Solving this issue/ What do you think? (Pictures Included)

in a 20 gal. pot you need to be watering a lot more than 2 cups. saturate them--but do it slowly.

the way I learned was to feel the weight of the container before it was watered at all, then water it until you get a good amount of runoff. you don't really need to water again until it feels as light as it did at the beginning.

if you want to set your fabric pots on a reservoir full of perlite or grow stones and keep that reservoir full of water, they'll always be able to take a drink and the microbiota will always be able to thrive. check out the phogs threads if you're interested in that kind of setup.

keep giving foliars, mix up an aloe juice foliar, and a kelp tea foliar and you'll be fine.

finally, consider giving them some light rest--18/6 is worth it for plant health.

after this grow, look into Sprouted Seed Teas, fermented plant extracts, and some way to get lactobacilli in your garden (em-1, bokashi, rye kvass, whatever, just enlist them in the support of your girls).

be easy,

jcurtis912 said:

Brah, listen. Coming from years of experience at this point; it isnt bad, leave it alone. Your doing just fine. All my lower leaves show some sort of damage over the course of a grow. The main thing that plant is suffering from is too much attention and love from you. You been looking at 420 Mag too much with these picture perfect plants.

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Lol thanks that makes me feel better.

RealGeezalio93 said:

Lol thanks that makes me feel better.

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Hey I see your in Cali like me. Let me ask you, do you have a worm bin?

Dr.J20 said:

in a 20 gal. pot you need to be watering a lot more than 2 cups. saturate them--but do it slowly.

the way I learned was to feel the weight of the container before it was watered at all, then water it until you get a good amount of runoff. you don't really need to water again until it feels as light as it did at the beginning.

if you want to set your fabric pots on a reservoir full of perlite or grow stones and keep that reservoir full of water, they'll always be able to take a drink and the microbiota will always be able to thrive. check out the phogs threads if you're interested in that kind of setup.

keep giving foliars, mix up an aloe juice foliar, and a kelp tea foliar and you'll be fine.

finally, consider giving them some light rest--18/6 is worth it for plant health.

after this grow, look into Sprouted Seed Teas, fermented plant extracts, and some way to get lactobacilli in your garden (em-1, bokashi, rye kvass, whatever, just enlist them in the support of your girls).

be easy,

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Hey, can you speak more on that Bokashi thing? Ive only lightly looked into it. I grow only organic so I think it may be beneficial for my grow.

2 cups of water for 20 gallons of soil is not enough water. There has to be dry pockets in your soil.

Also how long did you let the soil cook?

Are you using any sort of microbe’s? A little microbial life in your soil could go a long way towards uptaking Nutes and keeping your PH in range.

Tlarss said:

2 cups of water for 20 gallons of soil is not enough water. There has to be dry pockets in your soil.

Also how long did you let the soil cook?

Are you using any sort of microbe’s? A little microbial life in your soil could go a long way towards uptaking Nutes and keeping your PH in range.

Click to expand...

Yeah, you see, watering perfectly, on a set schedule isnt the way to to go. You need to use your senses. Look at the droop of the leaves, lift the pot, put your fingers in the soil. Dont be afraid to let it dry a bit. But when water, give it a good drink. When my plants are in smaller pots in the veg stage, i soak them in the sink over night with a bit of water at the bottom of the sink. For the next few days i got growth spurt, and the leaves are praying. Then let it dry again, repeat. In between i top dress with my homemade worm castings, and some alfalfa meal. Maybe I throw in a litle bit of kelp. Never had a plant not like it. I am growing in turpur with a bit of ocean forest, homemade castings, and dry amendments.

Last time i watered was last week and today I watered again.

1 gallon water ph 6.4
with 5ml of cal mag.




I'm thinking of feeding my plants nutrients. any recomendations on which 1s?


I was thinking going with the FloraGro, FloraBloom, FloraMicro set cause I seen Renfo using it lol

jcurtis912 said:

Hey I see your in Cali like me. Let me ask you, do you have a worm bin?

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Are you in So or Nor cali?

Nah I don't have a bin. not even sure about them.

Tlarss said:

2 cups of water for 20 gallons of soil is not enough water. There has to be dry pockets in your soil.

Also how long did you let the soil cook?

Are you using any sort of microbe’s? A little microbial life in your soil could go a long way towards uptaking Nutes and keeping your PH in range.

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Forsure. I def. have been watering it more.

last 2 waterings I did a gallon each. and i think the last 2 before that was half gal. in each.



it cooked for about 60 days. no more than 70 days forsure.



i 'googled' microbial, and looked around for hydro products that contain that but didnt find any really relaiable. Im currently not feeding it any nutes beide that last 2 waterings i did a cal mag dosage.



btw whats nutes u recommend i feed em?

Look into earth worm casting teas with some kelp.

Or to keep it easier there’s a product called recharge that is really good.

Mammoth P also..expensive though and used mostly during flower.

What kind of soil are u in?

Tlarss said:

What kind of soil are u in?

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subcool mix using original Roots Organic soil

I’d top dress with some earthworm castings and kelp meal. Considering you are in an organic ‘super soil’ you shouldn’t need bottled Nutes.

Continue on with your improved watering schedule and drop your light. 3 feet is way to far away for a 600 watt hps.

jcurtis912 said:

Hey, can you speak more on that Bokashi thing? Ive only lightly looked into it. I grow only organic so I think it may be beneficial for my grow.

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I use kvass to get lactobacilli in the mix. Bokashi is another way, and you can also buy em-1 mixes in most grow shops. Plenty of threads on bokashi; check out hyroot's work, i think he keeps a bokashi bucket going.

@RealGeezalio93 you really shouldn't need extra nutrients if you mixed up subcool's supersoil; i think its easy to think its a nutrient issue whenever you see something abnormal going on when you're getting started with this, but it looks more like overabundance and lockout/burn issues to me, especially the dark green and mottling on some of those upper fan leaves. Keep you're watering according to plant needs--fully saturate them. I dig water conservation and all, but you're plants need more than a gallon in a 20 gallon pot. you need all of the soil saturated at least, usually with a 10-15% runoff at least once in a while. Consider using a catchtray with the fabric pots to conserve water.

You shouldn't need to worry terribly much with pH as long as your microbial life is balanced. read "teaming with microbes" (and the rest of the Lowenfels and Lewis collaborations in the series) if you want to get a better understanding of soil food web gardening. try to find as many threads on AACT (actively aerated compost tea), SST (sprouted seed tea), and FPE (fermented plant extract) as you can. Buy some freeze dried 200x Aloe powder and learn how to use it as a soil drench and foliar, especially during vegetative growth. buy some good organic kelp meal and make buildasoil.com 's kelp tea, feed that weekly throughout the life of your plants.

I'll agree that sub's soil recipe is pretty fucking hot for most folks and most genetics; consider digging up clackamas coot's or the three little birds' recipes (3LB).

I prefer coco coir to peat--the former is also currently more sustainable than the latter.

earthworm compost (vermipost) is your best friend. Top dress it, make AACT with it, use it as the primary compost source in your soil mixes. fresh vermipost is by far the best; to get it fresh you gotta farm your own which means a worm bin. This will shift you're lifestyle so that you find yourself eating more veggies so that there are veggie leftovers to feed your worms; you start drinking more coffee at home because coffee grounds are a great source of nitrogen, after the worms eat 'em and poop 'em out.

these are just my thoughts, things I think I've learned. Oh yeah, also, blackstrap molasses is another friend for AACT and kvass, buy a bottle and it'll last 3-5 grows with 3-7 plants.

EDIT: Also, read a horticulture textbook or check out some regular gardening forums and stuff. she's a plant like all the others and the more you know and understand about plants in general, the better off you'll be with this plant.

P.S. I know it can be frustrating to get advice that directs you to more reading and learning. I know it feels like you just want to know about this one thing right now, or these plants right here. I used to hate this kind of advice but the folks giving it were just trying to help me without robbing me of the joy of exploration and finding my own way forward. you can cultivate plants exactly to the tastes and experiences that you want to have if you get good enough at working with the plant, helping her to help you.


good luck, have fun, and be easy,



Dr. J

Dr.J20 said:

I use kvass to get lactobacilli in the mix. Bokashi is another way, and you can also buy em-1 mixes in most grow shops. Plenty of threads on bokashi; check out hyroot's work, i think he keeps a bokashi bucket going.

@RealGeezalio93 you really shouldn't need extra nutrients if you mixed up subcool's supersoil; i think its easy to think its a nutrient issue whenever you see something abnormal going on when you're getting started with this, but it looks more like overabundance and lockout/burn issues to me, especially the dark green and mottling on some of those upper fan leaves. Keep you're watering according to plant needs--fully saturate them. I dig water conservation and all, but you're plants need more than a gallon in a 20 gallon pot. you need all of the soil saturated at least, usually with a 10-15% runoff at least once in a while. Consider using a catchtray with the fabric pots to conserve water.

You shouldn't need to worry terribly much with pH as long as your microbial life is balanced. read "teaming with microbes" (and the rest of the Lowenfels and Lewis collaborations in the series) if you want to get a better understanding of soil food web gardening. try to find as many threads on AACT (actively aerated compost tea), SST (sprouted seed tea), and FPE (fermented plant extract) as you can. Buy some freeze dried 200x Aloe powder and learn how to use it as a soil drench and foliar, especially during vegetative growth. buy some good organic kelp meal and make buildasoil.com 's kelp tea, feed that weekly throughout the life of your plants.

I'll agree that sub's soil recipe is pretty fucking hot for most folks and most genetics; consider digging up clackamas coot's or the three little birds' recipes (3LB).

I prefer coco coir to peat--the former is also currently more sustainable than the latter.

earthworm compost (vermipost) is your best friend. Top dress it, make AACT with it, use it as the primary compost source in your soil mixes. fresh vermipost is by far the best; to get it fresh you gotta farm your own which means a worm bin. This will shift you're lifestyle so that you find yourself eating more veggies so that there are veggie leftovers to feed your worms; you start drinking more coffee at home because coffee grounds are a great source of nitrogen, after the worms eat 'em and poop 'em out.

these are just my thoughts, things I think I've learned. Oh yeah, also, blackstrap molasses is another friend for AACT and kvass, buy a bottle and it'll last 3-5 grows with 3-7 plants.

EDIT: Also, read a horticulture textbook or check out some regular gardening forums and stuff. she's a plant like all the others and the more you know and understand about plants in general, the better off you'll be with this plant.

P.S. I know it can be frustrating to get advice that directs you to more reading and learning. I know it feels like you just want to know about this one thing right now, or these plants right here. I used to hate this kind of advice but the folks giving it were just trying to help me without robbing me of the joy of exploration and finding my own way forward. you can cultivate plants exactly to the tastes and experiences that you want to have if you get good enough at working with the plant, helping her to help you.


good luck, have fun, and be easy,



Dr. J

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Hey Dr. J , thank you for all the valuable words! I'm definetly looking into each of these you mentioned. Wish there was more then a 'like' button.

I'm getting trays for them this weekend! idk why i havn't already.
the water that collects after watering is relaible for me to test its PH and see the run off ? (or is that pointless?? )

"Teaming with Microbes" by Jeff Lowenfels right, I ordered it off amazon


I'm going to dive into AACT, SST, FPE but just so I can have a clear mind goin in, will I have to pick 1 of the 3 methods or will I be better off top applying all 3? Also about the worm bin.. I seen the bins are around $75, plus the matinance and not to mention looking for a ton of worms, do you feel its worth doing that versus just buying a good bag of some from your local shop?


I heard about aloe being used to get sticker buds, but it sounded like a myth since aloe is sticky itself lol. How do you feel it helps?


I apprechiate the help/recomendations forreal.
EArlier this year we where told that my mom diagnosed with cancer, and I been told by a dr. that I'm "pre-diabetic",
most recently with me taking care of my plants daily, she noticed and we've talked about starting a grow in the backyard.

I have a prune thats about 2 months in the back yard and a limon & peach tree we planted last year but I havn't started with anything else. Plan on having potatoes, tomatoes, carrots, garlic, and whatever else we can.
These sources sound like they'll be good for all that stuff too.

goodlookin

Tlarss said:

I’d top dress with some earthworm castings and kelp meal. Considering you are in an organic ‘super soil’ you shouldn’t need bottled Nutes.

Continue on with your improved watering schedule and drop your light. 3 feet is way to far away for a 600 watt hps.

Click to expand...

for the teas, I'll need to brew it right? what you use to brew?

RealGeezalio93 said:

Hey Dr. J , thank you for all the valuable words! I'm definetly looking into each of these you mentioned. Wish there was more then a 'like' button.

I'm getting trays for them this weekend! idk why i havn't already.
the water that collects after watering is relaible for me to test its PH and see the run off ? (or is that pointless?? )

Click to expand...

Its not something I do, but it isn't pointless. I just got tired of using the meter when I'm not using a method where that degree of precision is necessary. If I were in a hydro setup I'd have constant monitoring up. I'm thinking about soil probes that constantly monitor just for building datasets for specific strains, but its really the pH at the root zone that you care about. if that all makes sense.

RealGeezalio93 said:

"Teaming with Microbes" by Jeff Lowenfels right, I ordered it off amazon

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good on you! you'll dig it and it helps give a broader sense of what's going on below the surface of the soil.

RealGeezalio93 said:

I'm going to dive into AACT, SST, FPE but just so I can have a clear mind goin in, will I have to pick 1 of the 3 methods or will I be better off top applying all 3?

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Nope, they work in tandem and you don't have to use all three either. these are just ways of helping you get inputs to your plant using the natural systems already in place, rather than forcing it down your plants throats (so to speak) with salt based chemical ferts. I started with AACT because it has the most stuff to build and is the most active labor intensive of the three, but FPE and SST are more 'patience' oriented (they take more sitting, waiting, and watching).

RealGeezalio93 said:

Also about the worm bin.. I seen the bins are around $75, plus the matinance and not to mention looking for a ton of worms, do you feel its worth doing that versus just buying a good bag of some from your local shop?

Click to expand...

Whatever you've heard about worm bins is making them sound a lot of work! They aren't really. You can find super cheap builds online to make one for like 10 bucks--two totes with some holes drilled in em and a little coco coir at the bottom--boom, you got a worm bin. You don't need a ton of worms, maybe 4,000 (around 50 bucks from uncle jim's worm farm online) to make sure you're processing your veggie scraps at a rate fast enough to use them. Keep the bin outside if you don't like fruit flies in your house! That being said, good quality vermipost from your grow shop is totally good to go, too. take it easy on yourself--don't burn out by trying to do too much all at once, and give yourself enough time with each new skill so that you can really metabolize it and see what tweaks you'll want to make for yourself--everybody does stuff idiosyncratically around here, no matter how rigidly they present themselves.

RealGeezalio93 said:

I heard about aloe being used to get sticker buds, but it sounded like a myth since aloe is sticky itself lol. How do you feel it helps?

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That does sound like hogwash. Aloe isn't for stickier buds in any direct way, and you shouldn't be foliar feeding flowering buds until you're really expert with the sprayer and can mist without getting the buds wet at all. Aloe provides some silica, but its the saponins and surfactant properties that are helpful in the phylosphere/phyloplane. This is a general immune boost for ALL of your plants (my roses love it around this time of year when its wicked hot out), and can help with things like light and heat stress.

RealGeezalio93 said:

I apprechiate the help/recomendations forreal.
EArlier this year we where told that my mom diagnosed with cancer, and I been told by a dr. that I'm "pre-diabetic",
most recently with me taking care of my plants daily, she noticed and we've talked about starting a grow in the backyard.

Click to expand...

I'm terribly sorry to hear about all of this; gardening is therapeutic in itself, but when you're growing medicine for your family it adds another layer of goodness to the practice. My good vibes, thoughts, and prayers are with you all.

RealGeezalio93 said:

I have a prune thats about 2 months in the back yard and a limon & peach tree we planted last year but I havn't started with anything else. Plan on having potatoes, tomatoes, carrots, garlic, and whatever else we can.
These sources sound like they'll be good for all that stuff too.

goodlookin

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Absolutely all of this stuff scales to perennials, trees, shrubs--just have to read up and figure out what works for your soil. Potatoes and tomatoes are awesome, they just want to grow, but make sure you watch for potato beetles and hornworms! check out companion planting and cover cropping if you're going to have a year-round operation underway! Best of luck and hit me up if I can help out with anything!

be easy,

RealGeezalio93 said:

for the teas, I'll need to brew it right? what you use to brew?

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Yeah you'll have to brew it; for AACT, 24-36 hours is optimal for annuals like cannabis. you can read up on it at microbeorganics.com basically all you need is an air pump, some air stones, air tubing and a 5 gallon bucket. Get the biggest pump you can possibly afford--dissolved oxygen is the biggest limiting factor and you don't want there to be oxygen dead zones in your brew. Some folks swear by vortex brewers which are a bit more intensive to make but I've always had plenty good results with a pump and airstone setup. gardening with microbes is also a good place to read up on AACT. seriously, though, biggest pump you can possibly afford--i saw a 1000gallon per hour (gph) pump for like 40 bucks on Amazon the other day, so poking around locally or on the internet should be enough to get what you need.

I do bubble the seeds until they sprout with SST, but once they sprout, I just chop em up in a blender with the water they were bubbled in and add it to a bucket of water to dilute and use immediately. FPE is a fermenting process that uses anaerobic lactobacilli processing so adding air would be counterproductive; so FPE isn't 'brewed' with air, but we could think of it as a kind of 'brew'. I just add plants that I want to extract to my kvass after it has produced sufficient lactobacilli (about 3 days of fermenting). So if I want a comfrey FPE i just add chopped up comfrey to some 3 day old kvass and let it go another 3 days, boom, comfrey FPE.

hope this helps!

be easy,

Unless you sprayed with neem oil it looks like nitrogen toxic. Dark green, glossy leaves.
Hope things get better with your grow!
Cheers

Bourbon 2 said:

Unless you sprayed with neem oil it looks like nitrogen toxic. Dark green, glossy leaves.
Hope things get better with your grow!
Cheers

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yeah, I did spray some neem.