Fastslappy
Well-Known Member
pm me & i can go into more detail , but I was able to never buy that again & I LOVED using it
NaturalFarmer
Well-Known Member
"The highest known liquid extractions are around 15% but are so chemically adulterated at this saturation that it's suspect to if they even work."
"The same substance sent to different labs will come back with a variety of numbers, depending on the labs methods. As an example, by the Verplogh and Brandvold method Ful-Power fulvic measures 8%. By the Classical Method the same fulvic measures .015%."
http://www.bioag.com/images/MY_can_NovDec09_40-44.pdf
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Jubilant
Well-Known Member
Yeah I did want to try DE a while back too.
But just the fact that it can be dangerous to inhale makes it iffey to me...
As @NaturalFarmer said the goal of D.E. is to prevent the laying of more eggs as well as kill the larvae near the top of the soils and when emerging. You do not have to worry too much about it killing off beneficial organisms as the short time you will have it on top of the soil (Fungus Gnat life cycle is roughly 17 days in moist warm good environments) then when you water your pot, moisture will render D.E impotent in it mechanical insecticidal properties. With this being the case any D.E. that does find it's way deeper in your Rhizosphere it will not be harming anything. As for the Yellow Fly Paper that was not very effective I had a good amount of gnats in my tent and only found about 15-25 flies between 6 pieces of the paper, restricting them from laying eggs in the top soil was the effective symptom of my pest management I believe.
A lot of folks use D.E. as a soil conditioner as it offers a lot of (non water soluble mind you) micro nutrients and helps to aid in water retention. According to some studies *The one I was reading most recently was from Southern Cross University* it also aids in nutrient retention as well, making it harder to leak anything from the soil. D.E. holds up to 10X it's weight of water so if you soil drains far too fast for what you are growing D.E. as an amendment can help a lot. There has been a lot of time and research put into D.E. and Food Grade D.E. will not hurt your garden, that much can be said with certainty.
@Rasta Roy Have you used D.E. before? What was your experience and how was it used? I just am curious as I never realized this was a debated subject, my mother has been into organic methods her whole life and loves D.E. and most anyone I have seen that has used it properly and Food Grade has had great results. I ask cause I love expanding my point of view and learning how others deal with similar problems
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Fastslappy
Well-Known Member
I've used food grade DE by the cup full each amendment i did when I grew in 100% coco
good stuff in the the soil it's high in silicon
good stuff in the the soil it's high in silicon
NaturalFarmer
Well-Known Member
If your chickens ever get mites or you want to prevent it, set up a masonry mixing tub with 90% sand and 10% food grade DE (easier to find than feed grade). It is like a medicated dust bath for them.
Fastslappy
Well-Known Member
Man I got it down easy peasy , 1/2 gallon jar & some brown rice flour just a pinch 1/8 tsp
shake the shit up & let sit on the refer for a week
soifion off the middle juice add 90% milk then wait & strain add brw sugar
shake the shit up & let sit on the refer for a week
soifion off the middle juice add 90% milk then wait & strain add brw sugar
Vnsmkr
Well-Known Member
Well Im broke as fck and dont have any brown rice flour, but you can bet we got plenty of fukn rice.....the old way it is
Vnsmkr
Well-Known Member
Thanks, if you want some reading material I can load you up?
NaturalFarmer
Well-Known Member
Nutrients is my favorite reading for sure other than KNF docs. I am looking forward to teaming with fungi.
Vnsmkr
Well-Known Member
Fastslappy
Well-Known Member
that LAB is so useful , as well as food grade enzymes
Papaya is the best fresh enzyme going gonna try this papaya to help breakdown other stuff
Papaya is the best fresh enzyme going gonna try this papaya to help breakdown other stuff
Rasta Roy
Well-Known Member
I did before I learned it's unnecessary and I didn't miss it when I stopped. I have used it sparingly when I apply malted barley, it's a catalyst in the enzyme reaction. But other than that no, I don't think it's necessary if you're making your own fresh compost and castings.
Rasta Roy
Well-Known Member
I have used DE a lot. It never really seemed to do the job that well, at least not on it's own. And it adds up in cost pretty quick for me..
As @NaturalFarmer said the goal of D.E. is to prevent the laying of more eggs as well as kill the larvae near the top of the soils and when emerging. You do not have to worry too much about it killing off beneficial organisms as the short time you will have it on top of the soil (Fungus Gnat life cycle is roughly 17 days in moist warm good environments) then when you water your pot, moisture will render D.E impotent in it mechanical insecticidal properties. With this being the case any D.E. that does find it's way deeper in your Rhizosphere it will not be harming anything. As for the Yellow Fly Paper that was not very effective I had a good amount of gnats in my tent and only found about 15-25 flies between 6 pieces of the paper, restricting them from laying eggs in the top soil was the effective symptom of my pest management I believe.
A lot of folks use D.E. as a soil conditioner as it offers a lot of (non water soluble mind you) micro nutrients and helps to aid in water retention. According to some studies *The one I was reading most recently was from Southern Cross University* it also aids in nutrient retention as well, making it harder to leak anything from the soil. D.E. holds up to 10X it's weight of water so if you soil drains far too fast for what you are growing D.E. as an amendment can help a lot. There has been a lot of time and research put into D.E. and Food Grade D.E. will not hurt your garden, that much can be said with certainty.
@Rasta Roy Have you used D.E. before? What was your experience and how was it used? I just am curious as I never realized this was a debated subject, my mother has been into organic methods her whole life and loves D.E. and most anyone I have seen that has used it properly and Food Grade has had great results. I ask cause I love expanding my point of view and learning how others deal with similar problems
calliandra
Well-Known Member
Oh that reminds me, if we really do feel the need for some humic/fulvic acid, we can always make a wormcast extract by flushing the wormcasts with water. The runoff is then chock full of those acids, no need to worry about what's being sold out there.
greasemonkeymann
Well-Known Member
I think this is why fresh humus is so crucial, well, one of the reasons anyways, the billions of microbes, the modest nutrient content, the amazing CEC, the humic acids...
it's sorta like a multivitamin for soil grows
Rasta Roy
Well-Known Member
This is a room I consult on, seven 1000watt lights. Ten gallon pots, five plants a light.
Recycled soil reamended with a shit ton of compost, lime, blood and bone meal(I know, gross. These people are cheap it was their choice), sulfate of potash magnesia, and watered with kelp teas in flower every couple weeks or more.
Tomato cages just like I do in my personal room, used to train the plants out into nice bushes. Plants are allowed little breathing room, although adequately spaced, the canopy is kept full, no light is allowed to touch anything but plants. You don't need to light up your floor. Proper ventilation and air movement ensures no mold occurs.
Recycled soil reamended with a shit ton of compost, lime, blood and bone meal(I know, gross. These people are cheap it was their choice), sulfate of potash magnesia, and watered with kelp teas in flower every couple weeks or more.
Tomato cages just like I do in my personal room, used to train the plants out into nice bushes. Plants are allowed little breathing room, although adequately spaced, the canopy is kept full, no light is allowed to touch anything but plants. You don't need to light up your floor. Proper ventilation and air movement ensures no mold occurs.