Best NPK Ratio for Veg and Flower

bankcee

Well-Known Member
good question
I got some nice nls going but I think it was just beginners luck. 10 day flower. and I'm noticing an N def and trying to figure out if it's a def or lockout or my bennies aren't working.

but I also wanna understand all this info going into my second crop.
 

VTMi'kmaq

Well-Known Member
so if I added several different ammendments to a super soil with varying npk ratios, how do I get what NPK is in my soil. say I add 1-0-0 ewc 3-16-0 fish bone meal, 2.5-0.5-2.5 alfalfa, 4-3-0 crab meal, 1-0.-1-2 kelp? what npk ratio is in my soil at the point my bennies are there doing their job and everything is in tip top shape?
Imvho thats overdoing it in soil. Even if you started with (lets say 1 bale) of pro-mix or sunshine mix. It's been my experiance that adding too much stuff like the above post can cause nute lockouts or excess salts to build up. Sometimes its best to start with as minimal amendments as possible and let the plants tell you what they need to thrive. I am NOT arguing or saying i know whats best, just giving my experiance so far. I wanna be part of the solution here not the problem..
 

bankcee

Well-Known Member
Imvho thats overdoing it in soil. Even if you started with (lets say 1 bale) of pro-mix or sunshine mix. It's been my experiance that adding too much stuff like the above post can cause nute lockouts or excess salts to build up. Sometimes its best to start with as minimal amendments as possible and let the plants tell you what they need to thrive. I am NOT arguing or saying i know whats best, just giving my experiance so far. I wanna be part of the solution here not the problem..
you grow organically? if so I'm interested in your recipe then. I'm all for learning and trying new stuff. new recipes. and trial and error.
 

Carolina Dream'n

Well-Known Member
IMO there shouldn't be a different base nutrient fro veg or flower. It should be the same and any PK boost you should want in flower should be obtained through using monopotassium phosphate.

3-2-6 works perfect for me in veg and all of flowering.
 

bankcee

Well-Known Member
IMO there shouldn't be a different base nutrient fro veg or flower. It should be the same and any PK boost you should want in flower should be obtained through using monopotassium phosphate.

3-2-6 works perfect for me in veg and all of flowering.
you grow organically? super soils or feed schedule?
 

Carolina Dream'n

Well-Known Member
you grow organically? super soils or feed schedule?
No organics for me, unless it outside in the veggie garden. I always recommend Ionic bloom from start to finish. It's one part and does a great job. They have a pk boost if your into that. Super easy with great results. Pretty sure that's what everyone wants.
 
Hello Waiakeauka. I'm not sure if this will help you or not but i found this on another website and it made sense to me -
Cannabis requires a 1:2 ratio of P to K throughout all stages of it's growth.

It's worth stating for the record the actual ratios of N, P and K that cannabis requires through it's life cycle:

Vegetative Stage
N - P - K
3 - 1 - 2

Flowering Stage
N - P - K
1 - 1 - 2

Final Flowering Stage
N - P - K
0 - 1 - 2

To translate this into a 12 week schedule for a typical Skunk type such as Cheese or Psychosis would give something along these lines:

Veg week 1: 3 - 1 - 2
Veg week 2: 3 - 1 - 2
Flo week 1 : 3 - 1 - 2
Flo week 2 : 3 - 1 - 2
Flo week 3 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 4 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 5 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 6 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 7 : 0 - 1 - 2
Flo week 8 : 0 - 1 - 2
Flo week 9 : 0 - 0 - 0
Flo week 10: 0 - 0 - 0

This schedule reduces the Nitrogen two weeks into the 12/12 period which will assist in stopping the vertical growth (stretch). It cuts out all Nitrogen after 6 weeks which will result in a less leafy, smoother burning end product with greater density to the flowers. The last two weeks of plain water is sufficient to leach out all accumulated salts and give a clean end product. Three week flush as advocated by some really isn't necessary if the Nitrogen is cut out after 6 weeks. The people using a three week flush tend to use Canna nutes which have too much N in them for late flowering and this is why they get a benefit from flushing for three weeks.

Hope that makes sense. Despite all the crap the nute companies fill our heads with about the need for all kinds of fancy bottles, you really don't need any of them. Cannabis is a simple plant, a weed in fact, and all it needs is the correct NPK at the correct time plus a full range of trace elements, that is hard fact and no amount of BS an marketing from the nute companies will ever change that fact.

Anyway :-) Hope this helps you a little bit ? Good luck and Happy Growing :-)
I know this post is super old but I had some questions...

So if for veg the npk ratio is 3-1-2 and I wanted to brew my own tea for veg, how much of each npk should I add? For instance I am already using bat guano which is 7 P. Does this mean I would need a mix of other organic amendments to get me to 21-7-14? Or do I need more or less of that ratio
 
I know this post is super old but I had some questions...

So if for veg the npk ratio is 3-1-2 and I wanted to brew my own tea for veg, how much of each npk should I add? For instance I am already using bat guano which is 7 P. Does this mean I would need a mix of other organic amendments to get me to 21-7-14? Or do I need more or less of that ratio
No one can answer this?
 

LRX

Member
I know this post is super old but I had some questions...

So if for veg the npk ratio is 3-1-2 and I wanted to brew my own tea for veg, how much of each npk should I add? For instance I am already using bat guano which is 7 P. Does this mean I would need a mix of other organic amendments to get me to 21-7-14? Or do I need more or less of that ratio

Do not do this (21-7-14) for veg.
Your bat guano is best used as an additive for bloom/flower
if you throw it into a mix for veg and then try to make it fit you handy 3-1-2
you are gonna shock the life out of things.

10 for N is probably plenty for most general applications.
And I would say too much maybe.
I do not want to put a number ppl should use for N in veg.
I would just say a normal application threshold 10 is getting up there.

For example - Humboldt Nutrients 'Verde'
is an additive - SUPER high in nitrogen
I know first hand that scientist's were paid to make this line of products.
If they are using 16 for N in this product
which a tiny drops or 2 is all you need in a foliar spray.
Do you think you should be feeding your plants a regular dose of
Nitrogen level 21.

Come On Man'
Hope this helps.
I want to help.
 
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LRX

Member
*** please note *** this chart is up for interpretation***
Veg week 1: 3 - 1 - 2
Veg week 2: 3 - 1 - 2
Flo week 1 : 3 - 1 - 2
Flo week 2 : 3 - 1 - 2
Flo week 3 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 4 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 5 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 6 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 7 : 0 - 1 - 2
Flo week 8 : 0 - 1 - 2
Flo week 9 : 0 - 0 - 0
Flo week 10: 0 - 0 - 0

The good is the flush and the transitions.
The bad - is the 1 - 1 - 2 part for bloom.

Why do Nutrient lines make products like this for bloom:
0 N - 10 P - 0 K

Hmmm. Cuz you should use 1-1-2 for bloom. ???
Come on man.

It is double P to K /// 2P:1K

Basic dry fertilizer:
dr earth organic tomato herb (5 - 7 - 3)

dr earth organic bud bloom booster (4 - 10 - 7)
Notice here the P is still higher than the K

Nectar of the gods - Herculean Harvest (0 - 10 - 0)

Do you think these people make these products this way for a reason???
"I rest my case"

Hope this helps people sift through stuff.

Can anyone find me a bud bloom booster product on the market with double the K to P (1P:2K)??
 
Last edited:

LRX

Member
Ok.

Bountea - Makes a product that goes in their tea system.
Their B3 - compost tea bloom additive.
It is N1 P4 K7
Granted: this product is meant to grow huge veggies (really)
so i feel like for the MJ it might be better for the HIGHER levels of P.
However I did answer my own question by finding a bloom product with close to double the K to P.

Now I guess I need to research why this can seemingly flip-flop.
Have to go back to basics.
What does P do?
What does K do?
How do they work together?

Maybe it should change mid flower:
go from -- early flower 1-1-2
change -- mid flower to 1-2-1
--- or ---
early flower 1-2-1
mid flower 1-1-2
????
later flower = flush flush

What arguments are there that one should one be higher than another?
 

djwinslow

New Member
Im starting my first grow here in portugal, i know bits but as far as the NPK ratio is concerned i have no clue. I have read up about it and found that different types like different mixtures, like the blue dream i have likes more nitrogen unlike the california kush. So I am looking for a mix that will do well for all. I will add more to the ones i know but i need a general good NPK mix for outdoor grow. I am looking at the atami Bcuzz a + b and a root booster. I dont know if they are any good not, so if anyone knows if they are or not please let me know.
 

Alien88

Member
Hello Waiakeauka. I'm not sure if this will help you or not but i found this on another website and it made sense to me -
Cannabis requires a 1:2 ratio of P to K throughout all stages of it's growth.

It's worth stating for the record the actual ratios of N, P and K that cannabis requires through it's life cycle:

Vegetative Stage
N - P - K
3 - 1 - 2

Flowering Stage
N - P - K
1 - 1 - 2

Final Flowering Stage
N - P - K
0 - 1 - 2

To translate this into a 12 week schedule for a typical Skunk type such as Cheese or Psychosis would give something along these lines:

Veg week 1: 3 - 1 - 2
Veg week 2: 3 - 1 - 2
Flo week 1 : 3 - 1 - 2
Flo week 2 : 3 - 1 - 2
Flo week 3 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 4 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 5 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 6 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 7 : 0 - 1 - 2
Flo week 8 : 0 - 1 - 2
Flo week 9 : 0 - 0 - 0
Flo week 10: 0 - 0 - 0

This schedule reduces the Nitrogen two weeks into the 12/12 period which will assist in stopping the vertical growth (stretch). It cuts out all Nitrogen after 6 weeks which will result in a less leafy, smoother burning end product with greater density to the flowers. The last two weeks of plain water is sufficient to leach out all accumulated salts and give a clean end product. Three week flush as advocated by some really isn't necessary if the Nitrogen is cut out after 6 weeks. The people using a three week flush tend to use Canna nutes which have too much N in them for late flowering and this is why they get a benefit from flushing for three weeks.

Hope that makes sense. Despite all the crap the nute companies fill our heads with about the need for all kinds of fancy bottles, you really don't need any of them. Cannabis is a simple plant, a weed in fact, and all it needs is the correct NPK at the correct time plus a full range of trace elements, that is hard fact and no amount of BS an marketing from the nute companies will ever change that fact.

Anyway :-) Hope this helps you a little bit ? Good luck and Happy Growing :-)
Best answer yet :)
 

3m3n3m

Member
I find it interesting that some folks misquote me. If you want a guide, because you really haven't learned what makes a plant tick, then - Veg - 9-3-6. Bloom - 1-3-2, or do what I say, not what I do. I grow most of my pot using a high N food from start to finish - 18-4-9 slow release. There is way too much emphasis put on veg versus bloom foods. You should use whatever it takes to produce and retain the most amount of foliage from start to finish.

UB
Ffs you just confused the f out of me. I finally thought I found the right info on NPK and made a decision on what to go with it. Then you say the complete opposite to these other guys. This shit is so draining mentally lol I've been using N12 P1.4 K7 because I thought it was the good Shit for veg plus adding additional seaweed extract. They have been growing like shit and I thought it was the NPK. Now you're saying 18 4 9 start to finish. What headache. I think I'll just go with Mother Nature and use filtered water now.



Been using these for veg.
 

3m3n3m

Member
This needs to be said first....for some strange reason folks need to make pot growing as complicated and confusing as they can. That's why you must empower yourself with solid botanical knowledge rather than take someone's advice on lighting, foods, defoliation tricks, etc.



DO NOT start until you buy and read Mel Frank's "MJ Insiders Growers Guide". It will be your short cut to success. http://www.amazon.com/Marijuana-Growers-Insiders-Guide-Frank/dp/0929349008

That is the most comprehensive, down to earth book on horticulture. Get your nose out of this blind-leading-the-blind forum and into Mel's book.

Check out my Tweeks thread in Advanced and read my posts. You'll quickly find I don't subscribe to most principles or products pushed around here, only sound culture.

Learn these concepts too - http://www.totalgro.com/concepts.htm

http://www.puyallup.wsu.edu/~Linda Chalker-Scott/Horticultural Myths_files/index.html

http://retirees.uwaterloo.ca/~jerry/orchids/nutri.html

Second group on the page - READ

http://www.staugorchidsociety.org/culturewater.htm

Yes, most is geared towards other plants like orchids, but it's the concepts you need to be looking into, they are solid and will translate over to cannabis culture. If you master these concepts, you can grow this weed. Treat cannabis like a tomato and you'll be successful. Treat it as it is - nothing more than a flowering tropical annual.

UB
My Dad taught me to grow like tomatoes too. I've had success outdoor just growing simple but this indoor thing has so many more problems that come with it. I could go and plant a seed directly into the ground and give it nothing but water and it'll thrive. But if I spend a shit load of money, plant the same seed in soil indoor and fry my brain with all this internet advice and I get fd plants. There's so many people saying different stuff. I don't know who's more stressed me or my critical poison fast girls.
 

3m3n3m

Member
Hello Waiakeauka. I'm not sure if this will help you or not but i found this on another website and it made sense to me -
Cannabis requires a 1:2 ratio of P to K throughout all stages of it's growth.

It's worth stating for the record the actual ratios of N, P and K that cannabis requires through it's life cycle:

Vegetative Stage
N - P - K
3 - 1 - 2

Flowering Stage
N - P - K
1 - 1 - 2

Final Flowering Stage
N - P - K
0 - 1 - 2

To translate this into a 12 week schedule for a typical Skunk type such as Cheese or Psychosis would give something along these lines:

Veg week 1: 3 - 1 - 2
Veg week 2: 3 - 1 - 2
Flo week 1 : 3 - 1 - 2
Flo week 2 : 3 - 1 - 2
Flo week 3 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 4 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 5 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 6 : 1 - 1 - 2
Flo week 7 : 0 - 1 - 2
Flo week 8 : 0 - 1 - 2
Flo week 9 : 0 - 0 - 0
Flo week 10: 0 - 0 - 0

This schedule reduces the Nitrogen two weeks into the 12/12 period which will assist in stopping the vertical growth (stretch). It cuts out all Nitrogen after 6 weeks which will result in a less leafy, smoother burning end product with greater density to the flowers. The last two weeks of plain water is sufficient to leach out all accumulated salts and give a clean end product. Three week flush as advocated by some really isn't necessary if the Nitrogen is cut out after 6 weeks. The people using a three week flush tend to use Canna nutes which have too much N in them for late flowering and this is why they get a benefit from flushing for three weeks.

Hope that makes sense. Despite all the crap the nute companies fill our heads with about the need for all kinds of fancy bottles, you really don't need any of them. Cannabis is a simple plant, a weed in fact, and all it needs is the correct NPK at the correct time plus a full range of trace elements, that is hard fact and no amount of BS an marketing from the nute companies will ever change that fact.

Anyway :-) Hope this helps you a little bit ? Good luck and Happy Growing :-)
I'm sticking with you! At least you write in a way that doesn't confuse people. It's very simplified so thumbs up on that. I live in Australia and here I wouldn't know where to look for something with the NPK you're suggesting. The closest I found today was
N5
P0.1
K1.1

I've been using what I thought was the good stuff for veg
N12
P1.4
K7
Plus seaweed extract
And I'm pretty sure the girls hate it. Can you please send me some links with nutes that have the NPK you're suggesting so I have some idea of which products to look for? 99% of nute info I've seen is non Australian and I haven't seen any of the brands here that people talk about.
 

3m3n3m

Member
Uncle Ben says to stick to something close to 2-1-3 ratio (i.e. 6-3-9 or 12-6-18 ) for veg and a 1-2-3 ratio (for example 3-6-9 or even 6-12-18 ) for flowering when adding nutes to soil. I would only use bloom boosters once or twice after the two week transition and that's it. I think it's pointless to use bloom booster at every feeding after the flower sites are established. Too much P will lock out N so it's advisable to just stay with real low numbers if you're not really sure.
Bro.. do you even realise how confusing that is? I feel like I've been drugged with meth when I read that Shit lol
 
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