white hairs please help
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wonderwoman1355
Member
Do you have any pics have any of the hairs turned at all?
coopdevillan
Well-Known Member
You have visual access to your trichs and thats ALL you need to get a accurate reading of when to crop. If you have all milky trichs and some going amber YOUR READY TO CHOP ! Ripe trichs is what is going to establish your high. If your trichs rot and spoil then you have defeated the purpose of growing marijuana to smoke or consume.
Depending on strain and sought high you need milky to amber. Let this pic help ya. Hope this helps
Depending on strain and sought high you need milky to amber. Let this pic help ya. Hope this helps
Brick Top
New Member
What strain are you growing? Some strains, like Matanuska Tundra, will still have white pistils when the plant is ready to be harvested. Also, while it is not the most common of things, not all trichomes begin as colorless-clear. Some can be a clear-yellow or even a clear-amber from the beginning and in those cases you cannot go by a color change and only go by when whatever the original color is begins to turn cloudy.
The colorless-clear to cloudy/milky to amber is normal but it will not always happen 100% of the time. Pistils turning orange or red or brown and receding is normal but it will not always happen 100% of the time. It is strain dependent and now and then someone will grow a strain that is an exception to the norm.
Nip a small bud, or a piece of a larger bud, and dry it, without using heat, and sample it and see if you feel it is time to harvest or not.
coopdevillan
Well-Known Member
They look really fat and nice. If you have watched them go from clear to milky to amber then my opinion is your ready to cut ur weeds by 9 weeks.
rzza
Well-Known Member
i disagree totally. saying that a bud is ready to be picked when it has white hairs is like saying a green tomato is ready for pickin. i believe those strains your talking about happen to be 12 week flowerers. id bet that those pistils will receed and turn brown if you waited long enough.
also you simply cant nip a bud and get an accurate feeling of its high without at least a short cure and by then your plant is two wweks further along.
IMO this is the bottom line....grow each plant to its full maturity and choose strains that you enjoy the high such as indicas for the couch lock and sativas for the day time cerebral buzz. dont chop early because its the BUZZ you like. buy genetics that you can grow to maturity and still enjoy the buzz.
i like sorta spicy peppers. im not gonna buy the super spicy pepper seeds and grow it for less time to get sorta spicy ...ya know? ill buy the sorta spicy seeds and grow em out.
brick i know your rebuttal but its just not sensical imo, upon death EVERYONE experiences (or doesnt) rigor mortis. upon harvest time EVERYBUD has brown receeded hairs. it happens at the END of their life cycle.
rzza
Well-Known Member
this isnt my opinion im telling you fact, the truth. dont even start looking at the trichs yet, you will just start getting confused. im afraid you have a long while till their done. you will know when their getting close cuz theyll start looking like something you would buy from a dispensary. you know, like hard nuggets of delisciousness, not white hairy buds. those calyx will swell and look similar to this ...
not this
see the difference? thats thirty days. 60 day pic and 90 day pic.
Brick Top
New Member
If you read my post clearly it said; " Some strains, like Matanuska Tundra, will still have white pistils when the plant is ready to be harvested." That is not the only strain like that and while I am not claiming the strain in question is one such strain, it is possible. People like you like and want and need one answer accurately fits all questions but that is not how things always are.
You said; " i believe those strains your talking about happen to be 12 week flowerers. id bet that those pistils will receed and turn brown if you waited long enough." You were wrong. Matanuska Tundra is a 65 day strain, that is slightly more than 9.25 weeks and as I said it is one of the strains that is known to still have many white pistils when fully mature.
Here is a portion of an article about potency from Cannabis Culture Marijuana Magazine; "Traditionally marijuana has been harvested when the pistils die and the calyx starts to swell into a false seed pod. These days the best growers are getting much more detailed in their harvesting criteria. They take a close look at the trichomes themselves to judge peak harvest. Evidence that this is the only real way to tell peak maturity is in Sagarmatha's strain Matanuska Tundra, which ripens resin glands while most pistils are still alive and white. This seems an odd twist of evolution but proves that the pistil color and ripe glands do not necessarily have any correlation."
I never said that a sample bud would accurately represent what a final cured product will be. That was an incorrect assumption on your part. But if there is a good high and if it is fairly long lasting to long lasting that does tell you a hell of a lot more than you will ever know by only looking at trichs. Also just as a green banana continues to ripen after purchased harvested cannabis and curing cannabis continues to change so if a sample tells you that you are very close then the rest will occur during a long slow properly performed drying and a long slow cure. All chemical processes do not end once a plant is chopped down and all that do occur are not only the normally thought of breaking down of various elements.
You said; "grow each plant to its full maturity." I do not disagree with that but in this case there are conflicting signs of maturity. If someone puts more faith in pistil color and condition, which is what growers did back in the dark ages before they learned about trichome color, then clearly the plants need more time. If someone goes by trichome color then clearly they are ready to be harvested or possibly have already gone past peak time to harvest for maximum potency. That is unless someone is one who prefers to lose THC by allowing THC to oxidize and become CBN, which does not make a person high and instead only causes a confused messed up feeling.
So what is your opinion, to harvest according to the reddish/amber trichome color or ignore the trichome color and instead go only by pistil color?
coopdevillan
Well-Known Member
Im saying it's in the trichs. That is the only way to crop. You cant go wrong with a scope.
rzza
Well-Known Member
first of all, im speaking from experience. your speaking from someone elses writing (maybe about their own experience) and that makes a difference. second, this doesnt say its ready to pick. in fact it even says the hairs are white and ALIVE. perhaps this means that the trichs become extremely amber when its FINISHED.
not true, its mature when BOTH (trichs and hairs) say its mature.
fuck the trichs. they sure do tell a story but it doesnt matter because they often change colors before the pistils but that doesnt mean you should pick. you should wait till hairs are receeded (i agree not all strains receed but they all die and change color) and then stick a scope on the trichs to make you feel good about yourself. also its not ONLY about pistil color like you are claiming i think. its about full maturity and the pistils are usually the last to show sign of maturity. therefore thats what you look at, yes.
in the example pictures i showed, thats qwerkle, a 65 day strain. subcool suggests takings them between 60 and 70 days. again, the immature pic is at day 60 and the other day 92. those trichs looked amber around the second month. are you suggesting that should have been chopped?
bricktop, with all due respect, do you even grow cannabis? all your posts seem to be filled with amateur responses to many topics, suggesting you get all your info from books and forums. please dont come back with yes i grow, show me some pics of yur finished buds and preharvest shots please. if you cannot do that you should no longer be passing the advise from one wrong forum poster to the next. know what i mean?
i will go to my flower room today and find some amber trichs and show you what the buds look like. you will see my point very soon.
Brick Top
New Member
Originally Posted by Brick TopIf you read my post clearly it said; " Some strains, like Matanuska Tundra, will still have white pistils when the plant is ready to be harvested." That is not the only strain like that and while I am not claiming the strain in question is one such strain, it is possible. People like you like and want and need one answer accurately fits all questions but that is not how things always are.
You said; " i believe those strains your talking about happen to be 12 week flowerers. id bet that those pistils will receed and turn brown if you waited long enough." You were wrong. Matanuska Tundra is a 65 day strain, that is slightly more than 9.25 weeks and as I said it is one of the strains that is known to still have many white pistils when fully mature.
Here is a portion of an article about potency from Cannabis Culture marijuana Magazine; "Traditionally marijuana has been harvested when the pistils die and the calyx starts to swell into a false seed pod. These days the best growers are getting much more detailed in their harvesting criteria. They take a close look at the trichomes themselves to judge peak harvest. Evidence that this is the only real way to tell peak maturity is in Sagarmatha's strain Matanuska Tundra, which ripens resin glands while most pistils are still alive and white. This seems an odd twist of evolution but proves that the pistil color and ripe glands do not necessarily have any correlation."
I am speaking from nearly four decades of growing, I began growing in 1972. I cited information from Cannabis Culture marijuana Magazine to support my nearly four decades of growing experience. You on the other hand have only expressed your personal opinions based on what you consider to be experience.
Growers like you refuse to accept that not all answers or ways of doing things are correct 100% of the time for each and every strain. I gave an example of a strain, Matanuska Tundra, where when the plants are fully ripe it is totally normal for many to most pistils to still be white. That is a proven fact. It also proves, as the information cited said; "This seems an odd twist of evolution but proves that the pistil color and ripe glands do not necessarily have any correlation."
If you want to refuse to accept proven facts that is totally up to you but on a site that exists for the sharing of true factual knowledge it is irresponsible for someone to insist that their limited knowledge and chosen personal beliefs disprove actual facts.
I will not go into my feelings of SubCool based on past experiences.
I have grown since 1972. Regardless of you believing that or not, I have grown for nearly four decades. I stopped posting what I call evidence after two experiences I learned about, one was local. On one board I was a member of, that is now defunct a member was busted because of pictures he posted of his basement grow. In one picture you could see the corner of his furnace. If you enlarged the picture you could clearly read the name, address and telephone number of the heat-a/c business that serviced his furnace. LEO contacted them and from there they traced the grower and he was busted.
In my town a grower put a beautiful looking plant in his living room to be able to take a better picture of it. In the background was a picture of his daughter that he was given custody of in a divorce. His ex saw the picture, ratted him out and he was not only busted but he lost custody of his daughter.
After those two experiences I decided that I will not post any pictures. I stopped posting two boards ago and I will not post again. I do not even say if I have something growing at any certain time. I might mention something that happened a year or two ago, but it might have happened yesterday. I give nothing of any help to anyone I would prefer not to help.
After nearly four decades of not having any legal problems I see no reason to push my luck any farther than I did.
As for what you called amateurish responses. That is a common misconception among those with little to absolutely no botanical knowledge and who do not have as many years experience as I have decades of experience .. heck, many here who write as if they are pros have not had as many grows as I have had decades of growing experience.
I see things most others do not see. I know the reasons for things that most others do not know. Because of that my replies are not the typical 'it must be nute burn' or 'it much be pH' etc. to almost every single problem someone asks advice about.
Four family members have degrees in botany and I have picked their brains for years. I have read a fair number of the books they used while in college. I have read a fair number of other botanical books that are kept at the nursery. I have gone to various botanical short-courses with them. We own a pot-in-pot nursery that covers roughly 17 acres of land. We know how to grow in pots, we know what many various plants, trees and bushes need and when all that is added to my nearly four decades of cannabis growing experience it adds up to a rather large amount of knowledge.
If anyone wants an example of amateurish responses take a look at what you said earlier; "fuck the trichs." Any knowledgable grower knows that trichomes tell a grower far more than anything else in regards to when a plant is ready to be harvested, and I did cite information to that effect.
And what will pictures of amber trichomes prove? Do you actually believe that amber trichomes are what is always best and is always a sign of peak THC levels and the very best time to harvest? If so you really do need a great, great, GREAT deal more educating and gathering of real growing experience.
Additional information added:
What you wrongly described as being; "your speaking from someone elses writing (maybe about their own experience)" was information that came from:
References:
1) Starks, Michael. 1977. Marijuana Chemistry Genetics, Processing and Potency. Ronin Publishing, Inc., Berkeley, CA pp. 17-86.
2) McParland, Clarke, Watson. Hemp Diseases and Pests; management and biological control, CABI Publishing, New York, NY
3) Pate, DW, 1994. Chemical ecology of Cannabis. Journal of the International Hemp Association 2: 29, 32-37.
4) Kutscheid, 1973. Quantitative variation in chemical constituents of marihuana from stands of naturalized Cannabis sativa L. in east central Illinois. Economic Botany 27: 193-203.
5) B?csa, M?th? and Hangyel. Effect of nitrogen on tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) content in hemp leaves at different positions. 1997. Journal of the International Hemp Association 4(2): 78 -79.
6) Helen Philbrick and Richard B Gregg. Companion Plants and How to Use Them. 1996. Devin-Adair Company, Old Greenwich, CT.
7) Oldtimer1, 2001. Personal communication
Vic High, 2001. BC Growers Association. Web site and help desk.9) Hoffman, Dr Silke. 2001. Ultraviolet radiation in the greenhouse. Floraculture International, May 2001. Ball Publishing, Batavia, Illinois. pp18-27.
? An excellent general reference is Marijuana Botany, by Robert Connell Clarke. Ronin Publishing, Inc. Berkeley, CA
Their scientific findings cannot accurately be described, by you or by anyone else, as; "speaking from someone elses writing (maybe about their own experience.") Their "experience" falls under the heading of true scientific research and discoveries.
Now lets all see if your pictures of amber trichomes can actually disprove the scientific discoveries of, 1) Starks, Michael. 1977. Marijuana Chemistry Genetics, Processing and Potency. Ronin Publishing, Inc., Berkeley, CA pp. 17-86.
2) McParland, Clarke, Watson. Hemp Diseases and Pests; management and biological control, CABI Publishing, New York, NY
3) Pate, DW, 1994. Chemical ecology of Cannabis. Journal of the International Hemp Association 2: 29, 32-37.
4) Kutscheid, 1973. Quantitative variation in chemical constituents of marihuana from stands of naturalized Cannabis sativa L. in east central Illinois. Economic Botany 27: 193-203.
5) B?csa, M?th? and Hangyel. Effect of nitrogen on tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) content in hemp leaves at different positions. 1997. Journal of the International Hemp Association 4(2): 78 -79.
6) Helen Philbrick and Richard B Gregg. Companion Plants and How to Use Them. 1996. Devin-Adair Company, Old Greenwich, CT.
7) Oldtimer1, 2001. Personal communication
Vic High, 2001. BC Growers Association. Web site and help desk.9) Hoffman, Dr Silke. 2001. Ultraviolet radiation in the greenhouse. Floraculture International, May 2001. Ball Publishing, Batavia, Illinois. pp18-27.
? An excellent general reference is Marijuana Botany, by Robert Connell Clarke. Ronin Publishing, Inc. Berkeley, CA
Anyone care to bet on if his pictures of amber trichomes will disprove the scientific findings of those mentioned above?
doc111
Well-Known Member
Wow, this is one of those things that I usually don't weigh in on because of the heated arguments that are bound to happen as a result. Strong opinions and egoes cloud our judgement. The simplest way to tell if a bud is done enough to your liking is to smoke it! I don't have 4 decades of growing experience and frankly, I know plenty who do that can barely grow a dandelion but I digress. Experiment and see what you like. I can see arguments being made for bud appearance, trichs and pistils all being indicators of ripeness. Back to snipping a test nug for a minute. I disagree with whomever said that you can't get a true feel for the bud with a quick dry. Sure you can! It's not going to be the smoothest, most potent bud but IMO gives you the best idea of when to harvest. I don't use a microwave or an oven. I simply cut off a joint sized bud, stick it in a paper bag and check it in a couple of days. It is usually ready to smoke in about 3-5 days and the harvest window for growing indoor with most strains is at least 2 weeks. The buzz isn't going to change that much in 3-5 days. Remember, you are only trying to get a feel for potency and type of buzz with a quick dry sample. It's not rocket science but for some reason this seems to be one of these areas that often confuses novice growers and truth be told I think some people go way longer than need be but hey, to each their own. Happy growing!
rzza
Well-Known Member
the good ones?
then its not ripe.
you can still answer the question there that doesnt relate to subcool. i will ask it again at the end.
but nobody can back that up because refuse to show anyone anything bla bla. i guess if i was doing this illegally i wouldnt post pics either but you can post pics from ten years ago without risk.
im having a hard time understanding what their studies prove. i will admit that trichs change color in the process but my whole point is one needs to wait for two things to happen before its ripe:hairs receed and darken, trichs change to mostly amber. usually the trichs change first. therefore i said fuck trichs. look at the pistils.
heres the bottom line, this guy is asking what to do, his plants are still hairy but the trichs are colorful. your suggesting not to wory about the hairs. these hairs....
so again i will ask you why are you suggesting this plant is finished?