whats the differance between these 2 nutrients. .?

[CannaReview]

So you sell 10-15% above cost.... I call bullshit. No sense even continuing this convo.

After calling your AN is cheaper BS let me fix one more for you one more time.

I have some customers that get 15-20% over my cost as that's the deals I made with them to shop with me and not other stores and there are customers that pay 35% over cost.

Edit and just to piss on your cornflakes a bit some more.

A customer came in today for replacement digital ballast just after I posted this originally. The model he had was no longer available. I replaced with it with a model that cost me $30 more. I broke even on the deal but a happy customer.

Two weeks ago I sold 20 Hortilux 940 bulbs for $175 after tax. I made $5 profit on each bulb. The guy is picking up 10 more tomorrow.

 

[Uncle Ben]

I called my man Mike and he said they are discontinuing jungle juice. In fact, they are discontinuing ALL non-PH-Perfect base lines. Look on the web site. Why?
Because the PH-Perfect works and the other ingredients incorporated in them only adds to improving growth. Take it or leave it. For me Sensi is the shit and I don't care what some of these trolls on here think about that but you, yourself have to decide. I get 1 gal Sensi for ~70$ and it kicks ass in pro-mix

I just bought 25 lbs. of Jack's which is a much higher quality food than the AN snake oil line and much cheaper. I paid $53 shipped to my door. It's enough to split with 100 growers and last them 5 years. If you guys know more about plant nutrition than claims and cute labels, check out the elemental profile:
http://www.jrpeters.com/Products/Jack-s-Professional/Jack-s-FeED/20-3-19-Petunia-FeED.html

Cannabis specific products sold via hydro stores are a rip off. Their target is newbies who don't know any better.

UB

 

[CannaReview]

Cannabis specific products sold via hydro stores are a rip off. Their target is newbies who don't know any better.

UB

If you look at it that way everything is a rip off if you break it down to basic elements and not the final product. If you know how to be a gardener you don't need 20 additives in your nutrient line. No one says you have to use them all except for the manufacturers feeding charts. When you keep it simple the cost vs what the value of the final product it is pretty small

 

[BROBIE]

I just bought 25 lbs. of Jack's which is a much higher quality food than the AN snake oil line and much cheaper. I paid $53 shipped to my door. It's enough to split with 100 growers and last them 5 years. If you guys know more about plant nutrition than claims and cute labels, check out the elemental profile:
http://www.jrpeters.com/Products/Jack-s-Professional/Jack-s-FeED/20-3-19-Petunia-FeED.html

Cannabis specific products sold via hydro stores are a rip off. Their target is newbies who don't know any better.

UB

Yea, I need 25 lb bags of shit lying around. I have a tidy place because my castle is clean. Agree though, hydro stores are a rip. I for one need something mixed and ready to go because my time is worth about 75$/hr in my profession. That's where I'm coming from

 

[BROBIE]

If you look at it that way everything is a rip off if you break it down to basic elements and not the final product. If you know how to be a gardener you don't need 20 additives in your nutrient line. No one says you have to use them all except for the manufacturers feeding charts. When you keep it simple the cost vs what the value of the final product it is pretty small

I never said I use any other shit except Sensi base. Mix with water....done. Other things in life to do besides play Jonny green-thumb.

 

[TonightYou]

I just bought 25 lbs. of Jack's which is a much higher quality food than the AN snake oil line and much cheaper. I paid $53 shipped to my door. It's enough to split with 100 growers and last them 5 years. If you guys know more about plant nutrition than claims and cute labels, check out the elemental profile:
http://www.jrpeters.com/Products/Jack-s-Professional/Jack-s-FeED/20-3-19-Petunia-FeED.html

Cannabis specific products sold via hydro stores are a rip off. Their target is newbies who don't know any better.

UB

Man I couldn't be happier with Jacks. I finished off the Citrus tub and am getting towards the last 1/4-1/5 of a larger tub. Total cost was like $50 shipped. Could have done what you did but Jesus that a shit ton of fertilizer.

I was just thinking as I browsed some of these threads. Why spend way more money, for a less balanced in addition to meeting the basics, fertilizer that turns into a project just to apply?

I can start fertilizing very early, and back off easily when needed. I don't burn leaves, nor have to be reactionary when it comes to feeding the girls. I've noticed going a tad strong towards the end unnecessarily can cause some reflowering to occur, but this is learning ones strain and on the grower.

Liked the Citrus for end of flower. That was something you recommended. Interested in their other lines, even though I know classics is just fine.

Any other recommendations?

Eta: interested in the palm in lieu of citrus but I was happy with citrus, moving towards that mid flower. Only other thing I use is a giant container that will last me a lifetime of potassium silicate as I noticed stronger stems but it's just an observation

 

[Uncle Ben]

Yea, I need 25 lb bags of shit lying around. I have a tidy place because my castle is clean. Agree though, hydro stores are a rip. I for one need something mixed and ready to go because my time is worth about 75$/hr in my profession. That's where I'm coming from

Jack's or Dyna-Gro. All in one, complete, cheap, best quality. Jack's can be bought in 8 oz tubs up to 25 lbs. Dyna-Gro 8 oz bottles up to 55 gals.
http://www.dyna-gro.com/936.htm

Sensi Base sucks. Anything AN sells sucks.

For the record, you can't get a plumber around here for less than $110/hr.

UB

 

[BROBIE]

After calling your AN is cheaper BS let me fix one more for you one more time.



Edit and just to piss on your cornflakes a bit some more.

A customer came in today for replacement digital ballast just after I posted this originally. The model he had was no longer available. I replaced with it with a model that cost me $30 more. I broke even on the deal but a happy customer.

Two weeks ago I sold 20 Hortilux 940 bulbs for $175 after tax. I made $5 profit on each bulb. The guy is picking up 10 more tomorrow.

Yes, you had to edit to cover your obvious lie and to save face. You can't do business at your margins. Fact. We will see posts of you boo-hooing how the country sucks cuz you went out of business.

Anyways, why did you add in all those AN sups in your argument as to which nutrients were cheaper? We were talking about base nutrients. AN 3-part vs GH 3-part. If you delve deeper in the ingredients you will find AN 3-part has all those extras: Amino's, Fulvics, surfactant, chealators (ALL Macro's) PH-Perfect, all for $70-80 /gal. GH I can't get sub 100$/gal anywhere. See, with the extras in the AN base , there is no need for those other rip-off bottles you mention like Big Bud or Carbo crap. I'm not arguing that AN will take you to the cleaners, but so will all these other nute lines. But You still fail to substantiate your argument by combining sups with the bases, lets stick with the facts.

 

[Uncle Ben]

I liked the Citrus for end of flower. That was something you recommended. Interested in their other lines, even though I know classics is just fine.

Any other recommendations?

You can use the Citrus FeED from start to finish. I don't use Bloom foods and the cannabis specific foods actually will reduce yields because they induce premature defoliation. With many pinheads, defoliation is a good thing "cause Johnny does it and it works!"

Look at the specs on the Petunia food, the link. I swear it was designed for cannabis (very high Mg for starts). A fairly high nitrate form of N.

• Contains double the iron found in typical peat-like formulations
• Iron is derived from three chelate sources - EDDHA, EDTA, and DTPA to keep it available over a broad range of growing medium pH values
• Contains additional magnesium for optimum crop performance
• Low phosphorus level helps prevent excessive elongation
• High nitrate nitrogen, moderately high potential acidity and no urea
• Not recommended for geraniums or other iron sensitive crops

The 23-3-19 food would work great for start to finish in soil. Now if you must and some pros are experimenting with it...... Jack's has a new product called AquaGold that you could "finish" with.

I looked at all of JR Peter's foods and there are many that look great, think the Palm food was one of them...don't remember. Kicker is shipping costs and economy of scale that is IF you can find your formula for sale. After adding in all extraneous costs like shipping it's almost as costly to buy a 1.5 lb. tub as is a 25 lb. bag. If you're in the states you're gonna pay UPS charges of at least $12 even for a very small amount. Petunia food with extra Mg is a bargain - $2.12/lb.? Are you kidding me? I challenge any one to come close to such fertilizer quality and value.

UB

 

[BROBIE]

Jack's or Dyna-Gro. All in one, complete, cheap, best quality. Jack's can be bought in 8 oz tubs up to 25 lbs. Dyna-Gro 8 oz bottles up to 55 gals.
http://www.dyna-gro.com/936.htm

Sensi Base sucks. Anything AN sells sucks.

For the record, you can't get a plumber around here for less than $110/hr.

UB

How do you know that Sensi base sucks? Have U tried it? . I have and it works better then your dyna or Jacks but I know you talk through biased opinion. Show me where chelating macro's sucks.

And for the record - My 75$ hr is a cumulative average of what I get paid contracting with companies for maintenance agreements in support of complex networks. Your ass-crack plumber analogy is way off. Does the plumber get 110$/hr 9-5 daily? I think not. I take what hrs I put into a particular contract and other expenses incurred, in other words the bottom line. So I see it was some kind of attempt to degrade me and plumbers in general. Do you want to compare life resume's ? Bring it on.

 

[Uncle Ben]

How do you know that Sensi base sucks? Have U tried it? .

No and I never will either. Mama didn't raise no fool.

I can analyze a product and tell how it's gonna work. That includes pricing, value, bang for the buck. If you think there are any Sensi's products, 1 or the many crap supplements you just have to have, that competes with the Petunia food or Dyna-Gro then it reflects what I already know about you - you're a noob that doesn't understand plant nutrition, plant processes nor monetary value.

Change gears - AN are a bunch of dishonest hawks that have been busted by the authorities for including non-food additives in some of their stuff like Gravity. They've been forced to reclaim and stop selling at least 3 (expensive) products. They don't publish the guaranteed analysis. And like the media's MO (except for FOX News) withholding information is the same as telling a lie.

I don't like liars........

Uncle Ben

 

[BROBIE]

No and I never will either. Mama didn't raise no fool.

I can analyze a product and tell how it's gonna work. That includes pricing, value, bang for the buck. If you think there are any Sensi's products, 1 or the many crap supplements you just have to have, that competes with the Petunia food or Dyna-Gro then it reflects what I already know about you - you're a noob that doesn't understand plant nutrition, plant processes nor monetary value.

Change gears - AN are a bunch of dishonest hawks that have been busted by the authorities for including non-food additives in some of their stuff like Gravity. They've been forced to reclaim and stop selling at least 3 (expensive) products. They don't publish the guaranteed analysis. And like the media's MO (except for FOX News) withholding information is the same as telling a lie.

I don't like liars........

Uncle Ben

You just acknowledged you obvious bias. So show me the science degree where you have the competence to analyze a product solely on a governmental controlled label (is this where the government is good now?)

I do understand monetary value. I like Sensi because I can pour it in a bucket and be done with it and go on supporting my 75$/hr contracts !! Get it?

And for the record: Gravity is from Emerald Triangle, AN never sold ANYTHING with Paclo in it.
http://www.advancednutrients.com/paclotruth/

Also, "non-food additives" is also a governmental labeling law term that vendors must put on these labels to signify ingredients that are outside the traditional N-P-K guarantee umbrella.

 

[Doer]

You just acknowledged you obvious bias. So show me the science degree where you have the competence to analyze a product solely on a governmental controlled label (is this where the government is good now?)

I do understand monetary value. I like Sensi because I can pour it in a bucket and be done with it and go on supporting my 75$/hr contracts !! Get it?

And for the record: Gravity is from Emerald Triangle, AN never sold ANYTHING with Paclo in it.
http://www.advancednutrients.com/paclotruth/

What the hell are you talking about? You bring proof or you shut up.

Chelating? Do you even know what that is? Can you say how it is "good?" Have you done a single experiment before you come on trash mouthing experienced growers when questioned about your blabber?

None of that stuff, "works" uness you prove it. They are free to make claims and you are free to believe it. You don't know what "works" is until you grow side by side with one as the Control.

You tell us how you can possibly be competent to discuss this?

 

[Doer]

For the record, Gravity is the only thing I have tried that does work.

Two plants side by side, one will produce more dense buds per ring size diameter x length than the other not treated with a flower hardener.

 

[BROBIE]

What the hell are you talking about? You bring proof or you shut up.

Chelating? Do you even know what that is? Can you say how it is "good?" Have you done a single experiment before you come on trash mouthing experienced growers when questioned about your blabber?

None of that stuff, "works" uness you prove it. They are free to make claims and you are free to believe it. You don't know what "works" is until you grow side by side with one as the Control.

You tell us how you can possibly be competent to discuss this?

So now I need a controlled study? Wow. Let me mark off my calendar to do that.
How have I trash-mouthed? Where did I say "noob" or insulted my 75$ an hr. I think you have things reversed.
Yes I know what chelating is and yes I grown with Sensi and Dyna, and I came to the conclusion that Sensi is better weighing in all the variables. Where is the crime ? How bout you STFU and let UB fight his own fights.

 

[Doer]

So now I need a controlled study? Wow. Let me mark off my calendar to do that.
How have I trash-mouthed? Where did I say "noob" or insulted my 75$ an hr. I think you have things reversed.
Yes I know what chelating is and yes I grown with Sensi and Dyna, and I came to the conclusion that Sensi is better weighing in all the variables. Where is the crime ?

Your crime is being a jerk to well established members when you as a new member have brought nothing.

You don't need to do anything, but grow up, if you can.

 

[Doer]

What is chelating and why does it matter? It doesn't matter to me and I know what it is.

So, hawking product here is not allowed by the members if you don't have anything to say, but that you use it. We question that. And you don't like to be questioned, I'd guess.

 

[BROBIE]

Your crime is being a jerk to well established members when you as a new member have brought nothing.

You don't need to do anything, but grow up, if you can.

What is chelating and why does it matter? It doesn't matter to me and I know what it is.

So, hawking product here is not allowed by the members if you don't have anything to say, but that you use it. We question that. And you don't like to be questioned, I'd guess.

See now comes all the insults when this thread is about AN and I never insulted anyone. An accusation comes along that Gravity is AN derived and my rebuttal is substantiated with facts. Please, again show me where I insulted anyone except telling you to STFU !!

Funny fact: You reference "Hawking" only after UB mentions it. Quite funny actually how social mechanisms work

 

[Uncle Ben]

You just acknowledged you obvious bias.

And just why might that be?

I do understand monetary value. I like Sensi because I can pour it in a bucket and be done with it.... Get it?

You're really not getting this but I'll try one more time and then give up - 1 tsp/gallon of Dyna-Gro provides 13 essential elements for proper plant performance. That equates to just pennies per dose. There is not ONE Sensi product that is complete that I know of. Another damn good reason why any clear headed consumer would steer clear. Their goal is to stick it to you noobs any which way they can by selling in part not whole....and they do.

And for the record: Gravity is from Emerald Triangle, AN never sold ANYTHING with Paclo in it.
http://www.advancednutrients.com/paclotruth/

http://www.advancednutrients.com/paclotruth/

Bushmaster, Gravity....they're all the same to me. Here's one thread that just may disagree with you - https://www.rollitup.org/t/substitute-for-gravity.655110/

 

[BROBIE]

Look at the specs on the Petunia food, the link. I swear it was designed for cannabis (very high Mg for starts). A fairly high nitrate form of N.

• Contains double the iron found in typical peat-like formulations
• Iron is derived from three chelate sources - EDDHA, EDTA, and DTPA to keep it available over a broad range of growing medium pH values
• Contains additional magnesium for optimum crop performance
• Low phosphorus level helps prevent excessive elongation
• High nitrate nitrogen, moderately high potential acidity and no urea
• Not recommended for geraniums or other iron sensitive crops

So for the record, cannabis does have unique requirements is that right? Where did I read you slamming any company being cannabis specific ? just sayin'.

I also noticed how Peters is now using multi-element chelation also, something Sensi has been doing for a long time. Also, when was it really brought out that high P is not needed? Maybe Big Mike and this video published in 2009?:

Hate if you must but fact is fact. UB likes low P and agrees that cannabis has it's unique requirements , so does Mike lol