Leaf diagnosis request - burn or deficiency?

I never said I don't buy ferts anymore. sandman is right about the amended super soil thing. Building grow space can be expensive, true enough. DaFreak takes segments of what I write and uses them out of context to support his own argument. Stupid.

polishpollack said:

I never said I don't buy ferts anymore. sandman is right about the amended super soil thing. Building grow space can be expensive, true enough. DaFreak takes segments of what I write and uses them out of context to support his own argument. Stupid.

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No worries I'm happy to read whatever is written and try to continue a civil conversation. Hope you have a pleasant new year.

What a train-wreck of a thread.
OP, you had 2 very knowledgeable members try to help you at the beginning of this thread.

Couple of quick things...
Your plants are presenting a typical cal lockout due to an ion imbalance.
Plants use a lot of calcium and its immobile. The lock up likely started awhile ago.
Your PPM/EC is too high. I didn't run the numbers, but just by cursing over what you listed, I can see you're likely adding way too much K
( cant recall if floranectar is magnesium sulfate or potassium sulfate.)
For the Si, if you foliar it you can get the added benefits of SI while keeping it in your regimen and dropping it from your reservoir.
I use Power Si or Mills Vitalize (original Aptus Facilitator) but I foliar because silicic acid is very reactive. I like these brands for Si because they provide a higher bioavailable percentage of SI along with some aminos. I drop this around wk 2 of bloom.

I think you already know you've gotta simplify your feed for your next run. Maybe try running just a solid base nutrient and hold off on the additives until you've dialed it in.
And remember, manufacture feed charts are designed to market products. Ditch em and go by your EC instead.
Understanding your elemental inputs will take you much farther.

Oh and FTR, Dynagro has been around for a long time. Its not marketed toward cannabis growers (a plus) and its a complete formula that many growers have success with. Check out the side by side comparisons homebrewer has done. They're a great read.

Dynagro is a more complete fert, hence why you can get away with just one bottle, at least until you know you need something else. I wouldn't say it isn't marketed toward cannabis as it's in many grow shops, or so it seems. I've never seen it sold anywhere but a grow shop, except amazon. I'd say the front of every container is marketed to sell the bottle. Interesting imagery that captures attention. You never really know what you're getting. Knowing what you need and then the contents of the product are important. Another good product years ago was called Supernatural. I think it might also be a part fert, but in crystalline form. You have to be careful about crystalized nutrient's as they tend to be pretty strong. Carefully watch your EC or ppm. I prefer ppm. The hard part about those numbers is they don't tell you what elements might be missing. You have to read the labels to see what there and what isn't.
I'm always curious as to how someone can come to these threads and pinpoint exactly what element is locked out without testing the nutrient level. How can anyone know for sure that it's calcium lockout? Tangerine, what proof do you see to say this?

The problem with Dyangro is that since is has calcium and phosphorus in the same container, those to elements bind to each and render each other useless. The form a white, flaky substance that drifts to the bottom of the container and can no longer be used by a plant. So you have to use the fertilizer rather quickly. Dynagro comes in 8 ounce bottles and one quart size. If you have a small grow, it might be best to just get the 8 oz bottle.

Tangerine_ said:

What a train-wreck of a thread.
OP, you had 2 very knowledgeable members try to help you at the beginning of this thread.

Couple of quick things...
Your plants are presenting a typical cal lockout due to an ion imbalance.
Plants use a lot of calcium and its immobile. The lock up likely started awhile ago.
Your PPM/EC is too high. I didn't run the numbers, but just by cursing over what you listed, I can see you're likely adding way too much K
( cant recall if floranectar is magnesium sulfate or potassium sulfate.)
For the Si, if you foliar it you can get the added benefits of SI while keeping it in your regimen and dropping it from your reservoir.
I use Power Si or Mills Vitalize (original Aptus Facilitator) but I foliar because silicic acid is very reactive. I like these brands for Si because they provide a higher bioavailable percentage of SI along with some aminos. I drop this around wk 2 of bloom.

I think you already know you've gotta simplify your feed for your next run. Maybe try running just a solid base nutrient and hold off on the additives until you've dialed it in.
And remember, manufacture feed charts are designed to market products. Ditch em and go by your EC instead.
Understanding your elemental inputs will take you much farther.

Oh and FTR, Dynagro has been around for a long time. Its not marketed toward cannabis growers (a plus) and its a complete formula that many growers have success with. Check out the side by side comparisons homebrewer has done. They're a great read.

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I'll be honest, i had some very knowledgeable and friendly people DM me with some advice and I've just been following up on the thread. I do agree i way overdid it on the koolbloom and caused the lockout and all the issues to myself.

I will certainly checkout homebrewers threads, thanks for the recommendation.

polishpollack said:

How can anyone know for sure that it's calcium lockout? Tangerine, what proof do you see to say this?

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Look at the info sand gave and then look closely at his leaves.

sandman83 said:

I'll be honest, i had some very knowledgeable and friendly people DM me with some advice and I've just been following up on the thread. I do agree i way overdid it on the koolbloom and caused the lockout and all the issues to myself.

I will certainly checkout homebrewers threads, thanks for the recommendation.

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Right on.

sandman83 said:

Like the title states, plants are larger than I planned and might be rootbound in the 2 gal flo and gro. New system to me and been very long time so just looking for a 2nd pair of eyes. week 5 of flower, lower leaves started to yellow slightly but I left it as I didn't want to increase N at this point. Started noticing brown spotting on one girl, she is the lankiest and stretched the most, seems to use the most nutes. One other is a similar pheno and is starting to show similar symptoms.


GH Micro/Bloom 8ml/16ml
armor si 5ml
koolbloom 5ml
cal-mag 5ml
mammoth p/great white/hydroguard for bennies

recently added floranectar at the recommended 10ml per gallon, wondering if I should have left this out, not something I previously used.

PH has been very stable in the 55 gal, sitting right at 6.0-6.1 most days avg 1400 ppm, I'll adjust it down if needed but I've honestly just been letting it sit. After I noticed the leaf issue and thought it might be calcium or nute lockout I flushed the system and refilled with clean nutes, ppm was 1600 so i added some plain RO to bring it down to 1400.


Picture is same plant/bud, just with and without flash. The healthiest/best buds are on a different plant and show none of the issues, so I've been kinda leaning towards just letting her ride it out but the recommendation is 8-9 weeks so I'll need to nurse her a bit.

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Sorry bud cant help ya on this one! They look beautiful though! Good luck and Happy New Year!

Tangerine_ said:

Look at the info sand gave and then look closely at his leaves.

Right on.

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Hey good to see you here

I ran DynaGro Foliage Pro and still do in veg. It does a good job. Unfortunately DynaGro's Bloom formula always precipitated out on me.

curious2garden said:

Hey good to see you here

I ran DynaGro Foliage Pro and still do in veg. It does a good job. Unfortunately DynaGro's Bloom formula always precipitated out on me.

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Good to see you too.
I keep a small bottle of the FP on hand for mothers. Its always worked well for me.
I've had it for at least 4 yrs and it hasn't precipitated but my new bottle of Clonex solution did. I still added to my cloner and no issues yet but I'll likely move on to another brand in the future. I could probably fiddle with a couple of bottles I have on hand and come up with a similar formula but I'm lazy.

Tangerine_ said:

Good to see you too.
I keep a small bottle of the FP on hand for mothers. Its always worked well for me.
I've had it for at least 4 yrs and it hasn't precipitated but my new bottle of Clonex solution did. I still added to my cloner and no issues yet but I'll likely move on to another brand in the future. I could probably fiddle with a couple of bottles I have on hand and come up with a similar formula but I'm lazy.

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My Foliage Pro has never precipitated. It's been great. It's DynaGro's Bloom formula that always precipitated. I even called the company and they cheerfully replaced it twice. They also stated it was a known issue. But GH Flora has worked for me for many years now so I'm pretty happy with my routine. I find less is often more.

I'd suggest looking at DynaGro's K-L-N cloning solution. I'm a big fan and it's never precipitated either LOL Matter of fact I need to go transplant my rooted clones.

Tangerine_ said:

Look at the info sand gave and then look closely at his leaves.

Right on.

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I'm afraid that's not much of an answer. How do you know it's a calcium problem? When I've seen known calcium problems start, it does so with a tell-tale spot of a unique color. I don't see that color on the leaves. So it would good if you could explain how you know it's calcium so people can learn this from you.

curious2garden said:

My Foliage Pro has never precipitated. It's been great. It's DynaGro's Bloom formula that always precipitated. I even called the company and they cheerfully replaced it twice. They also stated it was a known issue. But GH Flora has worked for me for many years now so I'm pretty happy with my routine. I find less is often more.

I'd suggest looking at DynaGro's K-L-N cloning solution. I'm a big fan and it's never precipitated either LOL Matter of fact I need to go transplant my rooted clones.

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The KLN works great.
The first few days in the cloner I use my tap with KLN. One of the best formulas I've for older hard-to-root cuttings.
I also use a mix of KLN in labeled beer cups. This way, I can take several cuttings at once and they get the added benefit of a KLN bath/dip.

Oh, and I have 2 bottles with different labels. 1 with a low NPK listed and one without. Likely just a labeling/registration thing. I mention the 2 bottles because I bought one, forgot about it, read a post from you recommending it months later and ordered another, lol.

I blame the weed

polishpollack said:

I'm afraid that's not much of an answer. How do you know it's a calcium problem? When I've seen known calcium problems start, it does so with a tell-tale spot of a unique color. I don't see that color on the leaves. So it would good if you could explain how you know it's calcium so people can learn this from you.

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polishpollack said:

I'm afraid that's not much of an answer. How do you know it's a calcium problem? When I've seen known calcium problems start, it does so with a tell-tale spot of a unique color. I don't see that color on the leaves. So it would good if you could explain how you know it's calcium so people can learn this from you.

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Look don't spin this shit on me because your ego took a beating in this thread.
Stevie Wonder could see those tell tale round spots forming.
Let it go man. If the OP needs further clarification I'll happily expand on my opinion and/or experience.

curious2garden said:

Leaf diagnosis request - burn or deficiency?

Like the title states, plants are larger than I planned and might be rootbound in the 2 gal flo and gro. New system to me and been very long time so just looking for a 2nd pair of eyes. week 5 of flower, lower leaves started to yellow slightly but I left it as I didn't want to increase N at...

www.rollitup.org

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Yeah, I've seen that photo and it looks pretty good to me. So I'm curious how the problem of calcium is being determined as this is something we all need to understand and watch out for.

Tangerine_ said:

Look don't spin this shit on me because your ego took a beating in this thread.
Stevie Wonder could see those tell tale round spots forming.
Let it go man. If the OP needs further clarification I'll happily expand on my opinion and/or experience.

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My ego never took a beating. I'd like to know how you can tell it's a calcium problem. This is something new to me and I need to understand how you know it's calcium so I can learn something. If you are just guessing, then say so.

polishpollack said:

My ego never took a beating. I'd like to know how you can tell it's a calcium problem. This is something new to me and I need to understand how you know it's calcium so I can learn something. If you are just guessing, then say so.

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Your posts certainly aren't indicative of someone "seeking knowledge".
Start your own thread and if I have time I'll respond. Or you could study the picture Annie provided?

Are Annie and curious2garden the same person? What's interesting is that you won't give an answer. I don't need to start my own thread as I don't have any issues to address.

Tangerine_ said:

Look don't spin this shit on me because your ego took a beating in this thread.
Stevie Wonder could see those tell tale round spots forming.
Let it go man. If the OP needs further clarification I'll happily expand on my opinion and/or experience.

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@polishpollack is all good with me, we can let this ride.

I had previously self diagnoses as what I thought was calcium deficiency from the pictures, I am notorious for getting colors slightly off though so I wanted a "2nd pair of eyes" hence the post. I clearly didn't understand all the ferts use and purposes 100% like I thought I did so the recommendations to re-read while terse weren't exactly unwarranted.

I had thought I had a slight N deficiency on the lower leaves from slight yellowing and needed more calcium, when I increased the PPM I obviously forgot about lockout and screwed myself.


I typically don't share people's names unless they chose to do so. Annie has spoken with me via PM and I am content to leave it at that.

Even with all the back and forth, i really appreciate anyone who took the time to stop in and read the thread. At least it sorta stayed on topic!

sandman83 said:

@polishpollack is all good with me, we can let this ride.

I had previously self diagnoses as what I thought was calcium deficiency from the pictures, I am notorious for getting colors slightly off though so I wanted a "2nd pair of eyes" hence the post. I clearly didn't understand all the ferts use and purposes 100% like I thought I did so the recommendations to re-read while terse weren't exactly unwarranted.

I had thought I had a slight N deficiency on the lower leaves from slight yellowing and needed more calcium, when I increased the PPM I obviously forgot about lockout and screwed myself.


I typically don't share people's names unless they chose to do so. Annie has spoken with me via PM and I am content to leave it at that.

Even with all the back and forth, i really appreciate anyone who took the time to stop in and read the thread. At least it sorta stayed on topic!

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LOL It is RIU after all