Looking to up my bubble game!

Discussion in 'DWC/ Bubbleponics' started by Tstat, Feb 13, 2018.

  1.  
    Cold$moke

    Cold$moke Well-Known Member

    Silence mortal you are in the presence of greatness;)

    I spent 50 bucks to know you need clean air from outside of the grow (if sealed with co2)

    Sure glad it didnt cost me 250k
     
    Lordhooha likes this.
  2.  
    ANC

    ANC Well-Known Member

    [​IMG]

    If I were trying to keep water oxygenated, I'd use one of these hang-on aquarium filters. They form a wide waterfall on the outlet That exposes a large area of new water to the air for gas exchange, then dropping it deep under the water surface again while pushing old water up. Fill it with a bunch of ceramic media, sandwiched between 1/4" batting or filter floss, to improve performance. Bacteria will grow in it that will convert ammonia (which is the first thing organic stuff gives off when they die) into nitrates and those into nitrites. You could, in theory, create a nice stable water environment that is not friendly to slime, mold and harmful bacteria. Any fraction of food supplied by bacteria is going to come at a lower cost to the plant than sequestering it from a chemical source.
     
  3.  
    HydroEnthused

    HydroEnthused Active Member

    Airflow matters when the OP is looking to up his bubble game. The highest level of bubbles is when no matter where you poke a hole in the lid of the DWC bin, there will always be bubbles bursting above the water line to keep a seedling or clone hydrated. When you achieve the pinnacle of aeration you don’t even need a top feed timed drip even for a new seedling in a jiffy pellet.
     
  4.  
    HydroEnthused

    HydroEnthused Active Member

    It is always topped off. I mentioned in an earlier post in this thread that it is topped off automatically.
     
  5.  
    HydroEnthused

    HydroEnthused Active Member

    That will work great for a conventional system that has plumbing connected each DWC bin together. But if somebody wanted the option of not plumbing the DWC bins together (because it’s not necessary) you would use air stones. Your method cannot work for isolated bins. Also, your method does not do anything to up the bubble game of the OP. That method does not create a plethora of bursting bubbles above the water line of a DWC bin.
    The reason why you want isolated bins that are not plumbed together is because you only want the air bubbles traveling upward without any cross current pulling water into a pipe (as in a recirculating system) to get the most bubbles to pop above the waterline without any interference.
    Also, you never need to check or pH your nutrient solution after the first preparation before it enters your DWC system if you adjust properly enough that the pH stays between the 5.5-6.5 range for 7-10 days. Mine stays that way for about 2 weeks in early flowering but for as little as 7 days in late flowering.
    One of the greatest masters, Heath Robinson, never checked anything between a 7 day interval. I learned this from him. He had stability because he used 100% inorganic nutrients in his systems, weather or not they were recirculating.
    Think about it, if you could have multiple DWC bins that are automatically topped off and automatically water changed, why wouldn’t you want that? Heath Robinson proved beyond the shadow of any doubt that you don’t need to check anything in between water changes. When a DWC master (such as Heath) shows repeatedly that a certain method works (without checking between water changes) I’m gonna weigh his posts with almost the same importance as (for example) a respected journal of a scientific discipline.
    Furthermore, when you use isolated bins (besides getting maximum bubbles) you are able to add more or less nutrient to each container depending on which strain you are running by simply allowing a different time delayed cut out of the dosing system for when a particular holding tank is filled to supply change water for 1 or more DWC bins.
    Total control. Automatically. My system saves 10 man hours of labor per week just on the water change aspect and automatically tops off each container (without a float switch, rather a different level sensor that cannot get hung up or fail under the conditions of use) whenever there is a 1-1/2” difference in water line height. Believe it or not, it’s kind of easy to set up for smaller grows.
    Also, there is never ever any need to scrub the inside of the containers. The solution to pollution is dilution. Just do the water changes frequently, keep the undersides of the ceramic air discs super clean with super clean air and that little bit of slime that builds up on the surface of the air stone will not diminish performance.
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2018
  6.  
    Lordhooha

    Lordhooha Well-Known Member

    So each of your 36 sites are automatically topped off and you don’t check them. So you don’t adjust ph or check ec? Your method seems overly complicated for no reason.
     
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  7.  
    ANC

    ANC Well-Known Member

    Yes, It would increase dissolved O2, but also yes, it won't help as much for making a spray above the water. Although it doesn't create no spray. I have a glass cover over my tanks, partially because there is quite a bit of backsplash.
     
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  8.  
    HydroEnthused

    HydroEnthused Active Member

    No. You’re system creates more labor. Mine eliminates labor. My system eliminates complication by eliminating labor. How are you gonna check 54 containers? You would need to be there frequently. I can sometimes stay away from the operation for as long as 2 weeks. That is completely hands free. Quite the opposite of complication.
     
  9.  
    Lordhooha

    Lordhooha Well-Known Member

    All of them plumbed to one res. Check said res. Adjust as needed check again. 2 to however many checked in minutes. Just know how quickly your pump cycles water through your system.
     
  10.  
    Tstat

    Tstat Well-Known Member

    Well, I don't know about all this, but here is what mine looks like today:
    [​IMG]
    Here is a little video of the root zone. I don't know... lots of bubbles:

    And here is closeup of Goji OG, 4 weeks in:
    [​IMG]
     
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  11.  
    Lordhooha

    Lordhooha Well-Known Member

    Plants look happy happy happy
     
  12.  
    Tstat

    Tstat Well-Known Member

    Yea thanks, seems to be dialed in nicely, ATM. This is a 6 tote recirculating system built on the CC Under Current 6XL idea. It's a 7x3 space and lit by 800 watts of assorted cobs.
     
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  13.  
    HydroEnthused

    HydroEnthused Active Member

    I meant to write 54 containers that are not plumbed together.
    Looks like you have an excellent grow journal in the works Tstat.
     
  14.  
    Lordhooha

    Lordhooha Well-Known Member

    That’s where you faltered. Your running a large grow without them being plumbed together. In all reality your set yourself up for more work. I’m not sure how you don’t realize this? Even if I had 54 soil container grows they would be hooked up to a central res and drip rings installed. Your over complicating things. Your grow sounds Interesting to say the least. I imagine your growing in a warehouse am I correct. I’d like to see a picture of your grow to see how your system and you plants look.
     
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  15.  
    HydroEnthused

    HydroEnthused Active Member

    So, not doing water changes or topoff (automatically done) is more work in your reasoning? Tell me, what color is the sky in your world?
    All of your pH checking, manual water changes and manual top offs are work...a lot for that matter. I do not do this work. You do. Therefore your system is far far more work than mind. Automation takes work to install but saves a ton of work in the long run. It also gives you more stability because everything gets done on time and eliminates the possibility of human error. Granted, some people have no business setting up automation if they do not know how to properly apply materials and wiring methods, but for those of us that do , life becomes much easier and properly applied (meaning reliable after years of testing) automation can be scaled up to meet the demands of extremely vast indoor operations. In doing so many many jobs are lost. Exactly what a true grow boss is aiming for.
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2018
  16.  
    Lordhooha

    Lordhooha Well-Known Member

    Well one I don’t run a sterile res i run bennies in my system, I change my water out once to three times during any given grow. As I stated before I have my res on a float valve that tops off as water drops. I’ve yet to run into any root rot or any issue running my system. Tell me how is it easier to run 54 separate containers. Most commercial grows of any sort rely on a central res that are plumbed together to make maintenance easier. Checking your ph and ec is easier being connected. What color is your sky? Because you sound as if Offended I question your method?
     
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  17.  
    HydroEnthused

    HydroEnthused Active Member

    Not offended at all just amazed that you cannot believe that a DWC container needs no checking whatsoever with automation. The secret to making it work is a special level sensor in each container that is failure proof no matter what. That is the only thing I will never tell you. I will never tell anybody which sensor to use to achieve automatic and disconnected DWC because it is something that you can figure out for yourself if you experiment to see which water level sensor never fails.
    It took me about 2 months to figure that out back in 2002 when I wasn’t even doing anything grow related. DWC containers do not need any checking, topping off, connected recirculating plumbing, manually performed water changes or any human intervention whatsoever for at least a week (after an automatic water change hands free) but sometimes up to 2 weeks in early flower and easily a month in the veg stage.
     
  18.  
    Lordhooha

    Lordhooha Well-Known Member

    Gotcha you’ve got the secret sauce that makes your system run without checking anything. My top off is mechanical same as a toilet float pretty much. No electrical wiring needed. Oh and I only need one float valve to your 54. Also mine is fail proof I’ve seen float valves work for 50+ years. So tell me though how do you check you ph and ppm/ec? Still haven’t enlightened we peasants with your clearly superior knowledge. Or do you just use hillbilly guesstimating on where they sit. If your method works so well why do commercial hydro growers not use it? Lol dude your funny at least.
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2018
  19.  
    Cold$moke

    Cold$moke Well-Known Member

    Dude you sound like a tard




    Snap a pic of your setup for critique why dont you :)



    The problem isnt that dwc doesnt work

    Its that it was cool 10 years ago people have found the flaws and moved on

    Only an idiot would pay 250k to learn how to keep air clean :)
    Holy shit dude are you captain obvious?

    Check out any cloner if you want to see bubbles bursting ;)


    If you cant swallow that airstones and pumps suck power and put out heat im sorry for you bro
     
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  20.  
    Cold$moke

    Cold$moke Well-Known Member

    Here i found the old thread(edit to add thisnis not my post)

    The results are IN!

    PH 6.2
    PPM 820
    Measured in mg/l

    DO levels at 67F:
    Air stones: 8.0
    Ventruri: 8.0
    Water fall: 8.1
    Flooming: 7.9
    CapnStyle: 8.1
    All at the same time: 8.2

    DO levels at 78F:
    Air stones: 7.2
    Ventruri: 7.2
    Water fall: 7.3
    Flooming: 7.1
    CapnStyle: 7.3
    All at the same time: 7.4

    I also tried adding 5ml/gal of H2O2 at the request of sky in the warm water. This raised the DO to 7.6. Still, not even close to the DO levels in cooler water. 10 hours later I checked it again, and the DO was back down to 7.4 H2O2 is not a good solution.

    My hopes are crushed. I was hoping there would be a technique that would compensate for high water temps. If you have warm water, can you add more air to compensate? Nope. Take a look at the numbers. No matter how much air you add, you can't get DO levels past their saturation point.

    It's all about temp. I don't care if you if you use 100 airstones or a hot tub venturi, water has a certain oxygen saturation point, at a certain temperature, and you can't get it any higher. All of the methods are acceptable methods. It is not possible to compensate for higher temps, by putting in more air.







    Again i have to add this so noobs wont read too much into this nonsense.


    This guy sounds like someone ive met here before real funny, makes smart sounding sentences that dont really say more then the obvious :)


    Comedy
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2018

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