Obama ... He's Lookin' Good!

but im with stupid unfortunatly
hannimal I give you and A for effort and an A for being not backing down
but I fail you for being wrong. and not realizing it when somone is trying to put his dick up your ass
cuz thats what they are trying to do to us

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Nope no dick near my ass here.

I would agree with you if it was not for the fact that we are already paying for everything. Those dollars that are being walked out on are not disapearring, They are getting spread out over the system. And that means that we are paying for everyone already, it is just that they are getting the most expensive care instead of getting regular visits that would be much cheaper in the long run.


So I guess from your point of view, the dick was already stuffed into everyone already, and this is just a way to make sure that they use lube from now on.


Damn so I guess that means I have already had the dick in my ass.......... *sigh*

hanimmal said:

Nope no dick near my ass here.

I would agree with you if it was not for the fact that we are already paying for everything. Those dollars that are being walked out on are not disapearring, They are getting spread out over the system. And that means that we are paying for everyone already, it is just that they are getting the most expensive care instead of getting regular visits that would be much cheaper in the long run.


So I guess from your point of view, the dick was already stuffed into everyone already, and this is just a way to make sure that they use lube from now on.



Damn so I guess that means I have already had the dick in my ass.......... *sigh*

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lol



no im saying you cant add 50 million new customers without increasing the employees (doctors)


what say u?

no im saying you cant add 50 million new customers without increasing the employees (doctors)


what say u?

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There would be a sudden surge of demand for individual doctors, so on that level it would be shorted, but the demand would be less in other areas to compensate. Everyone in America that needs care is going to get it now (or suffer until way later when it is much worse), it is just that they are going to the emergency rooms and free clinics, or subsidized care clinics for reduced price.

I know two doctors that have closed their private practices due to people losing insurance and not having enough patients to keep it open so they went to the hospitals in their areas. If their would be demand they would love to reopen them.

Here is a list of Md's per 100,000 residents by state: http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/ranks/rank18.html

The highest amount per doctor is 581 (Oklahoma) to the lowest 216 (Mass.). So in theory we should be able to handle the load well.



Here is the link, it is very good if your into charts. I fucking love charts. http://www.aafp.org/fpm/20070400/44pane.html

Eventually we need to make a shift to more preventative care (general practice MD's), any change is always hard to do at first, but it is not like we are not eventually going to have to care for people anyway.

hanimmal said:

There would be a sudden surge of demand for individual doctors, so on that level it would be shorted, but the demand would be less in other areas to compensate. Everyone in America that needs care is going to get it now (or suffer until way later when it is much worse), it is just that they are going to the emergency rooms and free clinics, or subsidized care clinics for reduced price.

I know two doctors that have closed their private practices due to people losing insurance and not having enough patients to keep it open so they went to the hospitals in their areas. If their would be demand they would love to reopen them.

Here is a list of Md's per 100,000 residents by state: http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/ranks/rank18.html

The highest amount per doctor is 581 (Oklahoma) to the lowest 216 (Mass.). So in theory we should be able to handle the load well.

Here is the link, it is very good if your into charts. I fucking love charts. http://www.aafp.org/fpm/20070400/44pane.html

Eventually we need to make a shift to more preventative care (general practice MD's), any change is always hard to do at first, but it is not like we are not eventually going to have to care for people anyway.

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Easy way to resolve the problem, abolish the IRS and repeal the 16th Amendment.

and the donkey impales its own self



NYT: DEMS PLAN TO GO IT ALONE ON HEATHCARE... DEVELOPING...




if they do that they can kiss it goodbye. everything


these guys are wiz kids


more at 11

Obama can just blow me!!!!!

Arclight said:

Obama can just blow me!!!!!

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Careful, he might sick Barney Frank on you

Breakneck derailment in....

Easy way to resolve the problem, abolish the IRS and repeal the 16th Amendment.

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and the donkey impales its own self



NYT: DEMS PLAN TO GO IT ALONE ON HEATHCARE... DEVELOPING...

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I would like to see the bill in the senate pass, but it does not look like they will have the votes. More than anything I think this is a scare tactic to bring the insurance companies back to the table again to give up more. This is still a poker game, it is just the republicans decided to let the insurance companies see their cards by flopping them face up to screw it all up.

hanimmal said:

Breakneck derailment in....





I would like to see the bill in the senate pass, but it does not look like they will have the votes. More than anything I think this is a scare tactic to bring the insurance companies back to the table again to give up more. This is still a poker game, it is just the republicans decided to let the insurance companies see their cards by flopping them face up to screw it all up.

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in a poker game there is usually 1 winner and the rest are losers


that being said I think the peoples hand has been played

now we call

theres no way they can pass this, the blue dogs will be lynched if they vote for it and they know that.

The peoples hand has not been played yet.

We are still in negotiations, if the insurance companies can set up private co-ops that will cover the American public we will win. If the republicans would have not been so piss full of vinegar and played it smart, instead of just being anti everything, we would be able to get something good done.

Say the Republicans wanted tort reform like they are saying they so much do. What would be the best way to do it. If it was me, I would join up with the Dems letting the insurance companies know that they will now have to take care of the people that get the poor care that led to the malpractice suit, and they will just have to work with the hospitals to do it (Because no matter what someone always pays). This way the insurance company is left out and knows they will lose if they don't do something quick.

So that forces them to really give in and try to work with the government to make he best deals possible that they can. After that the Republicans only need to work with a few dems to get them on their side, and stonewall the bill a couple weeks before the vote to get the tort reform in place while allowing the insurance companies to run the co-op plans so that they can ensure a profit.

Instead they jumped out infront with lies and scare tactics on this bill in order to kill it right away. This is the problem, we really have had an opportunity to do some good for the country and they killed it. And the only way to get the boat back on track is to say fuck it and disregard the republicans. And the republicans have allowed this because they are more worried about leveraging the country to re-elect themselves that to do anything good for the country. This way in 2010, and 2012 they can say see we need republicans to fight this dictator, when it is not his fault that they have decided to fight everything that gets done.

The fact that the republicans tossed in their cards just means that we only have one chance at a winning hand, instead of the two that would have been better chance.

In the summer of 2009, The Economist magazine said "[t]he debate over health care... may be the pinnacle of the group’s power so far" and quoted Charlie Stenholm, a founding Blue Dog, as saying that "this is the first year for the new kennel in which their votes are really going to make a difference."[8]
The biggest single source of finance for the Blue Dog Political Action Committee is the health care industry. They donated $1.2 million dollars in the 2009-10 election cycle.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Dog_Coalition#cite_note-8

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The Democratic Blue Dog Coalition is a group of currently 52 moderate and conservative Democratic Party members of the United States House of Representatives

Likely targets for Bayh would include moderate Democrats like Sens. Mark Pryor (Ark.), Blanche Lincoln (Ark.), Mary Landrieu (La.), Ben Nelson (Neb.), Jim Webb (Va.), and Sen.-elect Mark Warner (Va.).

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They wouldn't have enough to kill some kind of bill.

UK SYSTEM: 45,000 'health' workers call in sick every day ...

CANADIAN SYSTEM: Thousands of surgeries may be cut in Vancouver...






ooooo i cant wait for my government to get thier hands on my healthcare soo exciting!!! cant wait!!!!



.

CrackerJax said:

What part don't you understand? i can explain it to you ....slowly.

Since the United States counts many more as "born"&"alive" the numbers seem worse than they are. Conversely, if the EU actually "counted" <500gram babies as alive, their numbers would worsen.

There is a cold chill in that the EU doesn't count the ,500g babies as "alive". Back to socialized medical again....

USA....save that baby. EU... trashbin.

So the FACT that the EU uses a different way of counting...... is somehow confusing to you?

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Well I guess I forgot that in virtue of you saying something, it must be correct. That is what you stated, right? Almost verbatim, in fact.

I guess I should just take everything you say as fact, even though you established no authority on ANYTHING. Even with authority, it's fallacy to believe something simply because the authority said it, but I guess having no authority on the matter makes it more believable. Like backwards logic - I get it. I must simply subscribe to backwards logic and then everything you say is right! In Cracker's world, being an authority makes you less believable and lacking authority makes you correct - hmmmm.......

Here is where I reject your reality and substitute the objective reality that most of us normal folk subscribe to. The real query is HOW you got to the point of reaching the inane conclusions that you push on us, day in, day out. Maybe it's your irrational and singular quest to keep the large amass of wealth you're constantly bragging about on this site. Perhaps this one drive to keep accumulating wealth has, in fact, destroyed your senses. Have you read Euripides' Medea? If not, you should. I'll give you a hint - you're Medea.

That unleash the dragon video that Big P has is great, very entertaining. It's like the marijuana food network.

jrh72582 said:

Well I guess I forgot that in virtue of you saying something, it must be correct. That is what you stated, right? Almost verbatim, in fact.

I guess I should just take everything you say as fact, even though you established no authority on ANYTHING. Even with authority, it's fallacy to believe something simply because the authority said it, but I guess having no authority on the matter makes it more believable. Like backwards logic - I get it. I must simply subscribe to backwards logic and then everything you say is right! In Cracker's world, being an authority makes you less believable and lacking authority makes you correct - hmmmm.......

Here is where I reject your reality and substitute the objective reality that most of us normal folk subscribe to. The real query is HOW you got to the point of reaching the inane conclusions that you push on us, day in, day out. Maybe it's your irrational and singular quest to keep the large amass of wealth you're constantly bragging about on this site. Perhaps this one drive to keep accumulating wealth has, in fact, destroyed your senses. Have you read Euripides' Medea? If not, you should. I'll give you a hint - you're Medea.

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Instead of deflecting away from my data and trying to discredit the messenger.... (how utterly predictable and lame).... why don't you just look up the parameters of what constitutes a "live birth" in the USA and Europe.

Prove me wrong..... take your time.

CrackerJax said:

Instead of deflecting away from my data and trying to discredit the messenger.... (how utterly predictable and lame).... why don't you just look up the parameters of what constitutes a "live birth" in the USA and Europe.

Prove me wrong..... take your time.

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Semantics. Arbitrary and hollow definitions cannot be used as justification for larger claims .

that means you must have looked it up.....

hardly a thing to impale yourself upon...... a curious choice.

Instead of deflecting away from my data and trying to discredit the messenger.... (how utterly predictable and lame).... why don't you just look up the parameters of what constitutes a "live birth" in the USA and Europe.

Prove me wrong..... take your time.

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I couldn't help myself. I already did the post on your numbers. The parameters are not what that guy made them out to be. They may not count them in the 'infant' category but they still get counted in other categories. And they are still lower in all of them.

Just because a baby is born underweight does not mean that it gets discarded and uncounted. It is just the way that they do the numbers, which are still lower in the other categories (neonatal, prenatal, ect).

Incorrect..... the TOTALS of births are just that... the TOTALS.... they aren't 'tucked" away somewhere else.

CrackerJax said:

Incorrect..... the TOTALS of births are just that... the TOTALS.... they aren't 'tucked" away somewhere else.

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Nope. As much as you'd like them to be, the numbers aren't skewed. Our health care system is abysmal compared to our economic standing in the world. It must be fixed.

I just had a conversation the other day with an 18 year old student who was diagnosed with cervical cancer - no insurance. She was on her father's and he lost his job. Now that she's diagnosed, no one will cover her. She is uninsurable. If we have nationalized health care, the government would step is, as should happen. An 18 year old with cervical cancer should NOT be systematically denied treatment because of greedy insurance companies.

U.S. Life Expectancy Hits All-Time High—Deaths All-Time Low

By: Madeline Ellis
Published: Friday, 21 August 2009


Americans may not be living as long as the Japanese, whose estimated life span is 83 years, but we are gaining ground. According to a new report by CDC’s National Center for Health Statistics, average life expectancy in the U.S. hit a record high of 77.9 years in 2007, the latest year that data from death certificates has been compiled. Both men and women set new records, with life expectancy now 75.3 years for men and 80.4 years for women. And, for the first time, life expectancy for black males reached 70 years.

The increase in mortality can be attributed to a drop in death rates. The number of deaths in the U.S. in 2007 was 2,423,995, a 2,269 decrease from 2006. And the overall death rate fell to a record low of 760 deaths per 100,000 people, 2.1 percent lower than the 2006 rate of 776.5. This marks the eighth consecutive year the mortality rate has fallen, and is half of what it was 60 years ago (1532.0 in 1947).


Sounds like we're doing terrible......also why your friends case while sad, is anecdotal and policies can't be based on those parameters. We have the finest health care in the world. The Govt. already spends more on health care RIGHT NOW than Canada spends on it's socialized system. We just need to streamline what we already have. Handing over something as important as your health to inept govt. employees is nonsensical. The govt. runs EVERY program it has into debt....every one. These same promises were made with SS, medicare, medicaid.... all broken promises. Yah, let's do it again.... The politicians will keep everything honest...... let's all go to Disneyland....wee!!!