Obama's address to congress.......

Here is an interesting update on the whole Wilson "You lie" donnybrook.




September 11, 2009
Dems decry Wilson outburst - then close illegal's loophole in bill

Rick Moran
[FONT=times new roman,times]This is too rich in irony to pass up.[/FONT]

[FONT=times new roman,times]Poor Joe Wilson is being absolutely skewered by the left over his ill-timed outburst against President Obama during his speech Wednesday night. Now Democratic senators are going back to the Baucus bill and fixing what Wilson was screaming about.[/FONT]

[FONT=times new roman,times]That's right. Democrats are proving Obama really is a liar, says Fox News:[/FONT]

[FONT=times new roman,times]Perhaps all this sturm and drang by Democrats over Wilson is a smokescreen to hide the fact that he was right and the president was lying about health care reform bills denying illegal immigrants access to government health care. They certainly are making a stink, aren't they? My my, but it crosses the mind that if liberals got half as outraged about terrorists, the war would be over. Instead, we learn that Wilson took caffeine pills to stay awake, that he and his family enjoy government insurance through the military, and that he's some kind of neo-confederate, closet Kluxer - or something.[/FONT]

[FONT=times new roman,times]So it turns out that Wilson may be ill-mannered - but dead on right.[/FONT]
[FONT=times new roman,times]http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2009/09/dems_decry_wilson_outburst_the.htm[/FONT]

[FONT=times new roman,times]Also:[/FONT]
[FONT=times new roman,times]From NBC's Mike Viqueira[/FONT]
[FONT=times new roman,times]The White House tonight is providing the below clarification on what the president's health-care proposals would mean when it comes to the issue of illegal immigrants.[/FONT]
[FONT=times new roman,times]The question, as we all know, arises from the Wilson "You lie" outburst, and the core claim that notwithstanding specific bill language barring illegal immigrants from participating in the "exchange," as a practical matter, there is no way of verifying the citizenship of applicants -- which is the current state of play. Republicans say that then means illegal immigrants would end up being enrolled in plans -- bill language or no bill language.[/FONT]
[FONT=times new roman,times]Today, for the first time as far as we know, the administration is backing a provision that would require proof of citizenship before someone could enroll in a plan selected on the exchange[/FONT]
[FONT=times new roman,times]http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2009/09/11/2065287.aspx[/FONT]

Wow if you think he had a great speech, I feel sorry for you. You cant see that he says the same thing over and over agian with no real input. If I was their I would of called him a lier too, he is the best damn car sales men I have ever seen, and each one of you are getting closed every time he speaks. Big Gov is getting too big, with every passing bill you we lose our freedom to make our own choices. Stop going down the easy road and stand up for our freedom. Unless you really want someone makeing up your mind with every turn they can take. This isnt Demos or Repubs, this us a the Amercian People vs to much big gov. Wake up!

[FONT=times new roman,times]"The Congressional Research Service has indicated that indeed the bills that are before Congress would include illegal aliens," Wilson said. "And I think this is wrong."[/FONT]

[FONT=times new roman,times]Indeed, the nonpartisan Congressional Research Service study found that the House health care bill does not restrict illegal immigrants from receiving health care coverage.[/FONT]

[FONT=times new roman,times]House Republican Minority Leader John Boehner amplified the complaint that without proof of citizenship, illegal immigrants could be insured.[/FONT]

[FONT=times new roman,times]"There were two opportunities for House Democrats to make clear that illegal immigrants wouldn't be covered by putting in requirements to show citizenships," he said. "Both of those amendments were, in fact, rejected."[/FONT]

Click to expand...

This does not stand up. It does restrict illegal immigrants and says exactly that. What they just started pointing to the last couple weeks is that they may be able to exploit a loophole to BUY the insurance. Which they are able to today with regular insurance. That is right folks, these people are arguing that illegal immigrants should not be able to PAY for health insurance, instead they should do what they do now, and PAY FOR THE INSURANCE IF THEY GET IT! Well either that or use the emergency rooms and run up bills then walk out on them.

So they are not able to take advantage of the free or reduced programs in this bill, but they MAY be able to use a loophole that allows them to buy it similar to insurance today (so does not change the system at all, and every extra person enrolled in insurance is more money saved for the system). So Obama is not 'lying' and that guy is still a dipshit, even though they are trying to save face.

I mean seriously you don't want these people to pay for the services they use? Or is it that you think somehow these people are evil and going to corrupt our precious dainty country? Please, we are the most hypocritical people sometimes. How many other countries are the majority of the people made up of foreigners? Us, Australia? I think that may be about it. And at least the Aussies don't call the people that are native to the region illegal immigrants.

They shouldn't be able to BUY insurance because they should NOT be here. They should be incarcerated for crossing the border and then deported. They shouldn't be able to buy a coke much less goverment subsidized insurance.

spinninggorilla said:

Wow if you think he had a great speech, I feel sorry for you. You cant see that he says the same thing over and over agian with no real input. If I was their I would of called him a lier too, he is the best damn car sales men I have ever seen, and each one of you are getting closed every time he speaks. Big Gov is getting too big, with every passing bill you we lose our freedom to make our own choices. Stop going down the easy road and stand up for our freedom. Unless you really want someone makeing up your mind with every turn they can take. This isnt Demos or Repubs, this us a the Amercian People vs to much big gov. Wake up!

Click to expand...

I concur. The speech was a rehash of the same ol same ol. The entire speech was rife with falsehoods and misleading estimates. The betting lines are for a 24% chance of health care passing. I concur with that also. If it wasn't dead before the speech, it's sure dead now. R.I.P. for good plz.

Obama is a great speaker..Wilson showed no respect and its not just respecting Obama its about respecting the office that he holds..You don't yell out liar when the President comes to your house to talk to you .... no class at all and Cracker seeing how wrong you have been on this forum I place no value on what you say anymore( I used to at least go check to see if you right or wrong because you never provide support for your assinine statements..got tired of finding out how wrong you are ) !!!!! You just hate Obama because he is Obama period...call it like I see it.....Healthcare will pass in some form and to those who don't like Obamas plan please come up with something better to bring the cost of healthcare down, make insurance company stop putting profit before healh, assure all american citizens can get healthcare when needed..If you can't do anything but say no no no liar liar liar..then just STFU....Grown folks trying to take care of business

As long as ppl stay uninformed.... the carnage will continue. Obama sure does know his base. He's losing everyone else though.

So, instead of letting "illegals" BUY insurance, it's better to let them use our emergency medical system at our expense? Because that's exactly what happens. Do you think that because they can't "buy into" this public option that they won't seek medical attention when they're ill or injured? They will, they just won't have the insurance to cover it so WE end up paying for it. Just like we do now, in the form of higher hospital/doctor bills.

If they want to BUY insurance (which means they PAY for it, with their own money, just like everyone else), what's the harm? They might get too comfortable and want to stay here? That's about the worst thing that could happen, huh?

If they AREN'T allowed to buy insurance, then they get a free ride. On our dime.

Which is worse?

as far as i know, obama had previously blocked legislation to require companies to use "e-verify" to ensure citizenship, and thus eligibility. so there was a major loophole, and we were lied to during the speech

The problem is the govt. program is DESIGNED to eventually ruin the pools of insurance in the private sector.

I'm glad you are concerned about costs.... sort of.

Here's the problem with anything which is offered as "free". If you walk out after eating a meal, there is a mint jar. They are "free". Now, the first person may only take 1 mint, but the next fellah takes 10. Y? Because it's free. Of course if everyone took 10, the diner would either raise the price of it's meals to compensate, or buy cheaper candy, or stop offering the candy altogether.

Same with medical care. Illegals use the Emergency room..... for actual emergencies. If however, insurance is offered, and the perception is that it is free, or extremely cheap, overuse is the result. This happens right now in the private sector and will surely increase IF the govt. proceeds. At first everything will seem okay, but it won't be.

Another point.... the vast majority of LEGAL citizens are very happy with the system in place, and have repeatedly rejected the "public" plan over and over again. Why would we scrap a system which delivers the best quality health care IN THE WORLD for a small percentage who don't belong here in the first place? Obama's bill doesn't even allow for the checking of a citizens status as a citizen.

You don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Mrphilliplesh said:

wow dude you are too far lost. you need to go back to school so you wont be so easily fooled by the uneducated lies of the right. if you would just remove the
"dumb fuck brain block" you have you would have heard a man telling nothing but truths.

where is the solution from your republican buddies? you have none. go lay on the couch and keep smokin yourself stupid.

Click to expand...

Well I feel the same about you..so try to articulate your arguement without personal attacks..you asshat, how does that feel

Just as a side note.... Rep. Wilson was 100% accurate when he called Obama out on the lie... it was a lie. His method of disagreeing was incorrect....but the substance of his comment was dead on......

CrackerJax said:

Just as a side note.... Rep. Wilson was 100% accurate when he called Obama out on the lie... it was a lie. His method of disagreeing was incorrect....but the substance of his comment was dead on......

Click to expand...

Amen to that Cracker jack!!! Hell I sent him5 bucks...LOL

Ever watch the British parliament in action when the Prime minister shows up .. ?

Think Obama could handle that? Obama gives great speeches but is hideous talking off the top of his head. I prefer Bush, who was bad at both ... it appeared to be not contrived. Bush made some serious domestic errors, but still someone I'd sit down and have a beer with. I find Obama to be a cold fish. So do others, those close to him.

Weekly parties aside, Obama needs to get down to work and quit campaigning... the elections over.... he won. It's time to lead.... in the right direction. It doesn't seem to dawn on Obama that all this resistance is because he is going the wrong way.....

Why here's Obama and Biden driving the economy right now..... let's listen in....

The luggage is the taxpayer by the way.




[youtube]NEZv0FUPtcc[/youtube]

[youtube]VxKIcrDsJAs[/youtube]

Get used to President Obama for the next three years and four more after.....I love how people just praying that this man to fail....All I hear is he can't do this...We spending too much that..Healthcare bad....I don't won't my child to listen to Obama tell them to "stay in school"..... Yeah we all know the real reason you hate....You see thru....Get some fresh ideas and put them on the table or again STFU...what don't have any ???? Just want to tell us what you don't like.... To all the folks that say Obama will fail ..are you the same people that said he wouldn't win..???? Do me a favor...take the Mccain/Palin bumper sticker off your cars.... America is about to move forward and you are about to get left behind with all your hate...

CrackerJax said:

The problem is the govt. program is DESIGNED to eventually ruin the pools of insurance in the private sector.

Click to expand...

If by "ruin", you mean bring down the price and ensure that everyone who can afford coverage has it, then I guess you're right. Unless you own or work for an insurance company, i don't see why this prospect would be so upsetting to you.

The problem with our medical system is that not everyone has access to medical care. The US tops the list for LEAST access to medical services. Sure, we might have great hospitals and doctors, but not everyone can afford to see them. This simply doesn't happen in other "developed" countries.


It cracks me up to hear people who say "I don't want the government to take away my CHOICE". Well, with an HMO, you don't really have a choice to be taken away. You have to go to a certain doctor, you have to have a referral from that doctor to see a "specialist", only certain hospitals will take your insurance, etc. You don't really even have a choice as to what carrier you buy your policy from, as most people who are insured are covered under an employer sponsored policy where the employer chooses the carrier! If you buy insurance on the private market, you have a choice, but they're all just as expensive as the next and there's no guarantee that they won't drop you as soon as you become ill. So, where's the choice that's being taken away?

Well, right now people are "choosing" not to have insurance, either because they can't afford it or because they feel they don't need it. Because of this "freedom to choose", insurance prices continue to rise 3x faster than wages, the insurance companies are making BILLIONS of dollars while sick people are denied the care they need, and why? Because the insurance companies are GREEDY. All they care about is the bottom line. How many claims can we deny to save money? Whoever denies the most claims gets a fat bonus! No matter that people are DYING, while the insurance companies count their monopoly money.

When people "choose" not to have insurance, it makes it all the more expensive for those who DO.

If it weren't for my boyfriend's employer-sponsored coverage, his health insurance would cost him nearly $400 per month, just for him .That's almost as much as our mortgage! Instead, he pays about $125 because his employer pays the rest. For the whole family to be covered, even with the employer contribution, it *would* cost us $400 out of pocket every month. If we tried to purchase a family policy on the individual market, it would cost twice as much as our house payment EVERY MONTH. That's IF we were even able to get it (which we wouldn't be... too many "preexisting conditions" AKA allergies, etc).

It frightens me to see what our nation has become. Not because of our government, but because of our citizens.

so misinformed Doob .... U deserve public health care... u really do. If only to teach u a lesson in politics and economics.

So green, like a babe in the woods u r.

CrackerJax said:

so misinformed Doob .... U deserve public health care... u really do. If only to teach u a lesson in politics and economics.

So green, like a babe in the woods u r.

Click to expand...

LOL....

I have been in the VA for years and its good health care. But even the Docs inside the VA tell you, Maybe you should get another opinion..Come on if their is no insentive Docs will do something else or go somewhere else.

Remember when it comes to health care the Kings, Presidents, Heads of state frfom all over the world come here when they get really sick!!!!!!