Are Boosters and Additives Really Necessary?

Bullshit? Well, ok if that's your opinion, but it's responses like that that discredit your intermitant lucidity. I have completly lost all respect I once had for you. Now, you're nothing more than a grouchy old man that's just pissed off at the whole world. If you think vitimin B doesn't have any effect on root growth you're stupid to boot...its really pathetic! And since I'm getting sick of your redundency and this thread has nothing left to offer. I'm done! you are not worth any more energy.

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Jack your wrong about Vitamin B-1, its been discredited in academia for many years.


http://ag.arizona.edu/yavapai/anr/hort/byg/archive/vitaminb1androotstimulators.html
http://www.colostate.edu/Dept/CoopExt/4dmg/Garden/beware.htm
ucce.ucdavis.edu/files/repositoryfiles/ca3809p15-70969.pdf

University peer reviewed Research is the basis of todays science. If you dont trust peer reviewed scientific research then your truly on your own.

OMG, can none of you people figure it out? Its the ridiculous sweeping statements, GUESSwork and general "fobbing off" of anyone elses opinion thats getting peoples backs up here.

I asked about a product to modify my PK ratio temporarily when flower generation is at its highest, and was told it wouldnt work, infact that it would reduce my yields...from a person who's never tried it? Then I got flamed to bits by UB and his fanboys who are stuck in the 70's (and UB pointed a link to a stupidly high PK flower nute)

I have a complete base nute, Im not happy with just a base nute, I wanted to try something more and got the same old shite from the grumpy old forum "celebrities", but no actual usable information...just generalised farming garbage from early nearly two decades ago that didnt contradict what I was trying to say at all.

Im still waiting on the list of stuff that either doesnt work or needs something else to work off Victorygarden, the very man who probably has a shelf of AN products that he sells everyday.

But there was no discussion, just UB and Victorygarden trying to slap people with their cocks.

OMG, can none of you people figure it out? Its the ridiculous sweeping statements, GUESSwork and general "fobbing off" of anyone elses opinion thats getting peoples backs up here.

I asked about a product to modify my PK ratio temporarily when flower generation is at its highest, and was told it wouldnt work, infact that it would reduce my yields...from a person who's never tried it? Then I got flamed to bits by UB and his fanboys who are stuck in the 70's (and UB pointed a link to a stupidly high PK flower nute)

I have a complete base nute, Im not happy with just a base nute, I wanted to try something more and got the same old shite from the grumpy old forum "celebrities", but no actual usable information...just generalised farming garbage from early nearly two decades ago that didnt contradict what I was trying to say at all.

Im still waiting on the list of stuff that either doesnt work or needs something else to work off Victorygarden, the very man who probably has a shelf of AN products that he sells everyday.

But there was no discussion, just UB and Victorygarden trying to slap people with their cocks.

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To answer your question - yes it is possible that Canna PK13/14 might help but it is very hard to say for sure. Most research that is done in agriculture tests different NPK ratios for a very particular cutting of a specific species. They run all types of ratios like 1-1-2/1-2-2/1-3-2 etc and compare yields. So it is totally possible that by adding PK13/14 during flower you change your NPK ratio to that most desired by your strain. The problem is that every strain will have a slightly different requirement. Finding the proper NPK ratio for your strain is really the name of the game. If you have the ability to mix your own nutes you can seriously dial this in.

yeah man, stop making it a fight, ever stop to consider that these people might actually be smarter than you? Vitamin B for example, that shit is in every canna specific brand, and its expensive. 4 university studies clearly dissprove that, with scientific data.

and your still talking about pk 13/14 nobody gives a shit dude. all your adding is a higher concentrate of PK, and all UB is sayin is to keep a high level of N so you don't lose leaves. serioulsy, thats not even a real additive, were talking NPK ratios, its all only relevant to your strain your grow method, your plants requirements. what happens when you mix PK 13/14 with with N 12 -0-0? your right back down to a 1-1-1 or close to it

hymem said:

To answer your question - yes it is possible that Canna PK13/14 might help but it is very hard to say for sure. Most research that is done in agriculture tests different NPK ratios for a very particular cutting of a specific species. They run all types of ratios like 1-1-2/1-2-2/1-3-2 etc and compare yields. So it is totally possible that by adding PK13/14 during flower you change your NPK ratio to that most desired by your strain. The problem is that every strain will have a slightly different requirement. Finding the proper NPK ratio for your strain is really the name of the game. If you have the ability to mix your own nutes you can seriously dial this in.

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Thank you for your help, concise and exactly what I couldve been given pages ago instead of pages of being attacked and naysayed. So Ill try it out, it possibly helping is enough for a shot in my book.

These guys are so dishonest with their sweeping comments, so fucking self-serving it is unreal. Didn't expect this from an old man.
Where as the study he sites regarding B1 (thiamine) shows that B1 is useless in soil and healthy plants outdoors, it also states several other supplements that actually do increase root growth. The study is also stating:

"Vitamin B-1 (thiamine) is an important component of tissue culture media, in which isolated plant tissues can be propagated. Its use for stimulating root growth in whole plants is not supported in the literature and one study reported that root growth was greater in the control treatment (water) than with thiamine. Plants in the field manufacture their own source of thiamine and it is therefore unnecessary to add any additional levels. Many fungi and bacteria associated with plant roots also produce thiamine, so it’s likely that healthy soils will contain adequate levels of this vitamin without amendment."

Notice how the word soil pops up here several time. Now, I do not know if B1 works, from the study UB refers to it appears that if the plants are in a healthy soil it is unlikely that it will need to be supplemented, but that is a long way from saying that it is a snake oil and has no use.
You are intellectually dishonest, I'm done with this conversation old man.

hymem said:

Jack your wrong about Vitamin B-1, its been discredited in academia for many years.


http://ag.arizona.edu/yavapai/anr/hort/byg/archive/vitaminb1androotstimulators.html
http://www.colostate.edu/Dept/CoopExt/4dmg/Garden/beware.htm
ucce.ucdavis.edu/files/repositoryfiles/ca3809p15-70969.pdf

University peer reviewed Research is the basis of todays science. If you dont trust peer reviewed scientific research then your truly on your own.

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Yep. Even in the face of a pHD in horticulture, Washington state university, noobs like Jack will deny the facts. I have talked personally to Dr. Linda Chalker-Scott and have the utmost respect for her. She busts myths (many found here in this thread) like they were a pinatta - http://www.puyallup.wsu.edu/~Linda Chalker-Scott/Horticultural Myths_files/index.html

I have posted in cannabis forums for over 10 years and have noticed a pattern of behavior with noobs no matter what forum it is.......their steadfastness to a false and phoney cannabis ideology with the same old mantras:

1. "Everyone's doing it",

2. "You're stuck in your old skool ways",

3. "Additives must work, if not, why would they put them in there",

4. An obfuscation of the truth and facts by mis-directing the factual spirit of the moment by demonizing discloser of facts - "can't you be nice and treat people with respect!",

5. A know-it-all attitude. I too was young once myself and thought I knew everything. I was fascinated by how much my father had matured once I hit 21.

.....and every new crop of noobs is like a baby who has opened their eyes for the first time, thinking no one but them has heard of this, that, and the other. They're gonna set the world of botany on fire and discover new and better horizons!

The only thing "new" in this biz is another ho-hum, recycled snake oil or seedbank vendor selling recycled mutts.

Uncle Ben

unity said:

These guys are so dishonest with their sweeping comments, so fucking self-serving it is unreal. Didn't expect this from an old man.
Where as the study he sites regarding B1 (thiamine) shows that B1 is useless in soil and healthy plants outdoors, it also states several other supplements that actually do increase root growth. The study is also stating:

"Vitamin B-1 (thiamine) is an important component of tissue culture media, in which isolated plant tissues can be propagated. Its use for stimulating root growth in whole plants is not supported in the literature and one study reported that root growth was greater in the control treatment (water) than with thiamine. Plants in the field manufacture their own source of thiamine and it is therefore unnecessary to add any additional levels. Many fungi and bacteria associated with plant roots also produce thiamine, so it’s likely that healthy soils will contain adequate levels of this vitamin without amendment."

Notice how the word soil pops up here several time. Now, I do not know if B1 works, from the study UB refers to it appears that if the plants are in a healthy soil it is unlikely that it will need to be supplemented, but that is a long way from saying that it is a snake oil and has no use.
You are intellectually dishonest, I'm done with this conversation old man.

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put your foot on your shoulder and give a good push, see if you can dislodge your head from your ass.
then go cut off all your fan leaves, it makes for bigger yields.

unity said:

"5. A know-it-all attitude. I too was young once myself and thought I knew everything."

The only difference is that now you are old, but you still think you know everything.

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I don't know everything, but I do know your a douchbag looking for a fight. It doesn't matter what anyone says, you 2 numbskulls just won't get it. Good luck with your additives.

VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO said:

put your foot on your shoulder and give a good push, see if you can dislodge your head from your ass.
then go cut off all your fan leaves, it makes for bigger yields.

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Uhh, here comes 'mini-me' with his usual idiotic comment. A piece of free advice from a fellow business owner: keep your mouth zipped on public forums about your shady business practices.
So, you own a store in Santa Ana, I'm in Tustin (Uhh, that must a stung), I think I shall stop by to see what kind of advice you really give to your customers as it relates to your 'snake oils'. Anonymity does have its advantages

VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO said:

I don't know everything, but I do know your a douchbag looking for a fight. It doesn't matter what anyone says, you 2 numbskulls just won't get it. Good luck with your additives.

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You are the one selling them, I just want information on them

unity said:

Uhh, here comes 'mini-me' with his usual idiotic comment. A piece of free advice from a fellow business owner: keep your mouth zipped on public forums about your shady business practices.
So, you own a store in Santa Ana, I'm in Tustin (Uhh, that must a stung), I think I shall stop by to see what kind of advice you really give to your customers as it relates to your 'snake oils'. Anonymity does have its advantages

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come on by, Bring some of your crap that is full of additives and I'll show you stuff that was done with $10 nutes that will prove to you that additives aren't necessary, OR, come give me all your money for more additives, It doesn't matter to me.

Oh, and when you get there, I'm the skinny white guy, not the 350lb black dude.

unity said:

You are the one selling them, I just want information on them

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So you want information on them, eh? Therein lies part of the problem, the vendor/manufacturer usually does not disclose what's in them. That should raise a red flag, but fools and their idealogies being what they are, you'll keep feeding this corrupt industry.

I asked you guys, even gave you a link to the Canna official webstie, what is the active ingredient or chemical in PK13/14. You don't know nor are you smart enough to care. Mama didn't raise no fool - I'll be damned if I buy anything without knowing what's in it.

Stupid is what stupid does.

UB

VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO said:

Oh, and when you get there, I'm the skinny white guy, not the 350lb black dude.

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Dude, you do not need to be scared of me, I'm talking about nutes, not about beating you up lol! But I certainly could spread the word about you in OC, so watch your fucking mouth!

VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO said:

come on by, Bring some of your crap that is full of additives and I'll show you stuff that was done with $10 nutes that will prove to you that additives aren't necessary, OR, come give me all your money for more additives, It doesn't matter to me.

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By 'your stuff' do you mean the bottles I bought from you?

i do not use canna,but is this what you are talking about UB? chitosan

unity said:

Dude, you do not need to be scared of me, I'm talking about nutes, not about beating you up lol! But I certainly could spread the word about you in OC, so watch your fucking mouth!

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Just want you to know who I am when You get there, and try to be there before 5, cause I have practice at the mma place next door

unity said:

By 'your stuff' do you mean the bottles I bought from you?

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Got a question, are you more interested in beating your chest or being shown something that might save you a lot of money and time mixing concoctions that contain eye of newt? Its sounds like to me he's offering to educate you with a first hand observation of his garden. Based on your responses, Victory might wanna consider the issue of trust first before trying to make a (futile) point.

Like I said before, it's like throwing pearls before swine when it comes to know-it-all noobs who have 0 to a few gardens under their belt.

UB