New to LEDs

hey guys I know someone's going to tell me to search. But I have. So many options my head is spun. I need a LED unit that puts out like a 1khps in a 5x5 Scrog. I don't want the heat again when I'm up and running. But idk if I should be spending crazy cash on an led unit
 
Just wait for reputable vendors to start putting out products using the Cree Horticultural Reference Design:

http://www.cree.com/~/media/Files/Cree/LED-Components-and-Modules/XLamp/XLamp-Reference-Designs/HorticultureReferenceDesign.pdf?la=en

The reference design has been constructed with the goal of 1k HPS replacement using LEDs and comes in at roughly 50% power usage for a similar density of light.

Cree is recommending to use discrete emitters rather than the CoB emitter setups many promote here. It is probably the smarter idea to go with what an LED manufacturer recommends rather than the suggestions from unqualified posters on public forums. The vendors here apparently don't even properly test their products and only use spreadsheets to determine performance. Any evidence they provide is anecdotal, highly subjective, often using non-relevant measurements and qualitative references that are completely unscientific.

You should always check to see if the vendor has the proper certifications, undergoes any third party validation testing (or even at least test themselves) and is financial viable as an entity to be able to handle warranty and liability claims.

Aside from the safety concerns from faulty manufacturing, non-certified products may cause significant problems with insurance in the case of a fire. Good luck explaining to an insurance adjuster about how you got the faulty grow lamp from some fly by night vendor pushing product on a pot forum.
 

BM9AGS

Well-Known Member
Led companies

Here's what I think is an all inclusive list of good cob led companies.

Artificial sun specialty- contact for inquiries
http://artificialsunspecialty.mysimplestore.com/

Northern Grow Lights
https://northerngrowlights.com/

Timber grow lights
http://timbergrowlights.com/?gclid=...jb6nburqI7waoSORMPToAQRqH6IEcl1rCEaAlT88P8HAQ

Johnson grow lights
Discount code for 20% is rollitup20
http://johnsongrowlights.com/index.php

Pacific lights concept
https://www.pacificlightconcepts.com

heavenbright.
http://www.heavenbright.com

TASTYLED
http://www.tastyled.com

Optic grow lights
http://opticgrowlights.com

GOGREENLEDS
Discount code for 15% is RIU15
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_c_0_3?url=search-alias=aps&field-keywords=cxb3070&sprefix=cxb,aps,198
 

Kempo

Active Member
Dont listen this new mad angry member, he tried to sell us some scammy stuff. Anyway it will be good to see the offers on this public post not pm with some explanation because im interested too.
 

BM9AGS

Well-Known Member
Just wait for reputable vendors to start putting out products using the Cree Horticultural Reference Design:

http://www.cree.com/~/media/Files/Cree/LED-Components-and-Modules/XLamp/XLamp-Reference-Designs/HorticultureReferenceDesign.pdf?la=en

The reference design has been constructed with the goal of 1k HPS replacement using LEDs and comes in at roughly 50% power usage for a similar density of light.

Cree is recommending to use discrete emitters rather than the CoB emitter setups many promote here. It is probably the smarter idea to go with what an LED manufacturer recommends rather than the suggestions from unqualified posters on public forums. The vendors here apparently don't even properly test their products and only use spreadsheets to determine performance. Any evidence they provide is anecdotal, highly subjective, often using non-relevant measurements and qualitative references that are completely unscientific.

You should always check to see if the vendor has the proper certifications, undergoes any third party validation testing (or even at least test themselves) and is financial viable as an entity to be able to handle warranty and liability claims.

Aside from the safety concerns from faulty manufacturing, non-certified products may cause significant problems with insurance in the case of a fire. Good luck explaining to an insurance adjuster about how you got the faulty grow lamp from some fly by night vendor pushing product on a pot forum.
Song for you:

I'm sorry buddy. Buy your iPhone light meter and let us know all its awesomeness
 

BM9AGS

Well-Known Member
hey guys I know someone's going to tell me to search. But I have. So many options my head is spun. I need a LED unit that puts out like a 1khps in a 5x5 Scrog. I don't want the heat again when I'm up and running. But idk if I should be spending crazy cash on an led unit
I had the same goal. So I got 4 of timber grow lights DIY kits. And it crushed a gavita de for a 5x5
 

Olive Drab Green

Well-Known Member
hey guys I know someone's going to tell me to search. But I have. So many options my head is spun. I need a LED unit that puts out like a 1khps in a 5x5 Scrog. I don't want the heat again when I'm up and running. But idk if I should be spending crazy cash on an led unit
Get a ViparSpectra V450. Perfectly between a 300 and 600 and only $149 on Amazon. I'm having good results.
 

Airwalker16

Well-Known Member
Led companies

Here's what I think is an all inclusive list of good cob led companies.

Artificial sun specialty- contact for inquiries
http://artificialsunspecialty.mysimplestore.com/

Northern Grow Lights
https://northerngrowlights.com/

Timber grow lights
http://timbergrowlights.com/?gclid=...jb6nburqI7waoSORMPToAQRqH6IEcl1rCEaAlT88P8HAQ

Johnson grow lights
Discount code for 20% is rollitup20
http://johnsongrowlights.com/index.php

Pacific lights concept
https://www.pacificlightconcepts.com

heavenbright.
http://www.heavenbright.com

TASTYLED
http://www.tastyled.com

Optic grow lights
http://opticgrowlights.com

GOGREENLEDS
Discount code for 15% is RIU15
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_c_0_3?url=search-alias=aps&field-keywords=cxb3070&sprefix=cxb,aps,198
July4th discount code for GoGreenLEDs right now for 30% THIRTY PERCENT OFF
 

BM9AGS

Well-Known Member
Get a ViparSpectra V450. Perfectly between a 300 and 600 and only $149 on Amazon. I'm having good results.
Flower for 675 ppfd center reading...... The par graph is impossible. So they just replicated their highest readings. At 24" it'll flower a 1' x 1' square.....very poorly

200 watts of likely worse efficiency than hid.

I'm sure a plant or 2 look fine in veg under them. But no
 

BOBBY_G

Well-Known Member
Im gonna address all the points of clownshoes who has been a member here for all of 3 days

Just wait for reputable vendors to start putting out products using the Cree Horticultural Reference Design:

http://www.cree.com/~/media/Files/Cree/LED-Components-and-Modules/XLamp/XLamp-Reference-Designs/HorticultureReferenceDesign.pdf?la=en

The reference design has been constructed with the goal of 1k HPS replacement using LEDs and comes in at roughly 50% power usage for a similar density of light.
and failed miserably by making the assumption that a 553W @1.82 PPF/W in a sphere is equivalent to 1000W @ 1.72 PPF/W, effectively discounting 100% of the light the HPS was casting outside of the 4x4 area


Cree is recommending to use discrete emitters rather than the CoB emitter setups many promote here. It is probably the smarter idea to go with what an LED manufacturer recommends rather than the suggestions from unqualified posters on public forums.
because of cree's extensive experience in real-world horticultural applications? oh wait, they have none.

The vendors here apparently don't even properly test their products and only use spreadsheets to determine performance. Any evidence they provide is anecdotal, highly subjective, often using non-relevant measurements and qualitative references that are completely unscientific.
when you say unscientific, do you mean interpreting manufacturer data sheets according to the well-known laws of physics?

when you say dont properly test their productsm do you mean that there should be some additional tests beyond light intensity, light pattern, spectum measurement, and real-world efficiency that were unaware of? please enlighten us.

You should always check to see if the vendor has the proper certifications, undergoes any third party validation testing (or even at least test themselves) and is financial viable as an entity to be able to handle warranty and liability claims.
in other words, go with just about any of the vendors recommended in post 2, all of which have been around for awhile, and have actual products out ther ein teh community that people have used and evaluated

Aside from the safety concerns from faulty manufacturing, non-certified products may cause significant problems with insurance in the case of a fire. Good luck explaining to an insurance adjuster about how you got the faulty grow lamp from some fly by night vendor pushing product on a pot forum.
yes the fly by nights are the worst here. i would 100% discount any advice offered here by people who just joined, with a yet-unclear agenda. Or maybe you should stick to "legitimate" companies like mars, kind, spectrum king, etc.
 
Dont listen this new mad angry member, he tried to sell us some scammy stuff. Anyway it will be good to see the offers on this public post not pm with some explanation because im interested too.
Angry? About?

Tried to sell scammy stuff? Uh no, I asked if anyone had any experience with a model of spectrometer. The only responses were from unqualified people who didn't use the product and trolling responses from cheerleaders in the peanut gallery. A spectrometer is used to measure light properties in real time which is much more realistic than what some random guy on a forum claims; they seemed pretty upset about that so you might be confused as to who is angry.

I guess I can see why the 'CoB cabal' on this forum would be upset as any challenges to what they assume to be true is considered a threat to their little business. After all, people who don't verify vendor claims are ripe for picking and to avoid such pitfalls it is best to make yourself an 'educated consumer' and do your research. A pretty big red flag for any vendor is one that can't back up their claims with real world testing using standardized measurement.

Anyhow, I posted a link to the manufacturer's design reference of the components these vendors are using in their products. That manufacturer says to use something completely different than what is being promoted here and sold by vendors. As I said in my original post, It is probably best to go with what the manufacturer recommends rather than some unqualified recommendation from some random person on a public forum. Fairly reasonable advice regardless of what product you are looking at.

Also, none of the vendors listed in the post after mine have any independent third party testing or certifications for their products - as a consumer that alone should raise some flags. Once again, fairly reasonable advice regardless of what product you are looking at.

But hey, if you want to spend your money on some fly by night companies run by some shady individuals then by all means follow their recommendations. It is your time and money, do what you want with it.
 

BOBBY_G

Well-Known Member
Angry? About?

Tried to sell scammy stuff? Uh no, I asked if anyone had any experience with a model of spectrometer. The only responses were from unqualified people who didn't use the product and trolling responses from cheerleaders in the peanut gallery. A spectrometer is used to measure light properties in real time
yes we know, weve been using them around here for quite some time. while the cost keeps them out of reach of many, youre hard pressed to find components and commercial fixtures that havent had spectrums run by either mfrs, vendors, or users.

A pretty big red flag for any vendor is one that can't back up their claims with real world testing using standardized measurement.
agreed. thank god we have no shortage of reputable vendors around here



Also, none of the vendors listed in the post after mine have any independent third party testing or certifications for their products - as a consumer that alone should raise some flags. Once again, fairly reasonable advice regardless of what product you are looking at.

But hey, if you want to spend your money on some fly by night companies run by some shady individuals then by all means follow their recommendations. It is your time and money, do what you want with it.
says the guy modding cheap chinese fixtures from ebay who doesnt even own a par meter or spectrometer
 

BOBBY_G

Well-Known Member
hey guys I know someone's going to tell me to search. But I have. So many options my head is spun. I need a LED unit that puts out like a 1khps in a 5x5 Scrog. I don't want the heat again when I'm up and running. But idk if I should be spending crazy cash on an led unit
if youre replacing a single ended (mogul) HPS, 600W of medium driven (~50% efficiency) cobs should cover it. and there are any number of options as seen in 3rd post
 

JorgeGonzales

Well-Known Member
Cree reference design: ~1006 PPF
Gavita 1000W: ~1830 PPF

Only numbers that matter. Only two they fail to list or compare. Pure fucking derp. And 4K + 660nm? That's their big contribution?

I guess if you are an asshole with a 4x4 tray surrounded by black walls, Cree has you covered.

Sorry op, I don't know what you should buy, but I do know you shouldn't listen to anybody telling you to wait for somebody to build this Cree whatever.
 

testiclees

Well-Known Member
Angry? About?

Tried to sell scammy stuff? Uh no, I asked if anyone had any experience with a model of spectrometer. The only responses were from unqualified people who didn't use the product and trolling responses from cheerleaders in the peanut gallery. A spectrometer is used to measure light properties in real time which is much more realistic than what some random guy on a forum claims; they seemed pretty upset about that so you might be confused as to who is angry.

I guess I can see why the 'CoB cabal' on this forum would be upset as any challenges to what they assume to be true is considered a threat to their little business. After all, people who don't verify vendor claims are ripe for picking and to avoid such pitfalls it is best to make yourself an 'educated consumer' and do your research. A pretty big red flag for any vendor is one that can't back up their claims with real world testing using standardized measurement.

Anyhow, I posted a link to the manufacturer's design reference of the components these vendors are using in their products. That manufacturer says to use something completely different than what is being promoted here and sold by vendors. As I said in my original post, It is probably best to go with what the manufacturer recommends rather than some unqualified recommendation from some random person on a public forum. Fairly reasonable advice regardless of what product you are looking at.

Also, none of the vendors listed in the post after mine have any independent third party testing or certifications for their products - as a consumer that alone should raise some flags. Once again, fairly reasonable advice regardless of what product you are looking at.

But hey, if you want to spend your money on some fly by night companies run by some shady individuals then by all means follow their recommendations. It is your time and money, do what you want with it.
Bro your blather is a pile of hysterical bull shit. The critical, well documented fact that all of us are killing it cannot be refuted. You ignored the most important critetia because youre talking out of your ass.
 
I am certain that Cree has quite a bit invested for resources into horticultural applications of their products. Resources like qualified personnel with degrees and the labs containing the equipment to properly test their products. You know, the things that most vendors have as part of their r&d programs.

On the flip side there are you guys. Median education level is what, maybe grade 10? Majority of which are drug dealers? Some who are self proclaimed antisemitic and others that routinely threaten violence?

I think I will stick to the recommendations of an established manufacturer just as would any sensible person.

Apparently I opened up a sore spot with the CoB crowd asking for real world validation testing. Guess they have something to hide or they would be flaunting the results like the gospel.

In regards to to the modification of chinese fixtures, sure I buy and test a lot of products including some of the CoB products advertised here. In general the chinese products were of much better manufacturing quality than the DiY based offerings coming out of america. As is the case with most american products, the workmanship is sub standard but it is even worse with products that require manual assembly. This is why the scientific community generally chooses america as the last resort for sourcing sensitive measuring devices.

Oh what else. Yes physics. Why don't we pick up the discussion once you get a physics degree? Attaining higher education is always good for personal growth and then you would know why you should vacate your position in the discussion. It is often difficult discussing science with laymen; fundamentals like the scientific method are often too complex for them to grasp.

As I said in my thread on spectrometers, I came asking for feedback and advice, not selling or promoting any product. My mistake in thinking that you guys might actually know something useful.

Could not care less what any of you think but please continue on as this is now quite entertaining. Mind you it could be simply resolved if the vendors would undergo standardized testing of their products. But apparently that is too much to ask.
 
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