is this a decnet tea mix for veg?

Rasta Roy · May 1, 2016

MistaRasta said:
Makes sense being its about 14?% or so phosphorus and phosphorus is your base anion.

..Nahh, I incorporated it into my soil when I first switched over to living soil. Since then I haven't used it..Not really a huge fan of hydrolosate either, nothing wrong with it. I've just learned that the strongest compounds and most potent effects come from accumulators and that's strictly what I use. That and sourcing, you know I'm all about sourcing brotha..

For instance, hydrolosate is a potent ground-up liquified fish product that has a good amount of nitrogen. While that may be the case id much rather use alfalfa, not only is there nitrogen but a slew of other benefits including other minerals/nutrients and secondary advantages. One being the fatty alcohol, tricantonol.. Use in combination with kelp meal and you have a complete power house nute combo.. The kelp also contains a fatty alcohol called gibberlic acid, these two fatty alcohols together work amazingly. (When I used this tea my plants would grow 2-4 inches in two days and the leaves would stick straight up.)

Much better than any nasty smelling fish product I've ever used..

I don't use alfalfa much anymore because I like neem more and alfalfa seems to burn things up no matter what rate I use it at. Neems' also an accumulator.. Plus I don't make ANY sort of teas anymore, totally and utterly unnecessary when you can just put everything right into your soil with a quarter of the work..

What do you use for your phosphorus source?

MistaRasta · May 1, 2016

Rasta Roy said:
Clone onlines? Forgive me I'm getting pregame stoned for game of thrones haha, what do you mean?

Ah, I take it you don't.

Clone Only- as in a cut that has been selected because of utmost quality and circulated.

Some examples being:
Og kush
Blue dream
Sour diesel
Girl Scout Cookies
Gorilla Glue #4
Chemdawg

MistaRasta · May 1, 2016

Rasta Roy said:
What do you use for your phosphorus source?

Let's see here, off the top of my head..

All on average..

Compost- 1%
Crab meal- 3%
Kelp meal - .2 %
Neem Meal - 1.8%
Alfalfa Meal - 1%
Basalt - .15%

Which gives me a healthy 6-7% of phosphorus in my overall batch.

Don't go with the thinking of the usual st0ner science behind plants needing high amounts of phosphorus for good yields and yadayadayada. I'm not worried about npk, haven't been for about 2 years and my yields and quality have never been better..

You should more so be questioning how that phosphorus is being broken down and delivered to the plant and make sure that's happening as efficiently as possible. This is the job of the mycorrhizae networks in your soil which specifically chelate P and tend to shy away from high phosphorus sources and do better with lower amounts..Phosphorus being your base anion means it ain't goin anywhere anytime soon, it's a very heavy metal and takes time to break down, Months to years..

This is why 'No till' has become so popular. When you break down your soil and recycle it you break down the myco networks that took so long to establish. The Myco networks are the most important part of P uptake (and a host of other minerals/nutrients in general tbh) in organics as we're not relying on chelated phosphates

Rasta Roy · May 1, 2016

MistaRasta said:
Let's see here, off the top of my head..

All on average..

Compost- 1%
Crab meal- 3%
Kelp meal - .2 %
Neem Meal - 1.8%
Alfalfa Meal - 1%
Basalt - .15%

Which gives me a healthy 6-7% of phosphorus in my overall batch.

Don't go with the thinking of the usual st0ner science behind plants needing high amounts of phosphorus for good yields and yadayadayada. I'm not worried about npk, haven't been for about 2 years and my yields and quality have never been better..

You should more so be questioning how that phosphorus is being broken down and delivered to the plant and make sure that's happening as efficiently as possible. This is the job of the mycorrhizae networks in your soil which specifically chelate P and tend to shy away from high phosphorus sources and do better with lower amounts..Phosphorus being your base anion means it ain't goin anywhere anytime soon, it's a very heavy metal and takes time to break down, Months to years..

This is why 'No till' has become so popular. When you break down your soil and recycle it you break down the myco networks that took so long to establish. The Myco networks are the most important part of P uptake (and a host of other minerals/nutrients in general tbh) in organics as we're not relying on chelated phosphates

I'm definitely leaning pretty hard into this approach. My next round of babies is only getting fertilized with worm castings, compost, neem cake, Alfalfa, and kelp.

Rasta Roy · May 1, 2016

MistaRasta said:
Ah, I take it you don't.

Clone Only- as in a cut that has been selected because of utmost quality and circulated.

Some examples being:
Og kush
Blue dream
Sour diesel
Girl Scout Cookies
Gorilla Glue #4
Chemdawg

Ahh I got ya! Yea definitely rocking some of those exact ones lol.

I got an LA Pure Kush cut that I love

Here she is hanging upside down

I have a gorilla glue #4 cut that I acquired recently but to be honest I'm not super impressed with it. It was solid and all but it doesn't match up to my other a listers. And goddamn do its fan leaves grow annoyingly in on its own canopy. I was constantly pruning these ones.

The blue cheese I got is from a clone from another local caregiver but I never got the name of the seedbank it came from.

Than I've got a boss hog from cali connection seeds and my favorite strain i have from seed is from world of seeds, Pakistan Valley. It's the perfect indoor indica! It barely stretches in flower, just fattens out.

With the cage off

I've been growing it for about three years.

MistaRasta · May 1, 2016

Rasta Roy said:
I'm definitely leaning pretty hard into this approach. My next round of babies is only getting fertilized with worm castings, compost, neem cake, Alfalfa, and kelp.

Awesome!

I'd personally cut out the alfalfa. It will give you more phosphorus but it will also give you more nitrogen and most likely more problems..With all the nitrogen sources in your soil and being as you'll have every nutrient/mineral available you need from the neem and kelp alone I'd say your safe with just those two.. I rarely use alfalfa these days, mainly if I have a problem, and like I said, with the neem/kelp/compost I rarely have problems..

Not to mention, I cut out alfalfa a while back when I started using the really good stuff from the feed store. This stuff was gold compared to the GROW MORE crap I was getting at hydra-heaven. People really don't understand the difference in good sourced good quality ingredients that don't come from China..

Rasta Roy · May 1, 2016

MistaRasta said:
Awesome!

I'd personally cut out the alfalfa. It will give you more phosphorus but it will also give you more nitrogen and most likely more problems..With all the nitrogen sources in your soil and being as you'll have every nutrient/mineral available you need from the neem and kelp alone I'd say your safe with just those two.. I rarely use alfalfa these days, mainly if I have a problem, and like I said, with the neem/kelp/compost I rarely have problems..

Not to mention, I cut out alfalfa a while back when I started using the really good stuff from the feed store. This stuff was gold compared to the GROW MORE crap I was getting at hydra-heaven. People really don't understand the difference in good sourced good quality ingredients that don't come from China..

Say Word! I've been thinking about cutting out the Alfalfa but I was worried I'd miss the growth hormones and goodies from it. I could always leave it out of the mix and do an Alfalfa tea if they need it.

MistaRasta · May 1, 2016

Rasta Roy said:
Ahh I got ya! Yea definitely rocking some of those exact ones lol.

I got an LA Pure Kush cut that I love

View attachment 3671155
Here she is hanging upside down
View attachment 3671156
I have a gorilla glue #4 cut that I acquired recently but to be honest I'm not super impressed with it. It was solid and all but it doesn't match up to my other a listers. And goddamn do its fan leaves grow annoyingly in on its own canopy. I was constantly pruning these ones.

The blue cheese I got is from a clone from another local caregiver but I never got the name of the seedbank it came from.

Than I've got a boss hog from cali connection seeds and my favorite strain i have from seed is from world of seeds, Pakistan Valley. It's the perfect indoor indica! It barely stretches in flower, just fattens out.
View attachment 3671167
With the cage off
View attachment 3671171
I've been growing it for about three years.

Ahhhh!
That pure kush! Goddamn that's some beautiful stuff bro, good job on her! You got her nice and chunky. Hope to get that cut one day. I've heard she's better than bubba.

Damn, hope you didn't get one of the fake cuts of gg4 bro. I've heard of 3 illegitimate cuts that go around..
I just got a gg4 cut a month or so ago supposed to be 100% real and they've been under a tiny light waiting their turn for rotation. Can't wait to run them tbh

That boss Hogg sounds nice, Chem 4? Selection I believe...

MistaRasta · May 1, 2016

Rasta Roy said:
Say Word! I've been thinking about cutting out the Alfalfa but I was worried I'd miss the growth hormones and goodies from it. I could always leave it out of the mix and do an Alfalfa tea if they need it.

A tea is the perfect way to go. Distribute the hot alfalfa evenly throughout the soil and Honestly, you really aren't missing out when using other amendments such as neem and kelp. Sure the tria is nice but all in all I see better result with just neem and kelp.

if you want to, throw your alfalfa on your compost and let your microbes at it before you throw it on top of your soil. This ensures a nice breakdown with no burn.

Rasta Roy · May 2, 2016

MistaRasta said:
Ahhhh!
That pure kush! Goddamn that's some beautiful stuff bro, good job on her! You got her nice and chunky. Hope to get that cut one day. I've heard she's better than bubba.

Damn, hope you didn't get one of the fake cuts of gg4 bro. I've heard of 3 illegitimate cuts that go around..
I just got a gg4 cut a month or so ago supposed to be 100% real and they've been under a tiny light waiting their turn for rotation. Can't wait to run them tbh

That boss Hogg sounds nice, Chem 4? Selection I believe...

Yeah I don't know about this GG4 cut I got. It is good bud and all, the yield was fine. It just doesn't live up to the hype for me. I had the same thing happen to me with a blue dream cut I had a couple years ago. Probably fake out phenos. That or people put way too much hype behind their reputation.

But yea the boss hog is supposed to be from a chem4 selection. I had a chem99 strain i started from one lonely seed I got out of a bag of bud years ago but I lost it's mother plant when we had a bad ice storm a couple years ago and power was out for two weeks. Every generator in the state of Michigan was bought up...it was hell. I've got some seeds from a dude I sold clones to forever ago that accidentally crossed it with a mystery plant when he didn't pull males out of his room (he's kind of an idiot lol). I started six of em a while ago and got em in my flower room now. Two of the phenos were males tho so now I'm down to four.

greasemonkeymann · May 2, 2016

MistaRasta said:
Teaming with nutrients is pretty in depth. I tried reading it when I first got into organics years ago but couldn't really wrap my head around what lowenfels was talking about.

Teaming with microbes on the other hand is simple and down to the core.

DonBrennon said:
Teaming with microbes is a beautiful book and I am gonna give teaming with nutes another go, I NEED!!! to get to grips with it. My problem is that I need to be able to visualize things to be able to understand them, it's similar to when I was learning about electricity, trying to get my head around electrons jumping from one atom to another and flowing through a solid metal.....fooked my head right up.
When he (Jeff) starts describing the cell and it's component's in the first chapter I had a similar experience, but made worse because of some of the names of the different parts and functions of the cell. I'll admit, I didn't get past the 1st chapter properly, although I have browsed the rest of it.

try readin it again guys, this book is GOLDEN when it comes to the description of the cycling process, ph, flow of water/nutrients, etc.
good shit, I've read it like 5 times
haven't read teaming with microbes yet

greasemonkeymann · May 2, 2016

GoRealUhGro said:
They had a shot ton of books on organic gardening I though about buying instead but these were so highly reccomended....they had the marijuana grow bible...all kinda shit...I was looking from one about composting of making living soil or some shit

you do NOT need ANY cannabis specific grow guides, those are rudimentary at best.
get a homesteading books, a composting book, and a basic horticulture book.
that's all you need.
the grow-specific books are not very good man, and overpriced too

GoRealUhGro · May 2, 2016

greasemonkeymann said:
you do NOT need ANY cannabis specific grow guides, those are rudimentary at best.
get a homesteading books, a composting book, and a basic horticulture book.
that's all you need.
the grow-specific books are not very good man, and overpriced too

Yeah I seen a lot of homesteading books ...ones on raised beds...none on composting or I would have gotten that as well...a bunch on organic gardening...I prob should have snagged one of those instead...I really wasn't looking at one of the canna grow books to but cause nobody I see on here that grows dank is ever screaming about em...unlike teaming with microbes and teaming with nutrients. ..iv been getting into twn but it's a lil weird at first for me to visualize but I'm getting in...I flipped to the back of it and read a min and it seems a lot no more of my style in a few of the later chapters. ...

greasemonkeymann · May 3, 2016

GoRealUhGro said:
Yeah I seen a lot of homesteading books ...ones on raised beds...none on composting or I would have gotten that as well...a bunch on organic gardening...I prob should have snagged one of those instead...I really wasn't looking at one of the canna grow books to but cause nobody I see on here that grows dank is ever screaming about em...unlike teaming with microbes and teaming with nutrients. ..iv been getting into twn but it's a lil weird at first for me to visualize but I'm getting in...I flipped to the back of it and read a min and it seems a lot no more of my style in a few of the later chapters. ...

any even half-ass homesteading books should have some DAMN good info on composting.
composting is a pretty easy thing to get.
I can confidently say that I know pretty much all there is to know about it, but it's not complicated.
it's like saying I know pretty much all there is to know about changing a tire.
Well.. alright it's a bit more complicated than that, but not much more.
nature does it on it's own with no turning, assembling, layering, etc.
here's a damn good link to a BUNCH of good shit.
http://www.motherearthnews.com/organic-gardening.aspx

go get some coffee, and spend the day or week over there and I guaran-fuckin-tee you'll be more versed in organics than 95% of the people here.
got everything you need to know there.

DblBrryInvestments · May 3, 2016

Hey greasemonkey, I read earlier on that teas may not be necessary with amended soil.

I went with LC's mix recipe #1 for the first time this year, and it seems like a pretty food rich soil as it is.

My question is, did you mean teas are not necessary throughout the whole season or just earlier on when they're still young?

I just bought a 35$ air pump that does about 50 lpm and was really looking forward to start making AACTs.

Rasta Roy · May 3, 2016

greasemonkeymann said:
any even half-ass homesteading books should have some DAMN good info on composting.
composting is a pretty easy thing to get.
I can confidently say that I know pretty much all there is to know about it, but it's not complicated.
it's like saying I know pretty much all there is to know about changing a tire.
Well.. alright it's a bit more complicated than that, but not much more.
nature does it on it's own with no turning, assembling, layering, etc.
here's a damn good link to a BUNCH of good shit.
http://www.motherearthnews.com/organic-gardening.aspx

go get some coffee, and spend the day or week over there and I guaran-fuckin-tee you'll be more versed in organics than 95% of the people here.
got everything you need to know there.

Dude you should just post the link to your composting thread. It in itself is a pretty easy to follow set up for a compost pile.

Rasta Roy · May 3, 2016

DblBrryInvestments said:
Hey greasemonkey, I read earlier on that teas may not be necessary with amended soil.

I went with LC's mix recipe #1 for the first time this year, and it seems like a pretty food rich soil as it is.

My question is, did you mean teas are not necessary throughout the whole season or just earlier on when they're still young?

I just bought a 35$ air pump that does about 50 lpm and was really looking forward to start making AACTs.

The purpose of compost tea is to introduce microbiology into the soil. The microbes help break down organic matter into something the plants can uptake yada yada. If your amended soil has already sat and broke down or is already a healthy living soil because it's soil your recycling than using compost teas to add healthy microbiology can be kind of a mute point. Although I personally recommend doing AACTs for foliar feedings for your veg plants even if you don't need to do a soil application.

DblBrryInvestments · May 3, 2016

Rasta Roy said:
The purpose of compost tea is to introduce microbiology into the soil. The microbes help break down organic matter into something the plants can uptake yada yada. If your amended soil has already sat and broke down or is already a healthy living soil because it's soil your recycling than using compost teas to add healthy microbiology can be kind of a mute point. Although I personally recommend doing AACTs for foliar feedings for your veg plants even if you don't need to do a soil application.

Great reply! Good to know, thanks! I'm still new to this whole living soil scene, I was under the impression that you can't have enough of the stuff!

How often would you recommend foliar feeding and care to share any good recipes?

Would you still spray down with neem oil if you consistently are foliar feeding with AACTs, I love neem oil!

Rasta Roy · May 3, 2016

DblBrryInvestments said:
Great reply! Good to know, thanks! I'm still new to this whole living soil scene, I was under the impression that you can't have enough of the stuff!

How often would you recommend foliar feeding and care to share any good recipes?

Would you still spray down with neem oil if you consistently are foliar feeding with AACTs, I love neem oil!

Recipes are simple:
Five gallons of dechlorinated or r/O water
2 cups of compost or worm castings
1/2 cup of Molasses
Brew for 24-48 hours

Neem oil will block stomata so you can't do both. I foliar feed with compost teas through veg and right before I moved them into flower I spray them with neem oil.

DblBrryInvestments · May 3, 2016

Rasta Roy said:
Recipes are simple:
Five gallons of dechlorinated or r/O water
2 cups of compost or worm castings
1/2 cup of Molasses
Brew for 24-48 hours

Neem oil will block stomata so you can't do both. I foliar feed with compost teas through veg and right before I moved them into flower I spray them with neem oil.

Last set of questions, I appreciate the help!

Will the foliar feed help combat pests, I've had major problems with whiteflies and caterpillars in previous years, so that's why I'm crazy for the neem oil and of course BT, makes it even possible for me.

is this a decnet tea mix for veg?

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