Mycorrhiza 101...

jberry

jberry

Well-Known Member
Well I know most people think its just for pests but since Azamax is made from Neem Oil... specifically one, potent, bio-compound found in Neem Oil, I figured it may prevent the myco from flourishing.

Neem Oil is an effective fungicide for the prevention and control of various fungal diseases including powdery mildew, black spot, downy mildew, anthracnose, rust, leaf spot, botrytis, needle rust, scab and flower, twig, tip blight, and alternaria.
 
Shrubs First

Shrubs First

Well-Known Member
jberry said:
Neem Oil is an effective fungicide for the prevention and control of various fungal diseases including powdery mildew, black spot, downy mildew, anthracnose, rust, leaf spot, botrytis, needle rust, scab and flower, twig, tip blight, and alternaria.
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I don't see mycorrhizae in there ;).....I use azamax as a feedant religiously...



Any more questions? Or do you have some experience that says otherwise? Because GH
will tell you their product is 100% OMRI certified and good to use with microbiologicals.
 
jberry

jberry

Well-Known Member
yea, a couple more...
why do you do that?
are you saying its the azamax that is making the roots pop threw the smart pot?
 
Shrubs First

Shrubs First

Well-Known Member
jberry said:
yea, a couple more...
why do you do that?
are you saying its the azamax that is making the roots pop threw the smart pot?
Click to expand...
Not at all, it is the mycorrhizae and the Rhizotonic which is making my roots do
this. This is showing that the Azamax if anything is not hurting the root and Myco
development. I use Azamax as a preventative against pests. Haven't had any in
years because of it.
 
jberry

jberry

Well-Known Member
right on... well you may be right about it not hurting/preventing mycorrhiza and beneficial bacteria because neem oil is pretty amazing stuff... example: it kills harmful pests but doesnt harm the beneficial pests! -maybe just maybe the same goes for harmful vs. beneficial fungi/bacteria? But honestly, regardless of how healthy your plant looks, it would be very hard for you to determine if the azamax was effecting your mycos in some ill way... on the other hand it is totally possible that the azamax does not hurt them at all as you are saying.

But I know that Neem Oil is Antifungal and Antibacterial (able to destroys or inhibit the growth of bacteria) so I think its worth taking that into consideration.
 
wyteboi

wyteboi

Well-Known Member
Shrubs First said:
Not at all, it is the mycorrhizae and the Rhizotonic which is making my roots do
this. This is showing that the Azamax if anything is not hurting the root and Myco
development. I use Azamax as a preventative against pests. Haven't had any in
years because of it.
Click to expand...
How would you possibly know this? How do you know you even have myco in there , thats alive? That close up is a lil too close to say its working.
Are you positive that the roots would not be bigger without the neem?
fungus is fungus. Myco is not special.
 
CrackerJax

CrackerJax

New Member
This thread has some good info on mycco fungi's.

There is just one very simple piece of information missing. Mycco fungi is not a rare thing. The companies make you think you need to purchase it.... you don't. If you have a healthy soil set up and a healthy plant..... they will come ... in droves. Even sterile soil will fill up with mycco fungi.

So yes, all the technical benefits to mycco is true enough..... the "fudge" is that you need to purchase some....you don't. You will get all you need absolutely free of charge. It's what they do.....24/7.
 
wyteboi

wyteboi

Well-Known Member
CrackerJax said:
This thread has some good info on mycco fungi's.

There is just one very simple piece of information missing. Mycco fungi is not a rare thing. The companies make you think you need to purchase it.... you don't. If you have a healthy soil set up and a healthy plant..... they will come ... in droves. Even sterile soil will fill up with mycco fungi.

So yes, all the technical benefits to mycco is true enough..... the "fudge" is that you need to purchase some....you don't. You will get all you need absolutely free of charge. It's what they do.....24/7.
Click to expand...
well i guess we agree on ONE thing :mrgreen:
 
i81two

i81two

Well-Known Member
CrackerJax said:
This thread has some good info on mycco fungi's.

There is just one very simple piece of information missing. Mycco fungi is not a rare thing. The companies make you think you need to purchase it.... you don't. If you have a healthy soil set up and a healthy plant..... they will come ... in droves. Even sterile soil will fill up with mycco fungi.

So yes, all the technical benefits to mycco is true enough..... the "fudge" is that you need to purchase some....you don't. You will get all you need absolutely free of charge. It's what they do.....24/7.
Click to expand...

Does the same apply to hydro ?
 
jberry

jberry

Well-Known Member
I know what your saying but world record setting giant vegetable growers would disagree, they claim that raising their spore count is the reason they are able to push the limits... Have you done any controlled tests? I have and the difference between treated and untreated is really obvious... but im in coco not soil.
 
jberry

jberry

Well-Known Member

Sustaining ‘Biomass’ (Bacteria numbers)​
The food source for friendly bacteria is sugars and carbons. Create an environment that is rich in these components and you will create a dynamic environment for friendly bacteria.​

Fulvic Acid​
Where friendly bacteria are concerned humates (e.g. humic acid and fulvic acid) are an extremely effective food source. Humates are carbons – elements of ancient compost that formed over millions of years through the interaction of organic material and microbial action – and, therefore, their presence (along with other factors) in the growing system will ensure a rich environment in which friendly bacteria numbers will explode.​
Fulvic acid is the most important humate bio-extract where hydroponics is concerned. It is water soluble and readily available for plant uptake.​
Other than creating a dynamic environment for friendly bacteria, fulvic acid aids greatly in nutrient uptake and translocation within the plant. For this reason it should always be used in conjunction with a balanced nutritional program.​

Fulvic Acid Benefits: ​

  • Enhances cell growth
  • Increases nutrient uptake
  • Increases nutrient transportation
  • Increases silica absorption
  • Stimulates plant immune system
  • Creates a dynamic environment for friendly bacteria
Humic Acid​
Humic acid is less suitable for hydroponic systems. However, humic acid is suitable for soil growing and its use in soils will prove beneficial for rhizosphere microbial interaction and nutrient uptake.
​

Sugars​
Other than humates (i.e. carbons) sugars are also the food source for friendly bacteria. Because of this, products containing molasses (e.g. some organic stimulants) and other sugars can be beneficial in the growing system.​

Cautions when using Friendly Bacteria ​
If you are adding friendlies to chlorinated water supplies (i.e. mains water), there is every chance (depending on the level of chlorine) that the chlorine is killing a good many of the beneficial microorganisms. Ideally you will have a secondary holding tank where you can leave your tap water exposed to air for 24 hours prior to it going into your system. This will ensure the water is chlorine free (the chlorine dissipates) by the time you introduce the friendlies.​
On this note, sterilising agents (e.g. monochloramine or hydrogen peroxide) should never be used in conjunction with friendly bacteria.​
 
Shrubs First

Shrubs First

Well-Known Member
wyteboi said:
How would you possibly know this? How do you know you even have myco in there , thats alive? That close up is a lil too close to say its working.
Are you positive that the roots would not be bigger without the neem?
fungus is fungus. Myco is not special.
Click to expand...
Look at the size of my plants in comparison to root growth, my clones were busting
through the 3 gallon smart pots after a week and a half of veg. This is the first time
that has happened for me, this is the first grow I'm using Great White P.M., and
Rhizotonic. I've always used Azamax. I've always had healthy roots, but this is new
for me... So this is special.
 
CrackerJax

CrackerJax

New Member
This is a fencepost issue.

Does the fungi occur naturally? You bet....just try and keep your soil fungi free....impossible to do.

So let's say you do introduce ur own fungi..... but maybe the native fungi would have done a better job?! They can't however, because they have been beaten to the punch.... and it cost you $$$ to do it.

If you build a good soil substrate from the start (compost especially).... you don't need to add much of anything else.
 
Shrubs First

Shrubs First

Well-Known Member
CrackerJax said:
This is a fencepost issue.

Does the fungi occur naturally? You bet....just try and keep your soil fungi free....impossible to do.

So let's say you do introduce ur own fungi..... but maybe the native fungi would have done a better job?! They can't however, because they have been beaten to the punch.... and it cost you $$$ to do it.

If you build a good soil substrate from the start (compost especially).... you don't need to add much of anything else.
Click to expand...
H202 can keep it sterile. Anyways, obviously what you're saying is true, but you
are just preaching to the choir, no duh if you make a composted dream soil you
don't neeed to add anything, including nutrients, but if you start in sayyyy, Fox
Farm, or coco, you have to supplement.
 
CrackerJax

CrackerJax

New Member
I hardly think I'm preaching to the choir.... :lol: If only that were true.

One of the most common maladies I see here is NUTE BURN. Over and over again. In the misplaced thought of pushing the plant as hard as it can stand to improve yields (perceived), ppl turn their substrates into nutrient junkyards. Then they scream online when it starts to implode....

Growing is like building a house. It's all in the foundation. It's all about patience.
 
jberry

jberry

Well-Known Member
I agree that soil growers are going to have a decent amount of fungi on their own, (especially if using a good compost, no argument there) but what is nice about inoculating is that you can isolate certain species of mycorrizae that have been shown to be most beneficial, that way you know your medium contains the exact species you are looking for in high amounts... Another benefit is that you can apply the fungi directly to the root structure in high amounts which speeds up the initial infestation process...The length of time it takes for the infestation to take place seems to be a topic of concern for a short annual crop like mj... Waiting for the colonies to build up and then infest the roots may indeed take a little time if you just are using a bag of sterilized potting soil (or at least it would seem)

Adding the myco can be very cheap... if you apply it directly to the roots during transplants it doesnt use much material... and I get mine for around $8.00 a pound.

please dont take this as confrontational, im not looking to make more enemies lol :dunce: and your points are valid, I'm just sharing my 2 cents, and beneficial bacteria can be a great addition for people like me who are growing in coco, ... thats why i like coco because you get some of the benefits of both hydro and soil.

CrackerJax said:
This is a fencepost issue.

Does the fungi occur naturally? You bet....just try and keep your soil fungi free....impossible to do.

So let's say you do introduce ur own fungi..... but maybe the native fungi would have done a better job?! They can't however, because they have been beaten to the punch.... and it cost you $$$ to do it.

If you build a good soil substrate from the start (compost especially).... you don't need to add much of anything else.
Click to expand...
 
Shrubs First

Shrubs First

Well-Known Member
They flower in 8 weeks, it's a short season plant, you don't need
to draw it all out, I use inert coco and do just fine with that as my
foundation.
 
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