## Bad Karma (Jul 2, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> Feeling accomplished! Bestseedbank.com is using my Black Rose tree run in an article..


Well done! Throw us a link.


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## pinner420 (Jul 2, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> Well done! Throw us a link.


Just gave photo release so see here soon.


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## Ryante55 (Jul 2, 2016)

Had to throw an LED in the lec room because a bulb went out and it's been hot but here's the citrus sap it has 2 or 3 weeks left the room now has 315w of lec and 200w of cxb3070 2700k in the next few days I'll be adding 200w of cxb 3070 3500k


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## pinner420 (Jul 7, 2016)

http://www.bestseedbank.com/diy-deep-water-culture-the-recirculating-oxygen-system/


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Jul 9, 2016)

Nirvana Northern Lights Fem- 57 Days 12/12, my first harvest


----------



## bob223 (Jul 10, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Nirvana Northern Lights Fem- 57 Days 12/12, my first harvest
> 
> View attachment 3728334


NICE!!!!!! looks great. trim job looks good too.

How do you think the yield was? It looks just like one of the phenos i run of nirvana's NL. 
Great looking bud congrats on the harvest.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Jul 10, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Nirvana Northern Lights Fem- 57 Days 12/12, my first harvest
> 
> View attachment 3728334


Gratz on the harvest looks pretty


----------



## GroErr (Jul 10, 2016)

3.5'x3.5' at the front under 1x Sun Systems LEC, 5x 3gal at Day 49. No shortage of frost, nice density all around the perimeter, had thrown a new bulb in there for this round after just shy of 2 years with the first bulb. No problem stretching these out to 3.5'x3.5' imo.



  

Cheers


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Jul 10, 2016)

bob223 said:


> NICE!!!!!! looks great. trim job looks good too.
> 
> How do you think the yield was? It looks just like one of the phenos i run of nirvana's NL.
> Great looking bud congrats on the harvest.


I do not know on yield man I see some pics of people posting yields and it don't look right in comparison to the numbers posted so I will just wait for everything to dry and let the scale tell me. Thanks for the kind words I did wet trim on half the plant anmd doing dry trim on the other half just to see which I prefer. She was a wonderful plant to work with and the preliminary smoke is out of this world. I still can't believe I grew this at home lol........


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Jul 10, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> Gratz on the harvest looks pretty


Thanks just trying to catch up to the quality people like you are growing along with MANY others on here.......


----------



## pinner420 (Jul 14, 2016)

New favorite


----------



## ttystikk (Jul 14, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> New favorite View attachment 3731874


Yet another great Colorado brewery, not far from where I live.


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## ttystikk (Jul 14, 2016)

I said I'd weigh in when I had an 860W CDM Allstart lamp up and running on a digital lfsw ballast- well it's up and running, and it looks a wee bit green compared to the 315W CMH lights in there. It's making a lot of light, I just couldn't say how much.


----------



## bob223 (Jul 14, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I said I'd weigh in when I had an 860W CDM Allstart lamp up and running on a digital lfsw ballast- well it's up and running, and it looks a wee bit green compared to the 315W CMH lights in there. It's making a lot of light, I just couldn't say how much.


I do not know much about any cdm bulb except for the Philips 315. what would the benefits of a 860 Cdm bulb be.
Is the spectrum comparable to the elite agro bulb? I know you only use cdm for veg but would the 860 have any use in flowering.
Do they make a bulb with a spectrum that would be more suitable for flower?

Thanks for the update.


----------



## bob223 (Jul 14, 2016)

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/nhfAmC06eI0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Does anyone have any experience with Double ended Cmh. the video i posted is has a guy who is starting to run one.

it looks like it will run off of any double ended ballast . I have lots of questions about this.

The bulb itself looks crazy. looks like 2 315 bulbs in one tube.


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## ttystikk (Jul 14, 2016)

bob223 said:


> I do not know much about any cdm bulb except for the Philips 315. what would the benefits of a 860 Cdm bulb be.
> Is the spectrum comparable to the elite agro bulb? I know you only use cdm for veg but would the 860 have any use in flowering.
> Do they make a bulb with a spectrum that would be more suitable for flower?
> 
> Thanks for the update.


The spectrum of 860W CDM Allstart lamps is 93 CRI, and yes it grows plants very well indeed- just look at most of the pics in my thread from the past year or so. 

The technology in 315W CMH lights and 860W CDM Allstart lamps IS THE SAME. Only the wattage specification is different. 

Magnetic ballasts drive this lamp technology at about 30% efficiency. Lfsw ballasts drive them to 38-40%, it's no more complicated than that.


----------



## Ryante55 (Jul 15, 2016)

Citrus sap first few branches pulled at 65 days rest will be cut down at 70 days


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## bob223 (Jul 15, 2016)

Ryante55 said:


> Citrus sap first few branches pulled at 65 days rest will be cut down at 70 days


That looks fucking dank. 
Have you grown out that cut before? is it a low yeilder?


----------



## Ryante55 (Jul 15, 2016)

bob223 said:


> That looks fucking dank.
> Have you grown out that cut before? is it a low yeilder?


First time for me. my top feed was a little to nitrogen rich I think the buds would have been fatter if I didn't screw that up. I'll post my yield in a few weeks when it's all dry. I have some Clementine going right now thats looking pretty good


----------



## Ryante55 (Jul 15, 2016)

Clementine day 45


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## bob223 (Jul 20, 2016)

I have been following this guys grow and I'm definitely impressed with the double ended CHM. it seems to be rocking the 5x5 with no problems.

Im seriously considering taking the dive and picking a de ballast to play with this winter. Anyone think this technology will catch on?
It seems like there is only one company making this light. But the price is right i think i could get the De CMH bulb, a de ballast and reflector for arounf the same price of a sun system 315.


----------



## Vnsmkr (Jul 20, 2016)

bob223 said:


> Anyone think this technology will catch on?


Not with the advancements cobs are making....


----------



## Psyphish (Jul 20, 2016)

Vnsmkr said:


> Not with the advancements cobs are making....


COBs are too pricey and difficult to handle (multiple tiny lights bolted together).

It's so much easier to just buy a single fixture that works well.


----------



## Vnsmkr (Jul 20, 2016)

Not always going to be like that ^. Things advance quickly....


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## Psyphish (Jul 20, 2016)

Vnsmkr said:


> Not always going to be like that ^. Things advance quickly....


Yeah maybe in a few years. At the moment COBs are just too DIY oriented and the pre-built fixtures are a lot more expensive than CDMs.


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## ttystikk (Jul 20, 2016)

Psyphish said:


> Yeah maybe in a few years. At the moment COBs are just too DIY oriented and the pre-built fixtures are a lot more expensive than CDMs.



Prebuilt fixtures are pricey only because of the components. 
Better efficiency means less cooling. A LOT less cooling than DE.
Better spectrum means better buds. 
No lamp replacement, means no slowly degrading lamp invisibly costing even more efficiency. 
Any questions?


----------



## Psyphish (Jul 20, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Prebuilt fixtures are pricey only because of the components.
> Better efficiency means less cooling. A LOT less cooling than DE.
> Better spectrum means better buds.
> No lamp replacement, means no slowly degrading lamp invisibly costing even more efficiency.
> Any questions?


I'd use the same fans with COBs as I do with 315w CDMs.
I think CDMs have a pretty good spectrum already, and they keep their efficiency better than standard HPS.

I can't afford COBs, but I can afford CDMs.


----------



## ttystikk (Jul 20, 2016)

Psyphish said:


> I'd use the same fans with COBs as I do with 315w CDMs.
> I think CDMs have a pretty good spectrum already, and they keep their efficiency better than standard HPS.
> 
> I can't afford COBs, but I can afford CDMs.


They're a transitional step. I did the same.


----------



## 2easy (Jul 20, 2016)

315w for the win


----------



## pinner420 (Jul 20, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> They're a transitional step. I did the same.


I still can't get anyone to build me one like @legallyflying. I just need a six footer.


----------



## Vumar (Jul 20, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Prebuilt fixtures are pricey only because of the components.
> Better efficiency means less cooling. A LOT less cooling than DE.
> Better spectrum means better buds.
> No lamp replacement, means no slowly degrading lamp invisibly costing even more efficiency.
> Any questions?



Yeah light penetration / light intensity would be a good question. LEDS always lacked that. You can't beat dual 600w fixtures w/ MH n HPS DE's and 860w allstart CDM bulb powered by a 1k badass ballast on a parabolic. All on 240v.


----------



## ttystikk (Jul 20, 2016)

Vumar said:


> Yeah light penetration / light intensity would be a good question. LEDS always lacked that. You can't beat dual 600w fixtures w/ MH n HPS DE's and 860w allstart CDM bulb powered by a 1k badass ballast on a parabolic. All on 240v.


I bet we know the same people; I'm running an 860W CDM Allstart lamp on a badass, too- only I'm doing it in veg. 

I promise the COB LED rack is pushing out way more light than your motley crew of dim bulbs! Lol j/k! You should see it, seriously.


----------



## Ryante55 (Jul 20, 2016)

Vumar said:


> Yeah light penetration / light intensity would be a good question. LEDS always lacked that. You can't beat dua upl 600w fixtures w/ MH n HPS DE's and 860w allstart CDM bulb powered by a 1k badass ballast on a parabolic. All on 240v.


Sounds like alot of A/C would be needed for that unless it's a huge room


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jul 20, 2016)

Finally got my 315 sun lec up after 3 months. Brought plants inside to veg out will leave some to finish this n closet. It's 3x4 turned out pretty good. Here is short video of room and plants. Thanks club lec the light is awesome on these ladies after a week in new home after several modification lol. Well video would not open. Few pics of some of the girls. The one flowering is 3 wks in. The others are about 18 days old


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## bob223 (Jul 20, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Finally got my 315 sun lec up after 3 months. Brought plants inside to veg out will leave some to finish this n closet. It's 3x4 turned out pretty good. Here is short video of room and plants. Thanks club lec the light is awesome on these ladies after a week in new home after several modification lol. Well video would not open. Few pics of some of the girls. The one flowering is 3 wks in. The others are about 18 days old



Glad you like your light it will do well for you. 

The plants look great. we would love to here some more details on your grow


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jul 20, 2016)

Well mostly freebies since first grow indoor in 20 yrs 9 autos, 4 are unknown as is the one in bloom they were Buddha auto fem. other 4 autos are a afghan kush freebie, free dark purple, free amnesia, and Twins Alpujarrena these were on sale one Pineapple Express auto one week had hull issues. The 4 photos are free afghan valley girls. Plan on putting them outside in two three more weeks, alone with the smallest autos. 

Soil is ffof with perlite, vermiculite, teaspoon blood meal, bone meal per gal. Added 5 6 grains of 33% nitrogen on outer edge of bags. Root bags 5 gal and 3gal

Using half dose cal mag each water no nitrogen due to blood meal and 33%. Half autos I did not it add the 33%. Just test. 

Afghans photo use same soil mix. 

Plant in flower same soil added jacks half dose of 10-30-20 first week l flower added small tablespoon of age old dry fruit this week 2-26-20. Not right close lol. Water with ca mag other as well with autos. Plan on same does ever other week last two weeks age old only. 

This is close. Just got to decide who goes out and who stays.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Jul 21, 2016)

Seedlings are entering 3 week today, fed 25%. 
All seeds are above the ground now, 100% germination rate this round. 24 planted 24 sprouted.
Rest of the ladies


----------



## DesertGrow89 (Jul 21, 2016)

Vumar said:


> Yeah light penetration / light intensity would be a good question. LEDS always lacked that. You can't beat dual 600w fixtures w/ MH n HPS DE's and 860w allstart CDM bulb powered by a 1k badass ballast on a parabolic. All on 240v.


550w of LED has more penetrating power than a 1k gavita hps, the efficiency and lack of heat definitely beats HPS. CAVEAT: LED is expensive!


----------



## hyroot (Jul 22, 2016)

looks like philips 3100k is the best cmh bulb


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Jul 22, 2016)

Blue Dream day 15. SunSystem315


----------



## genuity (Jul 22, 2016)

Now that is nice....


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Jul 22, 2016)

genuity said:


> Now that is nice....


Like #endofthread nice lol


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Jul 22, 2016)

Those plants were fed Ionic Bloom from start to finish. One bottle. 

6in rockwool on cocomats, 9 plants per 3x3 table. 12 day veg. Topped once.


----------



## Javadog (Jul 22, 2016)

I was going to say the same Gen....

Kitchen clean and clearly well thought out.

JD


----------



## bob223 (Jul 23, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> View attachment 3739059
> Blue Dream day 15. SunSystem315
> View attachment 3739062


DAMNNNNN Looking great .


if you don't mind me asking what are you pulling per light.

I'm pushing to try to pull a lb per light.
i think its possible.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Jul 23, 2016)

bob223 said:


> DAMNNNNN Looking great .
> 
> 
> if you don't mind me asking what are you pulling per light.
> ...


A little over a lb per light. I found the 315s have more penetration, but slightly less density than standard HID. Instead of tops being incredibly dense and the bottoms not so much, the 315s produce a standard density from top to bottom. 

I had to change my style of growing to get the yields with 315. I was growing SOG before, with the lack of super density, i wasn't pulling the yields I wanted with them at first. After changing to larger plants and less of them I am happy with the yields and quality.


----------



## MistaRasta (Jul 23, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> A little over a lb per light. I found the 315s have more penetration, but slightly less density than standard HID. Instead of tops being incredibly dense and the bottoms not so much, the 315s produce a standard density from top to bottom.
> 
> I had to change my style of growing to get the yields with 315. I was growing SOG before, with the lack of super density, i wasn't pulling the yields I wanted with them at first. After changing to larger plants and less of them I am happy with the yields and quality.



Great info! Thanks for sharing.

I just invested in 4 315's to replace my hid's in veg and im amazed at how bright they are, about to order 5 more as i grow 4 big bushes under each 600 hps. I see the variance in bud structure but was yield the same? What kind of light were you growing under prior to the cmh? (400w/600w/1000w)?


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Jul 23, 2016)

MistaRasta said:


> Great info! Thanks for sharing.
> 
> I just invested in 4 315's to replace my hid's in veg and im amazed at how bright they are, about to order 5 more as i grow 4 big bushes under each 600 hps. I see the variance in bud structure but was yield the same? What kind of light were you growing under prior to the cmh? (400w/600w/1000w)?


I was running 600s before and would yield between 1.25 and 1.5 lbs per light. So they do not outright replace a 600, but watt for watt they destroy them.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jul 24, 2016)

day 10 under the lec 315 sun 3100 bulb. Massive growth since last post 4 days ago. A few autos in 2 and 3 rd week. Last pic is of Pakistan valley photo been LST on her (playing) Autos Amnesia, Dark Purple, unknown. In order 
Have other all look awesome. Doing s little LST on Autos too.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jul 25, 2016)

Ok need a little help. I have auto that's in 26th day of flower. Unknown bag from Buddha. She seems to be growing taller now under the 315 since brought inside. The top 5 inches are thin with nugs now. Middle/bottom are stacking good. Anyone ever have this? Will it fatten up? Cause? Tried to upload video want let me. So cut pic from vid. Don't want to disturb progress again today. 
Last pic is from 11 days when first put her inside. Notice the top when zoomed is much thicker than today. What's up pros?


----------



## GroErr (Jul 26, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Ok need a little help. I have auto that's in 26th day of flower. Unknown bag from Buddha. She seems to be growing taller now under the 315 since brought inside. The top 5 inches are thin with nugs now. Middle/bottom are stacking good. Anyone ever have this? Will it fatten up? Cause? Tried to upload video want let me. So cut pic from vid. Don't want to disturb progress again today.
> Last pic is from 11 days when first put her inside. Notice the top when zoomed is much thicker than today. What's up pros?


Don't know a lot first hand about autos but I wouldn't fret about it, with photos there can be huge variations between strains and even phenos of the same strain in how they stretch and stack buds. As long as you keep them healthy they'll do their own thing. Not sure what you're vegging with but I've seen some extreme stretching go on with some phenos when changing from blurple veg lights to the 3100k CMH bulbs in flower. I've run a couple of fireballs that stretch like mofo's and end up with huge spacing between the nodes but eventually filled in pretty good.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jul 26, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Don't know a lot first hand about autos but I wouldn't fret about it, with photos there can be huge variations between strains and even phenos of the same strain in how they stretch and stack buds. As long as you keep them healthy they'll do their own thing. Not sure what you're vegging with but I've seen some extreme stretching go on with some phenos when changing from blurple veg lights to the 3100k CMH bulbs in flower. I've run a couple of fireballs that stretch like mofo's and end up with huge spacing between the nodes but eventually filled in pretty good.


. Well it's just actually grown about 4inch on top cola only in 10 days since I put under LEC. Veg was outdoor. Was two weeks in flower when put indoors. Hope to not have big fat cola in middle and nothing on top. Lol


----------



## GroErr (Jul 26, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> . Well it's just actually grown about 4inch on top cola only in 10 days since I put under LEC. Veg was outdoor. Was two weeks in flower when put indoors. Hope to not have big fat cola in middle and nothing on top. Lol


That change from outdoor to indoor could have had some effects on it's growth, likely a certain period of adjustment needed. I noticed my outdoor slowed down when I finished the last few weeks in the garage when the weather turned crap a couple of years back. It eventually finished but took longer than it should have.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jul 27, 2016)

Two days and a drank of juice makes a difference. Seem the girl is going to fatten up. Looks kinda like me big belly and skinny neck lol. They say your they will pick up your charteristics lol! 315 is rocking. Frost starting to build up. 4 wks in flower today. Unknown Freebie. 4 more weeks she should really have my traits lol. Happy growing. Thanks @GroErr for you help and support.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jul 27, 2016)

Pic may help.


----------



## bob223 (Jul 27, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Pic may help.


Keep us updated. im pretty sure that will fill out. It almost looks like it went in to flower stretched, started growing buds, then stretched again.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jul 28, 2016)

Inside of the room. Here is all the girls they are growing like crazy. The girl in the middle is 29 days flower. She is going to be a beast. Others will be 28 (4weeks) Saturday. With exception of 3 which are two to 3 weeks. 14 days under 315. Feed all autos with age old dry fruit showing
yesterday. Bloom on.


----------



## pinner420 (Jul 28, 2016)

Day 9. Shifting from transition to bloom.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jul 31, 2016)

Little growth in the past 3 days everything seems to be exploding. Autos and photos. I hate to move anything outside, but guess I have no choice Got two autos at 54 days unknown. 4 afghan girls. 4 weeks veg. 7 other autos 3-4. Weeks. Fing bushes everything. Pull the 315 to to 22 inches from 18in. Think this may of hrlped with the 3x4 space. The 315 is making me look good! 2nd n 3rd pic is on 7/17


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Aug 3, 2016)

SunSystem 315s
Blue Dream day 28


----------



## Gonefishn7420 (Aug 4, 2016)

Any one ever order a CMH through here? Sounds to good to be true.


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 4, 2016)

Gonefishn7420 said:


> Any one ever order a CMH through here? Sounds to good to be true.View attachment 3749277


Watch out for phantom gear; @dbkick had some and they gave him problems. Maybe he can chime in with more details and how he got the issue resolved.


----------



## Growdict (Aug 4, 2016)

thats an error, it should be 424.22 see link http://hydrobuilder.com/grow-light-bulbs-ballasts-hoods/lec-grow-lights.html?manufacturer=659. if you can get one for that price, it sounds like a good buy.


----------



## Gonefishn7420 (Aug 4, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Watch out for phantom gear; @dbkick had some and they gave him problems. Maybe he can chime in with more details and how he got the issue resolved.


I actually have one running currently and have had no problems so far(knock on wood) just in the market for a second.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Aug 4, 2016)

2 stars should mean something. If only 200$ Budget get bulb ballast for 200$ and just let hang down


----------



## dbkick (Aug 4, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Watch out for phantom gear; @dbkick had some and they gave him problems. Maybe he can chime in with more details and how he got the issue resolved.


Not sure but I think this was a bad batch of ballasts because I've also heard other stories of how some of the first phantom cmh had a intermittent random flicker that a reset fixed. I and a friend bought several , the friend is actually the one that caught it because he didn't run his on a timer and was just running 24/7 (which mh is not really designed for) , after he told me about the flicker he was seeing I kept an eye on mine more and found it had the same issues as his. There has already been a revision in design from what I understand and hydrofarm will more than likely refund or exchange any of the defective batch because it's a known issue.


----------



## SirSivart (Aug 4, 2016)

dbkick said:


> Not sure but I think this was a bad batch of ballasts because I've also heard other stories of how some of the first phantom cmh had a intermittent random flicker that a reset fixed. I and a friend bought several , the friend is actually the one that caught it because he didn't run his on a timer and was just running 24/7 (which mh is not really designed for) , after he told me about the flicker he was seeing I kept an eye on mine more and found it had the same issues as his. There has already been a revision in design from what I understand and hydrofarm will more than likely refund or exchange any of the defective batch because it's a known issue.


I've had a couple customers bring back bad ones and it has been zero hassle getting hydrofarm to warranty them. Here is the best price i've found them for yet. https://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/phantom-315w-ceramic-metal-halide-grow-light-3100k.html


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 4, 2016)

dbkick said:


> Not sure but I think this was a bad batch of ballasts because I've also heard other stories of how some of the first phantom cmh had a intermittent random flicker that a reset fixed. I and a friend bought several , the friend is actually the one that caught it because he didn't run his on a timer and was just running 24/7 (which mh is not really designed for) , after he told me about the flicker he was seeing I kept an eye on mine more and found it had the same issues as his. There has already been a revision in design from what I understand and hydrofarm will more than likely refund or exchange any of the defective batch because it's a known issue.


I bought a dozen bare kits of lamp and Philips Advance 210/315W LFSW ballasts, I paid $190 each plus shipping. Unfortunately, it seems that Advanced Lighting Tech is out of business and that avenue of purchase is no longer available.

Aside from price, the reason I went this route was that he was the only guy I knew of who had 315W CMH lights with mogul socket bases, allowing me to use my existing light fixtures. It was a substantial savings for me. 

The price mentioned above is very reasonable for a complete system with reflector.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 4, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I bought a dozen bare kits of lamp and Philips Advance 210/315W LFSW ballasts, I paid $190 each plus shipping. Unfortunately, it seems that Advanced Lighting Tech is out of business and that avenue of purchase is no longer available.
> 
> Aside from price, the reason I went this route was that he was the only guy I knew of who had 315W CMH lights with mogul socket bases, allowing me to use my existing light fixtures. It was a substantial savings for me.
> 
> The price mentioned above is very reasonable for a complete system with reflector.


$424? Can get SS lec 315 for that. 


SirSivart said:


> I've had a couple customers bring back bad ones and it has been zero hassle getting hydrofarm to warranty them. Here is the best price i've found them for yet. https://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/phantom-315w-ceramic-metal-halide-grow-light-3100k.html


Yes, that's the new style ballast , they've even changed the casing., unfortunately I don't buy anything phantom since I've had 3 of 3 returned. They are decent about exchange or refund though. I had a phantom 1kw, phantom DE and phantom cmh all go back.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 4, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I bought a dozen bare kits of lamp and Philips Advance 210/315W LFSW ballasts, I paid $190 each plus shipping. Unfortunately, it seems that Advanced Lighting Tech is out of business and that avenue of purchase is no longer available.
> 
> Aside from price, the reason I went this route was that he was the only guy I knew of who had 315W CMH lights with mogul socket bases, allowing me to use my existing light fixtures. It was a substantial savings for me.
> 
> The price mentioned above is very reasonable for a complete system with reflector.


Ah I see you meant the one at $330, yes that is a decent price especially considering they even come with the lamp.


----------



## Gonefishn7420 (Aug 4, 2016)

Thanks for the link, I'm gonna give it a go for that price. That is like paying 230-240 for hood and ballast.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 4, 2016)

Gonefishn7420 said:


> Thanks for the link, I'm gonna give it a go for that price. That is like paying 230-240 for hood and ballast.


Seriously the reflectors aren't all that. You can buy a sunplix 315 ballast that has a lot more features than the phantom for $150, I've found OG reflectors for $110 new, mogul to pgz adapter $25 , mogul extension $10 , $85 for Solis lamp.
And in the cooler months all I have to do is pull the mogul adapters switch out ballast to a hortilux platinum or sunplix 860 cmh and screw in the allstart 860.


----------



## Gonefishn7420 (Aug 4, 2016)

dbkick said:


> Seriously the reflectors aren't all that. You can buy a sunplix 315 ballast that has a lot more features than the phantom for $150, I've found OG reflectors for $110 new, mogul to pgz adapter $25 , mogul extension $10 , $85 for Solis lamp.
> And in the cooler months all I have to do is pull the mogul adapters switch out ballast to a hortilux platinum or sunplix 860 cmh and screw in the allstart 860.


Have a link for the sunplix for 150?


----------



## dbkick (Aug 4, 2016)

http://www.sunplix.com/
Ask if there is a distributor in your area. If not you'll have to deal with sonny and he quotes msrp which I would probably refuse to pay. Like the 860 cmh msrp 649, I will not pay that because I can get a hortilux platinum for less 


Gonefishn7420 said:


> Have a link for the sunplix for 150?


----------



## highdave (Aug 7, 2016)

Here's what I'm working with crammed 3x3nothing like some of you guys on here tho


----------



## Javadog (Aug 7, 2016)

That looks really really nice Dave. :0)


----------



## highdave (Aug 7, 2016)

Javadog said:


> That looks really really nice Dave. :0)


Thank you my friend I see bout a pound!


----------



## Pig4buzz (Aug 8, 2016)

Been a while since
Post of the girls. Pull the valley girls and put outside. Hope I don't regret the choice. Leaving all autos inside. They are all showing sex and growing like crazy. Burnt one looking ok. Now I think the oldest two are done they never really came out the speckle leaf issue. I cal-mag her but not much difference. Notice a few white specs on a couple of leaves on young one. Hope it's nothing bad. 
Starting a batch of incredible bulk(4) fem. and 2 Shaman reg. Those will be next for the flower room. 
Here are a couple pics. These are 4 - 5 wks old. Only 4 are known. Dark purple,amnesia, Alpujenna, and pineapple she is youngest 19days. 

Comments are welcome. My loupe hasn't come in but think the plant in center it's time to die. She was put indoor from outdoor at 4 wks she is now in her 9th week. 

9 total autos hope to pull 8zips. Total 10-12 on 4-5 photo next grow.


----------



## widowmaker31 (Aug 9, 2016)

Crammed in a 7x7 8 plants ; Day 33 of Flower ---- it's all in the details.... Great job everyone! thank you RIU!


----------



## Growdict (Aug 9, 2016)

Damn, thats frosty.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Aug 9, 2016)

twistedentities said:


> Awesome! If I have the ac running, I can get it as cool as needed. Real happy to have 80 with it being almost 90 outside. Only thing on now is an exhaust fan that pulls air from under the house. Can't wait to hook up the lec's


I have mine in a 4x2 tent with a/c room at 74 tent stays 74-78 with a mountain air 4x16 filter and a hurricane 171cfm with a PHC variac at 60%. These lights are cooler but I came from 3 1000w HPS with a/c in a basement and I did not care about odors. This size setup is all new to me, but I am very very impressed with the 315 CMH so far.


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## ttystikk (Aug 9, 2016)

widowmaker31 said:


> Crammed in a 7x7 8 plants ; Day 33 of Flower ---- it's all in the details.... Great job everyone! thank you RIU!View attachment 3753416 View attachment 3753417 View attachment 3753418 View attachment 3753419 View attachment 3753420 View attachment 3753421


That's some fire, bro- pretty frost rails on those.


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## Flowki (Aug 10, 2016)

Can anyone say if this ballast is ok for the Phillips bulb?. It says it ''precisely'' drives it, but it's hardly going to say ''kinda somewhat drives it'' .


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## Growdict (Aug 10, 2016)

i dont trust any that dont specifically say "low frequency square wave".


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## ttystikk (Aug 10, 2016)

Flowki said:


> Can anyone say if this ballast is ok for the Phillips bulb?. It says it ''precisely'' drives it, but it's hardly going to say ''kinda somewhat drives it'' .


Run screaming. 

If it doesn't say 'low frequency square wave' for CDM/CMH/LEC, do not buy the ballast. Period.


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## Flowki (Aug 10, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Run screaming.
> 
> If it doesn't say 'low frequency square wave' for CDM/CMH/LEC, do not buy the ballast. Period.


Ouch, thnx.

Can't seem to find a uk option with only ballast/bulb. Any ideas?. Theirs an omega ballast but it does not specify frequency. The Phillips ballast ? is connected to a fixed hood, really not good for a stadium approach or possible vert.


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## ttystikk (Aug 10, 2016)

Flowki said:


> Ouch, thnx.
> 
> Can't seem to find a uk option with only ballast/bulb. Any ideas?. Theirs an omega ballast but it does not specify frequency. The Phillips ballast ? is connected to a fixed hood, really not good for a stadium approach or possible vert.


It may not be easy to find, but Philips does sell the ballast alone.


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## Flowki (Aug 10, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> It may not be easy to find, but Philips does sell the ballast alone.


Yeah think I seen one, with £200 shipping. Should I run screaming from that, too 

Do you have the exact name of the Phillips ballast for reference?.


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## ttystikk (Aug 10, 2016)

Flowki said:


> Ouch, thnx.
> 
> Can't seem to find a uk option with only ballast/bulb. Any ideas?. Theirs an omega ballast but it does not specify frequency. The Phillips ballast ? is connected to a fixed hood, really not good for a stadium approach or possible vert.


http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/PHILIPS-ADVANCE-IZTMH-210-315-R-LF-/191924489945?nav=SEARCH

You may now kiss the ring, lol


----------



## Pig4buzz (Aug 10, 2016)

Well chopped the first unknown auto tonight. She is one of two I brought indoors on week 5. She had 4 weeks of the 315. Not to please with her, let her go to long I think, but ok with it since basically experimenting with the 315. Will finish rest of auto by first of month and start the photo flower. I think this girl will yield close to a zip. Nugs feel pretty dense and she's a stinky girl. I know she is ugly lol.! One down 8 to go


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## dbkick (Aug 10, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/PHILIPS-ADVANCE-IZTMH-210-315-R-LF-/191924489945?nav=SEARCH
> 
> You may now kiss the ring, lol


Whoa that's pricey, sunplix.com, ask sonny if there is a distributor near you. that is unless you don't like plug and play with all the bells and whistles.


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## Flowki (Aug 11, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/PHILIPS-ADVANCE-IZTMH-210-315-R-LF-/191924489945?nav=SEARCH
> 
> You may now kiss the ring, lol


With post+import its like £340 for the ballast alone. Pluss a Phillips bulb/mog will push price near 450 ($600 or so)


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## Flowki (Aug 11, 2016)

dbkick said:


> Whoa that's pricey, sunplix.com, ask sonny if there is a distributor near you. that is unless you don't like plug and play with all the bells and whistles.


Just want the ballast ;[. Have access to a bulb, converter and standard reflector. Those fixed hood reflectors are limiting


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## Flowki (Aug 11, 2016)

Btw, I don't doubt it but why is it so important to be low-f square wave?. On a basic level I assume it runs the light at a greater intensity. So well, worse case, would a ballast that could run the bulb but is not lowF sqrW still run a Phillips bulb that would surpass a 400w mh enough to consider?.


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## ttystikk (Aug 11, 2016)

Flowki said:


> Btw, I don't doubt it but why is it so important to be low-f square wave?. On a basic level I assume it runs the light at a greater intensity. So well, worse case, would a ballast that could run the bulb but is not lowF sqrW still run a Phillips bulb that would surpass a 400w mh enough to consider?.


In no particular order; 

CDM/CMH/LEC lamps are all the same thing. 
They all MUST run at frequencies of about 174Hz or less, or they either don't strike or destroy themselves. 
A magnetic ballast will drive one, but not well; see the dark bars in pics taken under lights driven by mags? That's an interference pattern, evidence that the lamp is actually OFF 30% of the time! It's just flickering so fast you don't see it. 
A square wave ballast eliminates the dark bars and thus drives this type of lamp much more efficiently. Spectrum output also improves. 
Therefore, the only ballast worth running a CMH lamp on is a LFSW type.

To be very clear, even this is a distant second in performance to COB LED. COB LED is fast becoming the new industry standard because of its performance, efficiency, reliability and durability. Costs are rapidly falling, as well.


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## dbkick (Aug 11, 2016)

Flowki said:


> Just want the ballast ;[. Have access to a bulb, converter and standard reflector. Those fixed hood reflectors are limiting


They'll reluctantly sell you only the ballast but to get a decent price you'll need a local distributor, Sonny will sell to you direct if there is no local distro but he'll charge you msrp which you'll probably refuse to pay.


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## ttystikk (Aug 11, 2016)

dbkick said:


> They'll reluctantly sell you only the ballast but to get a decent price you'll need a local distributor, Sonny will sell to you direct if there is no local distro but he'll charge you msrp which you'll probably refuse to pay.


Their strategy seems kinda stupid if you ask me. After all, COB LED is better technology and it's breathing down their necks already. The only advantage left to light bulbs is low initial cost of acquisition and if they price themselves too high, they blow even that edge.


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## dbkick (Aug 11, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Their strategy seems kinda stupid if you ask me. After all, COB LED is better technology and it's breathing down their necks already. The only advantage left to light bulbs is low initial cost of acquisition and if they price themselves too high, they blow even that edge.


Well, as you know you stated before that to manufacture a LFSW ballast does cost more but the msrp on the sunplix 860 cmh I was quoted was 649, they can keep it at that price.


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## dbkick (Aug 11, 2016)

Also I was talking with one of the local distributors and he seemed put off by sunplix and was actually talking a bit of shit on them. He's also a philips dealer. But he told me he was looking into a much better lighting solution than the sunplix 860 cmh. I'm still waiting to hear back.


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## ttystikk (Aug 11, 2016)

dbkick said:


> Also I was talking with one of the local distributors and he seemed put off by sunplix and was actually talking a bit of shit on them. He's also a philips dealer. But he told me he was looking into a much better lighting solution than the sunplix 860 cmh. I'm still waiting to hear back.


Sunpricks lol


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## ttystikk (Aug 11, 2016)

dbkick said:


> Well, as you know you stated before that to manufacture a LFSW ballast does cost more but the msrp on the sunplix 860 cmh I was quoted was 649, they can keep it at that price.


@Revolution Micro sells their whole fixture for $420 and it comes with a DE HPS lamp for that price.


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## dbkick (Aug 11, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> @Revolution Micro sells their whole fixture for $420 and it comes with a DE HPS lamp for that price.


But those seem to pop pretty easy.


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## dbkick (Aug 11, 2016)

I'm on to ceramic hps if I can ever get my hands on one.


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## ttystikk (Aug 11, 2016)

dbkick said:


> But those seem to pop pretty easy.


No mine was definitely an off label use, so I'd reserve judgement until there's a diagnosis.

And there WILL be a diagnosis; I'm shipping the ballast section back at their request and expense so they can determine what failed and why.


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## ttystikk (Aug 11, 2016)

dbkick said:


> I'm on to ceramic hps if I can ever get my hands on one.


The sooner you quit playing with light bulbs, the happier you and your AC will be.


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## Sire Killem All (Aug 11, 2016)

My ladies under Nanolux 630w fixtures

Jack Herer doing some major fox tailing all over the plant.

Quadrant of HSO blue dream clones and mother.

26" tall clone, can't see it well but is a round as a 24 oz cup.

Have yet to hear back from Nanolux about the idea they put on the box that they are high frequency.

Here are some from seed under sunplix 315w ballast and Phillips lamp
 



P.S. 
Just found this 
http://www.lighting-spot.com/iztmh210315rlfm.html?fee=24&fep=2013&gclid=Cj0KEQjwxLC9BRDb1dP8o7Op68IBEiQAwWggQE0jIgjsM1is5r35FMRIVDdXO_83R9zgIs3XH1OhkJAaAkDW8P8HAQ


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## ttystikk (Aug 11, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> My ladies under Nanolux 630w fixtures
> 
> Jack Herer doing some major fox tailing all over the plant.View attachment 3754979
> 
> ...


Perfect! Great find on the ballast! 

Now, to find the mogul socket base version of the Philips 315W CMH lamp.


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## Sire Killem All (Aug 11, 2016)

Ok, so I just got off the phone with Nanolux's president and he assured me that the 630 fixtures are ran on LFSW, and that it was a error on box labeling, that my email months ago brought to his attention.

Stupid spam folder made me think they never responded.


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## Flowki (Aug 11, 2016)

So it would seem a uk cmh is either not possible or way over priced ;[. And well, can only assume cobs would suffer the same fate here too.


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## dbkick (Aug 11, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> The sooner you quit playing with light bulbs, the happier you and your AC will be.


I do ok with light bulbs and I don't run AC.


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## dbkick (Aug 11, 2016)

Actually the hottest running lights I have in the 230-350 watt range are the onyx leds I run.


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## Flowki (Aug 11, 2016)

Is their a better option to 400mh that is not cob/cmh?.


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## ttystikk (Aug 11, 2016)

Flowki said:


> Is their a better option to 400mh that is not cob/cmh?.


They discontinued 330MH in favor of the 315W CMH, which should tell you what the industry is thinking.


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## Flowki (Aug 11, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> They discontinued 330MH in favor of the 315W CMH, which should tell you what the industry is thinking.


Damn you industry ;/.


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## ttystikk (Aug 11, 2016)

Flowki said:


> Damn you industry ;/.


More light for less power, and no annoying flicker. Wtf were they thinking, anyway?


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## Flowki (Aug 11, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> More light for less power, and no annoying flicker. Wtf were they thinking, anyway?


All at the very reasonable price of your soul


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## ttystikk (Aug 11, 2016)

Flowki said:


> All at the very reasonable price of your soul


Nah, just a lil filthy lucre.

I sold my soul to rock n roll long ago.

Fat lot of good it did me.


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## bob223 (Aug 11, 2016)

Here are some lec grown bud. Nirvana's Northern Lights and Headbands. 


First two are the Headbands last one is the Northern lights


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## kingzt (Aug 12, 2016)

So what standard on cooling a 315? How many btus would it take to cool one? In comparison to the amount of heat they put off is it a lot less than a 400 watt. I have been running gavitas and this summer's heat has been driving me crazy. Between the lamps and the ambient temps of where my rooms are located it, the heat is terrible. Can fall arrive soon!?!


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## Pig4buzz (Aug 12, 2016)

6- new babies were born today. They are 2 incredible bulk fem, 2 white widow fem, and two reg.Shaman. Will be vegging with the burple Mars 300 hydro. Not quiet thru setting up veg room under 250 watts of CFLs.at this time. Putting in flower under the 315 in 4 - 5 wks. 

Another unknow auto will hang Sunday, should of killed her at birth She's been sick from start. Thinking she may get a 1/4zip. 

The last 7 autos are out of control hopefully will stop growing within the week

The Pakistan valleys I set out side have double in size in one week. (Says they are big stretchers). 

Pics updates next week. Happy growing


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## bob223 (Aug 13, 2016)

kingzt said:


> So what standard on cooling a 315? How many btus would it take to cool one? In comparison to the amount of heat they put off is it a lot less than a 400 watt. I have been running gavitas and this summer's heat has been driving me crazy. Between the lamps and the ambient temps of where my rooms are located it, the heat is terrible. Can fall arrive soon!?!


If your interior temps are around 70-73 degree's you will not need extra ac unless you are running quite a few lamps. I find lec only increases room temps by a few degrees as long as you have good air flow. i would say they run about as warm as a air cooled 600 watt.


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## MistaRasta (Aug 13, 2016)

I was going to buy more Phillips 4200k bulbs and stumbled upon Ushio's ceramic bulbs. Wondering what you guys think of the spectrum on their 4200k. Theyre only a few dollars more than the phillips and seem to be worth it.

@ttystikk ?





http://growershouse.com/ushio-hilux-gro-cmh-ceramic-mh-lamp-315w-4200k


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## ttystikk (Aug 13, 2016)

MistaRasta said:


> I was going to buy more Phillips 4200k bulbs and stumbled upon Ushio's ceramic bulbs. Wondering what you guys think of the spectrum on their 4200k. Theyre only a few dollars more than the phillips and seem to be worth it.
> 
> @ttystikk ?
> 
> ...


That looks pretty good to me.


----------



## bob223 (Aug 13, 2016)

MistaRasta said:


> I was going to buy more Phillips 4200k bulbs and stumbled upon Ushio's ceramic bulbs. Wondering what you guys think of the spectrum on their 4200k. Theyre only a few dollars more than the phillips and seem to be worth it.
> 
> @ttystikk ?
> 
> ...


I seen a video on youtube were they compare all of the lec bulbs that are currently available. The Philips bulb out performed everything they tested including the ushio


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## dbkick (Aug 13, 2016)

Not sure about growershouse testing, their numbers have always looked odd to me in one way or another.
As you can see by the difference in the UV range it would appear the solis would do better than the ushio . Pay no attention to the solis DE finisher at the top of the photo. Err actually thats the daylight 4k DE up top, I'm gonna side by side it with an allstart 860 this fall/winter.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 13, 2016)

Actually solis may not be truthfully in their advertising , it's strange but they also print on the box "for best results use with solistek digital ballast" when solis doesn't even make a 315 cmh ballast.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 13, 2016)

Oh then, yes they do now. Fuck another thing to buy.
Pre-order now, due out first week of sept.


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## Sire Killem All (Aug 13, 2016)

MistaRasta said:


> I was going to buy more Phillips 4200k bulbs and stumbled upon Ushio's ceramic bulbs. Wondering what you guys think of the spectrum on their 4200k. Theyre only a few dollars more than the phillips and seem to be worth it.
> 
> @ttystikk ?
> 
> ...


http://growershouse.com/blog/cmh-314w-lamp-comparison-test-data-review/


----------



## dbkick (Aug 13, 2016)

I do believe I'm gonna look at one or two of these. Maybe one to start out with but solis is some solid shit in my book,
http://solis-tek.com/products/complete-systems/solistek-c1-315w-cmh-complete-fixture-120-240v.html


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## dbkick (Aug 13, 2016)

The reflector looks nice. No hammered aluminum there.
http://growershouse.com/solistek-c1-315w-cmh-complete-fixture-120-240v?keyword=&gclid=COCu_6f2vs4CFQELaQod8yMBEQ


----------



## bwailer (Aug 13, 2016)

Hi, I have a sun system 315w LEC and some reason it is not working. When we took it down it was working but now where I have it, it will not turn on. I can see a light on the on/off switch and it is going in and out. Anyone have any IDEAS? Thanks.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Aug 13, 2016)

bwailer said:


> Hi, I have a sun system 315w LEC and some reason it is not working. When we took it down it was working but now where I have it, it will not turn on. I can see a light on the on/off switch and it is going in and out. Anyone have any IDEAS? Thanks.


Check ur power plug.


----------



## bwailer (Aug 13, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> Check ur power plug.


I looked at the plug and it seems fine.


----------



## bwailer (Aug 13, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> Check ur power plug.


Is it bad to try and open it up?


----------



## Growdict (Aug 13, 2016)

They take about 15 minutes to reset. Leave it off for that long then try to refire it.


----------



## bwailer (Aug 13, 2016)

Growdict said:


> They take about 15 minutes to reset. Leave it off for that long then try to refire it.


Will do thank you


----------



## bwailer (Aug 13, 2016)

bwailer said:


> Will do thank you


Oaky so I had it unplugged for 30 minutes, plugged it back in and it is still the same.


----------



## Growdict (Aug 14, 2016)

Dunno. Maybe the bulb. You got a spare to try?


----------



## bwailer (Aug 14, 2016)

I do not. I was wording about the bulb too. It was fine when we took it down. When I flip it on should I hear anything? I do not hear anything? Could that be caused by the bulb going out?


----------



## Growdict (Aug 14, 2016)

I suppose if you had a meter you could see if power was going to the socket.


----------



## bwailer (Aug 14, 2016)

Growdict said:


> I suppose if you had a meter you could see if power was going to the socket.


The socket has power. I know it was tested.


----------



## Growdict (Aug 14, 2016)

Then it is almost certainly the bulb


----------



## bwailer (Aug 14, 2016)

Thanks for your info. I will see if I can find a new bulb for it tomorrow


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## bwailer (Aug 14, 2016)

Oaky, so i put a new bulb in there and still it is the same as before. I can faintly see a glow in the on/off switch. I am so bummed out.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Aug 14, 2016)

Take it back. SunSystem has good warranty.


----------



## bwailer (Aug 14, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Take it back. SunSystem has good warranty.


I was gifted it from a friend from their veg room. I was there when she took it down. It was working and right before I took it. It has not had any abuse since it left hers. I don't know if it is returnable because of this.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Aug 14, 2016)

bwailer said:


> I was gifted it from a friend from their veg room. I was there when she took it down. It was working and right before I took it. It has not had any abuse since it left hers. I don't know if it is returnable because of this.


Ask her where she got it. Go there and explain the situation. The answer is always no if you do not ask.


----------



## bwailer (Aug 14, 2016)

You are so very right. I will talk to her this evening or tomorrow morning as no one is open today.


----------



## Javadog (Aug 14, 2016)

Sorry to hear of the difficulty. I hope that it resolves as well as it might.


----------



## bwailer (Aug 14, 2016)

Thank you Javadog. I was also wondering if you can have people fix them too?


----------



## Sire Killem All (Aug 14, 2016)

Are u plugged into the right voltage... 110 vs 220


----------



## bwailer (Aug 14, 2016)

I have it plugged into a 240V that was put in for this light


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## bwailer (Aug 14, 2016)

it is a 240V light too.


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## ttystikk (Aug 14, 2016)

If two lamps won't work it's probably a dead ballast.


----------



## bwailer (Aug 14, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> If two lamps won't work it's probably a dead ballast.


I was thinking that too. is it fixable?


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 14, 2016)

bwailer said:


> I was thinking that too. is it fixable?


Not sure, but IME the only ballasts with serviceable parts are magnetic.


----------



## bwailer (Aug 14, 2016)

Thank


ttystikk said:


> Not sure, but IME the only ballasts with serviceable parts are magnetic.


Thanks. I am really bummed out. I can tell it is getting a bit of power cause the on/off switch flickers.


----------



## DesertGrow89 (Aug 14, 2016)

bwailer said:


> Thank
> 
> Thanks. I am really bummed out. I can tell it is getting a bit of power cause the on/off switch flickers.


I was sent two defective 315w bulbs in a row from Hydrobuilder, won't order anything from them again.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Aug 14, 2016)

Quick pic of one of the autos. Dark Purple. Bad pic but a pretty little plant. Purple leaves, frost and buds turning purple.


----------



## horribleherk (Aug 14, 2016)

bwailer said:


> Thank
> 
> Thanks. I am really bummed out. I can tell it is getting a bit of power cause the on/off switch flickers.


have you checked the power source you put in for the light? it sounds like one of your 2 positive sources isn't putting out of the three wires 2 should carry power & one should be a ground I'm not too electricity smart but I call it 220 & normal household I call 110 im not saying it's correct but I call the hot ones legs maybe each leg has a breaker & one is off or has been tripped just my 2 cents& last but not least dou have the right timer?


----------



## bwailer (Aug 15, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> have you checked the power source you put in for the light? it sounds like one of your 2 positive sources isn't putting out of the three wires 2 should carry power & one should be a ground I'm not too electricity smart but I call it 220 & normal household I call 110 im not saying it's correct but I call the hot ones legs maybe each leg has a breaker & one is off or has been tripped just my 2 cents& last but not least dou have the right timer?


Your two cents definitely helped. I looked in the breaker box and they had used two breakers into one and had put something over both switches to they both go at the same time but that little piece fell off. Thanks for the help.


----------



## bwailer (Aug 15, 2016)

I got it guys and gals. I got it all figured out. Thanks and I have a working Sun System 315W. I am excited to use it. is it perfect in a 3x3 tent?


----------



## Growdict (Aug 15, 2016)

congrats and yes, perfect for a 3x3


----------



## horribleherk (Aug 15, 2016)

bwailer said:


> I got it guys and gals. I got it all figured out. Thanks and I have a working Sun System 315W. I am excited to use it. is it perfect in a 3x3 tent?


glad to hear you're up & running I'm wanting one of these myself & the 3x3 tent as well using a 400 w. hps & a single waterfarm 29x29 in. scrog this (cmh/ lec) seems like the perfect match my scrog seems a bit much for the 400 hps as my outer growth isn't as dense as the 24x24" center keep us posted my setup is working good but the cmh would be the icing on th cake


----------



## bwailer (Aug 15, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> View attachment 3758042
> glad to hear you're up & running I'm wanting one of these myself & the 3x3 tent as well using a 400 w. hps & a single waterfarm 29x29 in. scrog this (cmh/ lec) seems like the perfect match my scrog seems a bit much for the 400 hps as my outer growth isn't as dense as the 24x24" center keep us posted my setup is working good but the cmh would be the icing on th cake


Thanks, I will keep you up to date with how well it works for me.


----------



## bwailer (Aug 15, 2016)

Growdict said:


> congrats and yes, perfect for a 3x3


Thank you, I am very excited it was not the lamp going out.


----------



## Flowki (Aug 15, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> In no particular order;
> 
> CDM/CMH/LEC lamps are all the same thing.
> They all MUST run at frequencies of about 174Hz or less, or they either don't strike or destroy themselves.
> ...


If you use a Phillips bulb on a digi ballast that can run it but is not square wave, is it any better than using a run of the mill 400w MH bulb/mag ballast?.

What would you personally knock up for a 4x4 cob veg area?.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Aug 15, 2016)

3x3 is recommended by many growers. You will like the 315. Happy growing


----------



## highdave (Aug 15, 2016)

bwailer said:


> Your two cents definitely helped. I looked in the breaker box and they had used two breakers into one and had put something over both switches to they both go at the same time but that little piece fell off. Thanks for the help.


That little piece fell off!!?? Not good my man. That piece is to keep the breakers together called a bridge, so if one trips they both trip. 
Now I have a little knowledge on electrical circuits not an electrician per say but not a laymen.
In the box there is 2 bars, A and B, both have 120 going to each adding to 240.
240 circuits on a 120/240 system will have one of the breakers on A and one on B both connected with that bridge that fell off. If A gets overloaded everything on that side will trip, if the bar is not there only one breaker on the 240 will trip and you can fry your ballast.


----------



## bwailer (Aug 15, 2016)

highdave said:


> That little piece fell off!!?? Not good my man. That piece is to keep the breakers together called a bridge, so if one trips they both trip.
> Now I have a little knowledge on electrical circuits not an electrician per say but not a laymen.
> In the box there is 2 bars, A and B, both have 120 going to each adding to 240.
> 240 circuits on a 120/240 system will have one of the breakers on A and one on B both connected with that bridge that fell off. If A gets overloaded everything on that side will trip, if the bar is not there only one breaker on the 240 will trip and you can fry your ballast.


Thank you that is some very good information. I will think about that and I might have a double pole breaker put in instead.


----------



## bwailer (Aug 15, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> 3x3 is recommended by many growers. You will like the 315. Happy growing


Thank you.


----------



## horribleherk (Aug 15, 2016)

bwailer said:


> Thank you that is some very good information. I will think about that and I might have a double pole breaker put in instead.


jb-weld them together so they both trip simultaneously or see why the bridge fell off in the first place


----------



## highdave (Aug 15, 2016)

bwailer said:


> Thank you that is some very good information. I will think about that and I might have a double pole breaker put in instead.


No problem it's baically the same thing as long as they are tied together properly. But if your getting new breakers 2 pole would be the way to go. Just make sure they are rated the same. But these things rock a 3x3 you will be pleased


----------



## horribleherk (Aug 15, 2016)

I'm looking to rock a 3x3 as well the 400 is doing good in my 29x29 scrog but I'm wanting a tad more


----------



## highdave (Aug 15, 2016)

That looks awesome bro!!


----------



## Sire Killem All (Aug 16, 2016)

Will be dropping them in 3 days. 2 of them look like they could go weeks more but will fall with them all.
All flowered under 3×Nanolux 630w fixtures.


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 16, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> Will be dropping them in 3 days. 2 of them look like they could go weeks more but will fall with them all.
> All flowered under 3×Nanolux 630w fixtures.


Do you not stagger your harvest, at least a little? I can take the first one in the batch whenever it's ready, even before term. Likewise, I can wait as long as day 70 for the last one if it can use it.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

The lamps are very fragile.one of the reasons i would stay away from those 630 de ones that are nothing but 2-315 arc tubes with an outer enevelope, id thnk theyd be even more fragile and they run on an ultra high freq sine wave ballast. If the design doesnt add something to ruggedness those 630 de cmh are going to be dropping left and right and their pricey .


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> The lamps are very fragile.one of the reasons i would stay away from those 630 de ones that are nothing but 2-315 arc tubes with an outer enevelope, id thnk theyd be even more fragile and they run on an ultra high freq sine wave ballast. If the design doesnt add something to ruggedness those 630 de cmh are going to be dropping left and right and their pricey .


All that complexity and fragility and they still don't work as well as COB LED.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> The lamps are very fragile.one of the reasons i would stay away from those 630 de ones that are nothing but 2-315 arc tubes with an outer enevelope, id thnk theyd be even more fragile and they run on an ultra high freq sine wave ballast. If the design doesnt add something to ruggedness those 630 de cmh are going to be dropping left and right and their pricey .


They are not DE, it is just a 2×315 fixture.


ttystikk said:


> Do you not stagger your harvest, at least a little? I can take the first one in the batch whenever it's ready, even before term. Likewise, I can wait as long as day 70 for the last one if it can use it.


normally I could jus hang them in my spare room to dry and finish the others, but we are remodeling the room. So the only place left is the flower room.


ttystikk said:


> All that complexity and fragility and they still don't work as well as COB LED.


one day when I don't have to worry about the law taking my Expensive toys.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Aug 16, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> jb-weld them together so they both trip simultaneously or see why the bridge fell off in the first place


Do not do this. Not up to code.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> They are not DE, it is just a 2×315 fixture.
> 
> normally I could jus hang them in my spare room to dry and finish the others, but we are remodeling the room. So the only place left is the flower room.
> 
> one day when I don't have to worry about the law taking my Expensive toys.


Two 315 arc tubes fit in a de sleeve. This really isnt even legit. Had they doubled arc tube length and it was more than 2-315s in a de sleeve id be interested its not that so I stick with the allstart with one arc tube thats 3 times the size of the 315.
http://growershouse.com/growers-choice-630w-de-double-ended-cmh-ceramic-mh-lamp-3100k


----------



## Sire Killem All (Aug 16, 2016)

Had seen those awhile back, I've never really cared for it. You have to dim past 630w to run it, so it under powering it, and forbid the idea of a accidentally increase in power (750,1000, 1100).


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> Had seen those awhile back, I've never really cared for it. You have to dim past 630w to run it, so it under powering it, and forbid the idea of a accidentally increase in power (750,1000, 1100).


----------



## bob223 (Aug 16, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> I'm looking to rock a 3x3 as well the 400 is doing good in my 29x29 scrog but I'm wanting a tad more View attachment 3758543 View attachment 3758545


You will increase your yeild and size of your buds when the lec. when are you thinking about switching?

you wont regret it!

p.s. it looks like you were getting pretty good results with the 400. you should be be able to kill it with the lec once you get it dialed in


----------



## bwailer (Aug 16, 2016)

highdave said:


> No problem it's baically the same thing as long as they are tied together properly. But if your getting new breakers 2 pole would be the way to go. Just make sure they are rated the same. But these things rock a 3x3 you will be pleased


I think I am going to put in a double pole breaker. I purchased one yesterday so i will be putting it in sometime in the next few days.


----------



## bwailer (Aug 16, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> I'm looking to rock a 3x3 as well the 400 is doing good in my 29x29 scrog but I'm wanting a tad more View attachment 3758543 View attachment 3758545


It looks very nice!!


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> Had seen those awhile back, I've never really cared for it. You have to dim past 630w to run it, so it under powering it, and forbid the idea of a accidentally increase in power (750,1000, 1100).


I kinda figured we were talking about two different things but wanted to state my opinion on the mickey mouse de ones.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

A lot of de ballasts have a boost feature , like the solis matrix de, hit the boost on 600w and it runs 630.


----------



## bob223 (Aug 16, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> Had seen those awhile back, I've never really cared for it. You have to dim past 630w to run it, so it under powering it, and forbid the idea of a accidentally increase in power (750,1000, 1100).


Yeah i was intrigued by the DE Lec mainly because the cost of a solis tek ballast is so low. but honestly the more i play with the 315 the more i realize that it is capable on its own.

I think i would get better results with multiple 315's then with a lec 630 or a double ended lec.
I believe 3x 315 lecs will rock a 8x8 NO problem. and that's about as big as i would ever go.

my last harvest i pulled 1lb off 1x 315lec the most i ever pulled of of 1x 1000w hps was slightly over 1lb. running the same genetics.
The 1 pound harvest has been my goal with the lec. I just need to see if i can maintain it. I have been pushing the light to just under a 4x4 foot print with no real consequence.
Buds are still huge and seem to be tighter then they were under hps. One major difference maybe that with hps i grew 6 smaller plants at a time, and now with Lec i grow 4 larger plants.

I couldn't be happier with the results i have been getting with this light.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

off topic it looks like hortilux really doesn't know wtf their time frame is for their new white hps(I quit calling it ceramic hps because all hps arc tubes are a form of ceramic).
So anyway now it's anywhere from 
Sept to January . Pull head out horti.


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> off topic it looks like hortilux really doesn't know wtf their time frame is for their new white hps(I quit calling it ceramic hps because all hps arc tubes are a form of ceramic).
> So anyway now it's anywhere from
> Sept to January . Pull head out horti.


They may be giving up on it, as COB LED is making a big entry into the market.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> They may be giving up on it, as COB LED is making a big entry into the market.


You saw the spectrum, they aren't tossing in the towel quite yet.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

Although I will like that comment.


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> Although I will like that comment.


Spectrum is good, but efficiency is no longer competitive- and the power utilities are handing out free money to facilities that upgrade with energy efficient lighting, which makes all the difference.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Spectrum is good, but efficiency is no longer competitive- and the power utilities are handing out free money to facilities that upgrade with energy efficient lighting, which makes all the difference.


The power companies can fuck themselves and MED (or whomever inspects these commercial grows around here)are full of shit and can't even do their job right.
Some of these commercial grows buy lights to get rebates just to turn around and craigslist the weak little lights and they're back to their 1+kw hid.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> You saw the spectrum, they aren't tossing in the towel quite yet.


 I am anxiously awaiting this bulb myself too. Meanwhile I will play with the 600w Blue MH and the new 1000W Platinum ballast and bulb that's en route as well.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I am anxiously awaiting this bulb myself too. Meanwhile I will play with the 600w Blue MH and the new 1000W Platinum ballast and bulb that's en route as well.


which lamp would that be?


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

For the platinum I mean,


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> which lamp would that be?



I thought you were talking about the release of this bulb:
http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/ceramic-hps.aspx

Waiting to try one out as I was please with my 315 LEC.

Right now I have this in the vert tent running on a Gold E series ballast:
http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/specific/600w-Hortilux-Blue


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> For the platinum I mean,


We were typing at the same time my apologies for the confusion.

I got the platinum ballast from Growers House and they include an enhanced HPS bulb (Eye Hortilux brand) with it so I will try that first. Thought is first half of flower under the 600 second half under the 1K.............. we will see how it works......

http://growershouse.com/hortilux-1000w-platinum-electronic-digital-ballast


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> The power companies can fuck themselves and MED (or whomever inspects these commercial grows around here)are full of shit and can't even do their job right.
> Some of these commercial grows buy lights to get rebates just to turn around and craigslist the weak little lights and they're back to their 1+kw hid.


Lol I Love how you speak the truth about this industry! 

As you know, I'm hard at work building lighting that not only gets the utility's subsidy money, but will be the envy of everyone who doesn't have it yet.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

Back on topic (I think) . I just emailed solis about getting a scope printout of the lamp output of their newest fixture that runs the 315 (suggested for best results when using their 315 lamp with more uv that the competition, although that's been questioned).
So the guy was real helpful plus protective of his possible proprietary info ( he thought I was asking internal readings which would be proprietary and none of my fucking business.) He also wanted to know why I wanted this info and I told him for my own personal use as a way to make a decision on whether I was sold or not. Mentioned to him if the signal printout was nice and clean it should be used in part of marketing, a snapshot of a nice clean square reading on a scope could sway someone towards their product. Of course it's all got to be done honestly unlike certain ways of measuring certain things pertaining to lighting. you cob guys nomesayin!
check out solis and their testing equipment, I like this company so far and I've been with them since the first matrix.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> We were typing at the same time my apologies for the confusion.
> 
> I got the platinum ballast from Growers House and they include an enhanced HPS bulb (Eye Hortilux brand) with it so I will try that first. Thought is first half of flower under the 600 second half under the 1K.............. we will see how it works......
> 
> http://growershouse.com/hortilux-1000w-platinum-electronic-digital-ballast


Damn those are still pricey, I bought used at like half that price. The guy only had one left or I'd have bought as m any as I could. But as @ttystikk will tell you . "wrong lamp". Toss that worthless "super" hps. Although I used nothing but for several years :/


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> Damn those are still pricey, I bought used at like half that price. The guy only had one left or I'd have bought as m any as I could. But as @ttystikk will tell you . "wrong lamp". Toss that worthless "super" hps. Although I used nothing but for several years :/


So which 1000K lamp would you use with the platinum ballast? Stick to the Blue like the 600w?

Just gonna run it up front because they toss it in.


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> Damn those are still pricey, I bought used at like half that price. The guy only had one left or I'd have bought as m any as I could. But as @ttystikk will tell you . "wrong lamp". Toss that worthless "super" hps. Although I used nothing but for several years :/





Evil-Mobo said:


> So which 1000K lamp would you use with the platinum ballast? Stick to the Blue like the 600w?
> 
> Just gonna run it up front because they toss it in.


Straight up, DB! I personally think the best combo going in light bulb land right now is the Philips 860W CDM Allstart lamp run on a 1000W LFSW ballast. Right up there with best in class efficiency, high light output, great spectrum, frosty and yields well.

No match for COB LED tho, not even close.

Sorry, Charlie- only the best tuna gets to be Star Bud, lol


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> So which 1000K lamp would you use with the platinum ballast? Stick to the Blue like the 600w?
> 
> Just gonna run it up front because they toss it in.


It should work well, use it up. But order that 860, if you're in north denver there's a hydro shop that even stocks them.


----------



## horribleherk (Aug 16, 2016)

bob223 said:


> You will increase your yeild and size of your buds when the lec. when are you thinking about switching?
> 
> you wont regret it!
> 
> p.s. it looks like you were getting pretty good results with the 400. you should be be able to kill it with the lec once you get it dialed in


this is my first waterfarm grow my goal is to get a strain that yields somewhat better than the pinkpanties I'm looking at citrus sap ( gg#4-X-tangie) then upgrade to the 315 cmh eventually a led is in order but you gotta crawl before you can walk I had to spend my light money on emergency veterinary bills for my dog but hopefully sometime after harvest I can make this happen I like the idea of a productive single waterfarm grow with a low operation cost I'm almost there I think the 315 will keep operating cost about the same & increase my yield a wee bit if all goes well I hope to have the new light before X- mas I'll probably go 1 more round with the hps


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Straight up, DB! I personally think the best combo going in light bulb land right now is the Philips 860W CDM Allstart lamp run on a 1000W LFSW ballast. Right up there with best in class efficiency, high light output, great spectrum, frosty and yields well.
> 
> No match for COB LED tho, not even close.
> 
> ...


This is all nice and stuff but I'm pretty sure just as pretty/tasty AND potent weed has been grown under different lighting.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> It should work well, use it up. But order that 860, if you're in north denver there's a hydro shop that even stocks them.


I will look into the 860 thanks for the heads up and info much appreciated


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> It should work well, use it up. But order that 860, if you're in north denver there's a hydro shop that even stocks them.


Really? Who and how much?


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 16, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I will look into the 860 thanks for the heads up and info much appreciated


You're in Denver?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Aug 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> You're in Denver?



Nope, wish I was in CO but not anywhere near lol.


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 16, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> this is my first waterfarm grow my goal is to get a strain that yields somewhat better than the pinkpanties I'm looking at citrus sap ( gg#4-X-tangie) then upgrade to the 315 cmh eventually a led is in order but you gotta crawl before you can walk I had to spend my light money on emergency veterinary bills for my dog but hopefully sometime after harvest I can make this happen I like the idea of a productive single waterfarm grow with a low operation cost I'm almost there I think the 315 will keep operating cost about the same & increase my yield a wee bit if all goes well I hope to have the new light before X- mas I'll probably go 1 more round with the hps


Sorry to hear about your dog, hope he's doing better.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Really? Who and how much?


didn't check price. 104th and huron, there's a liquor store, a head shop, a rec shop , a hydro shop and a fucking donut shop in the same little strip mall all in a row


----------



## bob223 (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> didn't check price. 104th and huron, there's a liquor store, a head shop, a rec shop , a hydro shop and a fucking donut shop in the same little strip mall all in a row


Sounds like a hell of a place. What a time to be alive lol


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> this is my first waterfarm grow my goal is to get a strain that yields somewhat better than the pinkpanties I'm looking at citrus sap ( gg#4-X-tangie) then upgrade to the 315 cmh eventually a led is in order but you gotta crawl before you can walk I had to spend my light money on emergency veterinary bills for my dog but hopefully sometime after harvest I can make this happen I like the idea of a productive single waterfarm grow with a low operation cost I'm almost there I think the 315 will keep operating cost about the same & increase my yield a wee bit if all goes well I hope to have the new light before X- mas I'll probably go 1 more round with the hps


I missed this posting, Sorry to hear about your dog but not so much about the led since your 315 will do you right.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> View attachment 3758962


Although I would like to sample that you out in the sticks fucker.


----------



## highdave (Aug 16, 2016)

bwailer said:


> I think I am going to put in a double pole breaker. I purchased one yesterday so i will be putting it in sometime in the next few days.


Cool, pretty straight forward. Un bolt one and and bolt on the other. Just make sure not to touch the top lugs. They will be hot even if you main breaker is off


----------



## bwailer (Aug 16, 2016)

highdave said:


> Cool, pretty straight forward. Un bolt one and and bolt on the other. Just make sure not to touch the top lugs. They will be hot even if you main breaker is off


I think I am just going to put in the 2 pole breaker so that way much less of a chance of anything happening. I will be definitely having all the power to the house shut off then it shut off in the breaker box too. Electrical stuff scares me. I just do not know enough about it.


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> didn't check price. 104th and huron, there's a liquor store, a head shop, a rec shop , a hydro shop and a fucking donut shop in the same little strip mall all in a row


Hot Damn! Now I know where to take you on a date!


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Hot Damn! Now I know where to take you on a date!


The bitching liquor store has no Sauvecito so don't plan on it being a hot date.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Really? Who and how much?


one hundred and twelve dollars per plus tax at that place, boycotted!


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> one hundred and twelve dollars per plus tax at that place, boycotted!


That's twenty more than growershouse.com


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> That's twenty more than growershouse.com


I paid like less than 80 I'm pretty sure, this was online. The first one came with shards inside it and when I told the seller he instantly sent me a new one.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

Time to go mix the batshits up. I don't know why I just don't stick to chems and hydro.


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> I paid like less than 80 I'm pretty sure, this was online. The first one came with shards inside it and when I told the seller he instantly sent me a new one.


Dayum, that's a deal- I'm happy when I get them for a Franklin.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Dayum, that's a deal- I'm happy when I get them for a Franklin.


Yeah I happen to have one too many myself since fucknuts stole my last baddass. I'm gonna give the allstart a ultra high freq sine and see wtf happens.


----------



## highdave (Aug 16, 2016)

bwailer said:


> I think I am just going to put in the 2 pole breaker so that way much less of a chance of anything happening. I will be definitely having all the power to the house shut off then it shut off in the breaker box too. Electrical stuff scares me. I just do not know enough about it.


Yes that's what I meant. When you turn off the main breaker and take off the cover to expose the wires and breakers the 2 lugs above that main breaker will still have potential(power) and even more so then Your panel box because it's taking it straight from the grid with nothing to break the circuit.

One more word of advice try to work with one hand. That way if you do get shocked it goes thru your hand and out your foot. If you using both hand it will go thru one arm, across your heart then out your other arm. That's how people die


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Dayum, that's a deal- I'm happy when I get them for a Franklin.


You must be used to the BT57 outer envelope because the BT37 right off amazon is 74.95.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 16, 2016)

Ships from and sold by Dominant Deelz.
Theses are the guys right here. good people to deal with.


----------



## horribleherk (Aug 16, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Sorry to hear about your dog, hope he's doing better.


my dog is coming around & I really thank everyone for your thoughts & concerns we are getting through this & my attention is gonna be back to growing THANKS!


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 16, 2016)

dbkick said:


> You must be used to the BT57 outer envelope because the BT37 right off amazon is 74.95.


Maybe I didn't look as hard as you, mine are the BT37.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Aug 17, 2016)

@ttystikk
@dbkick what's ur view on induction lights? I kno their not as good as cobs but...


----------



## ttystikk (Aug 17, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> @ttystikk
> @dbkick what's ur view on induction lights? I kno their not as good as cobs but...


Walk away. Induction is more of a pain and less rewarding than their close cousin, T5.

54W HO T5 is a proven and affordable technology that is extremely flexible in terms of spectrum tuning. You can get lamps from 2200K all the way up to 27% UVB!

COB LED is more efficient, but T5 still has the best UVB in the business.


----------



## dbkick (Aug 17, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> @ttystikk
> @dbkick what's ur view on induction lights? I kno their not as good as cobs but...


I consider induction for a moment, then I came to my senses.


----------



## horribleherk (Aug 17, 2016)

I talk a lot of crap to that guy from eco sunlight but that 500w. led (cobs & chips) actually looks pretty good for the money I see it uses Chinese driver & Cree cobs if anything went south I suppose you could order a part from a dig source & fix it easier than trying to send it back to China that being said I'm sure it's better than a vipar or similar Chinese light such as a Mars those Cree components are probably bought in bulk it's good to see led's dropping in price I have a 1000w.dimmable setup that I'll probably end up giving away lol but at this point the 315 is gonna be my next purchase but a led is on the distant horizon meanwhile I'm gonna wring a bit more out of my hps


----------



## Pig4buzz (Aug 18, 2016)

Well dry weight for my unknown auto. Half outside half inside. 29.2 grams. Zip full. 

Buds are kinda ugly, smell is getting better after being in jar one day hash pine Smoke is pretty smooth hash pine taste. High is good, kinda upbeat at first then relaxing. 

Not sure but she was sick for most of flower. Had yellow specks on leaves eventually turning all yellow. Two other outdoor to indoor are doing the same. Both are getting fat each day but sure are ugly.

I put cal-mag thinking that was the problem. Seem to help at first but longer in bud worse it gets

Will post some pics tomorrow of the room and some porn.


----------



## bob223 (Aug 19, 2016)

Nice video from youtube 3x315 lec vs 1000w Hps on a mover.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Aug 19, 2016)

bob223 said:


> Nice video from youtube 3x315 lec vs 1000w Hps on a mover.


Been waiting on that video for quite a long time it feels.


----------



## KushyMcKush (Aug 19, 2016)

I watched the previous video of that a few months ago. Was cool to see how it turned out. Fucking 3D topography?! Amazing... Can't wait to see their upcoming videos he mentioned.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Aug 19, 2016)

; $


----------



## DesertGrow89 (Aug 19, 2016)

bob223 said:


> Nice video from youtube 3x315 lec vs 1000w Hps on a mover.


He said the CBD content was "pretty similar, they're only off by 0.04%, which doesn't make any sense at all. 

It was low under both lamps but the LEC actually destroyed the HPS because the HPS produced 0.06% and the LEC was 0.10% CBD content, the LEC actually produced 40% more CBD!


----------



## Sire Killem All (Aug 19, 2016)

Well I just seen something interesting, two 630 double ended CMH running on a dual 600 nanolux fixture


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## Pig4buzz (Aug 19, 2016)

Ok pics of some of the autos. Most should have two weeks. The pineapple 4 weeks. Crook unknown coming down any day. 

The Amnesia not sure what's ups yellow leaves spots. Any ideals anyone? Light burn on one with specs. They seem to be stacking daily even with this issue. Cal-mag the crap out of them tonight. 

Ready for them to finish and put my photos in lol. 

Pic 1-2 dark purple. Lovely lady 
Pic 3 Alpujenna 
Pic 4 amnesia 
Pic 5 crook unknown 
Pic 6-9 group pics, colas on various ones


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## Pig4buzz (Aug 20, 2016)

Fucking spider mites!!!!! Is what it is damn! Washed the f out of them. Clean room sprayed with 3-1 and seven dust. Sprayed top of soil rubbed 3-1 on stalks, and sprayed root bags good. Will repeat again today. Also sprayed 3-1 in hand a gently rubbed underside of leaves. 

Chopped crook rip.


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## KushyMcKush (Aug 20, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Ok pics of some of the autos. Most should have two weeks. The pineapple 4 weeks. Crook unknown coming down any day.
> 
> The Amnesia not sure what's ups yellow leaves spots. Any ideals anyone? Light burn on one with specs. They seem to be stacking daily even with this issue. Cal-mag the crap out of them tonight.
> 
> ...


That purple in the first 2 pics is fantastic. One of those, the 5th picture in, doesn't even look like cannabis leaves.


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## blowinmaryfast (Aug 20, 2016)

Nice find I wanted to see ccd comparison results. I was going to run the same comparison but wasn't sure if the 1000w on the mover that long would give density... I'm maxing out 2 phantom 315w lec over a 4x7 of og kush. Getting this new space set up made me push veg for a week. So I'm hoping for more even coverage on these monsters like Carolina dreaming says.


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## Pig4buzz (Aug 21, 2016)

After couple of days curing the unknown auto in jar with boveda 62% pack. Unreal the difference in taste and smell. More of a grape/fruit/diesel 

The 315 CMH is great considering I haven't grown in 20+ years. Then the spider mites, thought it was cal-mag difficency. The little specs were bites. Learning a lot but the 315w CMH keeps me looking good even through this infestation 
Trying to just control the mites best I can for next 3 wks.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Aug 22, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Fucking spider mites!!!!! Is what it is damn! Washed the f out of them. Clean room sprayed with 3-1 and seven dust. Sprayed top of soil rubbed 3-1 on stalks, and sprayed root bags good. Will repeat again today. Also sprayed 3-1 in hand a gently rubbed underside of leaves.
> 
> Chopped crook rip.


OK I just applied Monterey Garden Insect Spray for thrips after using azomax x2(did nothing) neem oil(did nothing) but the spinosad seemed to work. I sprayed them and soaked the soil with a garden sprayer. My question is when to spray again? My infestation has one plant bad and the others are pretty good. Dead thrip larvae are visible but they seem to be at bay for day one.

Any advice is appreciated.


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## bwailer (Aug 22, 2016)

Hi, I have a 315w lec light but I am waiting for fy new tent to come in to set it up. I also have two 600 watt lights in two other tents. If I was to switch from a 600w light to the 315 what kind of effect would it have on plants!


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## ttystikk (Aug 22, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> OK I just applied Monterey Garden Insect Spray for thrips after using azomax x2(did nothing) neem oil(did nothing) but the spinosad seemed to work. I sprayed them and soaked the soil with a garden sprayer. My question is when to spray again? My infestation has one plant bad and the others are pretty good. Dead thrip larvae are visible but they seem to be at bay for day one.
> 
> Any advice is appreciated.


Safer insecticidal soap and repetition.


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## Sire Killem All (Aug 22, 2016)

bwailer said:


> Hi, I have a 315w lec light but I am waiting for fy new tent to come in to set it up. I also have two 600 watt lights in two other tents. If I was to switch from a 600w light to the 315 what kind of effect would it have on plants!


They would thank you.


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## ttystikk (Aug 22, 2016)

bwailer said:


> Hi, I have a 315w lec light but I am waiting for fy new tent to come in to set it up. I also have two 600 watt lights in two other tents. If I was to switch from a 600w light to the 315 what kind of effect would it have on plants!





Sire Killem All said:


> They would thank you.


315W CMH lights don't quite replace 600W HPS lamps on a one for one basis, I've found. Three 315W CMH to two 600W HPS is a pretty close ratio, even 4:3 works.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Aug 22, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Safer insecticidal soap and repetition.


I usually have great success with neem oil and it was my first use of asomax, but in this case the thrips literally looked at me in my 10x lens and gave me the finger? It claimed 1 california orange and it is damn close to getting another oner from that end of the tent. 

I would love to hear what is safer insecticidal soaps. I am diligent about inspecting my plants...I just dropped the ball on the thrips since I thought it was nute issues.


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## show-low (Aug 23, 2016)

Don’t know if this question is OK here.

I just bought a 630w LEC sunlight, my concern is about the radiation that this light generates.
I have a grobox secret jardin lodge 4v4 but is in the same room where I normally work all day. Is it dangerous to be working on the same room that the light is even if the growbox is completely closed?
Normally I'm sitting at about 1m away from the growbox.
Thank you.


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## ttystikk (Aug 23, 2016)

show-low said:


> Don’t know if this question is OK here.
> 
> I just bought a 630w LEC sunlight, my concern is about the radiation that this light generates.
> I have a grobox secret jardin lodge 4v4 but is in the same room where I normally work all day. Is it dangerous to be working on the same room that the light is even if the growbox is completely closed?
> ...


No problem at all. If you're working under it for extended periods you should consider sunglasses that block UV.


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## horribleherk (Aug 23, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> 315W CMH lights don't quite replace 600W HPS lamps on a one for one basis, I've found. Three 315W CMH to two 600W HPS is a pretty close ratio, even 4:3 works.


I'm wanting to replace my 400w. hps with the hydro farm/ phantom from what I've seen so far is that the 315 cmh.=500w. of hps & make no mistake it's not quality led my question is can I use this & safely assume it will outperform my 400- hps in both yield & quality will be doing a single plant in a waterfarm I'm really wanting a amare SE- 250 but that's a ways down the road as they're on the pricey side reality you gotta crawl before you can walk my scrog is now 29"x29" which is marginal oversize for the 400 but still working pretty good the 315 I could pull off by X- mas & eventually a led which won't replace the 315 but have its own area I could run both of them for pretty close to the cost of operating a 600w.hps+- just my thoughts also would keep my present setup in case one of my lights should quit for some reason


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## Javadog (Aug 23, 2016)

bwailer said:


> I got it guys and gals. I got it all figured out. Thanks and I have a working Sun System 315W. I am excited to use it. is it perfect in a 3x3 tent?


Team effort! Whew. Good news!


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## bob223 (Aug 23, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> I'm wanting to replace my 400w. hps with the hydro farm/ phantom from what I've seen so far is that the 315 cmh.=500w. of hps & make no mistake it's not quality led my question is can I use this & safely assume it will outperform my 400- hps in both yield & quality will be doing a single plant in a waterfarm I'm really wanting a amare SE- 250 but that's a ways down the road as they're on the pricey side reality you gotta crawl before you can walk my scrog is now 29"x29" which is marginal oversize for the 400 but still working pretty good the 315 I could pull off by X- mas & eventually a led which won't replace the 315 but have its own area I could run both of them for pretty close to the cost of operating a 600w.hps+- just my thoughts also would keep my present setup in case one of my lights should quit for some reason



It will blow a 400 hps out of the water. Size quality and density will improve drastically over then 400hps. i grow bigger buds(SIZE) under the lec then with my 1000w hps (yield was slightly better with the 1000w)
I have been yielding between 12 and 16oz per 315. I was never able to hit that with a 400 and if i did it was not that dense and had alot of under developed pop corn buds.
Now i know there are people that can kill it with a 400w but iam not one of them. Lec is where its at intill cob is affordable.


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## horribleherk (Aug 23, 2016)

bob223 said:


> It will blow a 400 hps out of the water. Size quality and density will improve drastically over then 400hps. i grow bigger buds(SIZE) under the lec then with my 1000w hps (yield was slightly better with the 1000w)
> I have been yielding between 12 and 16oz per 315. I was never able to hit that with a 400 and if i did it was not that dense and had alot of under developed pop corn buds.
> Now i know there are people that can kill it with a 400w but iam not one of them. Lec is where its at intill cob is affordable.


that's what I wanted to hear I'm using a waterfarm & a scrog there are people hitting 1 lb with the combination I'm using but my strain ain't gonna do that but I'm gonna change to either stardawg ( chemdawg) or citrus sap ( gg#4 X tangie) & the 315 lec 12 oz is very acceptable I'm getting close o harvest & my finances are gonna make me do one more run but by X- mas I'm gonna upgrade here is how my present scrog is working & like you I can't get a cob light for awhile & more research


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## horribleherk (Aug 23, 2016)

is anyone else having trouble posting pics


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 23, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> is anyone else having trouble posting pics


Yes everyone is lol.


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## horribleherk (Aug 23, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Yes everyone is lol.


thanks evilmobo I'm always last to catch on to what's going on


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 23, 2016)

It's all good just didn't want you thinking it was just you.


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## Frajola (Aug 23, 2016)

thanks lord I thought I was too stoned duh lol


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## bulimic (Aug 23, 2016)

would one of these sufficiently cover a 3x3 area? i'm considering buying two of them to do a 3x3 sea of green under each (18 sq ft total) with about 49 plants under each no veg from clone.


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 23, 2016)

bulimic said:


> would one of these sufficiently cover a 3x3 area? i'm considering buying two of them to do a 3x3 sea of green under each (18 sq ft total) with about 49 plants under each no veg from clone.


Perfect for a 3x3!


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## horribleherk (Aug 24, 2016)

the 315 seems to be the logical choice for what I aim to do that guy from eco sunlight sure is cheap for their cobs & they look attractive until you weigh a few issues & i did just that the main issue is that no one here has used one a-z on a grow they are using the Chinese drivers on the Cree stuff so who knows how long that will last & if you have a problem how do you get it resolved??? I think the guy uses your own desire to get that good deal as leverage to "set the hook" I just don't picture him as a stand up individual I think I'm gonna stick to my plan &use the 315 as a stepping stone to an amare & not let my own greed cloud my better judgment meanwhile here is the pic I tried to post yesterday of my 29"x29" scrog that I want the 315 for it's gonna take me about a month or so but I'll get there this is a single plant in a waterfarm


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## horribleherk (Aug 24, 2016)

bob223 said:


> It will blow a 400 hps out of the water. Size quality and density will improve drastically over then 400hps. i grow bigger buds(SIZE) under the lec then with my 1000w hps (yield was slightly better with the 1000w)
> I have been yielding between 12 and 16oz per 315. I was never able to hit that with a 400 and if i did it was not that dense and had alot of under developed pop corn buds.
> Now i know there are people that can kill it with a 400w but iam not one of them. Lec is where its at intill cob is affordable.


hey Bob what are you growing in & what light/ballast do you use I've found 3 with the square wave but even though I hear there were some problems with the earlier hydro farm/ phantom ballast they've got it fixed even looked at the ceramic science conversion which has the 50-60 hz frequency but saw no mention of square wave local hydro shop says he will match growehouse's price on the phantom,ballast,reflector,bulb & maybe after thanksgiving deal might get sweeter


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## bob223 (Aug 25, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> hey Bob what are you growing in & what light/ballast do you use I've found 3 with the square wave but even though I hear there were some problems with the earlier hydro farm/ phantom ballast they've got it fixed even looked at the ceramic science conversion which has the 50-60 hz frequency but saw no mention of square wave local hydro shop says he will match growehouse's price on the phantom,ballast,reflector,bulb & maybe after thanksgiving deal might get sweeter



I run sun system lec with the Philips 3100k bulb.
I grow in Ocean forest soil. (i thought about going to DWC but i think my temps are to high 5 months out of the year)
i have about 6 different strains none of them are huge yeilders but all of them are top notch.
I have Headband, Master Kush, northern lights, golden goat, and chem dog. I also have green Crack that i haven't flowered out.
In my neck of the woods genetics are hard to come by so i have pieced together everything i have. I wish it was just as easy as going down to the local club and picking up a new strain.

Pretty sure if i had a high yielding strain i would be consistently over 1 lb per light.

As for the Phantom i looked at one at a local shop and it seemed fine i was thinking about picking a few up because they are quite a bit cheaper then the sun system. Im not sure about the other brands.


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## horribleherk (Aug 25, 2016)

bob223 said:


> I run sun system lec with the Philips 3100k bulb.
> I grow in Ocean forest soil. (i thought about going to DWC but i think my temps are to high 5 months out of the year)
> i have about 6 different strains none of them are huge yeilders but all of them are top notch.
> I have Headband, Master Kush, northern lights, golden goat, and chem dog. I also have green Crack that i haven't flowered out.
> ...


I found a galaxy that had the square wave but 270v. I've made it through some hot stuff as I'm in cen- cal we've had at 1 point several days on end over 105 I have no air but run light at night the waterfarm hasn't missed a lick this my first dwc type grow changed over from e&f coco & so far no regrets chemdawg is on my radar we had a cut of 707- headband that would rock your socks off after growing wwxbb & a few other huge yielders I avoid them because sure you end with a bucket of buds it's just no one wants it I'm wanting to take a medium yielder & use the waterfarm & the 315 lec & get the most I can the pinkpanties I'm growing now is a notorious poor yielder never more than 2 zips in e&f well it ain't over until dried & weighed but I think I'm gonna triple that the 315 is gonna be the icing on the cake my goal a small productive grow of good quality product & 12+ zip harvest is very acceptable if I was to need more I could run 2 of these setups at roughly the cost of running a single 600w.hps & a good bit cheaper than a 1000w.hps I'm almost there


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## horribleherk (Aug 25, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> I found a galaxy that had the square wave but 270v. I've made it through some hot stuff as I'm in cen- cal we've had at 1 point several days on end over 105 I have no air but run light at night the waterfarm hasn't missed a lick this my first dwc type grow changed over from e&f coco & so far no regrets chemdawg is on my radar we had a cut of 707- headband that would rock your socks off after growing wwxbb & a few other huge yielders I avoid them because sure you end with a bucket of buds it's just no one wants it I'm wanting to take a medium yielder & use the waterfarm & the 315 lec & get the most I can the pinkpanties I'm growing now is a notorious poor yielder never more than 2 zips in e&f well it ain't over until dried & weighed but I think I'm gonna triple that the 315 is gonna be the icing on the cake my goal a small productive grow of good quality product & 12+ zip harvest is very acceptable if I was to need more I could run 2 of these setups at roughly the cost of running a single 600w.hps & a good bit cheaper than a 1000w.hps I'm almost there


speaking of heat & dwc/ waterfarm here is th- seeds mkultraXbubblegum outdoors in a waterfarm & I seriously think using my low ppm 35-65 tap water has just enough stuff in it to hold off bacteria but good enough to not prevent plant development this plant has been out in the sun for awhile in July and August which are hot again no issues with the waterfarm using a blend of gh-3 part nutes & soul synthetic nutes also growing tomatoes in home made waterfarms with my waste nutes it was always my biggest fear of dwc but so far so good


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## kingzt (Aug 25, 2016)

How many btus does it take to cool a 315?


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## ttystikk (Aug 25, 2016)

kingzt said:


> How many btus does it take to cool a 315?


Rough guesstimate, about 1000 BTu.


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## Pig4buzz (Aug 25, 2016)

Monday I will chop the autos. The 315 did well for me considering the spider mite issues. Going to redo the room I think. 7/16 plywood paint flat white and floor with flat white tile I bought. Here is a pic of the shorty's and my new kids at 13 days. They are vegging under the 300 Mars (thanks @GroErr ) great little veg light. Pics of some auto colas and the babies


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Aug 27, 2016)

Can anyone give some advice on when to flip to 12/12 with a 315 CHM?
I have a 4x2x7 tent
Hurricane 190cfm with a 4"x16" Mountain air
Temps never above 80(76 average) and RH is 40%-50%
FFOF soil
FF wholly mackerel, grow big, big bloom I will use tiger bloom(I have had nice results with this)
I had a battle with thrips that azomax and neem did nothing but the Monterey Garden with Spinosad has worked with two foliar drenching
7 plants have been manifolded total height 14"-16" so far light is 16 inches from canopy
1 cheese
3 critical widow
2 cali orange
1 easy sativa left over from outdoor

I am wondering about stretch with these lights?
I have only flowered under 1000hps in a bigger space.

I want the plants to veg a little longer since the inter nodal spacing is actually tightening up as they veg.
I am not in a hurry but I am worried that they may stretch too much since it is only a 315 smh?

Can I lower the light? I know the 30 second rule with his but these lights do not throw heat but I am worried about burning the tops if I get any closer?

Thanks for any advice with this new light source.


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## Pig4buzz (Aug 30, 2016)

Battle is over with the cooties ( spider mites). Chopped 5 of 6 auto at 57 days. I put the last of auto outside washed the crap. Hoping for best it's got two weeks. I think I should get 6/zips out with one left I know it will do 1 zip will update 57.8gs so far
Got some
pretty good size nugs. 

Cleaning room good and spraying with ammo. It's pesticide I had when farming kills the shit out of any bug. 24 hours it is harmless to humans. Let air out two days wipe down with alcohol, caulk, line my room with orca I decided. Put flat white tile on floor. Put 4 girls 3 weeks into flower under the 315. 

Here is the five hanging. Bad pic. My little babies 15 days old fat girls. Advice is welcome I know pic sucks what's everyone think? 3 zips 4,5,,6 maybe
Happy growing. 
315 did well for having as many as 13 girls she was nesting at one point.


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## genuity (Aug 30, 2016)

It just seems like the perfect fit....


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## Colo MMJ (Sep 1, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> hey Bob what are you growing in & what light/ballast do you use I've found 3 with the square wave but even though I hear there were some problems with the earlier hydro farm/ phantom ballast they've got it fixed even looked at the ceramic science conversion which has the 50-60 hz frequency but saw no mention of square wave local hydro shop says he will match growehouse's price on the phantom,ballast,reflector,bulb & maybe after thanksgiving deal might get sweeter


I was thinking of the ceramic science conversion with Phillips LEC bulb using a parabolic/parasol reflector where the bulb points down. I can get that all for about $290 from Growers House.


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## horribleherk (Sep 1, 2016)

Colo MMJ said:


> I was thinking of the ceramic science conversion with Phillips LEC bulb using a parabolic/parasol reflector where the bulb points down. I can get that all for about $290 from Growers House.


plantlightinghydroponics has the phantom/ hydro farm square wave low frequency ballast,bulb & reflector for $326.00 & my local hydro store says he will match the price I'm sure someone around here is running the ceramic science conversion I would convert & use my current reflector & save some but I'm thinking of running 2 setups one with headband the other with stardawg picked up babies today


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## Colo MMJ (Sep 2, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> plantlightinghydroponics has the phantom/ hydro farm square wave low frequency ballast,bulb & reflector for $326.00 & my local hydro store says he will match the price I'm sure someone around here is running the ceramic science conversion I would convert & use my current reflector & save some but I'm thinking of running 2 setups one with headband the other with stardawg picked up babies todayView attachment 3771159


$329.99 at that web site but that is a good price. I have hydropharm reflectors and the bulb is horizontal . The phantom deal is good but the parabolic is about 45" wide for more coverage.


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## Pig4buzz (Sep 2, 2016)

Ok the test run is over with the 315. Chopped all the autos 8 of 9 but the pineapple. 206 grams so far looks like the PA will get a zip easy. Estimate 235g total This with fighting damn mfing spider mites. And vegging 4 photos for 5 weeks lol 13 total plants. In a 3x4 space. .75g per watt.
First grow in over 20yrs.

Big thanks to @GroErr for all his help. Next adventure starts tomorrow with photos. I think long as I keep the bugs out. 1g to 1-1.25 per watt can be done blind folded.

Will have my room completely redesigned hopefully tomorrow. 

Here's some pics of some of my auto nugs. The black/purple is dark purple 3 are unknown 1 is Alpujenna


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## GroErr (Sep 2, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Ok the test run is over with the 315. Chopped all the autos 8 of 9 but the pineapple. 206 grams so far looks like the PA will get a zip easy. Estimate 235g total This with fighting damn mfing spider mites. And vegging 4 photos for 5 weeks lol 13 total plants. In a 3x4 space. .75g per watt.
> First grow in over 20yrs.
> 
> Big thanks to @GroErr for all his help. Next adventure starts tomorrow with photos. I think long as I keep the bugs out. 1g to 1-1.25 per watt can be done blind folded.
> ...


Nice haul there pig4buzz, looks like you have a good stash to keep you going for a bit


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## horribleherk (Sep 2, 2016)

Colo MMJ said:


> $329.99 at that web site but that is a good price. I have hydropharm reflectors and the bulb is horizontal . The phantom deal is good but the parabolic is about 45" wide for more coverage.


my scrog is only 29x29 those parabolic hoods work pretty good with hps sounds like a good choice plantlightinghydroponics don't have such a good rep these days growerhouse would be a better choice to o business with


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## Pig4buzz (Sep 2, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Nice haul there pig4buzz, looks like you have a good stash to keep you going for a bit


Thanks groerr. Yeah with the early harvest due to bugs. I think did ok. Couple are pretty dank for auto. Need to cure got some a little dry some not dry enough. Boveda pack them couple weeks makes be difference.


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## ttystikk (Sep 2, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> my scrog is only 29x29 those parabolic hoods work pretty good with hps sounds like a good choice plantlightinghydroponics don't have such a good rep these days growerhouse would be a better choice to o business with


I second this; growershouse.com staff have been knowledgeable about their products, been in stock with the stuff I want and been on the ball when it comes to shipping problems or returns. 

I'm not sure how you can do much better than that.


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## bob223 (Sep 2, 2016)

genuity said:


> View attachment 3769574
> It just seems like the perfect fit....


That thing looks bad-ass. i have been considering picking one of those double ended chm set ups. You will need to get us some pics of your results!


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## horribleherk (Sep 2, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I second this; growershouse.com staff have been knowledgeable about their products, been in stock with the stuff I want and been on the ball when it comes to shipping problems or returns.
> 
> I'm not sure how you can do much better than that.


 I just couldn't tell if it was square wave or not as it looks pretty cool now Galaxy has a sq.wave low frequency ballast as well


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## Colo MMJ (Sep 2, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Ok the test run is over with the 315. Chopped all the autos 8 of 9 but the pineapple. 206 grams so far looks like the PA will get a zip easy. Estimate 235g total This with fighting damn mfing spider mites. And vegging 4 photos for 5 weeks lol 13 total plants. In a 3x4 space. .75g per watt.
> First grow in over 20yrs.
> 
> Big thanks to @GroErr for all his help. Next adventure starts tomorrow with photos. I think long as I keep the bugs out. 1g to 1-1.25 per watt can be done blind folded.
> ...


What did you use against the spider mites?


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## Pig4buzz (Sep 2, 2016)

Flush flush and flushed more. Washed with water. Sprayed Neem in hand rubbed on underside of leaves never got rid of them. Just semi-controlled extending time for girls to fatten up a bit.

I did have one I still have. I sprayed sns217 on it don't see anything. Think this may of got them. Will watch close.
Bombed the room three times, bleached, clean lights fans etc. since.


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## GroErr (Sep 3, 2016)

Fresh round at Day 5, 4x 5gal which will end up around 3.5'x5'. Changing it up a bit this round, have an LEC in the center and 1x 100w of 3590 Tasty LED bars on each side. Slightly angled the LED's to mix the CMH + COB spectrum and see what develops 



Cheers


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## Colo MMJ (Sep 3, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Fresh round at Day 5, 4x 5gal which will end up around 3.5'x5'. Changing it up a bit this round, have an LEC in the center and 1x 100w of 3590 Tasty LED bars on each side. Slightly angled the LED's to mix the CMH + COB spectrum and see what develops
> 
> View attachment 3772096
> 
> Cheers


Nice Which LEC? The plants look super healthy. What is that little trellis/vertical scrog thing? Did you buy it or make it? What is the purpose? It looks effective.


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## GroErr (Sep 3, 2016)

Colo MMJ said:


> Nice Which LEC? The plants look super healthy. What is that little trellis/vertical scrog thing? Did you buy it or make it? What is the purpose? It looks effective.


Hey thanks, I have the Sun Systems LEC's, running just one right now and mixing in the COBs this round.

Those are bamboo trellises and I use them for exactly that purpose, kind of like a vertical scrog. I buy them from the dollar store, pic below. They work great with larger plants for support later in flowering and training them in veg. The two "feet" slide down the edge of the fabric pots and rest on the bottom so once they go in they can be used to guide the colas through, tie them back etc. Cheers.


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## ttystikk (Sep 3, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Hey thanks, I have the Sun Systems LEC's, running just one right now and mixing in the COBs this round.
> 
> Those are bamboo trellises and I use them for exactly that purpose, kind of like a vertical scrog. I buy them from the dollar store, pic below. They work great with larger plants for support later in flowering and training them in veg. The two "feet" slide down the edge of the fabric pots and rest on the bottom so once they go in they can be used to guide the colas through, tie them back etc. Cheers.
> 
> View attachment 3772183


I'm liking the trend to vertical grows. I've been preaching it for awhile now, lol


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## GroErr (Sep 3, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I'm liking the trend to vertical grows. I've been preaching it for awhile now, lol


They work well to get a more even canopy too, been using them on 5/7 gal and my outdoor for a couple of years. They're a requirement outdoor imo. I use them to do a pseudo mainlining outdoor, spread them right out and they fill the centers with new off-shoots


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## horribleherk (Sep 5, 2016)

has anyone tried the htg supply agro- max 315 cmh setup they claim square wave on it my first light kit came from them kinda cheap & people bad mouthed it but 6 years later a friend is still using it the price for the whole cmh setup ballast ,reflector,bulb ( agromax house brand) is $267.00 I would think the bulb would be questionable


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## Evil-Mobo (Sep 5, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> has anyone tried the htg supply agro- max 315 cmh setup they claim square wave on it my first light kit came from them kinda cheap & people bad mouthed it but 6 years later a friend is still using it the price for the whole cmh setup ballast ,reflector,bulb ( agromax house brand) is $267.00


I can't vouch for that light in particular but I have been very pleased with three of their tents and their CS the one time I needed it. I say if you have any questions on something in particular reach out to them directly. Good luck.


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## horribleherk (Sep 5, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I can't vouch for that light in particular but I have been very pleased with three of their tents and their CS the one time I needed it. I say if you have any questions on something in particular reach out to them directly. Good luck.


I'm always looking at off the wall stuff after looking at all angles it comes with their own mogul based bulb after figuring the cost of the screw in adaptor & a real name brand bulb it's in the same cost as the hydro farm that comes with all the right stuff I'm gonna have to wait until after harvest so " bud " can help me out


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## Evil-Mobo (Sep 5, 2016)

horribleherk said:


> I'm always looking at off the wall stuff after looking at all angles it comes with their own mogul based bulb after figuring the cost of the screw in adaptor & a real name brand bulb it's in the same cost as the hydro farm that comes with all the right stuff I'm gonna have to wait until after harvest so " bud " can help me out



I would recommend you wait if that's an option then. It's always nice when your buds can chip in and help with the bill.


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## horribleherk (Sep 5, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I would recommend you wait if that's an option then. It's always nice when your buds can chip in and help with the bill.


that's what I say I've ent through a bit of cash lately but in about 3 weeks I'll re- coop lol!


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## Flowki (Sep 7, 2016)

One guy stated that he thought the 3k was better for vegging than the 4k. Anybody have some experience using the 3k for veg?.


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## ttystikk (Sep 7, 2016)

Flowki said:


> One guy stated that he thought the 3k was better for vegging than the 4k. Anybody have some experience using the 3k for veg?.


Maybe that guy wanted a bit more stretch in veg. That would be the reason I used HPS in veg- until I got COB LED and my plants grew so much better that encouraging stretch was unnecessary.


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## Flowki (Sep 8, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Maybe that guy wanted a bit more stretch in veg. That would be the reason I used HPS in veg- until I got COB LED and my plants grew so much better that encouraging stretch was unnecessary.


He seemed to think they responded better to the 3k, perhaps he confused stretch with natural good growth?. Cob as good as it may be, I'm sure for a lot of folk is off putting because of it's price but mainly it's DIY/safety aspect. Great if you know what you are doing.


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## ThaMagnificent (Sep 10, 2016)

Any good deals on a light?


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## Midnite Gardener (Sep 11, 2016)

Flowki said:


> One guy stated that he thought the 3k was better for vegging than the 4k. Anybody have some experience using the 3k for veg?.


I bought the 4k bulb to try out for veg and it didn't seem any better. Could be just me, but the plants seemed stronger under the 3100k and it seemed brighter. I don't see any added benefit in buying the extra bulbs and swapping them out. 3k makes perfectly hardy, bushy plants with tough stems. Best veg light I've ever used.


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## Flowki (Sep 11, 2016)

Midnite Gardener said:


> I bought the 4k bulb to try out for veg and it didn't seem any better. Could be just me, but the plants seemed stronger under the 3100k and it seemed brighter. I don't see any added benefit in buying the extra bulbs and swapping them out. 3k makes perfectly hardy, bushy plants with tough stems. Best veg light I've ever used.


Ok cheers. Suppose going from 3k veg to 3k flower would also reduce stretch a little?.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Sep 11, 2016)

Flowki said:


> Ok cheers. Suppose going from 3k veg to 3k flower would also reduce stretch a little?.


I have 6 plants 1 week into flower. I used bud blood and the stretch has been maybe 3 inches so far. This is my first time using 315lec. I feel the 3100k bulb was amazing in veg. I will find out about flower.
3 critical widow mainlined from Canuck seeds. Almost no stretch
1 cheese main lined from Canuck seeds some stretch
2 California orange Canuck seeds 3-4 inches of stretch.

FFOF soil ph 6.0 i use distilled H2O
FF grow big/big bloom for veg
I will use FF big bloom and tiger bloom will be used

temps 75 -78 degrees i 190 com fan attached to a 4x16 mountain air as exhaust and a 190 cfm fan for air flow intake


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## Flowki (Sep 11, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I have 6 plants 1 week into flower. I used bud blood and the stretch has been maybe 3 inches so far. This is my first time using 315lec. I feel the 3100k bulb was amazing in veg. I will find out about flower.
> 3 critical widow mainlined from Canuck seeds. Almost no stretch
> 1 cheese main lined from Canuck seeds some stretch
> 2 California orange Canuck seeds 3-4 inches of stretch.
> ...


ok thnx


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## Midnite Gardener (Sep 11, 2016)

You don't want to over do it when using Bud blood and other flower boosters. I run a similar product called MOAB. I use about half of the recommended dose, and I also lower my base nutrients from 10ml/gallon to 8ml/gallon for a few days while I'm using MOAB. I give it to them for 3 days around week 2 and that's it. I've run the same strain with and without, and it definitely kicks them into flower faster and reduces stretching. That said, I don't think it makes a huge difference in the final results. You could also flower earlier if you're worried about vertical space.


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## THE KONASSURE (Sep 11, 2016)

[


Flowki said:


> Ok cheers. Suppose going from 3k veg to 3k flower would also reduce stretch a little?.


main issue people have with strains like Trainwreck for example is

if you veg @4000k or 5000k or bluer then flower @ 3000k or redder

well

think stems huge buds, lots of support needed

add some more red to the veg and you get a less bushy plant but with thicker stems, seaweed and such can make the plants bushy

So unless you need the extra blues for mold issues or the redder lamp makes your veg too hot

it`s a 2m x 1.2m veg area 2m H, normally got 6 to 10 teens in there a mum or 3 and clones and seeds shooting off. 

I did find using 600/1000w hps`s for veg had their uses

Swapped over to a 600mh @ 400w when my last hps lamp blew, then set up a 300w induction, best veg light I`ve used so far 300w 5000k induction with a "300w" (150w draw) blue heavy led panel

the led was in there the whole time so got used with the hps and such

but 5000k cobs veg up a nice plant just can`t be asked to make 5 to 8 units to run the veg and the induction lamp was £30 and I`ve let to see anything veg better than tube lights

The large leaves you get from tube lights, is it the extra uv or xrays they give off or what ?

cmh 5000k veggies nice too but same issues as hps/mh bare bulb gets hot fire risk, cooled hood can be a hassle......


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Sep 11, 2016)

Midnite Gardener said:


> You don't want to over do it when using Bud blood and other flower boosters. I run a similar product called MOAB. I use about half of the recommended dose, and I also lower my base nutrients from 10ml/gallon to 8ml/gallon for a few days while I'm using MOAB. I give it to them for 3 days around week 2 and that's it. I've run the same strain with and without, and it definitely kicks them into flower faster and reduces stretching. That said, I don't think it makes a huge difference in the final results. You could also flower earlier if you're worried about vertical space.


I used 7 ml per gallon of bud blood and only gave the plants 2 cups BB and 3 cups distilled water.
You can see the new growth has amazing green color.
I never use any notes at full strength 
just my .02
I am debating using it for week two...any one have any thoughts?


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## kingzt (Sep 12, 2016)

Does anybody happen to know the length of the cord of the sun system 315 lec commercial fixture? I can't seem to find it anywhere. I'm assuming it's 6 ft but just need to know for certain.


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## Evil-Mobo (Sep 12, 2016)

kingzt said:


> Does anybody happen to know the length of the cord of the sun system 315 lec commercial fixture? I can't seem to find it anywhere. I'm assuming it's 6 ft but just need to know for certain.


I would suggest sending an email to growers house and asking they are good about responding.


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## kingzt (Sep 12, 2016)

I emailed them and the 240v is 8 ft and 277v is 6 ft.


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## Midnite Gardener (Sep 12, 2016)

I have the 120v version and my cord is 6ft.


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## Pig4buzz (Sep 12, 2016)

well no doubt the plants weathered the storm of being burnt. 2xshaman 2xwhite widow 2xincredible bulk. 

About ft tall and that big around now

Going to veg a week more and see what they look like may flip. I am concerned about stretch and them being so bushy. (3x4 space) Specs say 2/3 times stretch on each. Shaman are regs so could be 2M 2F or one of each. Others are F Anyone 

Like the new look grow room. The 2 pans are Water is due to low humidity. @GroErr saves me again thanks.


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## Pig4buzz (Sep 12, 2016)

kingzt said:


> Does anybody happen to know the length of the cord of the sun system 315 lec commercial fixture? I can't seem to find it anywhere. I'm assuming it's 6 ft but just need to know for certain.


Yeah 6 ft.


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## DesertGrow89 (Sep 12, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Yeah 6 ft.


Nice, you should tie that stretchy stalk down at a 90 to even the canopy out a bit


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## DesertGrow89 (Sep 12, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Fucking spider mites!!!!! Is what it is damn! Washed the f out of them. Clean room sprayed with 3-1 and seven dust. Sprayed top of soil rubbed 3-1 on stalks, and sprayed root bags good. Will repeat again today. Also sprayed 3-1 in hand a gently rubbed underside of leaves.
> 
> Chopped crook rip.


Spray yourself off with andisopropyl alcohol and water solution every time before you enter the room/house it should help with bugs.


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## jzs147 (Sep 16, 2016)

I got 630 watt lec going off to a rough start.

Water pump fucked up lost 1 plant and I've got a runt so stuck 2 incredible bulk clones top left. an lower right i stuck an IB next to my pineapple express runt.

Dunno wats gonna happen. Might just chuck em in to flower so I can start again.


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## bob223 (Sep 16, 2016)

jzs147 said:


> View attachment 3782595 I got 630 watt lec going off to a rough start.
> 
> Water pump fucked up lost 1 plant and I've got a runt so stuck 2 incredible bulk clones top left. an lower right i stuck an IB next to my pineapple express runt.
> 
> Dunno wats gonna happen. Might just chuck em in to flower so I can start again.


i would veg it out for a week or two. That tent will fill nicely and the 630 will grow great buds.

A little patience will pay off in the end. Keep us updated everything looks good from here


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## jzs147 (Sep 16, 2016)

Cheers mate im an Australian.

I'm just running to separate 2x 315 lecs

Gree power ballasts and 1 large ajusta wing.

Running the 3100k lamps.

See how this grow goes might separate the 2 an try 2 tents.


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## Bad Karma (Sep 16, 2016)

bob223 said:


> i would veg it out for a week or two. That tent will fill nicely and the 630 will grow great buds.
> 
> A little patience will pay off in the end.


Agreed.


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## Pig4buzz (Sep 16, 2016)

we'll 4 days later the photos are growing like crazy. Was thinking would have to wait another week, but don't think will have enough room if wait due to specs of 2/3x stretch bushes baby.

First pic is today 2nd Monday

Flip or let veg? 4 fems 2 are reg. So could be 6 fems. Thinking 5.
Space 3x4x6.5'


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## Evil-Mobo (Sep 17, 2016)

I would veg them longer  but I like big plants


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## Pig4buzz (Sep 17, 2016)

Yeah have decided to veg longer week max. Think may do some super cropping too


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## Evil-Mobo (Sep 17, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Yeah have decided to veg longer week max. Think may do some super cropping too


If you are going to train further then I would veg longer just me though......


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## Pig4buzz (Sep 17, 2016)

No training yet


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## Evil-Mobo (Sep 17, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> No training yet


You made a comment about super cropping so I was just saying I would go longer than a week from right now if that's the case. The one week timeline would be as is with no super cropping etc. No need to rush plants that aren't auto's you can always veg longer and it makes a difference in the end.


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## NebyKingKron (Sep 17, 2016)

Hey everyone neby here. I bought a 315 lec about 8 months ago. I love it i have it in a 4×4 room do three girls ubder it and am averaging about 330 g. Per harvest. I love tyem im paying on average of 20 a month on electricity. Through the summer months ive hadvto add a heaterim gettin theee more asap


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## Pig4buzz (Sep 18, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> we'll 4 days later the photos are growing like crazy. Was thinking would have to wait another week, but don't think will have enough room if wait due to specs of 2/3x stretch bushes baby.
> 
> First pic is today 2nd Monday
> 
> ...


Two days has past since last post of my first run with photos under the 315 Sun The test run with autos has no comparison with these babies. 

Going to flip tonight or tomorrow.


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## NebyKingKron (Sep 18, 2016)

NebyKingKron said:


> Hey everyone neby here. I bought a 315 lec about 8 months ago. I love it i have it in a 4×4 room do three girls ubder it and am averaging about 330 g. Per harvest. I love tyem im paying on average of 20 a month on electricity. Through the summer months ive hadvto add a heaterim gettin theee more asap


    a few shots of ayent orange crushin it under the 315 lec! Will never go back


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## bob223 (Sep 19, 2016)

So i know this is a little off topic but im heading to colorado for a few days and was wondering if anyone can point me in the direction of good Rec concentrate for a good price. i will be in the Denver area and wont have alot of time to explore. Also are cuttings readily available.


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## Pig4buzz (Sep 19, 2016)

Fucking sider mites again. I'm through.


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## ttystikk (Sep 19, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Fucking sider mites again. I'm through.


Rotate Azamax and Safer insecticidal soap, spray twice a week. Keep at it.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Sep 21, 2016)

Help with RH in flower?
I am two weeks into flower and my RH at night is at 70% temps upper 60's low 70's lights off
room is a/c temps never above 80 degrees
I am in a 4x2x6 tent
1 315 cmh external ballast
1 intake hurricane 190cfm on a variac
1 exhaust hurricane 190 cfm attached to a mountain air 4x16 on a variac both on 24/7
6 plants in 5 gallon soil 4 little plants in 1 liter pots
Any need for concern?


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## NebyKingKron (Sep 21, 2016)

What do you mean RH.....as in room humidity?


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## Evil-Mobo (Sep 21, 2016)

RH= Relative Humidity


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## Bad Karma (Sep 21, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Help with RH in flower?
> I am two weeks into flower and my RH at night is at 70% temps upper 60's low 70's lights off
> room is a/c temps never above 80 degrees
> I am in a 4x2x6 tent
> ...


You definitely need to lower your humidity or your buds are going to start going moldy quick. 30%-40% humidity is the sweet spot that you want to shoot for.
Looking at what you've listed, I think the problem is that you lack negative pressure in your tent. Your intake and outtake fans are equal in CFM, which is not good. Your exhaust fan needs to be more powerful in order to clear out all of that excess humidity.


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## AAjax (Sep 21, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Fucking sider mites again. I'm through.


https://greenmethods.com/product/chrysoperla-rufilabris-3/

Put these in my flower tent 2 weeks ago with devastating effect. Low maintenance and fun to think about them chomping away at the little fuckers while Im at work. They are nearing the end of their cycle but I only have one week of flower left to go, have only seen one live mite since release. Not cheap (shipping kills it) but worked like a charm with no spraying late in flower. The advantage of releasing larvae over eggs is that they get right to work the day you place them.


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## Sire Killem All (Sep 22, 2016)

had to install an exhaust, room maxed out at 159`


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Sep 22, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> You definitely need to lower your humidity or your buds are going to start going moldy quick. 30%-40% humidity is the sweet spot that you want to shoot for.
> Looking at what you've listed, I think the problem is that you lack negative pressure in your tent. Your intake and outtake fans are equal in CFM, which is not good. Your exhaust fan needs to be more powerful in order to clear out all of that excess humidity.


I turned my intake down and exhaust up and RH is down to 53%
The temps outside are still in the mid to upper 80's but I thank you for the input.
This is my first small tent grow.
I am used to a larger area with 3 1000w hps in the flower so I have not had deal with a "smaller" environment.
Appreciate the input.


----------



## Bad Karma (Sep 23, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I turned my intake down and exhaust up and RH is down to 53%
> The temps outside are still in the mid to upper 80's but I thank you for the input.
> This is my first small tent grow.
> I am used to a larger area with 3 1000w hps in the flower so I have not had deal with a "smaller" environment.
> Appreciate the input.


I'm glad the advice helped and I hope you can get that humidity issue completely under control soon. Good luck.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Sep 23, 2016)

Last yield with 6 315s was 7.5 lbs of usable bud. 1.5 of larf. I know if they were my 600s the yields would have been slightly higher. But watt for watt these things rock. I'm happy with them.


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## ttystikk (Sep 23, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Last yield with 6 315s was 7.5 lbs of usable bud. 1.5 of larf. I know if they were my 600s the yields would have been slightly higher. But watt for watt these things rock. I'm happy with them.
> View attachment 3787673


The quality improvement is nice, isn't it?


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## Carolina Dream'n (Sep 23, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> The quality improvement is nice, isn't it?


Looks about the same. Seems to be slightly more potent. More of a indica buzz from this strain than I've ever had.


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## Pig4buzz (Sep 23, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Last yield with 6 315s was 7.5 lbs of usable bud. 1.5 of larf. I know if they were my 600s the yields would have been slightly higher. But watt for watt these things rock. I'm happy with them.
> View attachment 3787673


You use c02 with your grow. How much increase in yield would you say with as without. Thanks


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## Carolina Dream'n (Sep 23, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> You use c02 with your grow. How much increase in yield would you say with as without. Thanks


I've never ran without co2. I have no idea. Sorry.


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## ttystikk (Sep 23, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Looks about the same. Seems to be slightly more potent. More of a indica buzz from this strain than I've ever had.


I saw a bump in quality when I went from HPS to CDM. 

I saw a bigger one when I went to COB LED.


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## Javadog (Sep 23, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> I'm glad the advice helped and I hope you can get that humidity issue completely under control soon. Good luck.


+1 :0) I always had a neg press in order to make all of my stink 
go through the filter, and did not know about the humidity potential.
(also live in dry coastal desert) Thanks!


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## Mazey Farms (Sep 23, 2016)

Anyone else having trouble with the PHANTOM digital ballast for the 315W and their analog timers? I'm on my second ballast and can't figure out why my lights won't turn on using the Hydro farm analog timer and the Hydro farm phantom 315 W ballast? Thanks!


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Sep 24, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> I'm glad the advice helped and I hope you can get that humidity issue completely under control soon. Good luck.


I have been able to open the windows and turn off the A/C
Temps are below 80 and RH is at 40%
I hope the cooler weather is on the horizon.
These are recent pics today is day 19 of 12/12
I think the stretch is over. two days now and no vertical growth on the cheese(front left)
and the cali-o which is in the back left and back right.
so I am still using the FF grow big, big bloom and tiger bloom.
I used bud blood in week one of flower.
My question is my light is 15" inches from the taller plants and I will raise the three critical widows.
They seem to be fine at that distance and the penetration seems to be great.
Any input on the 315cmh canopy penetration?
Thanks


----------



## GreenLeafKief (Sep 24, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I saw a bump in quality when I went from HPS to CDM.
> 
> I saw a bigger one when I went to COB LED.


So, immediately getting into COBs and spending the initial loot is recommended over waiting a year for prices to drop, lets say? VS 315W LEC.


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## ttystikk (Sep 24, 2016)

GreenLeafKief said:


> So, immediately getting into COBs and spending the initial loot is recommended over waiting a year for prices to drop, lets say? VS 315W LEC.


All I can tell you is that the improvement in efficiency, performance, spectrum and yield have all combined to make COB LED the hands down best thing I've ever grown plants under, to include sunlight itself.

I'm not telling you what to buy, only what I've experienced myself.


----------



## Warpedpassage (Sep 25, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Last yield with 6 315s was 7.5 lbs of usable bud. 1.5 of larf. I know if they were my 600s the yields would have been slightly higher. But watt for watt these things rock. I'm happy with them.
> View attachment 3787694


Thats a great harvest. I would love to know how many sq feet those 6 315s covered?


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## GroErr (Sep 25, 2016)

Current run at Day 27, 4x 5gal in a 4' x 4.5' x 4'H, 1x 315 in the center and 1x 100w 3590 COB bar angled on each end, 515w total.



Cheers


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## Carolina Dream'n (Sep 25, 2016)

Warpedpassage said:


> Thats a great harvest. I would love to know how many sq feet those 6 315s covered?


9


----------



## Sire Killem All (Sep 25, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> 9


A 3×3?


----------



## Javadog (Sep 25, 2016)

2X2 4X5gal


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## augusto1 (Sep 25, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> I've never ran without co2. I have no idea. Sorry.


How many ppm of co2 do you room on veg and flower? thanks in advance.


----------



## Gonefishn7420 (Sep 25, 2016)

Mazey Farms said:


> Anyone else having trouble with the PHANTOM digital ballast for the 315W and their analog timers? I'm on my second ballast and can't figure out why my lights won't turn on using the Hydro farm analog timer and the Hydro farm phantom 315 W ballast? Thanks!


I have seen many timers that say not for use with digital ballast. I am flipping my 315s over tonight so I'll see how mine does, I am using a blue print controllers digital timer an i made sure it didn't say not for digital ballast.


----------



## doniawon (Sep 25, 2016)

Mazey Farms said:


> Anyone else having trouble with the PHANTOM digital ballast for the 315W and their analog timers? I'm on my second ballast and can't figure out why my lights won't turn on using the Hydro farm analog timer and the Hydro farm phantom 315 W ballast? Thanks!


Fuckin sweet another bad 315 phantom review as I sit and wait for mine to b delivered!


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## doniawon (Sep 25, 2016)

Within a week or two ill b adding 5-6 315 lamps to my space 
Currently running 6 se 1000 w hps 2000k bulbs.
And two sun system 315 are already running.
315s will run between the 1 kws.


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## doniawon (Sep 25, 2016)

Replacing t5 8 bulbs n veg room too. I hate them things


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Sep 25, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> A 3×3?


Yes. 


augusto1 said:


> How many ppm of co2 do you room on veg and flower? thanks in advance.


Start at 800, goes to 1300 then back down to 800. Should like like an arch if graphed.


----------



## Gonefishn7420 (Sep 25, 2016)

doniawon said:


> Fuckin sweet another bad 315 phantom review as I sit and wait for mine to b delivered!


I also picked up a phantom because of price everything with bulb for lile 380. I have had zero problems with it. I picked up a galaxy for my second and basically "built my own" and after shopoibg around I was abke to get everything for about 50 bucks cheaper than the phantom package


----------



## pergamum362 (Sep 25, 2016)

Hey folks, im looking into swapping my veg lights out for the 315s. Im running 600 watt mh's and a couple 8 and 6 bulb t5s for clones and smaller plants.

What is the heat output compared to the 600s and t5s, say with 8 of these things running?


----------



## pergamum362 (Sep 25, 2016)

Have they started making remote ballasts and sockets for them? Id like to hang a few vertical as supplemental lighting in flower...i wanted to do that about 2 years ago, but at my shops they were only avaliable as a single unit.


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## doniawon (Sep 25, 2016)

There's s conversion kit w remote ballast n adapter


----------



## Warpedpassage (Sep 25, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> 9


That really is amazing. So you managed over 1.5g per watt with only 35 watts per sq ft. You have skills, thanks for sharing.


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 25, 2016)

You're going to need a lot of lamps to cover much area, because of their wattage. That said, I do like mine... but I don't bloom under them. Only veg.


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## Gonefishn7420 (Sep 25, 2016)

doniawon said:


> Replacing t5 8 bulbs n veg room too. I hate them things


I also planned on doing the same but after about a week I switched back to my t5s for veg. I felt like i was getting healthier lush growth with the t5s


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## doniawon (Sep 25, 2016)

Gonefishn7420 said:


> I also planned on doing the same but after about a week I switched back to my t5s for veg. I felt like i was getting healthier lush growth with the t5s


Thats not fun
Hmmm


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## ttystikk (Sep 25, 2016)

My 315W CMH lights kick ass in veg.


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## Gonefishn7420 (Sep 25, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> My 315W CMH lights kick ass in veg.


It was working fine but for me, but personally I prefer the results I was getri f under my 8 bulb of t5. It's almost double the juice but I still stuck with the t5s


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 25, 2016)

Gonefishn7420 said:


> It was working fine but for me, but personally I prefer the results I was getri f under my 8 bulb of t5. It's almost double the juice but I still stuck with the t5s


Apples to apples, then; add another 315W CMH kit and see what happens. Don't just blame the bulb lol


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## Mazey Farms (Sep 25, 2016)

doniawon said:


> Fuckin sweet another bad 315 phantom review as I sit and wait for mine to b delivered!


I spoke to the guys at the hydro store...they had nothing but good things to say about the Phantom. I got it to work tonight by unplugging the inline fan and clip fan...wondering if the load is tripping the ballast now. Tomorrow I'll have my fans come on 15 minutes before the light to see if that works.


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## Gonefishn7420 (Sep 25, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Apples to apples, then; add another 315W CMH kit and see what happens. Don't just blame the bulb lol


I have two 315 for flower an when this run finishes I'm gonna put one of the 4100k bulbs in an see if I like that any better


----------



## doniawon (Sep 25, 2016)

Running two 315s in the corner for a side by side, sun systems vs dna irradiator hood.

But the rest should look like this when done the mix is perfect..


----------



## doniawon (Sep 26, 2016)

How far from the canopy should my 315 be?
Also anyone think I should spread the hoods out more?


----------



## Gonefishn7420 (Sep 26, 2016)

doniawon said:


> How far from the canopy should my 315 be?
> Also anyone think I should spread the hoods out more?


Running very similar set up. Got a complete phantom and a galaxy ballast run to an irradiator(local shop has them for $60 couldnt pass it up) I am in roughly a 5x5 and have my hoods roughly 1 foot apart and about 18 inches above canopy.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Sep 26, 2016)

I'm not down wit phantom 315w ballast. Keep it to the original. Phillips ballast and bulb only. They designed it, I feel like their technology is much better.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Sep 26, 2016)

.


----------



## doniawon (Sep 26, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> I'm not down wit phantom 315w ballast. Keep it to the original. Phillips ballast and bulb only. They designed it, I feel like their technology is much better.


As far as that goes, I'm down with solis tek.
Phillips invented it, they mastered it.


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 26, 2016)

doniawon said:


> As far as that goes, I'm down with solis tek.
> Phillips invented it, they mastered it.


All my 315W CMH kits came with Philips lamps and ballasts. They've been performing flawlessly for me. If anyone needs a recommendation, that's mine.

If you want better lighting, then it's time for LED.


----------



## doniawon (Sep 26, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> All my 315W CMH kits came with Philips lamps and ballasts. They've been performing flawlessly for me. If anyone needs a recommendation, that's mine.
> 
> If you want better lighting, then it's time for LED.


Its going down, I'll b yelling timber.....

Sorry for that, that's terrible.
But I'm switchn my hps for cobs no doubt. Cobs produce wayyyyyyyy better bud n more!


----------



## doniawon (Sep 26, 2016)

confuscious say man with cobs,
Very rucky man


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 26, 2016)

doniawon said:


> confuscious say man with cobs,
> Very rucky man


Man with COB very corny.


----------



## doniawon (Sep 26, 2016)

Somebody should build a huge 'corn cob' for a coliseum grow.. Stadium 
Or the corn cob omega garden 
Ups is here , got my adapter!


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 26, 2016)

doniawon said:


> Somebody should build a huge 'corn cob' for a coliseum grow.. Stadium
> Or the corn cob omega garden
> Ups is here , got my adapter!


You need to stop by for another visit, brah


----------



## doniawon (Sep 26, 2016)

Shit dude I've never even made but I sure do.
Can drive again in December! Been over two years


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 26, 2016)

doniawon said:


> Shit dude I've never even made but I sure do.
> Can drive again in December! Been over two years


You still got my digits? Drop me a line sometime, we'll make it happen.


----------



## genuity (Sep 26, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> View attachment 3790165 View attachment 3790166
> .


Nice....


----------



## doniawon (Sep 26, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> You still got my digits? Drop me a line sometime, we'll make it happen.


I really need to.


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 26, 2016)

doniawon said:


> I really need to.


I got wheels, no problem. Just HMU


----------



## doniawon (Sep 26, 2016)

Light tech is moving way too fast these days.

WHAT THE HELL IS A 630 DE CMH. GTFOH


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 26, 2016)

doniawon said:


> Light tech is moving way too fast these days.
> 
> WHAT THE HELL IS A 630 DE CMH. GTFOH


It's two 315W CMH pits in the same DE lamp. It isn't better.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Sep 26, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> It's two 315W CMH pits in the same DE lamp. It isn't better.


Isn't that light set up horizontal bulbs?
My 315 is hydro farm with a remote ballast. 
I am wondering has anyone removed the hood and just hung it in the tent? 
Any reason this would be not as effective?
It seems my CMH does not emit as much heat?
Any input is appreciated.


----------



## pergamum362 (Sep 26, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Isn't that light set up horizontal bulbs?
> My 315 is hydro farm with a remote ballast.
> I am wondering has anyone removed the hood and just hung it in the tent?
> Any reason this would be not as effective?
> ...


This is my plan to supplement in flower. Just two hung vertically inbetween lanes to compare.


----------



## pergamum362 (Sep 26, 2016)

Currently have two 600 watt mh, hung like that to supplement spectrum, feel like its really wasteful tho, because alot of light isnt used.


----------



## bottletoke (Sep 27, 2016)

I use vertical 315's for supplemental lighting on my gavita 1000's.tried it first on areas where there wasn't any de lamp over lap now I increased my footprint and tossed more 315's in between fixtures. The plants love these lamps!


----------



## Pig4buzz (Sep 28, 2016)

Well flipped 3 days ago should of been 10 days ago, but due to the spider mites 2 weeks ago. I help up to try and get those under control. Seems I have no bugs in 7 days

Now since the delay in flip I am concerned about the stretch. Head room is going to be s problem, as the space at bottom is a solid mass too. 

Question. Plans. To trim bottoms due to being so bushy and clone a few. Hope like heck I have enough head room. (3x4x6.5'). Plants are almost 20"x20" Anyone. There are 6 plants two are regs. So could have 4-5-6 fems. Hoping that regs is only 2 fem lol

Suggestion. F%^#~

No pic due to dark time. Pic is 10 days ago. So you can imagine


----------



## doniawon (Sep 28, 2016)

Will 240v operation pull less from the wall than 315 watts?


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 28, 2016)

doniawon said:


> Will 240v operation pull less from the wall than 315 watts?


You'll see more than 315W no matter what you plug into, because the driver needs a lil juice too. 120V means the driver needs a lil more than if it runs at 240V.


----------



## doniawon (Sep 28, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> You'll see more than 315W no matter what you plug into, because the driver needs a lil juice too. 120V means the driver needs a lil more than if it runs at 240V.


Thanks again Ty.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Sep 28, 2016)

doniawon said:


> Will 240v operation pull less from the wall than 315 watts?


Amps is the advantage of running @ 240v. Can run twice the amount of euipment on 240v then u can on 120v


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 28, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> Amps is the advantage of running @ 240v. Can run twice the amount of euipment on 240v then u can on 120v


The other advantages include safety and slightly better efficiency.


----------



## doniawon (Sep 28, 2016)

Would 3, 315s draw less than 1000 hps mag ballast?


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 28, 2016)

doniawon said:


> Would 3, 315s draw less than 1000 hps mag ballast?


3 x 340W (with ballast)= 1010 Watts
1000 x 1.08 (ballast factor) = 1080 Watts

The difference in watts pulled is much less than the difference in quality.


----------



## doniawon (Sep 28, 2016)

So I got my phantom 315 cmh ballast today. 
It won't fire on 110 or 220.
Guess I got a defective one. Ill b contacting 1000bulbs tomorrow...


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 28, 2016)

doniawon said:


> So I got my phantom 315 cmh ballast today.
> It won't fire on 110 or 220.
> Guess I got a defective one. Ill b contacting 1000bulbs tomorrow...View attachment 3792546


Fuck! That blows, bro-


----------



## Gonefishn7420 (Sep 28, 2016)

doniawon said:


> So I got my phantom 315 cmh ballast today.
> It won't fire on 110 or 220.
> Guess I got a defective one. Ill b contacting 1000bulbs tomorrow...View attachment 3792546


That no good hope it all gets straightened out for ya


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 28, 2016)

@dbkick has had his go rounds with China Farm equipment, perhaps he can make a helpful suggestion. 

Mine is more pedestrian; use a Philips ballast.


----------



## dbkick (Sep 29, 2016)

doniawon said:


> So I got my phantom 315 cmh ballast today.
> It won't fire on 110 or 220.
> Guess I got a defective one. Ill b contacting 1000bulbs tomorrow...View attachment 3792546


Dunno, I assume you've tried the ballast on different hood and lamp thats known working other than that hydrofarm is good about returns but that appears to be the revised version. I've had problems with every knock offi I've tried except for Pargrow and the latest brand Galaxy, its.still early though and both have plenty time to let me down. I can say I've not had one issue with sun systems lec which uses the genuine philips ballast. The galaxy seems promising and has a dimming feature, the Pargrow also seems solid but lacks any features other than neon green paint. Another thing to note would be lamp cord length Different brands seem to vary in maximum length .


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 29, 2016)




----------



## dbkick (Sep 29, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> View attachment 379270


That and a 30 dollar step transformer IF you can only run 120v may be the way to go , so far I'm confident with the Pargrow and Galaxy, of those two I like the Galaxy just because it has a dimming feature and cost me a bit less than the Pargrow, also as I've already stated the Pargrow housing in exact to the ceramic science 315 ballast at growershouse for 167 dollars or so, minus the neon green paint anyway. Next 315 ballast I try will be Solis Tek C1, uhf sine being the difference from most other 315 ballasts. Which is why I'm interested in @doniawon results with the DNA.


----------



## doniawon (Sep 29, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> @dbkick has had his go rounds with China Farm equipment, perhaps he can make a helpful suggestion.
> 
> Mine is more pedestrian; use a Philips ballast.


Lol


dbkick said:


> Dunno, I assume you've tried the ballast on different hood and lamp thats known working other than that hydrofarm is good about returns but that appears to be the revised version. I've had problems with every knock offi I've tried except for Pargrow and the latest brand Galaxy, its.still early though and both have plenty time to let me down. I can say I've not had one issue with sun systems lec which uses the genuine philips ballast. The galaxy seems promising and has a dimming feature, the Pargrow also seems solid but lacks any features other than neon green paint. Another thing to note would be lamp cord length Different brands seem to vary in maximum length .


yea the summit fired right up after swapping cords.

I'll b going for pargrow/ceramic science, next.

Got a dna going in there now! Seems to work well. 
Hydrofarm is generally solid so can't bitch much. But if u got the money Phillips is the smart choice.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Sep 29, 2016)

Lol for all the made in the USA stuff I hear about phillips ballasts it says right on it "Made in Mexico" .... thanks NAFTA..


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 29, 2016)

doniawon said:


> Lol
> 
> yea the summit fired right up after swapping cords.
> 
> ...


Ballast and lamp kit was $190, not my idea of expensive at all.


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 29, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> Lol for all the made in the USA stuff I hear about phillips ballasts it says right on it "Made in Mexico" .... thanks NAFTA..


IDGAF where they make it, Philips has their QC on point and that's what counts in my op.


----------



## Gonefishn7420 (Sep 29, 2016)

@doniawon if you in the market for a ballast check out the galaxy ballast. Growershouse had them very reasonable and sometimes they run some nice extra sales. Haven't had it running real long so far no problems. It running cooler to the touch than my hydrofarm and the ballast is dimmable(prolly won't ever use it but nice to have) and it had the standard plug reflector cord and not the special hydrofarm one.


----------



## rkymtnman (Sep 29, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> thanks NAFTA..


i never knew a Dutch company would have been part of NAFTA?


----------



## doniawon (Sep 29, 2016)

Gonefishn7420 said:


> @doniawon if you in the market for a ballast check out the galaxy ballast. Growershouse had them very reasonable and sometimes they run some nice extra sales. Haven't had it running real long so far no problems. It running cooler to the touch than my hydrofarm and the ballast is dimmable(prolly won't ever use it but nice to have) and it had the standard plug reflector cord and not the special hydrofarm one.


I called 1000bulbs, n josh said hold on to this one and another is on the way. So ill keep u posted cause that my dreadbread guava light!


----------



## Sire Killem All (Sep 29, 2016)

rkymtnman said:


> i never knew a Dutch company would have been part of NAFTA?


Thanks fact-checker..... j/k


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Sep 30, 2016)

Has anyone seen a fan leaf produce flowers? 
Dutch Passion California Orange
4'x2' tent 315cmh mainlined
Fox Farms OF GB,BB,TB day 25 12/12
temps 79 or less lights on

I have never seen this?

Any input is welcome?


----------



## ttystikk (Sep 30, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Has anyone seen a fan leaf produce flowers?
> Dutch Passion California Orange
> 4'x2' tent 315cmh mainlined
> Fox Farms OF GB,BB,TB day 25 12/12
> ...


Yes, I've seen this before. Nothing wrong with plant or nug.


----------



## Bad Karma (Sep 30, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Has anyone seen a fan leaf produce flowers?
> Dutch Passion California Orange
> 4'x2' tent 315cmh mainlined
> Fox Farms OF GB,BB,TB day 25 12/12
> ...


It happens every great once in a while and is one of cannabis' more entertaining genetic hiccups.
For me, it happened with Ripped Bubba, from TGA.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 1, 2016)

Thanks all...here are some more pics also noticed a leaf growing out of a leaf?
Last pics are of a clone of the same plant exhibiting none of the same traits so far?


----------



## Cyah1990 (Oct 1, 2016)

Wuts up fellow growers, just had sum question about the 315, there's a near by htg selling these. Things here's the link http://www.htgsupply.com/products/agromax-hypar-315w-cmh-grow-light
Seems like a really good price, these can be put into a regular air cooled hood, but will a glass stop the uv? Does uv even mean anything to bud or terp production? Also some of the hoods I seen on this post show the bulb hanging vert inside of the hood, is this important? Thanks for any feed back


----------



## Pig4buzz (Oct 1, 2016)

well after the battle with the spider mites again and a little help from some RIU regs. Spider mites are history. Day 5 f flip 

Trimmed bottoms and cut clones off the WW and IB. Looks like the shamans x 2 are males. Giving couple more days to make sure I am right. 
Plans are a sog attempt on the clones. 1st try cloning so hope to get a few to make it

Burn at two weeks, burn from spray of the mites. Wall to wall bushes Kinda glad the Shamans are males due to up coming stretch. Space 3x4x6.5'. 

Gave them all a half dose of jacks last night and grew 1.5 in in 24hrs. 

Thanks to all RIU players for help with multiple issues. @GroErr @ttystikk 

Try to update soon.


----------



## Haricot Vert (Oct 2, 2016)

I made the switch to the 315's about 1.5 months ago. I'm enjoying the spectrum and how the plant grows versus 600hps. I went through this whole thread this evening and have noticed what some are saying about the phantom ballasts. I got my phantom kits via NeHydro on Amazon. I have the older style of the ballast. Occasionally I will hear a mild clicking/buzzing sound from one of my 2 ballasts and that will accompany a barely perceptible flicker of the lamp. Well tonight both ballasts are making that sound and lamps are flickering, with one of the lamps very noticeably so. Is this a sign that the ballasts are about to go bad? How hard will it be to assemble a Phillips ballast and what ever else I'll need to replace my phantom ballasts if/when they go? I'm not good with electric stuff but can follow instructions. And I have a few sparky friends.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Oct 2, 2016)

Haricot Vert said:


> I made the switch to the 315's about 1.5 months ago. I'm enjoying the spectrum and how the plant grows versus 600hps. I went through this whole thread this evening and have noticed what some are saying about the phantom ballasts. I got my phantom kits via NeHydro on Amazon. I have the older style of the ballast. Occasionally I will hear a mild clicking/buzzing sound from one of my 2 ballasts and that will accompany a barely perceptible flicker of the lamp. Well tonight both ballasts are making that sound and lamps are flickering, with one of the lamps very noticeably so. Is this a sign that the ballasts are about to go bad? How hard will it be to assemble a Phillips ballast and what ever else I'll need to replace my phantom ballasts if/when they go? I'm not good with electric stuff but can follow instructions. And I have a few sparky friends.


If they are flickering then I would return them, while they are under warranty. I am running sunplix and Nanolux both have been good to me so far.


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 2, 2016)

Haricot Vert said:


> I made the switch to the 315's about 1.5 months ago. I'm enjoying the spectrum and how the plant grows versus 600hps. I went through this whole thread this evening and have noticed what some are saying about the phantom ballasts. I got my phantom kits via NeHydro on Amazon. I have the older style of the ballast. Occasionally I will hear a mild clicking/buzzing sound from one of my 2 ballasts and that will accompany a barely perceptible flicker of the lamp. Well tonight both ballasts are making that sound and lamps are flickering, with one of the lamps very noticeably so. Is this a sign that the ballasts are about to go bad? How hard will it be to assemble a Phillips ballast and what ever else I'll need to replace my phantom ballasts if/when they go? I'm not good with electric stuff but can follow instructions. And I have a few sparky friends.


I second @Sire Killem All on this; they should not be flickering.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Oct 2, 2016)

Quick peak, end of week 2 from flip


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 2, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> Quick peak, end of week 2 from flipView attachment 3795416 View attachment 3795417 View attachment 3795418


What strain?
How close can you get these lights? How is the penetration into the canopy?
What I mean is my Calio-O and Cheese are about 16" away on the outside of the tent I am worried they are too close.
They are day 27 of 12/12 and I think they have stopped stretching. I have maybe 3 inches left on my tent or I have to put the extension on?
I did the back of hand test and its fine for 30 seconds.
Thanks


----------



## bigjuice (Oct 3, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Run screaming.
> 
> If it doesn't say 'low frequency square wave' for CDM/CMH/LEC, do not buy the ballast. Period.


I contacted maxibright and they said there 315w ballast are lfsw


----------



## Javadog (Oct 3, 2016)

LFSW == low frequency, square wave


----------



## Cyah1990 (Oct 4, 2016)

Wuts up guys, would this be a good one?

http://www.htgsupply.com/products/agromax-hypar-315w-cmh-grow-light


----------



## Neoangelo147 (Oct 4, 2016)

4 Chronic Thunders in autopots fed with Maxsea grow/bloom. Coco and perlite mix. 
4x4 tent 
Lec 315
Week 3 of flower


----------



## bob223 (Oct 4, 2016)

Neoangelo147 said:


> 4 Chronic Thunders in autopots fed with Maxsea grow/bloom. Coco and perlite mix.
> 4x4 tent
> Lec 315
> Week 3 of flower
> View attachment 3797212


Looks great. i think you are going to do well in the 4x4. I have a few questions for you.

How for above your canopy is your light?
How far up have you lollipoped?

I know everyone always jokes about this but im serious. if you do this right you may get "about a pound"


----------



## Bad Karma (Oct 5, 2016)

Cyah1990 said:


> Wuts up guys, would this be a good one?
> 
> http://www.htgsupply.com/products/agromax-hypar-315w-cmh-grow-light


It's a repackaged version of their older CMH light (which was garbage) at the exact same price. I would not recommend it, it may work okay in veg, but it will severely disappoint in flower.
There are much better lights available to spend your money on.


----------



## Cyah1990 (Oct 5, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> It's a repackaged version of their older CMH light (which was garbage) at the exact same price. I would not recommend it, it may work okay in veg, but it will severely disappoint in flower.
> There are much better lights available to spend your money on.


Damn was just about to buy it, guess I'll save up, 600 for now, guy at da store was like dis was the shit and! save money, but we are using the lights to grow tomatoes, so yea


----------



## Bad Karma (Oct 5, 2016)

Cyah1990 said:


> Damn was just about to buy it, guess I'll save up, 600 for now, guy at da store was like dis was the shit and! save money, but we are using the lights to grow tomatoes, so yea


Good decision, good attitude. Save up for a Sun System 315 or at least a Phantom LEC. I have both and they work great.


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 5, 2016)

Stay away from the Phantom 315W CMH lights. Several people here have had problems with them.


----------



## Javadog (Oct 5, 2016)

*Thank you for your order!*

OK, I did it. Could not resist. I just want to check out this tech. 315W!

I went right for Sun Systems, for safety, and am getting an Apollo 4' tent 
to use with this new light. It is past time for me to get a second tent.

I will need to rework the man-cave, but have plenty of room

JD


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 5, 2016)

Javadog said:


> *Thank you for your order!*
> 
> OK, I did it. Could not resist. I just want to check out this tech. 315W!
> 
> ...


One 315W CMH system might have trouble filling a 4x4' space, but reflective walls will help.

I generally recommend them for 3x3' footprints but you could always add a second one in there. THAT would kill it!


----------



## Javadog (Oct 5, 2016)

Understood. My 600 did not really fill my existing 4' tent, but the
two Kessil 350s really made that work.

This is a tent that I am less likely to pack to the edges. I am likely to
go with a 3X3 of 5 gal buckets (a return to previous form) and then maybe,
finally, to the 2X2 of larger bins that a 4' tent is properly sized to support.

Thanks for taking the time.

JD

P.S. The other things that I need to do include growing more of things I know I like 
(what this tent is for) and another, smaller probably, to grow out a male or two.


----------



## Bad Karma (Oct 5, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Stay away from the Phantom 315W CMH lights. Several people here have had problems with them.


I know we've had some people saying they had issues with the old, and new, Phantom ballasts.
I have one of the originals and it's never given me a problem.


----------



## Frajola (Oct 5, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> It's a repackaged version of their older CMH light (which was garbage) at the exact same price. I would not recommend it, it may work okay in veg, but it will severely disappoint in flower.
> There are much better lights available to spend your money on.


Im running mh and hps 4 veg and flowering as well. Lets say I'm going to upgrade my lighting, so should I jump straight to LED COB or there is something worthy around CMH? What to use instead LED? Ur comment above about cmh, sparked some concerns about investing in it. thanks


----------



## Bad Karma (Oct 5, 2016)

Frajola said:


> Im running mh and hps 4 veg and flowering as well. Lets say I'm going to upgrade my lighting, so should I jump straight to LED COB or there is something worthy around CMH? What to use instead LED? Ur comment above about cmh, sparked some concerns about investing in it. thanks


I was only commenting on the junky HTG light in question, not all CMH/LEC lights. I have 3 CMH lights and they are wonderful (two Sun Systems 315's and a Hydrofarm Phantom CMH).
COB's are good too, it all depends on how much you want to spend on new lighting.


----------



## Neoangelo147 (Oct 6, 2016)

Here they are as of today.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 7, 2016)

Day 32 of 12/12
pulled two clones of the Calio-O(Dutch Passion seeds) that hermied from a mother that is not showing any signs yet. I wondering if was because they were in 1 gallon pots? The mom is in a 5 gallon. I have 3 other plants in the same size pot, a Calio-O from a different mom, a cheese and a early sativa. So far they have no nanners.

I am worried about light penetration through the canopy. Tent is 4x2 with one 315cmh.

Any thoughts?


----------



## Neoangelo147 (Oct 7, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Day 32 of 12/12
> pulled two clones of the Calio-O(Dutch Passion seeds) that hermied from a mother that is not showing any signs yet. I wondering if was because they were in 1 gallon pots? The mom is in a 5 gallon. I have 3 other plants in the same size pot, a Calio-O from a different mom, a cheese and a early sativa. So far they have no nanners.
> 
> I am worried about light penetration through the canopy. Tent is 4x2 with one 315cmh.
> ...


How far from the tops do you have your light?


----------



## GroErr (Oct 7, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Day 32 of 12/12
> pulled two clones of the Calio-O(Dutch Passion seeds) that hermied from a mother that is not showing any signs yet. I wondering if was because they were in 1 gallon pots? The mom is in a 5 gallon. I have 3 other plants in the same size pot, a Calio-O from a different mom, a cheese and a early sativa. So far they have no nanners.
> 
> I am worried about light penetration through the canopy. Tent is 4x2 with one 315cmh.
> ...


Looking good in there. The shorter one's on the right (1st pic) look about the perfect height for where the light is. The taller one's on the left are suffering though. If you can, bring the light up or add some light on that end like a COB or something. Looks about the right height for the shorter one's on the right for coverage but the angle on the left side at that height isn't going to get much light to those buds. Do you have some height to move it up? They can grow decent bud to 30" down at 20-22" above the canopy so you'd still be alright for penetration imo.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Oct 7, 2016)

Help what to do. The 2 shaman I thought were male seem to both be female, one for sure, more than likely the other is too. Since no nuts.

I burnt these girls about 3 weeks ago and now bushes. 10 days flip the room is a solid mass. 

Ok trim them down or what suggestion much appreciated. The tall ones are bulk and wwidow
Major stretch on these. Shaman are just getting fatter with tight nodes bad pic sorry shams in front

2-2-2 of each 6 total


----------



## Sire Killem All (Oct 7, 2016)

y do u have ur light so high?


Pig4buzz said:


> Help what to do. The 2 shaman I thought were male seem to both be female, one for sure, more than likely the other is too. Since no nuts.
> 
> I burnt these girls about 3 weeks ago and now bushes. 10 days flip the room is a solid mass.
> 
> ...


----------



## Pig4buzz (Oct 7, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> y do u have ur light so high?


24 in spec say 18/24 dropped to 20 tonight

Tell me different if wrong. 2 grow in 30 yrs.


----------



## Neoangelo147 (Oct 8, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Help what to do. The 2 shaman I thought were male seem to both be female, one for sure, more than likely the other is too. Since no nuts.
> 
> I burnt these girls about 3 weeks ago and now bushes. 10 days flip the room is a solid mass.
> 
> ...


Light looks way to high in this pic.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Oct 8, 2016)

Pic is 24 ". Light is now 20 " fellow RIU friends 

Well decided to defoliate about 15/20% of middle leaves remove branches with few nodes not tight and lst. Lollipop bottom like. This is what I am going by. I notice someone else is having same issue. 

http://www.growweedeasy.com/defoliation


----------



## GroErr (Oct 8, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Pic is 24 ". Light is now 20 " fellow RIU friends
> 
> Well decided to defoliate about 15/20% of middle leaves remove branches with few nodes not tight and lst. Lollipop bottom like. This is what I am going by. I notice someone else is having same issue.
> 
> http://www.growweedeasy.com/defoliation


20-24" above is fine. You'll have to decide but it looks like they have some more stretching to do so they'll be very tight in there. If I had to choose between defoliation and pulling a plant or two I'd cull to give the remaining plants room vs. defoliation. I'd pick the best looking/smelling one's and cull a couple if it gets too tight.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Oct 8, 2016)

GroErr said:


> 20-24" above is fine. You'll have to decide but it looks like they have some more stretching to do so they'll be very tight in there. If I had to choose between defoliation and pulling a plant or two I'd cull to give the remaining plants room vs. defoliation. I'd pick the best looking/smelling one's and cull a couple if it gets too tight.


Think that's what I am going to do is cull or finish the two indica in my veg. yet do some defo too. They for sure have more stretching. Guess it's a good problem lol


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 8, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Looking good in there. The shorter one's on the right (1st pic) look about the perfect height for where the light is. The taller one's on the left are suffering though. If you can, bring the light up or add some light on that end like a COB or something. Looks about the right height for the shorter one's on the right for coverage but the angle on the left side at that height isn't going to get much light to those buds. Do you have some height to move it up? They can grow decent bud to 30" down at 20-22" above the canopy so you'd still be alright for penetration imo.


put the tent extension on and had to kill one of my Calio-O throwing nanners. Light is now 18" above canopy.
Light


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## GroErr (Oct 8, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> put the tent extension on and had to kill one of my Calio-O throwing nanners. Light is now 18" above canopy.
> Light


Nice to have that extension, looks better, that should give you more even coverage on the long edges.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 8, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Nice to have that extension, looks better, that should give you more even coverage on the long edges.


I also was able to put the remaining Cali-O and the Cheese right under the light so I hope to make her bulk up. The other critical widows are exploding with density and trichomes, so is the cheese.
I wish I could figure out what is going on with my easy sativa?


----------



## GroErr (Oct 8, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I also was able to put the remaining Cali-O and the Cheese right under the light so I hope to make her bulk up. The other critical widows are exploding with density and trichomes, so is the cheese.
> I wish I could figure out what is going on with my easy sativa?


Little tip burn but not terrible, not a clear def. I've run a few strains that'll get bleaching/burn when the lights less than 20".


----------



## Pig4buzz (Oct 9, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Think that's what I am going to do is cull or finish the two indica in my veg. yet do some defo too. They for sure have more stretching. Guess it's a good problem lol


Well cleaned out a storage area putting up a tent 3x3 going to flower in it too. 

Review review reviewed lights. Got another 315 don't think I can go wrong. 

Should have it going by weekend moving the shaman in it along with two Bobby banner been vegging.


----------



## Javadog (Oct 9, 2016)

Well, I joined the club, officially. :0)

I got my new tent up and light installed. (Sun Systems)

I put a 3X3 array of plants in while I burn it in...it will be
gettings about 20 hours before I turn it off the first time.

 

I am thinking that I will flip these tomorrow. These are plants that survived the
Mite Fight and so are tall and scrappy. There is a lovely Super Qrazy in the center too.

JD


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 9, 2016)

I'm adding another 315W CMH to my veg, and then in a month we'll see if I end up replacing all of them or just some with LED.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Oct 9, 2016)

Javadog said:


> Well, I joined the club, officially. :0)
> 
> I got my new tent up and light installed. (Sun Systems)
> 
> ...


Well was going to say in you had another tent let them veg for 5 days before flip. They exploded under the 315 crazy


----------



## bob223 (Oct 10, 2016)

Javadog said:


> Well, I joined the club, officially. :0)
> 
> I got my new tent up and light installed. (Sun Systems)
> 
> ...


Well Welcome to the club!!!! Tent looks good 

If you are going to keep that many plants in the tent i would switch them over ASAP. I have been getting the best results with 4 medium/ large plants
I have been flowering when they are just under three feet tall. With that said i think you could get great results with what you got in there.

I would flip them Asap and lolipop the bottoms of the plants. I would space them out as much as possible and watch the canopy fill in. I like the Square pots. How many Gallons?


----------



## Javadog (Oct 10, 2016)

I call those my "baskets" because they look like little waste-baskets.

They are ridiculous....maybe two gallons. 

I moved to them to increase the numbers I could run when I restarted 
my grow with my mothers to work with. I will have popped and run a
couple hundred breeds/strains and will likely do the same this years.

I have found three of four that I'd like to move up to 5 gallon Homer Buckets.

I will likely do that in the next round, for one of my now two tents.

I agree completely on the flip and will have them off with tent #1 today. :0)

I have the light down low (an upside of no ducting) and will raise the light
as we go. I can actually see the plants reacting to the new light, in a positive
manner.

Re: the baskets, I thought about it and decided the perfect growing container
would be a 3D rectangle, one foot square at the base, 18 inches tall, and with
all square (90°) corners.

These would pack perfectly, without loss of space, and would hold a awesome
amount of soil.

I went right at the plastics manufacturers, but failed to find the product I wanted.
...but I will find them in time.

Take care, and good luck this week folks.

JD


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## Pig4buzz (Oct 10, 2016)

Well rearrange the girls putting the Shams in middle of tent on trays. The canopy looks much better. 

Gave them a major trim on bottom and did minor   middle defo. Hope I didn't f em up. To late now got about 24+ inches of veg figure should grow 3-4" more. Going to have some nice cola regardless lol! 

20 days now since flip little nugs everywhere. Pulling the Shams out and putting in a tent this weekend. Alone with couple Bobby banners. That are slow vegging. 

Underside of the 6 girls in pic 1. Canopy in 2 pic. 

White widow and Incredible bulk are other 4. No bugs hey!


----------



## Javadog (Oct 10, 2016)

That canopy looks complete...I am sure that you are fine. 

I fought the mites this last Summer....everything is still a tad scrappy from the sprays.

Good luck,

JD


----------



## Pig4buzz (Oct 10, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Well rearrange the girls putting the Shams in middle of tent on trays. The canopy looks much better.
> 
> Gave them a major trim on bottom and did minor View attachment 3801732 View attachment 3801733 middle defo. Hope I didn't f em up. To late now got about 24+ inches of veg figure should grow 3-4" more. Going to have some nice cola regardless lol!
> 
> ...


Correction 13 days since flip


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## GemuGrows (Oct 10, 2016)

This was under 2x 315w LEC in a 5x5
     

Those bags of FFOF are for an experiment for my next run. Roots organic original has so far proven to be supreme; but i'm going to have the bottom 4 inches or so of my 7 gallon pots be FFOF with the rest RO on the next run to see how it goes


----------



## bob223 (Oct 10, 2016)

GemuGrows said:


> This was under 2x 315w LEC in a 5x5
> View attachment 3801811 View attachment 3801812 View attachment 3801813 View attachment 3801814 View attachment 3801815 View attachment 3801816
> 
> Those bags of FFOF are for an experiment for my next run. Roots organic original has so far proven to be supreme; but i'm going to have the bottom 4 inches or so of my 7 gallon pots be FFOF with the rest RO on the next run to see how it goes


What strain is that????
That looks crazy good and the buds are huge. How dense are the buds?
It looks like it will be a pain to trim but well worth it.

how much did you yield in the 5x5


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## Javadog (Oct 11, 2016)

Was that White Kush Gemu? I saw that awesome plant in the 6....


----------



## GemuGrows (Oct 11, 2016)

Yep its the White OG. Buds are very dense and hella frosty

Karma is a great breeder imo. All props to the genetics- i've just been lucky enough to get to grow it. My current habit is: Train plants to 4 semi equal tops, lollypop the shit out of them and toss them in bloom. After that I mostly just water and feed. Its all the plant yo

I figured a lot of ppl in the 315 thread (which I see has been expanding) don't lurk into the 6

These LEC lights are pretty beast, I sold a loooooooooooot of them when I worked at a hydro shop

Yield was like 750g but the tent only used up like 80% of its grow space. Then I have probably 100g of sugar trim to blast. Last time the sugar trim gave me 16% return


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 11, 2016)

GemuGrows said:


> This was under 2x 315w LEC in a 5x5
> View attachment 3801811 View attachment 3801812 View attachment 3801813 View attachment 3801814 View attachment 3801815 View attachment 3801816
> 
> Those bags of FFOF are for an experiment for my next run. Roots organic original has so far proven to be supreme; but i'm going to have the bottom 4 inches or so of my 7 gallon pots be FFOF with the rest RO on the next run to see how it goes


what is the humidity i your tent ? Those are thick buds no worry of mold ?
Looks amazing.


----------



## GemuGrows (Oct 11, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> what is the humidity i your tent ? Those are thick buds no worry of mold ?
> Looks amazing.


Humidity was pretty damn high, I actually did lose about 6g to some white stringy mold on just a few buds. Its the first time i've ever had any mold at all though; It caused me to chop maybe a week earlier than I would have

I usually de-fan my plants like 3-7 days before chop; I saw mold on a few nugs when I de-fanned and decided to chop. It honestly looked more like spider webs than mold; but it was definitely mold. I was scared shitless that I had spider mites, the fact that it was mold was a relief lol. I'd say I caught it very early

It was spread between the 2 plants that get kinda shorted on the air flow [:/:] <--- is sorta how my ventilation goes, the line being the main draft. The mold was on plant [ /.] and the right side of plant [./ ]
if that makes any sense at least. Next time around i'll make sure everywhere in the canopy gets even air exchange and i'll keep my inline fan on during lights off hours. I only had my circulation fans on during lights off

Medicropper on youtube runs his grows at 99% humidity and gets insane nugs, I think his garden is nearly 100k watts


My lesson learned: Make sure air flow is entirely uniform and around week 6 drop humidity. I think I chopped these at week 9 or 10 from 12/12


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 11, 2016)

GemuGrows said:


> Humidity was pretty damn high, I actually did lose about 6g to some white stringy mold on just a few buds. Its the first time i've ever had any mold at all though; It caused me to chop maybe a week earlier than I would have
> 
> I usually de-fan my plants like 3-7 days before chop; I saw mold on a few nugs when I de-fanned and decided to chop. It honestly looked more like spider webs than mold; but it was definitely mold. I was scared shitless that I had spider mites, the fact that it was mold was a relief lol. I'd say I caught it very early
> 
> ...


I am always worried about humidity. I actually run another hurricane fan as intake both on a variac. I was told to keep it slightly slower than the carbon filter combo exhaust. I keep rh under 50%.

This is my first tent grow and my old grow was a basement in which the dehueys were on at 45%

Tent growing is harder than my 3x1000hps basement 

Those buds look amazing


----------



## GemuGrows (Oct 11, 2016)

IMO its definitely a good idea to make sure you don't get mold. So far i've just never had an issue so i've never had to adjust my tecnique- but yeah in the future i'll definitely be dropping my humidity 

Where my garden is I don't really have a choice but to run a tent, i'll be swapping to a 4x8 gorilla in like a week. I've never used an intake fan, i've always just opened vents so I get air flow from many directions. It is something i'd consider doing though

And thank you! White OG is a cross between "The white" and "SFV OG Kush." The white is apparently where the frost cover comes from hah


----------



## Neoangelo147 (Oct 12, 2016)

4 Chronic Thunder under 1 lec 315


----------



## NinjaNick (Oct 12, 2016)

Running 3 right now. 2 in a 5x9 with AC and 1 in a 4x4 no AC intake outtake only and chillin. Love these things


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## blowinmaryfast (Oct 12, 2016)

NinjaNick said:


> Running 3 right now. 2 in a 5x9 with AC and 1 in a 4x4 no AC intake outtake only and chillin. Love these things


Are those numbers canopy size? If so how is your coverage? I have two over a 4x8 and I've had to work hard to get the 315 spread over them.


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## ttystikk (Oct 12, 2016)

blowinmaryfast said:


> Are those numbers canopy size? If so how is your coverage? I have two over a 4x8 and I've had to work hard to get the 315 spread over them.


Lift your lights up a bit. Three is best for that area, but two will do well.


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## Pig4buzz (Oct 14, 2016)

Update ladies look good at 17 days since flip

Moving Shamans tomorrow to my 3x3 tent. Oh yeah did I say under another 315 sun lec 3100 lamp. 
Looking for a nice yield with my first grow of photos. Hey still no bugs! 

It's happening


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 18, 2016)

Day 43 of 12/12
1st pic is one of the three Critical Widow
2nd is Cheese
3rd is Easy Sativa
4th is kind of a group shot.
Next is my Calio-O just seems like it is on the struggle bus
Last two pics are two other Critical Widows

Also it seems like my trichomes are are turning amber already. This is my first grow with 315 LEC...I usually let my plants go at least a week longer than recommended but that is under a 1000hps?
Any advice?


----------



## Pig4buzz (Oct 18, 2016)

Not much experience with the 315 but @GroErr said that under these lights plants seem to finish a little early. I only have grow autos under, until recently no growing photos. 

Looks like you got some burn on tips and nugs maybe.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 18, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Not much experience with the 315 but @GroErr said that under these lights plants seem to finish a little early. I only have grow autos under, until recently no growing photos.
> 
> Looks like you got some burn on tips and nugs maybe.


The easy sativa was burned. I went away for work and my GF watered them. I was giving the easy sativa epsom water for a mg def but she watered it three times with the epsom mixed with distilled water.
I blasted the others with nutes since I have 2 or three weeks left on the cheese and critical widow.
They might get water from here on out?


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## Pig4buzz (Oct 18, 2016)

Could be the espsom salt. After stretch I don't give much nitrogen. More PK less N. Might give a good flush. Let them recoup


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## Pig4buzz (Oct 18, 2016)

Damn tent is driving me nuts with high temps and low humidity the 315 is really heating it up in this setup. I had my led 450 vipar in the tent until the 315 arrived. Temps were lower humidity high. Go figure. 

315 with passive intake 85-95 hum - 32-36
450 vipar 75-81 humidity 51-56. No intake 

Makes me wonder should I invest in a high quality cob led? Talk about comparison. Side by side. The heat factor. Temps going down in low 70s next few days with upper 40s low. Hope this helps my problem 
Suggestion on. Led cob?


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## Evil-Mobo (Oct 18, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> Damn tent is driving me nuts with high temps and low humidity the 315 is really heating it up in this setup. I had my led 450 vipar in the tent until the 315 arrived. Temps were lower humidity high. Go figure.
> 
> 315 with passive intake 85-95 hum - 32-36
> 450 vipar 75-81 humidity 51-56. No intake
> ...


Budget and DIY or pre built and for what size space?


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## Pig4buzz (Oct 18, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Budget and DIY or pre built and for what size space?


3.3x3.3x7'. Budget 6$ Not a diy person


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## Evil-Mobo (Oct 18, 2016)

$6 for an LED budget and no DIY?


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## Javadog (Oct 19, 2016)

It is, in part, the cost of LEDs vs. LEC that drove me to try this light. 

I opened my tent at 10:30 PM, after it had been "day" for three hours,
and the temps were 81F. Perfect. This is by just using my LEC tent
as the place to draw fresh air into the first (HPS) tent.

It does not look like I will be able to switch day back to the PM for the 
new tent, as I typically do during the year. This is fine, as energy is cheaper
during the off-hours.

JD


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## Pig4buzz (Oct 19, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> $6 for an LED budget and no DIY?


600$ don't want diy


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## Evil-Mobo (Oct 19, 2016)

Pig4buzz said:


> 600$ don't want diy


Save $100 more and get 2 of these in 4000K and call it a day brother there's grow logs with these lights all over using the diff COB's........

https://northerngrowlights.com/collections/all/products/photon-180v-gen-7?variant=25536717448


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## ttystikk (Oct 19, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Save $100 more and get 2 of these in 4000K and call it a day brother there's grow logs with these lights all over using the diff COB's........
> 
> https://northerngrowlights.com/collections/all/products/photon-180v-gen-7?variant=25536717448


For bloom get 3000K.


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## Evil-Mobo (Oct 19, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> For bloom get 3000K.



Not in the Vero bro I disagree there if it was cree yes and that's exactly what I did 3000K 3590's for my DIY


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## Pig4buzz (Oct 19, 2016)

22 days into flip White Widow x 2 Incediable bulk x 2. Lots of growth with little more room now since took Shaman x2 out. 3x4x6.5'. Shaman adjusting to transition from room to tent, 3.3x3.3 as I am myself trying to get everything dial end. Getting close. Pic of WW &IB. As of today. 

Putting Bobby Bannersx 2 in flower this weekend. Hope to get male/female on BB maybe a little breeding


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 19, 2016)

day 44 of 12/12
1 three are 3 different critical widow
last two is my cheese plant


----------



## Pig4buzz (Oct 19, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> day 44 of 12/12
> 1 three are 3 different critical widow
> last two is my cheese plant


They look much better looks like new nug growth. 
These lights they say make strains finish early. Cheese 8wks? Critical 8-9?


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 19, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> day 44 of 12/12
> 1 three are 3 different critical widow
> last two is my cheese plant


What do you know about the 315lecwith flowering time ? Longer or shorter @GroErr


----------



## bob223 (Oct 20, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> What do you know about the 315lecwith flowering time ? Longer or shorter @GroErr


I'm Not GroErr but i will weigh in on this.

I do notice that plants Mature slightly faster then under HPS. It seems like 3 to 4 days faster 7 days max 
But what i have done is run my plants for the same amount of time as the hps and enjoyed the results.

The finished bud seems better (potency, density, crystal formation) In my opinion a extra few days never hurts


----------



## GroErr (Oct 20, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> What do you know about the 315lecwith flowering time ? Longer or shorter @GroErr


Much like @bob223 said, 4-7 days shorter depending on strain, I have a pheno I was running under CMH that was typically 60 days and it takes about 66 under COBs. They start off quick and hold that throughout the cycle, main things most folks are seeing is the quick start compared to pretty well any lighting for some reason.


----------



## Javadog (Oct 20, 2016)

While I do check trichs, I like to push my plants to the edge, for the
extra taste more than anything else.....I am betting that I will find myself
being forced to harvest here and there....and a difference in those numbers
really ought to be something that I will notice.

We will see. It is so very cool to see 315W make a 4' tent work.*

JD

* OK, so it is not packed to the gills. It might be in time....we will see. :0)


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 21, 2016)

Will anyone chime in on this idea. I have to harvest soon and my plants will finish weeks apart.

Thanks

https://www.rollitup.org/t/bud-dryer-out-of-a-moving-wardrobe.924408/


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 23, 2016)

My Cheese plant is day 48 of 12/12 and she just yellowed her fan leaves over night. I have been feeding her FF Big Bloom Tiger Bloom and up until this last feeding Grow Big( I always give nitrogen up to week 5 then I flush for a week). I have a feeding of BB and TB a few days ago?
It says its an 8 week strain but I never believe what they say. Trichomes are coming on nicely.

Third pic she is the tall one.Last Pis is group shot. My other plants are Critical Widow and Calio-O they had some fan leaves yellow but not like the cheese. Temps are 75 day and 64 at night. RH is upper 30's to mid 40's
Any thoughts? @GroErr @BobBitchen


----------



## bob223 (Oct 23, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> My Cheese plant is day 48 of 12/12 and she just yellowed her fan leaves over night. I have been feeding her FF Big Bloom Tiger Bloom and up until this last feeding Grow Big( I always give nitrogen up to week 5 then I flush for a week). I have a feeding of BB and TB a few days ago?
> It says its an 8 week strain but I never believe what they say. Trichomes are coming on nicely.
> 
> Third pic she is the tall one.Last Pis is group shot. My other plants are Critical Widow and Calio-O they had some fan leaves yellow but not like the cheese. Temps are 75 day and 64 at night. RH is upper 30's to mid 40's
> Any thoughts?


Nice looking plants. how many days are you planning on running them?
Looks like you could go 60-66 at least

Is the cheese from clone or seed?


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 23, 2016)

bob223 said:


> Nice looking plants. how many days are you planning on running them?
> Looks like you could go 60-66 at least
> 
> Is the cheese from clone or seed?


Thanks I am not sure how long I will run them. I am not familiar with this strain(Canuk Seeds Cheese says 8 weeks which means at least 9 to me, I like 70% milky and 30% amber trichomes).
My issue is the fan leaves just turned over night.
I flipped them on Sept 6 and they all got a feeding of Bud Blood. Regular feeding with FF BB TB and GB. My clone of that same plant also in 12/12 did not yellow like that plant.
Maybe it is just me, but the yellowing bothers me. My plants usually stay lush and green through most of flower.
The Sativa plants in front are Calio-O from Dutch passion which will be a 11 week strain and I figure the Critical Widow also from Canuk Seeds will go 9 maybe 10 weeks.


----------



## Javadog (Oct 23, 2016)

GroErr has seen early finishes on the cycles he has run with the LEC.

If it is Day 48 of an 56 Day breed (in theory) then this might be what 
you are seeing as well. 

Perhaps you can just take it when the trich are right. 

Do let us know what you see.

Good luck!

JD


----------



## GroErr (Oct 23, 2016)

Javadog said:


> GroErr has seen early finishes on the cycles he has run with the LEC.
> 
> If it is Day 48 of an 56 Day breed (in theory) then this might be what
> you are seeing as well.
> ...


After a couple of years and running several seeds I found most finish closer to the low end of breeder's times under the 315's. Could be just fading hard, or a lock out. Are they drinking at their normal rate or slowing down? They look like they could use 7-10 days under 315's, still some white hairs left to mature.


----------



## dangledo (Oct 24, 2016)

@3 weeks

they absolutely mature quicker with the lec


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 24, 2016)

All the big plants are from seed. I watered them friday night and then again this morning. They are drinking like normal. My only experience is under Hortilux 1000hps which almost always went a week past the breeders time line. I am usually the type to wait until I see a 20% amber trichomes. I will give it a few days and look at them under the scope. One of my critical widows is just pushing out new pistils and calyx's and it is rock solid. Even my California orange plants are starting to develop. It is a strong Sativa pheno.
pic 1 and 2 Critical Widow reminds me of a Citral I grew years back.
3rd is the cheese from seed
4th is the cheese clone from that plant
5th is the Cali-O


----------



## Sire Killem All (Oct 24, 2016)

maybe i jus pull mime early but ive only ever had one plant with all orange/brown pistils at harvest.
Thought these seem to be colouring a lot faster then what i mnormally run.


----------



## doniawon (Oct 24, 2016)

Its strain dependant.
All 3 of these are 90% cloudy. Some are dark red n some are yellow orange n white


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 25, 2016)

so i finally busted out the 60x scope and checked the trichomes on my easy sativa and cheese and they are all still clear. So maybe they will bulk up even more?


----------



## Sire Killem All (Oct 28, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> so i finally busted out the 60x scope and checked the trichomes on my easy sativa and cheese and they are all still clear. So maybe they will bulk up even more?


yea they normally put on the most weight in the final week, imo.


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## Sire Killem All (Oct 28, 2016)

OG Kush/ barneys


----------



## Porky101 (Oct 28, 2016)

Hi guys, 

I am new to LEC/CMH. 

I have only used HPS. I have used a 600w hps for over 5 years and always got nice dense buds that were full of crystals and plenty of taste. 

I recently purchased some DE 1000W hps. 

I have been doing research and it looks like 2x 315 CMH are similar to a 1000W hps. 

I am guessing to match a 1000W DE hps you will need 3x 315CMH?


Now to my question! :

I have no doubt the spectrum is better with CMH, I am concerned about penetrative vs 1150W DE hps. Ultimately you only have 315 w vs almost 4x that from the HPS! 

Anyways my question is will 3x CMH out perform the DE HPS? 

Is it worth me changing? Are the results that much better?? 

I mean if it makes plants finish a week earlier then I'm already half sold...


----------



## Javadog (Oct 28, 2016)

Welcome Porky! 

I look forward to the more-experienced LEC answers here.

I am pretty sure that it is the current thinking that 2XLEC315 >= 1000W HPS
but I am no authority.

Good luck,

JD


----------



## GroErr (Oct 28, 2016)

Porky101 said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> I am new to LEC/CMH.
> 
> ...


You won't have any issues with penetration or bud density if that's a concern, as long as you have decent coverage over the whole of the area you're trying to flower out you'll be fine. My experience is they'll cover off up to about 3.5 x 3.5' each, with some overlap from multiple units they'll perform even better.

As far as outperforming a DE with 3 of them, I think they would be close but no experience with DE''s. You should do a run or two to get a feel for what they can do, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised. 2x can come close to a regular 1000w, probably more like 900w. I think you'll find the quality, quick flowering times, lower draw, and lower temps will sell you on them. I'd run 2x 315's vs. 1x 1000w any day.


----------



## Javadog (Oct 28, 2016)

OK, so, I am changing my ">=" to a "=~" 

:0)


----------



## Porky101 (Oct 28, 2016)

GroErr said:


> You won't have any issues with penetration or bud density if that's a concern, as long as you have decent coverage over the whole of the area you're trying to flower out you'll be fine. My experience is they'll cover off up to about 3.5 x 3.5' each, with some overlap from multiple units they'll perform even better.
> 
> As far as outperforming a DE with 3 of them, I think they would be close but no experience with DE''s. You should do a run or two to get a feel for what they can do, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised. 2x can come close to a regular 1000w, probably more like 900w. I think you'll find the quality, quick flowering times, lower draw, and lower temps will sell you on them. I'd run 2x 315's vs. 1x 1000w any day.



OK... I'm going to invest in 3x 315 CMH. 

Once I have done a grow with those, then only cobs are left for me to try (have used LEDs with mediocre results).


----------



## bob223 (Oct 28, 2016)

GroErr said:


> You won't have any issues with penetration or bud density if that's a concern, as long as you have decent coverage over the whole of the area you're trying to flower out you'll be fine. My experience is they'll cover off up to about 3.5 x 3.5' each, with some overlap from multiple units they'll perform even better.
> 
> As far as outperforming a DE with 3 of them, I think they would be close but no experience with DE''s. You should do a run or two to get a feel for what they can do, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised. 2x can come close to a regular 1000w, probably more like 900w. I think you'll find the quality, quick flowering times, lower draw, and lower temps will sell you on them. I'd run 2x 315's vs. 1x 1000w any day.



i would use three 315's to cover a 4x8 space/table. Most people i know would use 3x 600's or 2x 1000's to cover the same space.
I must be honest i have no experience with double ended Hps. What i would suggest is if you are in a legal state and are not worried about electricity run the Double ended's.
With the double ended Hps you will need A.c. and high ceilings. I can say i have now heard of people in my area setting up small scale commercial grows 100%on 315 LEC.
I have done alot of growing with a standard 1000w bulb in my day and i used a 4x4 max area for a single ended 1000w, but if i under stand double ended hps correctly it will cover a 5x5 space and then some if your ceilings are high enough.

I think the perks to LEC would be cover the same amount of space with less watts, runs cooler, better finished product. Penetration is not an issue with LEC
As long as they are spaced about 3.5 feet apart or less you can not go wrong with LEC and you wont go back to HPS.

My results may not be typical but i can crush 1000w hps with two LEC's.... That's just me i have them well dialed in.


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## Porky101 (Oct 28, 2016)

bob223 said:


> i would use three 315's to cover a 4x8 space/table. Most people i know would use 3x 600's or 2x 1000's to cover the same space.
> I must be honest i have no experience with double ended Hps. What i would suggest is if you are in a legal state and are not worried about electricity run the Double ended's.
> With the double ended Hps you will need A.c. and high ceilings. I can say i have now heard of people in my area setting up small scale commercial grows 100%on 315 LEC.
> I have done alot of growing with a standard 1000w bulb in my day and i used a 4x4 max area for a single ended 1000w, but if i under stand double ended hps correctly it will cover a 5x5 space and then some if your ceilings are high enough.
> ...



Can you post a pic of your canopy so I can see?? I always grow tree's.....


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## bob223 (Oct 28, 2016)

Im not really big on taking pictures but here are a few. All plants are in different stages of growth i run perpetual for the most part.
This is a 4x4 tent with 1 lec. Most of the plants in these pictures are pretty early in flower so you dont get a good idea of what the canopy will look like.


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## Porky101 (Oct 28, 2016)

bob223 said:


> Im not really big on taking pictures but here are a few. All plants are in different stages of growth i run perpetual for the most part.
> This is a 4x4 tent with 1 lec. Most of the plants in these pictures are pretty early in flower so you dont get a good idea of what the canopy will look like.



Cool thanks for the pics... What are the silver cages for?? Around the plants?


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## bob223 (Oct 28, 2016)

Porky101 said:


> Cool thanks for the pics... What are the silver cages for?? Around the plants?


they are modified tomato cages It seems to really help keep everything up when it gets to heavy.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 29, 2016)

Porky101 said:


> OK... I'm going to invest in 3x 315 CMH.
> 
> Once I have done a grow with those, then only cobs are left for me to try (have used LEDs with mediocre results).


This is day 54
These lights are better than my 1000hps IMHO
Photo 1 Critical Widow #2
Photo 2 Cheese
Photo 3 California Orange
Photo 4 Critical Widow # 1
Photo 5 Critical widow # 3
Photo 6 Easy Sativa
Photo 7 Critical Widow # 2 
Photo 8 Cheese up close


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## Jerseykushface (Oct 29, 2016)

2 lec 315 1 600hps week 5 day 2 flower


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## TheTomFool (Oct 29, 2016)

Well I've read for a while and lec 315 it is. Where would be the cheapest place to order a couple?


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## Jerseykushface (Oct 29, 2016)

TheTomFool said:


> Well I've read for a while and lec 315 it is. Where would be the cheapest place to order a couple?


If u find out let me kno cuz i paid 500 each for mine and i want like 2 more but don't really have 1k to blow right now


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## Jerseykushface (Oct 29, 2016)

Close up


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## Porky101 (Oct 30, 2016)

How many LEC to replace 1150W DE HPS... 3?


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 30, 2016)

TheTomFool said:


> Well I've read for a while and lec 315 it is. Where would be the cheapest place to order a couple?


https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01LW2450I/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s02?ie=UTF8&th=1


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## Javadog (Oct 30, 2016)

GroErr said:


> As far as outperforming a DE with 3 of them, I think they would be close but no experience with DE''s. You should do a run or two to get a feel for what they can do, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.
> 
> *2x can come close to a regular 1000w, probably more like 900w. *
> 
> ...


I would take Gro's word on this matter.

(but 3 will do even better.....and still use a bit less energy)


----------



## medicated00420 (Oct 30, 2016)

Also looking to upgrade lights Best prices iv found were 280 for nanolux and another 80 for the bulb so 360.the phantom for 380 and the sunsystem for 440.wnted to know if anyone would recommend one light over the others and why


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## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 30, 2016)

Growlights.net got great prices if you order enough.


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## Bad Karma (Oct 30, 2016)

medicated00420 said:


> Also looking to upgrade lights Best prices iv found were 280 for nanolux and another 80 for the bulb so 360.the phantom for 380 and the sunsystem for 440.wnted to know if anyone would recommend one light over the others and why


I've got a Phantom and some SunSystem LEC's. Both are good and can get the job done. The main difference that I noticed was that the SunSystem had slightly better canopy penatration.
Other than that, the only difference is that the SunSystem has its ballast built into the unit, where as the Phantom's ballast is not.
The SunSystem would be my first choice but the Phantom is still a worthwhile purchase for those on a budget.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 30, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> I've got a Phantom and some SunSystem LEC's. Both are good and can get the job done. The main difference that I noticed was that the SunSystem had slightly better canopy penatration.
> Other than that, the only difference is that the SunSystem has its ballast built into the unit, where as the Phantom's ballast is not.
> The SunSystem would be my first choice but the Phantom is still a worthwhile purchase for those on a budget.


I went with the phantom because it had a remote ballast. It kept heat to a minimum in a tent. At least for my application.


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## FRdoubleE (Oct 30, 2016)

TheTomFool said:


> Well I've read for a while and lec 315 it is. Where would be the cheapest place to order a couple?





ilovetoskiatalta said:


> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01LW2450I/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s02?ie=UTF8&th=1


This is where I got mine. Shipped and received in 5 days with no tax and they come with the new phantom ballast.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 31, 2016)

My Cheese is showing some purple, temps in the mid 60's at night in the tent.


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## Javadog (Oct 31, 2016)

Very pretty.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 31, 2016)

Javadog said:


> Very pretty.


thanks she has been finicky with nutes. Most of her fan leaves are really yellow. The lower buds are doing fine but the main colas are bare. She is frosty but I don't know what happened. Her clone looks amazing. Maybe some lock up. First time I have grown cheese. Says 8 weeks, trichomes are starting to turn milky. I figure another week or so.


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## Javadog (Oct 31, 2016)

Oh, I typically crisp things a tad while I learn what they need....

Running perpetual and constantly starting new breeds and I cannot
hardly post a shot that is not looking off-putting. lol

Chemical pruning has advantages. :0) Harvests are easy.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 31, 2016)

A mix of 315s and DE. Will be all 315s after this run.


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## Porky101 (Nov 1, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> A mix of 315s and DE. Will be all 315s after this run. View attachment 3819833



Are you saying multiple 315's are better than single DE 1k HPS?


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## FRdoubleE (Nov 1, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> A mix of 315s and DE. Will be all 315s after this run. View attachment 3819833


Wow, really nice set up you have going. Those plants look great, it's like a jungle.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 1, 2016)

Porky101 said:


> Are you saying multiple 315's are better than single DE 1k HPS?


Yes. I think 315s are better than DE. There is no reason to fight the heat from those lights for a less ideal spectrum.


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## ttystikk (Nov 1, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Yes. I think 315s are better than DE. There is no reason to fight the heat from those lights for a less ideal spectrum.


And that's why I've been running both 860W CDM Allstart and 315W CMH lamps for years. Kicking them to the curb, tho- my new girl LED done took their place in my growroom. She's not a hottie, but she's strong n steady lol


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## DuganNash (Nov 1, 2016)

Hey. I'm putting together a room and acting as a caregiver for a few people. I was planning on 20 little "beds" with a Nanolux 630w CMH over the top of each. Do you think that'd be overkill and too much light for 20 3x3 spaces? There's 10 foot ceilings.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 1, 2016)

DuganNash said:


> Hey. I'm putting together a room and acting as a caregiver for a few people. I was planning on 20 little "beds" with a Nanolux 630w CMH over the top of each. Do you think that'd be overkill and too much light for 20 3x3 spaces? There's 10 foot ceilings.


Yea, you don't NEED a 630 to cover a 3x3. Especially with overlap. I'm pulling 1-1.5 lbs per 3x3 space with 315s.


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## DuganNash (Nov 1, 2016)

I thought so. My reasoning was that an additional point of light and extra 315w each would better take advantage of the tall ceilings.


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## ttystikk (Nov 1, 2016)

DuganNash said:


> I thought so. My reasoning was that an additional point of light and extra 315w each would better take advantage of the tall ceilings.


I see serious access problems with your layout.


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## DuganNash (Nov 1, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I see serious access problems with your layout.


Only half the room is going to be utilized for awhile. If and when it fills up, things will have to be rearranged or be made more modular/mobile.


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 1, 2016)

I too have been looking at the nanolux 630, im doing a medical 4x4. Fixture and bulbs shipping and exchange rate make it a 960 dollar light. havent bit the bullet yet but tittering on the edge.


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## bob223 (Nov 1, 2016)

DuganNash said:


> Hey. I'm putting together a room and acting as a caregiver for a few people. I was planning on 20 little "beds" with a Nanolux 630w CMH over the top of each. Do you think that'd be overkill and too much light for 20 3x3 spaces? There's 10 foot ceilings.


i would run 315's instead of 630. you will be just fine even if you have high ceilings. with all that overlapping i think the 630 would be overkill i think you could get very similar results with a 315.
If you switch to 315's you could cover that area with 6800 watts with 3x3 spaces. is this an air conditioned room?


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 1, 2016)

Would you recommend 2 single 315's in a 4x4 vs the 630? Or should i stick with only 1 315?


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## DuganNash (Nov 1, 2016)

bob223 said:


> i would run 315's instead of 630. you will be just fine even if you have high ceilings. with all that overlapping i think the 630 would be overkill i think you could get very similar results with a 315.
> If you switch to 315's you could cover that area with 6800 watts with 3x3 spaces. is this an air conditioned room?


An air handling system is being installed with upwards of 40,000 BTUs of cooling on top of it being a cold climate area as well.


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## bob223 (Nov 1, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> Would you recommend 2 single 315's in a 4x4 vs the 630? Or should i stick with only 1 315?





thccbdhealth said:


> Would you recommend 2 single 315's in a 4x4 vs the 630? Or should i stick with only 1 315?


well you could murder a 4x4 with two 315's. But one would do the trick.

4x4 is a weird shape to shove two 315's into but im sure you could make it work. if you could find a 3x6 area that would be great.
3 of them in a 4x4 space seems to work well. I guess if you are set on two lamps in a 4x4 i would think about the sun system commercial they put out a 2x4 foot print or so.
That fixture not available in 120v


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 1, 2016)

Nanolux is available @ 120v. Im starting to relizeing that to run most other lights I'd also be needing a step down transfer. 

I could find the 3x6 space if i could find a tent that was 3x6 or 4x6..
Im on a tight budget at the moment and the 630 is a little costly right now but the cost of 2 315's is slightly more..
so if i could get the pound i need off a single 315 and potentially get a secound later on....it would cost more in the long run but easyer to obtain starting point..... or jist night the bullet for 2 bulbs off the get go.... but then again. Same fixtre-horizontal bulbs-8"tall or 2 separate fixtures-vertical bulbs-13" tall.


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## bob223 (Nov 1, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> Nanolux is available @ 120v. Im starting to relizeing that to run most other lights I'd also be needing a step down transfer.
> 
> I could find the 3x6 space if i could find a tent that was 3x6 or 4x6..
> Im on a tight budget at the moment and the 630 is a little costly right now but the cost of 2 315's is slightly more..
> so if i could get the pound i need off a single 315 and potentially get a secound later on....it would cost more in the long run but easyer to obtain starting point..... or jist night the bullet for 2 bulbs off the get go.... but then again. Same fixtre-horizontal bulbs-8"tall or 2 separate fixtures-vertical bulbs-13" tall.


1 lb is attainable but may be a struggle for some growers. If you have access to good yield genetics and know what you are doing you can hit 1 lb per lamp with the 315. i would get 1 315 and get it dial in well saving for another before buying a 630. that is just me

Im not in an area where i can just go buy quality genetics i would think that most everything i run is some where in the middle of the road when it comes to yield but i have hit a lb per lamp every run for the last few months. before that i was getting 12-14oz

when it comes to tents i dont think you will have much luck finding odd dimension tents. you could always get a bigger tent and fill it with lamps over time. you could do a 4x8 tent and only use 4x6. you could even get that panda/ orca film. That is just an option ot build a room to the dimensions that you need


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## DemonTrich (Nov 1, 2016)

I'm running 3x600 in a 8x12x7 room (center of room is offest 2.5'). Wonder how 4x 315s would fare next to my 3x600 runs? I do run ac, co2. I do pretty well, its dialed I n nicely. Cost of the lamps aren't that important, but not dropping 4k on lamps either. Was gonna swap the 3x600 for 3x1000 since winter is here. Free cold air.

Or drop 3 of these bulbs, source ballasts, use my current ac hoods setup

http://www.htgsupply.com/products/hypar-315-watt-cmh-bulb-by-agromax


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 1, 2016)

Are you running the 4200k or the 3100k?


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 1, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> I'm running 3x600 in a 8x12x7 room (center of room is offest 2.5'). Wonder how 4x 315s would fare next to my 3x600 runs? I do run ac, co2. I do pretty well, its dialed I n nicely. Cost of the lamps aren't that important, but not dropping 4k on lamps either. Was gonna swap the 3x600 for 3x1000 since winter is here. Free cold air.
> 
> Or drop 3 of these bulbs, source ballasts, use my current ac hoods setup
> 
> http://www.htgsupply.com/products/hypar-315-watt-cmh-bulb-by-agromax


4 315s would destroy 3 600s IMO.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 1, 2016)

Would 3x315s be equal in yeild to 3x600? This way I wouldn't have to move my hoods around. Not hard anyways, but


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## ttystikk (Nov 1, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Would 3x315s be equal in yeild to 3x600? This way I wouldn't have to move my hoods around. Not hard anyways, but


From what people tell me, a 315W CMH is roughly equivalent to 500W of HPS.


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## DuganNash (Nov 1, 2016)

Do equivalent watts of CMH run cooler than HPS or MH? Are three 315w CMH gonna put off the same heat as something like a single 1000w Gavita HPS.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 1, 2016)

DuganNash said:


> Do equivalent watts of CMH run cooler than HPS or MH? Are three 315w CMH gonna put off the same heat as something like a single 1000w Gavita HPS.


I'd say 3 315s is probably more like a SE 1000 as far as heat goes.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 1, 2016)

DuganNash said:


> Do equivalent watts of CMH run cooler than HPS or MH? Are three 315w CMH gonna put off the same heat as something like a single 1000w Gavita HPS.


I've been telling people to have 2,000btu of cooling for each 315 and that will cover any equipment in the room also (dehumidifier, pumps, co2 generator, ect).


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 1, 2016)

What temperature color are you guys running? 4200k over 3100k?


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## DuganNash (Nov 1, 2016)

Hmm. Maybe I'll scale it down to 12 4x4s with a Nanolux 630 over each. That footprint might be too large, but I've got access to a few discounted Nanolux 630s, that's largely why I'm considering them. That'd make life a lot easier.


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## bob223 (Nov 1, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> What temperature color are you guys running? 4200k over 3100k?


Most of the people in the thread run the 3100k i think Ttystikk was running 4200k for veg?


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 1, 2016)

DuganNash said:


> Hmm. Maybe I'll scale it down to 12 4x4s with a Nanolux 630 over each. That footprint might be too large, but I've got access to a few discounted Nanolux 630s, that's largely why I'm considering them. That'd make life a lot easier.


Just remember when going from a 315 over a 3x3 to a 630 over a 4x4 that your loosing 2 square foot of growing space per 630 compared to 2 315s. (18 sq ft with 2 315s vs 16 sq ft with a single 630). Therefore if you wee changing the 315s for 630s, watt for watt,(which I can see that you are not) in that room you'd be loosing 20 sq ft of canopy area or 2.5lbs per harvest. 

This is just a consideration to put into thought before buying the 630.


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## GroErr (Nov 1, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> Would you recommend 2 single 315's in a 4x4 vs the 630? Or should i stick with only 1 315?


2x 315's can cover 3.5 x 7'


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## DuganNash (Nov 1, 2016)

Haha. I'm trying to glean some positives to using the 630s, but it's getting difficult.


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 1, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> I too have been looking at the nanolux 630, im doing a medical 4x4. Fixture and bulbs shipping and exchange rate make it a 960 dollar light. havent bit the bullet yet but tittering on the edge.


i run 3 of them, and they are hot. like


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## Woodfella (Nov 1, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> I've been telling people to have 2,000btu of cooling for each 315 and that will cover any equipment in the room also (dehumidifier, pumps, co2 generator, ect).


Wasn't enough this summer  
350 sq ft vol, 4 lec, dehu, 8k btu= 93* in


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## ttystikk (Nov 2, 2016)

DuganNash said:


> Haha. I'm trying to glean some positives to using the 630s, but it's getting difficult.


That's because spreading the light out is always better.


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 2, 2016)

Well, I might just pull the trigger on 3x 315 and use them in veg for starters. 

Time to start digging thru pages and pages of hoods.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 2, 2016)

Woodfella said:


> Wasn't enough this summer
> 350 sq ft vol, 4 lec, dehu, 8k btu= 93* in


What brand and style AC were you using?

350sq ft is a HUGE space for 4 lights. Most people have 100 sq ft for 4 lights.


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## Javadog (Nov 2, 2016)

I was curious about that space as well....comes out to around an 18' square.....


----------



## genuity (Nov 2, 2016)

3.5 x 6 3 315lec
 
Last week's pics..will update this week pics.


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## Javadog (Nov 2, 2016)

Genuity Killing it!


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 2, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Well, I might just pull the trigger on 3x 315 and use them in veg for starters.
> 
> Time to start digging thru pages and pages of hoods.


Or just hang them bare.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 2, 2016)

In veg I don't run ac. All 6x600 are in air cooled hoods. If I run open bulbs, or no glass, I might have heat issues. They make an adapter for a mogul socket to take a Phillips 315 bulb


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

if ur gonna run sealed hoods i would go with the non-open rated lamps. It'll save a layer of glass to go thru.

http://www.ceramicmh.com/CDM-T9-ELITE-315W930E_p_738.html


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## genuity (Nov 2, 2016)

Better pics of the plants..first set is DB#2
 
this set is DB#1
 
I'll more than likely bend the top on some..

Also running 2-630de bulbs/AC-DE hoods on galaxy ballast,on the other side of the room...


----------



## GroErr (Nov 2, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> In veg I don't run ac. All 6x600 are in air cooled hoods. If I run open bulbs, or no glass, I might have heat issues. They make an adapter for a mogul socket to take a Phillips 315 bulb


There are T12 to mogul adapters around, saw some on ebay and the like. They also make a mogul version of the 315, they're just difficult to find but they're out there. Best place was advancedtechlighting.com but they shut the site down a while back


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## DemonTrich (Nov 2, 2016)

Adapters
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B01L13GQXY/ref=mp_s_a_1_34?ie=UTF8&qid=1478103428&sr=8-34&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_FMwebp_QL65&keywords=315+cmh&dpPl=1&dpID=414Qd2dWH8L&ref=plSrch

Bulbs
http://www.ceramicmh.com/CDM-T9-ELITE-315W930E_p_738.html

Then I just need to source the ballasts.


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

every CMH ballast has some bad reviews. i run 6 sunplix, not avalible online tho. if ur going online i would choose by CSM, and return policies.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 2, 2016)

I refuse to run anything from hydrofarm. Shit ass products. Galaxy has a ballast.

http://www.horticulturesource.com/product_info.php?products_id=24632&gclid=CjwKEAjwnebABRCjpvr13dHL8DsSJABB-ILJuP5zR5mu3MdA6wXs2j0g_msLPy_-TyxQ6h8eqqBxExoCtKLw_wcB


----------



## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

have any of you seen the


DemonTrich said:


> I refuse to run anything from hydrofarm. Shit ass products. Galaxy has a ballast.
> 
> http://www.horticulturesource.com/product_info.php?products_id=24632&gclid=CjwKEAjwnebABRCjpvr13dHL8DsSJABB-ILJuP5zR5mu3MdA6wXs2j0g_msLPy_-TyxQ6h8eqqBxExoCtKLw_wcB


 
could always call them. sure they can help


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 2, 2016)

Is that not a phantom II copy? Alot of bad reviews on the phantomII as well.


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

to be honest idk, cuz i can get u 5 of them unbranded for 500 from china. looks dead on to them both. though this plant just opened.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 2, 2016)

I'd like to stick with local incase I need warranty return.


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

yea, i get all my hardware local... returns, service, and keep money in the area all good reasons. think ima part with my nanolux, and get 6 more of the remote ballast. when i IR the ballast it runs around 100*, be nice to remove that from the room and spread the lights out abit more. they also make a 315w & 630w DE lamp.


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## ttystikk (Nov 2, 2016)

GroErr said:


> There are T12 to mogul adapters around, saw some on ebay and the like. They also make a mogul version of the 315, they're just difficult to find but they're out there. Best place was advancedtechlighting.com but they shut the site down a while back


Not sure what was up with that guy, I got mine from him shortly before it went out of business. He acted weird, wanted me to keep bugging him until he got the order or to me- so I did. It still took a week. 

I ended up with a dozen of his Philips ballasts and a dozen mogul socket base 315W CMH lights in 4100K. I use them (not all of them, only a few!) in veg where they stomp serious ass for me.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 2, 2016)

Ok, so ordering my upgrade shortly

3x315cmh in veg
Phillips bulbs made for enclosed hoods, 3x mogul socket adapters
3x ballasts

4x315 cmh for flower
Phillips bulbs made for enclosed hoods, 4x mogul socket adapters
4x ballasts
1 more big kahuna hood

Waiting for sunplix.com to get back to me about 7 ballasts.

Looks like another room reformat/rebuild.

Edit:
Almost forgot, I'll buy 4x 315 bulbs (2x 3100, 2x4200) and 2x ballasts as backups.


----------



## Javadog (Nov 2, 2016)

Good luck!


----------



## GroErr (Nov 2, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Not sure what was up with that guy, I got mine from him shortly before it went out of business. He acted weird, wanted me to keep bugging him until he got the order or to me- so I did. It still took a week.
> 
> I ended up with a dozen of his Philips ballasts and a dozen mogul socket base 315W CMH lights in 4100K. I use them (not all of them, only a few!) in veg where they stomp serious ass for me.


Yeah I'd heard someone mention some health issues, maybe he just got out. Went to the site a few months back to check his pricing for a conversation on the lamps and poof, gone!


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## ttystikk (Nov 2, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Yeah I'd heard someone mention some health issues, maybe he just got out. Went to the site a few months back to check his pricing for a conversation on the lamps and poof, gone!


AFAIK, the site has been down for a year.

Bummer.


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## GroErr (Nov 2, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> AFAIK, the site has been down for a year.
> 
> Bummer.


Yeah would like to know his source, haven't seen anything close to what his prices were for a combo ballast/bulb and they were Philips ballasts. Can't believe that site's been down that long, seemed like a few months back, like beginning of summer!


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## DemonTrich (Nov 2, 2016)

It's always crappy when a good spot for hard parts goes down.


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## Woodfella (Nov 2, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> What brand and style AC were you using?
> 
> 350sq ft is a HUGE space for 4 lights. Most people have 100 sq ft for 4 lights.


350 is the volume
50 sq on the floor.
1_4x8 flood table w 4 315's
8k window unit, insulated plenum in


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

so I was about to order a nanolux 315 when I read someone's post regarding them potential setting off their nanolux for a model with a remote ballast... was wondering whom that other unit was made by.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 2, 2016)

From distributor for sunplix.com in michigan area.....

"greetings.....My name is Ray, and I am the Sunplix distributor for Michigan. Price for ballast with phillips 3100K bulb and remote is $. $280. If you order more than 4...the price goes down a bit."

Hell of a price. I'm sure I can get 4x 3100k and 4x4200k bulb mix. Bulbs alone are 75 (average). If I can get 9 for 1800, I'll give them a go.


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

absolutely no information about any fixture on their site


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

facebook, https://m.facebook.com/groups/248519675519386?refid=17&_ft_=top_level_post_id.208328632910201:tl_objid.208328632910201:thid.100011991976277:306061129499414:2:0:1480579199:-980762182575327275


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

I have to wait till I'm accepted into the group, your personaly running nanolux 630's. are you recommending this fixture over the nanolux's ? I'm looking at a 315 in a 4x4 tent


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> I have to wait till I'm accepted into the group, your personaly running nanolux 630's. are you recommending this fixture over the nanolux's ? I'm looking at a 315 in a 4x4 tent


yes i run nanolux 630`s(3 of them). ina rent i would definatly recomened the remote ballast, it becomes a real pain in the ass trying to arrange everything around the fact the ballast sticks off the back and cant be moved, but a have pulled the same off of the 630's per 4×4 that i did with 1k HPS, but the radiant heat is at or above that of the 1k. only say that becuase i coild work under my 1k's,.... i turn the 630s off, that shit damn near gave me a sunburn.

so imho i would recommend 1-2 remote 315's in a 4×4 over a 630


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

I will have an exhaust fan and charcoal filter at 420cfm for the 4x4x6.5
I haven't came across any 120v fixtures with remote ballast's
but thankyou 2 315's over a 630.... now if I can find alternative fixture

in this case ill probabley start with one 315 in there


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

I had been looking at the phantom because of the remote ballast but I found more negative reviews about the phantom not working v.s none about the nanolux


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## DemonTrich (Nov 2, 2016)

Buddy who works at a grow store runs (well ran 3x phantom), 2 ballasts burnt in 40 days, 3rd one 3 months. There's a phantom and a phantomII. Not sure if both are crap or?


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

well, do us all a favor and check back in with him now, and see what he's running, then inform this CDL Community


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## DemonTrich (Nov 2, 2016)

1st Gen

Wonder how the II are? I'd rock them vs the Sunplix ones if they last


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

sunplix, you talk of them aswell, but there not a remote Ballast... and the bulbs horizontal... so why a sunplix over phantom or Nanolux?


----------



## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> sunplix, you talk of them aswell, but there not a remote Ballast... and the bulbs horizontal... so why a sunplix over phantom or Nanolux?


they are a remote ballast, they just sell it as a complete set also. it can fire upto 66'


----------



## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

whats the price per unit?


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 2, 2016)

With the sunplix, their ballast uses a normal digital/mag hps/Mh plug, the Phantom uses a totally different plug type. I was hoping to just do a bulb and ballast swap, and add a new hood to the flower room. Not run all new wires.


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> With the sunplix, their ballast uses a normal digital/mag hps/Mh plug, the Phantom uses a totally different plug type. I was hoping to just do a bulb and ballast swap, and add a new hood to the flower room. Not run all new wires.


they sell a hyrdofarm to "s" type adapter, for the phantoms but then u need to add the 10-15$ per adapter. adds up quick


DemonTrich said:


> With the sunplix, their ballast uses a normal digital/mag hps/Mh plug, the Phantom uses a totally different plug type. I was hoping to just do a bulb and ballast swap, and add a new hood to the flower room. Not run all new wires.


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> whats the price per unit?


i got mine for 215ea.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

I hope I come across a deal like that in my travels around the world wide web.....
I can drive into Dakota but I don't know what good that would do me for finding one


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

love the time of purchase.


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

so the Phantom being sold now is the second model and is good to go? 
am I wrong to think Nanolux is the better Technology and "Name" behind them?
wouldn't a 315 Nanolux in a 4x4 tent be adequately cooled with a 420 cfm circulation that's air volume circulated every 15 seconds?...


----------



## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

cant really make that out, but looks like 2200 for 5 lights?


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> so the Phantom being sold now is the second model and is good to go?
> am I wrong to think Nanolux is the better Technology and "Name" behind them?
> wouldn't a 315 Nanolux in a 4x4 tent be adequately cooled with a 420 cfm circulation that's air volume circulated every 15 seconds?...


If the ballast being on it doesnt bother u then, yes i would pick nanolux over sunplix..... then again might be because i got the CEO's cell number, LOL,


ps. but seriously the 400cfm will be more then enuff for the 315, but not enuff for a 630.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

well fuck me, I'm that New, I don't Even Know - if you on good terms with him, Ask him if he has interest in reaching the Canadian Market. I've had a hard time finding a dealer for there fixtures or anyone other then Gavita around here....so I'm left with bghydro


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

I thought they put off less heat then a 600 hps and a better spectrum, better quality and the same yield but usually the ballast is outside the tent or located on the wall?


the Nanolux is the alternative model over a 6oow hps cool tube or a gavita 6/750 flex both from the local shop


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

5 hoods, ballast, lamps, sockets,and rachets for 2200 after tax.


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

wa


thccbdhealth said:


> I thought they put off less heat then a 600 hps and a better spectrum, better quality and the same yield but usually the ballast is outside the tent or located on the wall?
> 
> 
> the Nanolux is the alternative model over a 6oow hps cool tube or a gavita 6/750 flex both from the local shop


the gravita can run 630DE i believe.
nvm they are not compatable...
go with the nanolux, Hps are nice but wat more unefficent, the DE's produce even more heat with same unefficency ( damn i need spellcheck)


----------



## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

yah I first wondered that aswell.... and the price point on the gavita is lower, but hot-spot i've been told, and bulbs designed to run hot, and the fixture is high frequency


and ive read the bulb life isn't as long, that's where the fixture with multiple 315's came into play, from what ive been reading on here


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

this will be my first real setup, and the nanolux (610) seamed to be the best choice to be had - at the price of a 600w hps cooltube (430) , and $70 cheeper then the Gavita 6/750 flex



so a single nanolux 315 I'm in 610.00
the 630 i'm in 950.00


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> this will be my first real setup, and the nanolux (610) seamed to be the best choice to be had - at the price of a 600w hps cooltube (430) , and $70 cheeper then the Gavita 6/750 flex


u will save the diffence in wattage alone in your first veg/flower cycle, verus either of those.


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

so go with the single 315 in there, because the 630 is to much heat?


then in a year or so once I'm dialed in.
then supplement with a 200W (4)cob light bar
or just add in another 315 and Bigger Fan??

as many of you sit back and shake your heads*


----------



## Sire Killem All (Nov 2, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> so go with the single 315 in there, because the 630 is to much heat?
> 
> 
> then in a year or so once I'm dialed in.
> ...


go with the COB, sure they'll be on the next big chip craze by then... lol. You could go with an nanolux 630 in the 4 by 4 but I would advise to get these
http://nanoluxtech.com/products/nccs/
so u can have complete control of them to help dial in ur tent..


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

are you saying go with cob over all ?

I think ill start with the single 315, now I have one of those burple led, 300w 145w in reality, is that even worth running? its made by Apallo Horticulture, says the label


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 2, 2016)

so nanolux does apparently have a remot ballast, now I'm wondering how I could incorporate this, I don't know enough

http://growershouse.com/nanolux-cmh-315w-ballast

http://nanoluxtech.com/products/cmh-315w-fixture/


any explanations would be appreciated


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 3, 2016)

DuganNash said:


> Haha. I'm trying to glean some positives to using the 630s, but it's getting difficult.


Also from my research the bulb emits better in the vertical vs. the horizontal position. My 315 crushed a 4x2 tent. I had the plants stuffed in there and they did great.


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 3, 2016)

Can someone please explain the use of flexible insulated ducting, my understanding is that solid pipe, ridged, is far mpre effective yet all i see in peoples pictures is flexible. The difference in resistance is 3-1. 10 feet of flexable is the same resistance as 30 feet of ridged , From what i was tought while doing hvac installs in new residential construction


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## ttystikk (Nov 3, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> Can someone please explain the use of flexible insulated ducting, my understanding is that solid pipe, ridged, is far mpre effective yet all i see in peoples pictures is flexible. The difference in resistance is 3-1. 10 feet of flexable is the same resistance as 30 feet of ridged , From what i was tought while doing hvac installs in new residential construction


You're absolutely right and most growers get their ducting from the hydro store, don't know better and that's what they end up with. 

You should see all the noobs pushing cooling air too, lol


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 3, 2016)

Well I am a Newb By All Account's So;

You should see all the noobs pushing cooling air too, lol ?
by that statement, do you mean they are having the filter and fan mounted together, then all the ducting- - rather then having the filter, some ducting, then fan on the end of all the ducting
What about the principle that's it always easyer to push then to pull?
What would be the best setup with ridged ducting.

or are you meaning intake fans, rather then natural draft threw ports creating a vacuum and pulling out the moisture from the tent


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## ttystikk (Nov 3, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> Well I am a Newb By All Account's So;
> 
> You should see all the noobs pushing cooling air too, lol ?
> by that statement, do you mean they are having the filter and fan mounted together, then all the ducting- - rather then having the filter, some ducting, then fan on the end of all the ducting
> ...


Pushing air compresses and heats it. MUCH better to draw cooling air than push it.


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 3, 2016)

would I be able to send you a private message somehow ttystikk


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## DemonTrich (Nov 3, 2016)

2400 from sunplix (remote ballasts only, not the new style knob adjustable/od type)

9 ballasts
9 bulbs
7 adapters


Waiting to hear from nanolux with a quote, but with the Phillips 21837 CDM-T9-ELITE bulbs x 7, like above. 

I'll post the price when I get it


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## Javadog (Nov 3, 2016)

One of things to remember about ducting...(tho I am forgetting! :^) is that
bends equal extra distance. 

"For example, each elbow used is equivalent to 30 feet of straight pipe or duct."

Ah, here


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## DemonTrich (Nov 3, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Pushing air compresses and heats it. MUCH better to draw cooling air than push it.



I do a push/pull thru both sets of hoods in 2 rooms. I also run seperate intake/exhaust and scrubbers not in line with my hood set up. Both veg and flower have 2x8" 720cfm.


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 3, 2016)

what are you running for hoods?


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## DemonTrich (Nov 3, 2016)

6x big kahuna, about to be 7.


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## Yodaweed (Nov 3, 2016)

Does a 315 lec yield the same as a 600w hps?


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## DemonTrich (Nov 3, 2016)

Yes and no

315 uses 2.6a
600hps/Mh uses 4.5

315 have much better par, avb and light output comparable to the sun vs mh/hps. 

315 put out less heat, therefore less work your ac has to do.

Light penetration is about the same for both.


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 3, 2016)

is it plausible to yield a pound off a 315 as you would off a 600 in a 4x4 - better spectrum, better flowers, more cbd production, half the power consumption, But is the yield there


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## Evil-Mobo (Nov 3, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> is it plausible to yield a pound off a 315 as you would off a 600 in a 4x4 - better spectrum, better flowers, more cbd production, half the power consumption, But is the yield there


I think with a long veg time yes. My first plant ever was a northern lights vegged for 8 weeks and in a 3x3 by itself under a 315 LEC I could have easily had two plants it's size in there so double the yield.....?

It gave me a 1/2 p dried and cured.......


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 3, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> is it plausible to yield a pound off a 315 as you would off a 600 in a 4x4 - better spectrum, better flowers, more cbd production, half the power consumption, But is the yield there


Yes.


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 3, 2016)

so then it should be a simply Choice, I'm far better off running a 315cmh over a 600hps at this point in time with todays tech?


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 3, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> so then it should be a simply Choice, I'm far better off running a 315cmh over a 600hps at this point in time with todays tech?


No question.


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## Evil-Mobo (Nov 3, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> No question.


I second this


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## DuganNash (Nov 3, 2016)

So it's just about equal price to outfit this room with *12 - 630w CMHs in 4x4* vs *20 - 315w CMHs in 3x3*. The 630w variation would technically get me 12sqft more canopy and around 1000w more overall, but go over the recommended 3x3 footprint with potentially more light crossover. The 315w variation is the exact opposite. Do you guys think at this point it's nitpicking and both would yield similar overall results?


----------



## Pig4buzz (Nov 3, 2016)

My 315 update got 2 different rooms with these jewels. 
WW & IB 
Shams 
Wk 5


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## bob223 (Nov 4, 2016)

DuganNash said:


> So it's just about equal price to outfit this room with *12 - 630w CMHs in 4x4* vs *20 - 315w CMHs in 3x3*. The 630w variation would technically get me 12sqft more canopy and around 1000w more overall, but go over the recommended 3x3 footprint with potentially more light crossover. The 315w variation is the exact opposite. Do you guys think at this point it's nitpicking and both would yield similar overall results?


I really feel that you would do way better with 20 315's over 12 630's. light will be more evenly distributed and i believe yield will be much better.
I think if you set up a room with either light you will do very well. You will never regret moving to LEC


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 4, 2016)

DuganNash said:


> So it's just about equal price to outfit this room with *12 - 630w CMHs in 4x4* vs *20 - 315w CMHs in 3x3*. The 630w variation would technically get me 12sqft more canopy and around 1000w more overall, but go over the recommended 3x3 footprint with potentially more light crossover. The 315w variation is the exact opposite. Do you guys think at this point it's nitpicking and both would yield similar overall results?


what i am noticing under my 630s is slightly denser nugs wih closer noding, compared to the 315's, but i am runnin them all 3' ofc.
the 630 nanolux fixture to me feels too focused and causes a hot spot. You can basucly bump your hoods up to each other and eliminate that.
my next run will be 3- 4×8 tables 630 in the middle, flanked by 315 on each end. and run a fourth table with 4- 315's..... Unless i can sell off the 630's and get 6 more 315's.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 4, 2016)

I'm switching from 3x600 to 3x315 in flower in an 8x12 (offset 2.5' from center).


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## Yodaweed (Nov 4, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I think with a long veg time yes. My first plant ever was a northern lights vegged for 8 weeks and in a 3x3 by itself under a 315 LEC I could have easily had two plants it's size in there so double the yield.....?
> 
> It gave me a 1/2 p dried and cured.......


I get a pound per 600w hps, let me know if you can achieve that with the 315 thanks.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 4, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> I get a pound per 600w hps, that's about half what I get.



You have hp per 315 vs 1lb with a 600?


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## Yodaweed (Nov 4, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> You have hp per 315 vs 1lb with a 600?


Yea sounds like I would need 2 of those lights to cover the same area as my 600w hps does, my hps does 16 squared feet, this light does 9. Yield is mainly determined by grow area, I don't see how this could yield as much as a 600w hps or a 1000w hps. 3x3 is kinda a small pattern and doesn't match my area I would have a good amount of overlap, i'd have to run 8 of these to cover what 3 of my hps cover. I would wager that would be a whole heap of a lot more heat.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 4, 2016)

1x600 does 16sq'?

I run 6x600s. Never found that good of a spread


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## Yodaweed (Nov 4, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> 1x600 does 16sq'?
> 
> I run 6x600s. Never found that good of a spread


All about your reflector, I use a 6 inch block buster, it puts out a perfect 4x4 square of light.

https://www.amazon.com/Sun-System-904650-Blockbuster-Air-Cooled/dp/B004JKFM14

Perfect for square growing areas (i.e. 4'x4')

Very uniform, square, intense light pattern

6" integrated air-cooled fittings

95% reflective textured German aluminum interior

Completely sealed with neoprene gaskets and hinged glass


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## Yodaweed (Nov 4, 2016)

A magnum xxl reflector will do a 5x7 with a 1000w hps in it, so that's like 35 squared feet and a 1kw gavita does a 4x6 so that's like 24 squared feet.


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## Schmarmpit (Nov 4, 2016)

Anyone ever see or use these 315W CMH bulbs before?:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/LED2020-CDM-TT-Ceramic-Metal-Halide-Light-Bulb-TT-Series-E26-E39-Base-/282013498281


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 4, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> A magnum xxl reflector will do a 5x7 with a 1000w hps in it, so that's like 35 squared feet and a 1kw gavita does a 4x6 so that's like 24 squared feet.


600s don't properly cover a 4x4. 
SE 1000s don't cover a 5x7. 

Can't really argue with the gavita statement. Although I prefer them in a 5x5 to a 4x6. 

A 315 will cover a 3x3. A 630 will cover a 4x4.


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## Yodaweed (Nov 4, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> 600s don't properly cover a 4x4.
> SE 1000s don't cover a 5x7.
> 
> Can't really argue with the gavita statement. Although I prefer them in a 5x5 to a 4x6.
> ...


I use a 600w hps in a 4x4 tent and it covers from wall to wall, I measured with my light meter and have grown plants from wall to wall. It's more about the reflector than anything, a 600w hps will properly cover a 4x4 for sure, that's what they are made for, and a 1000w hps will cover a 5x5, just like a 400w hps will cover a 3x3....even dumb ass grow weed easy knows whats up

http://www.growweedeasy.com/mh-hps-upgrade-guide

Sounds like you guys aren't buying good reflectors.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Nov 4, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> I get a pound per 600w hps, let me know if you can achieve that with the 315 thanks.


Dude what's your fucken issue? I have never directed a comment towards you, was not speaking to you, and no one is challenging anyone to anything, take your ego and your stupidity and shove it. I was answering someone else's question. If you can't grow a unit with a 315 that's your issue not mine right?

If I got a half unit in the past with one plant would it not be a decent guess that a second of the same plant would double the yield if it fit in the space under the light?

AND FYI, there are grow journals on here with guys who do get a pound with a single 315 so get over yourself and your 600W


----------



## Yodaweed (Nov 4, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Dude what's your fucken issue? I have never directed a comment towards you, was not speaking to you, and no one is challenging anyone to anything, take your ego and your stupidity and shove it. I was answering someone else's question. If you can't grow a unit with a 315 that's your issue not mine right?
> 
> If I got a half unit in the past with one plant would it not be a decent guess that a second of the same plant would double the yield if it fit in the space under the light?
> 
> ND FYI, there are grow journals on here with guys who do get a pound with a single 315 so get over yourself and your 600W


Wasn't trying to be rude so don't be so butthurt, I am looking to replace my 3x 600w hps with new lights cause they are getting old and used, Sorry you got bent out of shape about a simple question asking if this light can yield as much as a 600w hps.

Also it doesn't make you tough to act like a tough guy on the internet, I would wager a lot you would never speak to me like that in person.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Nov 4, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> Wasn't trying to be rude so don't be so butthurt, I am looking to replace my 3x 600w hps with new lights cause they are getting old and used, Sorry you got bent out of shape about a simple question asking if this light can yield as much as a 600w hps.
> 
> Also it doesn't make you tough to act like a tough guy on the internet, I would wager a lot you would never speak to me like that in person.


You're hilarious. And yes I would speak to you just like this so no worries there "tough guy" I have seen your passive aggressive bullshit time and time again on here save it for someone else. I'm not butt hurt because you're an ass no worries.


----------



## Yodaweed (Nov 4, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> You're hilarious. And yes I would speak to you just like this so no worries there "tough guy" I have seen your passive aggressive bullshit time and time again on here save it for someone else. I'm not butt hurt because you're an ass no worries.


Go grow your shitty auto plants under your LEDs while I harvest pounds and laugh at you. I bet you don't even have facial hair yet , little boy.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Nov 4, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> Go grow your shitty auto plants under your LEDs while I harvest pounds and laugh at you. I bet you don't even have facial hair yet , little boy.


Big tough guy getting wound up, there you go get angry jackass get angry 

Your old lady likes it when my facial hair tickles her privates


----------



## Yodaweed (Nov 4, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Big tough guy getting wound up, there you go get angry jackass get angry
> 
> Your old lady likes it when my facial hair tickles her privates


You gluing your pubes to your face again? Why don't you post some pictures of your grow so we can get some good laughs.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Nov 4, 2016)

Look at me big tough guy on the internet asking someone for pictures of their grow so I can learn something lol 

I'm not here for your teaching with the shitty attitude you have


----------



## GemuGrows (Nov 4, 2016)

Yoda your crazy dude. I hate getting into stuff like this but you seriously have no idea what your talking about.

LEC 315's are amazing. They make very little heat and have a considerably larger light spread than you think. I swapped from 1000w's and 600w's to LEC 315's and i'll never look back.

Pathetic man. Seriously if your going to say people are gluing pubes on their face then your the one who needs to grow up.

Absolutely pathetic.

Enjoy your 600w hps? I have no problem with that; they are very good lights. But have you ever even used a LEC315? Have you ever even seen one in action? 

Did your wife cheat on you with a LEC 315 or something? I can't imagine why the hell you have so much hate towards them when you clearly don't even know how to run a HPS properly.

God damn god damn. I don't know why you came into this thread to do a shitty job bragging; but seriously don't come back


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## Yodaweed (Nov 4, 2016)

GemuGrows said:


> Yoda your crazy dude. I hate getting into stuff like this but you seriously have no idea what your talking about.
> 
> LEC 315's are amazing. They make very little heat and have a considerably larger light spread than you think. I swapped from 1000w's and 600w's to LEC 315's and i'll never look back.
> 
> ...


Bro your crazy, I asked if these can yield the same as a 600w hps, then people started giving false information about lights like a 600w hps doesn't cover a 4x4 (which they were designed to cover) just looking to replace my lights and I got attacked , gonna defend myself. I want to know if these will yield as much as my 600w hps because it looks like they will not if they can only cover a 3x3 I would need 8 of them to cover the same as my 3 600w hps. A 600w hps with proper reflector covers a 4x4, these seems to be about the same as a 400w hps which covers a 3x3...just looking at upgrading my lights to something better with less heat is all.


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## GemuGrows (Nov 4, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> Bro your crazy, I asked if these can yield the same as a 600w hps, then people started giving false information about lights like a 600w hps doesn't cover a 4x4 (which they were designed to cover) just looking to replace my lights and I got attacked , gonna defend myself. I want to know if these will yield as much as my 600w hps because it looks like they will not if they can only cover a 3x3 I would need 8 of them to cover the same as my 3 600w hps. A 600w hps with proper reflector covers a 4x4, these seems to be about the same as a 400w hps which covers a 3x3...just looking at upgrading my lights to something better with less heat is all.


I gotta say man they are definitely better than a 400w HPS; Imo they are equal to about 500w of HPS with fantastic light penetration; but most importantly full spectrum. I've sold hundreds of HPS lights and i've sold about 50 LEC lights: My LEC customers always came back blown away by how well the lights performed; I've never had a HPS customer come back and rave about their HPS (obviously they are great lights, but LEC are fantastic lights).

In soil experienced growers will easily crop a pound per LEC 315, in hydro i've seen people crop 1.5 lbs per light. Personally i've gotten over a gram per watt and I've yet to fill out a canopy. The buds are frostier than HPS buds i've seen and grown; and the high is better (if you like sativa-like highs at least).

These lights arent worth hating on for any reason at all; you can throw more lights in a room so your plants get light from more angles than HPS; they are dirt cheap on the electricity bill; and they have light bleached more plants than any light i've ever seen. I've had to move up my LEC lights every time i've grown with them because my plants got way too much light- I've not even had that happen to that extent with HPS.

IMO the only HPS that will out perform LEC315 lights with a proper setup is Double Ended HPS; other than that the LEC315 is king. A properly lit LEC315 room will out yield any properly lit HPS room other than DE. And if you are looking at yield watt per watt; the LEC > HPS all day every day no matter how you look at it.

I'll likely never buy another HPS- the LEC lights are greatly superior.

Thats my 0.02; but that is an enormously researched/experienced 0.02 with both lights.

People wanna grow with HPS? Great; they are great lights go ahead. Looking for something amazing and different? LEC lights are great too.

No reason to hate on people for their light choice. Different spaces call for different lights; people have different preferences, etc... I've had happy customers with HPS and i've had happy customers with LEC and i've had 0 unhappy customers between either light.

One of the huge advantage single LEC lights have is that they are vertically hung; when you look at a LEC reflector instead of a magnum it looks like 5 lights are shining down on you.


This is all the same strain.
LEC buds (630w LEC 5x5 800g yield +100g trim) (closeup pics suck)

 
HPS buds (hps 3x3 ~20z yield)




Both lights are great. I see no reason to talk shit about either one.


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## Yodaweed (Nov 4, 2016)

GemuGrows said:


> I gotta say man they are definitely better than a 400w HPS; Imo they are equal to about 500w of HPS with fantastic light penetration; but most importantly full spectrum. I've sold hundreds of HPS lights and i've sold about 50 LEC lights: My LEC customers always came back blown away by how well the lights performed; I've never had a HPS customer come back and rave about their HPS (obviously they are great lights, but LEC are fantastic lights).
> 
> In soil experienced growers will easily crop a pound per LEC 315, in hydro i've seen people crop 1.5 lbs per light. Personally i've gotten over a gram per watt and I've yet to fill out a canopy. The buds are frostier than HPS buds i've seen and grown; and the high is better (if you like sativa-like highs at least).
> 
> ...


I'm looking to cover at least a 5x10 area, I use 3x 600w hps to do it right now, I was looking at the air cooled 630 lec as a possible replacement, maybe two of those instead , how much heat does that make? I like the hps , I have leds (not super impressed) , and I really like the AC/DE 1000w DE as an option but I am unsure if could run that in my room cause I have limited height 7 foot ceilings. I have a 14,000 btu air conditioner and I air cool my hoods. Getting about 3 pounds per run trying to up the yields as much as I can.


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## GemuGrows (Nov 4, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> I'm looking to cover at least a 5x10 area, I use 3x 600w hps to do it right now, I was looking at the air cooled 630 lec as a possible replacement, maybe two of those instead , how much heat does that make? I like the hps , I have leds (not super impressed) , and I really like the AC/DE 1000w DE as an option but I am unsure if could run that in my room cause I have limited height 7 foot ceilings. I have a 14,000 btu air conditioner and I air cool my hoods. Getting about 3 pounds per run trying to up the yields as much as I can.


You could get by with 2-3 LEC 315 lights in a 4x8; hell you could get by with 2x LEC 315 in a 4x8.

I see no reason to run air cooled; these lights will bleach your plants if they are too close. You need to keep them high up. Just have good exhaust on your space and fans cutting between your lights and your canopy's and you will be fine. These lights seriously make so little heat it will blow your mind.

5x10 I would do 4-5 LEC 315 lights at "max height" depending on how much head space you have.

An incredible option would be to run both LEC and HPS. You could do something like *[ (LEC)-(600w magnum)-(LEC)-(600w magnum)-(LEC) ]* and that would kick ass; I have a buddy running a *[LEC-1000w-LEC]* room that is performing incredibly well (its actually pretty insane).


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## Evil-Mobo (Nov 4, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> I'm looking to cover at least a 5x10 area, I use 3x 600w hps to do it right now, I was looking at the air cooled 630 lec as a possible replacement, maybe two of those instead , how much heat does that make? I like the hps , I have leds (not super impressed) , and I really like the AC/DE 1000w DE as an option but I am unsure if could run that in my room cause I have limited height 7 foot ceilings. I have a 14,000 btu air conditioner and I air cool my hoods. Getting about 3 pounds per run trying to up the yields as much as I can.


Keep your 600W setups and wait for this bulb to drop:

http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/ceramic-hps.aspx


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## GemuGrows (Nov 4, 2016)

the #1 tip I have on having a solid yield of solid nug is:

Keep your plants "short". Like between 3-4 feet. Lolly pop them so you have 1-2 feet of nug and virtually nothing under that. If you max your canopy with 1-2 feet of nugs you will max your light in most spaces and end up with fat dank nugs. Sorry to re post this pic but literally just like this:
 

I do a severe lollypop right before bloom (~2-3 days before) and then another minor one about 3 weeks from flip to take off the last few branches that clearly won't get much light.

If you have good light coverage then that tip above is my #1 grower tip for ANYBODY (unless you have like a 25 light double ended HPS room; then feel free to grow trees and space them out)


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## Javadog (Nov 4, 2016)

I would like to consider swapping out my 600W HPS bulb for that.

When might it be available? What would be expected MSRP? (w/ Ballast)


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## Evil-Mobo (Nov 4, 2016)

Javadog said:


> I would like to consider swapping out my 600W HPS bulb for that.
> 
> When might it be available? What would be expected MSRP? (w/ Ballast)


Not sure yet waiting to hear every month is next month for a while now. I believe that ceramic HPS will change the game a bit and bring them back closer to competiting with COB's but that's just a huge guess on my end.

I am liking my transition to COB's so far in testing the 5K for veg and the 3K for flower. 

Lot less heat than the 1K and 600w bulbs. Took the Portable A/C down yesterday. But if it was not for COB's my 5x9 would be lined with 315's and the veg tent would have one too simple as that. One of my favorite lights I have used to date aside from the Quantum Bad Boy 8 Bulb T5, which you just can't beat for a good all around light IMHO with the ability to change bulbs/spectrum so easily and cheaply. 

There's no one simple box answer, every grow is different.


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## Yodaweed (Nov 4, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Keep your 600W setups and wait for this bulb to drop:
> 
> http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/ceramic-hps.aspx


*Ceramic HPS should only be operated on EYE HORTILUX Gold Series eBallast. - See more at: http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/ceramic-hps.aspx#sthash.AV8JpX8R.dpuf
kinda scares me putting that in hood with my galaxy grow amp ballast , its not an eye hortilux gold series eballast...anyone willing to test?

Also lumen output is really weak

http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/CHPS600-PerformanceSpecs.aspx

34k lumens initial output and I think a 600w hps bulb does 90k if I am not mistaken.


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## Evil-Mobo (Nov 4, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> *Ceramic HPS should only be operated on EYE HORTILUX Gold Series eBallast. - See more at: http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/ceramic-hps.aspx#sthash.AV8JpX8R.dpuf
> kinda scares me putting that in hood with my galaxy grow amp ballast , its not an eye hortilux gold series eballast...anyone willing to test?


I just had three gold series ballast blow on me in the last month, they felt so bad they upgraded me to a 1K platinum on the last one. They can go suck it with their 600's lol if that's the case. I am waiting for the bulb to be released to see if it will require their ballast or not. Me thinks they have a bad batch of 600's going out right now.

3 out of 4 went bad within 12 hours of use. Of course the good and fourth one I sold to a buddy lol..........

I was perfectly happy vegging with the Blue MH 600w but got tired of the ballast blowing so built the COB light which is rocking the veg tent so far and has the T5 collecting dust........


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## Evil-Mobo (Nov 4, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> *Ceramic HPS should only be operated on EYE HORTILUX Gold Series eBallast. - See more at: http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/ceramic-hps.aspx#sthash.AV8JpX8R.dpuf
> kinda scares me putting that in hood with my galaxy grow amp ballast , its not an eye hortilux gold series eballast...anyone willing to test?
> 
> Also lumen output is really weak
> ...


Not a fair comparison because different light technologies in the bulbs remember that. We have all already established that depending on grower ability the one 315 is almost as good as a 600W.................

If it was all about lumens only we'd all be rocking T5's right......?


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## rkymtnman (Nov 4, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> Bro your crazy, I asked if these can yield the same as a 600w hps, then people started giving false information about lights like a 600w hps doesn't cover a 4x4 (which they were designed to cover) just looking to replace my lights and I got attacked , gonna defend myself. I want to know if these will yield as much as my 600w hps because it looks like they will not if they can only cover a 3x3 I would need 8 of them to cover the same as my 3 600w hps. A 600w hps with proper reflector covers a 4x4, these seems to be about the same as a 400w hps which covers a 3x3...just looking at upgrading my lights to something better with less heat is all.


from my experience, in my 3x4 my 315 is lacking. maybe 2.5 by 2.5 would be killer.

if i had the space, i would do plants in a circle aroudn a double stacked 315. vert grow would be great for the 315


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## Yodaweed (Nov 4, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I just had three gold series ballast blow on me in the last month, they felt so bad they upgraded me to a 1K platinum on the last one. They can go suck it with their 600's lol if that's the case. I am waiting for the bulb to be released to see if it will require their ballast or not. Me thinks they have a bad batch of 600's going out right now.
> 
> 3 out of 4 went bad within 12 hours of use. Of course the good and fourth one I sold to a buddy lol..........
> 
> I was perfectly happy vegging with the Blue MH 600w but got tired of the ballast blowing so built the COB light which is rocking the veg tent so far and has the T5 collecting dust........


Yeah their ballasts suck, I wouldn't buy one, these galaxy grow-amps work wonders, they got a over drive mode too 10% more if you into that type thing. I had a quantum ballast before this one, it blew in like 2 weeks and I traded up for this one and that was years ago.


Evil-Mobo said:


> Not a fair comparison because different light technologies in the bulbs remember that. We have all already established that depending on grower ability the one 315 is almost as good as a 600W.................
> 
> If it was all about lumens only we'd all be rocking T5's right......?


http://hydrobuilder.com/sun-system-630-watt-air-cooled-8-lec-fixture-with-dual-4-200k-lamps-208-240-volt.html
This is what I been looking at to replace my hps with, two of those instead of 3 600w hps.


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## Yodaweed (Nov 4, 2016)

rkymtnman said:


> from my experience, in my 3x4 my 315 is lacking. maybe 2.5 by 2.5 would be killer.
> 
> if i had the space, i would do plants in a circle aroudn a double stacked 315. vert grow would be great for the 315


How's the heat in that space? You vent or air condition? How much does that raise the temps during lights on?


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## rkymtnman (Nov 4, 2016)

rkymtnman said:


> from my experience, in my 3x4 my 315 is lacking. maybe 2.5 by 2.5 would be killer.
> 
> if i had the space, i would do plants in a circle aroudn a double stacked 315. vert grow would be great for the 315


and just to reply to myself, check out heath robinson vert grows with a 600 hps. imagine if he had 2 315s instead of the one 600.


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## Evil-Mobo (Nov 4, 2016)

I haven't messed with the 630's myself but there's a couple guys on you tube running them with good success. 

I just think two 315's gives you better flexibility if running different strains etc and you can remote mount the ballasts to help with heat too. This is the same thinking why I built my 8 cob light as 2 separate bars so I can adjust more and each half dims independent of each other. If you do run the 630's then I'd like to see the results myself. I know there's a member here who has a grow log running one in a 4x4 and rocking the house forgot his username would have to search.


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## rkymtnman (Nov 4, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> How's the heat in that space? You vent or air condition? How much does that raise the temps during lights on?


the room is under ground so it stays pretty cool on it's own. no A/c for sure. like i said, i realized last grow that the 315 wasnt quite enough so i added a solarstorm 400 to the room

havent run it yet but the heat should be managebale even if i have to bring in some fresh air


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 4, 2016)

GemuGrows said:


> Yoda your crazy dude. I hate getting into stuff like this but you seriously have no idea what your talking about.
> 
> LEC 315's are amazing. They make very little heat and have a considerably larger light spread than you think. I swapped from 1000w's and 600w's to LEC 315's and i'll never look back.
> 
> ...


This is funny, "Did your wife cheat on you with a LEC 315 or something?" 
Doesn't every one here smoke weed??


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 4, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> http://hydrobuilder.com/sun-system-630-watt-air-cooled-8-lec-fixture-with-dual-4-200k-lamps-208-240-volt.html
> This is what I been looking at to replace my hps with, two of those instead of 3 600w hps.


i replaced my 3×1k with 3×630 pulled aroumd the same, may be a little less do to the strains. if u get the lamp without the shield on them.


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## Yodaweed (Nov 5, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> i replaced my 3×1k with 3×630 pulled aroumd the same, may be a little less do to the strains. if u get the lamp without the shield on them.


How much heat are those making? Do you use a tent ? Do you air condition? Thanks.


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## GemuGrows (Nov 5, 2016)

I really think for larger home grow areas (between 630w and 4000w) a mix of HPS and LEC can perform incredibly wel.



IMO an individual 630w LEC fixture is overkill. Any time i've had 2x lec 315 lights next to each other it has been too much light (far too much).

I think the 3 most ideal fixture setups are:

-Appropriately spaced LEC 315 fixtures
-Appropriately spaced LEC 315 fixtures with some 600-1000w HPS fixtures in between
-Double Ended HPS fixtures (if you have a shitload of room); if your running these you know what you need

But for most of us the first 2 options are ideal. 

these LEC315's are not to be underestimated. Keep them too close and they WILL light bleach your plants; without any heat burn at all- despite their low wattage.

If you have a 5*X grow room (5 foot by X foot) IMO a mix of HPS and LEC would be ideal. If its 4*X foot then you have your choice, if its 3*X foot then pure LEC is ideal.

LEC lights work incredibly well to put in between HPS bulbs to make sure every square inch of your grow space has perfectly adequate light.

Sometimes fitting your space "perfectly" with LEC will be too much light (which hurts plants). 

Sometimes fitting your space "perfectly" with LEC won't be enough light; in which case having a few strategically placed HPS and LEC will do you wonders

And sometimes fitting your room with HPS (especially double ended HPS) is ideal; and maybe even then a few LEC in some lacking spots or corners will help you totally fill your light needs is appropriate. 

The lights can really fill in the holes in the other. Sometimes pure LEC is ideal(very often), sometimes a mix is ideal (very often), and sometimes HPS id ideal.

The beauty with mixing with HPS bulbs is that you get a bunch of hoods to vent from and you fill out your bloom spectrum very well (although i'm honesty not sure if LEC's need that). 



This is tough stuff to explain. Once you work a bunch with both lights you will understand; but in small grows LEC can be perfect- in medium grows LEC with HPS can create an unbelievable light setup. Once you get used to them both you'll be able to craft incredible grow spaces.




Everybody seems to be getting along here now which makes me happy  I'm here if anybody thinks my info is relevant; ask me anything


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## Evil-Mobo (Nov 5, 2016)

GemuGrows said:


> I really think for larger home grow areas (between 630w and 4000w) a mix of HPS and LEC can perform incredibly wel.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Good post and I will agree. On the DE I will add by shitload of room you also need good height.

As I have said previously, the 315's are one of my favorite lights that I have used, and if I wasn't so pleased with my DIY COB testing so far I would basically have a bunch of vertical 315 phillips bulbs running spaced correctly with remote mounted ballast.

Here is the NL I grew under my Sunsystems 315, it netted me a 1/2 unit dry and was my first ever plant to flower out, she had a 2 month veg with mainlining under an 8 bulb T5.


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## GemuGrows (Nov 5, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Good post and I will agree. On the DE I will add by shitload of room you also need good height.
> 
> As I have said previously, the 315's are one of my favorite lights that I have used, and if I wasn't so pleased with my DIY COB testing so far I would basically have a bunch of vertical 315 phillips bulbs running spaced correctly with remote mounted ballast.
> 
> ...


Looking great breh

When I think Double Ended HPS i think Medicropper's garden https://www.youtube.com/user/medicropper/videos
^That dudes a monster

But yeah i gotta say these LEC's have impressed me very much.


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## Evil-Mobo (Nov 5, 2016)

GemuGrows said:


> Looking great breh
> 
> When I think Double Ended HPS i think Medicropper's garden https://www.youtube.com/user/medicropper/videos
> ^That dudes a monster
> ...


That guy is on a whole 'nother level bro lol. Mad respect for grows like that!


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## GemuGrows (Nov 5, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> That guy is on a whole 'nother level bro lol. Mad respect for grows like that!


That homie is watering his garden with some of my technology that I gave him 

Yeah medicropper is where its at man. He pulls some serious chronic with impressive quantities


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## KushyMcKush (Nov 5, 2016)

Very happy with my ss 315! This thing is a beast in my 4x4 (well a 3.5x4.5 closet). I have 6 plants in here and the only areas a notice a lack of production is around the very outside edges so I spin everyone around once a week and keep my smallest girls on the outsides. 4 RD 501st OG, 1 Bodhi ssdd, 1 Bodhi granola funk (very very tiny plant). The only problem I have right now is that it doesn't keep my room warm enough! 65-68F... so I have a heater running during lights on to get it up to 75 lol. I want to add another for next run. What donyou think? Too much for this room? Maybe I should add ~150w of cob to one side just to fill it out? Anyone notice extremely leafy plants with these? 
Day 35
501st og
  

Ssdd
 
Great penetration. This is about 7-8 nodes down.


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 5, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> How much heat are those making? Do you use a tent ? Do you air condition? Thanks.


no, not in a tent. check out my thread, put pretty much everything there


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## DemonTrich (Nov 5, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> Yea sounds like I would need 2 of those lights to cover the same area as my 600w hps does, my hps does 16 squared feet, this light does 9. Yield is mainly determined by grow area, I don't see how this could yield as much as a 600w hps or a 1000w hps. 3x3 is kinda a small pattern and doesn't match my area I would have a good amount of overlap, i'd have to run 8 of these to cover what 3 of my hps cover. I would wager that would be a whole heap of a lot more heat.


I run 3x600mh in a 5x10 tent, them 3x600hps in a 8x12 built room. The light spread per1x600 is no where near adequate to do a 16' spread.


What bulbs you guys running? 31k, 42k, agro, elite cdm?


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## Javadog (Nov 5, 2016)

Yeah Kushy, I am sure that I would prefer to add heat by adding a light
as this would be doubly effective, increasing growth too.


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## ttystikk (Nov 5, 2016)

Javadog said:


> Yeah Kushy, I am sure that I would prefer to add heat by adding a light
> as this would be doubly effective, increasing growth too.


The other way to do this is by adding insulation. No extra power bill that way. If the garden needs more light, put it in there on its own merits.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 5, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> I use a 600w hps in a 4x4 tent and it covers from wall to wall, I measured with my light meter and have grown plants from wall to wall. It's more about the reflector than anything, a 600w hps will properly cover a 4x4 for sure, that's what they are made for, and a 1000w hps will cover a 5x5, just like a 400w hps will cover a 3x3....even dumb ass grow weed easy knows whats up
> 
> http://www.growweedeasy.com/mh-hps-upgrade-guide
> 
> Sounds like you guys aren't buying good reflectors.


I disagree. We will leave it at that.


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 5, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> I disagree. We will leave it at that.


maybe in a tent but i always felt like the 5×5 in open with a 1k was lacking around the edges. 
ran a 1k a 4×4 open and once in a tent with a sealed hoodand could see the diffenceversus the types. so I imagine a 630 work in a 4×4 open area and Up too a 5×5 in a tent behind glass.


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## DuganNash (Nov 5, 2016)

You guys have convinced me. Gonna go with the twenty 3x3 315W setup with about 3-4 plants each. Possibly add a DE here or there in the future. Thanks for the info.


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## bob223 (Nov 5, 2016)

DuganNash said:


> You guys have convinced me. Gonna go with the twenty 3x3 315W setup with about 3-4 plants each. Possibly add a DE here or there in the future. Thanks for the info.


HELL YES im excited for you!!!!


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## Pig4buzz (Nov 5, 2016)

WW &. IB update 315 in 3x4 closet. 4 girls day 39 flip should be good yield. First photos under 315


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## bob223 (Nov 5, 2016)

Here is some LEC Grown Bud. 
This is a super stinky northern Lights that i run often. Potency and smell are top notch yeild is alright.


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## GemuGrows (Nov 5, 2016)

Looks amazing bob- you did good



Evil-Mobo said:


> Here is the NL I grew under my Sunsystems 315, it netted me a 1/2 unit dry and was my first ever plant to flower out, she had a 2 month veg with mainlining under an 8 bulb T5.
> 
> View attachment 3823148


The stalk on that plant is huge


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 5, 2016)

DuganNash said:


> You guys have convinced me. Gonna go with the twenty 3x3 315W setup with about 3-4 plants each. Possibly add a DE here or there in the future. Thanks for the info.


are you doing aircooled? If so use the 315 that doesnt have the outer glass.


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 5, 2016)

this would be over kill, this will run 2 DE630 lamps.



http://hydrobuilder.com/nanolux-de-dual-fixture-600wx2-208-240v.html?utm_source=google&utm_medium=shopping&utm_campaign=DEFNC-600x2&gclid=Cj0KEQjwhvbABRDOp4rahNjh-tMBEiQA0QgTGuFvThvRmAK5DT9XPUDkmU9kB-hWizyUkJnq-k0Vqh8aAvrg8P8HAQ


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## bob223 (Nov 5, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> this would be over kill, this will run 2 DE630 lamps.
> 
> http://hydrobuilder.com/nanolux-de-dual-fixture-600wx2-208-240v.html?utm_source=google&utm_medium=shopping&utm_campaign=DEFNC-600x2&gclid=Cj0KEQjwhvbABRDOp4rahNjh-tMBEiQA0QgTGuFvThvRmAK5DT9XPUDkmU9kB-hWizyUkJnq-k0Vqh8aAvrg8P8HAQ


holy S%*#..... those are badass. for $1049 you would get to run 4 630 DE lamps? there is a guy on youtube running one 630 DE in a 5x5 and getting great results. Growers choice is the only one i know of making the bulb. I think if Philips ever got on board DE LEC could become a real thing but till then it will kinda be a novelty....... A kick ass novelty


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## ttystikk (Nov 5, 2016)

bob223 said:


> holy S%*#..... those are badass. for $1049 you would get to run 4 630 DE lamps? there is a guy on youtube running one 630 DE in a 5x5 and getting great results. Growers choice is the only one i know of making the bulb. I think if Philips ever got on board DE LEC could become a real thing but till then it will kinda be a novelty....... A kick ass novelty


It's already a novelty; COB LED is better now and will only continue to improve vs HID.


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## DuganNash (Nov 5, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> are you doing aircooled? If so use the 315 that doesnt have the outer glass.


I was going to use the Nanolux 315s to take advantage of their wireless control software. The room will be AC'd with an air handler system.


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## KushyMcKush (Nov 6, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> The other way to do this is by adding insulation. No extra power bill that way. If the garden needs more light, put it in there on its own merits.


The room is already well insulated. It was built by the previous owners of the home out in the shed and used as a meat locker. They were big hunters. If I need more light and more heat though... then why not just kill two birds and just add a second light? I am going back and forth between a second 315 and cobs though. I feel 2 315's in a 4x4 may be a little overkill. I can, however, move everything into the adjacent room which is 4.5x5.5 and I think two 315s would fill that up nicely. I figure for the price of another ss 315 I could build about 250-300w of cob which may be more power, yes? I haven't sat down and done the math yet but just from the little research I have done that seems about right.


----------



## DuganNash (Nov 7, 2016)

What height plant do you guys usually aim for with your 315s?


----------



## GroErr (Nov 7, 2016)

DuganNash said:


> What height plant do you guys usually aim for with your 315s?


Myself, I found over time that 36-42" from soil after stretch would get about the most out of them, penetration is good so the taller plants can take advantage of that for better yields.


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## KushyMcKush (Nov 7, 2016)

DuganNash said:


> What height plant do you guys usually aim for with your 315s?


Mine are all 36"-38" tall from the soil. Light is hung ~24" from canopy.


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 7, 2016)

i dont really measure to much, jus close... had them around 15" once i measured. but im not that good at growing so i let them get unruley alot room ranges from 28" plants to 60" plants.


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 8, 2016)

so I'm getting together a med 4x4, Have been told a 4x4 tent will be better with a 315 over a 630 from users on here, for heat and light distribution, however when I call store's Ready to order, then listen to them saying a 315 will not be enough light....and suggest running a 630 instead
I have been following this forum and the consensus is a set of 2 individual 315's is better then a 630 hood, enclosing 2 315's -

If I stick with one 315, and do find out I need more light, what would be the suggestions
What are some of you other guys finding?
Is anyone else running solely a 315 in a 4x4?
my needs are about a QP a month, so I'm thinking a LB per harvest


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## Javadog (Nov 8, 2016)

With the right genetics, I am sure that one 315 and a 4' tent
can make that happen. I am running my first such cycle but
the results are very good.

Now, I am only now about to move plants to the walls, as I intend
to add seven new plants (taking me from a 3X3 to a 4X4) so I will
know better soon.

The reality is that one 315 is probably just a shade less than one
wants for a 4X4 ....but *half* what one needs is just not true. :0)

JD


----------



## GroErr (Nov 8, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> so I'm getting together a med 4x4, Have been told a 4x4 tent will be better with a 315 over a 630 from users on here, for heat and light distribution, however when I call store's Ready to order, then listen to them saying a 315 will not be enough light....and suggest running a 630 instead
> I have been following this forum and the consensus is a set of 2 individual 315's is better then a 630 hood, enclosing 2 315's -
> 
> If I stick with one 315, and do find out I need more light, what would be the suggestions
> ...


ime you can get really good coverage and yields (density) up to about 3.5 x 3.5' and 3.5'H, if you fill that footprint with any decent producing strain and maintain a good environment you'll get a lb or very close with ONE 315.


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## Chronic Pharmer (Nov 8, 2016)

First time growing in a 4x4 tent with the 315 Lec I will post pictures when my seed plants are in flower


----------



## pinner420 (Nov 8, 2016)




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## Javadog (Nov 8, 2016)

Lush + nice avatar! :0)


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## GemuGrows (Nov 8, 2016)

Javadog said:


> I would like to consider swapping out my 600W HPS bulb for that.
> 
> When might it be available? What would be expected MSRP? (w/ Ballast)


I think they cost like $600/piece MSRP. But most shops do good deals every now and then.

I have 3 at this point. I paid $303, $303, $440. I got two when I worked at a hydro shop when I got a 35% discount, and I got a 3rd at another hydro shops customer appreciate day at 20% off.

So between $303-600 is what you could expect to pay per unit.

They are amazing lights, if your looking to swap over i'd do it over time. I think I got my 3 over a full year


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## Javadog (Nov 8, 2016)

I am curious....can you post the URL on one online? I failed to find it.

i.e Item # 66770


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## GemuGrows (Nov 8, 2016)

Javadog said:


> I am curious....can you post the URL on one online? I failed to find it.
> 
> i.e Item # 66770


2x of these, got em at $303 each. MSRP is $600 but most places sell them at $440

http://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-315w-light-cmh-ceramic-mh-fixture-240v-3100k?keyword=&gclid=CjwKEAiAjIbBBRCitNvJ1o257WESJADpoUt0WM22ZZfh-h_ALk_hbypq3x0tdvV765S3_Kjffs4O3BoCqvvw_wcB 

My 3rd one is this setup: Galaxy didgital dimmable ballast, standard bulb, remote hood. I had to pay $440 for this one. 

https://www.sunlightsupply.com/shop/bycategory/electronic-ballasts/galaxy-lec-brand-technology-electronic-ballasts-315-watt
http://hydrobuilder.com/sun-system-lec-315-ra-remote-reflector.html?utm_source=google&utm_medium=shopping&utm_campaign=906257&gclid=CjwKEAiAjIbBBRCitNvJ1o257WESJADpoUt0k27TAo7bNGKgd_kEBphdoxf9K9cq2TTaJFWwFQ3nzBoCvHrw_wcB
http://growershouse.com/philips-mastercolor-cdm-t-elite-315w-cmh-agro-lamp-t12-3100-k?keyword=&gclid=CjwKEAiAjIbBBRCitNvJ1o257WESJADpoUt0zZdk6h0uqv67HYZ8AMpCr4D3e7JrZngg-KvFTqAU4hoC9drw_wcB


I dunno if you were talking to me- but if you were then maybe this answered your question? hah

I never really was too concerned with price- so long as it wasnt super out of the ballpark. I have no good info regarding the didgital ballast one cuz i only just got it a few days ago. I can tell you though that it can be a pain in the balls to setup cuz the ballast seems picky about little stuff and the hood is harder to stick the bulb into than the Sun System version; which actually caused me to break the brand new bulb I put in it first and I had to go get another. Didgital dimmable ballast though; im expecting it to be great. The reflector isnt as good tho as far as my first impression goes.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 8, 2016)

I just ordered the prism ballasts, 3100 agro philips, and 4200 cmd elite philips bulbs, and socket adapters. Shit better be in parchment or better than my mh setup. Oh, and adding 1 more 315 to the flower room (total of 4, 3 in veg). Growershouse.com

Word over at the mag is the prism hold their own and work great. No issues.


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## Javadog (Nov 8, 2016)

Oh, maybe I am not on the right track here.....first of all, thank you 
so much for taking the time!

But I got the impression that what I was looking at was a new 600W
HID lamp....just one that uses a new bulb.....

The bulb is here:
http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/ceramic-hps.aspx
You can see that the 600W model is part #66770

For some reason, searching for that specific bulb failed for me.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 8, 2016)

Cmh/cdl/lec all same type. Ceramic metal halide, light emitting ceramic, ceramic discharge lighting. All need a special cmh type ballast, bulb, socket.

http://growershouse.com/prism-lighting-science-315w-ceramic-mh-ballast-120-240v


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## Javadog (Nov 8, 2016)

OK, lets all just forget about that other bulb.....

I figure that I am more likely to move to either LED or to another 
315W LEC when I give up my 600W HPS anyway. 

LOL


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## DemonTrich (Nov 8, 2016)

I'm swapping out 3x600mh and 3x600hps for all cmh 315. And adding a 4th to the flower room (4x315 cmh). Better light than a typical mh or hps, but lower amp draw.


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## ttystikk (Nov 8, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> I'm swapping out 3x600mh and 3x600hps for all cmh 315. And adding a 4th to the flower room (4x315 cmh). Better light than a typical mh or hps, but lower amp draw.


I needed 4 x 315W CMH for 3 x 600W HPS.


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## GemuGrows (Nov 8, 2016)

Javadog said:


> OK, lets all just forget about that other bulb.....
> 
> I figure that I am more likely to move to either LED or to another
> 315W LEC when I give up my 600W HPS anyway.
> ...


Ceramic HPS is intriguing; your post is the first i've heard of it. I have heard of a 600w Ceramic MH bulb thats coming out though.

I'd be impressed if it would out perform 2x LEC 315's. Not only would I be impressed but I would probably be a convert  Two of either of those bulbs could seriously kick ass with air cooled hoods.

With the hype (so far well deserved hype that is) around all things ceramic- its only a matter of time before our grow tents, vent fans, pots, etc... are all Ceramic too!


I used to bloom with like 1350 watts in a 5x5. Now I have 945w in a 4x8. The only problem I've had with LEC lights is that I get light bleaching if they are too close (which is still like 2 feet away). For that reason I would potentially be a little hesitant to do a 600w CMH. Its also why I generally discourage people from getting the 2 in 1 630w fixture- I just think its literally too much light for such a small space. IMO you get better spread with spread out 315's.

I'm sure you could build a superior room with mulitple 630s' but i'm sure you need a shitload of vertical space as well as a huge horizontal space


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## ttystikk (Nov 8, 2016)

GemuGrows said:


> Ceramic HPS is intriguing; your post is the first i've heard of it. I have heard of a 600w Ceramic MH bulb thats coming out though.
> 
> I'd be impressed if it would out perform 2x LEC 315's. Not only would I be impressed but I would probably be a convert  Two of either of those bulbs could seriously kick ass with air cooled hoods.
> 
> With the hype (so far well deserved hype that is) around all things ceramic- its only a matter of time before our grow tents, vent fans, pots, etc... are all Ceramic too!


You're still waiting for ceramic grow pots? 

Lol


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## GemuGrows (Nov 8, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> You're still waiting for ceramic grow pots?
> 
> Lol


LOL,

Nice catch


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## DemonTrich (Nov 8, 2016)

I'll have 2' max in my flower room. Might be able to squeeze another 3" if I'm lucky when I rebuild at the end of the month. I'll finish vegging under the cmh bulbs as soon as I get them in the mail. 

I'm hoping my hood will help with the bleaching by spreading the light wider bs centered. Plus adjustable socket helps too.


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## GemuGrows (Nov 8, 2016)

Kinda getting annoyed at this point. My new LEC315 galaxy ballast keeps going into protection mode. I've been trying a bunch of different stuff. Does anybody have any idea what will put a digital ballast into "protection mode?"


I've tried many things- but i'm open to any suggestions.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 8, 2016)

Short?


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## GemuGrows (Nov 8, 2016)

Potentially; i'll look into that.

Pretty much what happens: My bulb will fire up for a short time- but i'm not sure how long. Id say like 2 hours at the longest. Then it will turn off and the ballast will go into protection mode


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## DemonTrich (Nov 8, 2016)

Overheating 

Swap a bulb out


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## GemuGrows (Nov 8, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Overheating
> 
> Swap a bulb out


It could be the bulb- I don't think its overheating though. Its not felt any warmer than any other digital ballasts i've used.

If I can't figure it out i'll have to bring it back to the grow shop I suppose and see what they can do about it


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## Javadog (Nov 8, 2016)

Sorry to hear that but thank you for sharing Guru.

Let us know what comes of it....it might be us next. :^/


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## GemuGrows (Nov 8, 2016)

Javadog said:


> Sorry to hear that but thank you for sharing Guru.
> 
> Let us know what comes of it....it might be us next. :^/


Hah will do homie  If worst comes to worst one of my buddies has like 5 extra 1000w hps and a few 600w hps setups I can choose from to borrow. I just flipped to bloom so I have like 2 weeks to figure it all out before the light is super important. My 2 LEC315's honestly are probably enough to bloom a 4x8 with- or at the very least to get it going. But I really wanna try this light lmao


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## Schmarmpit (Nov 9, 2016)

Anyone tried these?: https://www.amazon.com/LED2020-Ceramic-Discharge-Halide-31000LM/dp/B01B4CUIL8/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1478725341&sr=8-2&keywords=led2020+315&th=1

I bought one recently off eBay. I fired it up once on my Phillips 315W ballast and it did fire, surprisingly. The bulb itself just looked super cheap and I was hesitant about the bulb life and other things. I returned it.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 9, 2016)

So thanks to all the club 315lec.
Preliminary results:
Buds were put into jars yesterday so they will dry a bit more but they have been drying in a shed for a week for a slow cool dry at temps in the 60's day and 50's at night.
332grams of legit main colas(I mainlined 5 plants in 5 gallon buckets) and I had three other plants in 1 gallon buckets all in a 4x2 tent with a 190 cfm hurricane fan and a 4x16 mountain air filter.

I lost one California Orange plant to Hermies(6th one).
And I chopped one California Orange in a 5 gallon and 1 in a 1 gallon at 8 weeks because of security breech.

oh and 71 grams of larf

I will NEVER go back to my 1000hps even though I never had DE1000. My heat was lower and my draw was lower. I estimate 12oz of real bud. 

Thanks Again
@GroErr @Bad Karma @BobBitchen


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## DemonTrich (Nov 9, 2016)

Comparing to your previous hid grow, how'd the cmh stack up?


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 9, 2016)

This is a tricky question but I will give some of my results.
My basement had three 1000hps
1 light had a perpetual of "crops" a lot of Cash Crop Ken "Shishkaberry" and "Northern Lights" that were 8 week strains that I flipped. Solid 1.25 lbs a light no questions asked. 
The second was my plants, White widow, California Orange California Orange x Northern Lights, Citral and NYC Diesel the stuff I liked to smoke.

The third light had my long flowering sativas...Reeferman Apple Pie, Hazey, and a few other longer flowering plants.

My only observation is the following. In a 4x2 tent with a 315lec the coverage was great because of the reflective walls. In my old basement each 1000hps had an area of 5'x5' but I would rotate plants in the area so that was different. 
315lec power consumption was 1/3, heat was a lot less.

I think that this list in a 4'x4' would crush it if you used 3.5' x 3.5'....I did not have the space so I am only speculating.

If I did not lose one plant to hermies and flowered the other Calio-o to 10 weeks I woulld have pulled close to a pound of legit buds with one 315lec. Quality of the buds was good, density good, canopy penetration was not as deep as the 1000hps BUT it is only a 315 w.

Just my .02....and I will weigh them after two weeks of cure, either way I think these lights rock and I am very happy with them.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 9, 2016)

Thanks for the review.

Were you running open or enclosed hoods on the 315?


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## GroErr (Nov 9, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> So thanks to all the club 315lec.
> Preliminary results:
> Buds were put into jars yesterday so they will dry a bit more but they have been drying in a shed for a week for a slow cool dry at temps in the 60's day and 50's at night.
> 332grams of legit main colas(I mainlined 5 plants in 5 gallon buckets) and I had three other plants in 1 gallon buckets all in a 4x2 tent with a 190 cfm hurricane fan and a 4x16 mountain air filter.
> ...


Awesome haul, sounds like a keeper. Those 315's are legit producers and great quality. Cheers.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 9, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Thanks for the review.
> 
> Were you running open or enclosed hoods on the 315?


no open light and i don't think i would run cooling...not needed.


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## GemuGrows (Nov 9, 2016)

So I guess i'm literally the first person to have a problem with the LEC315 galaxy ballast lol. At least the developers are going to potentially help me troubleshoot.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 9, 2016)

How's the stretch compare to hps? If you happen to run gg4 (clone version, not s1, bag seed, ect), how's that stretch?

@GemuGrows 
Try swapping out parts and see if you can narrow it down while you wait.


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## GemuGrows (Nov 9, 2016)

Yep i'm trying as many things as I can  

Today I fired it up dimmed to 80%. It was on longer than "usual" so I boosted it up to 90%. I just pumped it up to 100% and i'll see how that goes.

I really wanna use this light lmfao. It seems like awesome setup,

If it ends up working then I literally have no idea what fixed it. But thats fine with me


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## bob223 (Nov 10, 2016)

This is Master Kush that i do not run as much as i should because it is a pain in the ass to trim.

density, smell, potency are great. yield is just alright and trimming takes all day.

It is a good representation of the European kush's from the 90's


----------



## bob223 (Nov 11, 2016)

bob223 said:


> This is Master Kush that i do not run as much as i should because it is a pain in the ass to trim.
> 
> density, smell, potency are great. yield is just alright and trimming takes all day.
> 
> It is a good representation of the European kush's from the 90's


Oh i also remember why i dont grow This master kush out very often. Besides being a bitch to trim its super finicky to Heat and PH (only in flower) but when you get everything right during its 66-73 day flower period 
it can really reward you. I seem to really have the best luck with it in the colder months.


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 11, 2016)

ok I'm ready to pull the trigger, and go to order the light, decided to call nanolux directly. found out there distributer in Canada, Call that distributer, yes they carry them and just started selling that model......call my hydro shop to get them to call that distributer and get me the light.... They tell them the bulb is available but not the fixture, and say the sun system is available... 
So now, the Sun system is being recommended to me over the Nanolux.. and the difference in price is a couple 100, I initially thought sun system was a "lower quality" unit, based on my first impression's, but they are certianlly not priced like that.

Can the Community on here explain why Id be better with the sun system @ 900 vs the Nanolux @ 600
I'm not afraid to spend money on a good light, I'm just not made of it, and if I'm ordering the Nanolux from the States, I wont have really have any warranty without multiple shipping cost's, so effectively void


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 11, 2016)

about 7 days till i start dropping some.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 11, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> ok I'm ready to pull the trigger, and go to order the light, decided to call nanolux directly. found out there distributer in Canada, Call that distributer, yes they carry them and just started selling that model......call my hydro shop to get them to call that distributer and get me the light.... They tell them the bulb is available but not the fixture, and say the sun system is available...
> So now, the Sun system is being recommended to me over the Nanolux.. and the difference in price is a couple 100, I initially thought sun system was a "lower quality" unit, based on my first impression's, but they are certianlly not priced like that.
> 
> Can the Community on here explain why Id be better with the sun system @ 900 vs the Nanolux @ 600
> I'm not afraid to spend money on a good light, I'm just not made of it, and if I'm ordering the Nanolux from the States, I wont have really have any warranty without multiple shipping cost's, so effectively void


Nanolux is lower quality in the realm in my opinion. The ballast in the SunSystem is a Phillips, the bulb too. The nanolux uses a ballast they made to replicate Phillips, and it only works with MaxPar bulbs, which imo are lesser quality too. 

The fixture itself is much better with the SunSystem than the nanolux too.


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## Yodaweed (Nov 11, 2016)

bob223 said:


> This is Master Kush that i do not run as much as i should because it is a pain in the ass to trim.
> 
> density, smell, potency are great. yield is just alright and trimming takes all day.
> 
> It is a good representation of the European kush's from the 90's


I thought master kush is from California , snoop dogg's master kush...


----------



## bob223 (Nov 11, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> I thought master kush is from California , snoop dogg's master kush...


My understanding is Master Kush is From Holland in the late 90's. Its should be a land race indica ( Hindu kush) and crossed with skunk #1.
Master Kush has no relation to American kush's like O.g. Kush and similar.

The only thing i know about master kush and snoop dogg is at one point he said it is his favorite strain?


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 11, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Nanolux is lower quality in the realm in my opinion. The ballast in the SunSystem is a Phillips, the bulb too. The nanolux uses a ballast they made to replicate Phillips, and it only works with MaxPar bulbs, which imo are lesser quality too.
> 
> The fixture itself is much better with the SunSystem than the nanolux too.


misinformation, i run philips in mine fine


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 11, 2016)

@Sirekillemall. I see from your pictures above your running the sun system and have said your also running the nanotechnology 630..... is there any difference in bulb illumination in your opion?


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 11, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> misinformation, i run philips in mine fine


We have done testing on almost all 315s fixtures and bulbs at this point. The nanolux ballast works much better with the maxpar bulb. PAR meters don't lie. The nanolux might run a philips bulb, but it will not be to that bulbs full potential.


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 11, 2016)

got some data to show? seen most videos showing comparisons.



thccbdhealth said:


> @Sirekillemall. I see from your pictures above your running the sun system and have said your also running the nanotechnology 630..... is there any difference in bulb illumination in your opion?


the hoods are sun system, "designed" in cali, made in china. the ballast are sunplix. got 3x630 running mix of maxpar and philips.
i also run mix of philips and maxpar on my sunplix.only difference is the 4k philips looks more blue imo.


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## FeNuX791 (Nov 13, 2016)

fuck me... I bought my leds before these phillip bulbs came around. I wish I bought 3 Of these panels instead goddamn results don't lie. These have the penetration and lumens LED doesnt have. As well as the PAR, and lack of heat.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 13, 2016)

.


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 13, 2016)

So then the Sun System in the one to go with? They are the only company that has the use of the CMH Philips ballast to match their 315w bulb?


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## DemonTrich (Nov 13, 2016)

Wrong

Prism also runs phillips bulbs


See above pic. 1900.00
Not counting the t4 in the background


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## thccbdhealth (Nov 13, 2016)

Philips Ballast ...
apparently many will run the bulb... but not to the designed specs of the bulb


and on the note of sunsystems units, their website says all their units have a 6 foot power cord.. Defiantly not long enough for my need, if pluged into an extenshion?

mount a power bar on the wall with-in 6 feet of blub location and have powerbar ran to wall outlet?


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## DemonTrich (Nov 13, 2016)

Check out the 30pg thread over at mag. Lots of ppl running prism ballasts and Philips bulbs
OR I just made a 1900 error


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## ttystikk (Nov 13, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Check out the 30pg thread over at mag. Lots of ppl running prism ballasts and Philips bulbs
> OR I just made a 1900 error


You'll find out soon enough!


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## DemonTrich (Nov 13, 2016)

Hammerhead as well as 5 other main top growers ALL use prism ballasts, philips bulbs, some use SS hoods, some use greenbeans


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## DemonTrich (Nov 13, 2016)

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?p=7702206#post7702206


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 13, 2016)

Anyone use the 860 replacement bulb for 1000w magnetic ballast?
I heard you have to hang them vertical?
Is there a 3100k bulb or only a 4000k?


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## ttystikk (Nov 13, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Anyone use the 860 replacement bulb for 1000w magnetic ballast?
> I heard you have to hang them vertical?
> Is there a 3100k bulb or only a 4000k?


Yes, used it. Yes, need mag ballast. Yes, gotta hang them vert, so you might as well run bare vertical, just like I do with them lol! I run the 3850K actual, my plants love it.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 14, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Yes, used it. Yes, need mag ballast. Yes, gotta hang them vert, so you might as well run bare vertical, just like I do with them lol! I run the 3850K actual, my plants love it.


What is the spectrum of the bulb?


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## ttystikk (Nov 14, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> What is the spectrum of the bulb?


Dude, it's in the caption you quoted lol

3850K


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 14, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Dude, it's in the caption you quoted lol
> 
> 3850K


Maybe I am not understanding this?
What is the spectrum like then? I am looking for it to be like my 315lec that is the 3100K bulb ?

So the spectrum is 3850? I am still new to this lec stuff.


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## ttystikk (Nov 14, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Maybe I am not understanding this?
> What is the spectrum like then? I am looking for it to be like my 315lec that is the 3100K bulb ?
> 
> So the spectrum is 3850? I am still new to this lec stuff.


Mine are similar technology, but called 860W CDM Allstart lamps from Philips. They run at 1000W on magnetic ballast.

EDIT: I also have 315W CMH lights on Philips ballasts, mine happen to be 4100K and I run them in veg.


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## KushyMcKush (Nov 14, 2016)

Some pics. Day 41 in a 4x4 closet (well...3.5'x4x5') - 1 SS 315. 7 plants - 4 501st OG, 1 Sunshine Daydream, 1 Granola Funk (super midget @ 21" tall lol) Filling out nicely and getting pretty frosty.

Ssdd
 

501st OG
 
The midget Granola Funk next to a 501st OG (~38") smells suuuper dank but very very tiny and very light feeder. Was a finicky little thing


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## rsbigdaddy (Nov 15, 2016)

Sire Killem All said:


> about 7 days till i start dropping some.View attachment 3828096 View attachment 3828097 View attachment 3828098 View attachment 3828099 View attachment 3828100 View attachment 3828102 View attachment 3828104


How meny of the light would I need for 10 by 10 grow tent


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 16, 2016)

rsbigdaddy said:


> How meny of the light would I need for 10 by 10 grow tent


9.


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## DemonTrich (Nov 16, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> 9.



Damn, I'm only running 4 in my flower room (8x12). Well will be running after the swap.


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 16, 2016)

in total i have 12 × 315w lamps, even though 3 of the are 630's i would run 12 single 315's. but i like overlap


----------



## KushyMcKush (Nov 16, 2016)

Damn guys lol, you all put my one lonely little light to shame! Gotta start somewhere though right.


----------



## Javadog (Nov 16, 2016)

I love what my one light is doing to its 4X4 tent. I am thinking that the best yields
will come from much larger totes and with maybe four plants that are allowed to Veg
in the tent for at least a few weeks. But, for now, I am pheno hunting.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Nov 16, 2016)

I see it is most common that people set their carbon filter in the tent, and use it as an intake, sucking unpurified air threw it...
My question is, could I not set up my maxx fan inside the tent, and the carbon filter as the end of ducting behind the tent on the floor, and push the unfiltered air threw it..


it's more efficient to suck threw rather then push threw?


----------



## Javadog (Nov 16, 2016)

Yes, I think that it was something like that last statement....but I am not
recalling exactly....might also make leaks less likely.


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 16, 2016)

My scrubber is in the room, fan pulling air thru it, then out. No smell. You want to pull air thru it, not push it thru it.

From what ivebread


----------



## Sire Killem All (Nov 16, 2016)

you can push thru the filter, but will shorten the life of the filter and fan and risk air leaks as there will be back pressure on ur ducting. Have seen it done to run more then one room on the same fan and filter, tho they always use ridged duct to lessen the airflow restiction.


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 16, 2016)

I've always ran into issues when trying to push or pull air thru 3 lights and a scrubber. Found it easier to run seperate fans and ducting


----------



## Sire Killem All (Nov 17, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> .View attachment 3829558


i keep debating on picking up an T4, urs looks new, u kno anyone that uses it? 
did u get the dry or the wet T4?


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 18, 2016)

Wet
Know about 7 ppl who use one.


----------



## Nef22 (Nov 18, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Damn guys lol, you all put my one lonely little light to shame! Gotta start somewhere though right.


You're crushing it with one light dude, that 501st Og looks straight fire. Quality seems to be there for sure, how many grams per light are you averaging?


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 18, 2016)

Getting anzy. 1 week until harvest and redoing the veg and flower rooms. Damn cmh setups keep eye balling me in my smoking room. Put me in bish...what ya waiting for. Lol 

I get 1lb per 600 dry/cured every run for 4+ yrs. Wonder what I'll pull with 1x315 x 4 lights? Having the right strains helps tons. If I run 4x gg4 under 1 hood, I'll get about 20-22oz. All grown in 4.7gal pots.


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 18, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Getting anzy. 1 week until harvest and redoing the veg and flower rooms. Damn cmh setups keep eye balling me in my smoking room. Put me in bish...what ya waiting for. Lol
> 
> I get 1lb per 600 dry/cured every run for 4+ yrs. Wonder what I'll pull with 1x315 x 4 lights? Having the right strains helps tons. If I run 4x gg4 under 1 hood, I'll get about 20-22oz. All grown in 4.7gal pots.


One thing I can just about guarantee is that you'll like what you get in terms of quality. That's why I stuck with 860W CDM Allstart lamps.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Nov 18, 2016)

so would I be better to use a Philips 315 cmh? or a philips 860 cdm allstart? sole light source in a 4x4


----------



## bob223 (Nov 19, 2016)

thccbdhealth said:


> so would I be better to use a Philips 315 cmh? or a philips 860 cdm allstart? sole light source in a 4x4


i haven't used the 860 all start but im sure it could rock a 4x4. The 860 runs off of a magnetic ballast and the 315w runs off of a LFSW Ballast. i think that the way the new style ballast drives the lamp is part of the magic.
I think you will be more then happy with the 315.


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 19, 2016)

bob223 said:


> i haven't used the 860 all start but im sure it could rock a 4x4. The 860 runs off of a magnetic ballast and the 315w runs off of a LFSW Ballast. i think that the way the new style ballast drives the lamp is part of the magic.
> I think you will be more then happy with the 315.


For a 4x4 he'll need two of the 315W CMH lights, or possibly a twin fixture with the 630W CMH.

The magnetic ballast is very inefficient compared to the LFSW ballast for the 315W/630W system.


----------



## GemuGrows (Nov 20, 2016)

Got the 3rd LEC up and running.

Time to see how 930w of LEC in a 4x8 go.

630w was a little too much for a 5x5 (at least for the strain I was running) so I have high hopes


----------



## Woodfella (Nov 20, 2016)

I think you'll find the 4' direction to be a stretch for the 315's


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Nov 20, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> For a 4x4 he'll need two of the 315W CMH lights, or possibly a twin fixture with the 630W CMH.
> 
> The magnetic ballast is very inefficient compared to the LFSW ballast for the 315W/630W system.


If you were buying CMH again today @ttystikk what would you buy? I am pondering mixing some in with my COB's for the flower tent.............. depends what deals pop up next week.........


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 20, 2016)

That's why I'm running 4 hoods/lights in an 8x12 that's 2.5' offset from center.


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 20, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> If you were buying CMH again today @ttystikk what would you buy? I am pondering mixing some in with my COB's for the flower tent.............. depends what deals pop up next week.........


Stick with COB LED.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Nov 20, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Stick with COB LED.


Stick to the 3K or mix in some 4K/5K?


----------



## ttystikk (Nov 20, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Stick to the 3K or mix in some 4K/5K?


3000k for bloom, the chip already has the spectrum.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Nov 20, 2016)

Ty bro


----------



## TheChemist77 (Nov 21, 2016)

GemuGrows said:


> Got the 3rd LEC up and running.
> 
> Time to see how 930w of LEC in a 4x8 go.
> 
> 630w was a little too much for a 5x5 (at least for the strain I was running) so I have high hopes


ive run 3 315's over a 4ftx6ft and had hit 1.6 gpw, however i felt it was too much light 3 would be perfect over a 4x8ft table!!! wish i could get a 4x8 in my room but im stuck in the 4x6 and ive switched to running 2 lamps for the first 3 weeks of bloom then use all 930watts from week 3-finish,, last run i yielded just a bit less than when running the 930watts full time still got 1.58 gpw and saved a bit on electric....i also think u need to run the 315's 3ft above to cover the hole 4ft, any closer and the outside row of plants get a bit smaller buds than the rest...


----------



## TheChemist77 (Nov 21, 2016)

im looking into 2 go green 100watt citized cobs to run with 2 315's over my table...


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 21, 2016)

Your hood also plays a huge role in light dispersement. Imo, with a larger hood, the hood is able to spread the light out more, allowing you to lessen the canopy to light distance. 

I'll be testing out this theory next Saturday with my 315 in big kahuna hoods.


----------



## TheChemist77 (Nov 21, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Your hood also plays a huge role in light dispersement. Imo, with a larger hood, the hood is able to spread the light out more, allowing you to lessen the canopy to light distance.
> 
> I'll be testing out this theory next Saturday with my 315 in big kahuna hoods.


ive been using the 315watt lec from boulder ;lamp with great results but i like the hood on this one way better,,just cant buy another one, what do u think?

*Greenbeams 315W Ceramic Metal Halide (CMH) 120V Grow Light System w/3100K Bulb*
by Cycloptics


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 21, 2016)

Hammerhead over at mag been using greenbeams and liked them. I've been rocking big kahuna hoods for my 600s x 6 (currently) with superb results.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 22, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Hammerhead over at mag been using greenbeams and liked them. I've been rocking big kahuna hoods for my 600s x 6 (currently) with superb results.


are the lights mounted horizontal ?


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 22, 2016)

SS hoods are vert iirc. Most others are normal.


----------



## bob223 (Nov 24, 2016)

Has anyone had issues with their timers and the sun system LEC?

I use the titan control 9 timer i think. I have used them for years and never have one fail. 
I recently had one shut off on time but seemed like it would get stuck before it was supposed to turn back on. If left alone it would turn on but usually an hour or two late . since i have ran these timers for years on multiple different set ups I did not think anything of it and just replaced the timer. After about a month the new timer started to do the same thing.

Im wondering if the new style ballast has issues with the SWSF Ballast?

Anyone have a timer they would recommend?


----------



## Yodaweed (Nov 24, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Your hood also plays a huge role in light dispersement. Imo, with a larger hood, the hood is able to spread the light out more, allowing you to lessen the canopy to light distance.
> 
> I'll be testing out this theory next Saturday with my 315 in big kahuna hoods.


That's what I tried to tell you earlier depending on hood lights put out different footprints.


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 24, 2016)

I wasn't arguing with you about it, was I? Larger hoos, imo, can have the lights closer, and still reap the benefits of proper light spread


----------



## Yodaweed (Nov 24, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> I wasn't arguing with you about it, was I? Larger hoos, imo, can have the lights closer, and still reap the benefits of proper light spread


Not sure I was just saying you can spread your light up to 4x4 with a 600w hps if you use the right hood.


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 24, 2016)

I currently rock 6x600w in all big kahuna hoods in veg and flower rooms (3 in each room) I do over 1lb per light in flower for the past 4+yrs of growing. Minus 1 run epic fail from a bad co2 run.


----------



## Yodaweed (Nov 24, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> I currently rock 6x600w in all big kahuna hoods in veg and flower rooms (3 in each room) I do over 1lb per light in flower for the past 4+yrs of growing. Minus 1 run epic fail from a bad co2 run.


That's cool , with a blockbuster 6 inch reflector a 600w hps can do a 4x4 grow tent from wall to wall.


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 24, 2016)

Veg is a 5x10 tent

Flower is a 8x12 sealed room that's offset from center 2.5'. Gives me room to work, places for my scrubber, tank, a/c. Putting 4x315 in there this weekend from 3x600hps.


----------



## TheChemist77 (Nov 24, 2016)

i had the cool tube reflector with adjustable wings from virtual sun and the 600 watt hps covered a 4ftx4ft well,,but i now run the 315's cmh and get far better gpw's than i ever achieved with hps ,mh,or both..


----------



## TheChemist77 (Nov 24, 2016)

*Virtual Sun VSCR6000 6'' Cool Tube Enclosed Grow Light Hood Reflector*







4


----------



## TheChemist77 (Nov 24, 2016)

1 lb = 448grams... 1 lb per 600 watt hps well under 1gpw,, you should easily hit 1.5 gpw using the 315 watt ceramics,, i hit 1.4 first run and now im getting 1.6gpw,,ive ,never got better than 1.2 gpw with hps,mh,or both


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 28, 2016)

Finally got my flower room all.buttoned up and the new 4x315w cmh lights installed. Flippin my room tonight. Or as many of the 12 big, 1 medium, and 6 tester strains staked, tied, and moved. 

Light output looks fantastic. Cool, crisp, beautiful light vs the hps.


----------



## GroErr (Nov 28, 2016)

Nice clean setup, you should rock that room with those LEC's


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 28, 2016)

I still have to do some wire maintenence, cleaning and tieing up. Anyone know if I would still need glasses to protect my eyes? My old hps glasses are blue lenses


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Nov 28, 2016)

The method 7 metal halide glasses have worked for me under the cmh as well


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 28, 2016)

If the hps glasses are the same, I'll just use those vs spending more money. 

As far as philips bulbs go, I've been running philips alto daylight deluxe in my t8 for years with great results . About to swap out 32 bulbs tonight if I have time.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Nov 28, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> The method 7 metal halide glasses have worked for me under the cmh as well


Just to be clear I have two separate glasses from them for the hps and mh. They are not the same. I never bought led ones because they were meant for blurple and mono and I have COB's so just wear regular sun glasses with the cobs.


----------



## Yodaweed (Nov 28, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Finally got my flower room all.buttoned up and the new 4x315w cmh lights installed. Flippin my room tonight. Or as many of the 12 big, 1 medium, and 6 tester strains staked, tied, and moved.
> 
> Light output looks fantastic. Cool, crisp, beautiful light vs the hps. View attachment 3841184 View attachment 3841185


I thought LEC lights worked best if they aren't air cooled?


----------



## DemonTrich (Nov 28, 2016)

They offer cmh in 2 bulb styles, t9 and t12 (philips). Single jacket for enclosed fixtures, and double jacket for open fixtures. If the heats not an issue, I'll turn off my 2x8" 720 cfm fans, and remove the glass panels.


----------



## Yodaweed (Nov 28, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> They offer cmh in 2 bulb styles, t9 and t12 (philips). Single jacket for enclosed fixtures, and double jacket for open fixtures. If the heats not an issue, I'll turn off my 2x8" 720 cfm fans, and remove the glass panels.


Oh nice, never seen or heard of those good info thanks.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Nov 28, 2016)

Got my final plant dried and weighed, came out with 110 Oz. Need to order some more seeds and start again...


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Nov 28, 2016)

Nice haul! Congrats


----------



## bob223 (Nov 28, 2016)

random question

I would like to get some bud tested to compare potency of LEC vs HPS. It would be in the denver area 
Does anyone know of a good service?

thank you


----------



## Yodaweed (Nov 28, 2016)

bob223 said:


> random question
> 
> I would like to get some bud tested to compare potency of LEC vs HPS. It would be in the denver area
> Does anyone know of a good service?
> ...


In colorado you need to be a licensed dispensary to get cannabis tested(home growers can't get testing). Really a crappy law they passed back in 2014 i believe.


----------



## Javadog (Nov 29, 2016)

WhyTF? I wonder.....afraid of ideas, we are.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Dec 6, 2016)

Kripple Shock


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 6, 2016)

Post a little info about your grow if you are able to. Room size, how many cmh, what wattage, ect.


----------



## Warpedpassage (Dec 7, 2016)

"in total i have 12 × 315w lamps, even though 3 of the are 630's i would run 12 single 315's. " Sire posted the info page or two back.


----------



## blowinmaryfast (Dec 7, 2016)

Anyone have experience with the Sunburst 315. It's an all in one like sunsystem's but with a horiz bulb. I've heard it operates on the phantom 2. Btw I have no problem with hydro farm they've been reliable for us.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 8, 2016)

Can I join in? Just added a sun system remote LEC 315 reflector and a galaxy ballast to my flower room. I went with the Phillips 3100k bulb. 

I have 2 Blockbusters with Hortilux 600w super HPS bulbs already to go with it. I hope they don't exclude me from the club.


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## Javadog (Dec 8, 2016)

I am sure that we are happy to have you, and your mad skills, here. :0)


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## pinner420 (Dec 8, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Can I join in? Just added a sun system remote LEC 315 reflector and a galaxy ballast to my flower room. I went with the Phillips 3100k bulb.
> 
> I have 2 Blockbusters with Hortilux 600w super HPS bulbs already to go with it. I hope they don't exclude me from the club.
> 
> View attachment 3848534 View attachment 3848535


No you just get to post in the 600 club too!


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 8, 2016)

Javadog said:


> I am sure that we are happy to have you, and your mad skills, here. :0)


Thanks man. I don't know about mad skills but I think I am becoming a competent gardener.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 8, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> No you just get to post in the 600 club too!


Crap! I thought I was automatically out of that club when I doubled up.


----------



## GroErr (Dec 8, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Crap! I thought I was automatically out of that club when I doubled up.


Lol, shit they even let me post over there with my COB shit, you're good


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 8, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Lol, shit they even let me post over there with my COB shit, you're good


Yeah that's why I started posting my 600W COB pics figured that would be cool


----------



## KushyMcKush (Dec 9, 2016)

How often do you guys replace your 315 bulbs? Im using the agro elite 3100k, and after 2 cycles it seems like the light is a little more yellow in color. Before I remember it being a pinkish-white-blue color. Im not sure if its dimmer, but it seems like maybe it is, its hard to tell though. Im thinking its time for a replacement; what donyou guys think? Whats currently the best bulb on the market? Same one?


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 9, 2016)

20k hrs is the bulb life, says philips.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 9, 2016)

Same bulb again growers house has it on sale


----------



## TS-leo (Dec 9, 2016)

msrp @ $299 including lamp from gc.

pretty competitive pricing if the quality is solid.

not sure about their lamps. Anyone tried yet?


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 9, 2016)

I rock and a lot of others also rock the prism ballasts and Philips agro and cdm elite philips bulbs.


----------



## KushyMcKush (Dec 9, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> 20k hrs is the bulb life, says philips.


Right, I know what Philips claims, but Im interested in real world experiences. Id imagine the uv decay would be pretty significant at 20k hours running. I should have phrased my question differently. At which point SHOULD they be replaced to maintain peak performance?


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 9, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Right, I know what Philips claims, but Im interested in real world experiences. Id imagine the uv decay would be pretty significant at 20k hours running. I should have phrased my question differently. At which point SHOULD they be replaced to maintain peak performance?


I've been running lamps with this tech for a couple of years and they're fine. Two years is a max interval but it's not like you gotta swap them every couple of runs. 

I'm going to start saying it right here, however; you only want to run these for a long as it takes for you to get COB LED or better. They ARE better lights, more efficient, longer lasting and you'll get bigger crops of better bud.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 10, 2016)

The math makes LEC work very well right now though.

I have pretty much convinced myself that I can take a 600W HPS
down and replace it with 315W LEC and still get the same yield,
or close enough to blame my skills for the difference.

When I can fully light a four foot tent with $500 of LED then LEC will 
begin to fade away.

JD


----------



## KushyMcKush (Dec 10, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I've been running lamps with this tech for a couple of years and they're fine. Two years is a max interval but it's not like you gotta swap them every couple of runs.
> 
> I'm going to start saying it right here, however; you only want to run these for a long as it takes for you to get COB LED or better. They ARE better lights, more efficient, longer lasting and you'll get bigger crops of better bud.


Thanks! The only thing that made me wonder is the slight color change, but maybe this is just the lamp burning in. I will be adding a second light and Ive been going between a second 315 or 200-250w of cob led.
When you say cob led or "better," what is currently better? I was under the assumption that those are at the top right now. DE hps?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 10, 2016)

Don't even think about a DE unless you have very HIGH ceiling clearance lol, or mother winter to cool your space. Add a second 315 and call it a day brother you will not be disappointed.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 10, 2016)

80% at 10k hrs
Philips testing results

Hammerhead and rives on ic have done testing on all. These 2 guys plus others have KILLED it running 315 cmh ONLY. Nothing else. Or else why would I dump 2100 and drop 6x600 mp/hps from my current killer grows for cmh only.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 10, 2016)

Javadog said:


> The math makes LEC work very well right now though.
> 
> I have pretty much convinced myself that I can take a 600W HPS
> down and replace it with 315W LEC and still get the same yield,
> ...


In my experience, a 315W CMH system doesn't quite replace a 600W HPS.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 10, 2016)

KushyMcKush said:


> Thanks! The only thing that made me wonder is the slight color change, but maybe this is just the lamp burning in. I will be adding a second light and Ive been going between a second 315 or 200-250w of cob led.
> When you say cob led or "better," what is currently better? I was under the assumption that those are at the top right now. DE hps?


COB LED is great, but time and technology never stop their march. It's currently looking like Quantum boards will be the next better thing. 

DE lighting of any sort is a big step backwards in efficiency. That's not to say you can't grow good crops with them, but once you factor in the cost of cooling you'll find they are anything but efficient.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 10, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> In my experience, a 315W CMH system doesn't quite replace a 600W HPS.


I actually agree....but have yet to successfully describe the difference. 

My initial LEC results seem fat but I will know better soon.

JD


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 10, 2016)

Javadog said:


> I actually agree....but have yet to successfully describe the difference.
> 
> My initial LEC results seem fat but I will know better soon.
> 
> JD


I'm thinking a 315W CMH is in rough terms equivalent to 500W of HPS. You'll find it much easier to get more frost, however.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 10, 2016)

Another fair assessment.


----------



## KushyMcKush (Dec 10, 2016)

Frosty for sure. Heres some pics of my first harvest under the 315. Don't have a final yield yet, most still has a few days left of drying, but the quality is great. Main issue was penetration which killed my density and stacking under probably 8-10" from the tops. I didn't top/train as much as I should have which killed my yield. Just wanted a quick veg. This run I think Im going to net and definitely train/top/defoliate more to get them bushy for a more even canopy. A little more light too. 
501st og #1
 
501st og #2
  
Ssdd (just cut this branch today to test)


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 10, 2016)

Javadog said:


> Another fair assessment.


Three 315W CMH lights will stomp the shit out of two 600W HPS lamps. So there's that.


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 10, 2016)

Does anyone air cool their 315 CMH's 

Check out this hood http://growershouse.com/phantom-315w-ceramic-metal-halide-cmh-reflector
With this Kit you can air cool it http://growershouse.com/phantom-lens-system-phr3150-reflector-lens-w-flange-cooling-kit


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 10, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> Does anyone air cool their 315 CMH's
> 
> Check out this hood http://growershouse.com/phantom-315w-ceramic-metal-halide-cmh-reflector
> With this Kit you can air cool it http://growershouse.com/phantom-lens-system-phr3150-reflector-lens-w-flange-cooling-kit


I will be trying one out after this run in the veg tent.


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 10, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I will be trying one out after this run in the veg tent.


I'm thinking about taking one of my 600w hps down and sticking one of those in it's place , it would be real ez.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 10, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> I'm thinking about taking one of my 600w hps down and sticking one of those in it's place , it would be real ez.


To replace a 600 I would run (2) just my opinion one 315 is more like a 400 watt HID........

This is the kit I'm going to get to go with it:
http://growershouse.com/prism-lighting-science-315w-cmh-ballast-philips-bulb-combo-120-240v


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Dec 10, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> Does anyone air cool their 315 CMH's
> 
> Check out this hood http://growershouse.com/phantom-315w-ceramic-metal-halide-cmh-reflector
> With this Kit you can air cool it http://growershouse.com/phantom-lens-system-phr3150-reflector-lens-w-flange-cooling-kit


My hydrofarm(looks like that one in the link) has a kit for glass and ventilation. But I found no need in my application. The heat is much less even in a '4x2' tent. I have 7' tents with both exhaust and intake fans.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 10, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> Does anyone air cool their 315 CMH's
> 
> Check out this hood http://growershouse.com/phantom-315w-ceramic-metal-halide-cmh-reflector
> With this Kit you can air cool it http://growershouse.com/phantom-lens-system-phr3150-reflector-lens-w-flange-cooling-kit



I do, 7x 315 cmh all in ac big kahuna hoods. Pic is my flower room. 3x 315 in veg, 4x 315 in flower.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 11, 2016)

C-L-E-A-N


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 13, 2016)

Looks like i am joining the club guys , just bought this conversion kit for a 315 CMH 
http://growershouse.com/ceramic-science-315w-cmh-light-conversion-kit
with a phillips 4200k bulb.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 14, 2016)

So far I'm loving it. Day 15 From flip


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 14, 2016)

@Yodaweed

I have 2 grow diary threads over at the farm. 1 for veg and 1 for flower. Doing weekly updates. Should check them out.


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 14, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> @Yodaweed
> 
> I have 2 grow diary threads over at the farm. 1 for veg and 1 for flower. Doing weekly updates. Should check them out.


Sweet, it is ok to air cool a 315 CMH? i was going to put this conversion kit in my 6 inch block buster and air cool like i do the rest of my lights. What do i google to find your thread?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 14, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> Sweet, it is ok to air cool a 315 CMH? i was going to put this conversion kit in my 6 inch block buster and air cool like i do the rest of my lights. What do i google to find your thread?


Sunlight supply makes air cooled LEC reflectors. 

I am thinking of converting my Blockbusters too. But I think I would buy the Galaxy ballasts and the mogul adapter. 

I am going to have to grow under the first new one for a while though before I ditch the Hortilux super HPS.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 14, 2016)

I use 7x big kahuna ac hoods (4x flower, 3x veg). You can cool a 315 bulb w/o any issues. They make a t9 and t13 bulb. One is single jacket for ac hoods, other is double jacket for open hoods. 

Thcfarmer.com
Demontrich


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 14, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> I use 7x big kahuna ac hoods (4x flower, 3x veg). You can cool a 315 bulb w/o any issues. They make a t9 and t13 bulb. One is single jacket for ac hoods, other is double jacket for open hoods.
> 
> Thcfarmer.com
> Demontrich


http://growershouse.com/philips-mastercolor-cdm-tmw-elite-315w-942-cmh-lamp-4200-k/reviews/
this is the bulb i bought , is it the single jacket or double jacket? i plan to ac that bulb, hope i bought the right one , thank you for your help  Found your thread as well


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 14, 2016)

That's the double jacket bulb.


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 14, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> That's the double jacket bulb.


Double glass jacketed lamp is rated for either open fixture use (without glass lens) or enclosed fixture use (with glass lens). Bi-pin lamp base is compatible with all Sun System® LEC® Brand Technology Fixtures.

Does that mean it's ok to air cool this light?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 14, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> damnit so i can't ac that bulb?


It will be fine. It is just also rated for open use. 

The 400 watt one available at HTC is single jacket but the 315 you got has a better spectrum. 

@DemonTrich please correct me if I am wrong.


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 14, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> It will be fine. It is just also rated for open use.
> 
> The 400 watt one available at HTC is single jacket but the 315 you got has a better spectrum.
> 
> @DemonTrich please correct me if I am wrong.


<3 thank you guys, love this section of the forum, so many helpful people , information and awesome bud pics  Wish i could give you guys more than one like.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 14, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> It will be fine. It is just also rated for open use.
> 
> The 400 watt one available at HTC is single jacket but the 315 you got has a better spectrum.
> 
> @DemonTrich please correct me if I am wrong.



You can ac any bulb unless it specifically states not to ac it. They only offer the philips agro bulb in double jacket. We all (well most) ac the 315 bulbs.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 14, 2016)

Be careful of substandard bulbs. HH at IC had a non philips bulb explode and catch his floor on fire.


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 14, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Be careful of substandard bulbs. HH at IC had a non philips bulb explode and catch his floor on fire.


Yikes that's a bit scary , good thing i'm putting these under the glass but that will definitely be on my mind now


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 14, 2016)

With how affordable they are, there is really no reason NOT to use the Phillips Bulbs for the 315's which have already been tested and proven to be the best by many sales outfits and growers alike. The rest, ballast, reflectors, etc is really all personal preference. Just make sure you get a solid ballast and run the Phillips bulbs and you're GTG. 

My $0.02


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 14, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> With how affordable they are, there is really no reason NOT to use the Phillips Bulbs for the 315's which have already been tested and proven to be the best by many sales outfits and growers alike. The rest, ballast, reflectors, etc is really all personal preference. Just make sure you get a solid ballast and run the Phillips bulbs and you're GTG.
> 
> My $0.02


Open Rated lamps are okay. Make sure you get them if you run your lamps outside of a sealed, glass enclosed fixture.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 14, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> With how affordable they are, there is really no reason NOT to use the Phillips Bulbs for the 315's which have already been tested and proven to be the best by many sales outfits and growers alike. The rest, ballast, reflectors, etc is really all personal preference. Just make sure you get a solid ballast and run the Phillips bulbs and you're GTG.
> 
> My $0.02


Just some info I found while shopping for mine. 

Sunlight Supply Galaxy ballast is made to spec for the Phillips bulbs. 

Their remote and all in one reflectors were purpose built for the Phillips bulb. 

And their all in one unit had the Phillips ballast. 

Also I got my setup at growers house. The prices of the new remote setup I got are competetive with the new brands. 

The difference in the reflector is it is all pebbled aluminum like my blockbuster and does not have the 98% reflective smooth aluminum inserts like the commercial and all in one units. But it only cost $110.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 14, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Just some info I found while shopping for mine.
> 
> Sunlight Supply Galaxy ballast is made to spec for the Phillips bulbs.
> 
> ...


Yes sir and same deal with the prism kits which is a growers house brand made to spec to run the Phillips bulbs and longer warranty than the Phillips ballast.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 14, 2016)

I rock prism ballasts. 7 in use, and 2 as back ups.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 15, 2016)

This bud shot belongs here. (Even though I posted it on the frostiest buds thread)

Black Widow x Blue Lemon Thai finishing under the new 315 LEC for the last 10 days. 

Bud structure and growth has changed a bit and it is really getting potent looking and smelling. 

The foxtails I mentioned that looked really weird are completely filling in. She is going to have a pineapple for a main bud. 

Pretty much Lemon Diesel aroma coming on strong. 

Also seems like the tired burning leaves have perked up and regained their glow. 

I am liking working with this lamp!


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 15, 2016)

I just made a connection that might be obvious to the fans of more sunlight like spectrums. 

My bud looks like the old metal halide grown buds in the classic grow books. 

And it's a hybrid of classic strains so maybe they respond better as they were originally grown that way. 

Anyone using finishing lamps?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 16, 2016)

I thought I would post the pics of my completed upgrade and of course the beauties under my now 3 light flower room. 

Well I still need to get some fasteners and tidy up some cables......

I could barely keep from going in there tonight. 

I love this shit!


----------



## Bad Karma (Dec 16, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I thought I would post the pics of my completed upgrade and of course the beauties under my now 3 light flower room.
> 
> Well I still need to get some fasteners and tidy up some cables......
> 
> ...


Nice looking setup, sir. I just placed an order this morning for some new CMH gear. How is that Galaxy ballast treating you so far? I've got one on the way, along with the SunSystem reflector, too.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 16, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> Nice looking setup, sir. I just placed an order this morning for some new CMH gear. How is that Galaxy ballast treating you so far? I've got one on the way, along with the SunSystem reflector, too.



Thanks Bad Karma. 

The ballast fired fine the first time and has turned on and off like it's supposed to so far. I have a cheap sunleaves meter with a light part and it shows he same intensity as the 600's but in a slightly smaller than 3'x 3' area. 

I just realized I never checked to see if the dimmer works. I would use that when I get one for veg. I read that it doesn't change the spectrum very much.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 16, 2016)

I need to cover that old plywood floor. I set the room up hastily because I had a bunch of tents set up in my open basement and it got much colder down there than expected. 

First rounds made beautiful purple flowers and leaves but very low yield. Then it went very bad as the tent thermometer never read below 57 Fahrenheit but when I tested the old concrete form floor it was in the 40's. 

Wilted plants with cold rotting roots. Lost 3 months work. 

But I love my new rooms. And they are next to the living room couch. Convenient.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 17, 2016)

Ok I went and tried the Galaxy dimmer knob. 

I turned it down and saw nothing. I swear I panicked and turned it down all the way to 50%. 

Saw no change. I was going to tell you all so you could flame away about my galaxy but I went to get the light meter. 

It showed clear steps of lesser intensity as I turned down the knob. But I could not see the change with my eyes. At least in my growroom. 

The sunleaves green with 2 metal prong meter is likely anything but accurate. But it seems consistent with my bulb life and footprints so I want to report what it read. 

At 24" under the 600 Super HPS or the 315 LEC directly under the center of the reflectors it read "1500" maybe just under. 

The 600 on the blockbuster has a wider footprint before the light drops off. About 3.5' x3.5'. 

The LEC a little more than 2.5' x 2.5' with the sunlight remote reflector. 

But both lamps have good usable light for about 6 inches more out before drastic drop off. Still 750 on the meter or above. 

Not scientific but it says a lot for the 315 Phillips 3100k bulb and a good reflector. 

Shows the Blockbuster wasn't too bad a choice either. 

Having a shitload of fun in the garden lately. Had to share.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 17, 2016)

Thanks for taking the time Michigan. We are enjoying your pleasure. :0)


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 17, 2016)

Javadog said:


> Thanks for taking the time Michigan. We are enjoying your pleasure. :0)


Your welcome. I would never have known to research these bulbs without you all posting in these forums first. So it's only fair I share back.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Dec 17, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> This bud shot belongs here. (Even though I posted it on the frostiest buds thread)
> 
> Black Widow x Blue Lemon Thai finishing under the new 315 LEC for the last 10 days.
> 
> ...


That reminds me of Citral that I grew a few years back, those are some nice genetics @MichiganMedGrower


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 17, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> That reminds me of Citral that I grew a few years back, those are some nice genetics @MichiganMedGrower


He has a Citral too. It's Citral x POW33. 

That's her in the foreground. POW33 in the back.


----------



## Bad Karma (Dec 18, 2016)

Growershouse.com continues to impress me with every order. I placed my order on Friday morning and it was just delivered on Sunday afternoon. Did I pay for expensive overnight shipping? Nope. Am I beyond pleased that everything showed up so quickly and in good condition? Yup.

I'm looking forward to hanging my new lamp tonight.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 18, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> Growershouse.com continues to impress me with every order. I placed my order on Friday morning and it was just delivered on Sunday afternoon. Did I pay for expensive overnight shipping? Nope. Am I beyond pleased that everything showed up so quickly and in good condition? Yup.
> 
> I'm looking forward to hanging my new lamp tonight.


What's up BK what did you get this time? I just got an order from them blazing fast too. Got another 1K HPS bulb to have a spare and some connectors and a 240v ballast plug. 

Happy Holidays


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 18, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> Growershouse.com continues to impress me with every order. I placed my order on Friday morning and it was just delivered on Sunday afternoon. Did I pay for expensive overnight shipping? Nope. Am I beyond pleased that everything showed up so quickly and in good condition? Yup.
> 
> I'm looking forward to hanging my new lamp tonight.


I've heard about one or two complaints but they've always treated me very well.


----------



## Bad Karma (Dec 18, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> What's up BK what did you get this time? I just got an order from them blazing fast too. Got another 1K HPS bulb to have a spare and some connectors and a 240v ballast plug.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 18, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> View attachment 3856672


You replacing a light or expanding the grow?

Nice Score


----------



## Bad Karma (Dec 18, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> You replacing a light or expanding the grow?
> 
> Nice Score


Thanks. Replacing and ultimately expanding. I had to sell some of my grow gear off a few months back due to a unplanned change of employers. As Joe Hackett from the show Wings would have said, "Its all for the best". I've got a better paying job now, and can grab new gear better suited to my needs, so win/win. I plan on picking up another one of these next month, too.
I plan on replacing my three 3x3 tents and going back to using an 8x4 instead with three 315's inside.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 18, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> Thanks. Replacing and ultimately expanding. I had to sell some of my grow gear off a few months back due to a unplanned change of employers. As Joe Hackett from the show Wings would have said, "Its all for the best". I've got a better paying job now, and can grab new gear better suited to my needs, so win/win. I plan on picking up another one of these next month, too.
> I plan on replacing my three 3x3 tents and going back to using an 8x4 instead with three 315's inside.


Nice I recently turned one of my 3x3's into a veg tent put the 2x4 and the second 3x3 away and got a 5x9 for flower. 

Big things for you coming now brother, you were killing those 3x3's with the 315's. Congrats on the new and better paying job that is always a good thing.


----------



## a senile fungus (Dec 18, 2016)

I'm loving all this CMH action! I remember being worried about my purchase a few years ago and I'm glad the tech has caught on. I still use mine for veg and flower under gavita DE.


----------



## Snucks (Dec 18, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Yes sir and same deal with the prism kits which is a growers house brand made to spec to run the Phillips bulbs and longer warranty than the Phillips ballast.


DO the Prism kits come with everything to hook up to reflector to run? Anything else i need to get besides the kit and reflector?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 18, 2016)

Snucks said:


> DO the Prism kits come with everything to hook up to reflector to run? Anything else i need to get besides the kit and reflector?


Just make sure you get the proper power cord 120/240v. I linked the kit earlier in the thread all of the info is on the webpage. Sorry not at the PC right now.


----------



## Snucks (Dec 18, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Just make sure you get the proper power cord 120/240v. I linked the kit earlier in the thread all of the info is on the webpage. Sorry not at the PC right now.


What would you recommend in terms of ventilation and fans for a 3x3 tent? I dont plan on getting a carbon filter nor do i want to spend TOO much monies. Sorry for all the questions. HA. I am buying my light tonite... the Phantom reflector, prism kit and Phillips 4200k bulb from Growershouse.com


----------



## Bad Karma (Dec 19, 2016)

Snucks said:


> What would you recommend in terms of ventilation and fans for a 3x3 tent? I dont plan on getting a carbon filter nor do i want to spend TOO much monies. Sorry for all the questions. HA. I am buying my light tonite... the Phantom reflector, prism kit and Phillips 4200k bulb from Growershouse.com


If you're going to flower with that light, get the 3100k Phillips.


----------



## Snucks (Dec 19, 2016)

Bad Karma said:


> If you're going to flower with that light, get the 3100k Phillips.


it came with the prism kit


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 19, 2016)

4x315 cmh Philips agro 930 bulbs

All in ac big kahuna hoods, all prism ballasts.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 19, 2016)

3x315 cmh 940 veg grow. Only 2x315 are powered on currently.philips cdm.elite bulbs.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 19, 2016)

Snucks said:


> What would you recommend in terms of ventilation and fans for a 3x3 tent? I dont plan on getting a carbon filter nor do i want to spend TOO much monies. Sorry for all the questions. HA. I am buying my light tonite... the Phantom reflector, prism kit and Phillips 4200k bulb from Growershouse.com


My 3x3 runs a 6" hyper fan and phresh filter and I have a clip on fan up top and a walmart floor fan on the floor blowing up. The 6" hyper fan is overkill but I like having more fan than I need and running it at a lower speed for less noise. YMMV


----------



## pinner420 (Dec 19, 2016)

http://www.ncwgs.com/product_info.php?cPath=133&products_id=2466. Anyone know if this is S.W. ballast?


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 19, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> http://www.ncwgs.com/product_info.php?cPath=133&products_id=2466. Anyone know if this is S.W. ballast?


No idea.


----------



## disbeverk (Dec 19, 2016)

I love my LEC 3100k 315s, but have to say that I had better veg under 400w MH 6500k Tru-Blue bulb on a digital ballast. Larger, lusher leaves w/ more leaflets. Maybe the 4200k bulb could compete better, but an OOOOOG at the grow shop said he tried it and didn't care for it. I'll probably veg under 400w MH in the future.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 19, 2016)

disbeverk said:


> I love my LEC 3100k 315s, but have to say that I had better veg under 400w MH 6500k Tru-Blue bulb on a digital ballast. Larger, lusher leaves w/ more leaflets. Maybe the 4200k bulb could compete better, but an OOOOOG at the grow shop said he tried it and didn't care for it. I'll probably veg under 400w MH in the future.


Interesting. My Hortilux daylight blue my grew some amazing fat veg plants. I have only still started in flower with my 315. I actually veg under t-5's now. But I am not in a hurry with my perpetual and the structure is fantastic under the 6500k flourescents. Just slow growing compared to HID.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 19, 2016)

disbeverk said:


> I love my LEC 3100k 315s, but have to say that I had better veg under 400w MH 6500k Tru-Blue bulb on a digital ballast. Larger, lusher leaves w/ more leaflets. Maybe the 4200k bulb could compete better, but an OOOOOG at the grow shop said he tried it and didn't care for it. I'll probably veg under 400w MH in the future.


I veg under 4200K 315W CMH and it works brilliantly, so idk wtf the old guy was on about. 

MH is obsolete, i don't recommend using them for anything. The above system works better and is much more efficient.


----------



## pinner420 (Dec 19, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> No idea.


Nope....


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 19, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> Nope....


Then stay away from it. The square wave ballast is the whole reason why the 315W CMH system is more efficient. Without that it might as well be another MH.


----------



## disbeverk (Dec 19, 2016)

When it's time to replace any bulb... that fixture will be getting retired, and it will be replaced w/ a cob led.


----------



## pinner420 (Dec 19, 2016)

http://boulderlamp.com/vertical-grow-light/

Sexy


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 19, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> http://www.ncwgs.com/product_info.php?cPath=133&products_id=2466. Anyone know if this is S.W. ballast?


This looks to be just like the growers house kit with the prism ballast. It should be the right one. Just with a nickel wholesale vender instead of Hydrofarm or sunlight or something. 

Growers house has the Galaxy LEC dimmable for about the same price. 

Phantom has one too. They all do now.


----------



## Snucks (Dec 19, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> My 3x3 runs a 6" hyper fan and phresh filter and I have a clip on fan up top and a walmart floor fan on the floor blowing up. The 6" hyper fan is overkill but I like having more fan than I need and running it at a lower speed for less noise. YMMV


Do you use the hyper fan for a intake or a exhaust?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 19, 2016)

Snucks said:


> Do you use the hyper fan for a intake or a exhaust?


I don't use fans for intake I use passive intakes. That is I leave a vent open somewhere. My hyper fans are hooked up to my carbon filters and exhaust.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 19, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I don't use fans for intake I use passive intakes. That is I leave a vent open somewhere. My hyper fans are hooked up to my carbon filters and exhaust.


I use those too with the Phresh filters. I am on year 3 with one and still no weed smell getting through. And I dry and filter the air in the growroom closet through them. 

But this summer I added an intake fan and it made a pretty big improvement.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 19, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I use those too with the Phresh filters. I am on year 3 with one and still no weed smell getting through. And I dry and filter the air in the growroom closet through them.
> 
> But this summer I added an intake fan and it made a pretty big improvement.


One of my favorite upgrades as of recently. I was using an ipower amazon 4" kit before. Hooked up to a variac speed controller. I much prefer the hyper fan setup. It pulls less power and is quieter and includes the speed controller as well.


----------



## Snucks (Dec 19, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I don't use fans for intake I use passive intakes. That is I leave a vent open somewhere. My hyper fans are hooked up to my carbon filters and exhaust.


How do you not get light leaks when you leave a vent open?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 19, 2016)

I don't put my HPS though the vent bro lol


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 19, 2016)

disbeverk said:


> When it's time to replace any bulb... that fixture will be getting retired, and it will be replaced w/ a cob led.


THAT'S what I like to hear! Your only regret will be waiting so long.


----------



## Snucks (Dec 19, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I don't put my HPS though the vent bro lol


hahah i know. I'm talking about for the passive intake and light from outside the tent. Cause my tent is going to be in my bedroom.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 19, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> View attachment 3857163 http://boulderlamp.com/vertical-grow-light/
> 
> Sexy


I saw these a year ago. Crap then, crap now.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 19, 2016)

I have a spare room so no light leak issues. You just need to have your "on" time set for a schedule that works for you and stay out when it's lights out. I do not go into my tents for anything when it's lights out. My intake is away from any light source anyways. And honestly I'm not a freak about light leaks like most. If the light off of my portable A/C or some coming in through an intake is going to somehow mess up a genetic I have flowering, then that is not a genetic I want to keep running.

Just my opinion.


----------



## Snucks (Dec 19, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I have a spare room so no light leak issues. You just need to have your "on" time set for a schedule that works for you and stay out when it's lights out. I do not go into my tents for anything when it's lights out. My intake is away from any light source anyways. And honestly I'm not a freak about light leaks like most. If the light off of my portable A/C or some coming in through an intake is going to somehow mess up a genetic I have flowering, then that is not a genetic I want to keep running.
> 
> Just my opinion.


I mean i live in a pretty small apartment and i cant not go in my room on off hours (i spend alot of time im my room). I know not to open up tents on night hours. lol =P WHat would be MY best route, in your(or anyone else's) best opinion.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 19, 2016)

Set your lights out for when you sleep..........................


----------



## Javadog (Dec 19, 2016)

I have used short sections of ducting for passive intakes. It helps with light.


----------



## Snucks (Dec 19, 2016)

Javadog said:


> I have used short sections of ducting for passive intakes. It helps with light.


Thats what i was thinking about doing or getting a booster and getting a exhaust fan.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 20, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I have a spare room so no light leak issues. You just need to have your "on" time set for a schedule that works for you and stay out when it's lights out. I do not go into my tents for anything when it's lights out. My intake is away from any light source anyways. And honestly I'm not a freak about light leaks like most. If the light off of my portable A/C or some coming in through an intake is going to somehow mess up a genetic I have flowering, then that is not a genetic I want to keep running.
> 
> Just my opinion.


I wanted to believe this was a good plan for quite a while. Problem is. All of the most sensitive plants have been the best ones to smoke. So I maintain a dark room with only weak green light used in the dark cycle. 

And I still have to get used to seeing some stamen here and there because of the weed I like best.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 20, 2016)

Snucks said:


> Thats what i was thinking about doing or getting a booster and getting a exhaust fan.


Beware pushing air with a booster, if odor control is important, as one can give
a tent a positive air pressure with can cause leaks of air/smell.

Good luck,

JD


----------



## Flowki (Dec 20, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I wanted to believe this was a good plan for quite a while. Problem is. All of the most sensitive plants have been the best ones to smoke. So I maintain a dark room with only weak green light used in the dark cycle.
> 
> And I still have to get used to seeing some stamen here and there because of the weed I like best.


Sure I read that green light is not much safer to use than a normal light. I also recall somebody grew something or other using green spectrum or what not.


----------



## disbeverk (Dec 20, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I wanted to believe this was a good plan for quite a while. Problem is. All of the most sensitive plants have been the best ones to smoke.


^^^


Evil-Mobo said:


> And honestly I'm not a freak about light leaks like most.


It only takes one fuck-up to become one of those "freaks" you speak of...


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 20, 2016)

Flowki said:


> Sure I read that green light is not much safer to use than a normal light. I also recall somebody grew something or other using green spectrum or what not.


Very low intensity green light. The LED display on my light controller in there is green light even.


----------



## pinner420 (Dec 20, 2016)

6'4 x 4'6 . One more week..


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 20, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> 6'4 x 4'6 . One more week..View attachment 3857986


BOOM.


----------



## Warpedpassage (Dec 20, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> 6'4 x 4'6 . One more week..View attachment 3857986


Unholy mother of the Goddess. 

Reminds me a bit of that heath fellows grows from them days long gone. 
Good job!!


----------



## pinner420 (Dec 20, 2016)

Warpedpassage said:


> Unholy mother of the Goddess.
> 
> Reminds me a bit of that heath fellows grows from them days long gone.
> Good job!!


I still chat heath up. Got this as an f6 tester 7 years ago. He's alive and well.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 20, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> I still chat heath up. Got this as an f6 tester 7 years ago. He's alive and well.


Oh, REALLY now? 

Tell us more! 

You've seen my vertical goodness thread, right? It's practically an homage to the man's work.


----------



## pinner420 (Dec 21, 2016)

He's a testament to persistence, Less is more. The humblest master of the trade to grace us. I remember back when his threads had pictures. Now all that's left are his teachings. I remember asking really fucked up questions back in the day and he was so humble he would answer the dumbest of inquirys. He's the guy that follows principles and then shows his work. You know just one of those guys a true mad scientist. He does lurk now and then to check us all; however, not a word.. kinda nice to know he's still here!


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 21, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> 6'4 x 4'6 . One more week..View attachment 3857986


Wow!


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Dec 21, 2016)

Snucks said:


> hahah i know. I'm talking about for the passive intake and light from outside the tent. Cause my tent is going to be in my bedroom.


This is my 2'x2.5' tent(passive intake hooked to a 4"x12" phresh filter 190cfm hurricane on a variac that is my intake for my 4'x2' tent also hooked to a 190cfm hurricane and a 4"x16" mountain air. I need to have active intake or the sides pull in too much on the 4'x2'.

Smell is nonexistent


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 21, 2016)

i used 2 7" semi flexible 2 foot ducts. And I strapped a piece of air conditioner replacement foam on each end and bent it in an upside down "U".

No light passed through with the 2 black foam ends. It remained pitch black in my tent.

Pulls cool air from the floor and deposits it passively to the tent floor. Then the carbon filter was mounted at the top inside and exhausted through an air cooled reflector and out.

The larger diameter and double my 6" exhaust fan reduces the sucking in of the sides and increases air flow. 

The air can pass through the whole canopy from floor up. Works very well. I had 6 " clip fans inside for circulation.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 21, 2016)

Here's a pic of the inside.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 21, 2016)

I have to admit I would put a cmh or two in that old tent now instead of that 600 HPS. I bet one would be fine in the 4x4 with all that Mylar if you keep away from the edges. 

Anyway just posting because of the passive intake comment above. 

Now I'm thinking of re-purposing that tent into a 315 LEC veg tent. And my 3x3 could become a perpetual drying tent 

Hmmmmmmmm.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 21, 2016)

@MichiganMedGrower 

OR........

You could get a 600W "Blue MH" bulb for veg and kill it in that 3x3 for veg


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 21, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> @MichiganMedGrower
> 
> OR........
> 
> You could get a 600W "Blue MH" bulb for veg and kill it in that 3x3 for veg


Did that the first year with a 400 daylight blue and then switched to the 600 for flowering. Good ol Galaxy selectable wattage ballast.

Now I use a 2x3 propogator with 5 2 ft t-5's for seedlings and clones and the 3x3 now has 10 2 ft bulbs.

3x3

 

And here is the propogator.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 21, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> @MichiganMedGrower
> 
> OR........
> 
> You could get a 600W "Blue MH" bulb for veg and kill it in that 3x3 for veg


I MUCH prefer the light I just got in the mail. 

Thanks, brother!


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 21, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I MUCH prefer the light I just got in the mail.
> 
> Thanks, brother!


YW my friend I know it will serve you well. That one hurt to let go but you know the circumstances. Gotta do what you gotta do.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 21, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> He's a testament to persistence, Less is more. The humblest master of the trade to grace us. I remember back when his threads had pictures. Now all that's left are his teachings. I remember asking really fucked up questions back in the day and he was so humble he would answer the dumbest of inquirys. He's the guy that follows principles and then shows his work. You know just one of those guys a true mad scientist. He does lurk now and then to check us all; however, not a word.. kinda nice to know he's still here!


I'd very much like to make his acquaintance, if that's something you could facilitate I'd be in your debt.

His posted work was inspirational and foundational to my own.


----------



## Warpedpassage (Dec 21, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> I still chat heath up. Got this as an f6 tester 7 years ago. He's alive and well.


Thats good to hear. Hope the guy is well. His grows were truely inspirational, and i do remember him being quite generous with sharing knowledge and experiences.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 21, 2016)

Alright. We harvested the 12.5 week Black Widow x Blue Lemon Thai that has been under the new 315 LEC for more than 2 weeks.

She has foxtailed all over. I thought it was heat stress but it is genetic it seems. I raised the light and tried other plants. It's fine under there.

The other thing is the plant has gone white under the canopy. It seems to green up and finish maturing only when the thick leaves are not in the way.

It's funny because of all the argument for defoliation. But this is a penetration issue I believe. I had the light at 20" like my HPS but have started to lower it.

I should have copied the link but read last night that 16" is the optimal height for max par. I am at 18" now. We will see.

I think the spectrum may have brought out the haze in the widow side. It sure looks like it.

This pheno does normally have fluffier huge sativa type buds but I have never seen this. 

The buds are dense in the middle. This didn't happen until moved from HPS to LEC.

So we picked the fan leaves off to only harvest the top buds.





Here she is after the tops were removed



And I put her back under the Hortilux 600 Super HPS to finish up.



Here are the buds in the drying closet. They are intensely sticky. Much stickier than the only HPS grown ones in the past. When they are done they get drier than this. Maybe more resin from the new lamp.






Any thoughts on the foxtails?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 21, 2016)

Here is my flower room after I finished tonight. You can see the 2 different lights on the plants clearly. 

The Horti supposedly has 25% blue in their spectrum. It sure isn't as red as My old caregivers cheap bulbs at least to my eye. 

The CMH looks and "feels" like sunlight. And it greened up very tired leaves on both ripening plants in a short time. But I can see why they are already making 630 air cooled reflectors. 

But I am of course. New to these and still dialing in so please share your experiences so we can all use these to their potential. 

I have used my original equipment for 3 years and I am still making gains in potency and yield so I think amazing things can be done with this 315 watt lamp. 

Everyone says spectrum trumps lumens. I want to see it happen here.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 21, 2016)

Some more info and a pic. You can see the white buds next to the darker green one on the outside left. 

I also forgot to mention that she had a stamen outbreak out of some of the ends of the foxtails. 

Maybe 10 to 15 singles. Kinda of used to it. The background is Chem and Thai. 

Only found 2 more in the last two weeks and they were hidden a bit so I may have missed them. 

The genetics here are original white widow. Lemon Thai and Toxic Blue 33 which is an ECSD hybrid and a Jack/ Yumbolt hybrid. 

 

I have never seen this under my 600 HPS or the 400w one I use sometimes. And not under a Hortilux 400w daylight blue either. 

Has anyone here? Can't have light bleaching on the bottom. And it is already greening up under the HPS.


----------



## Snucks (Dec 22, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> BOOM.


Hey So i ordered:

http://growershouse.com/prism-lighting-science-315w-cmh-ballast-philips-bulb-combo-120-240v

and 

http://growershouse.com/phantom-315w-ceramic-metal-halide-cmh-reflector

and i guess the reflector and ballast don't have the same connections...

What should i do?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 22, 2016)

Snucks said:


> Hey So i ordered:
> 
> http://growershouse.com/prism-lighting-science-315w-cmh-ballast-philips-bulb-combo-120-240v
> 
> ...


They must have an adapter available? All the Hydrofarm stuff needs them. maybe it uses the same standard Hydrofarm one. Sorry I thought I had a better answer than I do. Lol


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 22, 2016)

https://www.amazon.com/Hydrofarm-BAASP-Plug-Brand-Adapter/dp/B001IQ480S

Here is the part @Snucks


----------



## Snucks (Dec 22, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> https://www.amazon.com/Hydrofarm-BAASP-Plug-Brand-Adapter/dp/B001IQ480S
> 
> Here is the part @Snucks


Thanks man =)
I shouldnt run into any issues using an adapter, right?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 22, 2016)

Snucks said:


> Thanks man =)
> I shouldnt run into any issues using an adapter, right?


That's a good question. I don't know I have not researched it. I am pretty sure the sunlight supply reflector uses the plug your ballast does. 

Exchange?

there are other reflectors too there but I am not sure exactly. I really like my sun system stuff. I just bought the Galaxy ballast and sun remote reflector there on Black Friday.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 22, 2016)

Snucks said:


> Thanks man =)
> I shouldnt run into any issues using an adapter, right?


NO you will not I use three of them no issue.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 22, 2016)

Snucks said:


> Hey So i ordered:
> 
> http://growershouse.com/prism-lighting-science-315w-cmh-ballast-philips-bulb-combo-120-240v
> 
> ...


Fucking jackass hydro store didn't tell you? You need an adaptor, they sell two types; male Hydro farm (oval plug) to female universal AND the reverse. Just be sure to specify the right one.


----------



## pinner420 (Dec 22, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> That's a good question. I don't know I have not researched it. I am pretty sure the sunlight supply reflector uses the plug your ballast does.
> 
> Exchange?
> 
> there are other reflectors too there but I am not sure exactly. I really like my sun system stuff. I just bought the Galaxy ballast and sun remote reflector there on Black Friday.


The universe is nudging you vertically. I have a coffee can full of the adapters I need to craiglist..


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 22, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> The universe is nudging you vertically. I have a coffee can full of the adapters I need to craiglist..


LMAO, me too!


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 22, 2016)

They sent me one of those @Snucks with my CMH315 conversion kit, you should be fine using it.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 22, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> The universe is nudging you vertically. I have a coffee can full of the adapters I need to craiglist..


My 315 hangs vertically


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 22, 2016)

Hey if anyone has any feedback on my posts last night that have already gone back a page I would appreciate it. 

Plenty of pics and info I tried to show best I could. 

The foxtails? The bleached looking buds?

@DemonTrich you have been using these a while?


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 22, 2016)

From my experience, Fox tails can be caused by over fert, too close to lights. One run I had my darlins net come out perfect. Last run, 2 of 4 foxtailed on me. Not like yours though.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 22, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> From my experience, Fox tails can be caused by over fert, too close to lights. One run I had my darlins net come out perfect. Last run, 2 of 4 foxtailed on me. Not like yours though.


thank you. Neither of those should be causes. The plants right next to her did nothing of the sort. 

Any idea about the white buds. The other plant finished under the 315 did it too but only in one spot under the foliage of the main cola. 

The HPS seems to be greening her back up already. 

Light way too high at 22"? That's where it was.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 22, 2016)

Genetics can also play a role. If said parent was prone to FT, that trait can also be passed down the line. Forgot to put that in there.

White bud/leaves = light bleaching. 

On 3 plants, getting reflected side lighting, I'm getting some white hairs Turning brown. I'm guessing at that certain spot, the light is getting reflected more so causing it. I'm not 100% sure though. Just a guess. I'm 4+yrs, I've never seen it happen.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 22, 2016)

I get foxtails from too much heat, happens with my 860W CDM Allstart lamps regularly. 

Yet another reason I'm replacing them all with LED.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 22, 2016)

It's not heat. The room is colder than it has been all year even with the new light. 

It's not light bleaching as the white buds are under all the buds and leaves. Not near any direct light or reflection. 

It's obviously genetic. You guys know too. And the Thai and the haze is very strong in this cross. 

It's going to be neat to break off a resin encrusted foxtail to throw in the pipe when it's dry. 

Maybe I had the light too high. I do maintain a forest of leaves in there. 

Maybe I will post it all in its own thread to see what surfaces. 

Who has the most experience with the cmh grows?


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 22, 2016)

Radiant heat could be another possibility.

I can keep my ambient temps at 75, but still have radiant heat issues if I don't have my fans blowing between canopy tops and bottom of hood.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 22, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Radiant heat could be another possibility.
> 
> I can keep my ambient temps at 75, but still have radiant heat issues if I don't have my fans blowing between canopy tops and bottom of hood.


I agree. But I am real dialed in with no real problems for over a year in this room now. Even just harvested my highest yielding plant so far last week. And it finished under the new light. 

But the lamp may have been too hot under it the first day I had her under there. It took a day or two to get the ventilation right for the whole room. 

Seems more like genetic expression but could be from the hot day I guess. No other plants were affected at all though. 

I put an email into the breeder. I will report in case anyone is interested. 

Thanks for your input man.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 22, 2016)

Just shooting out any possibilities I can think of.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 22, 2016)

Michigan....sorry to not have taken them time then and there.....but those white
buds are just crazy. The only thing that I have seen make bud that white was a mold.
(I learned not to spray down giant tops...dumb move)

That cannot be bleaching obviously and the only other dark-stimulated loss of color
that I have seen is the yellowing of leaf-loss. 

So, I was quiet because nothing helpful came to mind. :0)

JD


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 22, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Radiant heat could be another possibility.
> 
> I can keep my ambient temps at 75, but still have radiant heat issues if I don't have my fans blowing between canopy tops and bottom of hood.


Yep. The biggest surprise for me was when I held the Lighting Passport under the 860W CDM Allstart lamp and saw that the single highest, broadest peak was infrared.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 22, 2016)

I'm gonna be super honest. I'm an awesome grower. When it comes to deficiencies and light spectrum values from one bulb to another, honestly I haven't done my homework. 4 yrs banging out superb runs, but never bothered to read up on those 2 things. I've never had a deficiency yet. At least not one that wasn't remedied by either a normal watering or feeding.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 22, 2016)

I just did my flower room work. For day 24 from flip, these girls are looking great. Only running 1000ppm co2 on fuzzy logic. Ambient temps are 81*. Nice flowers, super frosty (I do use terminator). 

BUT I've noticed on 3 plants out of 21 k may be more), but 1 or 2 bud sites white hairs look like their Turing brown and receding already. Way too early for that shit. 

SO, I'm not really a betting man, but I believe it may be either due to my hood reflecting the light just a certain way. I was thinking it may be too much uva/uvb, but if so, most if not all buds would have funky hairs thing happening.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 22, 2016)

Early hair turning is one thing that I have surely seen under the LEC315.

I checked the trichs to be sure.

The effect seems to vary across breeds.

JD


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 22, 2016)

These are day 24 from flip. On 1 to 2 buds at most on 2 to 3 plants.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 22, 2016)

(not seeing the images...)


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 22, 2016)

Didn't post any

Picture the white hairs receding ever so slightly, and Turing like they would at sat week 6 or so. It's only on a couple on 2 plants or so.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 22, 2016)

Ah, I see. :0)


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 22, 2016)

I'm working in my veg room now. Tons to do, then head home to get my boys 3rd birthday stuff set up. I'll try and get a few pics tomorrow. Turning on my 3rd 315 cmh in veg tonight.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 22, 2016)

Javadog said:


> Michigan....sorry to not have taken them time then and there.....but those white
> buds are just crazy. The only thing that I have seen make bud that white was a mold.
> (I learned not to spray down giant tops...dumb move)
> 
> ...


I didn't mean to come off impatient. I really appreciate you checking it out. 

It's the lamp though. It does not have enough penetration to get through the 600HPS grown plant. These things are thick with buds and leaves

The half plant has greened almost all the way back up under the HPS already. 

It must be a very sensitive sativa genetic. And I stressed her out bad. 

The buds however look and smell fantastic. Maybe the lowers will get good too.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 22, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Didn't post any
> 
> Picture the white hairs receding ever so slightly, and Turing like they would at sat week 6 or so. It's only on a couple on 2 plants or so.



I hate to suggest this but possible pollination?


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 22, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I hate to suggest this but possible pollination?



I don't believe so. I am running 6 new strains I've yet to flower. 2 are from seed, rest were clones from a buddy. I thoroughly inspect those daily. Top to bottom for nanners. I am a very accomplished nanner hunter. Went thru hell for 4 runs with those he-bishes yrs ago. And I used to do paint inspections on 80k to 2.5 million $ paint jobs and restorations. I've got an eagle eye. Knock on wood.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 22, 2016)

I find them when scanning photos I take of my plants.

Not eagle eye....kinda funny....like, what what what?!?!


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 22, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> I don't believe so. I am running 6 new strains I've yet to flower. 2 are from seed, rest were clones from a buddy. I thoroughly inspect those daily. Top to bottom for nanners. I am a very accomplished nanner hunter. Went thru hell for 4 runs with those he-bishes yrs ago. And I used to do paint inspections on 80k to 2.5 million $ paint jobs and restorations. I've got an eagle eye. Knock on wood.


Well you got that covered. And the attention to detail sure shows in your grow. 

I did say I hated to suggest it. But it is the first sign. So I had to just in case.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 23, 2016)

Just to update. 

The lower half of the BW x BLT with the white buds and foxtails under the new 315lec. 

It has already greened mostly up and also finished turning many pistils dark to finish. The buds are actually filling in and getting denser back under the Super HPS 600w. 

  

So what height are you all keeping the 315 above the canopy for flowering?

I have a bud that is now at 16" and shows no stress now that I have my circulation fans set up better. And I read that is where the par and footprint is maxed out. I would say 2.5 feet square of good light from my reflector at that distance. As a guess without a real par meter of course.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 23, 2016)

Mine are farther than that. I also pig out and have plants
way beyond that footprint too....but they all mature nicely.
(not too worried about yield)


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 23, 2016)

Javadog said:


> Mine are farther than that. I also pig out and have plants
> way beyond that footprint too....but they all mature nicely.
> (not too worried about yield)


Cool thanks. I keep my 600's beyond 20". Even 22"-24" for ripening. But I always maintain the proper footprint for my lights. The plants can not grow to their full potential in many other ways than just yield without enough light. It has been known for quite some time now that the full usable light at the proper intensity develops more cannabanoids and terpenes as well as a bigger plant with a larger bloom. 

I think it all goes together. I don't get this "I don't worry about yield" mentality. I don't worry about it either. I keep good light distance. I stress on only feeding exactly what they need individually each time I water and not water the ones that don't need any and that seems to make the most difference in quality. And working the lights better. 

And the better I do these things with each next plant I clone or germinate the more I seem to get and the better the high and terpenes are. 

I agree you can end up with high yield from too much light and heavy nutes too but that hurts quality.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Dec 23, 2016)

Headband. 315s

 Sensi Star. 
 Sensi Star.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 23, 2016)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> View attachment 3859724 Headband. 315s
> 
> View attachment 3859725 Sensi Star.
> View attachment 3859726 Sensi Star.


Nice!

May I ask your light height and how far apart?


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Dec 23, 2016)

Headband live resin
 Blue Dream Whole Plant
 Blue Dream Nug Run

All ran in a closed loop with 70/30 butane/propane mix. Winterized with distilled everclear and Büchner funnel then purged at 100 degrees for 96 hours after recollecting majority of alcohol in a rotor evaporator.

All grown under 315s. My yields on oil returns went up a standard 2-3% across all strains compared to 600w HPS.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Dec 23, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Nice!
> 
> May I ask your light height and how far apart?


36 inches on Center. I honestly don't know the distance right now. Probable 24-36 inches?


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 23, 2016)

Turned on the 3rd 315cmh in veg last nigjt and rearranged my girls. That's my ultrasonic fogger system kicking out rh on the lower right "blur". About 2.5' max to canopy top. In flower I'm about 1.5' or so.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 23, 2016)

Clean work people!


----------



## GroErr (Dec 23, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Just to update.
> 
> The lower half of the BW x BLT with the white buds and foxtails under the new 315lec.
> 
> ...


Hey Michigan catching up on the thread and noticed you posted a few questions. Not running them right now but ran them for 2+ years until just recently and never saw foxtails like that. But I did find they bleached my leaves if I went below 20" or so above the canopy. They're pretty intense directly under the hood so having them around 16" could have contributed to it. Foxtails or not, nice bunch of budz


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 23, 2016)

GroErr said:


> Hey Michigan catching up on the thread and noticed you posted a few questions. Not running them right now but ran them for 2+ years until just recently and never saw foxtails like that. But I did find they bleached my leaves if I went below 20" or so above the canopy. They're pretty intense directly under the hood so having them around 16" could have contributed to it. Foxtails or not, nice bunch of budz


Thanks man. 

But I had the light 22"+ when it happened. 

Ever see the buds with no chlorophyll all white like that down lower?

It is not happening to the next plant now that the lamp is at 18"

And I just saw above demon trich keeps his there for flower. 

It's almost like the plant panicked like all of the sudden there was no light. And she sure freaked out. 

Here is a top bud from the next plant finishing under the new light. The resin production and terpenes seem better than the super HPS again. This time the buds are nice and dense. And quite lemony smelling. 

This one has gone past week 11. The 315 definitely changes the bud structure a bit. They want to bust out kinda. 

Black Widow x Blue Lemon Thai #5


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 23, 2016)

My veg hoods are height adjustable. My flower hoods are fixed. I raise my.plants with milk crates or cinder blocks.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 23, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> My veg hoods are height adjustable. My flower hoods are fixed. I raise my.plants with milk crates or cinder blocks.


Me too. I use 1" cut pieces of stuff to allow me to adjust height in small increments too. Have to with all the different size plants. And I bought every 6" plastic storage crate Walmart had.


----------



## GroErr (Dec 23, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Thanks man.
> 
> But I had the light 22"+ when it happened.
> 
> ...


It is a bit strange but I have seen differences recently when I switched over to COBs, spectrum does affect plants (if you've grown same strain both indoor and outdoor some can look like different strains altogether sometimes). Could be something with that strain/pheno and how it's reacting to the 315's. I think you and @Javadog noticed how they mature faster, particularly the hairs which I'd noticed right away when I first started running the 315's, they definitely have some unique spectrum and resulting effects compared to other lighting. Nice bud and classic look to it when running under these LEC's.


----------



## dangledo (Dec 23, 2016)

I've had Kali mist shoot crazy tails like that when I ran too high of n midway through flower. I'll see if I can dig up some pics.


----------



## full of purple (Dec 23, 2016)

How far should I run this light from plants
Seedlings?
Veg?
Flower?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 23, 2016)

dangledo said:


> I've had Kali mist shoot crazy tails like that when I ran too high of n midway through flower. I'll see if I can dig up some pics.


Sweet thanks!

I was adding to much for a while but I thought I had worked that out by this particular plant. But things we do earlier can always show late in flower. 

I also wonder if I let her go too long and it is overgrowth. It has been accompanied by some bananas. 

Sativa heavy hybrids are tricky.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 23, 2016)

full of purple said:


> How far should I run this light from plants
> Seedlings?
> Veg?
> Flower?


That's an Olds Cutlass in your avatar pic, isn't it?


----------



## full of purple (Dec 23, 2016)

Yes my old cutty
Has a 454 in it now before 350 bored out


ttystikk said:


> That's an Olds Cutlass in your avatar pic, isn't it?[/QUOTE


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 23, 2016)

full of purple said:


> Yes my old cutty
> Has a 454 in it now before 350 bored out


Blasphemer! Lol

The only fat block that belongs under the good is a properly built Olds 455!

I've built a couple in my time and they pull HARD, bro- NHRA mfr's championship in Pro Stock hard, even when outnumbered by hordes of Chevys and Fords.


----------



## Craig1969SS (Dec 23, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Blasphemer! Lol
> 
> The only fat block that belongs under the good is a properly built Olds 455!
> 
> I've built a couple in my time and they pull HARD, bro- NHRA mfr's championship in Pro Stock hard, even when outnumbered by hordes of Chevys and Fords.


Sure they pull hard cuz they have half a foot of stroke lol and hit like a jackhammer ....Idk man my 302 @ 8500... Id send you over to the tractor pulls where you belong lol. Just a little jab man


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 23, 2016)

Craig1969SS said:


> Sure they pull hard *cuz they have half a foot of stroke lol and hit like a jackhammer *....Idk man my 302 @ 8500... Id send you over to the tractor pulls where you belong lol. Just a little jab man


Damn straight it did!

Low et wins the race, bro.

Just the memory of the torque that thing made gets my heartrate up, lol

My 7.6 liter fat block (.060 over) would spin to 6500rpm, a snarl you would feel in your bones- betcha my Comp Cams 292H was bigger than the cam in your smallblock. It would still idle at 650rpm.

It was a force of nature lol


----------



## full of purple (Dec 24, 2016)

I'm actually building a 455 now 
I got the 454 for 500 from my relative who spent about 4K in parts building it not including labor 
Only reason I went threw the hassle of mating every thing up
And it's different 
Same reason I dropped the 350 in he built that one also
Shit I only paid 100 for the lec 315 watt only 1 month old lol


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 24, 2016)

I have a 5.7 hemi in my jeep grand cherokee. Does that count? Lol


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 24, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> I have a 5.7 hemi in my jeep grand cherokee. Does that count? Lol


It does to me. I will be jeep shopping next year after my move, will finally have a justification for the wrangler I've always wanted once I'm up North


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 24, 2016)

A month ago I scored an 08 limited grand cherokee, fully loaded, 4x4 low, nav, heated front/rear seats, moon roof, parking sensors with 76k miles for 13k. Put some new nitto Terra grappler g2 tires, full fluid change, 3" lift (suspension). FN LOVE this jeep. Went drifting with the wife and kid few weeks ago when we got 7" snow. Was super fun. 1st jeep ever.

BUT, the 5.7 hemis are notorious for having oil leak from the plug on rings into the plug sleeves. Need to change both valve cover and all plug o ring gaskets. 900 dealer fix or 600 small repair shop fix. My back 2 plug sleeves on both banks were full of oil as we're the plugs.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 24, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> It does to me. I will be jeep shopping next year after my move, will finally have a justification for the wrangler I've always wanted once I'm up North


Fucking things are death traps, especially on the highway. Please consider another vehicle.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 24, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> A month ago I scored an 08 limited grand cherokee, fully loaded, 4x4 low, nav, heated front/rear seats, moon roof, parking sensors with 76k miles for 13k. Put some new nitto Terra grappler g2 tires, full fluid change, 3" lift (suspension). FN LOVE this jeep. Went drifting with the wife and kid few weeks ago when we got 7" snow. Was super fun. 1st jeep ever.
> 
> BUT, the 5.7 hemis are notorious for having oil leak from the plug on rings into the plug sleeves. Need to change both valve cover and all plug o ring gaskets. 900 dealer fix or 600 small repair shop fix. My back 2 plug sleeves on both banks were full of oil as we're the plugs.


I'm holding out for a Tesla.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 24, 2016)

Until it runs your ass over like it did to that actor.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 24, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Until it runs your ass over like it did to that actor.


Lol I'm not stupid enough to trust automated controls the manufacturer says are 'in beta'.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 24, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Fucking things are death traps, especially on the highway. Please consider another vehicle.


I've always wanted something nice and 4x4 but could never justify the cost to myself as a flat lander so after the move wanted something to go mudding with my brother on the weekend every now and then. Maybe will consider a truck instead will be more practical when the kids visit and for dailly driving. Or I'll just keep my sedan and get a bike for the twisty's we will see lol......


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 24, 2016)

Fuck riding bikes on the street. Too many fuck-tards that can't drive or see tou. Once.you set foot...or rather rubber on a track, you'll never ride the street again.

Here's a sweet little video of me riding ccw (counter clockwise at my home track). The pros are only about 17 seconds faster than me and are on 150k+ bikes.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 24, 2016)

On board a 2007 Suzuki gsxr 600, about a 30k race bike. Fully dyno mapped, and on the fly adjustments. Ohlins forks (7000.00). 

I'd gladly.give up growing to go back to racing. Had 2 very bad highsides at this track. Both I have no memory of.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 24, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> On board a 2007 Suzuki gsxr 600, about a 30k race bike. Fully dyno mapped, and on the fly adjustments. Ohlins forks (7000.00).
> 
> I'd gladly.give up growing to go back to racing. Had 2 very bad highsides at this track. Both I have no memory of.


My ass hauling days on two wheels are over. I feel fortunate to have survived them. Even remembering some of my near misses still gives me clammy hands.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 24, 2016)

CCW at this track, going around t1 there 2' of run off right into a guard rail. That's a 90+mph turn.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 24, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> CCW at this track, going around t1 there 2' of run off right into a guard rail. That's a 90+mph turn.


Dude, maybe you should take up a less dangerous pastime. 

Like gardening, maybe. 

Lol


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 24, 2016)

It's more dangerous riding/driving on the streets vs racing on the track. Guaranteed.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 24, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> It's more dangerous riding/driving on the streets vs racing on the track. Guaranteed.


...and you have no memories of the injuries to prove it! 

LMAO

Seriously, riding a motorcycle at speed anywhere is an inherently dangerous activity. 

I condone the use of race tracks to haul ass, but 'safer' is relative in this case. 

The older I get, the more I appreciate the rolling cage sitting in my driveway!


----------



## SomeGuy (Dec 24, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Fucking things are death traps, especially on the highway. Please consider another vehicle.


Yes. Like a Toyota. . Toyotas rule off-road.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 24, 2016)

SomeGuy said:


> Yes. Like a Toyota. . Toyotas rule off-road.


I personally watched a Jeep Wrangler flip and pirouette in midair while in traffic on a freeway. No one had touched it.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Dec 24, 2016)

SomeGuy said:


> Yes. Like a Toyota. . Toyotas rule off-road.


They're also a lot more expensive I would love to get one.

Is there a model in particular? I like the FJR's but have heard horror stories on forums about them long term.......


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 24, 2016)

There are NO idiot drivers on a race track. No grandmas, no texting assholes, no pot holes, no stop lights, nothing but you, your bike, a sweet ass course and orher bikers who have the same thing in mind. There is NO debris, oil, or other shit on the roadways. Racers arw classed by their skill level. Both crashed were operator error. Had I crashed on the streets, I'd be dead. Theirs ambulances at the tracks. None on the streets, or at least not with in 20 mins of the twisty back roads we used to run weekly.

I can go on and on and on. I put 15yrs of riding on the streets immediately behind me after 6 times at the track. I had more near misses on the streets in a day, than issues at the track. I've been sideswippee, ran I to curbs, cut off, hit from behind. But the streets are safer. LMAO


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 24, 2016)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I've always wanted something nice and 4x4 but could never justify the cost to myself as a flat lander so after the move wanted something to go mudding with my brother on the weekend every now and then. Maybe will consider a truck instead will be more practical when the kids visit and for dailly driving. Or I'll just keep my sedan and get a bike for the twisty's we will see lol......


I was a car dealer manager for 20 years almost and jeep wranglers have every modern safety feature any American market car has. 

They do have tons of mechanical problems traditionally though. But not a lot more than the grand Cherokee which is not built for real off road use.

Jeep wranglers were a lot of fun up at Tiger Road near Breckenridge. 

You can unlock the front suspension and lock the front differential and climb most any rock.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 24, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Fuck riding bikes on the street. Too many fuck-tards that can't drive or see tou. Once.you set foot...or rather rubber on a track, you'll never ride the street again.
> 
> Here's a sweet little video of me riding ccw (counter clockwise at my home track). The pros are only about 17 seconds faster than me and are on 150k+ bikes.


Awesome Demon. I have a bit of history with fast cars and bikes. 

I have swithched to riding trail bicycles when I still can. We have 1000's of miles of maintained trails in the woods here. 

I keep wanting a new dirt bike though. I rode my friends Honda 450 and man I want to blast trails. 

I miss my 30's In Colorado before my illness got bad. 

4x4's, dirt bikes, atv's, snowboards. I miss adrenalin sports.


----------



## a senile fungus (Dec 24, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Awesome Demon. I have a bit of history with fast cars and bikes.
> 
> I have swithched to riding trail bicycles when I still can. We have 1000's of miles of maintained trails in the woods here.
> 
> ...


I'm in MI too and i just got into mountain biking this year. what are your favorite trails? i've only been to local ones so far but i'm compiling a list of good bike trails for 2017.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 24, 2016)

My buddies hit up stoney Creek all the time. Awesome man bike trails. Novice to expert.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 24, 2016)

a senile fungus said:


> I'm in MI too and i just got into mountain biking this year. what are your favorite trails? i've only been to local ones so far but i'm compiling a list of good bike trails for 2017.


I like to get on the North country trail out of white cloud sometimes but I hav gotten more I'll as time passes and tend to ride in the woods around home. 

Single tracks everywhere here ya know. 

Look up Michigan mountain biking on YouTube. There are tons of go pro videos and locations listed.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 24, 2016)

@MichiganMedGrower 

I used to work at a very high end exotic car dealership, then went to work doing show car and custom work for one of the big 3 Auto companies. I've driven 3 bugatti veyrons (1.5 million car, 1001hp), probably 30 different Lamborghini's (3x Reventon 450k car) , 7 or 8 Porsche Carrera GT (450k car), classic one-off concept cars, 1st built and last built cars, did a 2 million dollar resto on a 32 Buick. You could eat off every square inch of it. If anyone wants me to post pics of said cars or would like private pics of cars, either make a new thread, or pm me an email addy. 

Oh, one of the baddest cars I had the pleasure of working on was a certain yellow car from a certain "robot" movie that had mark wahlburgers in the last one. Confidentially agreements suck ass. So I have to beat around the bush so to speak. Dumb ass cop ran thru the movie set barricade and did a head on collusion with the car during a shoot. Production was halted for 30 days for us to repair it. And NO, the seat didn't smell like her ass guys (see 1st and 2nd movies). But she is a major Hottie. You kbknknow who she is. B.A.G. wife. 

Now back to the 315 thread. Damn hijackers always ruining things with cars and booty. Lol


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 24, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> @MichiganMedGrower
> 
> I used to work at a very high end exotic car dealership, then went to work doing show car and custom work for one of the big 3 Auto companies. I've driven 3 bugatti veyrons (1.5 million car, 1001hp), probably 30 different Lamborghini's (3x Reventon 450k car) , 7 or 8 Porsche Carrera GT (450k car), classic one-off concept cars, 1st built and last built cars, did a 2 million dollar resto on a 32 Buick. You could eat off every square inch of it. If anyone wants me to post pics of said cars or would like private pics of cars, either make a new thread, or pm me an email addy.
> 
> ...


Very cool man. I ran the used car department of a few fun ones. Jaguar, Acura, and Cadillac gmc And all the trades from those customers. 

The jag dealer in New Jersey was owned by Tom Hessert. Jaguar team driver at one time and won a 24 hour endurance race in the last lap with a blown radiator and his head out the window to see with the hot coolant everywhere. 

He let me drive some fun stuff on the side too. 

Start a car thread man. Many would probably like that here.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 24, 2016)

I have pics on my.phone and laptop. I'll try on Monday to get it up. I have motor, undercarriage shots of lamb's, Carrera GT, bugatti, ect. $$$$ in carbon fiber


----------



## Javadog (Dec 24, 2016)

Fun Thread!


----------



## markmax (Dec 25, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> I have pics on my.phone and laptop. I'll try on Monday to get it up. I have motor, undercarriage shots of lamb's, Carrera GT, bugatti, ect. $$$$ in carbon fiber


*Sounds good I'm in.*


----------



## purpleball (Dec 25, 2016)

Would a 315 lec work well in a 2x4x6 tent you think? Would the heat or electricity usage be a lot? I've been trying to decide between cmh, and cobs. Right now I have 2 300 watt king led.


----------



## Craig1969SS (Dec 25, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> I'm holding out for a Tesla.





ttystikk said:


> I'm holding out for a Tesla.


They're here kinda almost... I think it's a Model S with the now bigger 100kw battery. Its the 3rd fastest production car ever and it's only the second model. Going to be hard to compete with 100% torque at 0 rpm and 0-60 in 2.6. But like all rechargeable batteries when you push them they get hot,...hot batteries flame out quickly and it's a $30,000 replacement.. Keep holding out


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 26, 2016)

purpleball said:


> Would a 315 lec work well in a 2x4x6 tent you think? Would the heat or electricity usage be a lot? I've been trying to decide between cmh, and cobs. Right now I have 2 300 watt king led.


I think yes but maybe in a cool tube type set up. And it would fall short a bit at the ends for flowering.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 26, 2016)

Craig1969SS said:


> They're here kinda almost... I think it's a Model S with the now bigger 100kw battery. Its the 3rd fastest production car ever and it's only the second model. Going to be hard to compete with 100% torque at 0 rpm and 0-60 in 2.6. But like all rechargeable batteries when you push them they get hot,...hot batteries flame out quickly and it's a $30,000 replacement.. Keep holding out


I'm not worried about burning a battery, I can only accelerate so much lol

Replacement battery prices are falling too. This is an even bigger boost to the industry.


----------



## pinner420 (Dec 27, 2016)

purpleball said:


> Would a 315 lec work well in a 2x4x6 tent you think? Would the heat or electricity usage be a lot? I've been trying to decide between cmh, and cobs. Right now I have 2 300 watt king led.


Drop in two and put your kings in there too. Bumper...


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 27, 2016)

Well here is a plant that has been finishing under the new 315 LEC for over 2 weeks. 

Upper leaves were removed for harvest. 

It has blown up fatter and more colorful and stronger lemon smelling than any BW x BLT
of this pheno before it. 

The buds are huge and dense. The weird foxtail plant was a genetic anomaly I guess. 

Pics!

    

The 600 Hortilux Super HPS started this but look at the bud grown out of the bend from super cropping this stretchy Thai leaning plant.



Both cmh finished plants were still so healthy despite long flowering we decided to try to double harvest this one too and put the lower half of the plant back in the flower room to fatten up with her sister. 

 



I love this shit!


----------



## markmax (Dec 27, 2016)

Very nice indeed.....


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 27, 2016)

markmax said:


> Very nice indeed.....


Thank you very much.....


----------



## a senile fungus (Dec 27, 2016)

@MichiganMedGrower what size pot is that?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 27, 2016)

a senile fungus said:


> @MichiganMedGrower what size pot is that?


Go Pro Premium Nursery pot #3. Or a North American 3 gallon which is really 2.4 I believe.


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 27, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Go Pro Premium Nursery pot #3. Or a North American 3 gallon which is really 2.4 I believe.


What's BW x BLT? nice plant


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 27, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> What's BW x BLT? nice plant


Sorry. It's a CH9 Black Widow x Blue Lemon Thai. 

Mr. Nice original white widow (long renamed) crossed with Toxic Blue 33 ( Ch9 Motarebel hybrid) and Lemon Thai (Mota) which is BLT. 

I have a few different crosses going. 

The POW33 crosses are ripening next. I am comparing his old best with his newer Motatebel stuff. 

And some other stuff like Classic Seeds Headband and I was gifted a Deadhead OG and an actual Stella (Blue Dream S-1)

All are growing or flowering.

Since I have gotten carried away with this post I will also mention Ch9 Critical Mass 33 x BLT and OG Kush x Trainwreck. 

Pete at Ch9 even gave me some new POW33 x BLT seeds to try. I think I got it into his head to cross his old and new. They are not available and he does not use testers. He is a classic breeder. 

My avatar is a different Pheno of the Black Widow x Blue Lemon Thai. The classic Widow frosty pheno. He honored me by using that pic from my garden in his catalog. 

Got some serious fire ahead my friend


----------



## Javadog (Dec 27, 2016)

Yeah, Mr Nice had to use new names for his own breeds. Business bullcrud.

I recall thinking that Prince changing his name to a "symbol" was ridiculous....then
I learned that he lost the rights to his name. LOL. At that point I'd make the
studios release my album under a goofy name too.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 27, 2016)

We just smoked a sample of the Black Widow x Blue Lemon Thai plant that foxtailed like crazy at the end. 

This one:

 

It tastes like pure Haze. And it is seriously messing up my vision while I type this. 

It has loose braid like buds that have an amazing amount of resin glands to plant matter. And they taste a bit peppery and sagey. 

Mrs. Med Grower is sitting next to me with a classic "perma grin" giggling at everything.


----------



## a senile fungus (Dec 27, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Sorry. It's a CH9 Black Widow x Blue Lemon Thai.
> 
> Mr. Nice original white widow (long renamed) crossed with Toxic Blue 33 ( Ch9 Motarebel hybrid) and Lemon Thai (Mota) which is BLT.
> 
> ...


I think we know the same people, or at least run in close circles


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 27, 2016)

a senile fungus said:


> I think we know the same people, or at least run in close circles


I haven't been around long so I'm not sure what circle I am running in.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Dec 28, 2016)

Can anyone shed light on the 315lec being set up as 220v?

I have 110 now and would like to hard wire new 220v ones on a dedicated breaker board. 

Right now I run the phantom from hydrofarm. It does not appear to have a switch.

Thanks


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 28, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Can anyone shed light on the 315lec being set up as 220v?
> 
> I have 110 now and would like to hard wire new 220v ones on a dedicated breaker board.
> 
> ...


If you mean 120/240v , my CMH 315 ballast does both 
http://growershouse.com/prism-lighting-science-315w-ceramic-mh-ballast-120-240v


----------



## Javadog (Dec 28, 2016)

I bought my LEC without specifying the voltage....stupid...well, I had to buy
a converter but it is working fine.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 28, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Can anyone shed light on the 315lec being set up as 220v?
> 
> I have 110 now and would like to hard wire new 220v ones on a dedicated breaker board.
> 
> ...


110/220V? Are you sure you don't have 120/240V?

In any case the driver automatically detects voltage and acts accordingly.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 28, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Can anyone shed light on the 315lec being set up as 220v?
> 
> I have 110 now and would like to hard wire new 220v ones on a dedicated breaker board.
> 
> ...


The Galaxy LEC ballast has an optional power cord available and runs on both voltages.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 28, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> 110/220V? Are you sure you don't have 120/240V?
> 
> In any case the driver automatically detects voltage and acts accordingly.


Careful. The original Phillips ballast loaded units are 220 only. They use a built in step down transformer for 110. That's why they cost more than the commercial units. 

Just FYI


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Dec 28, 2016)

Thanks all yes 120v versus 240v

Am I under the wrong impression that using a 240 will reduce operating cost ?

I would have my friend who is an electrician do this but I want to buy the correct ballast


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 28, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Thanks all yes 120v versus 240v
> 
> Am I under the wrong impression that using a 240 will reduce operating cost ?
> 
> I would have my friend who is an electrician do this but I want to buy the correct ballast


Most of these ballasts prefer 240V. My Philips won't run on 120V at all. The square wave needs plenty of headroom to work properly- think high end amps for audio.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 28, 2016)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Thanks all yes 120v versus 240v
> 
> Am I under the wrong impression that using a 240 will reduce operating cost ?
> 
> I would have my friend who is an electrician do this but I want to buy the correct ballast



No the electricity costs the same but it reduces the load on the circuit. You can run about double the amps on the same breaker.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 28, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Most of these ballasts prefer 240V. My Philips won't run on 120V at all. The square wave needs plenty of headroom to work properly- think high end amps for audio.



The Phillips ballast is made to be run on 220 but "prefer" has nothing to do with it. 

and my high end audio systems always worked fine plugged into the 110 living room outlet with the plug that came with it.


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 28, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> The Phillips ballast is made to be run on 220 but "prefer" has nothing to do with it.
> 
> and my high end audio systems always worked fine plugged into the 110 living room outlet with the plug that came with it.


Prefer = cooler operation, more efficient, more light, longer life.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 28, 2016)

ttystikk said:


> Prefer = cooler operation, more efficient, more light, longer life.


Right. None of that applies to the voltage in this case.


----------



## pinner420 (Dec 29, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> No the electricity costs the same but it reduces the load on the circuit. You can run about double the amps on the same breaker.


You really are trying to say you can run double the ballasts on the same circuit. The circuits amp rating doesn't change.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 29, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> You really are trying to say you can run double the ballasts on the same circuit. The circuits amp rating doesn't change.


Yes. Thank you.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 29, 2016)

315w @110v is 2.8a
315w @220v is 1.6a (iirc)
This is on prism ballasts


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Dec 29, 2016)

pinner420 said:


> You really are trying to say you can run double the ballasts on the same circuit. The circuits amp rating doesn't change.


Yes thank you now I understand


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 29, 2016)

Here are the next 2 plants finishing under the LEC. The light is really bringing out the colors. 

In front Citral Pow 33 in rear Pow 33

 

Pow 33
 

Citral Pow 33


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 29, 2016)

@MichiganMedGrower 
How far is your canopy top to bottom of hoods?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 29, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> @MichiganMedGrower
> How far is your canopy top to bottom of hoods?


The buds under the 600 HPS air cooled sealed reflectors are 18"-22" and the buds under the 315 LEC open reflector are now at 16"-18". 

I adjust for relaxed leaf happiness as much as possible.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 29, 2016)

Veg and flower are about 1.5 to 2' max in my rooms. They seem happy


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 29, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Veg and flower are about 1.5 to 2' max in my rooms. They seem happy


I only have 1515 watts total in my flower room. 3 lamps in a 9' x 7' room. The footprints are 3.5' x 7' under the 2 air cooled 600's and about 2.75' x 2.75' under the 315 in an "L" shape. 

You have more reflectors don't you? Has to play into the light height. 

Also I am using very direct down reflectors the overlap is minor. Do your hoods have a strong overlap? That would allow higher light placement too I think.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 29, 2016)

I run 3x315 940 in veg plus 4x4' 4 bulb t8 (6500k) on the sides of the hoods. In flower I run 4x315 930.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 29, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> I run 3x315 940 in veg plus 4x4' 4 bulb t8 (6500k) on the sides of the hoods. In flower I run 4x315 930.


I must have better ventilation than I think. 

I can't find the link but a company printed the max par on the sun system LEC was at 16"

And they were using 3' centered spacing. They said 2.5 x 2.5' was it for proper flowering. And at that point they say it competes with a Hortilux 600 Super HPS at equal yield but higher quality. 

From my observations so far next to the HPS lamps I agree with the information.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 29, 2016)

So far I'm LOVING it. Less ac usage, but it's winter as well. Got the super frost going, but I also use terpinator. All perfectly green leaves. No deficiencies as of yet, knock on wood. I'll know come harvest time or a week earlier if it's better or not.


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 30, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> So far I'm LOVING it. Less ac usage, but it's winter as well. Got the super frost going, but I also use terpinator. All perfectly green leaves. No deficiencies as of yet, knock on wood. I'll know come harvest time or a week earlier if it's better or not.


If you looking for a cheap organic alternative to terpenator try using langbenite , it works great.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 30, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> If you looking for a cheap organic alternative to terpenator try using langbenite , it works great.



Isn't that what they extract humic acid from?


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 30, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Isn't that what they extract humic acid from?


Not exactly sure, it's potash of sulfate .


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 30, 2016)

Dr who posted the ingredients to make terpinator and sweet n raw (sugar daddy) But I have no time to source them. Easier just to buy the bottles


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 30, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> Dr who posted the ingredients to make terpinator and sweet n raw (sugar daddy) But I have no time to source them. Easier just to buy the bottles


Yeah I agree. I have no problem buying bottled products. But I also think both of those products are a waste of money For a container grow.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 30, 2016)

The proof is in the frost. It helps all but 1 of 15 strains I run. Well worth the $$ imo.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 30, 2016)

DemonTrich said:


> The proof is in the frost. It helps all but 1 of 15 strains I run. Well worth the $$ imo.


If added pk or sulfer helps in any way you were missing enough of those elements somehow. 

And in a peat lite type mix the plants don't uptake what you are pouring in unless the soil releases it. Most of the salts like that just build up. 

So maybe if the conditions are right you are seeing what you think you are seeing.


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 30, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> If added pk or sulfer helps in any way you were missing enough of those elements somehow.
> 
> And in a peat lite type mix the plants don't uptake what you are pouring in unless the soil releases it. Most of the salts like that just build up.
> 
> So maybe if the conditions are right you are seeing what you think you are seeing.


Sulfur is very important for terpene production, i use langbenite and garden gypsum, HUGE increase in flavors and essential oils.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 30, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> Sulfur is very important for terpene production, i use langbenite and garden gypsum, HUGE increase in flavors and essential oils.


Sulfer is needed as a trace element with many others. It is all just like vitamins for the plant. Environment and genetics and a good grow is what does everything. The plant does not need an excess of anything and can not use it. 

There is sulfer in my soil water and nutes. Adding more is needless. Except to the sellers of gardening additives.


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 30, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Sulfer is needed as a trace element with many others. It is all just like vitamins for the plant. Environment and genetics and a good grow is what does everything. The plant does not need an excess of anything and can not use it.
> 
> There is sulfer in my soil water and nutes. Adding more is needless. Except to the sellers of gardening additives.


Yea definitely don't use too much sulfur it tends to burn the plant, i use my amendments when i make my soil. It cooks for a few months in my garage to get the microbes going and cool it down.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 30, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> Yea definitely don't use too much sulfur it tends to burn the plant, i use my amendments when i make my soil. It cooks for a few months in my garage to get the microbes going and cool it down.


And you likely need all of the stuff you put in. But saying an additive makes more terps. Or more trichs. Or even more plant. Is just not how it works. 

Now the light spectrum and uv stuff. Science and results are showing something there. 

But a complete nutrient profile for an individual plant type is all that is needed. We will know the proper NPK and micros soon enough from legal weed. Just like the corn farmers know exactly what their corn needs. The differences in flavor and such is from breeding. Not feeding. 

And the farmers will say that the "sugar water" or something is their secret just like us. But they are mistaken as well.

It's not so much that some soils are better for plants. Just that some are lacking what they need. And when we add the missing ingredient and the magic happens. We come here and post what we saw. Like we did something special. 

I guess that's what Bro science is. I never heard the term until I came here.


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 30, 2016)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> And you likely need all of the stuff you put in. But saying an additive makes more terps. Or more trichs. Or even more plant. Is just not how it works.
> 
> Now the light spectrum and uv stuff. Science and results are showing something there.
> 
> ...


Building a complete soil is definitely something that takes some practice and trial and error, i been making my own mix for like 2 years now and i think i am finally getting good at it.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 30, 2016)

Yodaweed said:


> Building a complete soil is definitely something that takes some practice and trial and error, i been making my own mix for like 2 years now and i think i am finally getting good at it.


I have a feeling I will head in this direction myself. My problem is I am sure that my custom feeding every different plant in my garden separately is the reason for my increasing results in potency and yield. 

I mix a seperate gallon for every plant that needs it. And never water any plant early. I set them aside every day and rotate them. 

This is the key to my results. 

The better I do each time with each plant the better the product gets and weight. 

How will I mix the super soil unless I choose 1 strain and practice?

That's why I still do a hybrid with bottle of nutes.


----------



## full of purple (Dec 30, 2016)

About 10 days before I run my 315 yay


----------



## medicated00420 (Dec 31, 2016)

Just swapped out my magnetic 1000hps for a 315cmh and digital 600hps eventually going to replace the 600 and go with 2x315s and 200 watts of cobs on th edges


----------



## Javadog (Dec 31, 2016)

Sound plan. Good luck! :0)


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 31, 2016)

medicated00420 said:


> Just swapped out my magnetic 1000hps for a 315cmh and digital 600hps eventually going to replace the 600 and go with 2x315s and 200 watts of cobs on th edges


I added a 315 to my room with 2 600 super HPS and the results are pretty great so far. I can't do it in the room I am using but if I build a larger space I would go 1 Hortilux super HPS to 1 315 LEC per about 6'x3.5 footprint. 

Right now I am using it as a finishing lamp. 

But The buds in the overlap look the best to me.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 2, 2017)

Ok. 315 LEC harvest update. I posted these I. The random pics thread but feel this is important to share with out LEC growers. 

I have never found my plants lower buds lacking structure, density, size or ripeness but both plants removed from the 600 Super HPS side and finishing for 2-3 weeks under the new 315 LEC at even 18" from the canopy had whispy undone loose lowers. 

They were also the tastiest smelliest dankest most potent trippy plants to come out of my garden I am sure due to uv and the missing blue in my spectrum before. 

So........

Here is the foxtailing Black Widow x BLT I showed a bit back with the tops harvested and lower 1/2 put back under HPS. 

 

And here she is about a week later. Left at about 20" from the Hortilux 600 Super HPS. 

 

Got plenty of bud growth and a bit of density back. It is an obvious intensity issue and I am sure the 630 fixtures are made to address this issue. But I can't support any more electricity in my growrooms. Or honestly manage more heat or air cooled lamps. 

So I am going to try rotating all plants from the beginning of flower as equally as possible between the lights and hope I keep the benefits of the ceramic metal halide and the Super HPS. 

And that's my honest opinion from what I have seen so far. 

I really want to double up the lamps to even out the light in my room. 2 600HPS and 2 LEC 315. 

Each pair over a 3.5' x 5' footprint. I may rebuild the present room to have the LEC in between the 2 Blockbuster 600's for a 3.5' x 8' footprint. 

But that would not be as ideal for the full spectrum.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 4, 2017)

Here's a nice long pic filled update since I am sure the differences in color and in part the more obvious phenotype expression I am seeing. And more potent interesting pot for sure is growing under the Phillips 3100k 315 LEC. 

I have also been experimenting with lower doses of nutes and a good taper towards the finish and water/nute only when the plants are ready. 

It has cut a third of the fertilizer I thought I needed out. This has happened before. Better roots bigger plants but need less to grow. 

And I have started rotating all the plants equally under both types of lights. And have included the overlap spot which really always seems to be spurring strong plant response. 

Well here is my garden before I closed up. 

  

And here is the Citral Pow 33

 

 

 

And here is the Headband. All of the colors have come out in 2 days in the overlap then under the LEC only. It was not changing the day before under the super HPS. 

I am keeping this lamp in my room just for the bag appeal. Lol. 

 

 

I would say I am a believer in the 315 LEC for a 2.5' x 2.5' footprint and I am at 16" above the canopy to get the bud growth similar to the 600w Hortilux Super HPS. 

I will continue to combine them. I love my room like this. But I think ideally I would use both lights in a 6' x 3.5' area. 

But I don't have enoufh space or wattage available to try. 

Thanks for the feedback on my install and everything guys.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Jan 4, 2017)

What are the genetics of that Citrsl Pow? I love that plant. How is the effect ?

Thanks Alta


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 4, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> What are the genetics of that Citrsl Pow? I love that plant. How is the effect ?
> 
> Thanks Alta


I only grew one of these 2 years ago from a free seed they sent to try. It was very strong full body and head high and a delicious lemony and Hashy flavor.

But that plant was grown with 2 years less experience and I am really looking forward to this one.

It is Chitral (land race) x POW (Prisoner of War-Pacific G-13/ Hashplant x Purple Indica ) x Jack 33 ( hash plant, power plant , Jack Herrer, Mazar, and Flower)

I think this is right. He is not making seeds right now his catalog is missing this one now.

Correction:

I forgot that 98 Aloha White Widow was crossed into the Pow33 before the Citral pow.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Jan 5, 2017)

Can someone give me some info in this Hydrofarm Powerbox?

https://hydrobuilder.com/6-light-240v-controller-conf.html

vs.

https://hydrobuilder.com/combination-240v-120v-conf.html?dzid=strands_DPC-7500-COMBO-CONF

First off is it Junk?

Second can this be used for 4 315 smh in 12/12 and then also run 2 lights on a 18/6?

Does the length of cords from the ballast to the fixture have a limit? Meaning if I ran the 18/6 lights in another room can I only have that cord so many feet?

Does this have separate timers for the upper and lower sets of plugs?

https://hydrobuilder.com/powerbox-dpc-15000-10-light-controller-with-digital-ammeter.html?dzid=strands_DPC-15000-CONF

Thanks


----------



## Sire Killem All (Jan 5, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Can someone give me some info in this Hydrofarm Powerbox?
> 
> https://hydrobuilder.com/6-light-240v-controller-conf.html
> 
> ...


None of those will do what u want. It has 2 outlets that are either on same timer as test or it is always on.
I use a ,
http://growershouse.com/titan-controls-helios-8-8-light-controller-240v
It will let u do what u want.


----------



## Craig1969SS (Jan 5, 2017)

I have to ask, what are they growing in? It looks like a litter box and not a pot. Is it rockwool? Or am I seeing the pictures wrong? Hard to tell. Thanks. BTW I stopped all of the "add on" nutrients last grow. Top ppm is 700 with alternating dynagrow one week and floranova bloom the next. Both are affordable 1 part nutes. Results with daily feedings are far better than with other expensive brands that recommend 3-4 even 5 add ons.


----------



## Sire Killem All (Jan 9, 2017)

Decided to rearrange my room for this next run and try to max my light out put.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jan 9, 2017)

hey there guys, just gathering funds to order a cmh light, I have been setting cash aside for a Sun Systems CMH however I just came across this light, and if comparable, it would save me about 3 hundred a light, after currency exchange and shipping.

http://www.growlights.ca/fusion-series-vertical-315w-cmh-ceramic-metal-halide-complete-kit.html


----------



## Sire Killem All (Jan 10, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> hey there guys, just gathering funds to order a cmh light, I have been setting cash aside for a Sun Systems CMH however I just came across this light, and if comparable, it would save me about 3 hundred a light, after currency exchange and shipping.
> 
> http://www.growlights.ca/fusion-series-vertical-315w-cmh-ceramic-metal-halide-complete-kit.html


I would call them and ask about their warranty, it not stated in the page, and their terms say unless stated it would be 30 days. That might be a deciding factor in my opinion, but besides that it don't look bad.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jan 10, 2017)

Sire Killem All said:


> I would call them and ask about their warranty, it not stated in the page, and their terms say unless stated it would be 30 days. That might be a deciding factor in my opinion, but besides that it don't look bad.


I have tried calling, no response, so I fired off an email and see what they have to say

I asked about the warranty
if the ballast is LFSW
and if the optional bulb included, is of Philips.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jan 11, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> I have tried calling, no response, so I fired off an email and see what they have to say
> 
> I asked about the warranty
> if the ballast is LFSW
> and if the optional bulb included, is of Philips.


@SireKillemAll
and to this is the response .

The warranty is 1 year on the unit and 30 days on the bulb.


I am not sure how the ballast operates but I will try to find out from the manufacture.


The bulb isn't a Philips bulb it is just a normal custom made CHM bulb.
------------------------------------


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 12, 2017)

Here is what happens to the upside down bud on the lowest bent down branch under the LEC on the Citral x POW 33. It is inches from the floor.

I probably should have staked and tied her up some huh. 



And here is the garden finally full (for a minute) under the better combined light spectrum.

Got all kinds of strains going in there. Love the variety. The different flavors and high's are getting better.

Plants are continually rotated and put in a new location as I water/ feed.

Here is the HPS side tonight.


And the LEC and overlap corner.


I love this shit!


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jan 12, 2017)

is that the sun system fixture with the Philips bulb in it? 4200k?


----------



## Black Thumb (Jan 12, 2017)

Ill never switch back to 600 watt these 315s do exactly the same and sometimes more then my 600's did ( yes one 315 is doing = or more then one 600) . half the electricity half the heat.
Denser, more colors. The frost seems about the same.


----------



## ttystikk (Jan 12, 2017)

Black Thumb said:


> Ill never switch back to 600 watt these 315s do exactly the same and sometimes more then my 600's did ( yes one 315 is doing = or more then one 600) . half the electricity half the heat.
> Denser, more colors. The frost seems about the same.


Just wait until you try broad spectrum LED.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jan 12, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Just wait until you try broad spectrum LED.


What have you been trying out since the CMH, some of those QB Board's?


----------



## ttystikk (Jan 12, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> What have you been trying out since the CMH, some of those QB Board's?


COB LED and quantum boards both. Best lighting I've ever used for growing plants, SUNLIGHT INCLUDED.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 12, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> is that the sun system fixture with the Philips bulb in it? 4200k?


The 3100k Phillips


----------



## pinner420 (Jan 12, 2017)

Anyone catch any looks at the new 600 cmh by hortilux in action anywhere?


----------



## DemonTrich (Jan 12, 2017)

All I know for sure is I'm cutting at least 1 week off my veg times from now on. I still have a little over 3 weeks and I'm ready to flip. Time to bust out the hedge clippers and give the girls a flat top cut.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jan 12, 2017)

315 5 day flip golden glue


----------



## Bryers76 (Jan 15, 2017)

Are you guys swapping to the 4100k bulbs for veg or staying with the 3100k? I'm running a knockoff sun system with the 3k bulb now. Guy was at least nice enough to write Philips bulb on the side of the box LOL. So I doubt it's a good bulb. Wasnt sure if I could veg/ flower with the 3100k agro bulbs or if it's time to cough up more dough for different bulbs. What's worked for you?  
Current 600 supa hps and lec 315


----------



## DemonTrich (Jan 15, 2017)

I run 940 in veg, and 930 in flower.


----------



## Bryers76 (Jan 15, 2017)

Is it a noticeable difference when you switch them for veg/ flower or can you get similar results with 1 bulb? I'm usually using t5 ho for veg but was curious how they would veg under the 930.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jan 15, 2017)

Flip day 8. Slow and easy with this girl.


----------



## DemonTrich (Jan 15, 2017)

This is my 1st veg and flower run with the cmh. I do know my 3x315cmh is by far killing my previous 3x600mh growth by far. Going to trim the girls quite a bit 2 weeks before flip


----------



## ttystikk (Jan 15, 2017)

I only run this lamp in veg, and all my lamps are 4100K.


----------



## Sparky569 (Jan 15, 2017)

Here's my ICE at about 3 weeks into flower with the 315 lec.


----------



## DemonTrich (Jan 15, 2017)

Mix them if you can


----------



## Sparky569 (Jan 15, 2017)

Mix what?


----------



## DemonTrich (Jan 15, 2017)

Spectrum bulbs

930/940


----------



## Sparky569 (Jan 15, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> Spectrum bulbs
> 
> 930/940


I'm just doing this for fun. I don't even remember the spectrum of the bulb I have.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jan 16, 2017)

Day 10 flip golden girl 315cmh 3100 Phillips


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Jan 16, 2017)

I 


DemonTrich said:


> This is my 1st veg and flower run with the cmh. I do know my 3x315cmh is by far killing my previous 3x600mh growth by far. Going to trim the girls quite a bit 2 weeks before flip


I had some good results using bud blood the week before and the week of flip. If you don't mind using liquid nutes.


----------



## 68grasshopper (Jan 18, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> COB LED and quantum boards both. Best lighting I've ever used for growing plants, SUNLIGHT INCLUDED.


can you recommend a light buddy ??


----------



## ttystikk (Jan 18, 2017)

68grasshopper said:


> can you recommend a light buddy ??


This guy could be your best friend in lighting; @Stephenj37826. He's mine, for sure! Johnson Grow Lights, Northern Grow Lights and HLG all work together and produce a great line of products.


----------



## blowinmaryfast (Jan 18, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> This guy could be your best friend in lighting; @Stephenj37826. He's mine, for sure! Johnson Grow Lights, Northern Grow Lights and HLG all work together and produce a great line of products.


How is the heat coming from the cobs? I've never been in a far north INland climate. I Imagine you have To really work to keep a building warm.


----------



## ttystikk (Jan 18, 2017)

blowinmaryfast said:


> How is the heat coming from the cobs? I've never been in a far north INland climate. I Imagine you have To really work to keep a building warm.


Only if it isn't insulated. Running a flip schedule generates plenty of heat, after that it's just a matter of putting it where it's needed.


----------



## blowinmaryfast (Jan 18, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Only if it isn't insulated. Running a flip schedule generates plenty of heat, after that it's just a matter of putting it where it's needed.


Word. Great idea and use of space. So is the heat comparable to cmh/hps? I have no standard smd LED or cob led experience but we have dozens of the aforementioned. New rooms=new toys or better tools


----------



## Stephenj37826 (Jan 18, 2017)

blowinmaryfast said:


> Word. Great idea and use of space. So is the heat comparable to cmh/hps? I have no standard smd LED or cob led experience but we have dozens of the aforementioned. New rooms=new toys or better tools


The heat is a bit different. I've explained it a few times. Basically infrared radiant heat vs. conductive heat. One heats everything the light touches the other heats the air circulating through the light fixture.


----------



## blowinmaryfast (Jan 18, 2017)

Ok I follow. So essentially the led will emit heat to my plants and root area. But it won't cook the entire room so enviro control and manipulation is much easier. 

Also can you direct me to a cob vs standard led comparison? To my understanding the cobs supply more heat and more intense directed spectrum.

Correct me if I'm wrong.


----------



## ttystikk (Jan 18, 2017)

blowinmaryfast said:


> Ok I follow. So essentially the led will emit heat to my plants and root area. But it won't cook the entire room so enviro control and manipulation is much easier.
> 
> Also can you direct me to a cob vs standard led comparison? To my understanding the cobs supply more heat and more intense directed spectrum.
> 
> Correct me if I'm wrong.


Uh, you've got it exactly backwards; LED conducts and convects heat to the air around itself, whereas light bulbs emit lots of radiant heat, aka infrared, which heats plants directly. 

Hold your hand near an HID lamp, you'll feel your hand get warm very quickly. LED doesn't feel like this. Instead there's much more brightness but not so much heat forced at the plants. 

To put it another way; the element in an HID lamp shares many similarities to that ceramic bar in your toaster oven. They both make a lot of infrared light, aka radiant heat. 

You can't make toast with an LED.


----------



## Yodaweed (Jan 19, 2017)

blowinmaryfast said:


> Ok I follow. So essentially the led will emit heat to my plants and root area. But it won't cook the entire room so enviro control and manipulation is much easier.
> 
> Also can you direct me to a cob vs standard led comparison? To my understanding the cobs supply more heat and more intense directed spectrum.
> 
> Correct me if I'm wrong.


other way around, hps heats surfaces it touches ,led blast heat out their fans or permeate heat.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 19, 2017)

Took some random garden pics tonight. Thought I would post some.

Mrs. MedGrower and I tasted the Classic Seeds Headband test bud. It's been drying 2 days on a jar lid on the coffee table.



I took 2 good deep lungfuls from my bong and it was smooth sour fruity and really very tasty. I will stretch it to delicious even fresh off the plant and air quick dried.

The effects came on like a classic slow creeper weed. 20 minutes later a warm full blanket of high frequency buzz had taken me over.

It's early for a real good creeper so that is all I will report for now on that. It will be cut this week.

I hope the reveg clone roots.

Anyway.....

Here is a new CH9 strain for me. OG Kush x Trainwreck. She is only 7 days into 12/12. She is going to be huge. hope she likes bondage. 



I moved this tight short squat but showed sex yesterday G-13 Skunk x Blue Lemon Thai in to the flower room.

I am very curious about her and a Critical Mass x BLT also with Mr. Nice genetics crossed to the BLT that moved up a few days ago.

I already get great results from the Black Widow cross I have been growing.



And I took these 2 garden pics after I cleaned up. I was pretty high by then I admit. They came out weird.

HPS side


LEC and overlap corner.


Thanks for tuning in


----------



## Yodaweed (Jan 19, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Took some random garden pics tonight. Thought I would post some.
> 
> Mrs. MedGrower and I tasted the Classic Seeds Headband test bud. It's been drying 2 days on a jar lid on the coffee table.
> 
> ...


Very pretty nugs man, enjoy and happy growing!


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 19, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> Very pretty nugs man, enjoy and happy growing!


Thanks man. Appreciated.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 19, 2017)

I just took a good pic and a closeup of a middle of flower POW 33. These are really potent plants. They give souring high's. 

The added spectrum from the 315 is definitely making a difference in frost and psychoactivity. 

It's subtle. I don't think I would focus on light as a limiting factor over environmental improvements or better genetics but it is noticeable. Even the flavor is more like outdoor. A little.....

I wish I had the plant count to clone them all because I am loving all of my plants lately.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 19, 2017)

I had to supercrop that stretching OG Kush x Trainwreck shown above. Too big, too tall and too fast. For my little room anyway.



I guess the 315 just being in the little room helps with the spectrum all over. This plant has not been under it directly yet. Or it's just more watts of usable light and there will be gains anyway.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jan 20, 2017)

Pic of my closet room 3x4 315 two candy delicious seed. Original skunk, and last of my White widow clone. 
30 days flip


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 21, 2017)

Pig4buzz said:


> Pic of my closet room 3x4 315 two candy delicious seed. Original skunk, and last of my White widow clone.
> 30 days flip
> View attachment 3881247


Great work man! Real improvements going on there. Awesome!


----------



## Javadog (Jan 21, 2017)

Seriously....very happy plants there. :0)


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 21, 2017)

Javadog said:


> Seriously....very happy plants there. :0)


Plus look at the full canopy of buds forming. I have to admit. It gets me excited.


----------



## Bryers76 (Jan 22, 2017)

a little over 5 wks. 600 and 315 have a heavy overlap and looks like it maybe one of my better runs. I'm sure the lights help but still slowly figuring it out. Im really thinking about getting a second 315 and running a veg/flower with the 930/942 bulbs.


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jan 22, 2017)

15 days my 3x3 tent 315 lec. Nugs popping everywhere goldenglue redeyed genetics.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 22, 2017)

Pig4buzz said:


> 15 days my 3x3 tent 315 lec. Nugs popping everywhere goldenglue redeyed genetics.


Do you just have grows all over your house?

And again your plants look great! What did you do different? Something during transition to flower?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 22, 2017)

Bryers76 said:


> View attachment 3882124 View attachment 3882133 View attachment 3882138 View attachment 3882141 View attachment 3882143 View attachment 3882144 a little over 5 wks. 600 and 315 have a heavy overlap and looks like it maybe one of my better runs. I'm sure the lights help but still slowly figuring it out. Im really thinking about getting a second 315 and running a veg/flower with the 930/942 bulbs.


What plant is that? Looks nice with the colored pistils.

And I think I will like to have a Hortilux 600HPS and a 315 3100k Phillips bulb over each footprint. I am 2 600's to 1 315 now. 

What is your take on it?


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jan 22, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Do you just have grows all over your house?
> 
> And again your plants look great! What did you do different? Something during transition to flower?


Nothing different much little less of everything. Just one area maxed out. It's very tight


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 22, 2017)

Pig4buzz said:


> Nothing different much little less of everything


Yup. I thought so. Less is more.


----------



## ttystikk (Jan 22, 2017)

Bryers76 said:


> View attachment 3882124 View attachment 3882133 View attachment 3882138 View attachment 3882141 View attachment 3882143 View attachment 3882144 a little over 5 wks. 600 and 315 have a heavy overlap and looks like it maybe one of my better runs. I'm sure the lights help but still slowly figuring it out. Im really thinking about getting a second 315 and running a veg/flower with the 930/942 bulbs.


Very nice!
I'd say do it.


----------



## Bryers76 (Jan 23, 2017)

This was just a random that I've saved for awhile. These came off the same mother but the first pic is 16 to 20 in away from lights in a net. There's 3 with purty pistils all within to 6 to 10 in from lights. Hoping i got a clone from one of these. Different pheno's possibly?
I just got back la confidential, barneys lsd, and a desconocida kush. Planning on a 2 lec with those


----------



## Bryers76 (Jan 23, 2017)

I've been a believer off the 600 off the rip but the 315 looks to be pretty darn close in every aspect. My hood is vertical, almost exactly a sun system. Been very happy so far with less watt and less heat. Really excited to run 2 lecs alone and see the results. 
The overlap of the 600 and lec does look pretty healthy. In the future I think a 600 centered and 2 lec on the outside would do wonders.. I won't lie to ya though. I really like your setup Michiganmed. Hell I maybe even jealous . It Definitely looks like it works. Lol


----------



## Pig4buzz (Jan 23, 2017)

Day 17 golden glue. Day 34 candy delicious candy frosting up nicely

315 lec Phillips 3100 bulb


----------



## blowinmaryfast (Jan 24, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Uh, you've got it exactly backwards; LED conducts and convects heat to the air around itself, whereas light bulbs emit lots of radiant heat, aka infrared, which heats plants directly.
> 
> Hold your hand near an HID lamp, you'll feel your hand get warm very quickly. LED doesn't feel like this. Instead there's much more brightness but not so much heat forced at the plants.
> 
> ...


Word. Hence the high red spectrum in hid. Thanks for the info ttystikk. 
I suppose the only way to find out the heat differences is run a flip sched with cobs on one side.


----------



## blowinmaryfast (Jan 24, 2017)

But for now cmh supplementation


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 24, 2017)

Bryers76 said:


> I've been a believer off the 600 off the rip but the 315 looks to be pretty darn close in every aspect. My hood is vertical, almost exactly a sun system. Been very happy so far with less watt and less heat. Really excited to run 2 lecs alone and see the results.
> The overlap of the 600 and lec does look pretty healthy. In the future I think a 600 centered and 2 lec on the outside would do wonders.. I won't lie to ya though. I really like your setup Michiganmed. Hell I maybe even jealous . It Definitely looks like it works. Lol



Thanks for the compliment. I just go one little step at a time and I am really thinking of doing 2 and 2 with the glass removed from those blockbuster 600's. I have to panda film in an area of my back basement. Just work huh? Like I got time. Lol

I am surprised you have healthy buds so close to the cmh. I am down to about 16" with the Phillips in the remote sun system reflector and now some lower buds are giving me results more like the 600's. 

2 each mounted diagonally from each other in a 7' x 7' footprint on an 8' x 8' platform for a margin of error (big plants) and to keep off the cold floor and I could walk around the whole thing. Hmmmm......

Now it's just work and money


----------



## DemonTrich (Jan 24, 2017)

I'm less than 12" in veg and about 1.5' max in flower. No issues in almost 8 weeks. 3x315 in veg, 4x315 in flower.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 24, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> I'm less than 12" in veg and about 1.5' max in flower. No issues in almost 8 weeks. 3x315 in veg, 4x315 in flower.


With so many saying 18" + I was cautious. Plus I am used to air cooled. It's my first open lamp. 

I read a commercial review that said they measured the advertised max par with my type of lamp at 16" over a 2.5' x 2.5' area max.


----------



## DemonTrich (Jan 24, 2017)

Well this damn cmh setup has me about 1.5 weeks ahead of my usual veg growth schedule. And about 50% less stretch in flower.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 24, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> Well this damn cmh setup has me about 1.5 weeks ahead of my usual veg growth schedule. And about 50% less stretch in flower.
> 
> View attachment 3883984


Oh I know your setup. I saw it here and on the other site. You were key in my trusting the new lamp my friend.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 24, 2017)

You plants are busting out the doorway @DemonTrich


----------



## DemonTrich (Jan 24, 2017)

Yeah, some of the 3.7 pots on the sides are leaving today. More room for my main girls to stretch out for another week before I flip. Gonna try a new flowering tek this time. Instead of how i normally lollipop, I'm only gonna allow the main tops to grow. Nothing else. All else will be removed.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 24, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> Yeah, some of the 3.7 pots on the sides are leaving today. More room for my main girls to stretch out for another week before I flip. Gonna try a new flowering tek this time. Instead of how i normally lollipop, I'm only gonna allow the main tops to grow. Nothing else. All else will be removed.


Well that's the opposite of my style but results speak for themselves. I have low height so I cut nothing. Most of the seed plants have their baby leaves still even. And if there are any loose buds down low we add them to the trim for coconut oil. 

It was confirmed by Mrs. MedGrowers Doctor her cysts have reduced with no other treatment by 40% in 6 months. Just regular eating of a little oil. 

I think it is healing my colon and joints too. We have both suffered all our lives with no relief from health care system. Just delay and damage. 

Here are 2 terrible pics I can't seem to delete I took a few days ago of my flower room. I still veg in tents under 6500k t-5 HO's. 

  

And here is the Classic Headband finishing under the 315 and overlap.


----------



## DemonTrich (Jan 24, 2017)

I've been prepping veg plants and flowering the same.way for 4+ yrs. This is a "test" run of chopping any and all larffy garbage and 8 big tops. My theory is if a big plant can use its energy to grow just 8 big ass colas vs 8 colas and a bunch of Larffy garbage, the plant with just 8 big colas should yield the same as there's no extra energy needed to grow Larffy crap.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 24, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> I've been prepping veg plants and flowering the same.way for 4+ yrs. This is a "test" run of chopping any and all larffy garbage and 8 big tops. My theory is if a big plant can use its energy to grow just 8 big ass colas vs 8 colas and a bunch of Larffy garbage, the plant with just 8 big colas should yield the same as there's no extra energy needed to grow Larffy crap.


I hear you but have to say that plants don't grow like that. We are not saving or re directing plant "energy". Just molding and training it to our needs. 

Good jersey tomatoes are grown to be consistently large by removing the lower branches and suckers. But the yield is higher with the plant left to grow more uneven tomatoes. And of course will take up more space with foliage and fruit. It is all a trade off. The price is higher for the nicer tomatoes. 

I have found this with my plants as well. 

And I get 1 jar of larf and trim to about 6 or 7 of dense buds on average. But I keep my plants under 30" tall. 

In my opinion and research anyway.


----------



## JDMase (Jan 24, 2017)

Hey guys does anyone want to suggest the best CMH for me? Im not too sure what I should be looking out for spec-wise. I have a choice of, a uk made sun system replica, a maxibright kit, a maxibright kit with a sun systems reflector, or a straight sunsystems but is almost double the cheaper option. There's also a omega kit which has a dimmable driver? Links below.. 

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=262658095235&globalID=EBAY-GB

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=131946629225&globalID=EBAY-GB

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=201695010426&globalID=EBAY-GB

http://www.1-hydroponics.co.uk/grow-lights/cdm-336/sun-system-lec-315-watt-remote-fixture.html


http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=302005814066&globalID=EBAY-GB


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## DemonTrich (Jan 24, 2017)

Growershouse.com 

Prism ballasts
Mogul socket adapters 
Philips bulbs


----------



## JDMase (Jan 24, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> Growershouse.com
> 
> Prism ballasts
> Mogul socket adapters
> Philips bulbs


Which reflector?


----------



## DemonTrich (Jan 24, 2017)

I use my old ones. Big kahuna x7


----------



## JDMase (Jan 24, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> I use my old ones. Big kahuna x7


I checked out their site and it looks as though with shipping to the UK im looking at around £360 which is about the same as the maxibright kit with the sun systems reflector. May go for that one, although that sun systems copy for 235 pounds is making me want to take a chance on it.. Hmm.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 24, 2017)

JDMase said:


> I checked out their site and it looks as though with shipping to the UK im looking at around £360 which is about the same as the maxibright kit with the sun systems reflector. May go for that one, although that sun systems copy for 235 pounds is making me want to take a chance on it.. Hmm.


Just FYI. The sun systems new remote reflector I got from growers house is a Chinese copy with only the pebbled aluminum insert and not the smooth mirrored aluminum with the brand name like the original reflectors. 

But it works very well. It is still the same design other than the cheaper insert. 

I do know the bulb was engineered for that shape vertical mount reflector. And will put down the most par vertically. But @DemonTrich doesn't seem to be lacking any results in his room so ymmv.


----------



## DemonTrich (Jan 24, 2017)

Thanks

I'll post up my harvest $.02 in 2 weeks. I'll know if I'm on par or ahead of my 3x600 grows. So far, veg is KILLING it by about 1.5 weeks ahead of schedule.


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## Pig4buzz (Jan 24, 2017)

315 rocks in veg too. You can notice daily change. The stretch is awesome to in flower. Hell its all good in all stages lol.


----------



## typoerror (Jan 24, 2017)

vegging under the flowering bulb because i figured it would be ok for a few weeks. it's outperforming my t5 ho.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 24, 2017)

Ok guys. Here are better pics of my Now enhanced spectrum flower room and some buds finished under the Phillips 315 LEC 3100k. 

@Dr. Who I thought you might find this interesting and haven't seen you in here much. 

The buds are all more defined in their individual phenos than any from my room before cmh. They also all smell and taste stronger and have higher potency and full spectrum of effects than any previous buds I have grown. 

The lamp seems to help with uptake. Problems common at the end of flower seem reduced. 

I do want to repeat as I have said before. The effect is SUBTLE!

I can not say that in a blind test I would always get which light right. But I might......

Hortilux Super HPS side
 

Phillips 315 LEC side and overlap at the "L"
 

Left to Right
Black Widow x Blue Lemon Thai #6
Black Widow x Blue Lemon Thai #5
Blue Lemon Thai #4

1st pic no camera flash 2nd pic camera flash on
 

 

And I don't use 315's yet for veg but plant to when I get the tents out and the larger flower room built. So much light for the wattage. And the veg I am seeing around here is great!

Here is my fully covered 2' T-5 HO 6500k all around system. 

2' x 3' Propogation tent for seedlings and cuttings
 

3' x 3' Veg tent


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## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 24, 2017)

typoerror said:


> vegging under the flowering bulb because i figured it would be ok for a few weeks. it's outperforming my t5 ho.


Those plants look great! How much faster?


----------



## ttystikk (Jan 24, 2017)

typoerror said:


> vegging under the flowering bulb because i figured it would be ok for a few weeks. it's outperforming my t5 ho.


I veg under flowering light all the time. My girls love it.


----------



## typoerror (Jan 24, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Those plants look great! How much faster?


i'd say a few days faster. i bet the veg bulb would be at least a week faster.


----------



## Dr. Who (Jan 25, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Ok guys. Here are better pics of my Now enhanced spectrum flower room and some buds finished under the Phillips 315 LEC 3100k.
> 
> @Dr. Who I thought you might find this interesting and haven't seen you in here much.
> 
> ...


Hey thanks for the invite.

Interesting to be sure. I desgined and built my _personal_ building a cpl years ago now. CMH was _just_ popping in and Cob's were very close on it's heels. As I was building I had already bought my equipment. I got great hoods and they were the last ones anywhere in the country (Jupiter 6's). They have _proper _working reflective "covers" over the cooling air vents. I gained 20% in reflected light.
Then I saw the CMH's come out and began to feel I wished I had done something different. Well, I have what I have and suspend 400w Merc vapors underneath (horizontally) for the UV and of course that gives me more blue also. Total lux is 31,000 higher then with the 1k HPS alone. 

I'll most likely look carefully at COB and give a shot to it, in one foot print, and then slowly change over if I like the results.....The idea of dropping electrical cost and cooling cost, while increasing light efficiency is everyone's goal, or should be.

I've been around long enough to have seen "best available" lighting change many times.....You get settled into what you like and things change. Now it changes faster......I still picked the HID over "induction" at my purchase time.....If I had waited even 3 more months as to when the building it's self was ready to install the lighting.....I would most likely have CMH.....sigh.....

I'll be looking at this thread as it goes...subbed.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 25, 2017)

Dr. Who said:


> Hey thanks for the invite.
> 
> Interesting to be sure. I desgined and built my _personal_ building a cpl years ago now. CMH was _just_ popping in and Cob's were very close on it's heels. As I was building I had already bought my equipment. I got great hoods and they were the last ones anywhere in the country (Jupiter 6's). They have _proper _working reflective "covers" over the cooling air vents. I gained 20% in reflected light.
> Then I saw the CMH's come out and began to feel I wished I had done something different. Well, I have what I have and suspend 400w Merc vapors underneath (horizontally) for the UV and of course that gives me more blue also. Total lux is 31,000 higher then with the 1k HPS alone.
> ...


Why not supplement with CMH rather than the merc vapor lamps? Efficiency? Cheaper and likely equal results. Better according to the university of Utah. 

I myself am waiting a couple more years to see if real purpose made agricultural led lamps are out. And I will need lights on heaters here in winter with cobs. My bulbs save me a lot of money in heat at night. So.........


----------



## Dr. Who (Jan 25, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Why not supplement with CMH rather than the merc vapor lamps? Efficiency? Cheaper and likely equal results. Better according to the university of Utah.
> 
> I myself am waiting a couple more years to see if real purpose made agricultural led lamps are out. And I will need lights on heaters here in winter with cobs. My bulbs save me a lot of money in heat at night. So.........


At this point my set up with the MV's are far cheaper then new CMH _but, not to run!_.....I'll pop a shot of it, if it'll be clear enough, when I go out...I'm a night lighter. 

No real problem with heat for me.....Full home heating and cooling in the building! Nothing like a nice central AC......You run a higher rated cold transfer unit in the ducting and be more efficient.

There's a wholesale heating and cooling supply house, out of Florida. They'll sell direct to you at that wholesale price! I got a nice furnace and matched a 2.5 ton AC to a 3 ton transfer....If I have all 8 lights per room on. Each room does need a supplemental 12K portable in the hot months.....It runs only intermittently. Dehuey's run to condensate pumps that run to my water supply tank. 
In the winter I run thermo controller electrical switch's that draw in completely filtered cold air to cool as needed...I set the on and off points...


----------



## dangledo (Jan 26, 2017)




----------



## JDMase (Jan 27, 2017)

dangledo said:


> View attachment 3885935


Wow, what strain you got there?


----------



## dangledo (Jan 28, 2017)

JDMase said:


> Wow, what strain you got there?



kali mist x (destroyer x nepali og)ibl


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## JDMase (Jan 28, 2017)

dangledo said:


> kali mist x (destroyer x nepali og)ibl


Looks incredible. Mucho thumbs up


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## Dr. Who (Jan 28, 2017)

dangledo said:


> kali mist x (destroyer x nepali og)ibl



First F1 run. GG#4 X Hogsbreath..... Pheno hunt later. I just had to run a plant to see what could be up with this cross.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 28, 2017)

Dr. Who said:


> First F1 run. GG#4 X Hogsbreath..... Pheno hunt later. I just had to run a plant to see what could be up with this cross.
> 
> View attachment 3887541
> 
> View attachment 3887542


Nice flowers Doc! Can't go too wrong with the pheno you got there looks like.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 28, 2017)

Here is the second POW 33 from a recent seed pack.


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## Bad Karma (Jan 28, 2017)

*Green Crack*


----------



## Dr. Who (Jan 29, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Ok guys. Here are better pics of my Now enhanced spectrum flower room and some buds finished under the Phillips 315 LEC 3100k.
> 
> @Dr. Who I thought you might find this interesting and haven't seen you in here much.
> 
> ...



Here's that 1K with 400 MV set up.

 

No, the MV bulb does not touch the hood glass.

It fires for 3.5 hrs in a 11/13 cycle...runs on hrs 4,5,6 and the first half of 7. Fits in with the light saturation point in C3 plants. That way it runs at the peak of the plants ability to use the available light, before it begins to change on the cellular peptide level to protect it's self from the intense light....I might move the timer up by 30 min. To see if the UV is better utilized with that in mind.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 29, 2017)

Dr. Who said:


> Here's that 1K with 400 MV set up.
> 
> View attachment 3887865
> 
> ...


I wish I still had the links but when searching for uv results there was a commercial grow that had tested uv supplementation all through flowering and only for the last 2 weeks. 

The added thc % was the same when tested. They chose switching out 10k metal halides for the last 2 weeks and run HPS like they had been for their consistent yield and bud density. 

When I use my cmh for finishing I get the extra frost and trippy outdoor like effect and better flavor but it can't give me the nice dense lowers I am used to with my 600 HPS. With 2 it likely could. 

So I rotate the plants for now but I will need equal wattage in my new spot for equal results it seems so far. 

Now that I see where your mv is mounted I want to get my HPS and cmh close together to share a footprint and see what happens. I like how you are sharing the reflector. 

I think maybe 3.5' x 5' for the 2 reflectors only 8" apart. For my direct down style reflectors. About 18" above the buds. 915 watts and a pretty full spectrum with low uv. Which honestly I really don't want high levels where I work. And I don't want more bulbs and circuits so.....

I better start cleaning out my basement. I don't want to cool this upgrade in my little spare bedroom. Back to work plus work for me. 

I can't do the bulb switch as I have plants in all stages all the time in there. 

Nice setup Dr. Who.


----------



## Dr. Who (Jan 29, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I wish I still had the links but when searching for uv results there was a commercial grow that had tested uv supplementation all through flowering and only for the last 2 weeks.
> 
> The added thc % was the same when tested. They chose switching out 10k metal halides for the last 2 weeks and run HPS like they had been for their consistent yield and bud density.
> 
> ...



I did a bunch of that testing over 10 years ago......I basically came up with some of the same data points.

The thing I like about running as I do. Is the overall more "normal" plant reaction to it, in the form of far better outdoor style trich coloring.......I have not bothered to test this style of peak lighting in THC levels vs. the old ways I first ran these MV's and then tested them.

The first method settled on was like an "on" time of between 5-10 min and hr - all day. Needless to say I was rather stressed over the 11-12 times a day the damn ballast and bulb were spiked.... I eventually put the MV's away and simply ran. Folks in the dispensaries started asking why some of the products "changed" to be "weaker or less intense"..

I went quickly back to adding the deep blue and UV MV's and began trying differing applications of them. I settled on this one due to the "light saturation point" effectively reducing plant photosynthesis by over 30% from around mid day till dusk on a bell curve.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 29, 2017)

Dr. Who said:


> I did a bunch of that testing over 10 years ago......I basically came up with some of the same data points.
> 
> The thing I like about running as I do. Is the overall more "normal" plant reaction to it, in the form of far better outdoor style trich coloring.......I have not bothered to test this style of peak lighting in THC levels vs. the old ways I first ran these MV's and then tested them.
> 
> ...


I always got some colored resin glands under my Hortilux Super HPS on the old classic Sensei seed sativa containing strains from CH9 but one of my last Blue Lemon Thai crosses under the 415 LEC was peppered with purple and amber and some other variations of violet colorations as well as clear and cloudy. 

It tasted of pure haze and hit very hard in the eyes and head. You would swear it was grown outdoor.


----------



## DemonTrich (Jan 29, 2017)

63 days from flip
5 days till chop
315cmh 3k bulb
Darlins net Dansbud pheno


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 29, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> 63 days from flip
> 5 days till chop
> 315cmh 3k bulb
> Darlins net Dansbud pheno View attachment 3888147


Nice work Demon!


----------



## DemonTrich (Jan 29, 2017)

The cmh made all my strains under the lights Purple at week 6 (2 weeks ago). No drop in temps needed. Absolutely LOVE these lights. = yields (best eye glance as of last night) to my 600s, almost half the power usage, tins better available light, 20k bulb life. Now I have quite a few 600 digital ballasts taking up shelf space.


----------



## Yodaweed (Jan 29, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> The cmh made all my strains under the lights Purple at week 6 (2 weeks ago). No drop in temps needed. Absolutely LOVE these lights. = yields (best eye glance as of last night) to my 600s, almost half the power usage, tins better available light, 20k bulb life. Now I have quite a few 600 digital ballasts taking up shelf space.
> 
> View attachment 3888373


How high do you hang your lights?


----------



## DemonTrich (Jan 29, 2017)

I have about 1 to 1.5' from glass to canopy. I keep them low, like in veg. No issues.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 29, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> How high do you hang your lights?


To get the max par of a Phillips cmh it is supposed to be vertical mounted and 16" from the canopy according to Phillips. 

Of course that doesn't account for overlap of multiple lamps.


----------



## Javadog (Jan 29, 2017)

Loving the result and appreciating your taking the time DT. Lovely work!


----------



## ttystikk (Jan 29, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> View attachment 3888509 I have about 1 to 1.5' from glass to canopy. I keep them low, like in veg. No issues.


Impressive.


----------



## blowinmaryfast (Jan 29, 2017)

A new og kush less sedate than my mainstay og.
Plus GDP seeds Snowcap at week 6. Very impressed with this.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 29, 2017)

blowinmaryfast said:


> View attachment 3888622 View attachment 3888621
> A new og kush less sedate than my mainstay og.
> Plus GDP seeds Snowcap at week 6. Very impressed with this.


When you say sedate do mean less sleepy?


----------



## blowinmaryfast (Jan 29, 2017)

Yes definitely. I have a decade old OGK that is a knockout for most. It's that classic chubby cheeked permagrin hit-from-all-angles stone that melts away any Pressure. I can blaze all it day but the new wave of patients here are more interested in an up, productive, creative buzz. So I'm working with a deadhead og.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 30, 2017)

blowinmaryfast said:


> Yes definitely. I have a decade old OGK that is a knockout for most. It's that classic chubby cheeked permagrin hit-from-all-angles stone that melts away any Pressure. I can blaze all it day but the new wave of patients here are more interested in an up, productive, creative buzz. So I'm working with a deadhead og.


I got a deadhead OG going into flower soon.


----------



## Dr. Who (Jan 30, 2017)

blowinmaryfast said:


> Yes definitely. I have a decade old OGK that is a knockout for most. It's that classic chubby cheeked permagrin hit-from-all-angles stone that melts away any Pressure. I can blaze all it day but the new wave of patients here are more interested in an up, productive, creative buzz. So I'm working with a deadhead og.


But, but, that's still only a 60/40 cross value!

ECSD would rock their world (and yours, more then you think) Try Dr. Greenthumb's....


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 30, 2017)

Dr. Who said:


> But, but, that's still only a 60/40 cross value!
> 
> ECSD would rock their world (and yours, more then you think) Try Dr. Greenthumb's....


That and Lemon Thai are in my Ch9 Motarebel hybrids I love.


----------



## blowinmaryfast (Jan 30, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I got a deadhead OG going into flower soon.


Right on. Is it from seed or clone? Post a photo up if possible. These are the most lanky ogs I've had


----------



## blowinmaryfast (Jan 30, 2017)

Dr. Who said:


> But, but, that's still only a 60/40 cross value!
> 
> ECSD would rock their world (and yours, more then you think) Try Dr. Greenthumb's....


Sup Doc glad you dropped in. Are you referring to the original og as a 60/40? It is to my knowledge 60/40 indica heavy with deadhead being 60-70% sativa leaning

Btw I LOVE ecsd. I ran the 11 weeker for 3 years with 1000w sealed rooms and forearm sized colas. Unfortunately lost the sour d upon leaving the west coast. So I haven't been sure where to turn for those true sour d genetics that NY Goes crazy for. Is green thumb working with ajs cut?


----------



## Javadog (Jan 30, 2017)

$150 for a 10-pack is steep, but I do love that ECSD too.


----------



## Dr. Who (Jan 30, 2017)

blowinmaryfast said:


> Sup Doc glad you dropped in. Are you referring to the original og as a 60/40? It is to my knowledge 60/40 indica heavy with deadhead being 60-70% sativa leaning
> 
> Btw I LOVE ecsd. I ran the 11 weeker for 3 years with 1000w sealed rooms and forearm sized colas. Unfortunately lost the sour d upon leaving the west coast. So I haven't been sure where to turn for those true sour d genetics that NY Goes crazy for. Is green thumb working with ajs cut?


Yup, he works the original clone! The best SD ever was from a guy called Rez Dog. They both worked the same source plant/clone.
No more Rez or his SD IBL's are available......Greeny is the place to go!

His Train Wreck is the Arcata cut. Best cut for that Sativa heavy mix......Train wreck being train wreck.......You'll still run them all for the best and most stable one in the pack.. Another good High sativa hybrid choice....


----------



## Dr. Who (Jan 30, 2017)

Javadog said:


> $150 for a 10-pack is steep, but I do love that ECSD too.


$15 a bean is _not_ expensive!

I've seen $85 per and you had to buy 6 and even higher pieces for a another .....these were fucking S1's too!
Sometimes you just have to pony up to get those truly hard to find _real deal_ legends in seed form...

I mean if you want the everyday Blue Berry, it's cheap..... Ever heard of, or had the pleasure to try the "Muffin cut" of BB? It's like it's in a different league....
How about the real "Sticky Icky"? That's a rare ass pheno of the original Diesel.
Any of Orgnkids "personal" OG's?
Lemony cookies - 26% cut
Sour Larry - simply a Lemon Bar pheno but, rare
Blue Dream - Santa Cruz cut

There are many more strains out there with mind numbing cuts ,,, that most never even hear of....

150 for 10 beans isn't bad at all for what your getting...


----------



## Javadog (Jan 30, 2017)

Acknowledged.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 30, 2017)

blowinmaryfast said:


> Right on. Is it from seed or clone? Post a photo up if possible. These are the most lanky ogs I've had


She is a big girl even at 5 weeks veg. She is sleeping now but I will try to remember to shoot a pic. 

It was from a gifted seed. I will likely take a couple clones in case she is awesome.


----------



## blowinmaryfast (Jan 30, 2017)

Dr. Who said:


> $15 a bean is _not_ expensive!
> 
> I've seen $85 per and you had to buy 6 and even higher pieces for a another .....these were fucking S1's too!
> Sometimes you just have to pony up to get those truly hard to find _real deal_ legends in seed form...
> ...


word brother. These genetics are so much more a part of the garden than a lot of folks think. I grew up with access to any cut ,as far as my connection , provided anyway. Now I'm a phenos hunting seed grower. Twice the work, space , effort, dedication to master those genes YOU want specifically. Which is what makes or breaks it for a serious gardener imo

Is "sticky icky" the Giant fluffy floraly fuel aroma buds(like mine) or the hardball greasy skunky diesel pheno?

Let me add Orange Cookies to your list if you don't mind.


----------



## Dr. Who (Jan 30, 2017)

blowinmaryfast said:


> word brother. These genetics are so much more a part of the garden than a lot of folks think. I grew up with access to any cut ,as far as my connection , provided anyway. Now I'm a phenos hunting seed grower. Twice the work, space , effort, dedication to master those genes YOU want specifically. Which is what makes or breaks it for a serious gardener imo
> 
> Is "sticky icky" the Giant fluffy floraly fuel aroma buds(like mine) or the hardball greasy skunky diesel pheno?
> 
> Let me add Orange Cookies to your list if you don't mind.


The _small_, _super tight_, _gooey as hell_, fuel - grease - skunky one's.. Turns all but the core, purple with no effort - extra K makes the whole damn thing _real_ dark.

SUPER strain for blasting or other forms of extraction or ice hash!

Ah yes Orange cookies..GOOD ONE!

Ever had or tried FACEMELT? FA-KING dick in the dirt, over powering stone. Simply makes you *stupid!*
{Green Crack [grn crush cut] X Pre98 Bubba} X _real_ GSC - Even heavy smokers are set back on their heels! I got a standing notice of pre purchase for any return of these S1 only beans....Maybe one day.

Interesting DosiDos F1 cross in the works.


----------



## blowinmaryfast (Jan 30, 2017)

Dr. Who said:


> The _small_, _super tight_, _gooey as hell_, fuel - grease - skunky one's.. Turns all but the core, purple with no effort - extra K makes the whole damn thing _real_ dark.
> 
> SUPER strain for blasting or other forms of extraction or ice hash!
> 
> ...


Oh yea the greasey sour d. I haven't had the opportunity to partake in those dankaroonies in nearly a decade. If the cut would of gotten out I think it would still be all over the west coast imo. 

Orange cookies is occasional insence for my house. Couple puffs from a joint and it lingers all day. My buddy runs it in Organic hydro. 

Face melt?! Ah no it sounds like some truly potent meds. I'm betting the cross really shows what the GSC genetic stock can do. Im surprised to see it crossed with GC but sounds interesting. Who is the breeder? 

Dosidos? Now my mouth is watering! That's one of the elusive strains atop my list with Gelato. TELL ME MORE about this dude.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 30, 2017)

blowinmaryfast said:


> Right on. Is it from seed or clone? Post a photo up if possible. These are the most lanky ogs I've had


Deadhead OG from seed in my 3'x3' veg tent under T-5's.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 30, 2017)

And earlier someone said their purple was really coming out so I wanted to post this POW 33 X Blue Lemon Thai (Purple Indica Pheno). I wish you guys could see this beauty in person. And smell her blueberry hash perfume.


----------



## blowinmaryfast (Jan 30, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Deadhead OG from seed in my 3'x3' veg tent under T-5's.
> 
> View attachment 3889412 View attachment 3889413


Very nice clean space. Your deadhead is a bush. Nice! I will be keeping up with your progress.

My og is normally just under shoulder height while deadhead stretched for 4.5 weeks over my head. Heavily trellised these vines of course


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 31, 2017)

blowinmaryfast said:


> Very nice clean space. Your deadhead is a bush. Nice! I will be keeping up with your progress.
> 
> My og is normally just under shoulder height while deadhead stretched for 4.5 weeks over my head. Heavily trellised these vines of course


Check out this OG Kush x Trainwreck.

I supercropped her after the photo as I train all flowers to 30" tall for many tips unless they really are that short. Which is rare.

She is in a #3 nursery pot. About 2.4 gallons.


----------



## Dr. Who (Jan 31, 2017)

blowinmaryfast said:


> Oh yea the greasey sour d. I haven't had the opportunity to partake in those dankaroonies in nearly a decade. If the cut would of gotten out I think it would still be all over the west coast imo.
> 
> Orange cookies is occasional insence for my house. Couple puffs from a joint and it lingers all day. My buddy runs it in Organic hydro.
> 
> ...


Check your in box


----------



## thccbdhealth (Feb 10, 2017)

Hey guys, Hows life been treating you this last week?
Im wondering if any users in club 315 have tryed the QB Boards?
I am wondering if i would be better vegg and flowering under CMH or Led Quantum Boards


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 10, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Hey guys, Hows life been treating you this last week?
> Im wondering if any users in club 315 have tryed the QB Boards?
> I am wondering if i would be better vegg and flowering under CMH or Led Quantum Boards


Yes I have.

Quantum boards does what their 315W does for less than half the watts.

(Thanks Suave!)


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 10, 2017)

Not true the Phillips cmh offers a better spectrum with both temp bulbs and higher par with some uv as well. 

Also the cmh has been tested to give 4% higher thc levels than led in actual commercial medical side by sides. And the university of Utah has put it first for all plant growth lighting. 

Graphs have even been posted from the University showing all this earlier in this thread. 

But led tech advances every day. Blink and the next new bulb or chip is already out. One day even the uv chips will be affordable. For now the cost is easily double per square foot to use led. 

Not efficient quite yet.


----------



## Yodaweed (Feb 10, 2017)

QB's lack intensity, the boards got to be close to the plants to get any type of intensity , i wouldnt waste my money they are just PCB leds from china, definitely not the best out there, if you looking into LEDs i'd look into COB LEDs.


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 10, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> QB's lack intensity, the boards got to be close to the plants to get any type of intensity , i wouldnt waste my money they are just PCB leds from china, definitely not the best out there, if you looking into LEDs i'd look into COB LEDs.


-This from the guy who doesn't have any and is therefore throwing shade because he's jealous and butthurt. Of course he's been wrong before, so often he's a laughingstock around the LED section and likely everywhere else he goes on the site.

Having actually used quantum boards in a real actual grow on an actual Cannabis plant, I can testify they have absolutely no trouble emitting plenty of light for great growth and flowering performance.


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 10, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Not true the Phillips cmh offers a better spectrum with both temp bulbs and higher par with some uv as well.
> 
> Also the cmh has been tested to give 4% higher thc levels than led in actual commercial medical side by sides. And the university of Utah has put it first for all plant growth lighting.
> 
> ...


But you don't have any quantum boards, so here you are talking right straight out your ass again.

You and 'yo duh dweeb' make a fine pair; get a room.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 10, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> But you don't have any quantum boards, so here you are talking right straight out your ass again.
> 
> You and 'yo duh dweeb' make a fine pair; get a room.


And you can't grow healthy plants so your tests are completely meaningless. 

Should we show results again? My garden yields more grams per square foot than yours and with much higher quality. And in compliance with Michigan rules which you could never keep up perpetually. You would have to keep to a schedule instead of play with hobby lights and post bad info online. 

I referred to studies and proof. Not my opinion like you. You still have offered no results or any real information to justify your argument. 

Go back to your own thread and bitch. You are already fully discredited here.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Feb 10, 2017)

Holy..... sit back and smoke a bowl- chill The fuck out, this isnt a pissing contest, its a forum for collective knowledge


----------



## genuity (Feb 10, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Holy..... sit back and smoke a bowl- chill The fuck out, this isnt a pissing contest, its a forum for collective knowledge


It's crazy...


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 10, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Holy..... sit back and smoke a bowl- chill The fuck out, this isnt a pissing contest, its a forum for collective knowledge


Sorry about that. I tried to post pertinent info to consider but his responses piss me off. But what I wrote about cmh is documented by professionals. 

Please carry on


----------



## Javadog (Feb 12, 2017)

This one looks interesting: https://www.growersc.com/315w-3k-r

Just looking at the graphs seems to suggest more energy from 
other bulbs (i.e. 4K), but I am not certain.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 12, 2017)

Javadog said:


> This one looks interesting: https://www.growersc.com/315w-3k-r
> 
> Just looking at the graphs seems to suggest more energy from
> other bulbs (i.e. 4K), but I am not certain.


I don't use new untested stuff but that bulb looks nice. Just can't know if it has Phillips quality. Or if the claims are valid. 

Growers house previously tested the Phillips 315 3100k cmh to have the highest par over all the bulbs they sell. Even the 4K. This one you show is new though.


----------



## ganjafather27 (Feb 12, 2017)

Hey lec growers, I'm considering going this route for my new veg light. 

I have a couple questions if you all care to help me out. 

So I want to replace a 400w mh that's in a 2x4 tent. I see these LEDs at 315w, you guys think I'll get as good of growth comparatively? 

I also see they are cooler, but I'd assume I still need to cool them in a tent, but the reflectors I see aren't air cooled. Will a 4inch in line exhaust fan be enough to keep the tent cool or do you guys have a different method for cooling your tents with these? 

Lastly, if I'm only using it for veg, do you think a 315 lec would be better than a 4ft, 8 bulb t5? Would it be better than 2 Mars 300s? What are the pros and cons for anybody with experience with any of these? 

Thanks for any help


----------



## Bad Karma (Feb 12, 2017)

ganjafather27 said:


> Hey lec growers, I'm considering going this route for my new veg light.
> 
> I have a couple questions if you all care to help me out.
> 
> ...


Cramming an LEC light in a 2x4 tent is a tight squeeze, it can be done, but it doesn't allow for much airflow around the light for cooling. If you could bump it up to 6 inch inline fan in a 3x3 tent you would be golden, but I get that you're trying to work with what you already have. Using a clip on fan above the light, so its blowing on the back of it, will help keep the hood/light cool.

A 315 LEC will destroy any T5 setup or Mars LED in veg. LEC is easily the best overall light I've used, for veg, and bloom. In veg, they produce thicker stalks, and sturdier branches, which increases yield. I've vegged the same strain under a high quality T5 light, and an LEC, and the results weren't even close. 
LEC > T5


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 12, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> Cramming an LEC light in a 2x4 tent is a tight squeeze, it can be done, but it doesn't allow for much airflow around the light for cooling. If you could bump it up to 6 inch inline fan in a 3x3 tent you would be golden, but I get that you're trying to work with what you already have. Using a clip on fan above the light, so its blowing on the back of it, will help keep the hood/light cool.
> 
> A 315 LEC will destroy any T5 setup or Mars LED in veg. LEC is easily the best overall light I've used, for veg, and bloom. In veg, they produce thicker stalks, and sturdier branches, which increases yield. I've vegged the same strain under a high quality T5 light, and an LEC, and the results weren't even close.
> LEC > T5


My bare bulb vertical socket mounted 315W CMH will kick ass in that tent.

I can't use them anymore so I have to sell them.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Feb 12, 2017)

Cant use them based on that new bylaw?
Or because
your switching to qb boards for better efficiency?
And the quality is the same?
Your thinking you'll be able to get 3-4 pound trees with souly qb boards?


----------



## ganjafather27 (Feb 12, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> Cramming an LEC light in a 2x4 tent is a tight squeeze, it can be done, but it doesn't allow for much airflow around the light for cooling. If you could bump it up to 6 inch inline fan in a 3x3 tent you would be golden, but I get that you're trying to work with what you already have. Using a clip on fan above the light, so its blowing on the back of it, will help keep the hood/light cool.
> 
> A 315 LEC will destroy any T5 setup or Mars LED in veg. LEC is easily the best overall light I've used, for veg, and bloom. In veg, they produce thicker stalks, and sturdier branches, which increases yield. I've vegged the same strain under a high quality T5 light, and an LEC, and the results weren't even close.
> LEC > T5


Thanks for the reply. You made me alot more curious about these LECs. 

How would a single 315w LEC compare to a 600w hps in flower? 
.


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 12, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Cant use them based on that new bylaw?
> Or because
> your switching to qb boards for better efficiency?
> And the quality is the same?
> Your thinking you'll be able to get 3-4 pound trees with souly qb boards?


I'm not sure because I'll use them in conjunction with other LED lighting.


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 12, 2017)

ganjafather27 said:


> Thanks for the reply. You made me alot more curious about these LECs.
> 
> How would a single 315w LEC compare to a 600w hps in flower?
> .


Really close, but not quite the same quantity. Great quality though. Much easier to manage.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 12, 2017)

ganjafather27 said:


> Thanks for the reply. You made me alot more curious about these LECs.
> 
> How would a single 315w LEC compare to a 600w hps in flower?
> .



I have been using both and the 315 Phillips 3100k bulb in the sunlight supply remote reflector yields almost the same size and density but in a 2.5' x 2.5' area. Out to 3 feet the plants demonstrate some leaning and leaf adjustment to get more light. 

And the lowers in my dense compact plants are slightly less dense than my Hortilux 600w and the Hps handles 3.5' x 3.5' easily. 

However. The cmh seems to make plants a little greener and happier and maybe leafier but with more natural outside looking, smelling and smoking buds. 

The combo is working very well. I am going to go 50% each in my room next. I have 2 to one now and am going to try a 600w Hortilux blue mh in my other hood to try to match the full spectrum to see what 2 to one the other way might be like.


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 13, 2017)

Any thoughts on this one... would it run the philips 315 as a replacement? I Have leaned heavily on the "Less heat, more energy efficiency side of the MH/HPS vs. LED" side of the issue for a long time.... as well as the lifespan of the LED... But these CMH's seem to offer the best of both worlds.

Again, any thoughts / Experience regarding:

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B01CKJF0SK/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A2ITYAZGUJNKX4


This unit was rated best value unit in the above linked info, but I like the in-line cooling the other offers (as well as the price)...Am I wrong, or should I grab this one?

https://smile.amazon.com/Nanolux-CMH-315W-Fixture-240V/dp/B0178GTPH2/ref=sr_1_10?s=lawn-garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1486992416&sr=1-10&keywords=cmh+315w


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 13, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> Any thoughts on this one... would it run the philips 315 as a replacement? I Have leaned heavily on the "Less heat, more energy efficiency side of the MH/HPS vs. LED" side of the issue for a long time.... as well as the lifespan of the LED... But these CMH's seem to offer the best of both worlds.
> 
> Again, any thoughts / Experience regarding:
> 
> ...



That is the older tech bulb and it is actually only rated for closed reflectors but they show it open. 

The new 315's are run on the newer square wave ballasts and offer more par consistently. And the new bulbs are ok for open use and universal mounting but are designed to be run vertical for best effect by Phillips. 

I am sorry but have not actually used the 400 w cmh. But I wonder if a metal halide with a digital ballast may be better. I understand mag ballasts can be way less efficient and put out way less light.


----------



## Yodaweed (Feb 13, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> Any thoughts on this one... would it run the philips 315 as a replacement? I Have leaned heavily on the "Less heat, more energy efficiency side of the MH/HPS vs. LED" side of the issue for a long time.... as well as the lifespan of the LED... But these CMH's seem to offer the best of both worlds.
> 
> Again, any thoughts / Experience regarding:
> 
> ...


All watts are created equally, a 1000w LED will produce the same heat as a 1000w hps, first law of thermodynamics.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 13, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> That is the older tech bulb and it is actually only rated for closed reflectors but they show it open.


not true. there are 2 variants of the older Philips 400. both can be run open but one had to be run horizontal, the other vertical. they were a helluva bulb. and what got me started liking the CMH concept.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 13, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> not true. there are 2 variants of the older Philips 400. both can be run open but one had to be run horizontal, the other vertical. they were a helluva bulb. and what got me started liking the CMH concept.


I thought the old good bulbs were Phillips and discontinued and the one shown was the GE which is an inferior copy and only open rated and only available as I said.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 13, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I thought the old good bulbs were Phillips and discontinued and the one shown was the GE which is an inferior copy and only open rated and only available as I said.


my bad. i just saw the htg supply ballast (which is what I bought to fire them). they should probably fix that picture then! good catch.

on a side note, you can find some of the old philips on ebay. even used, they sell for a pretty penny. i got 4 of em out in the garage i need to go find.


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 13, 2017)

Thanks for the replies, all. So, here's a Q: Would it be better to suppliment the 8 T5's (2 4-bulb units (4ft)) with a 600 - 1200 watt LED in the flower room or would the $ be better spent on the Nanolux? I've got plenty of time, but may have up to two Med card patients within a few month's time...
p.s. considering this LED... older tech, but with the double 5Watt chips (pretty good canopy penetration, I am assuming, and the spectrum looks very good, esp. considering the full spectrum of the T5's, imo):

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B01320X10A/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_7?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A26I3HLV1WKXWW


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 13, 2017)

Also... if I get the Nanolux, should I use it as is or try to re-arrange it in a horizontal configuration with a double-parabola reflector (like the older HTG supply unit I have linked)?


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 13, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> The new 315's are run on the newer square wave ballasts and offer more par consistently. And the new bulbs are ok for open use and universal mounting but are designed to be run vertical for best effect by Phillips.


OH, o.k., I didn't catch that...so I should leave the thing vertical, if I go that route. got it.


----------



## Boyz N Da Hood (Feb 13, 2017)

whats good everybody! been a while since ive been online as i had to shut down a while back.. had to give the forums a break.
couldn't stop my seed collecting for too long though lol

I just got a pretty good deal on a SS 630 watt cmh. which led me to find this awesome thread. Been reading thru the first 30 pages and i'm convinced i want to try COB LEDs. Is there anybody with a reliable brand? was looking on ebay but i'm not too sure if their wattage claims are on point. and i'm not much of a DIYer unless its really simple stuff.


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 13, 2017)

Boyz N Da Hood said:


> whats good everybody! been a while since ive been online as i had to shut down a while back.. had to give the forums a break.
> couldn't stop my seed collecting for too long though lol
> 
> I just got a pretty good deal on a SS 630 watt cmh. which led me to find this awesome thread. Been reading thru the first 30 pages and i'm convinced i want to try COB LEDs. Is there anybody with a reliable brand? was looking on ebay but i'm not too sure if their wattage claims are on point. and i'm not much of a DIYer unless its really simple stuff.


Talk to @Stephenj37826 and @robincnn


----------



## Bad Karma (Feb 14, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> Thanks for the replies, all. So, here's a Q: Would it be better to suppliment the 8 T5's (2 4-bulb units (4ft)) with a 600 - 1200 watt LED in the flower room or would the $ be better spent on the Nanolux? I've got plenty of time, but may have up to two Med card patients within a few month's time...
> p.s. considering this LED... older tech, but with the double 5Watt chips (pretty good canopy penetration, I am assuming, and the spectrum looks very good, esp. considering the full spectrum of the T5's, imo):
> 
> https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B01320X10A/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_7?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A26I3HLV1WKXWW


Never buy an LED light off of Amazon, they are all crap, and I promise you will regret wasting your money. If you're gonna go LED, go with a COB light, one that uses Cree, Vero, or Citizen COB's.


----------



## THCBrain (Feb 14, 2017)

I bought one of these lec lights last week to replace my 600w cool tube in a 1mx1m tent so far it's great, no overheating issues but I am in a cold loft!


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 14, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> Never buy an LED light off of Amazon, they are all crap, and I promise you will regret wasting your money. If you're gonna go LED, go with a COB light, one that uses Cree, Vero, or Citizen COB's.


... O.K. so, what is the best source? Q: what is the dif between a higher wattage (5 and 6Watts was the highest for single chip LED as far as I know, haven't kept up...) are the COB's going to offer more canopy penetration than a multiple 6W single-chip light?


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> ... O.K. so, what is the best source? Q: what is the dif between a higher wattage (5 and 6Watts was the highest for single chip LED as far as I know, haven't kept up...) are the COB's going to offer more canopy penetration than a multiple 6W single-chip light?


unless i missed it, what size area do you have? and what is your budget? do you have a separate veg and bloom area or is it just one space to do both? i think we can steer you in the right direction after we answer these


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 14, 2017)

in the planning phase. Got zilch right now and no way to measure anything out. I JUST asked a seller on E-Bay what type of chips these were, as the info is lacking... 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/800W-COB-LED-Panel-Grow-Light-System-Full-Spectrum-For-Plant-Replace-HPS-Lamp-/171893004601?

Any ideas? Good LED or CRAP? Am leaning in my head toward getting a Phantom II and vert hood and the Philips... but my WALLET may not allow it...lol Here is that line-up....under $500 for the 3 parts... can I do better elsewhere?

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B01LQZDVD0/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_2?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ARU9XTG9WELO3
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B01LOXRX4W/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_3?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A1O863TZYF0C7N
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00HXOJ1FG/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER


----------



## genuity (Feb 14, 2017)

You will get better info in the led section...


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> in the planning phase. Got zilch right now and no way to measure anything out. I JUST asked a seller on E-Bay what type of chips these were, as the info is lacking...
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/800W-COB-LED-Panel-Grow-Light-System-Full-Spectrum-For-Plant-Replace-HPS-Lamp-/171893004601?
> 
> ...


check out growershouse.com for their CMH stuff.

if I had $500, I personally would buy the Cycloptics greenbeams 3100K 315 in 120Volt (unless you are running at 240V).

it will easily cover a 3x3 area for veg and bloom, will last years before you need to change bulbs, and you mount it on the ceiling and don't have to move it. done.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

if you want LED, check out timbergrowlights.com 

they have a few framework leds ready to hang for around $500. quality COBS, drivers etc and dimmable so you can use them from seedlings to bloom. i would think they should cover roughly a 3x3 area too.


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 14, 2017)

genuity said:


> You will get better info in the led section...


Yeah, I'm kinda in limbo, though between choosing LED over CMH/LEC...or the other way around. I will get to that thread soon enough, though, I'm sure... just planning things out and hope to have 2 MMM cardholders to supply for within 4-6 month's... will have 1, for sure, but he has to finish his Indina probation first (@ least that's what I advised him LOL)

@rkymntman... thanks for the info will be checking all that out soon


----------



## genuity (Feb 14, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> Yeah, I'm kinda in limbo, though between choosing LED over CMH/LEC...or the other way around. I will get to that thread soon enough, though, I'm sure... just planning things out and hope to have 2 MMM cardholders to supply for within 4-6 month's... will have 1, for sure, but he has to finish his Indina probation first (@ least that's what I advised him LOL)
> 
> @rkymntman... thanks for the info will be checking all that out soon


I said that cause most of the guys in the led section, don't really leave that section...and it is some good information in that section.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> in the planning phase. Got zilch right now and no way to measure anything out. I JUST asked a seller on E-Bay what type of chips these were, as the info is lacking...
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/800W-COB-LED-Panel-Grow-Light-System-Full-Spectrum-For-Plant-Replace-HPS-Lamp-/171893004601?
> 
> ...


If you go the cmh route. Growers house recently sold me a sunlight supply remote vertical open reflector. A dimmable galaxy ballast and a Phillips 3100k bulb under $400 delivered. I really like working with it. 

My pics and info have been going on since Black Friday or so if you want to go back some pages or search me out. I documented quite a bit. I was real excited. I was and am still happy with my hortilux 600 super HPS lamps. 

I will post some new pics anyway when we can. It has made a positive difference in my garden. I like it combined with the hps for my purpose but I would use one now for my 3x3 tent when I upgrade. I think a 6 " exhaust fan and speed controller will be fine for cooling. Seems about as hot with a fan blowing across under it as my air cooled sealed 600's. Maybe a degree or 2 cooler.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> If you go the cmh route. Growers house recently sold me a sunlight supply remote vertical open reflector. A dimmable galaxy ballast and a Phillips 3100k bulb under $400 delivered.


that is a good deal.

i've seen tons of used CMH's on craigslist here in CO lately. $200 for a Sunlight in 240v. $500 for a Sulight 630 cmh. dude had like 30 of the 315's and 10 of the 630's.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

Attempt to attach pic of growroom showing both the LEC and HPS lamps. I saw earlier if you click to respond to the message the pic will show in the response copy. 

Nope. Server error. Try again later.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Attempt to attach pic of growroom showing both the LEC and HPS lamps.


one combo that might be cool to try out is a 3100k LEC and the Hortilux blue daylight MH. not sure if they make it in 600 though.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> that is a good deal.
> 
> i've seen tons of used CMH's on craigslist here in CO lately. $200 for a Sunlight in 240v. $500 for a Sulight 630 cmh. dude had like 30 of the 315's and 10 of the 630's.


I should have mentioned the galaxy is either or 110 or 220v. But it's different to buy used in MI. I should get my Colorado friend to keep an eye out. Worth a step down transformer for half price! 

I think the availability of the used is because of the false claim that it keeps up with a 600. I get 2.5 x2.5 feet in my open flower room and my 600's get a foot more area than that easily. 

But the plants seem happier under it so I would just do 3 for 4x8 or 1 of each type of a 3.5 x 6 footprint. Which I think is my preference right now. But I have only been using the cmh a few months and the hps for a few years. 

To mess up all of his I just bought a 600w hortilux blue to try in place of one of my hps. 

Just had to do it. My 400w blue vegged killer. And the quality and natural look of my plants has definitely gone up a notch with the better spectrum.


----------



## DemonTrich (Feb 14, 2017)

I run 4x315cmh in ac hoods. I can leave my hand on the glass for hours of any of then4 hoods and it's only warm to the touch. A ton cooler than my 600s I previously had in there.

My 1st 4x315cmh is on par with my previous 3x600hps yield averages. But using a lot less power to run the lights, and less ac usage.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I think the availability of the used is because of the false claim that it keeps up with a 600. I get 2.5 x2.5 feet in my open flower room and my 600's get a foot more area than that easily.


i agree. i went from a 600 to teh 315. the 600 was better coverage in my 3x4 but the results were better with the 315. 

right now i have a california light works SS400 and the 315 in the space. i'm thinking about adding another 315 and using the LED in my veg tent.

so many choices! 


MichiganMedGrower said:


> To mess up all of his I just bought a 600w hortilux blue to try in place of one of my hps.


that's the bulb i was mentioning in my last post. the spectrum looks perfect.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> one combo that might be cool to try out is a 3100k LEC and the Hortilux blue daylight MH. not sure if they make it in 600 though.


Funny you mention that. In next post.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> I run 4x315cmh in ac hoods. I can leave my hand on the glass for hours of any of then4 hoods and it's only warm to the touch. A ton cooler than my 600s I previously had in there.
> 
> My 1st 4x315cmh is on par with my previous 3x600hps yield averages. But using a lot less power to run the lights, and less ac usage.


That's pretty close to the 4x8 with 3 I was saying I think. And the sunlight supply reflector is very direct down as are my blockbusters. Not designed for a spread out footprint like an xxl reflector for example. So my area numbers only reflect that kind of reflector should be noted. 

It's cool that these kind of details get flushed out. So many variables possible.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Funny you mention that. In next post.


is the one you got the blue daylight MH?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> i agree. i went from a 600 to teh 315. the 600 was better coverage in my 3x4 but the results were better with the 315.
> 
> right now i have a california light works SS400 and the 315 in the space. i'm thinking about adding another 315 and using the LED in my veg tent.
> 
> ...


The 400w blue has the perfect spectrum. The 600 has more spikes than the full sunlight spectrum but all the way across the wavelengths nicely. 

He 3 lamps are in an "L" and the outside 2 will have the more natural 90+cry bulbs and enhanced hps in the corner. 

And I rotate the plants around continually as I care for them. So they all get lots of all spectrums through their cycle. 

I tried finishing at first but like I said. In my room with my lamps the HPS is making more dense weight under the canopy so it is a compromise. 

In most university testing watts or lumens trump spectrum as plants convert photosynthesis primarily to the strongest wavelength. 

But th U of Utah proved more. That above that a good ballanced 50/50 blue to red light showed better growth and general health. But loss of yield with lower watts as usual. 

Hence the 600w blue test. It raises my budget $100 per year if it works


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> is the one you got the blue daylight MH?


Yup.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> The 400w blue has the perfect spectrum. The 600 has more spikes than the full sunlight spectrum but all the way across the wavelengths nicely.


i'll have to check those out. 400 would actually be better since i'm limited on my amps in my room. i also saw that growershouse has a solis tek 600w 4K MH for like 50 bucks cheaper than the horti. 


MichiganMedGrower said:


> Hence the 600w blue test


when will you start the test? i'll follow along on that one.


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 14, 2017)

wow some good conversation now and a lot more info to consider. 

They have the phantom 2 for 189 and the Company's specs say patented driver for longer bulb life...? any thoughts, otherwise identical to the unit in your $400 set up? Though I'm not sure i like the fact they have a pic of the Phantom I(?)

http://growershouse.com/phantom-ii-cmh-315w-ceramic-metal-halide-digital-ballast


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> wow some good conversation now and a lot more info to consider.
> 
> They have the phantom 2 for 189 and the Company's specs say patented driver for longer bulb life...? any thoughts, otherwise identical to the unit in your $400 set up? Though I'm not sure i like the fact they have a pic of the Phantom I(?)
> 
> http://growershouse.com/phantom-ii-cmh-315w-ceramic-metal-halide-digital-ballast


i personally wouldn't buy a Phantom. try to get a real Philips ballast and bulb. best combination out there.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> i personally wouldn't buy a Phantom. try to get a real Philips ballast and bulb. best combination out there.


the philips ballast is only for 200 to 277 volts though. are you stuck with 120volts? you could buy a step up transformer to go from 120 to 240 for pretty cheap.


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 14, 2017)

...yeah philips reccomends the 3100K for flower, but there was something about the extra UV in the 4200 creating high quality as well... so that does sound like a good expiriment. A gardenmonster vid comparing both against the LEP (Light Emitting Plasma) stated these should be supplimental FLOWER lights...so am VERY interested in getting the pics back up here to check out your set-up for sure


MichiganMedGrower said:


> ...My pics and info have been going on since Black Friday...





rkymtnman said:


> a 3100k LEC and the Hortilux blue daylight MH. not sure if they make it in 600 though.


Given that the 4200K cmh seems to get such high marks over HP MH...maybe a good combo to try as well would be one of each CMH 315s...?


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 14, 2017)

genuity said:


> I said that cause most of the guys in the led section, don't really leave that section...and it is some good information in that section.


I don't Know but I might be leaning toward going the CMH route, after all, with 4 to 8 tubes of flower T5's......but HOW to set that up?! They say 18 inches above canopy is ideal for PPF guess I will sacrifice the T5s to higher than normal...


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> i'll have to check those out. 400 would actually be better since i'm limited on my amps in my room. i also saw that growershouse has a solis tek 600w 4K MH for like 50 bucks cheaper than the horti.
> 
> when will you start the test? i'll follow along on that one.


I will install my new mh and hps bulbs tonight or tomorrow. If I do it tonight it will be like their tv commercial with the girl in the blue dress waiting for her husband to come home with all the candles arpund the house and he runs right past her to try his new bulb in the growroom. 

Valentine's Day and all.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> ...yeah philips reccomends the 3100K for flower, but there was something about the extra UV in the 4200 creating high quality as well... so that does sound like a good expiriment. A growmaster vid comparing both against the LEP (Light Emitting Plasma) stated these should be supplimental FLOWER lights...so am VERY interested in getting the pics back up here to check out your set-up for sure
> 
> 
> 
> ...


yeah, i use the 4200k for veg and bloom. the guy i bought it from told me that he had better results with the 4200k over the 3100k even though the 3100k has better PAR values. i have the mogul socket based bulb which puts out even more UV than the T12 based bulbs.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> wow some good conversation now and a lot more info to consider.
> 
> They have the phantom 2 for 189 and the Company's specs say patented driver for longer bulb life...? any thoughts, otherwise identical to the unit in your $400 set up? Though I'm not sure i like the fact they have a pic of the Phantom I(?)
> 
> http://growershouse.com/phantom-ii-cmh-315w-ceramic-metal-halide-digital-ballast


I have read they all have the square wave but I tend to stick to sunlight supply stuff cause I already have. 

The 110v may be a compromise under Phillips spec already. They only offer their ballast in 220 with a 6 foot cord. Mine is 110 capable with a 15 foot cord. 

I haven't had a failure in 3 years with my Galaxy select a watt ballasts. So I am trying the LEC.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I will install my new mh and hps bulbs tonight or tomorrow. If I do it tonight it will be like their tv commercial with the girl in the blue dress waiting for her husband to come home with all the candles arpund the house and he runs right past her to try his new bulb in the growroom.
> 
> Valentine's Day and all.


where did you find the 400? 

according to growershouse, i can't use my solis tek ballast for the 600 blue MH for some reason. they recommend galaxy or horti ballast or magnetic even. wonder why??


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> I don't Know but I might be leaning toward going the CMH route, after all, with 4 to 8 tubes of flower T5's......but HOW to set that up?! They say 18 inches above canopy is ideal for PPF guess I will sacrifice the T5s to higher than normal...


use the t5's as side lighting and a cmh for above lighting. problem solved


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> i'll have to check those out. 400 would actually be better since i'm limited on my amps in my room. i also saw that growershouse has a solis tek 600w 4K MH for like 50 bucks cheaper than the horti.
> 
> when will you start the test? i'll follow along on that one.


It's not going to be an official test or side by side. I run a perpetual with a plant harvested about every week on average. 

So it will really be feedback from me, mrs med grower and some patients. 

But they noticed the LEC difference and my tapering of feed more carefully during ripening without being told or even asked So......


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 14, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> if I had $500, I personally would buy the Cycloptics greenbeams 3100K 315 in 120Volt


WOW! that is a nice unit



rkymtnman said:


> i have the mogul socket based bulb


I'll have to consider that with the cycloptics, then... you Can get their hood wich has only 2% light loss in a remote fixture, also...

btw, DO you use other lighting in your flower stage?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> where did you find the 400?
> 
> according to growershouse, i can't use my solis tek ballast for the 600 blue MH for some reason. they recommend galaxy or horti ballast or magnetic even. wonder why??



Plantlightinghydroponics this time. They had the 400 for 79 I think. 

600 mh is a conversion hps bulb only. So electronic ballast or mag hps. The 400 is a real metal halide. 

And not all hps/ mh electronic ballasts are spec'ed equally.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> So it will really be feedback from me, mrs med grower and some patients.


that's all i care about. doesn't have to be exact science for me.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> WOW! that is a nice unit
> 
> 
> 
> ...


the mogul based bulb was part of a kit that i bought: bulb and ballast for $200. both Philips. if you go to the cycloptics website, they basically say hang it up permanently on your ceiling, make sure your walls are as reflective as possible and let the light do the rest.

you can get the reflector separate but it's almost $300 for it. for another 150, you get bulb and ballast too. so better deal.

i have a 2 ft T5 UVB bulb that i use in flower too. helps with the trichs/ more frost. will burn your eyes, skin and plants if not careful though.


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I haven't had a failure in 3 years with my Galaxy select a watt ballasts. So I am trying the LEC.



... sounds good, but I'm reaching info overload lol. Puffin' some green crack


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> 600 mh is a conversion hps bulb only. So electronic ballast or mag hps. The 400 is a real metal halide.


that makes sense. that 400 might be calling my name.


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 14, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> use the t5's as side lighting and a cmh for above lighting. problem solved



....full - tilt vertical?....HMMM..........could be intersting and possibly stretch that 3x3 footprint to 4.5x4.5....again, HMMMM.....


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> ....full - tilt vertical?....HMMM..........could be intersting and possibly stretch that 3x3 footprint to 4.5x4.5....again, HMMMM.....


boy, did you open a can of worms huh?? lol.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> that makes sense. that 400 might be calling my name.


http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/specific/600w-Hortilux-Blue

All specs and system requirements for the bulbs on this page in links. 

http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/metal-halide#blue


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/specific/600w-Hortilux-Blue
> 
> All specs and system requirements for the bulbs on this page in links.
> 
> http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/metal-halide#blue


i was just on the horti website. wow, that 400 spectrum chart is impressive. and i can use the ballast i have which is a bonus. 

what part of MI are you in? i used to do a lot of work near Kalamazoo. always had fun going there.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> i was just on the horti website. wow, that 400 spectrum chart is impressive. and i can use the ballast i have which is a bonus.
> 
> what part of MI are you in? i used to do a lot of work near Kalamazoo. always had fun going there.


I'm a ways up north and west from there. Out in the woods some.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I'm a ways up north and west from there. Out in the woods some.


the actual town was Paw Paw. always thought it to be a funny name. but got my first taste of Bell's brewing and some of their fantastic beers.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> the actual town was Paw Paw. always thought it to be a funny name. but got my first taste of Bell's brewing and some of their fantastic beers.


I drink those sometimes but not too much of a drinker myself. I have been here about 5 or 6 years. I met a local girl when I lived in the Colorado mountains. And just ended up here through cause and effect. But I ended up with a pretty cool little house in the woods to grow our meds. In a little country town like I have grown to prefer. Michigan has more negatives than most states I have been I am sad to say but out here is truly field and stream land. And miles of atv trails and dunes of course too.


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Feb 14, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> the actual town was Paw Paw. always thought it to be a funny name. but got my first taste of Bell's brewing and some of their fantastic beers.


I hit up a hydro shop there every once in a while when I'm up that way


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 14, 2017)

Well, heck, I think I found my light! Horizontal, wide double parabola Double-Ended 630 CMH, @ 3000K! more red and a little more UV as well...Same price as a Sun Systems 315, @ $545

http://growershouse.com/growers-choice-horticultural-lighting-630w-de-cmh-complete-fixture


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> Well, heck, I think I found my light! Horizontal, wide double parabola Double-Ended 630 CMH, @ 3000K! more red and a little more UV as well...
> 
> http://growershouse.com/growers-choice-horticultural-lighting-630w-de-cmh-complete-fixture


Neat! I think there is de 600hps with a great spectrum too. 

I never researched as I have low ceilings. My se 600 is pushing it.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 14, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> I hit up a hydro shop there every once in a while when I'm up that way


there was an awesome soup and sandwich place not too far from the minute maid plant in paw paw that we used to hit for lunch almost every day. can't remember the name but it was packed every day. everything homemade.


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 14, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> ....full - tilt vertical?....HMMM..........could be intersting and possibly stretch that 3x3 footprint to 4.5x4.5....again, HMMMM.....


I ran all my 315W CMH lights vertical, bare bulb. I still have almost a dozen fully assembled kits with fixture that I can't use anymore due to local regs. PM me if anyone wants more details or I'll put them on CL.


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 14, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> I ran all my 315W CMH lights vertical, bare bulb. I still have almost a dozen fully assembled kits with fixture that I can't use anymore due to local regs. PM me if anyone wants more details or I'll put them on CL.


No, I was talking about mounting the CMH on the cieling, well, yes, vertical w/ a dome reflector, but I was talking about vertical T5's.


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 14, 2017)

what is the setup you are looking to unload? I could be persuaded, possibly, but I really like that DE CMH I posted a couple back...


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 14, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> what is the setup you are looking to unload? I could be persuaded, possibly, but I really like that DE CMH I posted a couple back...


Just as simple as I said; Philips 240V only ballast, lamp and cord set, times a dozen. PM me for more details.


----------



## Michiganjesse (Feb 24, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Just as simple as I said; Philips 240V only ballast, lamp and cord set, times a dozen. PM me for more details.


Ttystikk your everywhere I go lol. Wish i had the loot want to get a 315.


----------



## Boyz N Da Hood (Feb 25, 2017)

just noticed that the sun systems 315 i have on the way has the bulb vertically and the 630 i have now has them horizontally.. just wondering if there is any reason why they have them in different positions?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 25, 2017)

Boyz N Da Hood said:


> just noticed that the sun systems 315 i have on the way has the bulb vertically and the 630 i have now has them horizontally.. just wondering if there is any reason why they have them in different positions?


Is the 630 a DE or 2 separate bulbs? If it's DE that's the reason


----------



## genuity (Feb 25, 2017)

I just put a tray under a 630 DE, veg + 4weeks of 12/12 under one 315..really do like these plants under these lights..just wish the light was bigger.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 25, 2017)

genuity said:


> I just put a tray under a 630 DE, veg + 4weeks of 12/12 under one 315..really do like these plants under these lights..just wish the light was bigger.


You seen this one brother?
http://growershouse.com/sun-system-grow-beast-208-240-volt-w-4200-k-lamps

Man if I only had the ceiling height and space...........


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 25, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> You seen this one brother?
> http://growershouse.com/sun-system-grow-beast-208-240-volt-w-4200-k-lamps
> 
> Man if I only had the ceiling height and space...........


Lol good grief what a Kludge


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 25, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Lol good grief what a Kludge


LOL how's it going brother? Good to see you around. 

I'm getting ready for a quantum build here soon to get the second tent running and compare with the 600W Blue MH, how's those lights treating you?


----------



## genuity (Feb 25, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Lol good grief what a Kludge


Damn right..waste of everything on that light setup....hopefully they did not make a lot...


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 25, 2017)

genuity said:


> Damn right..waste of everything on that light setup....hopefully they did not make a lot...


I will be waiting for this to drop (have been for a bit now):
http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/ceramic-hps.aspx

I will soon be doing a qunatum board test vs my 600W Blue MH excited to get that going


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 25, 2017)

Wow didn't think this site was going to get back online...thought it a goner for sure. What the hell happended I couldn't find much news on the two crashes...or was it more?

Anyway... found an even better deal on a DE CMH, here, no color temp as I can find in the ad, but the one that comes with the unit should work for a supplimented (T5 or LED) bloom room (if that is one's intent, as mine may end up being)...it is also Digital and Dimmable:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/112303076810


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 25, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I will be waiting for this to drop (have been for a bit now):
> http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/ceramic-hps.aspx
> 
> I will soon be doing a qunatum board test vs my 600W Blue MH excited to get that going


WELL.........F*@$#! That blows my post out of the water...lol


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 25, 2017)

WolfieLee said:


> WELL.........F*@$#! That blows my post out of the water...lol


LOL, no competing brother, it's just nice to share info on new lights. I love testing the different light sources and seeing things first hand and learning more, the more rounded you are as a grower the better you become in my opinion. I'm still a newb but have learned a lot fast thanks mainly to this website and the people I have connected with through here. Glad to see this place back up and when I do the different journals it's just my way of trying to give back and pay it forward in respect and gratitude to those on here that have helped me in many different ways and continue to do so. 

The one thing that is starting to become evident to me is that a good grower can just grow and doesn't stress over light source like a lot of people on here, you can grow no matter what, when things happen you adapt and push on, there's always "something". 

Keep em green!


----------



## WolfieLee (Feb 25, 2017)

@Evil-Mobo yeah, I am kinda in the same boat, though MORE so a noob... Only one grow under any lights and it had to come to an abrupt end after 2 of six were cut... T5 last minute deal....story is in sig links (should they ever recover the pics it would be much better). Between what I learned on that grow and my internet deal hunting putting me in a trance lately....lol; I think with the shopping list I got in the planning stages for my first real, legal MMM grow by mid- late summer, is going to amaze a lot of people should I throw it up... might only journal after the fact all in one shot, though considering the crash (Bust???).....anyway I like the freindly help here and also enjoy hearing I helped someone else out is even better...

Wow, though, I was wondering WHY they didn't have CHPS when I first saw the CMH....guess they had to tweak the composition of the ceramic b4 they got it right...GREAT news, now...how long b4 THOSE prices start coming withing range of MY budget...? LOL


----------



## Yodaweed (Feb 25, 2017)

So far so good with my 315 LEC , the plants love it so far during veg.


----------



## Boyz N Da Hood (Feb 25, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Is the 630 a DE or 2 separate bulbs? If it's DE that's the reason


no the 630 has 2 separate bulbs.. it's weird i wonder if you can change the positioning of the bulb


----------



## indianajones (Feb 26, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I will be waiting for this to drop (have been for a bit now):
> http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/ceramic-hps.aspx
> 
> I will soon be doing a qunatum board test vs my 600W Blue MH excited to get that going


those bulbs make 34,000 lumens for 600w? might as well just hit the atm 
and withdraw your money, then flush it down the toilet. i have a 200w fixture 
that makes the same amount of light. the 315w CDM makes 33,000 lumens! 
at 56.6 lumens per watt that's ~20% efficient, so the other 80% is going to 
be heat, that's nearly as many btus from a 600 as from a DE 1,000.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 26, 2017)

indianajones said:


> those bulbs make 34,000 lumens for 600w? might as well just hit the atm
> and withdraw your money, then flush it down the toilet. i have a 200w fixture
> that makes the same amount of light. the 315w CDM makes 33,000 lumens!
> at 56.6 lumens per watt that's ~20% efficient, so the other 80% is going to
> be heat, that's nearly as many btus from a 600 as from a DE 1,000.



Lumens is not the only thing to a light so we will agree to disagree. I never pay attention to Lumens to be honest and have grown with a few different types of lights now. Why? Because it interest me and I want to try it, and I already have a great ballast and solid hood/reflector, so for me it's just a bulb and I can try it out. Will be cheaper for me than a 315 CMH which I have already tested and was a big fan of and will be getting another at some point.


----------



## indianajones (Feb 26, 2017)

you're not the only one who has the desire to grow with several different lights. i've grown with two different brands of 400w CMH (GE and philips), 315w CDM, 860w, 400w hps/mh, 1000w hps/mh, 250w hps/conversion mh, and three different brands of LED.

do you know what from that list gets the best (and most consistent, regardless of season) results? the lights with the best efficiency. 

what produces the best quality? the plant with the best genetics. 

grow krome's "the white" and you'll see what i'm talkin' about, 30%+ thc on that plant is a given!

if you want to grow better herb, get better seeds or clones. i'm not saying anything about environment because it's a given, and this conversation is pointless if you can't keep your room in the optimal temperature/humidity/gas mix range. 

like i said, i'm all for light experimentation, but that 600w ceramic hps engineer needs to be fired and blacklisted. it makes 480w of heat from a 600w bulb FFS! that's what 20% efficiency means.


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 26, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> LOL how's it going brother? Good to see you around.
> 
> I'm getting ready for a quantum build here soon to get the second tent running and compare with the 600W Blue MH, how's those lights treating you?


Those lights work great! The local cops not so much. I'm coming back tho.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Feb 26, 2017)

indianajones said:


> you're not the only one who has the desire to grow with several different lights. i've grown with two different brands of 400w CMH (GE and philips), 315w CDM, 860w, 400w hps/mh, 1000w hps/mh, 250w hps/conversion mh, and three different brands of LED.
> 
> do you know what from that list gets the best (and most consistent, regardless of season) results? the lights with the best efficiency.
> 
> ...


Care to enlighten me about your findings with all that lighting...


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 26, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Those lights work great! The local cops not so much. I'm coming back tho.


Wow sorry to hear. You will be back in no time. I am just getting going again as well. Gonna be playing with some QB's soon  Keep in touch brother.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 26, 2017)

indianajones said:


> you're not the only one who has the desire to grow with several different lights. i've grown with two different brands of 400w CMH (GE and philips), 315w CDM, 860w, 400w hps/mh, 1000w hps/mh, 250w hps/conversion mh, and three different brands of LED.
> 
> do you know what from that list gets the best (and most consistent, regardless of season) results? the lights with the best efficiency.
> 
> ...


I already gave my opinion on growing and the various lights and do not feel like getting sucked into another back and forth on this forum about efficiency. Yes it's nice to have the most efficient lighting possible, but stats on paper and real world results are two different things. I listen and pay attention to what the plants tell me in my garden not just some math calculations.

I'm about growing medicine for myself could care less what the type of lighting is. All of the lights have their pro's and cons, and i have preferences in what the plants reactions are under certain lights over others. It's that simple.

Cheers


----------



## Pmbreno (Feb 26, 2017)

Want to order a light tonight and was hoping to get some opinions on some of the newest offerings. I currently have two ss 315's but I'm really leaning towards the new dimable one from growers choice or maybe the nanolux. $150 cheaper


----------



## thccbdhealth (Feb 26, 2017)

I'm contemplating the Nanolux, however this will be my first light

the dimability of the growers choice model would be a nice feature
then bulb being vertical V.S. horizontal


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 26, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> I'm contemplating the Nanolux, however this will be my first light
> 
> the dimability of the growers choice model would be a nice feature
> then bulb being vertical V.S. horizontal


No. COB LED or quantum LED. You'll thank me as soon as you plug it in.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Feb 26, 2017)

however I suggest you take a look at those prices again
the difference between the 2 is a couple dollars.

Nanolux on BGhydro.com without bulb 269.95
the Philips bulb is 74.12

Grower Choice on Growershouse.com is 341.67, with bulb included
Nanolux on Growershouse.com is 296.68

but for me growershouse doesn't ship here


----------



## Pmbreno (Feb 26, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> however I suggest you take a look at those prices again
> the difference between the 2 is a couple dollars.
> 
> Nanolux on BGhydro.com without bulb 269.95
> ...


Yes I was comparing the price of those 2 to the sunsystems I already have. Those were around 480 each


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 26, 2017)

You should be able to find the SS closer to $400 brother that's what I remember from when I had mine let me do some digging


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 26, 2017)

It's $436 plus shipping to your location on the growers house website right now with their sale. They also have the make offer tab which I have used with them a few times.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Feb 26, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> It's $436 plus shipping to your location on the growers house website right now with their sale. They also have the make offer tab which I have used with them a few times.


shipping is limited to the united states


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 26, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> shipping is limited to the united states


Was replying to pmbreno but was not aware he was out of the country. Was just trying to help someone save a few bucks guess i missed the location.


----------



## Pmbreno (Feb 26, 2017)

And you just did thank you very much now I just need to pull the trigger, do you have any opinions on the dim ability function with the ability to overdrive the 315?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 26, 2017)

Pmbreno said:


> And you just did thank you very much now I just need to pull the trigger, do you have any opinions on the dim ability function with the ability to overdrive the 315?


I never used one with a dimmer and honestly wouldn't see the reason to need it unless I had a grow area with limited vertical height available. I was very pleased with my SS and will own one again once I am done testing a couple more lights. It and my 600 Blue MH are two of my favorite lights.

YMMV


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 26, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I never used one with a dimmer and honestly wouldn't see the reason to need it unless I had a grow area with limited vertical height available. I was very pleased with my SS and will own one again once I am done testing a couple more lights. It and my 600 Blue MH are two of my favorite lights.
> 
> YMMV


I added a 600w blue to my room now too. It's tandem with my 600 Super HPS. And in a tight "L" off the HPS (which is in the middle of the "L") is the 315 LEC 3100k. 

I should have a pretty strong complete spectrum now no?

Loving the more natural light in the room to work in and the plants are happier and hungrier and growing and finishing faster. 

And everyone noticed they are tastier, smellier and more potent. I didn't mention any changes to anyone but Mrs. MedGrower and you guys.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 26, 2017)

I cannot say enough good things about it. And yeah I would say you have a good spectrum lol. Good to see you around brother.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 26, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I cannot say enough good things about it. And yeah I would say you have a good spectrum lol. Good to see you around brother.


Didn't realize pics were working. Here ya go.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 27, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> 600 Blue MH





MichiganMedGrower said:


> I added a 600w blue to my room now too.



my 400 Blue just showed up today. gonna run it and a 315 lec in a 3x4. can't wait to see the results.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 27, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Didn't realize pics were working. Here ya go.
> 
> View attachment 3895699


how is the heat off the MH blue compared to the lec? i'm guessing the MH is in a glass reflector and lec is open?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 27, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> my 400 Blue just showed up today. gonna run it and a 315 lec in a 3x4. can't wait to see the results.


You will love it and so will the plants. 

As for the heat my 600w blue MH gives off less heat air cooled in my 3x3 than my 315 did open. My money for the cooler setup is an air cooled 315 which I will try the next time I get a 315 in the future


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## rkymtnman (Feb 27, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> You will love it and so will the plants.
> 
> As for the heat my 600w blue MH gives off less heat air cooled in my 3x3 than my 315 did open. My money for the cooler setup is an air cooled 315 which I will try the next time I get a 315 in the future


i'm running just the lec for veg right now in an aircooled hood with co2. i've got my fan set at 86F and it hasnt even got close to that setpoint yet. 

i was hooked when i saw the spectral chart for the blue 400. the lec has a great spectrum but the blue is even better IMO.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 27, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> i'm running just the lec for veg right now in an aircooled hood with co2. i've got my fan set at 86F and it hasnt even got close to that setpoint yet.
> 
> i was hooked when i saw the spectral chart for the blue 400. the lec has a great spectrum but the blue is even better IMO.


Keep us posted, have yet to see anyone who has tried the Blue MH and NOT liked it


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 27, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Keep us posted, have yet to see anyone who has tried the Blue MH and NOT liked it


i guess it's on the HOrti website but the 400 blue is used in universities and plant research facilities. supposed to be the closest representation of natural sunlight. 

if not, it's only 80 bucks! i'm still resisting the urge to go all out on either cobs or quantums just yet when i got all this other equipment laying around collecting dust


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 27, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> i guess it's on the HOrti website but the 400 blue is used in universities and plant research facilities. supposed to be the closest representation of natural sunlight.
> 
> if not, it's only 80 bucks! i'm still resisting the urge to go all out on either cobs or quantums just yet when i got all this other equipment laying around collecting dust


Yup that's why I'm running it in my 600W setup and if I didn't have to move and had my old larger grow area the (2) 1K's would be running the same bulbs lol.

I will however be testing a QB soon vs the 600W Blue MH.....................................................


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 27, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I will however be testing a QB soon vs the 600W Blue MH


pre- subbed! lol. that should be a good one. do you know what the K value of the QBs are? in the 3 to 4K range?


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 27, 2017)

QB around 3500K. I like them as much as my COB LED lights.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 27, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> pre- subbed! lol. that should be a good one. do you know what the K value of the QBs are? in the 3 to 4K range?


Not yet I will be doing a dedicated journal for this run and will put a link in my sig. Very excited for it based oin what I saw in @captainmorgan grow journal with it.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 27, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> my 400 Blue just showed up today. gonna run it and a 315 lec in a 3x4. can't wait to see the results.


That should be real nice. The 400 Blue has a better spectrum than the 600 and it is a real metal halide rather than an hps conversion so it has measurable uv. That bulb tints my gradient glasses. The 600 and 315 3100k does not. The glasses are uv sensitive.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 27, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> how is the heat off the MH blue compared to the lec? i'm guessing the MH is in a glass reflector and lec is open?


Right. I have both 600 air cooled and the LEC I will bet the blue 400 is pretty close in heat output to the LEC. I find them manageable. But both may need to be air cooled in a tent or box. 

The heat with fans blowing under my 315 cmh is very close to the heat from my air cooled 600. It tends to run 1 degree colder at the canopy. And the 600 Blue slightly colder than the HPS. But I mean 10ths of a degree.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 27, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> measurable uv.


kinda sucks it needs to be enclosed. glass will block some/most of that uv. i've got a T5 UVB for that. 

are you going to rotate your plants at all during flowering so they are under each of the bulbs?


----------



## Yodaweed (Feb 27, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> pre- subbed! lol. that should be a good one. do you know what the K value of the QBs are? in the 3 to 4K range?


I think a lot of people are going crazy over QBs and from what i seen they aren't that great. I'd use them for growing lettuce and leafy greens because they would work great in my tiered lettuce system but for penetration they gonna suck, they don't grow big plants. Check out all the grow logs on the LED section, havent seen a single big plant from them, captn has the biggest and it's still really small and he didnt say final weights and whatnot. I like to grow big plants because the taller the more weight, i don't think these can grow a plant taller than 3 feet from the soil without going crazy on the build (huge budget) To me they look like they would be a great investment for a lettuce or spinach grower that has a vertical height limit. If i were to build myself a weed growing light with LED's i'd go with COB's , sacrifice a little bit of efficiency for intensity. For myself i don't like to have to keep lights within inches of plants.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 27, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> kinda sucks it needs to be enclosed. glass will block some/most of that uv. i've got a T5 UVB for that.
> 
> are you going to rotate your plants at all during flowering so they are under each of the bulbs?


Yup. I rotate and move plants as they are ready for water/nutes/training. They all get equal share. 

I have not added specific uv lights yet. the glass in Blockbusters is tempered. There was uv coming through the Hortilux blue 400. Just not the 600. It's really an hps bulb. And the 315 needs to be the 4200k and I would have more uv.


----------



## ttystikk (Feb 27, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> kinda sucks it needs to be enclosed. glass will block some/most of that uv. i've got a T5 UVB for that.
> 
> are you going to rotate your plants at all during flowering so they are under each of the bulbs?


You don't have to run them enclosed.


----------



## rkymtnman (Feb 28, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> You don't have to run them enclosed.


the 400 MH Blue by Horti does. i'm doing a combo of LEC and the 400 MH for the moment. 
*System Requirements*
*Lamp Wattage:* 400
*MSRP:* $129.95
*Fixture Requirement:* ENCLOSED
*ANSI Code:* M59/E
*E-Ballast Compatible (Y/N):* YES
*Operating Position:* HORIZONTAL
- See more at: http://www.eyehortilux.com/products/htl-metal-halid/SystemReqs/mt400dhorhtl-blue/57816#sthash.ibhc4k4z.dpuf


----------



## PSUAGRO. (Feb 28, 2017)

yeah horti blues aren't open fixture rated.........yet to see a glass grenade in my life , never risk it though

Quantum boards have the highest sphere tested ppf/w, umol/j ever and the usual suspect bashes it  or understands that sogs can beat tree growing in gpsf

anyone buy the new horti ceramic hps bulbs yet??????

edit.........nevermind, not released


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 28, 2017)

PSUAGRO. said:


> yeah horti blues aren't open fixture rated.........yet to see a glass grenade in my life , never risk it though
> 
> Quantum boards have the highest sphere tested ppf/w, umol/j ever and the usual suspect bashes it
> 
> ...


Been waiting like a kid for this to be released since announced ...........


----------



## PSUAGRO. (Feb 28, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Been waiting like a kid for this to be released since announced ...........


Soooooo you're getting one huh?????? .................lol, new light tech is always exciting and it usually pays you back unlike my other crap I buy


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Feb 28, 2017)

PSUAGRO. said:


> Soooooo you're getting one huh?????? .................lol, new light tech is always exciting and it usually pays you back unlike my other crap I buy


Will have a QB soon now that I'm running again and have been waiting for the ceramic HPS since last year lol. I am a big fan of the Eye Hortilux company their CS and the things they're doing with lighting.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 28, 2017)

PSUAGRO. said:


> yeah horti blues aren't open fixture rated.........yet to see a glass grenade in my life , never risk it though
> 
> Quantum boards have the highest sphere tested ppf/w, umol/j ever and the usual suspect bashes it  or understands that sogs can beat tree growing in gpsf
> 
> ...


The 600 is open rated too but I don't think it has the same amount of uv because my uv sensitive tinting glasses tiny with the 400 even through tempered glass and not the 600 or cmh 3100k.


----------



## bob223 (Feb 28, 2017)

Hey how often is everyone changing out their lamps? I have been having really poor yields the last month or so. I chalked it up to cold weather
but im starting to have my doubts 

i have a little over 4000 hours on the lamp.


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 1, 2017)

bob223 said:


> Hey how often is everyone changing out their lamps? I have been having really poor yields the last month or so. I chalked it up to cold weather
> but im starting to have my doubts
> 
> i have a little over 4000 hours on the lamp.


which bulb/K do you have?

i read something on another forum (not sure which) that the 3K lasts longer than the 4k T12 and the 4K mogul based lasts the shortest.


----------



## bob223 (Mar 2, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> which bulb/K do you have?
> 
> i read something on another forum (not sure which) that the 3K lasts longer than the 4k T12 and the 4K mogul based lasts the shortest.


Im using the Philips 3100k bulbs. everything i read before is these were supposed to last much longer the hps?

I guess i got almost a year out of the bulb so thats okay. i liked to switch HPS out every six months.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 2, 2017)

bob223 said:


> Im using the Philips 3100k bulbs. everything i read before is these were supposed to last much longer the hps?
> 
> I guess i got almost a year out of the bulb so thats okay. i liked to switch HPS out every six months.


It is supposed to be closer to 2 years before degradation. But I have only had mine for months.


----------



## Bad Karma (Mar 2, 2017)

bob223 said:


> Im using the Philips 3100k bulbs. everything i read before is these were supposed to last much longer the hps?
> 
> I guess i got almost a year out of the bulb so thats okay. i liked to switch HPS out every six months.


The 3100K in my Phantom is around a year old but hasn't shown any signs of slowing down yet. I'm also under the impression, like MMG stated above, that LEC bulbs are supposed to last for about 2 years.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 2, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> The 3100K in my Phantom is around a year old but hasn't shown any signs of slowing down yet. I'm also under the impression, like MMG stated above, that LEC bulbs are supposed to last for about 2 years.


Thanks for sharing that. I wonder when you will notice it needs replacement?


----------



## Growdict (Mar 2, 2017)

@GroErr has replaced one. I think he said nearly two years. Mine is 14 months old and still rocking it


----------



## GroErr (Mar 2, 2017)

Growdict said:


> @GroErr has replaced one. I think he said nearly two years. Mine is 14 months old and still rocking it


I changed them at 1 1/2 years and there was a bit of a difference in output once I threw the new bulb in.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 2, 2017)

GroErr said:


> I changed them at 1 1/2 years and there was a bit of a difference in output once I threw the new bulb in.


I track my bulbs with a cheap 3 way meter with a light sensor. Not a irate by any means but clearly shows when they start to dim. And I always check because something seems a miss with the plants. 

So I will eventually report back.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 2, 2017)

She was touchy during stretch and curled leaves under on her first feeding but that was weeks ago and she has blossomed into one pretty stunning girl. 

The coloring has become much more dramatic and earlier under the cmh. 

Critical Mass x Blue Lemon Thai
    

And my first try at the OG Kush x Trainwreck worked out real nice.


----------



## THCBrain (Mar 2, 2017)

That og x trainwreck looks beautiful


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## Michiganjesse (Mar 2, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> LOL, no competing brother, it's just nice to share info on new lights. I love testing the different light sources and seeing things first hand and learning more, the more rounded you are as a grower the better you become in my opinion. I'm still a newb but have learned a lot fast thanks mainly to this website and the people I have connected with through here. Glad to see this place back up and when I do the different journals it's just my way of trying to give back and pay it forward in respect and gratitude to those on here that have helped me in many different ways and continue to do so.
> 
> The one thing that is starting to become evident to me is that a good grower can just grow and doesn't stress over light source like a lot of people on here, you can grow no matter what, when things happen you adapt and push on, there's always "something".
> 
> Keep em green!


I suck growing 2 years still struggle to get a zip off a plant


----------



## ttystikk (Mar 2, 2017)

Michiganjesse said:


> I suck growing 2 years still struggle to get a zip off a plant


More veg time.


----------



## Michiganjesse (Mar 2, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> More veg time.


4 months on that


----------



## ttystikk (Mar 2, 2017)

Michiganjesse said:


> 4 months on that


Uhhh... I spend 4 months vegging and I get up to 2 lbs each.


----------



## Michiganjesse (Mar 3, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Uhhh... I spend 4 months vegging and I get up to 2 lbs each.


Thats what i mean i am terrible. My environment is good 76 degrees 30% to 40% rh. I do don't have the best of lights but i have alot of them at least 2000 watts of led for 2 plants cheap so probably 1000 more like and 300 cfl flower bulb. Super soil from buildasoil.com and that is my yield. Wtf am i doing wrong.


----------



## Growdict (Mar 3, 2017)

Stop buying crappy leds. 1 hps600w canget 1lb. Or save up for cob leds


----------



## genuity (Mar 3, 2017)

Or a 315 like the thread suggest....
 

This run was under 315 for 2 weeks of veg,and 30 days of 12/12...now under 630 lec.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 3, 2017)

genuity said:


> Or a 315 like the thread suggest....
> View attachment 3898790
> 
> This run was under 315 for 2 weeks of veg,and 30 days of 12/12...now under 630 lec.
> View attachment 3898792


Nice work!


----------



## Yodaweed (Mar 3, 2017)

my plants absolutely love the 315 CMH, plant's between coverage of my 600w MH and 315 CMH have a noticeable lean towards the CMH , praying right towards its light.


----------



## Growdict (Mar 3, 2017)

My current run under the cmh is killing it. Might get close to a pound. Pushing them hard only 16 inches away but buds are getting huge. Bit of leaf curl due to light at top but production is up


----------



## Michiganjesse (Mar 3, 2017)

Growdict said:


> Stop buying crappy leds. 1 hps600w canget 1lb. Or save up for cob leds


I really want to go cob nice cob i have a cheap 800watt cob Chinese knockoff but again cheap. I have 400 viparspectra 300 MarsHydro two 180 ufos not sure brand used i bought those and a 300 cfl Feliz flower bulb. I think even that much cheap light on two plants should do good but it's not. I'm thinking 315 lec may be my best bet. Snasmall space.


----------



## Growdict (Mar 3, 2017)

hmm, broken or do you keep hitting post


----------



## Michiganjesse (Mar 3, 2017)

Growdict said:


> hmm, broken or do you keep hitting post


I'm deleting now kept telling me error not posting bit i girguess it was


----------



## Michiganjesse (Mar 3, 2017)

Growdict said:


> hmm, broken or do you keep hitting post


All fixed up lol ya soon as it told me it went through i seen all 10 of my posts in a row. Guess I need more special wax chocolates lol


----------



## Michiganjesse (Mar 3, 2017)




----------



## 714steadyeddie (Mar 3, 2017)

Hey there needs some feedback, I'm purchasing a sun systems lec light. At first I was going with the built in ballast model that sells for 450$ 

I've seen recently that there is a remote ballast model and a different reflector. Does that run cooler temperatures wise? It's about a 100$ dollars cheaper


----------



## Bad Karma (Mar 3, 2017)

714steadyeddie said:


> Hey there needs some feedback, I'm purchasing a sun systems lec light. At first I was going with the built in ballast model that sells for 450$
> 
> I've seen recently that there is a remote ballast model and a different reflector. Does that run cooler temperatures wise? It's about a 100$ dollars cheaper


I've had both and the remote ballasts will help keep your temps down by 2-4 degrees (provided you keep the ballast outside of the tent).


----------



## 714steadyeddie (Mar 3, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I've had both and the remote ballasts will help keep your temps down by 2-4 degrees (provided you keep the ballast outside of the tent).


Thanks I thought so. I'm probably going to order the phantom 315w, I like how they have the updated remote ballast and air cooled option. Cheaper than sun systems too


----------



## Javadog (Mar 3, 2017)

Killing it there Gen. :0)


----------



## highdave (Mar 5, 2017)

Glad to see this still kickin around. Some good info and pretty buds!!!

This is my 4th run with the lec. 40 days in flower with a 10 day veg clones Dark Heart Nursery Chernobyl, SFV Og, the white and Sherbert.

There are somethings you may be able to cheap out on in your room. Your light should not be one on them


----------



## Bad Karma (Mar 5, 2017)

highdave said:


> Glad to see this still kickin around. Some good info and pretty buds!!!
> 
> This is my 4th run with the lec. 40 days in flower with a 10 day veg clones Dark Heart Nursery Chernobyl, SFV Og, the white and Sherbert.
> 
> There are somethings you may be able to cheap out on in your room. Your light should not be one on them


Dark Heart has some good cuts and is my favorite clone vendor.
Enjoy the Sherbet, I love that girl.


----------



## PSUAGRO. (Mar 6, 2017)

How's everyone's lec / lfsw phantom ballasts holding up?.........no troubles in paradise?


----------



## Psyphish (Mar 6, 2017)

I had two 315s in a 3x4 tent... the results were awesome. My next setup is going to be a lot smaller, A LOT, been thinking about COB kits from Timber, but I'm worried the results will be less than impressive compared to the two 315s. Anyone ever go from two 315s to COBs?


----------



## Growdict (Mar 6, 2017)

2 in a 3x4? wow thats a lot of light. why not just downgrade to one light going. you could block off a foot of your tent to make a 3x3 which is the perfect footprint for those imo.


----------



## dro-man80 (Mar 6, 2017)

Hey guys/gals, need some honest advice on 315s. Is the majority vote that "Sun Systems 315 LEC" the top of the line with the Phillips Bulb..
There are so many that are so different in price that can even run that bulb,that are much cheaper..Thanks for any help,,have a great day,much love and peace


----------



## Growdict (Mar 6, 2017)

if it doesnt specifically say "low frequency square wave ballast" dont buy it, otherwise go for it. just because a fixture can run that bulb, doesnt mean it is doing so at the effeciency you are looking for.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 6, 2017)

dro-man80 said:


> Hey guys/gals, need some honest advice on 315s. Is the majority vote that "Sun Systems 315 LEC" the top of the line with the Phillips Bulb..
> There are so many that are so different in price that can even run that bulb,that are much cheaper..Thanks for any help,,have a great day,much love and peace



From my research the bulb with the highest par and red spike is the Phillips 3100k. The bulb with the highest uv and blue range is the Phillips 4200k. And it is second in PAR. 

And it is said that all square wave ballasts are going to drive the bulb properly unlike electronic hps/ mh ballasts that vary on specs. 

But I still assume the cheaper ballasts will have more manufacturing issues and failures. 

I went with the sun system remote reflector and the galaxy ballast and 3100kbulb at growers house. $360 on sale delivered on Black Friday. Best deal with quality brands I could find.


----------



## dro-man80 (Mar 6, 2017)

Growdict said:


> if it doesnt specifically say "low frequency square wave ballast" dont buy it, otherwise go for it. just because a fixture can run that bulb, doesnt mean it is doing so at the effeciency you are looking for.


Ya i Definitely want the best,,just kind of confused about the differences..Mostly alot of what i read is I want the Sun System 315/Phillips Bulb,,but if ppl are pulling identical #s off different brands that happen to be cheaper then I'm all for it,,I run 4000 watts CXbs,and am considering these for the new room,avoiding all the DIYing lol,thanks again


----------



## dro-man80 (Mar 6, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> From my research the bulb with the highest par and red spike is the Phillips 3100k. The bulb with the highest uv and blue range is the Phillips 4200k. And it is second in PAR.
> 
> And it is said that all square wave ballasts are going to drive the bulb properly unlike electronic hps/ mh ballasts that vary on specs.
> 
> ...


Shit thats a awesome deal,Im checking there site now lol


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 6, 2017)

dro-man80 said:


> Hey guys/gals, need some honest advice on 315s. Is the majority vote that "Sun Systems 315 LEC" the top of the line with the Phillips Bulb..
> There are so many that are so different in price that can even run that bulb,that are much cheaper..Thanks for any help,,have a great day,much love and peace


Also I mentioned earlier in this thread that the cheaper remote reflector from SS has a cheaper pebbled reflective insert than the more expensive all in one unit or commercial remote. 

But it is very small percentage of reflectivity difference in practice. But is is less reflective and less money and all works on a 110 circuit.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 6, 2017)

dro-man80 said:


> Shit thats a awesome deal,Im checking there site now lol


I think that was 15 or 20% off at the time.


----------



## Bad Karma (Mar 6, 2017)

PSUAGRO. said:


> How's everyone's lec / lfsw phantom ballasts holding up?.........no troubles in paradise?


Mine has been chugging along for a year with no issues and great results.


----------



## dro-man80 (Mar 6, 2017)

Ya prices a little different now,but still looking,and prices are pretty reasonable.appreciate the link..I wasn't hip to GrowersHouse.com


----------



## GroErr (Mar 6, 2017)

Psyphish said:


> Anyone ever go from two 315s to COBs?


Yes, I was running 2x 315's covering off ~3.5x7'. Switched to 600w of 3590 Tasty LED's. About the same production, maybe a little more under the 3590's, density tends to be a little better. If you swapped out watt-for-watt you should be fine, quality/terps is outstanding. 400w of 3590 or V29's in a 3x4' should be good (recommend 30w/sq./ft.+) as long as the fixture/config can provide appropriate coverage in that footprint.


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 6, 2017)

dro-man80 said:


> Hey guys/gals, need some honest advice on 315s. Is the majority vote that "Sun Systems 315 LEC" the top of the line with the Phillips Bulb..
> There are so many that are so different in price that can even run that bulb,that are much cheaper..Thanks for any help,,have a great day,much love and peace


Cycloptics is supposed to be a better reflector. Philips bulb too.


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 6, 2017)

GroErr said:


> Yes, I was running 2x 315's covering off ~3.5x7'. Switched to 600w of 3590 Tasty LED's. About the same production, maybe a little more under the 3590's, density tends to be a little better. If you swapped out watt-for-watt you should be fine, quality/terps is outstanding. 400w of 3590 or V29's in a 3x4' should be good (recommend 30w/sq./ft.+) as long as the fixture/config can provide appropriate coverage in that footprint.
> 
> View attachment 3900862 View attachment 3900863 View attachment 3900864


what K value did you go with for your COBs?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 6, 2017)

GroErr said:


> Yes, I was running 2x 315's covering off ~3.5x7'. Switched to 600w of 3590 Tasty LED's. About the same production, maybe a little more under the 3590's, density tends to be a little better. If you swapped out watt-for-watt you should be fine, quality/terps is outstanding. 400w of 3590 or V29's in a 3x4' should be good (recommend 30w/sq./ft.+) as long as the fixture/config can provide appropriate coverage in that footprint.
> 
> View attachment 3900862 View attachment 3900863 View attachment 3900864


You can't be saying that as long as we use a good grow light of any kind it can grow good weed? What will I spend hours and hours reading, saving money and arguing about my way better results I can get because of a different light bulb? 

I guess I am going back to the flushing and defoliation threads. You ruined it now with those beautifully grown plants under those ice cold horrible cobs. Damn! I'm going to shoot out my new 315 with a bee bee gun. Hps all round! Lol.


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 6, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Hps all round!


shit man, mercury vapor is what the top notch growers use! lol


----------



## GroErr (Mar 6, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> what K value did you go with for your COBs?


Stuck with the standard 3500k and they seem to do just fine


----------



## GroErr (Mar 6, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> You can't be saying that as long as we use a good grow light of any kind it can grow good weed? What will I spend hours and hours reading, saving money and arguing about my way better results I can get because of a different light bulb?
> 
> I guess I am going back to the flushing and defoliation threads. You ruined it now with those beautifully grown plants under those ice cold horrible cobs. Damn! I'm going to shoot out my new 315 with a bee bee gun. Hps all round! Lol.


Lol, well sort of... to a point. I switched from blurples for flowering ~3 years ago, you won't see me flowering with those, may as well hang up Xmas lights or patio lanterns


----------



## dro-man80 (Mar 6, 2017)

GroErr said:


> Yes, I was running 2x 315's covering off ~3.5x7'. Switched to 600w of 3590 Tasty LED's. About the same production, maybe a little more under the 3590's, density tends to be a little better. If you swapped out watt-for-watt you should be fine, quality/terps is outstanding. 400w of 3590 or V29's in a 3x4' should be good (recommend 30w/sq./ft.+) as long as the fixture/config can provide appropriate coverage in that footprint.
> 
> View attachment 3900862 View attachment 3900863 View attachment 3900864


@GroErr is that pic/pics under the 315s or CXBs?
either way,awesome grow bro,,def eye pleaser


----------



## GroErr (Mar 6, 2017)

dro-man80 said:


> @GroErr is that pic/pics under the 315s or CXBs?
> either way,awesome grow bro,,def eye pleaser


Thanks & cheers Dro, they're under the 3590's and some are starting to harvest tonight  After a couple of rounds I can't bring myself to pull them out of there


----------



## Pmbreno (Mar 6, 2017)

Took my igrow out of the middle and added a 600 hps for this run. Not sure how they will mix but will definitely be adding another 315 in the middle next run just not sure which bulb to go with. Problems problems


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 6, 2017)

Pmbreno said:


> Took my igrow out of the middle and added a 600 hps for this run. Not sure how they will mix but will definitely be adding another 315 in the middle next run just not sure which bulb to go with. Problems problemsView attachment 3901135


Real nice grow! And it's ok to have 1st world problems.


----------



## Pmbreno (Mar 6, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Real nice grow! And it's ok to have 1st world problems.


Thank you. I was actually inspired by your grow and was originally going to add a 400 blue but that was being used by a friend


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 6, 2017)

Pmbreno said:


> Thank you. I was actually inspired by your grow and was originally going to add a 400 blue but that was being used by a friend


Thanks very much. I really appreciate that.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 7, 2017)

Here's a flower room update pic with the 600w Hortilux Blue, 600w Hortilux Super HPS and of course the 315w Phillips LEC 3100k with the new Galaxy ballast and Sun System remote reflector.



And here is the OG Kush x Trainwreck.

I stopped feeding her after taper about a week ago. She has received only well water 2x. I mention this because the plant is remaining so green and vibrant for the most part even though her buds were 90% cloudy trich's and some degradation started. She should be peaked and ready after a nights sleep.

Here is a mid canopy bud. Resin gland production is just awesome under the LEC I tells ya.


----------



## MistaRasta (Mar 7, 2017)

My first 315 flowers. Resin production and color definitely trumps hps and the buds all came out nice and chunky. Nice and dense pretty much all the way down. Pretty much comparable to a 600w with slightly less yield, which makes sense.

Trying cobs next, after that I'll make a determination on what I want to switch my main room with. Either way the 36% efficiency along with all the heat is going bye bye.


----------



## Yodaweed (Mar 7, 2017)

nice run @MistaRasta not to rain on your parade but all lights output the same amount of heat, the only factor that matters is how many watts you use(first law of thermodynamics), 1 watt = 3.412 BTU , so unless you are planning on using less watts the a/c requirements will be the same.


----------



## MistaRasta (Mar 7, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> nice run @MistaRasta not to rain on your parade but all lights output the same amount of heat, the only factor that matters is how many watts you use(first law of thermodynamics), 1 watt = 3.412 BTU , so unless you are planning on using less watts the a/c requirements will be the same.


If I put a 600w in that tent bare bulb my temps would be around 90-93. The 315 kept it around 78 the whole run.


----------



## Yodaweed (Mar 7, 2017)

MistaRasta said:


> If I put a 600w in that tent bare bulb my temps would be around 85-90. The 315 kept it around 78 the whole run.
> 
> Observation> your bullshit


315 watts is less than 600 watts? did you not read what i just said? no need to lash out because you don't understand...


----------



## MistaRasta (Mar 7, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> 315 watts is less than 600 watts? did you not read what i just said? no need to lash out because you don't understand...


And my yields were still on par with a 600. Efficiency is what you're not factoring in here.


----------



## Yodaweed (Mar 7, 2017)

MistaRasta said:


> And my yields were still on par with a 600. Efficiency is what you're not factoring in here.


Ok w/e you say boss not tryin to argue with you, trying to help guess you don't need it good luck. Just letting you know all watts are created equal , 600w of led = 600w of hps = 600w of a space heater. and i been using LEDs for years as well i use CXA2590's and mono cree XTE white + XTE red. my profile picture is some super silver haze grown under white/red LEDs.


----------



## MistaRasta (Mar 7, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> Ok w/e you say boss not tryin to argue with you, trying to help guess you don't need it good luck. Just letting you know all watts are created equal , 600w of led = 600w of hps = 600w of a space heater.


Then tell me why my 600w cob keeps my room about 12-14 degrees cooler than a 600w hps..

And I'm not trying to lash out, or argue. I just get tired of seeing your posts hating on anything that isn't hps. If hps works for you, great. Stick with it and I'll keep experimenting with new tech.

Either way, they're an amazing veg light and nobody can doubt that.


----------



## Yodaweed (Mar 7, 2017)

MistaRasta said:


> Then tell me why my 600w cob keeps my room about 12-14 degrees cooler than a 600w hps..
> 
> And I'm not trying to lash out, or argue. I just get tired of seeing your posts hating on anything that isn't hps. If hps works for you, great. Stick with it and I'll keep experimenting with new tech.
> 
> Either way, they're an amazing veg light and nobody can doubt that.


It's the same amount of heat just dispersed differently(leds use heat sinks , hps emits heat from bulb) , HPS have a high bump of IR light which makes surface temps higher , if your thermometer is directly in the light the readings will be off unless you got an IR/UV protected sensor. It's the first law of thermodynamics, it's not something i am making up or can change. If you don't believe me just google it, or google watts to btu conversion , lots of education out there on the net.

And i don't hate anything i am using all different types of equipment as well and let the results speak for themselves , i am currently testing 315 CMH's in different reflectors and the different bulbs in my setup , but i got leds too.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Mar 7, 2017)

ahahahahahaha I'm In.... 
Put My Name next to that Dotted Line.


----------



## Javadog (Mar 7, 2017)

Pmbreno for funniest avatar of the Year! :0)


----------



## ttystikk (Mar 8, 2017)

MistaRasta said:


> Then tell me why my 600w cob keeps my room about 12-14 degrees cooler than a 600w hps..
> 
> And I'm not trying to lash out, or argue. I just get tired of seeing your posts hating on anything that isn't hps. If hps works for you, great. Stick with it and I'll keep experimenting with new tech.
> 
> Either way, they're an amazing veg light and nobody can doubt that.


He's a waste of time. There will always be those who can't handle anything new. Meanwhile, you keep up the good work!


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 8, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> He's a waste of time. There will always be those who can't handle anything new. Meanwhile, you keep up the good work!


You have a know it all condescending blanket statement for everything. 

Except actual grow information.


----------



## MistaRasta (Mar 8, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> He's a waste of time. There will always be those who can't handle anything new. Meanwhile, you keep up the good work!


Thank you ttystikk!

Really enjoy your dedication to research of all the new tech. I see you're constantly trying new light setups. Most people want to stick to old methods as they've been around forever and they're a cheap buy-in. Needless to say, I've stepped out of my comfort zone and have no intention of back tracking. This is all thanks to you and a few other growers here that have put in the time,work, and $$$ to document their findings for advancement in the community.

I'll be trying Qb's after my cob runs as well. You're doing very well with them. Keep it coming!


----------



## HockeyBeard (Mar 8, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> It's the same amount of heat just dispersed differently(leds use heat sinks , hps emits heat from bulb) , HPS have a high bump of IR light which makes surface temps higher , if your thermometer is directly in the light the readings will be off unless you got an IR/UV protected sensor. It's the first law of thermodynamics, it's not something i am making up or can change. If you don't believe me just google it, or google watts to btu conversion , lots of education out there on the net.
> 
> And i don't hate anything i am using all different types of equipment as well and let the results speak for themselves , i am currently testing 315 CMH's in different reflectors and the different bulbs in my setup , but i got leds too.


Well, if a lamp is 35% efficient vs 60% efficient, wouldn't it stand to reason that 25% less heat is produced?


----------



## thccbdhealth (Mar 8, 2017)

has anyone herd anything about the "burn-in" time for the Philips 3100 bulbs?
is it fine to go straight into 12-12, or should it fire for 20hrs the first illumination?


----------



## pinner420 (Mar 8, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> has anyone herd anything about the "burn-in" time for the Philips 3100 bulbs?
> is it fine to go straight into 12-12, or should it fire for 20hrs the first illumination?


I went straight to 12. So that bulb has a,life expectancy of 2 years or so.


----------



## HockeyBeard (Mar 8, 2017)

I did too, I hadn't heard any such recommendations.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Mar 8, 2017)

I cant find the sheet for the 3100
only the 4100
https://hydrofarm.com/downloads/fc/220640_17600.pdf

this says the 4100 is rated for 24000 hours....
18hours a day x 365 days a year = 6570 x 3 years = 19,710

your saying its 2 years on 12/12, is the 3100 rated for less hours or am I somehow looking at this wrong?


----------



## pinner420 (Mar 8, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> I cant find the sheet for the 3100
> only the 4100
> https://hydrofarm.com/downloads/fc/220640_17600.pdf
> 
> ...


Read it somewhere other than the spec sheet... bonus year i like it....


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 8, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> has anyone herd anything about the "burn-in" time for the Philips 3100 bulbs?
> is it fine to go straight into 12-12, or should it fire for 20hrs the first illumination?


i have the mogul based bulb and it says on the box: until bulb has been run for 10 hours, do not shut off sooner than 2 minutes. if so, keep it off for 1 hour before relighting.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 8, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> i have the mogul based bulb and it says on the box: until bulb has been run for 10 hours, do not shut off sooner than 2 minutes. if so, keep it off for 1 hour before relighting.


My Phillips bulb had similar instructions.


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 8, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> My Phillips bulb had similar instructions.


mine is the philips too. just the mogul base model. 

how you likin the Blue MH? i've got another week or so and then i'm gonna add mine to the room with the LEC for 12/12.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 8, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> mine is the philips too. just the mogul base model.
> 
> how you likin the Blue MH? i've got another week or so and then i'm gonna add mine to the room with the LEC for 12/12.


Only had it burning a week or two but the plants seem to love it and my finishing buds look great. 

I hope it doesn't reduce my yield because I really like the room in natural looking lighting mostly.


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 8, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Only had it burning a week or two but the plants seem to love it and my finishing buds look great.
> 
> I hope it doesn't reduce my yield because I really like the room in natural looking lighting mostly.


how does it compare just by eyeing it to the "whiteness" of the LEC? i'm trying to decide if i want to keep the same plants under each bulb for the whole flowering or mix it up and give them some LEC and some Blue along the way.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 8, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> how does it compare just by eyeing it to the "whiteness" of the LEC? i'm trying to decide if i want to keep the same plants under each bulb for the whole flowering or mix it up and give them some LEC and some Blue along the way.


The LEC is more natural looking. The blue looks more "blue".


----------



## ttystikk (Mar 8, 2017)

HockeyBeard said:


> Well, if a lamp is 35% efficient vs 60% efficient, wouldn't it stand to reason that 25% less heat is produced?


It's closer to half.


----------



## ttystikk (Mar 8, 2017)

MistaRasta said:


> Thank you ttystikk!
> 
> Really enjoy your dedication to research of all the new tech. I see you're constantly trying new light setups. Most people want to stick to old methods as they've been around forever and they're a cheap buy-in. Needless to say, I've stepped out of my comfort zone and have no intention of back tracking. This is all thanks to you and a few other growers here that have put in the time,work, and $$$ to document their findings for advancement in the community.
> 
> I'll be trying Qb's after my cob runs as well. You're doing very well with them. Keep it coming!


Thank you. It's nice to be appreciated.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 9, 2017)

Here is an almost ready OG Kush x Trainwreck flowered almost 10 weeks under the 3 different lamps. It has been under the LEC for the last 9 days.


----------



## THCBrain (Mar 9, 2017)

How many 315's would you guys put in a 3 metre by 3 metre tent?


----------



## genuity (Mar 9, 2017)

THCBrain said:


> How many 315's would you guys put in a 3 metre by 3 metre tent?


I would go 3...but I know I would try to fit 4..


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 9, 2017)

THCBrain said:


> How many 315's would you guys put in a 3 metre by 3 metre tent?


4. The overlap would allow the additional coverage needed per lamp. They don't quite do a meter alone.


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## Madmungo (Mar 9, 2017)

3x3 would need 9x315's and should get you around 100oz, is that enuf for you?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 9, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> 3x3 would need 9x315's and should get you around 100oz, is that enuf for you?



Yes this! I don't know why I was thinking 2 meters by 2 meters. 9 is right.


----------



## THCBrain (Mar 9, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> 3x3 would need 9x315's and should get you around 100oz, is that enuf for you?


I was thinking 9 but didn't want to sound stupid, I may run a mixture of both 315's and 600's, the 600's would have to be air cooled.


----------



## ttystikk (Mar 10, 2017)

THCBrain said:


> I was thinking 9 but didn't want to sound stupid, I may run a mixture of both 315's and 600's, the 600's would have to be air cooled.


Every time I've run CMH alongside HPS, the plants hated the orange glow so much they did noticeably worse.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 10, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Every time I've run CMH alongside HPS, the plants hated the orange glow so much they did noticeably worse.


This statement is rediculous. Phillips made the things to assist hps not as a stand alone light source. 

And most pro growers use both. 

And the plants in the overlap in my room looks exactly the same as the directly under the lamps. 

And hps is already proven to grow plants fine so please ignore the above hps comments. They are silly.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 10, 2017)

HPS on left. LEC on right. The plants don't care. They transfer photosynthesis to the strongest wavelength. 

We stoned growers think we see all kinds of stuff that isn't there. And as humans make excuses for our own mistakes. 

The benefits are subtle. And unless you can grow a whole cycle healthy consistently you would never see any difference. And the light type won't help you if you can't. 

No one has picked 100% blind which weed I have that was grown under which light. I have jars of before and after hps alone.

I like the natural light to work under and have noticed a subtle quality improvement. No magic.
 

These plants have been in the same spot all week. 

Can you see a difference because of the light they are under? Hps corner looks ok to me. Lol. 

If I never heard of LEC and had added another hps. Except for the red tainted room I hate I would never have missed anything. 

I like them. And that is why I like them. Let's not pretend we are doing anything special to an adaptable plant. It is doing what's special.


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 10, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Here is an almost ready OG Kush x Trainwreck flowered almost 10 weeks under the 3 different lamps. It has been under the LEC for the last 9 days.
> View attachment 3902621


what do you grow from? seed , clone? if seed, what breeder is that one? looks nice.

i've been strictly fem seeds for a few years. the last clone i bought had mites and fucked my shit right up. nevermore.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 10, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> what do you grow from? seed , clone? if seed, what breeder is that one? looks nice.
> 
> i've been strictly fem seeds for a few years. the last clone i bought had mites and fucked my shit right up. nevermore.


I grow mostly from Fem seed because of plant count. I do also run clones from different seed plants that I liked and also some S-1 seed plants from some famous clone only'. Got Blue Dream now from a reversed Santa Cruz cut. 

The plant above is from ch9 female seeds.


----------



## Growdict (Mar 10, 2017)

me too. only time i have had pests, they have come from clones.


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 10, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> ch9 female seeds.


never heard of them. have to check out. 

i do like the fem seeds. i don't have the space or time to mess with growing reg seeds and find out half are dudes. my luck, all would be dudes.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 10, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> never heard of them. have to check out.
> 
> i do like the fem seeds. i don't have the space or time to mess with growing reg seeds and find out half are dudes. my luck, all would be dudes.


He used to be in all the seed banks. He finally pulled from attitude. seed politics. 

He mostly does bulk seeds now. But I have gotten stock in the last few months. He is prompt and helpful with emails usually. 

The Black Widow x Blue Lemon Thai pic in my avatar is a CH9 plant I grew. He used the pic on his website. I was honored. I was a newer grower at the time.


----------



## ttystikk (Mar 10, 2017)

Clone your own! Then you know what you have and no bugs.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 10, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Clone your own! Then you know what you have and no bugs.


But you buy and receive outside clones only by your own story about seeds being a terrible waste of time.


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 10, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Clone your own! Then you know what you have and no bugs.


i like variety. i've never bought the same strain of seeds twice.

and the 2 times i tried to clone, i failed horribly.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 10, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> i like variety. i've never bought the same strain of seeds twice.
> 
> and the 2 times i tried to clone, i failed horribly.


Me too! I plant a new seed or clone and harvest a different strain or cross every week. 

I am trying a lot of different seeds I acquired through a private forum from trading. 

I just clone in a cup of ocean forest and perlite and mist in a dome. Most of them root and grow fine. 

Need lower light and lots of humidity for clones to root. But they will root simply in a cup of water like grandmas flower cuttings.


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 10, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Me too! I plant a new seed or clone and harvest a different strain or cross every week.
> 
> I am trying a lot of different seeds I acquired through a private forum from trading.
> 
> ...


i've tried the rooting hormone powder and gel. i was doing it in a cobbled together dwc cloner contraption. so probably more operator error than anything else. 

maybe i'll try to clone in dirt next time and see if it works any better.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 10, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> i've tried the rooting hormone powder and gel. i was doing it in a cobbled together dwc cloner contraption. so probably more operator error than anything else.
> 
> maybe i'll try to clone in dirt next time and see if it works any better.


I don't use hormones either. Just well water. The breeder at ch9 blames rooting hormones for many later "hermies" on feminized seeds. 

Most have great results with aero cloners.


----------



## ttystikk (Mar 10, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> i've tried the rooting hormone powder and gel. i was doing it in a cobbled together dwc cloner contraption. so probably more operator error than anything else.
> 
> maybe i'll try to clone in dirt next time and see if it works any better.


Rapid rooters. Keep them damp, not wet.


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 10, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Rapid rooters. Keep them damp, not wet.


that might have been my problem last time. i had the cuts in RR's in an aero/dwc unit but they were soaking wet all the time. wonder if i can modify slightly so they are not so wet


----------



## ttystikk (Mar 10, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> that might have been my problem last time. i had the cuts in RR's in an aero/dwc unit but they were soaking wet all the time. wonder if i can modify slightly so they are not so wet


Yup. Dripping wet is a fatal mistake. Just damp.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 10, 2017)

Clones will root in a cup of water. It just takes longer. If you change the water out for fresh about every three days and leave it in indirect light most cuttings will root. 

Then just stick it in soil and keep it moist.


----------



## Pmbreno (Mar 10, 2017)

I've tried cloning with rapid rooters about 6 times and have zero success rate lol
I put together an aero cloner out of a 5 gallon bucket and I've always had 100% success with them
A friend of mine has the exact opposite problem. Mysterious shit


----------



## Growdict (Mar 10, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Clones will root in a cup of water. It just takes longer. If you change the water out for fresh about every three days and leave it in indirect light most cuttings will root.
> 
> Then just stick it in soil and keep it moist.


this is how i have been doing it, KIS and 80-90% success so far.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 11, 2017)

Pic time!

Stella Blue Dream S-1


 

Critical Mass x Blue Lemon Thai
  

Blue Lemon Thai #3 (re-vegged)


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 11, 2017)

Here's the OG Kush x Trainwreck harvested. 

She smells like lemons and fuel.


----------



## Javadog (Mar 11, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Yup. Dripping wet is a fatal mistake. Just damp.


This is correct.

When I kill young plants, I do it with water. (but I try not to)


----------



## Coloradoclear (Mar 12, 2017)

Pmbreno said:


> I've tried cloning with rapid rooters about 6 times and have zero success rate lol
> I put together an aero cloner out of a 5 gallon bucket and I've always had 100% success with them
> A friend of mine has the exact opposite problem. Mysterious shit


I build one of those 5 gallon bucket cloners too. Best thing I ever did for myself. Almost 100% success rate and no humidity dome!


----------



## Pseudogrowx (Mar 13, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Me too! I plant a new seed or clone and harvest a different strain or cross every week.
> 
> I am trying a lot of different seeds I acquired through a private forum from trading.
> 
> ...


Where do you acquire private strains and seeds? Where is that forum?


----------



## Pseudogrowx (Mar 13, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Pic time!
> 
> Stella Blue Dream S-1
> View attachment 3903781
> ...


Blue dream doesn't seem like a good yielder despite popular belief.


----------



## Javadog (Mar 13, 2017)

It did not look like Stella was done though...


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 13, 2017)

Pseudogrowx said:


> Blue dream doesn't seem like a good yielder despite popular belief.


Guess we will see. I never grew it before and this is not for sure the high yielding clone only cut. 

I don't really grow for high yield as much as potential.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 13, 2017)

Javadog said:


> It did not look like Stella was done though...


Mines got at least 3 weeks to go. could be more with the hazy smell and resin taste she keeps leaning more towards.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 13, 2017)

Pseudogrowx said:


> Where do you acquire private strains and seeds? Where is that forum?


They have to invite you on to a private forum. I have left the one I was at.


----------



## Pseudogrowx (Mar 13, 2017)

Is there a public forum where they trade seeds? Or is it more of they like what you are growing and they think you are skilled enough to grow private strains?


----------



## Pseudogrowx (Mar 13, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Mines got at least 3 weeks to go. could be more with the hazy smell and resin taste she keeps leaning more towards.


The reason why I say that, is because I am currently growing a blue dream strain and it is week 3 into flowering and the buds are still small (week 8 overall; partner did a 5 week veg) .


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 14, 2017)

Pseudogrowx said:


> The reason why I say that, is because I am currently growing a blue dream strain and it is week 3 into flowering and the buds are still small (week 8 overall; partner did a 5 week veg) .


Week 3 is early. The most bud growth is in the last 2 to 3 weeks on most hybrids. And the recommended times for flowering are not usually going to happen in our rooms. I have no strains finishing under 9.5 weeks. Most more than 10. 

I do mean finished though. I see way to many early cut plants. 

And the OG Kush is from CH9 Female seeds. They are not from the forums. He is a breeder located in Spain. I like to buy direct from breeders. He answered my emails and helped me some when I was a newer grower. My avatar is my pic he uses of Black Widow x Blue Lemon Thai. 

I have had very consistent results and have posted quite a few different ch9 plants.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 14, 2017)

Pseudogrowx said:


> Is there a public forum where they trade seeds? Or is it more of they like what you are growing and they think you are skilled enough to grow private strains?


And the forum I was on did not offer much more than hobby breeding. Anyone can try to reverse a famous clone only. They got better ch9 seeds back in my opinion so far.

Patients and Mrs Med grower have picked Ch9 BLT and crosses over classic headband and Dinachem.
And the forum's CTF and GTH x CTF So far.

I have many more seeds to grow and test. I always have a couple new seed plants I haven't grown before in rotation.

I'm sorry I made the forum sound so enticing. I quit it to continue my path for better meds.

My friend in Colorado has nerve damage and pain relief and Mrs Med grower has a 40% reduction of her cysts as of 2 months ago doctor verified from coconut oil made from various ch9 strains.


----------



## Pseudogrowx (Mar 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Week 3 is early. The most bud growth is in the last 2 to 3 weeks on most hybrids. And the recommended times for flowering are not usually going to happen in our rooms. I have no strains finishing under 9.5 weeks. Most more than 10.
> 
> I do mean finished though. I see way to many early cut plants.
> 
> ...


Damn, that black widow x blue lemon thai looks amazing, I'd like to acquire some of that.


----------



## Pseudogrowx (Mar 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> And the forum I was on did not offer much more than hobby breeding. Anyone can try to reverse a famous clone only. They got better ch9 seeds back in my opinion so far.
> 
> Patients and Mrs Med grower have picked Ch9 BLT and crosses over classic headband and Dinachem.
> And the forum's CTF and GTH x CTF So far.
> ...


It's all good, good luck with your plants and it's a great thing that you're doing. Giving patients alternative medicine to actually help with their ailments.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 14, 2017)

Pseudogrowx said:


> It's all good, good luck with your plants and it's a great thing that you're doing. Giving patients alternative medicine to actually help with their ailments.


Thank you. 

I only have a small garden and I am hurt and working as hard as possible to keep it going. But I try to help who I can. 

And my feeling on getting seeds is actually suggested in the beginning of Jorje Cervantes old book. Contact breeders that interest you and see who you feel deserves your business. 

And thats where I started. And I read as much as possible from growers here and other forums of course.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 14, 2017)

Pseudogrowx said:


> Damn, that black widow x blue lemon thai looks amazing, I'd like to acquire some of that.


Pretty sure he has that in stock.


----------



## Pseudogrowx (Mar 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Pretty sure he has that in stock.


I have been doing that, have learned so much so far. Thank you


----------



## thccbdhealth (Mar 14, 2017)

Im currently on my secound humidistate, the 20.00 Wal-Mart special "bio's"
Im on my secound as i didnt think the first was reading correctly, and the secound is reading the relative same....
It will read the humidity at say 33%
Ill reset it and hit the max/min memory recall button and it will say a high of 95% relative humidity.
i think these 2 i have are just Wal-Mart garbage.
Im in the secound week of flower and this is my first round in the 4x4 tent
420cfm turned down to 185cfm CanMax fan carbon filter and fan run continually 24/7
I have a dehumidifier but dont have a humidity controller for it to cycle it on and off so its not currently in use

Im wondering what a few suggestions of trusted brand of humidistates might be.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 17, 2017)

Here is the dried and 2 nights ago trimmed and jarred OG Kush x Trainwreck. It definitely leans towards the OG. It smells of faint earthy lemons and tropical fruit and fuel.

And I have been rotating plants pretty evenly and she still did our average. 4.2 oz quality nugs. And 2 jars of small buds and bud trim for tincture and coconut oil. 

So the 315 is hangin' in there folks. And helping buds look like this. I think the quality is getting better. This shit will bowl you over and taste good already.


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## Pmbreno (Mar 17, 2017)

Day 30 from flip. Seeing a lot more stretch on the lec sides but the growth seems to be knocking the hps out of their league all together.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 17, 2017)

Pmbreno said:


> Day 30 from flip. Seeing a lot more stretch on the lec sides but the growth seems to be knocking the hps out of their league all together. View attachment 3908116


I got the stretch issue handled in my room by getting he lamp 16" from the canopy. Then the plants grow more compact.

Nice grow you got going there


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## Pmbreno (Mar 17, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I got the stretch issue handled in my room by getting he lamp 16" from the canopy. Then the plants grow more compact.
> 
> Nice grow you got going there


I was running them at 16 last run and it wasn't quite this much. I added the 600 hps just out of curiosity and I always liked the way your plants looked. I've been spending time training for a lot of tops but I think I'm going to try to concentrate on fewer but larger colas this next run. I get the feeling this girl will do great with that. Another thing I noticed tonight was my branches under hps are smaller. The plant in the middle was the biggest of the three by far until the hps was introduced.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 17, 2017)

Pmbreno said:


> I was running them at 16 last run and it wasn't quite this much. I added the 600 hps just out of curiosity and I always liked the way your plants looked. I've been spending time training for a lot of tops but I think I'm going to try to concentrate on fewer but larger colas this next run. I get the feeling this girl will do great with that. Another thing I noticed tonight was my branches under hps are smaller. The plant in the middle was the biggest of the three by far until the hps was introduced.


Light is merely one of the many factors that need to be in balance. Stretch can be from an invisible potassium deficiency. And thin branches too. 

As well as environmental factors like temp and humidity and air flow. 

The type of lights have made the least difference in my Grow. Proper nutrition and working the light properly. The most.


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## Pmbreno (Mar 18, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Light is merely one of the many factors that need to be in balance. Stretch can be from an invisible potassium deficiency. And thin branches too.
> 
> As well as environmental factors like temp and humidity and air flow.
> 
> The type of lights have made the least difference in my Grow. Proper nutrition and working the light properly. The most.


Yes I am a believer in that exactly. I spent the last 6 months trying to get things dialed in with the means I am able to pull together and it's been working pretty well. Really good air flow and temps hold between 70 lights out 75 on, humidity pretty steady at 40-50. Nutes are house and garden and botanicare for bloom booster and cal mag.


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## Growdict (Mar 18, 2017)

Lec run 12/12 from seed sog grow. 8th week of flower. About 11 since germination. 2-3 weeks left i think. Cant wait. Going to be an awesome yield. Colas fat as pop cans


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 18, 2017)

Growdict said:


> Lec run 12/12 from seed sog grow. 8th week of flower. About 11 since germination. 2-3 weeks left i think. Cant wait. Going to be an awesome yield. Colas fat as pop cans
> 
> 
> View attachment 3908219 View attachment 3908220


Nice work! Sure are fat buds.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 18, 2017)

Blue Dream. Week 8 Day 1


I don't know what to make of this weird plant. An s-1 seed from a supposedly true cut sprouted her. She used to smell and her resin tasted of blueberries. But now that she is really stacking she smells and tastes like lime. Maybe peppery lime. 

On the random pics thread we compared her to a real Santa Cruz plant and they sure look alike. 

Here is mine 5 days ago. Week 7. 
 

Anyone got any input about Stella Blue Dream?


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Mar 18, 2017)

Hey all its been a long winter hope everyone is well.
Has anyone used the 3100k 315 for seedlings? How high should I keep the light? Or should i just use my 8 bulb t5?
@GroErr @Bad Karma @DemonTrich @GemuGrows I am open to suggestions since this is only my second run with these lights and I used my t5 last time for seedlings until they were 5 nodes or so(and every other time before for years)

Thanks


----------



## GroErr (Mar 18, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Hey all its been a long winter hope everyone is well.
> Has anyone used the 3100k 315 for seedlings? How high should I keep the light? Or should i just use my 8 bulb t5?
> @GroErr @Bad Karma @DemonTrich @GemuGrows I am open to suggestions since this is only my second run with these lights and I used my t5 last time for seedlings until they were 5 nodes or so(and every other time before for years)
> 
> Thanks


I haven't personally. but my son tried it and got too much stretch, lights have to be fairly high up for seedlings under these. He stuck to his T5's until they get a few nodes like you mentioned, probably your best bet if they're available. I did run some under the 3100k straight to 12/12 from seed and they stretched like mofo's too.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Mar 18, 2017)

So get the 4100K bulb?


----------



## Bad Karma (Mar 18, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Hey all its been a long winter hope everyone is well.
> Has anyone used the 3100k 315 for seedlings? How high should I keep the light? Or should i just use my 8 bulb t5?
> @GroErr @Bad Karma @DemonTrich @GemuGrows I am open to suggestions since this is only my second run with these lights and I used my t5 last time for seedlings until they were 5 nodes or so(and every other time before for years)
> 
> Thanks


I haven't had any stretching issues with my seedlings or clones under the 3100k bulb. I keep the light at 3.5 feet from the youngsters and let them grow towards it for awhile before adjusting the lamps height.


----------



## HockeyBeard (Mar 20, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Rapid rooters. Keep them damp, not wet.


This is the method I use with the most success. 75% success rate overall, if it's a good, strong clone site, almost 100% with proper humidity conditions.


----------



## HockeyBeard (Mar 20, 2017)

Growdict said:


> Lec run 12/12 from seed sog grow. 8th week of flower. About 11 since germination. 2-3 weeks left i think. Cant wait. Going to be an awesome yield. Colas fat as pop cans
> 
> 
> View attachment 3908219 View attachment 3908220


What's giving you that leaf curl?


----------



## Growdict (Mar 21, 2017)

Heat/light. Running it about 16" away from the light. Getting some leaf taco up top but below that is fine and getting better results then when i have run it at 22" away.


----------



## DemonTrich (Mar 21, 2017)

I still use a 4k bulb for veg and a 3k for flower. I'm absolutely KILLING it with these 315s. Equal to my 600hps runs. 

Week 5 iirc


----------



## Growdict (Mar 21, 2017)

nice, those are really healthy looking DemonTrich!


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Mar 21, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> I still use a 4k bulb for veg and a 3k for flower. I'm absolutely KILLING it with these 315s. Equal to my 600hps runs.
> 
> Week 5 iirc
> 
> View attachment 3910388


@DemonTrich are you using the phillips 4200K ? I am running the hydrofarm phantom ballast 2nd gen.


----------



## DemonTrich (Mar 21, 2017)

Prism ballasts 
3k philips agro bulb in veg
Philips cdm elite 4k bulb in flower.


----------



## Growdict (Mar 21, 2017)

you mean the other way around yes? 3k for flower


----------



## DemonTrich (Mar 21, 2017)

Growdict said:


> you mean the other way around yes? 3k for flower


Yes
3k flower
4k veg


----------



## TheBeesKnees (Mar 21, 2017)

Hi guys I recently got a 315 watt and the bulb feels really loose in the socket. The instructions said when I insert it into the mogul and turn clockwise, I would feel a lock in type mechanism. When I try to install my bulb I stick it, turn clockwise, but there's no lock in feeling. My bulb fell out and hit the floor but luckily didn't break, any help would be appreciated. Maybe I can put some electrical tape near the socket to secure it?


----------



## Growdict (Mar 21, 2017)

that doesnt sound right, mine is tight. can you post a link to product for reference?


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## TheBeesKnees (Mar 21, 2017)

It's a Philips Mastercolor CDM-TP Elite 315W CMH Agro Lamp T12 - 3100ºK and a sunsystem lec 315 ra remote reflector. Ya, it's not tight at all, the reflector is made so the bulb is faced downwards when I have it in the socket, if I turn the reflector so the bulb isn't facing downwards, then the bulb falls out.


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## Growdict (Mar 21, 2017)

like this?


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## ttystikk (Mar 21, 2017)

TheBeesKnees said:


> It's a Philips Mastercolor CDM-TP Elite 315W CMH Agro Lamp T12 - 3100ºK and a sunsystem lec 315 ra remote reflector. Ya, it's not tight at all, the reflector is made so the bulb is faced downwards when I have it in the socket, if I turn the reflector so the bulb isn't facing downwards, then the bulb falls out.


I seriously think you don't have the bulb in far enough.


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## TheBeesKnees (Mar 21, 2017)

I'll try sticking it in further now, and Growdict I have a sunsystem reflector, it's not a conversion socket.


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## genuity (Mar 21, 2017)

You have to make sure the 2 prongs are in the holes


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## TheBeesKnees (Mar 21, 2017)

Ok so ya it was already the furthest it could go, I've turned on the bulb and it fires it's just that it's really loose in the socket, I don't feel any lock in type mechanism with this socket.


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## TheBeesKnees (Mar 21, 2017)

This is really lame, I got this from growershouse too. I thought it was kind of strange when I received this reflector, the sticky green plastic film that is usually on new reflectors wasn't on this one... it was already taken off it appeared. And in the instructions, it tells me to take off the film... I wonder if growershouse were aware they sent me a defective reflector... 

Any suggestions, would a small amount of electrical tape around the socket be ok? I'm not sure about the heat coming from the bulb near the socket.

I'm thinking about just gorilla glueing this bitch, these bulbs have like a 10,000+ hour rating right lol


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## Bad Karma (Mar 21, 2017)

TheBeesKnees said:


> This is really lame, I got this from growershouse too. I thought it was kind of strange when I received this reflector, the sticky green plastic film that is usually on new reflectors wasn't on this one... it was already taken off it appeared. And in the instructions, it tells me to take off the film... I wonder if growershouse were aware they sent me a defective reflector...
> 
> Any suggestions, would a small amount of electrical tape around the socket be ok? I'm not sure about the heat coming from the bulb near the socket.


Call growershouse.com right away and get a new one. They are really good about making things right with their customers if you're not happy with a defective product.


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 21, 2017)

4x8 tent. How many lights?


----------



## all coco (Mar 21, 2017)

TheBeesKnees said:


> This is really lame, I got this from growershouse too. I thought it was kind of strange when I received this reflector, the sticky green plastic film that is usually on new reflectors wasn't on this one... it was already taken off it appeared. And in the instructions, it tells me to take off the film... I wonder if growershouse were aware they sent me a defective reflector...
> 
> Any suggestions, would a small amount of electrical tape around the socket be ok? I'm not sure about the heat coming from the bulb near the socket.
> 
> I'm thinking about just gorilla glueing this bitch, these bulbs have like a 10,000+ hour rating right lol


my reflectors didn't have any film either. For the bulb are you putting the prongs in correctly one has a flat spot.


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## TheBeesKnees (Mar 21, 2017)

I kind of jammed it in, I don't think mine has a lock mechanism and if it does it must be really ineffective.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 22, 2017)

TheBeesKnees said:


> I kind of jammed it in, I don't think mine has a lock mechanism and if it does it must be really ineffective.


Maybe me didn't have film either. They are a cheaper version of the remote reflector. 

And it was like you say for a minute when I tried to install the bulb. But if you get it in like the instructions say it locks right in.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Mar 22, 2017)

what are the differences with all these bulbs?

https://www.bulbamerica.com/products/philips-315w-cdm-elite-mw-t12-4200k-hid-light-bulb?CAWELAID=120150920000483410&catargetid=120150920005015693&cadevice=c&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=ECI - Google Shopping - All Products&utm_term=1100000054960&utm_content=All Products


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## PhuckDaPoeLease (Mar 22, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> I still use a 4k bulb for veg and a 3k for flower. I'm absolutely KILLING it with these 315s. Equal to my 600hps runs.
> 
> Week 5 iirc
> 
> View attachment 3910388


Beautiful canopy. I see you also like to press?


----------



## DemonTrich (Mar 22, 2017)

Nope, upped my game to short path distillation. Further refining of concentrates I to a pure thc form.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Mar 22, 2017)

> ="DemonTrich, post: 13426574, member: 547680
> "upped my game to short path distillation. Further refining of concentrates I to a pure thc form.


Im hoping there is a tread to follow your methods, experience, and results.


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## SensiPuff (Mar 23, 2017)

Does the added uv and infrared of the cmh produce more potent buds than the cob cxb3590? I want first hand experience please. Trying to decide whether it's worth buying a 315 set up for my 3x3. Right now I have a 250 watt cxb3590 kit from timber. Any answers are appreciated. Thanks folks


----------



## Madmungo (Mar 23, 2017)

SensiPuff said:


> Does the added uv and infrared of the cmh produce more potent buds than the cob cxb3590? I want first hand experience please. Trying to decide whether it's worth buying a 315 set up for my 3x3. Right now I have a 250 watt cxb3590 kit from timber. Any answers are appreciated. Thanks folks


There's no real UV with the double jacket lamps, but they do produce tip top bud, especially the 4200k


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 23, 2017)

SensiPuff said:


> Does the added uv and infrared of the cmh produce more potent buds than the cob cxb3590? I want first hand experience please. Trying to decide whether it's worth buying a 315 set up for my 3x3. Right now I have a 250 watt cxb3590 kit from timber. Any answers are appreciated. Thanks folks


There is a pair of vids on youtube by A grower that showed a cmh beat cobs and hps by 4% THC in his lab test. 

It's the fuller spectrum and additional uv likely.


----------



## SensiPuff (Mar 23, 2017)

What bulbs and fixture brand is everyone running?


----------



## a senile fungus (Mar 23, 2017)

Philips


----------



## jacrispy (Mar 23, 2017)

i run a couple of these  one of each max par bulbs.
$720 complete @ growers house
hydrobuilder said he would do a set for 700, but i got mine @ growers house.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 23, 2017)

SensiPuff said:


> What bulbs and fixture brand is everyone running?


Sun system remote reflector and galaxy ballast and Phillips 3100k bulb in flower room. 

Least expensive highest quality option at growers house in my opinion.


----------



## Madmungo (Mar 23, 2017)

SensiPuff said:


> What bulbs and fixture brand is everyone running?


D paps and I just stick in a bulb as I fancy, all 3 are very good


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## SensiPuff (Mar 23, 2017)

Are the growers choice fixtures any good? Looks like there system is about $320 but doesn't have the Phillips bulb.. which I'm assuming is the best?


----------



## SensiPuff (Mar 23, 2017)

jacrispy said:


> i run a couple of these View attachment 3912043 View attachment 3912044one of each max par bulbs.
> $720 complete @ growers house
> hydrobuilder said he would do a set for 700, but i got mine @ growers house.


Looks like you have the photon 180 side by side with cmh. Cob vs lec. Which light is putting out the danker buds?


----------



## jacrispy (Mar 23, 2017)

SensiPuff said:


> Looks like you have the photon 180 side by side with cmh. Cob vs lec. Which light is putting out the danker buds?


hmmm...
i just got those lights & several more
so i cant say yet.
you should ask groerr he has lots of experience with cob & lec.
i run plc, timber, northern, nanolux, agromax uv, my hps & love em all,
but if i was gonna buy another light
i would get ahold of a quantum board.


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 23, 2017)

3 or 4 lights for a 4x8?


----------



## PhuckDaPoeLease (Mar 24, 2017)

jacrispy said:


> hmmm...
> i just got those lights & several more
> so i cant say yet.
> you should ask groerr he has lots of experience with cob & lec.
> ...


You run the Agromax pure UV bulbs or the uv-A bulbs?


----------



## PhuckDaPoeLease (Mar 24, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> 3 or 4 lights for a 4x8?


2000 watts is the maximum I would do in a 4 x 8. I currently run 1708 watts in my 4 x 8 area.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 24, 2017)

PhuckDaPoeLease said:


> 2000 watts is the maximum I would do in a 4 x 8. I currently run 1708 watts in my 4 x 8 area.


The think he means 315 LEC lamps. And 3 would work. 4 would likely yield heavy.


----------



## PhuckDaPoeLease (Mar 24, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> The think he means 315 LEC lamps. And 3 would work. 4 would likely yield heavy.


Oh my bad. No experience with LEC but hear great things.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 24, 2017)

PhuckDaPoeLease said:


> Oh my bad. No experience with LEC but hear great things.


I really like working with mine. I say it is 3/4 of a 600 hps for flowering footprint but is lighter and needs no air cooling in my room of air cooled 600's. And it feels and looks like sunlight. Even on the back of my neck. The plants take to it immediately from the fluorescent veg tent. They shy away from the hps for a day or too usually. 

They all love the 600 Hortilux blue right away too but you have to watch the distance.


----------



## PhuckDaPoeLease (Mar 24, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I really like working with mine. I say it is 3/4 of a 600 hps for flowering footprint but is lighter and needs no air cooling in my room of air cooled 600's. And it feels and looks like sunlight. Even on the back of my neck. The plants take to it immediately from the fluorescent veg tent. They shy away from the hps for a day or too usually.
> 
> They all love the 600 Hortilux blue right away too but you have to watch the distance.


Interesting. So they emit far less heat than a 600 hps? Is there an LEC equivalent to 1000w hps?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 24, 2017)

PhuckDaPoeLease said:


> Interesting. So they emit far less heat than a 600 hps? Is there an LEC equivalent to 1000w hps?


They make air cooled and open 630's with 2 315's in 1 reflector. 

It is always 1 degree cooler with just clip fans between the 315 and the canopy than my air cooled 600's but they also vent the room. They are not on their own loop. 

I added another exhaust out but it only ever needs to be on low. 

It is basically as cool as 315 watts of light bulb I guess. I could run an open 400 w hps or mh the same way I think.


----------



## Madmungo (Mar 24, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> 3 or 4 lights for a 4x8?


Depends, do you want a kilo or 50 oz?


----------



## thccbdhealth (Mar 24, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> There's no real UV with the double jacket lamps, but they do produce tip top bud, especially the 4200k


Have you used the 3100k in flower?
Are you stating your findings are the 4200k flowers plants better then the 3100k?


----------



## Psyphish (Mar 24, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> There is a pair of vids on youtube by A grower that showed a cmh beat cobs and hps by 4% THC in his lab test.
> 
> It's the fuller spectrum and additional uv likely.


That's horrible news, I was thinking of getting COBs now that I don't have space for 315s, might have to reconsider since I loved the product I was getting with the 2x315w. I guess LEDs still have a long way to go.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 24, 2017)

Psyphish said:


> That's horrible news, I was thinking of getting COBs now that I don't have space for 315s, might have to reconsider since I loved the product I was getting with the 2x315w. I guess LEDs still have a long way to go.


Don't blame me


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 24, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Don't blame me


been running the blue daylight for a few days now. love it! plants seem to love it too. a bit bluer than the 4K LEC i have next to it. should be a good combo. gonna add a uvb T5 after stretch.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 24, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> been running the blue daylight for a few days now. love it! plants seem to love it too. a bit bluer than the 4K LEC i have next to it. should be a good combo. gonna add a uvb T5 after stretch.


Ok. I will take the blame for that.


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 24, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Ok. I will take the blame for that.


good blame for sure!


----------



## Yodaweed (Mar 24, 2017)

Psyphish said:


> That's horrible news, I was thinking of getting COBs now that I don't have space for 315s, might have to reconsider since I loved the product I was getting with the 2x315w. I guess LEDs still have a long way to go.


LEDs are massively over rated, all those efficiency numbers don't mean shit because their spectrum isn't proper, even white LEDs aren't full spectrum, they are a colored LED that has a coating over them(usually phosphor) to make them appear white. It is massively different than super heating a gas (like the sun or HID lights).


----------



## Growdict (Mar 24, 2017)

i have both, some cree3590s and a ss philips 315. both are great lights. I would recommend either. i dont see a difference in thc levels, but havent had a test done.


----------



## ttystikk (Mar 24, 2017)

Growdict said:


> i have both, some cree3590s and a ss philips 315. both are great lights. I would recommend either. i dont see a difference in thc levels, but havent had a test done.


I've run CDM/CMH type lights for years and they do make the frost. I had heat problems, which COB LED solved. I'm growing the best quality ever with them.


----------



## Yodaweed (Mar 24, 2017)

Growdict said:


> i have both, some cree3590s and a ss philips 315. both are great lights. I would recommend either. i dont see a difference in thc levels, but havent had a test done.


I got some cree cxa2590's , cree XTE white, cree xte red, i would recommend the CMH over any LED. Much fuller spectrum. LED's are over hyped and over priced, i really don't see any advantage of using LEDs over HID lights anymore. Honestly to replace a good 1kw hps you need nearly 1kw of LEDs, whats the point in that when they cost 10x more, and all watts produce the same amount of heat so 1,000 watts in = 3400 btu about. Not to mention they produce ZERO UV, ZERO IR, and nearly zero far red. They aren't even good at growing lettuce , my lettuce prefers the sun or my HID lights.


----------



## Gaz29 (Mar 24, 2017)

Hi all just bought myself an omega 315w ballast Phillips bulb connecter etc and I'm replacing a 600w hps.. i really like the cri/par etc of this bulb & tech.! Looking forward to seeing what these lights can do... happy growing 
Gaz


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## GroErr (Mar 24, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> I've run CDM/CMH type lights for years and they do make the frost. I had heat problems, which COB LED solved. I'm growing the best quality ever with them.


Quality is somewhat subjective but I have a pretty good nose and taste buds and my buds have never smelled or tasted better under COBs. I also had several comments from people I share with after I switched, many asking what the "new strains" were (same strains/phenos grown under different lighting). Quality and terps were great under the 315's but definitely a step up from that with 3590's ime. 

Not a tech snob and will likely use my 315's again if the situation calls for them. But I'd definitely stop short of saying quality is better under 315's and I used them for 2+ years. I've yet to see anyone say "I should have stuck with hps or CMH" after switching over to COBs.

BTW: I define quality in the context of smell, visual and taste. Not how high the THC is, THC is one of 70+ cannabinoids and only one factor in how high you get.


----------



## Madmungo (Mar 24, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Have you used the 3100k in flower?
> Are you stating your findings are the 4200k flowers plants better then the 3100k?


Generally I start with 1 4200k lamp then add a second fixture with a 3100k lamp 2 weeks after flip, I average about 600 grams from 9 indica dominant in coco.


----------



## Yodaweed (Mar 24, 2017)

GroErr said:


> Quality is somewhat subjective but I have a pretty good nose and taste buds and my buds have never smelled or tasted better under COBs. I also had several comments from people I share with after I switched, many asking what the "new strains" were (same strains/phenos grown under different lighting). Quality and terps were great under the 315's but definitely a step up from that with 3590's ime.
> 
> Not a tech snob and will likely use my 315's again if the situation calls for them. But I'd definitely stop short of saying quality is better under 315's and I used them for 2+ years. I've yet to see anyone say "I should have stuck with hps or CMH" after switching over to COBs.
> 
> BTW: I define quality in the context of smell, visual and taste. Not how high the THC is, THC is one of 70+ cannabinoids and only one factor in how high you get.


That's your opinion.What i have seen from actual lab test data is that CMH lights produce the highest THC levels, than DE HPS , then the rest(leds usually the lowest THC because they have no UV and UV is essential to THC and cannabinoid production). It's the reason a lot of the dispensaries are buying DE and CMH lights. They are not buying COBs on a mass scale so that should tell you something as well.


----------



## Madmungo (Mar 24, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> That's your opinion.What i have seen from actual lab test data is that CMH lights produce the highest THC levels, than DE HPS , then the rest(leds usually the lowest THC because they have no UV and UV is essential to THC and cannabinoid production). It's the reason a lot of the dispensaries are buying DE and CMH lights. They are not buying COBs on a mass scale so that should tell you something as well.


Mate, the outer jacket on a 315 open fixture lamp lamp blocks virtually all the uv from a cmh, unless you're running an single jacket in an open fixture (dangerous!)
Then you're not getting uv, also you can't get a sun tan through a window either, same principal.


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 24, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> The think he means 315 LEC lamps. And 3 would work. 4 would likely yield heavy.


So go with 4? open hood? I read a glass running it closed and cooled is bad because the glass blocks the uvb from the light.

I actually had a few Amare LEDs laying around and a Johnson CX9. Was thinking of running 2 - 315s with an LED in the middle...


----------



## Yodaweed (Mar 24, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> Mate, the outer jacket on a 315 open fixture lamp lamp blocks virtually all the uv from a cmh, unless you're running an single jacket in an open fixture (dangerous!)
> Then you're not getting uv, also you can't get a sun tan through a window either, same principal.


That's completely wrong. 

http://growershouse.com/blog/cmh-315w-lamp-comparison-test-data-review/

please read this before commenting.


----------



## Madmungo (Mar 24, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> So go with 4? open hood? I read a glass running it closed and cooled is bad because the glass blocks the uvb from the light.
> 
> I actually had a few Amare LEDs laying around and a Johnson CX9. Was thinking of running 2 - 315s with an LED in the middle...


I'd put the LED by the extract/air con so they can keep cool and more efficient and put the cmh together at the hot end.


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 24, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> I'd put the LED by the extract/air con so they can keep cool and more efficient and put the cmh together at the hot end.


Thanks

What is the difference between these 2 besides the light vertical vs horizontal?

http://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-315w-light-cmh-ceramic-mh-fixture-240v-3100k

http://growershouse.com/sun-system-diamond-lec-315-208-240-volt-w-3100k-lamp-ceramic-mh-grow-light

Should I go with the 2nd one because I'm in a tent?


----------



## Madmungo (Mar 24, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> That's completely wrong.
> 
> http://growershouse.com/blog/cmh-315w-lamp-comparison-test-data-review/
> 
> please read this before commenting.


So the relatively low numbers bit is meant to contradict me? I said virtually none the point is...........


----------



## Madmungo (Mar 24, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> Thanks
> 
> What is the difference between these 2 besides the light vertical vs horizontal?
> 
> ...


I I've only used DPaps and Philips lamps so I'm not qualified to answer.


----------



## ttystikk (Mar 24, 2017)

GroErr said:


> Quality is somewhat subjective but I have a pretty good nose and taste buds and my buds have never smelled or tasted better under COBs. I also had several comments from people I share with after I switched, many asking what the "new strains" were (same strains/phenos grown under different lighting). Quality and terps were great under the 315's but definitely a step up from that with 3590's ime.
> 
> Not a tech snob and will likely use my 315's again if the situation calls for them. But I'd definitely stop short of saying quality is better under 315's and I used them for 2+ years. I've yet to see anyone say "I should have stuck with hps or CMH" after switching over to COBs.
> 
> BTW: I define quality in the context of smell, visual and taste. Not how high the THC is, THC is one of 70+ cannabinoids and only one factor in how high you get.


This has been my experience as well.


----------



## Yodaweed (Mar 24, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> So the relatively low numbers bit is meant to contradict me? I said virtually none the point is...........


8% UV isn't low numbers....come on man you just now arguing for argument sake...


----------



## ttystikk (Mar 24, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> 8% UV isn't low numbers....come on man you just now arguing for argument sake...


That's rich coming from the likes of you!


----------



## Yodaweed (Mar 24, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> This has been my experience as well.





ttystikk said:


> That's rich coming from the likes of you!


you do not know what quality is, i have seen your plants that are burnt to a crisp under those LEDs. Please refrain from talking you are a total idiot . Didn't you get shut down growing in a legal state? I mean how fucking stupid can you be.


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 24, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> I I've only used DPaps and Philips lamps so I'm not qualified to answer.


Video I watched said designed for low ceiling applications which would mean a tent...But if the bulb is horizontal does that mean you lose coverage or still 3x3?


----------



## Madmungo (Mar 24, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> you do not know what quality is, i have seen your plants that are burnt to a crisp under those LEDs. Please refrain from talking you are a total idiot . Didn't you get shut down growing in a legal state? I mean how fucking stupid can you be.


Calm down lads, we've all had a drink, no scrapping eh....?


----------



## Madmungo (Mar 24, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> Video I watched said designed for low ceiling applications which would mean a tent...But if the bulb is horizontal does that mean you lose coverage or still 3x3?


1 will do the business in 3ft tent, I'd expect 12 plus oz from 4 well grown plants.


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 24, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> Mate, the outer jacket on a 315 open fixture lamp lamp blocks virtually all the uv from a cmh, unless you're running an single jacket in an open fixture (dangerous!)
> Then you're not getting uv, also you can't get a sun tan through a window either, same principal.


completely wrong. the mogul base 315 philips bulb puts out the most uv compared to the 2 pin models but they still put out uv. 

if it's an open rated bulb then it's designed to be run open. the outer envelope is designed to contain a bulb failure.


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 24, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> 1 will do the business in 3ft tent, I'd expect 12 plus oz from 4 well grown plants.


If I run 4 315s in a 4x8 is there any advantage/disadvantage to just going with 2 - 630s instead?


----------



## growingforfun (Mar 24, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> Mate, the outer jacket on a 315 open fixture lamp lamp blocks virtually all the uv from a cmh, unless you're running an single jacket in an open fixture (dangerous!)
> Then you're not getting uv, also you can't get a sun tan through a window either, same principal.


Dude havent you ever riden in a car all day and gotten sunburnt ? Sat in a chair by a big window all day reading? Maybe im a vampire or somthin but "it burnses us"


----------



## Growdict (Mar 24, 2017)

i think in a 4x8 you would be better off with 2x630, just looking at how the reflector throws down the light. In a 6x6 better with 4x315


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 24, 2017)

Growdict said:


> i think in a 4x8 you would be better off with 2x630, just looking at how the reflector throws down the light. In a 6x6 better with 4x315


word. and last question...air cooled?


----------



## Growdict (Mar 24, 2017)

that all depends on your ventilation. unless you are running co2 i wouldnt


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 24, 2017)

Growdict said:


> that all depends on your ventilation. unless you are running co2 i wouldnt


but 2 - 630s get hot? I'm in a basement so it's cool even in summer, but I'm worried about the heat still?


----------



## Yodaweed (Mar 24, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> but 2 - 630s get hot? I'm in a basement so it's cool even in summer, but I'm worried about the heat still?


2 630's make 1260 watts of energy, which is like 4300 BTU of heat.

http://www.rapidtables.com/convert/power/Watt_to_BTU.htm


----------



## Growdict (Mar 24, 2017)

but people run 2x1000w hps in 4x8 all the time. so, depends on your ventilation. you could always get the air cooled hoods and then you have the option.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 24, 2017)

GroErr said:


> Quality is somewhat subjective but I have a pretty good nose and taste buds and my buds have never smelled or tasted better under COBs. I also had several comments from people I share with after I switched, many asking what the "new strains" were (same strains/phenos grown under different lighting). Quality and terps were great under the 315's but definitely a step up from that with 3590's ime.
> 
> Not a tech snob and will likely use my 315's again if the situation calls for them. But I'd definitely stop short of saying quality is better under 315's and I used them for 2+ years. I've yet to see anyone say "I should have stuck with hps or CMH" after switching over to COBs.
> 
> BTW: I define quality in the context of smell, visual and taste. Not how high the THC is, THC is one of 70+ cannabinoids and only one factor in how high you get.


On the same videos I mentioned earlier that proved the 4% in THC with cmh the testers mention the smell and taste of the cob led grown pot is better and they noticed immediately. 

But just because we focus on the THC in tests doesn't mean all of the cannabanoids have not been increased. I notice better flavor and all around quality of high with cmh over hps alone. 

I will try cobs eventually. They are still 2x the cost of hid per square foot of Grow space. And I might need a heater in winter if I convert. And that is quite inefficient.


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 24, 2017)

Growdict said:


> but people run 2x1000w hps in 4x8 all the time. so, depends on your ventilation. you could always get the air cooled hoods and then you have the option.


Right but 2 - 1000w in a tent you most definitely need hood cooling or cool tubes


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 24, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> So go with 4? open hood? I read a glass running it closed and cooled is bad because the glass blocks the uvb from the light.
> 
> I actually had a few Amare LEDs laying around and a Johnson CX9. Was thinking of running 2 - 315s with an LED in the middle...


Sunlight supply makes specific air cooled reflectors for these lamps so the bulbs don't get cooled directly. Sorry. I have no experience. My fixture is the open vertical one.


----------



## Growdict (Mar 24, 2017)

mmg, what is your total watts, exhaust cfm and cu ft?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 24, 2017)

Growdict said:


> mmg, what is your total watts, exhaust cfm and cu ft?


You can page a member by typing @ and the user name. It makes an alert. I might have missed this. 

I have 2 600's in air cooled blockbusters over a 3.5' x 7' area and in an "L" shape 1 open 315 LEC over a 2.5' x 2.5' area. 

I exhaust the room through the ac reflectors with passive intakes in winter and active in summer to push the house air conditioning into the flower room. 

The room is 9'x7' and has a third open space. There is a second 6" exhaust also with a carbon filter ( both fans are 315cfm) to help with the 3rd open lamp as needed. I have 2 fans pushing and pulling air through the reflectors and carbon filter. 

So 3 6" fans total but only 2 exhausts. 

The room is about 400 cubic feet. 9x7 x 6.5 ceiling. 

And with the duct runs I likely turn the room air every 2 minutes on max.


----------



## Madmungo (Mar 24, 2017)

growingforfun said:


> Dude havent you ever riden in a car all day and gotten sunburnt ? Sat in a chair by a big window all day reading? Maybe im a vampire or somthin but "it burnses us"


Mate, you've never got sunburnt behind glass, you're not a tomato


----------



## growingforfun (Mar 24, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> Mate, you've never got sunburnt behind glass, you're not a tomato


Dude i do tho haha, so does my wife.. maybe we are tomato people.
Tomato lives matter bruh.


----------



## Madmungo (Mar 24, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> completely wrong. the mogul base 315 philips bulb puts out the most uv compared to the 2 pin models but they still put out uv.
> 
> if it's an open rated bulb then it's designed to be run open. the outer envelope is designed to contain a bulb failure.


I thought we were talking pgzx18 lamps?


----------



## GroErr (Mar 24, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> On the same videos I mentioned earlier that proved the 4% in THC with cmh the testers mention the smell and taste of the cob led grown pot is better and they noticed immediately.
> 
> But just because we focus on the THC in tests doesn't mean all of the cannabanoids have not been increased. I notice better flavor and all around quality of high with cmh over hps alone.
> 
> I will try cobs eventually. They are still 2x the cost of hid per square foot of Grow space. And I might need a heater in winter if I convert. And that is quite inefficient.


Yeah the COBs aren't necessarily the best option for every situation for sure. If you have to modify and spend money on other environmental controls you have to look at the hassle and costs of that as well. They fit better into my small flowering space (35 sq. ft w/7ft ceilings) reducing temps with no changes to environmental equipment/controls. If I were to move into a larger op, specially somewhere like a warehouse with high ceilings, I'd probably lean towards CMH over COBs (other than a 3x3 for my personal under COBs - lol). From a production stand point, all other factors being equal and dialed in properly, I think the techs are pretty close as far as production.

There's also no law stating you can't mix them  Both are top notch within their respective technologies and way ahead of hps/hid tech. No question or subjectivity there.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 24, 2017)

GroErr said:


> Yeah the COBs aren't necessarily the best option for every situation for sure. If you have to modify and spend money on other environmental controls you have to look at the hassle and costs of that as well. They fit better into my small flowering space (35 sq. ft w/7ft ceilings) reducing temps with no changes to environmental equipment/controls. If I were to move into a larger op, specially somewhere like a warehouse with high ceilings, I'd probably lean towards CMH over COBs (other than a 3x3 for my personal under COBs - lol). From a production stand point, all other factors being equal and dialed in properly, I think the techs are pretty close as far as production.
> 
> There's also no law stating you can't mix them  Both are top notch within their respective technologies and way ahead of hps/hid tech. No question or subjectivity there.


I really may buy cobs for my 4th light when I move my Grow to a new room in my basement I will build in time. Then I can compare all the lights. Hps, mh, cmh and led. 

The 4 way comparison Grow could be a forum favorite eh?


----------



## Yodaweed (Mar 24, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I really may buy cobs for my 4th light when I move my Grow to a new room in my basement I will build in time. Then I can compare all the lights. Hps, mh, cmh and led.
> 
> The 4 way comparison Grow could be a forum favorite eh?


I'm mixing my 315 CMH with two 600w hps and two area 51 panel LEDs (R/W 160 with cree XTE red and cree XTE white) , to cover the max area in my room, seems to work well.


----------



## Madmungo (Mar 24, 2017)

There's a lot of 'experts' on this thread, hands up who've got more than a half dozen Cmh grows under their belts?


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 24, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Sunlight supply makes specific air cooled reflectors for these lamps so the bulbs don't get cooled directly. Sorry. I have no experience. My fixture is the open vertical one.


I think going to buy 2 of the 630s with those air cooled hoods for my 4x8. Just run a carbon filter pulling through both to exhaust out the tent. Sound good? Should I go 6" filter?


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 24, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> I thought we were talking pgzx18 lamps?


i have a mogul E39 philips 315 lec. and all of the lecs' put out uvb


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 24, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> There's a lot of 'experts' on this thread, hands up who've got more than a half dozen Cmh grows under their belts?


about 6 years worth here. the older retro white 400 and now the 315s.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 24, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> I think going to buy 2 of the 630s with those air cooled hoods for my 4x8. Just run a carbon filter pulling through both to exhaust out the tent. Sound good? Should I go 6" filter?


I havent used air cooled cmh but I set up my old 4x4 with 600 w hps with passive bent duct light proof intakes and a 6" inline fan exhausting from the carbon filter at top of tent through air cooled reflector and out the top and out a stealth window board to outside. 

You may need 2 fans one to pull through the filter and 1 to help remove exhaust from the room. Or air conditioning. Cooling 1200 watts may need more help. If your intake air is low enough it all can work.


----------



## rkymtnman (Mar 24, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> I think going to buy 2 of the 630s with those air cooled hoods for my 4x8. Just run a carbon filter pulling through both to exhaust out the tent. Sound good? Should I go 6" filter?


i would almost think you could just exhaust the heat from the top of the tent and skip the air cooled hoods. but it would suck if i was wrong and you'd be stuck with the wrong reflector set up.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 24, 2017)

I needed my ac hoods in summer but in winter here I could just unhook the exhaust and exhaust the open tent and take off the glass and just run it open. That was with 2 600hps in a small bedroom.


----------



## GroErr (Mar 24, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> There's a lot of 'experts' on this thread, hands up who've got more than a half dozen Cmh grows under their belts?


2 1/2 years of perpetual runs before a recent switch to COBs. I was the first member here to run the 315's, or at least post grows with them.


----------



## Bad Karma (Mar 24, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> There's a lot of 'experts' on this thread, hands up who've got more than a half dozen Cmh grows under their belts?


I've been running multiple LEC tents for a year and a half now. They've helped to produce some of the best looking, best smelling, and best smoking buds I've ever grown.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Mar 24, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I've been running multiple LEC tents for a year and a half now. They've helped to produce some of the best looking, best smelling, and best smoking, buds I've ever grown.
> 
> View attachment 3912699


Gorgeous as usual my friend good to see you around


----------



## ttystikk (Mar 24, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> If I run 4 315s in a 4x8 is there any advantage/disadvantage to just going with 2 - 630s instead?


Yes. Better light distribution with four evenly spaced light sources as opposed to only two.


----------



## Yodaweed (Mar 24, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I've been running multiple LEC tents for a year and a half now. They've helped to produce some of the best looking, best smelling, and best smoking buds I've ever grown.
> 
> View attachment 3912699


beautiful colors in that one, what strain is that?


----------



## Bad Karma (Mar 24, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> beautiful colors in that one, what strain is that?


Sherbet.


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 24, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I've been running multiple LEC tents for a year and a half now. They've helped to produce some of the best looking, best smelling, and best smoking buds I've ever grown.
> 
> View attachment 3912699


Size? Cooled hoods?


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 24, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I havent used air cooled cmh but I set up my old 4x4 with 600 w hps with passive bent duct light proof intakes and a 6" inline fan exhausting from the carbon filter at top of tent through air cooled reflector and out the top and out a stealth window board to outside.
> 
> You may need 2 fans one to pull through the filter and 1 to help remove exhaust from the room. Or air conditioning. Cooling 1200 watts may need more help. If your intake air is low enough it all can work.


2 inline fans it just 1 and a booster? 2 6" inlines?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Mar 24, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> 2 inline fans it just 1 and a booster? 2 6" inlines?


What happened with your Amare's just curious.....


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 24, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> 2 inline fans it just 1 and a booster? 2 6" inlines?


I knew that sounded confusing. 

2 6" fans exhausting the room through the hoods and out 1 6" hole. And 1 other 6"exhaust out on the other side of the room now that I have the open 315 added in the room. 

The second exhaust port is newly added to handle the additional lamp or more if I need.


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 24, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> What happened with your Amare's just curious.....


Just finished a run with them. Best run yet. Just expanding lol


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Mar 24, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> Just finished a run with them. Best run yet. Just expanding lol


Do you have a thread with the results or can you share? 

Good to hear on all accounts


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 24, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Do you have a thread with the results or can you share?
> 
> Good to hear on all accounts


Nitro cookies chopped 10 days ago


Had a little security scare so down for the moment...


----------



## Madmungo (Mar 25, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I've been running multiple LEC tents for a year and a half now. They've helped to produce some of the best looking, best smelling, and best smoking buds I've ever grown.
> 
> View attachment 3912699


Looking really good, I'm sure we're all keen to know your yields. 
Well done.


----------



## Bad Karma (Mar 25, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> Size? Cooled hoods?


I've got three 315's, each one in it's own 3x3 tent. They're all open rated, so the only cooling needed is a 6" clip on fan aimed at the back of the reflector.



Madmungo said:


> Looking really good, I'm sure we're all keen to know your yields.
> Well done.


I grow for my own needs, and don't keep track of weight, but I can tell you that my yields have increased substantially since switching from LED to LEC.


----------



## PhuckDaPoeLease (Mar 25, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I've been running multiple LEC tents for a year and a half now. They've helped to produce some of the best looking, best smelling, and best smoking buds I've ever grown.
> 
> View attachment 3912699


I have been considering switching my hps/mh bulbs for LEDs (California light works) but you and @MichiganMedGrower have me reconsidering switching to LEC. BEAUTIFUL grow. Well done.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 25, 2017)

PhuckDaPoeLease said:


> I have been considering switching my hps/mh bulbs for LEDs (California light works) but you and @MichiganMedGrower have me reconsidering switching to LEC. BEAUTIFUL grow. Well done.


Damn! I wanted to see what you could do with the California lightworks rig.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 25, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I've got three 315's, each one in it's own 3x3 tent. They're all open rated, so the only cooling needed is a 6" clip on fan aimed at the back of the reflector.
> 
> 
> I grow for my own needs, and don't keep track of weight, but I can tell you that my yields have increased substantially since switching from LED to LEC.



How can you not have an exhaust out of an enclosed tent? It would just trap the heat and keep getting hotter. You can't only use a clip fan inside?


----------



## Bad Karma (Mar 25, 2017)

PhuckDaPoeLease said:


> I have been considering switching my hps/mh bulbs for LEDs (California light works) but you and @MichiganMedGrower have me reconsidering switching to LEC. BEAUTIFUL grow. Well done.





PhuckDaPoeLease said:


> I have been considering switching my hps/mh bulbs for LEDs (California light works) but you and @MichiganMedGrower have me reconsidering switching to LEC. BEAUTIFUL grow. Well done.


LED's are good, but LEC is superior, in my experience. Case in point, the same cut of Grape Ape under LED, and LEC.

Under LED (Area 51)

The Grape Ape under the LED looks good, has some traces of purple, and decent resin production.

Under LEC (Phantom)

Grape Ape under LEC is pure purple, has better resin production, and a much stronger aroma.



MichiganMedGrower said:


> How can you not have an exhaust out of an enclosed tent? It would just trap the heat and keep getting hotter. You can't only use a clip fan inside?


I've got 6" inline fans on each of the tents for exhaust, but the original question was if I was using cooled hoods, or not, you silly goose.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 25, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> LED's are good, but LEC is superior, in my experience. Case in point, the same cut of Grape Ape under LED, and LEC.
> 
> Under LED
> View attachment 3912913
> ...


Hey I was high and was alerted right to that post. It was an honest question. Lol


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 25, 2017)

Oh and @Bad Karma thanks for posting the comparison pics. Please remind us what led was used? 

And I think the Hortilux Blue is also helping bring out colors. Now that I have a more equal spectrum bouncing all around you can almost see which ones turn purple. 

 

You may be right to call me "silly"


----------



## Bad Karma (Mar 25, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Oh and @Bad Karma thanks for posting the comparison pics. Please remind us what led was used?
> 
> And I think the Hortilux Blue is also helping bring out colors. Now that I have a more equal spectrum bouncing all around you can almost see which ones turn purple.
> 
> ...


The Grape Ape was under an Area 51 LED light. So even under a high quality LED, the LEC easily out classed it.

Nice shot of your garden, MMG. Speaking of silly, that pic makes me want to start singing...


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 25, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> The Grape Ape was under an Area 51 LED light. So even under a high quality LED, the LEC easily out classed it.
> 
> Nice shot of your garden, MMG. Speaking of silly, that pic makes me want to start singing...


Loudly loling!


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## ThaMagnificent (Mar 25, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> The Grape Ape was under an Area 51 LED light. So even under a high quality LED, the LEC easily out classed it.
> 
> Nice shot of your garden, MMG. Speaking of silly, that pic makes me want to start singing...


But if I run 4 inline in a 4x8 that would be too much heat right? Should I just go 2 630s with cooled hood?


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## Evil-Mobo (Mar 25, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> But if I run 4 inline in a 4x8 that would be too much heat right? Should I just go 2 630s with cooled hood?


Two 315's and a 630 will be the same thing except you will have less light sources so less flexibility to adjust the lights and not as even coverage. I just can't see how two 630's would be a better fit or less heat ...........Get the 315's.....


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## ThaMagnificent (Mar 25, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Two 315's and a 630 will be the same thing except you will have less light sources so less flexibility to adjust the lights and not as even coverage. I just can't see how two 630's would be a better fit or less heat ...........Get the 315's.....


Agreed any the coverage. I'm worried about the heat though... Only the 630s come hood cooled. 4 315s in a tent.... How to control the heat?


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## rkymtnman (Mar 25, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> How to control the heat?


is a fresh air intake possible? run it at nite if need be and draw in cool outdoor air on a thermostat shut off.


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## ThaMagnificent (Mar 25, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> is a fresh air intake possible? run it at nite if need be and draw in cool outdoor air on a thermostat shut off.


I run at night. But that would be like running 2 600hps open hooded in a tent. Does anyone do that? Lol


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## Bad Karma (Mar 25, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> But if I run 4 inline in a 4x8 that would be too much heat right? Should I just go 2 630s with cooled hood?


I haven't used a 630, but it's my understanding that they put off more heat than two 315's would together. 315's run surprisingly cool, so four of them in an 8x4 should be fine, as long as your ventilation is good, and you've got some fans blowing on them.
I myself plan on switching back to an 8x4 tent and putting at least three 315's in there.


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## rkymtnman (Mar 25, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> I run at night. But that would be like running 2 600hps open hooded in a tent. Does anyone do that? Lol


i ran a 600 open in a 3x4 using outside air. it can be -10F to 50F depending on time of year around here. that would cool just about anything.


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## ThaMagnificent (Mar 25, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I haven't used a 630, but it's my understanding that they put off more heat than two 315's would together. 315's run surprisingly cool, so four of them in an 8x4 should be fine, as long as your ventilation is good, and you've got some fans blowing on them.
> I myself plan on switching back to an 8x4 tent and putting at least three 315's in there.


Did you see sun system now makes a diamond series? Supposedly for low ceiling use. Basically, just looks like they horizontally mounted the bulb. Would this be better for a tent?


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## Bad Karma (Mar 25, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> Did you see sun system now makes a diamond series? Supposedly for low ceiling use. Basically, just looks like they horizontally mounted the bulb. Would this be better for a tent?


I would recommend using the remote reflector/ballast models if your looking to keep the heat down. Also, for optimum effect, LEC bulbs should be mounted vertically. Which is another reason I prefer multiple 315's to one 630.


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## Psyphish (Mar 25, 2017)

Madmungo said:


> There's a lot of 'experts' on this thread, hands up who've got more than a half dozen Cmh grows under their belts?


5 years with 315w CDM and a couple of years with 400w Retro Whites.


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## Evil-Mobo (Mar 25, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> Agreed any the coverage. I'm worried about the heat though... Only the 630s come hood cooled. 4 315s in a tent.... How to control the heat?


There's an air cooled hood you can buy I think it's a hydro farm brand I will look it up for you in a bit. Growers house sells it and they also sell the prism ballast and Phillips bulbs as a kit. If I was buying a 315 today this is what I would look into. You would then have a remote ballast and AC hood I can't imagine how much better the 315 would run temp wise if this was one was looking for.

Reflector:
http://growershouse.com/phantom-315w-ceramic-metal-halide-cmh-reflector

AC kit:
http://growershouse.com/phantom-lens-system-phr3150-reflector-lens-w-flange-cooling-kit

Ballast:
http://growershouse.com/prism-lighting-science-315w-ceramic-mh-ballast-120-240v

The only other thing I'd consider would be the SS 315's which work great and I owned once. The prism ballast was being sold by them with the bulb not long ago as a kit for a great price, I'm sure they will have some kind of 420 sale coming..........

Just my $0.02 
YMMV


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## Yodaweed (Mar 25, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> LED's are good, but LEC is superior, in my experience. Case in point, the same cut of Grape Ape under LED, and LEC.
> 
> Under LED (Area 51)
> View attachment 3912913
> ...


What a huge difference that spectrum and UV makes, so much more resin. I use those area 51 lights, are those the RW150 or the SGS160?


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## ThaMagnificent (Mar 25, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> There's an air cooled hood you can buy I think it's a hydro farm brand I will look it up for you in a bit. Growers house sells it and they also sell the prism ballast and Phillips bulbs as a kit. If I was buying a 315 today this is what I would look into. You would then have a remote ballast and AC hood I can't imagine how much better the 315 would run temp wise if this was one was looking for.
> 
> Reflector:
> http://growershouse.com/phantom-315w-ceramic-metal-halide-cmh-reflector
> ...


Interesting.... External ballast...This might bring some heat down alone?

You've given me that much more to consider now lol.... SS or these..Hmmm...


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## DemonTrich (Mar 25, 2017)

Week 6 girls

No special hoods used here. Big kahuna hoods to be specific.


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## ThaMagnificent (Mar 25, 2017)

What distance do you keep?


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## Bad Karma (Mar 25, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> What a huge difference that spectrum and UV makes, so much more resin. I use those area 51 lights, are those the RW150 or the SGS160?


Its one of Area 51 older models, long before the RW150, or SGS160. I can't remember the model number anymore, sorry.


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## SensiPuff (Mar 25, 2017)

Just ordered a reflector + remote ballast & phillips light. Can't wait to see how this bad boy does.


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## 714steadyeddie (Mar 25, 2017)

SensiPuff said:


> Just ordered a reflector + remote ballast & phillips light. Can't wait to see how this bad boy does.


Which reflector did you go with?

Thinking of getting that cmh conversion kit


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## pinner420 (Mar 26, 2017)

Fuck it heres a 315 center stage helping a couple 600s make these girls ready to flip.


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## ttystikk (Mar 26, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> Fuck it heres a 315 center stage helping a couple 600s make these girls ready to flip. View attachment 3913460


That's an awful lot of watts for those little girls, bro...


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## pinner420 (Mar 26, 2017)

A little behind on veging. Had to fill spots.. see what they can do for me by next Saturday.


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## Psyphish (Mar 26, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> Fuck it heres a 315 center stage helping a couple 600s make these girls ready to flip. View attachment 3913460


They'd grow just as fast with just the 315w bulb, hell even a couple of E27 household LED bulbs would work at that stage. Serious waste of electricity.


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## Craigson (Mar 26, 2017)

How far away should I put my 315 in a 5x5 tent?
7 plants 2 weeks old still pretty small


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## SensiPuff (Mar 26, 2017)

714steadyeddie said:


> Which reflector did you go with?
> 
> Thinking of getting that cmh conversion kit


Growers house - sun system reflector. 
http://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-brand-315-neutron-cmh-reflector
It's small and it's cheap. I didn't want to run an enormous vertical reflector in my tent. Just in case you are wondering the prism remote ballast + phillips bulb came in a package. Altogether for the whole system my cart total was 270 + 20 for shipping. What a steal if I say so myself.


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## SensiPuff (Mar 26, 2017)

If you already got a hood though I think you could buy the conversion kit (~160) and run cmh. It's just the mogul base socket kit and different ballast if im not mistaken


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## SensiPuff (Mar 26, 2017)

Craigson said:


> How far away should I put my 315 in a 5x5 tent?
> 7 plants 2 weeks old still pretty small


From what I've read go about 20 inches and see how they respond


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## pinner420 (Mar 26, 2017)

Psyphish said:


> They'd grow just as fast with just the 315w bulb, hell even a couple of E27 household LED bulbs would work at that stage. Serious waste of electricity.


Ya with pretty outdated stuff. Its hard to let go of a light that serves so well... on the wish list....


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## 714steadyeddie (Mar 26, 2017)

Craigson said:


> How far away should I put my 315 in a 5x5 tent?
> 7 plants 2 weeks old still pretty small


You're gonna need more lighting. I think max flower a single 315 can cover is 3x3. If using for flower


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## 714steadyeddie (Mar 26, 2017)

SensiPuff said:


> Growers house - sun system reflector.
> http://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-brand-315-neutron-cmh-reflector
> It's small and it's cheap. I didn't want to run an enormous vertical reflector in my tent. Just in case you are wondering the prism remote ballast + phillips bulb came in a package. Altogether for the whole system my cart total was 270 + 20 for shipping. What a steal if I say so myself.


Nice, I have an over sized air cooled hood. Probably too big for a 315 Phillips


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## Evil-Mobo (Mar 26, 2017)

714steadyeddie said:


> You're gonna need more lighting. I think max flower a single 315 can cover is 3x3. If using for flower


Yes this is correct to flower in a 5x5 I would definitely run two


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## Craigson (Mar 27, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Yes this is correct to flower in a 5x5 I would definitely run two


Ya i have a 1200 watt LED too, just gotta add another exhaust first as the tent was getting up to 29/30 degrees Celsius.


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## Pmbreno (Mar 27, 2017)

Just picked up a growers choice model with the 3k. Bulb for 299 on amazon.


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## pinner420 (Mar 27, 2017)




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## jacrispy (Mar 28, 2017)

incredible bulk under two 315s3rd day of flower (after flip)


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## MoonTang420 (Mar 29, 2017)

Hey everyone I just picked up a 315 to compare to a 600 reg mh but I just needed a spot to fill untill I built my new tent does this seem like sufficent lighting for veg ? I need to transplant asap I'm super late


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## Evil-Mobo (Mar 29, 2017)

MoonTang420 said:


> Hey everyone I just picked up a 315 to compare to a 600 reg mh but I just needed a spot to fill untill I built my new tent does this seem like sufficent lighting for veg ? I need to transplant asap I'm super late


What size space?


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## MoonTang420 (Mar 30, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> What size space?


Well the closet in like 6 by almost 3 but no more than a 4x4 footprint for this tiny light I think I'm going to prob switch to a 600mh and put this 315 w three other 600hps in my tent n compare its corner to the 600s


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## MoonTang420 (Mar 30, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> What size space?


Just trying to veg w it to try her out for now but it's 3000k I'd rather flower w that but I was told it's efficient both ways they didn't have any 4200k


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## DemonTrich (Mar 30, 2017)

I'd use a 4k bulb for veg and flower. Not a 3k bulb for veg and flower.


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## MoonTang420 (Mar 30, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> I'd use a 4k bulb for veg and flower. Not a 3k bulb for veg and flower.


I wanted that but they didn't have the 4K bulbs so what can I do ? I'm sure it's not the most efficient but I think it will work


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## MoonTang420 (Mar 30, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> I'd use a 4k bulb for veg and flower. Not a 3k bulb for veg and flower.


The thing is my cmh bulb goes right into a standard mogel and spins right in as opposed to the special other ones


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## SensiPuff (Mar 30, 2017)

So you have the conversion kit? And square wave ballast?


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## thccbdhealth (Mar 30, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> I'd use a 4k bulb for veg and flower. Not a 3k bulb for veg and flower.


Do you find there is to much internodal stretch using the 3k to vegg?

http://rollitup.org/t/315cmh-current-users-poll.935028/


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## Craigson (Mar 30, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Do you find there is to much internodal stretch using the 3k to vegg?
> 
> http://rollitup.org/t/315cmh-current-users-poll.935028/


I dont have a ton of experience but I just put up my 315 w 3k bulb and plants stretched quite a bit in first few days. I just switched to 4200k yesterday


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## MoonTang420 (Mar 30, 2017)

SensiPuff said:


> So you have the conversion kit? And square wave ballast?


Yes hypar from htg


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## Yodaweed (Mar 30, 2017)

I'm using the 4k bulb for veg/flower and it is making my plants stack tighter than they ever stacked before i have run this same cut under standard MH and 600w hps lights previously.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 30, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> I'm using the 4k bulb for veg/flower and it is making my plants stack tighter than they ever stacked before i have run this same cut under standard MH and 600w hps lights previously.


I can say this about the 3100k bulb. And it has the highest par and is designed for flowering.


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## Yodaweed (Mar 30, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I can say this about the 3100k bulb. And it has the highest par and is designed for flowering.


I'm planning on using the 3k bulb after this run to see differences, i was kinda dumb and bought the 4k bulb thinking it was the better option for me since i am using it between two 600w HPS lights. Also plan to buy a vertical reflector instead of using my blockbuster to see differences. I will post pictures when my run is done of some bud shots under these CMH lights.


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## igothydrotoneverywhere (Mar 30, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> I'd use a 4k bulb for veg and flower. Not a 3k bulb for veg and flower.


Why would you use the opposite of what the manufacturer suggests?


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 30, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> I'm planning on using the 3k bulb after this run to see differences, i was kinda dumb and bought the 4k bulb thinking it was the better option for me since i am using it between two 600w HPS lights. Also plan to buy a vertical reflector instead of using my blockbuster to see differences. I will post pictures when my run is done of some bud shots under these CMH lights.


Nice. When I build my new room in the basement next I will be adding a 4200k bulb to see myself too. 

i went around and around on which bulb like everyone. Lol. 

Some great growers are using the 4200k and raving about it but I think it's because the difference is likely subtle. And the little 315 is pretty impressive. 

I have added the Hortilux blue mh to the room as well but may be switching that one back to hps. I have lost density and yield since taking out the Super hps. 

I will miss the more natural light to look at the plants. 

I am a believer fuller spectrum helps with quality but we need the strongest red peaks for proper budding. 

The answer always lies in the middle of the 2 sides of an argument often in my experience.


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## Yodaweed (Mar 30, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Nice. When I build my new room in the basement next I will be adding a 4200k bulb to see myself too.
> 
> i went around and around on which bulb like everyone. Lol.
> 
> ...


Yea spectrum is important in my opinion , i really like the 4200k bulb its really nice for seeing stuff under it and the plants seem to be growing beastly under it. 600w hps produces nearly 3x more lumens than those hortilux blue mh bulbs, i don't use hortilux mh bulbs anymore, they don't produce enough lumens for me to spend that kind of money on them, i got these el cheapo bulbs that produce like 2x more lumens (both MH) with a slightly less desirable spectrum. The 600w MH bulb i use produces 60k lumens vs 39k for the hortilux. A 600w HPS bulb produces 90k lumens so it's almost 3x more than that hortilux mh bulb, that could be why the weight + density wasn't good under that bulb. I like those hortilux mh bulbs for veg only.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 30, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> Yea spectrum is important in my opinion , i really like the 4200k bulb its really nice for seeing stuff under it and the plants seem to be growing beastly under it. 600w hps produces nearly 3x more lumens than those hortilux blue mh bulbs, i don't use hortilux mh bulbs anymore, they don't produce enough lumens for me to spend that kind of money on them, i got these el cheapo bulbs that produce like 2x more lumens (both MH) with a slightly less desirable spectrum. The 600w MH bulb i use produces 60k lumens vs 39k for the hortilux. A 600w HPS bulb produces 90k lumens so it's almost 3x more than that hortilux mh bulb, that could be why the weight + density wasn't good under that bulb. I like those hortilux mh bulbs for veg only.


Yes I know the numbers but I wanted to see how much spectrum counts for myself. 

And in every test for yield and density lumens always win. It's because plants transfer photosynthesis to the strongest wavelength regardless. 

The full spectrum crowd doesn't want to believe this. But the university of Michigan has proven it time and time again. 

But I still had to see. And the blue does seem to frost up the stuff a little more like the cmh. 

Also I am using the 600w blue. The 400 has a better spectrum. The 600 is speced like an hps conversion bulb and does not have the same smooth curve. Or the same amount of uv if my tinting eye glasses are right. Way darker under the 400 blue.


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## Yodaweed (Mar 30, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Yes I know the numbers but I wanted to see how much spectrum counts for myself.
> 
> And in every test for yield and density lumens always win. It's because plants transfer photosynthesis to the strongest wavelength regardless.
> 
> ...


I would agree, more quantity is always best , if i had higher ceilings i'd be using DE lights but my area only is 7 foot tall.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 30, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> I would agree, more quantity is always best , if i had higher ceilings i'd be using DE lights but my area only is 7 foot tall.


Me too. I'm at 6.5 feet in my old converted cabin.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 30, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> I would agree, more quantity is always best , if i had higher ceilings i'd be using DE lights but my area only is 7 foot tall.


I am waiting for more on the de cmh. And I consider 600 de hps too.


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## Yodaweed (Mar 30, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I am waiting for more on the de cmh. And I consider 600 de hps too.


I been looking at the 600/750 flex gavita, just need to see some results in an area similar to mine first. Also DE CMH sounds crazy , when is that comes out?


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 30, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> I been looking at the 600/750 flex gavita, just need to see some results in an area similar to mine first. Also DE CMH sounds crazy , when is that comes out?


Growers house has one. I think self branded. 

I will have to look into gavita. I don't know the flex.


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## Yodaweed (Mar 30, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Growers house has one. I think self branded.
> 
> I will have to look into gavita. I don't know the flex.


http://growershouse.com/gavita-pro-600-750e-flex-de-120-240v-fixture

That's the flex, i think it uses a 1kw DE bulb but i am not sure. You got a link for that DE CMH ?


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## Yodaweed (Mar 30, 2017)

Ok so i was wrong , it uses some special bulb only for that light

http://growershouse.com/gavita-pro-6-750-watt-400-volt-el-de-double-ended-lamp


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 30, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> http://growershouse.com/gavita-pro-600-750e-flex-de-120-240v-fixture
> 
> That's the flex, i think it uses a 1kw DE bulb but i am not sure. You got a link for that DE CMH ?




http://growershouse.com/growers-choice-630w-de-double-ended-cmh-ceramic-mh-lamp-3k-r-red-enhanced

https://www.growersc.com/double-ended-cmh-bulbs


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 30, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> Ok so i was wrong , it uses some special bulb only for that light
> 
> http://growershouse.com/gavita-pro-6-750-watt-400-volt-el-de-double-ended-lamp


I think these will be too hot for my purpose. And I wonder if they need to be too high with the greenhouse style reflector designed for overlap.


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## Yodaweed (Mar 30, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> http://growershouse.com/growers-choice-630w-de-double-ended-cmh-ceramic-mh-lamp-3k-r-red-enhanced
> 
> https://www.growersc.com/double-ended-cmh-bulbs


apparently you can put that in that 600/750 flex fixture...that's dope as fuck.


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## genuity (Mar 30, 2017)

The DE 630 is a good bulb,in a AC/DE hood.,been using them since they hit my shop...
18-24" is good to me..4x4..


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## gr865 (Mar 30, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower,

Just catching up on the forum and a few pages back you had some pics of buds. It looked like you are using LED's. Wondering if your using them in conjunction with the 315W.
My plans for this grow got all fucked so ended up doing two different strains and I am using both the SS400 LED and a 315 on angle. Seems to be working ok.
1/17/17

3/20/17
 

I flip the plants every week, so each receives the same amount of each light.
Running DTW in coco.

GR


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 30, 2017)

gr865 said:


> MichiganMedGrower,
> 
> Just catching up on the forum and a few pages back you had some pics of buds. It looked like you are using LED's. Wondering if your using them in conjunction with the 315W.
> My plans for this grow got all fucked so ended up doing two different strains and I am using both the SS400 LED and a 315 on angle. Seems to be working ok.
> ...


Probably quite a few pages back now but I use 2 air cooled 600's. One hps. One mh. And I added the 315 recently. I had been documenting the upgrades and plants under them for a few months now. 

The plants have all grown more compact and more resinous for sure. I grow and harvest a plant a week or so. I run a perpetual so it's easy to see the changes after a few plants run through. 

I would suggest you follow Phillips and sun systems recommendation of hanging he lamp vertical as intended so the reflector works properly for heat and light reflection. Since ou move the plants they will still receive plenty of spectrums. That's how I do it anyway. That reflector was specifically designed for that bulb.

Your grow looks great by the way!


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## Evil-Mobo (Mar 31, 2017)

genuity said:


> The DE 630 is a good bulb,in a AC/DE hood.,been using them since they hit my shop...
> 18-24" is good to me..4x4..


What would you recommend for a 3x3?

I was running a blue mh 600 hortilux but my gold e ballast blew out it's the second one too. Need to get it replaced but the ballast blowing is killing me the 1K platinum ballast have never blown and run cooler but too much heat inside the 3x3 that's why I am not running them. Doing an led comparison run right now but still want to replace that 600 with a cmh style light. Is a single 315 really enough for the 3x3? Or would an air cooled 630 work?

I ran a SS 315 once and loved it only got rid of it when I switched the old space to 240v because I had a 120v unit. I just have a hard time believing the one 315 would be enough to run four plants for flower in a 3x3 no doubt for veg but talking about flower out for max yields.........

Thanks for the help


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 31, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> What would you recommend for a 3x3?
> 
> I was running a blue mh 600 hortilux but my gold e ballast blew out it's the second one too. Need to get it replaced but the ballast blowing is killing me the 1K platinum ballast have never blown and run cooler but too much heat inside the 3x3 that's why I am not running them. Doing an led comparison run right now but still want to replace that 600 with a cmh style light. Is a single 315 really enough for the 3x3? Or would an air cooled 630 work?
> 
> ...


Under the SS remote reflector I can only flower 2 plants in 3 gallon pots. I will say it is almost as powerful as 600 hps at 2.5' x 2.5'. After that stretching plants lean in for more light. And it's weird the Hortilux ballast is problematic. They have a video showing an old galaxy failing with way more bulbs. 

My galaxy runs the 400 and 600 blue fine. And it's run the Super hps for 3 years the whole time at 12/12 pretty much. No problem with that big bulbous 600 blue the first few months either.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 31, 2017)

See 4 plants under each 600 but only 2 for the same results under the 315. 

I tried 3 but when they get to my standard 2'x2' trained size they crowd each other too much. I lost yield and density when I tried it. I am back to 10 plants. 

If I trained them slightly smaller it would work but of course it would still be 3 in my system. 

YMMV


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## Growdict (Mar 31, 2017)

I went the other way. 19 per light


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## genuity (Mar 31, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> What would you recommend for a 3x3?
> 
> I was running a blue mh 600 hortilux but my gold e ballast blew out it's the second one too. Need to get it replaced but the ballast blowing is killing me the 1K platinum ballast have never blown and run cooler but too much heat inside the 3x3 that's why I am not running them. Doing an led comparison run right now but still want to replace that 600 with a cmh style light. Is a single 315 really enough for the 3x3? Or would an air cooled 630 work?
> 
> ...


It's all about the way you grow...imo

This was a 2x2 tray,with a 3x3 canopy..9 1gal pots,screen....rich soil base.feed was tea/Neptune's harvest..9 weeks flower.
 
This is when I first got the 315..when they first hit my shop...they was so new.
The first couple weeks of 12/12 the light was only running at 250 watts...the ballast was not all the way up..had to take it in,to let the turn it up ton the full power.

That's what's not talked about a lot...you can turn these lights power down,I do not know the difference on the bulb it will have,but I was getting just fine growth.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 31, 2017)

genuity said:


> It's all about the way you grow...imo
> 
> This was a 2x2 tray,with a 3x3 canopy..9 1gal pots,screen....rich soil base.feed was tea/Neptune's harvest..9 weeks flower.
> View attachment 3916691
> ...



My galaxy ballast has a dimmer. I have read that with the square wave the spectrum doesn't degrade with less wattage.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 31, 2017)

Regardless of Grow style or plants per light the standard measurement everyone is saying is 3x3. 

I think that footprint would work with a sog or trained for only tops and lolipopped but with even mid size 4-5 oz dry bushes I can not get the lamp to grow more than two to their potential and I can still get twice that under a 600 hps. 

But I prefer them together so far.


----------



## Growdict (Mar 31, 2017)

I agree a single 315w will rock a 3x3 tent


----------



## genuity (Mar 31, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Regardless of Grow style or plants per light the standard measurement everyone is saying is 3x3.
> 
> I think that footprint would work with a sog or trained for only tops and lolipopped but with even mid size 4-5 oz dry bushes I can not get the lamp to grow more than two to their potential and I can still get twice that under a 600 hps.
> 
> But I prefer them together so far.


I veg 4 big plants with the 315,but I will only flower one under the lights...
My best runs was smaller plants,just more of them.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 31, 2017)

genuity said:


> I veg 4 big plants with the 315,but I will only flower one under the lights...
> My best runs was smaller plants,just more of them.


That is exactly how I want to flower them when I do my next room. 1 per 315. Nice big bush.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 31, 2017)

I figure 3/4 yield with great quality for almost half the wattage.


----------



## genuity (Mar 31, 2017)

My veg..
 
That


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Mar 31, 2017)

Just ordered 5 prism / phantom hood combos


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 31, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> Just ordered 5 prism / phantom hood combos


Jealous


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Mar 31, 2017)

genuity said:


> It's all about the way you grow...imo
> 
> This was a 2x2 tray,with a 3x3 canopy..9 1gal pots,screen....rich soil base.feed was tea/Neptune's harvest..9 weeks flower.
> View attachment 3916691
> ...



Thanks for your input. I am going to see what happens after the current run. I'd like to try one of the 630 CMH lights, but also waiting to see if Horti finally drops the 600W Ceramic HPS............that looks interesting........

Of the 630's which setup do you recommend? The growers choice is the only true DE 630 CMH right? The rest of the lights is just (2) 315 bulbs correct?

Also what's your take on this light and how much height from canopy would be required?
http://growershouse.com/gavita-pro-600-750e-flex-de-120-240v-fixture


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Mar 31, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Under the SS remote reflector I can only flower 2 plants in 3 gallon pots. I will say it is almost as powerful as 600 hps at 2.5' x 2.5'. After that stretching plants lean in for more light. And it's weird the Hortilux ballast is problematic. They have a video showing an old galaxy failing with way more bulbs.
> 
> My galaxy runs the 400 and 600 blue fine. And it's run the Super hps for 3 years the whole time at 12/12 pretty much. No problem with that big bulbous 600 blue the first few months either.


It's the second 600w Gold e-Ballast I have had fail on me within months of ownership. My 1K Platinum ballast run cooler and give me ZERO issues but too much light for a 3x3 heat is definitely an issue even with the exhaust fan @ 100% LOL. Speaking of which I need to reach out to them for a replacement again.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 1, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Thanks for your input. I am going to see what happens after the current run. I'd like to try one of the 630 CMH lights, but also waiting to see if Horti finally drops the 600W Ceramic HPS............that looks interesting........
> 
> Of the 630's which setup do you recommend? The growers choice is the only true DE 630 CMH right? The rest of the lights is just (2) 315 bulbs correct?
> 
> ...



I am going by memory but I saw an ad in a dispensary magazine for a de cmh from Max Par. 

And I don't remember the answer for sure but the recommended height is in the FAQ on the gavita website. It was like three feet. I stopped investigating the light because of my height issue.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 1, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I am going by memory but I saw an ad in a dispensary magazine for a de cmh from Max Par.
> 
> And I don't remember the answer for sure but the recommended height is in the FAQ on the gavita website. It was like three feet. I stopped investigating the light because of my height issue.


Yeah the height is my concern as well plus I'm in a tent not even an open space. Was just curious because the local guy has a couple left and they're on sale..........

Oh well back to the 630 cmh vs ceramic hps  

I want to keep running four plants per 3x3 if not I'd be all over a 315 again but as has been stated (and I agree based on prior use) for flower I think they're better one big plant per light.........


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 1, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Yeah the height is my concern as well plus I'm in a tent not even an open space. Was just curious because the local guy has a couple left and they're on sale..........
> 
> Oh well back to the 630 cmh vs ceramic hps
> 
> I want to keep running four plants per 3x3 if not I'd be all over a 315 again but as has been stated (and I agree based on prior use) for flower I think they're better one big plant per light.........


I am kind of considering going the other way. Get another 315 for veg and grow and train bigger plants transplanted up to maybe 7 or 10 gallon buckets (3 months?) and flower 1 plant per light. 

Think I still get 16-20 oz per light? It would be 600w Hortilux blue. A 600w Super hps and an SS 315 LEC. 

I have never vegged longer than 8 weeks under flourescents in my 3x3. So I have to open the room and have some space for training maybe 4 plants in different stages. But I can do that upgrade pretty easily. 

I may have just lost my girlfriend and her plant count. 

Here we go again......


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 1, 2017)

I think with the right strain and a long enough veg you could get the yields you want. I believe @Bad Karma does one big plant per light in a 3x3......

Would you do a scrog or not? 

Sorry to hear about the GF............


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 1, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I think with the right strain and a long enough veg you could get the yields you want. I believe @Bad Karma does one big plant per light in a 3x3......
> 
> Would you do a scrog or not?
> 
> Sorry to hear about the GF............


Thanks. It will work out for the best. 

And I am not too big on wanting nets or screens. I like bushes. They make me happy. 

I looked at the room and I think the next step of needed will be more like 4-5 under the dual air cooled 600's and 1 finishing and 1 stretching under the 315 and overlap areas.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 1, 2017)

@Evil-Mobo

Oh. That leaves 4-6 plants in veg as well but under hid instead of flourescents.

And as far as strains. I only grow for quality.

My min yield has broken 3 oz from any plant now.

I am averaging almost 4.5 oz per. 20 oz per light with a good yielder but I always have different plants ripening each week for variety. So I figure a pound if I keep searching through OG type strains.

Posted yields are the way I pictured earlier in the thread. In 3 gal pots 4 under each 600 and 2 under the 315. The extra 2 are to fill in the gaps from 10 week flowering. We love Michigan rules oh yeah. But I have been inspectable for 3 years now. 

Of course they would fuck me somehow anyway Is still always possible.


----------



## Bad Karma (Apr 1, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> I think with the right strain and a long enough veg you could get the yields you want. I believe @Bad Karma does one big plant per light in a 3x3......
> 
> Would you do a scrog or not?
> 
> Sorry to hear about the GF............


I was doing with that in one of my 3x3's for a while but ultimately decided a to go back to a multi pot setup. Multiple containers dry out much quicker than one large container which helps keep humidity, and mold, in check.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 1, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I was doing with that in one of my 3x3's for a while but ultimately decided a to go back to a multi pot setup. Multiple containers dry out much quicker than one large container which helps keep humidity, and mold, in check.


That's why I will only transplant in steps. They have to have a good enough root ball before transplant.

My garden stays pretty much at 3 days in ocean forest. In veg when sooner I transplant up.

That's why I think it will take months longer to get the same yield. I kinda have started already. I could train more and up pot some late veg to 5's and plant one less for a minute.

It's the only other benefit than staying out of jail to the plant count and on hand meds rules. I always am starting a new plant and harvesting one near the same time so I just have to adjust and in time it will be less bigger plants.

But I can't really see 1 lb bushes in my little room.

Not even in my basement room I plan.

So we try to move up to 1/2 lb. schrubbs maybe. 4' x 30" shrubbs.

Is shrub the actual word? Mixing strains in a salad is always fulfilling. (Fullfilling?) wow.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 1, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Thanks. It will work out for the best.
> 
> And I am not too big on wanting nets or screens. I like bushes. They make me happy.
> 
> I looked at the room and I think the next step of needed will be more like 4-5 under the dual air cooled 600's and 1 finishing and 1 stretching under the 315 and overlap areas.


I like to grow bushes as well. Usually top once or twice and do lst. Then put up bamboo if needed. 

I am however interested in a trying a scrog later down the road with a particular Sativa strain I have seeds of due to height restrictions in the tent. 

You're on the right track brother just keep at it. My mission is to get an elbow consistently out of my 3x3 's now that I'm in the smaller spaces. Just max out the yield but not sacrifice the quality. I don't have as big a space as I did before.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Apr 1, 2017)

Recieved the Nanolux 315cmh, waiting on the secound box of this shipment that contains the philps 3100k bulb.

I opted for the 315 as the bulbs are vertical rather then horizontal

Im illuminating a 4x4 tent x 6'6" tall


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Apr 1, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Recieved the Nanolux 315cmh, waiting on the secound box of this shipment that contains the philps 3100k bulb.
> 
> I opted for the 315 as the bulbs are vertivle rather then horizontal
> 
> Im illuminating a 4x4 tent x 6'6" tall


Nanolux are supposed to be run with maxpar bulbs


----------



## thccbdhealth (Apr 1, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Nanolux are supposed to be run with maxpar bulbs


Ok, can you elaborate-

from my understanding the Philips ballast isn't available in 120V
the Philips bulb performs better then the Maxpar bulb according to the growershouse.com comparison on youtube.


----------



## genuity (Apr 1, 2017)

Summertime is around the corner, Time to drop a few watts


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 1, 2017)

genuity said:


> Summertime is around the corner, Time to drop a few watts
> View attachment 3917565


What ballast and hood do you run with these ?


----------



## genuity (Apr 1, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> What ballast and hood do you run with these ?


Galaxy ballast with sun System AC/DE hoods..set to 600


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 1, 2017)

genuity said:


> Galaxy ballast with sun System AC/DE hoods..set to 600


Perfect thanks you this would run too hot for a 3x3? I am testing some LEDs now but usually run my 600w hps/blue mh in there.........


----------



## genuity (Apr 1, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Perfect thanks you this would run too hot for a 3x3? I am testing some LEDs now but usually run my 600w hps/blue mh in there.........


Way hot for a 3x3..


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 1, 2017)

genuity said:


> Way hot for a 3x3..


Ah damn ok .......Well will see when I have the proper space to run one. 

Guess I will give the 600 ceramic hps a try if I can get a hold of one


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 1, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Ah damn ok .......Well will see when I have the proper space to run one.
> 
> Guess I will give the 600 ceramic hps a try if I can get a hold of one


That's not going to run any cooler!

Lots of people are very happy running a good 315W lamp in a 3x3 space. A good one means using a LFSW ballast.


----------



## jacrispy (Apr 1, 2017)

i almost got a set of these, but decided on nanolux instead


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 1, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> That's not going to run any cooler!
> 
> Lots of people are very happy running a good 315W lamp in a 3x3 space. A good one means using a LFSW ballast.


I agree I just don't think it's the right fit to flower the way I grow with more than one plant is all............

And as far as the ballast thanks to you and a couple of other members I learned that early on before getting the SS 315 I use to run.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Apr 1, 2017)

Nanolux 315cmh would be LFSW?
I thought thats what made the cmh, was the LFSW ballast's and how they drive the bulbs.
Are there any cmh fixture' known of that dont operate on a low frequency square wave?, for others to avoid?


----------



## Bad Karma (Apr 2, 2017)

jacrispy said:


> i almost got a set of these, but decided on nanolux insteadView attachment 3917660


Good call, Nanolux will serve your garden much better than the Sunplix model pictured. Also, that Sunplix has the same ballast, and frame, as the Growers Choice CMH advertised here on RIU. Which tells me those Growers Choice lamps are nothing but rebranded junk from overseas with a different reflector.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 2, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Nanolux 315cmh would be LFSW?
> I thought thats what made the cmh, was the LFSW ballast's and how they drive the bulbs.
> Are there any cmh fixture' known of that dont operate on a low frequency square wave?, for others to avoid?


Yes the new tech Phillips cmh bulbs that we are using have a new more stable base connection and are made to run only on square wave ballasts. 

The LFSW ballast is the reason that the par is so high with such low wattage. And it enables the gasses to hold the better spectrum. It is also is meant for a vertical fixture and the par advertised is in specific cmh vertical reflectors. 

The old tech was a mogul base 400 watt lamp not made for horticulture but retail showrooms and store displays. They explain this on the Phillips website somewhere I found while researching these bulbs.

I am not as familiar with the old tech 860? But same mogul old mag driven design.


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## gr865 (Apr 2, 2017)

I am using the Nanolux 315W, got a hell of a deal on it.
Was going to do a vertical grow with it but shit happened and am doing a horizonal grow with a SS400 LED and the 315W.
After this grow is complete I will be going with a stacked vertical grow with the upper light being the 315W and the lower light being the 400W HPS. If I can get the right price on another 315 I will replace the 400 with the 2nd 315W.
 

My hydro shop guy, gave me a great deal on this 315 and I checking into another one to see if he can give me the same deal.

GR


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## Carolina Dream'n (Apr 2, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Ok, can you elaborate-
> 
> from my understanding the Philips ballast isn't available in 120V
> the Philips bulb performs better then the Maxpar bulb according to the growershouse.com comparison on youtube.


Philips uses a step down to get the ballast to 120v. 

The Phillips bulbs will outperform maxpar bulbs with a Phillips ballast. They comparison only used the one ballast. Not quite fair. 

Nanolux says to match there ballast with maxpar bulbs. Whether that's because they own maxpar, not sure. But I normally stick to manufacture suggestions.


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## thccbdhealth (Apr 2, 2017)

Really, i havent seem that anywhere on their website or anywhere on the instruction pamphlet thats included in the box..

http://nanoluxtech.com/products/cmh-315w-fixture/




gr865 said:


> I am using the Nanolux 315W, got a hell of a deal on it.
> Was going to do a vertical grow with it but shit happened and am doing a horizonal grow with a SS400 LED and the 315W.
> After this grow is complete I will be going with a stacked vertical grow with the upper light being the 315W and the lower light being the 400W HPS. If I can get the right price on another 315 I will replace the 400 with the 2nd 315W.
> View attachment 3917785
> ...


How is it that you have taken that ballast and made it remote...is that the cord that can be 15'?


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 2, 2017)

@Bad Karma @DemonTrich @Growdict anyone else is welcome.When I was switching and taking out a 3100K bulb and replacing it with a 4200K I noticed the jacket became loose. Has anyone experienced this? All I did was twist it gently and now it is loose. The bulb goes in tight but the jacket is loose. Is this bulb now finished?


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## Growdict (Apr 2, 2017)

I think what you are talking about is the outer jacket that protects in case of bulb pop. Gives it the O rating. Sounds like your electric/ bulb part is ok. Research a glue or epoxy that they use for bulb glass and affix it again


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## gr865 (Apr 2, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> How is it that you have taken that ballast and made it remote...is that the cord that can be 15'?


I believe the cord is 15', I hang the ballast outside the tent and it cuts down on the heat.
I tried getting the cord shorter but that was the only size it came in. I don't think there is any power loss with a cord that length. It allows me to slant the fixture.

You can see the extra length. It does not make for a clean look to the tent.
 
May cut it down some, but don't it's needed. But run it through the upper accessory port at the top of the tent. Will definitely move it to the upper port when i start my vertical grow in about 8 weeks.

GR


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 2, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Really, i havent seem that anywhere on their website or anywhere on the instruction pamphlet thats included in the box..
> 
> http://nanoluxtech.com/products/cmh-315w-fixture/
> 
> ...


The galaxy LEC ballast has a 15' cord and a dimmer and can be used 110 or 220. 220 cord optional. It is designed for the Sun systems remote reflector.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 2, 2017)

Growdict said:


> I think what you are talking about is the outer jacket that protects in case of bulb pop. Gives it the O rating. Sounds like your electric/ bulb part is ok. Research a glue or epoxy that they use for bulb glass and affix it again


Yes I am quite sure it is the outer jacket. I am just concerned about its safety.


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 2, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Yes I am quite sure it is the outer jacket. I am just concerned about its safety.


Sounds like it's broken, as expensive as they are , safety first


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Apr 2, 2017)

Stupid question, but if I need to run a longer cord from outlet to light do I run an extension to ballast cord or run longer cord from light to ballast? They're on 240v


----------



## thccbdhealth (Apr 2, 2017)

post: 13448907 said:


> I believe the cord is 15', I hang the ballast outside the tent and it cuts down on the heat.
> I tried getting the cord shorter but that was the only size it came in. I don't think there is any power loss with a cord that length. It allows me to slant the fixture.
> 
> You can see the extra length. It does not make for a clean look to the tent.
> ...


 Did you purchase that cord separately? 
My fixture has that cord about a foot long, to plug fixture into ballast, then the power supply cord is about 15' as well.
we're you finding the ballast to create to much heat inside the tent of was this a pre-emptive measure?


----------



## all coco (Apr 2, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Yes I am quite sure it is the outer jacket. I am just concerned about its safety.


When I twisted in both my bulbs for first use it caused the bases to have a slight wiggle but they are operating fine.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2017)

all coco said:


> When I twisted in both my bulbs for first use it caused the bases to have a slight wiggle but they are operating fine.


I did this the first time too but it is not right. It will only go in one way and twist and lock firm. it has to contact flat and you can feel it click together. 

I would not leave it wobbly.


----------



## gr865 (Apr 3, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Did you purchase that cord separately?
> My fixture has that cord about a foot long, to plug fixture into ballast, then the power supply cord is about 15' as well.
> we're you finding the ballast to create to much heat inside the tent of was this a pre-emptive measure?


Yes, my hydro store guy, gave it to me. He gives me a lot of stuff, I think the store is a cover for big grows. He charges me for stuff like, medium, lights, ferts and the such, but hardgoods, plumbing fixtures, thermometer, pH pin, and many other items. He is also very knowledgeable and doesn't try selling me a bunch a shit. 
MY fixture has that same foot long cord, The extension plugs into the ballast and then runs into the tent and hooks to that 1' cord. I move it for two reason, one was the heat and I decided to move it outside the tent from the start, the second was for balance. Without the ballast the fixture and light are very light so easy to handle and manipulate.
When I start the next vertical grow I will off the reflector hood.

GR


----------



## thccbdhealth (Apr 3, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Yes, my hydro store guy, gave it to me. He gives me a lot of stuff, I think the store is a cover for big grows. He charges me for stuff like, medium, lights, ferts and the such, but hardgoods, plumbing fixtures, thermometer, pH pin, and many other items. He is also very knowledgeable and doesn't try selling me a bunch a shit.
> MY fixture has that same foot long cord, The extension plugs into the ballast and then runs into the tent and hooks to that 1' cord. I move it for two reason, one was the heat and I decided to move it outside the tent from the start, the second was for balance. Without the ballast the fixture and light are very light so easy to handle and manipulate.
> When I start the next vertical grow I will off the reflector hood.
> 
> GR


Wish I Knew of a storefront like that, Sounds like a good relationship
would any "extenshion cord" work from a hydro shop or are these terminals Nanolux specific?
I'm in a tent so I'm thinking I too should be acquiring a longer cord set to remove the ballast aswell....
any chance you and that hydro shop of yours are in the Great North and I could order from them?


----------



## gr865 (Apr 3, 2017)

I live the Great South on the Gulf of Mexico. I am not sure if it is Nanolux specific. I would shop it at different online stores, the prices differ "Bigley" LOL, store to store.
I have a ten inch port at the top of my tent on that side, so I am going to run the cord thru there when I set up my next vertical grow.

GR


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 3, 2017)

I bought it on June 22 2016 and I ha


MichiganMedGrower said:


> I did this the first time too but it is not right. It will only go in one way and twist and lock firm. it has to contact flat and you can feel it click together.
> 
> I would not leave it wobbly.


The bulb is not wobbly but the jacket is.
I have the receipt I will try and warranty it. 
that light is in area so it doesn't matter yet.


----------



## DemonTrich (Apr 3, 2017)

I had 4 that wobbled. Sent back, got 3 that wobbles. These are on the double jacket philips bulbs. No probs in 6 months running.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2017)

Mine does not wobble. The outer jacket is tight. I would contact Phillips. I would not run bulbs like that without the manufacturers ok. 

@DemonTrich or @ilovetoskiatalta have you guys contacted anyone?

I seriously would have returned the whole set up if I had seen this problem on a return bulb too.


----------



## naiveCon (Apr 3, 2017)

Hey guys,
I picked up a secret Jardin dr60 in anticipation of having an LED built for me, but it seems to have gone by the wayside.
So now I have turned my attention to one of these 315 systems, the one that strikes me the most is the kit with the remote ballast that Growers house offers, but I have a few questions.
I can't possibly read through this whole post but I have read some of it.
My objective is to flower out 2-3 plants in my little 2×2 tent, I know head room is going to be a concern as my plants are already over 2 feet tall waiting on my LED. But what about heat, is this going to be way too much for the small tent.
I'm thinking maybe no reflector just hang the bulb near the top but I don't know I have so much here to rethink.
Are people using this kit and what kind of setups ?
Thanks for any info it would be a great help.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 3, 2017)

I would say you do not want to run this is a 2x2..........at my old place the 315 was not too much for my 3x3 but you had to pay attention to the environment or it would get hot. mine ran about as warm as my 600W Blue MH does in there. I would not even think of this light in a 2x2 tent. 

Much better options with and without LED IMHO

Just my $0.02


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## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2017)

Agree with @Evil-Mobo 

I would use a 250 metal halide or more likely a 2' t-5 x 8 bulb set up. And I would put a 3k red flower bulb in every other spot instead of the stock 6500k they come with. 

Perfect lamp for a 2x2. I would keep the plants bud canopy about 1 foot thick for best results.


----------



## naiveCon (Apr 3, 2017)

Thanks guys..
What I was thinking, and I would exchange my tent for a larger but I'm at a space limitation.
I first looked at a 250 mh, but thought I read somewhere that the 315 would be a bit cooler and a little more efficient.
So i guess its either going to be a 250 mh or kmog suggested a cx4, which is just a tad out of my budget.


----------



## Growdict (Apr 3, 2017)

http://timbergrowlights.com/200-watt-citizen-clu048-4-cob-grow-light-kit/

in the budget?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2017)

naiveCon said:


> Thanks guys..
> What I was thinking, and I would exchange my tent for a larger but I'm at a space limitation.
> I first looked at a 250 mh, but thought I read somewhere that the 315 would be a bit cooler and a little more efficient.
> So i guess its either going to be a 250 mh or kmog suggested a cx4, which is just a tad out of my budget.


https://www.amazon.com/960293-120-volt-Fluorescent-Lighting-Fixture/dp/B002YXTB38

This is the lamp I veg with in a 3x3. In your 2x2 you could grow 1 plant to very high quality buds but I would substitute the red flowering bulbs 1-1 for denser bigger nugs.

The blue 6500k bulbs are included with the price.

Just wanted to show you an alternative that is sized perfect for your tent.

I vent mine with a 4" inline fan and cheap speed controller and simply blow the exhaust into the next room and it stays 75 degrees easy.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 3, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> https://www.amazon.com/960293-120-volt-Fluorescent-Lighting-Fixture/dp/B002YXTB38
> 
> This is the lamp I veg with in a 3x3. In your 2x2 you could grow 1 plant to very high quality buds but I would substitute the red flowering bulbs 1-1 for denser bigger nugs.
> 
> ...


My old 2x4 ran the same light but 4 bulbs with the 6500 K and it was perfect because not too much heat and I could get super close to the canopy. Only change I would make is that depending on the ambient temps year round where he lives. Where I use to live 8 bulb would have been too much, where I am now I would most likely be able to pull off the 8 tuber.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> My old 2x4 ran the same light but 4 bulbs with the 6500 K and it was perfect because not too much heat and I could get super close to the canopy. Only change I would make is that depending on the ambient temps year round where he lives. Where I use to live 8 bulb would have been too much, where I am now I would most likely be able to pull off the 8 tuber.


I added a 2 tube to the 8 tube in that 3x3 a while ago. All 6500k. And it still stays fine with both passive vents open and the 4" fan. 

But I do maintain a 72 degree or under ambient temperature in the house and room that the tent is in.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 3, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I added a 2 tube to the 8 tube in that 3x3 a while ago. All 6500k. And it still stays fine with both passive vents open and the 4" fan.
> 
> But I do maintain a 72 degree or under ambient temperature in the house and room that the tent is in.


Like I said bro was not arguing just giving the guy something to think about since I do not think he mentioned his area. I was running the same 4 inch fan vents etc. We agree on most everything I see you post this was an addition to your comment not meant as argumentative and the 6500K T5's are my favorite too (run cool) and cheap I was running the GE's in my Quantum big boy T5 setup in my old 2x4 with 8 bulbs. That thing was a monster. So far though the new 6500K Citi 1212's are kicking ass for veg


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Like I said bro was not arguing just giving the guy something to think about since I do not think he mentioned his area. I was running the same 4 inch fan vents etc. We agree on most everything I see you post this was an addition to your comment not meant as argumentative and the 6500K T5's are my favorite too (run cool) and cheap I was running the GE's in my Quantum big boy T5 setup in my old 2x4 with 8 bulbs. That thing was a monster. So far though the new 6500K Citi 1212's are kicking ass for veg



I didn't think you were arguing. I just wanted to add the ambient temp cause I thought it would help. 

Those GE bulbs I used to have seemed higher quality than the stock sun blaze lamps. Which I always have a couple go bad soon. 

I have not thought seriously about led's yet. But I sure like the clean setups.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 3, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I didn't think you were arguing. I just wanted to add the ambient temp cause I thought it would help.
> 
> Those GE bulbs I used to have seemed higher quality than the stock sun blaze lamps. Which I always have a couple go bad soon.
> 
> I have not thought seriously about led's yet. But I sure like the clean setups.


My new nursery/pre veg area with the 6500K Autocobs:



First lights I have liked as much as my 6500K GE T5 setup so far. Like this better than the 5000K Cree's I use to have in my old DIY light too. Nice cool and efficient just @55W each. Plug and play.


----------



## naiveCon (Apr 3, 2017)

I really appreciate all the help.
I was not aware that you could get a T5 8 bulb 2 foot unit.
For years now, half of my basement has been finished off as a grow room and I have utilized a few of the larger quantum units growing hot peppers and vegetables, very successfully. But problem is now I'm handicapped and cannot go down to my basement.
I am left with growing in my kitchen or dining room with very limited space, reason why I went with a smaller tent and just thought I would try out some of this new technology that everybody is raving about.
Here are my current plants, 7 weeks into veg under 2, 2 foot 24 watt 6500k i think...


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 3, 2017)

^^^ Nothing Wrong with that


----------



## naiveCon (Apr 3, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> ^^^ Nothing Wrong with that


 It keeps my kitchen table occipied....


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> My new nursery/pre veg area with the 6500K Autocobs:
> 
> View attachment 3918649
> 
> First lights I have liked as much as my 6500K GE T5 setup so far. Like this better than the 5000K Cree's I use to have in my old DIY light too. Nice cool and efficient just @55W each. Plug and play.


That looks super nice. And obviously effective!


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2017)

naiveCon said:


> I really appreciate all the help.
> I was not aware that you could get a T5 8 bulb 2 foot unit.
> For years now, half of my basement has been finished off as a grow room and I have utilized a few of the larger quantum units growing hot peppers and vegetables, very successfully. But problem is now I'm handicapped and cannot go down to my basement.
> I am left with growing in my kitchen or dining room with very limited space, reason why I went with a smaller tent and just thought I would try out some of this new technology that everybody is raving about.
> Here are my current plants, 7 weeks into veg under 2, 2 foot 24 watt 6500k i think...View attachment 3918678


Thanks for filling us in on the situation. Your plants look great!

You could go either way. I really see a whole lot of potential in those single cobs @Evil-Mobo has set up above. 

Good luck in all your growing.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 3, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Thanks for filling us in on the situation. Your plants look great!
> 
> You could go either way. I really see a whole lot of potential in those single cobs @Evil-Mobo has set up above.
> 
> Good luck in all your growing.


I am REALLY liking the (4) 3500K's currently in one of my 3x3's............


----------



## naiveCon (Apr 3, 2017)

Once again, thanks guys...
I just ordered a vero kit from timber grow lights


----------



## mauricem00 (Apr 3, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> https://www.amazon.com/960293-120-volt-Fluorescent-Lighting-Fixture/dp/B002YXTB38
> 
> This is the lamp I veg with in a 3x3. In your 2x2 you could grow 1 plant to very high quality buds but I would substitute the red flowering bulbs 1-1 for denser bigger nugs.
> 
> ...


this would also be a good choice for a 2ft by 2ft grow space http://www.htgsupply.com/products/growbright-2-foot-tek-light-4-lamp slightly more effiecient than 2ft T5ho bulbs. several growers have built DIY 2G11 cfl (PL-L55) fixtures and had good grows with them. like any florescent they work best with a mix spectrum for flowering (6500k/3000k).I use a 2 bulb version in a 2ft by 2 ft vegging closet and have no problem with heat


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2017)

mauricem00 said:


> this would also be a good choice for a 2ft by 2ft grow space http://www.htgsupply.com/products/growbright-2-foot-tek-light-4-lamp slightly more effiecient than 2ft T5ho bulbs. several growers have built DIY 2G11 cfl (PL-L55) fixtures and had good grows with them. like any florescent they work best with a mix spectrum for flowering (6500k/3000k).I use a 2 bulb version in a 2ft by 2 ft vegging closet and have no problem with heat


Neat!

Haven't seen those before. There are higher output single t-5's available from sunlight supply too.


----------



## Bad Karma (Apr 4, 2017)

Hey guys, for those of you interested, I've put together a video featuring my prettiest bud shots from the past few years. About half of the footage is from my LED days but the other half is from my more current LEC grows. Enjoy.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 4, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> Hey guys, for those of you interested, I've put together a video featuring my prettiest bud shots from the past few years. About half of the footage is from my LED days but the other half is from my more current LEC grows. Enjoy.



Thanks. I really enjoyed that. Lovely flowers!


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 4, 2017)

Here are some random bud pics from the last couple of weeks. I wanted to show off the high quality flowers I am lucky to have grown pretty well under the fuller spectrums. 

Posted plenty but 3 different lamps used at this time. 

Hortilux 600w Blue MH, Hortilux 600w Super HPS and Phillips 315 LEC 3100k. Plants rotated regularly to get their share of all the light spectrums and overlaps.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Apr 4, 2017)

Mine is now hanging and illuminated.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 4, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> Hey guys, for those of you interested, I've put together a video featuring my prettiest bud shots from the past few years. About half of the footage is from my LED days but the other half is from my more current LEC grows. Enjoy.


Hey was there a picture of a bud growing out of a fan leaf? @Bad Karma


----------



## Bad Karma (Apr 4, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Hey was there a picture of a bud growing out of a fan leaf? @Bad Karma


Yes, it happened on one of my Ripped Bubba plants.


----------



## hlpdsk (Apr 4, 2017)

Seen some Sun System 315W 240V been used for 9 months @ 300 bucks each.. Does that sound like a good deal or is it better to just go new for warranty ect on this stuff? Thanks!


----------



## pinner420 (Apr 5, 2017)

Psyphish said:


> They'd grow just as fast with just the 315w bulb, hell even a couple of E27 household LED bulbs would work at that stage. Serious waste of electricity.


Think i should take it up another foot before flipn her.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 5, 2017)

You got the space for that? How tall right now?


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 5, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> Think i should take it up another foot before flipn her.


Grow baby, grow!


----------



## pinner420 (Apr 5, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> You got the space for that? How tall right now?


15 ft to the cieling i think a week or so more. Lots of room. Last measured 4 days ago at 23 inches.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 5, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> 15 ft to the cieling i think a week or so more. Lots of room. Last measured 4 days ago at 23 inches.


15 feet and you're worried LOL, let that biach GROW!


----------



## pinner420 (Apr 6, 2017)

Make note the half getting hit with the 315 is 1/3 farther along than the side with the 600.


----------



## Bad Karma (Apr 6, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> Make note the half getting hit with the 315 is 1/3 farther along than the side with the 600.


Full spectrum for the win!


----------



## igothydrotoneverywhere (Apr 6, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> Yes, it happened on one of my Ripped Bubba plants.


Ive had tga gear do the same


----------



## igothydrotoneverywhere (Apr 6, 2017)

hlpdsk said:


> Seen some Sun System 315W 240V been used for 9 months @ 300 bucks each.. Does that sound like a good deal or is it better to just go new for warranty ect on this stuff? Thanks!


Sun system has the dankest customer service and the best LEC light. Most big grow stores will allow you to just drop your broken under warranty stuff off and they will handle it from there, usually u get a new one. Even if 3100k bulb is totally beat(which it works, so its not), u can get them new for 80$. so for 380$ you get a hood that has the original Philips Ballast intended for the bulb, plus the remainder of what is probably 2 years left on the warranty. 

I would buy them in a heartbeat. Just wash the fuck out of them lol. I am always curious why someone would sell such a badass thing... If they are poor or bad circustance ok, but i mean what if their garden bombed due to russet mites and aphids? u buying a dirty light?? haha


----------



## hlpdsk (Apr 6, 2017)

Thank you for the reply!


----------



## gr865 (Apr 7, 2017)

I am still looking for a suggestion on my next project. Before I purchase another 315W I want to make sure it will not be a problem in the tent. Sorry if I have posted these pics in the past but this is the best way to explain my intentions.

I am considering a Stacked (2 - 315W) Vertical 5 Plant Scree grow. I have Vertical experience with a single 400W HPS. Right now I have one 315 and planned on doing a stacked grow with the 315 as the top light and a 400W HPS as the lower light. I believe I can get a good deal on another 315 and if I can I will use two 315's.

I am in a 4x4 tent 7' tall, 6" Max-Fan, three speed, 291 to 420 CFM, inline suction fan beyond the 6" Phrish filter, that is exhausted into the garage, so I believe I have plenty of air movement through the tent. I also have an AC if needed in the room I draw my intake air from. From the lights to the screen I have minimum of 16" and a max of 22". My ballast will be outside the tent so the only heat will come from the lamps themselves. Growing in coco 2 gallon Smart Pots with automated drip irrig. using the BlackHoles emitter. 

My question is: Will I have a heat problem with the 2 315W lamps in the tent?

This first photo is of the light stand for the lower light, it is set up for the 400W at present but I can change that to the 315 if I go that direction. If you note the red arrows, I can switch the PVC pipe out to change the height of the lamp. This are 6" rizers in the unit now, can go up to 18", but don't think I will ever need to go over 12".
 

These are the frames without the net on them, 20 x 40 inch frame, overall height is 54". The 315W that will hang is not in this picture but will hang directly above the bottom lamp.
 

Pic with the net attached. Note that each individual screen is movable as I stated above, from 16" to 22" from the bulbs.
 
The fan is not centered on the screen in this pic, but you get the idea. 
 

Thanks in advance!

GR


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 7, 2017)

No one can tell you for sure as there are way too many variables but I can tell you I needed an air cooled reflector for my 600w hps in my 4x4. 

And I needed ac in summer to keep the ambient intake air under 72 degrees. 

I don't think an open exhaust without air cooling would have worked. Maybe for the 400 alone. 

I would use vertical cool tubes like I have seen if I was sure I wanted to do vert in a tent.


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Apr 7, 2017)

So my lights came. How should I arrange them in a 4x8? All in a row or stack 2 next to each other?


----------



## pinner420 (Apr 7, 2017)

gr865 said:


> I am still looking for a suggestion on my next project. Before I purchase another 315W I want to make sure it will not be a problem in the tent. Sorry if I have posted these pics in the past but this is the best way to explain my intentions.
> 
> I am considering a Stacked (2 - 315W) Vertical 5 Plant Scree grow. I have Vertical experience with a single 400W HPS. Right now I have one 315 and planned on doing a stacked grow with the 315 as the top light and a 400W HPS as the lower light. I believe I can get a good deal on another 315 and if I can I will use two 315's.
> 
> ...


Sounds solid to me. 6" fan should be on point.


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 7, 2017)

gr865 said:


> I am still looking for a suggestion on my next project. Before I purchase another 315W I want to make sure it will not be a problem in the tent. Sorry if I have posted these pics in the past but this is the best way to explain my intentions.
> 
> I am considering a Stacked (2 - 315W) Vertical 5 Plant Scree grow. I have Vertical experience with a single 400W HPS. Right now I have one 315 and planned on doing a stacked grow with the 315 as the top light and a 400W HPS as the lower light. I believe I can get a good deal on another 315 and if I can I will use two 315's.
> 
> ...


Could be a bit hot for sure, you gonna have 630W(2150BTU about) of heat in there, i'd suggest a good exhaust and intake system.

http://www.rapidtables.com/convert/power/Watt_to_BTU.htm


----------



## gr865 (Apr 7, 2017)

Thanks for the responses y'all.

At present I am running a 315W and a SS400 LED horizontal grow, The 315 ballast is outside the tent but the LED vents into the tent. I have not had any heat probs with this set up.


----------



## Bad Karma (Apr 7, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> So my lights came. How should I arrange them in a 4x8? All in a row or stack 2 next to each other?


I'd go with stacking 2 next to each other. That way you can have the footprints from all 4 lights overlapping for maximum effect. It will leave you with about a foot of unused space on each end of the tent, but growth, and yield from that center 6x4 area will be amazing.


----------



## pinner420 (Apr 7, 2017)

Hot blond ass under blurple... happy Friday


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 7, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> Hot blond ass under blurple... happy Friday View attachment 3920562


She grew real nice!


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 7, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> Hot blond ass under blurple... happy Friday View attachment 3920562


'please no cameras no cellphones'
LOL


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 8, 2017)

Just a 315 LEC observation for everyone interested in these. With pics of course. 

Here is a Blue Lemon Thai from seed. I have seen this pheno before. It is a viney stretchy pain in the ass and yields real big lemony sativa looking buds. 

Under the 600 Super HPS loaded reflectors she usually takes 3-4 weeks to show her first blooms.

She also keeps growing most of the way through an up to 12 week bloom. And I have to constantly supercrop and stake and tie her to manage. 

This one under the 315 took 2.5 weeks and although I have supercropped her. Only 3 branches so far. 

Her nodes are tighter than usual as well. She can be a stretchy girl. 

Finish time if I ripen under the 315 has been up to 10 days shorter than average to truly finished. 

I will report on her progress but have a feeling she will stay much more compact than the last ones and finish early with huge frosty buds. 

I love these plants. I am getting a bit carried away on veg time for my room though. She is in a 3 gallon nursery pot. I use them to limit size. Lol.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 8, 2017)

And the 3 different bulb flower room tonight. 

I have thinned out the number of plants to increase air flow and growing space each. 

I plan to move up to 5 gallon pots and run less larger plants trained in veg like the one I posted above. 

And next configuration so far from what I have seen is 2 600 super hps' in the blockbusters with the SS 315 LEC in the middle. All over a 4x8 area. 

I have lost too much density and gained a bit too much leaf and lost a little yield with the blue metal halide and the LEC so I want to put the ratio back but with more overlap. 

I do still have to build a room in my basement so it will be a while.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 8, 2017)

One more update with bud porn included. 

The Hortilux Blue Metal Halide is a fantastic bulb. I bet it is amazing for big veg. It's buds have the frost and colors almost as much as the 315 and a larger footprint too. 

If I still used only the 2 air cooled set up I would likely still use 1 of these and 1 Super hps for quality and yield. 

Here is a Blue Lemon Thai going purple some. 

The buds are huge and solid. But they are not as dense and heavy as the Super hps can grow. But the quality it brings to the table is obvious just looking.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 8, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> So my lights came. How should I arrange them in a 4x8? All in a row or stack 2 next to each other?


Ask @DemonTrich


----------



## mr. childs (Apr 8, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> The Hortilux Blue Metal Halide is a fantastic bulb. I bet it is amazing for big veg. It's buds have the frost and colors almost as much as the 315 and a larger footprint too.
> 
> The buds are huge and solid. But they are not as dense and heavy as the Super hps can grow. But the quality it brings to the table is obvious just looking.


 how was the heat of the hortilux bmh compared to your past usage of the shps ?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 8, 2017)

mr. childs said:


> how was the heat of the hortilux bmh compared to your past usage of the shps ?


I run them in air cooled sealed hoods which may even out the difference but they are always within 1 degree of each other under the lamps. 

Switching out the other hps didn't really change temps noticeably in my set up.


----------



## DemonTrich (Apr 9, 2017)

Light/light/light in a row to cover the 8' span.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 9, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Mine does not wobble. The outer jacket is tight. I would contact Phillips. I would not run bulbs like that without the manufacturers ok.
> 
> @DemonTrich or @ilovetoskiatalta have you guys contacted anyone?
> 
> I seriously would have returned the whole set up if I had seen this problem on a return bulb too.


@MichiganMedGrower @DemonTrich I called philips and sent it back just to see what they say...I don't care about the $100.00 I do care about safety. I have no problem with the ballast/hood from hydrofarm. It is the second generation ballast and this is in a veg tent so I do not need this bulb. I was just wondering if anyone else had this problem. 
fyi philips wanted pics of the bulb and the hood, asked if it was vert or horizontal.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 9, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> @MichiganMedGrower @DemonTrich I called philips and sent it back just to see what they say...I don't care about the $100.00 I do care about safety. I have no problem with the ballast/hood from hydrofarm. It is the second generation ballast and this is in a veg tent so I do not need this bulb. I was just wondering if anyone else had this problem.
> fyi philips wanted pics of the bulb and the hood, asked if it was vert or horizontal.


Please report what they say. Thanks.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 10, 2017)

Update on philips bulb. They sent me a label I sent them back the bulb, they contacted me and said they were going to send me a check for a replacement bulb and they said I should not use any bulb that is in any way loose. They cited arcing. They did not test my bulb yet and they said it would take six weeks. They are sending a check out this week.

I just wanted to say that I am pleased with their customer service.

@MichiganMedGrower @DemonTrich @Bad Karma


----------



## all coco (Apr 10, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Update on philips bulb. They sent me a label I sent them back the bulb, they contacted me and said they were going to send me a check for a replacement bulb and they said I should not use any bulb that is in any way loose. They cited arcing. They did not test my bulb yet and they said it would take six weeks. They are sending a check out this week.
> 
> I just wanted to say that I am pleased with their customer service.
> 
> @MichiganMedGrower @DemonTrich @Bad Karma


Thanks for the report I think I will buy some new bulbs and contact them about mine that loosened upon installation


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 10, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Update on philips bulb. They sent me a label I sent them back the bulb, they contacted me and said they were going to send me a check for a replacement bulb and they said I should not use any bulb that is in any way loose. They cited arcing. They did not test my bulb yet and they said it would take six weeks. They are sending a check out this week.
> 
> I just wanted to say that I am pleased with their customer service.
> 
> @MichiganMedGrower @DemonTrich @Bad Karma



Thanks man. Super informative and helpful posts. I wonder how many loose bulbs are burning over plants out there right now.


----------



## Bad Karma (Apr 10, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Thanks man. Super informative and helpful posts. I wonder how many loose bulbs are burning over plants out there right now.


That is literally my only complaint with LEC is that the bulbs do not screw in, or out, very easily. I literally broke a bulb in my hand once trying to screw it in further because it still felt loose. When I screwed in the replacement bulb I ordered, no problem. Both were the same model bulb from Phillips, so I wonder if they've quietly made some minor adjustments to the more recently made bulbs to alleviate the "loose" issue?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 10, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> That is literally my only complaint with LEC is that the bulbs do not screw in, or out, very easily. I literally broke a bulb in my hand once trying to screw it in further because it still felt loose. When I screwed in the replacement bulb I ordered, no problem. Both were the same model bulb from Phillips, so I wonder if they've quietly made some minor adjustments to the more recently made bulbs to alleviate the "loose" issue?


Mine felt funny the first time I screwed it in. But when I looked at the 2 nuts that secure it to the socket (base?) I could see I was doing it backwards. 

Is it possible we are breaking the jacket and not noticing if we try to turn it in wrong?

You obviously tried so hard against the stop it broke the glass.


----------



## Bad Karma (Apr 10, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Mine felt funny the first time I screwed it in. But when I looked at the 2 nuts that secure it to the socket (base?) I could see I was doing it backwards.
> 
> Is it possible we are breaking the jacket and not noticing if we try to turn it in wrong?
> 
> You obviously tried so hard against the stop it broke the glass.


I make sure everything is lined up correctly before I start turning anything. As far as I know, righty-tighty, and lefty-loosey, are still in effect.
It's not like the bulb exploded in my hands from the shear might of my strength, which is mighty, mind you. No, it felt loose, so I tried to turn it a little further, and the base of the bulb cracked.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 11, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I make sure everything is lined up correctly before I start turning anything. As far as I know, righty-tighty, and lefty-loosey, are still in effect.
> It's not like the bulb exploded in my hands from the shear might of my strength, which is mighty, mind you. No, it felt loose, so I tried to turn it a little further, and the base of the bulb cracked.


It was the mighty strength thing that had worried me. 

I meant the big and little nut were lined up backwards not turning the wrong way. So it doesn't pop in the grooves correctly. And then the mighty strength thing. 

I really did fiddle with mine for a bit before I got it in there right. I could have easily done what I just described I think.


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 11, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I make sure everything is lined up correctly before I start turning anything. As far as I know, righty-tighty, and lefty-loosey, are still in effect.
> It's not like the bulb exploded in my hands from the shear might of my strength, which is mighty, mind you. No, it felt loose, so I tried to turn it a little further, and the base of the bulb cracked.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 11, 2017)

Heads up!


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 11, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Heads up!
> 
> View attachment 3922841


You think their 4/20 sale will be bigger? I been waiting for a good deal to buy that phantom cmh reflector to replace my blockbuster, i think the vertical hung light for cmh works better than how i have it horizontally.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 11, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> You think their 4/20 sale will be bigger? I been waiting for a good deal to buy that phantom cmh reflector to replace my blockbuster, i think the vertical hung light for cmh works better than how i have it horizontally.


The got my SS and galaxy set up for this price on Black Friday. I have not seen more than 15% off all year. But who knows?

The galaxy ballast. SS remote reflector and a Phillips bulb is 350 shipped to mi. I may grab one for veg.


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 11, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> The got my SS and galaxy set up for this price on Black Friday. I have not seen more than 15% off all year. But who knows?
> 
> The galaxy ballast. SS remote reflector and a Phillips bulb is 350 shipped to mi. I may grab one for veg.


my biggest issue is all my savings are eaten by the shipping fee's , it shows a savings of 20$ but a shipping charge of 17$...i am only 1 state away from their warehouse too


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 11, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> my biggest issue is all my savings are eaten by the shipping fee's , it shows a savings of 20$ but a shipping charge of 17$...i am only 1 state away from their warehouse too


Yeah. They all do that with shipping. It's $25 from there to MI. 

And that doesn't compute. 

But they all advertise the lowest internet price so it has to be made up somewhere. Internet deals don't leave much individual deal profit.


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 11, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Yeah. They all do that with shipping. It's $25 from there to MI.
> 
> And that doesn't compute.
> 
> But they all advertise the lowest internet price so it has to be made up somewhere. Internet deals don't leave much individual deal profit.


Yep, i called and asked if they ever do free shipping, they said no .


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 11, 2017)

Here is a garden pic for the full spectrum bulb crowd.

And it likely makes the garden supply retailers pretty thrilled too. Lol. At my expense.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 11, 2017)

Here is the overhead shot.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 12, 2017)

Update from Philips

The Contact for Phiips said they would like to know about any other bulbs like this.
800-555-0050 her name is Donya.

@MichiganMedGrower @DemonTrich @Bad Karma @all coco


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## thccbdhealth (Apr 12, 2017)

if you look at the 2 prongs on the base, you'll notice one is a circle the other is a half circle with the edge clipped.
On the socket in my Nanolux Fixture, one of the hole's has a clipped edge, and the other is a full circle.
I lined the 2 up accordingly, and turned clockwise.
while holding onto the metal housing on the bottom, rather then the bulb jacket.

Wondering if some models don't have the 2 different disgusted holes in the fixture?


----------



## all coco (Apr 12, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> if you look at the 2 prongs on the base, you'll notice one is a circle the other is a half circle with the edge clipped.
> On the socket in my Nanolux Fixture, one of the hole's has a clipped edge, and the other is a full circle.
> I lined the 2 up accordingly, and turned clockwise.
> while holding onto the metal housing on the bottom, rather then the bulb jacket.
> ...


I have a couple Sun System RA Remote reflectors and the fixture holes match the lamp prongs but the base is recessed into the fixture leaving only glass to grab and twist.


----------



## rollitupled (Apr 16, 2017)

Hi guys and gals 
I used to grow using a 600w HPS. I am back growing again and will be buying the following setup:

Dimlux 315w cmh
Secret Jardin - DarkRoom DR90 90x90x175 [3x3] (the biggest size i can fit in my space unfortunately)
6'' Stealth Hyper Fan-150mm
Rhino Pro Carbon Filter 6"

I need a quiet fan due to neighbours, i was torn between the TD silent and the Stealth Hyperfan. It's easier for me to buy a Stealth hyper fan kit with the rhino pro, so I am going to go for that. I could also run it at a lower speed with the included speed controller. 

The dimlux looks awesome....and I can get it for not much more than a SunSystem LEC 315w (also look great)

What do you think? I'm excited to try cmh


----------



## Growdict (Apr 16, 2017)

Sounds great. Bear in mind you will only get 2/3-3/4 of your 600 yield. Although some reports show a slightly faster ripening time and slightly higher thc. Awesome light for a 3x3 personal grow imo.


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 16, 2017)

Growdict said:


> Sounds great. Bear in mind you will only get 2/3-3/4 of your 600 yield. Although some reports show a slightly faster ripening time and slightly higher thc. Awesome light for a 3x3 personal grow imo.


My white fire og is purpling much much earlier under my CMH too , and as you said , ripening quickly. I think the spectrum is helping bring more fall colors out.


----------



## rollitupled (Apr 16, 2017)

Growdict said:


> Sounds great. Bear in mind you will only get 2/3-3/4 of your 600 yield. Although some reports show a slightly faster ripening time and slightly higher thc. Awesome light for a 3x3 personal grow imo.


Hi dude. Thanks for the reply. Yes, I know my yields will be less, although to be honest I wasn't maximizing my yield back then, as i was just having fun growing a few different strains and learning about growing and different growing techniques.

This time I am planning a scrog with two plants in the tent. 1 x la confidential and 1 x Exodus kush  They are about 2 weeks old under 125W cfls at the moment

Will order my bits of kit this week


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 16, 2017)

rollitupled said:


> Hi dude. Thanks for the reply. Yes, I know my yields will be less, although to be honest I wasn't maximizing my yield back then, as i was just having fun growing a few different strains and learning about growing and different growing techniques.
> 
> This time I am planning a scrog with two plants in the tent. 1 x la confidential and 1 x Exodus kush  They are about 2 weeks old under 125W cfls at the moment
> 
> Will order my bits of kit this week


Why did you call yourself rollitup 'led' when you plan to use a light bulb?


----------



## rollitupled (Apr 16, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Why did you call yourself rollitup 'led' when you plan to use a light bulb?


ha. Because when I registered recently..I was considering a cob led grow..but since becoming aware of cmh, I have changed my mind for various reasons..


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 16, 2017)

rollitupled said:


> ha. Because when I registered recently..I was considering a cob led grow..but since becoming aware of cmh, I have changed my mind for various reasons..


They both work just fine, no worries!


----------



## rollitupled (Apr 16, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> They both work just fine, no worries!


Thanks dude  Yes there is some great tech out there


----------



## Yts farmer (Apr 17, 2017)

rollitupled said:


> I need a quiet fan due to neighbours, i was torn between the TD silent and the Stealth Hyperfan. It's easier for me to buy a Stealth hyper fan kit with the rhino pro, so I am going to go for that. I could also run it at a lower speed with the included speed controller.


Hope you dont have to run your hyperfan on full speed, not the quietest fans.

Anyway cant wait to see what you do with your dimlux and good luck on your grow.

Peace.


----------



## rollitupled (Apr 17, 2017)

Yts farmer said:


> Hope you dont have to run your hyperfan on full speed, not the quietest fans.
> 
> Anyway cant wait to see what you do with your dimlux and good luck on your grow.
> 
> Peace.


Hi, I am looking at the Hyperfan Stealth model, not the standard Hyperfan. It's basically the hyperfan enclosed in a silencer as far as i'm aware. Do you have any experience with it? I still haven't placed my order yet. Thanks

I'm very excited about the dimlux..I'll be ordering it tomorrow and should have it by the end of the week/beginning of next week. I'll be sure to post pics and results.

It's so great to have these communities where you can come for advice, help and to share information.


----------



## naiveCon (Apr 17, 2017)

rollitupled said:


> Thanks dude  Yes there is some great tech out there


 I just discovered these today, don't know much about them but they look interesting...
http://www.solerpalau-usa.com/tdsilent.html


----------



## thccbdhealth (Apr 17, 2017)

are regular, 100% polarized sunglasses, enough protection to work around the Philips cmh?


----------



## mr. childs (Apr 17, 2017)

naiveCon said:


> I just discovered these today, don't know much about them but they look interesting...
> http://www.solerpalau-usa.com/tdsilent.html


i have a td 160, it moves a good amount of air. its pretty quiet, mine is about 8 years old now.


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 18, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> are regular, 100% polarized sunglasses, enough protection to work around the Philips cmh?


If they say UVA/UVB protection, yes. Polarized isn't necessary, but it's helpful to reduce fatigue.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 18, 2017)

Here is a "too" full spectrum plant I had troubles with during transition. Her leaves got spotted and burnt so I leached her and re fed and she eventually took off. But she has been flowering 12.5 weeks total with the stalled time and I was patient and kept her going. 

Her buds are huge frosty and way to leafy and fluffy. I will add a smoke report later when dry. 

So far replacing 1 of 2 hps with mh and still having the new 315 LEC in there has hurt my results compared to 2 hps and 1 LEC. 

Not in potency or terpenes though. Just weight and structure. 

Some more time back his way and I will see if the potency suffers next and figure the right balance. But I am pretty sure more blue than the 3100k has is not necessary. 

Here is the Blue Lemon Thai after we stripped her fan leaves for harvest. Still very impressive.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 18, 2017)

On the other side of the pros and cons of a lot of blue light in flower. 

Here is the normally viney stretchy pheno of BLT I showed last week. Instead of still stretching like crazy she took the initial mild supercrop and has budded up without further training. 

Big girl but so far nice even tops still. 

We will see where the balance of light needs to be to keep them compact but I have also learned what I have read in Greenhouse guides to be true. 

Well fed flowering plants with plenty of potassium during transition stay more compact. I am only using a one part. But I am making sure they are super happy and a bit more mature during transition. 

I still have not changed pot size but this all allows for bigger but still compact bushes in my room. 

BLT #7


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 18, 2017)

And a natural and a flash used pic of the growroom with the hps back. The room has not had any time to adjust to the new light change so this room was grown with....

Hortilux Blue MH, Hortilux Super HPS and Phillips 3100k CMH. 

  

Combo sure grew some big happy leafy plants. And the smoke has been very very good I am proud to say. The UV and more sunlight like spectrum definitely adds some perceived qualities. 

But I am growing flowers not leaves and I will find balance eventually. 

Thanks for following along.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 18, 2017)

rollitupled said:


> Hi guys and gals
> I used to grow using a 600w HPS. I am back growing again and will be buying the following setup:
> 
> Dimlux 315w cmh
> ...


Look into a variac...they are a little more money but they work very well. Pluses you can use it with a crock pot for decarbing I coconut oil at a perfect temperature. If you like edibles.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Apr 18, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> If they say UVA/UVB protection, yes. Polarized isn't necessary, but it's helpful to reduce fatigue.


Is there a specfic pair you would recommend? I havent came across any uva/uvb rated glasses


----------



## rkymtnman (Apr 18, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Is there a specfic pair you would recommend? I havent came across any uva/uvb rated glasses


https://www.amazon.com/Hobart-770727-Shade-Safety-Glasses/dp/B0086D59XQ

hard to beat this price. UV400 rated. and they fit really well too.


----------



## rollitupled (Apr 18, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Look into a variac...they are a little more money but they work very well. Pluses you can use it with a crock pot for decarbing I coconut oil at a perfect temperature. If you like edibles.


Variac as in the speed controllers? The hyperfan stealth has a speed controller included


----------



## thccbdhealth (Apr 18, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> https://www.amazon.com/Hobart-770727-Shade-Safety-Glasses/dp/B0086D59XQ
> 
> hard to beat this price. UV400 rated. and they fit really well too.


I found a pair in Marks Work Wearhouse that saus 100% uv protection on them, distortion free
would they be a safe use, as the say 100% uv protection


----------



## A guy (Apr 18, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> I still use a 4k bulb for veg and a 3k for flower. I'm absolutely KILLING it with these 315s. Equal to my 600hps runs.
> 
> Week 5 iirc
> 
> View attachment 3910388


Nice work, DemonTrich. I'm considering putting four 315s in my 5x5 tent and to me it looks like you have your lights similarly spread out as I would have in my tent.

What is your lighting / tent space arrangement? Do you think four 315s would be ridiculous in a 5x5 tent? Seems to make sense if I can keep the place cool enough.

Thanks


----------



## gr865 (Apr 18, 2017)

A guy said:


> Nice work, DemonTrich. I'm considering putting four 315s in my 5x5 tent and to me it looks like you have your lights similarly spread out as I would have in my tent.
> 
> What is your lighting / tent space arrangement? Do you think four 315s would be ridiculous in a 5x5 tent? Seems to make sense if I can keep the place cool enough.
> 
> Thanks


I will be running two stacked 315w in my 4x4 starting when these little ones get the strength to withstand the lights. I was worried about too much heat also, but your right, we have to keep it cool in there.

GR


----------



## rkymtnman (Apr 18, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> I found a pair in Marks Work Wearhouse that saus 100% uv protection on them, distortion free
> would they be a safe use, as the say 100% uv protection


they should. those uv400 ratings means all uv blocked below 400nm.


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 18, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Is there a specfic pair you would recommend? I havent came across any uva/uvb rated glasses


Actually most sunglasses are, it's on the tag or the box.

Believe it or not, my favorites are the Berkeley Angler brand sunglasses available at Wal-Mart for $12. They're UVA & UVB blocking, polarized, comfortable- and cheap enough to toss without concern.


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 18, 2017)

A guy said:


> Nice work, DemonTrich. I'm considering putting four 315s in my 5x5 tent and to me it looks like you have your lights similarly spread out as I would have in my tent.
> 
> What is your lighting / tent space arrangement? Do you think four 315s would be ridiculous in a 5x5 tent? Seems to make sense if I can keep the place cool enough.
> 
> Thanks


You will not lack for light intensity, that's for sure. Keep the tent cool and you'll kill it.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 19, 2017)

rollitupled said:


> Variac as in the speed controllers? The hyperfan stealth has a speed controller included


Yes I have found they are a worth the extra money compared to the controllers that come with fans. 
FWIW I run 2 hurricane 180 4" fans. One with a mountain air 4"x16" in a 4'x2' and one as intake in an apartment. It's very quiet and I have been fine with smell and noise. 
I'm running afgooey, white widow and cali-O. The afgooey will be a real test cuz these plants stink as seedlings. 
I am pleased with my hurricanes.


----------



## DemonTrich (Apr 19, 2017)

I'll let the pics speak for themselves


----------



## A guy (Apr 19, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> I'll let the pics speak for themselves
> 
> 
> View attachment 3927535 View attachment 3927536


That's awesome and what I'm looking to do as well, DemonTrich. The pics tell me you're using cool hoods. Could you tell me...

1. If you also need AC. 
2. How many lights in what size of space.
3. Your thoughts on four 315s in a 5x5 tent. 

I appreciate it.


----------



## DemonTrich (Apr 19, 2017)

A guy said:


> That's awesome and what I'm looking to do as well, DemonTrich. The pics tell me you're using cool hoods. Could you tell me...
> 
> 1. If you also need AC.
> 2. How many lights in what size of space.
> ...


1. Yes
2. 8x12x7 offset 2.5' from center (6'3 glass to floor height). Sealed/co2
3. If you can fit 4, go for it. Imo 3 would be good or overkill for a 5x5. Not a whole lot of room in a 5x5.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 19, 2017)

A guy said:


> That's awesome and what I'm looking to do as well, DemonTrich. The pics tell me you're using cool hoods. Could you tell me...
> 
> 1. If you also need AC.
> 2. How many lights in what size of space.
> ...


I have to say I really didn't like the 2 bulb 630 set ups. Seems more single point 315's would be better in most situations. 

But in yours with a 5x5 tent. I wonder if the air cooled 630 reflectors would be perfect for that footprint?


----------



## A guy (Apr 19, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> 1. Yes
> 2. 8x12x7 offset 2.5' from center (6'3 glass to floor height). Sealed/co2
> 3. If you can fit 4, go for it. Imo 3 would be good or overkill for a 5x5. Not a whole lot of room in a 5x5.


Thanks man. Yes, that's a next level setup you've got there. It makes sense that you're using AC with a sealed room, do you think you'd be able to get away with only ventilation (both input and exhaust) if you weren't doing co2? Smell isn't an issue, I don't use scrubbers.

I'm just looking to have excellent light over the entire 5x5 footprint. It's either 4 of these or COBs, I figure.


----------



## A guy (Apr 19, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I have to say I really didn't like the 2 bulb 630 set ups. Seems more single point 315's would be better in most situations.
> 
> But in yours with a 5x5 tent. I wonder if the air cooled 630 reflectors would be perfect for that footprint?


I'm sure it'd work well but I'd rather do two separate 315s than one hood with 2 bulbs. I think it'd get better coverage. Either way, I'm looking for ideal light over the entire 5x5 canopy which is not something that 2 lights with a 3x3 "quality" footprint can accomplish...considering basic geometry.

I already have a decent setup, I'm just looking to make it excellent. I don't want my next upgrade to leave me wanting for light.


----------



## gr865 (Apr 19, 2017)

A guy said:


> I'm sure it'd work well but I'd rather do two separate 315s than one hood with 2 bulbs. I think it'd get better coverage. Either way, I'm looking for ideal light over the entire 5x5 canopy which is not something that 2 lights with a 3x3 "quality" footprint can accomplish...considering basic geometry.
> 
> I already have a decent setup, I'm just looking to make it excellent. I don't want my next upgrade to leave me wanting for light.



Have you considered vertical growing?

GR


----------



## A guy (Apr 19, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Have you considered vertical growing?
> 
> GR


Not since I started looking into growing, early on. I'm intrigued by the idea, seems like there are a number of ways to do it. Might be a bit too high maintenance for my tastes but I'm open to learning more about it. I love how effectively it uses a bulb.


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 19, 2017)

A guy said:


> Not since I started looking into growing, early on. I'm intrigued by the idea, seems like there are a number of ways to do it. Might be a bit too high maintenance for my tastes but I'm open to learning more about it. I love how effectively it uses a bulb.


Pretty damn effectively and in my experience vertical grows are LESS maintenance per ounce of finished product.


----------



## gr865 (Apr 20, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Pretty damn effectively and in my experience vertical grows are LESS maintenance per ounce of finished product.


Hey Buddy,
Have you visited Marlo's WOW grow in ICmag.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=221265

Very interesting work, stuff like you do, well not with all the lighting but ideas.

GR


----------



## A guy (Apr 20, 2017)

I read some more about vertical grows last night. I'd want to stick with soil and so far the "donut SOG" where there are multiple levels of small plants surrounding a couple of vert lights seem most interesting to me. I'd have to change up my routine to include a reliable clone process which might mean I'd have to stick with a few varieties instead of rotating through different strains, as I do now. Watering would be a bit of a bitch but I guess I could set up drip systems (long story short...last time I did that the timer failed and I flooded my tent, with heater electrocuting myself and the plants causing them to flower within days). Definitely pros and cons.

That WOW grow is interesting but I think I'd shy away from the long veg that it seems to require. I'm starting to grow meds for folks so I kinda want to keep harvests coming in sooner than later.

Right now my maintenance is so minimal with my 4 plant "no-till" soil grow that it's hard to imagine anything being less maintenance but I'm going to keep looking into this.

Thanks


----------



## gr865 (Apr 20, 2017)

A guy said:


> I read some more about vertical grows last night. I'd want to stick with soil and so far the "donut SOG" where there are multiple levels of small plants surrounding a couple of vert lights seem most interesting to me. I'd have to change up my routine to include a reliable clone process which might mean I'd have to stick with a few varieties instead of rotating through different strains, as I do now. Watering would be a bit of a bitch but I guess I could set up drip systems (long story short...last time I did that the timer failed and I flooded my tent, with heater electrocuting myself and the plants causing them to flower within days). Definitely pros and cons.
> 
> That WOW grow is interesting but I think I'd shy away from the long veg that it seems to require. I'm starting to grow meds for folks so I kinda want to keep harvests coming in sooner than later.
> 
> ...


Well for me this is for my meds only, but I can get the quantity I need, by growing vertical, to make the CO I require for pain management, not to supply numbers of folks.
Where are you growing, I am in a 4x4 tent so instead of 16 sq ft of foot print. With my screens I get approx. 30 sq ft. So that allows me to do only one or two grows a year.
GR

In the process now of getting everything set up for my new grow. Will post info on it when I finish.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 20, 2017)

Trellised vertical grows may increase perceived square footage in an area but I say perceived because my plants grow under horizontal lamps but are thickly budded from top to bottom almost to the soil. 

That gives me almost 2 feet or more of flowers under the canopy footprint. 

All the guides and explanations show only a thin wall of buds weaved through the rack. Maybe a few inches thick against the wall.

So if you were to cross section the 2' into the thickness of the buds in the rack the supposedly greater yield evens out with the "flatlander" grow. 

And I can veg much shorter time rather than trying to stretch up 6' of branching. I actually joined here to learn about vertical set ups. 

But it's actually way more work and I would need multiple racks to keep a perpetual going. 

And I can move my plants around and grow any strains I want any time. And harvest a plant per week of variety. 

ymmv


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 20, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Hey Buddy,
> Have you visited Marlo's WOW grow in ICmag.
> https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=221265
> 
> ...


Yes I have seen it. Great stuff!


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 20, 2017)

A guy said:


> I read some more about vertical grows last night. I'd want to stick with soil and so far the "donut SOG" where there are multiple levels of small plants surrounding a couple of vert lights seem most interesting to me. I'd have to change up my routine to include a reliable clone process which might mean I'd have to stick with a few varieties instead of rotating through different strains, as I do now. Watering would be a bit of a bitch but I guess I could set up drip systems (long story short...last time I did that the timer failed and I flooded my tent, with heater electrocuting myself and the plants causing them to flower within days). Definitely pros and cons.
> 
> That WOW grow is interesting but I think I'd shy away from the long veg that it seems to require. I'm starting to grow meds for folks so I kinda want to keep harvests coming in sooner than later.
> 
> ...


It's easy to give plants a longer veg time; staging.


----------



## A guy (Apr 20, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Well for me this is for my meds only, but I can get the quantity I need, by growing vertical, to make the CO I require for pain management, not to supply numbers of folks.
> Where are you growing, I am in a 4x4 tent so instead of 16 sq ft of foot print. With my screens I get approx. 30 sq ft. So that allows me to do only one or two grows a year.
> GR
> 
> In the process now of getting everything set up for my new grow. Will post info on it when I finish.


I flower in a 5x5 tent. I want to upgrade my lighting because I know I could do better that what I'm doing now and part of that is more consistent coverage across the SCROG. A new patient wants 2-3 oz per month and I have others interested so my current plan with my two tents is to veg as long as whatever is in the flower tent takes to flower, and so on. I'm not in a hurry to change things up but I'll definitely consider new grow structures along with new lighting.


----------



## woodsyn2o (Apr 20, 2017)

what do ya think about this price 169.36 http://www.horticulturesource.com/product_info.php?products_id=25343&gclid=CJ-WtoaYp9MCFcS3wAod26EE5A


----------



## A guy (Apr 20, 2017)

woodsyn2o said:


> what do ya think about this price 169.36 http://www.horticulturesource.com/product_info.php?products_id=25343&gclid=CJ-WtoaYp9MCFcS3wAod26EE5A


Pretty cheap. Hard to pull the trigger without hearing folks' experience with that particular knock off. After $36 shipping it's about what the one I'm looking at costs (if you add $80 for a bulb on your's).
http://growershouse.com/ceramic-mh-315w-wing-reflector-package


----------



## woodsyn2o (Apr 20, 2017)

A guy said:


> Pretty cheap. Hard to pull the trigger without hearing folks' experience with that particular knock off. After $36 shipping it's about what the one I'm looking at costs (if you add $80 for a bulb on your's).
> http://growershouse.com/ceramic-mh-315w-wing-reflector-package


nice thanks i have seen prices from 169 to 400 so i was just wondering i am only grownig for my self using t8ho and i can get great results with little money spent on electric but i am looking into making anther room with this type of light to see what happens


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 20, 2017)

woodsyn2o said:


> what do ya think about this price 169.36 http://www.horticulturesource.com/product_info.php?products_id=25343&gclid=CJ-WtoaYp9MCFcS3wAod26EE5A


Low frequency ballasts will drive the lamp, but it takes low frequency SQUARE WAVE ballasts to actually get the full benefits of performance and efficiency from them.

The cheap knockoffs aren't square wave.


----------



## gr865 (Apr 20, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Trellised vertical grows may increase perceived square footage in an area but I say perceived because my plants grow under horizontal lamps but are thickly budded from top to bottom almost to the soil.
> 
> That gives me almost 2 feet or more of flowers under the canopy footprint.
> 
> ...



Can you point me to your journal or post that show your grow, I am interested in your theory and methods? 

GR


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 20, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Can you point me to your journal or post that show your grow, I am interested in your theory and methods?
> 
> GR


Thank you. I don't have a dedicated journal but I have posted many pics and info about my Grow for the last 4 months in this thread. 

My method is simple. I plant and harvest a seed or clone almost every week perpetually. I do this to stay in Michigan plant count and meds on hand (not reasonable). 

I use ocean forest with 20% large perlite added from start to finish. 

I transplant up from 16 oz cups to 1 gallon to final 3 gallon over 5-7 weeks while watering only with un phed well water. Mine is decent with only .3 ec from calcium. It low on mag and it's ph is 8.0. But it is not alkaline enough to change the soil ph. 

I veg to maturity. Better plants. Less stretch and higher and more complex potency. Takes 6 weeks or more usually from seed. 

In flower when the soil is depleted I start with 5 ml pure blend pro grow. And taper it up to 10-15 ml during peak flowering and then taper back down the concentration to the end when I end up back at 5-10 ml. 

I mix a seperate gallon of nutes for each individual plant as they are all different strains and crosses and at different growth stages. 

And I only water when pots are dry 3/4 the way down. Alarmingly light to pick up. 

I also bend plants to promote branching and to keep them ideally at 30" x 30" in mature size. 

Once nutes are needed. I feed with every watering these low doses. 

And I cut when the plants are truly finished and at peak potency. 

I have a room with 2 veg tents and a spare bedroom turned 3 light flower room. 

Here are some pics from last night. 

3x2 propogator tent. 5 2' t-5 tubes 6500k stock. 


3x3 veg tent. 10 2' t-5 tubes 6500k stock. 

Sometimes I need to bend them in veg. 


Flower Room overlap side. 315 LEC Phillips 3100k and 1 600w Hortilux Super HPS. 


Flower Room HPS side. Other 600w Super HPS


I was using a Hortilux Blue Mh in the left air cooled hood but I have gone back to hps here. 

Too much blue spectrum has cost me 20% yield and bids are way too light and fluffy compared to the Super hps grown. 

I finish under the 315. It adds more frost and seems to help with a shorter finish. 

If I start them under the 315 they remain more compact through stretch. 

I am yielding from 16 oz dry to my current record of 24 oz. per month. 

That's about it 

Blue Lemon Thai from feminized seed.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 20, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Low frequency ballasts will drive the lamp, but it takes low frequency SQUARE WAVE ballasts to actually get the full benefits of performance and efficiency from them.
> 
> The cheap knockoffs aren't square wave.


This info you keep repeating is false. Only a square wave ballast will light a new base style 315 ceramic metal halide lamp. 

They are all low frequency square wave ballasts. Can't vouch for quality. 

As far as performance. The Phillips bulbs are 15% or more higher in usable light than all the rest according to growers house testing. 

The ballast all tested the same no growers house branded a Chinese knock off. It was used for the test. 

If I am wrong. Please post proof.


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 20, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> This info you keep repeating is false. Only a square wave ballast will light a new base style 315 ceramic metal halide lamp.
> 
> They are all low frequency square wave ballasts. Can't vouch for quality.
> 
> ...


As usual, you're full of shit. Low frequency ballasts will strike and run CDM/CMH/LEC lamps just fine, otherwise why would my MAGNETIC ballasts work?

Low frequency ballasts are cheap to make, square wave units are more expensive. Any electronics tech will confirm this.

The cheap knockoff makers are counting on people making assumptions like you just did.

Be certain you get a square wave ballast to ensure best performance with these lamps. I've personally seen knockoffs that aren't.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 20, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> As usual, you're full of shit. Low frequency ballasts will strike and run CDM/CMH/LEC lamps just fine, otherwise why would my MAGNETIC ballasts work?
> 
> 
> Low frequency ballasts are cheap to make, square wave units are more expensive. Any electronics tech will confirm this.
> ...


Nice response. You get more clever all the time. 

I have no idea what incorrectly used ballast can strike which bulb. 

The new 315 cmh with the new base not the old mogul base like the 400 and 860 are designed to operate only with a square wave low frequency ballast. 

And it is also designed to be used in an open vertical mount reflector for max usable light. 

There are quite a few brands that are not Phillips that run this particular bulb that this thread is about and they all run the new bulbs just fine. 

The bulbs have vastly different performance like bulbs always have. 

And the only reason the 315 watt bulb can compete with a higher wattage one and have enough gas pressure and heat to supply the better spectrum is the square wave ballast as opposed to the pulsing and peaks of an old style even electronic ballast. 

But I am glad you are warning everyone. I asked to see an example. 

If we are talking about a hundred bucks compared to 400 buyer beware.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Apr 20, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Low frequency ballasts will drive the lamp, but it takes low frequency SQUARE WAVE ballasts to actually get the full benefits of performance and efficiency from them.
> 
> The cheap knockoffs aren't square wave.


and in your experienced opinion, do you think Nanolux would be running a low frequency square wave, or just a low frequency at 50Hz-60Hz


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## ttystikk (Apr 20, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> and in your experienced opinion, do you think Nanolux would be running a low frequency square wave, or just a low frequency at 50Hz-60Hz


I'm not sure; in that specific case, I was looking at the box in the hydro store and nowhere on it were printed the words 'square wave'.

Fire it up. If you take a digital camera pic and there are fat fuzzy lines in the pic, it's not square wave.

Philips ballasts are definitely square wave. No lines.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 20, 2017)

Now you have caused an un needed panic from your mis information @ttystikk 

None of them say square wave. They show it in comparative testing. 

If it runs the major brand 315's it is fine. 

The specs at the end of the description show a low frequency ballast for the proper base. 

You are making up the difference. 

https://www.amazon.com/Nanolux-CMH-315W-Fixture-240V/dp/B0178GTPH2#productDescription_secondary_view_div_1492750401575


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## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 20, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> I'm not sure; in that specific case, I was looking at the box in the hydro store and nowhere on it were printed the words 'square wave'.
> 
> Fire it up. If you take a digital camera pic and there are fat fuzzy lines in the pic, it's not square wave.
> 
> Philips ballasts are definitely square wave. No lines.


Why not admit you don't know? 

No lines in pics from my electronic hps/mh ballasts. Are my high frequency ballasts square wave?

Wow dude?


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 20, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Why not admit you don't know?
> 
> No lines in pics from my electronic hps/mh ballasts. Are my high frequency ballasts square wave?
> 
> Wow dude?


Standard electronic ballasts run at high frequencies, and they won't operate these lamps. The high frequency won't show up as fat lines on a digital camera. Different critter entirely.

Square wave output is different than and independent of frequency. Again, any electronics tech knows that.

There were two low frequency square wave 1000W ballasts I'm aware of; Hortilux discontinued theirs, the Platinum, and Bad Ass Ballasts discontinued theirs. Both of those were true 1000W low frequency square wave units and indeed they DID operate the Philips 860W CDM lamp, and very well too. I know, I ran two of them.

Wow dude. Do you bother to read or just run your Yap? Don't answer; I already know.


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 20, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Now you have caused an un needed panic from your mis information @ttystikk
> 
> None of them say square wave. They show it in comparative testing.
> 
> ...


I've heard that the cheap knockoff 315W units often employ low frequency ballasts that are NOT square wave. Whether Nanolux is one of them I don't know. I said what I knew; that the box doesn't say square wave on it.

But you just go right on babbling...


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## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 21, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Standard electronic ballasts run at high frequencies, and they won't operate these lamps. The high frequency won't show up as fat lines on a digital camera. Different critter entirely.
> 
> Square wave output is different than and independent of frequency. Again, any electronics tech knows that.
> 
> ...


Like I asked in my first response. Show proof of this non square wave ballast that operates at low frequency and runs 315 cmh bulbs and I will concede. 

I looked up a bunch and linked the well known nanolux to show the specs. 

Since any tech would know. Let's see any listing that proves you are correct.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 21, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> I've heard that the cheap knockoff 315W units often employ low frequency ballasts that are NOT square wave. Whether Nanolux is one of them I don't know. I said what I knew; that the box doesn't say square wave on it.
> 
> But you just go right on babbling...


Now you have just heard. But in your other post you said you have personally seen them. 

They are one and the same. I was trying to help clear your mis information up for people so they can make a good decision. 

the nanolux is the least expensive good option I know of. But there are branded and unbranded cheaper ones. 

I stick with sun system because they designed their reflectors with Phillips. And I have a bunch of galaxy ballasts that are good for years so I tried that one. The all in one units use Phillips ballasts. They have a step down transformer for 110v and cost even more. 

Any research will show all the cmh ballasts run the bulbs to spec. Their is only one to copy. 

Growers house sells tons of Prism. Theirs is a mass produced cheap Chinese ballast. Mine costs 50 more for the name I guess. Solid state components could be better. Or not. 

And the nanolux is etl listed. 

You have not researched or have any experience with these bulbs. 

You said you use the old mag driven 860's 

Those are old tech.


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## ttystikk (Apr 21, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Now you have just heard. But in your other post you said you have personally seen them.
> 
> They are one and the same. I was trying to help clear your mis information up for people so they can make a good decision.
> 
> ...


Now you're contradicting yourself. I was specific; I read the Nanolux box and didn't see where it said 'square wave'. I was clear that I didn't actually buy or run the unit. I did not say the Nanolux was a cheap knockoff, either.

I haven't seen every iteration on the market, but people I deem credible have told me that not all electronic ballast 315W systems are actually square wave, it seems to be one place the cheap knockoff vendors cut corners.

And your assumptions are making you look like an ass, not that you need any help;

I bought a dozen 315W CMH bare kits with lamp and Philips ballast, wired them up and ran them myself. My ballasts were 200-277V only, they would not work on 120V by themselves. I've done the research and the first hand testing.

Finally, the tech in 315W CMH lamps and 860W CDM lamps is EXACTLY THE SAME. The efficiency difference is ENTIRELY the result of the square wave driver. That's why I mentioned my use of the 'Bad Ass' LFSW 1kW ballasts. Philips said so themselves in their white papers.

You're talking out your arse again. Learn to bloody read.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 21, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Now you're contradicting yourself. I was specific; I read the Nanolux box and didn't see where it said 'square wave'. I was clear that I didn't actually buy or run the unit. I did not say the Nanolux was a cheap knockoff, either.
> 
> I haven't seen every iteration on the market, but people I deem credible have told me that not all electronic ballast 315W systems are actually square wave, it seems to be one place the cheap knockoff vendors cut corners.
> 
> ...


I quoted what you said. The rest is basically what I said. And your word of credible proof is meaningless. We prefer solid proof to look at here. 

The gasses are different. Therefore the tech is different. And the base is different for technical reasons that don't exist on your old tech bulbs. 

I made reasonable posts and can post cheaper setups with the same ballad specs as nanolux. 

All I said is that there is only one ballast type made for these new lamps. And of the price is not near the standard pricing buyer beware. 

You state only opinion and hearsay and call it experience. 

I just shopped all year for mine. I read and understand plenty. I have even posted all the university and commercial Grow research and results and comparisons all over this thread. 

Just concede when you don't know what you are talking about. You do this all day with cobs and boards too. And your odd overblown vert. 

People are spending money and asking for honest experience. You steer with incorrect info. 

But I am sure you will pretend to get away with twisting words around to make a point you don't really know. 

I was really trying to help. You self proclaimed experts make that very difficult here. 

Now go ahead and get the last words in ttyy. posting means a lot more to you than it does to me.


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## thccbdhealth (Apr 21, 2017)

No it doesnt say square wave on the box or in there pamphlet about the ballast.
it is illuminating a 3100k philips cmh bulb.
just wanting to know.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 21, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> No it doesnt say square wave on the box or in there pamphlet about the ballast.
> it is illuminating a 3100k philips cmh bulb.
> just wanting to know.


You're fine. The ballast is fine. There is no low frequency ballast without a square wave. The low frequency powers more steadily. That's why the bulb can run hotter and under higher pressure and requires the new ballasts and the new base. 

An old hid high frequency ballast has a peaky wave and it takes more wattage to get the same amount of usable light because of the sharp stutter of peaks and valleys in the electrical current to the bulb. 

I hope this makes sense without a graph. 

I did not mean to get into a huge stupid argument. I was really trying to answer your question before his mis information caused this confusion. 

Good luck with your grow.


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 21, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> No it doesnt say square wave on the box or in there pamphlet about the ballast.
> it is illuminating a 3100k philips cmh bulb.
> just wanting to know.


Take a pic in its light with a digital camera. If it has dark stripes, you may not have a square wave ballast.

I had the dark stripes with magnetic ballast because it's a standard sine wave output. The BadAss ballasts and the Philips 210/315W ballasts did not exhibit this phenomenon.


----------



## A guy (Apr 21, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> No it doesnt say square wave on the box or in there pamphlet about the ballast.
> it is illuminating a 3100k philips cmh bulb.
> just wanting to know.


Just email or call the company. I'll bet they'd get you the answer within a day.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 22, 2017)

Hey I got an email with an enhanced pic of mine from CH9 seeds today. 

It belongs here. The plant is a Blue Lemon Thai that was the first in my room finished 2 weeks under the new Sun Systems remote reflector and Galaxy ballast driving the Phillips 315w 3100k bulb.


----------



## A guy (Apr 22, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Hey I got an email with an enhanced pic of mine from CH9 seeds today.
> 
> It belongs here. The plant is a Blue Lemon Thai that was the first in my room finished 2 weeks under the new Sun Systems remote reflector and Galaxy ballast driving the Phillips 315w 3100k bulb.
> 
> View attachment 3929067


That's a beauty. Let's see the perimeter.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 22, 2017)

A guy said:


> That's a beauty. Let's see the perimeter.


Thank you and I'm sorry but Im not sure what you mean. I don't have a pic around that photo handy. It is from late last year. 

I have like February through present in my phone.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 22, 2017)

Hey @A guy 

Here is a pic with all three different bulbs going. I have since replaced the 600 blue with a Super hps. The pic above was grown with 2 hps and 1 315cmh. 

 

That SS 315 on the right falls in intensity and coverage right in between the 600w Super hps and the 600w Blue MH. 

I would put it equal to the 600 hps but only at about 2.5' x 2.5'

The 600w Hortilux Blue does not have the intensity I need for flowering bushes. It does however promote incredible foliage and branch growth. 

It would be great for big veg. Or I would like 2 to 1 hps to mh if no cmh. (Too many letters there. Lol)

I will go even. Hps to cmh in my next room. 2 and 2 in my basement likely without the glass in the blockbuster reflectors. And a bigger exhaust fan.


----------



## A guy (Apr 22, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Hey @A guy
> 
> Here is a pic with all three different bulbs going. I have since replaced the 600 blue with a Super hps. The pic above was grown with 2 hps and 1 315cmh.
> 
> ...


Haha, sorry. I was a few sheets to the wind last night when I wrote that. I was curious what the perimeter (outer area of light) looks like, in terms of bud development. You know, given that the buds under the light will always look great. Your assessment of a 2.5' x 2.5' strong footprint makes sense and kinda answers my question anyway. Lookin' good!


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 22, 2017)

A guy said:


> Haha, sorry. I was a few sheets to the wind last night when I wrote that. I was curious what the perimeter (outer area of light) looks like, in terms of bud development. You know, given that the buds under the light will always look great. Your assessment of a 2.5' x 2.5' strong footprint makes sense and kinda answers my question anyway. Lookin' good!


I see. Lol. 

With the 3 lights overlapping there is plenty of light everywhere so you won't see any plants lacking any light 

I also rotate and move plants around for even growth.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Apr 23, 2017)

Im wondering about riu etiquette.
I have a 315 3100k Philips bulb in a Nanolux Technology fixture.
Illuminating a 4x4.
I also have a vegg and propagation cabinet that the interiour dimensions are 16"deep x 32"wide x 54" tall
In the cabinet i currently have an Apollo horticulture 300w Burple led, 100 epistar diodes.
I also have a 10" x 20" hard bottomed humidity dome that is 7" tall with a sunblaster 16w 6400k cfl tube.
the humidity dome sits on top of the cabinet when in use.

Im wondering if i should make posts regarding my grow, with a few pictures in this forum, or start another thread or learn how to start a grow jornal.
I dont feel i have enough knowledge behind me to put together a grow gornal comparable to most on here.
Im currently useing tap water that has sat out in open 20liter water jugs for a minimum of 24 hours, usually not less then 48.
I have thought about a under the counter R.O. machine however, right now im wondering if ill also be needing to grab another ac. 
I do have a wall mounted ac down the hall from my room, however im wondering about a portable ac and dehimidifier combo to place directly in the room that contains the tent.
Cooler is always better right, right now my temps climb to a high of 28degrees Celsius, usally at 25.5 celcius without my wall mount ac running, spring like conditions.
I'll also be looking to grab a 10' or 15' ballast to fixture cord, thus aĺlowing me to remove the ballast from within the tent.
when i shoot my infored thermometer at the ballast it reads a 41degrees Celsius.
so removing that shall make a difference over the 12 hours.


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## ttystikk (Apr 23, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Im wondering about riu etiquette.
> I have a 315 3100k Philips bulb in a Nanolux Technology fixture.
> Illuminating a 4x4.
> I also have a vegg and propagation cabinet that the interiour dimensions are 16"deep x 32"wide x 54" tall
> ...


Start your own journal and post the link to it here. That way interested people can follow you, like me!

Don't feel badly about a journal with mistakes. They tend to be very instructive to those who follow your footsteps.


----------



## Bad Karma (Apr 28, 2017)

I just found out, the hard way, that the Galaxy ballast does NOT automatically restart after a power outage. You have to unplug it, and plug it back in, manually. That is a major design flaw, major.

I woke up to my clocks blinking today, which told me there had been a power outage, while I slept. The tent with the T5's was uneffected. The tent with the Hydrofarm Phantom CMH was fine, as it will automatically restrike after 20-30 minutes, if there's an outage.
The tent with the remote SunSystem LEC hood, and Galaxy ballast, was completely offline. The only light that was on was the little green power light blinking. This is totally unacceptable. The other two SunSystem LEC'S units I've owned both automatically restruck after an outage.

Now I'm going to have sell the SunSystem/Galaxy bundle off asap and buy another Hydrofarm Phantom CMH. God damn it.

*EDIT: Can anyone with a Prism ballast confirm if they automatically restrike after a power failure?*


----------



## pinner420 (Apr 28, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I just found out, the hard way, that the Galaxy ballast does NOT automatically restart after a power outage. You have to unplug it, and plug it back in, manually. That is a major design flaw, major.
> 
> I woke up to my clocks blinking today, which told me there had been a power outage, while I slept. The tent with the T5's was uneffected. The tent with the Hydrofarm Phantom CMH was fine, as it will automatically restrike after 20-30 minutes, if there's an outage.
> The tent with the remote SunSystem LEC hood, and Galaxy ballast, was completely offline. The only light that was on was the little green power light blinking. This is totally unacceptable. The other two SunSystem LEC'S units I've owned both automatically restruck after an outage.
> ...


All the lessons in this game cost big bucks... i was at the shop today a dude picked up a pallet of nexgen 315s with auto dimmerz.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 28, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I just found out, the hard way, that the Galaxy ballast does NOT automatically restart after a power outage. You have to unplug it, and plug it back in, manually. That is a major design flaw, major.
> 
> I woke up to my clocks blinking today, which told me there had been a power outage, while I slept. The tent with the T5's was uneffected. The tent with the Hydrofarm Phantom CMH was fine, as it will automatically restrike after 20-30 minutes, if there's an outage.
> The tent with the remote SunSystem LEC hood, and Galaxy ballast, was completely offline. The only light that was on was the little green power light blinking. This is totally unacceptable. The other two SunSystem LEC'S units I've owned both automatically restruck after an outage.
> ...


Mine come back on every time. 

They did on an analog titan timer. And now on a digital titan controller. 

Three years perfect operation for 2 of them. 

I think the manual said the flashing green light is a warning. Blown fuse?


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## Bad Karma (Apr 28, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Mine come back on every time.
> 
> They did on an analog titan timer. And now on a digital titan controller.
> 
> ...


I double checked the instruction manual, the blinking was to indicate the lamp went into "protection mode" because of the power outage, but the only way to get it out of that mode is to unplug the lamp, and plug it back in again. There is no mention of the ballast being able to auto restrike in the manual.

I've emailed GrowersHouse.com, where I got the ballast from, to see what their take on it is.


----------



## Growdict (Apr 28, 2017)

Mine needs to be off for at least 15 minutes. If the power only goes out for one minute. Then i know i have to physically restart it. Sunsystem unit


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## JDMase (Apr 28, 2017)

I too had a power cut a few nights ago, my maxibright CMH ballast turned back on the first time, the outages were literally seconds but sporadic through the night and the times after that it failed to re strike and I had to unplug and plug back in. Was a worry to me also that it didn't reatrike every time.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 28, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I double checked the instruction manual, the blinking was to indicate the lamp went into "protection mode" because of the power outage, but the only way to get it out of that mode is to unplug the lamp, and plug it back in again. There is no mention of the ballast being able to auto restrike in the manual.
> 
> I've emailed GrowersHouse.com, where I got the ballast from, to see what their take on it is.



What model is it. Age?

And have a 3 year old 1000/600/400/overdrive green brick shaped with cooling fan. I think they later called it the "classic"

And an almost 3 year old 600/400 grow amp. 

Both select a watt models.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 28, 2017)

Growdict said:


> Mine needs to be off for at least 15 minutes. If the power only goes out for one minute. Then i know i have to physically restart it. Sunsystem unit


I have only experienced for sure quick surge type skips in power and longer outages than 15 minutes. Both were running after but the analog timer needed reset. (Glad this came up. Need to remedy that.)

And once a short outage but I thought it was a breaker at the time. Maybe what you and @Bad Karma have just stated was the cause. 

As usual. Great heads up guys!

I will be tuned in for answes. Thanks. I plan to be away more his summer and this is a serious issue. 

And I forgot to mention my galaxy LEC dimmable ballast and am so high I just realized that is the ballast we are talking about. Duh!

But my hid ballasts likely react the same way. To protect the bulb. It contradicts our need for re strike. Hot re strike usually limits bulb life as far as I know. But nothing fatal usually.


----------



## JDMase (Apr 29, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I have only experienced for sure quick surge type skips in power and longer outages than 15 minutes. Both were running after but the analog timer needed reset. (Glad this came up. Need to remedy that.)
> 
> And once a short outage but I thought it was a breaker at the time. Maybe what you and @Bad Karma have just stated was the cause.
> 
> ...


With mine the analog timer doesn't work when the power goes out, it messes up the timings, could this have been a factor too? I also have a 15minute cool down time but mine also failed to re strike the 2nd and 3rd time until I did the old "turn it off and on again IT guy thing"


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 29, 2017)

CDM/CMH/LEC lamps are all pretty sensitive to hot restrike issues, in my experience. They need plenty of time to cool before they can be cycled. This is why I don't recommend them to those who live in areas with dirty power issues.

HPS is better, LED are pretty much immune.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 29, 2017)

JDMase said:


> With mine the analog timer doesn't work when the power goes out, it messes up the timings, could this have been a factor too? I also have a 15minute cool down time but mine also failed to re strike the 2nd and 3rd time until I did the old "turn it off and on again IT guy thing"


No. I only mentioned it to remove the variable. 

Seems the galaxy ballasts regardless of type may not testeike properly with a short power outage. Maybe because of the soft start system. 

I only noticed this once though and it could have been the Grow room lights breaker. 

I am waiting to see what sunlight supply says back. 

But I don't know if a 15 minute cool down time. Like I said all 3 ballasts tried to re fire and eventually did by themselves after a few minute failure. 

And a long failure too. So we will see.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 29, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> CDM/CMH/LEC lamps are all pretty sensitive to hot restrike issues, in my experience. They need plenty of time to cool before they can be cycled. This is why I don't recommend them to those who live in areas with dirty power issues.
> 
> HPS is better, LED are pretty much immune.


Mine re strikes fine immediately. It even says it recommends 20 minutes to cool til it breaks in. Because the ballast will re fire it immediately and it is not good for the bulb at first. No other warnings exist. 

Your experience seems different than the facts as usual. 

I still can't find any new based bulb cmh 315 ballast that is not "square wave" like you say either. All low frequency ballasts are. The wave is what low frequency puts out. but you are sure you are right as usual and telling people the false info. 

Please keep your mis-information to your own convoluted thread. This is not a fucking game to us.


----------



## Growdict (Apr 29, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> What model is it. Age?
> 
> And have a 3 year old 1000/600/400/overdrive green brick shaped with cooling fan. I think they later called it the "classic"
> 
> ...


Mine is the all in one sunsystem hood unit with transformer to 110v. About 15 months since purchase. It cannot restrike unless i cool it down. If i need to turn off th light for some reason, it needs to stay off 10-15 min


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## gr865 (Apr 29, 2017)

After an accidental, decent last grow, two plants,15+ zips, and decent quality, am back with my original plan for last fall. Will be doing a 5 plant vertical grow with coco, screens, and stacked 315W CMH (3100 K) and drip irrigation.

Grow area - 4x4x6’7” Gorilla tent
Lights – 2 x Nanolux 315W CMH NA
Screens - 21”x 40” Overall working height is 54” (137 cm)
Pots– Two gallon Smart Pots
Medium - Straight Coco
Nutes – Canna Coco A&B, Rhizotonic, Cannazym, Boost and KoolBloom.
Number of plants – 5
Strain – Barneys Farm G13 Haze (4), and Critical Kush (1)

The grow:

Seedlings should be replanted into the two gallon smart pots within a week, one of the G13's is behind by about 6 day or so.


The drip irrigation is a 1/2" setup fed by a 3/4" line that originates in a separate room, from a 10 gal primary rez and a secondary 14 gal rez that recirculates the rez's and keep the primary filled. The manifold is 8 stations, but will plug 3 stations. It will have equal length 1/4" feed lines that I am considering attaching a 1/4" cross that will allow three lines to feed each plant. Each main feed line will have a quick disconnect so I can move the plants in and out of the tent as needed to work on them. Will post pics soon of this setup.


I used one of the 315W last grow along with a 400W LED, both hung slightly tilted toward the two plants.
Now this run will be the first time I have run 2 - 315's in a vert grow. I am truly impressed with the 315W for how it responded last grow. Both ballast are outside the tent, have plenty of air movement so I am not that concerned with heat issues, do have extra AC in the small room I am extracting air from, if needed.
Here's a picture of the two fixtures w/o the bulbs.

Will change the height of the lower light stand by removing pvc pipe and replacing with with longer pieces.


I will accept comments, both positive and negative, and suggestion for all you very smart people, with more experience than I.

GR

I am linking this to my Journal.


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## Bad Karma (Apr 29, 2017)

I just heard back from Growers House, and the Galaxy LEC ballast *does not* have an auto restrike feature, in case of a power outage. The quality of SunSystem's products has really fallen off in the last year or so.

I'm still trying to find out if the Prism LEC ballast has an auto restrike feature.
@DemonTrich, aren't you using the Prism ballast with your LEC setup?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 29, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I just heard back from Growers House, and the Galaxy LEC ballast *does not* have an auto restrike feature, in case of a power outage. The quality of SunSystem's products has really fallen off in the last year or so.
> 
> I'm still trying to find out if the Prism LEC ballast has an auto restrike feature.
> @DemonTrich, aren't you using the Prism ballast with your LEC setup?


I am going to guess none have it. The manual says to wait 20-30 minutes for restrike. It could turn back on real hot. 

My titan controller does this automatically for any bulb. And has battery backup for the timer and settings. 

I am going to get a second one for the LEC'.


----------



## Bad Karma (Apr 29, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I am going to guess none have it. The manual says to wait 20-30 minutes for restrike. It could turn back on real hot.
> 
> My titan controller does this automatically for any bulb. And has battery backup for the timer and settings.
> 
> I am going to get a second one for the LEC'.


My Hydrofarm Phantom Ceramic ballast has the auto restrike feature in case of an outage. Both of my previous SunSystem LEC units featured that function, as well. Its a sad day when Hydrofarm products are outclassing SunSystem's.

I'll probably end up getting another Hydrofarm Ceramic Ballast, with a plug adapter, if the Prism LEC ballast is a no go.


----------



## DemonTrich (Apr 29, 2017)

I run 7x prism 315s. I've not had a power failure yet. It does say in the instructions when changing the bulb, the power cord must be removed then plugged back in. Nothing about a power failure.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 29, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> My Hydrofarm Phantom Ceramic ballast has the auto restrike feature in case of an outage. Both of my previous SunSystem LEC units featured that function, as well. Its a sad day when Hydrofarm products are outclassing SunSystem's.
> 
> I'll probably end up getting another Hydrofarm Ceramic Ballast, with a plug adapter, if the Prism LEC ballast is a no go.


Well mine has turned back on after the last outage. Like I said I am not sure if the quick loss tripped a breaker. 

But we are about to get 3 days of lake effect rain and thunderstorms so I may have more info soon.


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## Bad Karma (Apr 29, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> I run 7x prism 315s. I've not had a power failure yet. It does say in the instructions when changing the bulb, the power cord must be removed then plugged back in. Nothing about a power failure.


If they don't mention it in the manual then it doesn't have that feature. Thanks for sharing the info.


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 29, 2017)

Growdict said:


> Mine is the all in one sunsystem hood unit with transformer to 110v. About 15 months since purchase. It cannot restrike unless i cool it down. If i need to turn off th light for some reason, it needs to stay off 10-15 min


That's how it's supposed to work.


----------



## Growdict (Apr 29, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> That's how it's supposed to work.


and it doesnt restrike by itself after a certain amount of time. so if we have a 2 second power failure at midnight, the light will stay off until I check on it the next day at 6pm. not a huge deal unless I am off on holidays with nobody to check on it.


----------



## ttystikk (Apr 29, 2017)

Growdict said:


> and it doesnt restrike by itself after a certain amount of time. so if we have a 2 second power failure at midnight, the light will stay off until I check on it the next day at 6pm. not a huge deal unless I am off on holidays with nobody to check on it.


There's a piece of equipment out there called a delay timer; what it does whenever it detects an outage is delay by a set time, usually use adjustable, before it comes back on.

If you keep having power problems, this device will save your lamp and your grow.


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 2, 2017)

so I'm currently on day 67 of flower, I was thinking is give them 70 Days of light, then lights out for 3 days, and cut on the morning of the 74th day..
I pulled one at 60 days, after sampling a bud off it at day 55, it was the first to start flower.

I tried taking a couple pictures with all 3 of my digital camera's
However, with their zoom's - I'm unable to get any view of the crystals to see if they are clear, milky or amber
the hairs are about 60-75% brown
some new pistols are coming in with pink growth.

5 plants left in a 4x4 under a 315 3100k
spent the first 38 days of flower under a 100 3w Epistar diode Blurple Led.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 2, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> so I'm currently on day 67 of flower, I was thinking is give them 70 Days of light, then lights out for 3 days, and cut on the morning of the 74th day..
> I pulled one at 60 days, after sampling a bud off it at day 55, it was the first to start flower.
> 
> I tried taking a couple pictures with all 3 of my digital camera's
> ...


The have had some luck taking a pic through a 60x loupe. Or just got lucky taking a flash pic from a short distance to avoid glare and then closing in and taking screen shots until it gets too blurry.


----------



## Pig4buzz (May 2, 2017)

Been awhile since posted here. Few pics all under the 315 sun 
Goldenglue platinum gorilla n chronicxnorthernlights


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 2, 2017)

Pig4buzz said:


> View attachment 3935395 View attachment 3935396 View attachment 3935399 Been awhile since posted here. Few pics all under the 315 sun
> Goldenglue platinum gorilla n chronicxnorthernlights


Good to see ya! Nice work there!


----------



## Ray Kudronic (May 3, 2017)

How much does everyone yield on average from a 315?


----------



## Growdict (May 3, 2017)

Range 8-10.5oz so far


----------



## ttystikk (May 4, 2017)

Ray Kudronic said:


> How much does everyone yield on average from a 315?


Bout a pound. Lol


----------



## gr865 (May 4, 2017)

My last two plant grow was with a 315 and a SS400 LED,

420 grams, 15 zips, not bad for and incidental grow, never really figured out how I wanted to do that grow. So, mainly just LST and a little Super Cropping.

GR


----------



## genuity (May 4, 2017)

Yup....bout a #


----------



## Madmungo (May 4, 2017)

Ray Kudronic said:


> How much does everyone yield on average from a 315?


300/330g on average


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 4, 2017)

Ehhh Club 315 Check It Out - Give Me Your Thoughts- Please

http://rollitup.org/t/4x4-315cmh-5-plants-left-flowering-when-to-harvest.939889/#post-13510391


@GroErr @DonTesla @ttystikk @Sire Killem All @Jackal69 @gr865


----------



## gr865 (May 4, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> View attachment 3936552 View attachment 3936554 Ehhh Club 315 Check It Out - Give Me Your Thoughts- Please
> 
> http://rollitup.org/t/4x4-315cmh-5-plants-left-flowering-when-to-harvest.939889/#post-13510391
> 
> ...


Not one of your requested growers, but I would say 50+% cloudy.

GR


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 4, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Not one of your requested growers, but I would say 50+% cloudy.
> 
> GR


ohh yes you are;
so would you say to put them into dark for 3 days after 70 full days of light? cut and harvest on the 74th day?


----------



## gr865 (May 4, 2017)

I know nothing about dark days, have done 24 but no more. I look at the the trichs and when I think the are at the point that they will be after drying, I chop.
I normally will go a week before or after the suggested grow days, all depends on the trichs. I got a Buddy that will not let anything go cloudy and he grow some deep shit. I myself prefer, after cure and strain dependent for no amber and 50+% cloudy, for a sativa dom. For a indica, some amber but mostly cloudy.
Again that is just my preference.

BTW, those are lovely ladies, strain and days in flower?

GR


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 4, 2017)

gr865 said:


> I know nothing about dark days, have done 24 but no more. I look at the the trichs and when I think the are at the point that they will be after drying, I chop.
> I normally will go a week before or after the suggested grow days, all depends on the trichs. I got a Buddy that will not let anything go cloudy and he grow some deep shit. I myself prefer, after cure and strain dependent for no amber and 50+% cloudy, for a sativa dom. For a indica, some amber but mostly cloudy.
> Again that is just my preference.
> 
> ...


When you say his clear trichome stuff is some deep shit could you explain a little more?

I have experimented like most of us and I end up letting every plant go to as close to 100 % cloudy with as little degraded amber as possible for the fullest and best highs. In my opinion of course.


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 4, 2017)

it was some bag seed I got from my local compassion club
I'm not entirely sure, but I believe them to be "Black and Blue" and "Ice Cream"
I had just randomly placed them into a container, without separating them - at that point it time, and after that, they were no longer available.

for my harvest I have a dozen jars to keep each plant to its own.


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 4, 2017)

they are currently on day 69 of Flower
first 38 were under the Blurple Epistar 100count 3w diodes
and for the last 31 days so far, its been the 315 CMH 3100k 

and I was looking for the input of anyone who has a valid opinion.
thue part of the reason I did a grow journal for the last few days.
and not to spam this thread with 16 pictures.

http://rollitup.org/t/4x4-315cmh-5-plants-left-flowering-when-to-harvest.939889/#post-13510391


----------



## gr865 (May 4, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> they are currently on day 69 of Flower
> first 38 were under the Blurple Epistar 100count 3w diodes
> and for the last 31 days so far, its been the 315 CMH 3100k
> 
> ...



Well not sure if it was VALID or not, but I always have an opinion! 
 

GR


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 4, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Well not sure if it was VALID or not, but I always have an opinion!
> 
> 
> GR


ahaha
I was just viewing the pictures in the grow journal I started.
I clicked on the picture and I was able to zoom in.
I am able to see some crystal heads.
most appear to be milky or clear still
Yet I did spot a few amber crystal heads on a few of the buds.

http://rollitup.org/t/4x4-315cmh-5-plants-left-flowering-when-to-harvest.939889/#post-13510391


----------



## gr865 (May 4, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> When you say his clear trichome stuff is some deep shit could you explain a little more?
> 
> I have experimented like most of us and I end up letting every plant go to as close to 100 % cloudy with as little degraded amber as possible for the fullest and best highs. In my opinion of course.


He swears that he gets a lighter more up high by going clear. Now I have seen and smoke a shit load of his grows and usually when it has dried, cured and ready to smoke it is under 50% cloudy. It is just beautiful and his WW, that he has been growing since before dirt, at least 15 + years is just a light, feel good and floaty. I had clone at one point but equipment failure took care of it. Will get another, but right now I am looking to try new strains that will work with my vertical grows.
GR


----------



## ttystikk (May 4, 2017)

gr865 said:


> He swears that he gets a lighter more up high by going clear. Now I have seen and smoke a shit load of his grows and usually when it has dried, cured and ready to smoke it is under 50% cloudy. It is just beautiful and his WW, that he has been growing since before dirt, at least 15 + years is just a light, feel good and floaty. I had clone at one point but equipment failure took care of it. Will get another, but right now I am looking to try new strains that will work with my vertical grows.
> GR


Cut earlier for a more soaring high, later for more couch lock heaviness.


----------



## gr865 (May 4, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Cut earlier for a more soaring high, later for more couch lock heaviness.


I like to be soaring early, then come crashing down at about 9ish, good time for this ol' man.


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 4, 2017)

gr865 said:


> I like to be soaring early, then come crashing down at about 9ish, good time for this ol' man.


I'm looking for pain management and a sleep aid...


----------



## ttystikk (May 4, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> I'm looking for pain management and a sleep aid...


Then wait.


----------



## gr865 (May 5, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> I'm looking for pain management and a sleep aid...


Not sure of your strain but as the Tstick man said, wait, scope the buds and look for no clear, and about 15 to 20% amber. Don't wait until the trichs look hard and white as you can take them beyond the point and that is not a good thing.


----------



## GroErr (May 5, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> View attachment 3936552 View attachment 3936554 Ehhh Club 315 Check It Out - Give Me Your Thoughts- Please
> 
> http://rollitup.org/t/4x4-315cmh-5-plants-left-flowering-when-to-harvest.939889/#post-13510391
> 
> ...


Looking good, I'd give them another week or so, still a lot of clear and white hairs that could mature further...


----------



## gr865 (May 5, 2017)

Question?
I am running in veg under a 240W (SS400 LED veg mode) real watts, and all I have is a 3100K 315W. Will I get better veg out of the 315W?

GR


----------



## Evil-Mobo (May 5, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Question?
> I am running in veg under a 240W (SS400 LED veg mode) real watts, and all I have is a 3100K 315W. Will I get better veg out of the 315W?
> 
> GR


Either is fine what's the Kelivin on the LED?


----------



## gr865 (May 5, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Either is fine what's the Kelivin on the LED?


I have no idea.
I made the switch today to the Nanolux 315W CMH NA. The LED is about 5 to 6 yrs old, used off and on.


----------



## ttystikk (May 5, 2017)

gr865 said:


> I have no idea.
> I made the switch today to the Nanolux 315W CMH NA. The LED is about 5 to 6 yrs old, used off and on.


Was that an old blurple LED? You know, with red n blue lights?


----------



## gr865 (May 5, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Was that an old blurple LED? You know, with red n blue lights?


Yep, it has dual mode, veg which has a lot of white light and bloom which has lots of blues and reds.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (May 5, 2017)

For veg it will be fine but between the two id rather have the cmh. However I am slowly this grow jumping on the led train myself


----------



## ttystikk (May 5, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Yep, it has dual mode, veg which has a lot of white light and bloom which has lots of blues and reds.


LED has come a long way since then...


----------



## ttystikk (May 5, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> For veg it will be fine but between the two id rather have the cmh. However I am slowly this grow jumping on the led train myself


What are you talking about?

I know from personal experience that you have been on the LED bandwagon for quite some time now!


----------



## Evil-Mobo (May 5, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> What are you talking about?
> 
> I know from personal experience that you have been on the LED bandwagon for quite some time now!


This is my first grow with no hid on brother


----------



## ttystikk (May 5, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> This is my first grow with no hid on brother


I thought you ran the ones you sent me?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (May 5, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> I thought you ran the ones you sent me?


Yes but I ran my hps and blue mh in half my gorilla 5x9 at the time

The 5 K cree was in veg and the 3K other half of 5x9


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 6, 2017)

Day 71 of Flower Pictures Posted
"Black and Blue" - 2 plants
"Ice Cream" - 3 Plants

Looking for when to Harvest.
all bud shots
all plants on 3erd watering without fertilizer, just ph down.

http://rollitup.org/t/4x4-315cmh-5-plants-left-flowering-when-to-harvest.939889/



Any Humane Suggestions to Dealing with an apparent problem with Cat Hair?
I'm not sure how it got in the tent, the port on the side of the tent is a mesh.
Maybe ill have to get a furnace filter and tape that over it...


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 9, 2017)

http://rollitup.org/t/4x4-315cmh-5-plants-left-flowering-when-to-harvest.939889/#post-13520016

New Photo's Day 74 of Flower


----------



## Yodaweed (May 10, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Day 71 of Flower Pictures Posted
> "Black and Blue" - 2 plants
> "Ice Cream" - 3 Plants
> 
> ...


Use a filter on your intake system


----------



## Bad Karma (May 10, 2017)

And there goes my Hydrofarm Phantom ceramic ballast, fuck!!! Hopefully Growers House can get this sorted out for me asap. I've only had the unit for 16 months, and it has a 3 year warranty, but you never know. I'm so thankful right now that I didn't flip that tent into flower yet.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 10, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> And there goes my Hydrofarm Phantom ceramic ballast, fuck!!! Hopefully Growers House can get this sorted out for me asap. I've only had the unit for 16 months, and it has a 3 year warranty, but you never know. I'm so thankful right now that I didn't flip that tent into flower yet.


Sorry man. That sucks.


----------



## Bad Karma (May 10, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Sorry man. That sucks.


Thanks man. I walked into the grow room this morning and heard an unfamiliar buzzing in the air. Once I realized it was the ballast, I checked inside the tent, and the light was pulsating from dim to bright. I turned everything off right away. So the ballast has failed and it probably shaved quite a bit of life off of that bulb in the process.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 10, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> Thanks man. I walked into the grow room this morning and heard an unfamiliar buzzing in the air. Once I realized it was the ballast, I checked inside the tent, and the light was pulsating from dim to bright. I turned everything off right away. So the ballast has failed and it probably shaved quite a bit of life off of that bulb in the process.


I have had the cycling from dim to bright but it turned out to be a bad breaker.

Just a thought just in case.....


----------



## Bad Karma (May 10, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I have had the cycling from dim to bright but it turned out to be a bad breaker.
> 
> Just a thought just in case.....


It's definitely the ballast. I've already heard back from Growers House and they want me to send the whole unit back for an exchange. I have to pay to ship it back to them, but I'll get a brand new set up in return, so not a bad deal.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 10, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> It's definitely the ballast. I've already heard back from Growers House and they want me to send the whole unit back for an exchange. I'll having to pay to get it shipped back to them, but I'll get a brand new set up in return, so not a bad deal.


Nice! Glad it has a positive ending.


----------



## Bad Karma (May 10, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Nice! Glad it has a positive ending.


Indeed. A brand new reflector, ballast, and bulb. The new bulb is really the icing on the cake as it saves me from having to buy another one at the end of the year.


----------



## ttystikk (May 10, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> Indeed. A brand new reflector, ballast, and bulb. The new bulb is really the icing on the cake as it saves me from having to buy another one at the end of the year.


You're far from the first one to have trouble with those pieces of crap.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (May 13, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> You're far from the first one to have trouble with those pieces of crap.


what other brand of ballast is better?


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (May 13, 2017)

@Bad Karma @DemonTrich @MichiganMedGrower 
I am using a 4100k bulb for the first time in grow and the growth is very tight almost too tight compared to using the 3100k bulb from start to finish.

Anyone else experiencing this?

How can I upload pictures?


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 13, 2017)

@ilovetoskiatalta 

when your typing your next message, look beside the post reply button, it is "upload a file"


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 13, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> @Bad Karma @DemonTrich @MichiganMedGrower
> I am using a 4100k bulb for the first time in grow and the growth is very tight almost too tight compared to using the 3100k bulb from start to finish.
> 
> Anyone else experiencing this?
> ...


Sorry. I have only used the 3100k and only in flower so far. 

But maybe raise the lamp to promote a bit of stretch?


----------



## ThaMagnificent (May 13, 2017)

I'm using a prism ballast and the phantom hood. The right is the connection from the hood and the left is the ballast. What piece am I missing to connect them?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 13, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> I'm using a prism ballast and the phantom hood. The right is the connection from the hood and the left is the ballast. What piece am I missing to connect them?



Hydrofarm uses a different ballast plug than standard. You need an adapter cord. Available all over the net. 

https://www.google.com/search?q=hydrofarm+ballast+plug&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-us&client=safari


----------



## ttystikk (May 13, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> what other brand of ballast is better?


Philips. They're the ones who originally developed the 315W system and their ballasts are square wave and very reliable. I have a few extras.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (May 14, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Philips. They're the ones who originally developed the 315W system and their ballasts are square wave and very reliable. I have a few extras.


What brand is hydrofarm?
What is square wave?
@ttystikk


----------



## ttystikk (May 14, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> What brand is hydrofarm?
> What is square wave?
> @ttystikk


Low frequency square wave ballasts are the key to the CMH lamp being efficient.

Hydro farm is frankly cheap garbage. Lots of people on RIU have had trouble with their phantom line.


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 14, 2017)

@ttystikk 
Philips. They're the ones who originally developed the 315W system and their ballasts are square wave and very reliable. I have a few extras. [End QUOTE]

Philips ballast's are still only available in 240v correct.
i have a Nanolux 315 fixture and my pictures dont have any lines or distortion appear.


----------



## ttystikk (May 14, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> @ttystikk
> Philips. They're the ones who originally developed the 315W system and their ballasts are square wave and very reliable. I have a few extras. [End QUOTE]
> 
> Philips ballast's are still only available in 240v correct.
> i have a Nanolux 315 fixture and my pictures dont have any lines or distortion appear.


Then your ballast is very likely square wave.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 14, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> @ttystikk
> Philips. They're the ones who originally developed the 315W system and their ballasts are square wave and very reliable. I have a few extras. [End QUOTE]
> 
> Philips ballast's are still only available in 240v correct.
> i have a Nanolux 315 fixture and my pictures dont have any lines or distortion appear.


All 315 cmh bulbs are run on a low frequency ballast. Low frequency is a square wave. 

And sunlight supply has Phillips ballasts in their all in one fixtures and they have one for 110v circuits that uses a step down transformer. 

However. They also now have a galaxy dimmable ballast for the 315's that will work on either circuit and remote reflectors for them. 

The nanolux or any cmh ballast will work fine.

Phillips was tested best bulb for PAR. The ballasts (when working) are all spec' d the same.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 14, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Low frequency square wave ballasts are the key to the CMH lamp being efficient.
> 
> Hydro farm is frankly cheap garbage. Lots of people on RIU have had trouble with their phantom line.


Lol. You keep repeating this asinine statement and confusing people. You really don't know what you're talking about. 

There is no "key" that you have special knowledge of you fucking blowhard!

Low frequency ballasts produce a square wave. They are the same thing. 

The regular digital ballasts produce a high frequency signal that looks like peaks and valleys on a graph. 

We go through this constantly. Do you have a learning disability I should not be making fun of?

Post count is not a measure of competence folks.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 14, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Then your ballast is very likely square wave.


Of course it is "square wave" you moron.


----------



## ttystikk (May 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Of course it is "square wave" you moron.


Derp.

Have a look in the mirror. The moron is the one staring back at you with the stupid look on his face.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 14, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Derp.
> 
> Have a look in the mirror. The moron is the one staring back at you with the stupid look on his face.


Never any actual information or proof offered eh?

You're silly


----------



## ttystikk (May 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Never any actual information or proof offered eh?
> 
> You're silly


A pic with no dark bars is information, but only to those smart enough to know what it means.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 14, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> A pic with no dark bars is information, but only to those smart enough to know what it means.


That is from magnetic ballasts. Pics are clear with high frequency electronic ballasts for years. Or any electronic ballasts now. 

And the ceramic metal halides you ran that used magnetic ballasts are old tech and not made for horticulture. 

No one is going to see your silly old picture lines you goof. 

But you will just keep on posting as if you know better as your ego is much more important to you than the actual information or the work needed to acquire it.


----------



## ttystikk (May 14, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> That is from magnetic ballasts. Pics are clear with high frequency electronic ballasts for years. Or any electronic ballasts now.
> 
> And the ceramic metal halides you ran that used magnetic ballasts are old tech and not made for horticulture.
> 
> ...


You're the only one with an ego problem here.

Keep in mind that CMH lamps won't fire at all on high frequency ballasts.

But I'm sure you knew that.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 14, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> You're the only one with an ego problem here.
> 
> Keep in mind that CMH lamps won't fire at all on high frequency ballasts.
> 
> But I'm sure you knew that.


Yes I already studied all about the technology. But thank you. 

It is only the new designed 315's that use the new ballasts. The old 400's and 860's run on standard magnetic ones. You just keep the silly mis information coming like I said.


----------



## ttystikk (May 15, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Yes I already studied all about the technology. But thank you.
> 
> It is only the new designed 315's that use the new ballasts. The old 400's and 860's run on standard magnetic ones. You just keep the silly mis information coming like I said.


And you're STILL wrong, stupid and arrogant.

It turns out that all the above lamps work great on square wave ballasts. I've personally treated the 860W lamps on them.

But you keep flapping your face.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 15, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> And you're STILL wrong, stupid and arrogant.
> 
> It turns out that all the above lamps work great on square wave ballasts. I've personally treated the 860W lamps on them.
> 
> But you keep flapping your face.


They may look good to your eye. But they aren't designed for it and can't possibly be putting out the correct spectrum or wattage. 

You are now suggesting we run an 860 watt bulb designed for a magnetic ballast on a 315 watt square wave ballast. 

And I am the one who is wrong here?

You are a dangerously incompetent individual. 

Please shut up.


----------



## dangledo (May 15, 2017)

Ladies, you're both beautiful...


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 15, 2017)

Pretty sure I've been told there is a 1000w low frequency to be used with the 860's 
i believe i was told it was a philips ballast aswell.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 15, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Pretty sure I've been told there is a 1000w low frequency to be used with the 860's
> i believe i was told it was a philips ballast aswell.


Well I just searched and found this. 

http://www.thehydrosource.com/advanced-nutrients-baddass-ballast-low-frequency-1000w.html

But it isn't made with any bulb manufacturer or to any particular bulb spec.

And it's from Advanced. Lol. 

The Phillips 315 was made specifically for the square wave ballast. It has higher pressure and temperature than a regular metal halide and the square wave is what allows that. Also the new base was neccesary to stabilize it according to Phillips. 

I am not going to agree or take the advice of a post or hearsay and run bulbs and ballasts not made for each other.


----------



## genuity (May 15, 2017)

I don't get it....just buy ss 315 system...knocks offs suck.

I run my DE 630 on my 1000watt galaxy ballast...
 
They both work just fine,putting out so easy fine flowers..
I will be getting 1 630 ballast,just to see if any difference.


----------



## ttystikk (May 15, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> They may look good to your eye. But they aren't designed for it and can't possibly be putting out the correct spectrum or wattage.
> 
> You are now suggesting we run an 860 watt bulb designed for a magnetic ballast on a 315 watt square wave ballast.
> 
> ...


You continue to insist on misrepresenting what I say and I'm sick of it. The square wave ballast I ran the 860W CDM lamp on was a 1000W Bad Ass ballast.

Worked great!

Try harder not to be a jackass. MUCH harder.


----------



## ttystikk (May 15, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Pretty sure I've been told there is a 1000w low frequency to be used with the 860's
> i believe i was told it was a philips ballast aswell.


I'm aware of only two 1000W square wave ballasts; the BadAss from Advanced Nutrients and the Horti Platinum. Both are now out of production.

Frankly, if people want more efficient lighting I highly recommend they go with LED. Both COB LED and Quantum Boards are far more efficient, don't wear out and put out better spectrum.

They're only more expensive once, and both the spectrum improvement and improved efficiency pay for themselves.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 15, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> You continue to insist on misrepresenting what I say and I'm sick of it. The square wave ballast I ran the 860W CDM lamp on was a 1000W Bad Ass ballast.
> 
> Worked great!
> 
> Try harder not to be a jackass. MUCH harder.


Yeah I found and posted that earlier. I didn't know it existed because it is not spec' for any particular bulb. 

Figures you would be using that mismatched set up. 

I thought I told you to shut up. You are not credible. Please just stop.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 15, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> I'm aware of only two 1000W square wave ballasts; the BadAss from Advanced Nutrients and the Horti Platinum. Both are now out of production.
> 
> Frankly, if people want more efficient lighting I highly recommend they go with LED. Both COB LED and Quantum Boards are far more efficient, don't wear out and put out better spectrum.
> 
> They're only more expensive once, and both the spectrum improvement and improved efficiency pay for themselves.


And there is the cob salesman! I knew it was only a matter of time until you had to say it. 

The ballasts are out of production because they don't have any bulbs made to match with. 

This is Club 315. The university of Utah has proven this bulb to have the best horticultural spectrum. 

you are a goof.


----------



## ttystikk (May 15, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Yeah I found and posted that earlier. I didn't know it existed because it is not spec' for any particular bulb.
> 
> Figures you would be using that mismatched set up.
> 
> I thought I told you to shut up. You are not credible. Please just stop.


You have no authority to tell anyone else here what to do.

Your credibility is lacking; Your very notion of 'mismatched lighting' is itself an indictment of your knowledge base on the subject; you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. Such an assertion fairly screams the fact that you don't know Jack about electronics.

The ballast and lamp combination worked just fine for the simple reason that the specifications of each were compatible. 

I'm not even sure why you keep this shit up, you've already alienated a whole forum full of people.

Maybe the rest of us aren't the problem?


----------



## ttystikk (May 16, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> And there is the cob salesman! I knew it was only a matter of time until you had to say it.
> 
> The ballasts are out of production because they don't have any bulbs made to match with.
> 
> ...


Hmmmm, I recommended LED lighting because of its superior performance. Plenty of data out there to back that up. For the record, I'm not selling any lighting, COB or otherwise. You know this, you've accused me of it before.

Those ballasts are out of production because they were more expensive to manufacture than high frequency digital square wave ballasts and the makers failed to do an effective job of explaining their advantages. If you had any knowledge of electronics you'd know this.

FAIL on the 'no bulbs to match with'. The Hortilux Platinum ballast came with a Hortilux 1000W HPS lamp included as an incentive to buy the more expensive ballast. Dipshit.

The University of Utah may have evaluated the lamp against other HID lamps and if they found it superior I wouldn't argue with their findings. That said, there's no way it's the best light of all, bar none. Your arguments are simplistic, full of holes, unsupported and generally chickenshit.

You are an uneducated halfwit without basic knowledge about the technology.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 16, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> You have no authority to tell anyone else here what to do.
> 
> Your credibility is lacking; Your very notion of 'mismatched lighting' is itself an indictment of your knowledge base on the subject; you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. Such an assertion fairly screams the fact that you don't know Jack about electronics.
> 
> ...


I never said anything about "the rest of us". Or "a whole forum full of people". Just you. You are the fraud and you know it or you would leave this alone. 

My alerts and likes say different. 

But good try looping in the "us" for yourself and your few fans. Does it make your pretend world less lonely?

I have only alienated personally 3 people. One is a rat. One attracts cops and idiots and doesn't listen. And you. 

And you started with me on my first day. And only because I challenged your info with actual university links and it hurt your ego. 

I still have only challenged and asked for proof of any of your assertions. And you just keep spreading mis-informed opinion. 

Post count and years of membership is not earned credibility. 

I don't make claims and assertions with no proof. You never stop.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 16, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Hmmmm, I recommended LED lighting because of its superior performance. Plenty of data out there to back that up. For the record, I'm not selling any lighting, COB or otherwise. You know this, you've accused me of it before.
> 
> Those ballasts are out of production because they were more expensive to manufacture than high frequency digital square wave ballasts and the makers failed to do an effective job of explaining their advantages. If you had any knowledge of electronics you'd know this.
> 
> ...



I am sorry I made you this upset. But I have posted many times the chart showing cmh superiority in spectrum and usable light for the plants against hid. Flourescent. And led. 

Work on your reading comprehension. Then pretend your an electrician or consultant or a seller of commercial lighting like you told everyone when I met you. 

There are also memory excercises you can practice.


----------



## ttystikk (May 16, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I am sorry I made you this upset. But I have posted many times the chart showing cmh superiority in spectrum and usable light for the plants against hid. Flourescent. And led.
> 
> Work on your reading comprehension. Then pretend your an electrician or consultant or a seller of commercial lighting like you told everyone when I met you.
> 
> There are also memory excercises you can practice.


The difference between you and me is that I do research and testing.

In this way I don't need to depend on others, I know what works from first hand experience.

This gives me a thing you lack; 'credibility'.

Cry some more, baby britches.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 16, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> The difference between you and me is that I do research and testing.
> 
> In this way I don't need to depend on others, I know what works from first hand experience.
> 
> ...


I have told you since the beginning. You have to grow healthy plants to test anything. And you have to be able to repeat your results. You do neither. 

And haven't you read the thread your posting on. I have been sharing detailed results here since November. A plant a week to compare.


----------



## ttystikk (May 16, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I have told you since the beginning. You have to grow healthy plants to test anything. And you have to be able to repeat your results. You do neither.
> 
> And haven't you read the thread your posting on. I have been sharing detailed results here since November. A plant a week to compare.


Literally thousands of posts to the contrary.

Think what you want: it's clear facts mean nothing to you.

Good day.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 16, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Literally thousands of posts to the contrary.
> 
> Think what you want: it's clear facts mean nothing to you.
> 
> Good day.


You posted thousands of words. And a couple of pretty unhealthy plant pics toward the end. 

You posted for a long time on another site I frequent and also never showed any plants. Just a lot of egotistical claims with no proof of results ever. 

I have made no claims of anything. I learn. I practice. I show results. Consistent results. 

And I have no agenda but to finish healing Mrs. MMG. 

You are a fraud. Just admit it and move on.


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 16, 2017)

I Stand corrected, it was the badass ballast i was told about, apperently i recalled it wrong.


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 17, 2017)

Day 82 of Flower
My Last two "Ice Cream"
4 Photos of Each Plant

http://rollitup.org/t/4x4-315cmh-5-plants-left-flowering-when-to-harvest.939889/page-2#post-13536272


----------



## Bad Karma (May 18, 2017)

A big thank you to GrowersHouse.com for taking care of me so quickly. I mailed out my defective Phantom ballast, and the bulb it wrecked, last Friday. Now, Wednesday of the following week, I already have my new Phantom II ballast and Phillips bulb.


----------



## SUNDOG (May 18, 2017)

@ michiganmedgrower and ttystikk, there's two plus pages of you two bitching at one another. This is club 315w, not who knows more or who has the bigger cock. I'm sure everyone here wants to see and talk about big frosty buds growen with 315w's so just chill smoke some herb and let's gets this tread back on track.


----------



## genuity (May 18, 2017)

Just veg...


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 18, 2017)

SUNDOG said:


> @ michiganmedgrower and ttystikk, there's two plus pages of you two bitching at one another. This is club 315w, not who knows more or who has the bigger cock. I'm sure everyone here wants to see and talk about big frosty buds growen with 315w's so just chill smoke some herb and let's gets this tread back on track.


I will always correct any mis-information I see here. Too many of us have been steered wrong by internet "experts" like @ttystikk. 

He literally has no idea what he is talking about and never stops telling everyone about it. 

But you are right. It got out of hand.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 18, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> A big thank you to GrowersHouse.com for taking care of me so quickly. I mailed out my defective Phantom ballast, and the bulb it wrecked, last Friday. Now, Wednesday of the following week, I already have my new Phantom II ballast and Phillips bulb.


Glad to hear that but I am having the opposite experience at the moment. Hey sent me the wrong tent almost a month ago and I asked for a return label to simply be mailed out to me as I don't have a printer to print the shipping label and live far from town. 

I finally called and emailed enough and got the label in the mail 2 days ago. They did not return my emails. 

It will be 6 weeks before I see the tent I ordered. 

The zipper has been broke on the old one all this time. Very frustrating. 

And when I asked them to put a rush on my return and I would pay for the new tent and wait for the credit on the old one. 

The manager said no to fast shipping as their "margins" are too tight. 

Not happy with this order this time at all.


----------



## gr865 (May 18, 2017)

Ok, I now have the stacked 315W Vertical grow with screens going. 
4 G13 Haze and 1 Critical Kush.
 
Stacked 315's
 
Circle closed
 
The 315's in the middle of the circle
 
Lights on
 

Temp with lights on 78 degrees, and RH is 49%.

GR


----------



## Bad Karma (May 18, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Glad to hear that but I am having the opposite experience at the moment. Hey sent me the wrong tent almost a month ago and I asked for a return label to simply be mailed out to me as I don't have a printer to print the shipping label and live far from town.
> 
> I finally called and emailed enough and got the label in the mail 2 days ago. They did not return my emails.
> 
> ...


Wow, I'm literally shocked to read this. They've always over performed when I needed any help with a product defect or an order showing up damaged. Like on this most recent issue with my ballast going tits up, they weren't really obligated to give me a new bulb in the deal, but they did anyways.
I hope you get a fully functional new replacement tent asap. I wonder if your email was getting caught in their spam folder or something? They typically email me back with an hour during weekday business hours.


----------



## ttystikk (May 18, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> Wow, I'm literally shocked to read this. They've always over performed when I needed any help with a product defect or an order showing up damaged. Like on this most recent issue with my ballast going tits up, they weren't really obligated to give me a new bulb in the deal, but they did anyways.
> I hope you get a fully functional new replacement tent asap. I wonder if your email was getting caught in their spam folder or something? They typically email me back with an hour during weekday business hours.


I've always had good luck with growers house. The guys know their shit, stand behind the product and when stuff has been damaged in shipping they've been very good about getting it taken care of.


----------



## gr865 (May 18, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> I've always had good luck with growers house. The guys know their shit, stand behind the product and when stuff has been damaged in shipping they've been very good about getting it taken care of.


I have never had any problems with them, they replaced a light two times, paid for returns.

GR


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 18, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> Wow, I'm literally shocked to read this. They've always over performed when I needed any help with a product defect or an order showing up damaged. Like on this most recent issue with my ballast going tits up, they weren't really obligated to give me a new bulb in the deal, but they did anyways.
> I hope you get a fully functional new replacement tent asap. I wonder if your email was getting caught in their spam folder or something? They typically email me back with an hour during weekday business hours.



It's the first problem I have had. But it was the rep that dropped the ball. 

If I had called sooner rather than emailed the same rep back it would have been taken care of. 

Shit happens. Just sharing my recent experience. I want to add that the sale price on the tent was really low. 

I will still use growers house for sure.


----------



## Pig4buzz (May 19, 2017)

Nice fat colas under 315. Learning how to grow lol! 
Chronicxnl n goldenglue


----------



## Javadog (May 22, 2017)

Nice work!


----------



## davidcup (May 23, 2017)

Hello

Im spanish, sorry for me English

How much harvest is possible with 315W LEC? In other forums I have seen harvests of 350-450 gr, It´s true?

Regards from Spain


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 23, 2017)

davidcup said:


> Hello
> 
> Im spanish, sorry for me English
> 
> ...



Yes. With the right grower and the right genetics it is possible.


----------



## davidcup (May 23, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Yes. With the right grower and the right genetics it is possible.


OK, 600W HPS will always produce more harvest than 315W LEC? Same conditions

Thanks you


----------



## gr865 (May 23, 2017)

It is said that the 315's will put out about the same as a 500W HPS, and is a cooler lamp, very bright.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 23, 2017)

davidcup said:


> OK, 600W HPS will always produce more harvest than 315W LEC? Same conditions
> 
> Thanks you


I didn't say it wouldn't. I have gotten 24 oz dry nugs under my 600. I like the 315 as a supplemental lamp. 

I actually just pulled it from the flower room to try it in veg.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 23, 2017)

gr865 said:


> It is said that the 315's will put out about the same as a 500W HPS, and is a cooler lamp, very bright.


I am going to say closer to 400. We have to admit there is much hype.


----------



## gr865 (May 23, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I am going to say closer to 400. We have to admit there is much hype.


And where did you come up with that number?
I ran a 400W HPS and there is no comparison.
Please show me data!
GR


----------



## ttystikk (May 23, 2017)

gr865 said:


> And where did you come up with that number?
> I ran a 400W HPS and there is no comparison.
> Please show me data!
> GR


From me, among other places.


----------



## Javadog (May 23, 2017)

If I had to lean....it would be toward the 500 side here....I just am not seeing a 33% drop off.

I think that the HPS might penetrate deeper a bit too, but the terps are good, so I am happy. :0)

(but I never weigh yields, so use your own findings)


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 23, 2017)

gr865 said:


> And where did you come up with that number?
> I ran a 400W HPS and there is no comparison.
> Please show me data!
> GR


I have been running one right next to a 600w Super hps since last year. And I used a 400 Super in the same reflector as well. 

The number is approximate and my opinion of many comparisons I have done. 

I run plants at different stages so I don't have an average yield just results from one plant/clone at a time. 

The 400 has a definite 3x3 footprint in my Blockbuster. The 315 has a 2.5 x 2.5 footprint in the SS remote reflector. 

I would compromise by agreeing it could be 450 in intensity and usable plant light. 

It isn't closer to the 600 than the 400 in my experience.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 23, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> From me, among other places.


You have got to be kidding. I have been ignoring and correcting your information since my first night here.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 23, 2017)

Javadog said:


> If I had to lean....it would be toward the 500 side here....I just am not seeing a 33% drop off.
> 
> I think that the HPS might penetrate deeper a bit too, but the terps are good, so I am happy. :0)
> 
> (but I never weigh yields, so use your own findings)


I agreed after my post to 450


----------



## gr865 (May 23, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> You have got to be kidding. I have been ignoring and correcting your information since my first night here.


Ok I am asking you to shut the fuck up on this shit between you and Ty. I don't really give a damn about who said what, I was only looking for info I can use.

I will report you and get you banned, I don't want to have to do that. But this is a information site, not a one on one bitching site.


----------



## gr865 (May 23, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I have been running one right next to a 600w Super hps since last year. And I used a 400 Super in the same reflector as well.
> 
> The number is approximate and my opinion of many comparisons I have done.
> 
> ...


I ask for data, not personal experience. I am not trying to get on your shit, but hey I just did a 15 zip grow with a 315 and a 300+ W LED.
I may not be the best grower in this forum but I do value sound info. 
Thanks for the response.
GR


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 23, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Ok I am asking you to shut the fuck up on this shit between you and Ty. I don't really give a damn about who said what, I was only looking for info I can use.
> 
> I will report you and get you banned, I don't want to have to do that. But this is a information site, not a one on one bitching site.



You're going to report me for the above comment?

Lol. He has been calling me names post after post for days. And he started right away with me when I joined. 

I merely responded to his rediculous assertion about where I learn things. 

I don't see you warning him.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 23, 2017)

gr865 said:


> I ask for data, not personal experience. I am not trying to get on your shit, but hey I just did a 15 zip grow with a 315 and a 300+ W LED.
> I may not be the best grower in this forum but I do value sound info.
> Thanks for the response.
> GR



I can't tell if you appreciate my post or not. 

But for data. I'm pretty sure I could get 12 oz + with any of my seeds and just the 315. Problem is the footprint is small. 

I have done 24 with the 600 hps. In a 3.5 x 3.5 space with mid yielding genetics.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 23, 2017)

@gr865. If you are interested I have posted pics and info continually since last November when I added the sun sustem 315 LEC and a galaxy ballast to the room with my 2 air cooled 600's. 

The thread moves fast so the pages go way back. You can see how the plants growth changes and the increased frost finishing under the LEC. 

I posted all pros and cons I have seen.


----------



## ttystikk (May 23, 2017)

Seriously?


----------



## gr865 (May 23, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> @gr865. If you are interested I have posted pics and info continually since last November when I added the sun sustem 315 LEC and a galaxy ballast to the room with my 2 air cooled 600's.
> 
> The thread moves fast so the pages go way back. You can see how the plants growth changes and the increased frost finishing under the LEC.
> 
> I posted all pros and cons I have seen.


I will have a look. Thanks


----------



## gr865 (May 23, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Seriously?


Ty, get over it man.
What ever you two's bitches are do it in private not here.
Thanks.


----------



## gr865 (May 23, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> @gr865. If you are interested I have posted pics and info continually since last November when I added the sun sustem 315 LEC and a galaxy ballast to the room with my 2 air cooled 600's.
> 
> The thread moves fast so the pages go way back. You can see how the plants growth changes and the increased frost finishing under the LEC.
> 
> I posted all pros and cons I have seen.


Where is your post?
Journal?


----------



## ttystikk (May 23, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Ty, get over it man.
> What ever you two's bitches are do it in private not here.
> Thanks.


He can start a fight in an empty room. 

Don't lay his issues at my feet.

I call it like I see it.

Been doing it for years here.

I'm just gonna keep doing what I do.


----------



## gr865 (May 23, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> He can start a fight in an empty room.
> 
> Don't lay his issues at my feet.
> 
> ...


You know what, I am almost 70 years old, and I gave up petty bullshit long ago. 
You both could learn to ignore, and your blood pressures will be better for it.

Me I am just going to try and grow the best medicine I can, with the help of all you knowledgeable people on here. Gonna post my progress, my successes, my fuckup's, and my failures, of which I have had one or more. I love taking pics of my ladies, both the ones in the tent and the one's in my bed. I will post the one's from the tent, LOL.

All I ask for is info that has some sound science behind it.
You have shown me that you have done the work and provide the info in your threads or journals.
I have not read all of Med's stuff as I believe it is mingled in this thread, that would need some searching. He could start a thread and put his stuff there so it is easier to find.

Sorry not meaning to preach, but I am getting to old for this bull shit, LOL


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 23, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Where is your post?
> Journal?



It's all just posted here but starting say December were the first plants finished under it. 

I think if you go to my profile and look for content you can see posts and the preview text and search back. 

Here are some pics. 

OG Kush x Trainwreck. 

Finished 2 weeks under 315 and rotated evenly around before that. 


The potency increase from the uv was really noticeable and the flavor and smell much stronger than the Hortilux Super HPS alone. 


First purple leaves I had seen on these strains. 
 

Each reflector is the direct down type. Pretty clear where each lights footprint is. All the plants seem to flourish in the overlap 

The colors were way more common and the plants looked more natural with the fuller spectrum in there. 

But having the blue mh and the LEC and only1 hps made buds too leafy and cut my yield almost 30% so I had gone back to 2 600 hps and 1 315 LEC for best results with my gear. 

 


I am putting the LEC in a 3x3 to veg with now and using a Hortilux 600 Blue and Super HPS to compare for the summer. 

I harvest about a plant per week so I can really see where things are improving or not. And I feed and water each plant individually as needed for the best results. 

Here is the summer set up.

 
 
This set up is nice too. I like working under the more natural looking light but I can see if I am using hid I will be using hps primarily. I feel I would need 3 315's to every 2 600's. 4 to be sure and yield higher. 

But I have limited space. And I already have all this stuff. Lol.


----------



## Yodaweed (May 23, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> It's all just posted here but starting say December were the first plants finished under it.
> 
> I think if you go to my profile and look for content you can see posts and the preview text and search back.
> 
> ...


Which bulb do you prefer to use for flowering or do you use both? Great looking plants by the way, happy toking


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 23, 2017)

gr865 said:


> You know what, I am almost 70 years old, and I gave up petty bullshit long ago.
> You both could learn to ignore, and your blood pressures will be better for it.
> 
> Me I am just going to try and grow the best medicine I can, with the help of all you knowledgeable people on here. Gonna post my progress, my successes, my fuckup's, and my failures, of which I have had one or more. I love taking pics of my ladies, both the ones in the tent and the one's in my bed. I will post the one's from the tent, LOL.
> ...



I look forward to seeing your pics.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 23, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> Which bulb do you prefer to use for flowering or do you use both? Great looking plants by the way, happy toking


Thanks man 

I like the mix but when I build in the basement I will use the 2 aircooled hoods with 600 Super hps and the 315 LEC right in between all in a 4'x8' footprint with plenty of spectrum overlap. 

I will report in a month or so when I see how the present plants flower up with the mixed pair. 

I really like the blue but it seems to make plants grow even more leaves and side branches for me than even the 315. 

I keep seeing 1000 de hps and a 315 over tables in large Grows so I will sort of copy the big boys but of course produce only 1 plant at a time still and use a lot of stands. Lol.


----------



## Yodaweed (May 23, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Thanks man
> 
> I like the mix but when I build in the basement I will use the 2 aircooled hoods with 600 Super hps and the 315 LEC right in between all in a 4'x8' footprint with plenty of spectrum overlap.
> 
> ...


DE lights are bad ass, but for my setup i don't have the ceilings to work with to have that type of light intensity, i think you need to have about 10-12 foot ceilings for optimal use.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 23, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> DE lights are bad ass, but for my setup i don't have the ceilings to work with to have that type of light intensity, i think you need to have about 10-12 foot ceilings for optimal use.


My current ceiling is under 7' and the basement beams are at 6' 5".

But my setup will have 2 "ends" and hps? Eh??

Here was my solution for the little spare bedroom but I hit my head on that top hat reflector so many times the first few days and I can't seem to keep the range I need when it really gets hot without dedicated air conditioning or bigger fans so this is my chance to veg with the 3100k Phillips bulb I have and then I will get the 4200k to compare.

 


I love this shit!


----------



## JDMase (May 24, 2017)

gr865 said:


> You know what, I am almost 70 years old, and I gave up petty bullshit long ago.
> You both could learn to ignore, and your blood pressures will be better for it.
> 
> Me I am just going to try and grow the best medicine I can, with the help of all you knowledgeable people on here. Gonna post my progress, my successes, my fuckup's, and my failures, of which I have had one or more. I love taking pics of my ladies, both the ones in the tent and the one's in my bed. I will post the one's from the tent, LOL.
> ...


Gr865 is the realest


----------



## gr865 (May 24, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> It's all just posted here but starting say December were the first plants finished under it.
> 
> I think if you go to my profile and look for content you can see posts and the preview text and search back.
> 
> ...



Is that an MH in the second to the last pic?

GR


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 24, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Is that an MH in the second to the last pic?
> 
> GR


In those pics it is a Hortilux 600w Blue MH and a Hortilux 600w Super HPS in the glass enclosed air cooled reflectors left to right. They are 6" Sunlight Supply Blockbuster Gen 3. Run by galaxy ballasts. 

And the third lamp when present is a Sun System remote reflector 315 LEC 3100k Phillips bulb run by a galaxy ballast.


----------



## genuity (May 24, 2017)

Yeah,1000 watt DE with a few 315 is a very nice setup...
Them 600 blues are very good for veg,if you like lots of branching on the plants,I use it in my flower room the last few weeks of 12/12..it's a very "soft" light for flowering..imo.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 24, 2017)

genuity said:


> Yeah,1000 watt DE with a few 315 is a very nice setup...
> Them 600 blues are very good for veg,if you like lots of branching on the plants,I use it in my flower room the last few weeks of 12/12..it's a very "soft" light for flowering..imo.


Yeah I don't like the blue for flowering alone I don't think. 

I am about to try the cmh for veg. Seems perfect for a 3x3 tent. I used to veg under a 400 blue but that bulb is a bit different. Quite intense in the 3x3.


----------



## gr865 (May 25, 2017)

Day 32 from sprout

Tied back and leaves tucked behind screen.

The Group

Back in the tent and ready

View from the top.


GR


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 26, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Day 32 from sprout
> 
> Tied back and leaves tucked behind screen.
> 
> ...



Nice setup. Lookin' good


----------



## city hunter (May 26, 2017)

My first grow, and I went with a phantom II 315w and a phillips master 3100k. The plants are doing awesome and I barely understand what I am doing. Learning quick though  I love this light


----------



## Yodaweed (May 26, 2017)

city hunter said:


> My first grow, and I went with a phantom II 315w and a phillips master 3100k. The plants are doing awesome and I barely understand what I am doing. Learning quick though  I love this light


Sweet, good luck and happy growing, what strains you running?


----------



## MMJ Dreaming 99 (May 27, 2017)

Will two - 315 watts = a 1000 watt HPS? How much cooler versus HPS?


----------



## ttystikk (May 27, 2017)

MMJ Dreaming 99 said:


> Will two - 315 watts = a 1000 watt HPS? How much cooler versus HPS?


About a third cooler, perhaps half.


----------



## Yodaweed (May 27, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> About a third cooler, perhaps half.


lol this kid still doesn't understand basic physics. Always giving advice about stuff he is clueless about.


MMJ Dreaming 99 said:


> Will two - 315 watts = a 1000 watt HPS? How much cooler versus HPS?


Two 315W CMH will produce 630w of heat, which is about 2150 BTU/hr

http://www.rapidtables.com/convert/power/Watt_to_BTU.htm

A 1000w HPS produces about 3412 BTU/hr


----------



## Bad Karma (May 27, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> lol this kid still doesn't understand basic physics. Always giving advice about stuff he is clueless about.
> 
> Two 315W CMH will produce 630w of heat, which is about 2150 BTU/hr
> 
> ...


Double check your math because the numbers you provided prove his point.

2275 is 2/3rds of 3412
2150 is the BTU/hr output from two 315w LEC according to you

That's pretty fucking close.


----------



## gr865 (May 27, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> lol this kid still doesn't understand basic physics. Always giving advice about stuff he is clueless about.
> 
> Two 315W CMH will produce 630w of heat, which is about 2150 BTU/hr
> 
> ...


Isn't that about a third, 63%
I find that my two stacked 315's vertical is only a little bit hotter in the tent than the 400 hps I was running. 
The 400W's temp range was 77 to 81 degrees F
The two 315's temp range is 78 to 82 degrees F
That is the averages of the lamps over a 24 hr period, outside temps have minor effect.


----------



## Yodaweed (May 27, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> Double check your math because the numbers you provided prove his point.
> 
> 2275 is 2/3rds of 3412
> 2150 is the BTU/hr output from two 315w LEC according to you
> ...


He didnt provide numbers he just gave a blanket statement like he always does, he doesn't understand the basic math behind it at all, just randomly guesses, it's his standard operating procedure, just blab out the first thought that comes to his mind with no evidence or sources to cite. That's why he said "perhaps half" cause he didn't know he's just guessing like he does , similar to how he says LEDs are the best ever and nothing can compete but he has zero sources to backup his arguments. When i say something you best believe i got facts to back it up.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 27, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> He didnt provide numbers he just gave a blanket statement like he always does, he doesn't understand the basic math behind it at all, just randomly guesses, it's his standard operating procedure, just blab out the first thought that comes to his mind with no evidence or sources to cite. That's why he said "perhaps half" cause he didn't know he's just guessing like he does , similar to how he says LEDs are the best ever and nothing can compete but he has zero sources to backup his arguments.



He sure always does that and pretends to sound like he did some research. But you are still not taking in to account the efficiency of the lamp. 

More light per watt less heat per watt. It will burn off as one or the other.


----------



## Yodaweed (May 27, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> He sure always does that and pretends to sound like he did some research. But you are still not taking in to account the efficiency of the lamp.
> 
> More light per watt less heat per watt. It will burn off as one or the other.


Nah that's not really how it works, all light produces nearly the same output of heat, 600w of hps = 600w of led = 600w of cmh , read this thread it explains it much better than i can.

https://www.rollitup.org/t/heat-from-1200w-of-1212s-vero-29s-cxm-22-cxb3590-compared-to-2x-600w.936071/


----------



## Bad Karma (May 27, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> He didnt provide numbers he just gave a blanket statement like he always does, he doesn't understand the basic math behind it at all, just randomly guesses, it's his standard operating procedure, just blab out the first thought that comes to his mind with no evidence or sources to cite. That's why he said "perhaps half" cause he didn't know he's just guessing like he does , similar to how he says LEDs are the best ever and nothing can compete but he has zero sources to backup his arguments.


Source cited, or not, he was right. I'm no fan of ttystikk, there's plenty of proof of that in this thread, but he was correct on this occasion. Even a broken watch is right twice a day.


----------



## Yodaweed (May 27, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> Source cited, or not, he was right. I'm no fan of ttystikk, there's plenty of proof of that in this thread, but he was correct on this occasion. Even a broken watch is right twice a day.


I wouldn't rely on him being right ever, but you are very right.


A lion does not turn around when a small dog barks - African proverb


----------



## ttystikk (May 27, 2017)

LOL at all the shit y'all spew about me!

Nice to know I live in your heads like this!

BWAHAHAHA!


----------



## thccbdhealth (May 27, 2017)

Ok do you guys top all plants? Or strain dependent?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 27, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Ok do you guys top all plants? Or strain dependent?


I mostly bend the main stem and tie it down to promote branching without removing anything 

That way the plant never stops growing.


----------



## gr865 (Jun 7, 2017)

Day 2, Monday 6/5, 12/12 Generative Period of 2 to 3 for stretch and bud formation.

Fabulous growth now, drinking a lot. 
The defo I did on Wed. is filled in and we are started flower on Sat. night.
This morning I pull the ladies out of the tent for some pics and a little cleanup of the tray. After putting the plants back into the tent I began a rez empting flush. There was about 12 gallons left in both rez's and I ran the drip till they were empty. Then did a cleaning of both upper and lower rez's, mild clorox solution and a thorough triple rinse. I am very impressed with the EC and pH of the rinsate that passed through they pots and into the catch container, 1.15 EC and 5.69 pH, final reading before dumping .
Nute solution back in the rez's at 1.3 EC and pH of 5.79. 
The ladies are resting now as I am running my lights from 10 PM to 10 AM, may adjust that as summer rears its hot ugly self.
The Harem 
 
The ladies on parade
     
Lining up to get to that wonderful light
    

Now goodnight Ladies!

I do like the stacked 315's, but the plants are growing so fast that last night a few leaves got to close to the lamp. Tied everything back again today and removed a few fans.

GR


----------



## ttystikk (Jun 7, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Day 2, Monday 6/5, 12/12 Generative Period of 2 to 3 for stretch and bud formation.
> 
> Fabulous growth now, drinking a lot.
> The defo I did on Wed. is filled in and we are started flower on Sat. night.
> ...


Looks fantastic!


----------



## JDMase (Jun 12, 2017)

Sorry for the poor pics. This is pretty much the size of my buds throughout my kings kush and black dog. Start of week 5 of flower. Am I crazy but are these not gonna get any bigger? They just don't seem to be packing any size on. Ive had issues throughout with KK but the black dog seemed solid. 

Should I just set my 600w HPS at the top of the tent and blast them with some photons?


----------



## gr865 (Jun 12, 2017)

JDMase said:


> View attachment 3959560
> View attachment 3959561
> 
> Sorry for the poor pics. This is pretty much the size of my buds throughout my kings kush and black dog. Start of week 5 of flower. Am I crazy but are these not gonna get any bigger? They just don't seem to be packing any size on. Ive had issues throughout with KK but the black dog seemed solid.
> ...


Just give them some time, they have stretched put on buds and now they will begin to fatten.
Looks good Bud, 

GR


----------



## Javadog (Jun 12, 2017)

Fattening can happen quite late in the cycle. They look nice. :0)


----------



## JDMase (Jun 12, 2017)

Thanks guys youve put my mind at ease. Too used to fast autos. 

@gr865 @Javadog. 

I was considering buying supplements.. Amino and carbs.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Jun 12, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> Double check your math because the numbers you provided prove his point.
> 
> 2275 is 2/3rds of 3412
> 2150 is the BTU/hr output from two 315w LEC according to you
> ...


I think he's just jealous of his avatar...lol


----------



## Underground Scientist (Jun 12, 2017)

Seen nice things with these 315's. My understanding is buds mature a bit faster and get frostier. Surely the frost is UV related, but is the faster finishing a UV thing, or a spectrum thing?


----------



## gr865 (Jun 12, 2017)

Underground Scientist said:


> Seen nice things with these 315's. My understanding is buds mature a bit faster and get frostier. Surely the frost is UV related, but is the faster finishing a UV thing, or a spectrum thing?


I am fairly new to 315's but my last run was a horizontal grow with a 315 and and LED.
I normally do not go by the breeders recommendation on flowering time, usually it by trich viewing. Well I went with their recommendation and it may have been the 315 making it mature faster, I don't know, but that plant went way over mature. To the point that quality suffered. Was a 56 day flower plant and I should have gone 45 to 50 days


Lesson learned will continue trich viewing for harvest time.

GR


----------



## DemonTrich (Jun 12, 2017)

Ive never seen any quicker harvest times running cmh vs hps. I did cut back 1.5 week veg growth due to cmh having superior growth vs mh.

Below is darlins net (dansbud pheno)

Pic is taken 49 days from flip. 12 more days to go.

This cola is as big as a 20oz pop bottle. Rock hard, and super frosty.
+1gpw every run


----------



## JDMase (Jun 12, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> Ive never seen any quicker harvest times running cmh vs hps. I did cut back 1.5 week veg growth due to cmh having superior growth vs mh.
> 
> Below is darlins net (dansbud pheno)
> 
> ...


Awesome! What's your preferred nutes if you don't mind me asking! Do you also use the daylight bulb for flower? 

Ive heard the Agro isn't as advantageous to use in the flower phase.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Jun 12, 2017)

I used the 4000k bulbs in veg for the fist time and I found for my strains the nodes were tighter. I can also add that the cali-0 this run is from the same batch of seeds as last time and the nodes are tighter. Last run they were over 5 feet tall. The only difference between this run and last besides the bulb is that I gave them bud blood the week before and the week of 12/12. Last run I did it only the week of flip.


----------



## Yodaweed (Jun 12, 2017)

My last run under CMH my crop finished in about 4-6 days earlier than it has ever before. Same area , same strain, same medium, only difference was this time i put a CMH between my two HPS lights.


----------



## Schmarmpit (Jun 12, 2017)

I'm wondering if anyone out there runs the T9 315w bulbs in open hoods or not. They only have one jacket and are brighter than the T12 double jacket bulbs. Does anyone live life on the edge running these bare?


----------



## DemonTrich (Jun 13, 2017)

DO NOT RUN THE T9 IN AN OPEN HOOD! It's made for sealed hoods ONLY! If it explodes, the t9 will set your floor on fire. The t12 has a 2nd jacket designed to keep the exploding glass inside and not on your floor.

I run 930 in flower, and 940 in veg.


----------



## Schmarmpit (Jun 13, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> DO NOT RUN THE T9 IN AN OPEN HOOD! It's made for sealed hoods ONLY! If it explodes, the t9 will set your floor on fire. The t12 has a 2nd jacket designed to keep the exploding glass inside and not on your floor.
> 
> I run 930 in flower, and 940 in veg.


Which leads me to my next question, are these CMH bulbs known for exploding?


----------



## ttystikk (Jun 13, 2017)

Schmarmpit said:


> Which leads me to my next question, are these CMH bulbs known for exploding?


Not really but they are glass lamps. Imagine spray misting one by accident.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 13, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Not really but they are glass lamps. Imagine spray missing one by accident.


Spray missing one?
Spray misting one?

Can spraying in veg, cause your bulb to rupture should you potentially get any on it


----------



## Sailormoses (Jun 13, 2017)

it can happen,yes


----------



## Javadog (Jun 13, 2017)

Good word DT


----------



## ttystikk (Jun 13, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Spray missing one?
> Spray misting one?
> 
> Can spraying in veg, cause your bulb to rupture should you potentially get any on it


Water on hot glass can cause it to shatter.


----------



## genuity (Jun 13, 2017)

Big drops of water...yes...
A fine mist...no...

This is not a recommendation..


I always mist my veg plants(3x a week)...lights of 24hr..

Not a RECOMMENDATION!,!,!

spraying a very fine mist...gets foggy in that room.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 13, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Water on hot glass can cause it to shatter.


Though so,
Im careful around my t12


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Jun 13, 2017)

genuity said:


> Big drops of water...yes...
> A fine mist...no...
> 
> This is not a recommendation..
> ...


Same here.................


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Jun 13, 2017)

What's a minimum distance from the light? My plants stretched like crazy and are only like 10" away at day 26 already


----------



## genuity (Jun 13, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> What's a minimum distance from the light? My plants stretched like crazy and are only like 10" away at day 26 already


I run them around 18"
 
Nice,short,thick..


----------



## jonsnow399 (Jun 13, 2017)

genuity said:


> View attachment 3960586
> Nice,short,thick..


That's what she said.


----------



## gr865 (Jun 14, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> What's a minimum distance from the light? My plants stretched like crazy and are only like 10" away at day 26 already


I am running vertical stacked 315's and at day 11 the plants are about 10 inches from the lamps. Can get away with this in a vertical grow with a center fan. Had a few leaves grow into the lamps and got leaf burn. Just gonna have to watch them closely and tie back anything getting too close. 
The ladies in their tent in a closet.

View from the top

Front view looking past the light.


GR


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 14, 2017)

315 3100k
12 days under CMH
first 40 days under 300w Epistar purple led
Day 52
Pink Gravy - 3 in center pink and gray pots
Hash Plant - far right Green and Blue Pots
Starting to show sex, not yet 100% defined.
will be transplanting to 3 gallon pots, minimum 2 weeks prior to starting flower. 

on the left in the 2 gray pots are 2 clones I took from my last round of flowering plants, black and blue and ice cream.
I am unsure as specifics as they were bag seed.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 14, 2017)

I just mixed up some Biochar from 
http://www.airterra.ca/
with some earth worm castings, promix hp with their microhaze and 1 1/2 cups flower to feed micro life and watered till moistened, mixing thoroughly.
i will allow this to sit for 2-3 days before adding it to my hp soil in a Tote for storage.
untill up-sizing into 3gallon pots.
will probably pot-up next week sometime after sex shows clearly.
clones have already been taken of those showing signs of being female.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 14, 2017)

I'm wondering if I should be looking to add some Nematodes - I fear I may have brought some fungas gnats with the 20l bag of earthworm castings.

I already have already ordered some Humboldt Myco-Madness witch contains mycorrhizal fungi.

I'm currently using General Organics and would like an organic solution, I'm thinking Nematodes would be a solution to anything potentially brought in, but as to witch to choose I'm New, this is my Second round with this setup.


----------



## Javadog (Jun 14, 2017)

I just scoped a Tangerine Dream and was convinced to take it at seven weeks...46 days actually.

I am curious to see how it smokes. It is a fine pheno.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 15, 2017)

Mosquito Dunks.

Im wondering if anyone here has experience using Mosquito Dunks dissolved into water and used as a soil drench to fight and kill Fungas Gnats.

I have noticed a few airborne since obtaining a bag of earth worm casting as well as some red worms and their beding.


----------



## gr865 (Jun 15, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Mosquito Dunks.
> 
> Im wondering if anyone here has experience using Mosquito Dunks dissolved into water and used as a soil drench to fight and kill Fungas Gnats.
> 
> I have noticed a few airborne since obtaining a bag of earth worm casting as well as some red worms and their beding.


Do it now! If you have seen them they have laid eggs and them fuckers are eating your roots.
Crush them and soak them, pour over the coco. Also add crumbled to the surface.
I use SM90 but have use dunks.

GR


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 15, 2017)

I let 1 "Dunk", crushed up, sit in a 3L jug with water for around 3 1/2 hours, then diluted that 3:1 ( 3L to 9L) 
I added my General Organics as usual. 
I Then gave some plants 4 cups, others 6 cups, until about 10-20% run off.
I have left that run off, to sit in the drain pans, to Soak back in.

Repeat in 15 Days?


----------



## Yodaweed (Jun 15, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Mosquito Dunks.
> 
> Im wondering if anyone here has experience using Mosquito Dunks dissolved into water and used as a soil drench to fight and kill Fungas Gnats.
> 
> I have noticed a few airborne since obtaining a bag of earth worm casting as well as some red worms and their beding.


I crush up my dunks and sprinkle them ontop my soil


----------



## gr865 (Jun 15, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> I let 1 "Dunk", crushed up, sit in a 3L jug with water for around 3 1/2 hours, then diluted that 3:1 ( 3L to 9L)
> I added my General Organics as usual.
> I Then gave some plants 4 cups, others 6 cups, until about 10-20% run off.
> I have left that run off, to sit in the drain pans, to Soak back in.
> ...


Not sure how your set up for irrigation but just make a batch a day or so ahead, how ever much you would require, and treat at least weekly, and again put crushed, and as crushed as you can get it, and sprinkle on the top of your grow medium. 
Don't wait, them fuckers are bad.

GR


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 15, 2017)

I water by hand.
right now it seams to be 6 cups of water every 4 days roughly.
So i did a soil drench with it today.
Should i get another dunk and start soaking it now to use in 4 days?
as well as crush some and top dress with it?

All of the above?


----------



## Yodaweed (Jun 15, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> I water by hand.
> right now it seams to be 6 cups of water every 4 days roughly.
> So i did a soil drench with it today.
> Should i get another dunk and start soaking it now to use in 4 days?
> ...


All of the above sounds good, might wanna add a little neem meal to your top dress, those things hate it.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 15, 2017)

Neem Meal and Neem Flour are the same thing? Yes?

I was going to order some food grade neem flour but i read elsewhere that it can cause damage to my microbial life?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Jun 15, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Neem Meal and Neem Flour are the same thing? Yes?
> 
> I was going to order some food grade neem flour but i read elsewhere that it can cause damage to my microbial life?


https://buildasoil.com/collections/amendments


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 15, 2017)

Evil-Mobo st: 13600242 said:


> https://buildasoil.com/collections/amendments


Witch of there 3 neem products would you grab?
https://buildasoil.com/collections/amendments/products/neem-and-karanja-mixed-50-50


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 15, 2017)

http://www.neemresource.com/OnlineOrder.html

I was going to order just there neem meal,5lbs for $10
Or
would the mix of neem and karanja be better?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Jun 16, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> http://www.neemresource.com/OnlineOrder.html
> 
> I was going to order just there neem meal,5lbs for $10
> Or
> would the mix of neem and karanja be better?


I have not used the karanja so I cannot say. I linked them all so you could see what was available. I am a happy repeat customer. Email them and ask they will get back to you and quick. They are on point. You also go accumulating a higher discount level as you buy more and if you're into organics and no till this is like your home Depot for that they have it all and affordable and great service. Sorry for sounding like a commercial I'm just that happy with them as a customer.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Jun 16, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> 315 3100k
> 12 days under CMH
> first 40 days under 300w Epistar purple led
> Day 52
> ...


that is a 4x4 tent?


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Jun 16, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> What's a minimum distance from the light? My plants stretched like crazy and are only like 10" away at day 26 already


what strain ? My cali-O stretched a lot but she was sativa dominant...over 5 feet.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 16, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> that is a 4x4 tent?


Yes 4x4 x6'6" I believe


----------



## horribleherk (Jun 17, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Though so,
> Im careful around my t12


I know there are people that spray during lights on not only the hot bulb cold water things but a lot of sprays scald plants when the lights hit them I spray shortly after lights out & turn a fan on the plants my goal is to have the plants dry by the time the lights come back on


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 17, 2017)

https://www.rollitup.org/t/sexing-pink-gravy-under-315cmh.943159/

Sexing Plant's - Comment if you Concur or Not.


----------



## MistaRasta (Jun 18, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> I water by hand.
> right now it seams to be 6 cups of water every 4 days roughly.
> So i did a soil drench with it today.
> Should i get another dunk and start soaking it now to use in 4 days?
> ...



I'd opt out both the mosquito dunks and neem/Karanja for nematodes. Tried both several times and didn't even touch the gnat populations.

Got some nematodes from biologicco. On amazon, all the gnats in my pots were gone in a week. 

Didn't expect the stuff to work like it did but it did a great job. I use them once or twice a month and haven't had a gnat problem in a year or so..Check it out


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 18, 2017)

MistaRasta said:


> I'd opt out both the mosquito dunks and neem/Karanja for nematodes. Tried both several times and didn't even touch the gnat populations.
> 
> Got some nematodes from biologicco. On amazon, all the gnats in my pots were gone in a week.
> 
> Didn't expect the stuff to work like it did but it did a great job. I use them once or twice a month and haven't had a gnat problem in a year or so..Check it out


https://www.amazon.ca/Scanmask-Beneficial-Nematodes-Million-Spray/dp/B00BTJG19K

https://www.amazon.com/Live-Beneficial-Nematodes-Hb-Different/dp/B012U27NA0

How would those compaireas i can't locate ones suggested.
or could you forward your source?


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 18, 2017)

MistaRasta said:


> I'd opt out both the mosquito dunks and neem/Karanja for nematodes. Tried both several times and didn't even touch the gnat populations.
> 
> Got some nematodes from biologicco. On amazon, all the gnats in my pots were gone in a week.
> 
> Didn't expect the stuff to work like it did but it did a great job. I use them once or twice a month and haven't had a gnat problem in a year or so..Check it out


am I looking specificly for the SF Nematodes - *Steinernema feltiae*
_
of am I better and safer to get all 3 types?_
*Heterorhabditis-bacteriaphora**, **Steinernema-feltiae** and **Steinernema-carpocapsae**.*


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 18, 2017)

MistaRasta said:


> I'd opt out both the mosquito dunks and neem/Karanja for nematodes. Tried both several times and didn't even touch the gnat populations.
> 
> Got some nematodes from biologicco. On amazon, all the gnats in my pots were gone in a week.
> 
> Didn't expect the stuff to work like it did but it did a great job. I use them once or twice a month and haven't had a gnat problem in a year or so..Check it out


I have contacted Biologic Co and they have told me, they are not willing to ship to Me in Canada unless I'm a distributer or its a Large order.


----------



## pinner420 (Jun 21, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> I have contacted Biologic Co and they have told me, they are not willing to ship to Me in Canada unless I'm a distributer or its a Large order.


Bountea brews have the nematodes you seek.


----------



## Mr.Head (Jun 21, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> am I looking specificly for the SF Nematodes - *Steinernema feltiae*
> _
> of am I better and safer to get all 3 types?_
> *Heterorhabditis-bacteriaphora**, **Steinernema-feltiae** and **Steinernema-carpocapsae**.*


https://www.rona.ca/en/insecticide---eco-beneficial-nematodes
https://www.homehardware.ca/en/rec/index.htm/Outdoor-Living/Yard-Maintenance/Insect-Animal-Cntrls/Insect-Controls/Miscellaneous/Grub-Busters-Insecticide-Nematodes/_/N-ntlknZ1z140sg/R-I5045846
God I hope I just blew your mind  .

https://www.homehardware.ca/en/rec/index.htm/Outdoor-Living/Yard-Maintenance/Insect-Animal-Cntrls/Insect-Controls/Miscellaneous/Fungus-Gnats-and-Thrips-Nematodes-Insect-Control-Pot-Popper/_/N-2pqfZ67l/Ne-67n/Ntk-All_EN/R-I5045841?Ntt=nematodes
This is the one with that specific 'tode I believe


----------



## thccbdhealth (Jun 21, 2017)

Looks like ill be going to home hardwear to place an order for;

http://m.homehardware.ca/h5/m/en/r/hh//en/rec/index.htm/Outdoor-Living/Yard-Maintenance/Insect-Animal-Cntrls/Insect-Controls/Miscellaneous/Fungus-Gnats-and-Thrips-Nematodes-Insect-Control-Pot-Popper/_/N-2pqfZ67l/Ne-67n/Ntk-All_EN/R-I5045841?Ntt=nematodes


----------



## TheChemist77 (Jun 21, 2017)

question totally off topic,,, many years ago i bought weed from a friend,, as we rolled a joint, the red hairs fell on the table.. after a moment we noticed the littkle red hairs wher wiggling.. a wile later he asked the guy who grew it,, we wher told they are thc worms,, we packed a bowl of these hairs and smoked it... now i know there is no such thing as thc worms,,but what the hell where they?? we didnt look at them with a micro scope or anything,,wish we had.. no bigger than a normal bud hair, red,,and moving??


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## thccbdhealth (Jun 21, 2017)

How old were you?
Do you still know this guy who sold it to you?.


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## Javadog (Jun 21, 2017)

If the red hairs were wiggling, then this means that the weed is very strong. :0)


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## gr865 (Jun 21, 2017)

Javadog said:


> If the red hairs were wiggling, then this means that the weed is very strong. :0)


Wait, Barney's Farm had not breed LSD yet! 
That is my next grow!


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## rollitupled (Jun 22, 2017)

Hi,
Here is our scrog in a 90x90 tent, using a 315w Dimlux. 6" Rhino pro and a 6'' hyperfan stealth

Back left - Critical+
Bottom left - LA Con (dna)
Bottom right, top right - Exodus Kush (dna)

They are day 13 flower, were vegged for 9 weeks,

and finally, using biobizz nutes, last feed each plant got 2 liters

1ml grow, 1ml bloom, 0.5ml fish mix, 1.5ml Alg a mic (all per litre)


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## TheChemist77 (Jun 22, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> How old were you?
> Do you still know this guy who sold it to you?.


i was 17,, havnt spoken with him in many years, we were good friends but you know how people just lost touch.



Javadog said:


> If the red hairs were wiggling, then this means that the weed is very strong. :0)


im starting to wonder if we were just so high we thought they were wiggling,,, but my memory of it is very clear,,,i was always high,,mostly still am, never before,never since have i seen moving things..maybe a type of tiny catterpiller?? IDK

i did do alot of acid back then,,,,he did too,, but both of us having the same flash back at the same time??lol.. i guess ill die never really knowing..

.


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## TheChemist77 (Jun 23, 2017)

just wanted to update,, my bloom room is a 4x6ft f&d table w 37 plants. my lighting above is 2 315 watt cdl's in line over the center and 2 go green 100 watt citizens, 1 is 3000k the other 4000k these are placed between the cdl's 1 and a half feet in from each side of the table.. my previous runs w/out the led the 1st and 6th rows each the outside rows had a bit smaller buds, after adding the led bud size is pretty uniform. running a total of 830 watts im getting 1300 grams after trimming and drying ive now finished 3 runs w this lighting set up and each run was within 15 grams give or take.. so overall averaging 1.56 grams per watt...
after using the cdl's i would never go back to HPS or MH, Bud quality is better, plants finish sooner under the spectrum, and my gram per watt is up from 1 to 1.56..
as for the led,, i keep them at the same height above canopy as the cdl's 2-3ft above. they seem to have pretty good penetration and wile the plants under them are getting bigger buds they are still a bit smaller than buds under the cdl's...


1-2-3 -4 -5 -6
7-8-9-10-11-13
14-15-16-17-18-19
20-21-22-23-24-25
26-27-28-29-30-31
32-33-34-35-36-37

the cdls would be directly above between plants 10 and 16, and22 and 28 the leds above and between plants 15 and 21, and 18 and 24.. plants number 1,6,32, and 37 are always the smallest...

i love the 315 watt cdl's and im still on the fence on the leds,, i have not done any runs under led alone but i have w the cdls.. i have also found plants directly under the led's tops will burn quick if they get to close and they seem to use nutrients differently than plant under the cdl,, plants under the cdl's seem overall healthier... with a flood table they all get the same thing,, i would say if using both led and hid you would be better off hand watering plants under the led with a milder nute mix...just my opinion..


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## GroErr (Jun 23, 2017)

If anyone was wondering whether the 4200k bulbs veg ok. I had to throw my Sun Systems LEC into my 2x4x5' tent for a few days while my replacement LED's arrive. Had been wanting to try it for veg so this was the opportunity. As expected temps get too high in there but I did manage to get them manageable (81-83F through 18/6 cycle), not temps I like for veg but for a few days they'll be fine.

Anyhow, here's before and after pics after 4 days under the LEC. Makes me want to build a proper veg room where I can handle some noise from extraction fans and use this LEC for veg 

Sunday after transplant from party cups:

 

Thursday night after 4 days of 315w 4200k:

 

Cheers


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## MichiganMedGrower (Jun 23, 2017)

GroErr said:


> If anyone was wondering whether the 4200k bulbs veg ok. I had to throw my Sun Systems LEC into my 2x4x5' tent for a few days while my replacement LED's arrive. Had been wanting to try it for veg so this was the opportunity. As expected temps get too high in there but I did manage to get them manageable (81-83F through 18/6 cycle), not temps I like for veg but for a few days they'll be fine.
> 
> Anyhow, here's before and after pics after 4 days under the LEC. Makes me want to build a proper veg room where I can handle some noise from extraction fans and use this LEC for veg
> 
> ...



Have you vegged with the 3100k bulb too?


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## jonsnow399 (Jun 23, 2017)

anyone have an opinion on the 315 watt DE bulbs?


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## coreywebster (Jun 23, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Have you vegged with the 3100k bulb too?


I think I have. Would have to check the box because I cant remember which bulb I got.
Either way they bloody love it in there.
Have you compared the two colour temps?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jun 23, 2017)

coreywebster said:


> I think I have. Would have to check the box because I cant remember which bulb I got.
> Either way they bloody love it in there.
> Have you compared the two colour temps?


Not yet. I gott a sun system remote reflector, galaxy ballast and Phillips 3100k bulb last November and tested it in flower til recently. 

I am putting it in my 3x3 veg tent next. Using t-5's now.


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## coreywebster (Jun 23, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Not yet. I gott a sun system remote reflector, galaxy ballast and Phillips 3100k bulb last November and tested it in flower til recently.
> 
> I am putting it in my 3x3 veg tent next. Using t-5's now.


Look forward to hearing your opinions when the time comes.
My experience is not a fair test since I used to veg under a 400w hps so switching to the 315 was always going to be a win.


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## gr865 (Jun 23, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Have you vegged with the 3100k bulb too?


I have vegged and flowered under my Nanolux NA with the 3100k. Have not used the 4200k yet so I cannot compare, but the 3100 did veg very well. Both veg'es were under the 3100k and one flower was, my second flower is in progress but it is a vert grow.
I am really impressed with the light and the lamps Phillips Elite. But the largest lamp I have used is a 400W HPS. I sure do miss growing outside. Oh well, my state will be one of that last few to follow the trend, LOL.


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## GroErr (Jun 23, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Have you vegged with the 3100k bulb too?


No this is the first time I've vegged at all with the SS. Need a bigger tent (higher) to manage the heat without inline (noisy) fans. Don't really have the space for a 4x4' or 5x5' tent so I normally use LED's in multiple smaller tents so I don't have to worry about noisy extraction fans. 3100k's would probably be just fine though.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Jun 23, 2017)

coreywebster said:


> Look forward to hearing your opinions when the time comes.
> My experience is not a fair test since I used to veg under a 400w hps so switching to the 315 was always going to be a win.


Pretty sure my 315 setup equals about a 450 -500 w hps. 

I am not as impressed as the reports from growers on the forums are. I found it gives a small footprint. And it does not grow big dense lower in the canopy buds like my Hortilux 600w Super hps or my 600w Hortilux blue. 

I will eventually set up a room with 4'x8' flowering area with 2 air cooled blockbusters I have loaded with Super hps 600's and the sun system 315 in the middle of them. All hung close together for max blend. 

I documented my tests in flower here in club 315 back in December to about April. I grow perpetually a plant every week or two so it is easy to see results. 

CH9 seeds used this blue Lemon Thai bud I grew for a promotion. It was finished for 2 weeks under the 315 LEC. Stretched and transition and bud set under hps. 

It brought out a more sativa structure to the buds and more trichomes and color. 

It was a truly potent and trippy high. Obvious improvement over hps alone to all who tried. 

And I did not tell any patients about the new light. I conduct blind tests with friends and patients. 

 

It also stayed green easier than the plant under the hps the whole time. Like it was just happier under the light. 

I am using a 600 Hortilux blue MH and a 600 Super HPS now and getting similar results. 

Fuller spectrum for the win but I have found too much blue Grows leafier smaller buds. The 315 ultimately hurt my yield against the 600. 

Here is the summer setup 

 

Hope this helps someone. It's kind of a quick review of all my posts at the beginning of the year.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Jun 23, 2017)

gr865 said:


> I have vegged and flowered under my Nanolux NA with the 3100k. Have not used the 4200k yet so I cannot compare, but the 3100 did veg very well. Both veg'es were under the 3100k and one flower was, my second flower is in progress but it is a vert grow.
> I am really impressed with the light and the lamps Phillips Elite. But the largest lamp I have used is a 400W HPS. I sure do miss growing outside. Oh well, my state will be one of that last few to follow the trend, LOL.


I have viewed your fantastic going grow. Nice work man! Sure shows what the 315 can do.


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## Yodaweed (Jun 23, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Pretty sure my 315 setup equals about a 450 -500 w hps.
> 
> I am not as impressed as the reports from growers on the forums are. I found it gives a small footprint. And it does not grow big dense lower in the canopy buds like my Hortilux 600w Super hps or my 600w Hortilux blue.
> 
> ...


I would agree with this statement, i found pretty much the exact same thing, i grew under a very similar setup (2x 600w hps with hortilux super hps bulbs with a 315w CMH between them) the plants that were directly under the CMH had the smallest buds, the ones that were between the hps and cmh had decent sized buds, the ones directly under the hps had the biggest buds. I would like to get a vertical reflector to see if that can help concentrate the beam cause i used my CMH in a horizontal position , but that's gonna have to wait.


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## DemonTrich (Jun 23, 2017)

I'm quite the opposite. I'm +1.25gpw with 315 cmh every run. No pgr/boosters, with 1000ppm co2. I do run elite genetics and I can alter my yields by what strains and bow many I run. I absolutely KILL it, every single time. I've turned about 20 growers onto the cmh way. I've not heard anything I'll from it.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jun 23, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> I'm quite the opposite. I'm +1.25gpw with 315 cmh every run. No pgr/boosters, with 1000ppm co2. I do run elite genetics and I can alter my yields by what strains and bow many I run. I absolutely KILL it, every single time. I've turned about 20 growers onto the cmh way. I've not heard anything I'll from it.


I am usually averaging just under a gram per watt under a 600 hps but with plants at different stages and no static netted canopy. And I move the plants every day pretty much. Not a high yield technique but if I did it with known clones and a net I could easily get the other .25 in weight. Maybe more. 

And that is almost a pound and a half with only a 4x4 footprint. 

I don't grow for yield obviously with my technique only quality but the 600 hps yields over 30% more for me than the 315 can in the same approximate space. That's what I lost on average flowering under the cmh. 

I will only be using them for supplemental spectrum and veg.


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## genuity (Jun 23, 2017)

Under 630DE-R 
Few more water days then chop...big thick buds,good strong smells,..good lights in my opinion. 

Veg my plants under 6 315lec...4200 & 3100
 
They all veg just fine,now under 2 630DE-R temperature in the mid 80's 
Lots of air circulation.


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## Javadog (Jun 23, 2017)

Rocking it G!


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## TheChemist77 (Jun 24, 2017)

GroErr said:


> No this is the first time I've vegged at all with the SS. Need a bigger tent (higher) to manage the heat without inline (noisy) fans. Don't really have the space for a 4x4' or 5x5' tent so I normally use LED's in multiple smaller tents so I don't have to worry about noisy extraction fans. 3100k's would probably be just fine though.


can u get a pic of veg w/ only 4 days under the led as a comparison? what is the kelvin of the led u use?
i have a 4200k cdl bulb ive never used,, i went from a 6500k 400 watt mh in my veg to a 315 w/ the 3100k bulb.. my veg is a 2x4ft f&d table and the 315 does just as well if not better than under mh, clones and seed lings really pack on the nodes wile the height is very managable,, recently i added a 100 watt citizen 4000k to my veg room,, so now 1 315 and 1 citizen,, i havnt seen any big differences yet...i keep lamps at 2ft above canopy in veg always,, at 2ft above the 315 covers the 2x4 table well,,, i added the led as a test,, ill see how it goes... im going to have to switch the bulb in my cdl to see how the 4200k compares,,


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## TheChemist77 (Jun 24, 2017)

GroErr said:


> If anyone was wondering whether the 4200k bulbs veg ok. I had to throw my Sun Systems LEC into my 2x4x5' tent for a few days while my replacement LED's arrive. Had been wanting to try it for veg so this was the opportunity. As expected temps get too high in there but I did manage to get them manageable (81-83F through 18/6 cycle), not temps I like for veg but for a few days they'll be fine.
> 
> Anyhow, here's before and after pics after 4 days under the LEC. Makes me want to build a proper veg room where I can handle some noise from extraction fans and use this LEC for veg
> 
> ...




have u noticed any difference on how the plants use nutrients differently from led and the ceramic's?? i know its only a 4 day test,, but i wonder if you would need to change ur nutrient mix if you switched perminently from led to cdl in veg???


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## GroErr (Jun 24, 2017)

TheChemist77 said:


> can u get a pic of veg w/ only 4 days under the led as a comparison? what is the kelvin of the led u use?
> i have a 4200k cdl bulb ive never used,, i went from a 6500k 400 watt mh in my veg to a 315 w/ the 3100k bulb.. my veg is a 2x4ft f&d table and the 315 does just as well if not better than under mh, clones and seed lings really pack on the nodes wile the height is very managable,, recently i added a 100 watt citizen 4000k to my veg room,, so now 1 315 and 1 citizen,, i havnt seen any big differences yet...i keep lamps at 2ft above canopy in veg always,, at 2ft above the 315 covers the 2x4 table well,,, i added the led as a test,, ill see how it goes... im going to have to switch the bulb in my cdl to see how the 4200k compares,,





TheChemist77 said:


> can u get a pic of veg w/ only 4 days under the led as a comparison? what is the kelvin of the led u use?
> i have a 4200k cdl bulb ive never used,, i went from a 6500k 400 watt mh in my veg to a 315 w/ the 3100k bulb.. my veg is a 2x4ft f&d table and the 315 does just as well if not better than under mh, clones and seed lings really pack on the nodes wile the height is very managable,, recently i added a 100 watt citizen 4000k to my veg room,, so now 1 315 and 1 citizen,, i havnt seen any big differences yet...i keep lamps at 2ft above canopy in veg always,, at 2ft above the 315 covers the 2x4 table well,,, i added the led as a test,, ill see how it goes... im going to have to switch the bulb in my cdl to see how the 4200k compares,,


Sorry man, no time for doing proper comparisons, just posting what I saw when I set them up temporarily. Too hot for that tent which was what I figured but wanted to test it, already replaced them with some other LED's, mixed 6k (2x 70w) and 3k (1x 70w) for now, will see how that goes and maybe replace the 3k with another 6k if I don't like what I see.

I can tell you I haven't seen growth that fast with seedings with my blurple panels and I've been vegging with them for 4 years. Don't know what the kelvin would be for those blurple panels, it's mixed colours but lots of blue in there. Part of the increased speed in veg for that short period may have been the switch in spectrum imo, they were vegging up from seed under the blurples. Wasn't a proper test in that regard, I'd want to see them come up under the 4200k from seed to really know the difference.


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## Craigson (Jun 24, 2017)

JOTI Blueberry clones under 315
Topped once. Day 33 flower


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## rollitupled (Jun 25, 2017)

GroErr said:


> If anyone was wondering whether the 4200k bulbs veg ok. I had to throw my Sun Systems LEC into my 2x4x5' tent for a few days while my replacement LED's arrive. Had been wanting to try it for veg so this was the opportunity. As expected temps get too high in there but I did manage to get them manageable (81-83F through 18/6 cycle), not temps I like for veg but for a few days they'll be fine.
> 
> Anyhow, here's before and after pics after 4 days under the LEC. Makes me want to build a proper veg room where I can handle some noise from extraction fans and use this LEC for veg
> 
> ...


Hi Dude,
Nice looking plants and set up  Do you have a live feed from a camera set up? I was looking at doing the same, so i can monitor the ladies without having to cross the road to my garage...
I have wifi in the garage, was just a bit worried about streaming the live feed (security/hackers etc..)


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## GroErr (Jun 25, 2017)

TheChemist77 said:


> have u noticed any difference on how the plants use nutrients differently from led and the ceramic's?? i know its only a 4 day test,, but i wonder if you would need to change ur nutrient mix if you switched perminently from led to cdl in veg???


I've never noticed a huge difference but I've always vegged with LED's and flowered with CMH or COBs and feed very little, supplement is more what I call it. My medium is soil/pro-mix so needs very little feed in veg, every 3rd watering at like 350-400ppm. They get up-potted so get fresh medium about a week before flipping and I feed much the same in flowering, supplement at 400-450ppm when needed, usually every other watering through the stretch, then every 2nd or 3rd watering once they set, depending on the strain/pheno. I'd expect if I switched to CMH veg there would be some adjustments needed for the environment which combined with the difference in spectrum would likely affect the plants including feeding habits.


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## GroErr (Jun 25, 2017)

rollitupled said:


> Hi Dude,
> Nice looking plants and set up  Do you have a live feed from a camera set up? I was looking at doing the same, so i can monitor the ladies without having to cross the road to my garage...
> I have wifi in the garage, was just a bit worried about streaming the live feed (security/hackers etc..)


Hey thanks, I don't run a feed, too much risk. They are capable of streaming through a service from the vendor but I use them mainly through my WiFi. If I'm remote I don't have the network open or directing traffic to the cameras. I vpn into my network and then connect to the cameras, much safer than exposing them to the internet.

They're pretty cheap and I'm just now replacing 2 of them that are acting up after 4+ years so pretty reliable. Here's the models I use below. They're branded under Foscam or Armcrest, not sure if there's any difference, I have some of each and they're identical as far as setup/functionality.
https://amcrest.com/amcrest-1080p-wifi-video-security-ip-camera-pt.html


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## ttystikk (Jun 25, 2017)

GroErr said:


> Hey thanks, I don't run a feed, too much risk. They are capable of streaming through a service from the vendor but I use them mainly through my WiFi. If I'm remote I don't have the network open or directing traffic to the cameras. I vpn into my network and then connect to the cameras, much safer than exposing them to the internet.
> 
> They're pretty cheap and I'm just now replacing 2 of them that are acting up after 4+ years so pretty reliable. Here's the models I use below. They're branded under Foscam or Armcrest, not sure if there's any difference, I have some of each and they're identical as far as setup/functionality.
> https://amcrest.com/amcrest-1080p-wifi-video-security-ip-camera-pt.html


Foscam and similar cameras are remote hackable. I just read about it. Check into other brands that are more secure.


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## GroErr (Jun 25, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Foscam and similar cameras are remote hackable. I just read about it. Check into other brands that are more secure.


They're all hackable, why I don't expose them to the outside. You have to hack into my network first , then the camera. Low risk compared to having them available via internet, including cloud services. I go into my network through a vpn, then when I'm inside I can access them. I'm a network guy, it's all about risk and ease of access. There's so many open devices out there, any resistance and you move on to the next guy. It's not worth spending time on hacking into a network when so many other open targets are available.


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## ttystikk (Jun 25, 2017)

GroErr said:


> They're all hackable, why I don't expose them to the outside. You have to hack into my network first , then the camera. Low risk compared to having them available via internet, including cloud services. I go into my network through a vpn, then when I'm inside I can access them. I'm a network guy, it's all about risk and ease of access. There's so many open devices out there, any resistance and you move on to the next guy. It's not worth spending time on hacking into a network when so many other open targets are available.


And this is why I like to hear from knowledgeable guys like yourself. Now I know to set up a VPN.


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## Bad Karma (Jul 18, 2017)

The venting attachment for the Phantom CMH hood is doing its job and making this rare summer grow possible. Fighting the Northern California heat but still looking sweet.

*Sherbet*


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## TheChemist77 (Jul 18, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> The venting attachment for the Phantom CMH hood is doing its job and making this rare summer grow possible. Fighting the Northern California heat but still looking sweet.
> 
> *Sherbet*
> View attachment 3979977


looks TASTY....
I just put 10 bcbd purps regular seeds, 8 gdp reg seeds, 2 bcbd ultimate purple reg seeds, 2 th seeds dark star feminized, 5 feminized white lable purple bud,,in paper towels,, all seeds are about 3 years old but wer kept in the fridge w/ silica..

its been 7 days, out of all seeds, 1 ultimate purple is up and growing, the 5 white lable popped,3 of the GDP, 1 dark star, have popped and put into 1inch rock wool cubes,, its been 3 days since put in cubes,, not 1 has come up..
so 27 seeds, 1 plant, im pissed... how long should i leave them in paper towls before throwing them away?? i had a lady purple seed that took 14 days to pop before... hope the ones that popped come up and hope more popp,, not 1 of the purps has popped...

i have 10 seedsman purple bud regular seeds, and 3 ace seeds violleta feminized and 3 grizzly purple kush feminized by blimburn i think.. ill put them into paper towels if i dont get anymore plants... this will be all my purple strains,,I AM SO FAR PAST DISAPPOINTED!!!!!!!!!!


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## thccbdhealth (Jul 18, 2017)

TheChemist77 said:


> looks TASTY....
> I just put 10 bcbd purps regular seeds, 8 gdp reg seeds, 2 bcbd ultimate purple reg seeds, 2 th seeds dark star feminized, 5 feminized white lable purple bud,,in paper towels,, all seeds are about 3 years old but wer kept in the fridge w/ silica..
> 
> its been 7 days, out of all seeds, 1 ultimate purple is up and growing, the 5 white lable popped,3 of the GDP, 1 dark star, have popped and put into 1inch rock wool cubes,, its been 3 days since put in cubes,, not 1 has come up..
> ...


Using distilled water?


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## pinner420 (Jul 18, 2017)

315s rule


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## TheChemist77 (Jul 19, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Using distilled water?


paper towels wet w/ plain water w/ ph of 6.0... once in rock wool for seedlings i use 1/2 tsp maxi grow, 1/2 tsp of B+ per gallon of water PH BALANCED TO 5.8.. 

should i be using distilled water?? ive always used ph balanced tap water on seeds,never had problems... if using distilled do you ad ph down or just straight distilled water???

as of now i have 1 ultimate purple, 3 grand daddy purples, and 1 fem dark star that are up and growing,, the ultimate purple is a week ahead of the rest and all seeds wer in towels at the same time...
again how long should i give the seeds in paper towels before i throw them away?? is there a way to see if a seed is dead? i noticed some seeds are black..


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## thccbdhealth (Jul 19, 2017)

Germination with distilled or ro water.
Some tap water can apperently kill some seeds.


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## thccbdhealth (Jul 19, 2017)

Day 8 of Flower
From Seed - 88 days
First 40 days under 300w Blurple
Then 40 under 315 CMH 3100k


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## 517BlckBerry (Jul 20, 2017)

i dont have time to scim through the thread but I will soon and I want to...but can someone tell me Will a 315 cmh almost replace my 1000W MH for veg? I got a nice LED for veg but it makes them too bushy and takes too long compared to MH... is CMH similar or can i expect it to be closer to MH results? THANKS guys


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jul 20, 2017)

517BlckBerry said:


> i dont have time to scim through the thread but I will soon and I want to...but can someone tell me Will a 315 cmh almost replace my 1000W MH for veg? I got a nice LED for veg but it makes them too bushy and takes too long compared to MH... is CMH similar or can i expect it to be closer to MH results? THANKS guys


2 of them would get you close.


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## ttystikk (Jul 20, 2017)

517BlckBerry said:


> i dont have time to scim through the thread but I will soon and I want to...but can someone tell me Will a 315 cmh almost replace my 1000W MH for veg? I got a nice LED for veg but it makes them too bushy and takes too long compared to MH... is CMH similar or can i expect it to be closer to MH results? THANKS guys


You'll need 2 315W CMH to replace a 1000W MH. That's still only 630W vs 1000.


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## 517BlckBerry (Jul 20, 2017)

thanks guys! so one would match up to about a 600watter im assuming... Think im going to get one in a week or so. Solis Tek products are amazing from my experience but if you guys have a better option let me know thanks again!


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## bellcore (Jul 21, 2017)

What replacement bulb should I get for my Sun System LEC 315? I was hoping maybe an unwrapped bulb would be better for UV. I'm just using the one bulb for veg and flower. Thanks!


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jul 21, 2017)

bellcore said:


> What replacement bulb should I get for my Sun System LEC 315? I was hoping maybe an unwrapped bulb would be better for UV. I'm just using the one bulb for veg and flower. Thanks!



The Phillips 3100k offers the most par and is recommended for full cycles.


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## ttystikk (Jul 21, 2017)

bellcore said:


> What replacement bulb should I get for my Sun System LEC 315? I was hoping maybe an unwrapped bulb would be better for UV. I'm just using the one bulb for veg and flower. Thanks!


Use open rated lamps in fully enclosed fixtures only.

The difference in UV is negligible.


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## since1991 (Jul 22, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I can't tell if you appreciate my post or not.
> 
> But for data. I'm pretty sure I could get 12 oz + with any of my seeds and just the 315. Problem is the footprint is small.
> 
> I have done 24 with the 600 hps. In a 3.5 x 3.5 space with mid yielding genetics.


Was that with a single ended sixer? One strain? I uses to hit them numbers with the mogul socket sixers as well..but it was tough and lots of canopy/net trellis training with one strain to hit that. Nice job. Anyone that hits over 17 with a single ended sixer has got shit on point in my opinion. Glass or no glass makes a HUGE difference i have found. If your in the twenties consistently...dont change a thing I say. I sold off my single ended sixers and got a bunch of Gavita 6/750's a few years ago. I can hit 25 to 28 no problem on the 600 watt setting alone now. Much more grower friendly with the double ended lamps. Just gotta control the heat. A mini split ac is pretty much mandatory. But yeah. The double ended are less canopy work as well to hit them numbers. Less Net trellis training and whatnot.


----------



## since1991 (Jul 22, 2017)

genuity said:


> Yeah,1000 watt DE with a few 315 is a very nice setup...
> Them 600 blues are very good for veg,if you like lots of branching on the plants,I use it in my flower room the last few weeks of 12/12..it's a very "soft" light for flowering..imo.


How can you get them even remotely close in height to where the lamps to canopy and footprint is optimal? The 315 would have to be much closer to canopy..thus blocking the spread of that 1000 watt DE. No? What am I missing here? Seems a six hundred watt DE would play with a 315 or even a 630 cmh next to it much more nicely. I dunno. Maybe iam all wet on this.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jul 22, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Was that with a single ended sixer? One strain? I uses to hit them numbers with the mogul socket sixers as well..but it was tough and lots of canopy/net trellis training with one strain to hit that. Nice job. Anyone that hits over 17 with a single ended sixer has got shit on point in my opinion. Glass or no glass makes a HUGE difference i have found. If your in the twenties consistently...dont change a thing I say. I sold off my single ended sixers and got a bunch of Gavita 6/750's a few years ago. I can hit 25 to 28 no problem on the 600 watt setting alone now. Much more grower friendly with the double ended lamps. Just gotta control the heat. A mini split ac is pretty much mandatory. But yeah. The double ended are less canopy work as well to hit them numbers. Less Net trellis training and whatnot.



Yes single ended and in blockbuster glass enclosed air cooled hoods. 

And 4 different plants. And different strains and crosses but from seeds I have grown for a couple years perpetually. 

No trellis. Just 30" trained bushes. 

Looked like this with the 2 600's and 1 315. 

 

And here is a harvested plant from that time. 
 

Leaves removed.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Jul 22, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Yes single ended and in blockbuster glass enclosed air cooled hoods.
> 
> And 4 different plants. And different strains and crosses but from seeds I have grown for a couple years perpetually.
> 
> ...


@MichiganMedGrower are any of those mainlined? What are the lights and the size of the area? Looks like you use 3 gallon fabric or plastic? I did half fabric 3 gallon and half 12" square plastic. I wish i could find deeper fabric pots.
Are you still growing that strain that reminded me of Citral?
Your even canopy is great very nice work


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## MichiganMedGrower (Jul 22, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> @MichiganMedGrower are any of those mainlined? What are the lights and the size of the area? Looks like you use 3 gallon fabric or plastic? I did half fabric 3 gallon and half 12" square plastic. I wish i could find deeper fabric pots.
> Are you still growing that strain that reminded me of Citral?
> Your even canopy is great very nice work



Thank you very much. I was workin really hard to keep production high. 

And yes 3 gallon go pro plastic nursery pots. 

No training in veg unless the plants got too tall for my system then I either too or bend and tie the plants main stem down. 

Most are bent around day 7-10 in 12/12 to promote the branching. Then branches are staked and tied down or supercropped as training needs progress. 

And the plants are mostly staggered in pairs or a week apart for growth in the pic. So I crop a plant about every week. 

The 600's are over a 3.5' x 3.5' area each. 7' x3.5' total. 7 x 4 foot max if necessary. 

The 315 only covers 2.5'x2.5' as well. 

The plants seemed to have the best growth and buds in the overlap between the 600super hps and the 315 LEC.


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## since1991 (Jul 22, 2017)

Anyone got a link posts or threads on the very new double ended cmh lamps from Growers Choice? They got 315..a 630..and 945 watt fixtures.


----------



## genuity (Jul 22, 2017)

since1991 said:


> How can you get them even remotely close in height to where the lamps to canopy and footprint is optimal? The 315 would have to be much closer to canopy..thus blocking the spread of that 1000 watt DE. No? What am I missing here? Seems a six hundred watt DE would play with a 315 or even a 630 cmh next to it much more nicely. I dunno. Maybe iam all wet on this.


 
I run all my lights at 18" ... this pic is with just the 315lec litt....nice spread.
But it's only for that center part...


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## MichiganMedGrower (Jul 22, 2017)

genuity said:


> View attachment 3982580
> I run all my lights at 18" ... this pic is with just the 315lec litt....nice spread.
> But it's only for that center part...


Just a tip. Those plants are showing heat stress from the lights being too close likely. You can see all the tacoing and edges pointing up. The plants are transpiring too much and trying to retain moisture. 

I suggest a few more inches higher for the lights and maybe some circulation fan tweaks. 

The leaves should look flat and relaxed. I am a constant adjuster for happy plants.


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## genuity (Jul 22, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Just a tip. Those plants are showing heat stress from the lights being too close likely. You can see all the tacoing and edges pointing up. The plants are transpiring too much and trying to retain moisture.
> 
> I suggest a few more inches higher for the lights and maybe some circulation fan tweaks.
> 
> The leaves should look flat and relaxed. I am a constant adjuster for happy plants.


Them plants did just fine,with no heat stress..
 
 
Just lots of light....good light


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## Javadog (Jul 23, 2017)

LOL, Gen knows...


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Jul 23, 2017)

I think these 315cmh do quite well


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## TheChemist77 (Jul 23, 2017)

lo


genuity said:


> Them plants did just fine,with no heat stress..
> View attachment 3982662
> View attachment 3982663
> Just lots of light....good light[/QU
> ...


----------



## genuity (Jul 23, 2017)

TheChemist77 said:


> lo


Them are 

High school sweetheart & Breathwork 

Hope you find a good purp...


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## Javadog (Jul 23, 2017)

The red ones remind me of a color that my old Somango got. Very lovely.

This is probably the best color-shot:






Carry on! :0)


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## ttystikk (Jul 23, 2017)

Javadog said:


> The red ones remind me of a color that my old Somango got. Very lovely.
> 
> This is probably the best color-shot:
> 
> ...


Pretty!


----------



## Javadog (Jul 23, 2017)

Thanks Bro.

That was a long time ago when I ran one or two breeds at a time.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Aug 11, 2017)

Anyone run the DE 315's from Growers Choice yet?

Also I see that Growers house has a 315 kit for my Daystar hoods with the Phillips bulb. Anyone run this bulb horizontally?

Are there two versions a "vertical" and "horizontal"?


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Aug 11, 2017)

Just ran 9 different Tanana kush seeds and ended up with 10.1 oz. That's about .9 gpw. Any good? I would think so for a first run


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 15, 2017)

I got a question for you guys. I have a 1000watt and a 600,my question is do you think the 315 is worth the money or stick with the high light bill with the 1000?


----------



## Bad Karma (Aug 16, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> I got a question for you guys. I have a 1000watt and a 600,my question is do you think the 315 is worth the money or stick with the high light bill with the 1000?


A good 315 is worth every penny. I just invested in another Hydrofarm Phantom CMH myself. They're my grow light of choice.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 16, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> I got a question for you guys. I have a 1000watt and a 600,my question is do you think the 315 is worth the money or stick with the high light bill with the 1000?



A 315 cmh has no where near the coverage and intensity of a 1000 watt hid. 

I have the sun system and a Phillips 3100k and I do really like it but it doesn't even compete with my 600 Hortilux Super hps either. Lotta hype that distracts the buyer from the small coverage area with high gram per watt claims. 

It covers 2.5 to 3 feet square for flowering. I will use it only as supplemental spectrum to my 600 hps until I can try 3 in place of my 2 600's.

I have found it has the power of maybe 450-500 watt hps but only the coverage area of a 400. 

I do really like the natural looking light to work in. 

It also is as hot as my air cooled 600 hps but in an open reflector. I did need to add ventilation for it. 

Seems growers with multiple overlapping lights are seeing the benefit as a stand alone lamp more to me. 

It does increase resin production, frost and color over the hps. And some strains are finishing faster. I really like them paired with the 600.

I have been trying to figure out how to fit it in between my 2 600's. That would add the perfect amount of blue light for flowering and a little uv. If I went with the 4200k bulb even more uv. Even some uvb.


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## JDMase (Aug 16, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> A 315 cmh has no where near the coverage and intensity of a 1000 watt hid.
> 
> I have the sun system and a Phillips 3100k and I do really like it but it doesn't even compete with my 600 Hortilux Super hps either. Lotta hype that distracts the buyer from the small coverage area with high gram per watt claims.
> 
> ...


I think you're right, my first run with a CMH was using a 600w until halfway through flower and switching out for the CMH toward the end, got far superior yields than with either alone. Some people do switch from HPS to metal halide towards the end of flowering anyway, I can only imagine the CMH is slightly better than that. 

I'll save my reservations until I do a full run of 630w CMH myself and compare that to my HPS. But my HPS yield with autos is still way off my CMH photos right now.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 16, 2017)

JDMase said:


> I think you're right, my first run with a CMH was using a 600w until halfway through flower and switching out for the CMH toward the end, got far superior yields than with either alone. Some people do switch from HPS to metal halide towards the end of flowering anyway, I can only imagine the CMH is slightly better than that.
> 
> I'll save my reservations until I do a full run of 630w CMH myself and compare that to my HPS. But my HPS yield with autos is still way off my CMH photos right now.



Since I made that post I have been trying to figure out how to fit my 315 in between my 2 blockbusters in the frame I already built. 

I have a plan to relocate the inline fans to a "Y" duct and then could carbon filter the 2 lights like they are now and another exhaust duct pointed at the 315 reflector with an inline filter I have. 

Work is never done. Lol

I tried a few configurations in my little room. Here is one. You can see why I want to do. 

I will spread them out more and stick the 315 right in the middle. It will all be a 7' x 3.5' area. 1515 watts with the improved spectrum. 

My best plant so far and biggest also flowered under a 600 and finished 2.5 weeks under the 315 LEC. 

I think pairs would be best over a 6' x 4' area but this should give me good overlap and I would keep moving plants around and rotating as I water.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 16, 2017)

Here's what I have been using all summer. 600 Hortilux blue mh and 600 super hps. Excellent quality and yield but still too leafy buds and a bit looser than hps alone.

The quality was higher like with the cmh. And it produced the colors wihout cold night temps. Also kept plants shorter.

But I don't like the 50/50 split in the room and I am trying hps only to compare right now. The last two plants harvested are still fire. I have 2 more to compare soon. The frost is less but still really frosty. The potency is close enough that we are not sure. The flavor and smell are still strong and distinct with the 2 different strains.

But the leafy buds are obvious and I have twice the bud leaf trim and loose stuff I used to


I don't lab test anymore. So I don't have numbers just mine and Mrs. MMG' opinion and a bunch of patients. Laying real low since the new laws at the new year. Not dealing with dispensaries.


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 16, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> A 315 cmh has no where near the coverage and intensity of a 1000 watt hid.
> 
> I have the sun system and a Phillips 3100k and I do really like it but it doesn't even compete with my 600 Hortilux Super hps either. Lotta hype that distracts the buyer from the small coverage area with high gram per watt claims.
> 
> ...



Just hang one vertically in a socket in between the 600's?


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## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 16, 2017)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Just hang one vertically in a socket in between the 600's?



I really have thought about this. It is likely the best solution. But for safety and ease on my eyes I really prefer reflectors. They are pointing the light below my standing eye level in my short room. 

It would really mix the light spectrums up real nice. 

But isn't it a waste if I am hanging the bulb above the canopy?


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## Evil-Mobo (Aug 16, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I really have thought about this. It is likely the best solution. But for safety and ease on my eyes I really prefer reflectors. They are pointing the light below my standing eye level in my short room.
> 
> It would really mix the light spectrums up real nice.
> 
> But isn't it a waste if I am hanging the bulb above the canopy?



When I did a vert grow a while back I got these sockets than plug right to the ballast and hang meant for this very use. I would try and hang the 315 this way and see how close to the canopy I could get with the bare bulb. Go from there. You can always use the reflector again if you need to right?


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## since1991 (Aug 16, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> A 315 cmh has no where near the coverage and intensity of a 1000 watt hid.
> 
> I have the sun system and a Phillips 3100k and I do really like it but it doesn't even compete with my 600 Hortilux Super hps either. Lotta hype that distracts the buyer from the small coverage area with high gram per watt claims.
> 
> ...


Ive heard tall tales and outrageous claims from these 315 watt cmh fixtures as well. Everyone joining on the hype train. And you sir are correct. Many of my grower buddys arw finding these to have optimal coverage at 2.5 x 2.5 square. 3x3 is max and thats pushing it. One buddy grows big plants and has relegated one Sun Systems 315 in a 3x3 covering ONE plant. And it kicks ass but to compare these to mogul socket sixers or thouies in yield is pinnochios nose. At least what ive seen first hand in about 4 grower friends ops. Hell...all the industry even says these are optimal for SUPPLEMENTAL lighting for flower. But there is no question these are the better spectrum for more tasty..smelly amd potent end product. Its obvious because of the cmh sun like spectrum. In veg ive heard but havent seen these blow past t5's and standard mh hid lamps. What iam getting a hard on over is the very new double ended cmh fixtures just now coming out. I like the 630 i think. And these seem like they would pair up nice with 600 watt double ended hps in a flower room. One for every one for the bees knees in quality and quantity. Again this is just what iam thinking. But what i do know is the initial claims of comparable yields of single ended thouies or sixers has not happening. At least im the few growrooms around town i have visited. The irony here is just the opposite of when LED first hit the scene a few years back. It was the manufacturers and marketing that made the bold claims that growers found out (at a pricey cost) werent jiving. With the 315 cmh...its the growers themselves making up some tall tales. Anyone notice that no real pros and veterans are making these claims and the big players with huge operations? With all this said..i want 8 cmh 630 watt fixtures. One for every Gavita 600 double iam running now. Inna checkerboard pattern. One blue..one red..so on. Iam thinking hps for the weight. CMH de for the quality. One thing is certain....the old paradigm of mogul socket HID (hps for flower...mh for veg) is gone forever. I been growing steadily since 1991 and i have seen alot over the years but nothing like the advancements and choices in the last 5 or 7 years we have made in lighting choices. Just so many it makes my head spin. Led..cobs..compact curly floros..double ended hps and cmh..plasma..Just all kinds of lighting choices i got blasted with in less than 10 years. Before that it was single ended mogul socket hid for veg and flower..and t12 floros for cloning...and that was IT!!!! Not to mention vent fans. All we had in the early days were the dreaded "squirrel cage" blowers and for smell.. "Ion fountains" and ozone machines. God what a joke those were. In line blowers and charcoal filters really were game changers. A grow tent? That was a plywood cabinet lined with mylar and you made it yourself. Lol. Enough rambling. Iam done here. Iam higher than a Georgia Pine on some Glue right now. Good thread though. Carry on growers.


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## TheChemist77 (Aug 16, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> A 315 cmh has no where near the coverage and intensity of a 1000 watt hid.
> 
> I have the sun system and a Phillips 3100k and I do really like it but it doesn't even compete with my 600 Hortilux Super hps either. Lotta hype that distracts the buyer from the small coverage area with high gram per watt claims.
> 
> ...




3 315's work great, i agree the 315 is better when u use multiple fixtures, i replaced my 2 600 watt hps with 3 315's and im not looking back, higher gpw, plants finish faster, and im saving 255 watts... i also like the color for taking pix in the room,,no more orange tint...


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## genuity (Aug 16, 2017)

https://www.rollitup.org/t/50000-square-feet-colorado-legal-rec-grow.883667/page-35

Not a 8 light setup.... but what ever... and he give first had experience. 

It's the grower that makes things work,not the light..... 

Even the few big ops in Colorado I went to,was running walls of 315lec(but them was production ops,so not much care for the plants)

Common sense should tell anyone,that 315 watts of anything is not compatible with a 1000 watt....


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## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 16, 2017)

genuity said:


> https://www.rollitup.org/t/50000-square-feet-colorado-legal-rec-grow.883667/page-35
> 
> Not a 8 light setup.... but what ever... and he give first had experience.
> 
> ...



Yes but the common claim is it is a direct replacement for a 600. But it really is closer to 450 watts of hps for coverage.


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## genuity (Aug 16, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Yes but the common claim is it is a direct replacement for a 600. But it really is closer to 450 watts of hps for coverage.


When i got my first 315lec's,I was told they was just very good lights...not a replacement for anything..with a 600 over a 4x4 & 2 315lec over a 3x6 (same clone).. the 315lec out preformed the 600...in all categories. 

Running the same clone under 600hps then 315lec.... I like the 315"s 3x3 canopy.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 16, 2017)

genuity said:


> When i got my first 315lec's,I was told they was just very good lights...not a replacement for anything..with a 600 over a 4x4 & 2 315lec over a 3x6 (same clone).. the 315lec out preformed the 600...in all categories.
> 
> Running the same clone under 600hps then 315lec.... I like the 315"s 3x3 canopy.


Well I'm not surprised 2 would beat 1 600 eapecially in the proper footprint you used. 

What do you mean you like the 3x3 canopy? I try to stay 3.5'x3.5' under a 600 for best results. 

And would you prefer 2 600 hps with one 315 in the middle or 2 315's with 1 600 in the middle over a 7' x 3.5' area?

I can't decide if I want to get new hps ballasts as mine are 3 years old or another 315?


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 16, 2017)

genuity said:


> When i got my first 315lec's,I was told they was just very good lights...not a replacement for anything..with a 600 over a 4x4 & 2 315lec over a 3x6 (same clone).. the 315lec out preformed the 600...in all categories.
> 
> Running the same clone under 600hps then 315lec.... I like the 315"s 3x3 canopy.


That's what I'm trying to figure out, I can run 2 315lec"s in my setup but from my understanding it won't give me the same size nugs of a 600. I ran a 1000watt hps in a 4x4 and it was sick and so was the light bill


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 16, 2017)

Ok before I spend my hard earned money let me make sure I understand. A 315 lec cover around 3x3 area and the benefits are more resin production,better color and smell followed my no exhaust fan needed to cool off the light bulb, and less use of electricity. But I will have smaller size buds ! Did I hit the nail on the head?


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## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 16, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Ok before I spend my hard earned money let me make sure I understand. A 315 lec cover around 3x3 area and the benefits are more resin production,better color and smell followed my no exhaust fan needed to cool off the light bulb, and less use of electricity. But I will have smaller size buds ! Did I hit the nail on the head?


They get as hot as an open HID bulb gets. You will likely need ventilation. Never heard no exhaust needed. Well unless it's a sealed air conditioned room.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 16, 2017)

I have a 4x8 tent and running a 4 bucket dwc on one side and a 3x3 f&d system on the other side with co2 & a portable a.c. unit inside the tent.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 16, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> I have a 4x8 tent and running a 4 bucket dwc on one side and a 3x3 f&d system on the other side with co2 & a portable a.c. unit inside the tent.


I didn't know about the ac when I commented above.


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## genuity (Aug 16, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Well I'm not surprised 2 would beat 1 600 eapecially in the proper footprint you used.
> 
> What do you mean you like the 3x3 canopy? I try to stay 3.5'x3.5' under a 600 for best results.
> 
> ...


That's the setup I ran it in...a 2x2 tray filled with 9 -1gal pots of Rich soil/feed was Neptune's harvest,with a 3x3 canopy over top.

I always run the 600's/1000s over a 4x4 (depending on hood spread ) 

I like the sounds of 2 600/630DE-R with a 315lec...

But if I would of got that (sun system grow beast) I would go 2 315lec with a 630DE-R...



Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> That's what I'm trying to figure out, I can run 2 315lec"s in my setup but from my understanding it won't give me the same size nugs of a 600. I ran a 1000watt hps in a 4x4 and it was sick and so was the light bill


I just think the nugs development under the lec give off that deception,of being smaller.
It just stacks different.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 16, 2017)

Does anyone have pictures of buds grown with a lec v.s. a hps


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 16, 2017)

I still have my 2 600"s and my 1000watt setup but that light bill was like 600$


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## genuity (Aug 16, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Does anyone have pictures of buds grown with a lec v.s. a hps


I'm sure on you tube or something....for sure.

Edit:


----------



## genuity (Aug 16, 2017)

But it still falls back to the grower...all in how you go about it.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 16, 2017)

I think I'm gonna go for it and order 2 315 lec"s


----------



## genuity (Aug 16, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> I think I'm gonna go for it and order 2 315 lec"s







I like these vids the best...


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## ttystikk (Aug 16, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> I think I'm gonna go for it and order 2 315 lec"s


Do yourself a favor and insist on Philips brand low frequency digital square wave ballasts for them.


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## since1991 (Aug 17, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> I think I'm gonna go for it and order 2 315 lec"s


Stick 2 315's over a 3x6 table or area. Do the same with 2 600 watt hps lamps. See what your final weigh in is. I can almost guarantee you the weight will not even be close. You will have some frosty smelly sweet nugs but the weight...mmeh. Next..cram all 4 lamps in a checkerboard pattern over a 6x6 table or area...then do a weigh in.


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## ttystikk (Aug 17, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Stick 2 315's over a 3x6 table or area. Do the same with 2 600 watt hps lamps. See what your final weigh in is. I can almost guarantee you the weight will not even be close. You will have some frosty smelly sweet nugs but the weight...mmeh. Next..cram all 4 lamps in a checkerboard pattern over a 6x6 table or area...then do a weigh in.


The weight will be closer than you think, bro.


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## since1991 (Aug 17, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> The weight will be closer than you think, bro.


Ive seen it. At a buddys house. He got 2 and a half pounds of trimmed dry and cured nugs from the 2 sixers. And 2 pounds exactly from the 2 315's. The 315's gave up a higher quality product though. Half a pound difference using almost half the wattage. Not bad. But still...thats 8 ounces. Next...he is putting all 4 together in a 6x6. I will report on what he gets. It will be a couple months.


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## TheChemist77 (Aug 17, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Does anyone have pictures of buds grown with a lec v.s. a hps





https://www.rollitup.org/t/chemist77-315-watt-cdl-grow.880895/page-15


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## GroErr (Aug 17, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Ive seen it. At a buddys house. He got 2 and a half pounds of trimmed dry and cured nugs from the 2 sixers. And 2 pounds exactly from the 2 315's. The 315's gave up a higher quality product though. Half a pound difference using almost half the wattage. Not bad. But still...thats 8 ounces. Next...he is putting all 4 together in a 6x6. I will report on what he gets. It will be a couple months.


Use 4x 315's run them in a 6x6 and get 4 lbs from 1260w vs. 1830w?

Just by the numbers:

2x 600 = 1120g = .93 gpw
2x 315's = 908g = 1.44 gpw
2x 315's & 2x 600 = 908g + 1120g = 2028g = 1.11 gpw (1830w blended total)

Winner:
4x 315's = 1816g = 1.44 gpw (1260w total)
or comparing watt-for-watt as close as possible
6x 315's in a 6x9' 1890w total x 1.44 gpw = 1890w total & 2724g vs. 2028g

Correct me if I'm wrong but the 315's sound like a much better option, forget about "equivalent" watts, that's just marketing bull-shit and hype. Numbers don't lie, people do


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## since1991 (Aug 17, 2017)

GroErr said:


> Use 4x 315's run them in a 6x6 and get 4 lbs from 1260w vs. 1830w?
> 
> Just by the numbers:
> 
> ...


Go for it. Sounds like a plan. Crunch all the numbers you want but going out...buying all the equipment and applying it with skill in the real world and what not is a whole other different dealy. Trying to get 2.5 pounds off of 2 sixers i can tell you with many years experience...many make the claim...many arent actually doing it. Its not easy. Anyone that claims it is is a bullshitter or a third year wannabe pro. A vast majority of 600 watt single ended hps users are getting 10 to 15 ounces per lamp. The jury is still ouy on 315's because they are newish but a pound per from them isnt easy street as well. It takes a dialed room and strain...with perfect conditions at all times and an even perfect canopy.


----------



## GroErr (Aug 17, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Go for it. Sounds like a plan. Crunch all the numbers you want but going out...buying all the equipment and applying it with skill in the real world and what not is a whole other different dealy. Trying to get 2.5 pounds off of 2 sixers i can tell you with many years experience...many make the claim...many arent actually doing it. Its not easy. Anyone that claims it is is a bullshitter or a third year wannabe pro. A vast majority of 600 watt single ended hps users are getting 10 to 15 ounces per lamp. The jury is still ouy on 315's because they are newish but a pound per from them isnt easy street as well. It takes a dialed room and strain...with perfect conditions at all times and an even perfect canopy.


These aren't newish, they were newish 3 years ago when I first grabbed them. I ran 2x 315's for 2+ years and was grabbing 10-12 zips per light doing multi strain pheno hunts ffs. I know what they're capable of. 1lb. per 315 is easy dialled in and single strain/clone run for production (boring as shit but doable if that's your gig). I'm using COBs right now only because I can run more light in the same space and they're a little more flexible for me (I couldn't run 3x 315's in the space I have right now without major mods that I wasn't willing to bother with). But in the right conditions or different space/room I'd go back and use the 315's again, no question.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 17, 2017)

Ok fam, both of you make Damn good points. I'm in a new place and have a place I can do my work in without any stress. I'm really trying to get away from a light bill that makes me dizzy lol. And the thought of running lec"s @240 volts with a output of 1.38 to 2.0 really got my attention and the notions of better quality over quantity also got me thinking. Well anyway,, I will be running 2 systems in a 4x8 tent ...Dwc & F&D . It's the light bill that scares the shit out of me lol.


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## since1991 (Aug 17, 2017)

Mine has been a thought for over 20 years. 2000$ + per month in most situations


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 17, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Mine has been a thought for over 20 years. 2000$ + per month in most situations


Shit man and I'm crying about 600$


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## genuity (Aug 18, 2017)

Shit all I did was put my 315lec in the flower room (which is not close to a perfect room) and got "about a pound"(13-14 zips)....it seems easy to me..


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## since1991 (Aug 18, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Shit man and I'm crying about 600$


And 1500 - 2000 bucks is small potatos to some growers i know. Shit is expensive isnt it? Gotta pay to play is what they say. I try and pull off a monster outdoor season every year and that covers a large chunk if not all of my indoor electric and water bill for the year. Kinda like in the Deadliest Catch where they hate running cod in the off season but they do it because it basically covers food and fuel for the King and Opie crab seasons.


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## cannapharm (Aug 18, 2017)

Hello fellas. Ive been lurking for a while and since running my 315 for about a year now, I can finally make a comment based on my actual experience. I've ran my 3.5x3.5 tent with different styles of growing (see pics) just to get the feel of this light. At one point, I was attempting to convince all my farmer friends to make the switch based on the result I was getting. But then I was able to compare my final product to one grown under HPS. Someone has mentioned this on this thread, lec/cmh will be a killer supplemental light imo. It makes my ladies look pretty, grow well, produce all kinds of colors, ets. BUT the nug density is just not there (compared to HPS). I know there are a lot of other factors to consider and not just the light but this is what I've concluded for now.... Same mom for all these,

P.S. Im not a pro at taking pictures


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## since1991 (Aug 18, 2017)

cannapharm said:


> Hello fellas. Ive been lurking for a while and since running my 315 for about a year now, I can finally make a comment based on my actual experience. I've ran my 3.5x3.5 tent with different styles of growing (see pics) just to get the feel of this light. At one point, I was attempting to convince all my farmer friends to make the switch based on the result I was getting. But then I was able to compare my final product to one grown under HPS. Someone has mentioned this on this thread, lec/cmh will be a killer supplemental light imo. It makes my ladies look pretty, grow well, produce all kinds of colors, ets. BUT the nug density is just not there (compared to HPS). I know there are a lot of other factors to consider and not just the light but this is what I've concluded for now.... Same mom for all these,
> 
> P.S. Im not a pro at taking pictures


Your results from several crops confirms what I have found in my buddys grows around town for about a year as well. They shine when used in conjunction with hps. But stand alone they just don't bring it like some good ole high pressure sodiums. Maybe with a shit ton of em close together...with light overlap. Great spectrum. Superior to hps spectrum...but they just dont have the horsepower alone. Maybe if and when double ended cmh catches on results might be different. Alls I know is Gavita double ended hps kick much ass. Its the go to fixture for production.


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## cannapharm (Aug 18, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Your results from several crops confirms what I have found in my buddys grows around town for about a year as well. They shine when used in conjunction with hps. But stand alone they just don't bring it like some good ole high pressure sodiums. Maybe with a shit ton of em close together...with light overlap. Great spectrum. Superior to hps spectrum...but they just dont have the horsepower alone. Maybe if and when double ended cmh catches on results might be different. Alls I know is Gavita double ended hps kick much ass. Its the go to fixture for production.


Yup i think the overlap would have better results than only one lamp as I have tried out. I've been considering 630 DE CMH but leaning more toward 1k DE HPS as I can also confirm those thouies are go to for production. But Im in no rush to invest lol


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## since1991 (Aug 18, 2017)

cannapharm said:


> Yup i think the overlap would have better results than only one lamp as I have tried out. I've been considering 630 DE CMH but leaning more toward 1k DE HPS as I can also confirm those thouies are go to for production. But Im in no rush to invest lol


I run 8 x Gavita 6/750's in my main flower room. If i monocrop a production cut of a high yield og variant (diamond) or my Santa Cruz Blue Dream I can hit 16 to 18 pounds trimmed dried and cured SOLID buds a run on the 750 watt setting for each lamp. It was way more difficult to hit that back in the day with 8x 1000 watt single ended hps fixtures. Alot more work and attention to detail. The most minor of hicupps and i would see it in the bottom line. Anyways...I highly doubt 15 or even 20 315 watt cmh lamps crammed together would touch them numbers. Granted..the power is way less so there is that..but at 400 plus dollars a fixture...iam gonna wait a few and see how the double ended cmh lamps play out before I pull the trigger. Iam all for a less power bill like everyone else bit there are other factors to consider. One thing is certain...If i do buy a bunch of them...they will be used with hps lamps together.


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## augusto1 (Aug 18, 2017)

since1991 said:


> I run 8 x Gavita 6/750's in my main flower room. If i monocrop a production cut of a high yield og variant (diamond) or my Santa Cruz Blue Dream I can hit 16 to 18 pounds trimmed dried and cured SOLID buds a run on the 750 watt setting for each lamp. It was way more difficult to hit that back in the day with 8x 1000 watt single ended hps fixtures. Alot more work and attention to detail. The most minor of hicupps and i would see it in the bottom line. Anyways...I highly doubt 15 or even 20 315 watt cmh lamps crammed together would touch them numbers. Granted..the power is way less so there is that..but at 400 plus dollars a fixture...iam gonna wait a few and see how the double ended cmh lamps play out before I pull the trigger. Iam all for a less power bill like everyone else bit there are other factors to consider. One thing is certain...If i do buy a bunch of them...they will be used with hps lamps together.


What is the size of the room that you have the 8 Gavitas 6/750 and with how many plants are you getting 16 to 18 pounds?, thanks in advance.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 18, 2017)

Hps 600 no hood just the light bulb hanging their in between the lec"s ? Hum


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 18, 2017)

I just ordered 2lec"s and a titan 240 watt light controller


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## since1991 (Aug 18, 2017)

augusto1 said:


> What is the size of the room that you have the 8 Gavitas 6/750 and with how many plants are you getting 16 to 18 pounds?, thanks in advance.


The room is 14 x 22. But the lights are 4 to a side (4x 16 of canopy every 4 lamps - each lamp covering 4x4 with a two tiered net trellis) with a 2 foot aisle down the middle. 2 feet of walkway down the wall ends. 2 feet in back. And about 4 or 5 feet soon as you open the door for shelving. Santa fe dehuey and tools..brooms..pedestal fans. Carbon scrubber with inline etc. I also have wall mount fans 3 to a side. 15 inchers mounted on the side walls. My mitsu split blower is mounted up at the far end. I try to pack 4 to 6 plants under each 4x4 sometimes more but no less than 4 plants. I run a perpetual more or less of several strains. Something always coming and going. If i get real focused I try and run each side a month to 5 weeks apart. I also have another room next to this one running 4x 1000 watt single ended hps lamps. I try and run this in the cooler months. Its not always cranking like the Gavita room. I have several cultivars in the stable including the usual suspects like Dream...Glue...Og variants...plus a bunch of Sin City Seeds gear and a few others.


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## since1991 (Aug 18, 2017)

since1991 said:


> The room is 14 x 22. But the lights are 4 to a side (4x 16 of canopy every 4 lamps - each lamp covering 4x4 with a two tiered net trellis) with a 2 foot aisle down the middle. 2 feet of walkway down the wall ends. 2 feet in back. And about 4 or 5 feet soon as you open the door for shelving. Santa fe dehuey and tools..brooms..pedestal fans. Carbon scrubber with inline etc. I also have wall mount fans 3 to a side. 15 inchers mounted on the side walls. My mitsu split blower is mounted up at the far end. I try to pack 4 to 6 plants under each 4x4 sometimes more but no less than 4 plants. I run a perpetual more or less of several strains. Something always coming and going. If i get real focused I try and run each side a month to 5 weeks apart. I also have another room next to this one running 4x 1000 watt single ended hps lamps. I try and run this in the cooler months. Its not always cranking like the Gavita room. I have several cultivars in the stable including the usual suspects like Dream...Glue...Og variants...plus a bunch of Sin City Seeds gear and a few others.


Iam dealing with a short clearance Michigan basement. So i need every inch i can get. But i would like to ditch all the walk ways...reposition the lamps all together for maximum overlap (and a definite increase in yield from it) by using short as hell run off tables mounted on caster roll around wheels to get to the canopy for maintenance and working. But i tried that and iam losing height so I have to settle for traditional production rooms with walkways to get to the plants. But a buddy has a similar setup with an 8 foot tall basement and does the table/frame with wheels and has all the lamps and canopy bunched together and really bangs out the numbers with weight. If he has to get to a certain spot in the garden...he just rolls a section out the way for working...then rolls it back. Sweet. And I wish I could do the same. Having no walkways and all the light together really increases final weight.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 18, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Iam dealing with a short clearance Michigan basement. So i need every inch i can get. But i would like to ditch all the walk ways...reposition the lamps all together for maximum overlap (and a definite increase in yield from it) by using short as hell run off tables mounted on caster roll around wheels to get to the canopy for maintenance and working. But i tried that and iam losing height so I have to settle for traditional production rooms with walkways to get to the plants. But a buddy has a similar setup with an 8 foot tall basement and does the table/frame with wheels and has all the lamps and canopy bunched together and really bangs out the numbers with weight. If he has to get to a certain spot in the garden...he just rolls a section out the way for working...then rolls it back. Sweet. And I wish I could do the same. Having no walkways and all the light together really increases final weight.



I have only 6'4" to the old beams in the ceiling of my basement. I struggle with how to finally set up down there like you. 

Even in the spare bedroom upstairs in my old converted cabin house I don't even have 7 feet. 

So I use single ended 600's and Grow 30" bushes max and try to bud them down to bottom. 

I am trying to add the 315 in between to increase quality and yield in the same space.


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## since1991 (Aug 18, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I have only 6'4" to the old beams in the ceiling of my basement. I struggle with how to finally set up down there like you.
> 
> Even in the spare bedroom upstairs in my old converted cabin house I don't even have 7 feet.
> 
> ...


Are you running drain to waste drip setup in pots? Cuz if you are i can tell ya how to get the lowest clearance possible and still get that waste water out and away without running tables or shop vac (PAIN IN THEE ASS) saucers automated with the least amount of work.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 18, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Are you running drain to waste drip setup in pots? Cuz if you are i can tell ya how to get the lowest clearance possible and still get that waste water out and away without running tables or shop vac (PAIN IN THEE ASS) saucers automated with the least amount of work.


Actually I run a plant staggered every 10 days or so and harvest around the same to stay in plant and meds on hand counts. So all the plants are different sizes and stages. All different strains from seed usually. 

I hand water and mix nutes individually for each plant for best results and even monitor their runoff and keep a log. 

Not a very high yielding technique I know. And very time consuming. But variety and quality are outstanding. 

I have been getting a pound to 22 oz per month with 2 600's and 250 watts of fluorescent in veg. 

I ran the 315 as a 3rd area over the winter but it got too hot the way I had it set up in the little room in summer. 

I have a ventilation plan now and really liked the mixed spectrum with the 315 added to the Hortilux super hps so 2 600's and 1 315 in the middle over a 3.5' x 7' area should up my output by bulking up my 8 little bushes more. 

Here is one with the leaves stripped for harvest to give you an idea. 

 

And a pic with the 2 600's. 

 

I am thinking of either hanging the Phillips 315 in between and just below the glass of the reflectors or fitting the sun system remote reflector in the middle. Which means I have to relocate all my inline fans for space on the light stand I built. 

There are only 6 plants at the time of this pic. Usually 8 are present.


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## since1991 (Aug 19, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Actually I run a plant staggered every 10 days or so and harvest around the same to stay in plant and meds on hand counts. So all the plants are different sizes and stages. All different strains from seed usually.
> 
> I hand water and mix nutes individually for each plant for best results and even monitor their runoff and keep a log.
> 
> ...


If yer getting 22 zippers per month on 2 sixers on a perpetual staggered...your shit is on point. Period. Damn all the extras...thats just work and how a grower approaches said work. Not many can nail almost 3 units every 60 days with 1200 watts of hps. Good job.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 19, 2017)

since1991 said:


> If yer getting 22 zippers per month on 2 sixers on a perpetual staggered...your shit is on point. Period. Damn all the extras...thats just work and how a grower approaches said work. Not many can nail almost 3 units every 60 days with 1200 watts of hps. Good job.


Thank you. It took a lot of practice. And you're right. It's a lot of work.


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## ttystikk (Aug 19, 2017)

since1991 said:


> If yer getting 22 zippers per month on 2 sixers on a perpetual staggered...your shit is on point. Period. Damn all the extras...thats just work and how a grower approaches said work. Not many can nail almost 3 units every 60 days with 1200 watts of hps. Good job.


I think it's a total of 2400W but still nothing to complain about.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 19, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> I think it's a total of 2400W but still nothing to complain about.



I have never had 2400 watts including veg and even the air conditioner I use in summer. 

2 600's in flower room. (May add back the 315)

10 24 watt 2 foot t-5 tubes in veg tent. 

I had added a 315 and a 3x3 area during winter to the flower room. But I had 4-5 plants per month production then. Not the 3 plants per month I get the 16-22 oz dry nugs with. 

There is also a 1/4 pound of leaf trim and loose buds each month for edibles and concentrates not included above. 

My journal posted at rm3 dot com showed these results documented clearly. 

Thanks for your input. Although incorrect.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 26, 2017)

does anyone know if these can be hooked up to operate 120volts when they say 240volts or do they come in 120volts with 8 outlets


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## ttystikk (Aug 26, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> View attachment 4000678 does anyone know if these can be hooked up to operate 120volts when they say 240volts or do they come in 120volts with 8 outlets


You don't want to get one with 8 outlets on 120 volts, bro. 

Here's why; someone will want to plug 8 x 1000W into it, which at 120V is 67 amps! That's a recipe for disaster.

Better to run the same 8000W load on 240V and half the amps, plus some headroom for safety, that's why they come in 240V and 40A max draw.

I have several of those very units from Titan Controls, the Helios 8, and they're affordable and robust.

If you absolutely must pull that many watts at 120V then you really need a 40A sub panel with 240V in and lots of separately fused 120V plugs, evenly split between the two legs of your 240V service.

Since you're asking this question, I strongly recommend you find a qualified electrician to help you design and install your power, so you don't fry some wires and burn your place down. Seriously.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 27, 2017)

@ttys I bought a titan light controller box that's a 4 plug 240 volts for my lights...2 315lec and 2 600 watt hps. I was thinking about another titan for my air pumps,water pumps, a.c., exhaust ran and co2. All input is needed and wanted my friend


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## ttystikk (Aug 27, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> @ttys I bought a titan light controller box that's a 4 plug 240 volts for my lights...2 315lec and 2 600 watt hps. I was thinking about another titan for my air pumps,water pumps, a.c., exhaust ran and co2. All input is needed and wanted my friend


Ok so low wattage stuff, then. Get a circuit breaker protected power strip and put everything except the AC unit on it. Pumps, fans and the CO2 relay won't draw much juice.

How big is your AC unit in terms of output and power draw?


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 27, 2017)

Not really sure but it's 10k btu and it's 120volts.....portable a.c.


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## ttystikk (Aug 27, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Not really sure but it's 10k btu and it's 120volts.....portable a.c.


The panel will tell you how many watts. I'm gonna guess 1000W or thereabouts.

1000W/120V = 8.3 amps, so it would be best to run it on its own separate 15A circuit.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 27, 2017)

That's cool , I replaced the main breaker box for the house so I now have space to add on for my man cave aka special room


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 27, 2017)

So I'm on the right track? #1 put a.c. on its own circuit #2 get a light controller for all of the little equipment co2, inline fan, and pumps!


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## ttystikk (Aug 27, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> So I'm on the right track? #1 put a.c. on its own circuit #2 get a light controller for all of the little equipment co2, inline fan, and pumps!


You don't need a light controller for all the little stuff, just a circuit breaker protected power strip. If some or all of those items need to be off for part of the day, put them on a timer.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 27, 2017)

Ok that will free up some money


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## ttystikk (Aug 27, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Ok that will free up some money


I'm here to help, buddy!


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Aug 29, 2017)

Mailman came and dropped off my package and I went to get romex


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 3, 2017)

ok I bought this light controller and it said to use a 30amp but can that be correct. I would think 4000k would need a bigger amp


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 3, 2017)




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## since1991 (Sep 3, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> View attachment 4004641 ok I bought this light controller and it said to use a 30amp but can that be correct. I would think 4000k would need a bigger amp


You can run 4000 on 30 amp 240v. I had one of those running on 30 amp breaker...for years. When you step up to 8 light relays is when you need the bigger 50 amp breaker slot.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 3, 2017)

So what size breaker should I get and should it be a double?


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 3, 2017)

Thank you 91. This one had me stumbling since I have a fear of live wires


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## since1991 (Sep 3, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> So what size breaker should I get and should it be a double?


30 and 50 are double. Need 2 slots in your fuse panel.


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## since1991 (Sep 3, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Thank you 91. This one had me stumbling since I have a fear of live wires


Its not hard. Just turn off mains breaker and have at it. Its when I need a bigger fuse panel itself that I call in a sparky for a new grow spot. After a bigger fuse box panel is in..he can leave and let me do my thing.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 3, 2017)

I'm using the romex 240 wire running to the circuit panel. That's 2 hot wires 1 ground and 1white. So shouldn't it be a double?


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 3, 2017)

Ok sorry about the time delay on the post,


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 3, 2017)




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## Trollinlife (Sep 3, 2017)

So I started my first official grow a couple of weeks ago. Started with 6 seedling 3 sour diesel haze autos and 3 amnesia haze autos. One of the amnesias didn't make it out so my original plan to run 3 2gals went out the door so I swapped to 3 gals to make up for the loss of one plant. I'm kind of worried my one Phantom 315 isn't going to suffice but if I don't train at all I figured it would be alright. I'm also unsure of the feeding on autos so I've also included the feeding chart which recommends 1/2 strength nutes the entire lifecycle. I'm open to constructive criticism and guidance to bigger and better yields. 

Specs
4x4  
315 phantom CMH with Phillips bulb 3100k
3 gal auto pots 
3 part general hydroponic nutes


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## inventelpk (Sep 19, 2017)

In 7 3x3 room 

Wich is better 14 cmh 315 or 7 cmh 630?

Or maybe is a little overkill and only 7 315?

The heat is not a problem.

Thank you


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## Bad Karma (Sep 19, 2017)

inventelpk said:


> In 7 3x3 room
> 
> Wich is better 14 cmh 315 or 7 cmh 630?
> 
> ...


You only need a single 315 per 3x3 room. So seven 315's would be perfect for you.


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## inventelpk (Sep 19, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> You only need a single 315 per 3x3 room. So seven 315's would be perfect for you.


 Hi, thanks for the reply
Room Size are 22,9 ft ( 7 meters ) x 12.59 ft ( 3.84 meters )

Sealed room and lighs water etc are outside

What config are better ? 3 lines with 7 315 each line? 
Or 3 line with 630 double ended lec?

Thank you


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## ttystikk (Sep 19, 2017)

inventelpk said:


> Hi, thanks for the reply
> Room Size are 22,9 ft ( 7 meters ) x 12.59 ft ( 3.84 meters )
> 
> Sealed room and lighs water etc are outside
> ...


3 rows with seven 315W CMH each. You'll have room for 2 aisles about 50cm wide.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 19, 2017)




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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 19, 2017)

Time to play and see if it works


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 20, 2017)

Doing some research on brewing tea for hydroponics anyone can point me in the right direction?


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## ttystikk (Sep 20, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Doing some research on brewing tea for hydroponics anyone can point me in the right direction?


Friends in the neighborhood of hydro. Great for coco, not so good for RDWC.


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## xox (Sep 21, 2017)

hey i thought i'd drop in here with a question. thinking about buying one of these

https://www.amazon.com/Sun-System-Cooled-Fixture-3100K/dp/B01GUXV8TM

anyone own one of these how does it compare for heat vs 600watt hps air cooled hood


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 21, 2017)

I'm using two 315"lec"s and two 600. The lec"s still produce heat just like a 600.


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## ttystikk (Sep 21, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> I'm using two 315"lec"s and two 600. The lec"s still produce heat just like a 600.


Not in my experience; it took two of them to make the same heat as one 600W HPS.


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## jonsnow399 (Sep 21, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> I'm using two 315"lec"s and two 600. The lec"s still produce heat just like a 600.


The difference is the lec's don't put off much IR to heat the plants, so they are cooler than hps


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## since1991 (Sep 21, 2017)

With HID lamps...hps..hps de...mh...cmh..they almost all produce the same "watt of heat". A concentrated point source of heat. Generally...a room packed with equivalent wattage of any of em will usually require the same btu rated air conditoner if they arent enclosed air cooled reclectors using duct and fans. And depending on where you live (outside weather a1md seasons)...how many lights your using...and how your air cooled ducting/reflectors and fans are setup...you might (almost always) still need air conditioning with air cooled hoods. Albeit...not as much.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Sep 21, 2017)

since1991 said:


> With HID lamps...hps..hps de...mh...cmh..they almost all produce the same "watt of heat". A concentrated point source of heat. Generally...a room packed with equivalent wattage of any of em will usually require the same btu rated air conditoner if they arent enclosed air cooled reclectors using duct and fans. And depending on where you live (outside weather a1md seasons)...how many lights your using...and how your air cooled ducting/reflectors and fans are setup...you might (almost always) still need air conditioning with air cooled hoods. Albeit...not as much.


Agreed. This is my experience too. And good advice for a new cmh buyer. It was as hot or hotter than my 400w metal halide. 

Funny thing is the 315's new design is to run hotter than a metal halide of the same wattage. It has new hotter burning gasses to get the new spectrum and par. 

The square wave ballast allows the bulb to do this consistently.


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## ttystikk (Sep 21, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> The difference is the lec's don't put off much IR to heat the plants, so they are cooler than hps


They actually do, I've personally checked it with a Lighting Passport.

They put off half the heat because they pull half the watts.


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## jonsnow399 (Sep 21, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> They actually do, I've personally checked it with a Lighting Passport.
> 
> They put off half the heat because they pull half the watts.


Not exactly sure what you mean, but I don't care what the Passport says I can tell by the reflectors heating up. With a lec the reflectors hardly heat up with a hps bulb they get too hot too touch.


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## chakup (Sep 21, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> Not exactly sure what you mean, but I don't care what the Passport says I can tell by the reflectors heating up. With a lec the reflectors hardly heat up with a hps bulb they get too hot too touch.


You're also comparing reflectors taking 600watts with ones taking 300. Less watts is less heat.


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## ttystikk (Sep 21, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> Not exactly sure what you mean, but I don't care what the Passport says I can tell by the reflectors heating up. With a lec the reflectors hardly heat up with a hps bulb they get too hot too touch.


Ok. Then you don't care about quantifiable evidence.

I won't bother you with facts anymore.


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## ttystikk (Sep 21, 2017)

chakup said:


> You're also comparing reflectors taking 600watts with ones taking 300. Less watts is less heat.


Don't confuse him with facts, he clearly doesn't want to see them.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 21, 2017)

Portable a.c. in a grow tent with a inline fan should fix the heat problem if any


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## jonsnow399 (Sep 21, 2017)

When the facts are that the top of the reflector get very hot but the rest of the reflector is barely warm and when a hps is used the tip of reflector is too hot too touch i believe that fact not the instrument. Any metal nearby is heated with the hps not so with the lec.


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## ttystikk (Sep 21, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> When the facts are that the top of the reflector get very hot but the rest of the reflector is barely warm and when a hps is used the tip of reflector is too hot too touch i believe that fact not the instrument. Any metal nearby is heated with the hps not so with the lec.


That's because the lamp pulls half the watts.

But you know, facts. Not to be believed.


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## chakup (Sep 21, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> When the facts are that the top of the reflector get very hot but the rest of the reflector is barely warm and when a hps is used the tip of reflector is too hot too touch i believe that fact not the instrument. Any metal nearby is heated with the hps not so with the lec.


Maybe this will help- take a fixture and run at 100% and check whatever heat/area/ pot of gold you choose, day 2 run said fixture at 50% (1/2) power and test the same area and you'll discover something really amazing.


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## jonsnow399 (Sep 21, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> That's because the lamp pulls half the watts.
> 
> But you know, facts. Not to be believed.


a 400 hps heats the reflector MUCH hotter than the lec, but that pesky fact you ignore


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## jonsnow399 (Sep 21, 2017)

chakup said:


> Maybe this will help- take a fixture and run at 100% and check whatever heat/area/ pot of gold you choose, day 2 run said fixture at 50% (1/2) power and test the same area and you'll discover something really amazing.


Yeh, that the hps run at 50 percent heated the reflector less than running at 100 percent and that the lec heated the reflector much less than either.


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## ttystikk (Sep 21, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> a 400 hps heats the reflector MUCH hotter than the lec, but that pesky fact you ignore


Here I thought we were comparing two 315W LEC/CMH/CDM lamps to one 600W HPS?

I haven't ignored anything, nor have I attempted to bring in other lamps to 'prove' anything.

In fact, I've run all the lamps now being discussed, in large numbers, and I've both passively and actively cooled them both.

But I'm not trying to convince you, just share the facts with those who may come along and read this thread in the future.


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## jonsnow399 (Sep 21, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Here I thought we were comparing two 315W LEC/CMH/CDM lamps to one 600W HPS?
> 
> I haven't ignored anything, nor have I attempted to bring in other lamps to 'prove' anything.
> 
> ...


same difference, but people can try it for themselves and see.


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## chakup (Sep 21, 2017)

In my head was reading 600 as well. HPS is less efficient so will see more heat but that seems a little odd


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## ttystikk (Sep 21, 2017)

chakup said:


> In my head was reading 600 as well. HPS is less efficient so will see more heat but that seems a little odd


The heat is the same. The two 315W lamps provide much more PAR, which is where the savings come in.


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## since1991 (Sep 22, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> When the facts are that the top of the reflector get very hot but the rest of the reflector is barely warm and when a hps is used the tip of reflector is too hot too touch i believe that fact not the instrument. Any metal nearby is heated with the hps not so with the lec.


What wattage? Of course a 315 cmh (lec) is not gonna be as hot as a sixer of hps. Or even a 400 watt hps. I got buddys that use the double bulb 630 cmh fixtures. Guess what? They are just as hot as a 600 watt sodium. Iam telling you broseph...with HID lamps...a watt of heat is a watt of heat. They use different gasses to fire an arc tube to make a different spectrum...but the principal is the same. With equivalent wattage...they all generally produce the same amount of heat. I will go with "the facts" an instrument will provide and not me touching a reflector and coming to my own conclusions.


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## since1991 (Sep 22, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Portable a.c. in a grow tent with a inline fan should fix the heat problem if any


Not if its underrated (in btu's) for the heat load your trying to combat. There is actually a formula.


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## since1991 (Sep 22, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> a 400 hps heats the reflector MUCH hotter than the lec, but that pesky fact you ignore


85 watts of heat difference. Again...with HID lamps..a watt of heat is a watt of heat. Alot of growers (especially newer growers) go by hear say or what they want to beileve to be true. Like touching a reflector and thinking one lamp fixture is "cooler" than another. And that's as far as they go with it. There is a bunch of false shit going around these days. Here is a classic Ive heard alot....when you change the lamp wiring from 110v to 220v...you save on electricity. Lol. I remember that one was a doozy a few years back. But then some real deal growers like tty actually want to get to the bottom of things in the growroom. How shit really works. Include me in as well. Take a 630 watt cmh (lec) in a standard horizontal "batwing" reflector. Take a 600 watt mogul socket hps fixture in the same reflector. Let them both heat up for an hour side by side. Take an IR thermometer/temperature gun and take a reading at the same spot on both. Then get back with us. Lol.


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## jonsnow399 (Sep 22, 2017)

since1991 said:


> 85 watts of heat difference. Again...with HID lamps..a watt of heat is a watt of heat. Alot of growers (especially newer growers) go by hear say or what they want to beileve to be true. Like touching a reflector and thinking one lamp fixture is "cooler" than another. And that's as far as they go with it. There is a bunch of false shit going around these days. Here is a classic Ive heard alot....when you change the lamp wiring from 110v to 220v...you save on electricity. Lol. I remember that one was a doozy a few years back. But then some real deal growers like tty actually want to get to the bottom of things in the growroom. How shit really works. Include me in as well. Take a 630 watt cmh (lec) in a standard horizontal "batwing" reflector. Take a 600 watt mogul socket hps fixture in the same reflector. Let them both heat up for an hour side by side. Take an IR thermometer/temperature gun and take a reading at the same spot on both. Then get back with us. Lol.


don't have to. the hps will burn you , the lec won't lol


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## jonsnow399 (Sep 22, 2017)

since1991 said:


> What wattage? Of course a 315 cmh (lec) is not gonna be as hot as a sixer of hps. Or even a 400 watt hps. I got buddys that use the double bulb 630 cmh fixtures. Guess what? They are just as hot as a 600 watt sodium. Iam telling you broseph...with HID lamps...a watt of heat is a watt of heat. They use different gasses to fire an arc tube to make a different spectrum...but the principal is the same. With equivalent wattage...they all generally produce the same amount of heat. I will go with "the facts" an instrument will provide and not me touching a reflector and coming to my own conclusions.


Don't care what you do


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## since1991 (Sep 22, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> Don't care what you do


I do


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## since1991 (Sep 22, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> don't have to. the hps will burn you , the lec won't lol


Well then...set your cmh about a half inch from the tops of your plants...turn off all the fans...and let her rip. Lol. Cool to the touch buds. Hell...no dry and cure time even.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Sep 22, 2017)

This is an awesome discussion!


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## jonsnow399 (Sep 22, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Well then...set your cmh about a half inch from the tops of your plants...turn off all the fans...and let her rip. Lol. Cool to the touch buds. Hell...no dry and cure time even.


Reductio ad absurdum much? I can and do run the buds six inches away, try that with a 400 watt.


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## since1991 (Sep 22, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> Reductio ad absurdum much? I can and do run the buds six inches away, try that with a 400 watt.


There ya go. Smart grower. Good luck.


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## ttystikk (Sep 22, 2017)

since1991 said:


> 85 watts of heat difference. Again...with HID lamps..a watt of heat is a watt of heat. Alot of growers (especially newer growers) go by hear say or what they want to beileve to be true. Like touching a reflector and thinking one lamp fixture is "cooler" than another. And that's as far as they go with it. There is a bunch of false shit going around these days. Here is a classic Ive heard alot....when you change the lamp wiring from 110v to 220v...you save on electricity. Lol. I remember that one was a doozy a few years back. But then some real deal growers like tty actually want to get to the bottom of things in the growroom. How shit really works. Include me in as well. Take a 630 watt cmh (lec) in a standard horizontal "batwing" reflector. Take a 600 watt mogul socket hps fixture in the same reflector. Let them both heat up for an hour side by side. Take an IR thermometer/temperature gun and take a reading at the same spot on both. Then get back with us. Lol.


Thanks for the shout-out. Taking this a bit further, I've run water cooled LED. Watts are still watts, it's just a matter of where to put them to best effect.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 23, 2017)

At the end of the day we are here to help each other. It's up to you if you want to listen to another grower. I listened to jigs,oldfart ,bassman, doc and a few more over the years. Friends are hard to find in this hobby


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## ThatSpudGuy (Sep 25, 2017)

When it comes down to it guys. In terms of yield. 600 watt hps, 600 watt de hps or 315 watt cmh. Thanks


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## since1991 (Sep 25, 2017)

ThatSpudGuy said:


> When it comes down to it guys. In terms of yield. 600 watt hps, 600 watt de hps or 315 watt cmh. Thanks


600 watt double ended hps. All day. When it comes to putting the sun indoors...double ended hps and the very new double ended cmh fixtures are where its at. And if you like building your own lights...do it yourself COBS as well. Thing with the double ended lamps...you need air conditioning..and high ceilings. If you dont have the space or dont want to spend the big bucks on proper air conditioning units..double ended HID lamps are definitely not for you. I know a ton of growers that went out and bought them because the were told or heard they were "the best". Only to find out this isnt necesarily true unless other pricey factors go with it. Traditional single ended lamps and air cooled hoods still have a place. Especially for smaller tent and home growers in small spots and just a couple lamps.


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## Flowki (Sep 25, 2017)

In using 2x cmh to replace 1x 600 am I wrong in thinking this. With two cmh ballasts and more surface area to vent heat into the air>duct>out would that mean the ballasts combined are going to run cooler ambient than a 600 ballast?.


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## since1991 (Sep 25, 2017)

Flowki said:


> In using 2x cmh to replace 1x 600 am I wrong in thinking this. With two cmh ballasts and more surface area to vent heat into the air>duct>out would that mean the ballasts combined are going to run cooler ambient than a 600 ballast?.


What are your plants telling you compared to what they told you while basking under a single 600 watter?


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## thekingdomsallinside (Sep 26, 2017)

anyone know how to tell if its a t9 or t12 bulb? cant find anything online or in philips pdf leaflets.


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## since1991 (Sep 26, 2017)

thekingdomsallinside said:


> anyone know how to tell if its a t9 or t12 bulb? cant find anything online or in philips pdf leaflets.


The number (t5..t8..t12) is the diameter of the bulb in inches.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Sep 26, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> 3 rows with seven 315W CMH each. You'll have room for 2 aisles about 50cm wide.


@ttystikk @Bad Karma @since1991 @DemonTrich @GroErr Has anyone used this for a 12/12 room? The spec sheet on my phantom 315cmh says 1.5amp draw so four lights with my fans on 24hr this is way under my 30 amps allowable draw and I can cover only a 6' x 6' area? I have the phantom 315cmh ballast because it is a remote ballast. Are there better units that are also remote ballast?


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## since1991 (Sep 26, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> @ttystikk @Bad Karma @since1991 @DemonTrich @GroErr Has anyone used this for a 12/12 room? The spec sheet on my phantom 315cmh says 1.5amp draw so four lights with my fans on 24hr this is way under my 30 amps allowable draw and I can cover only a 6' x 6' area? I have the phantom 315cmh ballast because it is a remote ballast. Are there better units that are also remote ballast? View attachment 4017050


I know a buddy that has that same exact 4 lamp relay box. Extremely well built but expensive for what it actually is. You can get other switch boxes with trigger cord for the timer (I would go with a seperate timer - not one built in) for ALOT cheaper. And its preference but I like to hard wire my line from the fuse panel to the relay box. With those you have to wire a plug recepticle outlet to the line then plug the box into the recepticle. More work...more money. There are even instructions online on how to build your own relay switch box for really cheap. But those are nice. The extra outlets are cool for other accesories that need to be on when you set the timer.


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## DemonTrich (Sep 26, 2017)

X2 on just scoring a light controller for much cheaper.

Also the built.in timeer boxes. If the timer fails, the unit is worthless. 

I use this light controller as a power supply for my ac, and use the trigger cord plugged into my greenhouse controller as the on/off source.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 26, 2017)

Don't over think things family,sometimes the best of the best isn't worth the money. Save money where ever you can


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 27, 2017)

in between crying, pissing blood and trying to pass this kidney stone which is 6mms, I still found time to getherdone


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 27, 2017)

Next step is to wrap it up in rubber


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## Evil-Mobo (Sep 27, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Next step is to wrap it up in rubber


That's what she said


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 27, 2017)

Lol


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## ttystikk (Sep 27, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> View attachment 4017804 in between crying, pissing blood and trying to pass this kidney stone which is 6mms, I still found time to getherdone


Fucking ouch, bro. Hope you're feeling better?


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## Evil-Mobo (Sep 27, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> View attachment 4017804 in between crying, pissing blood and trying to pass this kidney stone which is 6mms, I still found time to getherdone


I recently passed (2) that were 4mm get better man stones are no joke been dealing with them for years.


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## Sailormoses (Sep 28, 2017)

thekingdomsallinside said:


> anyone know how to tell if its a t9 or t12 bulb? cant find anything online or in philips pdf leaflets.


 t9 designates single wall glass tube and t12 designates double wall glass tube


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## ttystikk (Sep 28, 2017)

Sailormoses said:


> t9 designates single wall glass tube and t12 designates double wall glass tube


Use the double tube for bare lamp or open fixture applications.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 28, 2017)

@evil thanks brother I'll be going into surgery this weekend. I'm glad I got some work done to the garden tho


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Sep 28, 2017)

DemonTrich said:


> X2 on just scoring a light controller for much cheaper.
> 
> Also the built.in timeer boxes. If the timer fails, the unit is worthless.
> 
> I use this light controller as a power supply for my ac, and use the trigger cord plugged into my greenhouse controller as the on/off source.


@DemonTrich would you mind PM me a little more info on how that controls the lights and the environment. Is your a/c on the thermostat controller?


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## thekingdomsallinside (Sep 29, 2017)

Sailormoses said:


> t9 designates single wall glass tube and t12 designates double wall glass tube


Thanks for that.Seems im using a t9 in an open hood.I talked to the store and they assured me it was perfectly fine and they had sold hundreds etc etc.I then read the 450 lec grow in colorado and hes in open as well.I'm loving the light but im a bit confused as to the risk? Is it any more than a metal halide for instance?


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 29, 2017)

Any bud porn before I go into the hospital guys?


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## ttystikk (Sep 29, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Any bud porn before I go into the hospital guys?


Best of luck. My brother in law said his kidney stones were the worst pain he's ever felt in his life.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 29, 2017)

if things go well I'll be able to finish this project for my dad before he loose all of his eyesight. 1964 vet


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 29, 2017)

@ttystikk trust me I know all to well. A woman told me today she rather give birth than to go through kidney stones again! I'm like Wyf?!##


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## NugHeuser (Sep 29, 2017)

Hey guys, just discovered this thread yesterday and I'm pretty interested in the cmh's.
I have a question. Does anybody personally have readings from their par meter on the 630w de cmh?
I got the growers choice in 3000k red a couple weeks ago and also just got a par meter today. I watched the postal carrier toss the package from about 5 feet away onto my step, was not happy. So now I'm wondering if it's even reading accurate or not.

At 33"(how high ive had it from my young plant)I'm only getting a reading of roughly 242.3 umol m2 s1 but the plant seems to be growing atleast an inch on branching per day and stacking nodes about every half inch. At about 17" I was getting roughly 671.2 umol m2 s1. 
Do these readings sound right?


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## ttystikk (Sep 29, 2017)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> @ttystikk trust me I know all to well. A woman told me today she rather give birth than to go through kidney stones again! I'm like Wyf?!##


That's exactly what my ex wife told me.

She was tough, and she looked at me and said 'get me some pain meds or kill me'.

You getting ultrasound?


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## ttystikk (Sep 29, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Hey guys, just discovered this thread yesterday and I'm pretty interested in the cmh's.
> I have a question. Does anybody personally have readings from their par meter on the 630w de cmh?
> I got the growers choice in 3000k red a couple weeks ago and also just got a par meter today. I watched the postal carrier toss the package from about 5 feet away onto my step, was not happy. So now I'm wondering if it's even reading accurate or not.
> 
> ...


No idea about the readings but if the plant's happy, that's what counts!


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## NugHeuser (Sep 29, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> No idea about the readings but if the plant's happy, that's what counts!


Yeah the plant has more than doubled in size in the last 7 days and its been under the light maybe 8 or 9 days(31 day old plant) she really seems to be liking it. 
I'm trying to decide on going with 4 315s to aid my 630 or 2 more 630s. Grow area is 4'x9'10".
What would you recommend?


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## ttystikk (Sep 29, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Yeah the plant has more than doubled in size in the last 7 days and its been under the light maybe 8 or 9 days(31 day old plant) she really seems to be liking it.
> I'm trying to decide on going with 4 315s to aid my 630 or 2 more 630s. Grow area is 4'x9'10".
> What would you recommend?


It's likely to cost a bit more but I'd go with more 315W lights over the 630W.

My reasoning is that all other things being equal, superior light distribution from more light sources is better. The efficiency difference is negligible.


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## NugHeuser (Sep 29, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> It's likely to cost a bit more but I'd go with more 315W lights over the 630W.
> 
> My reasoning is that all other things being equal, superior light distribution from more light sources is better. The efficiency difference is negligible.


Yeah I think that's what I'll do. Now to decide what company. I just saw growers house is running a sale on Sun system 315 lec stealth for $260 or I could go with the growers choice 315s for $290. Is there much of a difference? Both were square wave ballasts


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## ttystikk (Sep 29, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Yeah I think that's what I'll do. Now to decide what company. I just saw growers house is running a sale on Sun system 315 lec stealth for $260 or I could go with the growers choice 315s for $290. Is there much of a difference? Both were square wave ballasts


Square wave ballast is the main thing. No idea what brand is better.


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## Javadog (Sep 29, 2017)

Good luck Jojo!

Very exciting developments here Gro. Those 5 gals (way back now) are verdant
and the breeding news is awesome. :0)


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## Sailormoses (Sep 30, 2017)

thekingdomsallinside said:


> Thanks for that.Seems im using a t9 in an open hood.I talked to the store and they assured me it was perfectly fine and they had sold hundreds etc etc.I then read the 450 lec grow in colorado and hes in open as well.I'm loving the light but im a bit confused as to the risk? Is it any more than a metal halide for instance?


If a T9 ruptures it will shower everything in hot glass, including you if you are near it. It could also set the tent on fire. The double wall is supposed to contain the rupture within the bulb. I suppose the risk is the same. I never foliar feed near the bulb.


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## ttystikk (Sep 30, 2017)

Sailormoses said:


> If a T9 ruptures it will shower everything in hot glass, including you if you are near it. It could also set the tent on fire. The double wall is supposed to contain the rupture within the bulb. I suppose the risk is the same. I never foliar feed near the bulb.


The hot glass isn't anywhere near as much of an issue as scattering mercury all over your plants. Mercury is very bad for you.


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## thekingdomsallinside (Sep 30, 2017)

Sailormoses said:


> If a T9 ruptures it will shower everything in hot glass, including you if you are near it. It could also set the tent on fire. The double wall is supposed to contain the rupture within the bulb. I suppose the risk is the same. I never foliar feed near the bulb.


Thanks.looks like i got to go hassle the seller,i notice i cant buy a 315 hood either cos it wont take the base on a t9. cracking light,but not worth the risk.thanks for yer time mate.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Sep 30, 2017)

Flower room 1. Gorilla glue 4. Day 11. Automated with dosatrons, octabubblers and floraflex caps. Steady pull 7-8lbs from this room.


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## ttystikk (Sep 30, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Flower room 1. Gorilla glue 4. Day 11. Automated with dosatrons, octabubblers and floraflex caps. Steady pull 7-8lbs from this room.
> View attachment 4019632 View attachment 4019633 View attachment 4019634 View attachment 4019630


Killin it! So you're getting 2gpw?


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## Carolina Dream'n (Sep 30, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Killin it! So you're getting 2gpw?


1.6-2.1gpw. Depending on strain. 

My old blue dream cut would pull 9 out of there every once and a while.


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## ttystikk (Sep 30, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> 1.6-2.1gpw. Depending on strain.
> 
> My old blue dream cut would pull 9 out of there every once and a while.


Solid asf, bro.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 1, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Solid asf, bro.


Also gotta keep in mind I'm not growing cookies or low yielding strains. 

Blue Dream. Dairy Queen. Gorilla Glue. All big yielders.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 1, 2017)

@carolinaDream'n how wide are your rows ? How far apart is each light? Does your split a/chandler the heat ? How many lights? Your space looks almost identical to my new space that is being roughed in now. Do you have a split a/c in each room?


Carolina Dream'n said:


> Flower room 1. Gorilla glue 4. Day 11. Automated with dosatrons, octabubblers and floraflex caps. Steady pull 7-8lbs from this room.
> View attachment 4019632 View attachment 4019633 View attachment 4019634 View attachment 4019630


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 1, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Square wave ballast is the main thing. No idea what brand is better.


I just read that the phantom 2 is in fact a square wave ballast.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 1, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> @carolinaDream'n how wide are your rows ? How far apart is each light? Does your split a/chandler the heat ? How many lights? Your space looks almost identical to my new space that is being roughed in now. Do you have a split a/c in each room?


Each light is above a 3x3 tray. 
Mini split in each room.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 1, 2017)

Flower room 2. Gorilla Glue 4. Day 10.


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## NugHeuser (Oct 1, 2017)

So I'm about to make the purchase on 4 cmh's and I have a couple questions that maybe someone could answer. From everything I've gathered the phillips lamps in 3100k are the choice. The sun systems that they come with on growers house are a bit pricey. 

Would I be losing that much running the phillips in the growers choice 315 hood and ballast? Par/efficiency ect. Since the manufactures say they work best with "their own bulbs"

The other option I was considering is the double hooded sun system fixture. growershouse.com/sun-system-diamond-lec-630-277-volt-w-3100k-lamps?amp=1 

I have a 4 foot wide canopy area so I plan on running them, two lamps deep, width wise.

I appreciate any and all help


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## ttystikk (Oct 1, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I just read that the phantom 2 is in fact a square wave ballast.


I happen to know from another grower here that phantom units aren't reliable. FWIW


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## ttystikk (Oct 1, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> So I'm about to make the purchase on 4 cmh's and I have a couple questions that maybe someone could answer. From everything I've gathered the phillips lamps in 3100k are the choice. The sun systems that they come with on growers house are a bit pricey.
> 
> Would I be losing that much running the phillips in the growers choice 315 hood and ballast? Par/efficiency ect. Since the manufactures say they work best with "their own bulbs"
> 
> ...


Frankly, I think @Carolina Dream'n is showing us how it's done. The closer you emulate his setup with CMH, the better you'll do.


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## NugHeuser (Oct 1, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Frankly, I think @Carolina Dream'n is showing us how it's done. The closer you emulate his setup with CMH, the better you'll do.


Yeah I was just checking out his pics too to see what he's running. Those are some impressive gpw numbers. I'll be happy with 1 gpw until I get things more dialed in. 

I see most people running the sun system lec's with phillips lamps over competitors though so I'm just going to go with the sun system, it will pay for itself in the end. Will be well worth it, surely. 
I'm going to check out the models that it looks like he's running too before making a choice. 
Thanks for your reply.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 1, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Yeah I was just checking out his pics too to see what he's running. Those are some impressive gpw numbers. I'll be happy with 1 gpw until I get things more dialed in.
> 
> I see most people running the sun system lec's with phillips lamps over competitors though so I'm just going to go with the sun system, it will pay for itself in the end. Will be well worth it, surely.
> I'm going to check out the models that it looks like he's running too before making a choice.
> Thanks for your reply.


It's the sun system 315. Vertical bulb. They only have one other model and it's the commercial one with horizontal bulbs.


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## NugHeuser (Oct 1, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> It's the sun system 315. Vertical bulb. They only have one other model and it's the commercial one with horizontal bulbs.


Awesome I'll check this out. Thanks man


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## NugHeuser (Oct 1, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> It's the sun system 315. Vertical bulb. They only have one other model and it's the commercial one with horizontal bulbs.


What's your canopy size? Looks like either 3x9s or 4x12s


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## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 1, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> What's your canopy size? Looks like either 3x9s or 4x12s


6 lights. 6 3x3. 3 on each side. Roughly 3.5x10 after stretch canopy on each side.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 1, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> So I'm about to make the purchase on 4 cmh's and I have a couple questions that maybe someone could answer. From everything I've gathered the phillips lamps in 3100k are the choice. The sun systems that they come with on growers house are a bit pricey.
> 
> Would I be losing that much running the phillips in the growers choice 315 hood and ballast? Par/efficiency ect. Since the manufactures say they work best with "their own bulbs"
> 
> ...



Growers House sells a remote sun system open reflector vertical mount designed mostly like the more expensive all in one unit for $115. And they include it with their prism ballast in a package for around 300 dollars. 

The difference from the top of the line reflector is the whole inside is pebbled aluminum and the all in one has mirror finish reflector and pebbled together and with German brand names. 

The remote Chinese made but still had the quality of the all in one. 

I have that and the Galaxy ballast with a Phillips bulb for about $350 delivered. 

There are quite a few other options but sun systems seems to have the highest quality builds out there. Hydrofarm stuff seems kinda cheap next to it. 

In my opinion anyway. 

Oh and any ballast made for the new 2 pin base 315 cmh is square wave. The term is actually low frequency ballast. Rather than high frequency we use for hps. High has a stuttered spiky power flow in a graph and low has much steadier delivery. That is how they get more par from the new hotter burning gasses. 

Hotter gasses in bulb equals more light per watt.


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 1, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Growers House sells a remote sun system open reflector vertical mount designed mostly like the more expensive all in one unit for $115. And they include it with their prism ballast in a package for around 300 dollars.
> 
> The difference from the top of the line reflector is the whole inside is pebbled aluminum and the all in one has mirror finish reflector and pebbled together and with German brand names.
> 
> ...


Well said. I'll look into that then. Big savings at 3 lights. 
At this point I'm thinking one light deep side by side. Much like Carolina's is. If I have a half foot more narrow canopy that's fine, the light will be used better that way.
Already have one growers choice de 630 @3kr. I like it, but it's a big hot spot then dumps off quick. I think im going to get 3 more of the 315s we talked about, with my 630. My area is 9'10" wall to wall and I have panda film out 4 feet with equipment and what not on the other 5 feet of the room.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 1, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Well said. I'll look into that then. Big savings at 3 lights.
> At this point I'm thinking one light deep side by side. Much like Carolina's is. If I have a half foot more narrow canopy that's fine, the light will be used better that way.
> Already have one growers choice de 630 @3kr. I like it, but it's a big hot spot then dumps off quick. I think im going to get 3 more of the 315s we talked about, with my 630. My area is 9'10" wall to wall and I have panda film out 4 feet with equipment and what not on the other 5 feet of the room.



In my experience a single 315 can flower 2.5' x 2.5' as well as as possible but plants outside that area tend to lean in and crowd each other. 

When I run multiple 315's I will use 3x3 squares for placement. 

No need for two in a 4x4 more like 4x6 would be effective. 

Save some more money man. 

Personally I think a 600 hps and a 315 cmh over a 4x6 area would be perfect. The 315's made nice compact colorful plants but not as dense or as high quality as combined with hps. 

Just like the connisour growers have always used 2 to 1 hps to mh. 

1.5 grams per watt from a 315 is still a lot less than 1 per watt from a 600. My 315 next to the hps yielded 30% less. Just like the math says. 

Again. Just my experience. I tested all year from last November to about July when my room got too hot for 3 lamps. 

Plenty of pics and info from my trials in this thread back then. 

Also. I have gone back to hps only. (Hortilux super) and the potency has actually gone up from the stuff I thought was frostier and better under the 315. 

It looked better but less watts is less no matter what invested buyers say. 

I will use a combination of lamps with more hps for flowering In future builds. 

I know a few pros growing real big. They use de 1000 and a 315 Phillips per table. 

THe university of Michigan has shown that too much blue light while great for leafy greens is not right for flowering annuals. They suggest red with a little blue. Keeps plants green and healthy but has better flower response. 

The spectrum on the 315 3100k is mostly right but could use more red peak to offset the balanced spectrum in my testing too.


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 2, 2017)

So I gotta ask this, what's the difference in these bulbs standing vertical or laying horizontal?


----------



## jonsnow399 (Oct 2, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> So I gotta ask this, what's the difference in these bulbs standing vertical or laying horizontal?


about 90 degrees.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 2, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> about 90 degrees.



Lol


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 2, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> So I gotta ask this, what's the difference in these bulbs standing vertical or laying horizontal?



Both sun system and Phillips reported higher par when tested vertical in the properly designed reflector. 

Cycloptics has the most info on their website and a reflector designed with Phillips early on like sun system. 

https://www.cycloptics.com/greenbeams

Good links for the university of Utah spectral graphs on different light sources at the bottom of the page.


----------



## jonsnow399 (Oct 2, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Both sun system and Phillips reported higher par when tested vertical in the properly designed reflector.
> 
> Cycloptics has the most info on their website and a reflector designed with Phillips early on like sun system.
> 
> ...


A thread over at IC tested the phantom and cycloptics greenbeams and concluded the phantoms were better if you were gonna use only one or two, the greenbeams better for a larger number of lights.


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 2, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Growers House sells a remote sun system open reflector vertical mount designed mostly like the more expensive all in one unit for $115. And they include it with their prism ballast in a package for around 300 dollars.
> 
> The difference from the top of the line reflector is the whole inside is pebbled aluminum and the all in one has mirror finish reflector and pebbled together and with German brand names.
> 
> ...


Is this the setup you're talking about about for 350? I clicked on the ballast to make sure it was a low frequency square wave and all it said was square wave 

https://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-315-ra-cmh-remote-reflector?amp=1


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 2, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> I happen to know from another grower here that phantom units aren't reliable. FWIW


who else has a square wave but with a remote ballast?


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 2, 2017)

@MichiganMedGrower 
I looked into the galaxy ballast that you spoke of. I came across one that was dimmable for a 1k de. Is this what you were using for your 315, dimmed down to 400?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 2, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Is this the setup you're talking about about for 350? I clicked on the ballast to make sure it was a low frequency square wave and all it said was square wave
> 
> https://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-315-ra-cmh-remote-reflector?amp=1



That's the set. Must have been on sale. They constantly put different things on 10-15% off. 

Square wave is what you want.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 2, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> who else has a square wave but with a remote ballast?



Galaxy. Prism. And a bunch of other new Chinese brands emerging.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 2, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> @MichiganMedGrower
> I looked into the galaxy ballast that you spoke of. I came across one that was dimmable for a 1k de. Is this what you were using for your 315, dimmed down to 400?



No it's the square wave one made for the cmh bulbs with the bi-pin base.

It is in the cmh section at growers house.

Both of my Galaxy hid ballasts are dimmable too though. A 600/400 Galaxy Grow amp and a 1000/ 600/ 400 classic too.

I have only dimmed them to see what would happen. I believe the spectrum with less power will also diminish. I know plants don't "see" what we see but even to my eyes it gets kind of dull and pink. The Hortilux super I mean. 

I would not Grow even with 1 light dimmed. I would raise the light or use lower wattage for veg.

Like I reported the cmh ins supposed to stay mostly accurate dimmed.


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 2, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Galaxy. Prism. And a bunch of other new Chinese brands emerging.


Okay so this must be what your talking about right?
https://growershouse.com/galaxy-lec-electronic-ballast-cmh-315-watt-120-240-volt?amp=1


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 2, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> who else has a square wave but with a remote ballast?


Philips Lighting. I got mine as a bare kit, ballast and lamp only.

The distributor I got them through is out of business now, unfortunately.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 2, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Philips Lighting. I got mine as a bare kit, ballast and lamp only.
> 
> The distributor I got them through is out of business now, unfortunately.


Unmmm that doesn't help BTW LOL


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 2, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Unmmm that doesn't help BTW LOL


Surely someone else sells ballasts and bulbs. Maybe not an industry specific distributor but there has to be a way.

My kits were $190 each.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 2, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Okay so this must be what your talking about right?
> https://growershouse.com/galaxy-lec-electronic-ballast-cmh-315-watt-120-240-volt?amp=1



Yup. That's the one.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Oct 3, 2017)

Anyone have any leads on the pgzx socket that accepts the 315cmh


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 3, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Anyone have any leads on the pgzx socket that accepts the 315cmh


Lots of hydro outlets sell them. Call growershouse, those guys know their shit.


----------



## jacrispy (Oct 3, 2017)

I still have the walls to do yet.
3k mixed lighting lec, de lec, cobs & hps.gorilla bubble, ruby red, starfighters &
Cookie wrecks...27 days inruby redcookie wreck x lblGB


----------



## thccbdhealth (Oct 4, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Lots of hydro outlets sell them. Call growershouse, those guys know their shit.


From my findings, they have no interest in shipping to canada


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 4, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> From my findings, they have no interest in shipping to canada


Sorry to hear that. See if you can find a lighting wholesaler who has an account with Philips lighting. The 315W CMH makes an excellent nighttime security light due to its color temperature and efficiency.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 4, 2017)

@ttystikk the horticulture specific Phillips cmh is not recomended or used as a security light. You are the one constantly warning of uv exposure. The new 315 has enough to worry about. 

The old 400 and the larger one you always mention were made for accurate color for human eyes for showroom lighting and have little uv. Or any other horticultural benefit compared to a proper bulb. 

Please stop spreading made up info. Especially when it is dangerous and even contradictory to your own posts. 

And growers house has many employees answering phones. It's a big retail operation. Best to know the info before calling them. They have been good and bad in my experience. 

Their tests are great though. I have referred to their site often for comparison info.


----------



## GroErr (Oct 4, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> From my findings, they have no interest in shipping to canada


Their web site isn't really setup to ship to Canada but if you contact them they'll ship and give you decent shipping rates. I used them for my Sun Systems fixtures but that was a few years back now. They may have decided not to bother with Canada since then.


----------



## Javadog (Oct 7, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Frankly, I think @Carolina Dream'n is showing us how it's done. The closer you emulate his setup with CMH, the better you'll do.


Hell ya! :0)


----------



## Robbie Holiday (Oct 12, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Sorry to hear that. See if you can find a lighting wholesaler who has an account with Philips lighting. The 315W CMH makes an excellent nighttime security light due to its color temperature and efficiency.





ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I just read that the phantom 2 is in fact a square wave ballast.





ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I just read that the phantom 2 is in fact a square wave ballast.





ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I just read that the phantom 2 is in fact a square wave ballast.





ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I just read that the phantom 2 is in fact a square wave ballast.[/QUOT
> The Growers choice is the shit.


----------



## Robbie Holiday (Oct 12, 2017)

you shouldnt loose much if any, maybe go with the growers choice ive heard good things


----------



## Robbie Holiday (Oct 12, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> @ttystikk the horticulture specific Phillips cmh is not recomended or used as a security light. You are the one constantly warning of uv exposure. The new 315 has enough to worry about.
> 
> The old 400 and the larger one you always mention were made for accurate color for human eyes for showroom lighting and have little uv. Or any other horticultural benefit compared to a proper bulb.
> 
> ...


theyve always hooked me up


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 13, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> From my findings, they have no interest in shipping to canada


During checkout there's a point where you have to choose international shipping. The pain is that a lot of their products can't be sold in other countries so trying to go back and forth to figure it all out can be quite a hassle.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Oct 13, 2017)

If i was to do a planter thay was 3x3 
For 9sqft.

Is that really 254 liters of soil?
Or something like 75?

Im having trouble finding a conversion calculator to use.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 13, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> If i was to do a planter thay was 3x3
> For 9sqft.
> 
> Is that really 254 liters of soil?
> ...


You can find find conversion tables by just googling your question. In your case you need a third value. You have a length x width but you need depth.


----------



## Bad Karma (Oct 14, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> You have a length x width but you need depth.


That's what she said.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 14, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> That's what she said.


Yeah, I probably should've seen that one coming.


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 14, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> Yeah, I probably should've seen that one coming.


She said that, too.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 14, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> She said that, too.


Yep, I was ready for this one.


----------



## pinner420 (Oct 14, 2017)

DP.....


----------



## thccbdhealth (Oct 14, 2017)

No i dont.
I already have the girth.
3x3 9sqft - fabric planter is 12" deep


----------



## TedeBoy (Oct 14, 2017)

I got 19.6 ounces from a 3x3 tent with a Sun Systems 315 my last grow.

https://www.rollitup.org/Journal/tedeboy.892876/


----------



## Schmarmpit (Oct 14, 2017)

TedeBoy said:


> I got 19.6 ounces from a 3x3 tent with a Sun Systems 315 my last grow.
> 
> https://www.rollitup.org/Journal/tedeboy.892876/
> 
> View attachment 4026713 View attachment 4026715


Great work! What strain was that? Working from clone?


----------



## TedeBoy (Oct 14, 2017)

Schmarmpit said:


> Great work! What strain was that? Working from clone?


Those were Autoflowers from seed finished at 67 days.
Mephisto Genetics.
3 strains detailed in the journal.
2 x Hubbabubbasmeloscope
2 x White Chem #18
2 x White 'n Sour


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 14, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> No i dont.
> I already have the girth.
> 3x3 9sqft - fabric planter is 12" deep


So Google 9 cubic feet equals how many gallons or liters, whichever works for you.


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 14, 2017)

Is it normal for these low frequency square wave ballast to show bars in pictures on a camera like traditional hid?

I thought that was a sign of less efficiency because of the lights actually flickering at a super high speed and that these lec's aren't suppose to do that. I bought a couple and mine are showing that so I'm just wondering if maybe they're faulty or false advertisement


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 14, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Is it normal for these low frequency square wave ballast to show bars in pictures on a camera like traditional hid?
> 
> I thought that was a sign of less efficiency because of the lights actually flickering at a super high speed and that these lec's aren't suppose to do that. I bought a couple and mine are showing that so I'm just wondering if maybe they're faulty or false advertisement


Standard magnetic ballasts run at 60 hertz. Hertz is cycles per second. Digital ballasts run over 100 hertz.


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 14, 2017)

growershouse.com/galaxy-lec-electronic-ballast-cmh-315-watt-120-240-volt?amp=1

That's the ballast


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 14, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> Standard magnetic ballasts run at 60 hertz. Hertz is cycles per second. Digital ballasts run over 100 hertz.


Okay that makes since. And even so they are still more efficient than a standard hps right?


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 14, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Is it normal for these low frequency square wave ballast to show bars in pictures on a camera like traditional hid?
> 
> I thought that was a sign of less efficiency because of the lights actually flickering at a super high speed and that these lec's aren't suppose to do that. I bought a couple and mine are showing that so I'm just wondering if maybe they're faulty or false advertisement


No, that's a sign your ballasts aren't square wave units. The manufacturer cheaped out and you ended up with a less efficient system.

The flicker is a hallmark of a sinewave output, where square wave won't have the dark bars.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 14, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Okay that makes since. And even so they are still more efficient than a standard hps right?


I'm not sure about how they compare as far as raw light output. I think the biggest difference is in the quality of the spectrum.

The far red can help through the Emerson effect and even UV can increase growth rates on top of increasing potency by helping convert cbg into thc and cbd and increasing terpenes.

Eye Hortilux has a side by side comparison of seedlings started under their UV t5's and regular ones that make a strong case for using at least some UV in all stages of growth.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 14, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> No, that's a sign your ballasts aren't square wave units. The manufacturer cheaped out and you ended up with a less efficient system.
> 
> The flicker is a hallmark of a sinewave output, where square wave won't have the dark bars.



Well, full disclosure, I don't actually have any direct experience with lec. These pics,show the difference between my old sun systems magnetic ballasts and the smaller, less distinguishable pulses after switching to the Solistek Digital Matrix. I was making the mistake of assuming that the lec ballasts would have the same affect.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 15, 2017)

Pic taken under Phillips 3100k 315 cmh in sun system remote reflector run on the Galaxy ballast.

Which claims to be spec'd for the Phillips bulbs. 

 

With Galaxy run HPS in background. 
  
Never saw any lines in pictures either way.


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 15, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Pic taken under Phillips 3100k 315 cmh in sun system remote reflector run on the Galaxy ballast.
> 
> Which claims to be spec'd for the Phillips bulbs.
> 
> ...


Yeah that's weird because I think me and you have the exact same ballasts. They have about 30 hours run time on them. Maybe mine are defective, maybe the box's were dropped or thrown by ups carriers


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 15, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> No, that's a sign your ballasts aren't square wave units. The manufacturer cheaped out and you ended up with a less efficient system.
> 
> The flicker is a hallmark of a sinewave output, where square wave won't have the dark bars.


Okay so how big of a deal is that then if they aren't square wave? Is that really fucking me or just splitting hairs?


----------



## Sailormoses (Oct 15, 2017)

Bulb life will be shorter, and everything else will be less. match the ballast to the bulb or vice versa.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 15, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Yeah that's weird because I think me and you have the exact same ballasts. They have about 30 hours run time on them. Maybe mine are defective, maybe the box's were dropped or thrown by ups carriers



Honestly there are cmh pics all over this site and none have lines. What camera are you using and is there a magnetic ballast in the room?

And what brand/temp bulb?


----------



## MarWan (Oct 15, 2017)

Why do I get dark horizontal lines (stripes or bands) in bad lighting with my Fuji X-T1?

"These lines are very likely there because of the frequency at which your light flickers. This is most notably the case with fluorescent lighting or led lighting, especially when you dim the light. Led are dimmed by switching them on/off rapidly. The dimmer the light the longer the off periods which our cameras capture easily (and not only the X-T1) "
https://photo.stackexchange.com/questions/60701/why-do-i-get-dark-horizontal-lines-stripes-or-bands-in-bad-lighting-with-my-fu

try playing with the light source setting in you camera, it could fix the problem.


----------



## ThatSpudGuy (Oct 15, 2017)

Guys any idea if this system would be of any use or is it just a cheap crappy system that ill probably run into problems with? 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B071D26L6G/ref=ox_sc_saved_image_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A25TJCEOKW5IIO


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 15, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Honestly there are cmh pics all over this site and none have lines. What camera are you using and is there a magnetic ballast in the room?
> 
> And what brand/temp bulb?


Galaxy s7 camera and no, just the 3 cmh's. The growers choice one doesn't show the lines alone so it's coming from the two galaxy lec ballasts. They say LFSW on them though. Philips 3100k bulbs


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 15, 2017)

I am looking to buy some more 315cmh lamps.
I have been running the phantom 315 and it has been fine. I like remote ballasts and I will upgrade to cooled vents in the new flower room. I want to add 4 of these. I will be running 240v trying to keep the draw down. The lights will be on there own circuit. I want to know what ballasts are being used. 
Can someone tell me if these are better ballasts? I am not looking to buy inexpensive equipment. I want safe efficient equipment. 

Also can I cool 4 lamps with one fan? Run a Y connector with a 6" fan? They will be in a square pattern.

@DemonTrich @ttystikk @Bad Karma @MichiganMedGrower @Javadog @GroErr 

@Carolina Dream'n my room looks similar tp yours and I do not run cooled lights now? Is it neccesary?


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 15, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Okay so how big of a deal is that then if they aren't square wave? Is that really fucking me or just splitting hairs?


Dark bars are an indication that the lamp is dimming at a regular interval. If it's dimming, is not as bright, therefore you're losing light. If both ballasts from a given maker are doing it then it's the ballast design and not a defect.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 15, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I am looking to buy some more 315cmh lamps.
> I have been running the phantom 315 and it has been fine. I like remote ballasts and I will upgrade to cooled vents in the new flower room. I want to add 4 of these. I will be running 240v trying to keep the draw down. The lights will be on there own circuit. I want to know what ballasts are being used.
> Can someone tell me if these are better ballasts? I am not looking to buy inexpensive equipment. I want safe efficient equipment.
> 
> ...


Cool your room not your lights. Putting glass between a bulb that produces that much UV is also working against yourself. I will never recommend air cooling lights.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Cool your room not your lights. Putting glass between a bulb that produces that much UV is also working against yourself. I will never recommend air cooling lights.


Unless it's a bulb that also produces uvb and uvc. The glass will filter those out, which is important, and still let a good amount of the uva through.

When a light is compared with and without being air cooled the air cooled light will pretty much always give you more light at the plants level because it can be kept closer to the plant.


----------



## jonsnow399 (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> Unless it's a bulb that also produces uvb and uvc. The glass will filter those out, which is important, and still let a good amount of the uva through.
> 
> When a light is compared with and without being air cooled the air cooled light will pretty much always give you more light at the plants level because it can be kept closer to the plant.


Irrelevant with LEC since the light can be kept close anyway.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> Irrelevant with LEC since the light can be kept close anyway.


Except for the uv. Unless it drops off before getting into the uvb than you'll be exposing your plants, and yourself, to harmful UV spectrum.


----------



## jonsnow399 (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> Except for the uv. Unless it drops off before getting into the uvb than you'll be exposing your plants, and yourself, to harmful UV spectrum.


How would air cooling change the UV? anyway I got a huge Silver Mountain bud close to a non air cooled 315 and it is loving it.


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> Except for the uv. Unless it drops off before getting into the uvb than you'll be exposing your plants, and yourself, to harmful UV spectrum.


UVB is good for cannabis plants. All UV is bad for people. No HID currently sold for growing plants makes a significant amount of UV. If you want to supplement UV, use T5 lamps designed for the purpose or you're just kidding yourself.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> UVB is good for cannabis plants. All UV is bad for people. No HID currently sold for growing plants makes a significant amount of UV. If you want to supplement UV, use T5 lamps designed for the purpose or you're just kidding yourself.


These are the Solis Tek 6k and 10k that I've been using. Definitely a significant amount of UV. Their cmh/lec are also pretty solid. Growers Choice also has some good options.


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> These are the Solis Tek 6k and 10k that I've been using. Definitely a significant amount of UV. Their cmh/lec are also pretty solid. Growers Choice also has some good options.


Would you bloom under 6K or 10K?


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Would you bloom under 6K or 10K?


The 10k is for finishing in the last couple of weeks. The 6k is for vegging and works well for flowering in a 1 to 1 ratio with hps. The 4k is more of an all purpose bulb but you'd still benefit from the extra red of an hps during flowering.

To be honest though I'm really hoping that once Growers Choice releases their de 1000 watt CMH and a ballast to go with it I'll be able to just switch everything over to that.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> Unless it's a bulb that also produces uvb and uvc. The glass will filter those out, which is important, and still let a good amount of the uva through.
> 
> When a light is compared with and without being air cooled the air cooled light will pretty much always give you more light at the plants level because it can be kept closer to the plant.


100% disagree with you.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> 100% disagree with you.


About the UV or light intensity comparison? The research has been done on both.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> About the UV or light intensity comparison? The research has been done on both.


Light intensity.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 15, 2017)

what about the Ballast ?


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Light intensity.


I've seen a number of comparisons where an identical light system is compared ran with no glass at an appropriate distance for a non air cooled system and then with glass and active air cooling at the appropriate closer distance and the air cooled light kept closer always producers higher light levels.

I can't think of any right off the top of my head to provide a link to but I'm sure you could find a few pretty easily if you wanted to


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> How would air cooling change the UV? anyway I got a huge Silver Mountain bud close to a non air cooled 315 and it is loving it.


The glass filters out uvc and uvb but leaves a good amount of uva. From what I've seen most cmh only produce uva so it really only applies to regular mh.


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## ttystikk (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> I've seen a number of comparisons where an identical light system is compared ran with no glass at an appropriate distance for a non air cooled system and then with glass and active air cooling at the appropriate closer distance and the air cooled light kept closer always producers higher light levels.
> 
> I can't think of any right off the top of my head to provide a link to but I'm sure you could find a few pretty easily if you wanted to


Imma give you a piece of free advice; if he's getting 1.5gpw or more, maybe you should be listening to him instead of arguing.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> UVB is good for cannabis plants. All UV is bad for people. No HID currently sold for growing plants makes a significant amount of UV. If you want to supplement UV, use T5 lamps designed for the purpose or you're just kidding yourself.


UVB is a very small percentage of the uv that the earths atmosphere allows through. Plants do benefit from it but it also causes DNA damage. You can get the same benefits without the drawback from running just UVA.

All UV is damaging to people but it's also critical in how we use sunlight to produce vitamin d3.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> I've seen a number of comparisons where an identical light system is compared ran with no glass at an appropriate distance for a non air cooled system and then with glass and active air cooling at the appropriate closer distance and the air cooled light kept closer always producers higher light levels.
> 
> I can't think of any right off the top of my head to provide a link to but I'm sure you could find a few pretty easily if you wanted to


Comparisons done by who? Online forum growers or university studies.

Let's think of power consumption too. Your running an extra 200-400 watts to cool these lights that actually run better warm. Then you put glass between the bulb and the plant lowering its intensity by 10-20%. Sure you can lower your lights a little but that then reduces your canopy area actually getting intense light. So sure it's more intense but covers way less area leading to lower yields, terpene and cannabinoids reduction and nutrient deficiencies.

Not to mention you are assuming more light intensity means more yields.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Imma give you a piece of free advice; if he's getting 1.5gpw or more, maybe you should be listening to him instead of arguing.


That's all fine and dandy but it doesn't change the fact that when all of the facts are considered air cooled lights are actually more efficient when used properly. The only exception is in applications with large areas and lots of headroom like greenhouses where air cooling the lights would be ridiculous. Not to mention that lighting is only one if many factors that effect yield. It should also be said that I'm not trying to be argumentative but to share information.


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## ttystikk (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> That's all fine and dandy but it doesn't change the fact that when all of the facts are considered air cooled lights are actually more efficient when used properly. The only exception is in applications with large areas and lots of headroom like greenhouses where air cooling the lights would be ridiculous. Not to mention that lighting is only one if many factors that effect yield. It should also be said that I'm not trying to be argumentative but to share information.


The information I'm sharing is that until you're getting high yields and top shelf quality, don't argue with those who are.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Comparisons done by who? Online forum growers or university studies.
> 
> Let's think of power consumption too. Your running an extra 200-400 watts to cool these lights that actually run better warm. Then you put glass between the bulb and the plant lowering its intensity by 10-20%. Sure you can lower your lights a little but that then reduces your canopy area actually getting intense light. So sure it's more intense but covers way less area leading to lower yields, terpene and cannabinoids reduction and nutrient deficiencies.


If properly cooled in the right hoods there should be no ill affect to the performance of the bulb. You do make a good point about the overall efficiency being affected by the reduced coverage area of the individual light. Odds are the increase of intensity won't be enough to make it more, or even equally, efficient when that's considered.

As long as the spectrum shift is avoided by not over cooling the lights, which I was under the impression was exclusive to de, I don't think there would be any reduction in terpenes or cannabinoids but I am curious about how any of this could cause deficiencies? I've always ran air cooled lights and never had a problem in that area.

And the comparisons I'm talking about weren't done by online forum growers or as a part of an accredited university study but they were done as well decided controlled experiments that eliminated any variables that could taint the results.


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## ttystikk (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> If properly cooled in the right hoods there should be no ill affect to the performance of the bulb. You do make a good point about the overall efficiency being affected by the reduced coverage area of the individual light. Odds are the increase of intensity won't be enough to make it more, or even equally, efficient when that's considered.
> 
> As long as the spectrum shift is avoided by not over cooling the lights, which I was under the impression was exclusive to de, I don't think there would be any reduction in terpenes or cannabinoids but I am curious about how any of this could cause deficiencies? I've always ran air cooled lights and never had a problem in that area.


I've done both and got better results when I wasn't air cooling my HID. In fact, bare bulbs were best.


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## DemonTrich (Oct 15, 2017)

I air cool all my cmh. I also use 1x8"720cfm fan for 4x hoods, then another 6' 440cfm fan for my 3 veg hoods. 

I like prism ballasts. No frills ballast, that works like it should.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> If properly cooled in the right hoods there should be no ill affect to the performance of the bulb. You do make a good point about the overall efficiency being affected by the reduced coverage area of the individual light. Odds are the increase of intensity won't be enough to make it more, or even equally, efficient when that's considered.
> 
> As long as the spectrum shift is avoided by not over cooling the lights, which I was under the impression was exclusive to de, I don't think there would be any reduction in terpenes or cannabinoids but I am curious about how any of this could cause deficiencies? I've always ran air cooled lights and never had a problem in that area.


I see most people running air cooled lights using large hoods keeping plants 12" away from plant tops. Sometimes even less. The radiant heat from the hood will make the top of the plant transpire faster then the bottom leading to "burnt yellow leaves" on the colas. People then think they have deficiences and over react causing more damage than if they had just left it alone. 

Yea, the colas get huge but the quality drops significantly.


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## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> The information I'm sharing is that until you're getting high yields and top shelf quality, don't argue with those who are.





ttystikk said:


> I've done both and got better results when I wasn't air cooling my HID. In fact, bare bulbs were best.


That's fine as long as you're not using regular metal halides that produce UV since a lot of them produce high amounts of uvb and even some uvc. You also can't use them bare bulb in licensed rec or commercial med gardens because they aren't designed to be ran that way.


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## ttystikk (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> That's fine as long as you're not using regular metal halides that produce UV since a lot of them produce high amounts of uvb and even some uvc. You also can't use them bare bulb in licensed rec or commercial med gardens because they aren't designed to be ran that way.


I'm sick of people who have no pics of their grows running around trying to shove their opinions down the throats of those of us working been doing this for years.

Let's see some pics and while you're at it, tell us how great your numbers are?


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## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> I see most people running air cooled lights using large hoods keeping plants 12" away from plant tops. Sometimes even less. The radiant heat from the hood will make the top of the plant transpire faster then the bottom leading to "burnt yellow leaves" on the colas. People then think they have deficiences and over react causing more damage than if they had just left it alone.
> 
> Yea, the colas get huge but the quality drops significantly.


Twelve inches is still way too close.


ttystikk said:


> I'm sick of people who have no pics of their grows running around trying to shove their opinions down the throats of those of us working been doing this for years.
> 
> Let's see some pics and while you're at it, tell us how great your numbers are?


I've already posted pics. In this thread even. Whatever my numbers are are is irrelevant to subject of this conversation. To placate your delicate sensibilities I will tell you that I've always ran multiple strains in each cycle and while I've got around two pounds a light when running high yielding strains, with se bulbs and mag ballasts, I've never actually tried to focus on yield. I'll be getting my indoor going again shortly. Maybe I'll be able to present you with something that makes me more credible in your eyes. Maybe not. I'll be fine either way.

And again, "my numbers" are irrelevant and don't change the credibility of the comparisons I was talking about that got this whole "conversation" going.


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> Twelve inches is still way too close.
> 
> 
> I've already posted pics. In this thread even. Whatever my numbers are are is irrelevant to subject of this conversation. To placate your delicate sensibilities I will tell you that I've always ran multiple strains in each cycle and while I've got around two pounds a light when running high yielding strains, with se bulbs and mag ballasts, I've never actually tried to focus on yield. I'll be getting my indoor going again shortly. Maybe I'll be able to present you with something that makes me more credible in your eyes. Maybe not. I'll be fine either way.
> ...


Two pounds from what light? And no, numbers are anything but irrelevant. Only those who don't care about results would say that.

My point is that you're the one who needs to show your work to be credible.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 15, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Galaxy s7 camera and no, just the 3 cmh's. The growers choice one doesn't show the lines alone so it's coming from the two galaxy lec ballasts. They say LFSW on them though. Philips 3100k bulbs



Maybe too obvious of a question but is the Galaxy dimmed? And is the bulb properly installed?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 15, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I am looking to buy some more 315cmh lamps.
> I have been running the phantom 315 and it has been fine. I like remote ballasts and I will upgrade to cooled vents in the new flower room. I want to add 4 of these. I will be running 240v trying to keep the draw down. The lights will be on there own circuit. I want to know what ballasts are being used.
> Can someone tell me if these are better ballasts? I am not looking to buy inexpensive equipment. I want safe efficient equipment.
> 
> ...



I like my Galaxy stuff but for price vs growers reviews the prism set up with the sun system reflector is likely the best deal for quality. And use a Phillips bulb.


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## NugHeuser (Oct 15, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Maybe too obvious of a question but is the Galaxy dimmed? And is the bulb properly installed?


Yeah the bulb twisted firmly for seemed like half a rotation, all the way to a solid stop. And no they are not dimmed, they were on 100% when they came and I haven't switched them since


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## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 15, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Yeah the bulb twisted firmly for seemed like half a rotation, all the way to a solid stop. And no they are not dimmed, they were on 100% when they came and I haven't switched them since



Got me bud. I have never seen a line in a pic with the Galaxy and Phillips 315 3100k. 

It is definitely a low frequency square wave ballast. 

I did try the dimmer in every setting before I ever took a pic but I don't have any idea past what I asked. Sorry.


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## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Two pounds from what light? And no, numbers are anything but irrelevant. Only those who don't care about results would say that.
> 
> My point is that you're the one who needs to show your work to be credible.


Eye Hortilux Super HPS 1000's in sun system xxxl Magnum hoods.

I could have absolutely no experience whatsoever and it would have no bearing at all on the validity of the comparisons that I was talking about.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 15, 2017)

Room 3. Gorilla Glue day 26. This room usually out yields room 1&2 because of all 6 lights overlapping. Tray stands are on wheels and can be spread apart for maintenance/lollipoping. 
DTW Ionic Bloom, Ersa Elixir and calcium hypochlorite.


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## ttystikk (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> Eye Hortilux Super HPS 1000's in sun system xxxl Magnum hoods.
> 
> I could have absolutely no experience whatsoever and it would have no bearing at all on the validity of the comparisons that I was talking about.


2lbs(900g)/1000W= .9gpw



Carolina Dream'n said:


> Room 3. Gorilla Glue day 26. This room usually out yields room 1&2 because of all 6 lights overlapping. Tray stands are on wheels and can be spread apart for maintenance/lollipoping.
> DTW Ionic Bloom, Ersa Elixir and calcium hypochlorite.
> View attachment 4027471 View attachment 4027472 View attachment 4027473 View attachment 4027474


6lbs(2700g)/315Wx6(1890)= 1.42gpw

Any questions?


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## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> 2lbs(900g)/1000W= .9gpw
> 
> 
> 6lbs(2700g)/315Wx6(1890)= 1.42gpw
> ...


 As I've already said, I'm not growing for yield. To be clear about that I have some very low yielding strains that I grow for personal use and for specific card holders that I grow for. I am not a cash cropper who measures the skill of others strictly by their yield per watt. And again, comparing yields doesn't prove anything. 

This whole thing started over me saying that there are side by side comparisons that clearly show that air cooled lights yield more light at the canopy than non air cooled because they can be kept closer. Nothing about my yield compared to someone else's changes that or has anything to do with it.

I'm sorry you're so bent out of shape over me mentioning someone else's side by side comparisons but I'm getting tired of kicking this dead horse.


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## Bad Karma (Oct 15, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I am looking to buy some more 315cmh lamps.
> I have been running the phantom 315 and it has been fine. I like remote ballasts and I will upgrade to cooled vents in the new flower room. I want to add 4 of these. I will be running 240v trying to keep the draw down. The lights will be on there own circuit. I want to know what ballasts are being used.
> Can someone tell me if these are better ballasts? I am not looking to buy inexpensive equipment. I want safe efficient equipment.
> 
> ...


I like Hydrofarms Phantom II ballast best. I know, I know, not the most popular choice around here. I own three LEC lamps and two are Phantoms. Why do I like them so much? They'll auto restrike after a power outage, and as far as I'm aware, no other remote ballast has that feature. I like being certain that my lights are on when they're supposed to be on. This is a personal preference and I do not expect everyone to share it. To each their own.
Has one of my Phantoms failed on me in the past? Yes. It was the original model and replaced under warranty. The two Phantom II's that I have now have given me no issues at all.
Prism seems like it could be the best choice for those looking for an inexpensive, but solid, square wave ballast. I have one of the Galaxy ballasts and I'm not that impressed with it.


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## Evil-Mobo (Oct 15, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I like Hydrofarms Phantom II ballast best. I know, I know, not the most popular choice around here. I own three LEC lamps and two are Phantoms. Why do I like them so much? They'll auto restrike after a power outage, and as far as I'm aware, no other remote ballast has that feature. I like being certain that my lights are on when they're supposed to be on. This is a personal preference and I do not expect everyone to share it. To each their own.
> Has one of my Phantoms failed on me in the past? Yes. It was the original model and replaced under warranty. The two Phantom II's that I have now have given me no issues at all.
> Prism seems like it could be the best choice for those looking for an inexpensive, but solid, square wave ballast. I have one of the Galaxy ballasts and I'm not that impressed with it.


Only thing I will add is the Phantom's have an Air Cooled kit for their reflector and it keeps the bulb in proper orientation. Good to see you around brother hope all is well.


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## ttystikk (Oct 15, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> As I've already said, I'm not growing for yield. To be clear about that I have some very low yielding strains that I grow for personal use and for specific card holders that I grow for. I am not a cash cropper who measures the skill of others strictly by their yield per watt. And again, comparing yields doesn't prove anything.
> 
> This whole thing started over me saying that there are side by side comparisons that clearly show that air cooled lights yield more light at the canopy than non air cooled because they can be kept closer. Nothing about my yield compared to someone else's changes that or has anything to do with it.
> 
> I'm sorry you're so bent out of shape over me mentioning someone else's side by side comparisons but I'm getting tired of kicking this dead horse.


You're the one who tried to tell us what we're doing wrong, remember?


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## SchmoeJoe (Oct 15, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> You're the one who tried to tell us what we're doing wrong, remember?


I never said anything about what someone else was doing being wrong. I just said that it's been demonstrated that a light produced more light at the canopy when air cooled because of the closer proximity. 


Carolina Dream'n said:


> I see most people running air cooled lights using large hoods keeping plants 12" away from plant tops. Sometimes even less. The radiant heat from the hood will make the top of the plant transpire faster then the bottom leading to "burnt yellow leaves" on the colas. People then think they have deficiences and over react causing more damage than if they had just left it alone.
> 
> Yea, the colas get huge but the quality drops significantly.


So what you're saying is that they actually don't cause deficiencies?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 16, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I like Hydrofarms Phantom II ballast best. I know, I know, not the most popular choice around here. I own three LEC lamps and two are Phantoms. Why do I like them so much? They'll auto restrike after a power outage, and as far as I'm aware, no other remote ballast has that feature. I like being certain that my lights are on when they're supposed to be on. This is a personal preference and I do not expect everyone to share it. To each their own.
> Has one of my Phantoms failed on me in the past? Yes. It was the original model and replaced under warranty. The two Phantom II's that I have now have given me no issues at all.
> Prism seems like it could be the best choice for those looking for an inexpensive, but solid, square wave ballast. I have one of the Galaxy ballasts and I'm not that impressed with it.



I remember the restrike issue but never found out the answers. But you don't like Galaxy because you say it doesn't re strike after power outage?

Mine turns back on fine after short and long outages and once a spike blew the growroom circuit and when I reset the breakers the LEC came on with the HPS. All on Galaxy ballasts. 

The hps was plugged into a Titan 2 light Digital controller and the LEC and analog titan timer and a high temp kill switch. 

Still not sure why you had a problem. Not challenging. Just don't see why it wouldn't come in if plugged in to a hot circuit.


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## NugHeuser (Oct 16, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Got me bud. I have never seen a line in a pic with the Galaxy and Phillips 315 3100k.
> 
> It is definitely a low frequency square wave ballast.
> 
> I did try the dimmer in every setting before I ever took a pic but I don't have any idea past what I asked. Sorry.


They still have good readings on my par meter and my plants like them so they should do fine I guess


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## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 16, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> They still have good readings on my par meter and my plants like them so they should do fine I guess



I searched and can not find one pic of a 315 room with lines like a mag ballast and hps on the internet.

Ttystick has been saying that there are non square wave low frequency ballasts but there is no such thing. And the Galaxy ballast is certainly made to spec for Phillips. 

Also electronic hps ballasts don't do it either only magnetic ballasts.

I would unplug everything and try again. I would even swap bulbs and try them individually. Maybe you have a faulty ballast?


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 16, 2017)

Does anyone make a domestically made ballast or is everything made in China?


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## tombsy (Oct 16, 2017)

DE 630 vs 2 SE 315 (one fixture) vs 2 315 (two fixtures)?

Leaning towards DE 630 as it seems to cover a 4x4 the best.


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## MarWan (Oct 16, 2017)

I've been using Philips 330w CDM on a 400w Metal Halide Mag ballast, It reminds me of old floros when it switches on. 
https://www.1000bulbs.com/product/59300/MHS-232595.html

I also run 2 more 315w Philips mogul base on 2 Philips LFSW Ballasts.
I use a Canon Ti Rebel 3 to shoot pics of my grow, and never had problems with bands in my pics. I just set the appropriate light source setting in the cam and that's it.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 16, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> I never said anything about what someone else was doing being wrong. I just said that it's been demonstrated that a light produced more light at the canopy when air cooled because of the closer proximity.
> 
> 
> So what you're saying is that they actually don't cause deficiencies?


No they cause deficiencies. The plants can't transpire fast enough at the top, causing a decreased nutrient need for half the plant. Which never ever is gonna work. You'll be burning tops or be having nitrogen deficiencies on the bottom.


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## theinhibitor (Oct 16, 2017)

jacrispy said:


> View attachment 4021264 I still have the walls to do yet.
> 3k mixed lighting lec, de lec, cobs & hps.View attachment 4021265gorilla bubble, ruby red, starfighters &
> Cookie wrecks...27 days inView attachment 4021263ruby redView attachment 4021266cookie wreck x lblView attachment 4021267GBView attachment 4021268


Mixed lighting: the best and puts to rest any stupid arguments on which is superior.

I used mixed myself, just LED and HPS though.


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## SchmoeJoe (Oct 16, 2017)

theinhibitor said:


> Mixed lighting: the best and puts to rest any stupid arguments on which is superior.
> 
> I used mixed myself, just LED and HPS though.


I've been plotting on running plasmas or lec with either de hps or led. I'm still holding out for the release of the 1000 watt lec from Growers Choice though. That could be a game changer.


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## SchmoeJoe (Oct 16, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> No they cause deficiencies. The plants can't transpire fast enough at the top, causing a decreased nutrient need for half the plant. Which never ever is gonna work. You'll be burning tops or be having nitrogen deficiencies on the bottom.


If the plants are that hot at the tops than the problem isn't deficiencies but having the lights way too close.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Oct 16, 2017)

MarWan said:


> I've been using Philips 330w CDM on a 400w Metal Halide Mag ballast, It reminds me of old floros when it switches on.
> https://www.1000bulbs.com/product/59300/MHS-232595.html
> 
> I also run 2 more 315w Philips mogul base on 2 Philips LFSW Ballasts.
> I use a Canon Ti Rebel 3 to shoot pics of my grow, and never had problems with bands in my pics. I just set the appropriate light source setting in the cam and that's it.


So I can put this bulb in my old hydrofarm 400 mh magnetic ballast? @MarWan


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## theinhibitor (Oct 16, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> I've been plotting on running plasmas or lec with either de hps or led. I'm still holding out for the release of the 1000 watt lec from Growers Choice though. That could be a game changer.


IMO CMH is a waste - too much heat, worse than LEDs, and HPS beats it in flowering. CMH seems to really promote leaf growth which I think would be great for veg or 1st week of flower, but I mainly want flowers, all those leaves look great but shield the lower bud sites. Honestly, CMH seems best in vertical grows, but even Sedan mentioned that HPS is still king.


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## SchmoeJoe (Oct 16, 2017)

theinhibitor said:


> IMO CMH is a waste - too much heat, worse than LEDs, and HPS beats it in flowering. CMH seems to really promote leaf growth which I think would be great for veg or 1st week of flower, but I mainly want flowers, all those leaves look great but shield the lower bud sites. Honestly, CMH seems best in vertical grows, but even Sedan mentioned that HPS is still king.


Have you ran lec/cmh? I've seen examples of 1.5 grams a watt and a pound a light. There's not going to be a whole lot of excess leaf if your getting a pound per 315 watt light. Not to mention my biggest, densest, heaviest buds always come out of my greenhouses under natural light and these are the closest thing to full spectrum peak season sun light you can get.


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## theinhibitor (Oct 16, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> Have you ran lec/cmh? I've seen examples of 1.5 grams a watt and a pound a light. There's not going to be a whole lot of excess leaf if your getting a pound per 315 watt light. Not to mention my biggest, densest, heaviest buds always come out of my greenhouses under natural light and these are the closest thing to full spectrum peak season sun light you can get.


I have not ran LEC/CMH and dont plan to. Though it might have a better spectrum than HPS, I have not seen the evidence of the results.

I also dont really care for grams per wattage, as that mostly depends on strain. Too many variables involved in that number (tent, tent temp, reflector (or light density), water temp, PH, EC, feeding cycle, flushing, etc).

I think LED has every product beat on efficiency and spectrum, as it can be tailored rather simply, whereas metal halides and sodium lamps are at the beck and call of the resonance wavelengths.

I personally use only LED's and HPS. I now converted my veg into using only LED from T5's and love the response.

Here's a pic of DQ under the lights a few years back that I just found on my comp. Not sure what the yield was per watt, but it was definitely quite successful.


One thing I dislike about Metal Halides is that it makes the plants stringy and tall. I like cramming the nodes as close together as possible to get a condensed cola. HPS works great for that, and LED makes up for the spectrum deficiencies, at least that's how I look at it.

Oh and about the densest heaviest yields being in a greenhouse....have you ever seen the CO2 enhanced bud? I think that might have nature beat. Too much hassle for me though lol.


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## SchmoeJoe (Oct 16, 2017)

theinhibitor said:


> I have not ran LEC/CMH and dont plan to. Though it might have a better spectrum than HPS, I have not seen the evidence of the results.
> 
> I also dont really care for grams per wattage, as that mostly depends on strain. Too many variables involved in that number (tent, tent temp, reflector (or light density), water temp, PH, EC, feeding cycle, flushing, etc).
> 
> ...


I do agree about grams per watt not being a definitive measurement. I only used that as a reference because leafy buds won't weigh near as much as buds with a lower leaf to calyx ratio.

You do realize that you can also use co2 in a greenhouse? Tb at makes that comment irrelevant, especially since I don't run co2 indoors or in greenhouses so the only variables are root mass and light spectrum. Since I also run large pots with nearly the soil indoors as in the greenhouses in confident the difference is in the light spectrum.

It's also important to understand how co2 supplementation can suppress ethylene production delaying ripening and reducing essential oils.

One last thing, maybe someone who actually has experience with lec can chime in here, I was under the impression that one of the advantages of lec was that they ran cooler than other hid.


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## NugHeuser (Oct 16, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> I do agree about grams per watt not being a definitive measurement. I only used that as a reference because leafy buds won't weigh near as much as buds with a lower leaf to calyx ratio.
> 
> You do realize that you can also use co2 in a greenhouse? Tb at makes that comment irrelevant, especially since I don't run co2 indoors or in greenhouses so the only variables are root mass and light spectrum. Since I also run large pots with nearly the soil indoors as in the greenhouses in confident the difference is in the light spectrum.
> 
> ...


They do run much cooler. My 315 lec is cooler than my hps dimmed to 250 and my double ended 630w lec runs cooler than the hps @ 600 (se dimmable 600hps/mh)


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## MarWan (Oct 16, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> So I can put this bulb in my old hydrofarm 400 mh magnetic ballast? @MarWan


it works on old 400watt MH mag ballasts, the pulse start ones and probe ones.

"They offer the cost saving convenience of being usable with either Probe or Pulse Start magnetic ballasts, ANSI M59/O, M128/O, M135/O, M155/O, M165/O, M172/O, or C185/O."

^^ see those Nos, one of em should be written on the mag ballast.


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## SchmoeJoe (Oct 16, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> They do run much cooler. My 315 lec is cooler than my hps dimmed to 250 and my double ended 630w lec runs cooler than the hps @ 600 (se dimmable 600hps/mh)


I've been looking at those de 630's. I'm just trying to hold out until they've got purpose built ballasts for them.


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 16, 2017)

MarWan said:


> I've been using Philips 330w CDM on a 400w Metal Halide Mag ballast, It reminds me of old floros when it switches on.
> https://www.1000bulbs.com/product/59300/MHS-232595.html
> 
> I also run 2 more 315w Philips mogul base on 2 Philips LFSW Ballasts.
> I use a Canon Ti Rebel 3 to shoot pics of my grow, and never had problems with bands in my pics. I just set the appropriate light source setting in the cam and that's it.


If the only ballast running is the mag, you should see bars. They won't show up if there are other lights running.


----------



## theinhibitor (Oct 16, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> I do agree about grams per watt not being a definitive measurement. I only used that as a reference because leafy buds won't weigh near as much as buds with a lower leaf to calyx ratio.
> 
> You do realize that you can also use co2 in a greenhouse? Tb at makes that comment irrelevant, especially since I don't run co2 indoors or in greenhouses so the only variables are root mass and light spectrum. Since I also run large pots with nearly the soil indoors as in the greenhouses in confident the difference is in the light spectrum.
> 
> ...


About the greenhouse, I was referring to beating nature. Its somewhat obvious, to any casual observer, that trying to beat the sun indoors is simply impossible from the standpoint that plants have evolved to use the sun for millennia. 

Anyways, why CMH when LED? LED is the forefront tech right now. Platinum P600s are amazing, just alone they can produce massive colas.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 16, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> If the plants are that hot at the tops than the problem isn't deficiencies but having the lights way too close.


You really just wanna be right. Whatever you say at this point I'm done with it.


----------



## MarWan (Oct 16, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> If the only ballast running is the mag, you should see bars. They won't show up if there are other lights running.


I used HPs & MH with mag ballasts at first, No bars. 
bought a 330 CDM and replaced the MH, No Bars. 
Found a site that sells a Philips LFSW ballast with 315w philips light bulb (mogul) for a good price and bought 2 and used them , also no bars. 
I think it has to do with the camera setting, it has to match the frequency at which the light is pulsing.


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 16, 2017)

MarWan said:


> I used HPs & MH with mag ballasts at first, No bars.
> bought a 330 CDM and replaced the MH, No Bars.
> Found a site that sells a Philips LFSW ballast with 315w philips light bulb (mogul) for a good price and bought 2 and used them , also no bars.
> I think it has to do with the camera setting, it has to match the frequency at which the light is pulsing.


I'm guessing that's probably it. Because I tried out both separately and they both show bars. I'm sure there's a logical explanation, considering both show bars and not just one


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 16, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> I've been looking at those de 630's. I'm just trying to hold out until they've got purpose built ballasts for them.


Growers Choice has a ballast built for their de, it's all one piece


----------



## MarWan (Oct 16, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> I'm guessing that's probably it. Because I tried out both separately and they both show bars. I'm sure there's a logical explanation, considering both show bars and not just one


Try borrowing a digital cam (preferably a DSLR) and experment with the light source setting.

edit:

upon further reading, "Light Source Setting" in cams has to do more with colors "white Balance". 
http://support-th.canon-asia.com/contents/TH/EN/8201031500.html

The banding is caused by the shutter speed setting , sorry for my mistakes 

"With a low shutter speed, the image is evenly exposed, even with the 50/60Hz pulse in the light intensity.
However, in very strong light, the camera selects a very high shutter speed.

The pulsing light, and the fast shutter speed can interfere.
The pulsing light will cause not all lines of the image to be exposed evenly.
You can see this in the image, as banding, or flickering.
It appears as a series of dark and light bands horizontally across the image."

they offer solutions to the problem

https://vicon-security.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/210734443-Avoiding-interference-banding-or-flickering-with-fluorescent-tube-lights-or-high-frequency-lights-


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 16, 2017)

theinhibitor said:


> About the greenhouse, I was referring to beating nature. Its somewhat obvious, to any casual observer, that trying to beat the sun indoors is simply impossible from the standpoint that plants have evolved to use the sun for millennia.
> 
> Anyways, why CMH when LED? LED is the forefront tech right now. Platinum P600s are amazing, just alone they can produce massive colas.


If this is the case, then explain why indoor product is consistently better than outdoor?


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 16, 2017)

MarWan said:


> I used HPs & MH with mag ballasts at first, No bars.
> bought a 330 CDM and replaced the MH, No Bars.
> Found a site that sells a Philips LFSW ballast with 315w philips light bulb (mogul) for a good price and bought 2 and used them , also no bars.
> I think it has to do with the camera setting, it has to match the frequency at which the light is pulsing.


No it doesn't have to match at all, it just has to scan across at a constant rate. Maybe your camera is too good, because it shows up just fine on my cellphone camera.


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## theinhibitor (Oct 16, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> If this is the case, then explain why indoor product is consistently better than outdoor?


I think you are missing two things, compadre.

1st is, I was responding to another member and another question in total. Where did you get the idea that I, who grows indoor almost solely, would think outdoor has better product?
2nd is, that was my point exactly - that indoor is superior because you can control everything - light cycle AKA season, temp, humidity, CO2, feeding, etc. He was just talking about the sun though, which yes, you cant beat the sun. #1 cannabis producer (in pounds) in CA uses hydroponics in greenhouses, with timed lights for mimicking other seasons so he can grow all year round. Some thousand hectares in total.


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## MarWan (Oct 16, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Maybe your camera is too good, because it shows up just fine on my cellphone camera.


where I come from (I aint saying) we say Noobs get lucky sometimes, and I attribute my skills to that.


----------



## Javadog (Oct 16, 2017)

ThatSpudGuy said:


> Guys any idea if this system would be of any use or is it just a cheap crappy system that ill probably run into problems with?
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B071D26L6G/ref=ox_sc_saved_image_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A25TJCEOKW5IIO


I suppose that this would be the crux of that biscuit:

* Jim Hou *
*Just Launched* (Seller Profile)

"Just launched" should give you pause.....though not necessarily a killer.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 16, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> You really just wanna be right. Whatever you say at this point I'm done with it.


Ok, but if cooking the tops is causing the deficiency than the problem is from the light being too close and has nothing to do with problems related to the nutrients.

Besides, you said that air cooled lights cause nutrient deficiencies, which is ridiculous enough to start with. But then you said that they don't actually cause deficiencies but the damage they cause when kept too close is confused for deficiencies. Is it my fault that made a series of confusing and contradictory statements?


----------



## Bad Karma (Oct 16, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I remember the restrike issue but never found out the answers. But you don't like Galaxy because you say it doesn't re strike after power outage?
> 
> Mine turns back on fine after short and long outages and once a spike blew the growroom circuit and when I reset the breakers the LEC came on with the HPS. All on Galaxy ballasts.
> 
> ...


I've been in touch with GrowersHouse.com and Galaxy about the restrike issue. I was told by both parties that my unit was functioning fine because Galaxy ballasts do not auto restrike after a power outage. It has to be unplugged and plugged back in manually to resume normal operation after a power failure.


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 16, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> You really just wanna be right. Whatever you say at this point I'm done with it.


Some people you just can't reach, lol


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 16, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Growers Choice has a ballast built for their de, it's all one piece


Ok, that's good to know. I've been watching their sight for it for awhile but I've been slacking on it lately.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 16, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I've been in touch with GrowersHouse.com and Galaxy about the restrike issue. I was told by both parties that my unit was functioning fine because Galaxy ballasts do not auto restrike after a power outage. It has to be unplugged and plugged back in manually to resume normal operation after a power failure.



So are the titan units tricking mine into thinking they were plugged back in?

I'm tempted to plug it right into a wall outlet and trip the breaker to see what happens.


----------



## Bad Karma (Oct 16, 2017)

theinhibitor said:


> I have not ran LEC/CMH and dont plan to. Though it might have a better spectrum than HPS, I have not seen the evidence of the results.
> 
> I also dont really care for grams per wattage, as that mostly depends on strain. Too many variables involved in that number (tent, tent temp, reflector (or light density), water temp, PH, EC, feeding cycle, flushing, etc).
> 
> ...


So that's your picture of DQ under LED's and HPS? You mentioned living in the Emerald Triangle, right? I don't think so. Here's the origin of the pic you posted entitled "double_fun_op_hydrodensa_002-jpg". You gave it away by not renaming the picture file. So not only are you a complete fraud, but you're an idiot, as well.


----------



## ThatSpudGuy (Oct 17, 2017)

Javadog said:


> I suppose that this would be the crux of that biscuit:
> 
> * Jim Hou *
> *Just Launched* (Seller Profile)
> ...


So you wreckon its a no go then . Thanks for the input


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 17, 2017)

ThatSpudGuy said:


> So you wreckon its a no go then . Thanks for the input


If you're going to go with cmh you will most likely have your best luck under 315w Philips 3100k in a hood of decent size with the bulb hanging vertically, and making sure that the ballast advertises *low frequency square wave*. These are solid for 3x3's


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 17, 2017)

ThatSpudGuy said:


> So you wreckon its a no go then . Thanks for the input


https://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-315w-light-ceramic-mh-cmh-fixture-277v-3100k?amp=1

This specific unit in my opinion, if you have the extra money because it's a bit more expensive, is the one to go with.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 17, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> Ok, but if cooking the tops is causing the deficiency than the problem is from the light being too close and has nothing to do with problems related to the nutrients.
> 
> Besides, you said that air cooled lights cause nutrient deficiencies, which is ridiculous enough to start with. But then you said that they don't actually cause deficiencies but the damage they cause when kept too close is confused for deficiencies. Is it my fault that made a series of confusing and contradictory statements?


This is the last time I respond to anything you say. Your argumentative, just to argue. 


SchmoeJoe said:


> Ok, but if cooking the tops is causing the deficiency than the problem is from the light being too close and has nothing to do with problems related to the nutrients.
> 
> Besides, you said that air cooled lights cause nutrient deficiencies, which is ridiculous enough to start with. But then you said that they don't actually cause deficiencies but the damage they cause when kept too close is confused for deficiencies. Is it my fault that made a series of confusing and contradictory statements?


wow.

That's the whole point I'm trying to get it. Air cooled growers keep the lights too close. Whether you want to believe it or not nutrient deficiencies are commonly caused from environmental problems not just a lack of overdose of nutrients. A lack of transpiration from heat will change the nutrient needs, the problem with air cooling is that only the top half of the plants needs have changed. It needs more water than nutrients than its bottom half, because when a plant transpire it uses water much faster than nutrients leaving behind entirely too much salt.

I've set up anywhere from 4 lights to 2000 light grows. Not a single one uses any type of air cooling goods. No commercial grows I have ever been to uses air cooled. It's old technology. Just like HPS. It's an inefficient use a light putting glasss between bulb and plant. Inefficient use of power cooling lights that produce better when running at full temp. Inefficient use of money to buy $200 hoods that a 50 dollar hood could do better.

Air cooling is a thing of the past. Hop on board or be left behind.


----------



## ThatSpudGuy (Oct 17, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> https://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-315w-light-ceramic-mh-cmh-fixture-277v-3100k?amp=1
> 
> This specific unit in my opinion, if you have the extra money because it's a bit more expensive, is the one to go with.


Yeah bit more expensive then what my budget is and trying to replace my 600 watt hps . Im looking into all the different lights. My budget is 300. 350 max


----------



## genuity (Oct 17, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> So that's your picture of DQ under LED's and HPS? You mentioned living in the Emerald Triangle, right? I don't think so. Here's the origin of the pic you posted entitled "double_fun_op_hydrodensa_002-jpg". You gave it away by not renaming the picture file. So not only are you a complete fraud, but you're an idiot, as well.
> View attachment 4028008
> View attachment 4028015


Love this post....


----------



## DemonTrich (Oct 17, 2017)

I must be doing it all wrong with my 7x315 cmh all in air cooled hoods pulling in 1.5gpw each and every run then..........


----------



## pinner420 (Oct 17, 2017)

Do any of you guys run flips on your 315s?


----------



## thccbdhealth (Oct 17, 2017)

I run the 3100 straight threw, switching to flower.
or are you asking about switching bulbs


----------



## pinner420 (Oct 17, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> I run the 3100 straight threw, switching to flower.
> or are you asking about switching bulbs


So if you have a single ballast and two cord sets you flip from one room to the other. With some of the soft start circuits in the new digital balasts i know it to be an issue.


----------



## MarWan (Oct 17, 2017)

ThatSpudGuy said:


> Yeah bit more expensive then what my budget is and trying to replace my 600 watt hps . Im looking into all the different lights. My budget is 300. 350 max


I think your best bet is to source parts separately
for example

Ballast
https://www.lightbulbs.com/product/philips-07357
or
https://www.amazon.com/Advance-IZTMH210315RLFM/dp/B00OIGF58E

lamp
https://growershouse.com/philips-mastercolor-cdm-tp-elite-315w-cmh-agro-lamp-t12-3100-k

315w Ceramic MH CMH to Mogul Base Socket Adapter
https://growershouse.com/315w-ceramic-mh-cmh-to-mogul-base-socket-adapter

total cost ~ $225 - $325

you might find cheaper at other places.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 17, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> So if you have a single ballast and two cord sets you flip from one room to the other. With some of the soft start circuits in the new digital balasts i know it to be an issue.


As far as running digital ballasts on light flippers if they aren't smart ballasts that recognize the change they'll keep trying to power the new bulb without going through the striking phase. You have to run a timer on the ballast so that it shuts off a few minutes before the flip and comes back on a few minutes after. This will basically reset the ballast so that it will properly strike the next bulb.


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## ttystikk (Oct 18, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> As far as running digital ballasts on light flippers if they aren't smart ballasts that recognize the change they'll keep trying to power the new bulb without going through the striking phase. You have to run a timer on the ballast so that it shuts off a few minutes before the flip and comes back on a few minutes after. This will basically reset the ballast so that it will properly strike the next bulb.


Absolute bullshit. Obviously you've never tried it. Magnetic ballasts have capacitors inside so that when a flip box transfers power from one lamp to another, it will automatically strike. Digital ballasts with error sensing circuitry interpret the flip as a power fault and will stop operating.

Why is it that every time I turn around, you're full of shit?


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## Heisengrow (Oct 18, 2017)

Awesome thread.what dude said up.there about air cooled hoods is spot on but sometimes people have to have them to control excessive heat so I don't fault them.there like autos they both have there place.
Scott's OG 22 days since flip.twin 315w cmh in wing reflectors FTW....


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 18, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Absolute bullshit. Obviously you've never tried it. Magnetic ballasts have capacitors inside so that when a flip box transfers power from one lamp to another, it will automatically strike. Digital ballasts with error sensing circuitry interpret the flip as a power fault and will stop operating.
> 
> Why is it that every time I turn around, you're full of shit?


I said digital ballasts that aren't smart ballasts, as in don't have the sensory circuits you're talking about. I'm actually quoting a distributors directions here. I also didn't say a thing about magnetic ballasts at all. In case you feel like calling bullshit on this too I figured I'd just show you. 




Home / Controllers • Meters / Powerbox OG Flipbox

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The original Powerbox FLIPBOX is an individual light switching controller that allows an individual ballast to run two separate lights - one at a time - by switching back and forth between each light, at a user-specified interval, usually 12 hours for each light for flowering phases of plant growth.



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Additional Information
Name Powerbox OG Flipbox
Brand Powerbox
SKU 702975
Warranty 5 Year
Voltage 120-240v
MSRP $167.00


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Details
The original Powerbox FLIPBOX is an individual light switching module that allows an individual ballast to run two separate lights - one at a time - by switching back and forth between each light, at a user-specified interval. Flipboxes have lots of possibilities and save lots of money, when compared to buying new digital ballasts. Use the Powerbox OG Flibox to double production without installing additional power circuits and save money on ballasts by using one ballast. Hand-built at their California factory, 5 year warranty.

The Powerbox OG Flibox voltage independent - works with 120 Volt and 240 Volt ballasts. Fits Sunlight Supply style ballasts.
Use one Flipbox per 


Powerbox Flipbox Compatibility

Powerbox Flipboxes work with virtually any H.I.D. ballast, be it magnetic or digital/electronic. Some ballasts, however, may require additional steps to function properly. If you are using Lumatek, Nextgen, or Phantom digital ballasts, or if your ballasts are having trouble switching, you must observe the following instructions in BOLD lettering.

Some digital/electronic ballasts contain an 'error sensing' circuit that is meant to detect if there is a bulb failure. In the event of a bulb failure, the ballast will shut itself down and not restart until the user unplugs the ballast to reset it. When running with Flipboxes®, ballasts that contain this 'error sensing' circuitry often misinterpret a light switching cycle as a dead bulb, and they shut themselves off. This problem is easy to remedy by following a few simple steps:

1). With your lighting controller, or timer, program so that your ballast(s) turn OFF 5 minutes before you will be initiating the light switching (FLIP) cycle. (For Instance: If your light switching cycle occurs at 12:00PM, then program the ballast(s) to turn off at 11:55AM.)

2). Program the Flipbox® timer to initiate the changeover (FLIP) at 12:00PM.

3). Program your lighting controller, or timer, to turn the ballast(s) back ON at 12:05PM.

4). Repeat this procedure for the AM cycle (Ballasts OFF at 11:55PM, FLIP at 12:00AM, Ballasts ON at 12:05AM).

When using any of these electronic/digital ballasts with 'error sensing' circuitry, or if your ballast is having trouble igniting a lamp after switchover, you must observe the above instructions to ensure the trouble-free operation of your ballasts with the Flipbox®.


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----------



## ttystikk (Oct 18, 2017)

Heisengrow said:


> Awesome thread.what dude said up.there about air cooled hoods is spot on but sometimes people have to have them to control excessive heat so I don't fault them.there like autos they both have there place.
> Scott's OG 22 days since flip.twin 315w cmh in wing reflectors FTW....
> 
> 
> ...


Nice canopy management there!


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 18, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> I said digital ballasts that aren't smart ballasts, as in don't have the sensory circuits you're talking about. I'm actually quoting a distributors directions here. I also didn't say a thing about magnetic ballasts at all. In case you feel like calling bullshit on this too I figured I'd just show you.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Your first post was misleading.


----------



## Heisengrow (Oct 19, 2017)

theinhibitor said:


> I have not ran LEC/CMH and dont plan to. Though it might have a better spectrum than HPS, I have not seen the evidence of the results.
> 
> I also dont really care for grams per wattage, as that mostly depends on strain. Too many variables involved in that number (tent, tent temp, reflector (or light density), water temp, PH, EC, feeding cycle, flushing, etc).
> 
> ...


 @SchmoeJoe I was talking about this dude posted someone elses grow.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 19, 2017)

Heisengrow said:


> @SchmoeJoe I was talking about this dude posted someone elses grow.


Yeah, my apologies. I can't say that enough. I did edit my last post to include a question for you about the de cmh with some context. Again, sorry about that. I've just started getting used to getting called out and didn't take the time to really read between the lines on that one.

It's been frustrating. Some of my earliest memories are from being three or four years old in Las Vegas helping my dad compost and work his vegetable garden. I built my first grow rooms with him at 15 over twenty years ago and I've been doing it and studying the hell out of it ever since.


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## pinner420 (Oct 19, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> As far as running digital ballasts on light flippers if they aren't smart ballasts that recognize the change they'll keep trying to power the new bulb without going through the striking phase. You have to run a timer on the ballast so that it shuts off a few minutes before the flip and comes back on a few minutes after. This will basically reset the ballast so that it will properly strike the next bulb.


So ballast shuts down for 15min then power to the flip gets cut 10 min after that and it should flip?


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 19, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> So ballast shuts down for 15min then power to the flip gets cut 10 min after that and it should flip?


Plug the ballast into its own timer. The light flipper in its own timer. Set them so the power to the ballast is cut just before each flip and turned on just after. It doesn't have to be any specific amount of time but you can keep it closer to keep your flowering plants under more light.

Most mechanical timers run on 15 minute intervals. If you set it so the flip happens somewhere in the middle there you'd be fine. If you have a digital timer you might even be able to set it so the nallast is off for about 5 minutes with the flip somewhere in the middle of that. 

Since it will all be on timers you don't have to worry about it stressing plants because the day/night will still be consistent. The 12/12 gives you more light but some growers , like DJ Short, even recommend running 11.5 on 12.5 off. Anything in between will work fine so you don't have to worry about how long the ballast is off between flips. Just be sure the flip is somewhere towards the middle of the time frame where the ballast is off.


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 19, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> So ballast shuts down for 15min then power to the flip gets cut 10 min after that and it should flip?


Having looked into this, I realized there's very little point to it. The savings find by not having as many ballasts as lights is spent on the flipbox. Worse, if either a flipbox OR a ballast quits, there's two dead spots in your garden instead of just one.

So twice the points of failure, twice the consequences, no real cost savings.


----------



## pinner420 (Oct 19, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Having looked into this, I realized there's very little point to it. The savings find by not having as many ballasts as lights is spent on the flipbox. Worse, if either a flipbox OR a ballast quits, there's two dead spots in your garden instead of just one.
> 
> So twice the points of failure, twice the consequences, no real cost savings.


Or even worse you order a dual 315 balast and one side is DOA. So its a 7 day temporary implementation. Had a 6year old flip sitting om the shelf that was bullet proof with the old school lumateks....


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 19, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> Or even worse you order a dual 315 balast and one side is DOA. So its a 7 day temporary implementation. Had a 6year old flip sitting om the shelf that was bullet proof with the old school lumateks....


If you've already got the box, use it. But I did a cost/benefit analysis and found little upside, outweighed by the downsides I listed above.

And that's exactly the reason I want one ballast per box, so I can swap them out and repair or replace the offending unit and carry a minimum of spares.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 20, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> Or even worse you order a dual 315 balast and one side is DOA. So its a 7 day temporary implementation. Had a 6year old flip sitting om the shelf that was bullet proof with the old school lumateks....


If you're running a lot of lights then it's worth while but if not there's no savings. It's an economy of scale thing.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 20, 2017)

Running 2 rooms on the same ballasts doubles your total output with the same amount of power. 

If you have your power maxed out at 80% you can grow twice as much with the same circuit. 

Also rooms can heat one another in cold climates and share air conditioning/ ventilation/ co2. 

The cost benefit is huge. And the output for the power available is double. And the output for a given time period is doubled.


----------



## pinner420 (Oct 20, 2017)

A friend referred to it as a time machine. He always had a smile on his face if youd let him talk about it.


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 20, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> If you're running a lot of lights then it's worth while but if not there's no savings. It's an economy of scale thing.


No it isn't. Show us the math.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 20, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Running 2 rooms on the same ballasts doubles your total output with the same amount of power.
> 
> If you have your power maxed out at 80% you can grow twice as much with the same circuit.
> 
> ...


You'd still be running the same amount of power whether you're running two rooms on opposing schedules with two sets of ballasts or one set and a flip box. The only difference is how many ballasts you run and how you set up everything in the same circuit.

The only way you're saving money, since you use the same amount of power either way, is if the flip box costs less than the second set of ballasts. When I did the cost comparison I found that there wasn't much of a difference unless you're running a lot of lights.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 20, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> No it isn't. Show us the math.


Power Box OG 1x2 flip box MSRP 159

Growers Choice 630 CMH MSRP 200

At those prices you'll save 41 dollars which amounts to a 20% savings but the dollar amount is almost negligible and I'd rather spend the extra 41 dollars and have the extra ballast;

159÷200=.795=20% savings

Flip Box 12x24 MSRP 1,359$

Same 200$ ballast MSRP= 2,400$ for the extra set of ballasts.

1,359÷2,400=.56625. Essentially a savings of 50% over the cost of the ballasts the flip box replaces. That's a meaningful savings.

Like I said, economy of scale. I hope that wasn't too "misleading" for you to understand.


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 20, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> Power Box OG 1x2 flip box MSRP 159
> 
> Growers Choice 630 CMH MSRP 200
> 
> ...


As soon as you add in the fact that you now have to keep both spare ballasts AND flip boxes on hand, it suddenly stops being cost effective.

Furthermore, you're now stuck with two rooms that can't effectively be used for anything but flowering, so flexibility also suffers.

This is one of those technologies that I really wanted to like but the closer I looked at it, the less sense it made. Same deal with multiple ballasts in a single case.


----------



## since1991 (Oct 20, 2017)

I dont know much about flip boxes but from what i understand its just a way to save initial cash on startup for growers that want to run 2 rooms. Only one ballast purchase but still the bulbs and reflectors for both rooms. I heard about these a few years ago and they were popular with growers that also employed "lung rooms". If anyone is familiar with that method of dual growroom climate control.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 20, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> You'd still be running the same amount of power whether you're running two rooms on opposing schedules with two sets of ballasts or one set and a flip box. The only difference is how many ballasts you run and how you set up everything in the same circuit.
> 
> The only way you're saving money, since you use the same amount of power either way, is if the flip box costs less than the second set of ballasts. When I did the cost comparison I found that there wasn't much of a difference unless you're running a lot of lights.



If you do what you are saying you are still flipping rooms. The cost of the second ballasts is the point. They can all be backups or just not needed.

I am saying that flipping rooms doubles output for the same time and power. 2 harvests instead of 1 per cycle. 

The facility can grow day and night with no down time. 

And in colder climates the heating savings using the other rooms heat could be real big. 

I use my growroom exhausts to help heat my house.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 20, 2017)

since1991 said:


> I dont know much about flip boxes but from what i understand its just a way to save initial cash on startup for growers that want to run 2 rooms. Only one ballast purchase but still the bulbs and reflectors for both rooms. I heard about these a few years ago and they were popular with growers that also employed "lung rooms". If anyone is familiar with that method of dual growroom climate control.



I share summer air conditioning by using my veg room as a lung room. I air condition veg with an oversized window unit and have an intake fan sending the cool air through the wall into the flower room next door. 

Heat will circulate the same way in winter. But I unplug the exhaust from my chimney and run it under the living room. 

Saves 400 gallons of propane each winter on average.


----------



## since1991 (Oct 20, 2017)

Its all relative with the flip boxes. Saying if one has the space just run all the lamps and ballasts in the same room. Or however people do it. A million ways. All the flips do is fit the cats that see the need with what they are dealing with. Relative factors being space..time and cash. There are no savings after initial purchase.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 20, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Its all relative with the flip boxes. Saying if one has the space just run all the lamps and ballasts in the same room. Or however people do it. A million ways. All the flips do is fit the cats that see the need with what they are dealing with. Relative factors being space..time and cash. There are no savings after initial purchase.


The biggest advantage is being able to power twice the area on the same circuit. Its what they're intended for. You can't do that in the same room because they'll have to be on separate opposing photoperiods. I've done the same thing by just using a seperate set of ballasts running off of the same sub panel.The savings from buying fewer ballasts is a secondary benefit to that.


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 20, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> The biggest advantage is being able to power twice the area on the same circuit. The savings from buying fewer ballasts is secondary to that.


Only if you can't set a timer.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 20, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Only if you can't set a timer.


Anyone that can't set a timer will have a tough time using a flip box since they have to be used with a timer. They are nothing more than a timed relay after all. 

If you keep trolling me with condescending sarcasm I'm going to just put you down as ignored. Feel free to ask me to explain anything I've said but stop acting like a childish prick.


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 20, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> Anyone that can't set a timer will have a tough time using a flip box since they have to be used with a timer. They are nothing more than a timed relay after all.
> 
> If you keep trolling me with condescending sarcasm I'm going to just put you down as ignored. Feel free to ask me to explain anything I've said but stop acting like a childish prick.


You get awfully defensive when I'm just pointing out the obvious. Maybe climb down off your high horse there, cowboy.


----------



## since1991 (Oct 20, 2017)

SchmoeJoe said:


> The biggest advantage is being able to power twice the area on the same circuit. Its what they're intended for. You can't do that in the same room because they'll have to be on separate opposing photoperiods. I've done the same thing by just using a seperate set of ballasts running off of the same sub panel.The savings from buying fewer ballasts is a secondary benefit to that.


Never thought of that one. Makes sensei. Limited juice on a panel..can only run so much. Yep.


----------



## ttystikk (Oct 20, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Never thought of that one. Makes sensei. Limited juice on a panel..can only run so much. Yep.


Again, a timer can do the same thing. And doing it this way reduces the types of equipment one needs to keep spares for and it broadens one's options for lighting schedules.

I really wanted to like this tech and I looked hard for ways to justify it, but every 'advantage' turned into just another dead end.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 20, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> You get awfully defensive when I'm just pointing out the obvious. Maybe climb down off your high horse there, cowboy.


All of your calling "bullshit" about my previous posts makes me seriously question your intent when you respond to my comments. If I misinterpreted your intent here I apologize.


----------



## SchmoeJoe (Oct 20, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Again, a timer can do the same thing. And doing it this way reduces the types of equipment one needs to keep spares for and it broadens one's options for lighting schedules.
> 
> I really wanted to like this tech and I looked hard for ways to justify it, but every 'advantage' turned into just another dead end.


When I considered flip boxes I ended up doing the same thing. I just ran seperate sets of ballasts on their own timers so I could run two spaces off of the same limited available amperage.

If I we're running enough lights to save enough money to make it worth it I would've went that route but the cost for the number of ballasts I was looking at running was about the same as the cost of the flip box I would've needed and, like you said, having the ballasts instead of the flipper gives you a lot more flexibilty.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 20, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Its all relative with the flip boxes. Saying if one has the space just run all the lamps and ballasts in the same room. Or however people do it. A million ways. All the flips do is fit the cats that see the need with what they are dealing with. Relative factors being space..time and cash. There are no savings after initial purchase.



It is done as a way to maximize available power. The rest are just other benefits. 

You could do it in a bedroom and run 2 tents on one 600 watt draw so as not to tax a 15 amp circuit. The a/c could already max it out. 

For example. 

And I agree. Tons of variables to consider. All are tools to an end.


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## pinner420 (Oct 20, 2017)

I believe legally flying said it best. His electric bill was around 10k per month down in Colorado. I can't afford to have any of my equipment idle for even an hour. After feeling the pain of buying a dual balast and having one side fail the flip saved my bacon. I like simple and the flip does add a layer of complexity to trouble shooting. Ive read threads on guys pulling their hair out on this topic. Im glad my question recieved such healthy debate; great input. Experience has taught me you have to have a hot spare anyway.


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## ttystikk (Oct 20, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> I believe legally flying said it best. His electric bill was around 10k per month down in Colorado. I can't afford to have any of my equipment idle for even an hour. After feeling the pain of buying a dual balast and having one side fail the flip saved my bacon. I like simple and the flip does add a layer of complexity to trouble shooting. Ive read threads on guys pulling their hair out on this topic. Im glad my question recieved such healthy debate; great input. Experience has taught me you have to have a hot spare anyway.


Hot spares for everything; that's why I built 50+ of the exact same water-cooled LED module.


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## since1991 (Oct 21, 2017)

I swear I got 2 of everything in a corner of my basement. I even got pieces of an old ass Hydrofarm Quantum drip system. Still got my first light too. A very old 400 watt sodium set up. Hamilton Technologies "Max - 89" (lol) reflector. Circa 1990 there abouts. With the Iwasaki Hortilux bulb. Back when they were cheap and a second tier brand.


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## genuity (Oct 21, 2017)

Still running galaxy ballast (6yrs old)....no back ups on deck..

But I do got a back up wife on stand-by....just in case this first ones go's bad..


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## ttystikk (Oct 21, 2017)

genuity said:


> Still running galaxy ballast (6yrs old)....no back ups on deck..
> 
> But I do got a back up wife on stand-by....just in case this first ones go's bad..


I'd pay money to watch her face when you tell her that. LOL


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## genuity (Oct 22, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> I'd pay money to watch her face when you tell her that. LOL


I'm not trying to get beat up....


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## pinner420 (Oct 22, 2017)

genuity said:


> I'm not trying to get beat up....


Just dont get caught!


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## gr865 (Oct 22, 2017)

genuity said:


> But I do got a back up wife on stand-by....just in case this first ones go's bad..


Be safe get rid of the backup wife, cost plenty of pain and suffering in the end and the cost is stifling. Believe me I know, LOL


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## ttystikk (Oct 22, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> Just dont get caught!


I sense this is a lesson you've yet to learn...


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## gr865 (Oct 22, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> I sense this is a lesson you've yet to learn...


Well I hope he does not get caught, $100's of K's was the final cost.


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## Yodaweed (Oct 23, 2017)

Just got another sun system 315 CMH with vertical reflector, pretty excited for this next run, running rare dankess Grape Ox and OG Raskal White Fire OG, i'm hoping to see some pretty fall colors, the grape ox turns purple under my HPS so I think it might be real colorful under the CMH/HPS combo, also planning to put a couple LEDs next to my CMH this run since it's approaching winter time the heat shouldn't be an issue.


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## gr865 (Oct 24, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> Just got another sun system 315 CMH with vertical reflector, pretty excited for this next run, running rare dankess Grape Ox and OG Raskal White Fire OG, i'm hoping to see some pretty fall colors, the grape ox turns purple under my HPS so I think it might be real colorful under the CMH/HPS combo, also planning to put a couple LEDs next to my CMH this run since it's approaching winter time the heat shouldn't be an issue.



Can you link me to the sun system vertical reflector, have not seen this.
If you are going to run vertical, why reflector and not bare bulb?
Not questioning your grow just have never heard of this.

GR


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## Yodaweed (Oct 24, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Can you link me to the sun system vertical reflector, have not seen this.
> If you are going to run vertical, why reflector and not bare bulb?
> Not questioning your grow just have never heard of this.
> 
> GR


https://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-315-ra-cmh-remote-reflector

The reflector holds the bulb vertically not horizontally, much better light intensity than what i had.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 24, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Can you link me to the sun system vertical reflector, have not seen this.
> If you are going to run vertical, why reflector and not bare bulb?
> Not questioning your grow just have never heard of this.
> 
> GR



https://www.sunlightsupply.com/shop/product/sun-system-lec-brand-315-ra-remote-reflector_52_000010

This reflector or the original all in one unit with the ballast attached has shown the highest par the 315 cmh can put down at 16". 

Sunlight supply and cycloptics cmh vertical mount open reflectors were designed with Phillips specifically for the bulb. 

The 315 horticulture bulb was designed to be run vertically in an open reflector. The reflector actually enables the bulb to reach the high numbers and efficiency claimed by manufacturers. 

The university of Utah did their tests on the 315 with a reflector designed this way. 

https://www.cycloptics.com/sites/default/files/GB USU Spectral Characterization link.pdf


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## jonsnow399 (Oct 24, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> Just got another sun system 315 CMH with vertical reflector, pretty excited for this next run, running rare dankess Grape Ox and OG Raskal White Fire OG, i'm hoping to see some pretty fall colors, the grape ox turns purple under my HPS so I think it might be real colorful under the CMH/HPS combo, also planning to put a couple LEDs next to my CMH this run since it's approaching winter time the heat shouldn't be an issue.


I just got a 750 watt DE to go with my 315's so I'm stoked for the next run too. I got the 750 mainly for the heat.


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## gr865 (Oct 24, 2017)

I see, like mine only I remove the ballast and hood when I run bare bulb vertical.
Right now I am running my 25 day old plant under a 315W CMH with ballast attached in the horizontal position.
 

The plants under this horizontal setup.
 

When I remove the reflector and move the ballast outside the tent. This is from last grow. 
 

Here are the ballast outside the tent, the second ballast is just opposite this one.
 

When he talked vertical I was thinking this method. My grow before the last vert was horizontal, and I used the 315 with the hood but I also used a SS400 LED. I tilted both lights and rotated the plants and was running only two plants but got 15 zips off them. Here is a pic of them in veg, you can see the pick hue of the LED on the left and the Brightness of the 315 on the right.


This worked well but running stacked 315 in a vert grow I got 34+ total zips with 24.5 being trimmed smokable buds.

I begin training these ladies next week for this winter grow.

GR


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## since1991 (Oct 24, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> I just got a 750 watt DE to go with my 315's so I'm stoked for the next run too. I got the 750 mainly for the heat.


Interested to see how this works for ya. And the lamps distance for each fixture to canopy for optimum coverage. Thanks.


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## jonsnow399 (Oct 24, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Interested to see how this works for ya. And the lamps distance for each fixture to canopy for optimum coverage. Thanks.


I have a large hood mounted high for the 750 and a small gavita commercial type reflector mounted low for the 315, that way the 315 won't block out the 750.


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## gr865 (Oct 24, 2017)

jonsnow, you got some pics of that setup?

GR


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## jonsnow399 (Oct 24, 2017)

gr865 said:


> jonsnow, you got some pics of that setup?
> 
> GR


Sorry I haven't got it set up yet, and I don't post pics but these are the reflectors.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0123957K8/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

https://www.amazon.com/HydroplanetTM-Double-Reflector-Horticulture-Hydroponic/dp/B074JKPFL8/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1508881728&sr
just cheapies, but they work well.


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## since1991 (Oct 24, 2017)

Yeah id like to see how your gonna mount them. I know Gavita 750's need damn near as much height as a thouie de. At least 30 to 36 inches....multiple 750 de's anyways. And little 315 cmh's...16 to 20 inches?? I dunno. Seems like putting a howitzer field cannon next to a .22 caliber. This is speculation. Now a GC 630 cmh de...that seems it would pair up nicely with a 750 hps de.


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## jonsnow399 (Oct 24, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Yeah id like to see how your gonna mount them. I know Gavita 750's need damn near as much height as a thouie de. At least 30 to 36 inches....multiple 750 de's anyways. And little 315 cmh's...16 to 20 inches?? I dunno. Seems like putting a howitzer field cannon next to a .22 caliber. This is speculation. Now a GC 630 cmh de...that seems it would pair up nicely with a 750 hps de.


Just gonna set the two side by side with the 315 lower. This may not be the optimum pairing, but its what I'm going with.


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## gr865 (Oct 24, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> Just gonna set the two side by side with the 315 lower. This may not be the optimum pairing, but its what I'm going with.


Yay gotta go with the bitch you brung to the dance. Good luck buddy.


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## Rollngrow (Oct 25, 2017)

Building a new room and looking for some input. 

My room is 13.5 x 12 for flowering. Unfortunately my ceilings are only 7ft but I can't change that...

6 de 630 nanolux 

Considering adding 6 600w de hps just for extra penetration etc

Having a hard time relying on the nanolux system as my only timer etc... what if I lose internet? Any experience with using their system? 

Going with co2 and 8" vent for backup 

Mini split... dehumidifier etc...


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## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 25, 2017)

Rollngrow said:


> Building a new room and looking for some input.
> 
> My room is 13.5 x 12 for flowering. Unfortunately my ceilings are only 7ft but I can't change that...
> 
> ...


As someone who had grown with 7 ft ceilings for over 6 years now, stay away from anything DE. It leaves no room for mistakes on stretch/plant size. You'd be better off with 12 315s. Canopy essentially wall to wall.

Personally I'd go with 3 ton mini split. 
Two quest 105 dehumidifier.


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## TedeBoy (Oct 25, 2017)

My girls love their SS 315W LEC


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## Rollngrow (Oct 25, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> As someone who had grown with 7 ft ceilings for over 6 years now, stay away from anything DE. It leaves no room for mistakes on stretch/plant size. You'd be better off with 12 315s. Canopy essentially wall to wall.
> 
> Personally I'd go with 3 ton mini split.
> Two quest 105 dehumidifier.



Thanks! I was pretty set on the 630's but for some reason I got the idea in my head I should ad some 600's I have always grown in tents so the 7' ceiling wasn't as intimidating not to mention I'm in a wheelchair so I don't go huge anyway but I think the 6 fixtures will do well. I was hoping to find someone with some experience with the nanolux system. Or maybe even just someone who has enough computer experience to know if I need constant internet connection in order to keep everything running right


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## gr865 (Oct 25, 2017)

MIne also @ 26 days from sprout, spent 17 days under a a 4 lamp T5, transplanted into the 2 gallon Smart Pots and put under the 315W CMH with the hood for 8 days. Yesterday I went vertical bare bulb to begin training the plants for this vertical grow.

 

Can see my journal in sig below.

GR


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## gr865 (Oct 25, 2017)

Rollngrow said:


> Thanks! I was pretty set on the 630's but for some reason I got the idea in my head I should ad some 600's I have always grown in tents so the 7' ceiling wasn't as intimidating not to mention I'm in a wheelchair so I don't go huge anyway but I think the 6 fixtures will do well. I was hoping to find someone with some experience with the nanolux system. Or maybe even just someone who has enough computer experience to know if I need constant internet connection in order to keep everything running right


I run two Nanolux CMH NC 315W, Here is a pic with the hood, I run bare bulb so I remove the hood, remove the ballast from the lamp ( put it outside the tent), and let socket hang in the vertical position.

GR


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## jonsnow399 (Oct 25, 2017)

Rollngrow said:


> Thanks! I was pretty set on the 630's but for some reason I got the idea in my head I should ad some 600's I have always grown in tents so the 7' ceiling wasn't as intimidating not to mention I'm in a wheelchair so I don't go huge anyway but I think the 6 fixtures will do well. I was hoping to find someone with some experience with the nanolux system. Or maybe even just someone who has enough computer experience to know if I need constant internet connection in order to keep everything running right


You can get away with 315 de's easy, never ran the 630's but I bet they would work too.


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## rkymtnman (Oct 25, 2017)

hey, any of you guys or gals ever run the 210 w LEC?? I'm thinking of trying it out in a small veg tent instead of going T5's.my 315 puts me at almost 80 w/sq ft for a 2x2 veg tent. 210 is 50 w/sq ft

i have the philips ballast and it's an easy switch over to run the 210w. just need the bulb. like 50 bucks on ebay.

anyone?


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## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 25, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> hey, any of you guys or gals ever run the 210 w LEC?? I'm thinking of trying it out in a small veg tent instead of going T5's.my 315 puts me at almost 80 w/sq ft for a 2x2 veg tent. 210 is 50 w/sq ft
> 
> i have the philips ballast and it's an easy switch over to run the 210w. just need the bulb. like 50 bucks on ebay.
> 
> anyone?


http://www.lighting.philips.com/main/prof/conventional-lamps-and-tubes/high-intensity-discharge-lamps/ceramic-metal-halide/mastercolor-cdm-t-elite-med-wattage

I am sure it would work as well or better than standard metal halide. 

But it doesnt mention horticultural use like the 3100k 315.


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## rkymtnman (Oct 25, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> http://www.lighting.philips.com/main/prof/conventional-lamps-and-tubes/high-intensity-discharge-lamps/ceramic-metal-halide/mastercolor-cdm-t-elite-med-wattage
> 
> I am sure it would work as well or better than standard metal halide.
> 
> But it doesnt mention horticultural use like the 3100k 315.


my setup uses the mogul based 315 in 4200K.it has the e39 base instead of that pgzx18 like most 315s

it's a kick ass veg light. and does good in bloom now that i added some 3000K Cobs.


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## genuity (Oct 25, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> hey, any of you guys or gals ever run the 210 w LEC?? I'm thinking of trying it out in a small veg tent instead of going T5's.my 315 puts me at almost 80 w/sq ft for a 2x2 veg tent. 210 is 50 w/sq ft
> 
> i have the philips ballast and it's an easy switch over to run the 210w. just need the bulb. like 50 bucks on ebay.
> 
> anyone?


I ran my first SS 315 at 210....well the switch never got flipped at the manufacturer...
It did just fine..4200 bulb.


----------



## jonsnow399 (Oct 25, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> hey, any of you guys or gals ever run the 210 w LEC?? I'm thinking of trying it out in a small veg tent instead of going T5's.my 315 puts me at almost 80 w/sq ft for a 2x2 veg tent. 210 is 50 w/sq ft
> 
> i have the philips ballast and it's an easy switch over to run the 210w. just need the bulb. like 50 bucks on ebay.
> 
> anyone?


The bulbs rated open?


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## rkymtnman (Oct 26, 2017)

genuity said:


> I ran my first SS 315 at 210....well the switch never got flipped at the manufacturer...
> It did just fine..4200 bulb.


haven't thought of doing it that way! would save money on not buying a new bulb. 

how did you figure out it was set at 210? didn't seem like the bulb was as bright as it should be??


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## rkymtnman (Oct 26, 2017)

jonsnow399 said:


> The bulbs rated open?


the 210 i saw on ebay was enclosed rating. which is fine as i run my 315 in a reflector with glass anyways.


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## since1991 (Oct 26, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> As someone who had grown with 7 ft ceilings for over 6 years now, stay away from anything DE. It leaves no room for mistakes on stretch/plant size. You'd be better off with 12 315s. Canopy essentially wall to wall.
> 
> Personally I'd go with 3 ton mini split.
> Two quest 105 dehumidifier.


This^^^. I wish my basement had another 2 feet. At least a foot. Iam at 7 now with 8 750 Gavitas. And the fixtures are between the basement floor joists. Got lucky and they happen to fit just snug. Nanos with the flat horizontal orientated ballast would of been even better but they would of been even more recessed...shining on about an inch of joist wood...lol. (Sawzall on a rental home = been there done that. Many landlords are pissed in this town). Truth is..I actually am too low for double ended hps. My plant heights are critical. No room for error. And canopy management is critical/ veg size is of the utmost importance. Yes...with de's...its easy to fry the tops. I have to train them low and wide in my veg room. Much more important than mogul socket hid's. 8 foot plus minimum for even 750's and I'd venture to say 2 or 3 ft more with thouie de's. But if I keep them low and out of the danger zone...Iam ok. Cant run drain to waste tables either. Just plumbed together catch saucers for runoff. Lowest I can go. Every inch is prime real estate. Again..ive said it before..and ive heard of it but I dont understand how people are cramming 750 and 1000 watt de's into tents and low ceilings.


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## Rollngrow (Oct 26, 2017)

since1991 said:


> This^^^. I wish my basement had another 2 feet. At least a foot. Iam at 7 now with 8 750 Gavitas. And the fixtures are between the basement floor joists. Got lucky and they happen to fit just snug. Nanos with the flat horizontal orientated ballast would of been even better but they would of been even more recessed...shining on about an inch of joist wood...lol. (Sawzall on a rental home = been there done that. Many landlords are pissed in this town). Truth is..I actually am too low for double ended hps. My plant heights are critical. No room for error. And canopy management is critical/ veg size is of the utmost importance. Yes...with de's...its easy to fry the tops. I have to train them low and wide in my veg room. Much more important than mogul socket hid's. 8 foot plus minimum for even 750's and I'd venture to say 2 or 3 ft more with thouie de's. But if I keep them low and out of the danger zone...Iam ok. Cant run drain to waste tables either. Just plumbed together catch saucers for runoff. Lowest I can go. Every inch is prime real estate. Again..ive said it before..and ive heard of it but I dont understand how people are cramming 750 and 1000 watt de's into tents and low ceilings.


I considered doing the very same thing. I was going to get 1000 de hps and put hem up inside the ceiling joists but then decided on the cmh lights but of course had to over think it and want to add hps, as I have grown with hps for like 10 years so I naturally want to use it.


----------



## since1991 (Oct 26, 2017)

Rollngrow said:


> I considered doing the very same thing. I was going to get 1000 de hps and put hem up inside the ceiling joists but then decided on the cmh lights but of course had to over think it and want to add hps, as I have grown with hps for like 10 years so I naturally want to use it.


1000 watt de's arw no go for anything less than 9 foot. At least I would think so. Iam had trouble with 750's at 7 feet. Sucks for us low ceiling growers to not be able to take advantage of powerful efficient de lamps. I manage but I have to pay attention more to plant size. One of the reasons I am so on the fence with cmh lamps. Would be perfect. But i have to know for sure the weight would still be there. Its a hefty trigger pull/gamble buying equivalent wattage of fixtures of an untried (for me) new lamp at what...450 $ a pop? Thats alot of bread...even for a dope grower. Todays dope grower anyways. 15 years ago...sign me up no problem. Lol. Heres the cash. Lol.


----------



## since1991 (Oct 26, 2017)

Anyone see how high the big boys in warehouses and greenhouses keep their double ended lamps? At least 12 to 16 feet. Seems counter intuituve but thats how its done. Its because they have so damn many. I seen a pic of a Netherlands greenhouse. Giant fucker..size of 50 football fields. Tulip house. It said it was packed with like 2500 p.l. fixtures or some crazy number. Mounted up HIGH. They dont fuck around in the greenhouse world. And here we are...trying to cram 1 to 10 of em in a basement or house. Lol.


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## rkymtnman (Oct 26, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Anyone see how high the big boys in warehouses and greenhouses keep their double ended lamps? At least 12 to 16 feet. Seems counter intuituve but thats how its done. Its because they have so damn many. I seen a pic of a Netherlands greenhouse. Giant fucker..size of 50 football fields. Tulip house. It said it was packed with like 2500 p.l. fixtures or some crazy number. Mounted up HIGH. They dont fuck around in the greenhouse world. And here we are...trying to cram 1 to 10 of em in a basement or house. Lol.


i almost went the DE 750 route. i'm glad i didn't even with 8 ft ceilings.


----------



## jonsnow399 (Oct 26, 2017)

hmm, I'm not having a problem with heat with my 750, almost disappointed heatwise. Just barely kept the room at 75. Also while the light is intense for sure the way everyone talked I thought laser beams were gonna shoot out everywhere.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Oct 26, 2017)

since1991 said:


> Anyone see how high the big boys in warehouses and greenhouses keep their double ended lamps? At least 12 to 16 feet. Seems counter intuituve but thats how its done. Its because they have so damn many. I seen a pic of a Netherlands greenhouse. Giant fucker..size of 50 football fields. Tulip house. It said it was packed with like 2500 p.l. fixtures or some crazy number. Mounted up HIGH. They dont fuck around in the greenhouse world. And here we are...trying to cram 1 to 10 of em in a basement or house. Lol.


Overlapping light increasing intensity. But not that high indoor. 5-6 ft at the most. (6ft would be in veg or very early flower) and that's in 500-1000 light rooms. 

Also in greenhouse they are supplement light, most often to just keep light schedules or increase light on cloudy days, so the higher they are they most space they cover.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Oct 26, 2017)

since1991 said:


> 1000 watt de's arw no go for anything less than 9 foot. At least I would think so. Iam had trouble with 750's at 7 feet. Sucks for us low ceiling growers to not be able to take advantage of powerful efficient de lamps. I manage but I have to pay attention more to plant size. One of the reasons I am so on the fence with cmh lamps. Would be perfect. But i have to know for sure the weight would still be there. Its a hefty trigger pull/gamble buying equivalent wattage of fixtures of an untried (for me) new lamp at what...450 $ a pop? Thats alot of bread...even for a dope grower. Todays dope grower anyways. 15 years ago...sign me up no problem. Lol. Heres the cash. Lol.



I like 600 super hps bulbs every 3.5' for the low ceilings I deal with. Even better would be 2 600's with a 315 in the middle of each 4'x8' area. 

And I keep the plants under 30" over 3 gallon pots.


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## genuity (Oct 26, 2017)

rkymtnman said:


> haven't thought of doing it that way! would save money on not buying a new bulb.
> 
> how did you figure out it was set at 210? didn't seem like the bulb was as bright as it should be??


Watt meter..& a member on here pointing it out.


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## TedeBoy (Nov 1, 2017)

Just curious how close you get your vertical 315 cmh bulbs away from the plant tops?

I go about 20" but haven't noticed any difference at 30" in my 3x3 foot tent.


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## Bad Karma (Nov 2, 2017)

My 8x4 tent with three 315's is up and running. The ladies are mostly Bubblicious (Resin Seeds), along with a Jack Herrer (Seedsman), and a Glueberry OG (Dutch Passion).


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## TedeBoy (Nov 2, 2017)

Nice. I'm jealous but my ladies are getting sexy under my single SS 315.


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## gr865 (Nov 3, 2017)

Just put the ladies on the screens. I am running two 315's, one vert and one horizontal st present. They are not tall enough for both to be set vertical, so I have the lower one vert and the upper light horiz. Running the one vertical without the second light is a problem because to keep the lamp just above the tops of the plants creates that dead zone of light at the tip of the lamp. So the lower parts of the plant were out of the direct light. Will be going both vertical within a week or so.
This is the light setup.


Group shot.


She is only 20" but she loves being bound to the screen. 


As with last grow we are not removing the fans yet, tucking them behind the screens.


Ladies bound to the screens and ready to rock.


These are indica dom so I am not expecting a lot of lateral growth but hope to get at least a 150 to 200% stretch. Am around 20 plus inches not.

GR


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## TedeBoy (Nov 3, 2017)

TedeBoy said:


> Nice. I'm jealous but my ladies are getting sexy under my single SS 315.
> 
> View attachment 4037147


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## ttystikk (Nov 4, 2017)

Rollngrow said:


> OK guys I’m probably overthinking this but I need some opinions.
> 
> 13x12 flowering room sealed room
> 
> ...


Run 315W fixtures. That way you get better light distribution.


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## Rollngrow (Nov 4, 2017)

ttystikk said:


> Run 315W fixtures. That way you get better light distribution.


That’s what I was thinking. So many reasons why that seems better. It always feels better to have someone tell you what you already knew for some reason. 

I’ve never been able to set something up that was this large and legal. Even though it’s not that large in comparison it’s a large investment for me and i hate getting a project almost done and realizing it would have been better to do it different not even costing much more or less....


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## ThaMagnificent (Nov 4, 2017)

Rare Darkness


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## since1991 (Nov 4, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> Rare Darkness


Damn. Those look juicy. Look ripe too. Nice.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 11, 2017)

Anyone using Hydroplanet 315 cmh?

https://www.hydroplanets.com/hydroplanettm-315w-grow-light-ceramic-metal-halide-fixture-with-4000k-bulbs.html


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 11, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> Rare Darkness


nice color @themagnificent


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## Yodaweed (Nov 11, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> Rare Darkness


Pretty fall colors, good job on that.

I just finished my rare dankness grape ox, lots of pretty colors under the hps, just started some clones of her under my cmh/hps combo, trying to bring out those fall colors like yours.


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## 68grasshopper (Nov 12, 2017)

hi, since i switched to cmh my smells,resin,look and quality has def amazed me. ive got a mixture of uk cheese
and chocolate chunk, 28 days left. 2 x 315 cmh.


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## TedeBoy (Nov 12, 2017)

68grasshopper said:


> hi, since i switched to cmh my smells,resin,look and quality has def amazed me. ive got a mixture of uk cheese
> and chocolate chunk, 28 days left. 2 x 315 cmh.
> 
> 
> View attachment 4041975 View attachment 4041976 View attachment 4041977


Holy smokes!!


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## TedeBoy (Nov 12, 2017)

My little organic soil autoflower grow is 35 days old.
About halfway done.
3x3 tent and one 315.
Mephisto Genetics.


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## 68grasshopper (Nov 12, 2017)

TedeBoy said:


> My little organic soil autoflower grow is 35 days old.
> About halfway done.
> 3x3 tent and one 315.
> Mephisto Genetics.
> View attachment 4042009 View attachment 4042010 View attachment 4042011 View attachment 4042012


lookin nice buddy, cant go wrong with mephisto genetics.


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## TedeBoy (Nov 12, 2017)

68grasshopper said:


> lookin nice buddy, cant go wrong with mephisto genetics.


Thanks.
Yours are photos I take it?


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## TedeBoy (Nov 12, 2017)

68grasshopper said:


> yes from camera.


No. I meant "photoperiod" rather than "autoflower".


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## 68grasshopper (Nov 12, 2017)

haha yeah photos,silly me


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## TedeBoy (Nov 12, 2017)

68grasshopper said:


> haha yeah photos,silly me


Cool avatar by the way!


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## TedeBoy (Nov 16, 2017)

Just s heads up.
I sent a question to Sun System asking how far from the flowering cannabis tops the 315W LEC should be.

They answered 24 inches.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Nov 16, 2017)

TedeBoy said:


> Just s heads up.
> I sent a question to Sun System asking how far from the flowering cannabis tops the 315W LEC should be.
> 
> They answered 24 inches.



That's too high for just one lamp in flower. 

Maybe veg in a 4x4. 

16" over 2.5 x2.5' is max par according to university of Utah testing. 

I found 18" to be the sweet spot in my room. Over 3x3. 

If I used 3 or more I would likely raise them a bit. 

We grow a high light plant. Not all plants would have the same answer. So they gave you a middle of the road guideline.


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## pinner420 (Nov 16, 2017)

Going with 3 surrounding her. Day one.


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## Bad Karma (Nov 16, 2017)

TedeBoy said:


> Just s heads up.
> I sent a question to Sun System asking how far from the flowering cannabis tops the 315W LEC should be.
> 
> They answered 24 inches.





MichiganMedGrower said:


> That's too high for just one lamp in flower.
> 
> Maybe veg in a 4x4.
> 
> ...


You're exactly right MMG, not all plants will have the same answer, it's always going to vary from girl to girl. We as gardeners need to be able to read our plants and know when something is too much for them. A range of 16"-20" is what's been working in my garden, depending on the plant, of course.


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## dangledo (Nov 17, 2017)

Gotta love fall time. Pertty colors


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## Sire Killem All (Nov 17, 2017)

Rollngrow said:


> Thanks! I was pretty set on the 630's but for some reason I got the idea in my head I should ad some 600's I have always grown in tents so the 7' ceiling wasn't as intimidating not to mention I'm in a wheelchair so I don't go huge anyway but I think the 6 fixtures will do well. I was hoping to find someone with some experience with the nanolux system. Or maybe even just someone who has enough computer experience to know if I need constant internet connection in order to keep everything running right


U just need a router to create a local network. No outside network needed.


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## NugHeuser (Nov 18, 2017)

Got the broad mites out of the way. 6 more days till flip. Alien Rift and Malibu Pie. Full speed ahead now. This is my first grow with cmh's, anticipating these buds is like a kid counting down the 25 days of Christmas.


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## gr865 (Nov 19, 2017)

Two Nanolux 315W CMH stacked bare bulb, 5 plants vertical grow.


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## DOOZY (Nov 20, 2017)

Just ordred 3 x 315w. Starting indoor again after a to long hiatus . great thead. Going no till this round.


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## gr865 (Nov 22, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Got the broad mites out of the way. 6 more days till flip. Alien Rift and Malibu Pie. Full speed ahead now. This is my first grow with cmh's, anticipating these buds is like a kid counting down the 25 days of Christmas.


Hey NH, tried checking your profile for your grow info. Could not get to it. Just flipped my Barneys LSD.
GR


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## NugHeuser (Nov 22, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Hey NH, tried checking your profile for your grow info. Could not get to it. Just flipped my Barneys LSD.
> GR


Yeah I got paranoid one day and turned off the visibility to my profile activity lol 
Here's the link to my grow.
https://www.rollitup.org/t/ocean-grown-seeds-and-cmhs.950213/#post-13813187


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## Carolina Dream'n (Nov 24, 2017)

WPFF GG4 Live Resin. Grown under sunsystem 315s. Using Ionic Bloom and Ersa Elixir.

I stopped growing for dry plant material weight and started growing for total grams of oil. So it's hard to say what a dry weight would be per room anymore since it never gets dried. But with many years of experience i believe I can still guess within a 1/2 pound or so. This room would have been easily 7# finished flower from six 315s. Instead it yielded just under 1000 grams of live resin.

Easy harvest. No trimming. Good yields. Great quality.

Ran in a bidirectional closed loop with a true dewaxing sleeve. 40% ISO-butane 35% n-butane 25% propane. Frozen product brought to -50 to -60 degree for an hour, flooded from bottom, soaked for 8 minutes, flooded from top. Goes to the dewaxing sleeve for 45 minutes at -50 degrees. Majority of fats, waxed and lipids stay behind with the use of filter media. Purged at full vacuum, 90 degrees 72 hours in Pyrex or on PTFE sheets depending on desired consistency.


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## gr865 (Nov 24, 2017)

*@Carolina Dream'n*

I don't really know much about Risens but that stuff looks dangerous, 
Course I probably don't want to learn about it because I just love a good joint or bowl and do not need to add another tool in my arsenal of smoking devices, and I can't afford it also.


----------



## gr865 (Nov 24, 2017)

Day 2 12/12

Last nights watering was done by hand, wanted to add some Great White, so got a gallon on solution from the rez add the GW and gave each plant three cups. Did not get any runoff but felt the base of the pots and they were wet. Loving the plant color, very even plant to plant, not overly green/lush growth and as of lately no burnt leaf tips, so all is good.
I make sure to wear the UV glasses, that damn light is bright, Try and not even look at them as much as possible.






So put back in place surrounding the lamps and ready for their day, my night.






So this morning at light off, got a couple of shots. 
Love the way the plant is reaching for the lamps, I have a feeling that I am going to need the nets holding up the cola's this grow, at least I damn hope so. The main stem and branches are strong but the stems coming off the branches are not that strong looking. But man there are a shit load of bud sites. 






Here are a couple of the plants showing the regrowth following defo.
11/17




11/24 





11/16





11/24





Lights off temps 69 - 71F, lights on temps 80 - 82F
Sunday or Monday they will be due another defo, them ladies may not have grown very tall but there are many bud sites and a shit load of leaves that are going to keep me busy. I love it, in our nightly phone calls my GF ask me what did I do that day? But adds besides working on our plants It is a great hobby that provides me the medicines I need for pain management, stress relief and allows me to get much needed relaxation without meds or alcohol. 

C y'all,
GR


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## 68grasshopper (Nov 26, 2017)

a selection of buds under 315 cmh ,excellent thc production -to the touch they`re almost greasy !
all buds are chocolate chunk,really nice fox tailing.not massive buds but really solid. 
      
i have uk cheese but not as nice looking so no pics of her. just a hairy run of mill bud.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Nov 26, 2017)

Hey all- just figured I'd say hi here- running blue dream and Chocolate Mint under a single ss 315 lec... Day 2 flower:


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## clouds (Nov 27, 2017)

im kinda confused on what way i should go, just looking at having one light for right now. and dont know if i should get 1 315 or the 630 with 2 315s. they are about the same price . so im just wondering is it better to just go with the 630 as its the same price as most the 315s i see. i dont grow inside much so this whole setup thing is new to me

basically this but from the manufacturer and comes with hangers a remote and extra bulbs and is only 400 with free shipping and 4 year warrenty https://www.growlights.ca/growlights/fusion-bright-630w-cmh-complete-kit-2x-315w.html


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## Javadog (Nov 27, 2017)

Colorado....those are going to blow up! Nice.

If that lamp can be run with one bulb, and the prices are about the same, then why not? :0)


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Nov 27, 2017)

Some preemptive LST'ing...


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Nov 27, 2017)

Their structure is a little funky because i got them as "teen clones," and they had quite a bit of transplant stress going from aero to soil, so i really took it easy on these mothers till just recently... ​


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## Yodaweed (Nov 27, 2017)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Their structure is a little funky because i got them as "teen clones," and they had quite a bit of transplant stress going from aero to soil, so i really took it easy on these mothers till just recently... ​


Still lookin good man, front range grower here, good luck.


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## Bad Karma (Nov 27, 2017)

clouds said:


> im kinda confused on what way i should go, just looking at having one light for right now. and dont know if i should get 1 315 or the 630 with 2 315s. they are about the same price . so im just wondering is it better to just go with the 630 as its the same price as most the 315s i see. i dont grow inside much so this whole setup thing is new to me
> 
> basically this but from the manufacturer and comes with hangers a remote and extra bulbs and is only 400 with free shipping and 4 year warrenty https://www.growlights.ca/growlights/fusion-bright-630w-cmh-complete-kit-2x-315w.html


That 630 CMH is crap, DON'T BUY IT! There a two major things wrong with it.

1. Its literally the lowest quality CMH ballast/light you can buy. Every cheap CMH knockoff company uses this ballast/lamp (look around).

2. HEAT! This light is going to have overheating issues in a major way. Do you see how the two CMH bulbs are vertical and almost touching? By having both bulbs in the same reflector, so closely aligned, it gives the heat that they radiate no where to go. This is a major design flaw that all of the major CMH companies have moved away from.


----------



## clouds (Nov 27, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> That 630 CMH is crap, DON'T BUY IT! There a two major things wrong with it.
> 
> 1. Its literally the lowest quality CMH ballast/light you can buy. Every cheap CMH knockoff company uses this ballast/lamp (look around).
> 
> 2. HEAT! This light is going to have overheating issues in a major way. Do you see how the two CMH bulbs are vertical and almost touching? By having both bulbs in the same reflector, so closely aligned, it gives the heat that they radiate no where to go. This is a major design flaw that all of the major CMH companies have moved away from.


question whats a good one to go with from all the ones i have seen from most places they all look the same i was going to go with the Nanolux or the Grower’s Choice then i seen the one i was looking at getting was the same as the GC one just does not have their logos on it 
the one i posted the link for is one of the few that ship to canada. and thats my major problem is finding a CMH that will ship to canada. most the ones that are 300-400 US go up to about 700-800 bucks for the same one in canada and they all look the same


----------



## Bad Karma (Nov 27, 2017)

clouds said:


> question whats a good one to go with from all the ones i have seen from most places they all look the same i was going to go with the Nanolux or the Grower’s Choice then i seen the one i was looking at getting was the same as the GC one just does not have their logos on it
> the one i posted the link for is one of the few that ship to canada. and thats my major problem is finding a CMH that will ship to canada. most the ones that are 300-400 US go up to about 700-800 bucks for the same one in canada and they all look the same


Growershouse.com ships internationally from the US. You'd have to pay some duties (haha) on arrival, but otherwise, the store is yours.
If you're looking for inexpensive, but efficient, check out the remote ballast units featuring the Prism ballast. They have a combo with the SunSystem reflector, Prism ballast, and Phillips bulbs for $286 at the moment. So I'm thinking that with shipping, tax, and duties (haha) you'd probably end up paying around $400 total.


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## clouds (Nov 28, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> Growershouse.com ships internationally from the US. You'd have to pay some duties (haha) on arrival, but otherwise, the store is yours.
> If you're looking for inexpensive, but efficient, check out the remote ballast units featuring the Prism ballast. They have a combo with the SunSystem reflector, Prism ballast, and Phillips bulbs for $286 at the moment. So I'm thinking that with shipping, tax, and duties (haha) you'd probably end up paying around $400 total.


see now im more confused
lol dude thats the one i was getting was originally looking at so i asked the that site about it they are the ones who sent me to their supplier telling me i would be better off buying this one as with shipping and exchange rate it would be around the same and i would get more light for the price
i was going to get this https://growershouse.com/ceramic-mh-315w-lec-low-profile-stealth-package 353.40
but they sent me to the maker for somthing like this https://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-630-air-cooled-8-in-fixture-277-volt-w-3100k-lamps-cmh but mine comes with a ballest remote cord, hangers, remote and its dimmable with shipping its 358.1 USD with the one time use discount code they gave me as well from sunlight supply inc
i deleted the email with the pictures or i would post them over saying it looks like this or that i compared it to the Grower’s Choice one as i could not see the ballast on the picture on the growers house site but ya thats the same one im getting but this one in the pic is white and the one im getting is white and black as well as open not sealed like this one is from the sounds of it its the right one to pic or am i wrong again
only reason im looking at 630 over 315 is because of this deal thats a lil over 650 US off


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## NugHeuser (Nov 28, 2017)

clouds said:


> see now im more confused
> lol dude thats the one i was getting was originally looking at so i asked the that site about it they are the ones who sent me to their supplier telling me i would be better off buying this one as with shipping and exchange rate it would be around the same and i would get more light for the price
> i was going to get this https://growershouse.com/ceramic-mh-315w-lec-low-profile-stealth-package 353.40
> but they sent me to the maker for somthing like this https://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-630-air-cooled-8-in-fixture-277-volt-w-3100k-lamps-cmh but mine comes with a ballest remote cord, hangers, remote and its dimmable with shipping its 358.1 USD with the one time use discount code they gave me as well from sunlight supply inc
> ...


What size grow area are you working with? Don't buy that cheap dual 315w(630) fixture. You wouldn't be happy with it.


----------



## NugHeuser (Nov 28, 2017)

clouds said:


> see now im more confused
> lol dude thats the one i was getting was originally looking at so i asked the that site about it they are the ones who sent me to their supplier telling me i would be better off buying this one as with shipping and exchange rate it would be around the same and i would get more light for the price
> i was going to get this https://growershouse.com/ceramic-mh-315w-lec-low-profile-stealth-package 353.40
> but they sent me to the maker for somthing like this https://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-630-air-cooled-8-in-fixture-277-volt-w-3100k-lamps-cmh but mine comes with a ballest remote cord, hangers, remote and its dimmable with shipping its 358.1 USD with the one time use discount code they gave me as well from sunlight supply inc
> ...


The 315s with the remote reflectors and prism ballasts are the way to go. The cmh bulb fixed in a vertical position puts out much more intensity than the same bulb in the horizontal position, so that's the first thing you should watch for. ALSO- LOW FREQUENCY SQUARE WAVE BALLASTS- You want the ballasts that advertise this, they run much more efficiently. With the sunsystem reflctors the 315s are effective for a 3x3. Im running 2 of those on each side of a true double ended 630, the one from growers choice. I do not like the hood for the 630, it's to small. 
My 630 effectively covers about a 4x4 but as far as intensity goes on my par meter, 18" directly under the fixtures, the 315s measure just as high as my 630, if not higher. And with less heat. 

Hope this helps.


----------



## TedeBoy (Nov 28, 2017)

50 day old Mephisto Genetics Autoflowers under one 315W in my 3'x3'x7' tent.


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## gr865 (Nov 28, 2017)

I run the Nanolux CMH 315 NC,

I can remove both ballast and make them remote, outside of my grow area. Cuts back big on any heat issue.
 

I run vertical so not only do I run the ballast outside the tent, but also remove the mogul housing. Here is a pic of the ballast and the mogul housing, both are removed to run vertical.


Here is the configuration with the ballast removed and just the mogul housing and reflector are used for horizontal grow.

And here is the final configuration for hanging the lamp vertical with the mogul housing and reflector removed.


I did have to buy the extension cords to run from the ballast to the lamps. Was not that much.
Here they are in the vertical mode with both lamps.


GR


----------



## clouds (Nov 28, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> What size grow area are you working with? Don't buy that cheap dual 315w(630) fixture. You wouldn't be happy with it.


going with a 4x4 space. thats why i was looking at this deal but they said nothing about the vertical ones being better all i keep being told is that the 315s are better than the 630w singles so that was what i was looking for. then i was offered this one and was thinking well if i get this at least i got the ballast and cables so if i wanted to change hoods i can run two 315s with two hoods as this ballast has both connectors for two bulbs and its square wave 



gr865 said:


> I run the Nanolux CMH 315 NC,
> View attachment 4049792
> I can remove both ballast and make them remote, outside of my grow area. Cuts back big on any heat issue.
> View attachment 4049797 View attachment 4049798
> ...


from what i see from your setup would just buying 2 of the 315w conversion kits work ballast, connectors bulbs . from what i see the ballasts are the same only the Nanolux settings cant be changed. i like the idea of removing the hood and running the ballast outside the tent so is there any point in getting a hood vs just buying the ballast cables and bulbs with some hangers. just trying to get the best setup for spending the least amount on lighting as i still got to get other things and can upgrade as time goes but lighting is kinda important


----------



## clouds (Nov 28, 2017)

biggest question because it sounds mostly the problem with the one im planning on getting is the hood cant i just take that off and hang the bulbs?
as this is the ballast it comes with i like the fact that if i take the hood away from the ballast i can still run two bulbs with the cables off the ballast 
◆ 630W(2x315W) Low Frequency,Square wave,Soft start,CMH Ballast. ◆ Operating Frequency: 140-160Hz (Low Frequency) ◆ With short-circuit/circuit overheat/ lamp-failure protection,etc, Multi-aspect protection circuitry. Internal RF shielding. ◆ Matchs well with 2 pcs Philips GreenPower Elite Agro 315W lamp. ◆ Support Lamp Type: Ceramic metal halide(CMH),MH/QMH,HPS. Lamp Type Bulb (recommend) CMH 315W, 210W MH/QMH 350W,315W HPS 250W ◆ Patented output control maintains maximum PAR value over lamp life. ◆ It can ignite CMH lamp up to 66 feet/20 meters away. ◆ Power Factor(PF):>0.99, Efficiency:>91% , Crest Factor(CF):<1.5 ◆ Total Harmonic Distortion(THD):<6% ◆ Multi-voltage Input: AC 120V / 208V / 240V, 50/60HZ ◆ Output voltage: 2 x AC 100V (power supply to two 315W bulbs) ◆ Temperature: Ta=40℃ , Tc=70℃ . Packaging Weight: 6.2 Kg ◆ Power Outputs: Dimmable ( with LED display ) 0W(OFF),280W,420W,630W,700W ( Support IR remote control ); or 280-700W ( with 0-10V dimmer ) . Warranty Period: 3 years


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## clouds (Nov 28, 2017)

this is the ballast, if not i will go with recommended set up


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## full of purple (Nov 28, 2017)

clouds said:


> this is the ballast, if not i will go with recommended set up


Interested in this ballast also
Waiting for more info and opinions


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## full of purple (Nov 28, 2017)

clouds said:


> this is the ballast, if not i will go with recommended set up


Who sells this ballast?


----------



## clouds (Nov 28, 2017)

full of purple said:


> Who sells this ballast?


thats the thing its not for sale yet thats why i was wondering if its worth spending on. i was talking to one shop owner and then he sent me to sunlight supply and i explained how i was looking at CMH and was looking for a system to try out and see how it works, then he put me in contact with the another branch of the company and gave me a huge discount, im basically just paying for the ballast and 3 day shipping. the hood remote hangers and extra bulbs are all free i was going to order this from but then now i dont know. i know its going to be for sunlight supply when released but thats about all the info i have on it other than the some specs


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Nov 28, 2017)

gr865 said:


> I run the Nanolux CMH 315 NC,
> View attachment 4049792
> I can remove both ballast and make them remote, outside of my grow area. Cuts back big on any heat issue.
> View attachment 4049797 View attachment 4049798
> ...



Sun system has a bare bulb vert cord and socket for bi pin 315's like they do for hps/mh now 

It comes with a hanger and stress relieved cord. 

Thought I should mention as I saw it in the hydro store recently in case anyone was still diy'ing.


----------



## gr865 (Nov 28, 2017)

clouds said:


> from what i see from your setup would just buying 2 of the 315w conversion kits work ballast, connectors bulbs . from what i see the ballasts are the same only the Nanolux settings cant be changed. i like the idea of removing the hood and running the ballast outside the tent so is there any point in getting a hood vs just buying the ballast cables and bulbs with some hangers. just trying to get the best setup for spending the least amount on lighting as i still got to get other things and can upgrade as time goes but lighting is kinda important


I got a good deal on my setup, 1st 315 was $200 including a Phillips 3100 bulb. The second I got for $248 plus the cost of the bulb, think it was 80+.
So under $600 for both lights and bulbs.
I would get a hood to run if you want to run a horizontal grow. Don't think you can buy it without the hood. I understand you want to spend the least to get the most, but don't fuck around, get good equipment man, or you will pay for it in the end. Hell I started with a 10 bulb homemade CFL fixture to a LED to a 400 W MH/ HPS setup, to the 315's now I am happy, just wish I had started with this, would have saved a lot of stress and monies.

GR


----------



## gr865 (Nov 28, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Sun system has a bare bulb vert cord and socket for bi pin 315's like they do for hps/mh now
> 
> It comes with a hanger and stress relieved cord.
> 
> Thought I should mention as I saw it in the hydro store recently in case anyone was still diy'ing.


I am thinking I got the cords from Growers House, not sure though. Did not get hangers and the such, I use chains to hang my lamps.
If you have extensions for HPS/MH, they make a part you can screw into the HPS/MH socket to make it a Bi Pin for the 315, found it out after I bought the two of them, I have 2 extensions for HPS lamps could have bought the BiPin part.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Nov 28, 2017)

gr865 said:


> I am thinking I got the cords from Growers House, not sure though. Did not get hangers and the such, I use chains to hang my lamps.
> If you have extensions for HPS/MH, they make a part you can screw into the HPS/MH socket to make it a Bi Pin for the 315, found it out after I bought the two of them, I have 2 extensions for HPS lamps could have bought the BiPin part.



I am saying you can now buy a remote ballast and a vert bare bulb mount dedicated cord. I haven't looked for it online. It's $25 just like the dedicated hps vert cords. The socket is built in already with 1 metal v hanger attached. 

Growers house would likely carry it.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Nov 28, 2017)

Quick search I found this. 

Way too high price but shows what I am talking about. 



https://hydrobuilder.com/sun-system-315-watt-lec-vertical-hanging-grow-light-kit-3-100k.html


----------



## clouds (Nov 28, 2017)

gr865 said:


> I got a good deal on my setup, 1st 315 was $200 including a Phillips 3100 bulb. The second I got for $248 plus the cost of the bulb, think it was 80+.
> So under $600 for both lights and bulbs.
> I would get a hood to run if you want to run a horizontal grow. Don't think you can buy it without the hood. I understand you want to spend the least to get the most, but don't fuck around, get good equipment man, or you will pay for it in the end. Hell I started with a 10 bulb homemade CFL fixture to a LED to a 400 W MH/ HPS setup, to the 315's now I am happy, just wish I had started with this, would have saved a lot of stress and monies.
> 
> GR


ya i got 200w of clfs going right now main reason im looking at getting in to cmh now lol plants getting to big for lighting so i dont want to buy a system that will burn out or not last. my buddy got a cheap one and it blow after a day. thats why i was looking warrenty and a good model from what they told me if it fails in 3 years they will next day ship me a new one as soon as they get shipping info for the old one and from what i hear sun systems are good and this is made by sunlight supply the same people who make sun systems and this is coming from the company’s Northwest Distribution Center
the hood i can switch out at any time if i dont like it as i get extra cables for the ballast with this offer im looking mostly at the ballast as it has connections for two lights even after i disconnect the hood over all the ones i have seen that only run one light


----------



## clouds (Nov 28, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Quick search I found this.
> 
> Way too high price but shows what I am talking about.
> 
> ...


other then a different ballast the one that comes with the one im looking at has a 2x315W dual output and this one has no hood/reflector that mine comes with this is basicly what im getting but with two Sun System LEC Inner Sun PGZX Socket Assembly cords and 2 315 philips Elite Agro bulbs 2 Ushio back ups added for free for 358.1 us and thats with 3-5 day shipping 
thank you i did not know what the cords are called in infor for mine they are just called ballast cables and then has the pic. i have pics of the whole thing just no cam or scanner right now


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## MichiganMedGrower (Nov 28, 2017)

clouds said:


> other then a different ballast the one that comes with the one im looking at has a 2x315W dual output and this one has no hood/reflector that mine comes with this is basicly what im getting but with two Sun System LEC Inner Sun PGZX Socket Assembly cords and 2 315 philips Elite Agro bulbs 2 Ushio back ups added for free for 358.1 us and thats with 3-5 day shipping
> thank you i did not know what the cords are called in infor for mine they are just called ballast cables and then has the pic. i have pics of the whole thing just no cam or scanner right now



All of the sun system 630 models take 2 315 watt cmh bulbs. 

I have the sun system vertical open remote reflector and a galaxy ballast I got from growers house last Black Friday for about $350 delivered. 

And growers house has a cmh comparison blog that shows the Phillips 3100 has the highest par of all of them. 

And the ushio 4K has the most uv. 

Honestly I am a bit confused what you are looking at from them from your posts. But sun system lamps and ballasts are made to run Phillips lamps to spec. 

I would not buy an off brand eBay set up. But the prism ballasts seem to be still working for everyone since last year when I ran my tests in club 315.


----------



## full of purple (Nov 28, 2017)

Where can I get this deal?


clouds said:


> other then a different ballast the one that comes with the one im looking at has a 2x315W dual output and this one has no hood/reflector that mine comes with this is basicly what im getting but with two Sun System LEC Inner Sun PGZX Socket Assembly cords and 2 315 philips Elite Agro bulbs 2 Ushio back ups added for free for 358.1 us and thats with 3-5 day shipping
> thank you i did not know what the cords are called in infor for mine they are just called ballast cables and then has the pic. i have pics of the whole thing just no cam or scanner right now


----------



## gr865 (Nov 28, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Quick search I found this.
> 
> Way too high price but shows what I am talking about.
> 
> ...


Know nothing of that ballast, but he can get a Nanolux w/lamp for around 300 to 350.

Just did a quick search and he could get a Prism Ceramic Science 315W CMH Light Conversion Kit from Growers House for $158 plus the cost of the bulb. My last 3100 Phillips cost $80 +. I don't think he can get in any cheaper, unless he buy's shit products to save a buck.
https://growershouse.com/ceramic-science-315w-cmh-light-conversion-kit


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Nov 28, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Know nothing of that ballast, but he can get a Nanolux w/lamp for around 300 to 350.
> 
> Just did a quick search and he could get a Prism Ceramic Science 315W CMH Light Conversion Kit from Growers House for $158 plus the cost of the bulb. My last 3100 Phillips cost $80 +. I don't think he can get in any cheaper, unless he buy's shit products to save a buck.
> https://growershouse.com/ceramic-science-315w-cmh-light-conversion-kit



I only posted to show the very hanging cord. 

I only recommend Phillips or galaxy. And have seen prism still going good for a lot of growers. 

The deal he is saying he getting is not available anywhere I can find. 

Of course I wouldn't put this much energy into such an overhyped bulb.


----------



## clouds (Nov 28, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> All of the sun system 630 models take 2 315 watt cmh bulbs.
> 
> I have the sun system vertical open remote reflector and a galaxy ballast I got from growers house last Black Friday for about $350 delivered.
> 
> ...


i dont have much info as this has all been over fax and phone calls and a few emails. i know its sunlight supply inc in Vancouver, Washington
i was just wondering if the ballast and set up was worth buying as i dont not know much about them other then they cost a lot in my location, the only reason its cheap is because its for promotion i was asking and talking to a few distributors and then growers house got me in contact with sunlight supply. and i explained i have my medical to grow licence and was looking for a system that ran CMH they gave me a offer on a prototype system for 358.1 or there Sun System LEC 630 120 Volt for the same price, and then i told him i dont know if i wanted to run one with a hood so he said he would add ballast connectors if i want to remove it. so i went with the prototype as i liked the idea for the ballast with the 2x315W dual output. i have a picture of the ballast as posted but the only pic i have of the hood is on the fax. and there is nothing even close to it online other than the Sun System LEC 630 but thats a different color and shape but about the same size if not a lil smaller
i was just trying to get info on is it worth getting. from what i have been looking at the bulbs alone are worth more than im paying for the whole thing. its not a cheap ballast its going to be one of the new sun system ones. before the offer i was not even going to go 630 but now im thinking of switching my grow room setup for this light


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Nov 28, 2017)

clouds said:


> i dont have much info as this has all been over fax and phone calls and a few emails. i know its sunlight supply inc in Vancouver, Washington
> i was just wondering if the ballast and set up was worth buying as i dont not know much about them other then they cost a lot in my location, the only reason its cheap is because its for promotion i was asking and talking to a few distributors and then growers house got me in contact with sunlight supply. and i explained i have my medical to grow licence and was looking for a system that ran CMH they gave me a offer on a prototype system for 358.1 or there Sun System LEC 630 120 Volt for the same price, and then i told him i dont know if i wanted to run one with a hood so he said he would add ballast connectors if i want to remove it. so i went with the prototype as i liked the idea for the ballast with the 2x315W dual output. i have a picture of the ballast as posted but the only pic i have of the hood is on the fax. and there is nothing even close to it online other than the Sun System LEC 630 but thats a different color and shape but about the same size if not a lil smaller
> i was just trying to get info on is it worth getting. from what i have been looking at the bulbs alone are worth more than im paying for the whole thing. its not a cheap ballast its going to be one of the new sun system ones. before the offer i was not even going to go 630 but now im thinking of switching my grow room setup for this light



If it's sun system for those prices I wouldn't argue. Just buy the one you want. I know they came out with a sun system branded ballast but I have only seen ads. 

And their reflectors were designed with the bulb for highest par they can get. 

The 630 is like $700 normally.


----------



## clouds (Nov 28, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> If it's sun system for those prices I wouldn't argue. Just buy the one you want. I know they came out with a sun system branded ballast but I have only seen ads.
> 
> And their reflectors were designed with the bulb for highest par they can get.
> 
> The 630 is like $700 normally.


i have the info and link on the released 630 they offered me its this other one i want to know more about but i just got a few pics and the spec sheet in the fax. and from what they say its a big improvement over the other hood and ballast
https://www.sunlightsupply.com/shop/product/sun-system-lec-brand-630-watt-fixture_52_000003?categoryId=lec-lighting

i did not think of that for what its worth if i dont like it i can just sell it for more than i paid any way. i was just hearing so much on the 315s being better so i was wondering if this would be a good buy for the garden to grow myself something nice

think im going to go for it


----------



## gr865 (Nov 28, 2017)

clouds said:


> i have the info and link on the released 630 they offered me its this other one i want to know more about but i just got a few pics and the spec sheet in the fax. and from what they say its a big improvement over the other hood and ballast
> https://www.sunlightsupply.com/shop/product/sun-system-lec-brand-630-watt-fixture_52_000003?categoryId=lec-lighting
> 
> i did not think of that for what its worth if i dont like it i can just sell it for more than i paid any way. i was just hearing so much on the 315s being better so i was wondering if this would be a good buy for the garden to grow myself something nice
> ...


Man for the cost of that thing you can get 4 or 5 of the Prism 315 kits with bulbs. Why are you sold on that light? It's your money, but I thought you said you wanted to get into it cheap. .


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## NugHeuser (Nov 28, 2017)

Day 3 of flower with the two 315s and double ended 630.
- Malibu Pie
- Alien Rift
- and 3 random crosses with a bubblisious male

Made my first organic "tea" and gave it to them 4 days ago. They seem to be loving it. 

18 plants in 3 gallon pots and one older one in a 7 gallon pot.


----------



## clouds (Nov 28, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Man for the cost of that thing you can get 4 or 5 of the Prism 315 kits with bulbs. Why are you sold on that light? It's your money, but I thought you said you wanted to get into it cheap. .


because i can get it for $358.1 US and the Prism 315 kits with bulbs $317.87 US with shipping so its $458.85 CAD vs $407.27 CAD
the $458.85 CAD $1404.41 CAD is the price of the one this one is above in class without the discount im being given 
as i said before when i started asking i did not know much about this system but now that i have more info and know the other models in its class i see its a awesome deal


----------



## clouds (Nov 28, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Day 3 of flower with the two 315s and double ended 630.
> - Malibu Pie
> - Alien Rift
> - and 3 random crosses with a bubblisious male
> ...


wow thats awesome see thats what im looking for. love the canopy


----------



## NugHeuser (Nov 28, 2017)

clouds said:


> wow thats awesome see thats what im looking for. love the canopy


Thanks man. 
Yeah I'm still learning, it's only my second grow. I won't lie though, I am pretty proud of it thus far.


----------



## clouds (Nov 28, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Thanks man.
> Yeah I'm still learning, it's only my second grow. I won't lie though, I am pretty proud of it thus far.


well i will be keeping an eye out i can wait to see how they do. you should be proud they are doing vary well and look nice


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## genuity (Nov 28, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Day 3 of flower with the two 315s and double ended 630.
> - Malibu Pie
> - Alien Rift
> - and 3 random crosses with a bubblisious male
> ...


Looking damn good...


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Nov 28, 2017)

clouds said:


> i have the info and link on the released 630 they offered me its this other one i want to know more about but i just got a few pics and the spec sheet in the fax. and from what they say its a big improvement over the other hood and ballast
> https://www.sunlightsupply.com/shop/product/sun-system-lec-brand-630-watt-fixture_52_000003?categoryId=lec-lighting
> 
> i did not think of that for what its worth if i dont like it i can just sell it for more than i paid any way. i was just hearing so much on the 315s being better so i was wondering if this would be a good buy for the garden to grow myself something nice
> ...



That hood looks really nice. I haven't used a double only the remote 315. But I did have to add fans blowing in between the hood and plants and a second 6" exhaust to control heat. So be aware of that is all. It's twice as hot in 1 fixture. I would opt for 2 315's spread out a little more but for the prices you are quoted.......


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## gr865 (Nov 28, 2017)

clouds said:


> because i can get it for $358.1 US and the Prism 315 kits with bulbs $317.87 US with shipping so its $458.85 CAD vs $407.27 CAD
> the $458.85 CAD $1404.41 CAD is the price of the one this one is above in class without the discount im being given
> as i said before when i started asking i did not know much about this system but now that i have more info and know the other models in its class i see its a awesome deal


Dude if you can get a $1,095.95 MSRP light for 317.87 then you had better buy a dozen of them,  Just kidding, like I said I know nothing about them was just being a good citizen and tried to help. That does sound like a great deal, just not sold on the 630's, looks like a heat issue to me.
But you know what, it's your dollar. Hope you make the right choice!
GR


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Nov 28, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Day 3 of flower with the two 315s and double ended 630.
> - Malibu Pie
> - Alien Rift
> - and 3 random crosses with a bubblisious male
> ...



Great work!


----------



## Javadog (Nov 28, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> That 630 CMH is crap, DON'T BUY IT! There a two major things wrong with it.
> 
> 1. Its literally the lowest quality CMH ballast/light you can buy. Every cheap CMH knockoff company uses this ballast/lamp (look around).
> 
> 2. HEAT! This light is going to have overheating issues in a major way. Do you see how the two CMH bulbs are vertical and almost touching? By having both bulbs in the same reflector, so closely aligned, it gives the heat that they radiate no where to go. This is a major design flaw that all of the major CMH companies have moved away from.


Glad you were here. :0)


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Nov 28, 2017)

That's lookin better now:


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Nov 28, 2017)

Triple purple rhino week 2


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Nov 28, 2017)

ThaMagnificent said:


> Triple purple rhino week 2


Nice purps!


----------



## DOOZY (Nov 29, 2017)

Got me 3 ballasts for $ 321 delivered.


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 1, 2017)

Trying out Philips 942 t9 veg bulbs thru flower. 

Pic is 20 days from flip


----------



## clouds (Dec 1, 2017)

DOOZY said:


> Got me 3 ballasts for $ 321 delivered.


let me know how it works for you was looking at getting one that was cheap and building a mother/veg tent with one.


----------



## gr865 (Dec 5, 2017)

Day 12 of 12/12

Doing a little defo every few days until a good strip at day 21 and just want to show pheno #1. She is my most consistent plant, best growth pattern and looks like she will have a good number of bud sites.
I also looked at the difference of tied vs untied and how that effects growth patterns. I will discuss this more a little later.

As I said lite defo at the present, Untied






I think this is a cool pic, I can see candles attached to it, 






Arial shot from the blimp!






Something noticed is the plants gravitation to the lamp, since I untied them last week. I wanted to let the stems off the main branches themselves to stretch some toward the lamps before I tied them back to do a good defo. They have all steadily grown toward the lamps and just becoming a mass of plant material. 

11/28 #4 tied before being untied from the screen with defo





12/4 #4 untied and prior to defo






#4 Untied and after lite defo.






So we will be tying the ladies back to the screen this week, give them a good spread.
I went back and looked at my notes and some pics from the G13 grow and I had done the same thing on about the same schedule as now. The only difference is the Indica/Sativa difference, which is very noticeable.
GR


----------



## gr865 (Dec 5, 2017)

Day 13 of 12/12

As I stated last post, this AM we pulled the plants from the tent and tied the rest of the plants back to the screen, gave them a good spread, getting them in the flower mode. Only showing one plant but did the same to each of the 5 plants.

#5 prior to minor defo and tie back

#5 same view following tie back





Left side view





Back view





Right side view






After the tie back from the blimp, was able to move the plants closer to the lamps by moving the pot's 2 inches closer to the lamp. The big difference was being able to tilt the screens in again a few inches more towards the lamp after tie back. I had them tilted way back to keep the buds away from the lamps.






Back in the ol' 4x4






I am liking what I am seeing, not yet the second week of 12/12 getting decent stretch, and good fill in.

GR


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 5, 2017)

1 week in flower, 18/6>12/12, choc mint/blue dream


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 5, 2017)

I have posted flowers grown under the Phillips 315 LEC 3100k and said they were frostier than with the Hortilux 600Super Hps alone. 

And showed that it works as a finishing bulb for the last two weeks and that it is a great supplemental lamp to the hps. 

The colors and smells and flavors were very pronounced and the plants stayed greener through finish. 

Well the difference may be more negligible than I thought. I have been growing with only the 600 super hps and the plants have been equally frosty and even more potent on average for months of weekly and bi weekly harvests. 

Here is a Black Widow x Blue Lemon Thai flowered under only the Hortilux 600 Super Hps.

She smells pungent and fruity. And she is very sticky.


----------



## genuity (Dec 6, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Day 13 of 12/12
> 
> As I stated last post, this AM we pulled the plants from the tent and tied the rest of the plants back to the screen, gave them a good spread, getting them in the flower mode. Only showing one plant but did the same to each of the 5 plants.
> 
> ...


Now this is nice..


----------



## DOOZY (Dec 7, 2017)

clouds said:


> let me know how it works for you was looking at getting one that was cheap and building a mother/veg tent with one.


So far they work great . I can pass my vendors info if you are on alibaba they axcept paypal.


----------



## clouds (Dec 7, 2017)

DOOZY said:


> So far they work great . I can pass my vendors info if you are on alibaba they axcept paypal.


i was looking at that site but did not know if they were any good


----------



## gr865 (Dec 7, 2017)

DOOZY said:


> Got me 3 ballasts for $ 321 delivered.


Each? Great deal if that is the case!

May have missed where you got them but would like to see what all they have.

Thanks


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 8, 2017)

I just started 4x white fire og clones under my 315 cmh in a sun system remote reflector with prism lighting science ballast.

This is a test run, two of the wifi og's are in RDWC , two of them are in organic recycled soil, doing a side by side taste comparison.


----------



## pinner420 (Dec 8, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> I just started 4x white fire og clones under my 315 cmh in a sun system remote reflector with prism lighting science ballast.
> 
> This is a test run, two of the wifi og's are in RDWC , two of them are in organic recycled soil, doing a side by side taste comparison.


Rad...


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 8, 2017)

pinner420 said:


> Rad...


Plan to get results tested with a friends mydx tester, most likely will publish results.

Using a phillips CDM 4k bulb.


----------



## GroErr (Dec 8, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> Plan to get results tested with a friends mydx tester, most likely will publish results.
> 
> Using a phillips CDM 4k bulb.


Hey Yoda, anything I've seen/read on that mydx unit claims it's bogus. Basically uses a database of known strains and applies it to the sample.

Has your friend verified the results of the mydx unit against proper lab tests to see how accurate the results are?

I'd buy a unit in a second if it were legit and scientifically sound but those units raise my BS detector flags...


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 8, 2017)

GroErr said:


> Hey Yoda, anything I've seen/read on that mydx unit claims it's bogus. Basically uses a database of known strains and applies it to the sample.
> 
> Has your friend verified the results of the mydx unit against proper lab tests to see how accurate the results are?
> 
> I'd buy a unit in a second if it were legit and scientifically sound but those units raise my BS detector flags...



They say themselves that thc is detected. But with a 20% margin of error on how much. Lol. 

Reasonable testing of this sort of thing is within 2-3% accurate. And results are repeatable. 

Be funny to see how many different results the same bud can give.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 8, 2017)

I forgot the link

https://www.mydxlife.com/cannadx/


----------



## GroErr (Dec 8, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I forgot the link
> 
> https://www.mydxlife.com/cannadx/


Looks like they've made some progress in the last couple of years since they introduced it, but not quite there yet. Some interesting work they're doing but 20% variance is a little much for the price they're charging. Power to them, they seem to have been able to get customers to pay for their product while it's being developed, brilliant, if you're not a customer - lol


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 8, 2017)

Day 14 flower:


----------



## gr865 (Dec 8, 2017)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Day 14 flower:View attachment 4055128 View attachment 4055130


Good job, tough to keep an even canopy growing an indica and sativa together.


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 8, 2017)

GroErr said:


> Hey Yoda, anything I've seen/read on that mydx unit claims it's bogus. Basically uses a database of known strains and applies it to the sample.
> 
> Has your friend verified the results of the mydx unit against proper lab tests to see how accurate the results are?
> 
> I'd buy a unit in a second if it were legit and scientifically sound but those units raise my BS detector flags...


Yeah i hear that, the last results i got from him were pretty accurate from what i expected but due to stupid colorado laws i legally cannot get my buds tested unless i own a dispensary so honestly i do not know, it's the only resource i can get in this state to get my buds tested unfortunately.


----------



## pinner420 (Dec 8, 2017)

gotta get more than a velcro strip to a boat cleat and open her up.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 8, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Good job, tough to keep an even canopy growing an indica and sativa together.


Hey gr865- Definitely! And these were pretty mature "teen clones" with mediocre strucure that i picked up, so I've been lst'ing to try to make up for the differences... Been super busy lately, so they do need some scrog work though! Blue dream is pretty strechty, and this choc mint is super stout, so yeah, challenging but fun!!


----------



## gr865 (Dec 9, 2017)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Hey gr865- Definitely! And these were pretty mature "teen clones" with mediocre strucure that i picked up, so I've been lst'ing to try to make up for the differences... Been super busy lately, so they do need some scrog work though! Blue dream is pretty strechty, and this choc mint is super stout, so yeah, challenging but fun!!


I am babysitting two plants for a buddy who is having surgery and can't lift for a while. His first grow so his training methods are not there yet. 
So I have been topping, defo, bending, stretching and everything I can do to get some manipulation. Grown in soil mix so I am not use to that either.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 9, 2017)

Those look like they revegged GR.


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## gr865 (Dec 9, 2017)

Javadog said:


> Those look like they revegged GR.


J,
I gave him these clones off my current grow. When I got them they were shriveled dry, no fert at all, at 7 weeks into veg and about half the size they are in this pic. I am forcing them to grow, the soil mix is very light the plant is taking in lots of solution now so they get watered at least every 1 to 1.5 days. Take some pics later.

It's fun being in rescue mode. He is in the learning mode and is very attentive but overly worried he is going to fuck them up. I said "Dude! you fall off that pony, get your ass back up and ride him again." I will always have seed or clones for him.

Took a couple a pics


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 10, 2017)

A little better canopy elevation control now. Also, just transplanted 10 bluedream an 7 choc mint clones today. Will see which 3 of each win the prize for the next round


----------



## gr865 (Dec 11, 2017)

Day 19 12/12

Today did a fairly heavy defo, and will complete it on Wed.
Everything is tied in place, and should fill in nicely.
# 5 before defo and tie.





#5 after





#3 did not get a prior shot.





#1 prior





#1 after






#4 prior





#4 after






Continued next post.


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## gr865 (Dec 11, 2017)

Day 19 con't
#2





#2 after





The lineup #'s 5, 3, 1, 4, & 2 pics aren't very good.






















Wed or Thur I will do a full blown defo, did a good job today but will take a bit more. I expect with the growth they have shown they will be filled in quite soon.

GR


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 11, 2017)

gr865 said:


> Day 19 con't
> #2
> 
> 
> ...


Can't see your photos gr


----------



## gr865 (Dec 12, 2017)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Can't see your photos gr


I have gotten a few likes so the pics are there. Not sure what is up. Sorry!


----------



## NugHeuser (Dec 12, 2017)

Sitting at day 17 of flower for the canopy. All plants have begun packing on frost already, noticed first signs on an alien rift at day 13. So apparently the extra uv is doing it's thing, I'll post pics this evening when I get off work.


----------



## NugHeuser (Dec 12, 2017)

Day 17 of flower. Alien Rift, Malibu Pie, and 3 f2 bubbilicious crosses. 

Below is Alien Rift #10. This plant was first to start showing tricome production, starting in around day 12 to 13.
  

Malibu Pie # 5. This is suppose to be a 56 day finisher. We'll see, bud size is packing on quick. This plant has some of the bigger/biggest bud size so far. Right around the diameter of a quarter (US currency). 
Bubbilicious cross #4

All around pretty plant. Possibly my favorite of the bunch. Always praying, toward the top for bud size and tricome production in comparison to the rest, so far, and has a nice structure.


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## gr865 (Dec 12, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Day 17 of flower. Alien Rift, Malibu Pie, and 3 f2 bubbilicious crosses.View attachment 4057185 View attachment 4057199
> 
> Below is Alien Rift #10. This plant was first to start showing tricome production, starting in around day 12 to 13.
> View attachment 4057168 View attachment 4057202
> ...


Great looking canopy, good job bud!


----------



## NugHeuser (Dec 13, 2017)

@gr865 Thank you! I've got one problematic plant with n tox that im trying to work back to health. Other than that everythings going great!

I probably should've specified my lighting, 2 315w sun system with Philips 3100k, one on each end of the canopy, a 600w hps in the middle left half of the canopy and a 630w de cmh from growers choice with the 3k 'red enhanced' bulb in the middle right half of the canopy. Canopy is roughly 3.5'x9.5'.


----------



## LamontCranston (Dec 14, 2017)

Anyone ever experience something like this?

I just changed the bulbs out in my 315watt fixtures the other day. When they first came on, 3 bulbs lit up and one was dark. I gave it an hour or so and turned the lights on and off again. This time, the light that wasn't on before was the ONLY bulb to light up, other 3 are dark. I tried to reset the lights to get them all on at the same time but ended up having to go to bed with them all off. Today when I got home from work, the 3 lights that were originally on are back on with the fourth one being out. Is there some kind of safeguard built into these lights that prevents people from turning them on and off again repeatedly? Any ideas why my fourth light is acting so funny? It's a fixture that I've been using for 2 years with no issues. I remember when I first set my room up with 315 LEC I had a similar issue getting all the bulbs to fire at the same time...


----------



## genuity (Dec 14, 2017)

LamontCranston said:


> Anyone ever experience something like this?
> 
> I just changed the bulbs out in my 315watt fixtures the other day. When they first came on, 3 bulbs lit up and one was dark. I gave it an hour or so and turned the lights on and off again. This time, the light that wasn't on before was the ONLY bulb to light up, other 3 are dark. I tried to reset the lights to get them all on at the same time but ended up having to go to bed with them all off. Today when I got home from work, the 3 lights that were originally on are back on with the fourth one being out. Is there some kind of safeguard built into these lights that prevents people from turning them on and off again repeatedly? Any ideas why my fourth light is acting so funny? It's a fixture that I've been using for 2 years with no issues. I remember when I first set my room up with 315 LEC I had a similar issue getting all the bulbs to fire at the same time...


What brand?


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 14, 2017)

LamontCranston said:


> Anyone ever experience something like this?
> 
> I just changed the bulbs out in my 315watt fixtures the other day. When they first came on, 3 bulbs lit up and one was dark. I gave it an hour or so and turned the lights on and off again. This time, the light that wasn't on before was the ONLY bulb to light up, other 3 are dark. I tried to reset the lights to get them all on at the same time but ended up having to go to bed with them all off. Today when I got home from work, the 3 lights that were originally on are back on with the fourth one being out. Is there some kind of safeguard built into these lights that prevents people from turning them on and off again repeatedly? Any ideas why my fourth light is acting so funny? It's a fixture that I've been using for 2 years with no issues. I remember when I first set my room up with 315 LEC I had a similar issue getting all the bulbs to fire at the same time...


i think there's a 15 minute on/off cool down on some of the 315 cmh ballasts, when i was doing some work in my grow i unplugged my cmh, when i plugged it back in it didnt fire right away but like 10-15 mins later it was running.


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## gr865 (Dec 14, 2017)

LamontCranston said:


> Anyone ever experience something like this?


One of my 315's has a minute delay when striking. Both lamps set to come on at 9 PM, and the lower lamp strikes almost a full minute after the first.


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## LamontCranston (Dec 15, 2017)

genuity said:


> What brand?


Sun System hoods and ballasts with Phillip's 4200k bulbs.

The fourth bulb is still off even though the circuit has been stable for 36 hours now, I'm lucky there is no plant under it right now. =)


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## genuity (Dec 15, 2017)

LamontCranston said:


> Sun System hoods and ballasts with Phillip's 4200k bulbs.
> 
> The fourth bulb is still off even though the circuit has been stable for 36 hours now, I'm lucky there is no plant under it right now. =)


Are they all daisy chain?


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Dec 15, 2017)

genuity said:


> Are they all daisy chain?


I was wondering about the daisy chain on the sun system. They said you can chain 4 on a 240v(1.5amp each).
Anyone have any experience with them?


----------



## genuity (Dec 15, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I was wondering about the daisy chain on the sun system. They said you can chain 4 on a 240v(1.5amp each).
> Anyone have any experience with them?


I do 3 on 120,so I think it would be ok..


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## LamontCranston (Dec 15, 2017)

genuity said:


> Are they all daisy chain?


I'm not very familiar with this term but I did look it up and no, I think mine are 'Hub' wired. Does that sound correct?


----------



## ISK (Dec 16, 2017)

I'm looking for some feedback on a 315 watt Phantom CMH.......good, bad or ugly?

@hyroot , I notice you posted that you bought one....are you happy with it?


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## Bad Karma (Dec 16, 2017)

ISK said:


> I'm looking for some feedback on a 315 watt Phantom CMH.......good, bad or ugly?


I have two Phantom 315's and they are a very good investment. They're the only remote ballast CMH to have an auto restrike feature in case of a power outage.


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## Zeed (Dec 17, 2017)

I’ve been using sun system 315 CMH for over 3 years and had very good results. 
The down fall about the sun system CMH is that the reflector will fade on you after a year. I switched to commercial 315 because you can change out the reflector.
I called this the 315 killer room, here are some pics of OG Paris on week SEVEN a month ago. Harvest 2.5lbs on a 315 Amazing what a 315 can do!


----------



## muleface (Dec 17, 2017)

anyone think a 630 cmh over a open 3x4 would be overkill? I have been heavily using LED and think these might be worth looking at. I just picked up a double ended 630w unit. Other then this thread, there doesn't seem to be a hell of a lot on this subject matter.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 17, 2017)

Day 22, gettin frosty!


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## Warpedpassage (Dec 17, 2017)

Zeed said:


> I’ve been using sun system 315 CMH for over 3 years and had very good results.
> The down fall about the sun system CMH is that the reflector will fade on you after a year. I switched to commercial 315 because you can change out the reflector.
> I called this the 315 killer room, here are some pics of OG Paris on week SEVEN a month ago. Harvest 2.5lbs on a 315 Amazing what a 315 can do!
> 
> ...



Soooooo, 1120 grams from a 315. Come on now, thats 3.5 g/w. That would make you the messiah of a new religion. Hell even id follow you blindly.


----------



## Pmbreno (Dec 17, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I have posted flowers grown under the Phillips 315 LEC 3100k and said they were frostier than with the Hortilux 600Super Hps alone.
> 
> And showed that it works as a finishing bulb for the last two weeks and that it is a great supplemental lamp to the hps.
> 
> ...


Been watching your grows for a while now mmg and I have to say that looks like one of your best plants.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 18, 2017)

Pmbreno said:


> Been watching your grows for a while now mmg and I have to say that looks like one of your best plants.



Thanks. The genetics are excellent. This is the same pheno as my avatar or at least close enough and I have been growing these seeds for a few years now.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 18, 2017)

Pmbreno said:


> Been watching your grows for a while now mmg and I have to say that looks like one of your best plants.


BTW, Nice avatar, breno...


----------



## Stage420 (Dec 18, 2017)

ISK said:


> I'm looking for some feedback on a 315 watt Phantom CMH.......good, bad or ugly?
> 
> @hyroot , I notice you posted that you bought one....are you happy with it?


High and good evening.
I purchased 4 315w Phantom CMH kits with Philips 3100k bulbs in Jan 2017. 
I am not a fan of the ballasts. 

Two of the four ballasts are toast. 
Meaning one day one lamp didnt come on.

Then a couple weeks later another went.
I would suggest the Sun Sustems 120v 315w CMH core (remote) ballast. (Non digital).


----------



## gr865 (Dec 18, 2017)

z


ISK said:


> I'm looking for some feedback on a 315 watt Phantom CMH.......good, bad or ugly?
> 
> @hyroot , I notice you posted that you bought one....are you happy with it?


I am running two Nanolux 315W's and like them a lot, no problems through 2.5 vertical runs. 

GR


----------



## genuity (Dec 18, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> View attachment 3739059
> Blue Dream day 15. SunSystem315
> View attachment 3739062


I just like looking at this...


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## thccbdhealth (Dec 19, 2017)

gr865 said:


> z
> 
> 
> I am running two Nanolux 315W's and like them a lot, no problems through 2.5 vertical runs.
> ...


The only thing i dont like about the fixture is there inst any auto restrike in the event of a power outage.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 19, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> The only thing i dont like about the fixture is there inst any auto restrike in the event of a power outage.



I keep reading this here but mine was plugged into a digital Titan light controller and turns back on after short and long power outages every time. I never had to touch it or the ballast through multiple power outages.


----------



## gr865 (Dec 19, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> The only thing i dont like about the fixture is there inst any auto restrike in the event of a power outage.


I spoke with Nanolux and if the power goes out, be it for 1 min or 10 hours, if the lamp is plugged in it will restart after it cools down.
I am not sure if this is an auto restrike or not.

If I shut the units down for any reason, it will restrike in about 15 to 20 min after cool down.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 19, 2017)

gr865 said:


> I spoke with Nanolux and if the power goes out, be it for 1 min or 10 hours, if the lamp is plugged in it will restart after it cools down.
> I am not sure if this is an auto restrike or not.
> 
> If I shut the units down for any reason, it will restrike in about 15 to 20 min after cool down.



I should have mentioned I was using a galaxy ballast.


----------



## Yodaweed (Dec 19, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I should have mentioned I was using a galaxy ballast.


galaxy makes CMH ballasts?


----------



## gr865 (Dec 19, 2017)

That post was for thccbdhealth, he said that the Nanolux would not restrike after power outage. I would like to find out where he got his info.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 19, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> galaxy makes CMH ballasts?



Yes for the sun system remote reflectors.


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## Yodaweed (Dec 19, 2017)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Yes for the sun system remote reflectors.


didn't know that, i love galaxy ballasts they work great lots of features and last a long time.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 19, 2017)

Yodaweed said:


> didn't know that, i love galaxy ballasts they work great lots of features and last a long time.



It is the same high quality and green color of my classic hps 400/600/1000 and my grow amp 400/600. 

Runs only warm to the touch and has no fan like the others. 

The dimmer is silly though at 315 watts.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Dec 19, 2017)

gr865 said:


> That post was for thccbdhealth, he said that the Nanolux would not restrike after power outage. I would like to find out where he got his info.


Personal experience and speaking with nanolux.
it will try to fire the bulb, but there is not an internal delay timer, nor does it not try to fire a still warm bulb.
it will try to ignite 10 times, and if the power was interrupted shortly the bulb hasn't had enough time to cool while those 10 false ignitions take place.

Mine will not reilluminate untill I unplug the ballast from the wall, and replying it in, after power has been temporarily interrupted via service provider.

I also spoke with hydro builder who told me both galaxy and phantom ballasts do have an auto restrike timer and would eliminate this issue.
however they will not ship to me..


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## thccbdhealth (Dec 19, 2017)

Thier suggestion was to get 1000w cpu backup supply battery....​or a titan light controller with the built in delay


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 19, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Personal experience and speaking with nanolux.
> it will try to fire the bulb, but there is not an internal delay timer, nor does it not try to fire a still warm bulb.
> it will try to ignite 10 times, and if the power was interrupted shortly the bulb hasn't had enough time to cool while those 10 false ignitions take place.
> 
> ...



I had not heard what you just said about Galaxy. I thought only the phantom was advertising re-strike. 

I wonder if you use a light controller with its own shutoff circuit and fuse if yours would simply count down the waiting re start period and come back on with the controller?

I didn’t see the restrike feature on the galaxy paperwork. The Grow amps I have from them both have “soft restart”.


----------



## gr865 (Dec 19, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Personal experience and speaking with nanolux.
> it will try to fire the bulb, but there is not an internal delay timer, nor does it not try to fire a still warm bulb.
> it will try to ignite 10 times, and if the power was interrupted shortly the bulb hasn't had enough time to cool while those 10 false ignitions take place.
> 
> ...


So, Nanolux tells me one thing and they tell you another. That is interesting shit, I will call them again tomorrow and address this. I hate being lied too, and I hope you are wrong. I have not had this issue with either of my NC's. 
I know nothing about the Galaxy 315, except I have a 400W ballast (MH & HPS) that I used previously that work well.
Know nothing of the Phantom.


----------



## Bad Karma (Dec 19, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> I also spoke with hydro builder who told me both galaxy and phantom ballasts do have an auto restrike timer and would eliminate this issue.


He was half right, a Phantom CMH will reignite after cool down, a Galaxy CMH will not. I own both and the auto restrike topic has been well discussed during the course of this thread. I've spoken to Growers House where I purchased the Galaxy CMH ballast at, and to Galaxy themselves, and that ballast is NOT designed to restrike at all.


----------



## gr865 (Dec 19, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> He was half right, a Phantom CMH will reignite after cool down, a Galaxy CMH will not. I own both and the auto restrike topic has been well discussed during the course of this thread. I've spoken to Growers House where I purchased the Galaxy CMH ballast at, and to Galaxy themselves, and that ballast is NOT designed to restrike at all.


That is what I was told by Nanolux, will reignite after cool down. 
I am not a lighting person, but I know that this light works for me. I have had no issue's as of yet.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Dec 19, 2017)

genuity said:


> I just like looking at this...


@Carolina Dream'n  you like the daisy chain?
How is the heat so close to the ceiling without a remote ballast ?


----------



## ttystikk (Dec 20, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> @Carolina Dream'n  you like the daisy chain?
> How is the heat so close to the ceiling without a remote ballast ?


He consistently pulls over a pound a light of high quality product. In the absence of any other commentary, I'd say that speaks for itself.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Dec 20, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> He was half right, a Phantom CMH will reignite after cool down, a Galaxy CMH will not. I own both and the auto restrike topic has been well discussed during the course of this thread. I've spoken to Growers House where I purchased the Galaxy CMH ballast at, and to Galaxy themselves, and that ballast is NOT designed to restrike at all.


Thats what i had read and the reason for the phone call, phantom ballast isn't a typical hid cord socket.... and the galaxy is...
Seams as if i should grab a phantom for the secound ballast and a titan 15 minute delay timer for the nanolux.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 20, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Thats what i had read and the reason for the phone call, phantom ballast isn't a typical hid cord socket.... and the galaxy is...
> Seams as if i should grab a phantom for the secound ballast and a titan 15 minute delay timer for the nanolux.



Hydrofarm lamps have a different ballast plug than the rest of the industry. It’s on all their hid’s 

There is an adapter to make a Hydrofarm reflector fit a non Hydrofarm ballast.


----------



## genuity (Dec 20, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> @Carolina Dream'n  you like the daisy chain?
> How is the heat so close to the ceiling without a remote ballast ?


I don't think them 315 are the updated ones..

 This this is all it is..


----------



## ISK (Dec 20, 2017)

Thanks everyone for your feedback on the Phantom 315 CMh.....although not everyone has a positive experience with this product, I still made the purchase today from my local hydro store for $540 CND ($420 USA) c/w hood, ballast, power cords and one 315W/930 Philips master greenpower bulb.

The instructions say *"NOTE: for proper break-in on new lamps, we recommend that you run the ballast & lamp for at least 12 hours straight after initial startup. This will improve lamp life & performance.*

A few questions:

1) I never heard of breaking-in a light bulb...it this a normal practice?

2) The instructions also say use at least a 15 AMP timer ....I only have a 13 AMP timer, is this a problem, considering the lamp only draws 3 amps

3) the grow store dude said to keep about 18 inches between the bulb and the top of the plant....this seems very high to me, as I keep my 600 watt HPS about 10 inches away....how much distance do you folks keep between a mature plant and a 315w CMh bulb

thanks 
ISK


----------



## Pmbreno (Dec 20, 2017)

20 inches has been perfect for me for light distance with 315s. On a side note in regards to the discussion about ballasts restriking or not, the ss with the built in ballast has the restrike feature. So I came in one day to a light being off and unplugged and plugged back in the lamp, luckily I was able to actually see the bulb so I immediately noticed the inside bulb go grey and the ceramic bulb turn completely black. This was after two years of use so it went its life expectancy but I did inspect the bulb before trying to refire and noticed nothing out of the ordinary.


----------



## Bad Karma (Dec 20, 2017)

ISK said:


> Thanks everyone for your feedback on the Phantom 315 CMh.....although not everyone has a positive experience with this product, I still made the purchase today from my local hydro store for $540 CND ($420 USA) c/w hood, ballast, power cords and one 315W/930 Philips master greenpower bulb.
> 
> The instructions say *"NOTE: for proper break-in on new lamps, we recommend that you run the ballast & lamp for at least 12 hours straight after initial startup. This will improve lamp life & performance.*
> 
> ...


1. Yes, for CMH bulbs this is normal, so follow the directions.

3. During veg I keep it around 2.5'-3' and in flower between 16"-20".

Enjoy your new lamp.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Dec 21, 2017)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> @Carolina Dream'n  you like the daisy chain?
> How is the heat so close to the ceiling without a remote ballast ?


I do not daisy chain my lights together. Putting extra resistance and heat on your ballast never made any sense to me. Every light comes with its own cord for a reason. And light controllers are not expensive in anyway. 

There is a 1-2 inch gap between lights and ceilings. They run cool enough that I don't worry about any fire hazards from overheating the ceiling.


----------



## NugHeuser (Dec 21, 2017)

muleface said:


> anyone think a 630 cmh over a open 3x4 would be overkill? I have been heavily using LED and think these might be worth looking at. I just picked up a double ended 630w unit. Other then this thread, there doesn't seem to be a hell of a lot on this subject matter.


I don't think that's overkill. I have one but I have several other lights crammed in on my canopy as well so technically mine covers probably 2.5 x 4 feet. I know of a couple people running one in a 5x5 tent and are happy. In an open space though I'd say it's solid for about 3x4. 

*This is for the growers choice 630. *They have a smaller hood on theirs, I think it should be bigger but that's the coverage I see for this one.


----------



## NugHeuser (Dec 21, 2017)

Resin rails starting to form at day 26 under the two 315w sun systems with the Philips 3100k and Growers Choice 630w de @3000k with "red enhancement" and 600w hps.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 21, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> View attachment 3739059
> Blue Dream day 15. SunSystem315
> View attachment 3739062


Wowza!! Are you rinning those on 120v or 220v?


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Dec 21, 2017)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Wowza!! Are you rinning those on 120v or 220v?


220v.


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## NugHeuser (Dec 21, 2017)

This may be a stupid question but what's the gain for 220v? More efficiency? I had some 220v adapters sent with my lights but they'e just sitting around


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## Carolina Dream'n (Dec 21, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> This may be a stupid question but what's the gain for 220v? More efficiency? I had some 220v adapters sent with my lights but they'e just sitting around


It uses half the amps per light, allowing you to run more lights. 
Draws less resistance because the power load is split in two, resulting in cooler running longer lasting equipment. 
It's much safer and more efficient than 110v.


----------



## NugHeuser (Dec 21, 2017)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> It uses half the amps per light, allowing you to run more lights.
> Draws less resistance because the power load is split in two, resulting in cooler running longer lasting equipment.
> It's much safer and more efficient than 110v.


Well looks like I should start looking into how to wire that/hook it up. I've had the breaker pop in my room many times. I have 4 lights running at ~1900 watts total and everythings been fine with that as long as I don't use my 8000 btu a/c because thats what pops it. Otherwise I gotta kill one of my lights. Temps are dropping now that winter is finally here but there'd be no way I could run them in summer without a/c. And this is even with 2 desperate breakers in the same room and trying to split evenly. 15 amp breakers, I don't know much about electrical work though


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Dec 21, 2017)

NugHeuser said:


> Well looks like I should start looking into how to wire that/hook it up. I've had the breaker pop in my room many times. I have 4 lights running at ~1900 watts total and everythings been fine with that as long as I don't use my 8000 btu a/c because thats what pops it. Otherwise I gotta kill one of my lights. Temps are dropping now that winter is finally here but there'd be no way I could run them in summer without a/c. And this is even with 2 desperate breakers in the same room and trying to split evenly. 15 amp breakers, I don't know much about electrical work though


Entirely too many watts for 110v in my opinion.


----------



## NugHeuser (Dec 21, 2017)

So with 1900w spread between 4 lights your saying it's posing risk for fire at 110v? Or what do you mean by too many watts?


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Dec 21, 2017)

Sensi Star day 1. Flower room 2. 
Ionic Bloom, Ersa Elixir and calcium hypochlorite. Dosatrons control nutrients, ph doser controls ph. Rez has a 1800gph 3/4hp sump pump on a timer. Float valve keeps Rez 100% full at all times. Watering starts at once a day and goes up to 4. 4" rock wool cubes on slabs. 

Room was 86 degrees, 75% rh 1250 ppm co2. Nutrients at 1.4 EC, 5.8 ph 66 degrees. 

Once this room is setup up, it's 1-2 hours of work every 2 weeks. Automate or stay late.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 21, 2017)

Here we go- day 26 flower on 1 sunsystem 315 :


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 21, 2017)




----------



## gr865 (Dec 22, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Personal experience and speaking with nanolux.
> it will try to fire the bulb, but there is not an internal delay timer, nor does it not try to fire a still warm bulb.
> it will try to ignite 10 times, and if the power was interrupted shortly the bulb hasn't had enough time to cool while those 10 false ignitions take place.
> 
> ...


Interesting I have not run into that, hopefully I won't/

GR


----------



## thccbdhealth (Dec 22, 2017)

Phantom will reignite after bulb cool down.
Galaxy will try to illuminate as soon as the fixture is plugged in.
via hydro builder reply


----------



## Bad Karma (Dec 22, 2017)

thccbdhealth said:


> Phantom will reignite after bulb cool down.
> Galaxy will try to illuminate as soon as the fixture is plugged in.
> via hydro builder reply


That's what I said. The Galaxy ballast has to be reset manually by hand, but the Phantom ballast will take care of itself, in the event of a power outage. Therefore, Phantom > Galaxy, in my book.


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## Jss20 (Dec 23, 2017)

I , this is my first grow , in a 4x8 tent , running 2 powersun 315 lec lights ! 2 week bloom .... purple kush .. 11 plants ! Next time i will add one more 315 light and a scrog system


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 24, 2017)

Merry Christmas all! I'm thinking of buying another light for getting a good rotation setup going... thoughts?


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 25, 2017)

New microscope! Merry Christmas all!


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 25, 2017)




----------



## billzebill (Dec 27, 2017)

Hey, how often do you all replace your bulbs? I know these last a lot longer than HPS or regular MH bulbs, but I think the info I had was not quite right. I had read that they maintained 85% PPF at 20,000 hours. I just replaced mine (for the first time) at about 9,200 hours, and it was a HUGE difference.

I use a cheap light meter to give me an idea of light intensities, then use conversion values I found on the web to convert that into PPFD values. I know it's not very accurate, but it gives me a ballpark figure I can work with.

When I replaced my bulb at 9,200 hours my measurement under the light went from 600 PPFD to 1000 PPFD. That is a HUGE jump.

Any input?


----------



## gr865 (Dec 27, 2017)

billzebill said:


> Hey, how often do you all replace your bulbs? I know these last a lot longer than HPS or regular MH bulbs, but I think the info I had was not quite right. I had read that they maintained 85% PPF at 20,000 hours. I just replaced mine (for the first time) at about 9,200 hours, and it was a HUGE difference.
> 
> I use a cheap light meter to give me an idea of light intensities, then use conversion values I found on the web to convert that into PPFD values. I know it's not very accurate, but it gives me a ballpark figure I can work with.
> 
> ...


I got extra bulbs, but I will replace every grow.


----------



## Bad Karma (Dec 27, 2017)

billzebill said:


> Hey, how often do you all replace your bulbs? I know these last a lot longer than HPS or regular MH bulbs, but I think the info I had was not quite right. I had read that they maintained 85% PPF at 20,000 hours. I just replaced mine (for the first time) at about 9,200 hours, and it was a HUGE difference.
> 
> I use a cheap light meter to give me an idea of light intensities, then use conversion values I found on the web to convert that into PPFD values. I know it's not very accurate, but it gives me a ballpark figure I can work with.
> 
> ...


I replace my CMH bulbs every 18 months and don't notice much difference when I do. I wouldn't put much faith into "conversion values found on the web" as a way of calculating PPFD. There's a reason why PAR Meters are different than Light Meters.


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## billzebill (Dec 28, 2017)

Bad Karma said:


> I replace my CMH bulbs every 18 months and don't notice much difference when I do. I wouldn't put much faith into "conversion values found on the web" as a way of calculating PPFD. There's a reason why PAR Meters are different than Light Meters.


The conversion values I am not worried about. They came from Apogee and were specific to various light sources including my exact bulb. Any significant error is more likely to come from my shitty light meter measuring lux. 

But even so, I don't expect this to provide more than a VERY rough approximation for PPFD. Which is fine. The significance here is that when I took the measurements the same way under the new and old bulbs, I got vastly different values. To me that suggests either a change in intensity or a color shift - neither of which are likely to be good for plants.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 29, 2017)

So, i just received one of the Grower's Choice 10k CMH finishing bulbs this morning, packaging was undamaged, but upon opening, it appears as though the base of the inner glass tube may be broken or chipped. See attached photos showing concoidal fractures at base of glass (where metal wire leads penetrate the glass tubes and attach to ceramic bulb base). There is also glass dust and several larger glass shards loose and sliding around inside the inner tube. 

First of all, does anyone think/know if this is normal?? Should i fight to return this bulb??? I haven't plugged it in yet to see if it works, but really don't want to either, as it would ROYALLY SUCK to have a cmh bulb exploding in my grow room...

I ordered from HydroBuilder.com, who state in their return policy that they won't accept bulb/lamp returns, but this seems like an obviously defective product that was DOA, and should be fully replaced at no extra cost to me, right?? I sent a ~ verbatim email to them, so I'll keep ya'll posted on how this goes down....


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 29, 2017)

Boom! Hydrobuilder now officially rocks in my book!!


----------



## Javadog (Dec 29, 2017)

Good response.

*Finishing* lights......sigh...so behind the times. LOL


----------



## genuity (Dec 29, 2017)

Javadog said:


> Good response.
> 
> *Finishing* lights......sigh...so behind the times. LOL


Wait till you see the new chop time lights... crazy spectrum,makes the room look like a kaleidoscope.. 

It will make the nugs grow as you are chopping....138% increase in yield.


----------



## gr865 (Dec 29, 2017)

genuity said:


> Wait till you see the new chop time lights... crazy spectrum,makes the room look like a kaleidoscope..
> 
> It will make the nugs grow as you are chopping....138% increase in yield.


What you guys been smoking,


----------



## genuity (Dec 29, 2017)

gr865 said:


> What you guys been smoking,


Lol.... bubba fett shatter & red head stranger shatter & some unknown sugar & @BobBitchen meltdown dry sift....

No flower month kind of..


----------



## Javadog (Dec 29, 2017)

genuity said:


> Wait till you see the new chop time lights... crazy spectrum,makes the room look like a kaleidoscope..
> 
> It will make the nugs grow as you are chopping....138% increase in yield.


That would actually be fully freaky...with the nugs shifting in your hand while trying to trim!

:0)


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 29, 2017)

Javadog said:


> Good response.
> 
> *Finishing* lights......sigh...so behind the times. LOL


You're making me nervous... was this a waste of time and money or something??


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 29, 2017)

genuity said:


> Wait till you see the new chop time lights... crazy spectrum,makes the room look like a kaleidoscope..
> 
> It will make the nugs grow as you are chopping....138% increase in yield.


I'm going for frost not weight, so mostly hoping the 10000k will help make these babies even frostier.... not lookin too shabby already at day35 though:


----------



## genuity (Dec 29, 2017)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> I'm going for frost not weight, so mostly hoping the 10000k will help make these babies even frostier.... not lookin too shabby already at day35 though:View attachment 4065066


Please don't take my post in a bad way...

It was just a high ass post,I was just high... the joke sounded funniest the first time I ran it in my head...

Don't think I'm not waiting to see how that 1000 watt lec runs.. I like lec plant growth.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 29, 2017)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> I'm going for frost not weight, so mostly hoping the 10000k will help make these babies even frostier.... not lookin too shabby already at day35 though:View attachment 4065066



The added UVB for the last 2 weeks of ripening has been proven to give the same thc gain as running uv full cycle. 

Up to a 4% gain over no finishing lamp has been recorded. 

I am sorry I don’t have the links from last year when I researched and bought my LEC. 

There may be more benefit to uva and uvb full cycle in terpenes and flavonoids but this is still not proven for our plant that I have seen.


----------



## Javadog (Dec 29, 2017)

Mine either Colorado. 

I love it when growers can add the special steps. Groerr has a few of those too,
like some IR band for a while during the end of the cycle. It is all fun. 

and dank buds come from it too!


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 29, 2017)

Well, i guess we'll see! Replacement shipped!


----------



## Craigson (Dec 29, 2017)

Hey folks,
I have 2x 600W hps 2000k and a 315W cmh in my flower room.
I just started flower and still have the 4200k bulb in the cmh.
Should I change to the 3000k cmh bulb I have?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 29, 2017)

Craigson said:


> Hey folks,
> I have 2x 600W hps 2000k and a 315W cmh in my flower room.
> I just started flower and still have the 4200k bulb in the cmh.
> Should I change to the 3000k cmh bulb I have?



I just put my Phillips 3100k 315 back with my 2 Hortilux 600 Super hps’.

I really like this set up. When I had a Hortilux Blue in place of one of the hps things got to leafy and yield went down.

But 2 hps to one cmh vegging bulb should be great! If I had one I would have already tried it. More Uv in the 4200k Phillips.

I just don’t like too much blue light in flower after trying quite a few variations. Better calyx/leaf ratio and yield and potency with more red than blue in my opinion. 

But 2 hps to one mh has been proven for quality and yield for years.

Please post some results when you can. 

Here is a link to all the stats of different types of bulbs from the University of Utah.

https://www.cycloptics.com/sites/default/files/GB USU Spectral Characterization link.pdf


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Dec 30, 2017)

Pic of the flower room with the LEC back in.


----------



## gr865 (Jan 2, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> The added UVB for the last 2 weeks of ripening has been proven to give the same thc gain as running uv full cycle.
> 
> Up to a 4% gain over no finishing lamp has been recorded.
> 
> ...


What uv lights and how do you run them, would like to figure out how to hang a few vertical, maybe 24 or 36 inch T5's. Not sure, any thoughts?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 2, 2018)

gr865 said:


> What uv lights and how do you run them, would like to figure out how to hang a few vertical, maybe 24 or 36 inch T5's. Not sure, any thoughts?



The only uv I am getting really is coming from the 315 cmh. 

I may try a 4200k bulb next as they have more uva and b than the 3100k. 

But you can just get fluorescent uv and combo bulbs for t-5 fixtures now. 

Some use aquarium or reptile lighting but I have only read about it. I never added specific uv. Just read a lot about it.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 2, 2018)

Hey @gr865 

Here is a link to a spectral chart from the university of Utah showing the stats of many different types of lighting includong both cmh bulbs and standard t-5 and the uv a and b amount. 



https://www.cycloptics.com/sites/default/files/GB USU Spectral Characterization link.pdf


----------



## gr865 (Jan 2, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Hey @gr865
> 
> Here is a link to a spectral chart from the university of Utah showing the stats of many different types of lighting includong both cmh bulbs and standard t-5 and the uv a and b amount.
> 
> ...


Thanks Bud,
Good info.
This is the article that got my interest.
https://hightimes.com/grow/grow-hack-does-uv-light-increase-cannabis-potency/

I will try and figure out a way to hang a few T5' UV fixtures. All cost dependent!

Three thoughts,
1. Use 4 or 5 single 18 to 24" T5 fixtures hung vertical between my two 315's.
Here is a sketch to describe.
 

The distance between the lamps of the lights hung vertically would be about 12 to 18 inches, so I would have room to work on a design for it. But I don't know if that would just throw the light to the center of the plants or cover the entire plants with light? 

2. Could hang three or so of them horizontal, just above the tops of the plants but would that light do anything for the buds down lower on the plant?

3. The last 10 days or so, just before starting flush, hang X number of 3 to 4 foot T5 UV fixtures around the CMH bulbs. Run the CMH's for 10 to 11 hours then put the UV lamps around the CMH's and run them for 1 to 2 hrs. They would need to be able to be move when not in use but that would be a simple problem to solve, have room behind screens to tuck them.


Ok all you mad scientist out there let see what we can come up with. LOL 
Something to play with while getting very stoned on my SuperCitrusHaze on this cold week we are about to get here.

GR

Edit: Thought, the last X number of days before harvest run the 4' T5's UV's the entire light cycle and remove the CMH.


----------



## gr865 (Jan 2, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Thanks Bud,
> Good info.


Just got an email from California Light Works, they has a new supplemental light out. It is the SolarSystem UVB. Going to take a look at them.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Jan 3, 2018)

Oh man, had to kill 8 clones just now.... BUT, sure am lookin' forward to getting my Jelly Pie beans here shortly!! And a few others...


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Jan 3, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Thanks Bud,
> Good info.
> This is the article that got my interest.
> https://hightimes.com/grow/grow-hack-does-uv-light-increase-cannabis-potency/
> ...


I actually added two 24" 25w T5s on either side of my 315 lec, just hanging out on either side of the hood. The extra 100w total seems to have helped to boost terps significantly, but could also just be that point in their flower process too... Shouldn't hurt though!!


----------



## THCBrain (Jan 4, 2018)

x2 315w 1m square tent.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Jan 4, 2018)

Buhbam!

View attachment 4068299


----------



## gr865 (Jan 5, 2018)

Day 43 12/12

Just a couple of pics this AM after lights out. They are starting to bulk, can see the difference daily now.
This AM when I checked the tent my lower 315 was out, timer showed the ballast was on but no light. Fortunate to have a spare although I am not sure of the quality of the lamp, The reason I replaced this lamp prior to this grow, was that compaired to the other lamp it was just not as bright. This will get me through the weekend and I can go to the Hydro Store on Monday. I had just added the 5 plants for the next grow to the tent, between the current grow plants, but I removed them this AM and put them back under the T5's for at least another week.
Getting frosty and gaining bulk.





Oh yeah, gaining bulk.





This pic shows why not to touch the plants to the light when moving them around. Last week while adjusting the plants in the tent, with the lights on, I bumped the top of my head against one of the lamps. Instant 315 tattoo burned into the scalp. If I had hair I would have just burned it, but alas bald as an 8 ball. LOL Not the first time an doubt it will be the last.  






GR


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## NugHeuser (Jan 5, 2018)

With @gr865 @ColoradoHighGrower and myself being within a day or two of flower of each other, in about 3 weeks we should be seeing all kinds of beautiful frostiness 
Looking forward to that!!


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## NugHeuser (Jan 5, 2018)

I've got an alien rift pheno that is so frosty it looks like it's covered in a sheet of velvet, complete resin rails. I'm tickled pink with it. Will try to remember to put some pics up after work!


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## NugHeuser (Jan 5, 2018)

Day 41
I've been having some deficiencies but overall its going well. I'll probably be taking down the 600w hps tomorrow to get temps down a bit, leaving the two 315w Sun systems and 630w de growers choice.
 

This plant is a cross from a male Bubblicious by Nirvana and the mother could be from I believe 4 different strains. I got the seeds from a buddy, was an accidental cross and he mixed all the seeds together from the females. She's probably my smelliest plant, and that's saying something because most all of them are pretty strong smelling. I got 3 females from that specific bag of seeds, each looking completely different, this one thus far is the stinkiest and frostiest of the 3. 
Alien Rift #5
This one will be my earliest finisher of the rifts I'm thinking. Not bad for just before week 6! Also probably has the best calyxe to leaf ratio of the bunch.



Alien Rift #9

So this plant has a goofy cola. I remember I had a plant growing "trifoliate" on one of the branches and I meant to keep an eye on it but ended up forgetting about it with all of the never ending watering and all the other tasks. So I'm wondering if that is this branch on this #9 rift. Anyone ever seen a cola looking like that before? It's pretty beefy. Also rectangular shaped instead of round. Rest of the plant has pointed round colas like the other one in the picture. 

Alien Rift #12
Small buds but really white in color, they look pretty sweet. The hps is screwing up the lighting.


Alien Rift #8
This is one of my frostiest plants in the garden of 18. It's also one of the smallest plants, I accidently broke it in half after the second node after it was a few weeks old. I almost threw it away when that happened. Glad I didn't. She's also got the fattest colas of the garden. 


Getting there!!!


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Jan 5, 2018)

NugHeuser said:


> With @gr865 @ColoradoHighGrower and myself being within a day or two of flower of each other, in about 3 weeks we should be seeing all kinds of beautiful frostiness
> Looking forward to that!!


Yes!


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Jan 5, 2018)

NugHeuser said:


> Day 41
> I've been having some deficiencies but overall its going well. I'll probably be taking down the 600w hps tomorrow to get temps down a bit, leaving the two 315w Sun systems and 630w de growers choice.
> View attachment 4068666 View attachment 4068667
> 
> ...


Man, #8 and 9 look AWESOME!!! but #12 takes the cake on fatty points....


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## Javadog (Jan 6, 2018)

Very Crusty!


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Jan 7, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Man, #8 and 9 look AWESOME!!! but #12 takes the cake on fatty points....


Actually, i think it's #9 that has the fatty round chunker of a cola... she's a beaut!


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## NugHeuser (Jan 7, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Actually, i think it's #9 that has the fatty round chunker of a cola... she's a beaut!


Yep! #12 is small budded but they're beautiful buds, almost white in color. 
I took the hps out today to get temps below 80 so it's all cmh from here on out!


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## NugHeuser (Jan 7, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Actually, i think it's #9 that has the fatty round chunker of a cola... she's a beaut!


#9 Will probably be the best yielder of the rifts. But #5 is pretty chunky too and not very leafy which is nice.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Jan 7, 2018)

Nice!! Good job!! I'm looking forward to seeing the final countdown and product!!


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## gr865 (Jan 9, 2018)

NugHeuser said:


> With @gr865 @ColoradoHighGrower and myself being within a day or two of flower of each other, in about 3 weeks we should be seeing all kinds of beautiful frostiness
> Looking forward to that!!


Yeppers, Just watching them fatten up now.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 11, 2018)

I've been away for a while so here we go. 5 12 gal buckets I made into a dwc holding 5 gg#4 from docs dank seeds. 4x 8 tent with 2 lec 315 and 2 600 hps. I brew my. Own tea and add gh line


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 11, 2018)

Just to get my feet wet


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 11, 2018)




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## gwheels (Jan 12, 2018)

I use a 315 CMH in a 4 x 4 tent with 4 autopots. I am running 3 currently. I need space for the reservoir and fans and such. I am amazed at the 315 performance. I grew 12 oz of buds and 4 oz of larfy stuff i used in the MBM2.

This round is suffering because I need to properly clean my tubing but they are still better than buying.  Running 2 white rhinos and a cheese atm

My last round was stellar

And I need room in my tent for stuff. The coverage of the 315 is great and one of those lights does not produce enough heat to cause stress. I think it is the perfect light for growing 3 or 4 plants. But that is my humble opinion. 

And I grow for about 25 bucks an oz at this time. That is about as good as it gets.

I am no pro I learn as I grow


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 12, 2018)

Very nice


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 12, 2018)

This round i built a 2 1/2 foot platform the tent sits on top of. Now that gives me room for storage,Rez,and scrubber. and grow area


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## gr865 (Jan 12, 2018)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> This round i built a 2 1/2 foot platform the tent sits on top of. Now that gives me room for storage,Rez,and scrubber. and grow area


Do you have a pic of that setup, Sounds cool


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## gwheels (Jan 12, 2018)

I am living in the 4 plant limit that will come in July. My script runs out in August so the timing is great  Viva la Canada


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## gr865 (Jan 12, 2018)

@gwheels, I ran WR a few grows ago, it made some great Cannabis Oil.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 12, 2018)

brewing tea but this is pretty much my platform..the pipe is the drain pipe for my dwc to make things easier for me


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## NugHeuser (Jan 20, 2018)

The morning of day 56. A beautiful sight.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 20, 2018)

@nug very nice. You inspire me to go even harder..I'm at the end of week one of switch 12/12. What food are you using?


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## Underground Scientist (Jan 20, 2018)

My 315 kit came in today


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## NugHeuser (Jan 20, 2018)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> @nug very nice. You inspire me to go even harder..I'm at the end of week one of switch 12/12. What food are you using?


I've been giving Growth Science's product called Rock Solid since about week 3 in low amounts, starting at 1ml/g. Now a few are up to the full 9ml/g that's recommended and several that are nearing chop have been cut off. 
The last week and a half I also started giving Overdrive by Advanced Nutrients but I just ran out of of that, doubt I'm going to get more with most being so close to plain water only and chop.


----------



## Yodaweed (Jan 20, 2018)

gwheels said:


> I use a 315 CMH in a 4 x 4 tent with 4 autopots. I am running 3 currently. I need space for the reservoir and fans and such. I am amazed at the 315 performance. I grew 12 oz of buds and 4 oz of larfy stuff i used in the MBM2.
> 
> This round is suffering because I need to properly clean my tubing but they are still better than buying.  Running 2 white rhinos and a cheese atm
> 
> ...


I'm also doing a test run of a 315 cmh in a 4x4 , seems to be doing ok but i feel like more light wouldn't hurt. Do you feel the same about maybe having a second cmh in a 4x4 for max yield?


----------



## Underground Scientist (Jan 20, 2018)

Got the Sun Systems Dominator XXXL Hood all modded for dual bulb use. I want to leave the glass off, but keep exhaust on the hood to draw the heat. Up and running for a trial run to see what the temps do. I'm still scratching my head over how I can incorporate my carbon filter into the system this way. I want the efficiency and get rid of the UV blocking power of the glass. This is damn bright! 400w HPS and 315w CMH. I don't have a PAR meter, but I've always monitored what works for my plants using a lux meter, and I'm getting very good numbers with this.


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 20, 2018)

I have 2 315 cmh and 2 600 hps heat can and will be a issue if it's hot outside.but I love it


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 20, 2018)




----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 20, 2018)

@nug I'm brewing tea and loving it


----------



## bigdaddycannabis (Jan 20, 2018)

https://www.thegreenleafcompanyltd.com/product-page/315w-cmh-armour-series-reflector-ballast
has anyone ordered from these guys? cant seem to find much for reviews


----------



## Underground Scientist (Jan 21, 2018)

Heat test has been run. 6" High CFM exhaust set on high, passive filtered intakes from the cool basement. Isn't really enough. Steady 86 degrees, it's doable, but not ideal. I might need glass.


----------



## gwheels (Jan 21, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> I'm also doing a test run of a 315 cmh in a 4x4 , seems to be doing ok but i feel like more light wouldn't hurt. Do you feel the same about maybe having a second cmh in a 4x4 for max yield?


2 might work well but heat would be an issue. 12 to 14 oz per run from my 4 x 4 with a single 315 is more than enough for me.  If I were to do it again I would run 2 tents that were 3 x 3 with 2 plants in each and a 315 CMH. But I am very impressed with a single 315 and it works great.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Jan 21, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Heat test has been run. 6" High CFM exhaust set on high, passive filtered intakes from the cool basement. Isn't really enough. Steady 86 degrees, it's doable, but not ideal. I might need glass.


I suppose I could do a cold air intake set with a temp controller I have...I hate making things even more complicated, but I have the equipment and a problem with being obsessive...lol

That would work until summer hits, then I'd have to reassess at that point. I run enough electricity, I hope to not get AC involved, dehumidification is bad enough.

If the glass will block UV B, then it kinda defeats the purpose.


----------



## Bad Karma (Jan 21, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> If the glass will block UV B, then it kinda defeats the purpose.


The glass does block UVB. I've grown with and without the glass in place on my 315. The plants still finish out nice but noticeably less potent than buds exposed to UVB.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Jan 21, 2018)

gwheels said:


> 2 might work well but heat would be an issue. 12 to 14 oz per run from my 4 x 4 with a single 315 is more than enough for me.  If I were to do it again I would run 2 tents that were 3 x 3 with 2 plants in each and a 315 CMH. But I am very impressed with a single 315 and it works great.


We're you growing soil or hydro? If soil, what size pots?


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 21, 2018)

2 315 cmh & 2 600watt hps


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 21, 2018)

Wasn't able to take all clones at the same time so I'm paying for it now! Not bad , it's been over 2 years since I was able to play again


----------



## Underground Scientist (Jan 21, 2018)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> View attachment 4076970 2 315 cmh & 2 600watt hps


How are you handling the heat?


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 21, 2018)

Portable ac


----------



## Mojave (Jan 21, 2018)

I just got an ushio 4200k and it has a flicker on full power, it's extremely faint and fast but its there. I tried with and without the timer, and a directly into the wall outlet. Still there, but it goes away on medium 245w or 190w power setting. Made sure the bulb was tight twice. I did notice one of the bulbs contacts looked burned or like it had arcing? My other bulbs look good and the contacts are clean. Any idea? Think it may be a bad bulb.


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## Yodaweed (Jan 21, 2018)

gwheels said:


> 2 might work well but heat would be an issue. 12 to 14 oz per run from my 4 x 4 with a single 315 is more than enough for me.  If I were to do it again I would run 2 tents that were 3 x 3 with 2 plants in each and a 315 CMH. But I am very impressed with a single 315 and it works great.


I added two LEDs to my 315 cmh 4x4 tent, seems to be doing a good job so far


----------



## Bad Karma (Jan 22, 2018)

A little peak inside my CMH flowering tent.

Bubblicious (Lavender dom)
 

Bubblicious (Hybrid)


----------



## gwheels (Jan 22, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> We're you growing soil or hydro? If soil, what size pots?


I grow in an autopot system. It is like a bottom feed hydro system.

I have done 50 50 coco perlite (worked great)
50 50 hydroton coco
33/33/33 hydroton/perlite/1 inch rockwell cubes

They all worked good


----------



## Underground Scientist (Jan 22, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> I suppose I could do a cold air intake set with a temp controller I have...I hate making things even more complicated, but I have the equipment and a problem with being obsessive...lol
> 
> That would work until summer hits, then I'd have to reassess at that point. I run enough electricity, I hope to not get AC involved, dehumidification is bad enough.
> 
> If the glass will block UV B, then it kinda defeats the purpose.


Cold Air Intake works. Set a low limit of 75 and high limit of 78, set the inline fan on low, keeps the average 76-77...fan runs on low maybe 40% of the time. Not bad until summer comes. Except I have to fasten the door on my box now because of positive instead of negative pressure. I did notice a bit of a draft with the fan off, so I might have to set up a booster fan to mix the room air into the box during lights off to make sure temps don't dip too much. I think I have a spare temp limiter.


----------



## Schmarmpit (Jan 22, 2018)

Does anyone run the 210w CMH? 

My veg tent is a 3x3 with 8 T5 2 foot bulbs. It does fine just seems a little slow. I realized for just slightly more power I could do a 210w CMH and get much more quality light.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 23, 2018)

I didn't know they had them


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## Underground Scientist (Jan 23, 2018)

Schmarmpit said:


> Does anyone run the 210w CMH?
> 
> My veg tent is a 3x3 with 8 T5 2 foot bulbs. It does fine just seems a little slow. I realized for just slightly more power I could do a 210w CMH and get much more quality light.


Not sure about the performance of those, not like the Agro 315's


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## Schmarmpit (Jan 23, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Not sure about the performance of those, not like the Agro 315's


Actually they are relatively similar. They even make a 210w 3000k bulb much like the Agro spectrum 315. You have to have the option to put your ballast in 210w mode. Mine is an actual Philips CMH ballast and they have that feature built in. I decided to go for it and will update with my results. I expect great results just like when I switched to 315 CMH for the first time. I think it could be the perfect veg light for my little 3x3. 
http://www.lighting.philips.com/main/prof/conventional-lamps-and-tubes/high-intensity-discharge-lamps/ceramic-metal-halide/mastercolor-cdm-t-elite-med-wattage/928601164731_EU/product


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## gwheels (Jan 24, 2018)

The buds are fattening up and the trichs are loading up. Week 5 of flower on 2 white rhinos and a cheese. The 315 is all the light I will ever need. What do i do with the 3 other lights now  lol


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## Underground Scientist (Jan 24, 2018)

gwheels said:


> The buds are fattening up and the trichs are loading up. Week 5 of flower on 2 white rhinos and a cheese. The 315 is all the light I will ever need. What do i do with the 3 other lights now  lol


Where'd you get your genetics? Looking great!


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## gwheels (Jan 24, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Where'd you get your genetics? Looking great!


Canuck seeds. I bought a bunch when they went on sale. After this round in a couple of weeks I am going to use up my auto freebies. 2 auto amnesia (white russian auto) and a cheese and one of the kush autos i have left.


I will growlog 4 autos under a 3100 CMH in a 4 x 4 when i get it started. These are 4 footers too so they should be nice.

The seed hoard is going strong. I have Jack Herer, Train Wreck, Raw Diesel, King Tut, Sour Kush, Cheese, White Rhino and Northern Lights in fem seeds left. I should be good for a couple of years at 3 or4 plants a cycle


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## Underground Scientist (Jan 24, 2018)

gwheels said:


> Canuck seeds. I bought a bunch when they went on sale. After this round in a couple of weeks I am going to use up my auto freebies. 2 auto amnesia (white russian auto) and a cheese and one of the kush autos i have left.
> The seed hoard is going strong. I have Jack Herer, Train Wreck, Raw Diesel, King Tut, Sour Kush, Cheese, White Rhino and Northern Lights in fem seeds left. I should be good for a couple of years at 3 or4 plants a cycle


That's awesome.

I've run some PeakSeedsBC and NorthernSkunk is my favorite. I'm testing out Jordan of the Islands God's AK-47 and Blue Cheese. Blue Cheese is going to pop the CMH cherry in about 2 Weeks. 

I've been looking to what might be next, but I really want to do NorthernSkunk further justice and see what these JOTI strains have in em. But I've decided that Emerald City Cookies by RedEye is on the menu.


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## gr865 (Jan 25, 2018)

Day 62 and I am done!

Looking like I will get about half to 3/4 of last grows weight, They are just not heavy wet like the last ones. Numbers 1 & 2 were fairly heavy, number 3 was extremely light and fluffy. 
Her are a few pics of the harvest.
#2





Prior trim





Trimmed 





Just a couple of the ladies prior to trim, this was the highest yielder wet weight wise and the nicest buds





#4, very nice looking plant, but the buds were very tight, yet just doesn't seem to have any weight.






Sorry I did not take that many pics during harvest as I normally would but not only was I just coming down with a cold, I also had back spasms so fucking bad I almost shut it down multiple times, but I am out of oil. I was hoping to use some of this harvest to add THC to the remains of the last two grows. I will be making a small batch of oil tomorrow, from some of the remains of the last two grows.That should do until this grow is cured and can be added to the remainder of the last growse some of this harvest to add THC to the remains of the last two grows. 

Well being as how it has been two weeks since I ran out of oil, on my 1/20 low dosage maintenance dose, tonight I took 3/4 gram of oil orally. 

I am extremely high at present!!! 

Oh yeah, just put the clones in the tent today,from the T5's to the 315's. Pics when I am sober! 

Thanks for following along with this, it has been fun.
GR

Using my drying rack now for all the harvest. They should be going in jars by Saturday.


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## gr865 (Jan 25, 2018)

Here the clones are in the tent, 4 of LSD #1 and 1 LSD #3. There is a mystery LSD in there also. It is not in the pic, it was one my buddy that I gave some clones too that he could not get started. It has not been topped, thinking of running it in soil to build a mother.




















Will be going 12/12 in a week or so.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 25, 2018)

I get to the man cave and find this so I did a quick flush and can only thing the tea went bad .....so pissed so I turned the 600 off


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 25, 2018)

Heat stress? This was the only 3 plants under the 600 looking like this. All opinions are needed


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## genuity (Jan 25, 2018)

Looks like some type of root problem?
Temps of water?
What kind of tea?
What kind of light temps?


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 25, 2018)

I was afraid of that.. if it spreads to the last two I'll chop and start over


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 25, 2018)

I might. Chop and start over


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Jan 25, 2018)

Hey all- just canvassing to see what folks think this might be- deficiency? Currently running foxfarms, roots organics, orca, calmag, phd to 6.3, ec about 1.1 to 1.3 (1100-1300 us). I picked up some dr repair micro nutes and mammoth p (iron), just in the advent it's a metals issue?? Select leaves only at this point. While i realize this clone is way overdue for transplanting (just taken care of that actually), i don't think that's the issue and not too worried, as i saw this on my last run on the same strain and wasn't a major issue.... it seems like some older growth has an almost iridescent dark blue color as a precursor...

More early stage:
 

More progressive:
 


More late stage:


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## gr865 (Jan 25, 2018)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> I might. Chop and start over


Sorry bud, get off your butt, get the new grow going, correct the problems and produce some fine product.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Jan 26, 2018)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> View attachment 4079168 I get to the man cave and find this so I did a quick flush and can only thing the tea went bad .....so pissed so I turned the 600 off


Ouch. Ummmmm... H2O? I'd try what ever you're going to try, and then call it......


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 26, 2018)

I chopped the ones that were fucked . Thank God I have a second grow on separate system


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 26, 2018)

Root rot and the water temperature did me in.


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## Underground Scientist (Jan 27, 2018)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Root rot and the water temperature did me in.


I was prepared to do DWC, and thought about RDWC, but decided against it because I wasn't prepared to buy a chiller.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 27, 2018)

It was my fault, power went out for some reason, exhaust fan did not come on so by the time I got there it was to late. I got the heat out and cold everything off. The next day 4 out of the 5 plants came back. I thought I was in the clear but the following day 2more took a turn for the worse. I did a water change pH 5.5 for two days and still nothing. So it hurt me to chop them but it's had to be done. The other 2 are doing well.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 27, 2018)

as we move forward


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## frontline (Jan 29, 2018)

pinner420 said:


> So if you have a single ballast and two cord sets you flip from one room to the other. With some of the soft start circuits in the new digital balasts i know it to be an issue.


I just bought cmh ballast by growlite , does not play well with my flip box .


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## DCobeen (Jan 31, 2018)

Okay made it to oct 5th. got 120 plus pages to go. So far the 315's are killing it. I now have 2 and a cmh 400 with 1000 watt super hps going. It will all be lec from here on after I can afford to get 10 more lec 315 lights to replace 4 1000 watt lights. Going for the par which means yield and density.
I see allot of great grows so far. Gettingtired of hearing Cob ect as I want to see lec grows.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 31, 2018)

Dcobeen welcome to the new world


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## DCobeen (Jan 31, 2018)

okay site bot ugly on page 53 gonna fast forward 10 pages and hopefully it stopped.


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## DCobeen (Jan 31, 2018)

Okay I got a couple and see how they are doing. I am gonna replace 4k of 1000 watt lights with 12 315 watt lec so 3800 watts and I bet I do 20-30 percent more yield with better quality. I am gonna fast forward to the end and go back 10 pages tomorrow.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 31, 2018)

This is my first time running cmh and loving it. I'm also dialing in on my tea brewing with my ebb&flowad dwc


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## DOOZY (Feb 1, 2018)

3000k 315w cmh. Coco + teas.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Feb 1, 2018)

DOOZY said:


> View attachment 4082587 3000k 315w cmh. Coco + teas.


Now that's a sexy lady


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## Javadog (Feb 1, 2018)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> I might. Chop and start over


Sorry to hear this. I was reminded of finding a lady int he back of my tent that had just been missed
when the watering happened.....like she is dry as a bone. Def a nute shock, I am thinking.


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## DCobeen (Feb 1, 2018)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Dcobeen welcome to the new world


Thanks I been using a cmh 400 for years. I needed a better light for my low ceilings and these 315 lec lights fit the bill.


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## DCobeen (Feb 1, 2018)

I must say you all are killing it with the LEC lights. Doc uses some also (630 lec). Its nice seeing diff ways you all are using them.When I get all 315 lec's in my rooms then I can post what they do. I am just now switching to them and it takes time as I am not a rich man.


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## gwheels (Feb 1, 2018)

I have tried a few substandard lights. A mars reflector and a 550 watt MCOB and the 315 shows me what can be done. I am getting to a point of higher learning but good gear makes it easier. Get a 315 CMH and a 3 x 3 tent and you will never look back. COBs are great and the new samsung gear looks great but a 315....I know it works great

We have a 4 plant constraint. And very high electricity costs.

My last 2 runs with my 315 cost 9.50 per ounce.


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## gr865 (Feb 1, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> okay site bot ugly on page 53 gonna fast forward 10 pages and hopefully it stopped.


That happens, have been trolled and I hate that shit.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Feb 1, 2018)

I'm just glad buckuncle isn't trolling this thread...


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## DOOZY (Feb 1, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> I must say you all are killing it with the LEC lights. Doc uses some also (630 lec). Its nice seeing diff ways you all are using them.When I get all 315 lec's in my rooms then I can post what they do. I am just now switching to them and it takes time as I am not a rich man.


I got my 3 balast on alibaba for 324 dollars delivered. There digi and adjustable


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## DOOZY (Feb 1, 2018)

my tent vegging ghost og,ghost train haze, wedding cake, mango , girl scout cookies. Also 315w.


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 1, 2018)

DOOZY said:


> I got my 3 balast on alibaba for 324 dollars delivered. There digi and adjustable


I bet you'd be into each legit vertical setup for $350 each. As many as he's talking, that's some bucks. Kinda reminds me of how I feel when I bought plenty of gear that were part of my education, and now I'm like... Wish I would've just bought CMH to begin with, along with plenty more grow room lessons.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 1, 2018)

In the tests I have posted in this thread since 18 months ago it is apparent that the 315 cmh combined with hps at about 2/3 hps to 1/3 cmh yields the best results for quality and yield. 

Cmh alone cost me over 30% avg yield in the same space as a 600 hps. 

I drank the coolaid. The natural light sold me immediately. It is much better to see the plants and they look frostier. 

However the hps only grown bud was chosen as more potent in most blind tests. And we like the overlap buds the best. 

And cmh alone yields fluffier leafier buds when compared side by side. 

Too much blue light is not good for our flowers. Just the leaves. 

Sorry. It’s all hype.


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## Javadog (Feb 1, 2018)

What I am most impressed by is how well my 315W CMH tent does 
next to my 600W HPS tent. Not as well, but close enough to impress.

I liked the "500W" suggestion....that seems close.

But I am not running side-by-sides like you are....I would love to run some sort of combo too.

:0)


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## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 1, 2018)

Javadog said:


> What I am most impressed by is how well my 315W CMH tent does
> next to my 600W HPS tent. Not as well, but close enough to impress.
> 
> I liked the "500W" suggestion....that seems close.
> ...



I almost agree. I think about 450 watts of hps intensity with better leaf health and growth but less flower production and less footprint than a 400 hps. 

My whole room exploded with growth and even leaf spot repair when I put the 315 in there in a tight triangle with the 2 600 hps lamps. 

The flowering faded plant on the right greened back up during ripening with no additional fertilizer 

And some of the other hps only stress in the room. seems to go away too. 
 

Great grow bulbs but are what they are. 

What I need to know is what cri cobs matches this spectrum?


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## genuity (Feb 1, 2018)

Side by side with clones.... 315 holds its own with a 600(but it's only 315 watts)... fact.
Seed plants are seed plants..no way to really tell anything.

630lec next to a 600 is doing just fine also...better imho.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Feb 1, 2018)

gwheels said:


> I have tried a few substandard lights. A mars reflector and a 550 watt MCOB and the 315 shows me what can be done. I am getting to a point of higher learning but good gear makes it easier. Get a 315 CMH and a 3 x 3 tent and you will never look back. COBs are great and the new samsung gear looks great but a 315....I know it works great
> 
> We have a 4 plant constraint. And very high electricity costs.
> 
> My last 2 runs with my 315 cost 9.50 per ounce.


I know what you mean,I'm thinking about solar panels for the future


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 1, 2018)

I read this and get excited to use 315w CMH/400w HPS housed in 1 glassless hood. Not sure it's all hype. Are you saying if you put a 315w CMH in the same space as a 600w HPS you get 30% less yield. But you used 48.5% less power. What if you put 2 - 315 CMH at 630w, in a 3x6 space, or individual 3'x3', would the yield per Watt be only 5% more than a 600w HPS in it's ideal space.


MichiganMedGrower said:


> In the tests I have posted in this thread since 18 months ago it is apparent that the 315 cmh combined with hps at about 2/3 hps to 1/3 cmh yields the best results for quality and yield.
> 
> Cmh alone cost me over 30% avg yield in the same space as a 600 hps.
> 
> ...


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Feb 1, 2018)

two 315's& two 600 hps in a 4x8 tent chilling with 8k btu's


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## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 1, 2018)

genuity said:


> Side by side with clones.... 315 holds its own with a 600(but it's only 315 watts)... fact.
> Seed plants are seed plants..no way to really tell anything.
> 
> 630lec next to a 600 is doing just fine also...better imho.



I posted some of this and have told you before. I ran 3 cuttings each from 3 known mother’s 3 times in each configuration. 

Then pulled the 315 out for the summer to be sure of any results I got earlier. 

The hps grew more potent and less leafy buds. 

It is Hortilux super hps so there is some added needed blue light in their spectrum.

The 315 as supplemental helps with compactness some strains shorter ripening times and much more colorful leaves likely due to the fuller spectrum. 

The 600w Hortilux blue out grows the cmh 315 too. But even looser leafier buds. 

I think that it is easier to achieve potential with the cmh than the harder to dial in hps. The plants like less intensity during ripening in my opinion so I back the mature buds away to retain terpenes and help the buds keep growing with less light stress.


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## thccbdhealth (Feb 1, 2018)

Mr.jojodance post: 14050019 said:


> View attachment 4082918 two 315's& two 600 hps in a 4x8 tent chilling with 8k btu's


How do you have the fixtures arranged for equale light distribution?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 1, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> I read this and get excited to use 315w CMH/400w HPS housed in 1 glassless hood. Not sure it's all hype. Are you saying if you put a 315w CMH in the same space as a 600w HPS you get 30% less yield. But you used 48.5% less power. What if you put 2 - 315 CMH at 630w, in a 3x6 space, or individual 3'x3', would the yield per Watt be only 5% more than a 600w HPS in it's ideal space.



Well I said those were my average results with my known plants. The weight was lost mostly in footprint. But also in leafy mid buds and lowers. 

And that is with 30” tall from the pot bushes for reference. 

And of course that is my plants that I was running and that room. And me. There are tons of variables. I had a learning curve with the new 315 at first too. And I had been using the hps a few years perpetually already. 

I do think it will work great alone in a 3x3 tent with a nice 6” exhaust.


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## drgreentm (Feb 1, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> Okay I got a couple and see how they are doing. I am gonna replace 4k of 1000 watt lights with 12 315 watt lec so 3800 watts and I bet I do 20-30 percent more yield with better quality. I am gonna fast forward to the end and go back 10 pages tomorrow.


How big is your room?


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## DCobeen (Feb 2, 2018)

drgreentm said:


> How big is your room?


my big room is 14' x 16' but like to leave fan and moving around room. I think I will use 10' x 12' or so with the 315's. what do you think. I want 3 rows of 4 lights. 16 plants


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## DCobeen (Feb 2, 2018)

I am buying 2-3 lights each month till I have them all but will hang them as they come in and replace another lights with. got me a new cmh 400 bulb today 2100k I will mix match spectrum in the room 5 3100k/ 6 4200k and the 2100 cmh 400.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Feb 2, 2018)

Here's my blue dream and choc mint og, run #2, soil, ff and roots organics with orca microbes, under a single 315w lec. I only ran one of each last time, and going with 4 this round, 5 next round. The blue dream literally smells and tastes like candy/blue berries.. i have yet to see anything that even comes close in quality from dispensaries... YUM! some SERIOUS fire!!

Also, for those wondering about yields using cmh, my last run (first in ~2yrs) i got just under 8oz, so that's 1.23 grams/watt if you use the 315w number, and that's the weight a bit over-dry (after curing) at ~45%rh. Not sure what the actual wattage pull from the wall is... Regardless, feeling pretty proud, being a complete novice and all....


----------



## Underground Scientist (Feb 2, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Here's my blue dream and choc mint og, run #2, soil, ff and roots organics with orca microbes, under a single 315w lec. I only ran one of each last time, and going with 4 this round, 5 next round. The blue dream literally smells and tastes like candy/blue berries.. i have yet to see anything that even comes close in quality from dispensaries... YUM! some SERIOUS fire!!
> 
> Also, for those wondering about yields using cmh, my last run (first in ~2yrs) i got just under 8oz, so that's 1.23 grams/watt if you use the 315w number, and that's the weight a bit over-dry (after curing) at ~45%rh. Not sure what the actual wattage pull from the wall is... Regardless, feeling pretty proud, being a complete novice and all....
> 
> View attachment 4083250


So you're blending FFOF & Roots Organics?


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Feb 2, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> So you're blending FFOF & Roots Organics?


Yep, top-dressing with roots organics and using ff grow big, tiger bloom and big bloom. I also mix my soil using peat moss/perlite/worm castings (roots org big worm) at about a ratio of 50/30/20


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Feb 2, 2018)

7gal smartpots


----------



## Canadian Farmer (Feb 2, 2018)

Great comparison video of 4 315’s vs 4 1K HPS


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## genuity (Feb 2, 2018)

Canadian Farmer said:


> Great comparison video of 4 315’s vs 4 1K HPS


Definitely update the next vid.... nice


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## DCobeen (Feb 2, 2018)

he has 4k worth of hps vs 1260 watts of LEC and lec rocked it good. if he had double the 315 lights in there they would have beet the hps easy.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Feb 2, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Here's my blue dream and choc mint og, run #2, soil, ff and roots organics with orca microbes, under a single 315w lec. I only ran one of each last time, and going with 4 this round, 5 next round. The blue dream literally smells and tastes like candy/blue berries.. i have yet to see anything that even comes close in quality from dispensaries... YUM! some SERIOUS fire!!
> 
> Also, for those wondering about yields using cmh, my last run (first in ~2yrs) i got just under 8oz, so that's ~0.8 grams/watt if you use the 315w number, and that's the weight a bit over-dry (after curing) at ~45%rh. Not sure what the actual wattage pull from the wall is, so this is conservative estimate on g/w... Regardless, feeling pretty proud, being a complete novice and all....
> 
> View attachment 4083250


----------



## genuity (Feb 2, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> he has 4k worth of hps vs 1260 watts of LEC and lec rocked it good. if he had double the 315 lights in there they would have beet the hps easy.


Badass..


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Feb 2, 2018)

My gram/watt math was wrong- I was at ~0.8 g/w, not 1.23.... lol


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## DCobeen (Feb 2, 2018)

genuity said:


> Badass..


Doc has been telling me to switch to LEC for a bit now. I finally listened and am happy I am. I am gonna have to bust my ass to get lights ordered faster. Its a win win to me.


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## DCobeen (Feb 2, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> My gram/watt math was wrong- I was at ~0.8 g/w, not 1.23.... lol


That lec side did amazing. you gonna add couple more lights in there?


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Feb 2, 2018)

thccbdhealth said:


> How do you have the fixtures arranged for equale light distribution?


I use the cmh at 18 inches above the canapy. I only use the 600's after the two week stretch at flip


----------



## thccbdhealth (Feb 2, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower11121190dividedt: 14051221 said:


> Here's my blueam and choc mint og, run #2, soil, ff and roots organics with orca microbes, under a single 315w lec. I only ran one of each last time, and going with 4 this round, 5 next round. The blue dream literally smells and tastes like candy/blue berries.. i have yet to see anything that even comes close in quality from dispensaries... YUM! some SERIOUS fire!!
> 
> Also, for those wondering about yields using cmh, my last run (first in ~2yrs) i got just under 8oz, so that's 1.23 grams/watt if you use the 315w number, and that's the weight a bit over-dry (after curing) at ~45%rh. Not sure what the actual wattage pull from the wall is... Regardless, feeling pretty proud, being a complete novice and all....
> 
> View attachment 4083250


Your math is out to lunch....

8 oz- 224 / 315cmh = 0.71111111
my first run with the bulb was 302g/315cmh=0.9487

And yet there are others getting 448g a bulb for 1.422222


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## thccbdhealth (Feb 2, 2018)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> I use the cmh at 18 inches above the canapy. I only use the 600's after the two week stretch at flip



And after stench your running the 4 bulbs?
I was initially asking about fixture layout..spacing/distribution.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Feb 3, 2018)

thccbdhealth said:


> Your math is out to lunch....
> 
> 8 oz- 224 / 315cmh = 0.71111111
> my first run with the bulb was 302g/315cmh=0.9487
> ...


All numbers revised, came in just under *9oz at proper humidity (~55% rh at ~65° f). 

PSA: don't weigh after homebrews and homegrown...


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## DCobeen (Feb 3, 2018)

here is a great tool I found.
https://www.sunlightsupply.com/tools/lighting-tool
it has the 315 lec and for my area if I do a 10x10 its 9 lights and 12 if I do a 10x12 food for thought.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Feb 3, 2018)

thccbdhealth said:


> And after stench your running the 4 bulbs?
> I was initially asking about fixture layout..spacing/distribution.


Yes. The layout is from left to right
600, 315,600,315 and the AC pumping from the top down


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## DCobeen (Feb 3, 2018)

I agree use the bulbs you got as you replace them. For me its I wont be burning my plants anymore when they get the perfect height.


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## AbeFroman (Feb 4, 2018)

Here is my current grow in a 5x5 with a 630W LEC a week into flower. I have been using the light for abut 3 years now. I started a 2lbs challenge grow journal thread if anybody is interested in following.

A few things I have learned to do when I used these is train the plants to have as even of a canopy as possible as low as possible if you have limited vertical space. By limited I mean, I still have 8 foot ceilings and I try and keep them low using lst, supercropping, etc. I also use short and wide 5 gallon Hempy containers.

This light has been the best investment to date. The bud quality is the best I have ever grown.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Feb 4, 2018)

Sgrog ready!


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## pinner420 (Feb 4, 2018)




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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Feb 4, 2018)

It hurts to see root rot after veg and it hurts even more to cut them down. But after making an executive decision I will start to flower the remaining 27. No time to recover so I'll try again next time


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## DCobeen (Feb 5, 2018)

pinner420 said:


> View attachment 4084479


interesting way to to vert lights. how is your yield?


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## DCobeen (Feb 5, 2018)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> It hurts to see root rot after veg and it hurts even more to cut them down. But after making an executive decision I will start to flower the remaining 27. No time to recover so I'll try again next time


in 2014 my AIS run I lost a plant to root rot also. The plant died but was lucky to get buds ect for Making Bubble/kief. sucks when you get nothing.


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## pinner420 (Feb 6, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> interesting way to to vert lights. how is your yield?


20 to 36 zs; no big problems this run keeping my fingers crossed.


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## DCobeen (Feb 6, 2018)

pinner420 said:


> 20 to 36 zs; no big problems this run keeping my fingers crossed.


you got a room pic that shows it running full? That has my brain working.


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## pinner420 (Feb 6, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> you got a room pic that shows it running full? That has my brain working.


Like this...


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## DCobeen (Feb 7, 2018)

nice how many plants you put in there?


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## pinner420 (Feb 7, 2018)

2 In a 6 x 12. Ive tried more but it's tricky in a small room like that.


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## DCobeen (Feb 7, 2018)

that's a nice pull from 2 plants. I'm gonna have to try that one day.


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## Javadog (Feb 7, 2018)

That Black Rose has a 3" trunk, or so it seems, Pinner. Awesome!


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Feb 7, 2018)

"20 Zs, +/- a pound...." nbd...


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## DCobeen (Feb 7, 2018)

he puts light everywhere towards them. I really what to try that. I think this summer might work.


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## chomchom (Feb 7, 2018)

Hello everyone, late to the party here. I’m starting my second grow in a 5x5 after harvesting this crop last November. The first grow went really well, despite being out of town a lot. I vegged under one 315 but I was underpowered when I started flowering. I got a second 315 and realized about 1.25 lbs. Good learning experience for sure. I have been growing things all my life, a professional farmer and we grow fruits and veggies for our table too. I’ve grown indoors before, but years ago when the technology sucked and the Internet was useless. I was amazed to see all the innovation after jumping back in after 20 years, you guys have been busy! There’s some really talented growers here. 

I’m growing in soil, used 5 gal smart pots last time and this time I think I’ll use 7. I also want to change the lighting a bit. The footprint of these 315’s is awkward for 5x5. I’m considering putting together a 48” COB to provide some light on one end of the tent and slide the 315’s over some. I can also do much better with pruning and training but still thinking of adding some light. They got away from me a little last time and I was in Asia quite a bit but home for all the milestones. My wife no like to prune - or trim, damn it. But man she can vape mad nugs.... She’s a great gardener and this crop would’ve flopped without her, since I was gone for day to day care. 

This is a NY Diesel. We also grew Critcal Mass and Tutankhamen, oh and a bag seed, no fems, no auto. The bag plant was killa. I just used what I had, but I’ve got more seeds on their way for starting my cloning program. It was all really good stuff. The Tut was delish, the Diesel was sorta funky but fun nonetheless. This time I’ve got Afghan, Mickey Kush, Cheese, and OGK. And moneymaker. All random stuff I was given or collected, and I’ll take some cuttings this time and have a little 2x4 setup w T5’s ready to go. 

These were at 45 days. I came home from ‘Nam and tried some supercropping; my wife def won’t do that. She’d let the lights scorch em before she’ll bend a plant, but it worked really well, solved my height issues. 

Thanks for all your contributions, I’ve benefitted a lot.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Feb 7, 2018)

Lookin good @chomchom !!


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## DCobeen (Feb 8, 2018)

@chomchom I would put the Cob light in the middle of the 2 315's. or just add another 315.


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## genuity (Feb 8, 2018)

chomchom said:


> Hello everyone, late to the party here. I’m starting my second grow in a 5x5 after harvesting this crop last November. The first grow went really well, despite being out of town a lot. I vegged under one 315 but I was underpowered when I started flowering. I got a second 315 and realized about 1.25 lbs. Good learning experience for sure. I have been growing things all my life, a professional farmer and we grow fruits and veggies for our table too. I’ve grown indoors before, but years ago when the technology sucked and the Internet was useless. I was amazed to see all the innovation after jumping back in after 20 years, you guys have been busy! There’s some really talented growers here.
> 
> I’m growing in soil, used 5 gal smart pots last time and this time I think I’ll use 7. I also want to change the lighting a bit. The footprint of these 315’s is awkward for 5x5. I’m considering putting together a 48” COB to provide some light on one end of the tent and slide the 315’s over some. I can also do much better with pruning and training but still thinking of adding some light. They got away from me a little last time and I was in Asia quite a bit but home for all the milestones. My wife no like to prune - or trim, damn it. But man she can vape mad nugs.... She’s a great gardener and this crop would’ve flopped without her, since I was gone for day to day care.
> 
> ...


Beautiful. .


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 8, 2018)

chomchom said:


> Hello everyone, late to the party here. I’m starting my second grow in a 5x5 after harvesting this crop last November. The first grow went really well, despite being out of town a lot. I vegged under one 315 but I was underpowered when I started flowering. I got a second 315 and realized about 1.25 lbs. Good learning experience for sure. I have been growing things all my life, a professional farmer and we grow fruits and veggies for our table too. I’ve grown indoors before, but years ago when the technology sucked and the Internet was useless. I was amazed to see all the innovation after jumping back in after 20 years, you guys have been busy! There’s some really talented growers here.
> 
> I’m growing in soil, used 5 gal smart pots last time and this time I think I’ll use 7. I also want to change the lighting a bit. The footprint of these 315’s is awkward for 5x5. I’m considering putting together a 48” COB to provide some light on one end of the tent and slide the 315’s over some. I can also do much better with pruning and training but still thinking of adding some light. They got away from me a little last time and I was in Asia quite a bit but home for all the milestones. My wife no like to prune - or trim, damn it. But man she can vape mad nugs.... She’s a great gardener and this crop would’ve flopped without her, since I was gone for day to day care.
> 
> ...


Hey,

How many 5 gal pots did you use in that 5x5? I'm going to be running a similar setup, but I was thinking of shrinking it to a 5x4 with a strip dedicated to environmental controls.


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## chomchom (Feb 8, 2018)

Thanks y’all.

@DCobeen, if the 315 is about a 3x3 footprint, then I’m good one way across but I’m missing a little coverage on the edges. I kinda knew that going in but I oversized the tent a bit for crap like cirxularion fans, variac, and whatever else I didn’t know I needed. The lights can’t really cover the width of that tent on either side of a COB either. That said, these lights make for some extremely happy plants. Color, vigor, short nodes. And it works as is, but I think there’s some room for improvement with the light situation. Anởther 315 in there still doesn’t quite provide even coverage and would just be too hot.

Here’s a shot of early flower. 



@Underground Scientist, I had 7 in there. Like you, I figured extra space wouldn’t hurt. They fill that space, and an overwhelming desire for wall to wall tasty buds swells in your heart, eclipsing previous schemes.... Overall I think having room to work and for gear is helpful. At this point only the Variac on a small stool remain on my floor; I’ve cleared the decks for cannabis.

This time I’ll be home and will apply myself to canopy management. Eventually here I’ll use this tent for veg and will build out an actual room for flowering.

Cheers all-

Chôm


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 8, 2018)

chomchom said:


> Thanks y’all.
> 
> @DCobeen, if the 315 is about a 3x3 footprint, then I’m good one way across but I’m missing a little coverage on the edges. I kinda knew that going in but I oversized the tent a bit for crap like cirxularion fans, variac, and whatever else I didn’t know I needed. The lights can’t really cover the width of that tent on either side of a COB either. That said, these lights make for some extremely happy plants. Color, vigor, short nodes. And it works as is, but I think there’s some room for improvement with the light situation. Anởther 315 in there still doesn’t quite provide even coverage and would just be too hot.
> 
> ...


I'm trying something a little unique. I assume you have the sun systems vertical mount for each LEC. I modded a Sunsystems Dominator XXL Hood to accept dual bulbs and took the glass out. I'm almost certain I can cover a 5x4 space with it, even if I have to keep it at 18". I can keep the environment to a nice 76-78 degrees. Phillips bulbs and Prism ballasts. I do have a mover and will use it if necessary.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Feb 8, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> I'm trying something a little unique. I assume you have the sun systems vertical mount for each LEC. I modded a Sunsystems Dominator XXL Hood to accept dual bulbs and took the glass out. I'm almost certain I can cover a 5x4 space with it, even if I have to keep it at 18". I can keep the environment to a nice 76-78 degrees. Phillips bulbs and Prism ballasts. I do have a mover and will use it if necessary.


I have a portable AC and I'm just wondering how far from the exhaust point I can be without installing a booster, then sizing the booster. Thinking like 20' of 6" line.


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 8, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> I have a portable AC and I'm just wondering how far from the exhaust point I can be without installing a booster, then sizing the booster. Thinking like 20' of 6" line.


I'm using an 8,000 btu portable, but cold air intake in winter with 6" active air inline with bug guarded intake and exhaust, set on a thermostat.


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 8, 2018)

chomchom said:


> Thanks y’all.
> 
> @DCobeen, if the 315 is about a 3x3 footprint, then I’m good one way across but I’m missing a little coverage on the edges. I kinda knew that going in but I oversized the tent a bit for crap like cirxularion fans, variac, and whatever else I didn’t know I needed. The lights can’t really cover the width of that tent on either side of a COB either. That said, these lights make for some extremely happy plants. Color, vigor, short nodes. And it works as is, but I think there’s some room for improvement with the light situation. Anởther 315 in there still doesn’t quite provide even coverage and would just be too hot.
> 
> ...


How long did you veg? Those look pretty tall.


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## chomchom (Feb 8, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> I'm using an 8,000 btu portable, but cold air intake in winter with 6" active air inline with bug guarded intake and exhaust, set on a thermostat.


Ya limited portable AC experience here, but I did use one for that grow. 20’ seems pretty far based on my recollection of the manufacture rec.


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## chomchom (Feb 8, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> I'm trying something a little unique. I assume you have the sun systems vertical mount for each LEC. I modded a Sunsystems Dominator XXL Hood to accept dual bulbs and took the glass out. I'm almost certain I can cover a 5x4 space with it, even if I have to keep it at 18". I can keep the environment to a nice 76-78 degrees. Phillips bulbs and Prism ballasts. I do have a mover and will use it if necessary.


Well that’s cool. Lookin forward to hearing how that goes. I’m sure you’ll get great results with two Philips bulbs, they love this light. I run it high for veg and well, you saw how tall they got. That was 7 weeks I think and there were some sativas in there. So I was still 24”+ off thr lamp in flower, but supercropped some to keep a good margin. Canopy was uneven, that was my biggest take home. Best. Of luck w your grow


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## DCobeen (Feb 9, 2018)

@oldman60 hey this is the 315 thread since you got a 315 also come check out what these growers are doing with them. Impressive for sure.


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## DCobeen (Feb 9, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> I'm trying something a little unique. I assume you have the sun systems vertical mount for each LEC. I modded a Sunsystems Dominator XXL Hood to accept dual bulbs and took the glass out. I'm almost certain I can cover a 5x4 space with it, even if I have to keep it at 18". I can keep the environment to a nice 76-78 degrees. Phillips bulbs and Prism ballasts. I do have a mover and will use it if necessary.


That should work post pics and progress. I have a xxxl hood and would love to put couple 315 in it. My 315 lec are cheap topogrow ones with same warrenty as most. I need 12 of them so I had to buy cheaper ones so I can get it going faster.


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 9, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> That should work post pics and progress. I have a xxxl hood and would love to put couple 315 in it. My 315 lec are cheap topogrow ones with same warrenty as most. I need 12 of them so I had to buy cheaper ones so I can get it going faster.


How cheap, I felt like $200 with a phillips bulb without hood was cheap. The Sunsystems Vert is $150. Dominator hood is $150. I was just lucky enough to have a junk cool tube to rob a cord off. The mod was easy peasy and would be no problem to remove.


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## DCobeen (Feb 9, 2018)

$180 complete with free shipping. even has hanging straps which saves you $5
https://www.ebay.com/itm/TopoGrow-315W-CMH-Grow-Light-Kit-W-3100K-Bulb-120V-240V-120V-Plug-Full-Spectrum/253309421473?epid=15011300602&hash=item3afa6b07a1:g:9twAAOSwh1paMIcR


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## oldman60 (Feb 11, 2018)

Thunder Trix under a 315 along with NL x Chronic and Lambsbread.


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## DCobeen (Feb 12, 2018)

my next 3 315 lec will be here tomorrow.


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 12, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> my next 3 315 lec will be here tomorrow.


I think the 2 I have coming will be here Wednesday. Setup my new 5x5 today. 

Still undecided if I want to put the portable AC in the tent or leave it next to it cooling the room to 65 and running the exhaust fan enough to draw out warm air and intake cool air. I need to run a carbon filter. What's the alternative, running an inline hooked to the carbon filter inside the tent open air so it just circulates through it?

Then I gotta figure out humidification where I'm not filling ultrasonics everyday.


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## chomchom (Feb 12, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> I think the 2 I have coming will be here Wednesday. Setup my new 5x5 today.
> 
> Still undecided if I want to put the portable AC in the tent or leave it next to it cooling the room to 65 and running the exhaust fan enough to draw out warm air and intake cool air. I need to run a carbon filter. What's the alternative, running an inline hooked to the carbon filter inside the tent open air so it just circulates through it?
> 
> Then I gotta figure out humidification where I'm not filling ultrasonics everyday.


That’s what I did, set it up outside the tent w it blowing near the intake for good measure.


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## Alexzheng (Feb 13, 2018)

I installed 2 x 315 in a cheap amazon 4x4 tent, temp is around low 70's with both lights on, I managed to lower temp by cutting and installed a cheap window air conditioner through the tent, use a tarp to cover the excess hole, and duct tape all seams until enclosed, I am growing in a slightly opened garage,so far no ducting required, I am in SoCal.


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## Javadog (Feb 13, 2018)

Looks like a clean start.


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## DCobeen (Feb 13, 2018)

Alexzheng said:


> View attachment 4088975 View attachment 4088974 View attachment 4088973 I installed 2 x 315 in a cheap amazon 4x4 tent, temp is around low 70's with both lights on, I managed to lower temp by cutting and installed a cheap window air conditioner through the tent, use a tarp to cover the excess hole, and duct tape all seams until enclosed, I am growing in a slightly opened garage,so far no ducting required, I am in SoCal.


I would use at least a 400 cfm fan with big carbon filter to scrub air in garage. Don't want neighbors ect knowing you are growing in there aka why does it always smell so good around this garage/house. even if you are legal they can still complain ect.


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## DCobeen (Feb 13, 2018)

got the 3 lights. I want to let all know they are Chinese and I will have an extra complete unit on hand when I get them all hung. Lets see how they stand up to time.


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## oldman60 (Feb 13, 2018)

So far I like the early results in the flower room.


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## DCobeen (Feb 13, 2018)

I got 2 in flower room already and so far they are holding there own. Best thing is no light bleaching like i get with the 1000 watt hid lights. next flip of room is gonna rock.


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## gwheels (Feb 13, 2018)

Alexzheng said:


> View attachment 4088975 View attachment 4088974 View attachment 4088973 I installed 2 x 315 in a cheap amazon 4x4 tent, temp is around low 70's with both lights on, I managed to lower temp by cutting and installed a cheap window air conditioner through the tent, use a tarp to cover the excess hole, and duct tape all seams until enclosed, I am growing in a slightly opened garage,so far no ducting required, I am in SoCal.


Your temps are awesome. Are you way up north or something? 

In my 4 x 4 one 315 puts me to about 78 and a 200 watt vero puts that to 88 and I took it out for that reason


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## bigdaddycannabis (Feb 13, 2018)

Anybody have experience with silver star 315w hoods? 
https://www.growlights.ca/315w-silverstar-cmh-fusion-bright-ballast-system.html
thinking about getting this kit, says it comes with a philips ballast, if anyone has any experience with this light, I'd love to hear your opinion. I cannot find any reviews or grows using this light, but it seems decent to me

thank you


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## Bbcchance (Feb 14, 2018)

I bought the Solis Tek 315, really liking it so far. Went with the 4200 k bulb on a recommendation from a friend, ill know more when I've played with it for a bit more than 1 run


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## DCobeen (Feb 14, 2018)

bigdaddycannabis said:


> Anybody have experience with silver star 315w hoods?
> https://www.growlights.ca/315w-silverstar-cmh-fusion-bright-ballast-system.html
> thinking about getting this kit, says it comes with a philips ballast, if anyone has any experience with this light, I'd love to hear your opinion. I cannot find any reviews or grows using this light, but it seems decent to me
> 
> thank you


looks like a good one. only way to know is buy it and try it.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 14, 2018)

https://growershouse.com/blog/cmh-315w-lamp-comparison-test-data-review/

Phillips 3100k beats other bulbs by 8% average PAR

Ushio has 1% higher uv but is 10% lower in par.

In my side by sides the Phillips lamp yields as much as 30% less than my 600 Hortilux super hps. And the 600 hps pot was chosen as more potent almost every time in our blind testing. 

Wattage is still king. Don’t believe the hype. 

I had posted last year that the cmh grew more potent pot but we removed the cmh from the room and potency and frost were as high or higher each clone run. 

The benefits of the 315 over the hps are it helps keep plants shorter and more compact at the expense of somewhat leafier buds. And it brings out more fall colors and shortens ripening up to a week on some strains. And it keeps plants greener. It also is a low watt easy to use bulb. Too low watt for best results as a single flowering lamp in my opinion. 

The 315 footprint for flowering is also smaller than even a 400 hps at 2.5’ x 2.5’. That is with the ss open vertical reflector made specifically for the bulb at 18”. 

The best buds were grown with both lamps. The 315 cmh is a fantastic supplemental lamp to complete a great flowering spectrum with hps.


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## Schmarmpit (Feb 14, 2018)

I've been running a 315W CMH in a 4x4 for years with great success. I have 2 adjustable height 4ft T5 3000K hanging on either side of my hood for supplemental lighting. I perpetually flower 4 plants fairly short in 3 gallon fabric pots, soil. Always have been very happy with the CMH lighting. 

Recently I just switched up my 3x3 veg tent and went from an 8-bulb 2ft T5 6500K (16,000 lumens @ 192W) to a Philips 210W CMH 4200K T9 (23,000 @ 210W). http://www.lighting.philips.com/main/prof/conventional-lamps-and-tubes/high-intensity-discharge-lamps/ceramic-metal-halide/mastercolor-cdm-t-elite-med-wattage/928601164902_EU/product

The difference in veg is amazing after just a few weeks. They are growing much quicker and bushier than I was expecting. I try to keep a small electric bill and didn't want to go much higher than 200W for the lights in my veg tent. Seems like the 210W CMH is the perfect fit for my setup. Just thought I would let others know this option is out there. I should say that I use Philips CMH ballasts and they have a built in toggle switch for 315W or 210W. I'm sure other brands have a similar option as well. These 210W do not have an "agro" option, but do come in 4200K and 3000K spectrum.


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## genuity (Feb 15, 2018)

Schmarmpit said:


> I've been running a 315W CMH in a 4x4 for years with great success. I have 2 adjustable height 4ft T5 3000K hanging on either side of my hood for supplemental lighting. I perpetually flower 4 plants fairly short in 3 gallon fabric pots, soil. Always have been very happy with the CMH lighting.
> 
> Recently I just switched up my 3x3 veg tent and went from an 8-bulb 2ft T5 6500K (16,000 lumens @ 192W) to a Philips 210W CMH 4200K T9 (23,000 @ 210W). http://www.lighting.philips.com/main/prof/conventional-lamps-and-tubes/high-intensity-discharge-lamps/ceramic-metal-halide/mastercolor-cdm-t-elite-med-wattage/928601164902_EU/product
> 
> The difference in veg is amazing after just a few weeks. They are growing much quicker and bushier than I was expecting. I try to keep a small electric bill and didn't want to go much higher than 200W for the lights in my veg tent. Seems like the 210W CMH is the perfect fit for my setup. Just thought I would let others know this option is out there. I should say that I use Philips CMH ballasts and they have a built in toggle switch for 315W or 210W. I'm sure other brands have a similar option as well. These 210W do not have an "agro" option, but do come in 4200K and 3000K spectrum.


This is very good information ..


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 15, 2018)

New 5'x5' Tent, 6" Carbon Filtered Exhaust with ActiveAir Inline Fan and Speed Controller. 6" Bug Guarded 6" Passive Intake. 2 Blizzard 6" Oscillating Fans. Crap Evaporative Humidifier.

2 x 315 Phillips 3100k Bulbs retrofitted into a Sun Systems Dominator XXXL Hood & Prism Ballasts

24" to Canopy

  

Cool, but I'm 100% Sure I'm going to switch to 2 Vertical Sun Systems Reflectors. I have 1, need one more.

I used my lux meter and the equity of the light intensity isn't to my liking. But this is excellent without a full house of plants.


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 15, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> New 5'x5' Tent, 6" Carbon Filtered Exhaust with ActiveAir Inline Fan and Speed Controller. 6" Bug Guarded 6" Passive Intake. 2 Blizzard 6" Oscillating Fans. Crap Evaporative Humidifier.
> 
> 2 x 315 Phillips 3100k Bulbs retrofitted into a Sun Systems Dominator XXXL Hood & Prism Ballasts
> 
> ...


I'd like it better if I pulled that left bulb mount further left to mirror the right bulb mount...but I'm a symmetry freak


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## DCobeen (Feb 16, 2018)

with the XXXL hood you kinda need 3 315 bulbs as the spread is so big. I have a XXXL hood and it covers a 5x6 area with a 1k bulb at 24 inch over canopy and maxes out LUX app on phone at canopy at those distance with new bulb. I have to go another 6 inch lower or out to get meter to start dropping. Its a huge hood. Do you have a regular hood? or lower it down another 8 inches to 16" over canopy. Tent looks great.


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## Javadog (Feb 16, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> https://growershouse.com/blog/cmh-315w-lamp-comparison-test-data-review/
> 
> Phillips 3100k beats other bulbs by 8% average PAR


I watched that video and then checked on what lamp I am using.

LOL I got lucky and had already bought that Phillips Elite Agro. Whew....no second thoughts. :0)

It is amazing to see my Tangie looking done before a full seven weeks are past.

A few ambers and I will take it....little or no trichs not cloudy already.

JD


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## DCobeen (Feb 16, 2018)

Javadog said:


> I watched that video and then checked on what lamp I am using.
> 
> LOL I got lucky and had already bought that Phillips Elite Agro. Whew....no second thoughts. :0)
> 
> ...


are you saying no cloudy or all cloudy? Maybe I just need more coffee to wake up.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 16, 2018)

Javadog said:


> I watched that video and then checked on what lamp I am using.
> 
> LOL I got lucky and had already bought that Phillips Elite Agro. Whew....no second thoughts. :0)
> 
> ...



I have had a bunch of plants finishing under the 315 that finished in 9 weeks instead of their average 10. 

The results under the 2 Hortilux 600 super hps and the 1 315 LEC together have been fantastic. 

Better than either alone.


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 16, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> with the XXXL hood you kinda need 3 315 bulbs as the spread is so big. I have a XXXL hood and it covers a 5x6 area with a 1k bulb at 24 inch over canopy and maxes out LUX app on phone at canopy at those distance with new bulb. I have to go another 6 inch lower or out to get meter to start dropping. Its a huge hood. Do you have a regular hood? or lower it down another 8 inches to 16" over canopy. Tent looks great.


What do shoot for in lux measurements? That's how I gauge intensity.


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 16, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> with the XXXL hood you kinda need 3 315 bulbs as the spread is so big. I have a XXXL hood and it covers a 5x6 area with a 1k bulb at 24 inch over canopy and maxes out LUX app on phone at canopy at those distance with new bulb. I have to go another 6 inch lower or out to get meter to start dropping. Its a huge hood. Do you have a regular hood? or lower it down another 8 inches to 16" over canopy. Tent looks great.


Honestly, they're really compact and I could use some stretch, which is one reason I put the light a little higher than normal, but the plant growth is immersed in 45,000 - 35,000 lux, I like pushing tops over 60,000 lux, but it's early in the game yet.


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 16, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Honestly, they're really compact and I could use some stretch, which is one reason I put the light a little higher than normal, but the plant growth is immersed in 45,000 - 35,000 lux, I like pushing tops over 60,000 lux, but it's early in the game yet.


I have one Sun Systems Vertical reflector, I'll have another in a week. I plan to switch...for the record. I think that I can grow real efficiently in a 5x4 space with 2 - 315 LEC's. I'll be using the lux meter to measure canopy intensity, maybe T-5 for any low intensity perimeter pockets.


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## dangledo (Feb 17, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> https://growershouse.com/blog/cmh-315w-lamp-comparison-test-data-review/
> 
> Phillips 3100k beats other bulbs by 8% average PAR
> 
> ...


----------



## dangledo (Feb 17, 2018)

Meao Thai week 7. I'm guessing half way there. Hopefully worth the wait.

 


I had zero intentions of going vertical, but 7 days into stretch it was clear she was gonna go crazy. Had to lop a bunch of branches to get her to fit. Limited room at 6 foot ceiling. 20 gallon brute. 2+year old bulb


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## DCobeen (Feb 17, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> I have one Sun Systems Vertical reflector, I'll have another in a week. I plan to switch...for the record. I think that I can grow real efficiently in a 5x4 space with 2 - 315 LEC's. I'll be using the lux meter to measure canopy intensity, maybe T-5 for any low intensity perimeter pockets.


If I added in a t5 I would use ATI Actinic bulb and coral plus one on each side. I have used those bulbs and grown some super dank a couple years back.


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## bigdaddycannabis (Feb 17, 2018)

anyone have experience with fusion bright ballast systems?


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 19, 2018)

Looks like they like the CMH, Day 16 of Flower:


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## chomchom (Feb 19, 2018)

dangledo said:


> Meao Thai week 7. I'm guessing half way there. Hopefully worth the wait.
> 
> View attachment 4091212 View attachment 4091213
> View attachment 4091215
> ...


That should def be worth the wait. I brought back a bunch of seeds from Cambodia and I’ll start them after I harvest this run of indicas. 

Looks good!


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## gwheels (Feb 20, 2018)

This round I really screwed up a few things (didnt clean the rez, ran 2 lights and they produced too much heat and did not adjust the fan right, had issues with my RO machine). My last grow filled the tent and you could not see an autopot. Good excuses eh  Actualy it is true and it will drastically effect yield BUT. Wow the buds on the 3 plants are heavy. The branches on a few are starting to fall over. Chop is Friday I just saw the odd amber trich with my scope so that is good enough for me.
What I can say that is positive is that white rhino and cheese both have a lovely different aroma from what I have grown. The 315 also really made the trichs go nuts compared to my other grows and they are really dense and heavy buds. Look at the frost View attachment 4093117 View attachment 4093117

Day 60 cheese (8 to 9 week flower strain) and it is right on the mark for timing.


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## DCobeen (Feb 20, 2018)

gwheels said:


> View attachment 4093122 View attachment 4093125 This round I really screwed up a few things (didnt clean the rez, ran 2 lights and they produced too much heat and did not adjust the fan right, had issues with my RO machine). Good excuses eh  Actualy it is true and it will drastically effect yield BUT. Wow the buds on the 3 plants are heavy. The branches on a few are starting to fall over. Chop is Friday I just saw the odd amber trich with my scope so that is good enough for me.
> What I can say that is positive is that white rhino and cheese both have a lovely different aroma from what I have grown. The 315 also really made the trichs go nuts compared to my other grows and they are really dense and heavy buds. Look at the frost View attachment 4093117 View attachment 4093117
> 
> Day 60 cheese (8 to 9 week flower strain) and it is right on the mark for timing.


at least you know what to change. we all have grown un happy plants. I know I have.


----------



## chomchom (Feb 20, 2018)

gwheels said:


> View attachment 4093122 View attachment 4093125 This round I really screwed up a few things (didnt clean the rez, ran 2 lights and they produced too much heat and did not adjust the fan right, had issues with my RO machine). My last grow filled the tent and you could not see an autopot. Good excuses eh  Actualy it is true and it will drastically effect yield BUT. Wow the buds on the 3 plants are heavy. The branches on a few are starting to fall over. Chop is Friday I just saw the odd amber trich with my scope so that is good enough for me.
> What I can say that is positive is that white rhino and cheese both have a lovely different aroma from what I have grown. The 315 also really made the trichs go nuts compared to my other grows and they are really dense and heavy buds. Look at the frost View attachment 4093117 View attachment 4093117
> 
> Day 60 cheese (8 to 9 week flower strain) and it is right on the mark for timing.


That’s farming for ya. Nothing like making a mistake on several hundred acres. I’d have to wait years sometimes for a do over with perennials. There’s always a bright spot tho...besides the learning.


----------



## BecauseIgotHigh (Feb 22, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I have had a bunch of plants finishing under the 315 that finished in 9 weeks instead of their average 10.
> 
> The results under the 2 Hortilux 600 super hps and the 1 315 LEC together have been fantastic.
> 
> Better than either alone.


Hey Michigan,

So would you prefer using 4 x 315 LEC or 2 x 1K HPS in a 8X8?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 22, 2018)

BecauseIgotHigh said:


> Hey Michigan,
> 
> So would you prefer using 4 x 315 LEC or 2 x 1K HPS in a 8X8?



Those aren’t enough to cover 8’ x 8’. 

I use 2 600’s for 3.5’ x 7’. And the 315 covers 2.5 x 2.5. 

I would want and will set up in next space. 2 600 hps with 1 315 LEC in the middle over a 4’ x 8’ space. 

So for your 8x8 I would use 4 600’s and 2 315’s. 

Or 6-8 315’s would work well too. Or 4 600’s. 

1000 watt hps covers about 5 x 5. 

These numbers are for single ended bulbs. Double ended bulbs cover more but need more height. 

I keep my lamps 16”-18” over the canopy for the coverage.


----------



## gr865 (Feb 22, 2018)

Using two 315's in my 4x4, in actually I am only using 3/4 of my tent, ventilation and fan take up the other 1/4. For a 8x8 I would use 6 - 315's. That would be a bit of overkill but not much and 4 - 315's I don't think will give you what you want. I think that would be a TIT's grow.
It is said that a 315 CMH is the equivalent of 500 W's of HPS, so if that is the case you would have 3,000 W of light, using only 1,890 W's. 
You just need to do the math of the different options.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 22, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Using two 315's in my 4x4, in actually I am only using 3/4 of my tent, ventilation and fan take up the other 1/4. For a 8x8 I would use 6 - 315's. That would be a bit of overkill but not much and 4 - 315's I don't think will give you what you want. I think that would be a TIT's grow.
> It is said that a 315 CMH is the equivalent of 500 W's of HPS, so if that is the case you would have 3,000 W of light, using only 1,890 W's.
> You just need to do the math of the different options.



Plants even at the 3’ edge under the sun system vertical reflector with the Phillips 315 3100k bulb which has the highest par of all of them lean in to the center to get more light. 

I would definitely want 2 for a 4x4 but really 3 x 6 seems ideal.


----------



## gr865 (Feb 22, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Plants even at the 3’ edge under the sun system vertical reflector with the Phillips 315 3100k bulb which has the highest par of all of them lean in to the center to get more light.
> 
> I would definitely want 2 for a 4x4 but really 3 x 6 seems ideal.


Yes I agree, this is my first horizontal run with the two 315's and I have them tied down but they still lean in a bit, but my plants did that when I 400W HPS. There a falloff at a given point, i don't know anything about par or that light stuff, lol. Just what is working for me.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Feb 22, 2018)

Ok so given a 4x8 
Would you advise to go with 3 315cmh's 
3100,4200,3100k? 

Or with 2 600w hortilux super hps with a cmh centered between them?


----------



## oldman60 (Feb 22, 2018)

I'm using 2 600's with a 315 between and it seems to be working quite well.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 22, 2018)

thccbdhealth said:


> Ok so given a 4x8
> Would you advise to go with 3 315cmh's
> 3100,4200,3100k?
> 
> Or with 2 600w hortilux super hps with a cmh centered between them?



I have not tested multiple 315’s but I plan to do 2 600’s with the LEC in the middle next room build. 

I have to insulate and heat my open basement first. 

Otherwise I think 3 315 3100k would be best for flowering 4x8. Maybe 4. The penetration is also much less with the 315 than the Hortilux 600 hps. 

I can get about 2 feet of dense buds down with 600 w hps. Only about a foot to 18” down for 315 LEC. That is comparing 1 lamp only. Can’t say how overlapping will change that. 

Most of my yield loss from using only the 315 vs. the 600 was from lower bud production. The tops were nice and big with both lamps.


----------



## gr865 (Feb 22, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Using two 315's in my 4x4, in actually I am only using 3/4 of my tent, ventilation and fan take up the other 1/4. For a 8x8 I would use 6 - 315's. That would be a bit of overkill but not much and 4 - 315's I don't think will give you what you want. I think that would be a TIT's grow.
> It is said that a 315 CMH is the equivalent of 500 W's of HPS, so if that is the case you would have 3,000 W of light, using only 1,890 W's.
> You just need to do the math of the different options.


I am sorry I was wrong, for an 8 x 8 I believe you will need 8 - 315's. And the height varies, I run mine at around 18" in flower, Merlin runs his 50,000 sq ft commercial grow much higher. So you will have around 4,000 W of light in you tent. I think that would kill it dude.
This is current grow, taken yesterday @ 23 days into 12/12, a true frost factory.
 
That's under 2- 315's @ 18", coco and drip DTW.
GR


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## DCobeen (Feb 23, 2018)

thccbdhealth said:


> Ok so given a 4x8
> Would you advise to go with 3 315cmh's
> 3100,4200,3100k?
> 
> Or with 2 600w hortilux super hps with a cmh centered between them?


each light covers a 2x3 area perfect so 4 is the min and 6 is perfect for a 4x8 tent.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Feb 23, 2018)

Where do you get a 2x3 foor print?

My current 315cmh is vertical in an 18"x18" hood..


----------



## DCobeen (Feb 23, 2018)

thccbdhealth said:


> Where do you get a 2x3 foor print?
> 
> My current 315cmh is vertical in an 18"x18" hood..


what does a 18 x 18 vert have to do with a coverage? are you doing vertical if so sorry.


----------



## Bad Karma (Feb 23, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> each light covers a 2x3 area perfect so 4 is the min and 6 is perfect for a 4x8 tent.


They cover a 3x3 area each, this has been well documented.


----------



## Javadog (Feb 23, 2018)

I manage in a 4' square tent too. But BK is quite right.


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## DCobeen (Feb 23, 2018)

Okay cool I been placing then for 2x3 so i can change that to 3x3 cool. I right now have 12 of them and will have 24 in 4 weeks to do my whole grow area. which means I will have even better par so I am gonna keep them adjusted for 2x3 which means bigger yield I hope. Or am i wrong? I have been wrong before and will again I am sure.


----------



## gr865 (Feb 24, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> what does a 18 x 18 vert have to do with a coverage? are you doing vertical if so sorry.


His is like mine, my Nanolux 315 has a hood with the bulb mounted vertical.


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## Underground Scientist (Feb 24, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> Okay cool I been placing then for 2x3 so i can change that to 3x3 cool. I right now have 12 of them and will have 24 in 4 weeks to do my whole grow area. which means I will have even better par so I am gonna keep them adjusted for 2x3 which means bigger yield I hope. Or am i wrong? I have been wrong before and will again I am sure.


The vert hoods have square coverage is all. You might have a little more of a rectangular foot print like 2x3 with those horizontals. Either way, your going to have plenty of light with that many in a room at those foot prints.

What footprint are you giving each plant?


----------



## Underground Scientist (Feb 24, 2018)

I had a delay on my second vert hood. Seller cancelled my first order, it said "customer cancelled"...I thought maybe I screwed up. Ordered again, few days later, cancelled...out of stock. Douche.

Got one on the way now and found a $25 better deal @ $140.


----------



## Yodaweed (Feb 25, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> Okay cool I been placing then for 2x3 so i can change that to 3x3 cool. I right now have 12 of them and will have 24 in 4 weeks to do my whole grow area. which means I will have even better par so I am gonna keep them adjusted for 2x3 which means bigger yield I hope. Or am i wrong? I have been wrong before and will again I am sure.


More square footage will always yield more if light is available. Biggest factor for yield is usable lit space.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Feb 25, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> Okay cool I been placing then for 2x3 so i can change that to 3x3 cool. I right now have 12 of them and will have 24 in 4 weeks to do my whole grow area. which means I will have even better par so I am gonna keep them adjusted for 2x3 which means bigger yield I hope. Or am i wrong? I have been wrong before and will again I am sure.


Yeah, why not change it to 3x3, and if you feel it's lacking you could add the rest. That'd save you 8 lights (planned 24 lights per 6 SF is 144sf, 144sf / 9 is 16 lamps). Lotta cash savings in equipment and electricity. Like BK said, 3x3 is proven.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Feb 25, 2018)

Hey, I got a basic question for you guys. 

Do you guys maintain a 315 at roughly 20" from canopy height, or are there points during the plant cycle you keep it a little higher? Like at flip, do you keep it at 20" and keep ratcheting it up, or keep it a little high and let it grow into the space?


----------



## gr865 (Feb 25, 2018)

I run both of mine 18 to 22 inches depending on stage of growth. I don't know if that is the right height but it seems to work.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Feb 25, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Hey, I got a basic question for you guys.
> 
> Do you guys maintain a 315 at roughly 20" from canopy height, or are there points during the plant cycle you keep it a little higher? Like at flip, do you keep it at 20" and keep ratcheting it up, or keep it a little high and let it grow into the space?



I read the SS vertical reflector achieves max par at 16” and 2.5’ x 2.5’ area. 

I run young plants about 2 feet-30” and mature plants at 18” unless the plant wants more. Some show no stress at the 16”.


----------



## genuity (Feb 25, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Hey, I got a basic question for you guys.
> 
> Do you guys maintain a 315 at roughly 20" from canopy height, or are there points during the plant cycle you keep it a little higher? Like at flip, do you keep it at 20" and keep ratcheting it up, or keep it a little high and let it grow into the space?


24"+ in veg(seedlings,clones 4x4 area) 18" in flower(3x3 canopy)

For the most part,it's all on how the plants a growing(pheno depending) some like more,some like less.


----------



## DCobeen (Feb 26, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Yeah, why not change it to 3x3, and if you feel it's lacking you could add the rest. That'd save you 8 lights (planned 24 lights per 6 SF is 144sf, 144sf / 9 is 16 lamps). Lotta cash savings in equipment and electricity. Like BK said, 3x3 is proven.


I have 3 rooms. gonna have 12 in big flower room 6 in smaller flower room and 4 in veg with 2 extra lights. since mine are Chinese I want backup units on hand.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Feb 26, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> I have 3 rooms. gonna have 12 in big flower room 6 in smaller flower room and 4 in veg with 2 extra lights. since mine are Chinese I want backup units on hand.


What did you get your units for?
Share a link?


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## DCobeen (Feb 26, 2018)

$180 a unit 
Search this on ebay
TopoGrow 315W CMH Grow Light Kit W/3100K Bulb 120V-240V 120V Plug Full Spectrum
you can also change 3100k to 4200k 
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2047675.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.TRS0&_nkw=TopoGrow+315W+CMH+Grow+Light+Kit+W/3100K+Bulb+120V-240V+120V+Plug+Full+Spectrum&_sacat=0


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Feb 27, 2018)

6 plants, soil mix, 5&7gal smartpots, FoxFarms and Organic roots combo nutes, blue dream and Chocolate Mint under a single 315w LEC.... Flip time!!


----------



## hydgrow (Feb 27, 2018)

DOOZY said:


> Got me 3 ballasts for $ 321 delivered.



Please tell me how you got these? I have tried to work with EBM lighting and they are horrible to work with! They only take wire transfer and that does not insure me.

I am trying to buy 20 of these ballast, 40 bulbs, 20 hangers. They are insanel hard to deal with direct as days go by in between emails and once I asked for PayPal they totally quit responding.


----------



## DCobeen (Feb 28, 2018)

hydgrow said:


> Please tell me how you got these? I have tried to work with EBM lighting and they are horrible to work with! They only take wire transfer and that does not insure me.
> 
> I am trying to buy 20 of these ballast, 40 bulbs, 20 hangers. They are insanel hard to deal with direct as days go by in between emails and once I asked for PayPal they totally quit responding.


if you want 20 units here is where I would go. I wish I would have done this first. 3 year warranty several options available. 
https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Hydroponic-315-Watt-CMH-CDM-Grow_60598979352.html?spm=a2700.7724857/A.main07.38.68a61700hZKuUk


----------



## gwheels (Feb 28, 2018)

How high do you hang your light in veg. I pretty much keep it up at the same height for the full grow but maybe i should move it down. I am in veg and they are pretty small and the light is about 3 1/2 feet from the plant.


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## a senile fungus (Mar 1, 2018)

Any feedback from anyone on the 315w prism ballasts?


----------



## DOOZY (Mar 1, 2018)

hydgrow said:


> Please tell me how you got these? I have tried to work with EBM lighting and they are horrible to work with! They only take wire transfer and that does not insure me.
> 
> I am trying to buy 20 of these ballast, 40 bulbs, 20 hangers. They are insanel hard to deal with direct as days go by in between emails and once I asked for PayPal they totally quit responding.


Ali baba app for phone. I can give company by name later . mine are kick ass with all the bells and whistles.


----------



## DCobeen (Mar 1, 2018)

as far as hangin lights to a certain height is well up to grower. I hang mine 48' from floor in veg. so with pots and such 2-3 feet to canopy. in flower I have not set them all up yet so cant speak on that yet.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Mar 1, 2018)

a senile fungus said:


> Any feedback from anyone on the 315w prism ballasts?


I haven't been running these prisms real long, coming up on 4 weeks. No issues so far. Finally got setup for 2 individual vertical hoods instead of the Dominator XXXL dual horizontal.

18" from Canopy


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## a senile fungus (Mar 1, 2018)

I have a first gen Philips ballast that I am now finally getting a new lamp on it, and I am thinking of picking up some greenbeams and prism ballasts. 

Thank for your input!


----------



## Underground Scientist (Mar 1, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> I haven't been running these prisms real long, coming up on 4 weeks. No issues so far. Finally got setup for 2 individual vertical hoods instead of the Dominator XXXL dual horizontal.
> 
> 18" from Canopy
> 
> View attachment 4098610


7 weeks ago, those were rescued neglected solo cup plants.


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## DemonTrich (Mar 2, 2018)

a senile fungus said:


> Any feedback from anyone on the 315w prism ballasts?


They suck.
Lol

4x315 Philips bulbs and 1st gen prism ballasts. Week 6 from flip


----------



## a senile fungus (Mar 2, 2018)

DemonTrich said:


> They suck.
> Lol
> 
> 4x315 Philips bulbs and 1st gen prism ballasts. Week 6 from flip


Yeah, obviously those lights/ballasts are lacking something, those plants need brawndo, it's got electrolytes

Are those the same ballasts that you originally purchased when you switched to CMH? I remember when you switched to CMH few years ago, you were using Galaxy HPS ballasts before IIRC, on those same hoods too if my memory serves correct.

Btw, I hope you're well and enjoying this weather!


----------



## DemonTrich (Mar 2, 2018)

I used to run elcheapo Apollo ballasts and bulbs. Still got +1# per hood with 600. Get the same or more with my current setup.

I only swapped out the ballasts and bulbs when i made the switch from hps/mh to all cmh. That was it.

Super easy.


I Hate this weather. My a.c. needs to run a bit more often. I like it cold.


----------



## a senile fungus (Mar 2, 2018)

That's it, I knew it was some cheapy brand that you were killing it with

Sounds like I will be picking up an Apollo ballast then lol


----------



## LEDandCoffee (Mar 2, 2018)

DemonTrich said:


> I used to run elcheapo Apollo ballasts and bulbs. Still got +1# per hood with 600. Get the same or more with my current setup.
> 
> I only swapped out the ballasts and bulbs when i made the switch from hps/mh to all cmh. That was it.
> 
> ...


Got any fire seeds from Copycat lately?


----------



## DemonTrich (Mar 2, 2018)

LEDandCoffee said:


> Got any fire seeds from Copycat lately?


Lmfao

I' not that fn stupid to buy that garbage!!

Id rather give someone 200 vs buying that crap.


----------



## LEDandCoffee (Mar 2, 2018)

DemonTrich said:


> Lmfao
> 
> I' not that fn stupid to buy that garbage!!
> 
> Id rather give someone 200 vs buying that crap.


shh, your comments might get deleted and threats of ban


----------



## DemonTrich (Mar 2, 2018)

a senile fungus said:


> That's it, I knew it was some cheapy brand that you were killing it with
> 
> Sounds like I will be picking up an Apollo ballast then lol


I had a huge issue with Apollo gear. From my finding, I could Only run Apollo bulbs with Apollo ballasts. I tried to run ushio flower bulbs and instantly fried 3x ballasts and 3x ushio bulbs instantly!!


----------



## DemonTrich (Mar 2, 2018)

LEDandCoffee said:


> shh, your comments might get deleted and threats of ban


Ban me here, I don' give a fuck! 

THE WORD IS OUT ABOUT CC SEEDS. just banning me here and deleting my post won' save shit.


----------



## LEDandCoffee (Mar 2, 2018)

DemonTrich said:


> Ban me here, I don' give a fuck!
> 
> THE WORD IS OUT ABOUT CC SEEDS. just banning me here and deleting my post won' save shit.


I still have my folder full of screen shots


----------



## DemonTrich (Mar 2, 2018)

Many many do

Keep them


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## Underground Scientist (Mar 14, 2018)

What's up guys. Just a heads up. On eBay, there's a couple Sun Systems Vertical Remote Reflectors that were displays in a hydro store. Comes with a 315 bulb that has maybe 50% life. $110 shipped. Not bad.


----------



## xXOnyxXx (Mar 14, 2018)

i went to get a new 600 hps ballast and ended up picking up a 315cmh ... was told it would kill my 600hps .... i'm getting 1# + per run with the 600 and good quality ... what should i expect from the 315 3100k .. imma be pisssed if it don't do better LOL


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Mar 14, 2018)

Better quality is almost garunteed, but maybe not as much weight...


----------



## Bad Karma (Mar 15, 2018)

xXOnyxXx said:


> i went to get a new 600 hps ballast and ended up picking up a 315cmh ... was told it would kill my 600hps .... i'm getting 1# + per run with the 600 and good quality ... what should i expect from the 315 3100k .. imma be pisssed if it don't do better LOL


The quality will definitely improve. As for yield, you should be able to get around 80% of what you were getting under the 600w HPS, using only half as much electricity.


----------



## xXOnyxXx (Mar 15, 2018)

sounds good to me ... guess some time will tell, thanks peeps


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## DemonTrich (Mar 16, 2018)

If you can' pull the same weight using a 315 vs a 600, try a few differet grow teks. It' very easy to do.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 16, 2018)

DemonTrich said:


> If you can' pull the same weight using a 315 vs a 600, try a few differet grow teks. It' very easy to do.



If you can pull the same weight with a 315 LEC as a 600 hps you are doing something wrong under the hps. 

Sorry but it’s true. And I’m sick of the exaggeration. I wish I had not bought into the hype. I have tested it many ways now. 

The 315 is going to the veg tent where it belongs. I would need to shorten my plants bud canopy and add more lamps to replace my hps effectively to not hurt my production. 

3-4 over a 4x8 might work with the overlap. Expensive test though. 

Even at 1 gram per watt hps vs 1.4 for cmh the math is obvious. 

And plenty of Growers have gotten more than 1 gpw from hps. Me included.

The only real benefit is the uvb. But that is blocked by thick reflector glass. And I would prefer the natural light to see the plants better. 

The bulb equals a 400 w hps for comparison purposes. Maybe 450.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Mar 16, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> If you can pull the same weight with a 315 LEC as a 600 hps you are doing something wrong under the hps.
> 
> Sorry but it’s true. And I’m sick of the exaggeration. I wish I had not bought into the hype. I have tested it many ways now.
> 
> ...


Why are you using glass with the CMH?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 16, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Why are you using glass with the CMH?



I would never do that. It is recommended above in this thread with the conversion kit that also ruins the connection of the new base with a mogul adapter. 

Sorry for the rant. Anytime I have listened to the hype here and made a purchase it was bullshit. Someone else who already invested was just exaggerating.


----------



## DemonTrich (Mar 16, 2018)

Lol

No, I' just a damn good grower who has his rooms dialed in.

Just because you can' get weight with cmh, don' knock the ones who can.

Bunch if whiney asses who can' grow.

Your a fn idiot. Keep listening to what the mfg says and keep getting shitnregurns.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Mar 16, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I would never do that. It is recommended above in this thread with the conversion kit that also ruins the connection of the new base with a mogul adapter.
> 
> Sorry for the rant. Anytime I have listened to the hype here and made a purchase it was bullshit. Someone else who already invested was just exaggerating.


Who recommended it? I set one up like that initially, then took the glass out, then bought vert hoods after metering the coverage I was getting with that. I'm just fucking around, not recommending anything, totally new to CMH. Now your saying CMH only belongs in Veg? Seriously?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 16, 2018)

DemonTrich said:


> Lol
> 
> No, I' just a damn good grower who has his rooms dialed in.
> 
> ...



What are you talking about? I’m matching or exceeding your cmh yield with individual spaced out seed plants. And far exceeding your yield with 600 hps. 

If I get known clones with a net like you I would do far better. 

Just do the math. It’s simple arithmetic. You ignore what I say and just keep talking. But your not proving anything about the lights. 

They are just tools. And in the case of the little 315 underpowered ones.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 16, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Who recommended it? I set one up like that initially, then took the glass out, then bought vert hoods after metering the coverage I was getting with that. I'm just fucking around, not recommending anything, totally new to CMH. Now your saying CMH only belongs in Veg? Seriously?



Demon keeps recommending it. He says his old glass enclosed hoods work better than the ones designed for the bulb. I use the sun system remote vertical open reflector. 

And yes I am saying we need more bulbs to cover the same area or use the 315 as supplemental light to an hps for best results flowering. Best plants I have grown were with 2 600’s and 1 315. Same ratio recommended for Metal Halide by many experienced Growers. 

I am sure it is great for veg. I am installing soon to see. I have already done a year of side by sides with my set up. 

I almost bought another. Growers House is doing 15% off again. I want to see how 2 do in a 3x6 area to see if it is worth the expense to use more for my new flower room. But I am pretty set on 2 600’s with 1 315 in the middle over a 4x8.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Mar 16, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Demon keeps recommending it. He says his old glass enclosed hoods work better than the ones designed for the bulb. I use the sun system remote vertical open reflector.
> 
> And yes I am saying we need more bulbs to cover the same area or use the 315 as supplemental light to an hps for best results flowering. Best plants I have grown were with 2 600’s and 1 315. Same ratio recommended for Metal Halide by many experienced Growers.
> 
> ...


I'm swapping my 400w of Chinese COBs for one 315 in veg. Grabbed one of those $110 SS RA's. I am set on trying using purely LEC. I'm def not a pro or anything...if I could match what I did with a 750 HPS and see an improvement in quality with 630w of CMH, and enjoy less heat...I'll be happy.


----------



## xXOnyxXx (Mar 16, 2018)

i'm gettin 16 to 18 zips average from my 600hps ... i really don't expect that from the 315 but it should still be with in a few oz and much better quality hopefully ... if not imma go get a new ballast and go back to the 600


----------



## Bad Karma (Mar 16, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> If you can pull the same weight with a 315 LEC as a 600 hps you are doing something wrong under the hps.
> 
> Sorry but it’s true. And I’m sick of the exaggeration. I wish I had not bought into the hype. I have tested it many ways now.
> 
> ...


You said that you tested it "many ways", but you've only ever shown us your 315 in the middle of a mostly HPS garden, which is not an accurate way to test the light on its own merits. To my knowledge, you've never done/shown a stand alone CMH only grow under your 315. Sir, the scientific method behind your rationale is haphazard, at best. You've also personally stated that the plant under your CMH exhibited more color, more pronounced terps, and finished sooner. You clearly didn't adjust your growing style to get the most out of the light, which is something that needs to be done in every garden, it's called getting everything "dialed in". So just because you weren't able to get the most out of your 315 CMH doesn't mean that others aren't capable of doing more with the same lamp.


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## Yodaweed (Mar 16, 2018)

White Fire OG under a 315 cmh with 4k bulb, brought out lots of colors.


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## MichiganMedGrower (Mar 16, 2018)

Bad Karma said:


> You said that you tested it "many ways", but you've only ever shown us your 315 in the middle of a mostly HPS garden, which is not an accurate way to test the light on its own merits. To my knowledge, you've never done/shown a stand alone CMH only grow under your 315. Sir, the scientific method behind your rationale is haphazard, at best. You've also personally stated that the plant under your CMH exhibited more color, more pronounced terps, and finished sooner. You clearly didn't adjust your growing style to get the most out of the light, which is something that needs to be done in every garden, it's called getting everything "dialed in". So just because you weren't able to get the most out of your 315 CMH doesn't mean that others aren't capable of doing more with the same lamp.


I had the 315 separate from the hps all last year. It was outside the footprint of the blockbuster in the other corner of the room. I put it near the center recently. 

Do you get more than a pound under 1 315? I said I didn’t try monocropping known clones. I got 15 oz from 3 different plants. 

I ran 3 sets of clones a bunch of different ways but I didn’t push for yield because I normally grow plants in all different stages and measure monthly output for quantity. 

Growing in potting soil and with different seeds every plant. And no co2. 

And my plants are trained to max 30” tall. And I keep space between them and have plenty of airflow and stable temps within 3 degrees and stable humidity within 10%. And I adjust them all for happy leaves individually every day. 

Anything else I am doing wrong? I average 2 oz per gallon of soil with the occasional 3. The footprint and lower bud development is lacking on the 315 compared to a 600 hps. The extra plant under the footprint is worth 5.5 oz to me. And less loose lowers which I count on because of my low ceiling height and small space. 

I got it to perform as well as a 450 hps if such a thing existed. Which is what most say it will do.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Mar 17, 2018)

All you punks arguing about gpw, etc.... that's not why you go with cmh. It's for quality, low heat inefficiencies, and general plant health/happyness, right?

Regardless, I'm excited to see what i get on this current run... day 16, a single 315 lec with 6 ladies in one bathtub (a dream of most men )


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## genuity (Mar 17, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> All you punks arguing about gpw, etc.... that's not why you go with cmh. It's for quality, low heat inefficiencies, and general plant health/happyness, right?
> 
> Regardless, I'm excited to see what i get on this current run... day 16, a single 315 lec with 6 ladies in one bathtub (a dream of most men )
> 
> View attachment 4107155


You not gonna add another one ?

Looking good.


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## Javadog (Mar 18, 2018)

I love what a 315W CMS can do with 4'X4' tent #2....it is so close to what
a 600W HPS is doing in 4'X4' tent #1. I think that it is amazing how much
it can do with a little more than half the power. Like a 500W I would say but
that is my rough estimate.


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## thenotsoesoteric (Mar 18, 2018)

I'm currently running air cooled 400w in a 3x3 tent, could I run a non air cooled 315 cmh instead just using the same exhaust fan and carbon filter?


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Mar 18, 2018)

genuity said:


> You not gonna add another one ?
> 
> Looking good.


Lol, pretty full in there! the three on the left are actually late repots, so lagging on stretch a bit... lol


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Mar 18, 2018)

thenotsoesoteric said:


> I'm currently running air cooled 400w in a 3x3 tent, could I run a non air cooled 315 cmh instead just using the same exhaust fan and carbon filter?


Probably too small of a space to avoid heat buildup (based on my nube-ish experience), but mainly depends on how good your ventilation/air-exchange is, and where your tent is located...


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## xXOnyxXx (Mar 19, 2018)

i run in a 4ft x 5ft cab .. the rear 1ft or so is for fans and carbon scrubber .. so i figure a bout a 4x4 foot print .. anyway i was running a aircooled 600hps and i switched to the 315cmh non air cooled and my temps went down 6 degrees .. was runnin 79ish now 73 .... so yea you will be fine in a 4x4 cab ...


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## Bad Karma (Mar 19, 2018)

thenotsoesoteric said:


> I'm currently running air cooled 400w in a 3x3 tent, could I run a non air cooled 315 cmh instead just using the same exhaust fan and carbon filter?





ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Probably too small of a space to avoid heat buildup (based on my nube-ish experience), but mainly depends on how good your ventilation/air-exchange is, and where your tent is located...


ColoradoHighGrower is right, it will greatly depend on your tents air intake and exchange. I would add to this that as long as you've got cool/cold air going into the tent a 315 would be absolutely fine.
I myself have an 8x4 with an 8" inline fan pumping in the cold night air from the outdoors. Then theres another 8" inline fan sucking it all out on the other end of the tent. Due to the heat here in Northern California I have to shut down that CMH tent from June until October every year.


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## indianasc13 (Mar 21, 2018)

Dark plasma under 2 315s


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## Underground Scientist (Mar 21, 2018)

Finally ditched the 400w of Chinese COB Floodlights for a 315 CMH in Veg


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Mar 21, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Finally ditched the 400w of Chinese COB Floodlights for a 315 CMH in Veg
> 
> View attachment 4109816


Nice! What strain are you running? Fat leaves! 
Is that a well-pruned mother in the back left?


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## Underground Scientist (Mar 21, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Is that a well-pruned mother in the back left?


Yeah, if I clip 5 clones, it bounces back with new tops in a week or two. NorthernSkunk


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## Rocket Soul (Mar 22, 2018)

So im asking this on behalf of a friend who doesnt do forums, will post in a few of the knowledgeable CMH threads. Hes looking at a deal for Lumii LEC (same as cmh, right?) Ballasters, 315w at 100 euros each, and he can get cheap phillips bulbs as well. Any pros or cons on this specific setup? Cant find very much info on Lumii anywhere but i believe the ballaster being squarewave or not, and the bulb hanging horizontal or vertical are important. Not too interested in sales pitches for other lights/ballasters, were in Spain so many of the US options arent around. Price is important too, as there are about 20 x 600 hps that cant run this summer due to heat, even with cool tubes.
Also looking into leds where i am much more knowledgeable but there i kind of narrowed it down already. Any ideas? Sorry for not having more details, will try to get back with that.


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## DCobeen (Mar 22, 2018)

Rocket Soul said:


> So im asking this on behalf of a friend who doesnt do forums, will post in a few of the knowledgeable CMH threads. Hes looking at a deal for Lumii LEC (same as cmh, right?) Ballasters, 315w at 100 euros each, and he can get cheap phillips bulbs as well. Any pros or cons on this specific setup? Cant find very much info on Lumii anywhere but i believe the ballaster being squarewave or not, and the bulb hanging horizontal or vertical are important. Not too interested in sales pitches for other lights/ballasters, were in Spain so many of the US options arent around. Price is important too, as there are about 20 x 600 hps that cant run this summer due to heat, even with cool tubes.
> Also looking into leds where i am much more knowledgeable but there i kind of narrowed it down already. Any ideas? Sorry for not having more details, will try to get back with that.


if you are running 20 600 hps in cool tubes and its to hot then it will be to hot for 315 also. 315 doesn't use cool tubes as that would block spectrum. sounds like he needs a couple mini spilts or a big cooling unit.


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## Underground Scientist (Mar 22, 2018)

I should've done this in veg earlier. I was expecting maybe rapid soil drying or an elevated temp. Plants perked up, 77 degrees, 50% RH, healthy moisture in the pots, 6" exhaust on Med/Low. I'm thinking germinating and cloning on a dimmer edge, like offset the light like 3", might be real sweet. 30" from the top of the pot and I love having the tables so I'm not hunched on the floor. Expandible to 100w T5 under the table for cloning and germinating. For 315w - 415w in a 4x4. Liking it


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## Rocket Soul (Mar 22, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> if you are running 20 600 hps in cool tubes and its to hot then it will be to hot for 315 also. 315 doesn't use cool tubes as that would block spectrum. sounds like he needs a couple mini spilts or a big cooling unit.


Thx, maybe im not too clear, its not a 20 light room, its spread out over 4 rooms. Manageable but with a lot of ventilation and ac in the bigger room. Im really more after advice on Lumii ballasts, anybody know if they any good? With regards to square wave etc


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## DCobeen (Mar 26, 2018)

anyone running 630 DE cmh lights? I found a couple on sale and the price was to good to pass on. Question is height to canopy, how close can the plants get to the light? I know the 315's love 12-24 inches range. I am thinking 16-24 inches. Am I off on my guess?


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## genuity (Mar 26, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> anyone running 630 DE cmh lights? I found a couple on sale and the price was to good to pass on. Question is height to canopy, how close can the plants get to the light? I know the 315's love 12-24 inches range. I am thinking 16-24 inches. Am I off on my guess?


I run the in the summer @ 18-24" in these AC/DE hoods
 
Glass off.


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## hydgrow (Mar 26, 2018)

I tried to get the EBM lighting ballast some of you have but I did not have luck with that company and had to use my PayPal protection.

I did in the mean time buy a few Solis Tek set ups and the plants respond well to the CMH. I did end up going Dual CMH Solis Teks and it really does run really cool.

The Solis Teks are from what I understand, Ultra High Frequency square wave CMH technology. Where the Chinese brand was low frequency square wave technology. The EBM ballast where dimmable and plus lumens the Solis Tek is strictly plus lumens.

No matter what I am really happy and so are the ladies. I also have an HPS running to see what difference I do have come harvest besides the energy savings of the CMH.


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## SunPlix CMH (Mar 27, 2018)

hydgrow said:


> I tried to get the EBM lighting ballast some of you have but I did not have luck with that company and had to use my PayPal protection.
> 
> I did in the mean time buy a few Solis Tek set ups and the plants respond well to the CMH. I did end up going Dual CMH Solis Teks and it really does run really cool.
> 
> ...


EBM is a copycat of SunPlix ballast. Thanks for god they only copied our ballast appearance and some of our ballast technology, but not all. That is the reason you did not have luck with their ballasts. We are the original one.


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## SunPlix CMH (Mar 27, 2018)

We are a USA company and we have inventory in VA. Please click the below links to learn more.
https://www.instagram.com/sunplix_cmh/
https://www.facebook.com/groups/248519675519386/


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## SunPlix CMH (Mar 27, 2018)




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## SunPlix CMH (Mar 27, 2018)

SunPlix 700W dual 350 IR remote dimming CMH grow light.


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## SunPlix CMH (Mar 27, 2018)

SunPlix 1000W knob dimming CMH/HPS/MH grow light.


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## SunPlix CMH (Mar 27, 2018)

SunPlix daisy chain. You can chain 23 315W on 240V and 11 on 120V.


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## SunPlix CMH (Mar 27, 2018)




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## SunPlix CMH (Mar 27, 2018)

You can buy our lighting products on www.sunplix.com. Should you need a coupon code, please send email to [email protected].


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## Underground Scientist (Mar 27, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Nice! What strain are you running? Fat leaves!
> Is that a well-pruned mother in the back left?


Oh, I missed the first part of the question. 

NorthernSkunk Mom in the back, & baby clones.

Baby clones of JOTI God's AK-47

1 or 2 PeakSeedsBC KushBerry

RedEyed Genetics Locktite
RedEyed Genetics Emerald City Cookies
RedEyed Genetics Blueberry Iced Cream

Locktite is the best RedEyed so far.

Flipped a God's AK-47 a week or so ago:


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Mar 27, 2018)

Thanks @SunPlix CMH, or should i say, Sonny J., mysterious owner of SunPlix Lighting llc, who speaks English and Chinese, according to LinkedIn? So you're manufactured in US company? Or made in China, assembled in US sold in US company? Or a chinese manufactured/assembled/owned company under the guise of a US based company? If you're going to sales pitch us with "US based company," at least let us know who is actually making your products and components...


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## SunPlix CMH (Mar 27, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Thanks @SunPlix CMH, or should i say, Sonny J., mysterious owner of SunPlix Lighting llc, who speaks English and Chinese, according to LinkedIn? So you're manufactured in US company? Or made in China, assembled in US sold in US company? Or a chinese manufactured/assembled/owned company under the guise of a US based company? If you're going to sales pitch us with "US based company," at least let us know who is actually making your products and components...


Our lights are manufactured in China and our company is in USA. Sorry we can not disclose the manufacturer's info, like Philips doesn't tell you who manufactures bulb for them.


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## DCobeen (Mar 27, 2018)

@SunPlix CMH why are your prices are as high as American made lights?


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## SunPlix CMH (Mar 27, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> @SunPlix CMH why are your prices are as high as American made lights?


1. Which CMH lights are made in USA?
2. We use the high quality electronic parts to make our lights to make light working longer. High quality parts means high cost.
3. Our ballast is low frequency which cost is higher than high frequency.
4. Our reflectors are designed specifically for CMH bulbs, while other reflectors are copied from HPS reflector. We paid design fee, mold fee and other fees.


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## Bad Karma (Mar 27, 2018)

SunPlix CMH said:


> 1. Which CMH lights are made in USA?


Good to see that you pay attention to and are aware of your competitors business practices. Your business acumen is clearly top notch, I'm sure you'll go far.

So, what the hell is a "Plix" anyways?


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## SunPlix CMH (Mar 27, 2018)

Bad Karma said:


> Good to see that you pay attention to and are aware of your competitors business practices. Your business acumen is clearly top notch, I'm sure you'll go far.
> 
> So, what the hell is a "Plix" anyways?


Thank you for your encouragement! SunPlix is a brand name, I don't know the meaning of Plix either. LOL


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## ThaMagnificent (Mar 27, 2018)

Sherby Snax by greenline seed bank


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## hydgrow (Mar 27, 2018)

Thanks Sunplix but I am not buying into your BS about them not being the same. Lol

I did check your CMH out but went with a reputable brand name as your fixtures are priced higher than most like you have a lifetime warranty and are the best or something. Lol When buying 10 plus fixtures I am not paying more than the major manufactrers for a no name ballast, yours.You seem very full of shit and contradict yourself a lot in your own text.

You say American company but it is a Chinese ballast. Lol

You are a Chinese company with a dude in the US charging more than a grow store for a no name Chinese product. Lol

If you want to call yourself an American company, then you would have to have an American made product, sold in America.

Since your CMH is so amazing and like no other, lets put it right next to my Solis Tek and nanolux CMH fixtures. Your fixture should give me better results right? Nope. It will perform the same and it cost more. Lol


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## SunPlix CMH (Mar 27, 2018)

hydgrow said:


> Thanks Sunplix but I am not buying into your BS about them not being the same. Lol
> 
> I did check your CMH out but went with a reputable brand name as your fixtures are priced higher than most like you have a lifetime warranty and are the best or something. Lol When buying 10 plus fixtures I am not paying more than the major manufactrers for a no name ballast, yours.You seem very full of shit and contradict yourself a lot in your own text.
> 
> ...


Please tell me if Solis Tek or Nanolux is an American company? Where are their lights made, in USA? 
I appreciate your comments, but please be polite and show us your comments based on facts. OK?


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## DCobeen (Mar 28, 2018)

regardless if you go to htg supply and check out there prices they have a $148 315 cmh light. its even dimmable. if you gonna compete in the market lower prices is the only way.


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## hydgrow (Mar 28, 2018)

SunPlix CMH said:


> Please tell me if Solis Tek or Nanolux is an American company? Where are their lights made, in USA?
> I appreciate your comments, but please be polite and show us your comments based on facts. OK?



PL5WASE TELL ME HOW YOU ARE AN AMERICAN COMPANY?

You are not an American company! You are no more an American company than Solis Tek or Nanolux! Lmao

You are a Chinese company just like Solis tek, nano lux and everyone else in this game. You are NOT an American company. If you are an American company, where is you manufacturing facility located at inside the US? You are Chinese reboxer and worse than Solis tek and Nanolux because you are higher priced for Chinese ballast like all other companies. You are worse because you are a blatant liar! Lol

Funny you say to respect a lieing salesman like yourself! Lol


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## Underground Scientist (Mar 29, 2018)

SunPlix CMH said:


> Please tell me if Solis Tek or Nanolux is an American company? Where are their lights made, in USA?
> I appreciate your comments, but please be polite and show us your comments based on facts. OK?


I saw you had a non dimmable 315, with a phillips bulb for 319. That is the same as a nanolux priced on amazon, but the nano includes shipping. My understanding is that nanos have to run maxpar bulbs cuz they blow the phillips. Nano is a vertical mount though. Do a side by side with a nano with par readings if you are competing. How's your luck with Phillips bulbs? I'm partial to keeping my ballast outside the grow area, so I'm not real interested, but those are my thoughts.


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## Underground Scientist (Mar 30, 2018)

So...Anyway 

Pretty Happy with the CMH in 4x4 Veg


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Mar 31, 2018)

Back on track folks! also pretty happy with mine, using for veg and bloom...


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## DCobeen (Mar 31, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> So...Anyway
> 
> Pretty Happy with the CMH in 4x4 Veg
> 
> View attachment 4114249





ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Back on track folks! also pretty happy with mine, using for veg and bloom...
> 
> View attachment 4114578


looking great guys. I am liking the results of the 4k over the 4k in flower and in veg. what are you guys running 3100 or 4200?


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## Underground Scientist (Mar 31, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> looking great guys. I am liking the results of the 4k over the 4k in flower and in veg. what are you guys running 3100 or 4200?


3100


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Mar 31, 2018)

Bad Karma said:


> ColoradoHighGrower is right, it will greatly depend on your tents air intake and exchange. I would add to this that as long as you've got cool/cold air going into the tent a 315 would be absolutely fine.
> I myself have an 8x4 with an 8" inline fan pumping in the cold night air from the outdoors. Then theres another 8" inline fan sucking it all out on the other end of the tent. Due to the heat here in Northern California I have to shut down that CMH tent from June until October every year.


@Bad Karma I am finding that when I water the plants in 8x4 the humidity jumps to 65%. There are 2 315cmh using 2/3 of the tent. The other side is just vacant. Do you filter your intake fan? The room and house are at 50% if that. Do you find the intake fan helps? I have intake fans in my 4x2 tent but not the bigger ones.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Mar 31, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> looking great guys. I am liking the results of the 4k over the 4k in flower and in veg. what are you guys running 3100 or 4200?


Currently just running the 3100, but i tend on getting the 4k to separate out the spectra per photo-period stage.... not too bad though... so which do you prefer for both stages @DCobeen?


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## Bad Karma (Mar 31, 2018)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> @Bad Karma I am finding that when I water the plants in 8x4 the humidity jumps to 65%. There are 2 315cmh using 2/3 of the tent. The other side is just vacant. Do you filter your intake fan? The room and house are at 50% if that. Do you find the intake fan helps? I have intake fans in my 4x2 tent but not the bigger ones.


Yes, an intake fan will definitely help lower your humidity. I find it helps to run my lights overnight so I can pump in the cold night air from outside, if you can. Also, that vacant area in your tent should be for a couple of fans. Place some high, place some low, but all of them moving the air over the soil, and helping to dry it out faster, thus lowering your tents humidity.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 1, 2018)

Bad Karma said:


> Yes, an intake fan will definitely help lower your humidity. I find it helps to run my lights overnight so I can pump in the cold night air from outside, if you can. Also, that vacant area in your tent should be for a couple of fans. Place some high, place some low, but all of them moving the air over the soil, and helping to dry it out faster, thus lowering your tents humidity.


I do run my lights at night. I added another clip fan and ordered a oscillating clip fan. I also added a lasko fan to the room and the RH in the tent is 54% during the day with the lights off. I am holding off on plugging the dehumidifier in just yet. Its day 23 of flip. Thanks @Bad Karma


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## DCobeen (Apr 1, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Currently just running the 3100, but i tend on getting the 4k to separate out the spectra per photo-period stage.... not too bad though... so which do you prefer for both stages @DCobeen?


I said it wrong I like the 4200k over the 3100k where I have 4200k I am seeing more color coming from my plants and a bit more resin production. I am now ordering more 4200k bulbs and gonna alternate them in flower so each row of lights will be like this for flower
4200-3100-4200
3100-4200-3100
4200-3100-4200
this is a 9 x 9 grow area. I need to get 1 more 315 to make this happen and the 4200 in the middle will be a 630 DE 4200 to help overlap better. I will see how this goes(yield light coverage) and if needed the will change the 3 middle lights to 630 DE


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## dangledo (Apr 1, 2018)

Taken down at 12 weeks or so. 28 months on the same bulb. No real reason for it. New one on the way. Had some testers on the side which i found keepers so the cuts will have a new bulb to flex under. I imagine they'd have done much better under a new bulb.


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## Underground Scientist (Apr 1, 2018)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I do run my lights at night. I added another clip fan and ordered a oscillating clip fan. I also added a lasko fan to the room and the RH in the tent is 54% during the day with the lights off. I am holding off on plugging the dehumidifier in just yet. Its day 23 of flip. Thanks @Bad Karma


Are you running exhaust?


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 1, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> I said it wrong I like the 4200k over the 3100k where I have 4200k I am seeing more color coming from my plants and a bit more resin production. I am now ordering more 4200k bulbs and gonna alternate them in flower so each row of lights will be like this for flower
> 4200-3100-4200
> 3100-4200-3100
> 4200-3100-4200
> this is a 9 x 9 grow area. I need to get 1 more 315 to make this happen and the 4200 in the middle will be a 630 DE 4200 to help overlap better. I will see how this goes(yield light coverage) and if needed the will change the 3 middle lights to 630 DE



Interesting - since the 4k is intended more for veg, i wonder if it's the higher UV with the cooler spectrum that gives better color/frost by the end of bloom? I actually looked into/tried to buy a 10k finishing bulb, just to see what it would do, but after getting two consecutive defective/broken bulbs deliverred from hydrobuilder, i gave up.. just haven't had time to look at other options yet. I'm thinking i might get the 4100k, use it for veg, swap out to the 3100k for bloom, and swap back to the 4100k for last two weeks to finish them... I also have 6 24w 24" T5s in there, with 3/3 veg/bloom bulbs for supplemental light. Ideas?


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## Precaution (Apr 1, 2018)

Dollar for dollar, what do you all think is the best 315 complete system to buy for just a 3x3 room? It does not have to have a dimmer, but would be preferred.


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## Underground Scientist (Apr 1, 2018)

Precaution said:


> Dollar for dollar, what do you all think is the best 315 complete system to buy for just a 3x3 room? It does not have to have a dimmer, but would be preferred.


You could get a cheaper one, but it'd have a cheaper, small, horizontal setup, and attached ballast. Then you have like Nanolux that are $319 vert mount, with a MaxPar bulb, can't run a Phillips according to reviews, blows em. Has ballast attached.

Then what I got. The tried and true SunSystems Remote Vertical Reflector. Despite what I thought about verts initially, tests show you can get better par with em, and a nice uniform square footprint for the 3x3. You can put the ballast outside the tent. They go for like $150, but there are deals that pop up on eBay for $110-$120 I grabbed a non-dimmable Prism Ballast that came with the best CMH bulb according to testing, the Phillips Agro. $200. I've had no issues so far. $350 brand new unless you bargain hunt. Spend more and you could get a Phantom or Gallaxy with the bells and whistles and still keep it external. There's my 2 cents


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## DCobeen (Apr 1, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Interesting - since the 4k is intended more for veg, i wonder if it's the higher UV with the cooler spectrum that gives better color/frost by the end of bloom? I actually looked into/tried to buy a 10k finishing bulb, just to see what it would do, but after getting two consecutive defective/broken bulbs deliverred from hydrobuilder, i gave up.. just haven't had time to look at other options yet. I'm thinking i might get the 4100k, use it for veg, swap out to the 3100k for bloom, and swap back to the 4100k for last two weeks to finish them...  I also have 6 24w 24" T5s in there, with 3/3 veg/bloom bulbs for supplemental light. Ideas?


I have grown start to finish many plants under my 4200k 400 cmh and I like that spectrum. I also had 4k bulbs in my 12 bulb t5 right next to the cmh and both did great jobs. Using actinic and coral plus bulbs in my t5 added even more color and frost with allot more resin production. If you look at the spectrum of the 3100 and 4200 bulbs you will see you a bit of UV but gain in photosynthesis.
That is why I am mixing the 2. Here is a test showing diff lights for 315 cmh bulbs and the uv output.
https://growershouse.com/blog/cmh-315w-lamp-comparison-test-data-review/


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## DCobeen (Apr 1, 2018)

Precaution said:


> Dollar for dollar, what do you all think is the best 315 complete system to buy for just a 3x3 room? It does not have to have a dimmer, but would be preferred.


It's all about your budget. @Underground Scientist is right on about the hood. I have shorter celling's so I went with cheap complete units and so far I am happy with them. You can find complete 315 lights with hood and bulb for $150 or can spend $450 its all about what you can afford. I went cheap as I have 8 of them and 2 630 DE units and still need to buy 1 more 630 and 3 more 315 lights so I can have a spare 315 as I really don't trust the cheap ones and a spare unit is a good thing.


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## Evil-Mobo (Apr 1, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> You could get a cheaper one, but it'd have a cheaper, small, horizontal setup, and attached ballast. Then you have like Nanolux that are $319 vert mount, with a MaxPar bulb, can't run a Phillips according to reviews, blows em. Has ballast attached.
> 
> Then what I got. The tried and true SunSystems Remote Vertical Reflector. Despite what I thought about verts initially, tests show you can get better par with em, and a nice uniform square footprint for the 3x3. You can put the ballast outside the tent. They go for like $150, but there are deals that pop up on eBay for $110-$120 I grabbed a non-dimmable Prism Ballast that came with the best CMH bulb according to testing, the Phillips Agro. $200. I've had no issues so far. $350 brand new unless you bargain hunt. Spend more and you could get a Phantom or Gallaxy with the bells and whistles and still keep it external. There's my 2 cents


So if not a sunsystem unit what else would you recommend? What has the bells and whistles?

I want to get a 315 again for my 3x3 and I'm debating whether to cheap out on the socket adapter prism ballast and Phillips bulb and run it in my Daystar a/c hood or to buy something new. Anyone mess with the DE 315's?


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 2, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Are you running exhaust?


yes a 4'x16" mountain air, 4" hurricane on a variac


----------



## DCobeen (Apr 2, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> So if not a sunsystem unit what else would you recommend? What has the bells and whistles?
> 
> I want to get a 315 again for my 3x3 and I'm debating whether to cheap out on the socket adapter prism ballast and Phillips bulb and run it in my Daystar a/c hood or to buy something new. Anyone mess with the DE 315's?


I know that my 630 DE puts out as much heat as my 1000 watt HPS bulbs did and just as much par so read reviews about the 315 DE as far as heat and par to see if its worth it.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 2, 2018)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> yes a 4'x16" mountain air, 4" hurricane on a variac


I assume passive intake of some sort? I put two 6" duct couplings into low ports of my tent with dust screens. That inline sounds a little small. I use a 6", 440cfm active air inline, with variable speed in my 5x5.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 2, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> So if not a sunsystem unit what else would you recommend? What has the bells and whistles?
> 
> I want to get a 315 again for my 3x3 and I'm debating whether to cheap out on the socket adapter prism ballast and Phillips bulb and run it in my Daystar a/c hood or to buy something new. Anyone mess with the DE 315's?


Did u just say Socket Adapter...Michigan Med Grower will be jumping out at you over the loss in efficiency with that...lol


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 2, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> So if not a sunsystem unit what else would you recommend? What has the bells and whistles?
> 
> I want to get a 315 again for my 3x3 and I'm debating whether to cheap out on the socket adapter prism ballast and Phillips bulb and run it in my Daystar a/c hood or to buy something new. Anyone mess with the DE 315's?


A good dimmable ballast is supposed to be the Galaxy. Check Growers House website. Don't quote me, but I think the phantom hood you can draw heat from, and a phantom is similar in price to sun systems.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 2, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Did u just say Socket Adapter...Michigan Med Grower will be jumping out at you over the loss in efficiency with that...lol


Oh oh I said the S word lol.......


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 2, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> A good dimmable ballast is supposed to be the Galaxy. Check Growers House website. Don't quote me, but I think the phantom hood you can draw heat from, and a phantom is similar in price to sun systems.


So what would be comparable or a step up from the sunsysyem unit I'm trying to weigh my options .I used to own one of the SS units with the ballast built in and I would rather not do that again.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 2, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Did u just say Socket Adapter...Michigan Med Grower will be jumping out at you over the loss in efficiency with that...lol



Lol. I just call em’ as I see em’


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 2, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> So what would be comparable or a step up from the sunsysyem unit I'm trying to weigh my options .I used to own one of the SS units with the ballast built in and I would rather not do that again.


Have a look here (if this is allowed) https://growershouse.com/catalogsearch/result/index/?limit=90&q=Cmh


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 2, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Have a look here (if this is allowed) https://growershouse.com/catalogsearch/result/index/?limit=90&q=Cmh


Lol trust me I've been on there for a few days no stop looking at things. I'm just confused why you see the DE 315 bulbs from growers choice and not the fixtures ......same thing on Amazon .And I can find the sunsystem setup with the remote ballast configuration anywhere .............


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 2, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Lol trust me I've been on there for a few days no stop looking at things. I'm just confused why you see the DE 315 bulbs from growers choice and not the fixtures ......same thing on Amazon .And I can find the sunsystem setup with the remote ballast configuration anywhere .............


https://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-315-ra-cmh-remote-reflector


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 2, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> https://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-315-ra-cmh-remote-reflector


Then you can choose the Prism or Galaxy...Fixed power or Dimmable Power


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 2, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Lol trust me I've been on there for a few days no stop looking at things. I'm just confused why you see the DE 315 bulbs from growers choice and not the fixtures ......same thing on Amazon .And I can find the sunsystem setup with the remote ballast configuration anywhere .............


Sorry Bro 

You're Talking DE Configs ..my bad


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 2, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> https://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-315-ra-cmh-remote-reflector


I appreciate your help but I think you misunderstand me here. SS last time I looked last year had a remote ballast fixture that came with that hood you linked and a bulb and ballast all from Sunsystem. All I see now is the hood by itself like you just linked, the unit with the ballast on board, or a remote kit that uses a prism ballast.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 2, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Sorry Bro
> 
> You're Talking DE Configs ..my bad


Nah you're good because I'm talking about both .


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 2, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Nah you're good because I'm talking about both .


Both Sun Systems and Galaxy Ballasts are Signature Brands of Sunlight Supply.
Potato - Pota'to
I think SunSystems Brand still does magnetic ballasts.
https://www.sunlightsupply.com/page/signature-brands


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 2, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Both Sun Systems and Galaxy Ballasts are Signature Brands of Sunlight Supply.
> Potato - Pota'to
> I think SunSystems Brand still does magnetic ballasts.
> https://www.sunlightsupply.com/page/signature-brands


Here is an Etelligent SS 315 ballast though
https://m.ebay.com/itm/Sun-System-1-LEC-Brand-315-Etelligent-Compatible-Ballast-120-240-Volt/122771574056?epid=24007833637&hash=item1c95c18d28:g:cU8AAOSw5dlaOG9f


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 2, 2018)

Okay, so looking into the differences between the 3000k vs 4000k cmh bulbs, i realized that the lower temp 3000 kelven bulbs result in a higher frequency spectrum/shorter wavelengths.

 

And the opposite for the 4000k version, which has lower f/longer wavelengths. 

 

This seems counterintuitive, as i thought hotter objects emit higher frequencies of light (e.g., hot suns are blue/blue flames/etc)?? I'm confused...


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 2, 2018)

Wien's Law:


----------



## DCobeen (Apr 3, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Okay, so looking into the differences between the 3000k vs 4000k cmh bulbs, i realized that the lower temp 3000 kelven bulbs result in a higher frequency spectrum/shorter wavelengths.
> 
> View attachment 4115935
> 
> ...


Yes it is confusing. I can only attest to what I have seen in my grow rooms. If I had to choose 1 spectrum from a bulb it would be 4200 start to finish. Since we now have a choice I am mixing them trying to achieve the best balance. Would be nice is CMH bulb makers would make a 12k bulb so we could use that to finish with.


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 3, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> Yes it is confusing. I can only attest to what I have seen in my grow rooms. If I had to choose 1 spectrum from a bulb it would be 4200 start to finish. Since we now have a choice I am mixing them trying to achieve the best balance. Would be nice is CMH bulb makers would make a 12k bulb so we could use that to finish with.


The 4k is where it's at, everybody says the 3k for more weight, but cmh's are built for quality of spectrum, which the 4200k bulb has.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 3, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> The 4k is where it's at, everybody says the 3k for more weight, but cmh's are built for quality of spectrum, which the 4200k bulb has.


Side by Side Comparison with same strain or it's all bs


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 3, 2018)

You can't change the fact that the Phillips 3100k has the highest par output


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2018)

https://www.cycloptics.com/sites/default/files/GB USU Spectral Characterization link.pdf


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 3, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> You can't change the fact that the Phillips 3100k has the highest par output


Yeah it has the highest output in a less desirable spectrum.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> Yeah it has the highest output in a less desirable spectrum.



No. See the university of Utah chart linked above


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 3, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> No. See the university of Utah chart linked above


What do you mean no, please elaborate.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 3, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> Yeah it has the highest output in a less desirable spectrum.


Based on what exactly? Are we talking facts or Bro Science?


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 3, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Based on what exactly? Are we talking facts or Bro Science?


Just look at the chart it's pretty simple to read, which spectrum would you go with if they had the exact same output? I know which i'd be using.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> What do you mean no, please elaborate.



They highlight the 3100 Agro bulb as the best for plant growth. 2nd is the 4200k. 

And for our specific cultivar and even higher ratio of red than either helps our flowers. That’s why they are really recommended as supplemental to hps. 

I like 2 hps to one cmh personally. Better quality and bud structure without the size limiting compaction the blue heavy spectrums cause.


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 3, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> They highlight the 3100 Agro bulb as the best for plant growth. 2nd is the 4200k.
> 
> And for our specific cultivar and even higher ratio of red than either helps our flowers. That’s why they are really recommended as supplemental to hps.
> 
> I like 2 hps to one cmh personally. Better quality and bud structure without the size limiting compaction the blue heavy spectrums cause.


I ran two LEDs(red white combo) and one 4200k CMH last run, frost levels off the charts nearly two pounds from 550w of lighting.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 3, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> I ran two LEDs(red white combo) and one 4200k CMH last run, frost levels off the charts nearly two pounds from 550w of lighting.


Which lighting source did better between the cmh and LED's? Got any pics? 

Thanks


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> I ran two LEDs(red white combo) and one 4200k CMH last run, frost levels off the charts nearly two pounds from 550w of lighting.



That just proves you did well with those lamps. You are arguing about picking 1 cmh.


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 3, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Which lighting source did better between the cmh and LED's? Got any pics?
> 
> Thanks


I ran them together, in a 4x4 tent, two plants were grown hydroponically and two in organic, got some pictures on my IG


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 3, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> I ran them together, in a 4x4 tent, two plants were grown hydroponically and two in organic, got some pictures on my IG


Which light do you feel did better though? Not trolling brother asking an honest question as I'm debating switching one of my 3x3 back to a CMH from LED.........


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 3, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Which light do you feel did better though? Not trolling brother asking an honest question as I'm debating switching one of my 3x3 back to a CMH from LED.........


I like both, in my opinion both got different strengths and weaknesses, the cmh can be hung higher than my LEDs and also requires a bit more height to canopy, the LEDs definately brought a ton of colors out and no worry about burning my plants they can get very close, i really like all different lighting situations for different types of grows/techniques i also still use HPS lights. I think if you are going for purely weight the LEDs in my opinion are the best because spectrum is so high on par output, but for quality in my opinion the CMH is better.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 3, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> I like both, in my opinion both got different strengths and weaknesses, the cmh can be hung higher than my LEDs and also requires a bit more height to canopy, the LEDs definately brought a ton of colors out and no worry about burning my plants they can get very close, i really like all different lighting situations for different types of grows/techniques i also still use HPS lights. I think if you are going for purely weight the LEDs in my opinion are the best because spectrum is so high on par output, but for quality in my opinion the CMH is better.


Cool thanks for your input. I also am using a mix of hid and Led......


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 3, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Cool thanks for your input. I also am using a mix of hid and Led......


I got that going right now too, LEDs in with my HPS i use my LEDs as side lighting for my HPS area, it works great.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 3, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> I got that going right now too, LEDs in with my HPS i use my LEDs as side lighting for my HPS area, it works great.


Had my 4x8 all cobs but put my 600 hps back on one side


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 3, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> I ran two LEDs(red white combo) and one 4200k CMH last run, frost levels off the charts nearly two pounds from 550w of lighting.


You supplemented your 4200 with red led...it's not much of a comparison in that way. I bet that setup would work good. I'm pretty certain my future holds 200w of COBs that are dimmable and mix with my 2 315's. Thinking some Citi 1212.


----------



## Crab Pot (Apr 3, 2018)

Phillips 4200k - day 34 since flip


----------



## DCobeen (Apr 3, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> The 4k is where it's at, everybody says the 3k for more weight, but cmh's are built for quality of spectrum, which the 4200k bulb has.





Underground Scientist said:


> Side by Side Comparison with same strain or it's all bs


I am testing the 3100k 4200 bulbs and I have a cmh 400 watt ballast with a 2100k bulb to see if I notice a difference. I agree the 3100 has a tiny bit more par. With our cmh bulbs it isn't about the par like with HID. Sure we want great par but its about usable light for the plant in photosynthesis. The 3100k and 4200k both are excellent bulbs. I have more experience with 4000-4200k grow lights than I do the 3100's which now makes it so we can mix them into the grow to see what works better. I have not noticed a big difference between the 3100 and 4200 so far. The 2100 is showing less resin and trichrome production as I thought it would do. I do notice a bit tighter buds which tells me what I also thought. The lower the K the tighter buds. I think we all are lucky to have these new LEC lights to use. I currently have 2 630 DE with 3100k and 4200k bulbs. 7 lec 315 with 2 4200 and 5 3100. 400 cmh with 2100k bulb. 2 1000 watt super hps Hortilux all being used and the LEC is kicking HID lights ass. Hope you all enjoy the lec lights as much as I am.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 3, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> I ran them together, in a 4x4 tent, two plants were grown hydroponically and two in organic, got some pictures on my IG


IG Handle?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 3, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> I am testing the 3100k bulbs and I have a cmh 400 watt ballast with a 2100k bulb to see if I notice a difference. I agree the 3100 has a tiny bit more par. With our cmh bulbs it isn't about the par like with HID. Sure we want great par but its about usable light for the plant in photosynthesis. The 3100k and 4200k both are excellent bulbs. I have more experience with 4000-4200k grow lights than I do the 3100's which now makes it so we can mix them into the grow to see what works better. I have not noticed a big difference between the 3100 and 4200 so far. The 2100 is showing less resin and trichrome production as I thought it would do. I do notice a bit tighter buds which tells me what I also thought. The lower the K the tighter buds. I think we all are lucky to have these new LEC lights to use. I currently have 2 630 DE with 3100k and 4200k bulbs. 7 lec 315 with 2 4200 and 5 3100. 400 cmh with 2100k bulb. 2 1000 watt super hps Hortilux all being used and the LEC is kicking HID lights ass. Hope you all enjoy the lec lights as much as I am.


Which lec are you running? Also what ballast is pushing your 1K hps?


----------



## DCobeen (Apr 3, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Which lec are you running? Also what ballast is pushing your 1K hps?


I been buying the cheap complete units on EBay. I will down the road switch them out for better warranty ect but right now its all about how much I want to spend. when I get done I will have around $3300 in lec lights and if i did name brand lec it would be $7k for the same amount of lights. I can say this if you get a 630 DE lec get a xl hood as it helps tons with heat disbursement. I have a normal hood in one and the heat under the light is insane(using for veg) and a xl hood which spreads the heat over a wider area and its allot cooler but still has allot of heat.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 3, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> I am testing the 3100k bulbs and I have a cmh 400 watt ballast with a 2100k bulb to see if I notice a difference. I agree the 3100 has a tiny bit more par. With our cmh bulbs it isn't about the par like with HID. Sure we want great par but its about usable light for the plant in photosynthesis. The 3100k and 4200k both are excellent bulbs. I have more experience with 4000-4200k grow lights than I do the 3100's which now makes it so we can mix them into the grow to see what works better. I have not noticed a big difference between the 3100 and 4200 so far. The 2100 is showing less resin and trichrome production as I thought it would do. I do notice a bit tighter buds which tells me what I also thought. The lower the K the tighter buds. I think we all are lucky to have these new LEC lights to use. I currently have 2 630 DE with 3100k and 4200k bulbs. 7 lec 315 with 2 4200 and 5 3100. 400 cmh with 2100k bulb. 2 1000 watt super hps Hortilux all being used and the LEC is kicking HID lights ass. Hope you all enjoy the lec lights as much as I am.


When you say it's not about the par, but useable light...par IS the useable light. Photosynthetically Active Radiation. These are really efficient HIDs. We can run em open hood in tents and utilize the UV. 3100 has more reds, which are desirable for flowering, and has more photosynthetically useable light. What I would say is who knows what effect different spectral compositions have on terp profiles, but it does. The only way is through experience and apple to apple comparison. 

And I feel like I'm coming off like I really need a toke right now...I'm just obsessed with logical reasoning...lol

I'm a little skeptical of plain 4200 having a better bud/leaf ratio than 3100 without supplemental red. Mixing them in configurations might be interesting though. I get too obsessed with symmetry for it though.


----------



## gwheels (Apr 3, 2018)

Phillips has a 3k bulb and a 4k bulb. I use a 3k phillips bulb start to finish. Should i get a 4k and when would i use it ? (if it is more blue i would think veg.).


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2018)

gwheels said:


> Phillips has a 3k bulb and a 4k bulb. I use a 3k phillips bulb start to finish. Should i get a 4k and when would i use it ? (if it is more blue i would think veg.).



4200k is meant for veg but even Phillips states the 3100k is perfect start to finish. 

Personally I wouldn’t want the stronger blue leaning spectrum as the 3100k already keeps plants very compact.


----------



## UncleBuck (Apr 3, 2018)

gwheels said:


> Phillips has a 3k bulb and a 4k bulb. I use a 3k phillips bulb start to finish. Should i get a 4k and when would i use it ? (if it is more blue i would think veg.).


the 4k is good for finishing the plant in late harvest


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2018)

UncleBuck said:


> the 4k is good for finishing the plant in late harvest



Wow. That’s true but you meant to say ripening or late bloom. Except the 3100k has sufficient uvb so it is still an unessasary expense. I posted a link above with all the numbers for most common Grow lamps from the university of Utah.

And if it’s more uvb you are after ushio bulbs have almost 15% less par but more uv in their spectrum.

Growers house comparison linked above but more info available in their article than video.

Getting lonely in politics buck?


----------



## UncleBuck (Apr 3, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Wow. That’s true but you meant to say ripening or late bloom. Except the 3100k has sufficient uvb so it is still an unessasary expense. I posted a link above with all the numbers for most common Grow lamps from the university of Utah.
> 
> And if it’s more uvb you are after ushio bulbs have almost 15% less par but more uv in their spectrum.
> 
> ...


no, you're wrong and giving these growers poor advice


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 3, 2018)

UncleBuck said:


> no, you're wrong and giving these growers poor advice



No. I am repeating info from extensive university testing. 

Should we compare gardens for credibility anyway?


----------



## DCobeen (Apr 3, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> When you say it's not about the par, but useable light...par IS the useable light. Photosynthetically Active Radiation. These are really efficient HIDs. We can run em open hood in tents and utilize the UV. 3100 has more reds, which are desirable for flowering, and has more photosynthetically useable light. What I would say is who knows what effect different spectral compositions have on terp profiles, but it does. The only way is through experience and apple to apple comparison.
> 
> And I feel like I'm coming off like I really need a toke right now...I'm just obsessed with logical reasoning...lol
> 
> I'm a little skeptical of plain 4200 having a better bud/leaf ratio than 3100 without supplemental red. Mixing them in configurations might be interesting though. I get too obsessed with symmetry for it though.


when I said about par I mean HID lights are around 24% Usable par where as LEC is around 58% Usable par. just cause our meters say par doesn't mean the plant likes it and will use it. Hope that makes since it does to me. and 4200k is only a bit lower on the 680 nm range that is why I am using 3100k bulbs to help that more.


----------



## DCobeen (Apr 3, 2018)

gwheels said:


> Phillips has a 3k bulb and a 4k bulb. I use a 3k phillips bulb start to finish. Should i get a 4k and when would i use it ? (if it is more blue i would think veg.).


look at the spectrum output. 4200 or 3100 can be used all the way through. I had 3000k bulbs in a t5 and the 4200k did better all the way. but mixing them was even better. just saying from experience.


----------



## DCobeen (Apr 3, 2018)

Evil-Mobo said:


> Which lec are you running? Also what ballast is pushing your 1K hps?


1k ballast is just magnetic as I have only 7 ft ceiling to use. my solis tek 1k ballasts was to much. I buy the cheap LEC lights.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 3, 2018)

DCobeen said:


> 1k ballast is just magnetic as I have only 7 ft ceiling to use. my solis tek 1k ballasts was to much. I buy the cheap LEC lights.


Thanks for the reply .


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 3, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Based on what exactly? Are we talking facts or Bro Science?


Bro science.... lol


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 3, 2018)

Ah! So 4200k is more blue/uv intense, and the 3100k is warmer.. phew! I thought i was losing it.....


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Apr 3, 2018)

Sherby Snax by greenline


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 4, 2018)

What's the word on the Hortilux 315 CMH light that was new last month ?


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 4, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> I assume passive intake of some sort? I put two 6" duct couplings into low ports of my tent with dust screens. That inline sounds a little small. I use a 6", 440cfm active air inline, with variable speed in my 5x5.


It might be but there is no smell. Temps are steady 72 lights on 66 lights off. The RH has been 49-54% since adding an 18” oscillating fan. These numbers are for a week since getting the fan. The tent is just sucked in so there is air flow. The variac is set at 30%


----------



## DCobeen (Apr 4, 2018)

Since I went organic my plants stopped stinking until I touch them or chop them then they show you a potent smell for sure. 


ilovetoskiatalta said:


> It might be but there is no smell. Temps are steady 72 lights on 66 lights off. The RH has been 49-54% since adding an 18” oscillating fan. These numbers are for a week since getting the fan. The tent is just sucked in so there is air flow. The variac is set at 30%


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 4, 2018)

Crab Pot said:


> Phillips 4200k - day 34 since flip
> 
> View attachment 4116227


Beautiful Plant


----------



## Crab Pot (Apr 5, 2018)

Underground Scientist said:


> Beautiful Plant


Thank you brother. I’m really digging these bulbs.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 5, 2018)

Nice golden finish


----------



## Pee_You (Apr 6, 2018)

Using a 315w definitely gives some dense ass buds. Keeps plant growth very compact in my exp. First run wit a 315w; I'm loving it so far! Super bright!


----------



## frontline (Apr 8, 2018)

SchmoeJoe said:


> The biggest advantage is being able to power twice the area on the same circuit. Its what they're intended for. You can't do that in the same room because they'll have to be on separate opposing photoperiods. I've done the same thing by just using a seperate set of ballasts running off of the same sub panel.The savings from buying fewer ballasts is a secondary benefit to that.


My guy at the hydro store was a little miffed when I bought 1 cmh ballast and two bulb's . Instead of 200 for ballast it cost me 20 for a timer to shut new one off so it could flip .


----------



## frontline (Apr 9, 2018)

So vertical is the way to go for best results you all say . I will do some redesign I recon .


----------



## SunPlix CMH (Apr 9, 2018)

Grow under SunPlix CMH grow lights.


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 10, 2018)

Here's another glimpse of my 315w LEC 4'x4' Veg, with 100w T-5 4'x4' Clone/Seedling space.

 
 

I don't use 100w of T-5 in a 4x4 space, I just have the space and use that to light up like 2 seedling/clone flats.



Awesome 4x4+ veg using up to 415 watts.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 11, 2018)

SunPlix CMH said:


> Grow under SunPlix CMH grow lights.View attachment 4119573


Ice cubes, eh?


----------



## Bad Karma (Apr 11, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Ice cubes, eh?


Nah bro. That's resin.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 11, 2018)

PlixResin™


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 12, 2018)

Crab Pot said:


> Phillips 4200k - day 34 since flip
> 
> View attachment 4116227


what strain? @Crab Pot nice


----------



## hydgrow (Apr 12, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Ice cubes, eh?



Not just any ole ice! Imported, designed, and frozen in China, American Ice. That's the shit!


----------



## SunPlix CMH (Apr 12, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Ice cubes, eh?


Yes.


----------



## SunPlix CMH (Apr 12, 2018)

Grown under a SunPlix 315W CMH covering 4x4.


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## Crab Pot (Apr 12, 2018)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> what strain? @Crab Pot nice


Wedding Cake s1

Here she is today...


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 12, 2018)

Crab Pot said:


> Wedding Cake s1
> 
> Here she is today...
> 
> View attachment 4121183



Wow she is beautiful!


----------



## Crab Pot (Apr 12, 2018)

I posting this pic I just took to show how well a single 315w Phillips 4200k bulb in a Sun Systems remote hood is doing for me in this 4’x4’x7’ tent. I’ve got nineteen girls at around 4 1/2 weeks, packed in here (pheno hunt) in 2 gallon pots of living soil and the thing that I’m noticing is that some of the frostier plants with the biggest buds are in the far distance corners. Tough to see from the pic but these plants are frosty. Anyway you can see that as little as 315 watts of LEC in a 4’x4’ is not so bad and it’s going to give me well over a pound of quality bud, closer to a pound and a half.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 12, 2018)

Crab Pot said:


> Wedding Cake s1
> 
> Here she is today...
> 
> View attachment 4121183


Yowza!


----------



## Schmarmpit (Apr 13, 2018)

Crab Pot said:


> I posting this pic I just took to show how well a single 315w Phillips 4200k bulb in a Sun Systems remote hood is doing for me in this 4’x4’x7’ tent. I’ve got nineteen girls


Very nice. Did you give them any veg time or straight 12/12?


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## hydgrow (Apr 13, 2018)

Crab Pot said:


> Wedding Cake s1
> 
> Here she is today...
> 
> View attachment 4121183


Wow that's CAKED with trics!


----------



## genuity (Apr 13, 2018)

Crab Pot said:


> I posting this pic I just took to show how well a single 315w Phillips 4200k bulb in a Sun Systems remote hood is doing for me in this 4’x4’x7’ tent. I’ve got nineteen girls at around 4 1/2 weeks, packed in here (pheno hunt) in 2 gallon pots of living soil and the thing that I’m noticing is that some of the frostier plants with the biggest buds are in the far distance corners. Tough to see from the pic but these plants are frosty. Anyway you can see that as little as 315 watts of LEC in a 4’x4’ is not so bad and it’s going to give me well over a pound of quality bud, closer to a pound and a half.
> 
> View attachment 4121197


Perfect..

Very good information, definitely a bigger footprint than some claim.


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## gr865 (Apr 13, 2018)

Just added my 2nd Nanolux 315 to the 4x4.


She has filled about 3/4 of the 36 inch screen so got a little to go. The lazy susan on the rollers sure make life easier for this ol' fart.


She has been in her new 10 gallon Smart Pot since the 3rd of April and has roots growing through the fabric.


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## Crab Pot (Apr 13, 2018)

Schmarmpit said:


> Very nice. Did you give them any veg time or straight 12/12?



-14 day veg-

Sprouted 33 seeds (regs) in one gallon pots of living soil, then flipped them to 12/12 after they were 14 days from sprout. They showed sex (19 females and 14 males) after about five weeks at which time I transplanted them into 2 gallon pots so that they would have enough soil/root space to finish flowering out. They still have approximately five weeks to finish flowering.

I’m working on a CBD pheno hunt. I plan to take the most desirable plants and have them lab tested.


----------



## Crab Pot (Apr 13, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Just added my 2nd Nanolux 315 to the 4x4.
> View attachment 4121378
> 
> She has filled about 3/4 of the 36 inch screen so got a little to go. The lazy susan on the rollers sure make life easier for this ol' fart.
> ...



Looking awesome my friend. If you went to a 25 -30 gallon pot I think you would easily double your yield.


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Apr 13, 2018)

What kind of gpw are you guys getting?


----------



## gr865 (Apr 13, 2018)

Crab Pot said:


> Looking awesome my friend. If you went to a 25 -30 gallon pot I think you would easily double your yield.


It is already more than I want to fuck with. It takes about 8 gallons of solution every two days and about to step that up to daily. Early morning, water to just before runoff, then in the evening give it about 30% runoff. Oh I am in coco.
I will begin 12/12 in a few weeks or so, the plant has just about reached the edges of the 36" screen.

GR


----------



## gr865 (Apr 14, 2018)

ThaMagnificent said:


> What kind of gpw are you guys getting?


My last few grows, 
2 plant Horizontal grow Super Citrus Haze and WW 15 zips, *0.65 G/W* WW did 6 zips and SCH did 9 zips.
5 plant Vertical grow G13 Haze and Critical Kush, 24.5 zips, *1.08 G/W*. The 4 G13's did the 24.5 zips, the Critical Kush was a mess and ended up just going straight into make FECO.
5 plant Vertical grow LSD 17 zips *0.8 G/W* Pheno's # 3 and 5 were just under 2 zips each and #'s 1, 4 and 5 produced the other 13 zips.
5 plant Horizontal grow, LSD clones, 26.5 zips, *1.17 G/W*. This was 4 Pheno #1's and one Pheno #3, again #3 was about 2.5 zips and the 4 Pheno #1's was just over 24 zips.

Current grow, LSD Pheno #5 single plant Monster Crop, will harvest sometime late July or early Aug.

GR


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 14, 2018)

gr865 said:


> My last few grows,
> 2 plant Horizontal grow Super Citrus Haze and WW 15 zips, *0.65 G/W* WW did 6 zips and SCH did 9 zips.
> 5 plant Vertical grow G13 Haze and Critical Kush, 24.5 zips, *1.08 G/W*. The 4 G13's did the 24.5 zips, the Critical Kush was a mess and ended up just going straight into make FECO.
> 5 plant Vertical grow LSD 17 zips *0.8 G/W* Pheno's # 3 and 5 were just under 2 zips each and #'s 1, 4 and 5 produced the other 13 zips.
> ...



So from your data so far one could conclude that growing horizontal vs vertical will be strain dependent for max yields?


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Apr 14, 2018)

Yea I'm averaging .7gpw horizontal too


----------



## gr865 (Apr 14, 2018)

@Evil-Mobo

I agree with your conclusion of strain dependency on weight. But also mistakes during the grow are zip killers.
If all grows were trouble free, would have been a better test.
The last two grows, both LSD, 1st grow vertical, that did 17 zips was 5 different Pheno's, #1 was the biggest producer and I had 4 of them. at 5 plus zips, the rest were around 2+ zips with #3 being the lightest. 
So the LSD clone grow was a surprise, I burned the plants at three weeks into flower, plants grew into the lamps, not touching to too damn close. But the buds were heavy, and the aver. weight of those 4 plants was 6 zips per plant with no larf at all. 
I will be making oil today, 1.5 lbs of product, zip WW, three zips of G13 Haze, and the remainder will be buds from the LSD plus the sugar leaves from the trim and a few zips of the shit I did not want to trim, knowing it was going in making FECO.

I did a grow in 16' that started out lovely, was my first and last experience in Blumats, had troubles getting them adjusted. Finely thought I had it under control at 4 weeks into flower. Well I returned from a short trip, 5 days to find them dry a a bone, not burned that much yet but everything looked totally funky.
Critical Kush, just before harvest,

Nug from that plant. Very little trichs, funky leaf shapes.


Now this was one of the Cheese plants, looks great but was like smoking rope. I ended up composting the two CK and got about 10 zips off the Big Buddha Cheese, but it would not get you high, maybe a little but not worth keeping so made oil. Did not make a very good product.


So the conclusion of the grow was operator error and a wasted 5 months.

GR


----------



## gr865 (Apr 14, 2018)

ThaMagnificent said:


> Yea I'm averaging .7gpw horizontal too


I feel slighted if I don't achieve 1 plus G/W per grow. I have been growing for awhile and if I can eliminate the stupid errors I know I will do at least a G/W regulary.

This grow I have going now, in the 4X4, Barneys Farm LSD single plant Monster Crop will not even get close to G/W but my GF wanted me to flower it, she said it was so cute. Really was not going to grow until the fall but will flower this plant soon then get ready for the fall grow. It has turned out to be a fun grow.


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Apr 14, 2018)

That's exactly how I think. You need to get 1gpw. I'm going to get back to led bext round and compare


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 14, 2018)

gr865 said:


> @Evil-Mobo
> 
> I agree with your conclusion of strain dependency on weight. But also mistakes during the grow are zip killers.
> If all grows were trouble free, would have been a better test.
> ...


I appreciate the feedback and the honesty. I'm in the middle of a transition to hydro but did do a vert grow once in setups like yours with a bare 315 and I went away on a trip and burnt my plants as well. Been thinking about another maybe soon as with the setup for hydro I am losing vertical height inside my tents. But it's a necessary evil as I am disabled and needed to cut down on workload. 

I just chopped down about half my flower run because of an issue as well and it was looking like one of my best runs in a year or so and at almost 30 days to flower.

One thing I've learned with this plant, is it's always something lol. That's why we keep extra plants around just in case lol........


----------



## gr865 (Apr 14, 2018)

@ *Evil-Mobo*

Most I lost that crop not to light burn but no water for 4 or 5 days, with the lights on 12/12.


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 14, 2018)

gr865 said:


> @ *Evil-Mobo*
> 
> Most I lost that crop not to light burn but no water for 4 or 5 days, with the lights on 12/12.


I should reiterate yes no watering leading to drying out not burning .stoner moment in telling my story. I had a 3x3 tent with one plant on each side wall and the rear and had a fourth in a bucket with a net made of PVC and what not like you showed for the front plant so I could take it in and out and tend to the rest of the tent. The 315 hung bare in the center ter up top .


----------



## Underground Scientist (Apr 14, 2018)

First CMH grow - JOTI Blue Cheese


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 15, 2018)

Accidental test nug blue dream day 47 315lec (broke lower branch while watering):


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 15, 2018)

Crab Pot said:


> Looking awesome my friend. If you went to a 25 -30 gallon pot I think you would easily double your yield.


What do you think- one large pot or equivalent smaller pots in same footprint?


----------



## Evil-Mobo (Apr 15, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> What do you think- one large pot or equivalent smaller pots in same footprint?


Whats the footprint not a black and white question. Like in flower I use 4x4 trays and run 4 plants per, that's what I like. Other guys prefer to run 9 smaller plants for similar yields, but the footprint makes a difference.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 16, 2018)

About 0.75×1.5m


----------



## xXOnyxXx (Apr 17, 2018)

not impressed with the 315cmh .. trich production was up but density and yield where shit ... granted i switched at 30 day mark in flower because my 600hps ballast crapped out .. so they only got 30 days under the 315 but so far i'm disppointed in the cmh .... i usually pull 16+ zips from 600hps ..... got 8 this trip from the 315cmh .. the foot print is like 4 x4 ..... gonna use it a few more runs to see what tweaks i can make to get what i had before in quality ... these buds look like shit LOL loose n fluffy aint it !!! any advice is very welcomed! because that kind of loss is not acceptable, i'm gonna pick up a new hps ballast just to have on hand.


----------



## Yodaweed (Apr 17, 2018)

xXOnyxXx said:


> not impressed with the 315cmh .. trich production was up but density and yield where shit ... granted i switched at 30 day mark in flower because my 600hps ballast crapped out .. so they only got 30 days under the 315 but so far i'm disppointed in the cmh .... i usually pull 16+ zips from 600hps ..... got 8 this trip from the 315cmh .. the foot print is like 4 x4 ..... gonna use it a few more runs to see what tweaks i can make to get what i had before in quality ... these buds look like shit LOL loose n fluffy aint it !!! any advice is very welcomed! because that kind of loss is not acceptable, i'm gonna pick up a new hps ballast just to have on hand.


A 315CMH isn't gonna replace a 600w hps, and definately not gonna yield the same, if you were disappointed i'd suggest trying a run with only the CMH and lower your footprint to a 3x3 or less.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Apr 17, 2018)

xXOnyxXx said:


> not impressed with the 315cmh .. trich production was up but density and yield where shit ... granted i switched at 30 day mark in flower because my 600hps ballast crapped out .. so they only got 30 days under the 315 but so far i'm disppointed in the cmh .... i usually pull 16+ zips from 600hps ..... got 8 this trip from the 315cmh .. the foot print is like 4 x4 ..... gonna use it a few more runs to see what tweaks i can make to get what i had before in quality ... these buds look like shit LOL loose n fluffy aint it !!! any advice is very welcomed! because that kind of loss is not acceptable, i'm gonna pick up a new hps ballast just to have on hand.



My results too. Better after going 16” over the canopy and sticking to under 3’x3’ footprint. 

Awesome results in overlap next to a 600 hps. 

I also think multiple 315’s would work better. Say 3 to a 4x8. 

So overhyped I actually bought into it this time.

Mines going in a 3x3 veg tent next.


----------



## gr865 (Apr 17, 2018)

xXOnyxXx said:


> not impressed with the 315cmh .. trich production was up but density and yield where shit ... granted i switched at 30 day mark in flower because my 600hps ballast crapped out .. so they only got 30 days under the 315 but so far i'm disppointed in the cmh .... i usually pull 16+ zips from 600hps ..... got 8 this trip from the 315cmh .. the foot print is like 4 x4 ..... gonna use it a few more runs to see what tweaks i can make to get what i had before in quality ... these buds look like shit LOL loose n fluffy aint it !!! any advice is very welcomed! because that kind of loss is not acceptable, i'm gonna pick up a new hps ballast just to have on hand.


I am running 2 315's so 630 watts and I love the results. My last three grows have been 24.5, 17 and 26.5 zips. 
Nugs are tight and heavy.


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## dangledo (Apr 18, 2018)

Snagged the hortilux 315

Supposed to lay down 10 percent more uv than the Phillips. We'll see. 

It's easily 20 percent bigger in size. Sticks out from the bottom of the ss hood. so don't set it on the ground with the bulb in


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 18, 2018)

dangledo said:


> Snagged the hortilux 315
> 
> Supposed to lay down 10 percent more uv than the Phillips. We'll see.
> 
> ...


What ballast are you running?


----------



## dangledo (Apr 18, 2018)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> What ballast are you running?



Phillips 

Which I was told hortilux uses Phillips in their 315 lights

According to hydro dude. I didn't look into it.


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## killerx (Apr 22, 2018)

Not grown on se 315cmh but on growers choice de 630w cmh 3kR bulbs. on ebay 1000w de ballast and hood. Quality frost game up %100. Bud density game down from traditional hps.


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## Yodaweed (Apr 22, 2018)

dangledo said:


> Snagged the hortilux 315
> 
> Supposed to lay down 10 percent more uv than the Phillips. We'll see.
> 
> ...


Those only come in 4k spectrum?


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 22, 2018)

killerx said:


> Not grown on se 315cmh but on growers choice de 630w cmh 3kR bulbs. on ebay 1000w de ballast and hood. Quality frost game up %100. Bud density game down from traditional hps.


I am on the fence with bud density because when I grew critical widow they were rock hard nuggets. My last three runs were afgooey, kish, blue balls and two seedsman white widow, none have ever been super dense strains for me. The frost seems to be way better. Before this i was strictly 1000w hps in flower with magnetic ballasts. The lack of heat and lower cost of operation is still quite impressive. I have switched my flower area to 240v and you can feel the heat difference between the 120v and 240v with the back of my hand on the ballast. The 120v does not get hot but the 240v runs much much cooler. I wish I had a digital thermometer just to see the difference. Nice run @killerx


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 22, 2018)

Day 56


----------



## SunPlix CMH (Apr 24, 2018)

Day 56. Grown under SunPlix 315W CMH fixture with Philips T12/930 bulb. If you need more UV light, you can choose T12/942 bulb.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 24, 2018)

Mine's bigger than yours... just sayin...


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Apr 28, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Just added my 2nd Nanolux 315 to the 4x4.
> View attachment 4121378
> 
> She has filled about 3/4 of the 36 inch screen so got a little to go. The lazy susan on the rollers sure make life easier for this ol' fart.
> ...


Love this setup!!


----------



## dangledo (Apr 28, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> Those only come in 4k spectrum?


Honestly, not even sure. Nothing on the packaging saying what it is. Given the debate on which is better; not really concerned. 

Damn hobbyist


----------



## gr865 (May 2, 2018)

Here's what's going on in the 4 X 4 under the two Nanolux 315's. 

Two days in and we are starting to stretch. If she stretches like her mother, we should see around 12 to 14 inch stretch on the mains and 6 to 9 on the secondary's. See more tying down in my future.





  

Still relocating bud sites to get complete fill in. 



Noticed some trim work to be done, but going to wait a few more days before anymore work is done on her. Fan leaves are getting massive, this is a very sativa dominate Pheno. This is the best growth we've have had indoors, having a hard time believing that it was only 10 days ago that that the very heavy defoliation was completed. Believing it has to be the root system, it has only been 28 days (4/4) since transplant from the 3 gallon Smart Pot to the 10 gallon SP. Had roots growing out of the sides of the pots 8 days after transplanting. And every day they are sticking out of the lower half of the SP's. This root system has to be just massive, I fucking love it. Taken on 4/12


My G/F was here last Sunday when I did the defo and when she came back this Friday, she thought it was a different plant. Not sure what I am doing right but I ain't gonna stop. 

Use RO or rain water, I just started feeding them at 0.9 EC (450 ppm), prior to Monday was only at 0.65 EC (325 ppm). Epsom @ 0.75 grams, Cal/Magic @ 2 ml, Canna A&B @ 4.5 ml, Rhizotonic @ 4 ml, Cannazym @ 9 ml, drip clean, Mammoth @ 0.6 ml per gallon. Two cycles with three start times per cycle, per day. Hand water two days a week using Great White one day and on the second day it's Great White and Subculture M. Refilling the rez every 2.5 to 3 days, that was during veg, not sure what this refill regime will be until I see how they uptake over the next week or so.

Need to work on her watering schedule, the two full cycles are just a tad bit too much at this time. Thinking just reducing times a bit, still keep two cycles per day but with reduced times. Expect within the next week or so to begin increasing the times slowly. 
I'm happy! 

GR


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (May 2, 2018)

Nice! What's your soil/medium again, @gr865 ? I'm assuming coco, since you're cycling your res through twice a day?


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## ColoradoHighGrower (May 2, 2018)

Almost chop time for me:
 

Breaking down after this run, going on vaca after cure starts. I'm gonna try some new Greenpoint strains next round.. i did grab 5 clones of the blue dream though, just in case....


----------



## gr865 (May 2, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Nice! What's your soil/medium again, @gr865 ? I'm assuming coco, since you're cycling your res through twice a day?


Thanks, she is going to be fun. Yes I am in Canna Coco!


----------



## NugHeuser (May 2, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Almost chop time for me:
> View attachment 4130410
> 
> Breaking down after this run, going on vaca after cure starts. I'm gonna try some new Greenpoint strains next round.. i did grab 5 clones of the blue dream though, just in case....


Got me some Greenpoint beans going now under 2 315s and 3 separate 3 cob rails inside an 8x4. Have heard nothing but good about Greenpoint, I picked up quite a few packs.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (May 3, 2018)

I'm thinking of popping jelly pie next- how about you?


----------



## NugHeuser (May 3, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> I'm thinking of popping jelly pie next- how about you?


I wish I had a pack of jelly pie, all the JP I've seen looks fire, they sold out the early morning of 4/20, I was planning on snatching some during the sale but they were gone when the sale started.
I've got a bunch of their s1's going, Gorilla Glue #4, Purple Punch, Gelato #45, Dos-si-dos, and Mimosa.


----------



## Underground Scientist (May 3, 2018)

Just past 2 week mark


----------



## frontline (May 3, 2018)

clouds said:


> thats the thing its not for sale yet thats why i was wondering if its worth spending on. i was talking to one shop owner and then he sent me to sunlight supply and i explained how i was looking at CMH and was looking for a system to try out and see how it works, then he put me in contact with the another branch of the company and gave me a huge discount, im basically just paying for the ballast and 3 day shipping. the hood remote hangers and extra bulbs are all free i was going to order this from but then now i dont know. i know its going to be for sunlight supply when released but thats about all the info i have on it other than the some specs


Maybe just hookup an old 400 hps ballast and screw in a 315cmh with adapter to try for now .


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (May 5, 2018)

Cash Crop Ken Kish, GHS Afgooey and Blue Ballz (taken at day 56) taken at day 53 grown under 2 phantom 315cmh phillips 4000k for grow and first 3 weeks, finshed under 3100k. FFOF, Happy Frog and Perlite. Fox Farms Big Bloom, Grow Big and Tiger Bloom. I used Bud Blood 1 week before flower and first week of flower. Also first time using Photosynthesis Plus. Shutting it down for the summer.


----------



## Yodaweed (May 5, 2018)

LIGHTING: 315 CMH Phillips 4k + RED/WHITE LED COMBO
GENETICS: WHITE FIRE OG
MEDIUM: RDWC HYDROPONICS
NUTRIENTS: GENERAL HYDROPONICS 3 PART
FLOWERING DURATION: 56 DAYS
TRIM JOB: MINIMAL.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 5, 2018)

HPS only. It’s all just hype. 

 

If anyone is noticing a big quality difference between cmh and hps I suggest learning how to either keep the room cooler or work the light distance better. And backing the lamp away some during ripening helps.

And no one wants to hear this. But I am believing growing well with the higher wattage helps potency. Everyone noticed the hps buds were more potent when I removed the cmh from my flower room. 

I told no one what I did. They just mentioned it as a compliment.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (May 5, 2018)




----------



## Bad Karma (May 5, 2018)

If anyone is wondering how to shut up an HPS troll just hit the ignore button. Problem solved.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 5, 2018)

Bad Karma said:


> If anyone is wondering how to shut up an HPS troll just hit the ignore button. Problem solved.



You know I fully tested the 315 with 4 sets of clones 4 times. And also in different combinations with other bulbs.


----------



## genuity (May 6, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> You know I fully tested the 315 with 4 sets of clones 4 times. And also in different combinations with other bulbs.


Pics? Of the 315 setup(all 4 runs) please
I only see you post the mixed grows.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 6, 2018)

genuity said:


> Pics? Of the 315 setup(all 4 runs) please
> I only see you post the mixed grows.



I have said before that the rest of the pics were lost when I transferred phone service. 

But I have posted cmh only and 2 weeks finishing and hps only and mixed. At least a few examples. 

And I have blind tested the buds with patients the whole time. 

A quality grow light can give the same results as another if used properly. The limiting factor is wattage not spectrum. Although the spectrums have different pros and cons. And the pros and cons may be better or worse depending on method, room and grower.


----------



## Yodaweed (May 6, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> HPS only. It’s all just hype.
> 
> View attachment 4131624
> 
> ...


Why are you in the CMH area if you are pushing HPS , you might want to go to the forum for HPS , this is the forum for CMH growers.


----------



## gr865 (May 6, 2018)

@yoda
Some 1 looking to argue?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (May 6, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> Why are you in the CMH area if you are pushing HPS , you might want to go to the forum for HPS , this is the forum for CMH growers.


You’re kidding right?


----------



## Javadog (May 6, 2018)

Oh stop with the HPS :0)

I have both and I find both able to make nice smoke.

I am stoked that I can have a second tent w/o paying too much more dough. 

What's not to love?


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (May 7, 2018)

Finishing out perfect- Got a nice fade going about 24hrs after a really good flush


----------



## genuity (May 8, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Finishing out perfect- Got a nice fade going about 24hrs after a really good flush
> 
> View attachment 4132786


That's still just the 1 315lec?

Looking good.


----------



## gr865 (May 8, 2018)

SunPlix CMH said:


> Grown under a SunPlix 315W CMH covering 4x4.


Good luck on your SOG.
I might suggest you add another 315 as your outer plants will not receive the same amount of light as the inside plants.
I am running 2 - 315's in my 4 x 4 and loving it. 18 to 21 inches above the canopy.
From experience, if you try filling the 4 x 4 footprint with one light, the height you would have to raise the light will not give you the desired product you are looking for.

This pic taken 4/4 is a single 315 that I raised to get the plant to stretch so I could attach it to the begin filling the screen. The height is about 26 inches plus, don't remember exactly, and yes I got good stretch but it caused the node spacing to be to long between the nodes. Since I do heavy defo that does not effect this grow. 
 

This pic was taken 9 days later when I added the second 315. The height of the lamps are 18 inches.
 

Now, that being said, I still don't get true coverage of the 4 x 4. With the lights side by side at 18" the actual coverage is approx. 5' x 3.25', due to the overlap for the 5 feet and the side by side alignment for the 3.25 feet. Now the higher you raise the lamps the larger the foot print but the less intensity of the light. I would not go above 21" for normal growing and prefer 18".
To get around the coverage problem and also my back problems, I built a lazy susan to hold the 10 gallon smart pot. It has rollers on the bottom that ride in the channels of the catch tray so I can move it in and out and also rotate it 180 degrees.
It sure makes it easier to work on this plant. 

Taken yesterday 5/7 day 7 of flower, stretching has begun, the lamp is raised as needed to keep the height at 18".
 

GR


----------



## gr865 (May 8, 2018)

SunPlix CMH said:


> Grown under a SunPlix 315W CMH covering 4x4.


I also wanted to say I think your choice for the number of plants is perfect for a 4 x 4, but if your going with just one light @ 3 x 3 coverage then you would want to lower that number. 
Man, your going to kill this grow, years back I did a semi SOG with 12 plants in a 2.5 x 4 foot with a SS400 LED and did okay. With one you'll do okay, but with two 315's you'll rock it.

GR


----------



## ThaMagnificent (May 8, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Good luck on your SOG.
> I might suggest you add another 315 as your outer plants will not receive the same amount of light as the inside plants.
> I am running 2 - 315's in my 4 x 4 and loving it. 18 to 21 inches above the canopy.
> From experience, if you try filling the 4 x 4 footprint with one light, the height you would have to raise the light will not give you the desired product you are looking for.
> ...


With your drip, you have those little bearings to turn off each individual line?


----------



## gr865 (May 8, 2018)

ThaMagnificent said:


> With your drip, you have those little bearings to turn off each individual line?


I have a 1/4" ball valve on each line for isolating or pressure reduction for each dripper. I use them with my 2 gallon smart pot so I can remove the plants from the tent to work on them. With this run I am have not been using them as I couldn't move that sucker if I wanted too. Going to take two of us to get it out of there at harvest, I will allow it to dry for a day plus prior to harvest so she may be lighter.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (May 8, 2018)

genuity said:


> That's still just the 1 315lec?
> 
> Looking good.


Yup, and 50w of 24" T5s (2 @3100k and 2 @4200k)


----------



## ThaMagnificent (May 8, 2018)

gr865 said:


> I have a 1/4" ball valve on each line for isolating or pressure reduction for each dripper. I use them with my 2 gallon smart pot so I can remove the plants from the tent to work on them. With this run I am have not been using them as I couldn't move that sucker if I wanted too. Going to take two of us to get it out of there at harvest, I will allow it to dry for a day plus prior to harvest so she may be lighter.


Are you running a res with an anti siphon valve too?


----------



## Loudpack516 (May 8, 2018)

Just got my lec 315 how is it guys ??


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## Tkboy (May 9, 2018)

I just picked up a nice used 630 LEC to run with my 315. It came with the 4200k lamps whereas my 315 has the 3KR lamp. I’m in flower at the moment so I’m guessing it’s probably best to get 3k lamps rather..? Correct me if I’m wrong but the 4K are more for veg with more blue spectrum. These lamps aren’t cheap though, would I lose out substantially if I ran the 4K lamps now..?


----------



## NugHeuser (May 9, 2018)

Tkboy said:


> I just picked up a nice used 630 LEC to run with my 315. It came with the 4200k lamps whereas my 315 has the 3KR lamp. I’m in flower at the moment so I’m guessing it’s probably best to get 3k lamps rather..? Correct me if I’m wrong but the 4K are more for veg with more blue spectrum. These lamps aren’t cheap though, would I lose out substantially if I ran the 4K lamps now..?


You can use the 4200k for flower, shouldn't make too much of a difference. But technically yes a lot of people use that color for veg


----------



## oldman60 (May 9, 2018)

I'm using both and haven't seen much difference between the 2 in flower.
I have 2 630 double bulb and 4 315's in a 8x8 room.


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## Tkboy (May 9, 2018)

Great thanks guys, I reckon I’ll just use the 4200k lamps that I’ve got then and save some cash..


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## gr865 (May 14, 2018)

ThaMagnificent said:


> Are you running a res with an anti siphon valve too?


Yes it comes off the main feed line just above the rez.
 

This works extremely well but there is still about 6 feet of 3/4 inch tubing that has to empty into the smart pots after the pump shuts off. I will be able to eliminate the problem, if it is a problem, which it really isn't, by moving the rez down to the floor but I would need to add a anti siphon valve to the secondary rez which will be no problem to do.

GR


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## gr865 (May 14, 2018)

Day 14 of 12/12 under 2 - 315's with 3000 K lamps in a horizontal grow.

Not sure how much more stretch I can handle, may have to start a mass LST for this bitch. 
4/29 The day before start of 12/12






14 days later 5/13, I have had to tie her down twice since start of flower, she is taken over the space.






5/13 different shots from last night.


















Buds starting to form, stretch is continuing and she sure could use a trim, but will wait another week for that.

She not flowering as rapid as Pheno #1 or #3, but she is supporting much more growth.

GR


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## Yodaweed (May 17, 2018)

Just started 2 cff tangie under my cmh


----------



## NugHeuser (May 17, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> Just started 2 cff tangie under my cmh


First time running that one? That's one I've had my eyes on before.


----------



## SunPlix CMH (May 17, 2018)

Tkboy said:


> I just picked up a nice used 630 LEC to run with my 315. It came with the 4200k lamps whereas my 315 has the 3KR lamp. I’m in flower at the moment so I’m guessing it’s probably best to get 3k lamps rather..? Correct me if I’m wrong but the 4K are more for veg with more blue spectrum. These lamps aren’t cheap though, would I lose out substantially if I ran the 4K lamps now..?


Here is SPD of Philips 315W T12/930 3k and T12/942 4k bulbs working on different powers. Hope it helps.


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## Yodaweed (May 19, 2018)

NugHeuser said:


> First time running that one? That's one I've had my eyes on before.


Second time, first time plants were orange peel flavored, hoping for the same this run.


----------



## gr865 (May 19, 2018)

Two more days till day 21 of flower and major trim.
     

I really have no idea what to expect from her, have never had a plant like this.

GR


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (May 19, 2018)

What strain are you running again, @gr865 ?


----------



## gr865 (May 19, 2018)

@chg'er
Barneys Farm LSD


----------



## Yodaweed (May 20, 2018)

I have really bad luck with this tangie from crockett family farms, i have popped 6 seeds so far, 5/6 have been male , just found out the 2 i popped were both males


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## gr865 (May 20, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> I have really bad luck with this tangie from crockett family farms, i have popped 6 seeds so far, 5/6 have been male , just found out the 2 i popped were both males


That happened to me a while back, Black Widow, bought 15 popped 10 from Mr. Nice Seeds 8 of the 10 were males and the two that weren't I chopped after 15 weeks of flower, they still looked like they were only a couple of weeks old. Went to the compost bin! They were very tall and lanky. I have 5 more vacuum sealed, that have been kept in the chiller, thinking of popping them some time and see how they do under the two 315W lamps.


----------



## Yodaweed (May 20, 2018)

gr865 said:


> That happened to me a while back, Black Widow, bought 15 popped 10 from Mr. Nice Seeds 8 of the 10 were males and the two that weren't I chopped after 15 weeks of flower, they still looked like they were only a couple of weeks old. Went to the compost bin! They were very tall and lanky. I have 5 more vacuum sealed, that have been kept in the chiller, thinking of popping them some time and see how they do under the two 315W lamps.


Might try breeding one of these male tangies with my wifi if either of these have a strong orange peel smell to them, anybody know best way to determine male effectiveness for breeding other than just doing it?


----------



## gr865 (May 21, 2018)

@yada

If you are having problems with the strain, why breed? Find a stabilized strain and run with it.
Now this is coming from a person who has never tried breeding cannabis. 

GR


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (May 21, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> I have really bad luck with this tangie from crockett family farms, i have popped 6 seeds so far, 5/6 have been male , just found out the 2 i popped were both males


Same. Popped 40 beans and only got 6 females.


----------



## NugHeuser (May 21, 2018)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Same. Popped 40 beans and only got 6 females.


Haven't seen from you in a while. Still all cmh in your room?


----------



## Yodaweed (May 21, 2018)

gr865 said:


> @yada
> 
> If you are having problems with the strain, why breed? Find a stabilized strain and run with it.
> Now this is coming from a person who has never tried breeding cannabis.
> ...


no problems with the strain just bad odds so far, the one female i got was fire so i'm cool with low numbers as long as theirs high amounts of keepers in the females i do find. I also run clones of my white fire og and grape ape to make sure i always got weight, these are just being run in my tester area .


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (May 22, 2018)

NugHeuser said:


> Haven't seen from you in a while. Still all cmh in your room?


Yep.


----------



## gr865 (May 22, 2018)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Yep.


CD,
Do you have a journal here, would like to take a look.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (May 22, 2018)

gr865 said:


> CD,
> Do you have a journal here, would like to take a look.


Nah. I don't publicly document much.


----------



## Underground Scientist (May 23, 2018)

My 630W LEC Grown Collection


----------



## Underground Scientist (May 23, 2018)

315 Veg is looking for some room in Bloom soonish 

And Young Bloods are gettin going


----------



## oldman60 (May 23, 2018)

Sounds like Crockett family seeds need some stabilizing.
I popped 10 from Bhodi and got 7 females, it was Snow Lotus x Jamaican
pure fire.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (May 24, 2018)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Same. Popped 40 beans and only got 6 females.


Woah, that's pretty bad...


----------



## gr865 (May 24, 2018)

They have recovered nicely, don't think they slowed down much at all.
Day 24 of flower.
    

Did some untwisting of the branches in an attempt to fill in hole in the canopy. She's getting there.

GR


----------



## Yodaweed (May 28, 2018)

So this one tangie male i just could not bring myself to killing, it smells like straight orange peels, super stout and very sativa leaf structure. Might use this male to breed.


----------



## gr865 (May 29, 2018)

Inside the ol' 4 x 4

Day 28 of 12/12

All is going well, no problems to report, which is a good thing.
Added a third water cycle, now at three irrigation cycles per light cycle, 8 programs. Currently, lights on at 9 PM, 1st cycle and times, 9:10 PM, 9:20 and 9:30 each for one minute, just to get about 10% runoff. 2nd cycle 1:00 AM one minute, 1:15 AM two minutes, to just runoff, and third cycle is 6:00 AM one minute, 6:25 one minute, 6:45 AM 2 minutes, a good 20 to 30% runoff.
Began adding Liquid KoolBloom at day 21 @ 8 ml and with this last rez change will be at the 5 ml rate for the next week or so. Still running 0.8 EC with A&B, and with 2 ml Cal/Magic, 1 gram Epsom, 3 ml Rhizo, 9 ml Cannazym, 5 ml Golden Tree and Drip clean. I get a total EC of 1.2.
The only issue I have is with Golden Tree, without recirculation it settles out in the rez's. I had been recirculating from just after the final irrigation cycle to just before the start of the first cycle of night at lights on. This helps stabilize the nutes and provide passive O2 into the solution. At that time it shuts off and I adjust the pH to 5.8 , over the nights cycles it moves maybe to 5.84. Now I will have to recirculate continuously which with cause my pH over the nights cycles move from 5.8 to 5.95 +/-. Not sure is that will be a problem as some fluctuation is good.

Here she is at day 21 just after major pruning and retying.



Here she is this morning day 28.









Pleased with the growth, not lush, not underfed, budding nicely and continuing to stretch some, will do a bit of SC soon, can't move the lights any higher. So I went ahead and did a couple of SC's, did a couple last week, then last night and will do them as needed for height control.

Did this one last week


Did these two this last night.



GR


----------



## gr865 (May 29, 2018)

Inside the ol' 4 x 4
Day 28 of 12/12

Just wanted to add, I am a bit concerned with the height of the lamps, they are 15 to 17 inches off the plants. The lowest I have had these lamps was when the plants grew into them last grow and they were under 12 inches and that gave me a good burn, and that was days 22 and 23 right after defo, so most of the damage was to the new growth.
I do have good control over the environment, well best I can do with what I got. my temps at lights on are 80 degrees canopy level, dark period is high 60's low 70's. Only thing I don't have a good handle on is the humidity but I have very good air movement.
I am hoping I can LST and SC as necessary for height control. This strain does stretch beyond day 21, and it has slowed so maybe it's all good.

GR


----------



## xPeaceofMindx717 (Jun 1, 2018)

So I just picked up a knockoff internal ballast 315 watt fixture along with a 3100K Phillips Horticultural bulb. This thing kicks ASS. So much ass in fact, that I took it down and put my Tasty T2-2100 LED back up. I'm in a 2x4x6'11" tent with 4inch fan/scrubber(@100%) and the air temps jumped into the low 90's within 2 hours of turning that bad boy on. I invested in it as a low heat HID upgrade option, to my disappointment (Is HPS REALLY HOTTER than this beast for comparable wattages? YIKES!) That being said, I'm in LOVE with the spectrum and intensity of this light. I believe it's just the thing I need to bulk up my flowers. Any tips on what I can do to help beyond what I've already put in motion, would be greatly appreciated.

I only had a little 5K BTU window unit in the room that holds the tent and it wasn't cutting it. I invested in a portable 12K BTU and moved the 5K unit to another room, something the missus and I planned to do anyway. The AC is a single hose evaporative exhaust design and is currently just cooling the room. I've seen videos of people making a cowling out of cardboard and duct tape and routing the AC directly into the grow tent from the outside. Has anyone tried this? Would it work to still keep the outer room cool as well as the interior? 

Also ordered a two pack of clip on fans to replace my single one that just shit the bed. Planning on keeping one low near the passive intake, angled upwards on oscillating mode; and the other pointed at the light across the top of the canopy. I'm going to mess around with rerouting my exhaust system from the current horizontal configuration at the top of the tent to a vertical one exhausting out of the roof vent in the back right corner of the tent. If this all fails, my last ditch effort to keep this sweet lamp would be to upgrade to a 6 inch exhaust system. Its my last option because I freaking just bought this new 4 inch filter. 

Last run with the LED, I veg'd at 60% power and flowered at full power. The potency and flavor was excellent but the bud density was lacking compared to my desired outcome. The light was the only variable that I figured could have been improved. This time, I'm vegging under the LED at full power, but I'm considering throwing up the LEC now that the new AC is in and seeing how it goes. She's not a seedling anymore and might be able to handle the increased temperature. Is it better to have the light intensity increase for flowering, or will a constant brightness only positively effect yields?


----------



## gr865 (Jun 1, 2018)

Can you seperate the ballast from the fixture? I do and maintain in the upper 70's low 80's/

The ballast add a lot of heat.


----------



## gr865 (Jun 2, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Can you seperate the ballast from the fixture? I do and maintain in the upper 70's low 80's/
> 
> The ballast add a lot of heat.


I run Nanolux 315W CMH NA, this unit allows me to separate the two, Lamp/fixture and the ballast. Had to buy extension but well worth it.


----------



## xPeaceofMindx717 (Jun 2, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Can you seperate the ballast from the fixture? I do and maintain in the upper 70's low 80's/
> 
> The ballast add a lot of heat.


Anything is possible with enough jammed fingers and "What the Fucks!". I will definitely keep that option on the table should the need arise in the future.

After a bunch more surfing, I just decided to say to hell with it and throw the 315 up with the new AC rolling along. I also rehung my exhaust system vertically, out of the roof, in the right-rear corner of the tent. This allowed me to hang the light much higher up into the ceiling than on my test run. Currently its about 5 feet from the top of the plant, which I will lower in a few days in the attempt to avoid shocking the plant too much. Its been running for about 2 3/4 hours now and my air temps are 75F with 60% humidity at the level of the hood. 

The spectrum and intensity of this lamp is simply incredible! I wish I could bring my bearded dragons or my day geckos in there for a bask. I'm sure they'd LOVE it, they loves their 50 watt Metal Halide's! I might have found the lamp I'll use for my future American Alligator as soon as my wife divorces me... 
Aside from my reptiles and back to my other green babies. 

Just looking at the light coming through my passive vent, I can notice a significant increase in blue spectrum. And nothing got me more excited than watching that beautiful-blue and deadly UV-C bouncing off the tube at fire up. And I thoughts COB's were mini sun's. Bitch please, move over for some actual MF'in plasma!


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## gr865 (Jun 2, 2018)

@ xPeaceofMindx717

My stepson has a beautiful gecko, but they eat greenery, don't think I want a stoned dragon in my house, LOL.


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## xPeaceofMindx717 (Jun 2, 2018)

My gecko's dont, they only like bugs and fruit, but the dragon does. That bastard would chomp the shit out of my girl, the way he eats his collards


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## Yodaweed (Jun 3, 2018)

xPeaceofMindx717 said:


> So I just picked up a knockoff internal ballast 315 watt fixture along with a 3100K Phillips Horticultural bulb. This thing kicks ASS. So much ass in fact, that I took it down and put my Tasty T2-2100 LED back up. I'm in a 2x4x6'11" tent with 4inch fan/scrubber(@100%) and the air temps jumped into the low 90's within 2 hours of turning that bad boy on. I invested in it as a low heat HID upgrade option, to my disappointment (Is HPS REALLY HOTTER than this beast for comparable wattages? YIKES!) That being said, I'm in LOVE with the spectrum and intensity of this light. I believe it's just the thing I need to bulk up my flowers. Any tips on what I can do to help beyond what I've already put in motion, would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> I only had a little 5K BTU window unit in the room that holds the tent and it wasn't cutting it. I invested in a portable 12K BTU and moved the 5K unit to another room, something the missus and I planned to do anyway. The AC is a single hose evaporative exhaust design and is currently just cooling the room. I've seen videos of people making a cowling out of cardboard and duct tape and routing the AC directly into the grow tent from the outside. Has anyone tried this? Would it work to still keep the outer room cool as well as the interior?
> 
> ...


Heat is based off watts used, so HPS is not hotter than another light that uses the same amount of watts. 1 watt = 3.41 btu


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## Carolina Dream'n (Jun 3, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> Heat is based off watts used, so HPS is not hotter than another light that uses the same amount of watts. 1 watt = 3.41 btu


I disagree with this. Brand of ballast and bulb used/length of cord can change bulb temp. DE bulbs run hotter than SE bulbs watt for watt. MH bulbs run different temps than HPS. 110v vs 220v wiring will change temps. Too many variables to simply claim 3.41 btu per watt.


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## Yodaweed (Jun 3, 2018)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> I disagree with this. Brand of ballast and bulb used/length of cord can change bulb temp. DE bulbs run hotter than SE bulbs watt for watt. MH bulbs run different temps than HPS. 110v vs 220v wiring will change temps. Too many variables to simply claim 3.41 btu per watt.


Take that up with the first law of thermodynamics not me, it's why you can directly convert watts to btu.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Jun 4, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> Take that up with the first law of thermodynamics not me, it's why you can directly convert watts to btu.


Well considering the first law of thermodynamics is law of conservation of energy "energy can not be created nor destroyed it can only be transferred from one form to another."

Heat and work and your two forms.
When we turn on a light bulb we are converting electrical energy into light (work) and heat. as long as the sum of those two equal the internal energy then the law has been followed. 

I will throughly stand behind the fact that is not an accurate way to measure heat output from lamps.


----------



## Chip Green (Jun 5, 2018)

So, I wandered into my local liquidator store to pick up a seedling mat....
There in front of me on the shelf, is a factory sealed box, containing a Sunburst 315 CMH with a Phillips 4200k bulb.... for $150....
There's no way I could leave that just sitting there right? I didn't. I brought it home. I had to.
As a DIY LED enthusiast, I have zero experience with CMH, but I've been quite curious, and tempted to get one for some time now, so I feel like today was a bit of a stroke of good fortune.
Had plans of a new build in the works, but now? This honey ought to suffice for at least 3x3 of a 4x4 tent right?
Absolute worst case, these are fantastic VEG units?


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## DemonTrich (Jun 5, 2018)

The bulb alone is 73.00

Score!


----------



## Javadog (Jun 5, 2018)

I like what they do in Flower too, but they would be a rocking Veg light.

Score indeed!


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## oldman60 (Jun 5, 2018)

A short time back I was able to grab 2 630 dual bulb units for $150 ea.
(should have got a lottery ticket that day)


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## Yodaweed (Jun 7, 2018)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Well considering the first law of thermodynamics is law of conservation of energy "energy can not be created nor destroyed it can only be transferred from one form to another."
> 
> Heat and work and your two forms.
> When we turn on a light bulb we are converting electrical energy into light (work) and heat. as long as the sum of those two equal the internal energy then the law has been followed.
> ...


Transformed into heat....plants don't absorb enough to make a difference so eventually all watts turn to heat thats why they can be directly converted, proof is in the pudding.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Jun 7, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> Transformed into heat....plants don't absorb enough to make a difference so eventually all watts turn to heat thats why they can be directly converted, proof is in the pudding.


Not sure what pudding you're referring to.
Real life tells me otherwise. Dealing with almost every brand of ballast and bulb out, it's not that simple.


----------



## DemonTrich (Jun 8, 2018)




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## ColoradoHighGrower (Jun 10, 2018)

Watt is a unit of power, watt-hour is a measure of energy. High power (fast consumption of energy) is almost always less efficient compared to a lower power option for conducting the same amount of work (i.e., more energy is converted directly to thermal energy and lost to surrounding environment). So two 300w lights will almost always be more efficient par-for-par compared to a single 600w option. Also, balast/cabling/voltage of opperation are almost guaranteed to dominate the differences in efficiency between two lights, not just the bulbs (e.g., a 315w Plix is gonna run different than a 315 Sunsys with same bulb)...


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Jun 10, 2018)

Next run, instead of smoking your stuff, just go ahead and burn your enitre crop and see how much that burning plant material can heat up a CC of water. That would give an approximate measure of energy your plants consumed and converted to chemical potential energy from your fancy heat makers


----------



## gr865 (Jun 12, 2018)

Just a short update on the Monster in my 4 x 4 under the twin 315's.
Day 42 and another trim session. Mainly fan and lower growth.
Around 3 weeks to go.
As I worked on her I would tie her back in a counter clockwise rotation.


Got her laid out but have the whole back side to complete.
 
The Mass.
      

I know I will be doing a bunch more tying and bending.

GR


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## ThaMagnificent (Jun 12, 2018)

I moved my space around and have my plants vegging over my 315s but still using the 3100k bulbs. Plants are drooping and some leaves dying off. Could this be because of the spectrum?


----------



## DemonTrich (Jun 12, 2018)

I've ran the 942 bulb to harvest and the 931. What's the issue with your setup? And why do you think it's the bulb. I'm going on 2yrs of cmh growa.


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## gwheels (Jun 12, 2018)

The 4k bulb works start to finish. I used a 3k and I think the 4k would have resulted in better veg and tighter inter-nodal distance. Great deal for 150 and I bet you wont see that again !


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## ThaMagnificent (Jun 12, 2018)

DemonTrich said:


> I've ran the 942 bulb to harvest and the 931. What's the issue with your setup? And why do you think it's the bulb. I'm going on 2yrs of cmh growa.


I had them under a 150 w MH and they were fine until I moved then under the 315 and the big girls look like this


----------



## DemonTrich (Jun 13, 2018)

I found my.clones dont like the t9 942 Philip's cmh too much. Too much ava/b for them, and they start to get purple leaves. Kinda like hardening off a plant for outdoor.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Jun 14, 2018)

ThaMagnificent said:


> I had them under a 150 w MH and they were fine until I moved then under the 315 and the big girls look like this


My clones go from t5 to 315 cmh 4200k and I raise the light way up(3 feet) and after a few days I lower it a little, I continue this until I get to 20". I do not run cooled hoods. Some strains react better and some react worse.


----------



## Yodaweed (Jun 14, 2018)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Not sure what pudding you're referring to.
> Real life tells me otherwise. Dealing with almost every brand of ballast and bulb out, it's not that simple.


It's called the first law of thermodynamics, you might want to pickup a basic science book bro you have zero understanding of how heat works.

Watts are a measurement of energy.

read this thread if you still cannot grasp this

https://www.rollitup.org/t/heat-from-1200w-of-1212s-vero-29s-cxm-22-cxb3590-compared-to-2x-600w.936071/

Here's a quote you might want to read to get a better understanding of heat.



frica said:


> Yes, good LEDs put out more light.
> 
> That light eventually also turns into heat..
> Photosynthesis while endothermic is very inefficient so negligible.
> ...


----------



## ThaMagnificent (Jun 14, 2018)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> My clones go from t5 to 315 cmh 4200k and I raise the light way up(3 feet) and after a few days I lower it a little, I continue this until I get to 20". I do not run cooled hoods. Some strains react better and some react worse.


Yea I went back to the 150mh on my moms and they bounced back. I ordered the 3k bulb so will install that tomorrow


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Jun 14, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> It's called the first law of thermodynamics, you might want to pickup a basic science book bro you have zero understanding of how heat works.
> 
> Watts are a measurement of energy.
> 
> ...


I love how when people disagree online there first actions is to insult the others intelligence. You do not know me, nor my intellectual capacity. As far as I'm concerned this conversation is over. Can't be respectful then I don't have time for you.


----------



## Yodaweed (Jun 15, 2018)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> I love how when people disagree online there first actions is to insult the others intelligence. You do not know me, nor my intellectual capacity. As far as I'm concerned this conversation is over. Can't be respectful then I don't have time for you.


It must be nice to be that ignorant.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Jun 15, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> It must be nice to be that ignorant.


Good comeback. You feel like a badass yet for attempting to talk shit online?

I own and operate over 22,000 square foot of medical cannabis greenhouse space.
I own and operate one of the largest industrial hemp farms on the east coast.
I've consulted over 50 farms ranging from 2000 light indoor cannabis operations to 25 acre corn fields.
I regular give speeches at two local colleges that focus on agriculture about organic IPM.

I have more real life experience with horticulture than the average... I will stick with my conclusion that it isn't as simple as a formula.

Disagree. Agree. I honestly do not care but do not disrespect me. Not once did I disrespect you. Can't have a conversation without name calling I'll simply block you. I get on this site very rarely because of the way people act. People have other opinions, and are allowed those opinions without be bombarded with names.


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## Carolina Dream'n (Jun 15, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Next run, instead of smoking your stuff, just go ahead and burn your enitre crop and see how much that burning plant material can heat up a CC of water. That would give an approximate measure of energy your plants consumed and converted to chemical potential energy from your fancy heat makers


Isn't this about the same process we use to find calories in food?


----------



## Coloradoclear (Jun 15, 2018)

Chip Green said:


> So, I wandered into my local liquidator store to pick up a seedling mat....
> There in front of me on the shelf, is a factory sealed box, containing a Sunburst 315 CMH with a Phillips 4200k bulb.... for $150....
> There's no way I could leave that just sitting there right? I didn't. I brought it home. I had to.
> As a DIY LED enthusiast, I have zero experience with CMH, but I've been quite curious, and tempted to get one for some time now, so I feel like today was a bit of a stroke of good fortune.
> ...


I love my Sunburst 315-have the 3K lamp . . . Paid like $375 for it.


----------



## Yodaweed (Jun 17, 2018)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Good comeback. You feel like a badass yet for attempting to talk shit online?
> 
> I own and operate over 22,000 square foot of medical cannabis greenhouse space.
> I own and operate one of the largest industrial hemp farms on the east coast.
> ...


If you have all that space and setup how do you not know how to calculate basic heat loads....kinda makes me think you must not be that great a grower.


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Jun 17, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> If you have all that space and setup how do you not know how to calculate basic heat loads....kinda makes me think you must not be that great a grower.


Following a elementary math formula isn't the problem. It's the fact I do not think that formula applies to this situation. We just gonna have to agree to disagree.


----------



## Yodaweed (Jun 18, 2018)

Carolina Dream'n said:


> Following a elementary math formula isn't the problem. It's the fact I do not think that formula applies to this situation. We just gonna have to agree to disagree.


It's a law of nature, it's why it's called the first law of thermodynamics, it doesn't matter if you think it applies, it applies in every situation because laws cannot be disproven.


----------



## gr865 (Jun 18, 2018)

Anyone like to talk about the 315W CMH?
Heat is an issue only if you let it be. 
Environmental controls are the key, get your room is order an you should not have a heat issue. It took me awhile to learn that and even though it is not perfect now it is close.


----------



## DemonTrich (Jun 18, 2018)

My ac barely.runs in the winter, basement setting with 4x 315 in ac hoods. It does cycle more last 2 weeks when I'm dropping temps to finish my girls off for harvest.


----------



## gr865 (Jun 18, 2018)

I set the AC that is in the room I draw air from @ 70 degrees when lights are on, that keeps the tent @ 78 to 80 degrees. Lights off, I do not use the AC, just the house temp pulled into the tent. House is set at 76 degrees so by the time it is pulled through the tent, the temp is in the low 70's high 60's. I will be running the AC with lights off starting this week, my 7th weeks of 12/12, to get the temp around 68 in the tent at lights off, as I want a good 10 to 13 degrees difference between lights on and lights off. Get them buds tightening up nicely.

GR


----------



## Carolina Dream'n (Jun 19, 2018)

Platinum Purple Candy #8 bred by InHouse Genetics. 

Light dep supplemented with 315s.

Plants put outside February 12th supplemented till March 21st. Deps pulled April 16th to keep flower schedule. Harvested June 1st. Greenhouses refilled and supplemental lighting started again. Shouldn't need as long of a veg this round before flipping again. Trying to get 4 runs out of each houses this year.


----------



## DemonTrich (Jun 19, 2018)

Co2!

The power/ ac cost saver. And more yield to boot. It's a win win!

I only get down to 70 my last week of flower. Freeze them girls.and they bust out their purple coats (leaves for those of you who can't keep up)


----------



## gr865 (Jun 20, 2018)

Update:

Day 49 about two weeks left to go. 

Buds are just fattening up.  

The heart of this plant. Check out the growth around the crown of her trunk, should I try and re-veg her after harvest. I don't think so, this is a lot of work.
 

GR


----------



## Javadog (Jun 20, 2018)

That is an amazing spaghetti bowl of branches there!

I know LSD. You will enjoy this product, I am thinking.

:0)


----------



## gr865 (Jun 20, 2018)

Javadog said:


> That is an amazing spaghetti bowl of branches there!
> 
> I know LSD. You will enjoy this product, I am thinking.
> 
> :0)


Yeah Java, this is my 3rd grow of her and her sisters, 5 pheno's to start, then 4 of pheno #1 and one of pheno #3, and now this monster crop which is pheno #5 of this strain. It makes some of the best medicine I have made.


----------



## Coloradoclear (Jun 20, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Update:
> 
> Day 49 about two weeks left to go.
> View attachment 4153540
> ...


Wow, that's impressive!!! You must have the patience of a monk.


----------



## Coloradoclear (Jun 20, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Anyone like to talk about the 315W CMH?
> Heat is an issue only if you let it be.
> Environmental controls are the key, get your room is order an you should not have a heat issue. It took me awhile to learn that and even though it is not perfect now it is close.


I had to go to a slightly bigger fan and seal up my ventilation system. I absolutely love my 315 . . . and I would guess the heat is only slightly greater than a 250 HPS.


----------



## gr865 (Jun 20, 2018)

Coloradoclear said:


> I had to go to a slightly bigger fan and seal up my ventilation system. I absolutely love my 315 . . . and I would guess the heat is only slightly greater than a 250 HPS.


Are you running your ballast in the same tent as your plants, if so you should look at separating the lamp and ballast.
I did, only took an extension cord.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Jun 26, 2018)

What's up folks! Back from vacation, all rested up, and ready to pop some beans!! Did somebody say Jelly Pie?


----------



## gr865 (Jun 26, 2018)

@ CHG 
Where did you go in your trip. Going to headed to New Orleans in about a month, after harvest, drying and curing, well it will be about two weeks in cure when I leave. Son is coming by to burp them for me, should only need him to do it for a few days. I may be cured by then, we shall see.


----------



## NugHeuser (Jun 26, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> What's up folks! Back from vacation, all rested up, and ready to pop some beans!! Did somebody say Jelly Pie?


Just ordered me some jelly pie the other day, had my eyes on that one for a while.

Edit: You gonna have a journal going or just plan on updating here?


----------



## gr865 (Jun 26, 2018)

What's going on under my 315's in the 4 X 4
Day 56
Barneys Farm LSD, Pheno #5 Monster Crop.
         

Since I started flushing I am getting a little tuff of fast new growth at the very tip of the buds.
Will be chopping this weekend.

GR


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Jun 27, 2018)

NugHeuser said:


> Just ordered me some jelly pie the other day, had my eyes on that one for a while.
> 
> Edit: You gonna have a journal going or just plan on updating here?


I might do a journal, but this is also one of my favorite threads, so maybe both? I'm still a noob (this will only be my 5th run ever), so the thought of full documentation of my sloppiness seems silly, and makes me a bit nervous of all the rejection I'd probably get... lol


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Jun 27, 2018)

gr865 said:


> @ CHG
> Where did you go in your trip. Going to headed to New Orleans in about a month, after harvest, drying and curing, well it will be about two weeks in cure when I leave. Son is coming by to burp them for me, should only need him to do it for a few days. I may be cured by then, we shall see.


Iceland  beautiful but fucking expensive as hell...


----------



## NugHeuser (Jun 27, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> I might do a journal, but this is also one of my favorite threads, so maybe both? I'm still a noob (this will only be my 5th run ever), so the thought of full documentation of my sloppiness seems silly, and makes me a bit nervous of all the rejection I'd probably get... lol


Oh it's all good. I'm just talking simple description and picture updates, nothing fancy. Then I'll have a nice sneak peak at what I have coming since my JP will probably be popped in a few weeks or so.


----------



## gr865 (Jul 1, 2018)

Couple of pics the night before chop, stopped watering and cut the lights for 48 hrs prior chop.













As she was just about to get chopped, she is a very lovely plant.







Didn't take a lot of pics during the chop, was too damn busy,




, but here is one before and after.














It was a pleasure!







Now, I figure around 5 to 7 days @ approx 70 degrees with approx 55 to 60 % humidity. Let's see what she does. I am figuring a pound plus, but do not believe I did a G/W.




GR


----------



## ThatSpudGuy (Jul 1, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Couple of pics the night before chop, stopped watering and cut the lights for 48 hrs prior chop.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Fair play dude thats some job


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Jul 2, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Couple of pics the night before chop, stopped watering and cut the lights for 48 hrs prior chop.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yet another example of why plant count regulations are sort of meaningless for the small folks out there...


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Jul 5, 2018)

NugHeuser said:


> Oh it's all good. I'm just talking simple description and picture updates, nothing fancy. Then I'll have a nice sneak peak at what I have coming since my JP will probably be popped in a few weeks or so.


Journal started: https://www.rollitup.org/Journal/coloradohighgrower.925523/


----------



## NugHeuser (Jul 5, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Journal started: https://www.rollitup.org/Journal/coloradohighgrower.925523/


Click on the link and says I dont have permission to view it?


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Jul 5, 2018)

NugHeuser said:


> Click on the link and says I dont have permission to view it?


Hmmm... not sure how to unlock it for others to view!? I'll need to do some research on it, and possibly ask an administrator.... standby


----------



## gr865 (Jul 7, 2018)

This is a recap of this Barneys Farm LSD Pheno #5 Monster Crop.

A little history:
Ten Clones were taken during veg from a vertical grow that started on 10/4/17. That vert grow went into flower on 11/22/17.
At day 33 of flower I took 9 clones off of the 5 plants in flower, only one made it, pheno #5.
Well the vertical grow was harvested on 1/24/18, 24.5 zips, 1.08 G/W
Five of the clones that were taken on 10/4/17 went into the tent on and put into flower on 1/29/18, 5 plant horizontal grow. This was harvested on 4/2/18, 26.5 zips 1.18 G/W
That brings us to the star of this show, the Barneys Farm LSD Pheno #5, The Monster Crop.
Again this clone was taken at day 33 of 12/12 on 12/26/17 and vegged for 14 week under a T5 6 lamp fixture and natural sunlight plus 4 weeks in the tent under the two 315’s. Never want to do 18 weeks in veg again, waste of time and energy.
She was put into flower one 4/29/18 and harvested 61 days later on 6/30/18.

Twenty six days after she was cloned she finely started rooting so transplanted into Solo's, she was the only one to make it.






Fourteen days later and going through massive hormonal change to get back to veg.






4/29/18 flipped into 12/12












5/15, And elongation continues.


















5/21 pruning day












5/28 recovered from the 21 day pruning and growing well.


















6/04 Just moving branch to expose them to more light












6/11 minor pruning and retie.


















6/17 Just watching her fatten up












Con't in next post.


----------



## gr865 (Jul 7, 2018)

Con't from previous post.

6/25


















6/30 Harvest day
  


So after 4 days on the rack, one day in plastic bag to re-hydrate. After day back on the rack the buds were trimmed off the branches and jarred with a Boveda pack in each.
Weight in the jars 526 g's, 18.8 zips of trimmed smokable buds, and like I expected only 0.83 G/W. 18 plus zips off one plant ain't too bad but I really wanted to hit the G/W.
I believe had I had some experience in this style of grow I would have done better but, shit, I had no idea what I was doing during LST and trim, because she was so massive, so I probably over trimmed. Had I of had some form of netting to hold them up I probably would have trimmed less. This pheno was much different than #1 which was in the horizontal grow, it was more sativa like, long spacing between nodes, tall and stretchy but the nugs themselves are very hard and compact.
But live and learn, I am happy.
This is going to make some very nice FECO, I figure off 16 zips of buds and what ever the weight of the sugar leaf trim I should get around 60 to 75 grams of high quality oil.

GR


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Jul 7, 2018)

Okay all (& @NugHeuser ), try this, if interested, my grow journal, starting with some Greenpoint genetics... 
https://www.rollitup.org/t/315w-lec-soil-mix-organics-nube.969102/

Access works okay now??


----------



## oldman60 (Jul 19, 2018)

NugHeuser said:


> Click on the link and says I dont have permission to view it?


Diddo no permission.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Jul 27, 2018)

Whelp, my journal is going, but not sure how to share the link successfully. . It's accessible under forums>grow journals link, but whatever.  I like posting to this page too- greenpoint seedlings update:


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Aug 9, 2018)

Kinda quiet in here- what's up folks?  

Question: what's a good point to sex my girls? ~ half way through my planned veg? Recommendations?


----------



## oldman60 (Aug 9, 2018)

6 weeks or when the shade leaves start a staggered growth pattern instead of opposed growth.
The females should show with 2 pistils at the inter-nodes males are kind of like tiny crab claws.
Hope I was a help.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Aug 9, 2018)

Thanks- So no temporary light flip?


----------



## oldman60 (Aug 9, 2018)

No they will show at sexual maturity but you can force it by 72 hrs dark then 12/12 until
they show then 72 on and back to 18/6.


----------



## Aviatorshades (Aug 13, 2018)

Went through 20 pages. So I feel I’m allowed to ask now hahah. In a 4x4x7 how far away should I have my single 315 cmh open hood from the week old seedlings? I keep seeing 18” from top of plant and some saying 3’!! Or so I just stick to holding my hand under the light and if it gets too hot then raise it until the very top of my hand above plant doesn’t heat up?


----------



## oldman60 (Aug 13, 2018)

That works but seedlings can be sensitive be careful cmh put out more UV so watch out for burning.


----------



## Yodaweed (Aug 17, 2018)

White Fire OG under 315CMH


----------



## oldman60 (Aug 17, 2018)

That's a frosty wench how many days in?


----------



## Yodaweed (Aug 17, 2018)

oldman60 said:


> That's a frosty wench how many days in?


That was chop day, i believe day 63


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 17, 2018)

Aviatorshades said:


> Went through 20 pages. So I feel I’m allowed to ask now hahah. In a 4x4x7 how far away should I have my single 315 cmh open hood from the week old seedlings? I keep seeing 18” from top of plant and some saying 3’!! Or so I just stick to holding my hand under the light and if it gets too hot then raise it until the very top of my hand above plant doesn’t heat up?


The sweet spot for seedlings in my 3x3 under the open vertical remote reflector with a Phillips 3100k bulb is about 40”. 

I move the plants up according to how happy the leaves look and how much they are stretching. 

But usually about an inch per day closer works well. 

Teenagers at about 2-3’

Mature flowering plants at 16”-18” 

But you have to watch your own plants I. Your space to decide. There are so many variables.


----------



## gwheels (Aug 17, 2018)

I have a 4200k and 3100k bulb for my 315. I just got the 4200 and am running it in veg. Should i leave that for flower or switch out?

I will also run a qb board and a couple of cobs to fill out the space.


----------



## gwheels (Aug 17, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> The sweet spot for seedlings in my 3x3 under the open vertical remote reflector with a Phillips 3100k bulb is about 40”.
> 
> I move the plants up according to how happy the leaves look and how much they are stretching.
> 
> ...


I think you are right on. I keep mine about 2 feet off the tops of the ones i put in autopots. When veg is over i keep about an 18 inch distance until end of flower and then maybe 12 to 18 inches


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 17, 2018)

gwheels said:


> I think you are right on. I keep mine about 2 feet off the tops of the ones i put in autopots. When veg is over i keep about an 18 inch distance until end of flower and then maybe 12 to 18 inches



I didn’t decide. My plants did. Lol.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 17, 2018)

gwheels said:


> View attachment 4182518 I have a 4200k and 3100k bulb for my 315. I just got the 4200 and am running it in veg. Should i leave that for flower or switch out?
> 
> I will also run a qb board and a couple of cobs to fill out the space.



Depends on what you are going for. The 3100k alone keeps plants quite short and compact so I assume the 4200k with even more blue and less red spike will keep them even shorter. And leafier. 

Adding in the full spectrum boards will further add to the heavy blue spectrum. 

Probably great for space saving but not as good to stretch them out and fill larger spaces. 

Also these spectrums tend to grow more leaves than bud. 

I would run 2 3100k for flower but that’s just my opinion.


----------



## gwheels (Aug 17, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Depends on what you are going for. The 3100k alone keeps plants quite short and compact so I assume the 4200k with even more blue and less red spike will keep them even shorter. And leafier.
> 
> Adding in the full spectrum boards will further add to the heavy blue spectrum.
> 
> ...


I will run the 3100k in flower on the 315 and with my 3500 vero at 100 watts and and 4k QB at 100 wats. It will get me to around 3500k


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 17, 2018)

gwheels said:


> I will run the 3100k in flower on the 315 and with my 3500 vero at 100 watts and and 4k QB at 100 wats. It will get me to around 3500k



Doesn’t work that way. They don’t average out like that. And all the spectrums are different even with the same color temp listed. 

Have to look at the spectrum to compare.


----------



## oldman60 (Aug 17, 2018)

3100 or 4200 I get more leaves with CMH than HPS but I'm getting better resin and yields.
My last pull which was my 2nd full CMH grow was about 20% better than HPS.


----------



## Aviatorshades (Aug 18, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> The sweet spot for seedlings in my 3x3 under the open vertical remote reflector with a Phillips 3100k bulb is about 40”.
> 
> I move the plants up according to how happy the leaves look and how much they are stretching.
> 
> ...


Mine is horizontal not vertical. Does that change the 40” distance??


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 18, 2018)

Aviatorshades said:


> Mine is horizontal not vertical. Does that change the 40” distance??



Don’t know. But I would use those distances as a guideline and watch the plants to be sure they are happy with it.


----------



## Aviatorshades (Aug 18, 2018)

I had it around 26” away and they didn’t seem stressed however two seedlings have 8-10 leaves starting. But 3 are only have its first two sets of serrated leaves. They just slow or maybe I’ve been overwatering. I’ve got advanced nutrients micro bloom grow maybe too soon to start that or would a 1/4 does help?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 18, 2018)

oldman60 said:


> 3100 or 4200 I get more leaves with CMH than HPS but I'm getting better resin and yields.
> My last pull which was my 2nd full CMH grow was about 20% better than HPS.



Better yields than what wattage hps?

I thought I was getting more frost or a “better” high when I first tested the cmh 315 comparing to 600 super hps but after I took the cmh out the weed was still as frosty and potent. Just looked better under the more natural light. 

It was mostly confirmation bias. 

And the 600 consistently did 30% more yield with denser buds top to bottom. 

But those numbers show a higher efficiency for the cmh. 

I prefer them combined so far. I am testing a full run in a 3x3 tent next.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 18, 2018)

Aviatorshades said:


> I had it around 26” away and they didn’t seem stressed however two seedlings have 8-10 leaves starting. But 3 are only have its first two sets of serrated leaves. They just slow or maybe I’ve been overwatering. I’ve got advanced nutrients micro bloom grow maybe too soon to start that or would a 1/4 does help?



Seeds can all grow different. I can’t see from here. Lol. But feed when you see signs of hunger. Like lower leaves yellowing or something. Fertilizer doesn’t force them to grow like that. Plants get energy from light. Nutes are more like vitamins to plants than food. 

And there are tons of variables like what medium they are growing in and how big and how much light to decide the strength of the nutes.


----------



## Aviatorshades (Aug 18, 2018)

On the runts the cotyledpns are yellowing on one of them. Other runts seem fine


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 18, 2018)

Aviatorshades said:


> On the runts the cotyledpns are yellowing on one of them. Other runts seem fine


You should start a thread for help. We are just guessing without pics and all info.


----------



## oldman60 (Aug 18, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Better yields than what wattage hps?
> 
> I thought I was getting more frost or a “better” high when I first tested the cmh 315 comparing to 600 super hps but after I took the cmh out the weed was still as frosty and potent. Just looked better under the more natural light.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry they were 600's with Ushio super hps.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 18, 2018)

oldman60 said:


> I'm sorry they were 600's with Ushio super hps.


If comparing a 600 hps to a 315 cmh you got higher yields with the 315 doesn’t make sense to me.


----------



## doniawon (Aug 18, 2018)

banana punch simbiotic


----------



## oldman60 (Aug 18, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> If comparing a 600 hps to a 315 cmh you got higher yields with the 315 doesn’t make sense to me.


I was using 4 600's I now have 4 315's and 2 630's giving more sq.ft. coverage for 120 more watts.


----------



## Aviatorshades (Aug 18, 2018)

https://www.rollitup.org/p/14419223/
I posted some photos. Thanks for telling me to make a thread. I didn’t mean to annoy anyone. In here. I’m just new and needed help


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 18, 2018)

Aviatorshades said:


> https://www.rollitup.org/p/14419223/
> I posted some photos. Thanks for telling me to make a thread. I didn’t mean to annoy anyone. In here. I’m just new and needed help




No problem. Also better to hit reply to answer someone or use the @ symbol and their user name to alert them to your comment. 

Like @MichiganMedGrower


----------



## Aviatorshades (Aug 18, 2018)

@MichiganMedGrower thanks!


----------



## nobighurry (Aug 19, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Okay all (& @NugHeuser ), try this, if interested, my grow journal, starting with some Greenpoint genetics...
> https://www.rollitup.org/t/315w-lec-soil-mix-organics-nube.969102/
> 
> Access works okay now??


I was able to view it, looking good thanks


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Aug 19, 2018)

nobighurry said:


> I was able to view it, looking good thanks


Thanks @nobighurry !!!


----------



## genuity (Aug 20, 2018)

2+yr old bulb
 
Around 3 weeks of growth.


----------



## thenotsoesoteric (Aug 22, 2018)

I'll be joining the club in a week or so, just waiting for shipping. Looking forward to flowering under something besides the 400w hps. I can't run a 600w in my little 3x3 tent so might as well go cmh seeing as that seems to be the 315w sweet spot anyway.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 23, 2018)

thenotsoesoteric said:


> I'll be joining the club in a week or so, just waiting for shipping. Looking forward to flowering under something besides the 400w hps. I can't run a 600w in my little 3x3 tent so might as well go cmh seeing as that seems to be the 315w sweet spot anyway.



My seedlings are up and running. I ditched a slow deformed one as the other 3 are bright and vigorous. 

So 3 POW 33 x Blue Lemon Thai for a 12/12 run in the 3x3 under a sun system remote open vertical reflector loaded with a Phillips 315w 3100k bulb run on a galaxy LEC ballast. 

  

Funny I upgraded the os on my I phone and now the lines show up in my cmh pics. But last year on the old os the camera took clear pics. 

Weird. Might have to use a room light and turn off the hid to document.


----------



## Aviatorshades (Aug 23, 2018)

What yield are you getting doing 12/12 from seed with 315w cmh


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 23, 2018)

Aviatorshades said:


> What yield are you getting doing 12/12 from seed with 315w cmh



Don’t know yet from the lone 315 in the 3x3 but under my 600’s I have been averaging about 4-5 oz dry and a jar or 2 of little and loose bud and bud leaf trim each plant of the ch9 seeds. 

With 5 weeks veg under the 315 I was averaging 6-7 oz. but the plants get big. 

They are mostly sativa leaning hybrids I’m growing. They get way huge for my little growroom with even the 5 weeks veg under the 315. Manageable under my t-5 fluorescent lamp. 

But when I tested. 12/12 have the same results for yield and quality as 4 weeks under the t-5’s. 

Just the plants had less leaves and thinner branches. Needed more stakes and tying. 

So I’m running the flower room and the 3x3 12/12 from seed for now.


----------



## dangledo (Aug 23, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Don’t know yet from the lone 315 in the 3x3 but under my 600’s I have been averaging about 4-5 oz dry


4-5 from seed? Pics?


----------



## Yodaweed (Aug 23, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> My seedlings are up and running. I ditched a slow deformed one as the other 3 are bright and vigorous.
> 
> So 3 POW 33 x Blue Lemon Thai for a 12/12 run in the 3x3 under a sun system remote open vertical reflector loaded with a Phillips 315w 3100k bulb run on a galaxy LEC ballast.
> 
> ...


Looks like you finally got the right reflector for your CMH, notice a lot more intensity with the vertical bulb?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 23, 2018)

dangledo said:


> 4-5 from seed? Pics?



I post pics all the time for a couple years now. I run a staggered perpetual with a plant or two harvested every week or two. 

Just harvested this CH9 Herijuana jack a few days ago. Not weighed yet but will surely hit the average or better. 

Before leaves removed. 
 

After leaves removed. 


CH9 Citral x POW 33 before leaf removal. Harvested in December of 2017
 

After


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 23, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> Looks like you finally got the right reflector for your CMH, notice a lot more intensity with the vertical bulb?


That’s the only one I bought. Haven’t tried any others.


----------



## oldman60 (Aug 23, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I post pics all the time for a couple years now. I run a staggered perpetual with a plant or two harvested every week or two.
> 
> Just harvested this CH9 Herijuana jack a few days ago. Not weighed yet but will surely hit the average or better.
> 
> ...


Looks like you're hitting it well.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 23, 2018)

oldman60 said:


> Looks like you're hitting it well.



Thank you. I have been practicing with the same soil, pots and everything for over 4 years a plant at a time in a row perpetually. Haven’t had a day off yet. Always something to do.

My yield (and maybe quality too) has doubled since 3 years ago.


----------



## oldman60 (Aug 23, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Thank you. I have been practicing with the same soil, pots and everything for over 4 years a plant at a time in a row perpetually. Haven’t had a day off yet. Always something to do.
> 
> My yield (and maybe quality too) has doubled since 3 years ago.


That's the way, if it isn't broke don't fix it.


----------



## dangledo (Aug 24, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> I post pics all the time for a couple years now. I run a staggered perpetual with a plant or two harvested every week or two.
> 
> Just harvested this CH9 Herijuana jack a few days ago. Not weighed yet but will surely hit the average or better.
> 
> ...


Oh for sure I've seen your grows, always nice and healthy. Just didn't remember seeing 12/12 from seed. 4-5 is impressive. good work


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## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 24, 2018)

dangledo said:


> Oh for sure I've seen your grows, always nice and healthy. Just didn't remember seeing 12/12 from seed. 4-5 is impressive. good work



Thank you


----------



## oldman60 (Aug 26, 2018)

I'll be running some Black Viet Namese plants soon they go 12/12 from seed also.
I think I may have some Chocolate Thai to.


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## gr865 (Aug 31, 2018)

Well time to start another grow, this time it's again a vertical grow with Big Buddha Cheese, 8/18.
Started 7 seeds in water for 36 hrs then into paper towels for another 24 plus hours, then into coco solo's.
It only took a day for three of the solo's to pop and another day for the forth, but nothing since. I put 3 more seeds soaking and then into paper towels. Put them into coco solo's on the 28th. This is the longest I have had to wait for get beans up. Three days and nothing up yet.

Normally I get 90 plus % germ, not sure what I will get with this, but hate having to plant 10 seeds to get at least 5 up.














I am so ready for this grow, hope to get enough to make a good batch of FECO.

OK, so now it has been 13 days since I first started the 7 seeds and three days since I put the other 3 seeds into solo's. Two more of the original 7 came up so I am at 6 of 7 pop'ed.
The other three have been in coco solo's since Tuesday. Nothing yet.
 
So 6 out of 10 so far, going to move the 4 solo's that have not pop'ed out from under the direct lights for a few days see if that won't kick start germ on these 4.

GR


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## MichiganMedGrower (Aug 31, 2018)

oldman60 said:


> I'll be running some Black Viet Namese plants soon they go 12/12 from seed also.
> I think I may have some Chocolate Thai to.



I’m jealous


----------



## ThatSpudGuy (Aug 31, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Well time to start another grow, this time it's again a vertical grow with Big Buddha Cheese, 8/18.
> Started 7 seeds in water for 36 hrs then into paper towels for another 24 plus hours, then into coco solo's.
> It only took a day for three of the solo's to pop and another day for the forth, but nothing since. I put 3 more seeds soaking and then into paper towels. Put them into coco solo's on the 28th. This is the longest I have had to wait for get beans up. Three days and nothing up yet.
> 
> ...


looking forward to seeing the sort of beast you produce this round man


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## Javadog (Sep 1, 2018)

Yup, this should be good. :0)

I had that happen to me GR...started me wondering about how fast viability declines.

I had some Cali Connection packs for which the germ. rate was low enough to make
me wonder whether I had bought stale beans. ...might have been me though.

Good luck!


----------



## Bad Karma (Sep 1, 2018)

Javadog said:


> Yup, this should be good. :0)
> 
> I had that happen to me GR...started me wondering about how fast viability declines.
> 
> ...


Cali Connection is known for having weak germ rates in general. It's more likely breeder error than grower error.

What do California Connection seeds and antibacterial soap have in common? No germs.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Sep 1, 2018)

Bad Karma said:


> Cali Connection is known for having weak germ rates in general. It's more likely breeder error than grower error.
> 
> What do California Connection seeds and antibacterial soap have in common? No germs.



Hey man what’s up? I wanted to tell you that we finally had a longer power outage here. 

My Galaxy cmh ballast re fired in 30 minutes I think as my hps are on a 20 minute restart controller and shortly after the cmh came back on without me touching anything. 

The green light went to a flash twice then pause then flash twice mode until it restarted.


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## Javadog (Sep 2, 2018)

Thanks for the time BK. I can say that my CC packs from Attitude seemed to be fresher....but, again, might be me. :0)


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## trenton735 (Sep 4, 2018)

Thinking about replacing my 2 600w 4x8 tent to CMH. Would you guys go with 2 630w or 3 315w?


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## gr865 (Sep 4, 2018)

They say that the 315's do a 3 X 3, I have run two of them horizontal in a 4 x 4 with good results, I normally run 2 stacked 315's in a 5 plant vertical grow in my 4 x 4.


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## trenton735 (Sep 4, 2018)

gr865 said:


> They say that the 315's do a 3 X 3, I have run two of them horizontal in a 4 x 4 with good results, I normally run 2 stacked 315's in a 5 plant vertical grow in my 4 x 4.



How are they as far as penetration? That’s what I’m most worried about. I run a 3x6 tray but about 12-18 plants at a time depending. I’m leaning towards the 630 side pending I’d get THAT much more yield. Or if it’s just overkill. Not many ppl on here with the 630 unit


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## gr865 (Sep 4, 2018)

This was a horizontal grow, 5 plants, smokable 26.5 zips. 
 

This was a 5 plant vertical grow, 4 G13 Haze was 23.5 zips. Had one Critical Kush did not do well, was only 3.5 zips. So the total was 27 smokable zips. 

I would give this bud tightness a 8 + out of 10 in the horizontal grow and 9.5 on the vert grow.

GR


----------



## trenton735 (Sep 4, 2018)

gr865 said:


> This was a horizontal grow, 5 plants, smokable 26.5 zips.
> View attachment 4192940
> 
> This was a 5 plant vertical grow, 4 G13 Haze was 23.5 zips. Had one Critical Kush did not do well, was only 3.5 zips. So the total was 27 smokable zips.
> ...


Nice pull!! And only 2 315s? By vertical grow do you mean a 315 hood with vertical bulb or just a bare bulb? What brand 315?


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## gr865 (Sep 4, 2018)

trenton735 said:


> Nice pull!! And only 2 315s? By vertical grow do you mean a 315 hood with vertical bulb or just a bare bulb? What brand 315?


Stacked bare bulb 315's, in vertical but the Nanolux 315 comes with the hood and a vertical bulb. That is what I use in my horizontal grows.
You can see my journal in my sig if your interested.
1st one is horizontal the 2nd and thirds journals are vertical grows.

GR


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## coocooforkush (Sep 4, 2018)

Was wondering if anybody could tell me if this light is a good choice. Grow-Star Square Wave 315W CMH (Ceramic Metal Halide) Complete Kit. I am upgrading from led and cfl. Two plants 3x3 space. I was told to get the square wave. Any help much appreciated. I have no experience with lights but this one caught my eye. Its 249.00


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## gr865 (Sep 5, 2018)

Not a bad price, can you separate the ballast from the lamp. I run my Nanolux 315's with the ballast outside the tent, helps with the heat.


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## coocooforkush (Sep 5, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Not a bad price, can you separate the ballast from the lamp. I run my Nanolux 315's with the ballast outside the tent, helps with the heat.


Thanks for tbe reply. Keeping things cool was another thing i was thinking of. Thank you.


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## gr865 (Sep 5, 2018)

coocooforkush said:


> Thanks for tbe reply. Keeping things cool was another thing i was thinking of. Thank you.


Sure, Good luck on your grow!


----------



## coocooforkush (Sep 5, 2018)

gr865 said:


> Sure, Good luck on your grow!


Thanks man. I have 2 sensi seed super skunk just ready to pop. Last grow was critical kush barneys. One more week in the jar and its smoke time! Smells very good. This will be the third grow so its getting better but i still have a lot to learn. I will pop up a picture when the light and the plants are up and running. Happy growing.


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## gr865 (Sep 5, 2018)

I have tried growing CK a couple of times and had bad luck with both grows.
But may try it again.


----------



## coocooforkush (Sep 5, 2018)

gr865 said:


> I have tried growing CK a couple of times and had bad luck with both grows.
> But may try it again.


Yea its persnickety. Hates too much water. I found if it doesnt veg enough the roots dont get a chance to establish. They have huge root balls. Minimum 5 gallon pot with some sort of root helper or stimulator. They can fool you in flower too. They stall and look like they wont get bigger. Then you go at them with the scissors and i swear they know it and pop more pistils. Lmao. Its the buzz i love. Heavenly and if u let it go a bit over ripe sleep is never far away. The only other strain i have experienced that is as good is critical mass. But like i said i am learning. Hotrodharley turned me onto grandaddy purple and skunk so i say. Why not give them a try. There are a few phenos of ck that are weird. I had one grow forever. Had to cut it. Also had one that did weird triple branching. I binned it too. But the short bushy ones are the ones to keep. Frosty and compact with a punch out buzz. Just my style.


----------



## Javadog (Sep 6, 2018)

I found Critical Kush to be a nice grow. Barney's has some gems. :0)

Good word on moving the ballast GR.


----------



## coocooforkush (Sep 8, 2018)

This is the miricle critical kush. Poor girl got put outside in june because she was the runt and there was a lack of room. Two weeks ago i realized that she was a stronger plant than i thought so i started banging floweing nutes and bloom booster to her. Then 4 days ago someone noticed it and i had to dig her up. After getting advise on this site I put her in a 4 gallon pot with supersoil being careful not to hurt or disturb root ball. Here she is in her new home. Light defoliation and she is doing well. Phew. Next year it will be all outdoor ck.


----------



## plzy24blk (Sep 12, 2018)

First time posting on here. Already read through the entire forum. Great info! Appreciate all of y’all knowledge. I just purchased a sunsysten 315 lec light and I am halfway through flower, in my 3x3x6 grow tent. I have 4 plants (Venom OG, Chemdawg 4, and Dosi-dos) in 2gal fabric pots with a floraflex 6” cube on top to top feed, on top of suacers to catch the runoff water. I have one fan on top and an oscillating fan on the bottom. Currently have a 6” can fan max pro series (420cfm) running as an exhaust. My first question is, would I be okay with connecting my exhaust fan (w/speed reducer) to a duct reducer (6” to 4”), connected to a 4” phresh filter. Either a 4” 150cfm or 4” 200cfm phresh filter. Trying to optimize my space and a 6x16 phresh filter is just too big. 

Am I better off with a 6x16 400cfm filter *or* a smaller 4x8/4x12 150or200cfm filter?

I’ll try to post pics of my garden sometime this week.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Sep 12, 2018)

plzy24blk said:


> First time posting on here. Already read through the entire forum. Great info! Appreciate all of y’all knowledge. I just purchased a sunsysten 315 lec light and I am halfway through flower, in my 3x3x6 grow tent. I have 4 plants (Venom OG, Chemdawg 4, and Dosi-dos) in 2gal fabric pots with a floraflex 6” cube on top to top feed, on top of suacers to catch the runoff water. I have one fan on top and an oscillating fan on the bottom. Currently have a 6” can fan max pro series (420cfm) running as an exhaust. My first question is, would I be okay with connecting my exhaust fan (w/speed reducer) to a duct reducer (6” to 4”), connected to a 4” phresh filter. Either a 4” 150cfm or 4” 200cfm phresh filter. Trying to optimize my space and a 6x16 phresh filter is just too big.
> 
> Am I better off with a 6x16 400cfm filter *or* a smaller 4x8/4x12 150or200cfm filter?
> 
> I’ll try to post pics of my garden sometime this week.



No the fan will move too much air potentially for the smaller carbon filter. 

But phresh makes an inline filter that can be run after your exhaust vent. 

Also can terminate with the carbon filter but obviously no way to vent past it.


----------



## plzy24blk (Sep 12, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> No the fan will move too much air potentially for the smaller carbon filter.
> 
> But phresh makes an inline filter that can be run after your exhaust vent.
> 
> Also can terminate with the carbon filter but obviously no way to vent past it.



What if I were to turn the power to a bit less than 50% on the fan? Running approximately less than 200cfm? Would that work? It shouldn’t be pulling much more than the rated cfm on the filter, correct? Give or take.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Sep 12, 2018)

plzy24blk said:


> What if I were to turn the power to a bit less than 50% on the fan? Running approximately less than 200cfm? Would that work? It shouldn’t be pulling much more than the rated cfm on the filter, correct? Give or take.



In theory sure but is 50% really 200cfm?

Granted I would probably try it. It either works or not. 

I may try to do it the other way. I have a 4” fan needing a carbon filter soon in a 3x3 I am running on the side. But I have a 6” filter on hand. 

Wonder if there is a minimum to work?


----------



## plzy24blk (Sep 12, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> In theory sure but is 50% really 200cfm?
> 
> Granted I would probably try it. It either works or not.
> 
> ...


I’m sure it’s not exactly 200cfm if the fan is turned down to 50% of its power, but it’ll be close to it. Attached to a 200cfm carbon filter, good chance it should work out right?

I’m sure that combo wouldn’t work that great especially if your 6” carbon filter has a much higher cfm rating than your 4” fan.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Sep 12, 2018)

plzy24blk said:


> I’m sure it’s not exactly 200cfm if the fan is turned down to 50% of its power, but it’ll be close to it. Attached to a 200cfm carbon filter, good chance it should work out right?
> 
> I’m sure that combo wouldn’t work that great especially if your 6” carbon filter has a much higher cfm rating than your 4” fan.



Works with the fan turned down low now. 

The problem with the filters is when the air moves too fast the carbon does not make contact long enough to eliminate odor.


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## plzy24blk (Sep 12, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Works with the fan turned down low now.
> 
> The problem with the filters is when the air moves too fast the carbon does not make contact long enough to eliminate odor.


That’s my biggest concern. Because I know a 200cfm carbon filter won’t work efficiently if 420cfm is going through it. Was wondering if I were to lower the power of the fan up to 50%, possibly lowering the pulling power of the fan from 420cfm to approximately 200cfm, would the carbon filter still work effectively.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Sep 12, 2018)

plzy24blk said:


> That’s my biggest concern. Because I know a 200cfm carbon filter won’t work efficiently if 420cfm is going through it. Was wondering if I were to lower the power of the fan up to 50%, possibly lowering the pulling power of the fan from 420cfm to approximately 200cfm, would the carbon filter still work effectively.



Sorry I thought I answered that. It should work.


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## plzy24blk (Sep 12, 2018)

MichiganMedGrower said:


> Sorry I thought I answered that. It should work.


It’s all good, thank you. Appreciate it


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## coocooforkush (Sep 13, 2018)

Just got the lec installed. Crap. Its like the sun in there. Lol. Did as advised. Made sure it was squarewave and kept lots of airflow wight between plants and heat of bulb. I st it at 18 inchs above one flowering ck. Its as high as i can get it. Will 18 inches be enough?
Its all new to me so anyone jumping in and giving pointers no matter how simlle would be great. Read all of the forums so i am feeling confident but is am a boob and love gettinng pointers. I even got a humidistat and thermometer. Woooow. Lol.


----------



## coocooforkush (Sep 13, 2018)

coocooforkush said:


> Just got the lec installed. Crap. Its like the sun in there. Lol. Did as advised. Made sure it was squarewave and kept lots of airflow wight between plants and heat of bulb. I st it at 18 inchs above one flowering ck. Its as high as i can get it. Will 18 inches be enough?
> Its all new to me so anyone jumping in and giving pointers no matter how simlle would be great. Read all of the forums so i am feeling confident but is am a boob and love gettinng pointers. I even got a humidistat and thermometer. Woooow. Lol.


Doh! Its a 315


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## coocooforkush (Sep 13, 2018)

coocooforkush said:


> Doh! Its a 315


And rats. No bacon.


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## GreenNucleus (Sep 13, 2018)

plzy24blk said:


> I’m sure it’s not exactly 200cfm if the fan is turned down to 50% of its power, but it’ll be close to it. Attached to a 200cfm carbon filter, good chance it should work out right?
> 
> I’m sure that combo wouldn’t work that great especially if your 6” carbon filter has a much higher cfm rating than your 4” fan.


I don't think fan power (CFMs) are a linear relationship. I think they follow a logarithmic relationship. Double check me on that but 50% power of a 420CFM fan, will be quite a bit lower than 200 CFM. But double check that.


----------



## plzy24blk (Sep 13, 2018)

GreenNucleus said:


> I don't think fan power (CFMs) are a linear relationship. I think they follow a logarithmic relationship. Double check me on that but 50% power of a 420CFM fan, will be quite a bit lower than 200 CFM. But double check that.


Okay okay cool thanks for your feedback. I figured. I was assuming turning down the fan to 50% power would roughly be around 200cfm, give or take. Or close to it

Another question as a matter of fact. Since my fan is 420cfm, and I have a phresh filter rated @ 400cfm. They would go well with each other, correct? And I know if too much cfm is passing through a filter that is rated for less cfm, for example a 500cfm fan connected to a 250cfm filter, would run efficiently, correct?

So let’s say I have my 420cfm fan connected to my 400cfm filter. Would turning down the fan to roughly about 200cfm, effect the efficiency of the filter? Since only 200cfm would be rubbing through the filter and not 400cfm?

So would y’all say I am better off getting a 4” filter (200cfm) and turning down the speed of the fan, or connecting the fan to my 6” filter and turning it down?

420cfm is overkill for my grow tent and I am also trying to reduce the noise coming from my fan.


----------



## Growmanthumb (Sep 16, 2018)

TheChemist77 said:


> with


----------



## CalmedDown (Sep 17, 2018)

Sorry if it’s been answered guys I have read a lot of pages but needed an answer and didn’t have time for all pages. But I needed to know how many BTU per 315. And not the simple answer of 3.41 per watt because that would mean that it would be under 4K btu per 1k but most people figure them at 6k btu. Anyone running multiple 315’s sealed with mini split and open hoods?


----------



## trenton735 (Sep 17, 2018)

CalmedDown said:


> Sorry if it’s been answered guys I have read a lot of pages but needed an answer and didn’t have time for all pages. But I needed to know how many BTU per 315. And not the simple answer of 3.41 per watt because that would mean that it would be under 4K btu per 1k but most people figure them at 6k btu. Anyone running multiple 315’s sealed with mini split and open hoods?


What else is in your room putting off heat? Your math is right. I think most people get a little bigger than what they need to account for ballast, water chillers, etc also puttin off heat in the room. 315s won’t put off much heat on their own.


----------



## CalmedDown (Sep 17, 2018)

trenton735 said:


> What else is in your room putting off heat? Your math is right. I think most people get a little bigger than what they need to account for ballast, water chillers, etc also puttin off heat in the room. 315s won’t put off much heat on their own.


Wall fans, dehuey, maybe a C02 burner(need to research as have seen people have trouble with some fumes or something). I was just hoping someone had a figure like they do per De hps figure. For instance I hear that if you figure 6k btu per 1k that leaves enough extra room to cool C02 burner and dehuey. I was really hoping that a 12k mini split would do the job for 8 x 315 but now I’m not sure. Was hoping someone would chime in that had experience in cooling multiples with a mini split. My math right now say 315x8= 2520 watts x 3.41btu =8593 btu. By that theory a 9k btu would cool the lights and I’m sure that is wrong.


----------



## trenton735 (Sep 17, 2018)

CalmedDown said:


> Wall fans, dehuey, maybe a C02 burner(need to research as have seen people have trouble with some fumes or something). I was just hoping someone had a figure like they do per De hps figure. For instance I hear that if you figure 6k btu per 1k that leaves enough extra room to cool C02 burner and dehuey. I was really hoping that a 12k mini split would do the job for 8 x 315 but now I’m not sure. Was hoping someone would chime in that had experience in cooling multiples with a mini split. My math right now say 315x8= 2520 watts x 3.41btu =8593 btu. By that theory a 9k btu would cool the lights and I’m sure that is wrong.


I’d get a 12-15k btu unit personally. Just to have the extra cooling power. Probably lean towards 15k so that way it’s not working close to max power to Cool the room with 8 lights, ballasts, fans, dehu, C02, etc. If anyone else has any input feel free to chime in. But I think you’ll be fine.


----------



## CalmedDown (Sep 17, 2018)

Thanks man, yeah most the of minis I have been looking at were either 12k or 18k. So I guess I’ll just save a lil more money and go for 18k one with inverted compressor so even if is oversized it will work well. I have never run a sealed room before but don’t want to air cool the bulbs and didn’t figure could cool roughly 3k(all included) with just exhaust fans maybe I’m wrong if so that would save me a ton of money and work..but I’d have no way of really knowing without trying and can’t be down for weeks waiting on mini split if I can’t cool it with exhaust


----------



## trenton735 (Sep 17, 2018)

CalmedDown said:


> Thanks man, yeah most the of minis I have been looking at were either 12k or 18k. So I guess I’ll just save a lil more money and go for 18k one with inverted compressor so even if is oversized it will work well. I have never run a sealed room before but don’t want to air cool the bulbs and didn’t figure could cool roughly 3k(all included) with just exhaust fans maybe I’m wrong if so that would save me a ton of money and work..but I’d have no way of really knowing without trying and can’t be down for weeks waiting on mini split if I can’t cool it with exhaust



First I’d make sure your room has enough power to run all that as well. Because if it doesn’t AC will be the least of your worries


----------



## CalmedDown (Sep 17, 2018)

I am installing a sub panel just for the room and mini split so The electric is no problem. Have had to learn many trades over the years fo this hobby, electric is a new one to me but I feel confident I can do it.


----------



## thccbdhealth (Sep 17, 2018)

Day 20 of 12/12
PinkGravy-JAH- Platinum pheno
3100k Philips315cmh. 4200k Ushio315cmh
    
@DonTesla


----------



## thccbdhealth (Sep 17, 2018)

Flipped the fixtures 
side for side
Day 21


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## Forrestfirebuds (Sep 23, 2018)

WolfieLee said:


> Well, heck, I think I found my light! Horizontal, wide double parabola Double-Ended 630 CMH, @ 3000K! more red and a little more UV as well...Same price as a Sun Systems 315, @ $545
> 
> http://growershouse.com/growers-choice-horticultural-lighting-630w-de-cmh-complete-fixture


 I have to jump in on this conversation cuz I love a good old comparison of lights. I've done light setups in all kinds of ways. My new setup combines the hortilux 600 ballast that runs those new ceramic hps lights with a cmh 315 under a big ass hood(28"x34") and then I surrounded the hood with led cob lights. Talk about missing no light spectrum. And in veg I just use the metal halide blue daylight bulb instead of the ceramic hps which is for flower.


----------



## trenton735 (Sep 23, 2018)

Forrestfirebuds said:


> I have to jump in on this conversation cuz I love a good old comparison of lights. I've done light setups in all kinds of ways. My new setup combines the hortilux 600 ballast that runs those new ceramic hps lights with a cmh 315 under a big ass hood(28"x34") and then I surrounded the hood with led cob lights. Talk about missing no light spectrum. And in veg I just use the metal halide blue daylight bulb instead of the ceramic hps which is for flower.



How do you like the ceramic hps?


----------



## remington_tuff_lipz (Oct 1, 2018)

Hey great thread....lots of good info......so I have jumped off the led wagon and recently purchased 2 of the SunSystem 315 LEC fixtures both with 3000k Phillips bulbs.I have just set 1 up inside a new 3'x3'x6'6" fusion hut grow tent.The light puts off some heat,i haven't set up the exhaust fan yet,and haven't had a chance to grab a couple small clip on fans to circulate air inside the tent.So the temp right now is staying right around 30° or 90°,my room is air conditioned and it's set at ,20° or 70°.I am just waiting for the sonoff th16 I ordered to show,then I will wire that up to my exhaust fan and set it to go on and off by temp inside the tent...The light looks great and I hope iIdont regret the purchase,from what I have seen here and read elsewhere before purchasing,i think i will be pretty happy....The tent on the other hand,its the less expensive of the fusion hut models and there are what look like scratches in it that light comes thru... pretty light material.I germinated 9 seeds.........8 reg sacred cut seed co. DTK (dos-i-dos x triangle kush) all sprouted and i popped 1 fem Florida OG from DNA genetics.


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## DonkyDikBuds (Oct 8, 2018)

Has anyone heard anything about this ballast? Ive been on the hunt for a 315 ballast with the exact philips components we know work the best. Aside from the sun system lec, this PROSPEC is the only ballast I have come across with the actual philips components. Im looking for something in the price range of like the prism science ballast. Which I can not comfirm has the philips components. Any thoughts gentleman?


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## pinner420 (Oct 8, 2018)

DonkyDikBuds said:


> Has anyone heard anything about this ballast? Ive been on the hunt for a 315 ballast with the exact philips components we know work the best. Aside from the sun system lec, this PROSPEC is the only ballast I have come across with the actual philips components. Im looking for something in the price range of like the prism science ballast. Which I can not comfirm has the philips components. Any thoughts gentleman?


Looks like 110v model...


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## Opie1971 (Oct 8, 2018)

I'm thinking of getting a 315cmh soon, will it be too hot in 2x4x5? 4in exhaust fan pulling air out into a 4in carbon filter..


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## DonkyDikBuds (Oct 9, 2018)

Sounds good


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## Bad Karma (Oct 9, 2018)

Opie1971 said:


> I'm thinking of getting a 315cmh soon, will it be too hot in 2x4x5? 4in exhaust fan pulling air out into a 4in carbon filter..


You really need a bigger tent (3'x3'x6.5') and exhaust fan (6"). With only a 5' ceiling you'll have to sacrifice veg time, and therefore yield, by flowering early to control plant size (even if you do LST).

If you're going to do it, do it right, and start from scratch. Sell off what you have and use the proceeds to get a bigger tent, and fan, to properly compliment a 315.

As for heat management, buy a CMH with a remote ballast, and keep it outside of the tent.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 3, 2018)

Opie1971 said:


> I'm thinking of getting a 315cmh soon, will it be too hot in 2x4x5? 4in exhaust fan pulling air out into a 4in carbon filter..


I suggest an external ballast


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 3, 2018)

I put two Hortilux 315 cmh in my tent on the right and middle lamp. Its been a week @ 12/12. These clones have all been run before and I mixed them up so some will be Hortilux and some will be the phillips 3K. Not very scientific but I wanted to try this bulb.


----------



## pinner420 (Nov 3, 2018)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I put two Hortilux 315 cmh in my tent on the right and middle lamp. Its been a week @ 12/12. These clones have all been run before and I mixed them up so some will be Hortilux and some will be the phillips 3K. Not very scientific but I wanted to try this bulb.View attachment 4226483 View attachment 4226486


Please let us know. If ya got a link would like to follow..


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## Bud. (Nov 3, 2018)

Opie1971 said:


> I'm thinking of getting a 315cmh soon, will it be too hot in 2x4x5? 4in exhaust fan pulling air out into a 4in carbon filter..


I had one in a 2x2x4 with a 4” filter and fan set up. 

Temps weren’t a problem


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Nov 3, 2018)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I put two Hortilux 315 cmh in my tent on the right and middle lamp. Its been a week @ 12/12. These clones have all been run before and I mixed them up so some will be Hortilux and some will be the phillips 3K. Not very scientific but I wanted to try this bulb.View attachment 4226483 View attachment 4226486


What frequency/temp is it? 3100k?


----------



## thccbdhealth (Nov 16, 2018)

So I'm grabbed a 4x8 tent
And I have 3 cmh fixtures 2 [email protected] and 1 [email protected]
1 vertical nanolux fixture
2 horizontal commercial fixtures

So what I'm thinking is
Horizontal- vertical- Horizontal 

But my question is witch orientation for bulb color.
Should I go for uniformity from the beginning
3100k - 4200k - 3100k
Or should I be testing the over lap and go
3100k-3100k-4200k

If someone has experience running multiple bulb configurations and has an opinion on if the 4200k bulb is worth experimenting with or not..
Should I be ordering a third philips 3100k?


----------



## dangledo (Nov 17, 2018)

Purely anecdotal but the wider spectrum hortilux didn't seem to put as much girth as the Phillips 31k. I use the hortilux for first and last two weeks, now. It does seem to lay down more frost though. They claim 10% more uv than the rest of the bulbs on the market


----------



## thccbdhealth (Nov 17, 2018)

What's the spectrum of the hortilux
@dangledo


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## doniawon (Nov 17, 2018)

thccbdhealth said:


> So I'm grabbed a 4x8 tent
> And I have 3 cmh fixtures 2 [email protected] and 1 [email protected]
> 1 vertical nanolux fixture
> 2 horizontal commercial fixtures
> ...


Have 15 315s various hoods
The vert mount destroys the horizontal. Further the wide spread horizontal are terrible for 315s.

Gonna b replacing my 1ks w 630lec. Anxious to see how they compare.
I'm sure it's covered n this thread but if anyone can chime in... Do 630's compete w 1k sehps??


----------



## genuity (Nov 17, 2018)

doniawon said:


> Have 15 315s various hoods
> The vert mount destroys the horizontal. Further the wide spread horizontal are terrible for 315s.
> 
> Gonna b replacing my 1ks w 630lec. Anxious to see how they compare.
> I'm sure it's covered n this thread but if anyone can chime in... Do 630's compete w 1k sehps??


In my mind,what I see in my grows with them...
They perform 15%-25% better than a 600 sehps, so I would think that helps when compared to a 1k sehps


----------



## Yodaweed (Nov 17, 2018)

genuity said:


> In my mind,what I see in my grows with them...
> They perform 15%-25% better than a 600 sehps, so I would think that helps when compared to a 1k sehps


You use the 1kw DE CMH? How does that compare?


----------



## thccbdhealth (Nov 17, 2018)

doniawon said:


> Have 15 315s various hoods
> The vert mount destroys the horizontal. Further the wide spread horizontal are terrible for 315s.
> 
> Gonna b replacing my 1ks w 630lec. Anxious to see how they compare.
> I'm sure it's covered n this thread but if anyone can chime in... Do 630's compete w 1k sehps??


I know Philip's designed the cmh to burn vertical.
My first fixture was the nanolux

?Then I was told in the hydro shop that the plants receive more light from a horizontal bulb?
Didn't make sense to me..


----------



## Yodaweed (Nov 17, 2018)

thccbdhealth said:


> I know Philip's designed the cmh to burn vertical.
> My first fixture was the nanolux
> 
> ?Then I was told in the hydro shop that the plants receive more light from a horizontal bulb?
> Didn't make sense to me..


never listen to the hydro shop guys


----------



## genuity (Nov 17, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> You use the 1kw DE CMH? How does that compare?


Na,it just don't make sense to me for some reason..


----------



## Yodaweed (Nov 17, 2018)

genuity said:


> Na,it just don't make sense to me for some reason..


You got tall ceilings? IMO that's when it works best


----------



## genuity (Nov 17, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> You got tall ceilings? IMO that's when it works best


Na,I can see that for sure,cause the 630lec has to be ran a tad higher than the normal ..


----------



## Yodaweed (Nov 17, 2018)

genuity said:


> Na,I can see that for sure,cause the 630lec has to be ran a tad higher than the normal ..


You ever run the gavita flex? I been lookin at them for a possible DE upgrade over my 600w hps, i hear they can be run in 7foot rooms is that right?

I want to go all CMH but it would be expensive.


----------



## dangledo (Nov 17, 2018)

thccbdhealth said:


> What's the spectrum of the hortilux
> @dangledo


I believe it's closer to the 4200 than the 3100 but is not in writing. At least that i can find. I've heard and read that on forums, but haven't seen any numbers from hortilux themselves. Also heard it's about in-between the two, so i really don't know. The Phillips definitely looks more orange. 

I can't say I've looked to hard into that so take it with a grain of salt


----------



## doniawon (Nov 17, 2018)

genuity said:


> In my mind,what I see in my grows with them...
> They perform 15%-25% better than a 600 sehps, so I would think that helps when compared to a 1k sehps


Agree.


----------



## doniawon (Nov 17, 2018)

Dropped vert with no hood...
Forget about it. 
Kills. Js


----------



## genuity (Nov 17, 2018)

Yodaweed said:


> You ever run the gavita flex? I been lookin at them for a possible DE upgrade over my 600w hps, i hear they can be run in 7foot rooms is that right?
> 
> I want to go all CMH but it would be expensive.


Definitely sounds nice,120v also yea I need to look into that..


----------



## dangledo (Nov 18, 2018)

Hortilux bulb. Aboudapound


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 18, 2018)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> What frequency/temp is it? 3100k?


https://eyehortilux.com/grow-lights/ceramic-metal-halide/
Just giving it a try I needed new bulbs.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Nov 18, 2018)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> https://eyehortilux.com/grow-lights/ceramic-metal-halide/
> Just giving it a try I needed new bulbs.


Looks pretty good so far! Was your previous light a phillips? Any comparisons yet?


----------



## SunPlix CMH (Nov 18, 2018)

The following lights are on sale during Thanksgiving.
1. https://www.sunplix.com/product/315w-cmh-grow-light-fixture/
2. https://www.sunplix.com/product/sunplix-700w-dual-350w-ir-dimming-grow-light-fixture/


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## abuseguy (Dec 7, 2018)

Can I power a 315W CMH bulb using an electronic Lumatek 600W HPS ballast that is switchable to 400W and 300W? It's not "square wave," but can it power a 315 even if it's not ideal? Will it diminish the quality of the light produced or reduce the life of the bulb?

Thanks for any insight. I can't put a link into a post yet, but you can see the ballast at hydroponics dot net / i / 136856 (Just remove the spaces in the URL.)


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## DemonTrich (Dec 8, 2018)

NO NO NO NO!

Do NOT run a cmh bulb on a normal hps/mg ballast. Cmh runs on a square wave frequency. Hps/mh runs on a different frequency.


----------



## abuseguy (Dec 8, 2018)

So, reading between the lines, I sense you think this isn't a good idea. <grin> Of course, that's why I asked and I appreciate the advice. 

Just for curiosity, what would the result be? Would it kill the ballast, blow up the bulb, open a portal through the space-time continuum? (Rest assured that I'm not going to advise this approach despite my interest.)


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 8, 2018)

Blown up bulb, ballast and possibly a huge fire from the bulb exploding.

This was asked either in this or a newer thread a few days ago. 

The search function should have brought this same exact question up.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 8, 2018)

Different waveforms and different peak-to-peak voltages are the likely culprit. Not sure if the center frequency of the waveform matters as much. Likely both 60 or 50Hz, depending on the power grid it's connected to... just a guess


----------



## abuseguy (Dec 8, 2018)

DemonTrich said:


> Blown up bulb, ballast and possibly a huge fire from the bulb exploding.
> 
> This was asked either in this or a newer thread a few days ago.
> 
> The search function should have brought this same exact question up.


Well, damn. You definitely told me. I feel thoroughly chastised. What is "search function"? Does AOL have that?

Kidding aside, I did use the "search function" and wasn't successful based on the questions I was asking. Sorry to invade your day, but I appreciate the response.

Nothing to see here. Move along.

Edit: Seriously bummed that the portal through the space-time continuum is out of the question. I had my hopes...


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Dec 8, 2018)

Bring back a hoverboard for me!


----------



## RedDirtResin (Dec 8, 2018)

Sitting under a SunSytem LEC 630 in 20 gallons or soil


----------



## DemonTrich (Dec 9, 2018)

I'll give you a tip, that pot is WAY too big for the lower left little plant. She is going to take forever to take off vs you other 3 bigger girls. Solo cup, let the roots fill the cup, then uppot. 


@abuseguy 
We just dont want to hear your room was set on fire. Sometimes the search function doesnt always work 100%. Not singing ya on that at all.


----------



## RedDirtResin (Dec 9, 2018)

@DemonTrich the smaller 3 are being mainline. I know its hard to tell but they have 8 tops. I started them in solo cups then to 1 gal. They had only been in these pots for about 4 days when this pic was taken. The 2 bigger one I topped at the 5th node. They are about a 2 weeks older than the other 3. They will all veg for another 2 weeks before I flip.
Thanks for the input. Greatly appreciated


----------



## Unsinkableship420 (Jan 9, 2019)

Hi guys,
So im looking at getting a "hi par" dbl ended cmh fixture to use along side my qbs in winter... mainly for heating my tent haha... but also interested in using them.
They have both the "hi par" 315w and 630w dbl ended fixtures at my local shop, only $20 more for the 630w but this guy is telling me the dbl ended 315w is better haha i fail to see how....? Can someone with knowledge on these fixtures help me out? 
Cheers guys


----------



## coocooforkush (Jan 9, 2019)

I think he means that unless you are growing in an aircraft hanger. Double 630 is very powerful. one 315 roughly puts our the same as 500 watts of metal halide. Plus uv galore. So a double ended cmh would come in around a 1000 watts plus all that uv. A double 630 would be very strong. If u have lots of room and lots of height. Double 630 is a possibility. I am in 3 by 3 by 8 with one 315. Its as high as i can go and i still foxtail in late flower. You will need ventilation for heat if in confined space. Just my thoughts. You are in for a treat. Cmh is a great way to grow.


----------



## Forrestfirebuds (Jan 9, 2019)

Unsinkableship420 said:


> Hi guys,
> So im looking at getting a "hi par" dbl ended cmh fixture to use along side my qbs in winter... mainly for heating my tent haha... but also interested in using them.
> They have both the "hi par" 315w and 630w dbl ended fixtures at my local shop, only $20 more for the 630w but this guy is telling me the dbl ended 315w is better haha i fail to see how....? Can someone with knowledge on these fixtures help me out?
> Cheers guys


How much height space are you working with?


----------



## Bad Karma (Jan 9, 2019)

Unsinkableship420 said:


> Hi guys,
> So im looking at getting a "hi par" dbl ended cmh fixture to use along side my qbs in winter... mainly for heating my tent haha... but also interested in using them.
> They have both the "hi par" 315w and 630w dbl ended fixtures at my local shop, only $20 more for the 630w but this guy is telling me the dbl ended 315w is better haha i fail to see how....? Can someone with knowledge on these fixtures help me out?
> Cheers guys


The double ended 630w cmh will put out a TON of heat. The double ended 315w cmh will be much more manageable in terms of heat.


----------



## Unsinkableship420 (Jan 9, 2019)

Forrestfirebuds said:


> How much height space are you working with?


I have 2 flower tents , both are 2.2m long by 1.2m wide and 2m tall.... im running just over 800w of quantum boards in each one atm.


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 9, 2019)

Goodnight ladies


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 9, 2019)

I figured another 3 weeks and it's show time


----------



## Yodaweed (Jan 9, 2019)

Bad Karma said:


> The double ended 630w cmh will put out a TON of heat. The double ended 315w cmh will be much more manageable in terms of heat.


heat is determined by how many watts are used, 630 cmh puts out 630 watts of heat, approx 2150 BTU of heat for 630watts.


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## RedDirtResin (Jan 9, 2019)

White Widow grown under 630 cmh


----------



## coocooforkush (Jan 9, 2019)

RedDirtResin said:


> White Widow grown under 630 cmhView attachment 4262418 View attachment 4262419 View attachment 4262420 View attachment 4262422 View attachment 4262423 View attachment 4262424


Nice job! Those buds are beaudy man. Bud envy at coocoos house. Lol


----------



## RedDirtResin (Jan 9, 2019)

Thanks. Guessing 3-3.5lbs for final under two 630cmh
We will find out here in a couple of weeks


----------



## Greenthumbs256 (Jan 10, 2019)

can anyone tell me how much heat the lec gives off, say compared to air cooled 600w hps? also will a 315 lec, maximize a 4x4 space? or could it be better?


----------



## gr865 (Jan 10, 2019)

Less heat, covers a 3 x 3 well.


----------



## Greenthumbs256 (Jan 10, 2019)

gr865 said:


> Less heat, covers a 3 x 3 well.


so 2 wouldn't cover a 4x8 as well as 2 600w hps? 

thanks I appreciate it


----------



## RedDirtResin (Jan 10, 2019)

I run a sunsystem lec 630. It stays pretty cool. It does put out some heat but very little compared to what I'm used to with 1k hps. Each 630 will cover a 5x5 area, same as a 1k. I plan to run 2 over a 5x10 scrog. A buddy of mine runs 2 in a 4x8 tent.


----------



## gr865 (Jan 10, 2019)

Greenthumbs256 said:


> so 2 wouldn't cover a 4x8 as well as 2 600w hps?thanks I appreciate it


I run two 315W Nanolux NA's and in my 4 x 4 it is over kill but can never have too much light.


----------



## Deltagreen (Jan 10, 2019)

Greenthumbs256 said:


> can anyone tell me how much heat the lec gives off, say compared to air cooled 600w hps? also will a 315 lec, maximize a 4x4 space? or could it be better?


In my 5x5x80 tent I've noticed that my 630w CMH gets 12°F hotter than the temperature in the room it's in. That's with no AC running. Hope that helps, Happy Growing


----------



## gr865 (Jan 10, 2019)

Deltagreen said:


> In my 5x5x80 tent I've noticed that my 630w CMH gets 12°F hotter than the temperature in the room it's in. That's with no AC running. Hope that helps, Happy Growing


What kind of ventilation are you running?


----------



## Deltagreen (Jan 10, 2019)

gr865 said:


> What kind of ventilation are you running?


I have 2- 6" passive intakes, and a 8" - 780 CFM exhaust w/ speed control on a charcoal filter. Those numbers I gave you is when every thing is turned off.


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## gr865 (Jan 10, 2019)

Deltagreen said:


> I have 2- 6" passive intakes, and a 8" - 780 CFM exhaust w/ speed control on a charcoal filter. Those numbers I gave you is when every thing is turned off.


Yes I sort of figured you must of run the lamps without any ventilation. Never did that to check the heat difference. 
I have passive intake and a 6" exhaust w/ speed control and charcoal filter. Also have A/C in room where air is drawn from.
Run the exhaust on low and the speed control between 1 and 4, depending on outside temps, when not using A/C I can draw air from the outside, which is what I do in the winter. The temps in the tent during 12/12 with lights on is 79 to 84 and lights out 68 to 70. 
Never allow my temps to exceed 87.


----------



## coocooforkush (Jan 10, 2019)

RedDirtResin said:


> Thanks. Guessing 3-3.5lbs for final under two 630cmh
> We will find out here in a couple of weeks


The lec work better than i imagined. I have 2 mainlined sensi super skunks just starting week 4 under a 315. Its the first grow with it and i am quite happy.


Greenthumbs256 said:


> so 2 wouldn't cover a 4x8 as well as 2 600w hps?
> 
> thanks I appreciate it


Yes sir they will. And u get all that lovely uv for tricomes. 2 315s is comparable to 1000 but with better spectrum and more uv.


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## Bad Karma (Jan 10, 2019)

Greenthumbs256 said:


> so 2 wouldn't cover a 4x8 as well as 2 600w hps?
> 
> thanks I appreciate it


You need a minimum of three 315’s to properly cover an 4x8 tent. Four of them is ideal.


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## coocooforkush (Jan 11, 2019)

So the guy asked if 2 lec and a 600 watt hps would work. Yes it will. He didnt ask about 3 lecs. Read the post. I am out of here. Nothing constructive going on here. Good luck.


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## dangledo (Jan 11, 2019)

coocooforkush said:


> So the guy asked if 2 lec and a 600 watt hps would work. Yes it will. He didnt ask about 3 lecs. Read the post. I am out of here. Nothing constructive going on here. Good luck.


Looks like he's asking if 2 315 lec will cover as MUCH as 2 600 hps

Not mixing the two


----------



## Booyah! (Jan 11, 2019)

RedDirtResin said:


> White Widow grown under 630 cmhView attachment 4262418 View attachment 4262419 View attachment 4262420 View attachment 4262422 View attachment 4262423 View attachment 4262424


Very nice! Probably the best looking LEC grown bud I've seen. How's the Density?


----------



## RedDirtResin (Jan 11, 2019)

Booyah! said:


> Very nice! Probably the best looking LEC grown bud I've seen. How's the Density?


Thanks. This was my buddies grow. Every nug all the way down the plant is rock hard. These 630cmh flat out produce. His grow made me switch from 1k hps to 630cmh. Higher quality and higher yields. 
I had thought about switching over to LED, but I can buy a 630cmh for less than I can build an led for. They put off a little bit more heat than an led but nowhere near as much as a 1khps. Hell I'm having to run a heater in my room while the lights are on to keep my temps where I want. I may at some point try my hand at building my own QB. But for now I'm super happy with how the 630's work.


----------



## Booyah! (Jan 11, 2019)

RedDirtResin said:


> Thanks. This was my buddies grow. Every nug all the way down the plant is rock hard. These 630cmh flat out produce. His grow made me switch from 1k hps to 630cmh. Higher quality and higher yields.
> I had thought about switching over to LED, but I can buy a 630cmh for less than I can build an led for. They put off a little bit more heat than an led but nowhere near as much as a 1khps. Hell I'm having to run a heater in my room while the lights are on to keep my temps where I want. I may at some point try my hand at building my own QB. But for now I'm super happy with how the 630's work.


That sounds great! Thanks for getting back to me. I'm definitely getting some.


----------



## gr865 (Jan 11, 2019)

Four Barneys Farm LSD grown under two Nanolux 315W CMH in a 4 x 4


----------



## Javadog (Jan 11, 2019)

Nice!


----------



## ThatSpudGuy (Jan 13, 2019)

gr865 said:


> Four Barneys Farm LSD grown under two Nanolux 315W CMH in a 4 x 4 View attachment 4263250


another great grow gr. good job man


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 13, 2019)

Am I the only one who gets burning eyes and coughing in the grow room? I mean when I'm trimming shit gets real and I'm getting high?


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 13, 2019)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Am I the only one who gets burning eyes and coughing in the grow room? I mean when I'm trimming shit gets real and I'm getting high?



I suffer from allergies from the plants too. Need benadryl or sudafed often. And yes trimming even makes me break out on my arms sometimes.


----------



## Javadog (Jan 13, 2019)

I think that I went the "blindness" route. 

My stuff makes my truck smell better than anything in the cave, and
that's after holding a bagfull for a few hours and lasting for a couple of days.
(but, while in the cave, I am practically senseless ;0)

Hmmmmm :0)


----------



## Booyah! (Jan 13, 2019)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Am I the only one who gets burning eyes and coughing in the grow room? I mean when I'm trimming shit gets real and I'm getting high?


Are you using Pesticides? Growth Regulators? I trimmed for someone that used those and got a very strange feeling trimming. Other people got it too. My red eyes were from smoking so much...but who knows.


----------



## MichiganMedGrower (Jan 13, 2019)

Booyah! said:


> Are you using Pesticides? Growth Regulators? I trimmed for someone that used those and got a very strange feeling trimming. Other people got it too. My red eyes were from smoking so much...but who knows.



No chemicals in my rooms. Mrs. Mmg gets even more affected than me sometimes. We suffer from normal allergies and a little athsma too.


----------



## Booyah! (Jan 13, 2019)

I gotcha thats good...I mean not the allergies, but avoiding chemicals. You must be growing some super stoney Stuff! Right on. Might wanna try a respirator from Home Depot.


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 14, 2019)

No chemicals ever in my room. I guess it's the breed of girls I'm running. This might be a good thing.


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 14, 2019)

This round I'm running a mix breed," dj short blue moonshine x blue dream cross"


----------



## Booyah! (Jan 14, 2019)

That's a lotta Blue! Hopefully it's a real freak in potency.


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 14, 2019)

Booyah yeah I trust the breeder he produce monsters


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 15, 2019)

am I feeding to much once an hour for 15 minutes


----------



## Yodaweed (Jan 16, 2019)

No chems for me ever, you don't need pesticides if you don't introduce pests (easiest way is from other peoples grows)


----------



## Booyah! (Jan 16, 2019)

315w


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Jan 17, 2019)

Not very scientific but here is @BobBitchen Blue Ballz
3 gallon vivosun pots
Left is 3k Phillips 8 weeks 12/12 same mother similar conditions(temps were 75 lights on 70 lights off, slightly higher RH 58%), same nutes, same soil but different grow, harvested May of 2018. 
Right is Hortilux 315cmh 9 weeks 12/12 same mother, same nutes, same soil(temps 73 lights on 68 lights off RH 52%), harvested Dec 24 2018.
Both are from the seperate jars labeled top colas, stored in dark cool closet in ball jars. @sshbud


----------



## Bad Karma (Jan 17, 2019)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Not very scientific but here is @BobBitchen Blue Ballz
> 3 gallon vivosun pots
> Left is 3k Phillips 8 weeks 12/12 same mother similar conditions(temps were 75 lights on 70 lights off, slightly higher RH 58%), same nutes, same soil but different grow, harvested May of 2018.
> Right is Hortilux 315cmh 9 weeks 12/12 same mother, same nutes, same soil(temps 73 lights on 68 lights off RH 52%), harvested Dec 24 2018.
> Both are from the seperate jars labeled top colas, stored in dark cool closet in ball jars. @sshbud View attachment 4266413 View attachment 4266414 View attachment 4266415


Despite all of the provided data, the only thing I’ve learned, is that you’ve got to trim your buds better. Scissors are your friend.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Jan 18, 2019)

Bad Karma said:


> Despite all of the provided data, the only thing I’ve learned, is that you’ve got to trim your buds better. Scissors are your friend.


no one but me smokes it so i pull leaves before I smoke it. I don't feel the need to handle it any more than necessary. To each his own.


----------



## Apalchen (Jan 18, 2019)

What’s the consensus on vertical reflectors vs horizontal, I have a few 315s and love them but they are all horizontal and was wondering which is better or if they are pretty much the same


----------



## gr865 (Jan 18, 2019)

Apalchen said:


> What’s the consensus on vertical reflectors vs horizontal, I have a few 315s and love them but they are all horizontal and was wondering which is better or if they are pretty much the same


The vertical bulb in the reflectors of my 315's work well. With the horizontal placement of the bulbs about half of the bulb has to reflect off the to and the light reflects directly back to the bulb. With the vertical the bulbs reflect off the sides of the reflector and the light is directed down. Does that make sense?


----------



## Couch_Lock (Jan 18, 2019)

Also wouldn't a vertical bulb have superior penetration= better lower bud sites?


----------



## Bad Karma (Jan 18, 2019)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> no one but me smokes it so i pull leaves before I smoke it. I don't feel the need to handle it any more than necessary. To each his own.


A good trim helps prevent mold in the jar. If mold is what you want to own, they’re your lungs, own away.


----------



## Avant_Gardener (Jan 18, 2019)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Not very scientific but here is @BobBitchen Blue Ballz
> 3 gallon vivosun pots
> Left is 3k Phillips 8 weeks 12/12 same mother similar conditions(temps were 75 lights on 70 lights off, slightly higher RH 58%), same nutes, same soil but different grow, harvested May of 2018.
> Right is Hortilux 315cmh 9 weeks 12/12 same mother, same nutes, same soil(temps 73 lights on 68 lights off RH 52%), harvested Dec 24 2018.
> Both are from the seperate jars labeled top colas, stored in dark cool closet in ball jars. @sshbud View attachment 4266413 View attachment 4266414 View attachment 4266415


 Are you using the same fixture but different bulbs? If so, there is a noticeable difference....for sure.


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Jan 18, 2019)

Bad Karma said:


> A good trim helps prevent mold in the jar. If mold is what you want to own, they’re your lungs, own away.


Phant


Avant_Gardener said:


> Are you using the same fixture but different bulbs? If so, there is a noticeable difference....for sure.


Phantom 2 315 remote ballast vertical fixture. I switched all the bulbs in flower area. I still use the phillips in veg 4k. Not sure if I will swap them or not just yet. The 4k gives me nice tight internal spacing.


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Jan 18, 2019)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Not very scientific but here is @BobBitchen Blue Ballz
> 3 gallon vivosun pots
> Left is 3k Phillips 8 weeks 12/12 same mother similar conditions(temps were 75 lights on 70 lights off, slightly higher RH 58%), same nutes, same soil but different grow, harvested May of 2018.
> Right is Hortilux 315cmh 9 weeks 12/12 same mother, same nutes, same soil(temps 73 lights on 68 lights off RH 52%), harvested Dec 24 2018.
> Both are from the seperate jars labeled top colas, stored in dark cool closet in ball jars. @sshbud View attachment 4266413 View attachment 4266414 View attachment 4266415


Great job brother


----------



## Javadog (Jan 18, 2019)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> no one but me smokes it so i pull leaves before I smoke it. I don't feel the need to handle it any more than necessary. To each his own.


LOL, I use the little bud leaves like a wrapping. I take them off the smoke...sometimes to photo.


----------



## sshbud (Jan 19, 2019)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> Not very scientific but here is @BobBitchen Blue Ballz
> 3 gallon vivosun pots
> Left is 3k Phillips 8 weeks 12/12 same mother similar conditions(temps were 75 lights on 70 lights off, slightly higher RH 58%), same nutes, same soil but different grow, harvested May of 2018.
> Right is Hortilux 315cmh 9 weeks 12/12 same mother, same nutes, same soil(temps 73 lights on 68 lights off RH 52%), harvested Dec 24 2018.
> Both are from the seperate jars labeled top colas, stored in dark cool closet in ball jars. @sshbud View attachment 4266413 View attachment 4266414 View attachment 4266415


mmh interesting. it looks like the hortilux one has way more leaves, which may not be such a good thing... hows the smoke ?


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Jan 19, 2019)

sshbud said:


> mmh interesting. it looks like the hortilux one has way more leaves, which may not be such a good thing... hows the smoke ?


I think the leaf to calyx ratio is similar for that strain. It has moderate density. I think the only thing I miss about my 1000w hps bulbs is the density. This bulb seems to get "kinda" close. I won't smoke it for a month or two. I notice the difference with a long cure. It's just the way I do things.


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## coocooforkush (Jan 27, 2019)

Heres some updated pics of the super skunks. 2 weeks to go. 315 3100k cmh.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Feb 1, 2019)

as it begins


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## gr865 (Feb 2, 2019)

Under the two 315's in the 4 X 4, Big Buddha Cheese clones.
Day 1 of 12/12
Below the canopy. Plants 9 to 10" tall.
 
The canopy.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Feb 8, 2019)

gr865 said:


> Under the two 315's in the 4 X 4, Big Buddha Cheese clones.
> Day 1 of 12/12
> Below the canopy. Plants 9 to 10" tall.
> View attachment 4275363
> ...


They love it I bet


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Feb 8, 2019)

Well my brothers from another mother, I flipped the monster almost a week ago and found 4 males in my hen house. Still not bad for an old man. You Know your old when you need to buy a magnifying glass but my meds will bring my vision back to 20/20


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## gr865 (Feb 9, 2019)

Update 2/9/19, second week of flower under the two 315's

2/2 Start of 12/12
9 to 10 inches tall
  

2/9 One week later
16 to 18 inches
  

All seems to be going OK, lot's of big fans, lot's of grow period. Refilled the rez two times this week, and getting good runoff with each drip cycle.
Increased A&B to 350 ppm, cut out Rapid Start. Hand watering (2X runoff), sort of a mini flush, twice a week just prior to rez refill with remaining nutes and Great White. 
I think I got the timing right on this grow, flipped at the right time so they are not going to overpower the tent. They have stretched 7 to 9 inches this first week of 12/12 so I am kinda expecting around another 8 to 10 inches over the next two weeks. Then some trimming and planned staking.
Since this is my first Rodeo (SOG) I hope I have the undercarriage pruned enough. At day 21, will be removing everything that is not exposed at the canopy.
Later and Peace Out, 

GR


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## Javadog (Feb 9, 2019)

You're going to like the yield GR.

My first SOG was also almost a monocrop too, of AK-47s, and the yield was incredible.

Good luck,

JD


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## coocooforkush (Feb 10, 2019)

Ouch. Crap happens. My only vanilla kush. Amputee. Rats. Lol 16 cola skunk just getting repotted to 30 liter fabric pot. Going with one plant and first scrog. For this run.  Pics to come. Will be looking for tips. Get it. Tips.... doh!


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## gr865 (Feb 11, 2019)

coocooforkush said:


> Ouch. Crap happens. My only vanilla kush. Amputee. Rats. Lol 16 cola skunk just getting repotted to 30 liter fabric pot. Going with one plant and first scrog. For this run. View attachment 4279821 Pics to come. Will be looking for tips. Get it. Tips.... doh!


Whatever doesn't kill you will only make you stronger!


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## coocooforkush (Feb 11, 2019)

Here is the 16 manifold super skunk sensi. Reachin for the screen. The 315 3100 cmh provides a ton of light in this little space. Thats a tiny gs cookies crossed with a cookies and cream. It was a gift. Stayed very small but man does it stink. Its one of those plants that yeilds a tiny bit but man what a punch. My hydro guy gifted me 10 seeds. Thanks hydro dude! And yes i tied that screen all by myself. Lmao.


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## Chip Green (Feb 11, 2019)

Well, the Sunburst 315 that I stumbled into at a liquidator store many moons ago, turned out to be one of the best investments I have ever made...I used it for a Veg light for awhile with the Phillips 4100K it came with, but when temps began to drop in the flower room in NOV I decided to give it a run in flower, so I picked up the Phillips 3100K bulb. 
In a total of 17 g,al of soil, two well vegged plants, with enough branching to stretch the footprint to its max, and a little beyond really.... I yielded 15+ zippers...and a buncha larf for candy. This light is fantastic.
Needless to say, the CMH will remain in the flower room, as the few degrees of heat it adds in the dead of winter here in Da UP of MI, have benefited the rest of the room as well, which is generally lit with DIY LED....Im not one of those anti HID types, I believe in the right tool for the job. The CMH is a great tool for me now.
Last winter it ran too cold, and I was in the process of planning more builds to add flower space anyway, but the CMH is a winner, and will always have an area dedicated for its use in my rooms forever...


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## Coloradoclear (Feb 11, 2019)

coocooforkush said:


> Heres some updated pics of the super skunks. 2 weeks to go. 315 3100k cmh.View attachment 4272088 View attachment 4272089 View attachment 4272090 View attachment 4272091 View attachment 4272092 View attachment 4272093 View attachment 4272094 View attachment 4272095


Is that Bodhi Super Skunk?


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## coocooforkush (Feb 12, 2019)

Coloradoclear said:


> Is that Bodhi Super Skunk?


They are sensi super skunks. The one pheno i have is dark and dank. I clone it to keep it going.


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## coocooforkush (Feb 12, 2019)

Hey i have a general question. I get great results with maxibloom. I use it for the whole grow at quarter strength. Last grow i used b52 from advance too. So heres the question. Anybody think i should or could use a bloom enhancer to help. And if so which one works best for you. Having said that i am ok with just using maxibloom on its own. Just seeing if i can tweak it a bit. In my setup i have such an abundance of light she could probably eat more.
All opinions are welcome. And a big thanks to everybody thet has helped me to get this far.


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## Javadog (Feb 12, 2019)

I think that the Skunks largely originated with Sensi Seeds. I recently decided to see if
I could find a good Skunk and am testing their Skunk #1, Super Skunk, Shiva Skunk, 
and Early Skunk. LOL nothing that skunky so far. 

In spite of their popularity, I like to suggest DNAs crosses....pretty much anything 
that they cross with Sour Diesel, LA Con, Tangie, and Cannalope are amazing.

Good luck!


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## Hugo Phurst (Feb 13, 2019)

I finished switching over to CMH (from MH & HPS) about 2 months ago and I'm lovin it 
Replaced 2 x 600w w/cool tubes & a 400w open fixture (1600w HPS/MH) with 3 x 315 CMH (945w), and they're performing at least as well if not better than HPS & MH.
My grow isn't elaborate, kinda a KISS set-up, so now that pot is legal, I'm growing 4 girls in a 2 tent Perpetual Grow.
Veg tent has a 4000k bulb, and the flower has 2 x 3000k & 1 x 4000k bulbs.
I'm looking a two of the biggest plants that I've grown and I'm thanking the CMH.


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## gr865 (Feb 13, 2019)

I am wondering if I am having a ballast problem?
Here are a few pics taking in the past two days. The tray is elevated from the back to the front but not side to side. Note how the plants of the left are taller than the ones on the right. Same lights, fixtures, ballast, and same height.
That being said the ones on the extreme left and along the back wall are pheno #2, the plants in the middle are pheno #3 and on the right wall is pheno #5. The mothers of these three ranked in this order, #2 was the tallest only by a slight amount over #5 and #3 was the shortest of the batch. I replaced both bulbs this grow so I know it is not a bulb issue. Note how #3 in the middle is taller on the left side of the pic compared to the right side.

In another view you can see the individual tops and note that you can hardly see them on the right hand side.


Today I switched the fixtures but left the ballast in place to see if it makes a difference in growth on either side. Should I also lower the lamp on the right to get it the same distance from the plants as the left hand side. The left is 21 inches and the right is around 23 inches from fixture to plant tops.
Here is a picture of the fixtures, taken on 1/31.
 

GR


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## gr865 (Feb 13, 2019)

Hugo Phurst said:


> I finished switching over to CMH (from MH & HPS) about 2 months ago and I'm lovin it
> Replaced 2 x 600w w/cool tubes & a 400w open fixture (1600w HPS/MH) with 3 x 315 CMH (945w), and they're performing at least as well if not better than HPS & MH.
> My grow isn't elaborate, kinda a KISS set-up, so now that pot is legal, I'm growing 4 girls in a 2 tent Perpetual Grow.
> Veg tent has a 4000k bulb, and the flower has 2 x 3000k & 1 x 4000k bulbs.
> ...


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## Hugo Phurst (Feb 13, 2019)

Yes, fucked up with the pH (I seem to do that).


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## coocooforkush (Feb 13, 2019)

Javadog said:


> I think that the Skunks largely originated with Sensi Seeds. I recently decided to see if
> I could find a good Skunk and am testing their Skunk #1, Super Skunk, Shiva Skunk,
> and Early Skunk. LOL nothing that skunky so far.
> 
> ...


Agreed. Out of 15 seeds i got one that stinks like a good thing. The buds are nice and tight. Leaves are a little darker that rest. Seems darker leaves is something to look for. I am totally hooked on skunk for now. I will try some skunk 1.


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## Chip Green (Feb 13, 2019)

I got a freebie pack of Skunk Ass- (Ajs Sour D x Skunk 18 ), from Murica genetics, in a DC Seed Exchange order. I buried all 5 last night in the hopes of getting some major dope reekage from one of them...Like hafta run another scrubber kinda stench, hopefully. I doubt it will, but something named Skunk Ass, if it wont foul up the room, what will? They were free, so I have nothing but hope....


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Feb 25, 2019)




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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Feb 25, 2019)

Cotton ball porn


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## gr865 (Feb 25, 2019)

Cotton Balls


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Feb 25, 2019)

Love it gr


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## Nellyitis (Feb 25, 2019)

Heres my 1st real grow. 315w CMH.. Switched my 4k bulb to 3k 10 days ago. horizontal bulb with great penetration.. lights up my coco Aircooled is the only way I can get my temps down to 26c.... I dont know how everyone does it.. beyond me.
anyway what you guys think? week 4 of flowering. autoflowers.


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## Javadog (Feb 26, 2019)

Looking very good.....should swell up nicely.


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## diggs99 (Feb 28, 2019)

what kind of footprint are 2 x 315s covering for flower?


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## Stubbie (Feb 28, 2019)

diggs99 said:


> what kind of footprint are 2 x 315s covering for flower?


For me, 4x4 - I have 4 plants, two under each lamp. 20-24" above canopy.

Just harvested 2 of the 4 plants I have going in the other tent yesterday. From that, I would say the penetration of these 315's is about 18" for solid flower growth. Everything below that is pretty fluffy. I've started plucking the bottom 1/3'd of the plant of growth nodes and this was one of my easier harvests.

Here's one of 6 main branches I got off one plant, the other 5 are pretty similar. Shiva Skunk that went 62 days from flip. Guessing I'll end up with about a qp after it's dried. The other pics are of the garden over the weekend and cola shots of that same Shiva plant before she got a haircut.

-Stubbie


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## genuity (Feb 28, 2019)

diggs99 said:


> what kind of footprint are 2 x 315s covering for flower?


3x6 would be ideal with the sun systems lec(vert hood)

Not sure about others


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## diggs99 (Feb 28, 2019)

Stubbie said:


> For me, 4x4 - I have 4 plants, two under each lamp. 20-24" above canopy.
> 
> Just harvested 2 of the 4 plants I have going in the other tent last yesterday. From that, I would say the penetration of these 315's is about 18" for solid flower growth. Everything below that is pretty fluffy. I've started plucking the bottom 1/3'd of the plant of growth nodes and this was one of my easier harvests.
> 
> ...


Thanks man

Beautiful bud


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## diggs99 (Feb 28, 2019)

genuity said:


> 3x6 would be ideal with the sun systems lec(vert hood)
> 
> Not sure about others


I bought 2 of the vivosun low profile cmh

They came with no bulbs so I bought 2 x Phillips 3100k 

Gonn flower 2 plants under a scrog I think. Was wondering how big to make scrog and how much longer they will need to veg to fully maximize the footprint


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## diggs99 (Mar 1, 2019)

These lights are small and sleek

They will be installed later this evening 

I guess I'll officially be apart of the 315 crew


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## Lucky Luke (Mar 1, 2019)

Hi guys, after some advice for a 4 x 4 x 6 flower tent. Currently running a singe 600HPS. Thinking of going LED or CMH and was wondering what your thoughts would be on this. https://www.sunplix.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/CMH-630F-Dual-315-IR-Dimming-Fixture.pdf


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## diggs99 (Mar 1, 2019)

I got one in place.

These plants vegged under t5s , this cmh is on another level of brightness compared to the t5

Don't want to stress the plants or burn them up, any rough guidelines on distance to start the light away from the girls?

Dont mind the bit of droop, they were just watered before i put the light up


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## Stubbie (Mar 1, 2019)

Start high, then lower until it's about 20" from the canopy. You're right, it's intense, especially coming from T5's.

Some folks just leave them at the top of their grow space and never lower/raise them. Can't make myself do that, old habits die hard.


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## 2WorldsFrog (Mar 1, 2019)

Here's my 4x4 with a dual 315 five days after the flip to 12/12. I've had the light a steady 24" from the tops since they were about 6" tall at 1st week of veg in the tent. The only thing I've changed light wise is the dimming. Started at 60%, couple weeks later 85%, and now it's at 100%. The girls seem to like it, 3xCheese and 2xGG#4.


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## diggs99 (Mar 2, 2019)

thanks guys, i started it out as high as i could, ill start lowering it today, let them adjust


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## diggs99 (Mar 3, 2019)

My god these lights are bright, the plants seem to absolutely love it.

Im still just running the one fixture for now, will finish up vegging these girls and then install the 2nd 315 for flowering. Im excited to see 2 of these in action during the flowering phase.

Hers a pic from earlier after a hard training session.... second is hours later


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## coocooforkush (Mar 3, 2019)

diggs99 said:


> I got one in place.
> 
> These plants vegged under t5s , this cmh is on another level of brightness compared to the t5
> 
> ...


I start at 4 feet with the cmh. Vegging with t5s works great for me. Have never had a problem. They go to flower fast and frost up nicely. Will post a pic of superskunk tomorrow.


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## coocooforkush (Mar 3, 2019)

diggs99 said:


> My god these lights are bright, the plants seem to absolutely love it.
> 
> Im still just running the one fixture for now, will finish up vegging these girls and then install the 2nd 315 for flowering. Im excited to see 2 of these in action during the flowering phase.
> 
> Hers a pic from earlier after a hard training session.... second is hours later


The cmh really is an amazing light. The plants just love em.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Mar 5, 2019)

two 315's & two 600s in a 4x9


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Mar 5, 2019)




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## Justinsbudzzz (Mar 6, 2019)

diggs99 said:


> These lights are small and sleek
> 
> They will be installed later this evening
> 
> I guess I'll officially be apart of the 315 crew


Ha ha we got the same lights i liked how they saved me head space


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## Justinsbudzzz (Mar 6, 2019)

some vortex bye tga and dj shorts bluberry. blueberry headband couple gg4 seedlings under 1 315 w cmh will add another soon my first run with these light s hope they worth it


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## diggs99 (Mar 6, 2019)

Light has been lowered again.

They seem be to liking it

Gonna scrog the 2 bigger plants. Don't know what I'm doing with the mainliner lol


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## diggs99 (Mar 6, 2019)

Justinsbudzzz said:


> Ha ha we got the same lights i liked how they saved me head space


im loving mine so far, cant wait to run 2 of them in flower


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## Deltagreen (Mar 6, 2019)

Hey everyone, which reflector is better for a 315w CMH, open wing reflector or those small hood reflectors that a lot of CMH's come with?


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## Nellyitis (Mar 7, 2019)

Deltagreen said:


> Hey everyone, which reflector is better for a 315w CMH, open wing reflector or those small hood reflectors that a lot of CMH's come with?


The open hood's most of them come with are the better option, not wing.


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## gr865 (Mar 7, 2019)

My Nanolux 315W reflectors are pyramid shaped and lite. I like them.


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## Javadog (Mar 7, 2019)

Those are the traditional angles GR, with the bulb being vertical. I love my SunSystem LEC315,
but I would get one with the ballast outside the tent if I bought another today.


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## Deltagreen (Mar 8, 2019)

Thanks for all the replies, I have a dual bulb hood right now and I feel like I would get a wider spread of light without it being so high if I had a winged hood rather than the small hood


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## TintEastwood (Mar 8, 2019)

These stealthy units are working great over my 4x4. Philips 3k/4k bulbs.
Vero 3k COB kicker.


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## diggs99 (Mar 9, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> These stealthy units are working great over my 4x4. Philips 3k/4k bulbs.
> Vero 3k COB kicker.
> View attachment 4296949



everything about this picture screams clean grower

Nice job on the setup man, looks good.

What are your temp ranges normally? you needed any cooling help or than exhaust and fans?


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## TintEastwood (Mar 9, 2019)

Thanks for the kind words. Its a fun hobby. Running a sealed room with window shaker AC and C02. I keep temps around 80 during lights on, 70 lights off. Humidity 55d/40n. Its a 4x8 room with a 4x4 grow. Not cheap on electric, but I dig the end results.

MK Ultra (Cloud city clones)


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## Gemtree (Mar 9, 2019)

I just got the cheap hydrocrunch cmh that comes with a phillips 3k and so far so good. Just using it for veg right now.


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## coocooforkush (Mar 10, 2019)

Ok here is an update on the 16 head mainline scrog super skunk. Shes comin on nicely. Thats the vanilla kush i almost killed when training. Doing good for an amputee. 5 heads. Dont know how i did that. And 2 cookies and cream just starting to be trained. They are very different phenos from each other. One darker red stems and stout. The other is a beast. Its gonna be a biggie. They are getting 75% maxi bloom by gen hydro every second watering. The skunk is in a 12 gallon fabric pot. The fabric pot is really working out well. No soggy roots. I am quite happy with it and will use them all the time now. And the light is a single 315 cmh with a 3100 in it. 
Happy growing!!! Cmh is where its at.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Mar 11, 2019)

does anyone know who makes a DE 630cmh with a remote ballast?
Will this work? 

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Hydro-Crunch-630-Watt-DE-CMH-Double-Ended-Ceramic-Metal-Halide-Ballast-C02A011402/303413794?cm_mmc=Shopping|G|Base|D27L|Multi|NA|PLA|ExteriorLighting|71700000038718130|58700004245149811|92700035277638889&gclid=Cj0KCQjwjpjkBRDRARIsAKv-0O1r035-KsudGAU9RKYXulMklJGCXV_XZx41X078r3TMyHcyMVa1-0waAiRWEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

https://growershouse.com/sunsystem-blazer-de-double-ended-reflector


@DemonTrich


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## DemonTrich (Mar 11, 2019)

Honestly I'm not sure. If it's a 630 ballast going to a 630 setup, I'm sure it would work


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## gr865 (Mar 11, 2019)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> does anyone know who makes a DE 630cmh with a remote ballast?
> Will this work?


You can separate the Nanolux DE630 ballast from the fixture. You just need the proper extension cord.

I run two Nanoux 315W NA and run both ballast out side the tent.

The DE fixture.
https://nanoluxtech.com/super-de-double-ended-fixture/


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Mar 13, 2019)

right side blue balls xblue dream. She looks good but no smell!! I'm thinking it's to early. Left side smells so good and strong. Fucked up and found a male so seeds should be a nice mix's of both


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Mar 13, 2019)

Anyone came across this problem of no smell in week 4?


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## gr865 (Mar 14, 2019)

What's going on in my 4 x 4 w/two 315's.
Day 40 and 41


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## TintEastwood (Mar 14, 2019)

That 4x4 is pumping on all cylinders. Nice work.


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## gr865 (Mar 14, 2019)

@ *TintEastwood 
*
TE, I am only using it as a 4 X 3, because the lamps will not cover but a 3 x 3 area each, so side by side that would be 6 x 3. That and the fact that my fan takes up the extra foot.
My try staggering them next horizontal grow.
Getting close to being able to move to a legal state where I can grow my med's with actual room to grow.


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## ColieMaster (Mar 21, 2019)

I'm looking at switching from a 600W HPS to one of these in a very small 80 X 80 X120 (2x2) tent.Philips 930 (hopefully the best flowering lamp)

Philips 930 Agro

I'm wondering which ballast to get. I want one outside the tent and was thinking to get the Philips one

The Philips Balast

I'm also looking at a cheaper one that claims 

_"The only CDM ballast which precisely drives the Philips Ceramic Metal Halide 315w Lamps and are used in all of our CDM Lighting Kits"
_
Does anyone have any experience with Hyperlux?

Thanks guys


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## coocooforkush (Mar 24, 2019)

Rockin on with the 315 closet grow. The skunk is maturing nicely. The vanilla kush is a very different plant but flowering nicely in spite of me breaking her entire left side off 3 weeks ago. Seems to be a theme lately. I just overtrained a cookies and cream and did the same thing. Too agressive. Lol. Here they are. There is a super cropped super skunk veggin with the amputee cookies and cream. Lol. Another couple weeks and skunk will be drying. When i started with the 315 3100 i wasnt sure if i could produce enough to sustain myself. Well 2 trained plants at a time and i have been able to help old man crowly with his for free too. I callenge anybody to find an easier full spectrum light that performs like a cmh. I am oficially cmh diehard and its all no name stuff. Dirt cheap. Lol. Just look at those pretty flowers on the vanilla kush. So fine so symetrical.......... doh! Bzzzzzzzzz.......lol must raid fridge......


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## aussie antics (Mar 24, 2019)

Hey guys,
i have a SS 315 cmh, For a second lighI do i require a second ballast or can i just get a reflector and light?


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## AlaskaRob (Mar 24, 2019)

I have a dual bulb 630w chm in a regular hammered aluminum hood it came with. 
I see different things on the coverage area for the light. Is it 3x3, or 5x5?


----------



## hillbill (Mar 25, 2019)

ColieMaster said:


> I'm looking at switching from a 600W HPS to one of these in a very small 80 X 80 X120 (2x2) tent.Philips 930 (hopefully the best flowering lamp)
> 
> Philips 930 Agro
> 
> ...


If I were running 360 or so watts in my 2x2, I would want remote ballast for space conservation alone. Also removing 50 watts will help with cooling.


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## Lucky Luke (Mar 29, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> I have a dual bulb 630w chm in a regular hammered aluminum hood it came with.
> I see different things on the coverage area for the light. Is it 3x3, or 5x5?


if its an adjustable hood it would vary. But it should flower a 5 x 5 id say but hoods can restrict or expand the footprint. Certainly more than a 3 x 3.


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## coocooforkush (Mar 29, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> I have a dual bulb 630w chm in a regular hammered aluminum hood it came with.
> I see different things on the coverage area for the light. Is it 3x3, or 5x5?


If it helps i am in a 4 by 2 closet grow with a 315 and its plenty of light.


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## AlaskaRob (Mar 29, 2019)

a lot of a lot of it depends on the hood. Using. The standard 315 aluminum hood is great for 3 by 3


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## AlaskaRob (Mar 29, 2019)

Although I'm doing the Dual bulb 630w in the standard aluminum Hood, and I'm in a five by five! Check out these pics and see what you think of my six plants


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## AlaskaRob (Mar 29, 2019)

I started with one bulb in the ballast for 315w. Did that for a couple weeks until they hit 2ft tall abouts. Then added the other bulb to make 630w and keep the penetration going all the way through the plant. These lights are awesome, and I'm having no problems with my plants going wall to wall in my 5x5 tent.


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## AlaskaRob (Mar 29, 2019)

If you would like, I'm headed over to see my plants either tonight or tomorrow. I could get par readings if you would like for a 630w CMH at 30 in above the canopy? And then again at 2 Feet Under The Canopy?


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## AlaskaRob (Mar 29, 2019)

Lumen reading at canopy level, exfoliated the hell out of them for this last growth push, and spread them a bit more. Now it all wall to wall growth.


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## jHands (Mar 29, 2019)

Count me in! Bought a pair with light rails for my veg space. Curious, what kind of canopy distance can I get away with? Climate is very well controlled. CO2 enriched. Lights are on movers as well.


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## AlaskaRob (Mar 30, 2019)

I like light rails, but they're misleading. Not really meant to run the whole length. Made to run a couple feet of the track. Mostly for getting where the shadows usually are. That being said, they really are pretty awesome. I'll be getting one for my next grow. Had to dial in using chm and coco this time around. I'm still new. I can do all the research in the workd, but in the end real world experience is what matters. Although alot of guys seem to think their way is the best and only way. That kind of stuff irritates me. Most of the nutrients available are the same thing with just different packaging and advertising. I prefer to stick to numbers and principles....with a little opinions tossed in for pointing me in the right directions. Seem about right?


----------



## jHands (Mar 30, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> I like light rails, but they're misleading. Not really meant to run the whole length. Made to run a couple feet of the track. Mostly for getting where the shadows usually are. That being said, they really are pretty awesome. I'll be getting one for my next grow. Had to dial in using chm and coco this time around. I'm still new. I can do all the research in the workd, but in the end real world experience is what matters. Although alot of guys seem to think their way is the best and only way. That kind of stuff irritates me. Most of the nutrients available are the same thing with just different packaging and advertising. I prefer to stick to numbers and principles....with a little opinions tossed in for pointing me in the right directions. Seem about right?


I’m not running them full length. I cut down the tracks they came with. They’re running about 4 feet total track, with a pause at the end. Extending the 3x3 out to a functional 3x5 was my goal. The light footprint they cast in a time lapse is perfect.


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## AlaskaRob (Mar 30, 2019)

Sounds feasible. Keep me posted? That's how I was thinking of doing mine. Something like 6ft track, but only use maybe half of it so I don't deprive any of the plant of light while is moving it's course.


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## AlaskaRob (Mar 30, 2019)

If you want to have some stunning reading, someone messaged me with a side by side grow comparison of my 630w dual bulb cmh against a 1000w hps! Damn impressive....
Here's the link

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=352859


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## coocooforkush (Mar 31, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Lumen reading at canopy level, exfoliated the hell out of them for this last growth push, and spread them a bit more. Now it all wall to wall growth.View attachment 4308978 View attachment 4308979


Is exfoliated like defoliated. Lol.


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## AlaskaRob (Mar 31, 2019)

Stupid autocorrect is my nemesis lol


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## JohnDee (Apr 2, 2019)

Hi Guys,
Quick question. I have two 315s. Philips bulbs with philips ballasts. They only have one run on them. Oh...mounted horizontal.

OK...one light had several failed starts. I suspected my wiring in a diy switchbox. But later...just today...I bumped the light with my shoulder and it went out.

My question is this...are these bulbs sensitive to physical movement or jolting? I have it on a light mover too.

Probably a bad bulb but I thought I'd request opinions before making any changes or buying a new one.
Thanks,
JD


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 2, 2019)

Should be ok. Probably a bad or loose connection you made when wiring it. Use wirenuts at the least. Other items are better though.


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## JohnDee (Apr 2, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Should be ok. Probably a bad or loose connection you made when wiring it. Use wirenuts at the least. Other items are better though.


\\

Thanks Rob...Ya I've been telling myself to redo the wiring. When the bulb is on...it's bright as hell.

I also had to change out the sockets...better check that wiring too.
Thanks,
JD


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 2, 2019)

No problem. Remember when doing wiring to check connections by slightly pulling on the wires to make certain the connection is secure against bumping , earthquakes, or such things. A bad connection could easily go much much worse than just a bulb going out. Fires in the home are very bad things


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## JohnDee (Apr 3, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> No problem. Remember when doing wiring to check connections by slightly pulling on the wires to make certain the connection is secure against bumping , earthquakes, or such things. A bad connection could easily go much much worse than just a bulb going out. Fires in the home are very bad things


Thanks Bob...yes I'm careful and not a newbie. I did all the wiring in my room and everything works perfectly...except that 315. The fact that my bumping the reflector causing bulb shutoff makes me wonder if there's anything amiss with the socket wiring. I'll double check that and swap the bulbs. If the problem moves with the bulb...then bad bulb. Or so it seems to me.
JD


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 7, 2019)

Update on my 630w cmh. FIRE!

I'm kidding. I love this thing as always. But, I have noticed there's a hell of a hot spot in the middle 4 square feet of my 5x5 tent. I have the standard 315 hood with the dual bulb setup. I'm thinking of cutting along the seems of the aluminum hood (drastic?) To open up the footprint a bit. Think itll help with hot spot as well. The coverage on the floor looked pretty good at 4x4 without the tent. But having to keep the light a minimum of 28 inches from plants is about to cause ceiling issues. Its pulled to the ceiling at almost 7ft and I'm only a week into 12/12 flip. Got 3ft between light and canopy but they havent taken off into stretch. 
So what do you think of cutting the seems on the hood to open the footprint and allowing me to put light a bit closer?


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 7, 2019)

Camera is 4ft above canopy. Should I thin these girls out a bit also? I lollipops for the first time. Took the bottom 50% off. Left about 16inches of canopy.


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## TintEastwood (Apr 7, 2019)

315w's still cranking out the lumens.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 7, 2019)

I like the reflectors on the sunsystem 315's. Mine is vivosun. Figured for the price and the versatility of running one or both bulbs at the same time.....I was sold. Loving it, but kept seeing different charts showing conflicting area coverage for different wattage. one said a 315 light would be great for a 4x4, yet another said it was good for only 3x3. So I popped in second bulb, both at 4200k, and it seems to be going fairly well for the most part.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 7, 2019)

I just didnt want to have a bunch of unus ed d equipment sitting around depending on what space or setup I was going to run, you know?


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## NugHeuser (Apr 7, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Update on my 630w cmh. FIRE!
> 
> I'm kidding. I love this thing as always. But, I have noticed there's a hell of a hot spot in the middle 4 square feet of my 5x5 tent. I have the standard 315 hood with the dual bulb setup. I'm thinking of cutting along the seems of the aluminum hood (drastic?) To open up the footprint a bit. Think itll help with hot spot as well. The coverage on the floor looked pretty good at 4x4 without the tent. But having to keep the light a minimum of 28 inches from plants is about to cause ceiling issues. Its pulled to the ceiling at almost 7ft and I'm only a week into 12/12 flip. Got 3ft between light and canopy but they havent taken off into stretch.
> So what do you think of cutting the seems on the hood to open the footprint and allowing me to put light a bit closer?


Let me know how it goes if you do cut those seams open and spread it out. 
I've thought about doing it with my 630. I'm not real happy with it though tbh, if I could go back I would have put my money on either more of the the sun system 315s or COBS. 
My 630 is a double ended bulb, both bulb and fixture are growers choice brand. My beef is that the footprint is real small, maybe 3x4 and puts off some serious heat. It almost has to be kept atleast 30" from canopy because of heat and to get max spread but at that point it causes the plants to get fairly stretchy. Its honestly a light that I dont like to grow with, wish I could sell it. MSRP was something like $450


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 7, 2019)

Ouch. Must not be in the US? I got mine for 220 with free shipping. Ah! But I DID pay 90$ for each of the bulbs separately because I didn't trust having expensive bulbs mailed.i guess it's about the same then.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 7, 2019)

Australia has a company that has an amazing hood similar to the raptor xxl I see for ho s setup. If I can find the link I'll post it. Pretty sure I can Frankenstein something seriously awesome with it.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 7, 2019)

https://stealth-garden.com/collections/reflectors/products/hi-par-closed-wide-reflector-attachment


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## Lucky Luke (Apr 7, 2019)

My Hi-Par DE 630w is cooler than my old Growlush 600W HPS in the 4 x 4.
I use this reflector https://www.hi-par-horticulture.com/dynamic-reflector. But perhaps the one Rob posted would be better, always email them and ask what they reccoemnd for your situation.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 7, 2019)

LOoks like what I did to my reflector today. Lol
What do you think? I got the temps down enough at the canopy to lower the fixture about 4 inches from where I had it with this . Light footprint definitely seems bigger also.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 7, 2019)

@NugHeuser 
I did that model I was talking about. Posted just before this post


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## NugHeuser (Apr 7, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Ouch. Must not be in the US? I got mine for 220 with free shipping. Ah! But I DID pay 90$ for each of the bulbs separately because I didn't trust having expensive bulbs mailed.i guess it's about the same then.


No I'm in the US. The double ended bulb setup was pricier than the 2 single 315 setup, plus it was a year or maybe little longer ago when ofcoarse prices were jacked up because it was a newer thing


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## NugHeuser (Apr 7, 2019)

I now run a mixture of sun system 315s and cobs, in a checkered pattern and I'm real happy with how its treated me


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 7, 2019)

Sounds pretty nice. I like my cmh lamp, but I would like to have had just a little more red spectrum. Debating swapping one bulb out for 3100k. One of each would be pretty nice, but I'm working on other issues right now. Seems more important to make sure dumbasses watching my plants actually feed them anything. I'd be happy with even just water at this point


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## coreywebster (Apr 8, 2019)

All you guys using 315cmh bulbs or multiples of, does anyone know what a burnt out bulb looks like?

I lent mine to a mate for the last year, don't even think he plugged it in til last week, then he said it tripped the electrics.
So I took it back to take a look.
Just tried firing it up and it does nothing.
The ballast has a slight noise , like ballasts do, it then clicks every 5-10 seconds like its trying to fire up.

The bulb now has a green/grey tinge to the globe bit in the middle.
I just want to know what a burnt out bulb looks like so I can determine if its the bulb or ballast.
For all I know its been thrown around in transit or he could of half screwed the bulb in or something.
Im hoping its just the bulb. Its a Philips.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 8, 2019)

If you're sure you're using the correct ballast, I'd guess it would have to be the bulb. Make sure prongs are clean on the bulb. My bulb has a greenish hue to it. You're sure he gave you the correct bulb back? Take it to a hydro shop and they can tell you. I haven't seen my bulbs with the power off since I got them to be honest, but it doesn't sound like a blown bulb.


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## Logan Burke (Apr 14, 2019)

Hello fellow CMH growers, I suppose I am going to add myself to the CMH club since I just got my first LEC fixture just a couple weeks ago!  I was wondering if any of you all had issues with cal/mag deficiencies since moving your plants under CMH lights? I love my CMH so much, I just can't seem to get this calcium deficiency under control and it only started once I moved my autoflowers out from under their 1000w HPS and into my 315W CMH tent. Anyone else had this issue? I'm assuming it's from the more widely available spectrum and increased UV?


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## Hempire828 (Apr 14, 2019)

I’m about to join the club...chose over qb and cobs.. price being the main reason.. 
I’m upgrading from blurples.. my ? is what’s the advantage of hood vs hood less. Are some of the lesser valued 315’s just as good?


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## TintEastwood (Apr 14, 2019)

Logan Burke said:


> Hello fellow CMH growers, I suppose I am going to add myself to the CMH club since I just got my first LEC fixture just a couple weeks ago!  I was wondering if any of you all had issues with cal/mag deficiencies since moving your plants under CMH lights? I love my CMH so much, I just can't seem to get this calcium deficiency under control and it only started once I moved my autoflowers out from under their 1000w HPS and into my 315W CMH tent. Anyone else had this issue? I'm assuming it's from the more widely available spectrum and increased UV?


For me in coco, veg or flower, under cmh. Starting with 80% ro, 20% tap.
Where others, using the same medium/nutes, did not require additional calmag......I was forced to supplement to recover them. Used calimagic @ 4ml a gallon every watering. (I had pre-buffered the coco too)

I swooped a pair of these on sale...free shipping. 3yr warranty on ballast. Philips. Remote ballast. Yet to see better bang.


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## Logan Burke (Apr 14, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> For me in coco, veg or flower, under cmh. Starting with 80% ro, 20% tap.
> Where others, using the same medium/nutes, did not require additional calmag......I was forced to supplement to recover them. Used calimagic @ 4ml a gallon every watering. (I had pre-buffered the coco too)
> 
> I swooped a pair of these on sale...free shipping. 3yr warranty on ballast. Philips. Remote ballast. Yet to see better bang.


So, you're saying that you've noticed this very same issue yourself?...I use 100% RO water, and am in DWC so both mine and your plants are far more prone to cal/mag deficiency than soil growers. But even at that, I've grown for 5 years under HPS with very few true calcium or magnesium defs...then within the first 2 weeks of growing under CMH, I encounter a horrible one. I still love my cmh though. If I must supplement with calmag during it's use, then so be it, it is worth the results. So, you remeidied your issue by running label strength calmag?...I also use Calimagic. Thanks for your answer Eastwood


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## Logan Burke (Apr 14, 2019)

Hempire828 said:


> I’m about to join the club...chose over qb and cobs.. price being the main reason..
> I’m upgrading from blurples.. my ? is what’s the advantage of hood vs hood less. Are some of the lesser valued 315’s just as good?


I believe that one of the main advantages to open hoods is heat dissipation, and that of closed hoods are the increased intensity and improved light diffusion (I may be wrong, plz correct me if so). I do know that if you do decide to use an open hood, try to avoid air flow directly blowing onto/over the bulb. It can affect the spectrum the bulb puts out. I use a Vivosun 315w with the aircooled attatchment though I've yet to use the AC option. It comes with a glass/plastic hood below the bulb, and that allows me to point a fan directly at it without having the air make any contact with the bulb


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## Hempire828 (Apr 14, 2019)

Logan Burke said:


> I believe that one of the main advantages to open hoods is heat dissipation, and that of closed hoods are the increased intensity and improved light diffusion (I may be wrong, plz correct me if so). I do know that if you do decide to use an open hood, try to avoid air flow directly blowing onto/over the bulb. It can affect the spectrum the bulb puts out. I use a Vivosun 315w with the aircooled attatchment though I've yet to use the AC option. It comes with a glass/plastic hood below the bulb, and that allows me to point a fan directly at it without having the air make any contact with the bulb


I may try the Vivosun , I’ve purchased the fan and filter that has done well..Also what would be the best bulbs? Brand wise


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## Logan Burke (Apr 14, 2019)

Hands down, the best bulbs are Philips. I've seen a whole lot of side by side spectrum comparisons, and the best overall bulb would certainly be Philips. Many growers use the Elite Agro 3100k for bloom phase, and the 4200k for vegetative. I know some people that run the 3100k all the way through, and they do fine as well, but if you've the extra money get the 4200k bulb for vegetative stages. They are the most expensive brand, but it's in part because they've the longest life span compared to others. Vivosun is great and all with a great warranty, but it's really hard to beat Sun System if you've the extra $. If not, no biggie, the Vivosun does great.


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## TintEastwood (Apr 14, 2019)

Logan Burke said:


> So, you're saying that you've noticed this very same issue yourself?...I use 100% RO water, and am in DWC so both mine and your plants are far more prone to cal/mag deficiency than soil growers. But even at that, I've grown for 5 years under HPS with very few true calcium or magnesium defs...then within the first 2 weeks of growing under CMH, I encounter a horrible one. I still love my cmh though. If I must supplement with calmag during it's use, then so be it, it is worth the results. So, you remeidied your issue by running label strength calmag?...I also use Calimagic. Thanks for your answer Eastwood


The dwc folks should be of more help than myself.
As I have no experience with dwc or hps. Hope you get it sorted.

My nute cocktails....(week 8. Lower N and calmag.)


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 14, 2019)

Logan Burke said:


> Hello fellow CMH growers, I suppose I am going to add myself to the CMH club since I just got my first LEC fixture just a couple weeks ago!  I was wondering if any of you all had issues with cal/mag deficiencies since moving your plants under CMH lights? I love my CMH so much, I just can't seem to get this calcium deficiency under control and it only started once I moved my autoflowers out from under their 1000w HPS and into my 315W CMH tent. Anyone else had this issue? I'm assuming it's from the more widely available spectrum and increased UV?


If using coco, definitely going to need to use either calmag+ or calimagic. Don't think it has anything to do with light from my experience. Only one problem I've found with calcium magnesium supplement is that it takes up a good amount of your allowable ppm or EC range. I use it on the low end of the scale with my CalMag+. In retrospect I may have wanted to go with calimagic, it has less nitrogen which is one thing added to calmag+ that's not needed during flower stage. Hope that helps.
Good luck with your LEC!! I absolutely love these things so far. And you won't even need to swap bulbs like MH/PHD setups. You DID go with a square wave ballast tho, right? It really does make a difference. And the Phillips 945 elite bulb is the best from the study i read comparing the 930 and 945 from phillips. Better density and less stretching during flower transition. Same yield in side by side comparisons.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 14, 2019)

Hempire828 said:


> I’m about to join the club...chose over qb and cobs.. price being the main reason..
> I’m upgrading from blurples.. my ? is what’s the advantage of hood vs hood less. Are some of the lesser valued 315’s just as good?


I don't think the hood itself matters so much as the ballast. DEFINITELY want a square wave ballast. More light availability per wave over standard and digital ballasts even. Real shit I swear. Much less electromagnetic interference as well. Be aware that the smaller footprint hoods like mine give a hell of a hot spot 4 square feet under the bulb. I cut the seams on my hood and spread it open making essentially a wing reflector.....within an hour temps dropped so much under the bulb I was able to lower the hood 4 to 6 inches. Gave better spread also. My 630 dual bulb cmh covers 5x5 tent wall to wall evenly. 
One thing you really really want to splurge on is a great bulb! Phillips elite is the best out there. You can look it up instead of taking my word for it. Go for the 4200k. It's a bit you ter-intuitive to use a blue bulb for both veg and bloom but I promise it works great.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 14, 2019)

Damn. Sorry. Forgot to include pics of my light and the mods to assist with my explanation! Lol


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 14, 2019)

Hempire828 said:


> I may try the Vivosun , I’ve purchased the fan and filter that has done well..Also what would be the best bulbs? Brand wise


My light is the dual bulb cmh 630w from Vivosun. Can run one or both bulbs at once. Great deal and I'll never look at another hps again. Real talk. 
DEFINITELY go with Phillips elite bulbs 4200k. I hear nanolux bulbs are almost as good and cheaper but I wanted the best. No point using the best ballast and type of light if going to go cheap on the bulb, am I wrong?


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 14, 2019)

Damn tint! You're nute profile is way to involved for me to follow. Lol
I had to si policy things as much as possible and left it to Canna to figure it out for me. I use the Canna coco line, but added a couple things of my own along the line. CalMag+ (although i think ill use calimagic after this grow), Humbolts sweet and sticky (essentially blackstrap molasses for weed. Works well so far for added frosting), and flower fuel 1-34-32.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 14, 2019)

Nothing but respect for you tho Tint. Seriously


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## Chip Green (Apr 14, 2019)

As a DIY LED builder enthusiast, I say with no hesitation, that CMH absolutely kicks maximum major league dope growing ass...
I fell ass backwards into my FIRST 315 CMH, at a liquidator store, and have added another, and there will be more, I guarantee it.
The quality, and quantity that 350 actual watts (kill-a watt measured) can produce, in my experiences with the Phillips bulbs (both 42K and 31K) can go, toe to toe, blow for blow with ANY 350W configuration I can build with top end LED components....


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## growingforfun (Apr 14, 2019)

In the club now


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 14, 2019)

I'd put my 630w cmh against a 1000w hps anyday with similar results, but altho I may be maybe 10%short on weight if the ups uses the overdrive feature some digital ballasts have, my bud formation and density would be better certainly.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 14, 2019)

I have a guy I talk to in Australia that hooked me up with a distributor down there that has a good that looks alot like the raptor xxl hood for for hps......but I'm pretty sure it's for cmh! I think I'm really going to get it and Frankenstein my ballast and bulbs sockets into something incredible with it. Thoughts?


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## growingforfun (Apr 14, 2019)

My initial results for veg are much happier plants, honestly a little surprised. I had been vegging with hps after my wife shattered my last mh bulb, but I've always done pretty well doing 1000w hps the full cycle, but anyways, the plants are loving the 315 as I'm sure none of you are surprised.


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## Lucky Luke (Apr 15, 2019)

Anyone adding some small far red LEDS for flower?
I think I saw something mentioned on a thread somewhere...


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## hillbill (Apr 15, 2019)

Could the cal mag issues under CMH be the result of the plant being able to used and need more as a result of a powerful wide spectrum light source like some experience with COBs and Boards?


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## Logan Burke (Apr 15, 2019)

I'm sure I will, much appreciated!


AlaskaRob said:


> If using coco, definitely going to need to use either calmag+ or calimagic. Don't think it has anything to do with light from my experience. Only one problem I've found with calcium magnesium supplement is that it takes up a good amount of your allowable ppm or EC range. I use it on the low end of the scale with my CalMag+. In retrospect I may have wanted to go with calimagic, it has less nitrogen which is one thing added to calmag+ that's not needed during flower stage. Hope that helps.
> Good luck with your LEC!! I absolutely love these things so far. And you won't even need to swap bulbs like MH/PHD setups. You DID go with a square wave ballast tho, right? It really does make a difference. And the Phillips 945 elite bulb is the best from the study i read comparing the 930 and 945 from phillips. Better density and less stretching during flower transition. Same yield in side by side comparisons.


Yes I have the exact same issues, running label strength calimagic (4mL/gallon) I come out with around 200ish ppms, and as you said, it really eats into the allowable range of ppm's. I rarely ever feed full strength calimagic, but whether it be due to the strain or some other factor, I am having to run it full strength this grow. I switched to Calimagic from Calmag+ as well, and it seems to have helped. 


hillbill said:


> Could the cal mag issues under CMH be the result of the plant being able to used and need more as a result of a powerful wide spectrum light source like some experience with COBs and Boards?


This is what my suspicion was, and was hoping that some of our veteran cmh users could shed some light on the topic. I didn't change anything but the lighting before the deficiencies started. But I'm sure there are other factors that may have had an impact on this. I once read that increased UV exposure makes cannabis consume more calcium and/or magnesium. I know that CMH lighting, especially 4200k bulbs, have some UV in their spectrum.


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## diggs99 (Apr 15, 2019)

My cmh tent 

Vivosun low profile fixture and 3100k Phillips bulb from start to finish. 

Flipped them earlier than usual this time. Planing new setup and want the space asap.

2x critical purple kush and 3 x gelat.og


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 15, 2019)

Riggs, if youre planning on going with a other light anyways, try opening the hood like I did with the hood I have. It's the same hood and I get much better spread and cooler temps now instead of the hotspot directly underneath. My Grandaddy purples are going nuts into flower further than I thought. I only get to see them in person once a week because of work schedule. I usually spend all week watching them through wireless cameras in the tent.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 15, 2019)

I like the theory on cmh making more use of calcium and magnesium from the available light spectrum. Im going to look it up and let you know what i find. Im pretty good at finding things.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 15, 2019)




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## AlaskaRob (Apr 15, 2019)

Not exactly what I was looking for, but it does look like certain far reds in the light spectrum, such as those found more in cmh bulbs and certain specially designed LED boards directly affect nutrient uptake of different minerals like calcium and magnesium. 
Hmmm, interesting. 
I like thst they used an HPS as a control as the generic red is what HPS is all about, but looking at the pic I'm posting below you can clearly see clear evidence of how the cmh bulbs contain the far reds like infrared that causes such uptake differences. 
Have we ALL learned something new today? I did!


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 15, 2019)

Lol shit! Forgot to attach pic! Here you go


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 15, 2019)

I guess this only promotes using gradually increasing amounts of potassium, calcium, magnesium, and phosphorus (maybe not so much this one) when using cmh lights over other lights. 
I use flower fuel. It's powerful as hell and fairly cheap! 1-34-32 can easily do a ton of damage if dosing plants at full strength right from the start. I'd recommend starting low dose and increasing dosage each week as I've been doing. But definitely calimagic instead of calmag+ during flower cycles. Sound reasonable? I'm sure tinteastwood could find you a cheap easy way to just add potassium, calcium, and magnesium....if you're able to have the patience to dial in exact needs for your particular strains. I just don't have the time to devote to dialing something like that in. I go with a brand and stick with it to see the end results. I research my nutrients, take advice if i can get behind the idea, and read endless reviews before ever purchasing anything. Im just prone to anxiety attacks over little shit like that tho. Lol


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## Logan Burke (Apr 16, 2019)

Lucky Luke said:


> Anyone adding some small far red LEDS for flower?
> I think I saw something mentioned on a thread somewhere...


I have some cheap-o blurple led panels added in around the perimeter...seems to help, but I'm sure a real deal COB would help a lot more.


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## Logan Burke (Apr 16, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> View attachment 4318398


This, while it is about LED's, is exactly the type of information I was hoping to find. It still helps because CMH's spectrum, similar to led's, is much more widely available and hits many spectrums that conventional HPS/MH does not. Particularly with UV spectrums. I appreciate the info, please send anything else like this you find my way if you happen to stumble across anything  And don't worry I get overly stressed out about spending $ on grow stuff as well...sometimes I just have to clear my mind of the idea and come back to earth for awhile, then think about it again! I'm going to try and make do with my Calimagic, but if I keep running into deficiencies using the Calimagic and Floranova, I'll have to start considering the possibility that it isn't calcium/magnesium I'm lacking. I can always go back to adding Armor Si if it's potassium I'm lacking in veggy, or kool bloom in flower. Appreciate your thoughts on this!


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 16, 2019)

Logan Burke said:


> This, while it is about LED's, is exactly the type of information I was hoping to find. It still helps because CMH's spectrum, similar to led's, is much more widely available and hits many spectrums that conventional HPS/MH does not. Particularly with UV spectrums. I appreciate the info, please send anything else like this you find my way if you happen to stumble across anything  And don't worry I get overly stressed out about spending $ on grow stuff as well...sometimes I just have to clear my mind of the idea and come back to earth for awhile, then think about it again! I'm going to try and make do with my Calimagic, but if I keep running into deficiencies using the Calimagic and Floranova, I'll have to start considering the possibility that it isn't calcium/magnesium I'm lacking. I can always go back to adding Armor Si if it's potassium I'm lacking in veggy, or kool bloom in flower. Appreciate your thoughts on this!


What's your nutrient profile look like? PH? Grow medium? System?


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 16, 2019)

Just asking because I like to see how others do things. I'm not the kind of guy that "knows the best way of doing it", and I don't have "the secret recipe". Truth is different ways work for different people, environments, strains, etc.
I'm doing Grandaddy Purple clones from actual Ken Estes clones, in coco from Canna pre-buffered, 2x315 dual 4200k bulb cmh, AC Infinity T6 fan through 6 inch charcoal scrubber for smell, in 5ft x 5ft x 6ft8in grow tent. Canna coco 2 part nutrient, Canna Rhizotonic, Cannazym, CalMag+, Flower Fuel 1-34-32, and Humbolts Sweet & Sticky. Growing in Root Pouch fabric pots, and feeding 3/4 gallon a day. 
I'm 3rd week of flip to 12/12. Going pretty well despite setbacks.
Making some changes next grow for Calimagic instead of CalMag+, and other major change might possibly be to use one 3100k Phillips bulb and one 4200k. Not sure about that one. I'm pretty happy with the 4200k bulbs. Might maybe add small wattage light to boost blue spectrums for the veg cycle only. I'm wondering if maybe a 3 foot blacklight might work on either side. Cheap, but effective maybe? Is a blacklight really even countable as blue spectrum?


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 16, 2019)

Nah. I'd have to go for a strictly blue purple only led strip around the edge of tent I think.


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## nobighurry (Apr 16, 2019)

coreywebster said:


> All you guys using 315cmh bulbs or multiples of, does anyone know what a burnt out bulb looks like?
> 
> I lent mine to a mate for the last year, don't even think he plugged it in til last week, then he said it tripped the electrics.
> So I took it back to take a look.
> ...


One bulb looked like a spent fashion bulb when it died, no denying it was bad, but the other looked normal, I'd say sure could be the bulb, mine died after 4 cycles Phillips bulbs, using eye hortilux now..


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## Hempire828 (Apr 16, 2019)

Well it’s on now, went ahead and ordered the Vivosun 315w ,w 4200k Phillips bulb....I’m running a 3x3x6, think I should still add the blurples (2x 300 galaxyhydro =280 from wall) or is this overkill?


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## Lucky Luke (Apr 16, 2019)

Hempire828 said:


> Well it’s on now, went ahead and ordered the Vivosun 315w ,w 4200k Phillips bulb....I’m running a 3x3x6, think I should still add the blurples (2x 300 galaxyhydro =280 from wall) or is this overkill?


Id suggest not adding blurples..why not just add a far red like a HLG QB18 or the flowering initiator kit? I think growmou5 also does a red puck.


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## Hempire828 (Apr 16, 2019)

Lucky Luke said:


> Id suggest not adding blurples..why not just add a far red like a HLG QB18 or the flowering initiator kit? I think growmou5 also does a red puck.


This inside stuff is totally new to me... and I’ve damn near studied more on lights nutes soil pots etc etc...overthinking shit...but thanks man... as well as all the good smoke, I most definitely want it to look good..checking into it now


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 16, 2019)

Overkill. You'll be plenty happy with just the 315 cmh and 42ook bulb


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 16, 2019)

I cut my hood around the edge and undid the tabs to open it up from a ( shape to a { Or [ shape. Gets rid of the hot spot under the cmh bulb and you can run light lower and not worry about height problems. Gives much more even light disbursement also


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 16, 2019)




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## AlaskaRob (Apr 16, 2019)

And look at the light chart I supplied earlier in this page. Adding red is unnecessary. If anything, maybe add a little blue light spectrum in veg. Mjne did great with just the 4200k bulbs tho.


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## Hempire828 (Apr 16, 2019)

I can see the spread reflecting... seems to let heat escape as planned.. also I’m a barber.. so my eyesight is extremely Important... will my led glasses work or do I need glasses for a cmh.. and covering the skin from the UV rays are all safety precautions.. like OSHA


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 16, 2019)

I go in but dont spend hours without long sleeve shirt. I use my regular polarized lense safety glasses in my room if there is any chance of the light being in my eyes for more than just briefly. Or....just wear a baseball cap. I just look down mostly. What I'm in there for is down anyways. Lol


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 16, 2019)

If you cut the hood open, instead of 28-30 inches of distance from canopy I was able to get mine down to 24 inches with no heat issues


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 16, 2019)

From my cameras earlier today. Buds are just under a week old.


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## Lucky Luke (Apr 17, 2019)

Hempire828 said:


> This inside stuff is totally new to me... and I’ve damn near studied more on lights nutes soil pots etc etc...overthinking shit...but thanks man... as well as all the good smoke, I most definitely want it to look good..checking into it now


CMH is all new to me as well. That flower initiator kit from HLG should work with any light you choose to grow with and I believe will be standard fitment to the new 550V3. (but please don't quote me on that, i'm just assuming from a few things Stephen from HLG has said. The QB's he does are IMO the leaders in the lighting game and makes it easy to improve our spectrum with his tech- but it depends what your chasing to.)
https://horticulturelightinggroup.com/collections/all/products/flowering-initator-development-kit


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## nobighurry (Apr 17, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> I go in but dont spend hours without long sleeve shirt. I use my regular polarized lense safety glasses in my room if there is any chance of the light being in my eyes for more than just briefly. Or....just wear a baseball cap. I just look down mostly. What I'm in there for is down anyways. Lol


I learned my lesson the hard was as usual lol, I did a vertical bare bulb grow, no avoiding the welding arc like brightness and my eyes felt like they had sand thrown in them, I bought some welding goggles asap..


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## Logan Burke (Apr 17, 2019)

Not to annoy with novice questions about cmh lighting, but how many 315w/630w lights would I need to cover a 6.5x6.5 foot grow space? I only do 4 plants in this space, and they typically only take up about 5x5 or at a max 6x6, leaving me just a little room around the edges to walk around and access all 4 plants. I just can't quite pin down how many cmh lights I need for this space. Thanks for any help!!


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## TintEastwood (Apr 17, 2019)

Kool Tool for what-if....
https://www.currentbyge.com/ideas/watts-per-square-foot-estimator

A write-up I found helpful.
https://growace.com/blog/how-many-grow-lights-do-your-plants-need/


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## Apalchen (Apr 17, 2019)

Logan Burke said:


> Not to annoy with novice questions about cmh lighting, but how many 315w/630w lights would I need to cover a 6.5x6.5 foot grow space? I only do 4 plants in this space, and they typically only take up about 5x5 or at a max 6x6, leaving me just a little room around the edges to walk around and access all 4 plants. I just can't quite pin down how many cmh lights I need for this space. Thanks for any help!!


Well if it were me I’d do at least 4x315. You can get by with less if you have too but 4 should do well. I’m a fan of as much light as possible tho but I see all
kinda people get by with less but 3 minimum I’d say. If u got the money and wattage to use you can do 5 in there. If it was mine I’d also use the whole space if only scrogging 4 plants that leaves you plenty of room under the canopy to work(getting close but still not too old to some crawling under the trellis.)


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## JohnDee (Apr 17, 2019)

Hi guys,
Just thought I'd post a follow up. Using two 315w with Philips ballasts. One light failed to start several times and also shut off if I bumped the reflector. I had done rewiring and modification of hoods so was suspecting a wiring issue.

I swapped the bulbs and the problem followed the bulb...so bad bulb. Only 6 months old and one run. Probably defective from the start. Think I'll buy a spare when I replace it.
JD


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## Logan Burke (Apr 17, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> Kool Tool for what-if....
> https://www.currentbyge.com/ideas/watts-per-square-foot-estimator
> 
> A write-up I found helpful.
> https://growace.com/blog/how-many-grow-lights-do-your-plants-need/


Those are some really useful tools, really helps give a concrete number! 


Apalchen said:


> Well if it were me I’d do at least 4x315. You can get by with less if you have too but 4 should do well. I’m a fan of as much light as possible tho but I see all
> kinda people get by with less but 3 minimum I’d say. If u got the money and wattage to use you can do 5 in there. If it was mine I’d also use the whole space if only scrogging 4 plants that leaves you plenty of room under the canopy to work(getting close but still not too old to some crawling under the trellis.)


Precisely what I was hoping to find out, thank you! One of my issues with Scrogging is that I grow in 5 gallon DWC standalone buckets. I have to be able to lift the plant's netpot up to slide their buckets out from underneath them, so that I can dump out the old nutrient water and all of that. Is this something I could manage to do with a scrog setup? I'd really love to be able to do a scrog! I don't mind at all to purchase 4 units, it is actually the reason I just now bought a 10000 BTU window ac unit. I'm currently using a single 1000w HPS for my 4 plants, and I'm just not getting the rock hard dense colas that I feel I should be. For the time being, I'm only going to be able to buy 3 315's, but I believe this will far out-produce my single 1kw HPS light?


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## TintEastwood (Apr 17, 2019)

Logan Burke said:


> Those are some really useful tools, really helps give a concrete number!
> 
> Precisely what I was hoping to find out, thank you! One of my issues with Scrogging is that I grow in 5 gallon DWC standalone buckets. I have to be able to lift the plant's netpot up to slide their buckets out from underneath them, so that I can dump out the old nutrient water and all of that. Is this something I could manage to do with a scrog setup? I'd really love to be able to do a scrog! I don't mind at all to purchase 4 units, it is actually the reason I just now bought a 10000 BTU window ac unit. I'm currently using a single 1000w HPS for my 4 plants, and I'm just not getting the rock hard dense colas that I feel I should be. For the time being, I'm only going to be able to buy 3 315's, but I believe this will far out-produce my single 1kw HPS light?


Possible solution, or at least ideas on your bucket access needs.

Do a google search and look at images for....
"Scrog on wheels"


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 17, 2019)

Logan Burke said:


> Not to annoy with novice questions about cmh lighting, but how many 315w/630w lights would I need to cover a 6.5x6.5 foot grow space? I only do 4 plants in this space, and they typically only take up about 5x5 or at a max 6x6, leaving me just a little room around the edges to walk around and access all 4 plants. I just can't quite pin down how many cmh lights I need for this space. Thanks for any help!!


I have 6 plants in a 5x5 tent. It goes wall to wall buds with my 630w (2x315w bulbs in one ballast) cmh. If I could do remote ballast I may have preferred 2 separate hoods for the area, but cutting the seams and opening up my hood for wider coverage is working well in my space. A single 315 cmh would be good for 4 plants if you weren't training them. Covers about 3.5 feet x 3.5 feet.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 17, 2019)

Tinteastwood's link for growace is one i used when figuring out what to do for my tent lighting needs. The first one I never saw before but damn....niw I'm thinking I REALLY want another light for my next run! Lol


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 17, 2019)

Jesus! 4 lights in his tiny space? He would fry them even with AC. Way too far beyond the light saturation point. If he could get right around 40w per square foot of canopy it would be ideal. I want to push that and go for 45w next run


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## TintEastwood (Apr 17, 2019)

Oops. 
2x315-cmh. 1x260w-VeroCob.
I dont run the cobs at full power. About 220w. 700-1200ppm Co2.




Almost ready....


New Veg box.....under construction.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 17, 2019)

I didn't even notice until now that I typed 40, sorry I meant to write 50w per square foot.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 17, 2019)

I'm curious how far I can push the watts per square foot tho. Currently doing about 45w per square foot of canopy, but I'd like to go higher. Just need to add CO2 for the heat. My 630w cmh is great, but I have trouble regulating temps so regimes using 6 inch fan. I wonder if adding a 6 inch intake fan would make much difference? I could run it through the same controller I have now on my AC Infinity t6 setup


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 17, 2019)

2 of my light withjn a 5x5 tent would be really warm tho without CO2 AND venting. That sounds expensive already!


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 17, 2019)

But damn.....1260 watts in a 5x5!


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 17, 2019)

Tint, how do you vent?


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## GoBrah (Apr 17, 2019)

hello club members, i have some 315 free samples to sent out for test grow, anyone want to run them?


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## TintEastwood (Apr 18, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Tint, how do you vent?


To maintain O2 level, 4 times a day. Using a exhaust fan on cycle timer.
Dumps room air out, pulls fresh air in thru a Merv13.
Had 2 successful runs without any venting.
Really want an ambient O2 meter! (Ugh....another 100 bucks. Lol)


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 18, 2019)

Only 4x a day? What's your high temp before you vent? Always wondered how high someone could let temps get before doing serious damage. I get worried at anything over 80, but with CO2 I figured it still couldn't go over 88 or so.


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## Logan Burke (Apr 18, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> Oops.
> 2x315-cmh. 1x260w-VeroCob.
> I dont run the cobs at full power. About 220w. 700-1200ppm Co2.
> 
> ...


May I ask what size your grow room is with the 2 315's and vero cob?



AlaskaRob said:


> I didn't even notice until now that I typed 40, sorry I meant to write 50w per square foot.


With 3 315's I still wouldn't be at 40-50w per square foot, close, but not quite. And that is if I only consider the space I'll be using within my 6.5x6.5 tent, about 5x5. Does anyone know how hot it would become with 4 315's in a 6.5x6.5? I have a 850-900cfm fan extracting air through a large carbon filter at the top of my tent. Passive intake. I just bought a 10,000 btu window AC unit as well. Is this adequate to keep 4 315's cooled off enough?...


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## TintEastwood (Apr 18, 2019)

Logan Burke said:


> May I ask what size your grow room is with the 2 315's and vero cob?
> 
> 
> With 3 315's I still wouldn't be at 40-50w per square foot, close, but not quite. And that is if I only consider the space I'll be using within my 6.5x6.5 tent, about 5x5. Does anyone know how hot it would become with 4 315's in a 6.5x6.5? I have a 850-900cfm fan extracting air through a large carbon filter at the top of my tent. Passive intake. I just bought a 10,000 btu window AC unit as well. Is this adequate to keep 4 315's cooled off enough?...


It's 4x8x8. Only 4x4 used for grow.
Using a 6k window shaker.

No experience with AC sizing. But I would hope your 10k is sufficient.


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## TintEastwood (Apr 18, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Only 4x a day? What's your high temp before you vent? Always wondered how high someone could let temps get before doing serious damage. I get worried at anything over 80, but with CO2 I figured it still couldn't go over 88 or so.


AC keeps the room at temp.
Dehuey keeps humidity in check.
The bad news.....they run 24/7.


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## TintEastwood (Apr 18, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> It's 4x8x8. Only 4x4 used for grow.
> Using a 6k window shaker.
> 
> No experience with AC sizing. But I would hope your 10k is sufficient.


Dummy me. I forgot. Almost 4x4. 42"x42".


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## Logan Burke (Apr 18, 2019)

If you're able to keep temps in check with a 6k ac unit then I would imagine that I'd be ok running 4 315's with my 10k ac unit, 900cfm running 24/7, and plenty of oscilating fans on the inside. I apologize for all of the novice type questions, I'm just trying to decide exactly how much light I can get in this little tent of mine without running high temps! I've only ever owned HPS's. Your grow looks very impressive though, Eastwood. I am hoping that I can achieve a canopy of colas like you have.


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## TintEastwood (Apr 18, 2019)

Logan Burke said:


> If you're able to keep temps in check with a 6k ac unit then I would imagine that I'd be ok running 4 315's with my 10k ac unit, 900cfm running 24/7, and plenty of oscilating fans on the inside. I apologize for all of the novice type questions, I'm just trying to decide exactly how much light I can get in this little tent of mine without running high temps! I've only ever owned HPS's. Your grow looks very impressive though, Eastwood. I am hoping that I can achieve a canopy of colas like you have.


Its an investment running indoor setups. Huge investment of time.
I'm retired after 35yrs of IT. Lucky to have the time and money to grow for fun. I sell none.

Gentle airflow. I've burned my shit up by having too much air cirulation.

Its nice being able to add and/or mix lighting.

At mid flower I start running a fan/carbon filter to scrub inside the room.


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## Stubbie (Apr 18, 2019)

My little LEC grow show. 

2x 315 SS LEC
4x4' tent
3.5 gal hempy buckets, perlite bottom 2" CoCo Loco up to the top
Dyna-Gro nutes (ProTeKt/Bloom/Mag-Pro) nutes according to their feed plan. I started these with CRF (Osomocote) in the buckets, but they ate through it pretty quick and had to start supplementing with Bloom)
30 days veg from seed, photos are 7 weeks after the 12/12 flip
Clockwise from front left
1ea Dutch Passion Critical Orange Punch
1ea Sensi Seeds Afghan #1
1ea Blueberry
1ea Barney's Farm Triple Cheese

Topped them all several times, and ended up with a fairly even canopy. Pleased with everything so far, and has been one of my easiest grows.


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## Apalchen (Apr 18, 2019)

6.5x6.5= 42.5 sq ft 
42.5 x 35watts per sq ft= 1487.5 watts 

6x6=36 sq ft
36x 35 watts per sq ft =1260

These lights work great at 35 watts per sq ft and I’d say that’s about the max I’d try to cover with one. That being said if you can cool it add more as I’ve seen people running 5 or more per 4x8. 

Cooling 3.41 btu x 1260watts =4297 btu 
That 10k btu ac should work great and cover any additional heat from pumps,fans, dehuey.


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## ThatSpudGuy (Apr 18, 2019)

Stubbie said:


> My little LEC grow show.
> 
> 2x 315 SS LEC
> 4x4' tent
> ...


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## Apalchen (Apr 18, 2019)

3x3 shots needed another trellis last run tried to hold em up with yo-yos but some still fell over. Didn’t cause any problems tho. 

Younger plants are same tent reloaded. The others are right before chop. The pictures are loaded backwards as the young ones went in a day after old ones came down. 

Strain is banrneys farm critical kush from clone in both pictures.


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## Hempire828 (Apr 18, 2019)

Damn can’t wait to get my 315


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## Dr.Amber Trichome (Apr 18, 2019)

GoBrah said:


> hello club members, i have some 315 free samples to sent out for test grow, anyone want to run them?


What exactly are they? I might like some please.i jus bought this tent and could use some stuff to Put in it! Thank you!


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## TintEastwood (Apr 18, 2019)

Stubbie said:


> My little LEC grow show.
> 
> 2x 315 SS LEC
> 4x4' tent
> ...


Beautiful!


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## Chip Green (Apr 18, 2019)

GoBrah said:


> hello club members, i have some 315 free samples to sent out for test grow, anyone want to run them?


I'm listening....


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## GoBrah (Apr 18, 2019)

Dr.Amber Trichome said:


> What exactly are they? I might like some please.i jus bought this tent and could use some stuff to Put in it! Thank you!
> View attachment 4319718





Chip Green said:


> I'm listening....


same as those CMH315 you can find on the market, PGZX18 base could fit in any CMH315 fixture, similar spectrum as Philips, slightly higher PPF than Philips we have tested. both 3kk and 4kk


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## GoBrah (Apr 18, 2019)

Im now think about to make a CMH400W in E39 base to let you guys run with HPS ballast(high frequency), sounds good?


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## Hempire828 (Apr 19, 2019)

Finally... just waiting on bulb


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 19, 2019)

My light!


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## Hempire828 (Apr 20, 2019)

Got the bulb too everything set to go for 4/20...now to purchase seeds today..damn didn't plan this out right,,would of been nice if I could have planted something today...seems only right...


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## Unsinkableship420 (Apr 20, 2019)

Not a 315 i know but still cmh.... 
1x 630w DE cmh (hi par brand)
2x 260w hlg v2 kits
Tent is 2.2m W by 1.2m D by 2m tall
2 critical plus by dinafem 
2 sour lemon og by emerald triangle 
All 4 in 30L pot of coco perlite mix
11 days since flip.
This is my first run with the cmh in there so im excited to say the least.


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## Logan Burke (Apr 20, 2019)

GoBrah said:


> Im now think about to make a CMH400W in E39 base to let you guys run with HPS ballast(high frequency), sounds good?


I've always read that high frequency ballasts are bad for CMH lights? Not 100% sure on it though. I'm not a DIY'er.


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## turbobuzz (Apr 20, 2019)

My first try with the 315 lec. This is a pure power plant from MSNL seeds. Day 35 of flower. I never grew sativa before, and wasn't prepared for the massive stretch, but I'm really liking the light. Sun Systems Phillips bulb.


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## Logan Burke (Apr 20, 2019)

She sure did stretch a ton Turbo! Did you find heat to be an issue with such tall growing plants?


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## JohnDee (Apr 20, 2019)

Logan Burke said:


> I've always read that high frequency ballasts are bad for CMH lights? Not 100% sure on it though. I'm not a DIY'er.


Hi guys and happy 4/20...
They make a "conversion" ceramic MH bulb that uses mogul base and runs on MH ballast. I wouldn't try running a 315w on a 400 ballast though...
JD


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## turbobuzz (Apr 20, 2019)

Logan Burke said:


> She sure did stretch a ton Turbo! Did you find heat to be an issue with such tall growing plants?


I kept it around 83. Lights in a closet with a fan and the door open. It's about 8 degrees hotter than the outside room temp. I will top early next time I grow sativa.


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## GoBrah (Apr 20, 2019)

Logan Burke said:


> I've always read that high frequency ballasts are bad for CMH lights? Not 100% sure on it though. I'm not a DIY'er.


they said because they are unable to design the CMH that can work on HF ballast, also to sell LF ballast is good for their revenue.


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## GoBrah (Apr 20, 2019)

JohnDee said:


> Hi guys and happy 4/20...
> They make a "conversion" ceramic MH bulb that uses mogul base and runs on MH ballast. I wouldn't try running a 315w on a 400 ballast though...
> JD


the idea is use hps ballast to drive CMH, only change the bulb… save money on a separate ballast


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## Logan Burke (Apr 21, 2019)

Just be careful. I've heard of bulbs being fried from improper ballasts, and most cmh bulbs aren't cheap to replace!


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## GoBrah (Apr 21, 2019)

Logan Burke said:


> Just be careful. I've heard of bulbs being fried from improper ballasts, and most cmh bulbs aren't cheap to replace!


we will narrow down the condition of usage, that helps user to avoid accident but not everyone read the instruction and do things properly. 
Do you still want 315 samples?


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## growingforfun (Apr 21, 2019)

For what it's worth to anyone, I got some samples from @GoBrah . 
Sent me 2x 1kw cmh bulbs he claims should run on my de gavitas. I have not tested them yet as I'm waiting for my next run. But they were sent out at no cost and quickly.


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## Apalchen (Apr 22, 2019)

growingforfun said:


> For what it's worth to anyone, I got some samples from @GoBrah .
> Sent me 2x 1kw cmh bulbs he claims should run on my de gavitas. I have not tested them yet as I'm waiting for my next run. But they were sent out at no cost and quickly.


Just got some new gavitas for sure let us know how it goes. Are the bulbs jacketed if not you might want to order a shield from growers choice it’s just a glass tube that fits around bulb to prevent fire on bulbs not rated for open fixture use. I run my de 630 bulbs in acde hoods because was worried about it after saw a post where one of the growers choice bulbs caught someone room on fire.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 22, 2019)

Exactly why you would want proper ballast use that matches the bulbs you are using. New cmh bulbs use low square wave ballast, not digital ballast like gravitas. Gravitas are damn good for hps/mh, kinda risky for cmh tho. IMO


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## Apalchen (Apr 22, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Exactly why you would want proper ballast use that matches the bulbs you are using. New cmh bulbs use low square wave ballast, not digital ballast like gravitas. Gravitas are damn good for hps/mh, kinda risky for cmh tho. IMO


In my opinion some of these lighting company’s are taking a big liability releasing bulbs without much warning they are not open fixture rated. Growers choice sells a fixture to run their 630 and 1000 cmh and it’s high frequency and I don’t think it comes with the safety shield. But it’s not just cmh the mh de bulbs can be dangerous as well. I know growerchoice makes a shield you can use and I believe nanolux double jackets some of their bulbs.


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## growingforfun (Apr 22, 2019)

I honestly have no idea about the jackets or if @GoBrah 's bulbs have one or need one. 

I got the growers choice 315's (se) and just plugged it in an let it fly <shrug> I dunno. Did the same thing with the 1kw gavitas. Someone clue me in if I'm fuckin up.


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## Apalchen (Apr 22, 2019)

The 315 bulbs are double jacketed at least pretty sure I know the Phillips ones most people use are. As far as the the other bulbs You got im not sure without looking at em but if they look just like an hps on the outside glass they don’t have the double jacket.

I’d still run em if they in work on your gavita I would just order that shield from growerschoice for peace of mind. If they work good let me know I’d love to have 1000 watt cmh but I’ve bought enough experimental fixtures and just wanted something proven this time around. (Didn’t care for de 630 and terrible luck with ballast for em.)


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 22, 2019)

I have never run de bulbs, I prefer the 2x315 se fixture I got. I just like the versatility of running one or both bulbs at once depending on stage of growth or space needs. No point running 630w with seedlings barely out of the humidity dome. Lol


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## GoBrah (Apr 22, 2019)

growingforfun said:


> I honestly have no idea about the jackets or if @GoBrah 's bulbs have one or need one.
> 
> I got the growers choice 315's (se) and just plugged it in an let it fly <shrug> I dunno. Did the same thing with the 1kw gavitas. Someone clue me in if I'm fuckin up.


The DE bulb i've sent to you is thick quartz shell design, we've tested and it holds the arc tube explosion.
If you really need the outer glass shell, dont buy from Growerschoice, cuz the bulb diameter is not same as theirs. find me in conversation if you need extra shell.


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## GoBrah (Apr 22, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Exactly why you would want proper ballast use that matches the bulbs you are using. New cmh bulbs use low square wave ballast, not digital ballast like gravitas. Gravitas are damn good for hps/mh, kinda risky for cmh tho. IMO


The CMH315 has the own designed LF ballast. BUT, from 630 to 1000 CMH, it really depends on whom made the bulb, some factories can only made CMH for LF ballast, the growerschoice CMH1000W could use on HF ballast, i attached the screenshot from their web. 

Our CMH1000w is designed to use on HF ballast, the idea is to let you guys use one ballast to drive both HPS and CMH.
We have contacted and sent samples to ballast makers who supply those big brands (like gavita) , we did lots matching before sent to grower.

Before i sent samples to any grower, i always ask what ballasts they have at first.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 22, 2019)

What about the benefit of having a low-frequency square wave Ballast? With longer waves in between cycles in the 60 Hz zone, more light hits the plan are cycle over a regular digital ballast that has a higher frequency


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## Doofus32 (Apr 22, 2019)

I'm using a Barron Growlite 315 CMH digital ballast and bulb. The bulb is different from the Philips because it is a screw-in type with an old style mogul. This is my second round with it in my 3X3 tent using GH nutes in Promix BH and I could not be happier. My first round was a learning experience but my Critical Kush and Hawaiian plants were very impressive. One thing I noticed this time is that the addition of CalMag+ with every feeding has possibly solved a deficiency. It seems as though some of you have discovered this as well. This time round I am scrogging and I think that this setup is just perfect. I believe, however that next time I will switch to Coco Coir, but other than that I can't think of a setup better for my needs. My reflector is just an open El Cheapo wing style but it seems to provide excellent coverage.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 22, 2019)

Hello doofus,
others and myself included have found that when using the cmh bulbs theretends to be a common calcum or magnesium deficiency. Something to do with the specific spectrum put out by the bulbs. The idea we all seem to agree on is thst the fuller spectrum with the increased UV, and far deep reds seem to allow the plant to better absorb these nutrients versus other bulb types. 
Another thing you may want to consider, is that it's pretty common for anyone using coco four to also experience a calmag deficiency as well.
That being said, I have a dual bulb 2x315 cmh using the Phillips 945 4200k bulbs, and i love what the combination has d9ne for my grandaddy purple plants. 
I don't say any of this to try to discourage you, in fact very much the opposite. I think cmh and coco is a great combination! Just be aware that you will definitely need a calmag supplement. I currently use CalMag+ from Botanicare, but will be switching to Calimagic as soon as my Calmag+ is empty. The + is the nitrogen thst is useful in veg cycle, but takes up space in my nutrient profile is rather use for something else during bloom cycles.
I hope this helps at least a little.


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## GoBrah (Apr 23, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> What about the benefit of having a low-frequency square wave Ballast? With longer waves in between cycles in the 60 Hz zone, more light hits the plan are cycle over a regular digital ballast that has a higher frequency


Hi, AR. 
The frequency and light output are irrelevent. Normally CMH is suitable for LF, so factory make LF ballast for it. BUT, since material changes and optimized designs, CMH can match up the HF ballast, like the one we have.


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## growingforfun (Apr 23, 2019)

GoBrah said:


> Hi, AR.
> The frequency and light output are irrelevent. Normally CMH is suitable for LF, so factory make LF ballast for it. BUT, since material changes and optimized designs, CMH can match up the HF ballast, like the one we have.


Can you talk more about your statement that the light output is irrelevant? That's not generally something a manufacture of lighting equipment would say, and I think we may be missing what your trying to explain without further details.


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## GoBrah (Apr 23, 2019)

growingforfun said:


> Can you talk more about your statement that the light output is irrelevant? That's not generally something a manufacture of lighting equipment would say, and I think we may be missing what your trying to explain without further details.


I mean the frequency does not determine how much the light output. the suitable freqency match the ballast and bulb, so they running stable.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 23, 2019)

Ever notice the lines when someone takes a pic of their plants? Ever notice how when someone shares a pic of a cmh in proper ballast how there are no lines? Not visible to the eye but the plants see them. Those are gaps in the light available to the plant from the high frequency flicker. A square wave ballast, sometimes called low frequency, longer sine waves with less peaks and valleys. So more light is available per cycle from high peak to low peak in your 120/240v Alternating current power. That's what the 60hz meanslisted on electronics. Ever try taking a pic of a regular tv screen or computer monitor? The lines you see are the gaps from +peak through 0 to the - peak. Both peaks give the power for the appliance, but as it passes through zero there is no power. Regular sine wave looks like a ~, where as square wave looks like (this is going to look stupid but hopefully illustrate the idea) -l_-l_
Does that make sense?
I'll try to find the technical manual if you would like. I'm not the best at explaining stuff, I just went to trade school and did the electrical apprenticeship.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 23, 2019)

Regardless, it's what makes a 630w cmh square wave ballast give very similar results to 1000w hps. The light spectrum with the added UV and far reds is a hell of a bonus.


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## coocooforkush (Apr 23, 2019)

gr865 said:


> Whatever doesn't kill you will only make you stronger!


 That is sooo true. I am going to post a pic of the amputee today. Its a monster and grows by the inch at night. Wait till u see it.


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## growingforfun (Apr 23, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Regardless, it's what makes a 630w cmh square wave ballast give very similar results to 1000w hps. The light spectrum with the added UV and far reds is a hell of a bonus.


So to sum up what your saying a square wave 1kw cmh is going to be superior to a 1kw cmh running on a high frequency ballast hands down. Is the right?


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## coocooforkush (Apr 23, 2019)

Heres some new 315 3100 k. Pics. We have a nice bluberry in the closet with 16 mainlined heads. And a vanilla kush in its 8th week looking great. Check out the tiny blade growing backwards on the blueberry leaf. Very cool genetics. The monstorcropped skunk is just about ready to flower. It will be a beast. The little blueberry gave birth to some yellow tipped leaves. Weird. I think it got over fertilized a bit. Any ideas? Seems to be ok. The big bluberry in the closet was broken but recovered nicely and is now in the stretch. Its in a 10 gallon fabric pot. Never seen such a huge pheno. Leaves li     ke dinner plates. And the smell is heavenly. 
Happy growing to all.


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## TintEastwood (Apr 23, 2019)

Phat Phans. Nice.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 23, 2019)

growingforfun said:


> So to sum up what your saying a square wave 1kw cmh is going to be superior to a 1kw cmh running on a high frequency ballast hands down. Is the right?


From what I've read, yes.


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## Apalchen (Apr 24, 2019)

Has anyone run the 1000watt cmh on the revolution deva fixture it’s supposed to be a low frequency ballast? They claim it has a very low failure rate which would be nice as I tried a couple Chinese de 630 ballast and both quit working.


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## GoBrah (Apr 24, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Ever notice the lines when someone takes a pic of their plants? Ever notice how when someone shares a pic of a cmh in proper ballast how there are no lines? Not visible to the eye but the plants see them. Those are gaps in the light available to the plant from the high frequency flicker. A square wave ballast, sometimes called low frequency, longer sine waves with less peaks and valleys. So more light is available per cycle from high peak to low peak in your 120/240v Alternating current power. That's what the 60hz meanslisted on electronics. Ever try taking a pic of a regular tv screen or computer monitor? The lines you see are the gaps from +peak through 0 to the - peak. Both peaks give the power for the appliance, but as it passes through zero there is no power. Regular sine wave looks like a ~, where as square wave looks like (this is going to look stupid but hopefully illustrate the idea) -l_-l_
> Does that make sense?
> I'll try to find the technical manual if you would like. I'm not the best at explaining stuff, I just went to trade school and did the electrical apprenticeship.


you are totally right about electrical knowledge, when it passes through zero there is no power.
In the circumstances of HID does not produce any light when pass through 0, you are right because HF passes more than LF during same period of time.
but for the light itself, when the moment there is no power, light still emitting because the plasma inside remains the working temp for a short while.
im sure you heard duty cycle, if the duty cycle is low the plasma losses its working temp because of long time no power, there will be a very obvious flickering, and easily catch the line by camera, it happens on both LF and HF.

For both HF and LF ballast, the key is to control a good duty cycle to let the light emitting consitantly. 

The low frequency is good for bulb life for sure, cuz HF waves damage the bulb more. 

Hope it explains.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 24, 2019)

growingforfun said:


> So to sum up what your saying a square wave 1kw cmh is going to be superior to a 1kw cmh running on a high frequency ballast hands down. Is the right?


Definitely believe so, but that's from what I keep reading on different forums. I have not had the interest t9 do a side by side test myself. I use cmh, never read or seen anything wrong with them, and they're doing great for my needs. 
In the end, every person will find what works for them. I can only encourage those thst haven't tried cmh to look into the numbers, diagrams, etc. and give it a try. Technology is always evolving, but I really think this cmh technology is what will be what I stay with.


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## Apalchen (Apr 25, 2019)

Do you guys notice you get the lines on your pictures when your bulbs get old. I get lines on my pictures and my ballast low frequency. They are the sunburst 315 with Phillips bulbs. I never paid any attention before so I’m not sure if always did or just because bulbs getting a lil old.


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## Apalchen (Apr 25, 2019)

Picture for example of the lines I mentioned in post above forgot to add to post.


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## coocooforkush (Apr 25, 2019)

Apalchen said:


> Picture for example of the lines I mentioned in post above forgot to add to post.


Wow. You may have found an easy way to tell when to change bulbs. This is very interesting.


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## Apalchen (Apr 25, 2019)

coocooforkush said:


> Wow. You may have found an easy way to tell when to change bulbs. This is very interesting.


Or maybe the sunburst fixtures aren’t really square wave I’m not sure what to think.


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## coocooforkush (Apr 25, 2019)

Yea. I was looking on the net. From what i can see lec bulbs run on square wave transformers. I found this page that was good but didnt answer the question directly. Can u take a pucture of the specs on the transformer and post it. Then i can research it and find the answer. Heres the page i was on.
https://www.epicgardening.com/cmh-grow-lights/


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## coocooforkush (Apr 25, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> Phat Phans. Nice.


Hey have you ever see leaves grow out yellow like that and then turn green. They arent burnt or dying. Today they are getting green. Really weird.


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## hillbill (Apr 25, 2019)

I am an electric idiot but if the most advanced technology in HID grow lights is designed to operate on a certain type ballast, I would damn sure run it. Or just an old HPS on a magnetic.


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 27, 2019)

I like hillbill's explanation of cmh lighting better than mine. I went to school for electrical work.
But yes, if made to run a certain way, then why try to save money by cutting corners. If it says square wave ballast, you should adhere to that. Lol
The lines in your pic shouldn't be from the bulb going bad, it's a sign of the frequency wave that's powering the bulb. Check your ballast for sure, and then look into your power going into the ballast. How many hertz? How much voltage? If your area is prone to brown-outs (dimming of power from overloaded powergrid) thst might do it also. But ballast is most likely the issue.


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## coocooforkush (Apr 27, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> I like hillbill's explanation of cmh lighting better than mine. I went to school for electrical work.
> But yes, if made to run a certain way, then why try to save money by cutting corners. If it says square wave ballast, you should adhere to that. Lol
> The lines in your pic shouldn't be from the bulb going bad, it's a sign of the frequency wave that's powering the bulb. Check your ballast for sure, and then look into your power going into the ballast. How many hertz? How much voltage? If your area is prone to brown-outs (dimming of power from overloaded powergrid) thst might do it also. But ballast is most likely the issue.


Yea. What is said.


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## Logan Burke (Apr 27, 2019)

Doofus32 said:


> I'm using a Barron Growlite 315 CMH digital ballast and bulb. The bulb is different from the Philips because it is a screw-in type with an old style mogul. This is my second round with it in my 3X3 tent using GH nutes in Promix BH and I could not be happier. My first round was a learning experience but my Critical Kush and Hawaiian plants were very impressive. One thing I noticed this time is that the addition of CalMag+ with every feeding has possibly solved a deficiency. It seems as though some of you have discovered this as well. This time round I am scrogging and I think that this setup is just perfect. I believe, however that next time I will switch to Coco Coir, but other than that I can't think of a setup better for my needs. My reflector is just an open El Cheapo wing style but it seems to provide excellent coverage.


I too noticed that supplementing with Calmag is an absolute must for me ever since switching to cmh lighting. I'm sure there are other factors at play, such as me being in DWC, but I've never had to supplement with calmag before switching to these lights. I don't mind though, some calmag is more than worth the results I get with these


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 29, 2019)

630w cmh doing it's thing with my GDP into week3 of 12/12 flip


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 29, 2019)

Hmmm, so with these purple buds coming out for early summer/late spring, I'm thinking of growing upon theme based releases. Lol
Next batch would go in around beginning of July and crop out in October, so......black dog strain for Halloween? What's more appropriate than black plants with black buds and orange hairs?! Lol
And then batch after would be in late October, so....scarlett Johansson strain for some pink buds for Valentine's day?


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## AlaskaRob (Apr 29, 2019)

More pics from 3 weeks since light flip to 12/12 under 630 cmh. Pretty good amount of frosting for only having buds showing for nearly 2 weeks now?


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## Apalchen (Apr 30, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> I like hillbill's explanation of cmh lighting better than mine. I went to school for electrical work.
> But yes, if made to run a certain way, then why try to save money by cutting corners. If it says square wave ballast, you should adhere to that. Lol
> The lines in your pic shouldn't be from the bulb going bad, it's a sign of the frequency wave that's powering the bulb. Check your ballast for sure, and then look into your power going into the ballast. How many hertz? How much voltage? If your area is prone to brown-outs (dimming of power from overloaded powergrid) thst might do it also. But ballast is most likely the issue.


Hmm not sure I will check the ballast later and see, but you got me thinking it could be my power strip it has a built in timer and was convenient but have had issues where it only fires one of the 315s (have to 3x3 side by side) most times it fires em both but at least once a week I’ll go in and will have to unplug the one that didn’t fire for 30 seconds then it fires. I would say it was the ballast but I replaced it under warranty and it still happens occasionally. So I’m thinking it’s the power strip maybe.


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## AlaskaRob (May 1, 2019)

Apalchen said:


> Hmm not sure I will check the ballast later and see, but you got me thinking it could be my power strip it has a built in timer and was convenient but have had issues where it only fires one of the 315s (have to 3x3 side by side) most times it fires em both but at least once a week I’ll go in and will have to unplug the one that didn’t fire for 30 seconds then it fires. I would say it was the ballast but I replaced it under warranty and it still happens occasionally. So I’m thinking it’s the power strip maybe.


Any idea how many amps you're pulling from the circuit? Or even from that one outlet? 2 lamps can pull 5 amps to run, and slightly more to fire up. Standard household wiring in the states would either be a 15 or 20 amp circuit breaker. Rms (root mean squared) of that is 75%. Once you get to 75% of a circuit, it's only a matter of time before heat from the amperage running through the wires heat the breaker enough to pop. I only bring it up because maybe you're pulling too many amps but not enough to fire both lamps at the same time?


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## AlaskaRob (May 1, 2019)

Anyone know how much heat can expect a 50 pint dehumidifier to put out as it pulls moisture from the air?
My situation is that the person staying in the room where my rent is located has been closing the window at night and thereby cutting off the exhaust from escaping the room. Humidity levels in my flowering tent has hit over 70% each morning I check the security camera looking at the climate controller.


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## Apalchen (May 1, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Any idea how many amps you're pulling from the circuit? Or even from that one outlet? 2 lamps can pull 5 amps to run, and slightly more to fire up. Standard household wiring in the states would either be a 15 or 20 amp circuit breaker. Rms (root mean squared) of that is 75%. Once you get to 75% of a circuit, it's only a matter of time before heat from the amperage running through the wires heat the breaker enough to pop. I only bring it up because maybe you're pulling too many amps but not enough to fire both lamps at the same time?


I’ll try moving some stuff off that circuit and see if it changes, that very well could be the issue and I’d run a new outlet but this is last run in these tents, so I’ll just relocate some things for now.


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## Logan Burke (May 1, 2019)

I don't have a dehuey or I'd be happy to offer advice AlaskaRob :/

On a seperate note, I just got two 315w CMH's installed in my 6x6x6ft tent, one on each side of the 1000w HPS. The light is pretty intense, and I am very pleased. I am hoping that the extra 630w of cmh lighting will at least increase my yield by 50%...anyone think that will happen versus just my 1000w hps?


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## TintEastwood (May 1, 2019)

Apalchen said:


> I’ll try moving some stuff off that circuit and see if it changes, that very well could be the issue and I’d run a new outlet but this is last run in these tents, so I’ll just relocate some things for now.


Had a similar situation with staggering startup for two 315's. Had chitty timer relays fail on me as well. Invested in a lighting controller and no more frustrations since. Titan Hades 2 fit my needs.


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## TintEastwood (May 1, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Anyone know how much heat can expect a 50 pint dehumidifier to put out as it pulls moisture from the air?
> My situation is that the person staying in the room where my rent is located has been closing the window at night and thereby cutting off the exhaust from escaping the room. Humidity levels in my flowering tent has hit over 70% each morning I check the security camera looking at the climate controller.


When the compressor is running on my Black and decker 50 pint....it's constantly kicking out hot exhaust.

I run a sealed 4x8x8. Dehuey exhaust increases the load on my AC. I run the dehuey stand-alone 24/7, not connected to a controller.


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## AlaskaRob (May 1, 2019)

Yeah I setup the dehumidifier a half hour ago. Within 30 minutes on the low setting, it dropped from 65% to 40%! I set the humidistat at 40, but didn't realize that fans keep blowing on that thing but just blow cool air when not sucking moisture out of the air actively. What hurt was when I watched the temp, within that same half hour, climb up to 85°F. I inched the light timer forward an hour so I can move slowly towards only running the lights when the fans are sucking in air from the shaded side of the house. At least the humidity is under control now? I don't think the heat will be so bad now that the humidity is at the point of regulation but only time will tell.


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## AlaskaRob (May 1, 2019)

I had a thought tho:
Hot air rises, so I put exhaust duct, fan and filter at the top of the tent. I pull cooler air in at the bott9m of the tent.
If I swapped the ducting around and pulled the cooler air in at the top to rain down from above and pull out from the bottom to the outside......would that work better for regulating heat over the canopy?


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## AlaskaRob (May 1, 2019)

Holy hell Logan! I dare say you might melt the walls! Lol
I'd like to see what you're temps get to, if you don't mind sharing sometime. I think I'd like to add a second light, but I don't think another 630w cmh would be right for in there. In hindsight, altho I love my lights versatility, the hood just doesn't give the spread I want. Got a great guy in Australia that showed me the equivalent of a raptor xl hood but for dual bulb cmh. 60$ plus shipping. I think I'm going to Frankenstein my light with it. And I noticed screws that can easily be removed to separate the ballast from the hood I have now, but the cord to the bulbs would need to be lengthened for sure. A remote ballast, a raptor XL equivalent hood for cmh, AND 630w?! That could be a serious win for the heat battle, hot spot area, and light sprrad!


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## AlaskaRob (May 1, 2019)

Hmmm, I wonder how hard it would be to somehow exhaust the hot air from dehumidifier through another channel of ducting into main ducting that flows out the window? Hmmm....maybe something for the next run to consider since I'm so far into this one already? 
Oh! On that note, I got a good look at my ladies today! Bigger than a golf ball around and the colas are at between 6-10 inches before you can see gaps that haven't filled in yet! Just starting the filling out 2 week period. And the frosting on these is fairly impressive already. Score one for the blackstrap molasses additive Humbolts Sweet & Sticky? Anyone know of any other good ones since my Humbolts is going to run out in a week or so? Or should I just let it go, knowing that I'll defi Italy need to be buying more nutrients and supplements than a liter at a time next go around?


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## Apalchen (May 6, 2019)

Updates from the 3x3 tents both tents are critical kush from clone. Still have the lines showing up in my picture somewhat but the plants seem to be happy. 

Pics from day 22


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## TintEastwood (May 6, 2019)

Chopped the Wifi Alien. Thank you CMH.


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## AlaskaRob (May 6, 2019)

Question:
I have an 8 week of flowering strain. 
Is that 8 weeks from the time I flipped to 12/12? Or 8 weeks from first sign of buds? I keep getting conflicting answers, and I don't want to chop too early or too late.


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## hillbill (May 7, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Question:
> I have an 8 week of flowering strain.
> Is that 8 weeks from the time I flipped to 12/12? Or 8 weeks from first sign of buds? I keep getting conflicting answers, and I don't want to chop too early or too late.


FROM FLIP, only firm point of reference.


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## Apalchen (May 7, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Question:
> I have an 8 week of flowering strain.
> Is that 8 weeks from the time I flipped to 12/12? Or 8 weeks from first sign of buds? I keep getting conflicting answers, and I don't want to chop too early or too late.


You can’t go by that number to chop, I’ve had the same cut finish in different amount of times and from seed it’s always a guess. Post up some pics or use a loop to inspect trichomes. It’s rare to find a strain that’s truely done in 56 days. Most I’ve run are ready by 65-70 days.


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## hillbill (May 7, 2019)

Apalchen said:


> You can’t go by that number to chop, I’ve had the same cut finish in different amount of times and from seed it’s always a guess. Post up some pics or use a loop to inspect trichomes. It’s rare to find a strain that’s truely done in 56 days. Most I’ve run are ready by 65-70 days.


Have harvested for years by trichomes only. My preference is most all cloudy and 10% max amber and about the same clear. There are exceptions as some strains never amber and some begin with yellow/amber trichs.


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## Hempire828 (May 7, 2019)

Club 315w...my plants seem to be living the life with this light.. I think I made a wise decision...any flaws let me know..


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## AlaskaRob (May 7, 2019)

Thought my grow log app opened by mistake when this screen popped up! Lol
Looks nearly identical to when I started this batch.


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## AlaskaRob (May 7, 2019)




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## AlaskaRob (May 7, 2019)

Looks good tho. You're off to a good start.


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## Apalchen (May 8, 2019)

315s for the win was bored here is some cmh bud porn...lol

Gonna miss the cmh buds, I’m on my last run flowering under them for a bit. Got new room almost finished and went with de hps for penetration. Might break out the cmh and small tent again In the fall to make some seeds. I would have went all
Cmh but money and space limitations(more height than floor space so need penetration) kept me from it for now. Hopefully someone gets the 1000w cmh right then hopefully can upgrade at later time.
 Critical kush during the flush
 Modified Mints 
 Modified Mints


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## TintEastwood (May 8, 2019)

Apalchen said:


> 315s for the win was bored here is some cmh bud porn...lol
> 
> Gonna miss the cmh buds, I’m on my last run flowering under them for a bit. Got new room almost finished and went with de hps for penetration. Might break out the cmh and small tent again In the fall to make some seeds. I would have went all
> Cmh but money and space limitations(more height than floor space so need penetration) kept me from it for now. Hopefully someone gets the 1000w cmh right then hopefully can upgrade at later time.
> ...


Moving on up to da DE.....Nice.
You will kill. 

Lov da bud porn.


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## TintEastwood (May 8, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> View attachment 4329704


Yummy, bagged Canna Coco! 
My favorite.


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## Doofus32 (May 8, 2019)

A month into the flip and the girls look good. Critical Kush and Hawaiian. I'm even getting some purpling of the leaves.


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## AlaskaRob (May 11, 2019)

Got a 30x/60x loupe coming Monday to check my progress, but which crystals are better to look at to see if it's ready? I'm going into week 6 of flower only, but they seemfarther along. Check these pics and tell me what you think.


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## Doofus32 (May 11, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Got a 30x/60x loupe coming Monday to check my progress, but which crystals are better to look at to see if it's ready? I'm going into week 6 of flower only, but they seemfarther along. Check these pics and tell me what you think.View attachment 4331703 View attachment 4331704 View attachment 4331705 View attachment 4331706


You must be something right. They will probably start bulking up from here on.


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## AlaskaRob (May 11, 2019)

They're just wider than a golf ball now. Has me a bit worried at 6 weeks in. Shouldn't they have already gone through adding mass stage?


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## Doofus32 (May 11, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> They're just wider than a golf ball now. Has me a bit worried at 6 weeks in. Shouldn't they have already gone through adding mass stage?


Maybe. My last run was about to get chopped and then they exploded. I let em rip for another week and a half.


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## AlaskaRob (May 11, 2019)

I'm thinking this would be the time to cut back the nutrients and let them use some of their stored sugars I've been loading them up on for the past few weeks. I am pretty surprised that they handled the flower fuel 1-34-32 I was giving them full strength of. Overall they were getting about 4-38-37 with daily feeds a half gallon each. 
I think I can do much better. This run was more for learning than anything else. As long as I can at least break even I'm good with it. But don't you lose something like 75% of weight when drying?


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## AlaskaRob (May 11, 2019)

My 30x/60x loupe came early! Got some pics! Tell me your estimates on how much longer I have please. I did see a couple amber trichs here and there, but not enough to even count as 5%


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## Cowbizzoy (May 11, 2019)

awesome pics.... dont you hate those pesky hairs?!?! couple weeks...more if you can stand it..


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## AlaskaRob (May 11, 2019)

I have to be honest. Yes, the suspense is killing me! I want it so badly! But I've been chilling the room at night trying to get the purple to come out in these Grandaddy purples


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## Cowbizzoy (May 11, 2019)

I surely look forward to seein' the purp...

I've got a few GDP beans myself...last time I got 2/2 males, lol ..


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## AlaskaRob (May 11, 2019)

Damn good strain. Figured for spring/summer I'd come out with something purple to fire up I terest. I have a thing for oddball items. 
After This strain is done, I want to plant 6 heavy indica strain called The Black. The way I see it, what could be more perfect for Halloween time of year than black plants with orange hairs?!


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## AlaskaRob (May 11, 2019)

When that's done....ill do a nice pink strain like Scarlett Johansson to be done for Valentine's day! Meh, I get its a novelty but damn....the interest in it from people around alaska is definitely making it so etching I want to do.


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## AlaskaRob (May 15, 2019)

Eastwood, are you around? I need your opinion on a problem
#TintEastwood
My flipped the lights on my plants march 31st and i know theyre getting within 2 or 3 weeks before being done. In the past 2 days ive developed yellowing on the edges of a few leaves midway up a single plant, and I'm seeing sudden dead spots also on the same plant. Haven't seen any bugs tho. I feed them all the same, and I'm hoping that since I've started tapering off nutrients that it's just the plant beginning to cannibalize itself in a last push before chop. I need some opinions on this as none of the other plants have this issue.


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## TintEastwood (May 15, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Eastwood, are you around? I need your opinion on a problem
> #TintEastwood
> My flipped the lights on my plants march 31st and i know theyre getting within 2 or 3 weeks before being done. In the past 2 days ive developed yellowing on the edges of a few leaves midway up a single plant, and I'm seeing sudden dead spots also on the same plant. Haven't seen any bugs tho. I feed them all the same, and I'm hoping that since I've started tapering off nutrients that it's just the plant beginning to cannibalize itself in a last push before chop. I need some opinions on this as none of the other plants have this issue.View attachment 4334055 View attachment 4334056 View attachment 4334057


I'm not sure what that is. I even think I had some of that going on....but I was messin around with boosters, lowering N and crazy chit.
Any major PH fluctuations? or big drop in ppms?


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## AlaskaRob (May 15, 2019)

I 9nly measure what goes into the coco. I've never checked what comes out or what to look for homestly


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## Blue back (May 15, 2019)

Looks to me that the trics are still clear. You want at least half cloudy. They will turn amber were you've touched them. You still have a ways to go. Looks good though


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## TintEastwood (May 15, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> I 9nly measure what goes into the coco. I've never checked what comes out or what to look for homestly


Same here. Well, sometimes I'll mess around looking at runoff ph or ppm.
I think runoff ppm should only be a few hundred over what is being put in. Huge numbers = salt buildup


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## AlaskaRob (May 15, 2019)

Is it just as simple as filling with water until it comes out and measure that water?


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## TintEastwood (May 16, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Is it just as simple as filling with water until it comes out and measure that water?


Yes. You catch the runoff (in something without salt buildup) and check with meter.

My drain tray gets salt buildup so I put a saucer under 1 to get uncontaminated runoff.


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## AlaskaRob (May 16, 2019)

I'll do that this weekend. I got in there today to look for bugs and there isn't any at all. No eggs or anything. So....not bugs. Either salt buildup or just ending it's life cycle. I did see some purple coming out in a couple of the plants tho! Definitely going to keep making it cold in there at night niw that I know it's working. Been able to get it down to 53 but can't get much lower. Still staying right around 75-82 during the day. Humidity well under control and stays between 38-43.


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## dangledo (May 17, 2019)

Looks like you also have pm and thrip damage


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## AlaskaRob (May 17, 2019)

What's pm and thrip?


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## dangledo (May 17, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> What's pm and thrip?


Powdery mildew and insect damage.

The yellow damage could be from water droplets sitting on your leaves, as well as the pm. Are you spraying your plants with lights on? Or at all?


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## AlaskaRob (May 17, 2019)

I think I think they're in the course of their life, I may be sprayed them three times. But I don't generally spray nutrients on my plants, and it's been over a month since I sprayed them last


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## Flatrate (May 17, 2019)

Looking great AlaskaRob!


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## AlaskaRob (May 17, 2019)

Found some purple the other day but haven't been able t9 dig thru them to find out how much of the purple has come through


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## AlaskaRob (May 17, 2019)

Trying to flush tomorrow after unknown reason for insane 2.5EC and 3100ppm TDS reading. Sucks to need to do it early. Think i may just do water instead of Florakleen and save that for the last few days


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## hillbill (May 18, 2019)

Hydro and synthetics and drips and all that is too complicated for this old guy. I find I’m bright enough to grow in dirt.


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## dangledo (May 18, 2019)

Definitely powdery mildew lol

Insane run off is due to insane feed inputs


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## AlaskaRob (May 18, 2019)

That wasn't a measurement if the runoff, that's what was in the nutrient bin going into them. That's why I don't know how it got that high. I mixed a little under half strength nutrients 3 days earlier, and before she waters the plants with it she puts in a gallon of cold water to cool down the overall temp and add air to the water. I tried using airstones but the a air tubes kept getting algae.


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## coocooforkush (May 19, 2019)

Well heres an update from coocoos closet. The blueberrys are doing very well. Stinkola!!!! Dont know what heaven smells like but it must be sorta like these girls. Pungent and strong. One sugar leaf will numb your mouth for an hour lol. Thanks to Dj Short. The big one has about 2 weeks to fini and the smaller one is just starting to shoot pistules. The two little guys are legacy 420 green cracks. Excited to see how they do under the 315. And the just harvested and cured vanilla kush turned out very well. Great painkiller. 
Well thats it! Happy 315 growing. Setup coming down and relocation pending. See u soon!!


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## coocooforkush (May 19, 2019)

dangledo said:


> Powdery mildew and insect damage.
> 
> The yellow damage could be from water droplets sitting on your leaves, as well as the pm. Are you spraying your plants with lights on? Or at all?


Just to chime in. Got my vanilla kush leaves wet with neutrient water and didnt pay attention to rincing it off. The light just burned the leaves like a lazer. Cmh will fry wet leaves especially if it has nutes i it. Me tinks?


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## coocooforkush (May 19, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> View attachment 4332014 View attachment 4332015 View attachment 4332016 View attachment 4332017 My 30x/60x loupe came early! Got some pics! Tell me your estimates on how much longer I have please. I did see a couple amber trichs here and there, but not enough to even count as 5%


Ooooooo so close. Lol. Good job. Hold out man....


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## coocooforkush (May 19, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> 630w cmh doing it's thing with my GDP into week3 of 12/12 flip View attachment 4325414 View attachment 4325418


Currently using 315. New room will be 630. Can i expect a big difference?


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## AlaskaRob (May 19, 2019)

It would depend on the size of the room and how many plants. Definitely going to be a heat difference tho. I think I'm going to go down to 4 plants from 6 in my 5x5 tent. 6 is just too crowded and makes watering a pain in the ass when they're this big. The tent is in a corner so I only have easy access to 4 of the 6 plants. Trying to think of what strain I'll try next. 
On a happier note, my decision and patience is paying of greatly! I had thought that the buds would've fattened up fully by week 6 but I was wrong. In the past week (week 7), they've put on so much weight that the tops have to be tied up or the6 fall over. I let some stay fallen because they lay across the net I put up. I'll get some new pics today. The hairs are more than 50% orange now, and it's been a week since I looked at trichs under the 30x loupe


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## AlaskaRob (May 19, 2019)

I would definitely think you would do well with 4 plants under one hood with 630w.
2 hoods @ 315w each would be better I think. But the amps being pulled from the wall would be much more


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## Doofus32 (May 19, 2019)

With a month to go, the tent smells like citrus...citrus Mr Clean maybe? The Trichomes taste like lemon and I am very happy with the results so far. Next time I will definitely not go for maximum screen fill, though.


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## hillbill (May 19, 2019)

More than a few strains put on a lot of bulk in weeks 8 or 9.


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## Doofus32 (May 19, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> It would depend on the size of the room and how many plants. Definitely going to be a heat difference tho. I think I'm going to go down to 4 plants from 6 in my 5x5 tent. 6 is just too crowded and makes watering a pain in the ass when they're this big. The tent is in a corner so I only have easy access to 4 of the 6 plants. Trying to think of what strain I'll try next.
> On a happier note, my decision and patience is paying of greatly! I had thought that the buds would've fattened up fully by week 6 but I was wrong. In the past week (week 7), they've put on so much weight that the tops have to be tied up or the6 fall over. I let some stay fallen because they lay across the net I put up. I'll get some new pics today. The hairs are more than 50% orange now, and it's been a week since I looked at trichs under the 30x loupe


I'm so happy to hear that. I had a feeling that would happen. I think I will let the plants do the talking from now on and ignore the breeder's timelines. I'm also getting the idea that I may have overstuffed my 3X3 tent...only 2 plants next time.


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## AlaskaRob (May 19, 2019)

Figure 2 sq ft per plant, and you should be good t9 go. I skipped thst step thinking I could outsmart the system, my 6 plants in a 5x5 tent are intertwined in some places, and I had to rearrange plants a few times becomes some sides grew faster than the opposite side. I was thinking I was going to yield more with 6 then with 4. I wasnt thinking clearly and once in flower cycle it got difficult to water them or move around them freely for inspections. I'd like to avoid that next time.


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## hillbill (May 19, 2019)

A friend did SOG with commercial 2 quarts sour cream containers at abou 4 per square foot, lots of styles around and 12/12 from seed


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## Doofus32 (May 19, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Figure 2 sq ft per plant, and you should be good t9 go. I skipped thst step thinking I could outsmart the system, my 6 plants in a 5x5 tent are intertwined in some places, and I had to rearrange plants a few times becomes some sides grew faster than the opposite side. I was thinking I was going to yield more with 6 then with 4. I wasnt thinking clearly and once in flower cycle it got difficult to water them or move around them freely for inspections. I'd like to avoid that next time.


HaHa. I also thought that I would outsmart reality. What I have now is too many buds and not enough colas. Watering in a small tent isn't so hard and I use a siphon with a long piece of tubing so I can reach. Not the worst problem a guy could have but I think I'll get with the program a little more next time. Glad to hear you waited for more bulk tho.


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## AlaskaRob (May 19, 2019)

Awesome news!
I went into tent this afternoon to check trichomes for milky or clear.....didnt get a chance to have that inner debate with myself since I saw a few amber heads right at the beginning. Checking over the plants fully showed an average of around 3 amber per 100 white. Figure it's time for the Florakleen for a couple days, then one day of ph'd water, then lights off for 36 hours and then finally harvest time. 
My lights went to 12/12 on March 31st, by my count I should've had another week or 2. I was completely surprised and not prepared for what I found. Got some great trich pics under magnification and you can see the purple came out fairly nicely. Been keeping temps around 75 with lights on and down to mid-50's during lights out.


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## hillbill (May 19, 2019)

Getting right.


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## AlaskaRob (May 19, 2019)

I figure with 2days of flushing with FloraKleen, have been lowering nutrient levels for the past week, and then give a day of regular water to round out pulling out stored sugars....i think I'll be good to go to turn lights out around Thursday night. 
Damn this is way more exciting than I ever thought.


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## Doofus32 (May 19, 2019)

Maybe I will start using a camera with my magnifier. I can't see a friggin' thing through mine. Are you using a phone or a camera to take those?


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## AlaskaRob (May 19, 2019)

Hard to hold it all together. Lol
But if you can get the camera to focus, you'll be able to look at pics and zoom around to see things better without having to worry about hands shaking.


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## Apalchen (May 20, 2019)

These girls are 41 days from the flip both tents are critical kush from clone. The tent with the yo-yos is the 4200k Phillips and the double trellis is the 3100k Phillips. They will both get leave stripped again today on day 42. Thinking these should be my best yield off the 315’s but we shall see. Still getting those lines in my pics as you see but plants loving life so I’m not too worried about it.


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## Doofus32 (May 20, 2019)

Apalchen said:


> These girls are 41 days from the flip both tents are critical kush from clone. The tent with the yo-yos is the 4200k Phillips and the double trellis is the 3100k Phillips. They will both get leave stripped again today on day 42. Thinking these should be my best yield off the 315’s but we shall see. Still getting those lines in my pics as you see but plants loving life so I’m not too worried about it.
> View attachment 4336397
> View attachment 4336398


My Critical Kush aren't as nice as those. I jammed too many into a small space and have too many smaller buds. Nice Grow.


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## Apalchen (May 20, 2019)

Yes I’ve been running this strain for a while and it for sure will make a lot of small pop corn bud if you don’t give her enough space or get enough light to the lowers. I stripped these plants down to the top 3 sets of leaves right before the flip. Also if you notice the plants that don’t have double trellis have somewhat smaller buds than the double trellised tent. The one without double trellis actually has 5 instead of 4 plants. So it has more tops and they aren’t quite as big but I’m thinking yield will be close to equal at least I hope so.


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## Doofus32 (May 20, 2019)

I love this strain but have only run it once before in a more traditional grow. Next time I won't be so quick to fill the grid this much. Having said that, they are just starting to bulk up with those crazy explosions of sideways white hair groups so I guess I can't complain. I may have to harvest in stages.


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## Apalchen (May 20, 2019)

I’ve been taking her later and later and she def performs better if you wait til you think she is done and go another week or more. I usually run 9 plants in a 4x4 area of my bigger tent but a few runs ago I was short on plants and only had 6 critical
Kush for that side. The tent looked no where near as full as I usually run and hit very close to same number if not equal to some runs of 9. And they were in the same size pot and same size plants, the buds lower down really added weight when they get enough light.


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## AlaskaRob (May 20, 2019)

Apalchen said:


> I’ve been taking her later and later and she def performs better if you wait til you think she is done and go another week or more. I usually run 9 plants in a 4x4 area of my bigger tent but a few runs ago I was short on plants and only had 6 critical
> Kush for that side. The tent looked no where near as full as I usually run and hit very close to same number if not equal to some runs of 9. And they were in the same size pot and same size plants, the buds lower down really added weight when they get enough light.


That's exactly what I'm doing with the Grandaddy purples. Getting some really nice rewards from it as well! Between Saturday morning and tonight the plants have an almost pinkish haze to the crystals and there is alot more purpling leaves than before Saturday. Damn dude, this is going to be some insane space weed when I'm done.....if I can hold out that long! I'm into week 8 now. It's an 8 week strain from my distributor. He does this stuff for a living and is damn good. Some of the stuff he has shown me in his commercial warehouse blows my mind!


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## Doofus32 (May 21, 2019)

Apalchen said:


> I’ve been taking her later and later and she def performs better if you wait til you think she is done and go another week or more. I usually run 9 plants in a 4x4 area of my bigger tent but a few runs ago I was short on plants and only had 6 critical
> Kush for that side. The tent looked no where near as full as I usually run and hit very close to same number if not equal to some runs of 9. And they were in the same size pot and same size plants, the buds lower down really added weight when they get enough light.


I think last run I let 'em go for over 12 weeks and boy was I happy. They just kept bulking up every day. I probably could have let 'em run longer.


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## AlaskaRob (May 21, 2019)

Haha I thought you wrote 12 months! Lol
What strain did you run for 12 weeks? Mine is an 8 week strain, but I'm pushing through to 9. I'm just keeping a very close eye on them now. Did the 2 day flush with Florakleen, and it was disgusting as hell to look at all that orange water pooled in my tent! Mostly evaporated now but the bottom tray of the tent is gross. Now I'm feeding them ph'd water with just a touch of phosphorus and potassium, and a light dose of molasses.
Think I'm doing damage? Or is that ok?


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## AlaskaRob (May 21, 2019)

I DID manage to get the ppm down to 500. And the EC was like .900 or so. Still much less than ive ever given before?


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## Apalchen (May 22, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Haha I thought you wrote 12 months! Lol
> What strain did you run for 12 weeks? Mine is an 8 week strain, but I'm pushing through to 9. I'm just keeping a very close eye on them now. Did the 2 day flush with Florakleen, and it was disgusting as hell to look at all that orange water pooled in my tent! Mostly evaporated now but the bottom tray of the tent is gross. Now I'm feeding them ph'd water with just a touch of phosphorus and potassium, and a light dose of molasses.
> Think I'm doing damage? Or is that ok?


I use saucers under pots and a shop vac to keep the water out of the tent, I’m afraid leaving that much water late in flower will up the humidity. Also i think your timing on the flush is fine, they have plenty of built up food to ride out the rest of the time.


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## Doofus32 (May 22, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Haha I thought you wrote 12 months! Lol
> What strain did you run for 12 weeks? Mine is an 8 week strain, but I'm pushing through to 9. I'm just keeping a very close eye on them now. Did the 2 day flush with Florakleen, and it was disgusting as hell to look at all that orange water pooled in my tent! Mostly evaporated now but the bottom tray of the tent is gross. Now I'm feeding them ph'd water with just a touch of phosphorus and potassium, and a light dose of molasses.
> Think I'm doing damage? Or is that ok?


It was the Critical Kush. Normally a 9-10 week strain but they just kept getting bulkier, although to be accurate I was using time from flip not time from first noticing flower activity. So maybe only 11 1/2 weeks. I have my plants inside a couple of long narrow totes designed for under the bed storage. Easy to suck up any overflow. I don't think you will damage your ladies. Just keep a watchful eye on them. Usually at that stage I can't keep myself from looking many times a day.


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## AlaskaRob (May 22, 2019)

I seeing amber trichomes starting on each bud, and buds growing newly off of other buds. I'm calling it good for this batch. Tomorrow morning is last of regular PH water without nutrients, and then Friday after work I'll do lights out for 36-48 hours. Nearly 2 full days without water should be enough to dry the coco and plant out for drying., and and a day and a half at least in the dark for push from stress. I'll go in on Sunday afternoon and chop them down.


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## AlaskaRob (May 22, 2019)

If I'm getting buds growi g out of the mature buds, and amber trichomes on the buds instead of just the leaves, you guys think I'm ready to chop in a few days? I'm looking at Sunday afternoon or possibly memorial day. 
Thoughts?


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## diggs99 (May 23, 2019)

getting close now. another couple weeks and this run will be done.

everything is very dense and sticky. Really impressed with these lights/spectrum.

critical purple kush
gelat.og


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## AlaskaRob (May 23, 2019)

Very nice


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## AlaskaRob (May 24, 2019)

So.....the landlord came by to bitch about electric bill for the past couple months over at place I have my plants. Made me promise to take them down. Which has the worst timing as I just calculated the total time in flower. I have 10-15% amber trichs on the buds, but I'm a week less than originally thought. I'm actually right at the 8 week mark. I know I c9uldve pushed for another week but the trichomes are saying it's time. It's a bittersweet ending. I'll recoup the money I've invested but won't be able to do another run there. I need to find another place for the next batch! With the cost of my equipment recovered and knowledge gained from the learning curve, I KNOW I could do SO much better on the next run and I would have a much better margin of gain.


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## Doofus32 (May 24, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> So.....the landlord came by to bitch about electric bill for the past couple months over at place I have my plants. Made me promise to take them down. Which has the worst timing as I just calculated the total time in flower. I have 10-15% amber trichs on the buds, but I'm a week less than originally thought. I'm actually right at the 8 week mark. I know I c9uldve pushed for another week but the trichomes are saying it's time. It's a bittersweet ending. I'll recoup the money I've invested but won't be able to do another run there. I need to find another place for the next batch! With the cost of my equipment recovered and knowledge gained from the learning curve, I KNOW I could do SO much better on the next run and I would have a much better margin of gain.


Shitty. Rental grows are a crapshoot. And now you're Jonesing for the next one....At least you have the gifts of your grow.
Maybe try an outdoor run. I have a bunch ready to go but I did some major LST to them, I ran them around in a circle with irrigation stakes and they are short but bushy.....of course now I can't find the friggin' pictures. Don't piss off your landlord. "Winter is coming".


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## AlaskaRob (May 24, 2019)

Not my landlord, just where I keep my plants. My landlord is ok with them here but I'm not sure I want to test my court order against DOC barring them from jailing me for possession of marijuana when I have a doctor recommendation and my Alaska green card. It's easier to do it somewhere else at this point to avoid making waves and testing the strength of the courts order.


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## Doofus32 (May 24, 2019)

So


AlaskaRob said:


> Not my landlord, just where I keep my plants. My landlord is ok with them here but I'm not sure I want to test my court order against DOC barring them from jailing me for possession of marijuana when I have a doctor recommendation and my Alaska green card. It's easier to do it somewhere else at this point to avoid making waves and testing the strength of the courts order.


 So she's kinda cool but the state is in a tizzy? I'm happy to be in B.C. (Canada) where it's not such a big deal...except for when landlords have to pay for Power used for grow.


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## AlaskaRob (May 24, 2019)

Exactly.
I just have the added complication of probation for stupid mistake, not involving any drugs, over a decade ago. I did my jail time, and have come leaps and bounds in my way of life, financial stability like never before, college degree, trade school for electrical work as well, and I complete every class they put me through.


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## coocooforkush (May 26, 2019)

Things are winding down. The monster blueberry is hanging and lil sister is here finishing off. The sugar leaves on the first blueberry were so covered in tricomes i made brownies directly. Best brownies to date. Lol. Best brownies to date..... did i already say that..... lol keep on rockin in the weed world.


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## Apalchen (Jun 6, 2019)

Updates on my critical kush 3x3’s the one under the 4100 Phillips seem to be smaller buds and might take a few extra days to finish compared to the 3100k tent. Like I said before I guess it’s not a true side by side because I have 4 plants in the 3100k tent and 5 in the 4100k tent.

They are on day 59, I swear this strain confuses me sometimes she is ready at or before 65 days and sometimes it takes 75 days to really finish filling out and get done. They are on on the flush now and look like will be ready soon. 

Here are some pics it’s hard to get a good pic with lights o gonna try to catch them right before they come on tonight.
3100k tent 

4100k tent 

Random bud shot not sure from which tent oops lol
 
 
This strain has been my daily smoke for over a year I have plenty of others to choose from but this one has been my go to.


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## AlaskaRob (Jun 7, 2019)

I'm finishing up my first grow to completion. Dual bulb 630w cmh, 4200k, 5x5 tent, Grandaddy Purple clones in 3 gallon coco, and Canna nutrients  . I kept hearing it's normal for first grow to be about half gram per watt, but fuck that. 
Glad to report final weigh in comes in at 437g. Not perfect, I had to learn alot beforehand, learned a ton on the fly while it was going, some heat and feeding schedule issues here and there......but I'll definitely call this batch of heaven a success. Some purple, but all covered in crystals


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## AlaskaRob (Jun 7, 2019)

Oh yeah! And the reason for those 2 particular pics? What is in my bowl as I write this. Happy Smoking!


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## Apalchen (Jun 7, 2019)

Very impressive first grow, I could only wish my first grow looked so good. It was a terrible mess that should have been thrown away but we smoked it anyways, honestly could have bought Mexican swag as good. I had no clue what I was doing. That was back in the day before I knew about forums and all the info on the net I had to actually go buy a real book lol.

I said yesterday would try to get a shot of tent with lights off I only got the 4100 side before they came on here it is.


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## AlaskaRob (Jun 7, 2019)

Nice looking buds there for sure!


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## coocooforkush (Jun 9, 2019)

Man blueberry is slow on the flower. Its sooo worth it but slow. This pheno is tiny and has nice curly leaves. Its frosin up nice. Delecate flowers and what a great smell. I thinned it out and my whole hand was sticky afterwards. Her sister is cured and man its an eye dryin knuckle sandwich of a buzz. Lol i think the 315 cmh 3100 is the definitive closet light. Its produced plant after plant with no issues. Man i love that light.


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## coocooforkush (Jun 9, 2019)

Apalchen said:


> Very impressive first grow, I could only wish my first grow looked so good. It was a terrible mess that should have been thrown away but we smoked it anyways, honestly could have bought Mexican swag as good. I had no clue what I was doing. That was back in the day before I knew about forums and all the info on the net I had to actually go buy a real book lol.
> 
> I said yesterday would try to get a shot of tent with lights off I only got the 4100 side before they came on here it is.
> View attachment 4346306
> ...


Now thats pretty buds!


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## Apalchen (Jul 1, 2019)

Apalchen said:


> These girls are 41 days from the flip both tents are critical kush from clone. The tent with the yo-yos is the 4200k Phillips and the double trellis is the 3100k Phillips. They will both get leave stripped again today on day 42. Thinking these should be my best yield off the 315’s but we shall see. Still getting those lines in my pics as you see but plants loving life so I’m not too worried about it.
> View attachment 4336397
> View attachment 4336398


11.5 zips from the 3100k side and a lil over 12 from 4100k side. The 4100k side had 5 plants vs the 4 in the other side. The tent with 4 actually looked to be the bigger yielder cause buds were bigger but the other tent with 5 came out on top by a little bit. I'm happy with results that's the first time I've broken a gram per watt and was able to do with both tents this round. I was stuck in the .8 grams per watts area for a a while.


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## AlaskaRob (Jul 1, 2019)

Apalchen, how many watts did you have? I don't remember which cmh you had either. Short term memory loss

I did 6 under a 630w dual bulb cmh, and did better than average for first ever grow with 15.7oz. I was pretty good with it. I'm the guy with the purple bud pics in this thread. When I get to do it again tho, I'm going with 4 plants per 630w instead of 6. Things got too crowded and I think more watts per plant is a good practice to have.ill probably go from a 5x5 to a 4x8 tent, and add another light same as now.


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## Apalchen (Jul 2, 2019)

I had two 3x3 tents each one with one 315 one tent was 3100 bulb the other was 4200 bulb


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## Apalchen (Jul 2, 2019)

AlaskaRob said:


> Apalchen, how many watts did you have? I don't remember which cmh you had either. Short term memory loss
> 
> I did 6 under a 630w dual bulb cmh, and did better than average for first ever grow with 15.7oz. I was pretty good with it. I'm the guy with the purple bud pics in this thread. When I get to do it again tho, I'm going with 4 plants per 630w instead of 6. Things got too crowded and I think more watts per plant is a good practice to have.ill probably go from a 5x5 to a 4x8 tent, and add another light same as now.


I did a 4x8 with 2 air cooled double ended 630 and only got 2 pounds. It was summer and was trying to drop wattage, I counted it as a fail as I usually hit 3 or more from a 4x8. I ended up with 2 600hps and 1 de 630 in the middle to get my yields back up. Would have run 2 630 and one hps but those de ballast I originally ordered are junk.(both quit working had to order a growers choice ballast for the next run.)


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## dangledo (Jul 3, 2019)

Apalchen said:


> 11.5 zips from the 3100k side and a lil over 12 from 4100k side. The 4100k side had 5 plants vs the 4 in the other side. The tent with 4 actually looked to be the bigger yielder cause buds were bigger but the other tent with 5 came out on top by a little bit. I'm happy with results that's the first time I've broken a gram per watt and was able to do with both tents this round. I was stuck in the .8 grams per watts area for a a while.


They pull 350 from the wall
















Nice looking grow


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## Loudpack516 (Jul 12, 2019)

Light gets too hot and no way to cool it piece of shit


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## dangledo (Jul 14, 2019)

Loudpack516 said:


> Light gets too hot and no way to cool it piece of shit


Proper planning prevents piss poor performance


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## newgrow16 (Sep 13, 2019)

Replacing timber 400 cobs with sun system cmh 315 lec in 4 x 4. Running cobs at 360 watts.

How will temperatures be affected by the new light? 6" inline fan pumps air through tent into a small room with door open to ac.


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## gr865 (Sep 13, 2019)

newgrow16 said:


> Replacing timber 400 cobs with sun system cmh 315 lec in 4 x 4. Running cobs at 360 watts.
> 
> How will temperatures be affected by the new light? 6" inline fan pumps air through tent into a small room with door open to ac.


I run my 2 Ballas outside of the tent, I just replaced one of my nanolux ballast with I can't remember the name of it, but the new ballasts is 40° hotter than the nanolux. I'm considering returning this new ballast and buying me another nanolux if I can find one without the reflector own it as I don't need the reflector.


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## TintEastwood (Sep 13, 2019)

newgrow16 said:


> Replacing timber 400 cobs with sun system cmh 315 lec in 4 x 4. Running cobs at 360 watts.
> 
> How will temperatures be affected by the new light? 6" inline fan pumps air through tent into a small room with door open to ac.


Run both!?


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## newgrow16 (Sep 14, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> Run both!?


cobs have heat damage and I have a feeling that the spectrum is screwed up because of the damage.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 17, 2019)

Doc's super skunk super qrazy. I did a test run of this a few months back and fell in love. The smell was pure skunk with a earthy undertone. Bugs we're phat with a nice amount if ice. I really think people slept on this one!


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 17, 2019)

4x8 tent with 2 315 cmh and 2 600 hps. Portable ac to keep temps down. 5 15 gallon buckets with a top feeder on the dwc


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## lokie (Sep 17, 2019)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> View attachment 4396049
> Doc's super skunk super qrazy. I did a test run of this a few months back and fell in love. The smell was pure skunk with a earthy undertone. Bugs we're phat with a nice amount if ice. I really think people slept on this one!


Do you think they slept on phat Bed Bugs?

lol


Nice setup.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 17, 2019)

Y'all really need to check out doc's dank seeds. My brother really know what he's doing.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 17, 2019)

lokie said:


> Do you think they slept on phat Bed Bugs?
> 
> lol
> 
> ...


I'm not sure what you mean brother?


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## lokie (Sep 17, 2019)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> I'm not sure what you mean brother?


My guess is that your buds had a lot of trichomes on them?


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Sep 17, 2019)

lokie said:


> My guess is that your buds had a lot of trichomes on them?


Not so much like slymeballs but I'm happy with the outcome


----------



## FunkeyMunkey (Sep 17, 2019)

Subcool’s Cheesequake, tomorrow will be exactly 4 weeks into flower. Organic compost/coco/ewc with occasional teas and top-dressings. Under 2 315 CMH. Pics were with a flashlight @ lights out.


----------



## oldman60 (Sep 17, 2019)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Not so much like slymeballs but I'm happy with the outcome


JoJo, long time, check Doc's Clementine crosses tons of fire there.


----------



## Blue back (Sep 17, 2019)

2 315's and a 4' 6 bulb T5 on a 4x4 space 6 5 gal. fabric pots. 2 weeks to go. Canna nutrients. Packing and stacking on the risen!! All 5' to 6' tall
With a room full of this, this and that.
Forum Cut GSC mostly this and you can see why.lol
 
Wedding Cake wish you could smell it. STRONG Cherry smell.
 
Garlic Breath very unique smell of rock solid nugs.


----------



## newgrow16 (Sep 18, 2019)

Sun system 315 cmh arrived:


----------



## Blue back (Sep 18, 2019)

newgrow16 said:


> Sun system 315 cmh arrived:
> 
> View attachment 4396595


That's a vertical bulb right? Very nice


----------



## Mullalulla (Sep 19, 2019)

I have 7 plants under (6) Vivosun 315 CMH fixtures using
Philips Mastercolor CDM Elite 315W CMH Agro Lamp T12 - 3100K bulbs

1 (LSD X Apricot jelly by Mastergrowersofbukkake)
1 (Bearclaw by Alien Genetics)
1 (Trop cookies by harrypalms)
2 (Coldfront by Inhouse Genetics)
1 ( Trop f2 by oni seeds) 
1 (Plat Punch remix X Plat Kushmints by Inhouse Genetics)

I am using the nectar for the gods line with recharge and slf. Mycojordan from elite 91 at transplant.

small bit of light bleach on the lsdxaj and the trop cookies both grew closer to the light than I wanted and both seem pretty light shy. Other than that .. my best grow to date.


----------



## gr865 (Sep 19, 2019)

newgrow16 said:


> Sun system 315 cmh arrived:
> 
> View attachment 4396595


May I ask your grow medium, and is that straw on the top?
If this is your first 315W, you are going to love it, and will probably buy another, I know I did for my 4x4.


----------



## gr865 (Sep 19, 2019)

Mullalulla said:


> I have 7 plants under (6) Vivosun 315 CMH fixtures using
> Philips Mastercolor CDM Elite 315W CMH Agro Lamp T12 - 3100K bulbs
> 
> 1 (LSD X Apricot jelly by Mastergrowersofbukkake)
> ...


Nice room, nice plants!
What is your grow medium?

If I may make one comment. I hope you are wearing ear protection, that high pitch of the fans can and will cause damage to your hearing. I know I work in an industry where I was exposed to that. W/O my hearing aids I am dead meat. I always made sure my employees wore their protection but I never did, dumb ass I know.


----------



## Mullalulla (Sep 19, 2019)

gr865 said:


> Nice room, nice plants!
> What is your grow medium?
> 
> If I may make one comment. I hope you are wearing ear protection, that high pitch of the fans can and will cause damage to your hearing. I know I work in an industry where I was exposed to that. W/O my hearing aids I am dead meat. I always made sure my employees wore their protection but I never did, dumb ass I know.


Growing medium is just fox farms Happy frog mixed with like 10% extra perlite.

That pitch of the fan is from the AC motor. My actual fans in the room are pretty much silent. 

It comes over a lot louder than it really is. But thanks for the heads up, Ill look into getting a DECIBEL meter.


----------



## newgrow16 (Sep 19, 2019)

gr865 said:


> May I ask your grow medium, and is that straw on the top?
> If this is your first 315W, you are going to love it, and will probably buy another, I know I did for my 4x4.


Using "Clackamas Coots" soil recipe, sphagnum peat, ewc/compost, pumice.
Yes first 315. Straw mulch. Plants just watered before picture, praying this morning.


----------



## FunkeyMunkey (Sep 21, 2019)

Groupshot. Halfway through flower


----------



## Gingeroot (Sep 21, 2019)

I’ll be joining the club here once I flip! Always been a CMH fan. I have two 315w Sunlight LECs with Philips 3100k bulbs and I’m thinking 3x6 for the footprint? Don’t think a 4’ spread is doable. Any input would be much appreciated!


----------



## TintEastwood (Sep 21, 2019)

Mixing it up. 3k.4k.315s
3k vero29.260w. 42"x42" co2-800.


----------



## hillbill (Sep 22, 2019)

Still CMH tempted here. Damnit.


----------



## Gingeroot (Sep 22, 2019)

hillbill said:


> Still CMH tempted here. Damnit.



Out of every LED & bulb I’ve used CMH gives me the frostiest nugs


----------



## gr865 (Sep 22, 2019)

Gingeroot said:


> I’ll be joining the club here once I flip! Always been a CMH fan. I have two 315w Sunlight LECs with Philips 3100k bulbs and I’m thinking 3x6 for the footprint? Don’t think a 4’ spread is doable. Any input would be much appreciated!


I believe you will do fine with the two 315's in a 4x6, It is said that they have a 3x3 footprint. I run two 315's in a 4x4 and know that I could cover two more feet with the two. That being said I do not use the entire 4x4, mine is more like a 3x4 as I have a stand up fan in the tent that takes about a foot away from the overall footprint. 
 

You can see the distance from the end of the screen to the front of the tent, my screen is 4x3.
 

Yesterday Day 14 of 12/12


----------



## Gingeroot (Sep 22, 2019)

gr865 said:


> I believe you will do fine with the two 315's in a 4x6, It is said that they have a 3x3 footprint. I run two 315's in a 4x4 and know that I could cover two more feet with the two. That being said I do not use the entire 4x4, mine is more like a 3x4 as I have a stand up fan in the tent that takes about a foot away from the overall footprint.
> View attachment 4398217
> 
> You can see the distance from the end of the screen to the front of the tent, my screen is 4x3.
> ...


Beautiful set up! I’m in a room so won’t have much reflection. I’ll put several outta the 3x6 footprint and see how they do..


----------



## gr865 (Sep 22, 2019)

Gingeroot said:


> Beautiful set up! I’m in a room so won’t have much reflection. I’ll put several outta the 3x6 footprint and see how they do..


A suggestion if I might.
We set my assistant/apprentice up in a room and he run's two 315's also. We set the plants in a 3x5+ arrangement and place that foam insulation board around it, This is sort of what it is, I am not an engineer or artist but you get the point.
 

We actually lay the insulation board open some where the lights reflect off the walls. These boards can be moved to get in an work on the plants. This has worked well for him and if I had the room I would do the same setup.


----------



## FunkeyMunkey (Sep 22, 2019)

hillbill said:


> Still CMH tempted here. Damnit.


I’ve loved the switch to my 2 315’s so far. Less hassle than the HPS and the frost is mouth watering


----------



## Gingeroot (Sep 22, 2019)

Had to throw one LEC up after reading this thread! They got some nice perky leaves under this indoor sun. Living soil, Useful Seed Orange & Chocolate diesel, and 24” from canopy. They were under LEDs in solos for three weeks and fabric pots for two.


----------



## 10WeekFlushBro (Sep 23, 2019)

Nice pictures. I'm happy that the temperatures are down here so I can use 315 again. The most beautiful artificial light in the world, efficiency be damned. I wish I could hang 10 watt CMH lamps in my house.


----------



## GoBrah (Sep 23, 2019)

Gingeroot said:


> View attachment 4398477 Had to throw one LEC up after reading this thread! They got some nice perky leaves under this indoor sun. Living soil, Useful Seed Orange & Chocolate diesel, and 24” from canopy. They were under LEDs in solos for three weeks and fabric pots for two.


is your light a bit reddish？ or just because of the camera


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## Gingeroot (Sep 23, 2019)

GoBrah said:


> is your light a bit reddish？ or just because of the camera


It’s a 3100k Philips bulb...my fav! It does give off a reddish hue, maybe cuz it’s growin some redrum


----------



## Hempire828 (Sep 23, 2019)

I love my 315 4K str8 throwing frost...at start of 3 weeks


----------



## Blue back (Sep 23, 2019)

Garlic Breath week 8 pretty bud. I see a little purple creeping in.


----------



## GoBrah (Sep 24, 2019)

Gingeroot said:


> It’s a 3100k Philips bulb...my fav! It does give off a reddish hue, maybe cuz it’s growin some redrum


Maybe this one can get you a better yield than regular white 3100k Philips


----------



## RedDirtResin (Sep 24, 2019)

Running 2 630cmh lights over a 5x10 canopy. Running all Blue Dream this go around


----------



## FunkeyMunkey (Sep 24, 2019)

5 weeks in flower tomorrow


----------



## Blue back (Sep 24, 2019)

FunkeyMunkey said:


> 5 weeks in flower tomorrow
> 
> 
> View attachment 4399325


Nice looking sativa. What you got there?


----------



## FunkeyMunkey (Sep 24, 2019)

Blue back said:


> Nice looking sativa. What you got there?


I couldn’t tell you honestly. It’s from a bag of stuff from last fall. I’m wanting to say it may be Zkittles or some variant bc the stem rub smells just like a tropical skittles pack.


----------



## myke (Sep 24, 2019)

What’s the purpose of having the ballast attached to the light on these?Theres plenty of used ones for sale in my area for cheap.was going to pick one up. Thx


----------



## FunkeyMunkey (Sep 24, 2019)

myke said:


> What’s the purpose of having the ballast attached to the light on these?Theres plenty of used ones for sale in my area for cheap.was going to pick one up. Thx


Mine just came that way. I got the cheap ones off amazon to see how they were and I love them. Will def be upgrading to the vivosun and Phillips bulb in the next few runs. My 2 shitty topogro 315’s have performed well enough for me so far


----------



## TintEastwood (Sep 24, 2019)

myke said:


> What’s the purpose of having the ballast attached to the light on these?Theres plenty of used ones for sale in my area for cheap.was going to pick one up. Thx


Different environment, different setups. My ballast are separate but I keep them in the grow room where temps do not exceed 85f. A little more heat for my AC to deal with indeed.

Only because....the garage outside my grow room, temps daily exceed 100f during summer months and any heat wave. Possibly shorten ballast life.


----------



## myke (Sep 24, 2019)

So you can get a chord?Is this just a way for them to make them cheaper?When I first saw them I thought wtf is that ever dumb!


----------



## Blue back (Sep 24, 2019)

myke said:


> So you can get a chord?Is this just a way for them to make them cheaper?When I first saw them I thought wtf is that ever dumb!



They really don't get very hot barely warm even. The bulb its self gets much hotter.


----------



## NugHeuser (Sep 25, 2019)

Anyone using the double ended 630 watt cmh? I have a growers choice model with the 3k red enhanced bulb, I wasnt a fan of it, dont even use it anymore. Love my 315s though. 
I'd honestly like to sell my 630


----------



## Apalchen (Sep 25, 2019)

NugHeuser said:


> Anyone using the double ended 630 watt cmh? I have a growers choice model with the 3k red enhanced bulb, I wasnt a fan of it, dont even use it anymore. Love my 315s though.
> I'd honestly like to sell my 630


Yes with same results love my 315 and disliked the De 630 and tried diff spectrums.


----------



## GoBrah (Sep 25, 2019)

NugHeuser said:


> Anyone using the double ended 630 watt cmh? I have a growers choice model with the 3k red enhanced bulb, I wasnt a fan of it, dont even use it anymore. Love my 315s though.
> I'd honestly like to sell my 630


How was that 630 performed?


----------



## NugHeuser (Sep 27, 2019)

GoBrah said:


> How was that 630 performed?


It puts off a ton of heat, probably typical for a de, and ofcoarse being a de light isn't suppose to be as close to the canopy, well the problem is the light intensity is shit at a further distance, 33 to 36 inches if I remember right was giving par readings only in the 200s to 300s. And I've read people trying to defend that point saying par dont mean everything with cmh, something about it casts a different type of light that isnt measurable with a par meter, or something like that. So I went with it and kept the light around 33 inches, any closer and it got too hot on the canopy, and that was during the winter in a basement. Well 3 weeks in I had the stretchiest and smallest budded plants I'd ever grown before, so obviously there was a mistake with the design of the bulb or something. You cant get the light close enough to give adequate intensity without having an AC blowing directly over the canopy. 

It seems to be extremely bright to the eye though would make a good shop light lol I've used it in 2 runs though and hope I never have to use it again, need to replace it with something. I'm looking into DIY led strips. 
My two 315s are mixed in with cobs and do well. I like the lower heat that comes with leds though. Not knocking 315s at all though.


----------



## modeler (Sep 27, 2019)

guys, ive just received my first CMH kit, but unfortunately one of the bulbs has some sort of hazy cloudy spot on it. 

Should I return this bulb ? Theyre both Dimlux, I am planning on getting Phillips one soon.

Thanks


----------



## Gemtree (Sep 27, 2019)

NugHeuser said:


> It puts off a ton of heat, probably typical for a de, and ofcoarse being a de light isn't suppose to be as close to the canopy, well the problem is the light intensity is shit at a further distance, 33 to 36 inches if I remember right was giving par readings only in the 200s to 300s. And I've read people trying to defend that point saying par dont mean everything with cmh, something about it casts a different type of light that isnt measurable with a par meter, or something like that. So I went with it and kept the light around 33 inches, any closer and it got too hot on the canopy, and that was during the winter in a basement. Well 3 weeks in I had the stretchiest and smallest budded plants I'd ever grown before, so obviously there was a mistake with the design of the bulb or something. You cant get the light close enough to give adequate intensity without having an AC blowing directly over the canopy.
> 
> It seems to be extremely bright to the eye though would make a good shop light lol I've used it in 2 runs though and hope I never have to use it again, need to replace it with something. I'm looking into DIY led strips.
> My two 315s are mixed in with cobs and do well. I like the lower heat that comes with leds though. Not knocking 315s at all though.


Yea I keep my 315 like 24" above my veg plants in a 3x3 or they wont bush out. I really want a 4k bulb but this 3 really beefs out the stems had huge hollow stems my last grow with it I flower under 600w hps though


----------



## Blue back (Sep 27, 2019)

Gemtree said:


> Yea I keep my 315 like 24" above my veg plants in a 3x3 or they wont bush out. I really want a 4k bulb but this 3 really beefs out the stems had huge hollow stems my last grow with it I flower under 600w hps though



U got em backwords.jk lol


----------



## Gemtree (Sep 27, 2019)

Blue back said:


> U got em backwords.jk lol


I know I just got a cheap hydrocrunch off eBay to try out and it came with a 3k. Eventually want to flower with it but damn the veg plants look nice and dont even need support in flower


----------



## GoBrah (Sep 28, 2019)

modeler said:


> guys, ive just received my first CMH kit, but unfortunately one of the bulbs has some sort of hazy cloudy spot on it.
> 
> Should I return this bulb ? Theyre both Dimlux, I am planning on getting Phillips one soon.
> 
> ...


Gas leaked bulb, you need to return this.


----------



## GoBrah (Sep 28, 2019)

NugHeuser said:


> It puts off a ton of heat, probably typical for a de, and ofcoarse being a de light isn't suppose to be as close to the canopy, well the problem is the light intensity is shit at a further distance, 33 to 36 inches if I remember right was giving par readings only in the 200s to 300s. And I've read people trying to defend that point saying par dont mean everything with cmh, something about it casts a different type of light that isnt measurable with a par meter, or something like that. So I went with it and kept the light around 33 inches, any closer and it got too hot on the canopy, and that was during the winter in a basement. Well 3 weeks in I had the stretchiest and smallest budded plants I'd ever grown before, so obviously there was a mistake with the design of the bulb or something. You cant get the light close enough to give adequate intensity without having an AC blowing directly over the canopy.
> 
> It seems to be extremely bright to the eye though would make a good shop light lol I've used it in 2 runs though and hope I never have to use it again, need to replace it with something. I'm looking into DIY led strips.
> My two 315s are mixed in with cobs and do well. I like the lower heat that comes with leds though. Not knocking 315s at all though.



Which brand 630 was that? There are many brands with different manufacturers. The spectrum, PAR output and quality are not the same.


----------



## Blue back (Sep 28, 2019)

Work of 315's Wedding Cake


----------



## TintEastwood (Sep 28, 2019)

Blue back said:


> Work of 315's Wedding CakeView attachment 4401299


Light did good. You did great! Very nice.


----------



## Blue back (Sep 28, 2019)

Twin sister. Rock solid


----------



## Devil's cabbage (Sep 28, 2019)

Blue back said:


> Twin sister. Rock solidView attachment 4401317


Very nice what kinda fixture did you use?


----------



## Blue back (Sep 29, 2019)

Horizontal single end 2 of em on 4x4


----------



## Gingeroot (Sep 29, 2019)

Three days into stretch after 5 1/2 week veg from seed! Im pushing the limits with this 3x4 area. Prob gonna supplement with LED but I'm tempted to see how the edges produce without..


----------



## Devil's cabbage (Sep 29, 2019)

Blue back said:


> Horizontal single end 2 of em on 4x4


Nice, I started using CMH about a year ago and I love them.


----------



## TintEastwood (Sep 29, 2019)

Gingeroot said:


> Three days into stretch after 5 1/2 week veg from seed! Im pushing the limits with this 3x4 area. Prob gonna supplement with LED but I'm tempted to see how the edges produce without..View attachment 4401432


Off to a great start. Very healthy looking. Hope you kill.


----------



## Devil's cabbage (Sep 29, 2019)

Gingeroot said:


> Out of every LED & bulb I’ve used CMH gives me the frostiest nugs


I agree , I can't reach into my canopy without the hair on my arms getting completely matted.


----------



## Gingeroot (Sep 29, 2019)

Devil's cabbage said:


> I agree , I can't reach into my canopy without the hair on my arms getting completely matted.


Funny thing you say that...I've been indoor sun burned equally by 315, 400, and 860w CMHs lol! Must be that UV eh'


----------



## Devil's cabbage (Sep 29, 2019)

Gingeroot said:


> Funny thing you say that...I've been indoor sun burned equally by 315, 400, and 860w CMHs lol! Must be that UV eh'


I have 3, 315w and 2, 630w in a 9x12 room. I fucked up one night when after being in there I had to go to the store and almost crashed because I kept seeing shadows going across the road. That was over 30 minutes after I left the room and my eyes were still messed up.


----------



## Devil's cabbage (Sep 29, 2019)

dangledo said:


> Proper planning prevents piss poor performance


I can't like yet, So,,,,, LIKE!!


----------



## OneHitDone (Sep 29, 2019)

So, here we are 220 pages in... What is a realistic flowering footprint with a 315cmh?


----------



## Devil's cabbage (Sep 29, 2019)

OneHitDone said:


> So, here we are 220 pages in... What is a realistic flowering footprint with a 315cmh?


My best footprint is around 3x3 with good light reflection.


----------



## Apalchen (Oct 1, 2019)

3x3 is perfect keep your canopy even and not that deep(lollipop hard) and you will get good yields. 
As far as the 630 de conversation going on, I agree they aren't that good. I ran mine air-cooled on acde hood where air doesn't directly hit the bulb. Growers choice remote square wave ballast and GC bulbs. The GC bulbs don't last very well. I mean they work but I was expecting the equivalent of a 1000 watt hps just from reading the hype. They were a disappointment and comparable to my 600 watt hps. Love my 315s but the de 630's are money I wish I never spent. (Tried 3 diff color bulbs) Dont get me wrong it will grow some herb but not any better than a 600 hps.


----------



## gr865 (Oct 4, 2019)

Here is what's happening in the ol' 4x4 with 2 - 315W.
Day 27 of 12/12

Installed the screen on the 17th and had to raise it on the 27th as the plant were lifting it off the ground. Stretch is over for the two Indica dom plants but the Sativa is still stretching and just beginning to show sex, but I think the stretch is about over.




Running low nutes, around 40% of recommended base nutes. 1.4 to 1.5 EC with 0.5 grams Epsom and 2 ml CaliMagic. 
My new irrigation setup is working spectacularly, and running 3 cycles per light period.


----------



## Gingeroot (Oct 6, 2019)

Anyone ever try to push the LEC 315 footprint to 3x4? If so were the edges airy after harvest? I really don't want to supplement LEDs if I don't have to, but they're looking happy in the meantime. Just started showing sex!


----------



## Gemtree (Oct 7, 2019)

gr865 said:


> Here is what's happening in the ol' 4x4 with 2 - 315W.
> Day 27 of 12/12
> 
> Installed the screen on the 17th and had to raise it on the 27th as the plant were lifting it off the ground. Stretch is over for the two Indica dom plants but the Sativa is still stretching and just beginning to show sex, but I think the stretch is about over.View attachment 4403599
> ...


Damn bro..Id throw a 1k in there now lol


----------



## gr865 (Oct 7, 2019)

Gemtree said:


> Damn bro..Id throw a 1k in there now lol


And just why would you do that?


----------



## Andraupplagan (Oct 7, 2019)

bob223 said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> Im a long time lurker but do not usually post. But i decided to take the dive and and switch from a 1000w hps to a 315lec for the warm summer months. I have been researching these light and reading posts on multiple forums. I find that most of the posts get off topic and lack any really information or pictures of what people are actually doing with these lights.
> 
> ...



Nice one! Can I ask, does your make an irritating high pitch noise? Thanks


----------



## Cannademik (Oct 8, 2019)

How hot do these get? I'm looking for a quick light to set in my 4x4 with my QB. I was going to purchase a china QB but that might take about a month to receive.


----------



## TintEastwood (Oct 8, 2019)

CMH loves company. 
Slammin the sisters with a supplemental string of 5 cobbies cranked to 250w.


----------



## Gingeroot (Oct 8, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> CMH loves company.
> Slammin the sisters with a supplemental string of 5 cobbies cranked to 250w.
> View attachment 4405379


That's some serious lighting!!! Gonna be a big sticky mess lol


----------



## TintEastwood (Oct 8, 2019)

Gingeroot said:


> That's some serious lighting!!! Gonna be a big sticky mess lol


(and it's only 42"x42"! - w/Co2)


----------



## Gingeroot (Oct 8, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> (and it's only 42"x42"! - w/Co2)


You're gonna need a diamond cutter to grind those nugs


----------



## TintEastwood (Oct 8, 2019)

Gingeroot said:


> You're gonna need a diamond cutter to grind those nugs


I sure hope so. My last run was miserable - mediocre makes me cranky.


----------



## Cannademik (Oct 8, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> CMH loves company.
> Slammin the sisters with a supplemental string of 5 cobbies cranked to 250w.
> View attachment 4405379


That drip system, wow. Anyway you can send me a link for a setup? Are those manifolds?


----------



## TintEastwood (Oct 8, 2019)

Cannademik said:


> That drip system, wow. Anyway you can send me a link for a setup? Are those manifolds?


Super simple, Just Google....

Floraflex

Aquarium manifold

Attached to....Res, pump, timer, hose, a valve or two. See my Seven Sisters grow for more pics.


----------



## Cannademik (Oct 8, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> Super simple, Just Google....
> 
> Floraflex
> 
> ...


Ah found it, Could you be more clear on the valve or two part? What exactly could I search for that in amazon? Thanks.


----------



## Blue back (Oct 8, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> CMH loves company.
> Slammin the sisters with a supplemental string of 5 cobbies cranked to 250w.
> View attachment 4405379


I run a 6 bulb 4' T5 for side lighting along with my 2 315's on a 4x4. I just pulled a monster crop of 6 plants.


----------



## PJ Diaz (Oct 8, 2019)

So can ya'll catch me up real quick on the current cmh technology? First off, are there some brands that are way better than others, or are all ballasts pretty much the same, and the difference is in the lamp? What about vented hoods, I don't really see those much with 315w setups, not necessary? Finally, how does the 315w cmh compete with a 600w hps, is it really a close equivalent? I run a 600w hps, and bought a 400w mag ballast a few years ago, and ran a 400w Philips MasterColor Retro White lamp (now discontinued), and it didn't quite keep up with the 600w hps, so went back to hps.


----------



## PadawanWarrior (Oct 8, 2019)

Gingeroot said:


> Anyone ever try to push the LEC 315 footprint to 3x4? If so were the edges airy after harvest? I really don't want to supplement LEDs if I don't have to, but they're looking happy in the meantime. Just started showing sex! View attachment 4404058


Your plants look beautiful. I had 2 315's in an approximately 3x8 closet, and was really impressed with the penetration of the cmh lights. My lower and outer buds were still really nice. I'm trying all quantum boards this round, and they don't look quite as nice. Here's a pic with the 2 cmh.


----------



## Blue back (Oct 8, 2019)

PJ Diaz said:


> So can ya'll catch me up real quick on the current cmh technology? First off, are there some brands that are way better than others, or are all ballasts pretty much the same, and the difference is in the lamp? What about vented hoods, I don't really see those much with 315w setups, not necessary? Finally, how does the 315w cmh compete with a 600w hps, is it really a close equivalent? I run a 600w hps, and bought a 400w mag ballast a few years ago, and ran a 400w Philips MasterColor Retro White lamp (now discontinued), and it didn't quite keep up with the 600w hps, so went back to hps.


I would stay away from the super cheap China brands other than that it is the bulb that makes the defense. Most like the Phillips. I run Hortilux bulbs myself. 315 compares very well to a 600. 2 315's I think is better than A 1000 in many ways. The ballest run very cool that's why there not offered remote, there's no need. I got away with being less then 12" from canopy with AC blowing across them.


----------



## PadawanWarrior (Oct 8, 2019)

The bulb does make a defense, lol. The Phillips is the one I use. And they do have remote ballasts for cmh. That's what I have now.


Blue back said:


> I would stay away from the super cheap China brands other than that it is the bulb that makes the defense. Most like the Phillips. I run Hortilux bulbs myself. 315 compares very well to a 600. 2 315's I think is better than A 1000 in many ways. The ballest run very cool that's why there not offered remote, there's no need. I got away with being less then 12" from canopy with AC blowing across them.


----------



## Blue back (Oct 9, 2019)

PadawanWarrior said:


> The bulb does make a defense, lol. The Phillips is the one I use. And they do have remote ballasts for cmh. That's what I have now.



Is it a single or double end? Not aware of any single end (true CMH) that are remote. Nice

Just checked Google and there are some excellent deals on there right now. WOW
.


----------



## TintEastwood (Oct 9, 2019)

Cannademik said:


> Ah found it, Could you be more clear on the valve or two part? What exactly could I search for that in amazon? Thanks.


Valves. 1 to control flow rate from pump to manifolds. Sometimes helpful to have before each manifold if using multiples.





Two Little Fishies 5445W Ball Valve for 1/2 Inch : Amazon.ca: Industrial & Scientific


Two Little Fishies 5445W Ball Valve for 1/2 Inch : Amazon.ca: Industrial & Scientific



www.amazon.ca





Tubing. (hopfully you can find this for lower price)






Hydrofarm HGTB50GF 1/2-Inch Black Tubing, 25-Foot Roll: Amazon.ca: Patio, Lawn & Garden


Find products from Hydrofarm at low prices. Shop online for barbecues, mowers, garden tools, generators, snow blowers and more at Amazon.ca



www.amazon.ca





For additional anti-siphon, and to help drain manifolds/lines between feedings....manifold is higher than res/planter level.


----------



## TintEastwood (Oct 9, 2019)

Example of Vertical reflector, Remote ballast, Philips bulb.
Bees knees of CMH!


----------



## PadawanWarrior (Oct 9, 2019)

Blue back said:


> Is it a single or double end? Not aware of any single end (true CMH) that are remote. Nice
> 
> Just checked Google and there are some excellent deals on there right now. WOW
> .


Single ended. Here's what I bought.









Ceramic MH 315w Low Profile Stealth Package


This complete lighting kit contains: The Sun System 315 Neutron CMH Reflector, the Prism Lighting Science 315w CMH Ballast 120V-240V, and your choice of Phillips MasterColor 315W T12 lamps for flowering (3100k) or for propagation (4200k).




growershouse.com





I would have bought these though now that the adjustable Sun System ballasts are more affordable.









Sun System Neutron + Sun System 1 LEC 315w Ceramic MH Grow Light Package | direct from Growers House


This 315w ceramic MH package includes a 315 watt Sun System 1 LEC Brand Electronic Ballast, a Sun System LEC Brand 315 Neutron CMH Reflector, and a Philips Mastercolor CDM 315 Watt Lamp. The Philips Mastercolor Lamp is available as either 3100K (full spectrum light) or 4200K (blue light). The...




growershouse.com


----------



## Blue back (Oct 9, 2019)

PadawanWarrior said:


> Single ended. Here's what I bought.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Very nice. Heat is not an issue for me but I do have a portable AC unit in the room. The ballest is barely warm itself


----------



## Cannademik (Oct 9, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> Valves. 1 to control flow rate from pump to manifolds. Sometimes helpful to have before each manifold if using multiples.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Are those just fittings u connect with the tube? I circled the parts. Thanks man, this is gonna save me so much time!


----------



## TintEastwood (Oct 9, 2019)

Cannademik said:


> Are those just fittings u connect with the tube? I circled the parts. Thanks man, this is gonna save me so much time!


That is a combination of hose, t-fittings, reducers, and zip ties or hose clamps to keep things from leaking. Not pretty, but functional.
Good luck on your project!


----------



## PJ Diaz (Oct 9, 2019)

So can anyone explain what these new cmh square wave ballasts are all about? More efficient? I've only run cmh in the past from magnetic ballasts.


----------



## Blue back (Oct 9, 2019)

I understand 200 plus pages I'd alot to read but this has been gone over.


----------



## PJ Diaz (Oct 9, 2019)

Blue back said:


> I understand 200 plus pages I'd alot to read but this has been gone over.


Oh, ok then I guess I'll go dig thru hundreds of pages of posts. Thought someone might be able to help with a simple answer to a straightforward question.


----------



## TintEastwood (Oct 9, 2019)

Wave Shape and Frequency | EYE Hortilux


Low Frequency Square Wave vs High Frequency Sine Wave The square wave design provides constant maximum voltage to the lamp for a longer period of time. This produces more photons of light for your plants. The lower frequency needed will not cause any issues related to RF interference. The square...




eyehortilux.com





CMH refresher...








Best Ceramic Metal Halide CMH Grow Light (Updated Jan 2021)


Ceramic metal halide bulbs are far better than HPS and MH and our review shows you exactly why. They also beat most LEDs. But you want to make sure you get the right CMH light. Read on to ensure you get your money's worth and don't...




growlightinfo.com


----------



## PJ Diaz (Oct 9, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> Wave Shape and Frequency | EYE Hortilux
> 
> 
> Low Frequency Square Wave vs High Frequency Sine Wave The square wave design provides constant maximum voltage to the lamp for a longer period of time. This produces more photons of light for your plants. The lower frequency needed will not cause any issues related to RF interference. The square...
> ...


Thanks. I guess that would explain why these 315w square wave ballasts are better than the old school 60Hz 400w magnetic ballasts.


----------



## NugHeuser (Oct 10, 2019)

GoBrah said:


> Which brand 630 was that? There are many brands with different manufacturers. The spectrum, PAR output and quality are not the same.


Growers choice 630 w/ double ended 3k red enhanced bulb


----------



## Blue back (Oct 10, 2019)

PJ Diaz said:


> Oh, ok then I guess I'll go dig thru hundreds of pages of posts. Thought someone might be able to help with a simple answer to a straightforward question.


Sorry wasn't trying to be a dick. Glad TintEastwood tossed that up for you


----------



## TintEastwood (Oct 10, 2019)

Blue back said:


> Sorry wasn't trying to be a dick. Glad TintEastwood tossed that up for you


We all have our ups and downs. Humans. Being kind and gentle is a good thing.


Blue back said:


> CMH piling on the resin. GSC Forum CutView attachment 4405996


Dang. Stackin those trich's. Stack on!

Dang. Now you got me craving some Loaded Nachos for lunch. Ty


----------



## Blue back (Oct 10, 2019)

CMH doing it's thing. Rock solid dusted nugs. GSC and a big Wedding Cake top


----------



## GoBrah (Oct 10, 2019)

NugHeuser said:


> Growers choice 630 w/ double ended 3k red enhanced bulb


 i thought the same, hope it wasnt expensive


----------



## turbobuzz (Oct 12, 2019)

Blue back said:


> Very nice. Heat is not an issue for me but I do have a portable AC unit in the room. The ballest is barely warm itself


Exactly what I bought. Works great. I just grow one plant at a time, so it's perfect for me.


----------



## TintEastwood (Oct 31, 2019)

FYI. These vertical bulb CMH reflectors have a huge 18x18 opening. Just sayin, not sellin. I only know because I picked up a couple off craigslist.
A definite upgrade from my lil 11x13 horizontals. Very even and gentle light spread.









V-Lux 315w Ceramic Metal Halide 120-240v | citigardens


These next generation ceramic lamps offer better full color light spectrum and emit a higher amount of beneficial UV and more red spectrums. Vertical Lamp 50/60 Hz Low Frequency Square Wave Highly Efficient Electronic Ballast Rated for 50,000 Hour Ballast Life Built in Thermal Protection




www.citigardens.io





Here, currently. US 230 - no bulb.








V-Lux Vertical 315w CMH System 120-240v


Vertical 315w CMH System features a highly efficient, square wave, low-frequency ballast paired with a commercial grade hammer tone aluminum reflector that is highly reflective. Ceramic Metal Halide lamps offer a spectrum and CRI that closely resembles natural sunlight over any other form of...



www.hydro4less.io


----------



## nobighurry (Oct 31, 2019)

What everyone’s thoughts on vertical bulb vs horizontal? Noticed any increases with a vertical hood? have all horizontal, I ran them bare bulb for a couple runs but the final weight was down.. 2 315cmh and one 600watt DE hps in a 4x6 on movers


----------



## SUNDOG (Oct 31, 2019)

running 3 at the moment, going to kick on the fourth real soon.


----------



## SUNDOG (Oct 31, 2019)

The plants love them!!


----------



## Blue back (Oct 31, 2019)

I have highth


nobighurry said:


> What everyone’s thoughts on vertical bulb vs horizontal? Noticed any increases with a vertical hood? have all horizontal, I ran them bare bulb for a couple runs but the final weight was down.. 2 315cmh and one 600watt DE hps in a 4x6 on movers



I have height issue's so I have to run horizontal. 2 315's rock my 4x4 space


----------



## Blue back (Oct 31, 2019)

Garlic Breath pic 2 GSC forum cut
Wedding CakeAnd my new cross Wedding Cake x White Fire


----------



## Twohearted (Oct 31, 2019)

I am just starting my first grow with a Sun System 315 vertical all in one hood/ballast with a Phillips bulb in a 3ft x 3ft tent.
The tent is 6.5 feet tall, so I don't think I should have any issues with height. This is my first grow with any 315 cmh, but based on the research I did before buying this light it sounded like vertical mount was maybe a little better for the 315 bulbs?

I am really loving the light so far, runs quiet and cool. The tent is 78-79 degrees with no vent fan running, and light output and balance in the 3 x 3 space is great. Plants are literally just sprouting, but I am excited for this grow with the new light. I am not expecting it on my first grow with this light, especially since this is my first grow in a whole new setup (and in quite a while), but I have seen multiple reports of people pulling 3/4 -1 lb in about the same space with just one of the Sun Systems 315 Vertical.

It has been 5-6 years since I was growing last, it's fun to get back into it and have all these hi-tech new lights. Between the ever improving LED and the new sexy 315 LEC it's a huge step forward for the industry.

I'll post some pics once the grow gets going.


----------



## gr865 (Nov 1, 2019)

Couple of pics from my 4 x 4 with 2 - 315W CMH lamps. Day 54 & 55,


----------



## SUNDOG (Nov 1, 2019)

Blue back said:


> Garlic Breath pic 2 GSC forum cutView attachment 4415060View attachment 4415061
> Wedding CakeView attachment 4415062And my new cross Wedding Cake x White FireView attachment 4415063


Looking frosty Blue back, where did you get the Wedding Cake from and how you liking it?


----------



## SUNDOG (Nov 1, 2019)

gr865 said:


> Couple of pics from my 4 x 4 with 2 - 315W CMH lamps. Day 54 & 55,View attachment 4415276View attachment 4415272View attachment 4415273View attachment 4415274View attachment 4415275View attachment 4415277


Awesome 4x4! What strain?


----------



## Blue back (Nov 1, 2019)

SUNDOG said:


> Looking frosty Blue back, where did you get the Wedding Cake from and how you liking it?


a very reliable source that can authenticate that they are the clone only versions of GSC forum and Wedding Cake. The GSC is outstanding it's not going out of rotation for a very long time. The WC has an unbelievable cherry smell not a great yield but for now it's staying put also. The Garlic is also clone only very very unique


----------



## SUNDOG (Nov 2, 2019)

Blue back said:


> a very reliable source that can authenticate that they are the clone only versions of GSC forum and Wedding Cake. The GSC is outstanding it's not going out of rotation for a very long time. The WC has an unbelievable cherry smell not a great yield but for now it's staying put also. The Garlic is also clone only very very unique


They look great man, I grew out some Purple City Genetics GSC, OGKB bx2, GMO and Dosido. Didn't really impress me. I'm sure their knock offs. Decent smoke though except for their GMO it was straight up trash hermied, had no terps just no bueno all around.


----------



## SUNDOG (Nov 2, 2019)

Here's some seedjunkys Willies Kush Cake grown under 315s. Right before the chop:


----------



## turbobuzz (Nov 3, 2019)

Sunsystem neutron reflector, remote ballast, and Phillips 3200k CMH. I love these lights. This is my second grow with it. I'll be sticking with it. This is sour d day 48 from flip. I'm guessing 30 days to go.


----------



## gr865 (Nov 3, 2019)

SUNDOG said:


> Awesome 4x4! What strain?


4 - G13 Haze, 2 - BlueBerry, and 2 Original Skunk #1
Wish I had clones, growing 3 strains from seed has been a pain, especially the stretch, all three stretched differently. The G13 Haze mostly sativa of course stretched the most and the stretch was longer than the other two. Both the BB and Skunk stretched about the same and the stretch last about the same length.


----------



## .Smoke (Nov 3, 2019)

Jack Herer, Bubblegum and OG Kush autos.
1 month under 315CMH and 600 HPS in a 4x4x6.


----------



## GreenNorth (Nov 4, 2019)

White Fire OG Flower week 6
With 315w Philips agro


----------



## GreenNorth (Nov 4, 2019)

Full tent 3x3 with only 315w. Im sold 
Just got 2x 315 for my 4x4 and just got Wedding Cake break through coco  
600W HPS has been doing great but spread is so much better with double 315s i think. Much denser and even canopy. And with ballast outside of tent these things run cool. I used magnetic ballast for my hps because of digitals cause huge rf and emi with their 50k-60k hertz. Square wave that CMH use is only 110-130hertz. I got lower power consumption with 2x315 than magnetic 600w. Happy growing fellas!


----------



## Gingeroot (Nov 4, 2019)

Took the LEDs off the outer edge and started a side flip! Garden still looking happy & frosty 5 weeks flipped under the LEC


----------



## TintEastwood (Nov 6, 2019)

TintEastwood said:


> FYI. These vertical bulb CMH reflectors have a huge 18x18 opening. Just sayin, not sellin. I only know because I picked up a couple off craigslist.
> A definite upgrade from my lil 11x13 horizontals. Very even and gentle light spread.
> 
> 
> ...


$170. Shipped!








V-Lux Vertical CMH 315w LEC Grow Light Reflector Hood Kit Fixture 120-240v | eBay


Vertical Lamp 50/60 Hz. Square Wave. Built in Thermal Protection. We take our reputation seriously.



www.ebay.com


----------



## Brandon137 (Dec 29, 2019)

Hello all I've been reading through the beginning of this thread trying to get an idea for where people have been hanging there lights and so far I've seen it range from 10" up to 24" just wondering what you all are currently running at?


----------



## TedeBoy (Dec 29, 2019)

Brandon137 said:


> Hello all I've been reading through the beginning of this thread trying to get an idea for where people have been hanging there lights and so far I've seen it range from 10" up to 24" just wondering what you all are currently running at?


18"


----------



## turbobuzz (Dec 29, 2019)

Brandon137 said:


> Hello all I've been reading through the beginning of this thread trying to get an idea for where people have been hanging there lights and so far I've seen it range from 10" up to 24" just wondering what you all are currently running at?


I've been running around 20 to 22


----------



## Chip Green (Dec 29, 2019)

Anytime I got below the 18"(ish) threshold, things started to get weird. Foxtail mostly, typical light stress leaf curl. 

My total of 315 fixtures has now reached six.
I keep buying more. I can't stop.


----------



## hillbill (Dec 29, 2019)

Chip Green said:


> Anytime I got below the 18"(ish) threshold, things started to get weird. Foxtail mostly, typical light stress leaf curl.
> 
> My total of 315 fixtures has now reached six.
> I keep buying more. I can't stop.


So just what does the 315 add to your thoroughly modern LEDs?


----------



## Chip Green (Dec 29, 2019)

I live in the UP of Michigan. I need the heat, the LED areas had to be overlit to get into the sweet spot. By adding CMH into the mix, the results have been outstanding.
There are many available 315 units for under $200 these days, It costs in the neighborhood of $1 per watt to build proper LED, so it's really become a win win...
Also the CMH alone is really killing it quality wise.


----------



## gr865 (Dec 29, 2019)

Brandon137 said:


> Hello all I've been reading through the beginning of this thread trying to get an idea for where people have been hanging there lights and so far I've seen it range from 10" up to 24" just wondering what you all are currently running at?


First off you don't end a sentence with a preposition,  

18 to 24 inches for my horizontal grows, my last grow the plants grew into the lamps so got a little burn. Pic from that grow.

That being said, my vertical grows the lamps are within 10 to 12 inches from the plants. Couple of pictures from one of my vertical grows. 
Colored out the lamps.




Got a new thread in vertical growing, it is in my Signature!


----------



## NugHeuser (Dec 29, 2019)

hillbill said:


> So just what does the 315 add to your thoroughly modern LEDs?


Thoroughly modern LEDs cost how much? This is a serious question cuz I'm out for another light. I run cmh and led. I like both. One thing I can say cmh has is price for quality. 
I dont know what all "modern" consists of in terms of your reply but when it comes to quality flower, I'd bet money on my 315s in a side by side vs cobs. 
That being said, I believe led now has the tech to add red enhancement and uva/uvb. 
Which if so I could see them excelling past cmh just because of the ability to increase intensity. 
But let's be serious, a 400w quality, efficient led with the extra reds and UV added is going to run what kind of price range?


----------



## hillbill (Dec 29, 2019)

I used original Philips 250w and 400 watt CMH years ago so I have that goin on but been almost 7 years of all mostly white LEDs. A couple of my old A51 Cree panels are that old and my newest COB fixture is 3 1/2 years old. Great efficient lights are now around a $ a watt so not prohibitive and efficiency is much better. I haven’t bought a bulb since 2012!


----------



## NugHeuser (Dec 29, 2019)

hillbill said:


> I used original Philips 250w and 400 watt CMH years ago so I have that goin on but been almost 7 years of all mostly white LEDs. A couple of my old A51 Cree panels are that old and my newest COB fixture is 3 1/2 years old. Great efficient lights are now around a $ a watt so not prohibitive and efficiency is much better. I haven’t bought a bulb since 2012!


So what's the catch with alibaba.com? I found a ~630 watt top bin samsung strip light with red diodes added. Their price is 300$, what's the catch? As that is already built and seems to be high efficiency strips for half the price. I'm not real up on led but the drivers didnt really ring a bell. Sounds too good to be true?


----------



## gr865 (Dec 29, 2019)

Probably cheap Chinese bull shit!


----------



## Chip Green (Jan 1, 2020)

Came across an unknown recently, during compulsive searching of the interwebs for 315s
*High Noon Hydro*
Colorado company, specializing in CMH tech
Website, eBay, Amazon...

Well, at least I only bought four.
So far.


----------



## gr865 (Jan 2, 2020)

Chip Green said:


> Came across an unknown recently, during compulsive searching of the interwebs for 315s
> *High Noon Hydro*
> Colorado company, specializing in CMH tech
> Website, eBay, Amazon...
> ...


Trying to contact them, left message.
I want to find out if you can separate the ballast from the lamp and run the lamps in the vertical position.


----------



## 10WeekFlushBro (Jan 2, 2020)

Well, the bulbs they sell are available on alibaba I'm sure the rest is too


----------



## gr865 (Jan 2, 2020)

I would be careful with alibaba, most of the stuff they sell is chinese and not much quality. JMHO!


----------



## Chip Green (Jan 2, 2020)

Well, we'll see. They don't claim to manufacture the bulbs. 
I'm totally satisfied with the fixtures.


----------



## TintEastwood (Jan 2, 2020)

New for my room this run. 
Luv these verticals. 



Dang. Now only 140 shipped.








V-Lux Vertical CMH 315w LEC Grow Light Reflector Hood Kit Fixture 120-240v | eBay


Vertical Lamp 50/60 Hz. Square Wave. Built in Thermal Protection. We take our reputation seriously.



www.ebay.com


----------



## PJ Diaz (Jan 2, 2020)

TintEastwood said:


> New for my room this run.
> Luv these verticals.
> 
> View attachment 4448461
> ...


That looks sweet, but not sure I like the idea of ballasts built into the hood, I prefer remote. Also are the ballasts themselves any good?


----------



## gr865 (Jan 2, 2020)

TintEastwood said:


> New for my room this run.
> Luv these verticals.
> 
> View attachment 4448461
> ...


Can the ballast be separated from the lamp?


----------



## TintEastwood (Jan 2, 2020)

gr865 said:


> Can the ballast be separated from the lamp?





PJ Diaz said:


> That looks sweet, but not sure I like the idea of ballasts built into the hood, I prefer remote. Also are the ballasts themselves any good?


Yes. But it requires a complete disassembly - removing inner reflector to gain access.
Can't speak for reliability or quality of ballast. Not a huge risk when a 315cmh ballast alone cost is $100+.
The biggest draw for me was the 18x18 opening, and vertical bulb. They run really cool.


----------



## gr865 (Jan 2, 2020)

I always look at the heat of the ballast, being able to separate the ballast from the lamp is critical especially in a vertical grow, which is my major type of grow.


----------



## TintEastwood (Jan 2, 2020)

gr865 said:


> I always look at the heat of the ballast, being able to separate the ballast from the lamp is critical especially in a vertical grow, which is my major type of grow.


Neat. When growing vertical, do you also use these vertical sockets?








Phantom 315 Watt CMH Vertical Hanging Grow Light Kit


Buy the Phantom 315 Watt CMH Vertical Hanging Grow Light Kit at Hydrobuilder.com. Shop the entire line of Phantom products along with thousands of hydroponics supplies on sale now.




hydrobuilder.com











CMH Socket Set - PGZ18 Base | HTG Supply


The HYL CMH socket set – a quick, clean, and cost-effective solution for retrofitting existing grow light reflectors / hoods with CMH. Get it now at HTG Supply, the #1 grow shop online!




www.htgsupply.com


----------



## 10WeekFlushBro (Jan 3, 2020)

I used these bulbs (or the rebranded equivalent), IME they seem more prone to failure than Philips bulbs over time. I haven't had a philips bulb burn out and become unusable. I'm sure it happens, but with these it happened twice to me. maybe it was just bad luck. One of them burnt out after only 3600 hours of use :/
Anyway, I'm not trying to sound like a party pooper. My experience is just anecdotal. Maybe someone else can chime in. 315 bulbs from different manufacturers all performed quite similarly in the tests I've seen.


----------



## hillbill (Jan 3, 2020)

The big big names in electric supplies like Philips and GE etc. can sure enough build high quality bulbs.


----------



## gr865 (Jan 3, 2020)

TintEastwood said:


> Neat. When growing vertical, do you also use these vertical sockets?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I just take the Nanolux lamp apart and use it, I bought two of the cables like the ones in the Phantom Kit, but just the cable for my assistant.


----------



## tst2015 (Jan 21, 2020)

I just picked up a 4x8x6.5 tent for flower only and need to grab some lighting. Also, I need to keep heat down as I don't want to run AC.
Right now, running 620w of Aglex lighting and tent is getting up to 81 with exhaust running full blast. Problem is....thats only lighting one half of the tent. Once I have the tent full on both sides...I'd never be able to cool it down.
So, I've been considering all options and am leaning to CMH because they seem to work well and cheaper than quality LEDs. I'm trying to keep my costs down to keep the wife off my case lol.
I was looking at the SilberStar 315 vertical hood with the separate ballast and Philips 3100 bulb for about $400 delivered. 








Square Wave 315W CMH SilverStar Fusion Bright Ballast System


The Silverstar CMH 315W reflector is the latest innovation in the Silverstar line and is designed for Ceramic Metal Halide technology. Like all the Silverstar products, this reflector is made from highly reflective German textured aluminum for excellent light uniformity and diffusion. It has a...




www.growlights.ca





Figured I would get two and watch the heat. If it's manageable...get a third one and have a decent light overlap. Or I could throw in a one of my LEDs in between them with only the bloom switch running.
I'm running a 6" AC infinity fan and 6" carbon for exhaust. Also have a 6" fan for intake when it gets too hot. 
Any idea of how much heat buildup I can expect with 2 or 3 in a tent this size?


----------



## Couch_Lock (Jan 21, 2020)

Never had a 4 x 8, only 4 x 4's.......But I'd think with a few variable speed fans in there you would be fine. Ummm.....negative pressure is best, if using a 6" exhaust (I use one in a 4 x 4) Id use a 4" intake fan.....you want more exhausting, ideally. For a 4 x 8 tent Id want bigger then a 6" Exhaust.....

8" exhaust and then utilize the 6" intake. Another config


----------



## tst2015 (Jan 21, 2020)

Couch_Lock said:


> Never had a 4 x 8, only 4 x 4's.......But I'd think with a few variable speed fans in there you would be fine. Ummm.....negative pressure is best, if using a 6" exhaust (I use one in a 4 x 4) Id use a 4" intake fan.....you want more exhausting, ideally. For a 4 x 8 tent Id want bigger then a 6" Exhaust.....
> 
> 8" exhaust and then utilize the 6" intake. Another config


Thanks Couchlock. Exactly another issue I'm having. I'm getting positive pressure because even with the 6in intake dialed down to the lowest speed...it's pushing more than the 6" with carbon filter can exhaust. I have a 4" that I can try in place...or one of those 6" duct fans. 
I'll probably have to switch up to an 8" but it'll have to wait until spring so I can do the venting work at the wall.


----------



## Couch_Lock (Jan 21, 2020)

Ive had a rough start myself this winter.....had used my CMH's previously last Jan, bought an HLG 550 V2 Rspec last summer and that 2nd 2019 run was pretty good. 

So I started my Jan 2020 grow (I live almost as far north as Canada) with the LED......in a 63 degree cellar Ive seen average temp highs at 71....thats not enough, the stems are spindly AF so far. So, I unplugged the LED light and tossed in a CMH.....my humidity rose 10% in 3-4 minutes......temp rose 4 degrees in that time frame also (keeping the ballast IN the tent for warmth).

Plants are about 9-10 days old.


----------



## hillbill (Jan 21, 2020)

Cooler growing mix with LEDs can be a big deal, I like to keep that warm. Dark period can really drop mix temperature.


----------



## Couch_Lock (Jan 21, 2020)

hillbill said:


> Cooler growing mix with LEDs can be a big deal, I like to keep that warm. Dark period can really drop mix temperature.


Ya, my low has hit 59, lol.......Moved the grow to familys house a few days ago......their basement has better heat regulation.


----------



## gr865 (Jan 21, 2020)

Make sure you can separate the Ballast from the lamp. 
I run 2 Nanolux 315's, have the ballast outside my 4 x 4.
This makes any heat issues mute.


----------



## Couch_Lock (Jan 21, 2020)

I need the heat, its where I live. Ballast must be inside for winter grows.


----------



## tst2015 (Jan 21, 2020)

Couch_Lock said:


> Ive had a rough start myself this winter.....had used my CMH's previously last Jan, bought an HLG 550 V2 Rspec last summer and that 2nd 2019 run was pretty good.
> 
> So I started my Jan 2020 grow (I live almost as far north as Canada) with the LED......in a 63 degree cellar Ive seen average temp highs at 71....thats not enough, the stems are spindly AF so far. So, I unplugged the LED light and tossed in a CMH.....my humidity rose 10% in 3-4 minutes......temp rose 4 degrees in that time frame also (keeping the ballast IN the tent for warmth).
> 
> Plants are about 9-10 days old.


I've got mine in a basement bedroom but I have a furnace duct that I can open if needed to warm room in winter. But I've got it right closed now.
In the summer I have central air which helps but if I turn up the air too high then other in the house are complaining it's too cold. Lol


----------



## Couch_Lock (Jan 21, 2020)

You are all set then on temps...Once u hit your sweet spot on exhaust vs intake you will be perfect.


----------



## hillbill (Jan 21, 2020)

I’ve run dryer duct from a floor vent into flower tent, plug it with a towel when not needed. AC same.


----------



## NugHeuser (Jan 21, 2020)

tst2015 said:


> I just picked up a 4x8x6.5 tent for flower only and need to grab some lighting. Also, I need to keep heat down as I don't want to run AC.
> Right now, running 620w of Aglex lighting and tent is getting up to 81 with exhaust running full blast. Problem is....thats only lighting one half of the tent. Once I have the tent full on both sides...I'd never be able to cool it down.
> So, I've been considering all options and am leaning to CMH because they seem to work well and cheaper than quality LEDs. I'm trying to keep my costs down to keep the wife off my case lol.
> I was looking at the SilberStar 315 vertical hood with the separate ballast and Philips 3100 bulb for about $400 delivered.
> ...


So you're already a little warm with a 620w (at the wall) blurple light? Are you experiencing summer or winter in your region?
I've got plenty experience with 4x8 and cmh, just wondering for starters what season your area is currently in, because that does affect different setups


----------



## TintEastwood (Jan 21, 2020)

V-Lux Vertical CMH 315w LEC Grow Light Reflector Hood Kit Fixture 120-240v | eBay


Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for V-Lux Vertical CMH 315w LEC Grow Light Reflector Hood Kit Fixture 120-240v at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!



www.ebay.ca


----------



## tst2015 (Jan 21, 2020)

NugHeuser said:


> So you're already a little warm with a 620w (at the wall) blurple light? Are you experiencing summer or winter in your region?
> I've got plenty experience with 4x8 and cmh, just wondering for starters what season your area is currently in, because that does affect different setups


It's winter here but temps got to 0 celcius today so pretty nice for region. Normally, it's anywhere between -15 to -30 this time of year. 
The temps in the tent ended up coming down to about 78-79 with the 620w running. The temps had gotten up higher when I had another light going in there (110w) ....forgot to mention that in my original post. Once I shut that one off....temps came back down to 78-79 after a bit.
I'm running Aglex lights. Between the two lights (620w)...there are 6 COBs and a bunch of reds/blues.
I'll likely have to put a bigger extraction fan and carbon filter in before summer for sure.
The CMH I'm looking at have remote ballasts with vertical bulb in hood. I'm not sure how much heat the attached ballasts kick into the tent so I figured keeping ballasts out of the tent should help a bit.
Otherwise, I could get cheaper CMH with horizontal hoods with attached ballasts. This would be nice because I could get it closer to the top of the tent if needed.


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## NugHeuser (Jan 22, 2020)

tst2015 said:


> It's winter here but temps got to 0 celcius today so pretty nice for region. Normally, it's anywhere between -15 to -30 this time of year.
> The temps in the tent ended up coming down to about 78-79 with the 620w running. The temps had gotten up higher when I had another light going in there (110w) ....forgot to mention that in my original post. Once I shut that one off....temps came back down to 78-79 after a bit.
> I'm running Aglex lights. Between the two lights (620w)...there are 6 COBs and a bunch of reds/blues.
> I'll likely have to put a bigger extraction fan and carbon filter in before summer for sure.
> ...


Yeah if you do get any cmh I'd go with the remote ones with a vertically oriented bulb. The vertical ones have better light output. 

I think you just need a bigger inline fan on your carbon filter. 
Come summer time you'll probably still have heat problems if you cant crank the AC in whatever room your tents in but itll help using a bigger fan. 
I use a 10" hyperfan and filter on my 4x8 during summer with a 6" intake and AC in the area and my highest temps I wanna say in the dead of summer reach 86 and I sometimes have to dim my ballasts a little. Probably average 81 throughout the warmer seasons with my setup. Running 3- three cob rails with 2 315's oriented like so, [l o l o l]
Hopefully that helps


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## tst2015 (Jan 22, 2020)

NugHeuser said:


> Yeah if you do get any cmh I'd go with the remote ones with a vertically oriented bulb. The vertical ones have better light output.
> 
> I think you just need a bigger inline fan on your carbon filter.
> Come summer time you'll probably still have heat problems if you cant crank the AC in whatever room your tents in but itll help using a bigger fan.
> ...


I've got the AC infinity 6" with the adjustable controller running in there right now. I can plug a second fan into that same controller but it has to be the same type. So I wonder if I just add a second 6" exhaust fan and carbon filter in there (which I already have) will do the trick? 
I like the controller but to step up to the 8" fan and filter would cost me about 500 bucks here in Canada.


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## NugHeuser (Jan 22, 2020)

tst2015 said:


> I've got the AC infinity 6" with the adjustable controller running in there right now. I can plug a second fan into that same controller but it has to be the same type. So I wonder if I just add a second 6" exhaust fan and carbon filter in there (which I already have) will do the trick?
> I like the controller but to step up to the 8" fan and filter would cost me about 500 bucks here in Canada.


Yeah that's sucky with the higher prices in Canada. Yeah I'd say if money is an issue for now you'll just have to try a 2nd set of exhaust and just see what happens.
The problem with using a carbon filter(which I always recommend to use) is that itll take your 6" inline fan and by the time it has to push air through a filter, carbon and ducting, the air movement is significantly lessened. So it's always a good idea to use an overkill fan WITH a speed controller in my opinion. 
But you gotta do what you gotta do, maybe the double set will make a big difference. Good luck to ya


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## tst2015 (Jan 22, 2020)

NugHeuser said:


> Yeah that's sucky with the higher prices in Canada. Yeah I'd say if money is an issue for now you'll just have to try a 2nd set of exhaust and just see what happens.
> The problem with using a carbon filter(which I always recommend to use) is that itll take your 6" inline fan and by the time it has to push air through a filter, carbon and ducting, the air movement is significantly lessened. So it's always a good idea to use an overkill fan WITH a speed controller in my opinion.
> But you gotta do what you gotta do, maybe the double set will make a big difference. Good luck to ya


Yeah ill have to give it a try. Then if I need to step up to a bigger fan I will. Thanks for the help!


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## ISK (Feb 27, 2020)

I'm currently growing 4 plants in a 4.5 x 4.5 x 7 ft tent with a 600 watt HPS and I'm about 3 weeks away from harvest.

My buddy at the grow shop suggested that I use my 315 CMH for the last 2 weeks to finish off my crop.

Not sure if this would be a good idea or not...thoughts


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## .Smoke (Feb 27, 2020)

ISK said:


> I'm currently growing 4 plants in a 4.5 x 4.5 x 7 ft tent with a 600 watt HPS and I'm about 3 weeks away from harvest.
> 
> My buddy at the grow shop suggested that I use my 315 CMH for the last 2 weeks to finish off my crop.
> 
> Not sure if this would be a good idea or not...thoughts


Trying it out now between 2- 1000w hps. Harvest in a week or 2. Will see if it makes a difference.


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## tst2015 (Feb 27, 2020)

ISK said:


> I'm currently growing 4 plants in a 4.5 x 4.5 x 7 ft tent with a 600 watt HPS and I'm about 3 weeks away from harvest.
> 
> My buddy at the grow shop suggested that I use my 315 CMH for the last 2 weeks to finish off my crop.
> 
> Not sure if this would be a good idea or not...thoughts


I was running under some Aglex LED for their whole life. Decided to move them under the 315cmh to see if it would make any difference in the last couple weeks. They were pretty frosty when I put them in but they seem to be putting on a little more.
It's only one time with a new to me strain so I can't say for sure either way if it made a difference. But it didn't hurt anything.
These pics are after 5 days under the 315cmh


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## Lucky Luke (Feb 27, 2020)

ISK said:


> I'm currently growing 4 plants in a 4.5 x 4.5 x 7 ft tent with a 600 watt HPS and I'm about 3 weeks away from harvest.
> 
> My buddy at the grow shop suggested that I use my 315 CMH for the last 2 weeks to finish off my crop.
> 
> Not sure if this would be a good idea or not...thoughts


CMH does add THC..


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## Blue back (Feb 27, 2020)

Under 315 the whole flower cycle. Wedding Cake, Garlic Breath and forum cut GSC. 2 315's on 4x4.


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## Blue back (Feb 27, 2020)

Plenty of size too. Rock solid Wedding Cake cola.


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## Logan Burke (Feb 28, 2020)

Has anyone noticed that they need to increase/decrease their nutes under CMH lights as compared to regular HID MH/HPS? I keep finding that I need to raise the ppm's much higher than when under typical HID's, I'm suspecting that the spectrum perhaps makes the plant consume more of certain nutrients, but really haven't been able to find a wealth of info on the net about this.


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## Neoangelo147 (Mar 1, 2020)

12 plants under 2 Vivosun 315 CMH. Week 5 of flower.

*Strains: *Blueberry, LSD, Venom OG, Lemon Tree.
*Fertilizer*: Full organic dry amendments from Dr Earth flower girl and 5 tomato. EWC, dolomite lime, kelp meal, Recharge
*Soil*: Black Gold
*Pot size*: 3 gallons
*Grown in: *2 3x3ft trays.
*Canopy size: *4ftx7ft


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## tst2015 (Mar 1, 2020)

Neoangelo147 said:


> 12 plants under 2 Vivosun 315 CMH. Week 5 of flower.
> 
> *Strains: *Blueberry, LSD, Venom OG, Lemon Tree.
> *Fertilizer*: Full organic dry amendments from Dr Earth flower girl and 5 tomato. EWC, dolomite lime, kelp meal, Recharge
> ...


Nice. I've got a 4*8 tent. Was thinking about putting in a 3rd 315 for full coverage...but yours looks like it's doing well with just 2


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## Blue back (Mar 2, 2020)

2 315 will cover a 3'x3' area. I run 2 on a 4'x4'. 4x8 u would actually wanna run 3 if not 4 for total coverage. Neoangalo147 looks great for only 2 though no doubt


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## .Smoke (Mar 2, 2020)

.Smoke said:


> Trying it out now between 2- 1000w hps. Harvest in a week or 2. Will see if it makes a difference.
> View attachment 4490501
> View attachment 4490502


Results...


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## gr865 (Mar 2, 2020)

Blue back said:


> 2 315 will cover a 3'x3' area. I run 2 on a 4'x4'. 4x8 u would actually wanna run 3 if not 4 for total coverage. Neoangalo147 looks great for only 2 though no doubt


I run two 315's in a 4x4, but I believe that two should cover 3x6 very well.


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## Neoangelo147 (Mar 2, 2020)

Blue back said:


> 2 315 will cover a 3'x3' area. I run 2 on a 4'x4'. 4x8 u would actually wanna run 3 if not 4 for total coverage. Neoangalo147 looks great for only 2 though no doubt


This is my 2nd round running these lights. Something I learned from previous runs with these 315’s is you want to keep your canopy as low/even as possible. These lights don’t penetrate well so growing trees will produce fluffy bottom buds. Scrog or LST seems to work good with these lights. Also something to consider is genetics and healthy plants. If genetics aren’t there no matter what light you use you won’t see the full potential. Plant health is another important thing to consider.


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## Neoangelo147 (Mar 2, 2020)

gr865 said:


> I run two 315's in a 4x4, but I believe that two should cover 3x6 very well.


2 315’s will work in a 3x6 just make sure to keep the light as close as possible to the canopy without burning the plants.


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## Neoangelo147 (Mar 2, 2020)

tst2015 said:


> Nice. I've got a 4*8 tent. Was thinking about putting in a 3rd 315 for full coverage...but yours looks like it's doing well with just 2


One thing I forgot to say about these lights is keep them as close to the canopy as possible. They run a lot cooler than hps so a fan blowing across the canopy really helps keep the bulbs cool.


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## gr865 (Mar 2, 2020)

Neoangelo147 said:


> 2 315’s will work in a 3x6 just make sure to keep the light as close as possible to the canopy without burning the plants.


Here are my two 315's in the tent, and they are close.


And the ladies.


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## PadawanWarrior (Mar 2, 2020)

gr865 said:


> Here are my two 315's in the tent, and they are close.
> View attachment 4494436View attachment 4494441
> 
> And the ladies.
> View attachment 4494437 View attachment 4494438 View attachment 4494439 View attachment 4494440


Holy shit. I haven't been able get that nice of plants from my 2 315's, but mine are in hoods. Your setup makes me tempted. Nice job man.


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## Neoangelo147 (Mar 2, 2020)

gr865 said:


> Here are my two 315's in the tent, and they are close.
> View attachment 4494436View attachment 4494441
> 
> And the ladies.
> View attachment 4494437 View attachment 4494438 View attachment 4494439 View attachment 4494440


I like this style. What is your average yield when things are all on point?


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## gr865 (Mar 2, 2020)

Neoangelo147 said:


> I like this style. What is your average yield when things are all on point?


24 to 27 zips, of dried cured in jars, smokable bud and about 4 zips of untrimmed buds that go directly into FECO.


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## Blue back (Mar 3, 2020)

Neoangelo147 said:


> This is my 2nd round running these lights. Something I learned from previous runs with these 315’s is you want to keep your canopy as low/even as possible. These lights don’t penetrate well so growing trees will produce fluffy bottom buds. Scrog or LST seems to work good with these lights. Also something to consider is genetics and healthy plants. If genetics aren’t there no matter what light you use you won’t see the full potential. Plant health is another important thing to consider.


I grow pretty good size trees but I cut ALL the under growth off so the tops grow big and rock solid. Yes there not the best penetrating lights that's why I also run a big T5 for side lighting. I'm going to keep them shorter next run. I believe I can crop just as much with smaller height wise as trees like you said. Best part about CMH is the massive resin production they pack on. Also like you said I don't care what lights you use genetics are #1.


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## Neoangelo147 (Mar 3, 2020)

Some more bud porn from my Blueberry cut.

This Friday will be week 6 of flower.


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## Lucky Luke (Mar 4, 2020)

Logan Burke said:


> Has anyone noticed that they need to increase/decrease their nutes under CMH lights as compared to regular HID MH/HPS? I keep finding that I need to raise the ppm's much higher than when under typical HID's, I'm suspecting that the spectrum perhaps makes the plant consume more of certain nutrients, but really haven't been able to find a wealth of info on the net about this.


mine drink more under the CMH.


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## Lucky Luke (Mar 4, 2020)

Neoangelo147 said:


> Some more bud porn from my Blueberry cut.
> 
> This Friday will be week 6 of flower.
> 
> ...


Thats beautiful


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## ISK (Mar 4, 2020)

.Smoke said:


> Trying it out now between 2- 1000w hps. Harvest in a week or 2. Will see if it makes a difference.


I was thinking of just replacing the 600 HPS with the 315 CMH.....but your post inspired me to add the CMH along side of the HPS.

The downside is the tent temp has risen, but I should be able to manage the extra heat (I cranked up the exhaust fan speed controller)

anyhow...thanks everyone for your feedback


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## gr865 (Mar 4, 2020)

ISK said:


> I was thinking of just replacing the 600 HPS with the 315 CMH.....but your post inspired me to add the CMH along side of the HPS.
> 
> The downside is the tent temp has risen, but I should be able to manage the extra heat (I cranked up the exhaust fan speed controller)
> 
> ...


Can you seperate the ballast from the lamp. If you can move the ballast out of the tent, you can get longer power cables for them.


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## .Smoke (Mar 4, 2020)

ISK said:


> I was thinking of just replacing the 600 HPS with the 315 CMH.....but your post inspired me to add the CMH along side of the HPS.
> 
> The downside is the tent temp has risen, but I should be able to manage the extra heat (I cranked up the exhaust fan speed controller)
> 
> ...


You'll be happy you did...
Glad to help out


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## Neoangelo147 (Mar 4, 2020)




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## farmingfisherman (Mar 4, 2020)

Hey total newbie indoor grower using both a Sun System Boss 315 3100k and two SF-1000 leds in a 4 x 4 tent. I'm looking for any advice on if dimming may or may not be a good idea when using a 315.. I've been told dimming the light changes the spectrum and there for shouldn't be done. The info I have read was for HPS/MH bulbs and didn't mention CMH. If this is the case then why does Sun Systems make my light with a dimmer? Also the light hangs the bulb horizontally not vertically, could this be why they include a dimmer, does this change the way the bulb operates? I'm starting week 3 or 4 depending on your point of view and so far plants appear pretty happy but I have had to raise lights repeatedly because of stretch. One plant a Sativa has appeared to have suffered stress from being too close to the light, yellowing fan leaves that eventually get crispy. I'm trying to train her down to match the rest of the canopy but unfortunately I'm running out of room. Suggestions or advice from other more experienced CMH growers is much appreciated.


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## Hempire828 (Mar 5, 2020)

@ 9 weeks my 315 is at 24 inches!! The buds are rock hard and beautiful!!!


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## .Smoke (Mar 5, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> Hey total newbie indoor grower using both a Sun System Boss 315 3100k and two SF-1000 leds in a 4 x 4 tent. I'm looking for any advice on if dimming may or may not be a good idea when using a 315.. I've been told dimming the light changes the spectrum and there for shouldn't be done. The info I have read was for HPS/MH bulbs and didn't mention CMH. If this is the case then why does Sun Systems make my light with a dimmer? Also the light hangs the bulb horizontally not vertically, could this be why they include a dimmer, does this change the way the bulb operates? I'm starting week 3 or 4 depending on your point of view and so far plants appear pretty happy but I have had to raise lights repeatedly because of stretch. One plant a Sativa has appeared to have suffered stress from being too close to the light, yellowing fan leaves that eventually get crispy. I'm trying to train her down to match the rest of the canopy but unfortunately I'm running out of room. Suggestions or advice from other more experienced CMH growers is much appreciated.


The only issue I'm seeing is nute burn all around on the tips of the leaves. Not light issues.
With the size your plants are with the cmh they should be under 52-55k Lux with no problem.
My 315 is in a batwing about 16"-20" above the canopy with no issues.


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## .Smoke (Mar 5, 2020)

Hempire828 said:


> @ 9 weeks my 315 is at 24 inches!! The buds are rock hard and beautiful!!!
> View attachment 4496247


nice.


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## ISK (Mar 5, 2020)

gr865 said:


> Can you seperate the ballast from the lamp. If you can move the ballast out of the tent, you can get longer power cables for them.


I do have both ballasts outside the tent


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## farmingfisherman (Mar 5, 2020)

.Smoke said:


> The only issue I'm seeing is nute burn all around on the tips of the leaves. Not light issues.
> With the size your plants are with the cmh they should be under 52-55k Lux with no problem.
> My 315 is in a batwing about 16"-20" above the canopy with no issues.
> View attachment 4496248
> ...


 Nutrient issue is something I thought about but with the amount of food I've been giving I was leaning more towards a deficiency, I've been feeding with a bottled organic approach and have been feeding on the lighter side. I hope the near full strength feed I gave yesterday doesn't come back and bite me in the ass. Any knowledge on the dimming vs light height?


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## .Smoke (Mar 5, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> Nutrient issue is something I thought about but with the amount of food I've been giving I was leaning more towards a deficiency, I've been feeding with a bottled organic approach and have been feeding on the lighter side. I hope the near full strength feed I gave yesterday doesn't come back and bite me in the ass. Any knowledge on the dimming vs light height?


Knowledge, not really I guess. Personal preference I would raise a light or diffuse it before I dimmed it.

For instance, I just dropped a new seed. Tap root popped, so she's in her pot, in my veg tent under a 1kW hps, but thanks to my (patent pending) Glove Cup  , the light is diffused to 9k lux for her...100% success rate this way believe it or not...(so far..not tempting the gods here or anything...)

But no. Personally I wouldn't dim. This one will be getting 57k Lux in about 2 weeks anyways...
My 2 cents


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## farmingfisherman (Mar 5, 2020)

.Smoke said:


> Knowledge, not really I guess. Personal preference I would raise a light or diffuse it before I dimmed it.
> 
> For instance, I just dropped a new seed. Tap root popped, so she's in her pot, in my veg tent under a 1kW hps, but thanks to my (patent pending) Glove Cup  , the light is diffused to 9k lux for her...100% success rate this way believe it or not...(so far..not tempting the gods here or anything...)
> View attachment 4496540
> ...


Very clever!


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## Jakkar (Mar 5, 2020)

A view in one of my rooms. 315s with big hoods. The close up bud shot is from seed. It’s from my gorilla glue that I accidentally pollinated when I was looking for new strains, a couples males slid through.


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## farmingfisherman (Mar 5, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> Very clever!


How does she breath with the latex over her like that?


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## .Smoke (Mar 7, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> How does she breath with the latex over her like that?


There are 2- 1"x3" openings I cut out on each side of the cup from bottom about 1/2 way up.

Here's the first properly dried bud I smoked today from that Skywalker OG btw. I do also have a 24w UVB light right next to the CMH for the sole purpose of trichome production.








SolarSystem® UVB


The latest generation high output UVB T5 fluorescent bulb. This system is perfect for a single light in a tent or several hundred lights in a large commercial operation.




californialightworks.com




(Heh. Just noticed they're sold out. Interesting...)

Needless to say, I'm happy with the results


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## Jakkar (Mar 8, 2020)

.Smoke said:


> There are 2- 1"x3" openings I cut out on each side of the cup from bottom about 1/2 way up.
> 
> Here's the first properly dried bud I smoked today from that Skywalker OG btw. I do also have a 24w UVB light right next to the CMH for the sole purpose of trichome production.
> 
> ...


was there a noticeable difference with the addition of the UVB?


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## .Smoke (Mar 8, 2020)

Jakkar said:


> was there a noticeable difference with the addition of the UVB?


I've never ran this strain before so unfortunately dont have a base to measure from.


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## Jakkar (Mar 8, 2020)

gotcha, wasn’t sure there would be much benefit to run along side cmh considering how much the lights already produce.


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## .Smoke (Mar 8, 2020)

Jakkar said:


> gotcha, wasn’t sure there would be much benefit to run along side cmh considering how much the lights already produce.


I've heard mixed reviews on that. Some claim cmh=great uvb output. Some say it's quite minimal. I use the Phillips 3100k, so I figure I'm giving them the best shot possible.
Like I said though, seems like there's a lot of mixed reviews but very little DATA as far as cmh/uvb.

Its be nice if they'd fucking reclass the damn plant already so we can start getting real info/testing on growing instead of having to rely on "bro science" 
Until then, I'm running both


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## NugHeuser (Mar 10, 2020)

How often do you guys change out your 315 bulbs?


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## Jakkar (Mar 10, 2020)

NugHeuser said:


> How often do you guys change out your 315 bulbs?


 I’ve been using the same bulbs for over a year now. They don’t seem to be slowing up. Using Phillips 3100k


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## gr865 (Mar 10, 2020)

Phillips says their bulbs last 12,000 to 20,000 hours.
5 week veg and 10 week flower are about 1,700 hours.

My hort store guys says he sees most folks changing them after 4 or 5 grows.
My bulbs are on their 4th run and I plan on changing them next grow.


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## farmingfisherman (Mar 19, 2020)

Little update on my 315 CMH and LED grow. 

38 days since I flipped to 12/12


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## 2easy (Mar 30, 2020)




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## gr865 (Mar 30, 2020)

I am sure this has been ask before. I have run my 315's for 4 to 5 grows, not near the hours the lamp should last but my last grow the buds are kind of airy, not tight firm buds I am used too.
My hort shop guys says 4 to 5 grows is about right but what are you seeing?


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## NugHeuser (Apr 1, 2020)

gr865 said:


> I am sure this has been ask before. I have run my 315's for 4 to 5 grows, not near the hours the lamp should last but my last grow the buds are kind of airy, not tight firm buds I am used too.
> My hort shop guys says 4 to 5 grows is about right but what are you seeing?


Thanks for sharing. I've noticed my buds have been more on the airy side the past couple grows, I'm on about my 5th with my first go of cmh. I'm definitely ready for some new bulbs. Still nothing stacked up to the first run with the new bulbs, so I'm curious to see if the same happens when I buy new bulbs


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## gr865 (Apr 1, 2020)

NugHeuser said:


> Thanks for sharing. I've noticed my buds have been more on the airy side the past couple grows, I'm on about my 5th with my first go of cmh. I'm definitely ready for some new bulbs. Still nothing stacked up to the first run with the new bulbs, so I'm curious to see if the same happens when I buy new bulbs


Thinking back, well as much as this old mind can thank, and looking at pics of my past grows, the first two grows off the last new bulbs where very tight. Now that being said, the difference in overall weights and not been that different. This last grow of just under 23 zips of smokable buds, although thin, and about 8 zips of untrimmed buds, would have been to hard to trim, so that will go directly in making FECO. 
My aver. on both my vertical and horizontal grow is about 25 zips, plus 6 zips of untrimmed buds. I don't weigh sugar leaf but I keep it to go into the FECO.


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## i0dineAlf (Apr 4, 2020)

Sorry to interrupt your thread... I've been running two double ended Gavita lights in a 10' x 10' tent. The light intensity appears to be too much for the plants, so I have to keep them at 425 watts each. The lights go up to 825 watts. Does anyone have any suggestions for 315 watt cmh lights ? I'll be using a 4' x 8' tent in the future. The height is a measley 6 foot. Thank you for your time!


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## TintEastwood (Apr 5, 2020)

i0dineAlf said:


> Sorry to interrupt your thread... I've been running two double ended Gavita lights in a 10' x 10' tent. The light intensity appears to be too much for the plants, so I have to keep them at 425 watts each. The lights go up to 825 watts. Does anyone have any suggestions for 315 watt cmh lights ? I'll be using a 4' x 8' tent in the future. The height is a measley 6 foot. Thank you for your time!











V-Lux Vertical CMH 315w LEC Grow Light Reflector Hood Kit Fixture 120-240v | eBay


Vertical Lamp 50/60 Hz. Square Wave. Built in Thermal Protection. We take our reputation seriously.



www.ebay.com





Big vertical hoods with ballast. Just need bulbs.


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## norcalreppin77 (Apr 5, 2020)

Everyone says different stuff. Can you get a pound off of a 315w cmh? I have alot of experience with hps. Im not worried about nutrient, genetics or any of that stuff. I've been growing 10 years. Im just worried about light coverage. In a 3x3 or 4x4 area will a cmh pull a pound easily or toughly.

Some girls right now under t5's getting mothered out. Just need to get lights for flowering now.


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## hillbill (Apr 5, 2020)

Just threw an old 250w Philips 4000k CMH into tent with COBs and Board to reach for some uv and infrared. Hadn’t used for about 7 years but I do have 4 bulbs with zero hours. I put it at finishing end of my perpetual. Something is going on here! 
Plants are stinking like hell and very much suddenly much stickier.

My Basils are loving it.


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## TintEastwood (Apr 5, 2020)

norcalreppin77 said:


> Everyone says different stuff. Can you get a pound off of a 315w cmh? I have alot of experience with hps. Im not worried about nutrient, genetics or any of that stuff. I've been growing 10 years. Im just worried about light coverage. In a 3x3 or 4x4 area will a cmh pull a pound easily or toughly.
> 
> Some girls right now under t5's getting mothered out. Just need to get lights for flowering now.


Using a pair of 315s in a 4x4.
Easy, with your experience.
They don't penetrate as well as hps.

I do coco. Here I start a run with 2 cmh.





Seven Sisters


These 'citigardens' reflectors are dreamy. Puts off a nice even gentle spread. Internal ballast. Opening sizes. 18 x 18 citigardens Replacing these. 11 x 13 neutrons - external ballast



www.rollitup.org


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## norcalreppin77 (Apr 5, 2020)

I was gonna use 1 315w with a white version of these containers. 40 per light...


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## hillbill (Apr 5, 2020)

That will work, old real hippie used restaurant sour cream containers with great success. Had a huge ac unit like it took up the back of the house.


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## i0dineAlf (Apr 5, 2020)

Has anyone noticed less crystals on their plants from switching from double ended lights to cmh ? Or less crystals from switching from cmh to led ?


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## Joedank (Apr 9, 2020)

i0dineAlf said:


> Has anyone noticed less crystals on their plants from switching from double ended lights to cmh ? Or less crystals from switching from cmh to led ?


There is a YouTube vid showing higher thc % between cmh and hps 
Cmh won hands down.


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## Bowser1226 (Apr 14, 2020)

Hi everybody, I've been reading through this thread for days now, and I'm a bit confused. I'm in Canada, and I'm really considering buying a 315 bulb ballast combo, but apparently all ballasts don't run as well as others with the Philips bulbs? As far as I can tell, these Philips bulbs are far superior to any other? Anyway, thanks for reading. Any help is much appreciated.


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## norcalreppin77 (Apr 16, 2020)

Bowser1226 said:


> Hi everybody, I've been reading through this thread for days now, and I'm a bit confused. I'm in Canada, and I'm really considering buying a 315 bulb ballast combo, but apparently all ballasts don't run as well as others with the Philips bulbs? As far as I can tell, these Philips bulbs are far superior to any other? Anyway, thanks for reading. Any help is much appreciated.


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## GreenNorth (May 4, 2020)

Gelato 41 from Growers Choice. Flowered with Philips 315w bulb. Happy growing everyone in these tough times..


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## farmingfisherman (May 4, 2020)

@GreenNorth Back at you!


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## i0dineAlf (May 4, 2020)

Anyone else have to keep their Vivonsun 315's 30 inches away from the plants otherwise they're super unhappy ?


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## Apalchen (May 5, 2020)

i0dineAlf said:


> Anyone else have to keep their Vivonsun 315's 30 inches away from the plants otherwise they're super unhappy ?


In veg? And what size tent or space?


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## i0dineAlf (May 5, 2020)

In veg, 4 x 8 tent.


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## Apalchen (May 5, 2020)

i0dineAlf said:


> In veg, 4 x 8 tent.


Yeah that's a good distance for veg, I've noticed being to close in veg with the 315 makes the plant look like it has a cal/mag problem. Purpling of stems and droopy leaves.


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## i0dineAlf (May 5, 2020)

Apalchen said:


> Yeah that's a good distance for veg, I've noticed being to close in veg with the 315 makes the plant look like it has a cal/mag problem. Purpling of stems and droopy leaves.


What distance do you recommend for flowering ? I'm guessing the plants will be around 18 inches then ?


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## cryptogrow420 (Jun 22, 2020)

315 watt vertical LEC. 
Alien Cookies 16 days flowering.


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## Patito92 (Jul 12, 2020)

I'm considering a switch to LEC for my next grow. Currently I have two 600w HPS and four 200w COBs in a 4m² area. Wich should be better, to keep the two HPS and replace each COB with a 150w LEC (or two 315) or to replace everything with two 945w LECs and grow in a 3x1.5m area?


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## oldman60 (Jul 12, 2020)

Before you think about the 945w how much head room do you have? I run double 315's and about 24" to the
canopy works well.


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## Patito92 (Jul 12, 2020)

oldman60 said:


> Before you think about the 945w how much head room do you have? I run double 315's and about 24" to the
> canopy works well.


About 2,5 meters I think. I grow in a 3x3m room. Also I have AC and a pretty good extraction system, no issues with temperature.


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## Patito92 (Jul 12, 2020)

LECs are kind of a new thing where I live, not much options and they're heavily overpriced. A 315w with the ballast and hood costs maybe an average monthly salary, like four times the price of a 600w HPS kit. The 945w one I saw costed oddly about the same as an average 315w kit, this one:


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## Blue back (Jul 13, 2020)

Patito92 said:


> LECs are kind of a new thing where I live, not much options and they're heavily overpriced. A 315w with the ballast and hood costs maybe an average monthly salary, like four times the price of a 600w HPS kit. The 945w one I saw costed oddly about the same as an average 315w kit, this one:


4 times as much? That's not true a 315 cost between $100 and $400. Average for a real good one is around $250 and uses half the electricity as a HPS 600 with way less heat to cool down. It's also a way better grow light. Now u can pick up a 600 or 1000 dirt cheap used because everyone is switching to CMH and LED. For risen production a CMH can't be beat.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Jul 13, 2020)

Patito92 said:


> LECs are kind of a new thing where I live, not much options and they're heavily overpriced. A 315w with the ballast and hood costs maybe an average monthly salary, like four times the price of a 600w HPS kit. The 945w one I saw costed oddly about the same as an average 315w kit, this one:


That 945w DE is going to put off some heat...equivalent to a 1000w DE.


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## Humboldtcalikidd (Jul 14, 2020)

bob223 said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> Im a long time lurker but do not usually post. But i decided to take the dive and and switch from a 1000w hps to a 315lec for the warm summer months. I have been researching these light and reading posts on multiple forums. I find that most of the posts get off topic and lack any really information or pictures of what people are actually doing with these lights.
> 
> ...


315 2x4tent promix,ffof,perlite in 5 gallon pots


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## CrunchBerries (Aug 10, 2020)

Hey now,
Can you start seeds under a sun system 315 w lec if the ballast is turned all the way down to the lowest setting? Or would a fluorescent be better suited for the job? Thanks in advance.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Aug 10, 2020)

CrunchBerries said:


> Hey now,
> Can you start seeds under a sun system 315 w lec if the ballast is turned all the way down to the lowest setting? Or would a fluorescent be better suited for the job? Thanks in advance.


I start under fluorescent, after they have a few sets of leaves I will move them to the cmh keeping the light a good 3 feet for the first several days to a week. That is just my regimen.


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## CrunchBerries (Aug 10, 2020)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> I start under fluorescent, after they have a few sets of leaves I will move them to the cmh keeping the light a good 3 feet for the first several days to a week. That is just my regimen.


Thanks for the reply


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## farmingfisherman (Aug 10, 2020)

CrunchBerries said:


> Hey now,
> Can you start seeds under a sun system 315 w lec if the ballast is turned all the way down to the lowest setting? Or would a fluorescent be better suited for the job? Thanks in advance.


Have to agree with @ilovetoskiatalta (snowboarded their in the off season) the fluorescent light is my personal choice for veg or a led equiv to them. The 315 I've been told doesn't work as well when dimmed down. I've got one that can be dimmed and was advised when I was running it to not do so because it changed the spectrum the light puts out.


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## oldman60 (Aug 10, 2020)

LED shop lights work great for seedlings and veg, cheap and easy works for the full veg cycle.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Aug 10, 2020)

oldman60 said:


> LED shop lights work great for seedlings and veg, cheap and easy works for the full veg cycle.


I did change the bulbs to 4000k horticulture bulbs though...just my .02


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## Blue back (Aug 10, 2020)

I veg completely under T5's. 24 hr to keep them shorter and stout. May seem backwards but plants stretch more under non continues light. They stretch in the dark in search of light. But CMH are very good veg lights also. I just wouldn't start them under that much light.


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## oldman60 (Aug 10, 2020)

Blue back said:


> I veg completely under T5's. 24 hr to keep them shorter and stout. May seem backwards but plants stretch more under non continues light. They stretch in the dark in search of light. But CMH are very good veg lights also. I just wouldn't start them under that much light.


24 hrs. of 5500k led works for me.


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## hillbill (Aug 11, 2020)

CMH in 3000k to 4000k will veg just fine but full power will demand some room.


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## Patito92 (Aug 31, 2020)

Blue back said:


> 4 times as much? That's not true a 315 cost between $100 and $400. Average for a real good one is around $250 and uses half the electricity as a HPS 600 with way less heat to cool down. It's also a way better grow light. Now u can pick up a 600 or 1000 dirt cheap used because everyone is switching to CMH and LED. For risen production a CMH can't be beat.View attachment 4623160


That's how it is where I live, LECs are very overpriced. Switching to full LEC (same wattage) is not an option in my foreseeable future. But maybe I'll replace one at a time.


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## cryptogrow420 (Sep 2, 2020)

Northern lights - so stinky and sticky


----------



## oldman60 (Sep 2, 2020)

cryptogrow420 said:


> Northern lights - so stinky and sticky


Beautifully done!


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## CrunchBerries (Sep 3, 2020)

Are you supposed to dial back your ballast when you are close to chop?


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## oldman60 (Sep 3, 2020)

No it should be at full power, some ballasts have a 10% boost built in for flowering.


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## bodhipop (Sep 11, 2020)

I apologize if this has been posted before. Found this article helpful while in the market for a new bulb for my Sunsystem LEC 315





Ceramic Metal Halide CMH 315W Lamp Comparison Test Data & Review


<iframe src=




growershouse.com





What is everyone's favorite bulb? If Phillips, which 3100k version? Also, does the bulb pull straight out or twist...lol


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## Blue back (Sep 11, 2020)

The Horitilux has the most uv rays. All other bulbs have a protective film in them. Expensive though. Otherwise the phillips. It twist a little


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## weednerd.anthony.850 (Nov 6, 2020)

Hey guys, a quick question for LEC users, I’m sure this has been asked many times but I am getting all my gear together to set up a new grow since I moved, and I am strongly considering LEC instead of 1k HPS like I’ve always used, but as far as having enough wattage per sq ft for yield, and also the proper distance from plants for LECs how many 315s should I use for a 5x5 with 7’ ceilings? I’ve read a good bit on the topic, but I can’t decide if I should run 2 or 3 for my old 1 k HPS setup to be revamped, as I know their footprints are pretty small... Sorry for the very wordy post, any suggestions or recommendations would be greatly appreciated! Have a dank day!


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## RyanWestCoast (Nov 6, 2020)

New to the 315 club. Was previously a 600w HID grower for 6 years. The hydro store told me one 315w with a Phillips 3100K would be enough for a 4x4 area to veg and flower. My question is will a 315W actually be enough to flower? I don't mind buying another 315w to hang in there. I just want to make sure...

Hang height of 22-24" should be okay correct? What about the 10-15% boost on the ballast up to 350w, is it okay to use that without damage? If it lessens the bulb life I don't care, money isn't the issue here.

Here's what all my plants look like right now, 2x2x3ft tall. Total of 6 plants in 3 gallon buckets of pure coco. I just lollypopped them and put back into the tent. Canopy picture is about 3 days after lollypopping. Cheers


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 6, 2020)

weednerd.anthony.850 said:


> Hey guys, a quick question for LEC users, I’m sure this has been asked many times but I am getting all my gear together to set up a new grow since I moved, and I am strongly considering LEC instead of 1k HPS like I’ve always used, but as far as having enough wattage per sq ft for yield, and also the proper distance from plants for LECs how many 315s should I use for a 5x5 with 7’ ceilings? I’ve read a good bit on the topic, but I can’t decide if I should run 2 or 3 for my old 1 k HPS setup to be revamped, as I know their footprints are pretty small... Sorry for the very wordy post, any suggestions or recommendations would be greatly appreciated! Have a dank day!


For a 5x5 you might get away with 1 315 but you would need to also supplement with led to get the coverage you'd like to see. If that isn't a option or something you are interested in then I'd think about a 630 fixture. The problem with two 315's is the footprint that they provide. I did my first grow in a 4 x 4 with 1 315 cmh and two cheap china made led panels and had great results other than the stuff a newbie has to deal and learn about. If it was me and I had the budget I would go with one 315 and then buy 4 100 watt led bars and surround the 315 with them. Are you planning on only using the cmh for flower or are you going to use it all the way threw start to finish? Personally I'd use it only in the final stages of growing the way people did when the lights first came out. The UV they put out is pretty intense and can really cause the plants stress if you don't know what you are doing as I learned in the end, but take that with a grain of salt cause it was my first indoor grow. Photo below was my science project from last winter..


----------



## farmingfisherman (Nov 6, 2020)

RyanWestCoast said:


> New to the 315 club. Was previously a 600w HID grower for 6 years. The hydro store told me one 315w with a Phillips 3100K would be enough for a 4x4 area to veg and flower. My question is will a 315W actually be enough to flower? I don't mind buying another 315w to hang in there. I just want to make sure...
> 
> Hang height of 22-24" should be okay correct? What about the 10-15% boost on the ballast up to 350w, is it okay to use that without damage? If it lessens the bulb life I don't care, money isn't the issue here.
> 
> Here's what all my plants look like right now, 2x2x3ft tall. Total of 6 plants in 3 gallon buckets of pure coco. I just lollypopped them and put back into the tent. Canopy picture is about 3 days after lollypopping. Cheers


One 315 is good really for only about 3 x 3 space. I'd supplement if you can with another style of light to get a good overall coverage. I just posted to someone else who is asking about using CMH in a 5 x 5 and they will need at least a 630 to cover that space. Good luck and have fun with whatever you decide on.


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## RyanWestCoast (Nov 6, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> One 315 is good really for only about 3 x 3 space. I'd supplement if you can with another style of light to get a good overall coverage. I just posted to someone else who is asking about using CMH in a 5 x 5 and they will need at least a 630 to cover that space. Good luck and have fun with whatever you decide on.


Currently the plants in my 4x4 only really take up a 3x3 space, there is about 4-6" space around the canopy. Ill go with one for now and see how its goes. I have a 4ft 4 bulb T5 and a 2ft x6" wide fullsprecum LED bar I could put in there too if needed. Thanks!


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## gr865 (Nov 6, 2020)

weednerd.anthony.850 said:


> Hey guys, a quick question for LEC users, I’m sure this has been asked many times but I am getting all my gear together to set up a new grow since I moved, and I am strongly considering LEC instead of 1k HPS like I’ve always used, but as far as having enough wattage per sq ft for yield, and also the proper distance from plants for LECs how many 315s should I use for a 5x5 with 7’ ceilings? I’ve read a good bit on the topic, but I can’t decide if I should run 2 or 3 for my old 1 k HPS setup to be revamped, as I know their footprints are pretty small... Sorry for the very wordy post, any suggestions or recommendations would be greatly appreciated! Have a dank day!


A 315 CMH covers approx 3x3, I run two 315's in a 4 x 4 in a straight horizontal grows, with about 1 x 4 as space for fan and air intake, You can look in my, signature for my grows.


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## oldman60 (Nov 6, 2020)

weednerd.anthony.850 said:


> Hey guys, a quick question for LEC users, I’m sure this has been asked many times but I am getting all my gear together to set up a new grow since I moved, and I am strongly considering LEC instead of 1k HPS like I’ve always used, but as far as having enough wattage per sq ft for yield, and also the proper distance from plants for LECs how many 315s should I use for a 5x5 with 7’ ceilings? I’ve read a good bit on the topic, but I can’t decide if I should run 2 or 3 for my old 1 k HPS setup to be revamped, as I know their footprints are pretty small... Sorry for the very wordy post, any suggestions or recommendations would be greatly appreciated! Have a dank day!


I would use 2 - 315's each one gives a bit better than 3x3. 
Good luck and keep it green.


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## TintEastwood (Nov 6, 2020)

You can add more juice later.
I added strips and dropped one 315 for this run. Approx 4x4.


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 6, 2020)

TintEastwood said:


> You can add more juice later.
> I added strips and dropped one 315 for this run. Approx 4x4.
> 
> View attachment 4735537


Love seeing the different styles of growing each of us has, what are the plants up front? Guessing you have some really tall ceilings..


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## TintEastwood (Nov 6, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> Love seeing the different styles of growing each of us has, what are the plants up front? Guessing you have some really tall ceilings..


Fortunately 8ft.

Front row is..
Afghani x NL
JOTI Goji Black Funk Dawg
JOTI Blue God


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## Blindnslow (Nov 6, 2020)

Just started growing with a 315w in a 4x4 for veg and a 630w in a 4x4 for flower. Much better yields than the 400w hps i had in a 3x3 and faster turn arounds with separate tents. Glad i switched.


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## ilovetoskiatalta (Nov 6, 2020)

weednerd.anthony.850 said:


> Hey guys, a quick question for LEC users, I’m sure this has been asked many times but I am getting all my gear together to set up a new grow since I moved, and I am strongly considering LEC instead of 1k HPS like I’ve always used, but as far as having enough wattage per sq ft for yield, and also the proper distance from plants for LECs how many 315s should I use for a 5x5 with 7’ ceilings? I’ve read a good bit on the topic, but I can’t decide if I should run 2 or 3 for my old 1 k HPS setup to be revamped, as I know their footprints are pretty small... Sorry for the very wordy post, any suggestions or recommendations would be greatly appreciated! Have a dank day!


This is not a plug but this explains the spacing of a 315cmh. I am very happy with this bulb. The 315 really shines when you keep them 2.5' or 3.0' apart. I keep them at 30" apart center of bulb to center of bulb. I also use a Phantom 2 with remote ballast.





Log In ‹ EYE Hortilux — WordPress







eyehortilux.com


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## gr865 (Nov 6, 2020)

This was a 24 plant SOG.

I have thought of moving the lamp to the extreme sides of the tent and then tilting them slightly back over the plants. Did it a few years ago with one 315 and a SS400 led. It worked ok.


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 6, 2020)

Blindnslow said:


> Just started growing with a 315w in a 4x4 for veg and a 630w in a 4x4 for flower. Much better yields than the 400w hps i had in a 3x3 and faster turn arounds with separate tents. Glad i switched.


You have any photos of the results of each.. I'm torn in the thinking of using the cmh instead of a led for veg. Totally get the use of the 630 cmh for flower @ColoradoHighGrower but still love to the pics if you have any of the veg results. Cheers


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## weednerd.anthony.850 (Nov 6, 2020)

Wow guys thanks for all the replies! I think I will run two 325s side by side in my situation since it is a 5x5, I rather be a bit overkill with light than not enough if anything, and while I’m at it would be cheaper to get a 630 fixture ? I’ve heard two 315s would be better even if a bit more expensive as in case of ballast failure or any issues you can still have some light on the girls while you fix rather than 630 possibly giving out even if rare still possible and the girls having their light cycle thrown off scares me lol


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 6, 2020)

weednerd.anthony.850 said:


> Wow guys thanks for all the replies! I think I will run two 325s side by side in my situation since it is a 5x5, I rather be a bit overkill with light than not enough if anything, and while I’m at it would be cheaper to get a 630 fixture ? I’ve heard two 315s would be better even if a bit more expensive as in case of ballast failure or any issues you can still have some light on the girls while you fix rather than 630 possibly giving out even if rare still possible and the girls having their light cycle thrown off scares me lol


I think both are true plus it will allow you to move them up or down as needed to manage canopy height.


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## weednerd.anthony.850 (Nov 6, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> I think both are true plus it will allow you to move them up or down as needed to manage canopy height.


Thanks man that’s where I was leaning towards with my reading and all but I’m about to pull the trigger this weekend on lights and I will have a journal soon as I get back on track and pop some beans, much love 315 users !


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## daddy32992 (Nov 7, 2020)

Hey guys, would I be good with a 630w CMH in a 5x5? I have one that works very nicely in a 3x3 but looking to upgrade.


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 7, 2020)

daddy32992 said:


> Hey guys, would I be good with a 630w CMH in a 5x5? I have one that works very nicely in a 3x3 but looking to upgrade.


Damn it works well in a 3 x 3? Surprised you don't cook the plants in that small of space!


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## daddy32992 (Nov 7, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> Damn it works well in a 3 x 3? Surprised you don't cook the plants in that small of space!


Nope my bad I meant that a 315 works well in 3x3. I'm wondering what you guys think of a sunsystem 630 for a 5x5 (4 plant max)


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 7, 2020)

daddy32992 said:


> Nope my bad I meant that a 315 works well in 3x3. I'm wondering what you guys think of a sunsystem 630 for a 5x5 (4 plant max)


I bet it would rock at 3 x 3 well. 5 x 5 would be a stretch. You want at least 35 watts if I recall correctly per foot. You buy the tent yet? If not go with a 4 x 4 and you would be set. You planning on using it for both veg and bloom or only bloom?


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 7, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> I bet it would rock at 3 x 3 well. 5 x 5 would be a stretch. You want at least 35 watts if I recall correctly per foot. You buy the tent yet? If not go with a 4 x 4 and you would be set. You planning on using it for both veg and bloom or only bloom?


 If you own the 5 x 5 already then you could add some led to help fill in the gaps. Plenty of good strip led lights that will work nicely for that purpose these days. You have a budget you are trying to stay within?


----------



## daddy32992 (Nov 8, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> I bet it would rock at 3 x 3 well. 5 x 5 would be a stretch. You want at least 35 watts if I recall correctly per foot. You buy the tent yet? If not go with a 4 x 4 and you would be set. You planning on using it for both veg and bloom or only bloom?


Yup I cancelled it and got a 4x4. I plan on using it for both but I was thinking of doing the mixed spectrum setup with one 3100 K and 4200 K bulb


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 8, 2020)

daddy32992 said:


> Yup I cancelled it and got a 4x4. I plan on using it for both but I was thinking of doing the mixed spectrum setup with one 3100 K and 4200 K bulb


What light are you going to use? I'm not sure but I think one 4100k bulb should cover the space for veg.. The warmer the light during veg the more it will stretch.


----------



## ColoradoHighGrower (Nov 8, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> For a 5x5 you might get away with 1 315 but you would need to also supplement with led to get the coverage you'd like to see. If that isn't a option or something you are interested in then I'd think about a 630 fixture. The problem with two 315's is the footprint that they provide. I did my first grow in a 4 x 4 with 1 315 cmh and two cheap china made led panels and had great results other than the stuff a newbie has to deal and learn about. If it was me and I had the budget I would go with one 315 and then buy 4 100 watt led bars and surround the 315 with them. Are you planning on only using the cmh for flower or are you going to use it all the way threw start to finish? Personally I'd use it only in the final stages of growing the way people did when the lights first came out. The UV they put out is pretty intense and can really cause the plants stress if you don't know what you are doing as I learned in the end, but take that with a grain of salt cause it was my first indoor grow. Photo below was my science project from last winter..
> 
> View attachment 4735406
> View attachment 4735407


Love these photos!  Yep, like @farmingfisherman and others describe above, the 315s are perfect for ~3x3 feet. I grow in a bathtub that has an area of ~2.75x5.5 feet. My first few runs i only had a single SunSystems 315 lec hung in the center in that space, and definitely showed growth tapering off to either end of the tub. In the center directly under the unit, plants were smashed against the back wall and pushing the shower curtain out a good 6-8inches. I have since upgraded to two lights hung to divide the length of the space in thirds, and get much better and more even growth now.


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 8, 2020)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Love these photos!  Yep, like @farmingfisherman and others describe above, the 315s are perfect for ~3x3 feet. I grow in a bathtub that has an area of ~2.75x5.5 feet. My first few runs i only had a single SunSystems 315 lec hung in the center in that space, and definitely showed growth tapering off to either end of the tub. In the center directly under the unit, plants were smashed against the back wall and pushing the shower curtain out a good 6-8inches. I have since upgraded to two lights hung to divide the length of the space in thirds, and get much better and more even growth now.


Refresh my old man memory, do you veg under the 315's or use something else?


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## TintEastwood (Nov 8, 2020)

Different 315s.

The bigger taller on left is a vertical bulb with internal ballast. 18" x18" reflector opening. Gotta have the height for these.

The smaller is a horizontal bulb external ballast. 11"x9" reflector opening. IME, a great fit for smaller/shorter spaces.



I've run both. They work!


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 8, 2020)

TintEastwood said:


> Different 315s.
> 
> The bigger taller on left is a vertical bulb with internal ballast. 18" x18" reflector opening. Gotta have the height for these.
> 
> ...


The 315 does have many different ballast hood setups. I bought mine on a wim. Never again will I buy without researching better. I could have bought a 630 for the what I paid for the sun system boss..  Good light however.


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 8, 2020)

TintEastwood said:


> Different 315s.
> 
> The bigger taller on left is a vertical bulb with internal ballast. 18" x18" reflector opening. Gotta have the height for these.
> 
> ...


Grow shop swore that the hozo provides better coverage? You notice any difference?


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## TintEastwood (Nov 8, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> Grow shop swore that the hozo provides better coverage? You notice any difference?


No diff noticed. Ideally it would be nice to see a par map of both.

I've also ran mixed, 3k & 4k with no issues.

Sadly my 2 vertical 315s are sitting unused! Build strips over the summer for something to do. Lol


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## Blindnslow (Nov 8, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> You have any photos of the results of each.. I'm torn in the thinking of using the cmh instead of a led for veg. Totally get the use of the 630 cmh for flower @ColoradoHighGrower but still love to the pics if you have any of the veg results. Cheers


No pics but i can say they jump up fast from the start under the 315. once i put it under the 630 new growth nodes are alot closer and keeps it from getting out of hand height wise.


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## daddy32992 (Nov 8, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> What light are you going to use? I'm not sure but I think one 4100k bulb should cover the space for veg.. The warmer the light during veg the more it will stretch.


I'm going with the Sun System LEC 630. I have a 315 by them I plan to use in another tent, had great results using it throughout. Come to think of it, I did have some stretching issues (315 used 3100 K bulb) and the stems were bending pretty bad. I figure if I use the mixed spectrum it would be better if I'm using it for flower and veg. What do you guys think?


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 8, 2020)

daddy32992 said:


> I'm going with the Sun System LEC 630. I have a 315 by them I plan to use in another tent, had great results using it throughout. Come to think of it, I did have some stretching issues (315 used 3100 K bulb) and the stems were bending pretty bad. I figure if I use the mixed spectrum it would be better if I'm using it for flower and veg. What do you guys think?


I'd run 2 veg bulbs and 2 bloom bulbs personally.. Think the results would be better for you.


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## hillbill (Nov 8, 2020)

I have used 3000k to 4000k in flower and average about 3700k in the tent.


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## daddy32992 (Nov 9, 2020)

farmingfisherman said:


> I'd run 2 veg bulbs and 2 bloom bulbs personally.. Think the results would be better for you.


Ok yeah I'm sold going to do 2 for flower/veg in a 4x4 and I've still got my 3x3/315 waiting I may use it for a veg tent idk yet just getting back into the hobby. Really excited


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## F1_Grower (Jan 19, 2021)

Yodaweed said:


> <3 thank you guys, love this section of the forum, so many helpful people , information and awesome bud pics  Wish i could give you guys more than one like.


How do you like a thread or comment? Thank you kindly.
And right now I'm deciding which brand to get 4 to 5 cmh units which all are vertical hoods, except for the dimilux 630 is a dual lamp that lies horizontal and has separate cool air intake and out take above, whereas the phantom has only one


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## F1_Grower (Jan 19, 2021)

F1_Grower said:


> How do you like a thread or comment? Thank you kindly.
> And right now I'm deciding which brand to get 4 to 5 cmh units which all are vertical hoods, except for the dimilux 630 is a dual lamp that lies horizontal and has separate cool air intake and out take above, whereas the phantom has only one


I appologize im new and type long messages 
Phone died when I started taking pics lost message
I need help deciding between which 3 vertical 315cmh kits i should get for all 3 of my rooms. 
+New vegg/flower room 5 x 5 is master bath, im growing led 250w and bare bulb vert 315 cmh in cool tube going up to attic exhaust port from 3 in 1 light fan heater combo which i reinstalled a 20A -125 V plug in outlet bc why not. I like how the one room in this house that s a 15A breaker the atrium i first chose to grow in and i can tell ya running anything 600w or higher for long time on extension without proper gauge will melt it or anything in contact. I've done a lot of noob mistakes but has been an ever stellar. Learning experience hvac, electrical,, hst, lst, super, monster, ppm, ph, ec , video, integrated pest management solutions, damb those cali aphids, what wrong with bud im pointed at in pic pls 
i havent looked up any threads for RIU folks that have tried growing indoor in a bath tub but any hints tips or tricks welcomed.. we are demo bathroom come summer. In the bathtub river rock first with promix , volcanic pumice, perlute at bottom near mini French drain at bottom toward drain. My cuts for that are ice cream cake and katsu pheno hunting for just katsu to keep and to monster crop the kat keep her going so stelkar. and concentrate on perfecting that strain and gelato #41 even though im an og gas fan like WCSD aka kerosene kush, sfv , jedi, Darkstar og, deathstar og, yoda og, and good ole sensi star . But im also using each room to mass monster crop, veg for outdoor spring time.
The other room im setting up this week is a 5 x 8 walk through from master bedroom to bath, here i wanted to hang 3 vert with individual trellis like @gr865 open to suggestions

Main flower Room : 10 x 6 x 9 but im only using 8 x 5 due to double layers thivk mil mylar on black retrofitted atrium with 3 of the 4 walls having 10ft x 6ft glass sliders :/ I cracked and sealed two of the 3 sliders open with insulated foam board thick high R value but wish I just did all 3 walls flush with slated board like framing with sliver ducting tape sealing corners bc I got a lot of hot spots. I effed up wk 5 flower heat stress and mech issue sum pump no dry run setting:/ anyway i want to replace my two 1k watt hids mh, hps and possibly recessed leds even though the side monster cropped ones next to leds t5 n recessed are looking ever so exotic with dense nuggahe and exquisite terp profiles 3rd generation from my outdoor wk 2 flower 

I would like to have a scattered distributed/ hybrid lighting layout but not sure if I should get mogul adapter (either SS or phantom and PROPER ballast low frequency square wave tech) and take out glass cover and put horizontal in old hids (not like the big khaunas ) which i love that guys setup. I really want to put 3 315cmh phantoms in a triangle pattern surrounding a 630 w cmh by dimilux anlong side dmy 250w Full spec viaspectra led that I got two for 400$ 200ea with 1.7 u/mol and all same as ferrari , gavita ,lux. Or just get all 630 w dimi lux and daisy chained and vac in cool, out heat. And Im always looking to expand ops so not trying invest in 5 x 5 , 10 x 10 leds great for buy real deal setups pushing out packs so why invest in led but start building up my supply of efficient and effective like cmh. But im going crazy trying to guess heat issues and Compatibility with maybe what I already got but tjust the reflector switch out ballast n mogul adapter, or ss 315 lec cmh remotes x 10 and get rid of everything else. Check out pics and ill keep ya posted but some of indoor look horrible like heat stress and aphid damage lplease see for me lmk over nute? 

Im flushing rn but re thread, im ready to pull trigger in cmg but worried about heat, compatability meaning more along lines of versatility of use btwn vert and horizontal so, scrog


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## F1_Grower (Jan 19, 2021)

F1_Grower said:


> I appologize im new and type long messages
> Phone died when I started taking pics lost message
> I need help deciding between which 3 vertical 315cmh kits i should get for all 3 of my rooms.
> +New vegg/flower room 5 x 5 is master bath, im growing led 250w and bare bulb vert 315 cmh in cool tube going up to attic exhaust port from 3 in 1 light fan heater combo which i reinstalled a 20A -125 V plug in outlet bc why not. I like how the one room in this house that s a 15A breaker the atrium i first chose to grow in and i can tell ya running anything 600w or higher for long time on extension without proper gauge will melt it or anything in contact. I've done a lot of noob mistakes but has been an ever stellar. Learning experience hvac, electrical,, hst, lst, super, monster, ppm, ph, ec , video, integrated pest management solutions, damb those cali aphids, what wrong with bud im pointed at in pic pls View attachment 4800997
> ...


Here is other two rooms im setting up and need cmhs for , master bath tub grow and the 5 x 8 i want to trellis vert scrog 6 ea side in 10gal smart pots
Here is pics if my current grow setup which I know looks like a disaster right now but am moving the portabke ac out and cooling lights redirecting some of cool air intake through the hoods. So then I can setup 25 pound tanks to each ealed room. 
I love these zipper doors u can make and being able to semi see gals thru glass slider if I leave both of the double layered mylar walls open
Cheers


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## colocowboy (Jan 19, 2021)

Wow, you’ve been waiting to tell your tale! lol
I have used a tub space for my grow before, it’s actually not a bad place to do it. I mean you have access to drainage water supply and probably electricity nearby. Based on everything I’ve read about you so far, my biggest recommendation for you is to make sure you’re using a functional GFI on your electric. The other big recommendation would be not to mess around too much with a makeshift door like that, negative pressure will pull that thing apart and you’ll end up fighting a big fat mess in the end you’ll be way better off finding a tent that you can put on a makeshift topper for the tub. Don’t worry about cutting in a full sized vent as a sheetrock repair on that is easy/cheap!

so what are you doing? Convert you whole house to grow op?


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## F1_Grower (Jan 19, 2021)

colocowboy said:


> Wow, you’ve been waiting to tell your tale! lol
> I have used a tub space for my grow before, it’s actually not a bad place to do it. I mean you have access to drainage water supply and probably electricity nearby. Based on everything I’ve read about you so far, my biggest recommendation for you is to make sure you’re using a functional GFI on your electric. The other big recommendation would be not to mess around too much with a makeshift door like that, negative pressure will pull that thing apart and you’ll end up fighting a big fat mess in the end you’ll be way better off finding a tent that you can put on a makeshift topper for the tub. Don’t worry about cutting in a full sized vent as a sheetrock repair on that is easy/cheap!
> 
> so what are you doing? Convert you whole house to grow op?


ISo funny!!
Thank you. They are holding up so far so good but ur right ima do wall to wall insulation board silver side in works like mylar right? I used si much staple gun and 5 duff types of tape lol im just waiting to harvest, flipped on Nov 23 so almost there but this hardest part for me,

Fill, flush, fade, no water two day, cut

I think I should cut back on lengthy messages its hard in phone feel like I'm texting a girl,
now that I've introduced myself and should stick to topic im sorry. I decided to join riu o

It may sound like im overloading circuits but i think at time being if i don't go past 80% of total allowed on a 15a or 20a shud b all gravy, the breaker dosent trip, but a sub breaker would b nice.. is a gfi ground force indicator? I did see that green screw on back of 20A outlet and capped wires with correct colors not using and screwed any of those copper looking screws back down not in use. i installed with what was the light in the 3 in 1 docker switch to new outlet and remembered how everything was when I took apart. See i know as much as cutting power to where im working and reverse engineering.

Ii just feel like these se hps even at 32inches one at 110% other 100% not cutting it bc my vpd and aphids problem held me back, and wk 5 shouldn't left town.. my foliage so bare not li ke pics I've been seeing of og growers here,, i mean real og growers growing under street lamps light dep. Ill get there, but honestly I just love the whole plant sensimillia and feel like I have to make up a decade of not 'growing ' in the short time I picked it up from Sept 2020 bought 37 cuts from A Mook in Modesto put me on to katsu k and icc and just last wk an Ozzie got me gelato 41 cuts and rest is history, those clones have made hundreds more clones since then my room has evolved and I use zippers for
makeshift doorways bc im not a tent guy i like to retrofit whole rooms unless to dry n cute buds in cold garage bc 62 % and 60F important to me . I feel you thoughts its a pain bc any light leaks can cause hermit. But after harvesting its so so important freezing, getting my homie to make rosin solventless , that what a grow tent seen used for recently. to making live bubble hash, rosin , its endless, used stalks as firewood from outdoor etc but I want to grow own medicine . Sfv og like... i mean each breaker in thus home is 20A and up and corresponding gauge wire too but im one if those ppl who needs more and more. :/ im trying to chill tho but after college and civid came around , I went headstrong into this., like see i started indoor cannabis to practice mindfulness, patience, awareness, and heightening my consciousness, all of which is why I'm here right now on RIU. I gotta go to work but cheers!


**I just don't get why everyone else's nuggage look like exotic big ole colas and mine so small, if i don't get at least 2 packs under 2k hps, and 1k led then idk , I shudda mammoth sprayed and lost coast with painsorayyer all through vegg into flower bc I brought in aphids from outdoor clones and once they in hard to get off.

I did love going under canopy week 2 and 3 flower to spray upward under leaves looked like canopy blowing puffs iof sensi but taking the darn electric tape iff hids to wipe down glass sucked. . Yeah, that's my story but don't want to go against any proper forum etiquette , hijacking threads etc but still trying to descide between dimilux or more of say 3 x 3 spread nanolux, sun sys.
I just love to grow, and grow to live right now.
.
See I've been using the spare master bath since November harvest look how purp the katsu got amazing, the cured nugs is gelato #41 im focusing in now . See yall in flip side


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## F1_Grower (Jan 19, 2021)

daddy32992 said:


> Ok yeah I'm sold going to do 2 for flower/veg in a 4x4 and I've still got my 3x3/315 waiting I may use it for a veg tent idk yet just getting back into the hobby. Really excited


How many plants u plan 4 x 4? And how about medium? Which did u descide on? 315 brand model. Is it much cooler having seperate ballast? Is it better (more efficient)to cool heat source aka light rather than ambient room? Bc I feel like one can produce a pound under one 315 if vegged 6 to 7 weeks in 10 to 15 gals and scrog but two 315s in a 4x4 u can get over 1 lb


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## F1_Grower (Jan 19, 2021)

ThaMagnificent said:


> Interesting.... External ballast...This might bring some heat down alone?
> 
> You've given me that much more to consider now lol.... SS or these..Hmmm...


@ThaMagnificent i was wondering what area you live in and what your ambient (outside temps/ RH are plus what your home RH and temps are? ) are u sealed , co2? Does putting glass cover greatly affect lumens or uv rays? For me this will greatly affect descion being in nor cal bay area. Im leaning more towards phantom hydro farm bc of sealed glass and cooling capabilities and ability to remove and hang bare vert too. I have a 5 x 8 x 8 veg room and 10 x 6 x 9 flower room...I want to do a triangular pattern of of 3 in flower surrounding my 250w led. Any help deciding greatly appreciated rn. Thanks


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## F1_Grower (Jan 19, 2021)

colocowboy said:


> Wow, you’ve been waiting to tell your tale! lol
> I have used a tub space for my grow before, it’s actually not a bad place to do it. I mean you have access to drainage water supply and probably electricity nearby. Based on everything I’ve read about you so far, my biggest recommendation for you is to make sure you’re using a functional GFI on your electric. The other big recommendation would be not to mess around too much with a makeshift door like that, negative pressure will pull that thing apart and you’ll end up fighting a big fat mess in the end you’ll be way better off finding a tent that you can put on a makeshift topper for the tub. Don’t worry about cutting in a full sized vent as a sheetrock repair on that is easy/cheap!
> 
> so what are you doing? Convert you whole house to grow op?


I got a 20 A arc fault curcuit interruptor AFCI. To change switch to outlet.. was this the recommendation you made..
Thank you!!


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## colocowboy (Jan 20, 2021)

F1_Grower said:


> I got a 20 A arc fault curcuit interruptor AFCI. To change switch to outlet.. was this the recommendation you made..
> Thank you!!


I think it will keep you safe! Water and electricity don’t mix well and your officially full input! Man, make sure you leave a spot to sleep!


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## GrownAtHighAltitude (Jan 20, 2021)

I lit my entire room with CMH for $1000 by buying cheap fixtures on Ebay and Phillips lamps on sale. I researched through all the available LEDs, CMH, HPS, and fixture options and for my particular footprint (3x10.5) and climate (frozen cold right now) led me to just go with what was already working in tents. I upgraded from 400watt CMH retrofits in air cooled hoods. So glad to be done with those now 

I then added SolarCure lights in between for good measure. Excited to see results.


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## Humboldtcalikidd (Jan 26, 2021)

Cmh 315 Phillips bulb 3100k blue dream msnl genetics. Week 6 of flower


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## bodhipop (Jan 30, 2021)

Damn growmies, Phillips 3100k bulbs are up $20 bucks from the last time I checked.
Wish I would've stocked up when they were at $60.


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## F1_Grower (Jan 31, 2021)

Hi guys-
Just wanted to post update of my new bare 315 cmh vert grow setup. Its a 5 x 5 x 8 (bath tub) and a 5 x 8 x 8 master bath grow. Second ever grow , first cmh, first bare vert. Running gelato #41 clones, and pheno hunting for katsu in bathtub grow (5x5). My first grow in my other flip room with two 1k watt hids and two vert t5s , and 12 recessed full spect/blue_red leds was great except for aphids and wk 5 flower temp/lack of water stress :/ im harvesting first time indoor tomorrow at day 70 two wk flush. Ill attach pics of both griw rooms. I had to undo hardwire in the phantom ballast/reflector kits I got and re-hardwired to light fixture bracket and yes I got my gfci outlets installed on my 20A lines no problem! 

Have two viaspectra 250w leds (each supposedly replace a 600w hid) running at 60% , and two 315w cmh vert( will be adding a third) , the two t5s and gavita de 1000w are both off right now. Temps currently are 74 F lights on 66 F lights off and humidy 56 to 62 %. 

Soil Promix HP, A&N Sensi A+B, plusb52, and voodoo juice, PPM 400 - 450,pH 5.8 to 6.4.


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## Dape Green (Jan 31, 2021)

Here’s a 315 in a 4x4 days from harvest. Cmh grows beautiful buds.


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## colocowboy (Jan 31, 2021)

F1_Grower said:


> Hi guys-
> Just wanted to post update of my new bare 315 cmh vert grow setup. Its a 5 x 5 x 8 (bath tub) and a 5 x 8 x 8 master bath grow. Second ever grow , first cmh, first bare vert. Running gelato #41 clones, and pheno hunting for katsu in bathtub grow (5x5). My first grow in my other flip room with two 1k watt hids and two vert t5s , and 12 recessed full spect/blue_red leds was great except for aphids and wk 5 flower temp/lack of water stress :/ im harvesting first time indoor tomorrow at day 70 two wk flush. Ill attach pics of both griw rooms. I had to undo hardwire in the phantom ballast/reflector kits I got and re-hardwired to light fixture bracket and yes I got my gfci outlets installed on my 20A lines no problem!
> 
> Have two viaspectra 250w leds (each supposedly replace a 600w hid) running at 60% , and two 315w cmh vert( will be adding a third) , the two t5s and gavita de 1000w are both off right now. Temps currently are 74 F lights on 66 F lights off and humidy 56 to 62 %.
> ...


Damn, looking good bud!


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## F1_Grower (Jan 31, 2021)

colocowboy said:


> Damn, looking good bud!


Thank you @colocowboy ! Im excited to see where things go from here and hope to see big ole frosty colas like @Dape Green with these retrofitted 315 cmh and addition of co2 supplementation!


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## F1_Grower (Feb 5, 2021)

F1_Grower said:


> Thank you @colocowboy ! Im excited to see where things go from here and hope to see big ole frosty colas like @Dape Green with these retrofitted 315 cmh and addition of co2 supplementation!


Week 2 veg update Gelato #41

5 x 8 x 8
X 3 315w bare vert CMH 

5 x 5 x 8 
x2 250w viaspectra led, 1k watt mh,


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## hillbill (Feb 5, 2021)

Take care of your eyes with that bare CMH.


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## colocowboy (Feb 5, 2021)

Word, that’s a lot of extra UV.


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## GrownAtHighAltitude (Feb 5, 2021)

Also doesn't look like a whole lot of light is actually making it to those plants... The walls may need better diffused reflective material.

I would definitely consider some cheap vertical hoods some day.


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## F1_Grower (Feb 10, 2021)

colocowboy said:


> Word, that’s a lot of extra UV.


Did i make the cut? CLUB 315 ROCKS


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## Cloud Surfer (Feb 11, 2021)

Quick question for you cmh lovers.

Will running both bulbs in my SunSytems 630 be to intense for veg? Should I just use 1 bulb, and then switch both on for flowering? 

I've read that both bulbs is too much, but have also read that the plants will get use to it fairly quick? Not sure which theory is correct... this will be in a 5x9x7 tent utilizing a 4x4 footprint until I get it dialed in and the funds for another light.

Also, any insight on canopy distance? The manufacturer recommends 36in, but I've read distances anywhere 18in all the way up to the ceiling height and leaving it there? I plan on using the scrog technique.

Sorry for posing a question about a 630 in the club 315 thread, but I figured you ladies and gents would have some good first hand knowledge with these cmh lights.

You folks have some awesome looking grows going on in here.


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## Dape Green (Feb 11, 2021)

Cloud Surfer said:


> Quick question for you cmh lovers.
> 
> Will running both bulbs in my SunSytems 630 be to intense for veg? Should I just use 1 bulb, and then switch both on for flowering?
> 
> ...


That’s what I do, single bulb in veg and add the 2nd one in at flip.


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## colocowboy (Feb 11, 2021)

F1_Grower said:


> Did i make the cut? CLUB 315 ROCKS


Personally I love your grow! I have done shit just like this, brings back memories. Some of my best work was done in a space just like that.



Cloud Surfer said:


> Quick question for you cmh lovers.
> 
> Will running both bulbs in my SunSytems 630 be to intense for veg? Should I just use 1 bulb, and then switch both on for flowering?
> 
> ...


I don’t use mine for veg, induction and led FTW. I like to sculpt the structure of my plants with the veg lights, slow them, stack them, stretch them, etc. 

As far as distance from the light, with a reflector, I wouldn’t get closer than 18” but it seems strain dependent. I like about 18-24 inches 36 seems too far to really get the bud swelling imho.


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## CrunchBerries (Feb 12, 2021)

Is any one using or have experience with the Illuminar 315 lec? Any and all help is appreciated.


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## Rurumo (Feb 12, 2021)

CrunchBerries said:


> Is any one using or have experience with the Illuminar 315 lec? Any and all help is appreciated.


I have an iluminar 630 DE...not what you are asking about, but I'm impressed with the fixture and bulb quality. They use Japanese arc tubes.


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## CrunchBerries (Feb 12, 2021)

Rurumo said:


> I have an iluminar 630 DE...not what you are asking about, but I'm impressed with the fixture and bulb quality. They use Japanese arc tubes.


Thanks you. I was curious about the make and quality. I can’t seem to find any reviews on this brand.


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## hillbill (Feb 13, 2021)

Just did something very interesting with my old 250 watt 4000k Philips CMH. First I stuck a pair of Transition eyeglasses under a 3000k Quantum Board and the under 3500k Veros....... no change in lenses. Put them under the CMH and they were quite dark after about 7 seconds. UV is why I run it.


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## colocowboy (Feb 13, 2021)

They can do some descent red to blend the range too. Using a led to assist bulb maintenance cycle and these babies become a beautiful solution. I’m going to rebuild my logic pucks to be the supplement as they are more red.
A side note, it seems like seeds develop faster with more blue as well!


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## Rurumo (Feb 13, 2021)

hillbill said:


> Just did something very interesting with my old 250 watt 4000k Philips CMH. First I stuck a pair of Transition eyeglasses under a 3000k Quantum Board and the under 3500k Veros....... no change in lenses. Put them under the CMH and they were quite dark after about 7 seconds. UV is why I run it.


That's funny, I just noticed my arms are getting tan for the first time during winter. I love working under it, serious mental health benefits.


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## Rurumo (Feb 13, 2021)

colocowboy said:


> They can do some descent red to blend the range too. Using a led to assist bulb maintenance cycle and these babies become a beautiful solution. I’m going to rebuild my logic pucks to be the supplement as they are more red.
> A side note, it seems like seeds develop faster with more blue as well!


I'm using a "red enhanced" cmh bulb right now to test it out, the spectrum looks great but I can't find any reports of people using it on any of the forums.


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## hillbill (Feb 13, 2021)




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## hillbill (Feb 13, 2021)

Have several NIB bulbs manufacturing date 3/23/2013 4000k.


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## Rurumo (Feb 13, 2021)

Here are the charts for iluminar 630 DE bulbs...they may have slightly changed from these numbers. The middle one is the bulb I'm using now, but I have a regular 3k that I'll try out next round. Sorry, I know this is a 315 thread.


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## CrunchBerries (Feb 13, 2021)

colocowboy said:


> They can do some descent red to blend the range too. Using a led to assist bulb maintenance cycle and these babies become a beautiful solution. I’m going to rebuild my logic pucks to be the supplement as they are more red.
> A side note, it seems like seeds develop faster with more blue as well!


Would a 4K bulb be better suited for veg?


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## Rurumo (Feb 13, 2021)

CrunchBerries said:


> Would a 4K bulb be better suited for veg?


I think a lot of people are using the 4k phillips 315 bulb all the way through, but yeah, it's def good for veg.


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## CrunchBerries (Feb 13, 2021)

Rurumo said:


> I think a lot of people are using the 4k phillips 315 bulb all the way through, but yeah, it's def good for veg.


Thank you. I have a Sunsystem 315 but am in the market for a new veg light. I have a redeemable coupon to BAS and it’s burning a hole in my pocket. They carry the Illuminar brand and I’m toying with picking that up or going with another Sunsystem out of pocket. Sorry for all the questions, but you know. Trying to do my homework.


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## colocowboy (Feb 13, 2021)

I use the hortilux, it’s a 4K I believe.


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## Rurumo (Feb 13, 2021)

colocowboy said:


> I use the hortilux, it’s a 4K I believe.


Those hortilux bulbs are very nice too.


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## Rurumo (Feb 13, 2021)

CrunchBerries said:


> Thank you. I have a Sunsystem 315 but am in the market for a new veg light. I have a redeemable coupon to BAS and it’s burning a hole in my pocket. They carry the Illuminar brand and I’m toying with picking that up or going with another Sunsystem out of pocket. Sorry for all the questions, but you know. Trying to do my homework.


No worries, it's hard when there aren't many reviews on a brand. Iluminar is a premium brand like Sun System, I've only used mine for a single grow thus far, but the fit and finish seem high quality-I'm glad I went with it over a generic brand for sure.


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## hillbill (Feb 13, 2021)

Both those 3000k look awesome


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## weednerd.anthony.850 (Feb 18, 2021)

I'm currently running a sun system CMH hood/ballast with the 3100k Phillips in there, and I am VERY impressed with using it to start seeds and veg, I will be around to chime in once I get into flower these lil ones. Nice change after a 4-5 year hiatus from gardening. 

Never had near this fast growth with 4x8 T5 setups, plus much less fan/duct/AC than the old MH required I had before the t5s. 

Just need to see final weight and of course resin and terpene production vs what I always have had quality-wise under HPS...

but they seem to be loving the spectrum and intensity and less heat too! this is my first run with CMH and I doubt I'll ever go back to HPS, but I may do a run in summer with LED/CMH together to see the results of the mixed spectrum, and then next run after that just LED on its own so that I can decide if I can do LED in summer and CMH in winter or if I can keep temps in range with either setup and/or can maybe use both in two separate flowering areas. 

Can't thank you guys enough, if it wasn't for this thread I probably would have kept on blasting AC to cool HPS in a bit bigger setup right now instead of using the CMH and not needing any additional AC, just a couple circulation fans regular 4" size can fan to cool the 3x3. Much love club 315!


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## GrownAtHighAltitude (Feb 18, 2021)

315 brings the goods


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## shabazz47 (Feb 20, 2021)

Anybody run sun system LEC 630 or something comparable ? When do you turn on both bulbs?


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## Rurumo (Feb 20, 2021)

shabazz47 said:


> Anybody run sun system LEC 630 or something comparable ? When do you turn on both bulbs?


I have a 630 DE, so no separate bulbs, but I wanted to see how it did during veg so I used it for the last two weeks of veg in my current grow-the growth was excellent. So I'd turn both on either if you want faster growth in veg, once the plants get big enough to use the extra light, or at least I'd switch them both on like a week before flower so your plants can get used to the increased light.


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## gr865 (Feb 20, 2021)

Here's what's happening in my 4 x 4. Mimosa EVO
Wed. morning prior to light out and harvest.






Couple of bud pics





Drying racks.
Two plants on this rack.


Top rack of the drying screen.


Second rack of the drying screen.


Did not get a pic yet of the third screen, will tomorrow.

So wet weight @ 20% to day so far is about 26 zips with the heaviest plant to go. Expecting about 32 to 35 zips. This is just based on past grows and what my returns were.
I see a large batch of FECO in my future.

Will get up tomorrow and finish the one plant. Would have finished today but knew the stress I would be putting on my back so I took a big pat of cannabutter in my oatmeal this morning, so that slowed me down a bit.


Con't next post.


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## gr865 (Feb 20, 2021)

Finished the harvest this morning, I'm beat, LOL
The first two plants.

Each tray holds one plant. The remaining 4 plants.

Top tray

2nd Tray

3rd Tray

4th Tray


Total wet weight, 4,589 grams @ 20% dry weight should be right at 32 zips. That was my goal for this run, heaviest to date.
Now, if the humidity stays in the 60's and 70's I should be sweating them in plastic bags in about 4 days for around24 to 36 hours then everything will go on the screens for another few day to dry then into the jars for curing.

They look lonely now.


This has been a fun run, learned a lot about running a SCrog and my next will be better.
I will be putting this plant stand on the Lazy Susan for my next run. That will allow me to rotate the plants 180 degrees and not have to strain to work on the back side of the stand. And will still leave them on the rollings so I can move the stand back and forth while being able to rotate it the 180 degrees.


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## F1_Grower (Mar 4, 2021)

colocowboy said:


> Personally I love your grow! I have done shit just like this, brings back memories. Some of my best work was done in a space just like that.
> 
> 
> I don’t use mine for veg, induction and led FTW. I like to sculpt the structure of my plants with the veg lights, slow them, stack them, stretch them, etc.
> ...


Thank you! 

I think I've done it, reached my sweet spot! 

As a Systems Analyst I couldn't accept failure with my first harvest under just the two huds doing open loop and wanted to automate as much as possible/create ideal environment. Ran ICC and katsu kush first time indoors 

. Now In Wk 3 veg Gelato #41. Horizontal scrog 10 x 6 x 9 atrium Aircooled hids from master bedroom, 5 x 8 x 8 vertical scrog bare bulb x3 315w cmh , 5 x 5 x 8 cool tube 315 cmh and two 250w viaspectra IR/full spec lens. 

open to any critiques, queries, 

 Hybrid Loop System 1300 cu ft running co2, trolmaster, 315w cmh x 4 , 1k watt hids x2

Thanks to all RIU members for sharing in your wisdom, knowledge, and experience ‍


----------



## F1_Grower (Mar 4, 2021)

gr865 said:


> Finished the harvest this morning, I'm beat, LOL
> The first two plants.
> View attachment 4832070
> Each tray holds one plant. The remaining 4 plants.
> ...


You amaze me bro!

Congrats, sorry I've been mia , spent too much time and money to optimize my 10 x 6 x 8 horizontal and 5 x 8 x 8 vertical and 5 x 5 x 8 bathtub.

Which medium do you prefer? Fo you defoliate Wk 1 and wk 3 veg? I accidentally yesterday broke 4 lower tips/heads during wk 3 veg as I tried to weave new growth after weaving initial two wks in vertical construction screen , I think from now on gonna use sift ties instead if weave new growth.


I thought growing craft cannabis was supposed to be relaxing but I've had my hands full and feel the lower back pain of constant bending over working canopy


----------



## F1_Grower (Mar 4, 2021)

F1_Grower said:


> You amaze me bro!
> 
> Congrats, sorry I've been mia , spent too much time and money to optimize my 10 x 6 x 8 horizontal and 5 x 8 x 8 vertical and 5 x 5 x 8 bathtub.
> 
> ...


----------



## 1littlesoldier1 (Apr 3, 2021)

I was thinking of replacing my single vertical bare bulb 600w hps with two bare bulb vertical 315CMH but I hear the bulbs are more prone to exploding than the regular HPS. Anyone been running these bulbs bare and vertical for a long period of time without issues??


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## GrownAtHighAltitude (Apr 3, 2021)

1littlesoldier1 said:


> I was thinking of replacing my single vertical bare bulb 600w hps with two bare bulb vertical 315CMH but I hear the bulbs are more prone to exploding than the regular HPS. Anyone been running these bulbs bare and vertical for a long period of time without issues??


315 CMH Phillips should be open-rated. The old 400W CMH Retrofit's were not, however. Should be fine to go bare vertical with the new ones.


----------



## gr865 (Apr 3, 2021)

1littlesoldier1 said:


> I was thinking of replacing my single vertical bare bulb 600w hps with two bare bulb vertical 315CMH but I hear the bulbs are more prone to exploding than the regular HPS. Anyone been running these bulbs bare and vertical for a long period of time without issues??


My Nanolux 315W CMH NA run the bulb vertical even in the horizontal position with reflector on the unit. I and remove the reflector and run the two of them vertical with no issues.


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## hillbill (Apr 3, 2021)

UV protection would be a must.

Old Retrofit are “open rated” and have always been, it was part of the whole marketing strategy. I now use one as LEDs UV and IR supplement. Last bulbs made March 2013. I used them a lot for about 5 years. 4000k


----------



## GrownAtHighAltitude (Apr 3, 2021)

hillbill said:


> UV protection would be a must.
> 
> Old Retrofit are “open rated” and have always been, it was part of the whole marketing strategy. I now use one as LEDs UV and IR supplement. Last bulbs made March 2013. I used them a lot for about 5 years. 4000k


The Phillips retrofits (not made anymore) were open rated but the currently available GE 400W CMH retrofits are NOT. Just wanted to clarify that.

315's are superior and the way to go these days.


----------



## PopAndSonGrows (Apr 3, 2021)

New guy here! Did my first two grows under LED, but recently was given a 630w CMH fixture, currently running it with one bulb at 315w.



So far, the single bulb has been great since I'm only using about 3x3 of my 4x4. But later, when I run more plants or just fill the space better, I'll raise the fixture & add the second bulb.


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## 1littlesoldier1 (Apr 6, 2021)

Ok thx. Didnt even know they made 400W CMH ballast/bulbs. Anyways, anyone care to point me to the right ballast with the right bulb. So far I seen 2 threads with the phillips bulb exploding and causing fires


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## 1littlesoldier1 (Apr 6, 2021)

and that was last year


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## GrownAtHighAltitude (Apr 6, 2021)

Got any links for those threads? Geez... sounds bad


----------



## PJ Diaz (Apr 6, 2021)

1littlesoldier1 said:


> Ok thx. Didnt even know they made 400W CMH ballast/bulbs. Anyways, anyone care to point me to the right ballast with the right bulb. So far I seen 2 threads with the phillips bulb exploding and causing fires


400w cmh/cdm requires a standard magnetic hps ballast.


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## Jjgrow420 (Apr 7, 2021)

love me my cmhs
i run ushio 3000k and sunmaster full nova 3100k for flower.
with some cobs and leds for boost


----------



## F1_Grower (Apr 8, 2021)

1littlesoldier1 said:


> I was thinking of replacing my single vertical bare bulb 600w hps with two bare bulb vertical 315CMH but I hear the bulbs are more prone to exploding than the regular HPS. Anyone been running these bulbs bare and vertical for a long period of time without issues??


Have 3 hanging right now, no issues except don't order from hydrobuilder. Bulbs come cracked and 'loose ' sounding. Just make sure to have a hair cut, try and go in lights off beanie green light to avoid eye contact or any burns. No problem with bulbs exploding even if I lightly bump when off navigating my 5 x 15 bare bulb 315 vert scrog grow. Wk 3 flower


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## F1_Grower (Apr 8, 2021)

Jjgrow420 said:


> View attachment 4873415View attachment 4873416View attachment 4873417View attachment 4873418View attachment 4873419
> love me my cmhs
> i run ushio 3000k and sunmaster full nova 3100k for flower.
> with some cobs and leds for boost


Nice!
I'm running phillips 3000k x3 and hortilux 4100k x1 along with leds QB for boost


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## CrunchBerries (Apr 16, 2021)

Would a 630 lec cover a 5x5 space sufficiently?


----------



## colocowboy (Apr 16, 2021)

CrunchBerries said:


> Would a 630 lec cover a 5x5 space sufficiently?


Yes


----------



## CrunchBerries (Apr 16, 2021)

colocowboy said:


> Yes


Thanks bud!


----------



## colocowboy (Apr 16, 2021)

CrunchBerries said:


> Thanks bud!


If you add a couple supplemental leds you can keep “lumen maintenance” net 0.


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## F1_Grower (Apr 20, 2021)

Hi RIU Community! 

Just wanted to give quick update how my v-scrog 315 lec is comming along. Check it out in this thread on another topic re vertical growing i just posted on!






Is this vertical growing ?


What make trimming and maintenance work on the plants easier is being able to remove them from the tent to work on them. This pic is with the plant sitting on the pre rez barrel prior to 21st day defo. After the 21st day defo and before going back in the tent. Seven days later, day 29 of...



www.rollitup.org





Cheers


----------



## PJ Diaz (Apr 20, 2021)

colocowboy said:


> If you add a couple supplemental leds you can keep “lumen maintenance” net 0.


How's this?


----------



## F1_Grower (Apr 20, 2021)

PJ Diaz said:


> How's this?
> 
> View attachment 4883024


Cobs?


----------



## F1_Grower (Apr 20, 2021)

PJ Diaz said:


> How's this?
> 
> View attachment 4883024


Thats the way to do it, scattered is next room i want to setup reconnecting my 315s into their hoods. And In between lec's put leds.


----------



## PJ Diaz (Apr 20, 2021)

F1_Grower said:


> Cobs?


HLG QB96 elite v2's


----------



## Lilwatt (Apr 22, 2021)

So I’m probably about to get two of these an try it out but I was just wondering like what’s a good brand to go with price wise that’s not gone kill my pocket an how are they on heat I’ll like to find a brand that don’t throw off so much heat cause imma be using these in a five by five tent in my room


----------



## PJ Diaz (Apr 22, 2021)

Lilwatt said:


> So I’m probably about to get two of these an try it out but I was just wondering like what’s a good brand to go with price wise that’s not gone kill my pocket an how are they on heat I’ll like to find a brand that don’t throw off so much heat cause imma be using these in a five by five tent in my room


The heat is gonna be the same for every 315w lamp regardless of brand.


----------



## Lilwatt (Apr 22, 2021)

PJ Diaz said:


> The heat is gonna be the same for every 315w lamp regardless of brand.


So is the heat that bad cause I been doing a lil reading an one guy said his was worst then his 600 watt hps


----------



## PJ Diaz (Apr 22, 2021)

Lilwatt said:


> So is the heat that bad cause I been doing a lil reading an one guy said his was worst then his 600 watt hps


That guy doesn't know what he's talking about. Heat is based on watts burned regardless of how they are burned. It's a simple formula really, every 1 watt equals 3.41 btu's.


----------



## CrunchBerries (Jun 2, 2021)

I just purchased a 5x5 and I’m thinking of getting the timber trio of daises to go between two 315 cmh. Each daisy is a 100W COB. One cmh bulb is 3100, the other 4K. Thoughts? Any help is appreciated


----------



## colocowboy (Jun 2, 2021)

CrunchBerries said:


> I just purchased a 5x5 and I’m thinking of getting the timber trio of daises to go between two 315 cmh. Each daisy is a 100W COB. One cmh bulb is 3100, the other 4K. Thoughts? Any help is appreciated


Sounds descent to me, will be plenty of light and room to address lumen maintenance out to 5 years with that much led.


----------



## CrunchBerries (Jun 2, 2021)

colocowboy said:


> Sounds descent to me, will be plenty of light and room to address lumen maintenance out to 5 years with that much led.


Thanks for your response man. Was looking at a couple HLG 135W QB V2 RSpec led kits also but they are a bit pricier.


----------



## colocowboy (Jun 2, 2021)

CrunchBerries said:


> Thanks for your response man. Was looking at a couple HLG 135W QB V2 RSpec led kits also but they are a bit pricier.


The light is more diffuse from qbs which is nice for even spread. It’s all just choices, personally I like to wash in excess if it’s dimmable, remember running leds soft increases their life span. It’s a nice balance of efficiency, performance and durability.


----------



## CrunchBerries (Jun 2, 2021)

colocowboy said:


> The light is more diffuse from qbs which is nice for even spread. It’s all just choices, personally I like to wash in excess if it’s dimmable, remember running leds soft increases their life span. It’s a nice balance of efficiency, performance and durability.


Thanks again man for your time


----------



## dennis000 (Jun 3, 2021)

Now we have more choice


----------



## CrunchBerries (Jun 3, 2021)

PJ Diaz said:


> HLG QB96 elite v2's


What size driver are you using to run those? I was looking to run three Qb96’s with this driver hlg320h-54a. I’m going to call HLG today, but do you know of any resources for how-tos on building these things. I appreciate your time- CrunchBerries


----------



## colocowboy (Jun 3, 2021)

CrunchBerries said:


> What size driver are you using to run those? I was looking to run three Qb96’s with this driver hlg320h-54a. I’m going to call HLG today, but do you know of any resources for how-tos on building these things. I appreciate your time- CrunchBerries








DIY with Quantum Boards


Starting a new thread for DIY build with Quantum Boards. Please feel free to post your Mid-Power LED based designs here. Multiple LED Strips fine too. Related Threads https://www.rollitup.org/t/quantum-boards-grow.927065/ https://www.rollitup.org/t/pre-drilled-heatsink-for-boards.925811/...



www.rollitup.org




There’s an hlg rep there to help. PJ knows too and could probably be a rep too! lol


----------



## PJ Diaz (Jun 3, 2021)

CrunchBerries said:


> What size driver are you using to run those? I was looking to run three Qb96’s with this driver hlg320h-54a. I’m going to call HLG today, but do you know of any resources for how-tos on building these things. I appreciate your time- CrunchBerries


That driver will work perfectly with 3 QB96's. There's not much to building them really, just connect the boards to the drivers in parallel, and then hang them.


----------



## CrunchBerries (Jun 3, 2021)

PJ Diaz said:


> That driver will work perfectly with 3 QB96's. There's not much to building them really, just connect the boards to the drivers in parallel, and then hang them.


Thanks bud!


----------



## rkymtnman (Jun 3, 2021)

dennis000 said:


> View attachment 4915270
> 
> Now we have more choice


i wish the 150 w cmh wasn't so pricey. that would be an awesome light for a 2x2


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## Bear575 (Jul 15, 2021)

Blue back said:


> 2 315 will cover a 3'x3' area. I run 2 on a 4'x4'. 4x8 u would actually wanna run 3 if not 4 for total coverage. Neoangalo147 looks great for only 2 though no doubt


Seen you have the same setup as me you don't happen to know the distance I have 6 plants in veg week 2 my ballasts are at 70 percent 36 inches away from canopy


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## Adamjotan (Jul 20, 2021)

My first CMH grow (first bulb grow), 315w hi-par CMH over a 1x1meter tent. Did one plant (Rainbow Jones) connesour connection pre company closure, 1.46g/W 16.5oz + for the one plant in a 57L fabric pot, Coco no perlite. Canna Coco a+b no PK or additives. Quite amazing. I still remember my first led grow, something along the lines of 0.35gpw. In Australia these CMH come in a $499.00 kit now rather then 750.00 when they first came out, really affordable but worth the experience. I typed this out but I'm about to fork out $1400.00 on another led haha. 10/10 on the CMH anyway thought I'd share my experience.


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## turbobuzz (Jul 22, 2021)

This GDP is 6 weeks flowering at 12/12. I sure hope they tighten up some. I seem to have a hard time getting dense buds with the CMH 315. Maybe I’m just a shitty grower. This is my third run with the light, and the first two weren’t very dense either.


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## myke (Jul 22, 2021)

turbobuzz said:


> This GDP is 6 weeks flowering at 12/12. I sure hope they tighten up some. I seem to have a hard time getting dense buds with the CMH 315. Maybe I’m just a shitty grower. This is my third run with the light, and the first two weren’t very dense either.


Looks like a re veg going on?? Or is it just the strain?


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## turbobuzz (Jul 22, 2021)

myke said:


> Looks like a re veg going on?? Or is it just the strain?


You are correct, it did try to reveg about 3 weeks ago. I think it was a perfect storm of light to close, to much nitrogen, and a little light coming through the crack in the closet door, all of which has been taken care of, but I think it set it back a week, maybe two.


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Jul 23, 2021)

Just pulled about 16 mason jars full of tops and mid colas a couple months ago, Greenpoint Seeds Eaglescout (GS Cookies X Stardawg), tasty stuff! 2 X 315w Sunsystem lec's, 5.5x3.5ft bathtub/shower space, Day 90:


Dry rough trimmed:


----------



## Adamjotan (Jul 23, 2021)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Just pulled about 16 mason jars full of tops and mid colas a couple months ago, Greenpoint Seeds Eaglescout (GS Cookies X Stardawg), tasty stuff! 2 X 315w Sunsystem lec's, 5.5x3.5ft bathtub/shower space, Day 90:
> View attachment 4949928
> 
> Dry rough trimmed:
> View attachment 4949929


Now thats gold


----------



## CrunchBerries (Nov 20, 2021)

Quick question for y’all. I’m looking to take advantage of Black Friday and get another 315. If you had a choice would you choose Sun System or Illuminar? Thanks as always.


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 20, 2021)

CrunchBerries said:


> Quick question for y’all. I’m looking to take advantage of Black Friday and get another 315. If you had a choice would you choose Sun System or Illuminar? Thanks as always.


Do you already have a 315 ? I love the Sun System Boss 315 fixture but I don't think I drop that kind of coin again on one. I'd buy whatever one that works best for the space you are growing in. @ColoradoHighGrower uses a sun system 630 in a tidy grow and does incredible with it. Good luck!


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Nov 20, 2021)

I'm actually running two Sun System 315's (120v) because of the dimensions of my space. Nice overlap in the center with complete coverage out to ~3.5X6ft. Love them them though for both veg and flower so far!

Edit: but a bit pricey, yes...


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 20, 2021)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> I'm actually running two Sun System 315's (120v) because of the dimensions of my space. Nice overlap in the center with complete coverage out to ~3.5X6ft. Love them them though for both veg and flower so far!
> 
> Edit: but a bit pricey, yes...


Shoot I thought you used a 630  Your fixtures hang the bulb horizontal or vertical? Have you ever used a 315 veg spectrum?


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## ColoradoHighGrower (Nov 20, 2021)

Ha! Yeah I have the horizontal bulb fixtures.. have read that's better than vert? I've only run the warmer Phillips bulbs for a better mixed veg/flower spectrum, mainly because I'm cheap and lazy, but works good enough for me...


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## farmingfisherman (Nov 20, 2021)

ColoradoHighGrower said:


> Ha! Yeah I have the horizontal bulb fixtures.. have read that's better than vert? I've only run the warmer Phillips bulbs for a better mixed veg/flower spectrum, mainly because I'm cheap and lazy, but works good enough for me...


Yeah I'd say you are doing just fine.


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## GrownAtHighAltitude (Nov 20, 2021)

Still rockin my cheap Chinese knock-off 315's from Amazon/Ebay. All 4 of them have worked fine.

I don't think the brand name is worth the price difference at this point.


----------



## Gemtree (Nov 20, 2021)

First time flowering with my 315. Cheapo horizontal fixture with Phillips 3100 bulb. Looking good for day 35 in a 3x3


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Nov 20, 2021)

We rocking two cmh 315's and two 600 hps during flower.


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Nov 20, 2021)

5x8 with ac lol veg with 315s on a f&d system. Trellis in for 2-3 weeks then turn on the 600s.call it showtime


----------



## Adamjotan (Nov 20, 2021)

original glue ggfarms, lats in fan leaf stem maybe a keeper?


----------



## Alien GreenThumbs (Nov 22, 2021)

Damn yall make me want to run a 630 on a light mover in a bigger tent....ive always been curious about the cmh/lec


----------



## oldman60 (Nov 22, 2021)

I've had good results switching from 4 - 600 hid's to 6 - 315's with a noticeable increase in resin and yield.
Next yr. maybe a few 630 D.E.'s will be added.


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## sadboy92 (Dec 15, 2021)

I have a 2'x3' footprint and just over 5' tall tent with a 315w cmh lec with ballast in fixture (Sun Systems Flower Power). I was vegging some plants indoors last february as high as the fixture would go and they started budding at 18/6. I've read things about needing to place these much higher than LEDs, would the stress of being too low have caused this and how high should I be keeping these? 

I tried using the search function and people have mentioned height but I didn't find anything specific, sorry if I missed it.


----------



## hillbill (Dec 15, 2021)

Had to be hot


----------



## Rurumo (Dec 15, 2021)

sadboy92 said:


> I have a 2'x3' footprint and just over 5' tall tent with a 315w cmh lec with ballast in fixture (Sun Systems Flower Power). I was vegging some plants indoors last february as high as the fixture would go and they started budding at 18/6. I've read things about needing to place these much higher than LEDs, would the stress of being too low have caused this and how high should I be keeping these?
> 
> I tried using the search function and people have mentioned height but I didn't find anything specific, sorry if I missed it.


They really don't need to be placed a lot higher than most powerful recent LEDs, just depends on ventilation/circulation and room temperature. But in that size tent, I would expect you had trouble maintaining a proper temperature. As for height above canopy, 2 feet is a good average, some people go much lower, some go up to 30" or so with them. If your plants were budding at 18/6 it is most likely genetics, not related to the light. What strain/breeder? Lots of auto genes floating around nowadays.


----------



## sadboy92 (Dec 15, 2021)

Rurumo said:


> They really don't need to be placed a lot higher than most powerful recent LEDs, just depends on ventilation/circulation and room temperature. But in that size tent, I would expect you had trouble maintaining a proper temperature. As for height above canopy, 2 feet is a good average, some people go much lower, some go up to 30" or so with them. If your plants were budding at 18/6 it is most likely genetics, not related to the light. What strain/breeder? Lots of auto genes floating around nowadays.


I highly doubt these were autos. I was also using a hygrometer to keep track of the temps. I forget since it was so long ago, but it wasn't above 90F. That said, there was no exhaust ventilation, only a clip mounted to the side poles.


----------



## hillbill (Dec 15, 2021)

Without proper ventilation, even mediocre results are difficult. Decent exhaust would be so appreciated by your plants.

90* would be way hot with HID, 80* is on the upper end for HID without CO2, leaf temps had to be obnoxious.


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Dec 15, 2021)

sadboy92 said:


> I have a 2'x3' footprint and just over 5' tall tent with a 315w cmh lec with ballast in fixture (Sun Systems Flower Power). I was vegging some plants indoors last february as high as the fixture would go and they started budding at 18/6. I've read things about needing to place these much higher than LEDs, would the stress of being too low have caused this and how high should I be keeping these?
> 
> I tried using the search function and people have mentioned height but I didn't find anything specific, sorry if I missed it.


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Dec 15, 2021)

Trellis all day sir. It will buy you some time


----------



## elfo777 (Dec 20, 2021)

This has been my first experience growing with CMH after 5 or so years of using HPS. I have to say that at first, I was dissappointed because light coverage isn't as strong. And sometimes throughout the journey I was doubting if it was even comparable to a 400W HPS. I even made a thread.

Well, let me tell you I was wrong. I stopped looking at my plants and just watered them with some nutes when if I saw my soil dry. But I didn't look at the buds. I do this because if you stop looking at them after a few days/weeks you can get some nice surprises. And I did.

21 days without looking at them, but when I did, I saw the frostiest, best looking buds I have ever seen. These plants have only been vegged for barely 3 weeks, and some buds like the mazar i shariff strain (pic 2 and 3) are the size of my fist and literally glowing and sparkling everywhere. Pictures don't do it justice especially with my crappy old iphone, but you get the idea. The first pic from reina madre strain is totally covered in resin. It's the frostiest plant I have ever grown.

The smell, terpenes, resin production (can't speak about taste yet) is much better than my Phillips HPS.

Overall I am pleasantly surprised by the 315W CMH. I am not going to say it produces bud like a 600W HPS, but in my case it beats the 400W HPS pretty badly. I'd say it is somewhere in the middle, equivalent to about 500-550W. I have never gotten such compact, good quality buds with such little vegging time. Excited for what the future holds.

Now I am going to grow some lebanese hash plants and I can't wait to produce some top quality hash with my CMH. Could not be happier. Just wanted to share my experience.

Cheers.


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Dec 20, 2021)

Welcome sir..I have 3 cmh I veg with in my 4x8 tent.when I put my trellis in and train the ladies,the 315 is king in my book. When it's time to flower,I add 2 600hps with the 315cmh. Call it Holly sh!$+


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## hillbill (Dec 21, 2021)

I use all Boards for light anymore but would run a 315 CMH without second thoughts. I ran old Mastercolor 250 and 400 CMH for years whic are not as efficient as the 315 but they still made really gooey buds. Have fun


----------



## nobighurry (Dec 23, 2021)

I started using 315 CMH with hps because I lost a ballast I like what I saw and have been using it ever sense but recently bought a big 800watt LED going to give it a go


----------



## asdfmklasdfmklasdfmkl (Apr 12, 2022)

Running two 315 Sun Systems, one with a phillips 3100 and another with a hortilux 4200


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Apr 12, 2022)

asdfmklasdfmklasdfmkl said:


> View attachment 5117454View attachment 5117455
> 
> Running two 315 Sun Systems, one with a phillips 3100 and another with a hortilux 4200


Killing the game


----------



## farmingfisherman (Apr 12, 2022)

asdfmklasdfmklasdfmkl said:


> View attachment 5117454View attachment 5117455
> 
> Running two 315 Sun Systems, one with a phillips 3100 and another with a hortilux 4200


Lush garden!


----------



## ilovetoskiatalta (Apr 21, 2022)

F1_Grower said:


> Thank you!
> 
> I think I've done it, reached my sweet spot!
> 
> ...


@F1_Grower is that a John Wayne Gacy painting?


----------



## Mr.jojodancer305 (Apr 21, 2022)

ilovetoskiatalta said:


> @F1_Grower is that a John Wayne Gacy painting?


Job well done sir......question, how are you drying


----------



## BMWEATER (Apr 24, 2022)

I just switched this fun from the Chilled led 300w set up to the 315 vivosun cmh and i am loving the results. I am running 4 plants in a 2x4 area of my shed, and it's about 14 inches from the tops. Just did it for fun to mix things up. Weight is definitely up substantially but frost is done at least 20% - from what my eyes can see. Not bad for a $149 light 


Ice Cream Cake 


Trainwreck x GSC


----------



## farmingfisherman (Apr 24, 2022)

BMWEATER said:


> I just switched this fun from the Chilled led 300w set up to the 315 vivosun cmh and i am loving the results. I am running 4 plants in a 2x4 area of my shed, and it's about 14 inches from the tops. Just did it for fun to mix things up. Weight is definitely up substantially but frost is done at least 20% - from what my eyes can see. Not bad for a $149 light
> 
> 
> Ice Cream Cake
> ...


How are you getting a even spread in a 2 x 4 space with a 315. I ran one but ran it with two small 100 watt led boards and still didn't have great coverage throughout. That was in a 4 x 4 however. Plants look great!


----------



## BMWEATER (Apr 24, 2022)

farmingfisherman said:


> How are you getting a even spread in a 2 x 4 space with a 315. I ran one but ran it with two small 100 watt led boards and still didn't have great coverage throughout. That was in a 4 x 4 however. Plants look great!


Thank you! Honestly is not an even spread, the last two plants have to be rotated in the middle every other day. Kinda a pain in the ass lol but its working. But it seems to be working well. I might add a 65watt HLG quantum board this week to add a bit more light on the edges but we will see


----------



## farmingfisherman (Apr 24, 2022)

BMWEATER said:


> Thank you! Honestly is not an even spread, the last two plants have to be rotated in the middle every other day. Kinda a pain in the ass lol but its working. But it seems to be working well. I might add a 65watt HLG quantum board this week to add a bit more light on the edges but we will see


That's what I did. Looking back at that grow I should have spent less time working on the plants under the 315. They put out lots of UV and it should be respected.


----------



## BMWEATER (Apr 25, 2022)

farmingfisherman said:


> That's what I did. Looking back at that grow I should have spent less time working on the plants under the 315. They put out lots of UV and it should be respected.


Damn! Those ladies look really good! Ill shot a picture of the shed this weekend I think i may add my 65watt HLG at the very end of the 2x4 to add a bit more light


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## race (Nov 3, 2022)

I would like to know if its really a big difference between magnetic and electronc ballast for LEC?
Is it true you get lower PAR and even CRI rating with magnetic? (bulb is philips 3100k)
I bought in a hurry a magnetic 315W ballast and im thinking to replace it, didnt try it yet

Sorry if this has been answered before but this tread is too long to check all pages
Thanks


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## PJ Diaz (Nov 3, 2022)

race said:


> I would like to know if its really a big difference between magnetic and electronc ballast for LEC?
> Is it true you get lower PAR and even CRI rating with magnetic? (bulb is philips 3100k)
> I bought in a hurry a magnetic 315W ballast and im thinking to replace it, didnt try it yet
> 
> ...


You get lower efficiency with magnetic ballasts vs low frequency square wave digital ballasts. Your ballast choice will drive your lamp options and vice vs. In order to use a mag ballast with CMH you will need a lamp which is intended for use with magnetic ballasts.


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## race (Nov 3, 2022)

Ok so mine is actually hybrid magnetic, its magnetic with an added electronic circuit, LINK
But i see there are also standard magnetic ballasts for 315W that are cheaper than mine and dont have the circuit

That circuit should be for LFSW ? I dont get why there is no info about it online


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## PJ Diaz (Nov 3, 2022)

race said:


> Ok so mine is actually hybrid magnetic, its magnetic with an added electronic circuit, LINK
> But i see there are also standard magnetic ballasts for 315W that are cheaper than mine and dont have the circuit
> 
> That circuit should be for LFSW ? I dont get why there is no info about it onlineView attachment 5221534View attachment 5221535


I've never heard of a ballast like it, but my guess is that it still produces a sine wave, not a square wave. My understanding is that the square wave is more efficient for producing light, because it's continuously switching polarity rather than a traditional sloping oscillation.


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## budolskie (Dec 7, 2022)

2x630 de cmh, is this enough for 8x4 tent tp replace 2x600 hps
thanks


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## Mr.jojodancer305 (Dec 7, 2022)

Yeap that will pretty much do it. I have 2 600 and 2 315 cmh in mines


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## budolskie (Dec 7, 2022)

Mr.jojodancer305 said:


> Yeap that will pretty much do it. I have 2 600 and 2 315 cmh in mines



Thanks looks like am going to get them for future runs after crimbo


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## nobighurry (Dec 8, 2022)

PJ Diaz said:


> I've never heard of a ballast like it, but my guess is that it still produces a sine wave, not a square wave. My understanding is that the square wave is more efficient for producing light, because it's continuously switching polarity rather than a traditional sloping oscillation.


My understanding is bulbs last longer being juiced by a square wave ballast but I have not used anything but square so I have no personal data... I have noticed when a sq wave is nearing the end of its useful life it pops bulbs quicker... I had two 315 CMH same age bulb lifespan was reduced to 3 cycles...


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## elfo777 (Dec 28, 2022)

315W LEC buds


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## tkufoS (Dec 28, 2022)

elfo777 said:


> 315W LEC budsView attachment 5242651View attachment 5242656


Looks good..1st try with them or nah ?


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## elfo777 (Dec 28, 2022)

tkufoS said:


> Looks good..1st try with them or nah ?


My first experience is documented on the previous page of this post, this is my 4th or 5h growth with LEC, love it, so much flavor and trichomes.


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## tkufoS (Dec 28, 2022)

elfo777 said:


> My first experience is documented on the previous page of this post, this is my 4th or 5h growth with LEC, love it, so much flavor and trichomes.


Right on! I use hps currently. I liked the 315 cmh at the grow store.. I think Im gonna get one .I get post updates as much as a pay raise.. Sorry bout that


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## hillbill (Dec 29, 2022)

Growers House has a few unbelievable deals on some CMH lights and ballasts right now.


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