How long between cutting clone till switching to 12/12 in SOG?

Discussion in 'Hydroponics / Aeroponics' started by Keesje, May 3, 2018.


    Keesje Well-Known Member

    How many days would it take from the moment you cut a clone from your motherplant, and the moment you switch the lights to 12/12 ?
    And this for a Sea Of Green grow with 25 plants in a 4' x 4' tray.

    JSB99 Well-Known Member

    Depends on a lot. The time it takes clones to root has a lot to do with the strain. My White Widow only takes about a week, while my Girl Scout Crack takes around three weeks. The method of cloning will also effect how long it takes. If using a bubble, or aero, cloner, it'll take less time than just sticking them in glasses of water. On top of that, whether or not you have the ideal environment will effect the time. Having too bright of a light will cause the clones to try and grow, rather than root. Your clones will just sit there and do nothing, for weeks and weeks. A single t8 flouro tube, 12" above the clones is about all you need.

    A rough estimate would be four to eight weeks from clone, day-1 to flip.

    Keesje Well-Known Member

    So let's say a White Widow, a bubblecloner/aero/fogponics, just a little light like the T5 neon.
    After they show serious roots perhaps move them under a 400W HPI.

    JSB99 Well-Known Member

    I'd suggest building a bubble cloner. Aero cloners are tricky to seal and have a tendency of leaking if not done correctly. Fogponics is pretty much a forgotten technique, due to the many issues in operating and maintaining them.

    You can build your own bubble cloner super quick, and super cheap. Check out this video on a dwc bubble cloner. This is just one of many.

    Best case, with a White Widow (or equivalent, as many strains will root this quickly), probably 3 weeks. One week and a couple days to develop roots, and about a couple weeks in veg before flipping. Maybe less in veg if you're doing a song with a lot of smaller plants.

    This is a WW probably at around 2 1/2 to 3 weeks from root

    And this is a week later (WW's on the right)

    My bubble cloner. Just a cheap tote, an air pump and stones, and 2" neoprene pucks and net pots. So simple! Just add water and a dim light. I keep my light on an 18/6 schedule. Lots of ppl like that, while others like a 24/0 schedule. Each have their arguments.


    Take a guess which ones are the White Widows LOL
    Roger A. Shrubber likes this.

    Keesje Well-Known Member

    Nice pics and good looking plants.

    Off topic...
    I did a very small and non-scientific side by side test with a bubblecloner and a fogcloner.
    The roots in the fogcloner appeared days before the ones in the bubblecloner.
    I had the fogcloner on every 25 minutes for about 3 minutes.
    The bubblecloner was on 24/7.
    Nothing happened in the bubblecloner, till I decided to put in on 15 minutes/off 15 minutes.
    In both systems the stem was a tiny bit above the waterlevel.
    Why the difference in root developing? I have no clue. Perhaps it also had to do with the clones, for example where I cut them.
    What I found easy with the fogger is that you just pour some water in your tote. As long as the level is anywhere under the stem, it is ok.
    They make no sound at all.
    Downside is that foggers are more expensive and they can clog more easily.
    I think a lot of people stopped with foggers because you can only use them with plain water wthout nutrients.

    Back to topic.
    So you would say 10 days in a cloner, and another 10 days in a vegging tray.
    Then it will create a nice tray of Sea Of Green for 25 plants in a 4' x 4' tray?

    JSB99 Well-Known Member

    The reason you gave for issues with the fogger, is one of the main reasons the concept died. They do, or did, make nebulizers with hard ceramic disks, that were supposed to stand up to nutrient salt build-up, but even those didn't last long. One of the other main reasons, and probably the most significant, is that the high frequency vibrations of the nebulizers would kill the microbes. The disks literally obliterate the microbes! Therefore, the only time you can use them is in a cloner, like you're doing. The reason you get much finer root hairs, with the nebulizer, is because the water droplets are much smaller and can be absorbed by the finer hairs. If you're getting faster results using a fogger in your cloner, then I don't see any reason why you'd need to stop.

    As far as how much time it'll take, from clone to flower, there are too many variables to be more definitive. I'm basing my estimates on best-case scenario, with an experienced grower. I've got a few years of successful grows under my belt, and the RDWC, environment, water and nutrients are all finely tuned. If this is your first grow, then it might add some time. Many noobs make errors that stunt the growth of the plants. It's all a learning experience, so expect some mistakes along the way. Trying to micromanage the grow, which is probably one of the most common things with new growers, usually means being around the plants a lot and shuffling them around, neither of which is good. They don't like being shuffled around, and the more you're around your plants, the more chance you introduce things to the grow, like bugs. It's hard for new growers not to check up on their plants all the time, but try not to overdo it.
    Last edited: May 4, 2018
    Roger A. Shrubber and Keesje like this.

    klx Well-Known Member

    2 weeks to root clones then 1 week veg for 25 plants in a 4x4.

    I would put more plants in there and do zero veg personally for more yield, easier trim and shorter turnaround.

    JSB99 Well-Known Member

    There ya go lol ^^^^^^^^
    Keesje likes this.

    Keesje Well-Known Member

    Do you have experience with growing like this?
    If so, how many did you put in?
    And what was your yield?

    klx Well-Known Member

    Click on 'My Op' in my signature.
    Keesje likes this.

    Keesje Well-Known Member

    checking it out now.

    First remark.... you cut huge clones :p

    klx Well-Known Member

    Yeah man when doing zero veg sogs you want them big so they are ready to go as soon as they have roots. The thicker the stem the better.
    Keesje likes this.

    Keesje Well-Known Member

    I did read your post non-stop.
    Looks like you realised most things I only had in my head, and was not sure if it would work.
    Except for the cloning system, I am still sorting that out.
    Last edited: May 5, 2018
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    Rakin Well-Known Member

    Lot of variations here. You are going to have to see how long it takes for the clones to root and then how fast they veg. For 25 in a 4x4 I would imagine a month minimum and probably more like 6-8 weeks from cut to flip. I would start with probably 6 weeks from cut as an plan and go from there. Obviously if it’s going faster then you thought then do less time and adjust for next time. I used to do 3-4 weeks from cut in 1 liter bottles.
    JSB99 likes this.

    JSB99 Well-Known Member

    Wouldn't the length of time it takes for one clone to root be the same as 25 clones in the same cloner? He might have to have a few larger plants to get that many clones from at once. Unless he has a generous pharmer, or a lot of money to buy that many at the canna-store. If he plans on doing this many every few months, he'd probably have to have a couple mother's under powerful light(s). He's also going to have to have a decent sized cloner to root around 40, and take the best 25.

    Just playing devil's advocate here. I only grow four plants at a time, and haven't actually done a SOG, so my thoughts are just the from rocks in my head shifting around a bit :lol:
    Roger A. Shrubber likes this.

    Rakin Well-Known Member

    Not necessarily. All strains I’ve had rooted a little different from the other and veg a little differently. Even a lot of times with just one strain you might have some stubborn clones and some that are above the rest. Doing more cuts and culling them out helps. I got to where I would do perpetual and sometimes a few clones would get held back a few extra days. But I only had room for like a 10% failure on clones
    JSB99 likes this.

    CannaBruh Well-Known Member

    lean manufacturing helps, work on routing times, queue systems etc
    Then experiment
    I know some growers to flower right after feet, and others veg for a week and others veg for more, all using SOG style growing and various queue systems, pull systems, FIFO etc
    willhmx04 and JSB99 like this.

    StinkBud Well-Known Member

    24,420 minutes.
    willhmx04 likes this.

    Gquebed Well-Known Member

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