Tops for Toys

RottenBoy

Active Member
Woah woah woah lets stay civil boys....... Rottenboy relax man..if someone is critic of azcs let them be. Don get so pissy over it, you come off like a crazy person. Im sure you're a REALLY great guy, just relax and let people say what they say.

View attachment 1940125
"Be Excellent to each other"
true.. I am a really good guy..
true.. I do take offense pretty easily.

It just really pisses me off when people talk crap about someone who is trying to help us all.
IvIars, go rent a building, pay employees, pay utilities, then go dish our your free clones... I doubt youll do it for more then a day.
I too have given out free clones MANY occassions but i wouldnt be able to supply the "general public".
As cheap as it is to clone, you start cutting 1000 clones and thats gonna cost some money for supplies, lighting, heck even water.. and they are not selling them for 20$ they are giving you a free clone for an approximate dollar amount of a gift... Basically. donate a 20$ toy and we'll hook you up with some clones.
just quit talking shit, and lets get back to the matter at hand. changing the 25 mile rule :P just kidding... ITS THE KIDS!..
I picked up some toys a couple days ago but haven't dropped them off yet... I spent 65$ and i wont be picking up ANY clones or grams.. how about that :)
 

phx

Active Member
true.. I am a really good guy..
true.. I do take offense pretty easily.

It just really pisses me off when people talk crap about someone who is trying to help us all.
IvIars, go rent a building, pay employees, pay utilities, then go dish our your free clones... I doubt youll do it for more then a day.
I too have given out free clones MANY occassions but i wouldnt be able to supply the "general public".
As cheap as it is to clone, you start cutting 1000 clones and thats gonna cost some money for supplies, lighting, heck even water.. and they are not selling them for 20$ they are giving you a free clone for an approximate dollar amount of a gift... Basically. donate a 20$ toy and we'll hook you up with some clones.
just quit talking shit, and lets get back to the matter at hand. changing the 25 mile rule :P just kidding... ITS THE KIDS!..
I picked up some toys a couple days ago but haven't dropped them off yet... I spent 65$ and i wont be picking up ANY clones or grams.. how about that :)
off subject but i hope nobody's spending a lot on cloning lights and electricity.. i've rooted 300+ at a time with a single 14w cfl. clones only need enough light to inhibit the auxin(s) that generate the flowering response. i talked to someone that rooted a few cuts with the backlight of a cell phone screen, just for kicks. excessive light for clones is unnecessary and can be counterproductive.
 

phx

Active Member
if you want cheap cuts, move to CA :) i got your elite OGs, recommended donation 8 bones a pop. most of us that dish whole trays to dispensaries do so at $2-3 per cut
 

Philosophist

Well-Known Member
if you want cheap cuts, move to CA :) i got your elite OGs, recommended donation 8 bones a pop. most of us that dish whole trays to dispensaries do so at $2-3 per cut
what part ?? if ur in SD i might come get some OG if its KILLLLLLER
 

Bird Gymnastics

New Member
Its a business to make money. You have no business sense. Why give something to the masses when you can keep it yourself and charge people for it. They are a business trying to make money.

And genetics play a HUGE role in quality, grower talent helps a little.
coming from an azcs member!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You know nothing about LAW nor do you have the logic to look up a entity (AZCS)... Public records SAY different than what you preach...

As far as AZCS being nonprofit business that is NOT TRUE....
They are listed with the ACC as an L.L.C. in the state of Arizona which is a For Porfit business entity.... I believe you do not know what you are talking about....

File Numbe: DC
Corp. Name: ARIZONA CANNABIS SOCIETY L.L.C.
DC
WICKENBURG, AZ 85390
Agent Name:
Agent Mailing/Physical Address:
DC
WICKENBURG, AZ 85390
Agent Status: APPOINTED 03/28/2011
Agent Last Updated: 09/08/2011
Corporation Type: DOMESTIC L.L.C.Business Type:
Incorporation Date: 03/28/2011Corporate Life Period: PERPETUAL
Domicile: ARIZONACounty: MARICOPA
Approval Date: 05/26/2011Original Publish Date: 08/11/2011

Date of Taking Office: 03/28/2011 Last Updated: 05/26/2011






You have NOOO clue BRO... I feel bad for folks that know nothing of Public Info...
They are NOT a Non Profit with the State nor the IRS....

So Piss off dude and go back to AZCS and keep on trolling BRO... If you really believe this shit you are talking about you are a fucking idiot bro...

Is AZCS telling folks they are a Non Profit??? Highly Illegal if they are.....

No one bashed AZCS for the Toy drive DUDE!!! I bashed them for the way I was treated and the way a good friend was treated... There are a shit ton of people that were treated like shit...


Conclusion,

I respect those who go beyond the norm... The American dream as gone away in this country... The one thing I respect AZCS for is the strive for the American Dream... They are going way beyond the norm and are fulfilling the American Dream...But the road is very bumpy and being an ass to everyone that they do not like is not a Wise practice! In the end we all want Legalization of this beautiful plant we call cannabis.

It takes years to build reputation and 1 wrong doing to ruin it... So YES I go out of my way to express my opinion and Experience with AZCS just like you go out of your way to HIDE their wrong doings!!!

TIT 4 TAT
true.. I am a really good guy..
true.. I do take offense pretty easily.

It just really pisses me off when people talk crap about someone who is trying to help us all.
IvIars, go rent a building, pay employees, pay utilities, then go dish our your free clones... I doubt youll do it for more then a day.
I too have given out free clones MANY occassions but i wouldnt be able to supply the "general public".
As cheap as it is to clone, you start cutting 1000 clones and thats gonna cost some money for supplies, lighting, heck even water.. and they are not selling them for 20$ they are giving you a free clone for an approximate dollar amount of a gift... Basically. donate a 20$ toy and we'll hook you up with some clones.
just quit talking shit, and lets get back to the matter at hand. changing the 25 mile rule :P just kidding... ITS THE KIDS!..
I picked up some toys a couple days ago but haven't dropped them off yet... I spent 65$ and i wont be picking up ANY clones or grams.. how about that :)
I guess AZCS is in for rude awakening when a REAL collective comes around that strictly helps its patients for the cause. I understand a business is here to make money but before claiming you are a "compassion" club, actually show some compassion. I've worked at collectives and dispensaries in different states all over the country and very few are here for the good of this plant. I believe AZCS is not one of them. To our patients they pay nothing for clones, nothing for our help and close to nothing for some of the best medicine in the state (even according to some club members in AZCS.) I am curious, how do you guys go about getting the price for the medicine you provide? This will be the clarification if you guys are "compassionate" or merely here to cash out on this cash crop?
 

phx

Active Member
i don't do what i do for profit, but i don't think there's anything wrong with people that do. nothing morally superior about selling any other product to customers, people should be allowed to profit from work. that said, $50/8th all the way up isn't all that compassionate so i don't think it affords you that label. consider that cannabis is worth considerably less here in CA due to all the competition, and people are still profiting selling pounds of indoor at 2400usd, $150 an oz average. only the best growers with elite strains will take in over 3200/lb(200/oz). rent is at least 2x as much virtually everywhere in CA, and electricity can cost over $.40/kwh here. how much is electricity in phoenix these days? i'm pretty sure i remembered paying anywhere from 6-13 cents per kwh. considerably less. on top of that you have far fewer risks in AZ, the air is dry so pm is virtually nonexistent and cannabis pests are rare. over a decade of growing in phoenix and i've never seen spidermites, root aphids, thrips, powdery mildew, pythium, or botrytis on mine or any of my friends' grows. all you really have to contend with is heat. phoenix is a dream environment for indoor growing in my opinion and the quality we produced out there was totally top shelf every time.

i don't mean to dog anyone so i won't name names, i know AZ produces some fire indoor that can run with anything in CA because i've seen it and done it.. but i've seen the meds from a number of AZ compassion clubs and i've yet to see anything impressive at all. so many of these places have last year or earlier's hot cali commercial strains like blue dream and green crack, and old school dutch shit that just doesn't compare to what we're doing out here in CA, and it's not even good enough to call top shelf out here. the quality of the blue dream i see out there would be worth like 1600 a pack here, it's so totally average. everything i've seen was either harvested way too early, or clearly grown with high-EC straight mineral nutes just going by mfgr's excessive feed charts, or grown with illegal and dangerous PGRs like paclobutrazol, daminozide, and chlormequat chloride (bushmaster, gravity, phosphoload, flower dragon, probably bud factor x and other AN bloom boosters, many others) that totally diminish quality and potency. those rock-hard gravity-fed flowers with tiny little trichomes contain PGRs with potentially carcinogenic breakdown products, the stuff isn't safe medicine. people out there need to get educated about these PGRs and the products that contain them, and start calling out growers that use that shit. if i see it, i'm droppin' the dime to your patients. people deserve to know if their meds are safe or not.

i recommend sticking with the tried and true AZ local badasses Botanicare. their organic amendments for hydro are the secret behind probably the tastiest herb you've had in AZ. synth/organic in hydro is often considered high risk and challenging but botanicare makes a complete line of products for the method that makes things as easy as possible. liquid karma increases nutrient uptake and leads to the biggest god damn foliage you'll ever see, my POG produces fan leaves with 14" blades. pureblend original increases nutrient uptake and provides a slew of things you're not getting from a full-synth base and dramatically increases flavors, smells, textures, and visual appeal when added to your low-EC mineral nute mix. aquashield provides composted poultry litter enzymatic root breakdown along with root zone protection from a handful of bacillus strains. ZHO is a killer root zone inoculant devoid of myco species that don't even colonize root zones on annuals, though it's expensive as hell so i use roots oregonism which works just as well. hydroplex 0-10-6 is a basic bloom booster devoid of PGRs that just works, and very well, and also contains a bunch of amino acids and trace minerals. CNS17 and pureblend pro are both powerful and easy to use base nute regimens, and cal-mag+ is pretty much the gold standard of ca/mg/iron/trace element supplements. even the power series with blast-off, and tri-flex have given us outstanding results. "sweet" is bullshit though, i can't recommend that or any sweetener product for hydro.

if you're bent on sterile full synth hydro, i like botanicare cns17/power/triflex lines or dynagro most for base ferts but for a whole line, dutch master is where it's at. they make everything you need for a complete sterile synth formula including a high quality oxidizer (zone) but DON'T FOLLOW THE FUCKING FEED SCHEDULE. on ANYTHING, ever. watch your EC. many lines have feed schedules that top out at 2500-3000uS/cm EC. no indoor cannabis plant needs that much fertilizer, it leads to herb that tastes like hose water and looks like shit. 1500-1900uS/cm peak is as much as you'll ever need to facilitate strong healthy growth of HIGH QUALITY flowers.

you want heavier yields like you get with the illegal and dangerous PGR bloom boosters, without ruining the quality and potency of your flowers and risking your health? there's a safe and natural plant growth regulator that'll help you accomplish that. Triacontanol. it's commonly found in alfalfa meal and beeswax. beeswax seems to be the best source, but failing that an alfalfa tea or soil amendment will provide the benefits. there are several bloom boosters on the market that contain triacontanol, either naturally or synthetically derived, but the best i've seen so far is Resinator from Rock Nutrients. it's the only thing i've found that gives you dramatic results almost overnight. it's a high-K bloom booster to be used in late flower along with beeswax derived triacontanol, citric acid, and a few other things i can't remember. i use botanicare hydroplex for the first half of flower and rock resinator for the second half, 2ml/g hydroplex then 1-2ml/g resinator. trichomes swell up bigger than you've ever seen and become more numerous. big enough you can visually inspect their maturity without a loupe on some strains, i'm not joking. calyxes swell fatter than ever, aromas are more pronounced, yields are better, colors are better, texture is better, potency is better. it does all the things that AN claims to do, but doesn't. they also make a root stimulant product called "supercharge" that works just amazingly and i've seen it save some pretty much trashed grows full of pythium, but i hesitate to recommend it because i don't know what's in it.
 

Bird Gymnastics

New Member
i don't do what i do for profit, but i don't think there's anything wrong with people that do. nothing morally superior about selling any other product to customers, people should be allowed to profit from work. that said, $50/8th all the way up isn't all that compassionate so i don't think it affords you that label. consider that cannabis is worth considerably less here in CA due to all the competition, and people are still profiting selling pounds of indoor at 2400usd, $150 an oz average. only the best growers with elite strains will take in over 3200/lb(200/oz). rent is at least 2x as much virtually everywhere in CA, and electricity can cost over $.40/kwh here. how much is electricity in phoenix these days? i'm pretty sure i remembered paying anywhere from 6-13 cents per kwh. considerably less. on top of that you have far fewer risks in AZ, the air is dry so pm is virtually nonexistent and cannabis pests are rare. over a decade of growing in phoenix and i've never seen spidermites, root aphids, thrips, powdery mildew, pythium, or botrytis on mine or any of my friends' grows. all you really have to contend with is heat. phoenix is a dream environment for indoor growing in my opinion and the quality we produced out there was totally top shelf every time.

i don't mean to dog anyone so i won't name names, i know AZ produces some fire indoor that can run with anything in CA because i've seen it and done it.. but i've seen the meds from a number of AZ compassion clubs and i've yet to see anything impressive at all. so many of these places have last year or earlier's hot cali commercial strains like blue dream and green crack, and old school dutch shit that just doesn't compare to what we're doing out here in CA, and it's not even good enough to call top shelf out here. the quality of the blue dream i see out there would be worth like 1600 a pack here, it's so totally average. everything i've seen was either harvested way too early, or clearly grown with high-EC straight mineral nutes just going by mfgr's excessive feed charts, or grown with illegal and dangerous PGRs like paclobutrazol, daminozide, and chlormequat chloride (bushmaster, gravity, phosphoload, flower dragon, probably bud factor x and other AN bloom boosters, many others) that totally diminish quality and potency. those rock-hard gravity-fed flowers with tiny little trichomes contain PGRs with potentially carcinogenic breakdown products, the stuff isn't safe medicine. people out there need to get educated about these PGRs and the products that contain them, and start calling out growers that use that shit. if i see it, i'm droppin' the dime to your patients. people deserve to know if their meds are safe or not.

i recommend sticking with the tried and true AZ local badasses Botanicare. their organic amendments for hydro are the secret behind probably the tastiest herb you've had in AZ. synth/organic in hydro is often considered high risk and challenging but botanicare makes a complete line of products for the method that makes things as easy as possible. liquid karma increases nutrient uptake and leads to the biggest god damn foliage you'll ever see, my POG produces fan leaves with 14" blades. pureblend original increases nutrient uptake and provides a slew of things you're not getting from a full-synth base and dramatically increases flavors, smells, textures, and visual appeal when added to your low-EC mineral nute mix. aquashield provides composted poultry litter enzymatic root breakdown along with root zone protection from a handful of bacillus strains. ZHO is a killer root zone inoculant devoid of myco species that don't even colonize root zones on annuals, though it's expensive as hell so i use roots oregonism which works just as well. hydroplex 0-10-6 is a basic bloom booster devoid of PGRs that just works, and very well, and also contains a bunch of amino acids and trace minerals. CNS17 and pureblend pro are both powerful and easy to use base nute regimens, and cal-mag+ is pretty much the gold standard of ca/mg/iron/trace element supplements. even the power series with blast-off, and tri-flex have given us outstanding results. "sweet" is bullshit though, i can't recommend that or any sweetener product for hydro.

if you're bent on sterile full synth hydro, i like botanicare cns17/power/triflex lines or dynagro most for base ferts but for a whole line, dutch master is where it's at. they make everything you need for a complete sterile synth formula including a high quality oxidizer (zone) but DON'T FOLLOW THE FUCKING FEED SCHEDULE. on ANYTHING, ever. watch your EC. many lines have feed schedules that top out at 2500-3000uS/cm EC. no indoor cannabis plant needs that much fertilizer, it leads to herb that tastes like hose water and looks like shit. 1500-1900uS/cm peak is as much as you'll ever need to facilitate strong healthy growth of HIGH QUALITY flowers.

you want heavier yields like you get with the illegal and dangerous PGR bloom boosters, without ruining the quality and potency of your flowers and risking your health? there's a safe and natural plant growth regulator that'll help you accomplish that. Triacontanol. it's commonly found in alfalfa meal and beeswax. beeswax seems to be the best source, but failing that an alfalfa tea or soil amendment will provide the benefits. there are several bloom boosters on the market that contain triacontanol, either naturally or synthetically derived, but the best i've seen so far is Resinator from Rock Nutrients. it's the only thing i've found that gives you dramatic results almost overnight. it's a high-K bloom booster to be used in late flower along with beeswax derived triacontanol, citric acid, and a few other things i can't remember. i use botanicare hydroplex for the first half of flower and rock resinator for the second half, 2ml/g hydroplex then 1-2ml/g resinator. trichomes swell up bigger than you've ever seen and become more numerous. big enough you can visually inspect their maturity without a loupe on some strains, i'm not joking. calyxes swell fatter than ever, aromas are more pronounced, yields are better, colors are better, texture is better, potency is better. it does all the things that AN claims to do, but doesn't. they also make a root stimulant product called "supercharge" that works just amazingly and i've seen it save some pretty much trashed grows full of pythium, but i hesitate to recommend it because i don't know what's in it.
Wow man you might be my new best friend! I'm glad you do your research and no exactly what is beneficial and harmful to us and your plants. Like the saying goes in the growing world, "more is not better." with proper canopy management, good training and supplementing the right nutes at the right time, is the key to hard, dense flowers that not my taste amazing but smell amazing as well. I'm going to tune into your grow man. Wanna see what you are capable of ;)
 

BeaverHuntr

Well-Known Member
i don't do what i do for profit, but i don't think there's anything wrong with people that do. nothing morally superior about selling any other product to customers, people should be allowed to profit from work. that said, $50/8th all the way up isn't all that compassionate so i don't think it affords you that label. consider that cannabis is worth considerably less here in CA due to all the competition, and people are still profiting selling pounds of indoor at 2400usd, $150 an oz average. only the best growers with elite strains will take in over 3200/lb(200/oz). rent is at least 2x as much virtually everywhere in CA, and electricity can cost over $.40/kwh here. how much is electricity in phoenix these days? i'm pretty sure i remembered paying anywhere from 6-13 cents per kwh. considerably less. on top of that you have far fewer risks in AZ, the air is dry so pm is virtually nonexistent and cannabis pests are rare. over a decade of growing in phoenix and i've never seen spidermites, root aphids, thrips, powdery mildew, pythium, or botrytis on mine or any of my friends' grows. all you really have to contend with is heat. phoenix is a dream environment for indoor growing in my opinion and the quality we produced out there was totally top shelf every time.

i don't mean to dog anyone so i won't name names, i know AZ produces some fire indoor that can run with anything in CA because i've seen it and done it.. but i've seen the meds from a number of AZ compassion clubs and i've yet to see anything impressive at all. so many of these places have last year or earlier's hot cali commercial strains like blue dream and green crack, and old school dutch shit that just doesn't compare to what we're doing out here in CA, and it's not even good enough to call top shelf out here. the quality of the blue dream i see out there would be worth like 1600 a pack here, it's so totally average. everything i've seen was either harvested way too early, or clearly grown with high-EC straight mineral nutes just going by mfgr's excessive feed charts, or grown with illegal and dangerous PGRs like paclobutrazol, daminozide, and chlormequat chloride (bushmaster, gravity, phosphoload, flower dragon, probably bud factor x and other AN bloom boosters, many others) that totally diminish quality and potency. those rock-hard gravity-fed flowers with tiny little trichomes contain PGRs with potentially carcinogenic breakdown products, the stuff isn't safe medicine. people out there need to get educated about these PGRs and the products that contain them, and start calling out growers that use that shit. if i see it, i'm droppin' the dime to your patients. people deserve to know if their meds are safe or not.

i recommend sticking with the tried and true AZ local badasses Botanicare. their organic amendments for hydro are the secret behind probably the tastiest herb you've had in AZ. synth/organic in hydro is often considered high risk and challenging but botanicare makes a complete line of products for the method that makes things as easy as possible. liquid karma increases nutrient uptake and leads to the biggest god damn foliage you'll ever see, my POG produces fan leaves with 14" blades. pureblend original increases nutrient uptake and provides a slew of things you're not getting from a full-synth base and dramatically increases flavors, smells, textures, and visual appeal when added to your low-EC mineral nute mix. aquashield provides composted poultry litter enzymatic root breakdown along with root zone protection from a handful of bacillus strains. ZHO is a killer root zone inoculant devoid of myco species that don't even colonize root zones on annuals, though it's expensive as hell so i use roots oregonism which works just as well. hydroplex 0-10-6 is a basic bloom booster devoid of PGRs that just works, and very well, and also contains a bunch of amino acids and trace minerals. CNS17 and pureblend pro are both powerful and easy to use base nute regimens, and cal-mag+ is pretty much the gold standard of ca/mg/iron/trace element supplements. even the power series with blast-off, and tri-flex have given us outstanding results. "sweet" is bullshit though, i can't recommend that or any sweetener product for hydro.

if you're bent on sterile full synth hydro, i like botanicare cns17/power/triflex lines or dynagro most for base ferts but for a whole line, dutch master is where it's at. they make everything you need for a complete sterile synth formula including a high quality oxidizer (zone) but DON'T FOLLOW THE FUCKING FEED SCHEDULE. on ANYTHING, ever. watch your EC. many lines have feed schedules that top out at 2500-3000uS/cm EC. no indoor cannabis plant needs that much fertilizer, it leads to herb that tastes like hose water and looks like shit. 1500-1900uS/cm peak is as much as you'll ever need to facilitate strong healthy growth of HIGH QUALITY flowers.

you want heavier yields like you get with the illegal and dangerous PGR bloom boosters, without ruining the quality and potency of your flowers and risking your health? there's a safe and natural plant growth regulator that'll help you accomplish that. Triacontanol. it's commonly found in alfalfa meal and beeswax. beeswax seems to be the best source, but failing that an alfalfa tea or soil amendment will provide the benefits. there are several bloom boosters on the market that contain triacontanol, either naturally or synthetically derived, but the best i've seen so far is Resinator from Rock Nutrients. it's the only thing i've found that gives you dramatic results almost overnight. it's a high-K bloom booster to be used in late flower along with beeswax derived triacontanol, citric acid, and a few other things i can't remember. i use botanicare hydroplex for the first half of flower and rock resinator for the second half, 2ml/g hydroplex then 1-2ml/g resinator. trichomes swell up bigger than you've ever seen and become more numerous. big enough you can visually inspect their maturity without a loupe on some strains, i'm not joking. calyxes swell fatter than ever, aromas are more pronounced, yields are better, colors are better, texture is better, potency is better. it does all the things that AN claims to do, but doesn't. they also make a root stimulant product called "supercharge" that works just amazingly and i've seen it save some pretty much trashed grows full of pythium, but i hesitate to recommend it because i don't know what's in it.

Fuck yeah I precharge my coco with Liquid Karma! just look at my pics foliage galore!
 

BeaverHuntr

Well-Known Member
Switch to Pure Coco Coir... runs like hydro!
Dude Fire you should check out the Canna coco coir its more your style, I know you told me you use the bricks but give a go with a bag of Canna Coir the only stores that sell any Canna stuff are Home Grown Hydro... Im thinking about giving it a go next round maybe do a 50/50 mix of coco chips / coco coir.
 

phxfire

New Member
Dude Fire you should check out the Canna coco coir its more your style, I know you told me you use the bricks but give a go with a bag of Canna Coir the only stores that sell any Canna stuff are Home Grown Hydro... Im thinking about giving it a go next round maybe do a 50/50 mix of coco chips / coco coir.
I had a bad experience with Bagged coco... Plus they add calcium in the bagged coco!!! Most not all!

Recently bought 2 suitcase size bricks... Add 6 gallons of water and Fills up (1) 18 gallon tub!!!

I would not use coco chips unless you are running 5 gallon pots or bigger... Coco coir is best alone if packed Extremely tight... Tighter than a frogs.....
 

irieie

Well-Known Member
i don't do what i do for profit, but i don't think there's anything wrong with people that do. nothing morally superior about selling any other product to customers, people should be allowed to profit from work. that said, $50/8th all the way up isn't all that compassionate so i don't think it affords you that label. consider that cannabis is worth considerably less here in CA due to all the competition, and people are still profiting selling pounds of indoor at 2400usd, $150 an oz average. only the best growers with elite strains will take in over 3200/lb(200/oz). rent is at least 2x as much virtually everywhere in CA, and electricity can cost over $.40/kwh here. how much is electricity in phoenix these days? i'm pretty sure i remembered paying anywhere from 6-13 cents per kwh. considerably less. on top of that you have far fewer risks in AZ, the air is dry so pm is virtually nonexistent and cannabis pests are rare. over a decade of growing in phoenix and i've never seen spidermites, root aphids, thrips, powdery mildew, pythium, or botrytis on mine or any of my friends' grows. all you really have to contend with is heat. phoenix is a dream environment for indoor growing in my opinion and the quality we produced out there was totally top shelf every time.

i don't mean to dog anyone so i won't name names, i know AZ produces some fire indoor that can run with anything in CA because i've seen it and done it.. but i've seen the meds from a number of AZ compassion clubs and i've yet to see anything impressive at all. so many of these places have last year or earlier's hot cali commercial strains like blue dream and green crack, and old school dutch shit that just doesn't compare to what we're doing out here in CA, and it's not even good enough to call top shelf out here. the quality of the blue dream i see out there would be worth like 1600 a pack here, it's so totally average. everything i've seen was either harvested way too early, or clearly grown with high-EC straight mineral nutes just going by mfgr's excessive feed charts, or grown with illegal and dangerous PGRs like paclobutrazol, daminozide, and chlormequat chloride (bushmaster, gravity, phosphoload, flower dragon, probably bud factor x and other AN bloom boosters, many others) that totally diminish quality and potency. those rock-hard gravity-fed flowers with tiny little trichomes contain PGRs with potentially carcinogenic breakdown products, the stuff isn't safe medicine. people out there need to get educated about these PGRs and the products that contain them, and start calling out growers that use that shit. if i see it, i'm droppin' the dime to your patients. people deserve to know if their meds are safe or not.

i recommend sticking with the tried and true AZ local badasses Botanicare. their organic amendments for hydro are the secret behind probably the tastiest herb you've had in AZ. synth/organic in hydro is often considered high risk and challenging but botanicare makes a complete line of products for the method that makes things as easy as possible. liquid karma increases nutrient uptake and leads to the biggest god damn foliage you'll ever see, my POG produces fan leaves with 14" blades. pureblend original increases nutrient uptake and provides a slew of things you're not getting from a full-synth base and dramatically increases flavors, smells, textures, and visual appeal when added to your low-EC mineral nute mix. aquashield provides composted poultry litter enzymatic root breakdown along with root zone protection from a handful of bacillus strains. ZHO is a killer root zone inoculant devoid of myco species that don't even colonize root zones on annuals, though it's expensive as hell so i use roots oregonism which works just as well. hydroplex 0-10-6 is a basic bloom booster devoid of PGRs that just works, and very well, and also contains a bunch of amino acids and trace minerals. CNS17 and pureblend pro are both powerful and easy to use base nute regimens, and cal-mag+ is pretty much the gold standard of ca/mg/iron/trace element supplements. even the power series with blast-off, and tri-flex have given us outstanding results. "sweet" is bullshit though, i can't recommend that or any sweetener product for hydro.

if you're bent on sterile full synth hydro, i like botanicare cns17/power/triflex lines or dynagro most for base ferts but for a whole line, dutch master is where it's at. they make everything you need for a complete sterile synth formula including a high quality oxidizer (zone) but DON'T FOLLOW THE FUCKING FEED SCHEDULE. on ANYTHING, ever. watch your EC. many lines have feed schedules that top out at 2500-3000uS/cm EC. no indoor cannabis plant needs that much fertilizer, it leads to herb that tastes like hose water and looks like shit. 1500-1900uS/cm peak is as much as you'll ever need to facilitate strong healthy growth of HIGH QUALITY flowers.

you want heavier yields like you get with the illegal and dangerous PGR bloom boosters, without ruining the quality and potency of your flowers and risking your health? there's a safe and natural plant growth regulator that'll help you accomplish that. Triacontanol. it's commonly found in alfalfa meal and beeswax. beeswax seems to be the best source, but failing that an alfalfa tea or soil amendment will provide the benefits. there are several bloom boosters on the market that contain triacontanol, either naturally or synthetically derived, but the best i've seen so far is Resinator from Rock Nutrients. it's the only thing i've found that gives you dramatic results almost overnight. it's a high-K bloom booster to be used in late flower along with beeswax derived triacontanol, citric acid, and a few other things i can't remember. i use botanicare hydroplex for the first half of flower and rock resinator for the second half, 2ml/g hydroplex then 1-2ml/g resinator. trichomes swell up bigger than you've ever seen and become more numerous. big enough you can visually inspect their maturity without a loupe on some strains, i'm not joking. calyxes swell fatter than ever, aromas are more pronounced, yields are better, colors are better, texture is better, potency is better. it does all the things that AN claims to do, but doesn't. they also make a root stimulant product called "supercharge" that works just amazingly and i've seen it save some pretty much trashed grows full of pythium, but i hesitate to recommend it because i don't know what's in it.
if only growers like you would stay in AZ.
 

Bird Gymnastics

New Member
For soil growers, well where do I start...I've tried some different methods lately, using sythetic nutrients in a live organic soil medium, organic bottle nutrients with organic soil and then like subcool's super soil- premixing nutrients like guanos, EWC, dolomite lime etc... Al, of them have their benefits and I think using mostly organic or all organic is by far the best way to go. I believe all of the bud that taste/smells so amazing has to have some sort of organics mixed in somewhere. Anyways, my research has not been completed. I am still in search of the perfect regiment to the best bud possible (I'm very, very picky.) I have even been known to throw out (this was before I made bubble) whole plants because if being disappointed by how it turned out and how much time I spent with it. My patients, friends and even enemies/haters have always liked my buds but sometimes I am hard to please.

With that being said, IMO, organics is the way to go. In taste, potency, looks, smell, and all around dankiness! (all my opinion, arguments can come later) so far I like starting with Roots organic, mix in about 10-20% vermiculite (perlite is good too but under a microscope the living organisms in my medium cannot amend to perlite) , some Dolomite lime, 20-30% EWC, some alfalfa meal and depending on strain some fish bone meal. I then like to add some bottled nutrients as needed. I know most people don't like advanced nutrients and to be honest I dislike the company and the people that represent them, but whoever does the research and takes the time to mix up the nutrients really do know what they are doing. I have used roots organic nutes, botanicare organic line, earth juice, and GO, but it seems they don't stack up to the Iguana Juice by advanced nutes. It's a little pricy but has work wonders FOR ME. I will add iguana juice, bud candy and/or black strap molasses, cal mag and hygrozyme. I also brew up some tea in flower that is just a mix of EWC + molasses and I let an airstone bubble the water for at least 24 hours. I top feed with these until I see run off, about every other day. As PHX said, ZHO is amazing and I get samples of it all the time so have never seen had to buy it. On top of using ZHO, I also use mayan microzyme to help my roots. IMO having a strong root base is KEY to growing top shelf bud. Without strong roots they aren't able to uptake as much nutrients this resulting in not fully potential medicine.


Right now for my next couple runs I am going to try making my own soil. Using coco coir, peatmoss, EWC, and a few others. I recently bought the Canna Veganic line as I've heard amazing things as far as taste and potency goes. I want to mix my own soil so I can run a fully veganic grow (roots has blood meal and guanos so it won't work). That stuff was probably the most I've ever spent on nutrients Period. But we will see how much more worth it is vs cheaper, just as effective nutrients. I'm pretty medicated right now and am probably forgetting a ton of things. If you have any questions about anything just ask or even PM me. I don't consider myself a pro at any means, and take what I tell you with a grain a salt. This is what works FOR ME, everyone is different but my qwest will still continue. And once i do find out what I feel is the best, I'll be more then happy to share. As I could care less if I grow better then other growers, all I care about is the quality of bud in our streets and in our medical facilites. Hell if more people grew dank, there would be less cranky people IMO. And in top of that it would bring prices way down...
 

BeaverHuntr

Well-Known Member
Damn you guys know a lot of shit especially at your age. I'm a pretty smart dude but I'm impressed when I read some of the things you guys know Fuckin' A it's impressive.
 

irieie

Well-Known Member
sound like you do similar things to me Bird. i read as much as i can but the true learning comes from actually growing. i have found that i cant get the same yields with organics which is a major driving factor for me. the regiment i have currently working for me is a 45% coco, 35% ffof, and 20% perlite with a bit of dolomite lime mixed in. in veg i feed primarily organics using alaska fish emulsion as a base. i usually brew it with some benies and mollasses as well as a bit of cal mag. i also supplement with silica ( heavier in flower than veg) and also liquid karma. in flower i use gh and some other amendments. imo sometimes 100% organic can taste better but this is not enough of a trade off in yield and convenience for me. implementing an organic system indoors can be a pain without the use of bottled nutes and i have yet to find a premade organic line that beats the GH lucas formula. to me organics means developing the soil food web with benies and fungi and nutrient rich teas for them to eat and then the plant eats their shit, but to be labeled organic means that it is carbon based or came from a living organism at one point, it does not necessarily mean an organic system though.
 
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