I just filled out my mail ballot and I voted ___ on PROP 19!
- Thread starter Prop19fan
- Start date
EmptyWords
Active Member
also lets just trust the guy that's going to benefit from this more than anyone and who actualy wrote the bill. that makes a lot of sense... if this shit passes and ends up fucking you guys over that voted yes, don't come back crying because it's all you fault to begin with.
beardo
Well-Known Member
Much better to send more U.S. jobs to china
How about we try something different. Instead of rude asinine insults like, "you seem to be retarded", you make an argument against prop 19 worthy of convincing me to change my mind. I am the rational voice for over two dozen of my friends, here's your chance to change as many as 35 votes. For most of my friends I supplied the voter registration forms. My nick is Prop19fan, so obviously you do have you're work cut out for you, but changing mind is achievable with a convincing argument. Keep in mind I would be proud to pay taxes on sales and happy to buy permits for plants under prop 19.
EmptyWords
Active Member
well excuse me for the insults but your attitude towards certain peoples livelihood isn't any better. "I could give a shit less about keeping your profits up.". alot of people sell for a living which we all know. some people do it because they want to and some do it because they have to, to support their family or whatever. not everyone is fortunate enough to have a good job and you should have at least a little respect for these people before you come here telling me not to make rude insults. you tell me what makes prop 19 so special? it does nothing good that i see, you can be a medical grower and be better off but it seems either people are either too lazy or retarded to get their card "anybody can get it". do you think prop 19 really legalizes marijuana? no it doesn't and it will only bring more dea attention to cali. it seems strange that someone that doesn't smoke weed is so for this shit to pass. whats wrong with the way things are now? if you get caught with some weed you only get a misdemeanor, big deal, if you get caught with a lot and get busted then that's your problem and you knew the risks to begin with. i only see people that don't have their medical cards wanting this to pass and that should point out that maybe the whole medical thing is better. i'm not going to sit here and try to convince you to change your mind because i probably cant if any of the other threads about this haven't. i really cant think of saying anything more than what has already been said by many in other threads. if this shit passes and turns out not to be what you all thought it would be then i will sit back and laugh but then again i would feel like shit for everyone that was against it and tried their best to show why it is not good. you don't seem to understand that this shit wasn't meant to benefit you or the people, it's meant to benefit the people that are going to profit from it most. there is nothing in the prop that says anything and everything cannot change and it can change for the worse. in my opinion the vote should be for the decriminalization of marijuana and nothing more. i also don't want to hear no shit about how this will benefit cali financially because what happens if the next president turns out to be some republican hell bent on the drug war and such and then tries to cut all federal funding to cali, don't act like that cannot happen because it can. i will not say it will but it is a possibility.
desert dude
Well-Known Member
I too am a prop 19 fan. Here are my reasons:
1. The war on drugs has destroyed enough lives, and eroded enough constitutional freedoms; it is way past time to end it. Politicians are too cowardly to end it, so that leaves the ballot initiative as the only recourse. Prop 19 legalizes MJ in California, but it will be a very loud statement to the feds that will get the ball rolling to end prohibition on the federal level.
2. Medical MJ was a step in the right direction, but P19 is a bigger and better step.
3. I realize that a lot of people make a very lucrative living in the MMJ biz, but that does not justify imprisoning people and ruining their lives just so a few people can make a lot of money. You MMJ growers just might have to find a different line of work, that's life. There is no reason, except prohibition, why MJ should be "expensive". Cheaper goods (of all kinds) for consumers is a good thing.
4. I have seen no persuasive argument against P19. You (Emptywords) certainly did not make a persuasive argument. The feds might cut federal funding to Cali, but even if they do it will have no effect on P19 because P19 modifies the California constitution, hence California legislators can not modify P19 because they have no legal right to do so, despite federal threats. If this issue causes a dispute with the feds, then so be it, it is long past time that our society had this fight. P19 is not "perfect", but nothing ever is, it is certainly better than what we have now.
1. The war on drugs has destroyed enough lives, and eroded enough constitutional freedoms; it is way past time to end it. Politicians are too cowardly to end it, so that leaves the ballot initiative as the only recourse. Prop 19 legalizes MJ in California, but it will be a very loud statement to the feds that will get the ball rolling to end prohibition on the federal level.
2. Medical MJ was a step in the right direction, but P19 is a bigger and better step.
3. I realize that a lot of people make a very lucrative living in the MMJ biz, but that does not justify imprisoning people and ruining their lives just so a few people can make a lot of money. You MMJ growers just might have to find a different line of work, that's life. There is no reason, except prohibition, why MJ should be "expensive". Cheaper goods (of all kinds) for consumers is a good thing.
4. I have seen no persuasive argument against P19. You (Emptywords) certainly did not make a persuasive argument. The feds might cut federal funding to Cali, but even if they do it will have no effect on P19 because P19 modifies the California constitution, hence California legislators can not modify P19 because they have no legal right to do so, despite federal threats. If this issue causes a dispute with the feds, then so be it, it is long past time that our society had this fight. P19 is not "perfect", but nothing ever is, it is certainly better than what we have now.
You stole my line!! lol
To beardo and the notion that it will send jobs to China. Buy American. I know several people getting ready to grow if it passes. It's as easy as buying from your neighbor, or saying to your new seller, "hey, can I see your grow room?"
MMJ growers might just have to go the way of buggy-whip makers and move aside, the next (Automobile) revolution has arrived.
desert dude
Well-Known Member
Emptywords, I am a new member on this site, never heard of "prop19fan" before reading this thread. I don't smoke MJ and I don't drink alcohol because I prefer sobriety, but I don't begrudge those who do. I have no interest in growing, selling, or consuming pot. I am a Libertarian, so I am naturally interested in ending the war on drugs because I am very interested in maintaining and restoring our constitutional liberties. As long as the war on drugs rages on we (the US) won't be free to exercise property rights over our own bodies, and without that we are just serfs.
You are unaware that you tried to make an argument against P19 because you didn't. If you could make a coherent argument against it, I would like to see it.
You are unaware that you tried to make an argument against P19 because you didn't. If you could make a coherent argument against it, I would like to see it.
caseyg2007
Well-Known Member
Not trying to start an argument, but are you saying you should go to jail too? You say that if your doing something illegal and you know it then you need to be put in jail. Really? Are you really that much of a hypocrite? You say you have a small medi grow going for yourself. However even because the state says you're legal you still are not federally legal. So you can still be put in prison if the fed so chooses. I don't live in a medi state, and quite frankly would rather have a medi card then have it 100% legal or whatever prop19 does. Now for you to say I should go to jail just for smoking something far less destructive than cigarettes or alcohol, and way better than any prescription med out is just wrong, and I know you probably don't care, but it also makes you look bad. There are 2 reasons I smoke, I have back and knee problems. Yes I also consider my self relatively dependent on cannabis, but not like a crackhead. I can go a day or 2 without smoking, but any longer gets me super depressed and easily aggitated. So in a way yes I am dependent on it. And you know not everyone has the money to get a card, or is even capable of getting a card. And I don't think those people should have to be arrested for choosing a better alternative. I know you couldn't care less what I think or anyone else thinks, but before you go being hypocritical, think about what you are going to say, and who might be really paying attention to it. One day those people you piss off because you think they should go to jail may end up being the ones to bail your ass out. Just my .02 or a dollar considering the length of the message.
EmptyWords
Active Member
hey dude, how many times do i have to say go to the other threads they have said everything that i can say and if that cannot change your mind than i cannot.. i said this once, but once is enough. if you have no interest in pot then what are you doing here to begin with? you didn't come here just to see my single post. this prop wont do shit for the war on drugs, the dea will still be there to bust you or anyone else and this is only for cali so its not that big of a deal since the war on drugs is national, that means every other state is still getting fucked. prop19 does not make anything legal, you still cannot smoke in public and now you wont be able to consume in front of people under the age of 21 i believe, or cannot share with them. i don't remember at this point and don't feel like looking but that right there is a new law that will get alot of people in trouble and put in jail. marijuana will still be illegal for people under 21 also. fuck why am i still arguing? i know i cant change your minds like i said goto the other threads and if they cannot do it than obviously i cannot either. i could post plenty about why i think its bad but its all in other threads just like all what you have said is in the same threads and if you are as interested as you act you would go there instead of wasting your time trying to get my argument which has already been stated all over. no need for another huge thread some shit that doesn't even effect me. all i have to say is having medical marijuana was just fine, anyone could get it, it just takes a little work and that's it. a lot of the docs that give it are frauds anyway and give it to you knowing you dont really need it. i dont see why people cannot wait for another prop to come out "which i have stated elsewhere and many others have too" and the only answer is "it could take years and we can do this now". yeah well so fucking what, we have gone this long so why not go for a full blown legalization or decriminalization instead of this big business bullshit?
caseyg2007
Well-Known Member
Are you referencing that towards me or the other guy? Like I said I'm not looking for an arguement. All I said was it is pretty fucked up how you say people who do illegal shit should go to jail when infact you are one of those people. I also said that you should think about what you say about people.
EmptyWords
Active Member
you are taking me out of context. i am saying if you knowingly do anything illegal and get caught for it, it is your fault and you deserve to goto jail because you knew the consequences of your actions. i do have a small medical grow of a few plants and if the dea came to bust me then thats my fault for doing it because i know it is federally illegal to do what i am doing. i know what i am doing is wrong "by law" not by opinion and if i get caught then i get caught and thats my problem and you wont see me coming here crying trying to figure out what to do because i was in the wrong and i know this and accept this. so i am no hypocrite. i am not saying in my opinion you should goto jail for smoking marijuana in my opinion but "by law" you should if you were caught, thats what breaking the law is about. if i get caught drinking and driving, i knew it was illegal so i goto jail if i get caught whether i agree with it or not because its illegal and i knew it and still did it. i also didnt say anything like that "Now for you to say I should go to jail just for smoking something far less destructive than cigarettes or alcohol, and way better than any prescription med out is just wrong" you took me out of context. i am basically saying if you knowingly break the law and get caught thats your own fault and you have to accept the consequences. If you cannot afford a medical card thats no one's problem but your own, i know disabled people who can barely afford their rent every month save their money for a few months and got their card so anyone can so i dont want to hear shit about not being about to afford $200. if you cant save $200 then you are a fucking idiot. i could be completely homeless and save $200, would it be easy? no. but possible? yes. so i am absolutely no hypocrite. i agree marijuana is a better and safer alternative than anything. to tell you the truth i am struggling with a 8 year narcotic prescription medication addiction that the docs put me on and didnt tell me how mentally dependent it would make me so i am very aware of all of this. in less than a year i hope to have my struggle with my addiction gone and just use marijuana. i cant just stop these meds or it can kill me, i have to taper 10% every 14 to 30 days depending on certain things so it takes awhile. this shit fucked me up pretty good mentally and physically.
EmptyWords
Active Member
i didnt even see your post untill my last reply to you so thats not towards you but read and you will see im not a hypocrite because by law i deserve to goto jail because i know im in the wrong but by personal opinion i dont believe i should just like anyone would think but i am stating when you do something illegal and know its illegal and get busted then you have no one to blame but yourself.
Serapis
Well-Known Member
EmptyWords
Active Member
WonderfulYour screen name is perfect for this topic!! Thanks!!
caseyg2007
Well-Known Member
Sorry read it wrong, been a long day, and I'm super baked. Yes I agree if you knowingly do something illegal and get busted for stupidity then yes you deserved it. So I apologize for calling you a hypocrite. Sucks to hear about the scrip dependancy good luck with your struggle.
EmptyWords
Active Member
no problem, and thanks man
EmptyWords
Active Member
[video=youtube;nJhBWaNPV3w]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJhBWaNPV3w&feature=related[/video]
here is a good example of why prop19 is bad straight from an attorney and there many more videos of attorneys that say the same shit. do you really think you know more than them? do you think you understand law and such as much as they do? i highly doubt it. i would watch this video and look at some others and rethink prop19. make sure you watch the whole thing and don't skim through. im not trying to start a huge argument but im just showing just 1 of the clips i have found.
here is a good example of why prop19 is bad straight from an attorney and there many more videos of attorneys that say the same shit. do you really think you know more than them? do you think you understand law and such as much as they do? i highly doubt it. i would watch this video and look at some others and rethink prop19. make sure you watch the whole thing and don't skim through. im not trying to start a huge argument but im just showing just 1 of the clips i have found.