Alcohol Tincture
- Thread starter Hobbes
- Start date
GrowMoe
Member
Hey
I've read some pages in this thread, but I gave up finding an answer, so I thought I could just ask.
Yeasterday I made a tincture of 60% alcohol and stems and trim. Now I didn't pre-heat the stem/trim/bud, so I'm wondering what the best way to proceed with this tincture to make it as potent as possible. I was originally planning on just letting it sit in a dark place for a month or something, but now I understand that there are some options, like heating in a waterbath.
any suggestions on how to make the best of it? I just don't get all of this shit about heating alcohol and evaporating and stuff.
I've read some pages in this thread, but I gave up finding an answer, so I thought I could just ask.
Yeasterday I made a tincture of 60% alcohol and stems and trim. Now I didn't pre-heat the stem/trim/bud, so I'm wondering what the best way to proceed with this tincture to make it as potent as possible. I was originally planning on just letting it sit in a dark place for a month or something, but now I understand that there are some options, like heating in a waterbath.
any suggestions on how to make the best of it? I just don't get all of this shit about heating alcohol and evaporating and stuff.
nl3004.kind
Active Member
quick question, hummmbling, did you drink it down, or wait for it to absorb underneath your tongue (up to two minutes)? i think many people just drink it straight and forget to let it absorb sublingually.... just curious...
nl3004.kind
Active Member
Hobbes
Well-Known Member
.
I agree with NL. Better quality alcohol tincture is made over time, unless a person is able to invest the time and marijuana to develop the skill of someone like Dr Jay. For a person just making their own tincture and isn't captivated by the process there's no need to build a mad scientist lab when a mason jar will do.
.
For the mad scientists among us ....
I was designed a CO2 subcritical fluid extractor to replace butane extraction and the process was a hell of a lot of fun. Here's a link to the thread if you want to check it out - all the info for the extractor is in blue, I wove threads of information - technical, letters, comedy, philosophy, music, video - to make it like a fun park to visit while a person absorbs the extractor info. The info is all in point form - in blue - if all you want to do is breeze through that it's easy to pick out.
Have a look, spin your mouse wheel, it doesn't matter where you start. Bookmark the thread, open an account, post a hello and drop back in again and again if you enjoy the place. If you want to build your own CO2 extractor and help the medical marijuana community - lower prices to patients and increase the potency and quality of their extracts - I'll work through the process with anyone who wants to understand it - but only on Jon Stewart's forum. I wrestled with that beast for two weeks, it would add and subtract lines and blocks of text at will and randomly. I just needed a quiet place and there is NO place quieter than Jon Stewart's forum. Ba ding bam!
The thread was formatted for a MacBook Pro 17" screen, there's a short introduction on the first page.
http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page..._id=28916&pg=1
To understand, construct and operate the extractor this is all you need - if you put enough time into thinking the process through.
.
Drop in, register and say hi! I need you guys to help me get this spread throughout the marijuana community.
http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page=ThreadView&thread_id=28916&pg=1
.
.
I agree with NL. Better quality alcohol tincture is made over time, unless a person is able to invest the time and marijuana to develop the skill of someone like Dr Jay. For a person just making their own tincture and isn't captivated by the process there's no need to build a mad scientist lab when a mason jar will do.
.
For the mad scientists among us ....
I was designed a CO2 subcritical fluid extractor to replace butane extraction and the process was a hell of a lot of fun. Here's a link to the thread if you want to check it out - all the info for the extractor is in blue, I wove threads of information - technical, letters, comedy, philosophy, music, video - to make it like a fun park to visit while a person absorbs the extractor info. The info is all in point form - in blue - if all you want to do is breeze through that it's easy to pick out.
Have a look, spin your mouse wheel, it doesn't matter where you start. Bookmark the thread, open an account, post a hello and drop back in again and again if you enjoy the place. If you want to build your own CO2 extractor and help the medical marijuana community - lower prices to patients and increase the potency and quality of their extracts - I'll work through the process with anyone who wants to understand it - but only on Jon Stewart's forum. I wrestled with that beast for two weeks, it would add and subtract lines and blocks of text at will and randomly. I just needed a quiet place and there is NO place quieter than Jon Stewart's forum. Ba ding bam!
The thread was formatted for a MacBook Pro 17" screen, there's a short introduction on the first page.
http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page..._id=28916&pg=1
To understand, construct and operate the extractor this is all you need - if you put enough time into thinking the process through.
.
Drop in, register and say hi! I need you guys to help me get this spread throughout the marijuana community.
http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page=ThreadView&thread_id=28916&pg=1
.
.
nl3004.kind
Active Member
gods love you hobbes... that is a nice piece of equipment... one question: is using the pvc necessary? i've heard many things that lead me to believe that pvc is dangerous to use and that it can leach toxic chemicals ect into your smoke... but it looks trick, and i'd bet that compressed co2 would be much better than butane extraction, plus no "trace" chemicals are placed into it, right??? no off smells/ tastes... what a great idea, man!
Hobbes
Well-Known Member
.
"one question: is using the pvc necessary"
LOL!! Good point!
The model is a conceptual - its a teaching model only, not a working model. That's made from stainless steel - all of the written: parts list, assembly instructions, operating directions and parts list are in BLUE text on Jon's forum.
Everything else you advanced is correct, and more. There are very few trace chemicals left after a butane extraction, the concern is more for impurities in the butane than actual butane itself. But ... emptying two cans of butane into a single tray of brownies makes me queasy. Butane leaches various heavy metals from PVC, there is a past about that on my "gifts" thread on Jon's forum.
NL if you could would you open an account on Jon's forum and copy and past the question there - I want to start a discussion ... with other people for awhile!
Sometimes the journey is more important than the destination - I'm sure I could have made money selling these by now but if I start giving away fishes we're not going to go where we have to go. In pleasure boating there are two basic schools of thought - sailing and stink pots. In a power boat the destination is important - if going to an island a few clicks off shore you can power out in minutes and everyone can go about doing what they want to do. Sailing out requires time, skill and effort - people can get a ride out to the island and enjoy the scenery or they can chip in and help sail the boats: learning new skills that they can pass on, developing working friendships with their crew mates.
We are rudderless with only one engine working on a side, spinning us in circles.
http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page=ThreadView&thread_id=28916&pg=1
.
"one question: is using the pvc necessary"
LOL!! Good point!
The model is a conceptual - its a teaching model only, not a working model. That's made from stainless steel - all of the written: parts list, assembly instructions, operating directions and parts list are in BLUE text on Jon's forum.
Everything else you advanced is correct, and more. There are very few trace chemicals left after a butane extraction, the concern is more for impurities in the butane than actual butane itself. But ... emptying two cans of butane into a single tray of brownies makes me queasy. Butane leaches various heavy metals from PVC, there is a past about that on my "gifts" thread on Jon's forum.
NL if you could would you open an account on Jon's forum and copy and past the question there - I want to start a discussion ... with other people for awhile!
Sometimes the journey is more important than the destination - I'm sure I could have made money selling these by now but if I start giving away fishes we're not going to go where we have to go. In pleasure boating there are two basic schools of thought - sailing and stink pots. In a power boat the destination is important - if going to an island a few clicks off shore you can power out in minutes and everyone can go about doing what they want to do. Sailing out requires time, skill and effort - people can get a ride out to the island and enjoy the scenery or they can chip in and help sail the boats: learning new skills that they can pass on, developing working friendships with their crew mates.
We are rudderless with only one engine working on a side, spinning us in circles.
http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page=ThreadView&thread_id=28916&pg=1
.
Hobbes
Well-Known Member
.
I'll add some incentive to go to my thread on Jon's forum, for people who like this thread but find the information too jumbled. If you go to Jon's thread and read the BLUE text about the CO2 extractor; look at any of the jokes and one philisophical; open an account and make a few posts about anything you want (hopefully some extractor questions) I will:
- organize the information in this thread by tincture and extraction type, rate each for potency, time, taste, etc.
- organize every question into an FAQ, organized alphabetically by topic.
- post tutorial videos made by you guys, in a section of the thread for videos.
- all of the info together at the start of the thread.
- any unique questions answered, by anyone, will be added to the FAQ.
- post a disambiguator at the start of the thread.
http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page=ThreadView&thread_id=28916&pg=1
.
I'll add some incentive to go to my thread on Jon's forum, for people who like this thread but find the information too jumbled. If you go to Jon's thread and read the BLUE text about the CO2 extractor; look at any of the jokes and one philisophical; open an account and make a few posts about anything you want (hopefully some extractor questions) I will:
- organize the information in this thread by tincture and extraction type, rate each for potency, time, taste, etc.
- organize every question into an FAQ, organized alphabetically by topic.
- post tutorial videos made by you guys, in a section of the thread for videos.
- all of the info together at the start of the thread.
- any unique questions answered, by anyone, will be added to the FAQ.
- post a disambiguator at the start of the thread.
http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page=ThreadView&thread_id=28916&pg=1
.
Hobbes
Well-Known Member
.
Hey Big P!
Every part of that thread seems one in the same to me, I would pull whole sections from one page and post it on another or fuss for an hour to get my spacing between lines just right for one frame.
Unbelievably fun. I've listened to authors talking about their stories becoming more real to them than the physical reality and I now understand it differently than I did as a reader. The concept of non corporeal beings on Deep Space Nine always seemed contrived, but when you can travel to any part of the story at any time, making whatever change you want - eventually you start to forget that other people don't know the story like you do. I found myself placing a joke in the third post then placing the setup to the joke in the seventh post. And it made perfect sense from my perspective.
Anyone who can, please register on Jon's forum and say hi. Thanks!
http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page=ThreadView&thread_id=28916&pg=1
.
Hey Big P!
Every part of that thread seems one in the same to me, I would pull whole sections from one page and post it on another or fuss for an hour to get my spacing between lines just right for one frame.
Unbelievably fun. I've listened to authors talking about their stories becoming more real to them than the physical reality and I now understand it differently than I did as a reader. The concept of non corporeal beings on Deep Space Nine always seemed contrived, but when you can travel to any part of the story at any time, making whatever change you want - eventually you start to forget that other people don't know the story like you do. I found myself placing a joke in the third post then placing the setup to the joke in the seventh post. And it made perfect sense from my perspective.
Anyone who can, please register on Jon's forum and say hi. Thanks!
http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page=ThreadView&thread_id=28916&pg=1
.
nl3004.kind
Active Member
hobbes my friend, as much as i like the trailer park boys and the kids in the hall (destined to be new classics, i am sure) i could not follow the instructions or flow of ideas on the jon stewart website... i'm hoping that you chose to put it up here as well without all the other stuff, but i am impressed with all the tpb stuff you found to put with your instructions... it just didn't make all that much sense to me, i'm afraid...
nl3004.kind
Active Member
but i did try to sign up, and it wouldn't let me. so i'll just say it here: you, my friend are a scary smart person, perhaps to smart to be fully understood... congrats on the co2 extraction... looking forward to seeing it working... maybe youtube style? just a thought! keep it up... thanks again for this thread, it has helped me quite a bit.... and thanks for being here...
Hobbes
Well-Known Member
.
A CO2 extractor is pretty much an expresso machine - at 580 PSI, and CO2 instead of water.
.
The white round dials are for temperature, we need 88 F at the extraction tube
The black dials are for Pressure - we need 580 psi for the CO2 at the extraction tube but will start at 3000 psi and end below 580 psi
What do those two lines mean?
1: You need hot water to make expresso.
2: We have to pour the water from above because it won't flow up.
3: Set the dials to the numbers on the model and you're ready to go.
The gauges, regulators, stainless steel tubes, CO2 tank are all right off the shelf; the resin collector any tank that can be opened. Plug and play.
We're just not use to dealing with pressure in our daily lives and thinking of a gas as a solvent. Think of it as a liquid under pressure like a garden hose, it is a fluid, similar properties. Scuba divers might be more familiar with pressure.
.
The square grey boxes are pressure regulators - nothing more than a set of locks at the Panama canal. High pressure input on one side, low pressure comes out the other side? How? The same way the wiring in your car works - it doesn't matter, you can drive to the beach without knowing about electricity.
.
Pipes, tanks, regulators and gauges off the shelf. Simple. Screw them all together and pack your extraction tube.
All we are doing is running a solvent through plant matter, exactly the same as pouring hot water though coffee. The pressure differential between the high pressure CO2 tank and the low pressure resin collector acts as our gravity to force the solvent through the plant matter.
.
.
"looking forward to seeing it working"
Putting vids of mine on the web will do us absolutely no good, we'll just continue spinning in circles. Sometimes the process is more important than the product.
http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page=ThreadView&thread_id=28916&pg=1
.
.
A CO2 extractor is pretty much an expresso machine - at 580 PSI, and CO2 instead of water.
.
The white round dials are for temperature, we need 88 F at the extraction tube
The black dials are for Pressure - we need 580 psi for the CO2 at the extraction tube but will start at 3000 psi and end below 580 psi
What do those two lines mean?
1: You need hot water to make expresso.
2: We have to pour the water from above because it won't flow up.
3: Set the dials to the numbers on the model and you're ready to go.
The gauges, regulators, stainless steel tubes, CO2 tank are all right off the shelf; the resin collector any tank that can be opened. Plug and play.
We're just not use to dealing with pressure in our daily lives and thinking of a gas as a solvent. Think of it as a liquid under pressure like a garden hose, it is a fluid, similar properties. Scuba divers might be more familiar with pressure.
.
The square grey boxes are pressure regulators - nothing more than a set of locks at the Panama canal. High pressure input on one side, low pressure comes out the other side? How? The same way the wiring in your car works - it doesn't matter, you can drive to the beach without knowing about electricity.
.
Pipes, tanks, regulators and gauges off the shelf. Simple. Screw them all together and pack your extraction tube.
All we are doing is running a solvent through plant matter, exactly the same as pouring hot water though coffee. The pressure differential between the high pressure CO2 tank and the low pressure resin collector acts as our gravity to force the solvent through the plant matter.
.
.
"looking forward to seeing it working"
Putting vids of mine on the web will do us absolutely no good, we'll just continue spinning in circles. Sometimes the process is more important than the product.
http://forums.thedailyshow.com/?page=ThreadView&thread_id=28916&pg=1
.
.
Big P
Well-Known Member
Hobbes my friend i have recently been dabbling in opium tea using dried poppy pods obtainable on the net legally. The extraction process with those is interesting too, if you evaporate all the tea you end up with smokable cooked flake opium
If you are interested i can pm you with a website that sells the correct kind of pods
The annoying thing is you gotta let the water in the tea evaporate off but you cannot boil the mix because it would destroy the morphine and codine in the tea
Somone suggested useing a centrifuge. Like the ones that can separate blood i think. Maybe ill research. That
Just thought i would mention this whole other world of the subject of opium and its exraction as it is somewhat similar to cannabis extraction
If you are interested i can pm you with a website that sells the correct kind of pods
The annoying thing is you gotta let the water in the tea evaporate off but you cannot boil the mix because it would destroy the morphine and codine in the tea
Somone suggested useing a centrifuge. Like the ones that can separate blood i think. Maybe ill research. That
Just thought i would mention this whole other world of the subject of opium and its exraction as it is somewhat similar to cannabis extraction
Hobbes
Well-Known Member
.
Big P CO2 subcritical fluid extraction is what the pharmaceutical companies use to extract resin from plants. I'm not familiar with the properties of opiates if but they are soluble by CO2 a pharma would extract opium using CO2 SCFE. I'm sure they'd use this method but with a quarter million dollar machine. The smallest new machine I found was around $50K for a lab model - it's going to be more efficient (less CO2) and easier to use but resin is resin if the CO2 is passed through the plant matter at the same temperature and pressure.
I read an article about breeding an opium poppy that produces morphine rather than it being converted to morphine in the liver. Interesting.
.
.
Big P CO2 subcritical fluid extraction is what the pharmaceutical companies use to extract resin from plants. I'm not familiar with the properties of opiates if but they are soluble by CO2 a pharma would extract opium using CO2 SCFE. I'm sure they'd use this method but with a quarter million dollar machine. The smallest new machine I found was around $50K for a lab model - it's going to be more efficient (less CO2) and easier to use but resin is resin if the CO2 is passed through the plant matter at the same temperature and pressure.
I read an article about breeding an opium poppy that produces morphine rather than it being converted to morphine in the liver. Interesting.
.
.
nicodemusliam
Member
Wow! I am so happy to read your hub. I am new to this but delighted that you are like-minded. I want to introduced my self and let you know that I appreciate all you do! Very glads of you..
Hobbes
Well-Known Member
.
Hey nicodemusliam, welcome aboard RIU!
Check back in a couple of days, I've made a working demonstration CO2 Subcritical fluid extractor model from stuff I had around the house and a couple of cheap things I had to pick up. The product can't be used because the extractor parts aren't all high purity stainless steel for corrosive fluids and gasses, but its the daddy-O of all demonstration models for our group. A few people will have most of the parts already but I had to modify a couple of them to make the scfe work, and its almost as cheap to buy high purity fittings second hand to make a usable honey oil.
The subcritical extraction process (basically the same as a butane extraction) is incredibly simple: Constant temperature and pressure within a localized field.
We do this by adding heat to overcome Boyles Law, (The Ideal Gas Law) - as a gas expands there is less heat in the same volume of space (the tank) so the temperature goes down. Some of the heat leaves with the CO2 we are going release for extracting, the remaining CO2 must be warmed to 88F+ so it can be used for extraction.
As well, the CO2 being used for extraction is reduced from as high as 3000 psi to ~600 psi - it is going to be cooled when it leaves the tank and must be warmed to at least 88 F before it goes into the extraction tube. I do this the easy way, you can do it an easier way.
We need the fast transfer of heat to the cold CO2 and maximum surface area will speed heat transfer. Water is much denser than air so it can transfer heat quicker. A small water pump in your heating chamber will keep the water moving to speed heat transfer - cooled water moved away from the heating coil and warm water moved against it. A stainless steel coiled hose has a small diameter and a great surface area for the same volume as a tank, better than a second tank for expansion though the second tank can be used as well as the coil.
We heat the CO2 tank in water above 88F and release the 3000 psi CO2 into the SS coil at 600 psi and use a small volume/minute of CO2 for extraction, to give the remainder in the tank and coil time to warm back to 88F. When we release the CO2 from the extraction chamber (~600 psi) to 1 atmosphere (15 psi) there will be a reduction in temperature as well, another coil can be used to move the pressure reduction point out of the extraction tubes heating water and into a second tank of water, and then the CO2 and resin are vented to a resin harvester.
You guys are going to love my resin harvester, and the whole extractor. Very Trailer Park.
[youtube]T_mJmO7d6FI[/youtube]
.
Most of you folks will use two of the regulators below to heat your CO2, forget everything above. The regulators have inline heaters, or we can buy or make seperate inline heaters for second hand high purity regulators Part of the fun for me was to design an extractor that could be used anywhere without electricity (as an economic development tool), but if you've got electricity lets be practical. This stuff goes in number 5 on the sheet, I took it out to see if any paintballers or scuba people were reading the thread.
.
Hey nicodemusliam, welcome aboard RIU!
Check back in a couple of days, I've made a working demonstration CO2 Subcritical fluid extractor model from stuff I had around the house and a couple of cheap things I had to pick up. The product can't be used because the extractor parts aren't all high purity stainless steel for corrosive fluids and gasses, but its the daddy-O of all demonstration models for our group. A few people will have most of the parts already but I had to modify a couple of them to make the scfe work, and its almost as cheap to buy high purity fittings second hand to make a usable honey oil.
The subcritical extraction process (basically the same as a butane extraction) is incredibly simple: Constant temperature and pressure within a localized field.
We do this by adding heat to overcome Boyles Law, (The Ideal Gas Law) - as a gas expands there is less heat in the same volume of space (the tank) so the temperature goes down. Some of the heat leaves with the CO2 we are going release for extracting, the remaining CO2 must be warmed to 88F+ so it can be used for extraction.
As well, the CO2 being used for extraction is reduced from as high as 3000 psi to ~600 psi - it is going to be cooled when it leaves the tank and must be warmed to at least 88 F before it goes into the extraction tube. I do this the easy way, you can do it an easier way.
We need the fast transfer of heat to the cold CO2 and maximum surface area will speed heat transfer. Water is much denser than air so it can transfer heat quicker. A small water pump in your heating chamber will keep the water moving to speed heat transfer - cooled water moved away from the heating coil and warm water moved against it. A stainless steel coiled hose has a small diameter and a great surface area for the same volume as a tank, better than a second tank for expansion though the second tank can be used as well as the coil.
We heat the CO2 tank in water above 88F and release the 3000 psi CO2 into the SS coil at 600 psi and use a small volume/minute of CO2 for extraction, to give the remainder in the tank and coil time to warm back to 88F. When we release the CO2 from the extraction chamber (~600 psi) to 1 atmosphere (15 psi) there will be a reduction in temperature as well, another coil can be used to move the pressure reduction point out of the extraction tubes heating water and into a second tank of water, and then the CO2 and resin are vented to a resin harvester.
You guys are going to love my resin harvester, and the whole extractor. Very Trailer Park.
[youtube]T_mJmO7d6FI[/youtube]
.
Most of you folks will use two of the regulators below to heat your CO2, forget everything above. The regulators have inline heaters, or we can buy or make seperate inline heaters for second hand high purity regulators Part of the fun for me was to design an extractor that could be used anywhere without electricity (as an economic development tool), but if you've got electricity lets be practical. This stuff goes in number 5 on the sheet, I took it out to see if any paintballers or scuba people were reading the thread.
.
