Stunded growth

Meshuggah

Member
Setup - Closet grow with I'm growing one WWhidow, for about over a month now, it's still around 3-4 inches. I'm using miracle grow premium potting soil 0.14 - 0.14 - 0.14 with a ph of 6.5. I'm using for now dasani reverse osmosis water which I've been told has a ph of around 7(Bought distilled but haven't used it yet). 3_15w equivalent cfls ~4,500k and 3_65 watt ~6,500k.

Symptoms - It has stopped growing after the second node. It's leaves are curled down, it has a fragile stem, it also looks very white to me (the stem). the tips of the leaves are yellow and the first node leaves have died. (the first real leaves not the seedling ones).

I thought at first that ph might of been the problem so i added vinigar to the water, might have put too much, because the plant became very droopy from then on. And it gets very hot in the house.
Any suggestions?
 

backwoodsburner

Active Member
water your plants more... dont use vinager. miracle grow products kill marijuana plants from my experence. your whole grow is basically fucked, better luck next time...
 

Corbat420

Well-Known Member
#1 its too hot. it should be 27 C (80 F)
#2 it needs more light (thats why its white and not green.)
#3 you need to feed them after the second node/second week.
#4 use tap water. distilled water is for hydro grows, and reverse osmosis water is for hard water. if your worried about chlorine just put the water in a bucket for 24 hours before you water your plants. its a good thing to do in general since the water should be the exact same temperature as the soil so there is no difference in temps when you water the plant.......
 

Corbat420

Well-Known Member
acidic soil due to vinager will cause lockout...
actualy nutrient lockout is caused by a build-up if nutrients in the soil causing the PH to change durasticly. a spiked PH will lower the uptake of nutrients, but that alone wont cause a full on lockout.

View attachment 1679071

the vinigar was a stupid idea, but all you have to do is flush it twice with PH 6.5 nutrient soloution to flush and reconstitute the soil. the MAIN problems lie in my first post and the fact that he has to learn to use fertalizers.
 

Meshuggah

Member
So I'ts big enough to start nutes? If so how much should I mix in my water? Is molasses a good investement? I used it on a previous outdoor grow.
 

Corbat420

Well-Known Member
more light.
it needs a fan.
water it PROPERLY. ONLY when its dry. wait untill its totaly dry..... to dry is MUCH better than to wet.....
you should have started feeding it 1 week after it sprouted.

mollasis is used to feed soil microbes indoors. the carbohydrates are better gotten from good nutrients..... follow the directions on the bottle, mix 50% for the first watering and work your way on up from there.

Edit: dont support it with that stick :facepalm: you should let it fall over and pick its self up it makes for a strong stem and doesnt exactly damage the plant.....
 

Vindicated

Well-Known Member
I'd skip the molasses for right now. You can play with it when you got the basics down. I love how your recycling your containers. I do agree with Corbat though in that you made a few mistakes (but that's ok, that's how we learn), you need improve your lighting, and fertilizers. I'll go a step further and suggest how I would do it on a tight budget...

Containers - I start off my seeds in a #6 nursery pot, which holds 1 quart of medium. They'll run you about $5-$6 each. If you want stick with recycling, you can use 2 liter soda bottles. If you save the top part after cutting it, you can even use it for your cuttings (clones). Here's a good site on making a soda bottle terrarium: http://www.stormthecastle.com/terrarium/soda-bottle-terrarium.htm , the only change I would do is to add holes to the bottom since in our case we're more interested in using the bottles as containers.

Growing mediums - There are basically two types, soil and soilless. Soil is made up of sand, silt, and clay. Soilless mediums includes peat moss, bark, wood chips, coir, stylophone, perlite, etc. Basically anything not sand, silt, or clay. Miracle Grow uses peat moss, because very abundant, it's organic, it holds water and nutrients well, while also having lots of air spaces, giving roots plenty of oxygen. For years this was the best stuff to get and to this day many gardeners add peat moss to their soil if it contains to much sand to aid in water retention. Now people are slowly switching to Coir because of environmental reasons, but it's water holding abilities is not as good as peat moss, and it's a little more expensive, but it's less acidic, and very renewable.

Roots organic and fox farm use a mix of peat moss and coir and a bunch of different types of manures. Miracle Grow doesn't say what kind of manure they use, but I'd guess it's poultry since it runs a little hot and poultry is cheap and widely available in the US. There is nothing wrong with MG using peat moss and poultry (it's really good stuff!), it's just nice to know what's in your medium so you can better understand what your working with. When you shop for soils, ignore the brands and pay attention to the ingredients. If it has coir or exotic fertilizers like bat guano it's going to be more pricey. Is it worth paying more for coir and fancy poop? It all depends and what your looking to get out of it. I personally don't think so, but it's a hot issue and many intelligent people will disagree with me.

Fertilizers - First you have organic and chemical then you have Vegetative and Flower fertilizers. Organic has been used since the Earth was created. Chemicals are stronger, more concentrated and pure, but can cause environmental problems and they are more likely to burn your plants.

Since your just getting started and your already using an organic medium, I would suggest you start out using Worm Castings (1-0-0) for vegetative growth. As soon as you see yellowing leaves you can foiler spray using liquid worm casting. Its very safe and very good for your plants. I've added it to my seed starting mixes and both my cuttings and seedlings love it. Just feed no more then once a week if using liquid or use less then 10% when mixing it into your soil if using dry powder.

Another option for vegetative growth I'd highly recommend is fish emulations (5-1-1). Notice that higher first number, that's the nitrogen and because it's higher it's more likely to burn so you need to be a little more careful, but it's really good stuff. Another benefit of fish emulsions is that it's cheaper and more readily available. Most Home Depots and Lowes carry a brand called Alaska's Fish Emulsions for $6 a bottle. Worm castings is a little harder to find, but will usually run you $13-$16 for a bag. $5 if you can find a bottle, but it won't last as long as the Fish Emulsions.

I'm less picky about flowering fertilizers, since by then it should already be pretty healthy and I'm just looking to add Phosphorous and Potassium (potash) which is just mineral rock and ash. Kelloggs makes pretty good stuff and it's available at Lowes and Home Depot.

Water - one of the benefits of using tap and rain water is that they contain lots of trace minerals. Even chlorinated tap water is fine... just take a look at the grass and shrubs in your front lawn. I often hear that to much chlorine can kill the microbes, but you'll be supplying fertilizer anyway so you'll be able to make up for any lost nutrients along the way.

PH - your growing organic, so don't worry to much about this.

Boosters - Don't use them. Not yet anyway. Wait until you've done 2-3 harvests and gone through a few battles with pests and nutrient deficiencies. Once you know your strain you can slowly tweak your nutrients and start adding new things.

Lights - you want around 100 watts per cubic foot. For a closet grow I'd try to aim for at least 300-400 watts if you want to flower indoors. If you only need to veg for a month you can get away with 120-150 watts.

Insecticides - If you want to stay strictly organic look into diatomaceous earth, neem oil, and organic insecticidal soaps. If your not super picky about going organic, water and 2-3 drops of dawn dish soap inside a water bottle works really well. You can even add garlic, pepper, and cinnamon to the mix to make it extra deadly.

Vinegar ... normally used along side baking soda to adjust PH. Again your going organic so you don't need it. It's also commonly used in the garden as a weed killer so I wouldn't go around spraying your plants with it. I love it for sterilizing my grow room though (after I've removed my plants). Spray your grow area with vinegar, then come back with hydrogen peroxide (never mix the two together) and you've got a damn good disinfectant.
 

Corbat420

Well-Known Member
i have to agree completley with everything vindicated says. read everything, especial the parts on PH.

Alaskan Fish Fertalizer (or AFF) is largely praised around here, and for good reason. the only liquid fertalizerz i use are AFF all purpose and AFF morbloom, and i have AMAZING results with them. its almost difficult to add to much of it, VERY forgiving. and its all PH'ed at 6.5.

and the main point i have to emphasize is we learn through making mistakes. m BOMBED my first 3 indoor grows, so dont worry about messing up one or 2 plants. just start off slow to learn the process of how the plant grows, you will learn fast ;)

Edit: recycling containers: starter pots = pop cans (the black helps roots grow, roots hate light) first month of veg = 2 L painted black. flowering = 5 gallon buckets :D its what i started off with untill i had enough of a harvest to upgrade. and i still use 5 gallon buckets.....
 

haz102

Well-Known Member
This exact thing happend to my first grow. It just stopped growing an curled up into some sort of brown mess?! So I chucked it!
 

Meshuggah

Member
Thanks to everyone, you have all been very very helpfull. Also i think i might have enough light because there weas a typinh error, i have 3 150W equivalent (not 15 watt) and 3 65 watt equivalent this should be enough right?
 

Meshuggah

Member
And for flushing, I should flood the pot and let it drain out a few minutes then flood it again, both times with large amounts of water? I put 2 litres of city water out last night to let the chlorine evaporate so this shoud be alright for her?
 

queenster

Active Member
Miracle grow products do not kill marijuana unless used wrong and the soil they put out is very good for growing m.j or anyother veggi's as well.
water your plants more... dont use vinager. miracle grow products kill marijuana plants from my experence. your whole grow is basically fucked, better luck next time...
 
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