Guerrilla grower's nightmare Leaf spot disease

TwistedGenetics · Sep 4, 2011

My blueberry got this early, and is still growing pretty nicely regardless of being COVERED. I will have to harvest it early, for sure. My other plants are just getting infected now, and it seems to take weeks to spread/kill on a resistant plant, so I think I should be alright.
I bought Eagle 20 but have not had the balls to spray my budding plants with it. I will probably wait till next season and use it on the vegging plants. I am also going to scorch the ground with a blow-torch (the large type you can get from catalogs like Northern) to try to kill spores around the plant. It probably won't do all that much, but it is worth a shot. This blight is terrible. It has already killed my tomato plants, and has infected maples, ash, and oak on surrounding lands. Most broad leaf shrubs and weeds have it, also.

tristynhawk · Sep 4, 2011

Yea i wouldn't use it either on my flowering girls. Next year i will only use it in june and beginning of july when the disease starts showing it's ugly head. From then on it will be liquid copper. I want at least 6 weeks of not using eagle 20 before harvest. But if it can hold the disease at bay through veg, i will be happy. In the beginning of the thread there is a link That leads to a fountain of info on the subject. Seems someone has felt the need to close this thread the link leads you over to ICMAG where there is a fountian of info on this subject. I am done telling people about this disease on this forum, let them watch their plant's die. I see ten posts a week about why is my leaves yellowing and everyone always answer's nute def. or your ph is off. Im done.....

peace out tristynhawk

tristynhawk · Sep 4, 2011

This info is here for you to use or not to use.

SaneLawsMake4SaneSociety · Sep 4, 2011

mtbazz said:
This just started showing up to a large extent on the east coast within the past 3-5 years. Three years ago I lost almost my whole crop. this year I have been more fortunate and have found a strain or two that seem to be resistant, but I am still expecting losses. I started this year out counting a yield of 5 lbs (that figured was AFTER I factored in losses from insects, disease, storm damage,etc..but this stuff has been a battle this year also. If I get two pounds now I will be lucky, and dont really expect more than a pound.

LC definitely holds it at bay. The key thing is to use the maximum does possible, and than hit it again with an even larger does a few days later. I use 2 ounces per gallon of water one day, and than come back out a few days later and hit them with three ounces per gallon of water to take care of any stragglers that may develop a resistance.
The second key thing is to DRENCH the plant. It won't kill it or hurt it.

After a heavy rainfall you will need to apply it again, and even if there is no rain a touch up application once a week is not a bad idea.

Also, spray the surrounding vegetation, and the ground surrounding your plant, remove afflicted foilage (preferably carrying it back out with you).

This shit is a plant killer, and the spores can live for years in the surrounding soil.

There is another website that has a sticky in the outdoors growers forum with ALOT more information about this disease.

great info, thanks! do you have linkage for the sticky on the other forum? (NM, read the other post Re the TOS)

SaneLawsMake4SaneSociety · Sep 4, 2011

tristynhawk said:
After further reading i will for sure run with eagle 20 next year, i think what OG was trying to get across is it's no more dangerous then any other systemetic fungicide. Common sense tells you to use precautions with all fungicides and even pesticides. I wouldn't drink either of them or think of storing any fungicide with my food,
wear proper gear and spray away is what im going to do.
peace tristynhawk.

ps. you should use precautions with the liquid copper also if no has read the labels. Almost everything is harmful in today's world just ask The state of California.

My concern regarding the posts in this forum wasn't really so much that anyone would drink it, etc. It was that this user was posting absolutely bogus info, which was designed to deceive, and posting it here as truth that he had actually verified. That works counter tto the purposes of this whole forum. btw, the tactic of stating fiction as fact, mixing a bit of fact in there, and going on for a while about the fact, while distorting it's importance, then adding opinion and passing that off as fact is a pretty sophisticated attempt at misdirection, which makes it easier for people to accept as the truth that it is not. That is partly why I feel so strongly about the whole subject.

AFA " Almost everything is harmful in today's world" that is a whole other subject entirely, and if we didn't have to sort through someones intentional lies, etc, we could be focusing our energy on other topics of discussion, like that, or even what other methods are likely to be effective weapon s against the fungus among us, or even why this problem seems to be showing up more and more as time goes forward, even above and beyond what the high humidity this year can account for.

Seriously, we need to weed out people that do that on the forums (my opinion), as that kind of behavior makes it harder to move our collective knowledge forward.

As far as other approaches that are definitely less toxic, my hope is to have a number of things that I can do that will work in concert that can keep it from ever appearing on any outdoor plants, or at least the ones that are genetically strong. I am working on that now. There is a lot of info out there to be had.

I understand how attractive a one shot fix is, and some people are going to go that route, in spite of it being much more toxic, but telling everyone lies about how non toxic a particular approach is counter productive, and sticking our heads in the sand about how bad it is to spread the kind of lies OG was stating as fact, or about how toxic a particular thing is, etc, just gets in the way or any real learning, and isn't that what we are on this forum for?

puck1969 · Sep 4, 2011

You also have to remember that Eagle 20 is sold in a concentrated form, I don't know if the other fungicides that you mention
are sold the same way. I use Eagle quite often and it's used on apple and other fruit trees on a regular basis. Due to it being
concentrated of course it's going to have a higher toxicity. Just my 2 cents.

SaneLawsMake4SaneSociety · Sep 4, 2011

mtbazz said:
this year I have been more fortunate and have found a strain or two that seem to be resistant

Could you let me\us know what strains and seed breeders (if applicable) you have found to be resistant?

Thanks!

SaneLawsMake4SaneSociety · Sep 4, 2011

mtbazz said:
LC definitely holds it at bay. The key thing is to use the maximum does possible, and than hit it again with an even larger does a few days later. I use 2 ounces per gallon of water one day, and than come back out a few days later and hit them with three ounces per gallon of water to take care of any stragglers that may develop a resistance.
The second key thing is to DRENCH the plant. It won't kill it or hurt it.

Are you only using the LG as a foliar, or soil drench, too?

mtbazz · Sep 4, 2011

SaneLawsMake4SaneSociety said:
Are you only using the LG as a foliar, or soil drench, too?

Foilar spray, and than I also spray the surrounding vegetation and the surface soil, but I do not drench as I am not sure what the copper would do if concentrated in the soil from a drench.

Remember, dont be afraid to be liberal in your application. I have soaked my plants with 2-3 ounces per gallon of this stuff and the plants were fine, although I since most of stuff will done in three weeks I wont be doing any more spraying.

SaneLawsMake4SaneSociety · Sep 4, 2011

puck1969 said:
You also have to remember that Eagle 20 is sold in a concentrated form, I don't know if the other fungicides that you mention
are sold the same way. I use Eagle quite often and it's used on apple and other fruit trees on a regular basis. Due to it being
concentrated of course it's going to have a higher toxicity. Just my 2 cents.

Re concentration to toxicity factor...very good point to keep in mind, IMO. THe Exel LG is concentrated, but copper sprays, for instance, come in both ready to use and concentrated forms.

AFA Eagle (or anything else, really) being used on apples, (or anything else, really) I personally don't take that as proof that it would not be toxic. I was at a seminar in NY, and I had a conversation with a man who used to farm apples "conventionally". He told me that NY state has much higher cancer rates in and around the areas where apples are grown "conventionally" (they call them "Cancer Clusters") than in the areas where this practice does not take place, and he began growing organically when he found this out in the course of researching cancer when his wife was stricken with it.

It's anecdotal evidence, I know, but I do tend to believe that if we have evolved alongside a chemical or substance for literally millions of years, that there is generally a better chance that our bodies (and natural systems, for that matter) know how to deal with it than there would be if the chemical or substance just recently came into existence, hence my preference for copper and phosphorus acid, combined with other non toxic efforts over synthetic chemicals.

When humans go intervening into complex systems (for example, inserting complex synthetic compounds that have never existed before into them), there are very very often unforeseen consequences, this has played out many times throughout history.

The "Dust Bowl" is a great example of such unintended consequences. Human intervention in the ecosystem caused the dust bowl. "Drought" is sometimes cited as the main causative factor, with "over-cultivation" being the other main reason, but the land itself was far less able to handle drought, due the native grasses being eradicated, and replaced with monocultures which are much more suceptible to drought and other external pressures. (Human application of synthetic fertilizers and pesticides also contributed greatly to the soil depletion, btw)

So, when there was a drought, the monocultures were killed off, because monocultures are very very fragile, and because the plants in the monocultures were not able to handle the drought, leaving the depleted soil bare and vulnerable to drying up, and being blown away...and that is what happened.

mtbazz · Sep 4, 2011

SaneLawsMake4SaneSociety said:
Could you let me\us know what strains and seed breeders (if applicable) you have found to be resistant?

Thanks!

This year I am running BOG Sour Life Saver, BogBUbble, and GN PPP.

The PPP appears to have no tolerance at all for leaf blight and has been affected quite severly.

So far my Bog SourLife Savers have all shown little to no infection, and the BogBubble has shown a little, but not nearly as much as Nirvana's PPP. I think in general Bog strains tend to be more mold resistant than other strains, which probably helps in combatting leaf blight.

While LC works, it has its drawbacks, mainly being repeated applications are needed which hampers security. Some people in a thread on another forum (see my profile) have been doing some experiments with other treatments, but the verdict is still out on those results.

I think also early treatments of LC are required. Next year, within the first few weeks of my plants being in the ground I will be doing biweekly sprayings of my plants and all the surrounding vegetation.

The real unfortunate thing about all of this is that for many people it has taken the idea of having a fully organic grow out of the equation. In the past I have tried various organic methods (such as serenade, green cure) to keep it at bay, and nothing works. I hate spraying my plants with non-organic remedies, but it is either that or have no grow.

puck1969 · Sep 4, 2011

SaneLawsMake4SaneSociety said:
Re concentration to toxicity factor...very good point to keep in mind, IMO. THe Exel LG is concentrated, but copper sprays, for instance, come in both ready to use and concentrated forms.

AFA Eagle (or anything else, really) being used on apples, (or anything else, really) I personally don't take that as proof that it would not be toxic. I was at a seminar in NY, and I had a conversation with a man who used to farm apples "conventionally". He told me that NY state has much higher cancer rates in and around the areas where apples are grown "conventionally" (they call them "Cancer Clusters") than in the areas where this practice does not take place, and he began growing organically when he found this out in the course of researching cancer when his wife was stricken with it.

It's anecdotal evidence, I know, but I do tend to believe that if we have evolved alongside a chemical or substance for literally millions of years, that there is generally a better chance that our bodies (and natural systems, for that matter) know how to deal with it than there would be if the chemical or substance just recently came into existence, hence my preference for copper and phosphorus acid, combined with other non toxic efforts over synthetic chemicals.

When humans go intervening into complex systems (for example, inserting complex synthetic compounds that have never existed before into them), there are very very often unforeseen consequences, this has played out many times throughout history.

The "Dust Bowl" is a great example of such unintended consequences. Human intervention in the ecosystem caused the dust bowl. "Drought" is sometimes cited as the main causative factor, with "over-cultivation" being the other main reason, but the land itself was far less able to handle drought, due the native grasses being eradicated, and replaced with monocultures which are much more suceptible to drought and other external pressures. (Human application of synthetic fertilizers and pesticides also contributed greatly to the soil depletion, btw)

So, when there was a drought, the monocultures were killed off, because monocultures are very very fragile, and because the plants in the monocultures were not able to handle the drought, leaving the depleted soil bare and vulnerable to drying up, and being blown away...and that is what happened.

There is no doubt that introducing anything new into an ecosystem can have unintended consiquences. The thing is about animal testing etc. (which I
am vehamently against) they are exposed to exessive amounts of the product tested. Let's face it, we are exposed to cancer causing chemicals constantly.
Take a look at the back of your toothpaste sometime. If a child decides to swallow the toothpaste he/she is using poison control should be called immediately.
Flouride is a cancer causing agent when a person uses more than is recomended. Let's face it, we risk death walking out the door in the morning. Doesn't
mean I don't look out the door before I go but I don't want to stay in my house all the time. It's important for good folks like you to keep people aware of things
like this though because most people wouldn't think twice about using a product to protect their crop.

tristynhawk · Sep 4, 2011

mtbazz said:
This year I am running BOG Sour Life Saver, BogBUbble, and GN PPP.

The PPP appears to have no tolerance at all for leaf blight and has been affected quite severly.

So far my Bog SourLife Savers have all shown little to no infection, and the BogBubble has shown a little, but not nearly as much as Nirvana's PPP. I think in general Bog strains tend to be more mold resistant than other strains, which probably helps in combatting leaf blight.

While LC works, it has its drawbacks, mainly being repeated applications are needed which hampers security. Some people in a thread on another forum (see my profile) have been doing some experiments with other treatments, but the verdict is still out on those results.

I think also early treatments of LC are required. Next year, within the first few weeks of my plants being in the ground I will be doing biweekly sprayings of my plants and all the surrounding vegetation.

The real unfortunate thing about all of this is that for many people it has taken the idea of having a fully organic grow out of the equation. In the past I have tried various organic methods (such as serenade, green cure) to keep it at bay, and nothing works. I hate spraying my plants with non-organic remedies, but it is either that or have no grow.

really sucks about the PPP cause i was thinking of running it next year. And as for all organic in the wilderness, i have unfortunately never had any luck. I was also looking at BOG gear so it's good to hear that it has some resistance. I grew Kaya gold this year from nirvana and it also was not effected and i am super happy with results. I will average over 8zips a plant and quite a few at the pound mark and over. For a guerrilla grow this is very solid strain IMO. Plus i have already begun to cut it so it matures very quick, started flowering in early july.

Tennis1 · Sep 5, 2011

First pic is one of my Lowryder2's from Marijuana-seeds.nl (wouldn't recomend), second is showing how the leaf spot disease has affected my plants, and the third pic is one of Sannie's Heribe fem's (recomended strain).

mtbazz · Sep 5, 2011

tristynhawk said:
really sucks about the PPP cause i was thinking of running it next year. And as for all organic in the wilderness, i have unfortunately never had any luck. I was also looking at BOG gear so it's good to hear that it has some resistance. I grew Kaya gold this year from nirvana and it also was not effected and i am super happy with results. I will average over 8zips a plant and quite a few at the pound mark and over. For a guerrilla grow this is very solid strain IMO. Plus i have already begun to cut it so it matures very quick, started flowering in early july.

Yeah, I t sucks about the PPP. I have two nine footers that I was betting would yield close to a pound each, they have lost so much foilage now though i will be lucky to get 4-5 zips a piece.

As for BOGs gear, there is alot of hype about his gear, and he has his share of fanboys, but I have to admit, with what I have seen so far it is deserved. Rock hard nugs, fast finishing times ( am able to get bogbubble and SLS to finish flowering in 40-50 days), resinous buds and stable genetics make his stuff a no brainer to grow.

tristynhawk · Sep 5, 2011

Seen sannie's herijuana strain. It looks alot like the medijuana strain from amsterdam seeds

1badmasonman · Sep 5, 2011

Interesting read bro, I have about 10 monsters suffering from this disease and i afraid they are far to gone to help now. It makes total sense to me because i too thought it was a soil ph problem but that is not the case. + rep and thanks for sharing the info :peace:

1BMM

tristynhawk · Sep 5, 2011

1badmasonman said:
Interesting read bro, I have about 10 monsters suffering from this disease and i afraid they are far to gone to help now. It makes total sense to me because i too thought it was a soil ph problem but that is not the case. + rep and thanks for sharing the info 1BMM

Sorry we couldn't help you sooner man, at least you will be ready next season. Everyone here blames it on Ph or nute def.

1badmasonman · Sep 5, 2011

yeah its weird, I have several patches and my best 2 got hit with this. Fucking sucks man but what can ya do. They were all my exotics strains in those 2 spots. I may still have a chance at saving them yet though hopefully. Still got a grip of healthy ladies ripening up in 5 other patches so not a total kick in the seeds thankfully. I will most definately be on the look out next year believe me you

Never even considered a fungal prob. Good darts man Thanks again bro 1BMM

1badmasonman · Sep 5, 2011

Ohhh and sub'd too by the way hehehe :bigjoint:

Guerrilla grower's nightmare Leaf spot disease

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