Anyone Else Have Problems With Intense LED's and Organic Super Soil?

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Blazin Budz

Well-Known Member
Growitpondifarm said:
I use Epsom salts heavily in my veggie garden as it has proven to be super beneficial in staving of blossom end rot in tomatoes. I also give my cannabis bed good dose of epsom salts like roughly 2 tbsp/gal of water, watered in when I flip into bloom and again 2-3 weeks later. I don’t believe using Epsom salts has any negative effect on soil biology. People have been using Epsom salts in organic food production forever. If you believe you’re seeing a magnesium deficiency don’t be afraid to water with Epsom. Good luck
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I actually just got some Epsom salts for my next living soil go. Going to see if I can kick the synthetic cal-mag with it.
 
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Growitpondifarm

Well-Known Member
Yea what I have found helps in switch from synthetic growing is to try and think ahead in terms of the plants needs and fertigate/add compost accordingly. You know the plant is using a load of energy during the first 2-3 of bloom so if you can get that stuff in prior to the increased demand you’re styling. Seems like you can be a little more reactive in the synthetics. Good luck
 
N

Northwood

Well-Known Member
Growitpondifarm said:
Seems like you can be a little more reactive in the synthetics.
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I don't necessarily think being "reactive" is a good idea at all. That means waiting until the plant suffers a shortage or excess to the extent that it shows symptoms... and then you react defensively while your plant begs for help. Instead there is a way to hand control of what a plant needs to eat to the plant itself instead. After all it's what's doing the eating! lol

The main benefit that we gain is having to take our plant's nutrition off our worry list, because we've delegated that task to the plant instead. It's not that I'm lazy... honest!
 
KlompenOG

KlompenOG

Active Member
Under my Chinese COBs I developed some changes to my soil approach and that worked really well for me on that grow. Unfortunately I was overwhelmed by pests in the autumn during my switch to a QB96 with side lights(Samsung V-Series), and I didn't get very good results. Now that I have pests under control they seem to be feeding properly again. One thing I learned during my COB grow is that you can't put enough food directly into the soil for an LED grow without consequences. The big trick is MULCH. Mulch in nutrients. Plan ahead: mulch in the fertilizer you need NEXT, not what you need now. Oh and don't get half a dozen types of pests on your plants lol
 
420herbalist

420herbalist

Well-Known Member
Just wanted to say thanks for all the info provided in this thread. I have been using FFOF/EWC/Perlite under a 300w COB for my grows and consistently run into deficiencies at the end of veg or right after flip and then fight all the way to the end. I have been able to pull just over a gram per watt and have been happy with the results for sure but I know it can be better. I am upgrading my entire setup for my next run and have been gathering supplies to do a BAS/Coots type mix. I don't have much to add other than to share the pain of battling issues under a LED but super stoked to be trying something new :hump:
 
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ComfortCreator

Well-Known Member
The main "tricks" of supersoil are to transplant, and to topdress. I personally find giving too much light to be the thing to watch.
 
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Cookiezealous

Well-Known Member
Wondering if anyone in this thread is still having these issues. I recently had a ph issue with my plants but it seems like when I am in my veg tent with my crappy Chinese led light my plants flourish. As soon as they get to the 600rspec in my flowering tent they tank.
I’m dealing with a lot of other issues because of an accident with a timer but I just put two small plants in coco and will start running salts again to see if this is what is going on. I ran organics and loved it under my less powerful light but when I moved I’ve had trouble ever since. It’s either the light or the water.
hoping other people have figured this out.
 
HippieFarmer420

HippieFarmer420

Well-Known Member
Blazin Budz said:
I just posted most of this as a reply in another thread but now I actually want to see if anyone else has had similar results. At the start of the year I Built a new grow room and decided to go with 6 new HLG 320 QB XL LED's for my flower room. I also decided to go with organics/water only super soils (tried a lot of them including my own super hot mix). This past year of growing has been a nightmare for me in terms of loss of money and time plus the stress of my efforts not paying off.

The learning curve for LED's turned out to be more drastic than I was thinking. I cant, for the life of me, get an organic super soil dialed in with these intense LED's. The LED's make the plants eat the nutrients waaaayyyy before the plants are finished flowering. I've tried so many different Super Soils including mainstream ones like Build-A-Soil 3.0 and I cant seem to get through a full cycle with water only. Even with extra amended organic forms of cal-mag.

It'll get to where ill have to start adding synthetic Cal-Mag to actually see results then they'll start showing deficiencies again to the point to where ill have to start adding salt based nutes (megacrop) with extra cal-mag to fix my issues and by that time im hand watering because I don't have a specific plan as what to fill my res with (was using blumats). It just got to the point where I was forcing the plants to grow and trying my hardest just to keep them somewhat healthy. I like my plants to absolutely thrive. Also my yields are ridiculously low compared to what they should be. I feel like the only way I could make it work is to have a huge no till bed or at least use 10 gallon containers at a minimum and thats just too much space for the amount of plants im running at that point.

I could go on and on about the huge amount of money i've wasted this past year trying to unsuccessfully get an Organic Super Soil dialed in but bottom line is it just became too much of a pain in the ass to manage. With coco and salt based nutes, I can dial everything in pretty easily and run the amount of plants I want in the space I have.

I'll never hate on the quality or the taste of the herb with Organics. I think its a great way to grow for a lot of people but for me and my situation, it was just too much of a headache and loss of money to run organics with LED's. I've started my first coco run while im finishing out my organic soil plants and the glow my coco plants are putting off brings me sooo much relief.

So my question is, does anyone else run top brand intense LED's with a water only super soil and have great results?
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I use extra sea compost and glacial rock dust.

I water only and the plants seem to love me for it
 
JustBlazin

JustBlazin

Well-Known Member
Cookiezealous said:
Wondering if anyone in this thread is still having these issues. I recently had a ph issue with my plants but it seems like when I am in my veg tent with my crappy Chinese led light my plants flourish. As soon as they get to the 600rspec in my flowering tent they tank.
I’m dealing with a lot of other issues because of an accident with a timer but I just put two small plants in coco and will start running salts again to see if this is what is going on. I ran organics and loved it under my less powerful light but when I moved I’ve had trouble ever since. It’s either the light or the water.
hoping other people have figured this out.
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After you go to flower how big are your plants compared to your container.
I find if my plants have already used the majority of the soil in my container they run out of steam during the stretch and the rest of flower they struggle. Now I've learnt to repot a week before flower so they have lots of space for roots to grow during the stretch. I also top dress early in flower to get the feeder roots used to the top dressing, so when they need it the roots are there to uptake the nutrients it needs.
Just a thought.
I use led in flower and it works great. Only time I have trouble with led is in veg. They don't seem to like the led as much as my metal halide for veg.
 
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Cookiezealous

Well-Known Member
JustBlazin said:
After you go to flower how big are your plants compared to your container.
I find if my plants have already used the majority of the soil in my container they run out of steam during the stretch and the rest of flower they struggle. Now I've learnt to repot a week before flower so they have lots of space for roots to grow during the stretch. I also top dress early in flower to get the feeder roots used to the top dressing, so when they need it the roots are there to uptake the nutrients it needs.
Just a thought.
I use led in flower and it works great. Only time I have trouble with led is in veg. They don't seem to like the led as much as my metal halide for veg.
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I start top dressing about two weeks before I flip them but you’re absolutely right, they need more juice before they go into it. My buddy just did an entire grow in 5 gallon pots using living soil and top dressing for flower with plants that are about 6 feet tall. I think because his light was turned down so low and they grew so slowly that they did not use the juice inside the soil.
I was shocked when I saw it
I did turn down my light
My plants are recovering, but they got hit two fold, one. My light was turned up to 100% and they got flooded for four days while I was out of town.
I came back and they were sitting in 3 inches of water. I foliar fed with amino’s.
And then I watered with RO water, and added Cal mag and sulfur.
they are starting to perk up a bit, except for one of them, which is the most finicky of them all, an LA/OG but I’m keeping her around in case I want to breed with her.
I love living soil
But it is a bit more tricky then just water only unless your water is good
If your water is like mine, you have to constantly watch it because the water source changes every month or so and the PH and PPMs will be totally different
 
coreywebster

coreywebster

Well-Known Member
Cookiezealous said:
Wondering if anyone in this thread is still having these issues. I recently had a ph issue with my plants but it seems like when I am in my veg tent with my crappy Chinese led light my plants flourish. As soon as they get to the 600rspec in my flowering tent they tank.
I’m dealing with a lot of other issues because of an accident with a timer but I just put two small plants in coco and will start running salts again to see if this is what is going on. I ran organics and loved it under my less powerful light but when I moved I’ve had trouble ever since. It’s either the light or the water.
hoping other people have figured this out.
Click to expand...
Is the environment on point for LEDs?
 
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Cookiezealous

Well-Known Member
coreywebster said:
Is the environment on point for LEDs?
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This is the part I am ignorant to.
I may or may not be dialed in.
Please let me know.
Plants are in veg
The light is a 600 R spec HLG currently about 48 inches above the plants and that is temporary because they are sick. I didn’t want them to be super close. It’s at 40% power right now.
Humidity is at 45%
Temps are between 70-75, there is an air conditioner inside my tent to save space because of my living situation
CO2 on a very low setting, I don’t have an environmental controller to test the levels, but it kicks on every two hours for 15 minutes at .5 setting on my tank. I’m leaving it like that for right now just because I don’t have the environmental controller.
Fan above canopy
fresh air being pushed in throughout the day to swap it all out
I might switch over to Coco here soon
Just because the water situation out here is ridiculous
I calibrated my pen, even bought a new one, just to make sure, and the ph was 8.6-8.7 ppms at 500 out of the tap. I filter the water for chlorine, Chloramine and sediment. But because it fluctuates so much if I’m not checking the water and adjusting it every single time, I lose.
Open to any advice or suggestions
I love learning new things
 
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BeauVida

Member
Led doesn't provide increased nutrient uptake signaling with increased nutrient demand. Led Cannabis sucks up calcium super easy. You could run something like Coots mix for starts but your gonna triple the inputs over time fighting all the calcium . All the coots guys are doing it with "enzymes" (high N seed meal) and "microbes" (high PK compost teas). Growing organic pot indoor kinda sucks. Call all your inputs 'conditioners' or 'biostims' if you want to feel good about feeding. Works for everyone else.
 
weedstoner420

weedstoner420

Well-Known Member
BeauVida said:
Led Cannabis sucks up calcium super easy. You could run something like Coots mix for starts but your gonna triple the inputs over time fighting all the calcium
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Can you explain the biological mechanism behind this?

I grow under LEDs, and the main two fertilizers I use are both quite high in calcium. KiS Organics Nutrient Pak blend is 2.5 - 3.5 - 1 with 10% Ca, and Espoma Tomato Tone is 3 - 4 - 6 with 8% Ca. I've recycled the same mix for a half dozen runs now, amending and top-dressing with those two blends, and haven't really run into any nutrient issues so far...
 
Kamau42

Kamau42

Active Member
Cookiezealous said:
This is the part I am ignorant to.
I may or may not be dialed in.
Please let me know.
Plants are in veg
The light is a 600 R spec HLG currently about 48 inches above the plants and that is temporary because they are sick. I didn’t want them to be super close. It’s at 40% power right now.
Humidity is at 45%
Temps are between 70-75, there is an air conditioner inside my tent to save space because of my living situation
CO2 on a very low setting, I don’t have an environmental controller to test the levels, but it kicks on every two hours for 15 minutes at .5 setting on my tank. I’m leaving it like that for right now just because I don’t have the environmental controller.
Fan above canopy
fresh air being pushed in throughout the day to swap it all out
I might switch over to Coco here soon
Just because the water situation out here is ridiculous
I calibrated my pen, even bought a new one, just to make sure, and the ph was 8.6-8.7 ppms at 500 out of the tap. I filter the water for chlorine, Chloramine and sediment. But because it fluctuates so much if I’m not checking the water and adjusting it every single time, I lose.
Open to any advice or suggestions
I love learning new things
Click to expand...
500 ppm out of the tap is insane. Is it well water?
 
C

Cookiezealous

Well-Known Member
Kamau42 said:
500 ppm out of the tap is insane. Is it well water?
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No, I can’t figure out if that’s how it is in the city or if it’s just my house and maybe there’s something in the pipes. I live in a suburb, a little south of Denver. The weirdest part is that it changes, they source the water from different places, at least that’s what people tell me and it’s different all the time. It sucks.
 
Billy the Mountain

Billy the Mountain

Well-Known Member
Cookiezealous said:
No, I can’t figure out if that’s how it is in the city or if it’s just my house and maybe there’s something in the pipes. I live in a suburb, a little south of Denver. The weirdest part is that it changes, they source the water from different places, at least that’s what people tell me and it’s different all the time. It sucks.
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If the water is actually 500ppm on a TDS display (1.0 EC) it's likely not suitable for growing.
There's a LOT of something in the water.
 
Kamau42

Kamau42

Active Member
Cookiezealous said:
No, I can’t figure out if that’s how it is in the city or if it’s just my house and maybe there’s something in the pipes. I live in a suburb, a little south of Denver. The weirdest part is that it changes, they source the water from different places, at least that’s what people tell me and it’s different all the time. It sucks.
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Are you sure your ppm meter is accurate. That doesn't make sense for Denver city water.
 
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