how SHOULD the law be amended?

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bob harris

Well-Known Member
The Michigan law certainly needs clarification. The question is: Whats fair and responsible?

1) Getting your certification
Currently anyone can get certified. Just go to your local profiteering Dr. hand over your cash and tell him about the severe and chronic pain you have in your knee from falling off your bike as a toddler...of course you've got no medical records..but that's ok..The certification process needs to be legitimized. Real conditions need to be established....you can't go to a real Dr, give him the same story and get Oxycontin..

2) Growers
The person growing for themselves should be left alone, for the most part. Care givers on the other hand should be monitored. I'm not talking about distribution here, rather quality control.
Testing of the cannabis should be required. Not only thc/cbd/cbn levels, but mold, parasites, pesticides should all be checked for prior to distribution. It's medicine, not moonshine. If people growing for their own use want to supply their overages to other..same thing applies, it should be tested.

3) Distribution
Care givers need to be held responsible for "overages".. The vast majority of people seeking care giver status simply want to profit on the overages created. Come on now..if youv'e got 5 people on your card, and have 60 plants going...tell me with a straight face you don't have significant overages. No way possible that 5 people can use the product of that many plants.
I'm not saying that a profit shouldn't be made for the effort...I'm simply saying that records need to be kept..taxes need to be paid..it should be treated like any other business.

The 12 plant limit was established with the patient that grows their own in mind. It allows for less than ideal growing conditions of a small grow room..plants in different stages of life for a continual supply, and loss due to disease, pests and other maladies that can affect a crop.

When someone steps to the plate and invests the money to grow 60 plants..a lot of those variables are reduced or eliminated. All of a sudden proper lighting, atmospheric controls, nutrient schedule are all improved (hopefully) and the crops and yields are larger.

4) distribution..part 2
Dispensaries, commissaries, 'cafe's"...all need to be addressed. I'm not opposed to some form of dispensary distribution. For those that can't grow their own, there shold be a "pharmacy" resource.

But could we have a little professionalism please? Cafe's are ridiculous. That's just wanting to open a "bar' for cannabis....Dispensaries should be held to a professional standard. Certified testing of the product sold..low key, professional environment, maybe even someone behind the counter that understands THC/CBD/CBN values, and how they affect the type of treatment you can expect from a given strain. A heavy indica for pain relief is a whole lot different than sativa you would want for movement disorders.


Just my thoughts...
 
ThatGuy113

ThatGuy113

Well-Known Member
bob harris said:
The Michigan law certainly needs clarification. The question is: Whats fair and responsible?

1) Getting your certification
Currently anyone can get certified. Just go to your local profiteering Dr. hand over your cash and tell him about the severe and chronic pain you have in your knee from falling off your bike as a toddler...of course you've got no medical records..but that's ok..The certification process needs to be legitimized. Real conditions need to be established....you can't go to a real Dr, give him the same story and get Oxycontin..

2) Growers
The person growing for themselves should be left alone, for the most part. Care givers on the other hand should be monitored. I'm not talking about distribution here, rather quality control.
Testing of the cannabis should be required. Not only thc/cbd/cbn levels, but mold, parasites, pesticides should all be checked for prior to distribution. It's medicine, not moonshine. If people growing for their own use want to supply their overages to other..same thing applies, it should be tested.

3) Distribution
Care givers need to be held responsible for "overages".. The vast majority of people seeking care giver status simply want to profit on the overages created. Come on now..if youv'e got 5 people on your card, and have 60 plants going...tell me with a straight face you don't have significant overages. No way possible that 5 people can use the product of that many plants.
I'm not saying that a profit shouldn't be made for the effort...I'm simply saying that records need to be kept..taxes need to be paid..it should be treated like any other business.

The 12 plant limit was established with the patient that grows their own in mind. It allows for less than ideal growing conditions of a small grow room..plants in different stages of life for a continual supply, and loss due to disease, pests and other maladies that can affect a crop.

When someone steps to the plate and invests the money to grow 60 plants..a lot of those variables are reduced or eliminated. All of a sudden proper lighting, atmospheric controls, nutrient schedule are all improved (hopefully) and the crops and yields are larger.

4) distribution..part 2
Dispensaries, commissaries, 'cafe's"...all need to be addressed. I'm not opposed to some form of dispensary distribution. For those that can't grow their own, there shold be a "pharmacy" resource.

But could we have a little professionalism please? Cafe's are ridiculous. That's just wanting to open a "bar' for cannabis....Dispensaries should be held to a professional standard. Certified testing of the product sold..low key, professional environment, maybe even someone behind the counter that understands THC/CBD/CBN values, and how they affect the type of treatment you can expect from a given strain. A heavy indica for pain relief is a whole lot different than sativa you would want for movement disorders.


Just my thoughts...
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I agree completely.

I think some of those profiteering type doctors are needed though. What if a persons doctor does not believe in MMJ let alone the fear and anxiety of a patient who is so afraid to ask and suffers in return. There'd need to be more legitimate steps to receiving certification but we still need to make it accessible because some people would never be able to find a doctor.

The dispensaries working off other caregivers overages and that alone instead of in house medicine would be a great idea. I think even maybe a regulation on the signs that can be posted in the windows and in front. Those are what drive people crazy cause they draw to much attention while making it look almost trashy in some cases. The first impression is the most important and if we keep showing the outside world this kind of behavior we will never go as far as we could.

There are a few dispensaries that test and post the results on there websites. That was such a attractive thing to me and it just screamed "we take this seriously" in my head.
 
sniffer

sniffer

Well-Known Member
the whole law is wrong ,
1) Getting your certification - i need to be certified to use this plant ?
2) Growers - The person growing for themselves should be left alone, for the most part. You got this one right!
3) Distribution - yes
4) distribution..part 2 - Cafe's are ridiculous. That's just wanting to open a "bar' for cannabis.... facepalm , cafe`s are what we need , cannabis bars for all to enjoy!

i need to be sick to use this plant ? i think not
this plant keeps me from getting ill in the first place
 
B

bob harris

Well-Known Member
sniffer said:
the whole law is wrong ,
1) Getting your certification - i need to be certified to use this plant ?
2) Growers - The person growing for themselves should be left alone, for the most part. You got this one right!
3) Distribution - yes
4) distribution..part 2 - Cafe's are ridiculous. That's just wanting to open a "bar' for cannabis.... facepalm , cafe`s are what we need , cannabis bars for all to enjoy!

i need to be sick to use this plant ? i think not
this plant keeps me from getting ill in the first place
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You're making a "legalize for recreation" argument...that's a whole other topic. I'd like to see that as well, but medicinal acceptance and control should come first.

Personally,I use it for true medicinal (Parkinson's....movement disorder), but I would agree that it's less dangerous than alcohol, which is legal (age restrictions apply)....The problem I have is that the recreational users abusing the medical status that's been granted, are making the best argument possible for the anti cannabis minority with their irresponsible behavior.
 
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Pimpernickel

Well-Known Member
I don't like most of your thoughts. I like easy to get cards, I do have a regular doctor who refuses to give ANY certifications. I see you're afraid you'll have your legitimate medicine taken away for people misusing the system, don't worry, it will never happen. I don't really want to be monitored, although if there weren't out of control LEO out there I wouldn't mind so much if they knew where I was at and stopped by every once in awhile. I must have my overages, if I didn't I would go broke. Taking care of plants for 6 people is a lot of work, it would be incredibly hard for me to have another job while maintaining my patients plants.
 
B

bob harris

Well-Known Member
Pimpernickel said:
I don't like most of your thoughts. I like easy to get cards, I do have a regular doctor who refuses to give ANY certifications. I see you're afraid you'll have your legitimate medicine taken away for people misusing the system, don't worry, it will never happen. I don't really want to be monitored, although if there weren't out of control LEO out there I wouldn't mind so much if they knew where I was at and stopped by every once in awhile. I must have my overages, if I didn't I would go broke. Taking care of plants for 6 people is a lot of work, it would be incredibly hard for me to have another job while maintaining my patients plants.
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Soo..you shouldn't be accountable, or pay taxes on the income generated by growing?
 
ThatGuy113

ThatGuy113

Well-Known Member
Pimpernickel said:
I don't like most of your thoughts. I like easy to get cards, I do have a regular doctor who refuses to give ANY certifications. I see you're afraid you'll have your legitimate medicine taken away for people misusing the system, don't worry, it will never happen. I don't really want to be monitored, although if there weren't out of control LEO out there I wouldn't mind so much if they knew where I was at and stopped by every once in awhile. I must have my overages, if I didn't I would go broke. Taking care of plants for 6 people is a lot of work, it would be incredibly hard for me to have another job while maintaining my patients plants.
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Never say never we are in a GOP controlled state with a federal government breathing down it's neck. This isn't pot city USA and it never will be the more low key we can be about it the less worries for the WHOLE community. We can't just simply drop all of the variables and make pot legal it's not in the cards. Working in reality is a lot more productive then thinking about a pretend world with fake scenarios that work in only that realm.
 
Pravius

Pravius

Active Member
I personally agree on most of this, however with our abused tax system right now I have no idea the lemmings in the capitol would ever get this right. I just have a feeling alot of that money would line the politicians pockets while very little would go into our roads (we all live in Michigan, have you noticed we have the worst roads ever?) Just look at Detroit as an example of tax money being abused... more money to the government means more lies, scandals, and corruption.

We need to find good politicians (lol) before we begin to even think about taxation on this.
 
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hic

Well-Known Member
I grow meds and give them to patients for free. The harder they make it the harder that is for me to do. If anything needs to be clarified it is a way to let LEO who is legit and who is not so that tax money and time are not wasted. If we save the money I say fuck the tax. I also say that I am glad those are just your thoughts.

I think that they should make it so that the caregivers are not compensated for there growing of pot. That would take away all your problems. And would end all this in a heartbeat for many.

Quality Control? give me a fucking break dude...in a lab... I will smoke the shit and tell you how good it is. I tell you what some of you are just a sorry bunch indeed. I just cannot believe how unreal you guys are. Fucking taking weed to a lab that shit is just sad. I can see if you are trying out for high times or a government grant or something but many of the people have turned growing marijuana into a fucking sideshow and I just cannot believe this.... If mary- jane could talk she would tell half of you guys that she did not like you. Then how would you feel?.

I tell you what you wanna ruin something let man fucking touch it... o boy I am discraced at how dependant you babies are! I would hate to know many of your ideas on life. Perhaps you all are going to take your children for the doctor to check their IQ? or their molecular structure?. I have one more thing to say.... My how far away we have gone from our roots.
 
ThatGuy113

ThatGuy113

Well-Known Member
The testing can be very helpful for picking a medicine instead of buying it first then figuring out if it works. Not a lot of strains can really alleviate my problems but the ones that do tend to have higher levels in general of marjuana components. I think the idea of having every thing being tested could just be turned into what it is now in the legit dispensaries where the buds are checked for spider mites and mold. We just need to make that happen on a bigger scale. No compensation sounds like it could be a tad rough if that's 100% of your medicine. There would be a lack of growers for patients. I'm all abut trying to do the right thing for marijuana and I'd rather see it weened into society like this slowly rathernthen nothing at all. You don't just walk upto a wild animal and expect it to stay there but if you slowly work your way into it's comfort zone you can get pretty close until if you work long enough you can touch it.
 
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hic

Well-Known Member
The smell the resin the crystals the look is all I have ever needed. None of you guys wanna go there. I will make you all feel dumb.

Yes and we must also rely on gps now instead of a map. The farther you guys go the dumber we get. I will give up on all of ya if you guys have to rely on a fucking lab test to tell you if the fucking pot is good.... I must admit I am not very happy with what you guys do.

Half of what you read and see about marijuana is marketing you little brats. There is more money in telling you guys how to grow the pot then there is in the pot itself. I am damn glad I am a black sheep or I would be right along with the masses sounding like a retart.

You know I am not sorry if I hurt anyones feelings cause if what I write hurts your feelings that means you are the scum of marijuana.

Let me take a magnifying glass and look at my dick for a minute.... shit no crystals must not be a good dick after all.
 
TDM

TDM

Active Member
The only economic rational answer is marijuana legalization. If we are serious about deficit reduction lets get rid programs that dont work, like the war on drugs. This law has festered so long it now affects the entire hemisphere, America's consumption is the dynamic.

I would like to see America model a dug policy that has been so successful in Portugal, the only easy economic answer to this, now, complex problem.
With inovative leadership the problem would not exist in the first place. The "War on Drugs" is a bad law.
 
B

bob harris

Well-Known Member
hic said:
The smell the resin the crystals the look is all I have ever needed. None of you guys wanna go there. I will make you all feel dumb.

Yes and we must also rely on gps now instead of a map. The farther you guys go the dumber we get. I will give up on all of ya if you guys have to rely on a fucking lab test to tell you if the fucking pot is good.... I must admit I am not very happy with what you guys do.

Half of what you read and see about marijuana is marketing you little brats. There is more money in telling you guys how to grow the pot then there is in the pot itself. I am damn glad I am a black sheep or I would be right along with the masses sounding like a retart.

You know I am not sorry if I hurt anyones feelings cause if what I write hurts your feelings that means you are the scum of marijuana.

Let me take a magnifying glass and look at my dick for a minute.... shit no crystals must not be a good dick after all.
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You're just ignorant...and obviously have no understanding of the difference in cannabis strains or quality. Your writings are typical of someone that just wants to get stoned.you don't even care if there are mites or mold in your smoke...oh that's right, your the master of visual quality testing....I always thought looking at trichs only help determine ripeness...never knew you could determine potency or type of effect...

Far from hurt my feelings...you've made me happy...the more you express your opinion....the more mine becomes validated..
 
Beagle

Beagle

Well-Known Member
I like the law just how it is.

1.) What about the people who can't afford Health insurance? If these profiteer docs don't make all the profit from the no medical record crowd, then what will happen to their prices?

2.) Monitoring and testing? Are you going to pay for it? Because I can barely put food on my table. Also what of my right to privacy? If my patient doesn't like the quality of meds I provide, they are free to find a different caregiver.

3.) If caught, anybody with overages is very much held responsible. It's a prosecutors wet dream. I think you should be aloud to sell overages to dispensaries, while giving your patients free meds. If your going to tax it, then any expenses including labor, electrical, equipment, materials ect... should be deducted.

4.) I think dispensaries should be up to individual communities, though they're obviously going to be targeted by the DEA. It's a good place to get meds while you get your garden to produce. The law clearly states how patients should acquire their meds. Marijuana bars/cafes are a joke.....nothing medical about them. I don't go to a cafe to take my pain pills.

I'm for full legalization for adults, and if it ever does happen(I gotta believe), then Marijuana bars/cafes would make sense.

This is all just my opinion.
 
B

bob harris

Well-Known Member
TDM said:
The only economic rational answer is marijuana legalization. If we are serious about deficit reduction lets get rid programs that dont work, like the war on drugs. This law has festered so long it now affects the entire hemisphere, America's consumption is the dynamic.

I would like to see America model a dug policy that has been so successful in Portugal, the only easy economic answer to this, now, complex problem.
With inovative leadership the problem would not exist in the first place. The "War on Drugs" is a bad law.
Click to expand...
I totally agree...but it's a separate topic for now. The first step in legalization would be to show responsibility with whats already been given.
I kinda think we should make hookers legal too...after all, if it can sail, fly or fuck...it's always cheaper to rent...
 
H

hic

Well-Known Member
Well I can tell you Mr. bob harris... I think you are funny.

I will also say NO it is not all in those stupid crystals of yours. You see there is so much more to marijuana then you know. You are also setting a bad example to the hatchlings reading this thread about those crystals you all make your God.

Here is a fact..... Cannabis is a goldmine: it produces up to 60 different cannabinoids and up to 200 different terpenes, a really unique cocktail of natural molecules... We must also consider the resins.

There is more then the crystals my ill taught peers that make your buzz. What about the lack of oxygen to the brain? The thickness of the smoke also is a factor in potency as to the lungs ability to absorb. What about YOUR genetic make-up will that not be a factor as well?... You know I can make a pamphlet so I will stop right know.... oh wait I have to add the stickyness of the smoke.. not all smoke is as sticky as some and vice versa. This will also be a factor.

You see mr bob harris there are opinions of the masses and then facts. I have listened to the facts and never even paid attention to lies.

Tell me about your ever impressive crystals again? And I will talk about resin.
 
H

hic

Well-Known Member
View attachment 1683880



Threre's your crystals bob. You have no idea what I know bob and where I have been so give me everything you have and I will let you know how I take it. I do not know you but I have lived with pot for most of my life.

I take a few things serious. my family, my beagle, my pot. You have fucked with the pot aspect. By telling me your opinion. Pisses me off cause if there is one of ya there is more of ya.

Opinions are not always good as we can see with how things are going now in the world. Facts my friends would solve alot.
 
B

bob harris

Well-Known Member
Beagle said:
I like the law just how it is.

1.) What about the people who can't afford Health insurance? If these profiteer docs don't make all the profit from the no medical record crowd, then what will happen to their prices?

2.) Monitoring and testing? Are you going to pay for it? Because I can barely put food on my table. Also what of my right to privacy? If my patient doesn't like the quality of meds I provide, they are free to find a different caregiver.

3.) If caught, anybody with overages is very much held responsible. It's a prosecutors wet dream. I think you should be aloud to sell overages to dispensaries, while giving your patients free meds. If your going to tax it, then any expenses including labor, electrical, equipment, materials ect... should be deducted.

4.) I think dispensaries should be up to individual communities, though they're obviously going to be targeted by the DEA. It's a good place to get meds while you get your garden to produce. The law clearly states how patients should acquire their meds. Marijuana bars/cafes are a joke.....nothing medical about them. I don't go to a cafe to take my pain pills.

I'm for full legalization for adults, and if it ever does happen(I gotta believe), then Marijuana bars/cafes would make sense.

This is all just my opinion.
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I don't quite understand what your saying in point #1....the insured/un insured "workings are just like any other medical expenses.

Point 2 that you make the answer is ..yes, I am going to pay for it...if I'm going to sell overages to a dispensary...It's $60...a small expense compared to the rest of the growing costs.

Point 3..I pretty much agree..You should be able to sell overages to dispensaries, and you should be able to deduct the costs of the grow from any money received..just like any other business. The overage amount you are allowed is a problem....that needs to be addressed somehow. It's petty much impossible to tell the plants what to yield..so, as the law stands now, most everyone is in violation at some point in the harvest/drying stage.

Point 4...I agree mostly..there do need to be dispensaries..I'd just like more of them to look professional. The law isn't so clear on how patients are supposed to get their meds though., or for that matter seeds/clones if they wish to grow.

And yes, I favor full legalization..but that's not what this discussion is about...
 
B

bob harris

Well-Known Member
hic said:
Well I can tell you Mr. bob harris... I think you are funny.

I will also say NO it is not all in those stupid crystals of yours. You see there is so much more to marijuana then you know. You are also setting a bad example to the hatchlings reading this thread about those crystals you all make your God.

Here is a fact..... Cannabis is a goldmine: it produces up to 60 different cannabinoids and up to 200 different terpenes, a really unique cocktail of natural molecules... We must also consider the resins.

There is more then the crystals my ill taught peers that make your buzz. What about the lack of oxygen to the brain? The thickness of the smoke also is a factor in potency as to the lungs ability to absorb. What about YOUR genetic make-up will that not be a factor as well?... You know I can make a pamphlet so I will stop right know.... oh wait I have to add the stickyness of the smoke.. not all smoke is as sticky as some and vice versa. This will also be a factor.

You see mr bob harris there are opinions of the masses and then facts. I have listened to the facts and never even paid attention to lies.

Tell me about your ever impressive crystals again? And I will talk about resin.
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They started out as your ever impressive crystals, not mine. Remember, all you have to do is see them to know their quality...your words, not mine.
Me..I can only tell ripeness..heck I can't even tell if the crystal contain anything worthwhile by looking at them...and the number of crystals..though [pretty to look at...doesn't tell me anything. I've seen plants crystal up from stress and poor conditions..and the smoke was worthless.

terpenes, oils, mostly flavor factors, cannabanoids..tons..but only a few that are major contributors to effect.

and when you get into stickiness of the smoke and thickness of the smoke...well your just showing ignorance again. Those qualites may be preferences.. but they have no bearing on medicinal value. Plus your excluding edibles and vaporizers...not every one smokes their meds..

Your ramblings are...well, just ramblings....feel free to give me my next lesson...what was it? Oh yea, resins..can't wait
 
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