Fuel cells will replace batteries soon.

Nevaeh420

Nevaeh420

Well-Known Member
If fuel cells get cheap enough, and liquid hydrogen is bottled in little cans like butane bottles, then there are many more pros then cons to is viability.

The fuel cells would virtually last forever if constructed right and you could "charge" anything in a matter of seconds compared to the hours it takes to use a battery connected to a wall charger.

Think about it, you could "charge" you smart phone, tablet, laptop, or any gizmo or gadget in a few seconds compared to an hour or longer. Just add the liquid hydrogen and you have electrical power for a long time, probably longer then a rechargeable battery if the hydrogen reservoir/compartment was large enough.

There are more pros then cons here. This is going to be the future of electronic devices, just give it some time.

You might be able to charge your smart phone 50 times or so (more or less) from one small bottle of liquid hydrogen that may have cost 3 dollars or so.

I see a big potential in fuel cells that are integrated into electronics.

~PEACE~
 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
You are right, but I have a secret to tell you. They are here already. And you don't need bottled, cryogenic hydrogen.

What if, there was a nice substance already that was packed with hydrogen? 4 H and 1 C is Methane. Natural gas.

And there has just been a commericalziation of the latest MIT breakthrough. http://www.redoxpowersystems.com/
 
Nevaeh420

Nevaeh420

Well-Known Member
Doer said:
You are right, but I have a secret to tell you. They are here already. And you don't need bottled, cryogenic hydrogen.

What if, there was a nice substance already that was packed with hydrogen? 4 H and 1 C is Methane. Natural gas.

And there has just been a commericalziation of the latest MIT breakthrough. http://www.redoxpowersystems.com/
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See, you learn something everyday. At least I just did.

I bet natural gas is good but I would postulate that liquid hydrogen is better.

I'm just waiting to see all the gadgets equipped with fuel cells running of of liquid hydrogen, its a much better way then rechargeable batteries.

This idea of replacing rechargeable batteries with fuel cells is kind of a prophecy of Mine. It could happen any day now. Right now its just a prediction of Mine that I have had for about a year or so.

They would have to make the power, liquid hydrogen, readily available though, maybe in the form of bottles like how butane is stored. I know fuel cells have been around for MANY years but I have never heard of integrating them into gadgets yet.

~PEACE~
 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
Nevaeh420 said:
See, you learn something everyday. At least I just did.

I bet natural gas is good but I would postulate that liquid hydrogen is better.

I'm just waiting to see all the gadgets equipped with fuel cells running of of liquid hydrogen, its a much better way then rechargeable batteries.

This idea of replacing rechargeable batteries with fuel cells is kind of a prophecy of Mine. It could happen any day now. Right now its just a prediction of Mine that I have had for about a year or so.

They would have to make the power, liquid hydrogen, readily available though, maybe in the form of bottles like how butane is stored. I know fuel cells have been around for MANY years but I have never heard of integrating them into gadgets yet.

~PEACE~
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Hydrogen is such a tiny molecule it is hard to contain. And at over 2x the energy density of methane, can be much more dangerous.

You can't pump hydrogen out of the ground like methane, It is expensive to make, very hard to transport and impossible to store longer term.

You get it from Methane or water. Why bother?
 
tyler.durden

tyler.durden

Well-Known Member
Doer said:
Hydrogen is such a tiny molecule it is hard to contain. And at over 2x the energy density of methane, can be much more dangerous.

You can't pump hydrogen out of the ground like methane, It is expensive to make, very hard to transport and impossible to store longer term.

You get it from Methane or water. Why bother?
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George doesn't care about reason, facts or critical thought. All that interests him is being a prophet and spewing out crazy ideas in complete ignorance. He doesn't care to learn about reality or acquire knowledge, he simply wants his ideas to be cool without putting any mental effort into them. It's good that you're here to put your finger in the crazy dam, lest it break and flood this sub-forum...
 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
tyler.durden said:
George doesn't care about reason, facts or critical thought. All that interests him is being a prophet and spewing out crazy ideas in complete ignorance. He doesn't care to learn about reality or acquire knowledge, he simply wants his ideas to be cool without putting any mental effort into them. It's good that you're here to put your finger in the crazy dam, lest it break and flood this sub-forum...
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And my fine forum friend, this is the second time you have engaged in character assassination. None of us have any need for your scorn.
That is your deal...on you. I move on. Try it. You might like it.

Please, he didn't act like that here. Leave your hatin' for somewhere else. Please. This is a proper science discussion, that you are messing with for your on Small side. Nothing personal. ;)
 
tyler.durden

tyler.durden

Well-Known Member
Doer said:
And my fine forum friend, this is the second time you have engaged in character assassination. None of us have any need for your scorn.
That is your deal...on you. I move on. Try it. You might like it.

Please, he didn't act like that here. Leave your hatin' for somewhere else. Please. This is a proper science discussion, that you are messing with for your on Small side. Nothing personal. ;)
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I should have read that you guys were getting along in the other thread before I made my last post. George's entire attitude and mindset bothers me, so you are correct, it is my baggage. Everything I say about him I believe to be true, not merely trolling. He wants to be thought of as special and the second coming of christ to save the world, then admits to not being willing to do the reading or research behind scientific principles or concepts. He then often comes up with scientifically unsound or physically impossible ideas and proffers them up to others to verify or discredit. He often somehow manages to do this with an air of arrogance and/or superiority. I find that despicable, I can't help it. Ultimately, I am attempting to either be a part of breaking his delusion, or falling short of that, at least expose him to others so they know what they're dealing with. In the former scenario he wins, in the latter I feel the rest of us do...

P.S. I don't often take things personally, my skin's pretty thick. Plus, I really dig your fearless, witty, chaotic style. Keep doin' yo thing, Doer ;)
 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
tyler.durden said:
I should have read that you guys were getting along in the other thread before I made my last post. George's entire attitude and mindset bothers me, so you are correct, it is my baggage. Everything I say about him I believe to be true, not merely trolling. He wants to be thought of as special and the second coming of christ to save the world, then admits to not being willing to do the reading or research behind scientific principles or concepts. He then often comes up with scientifically unsound or physically impossible ideas and proffers them up to others to verify or discredit. He often somehow manages to do this with an air of arrogance and/or superiority. I find that despicable, I can't help it. Ultimately, I am attempting to either be a part of breaking his delusion, or falling short of that, at least expose him to others so they know what they're dealing with. In the former scenario he wins, in the latter I feel the rest of us do...

P.S. I don't often take things personally, my skin's pretty thick. Plus, I really dig your fearless, witty, chaotic style. Keep doin' yo thing, Doer ;)
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If you think I am getting along with any of you, you have missed it all together. :)

I believe I can work with both of you. Dark Mind Influence for ALL, remember?
 
Nevaeh420

Nevaeh420

Well-Known Member
Doer said:
Well, speak of the Debil, here's a start.

http://www.gizmag.com/alter-hydrogen-fuel-cell-bike/29768/?utm_source=Gizmag+Subscribers&utm_campaign=accf9ee2bf-UA-2235360-4&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_65b67362bd-accf9ee2bf-91265109

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So it totally possible to bottle hydrogen. That's all I needed to know.

The next step in fulfilling My prophecy is to get the fuel cells into gadgets like smart phones, laptops, tables, etc.

Doer, what do you think would be the pros and cons of replacing batteries with fuel cells powered by bottled hydrogen?

~PEACE~
 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
Nevaeh420 said:
So it totally possible to bottle hydrogen. That's all I needed to know.

The next step in fulfilling My prophecy is to get the fuel cells into gadgets like smart phones, laptops, tables, etc.

Doer, what do you think would be the pros and cons of replacing batteries with fuel cells powered by bottled hydrogen?

~PEACE~
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Engineering is all in the the math. Pros and Cons is marketing. :)
 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
2xcharming said:
As long as they make one that super powers my vibrator, I'll be happy.:hump:
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Well, I could use your vibrator for.....never mind...I'm not suppose to talk to married ladies like that....according to their husbands. :)

I must say the image of a hydrogen fueled vibrator in your hands is .....powerful.
 
heckler73

heckler73

Well-Known Member
Nevaeh420 said:
So it totally possible to bottle hydrogen. That's all I needed to know.

The next step in fulfilling My prophecy is to get the fuel cells into gadgets like smart phones, laptops, tables, etc.

Doer, what do you think would be the pros and cons of replacing batteries with fuel cells powered by bottled hydrogen?

~PEACE~
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Con: Energy requirements. What are the efficiency ratings on the cells, and how much energy is required to create/capture hydrogen?
Pros: It keeps tree-huggers and sci-fi types happy.
 
ginjawarrior

ginjawarrior

Well-Known Member
Doer said:
And the big guys jump in....2 H fuelers at the LA Auto show.

http://www.gizmag.com/fuel-cells-la-auto-show/29900/?utm_source=Gizmag+Subscribers&utm_campaign=25517dd304-UA-2235360-4&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_65b67362bd-25517dd304-91265109
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Hyundai giving quite an interesting offer

Hyundai will begin production of the Tucson Fuel Cell at its plant in Ulsan, South Korea in February. To help entice early adopters, it is offering the same At Your Service Valet Maintenance program as on the Equus, along with unlimited free hydrogen.
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When we have decent hydrogen refuelling facilities and clean co2 free production of hydrogen then this may take off pretty quick

 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
What is beyond power?

Beamed power. What is possibly the best beam of all?

Laser. So, the company that won the beam propulsion event last year also got a bunch of money from DARPA.

They now have a beam power demo for an indoor e-helicopter. So, cool. I have a couple of those but with a 2 minute battery...lacks something in the fun department.

They were able to keep it in the air for 12 hrs! That is way beyond boring, for me. :) Is it better than hydrogen fuel cells? Maybe a lot better. Maybe 100x better. See page 5.

http://lasermotive.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Laser-Power-Beaming-Fact-Sheet.pdf

So, conjectures about tech winners, like predicting bottled H2 power, is only as good as the next breakthrough.

H2 may never get going. We just have to see about that.
 
ginjawarrior

ginjawarrior

Well-Known Member
Doer said:
What is beyond power?

Beamed power. What is possibly the best beam of all?

Laser. So, the company that won the beam propulsion event last year also got a bunch of money from DARPA.

They now have a beam power demo for an indoor e-helicopter. So, cool. I have a couple of those but with a 2 minute battery...lacks something in the fun department.

They were able to keep it in the air for 12 hrs! That is way beyond boring, for me. :) Is it better than hydrogen fuel cells? Maybe a lot better. Maybe 100x better. See page 5.

http://lasermotive.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Laser-Power-Beaming-Fact-Sheet.pdf

So, conjectures about tech winners, like predicting bottled H2 power, is only as good as the next breakthrough.

H2 may never get going. We just have to see about that.
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Induction charging is already being used for public transport
http://www.wired.com/autopia/2013/08/induction-charged-buses/

But that's for set routes, I'd imagine it could be possible (if impractical) to change the roads in a city to accommodate private transportation but to change all roads a cross the country isn't practical

Would be easier to retrofit gas stations with hydrogen pumps
 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
It will be a test of the market. If I can just get in the Beam lane, I don't need to stop. And we don't need the very involved, H2 dispensing infrastructure and million of cars driving and crashing on CHG.

Here is a review of beam power in general. The Pros and Cons of Laser vs Microwave are interesting. And on page 10 they get into the idea of Solar Pumped laser at 30% efficiency. That is much better than solar cells converted to microwave beam.

http://trs-new.jpl.nasa.gov/dspace/bitstream/2014/16855/1/99-0263.pdf

I also been reading about the waste heat steam engine. The biggest output of a fuel cell is still heat.
 
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