Outdoor SIPs
- Thread starter Humanrob
- Start date
Rocket Soul
Well-Known Member
Im sorry about your hands mate, i hope you feel better soon. Cortisones a bitch
Your plants are pretty huge! With sips might be that the season is too long, too much time in long days vegging for the nutes in the soil to last. Ive been looking at some nice autogrows lately, you could probably do several runs in a summer. And for me i wouldnt be able to fit that kind of plant on my terrace. Maybe vegging inside and finishing of flowering outside would be my choice. Half and half i could maybe even do 4 runs a season, here we got decent weather up to almost october if lucky. Also autos and sips seems like a nice combo, limited cycletime to avoid finishing the nutrients but sips to make em grow bigger.
As for your nute probs dont know, mj noob only garden nerd. Now back from holidays,lets see if my housesitters have kept my garden alive... Fearing the worst
Your plants are pretty huge! With sips might be that the season is too long, too much time in long days vegging for the nutes in the soil to last. Ive been looking at some nice autogrows lately, you could probably do several runs in a summer. And for me i wouldnt be able to fit that kind of plant on my terrace. Maybe vegging inside and finishing of flowering outside would be my choice. Half and half i could maybe even do 4 runs a season, here we got decent weather up to almost october if lucky. Also autos and sips seems like a nice combo, limited cycletime to avoid finishing the nutrients but sips to make em grow bigger.
As for your nute probs dont know, mj noob only garden nerd. Now back from holidays,lets see if my housesitters have kept my garden alive... Fearing the worst
Humanrob
Well-Known Member
Thanks bro, hope your garden is OK. I've had cortisone shots before, but I forgot about how long I have to wait to fully use my hands... going to be a slow few weeks.
The two in the 5 gallon have gotten bigger than they should. Funny how 5 gallon is ample inside, but outside its just not enough dirt. I'm sort of trying to treat it like they are in coco, imagining the dirt is now inert medium and I need to feed the plants. I'm still trying to keep the nutes in the dirt, I really don't want to get into testing the water, I've never actually done hydro before.
Tim Fox
Well-Known Member
I would be really interested in doing an outdoor auto in Oregon, you are so right, it would finish well before the rains come, I would be curious to see how big an auto in a sip outdoor would get,, any idea?
Vnsmkr
Well-Known Member
Full light spectrum and everything else about the outdoor environment effects
Rocket Soul
Well-Known Member
No idea, but theres some pretty good strains out there by now. You can try checking out a grower called tang, does lovely stuff with dutch passion autos. Try googling him: tang dutch passion autoflower, i think he has his grows on autoflowernetwork, but i think hes a member here as well.
Humanrob
Well-Known Member
A couple of updates on the outdoor sips.
As I've mentioned, the two 5 gallons don't have enough soil to carry them, so I need to add nutes pretty regularly. I'm adding dry time release nutes to the top surface, so I need to hit them with water to activate them. Top watering about every other day over the course of a couple of weeks in conjunction with the sip/self-watering, apparently created an environment conducive to gnats, because there was quite an infestation. I have no idea if in an outdoor gnats are really an issue, but having had them in my indoor, I simply hate them and they had to go.
All I had to do was remove the straw I had over the soil, not top feed for a couple of days -- combined with some nice hot dry weather we're having -- and they are all but gone. The next two days will be in the mid-to-high 90's, so after that mini-heat wave I'll start top watering again, but maybe only once a week.
As a side note -- not a SIP -- but for the Jillybean I have in a 20 gallon cloth pot, I'm having really good luck drip feeding from a 2 liter soda bottle. I was having some issues gauging when to water that one, so there's another self watering system that's working for me.
As I've mentioned, the two 5 gallons don't have enough soil to carry them, so I need to add nutes pretty regularly. I'm adding dry time release nutes to the top surface, so I need to hit them with water to activate them. Top watering about every other day over the course of a couple of weeks in conjunction with the sip/self-watering, apparently created an environment conducive to gnats, because there was quite an infestation. I have no idea if in an outdoor gnats are really an issue, but having had them in my indoor, I simply hate them and they had to go.
All I had to do was remove the straw I had over the soil, not top feed for a couple of days -- combined with some nice hot dry weather we're having -- and they are all but gone. The next two days will be in the mid-to-high 90's, so after that mini-heat wave I'll start top watering again, but maybe only once a week.
As a side note -- not a SIP -- but for the Jillybean I have in a 20 gallon cloth pot, I'm having really good luck drip feeding from a 2 liter soda bottle. I was having some issues gauging when to water that one, so there's another self watering system that's working for me.
Humanrob
Well-Known Member
OK, I jumped the gun on that one. The bugs are not gone. They apparently have some times of day when they are inactive(?), and I must have looked then, because they are totally hopping this morning. I put down some DE and I added a yellow sticky card, because I need to catch some and look at them under magnification. If they are fungus gnats, then its probably not a big issue. If they are ROOT APHIDS, that could be a real issue, since its my understanding that they actually harm the plants.
When I had a *really* bad indoor infestation of gnats and aphids, I ended out using Azamax to put an end to it. I'm not sure how that would work in a SIP? Can anyone think of a reason using that would be a bad idea -- as in Azamax leaching its way into the res?
When I had a *really* bad indoor infestation of gnats and aphids, I ended out using Azamax to put an end to it. I'm not sure how that would work in a SIP? Can anyone think of a reason using that would be a bad idea -- as in Azamax leaching its way into the res?
Humanrob
Well-Known Member
This could be why companies like Earthbox -- which advertise their SIPs for growing veggies outdoors -- are pretty adamant in their instructions that the top of the container has to be sealed (they provide a cover that you cut holes in for the plants to grow through). The continuously moist soil and warm weather make for the perfect breeding ground for lots of bugs. I can't put plastic over these -- there is the plant, the fill tube, and the tomato cage all breaking the soils surface -- but future designs will include a cover.
I checked the sticky-bug-card this morning, and it looks to be 100% gnats (no aphids). The DE and dry hot weather has diminished them sufficiently to not be a concern. It is an outdoor grow, after all.
All of my remaining SIPs require water every day if the temps get into the mid-80's or higher. The ones with bigger res's have bigger plants, so it all evens out in the end. Next year I'll look into a 55g drum and some kind of passive/self-regulating water system.
I checked the sticky-bug-card this morning, and it looks to be 100% gnats (no aphids). The DE and dry hot weather has diminished them sufficiently to not be a concern. It is an outdoor grow, after all.
All of my remaining SIPs require water every day if the temps get into the mid-80's or higher. The ones with bigger res's have bigger plants, so it all evens out in the end. Next year I'll look into a 55g drum and some kind of passive/self-regulating water system.
Larry {the} Gardener
Well-Known Member
I do a red neck version of this rain gutter grow system for my tomatoes. {a trench lined with black plastic filled with water} You might give it a look and see what you think.
Humanrob
Well-Known Member
I will definitely be studying all of these designs late in the winter, while preparing for spring. I'm hoping to find a more closed system, open water around here attracts everything from mosquitos to raccoons. But the general idea of tubing and float valves is for sure what I'll be working with.
Humanrob
Well-Known Member
Little outdoor SIP update. 5 Gallons of soil is not enough for an outdoor grow. I'm not sure if there being a SIP made it even worse. The plant got pretty big, and then completely depleted the soil of nutes. I'm taking off dead and yellow leaves daily, and can't keep up with it. I've been adding GH to the soil (requiring a small amount of top watering) and to the res almost weekly, but I haven't been able to keep up with the plants needs. This one also only holds about 1.5 gallons in the res, and I have to fill it every day.
The other SIP I'm running -- 10 gallons of soil over 5 gallons of water -- is doing really well. I've read that GG#4 doesn't need a lot of nutes, that might be part of the reason.
A couple of quick pics, the first is the Bruce Banner that's hurting in its little pot, the second is an LSD that's in the ground. I suppose its an unfair comparison, but it says a lot.
The other SIP I'm running -- 10 gallons of soil over 5 gallons of water -- is doing really well. I've read that GG#4 doesn't need a lot of nutes, that might be part of the reason.
A couple of quick pics, the first is the Bruce Banner that's hurting in its little pot, the second is an LSD that's in the ground. I suppose its an unfair comparison, but it says a lot.
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Humanrob
Well-Known Member
If the 5 gallon were all I had access to, then I'd recommend putting them outside really late, end of June or even the beginning of July. Basically, I wouldn't give them enough time to get too big. I'd rather have a small healthy plant than a big one that's struggling.
I have two in 5g sips, one will stay outside, the other I plan on finishing in the garage under lights. They are different strains but both clones from ones I grew indoors last spring, so I have some vague anecdotal points of comparison. I'm really curious how 12 hours of direct COB lighting will compare with the diminishing fall light from the sun as it drops down in the south.
I have two in 5g sips, one will stay outside, the other I plan on finishing in the garage under lights. They are different strains but both clones from ones I grew indoors last spring, so I have some vague anecdotal points of comparison. I'm really curious how 12 hours of direct COB lighting will compare with the diminishing fall light from the sun as it drops down in the south.
mushroom head
Well-Known Member
I planted in a 5 gallon mid July and she has almost out grown it. I'd say beginning of July would be perfect with the 5 gallon sips.
Larry {the} Gardener
Well-Known Member
Almost across the board, my younger plants look much better than the older ones. The couple of exceptions is the ones that get regular food and water. The Darwin Dope patches are fading badly. They look worse than your "bad" looking one.
I was at one of my patches this morning at 1000. The sun was just poking over the trees and shining on the plants. It is so low already, it's not getting near the hours it needs. I bet 12 hours of COB's would fatten them up nicely.
I was at one of my patches this morning at 1000. The sun was just poking over the trees and shining on the plants. It is so low already, it's not getting near the hours it needs. I bet 12 hours of COB's would fatten them up nicely.
Humanrob
Well-Known Member
I have found that there is a relationship or a ratio between the amount of light a plant gets, and how much nutrients it needs. I first found this when I switched from cheap red/blue LEDs to COBs -- my plants needed a lot more nutes with the more intense light. I'm thinking about moving the one SIP into the garage sooner than later, because I think at this point the plant wants to grow in proportion to the great sunlight we're getting, and it just can't handle that much light with the weak soil its in.
I took a really good look at my plants today, and all the ones in SIPs are not doing as well as the ones in the ground. I top feed dry time release nutes to my girls in the ground, but that's useless without top watering which is problematic for SIPs, and the longer they go the worse it gets.
Humanrob
Well-Known Member
10 days later... I've moved one the 5 gallon SIPs into the garage, left the other one outside with some top cover to keep the rain off. I moved the Bruce Banner in and left the Rugdawg (Chemdawg OG x Rugburn OG) outside, partly because my patient prefers the BB and partly because the RD was too tall! Also, the BB had shown spots of PM, the RD is toughing it out and is one of only two plants I have that have shown no signs of PM!!!! Last year my Chemdawg 91 stayed PM free through the season, that is one tough strain I will run again outside. As another side note, the Rugdawg I ran in my tent last winter foxtailed like crazy because of heat issues, this outdoor one is growing in a completely different form. It's shape is looking really good actually. I hope it pulls through, like its sister in the other 5g its losing leaves daily.
The BB has caused me to buy my first cheap little PH kit, and I tested the water today. Found out my tap water is too alkali, so I adjusted that, and I adjusted the water in the res. I'm doing a half-assed job of feeding it through the res. It's not a good set up, because unless I invest in some sort of pump to drain the water, it is not set up for changing out the res water. I did drill a 1" whole in the side of the bucket and dropped an air stone in there... for what that's worth at this late point in the game. So its getting some nutes, and PH balanced aerated water. It's also losing leaves at an alarming rate, I can't imagine there will be any left in two weeks.
The garage is running around 90ºF during the mid-afternoon into early evening, and I'm running a dehumidifier at night (can't run both at the same time, only one 20amp circuit). The dehumidifier runs warm, so the nighttime temps are around 80º. This is quite a shock for the plants three weeks away from finishing -- moving to artificial light and simultaneously into a much warmer climate (especially in terms of nights that don't cool off). I'm sure they'll adjust, but I'm not sure what the impact will be. I will keep an eye out for hermies, although there isn't enough time left in the season for seeds to mature.
The only other true SIP outside (I'm not counting the one I completely buried, even though I do add water to it regularly), is the mighty but heavily damaged GG#4. The only other plant in my yard to so far have shown no signs of PM, that tough girl is holding her own. She has shown some spots of bark rot, which is a sign of too much water. I had been top watering to try and get the top-applied dried nutes to break down and release, but I'll have to stop that and only keep the res full for the remainder of the season. Another indication that SIPs outside need to be planned around a short season.
Sorry for the long post... its been a long summer. I am still of the opinion that I won't run SIPs outside again, so far in my limited experience, nothing beats putting the plant in the ground.
The BB has caused me to buy my first cheap little PH kit, and I tested the water today. Found out my tap water is too alkali, so I adjusted that, and I adjusted the water in the res. I'm doing a half-assed job of feeding it through the res. It's not a good set up, because unless I invest in some sort of pump to drain the water, it is not set up for changing out the res water. I did drill a 1" whole in the side of the bucket and dropped an air stone in there... for what that's worth at this late point in the game. So its getting some nutes, and PH balanced aerated water. It's also losing leaves at an alarming rate, I can't imagine there will be any left in two weeks.
The garage is running around 90ºF during the mid-afternoon into early evening, and I'm running a dehumidifier at night (can't run both at the same time, only one 20amp circuit). The dehumidifier runs warm, so the nighttime temps are around 80º. This is quite a shock for the plants three weeks away from finishing -- moving to artificial light and simultaneously into a much warmer climate (especially in terms of nights that don't cool off). I'm sure they'll adjust, but I'm not sure what the impact will be. I will keep an eye out for hermies, although there isn't enough time left in the season for seeds to mature.
The only other true SIP outside (I'm not counting the one I completely buried, even though I do add water to it regularly), is the mighty but heavily damaged GG#4. The only other plant in my yard to so far have shown no signs of PM, that tough girl is holding her own. She has shown some spots of bark rot, which is a sign of too much water. I had been top watering to try and get the top-applied dried nutes to break down and release, but I'll have to stop that and only keep the res full for the remainder of the season. Another indication that SIPs outside need to be planned around a short season.
Sorry for the long post... its been a long summer. I am still of the opinion that I won't run SIPs outside again, so far in my limited experience, nothing beats putting the plant in the ground.