SmallPowerzzz
Active Member
Does anyone think it's a good idea to use diluted bleach as ph up ?
What about bleach???
- Thread starter SmallPowerzzz
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brendon420
Well-Known Member
i think bleach kills anything and everything, i dont grow hydro though, so try it and tell us.
Al B. Fuct
once had a dog named
Household bleach is sodium hypochlorite (NaClO). It is strongly alkaline and will raise pH. However, it's not terribly good for plants. When it breaks down, the plant doesn't have much use for the sodium and chlorine, in fact both are toxic to plants in sufficient quantity.
pHUp as sold in hydro shops is potassium hydroxide (KOH). Potassium remaining after decomposition is used as a nutrient by the plants.
pHUp is very cheap, about $5-7 for 1L. You use it in such small quantities (about 1ml will shift a 125L tank of nutes pH +0.5) that it's false economy to use substitutes which may hurt the plants. About the only time you need to add pHUp is when you have accidentally corrected tapwater pH too low. Don't go overboard with the pHDown and you won't need any pHUp.
pHUp as sold in hydro shops is potassium hydroxide (KOH). Potassium remaining after decomposition is used as a nutrient by the plants.
pHUp is very cheap, about $5-7 for 1L. You use it in such small quantities (about 1ml will shift a 125L tank of nutes pH +0.5) that it's false economy to use substitutes which may hurt the plants. About the only time you need to add pHUp is when you have accidentally corrected tapwater pH too low. Don't go overboard with the pHDown and you won't need any pHUp.
SmallPowerzzz
Active Member
Thanks for the advise everyone. I've been having troubles with balancing my reservoir water ph before i do the weekly switch. after i add the nutes the ph is way low, so to raise it i tried to use baking soda...bad idea (salt issues)!
So I heard that you don't need ph up because the plants and medium raise the ph themselves, and I've been adding ph down every day.
I'm afraid that feeding them with solution with too low a ph will hurt them, and i am so looking forward to my own grown.
And thanks again I will buy potassium hydroxide for my ph up, after all that salt I'm sure my plants would appreciate the potassium. Cheers
So I heard that you don't need ph up because the plants and medium raise the ph themselves, and I've been adding ph down every day.
I'm afraid that feeding them with solution with too low a ph will hurt them, and i am so looking forward to my own grown.
And thanks again I will buy potassium hydroxide for my ph up, after all that salt I'm sure my plants would appreciate the potassium. Cheers
Al B. Fuct
once had a dog named
yeah, way bad idea.
Yes, low pH WILL hurt your plants. If pH is lower than it should be (never below 5.5), you stand a very good chance of locking out certain nutrients- this will appear as nutrient deficiencies on the plants.
Yep, use the right stuff. Guessing and using unproven substitutes will get you in dutch, every single time.
It's very unusual to see pH drop too low after adding nutes to plain water. Are you correcting the water's pH before adding nutes? If so- don't! Most nutrients have pH buffers built in and will correct pH without you adding any pHDown.
I use Canna nutes. Even when my tapwater is 7.5-8.1, when mixing for 1400ppm, the nutes alone will correct the solution pH to about 5.7-5.9, close enough for rock-n-roll.
I can't see any need to correct pH every day under normal circumstances. pH & nute strength can be allowed wander a bit, within a certain range.
As the days go by in the ~14 day life of your tank of nutes, if you top up with plain water every day, you will notice that the ppm will drop. This is because the plants eat some of the nutes, accounting for the drop in nute strength ppm when the volume of water is returned to the same level as on mixing day.
If your tank is too small for the plants it is supplying, the ppm will rise as the water is used up; in this case, the plants are using the water faster than it is using up the nutes. If this is your case, do top up with plain water often.
If your tank is too large for the plants it is feeding, water level, ppm & pH won't move far from your mixing day targets. Good for plants but hard on the wallet as you'll be dumping out nutes that the plants have not been able to eat come the end of the 14 day life of your tank of sauce.
If your tank size is ideally matched to the plants it is supplying, the plants use up the water and nutes in the same proportion. The nute strength ppm will stay very close to what it was on mixing day, even as the water level drops. If you find that your ppm stays close to the same (within 10%) while the water level drops, your tank size is perfect and you don't need to top up with plain water between mixing a fresh tank of nutes.
Don't try to jockey the pH & nute strength daily to a specific number for the life of a tank of nutes (usually 2 weeks). You stand a greater chance of stuffing it up by messing with your tank of nutes.
In particular, don't add more nutrient concentrate to a half-eaten, existing tank of nutes in between mixing up fresh tanks. Nutrient mixes are engineered to provide N, P & K not just in adequate quantity but in proper proportion for a certain phase of growth. Flowering nutes, in example, have a high ratio of P to N & K. Plants may use N, P & K at differing rates at different stages of growth. When you mix up a fresh tank, the NPK ratios will be right, per the maker's intentions. After several days of that tank of sauce feeding the plants, let's say that half the P is gone, 1/4 of the N is used and 2/3 of the K is eaten. If you then add more nutrient concentrate, you're going to wind up with N, P & K in proportions that the maker did not intend- and may not be right for the plants.
Only add nute mixes to plain water when you are mixing up a fresh tank, never add more concentrate to an existing tank of sauce.
If your pH is bouncing up significantly (+0.5 or more) a couple days after you mix a new tank (without adding more tapwater), I've seen that caused by root disease problems. If your watering rate is OK, eliminating overwatering as a cause, but plants are showing signs of root problems (yellowing lower leaves, slow growth), try adding 50% grade H2O2 to your nutes at 1ml/L of tank volume, every 3-4 days (which you should be doing anyway). Mix for pH5.7, don't correct down unless it wanders above 6.3 or so.
SmallPowerzzz
Active Member
That was a very informative post thanks very much for the info. I'm logging all that into my brain catalog for use in my setup. So I have been using reverse osmosis water in my tank and I am starting to believe that it might be what's throwing everything off balance. So this cycle I will change it to tap water, after the mandatory 24 hr sit out to ditch the chlorine and try adding my nutes to that to see where I stand. I will also check the sizing of my reservoir to my meager plants. Again thanks for the help Al, totally appreciated. I will post what happens next (if you care lol)
Have a good one
Have a good one
Al B. Fuct
once had a dog named
Glad there's some useful stuff in that. Took me a few years of hands on to work it out. 
I said this in another thread:
Wouldn't worry about chlorination.
I said this in another thread:
I've never seen the levels of chlorination in municipal water ever hurt a plant. However, I HAVE used a chlorinating additive for pythium control called 'PythOff' from the Flairform company in the past and managed to induce chlorine toxicity, so I sure know what it looks like!There's just no need for RO or other heroically filtered water. Chlorine is the indoor grower's friend, suppressing pathogens in rez tanks for a couple of days until the chlorine evaporates. After then, you must use an anti-microbial agent like H2O2 to keep your nutrient soup from being a friendly home to pathogens. Minerals like calcium and magnesium found in tapwater are essential micronutrients, which if they were not in the water would need to be added anyway.
Some folks will maintain that chlorination will kill beneficial microbes in soil. Do you like this 12ft tall cherry tomato plant I grew in my organic veg patch out back last season?
Grown mainly with municipal water right out of the tap. This single plant yielded more than 450 fruit. If tapwater is bad for plants, this plant was ASTONISHINGLY successfully fooled!
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Woomeister
Well-Known Member
pure genius, why didnt I think of it?
Al B. Fuct
once had a dog named
Maybe your plants were already white & bright like a summer's morn.pure genius, why didnt I think of it?
Stoney McFried
Well-Known Member
SmallPowerzzz
Active Member
Holy Crap Al, you seem to have a bevy of info locked in that skull of yours. I'm glad you responded. So your not just a canna-grower your just an all around green thumber. Mind if I ask if growing ganja got you into the veg grow or was it the other way around? I am interested in vegtable growing as well.
Do you treat your tapwater at all or just bang use it after pour?
Damn that tomato plant is like Frankenstein though nice job.
Do you treat your tapwater at all or just bang use it after pour?
Damn that tomato plant is like Frankenstein though nice job.
Al B. Fuct
once had a dog named
No worries, happy to help.
Strangely enough, I'm not a particularly good general gardener.
I wasn't a general gardener at all before I got practised at growing dope. Obviously, quite a lot of what one needs to know to grow cannabis transfers to the veg patch. Cannabis and most vegetable & herb plants are rather easy to grow.
However, some plants I've tried to grow lately are a lot more challenging. I really need some help with some Australian native plants like grevilleas and maidenhair ferns, both which are very picky. They are adapted to depleted soils and fertilising or watering them incorrectly can kill especially grevilleas outright. Grevilleas especially hate 'wet feet' and phosphorus. Maidenhairs, being rainforest bottom plants, need warmth (but not too much), dappled shade as well as consistent humidity and watering to duplicate their native conditions. However, I LOVE the intensely finely detailed and delicate nature of both of those plants.
Straight out of the garden hose. Don't fear tapwater.
Thanks, that one actually scared the neighbours. It reportedly threatened to eat their dogs and children.
Believe it or not, that plant was a volunteer; a seed got past my high-temp composting arrangement and sprouted in the veg patch, so I gave it some compost and put it in a good space in the patch. Knew it was a tomato plant early on of course, but didn't know it was a cherry tomato until I was very disappointed that the fruit were not getting large like regular tomatoes. However, it made the biggest cherry tomatoes I'd ever seen, most about 60mm dia, with the best flavour I've ever tasted from a cherry tomato. Lots of salads last summer.
I saved seeds and will be growing another copy this coming season. Next time, I'm growing them like a vine, along a fence instead of vertically. Storms tore down this monster plant twice over last summer, but it just sprang back and made more fruit. We had enough tomatoes to give to the neighbours- until they said 'no more, no more, please!' SmallPowerzzz
Active Member
Super insane stuff, and btw if your are growing rainforest calibre plants you just maybe a greenthumber. But only just a bit
I'm on the tapwater bandwagon now, so I'll keep you posted. As for the bleach it's out not going to do it, it was more just a wonder. Trying to clear my head of what I hear and fill it with what I learn. Hard sometimes with so many conflicting opinions.
As for cannabis growing it certainly seems it's the GATEWAY DRUG, but only just to other growing and radiactive tomato bushes that attack people and eat dogs. Damn where U live is crazy. Godzilla anyone, or I guess ATTACK OF THE KILLER TOMATOES!!!
So you've helped set me straight once again, thanks very much...
I'm on the tapwater bandwagon now, so I'll keep you posted. As for the bleach it's out not going to do it, it was more just a wonder. Trying to clear my head of what I hear and fill it with what I learn. Hard sometimes with so many conflicting opinions.
As for cannabis growing it certainly seems it's the GATEWAY DRUG, but only just to other growing and radiactive tomato bushes that attack people and eat dogs. Damn where U live is crazy. Godzilla anyone, or I guess ATTACK OF THE KILLER TOMATOES!!!
So you've helped set me straight once again, thanks very much...
Al B. Fuct
once had a dog named
Cool, I think you may have this sorted. Once you get the gnats and the fungus they are eating under control, your pH will stabilise.
Ignore opinions that don't have a basis in some science that you can independently verify. Will save you a lot of to-ing and fro-ing.
You still need a pH meter. Save your ducats and get a decent meter that will last you a while. I use Eutech pH meters, have for many years, worth the dough.
Ignore opinions that don't have a basis in some science that you can independently verify. Will save you a lot of to-ing and fro-ing.
You still need a pH meter. Save your ducats and get a decent meter that will last you a while. I use Eutech pH meters, have for many years, worth the dough.
Gr8Gr33nz
Active Member
thanks for this best info i can find..
goin hydro soon and was curious bout what to do with the ph fluctuation..
think i would be ok with fox farms or should i shoot for something else.?
I have some left but if not going to buy all new. possibly h&g.
sixstring2112
Well-Known Member
this thread is 2 years old