Outdoor Auto Thread

[OPfarmer]

Dont blame autos for not being dense. I personally, and dont take this as an offense (more like constructive criticism), dont think youre grow style/techniques are not conducive to bringing autos to their full potential. Heres a pic of some indoor grown green crack cbd (auto) I chopped off a plant to guage the trichomes to know when to harvest. This is from the lower part of the plant. Im using LED to grow.
View attachment 4169447 View attachment 4169448 View attachment 4169449
You can see some nanners starting to develop. That is because my friend likes there to be more amber than cloudy because of the pain relief for his chronic back pain. So I let these go past their chop date. Dense? Can you see through the buds? Im sorry my friend but Im defending autos. You must be doing something to get fluffy buds. If you dont have fluffy photos then I presume you are stressing your autos too much. Contrary to popular belief that autos can handle stress, well thanks to so much breeding I believe that trait of the ruderalis has been eliminated. Autos are not for beginners, Ive seen it too many times. Peace.

Could be.

Maybe? My gut thinks the story is much more complicated. Humanrob's garden looks healthy. We're not talking indoor autobuds here. We are looking at fluffy early season outdoor auto plants. Maybe, it's the fact that they finnished near summer solstice, and not in a waning sun of later summer?
Or maybe we should not lump all strains of autos together either. I feel some gotta be better than others outdoors, just like photoperiod strains.

Me, I think autos have great potential outdoors, but the industry has much to learn, also the laws which are based on plant count, really inhibit the potential popularity of autos outdoors.

Maybe the trend will be super autos, bred for outdoor production. Many of us have no need for stealth, but can't have flowering so late in fall. The risk of mold is just too great. Gotta flower and finish up by no later than September 15, some years the end of August, for a lower risk of mold.

Sounds like a good breeder project..

 

[Thegermling]

That looks like its got ages to go. Is that a normal looking auto bud?

Nope. I looked at the trichomes and about 80-90% are cloudy. Look up green crack foxtailing not "normal looking" for sure but the environment does play a part on how a cannabis plant physically expresses itself. Come on bro you know this.

 

[Humanrob]

Maybe? My gut thinks the story is much more complicated. Humanrob's garden looks healthy. We're not talking indoor autobuds here. We are looking at fluffy early season outdoor auto plants. Maybe, it's the fact that they finnished near summer solstice, and not in a waning sun of later summer?
Or maybe we should not lump all strains of autos together either. I feel some gotta be better than others outdoors, just like photoperiod strains.

There are a ton of factors, but the most interesting ones to me this year are genetic. My plants are all in very similar soil/nute/sunlight situations, and they range from over 5' tall to short single stem plants with only a handful of buds on them. Autos have a particularly diverse gene pool, I imagine that the potential for random outliers is greater because of it, and it's also going to make them more difficult to stereotype.

Me, I think autos have great potential outdoors, but the industry has much to learn, also the laws which are based on plant count, really inhibit the potential popularity of autos outdoors.

This totally frustrates me. Because of articles I've read from various sources leading me to believe that we won't be inspected (one med card, growing for self at own residence...), I'm rolling the dice and going with the spirit of the law if not the letter. In other words, I'll harvest WAY below my legal weight limit, but my plant count -- of what I have been referring to as my "dwarf plants" -- is way over my limit. I hope someday they can get a little more informed and sophisticated about the laws, and better reflect the reality of growing. The black market they are attempting to eliminate is all about volume, not plant count.

Maybe the trend will be super autos, bred for outdoor production. Many of us have no need for stealth, but can't have flowering so late in fall. The risk of mold is just too great. Gotta flower and finish up by no later than September 15, some years the end of August, for a lower risk of mold.

Sounds like a good breeder project..

Word.

 

[Humanrob]

Maybe the trend will be super autos, bred for outdoor production. Many of us have no need for stealth, but can't have flowering so late in fall. The risk of mold is just too great. Gotta flower and finish up by no later than September 15, some years the end of August, for a lower risk of mold.

Sounds like a good breeder project..

To some degree this is already happening, with breeders like Oregon Green Seed coming from the other side and breeding mold resistant short flower time photos for our climate (they still require being covered, they finish mid-Sept to early-Oct).

I think the marriage of the two is inevitable. I look forward to them stabilizing the strains -- as I mentioned before the Blueberry I grew last year from the same packet of seeds was about 2.5 feet tall at harvest, and the one I have now is huge. This year's looks like it will finish in about 6 weeks, making it a 16 week plant (!!!) germinated mid-May and finishing by late August/early September. That's still way better than any photo I've run in terms of finishing early. It has the potential to hold several ounces, so 4-6 of these properly spaced could be a healthy grow...

 

[OPfarmer]

I too have huge phenotype varibility with some strains of autos. Height difference no biggy outdoors, but inside those short plants would suffer.

 

[Lucky Luke]

Nope. I looked at the trichomes and about 80-90% are cloudy. Look up green crack foxtailing not "normal looking" for sure but the environment does play a part on how a cannabis plant physically expresses itself. Come on bro you know this.

I don't mean to sound rude or disrespectful. But that bud looks immature. Lots of white hairs still, brown hairs have not started to recede. I like some amber but wait for the bud to look more mature before I even scope it.
I haven't grown an auto to flower yet which is why I was asking. I'm not to excited about them so far.
:

 

[Thegermling]

I don't mean to sound rude or disrespectful. But that bud looks immature. Lots of white hairs still, brown hairs have not started to recede. I like some amber but wait for the bud to look more mature before I even scope it.
I haven't grown an auto to flower yet which is why I was asking. I'm not to excited about them so far.
:

None taken, I like to learn from other fellow growers. Over 80% of the pistils are amber in that photo. I dont understand how you say "lots of white hairs still" In my research on many forums I learned that to harvest the pistils have to be over 90% brown, calyxes swollen to the point it looks like there is a seed, and checking trichomes (color is based on personal prefrence). Ill take note of that brown and receding tip, thanks!

 

[Lucky Luke]

None taken, I like to learn from other fellow growers. Over 80% of the pistils are amber in that photo. I dont understand how you say "lots of white hairs still" In my research on many forums I learned that to harvest the pistils have to be over 90% brown, calyxes swollen to the point it looks like there is a seed, and checking trichomes (color is based on personal prefrence). Ill take note of that brown and receding tip, thanks!

When I said Amber I was referring to the trichomes. Its not unusual to see "waves" of trichomes come and go as the flower puts on weight. Trichomes are something the plant keeps producing for some time. Some strains don't show amber either, making it more important to go by the mature flower.
One of the growers on here who I cannot recall the Tag of wont harvest at all until the plant is showing no white hairs at all. Then they start checking trich's.

 

[Lucky Luke]

On another note, for some cool and colourful trichome pics have a gander through Dons active thread.
https://www.rollitup.org/t/the-dons-organic-garden.815786/

 

[puck1969]

I too have huge phenotype varibility with some strains of autos. Height difference no biggy outdoors, but inside those short plants would suffer.

I’ve been pretty lucky then ‘cause all but 1 of the auto’s I’ve grown the past 2 years have all been the same. The one this year is short but the yield will be at the top 1 or 2.

 

[OPfarmer]

A

I’ve been pretty lucky then ‘cause all but 1 of the auto’s I’ve grown the past 2 years have all been the same. The one this year is short but the yield will be at the top 1 or 2.

No auto expert here. Roughly 20 autos under or in my ( belt..).

My short plants may yield but,,, so far bigger plant the better. I am in 5 gallon fabric pots.

Even at that I can see some of the bigger autos wanting more .( Thick stems, consumed media, light bags.)

 

[OPfarmer]

here's more green phenotype of Automatic Bubblelicious. (Little bit of pink on the swelling calaxes). About 36 inches tall. Should have some Amber tricomes in the next few weeks. Maybe some more pink. Fan leaves are fading fast.


Here's a Med Gnome 1. Shorter plant at 2 feet. Frosty for a pure CBD strain

 

[Humanrob]

No auto expert here. Roughly 20 autos under or in my ( belt..).

My short plants may yield but,,, so far bigger plant the better. I am in 5 gallon fabric pots.

Even at that I can see some of the bigger autos wanting more .( Thick stems, consumed media, light bags.)

I've had two autos grow significantly bigger than 'advertised' so far, and both were in the ground. Too small a data set to be significant, but anecdotally interesting to me. I suspect that some plants given unlimited root space will (genetically) be able to take advantage of it more than others. The point of diminishing returns (in terms of pot size) seems to come more quickly with autos than photos, they just don't have the time to utilize the extra root space. Usually.

here's more green phenotype of Automatic Bubblelicious. (Little bit of pink on the swelling calaxes). About 36 inches tall. Should have some Amber tricomes in the next few weeks. Maybe some more pink. Fan leaves are fading fast.

View attachment 4170370
Here's a Med Gnome 1. Shorter plant at 2 feet. Frosty for a pure CBD strain
View attachment 4170376

Nice looking plants.

I'm having an issue I've had before and never come to fully understand, one of my plants had the hairs turn dark and shrivel, fall colors set in on the fan leaves... and then it came out with a full set of new white hairs. It's a Thai Ryder, the third "Thai" plant I've attempted (the others being Wild Thai and Thai Skunk) and the third one to be disappointing. Some people love them, I'm going to avoid them moving forward, something about my grow style is not giving them what they need.

 

[OPfarmer]

Here is some automatic purple Mazer from this summers round 1. Smaller plant only stuffed two 32 ounce Mason jars. (I leave sugar leaves on, as I dry sift everything.)

Pretty purple

 

[OPfarmer]

I've had two autos grow significantly bigger than 'advertised' so far, and both were in the ground. Too small a data set to be significant, but interesting to me. I suspect that some plants given unlimited root space will (genetically) be able to take advantage of it more than others. The point of diminishing returns (in terms of pot size) seems to come more quickly with autos than photos, they just don't have the time to utilize the extra root space. Usually.


Nice looking plants.

I'm having an issue I've had before and never come to fully understand, one of my plants had the hairs turn dark and shrivel, fall colors set in on the fan leaves... and then it came out with a full set of new white hairs. It's a Thai Ryder, the third "Thai" plant I've attempted (the others being Wild Thai and Thai Skunk) and the third one to be disappointing. Some people love them, I'm going to avoid them moving forward, something about my grow style is not giving them what they need.
ATTACH=full]4170408[/ATTACH]

I don't know are the plants having a second flush in the ground or in pots?
------

Me in 5 gallon fabric grow bags I had one of my Med Gnome's sorta do that, it did not want to finish up evenly, plant started turning with nice fall colors and fading fan leaves.

Under fertilization?, The early start to flowering before summer solstice? Or very cool nights in the upper 40s with hot dry days?

I'm going with a combination, and for me with a no fert approach, I should be in 7 gallon bags not 5, at least with some of the bigger autos. Otherwise, I think some strains just don't like it outside everywhere.

Most of all I question day length. Even if it is an auto flower, trying to finish up bloom in 17 hours of intense sun must be hard for any plant. I have noticed with the long days plants are not in a hurry to finish blooming. Getting swollen calexes before too many leaves die seems to be a challenge, at least with July maturity.

A lot of strong mixed message signals the flowering plants receive outdoors early in the season.

 

[Humanrob]

I don't know are the plants having a second flush in the ground or in pots?
------

Me in 5 gallon fabric grow bags I had one of my Med Gnome's sorta do that, it did not want to finish up evenly, plant started turning with nice fall colors and fading fan leaves.

Under fertilization?, The early start to flowering before summer solstice? Or very cool nights in the upper 40s with hot dry days?

I'm going with a combination, and for me with a no fert approach, I should be in 7 gallon bags not 5, at least with some of the bigger autos. Otherwise, I think some strains just don't like it outside everywhere.

Most of all I question day length. Even if it is an auto flower, trying to finish up bloom in 17 hours of intense sun must be hard for any plant. I have noticed with the long days plants are not in a hurry to finish blooming. Getting swollen calexes before too many leaves die seems to be a challenge, at least with July maturity.

A lot of strong mixed message signals the flowering plants receive outdoors early in the season.

The Thai is both in the ground, and a pot -- it was started in a 3 gallon pot and I dropped the whole pot into the ground to keep the roots cool, make watering easier, and let the roots reach out the bottom holes as far as they like. It's possible that my normal feeding was on the lights side for it, and then after feeding it, it reverted to an earlier stage of flower? I'm using time release dry nutes, so I feed them about every 4 weeks. When a plant starts to yellow but everything is looking like there are two weeks or less left, I won't feed it more, so I probably stopped feeding this one.

Alternately, when a plant starts to yellow (needing more nutes than my normal amount), but looks like there are closer to 4 weeks left, sometimes I'll hit it a couple of times with GH to give it a quick boost but allow time for the nutes to break down (I don't "flush", but I stop feeding weeks before harvest). Not my favorite thing to do, but I hate to see them hungry when the buds are still filling out.

I try and adjust some to individual plants, but I'm growing about a dozen different strains this summer, so for the most part they get what they get and do how they do. Most of them seem to be doing fine.

As far as length of day, I would estimate that mine get about 7 hours of direct sunlight, not all in one stretch (maybe 1.5 hours in the morning, then some shade, then 5.5 hours in the afternoon). There are serious trees to the east/SE and west of my property, we took two down that we could on our south side but we're left mostly with 1pm - 6:30pm for the meat of our sunlight. I don't imagine that's too much for them?

I have heard some photo breeders who claim certain strains they breed to not do well indoors, maybe the vast majority of auto breeding has been developed around indoor controlled environments and they don't adapt well to the inconsistencies of nature?

 

[puck1969]

My plants get 6-7 hours of direct sunlight from 9am to 3pm but
they all look almost identical. They are in different size pots to
see if there would be a difference. Last year all my autos had a
tap root like a dandelion and thin roots the width of a human hair
that grew out of that. Don’t know if that’s normal but I don’t see
a difference with the pot size.

 

[Humanrob]

I think it was @HighLowGrow who did an indoor comparison with 1, 2, and 3 gallon pots, and within that range saw a significant difference in plant size between pot sizes. Once you get over 5 gallons (with autos), indoors or out there seems to be a quick curve of diminishing returns.

I got three plants this year (long story) that were 30 days old in 3 gallon pots, and the experienced auto growers who gave them to me told me that those pots would be fine to carry them through an outdoor season. I guess it just depends on how much and how often you feed them.

My plants get 6-7 hours of direct sunlight from 9am to 3pm but
they all look almost identical. They are in different size pots to
see if there would be a difference. Last year all my autos had a
tap root like a dandelion and thin roots the width of a human hair
that grew out of that. Don’t know if that’s normal but I don’t see
a difference with the pot size.

What is the range in your pot sizes?

 

[puck1969]

I think it was @HighLowGrow who did an indoor comparison with 1, 2, and 3 gallon pots, and within that range saw a significant difference in plant size between pot sizes. Once you get over 5 gallons (with autos), indoors or out there seems to be a quick curve of diminishing returns.

I got three plants this year (long story) that were 30 days old in 3 gallon pots, and the experienced auto growers who gave them to me told me that those pots would be fine to carry them through an outdoor season. I guess it just depends on how much and how often you feed them.



What is the range in your pot sizes?

My fabric pots are 1-3-7 gallon but the 7 doesn’t look anywhere close to a
5 gallon Poland Spring water bottle. It’s weird what they call 7 gallons with
the cloth pots. I wouldn’t go any more than the 3 gallon size from now on.
It’s not worth the extra materials for not much if any improvement.

 

[OPfarmer]

Here is one of my autos root ball from a 5 gallon fabric bag.