growing older seeds

Wanna B. Wasted

Wanna B. Wasted

Active Member
High all and good day,

I have some seeds that are about 4 years old now, four years ago I tried a couple and failed, got frustrated and put it on the back burner ( no pun intend, and yes I am a noob at this, never grown before) so now I am ready to give it another try. I have tried germinating by soaking in a cup of water, the results are 0 for 6:(. I got 3 to split open and show a tiny sprout, I put them in a moist paper towel and after another 5 days there was no more growth. The rest of them did absolutely nothing. I did not have any problem germinating the seeds four years ago, and I trust the source of the seed provider, that fail is on me. So is it too late for these seed?
 
Cyrus420

Cyrus420

Well-Known Member
Just pop them in the soil and sprinkle with about a shot's worth of water.

I just germinated some bagseed I found in the laundry room I know has been there 6+ months.

Seeds can keep for a really long time and don't take this the wrong way but it's usually the grower over complicating their germinating process what keeps them from popping. I've never put seeds in a glass of water, never wrapped them in a damp paper towel just plain old soil and water.

Try making 1/2" holes in the soil, dropping your seed in, LOOSELY covering them, and pouring a tiny bit of water over the patch where you buried it. If you don't have sprouts within a week chances are the seeds are either no good or are taking longer than usual to sprout.
 
Wanna B. Wasted

Wanna B. Wasted

Active Member
Thanx for the tip, during this stage, is there any light needed or a plain dark, warm environment, FYI this is an indoor operation.
 
cindysid

cindysid

Well-Known Member
I just germinated some from 2011 and had about a 80% germination rate. They took an extra day or two to sprout though. I started mine in water and then planted into Happy Frog when they sprouted. They are doing great...wish I remembered what strain they were...lol
 
Wanna B. Wasted

Wanna B. Wasted

Active Member
ok, lets explore the storage of the seeds that I have for kicks and giggles, they have been kept in a little zip lock bag, in a totally dark shelf. Is that proper?
 
Larry {the} Gardener

Larry {the} Gardener

Well-Known Member
cindysid said:
I just germinated some from 2011 and had about a 80% germination rate. They took an extra day or two to sprout though. I started mine in water and then planted into Happy Frog when they sprouted. They are doing great...wish I remembered what strain they were...lol
Click to expand...
I popped a few of the Sidetracked: F1 seeds from 1988. They had a 100% germination rate. The BIL had kept them in a bag of shake in the freezer.
 
SPLFreak808

SPLFreak808

Well-Known Member
Wanna B. Wasted said:
ok, lets explore the storage of the seeds that I have for kicks and giggles, they have been kept in a little zip lock bag, in a totally dark shelf. Is that proper?
Click to expand...
It will work at the cost of shelf-life. 6 years is pretty damn good for seeds sitting around in a random bag but i would still reccomend a little refrigerator seed bank that can keep moisture and light away.
 
Indefinately

Indefinately

Well-Known Member
cindysid said:
I just germinated some from 2011 and had about a 80% germination rate. They took an extra day or two to sprout though. I started mine in water and then planted into Happy Frog when they sprouted. They are doing great...wish I remembered what strain they were...lol
Click to expand...
Hey bud,

You should detail what your process was and how long each stage took.
As it seams you have the answer to the ops question.

How long did you leave the seeds in water?
How long does it normally take as you said it took a little longer?
Then what did you do ?

Was the water tap water?
Boiled water?
Ph adjusted ?

Did you scratch the seed at all before placing in glass?

And what is a happy frog?

Haven't grown in many many years.
Thinking about popping a few seeds out my self.
I normally use a prop mat and clone box with Pete pellets or rockwool.

But my seeds are a few years on.

So curious to hear you opinion.

Cheers mate
 
Woyaboy

Woyaboy

Well-Known Member
Cyrus420 said:
Just pop them in the soil and sprinkle with about a shot's worth of water.

I just germinated some bagseed I found in the laundry room I know has been there 6+ months.

Seeds can keep for a really long time and don't take this the wrong way but it's usually the grower over complicating their germinating process what keeps them from popping. I've never put seeds in a glass of water, never wrapped them in a damp paper towel just plain old soil and water.

Try making 1/2" holes in the soil, dropping your seed in, LOOSELY covering them, and pouring a tiny bit of water over the patch where you buried it. If you don't have sprouts within a week chances are the seeds are either no good or are taking longer than usual to sprout.
Click to expand...
What do you recommend for ambient temps? I am one of those "over complicating" kind of people. NONE of my fucking seeds have sprouted, well all except the free seed they gave me. (figures). Do you re-water that soil at all over the course of the week? A shot's worth of water till it sprouts, at least where I live, seems like the medium would dry rather quickly.
 
SickSickWorld

SickSickWorld

Well-Known Member
Woyaboy said:
What do you recommend for ambient temps? I am one of those "over complicating" kind of people. NONE of my fucking seeds have sprouted, well all except the free seed they gave me. (figures). Do you re-water that soil at all over the course of the week? A shot's worth of water till it sprouts, at least where I live, seems like the medium would dry rather quickly.
Click to expand...
If you're growing in soil, it's really really simple. Best practise would be to prep your pots a day or two ahead of time, so mix your soil and perlite/coco/amendments if using, and then fill your pots to the top. Bump your pot bottoms against the ground a couple of times to help settle soil and get rid of air pockets. Water fully until you get a bit of run off out the bottom, and then sit them in you grow tent for a day or so to warm up. This way, you already know your soil is nice and warm and appropiately moist without being too wet.

Then, take your fucken pinkie finger, finger yourself a nice little hole no deeper than first knuckle, drop your seed, and dust over some loose dirt. Don't pack down. Now the hard bit.... Step away and leave it. Some seeds I've used (Speed Seeds) popped within 24 hours, others (TH Seeds) have taken 8-9 days. If you feel the medium is getting too dry, it's probably not. If you MUST water, use a spray bottle to dampen the surface; pouring water can disturb that little seed fella. I sometimes cover my pots with cling film to help keep it nice and humid in there, but then again sometimes I can't find the cling film, so it just doesn't happen.

95% successful germ rate, 5% impatient new grower poking about and fucking up.

Love.
 
Dr. Who

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
Indefinately said:
Hey bud,

You should detail what your process was and how long each stage took.
As it seams you have the answer to the ops question.

How long did you leave the seeds in water?
How long does it normally take as you said it took a little longer?
Then what did you do ?

Was the water tap water?
Boiled water?
Ph adjusted ?

Did you scratch the seed at all before placing in glass?

And what is a happy frog?

Haven't grown in many many years.
Thinking about popping a few seeds out my self.
I normally use a prop mat and clone box with Pete pellets or rockwool.

But my seeds are a few years on.

So curious to hear you opinion.

Cheers mate
Click to expand...
I was just about to comment on water and soaking! Good questions!

It should be noted that many "High end" breeders are now sending out notice with their gear that they say to NOT presoak seeds as they are getting too many requests for replacements because of "drowning" seeds!

Reason why would be that some are using distilled, boiled or water set out from taps to remove chlorine etc.!!!
These waters contain at BEST only TRACE amounts of dissolved o2 (you know, oxygen).
Seeds need to exchange o2 in the moisture/water they use to pop!

I do scuff my older seeds and new ones that are 2-3 times bigger then average seeds. You know, matchbook/sandpaper thing!

The best solution for this problem is to add 1oz of H2o2 to 1 pint of pH adjusted to 6.5 water and then soak in that solution. You can use as much or as little of the water as you want to soak in. NO longer then 24 hr soak (just to be safe) before moving to a media ! The idea is to not pop IN the water!

I use the paper towel method with the o2 enhanced water and have for years and years! Never had any problems! Fresh seeds go 24hrs and have popped and have perfect taps roots.
You might be careful of using a prop mat! If it goes over 10 degrees (F) from air ambient. It could reduce success rates...I simply find a warmer place in the grow and put my container there. I have had old seeds (up to 14 years) take as long as 3-4 days to pop. The older the seed the less vigor it will have! ASAP get that "retirement aged" popped bean into a media and deliver some seedling feed, as older beans are lacking the nutrient stores they need to get them going.

Seed storage should be done in non - air permeable containment and stored in a fridge!

Oh yeah, Happy Frog is a soil by Fox Farm.
 
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ButchyBoy

ButchyBoy

Well-Known Member
Great info Dr Who.

I have been doing it wrong all these years. :lol:

I have a bunch of seeds from the 80's that I put in a 35mm film container and tossed in a drawer. I recently started popping some of them looking for something tasty. I drop one in a cup of fresh water over night and set it on one of my veg lights. The next day I put it into a solo cup of used soil and add 60ml (1/4 cup) of fresh water.. Within a couple of days I have a plant to stare at until it is time to see what it will do. :mrgreen:

I have a few hundred seeds in storage. Do they really need to be refrigerated? Mine are in my veg room at 78 degrees.
 
Dr. Who

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
ButchyBoy said:
Great info Dr Who.

I have been doing it wrong all these years. :lol:

I have a bunch of seeds from the 80's that I put in a 35mm film container and tossed in a drawer. I recently started popping some of them looking for something tasty. I drop one in a cup of fresh water over night and set it on one of my veg lights. The next day I put it into a solo cup of used soil and add 60ml (1/4 cup) of fresh water.. Within a couple of days I have a plant to stare at until it is time to see what it will do. :mrgreen:

I have a few hundred seeds in storage. Do they really need to be refrigerated? Mine are in my veg room at 78 degrees.
Click to expand...
You get better success rates and a healthier seedling with cold storage beans! I use a commercial heavy non-air permeable vac sealing system we use on the farm, for sealing the beans for storage. I would guess that any "food" sealer like "foodsaver" would work well too.
 
potpimp

potpimp

Sector 5 Moderator
A heated seed mat is well worth the money IMO. Just make sure to turn it on and check it an hour later to make sure it's not too hot. You can put hand towel or two between the mat and the tray with the Rapid Rooters / rock wool cubes / potting soil, if it's too hot; a thermometer is recommended. Warmth is one of the keys to germination.
 
Indefinately

Indefinately

Well-Known Member
Dr. Who said:
I was just about to comment on water and soaking! Good questions!

It should be noted that many "High end" breeders are now sending out notice with their gear that they say to NOT presoak seeds as they are getting too many requests for replacements because of "drowning" seeds!

Reason why would be that some are using distilled, boiled or water set out from taps to remove chlorine etc.!!!
These waters contain at BEST only TRACE amounts of dissolved o2 (you know, oxygen).
Seeds need to exchange o2 in the moisture/water they use to pop!

I do scuff my older seeds and new ones that are 2-3 times bigger then average seeds. You know, matchbook/sandpaper thing!

The best solution for this problem is to add 1oz of H2o2 to 1 pint of pH adjusted to 6.5 water and then soak in that solution. You can use as much or as little of the water as you want to soak in. NO longer then 24 hr soak (just to be safe) before moving to a media ! The idea is to not pop IN the water!

I use the paper towel method with the o2 enhanced water and have for years and years! Never had any problems! Fresh seeds go 24hrs and have popped and have perfect taps roots.
You might be careful of using a prop mat! If it goes over 10 degrees (F) from air ambient. It could reduce success rates...I simply find a warmer place in the grow and put my container there. I have had old seeds (up to 14 years) take as long as 3-4 days to pop. The older the seed the less vigor it will have! ASAP get that "retirement aged" popped bean into a media and deliver some seedling feed, as older beans are lacking the nutrient stores they need to get them going.

Seed storage should be done in non - air permeable containment and stored in a fridge!

Oh yeah, Happy Frog is a soil by Fox Farm.
Click to expand...
Nice work Dr,

I'm sure all your info help many!

What's the consensus on whether or not you "need"to ph balance and H2o2 the water before soaking beans?

You guys think it's absulutely necessary?

Not really touched on by many of the literature and breeders.

Indefinately
" Let it be green in 2016 "
 
Indefinately

Indefinately

Well-Known Member
potpimp said:
A heated seed mat is well worth the money IMO. Just make sure to turn it on and check it an hour later to make sure it's not too hot. You can put hand towel or two between the mat and the tray with the Rapid Rooters / rock wool cubes / potting soil, if it's too hot; a thermometer is recommended. Warmth is one of the keys to germination.
Click to expand...
Hey Pot Pimp,

This is how I have always have started my seeds in the past, with great success.

But they have always been fresh.

These seed are 5 or so years old.
So I was tossing up soaking them in some water before putting them on the propagation mat in there station.

Interesting hearing everyone's personal opinion.
Hope all the opinions are from experienced growers helping out the up and coming greenies.

Indefinately
" Let it be Green in 2016 "
 
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