Clone only strains

akhiymjames

akhiymjames

Well-Known Member
King Arthur said:
Nope, first run went too long in soil 3 gal pots.
2nd run was 8 clone consisting of 2 phenos each having 4 in their square.
3rd run was another seed in a smaller tent and she looked amazing but still threw the bananas.

Every single one has so far, while the ones next to it have no issue. I think it might not be acclimated to my environment and that could be it.
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How hot is your soil or do you feed with nutes? Some OGs are very finicky and some people can never dial them in right. Keep trying bro
 
shishkaboy

shishkaboy

Well-Known Member
akhiymjames said:
The exact reason why i asked cus it just doesn't make sense to clone a pheno if its gonna show other traits. Im experienced grower but I haven't dealt with clones all my runs have been from seed so this is all new to me but I've done my research and that just didn't sound right to me. Like I said I believe different growers and conditions have shown different looks of the same pheno but it should be pretty consistent but pheno dominate to one side or specific cross in the hybrid and then other traits are shown as dominate just doesn't add up. Thats why I said I hope some other would chime in on this cus like you said OG, Chem and all the others wouldn't be what they are today
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Phenotype is 50% genetics's and 50% environment. So a genetic "copy" exposed to the same environmental stimuli, should produce the same results. Like Mr mushroom mentioned changing the lights, nutes or any other environmental factors may give different results. For example, many varieties will turn purple when grown in a cooler environment. Same strain, same phenotype, different trigger, different color. It actually gets a little more complex when we talk about environmental triggers, this is why I asked if they were the same exact mom or not. Maybe you always had the golden ticket but didn't unlock it all the runs, just most. I must say I hope this is the case because I cannot see why if a nursery was using multiple sources, they would not at least just keep the best eventually. I would have to think at one point even if they were making selections they would at least run them to see which to keep and get rid of the rest, uniformity is necessary when it comes to clones.
 
King Arthur

King Arthur

Well-Known Member
akhiymjames said:
How hot is your soil or do you feed with nutes? Some OGs are very finicky and some people can never dial them in right. Keep trying bro
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I got all kinds of good stuff in the arsenal though, I didn't run past 1000 ppms the whole run. I gave them a lot of water in between feedings and they were very healthy plants for the most part. The only one I wasn't happy with was the ones I let go too long because I think the amber is like 50%. I will definitely keep trying but when I just finished a Fire OG clone and some Headband without a hitch it makes it a little less desirable. I will give them another shot but they are definitely not getting a quadrant to themselves.
 
akhiymjames

akhiymjames

Well-Known Member
shishkaboy said:
What are the key traits that distinguish the "golden ticket" from the others?
How many other phenos, what's the ratio?
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I really don't have a clue bro these are some pics are from Instagram. I found them researching the pheno. All I can go from is the pics and the thread that @mdjenks that Subcool started.
 
st0wandgrow

st0wandgrow

Well-Known Member
akhiymjames said:
Ok I see but yea I hope some others with more experience chime in on this cus this is very interesting. I have never bred anything either but gonna start dabbling soon so Ive been doing lots of research and studying. Gonna talk to a few people here as I know a couple that have great eyes for males and breeding.

I feel you on why you don't like Lebron and thats most people who don't like him like the way he had to get rings but tell me this did Cleveland surround him with the caliber of team he should've had? Think of all the great teams that won championships they were all stacked lol Lakers, Celtics, Bulls, Pistons, Rockets and Bucks with Big O and Kareem. So I understand why he did it and Cleveland won't make that mistake this time. You see how they're surrounding him with the right players. OKC built the team they are now. They should be stacked too as they had Harden and Green but let them go. KD is great but its gonna be hard for him to win with just him and Westbrook. They aren't enough but we could talk ball all day lets stay on topic. Hit me with a pm for that :lol:
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I don't know about anyone else, but when I take cuts from a mother plant EVERY clone from that plant is exactly the same. That's why it's called a clone. It's an exact genetic match to the mother.

I have never heard of clones coming from the same mother ending up being different phenos. That doesn't make sense.
 
King Arthur

King Arthur

Well-Known Member
st0wandgrow said:
I don't know about anyone else, but when I take cuts from a mother plant EVERY clone from that plant is exactly the same. That's why it's called a clone. It's an exact genetic match to the mother.

I have never heard of clones coming from the same mother ending up being different phenos. That doesn't make sense.
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That would defeat the purpose of cloning, I still don't get why we never got an answer as to why he found a golden ticket in a batch of clones. To me that sounds like horse shit.
 
st0wandgrow

st0wandgrow

Well-Known Member
King Arthur said:
That would defeat the purpose of cloning, I still don't get why we never got an answer as to why he found a golden ticket in a batch of clones. To me that sounds like horse shit.
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I would say wherever he's getting the clones from they are using different mother (which are different phenos of the same strain) plants to take the cuts from. There is no way that you could get the golden ticket one time, then the lime sherbet pheno the next time if all of the cuts are coming from the same plant
 
King Arthur

King Arthur

Well-Known Member
st0wandgrow said:
I would say wherever he's getting the clones from they are using different mother (which are different phenos of the same strain) plants to take the cuts from. There is no way that you could get the golden ticket one time, then the lime sherbet pheno the next time if all of the cuts are coming from the same plant
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That is one of the worst way to sell clones, I would put golden ticket as its own so people know what they are getting. I would be pissed off if I was one plant shy of a lb.
 
dluck

dluck

Well-Known Member
st0wandgrow said:
I would say wherever he's getting the clones from they are using different mother (which are different phenos of the same strain) plants to take the cuts from. There is no way that you could get the golden ticket one time, then the lime sherbet pheno the next time if all of the cuts are coming from the same plant
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That sounds the most reasonable explanation even though some like to claim "genetic drift" as for that occurring .
 
mdjenks

mdjenks

Well-Known Member
shishkaboy said:
Phenotype is 50% genetics's and 50% environment. So a genetic "copy" exposed to the same environmental stimuli, should produce the same results. Like Mr mushroom mentioned changing the lights, nutes or any other environmental factors may give different results. For example, many varieties will turn purple when grown in a cooler environment. Same strain, same phenotype, different trigger, different color. It actually gets a little more complex when we talk about environmental triggers, this is why I asked if they were the same exact mom or not. Maybe you always had the golden ticket but didn't unlock it all the runs, just most. I must say I hope this is the case because I cannot see why if a nursery was using multiple sources, they would not at least just keep the best eventually. I would have to think at one point even if they were making selections they would at least run them to see which to keep and get rid of the rest, uniformity is necessary when it comes to clones.
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You could be right about me having the same pheno just different traits. This is why I wanted more experienced growers to chime in. I didn't know how to explain it, The first run was from DHN cuts and I took a cutting off the more vigorous lady and created a bonsai mother (short mother) and then did a run of 12 off of her and 3 out of the 12 had that "golden ticket" pheno look were as the others where the slurpee frost monsters, so maybe it was the positioning of those three the side they were on may have got more light and they were right next to a fan but the nutes and temps were all consistent. I need a damn degree for this. Now I don't know if cloning a plant is like cloning an animal it just seemed that different traits were coming from the mom on the runs I did meaning some were more trainwreck looking, etc ( I actually one time get the bloodwreck pheno, the one with dark red stems). There are entire books about this subject and I am up to learn as much as I can and I am only speaking from my experience, nothing I am saying is a fact across the board when it comes to cloning from my experience cause like I said it is all from what I have ran and experienced in doing so.
 
mdjenks

mdjenks

Well-Known Member
I consulted my buddy who is a 4th degree black belt in breeding/cloning and this is what he said:
"Maybe, but it wouldn't be like phenos, it'd be genetic drift. That is, if the cells that start a new shoot/branch were damaged, all the cells that result from them (i.e., the branch itself & any clones that come from it) will also reflect that "damage"/mutation. Thus, I don't think you'd see anything that you could attribute to either parent."

Does that make sense? I do do LST so maybe just maybe. or maybe I missed labeled a cut or something.

Oh and chernobyl is not a clone only so that may have something to do with it, I'm not sure.
 
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gitarre10000

gitarre10000

Well-Known Member
mdjenks said:
I consulted my buddy who is a 4th degree black belt in breeding/cloning and this is what he said:
"Maybe, but it wouldn't be like phenos, it'd be genetic drift. That is, if the cells that start a new shoot/branch were damaged, all the cells that result from them (i.e., the branch itself & any clones that come from it) will also reflect that "damage"/mutation. Thus, I don't think you'd see anything that you could attribute to either parent."

Does that make sense? I do do LST so maybe just maybe. or maybe I missed labeled a cut or something.

Oh and chernobyl is not a clone only so that may have something to do with it, I'm not sure.
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Hysterical , lol 4th degree , he'll be a master soon.:P
 
mdjenks

mdjenks

Well-Known Member
After all my research you guys are right, if you take a cutting form a mother it will be the exact genetic makeup of the mother which is the genotype and the phenotype is the environment but is the same as the mother as far as genetics go. So i must have had some fluctuations in temp and or nutes to get different phenotypes. With all this discussion I have learned a lot making myself research the shit out of the said subject and genetic drift would be the only different trait resulting in a different genotype and would not be a beneficial cut. So the environment is the culprit that keeps the clone from displaying the exact traits of the mother but having the exact genotype as the mother. With that said I have always had the golden ticket but with fluctuations in environment not all showed the same desired "look" or "trait" but is the same as the mother regardless.

Now maybe we can lay this horse to rest instead of beating it after it is already dead. thanks for all the input!
 
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shishkaboy

shishkaboy

Well-Known Member
mdjenks said:
You could be right about me having the same pheno just different traits. This is why I wanted more experienced growers to chime in. I didn't know how to explain it, The first run was from DHN cuts and I took a cutting off the more vigorous lady and created a bonsai mother (short mother) and then did a run of 12 off of her and 3 out of the 12 had that "golden ticket" pheno look were as the others where the slurpee frost monsters, so maybe it was the positioning of those three the side they were on may have got more light and they were right next to a fan but the nutes and temps were all consistent. I need a damn degree for this. Now I don't know if cloning a plant is like cloning an animal it just seemed that different traits were coming from the mom on the runs I did meaning some were more trainwreck looking, etc ( I actually one time get the bloodwreck pheno, the one with dark red stems). There are entire books about this subject and I am up to learn as much as I can and I am only speaking from my experience, nothing I am saying is a fact across the board when it comes to cloning from my experience cause like I said it is all from what I have ran and experienced in doing so.
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When you say that golden ticket look, what traits do you mean?
 
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