IF you are new to LED and want help choosing what to buy, POST HERE!

Status
Not open for further replies.
A

az2000

Well-Known Member
draz said:
The guy selling the Hans lights is getting 100g from an 80W panel. I'm looking for 2x that as I can get 2-2.5x that with my HPS.
Click to expand...
You're running 70w/sq ft. I suspect the Hans performance you mentioned is 30-35w/sq ft.

You mentioned important factors are vertical space and heat reduction. Now you want 2.5g/w? Something's going to have to give here. :)
 
OscarTheeGrouch

OscarTheeGrouch

Member
FranJan said:
Hans Mother Panel, A51 W100 come to mind. Advanced makes an interesting Veg panel. My personal favorite for a veg light is the Illumitex F1 based panels that you can get on Amazon right now on the cheap. And DIY is where the lowest watts and lowest heat in grow lights is found, but as long as you have some good circulation going on, (and a good strong place to hang it from), an AT600 is a proven winner.


You won't find a lot of love for the MarsII line around here and while not as bad as some other budget based panels from China, the panels that come out of that part of the world aren't a good representation of LED growing. Not very efficient, lots of heat, lots of wasted electricity. These are the basically the types of panels that give LED growing a bad rep. If you just jump in and grab any panel that seems right you may be surprised how dissapointed you are with your finished product. Hang around and take a look about the forum for a while before trying LEDs. And remember, the quality stuff uses less electricity to produce light than the cheap Chinese stuff does so in the long run they pay for themselves and this is in addition to their longevity and the superior quality of product they produce. The budget stuff just isn't worth it when growing MMJ. Hang around and you'll see.


Good Luck Everyone!
Click to expand...
Hello,
I appreciate your reply. I will never consider any lights made outside of the states. I previously considered Illumitex DIY. F6s for veg, F3s for flowering, and F7s for seedlings and clones. However, I am not a DIY kind of guy and after viewing GreenGenes videos with the Apaches and reading his thoughts on Illumitex I am now considering the Apache AT600 for flowering. Considering ApacheTech's extremely high prices, I am looking into other companies including Kind LED, CLW, Area 51, and Advanced LEDs. My top choices are Apache AT600 for flowering and AT120 or Advanced LED for vegetative. Icemud from 420, grasscity and ICMAG has displayed good results from Advanced LED. I'm curious about the Advanced EX VEG but I feel that its unnatural and too blue. Some advise blue for veg while others advise full spectrum. All the conflicting opinions and contradictions are really confusing and causing me to doubt everything.
 
leisuree

leisuree

Member
after a lot of debate i decided to get the onyx 8 + 20 version because it'll be easier than DIY and its pretty close to the spectrum i want. it has 8 of the 6500k and 20 of the 2700k. should be enough blue for veg i think. for $400 i couldve DIY a more powerful light or couldve went down the cob road for a lot cheaper but i think the 10w LEDs are going to be better for my small space.
 
leisuree

leisuree

Member
curious to see what you guys think about this information i found while browsing the web for COB results

I have a few things to add about Chip On Board (COB) LEDs. COB was never meant for grow light applications. It was originally designed to meet the needs of high-output pinpoint source lighting for street and area lighting, car headlights, etc. As such, they don't really work well in grow applications, where the idea is to cover a greater area, yet in close proximity to, our plant bed. Additionally, because of the greater heat you mentioned in your post, it is necessary to reduce current to the COB package to maintain lifespan of the device. As you rightly mention on your web site, LED output is not linear, in terms of current:lumens, and this reduction of current to reduce heat takes its toll on true light output. I pulled some of the efficacy (lumens per Watt) figures from a COB LED (30W) manufacturer. While the claim at full power is about to 92lm/W for "cool" white devices, this is in a lab and it is highly unlikely this can be achieved in the field. Even at half power, the relative luminous flux is derated to about 45% of the initial lumens. Thermal derating at 90degC (max junction temp for these COBs is 120degC) will shave 20% from the output. You wind up with about 30-35% of the original relative luminous flux OTF (Out The Front) of the luminaire (light fixture). This gives you about 1080 lumens out at 15W, or 72lm/W. I've built and tested a lot of luminaires over the past decade and this is a generous number.
Click to expand...
post is rather old and seems like many people are proving him wrong. is it because the newer cobs have much more power than older versions?

source:http://www.marijuanagrowing.com/archive/index.php/t-3429.html
 
FranJan

FranJan

Well-Known Member
Oscar it's always nice to go with Apache, especially in the flowering department. But yes they are a commitment $$$. Lots of panels work well with veg so don't stress too hard. See who's plants you like and go with what they are using otherwise there are books available on BitTorrent that will help you understand LEDs and help you make up your own mind. Knowledge is your only friend and defense in this world of LED salesmen who will say and do anything for your $$$.

I still think this is a best bet for vegging for the price.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DH2C9S4?ie=UTF8&at=&force-full-site=1&ref_=aw_bottom_links

Worst things I can say about it is the beams aren't adjustable so it can waste a bit of light in some grow tents/rooms, the driver is running at it's limit so it get's hotter than the light but it is on a long wire so it can be removed from the immediate growing area and if you do a lot of training it will stretch the nodes out a bit so you would need to add a blue heavy light in addition to it to cut auxin production that the 660nm heavy light will promote in that situation, along with the little bit of 730nm that it puts out. But for 250 and shipping if it fits your situation, put it on your short list. And what's up with that review on Amazon :roll:.
 
FranJan

FranJan

Well-Known Member
FranJan

FranJan

Well-Known Member
^^^Uh-oh, that one again! LOL Sorry Jimmy ain't touching it. Apples and Oranges and I've never used either so I can only go by what I've seen like a lot of folks. I do have a slight bias towards A51's RW spectrum and smaller panels but you're talking about 2 company's whose tech deliver lots of energy and seem to me to flower like beasts. You can go back and forth all day on those two.
 
JimmyIndica

JimmyIndica

Well-Known Member
I am gonna run 2 RW150 other side of the KIND and see whats up! Its either the AT200 or 2 RW150? I don't know till the day comes 7-10 days or so!
 
FranJan

FranJan

Well-Known Member
Oscar look for Captainmorgan's thread A51 vs Onyx. Good info there on Onyx. If cooling is priority one the Onyx might not be the best choice but they do work quite well from what I've seen. I'm waiting for RapidLED to upgrade the Onyx and really start to do some damage to the LED horti world.
 
growindo420

growindo420

New Member
I have seen so many new LED grow lights out there but only a few have caught my eye. I'm looking at Solar Storm, Black Dog LED and MKB Energy's HiOptiX LED.

all of these fixtures are so different and I guess I'm not sure what to look for in an LED grow light...
 
A

az2000

Well-Known Member
growindo420 said:
I'm looking at Solar Storm, Black Dog LED and MKB Energy's HiOptiX LED.

all of these fixtures are so different and I guess I'm not sure what to look for in an LED grow light.
Click to expand...
There's a lot of predation in the LED market. The lights you referenced don't mention which diodes they use. That's a warning sign. It surely means they're using epistar/epiled like inexpensive Chinese imports. I.e., as much as they hype their lights to justify the non-Chinese prices you can bet they'd mention the diode brand if that was something to brag about.

Therefore, you can do better for the money. What is the size of your grow space, including vertical height? Do you have any priorities such as reduced energy costs or heat issues?
 
growindo420

growindo420

New Member
Well I have 20 light going and heat is a big issue. I called the rep for the hioptix and they are using Philips High Intensity full spectrum lumiluds. All the components are American company's.
 
ellydee

ellydee

Well-Known Member
growindo420 said:
Well I have 20 light going and heat is a big issue. I called the rep for the hioptix and they are using Philips High Intensity full spectrum lumiluds. All the components are American company's.
Click to expand...
Yawn...Old school.
Check out the "DIY" COB light threads. (Cree CXAs and Bridgelux Vero series)
 
A

az2000

Well-Known Member
growindo420 said:
Well I have 20 light going and heat is a big issue. I called the rep for the hioptix and they are using Philips High Intensity full spectrum lumiluds. All the components are American company's.
Click to expand...
Someone else can speak to whether those are good or worth the money.

I'd just be concerned when companies (like HydroGrowLED, Lush, Kind, GrowBlu, California Lightworks, Blackdog) don't mention what diodes they use. They charge prices like companies that use high-efficiency chips, but are silent. That can't mean anything good for you as a consumer. They tend to play up grow journals, pictures of awesome plants, etc. But, TopLED/MarsHydro (cheap Chinese import) does that too.

So, be careful, it's easy to be gouged. The common recommendation here is Area 51, ApacheTech, Rapid/Onyx, Hans/Bonsai.
 
Greengenes707

Greengenes707

Well-Known Member
JimmyIndica said:
I am gonna run 2 RW150 other side of the KIND and see whats up! Its either the AT200 or 2 RW150? I don't know till the day comes 7-10 days or so!
Click to expand...
WIth apache it's at600 or nothing imo. 1 for 1 with a 1K hps. It's the top of the food chain in production panels right now imo still. Use the code ATLGR27 for a discount.
But if just needing 1 little light then go a51.

growindo420 said:
I have seen so many new LED grow lights out there but only a few have caught my eye. I'm looking at Solar Storm, Black Dog LED and MKB Energy's HiOptiX LED.

all of these fixtures are so different and I guess I'm not sure what to look for in an LED grow light...


http://www.mkbenergy.com/#!horticulture-and-growing-/cu7t
Click to expand...
az2000 said:
There's a lot of predation in the LED market. The lights you referenced don't mention which diodes they use. That's a warning sign. It surely means they're using epistar/epiled like inexpensive Chinese imports. I.e., as much as they hype their lights to justify the non-Chinese prices you can bet they'd mention the diode brand if that was something to brag about.

Therefore, you can do better for the money. What is the size of your grow space, including vertical height? Do you have any priorities such as reduced energy costs or heat issues?
Click to expand...
I know the guys at Hioptix. They are nice and have a great product for the most part. I definitely have some constructive criticism on the design...but the components in it are all quality.

They know near nothing about growing plants. I had my PAR meter at the max yield show and blew their mind. They had good numbers in a general speaking...but was just some quick readings at some guestimated distances. The spread is my biggest question other than the vertical height needed for just the fixture alone...then clearance form a spot source like it it. Greenhouses for sure could get great use from it...passively cooled with those big ass radiators too. But controlled indoor environments are going to be a tough sell with the design.
They were a high bay design/light...that happens to work and they are transitioning. Similar to lighting sciences story...which is successful...and crazy enough so is hps.
Anyways... they are worth a look if they fit someones space/style. I could probably get more info from them if we need it.

EDIT:
They put this up recently...
 
Last edited:
nogod_

nogod_

Well-Known Member
This is hogwash.

Poke around this forum and take a peek at the numbers.. If the spectrum is favorable and the chip is efficient its a grow light.

leisuree said:
curious to see what you guys think about this information i found while browsing the web for COB results


post is rather old and seems like many people are proving him wrong. is it because the newer cobs have much more power than older versions?

source:http://www.marijuanagrowing.com/archive/index.php/t-3429.html
Click to expand...
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top