Chemical Trails????

TheBrutalTruth

Well-Known Member
People, please, jets left those trails 30 years ago when I was a kid. It's not some conspiracy, it's just the wake the jet leaves behind. Sometimes they dissipate faster because the wind is blowing harder.

OMG, no wonder the rumor is that pot makes people paranoid.........
I thought it was supposed to be crack or Meth... though thinking about it, my cousin does seem a little paranoid, but that's probably the normal desire to avoid cops.

Then again, I have the same desire to avoid cops, especially up here in Ohio. I swear this state has to have the most robotic police I have ever seen. No personalities, and no intelligence...
 

s.c.mtn.hillbilly

Well-Known Member
don't ask me how I know(!); but in my travels, I discovered a psychological fact: unsafe(perceived) early childhood turns you into mel gibson in 'conspiracy theory'! most tinfoil hatters(the rest are tweekers!) fall into this category.
 

BCtrippin

Well-Known Member
don't ask me how I know(!); but in my travels, I discovered a psychological fact: unsafe(perceived) early childhood turns you into mel gibson in 'conspiracy theory'! most tinfoil hatters(the rest are tweekers!) fall into this category.

I dont know why everyone assumes that people who consider the possibility of Chemtrails are conspiracy theorists wearing tin foil hats.

No one here has ever denied Vapor trails, OR claimed that all vapor trails are "chemtrails"


Do some research on GeoEngineering If you honestly dont think that the USA government is interested in geoengineering then your a close minded fool. China has been seeding clouds for Years.

Do you really believe that an American government would let China spend years and years researching Geoengineering while they sit back and just dont care? The USA government will want to know just as much, if not More then China has learned. Theres only one way to find out, and thats by running experiments. And you definitely dont hear about very many American Geoengineering experiments....probably because no one would approve half the crap they want to try.



If the government wants to do something, but they feel like the public wont approve, they dont stop doing it...

They build secret military bases and deny that they exist till everyone shows up with photos and says "ITS RIGHT THERE, HOW CAN YOU DENY THAT EXISTS?!?"...... even after the satellite photos started showing up the government STILL denies Area 51 because if they admit it, then they have to follow sanctions and regulations.



:peace:
 

TheBrutalTruth

Well-Known Member
I dont know why everyone assumes that people who consider the possibility of Chemtrails are conspiracy theorists wearing tin foil hats.

No one here has ever denied Vapor trails, OR claimed that all vapor trails are "chemtrails"


Do some research on GeoEngineering If you honestly dont think that the USA government is interested in geoengineering then your a close minded fool. China has been seeding clouds for Years.

Do you really believe that an American government would let China spend years and years researching Geoengineering while they sit back and just dont care? The USA government will want to know just as much, if not More then China has learned. Theres only one way to find out, and thats by running experiments. And you definitely dont hear about very many American Geoengineering experiments....probably because no one would approve half the crap they want to try.



If the government wants to do something, but they feel like the public wont approve, they dont stop doing it...

They build secret military bases and deny that they exist till everyone shows up with photos and says "ITS RIGHT THERE, HOW CAN YOU DENY THAT EXISTS?!?"...... even after the satellite photos started showing up the government STILL denies Area 51 because if they admit it, then they have to follow sanctions and regulations.



:peace:
What sanctions and regulations?

It probably already has the area above Area 51 registered as Military Air Space, so Commercial Flights aren't likely to go there.

There's no Sanctions regarding how many military bases a country can have inside its borders, or regulations dictating the same.

If there were any gross violations of human rights out there some one would have leaked it.

If there were little green aliens out there, the same would have happened.

That doesn't mean there aren't black budget items at the Groom Lake Facility (Advanced Stealth Technologies lead no doubt by the Skunk Words).

The problem with jumping at shadows, is that shadows aren't solid...
 

BCtrippin

Well-Known Member
What sanctions and regulations?

It probably already has the area above Area 51 registered as Military Air Space, so Commercial Flights aren't likely to go there.

There's no Sanctions regarding how many military bases a country can have inside its borders, or regulations dictating the same.

If there were any gross violations of human rights out there some one would have leaked it.

If there were little green aliens out there, the same would have happened.

That doesn't mean there aren't black budget items at the Groom Lake Facility (Advanced Stealth Technologies lead no doubt by the Skunk Words).

The problem with jumping at shadows, is that shadows aren't solid...

Again, no one here is claiming aliens or any of that CRAP. I dont understand why people always throw anything that is unknown into the BS category.

There HAVE been human rights violations at Area 51. There have been many that have been leaked.....do some research. It doesnt make the news, it gets swept under the rug like everything else at Area 51. And now that everyone knows about Area 51, I would bet money that they went ahead and built another "non existent" facility.


Black Budget Items.... Exactly. So are you saying the USA government has absolutely no interest in Geoengineering?


Whos jumping at shadows? Im just not so quick to chalk it up as BS.



:peace:
 

TheBrutalTruth

Well-Known Member
Again, no one here is claiming aliens or any of that CRAP. I dont understand why people always throw anything that is unknown into the BS category.

There HAVE been human rights violations at Area 51. There have been many that have been leaked.....do some research. It doesnt make the news, it gets swept under the rug like everything else at Area 51. And now that everyone knows about Area 51, I would bet money that they went ahead and built another "non existent" facility.


Black Budget Items.... Exactly. So are you saying the USA government has absolutely no interest in Geoengineering?


Whos jumping at shadows? Im just not so quick to chalk it up as BS.



:peace:

I haven't challenged your claims about attempts made at Weather Control, just I fail to see any point in relating them to the contrails and vapor trails in the sky.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weather_control

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloud_seeding
This one should answer the questions about what chemicals are used, Silver Iodide, and Dry Ice (CO2)

With an NFPA 704 rating of Blue 2, silver iodide can cause temporary incapacitation or possible residual injury (e.g., chloroform) with intense or continued but not chronic exposure. However, there have been several detailed ecological studies that showed negligible environmental and health impacts. [2][3][4]. The toxicity of silver and silver compounds (from silver iodide) was shown to be of low order in some studies. These findings likely result from the minute amounts of silver generated by cloud seeding, which are 100 times less than industry emissions into the atmosphere in many parts of the world, or individual exposure from tooth fillings[5].


Modern uses

The largest cloud seeding system in the world is that of the People's Republic of China, which believes that it increases the amount of rain over several increasingly arid regions, including its capital city, Beijing, by firing silver iodide rockets into the sky where rain is desired. There is even political strife caused by neighboring regions which accuse each other of "stealing rain" using cloud seeding[5]. About 24 countries currently practice weather modification operationally. China has used cloud seeding in Beijing just before the 2008 Olympic Games in order to clear the air of pollution. Again, see above for disputes regarding the Chinese claims. [6]
In the United States, cloud seeding is used to increase precipitation in areas experiencing drought, to reduce the size of hailstones that form in thunderstorms, and to reduce the amount of fog in and around airports. Cloud seeding is also occasionally used by major ski resorts to induce snowfall. Eleven western states and one Canadian province (Alberta) have ongoing weather modification operational programs [7]. In January 2006, an $8.8 million cloud seeding project began in Wyoming to examine the effects of cloud seeding on snowfall over Wyoming's Medicine Bow, Sierra Madre, and Wind River mountain ranges. [8]
A number of commercial companies, such as Aero Systems Incorporated [9], Atmospherics Incorporated [10], North American Weather Consultants [11], Weather Modification Incorporated [12], Weather Enhancement Technologies International [13], Seeding Operations and Atmospheric Research (SOAR) [14], offer weather modification services centered on cloud seeding. The USAF proposed its use on the battlefield in 1996, although the U.S. signed an international treaty in 1978 banning the use of weather modification for hostile purposes.
In Australia, CSIRO’s activities in Tasmania in the 1960s were successful[citation needed]. Seeding over the Hydro-Electricity Commission catchment area on the Central Plateau achieved rainfall increases as high as 30% in autumn. The Tasmanian experiments were so successful that the Commission has regularly undertaken seeding ever since in mountainous parts of the State.




Russian military pilots seeded clouds over Belarus after the Chernobyl disaster to remove radioactive particles from clouds heading toward Moscow.[15]


http://www.universetoday.com/2008/06/19/when-cloud-seeding-goes-wrong-cement-chunk-falls-from-the-sky/


http://ask.yahoo.com/20020920.html


http://www.nawcinc.com/wmfaq.html


http://www.edwardsaquifer.net/cloudseeding.html


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Stormfury


There were no more near-seedings until 1969. In the interim, equipment was improved. What once was the primitive method of hand-dumping dry ice was replaced with rocket canisters loaded with silver iodide, and then gun-like devices mounted on the wings of the airplanes that fired silver iodide into the clouds. Observation equipment was improved.[9] Additional reconnaissance data was utilized to modify the working hypothesis. The new theory took cumulus towers outside the eyewall into account. According to the revised theory, by seeding the towers, latent heat would be released. This would trigger the start of new convection, which would then cause a new eyewall. Since the new eyewall was outside the original one, the first eyewall would be choked off of energy and fall apart. In addition, since the new eyewall was broader than the old one, the winds would be lower due to a less sharp pressure difference.[9]
Hurricane Debbie provided the best opportunity to test the underpinnings of Project Stormfury. In many ways it was the perfect storm for seeding: it did not threaten any land; it passed within range of seeding aircraft; and was intense with a distinct eye.[13] On August 18 and again on August 20, thirteen planes flew out to the storm to monitor and seed it. On the first day, windspeeds fell by 31%.[11] On the second day, windspeeds fell by 18%.[11] Both changes were consistent with Stormfury's working hypothesis. Indeed, the results were so encouraging that "a greatly expanded research program was planned."[14] Among other conclusions was the need for frequent seeding at close to hourly intervals.[15]
The 1970 and 1971 seasons provided no suitable seeding candidates.[11] Despite this, flights were conducted into Hurricane Ginger. Ginger was not a suitable storm for seeding, due to its diffuse, indistinct nature. The seeding had no effect. Ginger was the last seeding done by Project Stormfury.[11]


After the seedings


Stormfury inside Tropical Storm Dorothy


Atlantic hurricanes meeting all of the criteria were extremely rare, which made duplication of the "success" reached with Hurricane Debbie extremely difficult. Meanwhile, developments outside of meteorology hindered the cause of hurricane modification.
In the early 1970s, the Navy withdrew from the project.[16] Stormfury began to refocus its efforts on understanding, rather than modifying, tropical cyclones.[17] At the same time, the Project's aircraft were nearing the end of their operational lifetimes. At the cost of $30 million (year unknown)[16] two Lockheed P-3's were acquired. Due to the rarity of Atlantic hurricanes meeting the safety requirements, plans were made to move Stormfury to the Pacific and experiment on the large number of typhoons there.[10] This action required many of the same safety requirements as in the Atlantic, but had the advantage of a much higher number of potential subjects.[16]
The plan was to begin again in 1976, and seed typhoons by flying out of Guam. However, political issues blocked the plan. The People's Republic of China announced that it would not be happy if a seeded typhoon changed course and made landfall on its shores,[10] while Japan declared itself willing to put up with difficulties caused by typhoons because that country got more than half of its rainfall from tropical cyclones.[10]
Similar plans to operate Stormfury in the eastern north Pacific or in the Australian region also collapsed.[18]


Failure of the working hypothesis

Multiple eyewalls had been detected in very strong hurricanes before, including Typhoon Sarah[19] and Hurricane Donna,[20] although the double eyes were usually seen in very intense systems. Double eyewalls were also seen post-seeding in some of the seeded storms. At the time however, the only known times that rapid changes in eyewall diameter, other than during presumably successful seedings, was during rapid changes in intensity.[21] It remained controversial whether the seedings caused the secondary eyewalls or whether it was just a natural cycle.[22] Basically, if eyewall changes similar to those observed in seeded hurricanes were rare in unseeded tropical cyclones, it would provide powerful evidence that Project Stormfury was successful. Inversely, if such changes were common in unseeded systems, it would throw doubt on the very hypothesis and assumptions driving Project Stormfury.[23]
Data and observations began to accumulate that debunked Stormfury's working hypothesis. Beginning with Hurricanes Anita and David, flights by Hurricane Hunter aircraft encountered events similar to what happened in "successfully" seeded storms.[23] Anita itself had a weak example of a concentric eyewall cycle, and David a more dramatic one.[22] In August 1980, Hurricane Allen passed through the Atlantic, Caribbean, and Gulf of Mexico. It also underwent changes in the diameter of its eye and developed multiple eyewalls. All this was consistent with the behavior that would have been expected of Allen had it been seeded. Thus, what Stormfury was accomplishing by seeding was also happening on its own.[24]
Other observations in Hurricanes Anita, David, Frederic, and Allen[25] also discovered that tropical cyclones have very little supercooled water and a great deal of ice crystals.[26] The reason that tropical cyclones have little supercooled water is that the updrafts within such a system are too weak to prevent water from either falling as rain or freezing.[27] As cloud seeding needed supercooled water to function, the lack of supercooled water meant that seeding would have no effect.
Those observations called the basis for Project Stormfury into question. In the middle of 1983, Stormfury was finally canceled after the hypothesis guiding its efforts was debunked.[28]


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hail_cannon


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beijing_Weather_Modification_Office


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environmental_Modification_Convention


http://www.water.utah.gov/cloudseeding/pdf/facts96.pdf


Of course, the Silver Iodide and CO2 could potentially explain Chem Trails, but I really doubt that the government has come up with an idea to try seeding the exhaust trails of jets to cause it to rain.


There's no telling if the energy wasted pursuing such an action would justify the potential financial returns.


Though all this really does show that there's hardly a secret conspiracy about using vapor trails for weather modification, it's (well there's a lot) pretty much out in the open.
 

misshestermoffitt

New Member
You're in OH? We're almost neighbors, I'm in IL.

I don't like people with badges either.


I thought it was supposed to be crack or Meth... though thinking about it, my cousin does seem a little paranoid, but that's probably the normal desire to avoid cops.

Then again, I have the same desire to avoid cops, especially up here in Ohio. I swear this state has to have the most robotic police I have ever seen. No personalities, and no intelligence...
 

TheBrutalTruth

Well-Known Member
You're in OH? We're almost neighbors, I'm in IL.

I don't like people with badges either.
I've never liked people with badges, or authority, mostly because :: sneezes :: I'm allergic to Bull Shit, like stupid laws that state that there are crimes where there is no foul. I still can't figure out how if there's no harm, or no foul, there's still a crime.
 

misshestermoffitt

New Member
because we must oppress others. We can't just live and let live, we have to make stupid rules that effect the masses for the financial gain of a few.
 

s.c.mtn.hillbilly

Well-Known Member
you can bet your life that they built other sites in other states:california, utah, new mexico, arizona...if you know about it, it's not TOP SECRET...disinformation is military policy...that doesn't mean the secrets are THAT fantastic..it's the usual manhattan project redundant secrecy in spite of claus fuchs!
 

medicineman

New Member
I don't know if this is of any significance, but two days ago I spoted "chem/contrails" and last night and today it is raining. Coincidence??
 

tinyTURTLE

Well-Known Member
in my opinion those things are part of a project involving the HAARP radio array in alaska. for either weather controll or mind controll.
another theory of mine is that the trails carry in them nano-machines for what could be a variety of reasons. could be mind controll could be
some sort of highly modular signal intercept structure or used to create a surveilance 'blanket'.

at any rate, they ARE military planes. There are no civillian carriers that use planes that have 4 jet engines.
what comes to mind first is B-52, then i think c-17, but from the profile i can see from the ground it looks more like a b-52. long narrow body, slightly swept wing, 4 jet engines. my vision is excpetional (20/13 in both eyes) so i know what i am seeing is real.
just saying.
 

tinyTURTLE

Well-Known Member
What sanctions and regulations?

It probably already has the area above Area 51 registered as Military Air Space, so Commercial Flights aren't likely to go there.

There's no Sanctions regarding how many military bases a country can have inside its borders, or regulations dictating the same.

If there were any gross violations of human rights out there some one would have leaked it.

If there were little green aliens out there, the same would have happened.

That doesn't mean there aren't black budget items at the Groom Lake Facility (Advanced Stealth Technologies lead no doubt by the Skunk Words).

The problem with jumping at shadows, is that shadows aren't solid...
i think the regulations he is talking about are those regarding spending and resource allocation. as in: how much does it cost to run this base/program.

it is looked at:

http://www.gao.gov/docsearch/locate?searched=1&o=0&order_by=rel&old_keyword=Military+bases&ft=&search_type=publications&add_topic=&remove_topic=&add_type=&remove_type=&add_fed_type=&remove_fed_type=&add_fed_desc=&remove_fed_desc=&add_year=&remove_type=&keyword=Military+bases+costs

if they deny it exists, they dont need to explain the costs.
 

BCtrippin

Well-Known Member
i think the regulations he is talking about are those regarding spending and resource allocation. as in: how much does it cost to run this base/program.

it is looked at:

http://www.gao.gov/docsearch/locate?searched=1&o=0&order_by=rel&old_keyword=Military+bases&ft=&search_type=publications&add_topic=&remove_topic=&add_type=&remove_type=&add_fed_type=&remove_fed_type=&add_fed_desc=&remove_fed_desc=&add_year=&remove_type=&keyword=Military+bases+costs

if they deny it exists, they dont need to explain the costs.

Exactly. If it they deny it exists, then the law doesnt apply to them. Theres not gonna be any government inspectors stopping by to make sure things are running smoothly. The problem with Area 51/ Groom Lake is the para-military, private companies that are contracted to run the place. They dont follow the law, and they feel as if they are "above the law"

And Im sure a lot of their reasoning is that they are the "true" patriots.


:peace:
 

medicineman

New Member
it is winter. but, hmmmmmm :-|
Winter in the desert is still in the desert, meaning little to no rain. It's probably coincidence, just saying. The reason they are doing this in my "estimation", is one of two: slow global warming, or to make it rain.
 

misshestermoffitt

New Member
No chance of just a random upper jet stream pattern shift? I know it's the desert, but even the desert gets rain now and again.


I saw a chem trail and then the sun set and the moon came out...... :roll:
 

medicineman

New Member
No chance of just a random upper jet stream pattern shift? I know it's the desert, but even the desert gets rain now and again.


I saw a chem trail and then the sun set and the moon came out...... :roll:
Well, all you making light of this, may sometime in the future say, "wow they really did that", like you surmised they wouldn't, believe me they would and probably are.
 

misshestermoffitt

New Member
I'm just saying, not everytime you see a trail like that it rains. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't. It could just be that it's raining because it was going to rain. Planes left those trails back when I was a kid in the 70's.

There are a hell of a lot of planes going in and out of Atlanta every day, trails everywhere, yet they've been having a 2 year drought.
 

tinyTURTLE

Well-Known Member
I'm just saying, not everytime you see a trail like that it rains. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't. It could just be that it's raining because it was going to rain. Planes left those trails back when I was a kid in the 70's.

There are a hell of a lot of planes going in and out of Atlanta every day, trails everywhere, yet they've been having a 2 year drought.
those arent the planes. i know the difference between a contrail and a coherent vapour mass.
 
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