Onyx or A51?

dbkick

Well-Known Member
Seems it would just make lens replacement more expensive if the lens actually cost more. and if you get down to it (especially with certain spectrum/power diodes)lens replacement would be needed since plastic can possibly fog over with usage.
I mean maybe your diode will last 50k hours but what's that gonna do to your lens?
 

dbkick

Well-Known Member
Or maybe the lens last that long too, I dunno :\
I had a haight that looked like the lens clouded over enough to make it run for shit.Then again it was a haight.
 

PSUAGRO.

Well-Known Member
Or maybe the lens last that long too, I dunno :\
I had a haight that looked like the lens clouded over enough to make it run for shit.Then again it was a haight.
Don't know much about the secondary lens on the onyx, just from pics. I would email them about it, and if removing it would void the warranty.

You know those haight panels had some of the lowest par #'s on the market...........lol




edit....................YES they where shit
 

hyroot

Well-Known Member
Not a fan of HSS either. Would be cool to see vs with a51 and onxy. With the new a51's who knows which is better. I'm on the fence with the 5700k-6200k. I want to see some spectrum charts and see it in action.
 

dbkick

Well-Known Member
Don't know much about the secondary lens on the onyx, just from pics. I would email them about it.
Just did email them about their lenses and I'm sure I'll hear back from them soon enough.
Seems a pretty a51 biased thread so I guess only time will tell.
 

hyroot

Well-Known Member
they offer replacement lenses for the onyx. Other companies don't . Rapid led is more of a diy company. I don't know

Alright we need to see a a51 vs Hans vs onyx showdown once and for all. The winner goes up against apache.... Lets get ready to rumble
 

spazatak

Well-Known Member
Just did email them about their lenses and I'm sure I'll hear back from them soon enough.
Seems a pretty a51 biased thread so I guess only time will tell.
Let me know how you go either here or PM..

I like the lights a lot but whenever investing serious dosh on a light I want to cover all my bases.....What sort of footprint does yours cover?
 

SupraSPL

Well-Known Member
dbkick that would be awesome to see how much juice they draw. The measurement might continue to change until everything warms up and stabilizes.

With the number we have so far, Onyx should dissipate 187W and the SGS-190 should dissipate 166W so a side by side is doable (I subtracted 15% from both for driver and fan consumption).

I agree diffused lenses are a bad deal and I would recommend removing them or replacing them. The XTE is 115 degrees and the XML2 is 120 degrees. I use them without lenses so I keep them 6-8" from the canopy. If we did that with the onyx the coverage would be very bright in a small area. If you somehow reduced the current the efficiency would increase quite a bit and it would make sense to keep them in tight with no lenses. At 1A the XM-L2 T4 7A3 is 36% efficient but the lamp would only dissipate 84W.

I calculated the cost/W (dissipation) for SGS-190 incorrectly it should be $3.46/W and Onyx is $2.40.
 

dbkick

Well-Known Member
dbkick that would be awesome to see how much juice they draw. The measurement might continue to change until everything warms up and stabilizes.

With the number we have so far, Onyx should dissipate 187W and the SGS-190 should dissipate 166W so a side by side is doable (I subtracted 15% from both for driver and fan consumption).

I agree diffused lenses are a bad deal and I would recommend removing them or replacing them. The XTE is 115 degrees and the XML2 is 120 degrees. I use them without lenses so I keep them 6-8" from the canopy. If we did that with the onyx the coverage would be very bright in a small area. If you somehow reduced the current the efficiency would increase quite a bit and it would make sense to keep them in tight with no lenses. At 1A the XM-L2 T4 7A3 is 36% efficient but the lamp would only dissipate 84W.

I calculated the cost/W (dissipation) for SGS-190 incorrectly it should be $3.46/W and Onyx is $2.40.
Just put it on the killawatt , 250 watts exactly.
 

dbkick

Well-Known Member
Let me know how you go either here or PM..

I like the lights a lot but whenever investing serious dosh on a light I want to cover all my bases.....What sort of footprint does yours cover?
I'll let you know what they say but this lens thing isn't as big of an issue as we're making it .
footprint? dunno really, I intend to run enough light per wtfever to get the job done though.
All I can do is post the photos I've already posted somewhere here.....
 

Attachments

spazatak

Well-Known Member
I'll let you know what they say but this lens thing isn't as big of an issue as we're making it .
footprint? dunno really, I intend to run enough light per wtfever to get the job done though.
All I can do is post the photos I've already posted somewhere here.....

Will be watching your grow...


I just did the measurements and they are tiny as hell.. I know leds are quite directional so will see how yours turns out.
 

dbkick

Well-Known Member
from Mike at Rapid about clear vrs diffused lenses....

No, the other XM-L lenses we sell are diffused as well.

A clear lens doesn't mean it's better than a diffused lens, and vice versa. We've spoken to various manufacturers over the years about this and they all say it depends on the lens design. In most cases on narrow lenses (ie. 10, 15, 20 degrees, etc) you'll see a clear lens because the clear lenses tend to have more of a "hot spot" or "spotlight" effect. The diffused lens helps to smooth out the light so you'll get more even coverage. It's hard to describe but take a look at the attachment. The one on the left is a narrow angle (hence the smaller overall beam pattern), but look closely at the middle of the beam pattern. You'll notice a smaller circle within the larger beam. That's the "hot spot" that I was referring to. The picture on the right has a diffused lens and a wider angle, hence the larger beam pattern. However, you'll notice no noticeable inner circle within that beam pattern and a more or less uniform light.

I haven't seen Area 51's lights in person so I can't comment on their lenses. I suppose you'd have to ask them why they're using the lenses they are, but I can say for sure that having a clear lens doesn't necessarily mean it's better than a diffused lens and vice versa.
 

Attachments

spazatak

Well-Known Member
from Mike at Rapid about clear vrs diffused lenses....

No, the other XM-L lenses we sell are diffused as well.

A clear lens doesn't mean it's better than a diffused lens, and vice versa. We've spoken to various manufacturers over the years about this and they all say it depends on the lens design. In most cases on narrow lenses (ie. 10, 15, 20 degrees, etc) you'll see a clear lens because the clear lenses tend to have more of a "hot spot" or "spotlight" effect. The diffused lens helps to smooth out the light so you'll get more even coverage. It's hard to describe but take a look at the attachment. The one on the left is a narrow angle (hence the smaller overall beam pattern), but look closely at the middle of the beam pattern. You'll notice a smaller circle within the larger beam. That's the "hot spot" that I was referring to. The picture on the right has a diffused lens and a wider angle, hence the larger beam pattern. However, you'll notice no noticeable inner circle within that beam pattern and a more or less uniform light.

I haven't seen Area 51's lights in person so I can't comment on their lenses. I suppose you'd have to ask them why they're using the lenses they are, but I can say for sure that having a clear lens doesn't necessarily mean it's better than a diffused lens and vice versa.
Thanks man. interesting info...

I might send Rapid a message and ask about there coverage...

6x12 is tiny but hopefully their coverage is a good
 

dbkick

Well-Known Member
they are def helpful and prompt.
as stated earlier they are more a diy supplier but have been making the onyx for reef for years now.
They know their stuff but will soon know more. I think they'll advance in the horticulture area.
 

dbkick

Well-Known Member
You can also get the onyx in a diy package but they don't sell the xm-l2 emitters so you'd have to settle out for xt-e :P
 

PSUAGRO.

Well-Known Member
What he say about the warranty if the lenses are removed????????...........I'm not going into mike's response........ his remark is VERY debatable:P

Good luck Db........and be safe
 
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