No fuzz colloidal silver for making seeds
- Thread starter Daniel Lawton
- Start date
Ringsixty
Well-Known Member
Good points.
I just take a couple clones. Spray 1 b.i.d with CS , one week before flower. Flower both and boom you can make your seed stock and not worry about over spray., accident pollen release etc.
Daniel Lawton
Well-Known Member
Do you keep spraying until you see pods, or you trust to stop after 2 weeks?
Ringsixty
Well-Known Member
I start spraying 1 week before flowering. Then stop once I see the bananas forming. Takes about 2 weeks.
Daniel Lawton
Well-Known Member
So I still have a little paranoia. Let's say you see bananas forming, but you're using 24/7 lighting on an autoflower.
Is it possible to reverse the conversion so that you don't get enough pollen to pollinate a reasonable portion of that or another plant?
I have noticed the 24/7 keeps new white pistils coming all the way until the end, making it hard to judge harvest by color.
Is it possible to reverse the conversion so that you don't get enough pollen to pollinate a reasonable portion of that or another plant?
I have noticed the 24/7 keeps new white pistils coming all the way until the end, making it hard to judge harvest by color.
Ringsixty
Well-Known Member
No, It's an Auto. It's going to do what autos do, Reach its developed stage and flower. Done
Automatically mature in about seven weeks, regardless of photoperiod.
This is why I don't do autos. Can't control when I want to flower.
Just my personal preference.
Other growers love autos.
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Daniel Lawton
Well-Known Member
Well, a WARNING!!!! Turns out, without the Mr. Coffee filter heater pad, it could take 2 or more weeks using the 24VAC. I guess the previous times I tried it, there was still a little of the old colloidal in the water. I've heard of people leaving colloidal to speed things up, but in the case of using 24VAC, you really need to do that.
But with the heat, and with absolutely clean distilled water (I scrubbed the beaker also just to make sure), you can make colloidal overnight using 24VAC. It's not yet yellow, but another day or two would do that. In 24 hours you get a visible laser beam in room lighting.
So maybe, the 24VAC doesn't work well enough without heat, and perhaps that's why it's not a commonly used method.
The Mr. Coffee heater pads are fairly easy to get, and cost about $6 wi th taxes. But you have to cover the top of the beaker with plastic or the water will go down halfway overnight. And in case it comes up, yes it's ok to add fresh water to make up for evaporation.
I have 3 plants converted with this colloidal. Seemed to work better than my DC colloidal of the past.
But with the heat, and with absolutely clean distilled water (I scrubbed the beaker also just to make sure), you can make colloidal overnight using 24VAC. It's not yet yellow, but another day or two would do that. In 24 hours you get a visible laser beam in room lighting.
So maybe, the 24VAC doesn't work well enough without heat, and perhaps that's why it's not a commonly used method.
The Mr. Coffee heater pads are fairly easy to get, and cost about $6 wi th taxes. But you have to cover the top of the beaker with plastic or the water will go down halfway overnight. And in case it comes up, yes it's ok to add fresh water to make up for evaporation.
I have 3 plants converted with this colloidal. Seemed to work better than my DC colloidal of the past.
Daniel Lawton
Well-Known Member
Here's more measured results for using a Mr. Coffee heater ($5) under a 150mL beaker with 2 coils of silver wire and 24VAC. It started from pure distilled water with no addition of older colloidal. It ran until a very nice yellow color. TDS measurements are at room temp. They tend to read 3-4 higher if the colloidal water is still heated. There was no need to filter the colloidal after 4 days unattended operation. However, I did anyway. There was not enough residue to show in a picture or measure. As can be seen, the losses to the silver wire were also not measurable at .01g scale resolution.
Days Silver wire weight TDS Laser
0 13.51g 0 Not visible
1 13.51g 4 Visible in office lighting
2 13.51g 7 Very bright, can use it now
4 13.51g 18 Water now yellow as seen in pic, laser very bright
I've started a new experiment to NOT use the heater, since from distilled water and using 24VAC, that seems to take more than weeks. But the theory out there is, you can "prime" colloidal making by adding some from the last batch. I added just enough to get a TDS reading of 1 (perhaps 1/64th the volume of the last batch). We'll see if it can make colloidal fast enough to be practical without the heater.
Here's a pic of the colloidal's color after 4 days with heater. Note that the laser appears MUCH brighter in person.
x
Days Silver wire weight TDS Laser
0 13.51g 0 Not visible
1 13.51g 4 Visible in office lighting
2 13.51g 7 Very bright, can use it now
4 13.51g 18 Water now yellow as seen in pic, laser very bright
I've started a new experiment to NOT use the heater, since from distilled water and using 24VAC, that seems to take more than weeks. But the theory out there is, you can "prime" colloidal making by adding some from the last batch. I added just enough to get a TDS reading of 1 (perhaps 1/64th the volume of the last batch). We'll see if it can make colloidal fast enough to be practical without the heater.
Here's a pic of the colloidal's color after 4 days with heater. Note that the laser appears MUCH brighter in person.
xDaniel Lawton
Well-Known Member
Next batch that finishes I'm going to dilute in half, to see if the TDS is half. Then I'll dilute that in half, etc. So we can get an honest idea of what the TDS means for colloidal silver. Right now I can say, a TDS of 4 makes usable colloidal because the laser is clearly visible in office lighting.
Unfortunately, I just tossed out that nice yellow batch. I've got far too much colloidal from experimenting and didn't think of diluting it.
It really makes a huge difference for colloidal making, if you don't have to attend it and your electrodes don't wear down.
Unfortunately, I just tossed out that nice yellow batch. I've got far too much colloidal from experimenting and didn't think of diluting it.
It really makes a huge difference for colloidal making, if you don't have to attend it and your electrodes don't wear down.
Daniel Lawton
Well-Known Member
Here's the seeds resulting from that kind of colloidal silver. Plant 3 plants, spray one starting as soon as it's near to making buds (or after you see them, but spray more in that case). Put that plant between the other 2, and when shaking it a little shows a cloud of pollen, fluff all 3 together. This is from the 2 side plants, and weighs out to be 1800 seeds. However, it's poorly cleaned, so maybe there's 1000 good ones, 500 seeds per Amnesia Haze is easy to achieve.
Daniel Lawton
Well-Known Member
About not using the heater with 24VAC.
I tested it with 1/16th of the water being from a previous batch of strong colloidal (the one shown above). The laser was already slightly visible in room lighting, and the TDS was 1. It took 1 week before the laser was bright in room lights, and during that time the TDS only went up to 3. It seems as if the cold made colloidal reacts with the TDS meter a little differently. Some slight yellow color was visible after 11 days.
After that I ruthlessly cleaned everything, using only distilled water. TDS was 0, nothing was visible from the laser. It took 2 days for the TDS to reach 1, and 4 days before you could see the laser in the dark. To see the laser in room lighting took 4 days and the TDS was up to 2.
Conclusion: you can do without the heater if you don't mind waiting 20 days to get the yellow stuff. If you prime it with the last batch, you might make yellow stuff in 11 days.
If you're going on a trip, put a lid on the beaker (doesn't have to be perfect), and use the cold method. If you're in a hurry, use the heater but be warned you have to keep adding water once a day as it evaporates, even with a poorly fitting lid.
I tested it with 1/16th of the water being from a previous batch of strong colloidal (the one shown above). The laser was already slightly visible in room lighting, and the TDS was 1. It took 1 week before the laser was bright in room lights, and during that time the TDS only went up to 3. It seems as if the cold made colloidal reacts with the TDS meter a little differently. Some slight yellow color was visible after 11 days.
After that I ruthlessly cleaned everything, using only distilled water. TDS was 0, nothing was visible from the laser. It took 2 days for the TDS to reach 1, and 4 days before you could see the laser in the dark. To see the laser in room lighting took 4 days and the TDS was up to 2.
Conclusion: you can do without the heater if you don't mind waiting 20 days to get the yellow stuff. If you prime it with the last batch, you might make yellow stuff in 11 days.
If you're going on a trip, put a lid on the beaker (doesn't have to be perfect), and use the cold method. If you're in a hurry, use the heater but be warned you have to keep adding water once a day as it evaporates, even with a poorly fitting lid.
Daniel Lawton
Well-Known Member
Final followup: Electrode lasts an astoundingly long time using this method (longer than you'll live).
This beats using DC by a mile! AC is harder to set up, but once you have it, it's very trouble free.
The no heater version has been running more than a month continuously. I wanted to see if it ever produces a yellow color or any visible junk particles or sludge on the electrode.
No yellow color, but also no sludge or particles of any kind. Filtering it after 45 days leaves a completely white filter.
There's NO NEED to filter colloidal silver, unless you used DC to make it. DC is plagued with electrode burning and electroplate crystal formation.
With cold AC, the TDS goes up very slowly, but it does go up reliably. I'd say, 1 TDS point per week. But the laser is easily visible after a reading of 2, and that strength of colloidal made with AC works very well (have 800 seeds from this batch).
Electrode losses with continuous operation at room temperature, 24/7, using 24VAC for than 45 days:
The electrode started out weighting 13.51 grams. Now it weighs 13.50 grams, which is essentially 0 loss. The scale isn't accurate enough to measure that amount.
However, assuming a .01 gram loss per 45 days, that electrode will last at least 83 years and still be strong enough to hold its shape.
Besides saving your electrode from riding away on a wipes, it seems to make superior quality colloidal. Some sellers of AC machines claim that too, but it's fairly obvious from looking at it with a laser.
So you can stick a cold 24VAC colloidal silver making machine in a corner and leave it running your entire life. Just take some when you need it and put the water back.
But don't drink the coolaide...
This beats using DC by a mile! AC is harder to set up, but once you have it, it's very trouble free.
The no heater version has been running more than a month continuously. I wanted to see if it ever produces a yellow color or any visible junk particles or sludge on the electrode.
No yellow color, but also no sludge or particles of any kind. Filtering it after 45 days leaves a completely white filter.
There's NO NEED to filter colloidal silver, unless you used DC to make it. DC is plagued with electrode burning and electroplate crystal formation.
With cold AC, the TDS goes up very slowly, but it does go up reliably. I'd say, 1 TDS point per week. But the laser is easily visible after a reading of 2, and that strength of colloidal made with AC works very well (have 800 seeds from this batch).
Electrode losses with continuous operation at room temperature, 24/7, using 24VAC for than 45 days:
The electrode started out weighting 13.51 grams. Now it weighs 13.50 grams, which is essentially 0 loss. The scale isn't accurate enough to measure that amount.
However, assuming a .01 gram loss per 45 days, that electrode will last at least 83 years and still be strong enough to hold its shape.
Besides saving your electrode from riding away on a wipes, it seems to make superior quality colloidal. Some sellers of AC machines claim that too, but it's fairly obvious from looking at it with a laser.
So you can stick a cold 24VAC colloidal silver making machine in a corner and leave it running your entire life. Just take some when you need it and put the water back.
But don't drink the coolaide...
Blue man, ha "Smurf"
Daniel Lawton
Well-Known Member
Yea, you really need the Mr. Coffee cup heater. They're probably under $10 at some discount places like Walmart. I believe I got one at Fry's for $5.
With the heat, it can still take up to 3 days to get a nice yellow color. But once you have a yellow color, only use 3/4ths of it, and add water to make more. It goes faster if you already have some in there.
Or let the cold run a couple of weeks, so you have some primer. The nice thing about it is, it doesn't eat the electrode in any measurable way, and doesn't leave crystals or electode burn.
Biggest problem with the 24VAC is that you need the first wire to follow the second wire in a spiral, or you don't have enough surface area. If you just stuck 2 wires in there, that's going to take a long time. Better to rever to DC and let the electrode burn.
By the way, if you're doing autoflowers and got hooked on 24/7 lighting, it seems that the wiser folks among us are right. You need at least 4 hours of no light. I never believed it, because I've grown nearly 100 plants on 24/7. But the 4 hours minimum was what I had at first, and I never had trouble converting one to male with colloidal. With 24/7, it won't convert until the bitter end, too late for useful pollen. Now I just use 12/12 all the time, and the yield doesn't seem to be effected.
So get a mechanical timer at Home Depot if you don't already have such a thing. $10 if you look the shelf over very well. Don't need the $30 ones.
I've been testing STS lately. It does indeed convert a little better. But it goes stale very fast A month is all it's good for, and some autoflowers like Northern Berry (northern lights + blueberry), seem to need a little more than a month of spraying every 10 days.
I'll put in my 2 cents on the toxicity of silver. Nonsense. I don't know how that got started. I looked up STS, and it's barely toxic. In that small quantity, seems silly to worry about it. The colloidal? How coudl that be poisonous? You likely inhale that much silver in less than a month, just from dust in the air. If it were dangerous, people living near silver mines would have shown some statistical risk to it.
But, just get some 91% isopropyl and make a whole plant extraction, make some gummies, and call it a day. In that case, there's no reason to worry about the silver. In my opinion that is.
With the heat, it can still take up to 3 days to get a nice yellow color. But once you have a yellow color, only use 3/4ths of it, and add water to make more. It goes faster if you already have some in there.
Or let the cold run a couple of weeks, so you have some primer. The nice thing about it is, it doesn't eat the electrode in any measurable way, and doesn't leave crystals or electode burn.
Biggest problem with the 24VAC is that you need the first wire to follow the second wire in a spiral, or you don't have enough surface area. If you just stuck 2 wires in there, that's going to take a long time. Better to rever to DC and let the electrode burn.
By the way, if you're doing autoflowers and got hooked on 24/7 lighting, it seems that the wiser folks among us are right. You need at least 4 hours of no light. I never believed it, because I've grown nearly 100 plants on 24/7. But the 4 hours minimum was what I had at first, and I never had trouble converting one to male with colloidal. With 24/7, it won't convert until the bitter end, too late for useful pollen. Now I just use 12/12 all the time, and the yield doesn't seem to be effected.
So get a mechanical timer at Home Depot if you don't already have such a thing. $10 if you look the shelf over very well. Don't need the $30 ones.
I've been testing STS lately. It does indeed convert a little better. But it goes stale very fast A month is all it's good for, and some autoflowers like Northern Berry (northern lights + blueberry), seem to need a little more than a month of spraying every 10 days.
I'll put in my 2 cents on the toxicity of silver. Nonsense. I don't know how that got started. I looked up STS, and it's barely toxic. In that small quantity, seems silly to worry about it. The colloidal? How coudl that be poisonous? You likely inhale that much silver in less than a month, just from dust in the air. If it were dangerous, people living near silver mines would have shown some statistical risk to it.
But, just get some 91% isopropyl and make a whole plant extraction, make some gummies, and call it a day. In that case, there's no reason to worry about the silver. In my opinion that is.
Daniel Lawton
Well-Known Member
The paranoid guy's. If you run into it, you'll know who I mean. I don't have the complicated mixing instructions for parts A and B, because really, just dump it in there and make sure it's dissolved before you use them. If you feel like stirring it to a 90s song on the radio, be my guest.
But as my sister said (PhD running large ag. departments), "those marijuana guys are idiots!" (That must include her brother too).
One good thing about that guy was he included links to buy big dark brown glass bottles with decent plastic lids to hold the solutions, and also a sprayer capable of holding the 800ml mixed solution, with a separate lid. You really need good bottles if you want to get into this. But it turned out, the bottles came from China on a slow boat.
Decent bottles though. You just can't hate the Chinese despite the raw deal they give us on trade. They make such good stuff for so cheap!
STS Part A:
0.5 grams silver nitrate
500ml distilled water
Keep in fridge.
STS Part B:
2.5 grams Anhydrous Sodium Thiosulfate
(Formula NA2S2O3)
500ml distilled water
Keep in fridge.
1 Quart spray solution:
50ml part B in mixer cup using 60cc syringe B.
Gently add 50ml of Part A using syringe A,
while stirring with stainless steel stirrer.
Go for a 30 second mixing rate.
Add to 1 quart spray bottle and fill rest of
the way with distilled water (800ml+ more).
Add 6-10 drops of Dawn Ultra dish soap to make
it stick better to leaves. Solution is now 1:9.
Spray once every 5 days for a month.
Spray when lights are off.
Saturate all the nodes. Don’t get any on the dirt.
Dilute if signs of burning. Keep in fridge.
***************************************
Ignore the "don't get any on the dirt". This guy even believed if he sprayed his hands, they'd be cold for several days. Just spray away, and while you're at it use it for a breath freshner.
That was a joke. If you come out blue, don't complain to me.
But as my sister said (PhD running large ag. departments), "those marijuana guys are idiots!" (That must include her brother too).
One good thing about that guy was he included links to buy big dark brown glass bottles with decent plastic lids to hold the solutions, and also a sprayer capable of holding the 800ml mixed solution, with a separate lid. You really need good bottles if you want to get into this. But it turned out, the bottles came from China on a slow boat.
Decent bottles though. You just can't hate the Chinese despite the raw deal they give us on trade. They make such good stuff for so cheap!
STS Part A:
0.5 grams silver nitrate
500ml distilled water
Keep in fridge.
STS Part B:
2.5 grams Anhydrous Sodium Thiosulfate
(Formula NA2S2O3)
500ml distilled water
Keep in fridge.
1 Quart spray solution:
50ml part B in mixer cup using 60cc syringe B.
Gently add 50ml of Part A using syringe A,
while stirring with stainless steel stirrer.
Go for a 30 second mixing rate.
Add to 1 quart spray bottle and fill rest of
the way with distilled water (800ml+ more).
Add 6-10 drops of Dawn Ultra dish soap to make
it stick better to leaves. Solution is now 1:9.
Spray once every 5 days for a month.
Spray when lights are off.
Saturate all the nodes. Don’t get any on the dirt.
Dilute if signs of burning. Keep in fridge.
***************************************
Ignore the "don't get any on the dirt". This guy even believed if he sprayed his hands, they'd be cold for several days. Just spray away, and while you're at it use it for a breath freshner.
That was a joke. If you come out blue, don't complain to me.
Daniel Lawton
Well-Known Member
Oh yea, he also had the 60ml syringes. You get a 2 or 4 pack, so it's perfect. Suck up 50ml, and it won't even leak or cause you trouble. Just keep the A syringe separate from the B syringe, so you don't have to worry about contamination.