Recycled Organic Living Soil (ROLS) and No Till Thread

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reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
Pattahabi said:
This is probably obvious, but what is PBH? Rice hulls? I'm concerned they are going to break down too often, but good amendment, especially how local/sustainable it is.

Hey Mo, can I ask what you pay for pumice, and what size it is? I'm with Stow, my days of smashing lava rock for gardening are over! lol!


Thanks!
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Yep. "Parboiled rice hulls." I would have made the acronym "PRH," but i didn't get the chance to name the stuff. :)

I would simply top dress in a bit more periodically... i'm assuming that the parts that gradually break down and perhaps dissolve, and would then be slowly flushed by repeated watering, could also be amended in via top dress, just as gradually.

But yeah, it's a good line of questioning... if you had to build a soil that had to last as long as possible and remain effective... like if there was a weed apocalypse or something, and your last batch of soil was going to be the last batch you could ever make... AND you're not allowed to till it... (lol), then i suppose you'd want to know how to get it right in one try. :)

And the bonus on that is if you figure it out before the "apotcalpyse," you could prepare well in advance, and have many yards worth of all you'd need...
 
Pattahabi

Pattahabi

Well-Known Member
Reason, I don't know about the 'apotcalpyse', but I'm looking to run no-tills where remixing the soil kinda defeats the purpose. So when I mix up 200 gallons of soil and grow in it smart pot and grow continuously for the next 3 years it won't break down. Thus the title of the thread No-Till. ;)

So with all respect, while things like leaf mold and coco are awesome, I'm looking for a sturdy aeration that will hold some oxygen, not break down quickly, and could potentially add to the mineral content over time. I like pumice a lot, I just can't find any around here.


P-
 
R

reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
Pattahabi said:
Reason, I don't know about the 'apotcalpyse', but I'm looking to run no-tills where remixing the soil kinda defeats the purpose. So when I mix up 200 gallons of soil and grow in it smart pot and grow continuously for the next 3 years it won't break down. Thus the title of the thread No-Till. ;)

So with all respect, while things like leaf mold and coco are awesome, I'm looking for a sturdy aeration that will hold some oxygen, not break down quickly, and could potentially add to the mineral content over time. I like pumice a lot, I just can't find any around here.


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Yeah, tell me about it (i was just having fun imagination time with that 'apotcalpyse' thing), my regions grows all kinds of rice, but i have yet to locate a purchasable container of them locally.

I tend to think lava rocks won't break down. They've been around for thousands of years! But they're kinda heavy i guess. Or are they?

And i saw on the package/info for that "cocomur" that hyroot's testing, claims that it can last 10 years (or more?)...

Seems like anything made of or from rock, takes a long time to break down.

I would also think that, in this context, aeration would be fine as merely inert substance w/ proper characteristics, since you can always amend the mix with locally (mostly) available substances. Do you think, through tens or hundreds of waterings, that lava rock would gradually descend and accumulate in the bottom of the container? Or would the non-rocks parts compress and dissolve around the rocks, without affecting their position, as new materials are added? (e.g. vermicompost, mulch, etc)
 
C

CannaBare

Well-Known Member
Quick question.

I've been harvesting and trimming mother plants and the trim is pilling up. I usually just dumb it in a local forest but this time I am considering composting it. Can I compost material that has been grown with Maxibloom as long as the leaves have no salt residue on them? I ask because it was be so much free rich compost, but I want to make sure I wont kill my worms and bacterias.

I doubt I will ever move my mother plants away from Maxibloom as it is just toooo easy. But they produce a lot of foliage I could easily compost.
 
hyroot

hyroot

Well-Known Member
compost tea vs top dressing vermicompost. Thoughts?

I was thinking about maybe only doing a few more teas this round instead of topdressing or just topdress a thinner layer. To make the homemade VC last longer. My other bin is about a month away from harvest.. I just don't want to end up having to buy any castings and compost.
 
Chronikool

Chronikool

Well-Known Member
What about buying some castings and mixing them in with your home made castings ..to spin them out...

I'm lucky my compost bins are so full of worms...compost...vermicast...can't tell the difference.. :)
 
C

CannaBare

Well-Known Member
hyroot said:
compost tea vs top dressing vermicompost. Thoughts?

I was thinking about maybe only doing a few more teas this round instead of topdressing or just topdress a thinner layer. To make the homemade VC last longer. My other bin is about a month away from harvest.. I just don't want to end up having to buy any castings and compost.
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You can always top dress the ingredients after making the tea. Two birds
 
RedCarpetMatches

RedCarpetMatches

Well-Known Member
Pattahabi said:
Reason, I don't know about the 'apotcalpyse', but I'm looking to run no-tills where remixing the soil kinda defeats the purpose. So when I mix up 200 gallons of soil and grow in it smart pot and grow continuously for the next 3 years it won't break down. Thus the title of the thread No-Till. ;)

So with all respect, while things like leaf mold and coco are awesome, I'm looking for a sturdy aeration that will hold some oxygen, not break down quickly, and could potentially add to the mineral content over time. I like pumice a lot, I just can't find any around here.


P-
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Keeping this thread moist and thriving I see...

IMO lava rock is the best all round...as long as you have a strong back. On my third run with cheap bulk rice hulls, and they're still doing their job.
 
RedCarpetMatches

RedCarpetMatches

Well-Known Member
hyroot said:
compost tea vs top dressing vermicompost. Thoughts?

I was thinking about maybe only doing a few more teas this round instead of topdressing or just topdress a thinner layer. To make the homemade VC last longer. My other bin is about a month away from harvest.. I just don't want to end up having to buy any castings and compost.
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I've often wondered if we even need either if there's so much in our mix. I'd love to see a tea vs top dressing vs just mix.
 
X

x713

Well-Known Member
whats up with the *high brix* talk i see it all the time.i take a break from growing and more bullshit is fed to the farners smh if i needed brix i go buy some from home depot.have people at hydro store telling me i need brix brix brix lol never needed it before sounds like a ploy
 
greasemonkeymann

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
reasonevangelist said:
Yeah, tell me about it (i was just having fun imagination time with that 'apotcalpyse' thing), my regions grows all kinds of rice, but i have yet to locate a purchasable container of them locally.

I tend to think lava rocks won't break down. They've been around for thousands of years! But they're kinda heavy i guess. Or are they?

And i saw on the package/info for that "cocomur" that hyroot's testing, claims that it can last 10 years (or more?)...

Seems like anything made of or from rock, takes a long time to break down.

I would also think that, in this context, aeration would be fine as merely inert substance w/ proper characteristics, since you can always amend the mix with locally (mostly) available substances. Do you think, through tens or hundreds of waterings, that lava rock would gradually descend and accumulate in the bottom of the container? Or would the non-rocks parts compress and dissolve around the rocks, without affecting their position, as new materials are added? (e.g. vermicompost, mulch, etc)
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I don't know, I honestly haven't seen any settling with my lava rocks, they kinda stay where they are mixed, I don't mix a whole lot, just to re amend a lil, I've seen perlite float, even without watering, but it's so much lighter than the soil, and I think lava rock has a denseness that kinda lends itself well to being mixed with a soil heavy in EWC, keep in mind how much a bag of lavarock feels, in comparison to a bag of soil or especially castings (dense as hell) , it's not too far apart, soil is heavy... I LOVE lava rock, after my initial purchases of my soil mix (vermifire), I haven't bought soil in over a year now, (five harvests, I think) I have a bad back or I would have tried recycling my soil sooner, but with low amounts of mixing, hence the "no-till" attraction for me, I can't go and mix up my soil for hours and not pay the price the next morning
It's not as hard as you'd think
but no, when I get to the bottom of my mixing bin, it's the same as the regular soil, not all full of lavarock. I think over mixing MAY do it, but who knows, just don't overmix.
 
R

reasonevangelist

Well-Known Member
greasemonkeymann said:
I don't know, I honestly haven't seen any settling with my lava rocks, they kinda stay where they are mixed, I don't mix a whole lot, just to re amend a lil, I've seen perlite float, even without watering, but it's so much lighter than the soil, and I think lava rock has a denseness that kinda lends itself well to being mixed with a soil heavy in EWC, keep in mind how much a bag of lavarock feels, in comparison to a bag of soil or especially castings (dense as hell) , it's not too far apart, soil is heavy... I LOVE lava rock, after my initial purchases of my soil mix (vermifire), I haven't bought soil in over a year now, (five harvests, I think) I have a bad back or I would have tried recycling my soil sooner, but with low amounts of mixing, hence the "no-till" attraction for me, I can't go and mix up my soil for hours and not pay the price the next morning
It's not as hard as you'd think
but no, when I get to the bottom of my mixing bin, it's the same as the regular soil, not all full of lavarock. I think over mixing MAY do it, but who knows, just don't overmix.
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Just what i was hoping for: someone with lava rock experience, who has paid attention to whether it moves around or mostly stays put. ^^

Now the big question (for me) is: from where to source untainted horticultural scoria (red lava rock)?

Most of what i've seen available, seems to be intended for decorative purposes, and not sure whether anything unwanted has been added to it.
 
greasemonkeymann

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
reasonevangelist said:
Just what i was hoping for: someone with lava rock experience, who has paid attention to whether it moves around or mostly stays put. ^^

Now the big question (for me) is: from where to source untainted horticultural scoria (red lava rock)?

Most of what i've seen available, seems to be intended for decorative purposes, and not sure whether anything unwanted has been added to it.
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sorry, can't help there, like I mentioned, I started with vermifire, and it has a bunch of lavarock in it already.
I have ZERO idea if it's safe to use, but if you need a lot, maybe try a landscaping supply store, you could see what their smallest sizes are and go from there, not sure if they treat the rocks or anything so be diligent in trying it on a small scale if that's the route you want. I can't imagine why they'd treat lavarock with any kind of harmful chemical though, but I don't know that to be a fact
 
greasemonkeymann

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
foreverflyhi said:
Anyone ever use garden grade vermiculite?
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actually yes, I have used it for many grows, my brother used to, um, sheister things from a, um landscaping store... He scored me a HUGE bag of it, it works well, but it does retain a good bit of water, it works GREAT for cloning, fill a small pot full of it and the roots just go nuts, but you MUST keep it wet... For an amendment, my problem is it degrades over time, like probably three grows or so, I liked it though, but it doesn't work as well as lava rock. However i'd HIGHLY recommend it in a hot growing area, as it does retain water fairly well, at the same time if you aren't growing organically I had issues with it being kind of a magnet for nutrients, the vermiculite literally changed colors... May lead to issues over time.... I used it for organic grows and it worked MUCH better. Keep in mind my organic skills are light-years ahead of my chem-growing skills... Bottom line, if you have access to it, and it's more affordable, you can use it, but I don't recommend using it for a soil mix that you are going to re-use for an extended period of time, instead, go for the lava rock, or pumice, in my opinion. Not bad stuff though.
 
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