Advanced Nutrients Sensi PH Perfect Series aint Perfect

Discussion in 'Hydroponics / Aeroponics' started by dgaf757, Mar 18, 2011.

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    dgaf757

    dgaf757 Active Member

    Ok, so about 7 or so weeks ago I found a Canadian vendor selling the "new PH perfect" sensi bloom so I bought it. At first I was using the other sensi bloom that wasn't PH perfect. When I started using the what I call "PH stable" because it still isn't perfect, I saw really nice results, with a lot less hassle for me. After 4 weeks I saw some deficiencies. I had no idea whether it was Mg, Ca, Fe or my RO water screwing up. After getting an email back from high times, apparently the PH perfect advanced nutrients products COMPLETELY left out Iron... not only in the base bloom nutes, but NONE of their recommended supplements do either, as I use them too.

    If there's anybody else out there that has used this new formula... have you seen this same Fe def.? Its really bugging me out, because I was told if I use a cal+mag with iron, it could create toxicity from too much mg in my program. If anybody has any suggestions (besides the maxi-crop w/iron because its got chlorine in it and I use a bio active hydro system) please help me.
     
  2.  
    homebrewer

    homebrewer Well-Known Member

    That's piss poor if that's true. Just go with another brand and cut your losses now. You'll probably screw up future grows trying to correct the current screw up from the manufacturer.
     
    Logan Burke likes this.
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    dgaf757

    dgaf757 Active Member

    yeah im not shittin you. i didnt even realize NONE of their new products contain ANY iron until i got an email back from high times and they told me it was an iron def. because advanced cut out iron.

    its such a damn shame, because i still got pretty good yields. but you have a damn good point. but the reason i started using advanced was because i had a bottle of botanicare pure blend pro bloom and sweet berry go bad and growing mold in the bottles. i have shit for luck with nutes. i also used grotek bi tek but it cost a fortune mixing 24ml/gal and they discontinued production. (edit:i have a 55gal res indoor and a 250gal recirculating drip system on my back deck for my veggies)

    i see in your sig you tested dyna grow and gen hydro. you have any suggestions on amino acid based synthetic nutes?
     
  4.  
    djruiner

    djruiner Well-Known Member

    a large majority of AN's line of products are not properly labeled or just straight out lie about their product.i admit i almost got sucked into their clever marketing gimmics...but im glad i didnt.ended up getting jacks classic grow and bloom.under $20 for both and has lasted me almost 2 years now.thats all i give my plants other then molasses...and if you read and do some research...most of the crap that AN puts out has a base of molasses.clever marketing has pulled a lot of people in and they are just tossing their money away....keep it simple...give the plants what they tell you they need...not what some schmuck in a suit tells you you need
     
    Michael Huntherz likes this.
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    homebrewer

    homebrewer Well-Known Member

    Just wondering why you called high times about an AN product. Why not just call AN?

    I'm kinda confused about what 'amino acid based synthetic nutes' means. Both are 'synthetic' mineral based formulas and both work well, though I prefer DynaGro.
     
  6.  
    dgaf757

    dgaf757 Active Member

    oh no i completely understand your point. my local hydro store wont even stock AN because of EXACTLY what you just said. they have shady marketing, but since it was my first go round i bought 4L of everything on their "professional" suppliment line as well as sensi bloom. i always bought botanicare because they were cheap and effective, but hey i do admit even with the problems i have had... i harvested 11-16 grams per plant on 20 plants in a 2x4 tent with a 400w hps, 2 70w hps and 2 85w cfls. i never got over 6oz's total with botanicares full line.

    im all about the basics because i run a "hyped" molasses for my outside veggie drip garden its nutrilife heavy weight and it works quite well. but compared to what bud candy and other carbo products with the added vitamins and stuff... im impressed.

    maybe i just confide in having a label, but the added 4oz's over what i normally get did make an impression. but then again that equals about the same as what i paid for all those products.

    all that aside, you say the basics are running you around $20 a grow? what kind of system and what size reservoir are you running? if i could run a grow for under $200 id be thrilled! fawk the labels if i can run for that price!! for real, please go into detail about what you use. im not a natural or organic grower, i love my synthetics but i love keeping my money even more.
     
  7.  
    dgaf757

    dgaf757 Active Member

    by amino acid bases synthetic i mean that i want something that absolutely includes amino acids, and i dont like organic or natural organic nutes. they just seem to clog my system, leave sediment in my res and cause me headaches because some natural/organics will start to ferment after a couple days and just get to be a pain. i know its out of place in the cannabis culture of today, but id rather run fully synthetic nutes.

    the guy at worms way told me he uses dynagrow. and after seeing your comparison im swayed that way.
     
  8.  
    homebrewer

    homebrewer Well-Known Member

    Your plants already make their own amino acids and I know for a fact that DG doesn't include them in the bottles that I use. Stick to the 16 essential elements, keep your plants healthy from start to finish and you'll pull some good yields and an excellent product out of 'no frills' plant foods.
     
  9.  
    dgaf757

    dgaf757 Active Member

    yeah i know that plants create amino, enzymes, and other growth regulators on their own, but my previous understanding was that by providing the plants with these chemicals in the fertilizer, the plant didnt have to concentrate on making they all on their own. thus speeding up the growth and blooming and i am so concerned about it because i dont veg my plants... at all. i pop them from seed, run 24/0 for a week or so and then boom they go into bloom. i mean im not new to growing, but if what im using isnt really doing much then theres no point in me wasting big bucks on the nutes. but i do harvest every 6-8 weeks which is again why i thought if i added these chemicals the plant wouldnt have to work to create it on their own.

    im always down to getting new info on growing and trying to incorperate it into my grow cycle if it benefits my plants and my wallet.
     
  10.  
    djruiner

    djruiner Well-Known Member

    $20 is all ive spent so far on nutes for all my grows...a little jacks goes a long way.and im growing in soil...gave the dwc thing a go...just too much work for my liking.using cfl's start to finish and have yet to have a plant produce less then an ounce.i doubt i have $200 invested in my grow setup total and the only thing i have to buy is soil about every 4-6 months.granted im all about the DIY...built my grow box and light hood...did all the wiring myself.the most expensive part was my veg lights that was 65 watts a piece and got 4 of them for $25.but as long as you get good nutes with the right amount of NPK going into them they will tell you what they need.to get a good harvest of nice dense bud...keep the plant green and healthy all through flowering and you will get a decent harvest..and you def dont need hundreds of $ worth of nutes to get that
     
  11.  
    homebrewer

    homebrewer Well-Known Member

    The same logic is used by the 'defoliation crowd'. If my plant doesn't spend all this energy on maintaining leaves, it can better concentrate on making flowers. These companies will tell you all kinds of shiz to sell you their products. Leaves produce buds and your plants already makes their own carbs, sugars, aminos, hormones and enzymes. Your role as an indoor gardener is just to provide a good environment and the food needed for the plant to carry out the same process it has since the beginning of time.


    Just a suggestion about how your run your show. When your plants hit day 20 of flower or so, you should be germing more seeds or taking cuttings so you can veg for a few weeks before you flower. If I wasn't perpetual, I'd still be harvesting as frequently as you but I'd be putting 2 footers into flowering instead of 'no veg plants'. It's all about staggering and timing.
     
  12.  
    dgaf757

    dgaf757 Active Member

    i feel ya on that one. diy is really the only way to grow now because anything premade is was over priced. i better understand what you meant about spending 20 in nutes because i did the same thing when i was growing in peat. man nutes are wayy easier to afford when growing in soil/soiless. but i gotta make up 55gal of nutrient solution every week, so either way im still screwed because i run through nutes reall quick. the hardest part about all of this is i was on a schedule with botanicare, i knew how much to expect in yield every grow... and now im scrambling around trying to find a nute program that my plants like and that fits my schedule.
     
  13.  
    dgaf757

    dgaf757 Active Member


    thats true their main goal really is to sell you their product. i think instead of going out and buying another expensive cycle of nutes this time... im just going to run on the basics and see if i can even tell theres a difference.

    about the germing seeds... thats exactly what i do i pop the seeds about the 3-4 weeks in so that when i harvest i immediately put the seedlings in flower. i breed most of my own seeds and since i have no vegging i feel its kinda pointless to try and keep a mother plant or to clone them.
     
  14.  
    homebrewer

    homebrewer Well-Known Member

    Well depending on your light source, bigger plants usually yield better. Try germing on day 1 of flower of just go perpetual and harvest every week.
     
  15.  
    dgaf757

    dgaf757 Active Member

    yeah youre definately right. i pretty much got away from bigger plant only because on my first grow a few years ago i was given a skunk/haze plant by my boy and he grew outside. long story short, it scared me away from big plants but i know now that it was only because of the genetics that made it so out of control. i had a pretty good routine going for a while there but now im scarmbling with nutes i might just give to germing a try either today or tomorrow because my newer batch is 2 weeks into flower.

    oh by the way on a routine run to lowes today to get fertilizer for my lawn, i ran across a purely iron product. it comes in a 1 gallon size for like $6 so i think im going to use up the rest of my advanced nutes and see if adding this does anything to correct the iron defic. ill definately post back on here whether or not it helps, does nothing, or creates more problems.
     
  16.  
    ganjaman87

    ganjaman87 Well-Known Member

    From my experience with AN is that when you FIRST mix your nutrient mixture, the PH is then "perfect". You're still going to have to monitor and adjust PH a few days or so later..
     
  17.  
    dgaf757

    dgaf757 Active Member

    well this new ph perfect formula (it hasnt been released to be sold in the US yet) it automatically corrects the ph so that it is always available at the proper ph level, but thats not my real concern as i know it works. the part im reaqlly pissed about is that they not only left iron out in the base sensi bloom formula, but none of their suppliments contain any trace of iron either. i use everythng except the pirhana, tarantula, and sensizym. i use everything else and i had bad iron defic. problems and after paying all that money i didnt think id have that problem. i still have like a liter of each left so for the next 2 weeks im going to use the liquid iron suppliment i got for cheap and dilute the hell out of it and see how well it works.
     
  18.  
    hellraizer30

    hellraizer30 Rebel From The North

    I havent run into this Iron thing but Im using the origanal formula not the PH perfect stuff, and im geting fantastic results
     
  19.  
    bangkok101

    bangkok101 Active Member

    Heres the truth u should know, it doesnt matter if someone has over 10 years of growing or someone just started out. just do whatever works for you. i used ANs full line (not sensi but GMB and not ph perfect) everyone rags on AN but it works for me. i've tried GH, i just saw better results for me using AN. Every company wants to make money, every store that you go to wants to make money. its supply and demand. just do whatever works for you.
     
    hellraizer30 likes this.
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    bangkok101

    bangkok101 Active Member

    thank you! are you aero or dwc?
     

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