the thing i dislike about multi plant chambers,.. even though I've used a refrigerator as one in the past too,.. is the roots get tangled together, and you most likely need to grow the same strain, as well as crop all at the plants same time. I personally prefer a perpetual crop. Being legal i can have plants, but not many many ounces on hand. It's why i went individual buckets,.. and someday will go individual garbage cans, lol
True HP Aero For 2011
- Thread starter Trichy Bastard
- Start date
Wow that's a great idea you would def have to mess with the thermostat to keep it 60-65 degreesMaybe, but I think it is because he is able to provide optimal condtions with his aero being dialed in, nutes and everything. When you finally get it right, it seems all the trouble and expense of going all the way with HPA could be made up for in the extra yeilds of your first good grow. I don't know anyone else who currently has as nice of roots, or as good of performance per watt. It's a good inspiration to know that these results are possible for us if we keep working towards it. Alot of growers consider 1gram/watt the target to shoot for if you have everything perfect, while tree farmer would be scratching his head wondering what went wrong with these numbers!
My chamber is nearly done being retrofitted with the foam application. It really looks ugly as crap inside, the outside hasnt been compromised except for a few ripples due to overexpansion luckily. Hope I will fill the inside with so many roots that it will camoflauge the ugly foam so I can take some nice pics. I have a feeling however, that this thing is going to perform like a giant 5 day igloo ice chest, and that's what I was hoping for. Atomizer once told me a possibility for a root chamber would be one of those freezers with the door on the top. It's well insulated and you could retrofit the thermostat with a different refrigerator model that would control it in the 60 degee tamp range. Not really worth buying a new one for the job, but if you have an older one sitting around, or can find one on craigslist for 50 bucks, wouldn't be a bad idea to try.
youd almost need to swap out the freezer components for fridge components
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
Makes sense. I have seen G-love grow different strains in the same pod. It probably isn't ideal, but can be done fairly sucessfully. The main purpose of doing a multi plant chamber is because you can get the chamber large enough for the mist to spread out and expand properly. Trying to grow hp aero in 5 gallon buckets has never worked to it's full potential, although as even you have proven, it can still yield pretty good results if you get it dialed in. tree farmer seems to have the best of both worlds by growing trees- he gets large enough chambers, and only 1 plant per. I keep having dreams about putting some large chambers underground and growing some trees in them myself. I've also heard of some interesting setups with moveable panels filled with sog plants- you can jus move the whole trays from the veg area to the flower area, and restart the veg area again.
TheTruSmokr
Active Member
WOW!!! well put Trichy. I think I am going to start some SOG growing.
I measured my well tap water ppm. Using the .5 scale it measured 60 ppm, and this is after a lot of rain the past two weeks. So I think I am good here. I washed my roots last night, and flushed out the system. I then mixed a new batch keeping as close to 312 npk as possible. I had about 150 ppm before adding the cal-mag and now at around 257 ppm. Hope to see everything turn around this week. I used the premixppm3b tool to figure out the mixture. It took me a little while to figure the tool out but it is very usefull. It figures the ppm a little low but it is close to the end result. I didn't have the full info needed for the cal-mag so I contacted Botanicare and they got right back to me. On the bottle it didn't state the ppm that the tool needed. In case if anyone needs it, it is 60 ppm 1ml/gal. Wish me luck!
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
Yeah, sounds like your tap water is fairly soft, so that's good man. Just retest it every once in a while to make sure it doesn't change seasonally like some does. Glad your getting somewhere with the tools, keep us updated. Definitely rooting for you and your plants!
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
Still frustrated... The foam isn't curing properly in the chamber walls because it seals itself off. I drilled a small hole in the bottom just to see- and out shot amber sappy foam that sort of cured when it hit the air. I'm getting pretty discouraged that I have been dealing with heat issues for months now and can't seem to fix them other than a complete rebuild of the chamber, which I have neither the time nor money for any more. Not really sure what to do anymore- if I were indoors, or somewhere that the sun wasn't so strong it would be different. As it were before, I chilled the nutes down to 40 degrees, and the chamber didn't even fall a full degree from the 99 degrees it was sitting at prior to chilling them. I don't want to insulate the outside of the chamber because it will be an eyesore and attract attention. If I insulate the inside, I lose chamber volume. The only thing that made the most sense was inbetwen the chamber walls. It's bothering me that I can't seem to think my way out of this issue. It's funny how no matter how much you read about the other obstacles others had, and incorporate fixes for them in your design, you'll always have your own personalized set of issues.
How can insulating the outside attract attention, but flowering mj plants outside not? You said hpa is all about control, but you're never going to have any in that heat. Waiting for foliage to block direct sunlight from hitting your root chamber isn't really taking control either imo. I'd seriously consider moving inside and growing under LED's since you said electric is so costly. At least then you'll get control of your heat, and be able to put all your fancy equipment to accurate controlled use.
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
The whole point is to get the benefits if true sunlight, and not have to waste a bunch of energy. It would cost alot more to buy leds and supply them energy than to rebuild a chamber that's properly insulated. Of course I know this is my control issue, and why I am addressing it. The foliage blocking heat will be a nice benefit to the later stages of growth, but I agree it will be tough getting there until then. Even so, the shade will drop the temps, but probably still not to where I'd like them at (65f degrees). I am patiently waiting to see if perhaps the foam that has cured will work well enough. I have my remote thermometer sensor in there now, taking measurements of inside the chamber and the other half is taking ambient air temps. I should be able to tell if the insulation is making some sort of difference in tonight's cold and tomorrow's heat.
get wanting to grow outside, but you said your root zone hits 99f, and the air temp higher?... You didn't have to say you wanted 65f, everyone would. You better bury a deep freezer in the ground a few feet. Not to mention, who can really offer you good ideas without seeing your situation.
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
No- the air never xceeds 95 actually, and it gets around 60-70 at night... It's really not hard to cool an aero chamber as long as it is properly insulated. As long as I cool my nutes, they, along with evaporative cooling will easily keep the chamber cool. My entire setup and situation is documented and with pics, but you'd have to read a decent portion of this thread. I actually love reading about aero in good threads, in the beginning of this one, I link some of the best ones ever to be seen- might be worth checking out if you want to further your knowedge.
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
My problem was I gave more credit to the pull down effect of evaporative cooling than it had, and biggest issue is my dark plastic chamber is like a magnet for heat in the sun. The plastic in the lid actually gets soft in the sun, and too hot to touch. I figured the dual wall construction might be enough, but I was severely mistaken. Also, because the humidity is usually in the 70s and 80%- the air is alot more penetrating with the temp it is carrying.
tree farmer
Well-Known Member
the evaporative effect does work but will not cool imho anything that much if in direct sunlight. evaporative cooling works great in my AA chamber cooling the air and the solution going into a well insulated tank(3inches insulation) but i can tell that even something like this would not cool a large chamber in direct sunlight. Hp isnt like the evaporative cooling they sell for hot climates like arizona where the mist can drop the temps 15 degrees. Hp doesnt mist enough for that kind of cooling effect. imo to cool a chamber outside youd have to either use a refregerant type container or have a well insulated tank and bury it into the ground and then deal with the cover with thick insulation and reflective material. each of these i know isnt very practical unless you own your own property away from prying eyes. the great HPS in the sky could do amazing things with HP i bet as i once saw a mj plant in Australia grown in the intense sun and a huge pit filled with compost. the thing was as big as a small house. over 20ft tall and im guessing15-20ft square. now doing lp aero outside would not be much of a problem as ive seen some commerial tomato setups that grew so many tomatoes it was truly amazing but thats adifferent beast. maybe a container like this might do the trick
http://www.mrboxonline.com/plastic-chest-insulated-coolers-c-102_337.html?osCsid=b895598084902252e7d3ee2afccf0ddd
http://www.mrboxonline.com/plastic-chest-insulated-coolers-c-102_337.html?osCsid=b895598084902252e7d3ee2afccf0ddd
I said pages ago you MUST get direct sunlight hitting any of your shit, (minus your plants) out of the equation. An 1/8" thick sheet of anything to block the light, just a few inches atop your shit getting too hot, and bonus if you can move the air in that gap created, that my friend would lower your temp two fold what insolation will. But don't listen to me i don't know shit.
...to keep the sun off of it,..
and wait, who said bury a fridge in the ground earlier?.. but yea again i don't know shit
PetFlora
Well-Known Member
I just moved one of the Super Cropping Clones from my bubbler closet into my hpa rig. It has 3 roots about 4" long + lots of small laterals. I took 3 more cuttings at the same time, but they haven't rooted yet, although one has a bunch of root nodes. Weird huh?
I bought a 50 cfl reptile uvb bulb today. Added it to my high performance bubble clone closet. Got it on 4 hours a day (12-4) along with 3 daylight cfls. Gonna leave my UFO 90 on 24/0. This could be very interesting
I bought a 50 cfl reptile uvb bulb today. Added it to my high performance bubble clone closet. Got it on 4 hours a day (12-4) along with 3 daylight cfls. Gonna leave my UFO 90 on 24/0. This could be very interesting
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
I agree the sun is the first thing that is an issue. I do have a shade screen I put over the top of the chamber, even to protect the youngins until they're ready for the full force of the sun. The sides of the chamber are shaded from the foliage that grows from the ground below, so the top is the only real issue. Those bins you linked are pretty cool, matter of fact they look like a similar concept to my chamber after I filled the walls with insulation. A good sized one is a grand or so, plus shipping would be alot. I am sure I can build something with thick enough walls and insulation, but I'll have to do more research on the science of insulation. I do have the luxury of having my own place, and a good sized private yard at that. I just would have preferred to have everything up here on the second floor deck, so it's easy to keep an eye on things, and also to make sure none of the kids around here mess with it. I also seem to not have any issues with critters and bugs up here too. In the end, perhaps something in the ground will be the best idea, but the soil here seems to sit around 79 degrees itself, as are my tapwater temps. I am excited to see how the tropical sun would combine with HPA if I can just get the details worked out, i am sure it would be some pretty amazing results.
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
I'm quite aware of this, I just redesigned my roof last year since I have open beam vaulted cielings, no attic. I Put 2x4"s on end, and created an airgap from the original roof, plyed over with radiant barrier ply, and then shingled over. There is a ridge vent in the top seams that keeps the air cool with convection, constantly sucking air from the lower edges of the roof up and out the top ridge. It made a huge difference in my air conditioning bill. I could easily build an extra top over the chamber, out of plywood or whatever, with a 2" gap between the chamber, and holes just large enoungh for the stems to grow through. As mentioned before, the sides of the chamber don't really get much direct sun at all. Not sure why you feel the need to add comments like the end of your statement, but it detracts from the rest of the post.
yea Im using 2 5 gallon buckets stacked on one another and there not even that big and are outgrowing them! there black buckets as well which could be adding to my issue?! my chamber temps are prob around 85 i need to check but ill try wrapping them in reflective material hopefully it will help.