4 Kessil H350 - 600W HID Comparison; the highlight reel

I just added 2 Kessil h150 REDs to my T5 grow to see if it will boost flowering. It's too early to tell as of yet, but I wanted to point out another grow journal that is only utilizing 60w of LED lighting and having outstanding results. He is running a DIY LED light that has 28 LEDs, 12 which are 660nm and 18 which are 2700K white. The white LEDs contain enough blue 460nm and also complete the spectrum. From what I can tell, he's getting better results than anyone I've ever seen and only using those 2 types of LEDs. It's making me reconsider what I'm going to use for wavelengths when I finally make the switch to LED as a sole source of lighting. Instead of having to deal with many LED wavelengths, it looks like it's potentially much better to just use 2700K white LEDs combined with 660nm LEDs.

Just as a side note, I've tried doing a 50/50 blend of 660nm T5 bulbs with full spectrum white T5s with some pretty amazing results. I got an extreme acceleration in growth rate and also a major increase in fan leaf size, but also at the same time some pretty major stretching. I've now added one pure blue bulb to that mixture and it seems to have halted the stretch.

Here is the journal where the grower is using 12, 660nm and 16, 2700K white(full spectrum) LEDs only, with max watt output at 60w.
https://www.opengrow.com/topic/44537-50w-high-tech-diy-led-lamp-test/page__st__20

Very interesting LEDs Blue. I read through that forum and was very interested in the pictures with the plants under the light. The color from the LEDs looks like a HPS but with enhanced red. Really awesome looking, now if there were only a person that one could custom order lights from with exacting spectral specifications? Loving the thread so far it looks as though the LED plants are denser in general, the buds look only slightly smaller but maybe they are denser as well? Any way best wishes on the thread. I hope all goes well.
Grow well,
ILove

BlueB - those are BEAUTIFUL. I've never grown small plants before and have been curious about it. For my next round I have 24 Dinafem Industrial going, 3 weeks old now. They'll go into 3 qt pots for 2 weeks and then into 7 qt pots for finishing. The Kessils seems to be doing ok so I plan to buy 4 more and run an 8 light H350 grow over 24 plants.

justjim said:

BlueB - those are BEAUTIFUL. I've never grown small plants before and have been curious about it. For my next round I have 24 Dinafem Industrial going, 3 weeks old now. They'll go into 3 qt pots for 2 weeks and then into 7 qt pots for finishing. The Kessils seems to be doing ok so I plan to buy 4 more and run an 8 light H350 grow over 24 plants.

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Instead of buying 4 more Kessils, you should try adding a few 2700K T5 HO or CFL bloom bulbs to your LEDs first. Much much cheaper, and in the long run I think you find out to be much happier.

^^^ Don't you love it when people tell you what you should do and what would make you happier? I say go go with what you feel like! I'm glad to see you like the kessils, I'm about to order one or two myself. Good luck!!

puffenuff said:

^^^ Don't you love it when people tell you what you should do and what would make you happier? I say go go with what you feel like! I'm glad to see you like the kessils, I'm about to order one or two myself. Good luck!!

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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^hahahaha what the fuck do you care lol, $1600 vs $20 hmmmm lets see here lolololololollololollololololololololololol

you must be the owner of Kessil

Seems like a few pages got deleted after that restore didn't get to see what you said in your last post

Dang, wiped out most my postings. I'm day 6 into drying. I chop and hang and it's been the perfect 55-60% humidity. I'll start trimming tomorrow and after a few days in jars I'll weigh.

Obviously you're still drying but how is the comparison between the two looking so far? You got any pics from the end of flower you can reupload? I just bought a bunch of LED lights today so I hope it's worth it

The LED look lighter but it's hard to tell by how much which is good. I start final trimming today. I set my profile homepage to my photobucket album where I have all the pictures. I'll repost them all once I get a final weight.

The LEDs are only running 380w though correct? So the LEDs should pull just under 2/3 the yield of the 600w HPS if you go by that measure. If the LED is more than 2/3 what the 600w produces then I say LED wins.

I am getting ready to see what 5 240w blackstars evenly placed over a trained canopy with even light coverage and no gaps all the way across can do. The wattage I'm pulling puts it equivalent to an 800w HID light. If I can't put outdo what a 600w HID does i'm not gonna be a happy camper. I'm hoping that with the excellent even coverage and overlapping sidelighting that I'm gonna see some good results. Crossing my fingers.

The final results are in.

Notes:

I did nothing to increase the yield of this crop. My only goal was to use the exact same environment and nute schedule to see what each light produced. Also I used Biobizz nutes, aka 'great taste, low yield'.

Last, I only trimmed the non-popcorn bud. I'm not including popcorn in the totals.

The full picture set is posted at http://s1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh638/justjim3/

The numbers:

LED 96 grams
HID 143 grams

LED 360W
HID 600W

360W / 600W = 60%

96 / 143 = 67%

Approx HID weight untrimmed - 35 grams
Approx LED weight untrimmed - 21 grams

HID dried




LED dried - much more fluffy than the HID




HID (left jar) & LED (right jar) popcorn - untrimmed




HID & LED trim - except major fan leaves which I pull before hanging




Overall, I am glad that I bought these due to my heat issue. My tent was cooking at 86 degrees with only one HID. No way I could add another without AC. Yes, I could have added a second HID and AC for less than the 4 Kessils, but I really wanted to see these in action.

Now that I own 4, I'll buy two more. In a normal grow, I run 6 plants per light so on the LED side, it would be difficult to run 7 kessils (to make up the full 600 watts) over 6 plants. It works out well to run 6 lights for 6 plants.

So, if you have heat issues, or you do not have money issues, Kessils are a good way to go. If you want to pump out mad weight and can deal with the headaches of HID, go for it!

Thanks for watching.

Excellent reporting, jim. Thanks for doing this comparison! I added an h350 to my 200w led panel and am really enjoying it as an addition to my garden.

Any noticable difference in high, taste, amount of resin, etc?

Hi jim,

I had jumped in to let you know about my exact same setup. 4 kessil h350 magentas over a 4X4 tray. Ironically, I also use biobizz nutes. I had very similar outcomes as you: lower yield and less dense flowers.

I added (2) more H350s and a 4' 8-bulb VHO fluorescent T5 unit for the next grow.

Are you planning on making any changes? adding supplemental light?

How many plants yielded 96/21 grams under the 4 H350s?

Thanks,

pkgrower

Very good thread! Likes the results..

Long time lurker, first time poster.

I appreciate your side by side comparison greatly. Do you think it would be fair to say that the deep purple Kessils are supposed to be purely for flowering and may have performed better?

Regardless, I for one am quite disappointed in the LED results. Huge cost for an approximate 10% increase in yield, watt for watt. Not what these companies have promised. I wish I would have read this before I ponied up for 6 new LED lights to the tune of $2,500.00. I guess I can expect the performance of one 1000 watt light for five times the cost.

Damn.

Plantus Maximus said:

1. Do you think it would be fair to say that the deep purple Kessils are supposed to be purely for flowering and may have performed better?

2. I wish I would have read this before I ponied up for 6 new LED lights to the tune of $2,500.00.

Damn.

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1. Kessil says purple for veg, magenta for flower so that's what I followed.

2. You spent $2,500 without research? Damn. Lol. That's a valuable lesson!

pkgrower said:

Hi jim,

I had jumped in to let you know about my exact same setup. 4 kessil h350 magentas over a 4X4 tray. Ironically, I also use biobizz nutes. I had very similar outcomes as you: lower yield and less dense flowers.

I added (2) more H350s and a 4' 8-bulb VHO fluorescent T5 unit for the next grow.

Are you planning on making any changes? adding supplemental light?

How many plants yielded 96/21 grams under the 4 H350s?

Thanks,

pkgrower

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Biobizz and Kessil? I feel such a kinship!

Are you new to biobizz or do you have some experience with them? Used other nutes? I've only used Biobizz, I thought about switching but I had so many people telling me how good the taste was. Even though your flower was less dense, was the quality still there or did it diminish without the HID?

Last grow had 8 plants topped to yield the 96/21.

This time I have 5 H350s on one side and the 600 hps on the other. Each week I swap plants so they each get equal time under both lights. Also, I have 12 plants in 7qt plastic pots without topping. I grow from seed and figure I'll do better with more small plants than trying to top/train a few larger ones.

Ill post pics of my current setup if you'd like.