New to DWC

Hello, Im new!! So I'm on my first grow using the DWC system. I'm completely ignorant with most living plants, I tend to have a black thumb, even on the easiest grown. Please don't bash too bad lol

A lil background, my bf and I decided to try it this way since I tend to fail with soil. We got some supplies, I thought we had everything that we needed, but we only got the basic, didn't realize there were so much more that can go into it, I suppose I should have researched more, but I was tired of forking out money to clubs, and even with this grow, I'm on extremely limited funds.

We started with 3 - 3 gal black buckets (but only growing 2 plants, the 3rd bucket is just extra)with net pots
Also a 250w Light that was my bfs (I think it's HID, but I don't know much about lighting) it doesn't have a fan to cool it off.
Our hydro store recommended X nutrients, so we got Micro, grow, bloom, & amino blast.
2 air stones, and some tubing and a air pump.
I have a ph tester but not a ppm tester, I want to buy a stick but I haven't found one in my price range
I'm trying to find a water chiller that I could afford (no luck on Craigslist)

Im in a small condo so space is extremely limited, I have two bathrooms but using my bedroom bathroom to grow in, it doesn't have much ventilation, so I'm using 3 fans, 2 small personal fans, and 1 stand up fan. It is extremely hard to keep it under 80 in the room, so I tend to put a frozen jug in front of one of the fans to keep it cool but its not very efficient. It's also very hard to keep the water cool, I wrapped Mylar around them, and lined the top but it still stays warm.

On Dec 17th, we got 2 clones from a friend, free, so if we messed them up, at least we didn't pay for clones. Well the clones were a bit wrecked looking, weak and sad, so we nursed them back to health and got really strong white roots, and about 2 weeks later I noticed spider mites, these things are my arch nemesis, they always win and I always fail at growing because of them. Well I used a homemade spray with dish soap, and essential oil, but that didn't work, so we also used Dont bug me and we have neem but haven't used it yet. I also bought a hot shot strip.. But the webs were gone and subsiding a bit, but then....

Jan 5th I noticed these lil bugs in the roots of only one plant. My bf asked the hydro store and they said they were aphids and that we should mix 4.5 tsp per 1 3/4 gal of Monterey tree & ornamental spray in the res (the hydro store told him to do this, just keep in there during veg)

So I'm pretty sure we still have both pests and the plants are looking a bit saggy & yellowing, they don't look any better with the Monterey. It's very discouraging that people can successfully grow and not put much effort into it with limited equipment, but then there's me, with anything, I bet I could spend 10,000 on equipment and I'd still have problems with bugs, makes me want to throw in the towel, really sucks,

Ive included some pictures, these were taken on the 4th before I put the spray in the res

Mite control first along with a PPM meter. Check out the HM Aqua Pro series handhelds. Cheap and reliable. In my own experience, using plain tap water with chloramines still in it but pH adjusted prevents such root/res problems as critters and fungus.

Your light is weak. A better choice for early growth/vegging is CFL or even better a T5 fixture. It is far cooler and can be kept right on top of the grow.

ok first of all, if you want alot of nice people to help you make sure you drop the IM a chick bomb but not the boyfriend one

anyways im not much of a hhydro guy but ill put my 2¢ in since i have been reading on these forums for almost 2 years now and have picked up a thing or 2 along the way.

bugs suck end of story, the hot shot strips are bad news they have shitloads of chemicals in them and shouldnt be used inside your bathroom to your bedroom.
not sure what the root bugs are so not much help there.

make sure your keeping your PH 5.8-6.0 im sure you know this already just dropping it in case you dont.

warm rez water is a killer to your plants, instead of a frozen jug in front of the fan freeze a bunch of water bottle ans keep 1-2 in the rezz daily. this will keep temps down.

you may want to do a rez change, when you do add all the stuff you normally do + some hydrogen peroxide (research exact amounts because i dont know) and clean off your roots if they are brownish colored and slimy, you can do this with some bottled RO water and a little peroxide.

i have read up a little on spider mites and heard that a nice organic way to kill them is habenaro peppers boiled in water and then strain the water into a spray jusg and go nuts. BE CAREFULL with this stuff as its not harmfull but packs a good punch and getting it in your eyes, mouth or other places can cause severe dicomfort. this is for spider mites, im not sure how it will work with your roots but if you thouroghly wash the roots and do a rezz change you may be able to rid the root bugs.

also make sure yournot adding the "recomended" amount of nutes to your rezz. them clones are still small and dont need alot of food. go 1/4 strenth for a while untill they start getting bigger then you can gradually work your way up.

also you need to get your temps down a bit, try exausting some of the air out of the room or leaving the door open.

judging by the color of the pics looks like your running a 250w HPS

get your temps in your rez and your room under controll and you should see an improvement. also when taking pics take them when the lights are off and just turn on the reg bathroom light they will come out better for us to be able to see whats going on.

hope this helps
RMTB

i dont have any experience with hydro only what i read and watch on youtube. but hotrodharley is right you should use compact floresances get the day light ones not the warm get a socket with a plug in wire on it then get a bunch of Y splitters and screw into the socket to make a big light fixture. use your hps for flower and use the cfls for veg. i ordered my stuff off amazon but you can easily get at home depo.

yeah wasnt even really thinking of directing her to CFL's for veg.

check home depot for a T5 fixture

if you have the money for this it should work well

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-202985194/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=T5+HO&storeId=10051

Oohnoitsjenn said:

and about 2 weeks later I noticed spider mites, these things are my arch nemesis, they always win and I always fail at growing because of them. Well I used a homemade spray with dish soap, and essential oil, but that didn't work, so we also used Dont bug me and we have neem but haven't used it yet. I also bought a hot shot strip.. But the webs were gone and subsiding a bit, but then....

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This is the main reason why I grow from seed now, I use to grow from clones from fellow caregivers but everyone had mites and I battled them with the same things you have, hot shot pest strips and Neem oil. Bottom line, IMO, it's near impossible to completely get rid of them, depending on the species of mite. You can control the mature adults and swear you don't see any but take a microscope to the plants and you'll see eggs and juveniles. I now keep a clean room and environment and grow by seed and haven't had mites since and if I were to get them, I'd chop the plants sterilize my room and start over from seed.

About your temp. problems... One suggestion is to put your air pump into something that is smaller like a wooden box or something you can pump cold air into from outside or a separate room. The pump will then pump the colder air into the solution in the buckets and therefore cooling it down. The pump does warm the air a little so it does have to be pretty cool. I use this technique: I actually buy a cheap white table cloth and put it over my my 4 bucket RDWC which are in a square configuration. I cut holes about 4"x4" for the plants in the cloth where the middle of each bucket is. I them put the air pumps under the cloth as well in the middle of the 4 bucket conf. and then pump cold air from outside through a duct fan and tubing down under the cloth and towards the pumps. The cloth acts as a shield from my 1000 watt HPS and for the most part holds in the colder air around the buckets and allows the pumps to pump cold air into the buckets. When in bloom, have your light on at night so you can pull the coldest air from outside to cool everything when your rooms going to be the hottest(when your lights on.) Just a thought before you blow money on a water chiller.

I use DWC, My advice is stop opening up the lid, get rid of the cloth that you have underneath the plant - at least a section ( Fill your res through the top, not by lifting the lid) stuff cotton balls in the top of the net pot, to keep flies from laying eggs on the hydroton.

Water bottle works, but opening your lid constantly only works while it is small, and also exposes your water to bugs... All it takes is one tiny fly to infest your room! =/

As someone said before start using tap water, and just PH correct it after you add Nutes. I wouldn't worry too much about the bugs in the res, if you keep it closed they will go through their life cycle and disappear in a few weeks. The mites are obviously another story - I will only say get rid of them!

That light is horrible, as someone mentioned it is too hot, it is also HPS which is fine, but a MH would be better for your weak clones. My suggestion is go get some CFL's. If you can't set up ventilation then you just need to commit yourself to a CFL grow. Veg for 7-10 weeks, and then switch to flower. Those temps are going to cause problems, as I am assuming you also will run into humidity problems. (BUD ROT! =/ )

Next suggestion : Take your extra bucket and drill drain holes in the bottom of it, go to lowes or home depot and pick up a small drain/faucet, if you need help ask the plumbing department guy. Attach the faucet/drain to the bucket at the bottom, now you can effectively drain and flush your plant where as before you couldn't. Move your plant to it, clean and disinfect your old one, then place some stones in the bottom of it about two inches thick or so, place your plant & bucket with the holes in it. Set your two buckets on top of a box or something so that it is elevated (on second thought your in a bathroom so you may not need it) Keep the valve closed obviously, and every week I would open it up and hardcore flush your roots, it will help get rid of those root worms. Close the valve back!!

Fresh water at the right temperature & ph, and good light at the right temperature, your plant can't help but grow green!

Just thought about something I used to do back in the day, I got a big coffee can and emptied it, and about 3ft of copper tubing, wrap the tubing around your fist so that it is coiled, shape it so that both ends are pointed up. In the plastic top of the coffee can cut two small holes, through the holes you will run the tubing from your air pump to one side of the copper tubing, and then tubing to the other side that goes to your air stone. Fill your bucket with ice water, you can either make two of these cans, or just replace the water. It is less expensive to make 1, but easier on you to make 2. And we are talking about $15 for two cans. The air coming out of the pump will be considerably cooler and will help with the res temps.

Oohnoitsjenn, ...don't be down on yourself Jenn or you set yourself up to fail and if you're smart enough to follow a simple recipe you can learn how to grow ganja in your closet, ...having a black thumb just means itll be a little harder for you to learn but if you want it bad enough, nothing can hold you back, ...believe that and you can't fail.

...now, you won't like this but below i've listed a few threads for you to study and what each will offer you is the 'simple' approach, from the style of growing to the feeding and the cloning, each is an essential part of a successful grow and each of these threads gives you a simple, repeatable approach to do each. ...in the beginning, simple is good.

...DWC is a great way to grow and produces great results, plus, it is fairly simple to run, ...but it can be tricky and a real pain when things don't go right so here is a thread with a passive approach to hydroponics called hempy-buckets that is adapted from ancient technology probably dating back to the Romans. ...this particular thread discusses using a perlite/vermiculite mix as the grow medium but i and many others prefer coco as the grow medium, ...but this thread is filled with still useful information.
The Official Hempy Bucket Thread

...this one is too a very simple, 1 part nutrient feeding regimen that is not only brain-dead simple to use, it's dirt cheap to buy.
*The K.I.S.S. Method*

...here is a very simple and reliable cloning technique that is also cheap as hell to run.
World class cloner new at walmart

...this last discusses the benefits of vertical growing and because you have yet to invest any serious money in lights i think you would do well to read this one first.
Benefits of Vertical Growing

...i know this would mean you changing your approach but if you do this now your basic growing tech will become easy and that will allow you to really learn to read and understand your plants and all the little details like dealing with pests, ...no matter what method you grow with, pests will be an occasional pain in the posterior.

peace, bozo

Thanks everyone for taking the time to give me some much needed advice!!

So far I'm already using tap water that's ph'd, also the lights, it will take me a lil while to collect some CFL's & sockets for them, but I see how the room is too hot because of that dang light (just using what I had available)

About the res temps, I found a chiller on Craigslist about 1.5 hours away. He listed it as "usaeuro chiller 1/16 hp lowers a 55 gallon reservoir with no issues $100" is this worth it? He said its in new condition

Im also looking into putting valves on the bucket to help with flushing, it makes it 10x easier to flush because of being in the shower, lol

also about the seeds, it's so much harder to find decent seeds in my area than it is to find clones...and there's not any club near by, so any suggestions with that?

as far as putting "valves" on the buckets. I would think it would be easier if you just got a couple spare buckets. this way tou can sanitize and fill up a new bucket then just swap the lid? if thats not a option and valves are what you go with make sure you sterilize after each change. this is as simple as 1 cap full of bleach in 1 gal of water and just spraying and cleaning the bucket.

you shouldnt need to spen 100 bucks on a chiller if you can put a couple bottles of ice in the rez every day. just get 4 bottles and swap them out each morning, if that dosent seem to work just do it 2x a day. a bottle of water should freeze in 12 hours. just have to do 2 at night at around 10:00 then 2 in morning around 10:00.

growing isnt as easy as alot of people make it look. theres alot to it behind the scenes.

as far as your seed question goes. as long as the clones are reliable then your good but you need to remember. when you purchase seeds from a seed bank like attitude or sea of seeds, you are getting the product your paying for. these guys could be selling you clones of mexican piss weed and you would never know the difference. dial in your grow with the clones...then order your fancy on seeds.

RetiredMatthebrute said:

you shouldnt need to spen 100 bucks on a chiller if you can put a couple bottles of ice in the rez every day. just get 4 bottles and swap them out each morning, if that dosent seem to work just do it 2x a day. a bottle of water should freeze in 12 hours. just have to do 2 at night at around 10:00 then 2 in morning around 10:00.

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I tried doing the frozen bottles but I'm not always home at certain times a day and then there's days where I leave early and return that night or later, so the water wouldn't be a constant steady temp. And my freezer is extremely small, barely enough room for 2 bottles, & my fam loves frozen food lol

make room keeping them temps down is a must even if you buy the chiller you need to do something in the meantime.. a few days can mean the end.

im not opposed to you buying a chiller, if you can than thats the for sure way beter way to go. I was simply siggesting a way for you to do it on the "budget" as you stated earlier that you dint have alot of money to invest.

RetiredMatthebrute said:

make room keeping them temps down is a must even if you buy the chiller you need to do something in the meantime.. a few days can mean the end.

im not opposed to you buying a chiller, if you can than thats the for sure way beter way to go. I was simply siggesting a way for you to do it on the "budget" as you stated earlier that you dint have alot of money to invest.

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I don't, but I haven't seen a chiller going for even slightly that price.

im not very knowledgable about chillers since I just recently learned about them...

do you think that set up & chiller will be adequate? With slight changes including the lights

Well, we were going to flush out the plants but they were so....bad. I just decided we were wasting nutes and time for plants that were so stressed out it probably wouldn't have produced anything. We decided to revise some of our plans for the location, instead of growing on the inside of the shower, the other part of the bathroom is just as big, plus the floor is tile which keeps a lot cooler, same with the room. And instead of that 250w light, I'm going to try his other light, it is 1000w HPS with proper vent, and carbon filter, it's a ton cooler than the light I have now.

I decided to not fork out another $100 for the chiller and hope the new mods will lower the temps in the room & water. Instead of that I'm going to get a proper ppm & ph meter, and clean the hell out of the equipment and bathroom. I want to bleach and fog the room (will one application work or should I do multiple fogs/brands?) I did a bleach bath for all the buckets and other equipment.

Thanks for all your suggestions, I will def use them in the next grow. Any other suggestions will be appreciated.

have you thought about doing something like this ?

Keep your fish fresh by making your own cooler. Take a 5 gallon bucket and wrap foam insulation around the outside and lid. Use glue to adhere the insulation to the bucket. The best buckets to use are ones that are from dry wall containers. They are higher than a regular 5 gallon bucket giving you more volume. The one you see in the picture held about 45 average size ling including the ice. It also makes a great seat or a place to put your bait bucket on so you don't have to bend down to get your bait. Never use a stringer draped over the side of your boat. The temperature of the waters surface is to warm and will spoil your catch. Always put them on ice.

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http://anglerslink.com/tips.html

im sure they sell styrofoam inserts that you can put a 5 gal bucket in.

http://www.amazon.com/Reflectix-ST16025-Staple-Tab-Insulation/dp/B000BQSYRO/ref=sr_1_20?ie=UTF8&qid=1357750194&sr=8-20&keywords=insulation

not really sure what would be a good product but if you can somehow insulate the buckets properly and just use the frozen water bottle method discussed above it would cut down on how many times a day you have to put your bottles in and shouldnt heat up that fast. a 1 gal jug of frozen water will last a couple days i would imagine.

also you mentioned you dont have alot of space in your freezer. well where im from i have natures own freezer right outside my house, i realize not everyone is in a northern climate but if you are you can always just set the jugs outside and let them nightime temps freeze em for you.

...this guy wrapped his buckets in Reflectix to cool them, ...it's been a while since i read this thread but i'd bet you'll enjoy the read if you bother to take the time.

[URL="https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=105869"]12 Bucket DWC - 2000w - Romulan & Bubbakush[/url]

peace, bozo

RetiredMatthebrute said:

also you mentioned you dont have alot of space in your freezer. well where im from i have natures own freezer right outside my house, i realize not everyone is in a northern climate but if you are you can always just set the jugs outside and let them nightime temps freeze em for you.

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Not my case where I live, I live in California, hasn't froze at night yet I don't think where I am, maybe when it drops to freezing temps at night but idk if that's work. Thanks for the suggestion though

RetiredMatthebrute said:

im not opposed to you buying a chiller, if you can than thats the for sure way beter way to go. I was simply siggesting a way for you to do it on the "budget" as you stated earlier that you dint have alot of money to invest.

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How would you go about keeping bottles clean so it doesn't add any extra bacteria in the bucket? Also won't the roots touch the frozen bottles? Since I didn't get the chiller imma have to figure out something else.

justanotherbozo said:

...this guy wrapped his buckets in Reflectix to cool them, ...it's been a while since i read this thread but i'd bet you'll enjoy the read if you bother to take the time.


12 Bucket DWC - 2000w - Romulan & Bubbakush


peace, bozo

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Thanks for the link, good read