Keeping a sterile res in dwc Shock Chlorine Advice

curious2garden

curious2garden

Well-Known Mod
Staff member
xIPhobiaIx said:
So, what would you do in a SIP, hempy bucket, or Octopot where there is soil or coco, than roots below that are suspended in water?
Chlorine destroys organic matter naturally so it would affect the soil/coco so would imagine the only way forward is bennies.
Maybe a chlorine solution with less ppm would preserve the soil/coco? Not sure.
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Coco is hydro, soil is not hydro. I ran NFT rails prior to moving to Coco. I use Chlorine at roughly 3-5 PPM in both. I use dilute pool shock. I prefer the Ca Hypochlorite versus the Sodium Hypochlorite (household bleach). You use it in such a small amount you can easily get by with the Sodium product. I use pool shock because I have a 26,000 gallon pool in my backyard so I have the shock on hand.

Here's some info

Make $2200 worth of "Clear Rez" for $4 !!!

That is correct. Same EXACT ingredient as EZ Clone Clear Rez that sells for $20 a QT. Get your self a 1 lb bag of HTH Pool shock non PH buffered available online and most hardware stores (bought mine from Ace). Mix 1 GRAM (450 in the bag) per gallon of solution. Will make the SAME EXACT...
www.rollitup.org
 
Hollatchaboy

Hollatchaboy

Well-Known Member
xIPhobiaIx said:
So, what would you do in a SIP, hempy bucket, or Octopot where there is soil or coco, than roots below that are suspended in water?
Chlorine destroys organic matter naturally so it would affect the soil/coco so would imagine the only way forward is bennies.
Maybe a chlorine solution with less ppm would preserve the soil/coco? Not sure.
Click to expand...
You don't need that in a sip if your using a living soil. The microbiology takes care of pathogens for you, especially in a dialed in sip because the moisture levels are just right, but you can't get too much organic matter in the res. It'll get funky.
 
2

2com

Well-Known Member
xIPhobiaIx said:
How so? If there are no pathogens present in the water than for them to be present later on they would have to get introduced somewhere.

The roots would not be providing it so as long as that happens it remains "sterile" in the case of bad pathogens.

Also you could always add bennies as well to the mix post uv sterilization.
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Once the UV treatment was mentioned, it just reminded me of this video. I'm not making any claims. I'm just sharing this video clip where he mentions his experience, and view on it, I guess:
 
xtsho

xtsho

Well-Known Member
Cycad said:
Let me see if I understand matters. I'm a chemist so I like to be clear.
1. You intend chlorinating water using pool 'Shock'. Basically this is adding bleach.
2, You do not intend using a high strength solution (you'd need PPE) to clean it prior to use, but to attempt to maintain a system full of plant roots, sterile?
OK. Assuming I've got the facts right... this is a daft idea.
1. Tap water has about the highest concentration of chlorine or chloramine that the roots can stand. Using a stronger solution will stunt, then kill your plants.
2. Tap water is not resistant to the growth of algae and bio-film-forming organisms of all sorts.
3. Sterility can only be achieved in an autoclave or a recondensing solvent bath. I don't think your plants would like those.
4. Even 100% alcohol leaves viable spores behind. 70% alcohol + H2O2 will sterilise but I don't think your plants would like that.
In other words, what you think is sterile is anything but sterile.
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Adding chlorine will not kill or stunt your plants. Plain chlorine bleach is used by many in hydro. I used it for years and it had absolutely no negative effect on the plants but it did prevent root rot. My water contains both chlorine and chloramine and I always used it straight from the tap and then added plain old Clorox bleach. I always had healthy white roots and healthy plants.
 
U

Urso hidro

Member
I'm using an ORP sensor to monitor how much calcium hypoclorite should I add to the reservoir. Using tap water my ORP was 500 mV and dropped to 300 mV in just one day. I think it was the effect of the bubbles helping the chlorine evaporate. So I used calcium hypoclorite 65% 0.0133g/gal (150 ml of a solution 1g/1,5L) and the ORP raised to 500mV. According to https://scienceinhydroponics.com/2017/03/what-is-an-orp-meter-and-why-is-it-useful-in-hydroponics.html it's a ok value (in the range 300-500). I used h2o2 35% in other grow 2ml/gal (15ml/30L) and the ORP raised from 300 to 330mV. Maybe the h2o2 used was stale. So I am using calcium hypoclorite now because it sees more effective and cheaper. It has been 3 days since I add calcium hypoclorite and the orp is kepping at 500mV. I will add more hypoclorite (half dose) when the ORP falls under 420mV.

About the UV sterilization. "Iron stability has also been an important concern in UV sterilization for a while. This is because UV irradiation of chelated iron species can destabilize and destroy the chelate, leading to non-chelated forms of iron that can much more readily precipitate from solution." https://scienceinhydroponics.com/2017/03/using-uv-sterilization-in-your-recirculating-hydroponic-crop.html
 
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rkymtnman

rkymtnman

Well-Known Member
Urso hidro said:
I'm using an ORP sensor to monitor how much calcium hypoclorite should I add to the reservoir. Using tap water my ORP was 500 mV and dropped to 300 mV in just one day. I think it was the effect of the bubbles helping the chlorine evaporate. So I used calcium hypoclorite 65% 0.0133g/gal (150 ml of a solution 1g/1,5L) and the ORP raised to 500mV. According to https://scienceinhydroponics.com/2017/03/what-is-an-orp-meter-and-why-is-it-useful-in-hydroponics.html it's a ok value (in the range 300-500). I used h2o2 35% in other grow 2ml/gal (15ml/30L) and the ORP raised from 300 to 330mV. Maybe the h2o2 used was stale. So I am using calcium hypoclorite now because it sees more effective and cheaper. It has been 3 days since I add calcium hypoclorite and the orp is kepping at 500mV. I will add more hypoclorite (half dose) when the ORP falls under 420mV.

About the UV sterilization. "Iron stability has also been an important concern in UV sterilization for a while. This is because UV irradiation of chelated iron species can destabilize and destroy the chelate, leading to non-chelated forms of iron that can much more readily precipitate from solution." https://scienceinhydroponics.com/2017/03/using-uv-sterilization-in-your-recirculating-hydroponic-crop.html
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so you are using it more as a preventative than a fix for root rot?
i've never tried peroxide but i thought HTH pool shock worked great and was extremely cheap
 
U

Urso hidro

Member
C

Coal Train

Active Member
rkymtnman said:
agreed. i'd love to see some ORP readings of somebody trying to combat a bad case of pythium. to see how it goes up and down as it destroys the rot and then flattens out
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I've come to believe what many people believe is pythium is usually not proper watering times. I run nothing but aeroponics and have had a few cases of improper watering times upset my roots and them go from bright white to brown. Upside to aeroponics is the great rapid growth but you have to be on it mistake happen quick and cost the user when it happens.
I have an orp meter and disolved oxygen meter on top of the normal meters, if there's anything I can do let me know .
 
2

2com

Well-Known Member
Coal Train said:
I've come to believe what many people believe is pythium is usually not proper watering times. I run nothing but aeroponics and have had a few cases of improper watering times upset my roots and them go from bright white to brown. Upside to aeroponics is the great rapid growth but you have to be on it mistake happen quick and cost the user when it happens.
I have an orp meter and disolved oxygen meter on top of the normal meters, if there's anything I can do let me know .
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Could you share the exact tools you use (orp devices), and how you set them up? And any details on how you use whatever oxidator you use?
 
C

Coal Train

Active Member
2com said:
Could you share the exact tools you use (orp devices), and how you set them up? And any details on how you use whatever oxidator you use?
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I have a hm digital orp-200 ,extension exstik II D.O.600 , hm digital ph200 and a hm digital com 100 ec/tds meter. They are calibrated and set up using standard reference solutions. All of them have different uses but Google will tell you what you want to look for in terms of right and wrong good and bad. . The orp meter and D/O meter while nice aren't needed . The great thing about aeroponics is the roots hang in the open air with the tips being in water . The only thing that gets any type of solutions is my cloner . My 50gal totes get organic teas a few times. My 128 site ez cloner regularly get 35% peroxide at 10 ml . I also use 1 ml regularly of api melifix . It's used to treat bacteria infections on fish. On the back side of my air pump that goes to my ezcloner I have a small ozone generator that comes on for 15 minutes every 45 minutes. From time to time I use chlorine and when stuff gets really bad a drop of physan 20 and I use oxine to clean the cloner out.
It's said for sterile environment you want your orp values at 300 to 500 mv . Hanna recommends 5mg a liter of disolved oxygen.
 
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2

2com

Well-Known Member
Coal Train said:
I have a hm digital orp-200 ,extension exstik II D.O.600 , hm digital ph200 and a hm digital com 100 ec/tds meter. They are calibrated and set up using standard reference solutions. All of them have different uses but Google will tell you what you want to look for in terms of right and wrong good and bad. . The orp meter and D/O meter while nice aren't needed . The great thing about aeroponics is the roots hang in the open air with the tips being in water . The only thing that gets any type of solutions is my cloner . My 50gal totes get organic teas a few times. My 128 site ez cloner regularly get 35% peroxide at 10 ml . I also use 1 ml regularly of api melifix . It's used to treat bacteria infections on fish. On the back side of my air pump that goes to my ezcloner I have a small ozone generator that comes on for 15 minutes every 45 minutes. From time to time I use chlorine and when stuff gets really bad a drop of physan 20 and I use oxine to clean the cloner out.
It's said for sterile environment you want your orp values at 300 to 500 mv . Hanna recommends 5mg a liter of disolved oxygen.
Click to expand...
Thanks for sharing that info.
What do you mean "gets any type of solutions"? And what small ozone generator do you have?
I have an HOCl generator and some calcium hypochlorite.
 
C

Coal Train

Active Member
Solutions as in oxidizing agents in my ez cloner. Chlorine ,bleach or peroxide anything that kills bacteria. I look to create and manage beneficial bacteria in my veg and flower setups.
Search Amazon this is the ozone generator i use in my cloner . I have for years . RDEXP AC110V 3 G/Hr Ozone Quartz Tube Generator with 220x35mm Tube
 
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Wastei

Wastei

Well-Known Member
Coal Train said:
I've come to believe what many people believe is pythium is usually not proper watering times. I run nothing but aeroponics and have had a few cases of improper watering times upset my roots and them go from bright white to brown. Upside to aeroponics is the great rapid growth but you have to be on it mistake happen quick and cost the user when it happens.
I have an orp meter and disolved oxygen meter on top of the normal meters, if there's anything I can do let me know .
Click to expand...
Pythium thrives in anaerobic environments and may be a result from bad aeration or high water temperatures and not keeping proper preventative measures. An anaerobic root zone may come from not having enough aeration in the pots or not feeding frequent enough or to frequent depending on growing method.

The only time you upset roots in Aeroponics is if you don't have enough spray on time or hang time and to long time between watering cycles. It's more or less impossible to over water in Aeroponics but there's always an optimal amount depending on many factors like chamber size, nozzle size, water pressure, growth phase, ambient temps and humidity. Are you running AA or HPA?

I believe the chlorine calculator and recommended dosages are in my signature. Cheers!
 
C

Coal Train

Active Member
Wastei said:
Pythium thrives in anaerobic environments and may be a result from bad aeration or high water temperatures and not keeping proper preventative measures. An anaerobic root zone may come from not having enough aeration in the pots or not feeding frequent enough or to frequent depending on growing method.

The only time you upset roots in Aeroponics is if you don't have enough spray on time or hang time and to long time between watering cycles. It's more or less impossible to over water in Aeroponics but there's always an optimal amount depending on many factors like chamber size, nozzle size, water pressure, growth phase, ambient temps and humidity. Are you running AA or HPA?

I believe the chlorine calculator and recommended dosages are in my signature. Cheers!
Click to expand...
Dead roots from suffication is not the same as getting root rot from a fungal infection from having an abundance of pythuin in your growing area. Pytuim will attack after your roots die but thats not the main cause of dying roots and will just happen again.
I'm aware why and where pythium comes from.
I've been growing in some form of hydroponics since 04 in aero since 2015. You can suffocate your roots in Aeroponics.
 
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