Jack's Classic /JR PETERS (Don't waste money on anything else)
- Thread starter SheepsBlood
- Start date
Flowki
Well-Known Member
http://www.angelfire.com/cantina/fourtwenty/articles/profiles.htm
This was an astronomical help. Cut back on calN by .25g/l and on the base feed by 0.50g/l. Total elemental ppm is shy of 700, seems good start to finish so far, in coco. P will stay at 60ppm for a trial but here are some loose figures to give an idea of tweaking room, such as the N and C value later on. The base isn't jacks but they probably have something similar. Could be some mistakes below, or round offs.
Base - 0.5gl
N - 75
P - 15
K - 132
M - 10
Cnite - 0.5gl
N - 75
C - 95
Eps - 0.5gl
Mg - 50
Su - 65
Mpk - 0.10/20/30 g/l
P - 23/45/69
K - 28/57/84
Tot
N - 150
P - 38/60/84
K - 160/189/216
C - 95
M - 60
S - 65
I plan on re-introducing an organic/microbe means to add more P, so that any ''boost'' is taken care of by critters that know more than me.
This was an astronomical help. Cut back on calN by .25g/l and on the base feed by 0.50g/l. Total elemental ppm is shy of 700, seems good start to finish so far, in coco. P will stay at 60ppm for a trial but here are some loose figures to give an idea of tweaking room, such as the N and C value later on. The base isn't jacks but they probably have something similar. Could be some mistakes below, or round offs.
Base - 0.5gl
N - 75
P - 15
K - 132
M - 10
Cnite - 0.5gl
N - 75
C - 95
Eps - 0.5gl
Mg - 50
Su - 65
Mpk - 0.10/20/30 g/l
P - 23/45/69
K - 28/57/84
Tot
N - 150
P - 38/60/84
K - 160/189/216
C - 95
M - 60
S - 65
I plan on re-introducing an organic/microbe means to add more P, so that any ''boost'' is taken care of by critters that know more than me.
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McFrosticles
Well-Known Member
For hydro? Been coming across varying views on the subject. Seen real growers recharge being recommended but the packaging says its for soil, and see growers on here mention the microbes can't survive with some sort of soil to hang on to?
Im running dtw rockwool and one of the growers I've seen on you tube "thecapn" waters with recharge once a week or something, but on alternate waterings, just seems like a lot of fkn about. Do you think it's worth it?
Im 12 days since flip using just 321 and silica, plants look great but I keep almost pulling the trigger on canna boost, recharge or mammoth p. But boost and MP are stupidly expensive to run full strength
Flowki
Well-Known Member
No, for coco. I've read bits and pieces of people adding some basic forms of organic/microbes for hydrp but it's something that you should really read deeply into, I've read a fair share of people dumping res for sludge when using the wrong stuff or improper application.
In terms of the actual success these hydro growers are having by adding microbes I am personally sceptical, although could very well be down to lack of reading on that particular topic. I do know that microbes work a lot better in combination and also that too much P, from other sources turns off the plants signals to the microbes to go mine more P. Most of the reports on growers using microbes in hydro and even coco probably should be considered subjective. They don't really have a solid way of knowing if it is entirely down to the microbes or simply the addition of other beneficial ''nutrients'' that are also packed in with microbe products. They also can not be 100% sure the microbes are actually alive and in the coco/hydro while doing what the label says they are doing if they are.
If it was fully organic living soil I would say it's far less subjective, since they get microbes from a far fresher source and have a far more diverse colony. I would also say that it's less subjective results is you were using home made worm casting in either dressing/tea in coco (not sure if wise in hydro). A worm casting tea you made yourself is fresh and highly likely to have a lot of microbes.
This is why I look to supply 60ppm P synthetically in a part synth part organic coco set up. I don't trust microbe products to specifically cover P in it's entirety (worm castings is on the to do list). Microbes I do feel are the new snake oil of products, it's likely more the additional supplement's that come with the microbe products that is doing the work while the claim of ''complex'' and ''specialised'' microbe species is the smoke screen. You can supply this stuff far cheaper.
This is only an opinion and well open to be wrong.
Also their is a lot of conflicting info on how much synthetic ppm P and over all PPM microbes can tolerate or be of any use in. I would say try to use some logic. If you are supplying everything the plant needs synthetically, in terms of ppm for each element, then what useful part are the microbes going to play?.
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McFrosticles
Well-Known Member
Does anyone have the measurements for 321 in cups and/or spoons at all? No scales and can’t seem to find it anywhere
icetech
Well-Known Member
To be honest, i wouldn't use it without a scale, at least at the gallon level, the difference between 3 and 4g is so tiny on a spoon it's silly. A scale is like $12 on amazon..
McFrosticles
Well-Known Member
I mix up stocks with 300 200 100 gs.
icetech
Well-Known Member
Well ok then
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
Get a scale. Volume is unreliable.
StAuggydogg
Active Member
the calcium in jacks hydro comes from calcium nitrate... 2nd part of 2part formula... 3rd part in 321 is just epsom added specifically for herb... 3.6/2.4/1.2 of jacks5/12/26-CalNit-epsom into a gallon of RO comes out to 3-1-4 ratio which is what MEL Frank has recommended for herb... and I have to say my girls are happy since switching from Lucas via micro/bloom... thanks for all your help over the years...
OldCity
TintEastwood
Well-Known Member
buyyouabeer
Well-Known Member
The Ca fond in tap water is usually not useable by your plants until broken down in the soil over a long period. You will also lose the main nitrogen component.
icetech
Well-Known Member
Well.. nevermind then
And thank you.What exactly did you order? And more importantly, canadian, where did you order this from?
They look pretty happy. See some of that hook/clawing of the very tip of few leaves. You mentioned N tox is rather easy to get with jacks. Do you/have you ended up getting burnt tips? And couldn't you just stop following the ratio to the letter (reduce N).?
Thanks.
buyyouabeer
Well-Known Member
I do not worry about some slight claw and very minor tip burn, they usually grow out of it. If anything on this last grow from earlier in the year I should have kicked up the strength. They really faded at the end, however maybe that was perfect as all of them in that batch were my best. Everyone in my circles said they were topshelf and matched anything at the dispensaries (which around here are everywhere). Here are some of my final pictures before chop.
Fire OG
Wedding Cake
Gorilla
Group Shots
icetech
Well-Known Member
Jesus man. that's with jacks? I need to get some better lights. my buds are usually 1/2 to 1/3 that size
buyyouabeer
Well-Known Member
Yes Jacks 321 is the only thing I use. I used to add various 'enhancers' to it but when I came clean, things just went right. I also really recommend the HLG QBs for lights; they have some with added red now. I run them very soft, each bar has 3x V2 288s and I turn them down so it only pulls 200W total at the outlet.