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Dr.J's Hempy Hydrorganic/OC+ Adventure, 2K13

Discussion in 'Grow Journals' started by Dr.J20, Jan 30, 2013.


    Dr.J20 Well-Known Member

    Hey RIU, I'm up and running again! I'll be doing a 100% perlite hempy bucket grow, shooting for between 4 and 6 in 2-3gallon buckets. So i'll give a run down of the specs and follow that up with some of my goals for this run. Oh, and of course, pics!

    But before I get going, this thread is going to be something I maintain at minimum weekly, to help keep me honest with my work journaling and keeping track. My personal garden journal will not be posted, with all of my notes to self and shit and all the environmental data, but I will keep everyone informed of ballpark numbers for those kinds of things (temp, humid, pH etc.)

    Genetics: NorthernBerry from PeakSeeds, a Diesel Cross, and Purple Kush. currently, 1 NB, 3 D-X, 3 P-K
    Substrate: Currently, mini-hempy cups*, will be transplanted directly to 2-3gal hempy buckets with 100% perlite @ 7 sets of leaves.
    Nutrients: Osmocote plus CRF, tap water, blackstrap molasses @ 1-2 Tbsp/gal; Earth Juice (microblast, catalyst, grow, bloom) for supplements; and cal/mag if needed.
    H2O: TA = avg. 38 w/Range 29-48 , pH = avg. 8.1 w/Range 7.2-8.5, avg. Ca =7.46ppm w/Range 4.81-9.62ppm
    Environment: Currently, closet inside germination tray w/ dome; moving to 4x2x6 tent, mylar lined.
    Lights: Currently, 90w UFO LED + 105w 6500K CFL; moving to 3 4'x4bulb fullham racehorse T5s (2 Fluorogrow evergreens, 1 quantum badboy)
    T5 PARish Bulbs: Veg: 4 Zoo Med Flora Suns, 6 65K Grow, 2 27K Bloom; Bloom: 4 ZooMed Flora Suns, 6 27K Bloom, 2 65K Veg
    Avg Temp: 79, Range: Lights on, 72-83; Lights off, 64-70
    Humidity Range: max:65%, min:35%
    Ventilation: 530 cfm 6" inline extraction fan
    Circulation:2 booster fans, and a small box fan.

    Seeds were soaked in RO H2O for 36hrs, all sunk. They went straight into *mini-hempy cups. Mini-HCs are a seed starting device I picked up along the way (thanks DocBud!): 16oz solo cup, with a hole about 2.5" from the bottom. Fill with 100% perlite just above the hole. On top of the straight perlite goes a 50:50 mix of perlite and FFOF. Then a 1" layer on top of straight FFOF. I make a 1/4 to 1/2 inch "hole" in the middle of the top layer of FFOF and that's where the soaked seeds go. cover them over, water them in with RO H2O and then its under the LED and CFL. Took them about 30 hours to pop out above the surface and now they're going well just 48hrs after getting above the surface. They've been sprayed with RO H2O, and watered as needed. I'll probably have to cull the weakest of the Diesel crosses (heretofore Diesel-X or D-X) just for space's sake. As I said above, they will grow in these mini-hempy cups until they have 7 sets of leaves. At that point they will be transplanted into their final homes for a ~3 week veg. The final homes will be black 3 gallon buckets with 100% perlite mixed with 2 tbsp/gal of Osmocote+. I will be paying attention to the gals to use the nutrients I already own to try and supplement. I will also be venturing into AACT brewing to try to establish a microhoarde in the root systems of these hempys. hopefully this will help with flavor at harvest. AACT will be used at transplant and probably at least twice in flower (early, mid). I have a new fanspeed controller and I'm looking forward to getting these girls into the tent as soon as I'm done with the current run and have had a chance to give the ole girl a good cleaning. always want a fresh start!

    PICS: they're not much to look at now, but they sure will be before we know it!
    IMG_1429 (1).jpg IMG_1432 (1).jpg IMG_1439 (1).jpg IMG_1420 (1).jpg IMG_1433 (1).jpg IMG_1424 (1).jpg IMG_1426 (1).jpg IMG_1436 (1).jpg IMG_1433 (1).jpg IMG_1430 (1).jpg IMG_1421 (1).jpg
    Please feel free to comment here, but keep it respectable, and with an eye towards increasing understanding.
    Be easy, and I hope you all enjoy the ride!
    P.s let me know if i left out anything!
    Also, ignore the labeling on the cups--i thought i had a sour diesel cross and it turns out it was an NYC diesel cross, but it was crossed by what could veritably be called a common pollen chucker so its not really anything carefully procured or established, hence, diesel-x

    Attached Files:

    BCJohn likes this.

    Moebius Well-Known Member

    Subbed w/ interest

    Good luck dude :leaf:

    Dr.J20 Well-Known Member

    Thanks Moe! glad to have you along...ventilation going in today, and pics tonight!

    Dr.J20 Well-Known Member

    Ventilation added today: semi-rigid ducting, 6", and a huge 530 cfm tjernlund extraction fan. fairly quiet fan, though right next to it sounds like a damn jumbo-jet! Checked my temps and they're stable at the "canopy" (if you can say such a thing about seedlings) and at the base cups:: avg. 73; humidity is low at 20% but i'm going to fill up the humidifier and give that a shot in an hour or so...after dinner maybe...the first pic is rotated to the right, thats the top of my tent with the vent going up to the garage ceiling ~5-6'. Threw some other pics up too but not much going on yet...when i get the humidity right things will pick up...lights are 20/4 until they are ready for their final homes, then i'll step down to 18/6 until they're mature, and then its into bloom...I'll update next week but feel free to discuss...here's some food for thought: I want to incorporate aact into this grow, and that makes me rethink 100% perlite, should i do at least one coco hempy and compare the effects of aact on oc+ hempy buckets? i'll be looking into the ups and downs and reading "teaming with microbes" to see if I can't get a firmer handle on things
    as always,
    Be easy,

    IMG_1455 (1).jpg IMG_1456 (1).jpg IMG_1457 (1).jpg IMG_1458 (1).jpg IMG_1459 (1).jpg IMG_1460 (1).jpg IMG_1461 (1).jpg IMG_1462 (1).jpg

    Moebius Well-Known Member

    Doc, I don't know of any threads or peeps running AACT in hempys here at RIU. ... If there are theyre lost in the mix. Whichever way you go AACT or OC+, perlite or coco, they'll all work but will just take a bit of intuition to dial it in.

    I can see you've put some thought into this, so I'm sure this is going to be good.

    Dr.J20 Well-Known Member

    Here's the starting line-up; everyone is out of the woods and I've added a fan speed controller to keep my temps between 72 and 76. I'm keeping the catch tray filled with a little water so the humidity right around the gals is as high as I can get it right now (40%). I'm also gonna try running my humidifier in the storage room so that the storage room humidity goes up and the humid air gets sucked into the tent through the passive intakes. Seems to me that with the humidifier right in the tent, the humidity gets sucked right out immediately (the sides of my tent are being sucked in a bit so i'm pretty sure i'm getting good neg. pressure). Anywho, watered with RO H2O (except one of the PK's, i was too lazy to go in the house to get more and just used the pH'd water from my res. its probably back up around 8pH right now though, oh well…i'm sure the FFOF is gonna buffer plenty at this stage in the game.
    here's an introductory round of pics, each girl getting her own close up and a group photo at the end.

    Next time i update, the dx and pk will be numbered because it'll be getting time to cull the weakest two for a total plant count of 5…its always a tough decision (and i may throw the other two right into 12/12 and grow em out in some 2L bottles elsewhere, or just give 'em to some friends, that's the nicest thing i could do--that's what i'll do! :bigjoint: feel free to comment, question, constructively critique!

    IMG_1463 (1).jpg IMG_1470 (1).jpg IMG_1473 (1).jpg IMG_1469 (1).jpg IMG_1468 (1).jpg IMG_1467 (1).jpg IMG_1466 (1).jpg IMG_1465 (1).jpg IMG_1464 (1).jpg IMG_1471 (1).jpg

    be easy,

    Dr.J20 Well-Known Member

    Not much to report on as far as progress goes with the grow so this'll be brief. I've been manually controlling temps because my digital program of rotating 30 and 45 minute on/off intervals was doing way more up-and-down than is healthy (just 20 degree swings but fast ones from what i can tell). Anyway, since i've been monitoring things i've been able to control temp fine (avgs. between 72 and 82 lights on, 62 and 72 lights off). switching to 18/6 tomorrow (i'm still at 20/4) but growth seems alright. It is only day 10 so can't expect too much with all the temp and humidity strain but I've installed a ductstat plug in thermostat and we'll see if I can keep my range better in the 70s. I've got the girls numbered but we'll have to wait until they get a few more nodes to make any conclusive decisions about who's gonna make the final cut. (sorry about the orientation...tried fixing, can't).

    IMG_1494 (2).jpg IMG_1495 (2).jpg IMG_1496 (2).jpg IMG_1497 (2).jpg IMG_1498 (2).jpg IMG_1499 (2).jpg IMG_1493 (2).jpg IMG_1500 (2).jpg IMG_1492 (1).jpg
    Since that side of the update is fairly straightforward, everyone doing fine getting some straight RO H2O, i'll just give my side by side by side by side run down of some hash i made with the last go 'round: iso, bubble, dry ice--pressed vs. decarb'd.

    -Iso was a little harsh tasting but definitely fucks your world
    -dry ice was by far the easiest to make, the fastest, but the least potent. Pressed dry ice kief is floral and delicious with a nice high, and decarb'd has a slightly different taste with a more mellow high.
    -bubble was most labor intensive and messy but far and above the best. delicious taste, awesome high--i would seriously consider making one ultra trich'd out plant just to make bubble with from every grow here on out.
    I am defintely a bubble lover from here on out and am going to eventually invest in some serious bubble bags--the ones i have are a bit knock off from ebay, they do the trick but obviously not as well as some others…
    the 25micron, 73 micron, and 120 micron pulls are what i saved, 160 looked like shyte (only other bag i've got is a 220 work bag).

    Haven't tried any 25 micron but both 73 and 120 have bubbled and taken me away to a fantastical land of wonderment and joy…but i digress

    pictorial: IMG_1477 (1).jpg <---dry ice hash (pressed kief in upper left, decarb'd pressed upper right, loose in center)
    IMG_1481 (1).jpg <<<< iso hash evaporating
    IMG_1483 (1).jpg <<<<<<iso scraped up
    IMG_1485 (1).jpg <<<<bubble :bigjoint: :leaf: :joint: :mrgreen:
    IMG_1486 (1).jpg <<<<73 micron
    IMG_1488 (1).jpg <<<25 micron
    IMG_1490 (1).jpg <<<120 micron


    Attached Files:


    Dr.J20 Well-Known Member

    So there have been a few environmental issues. nothing major, but some seriously low humidity for veg (18% minimums with avgs. 27-33%), and we had a night of temps in the low 50s, dipping all the way down to 48 so that should explain some of the slowness of growth. Furthermore, I had to go out of town for the weekend, and rigged up an automatic watering system with my little sump (132 gph) and some 1/4 Tees, and tubes. I need to get this down pat for an upcoming business trip that will take me away from them for 8 days or so. In any case, when i checked my pump to make sure it was feeding all 5 whips, i shut it off abruptly and accidentally set up a siphon. :wall: I luckily went back in to check on my girls because I love them and like to talk to them etc. and I had drained half the 15 gal reservoir into DX-1, poor thing. The quick fix was to reorient her tubing, but if anyone has any tips on auto-watering feel free to contribute!...

    Enough blathering, I transplanted right before I went out of town. These gals were surprisingly not too rootbound when I transplanted so I'm not sure if the low humidity is what's stunting their growth, but they seem to be perking up in their new homes. Their homes consist of: 100% perlite, amended with 4 Tbsp OC+; 2 Tbsp 1 inch above the hole, 2 Tbsp at transplant level, scattered about; I will be adding another 2 Tbsp top-dressed tomorrow (b/c its a 3 gal bucket). And yes, in the pictures that is a genuine WattSaver full soil cap; thanks for the tip Watt!
    They got a good watering with some pH 6.8 tap that had been bubbling for 48 hrs. just after the pics were taken. They'll be under 18/6 now for a good little veg.

    comments, questions, criticisms, recommendations, discussions--all welcome!
    View attachment 2531684 View attachment 2531685 View attachment 2531686 View attachment 2531687 View attachment 2531688 View attachment 2531689
    be easy, :joint: :leaf: :joint:

    Dr.J20 Well-Known Member

    Our environs aren't totally perfect, but with the OC+ these are some green, healthy, happy gals. And, WattSaver's soil cap is an added bonus. The temp range is a little wider than would be preferable but the weather where I am has been swinging violently so nothing I can really do about it. We're seeing lows in the low 50s (avg 53), and that's the low when lights are off--absolute minimum; highs with lights on are maxing out at 86 on average, but the max and min are probably exaggerations because my fan's on a ductstat which detects air movment temps instead of just sitting ambient temps like a straight thermostat, so it has to get a little hotter when the lights come on before the fan starts controlling the temps at around 78. I wish I had my old TI-89 with thermometer probe, i'd set that up and snag 196 data points every day and really dial in my environment--alas, i'm rambling again.
    Anywho, long and short of it: Temps are OK, a little wider range in the extremes than is good, but on avg, we're ok ; Humidity is generally low: now its hovering around 40%, but over dark periods its jumping up to 78-80%, and still showing lows in the 20s. again i think the max and min are exaggerated by my fan set up and I will be considering switching back to the fanspeed controller, or maybe using the fsc in tandem with the ductstat, or throwing the fan on the fsc, but put that on a timer so that it runs only during lights on...any thoughts on that would be helpful, especially if you think that i'm just fucking with something that doesn't really need to be fucked with....

    Watering between pH 5.8 and 6.5--tap water gets bubbled continuously and has usually been ultraoxygenated by the time of watering; the water stays around 60 degrees so it can hold more dissolved oxygen.

    All that's left now are the pictures: View attachment 2542923 View attachment 2542924 View attachment 2542925 View attachment 2542926 View attachment 2542927 View attachment 2542928 View attachment 2542929 View attachment 2542930 View attachment 2542931

    The only one whose name tag you can't see is Purple Kush 2; and there are duplicates.
    Thinking about topping soon, using uncle ben's topping method. that, or lst but I'm thinking topping this time around will work with my circumstances. how long after the chop do most people veg until flowering is induced? I think i've found a research question to follow...

    well any comments questions or other thoughts you'd like to share, please feel free!
    be easy,
    Dr.J :leaf: :joint: :leaf:

    Spittn4cash Well-Known Member

    Nice, Im not usually a fan of LED grows..but you seem to know what you're doing. Cant wait to see more!


    Dr.J20 Well-Known Member

    Glad to have you along, but I only used the LED for popping the seeds...now we're in PAR T5 mode thru flower but do come along for more!
    be easy

    Dr.J20 Well-Known Member

    Not much to report. Temps settled in 52-72, with 72 being the average daytime temp and 52 being the night time low. (80 daytime max, never sustained though, usually reached right after lights on but before the thermostat registers the increase, then the fan kicks on and knocks shit down to keep it nice). humidity struggles continue but everyone looks healthy and happy.
    1 View attachment 2556712 2 View attachment 2556713 3 View attachment 2556714
    Pic 1 is the Diesel Cross (DX) #2
    Pic 2 is the two purple kush plants, PK1 in back, and PK2 in front
    Pic 3 is DX#1 in the back and Northernberry up front.
    Oc+ and a good environment with some healthy pH 6ish water (ive been hovering around 6.3) and you're good to g(r)o(w)
    Be easy,
    Dr.J :peace: :leaf:
    sky rocket

    sky rocket Well-Known Member

    Skyrocket is all in. At what point are you going to flip me to 12/12?

    WattSaver Well-Known Member

    Everything looks really green and healthy. And I'm sure you'll find that OC works great throughout the grow.

    Relating to your topping question. Do you plan on pulling clones from these? If so I'd let them grow enough to pull a top clone, if not you may want to top here soon. You'll want to veg for at least a wk after topping.

    Thanks for building a nice journal, it's a good read.

    Dr.J20 Well-Known Member

    I don't plan to top anymore; after thinking about it, I'll have plenty of room for the stretch because they'll go into 12/12 at about 12" and even if they triple in size we'll still have overhead for the T5s. I'll be flipping the switch next tuesday (darkness in a week) so I think 12" is a reasonable maximum to expect in the next seven days. OC+ is amazing. I wish i could get the aussie organic version; I'm going to be using molasses and some compost teas throughout flowering so hopefully i can brin out the flavors!
    I'm glad you're enjoying the journal, i'll keep on posting...next update coming soon, stay tuned!
    be easy! :leaf: :peace: :leaf:
    dr. j

    Dr.J20 Well-Known Member

    Not much to report; We went with a 34.5hr dark period before turning the lights on and have what I will call an "early autumn" blend of light from the T5s. I've rearranged the lights to better accommodate the girls but I may still run out of space and have to finish one of these elsewhere. The ductstat/thermostat is kind of a finicky little device and I'm not sure I've got things all that dialed in since I've recorded some highs in the 90s :shock:
    But, all seems to be functioning now. They'll get their first watering with molasses tomorrow or the next day depending on how much they drink today of course. As for progress/problems: they outpaced the light height a little bit while they were on autopilot so some of them had to have some super-burned fan leaves taken off; a couple also experienced some other burn of some sort, perhaps pH swing influences, perhaps overfeeding (super high temps plus supersaturation with h20 may have allowed slight nute burn from the oc+, but not likely really); I'm also curious about a pair of girls, different genetics, who are exhibiting twisting leaves: could this be a humidity issue?, overwatering? or is it just coincidental that I got two plants from different genetics with a phenotype who can express that feature--note, both are totally healthy otherwise. Any thoughts?

    For specs, it looks like while I was away thinks were pretty humid--maximums in the 90s, min. 47--so thats a relief, and the temps did pop up to the mid 90s (94) and had lows around 54, :idea: maybe the extreme temp. fluctuations caused the twisting response?!?

    Anywho, pics:
    :leaf: :leaf: :joint: :leaf: :leaf: :joint: :leaf: :leaf: :joint: :leaf: :leaf: :joint: :leaf: :leaf: :joint: :leaf: :leaf: :joint: :leaf: :leaf: :joint: :leaf: :leaf:

    View attachment 2576576 View attachment 2576577 View attachment 2576578 View attachment 2576579 IMG_1551 (1).jpg

    So, right now I've got my lights positioned in a dome and I wanted opinions on a bulb set-up. Right now, from L to R, the bulbs are ordered thus:
    Flora Sun / Flora Sun / Flora Sun / Flora Sun / BLOOM / BLOOM / BLOOM / GROW / GROW / BLOOM / GROW / BLOOM

    This puts me in a ratio 5:3 Bloom to Grow (2700K to 6500K)
    I will likely replace one more Grow bulb with a bloom bulb to achieve the 3:1 balance for the rest of bloom, adding one more far red bulb for the last 2 weeks of bloom, for a "Harvest Sun" blend spectrum.

    So, my question is, should I change up my order to more evenly incorporate the bulbs, or should I just rotate the plants 180* every day?
    I would think something like FS / B / G / B / G / G / B / FS / B / FS/ B / FS--another point of rationale in this design is the double G bulbs are actually the furthest point from the plants, since my dome is slightly lop-sided (think: Sydney Opera House)...Thus, placing the redder spectra closer to the plants, with the bluer spectra slightly further...sound good? I'm doing it!
    be easy!

    Attached Files:

    stoneslacker likes this.

    WattSaver Well-Known Member

    Hey DrJ20. I was looking at your photos, and noticed the spot yellowing and the canoeing of some of the leaves. So it looks like you're having an uptake problem. I hope you don't mind me asking, but what is the ph of your feed water? & Are you adding any cal/mag? I'd be adding 3 to 5ml/gal at the beginning of flower, but you know your tap water, I know it's not the same as mine.

    Spittn4cash Well-Known Member

    I says go with this...just my opinion. And since they're flowering the red spectrum will help them a little more than cool blue, so I'd keep the red spectrum bulbs closer. You've got the right idea.

    Rotating the plants every few days seems like too much work...but if its not too much trouble, you can do both.

    Looking good so far, keep it up!

    Dr.J20 Well-Known Member

    Hey Watt,
    my H2O specs are pretty good on calcium and fine on magnesium but I was thinking about adding some next feeding. The canoeing/twisting etc. I was thinking came from pH being too high...i try to keep it between 5.8 and 6.3, which i'll be keeping closer to 5.8-6.0 from here on out. They probably got two waterings of pH 7ish while I had them on autopilot for about 10 days. So, now that I can be sure to take care of em a little more closely, we should see less of the issues...
    thanks for stopping in!
    be easy,

    Dr.J20 Well-Known Member

    Thanks for stopping by mate! I 'll be rearranging at lights on today and going with this line-up; of course i'm going to switch out to more red in a week or so, so I doubt the effects will be that pronounced but who knows!
    be easy!

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