DWC Root Slime Cure aka How to Breed Beneficial Microbes

Skybound420

Skybound420

Well-Known Member
I've been using this for years in a top feed rockwool croutons for years. My mentor that taught me this recipe over on 420 mag like 4 years back later took a liking to Real Grower's Recharge and sent me a tub. I used it, but found much more plant vigor from using the HBT that I reverted. I only make 1 gallon every 3 days and use 36-48 hours after mixing. I have a weak ass air pump, so I also use a small 160 GPH pump and some tubing to circulate the bucket briefly every few hours to compensate. The recipes is as follows;

1 Gallon RO
3ml unsulfured molasses - agitate water till molasses dissolves
5-10ml Hydro Guard
1-2ml Fish Shit ***
1/4 TSP fulvic/humic/kelp blend ***
1/4 cup Ancient Forest in cheese cloth and zip tied
0.5 grams Great White - this is about 2/3 of a 1/4TSP scooper

aerate for a day and a half to 2 days and use. The cheese cloth prevents need of filtering. The ingredients with 3 asterisks (***) are things I added to the original recipe. As the OP stated, these things can be mixed and matched, whatever's possible to get the most diversity. Also, only add enough molasses to wake the bennies up and get them ready to feast. I know the bennies will all be dead in short order, so I want them to eat as much from the roots as possible before they tap out.

Thanks Heisenberg for taking the time way back when!!!

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Heisenberg

Heisenberg

Well-Known Member
nutcase said:
Hi all, sourcing a lot of this stuff in Australia is a major hassle, I went the sterile res route (chlorine) and it's worked for me, I'm back in action, new white roots everywhere, my only question is can I use floralicious plus in a sterile res as I believe it has kelp in it?
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There's no point. According to the GH website FL+ contains "high concentrations of vitamins, complex sugars, amino acids, polyflavonoids and aromatic oils in an organic fulvic base."

Plants cannot uptake organic compounds. They are too complex. They must first be broken down by microbes into less complex compounds. If your res is sterile then you have no microbes to break the FL+ down. So you will just be dumping it out when you dump the res.

If you're not having root problems I can understand not wanting to change things. I'd jus drop FL+ if I were you.
 
Skybound420

Skybound420

Well-Known Member
nicksol86 said:
Easiest, quickest, and cheapest method to brew a tea in only 15 minutes. Don't believe it read for your self. https://www.dudegrows.com/captain-uses-recharge/

Update from previous link.
https://www.dudegrows.com/recharge-beneficial-bacteria-final-thoughts-thecapn/

Straight from real growers site.
https://www.realgrowers.com/product/recharge/

Lots of great reviews and highly rated product on Amazon here.
https://www.amazon.com/Real-Growers-Recharge-8oz/dp/B00J1CAEIG/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1542249648&sr=8-3&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_FMwebp_QL65&keywords=real+grower+recharge&dpPl=1&dpID=41Q7Y590krL&ref=plSrch

It treated root rot here.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.reddit.com/r/microgrowery/comments/5sy285/recharge_saved_my_friends_growtotal_root_rot_to/#ampf=undefined

It also prevents and I believe fixes slime, the brown slime mentioned by Heisenberg on page 1 in his first post about cyanobacteria.
https://www.dudegrows.com/hydro-slime/

Hope this helps everyone. Happy growing :)
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Before The Capn blogged with Dude Grows, he was on 420 mag teaching us about Simple Hydroponics which he later dubbed Capn Style. His methods produce DWC-like plant vigor while eliminating most of the liabilities that come with DWC and aero, the most of which is depleted O2 in the water. Capn Style uses rockwool cubes which I have pictured above and is a top fed hydroponic system, so the roots have constant access to atmospheric air and nutrients from the rockwool while also buffering against timer or pump failures by keeping a generous supply of water and nutes stored in the rockwool. I've been using this technique since 2013 and have no plans of ever changing.

He is the guy that turned me onto Heisenberg's Tea, and than later onto Recharge. I will say that Recharge is a good product that doesn't require other ingredients, so it's mix and use. Well, I used it for about a year or two and though in that time I didn't encounter any root concerns, I did notice that my grows weren't growing as vigorously as they have when I brewed my own HBT, so I made the executive decision to revert to what worked better for me. The primary reason though is that Great White has a way more diverse combination of colonies to keep bad things at bay. I think the strength of using Tea mostly is frequent or continued use to stay ahead of the curve, or preventative maintenance. I suppose Recharge might be more reactive if aerated for a day or so and perhaps I may one day test that theory as I still have some Recharge, but IMO, I already have all of the primary ingredients to make a better product, it just requires some added effort which is ok with me.
 
nicksol86

nicksol86

Well-Known Member
Is it better to brew the tea with earthworm castings or is it better to brew the tea with ancient forest humus soil? And when applying the tea to deep water culture buckets do you pour it in the hydroton then let it drip into your reservoir? Or do you not want the tea in your res water? And also I was reading about making teas in other sites and mollases wakes up the beneficial bacteria. They also said in order to wake up the fungi you need food for them too like fish hydrolysate will feed the fungi while the molasses feeds the bacteria. Why do you only feed the bacteria and not the fungi? Is there a purpose here? @Heisenberg
 
Heisenberg

Heisenberg

Well-Known Member
nicksol86 said:
Is it better to brew the tea with earthworm castings or is it better to brew the tea with ancient forest humus soil? And when applying the tea to deep water culture buckets do you pour it in the hydroton then let it drip into your reservoir? Or do you not want the tea in your res water? And also I was reading about making teas in other sites and mollases wakes up the beneficial bacteria. They also said in order to wake up the fungi you need food for them too like fish hydrolysate will feed the fungi while the molasses feeds the bacteria. Why do you only feed the bacteria and not the fungi? Is there a purpose here? @Heisenberg
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Technically the ancient forest probably offers a much more diverse microbe population, but EWC works just fine. Generally the tea is added directly to the res though it is a good idea to pour some over the base of the stem and let it drain through.

The only fungi we really care about in DWC grows directly on the roots, meaning they don't wake up until we put them in the res anyway. That's why I recommend not adding any fungi products to the tea until a few hours before using it. That's enough time to soften the spores and get them ready for germ. Most myco fungi aren't gonna grow underwater, so really the only thing we care about is trichoderma.
 
nicksol86

nicksol86

Well-Known Member
Heisenberg said:
Technically the ancient forest probably offers a much more diverse microbe population, but EWC works just fine. Generally the tea is added directly to the res though it is a good idea to pour some over the base of the stem and let it drain through.

The only fungi we really care about in DWC grows directly on the roots, meaning they don't wake up until we put them in the res anyway. That's why I recommend not adding any fungi products to the tea until a few hours before using it. That's enough time to soften the spores and get them ready for germ. Most myco fungi aren't gonna grow underwater, so really the only thing we care about is trichoderma.
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Heisenberg said:
Technically the ancient forest probably offers a much more diverse microbe population, but EWC works just fine. Generally the tea is added directly to the res though it is a good idea to pour some over the base of the stem and let it drain through.

The only fungi we really care about in DWC grows directly on the roots, meaning they don't wake up until we put them in the res anyway. That's why I recommend not adding any fungi products to the tea until a few hours before using it. That's enough time to soften the spores and get them ready for germ. Most myco fungi aren't gonna grow underwater, so really the only thing we care about is trichoderma.
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So add the great white or mycogrow soluble a few hours before you feed the tea? I was just worried about the blackstrap molasses being in dwc. People told me with real growers recharge which I'm using now to not leave it in the res. But to pour it to the root base and let it drip down a drain so it doesn't cause any nasties in my res since that product contains molasses already in it. I plan to brew your tea too when I get funds together. I want to test it against recharge to see whats what. I believe your tea will be better but I don't know . There's not lots of info about real growers recharge or using teas in hydroponics on the web. Tons of info about feeding Bennie's to soil but not a lot on hydro
 
N

nutcase

Active Member
Heisenberg said:
There's no point. According to the GH website FL+ contains "high concentrations of vitamins, complex sugars, amino acids, polyflavonoids and aromatic oils in an organic fulvic base."

Plants cannot uptake organic compounds. They are too complex. They must first be broken down by microbes into less complex compounds. If your res is sterile then you have no microbes to break the FL+ down. So you will just be dumping it out when you dump the res.

If you're not having root problems I can understand not wanting to change things. I'd jus drop FL+ if I were you.
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Thanks Heisenberg, I'm going to make a tea with EWC and great white for my next grow but poolshock will have to do for now to get my ladies over the line. They didn't grow at all for almost 3 weeks due to root issues and they were 2 weeks into flower, they're 8 weeks in now, and this strain is supposed to finish in 1-2 weeks, so you know if I should be pushing the harvest back a week or 2 because of the stunted growth?
 
Heisenberg

Heisenberg

Well-Known Member
nicksol86 said:
So add the great white or mycogrow soluble a few hours before you feed the tea? I was just worried about the blackstrap molasses being in dwc. People told me with real growers recharge which I'm using now to not leave it in the res. But to pour it to the root base and let it drip down a drain so it doesn't cause any nasties in my res since that product contains molasses already in it. I plan to brew your tea too when I get funds together. I want to test it against recharge to see whats what. I believe your tea will be better but I don't know . There's not lots of info about real growers recharge or using teas in hydroponics on the web. Tons of info about feeding Bennie's to soil but not a lot on hydro
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The 48 hours we brew the tea gives time for the molasses to be broken down so it's not a threat to your res. If you want to use recharge in DWC you should probably brew it tea style first. It has a lot of organic stuff that will invite slime if you add it directly to the res.
 
Heisenberg

Heisenberg

Well-Known Member
nutcase said:
Thanks Heisenberg, I'm going to make a tea with EWC and great white for my next grow but poolshock will have to do for now to get my ladies over the line. They didn't grow at all for almost 3 weeks due to root issues and they were 2 weeks into flower, they're 8 weeks in now, and this strain is supposed to finish in 1-2 weeks, so you know if I should be pushing the harvest back a week or 2 because of the stunted growth?
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If you lost two weeks during the stretch period there isn't really a way to get that back. That's gonna effect yield more so than ripening. It's hard to say without knowing your plants, but they will probably finish in about the same time as they would have anyway.
 
Skybound420

Skybound420

Well-Known Member
@Heisenberg In your opinion, how long will bennies survive in the presence of dissolved sulfur? I mix my own concentrates and when mixing up my targets, I'm getting improved results by raising the sulfur content in my regimens. That said, my media will likely have a plentiful supply of it and I'd like to know about how long the bennies have in such an environment before dying off?
 
Heisenberg

Heisenberg

Well-Known Member
Skybound420 said:
@Heisenberg In your opinion, how long will bennies survive in the presence of dissolved sulfur? I mix my own concentrates and when mixing up my targets, I'm getting improved results by raising the sulfur content in my regimens. That said, my media will likely have a plentiful supply of it and I'd like to know about how long the bennies have in such an environment before dying off?
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I have no direct experience, but ppl who have tried sulfur burners with DWC have reported die off and slime within a few days due to air pumps cycling the sulfur through the water. But I imagine the concentration gets very high in that case.

My guess is you'll be ok with weekly doses and eventually the tolerant microbes will colonize.
 
Skybound420

Skybound420

Well-Known Member
Being in potted rockwool, slime is never a concern of mine. I make tea twice every week and more or less rely on preventative maintenance. Thanks for the feedback! Merry Christmas.
 
nicksol86

nicksol86

Well-Known Member
Heisenberg said:
The 48 hours we brew the tea gives time for the molasses to be broken down so it's not a threat to your res. If you want to use recharge in DWC you should probably brew it tea style first. It has a lot of organic stuff that will invite slime if you add it directly to the res.
Click to expand...
Thanks for all your help Heisenberg. Your a true og and your well known legend on the internet. Everyone having root rot or slime issues eventually stumbles upon this thread or the same info on different sites shared by other growers cuz I've seen ppl on other sites sharing your info also. Your awesome bro. Thanks for helping the whole growing community like you do. Mad respect and Merry Christmas to you and your family and friends bud. All these growers using sterile are missing out in my opinion. I've been convinced since the start that Bennie's were the way to go over sterile. Bennie's actually benefit your plants, sterile just kills shit with no benefits and your putting bad chemicals in your plant if you ask me.
 
Heisenberg

Heisenberg

Well-Known Member
nicksol86 said:
Thanks for all your help Heisenberg. Your a true og and your well known legend on the internet. Everyone having root rot or slime issues eventually stumbles upon this thread or the same info on different sites shared by other growers cuz I've seen ppl on other sites sharing your info also. Your awesome bro. Thanks for helping the whole growing community like you do. Mad respect and Merry Christmas to you and your family and friends bud. All these growers using sterile are missing out in my opinion. I've been convinced since the start that Bennie's were the way to go over sterile. Bennie's actually benefit your plants, sterile just kills shit with no benefits and your putting bad chemicals in your plant if you ask me.
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Thanks for the kind words. Glad the info is helping ppl. And as I've pointed out several times in this thread, the real credit goes to RichyRich over at icmag for pioneering the recipe.

I personally can't see doing DWC without microbes, but I do understand everyone is in a different situation. There may be times when it makes sense to go sterile, although I can't think of any. ;)
 
S

Siezed

Member
Hi all, I’m having trouble even STARTING my seeds right now nevermind getting rot in the dwc stage, my seedlings grow to the first set of true leaves then start curling, turning yellow and eventually just drying up and dying. I’ve lost 5 seedlings because of this and I cannot figure out what is happening. It all started when two things happened, I bought a clone from a shady looking seed shop, and I also was an idiot and used old water I had sitting in a water jug, well it formed slime and died within weeks, and ever since then everything I plant in my room seems to get this same clear slime that chokes out my plant, even starting in coco or rock wool I got the same foliar result. My question is, is this the same pathogen that you guys are curing with bennies or is the fact I can’t even get my girls to show enough roots to put them in a reservoir mean it’s something different? I know it’s the same clear slimy shit that killed my clone because I actually did a little test where I washed off the sick roots in a starter plug and made a mini reservoir so just the bottoms of the roots were in water and the top was in dry foam, and
the roots formed the same slimy shit within two days even after I changed the water halfway through. Whatever this is it seems to be either in the air or in my nutrient bottles because this last set of seedlings I used distilled water to rule that out. Sorry for the long post I’m just not sure what might be relevant since I have tried so much including neem oil, h202, potassium permanganate, sparsely watering, multiple mediums, I even bought a seedling heat mat and lowered my temps to try and stay right under 70, nothing seems to even affect it, just grows and attacks. Also this same slime actually formed in my humidifier as well that I bought for my clone, I checked the humidifier after about a week or so of using it and the bottom was the same slimy shit so whatever it is it’s probably spread all over my room and not really feasible to disinfect the entire area because I don’t even know how I’d do that to like my closet and bed etc. So should I try this beneficial tea on my seeds or am I dealing with something different here? How do you even use this on a starter plug? Add it to my watering solution or? Thanks and this is a last ditch effort here because I’m exhausted reading about pythium and root rot, but this is the one of the first posts I’ve read about this brown algae that really isn’t algae so I have hope.
 
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nicksol86

nicksol86

Well-Known Member
Siezed said:
Hi all, I’m having trouble even STARTING my seeds right now nevermind getting rot in the dwc stage, my seedlings grow to the first set of true leaves then start curling, turning yellow and eventually just drying up and dying. I’ve lost 5 seedlings because of this and I cannot figure out what is happening. It all started when two things happened, I bought a clone from a shady looking seed shop, and I also was an idiot and used old water I had sitting in a water jug, well it formed slime and died within weeks, and ever since then everything I plant in my room seems to get this same clear slime that chokes out my plant, even starting in coco or rock wool I got the same foliar result. My question is, is this the same pathogen that you guys are curing with bennies or is the fact I can’t even get my girls to show enough roots to put them in a reservoir mean it’s something different? I know it’s the same clear slimy shit that killed my clone because I actually did a little test where I washed off the sick roots in a starter plug and made a mini reservoir so just the bottoms of the roots were in water and the top was in dry foam, and
the roots formed the same slimy shit within two days even after I changed the water halfway through. Whatever this is it seems to be either in the air or in my nutrient bottles because this last set of seedlings I used distilled water to rule that out. Sorry for the long post I’m just not sure what might be relevant since I have tried so much including neem oil, h202, potassium permanganate, sparsely watering, multiple mediums, I even bought a seedling heat mat and lowered my temps to try and stay right under 70, nothing seems to even affect it, just grows and attacks. Also this same slime actually formed in my humidifier as well that I bought for my clone, I checked the humidifier after about a week or so of using it and the bottom was the same slimy shit so whatever it is it’s probably spread all over my room and not really feasible to disinfect the entire area because I don’t even know how I’d do that to like my closet and bed etc. So should I try this beneficial tea on my seeds or am I dealing with something different here? How do you even use this on a starter plug? Add it to my watering solution or? Thanks and this is a last ditch effort here because I’m exhausted reading about pythium and root rot, but this is the one of the first posts I’ve read about this brown algae that really isn’t algae so I have hope.
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Brew this tea. Or try hydroguard? Or if funds are low real growers recharge might help to add Bennie's for cheaper than this tea but this tea is best if your having problems. Go to page 1 and read the first post by Heisenberg
 
S

Siezed

Member
nicksol86 said:
Brew this tea. Or try hydroguard? Or if funds are low real growers recharge might help to add Bennie's for cheaper than this tea but this tea is best if your having problems. Go to page 1 and read the first post by Heisenberg
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Thanks for the reply, yea money is very tight at the moment so I bought some super cheap worm casting off eBay for like $1.50 for a 2 tbsp trial package and a 100g package of “mykos” mycorrhizae for $5.50, and I already have a jug of Monterey complete disease control which the guy at the grow shop told me was the same strain as Aquashield just more concentrated. I really hope this will work just wasn’t sure I was dealing with the same thing since everyone seems to be talking about established plants and mine won’t even get that far.
 
Skybound420

Skybound420

Well-Known Member
Siezed said:
Thanks for the reply, yea money is very tight at the moment so I bought some super cheap worm casting off eBay for like $1.50 for a 2 tbsp trial package and a 100g package of “mykos” mycorrhizae for $5.50, and I already have a jug of Monterey complete disease control which the guy at the grow shop told me was the same strain as Aquashield just more concentrated. I really hope this will work just wasn’t sure I was dealing with the same thing since everyone seems to be talking about established plants and mine won’t even get that far.
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If you're in the USA, you'll have more options than not, but generally, you want warmer and more humid areas (totes) for clones when they're rooting. H Tea is good to use at all times, but you want to let the medium dry before the next feeding. For cloning, I have great success mixing a bloom supplement with a fulvic/humic/kelp mix in equal parts to about 300ppm on the meter. I alternate between feed and inoculations every 24 hours. I clone in rockwool starting cubes too. I'm 100% and see roots in usually 8-10 days like clockwork. I do use RO, but have read pythium is in the air we breathe, and I assume some locations have more of it.

The magic of the tea is best realized when used frequently. I brew a tea for 36 hours and use it, then wait a day and brew another. I slimmed it down to just RO, molasses, Ancient Forest and Great White mycos. I also have other amendments I mix in from time to time such as Fish Shit, some stuff called Photosynthesis Plus, Rhizo, or that fulvic/humic/kelp blend I mentioned above. I grow with synthetic nutes, so I keep all organics to the tea as bennies are needed to properly process organics anyways.
 
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