reads and give advice !!!!

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SSHZ

Well-Known Member
It does appear you have multiple things going on.........the earlier pic's were mite damage, they look just like mine. The later pic's appear to be classic cal/mag deficiency (rust spots).

First thing I'd do is buy Botanicare Cal/Mag (what I use) or something similar and apply it generously (I use r.o. water and add 10 ml to every gallon).

The mite damage is harder to solve- how wide spread is it? How many plants are effected? Is the damage mainly on the sun leaves high on the plants?
 
johnnytballs

johnnytballs

Member
A few plants none having anything moving on the leaves I don't think it's mites I think more on the lines nute lockout or light burn is @SSHZ I'm just ting to figure it out
 
Dr. Who

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
I tend to agree with SSHZ....could have been some early mite damage.
I do not really see broad mite damage....Instead I see more of what the OP suspects.....A minor "lock" due to pH that appears to be somewhat ongoing.......Looks minor because it's simply slightly out doing a minor nutrient block (reduced up-take due to pH being out of that nutrients optimal pH range).....

Hydro ebb&flow right?

Set you pH to 5.8 and let it clime to 6.2 and reset..This "swing" of the pH is more like nature does for soil grows. this makes sure that every nutrient gets a proper balanced up-take...Check daily! Now then, I suspect that this has a lot to do with no Ca/Mg use.
The water is struggling to hold pH due to "no or weak" buffering ability!
Like SSHZ said - Add a Ca/Mg product at 5ml per gallon to your res. - ALWAYS......

Now then on which Ca/Mg product to use....(no offence SSHZ) I do NOT like Botanicares CAL-MAG plus!
I prefer G&H's CALi MAGic better!
REASONS:
The Botanicare is made from Calcium Nitrate and has a higher N value of 2-0-0. Cal Nitrate is not as effective as other forms of Cal for use with plants.....Now don't get me wrong, it works ok but the Calcium Carbonate is better absorbed by the plant and in my opinion, better stabilizes the buffering ability of the water!
The CALI MAGic is made with the Calcium carbonate and has the lower 1-0-0 N value......Better and easier used by the plant Ca is a good thing!

SO, get somebodies Ca/Mg and use it at 5ml per gallon.
Run your pH at 5.8 to 6.2 and check/adjust daily.

I think that will fix your problems as they look now.......Continue to monitor for mites...If you see them.....FORBID 4F and they're DONE! Be sure to hit your media surface with a contact killer to help out....
Like you were told - EBAY for affordable amounts of Forbid!

Good luck!
 
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PerfectGrower

Well-Known Member
Dr. Who said:
I tend to agree with SSHZ....could have been some early mite damage.
I do not really see broad mite damage....Instead I see more of what the OP suspects.....A minor "lock" due to pH that appears to be somewhat ongoing.......Looks minor because it's simply slightly out doing a minor nutrient block (reduced up-take due to pH being out of that nutrients optimal pH range).....

Hydro ebb&flow right?

Set you pH to 5.8 and let it clime to 6.2 and reset..This "swing" of the pH is more like nature does for soil grows. this makes sure that every nutrient gets a proper balanced up-take...Check daily! Now then, I suspect that this has a lot to do with no Ca/Mg use.
The water is struggling to hold pH due to "no or weak" buffering ability!
Like SSHZ said - Add a Ca/Mg product at 5ml per gallon to your res. - ALWAYS......

Now then on which Ca/Mg product to use....(no offence SSHZ) I do NOT like Botanicares CAL-MAG plus!
I prefer G&H's CALi MAGic better!
REASONS:
The Botanicare is made from Calcium Nitrate and has a higher N value of 2-0-0. Cal Nitrate is not as effective as other forms of Cal for use with plants.....Now don't get me wrong, it works ok but the Calcium Carbonate is better absorbed by the plant and in my opinion, better stabilizes the buffering ability of the water!
The CALI MAGic is made with the Calcium carbonate and has the lower 1-0-0 N value......Better and easier used by the plant Ca is a good thing!

SO, get somebodies Ca/Mg and use it at 5ml per gallon.
Run your pH at 5.8 to 6.2 and check/adjust daily.

I think that will fix your problems as they look now.......Continue to monitor for mites...If you see them.....FORBID 4F and they're DONE! Be sure to hit your media surface with a contact killer to help out....
Like you were told - EBAY for affordable amounts of Forbid!

Good luck!
Click to expand...


I dont know how you are getting pH stability with large amounts of calcium carbonate. It will make your pH rise considerably :)

A buffer is only created when the calcium carbonate is mixed with an appropriate acid.
 
Dr. Who

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
PerfectGrower said:
I dont know how you are getting pH stability with large amounts of calcium carbonate. It will make your pH rise considerably :)

A buffer is only created when the calcium carbonate is mixed with an appropriate acid.
Click to expand...
RO lacks any buffer. If it needed acids to actually work for buffering, why does it? Or has the maker done that IN the formulation???
Buffered water has far better pH "stability" then those with out....The accepted buffering agent is a Ca/Mg right?

The point I still contend is that it's better then Ca Nitrate for plants...:hug:
 
P

PerfectGrower

Well-Known Member
Dr. Who said:
I generally started at 5ml per gallon and adjust IF I had too....You can very safely start at 3ml and go up if you have to!
Click to expand...

Buffering is tricky. Every "good" nutrient company does their very best to buffer their products. Some products are easier to buffer than others. It really depends on the ingredients.


We've tested everything.....extensively.


Calcium nitrate is a wonderful calcium source and widely used. We use 3 different calcium sources in our formulations, each serving a unique purpose. Remember, when you add calcium nitrate, you're increasing both calcium and nitrogen. This isn't always beneficial (ie. flowering stage). This is why different calcium sources are chosen.


My point is, calcium carbonate should not be used as a calcium source. It should be used as a buffer :)
 
Dr. Who

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
PerfectGrower said:
Buffering is tricky. Every "good" nutrient company does their very best to buffer their products. Some products are easier to buffer than others. It really depends on the ingredients.


We've tested everything.....extensively.


Calcium nitrate is a wonderful calcium source and widely used. We use 3 different calcium sources in our formulations, each serving a unique purpose. Remember, when you add calcium nitrate, you're increasing both calcium and nitrogen. This isn't always beneficial (ie. flowering stage). This is why different calcium sources are chosen.


My point is, calcium carbonate should not be used as a calcium source. It should be used as a buffer :)
Click to expand...
I understand and respect that....C Carb, C, Phos, C Carb,,,,,I still like the CC better when I ran hydro.I did not like the higher N with CN - Look at stupid AN with 4-0-0....We all have our "likes" don't we? (Bet you can tell I prefer organic sourced products - lol)

As a nutrient maker, I'm sure your better qualified on the chemical end in many ways......Because you have a business interest. Some statements can lead to speculation by some members as to their intentions. I will not speculate on that.

You sell powders and I have to say that you have better respect from me for not being a "water re-seller" !!! ;-) ;-)

I'm NOT diss'in your gear! I have no experience with it so it's not my place to comment on that!
Still I left the synthetics behind me "again" a few years back......So then, If I were to be running soil. Do you offer something I should try for fun?
I mean I'd be open to testing a small amount to do a single run on a cpl of plants and give YOU my feedback.....You would have cart blanch to use my results if you like.....PM me.....I have the urge and ability to do plenty of testing again....up to you...

Nice chat though....
 
S

SSHZ

Well-Known Member
Don't spray neem on buds, it will destroy the growing buds and retard growth.

I use r.o. water, virtually 0 ppm and 5 ml of cal/mag is not enough as I show deficiencies. So I up it to 10 ml and the plants are healthy and loving life. But if you don't use an r.o device, 5 ml of cal/mag should surely be enough.
 
smokentoken

smokentoken

Active Member
the only other thing you could try is diametecous Earth

Dr. Who said:
And when they get out of control and you can't get rid of them or they simply keep coming back and back and back......You won't say "BEST" anymore...... LMAO! I'm not putting any "oil" on my plant...Blah...
Click to expand...
see avatar

good thing I wasn't talking to you..or is the OP your sp?
 
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S

SSHZ

Well-Known Member
I also think you're running your ph too high.......5.6 to 5.8 is where you should be, not higher. Lockup is probably partially caused by you running too high.
 
drewby

drewby

Well-Known Member
Less is more in many case with nutrients,,I feed straight water,,unless they need a boost I mix my own soil,,so they got all they need for the most part ,,just water ,I agree feed at half strength if it is a must and see if this improves it
 
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