Budbrother69
Active Member
Why do people winterize BHO? I have looked into how to do it but have yet to discover why it is done?
Why do you winterize BHO
- Thread starter Budbrother69
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SnapsProvolone
Well-Known Member
Simple answer: much smoother dabs. Also a little more concentrated so higher potency.
Longer answer: removes plant waxes and lipids extracted by the butane. These coat your lungs and aggravate them.
Longer answer: removes plant waxes and lipids extracted by the butane. These coat your lungs and aggravate them.
WarMachine
Well-Known Member
I second that. Couldn't of said it better.
I guess I can throw it out there, some people don't have a vac setup so they use this method to clean their concentrate without the vac.
I guess I can throw it out there, some people don't have a vac setup so they use this method to clean their concentrate without the vac.
WarMachine
Well-Known Member
I feel your pain, it seems like when I take dabs not that are unwinterized, it's like hell at times. I gotta keep the dab small, but if it is winterized, I can take nearly double the size lol. Try using ISO goalie if you can't get a hold of Everclear very easily, that's what I use and works well for me. I'd love to try Everclear though.
I got some everclear finally, because my iso experiments hadn't worked before. The experiments were taking old bho and just dissolving them in iso and then freezing/straining/evaping . I tried the same with the everclear, i took old crappy bho i had ruined by heating too high and overcooking and dissolved it in everclear. Froze, strained, Evapped, and whats left NEVER stops reacting in the vac chamber... i guess i killed it? LOL.
Next time i do a nug run i will try winterizing where i mix the everclear into the almost but not totally water evapped bho, and hopefully this creates whatever reaction is needed for proper butane purging to then properly (i hope) winterize
Sirdabsalot462
Well-Known Member
Well, since I'm a ” new member”...
I'll try to offer some advice..lol
Once you've got permagoo...winterizing will not be capable of solidifying the oleoresin.
You are on the right track...
Add the PGA as the last little bit of tane is evaporating....
The bubbling will get intense and slowly subside.
I'll try to offer some advice..lol
Once you've got permagoo...winterizing will not be capable of solidifying the oleoresin.
You are on the right track...
Add the PGA as the last little bit of tane is evaporating....
The bubbling will get intense and slowly subside.
Eye of Horus
Well-Known Member
Do not use ISO , if you wanna argue talk to Addison from Steep Hill.
WarMachine
Well-Known Member
I couldn't find anything about him talking about winterizing with ISO either.
potsnoberry
Active Member
I guess if you use really crappy material, or don't have skills, that winterization may have useful purpose but if the converse is true it's not needed.
SnapsProvolone
Well-Known Member
I beg to differ.
Butane being non polar, will extract fats, lipids and plant waxes that have no psychoactive effects. Being non polar it leaves the green behind.
Winterizing with a polar solvent will polish the finest BHO.
WarMachine
Well-Known Member
I agree with SP.
VladFromOG
Active Member
In my experience, winterizing only seems to remove anything when done on BHO made with impure butane that is contaminated with "mystery oil". I clean plate test each case of butane I buy, but I've a friend who used to like Vector or whatever the scam du jour the headshop was selling. We both had an oz of the same weed, I made mine into BHO using clean butane, he made his using Vector 5x. This was a couple years ago, and I was curious about this winterizing thing bc the reasoning behind it didnt make sense, so I suggested we give it a go. We used Everclear. I winterized and filtered nothing, bc, surprise surprise, the solid waxy lipids that are cannabinoids dissolve equally well in butane and cold ethanol, as does the solid waxy lipids that make up a fraction of a percent of my BHOs (according to the local cannabinoid analysis shop). My friend on the other hand, filtered out almost a full gram of white hard wax that looked exactly like the stearic acid flakes you get for candlemaking.
What was the reason for this? After all, we used the same weed, the same extraction and winterizing techniques, the only thing different was the butane. So we clean plate tested his butane and, of course, there was a good 3g of lubricant oil contaminants. Which makes sense. The stearic and oleic acid they put into butane to lubricate lighters dissolve in butane and hot ethanol but not cold ethanol. True, both these are minor components in the plants natural oils and so could theoretically be removed by winterizing, they only make up a few mg, esp in the flower material, though even an extract of the leaf would'nt yield anything like what folks report pulling out from winterizing.
I've tried winterizing BHO made from clean butane and a couple different strains since then, never succeeded in pulling anything out. I've known folks who winterize and always filter a lot out, but they also use butane I've tested and found contaminated with oil. I should note that although the winterizing removed some of the oil contaminant from my friends BHO, it didnt remove all of it.
If you winterize and remove a lot of hard wax, try a clean plate test of your butane; discharge a can into a dish and let it evape completely. Run your finger across, then smell it. If it feels greasy or has visible oil, or it smells, its contaminated.
The good news is I've figured out how to remove the contaminants from impure butane, to a very high degree: http://rollitup.org/t/method-to-remove-contaminants-from-butane-cheap-easy.823138/#post-10393273
What was the reason for this? After all, we used the same weed, the same extraction and winterizing techniques, the only thing different was the butane. So we clean plate tested his butane and, of course, there was a good 3g of lubricant oil contaminants. Which makes sense. The stearic and oleic acid they put into butane to lubricate lighters dissolve in butane and hot ethanol but not cold ethanol. True, both these are minor components in the plants natural oils and so could theoretically be removed by winterizing, they only make up a few mg, esp in the flower material, though even an extract of the leaf would'nt yield anything like what folks report pulling out from winterizing.
I've tried winterizing BHO made from clean butane and a couple different strains since then, never succeeded in pulling anything out. I've known folks who winterize and always filter a lot out, but they also use butane I've tested and found contaminated with oil. I should note that although the winterizing removed some of the oil contaminant from my friends BHO, it didnt remove all of it.
If you winterize and remove a lot of hard wax, try a clean plate test of your butane; discharge a can into a dish and let it evape completely. Run your finger across, then smell it. If it feels greasy or has visible oil, or it smells, its contaminated.
The good news is I've figured out how to remove the contaminants from impure butane, to a very high degree: http://rollitup.org/t/method-to-remove-contaminants-from-butane-cheap-easy.823138/#post-10393273
Texas(THC)
Well-Known Member
"The good news is I've figured out how to remove the contaminants from impure butane, to a very high degree: http://rollitup.org/t/method-to-remove-contaminants-from-butane-cheap-easy.823138/#post-10393273"
why try and remove the contaminants when the easier solution is to use quality butane, with no contaminants...
also it seems you are a bit confused on what takes place when you winterize
the fats/waxes/lipids clump up together while the cannabinoids bond to the alcohol making the undesirables easy to filter out
why try and remove the contaminants when the easier solution is to use quality butane, with no contaminants...
also it seems you are a bit confused on what takes place when you winterize
the fats/waxes/lipids clump up together while the cannabinoids bond to the alcohol making the undesirables easy to filter out
bez420
Well-Known Member
Ok so where would you suggest I find some good quality butane? I never really trust the head shop hype. But a Gas Pipe guy told me that I should be looking for cooking butane. Looked into it very little, but afraid he was just blowing smoke. Rock that Lone Star brother!
Guzias1
Well-Known Member
like!
VladFromOG
Active Member
Texas, it is better to use pure butane. But having the ability to clean impure could be very useful. In any event always test your butane! Its fast, easy, and you'll be shocked how every single manufacturer who labels theirs as X times refined is dirtier than those who dont.
Bez, I use colibri. Lucienne and Newport have also tested clean, but have many unclean counterfeits being sold in my area so I avoid them unless I'm ordering online.
Texas, you're a bit confused as to the nature of THC etc, I think. Think about it - thc is a white to off yellow waxy lipid, the other cannabinoids vary from thick waxes to thin oils. The remaining plant waxes, which total less than 1/10th the total mass of a flower extract, have the exact same physical properties, including solubility. Check out the solubility of thc and various plant fats on chemspider or test it yourself by winterizing hempseed oil (or any other plant fat), they'll stay dissolved in cold eto just as well. True, traces of oleic and stearic acid in the bhO would be removed, but they only amount to a few mg, not the huge amount most report getting filtered out.
Again, its impossible to filter out hemp waxes (THC) from other hemp waxes by using a solvent which holds both equally well. You know what cold ethanol doesn't hold on to? The semisynthetic lubricant oils in contaminated butane.
I know that this goes against hundreds of online "oil experts", but the tests don't lie: clean butane used and winterizing yields nothing, dirty butane used and winterizing yields lots.
As if all this evidence isn't enough, I'm sending a buddies winterizing cake to the lab, to prove that it is just the contaminant.
Bez, I use colibri. Lucienne and Newport have also tested clean, but have many unclean counterfeits being sold in my area so I avoid them unless I'm ordering online.
Texas, you're a bit confused as to the nature of THC etc, I think. Think about it - thc is a white to off yellow waxy lipid, the other cannabinoids vary from thick waxes to thin oils. The remaining plant waxes, which total less than 1/10th the total mass of a flower extract, have the exact same physical properties, including solubility. Check out the solubility of thc and various plant fats on chemspider or test it yourself by winterizing hempseed oil (or any other plant fat), they'll stay dissolved in cold eto just as well. True, traces of oleic and stearic acid in the bhO would be removed, but they only amount to a few mg, not the huge amount most report getting filtered out.
Again, its impossible to filter out hemp waxes (THC) from other hemp waxes by using a solvent which holds both equally well. You know what cold ethanol doesn't hold on to? The semisynthetic lubricant oils in contaminated butane.
I know that this goes against hundreds of online "oil experts", but the tests don't lie: clean butane used and winterizing yields nothing, dirty butane used and winterizing yields lots.
As if all this evidence isn't enough, I'm sending a buddies winterizing cake to the lab, to prove that it is just the contaminant.
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