Hydro Innovations/ Chill King

this thread was started to warn and inform anyone who is going to buy a chiller or other products from hydro innovations, on what you can expect from there customer service, and business ethics. LEARN from my mistakes below are emails between me and the owner of H.I. I have had a compressor go out after 8-10 weeks due to a leak in refrigerant leak from a manufacture defect, the unit tests at 70% of were it should, and the biggest was they sold me 5 hp compressors on the spec sheet, gave me 4 hp compressors, and then lied about ever writing the spec sheet until i caught them through email.

I told*a couple of time*$11,500 and the third time you asked me I made the mistake of telling you the wrong price.
*
I sent a text to Shawn with the pricing and here is an email that I sent to him also. Have Wes call me, I will explain the situation to him. Surely he had been quoted before yesterday off of the pricing that I had given to him before. I’m surprised that Shaw did not catch this either since this was the 3rd time it was discussed.
*
Shawn,

*
Specs:
Included but not limited too*
-Split unit twin 5 ton Goodman unit complete with a total of 10 ton in single phase 240v 13 seer
-twin fans for condensing unit with variable fan speed
-hard start kit for both scroll compressors
-5hp compressor wired in series
-outside dimensions must be less than 7’x4’ for condenser package
-upgrade to 1.5 HP pump
- stainless steel 55 gallon res
-Separate box for both 5hp compressor’s with screw on quick connect line’s fully charged including unit with 8 to 10 ft lines mounted on the short side of condenser
-3 used 2 ton heat exchanges with fans
-manifold with 3 ports for feed and return, sold separately
- 4 thermostats
*
Notes from Pat…
twin fans should say; fan motor for each condenser to contain low ambient fan cycle switch
5ton units controlled in two stages by temp controller
cabinet inside to contain; pump, tank, both compressors and controls,pre charged refrigerant lines with quick connects, 12 ft
*


From: stephen@hydroinnovations
 To: webhead
Subject:
Re: chiller 10 ton
Date: Wed, 17 Nov 2010 17:03:16 -0600
 Wes for you to test your chiller would cost you nothing but 15 min of your time. You bought a 10 ton chiller and you got an extra 1/2 ton for free. It should have been worded differently I agree but you are being ridiculous if you expect more than 10.5 tons out of the 10 ton chiller you bought and paid for. Especially since you are only paying for 8 tons of electricity. Prove to me that your chiller isn’t producing 10 tons and I will do everything in my power to fix, until then I can’t help you.
Wes seriously think about this….if your chiller is producing more than 10 tons of cooling and only paying electricity for 8 tons of cooling then that is a perfect situation….don’t you see that??? And you expect me to feel like I committed fraud??? I’m sorry but that isn’t going to happen. Here is what I think….I think that you have got more than 10 tons of heat in your garden and you think that if your compressors were 5 tons each that you would be getting 12 or 13 tons from it instead. You think that even though you bought a 10 ton chiller it should be at 12-13 hp. But lets be honest here, if you opened that up and it had (2) 5 hp compressors and it produced 10.5 tons you would be perfectly happy. You would be happy because that is what you expected the chiller to be. Instead you find out that it does indeed have the tonnage that you bought and paid for but it was actually doing this with smaller compressors saving you 20% on electricity….and you think that we screwed you.



from: webhead to: stephen@hydroinnovations
Stephen your incorrect others i called aqua products, and cold shot chillers, and with r-22 refrigerant which is what you used they do not sell a 5 ton unit or 10 ton unit with 4 hp compressors, they used 5 hp compressors in there r-22 units.*
** Yes i would have been happy if the unit had what the receipt stated and only produced 10 tons or less, because i got what i paid for and what we agreed on. Actually by standards the btu ratings have to be 80% not 75%. I have heard too many different views from chill king and hydro innovations on ratings. This is why i meant no disrespect when i said i didn’t want to hear any more views or opinions. I first heard from Pat (owner of chill king) that my unit put out 138,000 btu, then later he told me, and texted me that it was 126,000 btu, then later he emailed me and i have 125,000 btu which is below, and you say 126,000 btu which is 10.5 tons. This is why i wanted 5 hp compressors, and made sure it was in the receipt, and approved by all parties involved. Under a constant heat load like i have you cannot rely on the stored btu that you have in your chill tank, because the smaller compressors don’t have a chance to cycle on and off for a long period, they don’t have a chance to get the temperature of the water down in the chill tank. Wether i am rite or wrong on my theory is irrelevant, i paid for 5 hp compressors, and that’s what i want.*
**I am giving you a chance to fix this matter and have good rap-or, and keep a good standing reputation in our small industry.



*
. Wes I’m done with this until I personally know your chiller isn’t producing 10 tons. We can argue about this for a month but it’s not going to change my mind. I feel like I’m arguing with a fence post, you buy a 10 ton chiller that you expect to produce 10 tons, which it does. What you want is a 10 ton chiller that produces 10 tons but uses 20% more energy and I think that is stupid, I’m sorry but it is. You want to threaten our reputation! Go for it! We can’t build chillers fast enough as it is…and that’s because our chillers are badass, use less power, and produce over their btu rating. I would love for you to tell people that your 10 ton chiller, that produces 10 tons, that uses 8 hp compressors to do it. Sounds like a great sales pitch to me.
As far as the compressor going out. First you tell me it was used for 8 weeks and then 10 weeks, which doesn’t matter be because it’s a year old. Leaks caused by the manufacturer don’t develop after a year of use. But that doesn’t matter either because after 3 months the warranty covers parts only. This means that I would have to make an exception for you and I’m not willing to do that because you are being unreasonable and accusing us of fraud. Besides we didn’t make a dime off of your chiller, greencoast complained they were making enough money because we gave you a price instead of them marking it up even more. We gave our entire $1,500 markup to them. So you got a substantial discount on the chiller because of that. You can more than pay for your compressors with that discount.*
Wes like I said above I’m done with this until I know the chiller you have doesn’t perform at it’s rating. You know that it does and that’s why you won’t test it, you just want it to use 20% more power.
Stephen*
Hydro Innovations
512-917-0248 cell
512-285-4606 fax
Sent from iPhone


I recently tested the btu rating on the chiller using a licensed contractor, and chill kings test procedures. It came out at 83,591 btu. Stephen nor chill king wants to take any responsibility for this, and expects me at my cost to ship the unit back from ca, to texas at my expense after i have been repeatedly lied to by both parties. HORRIBLE CUSTOMER SERVICE AND PRODUCT, I AM TRYING TO MAKE SURE THESE COMPANIES DON'T BURN ANYONE ELSE, AFTER I SPENT OVER 11,OOO. THE WELDS AND CRAFTSMANSHIP ARE HORRIBLE AS WELL ON THE MOUNTING FRAME FOR THE CHILL TANK.

one more point of interest, I also had a compressor fail after 8-10 weeks of operation on the unit.I received the unit in 11/2009 but i had proof from the air handler receipts that it wasn’t installed till the beginning of september 2010. The failure was due to a refrigerant leak from a union, due to a manufacture defect. I was not reimbursed anything from hydro innovations and chill king paid for parts only 352 out of my $640 bill. thanks again


Interesting..sounds like the classic bait and switch. Better Buisiness Bureau and Consumer Afairs would be interested, at your own risk of course.

never thought of that thanks Spoc. I always try to be fair with people, but i have tried, and tried to work something out with all parties involved (chill king and hydro innovations) finally after i recovered the emails of H.I., also implementing chill king, they still are reluctant to help. Now H.I. admits the wording should have been different, but basically its ok to have a breach of contract?? Even after he is caught in a lie, still no resolution. I don't understand how people like this justify there actions or live with themselves. I did some research, and it seems there are many customers unsatisfied with there products.

Bottom line..you didn't get what you paid for after being assured the unit was installed with 5hp compressors. You have proof of this. The fact the unit is underated also is a breach. It's time to pull out the guns and rip another e-mail with your intentions. When they find out your prepared to file very real complaints that will effect sales and buisiness rating, they will ask you what it's going to take to make it right.

Am I understanding right? ... The product description says that the unit uses 5hp compressors. You bought it. It was delivered... But with 4hp compressors? You contact and ask what's up and they basically pass you around to different people all telling you different things before telling you that they think they are awesome and you are being unreasonable?

basically correct. The unit was built by chill king/Hydro innovations. They are both in Texas rite down the street from each other. So i ordered the unit form hydro innovations in texas, to be shipped to me in southern california. I paid for the entire unit, it took them waaaaay to long to build, 3 months. I received the unit in the end of 09, i moved and didn't install the unit till the end of august 2010 which i have proof from a receipt that i purchased the air handlers, dated 8-19-2010. I'm using the chiller as a standard ac in conjunction with the air handlers (which is done in many large applications), after I decided against using the ice boxes. After 8-10 weeks of use i started having a high heat load, the unit was struggling to keep up with, and a compressor fails due to manufacture defect(LEAK IN REFRIGERANT). I was skeptical on the compressors being 5 hp, so i ran a check on the internet to find out they were 4 hp, off a base line (low end) goodman. I was very upset, but i tried to approach the situation in a civil manner. Above you read Stephen's response (owner of hydro innovations) and pat (owner of chill king) doesn't return my emails or calls. I tried explaining everything to them, sent receipts from a contractor who fixed the compressor, and tried to ask if i could exchange the compressors, for what all parties agreed to upon the sale. The only person who talked to me was james king, (the owners son of chill king) who reimbursed me 352 out of a 640 dollar bill, for the compressor failure. THIS IS STEP 2 AFTER A BREACH OF CONTRACT, COMPRESSOR FAILURE, HORRIBLE CUSTOMER SERVICE, AND BAD CRAFTSMANSHIP. I contacted them, both parties refused to resolve this. AT THIS MOMENT STEP 2 IS TO MAKE SURE PEOPLE LISTEN TO MY STORY SO THIS DOESN'T HAPPEN TO THEM.

i weld off-road vehicles for a living, so maybe i'm being critical, but these welds suck, they need to hire someone who can do a proper mig weld, maybe older than 15 years old.

these welds hold 458 pounds of water, as well as all the electrical wires totally unsealed, and the compressors.

check out my video on you tube hydro innovations/chill king review http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ThStAu5PGew

those welds are helarious second looks like gas was off wire speed too slow and sayed fuck it

no doubt, i weld for a living so i'm being a little critical on the welds, but dam, can't these guys just hire somebody who can do the job rite? Funny thing is when i pointed that out to Hydro innovations this is what hydro innovations emailed me back
Why would you send me a shitty pic of something that is important and then send me several pics of welds that don't really matter?

WoW, that sucks. I hope you've got your system running.

I know my name might throw you off, but I have nothing to do with any of the companies / parties involved.

Here is the companies video response to wes22. [video=youtube;ujWarihpCN4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujWarihpCN4[/video]

To whomever cares

Final update: We received the chiller back from the customer and this is a pic of the heat exchanger inside the water reservoir. When there is corrosion of the heat exchanger it can drastically reduce the efficiency of the chiller. Corrosion is caused by failure to add appropriate amounts of propylene glycol as recommended by ChillKing. In the instructions we require propylene glycol to prevent corrosion from happening. The customer claims that he used glycol and has a receipt for it so it’s possible that he had a bad batch of glycol or maybe it was a diluted mixture already when purchased. While this can be repaired, it is no way a failure on the part of ChillKing or Hydro Innovations. With this new information we have been able to resolve it with the customer so that both videos were deleted and we can put this behind us.
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[email protected] said:

To whomever cares

Final update: We received the chiller back from the customer and this is a pic of the heat exchanger inside the water reservoir. When there is corrosion of the heat exchanger it can drastically reduce the efficiency of the chiller. Corrosion is caused by failure to add appropriate amounts of propylene glycol as recommended by ChillKing. In the instructions we require propylene glycol to prevent corrosion from happening. The customer claims that he used glycol and has a receipt for it so it’s possible that he had a bad batch of glycol or maybe it was a diluted mixture already when purchased. While this can be repaired, it is no way a failure on the part of ChillKing or Hydro Innovations. With this new information we have been able to resolve it with the customer so that both videos were deleted and we can put this behind us.
View attachment 1558771

Click to expand...

that is all good to me and im glad that it got worked out, but i just got a little shaky about doing business with you after reading you responses to his emails. i dont care how he acted or if he called you a "dirty motherfucker" and went on and on about your momma. you have to be professional about it. the commments and the saying about the pics are far from that. will prolly get the gen-pro. but im not sold on the chiller. and i worked in a welding shop and have a buddy who works in one still and those welds were horrible. if they dont matter,.......why did you weld then? i hope that you have gotten better over the past couple years. the vids at the shows and that hotty opening the freezer door about had me sold.

Wow, this thread is back from the dead. I have 2 of their chillers and a few of their other pieces of equipment (air handlers, ice box, minigen, hydrogen, cool coil, thermostats, resistats, pumps). I gotta say I have really had NO problems with my stuff and all of it has worked fantastic. The only issue I have is with their resistat. Seems to have no deadband (differential) and so that had to be taken out of the mox but everything else is great. I continue to buy from them. Great service and support.