ok..so I use mason jars to cure, but have run out

Gastanker

Gastanker

Well-Known Member
HydroDawg421 said:
The link I posted to The Container Store is for the Kilner type jar. These are the Bormioli Rocco Fido jars made in Italy. They are considerd to be some of the best glass jars around.

Go and price enough mason jars to equal 5 liters. Then compare the space needed to store those mason jars.
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...I did... It's $7.49 from walmart to buy 12, 1liter mason jars - that's $0.65/liter compared to $2/liter... Really really simple. You're right, the 5 1 liter jars will take up a tiny amount of additional room, but they come in cases which you can easily stack.

You're totally correct about the glass quality but is that a huge concern? The mason jars will always seal tighter for longer periods of time and keep things much much better than kilner jars so why fuss about the color of the glass?
 
P

psari

Well-Known Member
Gastanker said:
...

Personally as someone that use to sell bulk glass - I would steer you away from jars with rubber gaskets.
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Not trolling. Honest question mate: Why do you make this recommendation?

Like many I've had some with bad formed lids/seals and paid dearly for it. Just wondering if its a quality control issue or what.

Thank you.

edit: Ack posted while you modified the above. Seems to be answered that its failure over time ... If not, please expand on that some if you will.
 
Gastanker

Gastanker

Well-Known Member
psari said:
Not trolling. Honest question mate: Why do you make this recommendation?

Like many I've had some with bad formed lids/seals and paid dearly for it. Just wondering if its a quality control issue or what.

Thank you.
Click to expand...
Storage is pretty backwards as most of the best storage methods have the worst marketing benefits. Mason jars are used in canning because they seal super tight, for long long periods of time, without leeching anything into the product. Anything with a rubber gasket has the potential of both tainting the product as well as leaks - rubber is MUCH more porous and much less stable than metal. Really good rubber isn't terrible - it will work, but the problem is that the rubber gasket is always the most expensive part of the jar which means that it's usually the first piece for manufacturers to cheap out on. The vast majority of kilner jars I have worked with were nice jars (glass wise) with really really really bad rubber on them - fine for storing pastas for a short period of time, great for keeping marbles in, but nothing else food related.

Its kind of like wine - what keeps wine better longer, a metal screw cap or a cork? Well the cork will help your product sell but it can be terrible for the wine and is the leading cause of wine going off. Of course I'd rather uncork a bottle of wine than unscrew one... Or in olive oil, what's best for your product, clear glass or dark glass - dark glass obviously but you'll sell 3 times the amount of oil if you put it in clear glass...

There is a very good reason most all jarred food is packed in mason jars, and it's not the price (for one you can create and keep a vacuum in a mason jar - wont keep for long with most kilner jars). If you have a bad mason jar lid just buy some more. You can get new lids for like 10 cents a piece... I'm not sure about those specific container store kilner jars but many many kilner jars, in addition to the rubber gasket, have an inner plastic lid that covers the glass part of the lid - spend extra on a glass lid just to cover the glass? Yum, plastic and rubber!

By no way am I saying that all kilner jars are crap or that they can't be used. They are just much much more expensive and will not keep your product any better.

If you are a big grower I would make a trip to a legit glass distributor. I can get these 1 gal jars for ~$1 a piece... http://www.calglass.com/catalog/product?ProductId=57
 
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psari

Well-Known Member
Cheap rubber indeed. Nasty when it breaks down etc.

Seems many of the other (better) short term storage containers etc are using silicon based gaskets to remain "neutral" in the flavoring/contamination aspect. But those tend to have the same problem over time including becoming saturated and inevitably leaking odor absorbed.

I've always been frugal but occasionally I've found the "pretty glass" at the thrift and second hand stores for short term. Problem is I always end up having to redo seals and wind up using them as gifts for people.

Thanks for expanding on that mate. Especially the wine and olive references.
 
Gastanker

Gastanker

Well-Known Member
Np. The silicone is definitely more neutral to start with but breaks down super super fast, especially the presence of any amount of sunlight, and leeches scents pretty heavily. I've been seeing some of the cheaper distributors using straight hard plastic cut into thin semi flexible ribs. Looks like silicone and it holds the lid on tight, but in no way is it close to an air tight seal.
 
HydroDawg421

HydroDawg421

Well-Known Member
Gastanker said:
Storage is pretty backwards as most of the best storage methods have the worst marketing benefits. Mason jars are used in canning because they seal super tight, for long long periods of time, without leeching anything into the product. Anything with a rubber gasket has the potential of both tainting the product as well as leaks - rubber is MUCH more porous and much less stable than metal. Really good rubber isn't terrible - it will work, but the problem is that the rubber gasket is always the most expensive part of the jar which means that it's usually the first piece for manufacturers to cheap out on. The vast majority of kilner jars I have worked with were nice jars (glass wise) with really really really bad rubber on them - fine for storing pastas for a short period of time, great for keeping marbles in, but nothing else food related.

Its kind of like wine - what keeps wine better longer, a metal screw cap or a cork? Well the cork will help your product sell but it can be terrible for the wine and is the leading cause of wine going off. Of course I'd rather uncork a bottle of wine than unscrew one... Or in olive oil, what's best for your product, clear glass or dark glass - dark glass obviously but you'll sell 3 times the amount of oil if you put it in clear glass...

There is a very good reason most all jarred food is packed in mason jars, and it's not the price (for one you can create and keep a vacuum in a mason jar - wont keep for long with most kilner jars). If you have a bad mason jar lid just buy some more. You can get new lids for like 10 cents a piece... I'm not sure about those specific container store kilner jars but many many kilner jars, in addition to the rubber gasket, have an inner plastic lid that covers the glass part of the lid - spend extra on a glass lid just to cover the glass? Yum, plastic and rubber!

By no way am I saying that all kilner jars are crap or that they can't be used. They are just much much more expensive and will not keep your product any better.

If you are a big grower I would make a trip to a legit glass distributor. I can get these 1 gal jars for ~$1 a piece... http://www.calglass.com/catalog/product?ProductId=57
Click to expand...

GREAT LINK! Too bad the minimum order is $500.

I use mason jars for my smaller buds. However, I've yet to find a mason jar that is BIG enough to put my MASSIVE BUDS in. I'm being serious. The Bormioli jars are food grade, so I'm not really worried about the gasket breaking down. Not in my lifetime. I have spent a lot of time & money looking for cheap jars. And I found them. And they were cheap! My local Wal Mart doesn't stock any of the larger Mason jars. Mason jars are ideal for small stuff and vacuum sealing. I use the larger jars to cure out the bud and then I'll put them in a Mason jar and vacuum seal for long term storage. It PAINS ME GREATLY to cut up my LARGEST buds to put them in a Mason jar.

I used some of the cheaper no name plastic-ish Kilner style jars and others from Wal Mart and the tortilla chips I put in them to test it were stale in about 5 days.

I'm sticking with the larger Bormioli jars for cure and short/medium storage. Anything long term gets vacuum sealed in a Mason jar.
 
SimonD

SimonD

Well-Known Member
FWIW, I use 2.5gal jars made by Anchor Hocking. You can get them at Target, Amazon, etc. They're the same jars as the ones sold by canna hobbyist sites, but here they run ~$20.

Simon
 
missnu

missnu

Well-Known Member
Gastanker said:
Storage is pretty backwards as most of the best storage methods have the worst marketing benefits. Mason jars are used in canning because they seal super tight, for long long periods of time, without leeching anything into the product. Anything with a rubber gasket has the potential of both tainting the product as well as leaks - rubber is MUCH more porous and much less stable than metal. Really good rubber isn't terrible - it will work, but the problem is that the rubber gasket is always the most expensive part of the jar which means that it's usually the first piece for manufacturers to cheap out on. The vast majority of kilner jars I have worked with were nice jars (glass wise) with really really really bad rubber on them - fine for storing pastas for a short period of time, great for keeping marbles in, but nothing else food related.

Its kind of like wine - what keeps wine better longer, a metal screw cap or a cork? Well the cork will help your product sell but it can be terrible for the wine and is the leading cause of wine going off. Of course I'd rather uncork a bottle of wine than unscrew one... Or in olive oil, what's best for your product, clear glass or dark glass - dark glass obviously but you'll sell 3 times the amount of oil if you put it in clear glass...

There is a very good reason most all jarred food is packed in mason jars, and it's not the price (for one you can create and keep a vacuum in a mason jar - wont keep for long with most kilner jars). If you have a bad mason jar lid just buy some more. You can get new lids for like 10 cents a piece... I'm not sure about those specific container store kilner jars but many many kilner jars, in addition to the rubber gasket, have an inner plastic lid that covers the glass part of the lid - spend extra on a glass lid just to cover the glass? Yum, plastic and rubber!

By no way am I saying that all kilner jars are crap or that they can't be used. They are just much much more expensive and will not keep your product any better.

If you are a big grower I would make a trip to a legit glass distributor. I can get these 1 gal jars for ~$1 a piece... http://www.calglass.com/catalog/product?ProductId=57
Click to expand...

I'm a tiny grower...lol. I have like 4 or 5 mismatched jars and they work for me...so...
 
Gastanker

Gastanker

Well-Known Member
missnu said:
I'm a tiny grower...lol. I have like 4 or 5 mismatched jars and they work for me...so...
Click to expand...
If you show up in person they'll sell you a 'sample' or two (or a half dozen) for half price. ;)

But what works for you works for you. Will never ever argue that point.
 
missnu

missnu

Well-Known Member
Hahahahahahaa found 2 cases of jars in the shed...score! The less money I have to spend on all this the better...lol.
 
missnu

missnu

Well-Known Member
NO way! I noticed it seemed to take more time with the jar open with such a big jar, or perhaps it was that I don't usually have that much stuff in one jar...lol.
 
missnu

missnu

Well-Known Member
Well I got the one gallon with a giant jar of pickles...most of my jars are upcycled trash...
 
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