Maybe Now People Will Take Their Votes More Seriously

Miss ...

I can't say it better than TBT did above, other than to say ... stop voting for socialistic representatives. Also, I've paid into Social Security since I was 14 years old, and into Medicare since its inception. I agree that its a Ponzi scheme that never should have been started in the first place ... but shouldn't I be allowed to recoup my money "invested?" As far as your "adult" children are concerned, did you check into the high deductable insurance policies as suggested? I provided some links for you.

Vi

No you are recouping my money. Medicare tax is only 10 years old, that means you get 3 office calls and your money is gone. I on the other hand get to pay it along with social security for the rest of my life knowing full and well that I won't get a dime back.

How come when you are receiving services it's just "recouping your money" but if others receive those same services they are socialists and communists?

Sorry my kids don't get paid enough to make ends meet and afford health care. They are part of the generation that won't ever get paid shit because fat cats need to preserve their million dollar salaries. Maybe if they weren't paying social security and medicare tax then they could afford it.

misshestermoffitt said:

No you are recouping my money. Medicare tax is only 10 years old, that means you get 3 office calls and your money is gone. I on the other hand get to pay it along with social security for the rest of my life knowing full and well that I won't get a dime back.

How come when you are receiving services it's just "recouping your money" but if others receive those same services they are socialists and communists?

Sorry my kids don't get paid enough to make ends meet and afford health care. They are part of the generation that won't ever get paid shit because fat cats need to preserve their million dollar salaries. Maybe if they weren't paying social security and medicare tax then they could afford it.

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Actually, I really doubt that you can blame the "fat cats" I believe that the problem lies with in the government.

Average Federal Employee makes over $100,000 including benefits
Average State Employee makes ~$59,000 including benefits

Average Private Sector Employee makes ~$52,000 including benefits.

Perhaps the problem is that are so called public servants have became our masters, and instead of them serving us, we are stuck serving them.

Government should fear the people, not people fearing the government. Maybe if they were in fear for their jobs they might do the right thing where citizens are concerned, but since the corporations are allowed to purchase votes in their own favor, nothing will ever change.

misshestermoffitt said:

Government should fear the people, not people fearing the government. Maybe if they were in fear for their jobs they might do the right thing where citizens are concerned, but since the corporations are allowed to purchase votes in their own favor, nothing will ever change.

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Lol, and you don't think all these PACs do the same thing?
MoveOn.Org
The Teacher's PAC
The Unions' PACs
The Unions themselves?

The list of lobbyists goes well beyond just the "corporation".

But don't let that discourage you from believing that some how it is all the fault of the corporations. You know, they actually provide jobs, and produce goods and services, and are provably motivated by something (profit) other than screwing with laws.

And besides, if corporations are buying the votes, perhaps the problem isn't the fact that they are buying the votes, but that our congressmen are selling their votes?

Of course, there are plenty of votes sold to useless corrupt organizations like Acorn, the Teachers' Union, and the Trade Unions.

Actually, I suppose I should also list some non-liberalist organizations just to strike a balance.

There's also the NRA - Not a Corporation
and the Americans for Fair Taxation - Not a Corporation

There's also the various Environmentalist Groups - Not Corporations (though many corporations have seats on the boards)

Hmm, I think the root of all evil is congress, they are the ones that are selling their votes. If Corporations and other organizations buy those votes, are you faulting them?

Isn't that like the government going after people who buy pot, when it wants to wage its "war on drugs" instead of going after the people who sell pot?

Maybe I'm missing the logic of your argument...

Votes should not be for sale, that is the logic. Congress needs to be more closely monitored. They should not be allowed to vote against the peoples wishes in order to make a quick buck. Lobbists should not be allowed to throw big parties and hand out gifts and money. There should be NO exchange of anything other than ideas in Washington. When cash starts to change hands it's where the corruption begins.

2 months ago an electorial college delegate actually said on the news that his vote would go to the candidate that paid him the most for the vote. He stood right there on the news and said "my vote is for sale" now that's not how the electorial college was designed to work. The votes are to be cast based on how the people vote, not based on the biggest bribe. Shouldn't that guy be stripped of his electorial college status? Yes he should, but he wasn't. He's still selling his vote and we're all still the victims of corruption.

misshestermoffitt said:

Votes should not be for sale, that is the logic. Congress needs to be more closely monitored. They should not be allowed to vote against the peoples wishes in order to make a quick buck. Lobbists should not be allowed to throw big parties and hand out gifts and money. There should be NO exchange of anything other than ideas in Washington. When cash starts to change hands it's where the corruption begins.

2 months ago an electorial college delegate actually said on the news that his vote would go to the candidate that paid him the most for the vote. He stood right there on the news and said "my vote is for sale" now that's not how the electorial college was designed to work. The votes are to be cast based on how the people vote, not based on the biggest bribe. Shouldn't that guy be stripped of his electorial college status? Yes he should, but he wasn't. He's still selling his vote and we're all still the victims of corruption.

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Electoral College isn't supposed to be a winner-take-all system either.

Though as far is the electoral college. One could debate that as originally intended the electoral college (which was supposed to be formed of individuals that would make an informed choice on who to cast their electoral vote for) was meant to be representative of the wishes of the constituents. So, yes, the sale of the vote is corrupt, but no more corrupt than the current winner take all system.

TheBrutalTruth said:

Actually, I really doubt that you can blame the "fat cats" I believe that the problem lies with in the government.

Average Federal Employee makes over $100,000 including benefits
Average State Employee makes ~$59,000 including benefits

Average Private Sector Employee makes ~$52,000 including benefits.

Perhaps the problem is that are so called public servants have became our masters, and instead of them serving us, we are stuck serving them.

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The US Govt, worlds largest employer. Still is isn't it?

http://ftp2.census.gov/govs/apes/06fedfun.pdf

Spitzered said:

The US Govt, worlds largest employer. Still is isn't it?

http://ftp2.census.gov/govs/apes/06fedfun.pdf

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Don't forget all the state governments, and local governments, and county governments, and school boards, and ... actually I think that's it, 6 levels of government.

School Boards -> Municipal -> County -> State -> Federal, my bad, just 5, still why do we need 5 levels of government?

Wouldn't Municipal, State and Federal be enough?

Especially if there was no overlap (Federal was a lot smaller)

Why do we need the
FBI?
DEA?
ATF?
CIA?
DIA?
NSA?
INS?

Aren't all these supposedly doing more less the same?
Okay, so maybe, we might need the FBI and CIA, but the other chunks of acronym soup... not so much.

Department of Education...

That's not a responsibility of the Federal Government, and if NCLB is any standard which to judge Federal attempts to legislate Education then it was a damn good decision for the founders not to give it to the Federal Government.

Department of Health and Human Services...

Another useless Department that would be better off managed at the State Level, or Local Level (which for the most part it is)

Some one else have more useless/stupid departments that would be better off out of the hands of the Fed, and left up to the states, or departments that are duplicates?

Feeding the US govt money is like feeding stray cats. Can't get enough. Or any govt actually. Always come up with a reason to need more.

misshestermoffitt said:

Votes should not be for sale, that is the logic. Congress needs to be more closely monitored. They should not be allowed to vote against the peoples wishes in order to make a quick buck. Lobbists should not be allowed to throw big parties and hand out gifts and money. There should be NO exchange of anything other than ideas in Washington. When cash starts to change hands it's where the corruption begins.

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So ... tell me that you're not voting for O'Bama. Isn't he attempting to buy votes with the promise of a check to every citizen that makes under $250,000 a year?

And again, if you don't agree with Social Security and Medicare, then don't vote for socialist dreamers. Vote for true conservatives who want to privatize Social Security and end government's control over the medical system.

Vi

I don't think he's promising a check. You'll just have a bigger check, because less taxes will be taken out of it. He's just letting those big rich-folks tax cuts that Bush passed expire for the rich folks, then redirecting that money back onto the middle class. Basically, we'll be going back to the Clinton era tax rates (which were lower than under Reagan, incidentally), except that it's weighted a bit more to benefit the common man than it was under Clinton.

I've got some fairly wealthy friends. They didn't have any probs during the Clinton years, so I don't think they'll be suffering unduly if they go back to that tax rate. I'll ask 'em in a few years and see. I suspect the answer will be something like, "Well, I had to wait an extra year to replace my 30' boat with a new one, but otherwise, no biggie."

So you're saying that Obama is personally going to send a check to everyone who votes for him? That is what buying votes is. I don't see a check with my name on it, I think you're using that selective reading comprehension again.

ViRedd said:

So ... tell me that you're not voting for O'Bama. Isn't he attempting to buy votes with the promise of a check to every citizen that makes under $250,000 a year?

And again, if you don't agree with Social Security and Medicare, then don't vote for socialist dreamers. Vote for true conservatives who want to privatize Social Security and end government's control over the medical system.

Vi

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misshestermoffitt said:

So you're saying that Obama is personally going to send a check to everyone who votes for him? That is what buying votes is. I don't see a check with my name on it, I think you're using that selective reading comprehension again.

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Actually, I think it has nothing to do with reading comprehension by hearing comprehension, and frankly I heard something similar.

What I heard was that he was going to destroy the American Dream by taxing those making more than $250,000 even more, and give more money way to those making less then $250,000.

Of course what I heard from McCain was, "If you are single with no dependents, Fuck You!"

There's a lot of other groups McCain verbally gave the finger to, too.

I feel that people who are making a quarter of a million dollars a year can afford to pay more taxes than someone who makes 50 thousand a year.

misshestermoffitt said:

I feel that people who are making a quarter of a million dollars a year can afford to pay more taxes than someone who makes 50 thousand a year.

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I think the monetary amount is irrelevant.

For me the issue is, is it okay for theft to take place and the only way to answer that is no.

Especially considering that I still have yet to see a really transparent budget that describe government expenditures in minute detail. I want to know everything that they are spending the money on.

I don't even see why it would be that hard, well except the classified stuff, but how much of the budget can that really account for?

I don't know why there isn't a budget website. Taxpayers could go in and review it, if there are questionable items they can be flagged. After a certain number of flags on the same item that purchase goes up for review. If it is found to not be a righteous purchase, the money spent can come back out of the paycheck of the purchaser and go back into the budget.

Last spring a report came out that found tax dollars being spend on internet dating websites, lacy panties and whole lot of things that I dare say are not related to anyones government jobs. The spending is way, way, way out of control and it's time for the taxpayers to tighten the purse strings.

misshestermoffitt said:

I don't know why there isn't a budget website. Taxpayers could go in and review it, if there are questionable items they can be flagged. After a certain number of flags on the same item that purchase goes up for review. If it is found to not be a righteous purchase, the money spent can come back out of the paycheck of the purchaser and go back into the budget.

Last spring a report came out that found tax dollars being spend on internet dating websites, lacy panties and whole lot of things that I dare say are not related to anyones government jobs. The spending is way, way, way out of control and it's time for the taxpayers to tighten the purse strings.

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Got a link?

I saw it on CNN headline news. I don't have time to surf around the net looking for the latest way big gov. is screwing us over. I turn the news on and listen instead.

I figure I should come out and say it, to remove any doubt about my attitude towards my vote.

I must admit that I'm not going to take my vote seriously, and have never had any intention of taking my vote seriously. I don't plan on taking my vote seriously this election, because there is no point in doing so.

Voting for either mainstream candidate is just plain crazy. So I can either cast an insane vote, or I can cast an off the wall vote. In the end it comes down to being unable to take my vote seriously.