Advanced Nutrients pH Perfect

homebrewer said:

The point more educated growers are trying to make is not that $21 will make you go broke, but it is a lot more than you need to spend and that additional cost for plant food will not get you better results given the competition.



Are you saying that AN makes plant food for drug dealers? I guess that would make sense given their pricing and the lack of horticultural knowledge their user bases seems to possess.

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I'm just saying more educated business savvy growers go for time tested reliable nute regiments, specifically designed for the crop, and AN provides that. That is why so many big leaguers use it. There are so many other logistical concerns a serious grower spends time with other than an expense which only utilizes 2 or 3% of the net cost. I have tasted crops from many nute lines and I prefer AN. The key word here is "I". So what if Dyno gets you the same volume at half the cost, the quality of the smoke entering my lungs and the effect it has on my receptors is what finally matters the most, to ME, IMHO whatever. So be it if it costs more a grow, it works and tastes superb. For someone to slam the gavel down that one product is superb and all others are inferior and that all who do use these inferior products are idiots ,are idiots themselves.

By the way, I can match your Dyno growth and quality with AN 3-part G-M-B and a hobby kit any day. My cost 5$ a plant seed to flower including medium.

patlpp said:

I'm just saying more educated business savvy growers go for time tested reliable nute regiments, specifically designed for the crop, and AN provides that. That is why so many big leaguers use it. There are so many other logistical concerns a serious grower spends time with other than an expense which only utilizes 2 or 3% of the net cost. I have tasted crops from many nute lines and I prefer AN. The key word here is "I". So what if Dyno gets you the same volume at half the cost, the quality of the smoke entering my lungs and the effect it has on my receptors is what finally matters the most, to ME, IMHO whatever. So be it if it costs more a grow, it works and tastes superb. For someone to slam the gavel down that one product is superb and all others are inferior and that all who do use these inferior products are idiots ,are idiots themselves.

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When you take a step back and realize that ALL bottles of liquid fertilizer are mineral salts dissolved in water, that sort of puts things in perspective in terms of how much plant food should cost and helps demystify the concept of 'cannabis specific'. I'm not talking about specific brands here, just the salts and the idea that some companies charge a premium because they know their customers don't know any better. What is more important than brand is the mineral content of the bottles and the ratio of said minerals to one another. That seems to be a topic not brought up by the users of a certain brand.

By the way, I can match your Dyno growth and quality with AN 3-part G-M-B and a hobby kit any day. My cost 5$ a plant seed to flower including medium.

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The 3-part system is a good system and I used the original 3-part (made by GH) for years. I would absolutely disagree that you could match my growth/yields in my room with any 3-part as I used to use it and no longer do for a handful of reasons. It has nothing to do with your skills as a grower, maybe you're a fantastic grower, it has to do with the 3-part itself.

i love how homebrewer just goes on and on about how expensive AN is and how you don't need to pay that much for nutes. 1 gallon of Dyna costs $55. 1 gallon each of Sensi 2 part costs $65. Sensi 2 part when mixed together is about 15% more concentrated than Dyna. please show me how that is SO much more expensive? he also loves to say AN uses poor quality source materials. this is complete BS. he likes to quote the old Oregon Dept. of Agriculture article as most of the haters do. too bad he actually didn't read the article. AN is the only nutrient company that was approved by the department and their stringent guidelines. there is absolutely no evidence or proof that AN's source materials are of a poor quality. in reality, many of their source materials are of a higher quality than most nutrient companies. especially some of their additives.

try out all the nutes you want and use what works best for YOU!

homebrewer said:

I would absolutely disagree that you could match my growth/yields in my room with any 3-part as I used to use it and no longer do for a handful of reasons. It has nothing to do with your skills as a grower, maybe you're a fantastic grower, it has to do with the 3-part itself.

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I knew that would rock your boat LOL. You grow awesome bud, no argument. No way I'd take you up in your house.
I was wondering if you tried Foliage-Pro. It has that nice 3-1-2 ratio weed loves. I noticed that dyno grow and bloom lack sufficient Mg and Calcium. Do you use epsons or a sup? GH beats them in cal-mag quantities so what makes Dyno better? The micro-nutes?

patlpp said:

I knew that would rock your boat LOL. You grow awesome bud, no argument. No way I'd take you up in your house.
I was wondering if you tried Foliage-Pro. It has that nice 3-1-2 ratio weed loves.

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I've not used foliage pro and in regards to that, I think the ratios that work best in dirt differ from those that work in hydro. I find myself using more 'grow' in flower than 'bloom' in promix, but that same feeding pattern wouldn't give me my best results in hydro. That being said, I'd really like to try a 3-1-2 in promix whether that comes from DG or someone else. Doesn't CNS17 offer a 3-1-2?

I noticed that dyno grow and bloom lack sufficient Mg and Calcium. Do you use epsons or a sup? GH beats them in cal-mag quantities so what makes Dyno better? The micro-nutes?

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I use RO and use magpro in hydro which is basically epsom salt with a bloom-booster-like NPK content. I don't see a need for more cal/mag in promix where I do not use magpro so for me and the different mediums I grow in, a touch of magnesium is probably needed in hydro if one uses RO water.

Why did I see better results from DG than the GH 3-part? I think a big thing is the NPK ratio that DG offers. As I ran GH, I was ending up with something around a 1-2-2 NPK ratio and with DG, I come very close to a 1-3-2 which seems to be enough N to keep the leaves intact but also plenty of P and K for flower production. I think one thing that hurts the 3-part formulas is that one cannot gradually scale back the nitrogen content without cutting back everything that 'micro' is offering. The same holds true for 2-part formulas out there as I'm currently testing H&G's aqua flakes (which is doing really well) but the plants are much darker green than they need to be here at day 47 of flower.

I'm in a consistent environment and my results are so consistent that I've even been accused of posting the same photos over and over. The things I mentioned above are not necessarily things an inconsistent grower can lean on for greater consistency or better yields, they're just things I've settled into after making small tweaks round-after-round.

The 3-part formulas out there work great. Some 2-parts work great too. I think when one finds consistency, they can then make those tweaks as to find what NPK ratio works best. As much as I harp on some brands for being rip-off artists, their salts will grow herb and finding that combination of GH micro and Hydroplex or Aqua Flakes and Magpro is really what it's all about. Put that nutrient puzzle together and base a target on sound horticultural knowledge (ie. 3-1-2 ratio is best for cannabis). So many of these discussions turn to the name-dropping of products instead of why the minerals or ratios in said products will work well with the ones already being offered by the base. A lot of people can't participate in conversations like that which is probably why so many are quick to sling insults.

ScoobyDoobyDoo said:

i love how homebrewer just goes on and on about how expensive AN is and how you don't need to pay that much for nutes. 1 gallon of Dyna costs $55. 1 gallon each of Sensi 2 part costs $65. Sensi 2 part when mixed together is about 15% more concentrated than Dyna. please show me how that is SO much more expensive? he also loves to say AN uses poor quality source materials. this is complete BS. he likes to quote the old Oregon Dept. of Agriculture article as most of the haters do. too bad he actually didn't read the article. AN is the only nutrient company that was approved by the department and their stringent guidelines. there is absolutely no evidence or proof that AN's source materials are of a poor quality. in reality, many of their source materials are of a higher quality than most nutrient companies. especially some of their additives.

try out all the nutes you want and use what works best for YOU!

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What is sensi two part? I was looking on the AN website and could only find a four part base nutrient line called sensi that had a grow A and B and a bloom A and B. Is this it? http://www.advancednutrients.com/hydroponics/oregon/oregon_labels/SensiBloom_Part A_Label.pdf

This is not a complete fertilizer. Where are the micronutrients?

mm

by the way, check this out. http://www.advancednutrients.com/hydroponics/oregon/oregon_labels/WetBetty_Oregon_Label.pdf

She is cartoon hot! What the hell is this product? it is only minimal potash and some industrial surfacant that is moderately toxic and very destructive to the environment. Apparently it is banned in Europe.

http://www.healthychild.org/issues/chemical-pop/alkylphenols_and_alkylphenol_ethoxylates/
http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2003:178:0024:0027:EN:PDF

AN cracks me up sometimes.

mm

medicalmary said:

What is sensi two part? I was looking on the AN website and could only find a four part base nutrient line called sensi that had a grow A and B and a bloom A and B. Is this it? http://www.advancednutrients.com/hydroponics/oregon/oregon_labels/SensiBloom_Part A_Label.pdf

This is not a complete fertilizer. Where are the micronutrients?

mm

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exactly. everyone calls it 2 part just like they call Dyna a 1 part nute even though it has a grow and a bloom formula. pretty standard stuff if you've grown for a while.

you say it's not a complete fertilizer...plenty of others growing quality smoke would disagree with you. please show me another nutrient company that lists micronutes on their "labels" besides maybe Dyna. i can't seem to find one so i think it's strange that you would expect AN to do so.

I'm very pleased with the latest results of my DWC. Guess I'll be sticking with the 3 part for a while.


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VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO said:

That ain't my picture,you mad bro? and your the one who has been getting clowned. HYpocrite

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please post a picture of your plants then.

ScoobyDoobyDoo said:

please post a picture of your plants then.

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Come on guys, conversation not hate.

You guys flame each other and I will just keep deleting it.

Here is an example of what is possible when one can see past the labels and put that nutrient puzzle together (it's a lot easier than you think). You don't need to pay a lot for salts folks. You don't need to be a 'bottle collector' either because if your base nutes aren't supplying everything your plants need, your base nutes probably aren't as good as you think. Keep it simple, read your labels, don't fall for the sales pitch. Also be aware of where your advice is coming from. Look at their grow journals (do they even have grow journals?), look at their posting history, are they offering any applicable advice no matter what plant food you're feeding with?

First run with H&G. I'm attempting to match it up with two other items I already had sitting around to get close to a 1-3-2 ratio. I don't know that the yield will be there but the plants look happy.

Day 48:

If you would stop looking at all the pretty pictures and read(if you can), its a wetting agent. Who gives a shit about Europe! They know fuck all, so your going to stop using rubbermaid products too? They are more toxic but I bet you have some in the kitchen.

You crack me up! Your comments show the slope of your brow and your experience level

Enlighten yourself pick up a book, maybe start with Dr. Seuss.

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Cool it Winston! When I look at a fertilizer I use the product label in order to figure out what salts it has in it, because (as you said) pretty pictures do not tell the full story of what the hell is in the product.

And yes, the slope of my brow and experience level do not allow me to fathom the great and overwhelming complexity of what a wetting agent might be. I couldn't have any idea what this could possibly be. Look at the label and get said joke. It uses an active ingredient that is moderately toxic through dermal exposure and puts a cartoon picture of a hot chick using said wetting agent as sun tan lotion or coco butter (what have you). It's funny. You know, haha funny. I'm not that worried toxicity as I use a hundred products that are more toxic and carcinogenic on a daily basis. AN marketing is hilarious though. And the reason I thought it was some kind of "voodoo juice" that is "BOMBASTIC" is because I have never seem any wetting agent that costs $25 a liter.

• you say it's not a complete fertilizer...plenty of others growing quality smoke would disagree with you. please show me another nutrient company that lists micronutes on their "labels" besides maybe Dyna. i can't seem to find one so i think it's strange that you would expect AN to do so.​
  
  
  
  

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Here you go... http://www.greenhousemegastore.com/category/fertilizers

Every fertilizer on that site has an msds with everything that is it including inert ingredients. Click on said product and pull up the pdf and you know what is in the product. Every fertilizer company in the world that doesn't make "weed specific" fertilizer does this, which include micronutrients. There is no magic overdrive juice that makes plants tick.

mm

medicalmary said:

Cool it Winston! When I look at a fertilizer I use the product label in order to figure out what salts it has in it, because (as you said) pretty pictures do not tell the full story of what the hell is in the product.

And yes, the slope of my brow and experience level do not allow me to fathom the great and overwhelming complexity of what a wetting agent might be. I couldn't have any idea what this could possibly be. Look at the label and get said joke. It uses an active ingredient that is moderately toxic through dermal exposure and puts a cartoon picture of a hot chick using said wetting agent as sun tan lotion or coco butter (what have you). It's funny. You know, haha funny. I'm not that worried toxicity as I use a hundred products that are more toxic and carcinogenic on a daily basis. AN marketing is hilarious though. And the reason I thought it was some kind of "voodoo juice" that is "BOMBASTIC" is because I have never seem any wetting agent that costs $25 a liter.

Here you go... http://www.greenhousemegastore.com/category/fertilizers

Every fertilizer on that site has an msds with everything that is it including inert ingredients. Click on said product and pull up the pdf and you know what is in the product. Every fertilizer company in the world that doesn't make "weed specific" fertilizer does this, which include micronutrients. There is no magic overdrive juice that makes plants tick.

mm

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that i believe you are referring to is "bloombastic" which is actually made by Atami and not AN. also, on that page that you linked, the only nutrient company that list the micro nutes is Dyna just like i said in my previous post. Jack's has some; but not all; of the micro nutes listed just like you will find on many AN labels. so, do you honestly believe that if the micro nute is not listed (as it is with TONS of nutrient companies) that it isn't actually in the formula? i think you should do some more research. yes, i can click on the .pdf and get the total breakdown...you can do that for AN so why are you claiming there are no micro nutes as you did in your previous post. seems like you are using different rules there sweetheart.

no offense to you but i just took a look at your journal. seems to me like some of your "vegging" plants are burnt and a few deficiencies showing as well. come on..you can basically keep a plant green in veg with tomato juice. you might wanna rethink that formula your using.

you can hate on AN's marketing all you want. lord knows i think those guys are clowns too. but don't start your holiar than thou crap just cause they are trying to make a buck. guess what...so is every other company. not everyone can run a 100% non profit just for the benefits of the growing community. maybe you should actually try their products before basjing them and regurjitatin the same old lame garbage you hear from your buddy at the hydro store or by all the inexperienced growers that burnt their crops using AN and then blamed the nutrient when they couldn't explain to you what a ppm is.

homebrewer said:

Here is an example of what is possible when one can see past the labels and put that nutrient puzzle together (it's a lot easier than you think). You don't need to pay a lot for salts folks. You don't need to be a 'bottle collector' either because if your base nutes aren't supplying everything your plants need, your base nutes probably aren't as good as you think. Keep it simple, read your labels, don't fall for the sales pitch. Also be aware of where your advice is coming from. Look at their grow journals (do they even have grow journals?), look at their posting history, are they offering any applicable advice no matter what plant food you're feeding with?

First run with H&G. I'm attempting to match it up with two other items I already had sitting around to get close to a 1-3-2 ratio. I don't know that the yield will be there but the plants look happy.

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let's take a look at homebrewer's grow journal. why is it that someone who is a self proclaimed expert in growing somehow burnt plants to a crisp with AN. a ton of less experienced growers here were able to get great results using the same nutrients. could it be he did not run them correctly or was it done on purpose? why is it that he continues to claim that AN is more expensive when in reality it's actually the same price if not cheaper than Dyna to run their Sensi line. how is it that i can run an AN lineup for almost the same price using the same number of additives that homebrewer does but he continues to assume that just because AN has 10 bottles you have to buy all 10 bottles? seems silly to me that someone like him would assume that you need to purchase ALL of the AN additives. common sense would tell you that you need to pick and choose the additives based on your plants reactions and needs after running the base nutes.

i've openly admitted i don't run AN anymore in soil because i have found a better and cheaper recipe using a soil 2 part nute from House and Garden and a humisoil tea that i brew. why is it though that ANY thread that pops up in the nutrient section regarding AN is immediately attacked by homebrewer. there are 4-5 on the first page of the nutrient sub forum in which growers are asking questions about AN or talking about trying them out. in ALL of these threads homebrewer is seen insulting someone's intelligence and posting pictures of his plants. you would think that if someone wanted to try out a nutrient that we could all understand their need to experiment? i've never seen anyone make it such a mission to blatantly hate on a specific company or to go out of their way to promote another brand. all seems very odd to me.

here are some plants grown using AN. you will find no deficiencies on any of these plants and they were all grown with less money than homebrewer spends on his.

some veg pics. these plants grown in sunshine #4 with worm castings. using only sensi grow a&b, voodoo juice, and a little botanicare cal/mag plus as needed.




some early flower pics using connoisseur in sunshine #4 with worm castings. also used cal/mag as needed, rhino skin, overdrive, and bud candy.

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some pics from my harvest a few months back. these were grown in coco for some and rockwool for the others on flood tables. used sensi 2 part on the first ones i believe and connoisseur on the others. honestly can't remember all the additives but cal/mag plus, overdrive, piranha, tarantula, and sensizyme were used at different times for different plants. 1 or 2 more that i am sure i am forgetting.

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cultiv8 said:

There's always got to be a hater. I like how they always take it just a step too far though, calling everyone that uses something they don't like an idiot.

We couldn't be tolerant, could we? No, we gotta hate the people that use the products we don't like, not just the products.


I don't care what you use. I don't hate a company that hasn't done anything to me, and I don't hate you for using the products of the company.
See, I don't have a dog in the fight, I don't make any money based on who buys what nutrients so why should I get riled up because someone uses something different than me?


To the actual topic at hand, I'd say that anyone who wants to give the pH Perfect nutrients a try should do so. What's the worst that's gonna happen? You not like them? So you learn you don't like them. No biggie. Dyna-Gro or whatever company some hater works for is gonna lose maybe one sale and if the nutrients suck (which I know they don't because I use them myself) they might just get that customer down the road. But more likely they're gonna see what the rest of us see, that the pH Perfect nutes are amazing and by far the easiest and best way to grow.

In my opinion.

If yours is different, fine. Don't feel like you have to agree with me because I'm not gonna hate you if you do.
Now, if you keep being a jerk about it, that might change.

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Really do not care what you think...at all...jus sayin

patlpp said:

I'm just saying more educated business savvy growers go for time tested reliable nute regiments, specifically designed for the crop, and AN provides that. That is why so many big leaguers use it. There are so many other logistical concerns a serious grower spends time with other than an expense which only utilizes 2 or 3% of the net cost. I have tasted crops from many nute lines and I prefer AN. The key word here is "I". So what if Dyno gets you the same volume at half the cost, the quality of the smoke entering my lungs and the effect it has on my receptors is what finally matters the most, to ME, IMHO whatever. So be it if it costs more a grow, it works and tastes superb. For someone to slam the gavel down that one product is superb and all others are inferior and that all who do use these inferior products are idiots ,are idiots themselves.

By the way, I can match your Dyno growth and quality with AN 3-part G-M-B and a hobby kit any day. My cost 5$ a plant seed to flower including medium.

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that statement provides proof in and of itself that you believe hype...there are NO FACTS to back up the bolded statements you made...jus saying

homebrewer said:

I've not used foliage pro and in regards to that, I think the ratios that work best in dirt differ from those that work in hydro. I find myself using more 'grow' in flower than 'bloom' in promix, but that same feeding pattern wouldn't give me my best results in hydro. That being said, I'd really like to try a 3-1-2 in promix whether that comes from DG or someone else. Doesn't CNS17 offer a 3-1-2?



I use RO and use magpro in hydro which is basically epsom salt with a bloom-booster-like NPK content. I don't see a need for more cal/mag in promix where I do not use magpro so for me and the different mediums I grow in, a touch of magnesium is probably needed in hydro if one uses RO water.

Why did I see better results from DG than the GH 3-part? I think a big thing is the NPK ratio that DG offers. As I ran GH, I was ending up with something around a 1-2-2 NPK ratio and with DG, I come very close to a 1-3-2 which seems to be enough N to keep the leaves intact but also plenty of P and K for flower production. I think one thing that hurts the 3-part formulas is that one cannot gradually scale back the nitrogen content without cutting back everything that 'micro' is offering. The same holds true for 2-part formulas out there as I'm currently testing H&G's aqua flakes (which is doing really well) but the plants are much darker green than they need to be here at day 47 of flower.

I'm in a consistent environment and my results are so consistent that I've even been accused of posting the same photos over and over. The things I mentioned above are not necessarily things an inconsistent grower can lean on for greater consistency or better yields, they're just things I've settled into after making small tweaks round-after-round.

The 3-part formulas out there work great. Some 2-parts work great too. I think when one finds consistency, they can then make those tweaks as to find what NPK ratio works best. As much as I harp on some brands for being rip-off artists, their salts will grow herb and finding that combination of GH micro and Hydroplex or Aqua Flakes and Magpro is really what it's all about. Put that nutrient puzzle together and base a target on sound horticultural knowledge (ie. 3-1-2 ratio is best for cannabis). So many of these discussions turn to the name-dropping of products instead of why the minerals or ratios in said products will work well with the ones already being offered by the base. A lot of people can't participate in conversations like that which is probably why so many are quick to sling insults.

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they do but upon receiving the samples it is way diluted...takes 10 mls to = 1 ec! Diluted

The Growery said:

dynagro keeps my ph steady in the correct range all the time without having to adjust. ph balanced is just more hype from AN

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I agree w you