Will 2 of these 600 watt LED COB diode lights match a 1000 watt HPS?

Colo MMJ · Apr 10, 2018

Colo MMJ · Apr 10, 2018

nfhiggs said:
30,000 lumens for 300W....

LOL - I can hit 30K lumens with 6 Samsung F strips at 30W each (180W total). For about the same cost.

This guy is selling junk.

Where are you getting those F Strips bro? Thanks.

Colo MMJ · Apr 10, 2018

diyled said:
The vero29 C is just over 2umo/j @1400ma. I doubt it stays the same with twice the current.

I am trying to get a COb or QB to replace 1000 Watt HPS SE for $500 or less. I am thinking the closest is QB with 4 boards for about $649.

3 - Vero 29 $220 but I would probably need at least 3 of these.
https://www.rapidled.com/vero29-triple-cob-array-kit/

thetr33man · Apr 10, 2018

CobKits said:
posting realistic assessments about the lights you are asking about is not "hating" if they are in fact substandard, don't take it personally. You seem to be always on the hunt for deals that are too-good-to-be true, so dont be shocked when they are in fact, demonstrated to be too good to be true.

short answer:
140000 lm/ "nearly" 30000 lumens = 5 of those@250W each

HPS is cheaper and more efficient

long answer:
dude claims it is 600W
then he claims it is 300 "True watts"
then he claims it draws 2.1A (which assuming it is 120V is actually 250W)

he then claims it is "nearly" 30000 lumens (and gives you no information how he determined that number)
then he claims it will "easily outperform" a 400W HPS (which is actually 50000 lumens)
then he claims it is "on par with the best 600w HPS" - well the "best" 600W HPD would be a DE, about 96,000 lumens

even if it really was 30000 lumens (which you have absolutely no way to verify), at 250 input watts thats only 120 lm/W which is pretty awful by todays standards

enough red flags for you? if i wanted 30000 lumens of cheap intermediate efficiency white phosphors id go buy 4 of these for $85 and call it a day
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Philips-100-Watt-Equivalent-A19-LED-Light-Bulb-Daylight-4-Pack-455717/205887208

HA!

CobKits · Apr 10, 2018

Colo MMJ said:
I am trying to get a COb or QB to replace 1000 Watt HPS SE for $500 or less. I am thinking the closest is QB with 4 boards for about $649.

3 - Vero 29 $220 but I would probably need at least 3 of these.
https://www.rapidled.com/vero29-triple-cob-array-kit/

$550 for a 725W rig of 9 luminus on 3 hlg-185h-48a drivers. its not under $500 but will save you $200 a year in electricity and $50-$100 a year in bulbs over a 1000W HPS

CobKits · Apr 10, 2018

diyled said:
And ill stick to what the sphere says.

good call. build the actual fixture with drivers and optics and put it in a sphere at steady state operating temperature and then you will see that the system level efficiency is about 70-80% as efficient as the chips tested alone at 25C

Randomblame · Apr 10, 2018

Colo MMJ said:
Where are you getting those F Strips bro? Thanks.

From digikey or arrow, bro.
That's all F-strips listed on digikey..
The 4ft. double-row strips are interesting for you. Each has 288 LM561c diodes so basicly a QB288 in long for ~50$ instead of 75.
4-6 of them in parallel and two Meanwell HLG-320H-48A drivers are ~700w at the wall and would adaquately replace a 1000w HPS.

https://www.digikey.de/products/de/optoelectronics/led-lighting-cobs-engines-modules/111?k=&pkeyword=&v=1510&s=56498&FV=ffe0006f&mnonly=0&ColumnSort=0&page=1&quantity=0&ptm=0&fid=0&pageSize=25

Randomblame · Apr 10, 2018

So ~200-300$ for 4-6 strips and 160$ for the 2 drivers. Add another 100$ for 4-6 aluminium c-channels, some ft. single core wire(AWG18-22 will work), a roll double sided thermal tape and some misc parts and the whole lamp stay for sure below 550$ with 6 and below 450$ with only 4 strips.

ANC · Apr 10, 2018

You don't need such expensive channel, use lightweight stuff.
I got 32 feet of 3-inch channel for about $50

Colo MMJ · Apr 10, 2018

ANC said:
You don't need such expensive channel, use lightweight stuff.
I got 32 feet of 3-inch channel for about $50

Damn that is cheap. Local store or online or local steel scrap place? Thanks bro.

ANC · Apr 10, 2018

Local place, not even non-ferrous specialists. Just common builders warehouse setup.
The trick is to look for thin extrusions. Many of the larger extrusions are 3 or 4mm or more...
This is just unnecessary thermal mass. Each of my 300W lights weighs maybe 5 or 6 pounds including the driver.

Slinging PAR · Apr 10, 2018

diyled said:
Im out.

I don't know why you guys aren't using your component manufacturers' data. The budget they put into QA exceeds your combined sales forever so it would make business sense to leverage it. That is not being adversarial but respectful just to make it clear. Everyone is so thin skinned on the internet and thinks any differing viewpoint is an attack on them making it hard to get a decent discussion on anything without it turning into a slag fest.

CobKits said:
good call. build the actual fixture with drivers and optics and put it in a sphere at steady state operating temperature and then you will see that the system level efficiency is about 70-80% as efficient as the chips tested alone at 25C

If you are only getting 70-80% of your planned performance then you are doing something wrong. Either in calculations or assembly. Maybe a component isn't performing?

* edit: spelling is terrible.

CobKits · Apr 10, 2018

Slinging PAR said:
I don't know why you guys aren't using your component manufacturers' data. The budget they put into QA exceeds your combined sales forever so it would make business sense to leverage it. That is not being adversarial but respectful just to make it clear. Everyone is so thin skinned on the internet and thinks any differing viewpoint is an attack on them making it hard to get a decent discussion on anything without it turning into a slag fest.

If you are only getting 70-80% of your planned performance than you are doing something wrong. Either in calculations or assembly. Maybe a component isn't performing?

i havent researched your specific example but heres a general one

chip = 2.0 umol/J at 25C

correct to Tj at 70C (realistic if not conservative for 200W thru a chip) = 0.95
typical lens or reflector = 0.93
typical driver = 0.91-0.93

these losses are cumulative so theres 80% net efficiency right there

what is "wrong" with the design? they are design decisions, which all have a cost

Slinging PAR · Apr 10, 2018

CobKits said:
i havent researched your specific example but heres a general one

chip = 2.0 umol/J at 25C

correct to Tj at 70C (realistic if not conservative for 200W thru a chip) = 0.95
typical lens or reflector = 0.93
typical driver = 0.91-0.93

these losses are cumulative so theres 80% net efficiency right there

what is "wrong" with the design? they are design decisions, which all have a cost

2 different perspectives. I am working with the light output for a given amount of power which is presented on the data sheets.

You guys are looking at from all those other things which are better handled as necessary overhead anyhow. Many can be offset with other means. Example, why use reflectors or lenses? How about a cooler environment? Better power delivery?

Now we are way off topic. Aside from those discussions, back to the op, you still can get 30k lumen out of a 29 C.

nfhiggs · Apr 10, 2018

Colo MMJ said:
Where are you getting those F Strips bro? Thanks.

I got mine a month back from Arrow.

nfhiggs · Apr 10, 2018

Colo MMJ said:
I am trying to get a COb or QB to replace 1000 Watt HPS SE for $500 or less. I am thinking the closest is QB with 4 boards for about $649.

3 - Vero 29 $220 but I would probably need at least 3 of these.
https://www.rapidled.com/vero29-triple-cob-array-kit/

6 of the 100W 44" double row F series strips is about $300. Two 320H-48A drivers - about $180. 4 8 foot long 1" aluminum U-channels - another 50 bucks. There ya go.

skoomd · Apr 10, 2018

nfhiggs said:
6 of the 100W 44" double row F series strips is about $300. Two 320H-48A drivers - about $180. 4 8 foot long 1" aluminum U-channels - another 50 bucks. There ya go.

And those 44" double rows can be cranked up to about 200 watts a piece

Colo MMJ · Apr 11, 2018

nfhiggs said:
6 of the 100W 44" double row F series strips is about $300. Two 320H-48A drivers - about $180. 4 8 foot long 1" aluminum U-channels - another 50 bucks. There ya go.

Where do you buy them at friend? Thanks bro.

Colo MMJ · Apr 11, 2018

nfhiggs said:
6 of the 100W 44" double row F series strips is about $300. Two 320H-48A drivers - about $180. 4 8 foot long 1" aluminum U-channels - another 50 bucks. There ya go.

Is this it?

https://www.digikey.com/products/en?mpart=SI-B8U261560WW&v=1510

I cannot find the link on Arrow??? Thanks.

nfhiggs · Apr 11, 2018

Colo MMJ said:
Is this it?

https://www.digikey.com/products/en?mpart=SI-B8U261560WW&v=1510

I cannot find the link on Arrow??? Thanks.

Those are the single row strips - they work just as good, you just need to get twice as many strips - 12 instead of 6. Overall cost is going to be about the same.

Arrow is out of stock right now.

Will 2 of these 600 watt LED COB diode lights match a 1000 watt HPS?

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