Airwalker16
Well-Known Member
All true. To add to the importance of air movement too; without it, leaves get micro climates between them where humidity lingers and rot/mildew starts.
Not enough heat in my Bloom Room Since replacing HPS with LED. Had to switch back.
- Thread starter Strudelheim
- Start date
hybridway2
Amare Shill
To say led needs 40w/sq' is like saying all cars get the same gas mileage.
I run my bars at 27w/sq' & yielded better then i ever have.
The efficiency levels, spectrum, form-factor all come into play when predicting watts an led needs.
The good average/estimate these days is around 33.33 w/sq', based on the premium lights offered these days.
The majority of well designed leds will crush an hps's output in a hood. At 1/2-5/8 the watts at that. So lets not go there unless you're going to toss up par-mapps.
Hps puts out 1600 umols where?
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
Contrary to popular belief you should be running higher nutrient concentrations in winter than in summer. The reason is simple: less evaporation. Plants will take up what they can via three pathways: transpiration, ATP (active transport) and reverse osmosis at the root level. You are growing in what looks to be a coco/perlite mix and I assume hand-watering. If I'm wrong, then sorry I missed it.
So you'll have less evaporation in the pot and less water loss through transpiration. Less transpiration will affect mainly magnesium uptake, followed by calcium. Increasing nitrogen levels can help uptake magnesium and calcium, but can also result in raising pH at the root zone which will start to lock out iron and zinc. A good chelated micronutrient mix that includes magnesium, iron, zinc and other micronutrients can help when temperatures drop, but your first line of defence is to actually increase balanced nutrient concentrations. Also, don't forget to flush regularly to prevent excess salt build-up, but take into account the reduced evaporation at the root zone. You shouldn't have too many problems with a perlite mix that drains well, even in winter.
Studies have shown the ideal difference between dark and light temperatures is 15C, so in many cases it may be preferable to have your lights on during the day in winter if it gets cold in your area.
In addition to reduced transpiration lower temperatures will obviously affect metabolic rate. Pretty much everything on earth slows growth when it gets cold for this reason. You can offset the loss of temperature transpiration somewhat with a fan blowing on the leaves (more wind evaporation, not cooling).
Another tip, if you are hand-watering into coco-perlite, you will see much faster growth with an automatic watering regime. If you're already doing that, try increasing the number of times you water but reducing the amount you water each time. A bit like drip feed. And if you autowater, you can then add an aquarium heater to your reservoir and that will make a big difference to plant metabolism in winter.
One final trick: vent your room/tent out the bottom so that the extractor fan pulls hot air rising off the heatsink down through the canopy and out the bottom of the grow area.
That's all I've got because frankly, I live in Australia and it doesn't get that cold.
So you'll have less evaporation in the pot and less water loss through transpiration. Less transpiration will affect mainly magnesium uptake, followed by calcium. Increasing nitrogen levels can help uptake magnesium and calcium, but can also result in raising pH at the root zone which will start to lock out iron and zinc. A good chelated micronutrient mix that includes magnesium, iron, zinc and other micronutrients can help when temperatures drop, but your first line of defence is to actually increase balanced nutrient concentrations. Also, don't forget to flush regularly to prevent excess salt build-up, but take into account the reduced evaporation at the root zone. You shouldn't have too many problems with a perlite mix that drains well, even in winter.
Studies have shown the ideal difference between dark and light temperatures is 15C, so in many cases it may be preferable to have your lights on during the day in winter if it gets cold in your area.
In addition to reduced transpiration lower temperatures will obviously affect metabolic rate. Pretty much everything on earth slows growth when it gets cold for this reason. You can offset the loss of temperature transpiration somewhat with a fan blowing on the leaves (more wind evaporation, not cooling).
Another tip, if you are hand-watering into coco-perlite, you will see much faster growth with an automatic watering regime. If you're already doing that, try increasing the number of times you water but reducing the amount you water each time. A bit like drip feed. And if you autowater, you can then add an aquarium heater to your reservoir and that will make a big difference to plant metabolism in winter.
One final trick: vent your room/tent out the bottom so that the extractor fan pulls hot air rising off the heatsink down through the canopy and out the bottom of the grow area.
That's all I've got because frankly, I live in Australia and it doesn't get that cold.
lukio
Well-Known Member
does your environment actually change that much indoors? i reckon mines pretty stable here in England all year round. I run the lights at night
Strudelheim
Well-Known Member
I used to run at night for cooler temps. Now I run during days for hotter temps LOL. In my area electricity is a flat rate, inc. fees works out to $0.17 cad/ kwh
Strudelheim
Well-Known Member
Thanks for sharing that, I will take a look, that's pretty much the other point of this thread, seeing if anyone else is running or has done some runs at 70F range with ok results. At first I thought it was a light leak, but I'm not getting any bananas.
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
Mine does because we don't run central heating or airconditioning. My grow is also in a non-insulated part of the house. I've been adjusting nutes up and down to match the seasons ever since I switched to hydro.
hybridway2
Amare Shill
Stand in your room with lights off & sealed, let eyes acclimate & look hard for any light leaks or lit leds from the fans, AC or De-Hu.
hybridway2
Amare Shill
Ever considered the 4x8' sheets or 3x5' of reflective 3/8-3/4" foam insul-board they carry at home depot or lowes?
lukio
Well-Known Member
ah yeah that'll do it!
your climate, like the wild life, are a touch more extreme too. When i was a tree surgeon i was offered mega bucks to climb trees out your way. told em em to get lost, fuck that ahaha. just chillin in Aus is dangerous.
Strudelheim
Well-Known Member
Heya Mate!
Thanks for the great post. Just the type of info I love getting.
Actually growing in pro mix HP, so 70% peat moss, 30% perlite. Whats interesting about this run is I have 12 LGB clone, and have them in groups of 3. I put 4 into NEW promix, 4 into recycled/re used pro mix, and 4 into a recycled mix that has some organics in it. Then within each group of 4, one I feed every watering at 700ppm, the other 3 at 600ppm, out of those, one I have also added 20% EWC into the soil mix, and another I feed compost teas 2x during veg.
My tap water ppm is 210ppm. I PH it to 6, and it drifts up a couple points thereafter which Im ok with. My run off is 6.4 consistently. I currently use remo nutrients. Canadian brand.
I also measure the runoff of each plant after every watering, about a cup of run off. I then track these numbers to see if there is any buildup or reduction or staying equal. Organics really skew the numbers, so I just keep a watch in which direction the number is going to see if there is a reduction in ppms, or a buildup. I really should just be doing hydro, Im a meticulous numbers guy!
A few things I have learned is that all plants look equally happy across the board. The plants with higher ppms aren't doing better in any regards to my current problems. Since I have so many variables and I am getting similar issues, I would be inclined that my issue is not related to anything nutrient/ph related.
I do have a fan on them, 16" Hurricane, using 43 Watts, on the lowest setting, oscillating. It moves all leaves pretty hard. I wouldn't want it to be any harder than currently. It moves air around the room so well, that when I moved my exhaust from the ground to higher up, the overall room temps did not change at all. But I will keep that in mind for when I build a room in the future.
For autowatering, I would love to automate this. I actually have a disability so daily labour is becoming not fun. Problem is I have hardwood floors here and don't want the risk of any overflows. I know I can get large res trays etc, but I want to leave that for my new purpose built room. Im shutting down in a year here, and starting up in a new home.
Cheers!
Strudelheim
Well-Known Member
I actually just picked one of those up! I can basically put it up as a wall, and its light enough to just slide out of the room into the hallway to get access. better than panda film that I used to roll up and move out of the way all the time, I think. I put mylar film on it.
Strudelheim
Well-Known Member
I use the 1000 Hortilux super eye Bulbs. So thats what I have on them now, alongside the LEDS which are 2 of these, one on each end.
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Also my nighttime temps have probably been down to 60F, so also lower, but I figure the day temps are whats important more since thats when lights are on and photosynthesis is occurring. I figure outside things get way colder than 60F at night going down to 40-50 on the regular. I guess you see these numbers that are always saying this is the ideal range, but Im always thinking, ok what if I don't care about ideal, what will happen outside of that range. Hence I push into these unknown ranges. LOL
Strudelheim
Well-Known Member
This was Taken on April 1, So Day 20 Flower. First Pictures I showed were day 30.
This was yesterday, Day 35. 2 Days post HPS, 3 plants in the front are just finishing up on the outside for another week so ignore those.
This was yesterday, Day 35. 2 Days post HPS, 3 plants in the front are just finishing up on the outside for another week so ignore those.
OneHitDone
Well-Known Member
You might wanna take a peak at item # 5001671
hybridway2
Amare Shill
You should not have a problem with . Whenever I used water even a cloner over hardwood floors I put down a layer of rubber roofing on the floor 1st, roll up the edges of the wall 2" then I taped it & thumbtacked it to create a Pan.
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
OK, so don't get me wrong – the plants on the first page look good – but in these photos they do look a little hungry. Perhaps you underfed going into the stretch when the pants need a lot of nutrient – especially nitrogen and magnesium – or possibly it was being locked out by the drop in temperature, or probably a combination of both, but they need a bit more. Growers who have typically been growing under HIDs tend to underestimate the nutrient requirements of LED – I see that a lot in new LED grows. First the new growth starts to go lime green and maybe yellow a little from the base of the leaves outwards, then the lime green colour starts to progress a bit further down the plant. Growth is stunted and pots take longer to dry out. This is indicative of an immobile nutrient lockout, which will be Calcium (due to reduced transpiration) and other micronutrients including iron and sulphur. As it progresses further you'll see the middle leaves start to yellow (magnesium) which will progress between the veins and then rust patches from more serious calcium deficiency. The lockout can be partly pH related (too high) and/or temperature related (chelates fall out of suspension, reduced transpiration does not uptake calcium), or sometimes a lockout caused by too much potassium (especially in coco and peat moss). At 70% peat moss and 30% perlite, you're effectively running a run-to-waste hydro system like coco anyway, so nutrient demands may be higher than you think. I would bring the pH down to 5.7-5.8 too and let it naturally up drift – that's the sign of a healthy system. In any case, a chelated micronutrient solution (Mg, S, Fe, B, Cu, Mb, Mn etc) at 1ml per litre might be your friend. And regular run-off, too – I need to stress that. Don't let runoff sit in the catch trays and be reabsorbed back into the pot.
jimihendrix1
Well-Known Member
HID Bulb Test Comparison Review: Hortilux, Ushio, Digilux, Baddass, SolisTek, Lumatek, Maxlume, GrowLite, Ultra Sun
Conclusion-- Eye Hortilux Enhanced 1000 watt HPS came out the undisputed winner in this test being almost 10% better than the next best bulb. The Ushio and Digixlux, came in next very close to each other, and about another 10% above the rest of the pack
OneHitDone
Well-Known Member
If your talking about the dinosaur Growers House Test it aint the same bulb.
Also pairing the 2100umole lamp with a remote DE Ballast takes it to the next level
